[0:12] I will call this meeting to order. This is the regularly scheduled meeting,
[0:16] City Commission, City of Altamonte Springs for August 18th,
[0:20] 2026. If you all would please rise for a
[0:23] moment of silence, followed by the pledge.
[0:36] Thank you.
[0:37] I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of
[0:41] America, and to the republic for which it stands, one
[0:44] nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and
[0:48] justice for all.
[0:51] Thank you.
[0:53] If
[0:54] anyone wants to speak tonight and didn't fill out a speaker card, if you would
[0:59] please go do that,
[1:01] because that's how we're going to greet everybody this evening and
[1:05] let you speak.
[1:07] And for three minutes please. That will be the time.
[1:11] All right. Commissioners, we have approval
[1:15] of the minutes from our review meeting of June
[1:19] 24th, 2026, and the regular meeting of
[1:23] July 7th, 2026.
[1:26] I move that we approve the minutes from June 24th and
[1:30] July 7th.
[1:31] Second.
[1:32] We have a motion and a second. All those in favor indicate by saying aye.
[1:36] Aye.
[1:37] Opposed, like sign. Passes unanimously.
[1:40] Item three is informal communication from the floor on
[1:44] any item that is not a public hearing.
[1:48] So I am going to read
[1:52] Denver.
[1:57] And again, we're doing three minutes so we can all get to
[2:01] speak.
[2:02] Can I go here?
[2:03] Yes, sir.
[2:07] You can state your name.
[2:09] Yes, and please state your name and your address for the-
[2:13] I will not give my address, but I will give... My name is Denver.
[2:15] I will not surrender my Fourth Amendment right.
[2:18] I'm here to address you about the flock cameras.
[2:23] You guys have put so many...
[2:25] Is that the clock there?
[2:26] Yes.
[2:26] Yeah.
[2:27] Okay. There's nothing on it, so I want to be honest and-
[2:32] I could lie. There we go.
[2:34] Cool. Thank you. You guys have put so many flock cameras going up around the city
[2:38] that my little girl is scared to go places.
[2:40] She's learned how to point them cameras out.
[2:41] And not just Flock, there are other brand names.
[2:43] You guys, right here on Central, we went from seven cameras, we're now up
[2:47] to 19 that I can count. They're hidden in lights, they're hidden on poles,
[2:52] they're hidden all over the place. It's gotten to the point it's a game.
[2:55] They don't just read license plates. I don't know if you know that or not.
[2:58] They're actually tracking Bluetooth.
[2:59] They're actually looking into your car, straightening down, taking your picture.
[3:03] They've documented your car, the audio, video.
[3:05] They're surveilling you completely, 100%.
[3:07] I don't know if you guys know this or not.
[3:10] It is an invasion of privacy. The Supreme Court just ruled that by Google
[3:13] had a court case where they said 30 days of surveillance is too aggressive and too
[3:17] much. I can't go anywhere in Altamonte.
[3:19] I can't go anywhere from here to here without worrying about it, and my little girl
[3:23] hates it. Every car I get in, my oldest daughter, it's ridiculous.
[3:26] It is way too many vehicles, and I don't remember
[3:30] hearing saying we're going to put them up. Literally, they were here.
[3:32] The next day, they were here, here. It's all over the place.
[3:35] I can't even go to
[3:37] the city of Altamonte, right there at the
[3:39] my brain, Crane's Roost, without being seen.
[3:41] You can't get in and out without being seen.
[3:43] Now they got them with cameras at the park.
[3:46] My little girl doesn't want to go to the park. I'm afraid to go to the gun range.
[3:49] I'm afraid to go do this. I'm afraid to go do that. No, excuse me.
[3:51] Wrong word, afraid. I hate the fact that I'm being tracked everywhere I go.
[3:56] I disagree with it. You guys,
[3:58] when did we take the vote on it? When did we vote this in?
[4:02] I don't remember anything. Can you guys tell me that?
[4:05] The other problem I have is that your officers
[4:08] have violated rights on me and a few other folks, and I disagree with what's going
[4:11] on. My Fourth Amendment rights was violated because they believed a repo driver
[4:15] over me, and I was defending my life.
[4:17] And your cops put me in jail in handcuffs, read me my Fourth Amendment right,
[4:21] and
[4:22] basically arrested me for defending myself.
[4:26] And most of your cops do not know what the First Amendment is, the Fourth
[4:29] Amendment, the Second Amendment, or even the Fifth Amendment is.
[4:31] We need to get these officers better educated.
[4:34] But my main concern is definitely these flocks. We have too many here.
[4:38] We need to remove these or do something about this.
[4:41] Oviedo just voted some of them down.
[4:42] Other cities because I don't want to see the drones come here like we have in
[4:46] Orlando. Why? So I don't know who does what, what's that saying?
[4:50] I'm still learning, you guys, but please, folks, let's get these flock cameras out
[4:53] of here. They're not for our safety. They're not at all.
[4:57] The Supreme Court has ruled you cannot violate this constant
[5:01] surveillance. So thank you for your time. Y'all have a great night.
[5:04] Thank you, sir.
[5:12] Jessica Lynch.
[5:30] Thank you.
[5:31] You're welcome.
[5:34] Hello.
[5:35] You asked for my name, Jessica Lynch.
[5:37] My address is 603 Newport Avenue. I own my home with
[5:41] my husband. I also live with my daughter, Phoebe, who is five.
[5:45] I'm here today to speak with you all about the very upsetting news that the
[5:49] library is up for closure due to budgetary constraints.
[5:54] Two years ago, you all were the people I spoke with last time
[5:58] about keeping this library open.
[6:00] It wasn't just me, it was many, many citizens of this city who came out
[6:04] to speak in favor of keeping our library open.
[6:06] So much so that we
[6:08] encouraged you all to vote on our behalf to raise our taxes.
[6:13] And with that said, that two years later, we've run out of money, while we're here
[6:17] discussing other expenditure items that the people do not
[6:21] seem in favor of, seems pretty crazy to me.
[6:25] The library is a community resource that is good for children, it's good for
[6:29] people of all ages.
[6:31] In tough times, libraries are places where people can still get access to
[6:35] books. They can apply for jobs on computers.
[6:37] There are ESOL programs. There are citizenship programs that are available
[6:41] there. There are so many amazing community resources that are happening at that
[6:45] library, and it really, truly deserves to be saved.
[6:50] As a commission, you work for us people.
[6:52] I hope that you all will listen to us again this time and vote down any
[6:56] budget that would not include the library.
[6:59] I also hope
[7:01] that you will consider, please,
[7:05] continuing to invest in this library.
[7:06] It's a great community resource again, and it's just
[7:10] so, so devastating that I'm back here to try to save this only two years
[7:14] later. Like, where did those funds go, if not to the program
[7:18] that we came out to raise those taxes for?
[7:21] So, I, at this time, would ask that you send the budget
[7:25] commission back at it. Have them look at this before it comes up for a vote in a
[7:29] couple of weeks. Thank you.
[7:31] Thank you.
[7:38] All right, Gwen Guthrie.
[7:52] Good evening, everyone. I'm going to go back to the flock camera
[7:56] issue.
[7:57] I understand why technology that helps law enforcement solve crimes is
[8:01] appealing. We all want our communities to be safe.
[8:05] But every expansion of government surveillance deserves careful
[8:08] scrutiny. George Orwell wrote "1984" as a warning and
[8:12] not an instruction manual. And the movie "Minority Report" gave us
[8:15] another warning. What happens when we move away from investigating
[8:19] people suspected of crimes and towards watching everyone because
[8:23] someone might commit one?
[8:25] Obviously, we're not living in a science fiction movie, but the principles
[8:29] matter.
[8:30] There's an important difference between using technology to investigate a specific
[8:34] crime and collecting information about ordinary people first,
[8:38] then deciding later whose movements are worth investigating.
[8:42] That's what concerns me about the automated license plate readers.
[8:46] The vast majority of people whose plates are captured aren't suspected of
[8:50] committing a crime. They're going to work, they're taking their kids to
[8:54] school, or going to dinner, or just driving through town.
[8:58] And Altamonte Springs isn't alone in wrestling with this issue.
[9:02] Like mentioned earlier, the city of Oviedo met last night to
[9:05] discuss their own license plate reader program, and whether it should be
[9:09] eliminated. They'll soon vote on whether or not to eliminate the program.
[9:14] The question isn't simply, does this technology help law
[9:18] enforcement? I'm sure that it does.
[9:20] The harder question is, how much surveillance of innocent people are we
[9:24] willing to accept in exchange for that benefit?
[9:27] And what safeguards exist to make sure today's reasonable use
[9:31] doesn't become tomorrow's abuse?
[9:34] The Fourth Amendment exists precisely because government power needs
[9:38] boundaries. Privacy isn't something we should have to earn by
[9:41] proving we have nothing to hide.
[9:44] Technology changes, but our principles shouldn't.
[9:47] Freedom is rarely lost all at once.
[9:50] It disappears one reasonable exception at a time.
[9:53] Thank you.
[10:03] Audrey, I am going to try your last
[10:07] name, and I apologize ahead of time.
[10:12] Verowetwatana.
[10:15] Is that anywhere close?
[10:18] It's close.
[10:19] Thank you.
[10:22] I appreciate that.
[10:28] And again, we need your name and your address, please.
[10:31] I'm Audrey Verowetwat, and I live at
[10:35] 529 Fernwood Drive.
[10:37] Thank you.
[10:39] Good evening, Madam Mayor and Commissioners.
[10:43] I'm Audrey Verowetwat. Did you remember me?
[10:46] I was here two years ago, right here, speaking for the library
[10:50] to be saved. And today, I am back
[10:54] doing the same thing I've been doing last time.
[10:58] The library should be saved because it is very important.
[11:02] I know how important it is because I've been there since I was a baby.
[11:07] I'm still borrowing books every week.
[11:10] I cannot believe that this is happening again.
[11:14] The library is important because it helps people of all ages.
[11:18] It provides free resources, computers, and books.
[11:22] It helps kids by providing story times, reading programs, and
[11:26] summer reading to encourage kids to read and learn.
[11:31] It helps teens by providing a quiet place for them to work
[11:35] and help them meet new people and interact in their environment.
[11:39] It helps adults by providing computers so they can research some
[11:43] jobs and apply for it there.
[11:46] Libraries are important in many ways.
[11:49] This library should remain right here where it is now.
[11:53] So before you think of closing the library, think about all the
[11:57] perspectives of people living in this city.
[12:00] Think about who will be affected by this action.
[12:04] All of the kids, teens, adults, senior
[12:08] citizens, those in need, people who live here, and the
[12:12] librarians.
[12:13] The library will close
[12:17] if people want it to, but it will
[12:21] affect all the people that use the
[12:24] library.
[12:26] People need libraries. Libraries belong in everyone's
[12:30] life. Without libraries, people won't be connected
[12:34] with other people in the city. Do you know that advanced cities
[12:38] have libraries? Cities that don't have one want
[12:42] one. Altamonte Springs is one of the many cities that
[12:46] have one. The majority of the cities don't have one.
[12:51] Why do you want to close this precious library that everyone depends
[12:55] on?
[12:56] People like this library. Like I said before, this
[13:00] library is important to our city, to our everyday lives,
[13:04] to us. Please keep this library. Thank you very much.
[13:09] Thank you.
[13:16] My dad also printed out these for you guys to read before you guys
[13:20] vote.
[13:23] Thank you.
[13:25] All right.
[13:28] I think it's
[13:30] Dominic Fitz.
[13:41] Hello. My name is Dominic Fitz, zip code 32746 for the record.
[13:46] I'm here today to call for the immediate removal of all flock cameras and any other
[13:50] ALPR cameras in Altamonte Springs on grounds that they are in extreme
[13:53] violation of the Fourth Amendment.
[13:55] That amendment being the right of the people to secure their persons, houses,
[13:58] papers, and effects against unreasonable searches and seizures shall not be
[14:02] violated, and no warrants shall issue but upon probable cause supported
[14:06] by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched and
[14:10] the persons or things to be seized.
[14:13] According to the ACLU, less than 1% of license plates that are scanned are
[14:17] actually connected to any crime or wrongdoing.
[14:19] Flock cameras are not just license plate readers.
[14:21] They have AI algorithms that track the make, model, and color of your car.
[14:25] They track any bumper stickers, scratches, dents, and the time you drove by the
[14:29] flock camera. This information is then stored in their database with little
[14:32] regulation on how it can be used or who it can be shared with.
[14:35] According to the Institute of Justice, multiple police departments have been caught
[14:38] with officers using information from flock cameras to stalk exes, current
[14:42] romantic partners, and even just people on the street they find slightly
[14:45] interesting. Flock cameras are not just like my cell phone or
[14:49] any other electronic thing that people claim track me on a daily basis.
[14:53] They're unconstitutional checkpoints that store my data and your data and
[14:57] share it with anyone at their will with no warrant.
[15:01] Every time I watch the news, I'm constantly hearing them talk about how horrible a
[15:04] surveillance state is when it comes to other nations.
[15:07] But here I am living in a surveillance state right here in the United States of
[15:09] America. I have flock cameras down every street I drive.
[15:12] They're at the Lowe's when I'm trying to buy fertilizer.
[15:15] They're at the park when I'm trying to go for a run.
[15:16] They're outside Publix when I'm trying to buy eggs.
[15:18] They're a severe breach of privacy and my rights as an American citizen, and all
[15:22] ALPR cameras need to get the flock out of Altamonte Springs and everywhere else in
[15:26] this nation. Thank you.
[15:36] Justin Harvey.
[15:39] Justin Harvey?
[15:45] My name is Justin Harvey. I'm at 999 Douglas Ave.
[15:48] I'm also here to talk in opposition to the flock cameras.
[15:51] As I'm sure you've heard, cities across the US are canceling their contracts over
[15:55] privacy concerns. A Haines City police officer was just arrested for
[15:59] tracking his estranged wife, as someone just mentioned.
[16:02] In a California town, flock misread license plates in 71% of the
[16:06] cases it sent to police. In a report in Atlanta found their entire
[16:10] network of flock cameras has not reduced crime. And we all want safe communities.
[16:14] I don't think the goal is to take away your crime-fighting tools, but when the tool
[16:18] to reduce crime destroys what little privacy we have left while creating
[16:22] a mass surveillance state where we are tracked and it's ripe for abuse,
[16:26] I think we have to go back to the drawing board.
[16:28] They call them automatic license plate readers, but they've been found in bike
[16:31] paths, walking trails, public parks, community pools, children's
[16:35] gymnastics gyms. That's not plate tracking.
[16:38] That is people tracking. I saw this quote and it was too good not to
[16:41] share. "Flock is a mass surveillance network, and there's a difference between
[16:45] you seeing someone drive down the road and the government creating a searchable
[16:49] record of where you've been." This is a reason that we oppose flock,
[16:53] not because we're against law enforcement, but because we're against mass
[16:56] surveillance. In a free country, the government should not be able to track the
[17:00] daily movements of law-abiding citizens without individualized
[17:04] suspicion or a warrant. "But your phone already tracks you," is what
[17:08] most people will say, right? The difference is consent, and I have to click a
[17:11] button that says, "This device may track me." If you don't want to do that, you can
[17:14] get a flip phone, and some people do that because it's their choice.
[17:17] But flock is warrantless surveillance without consent.
[17:20] And the most dangerous thing isn't what the cameras are doing, but
[17:24] it's quietly what we're doing to society.
[17:27] It's this deeper, I think, picture here.
[17:30] It's the gradual abandonment of one of the oldest traditions, and that's
[17:34] innocent until proven guilty. One of the oldest
[17:38] premises we have is that an individual is innocent until we're shown
[17:41] otherwise. This surveillance system totally reverses those roles.
[17:45] Now we're guilty until proven innocent.
[17:47] We see people getting accused of things that they were not doing just because this
[17:51] robot system has misread it.
[17:54] It's a very dangerous precedent and a road that we don't want to go down
[18:01] Everyone is watched, everyone's cataloged, and everyone is searchable.
[18:04] And not because they've done something wrong, but because they might do something
[18:07] wrong in the future. And that shift is very concerning.
[18:10] As you've seen, some cities are solving the Flock backlash by adding
[18:14] contracts with Axon, Motorola, SoundThinking. This is not the answer.
[18:18] Denver did it and it's same mass surveillance, different logo.
[18:22] Just because it's a slicker product doesn't mean our Fourth Amendment is still
[18:25] out the window. We do not consent to warrantless tracking of our movements by
[18:29] any private companies. I think that's the key takeaway there.
[18:33] A wise man once said, "Those who exchange essential liberty for perceived security
[18:37] deserve neither and shall lose both." So I hope you will reconsider your Flock
[18:41] contracts.
[18:43] Thank you very much for your time.
[18:53] Dominique Douglas.
[18:56] Dominique Douglas?
[19:08] Good afternoon, everyone. Okay. Dominique Douglas,
[19:13] 936 Lake Destiny, Altamonte Springs.
[19:17] Good evening, City Council.
[19:21] As I said, my name is Dominique Douglas, and I'm a resident of Altamonte
[19:25] Springs. I'm going to read this real quick because I talk too much.
[19:30] So I have an English degree from Rollins College.
[19:33] Books, literacy, and access to information obviously
[19:36] matter to me.
[19:38] But this isn't about me loving books.
[19:40] It's about accessibility, fiscal transparency, and
[19:44] representation.
[19:46] If we
[19:48] were having this conversation 15 years ago, I might
[19:52] understand someone arguing that technology could eventually
[19:56] reduce the need for a physical library.
[19:59] Oh, she's like, "That's too much."
[20:02] You're good.
[20:03] Okay. Thank you. Thanks, Angie.
[20:07] Like I was saying, if we had this conversation 15 years ago, I might understand
[20:11] someone arguing that technology could eventually reduce the need for
[20:14] a physical library. But look at what has happened in these 15
[20:18] years. We've already lost so much physical access.
[20:22] Textbooks became e-books for my daughter.
[20:25] One year, they said all she's going to need is an iPad. She's got an app for that.
[20:29] Applications went online for everything.
[20:32] Government services went online, job applications went online, bills went
[20:36] online, banking went online. And every time we digitize something, we
[20:40] assume everyone has equal access to that device, the internet, the
[20:44] technology, and the ability to use it. They don't.
[20:47] Digital access is in addition to accessibility.
[20:50] It is not a replacement for accessibility.
[20:53] And a library is more than books on shelves.
[20:56] It is internet access, computers, educational resources,
[21:00] children's programming, a place for seniors, a place for families,
[21:04] a place where somebody who doesn't have everything at home or internet
[21:08] access can still have access to information and opportunity.
[21:12] So no, an e-book does not automatically replace a library any
[21:17] more than an e-book automatically replaces access.
[21:21] Then we have the money. I understand that you have to balance a budget,
[21:25] but a balanced budget tells us the numbers and that they work.
[21:28] Fiscal transparency tells us what your priorities are.
[21:32] The city's own budget documents show $500,000
[21:36] budgeted for a field, two press boxes, renovations at Esemont
[21:39] Park. I'm not standing here saying parks don't matter.
[21:43] I love Altamonte, and I live here partially because of the parks.
[21:46] They do.
[21:48] I'm asking a very simple question.
[21:49] What other options did you consider for the library?
[21:53] What funds can be reallocated? What could be reprioritized?
[21:57] What grants were explored? What partnerships were explored?
[22:00] Could a nonprofit even operate it?
[22:02] Could educational institutions participate? Could residents participate?
[22:06] Because residents should not learn after the fact that a major
[22:10] public service that they thought their tax dollars were supporting is going to
[22:13] disappear anyway. And if the answer is that somebody else should take over the
[22:17] library, fine. Let's have that conversation.
[22:20] But then let's also have the conversation about that tax increase residents were
[22:23] told was necessary, in part because of the library.
[22:26] If another organization assumes that responsibility, then explain where those
[22:30] dollars follow the library and whether those dollars should be returned to the
[22:33] taxpayers. The residents have already answered the question of whether they
[22:37] want their library. They do. So stop asking whether and ask
[22:41] how.
[22:52] All right. Jude Stevens.
[22:56] Jude Stevens.
[23:05] Jude Stevens, 32714.
[23:09] Not nearly as eloquent as anybody who's come before me, but
[23:14] Flock cameras, Axon, whatever
[23:18] company name you want to give them,
[23:21] they need to be removed.
[23:24] It doesn't matter if they say they're going to change from keeping our
[23:28] information from 30 days to seven days, or if the police need a
[23:31] specific number to get in. None of that matters
[23:35] because they shouldn't have the information to begin with.
[23:39] I realize we don't have an expectation of privacy
[23:43] in public,
[23:45] but that doesn't extend to anyone who's keeping a
[23:49] network that tracks me
[23:52] and stores my information for no reason at all.
[23:56] I haven't done anything wrong.
[23:58] It may help the police in some instances, but that doesn't justify
[24:02] what amounts to government surveillance of the general public.
[24:06] This is a slippery slope, and I don't know how many city
[24:10] and county commission meetings we have to go to because we could
[24:14] take care of it for the city of Altamonte, but then you
[24:18] drive through an intersection and all of a sudden you're county, and that's
[24:22] another whole set of people that we need to be talking
[24:25] to.
[24:27] But it has to start somewhere, and we
[24:31] need to start it here.
[24:34] The library,
[24:36] I don't understand why it's an issue every single year.
[24:41] We did this a couple of years ago. We had a budget that
[24:45] all the department managers in the city said, "Yep, we can do this.
[24:49] Not a problem. We don't need an increase, no
[24:53] tax increase."
[24:55] And
[24:56] then somebody said, "Well, the library.
[24:59] We can't fund the library." And
[25:02] we just listened to the young lady who was interviewed by Channel
[25:06] 9 News saying, "I like my library. I like my
[25:09] librarians. This is very important to me." And then all of a sudden,
[25:13] it was brought up again.
[25:16] We're finding out about these things after the fact,
[25:21] and
[25:22] that's not right.
[25:27] I like libraries. I have a six-year-old granddaughter going into the
[25:30] first grade, and she's already reading at a
[25:33] third-grade level because they go to the
[25:37] library all the time.
[25:41] I don't know what has to give, but
[25:44] I don't think we can keep making the library an issue year after year
[25:48] after year.
[25:51] And like I said, I don't know what can give to
[25:55] make sure that that happens, but
[25:58] maybe if we don't spend money on flock cameras, we can put them towards
[26:02] the library.
[26:15] Tyler Walter.
[26:26] My name is Tyler Walter. I'm 21. I live at
[26:30] 937 South Ridge Trail. I've lived in Altamonte Springs all my life. I grew up here.
[26:34] I've been in that library since I
[26:39] can really remember.
[26:40] I grew up in that library. I would always go there after school.
[26:43] I'd get a stack of books about this high, finish them in three days, and be back.
[26:46] I love that library.
[26:50] If we can do anything to fund it at all, I'm in support of it.
[26:53] As somebody else said, we can contract it.
[26:56] We can
[26:57] look at management options, volunteers, I don't care.
[27:01] Let's work it out.
[27:03] Couple other issues I'm here for,
[27:05] the flock cameras. The flock cameras,
[27:08] I really am concerned about the civil liberty violations.
[27:11] I think it can escalate really fast, not only from official use of it, but
[27:14] unofficial use of it, which kind of rolls into the third issue I'm going to talk
[27:18] about, which I haven't heard anybody talk about yet, is the
[27:22] allegations of playground cameras at Merrill that are
[27:26] facing our children's playgrounds.
[27:29] I brought that up here.
[27:30] Okay. That's what you're talking about? Okay.
[27:33] Wow.
[27:34] The potential for misuse there is really concerning to me.
[27:38] I think that needs to be addressed immediately.
[27:41] Why are those there? What are the statistics that are justifying those cameras
[27:44] being there? Is that a high-crime area?
[27:48] I go to Merrill all the time. I don't think that's a high-crime area we need to be
[27:50] watching all the time. If we want to watch a place
[27:54] more, those pedestrian tunnels. The amount of
[27:58] trash and human excrement, I mean, it's gross, but that's in there is
[28:03] appalling, and those need to be watched a little more closely.
[28:06] Just,
[28:11] I think our city can do better with our surveillance.
[28:14] I think we can do better with
[28:18] our civil liberties, okay? I think that we don't need flock cameras.
[28:21] This is, to my knowledge, a very safe city.
[28:25] When I turn on the news and see a news of a
[28:28] big police action, it's always a shock to me. I've grown up here.
[28:32] I've always felt safe here. Never felt unsafe here in my life.
[28:36] And so I just don't understand why we need all these flock cameras everywhere.
[28:39] I think really we can just do better, and I think
[28:43] consulting us, the residents, is what's important on
[28:46] these cameras. Voting,
[28:49] at least holding public hearings for when we're going to put new cameras in places,
[28:53] at least,
[28:54] I think is very important, and I would like to see that going forward.
[28:57] I have great faith in this city and its leadership, and I love living here, and I
[29:01] will hopefully continue to live here for as long as it's feasible for me to do so.
[29:05] And even when I don't live here, it'll always be special to me because I grew up
[29:08] here, and I want to see it thrive. Thank you.
[29:10] Thank you.
[29:19] Sarah Leveridge.
[29:27] Hello, my name is Sarah Leveridge.
[29:29] I live at 5051 Center Boulevard. I've
[29:33] lived in Altamonte Springs just a little over a year now, so I'm a newer
[29:36] resident. Moved here and I really loved the area
[29:40] and the library. I was absolutely shocked to hear
[29:44] about what is potentially going to happen to this library.
[29:48] And then to even hear that two years ago, this was already
[29:51] discussed and decided on. So do you care
[29:55] about what the citizens are saying to you or not?
[29:59] It's a little bit of a confusing situation.
[30:01] It'd be really sad to see the library close down.
[30:05] It's a great place. They do events, and it's just a great resource
[30:09] for the community.
[30:11] The other issue is the Flock cameras.
[30:14] I live on One Center Boulevard in Palm Springs.
[30:18] There's a ridiculous amount of Flock cameras there that have been brought to my
[30:22] attention.
[30:24] And people have really brought up already
[30:27] some misuse that has happened with these Flock cameras.
[30:31] This is an example from Orange City, Florida.
[30:33] A police officer ran his ex-girlfriend's license plate through the Flock
[30:38] automated plate reader. He searched for the license plate at least
[30:42] 69 times, he searched for the license plate belonging to her mom at
[30:46] least 24 times, and he searched for the license plate belonging to her
[30:49] dad at least 15 times. His searches were happening so often
[30:53] and were so commonplace, that even one of his colleagues noticed
[30:56] Brown researching his ex-girlfriend's whereabouts while the law enforcement
[31:00] officers sat in their police cruisers.
[31:03] This is not a one-off incident. There are a lot of police officers
[31:07] abusing these Flock camera systems.
[31:09] They seem to have unlimited access to them, and I think that's a very big
[31:13] danger to the community.
[31:16] So I wanted to bring that to people's attention and just come up here
[31:20] and say that I really disapprove of the Flock cameras and what is potentially
[31:24] happening to the library.
[31:26] Thank you.
[31:34] I believe it's Sammy Stout.
[31:45] Hey, I'm Sammy.
[31:48] History's taught us what happens when you have the rise of the power of the
[31:51] government and the police and that kind of thing, and burning books.
[31:55] That's what it sounds like what's happening here.
[31:57] Maybe it's a generalization, but I don't see why
[32:02] any of you would support that. We shouldn't even have to be
[32:06] here to tell you this. This is the kind of obvious stuff if you care about the
[32:10] people you live with and represent.
[32:12] So,
[32:15] if nothing's done,
[32:18] I don't see why any of you would still be up here.
[32:20] Maybe you started your political careers wanting to be
[32:24] really on fire to help people and everything, but I don't feel like this is
[32:27] happening.
[32:30] Let's see some positive stuff. We shouldn't even ask
[32:33] to not close a library. It's ridiculous.
[32:38] So,
[32:39] that's all I got. Thank you.
[32:40] Thank you.
[32:49] Sagar Patel.
[32:52] Here.
[33:00] Where do you want to go? Into nature or into a city?
[33:05] I don't know what that was.
[33:07] Hi.
[33:09] Just real quick, my name's Sagar Patel.
[33:11] I'll share my address if each of you shares yours.
[33:16] Mine's posted on the website.
[33:19] So you can understand that initial
[33:22] feeling of not wanting that privacy, and that's how a lot of
[33:26] people feel about these Flock cameras.
[33:28] The unnecessary tracking of everyone.
[33:32] And then the other problem is, it's not even just our police officers who are
[33:36] getting this, it actually is the city selling all of this information to
[33:40] the corporation and then buying it back from them.
[33:43] How much is the Flock contract in Altamonte Springs right now?
[33:47] Do we-
[33:47] It's zero.
[33:49] But there's cameras out there, so how much are you paying?
[33:51] How much-
[33:52] Those aren't ours. Those are owned by the Department of Homeland Security.
[33:56] No, they don't know.
[33:57] Department of Homeland Security.
[34:03] That's worrisome that we don't have a number on that.
[34:06] You can understand why everyone here is worried about that.
[34:10] That's a legitimate worry.
[34:13] And
[34:15] if anyone has looked into interviews with the representatives from
[34:19] Flock, they don't appear to be a trustworthy corporation.
[34:22] There was a city in Illinois that wanted to get rid of their cameras, and Flock is
[34:26] refusing to remove them, and there's actually legal issues now because it's
[34:30] still privately owned. So now the city is having to spend more taxpayer dollars
[34:34] to now remove the Flock cameras.
[34:37] So, and again, we're spending all this money
[34:41] on the Flock cameras.
[34:43] No one here seems to want them, but meanwhile, the library is struggling for
[34:47] funding.
[34:48] Yeah.
[34:50] It seems like a very easy call here.
[34:53] Anyway, that's my time.
[35:03] Christopher Hopkins.
[35:17] Good evening, ladies and gentlemen.
[35:19] Excuse me a moment. Here.
[35:21] My name is Christopher Hopkins, and I don't think I need to share my address, since
[35:25] I passed no fewer than a dozen Flock cameras on the way to this meeting, so
[35:29] you already know where I live.
[35:32] Why do we have flock cameras? There is no evidence that they reduce the
[35:36] incidence of crime, but one of the few audits of them done in Roseville,
[35:40] California, shows a 71% error rate.
[35:44] The fact of the matter is that flock cameras are not for citizens.
[35:48] They don't keep us safe. They are intended to watch innocent
[35:51] citizens and encourage police to
[35:55] violate our rights. Already we have seen dozens of
[35:58] incidents of police
[36:02] officers abusing the system to follow personal
[36:06] enemies and romantic partners.
[36:08] There are almost no regulations regarding this data.
[36:11] There's no recourse for the public in regards to abuse and almost no
[36:14] transparency. Like with AI, we rushed to adopt this
[36:18] technology with absolutely no idea how to protect average
[36:22] citizens, and possibly no thought to it at all.
[36:26] If this city cares about reducing crime, we should be investing
[36:30] in our libraries. According to a study published in "The Journal of
[36:34] Cultural Economics" thank you, in 2023,
[36:38] the expansion of public libraries in Kansas City, Missouri, resulted in, quote,
[36:42] "A substantial reduction in frequency of burglaries, vandalism, robberies,
[36:46] fraud, and assaults." This is just one of hundreds of
[36:50] studies going back to at least three quarters of a century,
[36:54] showing the exact same result over and over again.
[36:58] Instead of wasting money on an untested, easily abused
[37:02] technology, we should be investing in our libraries, which
[37:05] actually accomplish the goals we claim to want to accomplish.
[37:09] It's time we treat library budgets with the same reverence we treat police
[37:13] budgets. In fact, with even more.
[37:17] As a politician, there are very few slam dunk issues
[37:21] in the world.
[37:23] I am telling all of you, libraries instead of flock cameras
[37:27] is one of those slam dunk issues.
[37:30] Thank you.
[37:31] Thank you.
[37:39] All right. H. Alexander Duncan.
[37:46] Okay.
[37:50] Moving on to Craig Saba.
[38:05] Hi there, folks. As the previous people have mentioned,
[38:09] if you want my address, you can ask the police officer in the back to take a look
[38:12] at it. My license plate is in the front.
[38:14] He'll be able to find it in about five seconds.
[38:17] A lot of people have already spoken about the ALPR cameras, automated license plate
[38:21] readers. So I'm just going to go over some other key points because they
[38:25] frankly stole a lot of what I was going to say.
[38:28] The first gentleman that I walked in on, the guy in the gray shirt back there, he
[38:31] said that he's not currently afraid of these cameras.
[38:33] But that's today,
[38:35] because the government currently doesn't see him as a threat.
[38:39] He hasn't said something that the government has thought ill of yet, so he
[38:42] doesn't see any threat to the police showing up at his door yet.
[38:46] But it could happen at any time.
[38:49] This technology is still very young.
[38:51] So people might think that it's not that much of an issue yet, but this is just the
[38:55] infancy. Technology grows at an accelerated rate day by day.
[38:59] I work in IT. It changes every single day.
[39:01] That's the reason I have a job, because people don't know what's new, right?
[39:05] So we can't be thinking about what the technology is today and why it's okay today
[39:08] when you need to be thinking about why it's a problem in 5, 10, 15 years.
[39:11] Because in my opinion, it already is a problem.
[39:14] It's definitely going to be in 5, 10 years if we allow it to continue at this rate.
[39:18] Somebody earlier mentioned the Institute of Justice
[39:22] showing abuse of the system. Some people have thrown out some numbers.
[39:26] The current number of abuse cases on the IJ website is over
[39:30] 100, and that's just within the last year.
[39:32] That's an insane number of abuse cases.
[39:35] This isn't just somebody stalking their partner.
[39:38] This is somebody under the color of authority of law that we have
[39:42] entrusted to them using a state-sponsored surveillance system
[39:46] to abuse people's constitutional rights. This is insane.
[39:49] Constitutional rights are supposed to be inalienable, and every time the system is
[39:53] accessed, those rights are stripped away from us and stomped on and spit on.
[39:57] And people lose their jobs over it. They might get arrested.
[40:01] There's plenty of cases where people don't get arrested across the country for
[40:03] this. It's ridiculous.
[40:06] Multiple people have mentioned these
[40:08] cameras at playgrounds. I'm not familiar with the specific playground that they're
[40:11] talking about, but I've seen plenty of these cameras, which are supposed to be
[40:14] license plate readers, pointed at the children play sets.
[40:17] Why is a license plate reader trying to record a child going down a slide?
[40:22] Yeah.
[40:22] We're in the day and age of the Epstein files. Who thought that that was okay?
[40:27] We're putting these devices, which are easily hackable. This is not speculation.
[40:31] I can give you some resources. Please ask me.
[40:34] 404 Media has shown numerous instances of unidentified and unauthorized access of
[40:38] these systems in many cases, but particularly in places where children are
[40:41] at. Flock themselves cannot validate why these
[40:45] were being accessed where children are at.
[40:47] Why are we letting these systems continue in our community to promote
[40:51] this? We need to stop protecting children retroactively with cameras and
[40:55] start protecting them proactively by removing these cameras immediately.
[41:01] I have six seconds, so have a great evening, folks.
[41:03] Thank you.
[41:12] Yamina, and I'm not sure of the last name.
[41:15] It begins with an S.
[41:18] I apologize.
[41:24] Good evening. My name is Yamina Spiet.
[41:28] I created my little speech just as I walked in here, so
[41:31] forgive me.
[41:33] My name is Yamina. I came here to advocate for the removal of all flock
[41:37] cameras.
[41:40] I am no lawyer, but my background in tribal law allows me to
[41:44] understand the complexities of federal law.
[41:47] This complexity, frankly, does not exist in relation
[41:51] to our current surveillance state.
[41:54] Everyone here has demonstrated that this measure of surveillance is clearly a
[41:57] violation of our Fourth Amendment, and I will reiterate how
[42:01] blatantly obvious that is.
[42:03] It has already been brought up the level of stalking and harassment that is used by
[42:07] officers in tracking women across the country.
[42:10] These cameras are also used to statistically target people of color.
[42:14] Regulation does not stop this. Removal does.
[42:18] And I should not have to be another voice in reminding that violence against
[42:21] women is only expanding with the birth of a surveillance state.
[42:26] And to Mr. Patel's point,
[42:29] why have this conversation
[42:31] if you are claiming you have no responsibility behind it?
[42:36] In hopes of connecting our culture to the current
[42:39] surveillance state with a little bit of dark humor,
[42:42] I remember I was scrolling through Instagram and came upon a funny post.
[42:46] It was a side-by-side comparison of Spider-Man from 2002
[42:50] to "Spider-Man: Brand New Day." A person commented that Spider-Man from
[42:54] 2002 should have been caught with the amount of times he's walked around swinging
[42:58] webs without a mask.
[43:00] The difference is, that person had no idea what it was like to live in a
[43:04] world where there was no daily surveillance.
[43:07] Spider-Man's identity was safer then. We deserve to be as safe as Peter Parker.
[43:11] Thank you.
[43:12] Thank you.
[43:19] Trey McCoy.
[43:25] Hello.
[43:29] Hello, so many of you. I am here today. My name is Trey.
[43:32] I live at 889 Silversmith.
[43:35] I have been in this community for a long time, and it was shocking for
[43:39] me scrolling through Instagram, through cat videos,
[43:43] to find that flock cameras, that I have heard about so
[43:47] many times of being misused and
[43:50] abused
[43:52] to create a mass surveillance state, is being
[43:55] installed in our home.
[43:58] To drive by it myself, my heart starts to race
[44:01] because I don't know who's going to be reviewing that data.
[44:05] We don't know where this data's going. They say they delete this information.
[44:08] We have no assurances of that. We've known that AI,
[44:12] we keep seeing that AI is taking data, moving it to
[44:16] places, and storing it so it could be used.
[44:19] What's to keep it from being used to
[44:23] track us
[44:26] beyond what we can conceive? Because they could store that and use it 10,
[44:30] 20, 30 years from now. We don't know the
[44:33] implications. There's no regulation on storing this data
[44:37] or deleting it. There's no consequences.
[44:40] There's no regulations.
[44:43] None of it's been approved. These cameras were
[44:47] installed in our homes and around our homes, and
[44:51] we didn't even know. I didn't know until Instagram told me, which is
[44:55] shocking. It's shocking that these things are going to start
[45:00] mass surveilling us with no warning.
[45:03] So, we've seen in the past,
[45:07] after 9/11, where they were
[45:10] targeting Muslims and
[45:12] surveilling where they were going in their businesses, their homes, their student
[45:15] groups, their mosques, and that ended up becoming a
[45:19] much bigger problem because of all the extra information.
[45:22] They were focusing on a group to find an answer.
[45:25] Now
[45:26] they have this information, they can just search until they find some sort of
[45:30] answer.
[45:31] We don't know where the data's going. I said that already.
[45:34] I'm afraid that we're losing our privacy.
[45:37] We can't drive without worrying about
[45:41] who's going to be tracking us, and that's concerning.
[45:45] So,
[45:46] hopefully I can compel you guys, and
[45:48] clearly many people here are here for the same two things.
[45:52] I'm at the library with my daughter every Thursday,
[45:55] and
[45:56] it's a place where she can be safe, where she can
[46:00] find a book that changes her
[46:04] relationship with the way she reads, and to be
[46:08] part of the community. That is so important.
[46:12] So, I think
[46:14] we all said that, but
[46:16] I think we all
[46:18] deserve to be heard. So, thank you, guys.
[46:20] Thank you.
[46:27] Taylor Dibble.
[46:39] Good evening.
[46:42] So I want to start by talking about our Fourth
[46:46] Amendment rights, because it's very important in this country.
[46:49] It's very important as a formative part of who
[46:53] we are and what we fought against to make this country
[46:57] what it is. We fought tyranny, and now
[47:01] we are giving it away to a new type of tyranny,
[47:05] to Flock. And it's not even the most reliable company in the world.
[47:09] But I want to talk about
[47:11] specifically in 2012 and in 2018
[47:15] again, the federal government, the Supreme Court
[47:19] unanimously decided that GPS logging through your
[47:22] cellphone or through a device placed upon your car was
[47:26] unconstitutional because of its ability to survey an
[47:30] individual's everyday schedule.
[47:33] That was their decision.
[47:35] And
[47:36] because they called that unconstitutional-
[47:40] I fail to see how this is any different.
[47:44] When somebody sitting in their cruiser can enter in your license plate or
[47:48] even a partial plate, even if they didn't even get your entire partial plate,
[47:51] and they know the make and model of your car or vaguely what it's colored,
[47:55] then they can put together your schedule
[47:59] and track you throughout your entire day and put together a comprehensive list,
[48:03] all without a warrant?
[48:05] Yep.
[48:07] It's ridiculous. And to expand on some of the things that other people who have
[48:11] come up here and talked about have said,
[48:14] this is not a reliable or safe company. Not at all.
[48:19] They have been given instructions from several cities to take down and
[48:23] cease all operations of their cameras.
[48:25] Not only have they refused to stop operating their cameras, but
[48:28] when in certain places in Chicago, when they have taken down
[48:32] cameras, Flock has come back out and put new ones in their
[48:36] place and continue to operate illegally.
[48:39] This is not a safe or a
[48:42] reliable company that we need to be
[48:45] entrusting our day-to-day lives with.
[48:48] And
[48:50] I don't know about you guys, I don't particularly like that somebody who does
[48:54] not know who I am can just look at me,
[48:58] find a car or a vehicle or anything that is associated with me,
[49:02] and find me like that, just because I was
[49:05] frequenting a certain place or I passed by the wrong camera.
[49:11] I'm sorry, but the only solution to
[49:14] reliably ensure that this system is not abused is to pull
[49:18] each and every Flock camera out of the ground.
[49:23] And
[49:27] everyone's been talking about the cameras at parks.
[49:29] Me and my sister went out to three different parks, and
[49:33] all of them had Axis cameras. I don't have much time to explain that,
[49:37] but look it up. It's the same thing. I'm done. Thank you.
[49:41] Thank you.
[49:50] Valerie Wirtz.
[50:04] Good evening. Valerie Wirtz, and I am at
[50:07] 32701 for record.
[50:10] I want to talk about the disconnect that's happening right
[50:14] now. Two years ago, we all stood in front of you and we explained
[50:18] how important the library was to us. That was the people.
[50:22] The people came, told their elected people,
[50:25] "Represent us correctly, protect our library."
[50:29] And here we are again, having the same conversation.
[50:33] Obviously, some people are retiring, but you guys have served so well.
[50:37] You've done a great job for our city.
[50:39] The things that you have created, we will be living with this legacy
[50:43] for years to come.
[50:45] We need our voices to be represented whenever we put you up here.
[50:49] We need to know that whenever we come to you and we say, "This is important to us
[50:53] as a community," that's your new priority.
[50:57] Nothing else comes up before that.
[51:00] Second of all, these Flock cameras,
[51:04] we have to stand apart. We have to stand apart from what is
[51:07] popular. We have to stand apart from what is moving.
[51:12] This is not progression.
[51:14] This is absolutely suppression,
[51:18] and we need to stand together with our elected to say,
[51:21] "Not here. Not in this little city, Altamonte Springs." We
[51:25] are too good. You guys have been too good.
[51:29] Don't allow it to happen here. Remove what is in place,
[51:34] and turn it back to the people.
[51:36] I appreciate each one of you, and I appreciate your service.
[51:40] Mayor, I especially appreciate you.
[51:43] Thank you so much for your many, many years of service for this
[51:47] community.
[51:49] Please, guys, take up the next helm
[51:52] correctly.
[51:54] Represent us.
[51:55] Take care of this community.
[51:57] Thank you.
[52:07] Eric Soto.
[52:10] Eric.
[52:19] I'm Eric Soto.
[52:22] I'm back.
[52:24] I was hoping to not have to come back.
[52:27] I ran against Bob O'Malley because he was
[52:30] proposing a 29% increase in taxes
[52:34] to keep the library. The public came and said, "Hey,
[52:39] if you're going to get rid of the library, please do so responsibly.
[52:43] Have a plan in place. Let's find private
[52:46] partners to where we can actually keep the library open."
[52:50] And this panel,
[52:52] including Frank
[52:53] and all of the commissioners here, said, "This tax increase
[52:57] will save the library."
[53:01] It turns out that was not true.
[53:04] It is disappointing and disheartening.
[53:09] When I hear the reason why, it's because not enough
[53:12] people are using the library. It seems to me like
[53:16] plenty of people are using the library.
[53:20] There are current plans to try to change the deed on the
[53:24] library parcel so that you guys can sell it in the future.
[53:29] Why would you do that?
[53:32] Why not put it into a place that it can be sustained
[53:36] and used by the people in your community?
[53:38] That is very sad. I would like to thank Commissioner O'Malley.
[53:42] He has said that he will vote-
[53:44] against getting rid of the library. He said that on the news.
[53:48] I watched it, and that was a great thing.
[53:49] I haven't heard anything from the rest of you.
[53:52] I would love to hear that you're in support of the library.
[53:55] Would you like to, by show of hands, say who's in
[53:59] favor of saving the library, commissioners?
[54:03] Bob, you should raise your hand because you already said so publicly.
[54:06] I did.
[54:06] All right, so let's see your hand, Bob.
[54:09] All right. Would you guys like to say who would like to save the library?
[54:14] Perfect. That's a majority vote. You represent the
[54:18] majority of the populace. Now, I didn't even know we were going to talk about
[54:22] flock cameras today, but boy oh boy, do we have people from
[54:26] every walk of life letting you know that we don't want
[54:30] them in our city. So let's just do another little poll.
[54:34] Who would like the flock cameras to disappear?
[54:37] Hell yeah. Again, a majority. There you go.
[54:39] Seems to be the people that like the library. Interesting. They're readers.
[54:44] They've learned from history.
[54:47] Commissioners, who would like to get rid of the flock cameras?
[54:50] Now, let's not talk about who they are or anything.
[54:52] If you have the power, would you like to get rid of them? Let's show of hands.
[54:55] Who would like to do it? Okay. We're oh for five.
[54:59] These are the kind of things that really infuriate me
[55:03] as a citizen and cause me to leave my house.
[55:06] I have a six-week-old baby at home, and I had to come
[55:10] here to tell you how I feel, and I don't think it's going to make a difference
[55:14] because it didn't make a difference two years ago.
[55:17] Have a great day. Thank you very much.
[55:32] I'm thinking it's Aleta,
[55:36] but the last name is Anderson.
[55:39] I'm sorry.
[55:40] It's Allor.
[55:43] Okay.
[55:43] All right.
[55:45] Hello, my name is Allor Anderson. I'd like to not say my address.
[55:48] I'll do you one better, though.
[55:49] Okay.
[55:50] The police over there, they can track me by my license plate,
[55:53] 75F-QBS.
[55:57] As you can imagine, I'm here to talk about flock.
[56:00] Obviously, I don't really feel comfortable with surveillance, but I'm a federal
[56:04] contractor. They already have all my information.
[56:07] They know when I clock in, when I clock out, and there is only one
[56:11] place in my drive where I'm not being tracked by a flock camera.
[56:15] Can you imagine where that is?
[56:17] Try.
[56:17] Federal property.
[56:24] Flock is owned by a private company.
[56:26] I don't trust private companies with my information, and I was a
[56:30] little disheartened to hear that Altamonte Springs, you don't even have the
[56:34] contract.
[56:36] What?
[56:36] Why does the Department of Homeland Security have the contract?
[56:40] Why do we not have control?
[56:42] Nevertheless, I don't like a surveillance
[56:46] society. As a kid,
[56:50] I was a reader. I grew up, and I read "1984." It was a required
[56:54] book when I was in school.
[56:55] Whoo.
[56:57] That is now a banned book.
[56:59] And while I did not intend on speaking, nor did I know about the library
[57:03] issue,
[57:04] I want to speak on that.
[57:07] When schools have the right to ban books, you could go to a public
[57:10] library and you could read them. You have the right. We all have the right.
[57:15] I think we should be educated. If you take a look
[57:19] at Maitland, they're building a beautiful new library.
[57:23] I voted at
[57:25] Casselberry on Saturday. These are libraries.
[57:28] These are useful for our
[57:32] just society.
[57:34] And Winter Park, Maitland, Casselberry, I grew up in these
[57:37] libraries.
[57:39] They are important to me, just as not being
[57:42] surveillanced. I think we could do better, and I want to ask
[57:46] if anyone can provide an answer. If we do not have control
[57:50] over the flock cameras, and the Department of Homeland Security does,
[57:55] what can we do as the citizens of Altamonte Springs?
[57:59] How can we resolve this discomfort? Because clearly, we have it.
[58:04] So
[58:05] I did not intend to speak. This is my first city meeting.
[58:08] I'm happy to be here. So thank you guys for your time,
[58:12] and you have a great night.
[58:22] Christian Segarra.
[58:31] Hello, my name is Christian Segarra.
[58:33] I came all the way from Oviedo to talk about this just because I don't live here,
[58:37] doesn't mean I'm not concerned about my fellow citizens who are a 20-minute
[58:41] drive from me. Plus, I'm over here all the time anyways.
[58:44] Flock Safety executive used the cameras to access
[58:48] live footage of a children's gymnastic class in
[58:52] Dunwoody, Georgia.
[58:54] I thought these were just for reading license plates, but
[58:58] the independent journalist, Ben Jordan, was able to access the stored
[59:02] footage for Flock Security from a search on a Chromium browser.
[59:07] So think like Google or Brave or any normal browser.
[59:11] As a student completing the psychology
[59:14] degree, Bachelor of Science at UCF this semester, I know
[59:18] that being in constant observation has an
[59:22] effect on the well-being of people and citizens.
[59:25] And also just being a human, being watched doesn't feel nice.
[59:30] If you listen to my words alone, you wouldn't be able to tell my party affiliation.
[59:34] This isn't a partisan issue. Thank
[59:35] you.
[59:45] H. Alexander Duncan
[59:51] But you were gone, because I didn't see your hat.
[59:53] Oh, I know. I just went out there to listen to the PA. I was all stuffy.
[59:58] All right, good. I'm H. Alexander Duncan.
[1:00:01] I just want to say a couple of things real fast and try to get through it.
[1:00:04] I'm definitely against flock cams. I definitely want you guys to save the library.
[1:00:08] I think both of them go back to political scare tactics.
[1:00:11] You guys have a budget for the police of $124 million.
[1:00:15] Yes.
[1:00:16] The Seminole County Sheriff Office has a budget of $203 million.
[1:00:20] Sanford has $85 million, and they're much larger than you guys in
[1:00:24] both area and population. So just between the two largest cities in the
[1:00:28] county, we're pumping almost half a billion dollars a year into
[1:00:32] public safety. Let's be for real.
[1:00:34] Let's just be honest.
[1:00:35] Yep.
[1:00:36] So scare tactics. "Oh my God, if we get rid of property
[1:00:40] taxes, we can't have a library. Oh my God." Listen, man, you got
[1:00:45] Perdue Farms and these big companies like FPL that pay less per
[1:00:49] capita in property taxes than the average citizen, and they own thousands of
[1:00:52] acres. So the scare tactics have to stop.
[1:00:55] Another thing I just want to remind the audience about is this is listed at number
[1:00:59] three on the agenda. The reason you guys get away with a lot of stuff is because
[1:01:03] after they're done with number three, you guys make all the decisions of four
[1:01:06] through 10 with an empty chamber.
[1:01:10] So we just want to point that out. A lot of stuff gets handled on consent
[1:01:14] agendas, so the public don't really get to see it unless they go through it online
[1:01:18] or through a portal, all this. So if we're talking about accountability,
[1:01:21] transparency, and accessibility, it starts with you guys.
[1:01:25] The first thing is, if these guys vote everybody out, maybe the next
[1:01:28] set will change. If they don't change, vote them out.
[1:01:31] We get to do it, what, every four years, right?
[1:01:34] So at the end of the day,
[1:01:37] we watched a lady in Winter Springs a couple years ago, a year ago, get kidnapped
[1:01:40] right in front of multiple flock cameras.
[1:01:43] Then get her body put in a car and burnt up. The flock cameras didn't save her.
[1:01:47] Okay? Flock cameras capture our license plates, they capture our phone data,
[1:01:51] and they capture a lot of stuff that a lot of people in here haven't even mentioned
[1:01:55] tonight. So really what it is, is an invisible drag net.
[1:01:58] It's like the stingrays that the police ride around with, as well your police
[1:02:02] make on an average, like 77 grand a year.
[1:02:04] They're some of the highest-paid officers in the state. I looked it up.
[1:02:07] So, I really don't know how much money you guys need in Altamonte to go to the
[1:02:11] police. I think the library takes, what, $250,000 a year
[1:02:15] or something? Now, I'm pretty sure out of $124 million
[1:02:19] for public safety, we can keep a library. Thank you.
[1:02:23] Woo.
[1:02:36] Thank you all. That's all the cards I have, so we will go into our
[1:02:40] next item, and you all are more than welcome to stay-
[1:02:43] Yeah. You don't have to leave
[1:02:43] ... for our entire meeting. We never kick anybody out.
[1:02:47] So
[1:02:48] he was wrong about that.
[1:02:50] And we also have, at the end of our meeting,
[1:02:54] another informal communication from the floor.
[1:02:57] So I am going to move on.
[1:03:00] Franklin addressed it this time.
[1:03:03] No. All right.
[1:03:04] So,
[1:03:07] first of all, thank you all for coming tonight.
[1:03:10] And
[1:03:11] many of you had some really, really credible things to say and really
[1:03:15] appreciate the impact, and the impact it's had on me.
[1:03:19] Took a ton of notes.
[1:03:22] On the cameras, just to clear up a few things.
[1:03:25] We
[1:03:26] do control the contract.
[1:03:29] All of the cameras and all that, we don't pay any subscriptions.
[1:03:33] The cameras were funded by a federal
[1:03:37] grant. The federal government paid for that, we didn't.
[1:03:40] I'm just saying, we have not spent any of our money on that.
[1:03:44] There are six. There was the group of law enforcement
[1:03:48] agencies in Central Florida that did it. We were a part of that.
[1:03:51] There are six that are out.
[1:03:56] The rest are not ours. They, I think, are the Seminole County Sheriff's
[1:03:59] Office.
[1:04:02] But a lot of comments were made.
[1:04:06] I think what's the best next step for us is for
[1:04:10] Chief Nicholas, who I know
[1:04:12] is here.
[1:04:15] Yeah, Chief Nicholas is here. He and I will get together and listen to this and go
[1:04:19] through it, and rather than just recall what everyone said, we'll go
[1:04:23] through the audio and write down
[1:04:27] what was said so we can address it. What is real, what is not, what is true, what
[1:04:31] is not. There is a
[1:04:34] Fourth Amendment case that
[1:04:36] is moving through appeals right now called
[1:04:40] Schmidt versus City of Norfolk. They had 170
[1:04:44] cameras.
[1:04:45] In that case, it was actually found constitutional.
[1:04:48] It has been appealed, and we follow the law, so
[1:04:53] as the appeal process moves forward, we will continue watching that.
[1:04:56] There were a couple of things that were said about the technologies.
[1:05:01] And some were things that I want to make sure that I
[1:05:05] understand, understand what was said, understand what the capabilities are.
[1:05:08] We don't have any facial recognition here at the city at all.
[1:05:13] There were a couple of comments made about no regulation, no
[1:05:16] consequences. We are the highest-ranked police department in the
[1:05:20] state of Florida. It's called an Excelsior agency.
[1:05:23] We've had that designation five times.
[1:05:26] And one of the reasons is because we have protocols and procedures for virtually
[1:05:29] everything. So I will tell you, as a
[1:05:33] citizen of the United States, it
[1:05:36] really, it makes me unhappy when
[1:05:40] people in whom we give a great deal of trust, we entrust them with
[1:05:45] 5,700-pound vehicle, a nine millimeter, the ability
[1:05:49] to suspend your civil liberties, and when they break the rules,
[1:05:52] that is abhorrent. The people it's most
[1:05:56] important to, abhorrent to, are the people who work at our
[1:05:59] agency
[1:06:00] We've had no abuse. We audit everything.
[1:06:04] We make sure that there's an investigation that's tied to any search at
[1:06:08] all.
[1:06:10] I don't know what other agencies do.
[1:06:12] They may not do the audits the way we do.
[1:06:15] They may say they do the audits and don't.
[1:06:18] The reason why we get an Excelsior accreditation is because there's an independent
[1:06:22] police group that comes in, and they make you show them the
[1:06:26] audits. You actually have to produce the pieces of paper
[1:06:29] that has the audit on it.
[1:06:32] Because one of the things that we did is we wanted to control
[1:06:36] the contract so no one could sell the data and no one could sell the pictures.
[1:06:40] So now, some people said some questions
[1:06:44] about whether or not they're being moved to other places.
[1:06:47] It's a good thing to look into, and we will.
[1:06:50] But what I think is best to do is for Chief Nicholas and I to go
[1:06:54] through all of this information and bring you back a briefing
[1:06:57] about really what is out there that is in
[1:07:01] Altamonte Springs that are part of the UWASI grant,
[1:07:06] what they do, what they don't do,
[1:07:08] what the pictures look like, what they don't
[1:07:12] look like, and give you
[1:07:16] a pretty good overview, obviously, of what the protocols are
[1:07:20] so you can see them, so you can see the accountability that our police
[1:07:23] department applies to the trust that we give
[1:07:27] our officers. So we're very proud of the people who work here.
[1:07:32] We're very proud of the safety that they provide.
[1:07:34] It really was great to hear people talk about how they did feel safe here.
[1:07:38] As a city, understand people are not feeling comfortable with the cameras.
[1:07:43] But I think it would be best to bring back,
[1:07:45] answer all the things that were said, and
[1:07:50] then that's all public record, so
[1:07:53] everybody can have a copy of
[1:07:56] what that briefing looks like. So
[1:07:58] this is my name,
[1:08:04] and there's an email box on our website.
[1:08:08] If you'd like to send an email in, we'll have your email.
[1:08:11] We'll send you the briefing document so that you see it.
[1:08:15] I hope that's good with everybody.
[1:08:17] But we do appreciate
[1:08:21] there's a lot of conversation about it, for sure.
[1:08:23] Sometimes technology,
[1:08:27] without being fully explained,
[1:08:31] sometimes people see things that are on the internet.
[1:08:33] I watched some of it, and I just went, "That's not true. That's not true.
[1:08:37] That's not true. That's not true."
[1:08:40] But, the best way to deal with that is to hear the question,
[1:08:43] hear what you have to say, and answer it, and verify it with
[1:08:47] the data that we can tell you where we got the
[1:08:51] answer from, and you can go look for yourself to verify.
[1:08:55] I hope that sounds good for everyone.
[1:08:58] Yeah.
[1:08:58] I just want to add,
[1:09:01] because I heard more than one person say we, the commission,
[1:09:05] should never have voted for those flock cameras.
[1:09:08] We don't vote for equipment.
[1:09:11] And I will speak for myself personally, I didn't even know what a flock
[1:09:15] camera was
[1:09:16] until
[1:09:19] Frank Martz told me that you concerned citizens were coming
[1:09:23] today to talk about it, and I had to do some research.
[1:09:26] Thank you for coming,
[1:09:28] for me. I'm speaking for me alone. Thank you for coming and
[1:09:32] educating me
[1:09:34] and voicing your concerns, because I agree with everything you're
[1:09:37] saying.
[1:09:39] I want the facts, though, just like you do.
[1:09:41] I don't know anything about the company, but it does sound scary
[1:09:45] to me.
[1:09:47] But I wanted you to know, as commissioners, we don't vote on
[1:09:51] every piece of equipment that is used in our departments,
[1:09:55] especially for the police.
[1:09:56] Good.
[1:09:57] And one additional thing that I'll add, I'll make sure that we also
[1:10:01] do,
[1:10:02] when we prepare the briefing, is I'll speak with the sheriff and
[1:10:06] understand what their technology is as well.
[1:10:11] So we'll do that.
[1:10:14] Thank you.
[1:10:17] All right. Item four is a public hearing.
[1:10:20] First reading of ordinance number
[1:10:22] 1845-26, amending the land
[1:10:26] development code to clarify procedures for projects
[1:10:30] involving conditional letters of map revision.
[1:10:34] This is a public hearing. Is there anyone in chambers to address the commission on
[1:10:38] this item?
[1:10:42] No?
[1:10:43] Yes, sir. Come up.
[1:10:44] This is back on the-
[1:10:45] No, you need to come up here please, sir, and give us your
[1:10:49] name and address, please.
[1:10:52] No.
[1:10:53] Thank you.
[1:10:54] Hi, my name is Socker. This is back on the previous item, but
[1:10:58] is the contract for the flock, do we have, is that available
[1:11:02] online somewhere?
[1:11:03] We moved on.
[1:11:03] Yeah, we're in the middle-
[1:11:04] Sorry
[1:11:04] ... of a public hearing on another item.
[1:11:05] I'm sorry.
[1:11:06] But at the end of the meeting, we do have another public meeting.
[1:11:08] Yeah.
[1:11:11] All right.
[1:11:13] If there's no comments on this, I will close the public hearing and
[1:11:17] ask our attorney to read the title for the record, please.
[1:11:20] Ordinance number 1845-26, an ordinance of the
[1:11:24] city of Altamonte Springs, Florida, relating to the floodplain management,
[1:11:29] amending chapter 28, land development code of the Altamonte Springs code of
[1:11:32] ordinances, by amending article 12, floodplain management,
[1:11:37] by amending division one, general provisions, by amending section
[1:11:40] 12.1.15, definitions, to revise
[1:11:44] definitions relating to conditional letters of map revisions and
[1:11:47] conditional letters of map revisions based on fill, by amending division
[1:11:51] four, site development plans and construction documents, by amending section
[1:11:55] 12.4.2, site plan conditions of approval, to
[1:11:59] revise the requirements for projects involving letters of map change,
[1:12:03] providing for a business impact estimate, providing for conflict, severability,
[1:12:07] codification, correction of scrivener's errors, and for an effective date
[1:12:12] I move that we approve ordinance number
[1:12:14] 1845-26 on first reading and
[1:12:18] set second reading for October 7, 2026.
[1:12:22] Second.
[1:12:23] We have a motion and a second. Roll call vote, please.
[1:12:26] Commissioner O'Malley?
[1:12:27] Yes.
[1:12:28] Commissioner Reese?
[1:12:29] Yes.
[1:12:29] Commissioner Turney?
[1:12:30] Yeah. Yes.
[1:12:31] Commissioner Brunsching?
[1:12:32] Yes.
[1:12:32] Mayor Bates? Yes.
[1:12:36] Item five is a public hearing, Resolution
[1:12:40] 1484, FY
[1:12:43] 2025/26 budget amendment.
[1:12:47] This is a public hearing. Is there anyone in chambers to address the commission on
[1:12:51] this item?
[1:12:54] Hearing none, I will close the public hearing and ask for commission
[1:12:57] discussion or a motion.
[1:13:00] I move that we approve Resolution 1484.
[1:13:04] Second.
[1:13:05] We have a motion and a second. Roll call vote, please.
[1:13:09] Commissioner O'Malley?
[1:13:10] Yes.
[1:13:10] Commissioner Reese?
[1:13:11] Yes.
[1:13:11] Commissioner Turney?
[1:13:12] Yes.
[1:13:13] Commissioner Brunsching?
[1:13:14] Yes.
[1:13:14] Mayor Bates? Yes.
[1:13:18] Item six is a request for approval amendment
[1:13:22] to the Emergency Watershed Protection Hurricane Milton
[1:13:26] assistance grant.
[1:13:31] I move that we authorize the mayor to sign the Emergency Watershed
[1:13:35] Protection Grant amendment for additional funding from the United States
[1:13:39] Department of Agricultural Natural Resources Conservation
[1:13:43] Service.
[1:13:44] Second.
[1:13:45] We have a motion and a second. All those in favor indicate by saying aye.
[1:13:49] Aye.
[1:13:51] Aye.
[1:13:51] Aye.
[1:13:51] Opposed, like sign. Passes unanimously.
[1:13:55] Item seven is a request for approval.
[1:13:58] Seminole County Public Schools
[1:14:00] 2026/2027 school resource
[1:14:04] officer agreement.
[1:14:08] Move to approve the agreement with the Seminole County School Board to provide
[1:14:11] school resource officers to public schools located in Altamonte Springs and
[1:14:15] authorize the mayor to execute same.
[1:14:17] Second.
[1:14:18] We have a motion and a second. All those in favor indicate by saying
[1:14:21] aye.
[1:14:23] Aye.
[1:14:23] Aye.
[1:14:23] Aye.
[1:14:24] Opposed, like sign.
[1:14:26] Passes unanimously. Item eight is a
[1:14:29] request for approval,
[1:14:32] fine reduction 924, West State Road
[1:14:36] 436, Lido International Corporation
[1:14:39] Limited.
[1:14:43] And their attorney has advised us that they support this.
[1:14:47] Oh, okay. Good.
[1:14:48] Yeah.
[1:14:49] All right.
[1:14:50] I move that we reduce the fine to
[1:14:52] $48,201.79 if
[1:14:56] paid within 90 days. If the reduced fine is not paid within
[1:15:00] 90 days, the fine will revert to
[1:15:02] $143,800.
[1:15:08] Yes, ma'am.
[1:15:11] I need a second.
[1:15:14] Second.
[1:15:17] Any discussion?
[1:15:20] All those in favor indicate by saying aye.
[1:15:22] Aye.
[1:15:22] Aye.
[1:15:23] Aye.
[1:15:24] Opposed, like sign. Passes unanimously.
[1:15:27] Discussion item is number nine,
[1:15:31] appointment of citizen board and committee members.
[1:15:39] Yeah, Mayor. For BZA, for my appointment, I'd like to appoint
[1:15:42] Axel David. He's a neighbor that lives near me. I saw him.
[1:15:47] Hey, Axel.
[1:15:49] A
[1:15:50] neighbor very involved with community issues, and I'd like to appoint him to BZA.
[1:15:56] And I would like to reappoint Venus Robinson to a full term
[1:16:01] on the Board of Zoning Appeals.
[1:16:03] Thank you.
[1:16:05] Thank you to those who have said yes.
[1:16:08] We appreciate it.
[1:16:10] All right. Item 10 is finance items.
[1:16:14] We have four tonight. Item A is solicitation
[1:16:17] award to Amplex Tampa LLC, doing
[1:16:21] business as Amplex Site One Landscape
[1:16:25] Supply LLC and Spring Hill Nursery
[1:16:28] Incorporated for nursery plants and products,
[1:16:32] ITB-26-085-KY.
[1:16:37] Item B is solicitation award to Rotolo
[1:16:41] Consultants Incorporated, Brightview Landscape Services
[1:16:45] Incorporated, and Helping Hand Lawn Care LLC for
[1:16:49] landscape maintenance services,
[1:16:52] ITB-26-051-KY.
[1:16:57] Item C is solicitation award to AGAS
[1:17:01] MFG Incorporated, Timothy J.
[1:17:05] O'Donnell Corporation, doing business as
[1:17:09] O'Donnell Corporation, Gallagher Promotional Products
[1:17:13] Incorporated, doing business as GPP,
[1:17:16] and Quick Advertising Incorporated, doing business
[1:17:20] as Fast Signs of Apopka for banners and
[1:17:24] signs,
[1:17:25] ITB-26-072-KY.
[1:17:31] And item D is employee health insurance for
[1:17:35] fiscal year 2027.
[1:17:38] I move that we approve finance items A, B, C, and D.
[1:17:45] Second.
[1:17:46] We have a motion and a second. All those in favor indicate by saying
[1:17:49] aye.
[1:17:50] Aye.
[1:17:50] Aye.
[1:17:50] Aye.
[1:17:51] Opposed, like sign. Passes unanimously.
[1:17:55] That ends our formal agenda. Is there anyone in chambers to address the
[1:17:58] commission on any item at all?
[1:18:03] Hearing... Yes, sir.
[1:18:12] Hi. I was just back for clarification on, is that contract available
[1:18:15] online for us citizens to look at it?
[1:18:19] They're all available for public
[1:18:21] records. If you'd like to have my card, you can email, and I'm happy to get it to
[1:18:24] you.
[1:18:25] Okay. Excellent. Thank you.
[1:18:26] Yes, sir.
[1:18:26] Thank you.
[1:18:29] All right.
[1:18:30] I just have one other-
[1:18:32] Yes, ma'am.
[1:18:41] Jude Stevens, 32714. I just had a
[1:18:45] couple of questions for Mr. Martz on what he
[1:18:49] said about the flock cameras,
[1:18:52] and you referenced a court case that said
[1:18:56] that they were constitutional or...
[1:18:58] Yes, ma'am. Schmidt... I'm sorry.
[1:19:01] Um-
[1:19:01] Schmidt versus the City of Norfolk, whereas if
[1:19:05] you're from Virginia, it's Norfolk.
[1:19:08] Mm-hmm.
[1:19:12] My personal opinion on that is just because it's
[1:19:16] constitutional doesn't make it right.
[1:19:23] And
[1:19:25] on the abuse and the auditing, while I can
[1:19:29] really truly appreciate the checks and
[1:19:32] balances that the city
[1:19:35] has in place, and it's probably a lot better than
[1:19:39] 90% of the other cities that are out there from what I can tell.
[1:19:42] Oh, 100% better?
[1:19:43] 100% of 100%.
[1:19:46] Just because there hasn't been abuse
[1:19:49] doesn't mean that there won't be abuse
[1:19:51] as we move forward and the technology moves forward.
[1:19:56] And,
[1:19:58] with the report and the
[1:20:02] briefing,
[1:20:05] will the briefing be in a public forum
[1:20:09] like this?
[1:20:11] Yes, ma'am. It'll be here, yeah.
[1:20:15] Okay.
[1:20:17] Thank you very much.
[1:20:19] Could I also have a card?
[1:20:21] Oh, yes, of course.
[1:20:25] Does anyone else wish to speak? Yes, sir.
[1:20:29] There you go.
[1:20:30] Thank you, sir.
[1:20:30] Yes, ma'am.
[1:20:37] Greg Salva.
[1:20:39] You said the contract is available for public record.
[1:20:41] Can we get those audit logs and the third-party reviews of those audit logs as
[1:20:45] public record?
[1:20:45] Yeah. We can release whatever is a public record.
[1:20:49] Whatever... Are the audits public record?
[1:20:52] Yeah, so long as they're not involved in a-
[1:20:54] Current ongoing investigation.
[1:20:55] Yeah, I think so. Is that correct?
[1:20:56] So, Commissioner Price, you're not going to submit-
[1:20:58] Yeah
[1:20:58] ... exemptions of 119?
[1:20:59] You don't even have to do that email. I'll forward it to you.
[1:21:01] Love that.
[1:21:02] Yeah.
[1:21:03] Second, like she said, just because a court rules it constitutional, if it goes
[1:21:07] against the will of the people, then what good is
[1:21:11] it? If the people don't want it, it should be taken out.
[1:21:16] I have one more thing I wanted to say.
[1:21:19] Oh,
[1:21:20] history is filled with men and women that were just doing their jobs.
[1:21:23] I hope that we will go above and beyond that to do what the people want and
[1:21:27] to bring about the will of the people, whether or not a court has ruled it
[1:21:31] constitutional or not, or whether or not your personal convictions say that it's
[1:21:35] okay. Whatever. Please go above and beyond, as many
[1:21:39] people have attested that you already do. Thank you.
[1:21:41] Thank you.
[1:21:48] Good evening. I'm Axel David at 617 Newport Avenue.
[1:21:51] First I want to thank you, Commissioner Malach, for the appointment.
[1:21:53] I appreciate that. Hope not to let you guys down.
[1:21:55] I do want to say something really quick that hasn't been said thus far.
[1:21:58] I'll make it very brief. I know this is a very long meeting in the terms of city
[1:22:02] commission history here.
[1:22:04] One thing that I am, of course,
[1:22:07] very much in objection to the flock cameras, no matter how few there are.
[1:22:11] One thing that needs to be taken into consideration, what this board should take
[1:22:14] into consideration, is these draw a massive wedge of
[1:22:17] distrust between the community and the police department, and that's my concern
[1:22:21] when you look at this. These flock cameras are massively unpopular, left, right,
[1:22:25] center, however you look at it. You look across, like that gentleman said, all
[1:22:28] walks of life are against this, myself included. Do they have some good things?
[1:22:32] Yeah. But you've got to look at that balance there. But when Mr.
[1:22:35] Martz has that briefing with the chief of police and Sheriff Lama, I hope
[1:22:39] he takes into consideration the impact this has on the community and the level
[1:22:43] of trust. And I don't want to see that level of trust eroded between the city of
[1:22:47] Baltimore Springs and the police department.
[1:22:49] We have great officers, great leadership, and that's something that needs to be
[1:22:52] taken into consideration when this is being discussed. Thank you so much.
[1:22:55] Hear, hear.
[1:22:55] Thank you.
[1:22:59] Anything else?
[1:23:01] Yeah.
[1:23:04] Hello.
[1:23:06] My name's Paula Hamilton, and hopefully I can be brief.
[1:23:10] I'm sorry. Could you repeat your name?
[1:23:12] My name's Paula Hamilton.
[1:23:14] In any event, I think thank you,
[1:23:18] city manager for explaining, from your viewpoint, some of the things
[1:23:22] that you understand concerning the contract and
[1:23:26] concerning things revolving around the cameras.
[1:23:29] I do think, and that's going back to what the gentleman just said, that in
[1:23:33] 2026, we have more than a responsibility of what we're
[1:23:37] told or what the illusion of control that we feel
[1:23:41] we have when it comes to privacy matters and technology
[1:23:45] in 2026. We've seen enough data breaches.
[1:23:48] We've seen enough abuse of power, right?
[1:23:51] And just so much consistent expansion,
[1:23:55] for example, of what AI can do, for us to
[1:23:59] just comfortably say, "Well, we have control,"
[1:24:03] without exploring that in depth and making
[1:24:07] sure that's the truth. It's not enough to come
[1:24:11] before your residents and say, "Yes, we assumed
[1:24:14] control of the contracts," not knowing what's going on.
[1:24:18] Because you have so many different companies, technology companies, VPN
[1:24:22] companies, for example-
[1:24:24] Or companies that have antivirus software that many
[1:24:29] people have used, where we had the perception of
[1:24:32] safety because they told us they are protecting us
[1:24:36] from scams, from viruses, only for us to then find
[1:24:40] out that those very people were selling our
[1:24:43] information. And so that's why I say you have a
[1:24:46] responsibility beyond thinking, "Oh, we have a control of the
[1:24:50] contract." At this point, you were not even aware to some
[1:24:54] extent that there were more cameras than you thought
[1:24:58] was there. So there has to be more consistent conversation
[1:25:02] prompted, initiated by you before we
[1:25:06] have to come and express that to you, whether that be opening this
[1:25:10] up for the floor to find out what's going on out there, what your residents are
[1:25:13] seeing. But technology is such at this
[1:25:17] point where you cannot be complacent and be
[1:25:21] satisfied, I would say, with, "I have control,"
[1:25:25] and this illusion of control and this illusion of what
[1:25:29] we're told this contract means. What's in
[1:25:33] writing and what's technologically available and
[1:25:36] possible at this point do not always
[1:25:40] coexist in the same place.
[1:25:43] Mm-hmm.
[1:25:43] That's just the reality.
[1:25:45] Yeah. Excellent points. I want to let you know that none of
[1:25:49] this is a surprise. I know where they are, and I'm
[1:25:53] under no illusion that there's not technology
[1:25:57] functioning technology. So I'm aware of what the contract says.
[1:26:01] Yeah.
[1:26:01] And I'm also aware of how technology can fail.
[1:26:05] So all of those things we are aware of,
[1:26:08] but we-
[1:26:09] Respectfully, sir, Mr. City Manager.
[1:26:11] Yes, ma'am.
[1:26:12] It's not that you're not aware, then.
[1:26:14] What you don't realize is in an attempt to pacify us
[1:26:18] tonight and to put our minds at ease, the way you
[1:26:22] phrased it to us when you then responded
[1:26:26] to the feedbacks that were given, would leave people with that
[1:26:29] illusion and impression that you were confident
[1:26:33] that we had control and that the data is
[1:26:37] secure and safe. So in addition to whatever knowledge
[1:26:41] you have, you also have to be careful and
[1:26:46] aware of what you're communicating to us as residents, while at the same
[1:26:50] time not really knowing.
[1:26:52] So
[1:26:54] I think you make an excellent point.
[1:26:57] I know as much as I can through the contract.
[1:27:01] I don't know what's happening in another building, and I think that's your point.
[1:27:06] So, and I appreciate that.
[1:27:07] And then yes, and we would like transparency,
[1:27:10] accountability,
[1:27:12] and going forward to say, "This is what I know.
[1:27:16] I do not know if this is sufficient." And that
[1:27:19] conveys to us something beyond, and I
[1:27:23] appreciate your hopefulness and the way you expressed it was
[1:27:27] amazing. But at this stage in
[1:27:30] 2026, that gloss over is not
[1:27:34] enough and not substantive enough, especially for those
[1:27:38] of us who are aware of technology, whether we're
[1:27:42] coders, whatever we may be, that are fully invested
[1:27:46] in where technology is going for good or worse.
[1:27:49] All good points.
[1:27:51] Okay.
[1:27:59] Is there... Yes, sir.
[1:28:05] Hi, my name is Ben Barusi. I'm actually a resident of Longwood,
[1:28:08] but the flock cameras, I live near a whole bunch of them,
[1:28:13] and I think the greatest issue we're having is that
[1:28:17] we weren't really told or informed.
[1:28:19] They just appeared one day, and I know that the commission is not responsible for
[1:28:23] the equipment the police have or anything like that.
[1:28:25] But it's a little bit of a different piece of equipment
[1:28:29] than, "Oh, they got new trucks. They got new vehicles," than, "Okay,
[1:28:33] we put up all these cameras all over Altamonte, and we're kind of using them and
[1:28:36] trying to figure it out." It's a little more
[1:28:39] serious than just, "Okay, they got a new piece of equipment."
[1:28:42] It's a little more takes the freedom away, and then just seeing them appear
[1:28:46] one day can be scary for a lot of people here, just knowing that they're there.
[1:28:50] When you see the stories on the news about them being abused and all of that, and
[1:28:54] like you said, that some of us don't even know what they are.
[1:28:56] And to see brand new things that we've never seen before.
[1:28:59] Honestly, I don't even see them. I'm sorry.
[1:29:02] Maybe it's my age, but I'm just looking at the road and the traffic and making
[1:29:06] sure I'm not hitting anybody.
[1:29:08] I purposely didn't.
[1:29:10] I'm not kidding you. I really don't know anything
[1:29:13] about them, and you guys have really educated me, believe me.
[1:29:17] And that's part of our thing is that we're very concerned because they just went
[1:29:21] up without any of our knowledge, and there's several around the Altamonte
[1:29:25] Mall. I drive by there, go to Crane's Roost all the time, and they weren't there
[1:29:29] one day, and then there's six around that specific area now.
[1:29:31] I will look now, though.
[1:29:33] And I know most of them are under Seminole County, like you said
[1:29:37] beautifully. But there is
[1:29:40] a feeling of disconnect when something appears in our city that we're not used to,
[1:29:44] and especially something so inherent American as our privacy.
[1:29:48] We heard about people saying that they're used to seeing it on TV in other
[1:29:51] countries. Never imagined it would happen here, and that's part of the reason, is
[1:29:55] it just appears one day, and it's scary.
[1:29:57] And I think that's a lot of the fear that we're feeling. Thank you for your time.
[1:30:01] Thank you.
[1:30:08] Thank you.
[1:30:08] I'd like to ask a question.
[1:30:10] Sure.
[1:30:11] My name is Mark Perkins. I live over by Eastmont Park
[1:30:15] and right behind the library.
[1:30:18] I'm confused why the library is a discussion
[1:30:22] again.
[1:30:26] Can you explain to me like I'm five why this is a budget issue
[1:30:30] again?
[1:30:31] Why we're coming up short on the budget?
[1:30:35] I don't understand
[1:30:38] when we're putting artificial fields in at Eastmont Park,
[1:30:44] and
[1:30:46] it's a baseball complex now. It's not a city
[1:30:50] park. There's no green space for people to throw a
[1:30:53] Frisbee or do anything.
[1:30:59] Can someone please tell me why the library is up for
[1:31:02] discussion?
[1:31:04] So our public hearing on the budget is on September
[1:31:08] 3rd, and I'm going to transmit the budget to
[1:31:12] the city commission by the end of the week.
[1:31:15] So there will be an explanation in that,
[1:31:18] that's very detailed.
[1:31:21] And that'll be, you said September 3rd?
[1:31:23] September 3rd. Yeah, we have two public hearings in September.
[1:31:27] The first one on the budget is on September 3rd, right here at 7 o'clock.
[1:31:32] Okay.
[1:31:34] I appreciate your time.
[1:31:36] Yes. Yes, sir.
[1:31:39] It doesn't seem right
[1:31:41] that it's the library.
[1:31:44] What are you going to do with the books if you take it down on the library?
[1:31:47] Are you going to burn them?
[1:31:51] And we're turning into a surveillance state.
[1:31:54] Is this a reflection on cops that they can't do their jobs now?
[1:31:58] They don't do good police work
[1:32:01] to find
[1:32:04] the criminals?
[1:32:06] They have to track everyday citizens now?
[1:32:11] What are we doing?
[1:32:13] Thank you for your time.
[1:32:15] Bob, thank you.
[1:32:20] Now-
[1:32:20] I'd like to follow up with that.
[1:32:25] Mr. City Manager, I have to object to your answer.
[1:32:30] Which?
[1:32:30] To the answer about the budget.
[1:32:32] Okay.
[1:32:32] Because you have already publicly
[1:32:36] announced the closing of the library.
[1:32:38] It's a fair question why the library's being closed.
[1:32:42] Yes, there are maybe details of the budget which you're not ready to talk
[1:32:46] about. That's fair. But I don't think that was exactly-
[1:32:49] Okay
[1:32:49] ... what he was getting at.
[1:32:50] Okay.
[1:32:50] So I would appreciate if you would-
[1:32:52] Absolutely
[1:32:53] ... please explain to everyone, including me, why we're talking about the
[1:32:57] closing of the library.
[1:32:58] Absolutely. It's a good point.
[1:33:02] As we were preparing the budget this year and going through or when
[1:33:06] we started preparing the budget two years ago,
[1:33:10] I recommended taking the library out of the
[1:33:13] budget because of shortfalls in funding.
[1:33:17] We were experiencing a lot of inflation and cost increases.
[1:33:20] There were also, and primarily,
[1:33:24] needs in the police department to stabilize our police department.
[1:33:27] We were having officer retention issues, and people were looking for other
[1:33:31] jobs. We were having issues with insurance.
[1:33:33] Insurance costs were going up. Other places have cheaper
[1:33:37] insurance than we had at the time, so we had a difficult time
[1:33:41] keeping some of our younger officers in particular.
[1:33:44] So I presented a budget in 2024.
[1:33:49] It did not have any of those law enforcement costs or
[1:33:52] library or the number of other things in it.
[1:33:56] There were people in
[1:34:00] the community who were upset about the removal of the library from that
[1:34:03] budget.
[1:34:05] There was a special meeting called by Commissioner O'Malley to
[1:34:08] discuss the things that were not in the budget.
[1:34:12] Primarily, the thing that brought the issue ahead was the
[1:34:16] library.
[1:34:17] And the city commission
[1:34:20] provided enough funding to stabilize the police department,
[1:34:25] and the officer retention, and
[1:34:29] to bring the library back into the budget for the
[1:34:32] 2024-2025 budget year. And
[1:34:36] it was sufficient for that budget year.
[1:34:38] We do budgets one year at a time. The next year,
[1:34:43] which would be
[1:34:45] our '24-'25 budget. That
[1:34:49] was the '23-'24.
[1:34:52] There were shortfalls again, and we had been pumping a good deal of
[1:34:56] money into the library, doing our best to raise awareness
[1:35:00] for people to use it better.
[1:35:04] At the time,
[1:35:06] the
[1:35:07] visitors were still pretty flat, and wasn't seeing a
[1:35:11] growth in the
[1:35:14] number of people who were using it, and the budget was going up.
[1:35:17] So at the time,
[1:35:19] I decided that we would cut
[1:35:22] about 10% of our budget in other places.
[1:35:24] We laid off six people, about six positions,
[1:35:28] and we said, "Let's give the library another year to see if
[1:35:32] it can generate
[1:35:34] just more traffic, just more people using it for the cost."
[1:35:38] This year, the projected cost of the
[1:35:41] library would be, all in, it's about $750,000.
[1:35:45] And
[1:35:47] as I put the budget together, what I have to do is I
[1:35:51] have to balance a lot of things. There's 47,000 people in the city,
[1:35:55] and
[1:35:57] I need to deliver a balanced budget to the city commission,
[1:36:00] one that makes economic sense, and
[1:36:03] of course, community sense.
[1:36:06] And as I started looking at the data related to
[1:36:09] the
[1:36:11] library, and I appreciate Commissioner Turning's point.
[1:36:15] The
[1:36:16] visitors remained
[1:36:20] flat. The costs were going up.
[1:36:23] The number of participants per program was trending
[1:36:27] down.
[1:36:28] The number of the books were trending down year after year,
[1:36:32] so they did a little bit of a hump. There was a rise in digital
[1:36:36] And
[1:36:39] there is
[1:36:41] a completely different economic condition that is present right now than was
[1:36:44] present two years ago. We had a war,
[1:36:47] or have a war. I don't mean to use past tense.
[1:36:51] There's inflation, supply chain
[1:36:54] issues that have driven up costs. And while
[1:36:58] CPI, we don't buy loaves of bread, we don't buy gallons of
[1:37:02] milk. We don't buy household goods.
[1:37:04] We buy things that are made out of petroleum. We buy concrete and steel.
[1:37:08] We buy pine wood. We buy materials
[1:37:12] that
[1:37:13] are made from petroleum products and the like.
[1:37:16] Plus, healthcare has expanded 21%, and this
[1:37:19] year's estimate was 29% on top of last year's 21%.
[1:37:23] So the law enforcement budget, there was a gentleman here earlier who said
[1:37:27] our law enforcement budget was $124 million.
[1:37:31] Our whole budget's not that big.
[1:37:34] Our whole budget is 122. 122. Yes.
[1:37:38] And- You misspoke ... the law
[1:37:43] enforcement- We know. Yeah ... budget is 22 million,
[1:37:46] and that is 100% of all the property taxes we collect here in
[1:37:50] the city from not just residents, but businesses.
[1:37:54] So,
[1:37:56] in fact, the law enforcement budget is
[1:37:58] 100.33% of the total property
[1:38:02] taxes that we take in.
[1:38:04] So,
[1:38:06] I have to balance stuff. So I started
[1:38:10] in our staff. I think many of you
[1:38:13] heard we proposed to remove Red Hot and Boom from the budget and
[1:38:19] the library. And we struggled with what are the places, what could
[1:38:23] we do? And where we landed was not
[1:38:26] closing the library and having nothing.
[1:38:30] What we started thinking about doing after
[1:38:34] we looked at $750,000, a lot of
[1:38:38] you have talked about libraries and other...
[1:38:41] Maitland borrowed $14 million to build
[1:38:45] the library that they just broke ground on.
[1:38:48] We are a debt-free city, and one of the reasons why we're a debt-free city
[1:38:52] is we try to do pay as you go. We save along the way.
[1:38:55] We try to
[1:39:00] do what
[1:39:03] others communities don't do. They find themselves in a position where they're
[1:39:06] paying debt service instead of for service.
[1:39:09] So that is
[1:39:11] a decades long, 15 years we've been debt-free.
[1:39:17] So what we looked at doing,
[1:39:22] because
[1:39:24] the services themselves are really important,
[1:39:29] we started looking at how do we take some of those library
[1:39:33] services and move them to another place that has more traffic.
[1:39:37] So while where we have evolved to
[1:39:41] is
[1:39:42] the proposed budget is not going to eliminate all library
[1:39:46] services. We're going to try to move as many as we can to Westmont Park,
[1:39:50] where we have annual traffic of about
[1:39:53] 250,000 ins and outs, visitors.
[1:39:58] We have, for this year, right around 32,000
[1:40:02] at the library.
[1:40:04] We have
[1:40:06] 100,000 just in the spring at Eastmont.
[1:40:10] So in one year, we have
[1:40:13] more people going in and out in the spring of Eastmont than the library has for
[1:40:16] three years, all total. So what we are going
[1:40:20] to do is propose having library
[1:40:23] services that we can have at Westmont, and we think
[1:40:27] that it's going to expose library services
[1:40:31] to a broader number of people, and a couple of people talked about
[1:40:35] younger people and seniors. We already
[1:40:39] have youth programs and senior programs at Westmont
[1:40:43] Park. So there's a perfect tie together,
[1:40:48] taking out the feelings about the library place.
[1:40:54] That's what we're going to propose.
[1:40:56] And
[1:40:58] we also have to think about just the overall economics.
[1:41:02] Our library is proposed to cost about
[1:41:05] $750,000 with all of what we put into
[1:41:10] the whole cost.
[1:41:12] I learned today from the director of budget management,
[1:41:17] the budget director at OMB for the Seminole County,
[1:41:22] how much
[1:41:24] Altamonte Springs businesses and residents paid in property
[1:41:28] taxes to support the library
[1:41:32] system that exists in Seminole County.
[1:41:34] It's $545,000.
[1:41:38] And as I sit and look at what am I going to propose as
[1:41:42] a responsible chief executive here in the city,
[1:41:45] that's almost $1.3 million in library services,
[1:41:49] and we've not seen any uptick in the use of it.
[1:41:52] So
[1:41:55] my goal was how do we get some services used better?
[1:41:59] And if we put them at Westmont Park, we think we
[1:42:02] certainly get more eyeballs looking at
[1:42:06] it. We already have those youth programs and senior programs there.
[1:42:09] People talked about
[1:42:11] job applications. Some of you, if you've been in the library, you know that we
[1:42:15] moved in CareerSource from Central Florida
[1:42:18] to try to drive traffic there.
[1:42:22] And they have a little more than 500 people, about 386
[1:42:26] unique people, I think that's the number.
[1:42:28] But that's great.
[1:42:30] We've talked to them about potentially moving to Westmont too.
[1:42:34] They want to stay in the area if they can.
[1:42:37] So-
[1:42:39] This is a really wrenching decision, you'll read that in my transmittal,
[1:42:43] for me and for our team to recommend this.
[1:42:47] But the reason why there are budgets every year is because economic
[1:42:51] conditions change every year. And the
[1:42:55] funding that was raised by the city commission
[1:42:59] to stabilize that particular budget,
[1:43:03] it absolutely did that. And in fact, it did it
[1:43:07] for a second year. And I was asked that in our actual budget
[1:43:11] hearings, and I said, "Yes, we're good for one, two, maybe three
[1:43:15] years."
[1:43:16] This is the third year, and the economic conditions are
[1:43:20] different than they were two years ago, and even last year.
[1:43:23] So, that is some of the background.
[1:43:24] I appreciate Commissioner Attorney's point, and I
[1:43:28] will be transmitting
[1:43:30] all of those details and all of that data
[1:43:34] in my transmittal memo that will go to the city commission on Friday.
[1:43:38] So I appreciate you
[1:43:40] pointing that out.
[1:43:40] Thank you for the thorough answer.
[1:43:44] Did that satisfy your question? Did you get the answer you-
[1:43:48] Commissioner Jones
[1:43:48] ... Are you happy with that?
[1:43:51] Yes, no? Okay.
[1:43:51] Yeah.
[1:43:52] I just wanted to-
[1:43:52] No, I'm not.
[1:43:53] Okay. All right. We did our best. Thank you.
[1:43:57] Getting rid of red hot boom,
[1:44:00] and we're still short.
[1:44:03] Mayor, could I-
[1:44:04] Yes.
[1:44:06] I was planning on addressing the library during my report.
[1:44:09] Mm-hmm.
[1:44:10] Should I do it then, or now that it's come up
[1:44:12] out of line? Do you want me to talk about it now, or what's your pleasure?
[1:44:16] Go ahead.
[1:44:16] Okay.
[1:44:19] So commissioners,
[1:44:21] I was planning on talking about the library even before all the comments because,
[1:44:24] as you know, I was not at the June 24th budget workshop that you had
[1:44:29] Wednesday morning on June 24th. I had a work obligation I had to be
[1:44:33] at, couldn't make that meeting.
[1:44:36] For future reference, it's just a discussion for another day.
[1:44:40] We should probably have those meetings not during a Wednesday morning.
[1:44:43] But like I said, I couldn't be there because of a work commitment.
[1:44:47] I did have a makeup session with staff on July 7th.
[1:44:50] Hmm.
[1:44:51] At that July 7th meeting, I let staff know that I would be voting
[1:44:55] against any budget that did not fully fund the library.
[1:44:58] That's still my position.
[1:45:01] Just to recap
[1:45:04] the legislative intent or my intent behind what happened two
[1:45:08] years ago.
[1:45:09] As Mr. Martz mentioned, I'm the one that called the special meeting-
[1:45:12] Mm-hmm
[1:45:13] ... two years ago to
[1:45:16] discuss raising the millage.
[1:45:19] The idea of raising taxes is against everything I stand for.
[1:45:22] The reason why I did that is because I had dozens and
[1:45:26] dozens and dozens of citizens calling me, stopping up at my home,
[1:45:30] asking me to do something to save the library.
[1:45:33] So that's why I called that special meeting. We had the discussion.
[1:45:37] I'm the one that made the motion to increase our millage rate by
[1:45:41] .9 mills. The idea behind that,
[1:45:45] in talking with the city manager, and I knew the issue that we had, or the issues
[1:45:49] we were having and the problems we were facing with our police department, with
[1:45:53] funding for our police department.
[1:45:55] So my intent was to package those together, to save the
[1:45:59] library, to fund the library, and then with the extra money,
[1:46:03] to stabilize our police funding. But the
[1:46:06] reason for the special meeting, the reason for the motion, first and
[1:46:10] foremost, was to save the library.
[1:46:12] Anything extra was to stabilize police funding.
[1:46:15] Mm-hmm.
[1:46:16] There's nobody calling me, no citizens asking us to raise the millage rate
[1:46:20] to stabilize our police funding. Nobody cared about that.
[1:46:24] Even the police department, nobody was asking me from the police department.
[1:46:28] It was because our residents asked
[1:46:31] to raise their taxes. Which still, thinking back, I just
[1:46:35] can't believe they even did that.
[1:46:37] Mm-hmm.
[1:46:38] It blows my mind, but that's what they wanted.
[1:46:41] If we're now not going to fund the library, let's
[1:46:44] restore the millage rate to what it was before, and then if we want to have the
[1:46:48] discussion about raising it again just for police only, let's do that.
[1:46:52] But let somebody else make the motion.
[1:46:54] So
[1:46:56] like I said, I'm going to vote no on any proposed budget that doesn't include full
[1:47:00] funding. I was planning on
[1:47:03] making these comments on September 3rd when we were scheduled to talk about it,
[1:47:07] but-
[1:47:07] Mm-hmm
[1:47:07] ... obviously we started early. But
[1:47:11] again, if we're not going to do that, let's return the millage rate to
[1:47:14] 3.1, and then at that same meeting, if one of you wants to
[1:47:19] raise it again to 4.0 for the purposes of police funding and
[1:47:23] then whatever else,
[1:47:25] let's have that discussion there.
[1:47:26] But the intent two years ago was to save the library.
[1:47:30] The community support that we got was to save the library,
[1:47:34] and anything beyond--
[1:47:37] Closing the library doesn't honor that
[1:47:41] request that we heard from our citizens, and
[1:47:45] I think it's a bait and switch. So I wasn't going to speak this much like
[1:47:49] I said, but this kind of went out of order, and
[1:47:53] that's where I am on it just so that everyone knows, and
[1:47:56] look forward to continued discussion on September 3rd.
[1:48:04] Power.
[1:48:07] Well, if we're going to continue library conversation-
[1:48:10] We have--
[1:48:11] Can we have him come up first?
[1:48:13] Sure. Go right ahead.
[1:48:13] Thank you.
[1:48:19] Hi, Joseph Charles, 425 Center Point Circle.
[1:48:23] I just want to thank everyone here for listening to all of our concerns.
[1:48:26] We're all neighbors here, and we trust that you listen to our concerns.
[1:48:30] So I'd just like to kindly ask that when you all review the tape, go back and
[1:48:34] listen to the comments made tonight.
[1:48:36] Instead of looking for rebuttals based on audits and court cases, really listen
[1:48:40] to why we're concerned about this.
[1:48:43] We don't want to live in a surveillance state where innocent people have their
[1:48:46] license plate, their daily schedules, things they do every day tracked in a
[1:48:50] database, and they have no option to opt in or opt out to
[1:48:54] it
[1:48:55] These are concerns that we have regardless of perfect audits, regardless
[1:48:59] of... I understand we do have the best police department.
[1:49:02] I firmly believe that. I love our police here, and
[1:49:07] I want them to have the tools to catch criminals,
[1:49:10] but this is not the way. We need to protect our innocent
[1:49:14] citizens, the people of Altamonte Springs.
[1:49:17] Listen to your neighbors who've come here tonight and taken the stage
[1:49:21] and voiced their opinion of why this concerns them.
[1:49:24] It's not an easy thing to do to come up here and to
[1:49:27] explain what that is that they're afraid of, what it
[1:49:31] is that keeps them up at night.
[1:49:34] Commissioner Reese, I promise you, once you've seen one flock camera, you can't
[1:49:37] unsee them.
[1:49:39] So I'd like to kindly ask that-
[1:49:41] I'm going to look them up when I leave.
[1:49:43] I'm going to Google them.
[1:49:46] Far.
[1:49:46] I'd like to kindly ask that everyone here please review the tape and
[1:49:50] really take a moment to understand why we're concerned about these cameras,
[1:49:54] and let's rip these things out of the ground.
[1:49:56] Hear hear.
[1:49:57] Thank you.
[1:50:02] Chairman.
[1:50:05] I'll wait till we do individual reports.
[1:50:07] All right.
[1:50:09] Does anyone else wish to speak? Yes, sir.
[1:50:16] Hello, my name is Marcus.
[1:50:18] A resident of 30 years of Altamonte, Apopka, Maitland, all
[1:50:22] abroad.
[1:50:24] Been a Floridian my whole life.
[1:50:28] And
[1:50:30] security increases all the time. We always have traffic cameras.
[1:50:34] We have CNN cameras. We have Fox News cameras. We have traffic light cameras.
[1:50:40] Everything like that. But these flock cameras, you say they're DHS.
[1:50:43] So that means you guys have the contract,
[1:50:47] but
[1:50:49] the footage is going to DHS.
[1:50:51] That's federal, that's CIA, that's FBI.
[1:50:55] Your phones are no different. My phone has been tracking me since 2008.
[1:51:00] You can go into your system, your SIM card tracks everything.
[1:51:03] Your IP address tracks everything.
[1:51:08] It's 2026. 2008, my same phone has been tracked, everything
[1:51:12] I have done.
[1:51:14] There's nothing that you can do about it. Your license plate's everywhere.
[1:51:19] We can cut them down and all that kind of stuff, but there's no need for that.
[1:51:22] We don't need this stuff in here. If you're getting rid of $750,000,
[1:51:26] what are you doing with that? Also,
[1:51:30] how much is a DHS budget yearly?
[1:51:34] What does that go to? How many cameras can that put up?
[1:51:38] If a camera costs like 2,500 bucks a pop
[1:51:41] and say $750,000,
[1:51:45] 250 cams
[1:51:48] from 22-ish right now.
[1:51:50] So,
[1:51:51] I don't know.
[1:51:53] It's just not cool.
[1:51:56] That's it.
[1:51:57] Amen.
[1:51:57] Thank you.
[1:51:59] Appreciate it.
[1:52:00] Woo.
[1:52:06] Anyone else?
[1:52:24] Hi, my name is Michael Hairston. I reside in 32750.
[1:52:28] I just have one request is for your report, Mr. Martz.
[1:52:32] Again, well, thank you all for your service.
[1:52:34] Appreciate you all listening to us tonight.
[1:52:36] We greatly appreciate it, or at least I do.
[1:52:39] But one thing I have to ask, regardless of what everyone else has said, on top of
[1:52:43] that, one thing I request in your report is to see the
[1:52:47] efficiency of these flock cameras.
[1:52:49] Because if they're not doing anything, on top of everything else, if they're not
[1:52:52] reducing the crime rate, what's the point of having them?
[1:52:55] And that's pretty much all I have to say, and I would request,
[1:52:59] can I have a business card, Mr. Martz, please? Sorry.
[1:53:03] But that's all I have to really say.
[1:53:04] Thank you.
[1:53:05] Thank you.
[1:53:13] Anyone else?
[1:53:18] Thank you, all. I will
[1:53:20] start our reports
[1:53:22] to our attorney.
[1:53:23] Nothing from me tonight.
[1:53:24] Thank you. Ms. Angie?
[1:53:26] Nothing, thank you.
[1:53:28] Mr. Martz?
[1:53:28] I have a couple of things.
[1:53:31] First of all, it's great to see everybody out here and the concern that they
[1:53:35] have. And,
[1:53:37] in the events of two years ago and then the preparation of the
[1:53:41] budget,
[1:53:43] what I probably should have done, and I've had this conversation with Commissioner
[1:53:46] O'Malley, is I should have
[1:53:49] presented a tax increase then for the
[1:53:53] police needs that were present then. I was going to try to work that through.
[1:53:58] And as I discussed with Commissioner O'Malley, the reason why
[1:54:02] I suggested we do all of those things is because,
[1:54:07] first of all, they were real needs.
[1:54:10] Second, the importance of
[1:54:14] the budget process and trying to do them together from a fiscal standpoint made
[1:54:18] some sense. So, that's the reason I did it,
[1:54:22] and we had pretty extensive conversations along the way with all of
[1:54:25] us, just about how
[1:54:28] we were
[1:54:31] trying to move forward. And we had, obviously, extensive conversation from
[1:54:36] the community,
[1:54:38] those people who came to those meetings.
[1:54:42] And so really appreciate everybody coming tonight.
[1:54:46] I have a couple of other things that I want to let
[1:54:50] you know about.
[1:54:52] A couple are sad, and
[1:54:55] one is really, really good. I will tell you one informational item.
[1:54:59] You may have seen that the Department of Emergency Management-
[1:55:03] Mm-hmm
[1:55:03] ... director
[1:55:05] left That is a concern, obviously, for us because
[1:55:09] talking to Commissioner Turney a little bit earlier,
[1:55:12] the preparation for hurricane season,
[1:55:17] this is the middle of August, so as we start to prepare for
[1:55:22] hurricane season.
[1:55:24] The person who's taking it over is Secretary Perdue.
[1:55:27] Right.
[1:55:27] We all know him, and he's just a highly skilled and competent person.
[1:55:33] But
[1:55:34] there is change afoot, so I wanted to let everybody know if you
[1:55:39] had not seen that.
[1:55:40] We'll make sure that we stay on top of what's happening with the state and making
[1:55:43] sure that coordination
[1:55:45] remains in place. I have
[1:55:48] two
[1:55:49] somewhat sad things to
[1:55:52] report to you. The first, as you know, Dorothy Hussey passed away.
[1:55:55] She was the wife of former Commissioner Gardner Hussey.
[1:55:59] Yeah.
[1:56:00] And I
[1:56:02] have that funeral program, if anybody would like to see it.
[1:56:07] Tiffany Bryan, who some of you may know, a longtime chemist for the city,
[1:56:10] her husband passed away unexpectedly.
[1:56:14] And just keep her in your thoughts and your prayers, if you don't mind.
[1:56:17] The recess approvals are in front of you.
[1:56:19] The bright moment that I'd like to report
[1:56:23] to you is we have a police cadet named Jackson
[1:56:27] Soper, who was driving
[1:56:30] back on I-95,
[1:56:33] and noticed a car that had left the highway and gone into a
[1:56:37] retention pond. And he stopped, and went into the
[1:56:41] water, and saved two individuals who would've drowned.
[1:56:44] Mm.
[1:56:44] And
[1:56:46] at great risk because the car was in the process of sinking.
[1:56:50] So it's
[1:56:52] one of those moments
[1:56:56] where you tack it on to the other times that I was telling all of
[1:57:00] you about the contractor who had a heart attack in the middle of the street,
[1:57:04] and our employees stepped in and performed life-saving
[1:57:08] measures.
[1:57:10] And a lot of the other things many of our employees do day in and day out.
[1:57:14] But
[1:57:15] Jackson Soper went into the water at great risk to himself, and
[1:57:19] he saved those folks, and deserves to be
[1:57:23] recognized.
[1:57:23] Yeah.
[1:57:24] I wanted to make sure that was on the record.
[1:57:26] So if you'd like to see Dorothy's...
[1:57:30] Some of you were at the funeral. If you'd like to see Dorothy's funeral
[1:57:34] guide, it'll be in Amanda's office.
[1:57:37] Thank you.
[1:57:41] Commissioner O'Malley, do you have anything else?
[1:57:44] No, I certainly do not.
[1:57:45] Thank you. Appreciate it.
[1:57:47] Commissioner Reece.
[1:57:49] I don't have anything extra tonight. Thank you.
[1:57:51] Thank you.
[1:57:52] Commissioner Turney.
[1:57:54] Yes, I have to tell you all that I really appreciate,
[1:57:59] more than you'll ever know, that you're here tonight, especially
[1:58:03] the folks who've come to talk about the surveillance
[1:58:06] cameras.
[1:58:10] It has been an issue for me, a strong issue for me,
[1:58:14] for 25 years,
[1:58:16] and it really
[1:58:18] feels good to know that other people are starting to care.
[1:58:23] I don't want to dig into that any further, but we could be here all night if I did.
[1:58:27] So I'll just leave it at that. I really appreciate that you're
[1:58:31] here speaking out, and
[1:58:35] it is
[1:58:36] a significant issue, and it's not the only one, unfortunately, but
[1:58:40] it is one that people can see, and even Commissioner Reece will start
[1:58:44] probably seeing it now.
[1:58:48] And there's so many things that are surveillance that people
[1:58:52] don't see.
[1:58:55] But it's very comprehensive, more
[1:58:59] comprehensive than most people are aware of.
[1:59:04] So that's
[1:59:06] it. I just want to tell you how much I appreciate your being here and speaking out.
[1:59:10] Thank you.
[1:59:15] Commissioner Brunschwig.
[1:59:17] Well, I'm thankful for everybody attending, bringing their issues to the light of
[1:59:20] day of their opinion on Flock, the library, and some other things as
[1:59:24] well.
[1:59:26] This is the forum to hear them, and this is how we institute change and move
[1:59:30] forward to try to do better for our city, for our families, and to
[1:59:34] move forward into the future.
[1:59:39] The library is a challenge. It's $750,000.
[1:59:43] It's a large amount of money.
[1:59:45] It lives over here in the east.
[1:59:48] I spoke about it two years ago when there was talk of possibly moving City Hall.
[1:59:52] It doesn't need to go away. It needs to be centralized and reimagined to have the
[1:59:56] services that are used, to have the right things in place
[2:00:00] and be taken advantage of.
[2:00:02] I see merit to the Westmont Park move to maintain some of those
[2:00:06] services.
[2:00:09] I also know that there is a county library 2.6 miles away from our
[2:00:13] current city library. There's also a county library on the west side,
[2:00:17] so there is some duplicate services.
[2:00:19] And I think we also have to respect people that live on the other side of
[2:00:23] I-4 in the west side of Altamonte.
[2:00:26] What library are they going to? Do they utilize the city library?
[2:00:30] Are they going to the county library over there?
[2:00:33] There's a lot of information that we need to scale down and really take a look at.
[2:00:38] And then on the Flock cameras,
[2:00:40] tons of information, so well warranted, and I am
[2:00:44] curious for all of the answers. I would like one
[2:00:47] clarification and just to make sure, because I think Mr.
[2:00:50] Mert said it before, we have no facial recognition in the city
[2:00:54] currently. Is that correct?
[2:00:55] No.
[2:00:56] None. Okay. Just to clarify, because that was brought up in there,
[2:01:00] that it's license plate readers. So
[2:01:03] that's all I have at this time. I look forward to continuing conversations,
[2:01:07] exploring solutions for the library.
[2:01:09] Nobody's burning a pile of books. Books are not going away.
[2:01:13] I work next door to the library. My kids go to the library.
[2:01:16] It's important to me and my family.
[2:01:18] It's figuring out the best way for it to be the
[2:01:22] best library it can be for the entire city, not for part
[2:01:26] of the city, because we have other resources.
[2:01:29] So how do we pour the fuel into the engine that's performing
[2:01:32] well and trim the fat that's not doing well?
[2:01:37] Take it from the east and put it in the west, and now the east
[2:01:42] It's more centralizing is what I like to see, but I want to see the data.
[2:01:46] I'm not sitting up here and making a decision one way or another.
[2:01:49] I want to see additional data of-
[2:01:51] Putting it in the west is centralizing it. Yeah.
[2:01:56] It depends on where density of the city is and where our population
[2:02:00] is. So I'm glad to look at the data and what we see and come
[2:02:04] forth with a solid answer for it.
[2:02:06] What should the attendance rate be at the library per year?
[2:02:10] Is it too low now?
[2:02:13] We need 20,000 more a year
[2:02:17] to make it important?
[2:02:20] I don't know if there's a clear answer for that, but we have to respect the budget
[2:02:24] and the money that goes into it.
[2:02:26] Look into advertising for the library?
[2:02:30] Does the population know about the programs?
[2:02:34] Mr. Martz, I believe you had data that we've increased
[2:02:37] significantly over the last two years of advertising and increased programs,
[2:02:40] correct?
[2:02:41] Yes. We've increased advertising around
[2:02:45] 190%. If you divide up the amount of
[2:02:48] advertising of different types, email, e-blasts,
[2:02:52] magazines, posters, graphics,
[2:02:56] and you divided them equally through the year, we're
[2:02:59] producing about 19 different
[2:03:03] outputs every week
[2:03:05] just about the library.
[2:03:07] When you talk about moving services-
[2:03:10] We need you all. If you're going to talk, we need you on the public
[2:03:13] record. I'm sorry, but-
[2:03:15] Public. It's over.
[2:03:17] We're actually closed, all that, but-
[2:03:20] Right
[2:03:21] ...
[2:03:23] I will let you speak because I-
[2:03:24] Thank you. It's a real quick
[2:03:26] question.
[2:03:29] Jude Stevens, 32714. When you talk
[2:03:34] about
[2:03:35] relocating some of the important services,
[2:03:39] are we including books in that or not including, or just the services?
[2:03:44] I think that remains to be determined so far.
[2:03:46] Okay, thanks.
[2:03:47] Thank you, ma'am. Thank you.
[2:03:51] One more.
[2:03:51] Mayor.
[2:03:52] Okay.
[2:03:53] You're in city commission comments. You're not in public comments.
[2:03:57] I realize that. I don't like to turn
[2:04:00] anybody away who may have missed something.
[2:04:04] Last one.
[2:04:08] Thank you. I'm Patty Gable, 32701.
[2:04:12] I understand you said that the city of Altamonte
[2:04:16] has no facial recognition. However,
[2:04:20] those cameras are DHS.
[2:04:23] My question, if someone could find an answer,
[2:04:28] that does not mean that
[2:04:31] DHS does not do facial recognition.
[2:04:34] And if the equipment right now does not do that,
[2:04:39] it's a software modification to incorporate that.
[2:04:43] So I would like to know...
[2:04:45] Thank you.
[2:04:48] So I would like to know if we can find that information out.
[2:04:51] That's unbelievably critical.
[2:04:54] Well, I-
[2:04:55] I don't want anyone taking my face-
[2:04:57] I get your question
[2:04:58] ... and using my information on me. I don't think so.
[2:05:02] I don't live in a communist country.
[2:05:05] I moved away from one, actually,
[2:05:07] and that's how I can appreciate this.
[2:05:11] But we need to be careful that we don't go there.
[2:05:14] So if we could find that information out, that would be wonderful.
[2:05:18] Thank you.
[2:05:24] I allowed something that I wasn't supposed to allow.
[2:05:27] Thank you.
[2:05:28] But
[2:05:30] I just feel like you all are-
[2:05:32] That's why you're mayor
[2:05:33] ... important.
[2:05:33] Engaged.
[2:05:33] And
[2:05:36] now it's my turn.
[2:05:42] I want to let you all know, you
[2:05:46] don't know this, but I brag on all of you all the time, our
[2:05:50] citizens.
[2:05:52] I'm
[2:05:53] really involved with the Florida League of Cities, which is all
[2:05:57] 411 cities. And some of the stories that I have heard
[2:06:01] at meetings like this
[2:06:03] would curl your hair
[2:06:05] at the disrespect that citizens have had for people sitting up
[2:06:09] here.
[2:06:11] I appreciate more than you know
[2:06:15] the respect that you all had this evening for two
[2:06:19] items that were really, really important to you and you felt
[2:06:23] strongly about them. We never heard a cross word.
[2:06:27] I can't tell you how many times I have sat back and listened to
[2:06:31] other people in other cities, and I say, "Well, we
[2:06:35] don't have citizens like that." And so you are
[2:06:38] appreciated, and so if you come back to another meeting,
[2:06:43] I've put you on notice, because I'm sure you'll be back.
[2:06:46] But it's important
[2:06:49] to me that you know
[2:06:53] you're a special group of people, and it's one of the things that I
[2:06:57] have admired for
[2:07:00] years
[2:07:02] about this city is that
[2:07:05] between our citizens and our staff,
[2:07:08] we truly have the best people, and I'm so
[2:07:11] proud to be a part of this city. So thank you
[2:07:15] all. Thank you to staff tonight. You are deeply
[2:07:19] appreciated. And with that, we stand adjourned.
[2:07:22] Thank
[2:07:23] you.