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23.
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first committee is Public Safety I think
you'd like to call from safety
committee's order we have three items on
the agendas tonight first of which is
the acceptance of the state and
Municipal facilities program granted by
Chief cooker
thank you
good evening good evening here before
you tonight to ask for two things
they're connected so I'll talk about
both at the same time
we have been partnering with catapult
games over the last three and a half
years
to help them along with the community
build a platform called brpd which is a
virtual reality de-escalation training
tool
um that has again been built by catapult
games and the community with the
community's input
the owner of the company catapult games
Dane Jennings has offered the police
department a significant discount if we
enter into a two-year contract
at a contract amount would be seventy
thousand dollars
we previously had
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previously dedicated
roughly if I can find my paperwork here
what I did with it
we had previously dedicated a uh a Jag
award from jax21 25
000. roughly 25 000 range
I think it was a sword of 25 000.
um which which left us a bit short for
the seventy thousand dollars and uh from
uh assemblyman Santa Barbara had been
involved in this development he'd
attended some of the some of the
workshops and he had expressed interest
in helping us and he came through with a
50 000 Sam Grant to help offset the cost
of the seventy thousand dollars so our
plan is to is to use the the Jag funding
of roughly 23 000 and change with the
fifty thousand dollar CM Grant uh upside
you're right twenty five thousand one
sixty eight was the Jag Grant so we have
roughly 75 000 in uh in funding to put
towards this program with seventy
thousand going towards entering into an
agreement with catapult games for the
software as a service that includes the
equipment
and um and then the remaining funds we
would use
um to put on the community events where
we plan to utilize this training to
bring to the community to have the
community be the end user on the
de-escalation with the police officer
and then we will flip roles at the
Community member see what it's like to
have to de-escalate a situation where
the police officer will be the uh the
person that is uh is on the other end of
it so my request now would be to uh to accept the Sam Grant of fifty
thousand dollars and the second request
would be to enter into the agreement
with catapult games for the seventy
thousand dollar
contract for the software as a service
question
to comments
have any questions or comments regarding
answering the agreement with checkbook
news this word for me so Chief we did
have a discussion could you just talk a
little bit about how um axon has some of
these same capabilities and what the um
you know what will happen after this
money runs out with the intentions of
that sure
um so uh we had entered into this
partnership with catapult games again
three and a half years ago and in that
span of time
um we we recognize the need to replace
our body cameras and that's what got
brought us down the roadway of entering
into an agreement with axon axons
officer safety plan was a bundled
service where VR training was also
included when you bundle everything
between the tasers and the body worn
cameras effectively we got the virtual
reality training for free however we had
already gone down the road working with
catapult games so I did not want to
abandon that that's why we've um we're
doing both simultaneously we're using
the axon virtual reality training for a
variety of different things including
the escalation however the difference is that catapult games is built by our
community and it's also specific to
de-escalation training with a two-way
user Street rather than putting the
virtual reality on and just interacting
individually you're interacting with
another person on the other side and no
two scenarios are going to be the same
So the plan is is to we're going to use
it for the two years and we're going to
see if there's a value in maintaining
two separate programs or if there isn't
then we will certainly have to go with
the one that's free most likely which is
the axon one if we don't see the value
and maintaining the catapult games but
we're hopeful for is that we'll we will
continue building it with catapult and
find Value in it because there it is a
local company that built basically built
this for us and we're hoping that we see
the value and that you know two years
from now we're back before you asking
you to continue it
I know that there were many many
Community discussions
um I know that Mr Rivas I think hosted
multiple events that the community came
to so it had positive feedback from
folks that attended those events is that
yeah yeah Will Rivas was involved in it
um so was Mr Benitez who helped share
our we did she he moderated our police
reform uh reinvention conversations and
then there was many other people
involved in this even from Albany that
were involved so they so we have a more
of a regional approach to building this
but we were we were the lead on it it
was really our community that took the
lead on and giving feedback so that I I
know that everybody that's involved in
this is very excited about the program
but you know I kind of build a woman
special for saying so she probably would
remember us saving some time together
with some young man in the boys and
girls club and we're kind of talking
about I'm just this very uh In This Very
topic and I'm wondering do you see this
as a tool to
um as more of a an engagement tool for
maybe for like some of the youth
population maybe some of the something
applicable to the partnership that's
been online right now with the school
district or do you see this as just you
know more or less than the de-escalation
uh tool that in his people can just kind
of get that experimental piece
I'm the police officer and I see this as
training
um coupled with the the engagement end
on the community and I see this as
engagement and I really want to be able
to reach every age group that's in our
community
um from the from the youth to adults to
our seniors I think that's important for
everybody to understand
the challenges that we as police
officers face especially the
de-escalation challenges but also we
want to learn from all those three
different groups what it's like to to
have to practice different skills on
de-escalation and I'm not going to lie
I'm going to use this as a recruitment
tool also when I go to the schools and
colleges and maybe even out in the adult
community to show that you know this is
a job that is is professionalism that it
uses many different disciplines to be
effective and it's a very rewarding job
to have so I I do want to use it as a
recruiting tool we'll bring it to our
recruiting events but even when we're
out there talking to them to our youth
tell them to start thinking about the
career in law enforcement
I deferred to Mr farluki sure thank you
mayor so I was wondering do you see this
um in a connection with the hiring of
the mental health professional
that we approved class budget do you see
like this time maybe like but then
they're overall because I'm thinking
de-escalation that might be something
that
um Falls within that will help
sure and that's the beauty of this is
that um you know that professional or
anybody that has experience in that
space can sit on the other end of it and train an officer on on the
challenges so there's so many different
scenarios that can happen but we could
have somebody that just dealt with a
scenario last night and wants to
simulate that in a virtual reality
training that when you give these
commands they're replicating what was
given as a way to just you know train on
different things because no two
scenarios are ever the same
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thank you Mr chairman and again people
have to be cognizant of keeping the back
of your mind while we have to be talking
about policing and Public Safety tonight
this is applicable over a wide range of
applications for training so it might be
the paramedics could be the Bureau of
service
simulating just interactions with the
public coming in and whether it might be
in the city clerk's office or in finance
or other areas so it's part of the
transformation in how education is done
not only we're looking in the city but
in college platforms and schools and so
that we're fortunate to have a local
company to work with the chief has been
a leader in terms of implementing this
at the same time we're looking at those
options down the road again to leverage
that so that the headsets some of the
equipment that may end up being
purchased now through the police
department again could be used in the
fire department for other training
opportunities
any other questions or comments
I also definitely thank you chief for
the efforts that you and your department
are making that broaden our awarenesses
both as law enforcement professionals
and as community members that we can
truly work together so if there are no
other questions or comments second what
was your favorite all right thank you very much and the third item
on the agenda is a college hearing to
amend chapter of 186-16 in the city code
fires and smoking prohibited and city
parks exceptions injured thank you
um obviously
um the council knows that the use of
marijuana and cabinet Canada products
have been legalized and it's being
regulated in the state of New York there
are obviously a lot of restrictions that
apply to the use of those products as
well as tobacco products New York State
amended public health law state law to
prohibit smoking in public parks the
enforcement of the state law however is
left with the County Board of Health
there is language in the public health
law though that allows municipalities to
adopt and enforce local laws to prohibit
smoking and vaping for example that so
long as they're consistent with the
state laws currently city code
186-16b states that no person shall
smoke within city parks but we Define to
smoke as being to burn a lighted cigar
cigarette or pipe or to use any other
matter or substance which contains
tobacco so obviously it does not address
because at the time it was enacted the
legalization of marijuana and cannabis
products and also electronic cigarettes
so in order to be consistent with the
restrictions of New York state public
health law to give our local law
enforcement the ability to enforce those
rules and as opposed to relating of
relying on the County Board of Health
I'm looking to
requesting a call for public hearing and
as it relates to those definitions
relying on the definitions provided in
state law as opposed to creating our own
definitions so that would consistent
with New York state law
thank you Mr chairman I guess the
Corporation Council to put this on I had
a complaint from a citizen who was so
walking his dog that his name is Eric
Clifford
I wanted to follow up on your citizens
complaint
any other questions or comments and
you're not going to get a motion so
second all in favor
for the policy Committee hearing on in
the election for adjourn so second
favorite
thank you call to auto finance so the
first item is authorization for the
mayor to enter into an agreement with
Community with all the fund or the
capital regioning for two hundred
thousand dollars for small business
assistance program
all right
good evening
um so we're just here completed our five
day public comment period which was
required under the CBG CD rules
um we received no comments
um so at this point in time we're just
looking for authorization to enter
contract with uh
to for small business systems
questions any questions
Mr Gray the last time we did some
allocation can you give us a little
about did you receive any feedback from
the community in terms of how the
program rolled out and were there any
coupling in terms of people not getting
adequate funding
um I mean the by environment programs
people were happy to get the funding we
provided them lastly we provided grants
up to ten thousand dollars on we're
going to discuss the The Loan Fund would
make sense to restrict it to that limit
this time or not
um obviously there's plenty of
businesses that would have liked and
received more money and there wasn't
enough money to go around to all
businesses that requested money
but overall the business that received
it was well received it helped I think
we assisted over 64 businesses
go ahead so are you aware whether those
businesses or those folks are still in
business or how they're doing this point
is there any level of process to the to
the loans
um we had been following up
um I think much of that had been kind of
done through Ron Garfield's office okay
um I believe that the ones that I can
think of off the top of my head that I
know got the loans are by and large
still in business and still operating
yeah
thank you
okay so for small businesses have who
have previously received a loan
um what what that play into the
determination of who was eligible for
this time around and that effort to kind
of like
um Cast Away internet and have more
people take advantage of it or is it
just pretty much the urban thinking I
mean that you're just going to kind of
go in line with the same metric units
last time
um well so last time it was you couldn't
have received other sources of funding
okay so like we prioritize businesses
that didn't get
PPE money or other other sources of
funding
um this time I imagine how this kind of
the same guidelines we would start
probably with businesses that that
didn't receive money last time
um we haven't you know started
soliciting businesses yet and Publishing
a program so
it was kind of hard to say who's going
to reply but generally speaking we would
start with people that didn't get it
before
um and then you know people still needed
additional assistance we would look at
those applications as well
any other questions
move it second all in favor all right
thank you
the next item is the higher ground
Worship Center 8801 Stanley Street
Louisville property tax inference and
penalty
so far
good evening everyone good evening uh
the corporation council's office was
contacted by an attorney representing
Higher Ground Worship Center their
religious nonprofit corporation they
purchased a property uh in 2008 which
resulted in a lapse of their religious
property tax exemption through March of
the following year in 2009 this resulted
in about a six thousand dollar tax
liability in the corporation did not pay
it so it was named and is now currently
an interim tax Corp
in order for the municipality to apply
any kind of religious exemption
retroactively would require State
Legislative approval so rather than do
this the corporation has opted to pay
the back taxes but it now seeks a waiver
of the interest and penalties which
amounts to about 17
000 eighteen thousand dollars from 2009
to date and that would bring them
current on their on their taxes and pull
them out of the in-run
um and they are fully tax exempt now
they have been since 2009.
questions
good thanks
um in good faith and it shows up here on
the next page of your packet
um they have made a payment
um recently
um really it was last week I believe uh
so they paid a substantial amount of the
total amount of the
um of the principal
um obviously there's still some residual
that they'll have to pay
um you know unfortunately the state law
that was enacted didn't cover this
property it was not specific to this
property it's one of those unfortunate
things
um so you know and this is not a
property
um that would if the city were to take
in foreclosure it's not you know
I want to say that there's no use for
the property but I think it's better
served with the church
any other questions
I'll move it second all in favor all
right thank you
the next item is a location of
additional American Rescue plan act
funds for the construction of the
Central Park Pool credit and Facilities
uh
okay Mr Wilson who is uh
going to manage the project in San
Antonio Associates
Dan is here to answer questions go
through the process how it got there the
committing and
do you want to take anything
did you want to start since you guys
were here from the beginning yeah
all right here we are that microphone is
for the people at home Pat all right in
this week that's what I was going to say
because I tend to project pretty well
anyway how you folks doing
um last time I was here we talked about
a project I think it was in December of
2021 uh the potential for Central Park
Pool and we were looking at a concept
that would be around five million
dollars so if you look at kind of where
the renderings were land to where we are
today there has been a lot of input from
the community there was a committee that
came on board looked for a number of
additional improvements
obviously we've been dealing with the
construction costs so we built we ended
up doing a design of something that was
more significant than what we originally
planned on but if you look at what we
came up with it's really a benchmark
project it's kind of a legacy project
it's kind of a once in a generational
thing and we were encouraged by the
committee to make this somebody that
would be generational not just a pool
but really a destination so that's what
we ended up with and then we went
through the process of putting it up to
bid and we got bids back and there's a
number of challenges with respect to
Penny right now first of all there's a
number of issues with construction costs
there's issues with respect to some of
the requirements for the city which can
be a challenge and is scared some
bidders away but we work very hard to
get bitters in and we ended up with bid
prices working with Tom and twna from
Schenectady to get a project that we
could wrap our heads around that was I
think around
is it nine million dollars for the
contingencies yeah eight million yeah so the project has grown the project is
bigger it's more exceptional than it was
before
um but the prices are what they are and
I will tell you in the business of
design and construction nothing is
coming in where it's under cost
estimated so the challenge really is
justifying where we are and we had a
very highly credible uh bidders that
were thoroughly vetted we came in we're
very comfortable with where the prices
are Tom's company is uh absolutely
experts in this field of bid evaluation
construction management so now we're
standing here talking and we're glad to
address any questions that you have with
respect to how we add to this point
but we do have good costs that were
higher than were anticipated however the
project we discussed with you in
December of 2021 is not the project we
have today it's bigger and frankly it's
better
any questions please you just mentioned
the the new cause for the overall
project is just just over 8 million
dollars yes and that's including a
contingency
at what percentage of contingency area 8
million twenty one thousand is the uh
agricultural bids that came in and I
think Chris put eight or eight percent
on top of that he did put an eight
percent containment but eight million 21
000 plus 8 plus soft costs
so
X
says yeah
um so thank you for for coming again
sure and I want you to know I know I'm
fully supported the project but I have
to tell you really shock that the Dublin
doubling price than what you originally
um came with and you did mention that so
these are add-ons this is not that it's
double enticed based on your original
design but because so many things were
added our there's there's actually three picks okay to add
into the cost First of all the scope was
increased there were additions
um and secondly the construction costs
are highly volatile and third our
estimates are based on just you know
just no dealing with
um uh labor unions and any sort of any
sort of challenges dealing with the city
of apprenticeship program stuff that
some some uh contractors don't have so
that is a challenge and so those things
added up
and with inflation kind of got us to a
million dollars
but the scope is greater than it was
previously
do you find municipalities that just go
like kind of halfway or whatever or
sorry in the future that they really
didn't put everything out there one time
in one time only well I work I work
almost solely with municipalities
throughout the state right and what we
have done historically is when there's a
hard cap in terms of spending you try to
phase it unfortunately this project
doesn't
provide itself to be something that can
be phased the the thing we do with our
parks
is that the the the the investment in in
soft infrastructure like Parks always
gets a very strong uh return on
investment between seven to one or nine
to one is the return on investment with
respect to people coming to the parks
people tend not to regret the money
that's been invested
um you know we we we frankly did a
project a few years ago in Amsterdam
which was a bridge uh pedestrian bridge
over the river which no one could
understand why it was there it gets a
quarter of a million people a year now
so you know if if I were to you know I
recommend it to every one of our
Municipal clients when the Arca funding
became available to go for it because
this opportunity is generational and the
cost is greater but it is going to have
an even greater impact on the community
with the final result thank you we're
very proud of this side yeah
go ahead please I just want to say I'm
very supportive of this project I think
that the expanded scope also I think in terms because of some of the meetings
I mean multiple meetings which such a
large group of community members were
able to voice what they wanted to see as
part of this project but the project I
was going to say Legacy as well
um but the project just in terms of the
numbers of Youth served by this by this
project are just going to be
astronomical especially over Generations
as well as the youth that we employ to
not only the youth that will take
advantage of the pool but the youth that
we employ but the other parts of it the
road work the parking all those other
aspects are going to only enhance what
already is considered a jewel of our
city in terms of how it will assist the
other parts of the park like the tennis
courts like music Haven
um you know the other the other ass
aspects of everything that so many
people throughout the city well you
enjoy you know I I have two responses to
that first of all our most successful
parks are the ones in which the
community is very actively engaged and
this committee was very actively engaged
we met for a number of months on this
and they're kept being things added you
know we didn't originally plan on having
a hill removed but now you go up there
and you go up to Central Park and you
look and you go oh you can see a diamond
in the background boy that's beautiful I
didn't realize that was there it helps
connect that part there's there's so
many pieces to that Park that people
aren't aware of this helps just bring
people there and get a greater
understanding of the other elements and
uh activities that are available at the
park and I think this is kind of like
the launching point for the park to be
even more than it currently is and the the second thing I would say is you
know it's just the the opportunity to do
a project like this is just it's just
really special and and I think this is
something that can be generational in
terms of the impact on the community and
the youth in that in this community
particularly in that area
so you didn't mention about Community
inputs or it is a individual community
members or organizations within our
community I have both it was
a son
the uh
Woodlawn preserve and stuff that were
Boys and Girls Club to manage it uh
trying to think who else was there music
Haven yes Representatives the greenhouse is there yeah
we also have the uh the folks with the
uh the disc golf
they were they were Parkers are in the
whole two holes with one hole was
relocated there's a few that are going
to be impacted but fortunately they were
great to work with and frankly the the
um the the person that was participating
from the boys and girls club was of
Great Value because we were looking to
put these these uh
make it so it's user friendly for all
the programs
um that they have and so that's where we
ended up with the ultimate design
I think I think if I'm speaking myself
as people I think all of those support
can you fooled in Central Park Islam
with a Jew but the thing that is uh
getting us here today is the hard
question of moving from 5 million to
10.1 million
it's still originally we are allocated
five million dollars a month we're
asking for 10.1 million so those are the
hard questions I ask in you and your
hair to answer those questions but
that's right my final question of that
is if we were to proceed with this
project can you give us a breakdown of
the timeline the project timeline
well I think I think Tom you might be
the person to answer that I mean
probably yeah it doesn't uh we would if
we awarded contracts we'd start as soon
as possible the weather breaks these
guys are ready to go
um I think the contract I think it's end
of September is when uh looks like it
would be complete and we don't see a
problem with that completed in September
of this year yes
foreign
closing down the old pool what happens
with that
well that hasn't been addressed oh thank
you yeah thank you thank you that has
not been addressed the closing down in
the old rule right now the ECU will love
it but I mean looking at a future use of
it there's a lot of potential things
that could be done in that space and it
could be taking back some of it to help
crew you know have have a more
Consolidated Iroquois Lake and kind of a
Great Lawn there there's a lot of ideas
but but then again ma'am that that
involves going back to you know a
committee getting Community input what
the city wants the most successful
projects we've ever worked on are the
ones in which the city is actively
involved in the programming
well I would 100 agree with that and so
the reason we're asking all these
questions we weren't apprised of all the
additions that you're talking about
to us you know so that's why you know
you're asking me here tonight so there
would be an additional cost to do the
work around the old pool so that's not
included in this class so if we that's
what we want to do with the opal then
we're going to invert more costs that is
correct okay
um so in terms of the things that were
added
is there anything if like I know there
was a wish list clearly from the
committee who said like let's just give
everything Bells whistles and then bells
on top of the whistles so if if they're
realistically is there anything that we
could really have done about and still
make this a state-of-the-art project
I I think hindsight is always 20 20.
um but where the design is now if
anything were to be pulled out in a
redesigned to occur it would probably
take up half of that cost for the
redesign and then if you look at that
cost in 20 it's as opposed to 2023 if
the construction is done in 2024 you
might have you you might lose the rest
of that benefit so the way construction
costs are moving I think it's best I I
think it's probably the wisest decision
for the committee to to go forward with
this rather than to agreement
and
part of the challenges the bidding
environment how the market is right now
and in order to do a substantial
redesign you'd probably have to go up a
bit you you'd be looking and re-bidding
it
when you rebid it it all starts over
again everybody's seen everybody's
number if you I'm making things up if
you want to pull 250 000 out of removing
something well you got to design what
goes back number one
number two we right now have the GC
complaining because they're having a
hard time holding their structural steel
numbers it's very volatile very volatile
I cannot stand here and say if you pull
250 000 out you go out to rebid in four
or five months it won't come in more and
you've lost
so we had a project in Albany last year
the guy asked me you know what what is
your advice on a fitting strategy I said
well my crystal ball says bid it as soon
as you possibly can and get your bids in
so that if worse comes worse you can bid
it twice which you do not want to do in
this environment from our perspective so
that that's my concern and the other and
when when you re-bid you have to you
know as I said the numbers are out there
it I stopped a long time ago trying to
decide what everybody else's strategy is
going to be but I know crazy things will
happen so we uh and I'll say here
um we stand before you with some some of
the the best contractors that we have
worked with we worked with jerson on the
pump station I personally worked with
jerson on the uh
I'm very Services 25 million the head of
schedule under budget we work we know
those guys
um and and all the other there's the RMB
and I think O'Connell electric Rock
Solid guys
so we're
sort of comfortable ready to go we
understand the questions and completely
get it
but there's a catch every time you want
to Ravel you start to pull the string
you know so I agree with any other any
other question yeah the mayor said
something about um you would explain
about concrete and that was one of the
reasons that's a cost increased yes it's
um Let me let me address that that's one
of
and I have a Mark here there's probably
one of nine things that were more than
20 off I think concrete's gone up it I'm
gonna say 30 to 40 percent in the last
six to seven months the Northeast has
hit harder than a lot of the other parts
of the country
um we know that polypropylene adhesives
uh any any uh the iso insulation goes on
the roofs is up gypsum is way up
um steel right now is sort of I can't
say it's stabilized but it's it's
volatile in terms of then they're
complaining that they they're concerned
about getting the steel and they're
pushing us right now like we're counting
the days for the award and those you
know they got 45 days for the award
we're going to get a phone call is this
a go or not because they got the steel
guys pressure in them so concrete is
absolutely up uh asphalt last year went
up 10 percent we expected to go to
another again another time
now um You said like this is really
fancy and all this so are we using are
we using concrete that's like above and
beyond normal concrete are we going with
any of that colored stuff and all of
that and does that include the car yes
that's uh I think I think we have blue
some some colored concrete especially
the splash the splash pad area it's not
a colored concrete is not cheaper it's
included
um that is something you you could you
could turn it off and not do it without
probably rebidding um you might be you
might save twenty thousand dollars
it's not it's not a wholesale change but
it you know it goes in the right
direction that's for sure if that's the
concern
but
the blue concrete is also part of the
design that matches the tile on the
outside it's sort of cool but you know
those
absolutely something that could be like
I said the only thing I would add to
what Tom says you know in this business
when when like the stimulus funding
started coming out we kept looking for a
point where it was going to add
and it was like okay hold on you know
hold your money spend it now you're
going to be able to get more bang for
your buck we're not seeing the drop off
in the construction industry there is so
much public money funding these projects
unfortunately we don't we don't see it
dipping
um probably it's as strong as I've ever
seen the market I know we're as busy as
we've ever have been
um Our advice to our Municipal clients
is try to get the project you can right
now and move forward because we don't
know what next year is going to be like
and and I'm sorry go ahead
I was just I was just going to say that
to piggyback on to what what Dan just
said it's um
the guys are generally a big picture
we're commercial construction managers
we we operate in Albany Schenectady
manly a few other places
um guys are loading up on Municipal work
the private work they're they're not
hanging their head on so much because
it's that's a little shaky as as
everybody knows with the economy where
it's heading so these got you know it's
not their first clam bag they know that
they want to load up on middle school
work and that's what that's what people
are doing so the concern I have big
picture not for this project for other
projects we have other public bids
coming up and that is get your beds in
get it done because then these guys stop
bidding and you're only as strong as
your week you know your your bidders
list really
So to that very point I don't want to
speak lightly of it and growing up as a
kid and we'd get x amount of money to go
to McDonald's and my mom would say you
can get whatever you want as long as it
doesn't go over this dollar amount so I
understand the the consists with trying
to make sure we maximize uh the
potential for this pool area my biggest
concern is truly if we are trying to
stretch this arpa funding
how much rest of the project exists
because it'll be nice to have a very
lavishing pool area but if we want to
still have this other unfinished uh pool
that's just sitting if we have this
casino building that still needs to be
renovated if the pathways and paveways
still need to be addressed what is going
to be left that we are now responsible
because we have invested this much money
into to complete or we're just going to
have a half project well I can't I can't
speak on the city's budget okay what's
playing
um but uh but there's there's always
opportunities for grant funding that's
right um and because we work with a lot
of communities with respect to exactly
that doing doing those you know you can
deal with though you can deal with
oprhp with respect to Grants for the
casino building you can look with DEC
with respect to potential grants for
repurposing Iroquois Lake In The Swim
area I think the things are to remember
about what's the central our goal is
going to be is it's going to be a
destination which is a good thing
because the more people you come have
coming to that area the more interest
you're going to get in Central Park Pool
in the ear it is for you to get
additional monies for additional
projects at Central apartments
so pick back on your question and just
follow up on that when we were having
all these discussion with these
community members and organizations did
we let them know that we have a budget
of five million dollars
no because we didn't go back to that
original number until most of this work
had been put in place
and In fairness you don't know what the
number is until you get all the input
and then you put the design together
so you didn't we didn't know that said
okay that gets us to you and that's the
term we call Value imaginary
and what we wanted to do is put all the
pieces in and then kind of see where we
were with respect to the original
guideline of five million dollars but as
you can see it's it's more of a project
than it was when we were talking about
it as a five million dollar project no
understand understand what you're saying
there but at Highland we we take all the
information we take all the input from
the community we put them together in a
drawing we take it back to them and we
say okay this is going to cost 10
million I'll instead of 5 million
dollars
Where Do We Stand do we just go over the
community input rather than us coming to
a compromise and a solution to say we
have five million dollars or we're just
going to go ahead regardless and spend
10.1 million dollars no I respect your
possession it's I absolutely do because
it's like we got the community in but
this is where the dollar is and you
folks have to make the decision and you
know it's not an easy decision and we
respect that
yeah
go ahead decide so you say uh I don't
know whether you're able to speak to
this what portion of the entire Central
Park uh redesign will be remaining after
we address this pool area in our
facilities
well a lot of items of connectivity are
addressed because there's a new road to
access ways and stuff so you're really
improving the connectivity of Central
Park just by putting this part in place
it's not the end at all right there's a
number of descending projects that will
come from us none of them are going to
be eight million dollars but there's a number of other projects which
would probably be very manageable chunks
to get funding for them changing for for
kind of so it's set up
oh absolutely yeah that's the one nice
thing about this the pool is it it's it
also addresses the need for you know
locker rooms and restrooms for the
tennis courts which was good I hate a
lot of use
and if you had to put a number to that
would you say that's 10 would you say
that's 30 remaining
oh in terms of the other pieces versus
well you know a lot of that depends on
what you want because we don't have a
broad master plan for everything to be
done at the park because you you can put
a broad concept together but then you
want to look at these things piece by
piece in terms of what does the
community want here do you want an area
for picnics do you want more playground
area do you you know do you want more
pickleball do you want other things do
you want a skating area tough to tough
to do this year but those those sorts of
things it has to be addressed that way
to kind of do a piecemeal once you have
the infrastructure in place but we
really think having another destination
at the for the as the pool which can
also serve to benefit the tennis court
area is going to help activate that
whole area and I think that you
cued in on one of the important aspects
of limiting scope expansion for that
very reason we can have whatever we can
afford to pay for and absolutely I think
and making sure this resource reaches as
many people as possible or visitors and
patrons absolutely but we want to make
sure we're not overspending in this one
area and then we're having to schedule
them to get things included on the back
I I really appreciate the position but I can tell you frankly from my
experience working with parks and
communities
I have never heard a client or a
community complain that too much was
spent they often lament the fact that
not enough was wish we didn't cut this
corner here wish we didn't do that
that's that's just I've been looking
back at hindsight I've seen that a lot
thank you
hey Mr chairman to begin we have
taking these components if you look at
adion which you know like a few years it
was an embarrassment dirtfield
systematically lined up the money and I
will tell you I'll take most of the
credit for putting that in place and
making it happen
you look at the upgrades we've done in
the music Haven you look at the upgrades
that we've done at the golf course these
are not routine Municipal facilities
anymore they are entities that the
region looks at you look at the
volunteers that go into the Rose Garden
you look at the activity that's
happening at the greenhouse we're
setting the standards of things that are
happening within this community and
within the region and this swimming
facility is going to complement that
you you mentioned earlier about Brands
this project might be prime for friends
is that something that you can help the
city oh absolutely I don't know if the
city needs our help the city the city is
very good at doing these things but we really enjoy the relationship we've
worked with the city on a number of
projects over the last time you will
engage with us we absolutely can support
that in any way
so um one of you mentioned the soft
costs that weren't in there before
um my other question is there's clearly
going to be a lot of work that you've
done here you you've um accepted bids
from the various contractors
in terms of your mwbe participation
what are your guidelines on that and
where are you with that
um it was it was part of mid package in
terms of the requirements each of the
contractors filled it out I I don't I
can't recall the percentage off the top
of my head but we did have a
conversation with um the main contractor
jerson and Ron and Ron was working with
these guys in the past again on the pump
station and uh
I again I don't know the percentages but
they should be in the package
um each of these guys are required to
fill it out I think Jersey I I don't
want to quote numbers because I I've got
a
contract because I'm dealing with these
days so
um but they filled it out and it was
part of the bid package just like the um
just like their number again
so um Mr Wellington put in contingency
for changeovers at eight percent which
was a 641 680. so
you know we've already double the price
we I think what we're looking for is an
assurance that it's not going to now
increase more
my crystal ball
um so so let's recruit the the
project 100 design
you could you could go in with a
slightly lower contingency that would be
comfortable however this is a big
earthworm project it's as soon as you
start talking about earthwork there's no
drawing that shows where the rocks are
buried and you can't do borings every
two feet to a triple A you know exactly
what's going on so because it's a big
earthwork project
I I leaned towards and I was part of the
eight percent decision in that session
but discussion and she said it's Chris's
decision
um
I'm very comfortable the eight percent
now now if it was
if the substrata wasn't really
understood I'd be I'd be a little more
nervous about the eight percent because
it's such a big dirt work job however
they just did
um in the mass excavation and it's
generally insane it's beautiful soil it's and so unless
there is some burial ground we don't
know you know and I hate to even say it
but it could have stranger things have
happened
um I don't I don't I am not concerned
with that Ampersand I'm very comfortable
going into this yeah very comfortable my
you know my experience I I my
experiences is environmental engineer so
I've done boring solve around the
country and this was some of the most
consistent Sans I've seen uh we were
also involved with the the golf course
and I have a high level of confidence
because we saw that we aren't going to
get any anomalies specific to the
subsurface however as Tom would say you
never know until you know and and but I
at this point I would say confidence
levels are high that we wouldn't get
eight percent the other thing I want to
add
um as soon as you ask me that question I
think about who the who the um
the parent load bitters are well the low
bitters they're all solid guys that we
know can deliver and we've had
experience with it so we're that much
more comfortable they're not they're not
change order artists you know they do
their job and uh we hope and we're there
as construction managers to hold their
feet to the fire our job is to protect
the city against strange or less
interests yeah but with these this gang
I'm not too worried about it
and I knew there was one bitter that we
didn't actually we didn't have a bid you
had to go back to the Planters website
yeah so so
um
the general contractor the plumber the
electrician we all got bids for HVAC we
got no bids okay okay that affords us
the opportunity to then request
proposals so we our strategy was we
requested proposals from the plumbers
that did bid that also do adrac
and honestly we have a good relationship
with these guys so they didn't actually
really want a bid on it because it's
such a small package they're bidding on
you know fifty thousand dollar thing and
they got that much paperwork to do so
slightly reluctant we we certain we uh
enticed them a bit on it and so the the
good news is the the plumber that's
they've got the the plumbing bed is is
low bidder on the proposal was Fed so
it's the same guy and that's exactly
what happened just by chance on the on
the pump stations and again ideal if you
can have the plumber in the mechanic I'd
be the same same guy that is one big
issue that's resolved so that's that's
really good news so so yeah it's a good
question but that was
um accept the proposals because we had
no public bids
thank you I have two news
so
my statements last question is that
what how I'm understanding is that the
project itself didn't double in cost it
wasn't the project that don't make cost
it was the expansion of the scope you
know the watch then
um got us to where we're at uh for the
most part right because it is
that and the market markets
at all okay so I so you know I believe
uh Mr one was saying that uh usually
there's a 10 on contingency there oh
it's not uncommon and I think right now
when we're you know my concern is that
because this has doubled in cost due to
um the market as well as the additional
rate we have to make sure that we're
paying really close attention to that
and is that why the eight percent is is
there instead of the normal 10 or is
this just kind of it
go ahead
if the council Awards it says
presented to you these guys are in place
and they're going to bring this in on
time
and at least on budget and I hope it'll
come in under budget and I expect that
from Wilson and Saratoga Associates you
know they're ones that we work with and
you know we're all working together
sometimes
the discussions are a little bit more
heated but they're going to live up to
these obligations do it in a timely
fashion and within this existing budget
I have no problem with that and and then
the 10 that's not necessary you know I
don't know the context of that statement
and you know this is what we do for a
living we're the ones that put we didn't
put this budget together we got we got
involved in the bitter you know The
Bitter End but
um it's usually it really depends if you tell me the drawings are at 70
percent
10 if you tell me the drawing chart 100
we're done and we're on the street
bidding you can reduce it and that and
then it's not a it's not a science it's
more it's actually more of an art you're
like ah there's a lot of dirt work but
the dirt work is this yeah based on four
years experience
um
eight percent and I'm I I will
I'm comfortable with that going into
this I'm comfortable that with that sand
and how what we think we know
and and solid contractors that um
they're not gonna you know they're we've
just worked together they you know last
job we did that I ran with with the city
was Bureau of services and it was I had
a schedule and under the adjusted budget
uh somebody reminded me of that and I'm
like oh I didn't know it was an option
to do it otherwise it was a lot of hard
work to get it done on your budget and
had a schedule you know so yeah you
definitely answered my question I was
just wondering what are the variables
that are considered between that eight
and ten percent yeah no it sounds like
the same like once you know the more
further along you get in the project you
know more so you're able to right kind
of pinpoint right right and I'm exactly
and you know there's it's very dynamic
as you go there's also there's
opportunities as you can go that might
that we could address as we go
um and you can adjust that going it
might even come in much much less right
well we know we know which way you want
it to head and that's our game you know
look you know our
you know we have a certain fee what I
like to do at the end of the end of the
game we keep score we keep score every
change order we keep score at the end of
the day we like to walk in and say see
this is how much we save yeah and so
that is our game and uh you know we're
again working hopefully with guys and
gals that we can we can work with as we
go forward on us
so I'd say assuming um the chairship for
this committee uh just being very
candidly I appreciate both of me being
present and the work that your teams
have done I would say before I feel
comfortable voting in favor of moving
these monies I would like to hear from
our city engineer especially from an
understanding of wanting to recognize
what aspects of the entire project still
exist and as you mentioned there are
some great opportunities still existing
where is he get them on the phone he's
on vacation yeah he's on the he's alive
delaying the
projects so you can get them on the
phone seriously let's try the challenges
were down about 45 days and we start
losing
contractors
um
I thought it was like tomorrow
we were tracking the 45 days it's
you know
so I um for me I just wanted to make
sure that it comes in on September 20
23. that we're there yeah
um we you know we brought Wilson Times
too because
the Saratoga recommended that TWA be
brought in specific for what they had in
construction that uh construction
management and value engineering because
we've worked with them and they
absolutely
watch every penny that's spent and make
sure it's spent wisely and we thought
that was in the best interest in the
city so I'd say before I was cut off I
think the rest of my comment was going
to be would that posing any continued
issues with the funny university project
so if you're saying that 45 days is
already spent up is that what I'm
hearing well what happens is the bids
come in right and the contractors they
have to hold they have to hold their bid
for 45 days and then and then after that
45 days if you don't award they they get
to decide and we already know that the
construction was concerned that there's
still a guy who wouldn't hold their
numbers because it's very volatile so
I'm not feeling very comfortable but
you know and I'm not I remember the
question was what day are we in I know
the re the question is what day are we
in so I know we're really close to the
45 days and today now two weeks we bring
as well as well
26 7 6 is a Sunday right right that's
when the 45 days comes up will they give
us one more day it's
somebody will get wallet on the phone
and be able to answer your questions Mr
counseling
well I think
she had that I'm sorry I think we had
that opportunity to give our questions
to Mr wrong if you let us know that he
was going to be on vacation this week
and then if we got any questions given
all the material that he gave us
um that we were to contact him last week
before he left for vacation so I
personally just have to say I mean
especially given the level of community
input over months for this project and
the numbers of people
in all areas of our city that will be
benefiting from the use of this for me
like and you know as chair of the parks
committee here
um I have to say that I would be so
proud to be on a city council that
actually approved this kind of project
which long after we're gone uh not just
as a city council but probably on this
Earth will still be enjoyed by the
residents of this city
um so I I know I'm not on the finance
committee so I don't get to vote this
evening but I really encour encourage my
colleagues to vote in favor of this
project because I just think it has you
know long lasting benefits for so many
people in our city including water
safety employment
um you know just Health hot summers a
lot of the kids that use our pool
um you know don't have that kind of
opportunity at home to be able to cool
down with people with the pool so I just
really encourage the three of you to
vote in favor of this project this
evening
this question
I'm sorry what three are you referring
to the three people that are on the
committee I think Mr Williams
Oh I thought you said I thought that you
said that you were now the chair of the
committee for the evening assuming chair
responsibility yes yes
two people
oh I'm sorry I thought that Mr Paul and
my name is Miss Porterfield and no no
okay sorry about that so let's see here
okay um so I just sort of so I'll start
saying what I said when I started
speaking that I'm fully supported this
project and I just want to be clear it
wasn't why Community was there was a committee that was formed
and I have no objection for that but I
don't want it to be understood that
there was this you know we went from
Community to community community that's
not what happened there were
representing some Community who formed
the committee so let's you know um you
know just be clear with that
um
so and I just really uh for me again we
did not have the opportunity to hear
about the expanded
uh project that's expanded plan which is
why I felt like I needed to hear more if
you see the dollar uh amount of her
project you know go from one percent and
then it's doubled 100 I think it's fair
to ask for an explanation for that so
which is you know why I wanted you to
come today to to ask to get that
explanation so it's not about not being
against the project it's about making
sure we're clear because we are making
decisions financial decisions
so that that's 100 clear so um that's
what I wanted to say and I did I did you
know send questions to Mr Wallen
um got those responses so um here we are
today I'm I also am not on the committee
so I don't get to vote well I'm going to
make a motion to move this forward
especially before I think it's important
to say that there's yet again another
instance where the council is being
directed I absolutely do not want to be
the constructionist or anything holding
up these efforts I can understand the
investment that was made by both the
community and yourselves so I appreciate
that my hesitation again is just making
sure we can find the other aspects of it
but with the motion I will support it
um all those in favor
aye aye promotion to return
so I would say definitely it's making
sure that as a council these
conversations are brought in real time I
imagine that would alleviate any of
these instances continuing for
can I get a motion to start amazing
[Music]
I was a additional comment and ask for
it so remember which one of his emotion
you were supposed to either not prove it
or go gentlemen emotion second Paul's a
favorite for your turn
thank you I'd like to call the Florida
City development and planning
so
thank you thank you both for coming in
the explanations
all right all right thank you so we have
uh seven items on the agenda
uh these first item is to
um oops I'm sorry
government officers
sure okay so I'd like to call the order
of operations we have one agenda item
that's a reminder that amended to
chapter 161 is connected to city code
regarding the collection of white goods
um uh public hearing will be held on uh
227 2023
any questions comments on that
I like the next motion
no I don't need much better
modification okay that's just a reminder
okay
any questions
thinking now reconvene City development
planning we do have seven items on the
agenda the first item on the agenda is
to award and bid the contract for the
Central Park Pool
Etc we just had a lengthy conversation
about funding it
um
so Mr Wallen is not here is there
someone here to speak to this for Mr
Wallen
I'm more than willing to address any
issue that you have questions
are there any questions with regarding
the state and contract you just heard a
very thorough explanation any questions
I'll move it I'll second all's in favor
aye aye and the second item on the
agenda is the award admit contract for
the Central Park Pool spray pad Etc
contact to MC to
um RMB mechanical and the amount of
fifty three thousand dollars yeah
second all's in favor bye
uh the third I'm on the agenda is the
ceremony recognition uh ceremony
resolution recognizing women's History
Month
Etc yes March's women's history month
and so as we've done in the past I'd
like to
um have a resolution recognizing that
so I'd like to use that all right I'll
second all in favor
item number four is going to be
postponed
item number five uh creative outdoor
presentation on outdoor garbage
collecting bins Mr palomini yes last
time we had a presentation by Mr Diamond
from create about George about garbage
cans to put around the city but also
generate some Revenue let me give us a
question surrounding that I did ask and
he said all depends upon the cost of the
ads themselves but generally speaking
for the size of our city and the number
of cans that would be put out anywhere
from ten to fifteen thousand dollars
would be generated in revenue for the
city so we would have those cans put
around the city hopefully to deal with
some of the issues in regards to litter
Mr Golden and his staff looked into the
legality of it for the city he said it's
okay
yeah just for the sake of discussion
um we don't see any legal impediments
for moving ahead with this
and so therefore I would recommend that
we authorize the mayor to enter
contracts with creative outdoor for
these garbage cans
so 10 to 15 000 per year yes
and um so they said it would have to be
about 40 garbage cans
is what I'm doing I think that would be
something the mayor would negotiate but
he said minimum for you after I remember
what and
um and I as I also understand it needs
to be in high trafficked areas
yes but I think that's also something
that the mayor could negotiate with
higher traffic areas okay
look at this it's what I call some of
the obvious areas so you're going up
Albany Street Craig Street Crane Street
areas of downtown Eastern Avenue Van
Rank and
uh would be
areas that they would be able to agree
with us in terms of the best placement
of it
well for me I would like to see a plan
of exactly where they're going to go
um and
yeah I would like to see a plan of where
they're going to go and he definitely
said high traffic areas and I there's
actually actually I got some information
that was really specific about that so
they wouldn't be in residential areas so
I'd like to see a plan where we replace
these
um so do you want some in residential
areas or not
quite frankly I think that that's
another conversation that is maybe could
be out there for the public to have a
discussion regarding uh it's not just
you know what I would like to see there
but I definitely if we're talking about
high traffic areas I would definitely
like to see where that is going to be
and do we even get to that 40 number
considering that so I would like to see
a plan from this organization
um and and definitely some feedback for
what they've seen in similar size cities
in terms of that
um before we 100 commit to it not that
we don't have a problem with litter we
all know that we do I don't know that
this particular very large
piece of equipment is is
ideal
so I would really like to see a plan on
that before we move forward with that
that's mine I'll send your questions
along the email and I'll see if he will
address those I will say that this goes
hand in hand with the litter proposal
program that was put forward and the
council got behind and furthermore the
garbage cans are free instead of using
other resources that we could be using
for other efforts around the city this
would be something that we could get for
free and bring in money so send your
questions along and I'll be happy to try
to get those addressed
I'll make sure that I'll send them
through Miss Michael like we do
everything and then they can they can
move forward
um that's my concern about that and I
would like to see if it's anyone else
that has any questions or concerns
regarding this
so I I actually
um you know after listen to the
presentation
um I think it sounds like a really good
absolutely opportunity
um but I definitely would think that would be we'd see like kind of a
proposal where you know where the garden
that's a pretty reasonable expectation I
don't understand think that you need to
ask for that I thought that'd be
something that naturally happened but
quite honestly I I I appreciate the
information that was sharing I think
this is a good opportunity
um so um yeah I'd like to see that
information to make sure that it's a fit
um for our city and that the city
residents or something that that they
will be buying as well so
thank you
it's important thing is that um that
kind of a plan would that be coming from
the vendor or would that be coming from
the
mayor and his team honestly I think how
I understood was you would enter in a
contract negotiations this city would
say well we don't want to camp here yeah
we might want to hear and working hand
in hand with the vendor so I'm not even
sure I understand what you're saying but
not not even sure that's even possible
without there being some sort of
negotiation to happen
all right
so yeah
so I would generally expect that that
those conversations happen and what I
wouldn't want to do is say it said you
know if we agreed that we're going to
get 40 uh something cans and then uh
we're looking at the proposed placement
of those cans up now you know there
isn't enough real estate to do that
um in a way that uh is effective and now
we're looking at all possibly these six
or seven cans you know won't go for uh
population online or won't happen that
way and then we have and then and then
maybe this just isn't the fit for us or
other than that's what I was proposing
um again this is something that I happen
to
um agree and support
um and
that's why I'm the question that I'm
asking I think is pretty is it is a
question around how do we make sure that
we have all the information clear so
when we do this thing that I think is a
good idea it's done in the best possible
manner
yeah trying to demonstrate how we so the
Kelly school was the final ability to
reject garbage can placement
so
slippers that's not that's not what I'm
saying what I'm saying is we definitely
want garbage cans is this the best
choice and you know that's what I'm
saying so we clearly want garbage cans
uh many communities including mine
put garbage cans all over the city so we
know there's a need for it doesn't mean
that every um everything is an absolute
fit so can we take a look at what that
looks like that's what I'm saying
I guess then what would your proposal be
otherwise so that we could look into
this what you brought forward was for us
to consider this and what I'm asking you
for is to ask the folks who brought
forward what their plan would look like
for our city based on the size of the
city the high traffic areas
and if you would like to for another
vendor to come forward I'm sure that we
can look into that and have that happen
as well I understand what you're saying
what I was asking is what other proposal
do you have because right now this is
all we really have if you have something
else then we can look into this
um and to expect them to come in and say
we're going to put garbage cans here and
here without the negotiation just isn't
going to happen properly now I'll check
and ask but I'm just asking you what
proposal or plan do you have so then
maybe I can look into that and see if
there's something else well if there's
other vendors and generally speaking
when there's this kind of thing that
happens there are three people that can
take a look at so and this is not as I'm
sure that this is not something that's a Soulful Soul person you know that does
that so if you want to bring two others
which is reasonable we'll get look at
all three of them and see which makes
the most sense for the city well if you
have something with your questions to
Miss Michael please pass along on the
plan
thank you
Mr Clark yeah I just
think that we have to look at this that
um two things can be true here people
okay and everything doesn't have to be
you know uh
power struggle and I think that
um
what we're ended up doing right now is
that I think it's a pretty reasonable
question and so two things can be true
it's a reasonable request to see like
what this might look like in the city
before we you know move forward and
enter into a contract and we can still
support the initiative because we think
it's a good idea we are more than
capable of doing that um collectively as
a buyer so let's my comment it really is
let's focus our energy there that's what
we need to be doing no one's disagreeing
with the on that Mr Farley she missed
Porterfield indicated that there were
some other proposals or plans and all I
was asking for is that you know let us
know and maybe we can look into it
that's all that was said it wasn't
anything about trying not to
bring forward a plan of where cans might
go it was there was a comment made about
other plans so if there's something else
out there or other proposals let us know
so that we can try to work on that
that's all of us right I I understood
the question to be around the plan
that's existing in front of us that's
our understood it but in that energy and
in that Spirit pretty pretty solid
reasonable question and does not mean
that um that there's an opposition to
the plan so
and I didn't say there were other
proposal I simply asked for a outline of
what this one would look like so just to
make sure we're 100 clear you did bring
up the point that there could be others
and if we want to bring up others in we
certainly can do that as well it was not
an objection plan just what it's going
to look like
so we can bring that back I'll make sure
I have my questions
um most forward to Ms Michael so that
they can be answered by this vendor and
um and perhaps if there's other vendors
who may want to have an interest in them
and then we can bring this back um this
problem would you like it back in two
weeks yes
then we'll bring it back in two weeks
the next item is discussion of
Abandonment and sale of a large Street
Mr Brown
thank you
this discussion item is about the
abandonment and the sale of large Street is a small Street that's
located between 633 and 651 Lansing
Street we in the past have received
multiple complaints regarding people
attempting to dump trash on the land
that we own that is at the end of large
Street
and our city staff has addressed it
multiple times the owners at 60 33
Lancing Street as well as the owners at
651 Lansing Street have approached the
city about potentially purchasing it in
order for that to occur we would have to
abandon that in order to create it as a
partial to sell
one of the owners at 633 Lansing Street
would need a portion of that land if it
were to be parceled off in order to
access his garages and the other owner
would like to use the additional space
to provide parking for the tenants at
that location at 651 Lansing
any questions
Mr Golden sorry I just want to add a
little bit more to this um you know I
had a chance to meet with the owners
with Mr Brown uh this is one of those
there's nothing really to move today
it's just discussion item
um because we can't even start the
abandonment process until we have a
survey these owners have agreed to pay
all the costs to the city for you know
preparing the
um the survey which is going to run them
you know over a thousand dollars I'm
going to guess just based on the size of
this area of Street in the city would be
potentially abandoning they would also
agreed to
all costs related to recording any
documents which would be Deeds they will
pay for that so they're going to be on
the hook for all the costs out of pocket
the issue that they had was they wanted
before they wanted to go pay for a
survey to start this process and then
bring it to the council later on they
wanted to know if the council was
supportive of this of this by this mini
project
I will say the Straight is not in the
best of shape I did we didn't have a
chance to talk to Mr Wallen about it
it's a very small street there's really nothing fronting
um you know this brought this street uh
it's really the sides of both of these
properties as Mr Brown indicated the
cost to repave this area would be I
think Mr Wallen indicated upwards of two
hundred thousand dollars just for that
little tiny piece which nobody really
benefits from and as Mr Brown indicated
there's a considerable amount a
considerable amount of dumping dumping
going on there and the city has put
these cement blockades to prevent The
Dumping going on there so the the
request today is just to get informal
support to go ahead with this
abandonment and this project to
eventually allow these Property Owners
to buy what would be abandoned by
dividing it in half
thank you
discussion from council members and
get in favor against
support
is there anyone in the objection that we
would support this request
okay thank you
all right thank you uh the final item on
this on the city development planning is
sale of 35 moisten Street a vacant lot
which would be an executive session
so at this time I ask for a motion to
adjourn City development planning so
moved I mean I'm sorry reset so second
all in favor
so um I'd like to open claims
um there are three items on the agenda
for claims
um all three of these items need to be
discussed in executive session before we
go on Executive session I have something
I'd like to bring forward for claims
oh okay
um
typically we do Personnel issues and
claims
um
there's been serious allegations against
Mr Farley we know that
it's incumbent upon us as a body we have
an issue of serious allegations against
one of our members
there needs to be an investigation and
as our council president calling on you
to call for an investigation so Mr
Farley can have his name cleared and
then there's nothing pointing over his
head or if there's something found
that's determined there's something
either unethical or illegal then that
can be addressed
but I think it's very important for us
to be transparent in this body to make
sure that we have this addressed and I'm
calling on you as our council president
to call for an investigation
so I'm not sure which what you're
talking about specifically but let me
say this let me say that in terms of the
Consulting contract
that was entered into the school
district was very clear that there was
nothing illegal it was not against the
policy they were 100 clear when he um
when he they signed him hired him as an
employee that he already has a
Consulting contract there was nothing
illegal there so there's and and in
addition to that it's already been
referred to the State Board of Education
who will look into it and if there's
anything illegal it's up to them to make
that decision so that process has
already taken place
all right but this we don't have ethics
bot yes we do have a board at least
Ethics Committee on this Council we have
one in the city in the city yes well
then I'm asking you to call for an
investigation have the Ethics Committee
look into it that way Mr Farley can at
least have his name cleared and we can
move forward because we are getting
questions on this and you know it's
something that should be looked into and
while it is a school of board matter
it's not
a school issue it's not a no-show job
situation this is public money and then
there's some other issues with perhaps
taxation issues that's something that is
an Ethics issue and it should be looked
into and again if Mr Farley's got no
issue with this then he should have his
he deserves to have his name cleared and
I think that would need to be a request
for Mr Farley and let's just also keep
in mind that these things took place
before Mr Farley was seated as this
council at this Council so that's not
these are not things that took place as
a councilman
excuse me let me just stop right here
you started this by saying it's a
personal issue it should be discussed in
claim or in executive sessions however
not in claims there's no claim against
Mr Farley by anyone I said we usually do
Personnel matters in clients but yet you
want to discuss this particular one in
public
I didn't ask for it to be discussed in
uh exactly Obsession I said it should be
disgusting claims no one's discussing
whether he's illegal unethical or not
we're just calling for an investigation
of whether he has done something or not
done something there's a huge issue
difference there okay so just a couple
questions because I think that this is
definitely
um clearly something that um is a tad
bizarre that you introduced that at this
juncture of our standing committee
meeting um I think that that's pretty
telling us to follow me however
um you say that that you know the
question around ethics and transparency
all information that has been talked
about this is all public information I
don't think that you can get more
transparent than that
um and I I just again I find it kind of
odd that you would uh trying to
interject this into this phase of our
committee meeting and you're saying that
we
language you just used a couple minutes
ago was that we are calling for an
investigation and I would like to say I
oh
your I'll fix what I said I I just would
like to would like to be clear about
that um
uh president porterfield's point the
school district themselves was pretty
clear that you know that this was
nothing that uh that's even alleged
um was illegal and I personally did not
violate any standing policy that um that
was uh on the books in the school
district so with these things being said
um what enterpack means that you know
there's a there's an element to uh
Chicago grandstanding almost
criminalized
um well there is there is so you're
saying so Salon clear you're saying that
there is no element no not from you
right that's what you're saying right
because you can speak to yourself I'm
speaking of it myself so I will continue
on my point so there is an element of of
that that we've seen um from the GOP you
know we're in a strong effort to try to
criminalize uh myself and others you
know around very significant things
since I've been in this seat uh you know
there has been claims uh but uh
hate meal to me my colleagues I've been
uh accused of being I think I was a I'm
gonna make sure I go through the whole
family I was a drug dealer
um someone that would hurt children
then now
of defrauding that these type of things
is exactly to my early point is what you
call criminalization and it is all
political theater and
I just think that it's pretty rich
um from considering the sources um I you
know you know all color people are
criminals and I think that we really
need to deal with the issues in the
appropriate way of introducing this at
this time again is another way to try to
spin up a news story
speaking Spanish story but the people's
connected me didn't collect me for a
positive story or a negative story that
elected me because of my 20 years over
20 years of consistent leadership and
dedication to my community and that's
not something that is really going to
change based on the criminalization of
myself or any other people on this so
with that I appreciate um your concern
to clear my name is that's how you're
framing I'm not really sure
um but I again I think it it not only is
it bizarre but it's equally bizarre as
it is really unsettling and the tension
is not lost on me and I don't think
anybody else was witnessing this in this
moment thank you
so this is not bizarre because we
usually do Personnel matters during this
time and claims and quite frankly when
there's
public money in play whether we're
talking about paying taxes or school
money which is public both local federal
and state
and there's serious accusations and
people are calling us and saying what's
the deal what's going on
are there issues going on with Council
money or not
I don't know I personally don't think so
um excuse me excuse me let me just
interrupt you I'm not sure no I'm not
sure what the council money means
because we all get city council money in
terms of the budget and that's what I'm
talking about so in terms is this
another allegation
that's somebody okay so somebody did
call and asked about that then no wait a
minute Mr Farley was right I interrupted
him and I let him speak and he was right
I was wrong
I'm not finished when I'm done you're
able to speak all right and then we're
going to end this conversation because
um you know we as I said I am going to
interrupt you here the school district
is or someone has already said that this
is being investigated by the state and
State School Board
that's it and if there's an
investigation regarding taxes New York
state tax department has a an arm that
does that
so then as the leader of the city
council you're saying we should not ask
for an investigation of one of our
members of serious
improprietary allegations of public
funds I'm saying those investigations
are taking place by the bodies that are
involved ethics ethics is up to this
Bible so you're either saying yes or no no
I'm asking you and listen and I'm also
investigation or even either answer yes
or no my answer is awesome
excuse me you don't you don't get to
sell me yes or no I'm telling you why
you do it all the time
I think you do okay it doesn't well
that's your opinion I'm telling you this
that there's already been it's already
been turned over to the State Board of
Education it's New York State uh
Department of Taxation Fields there
needs to be investigation they will do
that so then the answer to question to
you from you that is
the answer to your question is it's
being investigated that is the answer to
your question and I'm asking for this
you as our library why do we need
additional investigations if they're
already being done because this is our
body and we're the city government and
people are asking questions what are you
guys going to do about it and if we
don't investigate ourselves in terms of
public money then there's no
accountability I disagree with that and
you and you can answer the people that
there are investigations taking place
already so then your answer to my
questions my answer to your question is
no your investigations are taking place
you will not put words in my mouth that
is my answer because everybody can see
what the answer is I think it's just
important um for me at this point to
just really
um highlight the fact that
these type of tactics are really really
like morrising
um and Mr probably mean when you
introduce something into a conversation
to say nope you know people are asking
me about city council money and just and
then to say oh you know all right you
know is there something going on there I
don't know that is again another dog
whistle and you have been consistent um
with your doll whistles and your you
know really attempts to try to
criminalize certain people
um that are on the city council and I
happen to be one of those people again
our business of the city is what I would
much rather be spacing our time on
um not wasting our time on with this but
really dedicating to that just like
earlier Mr probably meaning when we're
talking about
garbage cans and trying to figure out
where the place you know where the place
them are and then and get a clear
picture of that instead of accepting the
fact like okay that's that's a
reasonable question and let's do this we
try to turn that into a power struggle
you are clearly are an obstructionist
and this is just you uh perpetuating
that behavior and I really would
appreciate um if you at least had the
integrity and if they need to just say
what's really on your mind stop trying
to proud of the people called me and
said and I don't know on this answer and
just really be who you say you are but
that's why people have their faith in me
thank you you're welcome but the
Integrity of this council is an aimed
we're each of us you don't like it
that's for you to dislike or not like
you want to talk about obstructionists
there's been nothing brought forward
from many members of this Council but
when they are they're consistently
objected to and that is proven all you
gotta do is watch the meetings there's
been a literate proposal that's been all
kinds of issues with uh specific stuff
that really had nothing to do with the
literate proposal itself there's been
obstruction of other issues that we
brought forward so we can talk about
obstructionists or not but the fact is
there were allegations made and they
deserved some sort of hearing now
whether or not they're true or not isn't
for me to determine you to determine is
for somebody else to determine that's
why there would be an investigation and
you want to talk about dog whistles
you're the one that blows the dog
whistles every time because it's
distract and deflect from an issue of
seriousness and that's what's going on
here and continuously happens every time
something happens there is a distract
and deflect method
so with that I'll be done Miss Miss
Patrick do you want to move over the
place I do yep so we have three items on
the agenda
um one
um is Safeco Insurance
ASO Jonathan Miller versus the city of
Schenectady the next is ramen and Paulie
versus city of Schenectady and the final
one is Southside Development LLC versus
city of Schenectady all three of these
need to be addressed in executive
session they all yes and the reason why
you want to go to Executive session has
to do with negotiating settlements of
litigation which is an exception to the
open meetings law the purposes of
executive session thank you so I'd like
to
um call us to be able to go into
executive session may I have a motion
for that so
um
I need a second I'm sorry okay okay
so we're going to go into the executive
session