25th meeting of the 146th Council of the
Corporation of the City of St. Thomas uh
is tonight and thank you to for all
being here for our August meeting. It
seems like a whole month since I've seen
you because it's been a whole month
since I've seen you. Um disclosures of
interest from any of the members.
Seeing none, we'll move on to minutes.
Thank the minutes of the meeting held on
July 13th, 2026 be confirmed. Moved by
councelor Herbert, seconded by councelor
Bvin Sans. questions or comments on the
minutes? Seeing none, all those in
favor? Are there any opposed? That's
carried. Now, we're going to do a little
bit of a change in our agenda. Um, we
have uh our auditor here tonight rather
than make Christine sit around for
hours. Um, that's not true here at St.
Thomas, but we're going to let you go
first tonight.
John, do we have to change do a change
of the agenda that way?
>> Yes, your worship. Just if council
supports, I just have a motion that
council suspend section 4.2 to the
procedural bylaw on August 10, 2026 and
adjust the order of business on the
agenda to consider the 2025 audited
financial statements first followed by
the letter related to the minor baseball
and the Mleyfield grandstand. If I can
just get a mover move by councelor Riml,
seconded by councelor Gibson.
>> All right, questions or comments on the
change of the procedural bylaw? Seeing
none, all those in favor? Any opposed?
Carried. Take it away.
>> All right. Thank you. All right. Right.
I'll go through the financial statements
uh page by page as I normally do. Please
don't hesitate to ask me any questions
if you have them. Um it uh they are
dated. Uh the Canadian auditing
standards require council to approve
them those charged with governance. And
so once they are approved, we will
finalize them. There's also an FIR that
will get filed to the ministry which is
a requirement of the ministry um based
on these financial statements and so
they uh will follow uh closely. So they
are dated as of today's date. It is
what's called a clean audit opinion,
which means that we did not find
anything materially incorrect.
Materiality for the city of St. Thomas
is 2.7 million. However, that does not
mean we only look at transactions over
that amount. Every revenue and
expenditure that flows through,
including payroll is eligible for
statistical sampling that we uh perform
and test the controls within the city.
based on those tests and those results,
we can then clarify that we are issuing
a clean opinion. So all of that
preamble, I'll start through uh the
financial statements. So the first
statement that I'm going to go through
is a consolidated statement of financial
position, better known as your balance
sheet. And those of you who have heard
this spiel before, I'll just I'll I'll
continue on that. So I come down to the
net financial asset number. So about
threequarters of the way down the page.
So you'll see last year it was 1.4 4
million. And again, I'm running my
numbers. And this year, it's 24 uh
24.1.2
million this year. So, that's an
increase. That would be the amount of
money that you would have in the bank if
everybody paid you what they owe you and
you paid off all of your liabilities,
which obviously wouldn't happen at any
one point in time, but it just allows
you to see where you're at at the time.
Everything below that line are assets
that you need to have in place to
continue providing the services the city
provides. And obviously you're not able
to sell those assets and still provide
those services. So they're down below
the line obviously not a liquid asset
what we would call. And so some
indicators I look at when I looking at
these financial statements. One is where
your debt levels are at which you're
decreasing in that area. Um your net
financial assets have increased and then
you've also reinvested in your capital
assets above your amortization. The
amortization being the using up of your
assets. And so you can see there we do
have significant uh increase in the
assets but that also um obviously
requires significant investment going
forward. And so although these are all
good news stories uh just keep in mind
we'll get to a note 20 which is a year
commitments going forward.
coming down to an overall surplus of 945
million. And as we see when we get to
the note on this uh surplus, the
majority of that is invested in those
tangible capital assets.
Any questions on the balance sheet
specific numbers?
» Seeing none.
>> All right. We'll now go to the revenue
and expenditure. This statement of
operations. So again, this is the
operations of the town of the city. And
so I just uh make a couple comments
here. So the budget does not include
your investment in um both the health
unit and the Elgenary water primary
water system. Uh and so those numbers uh
are in the actuals for both 2025 and
2024.
And as well within the expenditures as
you'll remember we have amortization and
in 2020 the amortization costs for the
total city were just over 20 million. So
when I look at the budgeted expenditures
of 175 million and I get to the 207
actual spend, that does not mean the
city over spent by that amount. 20
million of that is amortization as I
mentioned as well as the pickup of the
health unit costs, your share of those
costs, uh, which is 19.78%
and then your pickup of the water system
as well. And so those numbers are in
there. The other increase that's both in
the government grants and in the social
and family services is the increase in
the what I call the quelk. So that's the
child care funding that changed if uh
you're familiar with that that the um
total funding formula changed in 2025
and so the cost and the revenue
proportionately increased for those
changes.
So coming down to the excess of revenue
over expenditures again 7.2 2 million uh
in 2025 and a negative number. So about
a $10 million swing there. And the
majority of that is uh some hookups
charges that we had that again uh flow
through to the reserve fund. So they're
not for operating um purposes.
Everything below that line relates to
either capital or other investments that
you have and so not consistent from year
to year. You can see that we uh the city
only budgets three of those numbers.
Obviously the pickup in the Integris
that we own, the shares that we own in
Integris and the um pickup in the uh
east or sorry uh Elgen area water system
uh are not not budgeted for because we
simply don't know those amounts
coming down. So that other revenue and
expenditures again deals with capital or
other investments not for operations
coming down to your total surplus at the
end of the year again of the 945
million.
Any questions on that statement at all?
Again I know I'm doing at a high level
so I'm happy to answer anything
specifically.
» Councelor Herbert. Thank you worship.
under the uh revenue when we have
government grants. I see we budgeted 68
million and actual 77. Is that because
some grants come in later and we right
up front?
>> The big piece of that is because the
health unit is almost 100% funded
outside of your municipal shares that
fund it by government grants. We pick up
our proportionate share of those. So
about $7 million of that was was the
health units grants. You're welcome.
Anything
else? Again, these are operating grants.
These would not be the capital grants
in that number. The next statement is
required because of the health unit
investing in a derivative towards their
debt. And so that's the next statement.
It's just your share of that derivative.
So they are hedging uh their interest
rates on their debt.
So then we get to the consolidated
statement of cash flows. A lot of these
numbers I've talked about, but I'm going
to just uh uh indicate a couple that
I've already uh talked about. Obviously,
the first one, the second line down is
amortization. That's the 20 million that
I've um referred to already. And then
the acquisition of capital assets plus
the increase in capital work in
progress. So capital work in progress,
it just means that it's projects,
capital projects that are in progress at
the end of the year, not yet uh
completed and so not yet amortized. And
so you can see there the significant
increase there of 132 million almost 133
million of new assets.
And then again the net repayment of
debt. So last year if you recall we
issued new debt for about 10 mill we did
issue debt for $10 million. And so this
year we don't have that new debt and we
just have the repayment of the debt.
coming down to your cash and cash
equivalents at the end of the year. And
again, there's a decrease there, but if
you remember on the uh statement or the
balance sheet, there was an increase in
accounts receivable. So, it's just a
timing of uh organizations owing you
money and then your um having it in your
bank account. And again, the majority of
those accounts receivable if you notice
the increase on the balance sheet uh
have been received subsequent to your
end. So we do do testing on that to
ensure that uh those receivables are uh
received in a reasonable amount of time.
The next statement is your statement of
c changing net financial assets. So this
really drills down into your capital and
again I've already talked about all
these numbers and as you can see this flows through to that net financial
assets number on the balance sheet that
I would um was discussing already.
We then get to the notes to the
financial statements. I'm just going to
highlight a couple of them uh for you.
Note number 1 C is where we talk about
what's consolidated in these financial
statements. So again, the health unit
which the percentage did not change. We
did pick up uh 1.25% on the Elgenary
water system and then the uh shares that
you have in Integris. So those are all
consolidated into these financial
statements.
The rest of the notes are account note
one is accounting policies. Note number
two, um if you didn't understand these
financial statements before, we now are
having uh significant changes again in
2027. So that's something to look
forward to. Uh note number three is your
trust funds, excuse me, [clears throat]
which are included in your package as
well and not a much big change there. Um
note number seven are employee benefits
payable. So these are benefits that are
uh present valued into today's dollar of
uh postretirement benefits that you will
be paying out on certain of your
employees.
Note number eight is a breakdown of
deferred revenue. So your various um
obligatory reserve funds uh which have
to be spent according to what they were
raised for, not at council's discretion.
Note number five, note number nine,
sorry, is your long-term debt note,
which shows that you're a decrease of
debt there. And then note number 11 is
the note that I wanted to discuss the
most. So this is the breakdown of your
accumulated surplus. Um, you can see
there that there only operating surplus
is the $51,000
of the uh DDB. I know there is a part of
this motion of a deficit for uh the city
for 2025 which will come from the um
which has been reflected here and come
from the um reserve
and then reserve fund balances, reserve
and reserve fund balances as well as we
broke out the reserve and reserve funds
that belong to those consolidated
entities which would be the health unit
and the water system. Um just to show
you where the city sits and again um
most of this reserve that's there
reserve funds most of that is uh water
wastewater which is required to be
retained separately and then the um
reserve increase is uh a lot of that is
already spoken for for funding future
projects.
Next notes uh just deal with the
integris investment. Um and then I'm
just going to flip forward to note
number 20
which is the uh note commitment which
I've kind of referred to throughout this
presentation on u making sure that we
keep this in in mind as we're going
forward that even though this is a good
news story, we still have lots lots of
things ahead of us to that we are
committed to.
And that's my presentation. The last two
schedules, one is the first one is the
breakdown of the capital assets by uh
type of asset. Um and so as you can see
there, the infrastructure uh assets are
your the majority of your assets as you
would expect. And then the last schedule
is it's on a angle [clears throat] but
uh the last schedule is the breakdown of
the revenues and expenditures on the FIR
functions. Uh to break this down. So
this is the segue between these
financial statements and what we file
with the uh the ministry.
And then we come to the trust fund
financial statements. And I don't have a
lot to say on this. The one trust fund
that was within uh the library board has
been moved over to their operations to
help fund the project that they're
currently undergoing. Uh so you can see
that that is now gone. So the only fun
trust fund that you will have left going
forward is the value view which is the
really the what I call their pocket
money. Residents are allowed certain
percentage of their funds to go into an
account where they pay for things like
hairdressing and and and things like
that. So at the end of the year there's
$22,774
in trust fund monies.
And that's my presentation on the
statements. I did have a couple of other
comments I wanted to make if that's all
right.
>> Please do.
>> Okay. First of all, I want to thank the
treasurer and his staff uh for all their
help uh getting this done. Uh there's a
lot of activity going on in the city and
so I really appreciate all of their
help. Um it's been it's been a really
smooth audit and I appreciate as I said
that both of them both of them being the
treasur and the deputy treasure. Uh the
second thing I wanted to say, I know um
your treasurer [clears throat] has
reports coming uh after me on just uh
setting up reserve fund policies,
investment policies. So I know you're
headed in that direction. So that's I
just want to uh reiterate that that's
great as well that Great Plains is uh
going to be archaic in the next three
four years. Uh so just keeping that in
mind that we will need a new operating
system uh for the G of General Ledger.
And then the last thing was uh and I've
mentioned this at several of my clients
uh the province is behind in reconciling
yearly uh child care reporting and
valley view your home for the agent
reporting and so uh we've acred what we
believe to be the right amounts but the
province has the final say and so those
numbers may change and adjust be
adjusted in the in the future years. uh
they are just finishing up 22 right now
and so we're still uh we've got a few
years to get done yet.
» And that's my report.
Happy to answer any questions.
>> Pastor WKY.
>> Thanks your worship. Um, so thank you
very much for that. And and in the end,
what I'm looking for from you is just in
kind of kitchen English, non-accounting
English. Um,
>> I could do that. You know, you you deal
with a lot of municipalities and of
course we're just our own municipality.
So we don't see things from the same
lens that you see things and you've
mentioned a few of these in your closing
remarks but for our benefit and the
benefit of the public when you look at
different municipalities and you look at
us like what would be an example of say
one thing you think is going
particularly well relative to our our
you know neighbors say or your other
clients I should say and one thing say
that you think you look at us and say
like you know this isn't in my
presentation but you know if some
counselor asks me I might want to tell
them blank. Um, if you're comfortable
doing that, I'd love to hear just a
really general thoughts on how you see
us doing relative to other
municipalities that are clients of
yours. Thank you.
>> Sure. Well, you have an unusual problem
in the in the note number 20, which I
I've talked about. So, you you've got a
lot of upcoming capital expenditures
that are going to be made and so just
making sure you keep your eye on that
ball um would be the thing that I would
caution you about. the the thing that I
think you do well um your treasurer and
his staff all understand the importance
of internal controls and so that's in
place and and they understand the
importance of reporting to council on a
regular basis. So I think that's like a big benefit and just also keeping in
mind that you have other um capital
assets that need to be replenished and
maintained outside of what uh the large
project is. And so just making sure that
uh you don't forget about those capital
projects that need to be re um repaired,
re redone, um torn up, taken down. Um
those all still have to be maintained.
And so just keeping your eye on that as
well and and and in order to do all of
that, obviously making sure your
reserves are healthy.
» Further questions?
Christina, thank you. I think in my
whole time here, this is as early as
we've had the final statements. So,
>> it is. And I I'll just say too, I I know
there may be some of the counselors
sitting around this table that may not
be here. Just want to thank uh
especially the mayor for all their
support over these uh last few years.
So, thank you.
>> Uh council Riml, I'm sorry I missed your
hand. You have to wave more viciously.
Okay. Yeah,
>> that's great. Anyway, thank you. And and
thank you, Christine. I really find I I
really like your presentation how you go
through everything. It's very clear and
I I really appreciate that. And I just
wanted to ask a question on page 18. It
might be more for the treasure. Uh the
integris it said that there was the um
uh the extra 500,000. Did we decide to
put that on our internal debt or what
did we decide to do with that? So the
2025 budget had you not make not making
that reduction in this year because of
other commitments that you had on the
tax rate. Okay.
>> Thank you.
>> Further questions?
Seeing none. Is there a motion that we
Yes. Okay. Councelor got balls and fans.
Then we'll go to the motion.
I was moving the report and then I have
a
question if I could.
>> Go ahead. Go ahead with your question.
My question is going back to the
original and it's more of a statement
and it's the sixth bullet that was put
forward and I would like to thank the
treasurer for ensuring that the um for
the people at home and for the people
around the table that council approve
100,27
for community center reserve and I'm
very pleased to see that in this report
and look forward to engagement in the
future of this council meeting. Thank
you.
Thanks worship. I'll just read the
motion here. So I've got a mover in
councelor Bobin Sans, but the motion
reads that report TR2126 relating to the
2025 audited financial statements be
received for information. And further
that council approved the draft
consolidated financial statements for
the year ended December 31st, 2025. And
further that council approved the draft
financial statements for the city of St.
Thomas trust funds for the year ended
December 31st, 2025. And further that
council authorized the mayor and clerk
to carry out any administrative acts
necessary to complete the audit. And
further that council approve the
transfer of 748,675
from the infrastructure reserve to
offset the 2025 deficit. And further
that council approved the transfer of
$1,217
related to bingo revenues in excess of
300,000 to the community center reserve.
And further that council approved the
transfer of $540,484
relating to the 2025 water operating
deficit from the water reserve. And
further that council approved the
transfer of 1,227,437
from the 2025 wastewater operating
surplus to the wastewater reserve. And
further, the council approved the
transfer of 26,759,245
from the 2025 operating surplus to the
industrial servicing reserve for the
purpose of contributing towards the
Dalewood water reclamation facility. So,
I've got a move by councelor Bobin Sans,
seconded by councelor Herbert.
>> Further questions or comments?
Seeing none, all those in favor? Are
there any opposed? That's carried.
Thank you.
» Thanks, worship. And just in keeping
with our a little bit of out of order
here, we're going to move to the under
communications the St. Thomas Minor
baseball field grandstand. Uh, a letter
has been received by Derek Brooks, St.
Thomas Minor baseball, regarding the
Emily Field Grandstand. Uh, I have a
motion that the letter received from
Derek Brooks, St. Thomas Minor baseball,
regarding the Emily Field Grandstand, be
referred to the parks and recreation
department for a report. Moved by
councelor Clark, seconded by councelor
Riml.
>> Questions or comments? Councelor G or
Baldwin Sans.
>> Thank you. When this report comes back,
because of the conversations that I've
been having with people involved with
this, I want to see some clarity in
there that there is no demolition
scheduled to take place. That also the
loyalty that we've had for Bob Emley. um
not just as a baseball player and an
umpire in our community, but how he has
used that area especially for
encouraging not just youth baseball, but
also golf in that area and archery in
that area. And that is why we named the
grandstand in his honor. And I'm hoping
that uh whatever how this moves forward
is that we still respect that and the
memory of Bob Emley and what he did for
the youth of this community and the
integrity of that is maintained.
>> Councelor Herbert then councelor Clark.
>> Thank you worship. Welcome to everybody
from minor baseball up there. It's great
to see so many people. I I recognize
some of the ones up there. I see Phil
Ambrose. I see Neil. Neil used to pitch
for the pretty good pitcher in his day.
I probably he didn't probably like my
umpire as much, but I knew he was a good
pitcher. So, thank you everybody. This
is a great report for us. I mean, even
my myself when I I played there, coached
there, ired there, and I go back to
probably one of your first presidents,
Ron Baldwin. He was one of our coaches,
Ron and Jack Armstrong. And uh so that's
how far back I go with minor baseball.
But when this first came to us, I I I
don't I don't think we we realize just
how important that to keep the uh the
grandstand there. And you people are
telling us how important it is to keep
the grand stand there. So we really have
to take a good look at this. I
understand there was a meeting a few
weeks ago with a group of people and
this is the end of the report and and I
don't have a problem with your uh uh
recommendation of trying to renovate it
at a cost. uh you people are obviously
going to work to try to do it and I I
don't know what council if we can do in
the end with budgeting or something or
maybe a grant but whatever uh I think
it's a great thing
and of course we talk about Emily he was
an umpire too back in way back before my
time but uh
>> oh I know you're worship [laughter]
>> but anyway it's great to see the support
I mean this is what it's all about you
say council doesn't listen we're
listening
and and I I I'm going to support the the
second one when it comes to a vote if it
comes to a vote and we'll try and make
it work out. So anyway, congratulations
on your support up there. Thank you very
much. So and I see Neil sit or Phil
sitting up there. We were Japan buddies
for a week.
Anyway, thank you very much. That's my
comment. I'm happy for this. So thank
you. Just wanted to note Council Herbert
doesn't have very many friends, so when
a bunch of them show up, he's quite
pleased. Uh, councelor Clark.
>> Uh, before I make my remarks about the letter, I'd like to congratulate
Councelor Herbert on the improvement of
his eyes for
>> Yeah. No,
>> as an umpire, at least he could
recognize Phil and Neil, and I'm not
sure he knows which is which from that
distance, but uh,
>> you've been talking to Neil, haven't
you?
>> Yeah. Um uh the letter is uh
wellreceived and and it's it's sparked a
lot of interest over the last few weeks
of the debate about Emily Field and
that's great because it's generating um
it's generating community interest and
that's what we want to hear as
counselors and I I would just like to uh
ask u staff as they review the letter
and report back to us that they might
have a conversation with minor baseball
on their feelings about bringing back um
an inner county team or now uh it's
called you know the Canadian Baseball
League and while they're starting to
canvas or or look at interest in
fundraising if we were to refurbish the
uh the grand stand and that was the the
decision that was made perhaps through
their research we could find out what
kind of interest there would be in
through um individuals through industry
whether or not there would be any kind
of support for bringing back inter
county baseball. If we're going to have
a large grand stand, it'd be nice to see
it full of baseball fans. So, perhaps
that could be incorporated in the
report.
>> Great.
>> Councelor Kohler,
>> thanks worship. I I want to echo the
comments by my colleagues, but also
mention uh that I appreciate the
dialogue that had taken place prior to
this and I certainly support this motion
and look forward to it. But the what I
thought was really positive is that it
wasn't the dialogue wasn't criticism.
was how we can find and help find a
solution and from what I understand
minor baseball has committed money and
actually showed up with a check today
too. So that's uh definitely showing
commitment towards this and I think
that's what uh makes St. Thomas such a
great community is that when people are
looking to uh move something forward is
that they come forward with a solution
rather than just criticize about it.
>> Great. Councelor Wy did I see your hand
too? Yes.
>> Thank your worship. I just want to say
that, you know, we get a lot of requests
from a lot of groups, right? And there's
a lot of people that say they're going
to fundra and and provide money, but my experience over the over a decade
I've been around here is that baseball
is one of the groups that actually shows
up with the money.
>> Y
>> and and so there's some people I might
have some doubts with, but I think this
group up here, they they do it. And uh
that helps that's helps us support you
knowing that you guys in the past have
come through and did what you said you
were going to do. So that's kudos to
your group because that helps us help
you. Thank you.
>> Further questions or comments? John, is
there a motion?
>> Yeah, the motion was just that the
letter be referred to for a report.
>> Okay. And we have a mover and seconder
on it. Okay. Great. Further questions?
Councelor Blandstead?
>> Mine is just a further comment. Back in
when this was originally discussed back
in November and December, I also
requested that the parks and rec
department look at other ways to bring
people to that band stand, right?
>> Whether it be events, whether it be um
some of the programming that we do
there, but also looking for
sponsorships. Now, we've got a great
group up there that has come forward,
but there are also groups in the
community that I've discussed with some
of the members of this organization that
they would like to see others step up
and step forward as they have done to
look at sponsoring and looking at
partnering and looking at creating
something amazing at once again at that
park and it goes back to what councelor
Herbert was saying that many years ago
there were so many things there and I'm
very proud of what my family has
contributed in the past to that and
would like to see it to continue. Thank
you very much.
>> Great. Thank you, counselor. Further qu
further questions or comments? I've got
a new set of lips today, so we're
working them in. Seeing none on the
motion, all in favor? Are there any
opposed? That is carried unanimously and
we thank you for your help moving us
forward on this.
John, find out where we are in the
agenda and get us back there, please.
>> Thanks, your worship. We'll return to
sort of the regular agenda here. So, uh,
council will now resolve itself into
committee the whole to deal with the
following business. Uh, the first
committee is strategic direction and
development and the first item is, uh,
residential lands, land needs 2021 to
201.
I have a motion that report PD4526
relating to residential land needs 2021
to 201 be received for information and
further that council accept the report
residential lands needs to accommodate
the 30-year housing forecast 2021 to 201
by Dylan Consulting Limited. Moved by
councelor Gibson, seconded by councelor
Kohler.
>> All right, questions or comments?
Michelor Taylor, you're up.
Thank you, your worship. Um, just a
quick question. I know this is a a huge
major report. Took a bit of reading to [clears throat] try to understand it,
but I'm just curious as to I had to
convert this.
Maybe I'll just wait a second.
Okay,
>> thank you. I just had to convert this
into acres because as an old farmer
that's better than I understand more
than hectare hectars, but uh we're
talking about 700 gross acres that we
might need for future development. I'm
just curious uh in the report whether it
actually took into consideration other
development that's happening in our
neighboring municipalities or is this on
top of does St. Thomas needs 700 acres
by I forget the year now. Uh 20 is it
201 or is the 700 acres also um let's
say the neighboring municipalities pull
in 350,000
350 acres is that on top of the 700 that
St. Thomas needs or is that part of the
St. 700 that we're talking about here? I
think we're not an island. I'm just
wondering what our other municipalities
are doing to to help uh our development.
Thank you. Does that make sense?
>> Sure. Uh so through your worship uh to
councelor Taylor. So this is just us uh
the growth analysis forecast did look at
the growth of those adjacent
municipalities and looked at um their
and uh indicated you know that looked at
our growth um relative to that growth.
um those municipalities have undertaken
their own growth analysis, determined
locations for their growth, but this is
what St. Thomas needs um for St. Thomas,
separate from Central Alga and separate
from South Bold.
» Further questions or comments? Council
Herbert, thank you. worship through the
um under the policy number 2.1.3
it states sufficient land shall be made
available accommodating an appropriate
range and mix of land uses. So when you
say mix of land are you saying there's a
certain percentage has to be set aside
for commercial or that type of thing. Uh
so through your worship um that means uh
yeah a set amount of land needs to be
set aside for employment commercial
residential the city's undertaken um
studies to look at how much employment
land we needed um and it ended up being
about 19 hectares commercial land was 24
hectares in addition to the land we
already have. Um so when the province
looks at an official plan when it comes
to the province for approval they look
to make sure that we're accommodating
all of those growth needs. So um they
look at the studies we've done and they
look to make sure that all that land is
being accommodated um and that uh well
all that population and employment
projections are being accommodated. And
what Watson um or sorry what Dylan has
done is they've taken that population
and housing needs and looked at
realistically how much land do we need
to accommodate it in a realistic way and
that's what's in the residential land
needs report.
>> Carry on through worship. So is there
any ever discussion with schools like a
school being built on some of this land
that we're taking or is that something
that we don't do they would approach us?
Temps Valley would approach us.
>> Yeah. So through your worship Temp's
Valley and London Catholic District
School Board they undertake their own um
analysis about where schools are needed.
Um they're apprised of all of our work.
They're very aware of it. Um and then uh
you know as development and development
applications move forward um they're
constantly planning and determining
where they need various school
locations.
» Councelor Clark,
>> thank you. In their methodology, do they uh discount certain areas in
terms of our potential to provide
services to an area? So, for example, if
there's an area where um you know, we
would incur increased costs because we
can't get the sewage to run uphill and
we've got to put an extra pumping
station or um you know, it's isolated or
I guess even um you know, any of those
types of factors or or and and that's
the first one. The number the number two
is whether or not um they rely on
probably a lot of your figures as u
inputs. Did was there any uh
disagreements in terms of how certain
things got discounted in terms of land
being available for use um through your
methodology as opposed to what they
thought and how did [clears throat] you
resolve any of that?
>> Yes. So through your worship um under
the provincial policy statement and the
provincial planning framework which we
have to abide by um the cost and
feasibility of development if it's de if
it's land within our boundary that could
accommodate development that would be
appropriate for that type of
development. It's something that we
would need to look at. um we couldn't
just uh discount it because it's um
challenging to service because this is
supposed to be for um you know a matter
of 30 years, right? So it's a much
longer term plan and longer term
horizon. You know, ideally we want to
make sure that we have land that's
feasible um can feasibly and cost
effectively be serviced and it's
something that we'd want to take into
account um you know when making
decisions about uh sort about servicing
and about where where and how we grow.
But from a provincial planning
perspective, um the ministry when they
look at a document uh coming from the
city, if we were to say um you know that
we have uh land but it's really
challenging to service, there's no
provincial policies that would make it
so that um we would just be able to just
exclude that land when we don't have any
other land available.
So um yeah I mean we have worked with
this consultant extensively had a number
of um discussions about that and about
um just this provincial policies and
it's not a matter of um you know there
are definitely certain areas that are
preferable for growth and we would be
looking to grow first but um over that
longer term horizon uh there's nothing
in provincial policy that allows us to
exclude land um that's suitable for
development. you know, if it was natural
heritage or something of that nature, we
could. But, um, if it's feasible for
development, um, even very at a very
expensive cost, uh, we're not able to
exclude it.
>> Okay. More go.
>> Just part two is, um, you know, the the,
uh, the 700 acres, I guess, right?
[clears throat] Old school. Um, is do
you concur with that? Was there any
discussion whether it was too high, too
low in terms of where you thought we
might end up, where the department
thought we might end up or are we pretty
well on and and accepting the report as
it's written?
>> Uh so through your worship, Councelor
Clark, uh we have had some back and
forth with the developer and we're
comfortable with uh the number that
they've arrived at. U we've run our own
calculations and uh we're comfortable
with the figure um that it uh it
represents what we would need.
Mr. Pompilly. No, I'll just add through
your No, I'll just add to that Michelle
is is is accurate every every comment
made. This was a long process with um
with with the consulting company. Some
we we had a lot of back and forth
particularly it does get a little
difficult to kind of determine within
our own boundaries like what what we can
anticipate from intensification that that can be sometimes a bit of a
wild card. So, there was a lot of back
and forth and analyzing that, but but
otherwise, um, we're in agreement with
the recommendation here and and and the
number that we landed on.
Okay. Further questions or comments?
Seeing none, all those in favor? Any
opposed? Carried.
Thanks, Shisha. The next item is
requested zoning bylaw amendment for 417
Wellington Street and 275 Hy Drive. I
have a motion that report PD 4626
related to requested zoning bylaw
amendment 417 Wellington Street and 275
High View Drive be received for
information and further that a public
meeting be scheduled for Monday,
September 14th, 2026 in accordance with
Ontario regulation 54506 as amended.
Moved by councelor Rimol, seconded by
councelor Gibson. Questions or comments
on the report?
Councelor Herbert.
>> Thank you worship. I I I found it
interesting when I read that there was a
concern about the airport being involved
here that um I I'm just say and
obviously you've done the planning uh
and it right now it's not going to be an
issue but say what happens in 15 20
years the airport decides to grow their
runway and bigger planes come in would
they would that have an effect on this
project that's
would there be an issue with it at any
time?
Uh so through your worship uh the city
um including the airport have developed
the airport zoning bylaw which talks
about uh the permitted heights um how
they inter or how they uh work with the
flight path to make sure that we do have
that safe travel to and from the
airport. um you know should there be
some changes operationally to the
airport in the future they would need to
you know account for um various
developments um but uh that um and
that's something that it would happen in
any municipality.
>> Very good. Thank you.
>> Quest further questions or comments? I I could maybe clarify for those at home
and those in the gallery. This is an
application uh uh pertaining to the
Elgen Center and the this council a
number of years ago gave them approval
of about two apartment buildings on on
the pad there and this is the now moving
forward of that process.
Further questions
seeing none all those in favor? Any
opposed? Carried.
Thanks for worship. Next item relates to
an application by Shawside Development
Limited for temporary removal of
partlock control on townhouse dwellings
block 38 on plan 11m274.
I have a motion that report PD-5226
relating to the application by Shawside
Development Limited for temporary
removal of partlock control townhouse
dwellings block 38 plan 11M274 be
received for information and further
that the application by Shawside
Development Limited relating to the
passing of a bylaw to temporarily remove
part control for townhouse dwellings
block 38 plan 11m274 be approved and
further that council authorize staff to
prepare a bylaw pursuant to section 57
of the planning act which provides that
subsection 505 of the planning act part
lock control does not apply to block 38
on plan 11 M274.
Moved by councelor Riml, seconded by
councelor Taylor.
>> Questions or comments?
Seeing none, all those in favor? Any
opposed? Carried.
Thank item relates to an applications
for draft plan of subdivision and draft
plan of condominium approval for 96, 98,
and 100 more street. I have a motion
that report PD 4726 relating to
applications for draft plan of
subdivision and draft plan of
condominium approval 9698 and 100 more
street be received for information.
Moved by councelor Clark, seconded by
councelor Riml.
>> Questions or comments on the report?
Councelor Riml.
>> Just a question as to um what does this
mean for tenants? you know that someone
that's uh got into the building and is
renting and now they plan to change it
to a common condominium status. Just
what does that mean?
>> If if I'm not correct, but I'll I'll try
first. We have a number of buildings
that now are condominium in the sense of
how it works with their mortgage and
stuff, but they're not individually
owned by the tenants or offered for sale
to the tenants. So, am I correct in this
case that that's still the same
>> through your worship? Yes. In our
discussions with the applicant, nothing materially is going to change
with this in terms of the approvals that
have been given the the structures that
have that that have been uh built or
planned to be built. This is strictly um
a mechanism for assisting the developer
with financing the project so that they
can move forward with their their third
building hopefully soon.
>> Yeah.
>> Further questions or comments on the
report?
Seeing none, all in favor? Any opposed?
Carried.
Next item relates to a community
improvement plan project at 180 118
center street grants. I have a motion
that report PD 4926 relating to
community improvement program grants for
118 center street be received for
information and further council directed
a bylaw be prepared to enter into a
community improvement program grant
agreement with fresh start support
services relating to CIP application
2023-17.
Move by councelor Balvin Sand second by
councelor Kohler. questions or comments?
Seeing none, all in favor? Any opposed?
Carried.
>> Next item, uh, community improvement
plan project, Heiho Rentals Limited, uh,
for 43954 Southdale Line. I have a
motion that report PD50-26
relating to a community improvement
project by Heiho Rentals Limited for
43954 Southdale Line be received for
information and further that council
approve a residential grant and loan for
application 20268
as submitted by Heiho Rentals Limited
for 43954 South Dale Line and further
that council directed by be prepared to
entered into a residential loan
agreement with Heiho Rentals Limited
relating to a CIP project at 43954
Southdale Line.
moved by councelor Wookie, seconded by
councelor Taylor.
>> Questions or comments? Councelor Rhiml,
>> I have a question and it um I have no
concern with the application or or um
that at all. Just a general question
about CIP and I recognize it's a great
uh program and the different incentives
that are there, but I just is there a
concern with the city becoming uh
lending loans that you know we have to
track the payments? they have, I think,
seven years in order to pay. What if
someone defaults? Um, does the program
do we need to look at different other
types of incentives or is the loan piece
still working?
>> Mr. Pompilly, please go ahead.
>> Yeah, through your worship. No, that's
that that's a great question. Um, the
experience that we've had to date with loans has been has has has been
very effective. that there's been a lot
of uptake on. It's been a positive
result to help um u to help give that um
you know last bit of incentive for um a
proponent to go forward. That being said
um we are in the process of looking at
our CIP program um and and looking at
its effectiveness and maybe some
amendments that we can make to it. And
during the course of that review, we
we'll look at all the incentives that we
offer and just ensure that they are
functioning appropriately and providing
the incentives that they're intending to provide.
>> Go ahead.
>> And so that's another uh as far as the
loan the um looking after the the
repayment that's another uh task for
Treasury. Then the Treasury has to look
after that. So it's just you know just you know they got a lot on their
plate you know right now is that become
you don't want things to become too
ownorous. So yeah thanks
>> further questions or comments
>> seeing none all those in favor any
opposed carried
worshipership. Next item relates to
community improvement plan project uh by
101523556
Ontario Inc. for 52 more street. I have
a motion that report PD 5126 relating to
a community improvement project by
10001523556
Ontario, Inc. for 52 Mor Street be
received for information. And further
that council approve a heritage facade
and building improvement grant and loan
heritage design grant and building and
PL planning and building fees grant for
application 2026 167 as submitted by
101523556
Ontario, Inc. for 52 More Street. And
further that council directed by be
prepared to enter into a heritage facade
and building improvement loan agreement
with 101523556
Ontario Inc. related to a CIP project at
52 more street. Moved by councelor
Taylor, seconded by councelor Herbert.
>> Questions or comments?
Seeing none, all those in favor? Any
opposed? Carried.
>> The next four items are notices from the
committee of adjustment. Uh first up we
have a notice relating to 56 to 62 and
64 to 70 Sandy Mount Parkway. Notice of
a public meeting to take place by Zoom
on August 13th, 2026 at 10 a.m. has been
received from the committee of
adjustment regarding an application for
minor variance by landrise developments
to permit driveway widths and areas of
68.5% for interior and 53.5% for
exterior townhouse dwellings. Whereas
the maximum permitted width and area
coverage is 50% for two town houses
including eight units at 56 to 62 and 64
to 70 Sandy Mount Parkway. Uh, next
notice, uh, notice for a public meeting
to take place by Zoom on August 27th,
2026 at 10 a.m. has been received from
the committee of adjustment regarding an
application for minor variance by Jolie
Newfeld to permit an additional
residential unit on private services,
convert an existing detached garage into
an additional residential unit, and
construction of a new detached garage in
the front yard with a height of 4.28 28
m and a floor area of 112 m. Whereas the
maximum height shall not exceed 4 m and
maximum floor area shall not exceed 67
square m. And this is for a property at
40979 major line.
Remaining notices notice of a decision
has been received from the committee of
adjustment to permit lot coverage of
37.4% 4% whereas the maximum is 35% and
to permit a threeseason sun room 5.76
mters from the rear lot line whereas the
minimum rear yard depth is 7 m and this
is for a property at 85 Benjamin Parkway
and finally notice of a decision has
been received from the committee
adjustment to sever two lots for the
purposes of facil facilitating separate
mortgage financing for the threetory and
five-story apartment dwellings at 57 and
65 Walnut Street.
Unless there are any items from the
members under this committee.
>> Councelor Riml,
>> I just wondered given the committee of
adjustment if if we could perhaps have a
future report about the committee of
adjustment. Like my concern is or not
concern is just to be aware of um how
much the planning you know participates
in those to make sure that we're not
setting precedent you know because when
someone's asking for something that's
more and then once that's done then you
know someone else comes in and says well
that's a precedent so maybe just a
future report as to what the committee
adjustment does and how the process uh
works would be helpful. I know at some
point through this term of council we
did look at committee of adjustment even
looking at whether a member of council
would sit on it too but I think if if
that's not too ownorous for us to answer
councelor Rhymer's questions can we put
that under unfinished business and and
you know how the CEO is about making
sure all that stuff gets done so
John
>> worship just if to direct report if I
can just get a a motion that that staffy
director to prepare that report. I have
a I have a mover and councelor Riml if I
could just get a seconder.
Councelor Clark.
>> All right. Discussion on it. Seeing
none. All in favor? Any opposed?
Carried.
See how fast we can do that if we
worship. Unless there any further items
under this committee, we will move into
community engagement and services. Uh
first item this evening is the 2026
Elgen St. Thomas age friendly community
strategy. I have a motion that report
CMO 5626 relating to the 2026 Elgen St.
Thomas age friendly community strategy
be received for information and further
that council reaffirm the city's
commitment to maintaining its
designation as an agefriendly community
and supporting initiatives that enhance
the quality of life inclusion and
participation of older adults and
further that the Elgen St. Thomas Age
Friendly Strategy 2026 update be
recognized as a resource where
appropriate to inform municipal planning
programs and service delivery. And
further that an annual contribution of
$2,000 to support the activities of the
Algen St. Thomas Age Friendly Committee
be included as part of the city
manager's office operating budget
beginning in 2027.
Moved by councelor Gibson, seconded by
councelor Baldwin Sanss.
>> Questions or comments?
Wow, a group a group question and
comment. Councelor Baldwin Sands, you're
first.
>> Thank you very much and I would like to
thank very much for this report to
Taylor. I like to keep that conversation
going that we have with our seniors in
our community, not just at Valley View,
but also at the library and the senior
center. So, I was hoping that Taylor
could provide a little bit of a verbal
update on what's happening and what sort
of engagement is happening in our city
facilities in regards to keeping seniors
engaged in this community. And that's my
first question. Thank you.
>> Great. Hey Taylor, about 15 or 20
minutes worth of [laughter]
>> not quite but thank you worship through
you to councelor Baldwin Sans. Um yeah
so as you explained in the report and
through the strategy um many city staff
members sit on this committee. Um and
through that process we were able to
develop this um strategy using those
members as expertise and also getting
them to bring um the information and
data collection back to their groups um
at Valley View, at the library um at
social services based on the community
members that they're serving. Um so
there's a lot of engagement that way and
then also just through their individual
programs and services that the city
participates in and provides to seniors
and older adults in the community. Um,
so we're very thankful for those
different groups to come together and
um, hopefully with this strategy we
we'll continue that momentum going
forward and be able to come back uh,
with some solid updates to council on
what that work looks like.
>> Carry on councelor Baldwin Sans.
>> Thank you. And that goes to sorry
councelor wiki to steal your thunder
about having a report and letting it see
and collect dust on a shelf which this
report is obviously not doing and it is
still engaging and it has a level of
engagement with members of our
community. So my next question is what
levels are you using to track um and see
how the progress is going and is there
an attendance model that is doing it or
an increase of engagement on a social
media? What sort of
uh templates do you use in order to keep
track? Thank you. Then I have a last
question.
>> Yes, thank you. Um so the initial first
step here is to get council's
endorsement of the strategy. This also
went to Algen County Council for
endorsement and we'll go to Southwestern
Public Health's board for endorsement as
well. Um so once we have those
endorsements in place, the next steps of
this process um after completing the
strategy are to develop those monitoring
and performance metrics. So I will say
at the current time I don't have
anything um currently to bring forward
but that's the next steps for the
committee is to develop those. Um it's a new strategy um for the
committee. So that work needs to still
take place. Um but we will be coming
back to council I would expect on an
annual basis to report on what metrics
um we've evaluated in the past year and
probably set some performance targets
that way as well similar to what we do
for our own strategic plan. Um, and
especially with the requests for the
financials, I think it's important that
we do have those reports come forward if
we're not only council but for the
community to see what work is being done
um through this committee.
>> Go ahead.
>> Thank you. My last questions are about
Southwest Public Health, their level of
engagement, the conduits they use to
educate and communicate out because one
thing that really um stood out for me in
this report was how caregivers were
involved and how caregivers are feeling
some of the stress. So, it's not just
the active healthy seniors etc., but
you've also done a focus on caregivers
etc. that are companions to a lot of the
programming that goes on. So if you can
provide some comment on that and again
thank you for the report.
>> Yes, thank you. Um so yeah it's outlined
in the strategy quite well um the stress
and the burden on caregivers in the
community. So we feel that through the
recommendations of this report if a lot
of these things are implemented it will
not only support seniors and older
adults in the community but the people
that are caring for them as well
alleviate some of those stress and
pressures.
>> Okay. Thank you. Um, I have councelor
Gibson, then councelor Clark, then
councelor Taylor, councelor Riml's on
there, too. Okay.
>> Thank you, Taylor, for the uh for the
report. Uh, I'm on three or four I'm on
actually three committees that really um
really represent in this age group. And
I just and to include the parks and
recreation for being very inclusive with
some uh activities that have just come
out. the walking soccer. I love that
idea. And the pickle ball and a few
other sports that are geared to our
seniors.
This is wonderful news because this just
indicates it's going to be another
fabulous place to live. Like wow, this
is very the the inclusiveness of seniors
in the past I would say 12 years has
grown so much and I'm really pleased at
seeing this. You go to the sen, you go
to the senior center, you go to their
parks, you go to our swimming pool, JC's
pool, they have um aquatic there,
exercise program. I mean, we never had
that until last year. I think was our
first year. And I mean, kudos to our
parks and racks. This is really a good
report. And um I just have one question.
The 2000 contribution, what account does
that come from? Thank you. And again,
thank you, Taylor.
Um if approved, it will be put in the
city manager's ongoing operating budget
annually. Um and that contribution from
the county and public health will also
um be put into that uh budget line as
well.
>> Councelor Clark,
>> thank you. Worship. Uh it was
interesting to see the number of
different community partners that were
involved in the um in the study and I'm
just wondering if part of the process
will be to to identify who's going to
take the leadership on on the
recommendations. I think it goes back to
kind of what councelor Baldwin Sans was
u was getting at is um to make it a
living document um and to move it
forward, somebody's got to um take the
bull by the horns and and run with it.
And so I'm just hoping as um as you
report back to us, you could let us know
which of these different groups are
going to take the lead and and who in
that organization is taking the lead so
that when people come to us with direct
questions, uh we'll be able to steer
them in the right direction as to who's
working on what. And my second comment
would just be uh it's interesting to see
um and not surprising that caregivers
are highlighted again. So again, the
need for the adult day program at Valley
View to expand, I think, is is again
being highlighted. Thank you.
>> Yes. Thank you, councelor clerk. We'll
definitely um as part of the performance
metrics and the action plan going
forward, make sure that there's
responsibilities assigned to the um
recommendations in the report and make
sure that those come back to council.
And I'm in agreement with the um
expansion and support of the adult day
program and we're looking forward to
bringing that to AMO next week.
Councelor Taylor,
you okay? I think you are too. Councelor
Ry,
>> just a comment that um it's great
information. It's great for future
planning and just going forward, I
guess, with your plan is to uh to have
an effective communication strategy. You
know, how are you going to communicate
all these things? you know, people
there's reduced vision, reduced hearing,
and not everybody has a cell phone, so
you can't text someone or give them a QR
code to get information. So, um I guess
that'll be part of the next step is to
um you know, your communication plan is
how you're going to get these this
information out there.
>> Yeah. Thank you, Councelor Riml. And
that um $2,000 contribution from the
three partners will especially help with
communications. um part of the strategy
and the engagement that we heard from
people. Like you said, people aren't a
lot of people aren't online as part of
this demographic. So having printed
materials is very important to um
provide information out. So um that
$6,000 total will definitely contribute
to printed materials and promotions,
etc.
>> Council Herbert, thank you, Worship. Uh,
if I might make a suggestion, and I
don't know if it would qualify, could we
take the 2,000 out of grant? We give
grants every year out and not have to
put it into the budget.
>> If someone put forward a grant request,
that would be a way.
>> Oh, I would put it forward if I had to.
>> Then I put it forward. Then we take it
out a grant.
>> Well, there's some forms that you'll
need to get to the treasurer on the
grant request, but is that possible?
>> Yeah. Would that just a suggestion?
>> I'd make that motion.
>> Not against your suggestion. Just
looking for your paperwork and maybe the
signature on a checks. No.
[clears throat] I'm just trying to be
age friendly, Jim.
>> You are. [laughter]
Further questions or comments? But I I
see that as another natural thing that
could happen. It'd be a place where the
grant process could work.
No further questions. All in favor? Any
opposed? Carried.
» Thanks, worship. Next item relates to
the 2026 Orange Shirt Day flag raising
road closure request. I have a motion
that report ES4526 relating to the 2026
Orange Shirt Day flag raising road
closure request be received for
information. And further that council
approve the temporary closure of Talbert
Street from White Street to St.
Catherine Street and Mondaman Street
from Talbet Street to Curtis Street from
11:00 a.m. to 12:30 p.m. and Curtis
Street from Mandaman Street to St.
Catherine Street from 8:00 a.m. to 3:00
p.m. on Wednesday, September 30th, 2026
to allow for the Orange Shirt Day flag
raising. Moved by Councelor Baldwin
Sans, seconded by Councelor Gibson.
Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
>> Next item relates to the 2026 railway
city road race uh 2026 road closure
request. I have a motion that report
ES4626 relating to the railway city road
race 2026 road closure request be
received for information and further
that council authorize the road closures
as outlined in report ES4626
moved by councelor Wookie second by
councelor Riml.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none. All
in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
>> Next item relates to the accessibility
2026 openhouse free transit request. I
have a motion that report ES4826
relating to the accessibility 2026
openhouse free transit request be
received for information and further
that council wave the transit fair for
riders traveling to and from the
accessibility openhouse at the Joe
Thornton Community Center on Tuesday
September 26 22nd 2026
moved by councelor Gibson seconded by
councelor Taylor
>> questions or comments seeing none all in
favor any opposed carried
>> unless there are Any further items from
the members under this committee? We
will now move into infrastructure and
civic operations.
Uh first item this evening in this
committee relates to the transit master
servicing plan public engagement
summary. Uh we have Dennis Carr here
from Dylan Consulting in attendance to
present the transit master servicing
plan round one engagement summary. Uh
then following the presentation I have a
motion.
Welcome. Did they tell you how to set it
all up?
Look at that.
» Okay, just testing. You can hear me.
Perfect.
>> You're all right.
>> Okay. Um, thank you everybody for having
me here today. Uh, once again, my name
is Dennis Carr with Dylan Consulting.
I'm the project manager um for the
transit study that we're conducting for
the city of St. Thomas. So, thank you
for having me here today. Uh so today
I'm just here to present uh an initial
part of the study that we're working on
which is uh the round one of engagement
that we conducted and the engagement
that we conducted was very
comprehensive. It involved posting the
study on the city website providing
multiple opportunities for uh residents
and stakeholders to participate. and
involved a number of in-person
activities, you know, focusing on both
communitywide engagement and online
survey uh with paper versions available
along with a number of focused
engagement with key sort of stakeholders
within the community. Uh so I'm here
today to present some of the outcomes of
this engagement and some of the key
themes that we heard about, you know,
what's working well uh with the existing
transit service and what are the key
areas for improvement that we're seeing.
Uh so the first part of the engagement
uh that I want to talk about is really
the focus engagement and and this talks
about um a lot of you know a number of
the key stakeholders that we uh talk to
and again you'll hear some very
different uh perspectives on what's
working well and what are some of the
priorities for transit that individual
stakeholders want to see based on their
perspective and how they use the system
or how their constituents use the system
as well. And some of the key overarching
themes that we've heard uh throughout
this process uh that you'll hear me talk
about is one the need for, you know,
what's working well is, you know,
friendly drivers. You know, um some some
in many cases a reliable service. Uh but
one of the things that people want to
hear more of and see more of is extended
service hours. So, and that was a
consistent theme that we heard
throughout uh improving the reliability
of the service. uh and also extending
the service particularly within the
city. So extending the coverage in the
areas in which the service provides
particularly with a growing city. So uh
I'll go through some of these and I'll
you know there's a lot of detail that
has been identified in this slide and
again I'll just identify some of the key
themes that we heard from each of the
focus areas. Uh so when we when we spoke
to senior care workers through a focus
groups uh a lot of the key themes that
we heard uh was you know the
affordability of the system was good but
there's some reliability issues the need
to extend hours and again a key theme of
what we heard uh and you know making
sure bus stops are close to uh key
important uh destinations uh
particularly uh key shopping areas. Um
when we spoke to Fanshaw College again
you'll you'll see some consistency in
some of the themes that we've heard and
some new systems as well. Uh you know
based on the existing classes and the
hours of service the services typically
unable to meet um a lot of the demand
for student trips particularly in the
later evenings. Um the on demand system
doesn't always adhere to scheduled
pickup times. Uh and there was some
discussion about the benefit of a a
universal transit pass to increase the
affordability for students. Uh again
some of the key themes that we heard uh
for power co um ma major employer moving
more frequent service more nighttime
service and connections to London. So
that idea of more regional connection uh
particularly to to draw from an employer
draw from a larger array of employees as
well as new jobs are coming into uh the
city were some of the key themes that we
heard. Uh we also talked to the
supervisors and the drivers that
currently operate the service and again
just reiterated some of what we saw
looking through the data identifying
some of the busiest routes in the system
with Talbot you know being the busiest
uh some of the challenges of night
operations uh and the challenges of
continuing to operate the on demand with
demand uh being uh uh demand growing for
the ondemand service for other major
employees. employers that we spoke to.
Again, transit schedule and frequency
not always aligning with shift times and
when you're operating at hour at hourly
service, that can be a challenge to
align an hourly service with various
different shift times throughout the
city. Uh routes that don't connect to
different points of the city uh and the
need to, you know, ensure some of those
connections uh and improve frequency as
well. Uh in terms of connecting
agencies, we had a sort of a group of
other connecting agencies including
London, Middle Sex, Elgen uh uh and
again just providing some feedback into
the overall study. The need for improved
industrial coverage uh the need for
weekend service uh improved improved
payment options were some of the key
themes that we heard uh from from this
group as well
uh in terms of planning and economic
development. So speaking with staff
again that kind of theme of providing
more access to new areas particularly uh
new industrial developments that
necessitate transit expanding some of
the transit including the on demand and supporting intensification along uh
of transit or or supporting uh expanded
transit along intensification corridor.
So where there is new development,
making sure we're pro providing transit
there to provide those connections uh as
well as uh transit to uh other regional
destinations such as Londy and London
and Port Stanley. Uh our conversations
with the accessibility advisory
committee uh talked more about the
parallel transit service uh and with
weight times getting worse uh and what
are some of the potential ways we can
improve uh that. um some of the
challenges passengers are having in
terms of booking trips ahead and getting
the ride that they need. uh and also
when using the conventional service uh
ensuring that there's accessible ways to
pay for fair uh and also looking at uh
stops as well
uh in terms of social services again uh
some key themes around providing uh
enhanced travel options to places like
London where there's specialized needs
uh that may not be available in St.
Thomas. So having those connections
available and linking transit to
recreational youth programming and the
need to align transit schedules uh with
that which which can be difficult uh
when operating hourly service.
Uh in terms of high school students, we
did make our way into a couple of high
schools and did had some engagement
directly with students uh where they
were able to um you know identify how
the existing transit system is working
and draw some maps about what they would
like the service to look like. So uh
that was sort of a really good
connection and with students uh again
interest in regional destinations uh and
establishing direct connections and
dedicated loops between high schools,
Fchaw College and other key retail or
other destinations in the city uh was
something that was prioritized.
And then of course uh in early counselor
workshops that we had uh with members of
council uh some of the key themes that
we heard was um more efficient service
frequent and reliable transportation uh
particularly recognizing that growth
that's happening in the city including
growth in employment investing more into
our service while also thinking about
how we increase our overall cost
recovery with that investment. So it's
about effective investment in our
service. Uh improving the reliability or reliability reliably servicing shift
workers um was identified as a key pri
priority. Identifying more capacity for
our parat transit uh customers as well.
Exploring regional partnerships. So as
we're exploring these sort of trips
outside of St. Thomas and and those
connections, what do those regional
partnerships look like? and ensuring
that we have that integration with
active transportation as well. So it's
not just about the service but how do
people get to and from our bus stops.
So when it come when it came to sort of
overall community and what we heard uh
through both the popups and the
community survey again a lot of the key
themes came out through the two popup
sessions that we had both at the St.
Thomas home show and and a library
drop-in session. Uh we heard a lot of
strengths about you know uh highlighting
about the um the positive feedback
regarding the drivers and schedules
uh and uh them specifically liking
routes three and four in terms of the
convenience and and the connection to
the Walmart. But those opportunities for
improvement focus on expansion uh both
with regional transit expanded service
within St. Thomas as well including uh
and and sort of adjacent areas uh and to
industrial areas as well. Uh again key
theme that we heard was later evening
service uh particularly as we start to
see more of these sort of shift work uh
opportunities. If we can accommodate a
daytime shift but not an evening shift
that limits the opportunity to use
transit uh and more frequent service uh
what were all sort of identified as sort
of key areas and and of course you'll
see here a lot of sort of detailed
things about the use of smart cards,
fairs, shelters. These are all things
that we take into consideration sort of
when developing uh when we're going to
develop a plan in the future. And again,
just to re reiterate from the online
survey, a lot of similar themes that we
heard. We had over 200 responses back
from our online survey. Again, the key
themes around extending service hours.
That was sort of a major theme that we
heard as a priority for transit. uh
followed by the reliability of service,
increased frequency and and and ease of
use were sort of the major themes that
came out in terms of what's important
when looking at overall um transit. So
again, I'm not going to get into each of
these uh specific points. I'm just
recognizing uh the time that I have, but
I hope this provides a good summary of a
lot of the key themes that we heard. I'm
happy to answer any questions that you
may have.
questions. Councelor Wookie then
councelor Herbert.
>> Thanks your worship. Uh just one quick
one. I saw that on one of the slides
issues of co-mingling between on demand
and parallel. What was the expression of
the concern with that one if you could
just uh let us know. Thank you.
» Uh through your worship uh some of the
issues that we hear around comingling uh
really have to do with um not
understanding what co-mingling is. Uh so
uh someone that's a parallel transit
registrant may be on board a vehicle and
someone who is not a registrant may get
on that vehicle at the same time and
there's sort of that misunderstanding of
why why are they on that same vehicle.
Uh so that's sort of the major concern
and and sometimes when it adds to if
there's not enough service uh it may add
to the number of trips that may be
denied in the service. But that was
there was a couple comments on it. It
wasn't too significant from what we
heard. Council
>> Herbert
worship. Well, thank you very much. This
is something this has been a priority
for council for the last six months to we know transportation has to be
improved in in the city and um it's it's
you had so much information in this I
had I had to get printed copy because I
wanted to make some notes on it. So, but
we know a lot of these things it's it's
going to be budget time. Uh do we need
more buses? We had an opportunity to
meet the minister of transportation out
on Highway 3. Uh and he talked about
transportation joining the cities. In
fact, council Taylor and Council Riml
and Council Core was the acting mayor
that day and we had a good discussion
with them about transportation and they
all they're very excited about how we're
going to improve transportation. But for
inside the city, uh this is good for us.
Uh I know someone had talked to me about
sometimes routes change and they don't
tell anybody. They go to the bus and
know all of a sudden the bus stop's been
moved. So stuff like that we we need to
be we need to improve on. So no, this is good. We we know these are all
budget items. Do we need three more
buses? Do we need 10 more operators?
This is something we have to sit down
discuss because implement a lot of these
suggestions is difficult. I mean you
want to increase time lengths and 101
which we agree like power co is going to
want people running bus out there 10
maybe 11 12 at night but we need staff
to do it. So that's the other side of
the coin. Great suggestions but we have
to make it work with within our existing
budget. So but anyway thank you very
much. I I you really did a good job
touching bases with almost everybody
that I can see. So, thank you, Councer.
>> Thanks to your worship. It's great to
see how uh we're progressing through
here and the public feedback that is
coming coming back with this too. Now,
like just a couple comments too with the
from what I see, especially with the
question that councelor Wookie talked
about with the on demand and and that
being mixed is that there's a lot of
confusion. And I think some of it's
being portrayed by the provider because
they're telling people that their rides
are being cancelled because of the on
demand. So somebody on paratransits
booked something and then they're being
told by the provider that their route
was canceled because on demand came on,
which I've been assured by staff that does not happen. So somehow we got
to get that communication out that
that's not happening because that's a
consistent complaint that I keep getting
from this and and it's it's a
misconception. And then I don't know if
we we how much we delve into policy here
because lately what's been I've been
getting especially with the paratransit
is that they're telling me that there's
a policy which I haven't had a chance
yet to talk to staff that they're not
allowed to bring their grocery carts on
the paratransit bus. They got to take it
apart but meanwhile it's full of
groceries and people are going there.
So, I found that quite strange and I'm
hoping that that actually isn't a policy
because uh it's I've been getting a few
calls with that and I I just haven't had
a chance to talk to Scott, but I didn't
know if those type of comments are
coming through these surveys or not.
» Kevin,
uh through the mayor to councelor
Kohler, thanks for for raising those.
We'll I'll take that back about the
grocery carts on buses.
>> Councelor Baldwin Sans, will you finish?
Councelor Kohler and councelor Balden
Shans and councelor Ry.
>> Thank you. Just a couple of brief
questions on the level of engagement
that you introduced to us. Were you
pleased as a consultant with the number
of engagement pieces that you've been
able to do? You had several public
consultations. You've had the 200 that
you mentioned online. So, were you uh
pleased with the outcome with the number
of people that we have in our community?
Does it give you a good snapshot
and what you presented back to us? Thank
you.
>> Yeah. Uh through through your worship as
with sort of any engagement uh you know
the level engagement we receive is
always going to vary depending on what's
going on and how people prioritize it.
You know what I am pleased about is the
amount of different tactics that we use
to engage uh with the public through the
various different focus groups going
right into the high schools uh through
the the the two inperson sessions as
well as the uh the in-person surveys.
So, you know, combined with with
everything, I think we got a fairly good
snapshot of what the community is is
thinking. Um, you know, always open to
hear more from from individuals, but I I
think we got a decent snapshot of sort
of what's going on and and what we're
what people like and and would like to
prioritize seeing improved.
» Any further questions or comments?
Seeing none all those in oh Joan
councelor Riml
>> sorry just um I thought it was wonderful
information and you really did capture a
lot of detail just and so and and so one
of my questions will be like what are
your next steps you know as for the in
the plan and then in the next steps will
you then also give us some ideas um
looking at dollars and cents you know
comparing um St. Thomas to other like
size cities you know as to what um you
know how do we rank you know are we are
we funding enough you know for the for
the thing and the other thing is too I I
think it's really critical and it's in
there too as far as looking at the
payment option for all groups no matter
what age you know when you're trying to
get on the bus parallel transits may be
booked and so you're trying to use the
regular service and you're older and
you're trying to maintain your balance
you don't want to become a false
statistics in the age friendly uh
report. So uh I think looking at the uh
a payment you know some kind of and
without having an iris scan for
everybody you know is there with all the
agent technology there must be something
we could simplify that with but
>> uh through through your worship. So yes
there there's a number of next steps uh
this engagement process provides sort of
one level of input of what we're going
to look at uh we we also looked at sort
of the existing performance how it's
operating. We we looking at uh your
peers and and the level of investment
and the level of writership compared. So
we're going to take all of that
information uh and start to develop uh
some strategies and sort of recommended
options. Some of those will be around
roots. Some of those will be around uh
the extent of service, the frequency,
fair payment, fair technology is
something that we're going to look at.
Are there different technology options
that should be prioritized? And again
thinking about you know uh you know
given the level of investment that you
have what should you prioritize to help
you achieve your goals around around
transit. Uh so we're going to sort of
take all of that information and and
present it back to you at a future date.
>> Okay. Just
>> I didn't turn this off. Sorry. One just
one last thing. I'm not sure whether
it's for you or will we be looking at
the current transit station? you know,
is that the best use of um that
building, you know, to house the buses,
you know, is that could they be at a
different location and and repurpose
some of that space? Anyway, it's just I
didn't know whether that would be part
of the whole transit package.
Further questions or comments?
Seeing none, thank you for your help
tonight. All in favor? Any opposed?
Carried. Mr. Clerk,
>> I just have
>> Is there even a motion?
>> There wasn't a motion yet. I just have
to read the motion here. So,
>> just apply what we just did.
>> So, I have a motion that report ES5026
relating to the transit master servicing
plan public engagement summary be
received for information and further
that council acknowledge the key themes
and findings outlined in the what we
heard engagement summary as
representative of the feedback received
during phase one of the public
consultation process. and further that
the what we heard engagement summary
together with the comments and direction
provided by council during consideration
of report ES-5026 be incorporated into
the preparation of preliminary service
concepts and potential system changes
and further that staff report back to
council following the second phase of
public consultation summarizing the
development and components of the draft
transit master servicing plan for
further consideration.
Moved by councelor Wookie, seconded by
councelor Taylor.
questions or comments further?
Seeing none, all in favor? Any opposed?
Carried.
>> Thanks, worship. We'll next move on to
the school crossing guard location
review. I have a motion that report
ES4726
relating to the school crossing guard
location review be received for
information and further that council
authorize the deployment of a school
crossing guard at the intersection of
Edward Street and Balaclava Street
relating starting in September 2026.
Move by councelor Baldwin Sand, second
by councelor Gibson. questions or
comments on this? Councelor Balden Sans.
>> Thank you. As someone who uses this
intersection frequently, I strongly
support what is recommended by staff and
thank them for this report.
>> Okay,
further questions or comments? All those
in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
>> Next item relates to the fingle line
servicing RFP 202621 award. I have a
motion that report ES4926 relating to
the fingle line servicing RFP 202621
award be received for information and
further that council award RFP 202621
to CIMA plus in the amount of 437,500
excluding HST
move by councelor Riml second by
councelor Gibson
questions or comments
seeing none all those in favor any
opposed carried
Last item under this committee is
relates to the Yarmouth Yards Earthworks
and servicing phase 5 tender award. I
have a motion that report ID0626
relating to Yarmouth Yard earthworks and
servicing phase 5 tender award be
received for information and further
that the tender submitted by network
sewer and water main limited in the
amount of 3,524,334
and30 excluding HST be accepted.
Move by councelor Riml, seconded by
councelor Clark.
>> Questions or comments.
Seeing none, all those in favor? Any
opposed? Carrie?
>> Unless there any further items from the
members under this committee.
» Oh, sorry. Councelor Kohler.
>> Thanks, your worship. uh the harvest
court parking strategy has been
implemented and uh I think 98% of the
people are extremely happy. Uh I had the
opportunity to talk to a couple people
that aren't upset. It's just they were
hoping that we would go a little bit f
further and they have addressed this
through the customer service uh program
and um they followed through the process
and it's been closed off and uh it's
just um kind of been left at where it's
going to where it's going to stay
because of council's um direction for
the the report. So, what I'm hoping for,
and I'd like to actually uh move a
motion, hopefully there's a seconder
that we include parking, no parking
signs in front of 19 and 21 Harvest
Court. So, when we've come around the um culde-sac there, there's those
two houses there, and we don't have
signs, but the way their frontage is, if
you try to park in those areas, they're
too small and they extend over the
driveways. Like, they're illegal parking
spots anyways. you would be ticketed
based on our bylaw is you have to have 3
ft on either side. So, but what's
happening because we've gone no parking
on that side, people are now just
parking there and it's actually blocking
them into their their laneways. I know
they've talked to some other counselors
too, but I've had the opportunity to go
over there and actually park there and
seeing what's happened. And my fear is
if we don't do something uh with this
because he was actually trapped inside
his lane. We trying to get to his
afternoon shift and couldn't get out
because somebody was parked there. Once
school starts, if people do that and
they're going to be forced to that side,
I think they're going to be these people
at 19 and 21 will be hampered with that
the whole school season. So, I was
hoping that we could uh have a motion or
accepted motion that we install two
signs, one in front of 19 and 21 Harvest
Court. And I I'm sure that can be taken
care of in the operating budget. But
thank you.
Are you looking for a seconder?
Councelor Gibson. Good. Now we can have
discussion.
>> I'm thinking Kevin's going to take care
of it by the look on his
>> I was thinking I saw him writing
feverishly, but you know,
>> Kevin want input.
>> Yeah. Through the mayor to councelor
Kohler. Um that's something uh I can
easily take away and have installed.
>> Okay. Then we do we do not need to vote
on the motion then
staff has already picked it up. Clerk
>> you are sure. We can still have a motion
just that staff be directed to install
no parking signs in front of 19 and 21
Harvest Court. I have moved by councelor
Kohler. Second by councelor Gibson.
>> Great. Just as easy to say. No further
comment. All those in favor? Any
opposed? Carried. Great. All right.
Councelor Clark, did you have more?
>> Yes. Um I had a couple calls with regard
to um Shawside and um when the roads are
going to be assumed by the city and I
was just wondering I know we're going
through that process with a number of
subdivisions and just wondering if we
could get an update on the timelines for
the Shaw Valley one.
Kevin, you got some help or you you want
to get back to us on this one or
>> No, I I can give you an update uh
through the mayor to councelor Clark.
our our dev development uh um team has
been working on going back in history,
going back in time to find out, making
sure that we are crossing our tees and
dotting our eyes on all of our
subdivisions and discovered that we need
to go a little bit further back than
2017 uh in order to make sure that uh we
assume those properly. So, it's taking
us a little bit longer. Uh we're hoping
to bring a a report into council in
September. Uh we were targeting this
council meeting uh to do that but it's
just taking us a little bit more time.
Uh so um that's our status update.
>> Okay.
Anything else under this topic or this
committee? I mean
>> seeing none.
>> Thanks for worship. We'll move into
corporate governance and administration.
Having already dealt with the financial
statements, we'll move on to Yarmouth
Yard's financial plan. I have a motion
that report TR 2026 relating to the
Yarmouth Yards financial plan be
received for information.
Moved by councelor Wookie, seconded by
councelor Rhiml.
>> Questions or comments or Mr. Treasur?
Would you like to go first?
» Uh certainly I can introduce the report
at least. Uh so we've been speaking
about the Yarmmouth Yards uh development
for some time but mostly in generalities
right we all understand that uh we have
this large upfront investment and it's
going to pay off in a significant way in
the future but how do we manage the
interim so the purpose of this report is
to get a bit more specific in that
regard and outline a kind of like a
budgeting context uh for how we're going
to handle this moving forward. And so
the report goes through uh a number of
items. It it specifies what our unfunded
portion of Yarmouth Yards is. That'd be
167 million, but also highlights the
opportunity that we have received over
$800 million in in grants and subsidies
and private u private agreements.
Uh it then tests um you know, can can
the city afford that 167 million if we
were to debt finance it? And so the
report goes through a number of
assumptions that leads us to the opinion
that yes yes we can um without kind of
uh doing things like deferring capital
or increasing taxes any of those
extraneous measures that would apply
pressure to the the tax base. Uh then we
took that set of assumptions and we kind
of tested it uh with some different
adverse scenarios to see you know to
just stress test the model to see if
things don't go quite as as we intend
them to uh do we then have to increase
taxes or defer capital or take on take
extraneous measures. And generally the
answer is no. But we do we do um specify
in the report that this is all based on
a set of assumptions that could change
as we move forward. It's also uh it also
notes that if several adverse u
conditions stack upon one another then
the city could be in some trouble in
that situation. So it does recommend a
set of uh risk management uh initiatives
that we can take at most being no cost
at all to the to the taxpayer and those
are recommended through that this report
uh for council's consideration in future
budgets.
>> Great. having the report attached and
that summary to begin with. Are there
questions or comments of the treasure?
Councelor Wiki.
>> Thanks, your worship. Um, comprehensive
reports like this uh help lower our
blood pressure because I think for both
us currently and the next council and
the next council after that, this
provides us with a really good road map
of what is both uh possible, reasonable,
and prudent to do. And that's what we
need. That's what we as elected
officials need is we need a road map
like this. So for me, when I take a look
at some of the the um the charts, thank
you. Uh graphs, counselors love graphs,
and um and see that the debt repayment
is reasonable. and seeing that the
available cash flow what the what the
kind of uh road ahead looks like for
that it provides us with a framework
where we can frame our own expectations
about what's going to happen over the
next 8 years. Um, this is one of those
ones where it's sort of like a few of
these graphs I'd like to have up in the
counselor's lounge like really large uh
and uh you know framed and you know make
sure we can see those every week when we
walk in kind of thing because documents
like this are great guiding documents
for us uh Adam. So thank you. when I
read this, I uh um you just you just
feel like you have a better grip on
what's what's going on and what's ahead
and so there's no question just a uh
appreciation of how this guides us going
forward. Thank you.
>> Thanks,
>> Council Riml. Then councelor Kohler.
[clears throat]
>> Okay,
>> I have a couple of questions, but uh I
appreciate this very much.
and and uh response to councelor Wookie,
I think we should have one of Justin's
charts, you know, on the wall, you know,
with all the timelines and the great big
thing because um to me um this project
is I would think it's the city's number
one project. It's it's it's the one we
need to really keep focused and I am
concerned that we don't have a currently
we don't have a a um a re not a revenue
a reserve fund set up not I know we're
trying to do the development charge um
project and that will come but we could
set aside right today uh a I don't know
how to call it DWRF anyway reserve fund
where we start to you know we have to be
mindful that we have the sock money away
in there for this this project. We can't
wait till all of a sudden it's it's done
and then say, "Oh, we didn't save any
money." So, I you know, I'd like to see
some visible
markers that we've got something set
aside. And with all the things that the
treasurer has written about the um
mitigation things like he's recommending
these things, well, how do we make them
actually happen? You know, how can we
make all these Yes. Okay. you know, um,
all the things that he's suggested, we
should say yes, you know, we want them
all to happen. Uh, and including the
reserve fund, you know, something today.
I'm I'm concerned about the um the
ARIRL, the um the funding, you know,
like we're planning, I think it's 9.7
million, you know, that we're going to
be able to um incur every year. But just
for instance, like we just recently
increased our reserve last council or
last meeting 7.4 million because we had
um depleted our reserves like what would
a 7.4 million um hit like that due to
that ARIRL and is that effective like
for one year or does that effect does
that effect go on you know for
subsequent years?
>> Mr. Treasur,
thank you. Yeah. um it it would affect
us as long as the debt is active. So our
airl is based on our annual repayments.
So once our annual repayments against a
dementure stops are we re recapture some
of our debt capacity. So you're right uh
the debenture we just decided to issue
will take up um additional debt capacity
space. That being said, you can see from
the graph that there is ample space
available. We just have to be a little
cautious going forward that um we
exercise discretion when we're going to
issue debt and we also have to be aware
of the fact that our debt capacity can
also be proportionately used by uh
entities that we proportionately own
such as the water board.
So I think we just have to be really careful and really mindful when
people you know and and three years some
point it seems like a long time but
everyone wants a project you know but we
have to be very careful that we have to
start saving up and and having some uh
funding. We don't want to uh um get in
big trouble with this because we're
trying to look at operational, you know,
we've got staff and we're trying to grow
the city and everybody wants their
streets plowed early and their garbage
picked up. So, we've got so many
pressures on there, but this uh uh fund
um this project is is critical. It's
critical to the growth, but it's it's an
expensive project. Um, how did we make
out with the grant request that we did
back in April? Was it 172 million? Did
were we successful in that?
>> Well, sorry, city manager. Go ahead.
>> Sure. Thank you. Rush three to council
Ryal. We have not heard the results of
that grant funding. However, we have
been in contact with the federal
ministry that's administering that grant
and we are continued to be uh up for
consideration of receiving that funding.
So, we're quite hopeful. However, we
know there is a lot of competing capital
infrastructure projects across the
country and we are just one of many
applications.
>> Okay. So, just back I' I'd like to, you
know, suggest that we set up some kind
of reserve fund like at least get some
kind of marker on the wall and say,
okay, you know, we're going to start
putting money in this pot so at least
it's visible.
And I would expect that the budget
season coming up upon you. Um is a great
time to really analyze all of that. Mr.
Treasur, um should can we do it now or
is it a part of our fiscal
responsibility over the next little
while?
>> We'll have to establish uh a reporting
framework that is number seven in those
risk mitigation uh items I recommend in
the report is to establish an ongoing
financial monitor monitoring framework.
We'll have to decide exactly how that
looks. I'm certainly open to council's
opinion or preferences on on what that
may look like. Uh we can include as part
of our quarterly budget monitoring
process or we could do a standalone uh
item. I think we'll take that item back
as staff and kind of develop it and
bring it back for council's
consideration.
>> Okay, great. And and I agree, Mr.
treasur. The addition of our quarter
quarterly reports to council now have
given us a far greater piece of
knowledge on
some of these larger projects we have
going on too. Uh what you don't I'm
going to councelor Kohler then councelor
Clark.
>> Thanks your worship. Uh I uh told the
treasurer this already that in my short
time on council, this is probably one of
the most important reports that I've
ever dealt with. And uh I think when we
look at this and it shows the the
planning, I think it proves to the
people that we can
focus on
industrial and commercial growth without
forgetting the long-term residents here.
And I think this this report should give
them uh some comfort in that. And I I I
just want to point out the the the one
paragraph that's in here that should
reassure everybody. It's a based the
based on the assumptions adopted by
staff. The forecast indicates that the
city is not expected to exceed cash
flows constraints that would require
interimm capital project deferrals or
increases to property taxes or utility
rates to meet annual debt servicing
obligations. Rather, the annual projects accumulated surplus and cash
flows in the forecasted period. So, I
think we should all we all know that the
next four years are going to be tough in
the fact that we're not going to have
that money to throw throw around, but
this should give everybody the the
comfort that if we if we continue to go
through the financial plan and we make
sure that we're prudent, we don't
increase spending or on unbudgeted items
that we can make it through here and get
to the point where we start realizing
that tax uh repayment from the projects
that we're investing in. So, I I really
appreciate this this report, how it's
laid out. It's nice and simple, but it
should give everybody comfort that if we
maintain what we're doing and we
consistently continue to go through and
monitor what we're doing that we can get
through it without impacting the
long-term residents.
>> Dr. Clark,
>> thank you. The um the report mentions
that uh part of the funding will be land
sales from the Armouth Yards um complex.
I'm just wondering um whether the 167
million of debt uh has taken all the
sales of that land in into the
calculations or or what percentage of
the lands you know we've sold some we
haven't sold the others. Just wondering
whether the 167 could be less um if more
land is sold or where how you've used
that um future land sales in this
report.
>> Yeah. So part of the 800 million um that
is funded for the project includes uh
some land sales that have already
transpired. Um if we were to generate
additional land sales, those could be
applied similarly against that uh
unfunded portion which is slated to be
debt funded right now. That would be an
option council has. you you could either
apply it against the the project to to
avoid debt or you can hold it for some
of those high risk years to just make
sure that um we're going to be able to
make those debenture payments without
increasing taxes or utility rates if you
wanted a little bit bit of extra
assurance. Uh that's something that we
could discuss uh as a council as those
land sales uh transpire in the future.
» Please go ahead. So just for
clarification then the the land sales if
we were to apply if we decide to take
the land sales and apply it against the
short-term debt the 167
could is not taking into account future
land sales
or sorry it yeah
>> that's correct we value the land that's
unsold out at Yarmmouth Yard somewhere
around a quarter billion dollars. So,
it's it's possible that if we had a
bunch of land sales, you could apply it
against the the unfunded portion of the
project to significantly avoid debt,
>> but it'd be reliant on those land sales
happening.
>> Sure. But the good news is we have the
land. It's not going away. And so, it's it's not as scary as the 167, you
know, may appear to be.
» Councelor Taylor, then councelor Wiki.
>> Thank you, your worship. I had a similar
uh question in regards to the um annual
repayment limit that we've set at 80%.
Um I'm just maybe thinking that maybe
and that's a maximum. Is there a way to
limit that? Because when the world
pandemic hit in 2020, no one in their
financial plans or in their strategic
plans had any idea that a world pandemic
is something we should think about.
Believe me, I don't want to even see
something like that happen. But let's
just say that there's some sort of a
world catastrophe that happens. I'm just
wondering uh if Treasury has uh reviewed
the fact is that a a maximum or should
we be looking at other numbers like 70%
or 60% as being our annual uh repayment
limit rather than setting Yeah, that's
our max. But is that where we really
want to go or should should we be
looking just in case because the sky is
falling? I'm never going to say that,
but I don't want to be in that position
when it does, if it ever does. But
anyway, just wondering about that 80%.
Is that really the number we want to set
today? Thank you,
>> Mr. Treasurer.
So, uh, it is best practice for council
to adopt what's called a debt management
policy where you define that level. I
would suggest you don't want to use your
whole ARIRL. If you've done that, you've
done something wrong. I've suggested in
the report that we use up to 80% of it
to leave some room for the unknown as as
suggested by the counselor, but it is
completely within council's ability and
right to determine where that line uh
may be.
» So, we have councelor Taylor down for
less.
» Yes, councelor Wiki.
>> Thank you. This is a a question for the
city manager and the communications
team. And the challenge here is going to
be as councelor Cer said, this is one of
the most important reports we've had in
many, many years. And how do we how does
this get condensed, simplified, so it
can be digestible for the public because
I want to be able to when we talk to the
public to say, "Hey, on Speak Up St.
Thomas, there's an article on this. You
can read it. It's right there. It'll
take you five minutes and you'll have an
idea of what we're going through and
what we're talking about. Um, so to the
city manager, I think you've got a
challenge because this is not going to
be a real simple one, but it's a very
important one to be able to point out to
people what's going on. I I just I guess
what's the how do you see this getting
out to the public and on in on what
avenue? Because it's it's not uh having
it as a social media post is kind of
doesn't do it justice. Um but it that
might be the start of it. So just a
question for you. Thanks.
>> Go ahead, city manager.
>> Uh thank you councelor Wiki and through
to or through the mayor to council. Um
our communications and public relations
coordinator has been working on a robust
communications strategy. Uh the first
step in this process was this council
report. So making sure we get that out.
The mayor did some media work today with
CTV to try to kind of elaborate more on
these concepts. Uh a lot of the work
involves utilizing our beehive. So kind
of breaking down various aspects of this
into kind of nice consumable videos. So
we appreciate the partnership of the EDC
in putting that out. It's also doing
some social media work using our new
engagement platform and making sure that
we communicate this in all of the
different ways. So there is a a strategy
and a plan, but it it works kind of on
uh because it is so complex and a lot of
people don't want to read a 12-page
council report. It's making sure that
it's consumable to the average citizen.
So there there is a plan and it's
rolling out this fall.
Don't 11
council Herbert. No. Did I have any? No.
Council Herbert. Thank you, worship. Um,
thank you for the report, Adam. I mean,
this really helps me understand what's
going on. And yet I I was a little bit
confused when I was reading through it
where under your consolidated statements
of operations accumulate surplus income
statement you say that we have reflect
an operating deficit of 748,000
and then in the next statement you say
however we have an surplus of 134,000
and then you list a bunch of uh uh
budget line items. Are those if you
total those budget line items, would
that make the difference between the we
go from a deficit to a surplus? That's
how we get to the surplus by adding up
what you're suggesting there like
industrial development activities and
non-cash accounting adjustments.
» Yeah. So that um that question is in
reference to the audited financial
statements. Um
yes we we with respect to that we
incurred a budget deficit uh that we
required to draw from the uh a taxf
funded reserve to resolve we but on the
financial statements we had a large
surplus that was in relation to Yarmouth
Yards as I just mentioned we secured
over $800 million in uh grants and
private sector agreements and so that's
why the financial statements both show a
budget deficit and a very large surplus
plus for the city simultaneously.
>> So they offset each other. Is that what
you're saying?
>> Uh they're just used for different
purposes. The the money for Yarmouth
Yards is for Yarmouth Yards. It's not to build a road or pay staff.
It's just very specific purpose. Um the money that is used for general city
operations, we did have a modest deficit
as reported in Q4.
>> Okay. Thank you.
Our questions, comments,
Mr. Treasur, again I'll I'll say it
again. The information flowing from your
department has been exceptional on big
things like this and even where what we
need to do next. And there's a lot of
large large amount of gap between last
message to this message which makes it a
little easier for us to as counselor
Wiki says um answer the the questions of
the of the taxpayers of the city and
what is it you're doing. I think this
was a excellent document. It got out
there with the agenda this this week and people read it. people had great
questions on it and there'll be more
following up and the as you say the
communication uh plan on it is to be as
straightforward as we can against the
information that we now know to be and
the risks that are in the report.
So thank you.
Any further questions or comments?
Seeing none all those in favor? Are
there any opposed? Carried.
>> Thanks worish. Next item relates to
community grant requests intake 4. I
have a motion that report TR226
relating to community grant requests
intake 4 be received for information and
further that council decline all
applications under the 2026 community
grants program intake 4.
Move by councelor Riml
seconded by councelor Gibson.
>> Questions or comments?
Seeing none all those in favor? Any
opposed? Carried.
>> Membership. The next item relates to the
2026 municipal election accessibility
plan. I have a motion that report CC
1526 relating to the 2026 municipal
election accessibility plan be received
for information and further that council
adopt the 2026 municipal election
accessibility plan for the 2026
municipal election.
Move by councelor Gibson, second by
councelor Riml. Questions or comments on
the uh election accessibility plan?
Mr. Deputy Clerk, is there you you want
to share any of the information on this
or you
» worship? Similar plans to previous
years. Again, with council supporting
the uh online and telephone voting,
anyone can vote from anywhere. Um all
the technology is is available for
assistive u screen readers. Lots of
accessible technologies can utilize the
online voting. Um, and we're just
finalizing voter assistance centers
right now within that two-eek window
that you can vote. Um, and they'll all
be fully accessible as well.
>> Super. Councelor Herbert,
>> question to John through the mayor. Uh,
are you having more than two sites or
because people have asked me I know we
had I think two last year's library and
Mo Arena, but they're asking me other sites.
>> Thanks. And through the council. So,
right now we will likely be uh two dates
at the Elgen Center, uh the senior
center, and the library. So, three
different locations across four dates.
Uh we're looking to include a Saturday,
evening hours, uh and daytime as well.
>> Further questions or comments? Councelor
Taylor,
>> I'm not sure if this is the right Thank
you. worship spot to say thank you to
city staff. have been out at the Horton
Market a number of weekends, a number of
Saturdays promoting get out and vote.
So, congratulations to that work that
they've done. Thank you.
>> Have Have you all checked that you're on
the that you're eligible to vote? I
spent some great time fighting with it
one night, but I got it, so it works. I
can vote this week or this year. Further
questions or comments? Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
Thanks worship. Next item relates to the
council staff relations policy. I have a
motion that report CC 1326 relating to
the council staff relations policy be
received for information and further
that council adopt council staff
relations policy GAO4 as presented and
further that a bylaw authorizing the
adoption of council staff relations
policy GA4 be presented to council for
enactment.
Moved by councelor Gibson or sorry
councelor Herbert, seconded by councelor
Taylor.
>> Questions or comments?
Seeing none, all those in favor? Any
opposed? That's carried.
>> Last item under this committee relates
to the St. Thomas Municipal
Accessibility Advisory Committee terms
of reference. I have a motion that
report CC1 1426 relating to the St.
Thomas Municipal Accessibility Advisory
Committee terms of reference be received
for information. And further that
council authorized the preparation of a
bylaw establishing the St. Thomas
Municipal Accessibility Advisory
Committee in accordance with the
Accessibility Frontarians with
Disabilities Act 2005 as amended. No by
councelor Gibson, second by Councelor
Rhyme.
>> Questions or comments?
Seeing none, all those in favor? Any
opposed? Carried
your worship. Unless there are any
further items from this committee from
the members.
Uh council will now reconvene into
regular session. I have a motion that
the recommendations, directions, and
actions of council and committee of the
whole as recorded in the minutes of this
date be confirmed, ratified, and
adopted. Moved by councelor Bowwin Sans,
seconded by councelor Wookie.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
>> Uh, next we move into reports of
committees. Uh, a couple items this
evening. Uh, we have report chief 2026
24 of the police chief to the St. House
police services board relating to the
crime severity index values for 2025. Uh
this is included for the members
information.
>> Councelor Wiki.
>> Thanks your worship. I just like to ask
Chief because he's here just to talk a
little bit about the highlights of of
that and what it means for the citizens
of St. Thomas. Thank you,
>> Chief. Great to have you here tonight.
>> Thank you for having me. Well, good
evening uh council. I'm pleased to be
here this evening to uh to report to you
and provide information on purposes of
the 2025 crime severity index results um
which demonstrates that St. Thomas uh
remains a safe city and that the
strategic investments by the city and
the police services board are producing
measurable results. As you all know,
I've attended here the last three years
as the chief of police to report on the
crime severity index.
Crime severity is separated into three
primary uh measures. Overall crime
severity index, non-violent crime
severity index and the violent crime
severity index. We saw reductions in all
three measures. This is a significant
notation
uh and provides a clear evidence that
the strategic investments made are
producing tangible and measurable public
safety outcomes. Of note, overall crime
severity decreased 6.1% in 2025 and by
10% since 23, while violent crime
severity fell by a significant 17% over
the past year and is averaging a 6%
reduction since 2023.
Notably, we saw homicides decline 50%,
robberies decline 33%, and elicit drug
offenses decline 6%. The nonviolent CSI
held steady at a reduction of2%
representing 12% average reduction since
2023.
I would be remiss not to mention the
very promising results from our
downtown. Social and health related
disorder issues in the downtown core
have been a primary focus of our police
service. As you know, since 2021,
unwanted persons in the downtown core
have decreased by 75%.
Complaints involving drug use, behavior,
or activities in the downtown core have
decreased by 84% since 2021.
These are major reductions, and I
commend the police services board and
the city council for providing the
financial resourcing to provide a safe
city.
This council and the police services
board made deliberate investments over
the last couple of years to address
emerging risks and strengthen
organizational police capacity. These
investments were wise and necessary and
they are working.
What they have done is increased
frontline capacity. They've targeted
intelligenceled enforcement.
They provided a community resource team
which is now comprised of 10 special
constables. Strengthened street crime
and our property crime units.
It has provided the creation of a crime
analysis unit. It has provided a second
police services dog team. It enhanced
forensic identification and digital
forensics capacity and it has uh
provided the strategic deployment of
uniform resources where we need them
most and the creation of a of a of a
deployment uh and deployment of a
critical incident response team.
While these results are encouraging, I
do want to note, and it's important for
me to note, that there are rising
incident volumes this year.
We are at 1,000 incidents over where we
were last time this year. Uh so we're
looking at what is causing the community
to need the police 1,000 more times in
26, more than 25. Is that what growth
looks like? Is this our new normal? uh
and you know we can manage these
incident volumes. It's just the
complexities we have to look at. And
that by complexities I'm referring to
violent and non-violent recidivism,
intimate partner violence, which notably
rose 30% in 2025, community disorder and
calls for service, high-risisk and
prolific offending, investigative and
frontload frontline workload, population
and municipal growth, and member uh and
organizational resilience and wellness.
So, those are the areas we're looking
at. I do want to take this opportunity
to thank council for your continued
prioritization of public safety uh and
for the men and women of the police
service that serve this community every
day. Um the results and the work we're
doing together are working. So subject
to any questions, I I yield back.
>> Okay, Council Herbert on the crime
severity.
>> Thank you, Worship. I don't really have
a question for you. It's just going to
be a couple good positive comments. Uh,
I know when I when I ran for election my
first term, one of the things I had
highlighted was a satellite office
downtown for the police department.
Well, look where we are now. Your
special constables. I'm going to brag
about them. They know everybody on that
street. They take care of everybody and
it gives your officers an opportunity to
do police work around the city and not
be dragged down to Jenny. So, kudos to
you in that. Your key findings. We want
to promote St. Thomas, a safe place to
live. Read this. You know, I mean, it
never going to be perfect, but we're in
the downward stuff and that's great. So, you have a a great staff and team and
so I always get excited. I always follow
these reports along pretty good. So, you
did it. Who if you did the report?
Perfect. You did a great job in putting
it all together, especially the diagrams
and stuff. Very good. Thank you very
much. Appreciate it. [snorts]
>> If I did the report, councelor Herbert,
I I did the report.
>> Yeah.
Further questions or comments? Councelor
Riml,
>> just I I appreciate the report as well
and uh it's one thing, you know, when
you get the funding, it's how to
strategically manage it and to be
flexible and to constantly uh maneuver,
you know, strategies and, you know,
you're looking at um the national rate
is 75. London's up to 65.95.
So, you know, you're you're doing a
tremendous uh tremendous job, a very
progressive um department, and we're
very fortunate in the city.
>> Yeah. Councelor Clark,
>> just wondering about the domest domestic
violence and whether or not that um is
triggered by anything that you're seeing
locally or is it a nationwide trend
after the pandemic or whether it's a
reflection of the economy? and just
wondering why in one year we're seeing
such a change
» through your worship to c to council
counselor Clark. Um it is these
statistics for intimate partner violence
are up nationally. Um so we're looking
at ways that we can address that. We
have received provincial funding to come
up with proactive, not just the reactive
pieces, but the proactive ways to
identify uh problematic family disputes
um uh gender-based
violence before it occurs. Um, if we
have an argument, we now send a social
worker who's embedded in our police
service to the to the residents or if we
make an arrest, we have the social
worker meet with the accused and the
victims so that uh we can we can stop
the cycle of of violence and knock down
this 30% rise. But we are still
analyzing why it's happening, but it is
happening nationally. There will be some
relation to the second order effects to
the pandemic, the government's
responses, all of our responses to uh to
the to the pandemic in terms of
resources. Are they not available any
longer? Um have we closed doors to some some important social resources
that once were there to to prevent this?
We're looking at uh all of that, but uh
the 30% is a real number. Um, and it's
uh it's concerning.
>> Wiki,
>> thanks. Your worship. I have a couple
questions. One comment about what you
just talked about in partner violence.
I'm hoping that part of it is that we as
a society are getting more comfortable
talking about it. So perhaps it is that
more is being reported, you know, that
might not have been reported. And I
don't so I'm not trying to phrase this
as a positive thing but if if people are
more comfortable talking about it and
reporting it you know we are helping to
deal with the problem. Um two questions
and they're both I don't want to get
your blood pressure up chief but I know
these are both hot topics because I've
heard you talk about them many times in
terms of arson and how it fits into the
crime severity index. How does the the whole topic of arson fit into this
um into these into the graphics here?
That's my first one. Thank you,
» Councelor Wookie. Um, the arson would
fit into the nonviolent
um crime severity measure. We've tal
we've spoken about this in the past. Um,
I would submit to you that arson. Um,
they've used they've used fire as the
weapon and it can have devastating
effects. We all know uh the results are
in recently and we put a statement out
on on the sentencing of the individual
that uh dropped the historical building
in our downtown core. Um and that was a
significant
um uh sentence. Keep in mind that
sentence issued in 2025 will have a
direct impact on 26's crime severity for
the nonviolent because crime severity is weighted on the sentences that are
issued in the year that that they occur.
So we will see um the arson sentence of
five years uh for that individual
reflected in 26 is crime severity. again
uh and I didn't get into this but we
can't take the crime severity results uh
alone. They have to be uh looked at on a
whole host of of of things that are
affecting our community public safety.
But they these results coupled with um
other quantitative results are showing
that we have a very safe city and it is
uh it can be attributed to the the uh
the resources the financial resources
that this council has provided me.
>> Next question. Uh, the second one,
reoffenders.
Now, I I'm wondering if there's been
analysis done, not asking for it to be
done, but I'm going to guess your
analytics people can take a look at and
say if you [snorts] know x% of these
serious offenders who are let out on
recgnissance or whatever conditions were
not let out and we can take a look at
the uh crimes they committed when they
were let out, what would the crime
severity index kind of look like for us?
Um, just some general comments. I'm not
asking for that to be done if it's not
been done, but I'm guessing that it
would be a very interesting set of
statistics
if you took a look at who's doing the
offending, you know, because we have a
crime severity index, but it'd be
interesting and take a look at like, you
know, are there eight individuals who
are responsible for 30% of this index,
things like that. So, just a few
comments from that would be uh great I'd
be grateful for that.
>> Great
chief. Certainly um
recetiv recetivism is a is a real thing.
Um we work on the premise that repeated
mistakes or choices. Um and so uh the
federal government as you know just
released um Bill C14 which is an act to
amend um bail. Uh specifically uh I'll
speak to the reverse onus and repeat
violent offending uh failure to failure
to appear um and just um shity uh it's
strengthening uh who becomes a shity and
who doesn't. Um
councelor Wookie uh recidivan has has
been a big issue for for us in in uh
recent years. fail to comply offenses
are committed by a disproportionate few.
Um, and so, uh, we're working to reduce
those those numbers considerably.
In answer to your point about the
reporting up read the gender-based, uh,
gender- based intimate partner violence,
you are correct. We have been advocating
and campaigning publicly about reporting
and trying to reach victims and
survivors of of IPV and gender- based
violence. And I think that that also has
a result, Councelor Clark, as well on
why our numbers nationally have been up.
There's been an enhanced focus na uh
proincially and nationally on on trying
to end that. It's become an epidemic and
we're trying to end that. So the
increased resources put towards that
specific crime complexity
um
results in some u increased numbers in
those areas. So
>> further questions or comments on the
crime severity index. Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
Chief, you have a second report.
>> Thanks. Yeah, another report under
reports of committee report. Chief
202628 of the police chief to the St.
Thomas Police Services Board. This one
relates to tactical readiness vehicles.
As there's a financial component, I do
have a motion ready that council support
the proposed acquisition of two tactical
response vehicles at a cost of 159,900
plus applicable taxes and necessary
transfer costs funded from available
police services development charge
reserves.
Moved by councelor Wilkey, second by
councelor Gibson.
>> Questions or comments? Councelor Rhymel
>> just the um development charge reserve
fund report is a very handy report there
to have so anyway but I I know that you
do
not try you do uh contain any vehicle
costs in your operating which I don't
know how you do it so um this is a seems
to be very reasonable amount and we've
got the you you know you have the
reserve fund and we can't use it for
anything else like we can't take it and
give it to planning so Um, it's there to
be used and this seems like a good uh a
good use of it.
>> Councelor Herbert,
>> thank you. Worship. Well, you know,
Mark, this was my first term board. This
was a discussion at that time with you
and Chris and your worship was on the
board. We'll get this and it just wasn't
in the cards at that time. Uh, your plan
was, I believe, was to contact London if
you needed uh that type of service. But
now, so this is this is great here. I
mean, I'm I'm happily supporting it and
uh I don't know what uh uh when you
finally get them if you're going to be
able to offer your service maybe to
Elmer. I don't know how that works, if
that's a possibility. But my question is
not capital. I mean, your reserve fund,
your worship will remember we had a big
debate about the reserve fund for the
police services board and we ended up
letting you keep your money in police
services board. So, my question is
operational.
Do you have to hire more officers now to man these? You have to train officers
for this special. Do you have to buy
special equipment? Bigger gun? I don't
know. I say bigger guns, but is is that
something that would come out of a
reserve hunt or is that not necessary?
You just have certain you just take two
officers on a shift and put them in the tank and away you go. Is that the
way it works? I'm just not sure. I'm
just wondering if there's any more
operational costs that are going to pop
up here. So, that's my question. Thank
you,
>> Chief.
through your worship worship to
councelor Herbert. Um the police service
has been transitioning from a
containment team that we developed two
years ago to a tactical team in 2027.
What these vehicles will do is they will
provide further readiness. We're not
quite there but we are getting ourselves
there for the arrival of Power Cole
which is a requirement. Um,
in terms of the upscaled uh
qualifications of this team, they are 12
individuals that are highly trained to
deal with very serious violent crisis um
matters. Uh, front line has some of this
training, but not near what these
individual officers have. Uh, yes, it
is. is these vehicles are equipped with
vaults for rifles uh for all of those um
critical incidents that we are
legislated to uh to be ready for and to
provide.
Counc.
>> Thanks, Worship. Uh, typically
police budget items don't come to us.
And so I just wanted clarification on
the the development charge reserve fund
is our fund, right? It's not the part of
the police budget as you described,
Council Herbert.
So, so this is an ask outside of the
budget that we've we've established that
we're asking to be approved tonight.
Just clarification.
>> I think I'd like our treasurer to give
us just a little further explanation on
where this came from.
>> Thank [clears throat] you.
>> Thank you, your worship. That was an
accurate description. Um, we see this as
a a ask extraneous to the budget process
between the police services board and
the city. Um the use of the development
charge uh police police development
charge reserve fund is at the city's
discretion. It's not an area that the
police board could um forcibly transfer
out of. Uh but that being said, we did
encourage the chief to come to the
meeting tonight. We're supportive of the
request and ultimately these DC funds
were set aside for the purposes of what
is being proposed uh through his report.
So we are supportive of uh him coming
here tonight and um approval of the
request.
Okay.
Right. I just um
we had a a large increase in our in our
budget this year driven by the fact that
the province didn't give the police the
grants that they typically get and now
bec now we're uh transitioning from
um to a tactical unit. Is there
is is is all this on the taxpayers's
back or does the province when you move
from a containment unit to a tactical
unit is there new provincial dollars
that we didn't get recently that could
be applied to this situation
» councelor clerk we're always looking for
ways to offset uh expenses through
provincial revenues um I don't know of
any stream that would offset that uh
this this fits into the community safety
and policing act. It's a regulation that
if the the city needs a tactical unit,
they are uh financially uh responsible
to to operationally fund that. Um and so
again, this is as a result of growth uh
where we're going with crime severity um
uh with the arrival of Power Co. There's
a number of reasons why we need to move
ourselves to a tactical response team
that is working. We reported out in the
annual annual report in June. We have um
involved this team 94% more than we did
in uh 2025.
We didn't have a team in uh completely
formed in 2024. So, it's relatively a
new team. Uh there are operational
expenses that we've been chipping away
at trying to get there over about a
three-year period for the arrival of
Power Co next September. And this team
is required uh as a level two legislated
team. Um and it it does fit the growth.
It is a requirement of growth. Hope that
answers your question.
Further questions?
Thanks, Chief. Um, there was a motion on
the floor. So, I'll say all in favor.
Any opposed? Carried. Chief, thank you
for coming, sharing with us on both of
those topics tonight.
>> Thanks, worship. We'll now move into
communications. First item relates to
the fetal alcohol spectrums disorder
awareness. Uh, it's a September 9th,
2026 proclamation, jumbo lighting, and
bell ringing. I have a motion that the
council of the city of St. Thomas
proclaimed September 9th, 2026 as fetal
alcohol spectrum disorder awareness day
in the city of St. Thomas. And further
that the jumbo monument be lit in red
from September 5th to 9th, 2026. And
further that the bells at city hall be
rung nine times at 9:09 a.m. on
September 9th, 2026.
Moved by councelor Kohler, seconded by
councelor Herbert.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
Next item relates to the international
day for the eradication of poverty,
October 17th, 2026 proclamation and
plague raising. I have a motion that the
council of the city of St. Thomas
proclaim October 17th, 2026 as
international day for the eradication of
poverty in the city of St. Thomas. And
further that the coalition to end
poverty flag be flown on October 17th,
2026.
By councelor Bobin Sand, seconded by
councelor Gibson.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
Next item relates to Ontario Public
Library Week October 18th to 24th, 2026
proclamation and flag raising. I have a
motion that the council of the city of
St. Thomas proclaim October 18th to
24th, 2026 as Ontario Public Library
week in the city of St. Thomas and
further that the green libraries for
life flag be flown for the week. Moved
by councelor Riml, seconded by councelor
Gibson.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
Next item relates to the foster family
appreciation week October 19th to 25th
2026 proclamation flag raising. I have a
motion that council of the city of St.
Thomas proclaim October 19th to 25th
2026 as foster family appreciation week
in the city of St. Thomas and further
that the family and children services
flag be flown for the week. Moved by
councelor Taylor, seconded by councelor
Clark.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
Uh, next item relates to a request to
permit the keeping of backyard hens. A
letter has been received from Daniel
Zeniga, 26 Welch Court regarding the
keeping of backyard hens in the city.
Uh, as noted on council's agenda, a
motion was lost to permit the keeping of
backyard hens in 2025. Should council
wish to change that direction, a motion
to reconsider would be required.
>> Councelor Kohler,
>> thanks your worship. I I thought that
report actually had something in it that
they would
keep monitoring this and then report
back later because I know that most of
council had a serious um concerns with I
think aviation like the bird bird bird
flu at that time and they were looking
at different ways for for doing that. So
I wasn't sure if that was built into
that but um
>> obviously
>> still require a rec reconsideration
vote.
>> Okay. So I guess that's where I was
mistaken. I thought it was just left on
there that it was uh put for further
review, but okay. So, I guess um we'll
let that individual know that that has
to take place prior to that, but okay.
>> Thanks, Worship. Uh we already dealt
with the Emily Field Grandstand. So,
next item under communications, the
Catfish Creek Conservation Authority
2027 draft budget and municipal levy
aortionment. A letter has been received
from Dusty Underh Hill, general manager,
secretary treasurer for the Catfish
Creek Conservation Authority regarding
the authority's 2027 draft budget and
municipal levy uh portionment.
That's for council's information. Uh
next item relates to the Eastern Lake
Erie Regional Conservation Authority
amalgamation. A joint statement has been
received from Morgan Griffin, chair
Catfish Creek Conservation Authority,
John Chalinor, II, chair, Grand River
Conservation Authority, Todd Noble,
chair, Kettle Creek Conservation
Authority, and Doug Brunton, chair
Longpoint Region Conservation Authority,
regarding the appointment of Samantha
Lawson as project executive to chair the
regional transition committee and
inaugural CEO for the Eastern Lake Erie
Regional Conservation Authority. again
for council information. Next item
relates to the Ontario Provincial
Conservation Agency Regional Transition
Committees. A letter has been received
from Hassan Basset, CEO, Ontario
Provincial Conservation Agency,
regarding members appointed to
transition committees to support the
implementation of regional conservation
authority consolidation.
And the last item on the agenda under
communications from the Obudsman Ontario
uh relating to the 2025 annual report. A
letter has been received from Barbara
Finlay, acting OMBbudsman of Ontario
regarding the 2025 2026 annual report.
The report is available electronically
on the OMBbudsman's website.
Uh unless there are any items under
communications or unfinished business or
new business of council.
>> Council Herbert. Thank you, worship. Uh,
I'm glad the fire chief is in attendance
tonight because I have a question for
him. If you notice in the paper a few
weeks ago, there was a big fire in
Strathroy and when the fire department
got there, it was magnesium on fire and
I don't know uh if they had they had to
get some special
stuff to put on it. I don't know if they
had it on and I don't know is it
dangerous for the firefighters to to
come on a site with magnesium. And the
third part, do we have magnesium in the
city? So those three questions for you
there, Mr. Gregory. Thank you,
>> Chief. How's your magnesium knowledge?
>> Your worship is great.
>> All right. So you your worship to
councelor Herbert. So a great question.
Um I read about that and I saw some of
the um media stuff over that. Yes, we
have magnesium in the city. Um, a lot of
the, uh, shops that do, um, tool and die
work and, uh, specialty shops like that,
they do carry magnesium. We are prepared
for any of those fires. Um, we carry a
special extinguisher on our trucks
that's designed just for that. You can't
put water on it. Water intensifies
magnesium fires. Um, it just creates
heat. Magnesium fires burn around
anywhere between 3,000 and 5,000
degrees. it is dangerous to the
firefighters but during initial um you
know indications through alarms and
whatever and I think through the
building code and the fire code if
anybody has magnesium in there is they
have to put in specialty systems that
are integrated into their sprinkler
systems or whatever they have it would
be a chemical uh area where it's stored.
Um and also one of the other things if
you don't have enough uh agent applied
you can put sand on it and we carry
abundant amount of sand will put it out
too. So it's a matter of smothering the magnesium to put it out and we have
that all day long and our training
officers here too. So that's some of the
thing that uh we train our firefighters
in different aspects to mitigate.
>> Great council Riml say Chief Gregor just
stay there.
So when you're talking about uh um
Stroth anyway I have a fire question.
And I just wondered if you could give an
update on the vacant um building um
registry that we're going to do. Just,
you know, there was a house that blew up
in London. You know, it was vacant and I
just wondered where we are in that
process because that's a concern. And
just another piece of that, do we need
some type of listing of new businesses
because um I don't think we have a not
to have a building permit or whatever,
but just some listing that uh fire
police, everyone's aware that here's
this new building and maybe they're
holding propane tanks, maybe it's full
of magnesium, who knows? But and then we
could also give them a little welcome
wagon, you know, with uh stuff about the
city. But just as two pieces, do we need
a a listing of building and where are we
at with the vacant uh building
>> through your worship to council Raml? So
Kim and I uh fire prevention officer
Destin and I are working uh towards
that. We have to set up a meeting with
uh Lou and his team to put it all
together. We don't like and like we said
before uh we don't want to do this, you
know, piece it together. We want to make
this spectacular. Uh there's some other
ones out there. uh other municipalities
have reached out to us and said you know
great idea how can we you know look at
this and what can we do to help you so
this will be big um the second part of
your question as uh indication of new
businesses I know our fire prevention
team meets with new businesses go in and
uh say it's a restaurant or whatever it
is they go through the fire safety plans
they look what they have they uh
register they're in our crisis system at
work uh through our dispatch u they have
a list of the owners, what the contents
are, and what their fire safety plans
are, too. So, anything that's new, our
fire prevention team go into those
buildings, check out those buildings,
and do all the means of egress, whether
they have the right amount of uh
extinguishers, lighting, and all those
processes are done before that they're given access to open as a a new
building.
>> Just just a qu So, do we have a formal
listing where where new businesses
register somewhere? like how do you know
that a new business has has come to the
city?
>> So they reach out to usually through I
think it's through planning that we get
it and other departments that we get an
idea that something. So if somebody's
building a new restaurant, they have to
go through us. So we'll get a building
permit. It'll come to us first and
building permit and then we do the
followup of of stuff like that.
>> Okay. So it just might be a thought if
we know that new businesses are coming
just is that a way we could communicate
things you know a little package about
the city is you know things to help them
with their their you know planning
around the city. But anyway thank you
very much. I just
>> back to the old days like welcome wagon
where we used to get a little basket.
>> Yeah we're just worried about that
building blowing up you know.
>> Thank you.
>> Great. Other new business or unfinished
business questions? It's been a very
busy summer for a lot of people in our
community, but um looking forward to the
rest of August and into Labor Day before
we're back together as a team. So,
perfect. Councelor Herbert, I'm just I'd
like to thank the our customer service
department there. I've had three people
call me and I've said I'll forward me
the information. I'll send it on to
customer service. That's what's
happened. Two of the people got back to
me and said that they had a response
from customer server who with a detailed
thing. I thought that was pretty
impressive. So anyway, thank you to the
customer service.
>> It is the right route and I I hear from
almost all of the council now that
that's the referral. So it's perfect and
lots of good result because of it.
Nothing else under unfinished or new.
Moving on.
>> Thanks worship. No public notices or
notice uh no public notices this
evening. We do have a notice of motion
previously from councelor Baldwin Sans.
I have a motion that's moved by
councelor Baldwin Sans. Whereas the city
of St. Thomas is positioned to
experience and capitalize on significant
regional growth. And whereas the city
provides a breadth of services to its
growing community including parks and
recreation. And whereas at its March
9th, 2026 regular meeting, council
received report PR726 from the director
of parks and recreation relating to the
community and aquatic center feasibility
study final report. And whereas report
PR726
noted in part that the appended
consultant report does not provide the
depth of analysis that staff would
regard as sufficient to support
implementation at this stage. and
further that until a broader growth
related financial framework is
established, staff are not in a position
to appropriately assess the financial
feasibility of the proposed aquatics
center. And whereas council passed the
resolution associated with report pro
726 that council shall have the ability
to provide direction on further action
relating to the study. And whereas the
town of Axbridge has proceeded with a
similar project and associated
guidelines that appear to align with the
intent of a future city related
community and aquatic center project.
Now therefore, be it resolved that staff
be directed to investigate and report
back on alternatives to the community
and aquatic center project that consider
and integrate where possible the
formulas, methodology, and objectives
associated with Bridg's project
approach. Again, I have move as
councelor Baldwin Sans seconded by
councelor Gibson.
>> Questions or comments? Councelor Riml
then councelor Baldwin Sands, it's
yours. I'll let you go first and then
I'll go to councelor Raml.
>> Thank you. Just to add a little more
context is that what Oxbridge is in
currently building and the process is 13
months rather than years away is an
eight lane 25 meter pool with a full
community center which is three gyms and
in one of the gyms is also a performance
stage. All of that is being done
underneath an umbrella of $16 million
and those are current numbers and they
received 50% provincial funding in order
to move this forward. So the community
of Axbridge is a population of just over
22,000
and they are putting this program
together and it is um to be completed
very very soon. So that is what I'm
hoping for today and I am grateful that
someone seconded that we do develop more
of the framework rather than that what
was in the consultant report about 6
months ago and have the city investigate
freely this type of option and bring a
full community center to this community.
» Councelor Riml questions or comments? I
just had a comment that um the expert
just the concern that the actual pool is
not built yet. It hasn't, you know, I
know it's in the process. They've
started some site preparation, but it
hasn't been built and it hasn't been
tested as far as how is the dome uh
going to work with the humidity because
humidity and pools are a big uh issue
and especially with the uh cold weather.
So, it's just a concern that to try and
um
investigate a project that hasn't
actually been established is a concern.
I think the question and during my
investigation of this and attending
several workshops on what was available
uh over the last few months is that
there is a 25year warranty that comes
available with this type of program and
there is uh extended warranties that are
also available. So, there is a 25-year
warranty on the that dome. And when it
comes to what it can accommodate,
usually a lifespan of a pool of this
sort is about 25 years, but you do hope
that there is a longer lifespan for it
as some pools have been in existence for
longer. But I do appreciate the question
because yes, there um that is something
that people do bring up, but it comes
with a very extensive warranty. And
that's why I want the city to
investigate, city staff to investigate
and bring a report back.
>> If if I can just ask that of you're
asking our parks and recck department to
do this research. Is that what the
motion reads? Okay. Councelor Wiki.
>> Thanks, your worship. Um I'm okay with this certainly happening,
but for me it's a it's a matter of staff
capacity. And then I have one other
comment. So, if this is like I guess I
mean there's lots of councelor Balden
Sans says has an amount of information
available and if this is a a say I'm and
I'm just I don't have any idea like if
this is a 20-hour project for staff
that's one thing. If it's a 100 hour
project for staff that's a whole other
thing. So, if this can be done in a a
reasonable amount of time, um I'd be
pleased to hear from this because the
challenge is like and I and councelor
Baldin stands and I talked about this is
not a secret like um if we had the
sprung and mirth of people come here,
it's not it's less information. It's
informationational but it's an
infomercial. If we have our staff doing
it, I think we're getting a more of a
third party look at this, which I'm all
in favor of. Right. Um, so I guess that
is um I've satisfied my second part
about the it not being an infomercial
and I just I'm looking for information
uh perhaps from um the parks director in
how much time she thinks something like
this would take to do properly for us.
Thank you.
>> Go ahead. But I'm going to go to the to
the people are going to have to do the
work. So go ahead.
>> Absolutely. there is templates that are
there and that's one of the things that
I have done with the XBridge project and
what I've been looking at um the best
way to describe it is it's a program in
a box so here it is here it is this is
what you need this is what you have to
do etc all of the materials are provided
has just gone through it the Oxbridge
staff have just gone through it the city
council has just gone through it and the
local MPP was very actively involved as
well. So, all of the pieces are there.
is I understand that there is no
um
hiccups that could happen with having to
use something else that is already there
because those templates do exist and
they're ready to go. And I thank
Oxbridge if we can able to do this. And
then I actually do want to hear from the
staff how long they think this um
investigation would last. Thank you.
>> Okay. I have a couple of questions. If
you don't, can I jump in, Gary? Cuz
first off,
Oxbridge is under construction, so we
certainly could get them from them, and
we certainly probably have friends we
could probably do that with, but we're
talking about a a structure that I don't
need to see a new one. I need to see a
25-year-old one. Who's got one? The
motion only asks us to go look at a new
one under construction.
Do you know where else Sprung has built
say in the last 10, 15 or 20 years that
we could go ask them how is it holding
up? How did it do? How do how were they
to work with? Because I don't want to
expand your motion, but I don't want to
make I'm not sure going and looking at
another brand new project gives us much.
But go ahead.
>> It is a very good question and I
appreciate it. There has been some
others that have been done and one of
the things that I have been
investigating is one particular one that
was put in a few years ago was not
maintained properly during the COVID
years. You uh drain the pool. If you
have a backyard pool, you don't drain
your pool unless you're going to
completely replace the liner. Um, I've
been working on pools for especially
backyard pools for a very long time and
do appreciate that there is some
questions that need to be investigated
by staff and I strongly support staff to
do that type of investigation, but I do
have a strong feeling that it's going to
come back in a very positive manner.
>> Super
Adrian [laughter]
and then I'll go back to you council
clerk. Thank you, your worship. Uh
through to council, we'll do our best to
bring back a report that is, you know,
sourced from consultants and um I do
know of another municipality that has
used this product so we can reach out to
them as well um and and make sure that
we're cognizant of time. So just
bringing back some facts um for council
to decide if that's a further
exploration that we want to do
>> to look into that product.
>> Mr. Mr. Baldin sense I'm considering
this an addition to the pool report we
already have the community center report
we already have. You want this as an
addendum to it or an addition to it
>> as an addition because that's what we
want to see is not just the expansion of
what we were given in that report. the
framework that we were given was not
enough to include this type of
investigation and to have those pieces
to investigate I think will be to
benefit not just to the department but
to the citizens of this community.
>> Yeah. So what I just suggested that's
what you're thinking too. Okay.
Councelor Clark you had a question.
>> Thanks. Yeah, Mike, you have raised the
my issue was the looking at not just
Oxbridge, but I'm sure the company has
dealt with other other municipalities in
Ontario with our weather and our u
similar factors and so I'd like to hear
from some of those as well. Thank you.
>> Go ahead.
>> I do [clears throat] understand that
there are two other municipalities that
are currently doing the same Oxford
project as part of theirs and they're
very quick and they are also almost to
completion as well. Yeah, but but again,
as I suggested, I'm not looking for one
that's happening right now, brand new.
I'd like to know what it looks like 10
years down the road or 15 years down the
road because I understand what they're
saying to us. So, let's uh let's let uh
you have a fairly good indication of the
direction you're being given if this
motion was to pass. Okay. Further
questions or comments on the motion?
Seeing none, all those in favor?
Passes. carries. Great. Did Did I'm
sorry, Lori. Sorry. [snorts] Councelor
Baldwin says, did we have a a kind of
requested back date in your motion
as soon as possible or by certain dates?
>> I believe that would be up to staff, but
we would want to see it during this term
of council.
>> Yep. Okay. Perfect.
» Thanks, your worship. At this time,
there is a need to go into close
session. I have a motion that this
meeting be closed to deal with proposed
or pending acquisition of land queso
corridor. A proposed or pending
disposition of land, sale of land,
Yarmouth Yards. A position, plan,
procedure, criteria, or instruction to
be applied to any negotiations carried
on or to be carried on by or on behalf
of the municipality, municipal facility
planning, and a trade secret or
scientific, technical, commercial,
financial, or labor relations
information supplied in confidence to
the municipality or local board, which
if disclosed could reasonably be
expected to prejudice significantly the
competitive position or interfere
significantly with the contractual or
other negotiations of a person, group of
persons, or organization relating to
Southwestern Public Health at 7:38 p.m.
>> Questions or comments? Um, no, we need a
>> Sorry, I get a mover. Move by move by
councelor Herbert, seconded by councelor
Riml.
>> Okay, for all of you here before I call
the vote, I'll let you know we're going
to go into close session. when we rise
from close session to come back, we'll
vote on
um certainly the bylaws from today's
meeting and anything that might come out
of the close session meeting. So, I want
to thank all of those that joined us
tonight in the gallery and for all of
you following us at home uh for a fairly
long, but it's a one one month meeting
or one meeting month. So, uh all those
in favor of going to close. Any opposed?
That's carried. See you in a bit.
Uh, at this time I have a motion to rise
from close session. So I have a motion
that council now rise from close session
at
time here sorry 9:08 p.m. And further
that staff proceed as directed on the
close session items dealing with the
queso corridor sale of land Yarmouth
yards municipal facility planning and
southwestern public health. Moved by
councelor Herbert.
Seconded by councelor Taylor. Questions
or comments? Seeing none. All in favor?
We're rising.
Thank you worship. We'll now move into
bylaws. I have a motion that lead be
granted to bring in the bylaws. Moved by
councelor Baldwin Sans.
Second by councelor Herbert.
>> Questions or comments? Hearing none. All
in favor? Any opposed? Carried.
>> I have a motion moved by councelor
Bobman, second by councelor Herbert that
the bylaws be now read a first time,
referred to council and committee the
whole and read a second time.
>> Questions or comments?
Hearing none. All those in favor? Any
opposed? Carried.
>> Okay. First bylaw.
>> First by this even this evening is a
ballot to confirm the proceedings of the
council meeting held on the 10th day of
August 2026.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? Next bylaw.
>> Sorry. Second bylaw is a bylaw to
temporarily remove certain lands from
partlock control. This relates to block
38 on registered plan 11m274
of the McGregor farm phase 2A.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's passed. Next by
>> third bylaw is a bylaw to appoint a
property standards uh bylaw officer and
noise control officer. Uh and this
individual is Shira Wiggins.
>> Questions or comments?
>> Yes.
>> Sorry. Are these full-time positions or
part-time?
two new staff or
>> uh through your worship to council. This
is a full-time property standards
officer position.
>> Any other questions or comments? Seeing
none, all in favor? That's passed. Next
bylaw.
>> Next by a bylaw to adopt official plan
amendment number 118 to the city of St.
Thomas official plan. This is to permit
clinic, business office, and residential
uses at four Morrison Drive and 358 Elm
Street relating to file number 30226.
Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's pass.
>> Fifth bylaw is a bylaw to amend bylaw
50-88 being the zoning bylaw for the
city of St. Thomas. This is to permit
clinic, business office, and residential
uses at For Morrison Drive and 358 Elm
Street relating to file number 2-08-26.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's passed. Next,
>> six bylaws. a billet authorized the
submission of an application to Ontario
Infrastructure and Lands Corporation for
financing of certain capital works of
the corporation of the city of St.
Thomas and authorized the long-term
borrowing for such capital costs uh
through the issue of debentures to
Ontario Infrastructure and Lands
Corporation.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's passed. Next,
>> the seventh bylaw is a bylaw to
authorize the mayor and clerk to execute
and fix the seal of the corporation to a
certain agreement between the
corporation of the city of St. Thomas
and the trustees of the Central
Congregation of the United Church of
Canada. This relates to the affordable
housing grant program at 135 Wellington
Street.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's passed. Next.
>> Eighth bylaw is a ballot to authorize
the mayor and clerk to execute and fix
the seal of the corporation to a certain
agreement between the corporation of the
city of St. Thomas and the YW.CA St.
Thomas Elgen. This relates to the
affordable housing grant program for 53
Hayawa Street.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's passed. Next.
>> Ninth bylaw is a bylaw authorized the
mayor and clerk to execute and fix the
seal of the corporation to a certain
agreement between the corporation of the
city of St. Thomas and Eastwood Housing
Corporation. This relates to the
affordable housing grant program at 200
Burwell Road.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's passed.
>> 10th bylaw is a bylaw to establish the
St. Thomas Municipal Accessibility
Advisory Committee.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's passed. Next
>> and the 11th and final bylaw is a bylaw
to authorize the adoption of a council
staff relations policy policy GAO4.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
in favor? That's passed. I rise and
report the successful passing of 11
bylaws.
>> Your worship, I have a motion that the
report of council and committee of the
whole on the following bylaws be
received and adopted. The same be read a
third time and grow signed by the mayor
and clerk, sealed and numbered. It's
been moved by councelor Baldwin Sand,
seconded by councelor Herbert.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? That's
carried.
>> And finally, I have a motion for
adjournment that we do now adjourn at
9:13 p.m. Moved by councelor Kohler,
seconded by councelor Baldwin Sans.
>> Questions or comments? Seeing none, all
those in favor? Any opposed? That's
carried.