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Hello to the members of the Commission. My name is Special Assistant Attorney General Patrick Reynolds.

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I'm going to be filling in for Kate Satek in her absence for facilitating these meetings. So looking forward to working with all of you.

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And without further ado, calling this meeting of the Inspector General Independent Advisory Commission to order.

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As our first agenda item, we have a few discussion in vote on the meeting minutes from the commission's last meeting.

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Just July 21st, 2026.

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Is there any discussion from any commission members on the draft of the meeting minutes?

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The commission to approve.

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Motion may in second it, all those in favor.

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All those opposed.

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Motion carries.

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these approved meeting minutes from the July 21 meeting will be posted after this meeting

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on the Secretary of State's website.

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Our next agenda item is a presentation from the President of the Association of Inspectors

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General to talk more about the Association of Inspectors General Certification Process.

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Based on questions raised in last week's meeting, I would like to briefly clarify the certification

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process and requirements for the certified inspector general and certified inspector general

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to investigate or credentials from the association of inspectors general.

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Most importantly, a person does not need to be or have been an inspector general to receive

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either of the AIG certifications required in Rhode Island statute.

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I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough about that last week.

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However, to obtain a professional certification from the association, those who attend

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our certification programs must currently be an employee of either an established OIG or another

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government agent, see with commensurate authority.

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The AIG certification institute has held twice a year in March and August and consists of

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35 hours of in-person training provided by anywhere from 10 to 15 instructors from around

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the country, who are from around the country, who are experts in investigations, audits, inspections

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and legal issues.

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The curriculum is reviewed by NASBA for CPA professional credits.

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All applications are submitted online and reviewed by the Association's Professional

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Certification Board, which is made up of AIG, current and former board members who evaluate

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each prospective institute, the TND.

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The following certification requirements are current as of the last application period, which

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from April 1 through July 17th,

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2026 for the upcoming August Institute.

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Applicants for the Inspector General

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investigator program must satisfy each of the following criteria.

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Currently employed in an office of Inspector General

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or agency with commensurate authority,

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performing or managing investigations,

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the applicant must have earned a bachelor's

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a graduate degree from an accredited college or university

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or have equivalent experience.

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Applicants to the certified Inspector General Program must satisfy the following criteria.

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As a senior level staff member in an Inspector General's office or agency with commensurate authority,

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or currently hold an appointed position as an Inspector General, including interim or acting Inspector General,

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or those who have received an appointment or at an agency with commensurate authority in public and a public jurisdiction.

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Currently, the AIG has recorded 1,129 certified inspectors general and 2,141 certified inspector general investigators.

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Some certified inspectors general may hold both certifications.

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Thank you, Mr. Fletcher, any further discussion?

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Yeah, I have a question, I read

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the statute I gather, and so when the statute requires a professional certificate from the association of inspectors general, including certified inspector general or certified inspector general investigator,

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it looks like according to the statute, the drafters believed.

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And I'm asking for affirmation that there were at least two types of certificates issued by the association.

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That, right?

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That's right.

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Are there others?

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There are others.

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You can be a certified inspector general.

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You can be, you can get a certificate certification in, as an auditor, as a site evaluator,

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or as the most recent certification is for counsel for lawyers who work in IG offices.

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I mean, the way the statute is written, you know, as the lawyer, one of the lawyers, sitting up here,

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actually we have three.

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I mean, I read that statute as the criteria holding any certificate from the association.

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It says, hold a professional certificate from the Association, including A or B, but not limited

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to A or B.

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So I just want to clarify that there are more than two sounds like certificates

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issued and the applicant for our purposes could have one or both or another from the association.

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That's why I read it.

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I don't know if you, it doesn't, it doesn't, it doesn't.

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It doesn't.

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It doesn't.

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It doesn't.

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It doesn't.

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It doesn't.

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that the language doesn't specifically exclude any of the certifications that you can receive

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from the organization, although it's specifically highlights to it.

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With your experience, from an advocate for the position that is described in our statute,

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for the 14th-day basis on what we're looking for here in Rhode Island, other certificates

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beyond the two specifically described in the statute, would we equally qualify?

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I would say that if the commission has allowed you to evaluate candidates who have the other certifications they would be worth talking to.

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But that's important to you now.

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What I am, my other question is,

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And, well, have a really odd part of the meaning.

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Could we at this point talk about when the certificate requirement attaches to that

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be important to discuss now when we have the way to later, which we discussed that now.

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And that's the next agenda topic, which obviously dovetails from this one, which is the discussion

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in possible vote on the qualifications for the inspector general, and I open the floor up for discussion

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on that agenda topic.

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So

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as we, as I mean to the statute, we, uh, we needed as the person was half of

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the certificate at the time of the vote by the government, um, but before the set was

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according to the one that is a week.

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And so based on that, we, if there were candidate who did not back

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candidate to go to the

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that would be a tiny issue here, for the other side, for the other side.

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Getting into Europe's certificate class does require a certain background to begin.

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But notice, even if we take set three names of them, and let's assume that none of them has to begin.

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They might not qualify for anything to your class.

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It's my experience that I then have the appointment from

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the mayor, from the governor that

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what's happened as a matter of practice, is that if somebody has been appointed an inspector

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general, that would alone be reason for them to be admitted into the class.

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Oh, that's good, okay, good.

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All right, that's important, because as you can see that by doing it,

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if that were not the case, we would narrow the breadth

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of the kinds of applicants that would be available

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for consideration, right?

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Because if our view, open for discussion, of course,

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for our view, as we read the statute is,

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You have to have that certificate at the time the governor sends the name to the Senate.

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Is that not correct, Patrick? Is that how we read it?

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That's our understanding, that's correct.

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Okay. So the way I've always considered it, which is slightly different than that,

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but I don't know that I'm correct about it.

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is that the governor nominates, but doesn't appoint right off the bat.

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There's a nomination, then it goes to the Senate for confirmation, and at that point if the person is confirmed, then the governor's office creates the appointment letter that gets sent out.

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So I've always considered that to be that later date following advice and consent to be the appointment, but I might have it wrong.

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Well, I guess the question turns on, at what point is appointment, does appointment attach, is it at the time, the name is sent, or is it at the point where the Senate confirms.

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And I don't know if the statute addresses that directly. Does anybody on my legal team know whether the statute addresses that directly?

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I don't believe it does, so I mean, I understand what you're saying.

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I think we looked at the specific language in this statute and it looked a little bit more

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like a point with advice and consent, but we can certainly, we'll give us more time.

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We'd give the candidate a little bit more time to get that certification if the appointment

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means the date the appointment letter is actually created.

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But I think what's clear, regardless of whether you read the statute, the way I read, we read it at the office of the way you read it, Mr. Grant, the governor is not going to be able to send a name to the Senate until, when's the next class?

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The very next one is August 13, registration is closed, so we're talking March.

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And so at that point the person having, which is just a handful of days, right?

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It's not a three month class, it's a two or three day class five days five day class.

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So at that point next March with the appointment in hand of the Governor could send the name to the Senate.

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Under your interpretation, Jason went, Mr. Graham, when, when could the governor transmit that aim?

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Well, he certainly could do it on the date you're talking about, I think.

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So by the time he makes that, well, that initial announcement,

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It's not a select.

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It counts.

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It counts.

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It's something spectacular.

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You know, what I'm suggesting is, it may be post-production consent, command, and

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it got that form in these.

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Which one question theory would allow the governor to send the appointment sooner or the nomination

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sooner?

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But we're read that way, in other words, the governor could send the name, the governor could send the name, the Senate could confirm, at that point, there would be an appointment, and then the class could take place.

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That would move the process up, right?

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I think the class would have to, in terms of time.

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prior to whatever we call the right, but it could be after the confirmation.

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Yeah, only your interpretation.

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Correct.

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So that interpreting the language that way, I'm not saying I agree with it, but I

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want to understand the stakes that we're talking about, would actually move the process up.

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I guess my question would be, how would we clarify that in the posting of the job?

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Well I think it has to be included and look, I think one of the things that we should think

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about is what litigation risk is there by getting it wrong and that may be something

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that perhaps we want to discuss in executive session

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because somebody agreed by the timing.

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May.

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And theory could bring a lawsuit alive, but there may be just pause for a second and seems the live stream has stopped working.

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So we're trying to see if we can get that back very well.

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So that's just a time to commission has voted to make into executive session.

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To discuss qualifications for attorney general as it may involve legal advice and strategy discussions that could implicate potential litigation,

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and laid to such qualifications, and thus is going to executive session,

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pursuant to Rhode Island General Laws, chapter 42-46-5A2.

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Following discussion, the commission will be returning to open session.

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You guys can come with, right?

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There you go.

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The inspector general's independent advisory commission.

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The commission has returned to back into open session from executive session.

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Is there a motion to seal the minutes of the July 29th, 2026 executive session?

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Make a motion to seal the minutes.

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Motion made and seconded all those in favour say aye.

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All those against motion carries.

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The commission met an executive session and discussion was had if the no votes were taken to report.

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Moving on to the next agenda item.

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Discussion and possible vote on job description.

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and qualifications and application process for Inspector General Candace.

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Secretary Murray.

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Thank you.

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Thank you, Patrick.

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Each of you have received this memo from our office with the proposed draft application

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process.

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Job description and salary range.

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And I know you had an opportunity to review this.

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Our team came to this memo in this proposal through research, kind of looking at the judicial

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nominating committee process, as well as the process used in Delaware to select their first

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inspector general, Delaware recently appointed their first inspector general in May of this year.

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So I'm going to present some highlights of this memo and propose what I think the commission

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should adopt moving forward. And of course, we want to hear feedback from the commission members

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as we go forward. So the job description section of the memo starts on, I'm sorry, the application

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process starts on page one and goes into page two.

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And you can see it specifically focuses

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on where the application would be advertised. It asks all of the members of the Advisory Commission

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who are able to do so to post on their social media channels website if applicable. Given

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the timeline of the commission's process, the application will be open for three weeks with

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deadline of Friday, August 21st, 2026 at 4 p.m.

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And if you compare that to the background of what Delaware did,

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they had it open for a month, but our timeline is more condensed than that.

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As applications are received, the Department of State staff will screen

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applications for completeness to ensure the applicant has met the minimum

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qualifications required pursuant to the statute, and that it may be

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Department of State staff will notify applicants via email that their application has been received and is complete.

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In complete applications will not be considered, and applicants will be notified that the Department of State staff

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that their application will not be reviewed by the Commission.

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Applicants who do not meet the minimum qualifications required pursuant to the statute,

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who are disqualified by the eligibility restrictions, will be notified by the Department of State staff

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that they do not meet the qualifications.

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applications will not be reviewed. When we get to complete applications, the Department of State

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staff will redact the names of the applicant from all pieces of the application packet and assign

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each applicant a unique identification number to facilitate a blind recruitment process. Each Friday

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during the application period, August 7th, 14th and 21st, at close of business, the Department

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staff will email in PDF format the redacted applications received that week to commission members

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or designated staff. Commission members will review the application prior to the next

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commission members. Excuse me, prior to the next commission meeting and the commission members

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will review and rank each of the applicants to the score 1 to 10, 10 indicating the strongest

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applicants. The Inspector General Independent Advisory Commission will meet during the week of Monday,

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August 24th, 2026 to Friday, August 28th if possible, to discuss the candidates and select

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six candidates of that application pool to interview.

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To facilitate the discussion, the Department of State will collect preliminary scores from

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all commission members and provide a total combined score for each applicant to the commission.

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After a voting to, after voting to approve the six candidates to interview,

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the Department of State staff will provide the names of the six applicants in open session

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for the record. And so, we'll open this up to discussion around that application's process.

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Mr. Secretary, so if we approve this today, you would post it by this Friday?

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That's correct.

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First, I want to say that this is still helpful.

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Great, gentlemen, we have the job description, everything, everything, and tasks.

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I just have a couple of notes, so I'll just add a little notes that I had here.

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Going down the Akron Chat part, one thing that I would suggest.

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So that's not part of the application for our citizens.

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Okay.

228
00:21:27,770 --> 00:21:28,330
Any other something?

229
00:21:28,330 --> 00:21:29,170
It's in the job.

230
00:21:29,390 --> 00:21:30,090
Job is correct.

231
00:21:30,570 --> 00:21:31,710
It's the letter for the interview.

232
00:21:32,010 --> 00:21:32,590
Oh, pardon.

233
00:21:33,670 --> 00:21:34,010
Okay.

234
00:21:34,330 --> 00:21:34,910
You should go back.

235
00:21:35,270 --> 00:21:35,470
Yep.

236
00:21:35,950 --> 00:21:37,190
It's the 7th of a little point.

237
00:21:38,630 --> 00:21:45,290
I'm going to suggest adding the eI commission to the back of the best standard part of the

238
00:21:45,290 --> 00:21:46,450
LGBTQ back of the checks.

239
00:21:46,710 --> 00:21:49,750
And the Senate also has the school loan when they do the behavior of their advice.

240
00:21:50,010 --> 00:21:52,670
And so we can just look for work of links.

241
00:21:52,670 --> 00:21:58,470
It's a pleasure to use the financial disclosure statements on a file, submit that to this commission.

242
00:21:59,670 --> 00:22:02,610
Sometimes it's relatively difficult, sometimes there's something interesting to go as well.

243
00:22:04,310 --> 00:22:09,510
And then also the issue, somewhere it says that we're going to ask you to do a financial disclosure,

244
00:22:09,930 --> 00:22:10,850
I don't even have this commission.

245
00:22:12,950 --> 00:22:19,530
My suggestion here would be that we have to continue to pay low financial disclosure statements.

246
00:22:19,530 --> 00:22:27,530
and submit to this mission, and not fly away against permission, as if they're just happy.

247
00:22:27,710 --> 00:22:28,490
It's a bad thing.

248
00:22:29,150 --> 00:22:35,490
And then if they are actually appointed to the position, then we have 30 days to fly away against.

249
00:22:35,650 --> 00:22:39,590
We would ask them to do it online when you all probably do it.

250
00:22:39,870 --> 00:22:44,870
But I just think it makes sense to just have a paper for our mother that just goes to us,

251
00:22:45,150 --> 00:22:46,670
confidentially in the beginning.

252
00:22:51,830 --> 00:22:54,990
I'm thrilled at the moment I'm not a school worker.

253
00:22:55,230 --> 00:22:58,930
I think that's true over the level of that.

254
00:23:04,490 --> 00:23:09,710
The issue of having this staff kind of do the preliminary scrutiny,

255
00:23:09,930 --> 00:23:12,390
finding out if I can, it makes a whole lot of sense.

256
00:23:12,730 --> 00:23:13,270
I think it's true.

257
00:23:13,270 --> 00:23:32,190
I would like for us, just as a matter of transparency and kind of delineating checks and balances if they could provide the commission with the list of who they just bought, and with a bullet going to the reason why something like that would be helpful.

258
00:23:32,190 --> 00:23:45,250
And then my last question, when we, on the top page 3, we're talking about the disqual

259
00:23:45,250 --> 00:23:51,810
line factors that we're going to tell people out, that number 2 and any other public

260
00:23:51,810 --> 00:23:57,610
officeholder, I wonder, and that's what the statute says, but I wonder if we want to clarify

261
00:23:57,610 --> 00:24:00,230
I'm going to have a patient, job description.

262
00:24:01,450 --> 00:24:03,650
If you agree with this interpretation,

263
00:24:04,370 --> 00:24:06,030
I assume we're talking about the elected

264
00:24:06,030 --> 00:24:07,190
public office worker.

265
00:24:08,030 --> 00:24:09,970
I assume that because it meant

266
00:24:09,970 --> 00:24:11,550
pulling it also, and it would have been

267
00:24:11,550 --> 00:24:12,910
no reason for not having to do it.

268
00:24:13,210 --> 00:24:15,050
We're going through it.

269
00:24:15,050 --> 00:24:15,230
We're going through it.

270
00:24:15,710 --> 00:24:17,710
We can't talk about it.

271
00:24:17,710 --> 00:24:20,290
Do I have my assumption is that that

272
00:24:20,290 --> 00:24:22,710
this fall of my factory number two

273
00:24:22,710 --> 00:24:24,010
would first of all be a human.

274
00:24:24,010 --> 00:24:30,250
I'd like to call the calls, and I see that state in, you know, soon.

275
00:24:31,370 --> 00:24:35,150
But I think we should clarify that to the staff, we were actually doing it as well.

276
00:24:35,490 --> 00:24:37,790
I think the students actually went there.

277
00:24:38,070 --> 00:24:38,070
That,

278
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:46,860
I guess, started to find a client and went into the call for that.

279
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:54,440
Those are the economics and other things.

280
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:56,480
They're just very helpful.

281
00:24:57,700 --> 00:25:02,900
And I guess if the leave of the committee all go next,

282
00:25:04,980 --> 00:25:06,380
you know, as somebody who's hired

283
00:25:06,380 --> 00:25:13,360
a lot of prosecutors over the course of the over my career, state and federal, and I

284
00:25:13,360 --> 00:25:19,820
equate this job, many of the skill sets, as I think Mr. Fletcher pointed out, are those

285
00:25:19,820 --> 00:25:25,500
of a prosecutor, frankly, less of an accountant, more of somebody who can get to truth

286
00:25:25,500 --> 00:25:27,160
and understand truth.

287
00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:31,880
I don't like the anonymous application process.

288
00:25:33,180 --> 00:25:36,920
I think that if you want this job of heavy responsibility,

289
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:44,020
then I think your name from jump ought to be out there.

290
00:25:44,660 --> 00:25:45,740
We'll get to that in a minute.

291
00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:51,280
If the intent of that is to somehow prevent some kind

292
00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:53,240
of bias on the part of the commission,

293
00:25:53,820 --> 00:25:55,800
I don't feel that it's necessary.

294
00:25:56,280 --> 00:26:01,980
Again, I make a lot of hiring decisions, hard to a lot of lawyers, well, over a hundred

295
00:26:01,980 --> 00:26:07,660
over the course of my career, a little long staff, and I rely on the interview process and

296
00:26:07,660 --> 00:26:11,840
the collective wisdom of the people who interview people with me to make the appropriate

297
00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:15,500
to make the appropriate choices.

298
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:20,600
I also think that the application, you know, if what we're talking about is a cover letter,

299
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:30,720
a background check and a resume. I don't know how that's got so little to it. I just don't

300
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:35,760
understand why it needs to be anonymized. I mean, so I don't feel like it's necessary

301
00:26:36,820 --> 00:26:47,620
for me to make fair decisions about who to interview. And I also feel like if the intent

302
00:26:47,620 --> 00:26:55,640
is to protect someone who might not apply and could be both or one of the other.

303
00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:02,460
Then my view is that if you're going to apply for this job, then which is an important

304
00:27:03,260 --> 00:27:10,320
job, excuse me, and Rhode Islanders are going to be looking to this person for answers

305
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:16,280
and quickly, then you should have the confidence in the willingness to put your name out

306
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:20,040
And, you know, moving forward, you know, how we interview these candidates,

307
00:27:22,580 --> 00:27:31,860
is going to be one that I would like to be as public as possible, so I would expect them sitting right in front of us, and, you know, all right, we've got their resume.

308
00:27:32,620 --> 00:27:36,620
I'll get to some of the other components in a minute, but let's just talk about the resume and the cover letter.

309
00:27:36,620 --> 00:27:40,220
Kind of a letter will say, virtually nothing that helps frankly.

310
00:27:40,940 --> 00:27:44,680
So what we'll be looking at is the educational background work experience,

311
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:47,760
so we'll want to probe and I think that should be on the record.

312
00:27:48,940 --> 00:27:52,940
And frankly, any bias that comes from that people will see in plain sight.

313
00:27:53,220 --> 00:27:56,100
So I just don't see the need to do it that way.

314
00:27:56,260 --> 00:27:58,180
It seems cumbersome to me.

315
00:27:59,360 --> 00:28:03,740
And I also feel like we,

316
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:11,820
I don't suspect that we're going to be overwhelmed with candidates, so I don't feel like I need someone staff,

317
00:28:12,020 --> 00:28:15,920
mine or anyone else's, to advise me on who to interview or not.

318
00:28:16,180 --> 00:28:23,340
I want to make that call myself, particularly given that, again, what you're going to be looking at is a resume and a cover letter for the most part.

319
00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,360
And perhaps the results of a background check.

320
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:33,120
And so I have other things to bring up, but rather than go through the laundry list and keep coming back to one or the other,

321
00:28:33,820 --> 00:28:39,260
I don't want to suggest my laundry list is incredibly long, but there are things in here as well

322
00:28:39,260 --> 00:28:43,480
Don't as this is that I want to expand upon a little bit.

323
00:28:43,940 --> 00:28:46,180
I think maybe we could start with that issue.

324
00:28:46,980 --> 00:28:53,360
So the screening process was pulled from the Delaware process, and it's just the screening process.

325
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:59,420
So to get to your finalists, and then obviously the finalists would be, would be known.

326
00:28:59,420 --> 00:29:00,940
those names would be known.

327
00:29:02,740 --> 00:29:05,620
So the reasoning behind it is not necessarily

328
00:29:05,620 --> 00:29:09,600
for the applicant, it's for the commission members

329
00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:12,640
to take a look at the applications and determine

330
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:17,460
based on those applications, who is qualified plus,

331
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:20,220
based on what we've heard from Mr. Fletcher,

332
00:29:21,100 --> 00:29:22,720
to narrow that group down.

333
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:25,960
And I don't know what to predict for the application pool.

334
00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:28,700
But if there is a significant application pool,

335
00:29:29,980 --> 00:29:33,960
this is a way to ensure that we're looking at qualifications

336
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:41,040
and experience only a not a name associated with whoever

337
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:42,020
that person might be.

338
00:29:42,420 --> 00:29:45,680
So the intent, I believe in Delaware, and the intent here,

339
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:48,540
is not necessarily that the person who is applying

340
00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:53,000
is kept anonymous, so that the process in winnowing

341
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:57,660
down the number of applicants to a group of finalists

342
00:29:57,660 --> 00:29:59,240
is done blindly.

343
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:25,460
Mr. Secretary, this is here that there will send us six applicants, right? So, six will, but we'll determine the six. Okay. Based on the first part of the review, and then meetings, where we discussed those applicants that we've chosen, through the, through the blind process, based on what we see as their resumes.

344
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:36,320
But what would any one of us be able to do appropriately on our own with a name to learn more about them?

345
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:40,400
Like, for example, when somebody applied in my office to be in the Sistine Islands, it's a turning.

346
00:30:40,420 --> 00:30:42,380
They weren't going to go through a background check.

347
00:30:42,580 --> 00:30:45,000
They're going to go through a hiring committee. They're going to come to me eventually.

348
00:30:46,100 --> 00:30:47,940
But we wanted to know the consequences they handled.

349
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:52,460
We wanted to know whether or not judges had disciplined them.

350
00:30:52,460 --> 00:31:00,820
You know, these are all things that would go well, if I run this person in Google and the first thing comes up is that Judge Leesie had a real problem with this person.

351
00:31:00,980 --> 00:31:11,660
I'm not going to hire that person. I'm not even going to consider them. Certainly not the expense of somebody else who want to perform that kind of really basic basic look in says, okay.

352
00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:17,820
All right, this person has a pretty good track of look. They drive that big case out in LA or they handle that big, you know,

353
00:31:17,820 --> 00:31:19,960
It's like the tunnel case, well, that's,

354
00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:22,200
somebody give that person a lot of responsibility.

355
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:23,460
I want to know that.

356
00:31:23,900 --> 00:31:25,160
Now, maybe that's in the cover letter.

357
00:31:25,340 --> 00:31:27,560
Maybe it's not, maybe the positive is in there.

358
00:31:27,900 --> 00:31:29,480
Maybe the negative isn't.

359
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:35,800
Again, I feel like knowing who I am looking at

360
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:38,220
with the ability to do some common sense.

361
00:31:38,420 --> 00:31:42,000
Oh my, not doing a rolling quorum or anything.

362
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:46,720
Arms me to better say, hey, look, this person,

363
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:48,580
whether they're from Rhode Island or not,

364
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:52,840
is somebody who has the pelts on the wall

365
00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:55,260
to really get this done.

366
00:31:57,660 --> 00:32:02,620
And I think those things, I think that could be helpful.

367
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:06,760
So that's, and I find the point ranking thing

368
00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:11,480
to be an artificial way of getting to a good candidate.

369
00:32:11,620 --> 00:32:14,780
I feel that's more of an art than a science.

370
00:32:15,740 --> 00:32:20,800
And again, having hired a lot of, you know, I will, I will say, I think really good

371
00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:27,060
people, you know, I think when there is, there's more of an art than a science, and

372
00:32:27,060 --> 00:32:35,900
I want us to have more, more stake in the game, and more, more information at our fingertips

373
00:32:35,900 --> 00:32:40,340
other than a cover letter, and this is my resume.

374
00:32:40,340 --> 00:32:51,800
But the idea is that the staff would review it based on this process and then we would have access.

375
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,820
Well, that's been on base on base qualifications.

376
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:57,560
So which is the rest of the man to cover that?

377
00:32:57,740 --> 00:32:58,760
So it's a good person.

378
00:32:58,900 --> 00:33:04,760
But an application will be more than it'll, it'll, I assume when you're applying for this job,

379
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:09,620
you're going to demonstrate the things they required in the, in the, the mandated requirements.

380
00:33:09,620 --> 00:33:19,920
When you're applying, you're going to say from this date to this date, this is what I did to your point, some big case.

381
00:33:21,220 --> 00:33:31,040
And so I agree that when you get to a pool of six or eight, then yes, that is entirely public process.

382
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:39,320
And this is a public process as well. And the point ranking is not based, that doesn't determine who the finalists are.

383
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:46,700
that just gives you kind of a guideline as to how we all interpreted the application.

384
00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:50,980
But I'm just going to intent, speaking to intent as to why this was put for me.

385
00:33:50,980 --> 00:33:51,880
No, I understand.

386
00:33:52,300 --> 00:33:55,100
I mean, to me, give me the resumes, just speak for myself.

387
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:58,200
I would like to see the resumes, I'd like to see who's applied,

388
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:02,160
I'd like to be able to just learn when I can learn about them,

389
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:06,960
and then come, you know, if come to a meeting here in public,

390
00:34:08,300 --> 00:34:15,720
identify the people who have applied, identify what about them, you know, go

391
00:34:15,720 --> 00:34:20,300
on one by one. I don't, you know, if we have a 200 rule deal with that one,

392
00:34:20,380 --> 00:34:23,780
the time comes, what if we have 10, both of them one by one, and here's what we

393
00:34:23,780 --> 00:34:26,260
know about them, and here's what, here's what we think.

394
00:34:26,660 --> 00:34:30,300
So I think that, to me, you know, more reasonable is, you know, I have the staff

395
00:34:30,300 --> 00:34:37,120
that they listed based on experiencing qualifications wants to get to us to give us to us

396
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:41,160
with all the information so that we have a full picture of who is president.

397
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:47,280
But I think from a staff perspective, be great for them to, you know, give their due diligence

398
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:55,260
as well as to who's qualified and I want to say rank it but put it in a way that shows

399
00:34:55,260 --> 00:34:57,860
who's more qualified than that for them.

400
00:34:57,860 --> 00:35:03,000
the who staff is that is it's it's the combination of five staff but the proposal is not

401
00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:08,540
for the staff to do that the proposal is for the staff to eliminate non-qualified people

402
00:35:08,540 --> 00:35:15,300
based on the specific requirements of the job so so if you don't hold a batches or above

403
00:35:15,300 --> 00:35:20,800
degree you're not going to be screen you don't you never make it to your destiny so that's the

404
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:27,120
only thing but the staff is again but how many people are not going to self are not going to

405
00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:37,120
I don't know if it would be so unself-aware that based on those very frankly clear statutory career.

406
00:35:41,220 --> 00:35:45,280
But it's going to be clear the way we're going to talk about it in a minute.

407
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:46,520
It's going to be pretty clear, right?

408
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:49,940
So you're going to either have that certificate or not.

409
00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:52,500
So you either have a bachelor's or you're not.

410
00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:54,640
You're going to have a certificate or you're not.

411
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:57,520
you're going to have 10 years of experience or you're not.

412
00:35:58,420 --> 00:36:01,460
How much help do we need to sort out those people?

413
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,280
And I would say zero.

414
00:36:04,860 --> 00:36:06,480
Give me the information.

415
00:36:07,260 --> 00:36:10,460
On the appointee, I don't need staff to help me make that decision.

416
00:36:11,100 --> 00:36:12,260
I want to see it.

417
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:13,580
I want to be able to vote.

418
00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:16,760
I want the whole University of People who've Applied.

419
00:36:17,540 --> 00:36:20,440
And I want the public to see every single person

420
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,500
that's put their name in that hat

421
00:36:22,500 --> 00:36:27,580
So that nobody thinks anybody was excluded or included for any particular reason or another.

422
00:36:28,220 --> 00:36:29,280
Let's see the resumes.

423
00:36:29,740 --> 00:36:32,720
Let's the public have them. Let's bring them before us.

424
00:36:33,020 --> 00:36:34,320
Let's walk through the qualifications.

425
00:36:34,980 --> 00:36:37,180
Let's vote on six or five or seven.

426
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:38,800
I don't know what the magic of six is.

427
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,080
To interview, we can decide that now or later.

428
00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:44,060
And then go ahead and interview and sit right here in front of us.

429
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:47,540
So that everybody watching on Capitol TV sees the whole process.

430
00:36:47,720 --> 00:36:48,740
Start to finish.

431
00:36:48,980 --> 00:36:50,000
Nobody's excluded.

432
00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:53,160
There's no risks included by anyone other than us.

433
00:36:53,580 --> 00:36:59,560
To me, that's transparent, and it helps us who are tasked

434
00:36:59,560 --> 00:37:02,000
with ultimately the decision-making process

435
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:03,680
to get to the list.

436
00:37:03,860 --> 00:37:07,240
Whether we agree on which six or three to set, who knows?

437
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:09,100
Well, we'll get there.

438
00:37:09,700 --> 00:37:13,920
We'll figure that out, but that's the process that I think

439
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:18,180
helps me decide who I'm going to recommend or vote

440
00:37:18,180 --> 00:37:23,940
recommend to the governor to choose and that's that's I've got one fifth of that

441
00:37:23,940 --> 00:37:29,000
responsibility I want all the information in front of me to be able to make the

442
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:32,740
best decision I can make on behalf of the people of the state of Rhode Island

443
00:37:32,740 --> 00:37:39,060
entrusted with this responsibility so you know those are my those are my thoughts

444
00:37:39,060 --> 00:37:42,200
on that I don't need to be the dead horse you know I think I've I've waited

445
00:37:42,740 --> 00:37:46,380
out and it doesn't mean I'm right it's just that's how I do it

446
00:37:46,380 --> 00:37:51,260
If I follow up to what you said, can I just go, just a practical question, are you?

447
00:37:51,260 --> 00:38:01,040
How are you envisioning that, once we, let's say, we get 50 applicants, or just call it 50 applicants,

448
00:38:02,100 --> 00:38:11,320
are we going to discuss their qualifying and disqualifying all 50 of them by name in open

449
00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:11,680
session?

450
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:19,160
I would. I think if you're applying for this job, this job to me is as close to a constitutional officer

451
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:23,940
as you can get without being a constitutional officer. I mean, if you think of the way to respond,

452
00:38:24,060 --> 00:38:28,120
you're giving them subpoena power. You're giving them the power to swear people under oath.

453
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:33,500
You're giving them the power to write reports which I can't do. I can't do using a grand jury

454
00:38:33,500 --> 00:38:39,480
because that bill's never passed. So you're giving this person as close to an attorney general's power

455
00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:45,400
as you're going to get and it seems to me that if you want that power then you should put your name out there

456
00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:53,660
and be judged on your resume in public and that gives the people of the state confidence that we looked at all 50

457
00:38:53,660 --> 00:38:59,020
these are the names because before you know they're going to do their good research right if we don't do it

458
00:38:59,020 --> 00:39:04,700
they're going to do it right and so so let's let's not put any blinders on

459
00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:11,440
What's see how many resumes come in now if we get 2,000 resumes when we come back together and we say listen

460
00:39:12,180 --> 00:39:14,660
Nobody nobody was a look at 2,000 resumes

461
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:20,860
A lot of these resumes are clearly or our peer to be clearly of people aren't qualified

462
00:39:20,860 --> 00:39:24,700
Well then we can come up with a different process. I just don't think that's going to be necessary

463
00:39:25,500 --> 00:39:28,460
So that's why that's why I'm trying to answer I mean again

464
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:32,920
We could do it differently obviously, but but I think the more

465
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:42,100
given the awesome responsibility that this statute in the General Assembly has given to this person as close to an attorney general as you're going to find.

466
00:39:42,420 --> 00:39:45,400
The only thing they don't have is a grand jury as far as I can tell.

467
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:50,040
And which means a can, and they can't go to the spirit court to immunize the witness, but they're that close.

468
00:39:50,580 --> 00:39:55,100
And let me say, when you wish you a report, as somebody who's issued reports, people don't like it.

469
00:39:55,380 --> 00:39:57,520
People don't like it, people in power don't like it.

470
00:39:57,640 --> 00:39:59,260
That's an awesome responsibility.

471
00:39:59,260 --> 00:40:05,880
So you better be ready for the moment, and I think we should, and the public should see exactly who

472
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:10,440
we're considering, and how we're willing people in, and how we're willing people out.

473
00:40:12,180 --> 00:40:12,620
That's my answer.

474
00:40:17,110 --> 00:40:25,390
First of all, I want to say thanks, echo the executive directors, comments about the work that

475
00:40:25,390 --> 00:40:25,890
you're off of, too.

476
00:40:26,190 --> 00:40:26,730
Thank you.

477
00:40:26,730 --> 00:40:52,890
Secondly, these may be housekeeping things, but is it the normal procedure that when you submit a job application through your office or through to the state of Rhode Island that candidates would have to attest to the truth of their bonifies, their resume, their qualifications, at some point in the application?

478
00:40:56,060 --> 00:41:06,300
I'd recommend that you do, you'd say everything in here is true because you'd have a standalone basis to qualify someone if they were to make a false representation in the application.

479
00:41:06,300 --> 00:41:08,000
The second thing is,

480
00:41:11,180 --> 00:41:22,840
I would ask on behalf of my association that the application materials make it clear that by submitting the application,

481
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:33,500
And the AIG is permitted to share with this commission, the certification that they've received.

482
00:41:33,660 --> 00:41:38,800
In other words, if you just write us and say, does this person have a certain certification?

483
00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:41,380
We don't say, yeah, so it's not a public, right?

484
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:47,160
So by submitting this application, you're saying, yes, I can, we can, that this association can disclose those details.

485
00:41:52,290 --> 00:41:53,910
I have more, but I don't know.

486
00:41:53,910 --> 00:41:57,670
So let's get through the application process first

487
00:41:57,670 --> 00:41:59,590
and then we'll go to the next part.

488
00:42:00,290 --> 00:42:04,410
So if we were to eliminate the blind aspect of this,

489
00:42:04,410 --> 00:42:11,550
you receive every application and there's no staff

490
00:42:11,550 --> 00:42:13,710
who are done to eliminate folks who don't need

491
00:42:13,710 --> 00:42:14,650
minimum qualifications.

492
00:42:15,570 --> 00:42:18,450
Each other five members gets the entire package.

493
00:42:19,950 --> 00:42:22,310
Unredact with the person's name.

494
00:42:23,050 --> 00:42:30,250
How about the other recommendations that Jason made remind you Jason's a little bit.

495
00:42:30,530 --> 00:42:34,390
Oh, that was just include ethics commission in the background.

496
00:42:34,430 --> 00:42:35,390
Oh, yeah.

497
00:42:35,670 --> 00:42:36,070
Yeah.

498
00:42:36,230 --> 00:42:36,570
I have.

499
00:42:37,250 --> 00:42:39,090
I personally have no objection to those already.

500
00:42:39,190 --> 00:42:40,530
I guess I would have said so at the time.

501
00:42:40,550 --> 00:42:44,170
Yeah, I just wanted to get us to the point where we can go on that application process,

502
00:42:44,170 --> 00:42:45,510
including your suggestions.

503
00:42:45,990 --> 00:42:46,270
Yep.

504
00:42:46,650 --> 00:42:47,470
I'm not there yet.

505
00:42:47,770 --> 00:42:49,250
I have other things to go with.

506
00:42:49,330 --> 00:42:49,370
Yeah.

507
00:42:49,570 --> 00:42:49,850
I do.

508
00:42:49,850 --> 00:42:59,750
Yes, I do. So, there's something in the application process about complete this. Will there be an opportunity or should

509
00:42:59,750 --> 00:43:01,770
to be an opportunity for the applicant to cure?

510
00:43:04,750 --> 00:43:09,310
So, you know, whatever, whatever the criteria is,

511
00:43:09,730 --> 00:43:14,950
they didn't include it. They don't, they don't, they don't attach this certificate. Will someone

512
00:43:14,950 --> 00:43:21,690
staff member presumably say, okay, he didn't attach this with their at least be that opportunity to cure.

513
00:43:21,810 --> 00:43:27,130
I think it should be, frankly, obviously if they don't have a bachelor degree, you know,

514
00:43:27,550 --> 00:43:32,050
they can't cure that within whatever the three-week timeframe, but there may be some sort of technical

515
00:43:32,050 --> 00:43:38,330
aspect that's missing. Sure, so we would all get the applications. If we shifted to your proposed

516
00:43:38,330 --> 00:43:44,730
we get the applications and then if any one of us saw an application that looked like it was missing

517
00:43:44,730 --> 00:43:48,090
something that could possibly be cured, we can bring that to the edge.

518
00:43:48,090 --> 00:43:51,590
Yeah, well, I think that's, I think that's correct or it could be simply a ministerial

519
00:43:51,590 --> 00:43:55,550
establishment work could reach out, they're going to have access to them too, and they could

520
00:43:55,550 --> 00:43:59,190
offer the candidate an opportunity to cure without a vote.

521
00:43:59,270 --> 00:44:03,430
I don't know that it needs to vote, maybe we wouldn't want to give them that opportunity.

522
00:44:03,430 --> 00:44:03,910
I

523
00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:10,760
don't object to that, I don't know.

524
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:15,460
Okay, so when do we, it wasn't clear to me,

525
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:16,980
so this is more of a question or anything else.

526
00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:19,100
The background checks, when will they be done?

527
00:44:19,640 --> 00:44:24,720
Will they be done prior to our decision

528
00:44:24,720 --> 00:44:30,460
who to interview and the interview itself?

529
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:35,780
Or will it follow after the six or three are selected?

530
00:44:35,780 --> 00:44:42,800
I think the process is outlined here, it would happen when the six were selected, the finalists.

531
00:44:43,180 --> 00:44:46,400
For interview, do we know how long it takes?

532
00:44:46,700 --> 00:44:49,380
I'm assuming we're going to task the state police will just task.

533
00:44:50,460 --> 00:44:50,820
That right?

534
00:44:53,020 --> 00:44:59,690
And do we have any idea what their bandwidth is to do it?

535
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:10,320
No obligation to do it. And the scope of the background check that that is being anticipated. So, for example, there's

536
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:17,900
the kind of background check that you do, which frankly is not, not very extensive. You go through the

537
00:45:17,900 --> 00:45:24,520
presidential appointment process. That's a background check. They talk to everybody that you've ever

538
00:45:24,520 --> 00:45:27,700
work for since your 18th birthday, federal service,

539
00:45:27,780 --> 00:45:29,480
generally I think it's 70 years, it's 20 years,

540
00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:30,700
it goes back to 18th birthday.

541
00:45:32,540 --> 00:45:37,760
I don't have in my head the scope of what the background

542
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:41,300
check should be, except I do think it should be more

543
00:45:41,300 --> 00:45:46,480
than just the running of an NCIC and a AAAI and a BCI.

544
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:49,060
I think, for example, you should provide an end

545
00:45:49,060 --> 00:45:49,920
worth statement.

546
00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:53,260
You know, we're not just looking for conflicts.

547
00:45:53,260 --> 00:46:04,120
We're looking for things that may subject this person to influence, extortion, the person may have been,

548
00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:06,300
have discharged dead in bankruptcy.

549
00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:12,500
That may or may not weigh in to the more esoteric qualifications that your staff has identified,

550
00:46:12,700 --> 00:46:13,660
I think, quite correctly.

551
00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:21,000
So I think understanding the scope of that background check and how long it will take to be done,

552
00:46:23,260 --> 00:46:25,140
We should give some talk to you.

553
00:46:25,140 --> 00:46:26,940
I don't know what the analog is.

554
00:46:27,240 --> 00:46:29,280
My sense is, is that in state service.

555
00:46:29,620 --> 00:46:31,360
It's not extensive enough.

556
00:46:33,300 --> 00:46:35,260
But I think we could start with,

557
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:37,780
maybe this is what the staff conditions I don't know.

558
00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:40,400
What they do for judicial candidates.

559
00:46:40,780 --> 00:46:41,620
I don't know what that is.

560
00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:43,180
I'd like to know more about it,

561
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:45,780
because I sometimes based on, well,

562
00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:46,820
I don't want to go farther than that.

563
00:46:46,820 --> 00:46:54,680
I just, my sense is that that some of these background checks that are done for state positions don't go far enough.

564
00:46:57,250 --> 00:47:05,890
Yeah, I think the background check basis was kind of in the traditional momentary committee, so that that process.

565
00:47:06,210 --> 00:47:07,070
Would we know what that is?

566
00:47:07,070 --> 00:47:12,550
Which I can't speak to specifically, other than it's a intensive process conducted by the state police.

567
00:47:12,630 --> 00:47:13,350
Do you have any staff?

568
00:47:13,350 --> 00:47:18,950
I don't know if they are the ready-cifix of the background check.

569
00:47:23,970 --> 00:47:25,870
This is the end of the Chief of State policy.

570
00:47:26,210 --> 00:47:32,310
We did not research or contemplate the background check process because we only went through the application.

571
00:47:33,610 --> 00:47:36,810
And this was not something we proposed to be in the application.

572
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:49,440
understood, but doesn't the application by putting in timelines require us to consider as

573
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:53,360
a practical matter, the length of time it will take to do a backroach.

574
00:47:53,480 --> 00:47:57,060
So one of the things that Stapley's tell us, it's going to take us six weeks.

575
00:47:58,020 --> 00:48:03,260
I mean, it was 90 days in the federal service to do a backroach, and you've got 25 applicants.

576
00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:06,940
You know that will never be interviewing anybody before Christmas.

577
00:48:06,940 --> 00:48:14,500
So without envisioning what that background check looks like and how extensive it needs to be.

578
00:48:14,640 --> 00:48:19,000
For again, this incredibly important position that we're talking about.

579
00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:25,580
I just think some, I think what we need to do to cut to a solution rather than to simply raise the question is.

580
00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:29,260
I think that my office can go back as we work with the state police.

581
00:48:29,700 --> 00:48:33,420
Find out the willingness, find out what resources they'll commit to it.

582
00:48:33,660 --> 00:48:35,360
Find out how long it will take to do it.

583
00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:41,870
find out what the process is for judicial nominees and come back at the next meeting so that we know

584
00:48:43,420 --> 00:48:48,960
exactly what that time line is so we can build that into our application process.

585
00:48:50,500 --> 00:48:52,520
Right because there's me, I don't want any of you so many people.

586
00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:56,830
I don't want to embarrass them with nothing else, right?

587
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:03,900
So that was that was background check and so staff, AG staff, can we to me do that?

588
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:12,340
I had a question about six, but I guess six is as good as eight, or as good as seven, or five,

589
00:49:14,790 --> 00:49:15,750
should do the interview?

590
00:49:16,090 --> 00:49:19,830
Does the application should it tell the interviews?

591
00:49:20,830 --> 00:49:25,690
What the applications will, what the interviews will look like?

592
00:49:26,390 --> 00:49:35,190
You know, the applicant should be aware prepared to be interviewed in public before by the members of the country.

593
00:49:35,190 --> 00:49:39,230
mission. I think it should. Yeah. And that's included. It doesn't

594
00:49:39,230 --> 00:49:42,330
include it. Thank you. Sorry, Mr. That. All right, great. We'll get

595
00:49:42,330 --> 00:49:44,590
to salary range in a minute.

596
00:49:47,510 --> 00:49:48,950
And we talked about the background

597
00:49:49,610 --> 00:49:50,130
check.

598
00:49:52,210 --> 00:49:58,410
So to link in the executive session, James, do you want to

599
00:49:58,730 --> 00:50:04,070
be that? I'm just looking because I'm tired of talking. I think

600
00:50:04,070 --> 00:50:13,670
I think we all agree that we were going to stay true to the letter of the law and

601
00:50:13,670 --> 00:50:20,050
base the application process on the specifications of the requirements that an applicant needs

602
00:50:20,050 --> 00:50:21,950
at the time of applying.

603
00:50:22,710 --> 00:50:27,390
So I think that that was the general consensus, but I don't know if anyone else instead of

604
00:50:27,390 --> 00:50:27,570
different.

605
00:50:28,350 --> 00:50:30,150
Did we tee that up correctly, Patrick?

606
00:50:31,030 --> 00:50:31,970
That sounds accurate to me.

607
00:50:31,970 --> 00:50:35,090
So just so I have it clear in my head.

608
00:50:35,250 --> 00:50:40,630
So what we're saying here is that part of the statute that requires

609
00:50:41,410 --> 00:50:46,410
a certificate, a professional certificate from the Association

610
00:50:46,410 --> 00:50:51,590
of Inspector's General, that that certificate be in hand

611
00:50:51,590 --> 00:50:53,530
at the time of the application.

612
00:50:53,890 --> 00:50:57,850
That is how we collectively read that provision based

613
00:50:57,850 --> 00:51:00,970
on the plain language of the statute.

614
00:51:02,710 --> 00:51:04,490
And then I think it's what we found consensus.

615
00:51:04,810 --> 00:51:05,410
Is that accurate?

616
00:51:08,270 --> 00:51:12,230
Yeah, I think that it wasn't written crystal clear,

617
00:51:13,170 --> 00:51:15,310
but at least speaking for myself,

618
00:51:16,590 --> 00:51:18,670
I think that was the intent of it

619
00:51:18,670 --> 00:51:21,570
that otherwise it would have said within three months

620
00:51:21,570 --> 00:51:23,270
and it refers to a candidate.

621
00:51:24,490 --> 00:51:26,290
So I agree with that interpretation.

622
00:51:28,110 --> 00:51:33,590
And the last thing that I have is the salary range, I just think, our salary range is too low.

623
00:51:33,690 --> 00:51:37,990
I appreciate the staff as they did an excellent job on the application, giving us the

624
00:51:39,610 --> 00:51:47,050
comps, but I think that, again, given the expectations of the general assembly and the public

625
00:51:47,050 --> 00:51:52,390
with respect to this job and how difficult it's going to be, I think the salary range is too low

626
00:51:52,390 --> 00:51:57,830
to get an extraordinary candidate, which I think we want, and so I would recommend that

627
00:51:57,830 --> 00:52:02,270
salary range be 175 to 225.

628
00:52:08,910 --> 00:52:10,210
I support that.

629
00:52:11,750 --> 00:52:14,290
So those are my only comments on the application.

630
00:52:14,850 --> 00:52:15,190
Thank you.

631
00:52:15,570 --> 00:52:15,810
Of course.

632
00:52:16,770 --> 00:52:26,490
I'd like to get some background on what salary range would appeal to someone who is taking on this.

633
00:52:27,250 --> 00:52:33,350
And obviously the Delaware salary is even lower than the bottom and of this salary range that is proposed.

634
00:52:33,350 --> 00:52:37,250
than that person had to do the exact same thing that this person's going to have to do,

635
00:52:37,330 --> 00:52:38,650
which is established the office.

636
00:52:39,790 --> 00:52:40,870
So I just want to get some background.

637
00:52:41,070 --> 00:52:46,190
I don't disagree that we want to attract someone to this position and in order to do so

638
00:52:46,190 --> 00:52:49,690
and to expand the application pool, that certainly would be a way to do that.

639
00:52:49,950 --> 00:52:51,270
But I'd like to get some background.

640
00:52:51,550 --> 00:52:59,070
So our research on this shows that the salary range for statewide IGs from the information

641
00:52:59,070 --> 00:53:08,230
that we could find publicly was from $98,500 all the way up to $271,000.

642
00:53:08,610 --> 00:53:15,410
Massachusetts being $188,000 and Delaware being $1,195.

643
00:53:15,770 --> 00:53:23,070
So I think that what's being discussed or potentially situating that salary range within

644
00:53:23,070 --> 00:53:27,830
Massachusetts, which is your neighbor or state and also Delaware, which is the most recent

645
00:53:27,830 --> 00:53:32,430
state to stand up in office of Inspector General, I think would be a competitive salary range.

646
00:53:32,570 --> 00:53:35,270
I think that would be good.

647
00:53:35,650 --> 00:53:36,450
That would be good.

648
00:53:37,030 --> 00:53:37,730
That would be good.

649
00:53:37,890 --> 00:53:41,050
It's with the range that was just, that you just proposed.

650
00:53:43,290 --> 00:53:47,850
All right, so we would effectively be increasing it for one fifty five to one seventy five to one

651
00:53:47,850 --> 00:53:50,190
seventy five to two twenty five.

652
00:53:50,210 --> 00:53:50,790
Is that correct?

653
00:53:51,130 --> 00:53:52,090
That's correct.

654
00:53:53,610 --> 00:53:55,330
Then we can take more comment on that.

655
00:53:58,590 --> 00:54:06,230
I'm mostly comfortable with that enhanced range, given the unique nature of what it's going

656
00:54:06,230 --> 00:54:07,150
to take.

657
00:54:08,470 --> 00:54:15,310
I find a person who's not just a good inspector general, but a person who can come into

658
00:54:15,310 --> 00:54:23,390
us and create an agency that doesn't exist, that's going to have to hire 100% of the rest

659
00:54:23,390 --> 00:54:28,530
of the staff is going to have to build this thing from the ground up.

660
00:54:28,630 --> 00:54:33,070
It really will take an incredible skill set to do that.

661
00:54:34,270 --> 00:54:37,630
So at least for this first five-year term,

662
00:54:37,970 --> 00:54:41,530
that sounds like from what the state's asking of that person.

663
00:54:41,550 --> 00:54:44,970
That sounds like a reasonable range to me.

664
00:54:45,270 --> 00:54:48,670
So that's something we should specifically take a vote on.

665
00:54:49,050 --> 00:54:51,530
Yeah, maybe I don't feel like I should have to do this.

666
00:54:51,530 --> 00:54:57,210
going to do it anyway. I have just so it's clear since I propose the salary range and I have

667
00:54:57,210 --> 00:55:02,070
some of the qualifications for this job. I can guarantee and promise the people the state of

668
00:55:02,070 --> 00:55:08,090
Rhode that I will never ever apply for this job. I'm prevented by the revolving door, but

669
00:55:08,090 --> 00:55:16,170
I can promise you I will never ever apply for this job. Hold this certificate. Yes,

670
00:55:21,510 --> 00:55:21,510
I don't

671
00:55:21,510 --> 00:55:28,050
How make the motion to create a salary range between 175 and 25?

672
00:55:30,050 --> 00:55:33,130
Second, motion made in the seconded.

673
00:55:33,590 --> 00:55:34,530
Is there any third discussion?

674
00:55:35,770 --> 00:55:37,210
All those in favor say aye?

675
00:55:38,290 --> 00:55:38,610
Opposed?

676
00:55:39,150 --> 00:55:39,970
Motion carries.

677
00:55:41,590 --> 00:55:46,750
But I guess the other motion I would make is to start the application process anyways so that

678
00:55:46,750 --> 00:55:55,410
position is advertised, is that we do everything that we suggested here, including the changes

679
00:55:55,410 --> 00:56:04,790
that both Jason and the general suggested with the one exception of the background check

680
00:56:04,790 --> 00:56:07,390
process, which we will come back to.

681
00:56:08,750 --> 00:56:11,790
I guess my question is, are we able to do that?

682
00:56:11,790 --> 00:56:18,330
Can we put an application process out there without knowing the timeline?

683
00:56:19,630 --> 00:56:25,290
I think we're telling the applicants there's going to be a background check, but can we do that without knowing a specific timeline?

684
00:56:26,350 --> 00:56:33,030
Well, I think we can without committing to what the timeline will be after the application closes, right?

685
00:56:33,930 --> 00:56:40,040
So there may be a gap in theory between when the application process closes and when the interviews would start

686
00:56:40,040 --> 00:56:43,240
Well, those background checks are concluded.

687
00:56:44,120 --> 00:56:49,640
I think I want to ask Patrick, Patrick, would it be possible for the members of two staffs

688
00:56:49,640 --> 00:56:50,540
to work together?

689
00:56:51,360 --> 00:56:55,220
So I would volunteer our staff to work with the Secretary of State staff?

690
00:56:55,540 --> 00:56:59,900
Yes, if the Secretary was agreeable, that would allow you.

691
00:56:59,900 --> 00:57:03,180
And stay within the bounds of the open meetings act, and then come back.

692
00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:06,220
Yes, this body would be the application itself.

693
00:57:06,220 --> 00:57:12,380
Yes, because three commissioners or their staff would be a quorum, so two would be less than a quorum, it would not

694
00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:14,840
Institute though, man

695
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:26,240
And then we have to vote in open meaning on the newly revised application or could the staffs take the general direction that we have collectively offered them

696
00:57:26,940 --> 00:57:33,920
Incorporated and simply put the application up. They'll be up to the commission. The commission could either decide they want to vote on it again

697
00:57:33,920 --> 00:57:40,260
or they can vote on the concepts and then vote to delegate that decision to those two staffs.

698
00:57:40,360 --> 00:57:46,740
So there are two things at play. There is the job description, which I think we've kind of settled.

699
00:57:47,720 --> 00:57:52,920
And then there's the application process, which I'm not sure if we have said it.

700
00:57:54,420 --> 00:57:59,720
Yeah, I think the application is based on pace with the suggested changes.

701
00:58:00,480 --> 00:58:03,600
have we settled on that or have we not settled on that with the

702
00:58:03,600 --> 00:58:08,840
suggestion? Yeah, I have no objection to a non-blind process where the

703
00:58:08,840 --> 00:58:12,560
five, I can't speak for anybody, obviously, where the five of us receive

704
00:58:12,560 --> 00:58:19,160
every application, review that application and determine who the finalists will be.

705
00:58:21,570 --> 00:58:27,790
Yeah, I would say my preference would have been to go blind up until we select

706
00:58:27,790 --> 00:58:33,070
people that we want to interview and in which case it's an open book at that point.

707
00:58:35,030 --> 00:58:45,150
But, you know, if the commission's will to do it all in the open, then that's what it will be.

708
00:58:45,470 --> 00:58:46,810
I can live with it.

709
00:58:47,110 --> 00:58:47,750
Here from the other.

710
00:58:48,230 --> 00:58:54,330
So, just to clarify, does that mean that the proposal to have your staff sort of vet the minimum

711
00:58:54,330 --> 00:58:57,450
qualifications that no longer exists?

712
00:58:57,450 --> 00:59:00,550
and we look through all of the applications that's correct. I'm fine with that.

713
00:59:02,970 --> 00:59:10,050
Okay, so we can make a, I'll make the motion to accept the application process proposal

714
00:59:10,750 --> 00:59:18,390
with the agreed upon adjustments and to accept the job, let's do that first.

715
00:59:19,230 --> 00:59:22,970
Let's, let's, let's, I've made the motion to accept the application process with the

716
00:59:22,970 --> 00:59:25,670
adjustments that the commission has been doing too.

717
00:59:25,670 --> 00:59:28,270
motion made and seconded any further discussion.

718
00:59:29,050 --> 00:59:30,770
Hearing none, all those in favor say aye.

719
00:59:31,530 --> 00:59:33,590
All those opposed motion carries.

720
00:59:34,190 --> 00:59:37,570
And then I would make the motion to approve the job description.

721
00:59:38,230 --> 00:59:40,450
One of the things we haven't talked about in the job description

722
00:59:40,450 --> 00:59:44,070
is whether or not it is going to be only what is in the statute.

723
00:59:44,830 --> 00:59:47,790
Because the memo suggests some of the things

724
00:59:47,790 --> 00:59:58,350
that Mr. Fletcher put forth as enhanced, not a qualification, but a preference.

725
00:59:58,650 --> 00:59:59,770
Can you hear it, sir?

726
01:00:05,790 --> 01:00:29,050
Okay, so if you go to page 3 of the memo, you will see the minimum qualifications listed, which I think we've all agreed to, and then the ideal candidate would have the following qualifications, and this is best on this is based on what Mr. Fletcher initiated.

727
01:00:29,050 --> 01:00:30,650
to mine the right page here.

728
01:00:30,650 --> 01:00:31,390
I'm a bit of a page.

729
01:00:31,970 --> 01:00:32,090
I'm a bit of a page.

730
01:00:32,870 --> 01:00:35,510
Yeah, yeah, the bullet points near the top of the page.

731
01:00:36,870 --> 01:00:39,310
That's the background, I think.

732
01:00:39,730 --> 01:00:43,250
I believe it in page five, at the time of the point.

733
01:00:44,090 --> 01:00:44,750
Time of the point.

734
01:00:44,850 --> 01:00:46,670
Yeah, some pull back to the finish, there it is.

735
01:00:47,570 --> 01:00:47,910
So, yes.

736
01:00:48,430 --> 01:00:50,630
Supplemental information, which would be enhanced

737
01:00:51,110 --> 01:00:52,990
is on questionable integrity, independent

738
01:00:52,990 --> 01:00:54,550
courage and unwavering commitment to the truth.

739
01:00:54,630 --> 01:00:59,030
The things that Mr. Fledger put forward in the

740
01:00:59,030 --> 01:01:00,250
in the last meeting.

741
01:01:01,150 --> 01:01:03,370
We can add that or we can eliminate that.

742
01:01:03,990 --> 01:01:04,210
There.

743
01:01:08,860 --> 01:01:12,440
I'm comfortable with all of the additional requirements.

744
01:01:12,700 --> 01:01:15,100
I think it provides a little bit more information.

745
01:01:15,680 --> 01:01:24,020
One piece of information that I would like to see in here is just to let potential applicants know that this doesn't exist yet.

746
01:01:24,020 --> 01:01:33,900
that you're applying to establish and staff and office from the ground floor up.

747
01:01:34,060 --> 01:01:40,720
There may be many people who are qualified for this that wouldn't sign on for that, for instance.

748
01:01:40,920 --> 01:01:44,840
You know, they might want to go to an established office and have a great staff already in hand,

749
01:01:44,940 --> 01:01:52,330
and just be the head of it rather than quite a bit, you know, this is a lot of work, right?

750
01:01:52,330 --> 01:01:58,410
And we want to attract that kind of person who wants that kind of...

751
01:01:58,410 --> 01:02:03,490
Well that would be additional supplemental information within the job description.

752
01:02:05,070 --> 01:02:09,330
That is not considered a requirement but considered important information.

753
01:02:09,590 --> 01:02:12,450
Or maybe just right up front in the general statement of duties,

754
01:02:12,590 --> 01:02:16,950
just an extra sentence or two that explains that.

755
01:02:16,950 --> 01:02:20,190
would say the Rhode Island is standing up and also the spectrogens.

756
01:02:21,110 --> 01:02:22,910
So you gave that a motion of first time?

757
01:02:23,050 --> 01:02:23,270
Yeah.

758
01:02:23,810 --> 01:02:25,150
I'll say that.

759
01:02:25,730 --> 01:02:28,610
What are we doing again at the financial disclosure piece?

760
01:02:28,690 --> 01:02:28,990
No.

761
01:02:29,310 --> 01:02:37,570
We're adding straightforward statement at the top of the process that indicates this is beyond

762
01:02:37,570 --> 01:02:42,710
an Inspector General's job and is standing up and Inspector General is office and then

763
01:02:42,710 --> 01:02:43,870
becoming Inspector General.

764
01:02:47,750 --> 01:03:01,550
I could live with it, you know, I don't know how you evaluate supplemental information or qualifications with one of them as courage.

765
01:03:02,630 --> 01:03:07,230
Forgive me, I'm thinking of, you know what, I'm thinking of the cowardly law.

766
01:03:07,950 --> 01:03:17,190
But that's why this is, this is in addition to kind of outlining who the, who the ideal candidate, this type of person.

767
01:03:17,970 --> 01:03:21,990
You can live with it, but I would also strengthen, I mean, I think, or keep parts of it in a lot of others.

768
01:03:22,510 --> 01:03:34,430
I think I think those are all things that we're going to probe and prod because they come naturally with the kind of person who has the statutory qualifications as written out.

769
01:03:35,670 --> 01:03:50,430
So, you know, if, if for me, you know, shorter is always, is always, in this case, better, and I would probably eliminate it, but if, obviously, you know, we can, you know, we reach, because that's a straight up, we don't, we can vote, whatever, whatever you think people think.

770
01:03:50,810 --> 01:03:55,010
Are you talking about these bullet points here on page three, or are you talking about this?

771
01:03:55,010 --> 01:03:56,550
Very end of page five.

772
01:03:58,110 --> 01:04:11,890
It's basically a, as I read it, an encapsulation of what you described as what the ideal candidate would have, and there's no question we're going to be looking for those things, but I don't know that they need to be stated in such a way.

773
01:04:13,270 --> 01:04:21,190
It's, I mean, it certainly is aspirational in terms of the search, but to me, some of it would go without saying, but

774
01:04:21,190 --> 01:04:26,750
I agree, I think that the questions that the interview, the information that's supposed to be

775
01:04:26,750 --> 01:04:29,410
elicited by the interview should get to the heart of some of these things.

776
01:04:29,670 --> 01:04:31,290
I don't know that they ought to be.

777
01:04:33,960 --> 01:04:35,140
I don't.

778
01:04:35,320 --> 01:04:36,280
I'm fine with that.

779
01:04:36,480 --> 01:04:44,520
We put that forward as an opportunity to talk about what was presented, but I'm fine with moving

780
01:04:44,520 --> 01:04:51,240
forward on the specific qualifications that are listed without enhanced or supplemented.

781
01:04:52,060 --> 01:04:52,280
Thanks.

782
01:04:52,280 --> 01:04:54,480
Yeah, I mean, go ahead, I'm sorry.

783
01:04:54,640 --> 01:05:01,060
No, I think I don't know if it was clear again and there are peace about, I know the process

784
01:05:01,060 --> 01:05:06,860
of the financial disclosure to the ethics commission that we want, what we've voted on,

785
01:05:07,060 --> 01:05:10,840
accepting the, accepting the, accepting the recommendations that's all I have.

786
01:05:11,260 --> 01:05:16,040
Yeah, and I'm, I'm very happy that, you know, what I said last week, you know,

787
01:05:16,140 --> 01:05:20,420
appear to be taken a heart and I just want to make sure that we are, when we're interviewing

788
01:05:20,420 --> 01:05:23,120
I mean, the candidates that with these are the things that we were looking for.

789
01:05:23,600 --> 01:05:23,840
Yeah, right.

790
01:05:24,120 --> 01:05:24,180
Okay.

791
01:05:24,780 --> 01:05:25,900
There are certainly aspirations.

792
01:05:28,040 --> 01:05:28,460
Okay.

793
01:05:28,680 --> 01:05:29,440
So hopefully it achieves.

794
01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:36,900
So I'll restate the motion only without the supplemental information.

795
01:05:38,260 --> 01:05:40,120
So it would be just a civic job requirements.

796
01:05:40,240 --> 01:05:46,700
In addition to a notifier that this is standing up in office of the Inspector General.

797
01:05:46,700 --> 01:05:58,440
I just to put on the I would leave all of that supplemental information in there. I'm very comfortable with having it in the job description, but although yes on this motion.

798
01:05:59,120 --> 01:06:03,200
So a motion made by Secretary Moray is there a second. Seconded.

799
01:06:03,980 --> 01:06:10,120
Any further discussion? All those in favor state I. All those opposed motion carries.

800
01:06:11,180 --> 01:06:15,080
Is there any further discussion on this agenda item?

801
01:06:16,280 --> 01:06:24,360
Hearing none, we'll move on to the final agenda item, which is discussion and possible vote on funding and reimbursement processes for the expenses of the commission.

802
01:06:24,820 --> 01:06:25,200
Treasurer Dioza.

803
01:06:25,280 --> 01:06:26,200
Thank you so much.

804
01:06:26,440 --> 01:06:32,800
And our last meeting, we discussed the matter of covering expenses related to the search process.

805
01:06:33,660 --> 01:06:41,540
And that same day, we received a letter from Acting Director Thomas Verdi of the Department of Administration who wrote that.

806
01:06:41,540 --> 01:06:47,620
commission, I quote, reasonable, expensive directly related to their selection of the first

807
01:06:47,620 --> 01:06:53,640
inspector general, are chargeable to the fiscal year 2027 appropriation establishment for

808
01:06:53,640 --> 01:07:01,340
that office. And so these expenses would include travel arrangements for qualified out-of-state

809
01:07:01,340 --> 01:07:07,220
campus who may be called to appear in person before this commission. Travel arrangements for commission

810
01:07:07,220 --> 01:07:12,280
members traveling from out of state and across associated with potentially

811
01:07:12,820 --> 01:07:16,820
advertising the position in a publication or on a site.

812
01:07:17,580 --> 01:07:25,440
Talking to DOA staff, my staff would work with them to establish a process and as a result

813
01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:31,500
I'm proposing and ask the Commission to take a vote to approve the use of funds for expenses

814
01:07:31,500 --> 01:07:36,460
related to the selection process, specifically to cover travel arrangements for out-of-state

815
01:07:36,460 --> 01:07:41,500
candidates and commission members and to cover the possible advertisement of this position

816
01:07:41,500 --> 01:07:46,720
is so dealing by the commission and to designate my office as the commission's liaison

817
01:07:46,720 --> 01:07:53,300
with DOA to simplify the coordination of travel arrangements and process related expenses.

818
01:07:54,180 --> 01:07:59,240
And DOA has agreed to assign a point of contact to work with my office.

819
01:07:59,240 --> 01:08:03,880
And we are meeting the office of the general treasurer.

820
01:08:04,300 --> 01:08:06,660
We'll cover the first expenses of your travel.

821
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:10,420
Prior to this meeting.

822
01:08:11,320 --> 01:08:14,240
And so I would like to open up for a discussion.

823
01:08:14,900 --> 01:08:15,540
If anything.

824
01:08:19,260 --> 01:08:19,280
Fantastic.

825
01:08:23,570 --> 01:08:23,750
Hello.

826
01:08:23,830 --> 01:08:24,090
Member questions?

827
01:08:24,330 --> 01:08:24,850
Thank you.

828
01:08:26,360 --> 01:08:28,770
Motion made and seconded any further discussion.

829
01:08:29,570 --> 01:08:29,930
Hearing none.

830
01:08:30,150 --> 01:08:31,030
All those in favor state.

831
01:08:32,150 --> 01:08:32,850
All those opposed.

832
01:08:33,310 --> 01:08:33,830
Motion carries.

833
01:08:34,550 --> 01:08:38,850
Peter, can we go back to seven that allowable?

834
01:08:39,950 --> 01:08:39,970
Yes.

835
01:08:41,650 --> 01:08:45,850
So did we vote, forgive me if I, if I would be didn't I forgot?

836
01:08:47,070 --> 01:08:54,530
But did we vote on whether or not we were going to ask the staff to bring a written document back for us to vote on,

837
01:08:54,690 --> 01:09:01,130
or whether we were going to give or in the alternative given the direction that we have given them at this meeting,

838
01:09:01,130 --> 01:09:08,290
We were going to rely on them to incorporate it so that the application can be posted prior to our next.

839
01:09:08,490 --> 01:09:09,450
We voted on the letter.

840
01:09:10,470 --> 01:09:12,870
And we voted that the staff could do it.

841
01:09:13,090 --> 01:09:13,950
Okay, good.

842
01:09:14,030 --> 01:09:14,250
All right.

843
01:09:14,370 --> 01:09:15,110
Thank you.

844
01:09:16,980 --> 01:09:20,100
With no other business, I'll take a motion to adjourn.

845
01:09:20,220 --> 01:09:21,560
Make a motion to adjourn.

846
01:09:21,680 --> 01:09:21,920
Second.

847
01:09:22,240 --> 01:09:22,660
Should be it.

848
01:09:22,920 --> 01:09:24,920
And seconded, all those in favor state aye.

849
01:09:25,540 --> 01:09:26,480
All those opposed.

850
01:09:27,220 --> 01:09:30,160
The meeting is now adjourned at 5.

851
01:09:30,460 --> 01:09:30,540
18.