1
00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:12,840
I'm using plastic tubing, and that's what we're continuing to do down at the beach, other places where it's copper. Yeah, yeah, polyethylene, some type, yeah, plastic. That's what plastic is good. Classics my favorite metal.

2
00:15:17,290 --> 00:15:22,490
Something just slipped my mind. Thank you, sorry. I was going to go to a different question.

3
00:15:22,490 --> 00:15:30,390
Oh, I'm aware, or at least I'm told, that a lot of these streets have recently been paved over.

4
00:15:31,170 --> 00:15:31,930
Like recently.

5
00:15:33,390 --> 00:15:35,430
How do you handle recently pungos?

6
00:15:35,870 --> 00:15:38,910
Unfortunately, it seems to be something that happens every time in the utilities.

7
00:15:38,930 --> 00:15:39,370
I know, right.

8
00:15:39,870 --> 00:15:45,530
I can ask for an extension, but I do know on some of those streets, I've just learned this week that

9
00:15:45,530 --> 00:15:51,030
town has potentially some plans which would result in them digging up the same street.

10
00:15:51,030 --> 00:15:53,510
So we'll need to work with the town on it.

11
00:15:54,010 --> 00:16:02,430
A lot of these streets are pretty narrow and our trench plus services really end up impacting the whole street.

12
00:16:02,650 --> 00:16:04,390
So we would be repaying it anyway.

13
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So we're really going to have to work with the town on that and which order that we do these streets in.

14
00:16:11,170 --> 00:16:11,470
Okay.

15
00:16:12,330 --> 00:16:13,490
That's what I needed to know.

16
00:16:16,160 --> 00:16:22,080
How will residents and property owners be aware or how much notice will they have?

17
00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:33,020
I mean, we typically try to give them at least a month notice, send out notifications, let them know the work is happening.

18
00:16:33,820 --> 00:16:43,220
This work will be in most situations, we're digging the new main and then abandoning the old main.

19
00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:49,680
So it's like the very minimal impact of water service, so the impact's really the construction in and out of the street.

20
00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:50,000
So.

21
00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:50,580
Just

22
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curious.

23
00:16:56,350 --> 00:17:00,910
So in briar, you had a plastic pipe going in and ductalized.

24
00:17:03,070 --> 00:17:04,010
That's an error.

25
00:17:04,290 --> 00:17:06,690
It's all going to be ductile on briar.

26
00:17:06,990 --> 00:17:07,270
Okay.

27
00:17:07,590 --> 00:17:07,690
Yeah.

28
00:17:09,730 --> 00:17:10,970
With the choice of materials.

29
00:17:12,110 --> 00:17:18,430
The HTTP, the plastic pipe we use down at the beach, it's just because we have corrosive

30
00:17:18,430 --> 00:17:23,290
wetlands, soils down there, or just more concerns about the pipe degrading.

31
00:17:23,290 --> 00:17:28,670
And in general, we like working with the ductile iron pipe better.

32
00:17:28,890 --> 00:17:30,330
So that's what we use if we're upland.

33
00:17:31,430 --> 00:17:39,840
So at the end of Keith, you left some cast iron by the hunter.

34
00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:41,120
That's also labeled wrong.

35
00:17:41,300 --> 00:17:44,820
So that end of Keith is a fairly new development.

36
00:17:44,820 --> 00:17:46,660
So that's ductile in there.

37
00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:51,220
And that's one of the markups on the plants that changed that ductile.

38
00:17:53,970 --> 00:18:00,590
Some of the plans that we have seen recently show the water level, all of these streets

39
00:18:00,590 --> 00:18:09,150
of Ashworth are flood so often, show the water level at 2050, right, projected water

40
00:18:09,150 --> 00:18:14,730
levels, and we just show the boundaries.

41
00:18:14,930 --> 00:18:23,870
Now, the wetland permit says, what does this mean, a property-specific map showing M

42
00:18:23,870 --> 00:18:27,490
I'm HHW plus two feet, means high water.

43
00:18:27,490 --> 00:18:34,870
Mean high water plus two feet sea level, and the coastal viewer application that they can refer to for that, and that's what the links for.

44
00:18:37,250 --> 00:18:38,590
Is that supposed to be on the map?

45
00:18:42,970 --> 00:18:45,750
Seems they checked it, so it should be in the packet, right?

46
00:18:46,130 --> 00:18:46,270
Yeah.

47
00:18:47,090 --> 00:18:49,830
Yeah, M-H-H-W is mean high water,

48
00:18:52,330 --> 00:18:57,970
so it's like, it's the mean, but it's the highest it can get to be an average.

49
00:18:58,930 --> 00:19:06,850
It doesn't make any sense that I didn't see it in there anyway, I have to do two foot

50
00:19:06,850 --> 00:19:07,250
levels.

51
00:19:08,410 --> 00:19:10,110
They do have it in the back at this.

52
00:19:11,950 --> 00:19:12,490
What is that?

53
00:19:13,590 --> 00:19:16,030
Poor the end of the foot, the end of the foot, the end of the foot.

54
00:19:16,030 --> 00:19:17,770
So you

55
00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:26,920
want that on the plan, John?

56
00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:30,520
No, as long as it's a show and somewhere, okay,

57
00:19:49,490 --> 00:19:51,390
do you know where it is on the side lines?

58
00:19:52,470 --> 00:19:54,810
I don't think it's on, I don't think it's on the drawings, right?

59
00:19:54,810 --> 00:19:57,870
I don't think it's in wire, but it's just what you provided in the packets.

60
00:19:57,870 --> 00:19:59,090
So that was the requirement.

61
00:19:59,970 --> 00:20:00,270
Okay.

62
00:20:01,290 --> 00:20:01,690
Okay.

63
00:20:02,170 --> 00:20:02,410
It's in there.

64
00:20:02,410 --> 00:20:04,170
We may have an abbreviated packet.

65
00:20:04,490 --> 00:20:04,670
Yeah.

66
00:20:05,310 --> 00:20:05,630
Yeah.

67
00:20:05,630 --> 00:20:06,710
We'll be talking about flooding.

68
00:20:06,770 --> 00:20:07,870
My pile is hectic.

69
00:20:08,250 --> 00:20:08,410
Yeah.

70
00:20:08,670 --> 00:20:10,850
Yeah, it was in the file copy.

71
00:20:11,010 --> 00:20:11,430
It was all there.

72
00:20:12,030 --> 00:20:12,790
Twenty-fifty.

73
00:20:12,950 --> 00:20:14,250
And it would be, I believe there's a lot.

74
00:20:14,370 --> 00:20:14,670
Yeah.

75
00:20:14,990 --> 00:20:15,190
Two.

76
00:20:15,750 --> 00:20:16,050
So.

77
00:20:16,430 --> 00:20:16,510
Yeah.

78
00:20:19,190 --> 00:20:20,030
That's all I have.

79
00:20:21,690 --> 00:20:23,190
Any other questions on the board?

80
00:20:24,710 --> 00:20:27,490
Is anyone here from the public who would like to address this?

81
00:20:28,770 --> 00:20:34,230
Could you please go over to the podium and give us your name and address?

82
00:20:43,180 --> 00:20:43,940
Oh, including me.

83
00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:46,840
I name Stan Walczyk, live on Bragg Ave.

84
00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:48,980
I have a few questions.

85
00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:56,960
It says you're going to dig up the street and you're going to restore to existing

86
00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:02,800
conditions. Is that mean you're just gonna pave what you dig up or you're gonna

87
00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:08,660
pave the whole street? We typically work with the town to see what they

88
00:21:08,660 --> 00:21:13,160
require. In this case a lot of these streets are fairly narrow so by the time

89
00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:17,720
we're done we're torn up a lot of the street and we just repaved the whole of it.

90
00:21:18,020 --> 00:21:21,740
I'd have to double check the width on Brad to see exactly what I do there but we

91
00:21:21,740 --> 00:21:26,740
usually work with the town to see what's required. There's a town no now what

92
00:21:26,740 --> 00:21:29,780
So the requirements are, do we know?

93
00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:33,920
Well, I'm sorry, when I say town, it's the DPW, we usually work with them.

94
00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:36,380
Well, so you can't answer that question then.

95
00:21:36,940 --> 00:21:41,960
Well, I just want to check, I mean, we don't, I, yeah, I guess I can't answer that question right now.

96
00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:48,840
I mean, we definitely restore our trench, our, our trenches, but if the roads narrow enough, we just end up restoring

97
00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:50,640
whole paved width of the roadway.

98
00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:57,260
And also, is this going to be impact on a water bill?

99
00:21:57,940 --> 00:21:58,700
I mean-

100
00:21:58,700 --> 00:22:01,000
Oh, a water bill is going to increase because of this?

101
00:22:01,860 --> 00:22:04,900
Not immediately, but all the work that we do, right?

102
00:22:05,020 --> 00:22:10,740
And everything that goes into the water system ultimately someday goes into a rate case.

103
00:22:10,940 --> 00:22:15,940
But there's not one in the, you know, we don't know when the next rate case is going to be.

104
00:22:16,060 --> 00:22:16,820
I certainly don't.

105
00:22:16,940 --> 00:22:19,040
You don't know that question either, that's no.

106
00:22:25,430 --> 00:22:31,370
I think what she's trying to explain, if I can, I don't know if it's the right thing to do or not, but

107
00:22:32,950 --> 00:22:38,950
whatever construction they do goes into, it's out of the big budget, and at the end of the day they

108
00:22:38,950 --> 00:22:45,790
divvy up all those costs, every rate payer per squirt cubic foot or whatever our rate is correct.

109
00:22:45,790 --> 00:22:45,930
All right.

110
00:22:46,450 --> 00:22:46,850
Yeah.

111
00:22:47,110 --> 00:22:50,850
And they will not see an impact of an increase because they got into water line.

112
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Right.

113
00:22:51,930 --> 00:22:52,050
Yeah.

114
00:22:52,590 --> 00:22:52,710
No.

115
00:22:52,930 --> 00:22:53,590
Into your question.

116
00:22:55,270 --> 00:22:59,330
I just want to know if we're going to have an increase in the water bill.

117
00:23:00,150 --> 00:23:01,550
I mean, we used to get them once a year.

118
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Now they're every month.

119
00:23:04,730 --> 00:23:10,590
I mean, so in order to increase rates on water bill requires a rate case, right?

120
00:23:10,750 --> 00:23:12,890
And then that's a public hearing.

121
00:23:12,890 --> 00:23:14,830
and so that's a whole process, so.

122
00:23:15,270 --> 00:23:21,550
If I may, maybe a, is your question that you would specifically,

123
00:23:22,010 --> 00:23:25,310
your street, for example, be impacted,

124
00:23:25,770 --> 00:23:28,570
or are you looking at the rate at the general?

125
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Everybody as whole.

126
00:23:30,650 --> 00:23:32,990
Everybody, yeah, I think that's the point.

127
00:23:33,230 --> 00:23:37,470
No, I think the answer is, no, your specific street

128
00:23:37,470 --> 00:23:40,830
will not be impacted anymore than anyone else,

129
00:23:40,830 --> 00:23:52,070
But it will ultimately, as with everything else that the company would be doing, would be part of their ultimate rate that's charged to all rate payers.

130
00:23:52,710 --> 00:23:57,330
But that wouldn't happen until we went through a rate case and we don't have one planned.

131
00:23:57,730 --> 00:24:05,430
And I think what's what he needs to hear is a rate case aquarium is going to gather all their financial information.

132
00:24:05,430 --> 00:24:07,450
This is what it costs us to do this.

133
00:24:08,070 --> 00:24:12,130
The querian is guaranteed, I'm not sure what the word is,

134
00:24:12,350 --> 00:24:14,650
but they get a certain return on their investment.

135
00:24:15,390 --> 00:24:17,990
That goes to the Public Utilities Commission,

136
00:24:17,990 --> 00:24:19,930
which I believe is located and conquered.

137
00:24:20,670 --> 00:24:22,990
And they go to the Public Utilities Commission and say,

138
00:24:23,430 --> 00:24:25,710
we need a rate, we need to increase our rates

139
00:24:25,710 --> 00:24:27,030
to cover our costs.

140
00:24:27,530 --> 00:24:29,650
And it's up to the Public Utilities Commission

141
00:24:29,650 --> 00:24:32,410
to make that decision based on their input

142
00:24:32,410 --> 00:24:33,450
plus public comment.

143
00:24:33,450 --> 00:24:35,910
They may actually lower our rates.

144
00:24:38,110 --> 00:24:39,490
How about this?

145
00:24:39,670 --> 00:24:42,590
I want to go inside every house in Hampton.

146
00:24:43,170 --> 00:24:44,790
And I charge all the people to do it

147
00:24:44,790 --> 00:24:47,150
because it'll make Hampton look so much better.

148
00:24:47,710 --> 00:24:48,590
Same thing.

149
00:24:49,810 --> 00:24:51,830
The customer always pays.

150
00:24:55,980 --> 00:24:58,360
My understanding is that the reason they're replacing

151
00:24:58,360 --> 00:25:01,380
this water means is it's not some of you have water service.

152
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:03,140
No. It's like maintenance.

153
00:25:03,140 --> 00:25:14,920
Now, you're going to replace just a main water line or you're going to replace them to the meters, I mean, to the curve some property line.

154
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:15,980
So, we'll be in the water line.

155
00:25:15,980 --> 00:25:16,940
Right, into the property line.

156
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:21,120
Yeah, we'll replace the main line and then the services to the property line.

157
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:22,420
So, there'll be a new service up.

158
00:25:22,620 --> 00:25:24,460
You'll be digging up our front yards also.

159
00:25:25,040 --> 00:25:26,260
To your property line.

160
00:25:26,380 --> 00:25:27,020
To the property line.

161
00:25:28,300 --> 00:25:30,740
You'll have a valve in your front yard someplace.

162
00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:31,280
That's right.

163
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:32,900
Is it going to go places out there?

164
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:36,040
I hope it's a new valve.

165
00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:45,700
I really didn't get the answers I wanted.

166
00:25:47,300 --> 00:25:48,400
Again, may I...?

167
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,860
I mean, I can give you my information and you can call me directly.

168
00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:56,140
And I can try to get you better, you know, get you the answers you want

169
00:25:56,140 --> 00:25:57,880
or any other questions you have, too.

170
00:25:58,220 --> 00:26:00,020
And is that going to do me any good?

171
00:26:00,020 --> 00:26:03,780
I mean, I want the public to know this, not just me.

172
00:26:04,580 --> 00:26:07,520
To know, what do you want them to know, can you?

173
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:08,300
What is the concern?

174
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:12,640
My concern is, you're going to dig up the middle of the street and

175
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:17,400
you're going to, we don't know if we're just going to go and

176
00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:19,560
pay that, or pay the whole street.

177
00:26:20,580 --> 00:26:23,140
That's still up the grabs, okay?

178
00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:26,620
And now it's going to impact everybody's water bill.

179
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:31,140
Not now, but it's going to know how much is that going to be.

180
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:32,960
Those are my questions.

181
00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:38,420
So how much this particular project impacts the water bill is not,

182
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:45,900
you're right, it's not something I can answer because water rate changes are not based on any one project.

183
00:26:46,140 --> 00:26:50,420
It's everything, every improvement that goes into the water system.

184
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:55,280
So it isn't something that can be answered until a rate case is filed and

185
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,860
We don't have one planned at the moment.

186
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:00,280
Now, how about the storage lines, aren't they, right?

187
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:02,120
Conjunctions with the water lines?

188
00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:03,100
The town.

189
00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:04,060
That's the town.

190
00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:06,240
The homes that you maintain, the sewer lines.

191
00:27:09,660 --> 00:27:09,900
Okay.

192
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:12,120
Thank you.

193
00:27:12,460 --> 00:27:12,740
Thank you.

194
00:27:17,460 --> 00:27:17,900
Please.

195
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:23,960
Thank you all, guys.

196
00:27:24,360 --> 00:27:25,040
We had issues.

197
00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:26,000
I'm sorry.

198
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:27,460
My name is Pamela Ock.

199
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:28,680
I live at eight breakouts.

200
00:27:28,900 --> 00:27:29,380
Thank you.

201
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:31,940
This is just kind of small.

202
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:34,540
One of the biggest issues we had when everybody did work

203
00:27:34,540 --> 00:27:35,600
on a street before.

204
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:43,000
They put all the dirt down the marsh and they never removed it so now the water level is a lot higher on our street

205
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:46,240
And I'm one of the low people in the street and I go on to water

206
00:27:47,660 --> 00:27:53,340
The other issue is if you guys can you avoid that putting on I mean, we're not allowed to put any

207
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:58,880
They have on the paper in the in the wetland or in that, you know, we're not

208
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:01,880
They have in the castle

209
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:08,180
I just want to do the streets, they tend to put all the dirt in the marsh and then they go back and fill it back up

210
00:28:08,180 --> 00:28:12,200
They did do us three to about 15 years when they did all the pipings before

211
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:20,540
Yeah, yes, and what happened was is they put all the dirt down the marsh and then they fill everything back in and now

212
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:25,500
It's like you know we used to go on a cliff and now it's like it's higher

213
00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:28,340
So I was just wanting to take away

214
00:28:28,340 --> 00:28:35,420
We would not be doing any excess materials that will be taken off site.

215
00:28:36,120 --> 00:28:37,200
That was one of my concerns.

216
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:47,120
But one more, when they tied the road, we had an engineer that came down and they went from house to house to make sure that some of us had a low.

217
00:28:47,460 --> 00:28:55,640
I'm going to slab to make sure the roads are tied properly and what happened as they came lower in front of my house, they made a mistake.

218
00:28:55,640 --> 00:29:01,440
And the engineer came down from the town and apologized to me and I said, so can you fix it?

219
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:05,260
He goes, no, so now you have a big massive puddle in front of our houses all the time.

220
00:29:05,540 --> 00:29:05,980
It's not level.

221
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:07,280
It's not leveled.

222
00:29:07,420 --> 00:29:14,360
So we're lower than most so when it rains, all the water puddles can maybe make sure they don't, I can add again.

223
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:20,220
I mean, I can try, like generally speaking, we're going to try to restore things to how they are now.

224
00:29:20,220 --> 00:29:26,200
and not get into redesigning the drainage on the street.

225
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:28,840
If I do that, it's that water is up somewhere.

226
00:29:29,260 --> 00:29:33,420
Whenever they tap, they can just make sure they do it right this time.

227
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,060
Really, guys, I live in a house that,

228
00:29:37,980 --> 00:29:40,300
the second most house on the street,

229
00:29:41,100 --> 00:29:44,580
we have a slab like we told this gentleman about it,

230
00:29:44,940 --> 00:29:47,160
and it was all not our fault.

231
00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:53,740
You know the town the old town people really messed us up and we're living with it and we're dealing with it

232
00:29:53,740 --> 00:29:54,840
But if anybody makes any

233
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:08,060
Major changes on the street. It could affect us majorly. Yeah, so we would intend to put everything back to your address. Yeah, break out. Yeah.

234
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:29,980
Just thinking when they talk, they can just be careful not to make it at the well. You know, they try to help us. We feel in just so you know, they tried to help us, but a backfire on the engineer and said, oh, we screwed up and they came down lower on us to help us, but it actually that fired on us. Do you happen to know?

235
00:30:29,980 --> 00:30:35,780
No, if Bragg have is one of the streets in which the town will be doing some work time.

236
00:30:35,780 --> 00:30:36,700
No, I don't know.

237
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:38,040
Not that I am aware of.

238
00:30:38,140 --> 00:30:44,980
Because perhaps I might be that if in fact they were, if you coordinated with them to reset.

239
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:46,460
But I can check.

240
00:30:46,460 --> 00:30:47,560
Oh, we're on the list, so I didn't know.

241
00:30:47,740 --> 00:30:51,720
I can check, I can yeah, on our list, or you had another list.

242
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:53,480
We're on you, yeah, you're on this list.

243
00:30:53,620 --> 00:30:58,660
I'm just saying the town is town's work is separate, so I don't know if they have any plans.

244
00:30:58,660 --> 00:31:03,900
But if perhaps, you know, they were going to be doing, you know, working the same timeframe,

245
00:31:03,900 --> 00:31:08,360
which you had mentioned earlier that some of the streets did have that, you know,

246
00:31:08,500 --> 00:31:14,800
perhaps there could be some coordination with the town and, you know, querian to remedy

247
00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:21,700
that particular, it doesn't sound like it would be a huge amount of work to do, you know,

248
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:27,160
I'm not an engineer, I don't know the specifics of it, but it doesn't sound like it would

249
00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:28,860
be, you know, unreasoned.

250
00:31:28,860 --> 00:31:31,180
You just don't want to backfire on it like last time.

251
00:31:31,460 --> 00:31:33,780
And we're sitting there like, and the engineer goes,

252
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:36,260
I am so sorry, you know, there's nothing we can do now.

253
00:31:36,660 --> 00:31:39,220
I'm like, well, yeah, they can't retire the whole street

254
00:31:39,220 --> 00:31:40,700
just because of our one house.

255
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:42,060
That can do.

256
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:45,100
Hopefully you'll be around when it's happening outside.

257
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:46,000
I mean, around.

258
00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:47,640
Alive?

259
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:51,180
Well, that is there, right?

260
00:31:51,260 --> 00:31:51,580
I know.

261
00:31:51,860 --> 00:31:52,320
I know.

262
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:54,060
Yeah, but that'd be great.

263
00:31:54,260 --> 00:31:56,120
I mean, no, we kind of get it.

264
00:31:56,120 --> 00:31:58,460
We're a site that you're going to replace pipes.

265
00:31:58,660 --> 00:32:02,800
We know there's going to be an issue just at the towering

266
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:03,620
in the dirt thing.

267
00:32:03,780 --> 00:32:04,680
Just keep an eye on it.

268
00:32:04,700 --> 00:32:05,140
That's great.

269
00:32:05,660 --> 00:32:07,200
I can look at and talk to the town.

270
00:32:07,500 --> 00:32:11,500
It's one of those things where the water is an issue

271
00:32:11,500 --> 00:32:13,340
from one place that goes somewhere else, right, somewhere.

272
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:17,080
So that's always a risk.

273
00:32:17,980 --> 00:32:18,160
OK.

274
00:32:18,660 --> 00:32:22,100
Could you perhaps make that note in your discussions

275
00:32:22,700 --> 00:32:25,280
that there is an issue with that particular address

276
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:29,660
And if they're going to be working on the street for the same time if you could

277
00:32:29,660 --> 00:32:34,720
specifically coordinate with them to try to remedy that particular situation.

278
00:32:36,860 --> 00:32:41,840
One more thing, I know we're not allowed to do this, but a lot of us in Hampton, as you know,

279
00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:46,740
we know the town owns four or five feet in front of a house, but a lot of us did

280
00:32:46,740 --> 00:32:49,460
really pre-landscaping to make it look nice.

281
00:32:50,420 --> 00:32:53,340
Do I have to remove anything like the railroad ties that I have there?

282
00:32:53,500 --> 00:32:54,440
Do you guys do that?

283
00:32:54,440 --> 00:33:01,540
So there's, in the contract, they'll be required to restore everything back to how it was.

284
00:33:01,780 --> 00:33:07,700
So if it's really complicated, it's complicated and you know, hopefully they're not able

285
00:33:07,700 --> 00:33:10,140
to do that, you know, to match what you have there.

286
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:14,600
But that's typically how the contract's written, if anything's damaged, they restore it back.

287
00:33:15,380 --> 00:33:16,160
You don't have to, yeah.

288
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:18,360
You don't have to.

289
00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:18,860
Okay.

290
00:33:19,300 --> 00:33:22,880
So I'm just seeing like, do you do this, will it be removed from you guys, or do I have to

291
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:23,360
remove it?

292
00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:29,520
I guess we need to have a sidebar right away and it's just easy enough to take off.

293
00:33:29,540 --> 00:33:31,120
So if I make a ribbon, take it away.

294
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:33,540
All right, thanks guys.

295
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:34,580
Thank you.

296
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:37,820
Is there anyone else who would like?

297
00:33:38,260 --> 00:33:38,380
Please.

298
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:42,340
All right, my name is Susan.

299
00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:44,320
I'm going to 12 Riverville Terrace.

300
00:33:45,260 --> 00:33:48,260
And I'm just curious about the timing of it.

301
00:33:48,820 --> 00:33:51,780
I mean, Hampton's becoming more of a year-round community.

302
00:33:51,780 --> 00:33:54,480
but is it going to be at the height of the season?

303
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:54,880
No.

304
00:33:55,520 --> 00:34:00,420
So all of the streets that are off of Ashworth,

305
00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:02,880
we would plan to do that work.

306
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:07,840
And it would be fall, so like after the seafood festival,

307
00:34:08,420 --> 00:34:10,580
and for Memorial Day.

308
00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:14,100
So when down at the beach, that's when we try to do all work.

309
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:17,440
Okay, also, and I know this probably is nothing to do with you,

310
00:34:17,580 --> 00:34:21,200
but will this work impact and make flooding even worse than it is?

311
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:22,420
in our street.

312
00:34:23,220 --> 00:34:28,140
No, I mean, this should, right, the idea is we dig out, put in the water main,

313
00:34:28,260 --> 00:34:30,400
and then everything goes back to the same grade.

314
00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:31,660
So we'll still the same flooding.

315
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:34,460
So the same, it won't improve flooding, it's not going to be any worse.

316
00:34:35,260 --> 00:34:36,060
Is my concern?

317
00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:38,980
No, but it's, I mean, it can't get any worse, let's look at that way.

318
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:41,320
Yeah, it shouldn't make it worse.

319
00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:42,600
Okay.

320
00:34:43,260 --> 00:34:45,100
I guess that's all I have to ask.

321
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:46,120
Thanks.

322
00:34:52,420 --> 00:34:59,920
We'll definitely, especially on these streets that are narrow, we'll have to work with you guys to make sure you can get in and out.

323
00:35:10,720 --> 00:35:14,200
Yeah, we'll have to look and see how the contractor does their work.

324
00:35:14,660 --> 00:35:19,800
We certainly, if it we were asking you to park somewhere else, we would give you a heads-up.

325
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:25,740
But generally, we contract and need to make provisions so that folks come in and out.

326
00:35:27,900 --> 00:35:30,860
Are there any other comments or questions?

327
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:36,640
Seeing none, back to the board. Are there any remaining

328
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:43,600
comments or questions on the board? At this time, is there no?

329
00:35:44,060 --> 00:35:45,320
Okay. All right.

330
00:35:48,550 --> 00:35:55,350
Is there any? I'll make a motion that we approve the town wetlands

331
00:35:55,350 --> 00:35:59,850
It's permanent for 26-026 office and have keep a mooring drive.

332
00:36:00,050 --> 00:36:03,630
Johnson have riverview terrors, Bragg Avenue, Total Avenue and Briarot.

333
00:36:03,970 --> 00:36:05,210
There is no wetlands.

334
00:36:05,790 --> 00:36:07,490
There's no wetlands commission letter.

335
00:36:07,690 --> 00:36:07,990
There is.

336
00:36:08,050 --> 00:36:08,450
Okay.

337
00:36:08,570 --> 00:36:09,270
Audits 27.

338
00:36:09,510 --> 00:36:10,250
Audits 27-26.

339
00:36:10,550 --> 00:36:12,050
Audits 27-26.

340
00:36:13,350 --> 00:36:13,690
Second.

341
00:36:14,290 --> 00:36:14,910
Allen Thager.

342
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:17,880
Thank you.

343
00:36:18,060 --> 00:36:18,240
Good lord.

344
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:18,740
Thank you.

345
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:19,080
You're right.

346
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:19,840
Have a good evening.

347
00:36:25,730 --> 00:36:26,110
Good evening.

348
00:36:32,310 --> 00:36:34,790
Consideration of minutes of August 19, 2026.

349
00:36:34,790 --> 00:36:36,110
So moved.

350
00:36:37,030 --> 00:36:37,750
Second.

351
00:36:38,390 --> 00:36:39,350
All in favor?

352
00:36:40,790 --> 00:36:41,650
One extension.

353
00:36:42,250 --> 00:36:43,010
Two extensions.

354
00:36:43,630 --> 00:36:44,750
Two extensions?

355
00:36:44,890 --> 00:36:44,970
Yes.

356
00:36:45,430 --> 00:36:46,210
Yes.

357
00:36:46,810 --> 00:36:47,650
Sharon wasn't here.

358
00:36:47,970 --> 00:36:48,570
I was not.

359
00:36:50,030 --> 00:36:50,610
Okay.

360
00:36:51,430 --> 00:36:52,110
On to.

361
00:36:52,350 --> 00:36:53,210
It's right over in Scotland, right?

362
00:36:54,390 --> 00:36:55,650
With the flood.

363
00:36:56,930 --> 00:36:57,950
Interesting video.

364
00:36:58,590 --> 00:36:59,850
No correspondence.

365
00:37:00,410 --> 00:37:00,510
No.

366
00:37:00,810 --> 00:37:01,250
Okay.

367
00:37:01,250 --> 00:37:08,770
Okay, then would you like to come up to talk about the coastal resilience road map?

368
00:37:09,310 --> 00:37:09,410
Yes.

369
00:37:09,410 --> 00:37:12,610
All the flooding that he's going to prevent should

370
00:37:14,780 --> 00:37:15,800
stop around for a minute.

371
00:37:16,100 --> 00:37:18,060
They've got an answer on that.

372
00:37:21,260 --> 00:37:27,140
Well, they probably have firsthand knowledge of the Actio app, they do usually handle super

373
00:37:27,140 --> 00:37:29,320
moons and King Tide.

374
00:37:30,420 --> 00:37:58,680
So, I wanted to come in today and talk to you guys a little bit about some of the things that are on the coastal resilience road map, especially in consideration of the compensatory storage draft amendment that is there because this is actually something that is on our road map, it's part of the agenda for completing the road map is to, I have it right here on the website, I actually have it pulled up,

375
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:06,340
But as we have a number of different strategies that were developed as part of this and this actually kind of falls within several of them.

376
00:38:08,620 --> 00:38:13,760
Number one is, you know, conserving areas for potential marsh migration and flood storage.

377
00:38:14,140 --> 00:38:19,620
So, you know, by, you know, creating more flood capacity through compensatory storage,

378
00:38:19,620 --> 00:38:26,800
this is something that would, you know, actually look into, you know, many of these areas that we want to conserve for future marsh migration.

379
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:38,940
So, you know, requiring that, you know, as part of development would actually help in advance and improve a lot of the storage capacity for future flood events in the future.

380
00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:46,280
I'm actually, you know, I'm not going to scroll through this whole thing because I actually made myself a fun little slide for it.

381
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:50,740
So number six on our roadmap, actually, I should probably hit the

382
00:38:53,560 --> 00:39:12,260
big play button, is that we want to review zoning and land use regulations and look at how best we could improve the different ordinances and regulations within the town to make our flood capacity and our ability to be more resilient much better.

383
00:39:12,260 --> 00:39:41,680
And so doing these kind of reviews and looking at, these kind of amendments is very powerful in terms of making sure that when we are allowing people to build things within the special flood hazard area, especially when it's very adjacent to areas of the wetland or in areas that would traditionally flood during high tide events or storm events that what we're doing is ensuring that we have the capacity to place that water somewhere else, if not on that property, at least somewhere else so that,

384
00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:46,100
It's not stacking, it's not creating a larger problem as we move forward.

385
00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:53,760
So, that's another really important reason, I think that this should move forward, is we're doing number six on the roadmap.

386
00:39:55,100 --> 00:40:11,520
We're looking at number one for conserving areas, and then also, this actually provides a really interesting method for a funding strategy, which we've been trying to figure out great ways to bring in the kind of capital.

387
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:20,800
to do larger projects, whether it be infrastructure-based projects, larger flood control programs

388
00:40:20,800 --> 00:40:25,500
and drainage programs, like we had over at Meadow Pond, which we recently celebrated,

389
00:40:26,100 --> 00:40:31,260
to larger projects that would hopefully hold back the flood waters or drain neighborhood's

390
00:40:31,260 --> 00:40:37,020
quicker or elevate roads, improve stormwater and stuff like that. So there's actually mechanisms

391
00:40:37,020 --> 00:40:42,340
within this, that Jason in the draft that he sent to me had brought up things like credits

392
00:40:42,340 --> 00:40:47,560
and stuff like that. Could it actually really help bolster that kind of revenue funding?

393
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:54,140
That might help build a piggy bank for the future for that literal late rainy day fund

394
00:40:54,140 --> 00:40:59,520
that we would want to do these larger projects. So I think that this is something really important.

395
00:40:59,880 --> 00:41:04,060
And I wanted to come in and chat with you guys and answer any questions you guys might have.

396
00:41:04,060 --> 00:41:06,980
but you know, kind of give some commentary on it.

397
00:41:07,140 --> 00:41:09,060
So, you know, that's why I really meant

398
00:41:09,060 --> 00:41:11,100
I wanted to come in and talk about the roadmap today

399
00:41:11,100 --> 00:41:13,260
is I think this is something that since you guys

400
00:41:13,260 --> 00:41:14,360
were gonna talk about it today,

401
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,040
I could come in and give some input on it.

402
00:41:19,020 --> 00:41:21,400
Can you go back for a second?

403
00:41:21,660 --> 00:41:24,580
And I think we knew, know what you meet,

404
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:27,100
what you're storing and what you need by that.

405
00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:29,700
But I don't know if people are watching.

406
00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:35,240
if they understand the concept of storing what you're storing.

407
00:41:35,380 --> 00:41:40,160
Absolutely, so I made a couple other slides that are for this, so in general what we're

408
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:46,800
talking about is when you build in a certain area you might do fill, so this could come

409
00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:51,620
in a lot of different ways, somebody might do something called slab on grade, they might

410
00:41:51,620 --> 00:41:56,300
put down a big piece of concrete and build a house there, or they might raise the area

411
00:41:56,300 --> 00:42:24,140
that they're building, and what this means is that when water comes into that area either through a rain event or a storm surge event or a title event, that water would normally like to be at that same elevation, but because there's now something blocking it has to go somewhere else, and so that can push water further into neighborhoods that can push water over into neighboring properties, you know, and so it creates what I like to call water stacking.

412
00:42:24,140 --> 00:42:26,940
where now water has to go somewhere else.

413
00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:29,540
It's like electricity, path of least resistance.

414
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:33,380
So when we're talking about doing storage,

415
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:36,540
what we're saying is either on the property site

416
00:42:36,540 --> 00:42:38,280
or at a secondary location,

417
00:42:38,820 --> 00:42:41,600
there needs to be a compensatory or equal

418
00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:44,460
or greater amount of storage created.

419
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:47,680
So a way to think about it is, you know,

420
00:42:47,860 --> 00:42:50,860
if you're digging, you know, out on the beach,

421
00:42:50,860 --> 00:42:53,440
you're out on the beach and you want to build a sand castle

422
00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:58,840
And the waves are coming in, and you don't want the waves to come into that sandcastle.

423
00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:01,780
You might dig out a hole in front of it where all that water would go in.

424
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:07,260
This is almost kind of like that, it's saying, well, we took up the place, what we want

425
00:43:07,260 --> 00:43:11,940
to do is make sure that the sandcastle is safe, so we're going to make sure that the area

426
00:43:11,940 --> 00:43:15,680
that the water would go, that was normally at the sandcastle, would go somewhere else.

427
00:43:16,260 --> 00:43:22,120
This can happen on the location or it can happen somewhere else nearby, usually we call

428
00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:25,980
like the hydrologic reach refers to the area

429
00:43:25,980 --> 00:43:27,360
that the water is influencing.

430
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:30,560
And because Hampton has the salt marsh

431
00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:32,480
and also some riverine stuff,

432
00:43:32,860 --> 00:43:35,560
generally what is our hydrologic reach

433
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:38,500
is the special flood hazard area when we look at it.

434
00:43:38,700 --> 00:43:41,240
It's a little bit more nuanced than that for the town,

435
00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:44,620
but that's a really good kind of boundary line

436
00:43:44,620 --> 00:43:46,920
to kind of think about what our hydrologic reaches.

437
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:50,460
So if we were to remove the capacity to store water

438
00:43:50,460 --> 00:43:52,760
or in one location in the special flood hazard area,

439
00:43:52,940 --> 00:43:55,400
we want to increase the capacity to score water

440
00:43:55,400 --> 00:43:57,860
in another part of that special flood hazard area.

441
00:43:59,180 --> 00:44:02,160
So what if you had a house, the existing house

442
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:07,540
that was at grade and you're gonna raise it up 10 feet

443
00:44:08,260 --> 00:44:12,840
and underneath is designed to flow right through

444
00:44:13,440 --> 00:44:14,700
the flood waters.

445
00:44:15,720 --> 00:44:18,100
And the house might be bigger than the existing house.

446
00:44:18,100 --> 00:44:21,700
Would that require compensatory storage?

447
00:44:22,100 --> 00:44:24,520
No, not necessarily. It really kind of depends.

448
00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:30,760
So if that house was just on stilts and there was no slab below it,

449
00:44:30,860 --> 00:44:34,240
so if that property was scraped clean, and it was just the dirt,

450
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:39,480
and let's say it was in that like six to eight foot kind of range of elevation

451
00:44:39,480 --> 00:44:44,680
where we see flooding in that area, then the ground could absorb some of that water.

452
00:44:44,680 --> 00:44:49,020
This kind of goes into things like, you know, permeable surfaces and stuff like that.

453
00:44:49,540 --> 00:44:53,900
You know, some of the marshland that might be near it if there is any.

454
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:29,300
And so if you don't have anything under there, there would be room for some martial migration. There would be room for that water to absorb into the ground. If you lifted the home and you put a big slab of concrete there, that might actually impact the storage capacity of the soil that's there. But in general, what we're talking about in these is larger, more in place projects than a lift. You're kind of standard for wall building that the water would have to flow around.

455
00:45:29,300 --> 00:45:30,520
rather than underneath.

456
00:45:31,820 --> 00:45:37,480
For example, the casino is approved by the new building.

457
00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:42,200
New casino is going to be a much larger building than the existing.

458
00:45:42,820 --> 00:45:45,140
Yeah, that would be an example.

459
00:45:45,460 --> 00:45:52,260
Many buildings that are in the special flood hatches are kind of in this category.

460
00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:57,340
Where if what we wanted to do was build something here to a certain size and

461
00:45:57,340 --> 00:45:59,200
degree, it would take up this.

462
00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:03,880
In general, when you look at these kind of things, what you're trying to say is, you know,

463
00:46:04,280 --> 00:46:10,720
we want to minimize increased footprint into this, you know, we're already at a certain

464
00:46:10,720 --> 00:46:15,820
footprint of building area that has been completed within the special flood hazard area.

465
00:46:16,020 --> 00:46:20,480
So there's already houses that sit on slabs that are a certain size, there's already buildings

466
00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:24,000
that sit on those, there's already paved streets and sidewalks and stuff.

467
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:27,580
But what we want to do is make sure that as we move forward into the future, if somebody says,

468
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:34,540
well, I want to expand on this site, and it would take up area that is already part of our flood capacity storage.

469
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:40,580
So more, more land that could absorb that water or redirect it or do something.

470
00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:46,720
Then if they were going to take that up, they would need to create an equal or greater storage capacity somewhere else.

471
00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:48,700
Or on site preferable.

472
00:46:48,700 --> 00:47:00,820
By our flood storage capacity, that would include any permeable surface on someone's property, correct?

473
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:07,060
Where they're looking at in-larging, raising in-larging whatever.

474
00:47:07,220 --> 00:47:13,200
It would be an impermeable surface, what we're concerned about is if water can't penetrate and

475
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:18,720
get into the ground and be absorbed and go back in the hydrological system and do that.

476
00:47:18,860 --> 00:47:22,460
Because when we talk about things like the salt martian stuff, what we're talking about

477
00:47:22,460 --> 00:47:29,460
is its ability to absorb water and also the distance between where that water starts

478
00:47:29,460 --> 00:47:34,260
and the properties we're trying to protect and the elevation slope, the grade that that

479
00:47:34,260 --> 00:47:35,600
water then has to go up.

480
00:47:35,840 --> 00:47:42,080
So the more distance we have, the more elevation we have, the more soil that can absorb this

481
00:47:42,080 --> 00:47:47,820
water and then let it drain back out to where we want it to be is the building of that capacity

482
00:47:47,820 --> 00:47:57,820
or, you know, holding on to that capacity. How will people who are considering a project

483
00:47:57,820 --> 00:48:06,800
understand what they would need to do to have adequate storage of the store more flood water?

484
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:36,780
So that would be, if past this would be something that they would need to coordinate with the floodplain manager and they would need to talk with Jason and myself, possibly Brianna from the Conservation Commission if it involved the salt marsher wetlands and stuff like that where we would walk them through this kind of thing because one of the things we want to really consider is that when we're talking about this, if we're doing projects and the fill is going to happen.

485
00:48:36,780 --> 00:48:39,220
happen at a place that's like eight to 10 feet in elevation.

486
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:44,560
We don't want people going out and making, you know, increasing capacity in the six to

487
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:50,780
eight foot category because that's not compensatory, that's not the same type of storage that

488
00:48:50,780 --> 00:48:52,400
they have removed from that system.

489
00:48:52,600 --> 00:48:57,980
So we want them to go and do that at eight to 10 feet, you know, which is why usually

490
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:04,100
preferably you want to do this on site, you know, if at all possible and why sometimes

491
00:49:04,100 --> 00:49:08,600
Sometimes you need, you know, additional mechanisms so that, you know, if that's not a possibility,

492
00:49:09,680 --> 00:49:13,680
they're, you know, incentivized to go do it somewhere else.

493
00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:21,860
That would, you know, benefit the town, the, you know, the public good in general by increasing that storage capacity for what they removed from the system.

494
00:49:22,140 --> 00:49:23,620
Can you give us a better example?

495
00:49:24,220 --> 00:49:26,180
I mean, where's the level on that?

496
00:49:26,300 --> 00:49:27,580
I see four feet as your lowest.

497
00:49:28,040 --> 00:49:36,760
Yeah, so, unfortunately, this isn't really great for looking at that, you know, if we're talking 8 feet and 10 feet.

498
00:49:36,980 --> 00:49:43,920
Yeah, so for the purposes of right now, what's called four feet sea level in this?

499
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:48,140
Just to kind of have the discussion, that's not truly that.

500
00:49:48,280 --> 00:49:51,140
Which would be like nine, yeah, which would be like nine.

501
00:49:51,140 --> 00:49:56,840
You know, what we want to make sure is that, you know, if sea level was at that grade,

502
00:49:57,680 --> 00:50:01,700
you know, we have land, you know, all the way from the beach all the way up to,

503
00:50:01,700 --> 00:50:05,180
you know, much higher elevations outside the special flood hazard area.

504
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:12,080
But we tend to build in the special flood hazard area in this, actually,

505
00:50:12,780 --> 00:50:18,800
I bet it can pull up, we have the special flood hazard area.

506
00:50:18,800 --> 00:50:24,760
And when we go and we look at it, which is in pain, which is in pain, and right, if it's

507
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:29,080
colored on this map, it's part of the FEMA firm panels and in this special flood hazard

508
00:50:29,080 --> 00:50:29,340
area.

509
00:50:29,780 --> 00:50:36,000
We can see, you know, areas that have elevations of 10, elevations of 9, elevations of 8, and

510
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:36,860
so on.

511
00:50:36,940 --> 00:50:39,100
And that's when base flooding starts.

512
00:50:39,300 --> 00:50:41,200
That's when water is on the street.

513
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:44,620
That's, you know, and permanently, not just from a little bit of rain and stuff.

514
00:50:44,780 --> 00:50:46,140
That's when it's starting to come up.

515
00:50:46,240 --> 00:50:47,320
That's where you would notice it.

516
00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:59,940
And so, when we're talking about this, what we're saying is, you know, if somebody wants to come and, you know, develop all of Island Path, let's say, you know, some point in the future, somebody wanted to do that.

517
00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:13,680
You know, then what we want them to do is recognize that there is a point at which they're going to be impacting the flood storage that is in a, you know, a 10-foot zone.

518
00:51:14,180 --> 00:51:19,980
You know, and so, you know, we don't want them to go and create flood capacity, increased

519
00:51:19,980 --> 00:51:24,120
flood capacity only in a six to eight foot zone because they're removing a 10 foot zone.

520
00:51:24,220 --> 00:51:31,560
So if we allowed that, then all the other 10 foot zones wouldn't get the benefit from this.

521
00:51:31,960 --> 00:51:38,140
You know, we're trying to do apples to apples here in elevations instead of saying, well,

522
00:51:38,780 --> 00:51:43,220
maybe we'll let them go do six foot elevations, well that only helps people at six feet, which

523
00:51:43,220 --> 00:51:48,420
It's just still helpful, but when you get a large enough storm or something, you want

524
00:51:48,420 --> 00:51:49,920
that maximum capacity.

525
00:51:50,520 --> 00:51:57,160
So can we zoom in where we're actually going to allow any increase in size?

526
00:51:59,040 --> 00:52:01,160
Because we have our wetland setbacks, right?

527
00:52:03,320 --> 00:52:07,120
You're talking about it down mostly along the coast or the riverway.

528
00:52:09,400 --> 00:52:21,680
So the light pink areas where there's buildings that exist currently, I don't want to go to the same dilemma, but the folks who are just in here for the water, they got it.

529
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:29,100
So like if we went and looked at light looks sorry, didn't mean to single out a specific house.

530
00:52:29,100 --> 00:52:29,880
No, that's fine.

531
00:52:30,180 --> 00:52:31,800
We'll explore the map and go back.

532
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:32,780
Wait.

533
00:52:33,880 --> 00:52:36,340
Because I'm thinking of like someone improving their property.

534
00:52:36,520 --> 00:52:42,220
We want to help them improve it, and it's just going to create a burden as well at the

535
00:52:42,220 --> 00:52:45,260
same time if they want to improve their property versus not improving it.

536
00:52:45,800 --> 00:52:51,400
So yeah, if we look off of like, you know, some of the side streets off of brown app, you

537
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:51,540
know.

538
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:52,440
Yeah, that's a great spot.

539
00:52:52,440 --> 00:53:04,000
Yeah, so if we were to choose one of those houses on the 100 by 50 foot a lot, that's probably at 70% house.

540
00:53:07,620 --> 00:53:16,240
And if they just want to do, raise your house, or not increase any sealed surface from the rain falling to the earth,

541
00:53:17,370 --> 00:53:19,740
they would have to do a mitigation.

542
00:53:19,740 --> 00:53:26,800
No, if they were raising their house and they weren't increasing the footprints of what they're already at,

543
00:53:27,200 --> 00:53:29,760
they wouldn't have to do any mitigation for this.

544
00:53:30,240 --> 00:53:35,100
Okay, so if they raised their house and brought it up floodplain,

545
00:53:35,200 --> 00:53:38,360
we'll say on a still type of structure of the car under,

546
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:44,340
but wanted to bump out their impervious like,

547
00:53:44,340 --> 00:53:52,920
like put a portrait, screen portrait has a roof on it and it was clear underneath, you

548
00:53:52,920 --> 00:53:55,640
know, because it's all raised up, would that have to do mitigation?

549
00:53:56,300 --> 00:53:56,440
No.

550
00:53:57,700 --> 00:53:58,020
Okay.

551
00:53:59,300 --> 00:54:03,140
Really that the circumstances, I'm just trying to find circumstances because people are going

552
00:54:03,140 --> 00:54:06,200
to be like, we can't have this because everybody's going to have, it's going to cost a fortune

553
00:54:06,200 --> 00:54:08,000
to do this and we're not going to be able to break our house.

554
00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:10,500
I can see a lot of opposition, but not understanding.

555
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:11,300
Absolutely.

556
00:54:11,300 --> 00:54:21,980
Absolutely, and so really the circumstances that would trip something like this would be if somebody bought both of these lots and said, I'm going to tear down both of these houses and build a really big gigantic expensive house.

557
00:54:22,600 --> 00:54:33,340
We take up both of these lots because now the area in between them would be filled with a building that is removing the flood capacity that would be found between these two homes.

558
00:54:33,340 --> 00:54:41,980
It might impact some of what is now their backyard could become a private pool or something like that.

559
00:54:42,100 --> 00:54:46,800
Any of those things that would increase the footprint of the house or

560
00:54:46,800 --> 00:54:52,140
the property in general by these margins that would remove a sort of asset.

561
00:54:52,540 --> 00:54:58,100
So what's stick with that scenario if these are not individual lots or not right now.

562
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:01,540
But let's say they do a lot more or they create two lots.

563
00:55:01,540 --> 00:55:07,520
But they put the house up high above flood plain elevations or so

564
00:55:07,520 --> 00:55:09,560
it flows through like we were talking about before.

565
00:55:10,420 --> 00:55:12,720
But the house is larger than what's there.

566
00:55:12,860 --> 00:55:15,560
I imagine that out the difference if you put 2,000 square foot

567
00:55:15,560 --> 00:55:21,280
new build and you're replacing 1,000 foot you'd have a net of 1,000 feet increase.

568
00:55:22,120 --> 00:55:26,480
But if it's all elevated, the old 1,000 foot house and

569
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:30,300
the new 2,000 foot house, is there any mitigation there because it's all

570
00:55:30,300 --> 00:55:33,620
Are they getting credit for lifting their house up?

571
00:55:34,020 --> 00:55:37,580
They would get credit under different programs for lifting their house up.

572
00:55:37,820 --> 00:55:40,760
The cost resilient incentive zone would do with those kind of things.

573
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:56,920
In general, that would really affect it because what we're still doing is allowing that flood water to move underneath that property, soak into the ground, drain back out, we're not creating more impermeable surface.

574
00:55:56,920 --> 00:56:17,040
I think there's some fine-tuning to the language that could certainly be done that would address some of these things, but in general, if you're doing all of the other right things, elevating the home, you're mitigating a lot of what would create a loss of storage in the area.

575
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:21,960
If he came in and he just said, no, I'm not elevating, that would be a different story,

576
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:29,580
but elevating it would most likely, under most cases, keep the storage capacity that area

577
00:56:29,580 --> 00:56:35,040
possibly even approve it because now you've taken two houses that were on slabs on the ground

578
00:56:35,040 --> 00:56:39,200
up and off, so many arguments could be made created to the capacity.

579
00:56:39,200 --> 00:56:47,580
Okay. Thank you. Now, what about if I can't, I'm putting myself in a place. I can't,

580
00:56:47,660 --> 00:56:54,580
but we're adding, let's say we add a ramp, right? That we need to get up and the ramp

581
00:56:54,580 --> 00:57:00,820
has to be 20 feet long, 5 feet wide. So we're adding, let's say a couple hundred feet.

582
00:57:01,320 --> 00:57:07,180
I've been pervose service. And I don't have any place to create capacity.

583
00:57:08,540 --> 00:57:17,140
do I do a, what do you do? Do you do a, the divert 5,000 magic thing put under the ground and the water goes in and floods out?

584
00:57:17,680 --> 00:57:22,640
Where do I buy this? Where do I buy a share and something to cover my mitigation?

585
00:57:23,240 --> 00:57:26,320
So it's interesting that you brought that up.

586
00:57:26,920 --> 00:57:37,180
So, one of the things that what, you know, when we look at this is generally people talk about, you know, credits for doing this.

587
00:57:37,560 --> 00:57:46,200
And there's something that you have to be very careful with because it's an opportunity to address this very issue.

588
00:57:46,420 --> 00:57:49,720
I have developed something or designed something to be built in an area.

589
00:57:49,720 --> 00:57:58,000
We no longer on this lot have the capacity to mitigate this issue and create more storage or do that.

590
00:57:58,380 --> 00:58:04,660
So what's develop a method where somebody can go do it somewhere else where it is compensatory.

591
00:58:05,020 --> 00:58:12,760
It meets the same grade, it meets the same grade as where we're filling, it's the same footprint area, it does this.

592
00:58:13,220 --> 00:58:19,300
some places require it to be one-to-one, if this is an avenue that were to be pursued,

593
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:25,540
some municipalities require one-to-one, some municipalities require two-to-one.

594
00:58:27,480 --> 00:58:30,720
As kind of, well, do you really want to do this?

595
00:58:30,760 --> 00:58:31,640
This is our requirement.

596
00:58:32,460 --> 00:58:37,480
If you wish not to do it here, it has to be still within the hydrologic reach, so

597
00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:44,440
So the special flood has various, so that storage that is being mitigated for is still benefiting

598
00:58:44,440 --> 00:58:45,660
the general area.

599
00:58:46,260 --> 00:58:51,860
So you can't say, well, I'm going to go, I can't do this here on this property.

600
00:58:52,080 --> 00:58:57,040
I'm going to go do this in the Amazon rainforest that doesn't help anybody here.

601
00:58:57,140 --> 00:59:00,400
So we want it to be in the same hydrologic reach.

602
00:59:01,420 --> 00:59:06,660
There's a lot of concerns usually around doing these kinds of things and they have to be

603
00:59:06,660 --> 00:59:12,660
carefully addressed when doing it, generally what you want to do is make sure that there is

604
00:59:12,660 --> 00:59:18,220
no storage curve, you know, so to go back to this slide, we want to make sure, you know,

605
00:59:18,240 --> 00:59:24,200
if somebody applies for a credit, then, you know, if they apply for one in the eight to

606
00:59:24,200 --> 00:59:28,240
ten-foot zone, they're doing work in an eight to ten-foot zone to do this.

607
00:59:28,780 --> 00:59:35,880
Hampton has a very unique opportunity in this because we are doing a lot of work out restoring

608
00:59:35,880 --> 00:59:40,600
our wetlands and restoring our salt marsh with ditch remediation projects, which is another

609
00:59:40,600 --> 00:59:48,000
road map item. And so, you know, we're looking at increasing that capacity all the time. And there

610
00:59:48,720 --> 00:59:54,580
could be opportunities to allow for the development of credits by helping us do that, you know.

611
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:28,060
Or working on other sites that would increase this capacity along that same range, out in the salt marsh, would be a great way to do that kind of thing. But it has to be carefully done so that, like I said, nobody's doing it out in the Amazon, and it meets the same specs as where the work was done. First is getting a variance. Yeah, versus getting a variance. There's some other things that might have to be considered.

612
01:00:28,060 --> 01:00:51,420
You know, we have the coastal resistance incentive zone, you know, is stacking a thing, can one get a competitive storage credit and, you know, coastal resistance incentive zone, you know, tax abatement for that's generally not a huge issue in these things, you know, and might actually, you know, improve a lot of situations.

613
01:00:52,880 --> 01:01:17,660
And it could develop a funding strategy for a lot of these things, especially if the town were to look at the work that we're doing out in our wetlands and out in our salt marsh in these areas that we are currently working on and saying, you pay into the fund to help us do that, you get the credit to develop your thing in this area because we're already working on developing this capacity.

614
01:01:17,660 --> 01:01:26,440
So, help us fund these types of projects, and then you can develop here in this site, and then you've got your compensatory storage credit.

615
01:01:30,290 --> 01:01:32,570
A couple of questions following on here.

616
01:01:33,110 --> 01:01:41,250
You were talking about if somebody raised a structure that the area underneath, assuming it was not a cement slab,

617
01:01:42,310 --> 01:01:47,010
would count for this because water could be absorbed under there.

618
01:01:47,970 --> 01:01:54,530
I'm assuming that would not be the case if they park there, even if it's not cement?

619
01:01:55,350 --> 01:02:05,170
I don't, so, in a, in a very like geological position, it wouldn't really matter because the car

620
01:02:05,170 --> 01:02:11,690
probably isn't there all the time and what's the footprint of a tire on the ground, you know, water can still

621
01:02:11,690 --> 01:02:16,050
flow under a car. Unfortunately, you just wanted to flow through, not just flow through.

622
01:02:16,170 --> 01:02:17,850
So it would depend on the substrate as well.

623
01:02:18,050 --> 01:02:22,970
Yeah, it depend on substrate. You know, in order to do this type of thing, somebody would

624
01:02:22,970 --> 01:02:28,970
need to bring in an engineer, look at what they were doing, look at the ordinance and say,

625
01:02:28,990 --> 01:02:33,550
okay, we need to create compensatory storage is the substrate here, you know, compatible

626
01:02:33,550 --> 01:02:39,110
with doing that. Is our planning and design compatible with doing that on site? If not,

627
01:02:39,110 --> 01:02:40,870
But what are our next steps?

628
01:02:42,750 --> 01:02:49,830
So the compensatory storage and the credits and so forth would address the issue for

629
01:02:49,830 --> 01:02:58,190
Hampton, but not necessarily a butters or the specific neighborhood where this,

630
01:02:58,870 --> 01:03:05,050
let's say that somebody's buying up two or three lots ripping down and building something larger.

631
01:03:05,050 --> 01:03:13,670
It would not necessarily impact or aid the surrounding neighborhood of this project.

632
01:03:14,050 --> 01:03:20,250
So when we, when you look at these types of programs, there's generally two paths for it.

633
01:03:20,290 --> 01:03:24,310
There's the, like I was saying, actually I'll go back to the slides before I click over here.

634
01:03:24,890 --> 01:03:32,470
There's a one-to-one strategy where you say you, in order to meet your compensatory storage requirement,

635
01:03:32,470 --> 01:03:37,570
you make sure that there is the same amount of storage as what you removed.

636
01:03:38,290 --> 01:03:43,130
So if you remove once one, you know, Olympic swimming pools worth of storage,

637
01:03:43,650 --> 01:03:45,810
you create another Olympic swimming pools worth of storage.

638
01:03:46,610 --> 01:03:55,350
Many places go to a 1.5 to 2 to 1 type of scenario where you have to create, you know,

639
01:03:55,630 --> 01:03:59,210
a little bit more storage than what you removed from the system.

640
01:03:59,210 --> 01:04:05,030
And so, keeping that in mind, if we go back to the map of the flood hazard area, say

641
01:04:05,030 --> 01:04:11,990
somebody did by a large number of these properties and they, you know, removed that storage

642
01:04:11,990 --> 01:04:15,730
capacity in that area, what we're talking about is the special flood hazard area.

643
01:04:16,130 --> 01:04:23,130
And so, if they could do that storage at a secondary location that was still within it, it

644
01:04:23,130 --> 01:04:28,290
wouldn't be necessarily an immediate effect on the people right next to them, but it would

645
01:04:28,290 --> 01:04:32,430
would have a large effect within this area.

646
01:04:32,610 --> 01:04:33,950
So water has to flow somewhere.

647
01:04:34,790 --> 01:04:37,830
And so while there would still be flooding

648
01:04:37,830 --> 01:04:40,570
for their neighbors by increasing the capacity

649
01:04:40,570 --> 01:04:44,490
by 1.5 or two to one in those areas,

650
01:04:44,790 --> 01:04:47,010
you would be actually reducing the flood,

651
01:04:47,450 --> 01:04:50,410
how much flooding was happening over a very large area,

652
01:04:50,430 --> 01:04:52,410
which would have a net benefit effect.

653
01:04:52,850 --> 01:04:56,250
Okay, and what does assuming it is on site,

654
01:04:56,250 --> 01:05:03,030
What does it look like? Is this like a retention pond and people's vacuars?

655
01:05:03,090 --> 01:05:05,210
In some cases, they can be retention ponds.

656
01:05:05,390 --> 01:05:10,530
In some cases, it can be the creation of more wetlands space.

657
01:05:10,890 --> 01:05:15,330
So saying we're going to leave this area for future marsh migration in there.

658
01:05:15,990 --> 01:05:20,730
Another really good example is a project that we've been working with,

659
01:05:20,730 --> 01:05:28,990
A DES on the Department of Environmental Services out in our own salt marsh doing salt marsh ditch remediation.

660
01:05:29,130 --> 01:05:35,130
Making sure that those ditches got filled back up so that they're just actual soil to absorb that water.

661
01:05:35,490 --> 01:05:38,470
And help that marsh be the biggest and the healthiest it is.

662
01:05:38,790 --> 01:05:41,010
That would be another example of doing it.

663
01:05:41,390 --> 01:05:49,630
Some in some cases people do much more heavily engineered projects where they take out below where they were going to do work

664
01:05:49,630 --> 01:05:55,430
and put in certain types of fill and drainage systems and stuff so that they can absorb that water.

665
01:05:55,890 --> 01:06:02,410
You can see a lot of fantastic options underneath large parking garages sometimes where they build cisterns down there.

666
01:06:02,490 --> 01:06:07,450
That hold the water until the floods go away and then they pump it out through a specified system.

667
01:06:07,730 --> 01:06:09,550
So there's many ways to do this.

668
01:06:10,050 --> 01:06:12,570
The water table pretty close down there.

669
01:06:12,650 --> 01:06:12,870
Yeah.

670
01:06:12,870 --> 01:06:13,970
Yeah, yeah, that's cool.

671
01:06:14,930 --> 01:06:15,970
Can you drive in Phil?

672
01:06:16,250 --> 01:06:18,450
So let's say I have an idea that I'm

673
01:06:18,450 --> 01:06:24,830
going to build my whole lot up to 10, or 11, or 12,

674
01:06:25,230 --> 01:06:27,350
because I don't want any water around my house.

675
01:06:29,950 --> 01:06:33,370
And I buy offsite mitigation.

676
01:06:33,670 --> 01:06:34,710
I buy the 2 to 1.

677
01:06:35,270 --> 01:06:35,970
I can do that.

678
01:06:39,300 --> 01:06:40,740
So you lifted the house.

679
01:06:40,880 --> 01:06:42,020
I want to fill the land in.

680
01:06:42,060 --> 01:06:44,420
I'm going to reclaim more soil on the bottom of the bot.

681
01:06:44,420 --> 01:06:57,720
So, so right into the line of building the town right up your build the tower with soil. Yeah, and I'm going to build a new structure on top of that. Yeah, can you do that? If you do offsite mitigation, there's a lot of reasons

682
01:06:57,720 --> 01:07:12,060
I don't think that that would be a good idea, but, you know, I, you know, if you drive sheeding around and I'd be an island, if building would give you the permits. Yeah, you like, if you, if you, if that was

683
01:07:12,060 --> 01:07:20,660
Because otherwise allowable under all other conditions, then doing a two to one, you would

684
01:07:20,660 --> 01:07:26,180
have to build essentially to that amount of fill out somewhere, would have to be removed

685
01:07:26,180 --> 01:07:33,220
from another location so that water could fill in through another type of method, whether

686
01:07:33,220 --> 01:07:38,720
the program would offer me that out, it could, yeah, it would allow you to do that.

687
01:07:38,720 --> 01:07:56,380
How would this compliance and permitting and so forth be managed by, is this by the building requirements, if by the Conservation Commission, where and what's the mechanics of making this happen?

688
01:07:56,380 --> 01:08:10,600
So, it's something that the floodplain manager and planning and zoning would have to sign off on is generally what you want to do is you want to say we are doing a project here.

689
01:08:12,220 --> 01:08:19,720
Building permits, all the other permitting that we go through it, conservation might need to look at it if it involves wetlands.

690
01:08:21,620 --> 01:08:24,840
There's a slight argument for case-by-case basis in these.

691
01:08:25,160 --> 01:08:31,340
In general, most homeowners and residents would not be taking advantage of this unless they're building gigantic properties.

692
01:08:31,660 --> 01:08:34,440
It's usually much larger buildings.

693
01:08:35,280 --> 01:08:40,160
If Amazon would put up warehouse in the middle of the special flood hazard area and

694
01:08:40,160 --> 01:08:45,360
they didn't want to do it right underneath them, they would go and

695
01:08:45,360 --> 01:08:47,580
they would want to look at doing these kind of projects.

696
01:08:47,580 --> 01:08:56,040
That's usually what you're kind of targeting, is larger development scale that's removing a lot more of this capacity by filling in the lands in between things.

697
01:08:56,560 --> 01:09:04,040
So in general, it would be a planning board issue, would be to come in and say, I wish to, it looked like you're going to say something like that.

698
01:09:04,040 --> 01:09:13,140
Yeah, I was just going to say that it would depend on the application if there was something that required site plan approval from the planning board, then certainly it would be part of that application process.

699
01:09:13,140 --> 01:09:18,260
If it's not, then it might not come to the board because the floodplain administrator

700
01:09:18,260 --> 01:09:21,040
who is the building inspector is responsible for the floodplain ordinance.

701
01:09:21,600 --> 01:09:25,280
There might be other factors too, like you mentioned, where there could be wetlands

702
01:09:25,280 --> 01:09:29,120
of all, so it could be wetland permitting where the Conservation Commission would have a role

703
01:09:29,120 --> 01:09:29,720
there, too.

704
01:09:30,440 --> 01:09:34,060
I think we're all going to have some say in this, but I think that ultimately the floodplain

705
01:09:34,060 --> 01:09:37,660
administrator is where it starts, and then it kind of branches off depending on what

706
01:09:37,660 --> 01:09:38,460
the application is.

707
01:09:38,520 --> 01:09:39,420
That's all I was going to say on that.

708
01:09:39,420 --> 01:09:43,360
Yeah, absolutely, is that exactly what I'll say.

709
01:09:43,840 --> 01:09:48,940
So, this is one of those things where it has the capacity

710
01:09:48,940 --> 01:10:00,760
for ensuring that development and building in the town is making sure that we're not increasing the problem.

711
01:10:00,900 --> 01:10:06,980
What we're doing is we're ensuring that at least everything is at minimum the same status quo or getting better.

712
01:10:06,980 --> 01:10:14,560
and whether that be directly on site, it could also be somewhere else, but within the large

713
01:10:14,560 --> 01:10:19,840
pink area, what we want to be doing is making sure that we have capacity to absorb flood waters

714
01:10:19,840 --> 01:10:26,480
and allow them to drain out and leave our people and our property alone. So this has the capacity to

715
01:10:26,480 --> 01:10:34,420
do that. One of the things is, like I said earlier, this is really kind of a thing that is usually

716
01:10:34,420 --> 01:10:39,580
targeted towards much of your developments, less so residences because either they're

717
01:10:39,580 --> 01:10:44,620
doing the kind of renovations to the house that are either going to lift it out and therefore

718
01:10:44,620 --> 01:10:51,160
actually increase flood storage capacity underneath their property by allowing the land underneath

719
01:10:51,160 --> 01:10:56,740
the house to absorb some of that water, especially gets a larger flow through or they're keeping

720
01:10:56,740 --> 01:11:02,220
the same footprint more or less. It's usually for the removal of large parts of this.

721
01:11:02,220 --> 01:11:09,040
So building out entire neighborhoods into removing single-family homes and turning them into condominiums,

722
01:11:09,280 --> 01:11:11,080
building out large buildings,

723
01:11:13,200 --> 01:11:16,200
Amazon warehouses or something like that.

724
01:11:16,680 --> 01:11:17,320
Data centers.

725
01:11:17,500 --> 01:11:17,940
Data centers.

726
01:11:18,040 --> 01:11:27,640
But the permitting and the enforcement is not 100% clear with, it's going to be different for every project.

727
01:11:31,880 --> 01:11:33,460
Yeah, it's kind of ambiguous.

728
01:11:34,060 --> 01:11:39,880
Yeah, if they're close enough to the wetland buffers and

729
01:11:39,880 --> 01:11:44,040
they have to do that, they're going to have to work with conservation.

730
01:11:44,380 --> 01:11:51,300
If they're in the middle of Hampton Beach, they're going to have to do something else.

731
01:11:52,200 --> 01:11:55,340
It's going to be a little bit case by case, but

732
01:11:55,340 --> 01:12:12,800
But I think, you know, that's how a lot of these things go is it's very hard to make a cookie cutter option that actually fits, you know, everybody's preferences for what they want to do, but it has a great net benefit that I believe, you know, is well worth some of those headaches that might come down the line.

733
01:12:13,120 --> 01:12:19,580
We do have some large lots that could be developed that have nothing on about parking right now that are in the pink.

734
01:12:19,580 --> 01:12:20,500
So

735
01:12:23,820 --> 01:12:29,580
the parking lot, assuming it's paved, well, even Pax Oil is considered impervious.

736
01:12:29,580 --> 01:12:30,100
That's right.

737
01:12:32,260 --> 01:12:49,800
If somebody is going in and developing this impervious, currently impervious land, they are not increasing the amount of impervious surface.

738
01:12:49,800 --> 01:12:49,900
Yes.

739
01:12:50,580 --> 01:12:50,780
Right.

740
01:12:51,280 --> 01:12:59,500
They may in fact be decreasing it, if they want to, I don't know, lawn or something around this structure with the supply in that case.

741
01:12:59,680 --> 01:13:05,980
That would require an engineering feasibility study and looking at the other factors that are in this.

742
01:13:06,060 --> 01:13:14,760
It's not just whether or not the ground is impervious in these cases, that is a large factor.

743
01:13:15,540 --> 01:13:21,260
There are many other avenues by which we talk about these kind of flood capacities issues.

744
01:13:21,620 --> 01:13:28,980
So, if this also happened to impact a section of the salt marsh indirectly and we knew

745
01:13:28,980 --> 01:13:35,300
that going into it, we might say you need to make sure that you're mitigating that through

746
01:13:35,840 --> 01:13:36,500
this mechanism.

747
01:13:37,200 --> 01:13:41,080
Really what it is, is we want to ensure that we have a mechanism that we can point out and

748
01:13:41,080 --> 01:13:49,540
say, you're removing something we want you to put it back to the way that it was to a certain degree or add to the capacity here.

749
01:13:49,680 --> 01:13:59,120
We just want to make sure that, you know, it's not constantly taking away that we're at least keeping the status quo in capacity or increasing it.

750
01:13:59,400 --> 01:14:08,720
But if it's impervious, like, experiment, same thing, if it's impervious, and if the new thing is impervious, what's the difference is the same thing?

751
01:14:08,720 --> 01:14:18,780
Well, it depends on the volume of the building, an empty parking lot has no volume, but a building put on the parking lot, takes up flood storage.

752
01:14:19,260 --> 01:14:19,860
How?

753
01:14:20,800 --> 01:14:23,460
Because it has a volume that has to flow around it.

754
01:14:24,460 --> 01:14:26,580
And then you're pushing water into other properties.

755
01:14:27,620 --> 01:14:32,780
But it's not pushing anymore off property than when it was just completely paid.

756
01:14:35,780 --> 01:14:43,800
because it's going to be that high-level fur of one tide and that's what we'd be arguing.

757
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:46,300
I'm just trying to ferret this out.

758
01:14:46,300 --> 01:14:54,900
Yeah, it's okay, it's it's it's uh, the same building up to be an L.A.L.A.D.E. flow throw, right?

759
01:15:00,300 --> 01:15:16,480
For the analogy, it's adding people to the pool. If the pool is at two feet deep, and you keep adding people into the pool, the water level goes up, even though, yeah. But if it's the surface is completely impervious,

760
01:15:18,000 --> 01:15:30,120
I assume where John was coming with what you put the building on it has to go around yet. But the roof on top of the, that's why imperviousness is not the only single definition.

761
01:15:30,120 --> 01:15:32,740
for flood flood storage capacity.

762
01:15:34,960 --> 01:15:41,960
I was going to say to Ben, that in the ordinance addressed ordinance under submission

763
01:15:41,960 --> 01:15:46,240
requirements, there is that reporting template and instructions that has to be prepared

764
01:15:46,240 --> 01:15:53,200
by an engineer that would probably help, that technical guidance might help to help

765
01:15:53,200 --> 01:15:55,180
advise that is what I'm thinking about.

766
01:15:55,280 --> 01:15:56,140
Yeah, would you agree with that?

767
01:15:56,380 --> 01:16:00,600
Yeah, absolutely, because there's imperviousness.

768
01:16:00,600 --> 01:16:16,860
Yes, there's, you know, area capacity, there's connectivity, so if one of these projects broke up where water would flow into another area that it could be stored, that would be another example of needing to have compensatory storage mitigation work done.

769
01:16:17,300 --> 01:16:26,080
If I just blocked off where the water flows into Meadow pond, you know, then you would have more water going into other parts of Hampton.

770
01:16:26,080 --> 01:16:29,220
And I wouldn't like your room to get the part where it comes in, but please.

771
01:16:30,640 --> 01:16:31,500
A couple questions.

772
01:16:33,240 --> 01:16:38,060
If I live next to an NMD law, that's gratis.

773
01:16:38,620 --> 01:16:40,120
Somebody comes in and builds there.

774
01:16:41,440 --> 01:16:47,240
And they mitigate, or they help restore some dishes in the marsh.

775
01:16:48,420 --> 01:16:50,460
It's going to affect me as their neighbor.

776
01:16:55,850 --> 01:17:00,250
We average it all out, it's not going to affect everyone in the same way.

777
01:17:01,250 --> 01:17:06,890
Is there something in the ordinance, or would there be something in the ordinance that

778
01:17:06,890 --> 01:17:07,270
says,

779
01:17:11,150 --> 01:17:15,030
I mean, we have the ability as a planning board to deny that

780
01:17:17,210 --> 01:17:20,690
if it's going to adversely

781
01:17:20,690 --> 01:17:20,930
effect.

782
01:17:20,930 --> 01:17:23,810
There is no way for you to be able to do that.

783
01:17:32,050 --> 01:17:39,270
My understanding compensatory, the ability to use compensatory storage for, I don't

784
01:17:39,270 --> 01:17:44,530
want to say, a condition of approval, but for what, as something you need to do to get

785
01:17:44,530 --> 01:17:50,090
a project approved does not, is not carte launch over all of the regulations, is my understanding.

786
01:17:50,330 --> 01:17:55,090
So, you currently cannot flood somebody else's property and make something worse.

787
01:17:55,090 --> 01:18:05,830
So, in theory, you can do offsite mitigation with compensatory storage, but not at the expense of other regulatory requirements in the town.

788
01:18:06,470 --> 01:18:11,870
And that would also apply to, for example, you gave with bringing in fill, that's not something you can really do.

789
01:18:12,070 --> 01:18:12,770
I was just curious.

790
01:18:12,890 --> 01:18:13,310
Yeah, yeah.

791
01:18:13,310 --> 01:18:13,350
Yeah.

792
01:18:13,810 --> 01:18:19,090
So it might be outside of the wetland's jurisdiction like on peace street.

793
01:18:19,590 --> 01:18:24,910
You can't really do that in the floodplain without loss of permitting anyway, bringing

794
01:18:24,910 --> 01:18:29,810
in fill requires oversight through FEMA in the floodplain generally, and especially that

795
01:18:29,810 --> 01:18:30,290
much fill.

796
01:18:30,490 --> 01:18:35,410
So the only reason I'm bringing that example back up is because compensatory storage is an

797
01:18:35,410 --> 01:18:40,830
additional regulation and it's just because you meet that requirement doesn't mean you don't

798
01:18:40,830 --> 01:18:42,170
have to meet any of the other requirements.

799
01:18:43,890 --> 01:18:44,890
Am I correct?

800
01:18:45,190 --> 01:18:45,810
You are correct.

801
01:18:45,810 --> 01:18:46,470
Thank you very much.

802
01:18:46,470 --> 01:18:47,910
That's what I was looking back here.

803
01:18:48,130 --> 01:18:49,910
So I just wanted to make sure I didn't miss a plan.

804
01:18:52,430 --> 01:18:55,890
So no, that's many of these stacked together.

805
01:18:56,690 --> 01:19:02,290
We have other building regulations, our free board regulation, things like that.

806
01:19:02,850 --> 01:19:08,150
When somebody comes to build a house or a property and we say, okay, here's what you need to

807
01:19:08,150 --> 01:19:13,790
do, you know, just because they elevated their home doesn't mean they don't have to put

808
01:19:13,790 --> 01:19:18,290
in smoke detectors and stuff like that, you know, they saw it to meet all other requirements.

809
01:19:19,430 --> 01:19:27,190
So follow up question, the parking lot, okay, somebody takes the parking lot and builds

810
01:19:27,190 --> 01:19:33,330
a small house and makes the rest of the parking lot permeable, can they then sell that credit

811
01:19:33,330 --> 01:19:36,510
to someone building a house elsewhere?

812
01:19:36,890 --> 01:19:37,710
As they're offset?

813
01:19:38,130 --> 01:19:39,690
Yeah, I mean, it's like covering the distance.

814
01:19:40,210 --> 01:19:44,310
So this is one of the things that generally,

815
01:19:44,530 --> 01:19:45,630
when you start talking about credits,

816
01:19:47,230 --> 01:19:52,290
there's this, this is one that the discussions get very

817
01:19:52,290 --> 01:19:56,090
interesting as we'll put it, because many times,

818
01:19:56,370 --> 01:19:58,110
when you look at crediting systems,

819
01:19:58,110 --> 01:20:00,210
what you have to start considering is,

820
01:20:00,210 --> 01:20:04,110
are their perverse incentives to doing things, you know?

821
01:20:04,830 --> 01:20:09,910
And so, you know, what you generally want to do is ensure that nobody is, you know,

822
01:20:10,110 --> 01:20:14,290
doing something, gaming the system and doing those things.

823
01:20:14,470 --> 01:20:20,270
So, generally, what you want to do is ensure that they're not a fungible item, really,

824
01:20:20,590 --> 01:20:25,690
and that the transfer of them is well regulated by the town itself.

825
01:20:26,310 --> 01:20:34,170
Usually, and that's why my recommendation would be, it would have to be essentially purchased into a town owned project.

826
01:20:34,690 --> 01:20:42,890
So, one homeowner couldn't say, I'll build a wetland so that you can build your big deck and give me $10,000.

827
01:20:43,350 --> 01:20:54,350
It's, no, we're going to give the town a hampton, what the amount of money to create the compensatory storage out in the salt marsh in the ditches or a drainage system project or something like that.

828
01:20:54,350 --> 01:20:56,690
Okay. Thank you.

829
01:20:57,370 --> 01:20:58,210
Thank you, thank you.

830
01:20:58,290 --> 01:20:59,910
Is there a rule of thought?

831
01:21:00,050 --> 01:21:04,230
I'm thinking about the people who were attending the earlier part of this meeting.

832
01:21:04,930 --> 01:21:10,150
And other similar properties, all throughout the beach area.

833
01:21:10,630 --> 01:21:17,570
Is there a rule of thumb for people to understand if they may have to go through this process?

834
01:21:18,030 --> 01:21:21,470
Or if they're free, other than an Amazon warehouse?

835
01:21:23,210 --> 01:21:29,490
So, to kind of go back to how eloquently Brianna put it and everything else is somebody

836
01:21:29,490 --> 01:21:34,630
would start to do a project that would possibly trigger this.

837
01:21:34,790 --> 01:21:38,610
And in that they would be going through all of the other steps.

838
01:21:38,950 --> 01:21:44,990
And because this is now, you know, if this was part of that, this would just be another one

839
01:21:44,990 --> 01:21:45,490
of those steps.

840
01:21:45,490 --> 01:22:06,930
So, during their engineering study, you know, that engineer would have to, you know, look at this and say, okay, we have an ordinance for this, this means that I have to look and see does this decrease capacity in the area that we're doing it, if yes, then we need to do compensatory storage, if no precedes of the next step in our project.

841
01:22:06,930 --> 01:22:13,010
And decrease capacity by a percentage or just period?

842
01:22:15,330 --> 01:22:21,390
Generally, what you're really trying to do is not lose any capacity, though,

843
01:22:21,530 --> 01:22:26,770
that's in reality that's very hard to do, right?

844
01:22:27,050 --> 01:22:30,270
So generally, what you want to do is set a threshold for that.

845
01:22:31,750 --> 01:22:36,590
And there are examples nationwide of different percentages

846
01:22:36,590 --> 01:22:43,610
of that kind of loss that really trigger that, but, you know, and that's something that we would have to be very specific.

847
01:22:44,450 --> 01:22:53,930
So, if I'm understanding you correctly, any project could be susceptible or this could apply to.

848
01:22:54,550 --> 01:23:05,590
So, that being the case, what kind of money are you talking about to purchase credits for some, I don't know, you pick whatever size you...

849
01:23:05,590 --> 01:23:21,650
So, you know, these things run a large game, but, you know, once again, we would have to decide on what would qualify as, you know, what's called compensatory storage credit work.

850
01:23:21,890 --> 01:23:27,830
What we're doing in the town that would, you know, meet the requirements for doing that.

851
01:23:27,830 --> 01:23:52,230
So if we're talking about salt marsh, ditch remediation and stuff like that, we might talk about it in a cubic footage sets and say, well, what does it cost us to do 25 cubic feet of a salt marsh, that's how much money you have to pay to, if they're taking out 25 cubic feet and we want 25 cubic feet put in, what does that cost us to do?

852
01:23:52,230 --> 01:23:58,050
So there's some discussions that need to be thought about in creating a credit system.

853
01:23:58,610 --> 01:24:07,490
I think they can be very useful in stuff, but these are some of the issues that have been traditionally run into is who can buy and sell credits.

854
01:24:08,170 --> 01:24:11,770
I would caution against that, it creates perverse incentives in gaming the system.

855
01:24:12,130 --> 01:24:14,910
And then also what is the value of doing this?

856
01:24:14,910 --> 01:24:20,830
As many of the examples I found are essentially what is the cost of doing the fill on the site.

857
01:24:21,610 --> 01:24:31,420
So if you are going to fill, I just kind of blanked on a number there, but imagine filling

858
01:24:31,920 --> 01:24:34,520
an average size basement, something in the size of this room.

859
01:24:35,680 --> 01:24:37,260
What did that cost you to do?

860
01:24:37,640 --> 01:24:42,100
Well, then it's probably cost you the same amount to do that, that works somewhere else.

861
01:24:43,380 --> 01:24:50,860
So there's not a perfect one for one to that, but traditionally places, other places across the U.S. have gone.

862
01:24:51,980 --> 01:24:56,300
You have to account for what your fill cost was and then double it for doing that somewhere else.

863
01:24:56,600 --> 01:25:03,100
Unless they've gone with the 1.5 ratio or the 2.5 ratio and they could say you might need to double the cost of your fill costs.

864
01:25:05,000 --> 01:25:08,640
So that's part of the process usually.

865
01:25:09,540 --> 01:25:16,560
And we would, one of the things we would be determining is the one to one or the one point five or two on.

866
01:25:17,640 --> 01:25:29,940
And as I, when you were going through this earlier, I, I was understanding on site is one to one off-site or credits is the one and a half or two to one.

867
01:25:30,460 --> 01:25:30,960
Okay.

868
01:25:33,020 --> 01:25:41,060
That would be my recommendation, because generally most people are not purchasing enough land to do anything over a one-to-one site.

869
01:25:41,220 --> 01:25:43,080
But which, the one-and-a-half or the two?

870
01:25:43,460 --> 01:25:44,900
I would prefer two, please.

871
01:25:45,800 --> 01:25:48,280
Let's get as much stored or pass any out there as possible.

872
01:25:48,280 --> 01:25:59,140
It sounds like the enforcement, the permitting,

873
01:25:59,380 --> 01:26:03,260
and the administration of this becomes an administrative nightmare.

874
01:26:07,960 --> 01:26:13,360
And Jason, you would be involved in something like that.

875
01:26:13,360 --> 01:26:21,540
I mean, how, it sounds like it's much of this is somewhat vague,

876
01:26:23,620 --> 01:26:28,820
it's all the right thing to be doing,

877
01:26:29,600 --> 01:26:37,580
but it's not clearly defined or can it be clearly defined in an ordinance or whatever.

878
01:26:37,580 --> 01:26:39,760
Well, I think of it differently.

879
01:26:40,000 --> 01:26:44,140
I think if you're raising your house up, you can probably prove that you don't need

880
01:26:44,140 --> 01:26:48,860
to, without hiring an engineer, just talking to the building inspector.

881
01:26:49,200 --> 01:26:53,740
But on a larger project, this is going to be a simple engineer.

882
01:26:54,000 --> 01:26:55,260
It's going to be a simple engineer, I can do that.

883
01:26:55,560 --> 01:27:00,240
Like I said, typical raising of a house, that's a pretty simple manner.

884
01:27:00,240 --> 01:27:04,740
But on a project, a simple engineer can design a plan for you.

885
01:27:04,740 --> 01:27:09,540
Yeah, I think there's some things still here and this is just the first crack at the ordinance really and I think there's some

886
01:27:09,540 --> 01:27:15,200
Still some things to refine here. Maybe what's the threshold type of project that trips it for example

887
01:27:15,720 --> 01:27:20,680
We talked about I know when we talked earlier the storage credit. We talked about maybe not doing it at all

888
01:27:20,680 --> 01:27:25,220
Yeah, but you know, but maybe there is some value of it structured a certain way

889
01:27:25,220 --> 01:27:31,200
So I mean there's some things still to be to be worked out on that, you know, there's there's arguments to be made for

890
01:27:32,420 --> 01:27:41,560
Or a lot of the minutiae of such an amendment and things like that, there's obviously

891
01:27:41,560 --> 01:27:46,600
fine tuning that needs to be done so that it works best for the town of Hampton and its

892
01:27:46,600 --> 01:27:46,900
residents.

893
01:27:47,400 --> 01:27:54,120
I would heavily argue that the benefits of doing one of these outweighs some of the headache

894
01:27:54,120 --> 01:28:00,680
and getting that move forward because there is the one, reducing a lot of flood risk or

895
01:28:00,680 --> 01:28:03,960
you know, at least not making flood risk worse through development.

896
01:28:04,360 --> 01:28:11,960
And then also the capacity potentially to do improvement projects that we traditionally have been struggling to do

897
01:28:11,960 --> 01:28:16,380
unless we find specific granting and stuff like that's real possible credit systems.

898
01:28:16,940 --> 01:28:21,060
Though once again, those come with a cost and a benefit.

899
01:28:21,380 --> 01:28:29,960
And when I had talked to Jason about it before, generally I have recoil a little bit at the idea of credit systems

900
01:28:29,960 --> 01:28:38,480
because they are so easily gamed and stuff like that, but if we do it correctly, there are plenty of examples out there of other people doing it correctly.

901
01:28:39,740 --> 01:28:47,920
There's a positive benefit out of doing it, and also it allows us to recognize that you can't do everything at one site.

902
01:28:48,460 --> 01:28:54,200
And you might not be able to find another way to do it, but we still want this project to go forth for other beneficial reasons.

903
01:28:54,760 --> 01:28:57,220
So here's an avenue to still allow this to happen.

904
01:28:58,780 --> 01:29:04,300
Yeah, it seems to me that the administration shouldn't be hard if we do the workup front

905
01:29:04,300 --> 01:29:09,980
to make sure that the ordinance is specific enough that an engineer doesn't have questions

906
01:29:09,980 --> 01:29:11,300
about what the ordinance means.

907
01:29:12,080 --> 01:29:19,680
So I think what we, you know, if we do the work now here before we submit the warning, it's

908
01:29:19,680 --> 01:29:20,960
not going to be a administrative burden.

909
01:29:20,960 --> 01:29:27,520
Can it be made specific enough to fulfill that, you know, thought?

910
01:29:28,000 --> 01:29:28,400
Absolutely.

911
01:29:28,940 --> 01:29:29,140
Okay.

912
01:29:30,040 --> 01:29:35,600
You say, I just, as I've listened to this, you know, there seems to be a lot of what-ifs.

913
01:29:36,420 --> 01:29:41,620
And if an ordinance could be drawn, that's reasonably specific.

914
01:29:42,600 --> 01:29:46,340
You know, it takes some of that subjectivity out of it, you know.

915
01:29:46,680 --> 01:29:48,520
And okay, this is what you have to do.

916
01:29:48,980 --> 01:29:53,710
A lot of creative minds are going to find our little poles and that's when we would come back and

917
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:30,300
Change our ordinance to find what we may have missed. And that's kind of exactly. Could some of this be handled in the site plan regulations? No, this should be totally under the flood plan. A lot of this depends on the ethical strength of the professional engineers that are required to put a stamp on any plans and things like that.

918
01:30:30,300 --> 01:30:39,600
I mean, these are engineering problems that need to be solved, and as much as many people

919
01:30:39,600 --> 01:30:45,540
dislike experts, if you've got a stamp, it's more than your livelihood.

920
01:30:47,340 --> 01:30:52,220
We have to think about what engineers can and cannot do.

921
01:30:53,020 --> 01:30:57,200
It's a matter of putting in, maybe, I don't know what engineering standards would have to

922
01:30:57,200 --> 01:31:01,580
go in here, but if you're going to tighten anything up, it would have to be along those

923
01:31:01,580 --> 01:31:06,360
those lines because those physics is physics.

924
01:31:06,900 --> 01:31:07,980
And I said this is physics.

925
01:31:08,580 --> 01:31:13,100
Right. Plus we also have our engineers audit that to prove out there.

926
01:31:13,500 --> 01:31:13,660
Yes.

927
01:31:13,860 --> 01:31:13,880
Yes.

928
01:31:14,040 --> 01:31:16,540
We have secondary engineers in both.

929
01:31:16,600 --> 01:31:16,740
Right.

930
01:31:17,800 --> 01:31:18,000
At NOM.

931
01:31:18,440 --> 01:31:19,020
What's that?

932
01:31:19,200 --> 01:31:19,580
At NOM.

933
01:31:21,340 --> 01:31:25,320
I mean, but much like an engineer submits like a drainage report for a project or whatever.

934
01:31:25,420 --> 01:31:30,180
There is this template here that has a spot on it for their stamp and signature.

935
01:31:30,180 --> 01:31:36,820
So, I mean, they were, I mean, much smaller scale, but they were complete this with their expertise and certify that.

936
01:31:36,920 --> 01:31:42,260
So I think that too helps alleviate some of that administrative burden that was being talked about.

937
01:31:42,640 --> 01:31:51,540
Right, and I would suggest that I mean, I think consult with some of those engineers, as we're putting this together, and say to them, you know, where are the impulse?

938
01:31:52,020 --> 01:31:57,880
Let's close the impulse before, so we don't have to come back and redo the ordinance next year.

939
01:31:58,440 --> 01:32:00,560
Any money in the budget to talk to CME?

940
01:32:02,860 --> 01:32:07,180
I would think that a number of engineers would be interested, you know, particularly those

941
01:32:07,180 --> 01:32:12,920
that work within this area, you know, would be interested in having their input heard.

942
01:32:13,400 --> 01:32:16,240
So I don't think that that would incur any cost.

943
01:32:18,660 --> 01:32:20,080
And it's got more spare time.

944
01:32:20,080 --> 01:32:20,220
I'm sorry.

945
01:32:22,360 --> 01:32:32,400
Assuming a credit system, how will those who pay into this credit system know that whatever

946
01:32:32,400 --> 01:32:39,200
they were buying was done and how long does the town have to achieve that?

947
01:32:39,940 --> 01:32:49,620
So what I would generally kind of advise is, the best methodology for doing this is essentially

948
01:32:49,620 --> 01:32:53,080
creating a fund that this we can see did too.

949
01:32:53,630 --> 01:33:00,540
That way we're not specifically saying you're paying for a certain linear footage of this project over here.

950
01:33:00,760 --> 01:33:06,320
But instead saying, okay, we have a separate fund that has been set aside built by this credit system.

951
01:33:06,800 --> 01:33:11,820
And then when we need to do great matching for a project or

952
01:33:11,820 --> 01:33:18,260
to, we find something that we can use that money for, that improves the special flood hazard area.

953
01:33:18,260 --> 01:33:23,400
It reduces what increases blood capacity and reduces blood risk.

954
01:33:23,660 --> 01:33:26,980
That's when that money would be spent towards it through this credit system.

955
01:33:27,320 --> 01:33:37,320
It's a mechanism to build the kind of funding that many of the projects in the road map need that would benefit this entire zone, this special flood hazard area.

956
01:33:37,800 --> 01:33:39,720
So that's where that would be going into.

957
01:33:39,900 --> 01:33:43,060
So they would pay into that and they would get a receipt for doing that.

958
01:33:43,060 --> 01:33:49,040
So, and then, you know, we would be announcing we're using this money for this project.

959
01:33:49,180 --> 01:33:56,420
It might not be that month, it might not be that year, but, you know, next time we need to come up with, you know, money for another mental

960
01:33:56,420 --> 01:34:00,500
Pontite project, we would be able to, we would be able to have access to that.

961
01:34:00,720 --> 01:34:11,240
So they would be assessed on a specific cube, I don't know, cubic footage or whatever the assessment mechanism is, but

962
01:34:11,240 --> 01:34:19,220
But that does not necessarily need to translate into the same amount of storage within

963
01:34:19,620 --> 01:34:25,080
experience of time it is contributing to solving this entire problem for Hampton.

964
01:34:26,840 --> 01:34:35,100
In general, what we want is to be using that money so that we're not reducing storage over a long term.

965
01:34:35,100 --> 01:34:45,100
So, I would not anticipate this fund to be building up, that's one of the ease of financial finances for us to use down the line.

966
01:34:45,420 --> 01:34:51,680
So it would be used fairly quickly, because what we don't want to do is let it sit there for two to five years.

967
01:34:52,080 --> 01:35:03,800
And then, while people decrease the capacity and we build up a large fund to do projects, but it is a very much an option for creating the type of funding for these things.

968
01:35:03,800 --> 01:35:10,480
as long as we're spending it wisely and we're using it frequently to make sure that we're not making the problem worse ourselves.

969
01:35:10,860 --> 01:35:14,720
But if we don't know the budget of the project we're trying to solve,

970
01:35:14,960 --> 01:35:17,980
how do you know what a share would cost to buy in?

971
01:35:20,520 --> 01:35:31,180
If I don't, if you don't know what we're not you, but if we don't know what projects we want to achieve and it has a dollar value.

972
01:35:31,180 --> 01:35:44,620
So Sharon's not going to know how many dollars she has to put in to offset her hundred units of how do you set a value for the trade off if we don't know what we're doing with the money.

973
01:35:44,940 --> 01:35:46,980
We know what marshaly mediation costs.

974
01:35:47,780 --> 01:35:50,080
But he said we might not do a marshaly.

975
01:35:50,260 --> 01:35:50,740
So what?

976
01:35:51,780 --> 01:35:54,360
That's what we would call it to be based on that value.

977
01:35:54,580 --> 01:35:55,020
Could be.

978
01:35:55,020 --> 01:35:57,020
today, and then change next time?

979
01:35:57,380 --> 01:35:58,760
I've just said these.

980
01:35:58,880 --> 01:36:00,500
There are numerous, there are numerous reasons.

981
01:36:00,500 --> 01:36:12,720
A great, but we need to determine, for how much an individual have to pay, what the pool is of the cost that we're trying to offset.

982
01:36:14,540 --> 01:36:22,780
But that could change, and that's my point, so it wouldn't it be better to base it on A.

983
01:36:22,780 --> 01:36:28,180
the mediation type that is, I don't know, I don't know,

984
01:36:28,460 --> 01:36:31,380
it's a median mediation type.

985
01:36:31,900 --> 01:36:38,300
Well, rather than putting a specific dollar amount in the

986
01:36:38,300 --> 01:36:45,020
ordinance, you know, say subject to the current standards

987
01:36:45,020 --> 01:36:48,860
established by the town, you know, be that, you know, you

988
01:36:48,860 --> 01:36:55,320
or the various, whatever department would be, you know, administering and overseeing it.

989
01:36:55,660 --> 01:36:56,960
How do you get that random number, though?

990
01:36:58,280 --> 01:37:01,160
Based on existing projects.

991
01:37:03,000 --> 01:37:07,480
And that will change over time, you know, and that's why, if the ordinance had something

992
01:37:07,480 --> 01:37:16,980
to the effect of subject to a standard established by the town, that doesn't need to be in the

993
01:37:16,980 --> 01:37:21,440
would, and it's the town could say, okay, this year it's $100 or for it.

994
01:37:21,540 --> 01:37:23,600
Next year maybe it's $250 for it.

995
01:37:23,620 --> 01:37:26,220
That may be the amount doesn't need to be in the ordinance.

996
01:37:26,420 --> 01:37:29,120
We have to understand how the fund and the amount is derived.

997
01:37:29,760 --> 01:37:35,040
But wouldn't that be based on projects that are currently on the way or or anticipated

998
01:37:35,040 --> 01:37:36,400
or in budgeted?

999
01:37:36,620 --> 01:37:40,200
There are some projects on this list that don't have dollar values.

1000
01:37:40,360 --> 01:37:42,720
They have $3 signs, they have a single dollar sign.

1001
01:37:43,400 --> 01:37:45,920
So those are remediation projects.

1002
01:37:46,440 --> 01:37:54,800
Yeah, I don't know if you need to define the number I'm just saying in accordance with whatever other document that's being prepared.

1003
01:37:54,980 --> 01:37:57,600
Right, that's among the things that I just talked about.

1004
01:37:57,760 --> 01:38:11,280
No, to mention, if you're creating a report calling this a fund, okay, if this is a fund, any funds taken from the fund to pay for something are going to require one or an article.

1005
01:38:11,280 --> 01:38:14,240
And you know, it has to be probably under the

1006
01:38:14,240 --> 01:38:17,060
Gospels of the trustees of the trust funds.

1007
01:38:17,200 --> 01:38:17,480
Yeah.

1008
01:38:18,980 --> 01:38:19,840
I'm going to be.

1009
01:38:21,000 --> 01:38:22,060
That's my point.

1010
01:38:22,540 --> 01:38:23,360
Maybe probably.

1011
01:38:23,580 --> 01:38:24,240
That's what I say.

1012
01:38:24,500 --> 01:38:24,760
Yeah.

1013
01:38:25,000 --> 01:38:25,360
Yeah.

1014
01:38:25,360 --> 01:38:25,580
Yeah.

1015
01:38:25,580 --> 01:38:25,720
Yeah.

1016
01:38:29,440 --> 01:38:31,440
Let's just say that it's at the discretion.

1017
01:38:31,580 --> 01:38:38,900
Well, I mean, this is this is the ordinance telling people you can do this and you can do this and you can do this and you can do this if you do the following.

1018
01:38:38,900 --> 01:38:46,920
When you start going beyond the ordinance, talking about funds and credits and things like that, that's just like boards.

1019
01:38:47,460 --> 01:38:48,240
Not necessarily.

1020
01:38:48,240 --> 01:38:48,380
Not necessarily.

1021
01:38:49,400 --> 01:38:52,640
But it's not something you can't set up something like that in an ordinance.

1022
01:38:53,020 --> 01:38:57,060
Well, you can write the ordinance so that it sets up a fund just like the ambulance fund.

1023
01:38:57,600 --> 01:39:00,160
Yeah, it would have to be separate from the actual zoning.

1024
01:39:00,460 --> 01:39:01,780
But we know we're buying an ambulance.

1025
01:39:03,040 --> 01:39:03,360
Right.

1026
01:39:06,000 --> 01:39:10,260
We don't know when it's going for the ambulance or for other types of gear, but it's the limit

1027
01:39:10,260 --> 01:39:10,920
into that.

1028
01:39:11,520 --> 01:39:11,640
Right.

1029
01:39:12,340 --> 01:39:12,580
Exactly.

1030
01:39:13,360 --> 01:39:15,600
So it's limited to the remediation projects.

1031
01:39:16,140 --> 01:39:16,200
Right.

1032
01:39:16,320 --> 01:39:20,440
Well, he was saying that you would be buying remitting a ditch with this example he kept using.

1033
01:39:20,720 --> 01:39:22,620
So that's our mindset we're thinking.

1034
01:39:22,760 --> 01:39:23,180
That's wonderful.

1035
01:39:23,800 --> 01:39:23,840
Right.

1036
01:39:24,160 --> 01:39:26,300
But my point is easy to put your arms around.

1037
01:39:26,420 --> 01:39:28,800
It's not a random number.

1038
01:39:29,420 --> 01:39:33,060
It's an estimate across various projects.

1039
01:39:33,060 --> 01:39:40,000
We don't know which project we're going to do first or second or which one we're going to get matching funds for what to do.

1040
01:39:40,800 --> 01:39:41,780
But it's an estimate.

1041
01:39:43,380 --> 01:39:46,600
I'd like to understand that a little better like what the estimate is.

1042
01:39:47,040 --> 01:39:50,720
But I think this is all an angle that we had not considered prior to this kind of action.

1043
01:39:50,960 --> 01:39:53,320
But we're talking about remediation.

1044
01:39:53,320 --> 01:40:10,580
But we're talking about assessing a project for an item, not how we are, assuming they're buying a credit, not how we are making up for that loss of storage, right?

1045
01:40:10,580 --> 01:40:25,840
Right, that second part would be up to, I don't know, you or whomever it's up to to wisely use those funds to achieve the additional storage that was lost, that other project.

1046
01:40:25,840 --> 01:40:37,360
That climate ready Hampton would look at what that money could be used for for the best remediation type projects and stuff like that.

1047
01:40:37,540 --> 01:40:52,920
So in general, something I mentioned a little earlier, in general, what most credit programs do is they pre-decide what the value of, say, a cubic yard or a cubic foot of lost storage is worth.

1048
01:40:53,460 --> 01:40:59,440
Some places, as I mentioned before, do this based off of the cost of how much it costs to put in that fill.

1049
01:40:59,660 --> 01:41:07,560
So if you put in a 100 cubic feet of fill, what did that cost you to do with a building company?

1050
01:41:08,220 --> 01:41:13,920
And they say, you need to pay that amount into some of these credit systems.

1051
01:41:14,240 --> 01:41:16,700
Other ways to determine it through various other means.

1052
01:41:16,700 --> 01:41:26,640
But in general, what we're trying to say is that the cost should be associated at least with the minimum types of projects that we're doing.

1053
01:41:26,860 --> 01:41:32,400
But one project doesn't necessarily need to be the one that does the remediation.

1054
01:41:33,120 --> 01:41:39,400
So we have, for lack of a better term, a schmory sport of projects that we do that would do this.

1055
01:41:39,400 --> 01:41:46,020
your example of gravel for gravel costs is very different than something that's more

1056
01:41:47,560 --> 01:41:52,040
idealistic of what we're going to do this or we're buying some land you know

1057
01:41:52,040 --> 01:41:56,180
because you know what your cost of your gravel is. That's very different than

1058
01:41:56,180 --> 01:42:02,380
saying ditch remediation, buying land, or some of these other things that we could

1059
01:42:04,300 --> 01:42:12,460
I agree with it because if I'm a developer, and I have the cost, and it's not attributed

1060
01:42:12,460 --> 01:42:18,020
to something tangible, I'd be talking to my lawyer next, if I think it's obituary.

1061
01:42:21,400 --> 01:42:27,440
If I were a developer, if I were a developer, and I knew what the cost was, I wouldn't care

1062
01:42:27,440 --> 01:42:30,920
how it was spent as long as I knew it was going to be spent through that purpose.

1063
01:42:31,940 --> 01:42:40,400
Right. Are there models, existing models of this that you may want to base aspects of

1064
01:42:40,400 --> 01:42:47,680
your proposal on that we could see and that we could perhaps use to help communicate this

1065
01:42:47,680 --> 01:42:52,380
to the people who will be voting on it? Yeah, absolutely. I can put those together.

1066
01:42:53,380 --> 01:42:55,840
Nationally, there are several here in New Hampshire that have done it.

1067
01:42:56,120 --> 01:43:03,120
Key New Hampshire is one that we have looked at as part of developing this ordinance proposal.

1068
01:43:03,740 --> 01:43:13,940
I'm very happy to put those all together for you guys and produce this is how credit systems have worked in other states, other towns, and stuff like that.

1069
01:43:14,140 --> 01:43:22,080
And as well as some of the ratio decisions that were made because I think that that's also part of this is.

1070
01:43:22,080 --> 01:43:28,760
You know, do you do one-to-one outside of the area or do you do two-to-one, you know, or do we want them to do 20-to-one?

1071
01:43:28,960 --> 01:43:29,600
That would be correct.

1072
01:43:30,740 --> 01:43:39,380
I think that would be very helpful is how they calculated the costs or the cost of the credits.

1073
01:43:40,200 --> 01:43:47,160
You know, and, you know, if we had some, not necessarily in the ordinance itself,

1074
01:43:47,160 --> 01:43:58,900
But some sort of a standard or maybe a method of calculating what a credit would sell for.

1075
01:43:59,920 --> 01:44:00,600
Yeah.

1076
01:44:01,980 --> 01:44:11,060
As I don't want to speak for everybody here, though I suspect I may be, in saying that we don't want to do anything to discourage

1077
01:44:11,060 --> 01:44:17,720
which landowners from taking some of the right steps and raising a property or whatever,

1078
01:44:17,980 --> 01:44:26,460
but if they are totally flummoxed by this or it becomes something that prevents a beneficial

1079
01:44:26,460 --> 01:44:35,220
project from going forward, that's not reason to trash this, but it would be good to think

1080
01:44:35,220 --> 01:44:45,040
about at what point this could become onerous. And from what I'm hearing, it wouldn't because

1081
01:44:45,040 --> 01:44:54,900
it's related to the project size and so forth. But I don't want people, voters in particular.

1082
01:45:01,900 --> 01:45:17,080
We're looking for some slush fund for the town and we have no idea how they're going to use it or how much we're going to have to pay and I can't do this project now and so forth. Which sounds kind of like what's happened here tonight.

1083
01:45:17,080 --> 01:45:32,980
To me, all of this makes great good sense and we need to achieve that we need to be able to communicate this whole thing in a way that is easy enough for people to understand and to follow.

1084
01:45:34,060 --> 01:45:40,760
Absolutely. I think that there's some really good opportunities for advocacy and outreach through doing this.

1085
01:45:40,760 --> 01:45:48,840
to before this goes up for vote that makes it very clear to people exactly how this works.

1086
01:45:49,500 --> 01:46:00,560
Once we have a good draft decided upon and we've narrowed down some of these outline questions about like ratio work and costs and

1087
01:46:00,560 --> 01:46:06,660
stuff like that to explicitly lay out exactly how it works, what types of projects would it would not qualify for.

1088
01:46:07,480 --> 01:46:09,320
That's something I'm very happy to do.

1089
01:46:09,420 --> 01:46:11,160
I love doing outreach projects with everybody

1090
01:46:11,160 --> 01:46:12,500
and it's sharing those kind of questions.

1091
01:46:13,380 --> 01:46:16,180
And maybe a good starting point now would be that and I can,

1092
01:46:16,480 --> 01:46:18,500
and I think we've heard a lot of good information tonight

1093
01:46:18,500 --> 01:46:19,940
from the board here.

1094
01:46:20,480 --> 01:46:22,280
We could take back and go back and meet

1095
01:46:22,280 --> 01:46:25,480
and discuss what we heard and kind of refine that.

1096
01:46:25,600 --> 01:46:26,840
Maybe there's things we would include,

1097
01:46:26,980 --> 01:46:28,560
things we wouldn't include and come back to you

1098
01:46:28,560 --> 01:46:32,040
with another refined draft, some more information

1099
01:46:32,040 --> 01:46:32,880
that Ben was talking about.

1100
01:46:32,940 --> 01:46:36,260
He was going to compile and see how the board feels

1101
01:46:36,260 --> 01:46:37,180
is about that at that point.

1102
01:46:37,620 --> 01:46:38,740
I think that is more important.

1103
01:46:39,000 --> 01:46:39,440
It's a question to that.

1104
01:46:39,680 --> 01:46:39,820
Yeah.

1105
01:46:41,880 --> 01:46:42,060
Absolutely.

1106
01:46:43,320 --> 01:46:43,640
Excellent.

1107
01:46:44,500 --> 01:46:44,780
Great.

1108
01:46:46,960 --> 01:46:47,400
Sorry.

1109
01:46:47,620 --> 01:46:48,420
I'm wondering all the more.

1110
01:46:49,320 --> 01:46:49,960
Oh, yeah.

1111
01:46:50,460 --> 01:46:50,900
Absolutely.

1112
01:46:51,440 --> 01:46:52,120
No, it's that.

1113
01:46:54,580 --> 01:46:56,420
That's better or worse than you thought it might be.

1114
01:46:56,800 --> 01:46:57,180
Oh, no.

1115
01:46:57,320 --> 01:46:59,200
This is exactly kind of what I was hoping for.

1116
01:46:59,320 --> 01:47:04,180
I wanted a discussion about these things because there are many different ways that we can go

1117
01:47:04,180 --> 01:47:04,700
with this.

1118
01:47:04,700 --> 01:47:09,800
And I just want to make sure that it's what you guys want and what the town wants.

1119
01:47:10,260 --> 01:47:14,200
And so, you know, I'm happy to do all this, I find it very interesting.

1120
01:47:14,540 --> 01:47:18,560
So, you know, I'm happy to do all this, we just got to make sure that's the right way to

1121
01:47:18,560 --> 01:47:18,880
do it.

1122
01:47:19,060 --> 01:47:24,300
So, you know, I'm glad to get all this kind of input so we can make sure that's the best

1123
01:47:24,300 --> 01:47:26,920
draft that goes out there and provides the most positive.

1124
01:47:27,520 --> 01:47:32,360
Well, I mean, we're currently living in a town where people are experiencing flood damage

1125
01:47:32,360 --> 01:47:47,640
and we're operating under a default budget, so not that either of us, particularly by themselves as anything to do with us, but concerns and suspicions, I think are, you know, to address.

1126
01:47:47,960 --> 01:48:01,540
I think there's a lot of opportunities for the kind of outreach and transparency and exactly why these are created, how they work and who would actually affect and what triggers certain conditions that, you know,

1127
01:48:01,540 --> 01:48:06,960
So that can be done through really good outreach programs that we know that those systems

1128
01:48:06,960 --> 01:48:10,320
can work that will usually alleviate those kind of fears.

1129
01:48:10,760 --> 01:48:10,880
Okay.

1130
01:48:11,500 --> 01:48:12,260
Thank you.

1131
01:48:12,820 --> 01:48:13,380
Absolutely.

1132
01:48:13,580 --> 01:48:14,080
Thank you guys.

1133
01:48:14,400 --> 01:48:15,740
Appreciate it very much.

1134
01:48:16,180 --> 01:48:16,540
Thank you.

1135
01:48:17,220 --> 01:48:18,960
We learned something over the day.

1136
01:48:20,200 --> 01:48:21,580
You've started it every day.

1137
01:48:22,560 --> 01:48:23,120
Wow.

1138
01:48:26,680 --> 01:48:28,480
We're Jack Balltrade's master.

1139
01:48:28,820 --> 01:48:29,100
Okay.

1140
01:48:29,960 --> 01:48:31,080
Impervious surface.

1141
01:48:47,400 --> 01:48:50,160
So, I don't have the agenda in front of me. We're sharing with Ampera Service.

1142
01:48:50,360 --> 01:48:51,200
Yeah, we'll start with that one.

1143
01:48:58,820 --> 01:48:59,140
So,

1144
01:49:03,880 --> 01:49:05,860
this is the existing... No?

1145
01:49:06,540 --> 01:49:12,680
Yeah, you don't have this in your documents. I had done an initial version and then Briana met with the Conservation Commission.

1146
01:49:13,380 --> 01:49:15,900
And I don't think you've printed new copies of this.

1147
01:49:16,060 --> 01:49:17,140
I didn't print copies of this.

1148
01:49:17,140 --> 01:49:18,040
That's fine. It's on the screen.

1149
01:49:18,140 --> 01:49:18,780
Yeah. All right.

1150
01:49:18,780 --> 01:49:19,700
I just want to look at the board now.

1151
01:49:19,940 --> 01:49:20,160
Okay.

1152
01:49:20,440 --> 01:49:20,540
Yeah.

1153
01:49:20,700 --> 01:49:28,360
So, this is the existing language for impervious surface, and I'm proposing just a little

1154
01:49:28,360 --> 01:49:32,300
bit of a conversation about this, the conservation commission had some thoughts about it.

1155
01:49:33,380 --> 01:49:39,420
And the reason that it's come up is because perviousness is a spectrum.

1156
01:49:40,580 --> 01:49:45,040
Most things are not 100% pervious, or 100% impervious.

1157
01:49:45,040 --> 01:49:52,040
And in the town of Hampton, we currently call DEX impervious.

1158
01:49:52,900 --> 01:49:57,020
There are some conditions here, but generally DEX are considered impervious.

1159
01:49:59,700 --> 01:50:05,940
And patios, pervious patios, if they are constructed using pervious pavers,

1160
01:50:06,420 --> 01:50:10,060
and engineered subsurface layers are considered pervious.

1161
01:50:11,420 --> 01:50:20,100
A pervious patio paver, most of the materials on the market, that paver in and of itself

1162
01:50:20,100 --> 01:50:22,160
is not a pervious material.

1163
01:50:22,520 --> 01:50:26,500
It has some permeability, but it's very minimal.

1164
01:50:26,760 --> 01:50:31,960
It's called a pervious system because of the joint materials that are pervious and because

1165
01:50:31,960 --> 01:50:35,460
of the subsurface, what's constructed underneath.

1166
01:50:35,460 --> 01:50:50,080
And so if we're looking at it from that perspective, I'm having a hard time as an individual looking at this ordinance regularly calling DEX impervious and patio's pervious.

1167
01:50:50,720 --> 01:50:58,300
Again, it's a spectrum. Some DEX might be a lot less pervious than some patios and vice versa.

1168
01:50:58,300 --> 01:51:10,460
But I think, functionally, they are similar enough most of the time that it doesn't make sense to separate them, and I'm seeing more and more pushback from applicants with this definition.

1169
01:51:11,380 --> 01:51:20,780
And rightfully so, the example, I mean, the times that I've gotten pushback from applicants, they had a really good point that their deck was probably more pervious than many patios.

1170
01:51:22,460 --> 01:51:38,760
I think just to get ahead of some questions and some of the conversation from the Conservation Commission in previous years has been that, you know, it's easier to say that there's not going to be storage under pervious patio because in order for it to be a pervious patio, it has to be constructed properly.

1171
01:51:40,220 --> 01:51:47,740
And you can take away some of the perviousness or permeability of a deck by putting storage underneath it or putting furniture on it.

1172
01:51:47,740 --> 01:51:50,440
And you can put furniture on patios.

1173
01:51:51,480 --> 01:51:59,080
So some of the caveats that were much more kind of prevalent in the conversation with

1174
01:51:59,080 --> 01:52:03,620
the Conservation Commission over the past few years is starting to make less sense to

1175
01:52:03,620 --> 01:52:03,820
me.

1176
01:52:04,360 --> 01:52:10,080
And I brought this back to the Conservation Commission and they have, you know, agreed that even though

1177
01:52:10,080 --> 01:52:14,320
permeability is a spectrum, and I really want to emphasize that because I don't, just,

1178
01:52:14,320 --> 01:52:26,080
I know you probably all understand that for anybody watching at home and hearing this conversation it's really important to know that permeability is a spectrum and we have to draw these lines somewhere that makes the most sense.

1179
01:52:26,900 --> 01:52:32,920
So in my mind, the most sense is that decks should be considered pervious.

1180
01:52:34,340 --> 01:52:40,060
Now, the existing language, like I said, most of the time decks are considered impervious.

1181
01:52:40,280 --> 01:52:46,780
There are some conditions here where a deck could be considered impervious, generally that's

1182
01:52:46,780 --> 01:52:52,500
if it is more than six feet off the ground and constructed in a certain way, that those

1183
01:52:52,500 --> 01:53:00,340
construction conditions come from the UNH Stormwater Center so that's a standard that's been used

1184
01:53:00,340 --> 01:53:07,160
around the country. It also mentions a distinction with the aquifer, this actually,

1185
01:53:07,280 --> 01:53:11,440
this language didn't get updated when the update happened, but it, the groundwater protection

1186
01:53:11,440 --> 01:53:16,600
district and the wetland conservation district have additional criteria because those are generally

1187
01:53:16,600 --> 01:53:17,820
more sensitive zones.

1188
01:53:22,080 --> 01:53:27,100
I'm proposing to simplify this substantially because I think it makes

1189
01:53:27,100 --> 01:53:30,600
sense, and I like when things are simple, you're easier to interpret.

1190
01:53:33,580 --> 01:53:40,780
So, and Jason and I also talked about taking out standards from definition, so it might

1191
01:53:40,780 --> 01:53:44,240
make sense to actually move this somewhere else in the ordinance, but I think just the

1192
01:53:44,240 --> 01:53:46,200
message here is what we're talking about right now.

1193
01:53:48,640 --> 01:53:51,900
So the first option here is the most simple one.

1194
01:53:51,900 --> 01:53:58,000
So using the same construction conditions and requiring that DEX are built to those standards

1195
01:53:58,960 --> 01:54:03,360
and requiring that they're not covered by a roof or enclosed above or below,

1196
01:54:03,660 --> 01:54:08,680
and that the area below remains entirely pervious, meaning it's not used as storage.

1197
01:54:10,480 --> 01:54:13,080
That's the first example pretty straightforward.

1198
01:54:13,520 --> 01:54:17,720
Just eliminating the conditions about the groundwater protection district and the wetland

1199
01:54:17,720 --> 01:54:24,120
conservation district, the height off the ground, the size, just keeping it like this.

1200
01:54:25,100 --> 01:54:34,540
The second option is a little bit more involved because, again, the groundwater protection

1201
01:54:34,540 --> 01:54:37,280
districts and the conservation district are more sensitive.

1202
01:54:38,040 --> 01:54:44,360
So it might make sense to put an additional condition here, recognizing, again, I'm going

1203
01:54:44,360 --> 01:54:50,680
repeat myself that permeability is a spectrum. And so in an area where we want to be more conservative

1204
01:54:50,680 --> 01:54:57,480
with impervious surface, we have an opportunity to do that with restrict emphasize of the deck

1205
01:54:57,480 --> 01:55:05,480
that we would consider to be pervious. So saying anything above 160 square feet in size

1206
01:55:06,200 --> 01:55:13,480
would be considered would be subject to 100% of that total surface being considered impervious.

1207
01:55:15,020 --> 01:55:20,200
which is reminiscent of the original language from this, anyway.

1208
01:55:21,160 --> 01:55:24,480
So, just pulling that back in, but in a different, in a different way.

1209
01:55:27,000 --> 01:55:29,380
I'll stop there if there are any questions.

1210
01:55:30,780 --> 01:55:43,320
Why couldn't the definition be the same, but assuming that these two definitions offer a broader spectrum

1211
01:55:43,320 --> 01:55:54,080
of permeability, not say that within groundwater protection or, you know, applicable districts,

1212
01:55:54,560 --> 01:56:01,380
you have to also achieve or you are limited to, as opposed to having two different definitions

1213
01:56:03,100 --> 01:56:04,880
of impervious service.

1214
01:56:06,630 --> 01:56:10,560
I think I understand what you're asking, but correct me if I'm on the wrong track here.

1215
01:56:11,260 --> 01:56:15,480
I'm just showing you two different options for this ordinance language.

1216
01:56:15,740 --> 01:56:17,080
There wouldn't be two different definitions.

1217
01:56:17,760 --> 01:56:22,100
So this option is just a simple definition that doesn't introduce that additional caveat.

1218
01:56:22,540 --> 01:56:27,160
This second option has that additional caveat for the groundwater protection district.

1219
01:56:27,420 --> 01:56:36,920
Does it really make that, is the spectrum of permeability really that difference between three and six foot high deck?

1220
01:56:38,740 --> 01:56:46,520
I don't have the, we don't have science to back that up, really.

1221
01:56:47,980 --> 01:56:53,220
I'm proposing to eliminate the height requirements because I don't think it makes a lot of sense.

1222
01:56:53,460 --> 01:56:54,500
Right. I agree.

1223
01:56:54,920 --> 01:57:00,300
So I'm proposing to take that link, in both definitions, that language about the height requirement is not there.

1224
01:57:00,300 --> 01:57:07,900
The only difference between this definition, the simpler one, which is just saying all, basically all decks are pervious.

1225
01:57:08,440 --> 01:57:18,300
And this one, which is all decks are pervious, but if a deck is less than six feet off the ground and it's in the ground water protection district or the wetland conservation district.

1226
01:57:18,880 --> 01:57:22,000
And the deck is bigger than 160 square feet.

1227
01:57:22,000 --> 01:57:31,180
any of that overage 161, so let's say it's a 200 square foot deck, that additional 40 square feet could not be considered pervious.

1228
01:57:31,780 --> 01:57:38,480
So basically you're only allowed to consider 160 square feet of your deck to be pervious in these zones.

1229
01:57:40,080 --> 01:57:44,240
Again, a deck doesn't stop being pervious at 160 square feet.

1230
01:57:44,240 --> 01:57:53,780
It's just a method to introduce some some restriction here where we want to be a little bit more conservative with the impervious surface.

1231
01:57:55,140 --> 01:58:03,220
I don't know how much it's going to matter in most scenarios, but sometimes people on small lots want to make the most of it and they want to put a huge deck.

1232
01:58:04,460 --> 01:58:12,780
And a deck is not as pervious as ground, vegetated ground, even crushed stone that's not being driven on.

1233
01:58:15,520 --> 01:58:22,940
So, it's very subjective and this is, again, the approach to kind of draw a line to make some clarity.

1234
01:58:23,740 --> 01:58:28,740
Yeah, in our conversation, in our conversations, I'm just gravitating toward option one here.

1235
01:58:29,080 --> 01:58:33,220
Thinking that, you know, let's just make it simpler and let's test it out.

1236
01:58:33,640 --> 01:58:36,180
On the other hand, I think there's a valid point.

1237
01:58:36,360 --> 01:58:38,980
I mean, somebody might try to deck their whole backyard.

1238
01:58:38,980 --> 01:58:47,780
That was kind of the one thing that, you know, I was a little bit concerned, but I still gravitate toward one, but again, I open to the board, I'm sorry, just go ahead.

1239
01:58:48,080 --> 01:58:48,180
No.

1240
01:58:48,480 --> 01:58:55,760
If this is a definition, the definition of a pervious doesn't change depending on what disordered.

1241
01:58:56,600 --> 01:59:05,280
Yeah, exactly. That's why I gave that note earlier. This is currently in the definition now. There's lots of standards here.

1242
01:59:05,280 --> 01:59:10,320
So Jason and I spoke about removing the conditions from the definition.

1243
01:59:10,660 --> 01:59:15,100
The definition will stay the same, but this condition might get added somewhere else in the ordinance.

1244
01:59:15,740 --> 01:59:16,280
Yeah. Okay.

1245
01:59:16,500 --> 01:59:17,380
That makes sense to me.

1246
01:59:18,340 --> 01:59:19,180
Where's Patios?

1247
01:59:20,440 --> 01:59:24,540
We're going to have 160 square foot of patio and then, okay, put it.

1248
01:59:24,620 --> 01:59:26,980
So we're not really saying that.

1249
01:59:27,080 --> 01:59:35,260
Right, so that's where I also gravitate toward option one because I don't think it makes any sense to treat these surfaces.

1250
01:59:35,260 --> 01:59:40,540
is differently, and currently, and it is a concern. People are probably more likely to

1251
01:59:40,540 --> 01:59:47,700
do 100% patio than they are deck, and people have. Yeah, I've seen that happen. So it's

1252
01:59:47,700 --> 01:59:50,940
It's not restricted and I'm not proposing that changes.

1253
01:59:53,640 --> 01:59:54,980
Explain that in another way.

1254
02:00:00,980 --> 02:00:30,960
The way that this proposal introduces restrictions for decks in the Wetland Conservation District and the Groundwater Protection District. Those restrictions currently not apply to patios, and I am not proposing that any restrictions are added to patios in these districts. While the concern still remains, and I would, when people come into my office, I say it's not preferable, it's not a good use of your property.

1255
02:00:30,960 --> 02:00:35,420
property, especially if you're an aerosol marsh, I'm very vocal about that, but that's

1256
02:00:35,420 --> 02:00:39,900
the extent of what I can say, because we don't have anything that restricts the size of

1257
02:00:39,900 --> 02:00:46,500
a patio, and I am not proposing that to change existing language about decks.

1258
02:00:51,410 --> 02:00:52,150
So I guess

1259
02:00:52,150 --> 02:00:54,690
they're still not defined? Defined?

1260
02:00:55,270 --> 02:01:00,930
Cadiosis being the same. Okay, that's what I was curious about. Because we're changing

1261
02:01:00,930 --> 02:01:06,010
this because patios are similar, but yet when I'm changing patios to be similar to that.

1262
02:01:06,030 --> 02:01:06,290
Correct.

1263
02:01:06,890 --> 02:01:07,010
Okay.

1264
02:01:07,490 --> 02:01:08,510
So that's what I do.

1265
02:01:08,810 --> 02:01:09,630
My circle is confused.

1266
02:01:09,710 --> 02:01:10,110
Yeah, yeah.

1267
02:01:10,250 --> 02:01:10,790
It is confusing.

1268
02:01:10,990 --> 02:01:17,150
And I mean, again, I'm not, I like Jason, I'm not gravitating towards the second option, but

1269
02:01:17,150 --> 02:01:25,030
I just wanted to introduce it for the conversation about potentially developing some language to restrict

1270
02:01:25,730 --> 02:01:28,890
in the zones that are more sensitive.

1271
02:01:30,790 --> 02:01:31,310
I'm

1272
02:01:41,100 --> 02:01:44,980
just thinking about the potential for challenge.

1273
02:01:45,400 --> 02:01:46,580
Who is she the number one again?

1274
02:01:51,320 --> 02:01:54,120
Which one is recommended by conservation?

1275
02:01:55,740 --> 02:01:58,440
They were split. They wanted to hear what you said.

1276
02:01:58,940 --> 02:02:02,700
It was a spirited conversation.

1277
02:02:03,320 --> 02:02:05,040
It has been for years.

1278
02:02:06,220 --> 02:02:07,120
They were pretty split.

1279
02:02:07,120 --> 02:02:23,530
But they were curious about your thoughts as a board and they generally agree that Dex and patio should be considered the same when it comes to herbiasness.

1280
02:02:24,670 --> 02:02:25,230
So

1281
02:02:27,760 --> 02:02:31,040
that would be number one, definitely not pervious.

1282
02:02:32,300 --> 02:02:39,620
I mean, you can have pervious papers, but I don't believe that they're solid.

1283
02:02:40,300 --> 02:02:45,780
I mean, you put water on it. I don't think it's going to sink down in any appreciable amount of time.

1284
02:02:45,780 --> 02:02:50,340
It's going to evaporate faster, but I've never had one in my hand.

1285
02:02:51,400 --> 02:02:52,300
It's not the papers.

1286
02:02:52,300 --> 02:02:52,700
Yeah.

1287
02:02:52,700 --> 02:02:55,580
If I understand, I'll use it on the space between the fibers.

1288
02:02:55,680 --> 02:03:01,200
Yeah, I mean, six inches across the zone and then 12 inches across the zone, sand, right?

1289
02:03:01,500 --> 02:03:01,580
Yeah.

1290
02:03:01,580 --> 02:03:03,840
And then you have to maintain it.

1291
02:03:04,200 --> 02:03:05,280
The vacuuming.

1292
02:03:05,460 --> 02:03:06,860
Yeah, the vacuuming part.

1293
02:03:07,160 --> 02:03:08,140
How many people are there?

1294
02:03:08,140 --> 02:03:11,720
So the vacuuming part, so let me just clarify that.

1295
02:03:11,820 --> 02:03:15,500
Pervious patios actually require a lot less maintenance than pervious asphalt.

1296
02:03:15,840 --> 02:03:16,040
Okay.

1297
02:03:16,440 --> 02:03:21,480
So pervious patios are a little, they have a little bit more longevity in terms of their permeability

1298
02:03:21,480 --> 02:03:33,400
Because they, they, you can maintain them, but it doesn't change that much about them unless something happens, like unless there's a storm or, you know, some damage or something.

1299
02:03:33,980 --> 02:03:41,700
But poor as asphalt is designed to be maintained regularly because those voids get filled pretty easily, yeah, quickly.

1300
02:03:43,300 --> 02:03:48,860
Certainly, I'm not just curaging maintenance for pavers, and I think some O&M's require

1301
02:03:48,860 --> 02:03:54,160
it per the manufacturer's specifications, but they are designed to function better

1302
02:03:54,160 --> 02:03:54,760
without it.

1303
02:03:56,060 --> 02:04:01,840
I have seen pavers that are kind of like a grid, and it's just soil underneath, and stuff

1304
02:04:01,840 --> 02:04:02,680
grows up through it.

1305
02:04:03,500 --> 02:04:04,300
I like those.

1306
02:04:05,580 --> 02:04:08,960
Yeah, those are, you know, a different type, they function very well.

1307
02:04:14,360 --> 02:04:15,160
I

1308
02:04:17,620 --> 02:04:26,400
think arriving at a definition and a policy that doesn't just sound good and lets people

1309
02:04:26,400 --> 02:04:31,740
do what they want to do, but actually achieves what we're trying to achieve.

1310
02:04:32,660 --> 02:04:41,340
And if we can't achieve what we're trying to achieve realistically, I think we need

1311
02:04:41,340 --> 02:04:44,120
to rethink what we're talking about.

1312
02:04:44,500 --> 02:04:47,040
Personally, I like one more than two.

1313
02:04:48,780 --> 02:04:53,060
I was at a conservation commission meeting

1314
02:04:53,060 --> 02:04:58,100
where I don't remember what they called it.

1315
02:04:58,220 --> 02:05:00,260
I think they called it a new type of paper.

1316
02:05:00,880 --> 02:05:03,540
And then we discovered that the new type of paper

1317
02:05:03,540 --> 02:05:09,740
was essentially granite strips with crushed stone

1318
02:05:09,740 --> 02:05:11,540
or something around it.

1319
02:05:11,980 --> 02:05:16,340
And the argument was that they were at least as pervious

1320
02:05:16,340 --> 02:05:26,840
as other pavers with less space between the pavers, OK?

1321
02:05:27,480 --> 02:05:31,680
So I think this is a huge challenge

1322
02:05:31,680 --> 02:05:37,960
to get a permeable surface that people walk on

1323
02:05:37,960 --> 02:05:46,380
and have various activities that are expecting like a solid floor under them that they don't want to be wet.

1324
02:05:47,140 --> 02:05:49,460
It's hard to do this.

1325
02:05:49,740 --> 02:05:49,840
Yeah.

1326
02:05:51,140 --> 02:05:56,420
And I wonder if some of the things that we've come up with in the past just don't work.

1327
02:05:57,280 --> 02:06:04,440
So, is there really no longitudinal research about what actually works?

1328
02:06:05,700 --> 02:06:10,140
No, I mean, there is in terms of like certain products.

1329
02:06:10,500 --> 02:06:12,500
Yes, but the products stay pervious.

1330
02:06:12,580 --> 02:06:12,820
Yes.

1331
02:06:13,240 --> 02:06:14,380
Yeah, there is research on it.

1332
02:06:15,420 --> 02:06:17,540
So, they're grades, or is there anything that's good?

1333
02:06:18,740 --> 02:06:24,160
I'm not sure if they're, if like the different products are graded against each other, because it's,

1334
02:06:24,520 --> 02:06:27,820
you can't compare a product to a product.

1335
02:06:27,820 --> 02:06:34,960
It's so dependent upon how it's installed and the ground water table and the type of subsurface material.

1336
02:06:35,300 --> 02:06:44,540
So, you know, like I said, generally pervious pavers are more, they have a little bit more longevity than a poorest asphalt.

1337
02:06:44,840 --> 02:06:50,340
But that's really the extent of how you could compare two products.

1338
02:06:50,340 --> 02:06:59,400
I mean, the only way you could really do that is to do drainage analysis on every installation

1339
02:06:59,400 --> 02:07:00,100
of these products.

1340
02:07:00,960 --> 02:07:03,540
That's the only way you would ever know truly.

1341
02:07:05,720 --> 02:07:08,420
Or it's significant sample under different conditions.

1342
02:07:09,560 --> 02:07:21,580
But for example, somebody was asking me, they installed a wooden boardwalk over sand and

1343
02:07:21,580 --> 02:07:26,020
And they had asked, it was originally proposed to be pervious payers.

1344
02:07:27,880 --> 02:07:31,360
And I pushed back and I said, that's not what was on your plan.

1345
02:07:31,360 --> 02:07:32,460
It needs to be removed.

1346
02:07:33,100 --> 02:07:37,320
And they pulled up some of the boards and we dug down and it was feet of sand.

1347
02:07:37,520 --> 02:07:39,900
That's the most pervious thing ever.

1348
02:07:40,480 --> 02:07:49,080
So it was, in that case, I didn't need to look at the conditions of any of the standards in the ordinances.

1349
02:07:49,080 --> 02:07:53,780
is because the definition of pervious is a surface that allows the infiltration of water.

1350
02:07:53,980 --> 02:07:57,120
So I could interpret that situation to be pervious.

1351
02:07:58,320 --> 02:08:00,460
And some of the situations are that simple.

1352
02:08:00,840 --> 02:08:07,760
And it's easy enough to say, sand is pervious, and a wooden boardwalk over sand is always

1353
02:08:07,760 --> 02:08:13,120
going to be pervious, that's actually what made me start thinking more about decks.

1354
02:08:13,120 --> 02:08:18,760
Yes, the one fourth of the space between eight inch boards.

1355
02:08:19,640 --> 02:08:23,020
Nope, yeah, like no longer, no wider than eight inch boards.

1356
02:08:25,700 --> 02:08:32,200
Sharon, did you get to your point this, what you would, I think what you said about achieving

1357
02:08:32,200 --> 02:08:38,960
the goal here, it's an important point but I've kind of, this is actually a step back from

1358
02:08:38,960 --> 02:08:46,020
achieving a goal and being more common sense about the use of materials that should be considered

1359
02:08:46,020 --> 02:08:47,320
pervious or not.

1360
02:08:50,300 --> 02:08:56,000
It's challenging but I still stand behind the conditions that we put in

1361
02:08:56,000 --> 02:09:08,880
for pervious hardscapes and requiring people to follow manufacturer specifications and photo

1362
02:09:08,880 --> 02:09:14,760
the contractors that do driveways know those standards and they will submit to me the paperwork

1363
02:09:14,760 --> 02:09:21,160
that in the forms and the information ahead of time. And when people are putting in a pervious

1364
02:09:21,160 --> 02:09:28,220
patio as part of their town wetland permit or a subdivision plan 99% of them have those specs

1365
02:09:28,220 --> 02:09:34,960
the details on their plan. So it's becoming these materials are becoming more ubiquitous and

1366
02:09:34,960 --> 02:09:37,180
contractors are getting more comfortable with them.

1367
02:09:37,360 --> 02:09:45,520
It doesn't necessarily solve the long-term problem, but I do believe that the town has taken

1368
02:09:45,520 --> 02:09:52,100
a pretty strong approach to ensuring that the installation is done correctly.

1369
02:09:52,400 --> 02:09:54,660
And again, I stand behind that today.

1370
02:09:55,340 --> 02:10:01,180
This amendment, I actually don't think, has to do with achieving any goal other than just

1371
02:10:01,180 --> 02:10:08,140
making sure we're being fair to residents and applicants and using the science

1372
02:10:08,140 --> 02:10:12,140
that we know exists and again common sense when it comes to what material

1373
02:10:12,140 --> 02:10:20,260
infiltrates water. I would just take for us to rely on all of this and put people

1374
02:10:20,260 --> 02:10:26,040
through the trouble and expense of installing it properly and then to have it

1375
02:10:26,040 --> 02:10:32,720
work. Right. And, you know, that's, we've actually, in some cases, with town

1376
02:10:32,720 --> 02:10:36,740
wetland permits said, you know, you're proposing a pervious driveway, a

1377
02:10:36,740 --> 02:10:40,400
pervious paper driveway, a pervious patio, you're on the marsh. The water table

1378
02:10:40,400 --> 02:10:45,200
is so high, you might see adverse effects from that. So you might want to

1379
02:10:45,200 --> 02:10:50,480
reconsider because it's not really benefiting anything on your property. And you

1380
02:10:50,480 --> 02:10:53,680
You might see the, you know, damage from it.

1381
02:10:55,880 --> 02:11:03,040
So I don't think this change, changes anything for most applicants.

1382
02:11:03,040 --> 02:11:05,780
In fact, it probably makes things easier.

1383
02:11:05,960 --> 02:11:06,920
And I think fairer.

1384
02:11:07,760 --> 02:11:08,360
Right.

1385
02:11:16,600 --> 02:11:16,920
Anything else?

1386
02:11:17,880 --> 02:11:18,220
Are we?

1387
02:11:19,080 --> 02:11:20,120
Oh, we don't have this.

1388
02:11:20,940 --> 02:11:21,420
Sorry.

1389
02:11:21,420 --> 02:11:21,820
Yes, sorry.

1390
02:11:22,140 --> 02:11:23,760
Some last minute changes.

1391
02:11:24,000 --> 02:11:25,000
That's okay.

1392
02:11:25,000 --> 02:11:29,160
Okay, so this is a definition for zoning.

1393
02:11:29,820 --> 02:11:36,400
So yeah, so this is a modification to the existing definition scaling it back.

1394
02:11:36,780 --> 02:11:46,820
But what we would also like to do is further simplify the definition and take the standards and put them into another section to be consistent with what the audit had suggested.

1395
02:11:47,980 --> 02:11:50,680
And I was trying to figure out where to put them.

1396
02:11:50,680 --> 02:12:06,120
I think I found a section right after the dimensional requirements table, like a section 2.3 or something that we could include, but we could talk about that and we'll come up with something for the board to see that actually shows that if the board agrees with lip this option and pursuing that.

1397
02:12:06,700 --> 02:12:15,180
Jason, you mentioned that you had your concerns about, I think, one over two because everybody would be decking out their promise.

1398
02:12:15,180 --> 02:12:17,000
Well, that was, yes, the halls and all that.

1399
02:12:17,420 --> 02:12:20,740
I, realistically, that probably wouldn't happen.

1400
02:12:20,740 --> 02:12:24,460
But as we talked about it, it was something that at least crossed my mind.

1401
02:12:24,700 --> 02:12:24,940
Okay.

1402
02:12:25,240 --> 02:12:27,940
But I think we should test out option one.

1403
02:12:27,960 --> 02:12:30,000
I was always gravitated toward option one.

1404
02:12:30,360 --> 02:12:35,460
But, you know, just weighing them out and you'll pose in kind of sense where we're waiting that you.

1405
02:12:35,520 --> 02:12:38,300
But there was nothing, no, there's nothing like explicit that I was trying to say there.

1406
02:12:38,500 --> 02:12:38,740
Okay.

1407
02:12:38,740 --> 02:12:44,260
Yeah, I can't see someone decking over 10,000 square-foot a lot.

1408
02:12:44,980 --> 02:12:49,180
Yeah, I'd agree with you, option 1 that's an improvement over the existing kind.

1409
02:12:49,340 --> 02:12:51,120
It's easier to interpret.

1410
02:12:51,220 --> 02:12:51,340
Yeah.

1411
02:12:51,620 --> 02:12:52,040
It's kids.

1412
02:12:52,400 --> 02:12:52,760
Exactly.

1413
02:12:54,360 --> 02:12:54,680
Yep.

1414
02:12:56,720 --> 02:12:57,160
Okay.

1415
02:12:58,100 --> 02:12:58,740
Moving on.

1416
02:12:58,760 --> 02:12:59,600
I don't think that helps you.

1417
02:12:59,800 --> 02:13:00,260
Yes, it does.

1418
02:13:00,440 --> 02:13:00,780
Thank you.

1419
02:13:03,890 --> 02:13:04,170
Okay.

1420
02:13:04,170 --> 02:13:11,770
Okay, so this next one is, this is the existing language in the ordinance about replacement

1421
02:13:11,770 --> 02:13:14,150
or repair of an existing structure.

1422
02:13:16,540 --> 02:13:22,040
And recently, a few things came up that gave me a little bit of concern about how much

1423
02:13:22,040 --> 02:13:24,620
leniency this language allowed.

1424
02:13:27,320 --> 02:13:32,420
These are the, it lists the conditions that have to be met in order for a structure and existing

1425
02:13:32,420 --> 02:13:39,480
the existing structure to be repaired or replaced without the use, without a new town wetland permit.

1426
02:13:39,960 --> 02:13:46,880
So it's saying if the structure has been previously approved by a town wetlands permit and or a building permit,

1427
02:13:47,680 --> 02:13:56,980
the square footage of temporary and or permanent impacts on the parcel is not increasing or encroaching further into the wetland conservation district.

1428
02:13:56,980 --> 02:14:03,540
and the proposed work will not be contrary to the spirit or intent of the wetland conservation district ordinance,

1429
02:14:04,160 --> 02:14:11,960
then a new town wetlands permit is not required and the repair or replacement of the existing structure can happen

1430
02:14:11,960 --> 02:14:15,320
with just a building permit if the building permit is even needed.

1431
02:14:17,480 --> 02:14:28,020
So, recently, last month actually, I think it was, there was a repair of a foundation

1432
02:14:30,380 --> 02:14:36,260
and they had a previous town wetland permit for that project and they were claiming

1433
02:14:36,260 --> 02:14:39,340
that it was the exact same project, they were just repairing the foundation.

1434
02:14:39,700 --> 02:14:43,320
This all came before you as well, I just am refreshing everybody's memory.

1435
02:14:43,320 --> 02:14:47,560
and so because of that oh I'm sorry I didn't come before you because it didn't

1436
02:14:47,560 --> 02:14:52,520
have a town wetland permit it was only a state wetland permit because their

1437
02:14:52,520 --> 02:14:54,940
claim was that they didn't need a town wetland

1438
02:15:00,000 --> 02:15:06,760
Government, because it was the same work that was originally permitted when the project was permitted 10 years ago.

1439
02:15:07,380 --> 02:15:09,360
Yes, they were replacing like for like.

1440
02:15:09,820 --> 02:15:22,100
Correct. The structure was changing because it was going up, because the foundation needed to be repaired and it needed to come into compliance, but ultimately the footprint on the property wasn't changing.

1441
02:15:24,760 --> 02:15:28,660
against their case with the existing language here.

1442
02:15:30,100 --> 02:15:35,340
Similar situation, I've spoken, this hasn't come before us yet, but

1443
02:15:35,340 --> 02:15:42,400
I've spoken to somebody who in 2016 got a town wetland permit approved to rebuild,

1444
02:15:43,700 --> 02:15:47,260
to build a new home, to demolish their existing home and rebuild a home.

1445
02:15:47,260 --> 02:16:00,340
They ultimately did not go through with that project and instead they just did part of the work and they just added an addition on to meet the footprint that they had gotten approved for the year prior.

1446
02:16:00,580 --> 02:16:04,560
They got a new town wetland permit and did just kind of half the work and put an addition on their house.

1447
02:16:04,560 --> 02:16:11,540
They now want to demolish the house and rebuild the house in the footprint that was

1448
02:16:11,540 --> 02:16:17,200
approved in 2016, and under this language they can do that without a new wetlands permit.

1449
02:16:18,980 --> 02:16:24,600
So generally those two projects, fortunately, don't really have any temporary impacts

1450
02:16:24,600 --> 02:16:25,600
that concern me.

1451
02:16:26,040 --> 02:16:31,860
But it does concern me that this leaves the door wide open for people to do that with

1452
02:16:31,860 --> 02:16:41,340
the town wetlands permit from 2005 or for it doesn't even really say that the town wetlands

1453
02:16:41,340 --> 02:16:44,680
permit has to be similar to what the proposed work is here.

1454
02:16:45,480 --> 02:16:52,080
So I'm not opposed to keeping the process simple for folks, I'm not interested in making

1455
02:16:52,080 --> 02:16:59,280
somebody jump through hoops to repair this foundation of a shed or replace a shed with

1456
02:16:59,280 --> 02:17:03,400
the shred, that's the same size. That kind of thing doesn't really concern me, but this

1457
02:17:03,400 --> 02:17:08,600
language is so lenient that many applicants could make the case that they don't need

1458
02:17:08,600 --> 02:17:16,380
to come back for review. Even if the town's ordinances have since changed, or the location

1459
02:17:16,380 --> 02:17:22,620
of the wetlands have since changed, or the description that they gave when their permit

1460
02:17:22,620 --> 02:17:29,720
was originally approved wasn't very clear. So, you know, how do we know in 2026 that the

1461
02:17:29,720 --> 02:17:36,800
work is actually what was approved in 2005? I think, you know, moving forward, we're pretty

1462
02:17:36,800 --> 02:17:41,400
diligent in our minutes and in our reviews, so it might not be as much of a concern, but looking

1463
02:17:41,400 --> 02:17:47,160
back, some of these permits don't have a lot of language in them. And so it does make me a little

1464
02:17:47,160 --> 02:17:53,600
bit concerned. There's again two options here. Jason and I are trying to keep this simple

1465
02:17:53,600 --> 02:17:58,480
and not change the intent. I still like the idea of keeping things simple like I said

1466
02:17:58,480 --> 02:18:05,680
for somebody replacing, you know, a shed or, you know, footing on their deck. That, to

1467
02:18:05,680 --> 02:18:11,680
me, doesn't require the same type of review as of wetland permit from 2005 to build a new

1468
02:18:11,680 --> 02:18:21,060
house. So this version addresses limiting the time frame in which a permit can be, for lack of

1469
02:18:21,060 --> 02:18:28,140
a better word, reused. This version ensures that the proposal is compliant with today's standards,

1470
02:18:28,900 --> 02:18:36,020
and it ensures that the wetland delineation that's used is up to date. The state uses five years

1471
02:18:36,020 --> 02:18:38,680
as a timeline for wetland delineations.

1472
02:18:39,020 --> 02:18:41,260
Generally speaking, that's what the town uses,

1473
02:18:41,360 --> 02:18:43,320
although we don't have a hard and fast rule,

1474
02:18:44,040 --> 02:18:46,460
but I think there's no harm in applying

1475
02:18:46,460 --> 02:18:49,260
the five-year time frame in this language here.

1476
02:18:51,780 --> 02:18:53,980
So it's a look back here in Defenders.

1477
02:18:54,820 --> 02:18:56,160
How would that be applied?

1478
02:18:56,660 --> 02:18:59,560
So it would apply if you had a town wetland permit

1479
02:18:59,560 --> 02:19:02,280
from 2021 to build a new house.

1480
02:19:02,940 --> 02:19:05,260
You can replace that house

1481
02:19:05,260 --> 02:19:12,280
in the same exact footprint or repair part of it up until five years later in 2026.

1482
02:19:13,000 --> 02:19:19,280
If that permit was from 2019, that's no longer a permit that can be again for lack of a better

1483
02:19:19,280 --> 02:19:25,400
word reused for that repair or replacement. So it puts that five-year time period on the lookback

1484
02:19:25,400 --> 02:19:30,360
just to protect basically the wetland delineation accuracy.

1485
02:19:31,400 --> 02:19:40,900
What has to be achieved within that five-year limit going back for a building permit or the project is complete and due of occupancy?

1486
02:19:43,070 --> 02:20:01,450
If nothing happened in the time frame of the permit, generally speaking the permit, I mean my interpretation is that the permit would be expired, but this case that I mentioned as an example is arguing otherwise because this existing language doesn't say that.

1487
02:20:01,450 --> 02:20:06,770
That's right, and they use the footprint to their modifications that they had in their application.

1488
02:20:06,950 --> 02:20:07,050
Right.

1489
02:20:07,950 --> 02:20:12,410
They did, let me clarify, they got a permit in whatever 2016 for a new house.

1490
02:20:12,690 --> 02:20:17,970
They didn't tear down and rebuild, but the year later they got a new town wetland permit, and

1491
02:20:17,970 --> 02:20:24,790
they just put an addition on the side, second permit, second permit in the same footprint.

1492
02:20:24,970 --> 02:20:29,170
But now they want to go back to what they got a permit for in the first time.

1493
02:20:29,170 --> 02:20:30,110
I see.

1494
02:20:33,640 --> 02:20:41,780
But it's obvious that the language, the language in Section A is open to a few of you.

1495
02:20:41,780 --> 02:20:49,100
This version seems to address it more in the copy we have, a little bit more in detail,

1496
02:20:49,620 --> 02:20:51,400
more thoroughly than that.

1497
02:20:51,400 --> 02:20:52,180
Right, absolutely.

1498
02:20:52,420 --> 02:20:56,360
And that's from the Conservation Commission's discussions on it that they added to that.

1499
02:20:56,440 --> 02:20:57,560
That was just to get us started.

1500
02:20:57,740 --> 02:21:00,020
And that was done before the Conservation Commission met.

1501
02:21:00,020 --> 02:21:05,360
Yeah, because I was looking at this one, come on.

1502
02:21:06,120 --> 02:21:08,720
No, this bill is significantly able, I gave you.

1503
02:21:08,980 --> 02:21:09,100
Yeah.

1504
02:21:09,560 --> 02:21:10,960
I think it helps clear it off.

1505
02:21:12,660 --> 02:21:19,180
Where would we add the five year concurrent would state permits or however the language would be?

1506
02:21:19,400 --> 02:21:25,040
So this would say the structure shall have also received a town.

1507
02:21:25,180 --> 02:21:30,620
What building permit, if one was required, and have been constructed in compliance with all applicable regulatory requirements

1508
02:21:30,620 --> 02:21:32,700
at the time of the original application.

1509
02:21:33,080 --> 02:21:35,700
This provision applies to town wetland permits

1510
02:21:35,700 --> 02:21:37,760
that are not more than five years old,

1511
02:21:38,180 --> 02:21:42,180
or if greater than five years old are supported

1512
02:21:42,180 --> 02:21:45,380
by an updated delineation showing the wetlands

1513
02:21:45,380 --> 02:21:46,760
in the same location.

1514
02:21:47,680 --> 02:21:52,560
So the caveat there is if somebody's wetland permit

1515
02:21:52,560 --> 02:21:56,940
is seven years old, but they hire a wetland scientist

1516
02:21:56,940 --> 02:22:05,600
to re-delineate the wetlands, and that scientist confirms that they are the same in the same location as the seven-year-old permit,

1517
02:22:06,000 --> 02:22:10,620
then they can still move forward with their repair or replacement without a new town wetland permit.

1518
02:22:11,540 --> 02:22:15,820
And that's something that happens, so we're not making up that process that happens regularly.

1519
02:22:16,340 --> 02:22:24,700
And wetland scientists are familiar with verification of a wetland delineation, so that would not be, you know, something that Hampton requires that nobody else has ever asked of them.

1520
02:22:27,710 --> 02:22:30,210
Is there an option two as well?

1521
02:22:30,630 --> 02:22:43,250
The option two is the same exact thing except it eliminates homes and only allows the replacement or repair of existing accessory buildings or structures.

1522
02:22:46,140 --> 02:22:46,260
Why?

1523
02:22:46,480 --> 02:22:51,880
The reason for that would be, well, I have a question about accessory structures can be barns.

1524
02:22:51,880 --> 02:22:55,740
They can be very large, but the majority of them are not.

1525
02:22:55,740 --> 02:22:59,180
the majority of them are Sheds, Decks, Fences.

1526
02:23:01,720 --> 02:23:05,300
The reason for this is not just because of the

1527
02:23:05,300 --> 02:23:13,320
footprint but the impact on the ground during construction for a home is a lot more invasive.

1528
02:23:14,720 --> 02:23:19,240
Many Sheds are not on a foundation, they're on Cinder blocks or something very minor,

1529
02:23:19,500 --> 02:23:25,420
that is not impactful to repair or replace if it even needs the foundation itself to be repaired or

1530
02:23:25,420 --> 02:23:34,740
replaced. So this option says, yeah, you can repair a replaced, whatever small, I mean small generally, things on your property.

1531
02:23:35,360 --> 02:23:42,420
But if you, you can't reuse a wetland permit, you had two years to use your wetland permit for your home.

1532
02:23:42,800 --> 02:23:44,380
You can't reuse that.

1533
02:23:46,810 --> 02:23:48,210
It doesn't make sense.

1534
02:23:48,210 --> 02:23:53,930
The current definition of accessory building or structure exclude pay-to-use?

1535
02:23:55,760 --> 02:23:58,880
Well, pay-to-use are an accessory dwelling.

1536
02:23:58,880 --> 02:23:59,060
Right.

1537
02:24:00,200 --> 02:24:07,700
I think the definition of accessory building is, just says not the primary dwelling structure.

1538
02:24:08,100 --> 02:24:08,180
Right.

1539
02:24:09,720 --> 02:24:16,840
So that's why this option I have two questions about, or your discussion, is allowing accessory buildings

1540
02:24:16,840 --> 02:24:21,280
and structures too lenient because it could include ADUs, it could include barns,

1541
02:24:21,320 --> 02:24:24,740
it could include pool houses that can be very large.

1542
02:24:25,680 --> 02:24:30,320
So that's a question, not necessarily concerned just to, you know, I'm not sure.

1543
02:24:31,140 --> 02:24:38,360
And then the opposite of that is restricting the repair and replacement of homes too restrictive.

1544
02:24:39,100 --> 02:24:44,700
So I don't know if this is like a happy medium or if it hits the mark on both, it misses the

1545
02:24:44,700 --> 02:24:45,700
mark on both ends.

1546
02:24:48,540 --> 02:24:51,120
Again, the only thing that's different about this is that change

1547
02:24:51,120 --> 02:24:52,180
at the top.

1548
02:24:55,400 --> 02:25:01,640
Well, the permit was granted within five years, and things are the same, or the wetlands

1549
02:25:01,640 --> 02:25:08,960
if it was seven years, as your example, and the wetlands are where they were, unless the

1550
02:25:10,380 --> 02:25:17,120
why would it matter unless the policy changed? I mean, five years ago, they were given

1551
02:25:17,120 --> 02:25:21,640
going to permit for all the disruption that goes along with constructing a house.

1552
02:25:22,660 --> 02:25:25,340
Why would that be different now?

1553
02:25:28,100 --> 02:25:37,990
I think the larger city of an accessory building that's from this thing here today, that's one size,

1554
02:25:38,610 --> 02:25:40,190
say it's like ten times the size.

1555
02:25:40,190 --> 02:25:43,930
It's an accessory building, it's not a dwelling or anything like that.

1556
02:25:44,310 --> 02:25:46,010
No, I'm talking about temporary effect.

1557
02:25:46,290 --> 02:25:46,970
The why?

1558
02:25:49,220 --> 02:25:49,600
Okay.

1559
02:25:50,340 --> 02:25:56,080
But the option to remove the house, the home, the primary dwelling.

1560
02:25:56,240 --> 02:25:58,380
Can you go back to the office and want to please get

1561
02:26:00,580 --> 02:26:06,270
it, let's see, oh, I see Dex and homes, okay.

1562
02:26:13,290 --> 02:26:26,350
The option one seems to address the, you know, people, the abuse that could potentially occur in modifications to homes or anything out.

1563
02:26:27,750 --> 02:26:29,290
If we don't change the language.

1564
02:26:29,850 --> 02:26:31,390
We don't tighten up the language.

1565
02:26:33,350 --> 02:26:33,830
Just

1566
02:26:36,840 --> 02:26:38,600
a technical question.

1567
02:26:40,460 --> 02:26:45,200
Does it have, this doesn't say that it has to be A, B, and C.

1568
02:26:45,580 --> 02:26:47,460
Is that implied in ordinances?

1569
02:26:49,500 --> 02:26:55,040
So, I believe that this was A, B, and C, wasn't it?

1570
02:26:55,480 --> 02:26:56,600
I'm trying to understand what the appeal was.

1571
02:26:56,700 --> 02:26:57,420
I think it was all three.

1572
02:26:57,560 --> 02:27:02,340
Yes, I thought that was implied with provided that, but maybe that's an important thing.

1573
02:27:02,340 --> 02:27:11,020
I don't know, maybe in the answer that's implied, but I've always interpreted it that way.

1574
02:27:11,100 --> 02:27:14,860
Yeah, I have one last comment that could just throw wrench in this whole conversation.

1575
02:27:15,100 --> 02:27:16,300
Sure, I'm pretty think about.

1576
02:27:16,680 --> 02:27:17,040
It's time.

1577
02:27:20,140 --> 02:27:27,620
This is a question that I don't have an answer to, but I don't know if it makes more sense

1578
02:27:27,620 --> 02:27:57,860
to change the lifespan of a town wetlands permit to five years and allow for repair and replacement within that five years, and add these conditions into the section that talks about wetland permits, right now they're good for two years, and it doesn't talk about repair replacement within that two years, but I have always interpreted and have allowed repairs immediately after something has happened.

1579
02:27:59,200 --> 02:28:05,300
or for like landscaping projects that needed certain replacements or changes in a short period of time.

1580
02:28:06,940 --> 02:28:13,980
But it might make sense to just add this language into that and change the lifespan of the town wetlands permit instead.

1581
02:28:14,460 --> 02:28:15,180
That makes sense.

1582
02:28:15,300 --> 02:28:15,700
I don't know.

1583
02:28:16,420 --> 02:28:24,800
You said that what happens every, usually every five years within the state, delineating where the wetlands are?

1584
02:28:24,800 --> 02:28:41,840
No, the state requires applicants to have an update in delineation for their applications, and they will only accept a delineation that is less than five years old, the state, DES.

1585
02:28:41,840 --> 02:28:55,960
Yes, so if, and that's a role, that's not 20, 20 through 20, 25, that's a rolling five years.

1586
02:28:57,100 --> 02:29:01,600
But it's not, we don't have delineations for the whole state, it's per application.

1587
02:29:02,400 --> 02:29:05,580
So I'm applying for a new house and I have a wetland in my backyard.

1588
02:29:05,900 --> 02:29:08,840
I need to hire a wetland scientist to delineate the edge of that wetland.

1589
02:29:08,840 --> 02:29:13,480
and I submit that on my survey plan with my application to the state.

1590
02:29:14,140 --> 02:29:18,160
And then in six years, if I want to add a deck onto my house, the state,

1591
02:29:19,060 --> 02:29:28,240
it's generally, we'll ask for a new delineation because that is not an updated and reliable delineation.

1592
02:29:28,240 --> 02:29:39,500
So with marshland moving and such, it doesn't adhere to a five-year, that was a little

1593
02:29:39,500 --> 02:29:48,060
snarky, are there areas or how vast is the area within our wetlands that would change

1594
02:29:48,060 --> 02:29:54,240
more frequently than that or require testing more frequently than five years

1595
02:29:54,240 --> 02:29:54,920
is still fully under.

1596
02:30:00,000 --> 02:30:02,840
Stand where it is, where it's going.

1597
02:30:05,760 --> 02:30:29,980
The marsh certainly is dynamic, but most wetlands are dynamic. This year, if somebody went out to get a wetland delineation for something near their backyard that's always been wet, I'm thinking of several areas around town, it might not actually show as a wetland because it's been drive for two years. But we have plant life that we could use.

1598
02:30:30,620 --> 02:30:36,180
potentially, but it may not be surviving after a two-year drought. Right. And the

1599
02:30:36,180 --> 02:30:40,380
plant life is more than that because we had some delineation done at my

1600
02:30:40,380 --> 02:30:48,080
condo association. He came in with a, based on the color of the soil. If it's

1601
02:30:48,080 --> 02:30:53,620
red, it's got oxygen in it. If it's not, it's anaerobic, in which case that's

1602
02:30:53,620 --> 02:30:58,980
white lung. So yeah, I mean, so there's, there's soil, there's hydrology, there's

1603
02:30:58,980 --> 02:31:08,060
physical presence of water, like hydrojemy by the soils, there is no answer to your question.

1604
02:31:08,380 --> 02:31:13,420
All wetlands are dynamic, all wetlands are dynamic on different time frames.

1605
02:31:15,910 --> 02:31:19,850
But five years seems to be a reasonable, or at least the state, that's right.

1606
02:31:19,850 --> 02:31:23,870
Yeah, and I actually, I think the Army Corps of Engineers uses five years as well.

1607
02:31:23,870 --> 02:31:24,150
OK.

1608
02:31:26,230 --> 02:31:30,870
So then why wouldn't the permit be applicable for five years?

1609
02:31:32,410 --> 02:31:33,750
Like I said, it made sense.

1610
02:31:37,200 --> 02:31:38,980
I think that needs to be explored.

1611
02:31:39,500 --> 02:31:41,660
It made it in two years when they've created the ordinance.

1612
02:31:43,020 --> 02:31:45,940
I think it also is a little bit more in line

1613
02:31:45,940 --> 02:31:48,040
with zoning like variances.

1614
02:31:48,660 --> 02:31:50,240
And building permits are one year.

1615
02:31:50,820 --> 02:31:52,900
But I don't know if they were ever two years.

1616
02:31:52,900 --> 02:32:18,620
So I don't I don't think it was random and I also by throwing in this at the end of the conversation don't think that the discussion about this ordinance is for not because I think this language should still be applied wherever it ends up in the section and whether whether this just means this section gets eliminated and added into the section that talks about wetland permits, you know, I think all of this conversation is important and we can add it in there.

1617
02:32:20,680 --> 02:32:27,460
But just for simplification purposes, like I said at the beginning, that's what I'm always in favor of.

1618
02:32:27,600 --> 02:32:35,800
Can you call your op-how you would change it to be the five years and how you would take our conversation into a final draft?

1619
02:32:37,760 --> 02:32:40,920
Yeah, I don't have the whole ordinance in front of me, the whole ordinance section.

1620
02:32:41,060 --> 02:32:47,700
But wherever the ordinance section says that town wetland permits are good for two years unless it's a sea wall,

1621
02:32:47,700 --> 02:32:54,920
All which is good for six years, I would literally probably just copy and paste this underneath that and

1622
02:32:54,920 --> 02:33:04,600
say replacement or repair of structures that have been approved through the town wetlands permit can be done with these conditions.

1623
02:33:05,800 --> 02:33:08,760
I really don't think this language would need to change at all.

1624
02:33:09,020 --> 02:33:10,260
I think we just go right in.

1625
02:33:11,520 --> 02:33:17,900
As the commission talked about this, Brianna, the five-year, the five-year idea of the commission, they haven't.

1626
02:33:17,920 --> 02:33:28,820
Not the permit life, but I mean, I don't want to speak on behalf of them, but the reason I brought it up is because to me the intent is so similar, it doesn't really change anything.

1627
02:33:29,540 --> 02:33:34,900
And like, application, not an application, but an application of the life.

1628
02:33:35,040 --> 02:33:37,760
I mean, it makes good sense. I just would want their feedback.

1629
02:33:37,760 --> 02:33:43,860
Yeah, absolutely. And they wanted to be back after this meeting anyway. So your lightbulb went on a little bit there and said, yeah.

1630
02:33:46,120 --> 02:33:50,320
The sections on jumping out of me, but obviously it's in here. I think it's at the top towards the end.

1631
02:33:50,520 --> 02:33:51,480
I thought it was too.

1632
02:33:56,780 --> 02:34:01,820
If I think the five-year thing would solve it, I'm in favor of moving it in that direction.

1633
02:34:01,820 --> 02:34:12,380
And let's move on that assumption and think about any reason that it shouldn't be right five year.

1634
02:34:13,460 --> 02:34:14,960
I can't think of any LFN.

1635
02:34:15,280 --> 02:34:20,220
We can also, I think the language is already in there, but we can also add something like the,

1636
02:34:22,060 --> 02:34:27,620
this isn't how it would be worded, but like the bulk of the work has to be completed within a year or two years,

1637
02:34:27,620 --> 02:34:31,120
which I believe that language is already in there.

1638
02:34:31,940 --> 02:34:35,120
They found it 415-C two years.

1639
02:34:36,400 --> 02:34:41,700
Does it say that the like the essence of the project has to be completed within one,

1640
02:34:41,820 --> 02:34:43,300
or it has to be started?

1641
02:34:43,300 --> 02:34:47,060
I see you like you frontload it like you have to really get started on this within two years.

1642
02:34:47,180 --> 02:34:47,300
Yeah.

1643
02:34:47,500 --> 02:34:49,060
You're five years to finish.

1644
02:34:49,320 --> 02:34:49,500
Yes.

1645
02:34:49,960 --> 02:34:53,340
If the work approved is initiated but not completed during that time,

1646
02:34:53,460 --> 02:34:55,080
the owners may apply for two-year extension.

1647
02:34:55,400 --> 02:34:56,300
That's all it says, okay.

1648
02:34:56,300 --> 02:35:00,400
So it was two years and then applied for an extension if you did so.

1649
02:35:00,400 --> 02:35:02,760
You've got to craft what, however, that bridge is made.

1650
02:35:02,900 --> 02:35:07,780
Yeah, because I do think it's important that the bulk of the work is started or completed

1651
02:35:07,780 --> 02:35:08,740
within two years.

1652
02:35:09,420 --> 02:35:13,340
It could just be that, you know, that language stays the same and then it says you have three

1653
02:35:13,340 --> 02:35:15,620
years for repair and replacement with these conditions.

1654
02:35:18,660 --> 02:35:19,900
That would make sense.

1655
02:35:20,900 --> 02:35:22,520
That would fit every year of thing, right?

1656
02:35:22,740 --> 02:35:22,900
Yeah.

1657
02:35:25,540 --> 02:35:31,420
I said I hope that they don't have to repair or replace within three years what they built in the first two.

1658
02:35:32,160 --> 02:35:34,140
But for some, see walls.

1659
02:35:34,560 --> 02:35:38,700
See walls, yeah, and that's that language has changed and they're already.

1660
02:35:39,420 --> 02:35:43,000
But I do think I've seen it happen with Sheds and Decks.

1661
02:35:44,040 --> 02:35:45,480
And fences can be knocked out in school.

1662
02:35:45,940 --> 02:35:48,320
So those kinds of things I've seen.

1663
02:35:48,320 --> 02:35:51,580
and replantings in the buffer.

1664
02:35:51,920 --> 02:35:52,920
Yeah, yeah, okay.

1665
02:35:53,140 --> 02:35:54,720
That makes more sense than a house.

1666
02:35:55,160 --> 02:35:55,260
Yeah.

1667
02:35:56,860 --> 02:36:01,360
So I think I can re-work based on this conversation.

1668
02:36:01,600 --> 02:36:05,480
I can rework this option to into that other section.

1669
02:36:06,330 --> 02:36:09,700
Kind of still capture the same essence of all of this.

1670
02:36:09,960 --> 02:36:14,580
Allow the replacement and repair within reason

1671
02:36:14,580 --> 02:36:20,920
and eliminate the leniency that kind of opened too many doors for too much gray area.

1672
02:36:21,460 --> 02:36:21,580
Okay,

1673
02:36:25,950 --> 02:36:27,150
that's all, I'm done.

1674
02:36:27,230 --> 02:36:32,470
That's all, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you for your hard work.

1675
02:36:32,470 --> 02:36:34,790
All right, yeah, have a good night, frontage.

1676
02:36:35,530 --> 02:36:37,650
Okay, so

1677
02:36:39,990 --> 02:36:44,290
this is something that I mentioned that a recent meeting that the building inspector and

1678
02:36:44,290 --> 02:36:48,690
I had been talking about, that interpretation of the definition of frontage,

1679
02:36:48,690 --> 02:36:54,590
that was never really clearly defined for corner lots, first of all, and especially.

1680
02:36:55,250 --> 02:36:59,050
But also the definition we see includes some outdated references to.

1681
02:36:59,810 --> 02:37:06,690
So all this does is adds a new, replaces the old definition of frontage with a new one that you see there.

1682
02:37:07,590 --> 02:37:13,350
That talks about how it's measured, linear distance measured from a front lot line of joining class fiber better highway.

1683
02:37:14,810 --> 02:37:17,130
on a plot approved by the planning board

1684
02:37:17,130 --> 02:37:19,930
between the points of intersection with the side lot line.

1685
02:37:20,090 --> 02:37:21,870
So that makes it much clearer to understand

1686
02:37:21,870 --> 02:37:24,170
you have your front and then the sides.

1687
02:37:24,650 --> 02:37:26,690
So point to point that's your front edge.

1688
02:37:26,830 --> 02:37:28,590
So that defines it very clearly in a way

1689
02:37:28,590 --> 02:37:30,570
that generally wasn't in there before.

1690
02:37:31,090 --> 02:37:32,730
Then we talk about the corner lots.

1691
02:37:33,590 --> 02:37:36,110
Front edge shall be the total length along the roadway

1692
02:37:36,110 --> 02:37:39,270
which is the legal address of the subject property.

1693
02:37:39,570 --> 02:37:42,730
Now this has been interpreted a couple of ways by different people

1694
02:37:42,730 --> 02:37:48,530
And I corner a lot, does it mean just what this says or does it wrap around and include both streets?

1695
02:37:48,870 --> 02:37:56,210
Well, it is just one side that has been traditionally interpreted, but that is absolutely not spelled out in the current language.

1696
02:37:56,950 --> 02:37:59,410
So it's something that I talked to Greg.

1697
02:37:59,950 --> 02:38:04,290
I believe he talked with his own Lord as well, and that's how it's been interpreted.

1698
02:38:04,630 --> 02:38:08,610
And we want to make sure that that is how it's written into the ordinance.

1699
02:38:09,790 --> 02:38:18,810
And then just, obviously, footage requirements are contiguous as defined in 1.5, but we also

1700
02:38:18,810 --> 02:38:22,170
define contiguous because that was another point of contention.

1701
02:38:22,330 --> 02:38:26,210
Some people saying, well, the line jogs like this and there's a corner like this, so that's

1702
02:38:26,210 --> 02:38:26,810
not contiguous.

1703
02:38:27,070 --> 02:38:27,210
No.

1704
02:38:27,450 --> 02:38:29,790
If it goes straight across, it's contiguous.

1705
02:38:30,130 --> 02:38:31,710
So I think that there's no breaks.

1706
02:38:32,450 --> 02:38:33,110
Right, no breaks.

1707
02:38:33,310 --> 02:38:37,170
So that single connected path, regardless of its geometric shape, is contiguous.

1708
02:38:37,170 --> 02:38:42,630
this, having that in there eliminates somebody potentially suggesting that it's interpreting

1709
02:38:42,630 --> 02:38:43,210
in other way.

1710
02:38:44,230 --> 02:38:48,070
So this is just, really, this is a housekeeping amendment, but I wanted you to all to see

1711
02:38:48,070 --> 02:38:48,270
it.

1712
02:38:49,350 --> 02:38:54,230
And so how do you change your address, if you don't want to be on that one street, if you have

1713
02:38:54,230 --> 02:38:55,530
more frontage on the other side?

1714
02:38:55,650 --> 02:38:57,050
More sideage than frontage?

1715
02:38:57,110 --> 02:38:57,470
So yeah.

1716
02:38:57,550 --> 02:39:01,830
So you're saying, if you don't want to be the registry A, you want to change your address

1717
02:39:01,830 --> 02:39:04,950
to street B, because I might have more frontage, to legal frontage.

1718
02:39:04,950 --> 02:39:05,390
Right.

1719
02:39:06,830 --> 02:39:09,630
I mean you have to make an interpretation somehow.

1720
02:39:09,950 --> 02:39:10,730
OK, just say.

1721
02:39:10,930 --> 02:39:11,270
No, I know.

1722
02:39:11,410 --> 02:39:11,970
No, I know.

1723
02:39:12,070 --> 02:39:13,670
It's a double-sided question.

1724
02:39:13,990 --> 02:39:14,390
It's a double-sided question.

1725
02:39:14,390 --> 02:39:15,150
I'm about a question.

1726
02:39:15,450 --> 02:39:17,450
Yeah, I can see somebody wanting to do that.

1727
02:39:17,630 --> 02:39:18,470
The creative.

1728
02:39:18,670 --> 02:39:21,550
There's the town established the address?

1729
02:39:21,730 --> 02:39:21,890
Yes.

1730
02:39:22,290 --> 02:39:22,390
Yes.

1731
02:39:22,710 --> 02:39:22,970
Yes.

1732
02:39:23,170 --> 02:39:33,090
Which I find interesting because as you know I've been walking around the town and I have found some streets that absolutely confuse me.

1733
02:39:33,090 --> 02:39:44,890
A street of this name has a house on the corner where its driveway goes out to this street, but it has an address of this street.

1734
02:39:45,530 --> 02:39:46,650
Oh yeah, there's plenty on that.

1735
02:39:46,950 --> 02:39:52,630
That is a bear to find one of those houses unless you realize that at home point this is really screwed up.

1736
02:39:52,750 --> 02:40:00,070
I have to go look on 04 corners because there are some that are across the street across an intersection and they still have the same address.

1737
02:40:00,070 --> 02:40:03,850
Yes, I think she just necessary it doors necessary in a way

1738
02:40:05,130 --> 02:40:06,010
Number three

1739
02:40:07,090 --> 02:40:10,950
I see I can't remember I could take you there it quite a time

1740
02:40:11,670 --> 02:40:18,310
So I think yeah, but I think saying legal address of the subject properties of people is if somebody wanted to change their address

1741
02:40:18,310 --> 02:40:19,990
They have to do it through the town anyway

1742
02:40:21,930 --> 02:40:24,130
So so I think I think that that works

1743
02:40:30,070 --> 02:40:33,370
So, but I think this will add a lot of clarification.

1744
02:40:33,510 --> 02:40:36,310
It's obviously severely missing from the existing language.

1745
02:40:36,690 --> 02:40:40,170
So, that's that one and if the board's good with that one,

1746
02:40:40,390 --> 02:40:42,930
I don't know if you need to see it again before we get the public hearings.

1747
02:40:42,930 --> 02:40:47,090
I think that it's pretty straightforward, but it's good to make sure you're good with that.

1748
02:40:49,370 --> 02:40:50,470
So, next one?

1749
02:40:50,730 --> 02:40:51,270
Next one?

1750
02:40:51,570 --> 02:40:51,650
Yes.

1751
02:40:51,930 --> 02:40:52,670
Next one was?

1752
02:40:53,070 --> 02:40:53,970
So, yeah.

1753
02:40:53,970 --> 02:41:12,610
So, in the interest of Alex being here and the time, I would really, I would like to talk about business seasonal and business seasonal one and leave the 10th Center for another meeting.

1754
02:41:13,650 --> 02:41:16,050
Okay, that sounds good.

1755
02:41:18,830 --> 02:41:34,870
So when we were going through the work with, we talked about why we have a different

1756
02:41:34,870 --> 02:41:41,790
requirement for business seasonal and business seasonal one. And I think at the last meeting or

1757
02:41:42,390 --> 02:41:47,830
well the last meeting that I was at probably two meetings ago, Keith was talking about the

1758
02:41:48,590 --> 02:41:56,390
history behind that, right, business seasonal one. I noticed. Yeah, I just got big.

1759
02:41:58,210 --> 02:42:07,690
And there being a desire, following a fire, I think, to encourage additional growth in the center of the beach.

1760
02:42:07,810 --> 02:42:08,050
Correct.

1761
02:42:08,390 --> 02:42:21,410
There are, and now we are left wondering why, and developers are wondering, a lot of people are wondering why that is.

1762
02:42:21,410 --> 02:42:33,230
So my recollection is that when we were talking to the consultants, we said, let's just combine the two with 70 foot.

1763
02:42:34,150 --> 02:42:42,570
At our last meeting, there was also a conversation about wanting to avoid looking like some towns in Massachusetts.

1764
02:42:42,570 --> 02:42:50,850
So, what I was suggesting or would like to talk about tonight is the possibility

1765
02:42:50,850 --> 02:43:01,230
of extending essentially business seasonal one south and maintaining the, okay.

1766
02:43:01,910 --> 02:43:07,030
Jason and I talked about this earlier today, and I don't know, I'm tired or something.

1767
02:43:07,190 --> 02:43:12,030
I'm losing track of some of the surveys that we achieved, yes.

1768
02:43:12,030 --> 02:43:13,390
All right, I'll jump later.

1769
02:43:13,870 --> 02:43:17,430
So one way that I thought of this could be what that is.

1770
02:43:17,550 --> 02:43:20,850
The business seasonal one zone only has one difference

1771
02:43:20,850 --> 02:43:22,830
from the business seasonal zone and that is high.

1772
02:43:23,510 --> 02:43:24,950
Everything else is identical.

1773
02:43:26,050 --> 02:43:30,070
So I thought, what if you eliminated the business

1774
02:43:30,070 --> 02:43:35,370
seasonal one zone, you kept this reference

1775
02:43:35,370 --> 02:43:38,070
to between nut and dust and that you have in here.

1776
02:43:38,130 --> 02:43:39,270
So that's stretch of streets.

1777
02:43:40,090 --> 02:43:42,650
And there's two ways you could handle this.

1778
02:43:42,790 --> 02:43:44,630
There were two things, two scenarios I presented.

1779
02:43:45,170 --> 02:43:55,120
One would be to change the stretch to 70 feet, but contingent upon a satisfactory shadow study.

1780
02:43:55,260 --> 02:44:00,240
That's the one concern about the height is that you can have the issue of the shadows on the beach.

1781
02:44:00,500 --> 02:44:04,300
And we asked for those studies during our applications that we hear.

1782
02:44:05,260 --> 02:44:09,980
The other way it could be looked at could be change it to 50.

1783
02:44:09,980 --> 02:44:14,780
and yes that brings a section of 70 down to 50 but for the whole stretch by

1784
02:44:14,780 --> 02:44:20,100
conditional use permit you could go to 70 which puts it before this board rather

1785
02:44:20,100 --> 02:44:23,680
than need for variance in some of those other areas so it's kind of a little

1786
02:44:23,680 --> 02:44:27,720
bit of a trade-off so in our conversations those are basically the two scenarios

1787
02:44:27,720 --> 02:44:32,300
that I thought I did want Alex's input on this though because obviously your

1788
02:44:32,300 --> 02:44:37,220
experience of the beach and yeah so between the 50 and 70 that's when you would need

1789
02:44:37,220 --> 02:44:42,100
the sun study in the first option. So in the first option both of these apply to the stretch

1790
02:44:42,100 --> 02:44:47,980
between none and dust. Okay so on the ocean and ashwards side. Well even at 50 feet you have to have

1791
02:44:47,980 --> 02:44:52,280
that. Yeah I don't think you I don't you wouldn't eliminate the shadow study from any of it

1792
02:44:52,280 --> 02:44:54,760
any of the scenarios because I think that's super important.

1793
02:45:00,000 --> 02:45:29,880
Anyway, the reason, you know, one of the things about the shadow study that I thought could allow you to go to 70 all the way down is think of how the casino approached this. They kind of wetting case, the bill, yeah. So they are lower in the front, but they were able to get that additional height and avoid casting it like that that's constructed. Other projects might follow suit in a similar way.

1794
02:45:29,880 --> 02:45:34,280
and minimize that impact of the higher buildings

1795
02:45:34,280 --> 02:45:36,580
that also are maybe a concern to some.

1796
02:45:37,000 --> 02:45:38,660
Right, and that would be a kind of a

1797
02:45:38,660 --> 02:45:40,860
big sense to the buildings all on ocean.

1798
02:45:41,420 --> 02:45:43,040
So, it makes those middle blocks worth a little bit.

1799
02:45:43,120 --> 02:45:46,160
So, that is one way to speak off higher.

1800
02:45:46,380 --> 02:45:50,160
So, the shadow, an unsatisfactory shadow study

1801
02:45:51,160 --> 02:45:54,620
eliminates your ability to go to 70 feet at the front,

1802
02:45:54,900 --> 02:45:56,780
even if the requirement is 70 feet

1803
02:45:56,780 --> 02:45:58,500
because you haven't met the shadow study.

1804
02:45:58,900 --> 02:45:59,680
Right, okay.

1805
02:45:59,680 --> 02:46:00,520
That kind of makes sense?

1806
02:46:00,780 --> 02:46:00,880
Yeah.

1807
02:46:01,260 --> 02:46:02,740
So that is one way of looking at it.

1808
02:46:02,780 --> 02:46:17,060
The other one was just saying 50 across, which means the 70-foot section gets reduced to 50, but by doing that, by conditional use permit from the planning board, it all could be as high as 70.

1809
02:46:17,740 --> 02:46:20,280
The current BS1 section plus further out.

1810
02:46:20,700 --> 02:46:25,600
I kind of like the first scenario better, but I wanted to present both.

1811
02:46:25,900 --> 02:46:26,940
We talked about both.

1812
02:46:27,660 --> 02:46:35,980
The conditional use permit, I think, would be as a layer of complexity for the developer.

1813
02:46:36,160 --> 02:46:37,520
It's on KISS.

1814
02:46:37,840 --> 02:46:38,960
It's on KISS.

1815
02:46:39,380 --> 02:46:39,520
Yes.

1816
02:46:40,160 --> 02:46:41,360
But either scenario.

1817
02:46:41,500 --> 02:46:47,420
We want a 70-foot high wall running down the whole coast of Hampton Beach.

1818
02:46:47,640 --> 02:46:48,700
Well, we're not.

1819
02:46:48,760 --> 02:46:50,340
Not Avenue to Dostin.

1820
02:46:50,660 --> 02:46:52,220
Everything's 70 high.

1821
02:46:52,220 --> 02:46:57,620
Well, there's significant business seasonal north of business seasonal

1822
02:46:57,620 --> 02:47:05,800
sure and that is not addressed in this right now that's why it's just a

1823
02:47:05,800 --> 02:47:10,340
continuation of this that would be the next argument right that we include that

1824
02:47:10,340 --> 02:47:18,280
now too. I agree with you it changes the whole character of all that you know

1825
02:47:18,280 --> 02:47:28,200
Dustin North. There's no beach there. There's no shadow study to protect the beach there. So you make a canyon there. Yeah, it's in Verde Canyon.

1826
02:47:28,840 --> 02:47:34,220
Well, the streets could be adjusted too. Asher at that. On Asher at that, we have 70-foot story buildings.

1827
02:47:34,580 --> 02:47:44,120
I used one right beside the dust and that's what you presented. I mean, I'm not saying the final amendment would be necessarily not the dust and I'm giving an example of that.

1828
02:47:44,120 --> 02:47:50,560
But if you look at that banana shape, that would all be up in the air, 70 feet instead of four stories, three stories.

1829
02:47:50,560 --> 02:47:50,760
Okay.

1830
02:47:51,980 --> 02:47:54,480
I don't know what what do you want the beach to look like.

1831
02:47:54,880 --> 02:47:57,840
Do we want it to look like Fort Lauderdale?

1832
02:47:58,400 --> 02:48:03,100
Do we want it to look like Mertle Beach?

1833
02:48:03,520 --> 02:48:03,780
Right.

1834
02:48:04,060 --> 02:48:07,120
Where it's all just high buildings, they have a deeper beach.

1835
02:48:07,480 --> 02:48:09,260
Their properties are on the sand.

1836
02:48:09,260 --> 02:48:13,760
But I mean, there, there, I don't know, I just-

1837
02:48:14,240 --> 02:48:18,460
This is also a part of the beach at a higher elevation, I believe.

1838
02:48:19,080 --> 02:48:23,840
So it is more protected from flood and-

1839
02:48:23,840 --> 02:48:25,040
I'm not worried about the flooding.

1840
02:48:25,240 --> 02:48:32,540
I just the actual human element to the parents of everything.

1841
02:48:32,700 --> 02:48:38,760
There isn't that bipedal movement around the beach because you've been in Atlantic City

1842
02:48:38,760 --> 02:48:45,120
where they're all tall and you go down the narrow A-street or G-street and it's just a wind tunnel.

1843
02:48:46,760 --> 02:48:55,880
What would you think about additional height there but perhaps considering a degree of setback

1844
02:48:55,880 --> 02:48:59,140
that prevents the buildings from going right to the sidewalks?

1845
02:48:59,140 --> 02:49:01,000
Are the lights big enough to have setbacks?

1846
02:49:01,260 --> 02:49:05,040
No, we needed to build that study, right?

1847
02:49:05,040 --> 02:49:08,900
Right. When we were initially talking about this, I was just thinking about the fact that

1848
02:49:08,900 --> 02:49:14,380
pretty much every building proposed above 50 feet has been able to get a variance.

1849
02:49:14,840 --> 02:49:19,460
So I was just thinking there must be a hardship that exists. We're already kind of at that point

1850
02:49:20,520 --> 02:49:24,880
you know when something's getting that many variances, I think that's when you've got to go and look

1851
02:49:24,880 --> 02:49:30,920
at the ordinance to figure out why it isn't working. That's what the audit told us. That's one of

1852
02:49:32,160 --> 02:49:39,540
Well, some of the variances were originally given to put up a parapet to hide rooftop elevators.

1853
02:49:40,560 --> 02:49:45,400
And that mechanicals and then the next application comes, well, they're at 70 feet.

1854
02:49:46,000 --> 02:49:48,920
We're going into 70 feet, but we're not doing it for our mechanicals.

1855
02:49:49,140 --> 02:49:50,620
We're doing it to get 70 feet.

1856
02:49:51,820 --> 02:49:53,880
Then we're going to put the mechanicals on top.

1857
02:49:54,620 --> 02:50:02,400
maybe, but I mean, that was how that kind of worked, like the one near Ron's leaning, right?

1858
02:50:06,830 --> 02:50:10,770
Because if that's okay, it's just going to, because the president is set, so it should just be

1859
02:50:10,770 --> 02:50:13,590
70 feet thin, because you're going to say what someone else is going to, we should have it.

1860
02:50:13,930 --> 02:50:17,090
But my hope would be that like the zoning board would look, you know, when they're talking about

1861
02:50:17,090 --> 02:50:21,950
the spirit of the ordinance, and if we're saying 70 foot is your heart stop, that includes your

1862
02:50:21,950 --> 02:50:27,510
Mechanicals that includes your elevator lobby were giving you that action would have to be added into the ordinance to make it clear.

1863
02:50:27,510 --> 02:50:32,070
Oh, yeah. 50 feet was the stop. But, well, never.

1864
02:50:32,230 --> 02:50:38,710
50 feet was the extra for mechanicals, though, with the unoccupied affronts, I can never say that word.

1865
02:50:39,730 --> 02:50:47,650
But if you think about it, 50 foot was the height of the building, of the building, not necessarily the, right.

1866
02:50:47,650 --> 02:50:54,490
So, it just, it doesn't matter if the, how do you have a hardship 50, 50, 50, 50, 50.

1867
02:50:54,730 --> 02:50:55,110
Right.

1868
02:50:56,970 --> 02:50:57,830
What about the hardship?

1869
02:50:57,890 --> 02:50:59,370
I'm going to take a look at it.

1870
02:50:59,610 --> 02:51:03,390
But I don't, but look at the character from South of F street.

1871
02:51:03,590 --> 02:51:06,090
That's what I'm looking all the way to Dustin.

1872
02:51:06,530 --> 02:51:10,430
It's all significantly lower than 50 feet, I think.

1873
02:51:10,590 --> 02:51:12,830
What if the presidential single-family residence?

1874
02:51:13,050 --> 02:51:13,630
Now are lots.

1875
02:51:14,030 --> 02:51:14,150
Yeah.

1876
02:51:14,610 --> 02:51:17,070
but what if you took it further than the current

1877
02:51:17,070 --> 02:51:20,150
as a seasonal one to whatever street before,

1878
02:51:20,150 --> 02:51:21,890
I don't know what it is before I've had the map in front of you,

1879
02:51:21,930 --> 02:51:24,110
but before the bend, kind of like, you know,

1880
02:51:24,130 --> 02:51:26,290
I'm talking about what before my cable have.

1881
02:51:26,670 --> 02:51:28,090
Somewhere around the end street.

1882
02:51:28,710 --> 02:51:32,430
Yeah, yeah, maybe from mud to end street

1883
02:51:32,430 --> 02:51:34,730
or whatever it could be that the stuff doesn't manage.

1884
02:51:34,850 --> 02:51:36,590
And then after that, where I agree,

1885
02:51:36,690 --> 02:51:39,230
it gets a little more narrow and you don't have the beach.

1886
02:51:39,370 --> 02:51:41,410
Maybe that's the part that stays fit.

1887
02:51:41,410 --> 02:51:44,070
maybe the area in a lot should be a certain percentage

1888
02:51:44,070 --> 02:51:47,210
of the height than you have just have to have a bigger lot

1889
02:51:47,210 --> 02:51:49,090
so you can have bigger setbacks.

1890
02:51:50,110 --> 02:51:50,170
Yeah.

1891
02:51:51,110 --> 02:51:52,090
What do you want?

1892
02:51:52,950 --> 02:51:57,630
Well, just it's very, we're gonna have building

1893
02:51:57,630 --> 02:52:00,190
70 feet, eight foot from each other,

1894
02:52:00,330 --> 02:52:01,970
four foot setbacks on each side.

1895
02:52:03,470 --> 02:52:04,830
So we're gonna have just like,

1896
02:52:05,230 --> 02:52:06,530
what do they call those in the city

1897
02:52:06,530 --> 02:52:08,470
when you have air shafts?

1898
02:52:08,470 --> 02:52:21,510
Yeah. So, the additional border there that I was originally proposing was Ashworth. So, we're not talking about going west of Ashworth.

1899
02:52:21,710 --> 02:52:22,930
No, not into this.

1900
02:52:23,710 --> 02:52:24,990
That's kind of the bananas.

1901
02:52:25,630 --> 02:52:33,470
Yeah. This business seasonal one does extend, I believe, west of Ashworth. So, in this...

1902
02:52:35,850 --> 02:52:37,790
Only were the parking lots in some of the levels.

1903
02:52:38,650 --> 02:52:40,430
Not deeper than that.

1904
02:52:40,530 --> 02:52:42,390
But some of those parking lots will be buildings.

1905
02:52:43,330 --> 02:52:43,430
Right.

1906
02:52:43,690 --> 02:52:43,970
Or made.

1907
02:52:44,010 --> 02:52:46,090
But is there something about 50 feet off of Ashworth?

1908
02:52:46,090 --> 02:52:47,950
There was certain something that we had certain,

1909
02:52:48,210 --> 02:52:49,950
the ones that faced Ashworth, wasn't it?

1910
02:52:49,970 --> 02:52:51,790
There was something in there that I'd have to deliver.

1911
02:52:51,830 --> 02:52:51,970
Right.

1912
02:52:52,410 --> 02:52:55,110
Because we were going to allow them to mimic across the street.

1913
02:52:55,290 --> 02:52:55,830
It was probably fine.

1914
02:52:55,830 --> 02:52:59,530
But it was further up that it was part of the BS1 side.

1915
02:52:59,810 --> 02:53:01,530
I'd have to verify.

1916
02:53:01,530 --> 02:53:05,890
Yeah, like we're chewing chat is and that's right, yeah, that's right

1917
02:53:06,810 --> 02:53:12,390
Would the conditional use permit would that give the board more discretion about the overall design?

1918
02:53:12,570 --> 02:53:17,030
Yes, we're doing a step back. So yes, so that when I have a conditional use permit

1919
02:53:17,030 --> 02:53:23,430
They have to submit a letter with the findings of fact and the board would have to verify that those findings of fact have been met

1920
02:53:23,430 --> 02:53:28,890
We'd have to decide what those findings of fact are, but that would be what one way of doing it

1921
02:53:28,890 --> 02:53:35,210
So if you're designing a beautiful building, that's a little different and not a box and that kind of thing, we can give you that extra 20 feet.

1922
02:53:35,470 --> 02:53:37,310
It would give you more discretion, yeah.

1923
02:53:39,380 --> 02:53:44,300
But again, it's always, but it's also, yeah, but it's also tricky to deny things.

1924
02:53:44,440 --> 02:53:47,380
I mean, we don't need a good reason for this.

1925
02:53:47,860 --> 02:53:51,000
It's like, it's like re-slanders, like, now that's the actual way.

1926
02:53:51,040 --> 02:53:56,000
So you could get into a little problem there. So there's a few ways of looking at it.

1927
02:53:56,940 --> 02:53:58,660
It's all what we want for a beach.

1928
02:54:02,300 --> 02:54:05,440
Yeah, I don't know if I like the 70-foot height, but it's already there.

1929
02:54:06,720 --> 02:54:10,120
But I'm not going to do it.

1930
02:54:10,120 --> 02:54:11,820
Oh, no, I didn't take it though, I was just saying.

1931
02:54:12,580 --> 02:54:13,760
But I almost just wonder.

1932
02:54:14,320 --> 02:54:21,940
I almost wonder if having all that aside, I wonder if having the BS1 layer is confusing.

1933
02:54:22,460 --> 02:54:29,760
If you're going to allow 70 feet in that area, just saying the ordinance from A-street to F-street is 70 feet.

1934
02:54:29,760 --> 02:54:34,520
Instead of saying we have this other zone, but everything is the same except for this one thing.

1935
02:54:34,760 --> 02:54:39,740
You follow what I'm saying. So maybe you're not really changing anything, but you're

1936
02:54:39,740 --> 02:54:45,960
pretty into using a layer of it. It's all just business seasonal, but this section of it is

1937
02:54:45,960 --> 02:54:48,100
almost like an overlay. It is, it's almost a little required.

1938
02:54:48,180 --> 02:54:51,080
So this started also with the Breckenridge project.

1939
02:54:53,020 --> 02:54:57,120
And that was on G Street. It's a G Street, the Breckenridge.

1940
02:54:57,120 --> 02:55:02,580
I'm trying to think the guy that came in and did it, there was a fire down there.

1941
02:55:04,000 --> 02:55:09,160
I think it's G Street and I guess it's kind of where they all sold us.

1942
02:55:09,940 --> 02:55:11,420
That's G Street and...

1943
02:55:11,420 --> 02:55:11,820
Jane Kay.

1944
02:55:12,200 --> 02:55:12,620
Jane Kay.

1945
02:55:14,780 --> 02:55:19,220
And they were trying to wedding cake it, but they were trying to go really high in the back.

1946
02:55:23,300 --> 02:55:27,320
And so that that got passed but didn't make it financially.

1947
02:55:29,320 --> 02:55:31,180
Recession or whatever happened there.

1948
02:55:31,940 --> 02:55:36,820
And of course what we have now is a straight building.

1949
02:55:38,000 --> 02:55:39,020
Quantals I believe.

1950
02:55:39,440 --> 02:55:39,580
Right.

1951
02:55:39,740 --> 02:55:42,560
Or modern, modern cottages.

1952
02:55:46,840 --> 02:55:50,320
So that's what started because that was the beginning

1953
02:55:50,320 --> 02:55:54,200
And then when I looked at the first master planes we did a Hampton Beach.

1954
02:55:54,720 --> 02:55:57,920
We were trying to keep it more of a seaside village feel.

1955
02:56:03,440 --> 02:56:07,560
So then we got to 70 feet because a lot of other places stopped.

1956
02:56:07,780 --> 02:56:11,880
But there were a couple proposals for the 70 feet and we had all those missing teeth.

1957
02:56:13,520 --> 02:56:20,220
From the surf fire and then there were some other fires that were behind a playland.

1958
02:56:20,220 --> 02:56:24,780
And then there were some fires and then the buildings couldn't earn their keep.

1959
02:56:25,040 --> 02:56:27,280
So the chief got vacant lots and have parking.

1960
02:56:29,600 --> 02:56:35,460
And you can see that's how all that parking happened on all the side streets, because a front business.

1961
02:56:37,680 --> 02:56:46,500
For example, I know that the Lincoln House, but lots further down when they were just stressed to tear them down to have on street.

1962
02:56:46,500 --> 02:56:54,680
They have their own Austrian parking because they couldn't afford the rents from the state to have deed at least land parking

1963
02:56:55,380 --> 02:56:58,100
So that was their solution to

1964
02:56:58,760 --> 02:57:01,840
solve their own problem for their hotels

1965
02:57:02,900 --> 02:57:05,220
Because everybody still had cars then

1966
02:57:08,140 --> 02:57:10,720
So that's how the beach has evolved

1967
02:57:10,720 --> 02:57:15,540
And that's why you had, when we, I'm trying to think on G Street there was a new place

1968
02:57:15,540 --> 02:57:15,900
put up.

1969
02:57:16,040 --> 02:57:16,720
They were modulars.

1970
02:57:17,140 --> 02:57:21,380
I'm trying to think guys that put that in on that.

1971
02:57:21,560 --> 02:57:22,180
Data fire.

1972
02:57:23,120 --> 02:57:29,580
Then they tore down that, the, uh, Roaming House slash hotel slash motel on that corner.

1973
02:57:30,280 --> 02:57:38,220
And he did a deed to have the parking lots on a separate lot down that street.

1974
02:57:39,080 --> 02:57:51,800
They were tied to the ownership of those units on that, as well, to prove that they provided one or two parking spaces for each unit so they could get the billing permit to create housing there.

1975
02:57:52,880 --> 02:58:07,400
So it's a fine web we weave and here we are, but we should expect that the center of existing BS1 is going to be 90 feet, large building 90 feet.

1976
02:58:08,560 --> 02:58:09,040
will have.

1977
02:58:10,240 --> 02:58:11,540
Because the casino is 90 feet.

1978
02:58:11,720 --> 02:58:13,580
That is what will happen now is 90 feet and 70.

1979
02:58:14,280 --> 02:58:15,580
Even though ordinance is 70.

1980
02:58:16,340 --> 02:58:23,600
They got a variance to go to the 90 and achieve what we were asking for with the the

1981
02:58:23,600 --> 02:58:23,880
cake.

1982
02:58:24,500 --> 02:58:25,920
So why do we have to change it?

1983
02:58:26,020 --> 02:58:30,320
They're going to get variances because we're trying to avoid that.

1984
02:58:32,460 --> 02:58:33,360
I agree.

1985
02:58:36,800 --> 02:58:39,760
We have a hard job too, at the very end.

1986
02:58:39,840 --> 02:58:41,000
I'm not disagreeing.

1987
02:58:41,060 --> 02:58:45,980
Part of what we should be doing is, you know, planning.

1988
02:58:47,920 --> 02:58:50,440
My planning would be to keep it lower.

1989
02:58:51,080 --> 02:58:51,340
Okay.

1990
02:58:56,330 --> 02:58:57,130
And 50?

1991
02:58:57,750 --> 02:58:57,890
Yeah.

1992
02:58:58,350 --> 02:58:58,530
Okay.

1993
02:58:58,690 --> 02:59:06,070
If they're going to give variances, if they're going to see variances, and have a legitimate, can justify their five reasons, that's different.

1994
02:59:07,250 --> 02:59:15,130
but they are, right? I don't know. You're going up to half. Yeah. Have there been some of the

1995
02:59:15,130 --> 02:59:17,650
denied? I don't know if any.

1996
02:59:20,170 --> 02:59:28,510
Some of those variances are definitely not. Yeah, quite a few. Yeah.

1997
02:59:29,150 --> 02:59:33,310
Most people will look like they're going to be denied with draw their application and try to figure

1998
02:59:33,310 --> 02:59:38,010
something old, right? If you can't come back twice with the sample chart, unless a significant change.

1999
02:59:40,060 --> 02:59:48,160
I think to me part of this is what is the best use for the town of, let's just talk about the

2000
02:59:48,160 --> 02:59:54,260
South of or that little triangle of BS1 and

2001
03:00:00,000 --> 03:00:11,360
What we are expecting, the demand, both development, demand, and people demand, maybe, for that area after the casino goes in.

2002
03:00:12,180 --> 03:00:16,080
My expectation is it may be different than what we have right now.

2003
03:00:16,820 --> 03:00:17,380
It may be.

2004
03:00:19,620 --> 03:00:28,580
And generally speaking, my preference would be to have less zoning variances granted

2005
03:00:29,380 --> 03:00:39,020
because the zoning is more in line with what we're actually looking for and is current

2006
03:00:39,380 --> 03:00:44,760
with the demands and needs so that it would be more challenging.

2007
03:00:45,060 --> 03:00:45,560
Good question.

2008
03:00:46,000 --> 03:00:49,220
So I'm the business-seasonal, business-seasonal one here that we're talking about.

2009
03:00:50,180 --> 03:00:53,440
I mean, the casino is still probably a few years from being completed.

2010
03:00:53,600 --> 03:00:54,960
The project's not underway or that.

2011
03:00:57,080 --> 03:01:03,600
I'm asking the board collectively here, what do you think about maybe thinking about this one more for 28?

2012
03:01:03,820 --> 03:01:08,560
We already have 13 zoning amendments on the ballot, we talked about, not a ballot, but I mean 13.

2013
03:01:08,820 --> 03:01:10,480
I predict torches and pitchforks.

2014
03:01:10,620 --> 03:01:14,980
Because we have a number of them that we're going to talk about at another meeting from the RSA,

2015
03:01:15,220 --> 03:01:21,940
from changes in the RSA, so not in a ballot, but it looks like as of right now, we'd be at 13, including this one.

2016
03:01:22,420 --> 03:01:33,020
This seems like something that, in my opinion, it's all up to the board, doesn't necessarily need to be 27, but I'm putting that out to the board for your thoughts.

2017
03:01:33,760 --> 03:01:36,720
I was thinking a lot of those lines were all the kind of things.

2018
03:01:36,820 --> 03:01:40,240
If we've got 13 coming up, we're going to have to cut some more.

2019
03:01:40,240 --> 03:01:40,280
We're going to have to cut some more.

2020
03:01:40,360 --> 03:01:41,020
We're going to have to be a good thing.

2021
03:01:42,160 --> 03:01:43,560
That's a lot of zoning amendments.

2022
03:01:43,720 --> 03:01:46,380
But I mean, but I don't want to take that off the table.

2023
03:01:46,520 --> 03:01:49,620
I want to make sure the board agrees that that's the plan for 28 for sure.

2024
03:01:49,620 --> 03:01:53,420
So that's a good approach, but it seems like, and I think one is controversial.

2025
03:01:53,880 --> 03:01:55,040
It's a real issue.

2026
03:01:56,160 --> 03:01:58,900
He spent some time looking at the, yeah, the character of the neighborhood.

2027
03:01:59,280 --> 03:02:03,100
And I'm only saying that based on the conversation that I'm hearing in this meeting,

2028
03:02:03,380 --> 03:02:07,460
specifically, that it seems like there is a lot of difference in opinion.

2029
03:02:07,580 --> 03:02:11,440
A lot of, we probably want to get a lot of feedback from people at the beach on this,

2030
03:02:11,580 --> 03:02:14,340
that maybe we don't have that window right now.

2031
03:02:14,400 --> 03:02:15,340
How do we, I don't know.

2032
03:02:15,480 --> 03:02:18,280
How do we apply form-based zoning for the beach?

2033
03:02:18,280 --> 03:02:28,420
because that is probably a better argument of figuring out how to future rise development

2034
03:02:29,450 --> 03:02:33,360
in that commercial district.

2035
03:02:34,990 --> 03:02:41,940
We've taken so many swipes at this to do it right once, but there's always change.

2036
03:02:44,620 --> 03:02:58,120
But when in for for base housing start looking at this block, you're going to be up here this night that far back and we go a little bit more or we could do this or our expectations are how that is bill modeled.

2037
03:03:00,400 --> 03:03:08,560
Well, I'm hoping that we will be able to discuss some element at least of for base housing at the next meeting.

2038
03:03:08,560 --> 03:03:14,600
I think Ryan is pretty certainly a lot more familiar with it than I think most of us are

2039
03:03:16,040 --> 03:03:17,240
But we won't have

2040
03:03:17,240 --> 03:03:17,340
a

2041
03:03:18,840 --> 03:03:27,220
representative from the beach here, which I had thought would be helpful to this conversation not to put too much on you.

2042
03:03:27,360 --> 03:03:32,940
It's not that you can always talk about it because the name to Beach Village is strict, too. Right. He says on that as well, right

2043
03:03:32,940 --> 03:03:34,700
because it is a big discussion.

2044
03:03:34,980 --> 03:03:35,240
It is.

2045
03:03:36,420 --> 03:03:40,280
Like less fighting for the height, but just more so,

2046
03:03:40,440 --> 03:03:43,560
just the BS1 zone is just such a weird little space.

2047
03:03:43,820 --> 03:03:44,080
Totally.

2048
03:03:44,400 --> 03:03:44,780
Zoning.

2049
03:03:45,220 --> 03:03:45,400
Yeah.

2050
03:03:45,660 --> 03:03:46,780
You know, just making a uniform.

2051
03:03:47,100 --> 03:03:47,240
Yeah.

2052
03:03:47,620 --> 03:03:48,100
It makes sense.

2053
03:03:48,840 --> 03:03:51,740
I think form-based zoning, we talked about this is something

2054
03:03:51,740 --> 03:03:53,780
that would require outside consulting assistance,

2055
03:03:53,780 --> 03:03:55,940
because it is much more complex.

2056
03:03:56,560 --> 03:03:59,180
You know, maybe we'll get it for the town center, perhaps, too.

2057
03:03:59,560 --> 03:04:01,740
So I mean, I think that's something that would require

2058
03:04:01,740 --> 03:04:06,620
that assistance, but I think that is like you said Sharon, for a conversation for maybe even in two weeks.

2059
03:04:07,420 --> 03:04:10,480
Getting some thoughts on whether we want to start thinking about that.

2060
03:04:10,780 --> 03:04:10,920
Right.

2061
03:04:11,420 --> 03:04:13,720
Because a lot of times we're just anxious to get something done.

2062
03:04:14,120 --> 03:04:14,260
Yeah.

2063
03:04:14,480 --> 03:04:17,580
We want to have that building built.

2064
03:04:17,780 --> 03:04:19,320
We want to have that attraction.

2065
03:04:19,540 --> 03:04:28,940
We want to have that, but it's not based around, if it was Disney, they would have a long term production on how they're going to develop it.

2066
03:04:28,940 --> 03:04:33,820
We don't really have that because it's the individual rights on each piece of property.

2067
03:04:34,120 --> 03:04:39,320
We aren't developing it ourselves but right now it seems as though it was pointed out

2068
03:04:39,320 --> 03:04:47,460
as an issue by the consultants and I know that people around, we are a little confuzzled

2069
03:04:48,220 --> 03:04:52,920
by it and others at the beach that I have talked to, too.

2070
03:04:53,340 --> 03:04:58,060
So I think it needs attention but it needs proper attention.

2071
03:04:58,060 --> 03:05:04,920
not just thoughtful consideration right I know from my previous community you know

2072
03:05:04,920 --> 03:05:10,240
they did certain areas with some form based and it's it's not a quick and

2073
03:05:10,240 --> 03:05:15,520
simple process right I think this is something that you know we should

2074
03:05:16,960 --> 03:05:21,160
continue to talk about but but move down the road a little bit I mean you're

2075
03:05:21,160 --> 03:05:24,900
changing your format of your zoning one area or two areas of town from one

2076
03:05:24,900 --> 03:05:27,300
an entire format is something entirely different, right?

2077
03:05:27,560 --> 03:05:28,400
That is not simple.

2078
03:05:28,560 --> 03:05:30,240
That is something that is probably requires.

2079
03:05:30,540 --> 03:05:33,320
That's something that's going to take years, probably.

2080
03:05:33,860 --> 03:05:34,740
We're going to get together.

2081
03:05:35,140 --> 03:05:37,680
I mean, you know, the consultant assistance may be a year,

2082
03:05:37,760 --> 03:05:39,440
I don't know, but it's something that you know,

2083
03:05:39,440 --> 03:05:40,140
start thinking about.

2084
03:05:40,880 --> 03:05:41,880
What are you just going to do with this?

2085
03:05:41,880 --> 03:05:48,220
What I'm suggesting is that 12 or 13 zoning is a lot,

2086
03:05:48,420 --> 03:05:51,380
or that is a lot, but I think it's going

2087
03:05:51,380 --> 03:05:52,260
to be the need normal.

2088
03:05:52,260 --> 03:05:59,960
If you if you've got the state making all sorts of changes you know a lot of our zoning changes are

2089
03:05:59,960 --> 03:06:04,140
Reactions to the state some of them are from the hot grant some of them are

2090
03:06:04,780 --> 03:06:13,740
Well, it's time to be a zone but 79 east off is gonna be perceived as a zoning right so I yeah, so I would not say that

2091
03:06:14,260 --> 03:06:16,960
You know, there has to be an absolute limit to the number of zoning

2092
03:06:31,620 --> 03:06:37,640
I think it's the number of amendments. I don't know how many people were able to attend

2093
03:06:37,640 --> 03:06:43,820
on the 20th of August the BEA session about the RSA changes that I'd like you all know

2094
03:06:43,820 --> 03:06:53,200
about one of the things that was mentioned there that I mentioned to you sharing was about the number of amendments in communities start having 10, 12 plus amendments in the ballot.

2095
03:06:53,720 --> 03:06:58,600
It gives its voters owning fatigue, basically, and it really can, they don't advise it.

2096
03:06:58,720 --> 03:07:06,440
I know we're kind of in a position right now where we're naturally going to have some more because of where we are with our work on zoning.

2097
03:07:07,140 --> 03:07:12,460
But I do also think that we have to balance that with not overwhelming the voter.

2098
03:07:12,460 --> 03:07:19,160
with 15 amendments or something like that. I think that is a concern, and I think others

2099
03:07:19,160 --> 03:07:21,020
would echo that, based on what I've heard.

2100
03:07:21,360 --> 03:07:26,140
Well, some of this is housekeeping, but there is a number of them that have some substance

2101
03:07:26,140 --> 03:07:34,220
to them. And I think we need to, you know, pick and choose a battle, so to speak.

2102
03:07:34,900 --> 03:07:39,420
Oh, I think the majority of them have substance to them this time around.

2103
03:07:40,960 --> 03:07:43,160
So it's just something for the board to keep in mind.

2104
03:07:43,480 --> 03:07:46,620
I mean, we'll do what the board feels as far as the number.

2105
03:07:46,880 --> 03:07:48,200
I know what this one's for me, too.

2106
03:07:48,760 --> 03:07:48,860
Yeah.

2107
03:07:50,800 --> 03:07:52,920
By the time he's in budget, people are asleep.

2108
03:07:54,900 --> 03:07:57,120
I'm not sure the cost of the hall is going to be good.

2109
03:07:57,920 --> 03:07:58,580
You're just kidding.

2110
03:07:59,060 --> 03:07:59,280
Just kidding.

2111
03:08:00,200 --> 03:08:03,420
I'm close to that anyway, so I don't know.

2112
03:08:04,740 --> 03:08:07,320
Excel is my friend for the ballots.

2113
03:08:07,320 --> 03:08:12,700
So do you want to talk about form-based a little bit?

2114
03:08:13,420 --> 03:08:16,340
I think the public should be informed what form-based is,

2115
03:08:16,360 --> 03:08:20,400
and if it's these are good applications of the two commercial

2116
03:08:24,920 --> 03:08:26,560
commercial urban areas.

2117
03:08:26,960 --> 03:08:29,620
A lack of a better term.

2118
03:08:30,340 --> 03:08:32,580
Okay, that sounds good to me.

2119
03:08:33,600 --> 03:08:34,940
And we'll talk about the

2120
03:08:37,660 --> 03:08:39,220
I'm not tonight tonight.

2121
03:08:40,640 --> 03:08:42,840
It is 10 o'clock and we're going to

2122
03:08:42,840 --> 03:08:47,740
do the other item was the alternate seats.

2123
03:08:47,740 --> 03:08:49,260
Do you want to take those up in two weeks?

2124
03:08:50,020 --> 03:08:50,580
Or do you want to do it?

2125
03:08:50,660 --> 03:08:51,160
Still now.

2126
03:08:51,640 --> 03:08:51,720
Yeah.

2127
03:08:51,980 --> 03:08:52,480
Let's do them now.

2128
03:08:52,700 --> 03:08:54,520
So you have to be quick.

2129
03:08:55,060 --> 03:08:55,420
So all right.

2130
03:08:55,580 --> 03:09:01,160
So we do have two alternate requests that we received.

2131
03:09:01,160 --> 03:09:03,000
You'd receive both of those.

2132
03:09:03,080 --> 03:09:07,680
One of those I got a couple of weeks ago from a gentleman, you have that.

2133
03:09:07,820 --> 03:09:09,800
And then there was another one that we received today.

2134
03:09:11,820 --> 03:09:13,280
Any openings do we have?

2135
03:09:14,660 --> 03:09:17,960
Technically, you can have up to five alternates.

2136
03:09:18,420 --> 03:09:20,720
We only have two right alternates right now.

2137
03:09:20,840 --> 03:09:22,000
So technically three openings.

2138
03:09:22,020 --> 03:09:29,700
I was going to leave one seat open depending on other circumstances, you know, with my arise.

2139
03:09:29,700 --> 03:09:35,860
But I think that we need to fill two seats, basically, and you have two requests here.

2140
03:09:37,360 --> 03:09:43,180
They have interest, they have interest, and they both have nice resumes that they provided.

2141
03:09:44,000 --> 03:09:51,280
I have the resume first, and I have the resume first, William and Thomas.

2142
03:09:51,900 --> 03:09:53,480
Do we need to take these separately?

2143
03:09:53,480 --> 03:09:56,960
Yeah, absolutely so and then I would just

2144
03:10:02,740 --> 03:10:07,000
We could start with the one that we received a little COVID activity

2145
03:10:09,160 --> 03:10:15,140
Does anyone want to make a motion on the one that we received two weeks ago Mr. Jones here?

2146
03:10:15,920 --> 03:10:21,220
I'll make a motion that way to point Mr. Jones for a is it a two or three or a one?

2147
03:10:21,360 --> 03:10:21,800
It's a

2148
03:10:22,680 --> 03:10:27,560
So it's three, but actually the term, because we're appointing him now would expire in 2029.

2149
03:10:28,800 --> 03:10:30,460
So it's a three for three year term.

2150
03:10:30,520 --> 03:10:31,440
Effectively three year term.

2151
03:10:31,600 --> 03:10:31,760
Yes.

2152
03:10:32,600 --> 03:10:33,080
Second.

2153
03:10:33,700 --> 03:10:34,480
All in favor.

2154
03:10:36,080 --> 03:10:37,240
Let me just write the.

2155
03:10:37,520 --> 03:10:38,860
Congratulations, Mr. Jones.

2156
03:10:39,620 --> 03:10:41,060
We're going to work with him.

2157
03:10:41,880 --> 03:10:48,600
Have we had the opportunity to review Mac the boy?

2158
03:10:57,460 --> 03:11:02,540
He has interest, he's worked with some community development engineers.

2159
03:11:03,080 --> 03:11:07,020
He lives in Hampton, he lives in the beach, I don't want to give out his address, but

2160
03:11:07,680 --> 03:11:10,460
that brings a nice perspective from that neighborhood.

2161
03:11:11,000 --> 03:11:15,560
And he's used to tell himself, yeah, municipal experience, that's it.

2162
03:11:15,620 --> 03:11:16,080
That's right, yeah.

2163
03:11:17,660 --> 03:11:20,100
I move that we accept Mr. McAvoy.

2164
03:11:20,580 --> 03:11:20,860
A point.

2165
03:11:21,420 --> 03:11:22,040
Is there a second?

2166
03:11:23,100 --> 03:11:23,940
All in favor?

2167
03:11:25,620 --> 03:11:26,020
Congratulations.

2168
03:11:26,020 --> 03:11:28,240
And again, that's for a three-year term.

2169
03:11:28,600 --> 03:11:28,680
Yeah.

2170
03:11:29,000 --> 03:11:32,580
So we'll do, the planning office will reach out to them,

2171
03:11:32,940 --> 03:11:35,200
let them know they're going to need to get sworn in

2172
03:11:35,200 --> 03:11:36,800
if the town starts off as soon as we will.

2173
03:11:37,060 --> 03:11:37,400
Okay.

2174
03:11:37,580 --> 03:11:38,080
I'm sure they do that.

2175
03:11:38,300 --> 03:11:38,800
Yeah, they have to.

2176
03:11:38,940 --> 03:11:39,580
Nice meeting them.

2177
03:11:43,480 --> 03:11:46,940
Are there any burning issues and updates

2178
03:11:46,940 --> 03:11:49,340
from the Select Board or Conservation Commission?

2179
03:11:49,960 --> 03:11:51,540
We really only talk trash.

2180
03:11:55,440 --> 03:12:00,560
And we approve the order of the glider drops so far in front of you.

2181
03:12:00,600 --> 03:12:00,940
Okay.

2182
03:12:01,060 --> 03:12:01,320
Awesome.

2183
03:12:02,620 --> 03:12:11,080
I think offline, can I communicate to the select board, that the CBE, I think everybody

2184
03:12:11,080 --> 03:12:17,860
knows that community business engagement through UNH, we will be holding an initial conversation

2185
03:12:17,860 --> 03:12:20,320
with Nate on October 7th.

2186
03:12:22,100 --> 03:12:36,200
I believe it's at 10 in the morning and I suspect it will end up being virtual, so if that can go back to the select board and then communicate who from select will be joining us.

2187
03:12:36,580 --> 03:12:37,420
That's awesome.

2188
03:12:38,260 --> 03:12:45,640
Yeah, it doesn't mean no, but it means that we're continuing the conversation and I expect that we will.

2189
03:12:45,640 --> 03:12:56,240
we may know at the end of that what the timeline is for finding out more, which then would go to Selective Board at the rate.

2190
03:12:57,280 --> 03:12:57,980
Yeah, it was so.

2191
03:12:58,380 --> 03:12:58,640
Okay.

2192
03:12:59,000 --> 03:13:02,640
And one more thing, just a reminder for everybody, budget.

2193
03:13:02,920 --> 03:13:05,000
So I had sent you the budget several weeks ago.

2194
03:13:05,700 --> 03:13:10,260
It has to be submitted to the town manager by the 10th of September.

2195
03:13:10,260 --> 03:13:17,600
I need so I need to know the comments by Friday so that I can finish it up and get it inputted in that I don't I don't know that

2196
03:13:17,600 --> 03:13:25,640
I mean we're keeping it flat. That's that's what Jeff Prime knows this that's what's been talked about doing for the most part of this year

2197
03:13:26,300 --> 03:13:33,860
If if there are increases we're gonna have to justify them pretty hard. So that's are there collars? I haven't looked at that that is separate

2198
03:13:33,860 --> 03:13:39,520
So that's not that's not shown not to be addressed that would be addressed separately. Okay

2199
03:13:39,520 --> 03:13:41,380
So you're really looking at the other numbers.

2200
03:13:41,840 --> 03:13:44,280
So if you have no objection, you don't have to hear from us.

2201
03:13:44,360 --> 03:13:48,840
Yes, if I don't hear from you by Friday, I'm just going to type it in Tuesday morning

2202
03:13:48,840 --> 03:13:49,460
and get it submitted.

2203
03:13:49,680 --> 03:13:51,720
I'm glad we're able to do our part to keep it flat.

2204
03:13:52,800 --> 03:13:54,680
But if you do have comments, let me know.

2205
03:13:55,720 --> 03:13:58,300
Have people had the opportunity to review the budget?

2206
03:13:59,760 --> 03:14:01,940
It's like six lines long, it's not different.

2207
03:14:02,500 --> 03:14:02,680
Right.

2208
03:14:03,540 --> 03:14:06,480
Are we in a position where we could say tonight?

2209
03:14:07,560 --> 03:14:08,840
Do you need a motion?

2210
03:14:08,840 --> 03:14:15,160
No, I don't need any motion. I just can sense. I just want to make sure that the planning board has had a chance to comment on it twice a month.

2211
03:14:16,820 --> 03:14:21,040
I'm good. Now, if we were to receive any grants or anything, that would be separate.

2212
03:14:21,200 --> 03:14:24,700
There's a line that we would put that under the place. Yeah, that's a TBD.

2213
03:14:25,140 --> 03:14:25,740
Yeah, that's right.

2214
03:14:27,220 --> 03:14:28,600
It's not subtracted.

2215
03:14:29,440 --> 03:14:32,700
So if you're all set with it, then I'll just work towards it.

2216
03:14:32,700 --> 03:14:33,300
I think we are.

2217
03:14:33,480 --> 03:14:33,720
We'll do.

2218
03:14:33,980 --> 03:14:34,440
All right, we'll do.

2219
03:14:34,540 --> 03:14:35,880
I would kindly take it for the agenda.

2220
03:14:36,380 --> 03:14:36,480
Yeah.

2221
03:14:36,620 --> 03:14:37,640
Well, I had more less.

2222
03:14:37,780 --> 03:14:39,700
I had comments on the Conservation Commission.

2223
03:14:39,960 --> 03:14:41,060
They can wait till the next meeting.

2224
03:14:41,320 --> 03:14:42,780
I figured you might say that.

2225
03:14:43,000 --> 03:14:43,840
We'll be adjourned.

2226
03:14:44,220 --> 03:14:45,080
Okay, second.

2227
03:14:45,900 --> 03:14:46,520
All in favor?

2228
03:14:48,540 --> 03:14:49,340
The adjourned.

2229
03:14:50,100 --> 03:14:50,860
10-09.

2230
03:14:51,160 --> 03:14:51,480
Thank you.

2231
03:14:51,660 --> 03:14:52,060
22.

2232
03:14:52,460 --> 03:14:53,860
And anyone who's still with us.

2233
03:14:53,980 --> 03:14:54,480
I think this.