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Yeah. Where? Oh, wait. Where's

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>> She was here.

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>> She'll be right back.

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>> All right. It's recording.

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>> Okay.

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Let's give her a couple minutes or a

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minute. Is she on her way?

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>> Okay. Let's

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Sorry. Let's call to order. City Council

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meeting, Alpine City Council meeting for

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April 14, 2026.

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Okay. Okay, we'll start with the roll

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call starting from Councilwoman Muan and

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then followed by a prayer by

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Councilwoman Smeuan followed by a pledge

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led by Councilwoman Blackwell.

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>> Jessica Smean present.

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>> Sarah Blackwell present. Chrissy Hanaman

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present.

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>> Andrew Young present. Brett Rumbler

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present. Our

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Father in heaven, we come before thee

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this beautiful spring day with gratitude

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for the time we have to gather together

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as city officials and as residents to

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work through our future for our

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community. We're grateful, Father, for

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this

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time that we have to set aside and to

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prioritize and ask for thy direction and

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guidance that we will be able to make

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decisions and we will be able to um be

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able to hear and to understand each

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other and that we ask for civility in

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this time. We are grateful, Father, for

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our country and for the freedoms we

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enjoy. And we ask for thy blessings upon

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all of those that are serving that will

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that are working and serving keeping us

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protected to enjoy these freedoms. And

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we say this thing in the name of Jesus

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Christ. Amen.

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>> Amen.

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>> Please rise for the pledge of

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allegiance.

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>> Ready? Begin.

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I pledge algiance to the flag of the

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United States of America and to the

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republic for which it stands, one nation

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under God, indivisible, with liberty and

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justice for all.

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» Okay.

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>> Recording in progress.

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» Okay. Okay. We will move on to item two

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which is the consent calendar. Are there

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any questions regarding any of the items

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on the consent calendar?

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>> I have some questions but would anyone

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like do are we doing it in an order

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today?

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» Yeah.

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>> Just this might eliminate some questions

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maybe. So on item D that one can be

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removed from the agenda. There's some

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developments that have happened since

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this went out and so we won't need to

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have that on there.

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>> I I appreciate all the emails back and

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forth and the work that uh everyone's

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doing to try to help with that.

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[clears throat and cough] Um you you

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okay if I just go on a couple others.

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>> Is there anybody else that has comments?

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If not, then yeah, we can skip going

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through the order and you go ahead.

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>> Okay. Just butt in if if someone has one

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on one of these. Um let me just go

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through them. There's like 12 of them.

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So I'm just getting back to uh yes on

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the minutes. Let me see.

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So, uh, on B, the municipal wastewater

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planning program.

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Um, I like it. Uh,

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let me see. Hold on one second.

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You, uh,

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you mentioned that there was just a

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replacement. Basically, we don't talk

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about this very much, so I was just

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wanting to get a just a handhold on it.

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The replacement of the sewer line with a

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sag in the line. The only reason for

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bringing this up is just if there's any

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information we can glean that we don't

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get too late on something like this. Is

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this urgent? Is this stuff that we

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should be No, but that is that the only

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thing on your radar?

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>> If if it was, we would have brought it

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before now. But it's it's a project uh

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recommended as a capital project on our

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capital improvement project or our

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capital improvement plan. And um I just

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I was talking with the public works guys

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uh last week and we feel like we

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probably should take care of this one.

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>> Okay. Okay.

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>> It it'll be something coming up.

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>> Other than that, everything checked out

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is like excellent condition with the

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sewers, but

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>> yeah,

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>> it's just our sewers in good condition,

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>> right? It's just that one thing with

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those uh with the sewer line sag. So,

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just let us know if that becomes

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apparent. Um on the uh

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item C, Sarah Blackwell, I'm got some

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worries about No, I'm kidding. No, I

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think it's really good and I guess it

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goes along with item

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E. C and E are related because she's

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going onto the committee, which we all

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love and are so appreciative. But the

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[clears throat]

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letter E on the water management plan.

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Um I'll bring this up a couple times. I

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don't know if Heidi if you can pull up

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an image that I included. I'm I'm a

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little worried on the management plan

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that it's too aggressive. When I read

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it, it's like we'll turn off their water

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and basically block them if they violate

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it. Um I I just and then we want like I feel like it's a little harsh on the

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water plan. I don't know if everyone

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agrees that uh it's fine as it is. It

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just seemed like a little bit

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aggressive.

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>> So, it's the same plan we've had for

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like 10 plus years

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>> and we just turn their water off.

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>> We can. Yes.

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>> It's not common though.

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>> If if there's multiple violations, I

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mean, on on years when water is

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plentiful, it's not as much of an issue,

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but we anticipate

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a tougher year this year.

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>> Right. Right.

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>> And so, we need to have the ability and

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that's why it's in ordinance format. So,

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we have an ordinance to back up Okay.

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>> The actions that are taken.

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>> So I [clears throat] I mean I understand

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the penalty. I guess it would be helpful

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if we offered the residents something

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besides just like a hammer

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>> like the first is a warning and then

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they get a fine and then they get a

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second fine. I think that turning it off

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is perfectly um logical after

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>> the steps that are taken and I think it

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needs to be taken. if you have issues

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with it. Um, you know, you've made your

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statement. Do is there anything else

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that you wanted to add? You could vote.

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>> Yeah, you had a question. Yeah. And I

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only have a couple more.

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>> Okay.

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>> Sorry. It's also very standard in util

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utility companies and governments and

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HOAs that warning moderate fines and

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more significant

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>> electric does it, gas does it. So the

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question is because it just feels so

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heavy-handed um if we can also just as a

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thought process be thinking of ways to

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help them through these like uh

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basically droughts that we're about to

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go through. Not just penalize them but

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help them because what they're being

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told is um basically your lawns are the

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problem. You use too much water. You got

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to cut back. Your rates are going to go

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up. And anyways, I'm I'm just trying to

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provide them some sort of benefit of how

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they fix it. So, I wrote up some stuff.

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We can show it later because this water

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comes up like four times today. So, we

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can show it later.

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>> Can I just maybe answer your question,

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Andrew?

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>> Yeah. The question is, how can we add

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some more positive stuff to our water

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plan that gives them some benefits like

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rain barrels or something like that

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where they can store water, they can

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help versus just if you go wrong, we're

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cutting you off. So,

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>> probably

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go ahead. Well, Chrissy and I and Mayor

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Oh, sorry, Councilwoman Hanniman and

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Mayor Merrill and I have all been

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working with the water committee with

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Steve and that's one of the things we've

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discussed is the education part and we

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want to try to keep all of this positive

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and not go down like a like you said

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like a heavy-handed. So, we're working

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towards that. I don't know if

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Councilwoman Henman has anything she

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wants to add to that, but um that is

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something that we've taken into

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consideration. Is it our approach?

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>> I think Okay, thanks. That that does it.

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>> And I do think um based on the work of

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the water committee who we've been

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meeting weekly and so there's a a time

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is of the essence feeling that helping

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uh prepare for what the summer lies

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ahead. So, it is a very very high

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priority of the city staff who are

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preparing water fixtures but also

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messaging to get to our residents. So,

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just so you know, it's a very high

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priority just because we're turning on

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the water tomorrow.

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>> Okay.

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>> So,

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>> okay, that's it. Uh the next one is um

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the money ones. Uh

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>> mayor, [clears throat] may I make a

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suggestion?

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>> Yes. Yes, if there's some these items

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are on the consent calendar for a reason

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and if they need to be subject to

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further discussion, I think you ought to

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entertain a motion to remove these items

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and and put them down below in the

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action items.

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00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:00,560
>> No, that's excellent suggestion. Also,

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you know, I know that Shane took out of

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time with family time yesterday while

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dealing with funeral and

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>> asked for questions regarding item on

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the agenda and took time out of the

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family while family was doing other

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things. He went to a separate room and,

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you know, worked really hard in replying

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to your questions. Did you send any of

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these questions to Shane?

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00:09:23,680 --> 00:09:25,360
>> I I was out of town, so I was only able

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to read them today. I only have three

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more if you just want to finish them

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quick. It's just on

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>> Oh, no. Let's move on. I mean,

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00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:31,600
>> well, but there's there's a money

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discrepancy on the last one. So, I it'd

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be quick to ask.

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>> Okay. So,

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>> so well, first the there's cemetery and

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then there's two money ones.

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>> So, so the cemetery one is a big

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ordinance and there are just several

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questions minimum. Could we move that

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one down?

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>> You can make a motion for that. But

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let's finish your one

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>> money discrepancy and then let's move

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on.

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>> So, the money ones are on item G. We uh

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we approved this is the money

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discrepancy. We we approved the 300

273
00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:01,120
North Well, I think on the 10th.

274
00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:04,160
Uh and I think we approved 121,000 for

275
00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:08,160
that. Um they were the lowest bid. Um

276
00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:09,519
and I was asking Jason, I was like,

277
00:10:09,519 --> 00:10:11,120
"This includes everything, right? This

278
00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:13,440
includes like there's no extra work."

279
00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:18,560
And the response I got was, "Yeah, this includes everything." Um and so the

280
00:10:18,560 --> 00:10:21,200
question is with this now changing by

281
00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:23,040
$26,000,

282
00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:24,399
this would go into one of the higher

283
00:10:24,399 --> 00:10:26,240
bids. So I don't know if one of those

284
00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:26,800
other bids

285
00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:29,279
>> No, that's that's not right. So So the

286
00:10:29,279 --> 00:10:32,160
previous bid was components

287
00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:34,720
and installation of the pump,

288
00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:35,360
>> right?

289
00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:38,480
>> Um but this is installation of the

290
00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:40,720
electrical components. The electrical

291
00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,440
components were part of the previous bid

292
00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:45,200
but not the installation of those

293
00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:46,079
components.

294
00:10:46,079 --> 00:10:47,279
>> Oh, just the actual purchase.

295
00:10:47,279 --> 00:10:48,959
>> So this is on top of that.

296
00:10:48,959 --> 00:10:51,040
>> So would that make this bid still lower

297
00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:52,480
than the other two? Do the other two

298
00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:54,079
follow the same structure of their bid

299
00:10:54,079 --> 00:10:55,279
where they didn't include electrical?

300
00:10:55,279 --> 00:10:56,720
>> So the other bids were for the

301
00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:58,160
components,

302
00:10:58,160 --> 00:10:58,880
>> not for this.

303
00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:00,079
>> Not for the electrical.

304
00:11:00,079 --> 00:11:00,880
>> Right.

305
00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:01,920
>> Um, [snorts] okay.

306
00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:03,440
>> Andrew, can I just add something that

307
00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:05,519
might be helpful is because this is kind

308
00:11:05,519 --> 00:11:07,839
of timesensitive with the water. I

309
00:11:07,839 --> 00:11:09,839
talked to Jason about this as well.

310
00:11:09,839 --> 00:11:11,839
>> They went with this company because

311
00:11:11,839 --> 00:11:14,720
they're well known and trusted and they

312
00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:16,800
didn't really have the time the luxury

313
00:11:16,800 --> 00:11:19,120
of gathering lots of bids for the

314
00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:20,720
electrical side of it.

315
00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:22,320
>> Right. Okay. So, because it was that I

316
00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:23,519
just didn't know if when we added that

317
00:11:23,519 --> 00:11:24,959
if it would have changed the bid numbers

318
00:11:24,959 --> 00:11:26,000
on that.

319
00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:26,560
>> Um,

320
00:11:26,560 --> 00:11:28,480
>> yeah, these these electricians aren't an

321
00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:30,079
electrician you'd have come to work on

322
00:11:30,079 --> 00:11:30,800
your home.

323
00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:31,839
>> No, I know. I know.

324
00:11:31,839 --> 00:11:32,480
>> It's different.

325
00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:33,920
>> And they added a bunch of stuff too like

326
00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:36,320
the new uh control system as well. Okay.

327
00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:38,720
That that was the main question.

328
00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:39,839
I don't know if I you guys would

329
00:11:39,839 --> 00:11:41,680
entertain a motion to move cemeteries.

330
00:11:41,680 --> 00:11:43,200
>> Can you make the motion? Can you state

331
00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:44,320
it in the form of a motion?

332
00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:45,839
>> Uh, yeah. I would make a motion that we

333
00:11:45,839 --> 00:11:48,959
move item uh item F down just for some

334
00:11:48,959 --> 00:11:50,880
brief discussion because it is so

335
00:11:50,880 --> 00:11:51,360
complex.

336
00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:53,279
>> Okay. So, let's shorten that motion.

337
00:11:53,279 --> 00:11:56,320
There's a motion on the floor to move

338
00:11:56,320 --> 00:11:59,839
item F, ordinance 2026-10

339
00:11:59,839 --> 00:12:02,480
to um

340
00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:05,680
what would it be? Item six. Is there a

341
00:12:05,680 --> 00:12:09,670
second for that motion?

342
00:12:09,680 --> 00:12:13,279
» Second. It's been moved by council um

343
00:12:13,279 --> 00:12:15,279
Min Young, seconded by Councilwoman

344
00:12:15,279 --> 00:12:16,959
Smean.

345
00:12:16,959 --> 00:12:19,360
Um is there any discussion on the

346
00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:21,279
motion? If not,

347
00:12:21,279 --> 00:12:23,519
>> in this motion, should we also remove

348
00:12:23,519 --> 00:12:27,990
item D?

349
00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:29,600
» Yeah, [clears throat] for a future for a

350
00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:30,000
future.

351
00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:32,000
>> So, are you going to amend your motion?

352
00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:32,560
>> Yeah, of course.

353
00:12:32,560 --> 00:12:34,079
>> Are you okay with that at the second?

354
00:12:34,079 --> 00:12:36,880
Okay. So there's a motion to remove item

355
00:12:36,880 --> 00:12:41,839
D and then to move item F to action

356
00:12:41,839 --> 00:12:44,720
items. So if there's no discussion,

357
00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:46,160
we'll proceed with the roll call vote.

358
00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:48,959
>> Jessica Young, yes.

359
00:12:48,959 --> 00:12:51,279
>> Sarah Blackwell, yes.

360
00:12:51,279 --> 00:12:52,800
>> Chrissy Henman, no.

361
00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:55,760
>> Andrew Young, yes. Brent Rmler, yes.

362
00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:57,360
>> Okay,

363
00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:01,040
let's move on to public comments. I

364
00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:02,560
should I need a

365
00:13:02,560 --> 00:13:04,480
>> I have a motion for on the consent

366
00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:06,720
calendar

367
00:13:06,720 --> 00:13:07,519
the rest of it.

368
00:13:07,519 --> 00:13:08,000
>> Sorry,

369
00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:09,360
>> I threw off. Sorry.

370
00:13:09,360 --> 00:13:12,560
>> I move to approve the consent calendar.

371
00:13:12,560 --> 00:13:14,079
Um

372
00:13:14,079 --> 00:13:19,120
as noted with the removal of item D and

373
00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:20,560
F.

374
00:13:20,560 --> 00:13:21,760
>> Second.

375
00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:23,200
>> Okay. It's been moved by Councilman

376
00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:27,519
Smeuan, seconded by Councilman Young

377
00:13:27,519 --> 00:13:29,760
um to approve the items left on the

378
00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:31,519
consent calendar. [clears throat] Is

379
00:13:31,519 --> 00:13:34,240
there any discussion?

380
00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:35,839
If not, we'll proceed with a roll call

381
00:13:35,839 --> 00:13:38,240
vote. Jessica Sme, yes. Sarah Blackwell,

382
00:13:38,240 --> 00:13:38,560
yes.

383
00:13:38,560 --> 00:13:39,760
>> Chrissy Ammon, yes.

384
00:13:39,760 --> 00:13:43,040
>> Andrew Young, yes. Brent Rumbler, yes.

385
00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:46,320
>> Okay. Consent calendar passes as a

386
00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:48,480
motion. Um, I'm looking at these public

387
00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:50,480
comment cards and usually for public

388
00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:52,079
comment,

389
00:13:52,079 --> 00:13:54,639
um, it's for topics that are not on the

390
00:13:54,639 --> 00:13:56,399
agenda and usually if there's item on

391
00:13:56,399 --> 00:13:59,519
the agenda, um,

392
00:13:59,519 --> 00:14:01,360
there's a little bit of leeway that as

393
00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:03,760
the chair I can allow comments. So, I

394
00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:09,829
will ask I believe

395
00:14:09,839 --> 00:14:11,440
is it Mr. Hobbs?

396
00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:12,800
>> You can't read my handwriting.

397
00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:14,800
>> I cannot read your handwriting. What the

398
00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:17,279
topic is? What is the topic, Mr. Hobbs?

399
00:14:17,279 --> 00:14:18,480
>> I just wanted to come and do some

400
00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:20,880
bragging on the public works department.

401
00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:23,920
>> Okay. Will you come on up? Come on up.

402
00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:29,269
>> I'm an easy one.

403
00:14:29,279 --> 00:14:31,199
» All right. So, to help you, that is Jim

404
00:14:31,199 --> 00:14:32,880
Hobbs.

405
00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:34,240
>> Oh, yeah. I'm sorry.

406
00:14:34,240 --> 00:14:35,519
>> If you could say your name and just the

407
00:14:35,519 --> 00:14:37,279
state the street that you live in. You

408
00:14:37,279 --> 00:14:38,560
don't have to say your house number.

409
00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:40,959
>> I I live on Dry Creek Lane.

410
00:14:40,959 --> 00:14:43,040
>> Thank you.

411
00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:45,600
Anyway, recently we had the public works

412
00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:47,199
department have to come in, replace a

413
00:14:47,199 --> 00:14:49,920
hydrant, do some yardline work, work

414
00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:52,800
with Landon, Jaden. I just wanted to let

415
00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:54,560
you know they they are very

416
00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:56,240
professional.

417
00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:58,639
They they do a great job. They were

418
00:14:58,639 --> 00:15:00,560
efficient. They were communicated. They

419
00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:03,199
cleaned up behind themselves. They did a

420
00:15:03,199 --> 00:15:05,839
fabulous job. We should be proud of them

421
00:15:05,839 --> 00:15:07,120
as a city.

422
00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:09,199
>> Thank you. Thank you. No, we're very

423
00:15:09,199 --> 00:15:13,680
proud of our employees. They work very hard and are multitaskers. I don't

424
00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:16,160
know. But our very same public works

425
00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:18,160
guys who worked on your street are now

426
00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:20,240
helping to preserve the bricks on the

427
00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:22,399
Olsen house the last couple days. It's

428
00:15:22,399 --> 00:15:23,839
not something that they normally do, but

429
00:15:23,839 --> 00:15:25,360
it's a task that they've taken on to

430
00:15:25,360 --> 00:15:28,160
save the city additional dollars. So,

431
00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:30,000
no, very appreciative, but thank you for

432
00:15:30,000 --> 00:15:31,360
coming in and saying something.

433
00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:33,120
Appreciate it.

434
00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:36,000
>> Okay, we've got Mr. burrows

435
00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:39,600
and then um wait no we've got the water

436
00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:41,600
management ordinance. Is that on the

437
00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:43,600
agenda? I'm sorry.

438
00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:46,720
>> And then we've got I think the rest of

439
00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:50,880
them are all items on the agenda. So

440
00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:52,079
>> yes or no.

441
00:15:52,079 --> 00:15:54,720
>> I can't remember. I'm like sorry my mind

442
00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:56,399
is a little I've told you I've been up

443
00:15:56,399 --> 00:16:02,389
since 1:00 am. Um,

444
00:16:02,399 --> 00:16:04,320
» approval of the water management plan.

445
00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:05,920
You know, you're up here. Go ahead and

446
00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:07,519
say your comment. If you can state your

447
00:16:07,519 --> 00:16:08,959
name and your street.

448
00:16:08,959 --> 00:16:11,519
>> Steven Burroughs live on Metoark. First

449
00:16:11,519 --> 00:16:13,519
of all, thank you for your service to us

450
00:16:13,519 --> 00:16:16,800
citizens. Um I take we take as chair of

451
00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:18,320
the water committee we take very

452
00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:20,160
seriously some of the questions that

453
00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:22,079
have been asked and as we've met four

454
00:16:22,079 --> 00:16:25,920
times in the last uh 14 days. We are

455
00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:28,079
discussing those and and we want to make

456
00:16:28,079 --> 00:16:31,279
it an educational process to essentially

457
00:16:31,279 --> 00:16:34,560
get converts for the need to conserve.

458
00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:38,560
Um and uh second of all as as I see

459
00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:40,800
what's going on with in this ordinance

460
00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:42,720
in particular I'm very supportive

461
00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:44,959
personally. We haven't taken a vote by

462
00:16:44,959 --> 00:16:47,600
the committee, but this is in very much

463
00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:50,000
in keeping with what we've discussed and

464
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:54,079
what we had hoped for. So, thank you.

465
00:16:54,079 --> 00:16:56,800
>> Thank you for your time. I appreciate um

466
00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:58,800
your involvement with the committee.

467
00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:01,120
Okay. The rest of them will wait until

468
00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:02,959
um

469
00:17:02,959 --> 00:17:05,039
if we are going to allow public comment

470
00:17:05,039 --> 00:17:07,679
as the item comes up.

471
00:17:07,679 --> 00:17:10,319
Um at least from what I am reading, that

472
00:17:10,319 --> 00:17:12,640
is my take on it. Okay. So, let's move

473
00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:16,720
on to um item four, which is reports and

474
00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:20,549
presentations.

475
00:17:20,559 --> 00:17:23,679
» Okay. Um so, we're at the end of the

476
00:17:23,679 --> 00:17:27,280
third quarter and I can if depending on

477
00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:29,280
what you want me to do, I can let you

478
00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:32,080
review it or I can go over it. You look

479
00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:34,320
at the agenda and tell me I can spend

480
00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:35,840
five minutes on it. Whatever you want me

481
00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:39,110
to do.

482
00:17:39,120 --> 00:17:41,120
You have some highlights.

483
00:17:41,120 --> 00:17:42,880
Yeah, I mean every

484
00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,280
>> or any like changes if you have like

485
00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:47,840
>> Yeah, we're we're in, you know,

486
00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:49,600
everything's good. If you look at the

487
00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:52,400
trend, you can see that you know, some

488
00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:54,867
things have happened like with projects

489
00:17:54,867 --> 00:17:55,919
[cough and clears throat]

490
00:17:55,919 --> 00:18:00,080
um with our uh you know the revenue from

491
00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:03,760
our property tax and different things

492
00:18:03,760 --> 00:18:07,120
is in there. The second graph has the uh

493
00:18:07,120 --> 00:18:09,600
utilities. Uh if you notice the pressure

494
00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:13,200
irrigation drop down that's uh so I'll

495
00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:16,559
just one one last thing the the second

496
00:18:16,559 --> 00:18:20,320
to last point on the graphs is the end

497
00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:23,200
of the last fiscal year

498
00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:25,679
>> the second graph I don't know what

499
00:18:25,679 --> 00:18:27,600
>> yes

500
00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:30,237
>> so this drop in the green line that's

501
00:18:30,237 --> 00:18:30,960
[clears throat] the pressurized

502
00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:34,000
irrigation fund balance this uh the

503
00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:35,919
point up there at the top the second to

504
00:18:35,919 --> 00:18:38,960
last uh data point. That's the end of

505
00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:42,000
the last fiscal year and the the last

506
00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:44,320
one is the end of the third quarter for

507
00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:47,120
this fiscal year. But the reason for the

508
00:18:47,120 --> 00:18:48,960
drop there is our project we did on

509
00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,840
Canyon Crest Road. Uh and then there was

510
00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:53,840
some funds that were used to help

511
00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:56,438
purchase Carlton shop

512
00:18:56,438 --> 00:18:57,600
[clears throat] and that would be the

513
00:18:57,600 --> 00:19:00,160
reason for the drop in these other funds

514
00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:02,640
as well. You can see here storm drains a

515
00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:05,520
little bit steeper because of uh couple

516
00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:07,360
of storm drain projects we did last

517
00:19:07,360 --> 00:19:09,280
fall.

518
00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:10,559
Um the next

519
00:19:10,559 --> 00:19:12,640
>> the Carlton the Carlton shop came from

520
00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:13,679
which one of those?

521
00:19:13,679 --> 00:19:15,679
>> It came from various like five different

522
00:19:15,679 --> 00:19:16,080
places.

523
00:19:16,080 --> 00:19:17,520
>> Oh, so you grabbed it from multiple

524
00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:19,440
because it holds equipment to support

525
00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:20,559
all those. Okay.

526
00:19:20,559 --> 00:19:23,679
>> That way no one funds getting hit too

527
00:19:23,679 --> 00:19:25,679
hard and it just kind of spreads

528
00:19:25,679 --> 00:19:30,240
everything out. So, um

529
00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:32,480
the the next graph, [clears throat]

530
00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:35,280
Heidi, um the one that keeps running

531
00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:39,600
uphill is the uh well, that's actually

532
00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:42,480
our water impact fees. And as we get

533
00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:44,640
into some of these projects that are

534
00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:46,799
planned and upcoming, you'll see a a

535
00:19:46,799 --> 00:19:51,760
drop in those. Um street impact fees had

536
00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:53,360
a pretty significant drop there, and

537
00:19:53,360 --> 00:19:54,880
that was because of the purchase of

538
00:19:54,880 --> 00:19:56,480
property.

539
00:19:56,480 --> 00:20:01,520
um for future street improvements. Um

540
00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:03,520
the last sheet actually has a few

541
00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:05,840
highlights kind of actually I'll go over

542
00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:10,320
the sales tax real quick. Um right now

543
00:20:10,320 --> 00:20:14,240
we're just under 5% um year

544
00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:17,520
year-over-year on our sales tax revenue.

545
00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:19,679
So it's it keeps going up and down.

546
00:20:19,679 --> 00:20:22,000
It'll go negative and then it goes over

547
00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:26,240
6% positive. But it's a good lesson in

548
00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:28,240
you need more than a month or two for a

549
00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:30,400
trend.

550
00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:33,520
Uh so that's actually looking good and

551
00:20:33,520 --> 00:20:35,840
positive. And then some upcoming

552
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:39,520
expenses. Uh we do have our fire station

553
00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:42,159
project. Uh

554
00:20:42,159 --> 00:20:43,919
I can update you more on this in

555
00:20:43,919 --> 00:20:46,240
communication, but construction drawings

556
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:48,400
are due this week and so things are

557
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:49,919
going to start moving and you'll see

558
00:20:49,919 --> 00:20:52,640
activity over here. I'm gonna say

559
00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:55,200
probably probably towards the end of

560
00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:58,240
May, mid to end of May.

561
00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:00,080
U we have some other capital projects

562
00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:02,640
that will finish up um through this

563
00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:04,799
budget year [clears throat] and then

564
00:21:04,799 --> 00:21:06,400
some of the well projects that we've

565
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:09,120
already seen earlier in the agenda that

566
00:21:09,120 --> 00:21:12,400
we're we're working on. So,

567
00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:16,159
uh still a lot of things going on. Um,

568
00:21:16,159 --> 00:21:19,039
now that the water's coming on, we'll uh

569
00:21:19,039 --> 00:21:20,559
be able to finish some of the park

570
00:21:20,559 --> 00:21:22,559
projects up that needed water to be able

571
00:21:22,559 --> 00:21:24,240
to repair sprinklers and different

572
00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:28,000
things. But, um, I think very positive

573
00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:31,039
finance report in my mind. And we've

574
00:21:31,039 --> 00:21:32,960
been working with Science Bake on some

575
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:34,640
things, some potential bonding and

576
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:36,960
things, and it's it's kind of put us in

577
00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:40,799
a good place to be able to to bond for

578
00:21:40,799 --> 00:21:44,559
some larger projects. So

579
00:21:44,559 --> 00:21:48,870
any questions?

580
00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:52,080
» Just two minis. Uh

581
00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:56,240
the um the Canyon Crest project, am I

582
00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:58,559
right in understanding that's one of

583
00:21:58,559 --> 00:22:00,880
like 10 segments of that project and we

584
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,440
have to continue it on going forward.

585
00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:04,000
>> Okay.

586
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:07,600
>> Yeah. Um and then um how do we're coming

587
00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:12,000
up on the 2027 or I'm sorry 2026 2027

588
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:14,960
budget year. How how are we looking like

589
00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:16,000
and I know we're going to get this when

590
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:18,240
we get to the budget projects. How are

591
00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:21,919
we looking excesswise so that we can

592
00:22:21,919 --> 00:22:23,679
pursue some of these other budget

593
00:22:23,679 --> 00:22:26,480
projects we have? Are we typical? Do we

594
00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:28,480
have lots of extra?

595
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,159
>> I don't I wouldn't say we have lots of

596
00:22:30,159 --> 00:22:32,000
extra. you know, our capital improvement

597
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:33,440
fund, if you look at it, there's about

598
00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:36,000
10 million in there, but um there's

599
00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:38,480
three of that. That's well, we've we've

600
00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:40,240
spent some money on

601
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:41,120
>> fire

602
00:22:41,120 --> 00:22:43,440
>> uh the fire station design and things,

603
00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:46,480
but um the construction portion, which

604
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:48,000
will really start to ramp up the

605
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:50,480
expenses, um hasn't started yet.

606
00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:50,880
>> Okay.

607
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:55,440
>> Um but there's uh money in there that's

608
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:57,600
reserved for that and some different

609
00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:00,799
things. So it it's not as fleshy as it

610
00:23:00,799 --> 00:23:04,799
might look on the surface and we'll get into more of that

611
00:23:04,799 --> 00:23:05,520
>> in the budget part

612
00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:06,960
>> as we get into the budget. Okay. Yes.

613
00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:08,159
>> All right. Well, yeah. Just knowing

614
00:23:08,159 --> 00:23:09,919
those parameters and walls will help

615
00:23:09,919 --> 00:23:11,280
with the budget items. [clears throat]

616
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:12,480
>> Thanks. Thanks for doing all that.

617
00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:12,799
>> Yeah.

618
00:23:12,799 --> 00:23:16,240
>> Um just one question. Can you again just

619
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:18,000
um tell us what projects we've already

620
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,159
bonded for and which ones you anticipate

621
00:23:20,159 --> 00:23:22,400
us needing to bond for? Just

622
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:23,120
>> bonded.

623
00:23:23,120 --> 00:23:24,640
>> I thought we were paying off a bond.

624
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:26,559
>> We still have one mini one. We only have

625
00:23:26,559 --> 00:23:28,400
one bond right now. It's pressure

626
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:30,320
irrigation. I think we've got about five

627
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:31,200
years left on that

628
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:33,440
>> from what 199 Oh, no. 2000 something,

629
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:34,000
right?

630
00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:35,440
>> Yeah, it was uh

631
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:36,880
>> is it 797?

632
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:39,039
>> See, 2020, I believe.

633
00:23:39,039 --> 00:23:41,120
>> Oh, 2020. So, we had we had the early

634
00:23:41,120 --> 00:23:43,039
one way long ago and then this was the

635
00:23:43,039 --> 00:23:43,919
second one, right?

636
00:23:43,919 --> 00:23:46,320
>> Yeah, we refinanced the original

637
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:48,240
pressure irrigation bond and added a

638
00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:49,679
million dollars to it

639
00:23:49,679 --> 00:23:53,039
>> to help bring CUP water into the city

640
00:23:53,039 --> 00:23:55,200
>> like the Healey Well and stuff.

641
00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:57,600
Yeah, it was the filter building mainly

642
00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,919
and then our portion of the expenses to

643
00:23:59,919 --> 00:24:00,640
pipe.

644
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:01,919
>> Sorry, I didn't mean to.

645
00:24:01,919 --> 00:24:03,120
>> Oh, no, that's okay.

646
00:24:03,120 --> 00:24:04,559
>> So, we're just we're still paying off

647
00:24:04,559 --> 00:24:05,679
that one and [snorts] then the fire

648
00:24:05,679 --> 00:24:08,159
station and potentially some water.

649
00:24:08,159 --> 00:24:09,200
>> Yes, those are the ones that we're

650
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:10,080
looking at. Yes,

651
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:11,520
>> but the fire station and the water

652
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:13,120
haven't been started yet.

653
00:24:13,120 --> 00:24:13,840
>> No.

654
00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:14,640
>> Okay.

655
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:16,640
>> Well, started.

656
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:17,120
>> I mean,

657
00:24:17,120 --> 00:24:19,440
>> they haven't been voted on or approved.

658
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:21,200
>> Yeah, the bonding has not happened.

659
00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:23,360
>> The bonding has not started. Yeah,

660
00:24:23,360 --> 00:24:26,480
>> the planning phases and all of that is

661
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:27,919
>> well, we would love to be in the loop on

662
00:24:27,919 --> 00:24:29,919
that as much as possible

663
00:24:29,919 --> 00:24:30,559
>> for the bond.

664
00:24:30,559 --> 00:24:31,919
>> Yep. And we'll talk a little bit more

665
00:24:31,919 --> 00:24:32,640
about that

666
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:33,760
>> we can

667
00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:36,400
>> in a future meeting.

668
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:37,440
>> Okay.

669
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:38,159
>> Even tonight

670
00:24:38,159 --> 00:24:39,600
>> and the fire department is sales tax

671
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:41,440
bond. The pressurized irrigation will be

672
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:43,919
based on the rate collection.

673
00:24:43,919 --> 00:24:46,000
>> That's that's our thought right now.

674
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:46,960
That's our

675
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:49,360
>> recommendation right now. Yeah.

676
00:24:49,360 --> 00:24:51,600
Um this might be what [clears throat]

677
00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:55,760
you talk about later but is um with our

678
00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:58,880
we have to do our budget by June

679
00:24:58,880 --> 00:24:59,679
something.

680
00:24:59,679 --> 00:25:01,440
>> So our tenative budget will be on the

681
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,360
agenda for the first meeting in May.

682
00:25:03,360 --> 00:25:05,360
That's okay. Say code says we have to

683
00:25:05,360 --> 00:25:08,400
adopt it by by that meeting and then

684
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:09,679
>> we have to adopt

685
00:25:09,679 --> 00:25:10,799
>> adopt the tenative budget

686
00:25:10,799 --> 00:25:12,080
>> tenative budget and then the final

687
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,799
>> by the May first meeting in May. the the

688
00:25:14,799 --> 00:25:16,799
final budget's just by the end of June

689
00:25:16,799 --> 00:25:19,440
and we typically do it the last meeting,

690
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,679
the second meeting in June.

691
00:25:21,679 --> 00:25:23,440
>> That's what would include all our our

692
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:24,400
budget proposals.

693
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:27,360
>> And so um in order to to finance such

694
00:25:27,360 --> 00:25:30,400
large projects, when do we have to uh

695
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:32,080
sort of juggle

696
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:35,120
>> the bonding process? Like is that part

697
00:25:35,120 --> 00:25:37,840
of the current budget that we have to

698
00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:39,919
the future budget that we're we're going

699
00:25:39,919 --> 00:25:41,600
to be talking about or is it a separate

700
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:42,640
process? How does that

701
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,279
>> it will be part of of

702
00:25:45,279 --> 00:25:47,279
this budget discussion because we

703
00:25:47,279 --> 00:25:49,520
anticipate some of those bonds um being

704
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:52,080
done in that time frame. But we're

705
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:53,840
actually working right now at science

706
00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:57,360
public finance on a calendar and kind of

707
00:25:57,360 --> 00:25:59,200
the first steps here at the council

708
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:01,919
meeting um for like a parameters

709
00:26:01,919 --> 00:26:04,320
resolution so that we can start that

710
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:05,600
process.

711
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,100
>> So will we um how do I want to say this?

712
00:26:08,100 --> 00:26:09,200
[clears throat] Are they dependent on

713
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:10,960
each other or working independent of

714
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:12,080
each other?

715
00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:13,039
>> Uh well,

716
00:26:13,039 --> 00:26:15,120
>> the budget and the bonding.

717
00:26:15,120 --> 00:26:16,640
>> They're they're working together.

718
00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:18,080
>> Okay. So, they're interdependent.

719
00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:20,159
>> Yeah. Because we need to plan for

720
00:26:20,159 --> 00:26:21,600
expenses.

721
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:23,039
>> So, they're they're working.

722
00:26:23,039 --> 00:26:23,679
>> Okay.

723
00:26:23,679 --> 00:26:24,559
>> Side by side.

724
00:26:24,559 --> 00:26:26,080
>> Okay. Well, we have a lot to do, don't

725
00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:27,279
we? Shane, do you have a

726
00:26:27,279 --> 00:26:28,320
>> This is going to be a big year.

727
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:29,360
>> Yeah. Because there's

728
00:26:29,360 --> 00:26:30,799
>> competitive budget. Do you have plans to

729
00:26:30,799 --> 00:26:32,720
have individual meetings with Yes.

730
00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:34,480
>> with council members? And do you have an

731
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:36,480
idea when that will be? I'll be shooting

732
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:41,760
that calendar out this week. Yeah. So,

733
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:43,039
>> okay.

734
00:26:43,039 --> 00:26:45,039
Any other questions regarding the

735
00:26:45,039 --> 00:26:47,120
third quarter financial report?

736
00:26:47,120 --> 00:26:48,240
>> Thank you for doing that with all your

737
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:49,679
family stuff that was going on. That

738
00:26:49,679 --> 00:26:50,799
that's appreciative.

739
00:26:50,799 --> 00:26:53,760
>> Okay. Let's move on to item five, which

740
00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:58,159
is discussion items. Um,

741
00:26:58,159 --> 00:27:00,720
we have a proposal to adopt an ordinance

742
00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:03,200
regulating the use of golf carts on city

743
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:05,039
roadways.

744
00:27:05,039 --> 00:27:06,080
Chrissy, do you want to make that

745
00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:07,120
motion?

746
00:27:07,120 --> 00:27:12,559
>> I was going um I was looking at the full agenda and

747
00:27:12,559 --> 00:27:14,720
thinking that um this maybe isn't as

748
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:17,120
time-sensitive as the other items. And

749
00:27:17,120 --> 00:27:19,440
so I'd like to make a motion and

750
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:21,600
hopefully there'll be a second to

751
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:24,960
postpone this uh till the 28th, but not

752
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:28,559
longer than that of April. Does that

753
00:27:28,559 --> 00:27:30,559
>> is that as formal as it can be?

754
00:27:30,559 --> 00:27:32,559
>> Is that your motion? My motion is to

755
00:27:32,559 --> 00:27:35,039
table this until April 28th.

756
00:27:35,039 --> 00:27:37,440
>> We have a motion to table. Is there a

757
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:40,240
second?

758
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:41,520
>> I can second it.

759
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:42,559
>> Okay. [clears throat] It's been moved by

760
00:27:42,559 --> 00:27:44,559
Councilwoman Hanaman, seconded by

761
00:27:44,559 --> 00:27:49,120
Councilman Young to table item A, which

762
00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:52,000
is a proposal to um the discussion item

763
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,720
to for the ordinance regulating the use

764
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:56,240
of golf carts in the cities and

765
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:58,320
roadways. Um let's proceed with the roll

766
00:27:58,320 --> 00:27:59,919
call vote.

767
00:27:59,919 --> 00:28:01,600
>> Jessica Smeon. Yes. Can I ask a question

768
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:01,840
first?

769
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:02,640
>> Yeah. A brief discussion.

770
00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:04,080
>> No, actually there's no discussion on

771
00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:05,600
tableabling. I just went over our

772
00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:07,120
>> I just want to know are we do we

773
00:28:07,120 --> 00:28:10,080
anticipate a better a less busy agenda?

774
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:11,600
>> I can't ask. Sorry.

775
00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:13,279
>> I don't I haven't even looked at it.

776
00:28:13,279 --> 00:28:15,200
>> Depends on how many things you guys.

777
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:16,480
>> All right. Well, can you put it at the

778
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:17,279
top of the list?

779
00:28:17,279 --> 00:28:18,000
>> All right.

780
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,399
>> So, right now the motion is at hand. Is

781
00:28:20,399 --> 00:28:22,320
there Let's proceed with the roll call

782
00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:23,520
vote.

783
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:25,360
>> Jessica Simone, yes.

784
00:28:25,360 --> 00:28:26,880
>> Sarah Blackwell, yes.

785
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:28,080
>> Chrissy Anaman, yes.

786
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:30,880
>> Andrew Young, yes. Brent Rler. Yes.

787
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:32,240
>> Okay. Um,

788
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:35,830
>> is there post?

789
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:37,600
» No.

790
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:39,919
>> Just as a post discussion on that, just

791
00:28:39,919 --> 00:28:41,440
to give some background for residents

792
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:44,720
and anyone concerned, we had a group of

793
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:46,559
residents wanting to push this forward.

794
00:28:46,559 --> 00:28:48,159
We saw that the schedule was so busy

795
00:28:48,159 --> 00:28:50,080
today. Chrissy asked and we asked the

796
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:51,360
residents and they said that would be

797
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:53,279
okay and they wanted all of you to be

798
00:28:53,279 --> 00:28:54,559
comfortable with the time. So, they're

799
00:28:54,559 --> 00:28:56,399
supportive and hopeful that this can be

800
00:28:56,399 --> 00:28:58,559
at the next meeting. I wish you would

801
00:28:58,559 --> 00:28:59,760
have told me so I wouldn't have spent so

802
00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:01,919
much time researching. I'm sorry.

803
00:29:01,919 --> 00:29:04,240
>> Okay, let's move on to item B. Review of

804
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:06,320
Main Street and Gateway Corridor will be

805
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:08,159
useful next week. I know.

806
00:29:08,159 --> 00:29:10,799
>> So, um

807
00:29:10,799 --> 00:29:13,760
Shane, are we are you taking that or

808
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:14,000
>> um

809
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:15,039
>> or is Ryan on?

810
00:29:15,039 --> 00:29:17,200
>> Ryan Ryan, are you on?

811
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:18,960
>> No, he's not yet. He said he's going to

812
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:21,039
tell us as soon as he's on.

813
00:29:21,039 --> 00:29:23,120
>> So, he he has their planning commission

814
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:25,440
on or on this Tuesday night.

815
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:25,919
>> Okay, that's

816
00:29:25,919 --> 00:29:27,440
>> I think it starts at 5 though. He

817
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:29,760
anticipated it not taking too long.

818
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:30,320
>> Okay.

819
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:31,679
>> So maybe we can just switch the

820
00:29:31,679 --> 00:29:34,880
>> agenda to item C then budget. So let's

821
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:37,600
go move to FY2027

822
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:42,070
budget projects.

823
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:44,000
» Mayor introduce

824
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:45,440
>> Oh, I'm sorry you guys. While we're

825
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:48,240
waiting, um wanted to introduce our new

826
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,520
assistant as city administrator, Kaden.

827
00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:54,799
Um I you know when I first came back I

828
00:29:54,799 --> 00:29:56,799
asked how he was doing and it sounds

829
00:29:56,799 --> 00:29:59,840
like he is really just diving in and um

830
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:03,360
taking ownership of his duties and is

831
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:05,360
really been self-sufficient and I think

832
00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:07,200
he's going to be awesome. So take please

833
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:09,520
take the time to introduce yourself um

834
00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:12,399
and get to know him and as he'll be

835
00:30:12,399 --> 00:30:13,919
working very closely with council moving

836
00:30:13,919 --> 00:30:15,039
forward.

837
00:30:15,039 --> 00:30:16,399
>> Yep. We're excited to have you.

838
00:30:16,399 --> 00:30:21,110
>> Thank you. Thank you every

839
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:24,320
Okay. So, uh, leading up to, you know,

840
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:25,840
Chrissy mentioned the tenative budget.

841
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:28,720
Leading up to this, um,

842
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:30,799
you guys haven't haven't seen kind of

843
00:30:30,799 --> 00:30:33,840
the project list, uh, with, I mean, we

844
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:36,000
had a retreat and projects that were

845
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,159
requested to be potentially part of this

846
00:30:38,159 --> 00:30:40,559
budget, but you had not seen that list

847
00:30:40,559 --> 00:30:42,640
with our other kind of maintenance

848
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:44,399
activities and different projects like

849
00:30:44,399 --> 00:30:46,320
that that we typically have within our

850
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:49,919
budget. So, we put these in here. This

851
00:30:49,919 --> 00:30:52,320
isn't by any means finalized. There's

852
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:55,120
some estimates in here. There's one one

853
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:57,840
that's um

854
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,320
uh the one roundabout in here. I put the

855
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:04,080
wrong cost in, but it will likely be

856
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:06,480
over two budget years. Um so, it'll

857
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:08,559
probably end up reducing from this

858
00:31:08,559 --> 00:31:10,159
number.

859
00:31:10,159 --> 00:31:12,080
But I [clears throat] wanted to make

860
00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:13,679
sure

861
00:31:13,679 --> 00:31:16,240
uh so just to back up, the projects in

862
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:17,760
yellow are the projects that were

863
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:20,559
discussed in the retreat. Um the other

864
00:31:20,559 --> 00:31:24,399
projects are are things that we've had

865
00:31:24,399 --> 00:31:26,240
in our budget pretty much year after

866
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:28,960
year. Some are general in nature. Um for

867
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,760
example, crosswalk improvements or

868
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:34,640
miscellaneous trail improvements,

869
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:37,840
tree uh removal and trimming. There's

870
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:39,840
not like a target spot usually at this

871
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:41,440
point in the budget, but they're funds

872
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:43,679
that, you know, we usually

873
00:31:43,679 --> 00:31:46,640
uh update a crosswalk or have some kind

874
00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:48,559
of trail improvements that come up as,

875
00:31:48,559 --> 00:31:50,320
you know, some expenses as part of trail

876
00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:52,960
day or something like that.

877
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:57,519
Um so those projects are there. Uh the

878
00:31:57,519 --> 00:32:00,559
uh fire station project

879
00:32:00,559 --> 00:32:04,399
is here. Um

880
00:32:04,399 --> 00:32:09,190
so on this

881
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:11,120
In the current budget year, we have we

882
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:14,399
budgeted $3 million to go towards this

883
00:32:14,399 --> 00:32:15,919
project.

884
00:32:15,919 --> 00:32:18,080
Um,

885
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:20,640
we've expanded

886
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:22,880
it's like 400 I I estimate we'll be

887
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,200
around 500,000 by the end of the budget

888
00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:27,760
year. So that leaves two and a half

889
00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:30,240
million that was budgeted here that

890
00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:33,919
would roll over into the next year.

891
00:32:33,919 --> 00:32:37,519
Um and then uh what I'm suggesting is

892
00:32:37,519 --> 00:32:40,080
that we budget 500,000

893
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:44,159
from the general fund um for this

894
00:32:44,159 --> 00:32:47,679
project and then there will be some

895
00:32:47,679 --> 00:32:49,120
depending on the bids and everything

896
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:52,000
that uh we get. We'll have that number

897
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:53,600
later

898
00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:55,600
um that we budget some in the next

899
00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:58,240
budget year and then we'll bond for that

900
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:02,000
difference of $2 million.

901
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:05,600
So, we're hopeful uh the prices will

902
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,159
come in really well and that some of the

903
00:33:08,159 --> 00:33:09,919
contingencies that are already built

904
00:33:09,919 --> 00:33:13,919
into the project won't be needed. Um but

905
00:33:13,919 --> 00:33:15,760
we don't we're not comfortable enough at

906
00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:18,880
this point to pull those back.

907
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:20,960
Um we're getting close on the design

908
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,640
contingency because construction

909
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:24,399
drawings are almost done and I think

910
00:33:24,399 --> 00:33:27,600
there will be money left in there. Um,

911
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,640
so it's possible that this 500,000

912
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:32,480
number could be reduced and kind of

913
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:34,159
split

914
00:33:34,159 --> 00:33:38,720
uh the difference between the two the money we've already budgeted the 2

915
00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:42,399
million bond and the difference to make

916
00:33:42,399 --> 00:33:46,960
up that roughly I think it was 5 eight

917
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,320
>> 8 million right around there. Um, so

918
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:52,240
that's that that's what we're suggesting

919
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:54,399
at this point for [clears throat] that

920
00:33:54,399 --> 00:33:55,200
project

921
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:57,679
>> Shane on that project. Uh so if we do if

922
00:33:57,679 --> 00:34:00,000
we do we've got three

923
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:02,799
already budgeted for it from 2025 2026

924
00:34:02,799 --> 00:34:05,120
2.5 is going to be used

925
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:06,960
>> and then you're ask you're saying for

926
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:10,079
this coming 2026 2027 another 500 that

927
00:34:10,079 --> 00:34:12,560
puts us at 3.5

928
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:14,240
>> are you just assuming that are you

929
00:34:14,240 --> 00:34:16,879
thinking that 2027 2028 will be the the

930
00:34:16,879 --> 00:34:20,560
remaining of the 5.8 eight.

931
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:21,280
>> Yeah. So,

932
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:23,280
>> or or is the rest all coming from bond?

933
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:23,760
Is that

934
00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:25,440
>> So, it's kind of confusing. We budgeted

935
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:28,639
3 million in FY26.

936
00:34:28,639 --> 00:34:31,359
>> By the end of June, I estimate we'll

937
00:34:31,359 --> 00:34:33,839
have expanded about 500,000 of that in

938
00:34:33,839 --> 00:34:34,480
design,

939
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:35,280
>> right?

940
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:37,280
>> So, that will leave 2.5 million that

941
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:41,679
we'll just earmark for this project.

942
00:34:41,679 --> 00:34:44,240
>> The additional 500,000 is proposed to

943
00:34:44,240 --> 00:34:45,679
come from the general fund

944
00:34:45,679 --> 00:34:48,000
>> for 226. That would make the 3 million

945
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:49,839
in this total column.

946
00:34:49,839 --> 00:34:50,480
>> Okay.

947
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:52,560
>> And then we'd have $2 million bond. That

948
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:55,440
puts us, I think, at 5.5. And then

949
00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:58,720
500,000 from FY28

950
00:34:58,720 --> 00:35:00,320
is what I would suggest.

951
00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:00,960
>> The 20.

952
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:01,280
>> Okay.

953
00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:03,040
>> And hopefully that number will come down

954
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:04,880
with these contingencies and stuff that

955
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:06,480
we have. And hopefully we get good

956
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:08,640
pricing, which our our contractor says

957
00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:10,320
they're really seeing a competitive

958
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:15,520
market right now with their bids. So

959
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:17,200
>> and we'll have that number before we

960
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:20,000
adopt our final budget. We'll have our

961
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:23,119
guaranteed maximum price and so we can

962
00:35:23,119 --> 00:35:26,720
make some adjustments once we get that

963
00:35:26,720 --> 00:35:29,599
um and make a plan for these next two

964
00:35:29,599 --> 00:35:31,440
budget years.

965
00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:31,920
>> Thanks.

966
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:33,280
>> So okay,

967
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:35,280
>> I did skip over one the very first one

968
00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:42,079
on here uh street projects. We've been budgeting uh a million

969
00:35:42,079 --> 00:35:45,200
dollars. Um and our I think our streets

970
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:48,400
are really coming along and we're

971
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:50,800
getting I think closer than we've ever

972
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:54,000
been to being caught up

973
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:58,160
um and being more of a silo maintenance

974
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:00,640
um and spending less on overlays, but we

975
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:04,560
still have some work to do. Um

976
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:06,160
but

977
00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:09,599
uh most of that money is coming from our

978
00:36:09,599 --> 00:36:12,079
class E road funds

979
00:36:12,079 --> 00:36:15,040
and in that fund

980
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:17,520
sheet here

981
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:20,640
right now we have

982
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:22,880
uh like 986,000

983
00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:25,040
in there. We try to stay about a year

984
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:30,160
ahead so we have a year's worth of class

985
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:34,079
C road money. um basically in the bank

986
00:36:34,079 --> 00:36:36,240
in case we have a bad winter and roads

987
00:36:36,240 --> 00:36:38,000
blow up, which we have had happen

988
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:41,440
before. Um

989
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:42,960
so

990
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:45,359
we're we're essentially spending what we

991
00:36:45,359 --> 00:36:48,800
get for that year plus a little bit from

992
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:51,359
the general fund. I've plugged in

993
00:36:51,359 --> 00:36:53,680
162,000.

994
00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:55,839
So the adjustments of valves and

995
00:36:55,839 --> 00:36:57,680
manholes and those things, we take a

996
00:36:57,680 --> 00:36:59,440
little bit of money from our utility

997
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,400
funds. um since those are related to

998
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:04,640
those utilities and let them help pay

999
00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:06,560
for those adjustments.

1000
00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:08,880
>> Is there any update on the three falls

1001
00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:11,760
landslide mitigation?

1002
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:14,320
>> Yeah. Um

1003
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:15,760
actually that's the next project we're

1004
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:17,280
going to talk about anyway. So

1005
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:18,560
>> perfect.

1006
00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:20,640
>> It's just one that frankly we haven't

1007
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:22,640
been able to get to and we've had dry

1008
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:24,240
years. It hasn't been too much of a

1009
00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:26,400
concern. It's the wet years where they

1010
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:31,200
typically move. But um we it is one that

1011
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:35,599
we need to get something done on. So

1012
00:37:35,599 --> 00:37:37,599
>> Shane, do you want the sidewalk budget

1013
00:37:37,599 --> 00:37:40,079
that we propose to be part of that or do

1014
00:37:40,079 --> 00:37:43,119
you want them to stay separate?

1015
00:37:43,119 --> 00:37:44,960
>> Part of the first item here.

1016
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:46,880
>> Yeah. Part of the street maintenance.

1017
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:50,560
>> Um it depends on the level,

1018
00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:53,200
>> you know, that you want to fund that at.

1019
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:59,270
I I just picked a number uh that's down

1020
00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:00,480
Okay.

1021
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:02,640
>> The intention of the budget item was

1022
00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:05,119
like when personal residents would ask

1023
00:38:05,119 --> 00:38:06,240
for

1024
00:38:06,240 --> 00:38:06,960
>> Yeah.

1025
00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:10,320
>> Uh like specific areas to have sidewalk.

1026
00:38:10,320 --> 00:38:11,680
Does that fit into that or should it be

1027
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:12,400
combined or

1028
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:14,079
>> So that's the fourth item down in

1029
00:38:14,079 --> 00:38:14,960
yellow,

1030
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:15,760
>> right? Yeah.

1031
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:17,680
>> And I just I plugged a number in there.

1032
00:38:17,680 --> 00:38:19,359
>> No, I like Hey, I'll take I'll take

1033
00:38:19,359 --> 00:38:20,560
anything.

1034
00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:21,119
>> So,

1035
00:38:21,119 --> 00:38:21,520
>> yeah.

1036
00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:22,800
>> Okay. Well, if you need them separate,

1037
00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:23,839
we can have them separate. If you want

1038
00:38:23,839 --> 00:38:25,119
them together, just let me know. I can

1039
00:38:25,119 --> 00:38:26,640
throw it into that. Could you just

1040
00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:28,480
briefly explain the three falls

1041
00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:30,079
mitigation project? I looked in our

1042
00:38:30,079 --> 00:38:32,160
binder from our budget retreat. I didn't

1043
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:33,119
see it in there. So,

1044
00:38:33,119 --> 00:38:36,880
>> yeah, it it wasn't in there. So,

1045
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:38,640
what year was it? We had the really wet

1046
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:39,920
winter.

1047
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:41,760
>> It was 24 cuz I think that was my first

1048
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:42,079
year.

1049
00:38:42,079 --> 00:38:43,040
>> 24 city.

1050
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:46,240
>> Okay. So, in 2024,

1051
00:38:46,240 --> 00:38:48,079
um there's an area up in Three Falls.

1052
00:38:48,079 --> 00:38:51,920
that's in public open space that uh got

1053
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:54,960
very wet and we had a some land move up

1054
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:56,720
there.

1055
00:38:56,720 --> 00:39:00,400
And so uh it all happened within like a

1056
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:02,560
week because I know because I was up

1057
00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:04,880
there looking at a project and

1058
00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:06,960
everything was fine. And a week later we

1059
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:09,040
get a call from somebody that was up

1060
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,240
there walking. It's either

1061
00:39:12,240 --> 00:39:15,680
late winter, early spring and like the

1062
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:18,079
road would buckle. I'm like, I was just

1063
00:39:18,079 --> 00:39:19,760
up there like a week ago. There's no way

1064
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:21,359
this happened. We drive up there and

1065
00:39:21,359 --> 00:39:22,880
sure enough, one side of the road's down

1066
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:24,960
here and the other's like this. So, the

1067
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:28,800
land had slipped down and bulged the toe

1068
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:31,040
of the landslide

1069
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:36,720
had had bulged uh the road. Um,

1070
00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:40,240
and so we we got a consultant to kind of

1071
00:39:40,240 --> 00:39:43,920
review things, uh, look at it. Um, we

1072
00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:46,320
put some markers in the ground for over

1073
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:50,640
a year. Uh, we surveyed and there was no

1074
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:53,119
more movement. It had just kind of

1075
00:39:53,119 --> 00:39:56,640
stopped. Um, but there is a house below

1076
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:59,760
it and it's something that we need to

1077
00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:04,240
look at mitigation measures. Um, and it

1078
00:40:04,240 --> 00:40:07,280
there's different ways to do it. Um, it

1079
00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:11,440
will be expensive. Um, we don't have

1080
00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:14,240
expertise in it. we've got to get a

1081
00:40:14,240 --> 00:40:16,160
consultant on board to make some

1082
00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:17,680
recommendations and look at different

1083
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:19,280
options and see what's most cost

1084
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,839
effective to address it.

1085
00:40:21,839 --> 00:40:24,880
So, and during all that, we didn't have

1086
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:29,440
an engineer besides me for like 15

1087
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:32,400
months. And it's it's just a time to get

1088
00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:35,599
a project put together um get a bid out,

1089
00:40:35,599 --> 00:40:37,599
get somebody on board to get some

1090
00:40:37,599 --> 00:40:39,280
drawings done and then we can bid it out

1091
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:43,520
for the construction side of it. So, um,

1092
00:40:43,520 --> 00:40:46,079
but we'll we'll get that we'll get that

1093
00:40:46,079 --> 00:40:47,763
moving.

1094
00:40:47,763 --> 00:40:49,440
[clears throat]

1095
00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:50,000
>> Um,

1096
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:51,119
>> Sarah, did that make sense?

1097
00:40:51,119 --> 00:40:53,440
>> Last year, did we have a a placeholder

1098
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:54,960
in the budget for that with certain

1099
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:56,480
amount, but we didn't know the cost?

1100
00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:59,599
>> We did. And it's it's from it's from the

1101
00:40:59,599 --> 00:41:01,040
capital improvement fund. It was our

1102
00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:04,960
estimate of 500,000. So this is

1103
00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:08,000
I think one of the only

1104
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:09,520
rollover

1105
00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:12,653
projects that hasn't been started.

1106
00:41:12,653 --> 00:41:14,560
[clears throat] Um so the money is still

1107
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:18,319
in the capital improvement fund. Um but

1108
00:41:18,319 --> 00:41:19,920
it's it's one of those things that we

1109
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:21,839
need to consider as we talk about you

1110
00:41:21,839 --> 00:41:25,359
know what's left for other projects. So

1111
00:41:25,359 --> 00:41:27,280
and we'll get into that in more detail

1112
00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:29,760
in the next next phase of the budget.

1113
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:32,240
And Shane is for the MAG project on

1114
00:41:32,240 --> 00:41:35,200
Canyon Crest the 5.4 million is that

1115
00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:37,440
just our portion or the cost of the

1116
00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:39,760
entire project for Island and Alpine?

1117
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:41,760
>> That's actually the cost of the entire

1118
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:43,359
project. So that's not going to be the

1119
00:41:43,359 --> 00:41:44,720
cost to us,

1120
00:41:44,720 --> 00:41:45,200
>> right?

1121
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:47,920
>> Um

1122
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:49,920
uh yeah, it was kind of a weird one

1123
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:51,520
where it's split between us and

1124
00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:53,599
Highland. It's it's kind of a weird one

1125
00:41:53,599 --> 00:41:56,160
to address in the budget, but that's why

1126
00:41:56,160 --> 00:42:00,000
we put most of that in the grant column

1127
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,433
in blue.

1128
00:42:02,433 --> 00:42:04,800
[clears throat] And on that project, um

1129
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:06,960
it's looking very much like that will be

1130
00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:09,520
a project done next summer, not this

1131
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:12,240
summer, unfortunately. There are some

1132
00:42:12,240 --> 00:42:14,720
benefits to it. uh with the roundabout

1133
00:42:14,720 --> 00:42:16,960
that's under consideration.

1134
00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:19,520
Uh the MAG

1135
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:22,160
uh projects will be decided on in

1136
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:24,800
August. And so if you remember our

1137
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,119
discussion, if we were awarded and and

1138
00:42:27,119 --> 00:42:29,119
we made the first cut, if we were

1139
00:42:29,119 --> 00:42:32,000
awarded that project, we could build it

1140
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:35,280
and then get reimbursed in four years.

1141
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:37,520
And so the timing of next year versus

1142
00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:41,599
this summer is in a way better for that.

1143
00:42:41,599 --> 00:42:46,319
At least in my mind it is. Yeah.

1144
00:42:46,319 --> 00:42:48,400
[clears throat] Um,

1145
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:50,880
so that project I put a million in here.

1146
00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:52,560
It's actually a million and a half was

1147
00:42:52,560 --> 00:42:55,920
the last kind of I would call bet. It's

1148
00:42:55,920 --> 00:43:00,640
a pretty good estimate I would say. Um

1149
00:43:00,640 --> 00:43:03,119
but what what we submitted to MAG

1150
00:43:03,119 --> 00:43:05,920
because of the requirements they have

1151
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:08,000
and doing things to UD standards was

1152
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:14,630
actually more like 2 million. So

1153
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:17,599
um let's see.

1154
00:43:17,599 --> 00:43:22,319
So some of these other projects uh

1155
00:43:22,319 --> 00:43:24,000
like the weatherbased sprinkler

1156
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:26,319
controllers, we've done all of our big

1157
00:43:26,319 --> 00:43:28,560
parks now. So now it's just some small

1158
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:30,800
ones. So I cut that back from like 40 to

1159
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:35,440
20,000, but I increased uh things like

1160
00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:40,720
tree trimming. I doubled it because we actually ended up having a company

1161
00:43:40,720 --> 00:43:44,319
come into Creekide Park this year and do

1162
00:43:44,319 --> 00:43:46,319
a bunch of tree trimming and it was well

1163
00:43:46,319 --> 00:43:48,160
needed and it's something that we're

1164
00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:49,040
going to

1165
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:50,319
>> focus on a little bit more.

1166
00:43:50,319 --> 00:43:51,920
>> They did on a lot of the streets too,

1167
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:52,960
right?

1168
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:55,839
>> By Creek Side up and down. Uh, no. This

1169
00:43:55,839 --> 00:43:57,760
is all within the park, but the power

1170
00:43:57,760 --> 00:43:59,520
company has a contractor come out and do

1171
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:01,200
tree trimming. You may have seen them.

1172
00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:03,119
I've heard they're in town.

1173
00:44:03,119 --> 00:44:04,400
>> They are. They've been doing Main

1174
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:05,040
Street.

1175
00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:08,560
>> Yeah. Um,

1176
00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:12,880
and so, basically, I wanted to see if

1177
00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:14,480
Oh, there's one more. I want to talk in

1178
00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:16,560
detail about the water projects. I

1179
00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:18,880
included a

1180
00:44:18,880 --> 00:44:19,760
>> letter from John.

1181
00:44:19,760 --> 00:44:22,400
>> The Horox letter was helpful. And you

1182
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:24,240
know, he's saying, "Yeah, you could go

1183
00:44:24,240 --> 00:44:27,359
do the pipeline, but it's it's estimated

1184
00:44:27,359 --> 00:44:30,640
at $18 million versus 9 million for

1185
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:31,760
these other projects."

1186
00:44:31,760 --> 00:44:32,720
>> Yeah, I saw that number.

1187
00:44:32,720 --> 00:44:34,640
>> And so,

1188
00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:34,960
>> uh,

1189
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:37,200
>> but thank you for asking him in that to

1190
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:39,359
give us the best bang for our buck, what

1191
00:44:39,359 --> 00:44:41,280
our like immediate need is. I I thought

1192
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:42,240
that was really helpful

1193
00:44:42,240 --> 00:44:44,160
>> and that's exactly what I asked him for.

1194
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:44,480
And

1195
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:46,400
>> awesome. Thank you. So, I've been

1196
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:49,040
working with Zans's on this one as well,

1197
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:51,359
and I asked them to give us some numbers

1198
00:44:51,359 --> 00:44:54,880
for a $9 million bond

1199
00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:58,000
over 25 years. And the bond payment on

1200
00:44:58,000 --> 00:45:00,880
that would be about 600,000

1201
00:45:00,880 --> 00:45:02,000
>> over the life, right?

1202
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:02,560
>> Annually?

1203
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:04,160
>> No, not annually.

1204
00:45:04,160 --> 00:45:05,520
>> Annually? Annually?

1205
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:07,760
>> Oh, that's I thought it was 150.

1206
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:09,440
>> Annually, no, that was for the fire

1207
00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:10,560
station fire station.

1208
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:11,040
>> Station.

1209
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:12,319
>> Oh, 150.

1210
00:45:12,319 --> 00:45:14,000
>> Yeah.

1211
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:14,720
So,

1212
00:45:14,720 --> 00:45:16,160
>> and then and then that and you're

1213
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:17,920
thinking that bond since we're on water

1214
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:22,960
project is for the uh the uh well up at

1215
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:23,839
>> it would be the well,

1216
00:45:23,839 --> 00:45:25,119
>> the Heritage Hills well.

1217
00:45:25,119 --> 00:45:29,680
>> Um the 400 West Booster Station and a

1218
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:32,880
bunch of piping that goes with it.

1219
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,599
And so what it's doing is freeing up

1220
00:45:35,599 --> 00:45:38,640
water in one zone

1221
00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:41,440
by taking it's it's shuffling water

1222
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:42,880
basically giving us the ability to

1223
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:44,160
shuffle water.

1224
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:45,920
>> Yeah. I saw he said it would it would

1225
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:47,520
help everywhere basically but the west

1226
00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:48,240
side, right?

1227
00:45:48,240 --> 00:45:48,960
>> Yep.

1228
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:49,920
>> Okay.

1229
00:45:49,920 --> 00:45:53,520
>> And that so that those $600,000 annual

1230
00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:55,680
payments would come out of the

1231
00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:57,680
enterprise fund, the collection of of

1232
00:45:57,680 --> 00:46:01,440
fees, not a tax draw. That's that's the

1233
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:02,880
way we're looking at it right now. A

1234
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:05,760
revenue bond. Um

1235
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:07,520
>> so

1236
00:46:07,520 --> 00:46:10,560
they look at both of our they

1237
00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:13,200
in looking at this they look at both

1238
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:16,319
revenues from our PI and culinary water

1239
00:46:16,319 --> 00:46:18,000
systems.

1240
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:19,839
Even though the improvements really

1241
00:46:19,839 --> 00:46:23,520
should be funded from the PI system,

1242
00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:25,440
that's the way our bond is right now.

1243
00:46:25,440 --> 00:46:28,240
And I don't understand all the details,

1244
00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:30,480
but they said that's they call it parody

1245
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:33,280
and that's how it has to stay so that

1246
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:35,280
everything's on the same playing field.

1247
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:37,760
And Mark will come and and give us more

1248
00:46:37,760 --> 00:46:40,800
explanation on that.

1249
00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:42,319
Um,

1250
00:46:42,319 --> 00:46:45,920
but we would probably have to raise PI

1251
00:46:45,920 --> 00:46:48,240
rates really to have that utility pay

1252
00:46:48,240 --> 00:46:51,040
for it. Even though to qualify for the

1253
00:46:51,040 --> 00:46:52,560
bond and have the coverage, they're

1254
00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:55,200
looking at revenue streams from both

1255
00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:57,760
water systems.

1256
00:46:57,760 --> 00:46:59,839
Um, and I think that's only fair because

1257
00:46:59,839 --> 00:47:01,359
there will be improvements needed in the

1258
00:47:01,359 --> 00:47:04,400
culinary system as well.

1259
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:06,560
Um, we're very hopeful that we'll get a

1260
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:10,480
grant um for the culinary water tank.

1261
00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:12,400
Uh,

1262
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:14,880
the mayor put a ton of work into this

1263
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:17,440
and we got a call the other day just

1264
00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:20,000
asking a couple of questions. Uh, one,

1265
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:22,319
is it finished water? And two, what our

1266
00:47:22,319 --> 00:47:26,800
water system number is. There weren't any details they were looking

1267
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:29,839
for. So, I think the bases were covered.

1268
00:47:29,839 --> 00:47:31,520
I'm not sure what the timeline is on

1269
00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:33,280
that, but but it would be very helpful

1270
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:34,880
and awesome if we got that.

1271
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:36,560
>> Yeah, I think we're supposed to find out

1272
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:38,480
within the next month and a half. It was

1273
00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:39,599
a quick It was a pretty quick

1274
00:47:39,599 --> 00:47:40,400
turnaround.

1275
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:42,560
>> Yeah.

1276
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:44,560
Um, [clears throat]

1277
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:47,119
so I guess what I'd like to know from

1278
00:47:47,119 --> 00:47:51,200
the council is are are there any

1279
00:47:51,200 --> 00:47:53,200
concerns with these projects that aren't

1280
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:55,839
in white.

1281
00:47:55,839 --> 00:47:57,839
They're pretty standard from year to

1282
00:47:57,839 --> 00:48:02,720
year things that that we plug in here.

1283
00:48:02,720 --> 00:48:03,599
Um,

1284
00:48:03,599 --> 00:48:04,960
>> sorry. Did you ask if there are concerns

1285
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:06,800
on the ones in white or the ones not in

1286
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:07,280
white?

1287
00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:10,079
>> Well, the ones in white and then we can

1288
00:48:10,079 --> 00:48:11,760
integrate,

1289
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:14,640
you know, as we pair things down. Um,

1290
00:48:14,640 --> 00:48:16,720
the ones in yellow. I did make some

1291
00:48:16,720 --> 00:48:20,000
suggestions on these ones in yellow.

1292
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:22,880
For example, the roundabout, you know,

1293
00:48:22,880 --> 00:48:26,800
we applied for this grant. Um,

1294
00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:29,760
we can, this project would start

1295
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:32,240
probably next spring

1296
00:48:32,240 --> 00:48:34,559
is what I'd anticipate the Cany Crest

1297
00:48:34,559 --> 00:48:37,040
project and if we did a roundabout, uh,

1298
00:48:37,040 --> 00:48:38,960
I would anticipate it being part of the

1299
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:41,680
same same project.

1300
00:48:41,680 --> 00:48:45,109
Um,

1301
00:48:45,119 --> 00:48:47,680
then

1302
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:50,720
let's see, the ranch drive extension. I

1303
00:48:50,720 --> 00:48:52,960
think this is just a planning effort at

1304
00:48:52,960 --> 00:48:54,640
this point

1305
00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:56,800
because realistically there's there's a

1306
00:48:56,800 --> 00:48:58,160
lot of things that would have to fall in

1307
00:48:58,160 --> 00:49:00,559
place for that to happen besides it

1308
00:49:00,559 --> 00:49:03,520
would be very expensive. But I think a

1309
00:49:03,520 --> 00:49:05,680
planning effort for sure is warranted

1310
00:49:05,680 --> 00:49:07,920
and we could include you know the funds

1311
00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:11,040
for that planning in this budget year.

1312
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:14,559
>> Can we utilize MAG's TA grants for that

1313
00:49:14,559 --> 00:49:17,200
for the planning portion?

1314
00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:19,280
>> It's a good question.

1315
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:20,400
We can ask.

1316
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:24,150
>> I'll ask

1317
00:49:24,160 --> 00:49:27,760
» um the Beex Hill Park Restoration. This

1318
00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:30,000
will be jumping just just a little bit

1319
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:32,800
ahead to a communication item, but um

1320
00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:37,359
our parks master plan is underway. Um

1321
00:49:37,359 --> 00:49:41,520
we'll talk uh in communication about uh

1322
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:43,920
steering committee. Um, we've planned a

1323
00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:47,839
public meeting that will be noticed for

1324
00:49:47,839 --> 00:49:52,160
May 13th. I believe that's a Wednesday.

1325
00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:54,880
Um, where they'll, you know, we'll

1326
00:49:54,880 --> 00:49:57,680
advertise it, get the public to come in.

1327
00:49:57,680 --> 00:49:59,839
Um, they can tell us what they think we

1328
00:49:59,839 --> 00:50:02,160
should do in these parks, where they,

1329
00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:04,160
you know, think we have needs, what

1330
00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:07,760
their ideas are for, uh, Beexill Park

1331
00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:10,559
and that property the city owns there.

1332
00:50:10,559 --> 00:50:14,480
uh Peterson Park and just really start

1333
00:50:14,480 --> 00:50:18,400
into that process. Um but my

1334
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:19,760
recommendation, and you don't have to

1335
00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:21,119
take it, if you want to go a different

1336
00:50:21,119 --> 00:50:22,880
direction, that's totally fine. We'll do

1337
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:26,160
whatever you want, is for that one and

1338
00:50:26,160 --> 00:50:30,400
for the Peterson Parking lot with those

1339
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:32,960
two projects, maybe see what comes out

1340
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:36,079
of this parks plan and then move forward

1341
00:50:36,079 --> 00:50:38,000
from there.

1342
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:40,720
Otherwise, it kind of feels like we're

1343
00:50:40,720 --> 00:50:42,720
injecting something in before the parks

1344
00:50:42,720 --> 00:50:46,000
plan is created. And they might you

1345
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:47,359
might find that the public wants

1346
00:50:47,359 --> 00:50:48,880
something different. I don't I don't

1347
00:50:48,880 --> 00:50:50,480
know. It's just an idea.

1348
00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:52,400
>> As part of the public [clears throat]

1349
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:54,160
meeting for the parks plan, are they

1350
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:56,240
going to be given some preliminary

1351
00:50:56,240 --> 00:50:57,920
thoughts and ideas or are you just

1352
00:50:57,920 --> 00:50:59,359
asking for cold ideas?

1353
00:50:59,359 --> 00:51:01,599
>> Not on this one. This one I believe is

1354
00:51:01,599 --> 00:51:06,559
collecting ideas and then like um I

1355
00:51:06,559 --> 00:51:08,400
remember back on Creekide Park they had

1356
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:11,920
a sharet and they just had like maps

1357
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:13,520
where people could draw on them. We

1358
00:51:13,520 --> 00:51:16,400
think there should be this back then

1359
00:51:16,400 --> 00:51:18,800
somebody wanted outdoor raetball courts

1360
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:20,319
and so they could write that on that

1361
00:51:20,319 --> 00:51:22,400
plan and all those things would be

1362
00:51:22,400 --> 00:51:24,800
considered and then this won't be the

1363
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:26,960
only public meeting. [clears throat] So

1364
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:29,280
then we'll start getting into other

1365
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:32,800
ideas and and start kind of narrowing it

1366
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:33,520
down.

1367
00:51:33,520 --> 00:51:34,240
>> Perfect.

1368
00:51:34,240 --> 00:51:36,480
>> And the second question or thought is we

1369
00:51:36,480 --> 00:51:37,920
talked in our previous budget meeting

1370
00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:40,400
about Peterson Park being a priority

1371
00:51:40,400 --> 00:51:42,319
because of the Canyon Crest project, but

1372
00:51:42,319 --> 00:51:43,599
now that that's going to be pushed back

1373
00:51:43,599 --> 00:51:46,720
to 2027, it should still meet with the

1374
00:51:46,720 --> 00:51:51,040
time frame of of the park's master plan

1375
00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:52,400
establishing priorities. But I still

1376
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:53,680
think that should be a priority because

1377
00:51:53,680 --> 00:51:55,599
we're already tearing up that little

1378
00:51:55,599 --> 00:51:56,800
corner and

1379
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,200
>> be a good time to work on Peterson Park.

1380
00:51:59,200 --> 00:52:01,119
>> Yeah. And I think we can share the

1381
00:52:01,119 --> 00:52:05,599
information um as it's work for

1382
00:52:05,599 --> 00:52:07,280
roundabout or whatever. I've already

1383
00:52:07,280 --> 00:52:09,599
told our consultant that we own that

1384
00:52:09,599 --> 00:52:12,800
house and uh we're looking at a

1385
00:52:12,800 --> 00:52:14,880
roundabout there and so they're aware of

1386
00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:18,240
that and they can kind of plan around

1387
00:52:18,240 --> 00:52:23,680
it. So yeah. So I think all those things

1388
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:25,119
>> come together at a really good time.

1389
00:52:25,119 --> 00:52:25,599
Yes.

1390
00:52:25,599 --> 00:52:27,520
>> Just just so everybody's aware, the

1391
00:52:27,520 --> 00:52:29,520
meeting is in May. So we're not talking

1392
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:31,920
about the first public meeting.

1393
00:52:31,920 --> 00:52:32,880
>> Yeah. Is in May.

1394
00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:33,839
>> Is it May 13th?

1395
00:52:33,839 --> 00:52:34,880
>> May 13th.

1396
00:52:34,880 --> 00:52:36,559
>> I think I think the residents and I'm

1397
00:52:36,559 --> 00:52:39,520
good with taking the guidance from that

1398
00:52:39,520 --> 00:52:42,160
uh those plans that you're that's that

1399
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:45,359
are coming together before uh pushing

1400
00:52:45,359 --> 00:52:47,040
things towards I think that's I think it

1401
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:49,359
will form that whole budget item. Yeah,

1402
00:52:49,359 --> 00:52:51,040
I I think it's good planning and it

1403
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:53,040
might be we're talking more about the

1404
00:52:53,040 --> 00:52:55,200
details of those projects in next year's

1405
00:52:55,200 --> 00:52:56,800
budget instead of this, you know what I

1406
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:57,520
mean? Instead of

1407
00:52:57,520 --> 00:52:59,359
>> maybe if there's some money available,

1408
00:52:59,359 --> 00:53:01,599
we could just allot it to that but not

1409
00:53:01,599 --> 00:53:04,000
specify it to what goes in those parks

1410
00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:04,640
and tell the plan.

1411
00:53:04,640 --> 00:53:05,839
>> That's a way to approach it.

1412
00:53:05,839 --> 00:53:07,599
>> Even just 20 grand or something just so

1413
00:53:07,599 --> 00:53:09,440
they can get started.

1414
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:14,079
>> Okay. And with that, uh, our consultant,

1415
00:53:14,079 --> 00:53:16,160
uh, already has a website established.

1416
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:17,599
We haven't pushed it out there yet

1417
00:53:17,599 --> 00:53:19,440
because we didn't want to get it too far

1418
00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:22,240
ahead of their survey. And oh, I forgot

1419
00:53:22,240 --> 00:53:23,599
to mention that they're they're

1420
00:53:23,599 --> 00:53:26,480
preparing this survey as well.

1421
00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:28,000
And so all those things will kind of

1422
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:30,559
come together leading up to that uh May

1423
00:53:30,559 --> 00:53:32,160
13th meeting.

1424
00:53:32,160 --> 00:53:34,160
>> So what is the plan for getting notice

1425
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:35,760
out

1426
00:53:35,760 --> 00:53:38,559
uh well in advance so people don't wait

1427
00:53:38,559 --> 00:53:40,319
have to see it on the sign a couple days

1428
00:53:40,319 --> 00:53:45,520
before? So, uh, social media news line,

1429
00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:47,839
uh, we talked about a banner at the sign

1430
00:53:47,839 --> 00:53:50,400
in the roundabout. Um, we even talked

1431
00:53:50,400 --> 00:53:55,200
about, uh, using our Everbridge system,

1432
00:53:55,200 --> 00:53:57,680
just a short, hey, you know, city's

1433
00:53:57,680 --> 00:53:59,520
working on parks master plan, public

1434
00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:02,559
meeting, May 13, 7 p.m. or 6 p.m., what,

1435
00:54:02,559 --> 00:54:06,000
whatever time it is. Um, we talked about

1436
00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:08,640
all those different ways to do that.

1437
00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:09,920
>> Brad, do you like the banners? So, I

1438
00:54:09,920 --> 00:54:11,040
thought the banners have been working

1439
00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:12,720
pretty well for the meetings.

1440
00:54:12,720 --> 00:54:13,920
>> I think the banners are great just as

1441
00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:15,520
long as they go out well in advance and

1442
00:54:15,520 --> 00:54:16,640
not just a couple days before,

1443
00:54:16,640 --> 00:54:18,079
>> like a week or two.

1444
00:54:18,079 --> 00:54:19,760
>> The banner signs been great. We haven't

1445
00:54:19,760 --> 00:54:21,359
lost We haven't had the wind take

1446
00:54:21,359 --> 00:54:23,280
anything out and it's always looks neat

1447
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:23,920
and tidy.

1448
00:54:23,920 --> 00:54:25,280
>> I just mean like for getting the word

1449
00:54:25,280 --> 00:54:26,640
out. People call me and they're like,

1450
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:28,000
"Are you going to this meeting?" So,

1451
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:30,160
it's people are seeing it.

1452
00:54:30,160 --> 00:54:30,559
>> Yeah.

1453
00:54:30,559 --> 00:54:33,040
>> Isn't there also a way to sign up from

1454
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:35,599
to receive notifications on the website

1455
00:54:35,599 --> 00:54:37,599
as well? Yes. Right. Okay. So,

1456
00:54:37,599 --> 00:54:39,200
>> Yep.

1457
00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:40,932
Yeah, those come out just like a

1458
00:54:40,932 --> 00:54:41,839
[laughter] day or two before.

1459
00:54:41,839 --> 00:54:43,599
>> We can reach out to those neighbors

1460
00:54:43,599 --> 00:54:45,200
around those areas as well because those

1461
00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:46,559
are the ones who I mean everyone will

1462
00:54:46,559 --> 00:54:47,920
have input, but the ones who live around

1463
00:54:47,920 --> 00:54:49,839
there are really interested in it. I'm

1464
00:54:49,839 --> 00:54:50,880
sure they'd want to come.

1465
00:54:50,880 --> 00:54:52,559
>> Well, it's not just those two parks.

1466
00:54:52,559 --> 00:54:54,480
It's throughout the whole city. So, it's

1467
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:56,240
really everything.

1468
00:54:56,240 --> 00:54:56,720
>> Yeah.

1469
00:54:56,720 --> 00:54:58,319
>> All right. Everyone then.

1470
00:54:58,319 --> 00:55:01,040
>> Mhm. Yep. So, we'll do everything we can

1471
00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:04,240
to get the word out on those.

1472
00:55:04,240 --> 00:55:07,520
Um, but if if we this will help us

1473
00:55:07,520 --> 00:55:10,079
narrow down as we work on this budget.

1474
00:55:10,079 --> 00:55:12,480
Is that approach good on those two

1475
00:55:12,480 --> 00:55:13,920
parks?

1476
00:55:13,920 --> 00:55:16,079
>> Is that is that okay?

1477
00:55:16,079 --> 00:55:17,280
>> All right. Um,

1478
00:55:17,280 --> 00:55:19,520
>> wait, which two parks are you referring

1479
00:55:19,520 --> 00:55:20,800
to specifically?

1480
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:23,680
>> Peterson Park and Becktail Park.

1481
00:55:23,680 --> 00:55:25,359
>> The two parks that are in the

1482
00:55:25,359 --> 00:55:28,640
>> yellow park.

1483
00:55:28,640 --> 00:55:32,000
>> Um, why am I not finding Peterson?

1484
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:32,720
>> Peterson.

1485
00:55:32,720 --> 00:55:34,559
>> It's I see.

1486
00:55:34,559 --> 00:55:36,559
>> It says parking lot at Peterson Park.

1487
00:55:36,559 --> 00:55:37,040
>> Yeah,

1488
00:55:37,040 --> 00:55:38,160
>> it's the

1489
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:38,880
>> It's just right under

1490
00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:40,480
>> Beck under the Beex Hill.

1491
00:55:40,480 --> 00:55:43,920
>> Right above the best one. Raccoon Plan.

1492
00:55:43,920 --> 00:55:46,640
>> Oh, you're saying that we're propo Okay.

1493
00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:48,559
You're saying that we're proposing We're

1494
00:55:48,559 --> 00:55:51,040
proposing to wait till to move those

1495
00:55:51,040 --> 00:55:52,400
after the master plan.

1496
00:55:52,400 --> 00:55:54,799
>> Yeah. To be honest to what I'm saying.

1497
00:55:54,799 --> 00:55:56,640
>> I thought you were saying everything was

1498
00:55:56,640 --> 00:55:58,400
going to the after the master plan, but

1499
00:55:58,400 --> 00:56:02,160
these two, but no.

1500
00:56:02,160 --> 00:56:03,920
>> Okay.

1501
00:56:03,920 --> 00:56:05,839
Um

1502
00:56:05,839 --> 00:56:07,359
>> Shane, since you're about there, I don't

1503
00:56:07,359 --> 00:56:08,160
know if you're going to go to the other

1504
00:56:08,160 --> 00:56:10,240
ones, but the traffic calming one, is

1505
00:56:10,240 --> 00:56:13,440
that the whole the big traffic calming

1506
00:56:13,440 --> 00:56:15,119
one with like entrance signs and

1507
00:56:15,119 --> 00:56:16,319
everything? Is that that

1508
00:56:16,319 --> 00:56:18,880
>> that's that's the project. I didn't I

1509
00:56:18,880 --> 00:56:20,480
didn't put a number in there because

1510
00:56:20,480 --> 00:56:21,839
>> Do you want me to try to find some

1511
00:56:21,839 --> 00:56:26,960
numbers and research? I I think it's going to be the council

1512
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:28,720
saying

1513
00:56:28,720 --> 00:56:30,240
we want to do this project. We're

1514
00:56:30,240 --> 00:56:33,680
willing to budget X dollars for this

1515
00:56:33,680 --> 00:56:34,480
budget year.

1516
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:34,960
>> Okay.

1517
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:36,720
>> And then

1518
00:56:36,720 --> 00:56:39,680
if we get 50 things in for X dollars,

1519
00:56:39,680 --> 00:56:42,079
great. If we get five things in for X

1520
00:56:42,079 --> 00:56:43,839
dollars, that's what it will be for that

1521
00:56:43,839 --> 00:56:45,680
budget year. That's what I would suggest

1522
00:56:45,680 --> 00:56:46,720
starting out.

1523
00:56:46,720 --> 00:56:48,880
>> Okay.

1524
00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:50,480
Um,

1525
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:53,359
and as I pair this down, I can I can put

1526
00:56:53,359 --> 00:56:55,760
a number in there that fits or if you

1527
00:56:55,760 --> 00:56:57,440
have a suggestion, I'm happy to take

1528
00:56:57,440 --> 00:56:57,920
that.

1529
00:56:57,920 --> 00:56:58,319
>> Okay.

1530
00:56:58,319 --> 00:56:58,960
>> As well.

1531
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:00,880
>> So, for me, what would be really helpful

1532
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:03,920
is um as we look at these numbers, how

1533
00:57:03,920 --> 00:57:06,319
much we have left in the accounts for

1534
00:57:06,319 --> 00:57:07,760
each of these allocations.

1535
00:57:07,760 --> 00:57:08,240
>> Yeah.

1536
00:57:08,240 --> 00:57:10,160
>> To see whether we actually have the

1537
00:57:10,160 --> 00:57:12,319
money. I mean, these are all um notable

1538
00:57:12,319 --> 00:57:16,319
projects. Um, but it's a good way to,

1539
00:57:16,319 --> 00:57:19,119
you know, help us prioritize to see what

1540
00:57:19,119 --> 00:57:21,280
pool of money we have to draw from. I

1541
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:22,640
mean, if we don't have the money, then

1542
00:57:22,640 --> 00:57:24,160
we shouldn't even be considering, but if

1543
00:57:24,160 --> 00:57:25,280
we do, great. Then let's start

1544
00:57:25,280 --> 00:57:26,960
prioritizing what we have,

1545
00:57:26,960 --> 00:57:28,880
>> right? And you'll see more detail on

1546
00:57:28,880 --> 00:57:30,960
that in this next step.

1547
00:57:30,960 --> 00:57:32,720
>> On Carla's thought there, that's what I

1548
00:57:32,720 --> 00:57:35,280
was um I'll you can go through the list,

1549
00:57:35,280 --> 00:57:38,799
but is the $12 million the total of this

1550
00:57:38,799 --> 00:57:41,359
entire column?

1551
00:57:41,359 --> 00:57:44,880
>> Yeah, but 5.4 before that's

1552
00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:46,640
>> the candy crest project.

1553
00:57:46,640 --> 00:57:50,799
>> Right. Right. So, um I guess I'll let

1554
00:57:50,799 --> 00:57:52,400
you finish, but like I was just

1555
00:57:52,400 --> 00:57:54,000
wondering

1556
00:57:54,000 --> 00:57:56,799
um [clears throat] yeah, some some more

1557
00:57:56,799 --> 00:57:59,200
how's this spreadsheet going to come

1558
00:57:59,200 --> 00:58:02,319
together like in as far as a budget?

1559
00:58:02,319 --> 00:58:05,119
Well, if you look at the bottom,

1560
00:58:05,119 --> 00:58:07,440
not not the total, but over in the the

1561
00:58:07,440 --> 00:58:10,880
colored portion to the right. Um, those

1562
00:58:10,880 --> 00:58:12,799
will be the numbers that we'll focus on

1563
00:58:12,799 --> 00:58:15,280
from one fund to another.

1564
00:58:15,280 --> 00:58:17,920
>> Well, if I'm understanding, and I have

1565
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:19,599
looked at this so many times and still

1566
00:58:19,599 --> 00:58:22,319
am interpreting, um, the general fund is

1567
00:58:22,319 --> 00:58:24,559
the light peach, and that's annual

1568
00:58:24,559 --> 00:58:28,079
revenues coming in fresh like in the in

1569
00:58:28,079 --> 00:58:30,079
the next calendar in the next fiscal

1570
00:58:30,079 --> 00:58:32,880
year. Whereas the orange is more of our

1571
00:58:32,880 --> 00:58:35,760
things we've earmarked for the future

1572
00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:37,599
>> that will be pulled from the 10 million

1573
00:58:37,599 --> 00:58:39,280
there at the bottom.

1574
00:58:39,280 --> 00:58:41,839
>> Um so the first two columns of the the

1575
00:58:41,839 --> 00:58:44,079
darker orange they're

1576
00:58:44,079 --> 00:58:46,319
>> I would call them more restricted like

1577
00:58:46,319 --> 00:58:48,640
park funds. Oh yeah go spend those on

1578
00:58:48,640 --> 00:58:51,200
streets. The next column class C we

1579
00:58:51,200 --> 00:58:53,200
can't go spend those on parks.

1580
00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:55,839
>> So those would stay in in those two.

1581
00:58:55,839 --> 00:58:57,280
>> Oh I see what you're saying. The third

1582
00:58:57,280 --> 00:58:59,280
one, capital improvements, is the more

1583
00:58:59,280 --> 00:59:00,559
flexible one.

1584
00:59:00,559 --> 00:59:02,799
>> But you're saying if we if we go with

1585
00:59:02,799 --> 00:59:05,520
everything in white, doing the cross

1586
00:59:05,520 --> 00:59:07,520
here, everything in white, we're going

1587
00:59:07,520 --> 00:59:10,319
to pull uh 3.1

1588
00:59:10,319 --> 00:59:14,079
million from the fund balance. And most

1589
00:59:14,079 --> 00:59:16,319
of that is our fire station

1590
00:59:16,319 --> 00:59:18,480
>> and the three falls mitigation. That's

1591
00:59:18,480 --> 00:59:21,680
$3 million together, [snorts] right? Is

1592
00:59:21,680 --> 00:59:22,960
that what you're saying?

1593
00:59:22,960 --> 00:59:25,200
>> Yeah. And this this isn't built out.

1594
00:59:25,200 --> 00:59:27,119
These yellow projects aren't built out

1595
00:59:27,119 --> 00:59:27,920
yet,

1596
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:29,599
>> right? I can see that they're blank

1597
00:59:29,599 --> 00:59:31,599
going across the whole thing. So, in

1598
00:59:31,599 --> 00:59:33,760
general, how that's I think what Carla's

1599
00:59:33,760 --> 00:59:36,799
getting to is um we're already

1600
00:59:36,799 --> 00:59:40,079
allocating close to

1601
00:59:40,079 --> 00:59:41,599
700,000

1602
00:59:41,599 --> 00:59:45,760
of the 2027 budget in the light peach.

1603
00:59:45,760 --> 00:59:48,640
So, if there's if we have 2 million,

1604
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:52,079
then we have 1.3 left or if there's um 1

1605
00:59:52,079 --> 00:59:53,920
million, we have, you know, something

1606
00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:57,040
different. So, do we know what's what we

1607
00:59:57,040 --> 01:00:00,720
could allocate in the peach column for

1608
01:00:00,720 --> 01:00:01,920
projects yet?

1609
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:03,599
>> That will be in the next step of the

1610
01:00:03,599 --> 01:00:05,920
budget. We'll have a lot of detail on

1611
01:00:05,920 --> 01:00:09,599
that projected revenues and things. So,

1612
01:00:09,599 --> 01:00:12,240
we'll know those numbers. I think at one

1613
01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:14,160
point I did make a suggestion and it was

1614
01:00:14,160 --> 01:00:16,000
sort of uh we got to the end of our

1615
01:00:16,000 --> 01:00:18,799
retreat, but if um we do have projects

1616
01:00:18,799 --> 01:00:20,480
and we know how much money we have to

1617
01:00:20,480 --> 01:00:23,280
spend that we go through a a matrix

1618
01:00:23,280 --> 01:00:26,160
rating where we all would just rank it

1619
01:00:26,160 --> 01:00:28,640
>> and we can only if we rank everything

1620
01:00:28,640 --> 01:00:30,240
and we all think the most important

1621
01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:33,760
thing is to do sidewalk improvements for

1622
01:00:33,760 --> 01:00:37,119
25,000 and then all we have is you know

1623
01:00:37,119 --> 01:00:38,960
what we have. We could just say these

1624
01:00:38,960 --> 01:00:40,480
are our top projects and now we're out

1625
01:00:40,480 --> 01:00:41,760
of money. we're done.

1626
01:00:41,760 --> 01:00:42,559
>> Mhm.

1627
01:00:42,559 --> 01:00:45,200
>> So, um that's that's kind of because I

1628
01:00:45,200 --> 01:00:49,599
it is hard to weigh our resources that

1629
01:00:49,599 --> 01:00:51,760
we have available against our needs

1630
01:00:51,760 --> 01:00:53,440
unless we know what we have available,

1631
01:00:53,440 --> 01:00:56,160
which I know is coming. But then like to

1632
01:00:56,160 --> 01:00:58,960
have a systematic way to rank it and say

1633
01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:01,359
like everybody agrees that the 25,000 is

1634
01:01:01,359 --> 01:01:04,000
going to be like the a priority or maybe

1635
01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:05,920
we don't, but it's hard to do that in a

1636
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:08,000
discussion format. I'm, you know, I'm a

1637
01:01:08,000 --> 01:01:10,400
numbers person, so I brought this up

1638
01:01:10,400 --> 01:01:12,000
before. I don't know how the council

1639
01:01:12,000 --> 01:01:13,520
feels about that, but that might help

1640
01:01:13,520 --> 01:01:16,240
give you more direction as well, rather

1641
01:01:16,240 --> 01:01:18,640
than trying to read our body language or

1642
01:01:18,640 --> 01:01:20,400
langu, you know, what do we how do we

1643
01:01:20,400 --> 01:01:22,240
feel about these things, right?

1644
01:01:22,240 --> 01:01:24,079
>> So, that was I don't know, that's just

1645
01:01:24,079 --> 01:01:26,160
kind of where I'm thinking is if we have

1646
01:01:26,160 --> 01:01:28,319
more needs than resources and you said

1647
01:01:28,319 --> 01:01:30,720
in the past we had very few requests

1648
01:01:30,720 --> 01:01:33,440
from council and now our our requests

1649
01:01:33,440 --> 01:01:36,160
from council far exceed our resources.

1650
01:01:36,160 --> 01:01:37,599
maybe we can come up with a way to

1651
01:01:37,599 --> 01:01:42,559
narrow down the projects and say what is the consensus of all of us

1652
01:01:42,559 --> 01:01:45,200
without discussing this you know at

1653
01:01:45,200 --> 01:01:48,000
length. So would I'm just suggesting

1654
01:01:48,000 --> 01:01:50,799
even before you you get to the next

1655
01:01:50,799 --> 01:01:53,359
presentation that we rank these in some

1656
01:01:53,359 --> 01:01:54,960
way and give you some direction that

1657
01:01:54,960 --> 01:01:57,599
way. Would anybody else feel

1658
01:01:57,599 --> 01:01:59,359
uncomfortable or think that's a good

1659
01:01:59,359 --> 01:02:00,240
move forward?

1660
01:02:00,240 --> 01:02:02,960
>> Well I also think ranking relates to the

1661
01:02:02,960 --> 01:02:04,960
funding source. So, for example, if you

1662
01:02:04,960 --> 01:02:08,240
go back to that um chart and in the

1663
01:02:08,240 --> 01:02:12,319
yellow, it shows the relic hall as a

1664
01:02:12,319 --> 01:02:14,559
grant waiting on a grant, but we

1665
01:02:14,559 --> 01:02:17,760
discussed adding not a true ADA ramp,

1666
01:02:17,760 --> 01:02:19,200
but a ramp so that it makes more

1667
01:02:19,200 --> 01:02:22,079
accessible for um you know, people that

1668
01:02:22,079 --> 01:02:24,319
can't do the stairs. And so, there's

1669
01:02:24,319 --> 01:02:27,760
funds available through our park tax.

1670
01:02:27,760 --> 01:02:31,280
And so it's not just really specifically

1671
01:02:31,280 --> 01:02:33,200
what's the most important, it's what's

1672
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:35,680
the most important based on the funding

1673
01:02:35,680 --> 01:02:36,799
pathway because

1674
01:02:36,799 --> 01:02:38,960
>> it's a two-way discussion. Yes.

1675
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:41,599
>> And I think did I misunderstand that in

1676
01:02:41,599 --> 01:02:44,240
our general fund we typically have about

1677
01:02:44,240 --> 01:02:46,559
nine or$10 million? I don't know if he

1678
01:02:46,559 --> 01:02:48,480
said new revenue that comes in every

1679
01:02:48,480 --> 01:02:51,599
year that we're looking at allocating or

1680
01:02:51,599 --> 01:02:53,280
is it more like three million that we're

1681
01:02:53,280 --> 01:02:54,960
looking at allocating

1682
01:02:54,960 --> 01:02:56,799
>> between those two numbers.

1683
01:02:56,799 --> 01:02:58,480
>> Not as low as 3 million. It's not as

1684
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:00,319
much as 10 or 12.

1685
01:03:00,319 --> 01:03:04,160
>> No, I I think um we we we're making

1686
01:03:04,160 --> 01:03:06,480
commitments to bonding. We're making

1687
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:09,359
commitments to fire and police, you

1688
01:03:09,359 --> 01:03:12,160
know, increasing those um to the Lone

1689
01:03:12,160 --> 01:03:14,720
Peak special. So, like it's a it's a

1690
01:03:14,720 --> 01:03:17,599
sort of a moving target, but I do think

1691
01:03:17,599 --> 01:03:19,440
to your point to keep it really simple,

1692
01:03:19,440 --> 01:03:21,520
we get a h 100,000. We do know we get

1693
01:03:21,520 --> 01:03:23,760
about $100,000 in park tax, which is

1694
01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:27,520
that first dark orange. And if we assign

1695
01:03:27,520 --> 01:03:30,720
30,000 from his white items, that gives

1696
01:03:30,720 --> 01:03:32,480
us to what you're saying, we still have

1697
01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:35,440
70,000 left to say, what should we spend

1698
01:03:35,440 --> 01:03:37,039
those items on? Because like you like

1699
01:03:37,039 --> 01:03:38,000
you're pointing out, they're very

1700
01:03:38,000 --> 01:03:39,359
restricted,

1701
01:03:39,359 --> 01:03:40,640
>> you know, because we have to spend them

1702
01:03:40,640 --> 01:03:42,319
on specific things

1703
01:03:42,319 --> 01:03:43,760
>> and we can't spend them on the roads,

1704
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:46,720
right? So, we could I I don't know like

1705
01:03:46,720 --> 01:03:48,000
come up with a list of what could we

1706
01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:49,440
spend the park tax and then anything

1707
01:03:49,440 --> 01:03:51,839
that we can't spend park tax on, it has

1708
01:03:51,839 --> 01:03:53,280
to come out of general fund. Like

1709
01:03:53,280 --> 01:03:54,880
there's no other source.

1710
01:03:54,880 --> 01:03:57,200
>> We just allocate that park tax fund now

1711
01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,359
to whatever the priority projects come

1712
01:03:59,359 --> 01:04:02,640
out of the parks master plan, right? But

1713
01:04:02,640 --> 01:04:04,400
I'm saying I would like to see some of

1714
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:06,240
that go to Relic Hall because we're

1715
01:04:06,240 --> 01:04:08,079
going to be improving our whole town

1716
01:04:08,079 --> 01:04:11,440
square and then we haven't improved, you

1717
01:04:11,440 --> 01:04:13,200
know, the window sills and we haven't

1718
01:04:13,200 --> 01:04:16,000
added a more accessible space. So, it's

1719
01:04:16,000 --> 01:04:17,839
also a timing piece just like doing

1720
01:04:17,839 --> 01:04:19,920
Peterson Park is a timing piece. So,

1721
01:04:19,920 --> 01:04:22,480
there's more information and part of a

1722
01:04:22,480 --> 01:04:24,559
discussion for prioritizing those

1723
01:04:24,559 --> 01:04:25,119
things.

1724
01:04:25,119 --> 01:04:26,960
>> I also did suggest during the retreat

1725
01:04:26,960 --> 01:04:29,039
that we took the park tax which is

1726
01:04:29,039 --> 01:04:31,760
generally a 100,000. It looks like Yeah,

1727
01:04:31,760 --> 01:04:33,359
that's what he's projecting again,

1728
01:04:33,359 --> 01:04:34,400
Shane.

1729
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:37,760
>> So, if we always allocated 30,000 to

1730
01:04:37,760 --> 01:04:41,119
culture, the other A RC, arts,

1731
01:04:41,119 --> 01:04:43,119
recreation, and culture, and then 70,000

1732
01:04:43,119 --> 01:04:45,760
to parks, we'd kind of like have a an

1733
01:04:45,760 --> 01:04:49,599
ongoing resource for other sources. And

1734
01:04:49,599 --> 01:04:52,720
so, this first $30,000 would eat up the

1735
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:54,720
70. And now we've got 40 left to spend

1736
01:04:54,720 --> 01:04:57,760
on parks and 30 to do the ARC part of

1737
01:04:57,760 --> 01:04:59,760
the tax. I'm just saying if we come up

1738
01:04:59,760 --> 01:05:01,760
with some kind of system that gives

1739
01:05:01,760 --> 01:05:04,160
Shane more direction as well.

1740
01:05:04,160 --> 01:05:05,839
>> I think that's a great idea. Also, we

1741
01:05:05,839 --> 01:05:08,240
have to consider or we can consider the

1742
01:05:08,240 --> 01:05:10,960
general fund balance. Um we can only

1743
01:05:10,960 --> 01:05:13,440
maintain a certain percentage of savings

1744
01:05:13,440 --> 01:05:15,119
in that in those fund balances. And so

1745
01:05:15,119 --> 01:05:16,799
those that's

1746
01:05:16,799 --> 01:05:18,559
>> some resources that are available

1747
01:05:18,559 --> 01:05:20,880
potentially for use.

1748
01:05:20,880 --> 01:05:21,839
>> Yes.

1749
01:05:21,839 --> 01:05:25,200
>> And then also impact fees. Um, for some

1750
01:05:25,200 --> 01:05:26,720
of those projects, we could use impact

1751
01:05:26,720 --> 01:05:28,880
fees to help offset the cost from the

1752
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:29,760
general fund.

1753
01:05:29,760 --> 01:05:31,119
>> Yeah.

1754
01:05:31,119 --> 01:05:33,440
>> So, I I think we're getting close, but

1755
01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:36,000
um I guess to sort of give you better

1756
01:05:36,000 --> 01:05:38,720
direction, would you would we would we

1757
01:05:38,720 --> 01:05:42,000
be okay with like everyone ranking these

1758
01:05:42,000 --> 01:05:45,039
based on like four criteria like what's

1759
01:05:45,039 --> 01:05:46,880
the public need? What's the you know

1760
01:05:46,880 --> 01:05:49,200
infrastructure? I don't know. We I came

1761
01:05:49,200 --> 01:05:50,480
up with a suggestion. It's at the back

1762
01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:53,760
of her trusty binder. I at one point I

1763
01:05:53,760 --> 01:05:55,200
thought about it a long time and I I

1764
01:05:55,200 --> 01:05:56,960
came up with something but we could come

1765
01:05:56,960 --> 01:05:57,760
improve that

1766
01:05:57,760 --> 01:06:00,319
>> along with that. Um do you think we

1767
01:06:00,319 --> 01:06:02,400
could also include like how much money

1768
01:06:02,400 --> 01:06:04,079
we have available kind of like what has

1769
01:06:04,079 --> 01:06:05,520
already been said as part of that matrix

1770
01:06:05,520 --> 01:06:07,359
we kind of have a guideline as we're

1771
01:06:07,359 --> 01:06:08,880
prioritizing project

1772
01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:11,440
>> are we enough in along in the budgeting

1773
01:06:11,440 --> 01:06:12,640
process where you could come up with

1774
01:06:12,640 --> 01:06:13,920
that number Shane?

1775
01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:16,160
>> Yeah I mean we it'll obviously rough

1776
01:06:16,160 --> 01:06:17,680
estimate some rough estimates

1777
01:06:17,680 --> 01:06:18,799
>> right but and you're going to be

1778
01:06:18,799 --> 01:06:19,839
conservative. Yeah,

1779
01:06:19,839 --> 01:06:21,599
>> because that's your nature

1780
01:06:21,599 --> 01:06:24,000
>> and and we appreciate that.

1781
01:06:24,000 --> 01:06:26,079
>> We'll suggest that the entire fund

1782
01:06:26,079 --> 01:06:27,599
balance doesn't get spent in one budget

1783
01:06:27,599 --> 01:06:28,000
year.

1784
01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:29,119
>> Yes. Thank you. [laughter]

1785
01:06:29,119 --> 01:06:30,400
>> Yeah, exactly.

1786
01:06:30,400 --> 01:06:31,119
>> Okay.

1787
01:06:31,119 --> 01:06:32,559
>> And then maybe explaining how some

1788
01:06:32,559 --> 01:06:34,799
projects might carry over into a second

1789
01:06:34,799 --> 01:06:36,799
fiscal year so it's we can make a more

1790
01:06:36,799 --> 01:06:37,680
informed decision.

1791
01:06:37,680 --> 01:06:38,160
>> Yeah.

1792
01:06:38,160 --> 01:06:39,599
>> Shane, does any of this come from the

1793
01:06:39,599 --> 01:06:41,839
capital projects fund or not?

1794
01:06:41,839 --> 01:06:42,799
>> The orange.

1795
01:06:42,799 --> 01:06:43,760
>> Yes.

1796
01:06:43,760 --> 01:06:44,079
>> Okay.

1797
01:06:44,079 --> 01:06:45,359
>> The bulk of it will be coming from

1798
01:06:45,359 --> 01:06:45,760
capital

1799
01:06:45,760 --> 01:06:47,920
>> dark orange. The third column in the

1800
01:06:47,920 --> 01:06:49,920
dark orange is capital.

1801
01:06:49,920 --> 01:06:51,440
>> That's what I was saying. Right now at

1802
01:06:51,440 --> 01:06:53,280
the bottom it says it has a $10 million

1803
01:06:53,280 --> 01:06:54,960
balance, but by the time we're done with

1804
01:06:54,960 --> 01:06:57,359
these projects, we're have spent four of

1805
01:06:57,359 --> 01:06:59,599
that 10, which is nearly half. We've

1806
01:06:59,599 --> 01:07:01,119
been saving up.

1807
01:07:01,119 --> 01:07:03,599
>> But won't those be noted? Like those

1808
01:07:03,599 --> 01:07:05,440
these are earmarked. So even though we

1809
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:07,680
see 10, it's really, you know, to your

1810
01:07:07,680 --> 01:07:09,039
point six because we've already

1811
01:07:09,039 --> 01:07:10,000
earmarked four.

1812
01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:10,400
>> Yes.

1813
01:07:10,400 --> 01:07:12,799
>> Okay. Yeah.

1814
01:07:12,799 --> 01:07:16,000
But if if you know if there's any of

1815
01:07:16,000 --> 01:07:18,880
these projects that aren't in yellow

1816
01:07:18,880 --> 01:07:20,480
that are a concern, you know, we don't

1817
01:07:20,480 --> 01:07:22,000
think that's priority and should be on

1818
01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:24,240
here. I would like to know that.

1819
01:07:24,240 --> 01:07:25,520
>> I just have one question about the

1820
01:07:25,520 --> 01:07:27,119
surveillance cameras. Yes.

1821
01:07:27,119 --> 01:07:29,680
>> How I don't I just don't have much of a

1822
01:07:29,680 --> 01:07:31,599
context for that. Is there a great need

1823
01:07:31,599 --> 01:07:32,960
for that?

1824
01:07:32,960 --> 01:07:36,400
>> There has been. Um, we haven't went all

1825
01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:39,280
in because our internet service isn't

1826
01:07:39,280 --> 01:07:42,160
fantastic and so the parks that we have

1827
01:07:42,160 --> 01:07:45,200
them at, it's fairly cumbersome to try

1828
01:07:45,200 --> 01:07:47,839
to go back and find an issue when it

1829
01:07:47,839 --> 01:07:50,480
happened or potentially who did it. Um,

1830
01:07:50,480 --> 01:07:53,359
I was actually at a training today on

1831
01:07:53,359 --> 01:07:56,160
that and and I talked to a guy from

1832
01:07:56,160 --> 01:07:58,400
Hooper Water, Hooper, I think that's how

1833
01:07:58,400 --> 01:08:01,760
they say it. Anyway, uh,

1834
01:08:01,760 --> 01:08:04,480
he he actually they had the same issue.

1835
01:08:04,480 --> 01:08:07,760
We're we're using Verizon cradle points

1836
01:08:07,760 --> 01:08:10,160
at these locations and they had the same

1837
01:08:10,160 --> 01:08:11,760
issue.

1838
01:08:11,760 --> 01:08:14,480
He said they talked to their Verizon rep

1839
01:08:14,480 --> 01:08:16,560
and they got better service and the cost

1840
01:08:16,560 --> 01:08:18,400
came down. He said it makes no sense

1841
01:08:18,400 --> 01:08:20,480
whatsoever, but he says ever since we

1842
01:08:20,480 --> 01:08:23,120
did that, um things have worked better

1843
01:08:23,120 --> 01:08:25,359
for them. So, we've actually been

1844
01:08:25,359 --> 01:08:28,159
working also with Centricom to try to

1845
01:08:28,159 --> 01:08:30,719
get a cost to get fiber into some of

1846
01:08:30,719 --> 01:08:33,759
these uh larger parks. Um, but they

1847
01:08:33,759 --> 01:08:36,400
haven't came up with that number yet.

1848
01:08:36,400 --> 01:08:38,640
So, we'll continue to work on that. So,

1849
01:08:38,640 --> 01:08:41,199
I didn't want to like totally expand

1850
01:08:41,199 --> 01:08:45,359
that system and have these ongoing costs

1851
01:08:45,359 --> 01:08:46,640
that

1852
01:08:46,640 --> 01:08:48,239
>> aren't working.

1853
01:08:48,239 --> 01:08:50,000
>> The reason that we went with that is

1854
01:08:50,000 --> 01:08:52,799
every year we have issues with vandalism

1855
01:08:52,799 --> 01:08:55,839
and um they're just not traceable unless

1856
01:08:55,839 --> 01:08:58,000
there are. And as I've talked to the

1857
01:08:58,000 --> 01:09:02,960
cities in Utah, most of them have cameas

1858
01:09:02,960 --> 01:09:05,600
and um very high definition cameras in

1859
01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:07,440
their parks just because they're running

1860
01:09:07,440 --> 01:09:09,040
into the same thing. Cedar Hills last

1861
01:09:09,040 --> 01:09:10,719
year they had a huge case where they set

1862
01:09:10,719 --> 01:09:13,440
off fireworks and um caused like

1863
01:09:13,440 --> 01:09:16,239
$300,000 worth of damage to their park

1864
01:09:16,239 --> 01:09:18,400
>> and um but they had the cameras and they

1865
01:09:18,400 --> 01:09:20,560
were able to track the kids down.

1866
01:09:20,560 --> 01:09:22,799
>> But for example, we had I think $40,000

1867
01:09:22,799 --> 01:09:24,480
in the budget this year. We haven't

1868
01:09:24,480 --> 01:09:27,520
spent any of that yet because like these

1869
01:09:27,520 --> 01:09:29,279
cradle points, they're

1870
01:09:29,279 --> 01:09:32,000
>> they definitely add to our our constant

1871
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:34,159
monthly expenses

1872
01:09:34,159 --> 01:09:36,159
>> and I didn't want to pile that on until

1873
01:09:36,159 --> 01:09:37,759
we're really getting the benefit from

1874
01:09:37,759 --> 01:09:38,080
it.

1875
01:09:38,080 --> 01:09:39,279
>> What about Starlink?

1876
01:09:39,279 --> 01:09:41,920
>> Yeah, I was going to say maybe Starlink,

1877
01:09:41,920 --> 01:09:44,159
>> but then I've heard when it's

1878
01:09:44,159 --> 01:09:45,520
>> a bad storm, they don't work out,

1879
01:09:45,520 --> 01:09:47,040
>> you guys. But usually we have issues in

1880
01:09:47,040 --> 01:09:48,400
the summertime and so

1881
01:09:48,400 --> 01:09:51,040
>> vandalism during a big storm. [laughter]

1882
01:09:51,040 --> 01:09:51,839
>> Yeah, because

1883
01:09:51,839 --> 01:09:53,600
>> that's true. I know with our Starlink

1884
01:09:53,600 --> 01:09:55,679
when we had it, it was more issues with

1885
01:09:55,679 --> 01:09:56,480
snow.

1886
01:09:56,480 --> 01:09:57,040
>> Yeah.

1887
01:09:57,040 --> 01:09:59,920
>> Um or trees, you know, physical

1888
01:09:59,920 --> 01:10:02,480
obstructions. Um I'm Yeah, when you were

1889
01:10:02,480 --> 01:10:03,679
saying that I was like I I didn't

1890
01:10:03,679 --> 01:10:05,679
realize that we're using Verizon CD

1891
01:10:05,679 --> 01:10:07,600
points, but I'm wondering if we switched

1892
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:09,679
to Starlink

1893
01:10:09,679 --> 01:10:11,360
if um

1894
01:10:11,360 --> 01:10:12,320
>> if it would be better.

1895
01:10:12,320 --> 01:10:13,760
>> Is there anything else you need though

1896
01:10:13,760 --> 01:10:14,400
from us?

1897
01:10:14,400 --> 01:10:16,640
>> No, I think I have enough information to

1898
01:10:16,640 --> 01:10:19,600
take this to the next step. um as long

1899
01:10:19,600 --> 01:10:23,280
as you're okay with these regular

1900
01:10:23,280 --> 01:10:25,120
projects and maintenance items we have

1901
01:10:25,120 --> 01:10:26,960
in there. And you know, if we need to

1902
01:10:26,960 --> 01:10:29,520
down the road, we can adjust the the

1903
01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:32,080
funding level to those to make things

1904
01:10:32,080 --> 01:10:32,640
work. But

1905
01:10:32,640 --> 01:10:35,040
>> I I obviously we love the yellow ones

1906
01:10:35,040 --> 01:10:36,480
and no one has brought up the raccoon

1907
01:10:36,480 --> 01:10:39,360
pine for 200 for $2,835.

1908
01:10:39,360 --> 01:10:40,880
I just want to make sure that gets some

1909
01:10:40,880 --> 01:10:41,920
notice.

1910
01:10:41,920 --> 01:10:44,239
>> Well, we can rank it. You'll know how we

1911
01:10:44,239 --> 01:10:44,960
all really feel.

1912
01:10:44,960 --> 01:10:46,719
>> But well, hold on. I was a joke. The

1913
01:10:46,719 --> 01:10:48,080
real thing is u I have had a lot of

1914
01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:50,000
residents bring up concerns about

1915
01:10:50,000 --> 01:10:51,679
surveillance cameras. So if they're in

1916
01:10:51,679 --> 01:10:53,440
the parks, I think that's one thing.

1917
01:10:53,440 --> 01:10:54,960
They don't like them tracking their

1918
01:10:54,960 --> 01:10:56,800
cars. They brought that up several

1919
01:10:56,800 --> 01:10:58,800
times. I was like, "We have cameras. I

1920
01:10:58,800 --> 01:11:00,960
didn't even know we had them." And so

1921
01:11:00,960 --> 01:11:02,640
that was brought up several times

1922
01:11:02,640 --> 01:11:04,159
saying, "Do you know about the cameras?

1923
01:11:04,159 --> 01:11:06,640
How can we get rid of them?" And I said,

1924
01:11:06,640 --> 01:11:08,640
"I didn't even know we had cameras." Uh

1925
01:11:08,640 --> 01:11:12,000
and so they're not fans of them tracing

1926
01:11:12,000 --> 01:11:12,480
them.

1927
01:11:12,480 --> 01:11:14,400
>> We do have a long agenda. Can we just

1928
01:11:14,400 --> 01:11:16,000
move on? Wait, that that was like one

1929
01:11:16,000 --> 01:11:17,520
concern of a resident. He asked if there

1930
01:11:17,520 --> 01:11:18,239
were any issues.

1931
01:11:18,239 --> 01:11:20,080
>> It's not on the agenda right now. So,

1932
01:11:20,080 --> 01:11:22,480
let's move on and agenda.

1933
01:11:22,480 --> 01:11:24,320
>> The cameras are the surveillance cameras

1934
01:11:24,320 --> 01:11:26,640
for city properties are on the agenda.

1935
01:11:26,640 --> 01:11:29,120
>> This is for the parks. The surveillance

1936
01:11:29,120 --> 01:11:30,400
cameras that you're talking about are

1937
01:11:30,400 --> 01:11:31,360
something totally different.

1938
01:11:31,360 --> 01:11:32,880
>> Well, no one has clarified that, so I'm

1939
01:11:32,880 --> 01:11:35,520
bringing it up right now in the same

1940
01:11:35,520 --> 01:11:38,080
issue of surveillance cameras and the

1941
01:11:38,080 --> 01:11:39,760
residents who pay for these surveillance

1942
01:11:39,760 --> 01:11:41,360
cameras have the right to have their

1943
01:11:41,360 --> 01:11:43,360
voice heard. Andrew, if this is

1944
01:11:43,360 --> 01:11:44,960
something that you want to discuss, you

1945
01:11:44,960 --> 01:11:46,640
know what the policy is and what the

1946
01:11:46,640 --> 01:11:48,080
>> It was a two sentence discussion. There

1947
01:11:48,080 --> 01:11:49,600
was no more to discuss. So, I let him

1948
01:11:49,600 --> 01:11:50,719
something that you want to do, this is

1949
01:11:50,719 --> 01:11:52,400
something that a previous city council

1950
01:11:52,400 --> 01:11:54,000
has voted for. I did not want to do it.

1951
01:11:54,000 --> 01:11:55,600
>> If you want to change it, you know what

1952
01:11:55,600 --> 01:11:57,679
you need to do. Let's move on.

1953
01:11:57,679 --> 01:11:59,280
>> I do have one suggestion, Andrew, that

1954
01:11:59,280 --> 01:12:01,440
you talk with Chief William about how

1955
01:12:01,440 --> 01:12:03,280
that how it's used. So, it's not

1956
01:12:03,280 --> 01:12:04,640
something that they're going to be

1957
01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:06,080
looking at and monitoring people's

1958
01:12:06,080 --> 01:12:08,480
access like people were worried the FBI

1959
01:12:08,480 --> 01:12:09,840
was looking at everyone's library cards

1960
01:12:09,840 --> 01:12:11,040
after 911,

1961
01:12:11,040 --> 01:12:12,000
>> right?

1962
01:12:12,000 --> 01:12:15,840
>> It's it's used specifically to identify

1963
01:12:15,840 --> 01:12:18,080
>> it criminal activity,

1964
01:12:18,080 --> 01:12:19,120
>> right? So, there was no

1965
01:12:19,120 --> 01:12:20,560
>> I would talk to him about it and if you

1966
01:12:20,560 --> 01:12:22,080
still have a concern then we can

1967
01:12:22,080 --> 01:12:23,120
potentially discuss it.

1968
01:12:23,120 --> 01:12:24,560
>> Just last thing, it was not my concern.

1969
01:12:24,560 --> 01:12:25,600
I would just bring it up. That's what

1970
01:12:25,600 --> 01:12:27,520
the residents thought. So, thank you. So

1971
01:12:27,520 --> 01:12:29,920
just to conclude like the plan is is to

1972
01:12:29,920 --> 01:12:32,159
come up with a matrix what the estimated

1973
01:12:32,159 --> 01:12:33,840
budget for each of them where they would

1974
01:12:33,840 --> 01:12:37,280
come from what revenue source or um fund

1975
01:12:37,280 --> 01:12:40,400
balance it would come from and then we

1976
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:42,719
can prioritize and then weigh in and

1977
01:12:42,719 --> 01:12:44,159
eliminate the ones that we

1978
01:12:44,159 --> 01:12:44,480
>> Yes.

1979
01:12:44,480 --> 01:12:45,600
>> Okay. I just want to make sure I

1980
01:12:45,600 --> 01:12:47,360
understood that was the plan.

1981
01:12:47,360 --> 01:12:50,560
>> Yep. That's it. Okay. I think I have

1982
01:12:50,560 --> 01:12:52,560
what I need here.

1983
01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:54,719
>> Did you talk about the PIA bonding

1984
01:12:54,719 --> 01:12:56,800
process or bonding projects? Was that

1985
01:12:56,800 --> 01:12:58,480
the 9 million

1986
01:12:58,480 --> 01:12:59,679
>> the sorry

1987
01:12:59,679 --> 01:13:01,520
>> the PI bonding?

1988
01:13:01,520 --> 01:13:01,840
>> Yes.

1989
01:13:01,840 --> 01:13:03,600
>> Do Okay. So there's nothing more on that

1990
01:13:03,600 --> 01:13:04,640
one. Okay.

1991
01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:07,199
>> No, we'll be bringing more details back

1992
01:13:07,199 --> 01:13:08,080
on that.

1993
01:13:08,080 --> 01:13:08,719
>> Okay. Perfect.

1994
01:13:08,719 --> 01:13:10,159
>> That one will obviously take more

1995
01:13:10,159 --> 01:13:12,480
discussion here. [clears throat]

1996
01:13:12,480 --> 01:13:16,320
>> Okay. Let um is Ryan online? Okay. Hey

1997
01:13:16,320 --> 01:13:19,350
Ryan.

1998
01:13:19,360 --> 01:13:20,960
» Yep. I'm here. Can you guys hear me?

1999
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:21,440
Okay.

2000
01:13:21,440 --> 01:13:24,709
>> Yep.

2001
01:13:24,719 --> 01:13:26,480
» No, it's fine.

2002
01:13:26,480 --> 01:13:30,080
Ryan, if you want to go over um

2003
01:13:30,080 --> 01:13:31,679
the agenda item to review the main

2004
01:13:31,679 --> 01:13:33,280
street and gateway corridor master plan

2005
01:13:33,280 --> 01:13:35,520
a little bit. I think what the feeling

2006
01:13:35,520 --> 01:13:37,920
from council is that we probably want to

2007
01:13:37,920 --> 01:13:39,440
break it up, but let's if you can

2008
01:13:39,440 --> 01:13:42,719
introduce it and then um we can have a

2009
01:13:42,719 --> 01:13:44,400
discussion on it.

2010
01:13:44,400 --> 01:13:46,640
>> Yep. Yep. No, I'm happy to. And if if I

2011
01:13:46,640 --> 01:13:48,480
lose you for a minute, I'm in a I'm in a

2012
01:13:48,480 --> 01:13:50,480
truck leaving a meeting, so sorry about

2013
01:13:50,480 --> 01:13:53,040
that, but bear with me. Yeah. So, and my

2014
01:13:53,040 --> 01:13:55,520
understanding is uh we're not

2015
01:13:55,520 --> 01:13:57,120
necessarily looking for any action item

2016
01:13:57,120 --> 01:14:00,000
tonight. Maybe some some feedback, but

2017
01:14:00,000 --> 01:14:03,040
um so when we most of you I won't go

2018
01:14:03,040 --> 01:14:04,239
into the history of the main street

2019
01:14:04,239 --> 01:14:05,520
master plan because I think we've all

2020
01:14:05,520 --> 01:14:06,880
had you know we're all we're all up to

2021
01:14:06,880 --> 01:14:08,480
speed on that. We were awarded a grant

2022
01:14:08,480 --> 01:14:10,719
to help with our main street master

2023
01:14:10,719 --> 01:14:13,440
plan. Give it some guidelines, some

2024
01:14:13,440 --> 01:14:16,480
vision on on what uh you all wanted it

2025
01:14:16,480 --> 01:14:20,000
to be. And then um the the main street

2026
01:14:20,000 --> 01:14:22,080
and gateway corridors is the the area

2027
01:14:22,080 --> 01:14:26,080
that we that we focused on. Um the

2028
01:14:26,080 --> 01:14:28,239
planning commission, we held multiple

2029
01:14:28,239 --> 01:14:29,679
public hearings on this with the

2030
01:14:29,679 --> 01:14:31,600
planning commission. We held uh we held

2031
01:14:31,600 --> 01:14:33,679
two of those. What they decided to do

2032
01:14:33,679 --> 01:14:35,440
was break it up into sections that were

2033
01:14:35,440 --> 01:14:37,920
relevant to the planning commission and

2034
01:14:37,920 --> 01:14:39,280
then they so we held one at the

2035
01:14:39,280 --> 01:14:40,960
beginning of of the when they first

2036
01:14:40,960 --> 01:14:43,600
reviewed the main street master plan. uh

2037
01:14:43,600 --> 01:14:45,440
and then we broke it down into sections

2038
01:14:45,440 --> 01:14:46,800
and then before they made a final

2039
01:14:46,800 --> 01:14:49,040
recommendation they held another another

2040
01:14:49,040 --> 01:14:52,159
public hearing. So their motions that

2041
01:14:52,159 --> 01:14:54,239
they made throughout these meetings

2042
01:14:54,239 --> 01:14:58,800
process um they uh they're included in

2043
01:14:58,800 --> 01:15:01,360
the in the staff report part of this. Um

2044
01:15:01,360 --> 01:15:03,360
but they they had some changes and some

2045
01:15:03,360 --> 01:15:05,600
edits they wanted to make. The reason

2046
01:15:05,600 --> 01:15:08,080
that the the draft before you does not

2047
01:15:08,080 --> 01:15:10,880
entail all those changes

2048
01:15:10,880 --> 01:15:13,600
um is we get in the contract with the

2049
01:15:13,600 --> 01:15:15,679
consultants that were that were awarded

2050
01:15:15,679 --> 01:15:17,679
this project. We get three rounds of

2051
01:15:17,679 --> 01:15:21,120
edits with them. So we had a a steering

2052
01:15:21,120 --> 01:15:24,480
committee which which uh was the mayor

2053
01:15:24,480 --> 01:15:27,199
uh Chrissy Jessica were also a part of

2054
01:15:27,199 --> 01:15:29,840
that and then we had some residents uh

2055
01:15:29,840 --> 01:15:31,840
feedback on there. they went through a

2056
01:15:31,840 --> 01:15:34,239
round of edits and and uh uh Brent was

2057
01:15:34,239 --> 01:15:36,000
also instrumental in that. He helped a

2058
01:15:36,000 --> 01:15:38,560
lot with with a lot of the the uh

2059
01:15:38,560 --> 01:15:40,719
feedback on that. So, we had one round

2060
01:15:40,719 --> 01:15:43,520
of edits with that group. Uh we gathered

2061
01:15:43,520 --> 01:15:46,320
all the planning commission edits uh and

2062
01:15:46,320 --> 01:15:47,760
sent it to the consultants. So, that'll

2063
01:15:47,760 --> 01:15:50,560
be round two. Uh once they get us that

2064
01:15:50,560 --> 01:15:53,520
final or the the draft with the consult

2065
01:15:53,520 --> 01:15:55,199
or with the planning commission edits in

2066
01:15:55,199 --> 01:15:58,560
them, um it'll come to you guys. you

2067
01:15:58,560 --> 01:16:02,880
guys can suggest edits and and make a motion to do the do the same

2068
01:16:02,880 --> 01:16:05,040
thing. Once we get all those changes,

2069
01:16:05,040 --> 01:16:06,640
we'll send it back to the consultants

2070
01:16:06,640 --> 01:16:12,320
and they'll give us the third round of edits as part of that. So, um the

2071
01:16:12,320 --> 01:16:14,159
process-wise, that's where we at. I just

2072
01:16:14,159 --> 01:16:16,560
want to really emphasize this plan is

2073
01:16:16,560 --> 01:16:18,880
not written in stone. It's not

2074
01:16:18,880 --> 01:16:21,600
suggesting new code that you'll if you

2075
01:16:21,600 --> 01:16:23,679
know if you go through it and it breaks

2076
01:16:23,679 --> 01:16:25,920
it up into into I think we call them

2077
01:16:25,920 --> 01:16:29,040
planning districts. So, it'll break up

2078
01:16:29,040 --> 01:16:31,199
elements of the, you know, the Alpine

2079
01:16:31,199 --> 01:16:34,560
Highway, Canyon Crest, Main Street. Uh,

2080
01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:37,520
it'll it'll break those up uh into into

2081
01:16:37,520 --> 01:16:40,080
these kind of planning districts. It's

2082
01:16:40,080 --> 01:16:42,400
not proposing new code. It's not doing

2083
01:16:42,400 --> 01:16:45,280
any of that. This is a planning document

2084
01:16:45,280 --> 01:16:48,320
of where does, and I I use this term too

2085
01:16:48,320 --> 01:16:50,239
much, so I apologize, but where does

2086
01:16:50,239 --> 01:16:52,000
Alpine want to see the Main Street and

2087
01:16:52,000 --> 01:16:54,000
Gateway Corridor plans when it grows up,

2088
01:16:54,000 --> 01:16:55,520
right? Who who do we want to be when we

2089
01:16:55,520 --> 01:16:58,239
grow up? It's funny, a town that's 175

2090
01:16:58,239 --> 01:16:59,920
year old as we say growing up, but

2091
01:16:59,920 --> 01:17:01,360
that's that's the best phrase I've come

2092
01:17:01,360 --> 01:17:04,880
up with. So, um, so yeah, this is just a

2093
01:17:04,880 --> 01:17:07,040
visioning document. It's kind of to help

2094
01:17:07,040 --> 01:17:09,520
us if if new proposals come in or or

2095
01:17:09,520 --> 01:17:10,560
identify, hey, you know what, this is

2096
01:17:10,560 --> 01:17:11,679
where we want to see this kind of

2097
01:17:11,679 --> 01:17:13,520
commercial. This is where we want to see

2098
01:17:13,520 --> 01:17:15,920
this kind of housing along these uh

2099
01:17:15,920 --> 01:17:18,239
major transportation corridors within

2100
01:17:18,239 --> 01:17:21,360
the city. That's all it's meant to be.

2101
01:17:21,360 --> 01:17:23,040
uh just to give you guys and the

2102
01:17:23,040 --> 01:17:24,960
planning commission when when projects

2103
01:17:24,960 --> 01:17:27,600
come in some some feedback and some

2104
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:29,600
visioning of saying hey we as a

2105
01:17:29,600 --> 01:17:31,280
community we spoke with residents we

2106
01:17:31,280 --> 01:17:34,159
gave everyone ample opportunities to to

2107
01:17:34,159 --> 01:17:36,480
have their voices heard and this is the

2108
01:17:36,480 --> 01:17:38,400
vision that we have for the community.

2109
01:17:38,400 --> 01:17:39,840
If something comes in that doesn't fall

2110
01:17:39,840 --> 01:17:42,880
within that that vision or that you know

2111
01:17:42,880 --> 01:17:44,960
we've identified

2112
01:17:44,960 --> 01:17:46,880
you guys or future councils are well

2113
01:17:46,880 --> 01:17:49,360
within your right to say yes this wasn't

2114
01:17:49,360 --> 01:17:52,640
identified but we we think it's a good a

2115
01:17:52,640 --> 01:17:54,239
good thing that maybe just didn't didn't

2116
01:17:54,239 --> 01:17:56,560
get included in that. So that's all it

2117
01:17:56,560 --> 01:17:59,679
is. We're so close. I think this it's my

2118
01:17:59,679 --> 01:18:01,760
fault that it's dragged out so long, but

2119
01:18:01,760 --> 01:18:03,840
I think we're pretty close to to

2120
01:18:03,840 --> 01:18:06,159
finishing it up. Uh we're just we're

2121
01:18:06,159 --> 01:18:08,080
just at the process where you guys now

2122
01:18:08,080 --> 01:18:11,120
uh get your say in the final final uh

2123
01:18:11,120 --> 01:18:13,360
review of it. So happy to take any

2124
01:18:13,360 --> 01:18:15,440
questions or anything, but I think we're

2125
01:18:15,440 --> 01:18:18,000
still waiting for that uh second edit to

2126
01:18:18,000 --> 01:18:20,239
come back from the consultants before we

2127
01:18:20,239 --> 01:18:22,960
officially have it on the agenda. Uh

2128
01:18:22,960 --> 01:18:24,800
happy to take any questions or if I I

2129
01:18:24,800 --> 01:18:26,480
missed anything, happy to happy to go

2130
01:18:26,480 --> 01:18:30,950
over that as well.

2131
01:18:30,960 --> 01:18:34,080
» I have a question about the process. So,

2132
01:18:34,080 --> 01:18:36,800
you said we're using our second edit to

2133
01:18:36,800 --> 01:18:39,520
take back the planning commission

2134
01:18:39,520 --> 01:18:42,239
>> um feedback for them to change it.

2135
01:18:42,239 --> 01:18:44,960
>> My understanding is we should

2136
01:18:44,960 --> 01:18:47,600
>> as a city council review the

2137
01:18:47,600 --> 01:18:49,360
recommendations from planning commission

2138
01:18:49,360 --> 01:18:52,400
before they become a permanent change to

2139
01:18:52,400 --> 01:18:55,040
the document.

2140
01:18:55,040 --> 01:18:56,400
>> Yeah. And that's that's something you

2141
01:18:56,400 --> 01:18:58,000
can you can do that as well if you'd

2142
01:18:58,000 --> 01:19:00,560
like. Um, I don't think the consultants

2143
01:19:00,560 --> 01:19:03,199
I sent the review to the consultants.

2144
01:19:03,199 --> 01:19:04,560
Uh, I don't know if they've gotten too

2145
01:19:04,560 --> 01:19:06,719
far on it yet, but if that's something

2146
01:19:06,719 --> 01:19:08,000
you guys want to do, that's that's

2147
01:19:08,000 --> 01:19:10,960
totally fine as well.

2148
01:19:10,960 --> 01:19:12,640
>> Yeah, there weren't that many, so maybe

2149
01:19:12,640 --> 01:19:15,840
we can just look at their changes

2150
01:19:15,840 --> 01:19:17,199
rather than trying to stop the process.

2151
01:19:17,199 --> 01:19:19,199
I don't I mean, didn't sound like there

2152
01:19:19,199 --> 01:19:21,600
that many changes they recommended.

2153
01:19:21,600 --> 01:19:24,159
Yeah, I think um

2154
01:19:24,159 --> 01:19:25,760
because [clears throat]

2155
01:19:25,760 --> 01:19:27,600
as I understand it, Ryan, you can help

2156
01:19:27,600 --> 01:19:29,040
me remember because this has been a long

2157
01:19:29,040 --> 01:19:30,080
process. Yep.

2158
01:19:30,080 --> 01:19:32,640
>> That um I have notes from this exact

2159
01:19:32,640 --> 01:19:36,320
same document that we gave feedback to

2160
01:19:36,320 --> 01:19:39,920
the consultants um and I'm looking at

2161
01:19:39,920 --> 01:19:43,040
the exact same document um that the

2162
01:19:43,040 --> 01:19:45,040
planning commission saw as a steering

2163
01:19:45,040 --> 01:19:47,199
committee. We gave them feedback and

2164
01:19:47,199 --> 01:19:49,440
then it went to planning commission and

2165
01:19:49,440 --> 01:19:51,760
so like where there's actually two sets

2166
01:19:51,760 --> 01:19:53,679
of feedback that need to be incorporated

2167
01:19:53,679 --> 01:19:57,440
into this and council feedback and then

2168
01:19:57,440 --> 01:19:59,520
that that will be the final version,

2169
01:19:59,520 --> 01:20:01,040
right?

2170
01:20:01,040 --> 01:20:03,280
>> Yeah. Yep. Yep.

2171
01:20:03,280 --> 01:20:05,440
>> So like everything that the steering

2172
01:20:05,440 --> 01:20:07,199
committee talked about did not is not

2173
01:20:07,199 --> 01:20:09,840
yet even seen in this document yet. It's

2174
01:20:09,840 --> 01:20:12,560
they're minor. They're minor, but and I

2175
01:20:12,560 --> 01:20:13,920
feel like the planning commission is

2176
01:20:13,920 --> 01:20:16,719
minor as well, but I agree with Jessica

2177
01:20:16,719 --> 01:20:19,199
that we we sort of we're at this stage

2178
01:20:19,199 --> 01:20:21,920
where we they need a kind of like Shane

2179
01:20:21,920 --> 01:20:24,080
forced us to like freeze, you know, say

2180
01:20:24,080 --> 01:20:25,679
we need to go out of jello stage and

2181
01:20:25,679 --> 01:20:28,000
like make it hard, right? So, we're sort

2182
01:20:28,000 --> 01:20:30,480
of in the jello stage still where we can

2183
01:20:30,480 --> 01:20:32,719
change things. They're minor, you know,

2184
01:20:32,719 --> 01:20:35,360
but they're there. And then then the

2185
01:20:35,360 --> 01:20:38,880
last draft is their final. Is that am I

2186
01:20:38,880 --> 01:20:40,719
understanding that?

2187
01:20:40,719 --> 01:20:42,640
>> Yeah. And my my understanding as well is

2188
01:20:42,640 --> 01:20:44,480
those those changes from the steering

2189
01:20:44,480 --> 01:20:46,480
committee should have already been made.

2190
01:20:46,480 --> 01:20:48,000
I mean should have should have already

2191
01:20:48,000 --> 01:20:49,840
been shown in that draft like the the

2192
01:20:49,840 --> 01:20:51,199
draft that went to the planning

2193
01:20:51,199 --> 01:20:54,080
commission should have shown those

2194
01:20:54,080 --> 01:20:58,480
recommendation those changes from the steering committee if that

2195
01:20:58,480 --> 01:21:01,520
makes sense. Um like if you'll if you

2196
01:21:01,520 --> 01:21:03,280
look one of the one of the areas is one

2197
01:21:03,280 --> 01:21:04,719
of the things we looked at is a steering

2198
01:21:04,719 --> 01:21:08,719
committee is the area kind of between

2199
01:21:08,719 --> 01:21:11,040
uh the the I guess the church owns it

2200
01:21:11,040 --> 01:21:14,080
now that that field there on the on the

2201
01:21:14,080 --> 01:21:16,880
side of of Alpine Highway on the north

2202
01:21:16,880 --> 01:21:20,159
side going to the art center. One of the

2203
01:21:20,159 --> 01:21:21,280
things that the steering committee

2204
01:21:21,280 --> 01:21:23,040
recommended is having that be a

2205
01:21:23,040 --> 01:21:26,239
transitional zone going from residential

2206
01:21:26,239 --> 01:21:27,840
going into the commercial along Main

2207
01:21:27,840 --> 01:21:29,760
Street that we see there. There's a

2208
01:21:29,760 --> 01:21:32,239
similar zone on the north end of Main

2209
01:21:32,239 --> 01:21:34,080
Street that's meant to be a transitional

2210
01:21:34,080 --> 01:21:37,280
from um going from commercial back to

2211
01:21:37,280 --> 01:21:38,719
residential. So like that's what

2212
01:21:38,719 --> 01:21:39,760
changes.

2213
01:21:39,760 --> 01:21:42,000
>> But Ryan, no. What I'm saying is like

2214
01:21:42,000 --> 01:21:44,800
that we took that recommendation

2215
01:21:44,800 --> 01:21:46,640
to the public and that's why they have

2216
01:21:46,640 --> 01:21:48,400
the jars there because we already took

2217
01:21:48,400 --> 01:21:49,920
that to the public

2218
01:21:49,920 --> 01:21:51,920
>> and then they came back and like nothing

2219
01:21:51,920 --> 01:21:53,600
had been really written up and then we

2220
01:21:53,600 --> 01:21:57,920
got this document dated November 2025

2221
01:21:57,920 --> 01:22:00,080
>> and after we gave us this to the

2222
01:22:00,080 --> 01:22:01,520
steering committee and I have notes in

2223
01:22:01,520 --> 01:22:04,880
here of things I'd like to you know just

2224
01:22:04,880 --> 01:22:07,600
it wasn't significant but this is the

2225
01:22:07,600 --> 01:22:09,520
exact same document I already gave them

2226
01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:11,920
feedback on.

2227
01:22:11,920 --> 01:22:13,360
>> Yeah, it shouldn't it shouldn't have

2228
01:22:13,360 --> 01:22:14,960
been. It should have been the ones that

2229
01:22:14,960 --> 01:22:17,280
had the steering committees changes in

2230
01:22:17,280 --> 01:22:17,840
there,

2231
01:22:17,840 --> 01:22:23,199
>> but I'm not I'm not talking about this stuff here because

2232
01:22:23,199 --> 01:22:25,520
we brought that all to the public and so

2233
01:22:25,520 --> 01:22:27,520
that wasn't even in the final like

2234
01:22:27,520 --> 01:22:29,199
nothing had even been written up at that

2235
01:22:29,199 --> 01:22:30,560
point when we brought this all to the

2236
01:22:30,560 --> 01:22:31,840
public.

2237
01:22:31,840 --> 01:22:33,679
>> Right. Right. Yep. You're right on that.

2238
01:22:33,679 --> 01:22:36,000
Yep. Yep.

2239
01:22:36,000 --> 01:22:38,320
>> Okay. And Ryan, if it's possible, maybe

2240
01:22:38,320 --> 01:22:40,480
they could do just a red line edit copy

2241
01:22:40,480 --> 01:22:42,800
for us so we can see the changes that

2242
01:22:42,800 --> 01:22:43,440
were made.

2243
01:22:43,440 --> 01:22:44,400
>> Yeah, that's a great idea.

2244
01:22:44,400 --> 01:22:46,000
>> Yep, that's a great idea. That's a great

2245
01:22:46,000 --> 01:22:48,159
idea. Yep, that's what we do on all all,

2246
01:22:48,159 --> 01:22:49,679
you know, code changes. So, I think I

2247
01:22:49,679 --> 01:22:51,199
think that's a great idea. Yep. I can we

2248
01:22:51,199 --> 01:22:54,000
can run that by him as well.

2249
01:22:54,000 --> 01:22:57,840
>> Okay. So, um as just as the um planning

2250
01:22:57,840 --> 01:22:59,840
commission broke it up, having like I

2251
01:22:59,840 --> 01:23:01,679
said, this has been a long process. So I

2252
01:23:01,679 --> 01:23:04,320
don't feel like we could give it justice

2253
01:23:04,320 --> 01:23:05,840
because it really has been resident

2254
01:23:05,840 --> 01:23:08,560
driven. Um the hiring of the committee

2255
01:23:08,560 --> 01:23:11,440
or the hiring of the professionals was

2256
01:23:11,440 --> 01:23:13,600
um something that was supported by our

2257
01:23:13,600 --> 01:23:16,800
residents and we applied for a grant and

2258
01:23:16,800 --> 01:23:19,360
got that and we the residents have been

2259
01:23:19,360 --> 01:23:21,679
very involved with this whole process.

2260
01:23:21,679 --> 01:23:24,000
So I I don't feel like we can fully

2261
01:23:24,000 --> 01:23:26,560
absorb all the information and feedback

2262
01:23:26,560 --> 01:23:29,440
that um has gone on through all the

2263
01:23:29,440 --> 01:23:32,480
sharets and many you know committee

2264
01:23:32,480 --> 01:23:34,560
meetings and stuff in one meeting

2265
01:23:34,560 --> 01:23:36,239
otherwise we're not going to go to bed

2266
01:23:36,239 --> 01:23:38,880
tonight. So I was thinking of dividing

2267
01:23:38,880 --> 01:23:41,199
it up into three parts and I was

2268
01:23:41,199 --> 01:23:43,920
thinking um just looking at the uh if

2269
01:23:43,920 --> 01:23:53,750
you could go to the um table of contents

2270
01:23:53,760 --> 01:23:56,400
Okay, thank you. Right there. So, the

2271
01:23:56,400 --> 01:23:58,800
first part, the first two bold items are

2272
01:23:58,800 --> 01:24:00,639
a vision for Alpine City's gateway

2273
01:24:00,639 --> 01:24:03,199
corridors and Alpine City Gateway

2274
01:24:03,199 --> 01:24:05,840
Corridors today. So, we'd understand

2275
01:24:05,840 --> 01:24:08,159
sort of what was driving this project

2276
01:24:08,159 --> 01:24:10,560
was understanding where we are today.

2277
01:24:10,560 --> 01:24:13,760
And then um we could look at also

2278
01:24:13,760 --> 01:24:16,800
appendix um one and uh I'm sorry

2279
01:24:16,800 --> 01:24:20,239
appendix A and appendix C which helps

2280
01:24:20,239 --> 01:24:24,080
like say this is where we are and then

2281
01:24:24,080 --> 01:24:26,480
uh that feedback is what kind of

2282
01:24:26,480 --> 01:24:28,320
develops some three three different

2283
01:24:28,320 --> 01:24:31,723
tools. Um one of the most important

2284
01:24:31,723 --> 01:24:33,040
[clears throat] tools is land use

2285
01:24:33,040 --> 01:24:35,120
because as Andrew likes to tell us it

2286
01:24:35,120 --> 01:24:37,520
will outlive us all. And then the second

2287
01:24:37,520 --> 01:24:42,800
tool um was uh see there was land use.

2288
01:24:42,800 --> 01:24:44,560
Yes. And then traffic management was

2289
01:24:44,560 --> 01:24:47,440
another tool. And then another tool was

2290
01:24:47,440 --> 01:24:50,480
these uh design guidelines. And I don't

2291
01:24:50,480 --> 01:24:52,719
know um based on the quantity of

2292
01:24:52,719 --> 01:24:54,800
information being presented if we could

2293
01:24:54,800 --> 01:24:56,960
take one meeting to just do that what

2294
01:24:56,960 --> 01:24:59,600
how do we get here like why did we even

2295
01:24:59,600 --> 01:25:01,760
want this project in the first place?

2296
01:25:01,760 --> 01:25:03,600
And then the second is what are the um

2297
01:25:03,600 --> 01:25:05,440
and understand the issues we are trying

2298
01:25:05,440 --> 01:25:07,679
to address. And then number the second

2299
01:25:07,679 --> 01:25:09,840
thing would break these um tools that

2300
01:25:09,840 --> 01:25:12,719
we've been given into two meetings. And

2301
01:25:12,719 --> 01:25:16,480
then the um just because traffic itself

2302
01:25:16,480 --> 01:25:21,520
is a big big part of this plan. And then

2303
01:25:21,520 --> 01:25:25,040
um at the final meeting, we could take

2304
01:25:25,040 --> 01:25:27,120
all the feedback we got from planning

2305
01:25:27,120 --> 01:25:29,760
commission and from the city council and

2306
01:25:29,760 --> 01:25:32,880
give them specific things to change.

2307
01:25:32,880 --> 01:25:36,320
But that's kind of what I was thinking.

2308
01:25:36,320 --> 01:25:36,880
>> So how many

2309
01:25:36,880 --> 01:25:38,800
>> is that is that too long? Is does that

2310
01:25:38,800 --> 01:25:39,920
take too long?

2311
01:25:39,920 --> 01:25:40,320
>> Four.

2312
01:25:40,320 --> 01:25:41,120
meetings,

2313
01:25:41,120 --> 01:25:44,000
>> including Well,

2314
01:25:44,000 --> 01:25:45,520
no, I was including today.

2315
01:25:45,520 --> 01:25:47,040
>> Oh, so today is just kind of an overview

2316
01:25:47,040 --> 01:25:48,960
and making a decision on how to review

2317
01:25:48,960 --> 01:25:51,360
it going forward. Well, and also we

2318
01:25:51,360 --> 01:25:53,679
could understand what like the existing

2319
01:25:53,679 --> 01:25:55,760
conditions are not new to any of us, but

2320
01:25:55,760 --> 01:25:58,639
just understand like um 1 through 14,

2321
01:25:58,639 --> 01:26:00,480
page 1 through 14.

2322
01:26:00,480 --> 01:26:01,679
>> You want to go through one through 14

2323
01:26:01,679 --> 01:26:02,639
today?

2324
01:26:02,639 --> 01:26:03,120
>> Yeah.

2325
01:26:03,120 --> 01:26:03,920
>> Okay.

2326
01:26:03,920 --> 01:26:04,639
>> Why not?

2327
01:26:04,639 --> 01:26:05,040
>> All right.

2328
01:26:05,040 --> 01:26:07,679
>> And appendix A and C.

2329
01:26:07,679 --> 01:26:10,080
>> Well, and Chrissy, as part of just an

2330
01:26:10,080 --> 01:26:12,880
operation, we did this with our general

2331
01:26:12,880 --> 01:26:14,400
plan and we also did this with the

2332
01:26:14,400 --> 01:26:16,080
conservation easement. We actually had a

2333
01:26:16,080 --> 01:26:18,880
work session before our council meeting.

2334
01:26:18,880 --> 01:26:21,920
>> Oh. So I do think that that was really

2335
01:26:21,920 --> 01:26:22,800
effective.

2336
01:26:22,800 --> 01:26:24,480
>> Okay. Rather than in a meeting.

2337
01:26:24,480 --> 01:26:24,880
>> Yeah,

2338
01:26:24,880 --> 01:26:26,000
>> that would work too.

2339
01:26:26,000 --> 01:26:28,239
>> Anyone interested in those topics, you

2340
01:26:28,239 --> 01:26:29,920
know, it was noticed and can could come

2341
01:26:29,920 --> 01:26:30,800
and listen.

2342
01:26:30,800 --> 01:26:33,360
>> Okay. So having

2343
01:26:33,360 --> 01:26:35,360
doing like all the things I just said in

2344
01:26:35,360 --> 01:26:37,040
a work session rather than breaking it

2345
01:26:37,040 --> 01:26:37,600
up.

2346
01:26:37,600 --> 01:26:39,040
>> Okay. I'm open to that, too.

2347
01:26:39,040 --> 01:26:40,800
>> But in the same order, like chunking it

2348
01:26:40,800 --> 01:26:42,719
like you did. Yeah. So we know be

2349
01:26:42,719 --> 01:26:44,080
prepared. We're going to be talking

2350
01:26:44,080 --> 01:26:45,840
about this section.

2351
01:26:45,840 --> 01:26:47,280
>> Yeah.

2352
01:26:47,280 --> 01:26:50,320
I'm happy to do that, too. I

2353
01:26:50,320 --> 01:26:51,520
thought we were trying to spread it out,

2354
01:26:51,520 --> 01:26:53,280
but I'm I'm flexible.

2355
01:26:53,280 --> 01:26:55,360
>> It's still spread out.

2356
01:26:55,360 --> 01:26:56,880
>> No, I think it's just exactly it would

2357
01:26:56,880 --> 01:27:01,590
be under discussion items, right?

2358
01:27:01,600 --> 01:27:02,480
» Sorry. No,

2359
01:27:02,480 --> 01:27:03,920
>> Jessica said doing a

2360
01:27:03,920 --> 01:27:06,320
>> work session prior to work session or

2361
01:27:06,320 --> 01:27:08,000
discussion item. It's kind of the same

2362
01:27:08,000 --> 01:27:09,679
thing as presentation, right? We're

2363
01:27:09,679 --> 01:27:11,760
going to be learning about it, what it

2364
01:27:11,760 --> 01:27:14,400
is. This is pretty new to both Sarah and

2365
01:27:14,400 --> 01:27:15,760
Andrew, I'm assuming. I'm sure you guys

2366
01:27:15,760 --> 01:27:17,760
have read it, but you know, we wor with

2367
01:27:17,760 --> 01:27:20,960
it last year, so I feel like the four of

2368
01:27:20,960 --> 01:27:22,480
us are pretty familiar with everything.

2369
01:27:22,480 --> 01:27:24,880
We either sat on the committee and

2370
01:27:24,880 --> 01:27:26,239
>> we have Kaden, too. He's

2371
01:27:26,239 --> 01:27:27,360
>> I know Kaden's brand new

2372
01:27:27,360 --> 01:27:28,560
>> and you're going to be like our

2373
01:27:28,560 --> 01:27:30,080
cheerleader for this whole thing.

2374
01:27:30,080 --> 01:27:31,600
>> Whether we call it a work session or

2375
01:27:31,600 --> 01:27:33,440
whether we call it a presentation or a

2376
01:27:33,440 --> 01:27:35,600
discussion item, it's the same thing.

2377
01:27:35,600 --> 01:27:38,000
We'll be discussing that portion of it.

2378
01:27:38,000 --> 01:27:42,000
So, we can um start right now. Um

2379
01:27:42,000 --> 01:27:43,760
>> Wait, is that what Jessica you were

2380
01:27:43,760 --> 01:27:46,080
saying? The way we did it with the

2381
01:27:46,080 --> 01:27:47,520
general plan and the conservation

2382
01:27:47,520 --> 01:27:50,719
easement is we actually held it prior to

2383
01:27:50,719 --> 01:27:53,199
the city council meeting. So do you

2384
01:27:53,199 --> 01:27:54,560
remember when we went through those?

2385
01:27:54,560 --> 01:27:55,840
>> Yeah, because we have all these people

2386
01:27:55,840 --> 01:27:57,679
waiting sitting here waiting for their

2387
01:27:57,679 --> 01:27:59,679
agenda items.

2388
01:27:59,679 --> 01:28:01,120
>> So I was thinking if we did a work

2389
01:28:01,120 --> 01:28:02,639
session like Jessica is saying that

2390
01:28:02,639 --> 01:28:04,480
might be more efficient for everyone

2391
01:28:04,480 --> 01:28:05,280
else,

2392
01:28:05,280 --> 01:28:06,560
>> right? But what I'm saying is whether

2393
01:28:06,560 --> 01:28:08,719
it's called a work session or not,

2394
01:28:08,719 --> 01:28:10,000
>> it's the same thing. we're going to be

2395
01:28:10,000 --> 01:28:11,600
here. Whether we call it a work session

2396
01:28:11,600 --> 01:28:13,840
and then don't start the meeting and I

2397
01:28:13,840 --> 01:28:15,199
don't see us starting before.

2398
01:28:15,199 --> 01:28:16,800
>> Oh, you don't mean doing a work session

2399
01:28:16,800 --> 01:28:18,960
prior to the official meeting.

2400
01:28:18,960 --> 01:28:21,199
>> She's saying do a work call it a work

2401
01:28:21,199 --> 01:28:23,760
session before, but we could just say

2402
01:28:23,760 --> 01:28:25,120
let's do it under reports and

2403
01:28:25,120 --> 01:28:27,199
presentations or actually not report and

2404
01:28:27,199 --> 01:28:28,960
presentations, but probably discussion

2405
01:28:28,960 --> 01:28:32,560
items every meeting and just chunk it

2406
01:28:32,560 --> 01:28:33,440
out

2407
01:28:33,440 --> 01:28:36,320
>> and it'll still be noticed. Um, we could

2408
01:28:36,320 --> 01:28:38,239
just have it at the very beginning of

2409
01:28:38,239 --> 01:28:40,159
the discussion items and have it always

2410
01:28:40,159 --> 01:28:43,440
be item A and say we're going to be

2411
01:28:43,440 --> 01:28:45,440
talking about the Main Street Gateway

2412
01:28:45,440 --> 01:28:48,480
Corridor master plan and for this item

2413
01:28:48,480 --> 01:28:52,000
it will be the, you know, you could say

2414
01:28:52,000 --> 01:28:53,440
when you want to go, we'll talk about

2415
01:28:53,440 --> 01:28:56,400
the Alpine um, we'll do the Alpine Main

2416
01:28:56,400 --> 01:28:58,480
Street and Gateway Corridor, small area

2417
01:28:58,480 --> 01:29:00,960
plan and the land acquisition policy and

2418
01:29:00,960 --> 01:29:02,400
go over that, you know, and that's what

2419
01:29:02,400 --> 01:29:04,400
we'll notice and then we'll go on with

2420
01:29:04,400 --> 01:29:07,910
the rest of our

2421
01:29:07,920 --> 01:29:09,040
Are you opposed to

2422
01:29:09,040 --> 01:29:10,480
>> I'm just I'm looking back at how we

2423
01:29:10,480 --> 01:29:13,040
>> It's just logistics whether you

2424
01:29:13,040 --> 01:29:14,719
logistics I think is the public you know

2425
01:29:14,719 --> 01:29:16,320
the public comes to talk about their

2426
01:29:16,320 --> 01:29:19,360
action items and so it's putting things

2427
01:29:19,360 --> 01:29:21,520
in a way that the public can come and

2428
01:29:21,520 --> 01:29:24,480
participate in in their action items and

2429
01:29:24,480 --> 01:29:27,120
then we can do our work session.

2430
01:29:27,120 --> 01:29:28,560
>> So we could do the work session at the

2431
01:29:28,560 --> 01:29:30,000
end of the meeting.

2432
01:29:30,000 --> 01:29:30,960
>> Yeah, you can do that.

2433
01:29:30,960 --> 01:29:32,639
>> It's the I mean it's semantics. It

2434
01:29:32,639 --> 01:29:34,320
doesn't matter action items and

2435
01:29:34,320 --> 01:29:36,480
discussion items. It's easy to do on the

2436
01:29:36,480 --> 01:29:38,639
>> Let's do that. I think maybe that's a

2437
01:29:38,639 --> 01:29:39,760
better course.

2438
01:29:39,760 --> 01:29:40,880
>> So people are here for particular

2439
01:29:40,880 --> 01:29:43,360
issues.

2440
01:29:43,360 --> 01:29:46,239
>> So um

2441
01:29:46,239 --> 01:29:50,000
>> so I I'd like a motion as far actually

2442
01:29:50,000 --> 01:29:52,159
no this is still a discussion item. So,

2443
01:29:52,159 --> 01:29:54,560
I would like to know

2444
01:29:54,560 --> 01:29:57,360
um as far as council, do you want to

2445
01:29:57,360 --> 01:29:59,920
start off with the first subject today,

2446
01:29:59,920 --> 01:30:02,719
maybe at the end of the meeting

2447
01:30:02,719 --> 01:30:04,880
um so we can proceed with action items

2448
01:30:04,880 --> 01:30:09,120
or do we want to forego that and start

2449
01:30:09,120 --> 01:30:11,600
um at our next meeting? That's really

2450
01:30:11,600 --> 01:30:13,520
what we just need to know. The semantic

2451
01:30:13,520 --> 01:30:15,520
>> is someone prepared to present and talk

2452
01:30:15,520 --> 01:30:17,520
about it?

2453
01:30:17,520 --> 01:30:18,800
this first section

2454
01:30:18,800 --> 01:30:20,880
>> about the first section. I' I'm assuming

2455
01:30:20,880 --> 01:30:23,040
that you guys went over it and I'm sure

2456
01:30:23,040 --> 01:30:25,600
Ryan is here to I mean that's why he's

2457
01:30:25,600 --> 01:30:27,679
online, right? To um

2458
01:30:27,679 --> 01:30:28,800
>> Yep.

2459
01:30:28,800 --> 01:30:29,840
>> So maybe we

2460
01:30:29,840 --> 01:30:30,960
>> lead the discussion. So

2461
01:30:30,960 --> 01:30:32,800
>> maybe we decide to do that, but if we

2462
01:30:32,800 --> 01:30:33,920
run out of time and it's getting too

2463
01:30:33,920 --> 01:30:35,199
late, we can just push it to the next

2464
01:30:35,199 --> 01:30:36,000
meeting.

2465
01:30:36,000 --> 01:30:37,920
>> So we're not here till midnight.

2466
01:30:37,920 --> 01:30:41,840
>> I would be good with that.

2467
01:30:41,840 --> 01:30:44,560
>> So do we need to make a motion to move

2468
01:30:44,560 --> 01:30:47,280
discussion item C?

2469
01:30:47,280 --> 01:30:52,239
um to occur right before staff

2470
01:30:52,239 --> 01:30:55,920
>> B oh right before staff reports

2471
01:30:55,920 --> 01:30:58,239
>> following action items. Is that a motion

2472
01:30:58,239 --> 01:31:00,639
we need to make or can we just make that

2473
01:31:00,639 --> 01:31:03,920
>> agenda new agenda item for the next

2474
01:31:03,920 --> 01:31:05,760
week?

2475
01:31:05,760 --> 01:31:08,320
>> Steve saying yes. What do we do?

2476
01:31:08,320 --> 01:31:09,520
>> We need to have a motion to do

2477
01:31:09,520 --> 01:31:10,960
>> you need a motion if you want to change

2478
01:31:10,960 --> 01:31:11,920
the agenda.

2479
01:31:11,920 --> 01:31:12,480
>> Okay.

2480
01:31:12,480 --> 01:31:13,520
>> And the order.

2481
01:31:13,520 --> 01:31:16,960
>> So I'll entertain a motion. Oh, wait.

2482
01:31:16,960 --> 01:31:19,920
Before you entertain the motion, this is

2483
01:31:19,920 --> 01:31:22,159
pardon being done very unorthodox. We

2484
01:31:22,159 --> 01:31:24,800
brought up a discussion item. Chrissy

2485
01:31:24,800 --> 01:31:27,760
began and no one else really talked. It

2486
01:31:27,760 --> 01:31:30,320
was more just the format. We were all

2487
01:31:30,320 --> 01:31:32,719
told to go through this whole report.

2488
01:31:32,719 --> 01:31:34,159
So, I wrote down notes. I went through

2489
01:31:34,159 --> 01:31:35,440
the whole thing. I went through it as if

2490
01:31:35,440 --> 01:31:36,639
we were going to talk about the whole

2491
01:31:36,639 --> 01:31:38,719
thing. What we've done is we've talked

2492
01:31:38,719 --> 01:31:42,000
about talking about it, which is fine if

2493
01:31:42,000 --> 01:31:43,360
that's what you all want to do. But

2494
01:31:43,360 --> 01:31:46,239
we're just it's it's just it's a little

2495
01:31:46,239 --> 01:31:47,360
hard. Like I'll bring up a thing and

2496
01:31:47,360 --> 01:31:49,280
I'll get like

2497
01:31:49,280 --> 01:31:52,159
plowed over like I'm doing something not

2498
01:31:52,159 --> 01:31:56,400
in legal order and then we just freeilly

2499
01:31:56,400 --> 01:31:59,040
this into whatever we can come up with

2500
01:31:59,040 --> 01:32:01,360
in a moment's notice and we're just

2501
01:32:01,360 --> 01:32:02,719
like, let's make a motion. By the way,

2502
01:32:02,719 --> 01:32:05,440
no one has spoken on it

2503
01:32:05,440 --> 01:32:07,440
>> and that's okay. that I mean you can't

2504
01:32:07,440 --> 01:32:09,120
do that. No, in the meeting if somebody

2505
01:32:09,120 --> 01:32:10,880
wants to make a motion or if I call for

2506
01:32:10,880 --> 01:32:12,159
a motion, we can do that.

2507
01:32:12,159 --> 01:32:13,600
>> I know, but it's also chaos, but no one

2508
01:32:13,600 --> 01:32:14,560
else has spoken.

2509
01:32:14,560 --> 01:32:16,080
>> And I Yeah, I apologize. You were out of

2510
01:32:16,080 --> 01:32:17,840
town yesterday, but when I I didn't have

2511
01:32:17,840 --> 01:32:19,199
time to start looking at the agenda

2512
01:32:19,199 --> 01:32:21,520
until Monday and when I saw this agenda

2513
01:32:21,520 --> 01:32:24,239
item and the writeup, which was minimal,

2514
01:32:24,239 --> 01:32:26,800
and it talked about we haven't even seen

2515
01:32:26,800 --> 01:32:29,600
the changes yet. My recommendation or my

2516
01:32:29,600 --> 01:32:30,719
thought was, hey, can I get some

2517
01:32:30,719 --> 01:32:32,639
clarification? I don't I want to know

2518
01:32:32,639 --> 01:32:34,560
what to prepare for. And that's when we

2519
01:32:34,560 --> 01:32:35,920
had some email exchanges just

2520
01:32:35,920 --> 01:32:37,440
administratively

2521
01:32:37,440 --> 01:32:39,360
on hey this is we're going to probably

2522
01:32:39,360 --> 01:32:41,600
just talk about how we can do this going

2523
01:32:41,600 --> 01:32:42,960
forward, how we can split up the

2524
01:32:42,960 --> 01:32:46,480
discussion. Um so I'm all for having the

2525
01:32:46,480 --> 01:32:48,239
work sessions. It's it's good. I just if

2526
01:32:48,239 --> 01:32:49,360
we're going to talk about it, we could

2527
01:32:49,360 --> 01:32:51,679
do a lot now, but why don't we do what

2528
01:32:51,679 --> 01:32:53,600
the plan what you'd like to do and we

2529
01:32:53,600 --> 01:32:56,159
can come prepared for those pieces you

2530
01:32:56,159 --> 01:32:57,520
want to kind of piece out kind of like

2531
01:32:57,520 --> 01:32:59,280
the planning commission did.

2532
01:32:59,280 --> 01:33:01,280
>> Um and I'm for that. But we did prepare

2533
01:33:01,280 --> 01:33:02,560
and come with a lot of things to bring

2534
01:33:02,560 --> 01:33:03,679
up about it today.

2535
01:33:03,679 --> 01:33:04,960
>> No, for sure. And I'm sure everybody

2536
01:33:04,960 --> 01:33:06,719
has. But I just assume, was everybody

2537
01:33:06,719 --> 01:33:08,719
not included in the email discussion? I

2538
01:33:08,719 --> 01:33:10,080
just assume we were all included.

2539
01:33:10,080 --> 01:33:11,280
>> Yeah, I think everyone was. So, I

2540
01:33:11,280 --> 01:33:11,840
apologize.

2541
01:33:11,840 --> 01:33:13,679
>> I don't This has been in the uh packet

2542
01:33:13,679 --> 01:33:14,880
for weeks. This

2543
01:33:14,880 --> 01:33:18,320
>> No, no, no. I know. But um the I my

2544
01:33:18,320 --> 01:33:20,480
understanding was from the email threads

2545
01:33:20,480 --> 01:33:22,000
because there was no one that said, "No,

2546
01:33:22,000 --> 01:33:23,600
we want to move forward with the entire

2547
01:33:23,600 --> 01:33:26,320
packet or the entire thing." So my

2548
01:33:26,320 --> 01:33:28,719
understanding was from the email threads

2549
01:33:28,719 --> 01:33:31,600
that I read and again I have major jet

2550
01:33:31,600 --> 01:33:34,000
lag but my understanding was that we

2551
01:33:34,000 --> 01:33:35,199
were going to discuss how we were going

2552
01:33:35,199 --> 01:33:36,719
to break it up today and how we would

2553
01:33:36,719 --> 01:33:40,480
move forward that for um in

2554
01:33:40,480 --> 01:33:43,440
consideration of the time and um doing

2555
01:33:43,440 --> 01:33:45,760
other business at hand that we would be

2556
01:33:45,760 --> 01:33:46,719
breaking it up.

2557
01:33:46,719 --> 01:33:51,120
>> Okay. And so that is so um right now I

2558
01:33:51,120 --> 01:33:53,360
feel that or at least my understanding

2559
01:33:53,360 --> 01:33:56,639
is if I'm wrong let me know but I would

2560
01:33:56,639 --> 01:34:01,360
um entertain a motion to move item B to

2561
01:34:01,360 --> 01:34:02,800
um

2562
01:34:02,800 --> 01:34:05,760
>> the end right before staff reports so

2563
01:34:05,760 --> 01:34:08,639
that we can move on to the action items.

2564
01:34:08,639 --> 01:34:11,760
I can make a motion to move discussion

2565
01:34:11,760 --> 01:34:15,920
item B to be after the action items and

2566
01:34:15,920 --> 01:34:18,320
before staff reports

2567
01:34:18,320 --> 01:34:20,560
contingent on whether we have time to do

2568
01:34:20,560 --> 01:34:22,080
so tonight.

2569
01:34:22,080 --> 01:34:24,320
>> Okay. Did you want to put a time on it

2570
01:34:24,320 --> 01:34:26,639
or no? Just

2571
01:34:26,639 --> 01:34:28,639
>> I think we can evaluate it at the time.

2572
01:34:28,639 --> 01:34:29,920
>> Okay, we'll evaluate the time. That

2573
01:34:29,920 --> 01:34:30,400
sounds good.

2574
01:34:30,400 --> 01:34:32,639
>> Okay. Got a motion by Councilman Rmler.

2575
01:34:32,639 --> 01:34:34,080
Is there a second?

2576
01:34:34,080 --> 01:34:35,120
>> I'll second.

2577
01:34:35,120 --> 01:34:36,560
>> It's been seconded by Councilwoman

2578
01:34:36,560 --> 01:34:39,040
Haniman. Is there any discussion on the

2579
01:34:39,040 --> 01:34:39,760
motion?

2580
01:34:39,760 --> 01:34:41,120
>> Now we get to discuss.

2581
01:34:41,120 --> 01:34:43,920
>> I never know. No, I'm okay with it. I'm

2582
01:34:43,920 --> 01:34:46,560
okay. I I I'm I'm I love

2583
01:34:46,560 --> 01:34:48,320
>> Chrissy. I'm I'm sorry, Jessica. Did you

2584
01:34:48,320 --> 01:34:49,040
have anything you want?

2585
01:34:49,040 --> 01:34:50,320
>> I don't have anything to discuss about

2586
01:34:50,320 --> 01:34:51,520
this.

2587
01:34:51,520 --> 01:34:53,679
>> Do you have any um discussion regarding

2588
01:34:53,679 --> 01:34:55,679
>> I was just asking Chrissy how she had

2589
01:34:55,679 --> 01:34:57,600
chunked it just out of curiosity.

2590
01:34:57,600 --> 01:35:00,480
>> We can um get this in writing. Uh and

2591
01:35:00,480 --> 01:35:01,920
Brian would appreciate that too. I'm

2592
01:35:01,920 --> 01:35:04,960
sure Kaden too. But just for tonight

2593
01:35:04,960 --> 01:35:06,560
talking about what's our existing

2594
01:35:06,560 --> 01:35:09,440
situation which is the first two items

2595
01:35:09,440 --> 01:35:12,719
and then if we have time appendex A and

2596
01:35:12,719 --> 01:35:17,120
C but other than that um we don't have

2597
01:35:17,120 --> 01:35:18,880
>> we can see how far we get.

2598
01:35:18,880 --> 01:35:20,960
>> Did you have discussion on the item?

2599
01:35:20,960 --> 01:35:22,320
>> My only word I'll just bring up

2600
01:35:22,320 --> 01:35:24,159
>> the motion. I'm sorry not the item.

2601
01:35:24,159 --> 01:35:26,080
>> Yeah. When we discuss it tonight I'll

2602
01:35:26,080 --> 01:35:28,080
bring up the the good things that

2603
01:35:28,080 --> 01:35:29,600
weren't so great in it.

2604
01:35:29,600 --> 01:35:30,800
>> Want to say anything regarding the

2605
01:35:30,800 --> 01:35:32,800
motion now? Okay. I just have one other

2606
01:35:32,800 --> 01:35:35,440
comment. We'll we'll when we chunk it,

2607
01:35:35,440 --> 01:35:37,679
we would like to be able to see the

2608
01:35:37,679 --> 01:35:40,400
edits or the contribution that planning

2609
01:35:40,400 --> 01:35:41,679
commission made.

2610
01:35:41,679 --> 01:35:43,440
>> Yeah. And a lot of those were from

2611
01:35:43,440 --> 01:35:44,719
coming from planning commission had to

2612
01:35:44,719 --> 01:35:46,800
do with recommendations. So what we're

2613
01:35:46,800 --> 01:35:48,239
covering today has nothing to do with

2614
01:35:48,239 --> 01:35:49,840
recommendations. It's just like where

2615
01:35:49,840 --> 01:35:52,080
are we and like why did we even start

2616
01:35:52,080 --> 01:35:53,120
this project?

2617
01:35:53,120 --> 01:35:54,960
>> But for the future sessions to have

2618
01:35:54,960 --> 01:35:55,760
those red lines.

2619
01:35:55,760 --> 01:35:57,199
>> Yes. No. I thought that was a great

2620
01:35:57,199 --> 01:35:58,000
idea.

2621
01:35:58,000 --> 01:35:58,480
>> Okay. Great.

2622
01:35:58,480 --> 01:35:59,760
>> Okay. Let's proceed with a roll call

2623
01:35:59,760 --> 01:36:01,840
vote. Jessica Kosan. Yes.

2624
01:36:01,840 --> 01:36:02,960
>> Sarah Blackwell. Yes.

2625
01:36:02,960 --> 01:36:04,000
>> Gracie Henman. Yes.

2626
01:36:04,000 --> 01:36:06,800
>> Andrew Young. Yes. Brandon Rama. Yes.

2627
01:36:06,800 --> 01:36:09,830
>> Okay.

2628
01:36:09,840 --> 01:36:11,760
» I I love the plan. I love it.

2629
01:36:11,760 --> 01:36:14,639
>> Let's move on to item C. I'm sorry.

2630
01:36:14,639 --> 01:36:15,199
>> That's good.

2631
01:36:15,199 --> 01:36:19,199
>> Item six, which is action items. Um we

2632
01:36:19,199 --> 01:36:22,880
will be the item A is um the

2633
01:36:22,880 --> 01:36:25,520
reconstruction of a non-conforming

2634
01:36:25,520 --> 01:36:29,840
building on 480 East and 100 South.

2635
01:36:29,840 --> 01:36:31,840
>> Is that you, Shane? Yeah, I'll take this

2636
01:36:31,840 --> 01:36:35,199
one. So, uh, the applicant, uh, Corey

2637
01:36:35,199 --> 01:36:37,520
Fabian purchased this property of 480

2638
01:36:37,520 --> 01:36:40,092
East 100 South.

2639
01:36:40,092 --> 01:36:42,320
[clears throat] Um, it is a property

2640
01:36:42,320 --> 01:36:46,080
that's about 8,150 square feet in area

2641
01:36:46,080 --> 01:36:48,560
and has 80 ft of frontage. So, the

2642
01:36:48,560 --> 01:36:50,800
minimums for that zone are 10,000 square

2643
01:36:50,800 --> 01:36:54,239
feet uh, with 90 ft of frontage. Um

2644
01:36:54,239 --> 01:36:57,280
because of this it's it's considered a

2645
01:36:57,280 --> 01:36:59,199
non-conforming

2646
01:36:59,199 --> 01:37:03,679
building and to reconstruct or enlarge a

2647
01:37:03,679 --> 01:37:05,360
non-conforming

2648
01:37:05,360 --> 01:37:08,159
uh building on this non-conforming lot

2649
01:37:08,159 --> 01:37:10,560
uh section 322070

2650
01:37:10,560 --> 01:37:13,280
of our uh development code comes into

2651
01:37:13,280 --> 01:37:14,800
play.

2652
01:37:14,800 --> 01:37:18,320
Um so that means that they have to take

2653
01:37:18,320 --> 01:37:21,040
this request to the planning commission

2654
01:37:21,040 --> 01:37:22,800
and planning commission makes a

2655
01:37:22,800 --> 01:37:24,719
recommendation to the city council and

2656
01:37:24,719 --> 01:37:26,960
then the city council

2657
01:37:26,960 --> 01:37:29,280
um being the land use authority in this

2658
01:37:29,280 --> 01:37:32,880
case would make the decision and apply

2659
01:37:32,880 --> 01:37:36,000
any conditions uh as per this ordinance

2660
01:37:36,000 --> 01:37:40,560
that they see fit. So, the applicant has

2661
01:37:40,560 --> 01:37:44,080
uh prepared a site plan and a set of

2662
01:37:44,080 --> 01:37:47,760
plans um that are included in the packet

2663
01:37:47,760 --> 01:37:51,119
uh with a proposal to reconstruct a

2664
01:37:51,119 --> 01:37:56,000
house uh on this property. Um as

2665
01:37:56,000 --> 01:37:59,280
presented, it does meet the setbacks for

2666
01:37:59,280 --> 01:38:01,199
the zone

2667
01:38:01,199 --> 01:38:04,960
and the height requirements. Um the

2668
01:38:04,960 --> 01:38:07,600
applicant is here tonight.

2669
01:38:07,600 --> 01:38:10,480
um in our audience. So

2670
01:38:10,480 --> 01:38:12,320
if you have any specific questions for

2671
01:38:12,320 --> 01:38:14,639
her, she I'm sure would be happy to

2672
01:38:14,639 --> 01:38:16,960
answer those as well.

2673
01:38:16,960 --> 01:38:21,119
>> So do you guys have any questions or I

2674
01:38:21,119 --> 01:38:22,719
was going over our rules of order. So

2675
01:38:22,719 --> 01:38:24,320
we're supposed the format is that we're

2676
01:38:24,320 --> 01:38:25,920
supposed to once it's been presented if

2677
01:38:25,920 --> 01:38:27,440
there's any technical questions that you

2678
01:38:27,440 --> 01:38:29,760
need answered and then after that is

2679
01:38:29,760 --> 01:38:32,159
followed by a motion and then discussion

2680
01:38:32,159 --> 01:38:34,719
on the motion and then the vote. Um, we

2681
01:38:34,719 --> 01:38:37,119
do have I had a council person reach out

2682
01:38:37,119 --> 01:38:39,520
to me earlier regarding there are a

2683
01:38:39,520 --> 01:38:40,880
couple of residents that would like to

2684
01:38:40,880 --> 01:38:43,280
make a comment which we will do before

2685
01:38:43,280 --> 01:38:46,400
um we come to a motion so that they can

2686
01:38:46,400 --> 01:38:48,080
um I believe they're neighboring

2687
01:38:48,080 --> 01:38:51,119
residents is my understanding. Um so I

2688
01:38:51,119 --> 01:38:52,880
think that will be the format that we'll

2689
01:38:52,880 --> 01:38:54,800
go with. So we'll start with Jessica or

2690
01:38:54,800 --> 01:38:56,960
Councilwoman Smean. Do you have any

2691
01:38:56,960 --> 01:38:58,159
questions regarding that?

2692
01:38:58,159 --> 01:39:00,639
>> Just as a prelude to that, may I just

2693
01:39:00,639 --> 01:39:02,560
suggest that if there is a motion to

2694
01:39:02,560 --> 01:39:04,880
approve, it has to be based on the

2695
01:39:04,880 --> 01:39:07,119
findings that are in the staff report on

2696
01:39:07,119 --> 01:39:10,560
pages 245 and 246.

2697
01:39:10,560 --> 01:39:13,119
So, somebody needs to either refer to

2698
01:39:13,119 --> 01:39:16,719
those or or say them out loud. That's a

2699
01:39:16,719 --> 01:39:18,560
requirement of our ordinance if you're

2700
01:39:18,560 --> 01:39:20,320
approving the reconstruction of a

2701
01:39:20,320 --> 01:39:22,239
non-conforming

2702
01:39:22,239 --> 01:39:24,639
building. So yeah, my understanding is

2703
01:39:24,639 --> 01:39:26,800
legal non-conforming is that if they

2704
01:39:26,800 --> 01:39:28,320
take down a structure, they're supposed

2705
01:39:28,320 --> 01:39:30,159
to build it back in the original

2706
01:39:30,159 --> 01:39:31,920
footprint. If it's anything else, it

2707
01:39:31,920 --> 01:39:33,760
needs to come to planning commission and

2708
01:39:33,760 --> 01:39:35,040
city council. And that's why it's here,

2709
01:39:35,040 --> 01:39:35,360
right?

2710
01:39:35,360 --> 01:39:41,280
>> Not not the original footprint is it any addition to a non-conforming

2711
01:39:41,280 --> 01:39:44,320
structure or if it's a rebuild needs to

2712
01:39:44,320 --> 01:39:46,800
meet the current setbacks.

2713
01:39:46,800 --> 01:39:49,679
So, so not necessarily within the

2714
01:39:49,679 --> 01:39:51,520
footprint of the previous home,

2715
01:39:51,520 --> 01:39:53,920
>> but but also has to meet the findings

2716
01:39:53,920 --> 01:39:56,000
that are stated in the code.

2717
01:39:56,000 --> 01:39:59,910
>> Yeah.

2718
01:39:59,920 --> 01:40:02,159
» Numbers one, two, three, and four.

2719
01:40:02,159 --> 01:40:04,320
Uhhuh.

2720
01:40:04,320 --> 01:40:07,440
>> On those two pages. Yeah. And to clarify

2721
01:40:07,440 --> 01:40:10,159
what they were asking, this is for

2722
01:40:10,159 --> 01:40:13,280
anything built in a nonconforming

2723
01:40:13,280 --> 01:40:15,920
situation, whether it's on the footprint

2724
01:40:15,920 --> 01:40:17,760
like she's bringing up or not, right? We

2725
01:40:17,760 --> 01:40:19,520
have to do all of this, right?

2726
01:40:19,520 --> 01:40:21,199
>> Yeah. Let me just go over these three

2727
01:40:21,199 --> 01:40:22,800
things that are up on the screen right

2728
01:40:22,800 --> 01:40:25,920
now. Uh, a non-conforming building or

2729
01:40:25,920 --> 01:40:27,600
structure or a building housing a

2730
01:40:27,600 --> 01:40:29,760
non-conforming use may be extended or

2731
01:40:29,760 --> 01:40:32,560
enlarged or reconstructed subject to the

2732
01:40:32,560 --> 01:40:36,159
prior approval by the city council after

2733
01:40:36,159 --> 01:40:37,440
recommendation of the planning

2734
01:40:37,440 --> 01:40:39,280
commission and such compliance with the

2735
01:40:39,280 --> 01:40:41,840
following. Uh, number one, the proposed

2736
01:40:41,840 --> 01:40:43,920
extension or replacement shall be

2737
01:40:43,920 --> 01:40:46,400
located entirely on the same lot or

2738
01:40:46,400 --> 01:40:48,320
parcel as the present non-conforming

2739
01:40:48,320 --> 01:40:50,080
structure and will conform with all

2740
01:40:50,080 --> 01:40:51,679
current setback and location

2741
01:40:51,679 --> 01:40:53,280
requirements.

2742
01:40:53,280 --> 01:40:54,800
Uh

2743
01:40:54,800 --> 01:40:56,800
number two, the applicant shall submit a

2744
01:40:56,800 --> 01:40:58,400
detailed site plan showing the location

2745
01:40:58,400 --> 01:41:00,480
of the existing and proposed structures

2746
01:41:00,480 --> 01:41:03,440
on the site and then in the vicinity,

2747
01:41:03,440 --> 01:41:05,199
existing lot boundaries, roads,

2748
01:41:05,199 --> 01:41:07,280
driveways, parking areas, utilities, and

2749
01:41:07,280 --> 01:41:10,159
other significant features on the site

2750
01:41:10,159 --> 01:41:12,400
in the immediate vicinity. And then a

2751
01:41:12,400 --> 01:41:14,880
finding be made or a finding made by the

2752
01:41:14,880 --> 01:41:17,040
majority of the council that and then

2753
01:41:17,040 --> 01:41:18,719
there's these three things that Steve

2754
01:41:18,719 --> 01:41:20,239
mentioned.

2755
01:41:20,239 --> 01:41:23,280
Um, number one, the proposed enlargement

2756
01:41:23,280 --> 01:41:26,000
four actually, sorry. Uh, the proposed

2757
01:41:26,000 --> 01:41:27,840
enlargement or extension will not

2758
01:41:27,840 --> 01:41:29,920
significantly alter the character of the

2759
01:41:29,920 --> 01:41:32,320
building or use or its impact upon the

2760
01:41:32,320 --> 01:41:34,639
area. Number two, building or use if

2761
01:41:34,639 --> 01:41:36,639
extended will not have the effect of

2762
01:41:36,639 --> 01:41:38,800
diminishing the value of property or the

2763
01:41:38,800 --> 01:41:40,719
quality of living environment of

2764
01:41:40,719 --> 01:41:42,800
adjacent properties.

2765
01:41:42,800 --> 01:41:44,719
Three, the proposed enlargement will not

2766
01:41:44,719 --> 01:41:46,400
significantly increase the number of

2767
01:41:46,400 --> 01:41:49,360
vehicles or pedestrians or result in the

2768
01:41:49,360 --> 01:41:51,280
establishment or increase a safety

2769
01:41:51,280 --> 01:41:54,239
hazard to the area. And four, the

2770
01:41:54,239 --> 01:41:56,719
proposed enlargement will not result in

2771
01:41:56,719 --> 01:41:58,480
the establishment of a condition

2772
01:41:58,480 --> 01:42:00,800
incompatible with the neighborhood area

2773
01:42:00,800 --> 01:42:03,360
and the stated objective of the zone in

2774
01:42:03,360 --> 01:42:05,840
which it was located.

2775
01:42:05,840 --> 01:42:08,400
I did not mention that the planning

2776
01:42:08,400 --> 01:42:11,440
commission recommended approval on this

2777
01:42:11,440 --> 01:42:18,870
site plan.

2778
01:42:18,880 --> 01:42:20,960
» Okay. Um,

2779
01:42:20,960 --> 01:42:22,480
yeah, I have a couple of questions on

2780
01:42:22,480 --> 01:42:26,880
the site plan. What is the

2781
01:42:26,880 --> 01:42:28,800
certain like a calculation? And I don't

2782
01:42:28,800 --> 01:42:31,280
know if your architect is here, but how

2783
01:42:31,280 --> 01:42:34,480
much square footage of the lot is left

2784
01:42:34,480 --> 01:42:36,719
over once all the improvements have been

2785
01:42:36,719 --> 01:42:44,149
made?

2786
01:42:44,159 --> 01:42:46,159
» Oh, [laughter]

2787
01:42:46,159 --> 01:42:48,159
I'm not sure if

2788
01:42:48,159 --> 01:42:50,639
>> So, I I know one one thing that we did

2789
01:42:50,639 --> 01:42:57,040
check and uh the applicant came in and met with us. uh in this particular

2790
01:42:57,040 --> 01:42:59,920
zone you can't have over 50% imperous

2791
01:42:59,920 --> 01:43:02,239
area and so I know that they went

2792
01:43:02,239 --> 01:43:03,760
through that exercise with their

2793
01:43:03,760 --> 01:43:05,440
architect

2794
01:43:05,440 --> 01:43:08,880
uh and this was found to meet that.

2795
01:43:08,880 --> 01:43:11,840
>> So what's the hash marking?

2796
01:43:11,840 --> 01:43:14,560
>> You can see yeah um you can see the the

2797
01:43:14,560 --> 01:43:16,800
hashes to the bottom left there. That's

2798
01:43:16,800 --> 01:43:20,800
all pvious surface area and to the to

2799
01:43:20,800 --> 01:43:22,560
the right of the structure as well. And

2800
01:43:22,560 --> 01:43:23,760
so that's how they're meeting that

2801
01:43:23,760 --> 01:43:25,760
requirement.

2802
01:43:25,760 --> 01:43:27,600
>> What do you mean the zone? Is it because

2803
01:43:27,600 --> 01:43:29,360
they're TR10,000 or

2804
01:43:29,360 --> 01:43:29,840
>> Yeah.

2805
01:43:29,840 --> 01:43:30,480
>> Okay.

2806
01:43:30,480 --> 01:43:37,830
>> Yes.

2807
01:43:37,840 --> 01:43:40,000
» I think that was my main question. Did

2808
01:43:40,000 --> 01:43:42,080
that calculation on impervious include

2809
01:43:42,080 --> 01:43:44,560
it looks like there's a shed,

2810
01:43:44,560 --> 01:43:46,239
a little out building in the back, and

2811
01:43:46,239 --> 01:43:48,000
then I'm not sure what the darker area

2812
01:43:48,000 --> 01:43:51,119
is to the right.

2813
01:43:51,119 --> 01:43:52,560
a decking.

2814
01:43:52,560 --> 01:43:55,040
>> Yeah, [clears throat]

2815
01:43:55,040 --> 01:43:56,639
>> we might have to double check that to

2816
01:43:56,639 --> 01:43:56,960
make sure.

2817
01:43:56,960 --> 01:43:58,239
>> Yeah, just I mean visually

2818
01:43:58,239 --> 01:43:59,360
>> during the building permit. Yeah.

2819
01:43:59,360 --> 01:44:00,719
>> Yeah. I don't know if this is scaled

2820
01:44:00,719 --> 01:44:03,280
right, but even with the hash mark that

2821
01:44:03,280 --> 01:44:05,920
is impervious material, it it doesn't

2822
01:44:05,920 --> 01:44:08,639
look like it's meeting that minimum 50%

2823
01:44:08,639 --> 01:44:09,600
requirement.

2824
01:44:09,600 --> 01:44:14,480
>> So, so the the box hatched area, it's

2825
01:44:14,480 --> 01:44:16,560
actually pvious

2826
01:44:16,560 --> 01:44:20,320
uh paper. So, it's a product we had to

2827
01:44:20,320 --> 01:44:23,040
do. Uh, they provided us some

2828
01:44:23,040 --> 01:44:26,719
information and and I trying to remember

2829
01:44:26,719 --> 01:44:28,960
I think the calculations might be on

2830
01:44:28,960 --> 01:44:30,880
here.

2831
01:44:30,880 --> 01:44:36,950
>> Um, let me just look.

2832
01:44:36,960 --> 01:44:38,480
» Yeah. Yeah, it's actually right there.

2833
01:44:38,480 --> 01:44:45,830
The site plan calculations on that page.

2834
01:44:45,840 --> 01:44:49,920
So it's 44 just under 45%

2835
01:44:49,920 --> 01:44:53,830
coverage.

2836
01:44:53,840 --> 01:45:03,590
» Sorry

2837
01:45:03,600 --> 01:45:06,560
they're 5.1%

2838
01:45:06,560 --> 01:45:09,520
below the threshold. Did you include the

2839
01:45:09,520 --> 01:45:11,440
calculation on the future accessory

2840
01:45:11,440 --> 01:45:14,960
structure of 97 square feet? How was

2841
01:45:14,960 --> 01:45:17,440
that taken into account

2842
01:45:17,440 --> 01:45:20,800
for TR 10,000?

2843
01:45:20,800 --> 01:45:28,310
>> See, let's do the math.

2844
01:45:28,320 --> 01:45:30,560
» Isn't it the second line item? 149

2845
01:45:30,560 --> 01:45:33,830
square feet.

2846
01:45:33,840 --> 01:45:41,189
» Oh, no. It's 97. I see.

2847
01:45:41,199 --> 01:45:52,950
I'm just trying to see on here.

2848
01:45:52,960 --> 01:45:56,639
» So, if that is not included in here, um

2849
01:45:56,639 --> 01:45:59,199
that would require a separate permit

2850
01:45:59,199 --> 01:46:02,088
from the house itself.

2851
01:46:02,088 --> 01:46:02,239
>> [clears throat]

2852
01:46:02,239 --> 01:46:03,920
>> Is that because it's less than 100

2853
01:46:03,920 --> 01:46:05,920
square feet and we don't if the height

2854
01:46:05,920 --> 01:46:07,760
is less they don't require a separate

2855
01:46:07,760 --> 01:46:09,280
permit.

2856
01:46:09,280 --> 01:46:22,709
>> So um but it it would take them over.

2857
01:46:22,719 --> 01:46:25,360
» No, they still wouldn't be 50%.

2858
01:46:25,360 --> 01:46:26,159
>> They're still under it.

2859
01:46:26,159 --> 01:46:28,400
>> Well under it.

2860
01:46:28,400 --> 01:46:30,159
>> That was it. That was the question I

2861
01:46:30,159 --> 01:46:31,760
had. Thank you.

2862
01:46:31,760 --> 01:46:33,280
>> Sarah, do you have a question?

2863
01:46:33,280 --> 01:46:36,159
>> Yes. Um, if this is denied, what are the

2864
01:46:36,159 --> 01:46:42,550
resources for the landowner?

2865
01:46:42,560 --> 01:46:45,280
» I'll let Steve answer that.

2866
01:46:45,280 --> 01:46:46,800
>> They can appeal it to the hearing

2867
01:46:46,800 --> 01:46:47,360
officer.

2868
01:46:47,360 --> 01:46:49,199
>> I was going to say,

2869
01:46:49,199 --> 01:46:51,679
>> well, can they not also try to meet

2870
01:46:51,679 --> 01:46:55,280
those criterias that we just read

2871
01:46:55,280 --> 01:46:59,520
by modifying the design?

2872
01:46:59,520 --> 01:47:01,360
If if we have the view that this does

2873
01:47:01,360 --> 01:47:03,360
not meet that criteria, couldn't they

2874
01:47:03,360 --> 01:47:05,920
fall in line with the criteria?

2875
01:47:05,920 --> 01:47:07,760
>> They could or they can appeal to the

2876
01:47:07,760 --> 01:47:08,080
hearing.

2877
01:47:08,080 --> 01:47:10,400
>> So they can appeal how it is or refine

2878
01:47:10,400 --> 01:47:12,239
and meet the criteria.

2879
01:47:12,239 --> 01:47:12,960
>> Correct. Okay.

2880
01:47:12,960 --> 01:47:14,719
>> It's up to the property owner.

2881
01:47:14,719 --> 01:47:16,080
>> And forgive me because I'm still

2882
01:47:16,080 --> 01:47:18,560
learning that if they appeal, what's

2883
01:47:18,560 --> 01:47:20,239
that process like?

2884
01:47:20,239 --> 01:47:23,520
>> So we have a hearing officer. Okay.

2885
01:47:23,520 --> 01:47:26,239
>> Our staff will go and present and then

2886
01:47:26,239 --> 01:47:28,400
the hearing officer um decides.

2887
01:47:28,400 --> 01:47:30,000
Sometimes it goes the way we think it

2888
01:47:30,000 --> 01:47:31,760
will and sometimes it goes completely

2889
01:47:31,760 --> 01:47:32,880
opposite.

2890
01:47:32,880 --> 01:47:36,239
>> It's totally up to the hearing officer.

2891
01:47:36,239 --> 01:47:37,600
>> Um, okay. I

2892
01:47:37,600 --> 01:47:38,480
>> authority

2893
01:47:38,480 --> 01:47:40,719
>> I just have a few thoughts and comments.

2894
01:47:40,719 --> 01:47:45,750
Um, just looking at this 3.22.07

2895
01:47:45,760 --> 01:47:47,760
looking under number three says the

2896
01:47:47,760 --> 01:47:49,360
proposed enlargement or extension will

2897
01:47:49,360 --> 01:47:51,440
not significantly alter the character of

2898
01:47:51,440 --> 01:47:53,840
the building or use or its impact upon

2899
01:47:53,840 --> 01:47:56,000
the area. I noticed this building is

2900
01:47:56,000 --> 01:48:00,239
technically a three-story h house

2901
01:48:00,239 --> 01:48:02,400
next to

2902
01:48:02,400 --> 01:48:04,719
two one-story homes and in this

2903
01:48:04,719 --> 01:48:09,040
neighborhood to me it doesn't fit the

2904
01:48:09,040 --> 01:48:11,760
neighborhood and or the character it

2905
01:48:11,760 --> 01:48:13,440
says the building or use if extended

2906
01:48:13,440 --> 01:48:14,800
will not have the effect of diminishing

2907
01:48:14,800 --> 01:48:16,480
the value of property or the quality of

2908
01:48:16,480 --> 01:48:18,239
living environment of adjacent

2909
01:48:18,239 --> 01:48:21,600
properties. This again going back to the

2910
01:48:21,600 --> 01:48:24,719
height and to views I just think that

2911
01:48:24,719 --> 01:48:26,480
this will diminish some of the quality

2912
01:48:26,480 --> 01:48:35,440
of living of the adjacent properties. Um I was looking I was revisiting kind

2913
01:48:35,440 --> 01:48:38,639
of land use in the

2914
01:48:38,639 --> 01:48:41,199
um Utah League of Cities and Towns and

2915
01:48:41,199 --> 01:48:42,639
they talked a lot about property rights,

2916
01:48:42,639 --> 01:48:44,480
but they also talk a lot about community

2917
01:48:44,480 --> 01:48:48,239
rights and um how both need to be

2918
01:48:48,239 --> 01:48:51,679
respected. And so when I look at our

2919
01:48:51,679 --> 01:48:56,159
overall vision and our our master plan,

2920
01:48:56,159 --> 01:48:58,800
it says under land use, preserve and

2921
01:48:58,800 --> 01:49:01,920
protect specific comm community characteristics such as

2922
01:49:01,920 --> 01:49:05,760
hillsides, scenic views, and critical

2923
01:49:05,760 --> 01:49:08,159
lands in a historic small town. I love I

2924
01:49:08,159 --> 01:49:10,159
love the style of this home. I fit feel

2925
01:49:10,159 --> 01:49:12,960
like it fits. I just think the the

2926
01:49:12,960 --> 01:49:17,280
height of the house does not fit. And I

2927
01:49:17,280 --> 01:49:20,400
know that there's a little history. My

2928
01:49:20,400 --> 01:49:22,560
understanding with this is that someone

2929
01:49:22,560 --> 01:49:25,920
had approached the city to purchase this

2930
01:49:25,920 --> 01:49:28,320
and they were told if you tear down the

2931
01:49:28,320 --> 01:49:30,639
house, you have to rebuild on the same

2932
01:49:30,639 --> 01:49:32,719
foundation, the same footing. And so

2933
01:49:32,719 --> 01:49:35,760
they ended up not purchasing the home.

2934
01:49:35,760 --> 01:49:38,000
And so [snorts] I feel like granting an

2935
01:49:38,000 --> 01:49:39,920
exception when we've already told

2936
01:49:39,920 --> 01:49:43,119
someone that they can't is is a little

2937
01:49:43,119 --> 01:49:44,880
bit contradictory to what we've already

2938
01:49:44,880 --> 01:49:47,199
told another resident that has tried to

2939
01:49:47,199 --> 01:49:49,119
purchase the same home. So those are

2940
01:49:49,119 --> 01:49:52,719
some of my concerns. Um yeah and my

2941
01:49:52,719 --> 01:49:54,480
questions.

2942
01:49:54,480 --> 01:49:56,159
>> Chrissy, did you have any questions?

2943
01:49:56,159 --> 01:49:57,760
>> Shane, do you have a comment?

2944
01:49:57,760 --> 01:49:58,719
>> If I can just

2945
01:49:58,719 --> 01:50:01,280
>> Sure. I don't typically those

2946
01:50:01,280 --> 01:50:03,280
conversations take place in our Monday

2947
01:50:03,280 --> 01:50:06,080
morning meetings and I don't I know

2948
01:50:06,080 --> 01:50:08,800
people came in and asked about this

2949
01:50:08,800 --> 01:50:11,280
property over the last I don't know how

2950
01:50:11,280 --> 01:50:13,840
many years few years I don't remember

2951
01:50:13,840 --> 01:50:16,960
that conversation taking place like that

2952
01:50:16,960 --> 01:50:20,239
um I mean the requirement is really

2953
01:50:20,239 --> 01:50:23,679
what's in the ordinance um that's what

2954
01:50:23,679 --> 01:50:27,040
we have to fall back on

2955
01:50:27,040 --> 01:50:33,270
and which is why this is here right now.

2956
01:50:33,280 --> 01:50:36,080
» So, um the my question just to clarify

2957
01:50:36,080 --> 01:50:37,840
is the reason that it's non-conforming

2958
01:50:37,840 --> 01:50:41,280
is because of the width of the frontage

2959
01:50:41,280 --> 01:50:45,600
>> and the square footage

2960
01:50:45,600 --> 01:50:46,320
>> 10,000

2961
01:50:46,320 --> 01:50:48,400
>> but every and every like the setbacks

2962
01:50:48,400 --> 01:50:50,159
the height all of that was within our

2963
01:50:50,159 --> 01:50:52,480
own guidelines.

2964
01:50:52,480 --> 01:50:57,040
>> Okay. And then because this um

2965
01:50:57,040 --> 01:50:58,800
how do I want to say this? Seems

2966
01:50:58,800 --> 01:51:01,119
somewhat subjective

2967
01:51:01,119 --> 01:51:05,520
um about diminished value of property.

2968
01:51:05,520 --> 01:51:07,280
Um

2969
01:51:07,280 --> 01:51:10,400
let's see. Okay. Vehicle or pedestrians.

2970
01:51:10,400 --> 01:51:14,320
It's still a single family home. Um

2971
01:51:14,320 --> 01:51:16,880
character like character of the building

2972
01:51:16,880 --> 01:51:19,280
like in a legal sense. What is the

2973
01:51:19,280 --> 01:51:20,719
character of the building? Is it still a

2974
01:51:20,719 --> 01:51:23,360
single family residence? So it conforms

2975
01:51:23,360 --> 01:51:28,239
to number one and then um diminished

2976
01:51:28,239 --> 01:51:30,320
value I think is somewhat well it's

2977
01:51:30,320 --> 01:51:33,520
still a single family home and adjacent

2978
01:51:33,520 --> 01:51:36,480
properties and then proposed enlargement

2979
01:51:36,480 --> 01:51:39,280
um okay we talked about number three uh

2980
01:51:39,280 --> 01:51:41,040
establishment of a condition in the

2981
01:51:41,040 --> 01:51:42,880
neighborhood incompatible with the

2982
01:51:42,880 --> 01:51:46,000
neighborhood and zone so we talked about

2983
01:51:46,000 --> 01:51:48,639
impervious impervious and anything else

2984
01:51:48,639 --> 01:51:52,000
in TR 10 that makes it unique

2985
01:51:52,000 --> 01:51:54,400
that we're we haven't talked about. Is

2986
01:51:54,400 --> 01:51:58,159
it compatible with the zone? Yes. Okay.

2987
01:51:58,159 --> 01:52:00,719
So, [clears throat] I in reading the

2988
01:52:00,719 --> 01:52:02,960
what what are the conditions to Steve's

2989
01:52:02,960 --> 01:52:05,440
point like I can't really find anything

2990
01:52:05,440 --> 01:52:08,719
that it doesn't conform to like the the

2991
01:52:08,719 --> 01:52:11,920
four things um that we have to use as a

2992
01:52:11,920 --> 01:52:15,199
tool to sort of guide you know anything

2993
01:52:15,199 --> 01:52:18,717
that's not conforming. Um I do

2994
01:52:18,717 --> 01:52:20,480
[clears throat] think

2995
01:52:20,480 --> 01:52:22,800
like it's still a single family home.

2996
01:52:22,800 --> 01:52:25,199
The the only concern I had and I need

2997
01:52:25,199 --> 01:52:27,599
guidance here from um maybe from Steve

2998
01:52:27,599 --> 01:52:30,400
and and uh from staff is that there

2999
01:52:30,400 --> 01:52:32,239
during the construction period there was

3000
01:52:32,239 --> 01:52:34,639
a fence that was removed and that has

3001
01:52:34,639 --> 01:52:36,480
been brought to the attention of staff

3002
01:52:36,480 --> 01:52:40,560
and um there's been interactions and so

3003
01:52:40,560 --> 01:52:42,880
that can't play into this decision or is

3004
01:52:42,880 --> 01:52:44,960
it outside of this decision?

3005
01:52:44,960 --> 01:52:46,880
>> Yeah. Or can we like hook them together

3006
01:52:46,880 --> 01:52:49,360
and say the fence needs to be re

3007
01:52:49,360 --> 01:52:50,320
rebuilt?

3008
01:52:50,320 --> 01:52:52,560
>> I I can address that. [clears throat]

3009
01:52:52,560 --> 01:52:54,560
Let's say that you and I are next door

3010
01:52:54,560 --> 01:52:57,280
neighbors and I decide to tear your

3011
01:52:57,280 --> 01:53:00,880
fence down. I shouldn't my opinion I

3012
01:53:00,880 --> 01:53:02,880
shouldn't do it but it's not something

3013
01:53:02,880 --> 01:53:05,199
that we issued a permit a demolition

3014
01:53:05,199 --> 01:53:08,239
permit for a fence and then they did it

3015
01:53:08,239 --> 01:53:10,960
wrong. Um the city issued a demolition

3016
01:53:10,960 --> 01:53:12,880
permit for the home because the

3017
01:53:12,880 --> 01:53:15,520
requirements for that permit were met.

3018
01:53:15,520 --> 01:53:18,960
Um fairly basic asbestous

3019
01:53:18,960 --> 01:53:23,920
disconnect utilities and then they can get a permit

3020
01:53:23,920 --> 01:53:28,000
um to demo a home. But uh we we view the

3021
01:53:28,000 --> 01:53:30,880
fence issue as really a dispute between

3022
01:53:30,880 --> 01:53:33,440
neighbors. Really a a civil dispute

3023
01:53:33,440 --> 01:53:36,719
between neighbors. Um, you know, we

3024
01:53:36,719 --> 01:53:40,080
might say, "Yeah,

3025
01:53:40,080 --> 01:53:41,840
we think that fence shouldn't have came

3026
01:53:41,840 --> 01:53:43,599
down." But we really don't have any way

3027
01:53:43,599 --> 01:53:45,920
of going in and injecting oursel into

3028
01:53:45,920 --> 01:53:47,840
that process and saying, "You, property

3029
01:53:47,840 --> 01:53:50,800
owner one, need to uh replace property

3030
01:53:50,800 --> 01:53:53,360
owner two's fence."

3031
01:53:53,360 --> 01:53:57,119
Um, so that's they are unrelated, but I

3032
01:53:57,119 --> 01:53:59,679
don't think the city's even a player in

3033
01:53:59,679 --> 01:54:02,159
the fence discussion.

3034
01:54:02,159 --> 01:54:05,350
So,

3035
01:54:05,360 --> 01:54:07,679
What?

3036
01:54:07,679 --> 01:54:09,199
>> Okay, you guys.

3037
01:54:09,199 --> 01:54:10,960
>> I'll give you guys a chance, but let's

3038
01:54:10,960 --> 01:54:12,320
>> He said the fence wasn't on the

3039
01:54:12,320 --> 01:54:14,239
property. The issue is the fence was not

3040
01:54:14,239 --> 01:54:16,239
on the city's property.

3041
01:54:16,239 --> 01:54:18,400
>> And so the old saying, the city really

3042
01:54:18,400 --> 01:54:21,119
didn't have a dog in that fight. Um

3043
01:54:21,119 --> 01:54:23,040
would apply here. Um

3044
01:54:23,040 --> 01:54:25,040
>> well, we try to protect our residents,

3045
01:54:25,040 --> 01:54:25,679
you know,

3046
01:54:25,679 --> 01:54:26,800
>> but but we

3047
01:54:26,800 --> 01:54:29,119
>> from with ordinances that protect them

3048
01:54:29,119 --> 01:54:32,000
from having things demolished. We get

3049
01:54:32,000 --> 01:54:33,599
issues all the time. You know, my

3050
01:54:33,599 --> 01:54:35,920
neighbor's water is raining onto my

3051
01:54:35,920 --> 01:54:38,800
property or this or that or the other.

3052
01:54:38,800 --> 01:54:40,639
And some things, you know, there's a

3053
01:54:40,639 --> 01:54:43,520
city ordinance that we can say, "Hey,

3054
01:54:43,520 --> 01:54:45,360
you're breaking this." And others

3055
01:54:45,360 --> 01:54:48,800
there's not. And we don't have anything

3056
01:54:48,800 --> 01:54:51,920
that addresses this fence issue

3057
01:54:51,920 --> 01:54:53,360
>> that that we can back up.

3058
01:54:53,360 --> 01:54:55,119
>> We're trying to bring a fence ordinance

3059
01:54:55,119 --> 01:54:57,920
to the table.

3060
01:54:57,920 --> 01:54:59,119
We've got one on the list,

3061
01:54:59,119 --> 01:55:00,560
>> but it probably doesn't say you can't

3062
01:55:00,560 --> 01:55:01,679
tear your neighbor's fence down at the

3063
01:55:01,679 --> 01:55:01,920
same time.

3064
01:55:01,920 --> 01:55:03,920
>> It actually does. It talks about what to

3065
01:55:03,920 --> 01:55:05,599
do with fence disputes. It's been

3066
01:55:05,599 --> 01:55:06,800
sitting there for two months.

3067
01:55:06,800 --> 01:55:07,360
>> Oh,

3068
01:55:07,360 --> 01:55:07,760
>> yeah.

3069
01:55:07,760 --> 01:55:08,880
>> Let's move that up.

3070
01:55:08,880 --> 01:55:11,040
>> Well, this is not a single problem. It's

3071
01:55:11,040 --> 01:55:12,400
happened a couple times. So, the hope is

3072
01:55:12,400 --> 01:55:14,080
that we can help with it, but sorry,

3073
01:55:14,080 --> 01:55:14,800
it's not my turn.

3074
01:55:14,800 --> 01:55:16,639
>> Okay. No. All right. So, that is not a

3075
01:55:16,639 --> 01:55:19,520
re We can't um All right. We can't tie

3076
01:55:19,520 --> 01:55:19,679
that.

3077
01:55:19,679 --> 01:55:21,199
>> If you said anything wrong, Steve can

3078
01:55:21,199 --> 01:55:22,960
correct me.

3079
01:55:22,960 --> 01:55:25,119
Well, I just might point the council to

3080
01:55:25,119 --> 01:55:26,880
the remainder

3081
01:55:26,880 --> 01:55:30,080
but the following portion after those

3082
01:55:30,080 --> 01:55:33,040
four findings that if the council

3083
01:55:33,040 --> 01:55:36,159
decides to approve this, you have to

3084
01:55:36,159 --> 01:55:39,119
make those findings expressly. Uh but

3085
01:55:39,119 --> 01:55:41,440
then it says the council may attach such

3086
01:55:41,440 --> 01:55:43,840
conditions to its approval as are

3087
01:55:43,840 --> 01:55:45,760
necessary to adequately protect the

3088
01:55:45,760 --> 01:55:47,840
property and uses in the surrounding

3089
01:55:47,840 --> 01:55:50,800
territory and the intent of the zone

3090
01:55:50,800 --> 01:55:52,480
including but not limited to the

3091
01:55:52,480 --> 01:55:54,000
providing of off- streetet parking

3092
01:55:54,000 --> 01:55:56,960
accessways, landscaping features and

3093
01:55:56,960 --> 01:55:59,679
additional setback of structures.

3094
01:55:59,679 --> 01:56:02,960
So if they're reasonable and if they're

3095
01:56:02,960 --> 01:56:04,960
reasonably related to potential

3096
01:56:04,960 --> 01:56:07,360
detrimental impacts,

3097
01:56:07,360 --> 01:56:09,920
I that's when a conditions would be

3098
01:56:09,920 --> 01:56:11,599
appropriate. The planning commission did

3099
01:56:11,599 --> 01:56:13,440
not attach any conditions to its

3100
01:56:13,440 --> 01:56:15,040
recommendation.

3101
01:56:15,040 --> 01:56:17,679
Okay, that's what I was thinking. Um,

3102
01:56:17,679 --> 01:56:20,239
was that it meets all the one through

3103
01:56:20,239 --> 01:56:22,560
four, but that this the fence issue

3104
01:56:22,560 --> 01:56:24,320
could have been a condition, but

3105
01:56:24,320 --> 01:56:27,040
according to Shane, um, we don't

3106
01:56:27,040 --> 01:56:29,920
necessarily have standing on the fence

3107
01:56:29,920 --> 01:56:32,480
issue. Would you give me some direction

3108
01:56:32,480 --> 01:56:34,800
with that, Steve?

3109
01:56:34,800 --> 01:56:37,440
Well, Shane is right in that if there's

3110
01:56:37,440 --> 01:56:39,360
a dispute between neighbors about a

3111
01:56:39,360 --> 01:56:42,800
fence, that's typically not what we get

3112
01:56:42,800 --> 01:56:44,880
involved with as a city.

3113
01:56:44,880 --> 01:56:45,280
>> Okay?

3114
01:56:45,280 --> 01:56:47,760
>> Often either neighbor, the disgruntled

3115
01:56:47,760 --> 01:56:49,280
neighbor will come to the city and say,

3116
01:56:49,280 --> 01:56:51,840
"Why don't you help me with this?" And

3117
01:56:51,840 --> 01:56:54,080
it's not really our issue. It's a civil

3118
01:56:54,080 --> 01:56:57,440
issue between neighbors. But again,

3119
01:56:57,440 --> 01:57:00,239
landscaping features and those things,

3120
01:57:00,239 --> 01:57:03,040
any reasonable conditions called out in

3121
01:57:03,040 --> 01:57:05,679
the ordinance, if they can be reasonably

3122
01:57:05,679 --> 01:57:10,000
tied to protecting, as it says, you

3123
01:57:10,000 --> 01:57:12,239
know, the surrounding territory and the

3124
01:57:12,239 --> 01:57:15,040
intent of the zone, then the council

3125
01:57:15,040 --> 01:57:16,880
could attach conditions.

3126
01:57:16,880 --> 01:57:18,800
>> So, my understanding is that you can

3127
01:57:18,800 --> 01:57:21,840
attach what you questioned about

3128
01:57:21,840 --> 01:57:24,880
regarding the fence to as a condition of

3129
01:57:24,880 --> 01:57:26,239
the approval. That's how I'm

3130
01:57:26,239 --> 01:57:29,280
interpreting what Steve so eloquently

3131
01:57:29,280 --> 01:57:32,000
what Mr. Dy eloquently said.

3132
01:57:32,000 --> 01:57:33,679
>> If she has to improve, if she has to

3133
01:57:33,679 --> 01:57:36,880
interpret it, then it's not so eloquent.

3134
01:57:36,880 --> 01:57:38,400
>> I have a question. Council member

3135
01:57:38,400 --> 01:57:40,000
Haniman, I know you've been working on

3136
01:57:40,000 --> 01:57:45,199
bulk and massing and then, you know, we kind of put that aside for a little

3137
01:57:45,199 --> 01:57:48,960
while. um with this being just an 8,000

3138
01:57:48,960 --> 01:57:51,599
square foot lot and then considering the

3139
01:57:51,599 --> 01:57:56,400
bulk and massing impact, do you see that

3140
01:57:56,400 --> 01:57:58,800
um

3141
01:57:58,800 --> 01:58:00,560
would relate to item number one, the

3142
01:58:00,560 --> 01:58:02,880
proposed enlargement or extension will

3143
01:58:02,880 --> 01:58:04,960
not significantly alter the character of

3144
01:58:04,960 --> 01:58:06,800
the building,

3145
01:58:06,800 --> 01:58:09,119
which I'm assuming means the current

3146
01:58:09,119 --> 01:58:12,000
building before it was torn down or its

3147
01:58:12,000 --> 01:58:14,400
impact on the area. So when you look at

3148
01:58:14,400 --> 01:58:18,639
that row of homes on that street, that

3149
01:58:18,639 --> 01:58:21,360
was a small home and that was the

3150
01:58:21,360 --> 01:58:24,800
character of that bulk and mass.

3151
01:58:24,800 --> 01:58:28,159
>> So as you say, number one is arbitrary.

3152
01:58:28,159 --> 01:58:30,480
It's actually

3153
01:58:30,480 --> 01:58:32,159
not arbitrary at all because you can

3154
01:58:32,159 --> 01:58:33,679
take a measurement. I think the other

3155
01:58:33,679 --> 01:58:36,480
home that was torn down was about

3156
01:58:36,480 --> 01:58:38,800
>> I don't know 800 square feet. I don't it

3157
01:58:38,800 --> 01:58:43,199
was little. And so that one of all four

3158
01:58:43,199 --> 01:58:47,119
is very concrete and more than triple

3159
01:58:47,119 --> 01:58:49,920
>> impacting the character you know of the

3160
01:58:49,920 --> 01:58:51,360
area.

3161
01:58:51,360 --> 01:58:52,880
>> Well I think the character of the

3162
01:58:52,880 --> 01:58:54,960
building like we have talked so much

3163
01:58:54,960 --> 01:58:57,040
about um and listening to planning

3164
01:58:57,040 --> 01:58:59,679
commission on main street like flexible

3165
01:58:59,679 --> 01:59:01,440
housing like a character of the building

3166
01:59:01,440 --> 01:59:03,840
may be like a multif family or something

3167
01:59:03,840 --> 01:59:06,080
but it's still a single family home. So

3168
01:59:06,080 --> 01:59:08,000
that's what I'm trying to I don't think

3169
01:59:08,000 --> 01:59:09,840
the character of the building is really

3170
01:59:09,840 --> 01:59:12,560
altered. I do believe that we do have a

3171
01:59:12,560 --> 01:59:15,440
massing. Um and this is going to this

3172
01:59:15,440 --> 01:59:16,800
just brings up something we will see

3173
01:59:16,800 --> 01:59:20,239
more and more often because we see it in

3174
01:59:20,239 --> 01:59:22,880
the new builds like people are filling

3175
01:59:22,880 --> 01:59:25,440
up their entire lot with a building. And

3176
01:59:25,440 --> 01:59:27,040
so I would really like to address

3177
01:59:27,040 --> 01:59:29,840
massing. I don't feel like this is that

3178
01:59:29,840 --> 01:59:33,119
extreme. Um although it's relative to

3179
01:59:33,119 --> 01:59:35,840
what's maybe the next door neighbors if

3180
01:59:35,840 --> 01:59:39,520
you look across the street um the homes

3181
01:59:39,520 --> 01:59:41,119
you know to the what would that be east

3182
01:59:41,119 --> 01:59:43,840
and west of creek side are are that

3183
01:59:43,840 --> 01:59:45,440
similar size so

3184
01:59:45,440 --> 01:59:47,520
>> but they are in different subdivisions

3185
01:59:47,520 --> 01:59:52,800
all the homes across the street are to the west are about the same they're

3186
01:59:52,800 --> 01:59:54,880
all about the same height about the same

3187
01:59:54,880 --> 01:59:55,840
size.

3188
01:59:55,840 --> 02:00:00,639
>> Yeah. But that that is not like um that

3189
02:00:00,639 --> 02:00:02,960
is not within our ordinances to to force

3190
02:00:02,960 --> 02:00:05,760
everyone to stay that way because people

3191
02:00:05,760 --> 02:00:08,239
are putting on large expansions of their

3192
02:00:08,239 --> 02:00:10,960
homes right now and they are taking an

3193
02:00:10,960 --> 02:00:13,440
empty lot and filling it up with a house

3194
02:00:13,440 --> 02:00:16,320
four times the size um of maybe what

3195
02:00:16,320 --> 02:00:17,840
would have built 20 years ago because

3196
02:00:17,840 --> 02:00:20,639
the lot sat vacant. So, I don't think we

3197
02:00:20,639 --> 02:00:23,119
can really limit landholders to

3198
02:00:23,119 --> 02:00:25,199
something that's unreasonable,

3199
02:00:25,199 --> 02:00:27,119
like restrict them that in that way,

3200
02:00:27,119 --> 02:00:28,719
even though it doesn't maybe we're not

3201
02:00:28,719 --> 02:00:30,880
happy about it or maybe it doesn't feel

3202
02:00:30,880 --> 02:00:32,560
right. I just don't think that we have

3203
02:00:32,560 --> 02:00:36,159
that um authority. But so I see your

3204
02:00:36,159 --> 02:00:38,560
points but I I'm just trying to you know

3205
02:00:38,560 --> 02:00:40,800
stay within what do we have legal

3206
02:00:40,800 --> 02:00:44,000
authority to do and legal um so when I

3207
02:00:44,000 --> 02:00:45,760
saw the conditions I was wondering about

3208
02:00:45,760 --> 02:00:47,679
the fence but I don't want to put the

3209
02:00:47,679 --> 02:00:49,360
city in the middle of something that

3210
02:00:49,360 --> 02:00:52,000
they don't really have a right to be in

3211
02:00:52,000 --> 02:00:55,760
the middle of um based on what Shane has

3212
02:00:55,760 --> 02:00:58,239
described. So I will think on that and

3213
02:00:58,239 --> 02:00:59,760
that's the end of my comments.

3214
02:00:59,760 --> 02:01:02,639
>> Okay Andrew so many I'll try to remember

3215
02:01:02,639 --> 02:01:03,679
them and I'll try to get through them

3216
02:01:03,679 --> 02:01:06,480
fast. So, uh, I want to just put the

3217
02:01:06,480 --> 02:01:08,320
plug for our fence ordinance because

3218
02:01:08,320 --> 02:01:11,360
that would solve this. By us not having

3219
02:01:11,360 --> 02:01:13,760
an ordinance, we are creating problems

3220
02:01:13,760 --> 02:01:16,400
for residents both on the height and how

3221
02:01:16,400 --> 02:01:18,639
to demolish or how to build them. And

3222
02:01:18,639 --> 02:01:20,800
so, we saw this earlier. So, Kaden, we

3223
02:01:20,800 --> 02:01:22,080
love that you're here. If you could

3224
02:01:22,080 --> 02:01:23,119
check it out and tell us everything

3225
02:01:23,119 --> 02:01:24,639
that's wrong with it and help us improve

3226
02:01:24,639 --> 02:01:27,199
it, we are at your mercy to try to make

3227
02:01:27,199 --> 02:01:28,800
a great fence ordinance because we have

3228
02:01:28,800 --> 02:01:30,480
just some things that haven't been

3229
02:01:30,480 --> 02:01:32,560
finished. So, anyways, that would help.

3230
02:01:32,560 --> 02:01:35,360
Um, thanks for all your comments. Uh, I

3231
02:01:35,360 --> 02:01:37,520
think so. I I [clears throat] land

3232
02:01:37,520 --> 02:01:40,400
totally opposite, but let me explain one

3233
02:01:40,400 --> 02:01:41,520
thing that might help, and I love that

3234
02:01:41,520 --> 02:01:42,800
you're working on bulk and masking. I'll

3235
02:01:42,800 --> 02:01:44,560
be the first one to support you if you

3236
02:01:44,560 --> 02:01:46,400
want. Uh, I think all of us will be

3237
02:01:46,400 --> 02:01:50,080
behind you on that. Um, [clears throat]

3238
02:01:50,080 --> 02:01:52,320
we are not in ordinance bill on this

3239
02:01:52,320 --> 02:01:55,440
because from the beginning it is out of

3240
02:01:55,440 --> 02:01:58,000
ordinance. Okay? It is a special

3241
02:01:58,000 --> 02:02:00,239
situation. So it's not like we're in

3242
02:02:00,239 --> 02:02:03,520
normal setback land and 10,000 square

3243
02:02:03,520 --> 02:02:05,360
foot land. We're in a totally different

3244
02:02:05,360 --> 02:02:07,360
realm because someone made an exception

3245
02:02:07,360 --> 02:02:09,920
a long time ago. So the subjectiveness

3246
02:02:09,920 --> 02:02:12,320
does kick in and that's what we have

3247
02:02:12,320 --> 02:02:14,880
here. These these conditions I read

3248
02:02:14,880 --> 02:02:16,239
through these conditions and I think it

3249
02:02:16,239 --> 02:02:19,280
fails on one two and four. The proposed

3250
02:02:19,280 --> 02:02:20,800
enlargement or extension will not

3251
02:02:20,800 --> 02:02:22,480
significantly alter the character of the

3252
02:02:22,480 --> 02:02:25,840
building or use uh or its impact upon

3253
02:02:25,840 --> 02:02:28,480
the area. Remember most everyone built

3254
02:02:28,480 --> 02:02:32,000
when that was a 600 foot uh 600 square

3255
02:02:32,000 --> 02:02:34,639
foot house and that was the style and

3256
02:02:34,639 --> 02:02:37,119
they got permission a special permission

3257
02:02:37,119 --> 02:02:39,599
for that. This is be this will be very

3258
02:02:39,599 --> 02:02:41,280
different. This will be very different

3259
02:02:41,280 --> 02:02:42,639
on that. Number one so it doesn't mean

3260
02:02:42,639 --> 02:02:44,960
that for me for number one the building

3261
02:02:44,960 --> 02:02:48,080
or use is extended if extended will not

3262
02:02:48,080 --> 02:02:49,760
have the effect of diminishing the value

3263
02:02:49,760 --> 02:02:52,400
of property or the quality of living uh

3264
02:02:52,400 --> 02:02:54,719
environment of the adjacent properties.

3265
02:02:54,719 --> 02:02:56,719
very much will modify the adjacent

3266
02:02:56,719 --> 02:02:59,360
properties based on

3267
02:02:59,360 --> 02:03:03,199
nearly quadrupling its size but not

3268
02:03:03,199 --> 02:03:04,800
quadrupling

3269
02:03:04,800 --> 02:03:07,760
the land size or the lot size. So that

3270
02:03:07,760 --> 02:03:11,040
will be very different. Um uh I mean you

3271
02:03:11,040 --> 02:03:12,800
can do two things. You can build a lot

3272
02:03:12,800 --> 02:03:15,040
of bulk or you can shrink a lot of land

3273
02:03:15,040 --> 02:03:17,199
and it creates the same effect to live

3274
02:03:17,199 --> 02:03:20,960
around which is lower quality of life.

3275
02:03:20,960 --> 02:03:22,719
Um and but what as you increase the

3276
02:03:22,719 --> 02:03:24,400
density number number three it doesn't

3277
02:03:24,400 --> 02:03:26,320
really work with I'm sorry it it it

3278
02:03:26,320 --> 02:03:28,080
passes number three in my mind. Number

3279
02:03:28,080 --> 02:03:29,599
four though it does not pass the

3280
02:03:29,599 --> 02:03:32,080
proposed enlargement will not result in

3281
02:03:32,080 --> 02:03:34,560
the establishment of a condition

3282
02:03:34,560 --> 02:03:36,800
incompatible with the neighborhood area

3283
02:03:36,800 --> 02:03:38,960
and the stated objective of the zone in

3284
02:03:38,960 --> 02:03:41,360
which it is located. Now remember we are

3285
02:03:41,360 --> 02:03:43,199
in subjective bill because it has

3286
02:03:43,199 --> 02:03:45,760
already broken the laws of the zone.

3287
02:03:45,760 --> 02:03:48,320
Okay? It's not doing normal zone stuff.

3288
02:03:48,320 --> 02:03:50,480
So, it is subjective and when we go and

3289
02:03:50,480 --> 02:03:51,760
we look at that neighborhood and we look

3290
02:03:51,760 --> 02:03:53,119
at what this would be with the

3291
02:03:53,119 --> 02:03:55,119
surrounding neighborhood, it is not

3292
02:03:55,119 --> 02:03:57,119
compatible at all with the adjacent

3293
02:03:57,119 --> 02:03:58,560
homes. I'm not just talking to you. I'm

3294
02:03:58,560 --> 02:03:59,199
talking to everyone.

3295
02:03:59,199 --> 02:04:01,760
>> Mayor, may I just

3296
02:04:01,760 --> 02:04:02,080
>> Yes.

3297
02:04:02,080 --> 02:04:03,840
>> I don't know the whole history of this,

3298
02:04:03,840 --> 02:04:06,159
but there's a difference between an

3299
02:04:06,159 --> 02:04:08,639
illegal use and a legal non-conforming

3300
02:04:08,639 --> 02:04:09,679
use.

3301
02:04:09,679 --> 02:04:11,840
>> Legal non-conforming use is legal.

3302
02:04:11,840 --> 02:04:12,560
>> It was approved.

3303
02:04:12,560 --> 02:04:13,920
>> It just doesn't

3304
02:04:13,920 --> 02:04:16,480
>> it doesn't comply now with the current

3305
02:04:16,480 --> 02:04:19,040
ordinance. It's a more recent ordinance

3306
02:04:19,040 --> 02:04:21,520
is overlaid on a legal use, what was

3307
02:04:21,520 --> 02:04:23,440
illegal use. So now it's legal

3308
02:04:23,440 --> 02:04:25,119
non-conforming. It doesn't mean it was

3309
02:04:25,119 --> 02:04:27,760
illegal when it was when it was built.

3310
02:04:27,760 --> 02:04:30,320
>> Thank you. I don't believe I said it was

3311
02:04:30,320 --> 02:04:32,159
illegal ever. But thank you for that

3312
02:04:32,159 --> 02:04:35,119
clarification.

3313
02:04:35,119 --> 02:04:37,599
Uh, no, I didn't say it broke the rules.

3314
02:04:37,599 --> 02:04:40,320
I said we were not adhering to the zone

3315
02:04:40,320 --> 02:04:42,480
code or that's what I meant if I can

3316
02:04:42,480 --> 02:04:44,320
clarify it. And you got the writing. So

3317
02:04:44,320 --> 02:04:46,239
I'll I'll I'll trust you. But we don't

3318
02:04:46,239 --> 02:04:48,480
know if when that home was built if the

3319
02:04:48,480 --> 02:04:51,280
code was different and allowed us.

3320
02:04:51,280 --> 02:04:53,040
>> That is true. I bet we could find that

3321
02:04:53,040 --> 02:04:55,360
out. Um so anyways, under the current

3322
02:04:55,360 --> 02:04:57,440
condition that it is, I don't I don't

3323
02:04:57,440 --> 02:05:00,320
see it meeting those criteria. Uh

3324
02:05:00,320 --> 02:05:02,719
however, is is it is it proper to ask

3325
02:05:02,719 --> 02:05:06,080
questions to the uh um person

3326
02:05:06,080 --> 02:05:07,760
petitioning for this? Is that okay to

3327
02:05:07,760 --> 02:05:09,119
ask some questions for

3328
02:05:09,119 --> 02:05:11,119
>> Is it a technical It's usually like

3329
02:05:11,119 --> 02:05:12,159
technical questions.

3330
02:05:12,159 --> 02:05:13,280
>> Well, I can just ask if they want to

3331
02:05:13,280 --> 02:05:14,639
answer, they can answer. Do we have the

3332
02:05:14,639 --> 02:05:16,080
property owners here?

3333
02:05:16,080 --> 02:05:16,800
>> Yeah.

3334
02:05:16,800 --> 02:05:23,430
>> If you can come up and state your name.

3335
02:05:23,440 --> 02:05:25,199
» Is the microphones turned on?

3336
02:05:25,199 --> 02:05:25,679
>> Yeah.

3337
02:05:25,679 --> 02:05:27,199
>> Okay. Thank you. Hello.

3338
02:05:27,199 --> 02:05:27,840
>> Hi.

3339
02:05:27,840 --> 02:05:30,000
My name is Corey Fabian and I am the

3340
02:05:30,000 --> 02:05:32,719
owner of the property and this is my

3341
02:05:32,719 --> 02:05:35,119
general contractor uh Jared Bishop who

3342
02:05:35,119 --> 02:05:37,440
has built numerous homes um for the

3343
02:05:37,440 --> 02:05:39,520
Alpine community. So I've asked him to

3344
02:05:39,520 --> 02:05:41,119
come and stand beside me. I hope that's

3345
02:05:41,119 --> 02:05:42,159
okay.

3346
02:05:42,159 --> 02:05:43,920
>> Thanks for coming. Uh, do you mind if I

3347
02:05:43,920 --> 02:05:45,040
ask you a couple questions?

3348
02:05:45,040 --> 02:05:45,679
>> Please do.

3349
02:05:45,679 --> 02:05:47,119
>> Okay. Thanks. And I hope you do live in

3350
02:05:47,119 --> 02:05:49,280
Alpine. Are you guys open to any

3351
02:05:49,280 --> 02:05:51,040
modifications that the adjacent

3352
02:05:51,040 --> 02:05:53,360
neighbors would uh maybe because we've

3353
02:05:53,360 --> 02:05:56,960
received some uh feedback that they are

3354
02:05:56,960 --> 02:06:00,080
uh worried of negative impact from the

3355
02:06:00,080 --> 02:06:01,520
designs that they're looking at. Would

3356
02:06:01,520 --> 02:06:04,480
you guys be open to uh meeting them in

3357
02:06:04,480 --> 02:06:05,920
the middle trying to create something

3358
02:06:05,920 --> 02:06:07,199
that maybe fits a little better? Would

3359
02:06:07,199 --> 02:06:09,199
that still fit your goals? I'm curious

3360
02:06:09,199 --> 02:06:13,119
to know what what the negative impacts,

3361
02:06:13,119 --> 02:06:14,320
okay, are.

3362
02:06:14,320 --> 02:06:17,127
>> So, there's a couple. Um, one would be

3363
02:06:17,127 --> 02:06:18,159
[clears throat] bringing down the height

3364
02:06:18,159 --> 02:06:20,639
a little to to be more in line with some

3365
02:06:20,639 --> 02:06:22,000
of the similar ones that have been there

3366
02:06:22,000 --> 02:06:24,639
for a long time. Um, another one would

3367
02:06:24,639 --> 02:06:27,920
be uh just the square foot of the home

3368
02:06:27,920 --> 02:06:30,639
if that is uh at all. And I'm asking not

3369
02:06:30,639 --> 02:06:32,560
for you to do it. I'm asking if you're

3370
02:06:32,560 --> 02:06:34,000
open to it.

3371
02:06:34,000 --> 02:06:35,760
>> Um,

3372
02:06:35,760 --> 02:06:37,760
>> thank you. Yeah.

3373
02:06:37,760 --> 02:06:40,639
All the highlighted ones are ones that

3374
02:06:40,639 --> 02:06:42,880
are as large or as tall.

3375
02:06:42,880 --> 02:06:44,000
>> Okay. Well, look, you're doing your

3376
02:06:44,000 --> 02:06:44,800
research. Good.

3377
02:06:44,800 --> 02:06:45,920
>> That is neat.

3378
02:06:45,920 --> 02:06:53,797
>> Um Okay. So, so that's the uh

3379
02:06:53,807 --> 02:06:55,360
[laughter]

3380
02:06:55,360 --> 02:06:56,719
>> So, first,

3381
02:06:56,719 --> 02:06:58,880
>> and uh and this is good that he's

3382
02:06:58,880 --> 02:07:00,800
passing this out. Just one thing because

3383
02:07:00,800 --> 02:07:03,119
I know this neighborhood well. The ones

3384
02:07:03,119 --> 02:07:05,440
in yellow are mostly new builds. The

3385
02:07:05,440 --> 02:07:07,840
ones in yellow are mostly new builds. Um

3386
02:07:07,840 --> 02:07:09,760
the homes that are directly behind the

3387
02:07:09,760 --> 02:07:11,840
property, um they sit up a little bit

3388
02:07:11,840 --> 02:07:13,679
higher.

3389
02:07:13,679 --> 02:07:15,679
>> There are four homes that are directly

3390
02:07:15,679 --> 02:07:17,360
adjacent to the backside of the

3391
02:07:17,360 --> 02:07:20,159
property. Three out of those four are

3392
02:07:20,159 --> 02:07:21,920
twostory homes,

3393
02:07:21,920 --> 02:07:22,560
>> right?

3394
02:07:22,560 --> 02:07:25,119
>> And one of them might be arguably a

3395
02:07:25,119 --> 02:07:26,880
three-story home because it has a full

3396
02:07:26,880 --> 02:07:29,360
walkout basement that is fully visible

3397
02:07:29,360 --> 02:07:33,360
from my property. Um, I'd also like to

3398
02:07:33,360 --> 02:07:36,000
note that the property that I'm building

3399
02:07:36,000 --> 02:07:39,679
is a two-story house. Um, it's not a

3400
02:07:39,679 --> 02:07:43,280
three-story house. And if you look at if

3401
02:07:43,280 --> 02:07:45,199
you if you look at this map, you'll see

3402
02:07:45,199 --> 02:07:49,440
that yes, the homes on either side of my

3403
02:07:49,440 --> 02:07:54,880
home um were built um in the Yeah. in in

3404
02:07:54,880 --> 02:07:57,679
the in the recent past. Um, and they are

3405
02:07:57,679 --> 02:08:00,480
singlestory homes. When we talk about

3406
02:08:00,480 --> 02:08:02,800
the neighborhood and how the

3407
02:08:02,800 --> 02:08:06,079
neighborhood may be impacted,

3408
02:08:06,079 --> 02:08:08,719
to me, the most defining feature of this

3409
02:08:08,719 --> 02:08:11,199
neighborhood is the park. If you go

3410
02:08:11,199 --> 02:08:13,599
around the entire perimeter of the park,

3411
02:08:13,599 --> 02:08:15,760
you have 12 twostory homes and eight

3412
02:08:15,760 --> 02:08:18,639
singlestory homes. Most of those homes

3413
02:08:18,639 --> 02:08:21,599
are new builds. And I'd also like to

3414
02:08:21,599 --> 02:08:25,840
note that I haven't taken the the design

3415
02:08:25,840 --> 02:08:28,639
of this house lightly.

3416
02:08:28,639 --> 02:08:31,679
this house. I purchased this property

3417
02:08:31,679 --> 02:08:33,760
three years ago and I've been in a

3418
02:08:33,760 --> 02:08:37,119
design process for three years and I

3419
02:08:37,119 --> 02:08:38,960
started the process by approaching the

3420
02:08:38,960 --> 02:08:42,239
city and asking questions about the

3421
02:08:42,239 --> 02:08:44,880
existing property to make sure that the

3422
02:08:44,880 --> 02:08:47,040
home that I wanted to build was

3423
02:08:47,040 --> 02:08:49,679
buildable on this piece of property.

3424
02:08:49,679 --> 02:08:52,480
Somebody noted that somebody else had

3425
02:08:52,480 --> 02:08:54,159
questioned whether or not they could

3426
02:08:54,159 --> 02:08:56,719
build and if they could build it have to

3427
02:08:56,719 --> 02:09:00,719
be on the exact same on the exact same

3428
02:09:00,719 --> 02:09:01,280
um

3429
02:09:01,280 --> 02:09:02,159
>> footprint

3430
02:09:02,159 --> 02:09:04,239
>> on the exact same footprint on the exact

3431
02:09:04,239 --> 02:09:05,440
same foundation.

3432
02:09:05,440 --> 02:09:06,960
>> I would like to note that I had the

3433
02:09:06,960 --> 02:09:09,199
foundation professionally inspected and

3434
02:09:09,199 --> 02:09:11,840
the foundation was failing. The house

3435
02:09:11,840 --> 02:09:14,480
was actually tipping. You could roll a

3436
02:09:14,480 --> 02:09:16,159
marble across the across [clears throat]

3437
02:09:16,159 --> 02:09:19,760
the floor. So, under any circumstances,

3438
02:09:19,760 --> 02:09:22,000
that house could not have been rebuilt

3439
02:09:22,000 --> 02:09:23,199
in place.

3440
02:09:23,199 --> 02:09:25,280
>> I think they don't mean like built on

3441
02:09:25,280 --> 02:09:26,880
the same foundation because Park City

3442
02:09:26,880 --> 02:09:28,560
runs into this problem a lot.

3443
02:09:28,560 --> 02:09:30,719
>> They have to like basically put a new

3444
02:09:30,719 --> 02:09:32,880
foundation in the same spot. But just

3445
02:09:32,880 --> 02:09:34,719
going back, I appreciate this. No, I

3446
02:09:34,719 --> 02:09:35,920
know the neighborhood really well.

3447
02:09:35,920 --> 02:09:38,239
You're lucky to, if you move there, live

3448
02:09:38,239 --> 02:09:40,000
by some of the finest Alpine residents

3449
02:09:40,000 --> 02:09:41,360
who have lived there for a really long

3450
02:09:41,360 --> 02:09:44,000
time. Um, the ones in yellow are new

3451
02:09:44,000 --> 02:09:45,360
builds. And this is kind of what we're

3452
02:09:45,360 --> 02:09:48,159
running into in Alpine is that uh the

3453
02:09:48,159 --> 02:09:50,880
new builds are uh drastically different

3454
02:09:50,880 --> 02:09:53,679
from some of the more uh historic homes

3455
02:09:53,679 --> 02:09:54,960
that have been here. And we're trying to

3456
02:09:54,960 --> 02:09:56,560
preserve or I am trying to preserve

3457
02:09:56,560 --> 02:09:58,560
that. I can't speak for everyone. Um,

3458
02:09:58,560 --> 02:10:01,040
but back to the question uh and I

3459
02:10:01,040 --> 02:10:03,040
appreciate you given the case. I I would

3460
02:10:03,040 --> 02:10:05,760
do the same thing. Are you guys open to

3461
02:10:05,760 --> 02:10:08,800
uh some modification to maybe um meet

3462
02:10:08,800 --> 02:10:10,480
some of the hopes of some of the

3463
02:10:10,480 --> 02:10:11,920
residents around you?

3464
02:10:11,920 --> 02:10:13,840
>> I'm I'm still curious to understand what

3465
02:10:13,840 --> 02:10:14,639
those would be.

3466
02:10:14,639 --> 02:10:16,239
>> Well, I was trying to list some there.

3467
02:10:16,239 --> 02:10:18,480
The uh the height, uh the square

3468
02:10:18,480 --> 02:10:22,239
footage, um

3469
02:10:22,239 --> 02:10:24,320
and then there's a couple specific

3470
02:10:24,320 --> 02:10:25,760
things I was going to ask you guys about

3471
02:10:25,760 --> 02:10:29,040
if you know about that would um be

3472
02:10:29,040 --> 02:10:31,760
fixable. Um can I ask about those as

3473
02:10:31,760 --> 02:10:32,239
well?

3474
02:10:32,239 --> 02:10:34,719
>> Of course. One was uh removed large pine

3475
02:10:34,719 --> 02:10:38,800
tree on the south side and then a um the

3476
02:10:38,800 --> 02:10:41,280
chain link fence that was removed. Are

3477
02:10:41,280 --> 02:10:44,000
those things that you're planning on are

3478
02:10:44,000 --> 02:10:45,840
in your in your view are those things

3479
02:10:45,840 --> 02:10:47,920
that need to be fixed? Is that is that

3480
02:10:47,920 --> 02:10:49,199
something you were planning on replacing

3481
02:10:49,199 --> 02:10:50,320
or fixing?

3482
02:10:50,320 --> 02:10:52,400
>> I don't know what large pine tree you're

3483
02:10:52,400 --> 02:10:53,920
talking about. The large pine tree that

3484
02:10:53,920 --> 02:10:55,599
I know of is actually on Kelly's

3485
02:10:55,599 --> 02:10:57,360
property on the other side of the fence.

3486
02:10:57,360 --> 02:10:59,040
So I'm a little unclear as to what

3487
02:10:59,040 --> 02:11:00,239
>> So you don't know what that is? How

3488
02:11:00,239 --> 02:11:02,000
about the fence? Is that something that

3489
02:11:02,000 --> 02:11:04,719
is uh you guys are thinking of putting

3490
02:11:04,719 --> 02:11:05,280
back?

3491
02:11:05,280 --> 02:11:08,000
>> The fence is something that I directly

3492
02:11:08,000 --> 02:11:10,639
uh went to Kelly with at the time that

3493
02:11:10,639 --> 02:11:12,960
there was a dispute and I offered

3494
02:11:12,960 --> 02:11:15,679
several suggestions for remedying the

3495
02:11:15,679 --> 02:11:19,280
problem. Um I know that this is a

3496
02:11:19,280 --> 02:11:20,960
completely separate and it's civil and

3497
02:11:20,960 --> 02:11:24,320
not and should not be weighted in the

3498
02:11:24,320 --> 02:11:26,000
decision as to whether or not I can

3499
02:11:26,000 --> 02:11:27,840
build a house, but but I'm happy to

3500
02:11:27,840 --> 02:11:28,639
speak to it.

3501
02:11:28,639 --> 02:11:32,079
>> Hope to bring peace and harmony. There's homes, but there's people,

3502
02:11:32,079 --> 02:11:32,480
>> right?

3503
02:11:32,480 --> 02:11:34,719
>> And we want to the people to love each

3504
02:11:34,719 --> 02:11:35,520
other. Now,

3505
02:11:35,520 --> 02:11:37,280
>> I fully understand that. I actually

3506
02:11:37,280 --> 02:11:39,599
approached Kelly the day before the um

3507
02:11:39,599 --> 02:11:42,800
the the uh fencing came down. I was

3508
02:11:42,800 --> 02:11:44,239
under the impression that all of the

3509
02:11:44,239 --> 02:11:45,840
fencing all the way around the property

3510
02:11:45,840 --> 02:11:48,239
belonged to me, which I was wrong.

3511
02:11:48,239 --> 02:11:51,119
>> Okay. And I approached Kelly, um,

3512
02:11:51,119 --> 02:11:52,960
actually my fiance and I went over and

3513
02:11:52,960 --> 02:11:54,719
brought cookies and let her know that,

3514
02:11:54,719 --> 02:11:56,159
you know, demolition was going to be

3515
02:11:56,159 --> 02:11:57,679
starting and if she had any problems,

3516
02:11:57,679 --> 02:12:00,000
here was a list of of phone numbers that

3517
02:12:00,000 --> 02:12:03,040
she could contact and the like. And um,

3518
02:12:03,040 --> 02:12:05,679
she promptly told me that the block wall

3519
02:12:05,679 --> 02:12:08,880
was hers, which was I didn't know that.

3520
02:12:08,880 --> 02:12:09,119
Okay.

3521
02:12:09,119 --> 02:12:12,480
>> And I I told her that I had a mason have

3522
02:12:12,480 --> 02:12:14,800
the had the block wall professionally

3523
02:12:14,800 --> 02:12:17,440
evaluated. and the interior of the block

3524
02:12:17,440 --> 02:12:22,239
wall is rotted out. And I offered to,

3525
02:12:22,239 --> 02:12:23,679
you know, I told her, "I've already paid

3526
02:12:23,679 --> 02:12:25,599
for the excavation. If we wanted to take

3527
02:12:25,599 --> 02:12:27,920
it down, I would rebuild it." And she

3528
02:12:27,920 --> 02:12:30,960
wasn't open to that. And I figured that

3529
02:12:30,960 --> 02:12:33,119
that's not worth a a

3530
02:12:33,119 --> 02:12:33,440
>> okay,

3531
02:12:33,440 --> 02:12:35,199
>> that's not worth a relationship. And so

3532
02:12:35,199 --> 02:12:37,679
I said, "Okay, so maybe when it's all

3533
02:12:37,679 --> 02:12:40,159
said and done, we can at least cap it

3534
02:12:40,159 --> 02:12:42,079
off so that it stops the rotting or

3535
02:12:42,079 --> 02:12:44,560
whatever." Um, and I asked her about the

3536
02:12:44,560 --> 02:12:46,400
chain link fence. There was a three-foot

3537
02:12:46,400 --> 02:12:49,280
chainlink fence across the sidey yard in

3538
02:12:49,280 --> 02:12:52,000
the front of the house. That was a tree

3539
02:12:52,000 --> 02:12:53,679
or something must have fallen on it at

3540
02:12:53,679 --> 02:12:56,079
some point. It was crushed in one area

3541
02:12:56,079 --> 02:12:58,960
and in disrepair. And

3542
02:12:58,960 --> 02:13:00,159
>> I asked her, "Well, what do you think

3543
02:13:00,159 --> 02:13:02,639
about the chain link fence?" And her

3544
02:13:02,639 --> 02:13:04,719
quote reply was, "I don't care anything

3545
02:13:04,719 --> 02:13:05,920
about the chain link fence."

3546
02:13:05,920 --> 02:13:07,440
>> Okay. Okay. Well, just

3547
02:13:07,440 --> 02:13:09,360
>> the chain link fence is what came down

3548
02:13:09,360 --> 02:13:10,079
the next day.

3549
02:13:10,079 --> 02:13:12,159
>> I'm trying. I I I only had one question.

3550
02:13:12,159 --> 02:13:14,800
I haven't got it. Uh e either way the

3551
02:13:14,800 --> 02:13:16,560
question is um would you be willing to

3552
02:13:16,560 --> 02:13:17,920
make some adjustments? Absolutely. You

3553
02:13:17,920 --> 02:13:19,360
would? Okay. That's all I'm wondering.

3554
02:13:19,360 --> 02:13:20,800
You would be willing to work with the

3555
02:13:20,800 --> 02:13:22,000
adjacent neighbors to make some

3556
02:13:22,000 --> 02:13:24,239
adjustments that would create a harmony

3557
02:13:24,239 --> 02:13:25,520
in that neighborhood?

3558
02:13:25,520 --> 02:13:26,400
>> Of course.

3559
02:13:26,400 --> 02:13:27,920
>> I would I would I would be happy to

3560
02:13:27,920 --> 02:13:29,920
table this. I'm not making a motion. I'm

3561
02:13:29,920 --> 02:13:31,360
just suggesting I'd be happy to table

3562
02:13:31,360 --> 02:13:33,199
this until they come to a happy medium

3563
02:13:33,199 --> 02:13:34,400
and then I would be more than

3564
02:13:34,400 --> 02:13:36,000
supportive. That was the only question I

3565
02:13:36,000 --> 02:13:38,000
had. May I ask one question to to the

3566
02:13:38,000 --> 02:13:38,880
Workman family?

3567
02:13:38,880 --> 02:13:40,480
>> So I just want to make sure like you

3568
02:13:40,480 --> 02:13:42,079
know what? Let's wait. I they're going

3569
02:13:42,079 --> 02:13:44,400
to come up for comment. So, you're

3570
02:13:44,400 --> 02:13:46,719
agreeing to change the height and the

3571
02:13:46,719 --> 02:13:48,400
square foot of your home. Is that what

3572
02:13:48,400 --> 02:13:50,639
that's what he's asking? I just

3573
02:13:50,639 --> 02:13:52,159
>> I'm hearing are you willing to work with

3574
02:13:52,159 --> 02:13:54,719
the neighbor to remedy the fence that

3575
02:13:54,719 --> 02:13:57,119
came down? And just to be clear, as soon

3576
02:13:57,119 --> 02:13:57,520
as

3577
02:13:57,520 --> 02:13:59,360
>> that's not his question, the three

3578
02:13:59,360 --> 02:14:01,520
things. Uh I don't need to answer the

3579
02:14:01,520 --> 02:14:02,639
question. And I understand because

3580
02:14:02,639 --> 02:14:03,840
>> you don't have to. I just want to make

3581
02:14:03,840 --> 02:14:04,960
sure that

3582
02:14:04,960 --> 02:14:06,159
>> you understand what you're going to

3583
02:14:06,159 --> 02:14:07,040
because

3584
02:14:07,040 --> 02:14:09,599
>> I believe what you're asking is you want

3585
02:14:09,599 --> 02:14:11,280
her to agree to change the square

3586
02:14:11,280 --> 02:14:12,480
footage and the height of her home.

3587
02:14:12,480 --> 02:14:15,040
>> I'm asking if she would be open to these

3588
02:14:15,040 --> 02:14:16,880
>> and you said yes. That's what he's

3589
02:14:16,880 --> 02:14:18,159
hearing. So, I just want to make sure

3590
02:14:18,159 --> 02:14:20,159
that you guys are on the same page that

3591
02:14:20,159 --> 02:14:21,599
you understand what you're

3592
02:14:21,599 --> 02:14:23,440
>> So, you're not in agreement or you're

3593
02:14:23,440 --> 02:14:24,800
not okay with making adjustments.

3594
02:14:24,800 --> 02:14:26,239
>> She's in agreement with working on with

3595
02:14:26,239 --> 02:14:27,040
the fence situation.

3596
02:14:27,040 --> 02:14:28,639
>> Fence, yes. Home, no.

3597
02:14:28,639 --> 02:14:29,520
>> Well, is that correct?

3598
02:14:29,520 --> 02:14:31,040
>> So, here's the thing with the house. I

3599
02:14:31,040 --> 02:14:32,400
mean, I hear what you're saying where

3600
02:14:32,400 --> 02:14:34,639
your interpretation of those four rules

3601
02:14:34,639 --> 02:14:37,520
aren't met, but I I disagree with that.

3602
02:14:37,520 --> 02:14:40,560
And I've checked with the city one, two,

3603
02:14:40,560 --> 02:14:43,360
three, four, five, six, seven, seven

3604
02:14:43,360 --> 02:14:46,000
times. I've either spoken directly with

3605
02:14:46,000 --> 02:14:47,920
planning and zoning or sat in front of

3606
02:14:47,920 --> 02:14:50,079
the DRC to make sure that everything

3607
02:14:50,079 --> 02:14:52,400
that I was doing was within compliance

3608
02:14:52,400 --> 02:14:54,960
of all of the codes and the ordinances.

3609
02:14:54,960 --> 02:14:56,560
And I have been told over and over again

3610
02:14:56,560 --> 02:14:59,119
that it is. And I am hundreds of

3611
02:14:59,119 --> 02:15:00,800
thousands of dollars into the this

3612
02:15:00,800 --> 02:15:02,880
project at this point. And the only

3613
02:15:02,880 --> 02:15:04,239
thing that's keeping me from breaking

3614
02:15:04,239 --> 02:15:07,679
ground is the is the building permit.

3615
02:15:07,679 --> 02:15:10,400
And this is supposed to be a

3616
02:15:10,400 --> 02:15:12,000
technicality because it's legal

3617
02:15:12,000 --> 02:15:14,480
non-conforming. But I've conformed to

3618
02:15:14,480 --> 02:15:15,920
everything that is legal.

3619
02:15:15,920 --> 02:15:17,360
>> She meets all of the ordinances.

3620
02:15:17,360 --> 02:15:19,280
>> I meet all of the ordinances and all of

3621
02:15:19,280 --> 02:15:19,920
the codes.

3622
02:15:19,920 --> 02:15:21,440
>> I know that I work a different way

3623
02:15:21,440 --> 02:15:22,239
though.

3624
02:15:22,239 --> 02:15:24,000
>> Okay. Did you have any other questions?

3625
02:15:24,000 --> 02:15:25,280
>> Just for the workman, but thank you so

3626
02:15:25,280 --> 02:15:28,239
much. Can I can I finish commenting? I

3627
02:15:28,239 --> 02:15:30,320
would like to say that this does not

3628
02:15:30,320 --> 02:15:32,079
bring down the value of the properties

3629
02:15:32,079 --> 02:15:34,159
or the adjacent neighborhood. It

3630
02:15:34,159 --> 02:15:35,599
actually improves the adjacent

3631
02:15:35,599 --> 02:15:37,760
neighborhood. And the house that came

3632
02:15:37,760 --> 02:15:41,119
down was questionably a drug house and

3633
02:15:41,119 --> 02:15:43,440
had multiple people that that came

3634
02:15:43,440 --> 02:15:46,800
through. You can look it up next door.

3635
02:15:46,800 --> 02:15:50,159
>> Well, okay, you guys make a comment, but

3636
02:15:50,159 --> 02:15:51,280
then we need to move on.

3637
02:15:51,280 --> 02:15:55,589
>> My comment is that

3638
02:15:55,599 --> 02:15:59,920
the home that I'm going to build.

3639
02:15:59,920 --> 02:16:03,360
I've even designed it so that it has the

3640
02:16:03,360 --> 02:16:07,440
same character as the adjacent

3641
02:16:07,440 --> 02:16:08,960
neighborhoods.

3642
02:16:08,960 --> 02:16:12,400
It's literally in the corridor between

3643
02:16:12,400 --> 02:16:15,840
what I would consider Alpine proper and

3644
02:16:15,840 --> 02:16:18,239
all of the new development. And the

3645
02:16:18,239 --> 02:16:21,599
homes that are directly behind my home

3646
02:16:21,599 --> 02:16:24,000
are not brand new homes and they are all

3647
02:16:24,000 --> 02:16:25,840
two-story homes. Almost all of them.

3648
02:16:25,840 --> 02:16:28,800
There's only one exception.

3649
02:16:28,800 --> 02:16:29,360
>> They're very

3650
02:16:29,360 --> 02:16:31,119
>> And I don't block the view for anybody

3651
02:16:31,119 --> 02:16:32,160
in any area.

3652
02:16:32,160 --> 02:16:33,840
>> Okay. Well, we heard you. Thank you. I

3653
02:16:33,840 --> 02:16:35,200
appreciate it. I I hope you're a

3654
02:16:35,200 --> 02:16:37,280
wonderful resident of Alpine. I I'll ask

3655
02:16:37,280 --> 02:16:38,559
the last question to the workman when

3656
02:16:38,559 --> 02:16:39,200
they come up with this.

3657
02:16:39,200 --> 02:16:40,880
>> Okay. Great. Thank you, Corey, for your

3658
02:16:40,880 --> 02:16:40,960
time.

3659
02:16:40,960 --> 02:16:42,000
>> Thank you for your time. Thank you.

3660
02:16:42,000 --> 02:16:44,399
>> Brent, did you have any questions

3661
02:16:44,399 --> 02:16:45,040
regarding this?

3662
02:16:45,040 --> 02:16:46,080
>> Well, it wasn't just questions because

3663
02:16:46,080 --> 02:16:47,200
everyone gave their opinions. So, I'm

3664
02:16:47,200 --> 02:16:48,080
gonna go ahead and do the same.

3665
02:16:48,080 --> 02:16:51,760
>> Yes, please. Brent, sorry.

3666
02:16:51,760 --> 02:16:52,479
>> What?

3667
02:16:52,479 --> 02:16:55,750
>> No.

3668
02:16:55,760 --> 02:16:57,200
» I mean, yeah, everyone gave their

3669
02:16:57,200 --> 02:16:58,080
opinion, so

3670
02:16:58,080 --> 02:16:59,760
>> I know. No, I thought I laid it out.

3671
02:16:59,760 --> 02:17:02,160
>> I'm gonna I'm gonna revert back to my

3672
02:17:02,160 --> 02:17:04,000
law school days when I studied real

3673
02:17:04,000 --> 02:17:06,960
property and my time uh practicing land

3674
02:17:06,960 --> 02:17:09,519
use law and also my own practical

3675
02:17:09,519 --> 02:17:10,880
experience of living all over the

3676
02:17:10,880 --> 02:17:14,240
country. Um, first of all, I was going

3677
02:17:14,240 --> 02:17:17,920
to save this until the next item, but I

3678
02:17:17,920 --> 02:17:19,519
will talk about the constitutional

3679
02:17:19,519 --> 02:17:22,880
rights to own and use property as you'd

3680
02:17:22,880 --> 02:17:26,160
like to use it. Um, I think that's very

3681
02:17:26,160 --> 02:17:27,679
important to understand that people have

3682
02:17:27,679 --> 02:17:29,040
the right to use their property as they

3683
02:17:29,040 --> 02:17:31,280
would like to use it.

3684
02:17:31,280 --> 02:17:34,800
I would also like to note that um, I

3685
02:17:34,800 --> 02:17:36,000
made a lot of different notes from the

3686
02:17:36,000 --> 02:17:39,120
different the different uh, discussions.

3687
02:17:39,120 --> 02:17:40,639
Um,

3688
02:17:40,639 --> 02:17:42,399
I'll just go through the the list here.

3689
02:17:42,399 --> 02:17:44,479
The proposed enlargement or extension

3690
02:17:44,479 --> 02:17:45,679
will not significantly alter the

3691
02:17:45,679 --> 02:17:46,800
character of the building or the use of

3692
02:17:46,800 --> 02:17:48,639
the property. In this case, we're not

3693
02:17:48,639 --> 02:17:51,599
expanding on the building. It's uh it's

3694
02:17:51,599 --> 02:17:53,599
a reconstruction. This is very common,

3695
02:17:53,599 --> 02:17:55,519
especially in older neighborhoods all

3696
02:17:55,519 --> 02:17:58,319
over the country, that eventually houses

3697
02:17:58,319 --> 02:18:00,800
break down and it's time to rebuild. And

3698
02:18:00,800 --> 02:18:03,200
it's very common in Alpine and other

3699
02:18:03,200 --> 02:18:05,760
places to see new homes in old

3700
02:18:05,760 --> 02:18:06,960
neighborhoods. That's just a matter of

3701
02:18:06,960 --> 02:18:09,920
fact. So I don't think I I believe it

3702
02:18:09,920 --> 02:18:12,800
meets number one. Um the second one is

3703
02:18:12,800 --> 02:18:14,479
the building or use of extended will not

3704
02:18:14,479 --> 02:18:16,080
have the effect of diminishing the value

3705
02:18:16,080 --> 02:18:17,920
of property or the quality of living

3706
02:18:17,920 --> 02:18:20,639
environment of adjacent properties. I

3707
02:18:20,639 --> 02:18:22,880
agree with the owner um based on my own

3708
02:18:22,880 --> 02:18:25,120
experience and understanding land use

3709
02:18:25,120 --> 02:18:27,040
law is you never want to be the biggest

3710
02:18:27,040 --> 02:18:28,960
house in the neighborhood because the

3711
02:18:28,960 --> 02:18:31,040
smaller homes increase in value as home

3712
02:18:31,040 --> 02:18:32,960
bigger homes are built. So I think the

3713
02:18:32,960 --> 02:18:36,000
opposite is in fact true that the area

3714
02:18:36,000 --> 02:18:38,479
the homes in the area will imp their

3715
02:18:38,479 --> 02:18:41,120
property value will increase by having a

3716
02:18:41,120 --> 02:18:43,760
nicer home next to them.

3717
02:18:43,760 --> 02:18:45,359
Uh the proposed enlargement will not

3718
02:18:45,359 --> 02:18:46,559
significantly increase the number of

3719
02:18:46,559 --> 02:18:48,719
vehicles or pedestrians. I think that's

3720
02:18:48,719 --> 02:18:51,120
been met or no additional hazards. The

3721
02:18:51,120 --> 02:18:52,800
proposed enlargement will not result in

3722
02:18:52,800 --> 02:18:54,080
the establishment of a condition

3723
02:18:54,080 --> 02:18:55,840
incompatible with the neighborhood. I'll

3724
02:18:55,840 --> 02:18:58,000
agree with Chrissy that that

3725
02:18:58,000 --> 02:19:00,719
compatibility is single family homes.

3726
02:19:00,719 --> 02:19:02,559
You look at this diagram and thanks for

3727
02:19:02,559 --> 02:19:04,719
providing that. It looks exactly like my

3728
02:19:04,719 --> 02:19:07,679
neighborhood in South Alpine where we

3729
02:19:07,679 --> 02:19:10,000
have a mix of Ramblers singlestory and

3730
02:19:10,000 --> 02:19:12,080
we have

3731
02:19:12,080 --> 02:19:13,519
uh two-story buildings with basements

3732
02:19:13,519 --> 02:19:15,439
like my home and like you were talking

3733
02:19:15,439 --> 02:19:17,760
about. Um there's a home being built in

3734
02:19:17,760 --> 02:19:19,920
my in my neighborhood that looks nothing

3735
02:19:19,920 --> 02:19:22,719
like the others. It everyone else has

3736
02:19:22,719 --> 02:19:24,479
the standard look of the homes that were

3737
02:19:24,479 --> 02:19:26,960
built basically 20 years ago. This new

3738
02:19:26,960 --> 02:19:28,800
home is a modern home with a flat roof.

3739
02:19:28,800 --> 02:19:31,120
It's a It's a rectangle. It looks very

3740
02:19:31,120 --> 02:19:34,000
odd to me, but that's their property,

3741
02:19:34,000 --> 02:19:36,160
right? They meet the condition. They

3742
02:19:36,160 --> 02:19:39,359
meet the ordinances of setbacks of

3743
02:19:39,359 --> 02:19:42,319
what's the other term?

3744
02:19:42,319 --> 02:19:45,120
>> Yeah. Height, but also uh lots lot

3745
02:19:45,120 --> 02:19:47,040
coverage ratio, which we're talking

3746
02:19:47,040 --> 02:19:48,880
about bulkan massing, but I think it's

3747
02:19:48,880 --> 02:19:53,280
actually called um lot coverage ratio.

3748
02:19:53,280 --> 02:19:55,840
Um, you just people have the right to

3749
02:19:55,840 --> 02:19:57,120
build the properties they want as long

3750
02:19:57,120 --> 02:19:58,319
as it's within the or within the

3751
02:19:58,319 --> 02:20:01,600
ordinance. And um, you can't just like

3752
02:20:01,600 --> 02:20:03,520
we can't dictate the color of someone's

3753
02:20:03,520 --> 02:20:05,520
home, we also can't dictate the size of

3754
02:20:05,520 --> 02:20:07,600
their home. If someone there's still a

3755
02:20:07,600 --> 02:20:08,640
couple of vacant lots in my

3756
02:20:08,640 --> 02:20:09,760
neighborhood, if someone would want to

3757
02:20:09,760 --> 02:20:14,080
build a a a much larger home than mine

3758
02:20:14,080 --> 02:20:16,720
is, um, as long as it meets the

3759
02:20:16,720 --> 02:20:18,399
criteria, I don't think I'd have any

3760
02:20:18,399 --> 02:20:22,880
justice in or basis in opposing that.

3761
02:20:22,880 --> 02:20:25,920
Uh it's a it's an irregular lot and we

3762
02:20:25,920 --> 02:20:27,359
just dealt with one of those just a

3763
02:20:27,359 --> 02:20:29,920
couple of meetings ago.

3764
02:20:29,920 --> 02:20:32,319
Unfortunately, having practice law in

3765
02:20:32,319 --> 02:20:34,399
Oregon where land use is very very

3766
02:20:34,399 --> 02:20:36,000
controlled. It's one of the most liberal

3767
02:20:36,000 --> 02:20:37,840
cities in America and they significantly

3768
02:20:37,840 --> 02:20:39,760
control land use. Utah was not like

3769
02:20:39,760 --> 02:20:42,080
that. Utah is more of a conservative uh

3770
02:20:42,080 --> 02:20:46,560
state and until fairly recently

3771
02:20:46,560 --> 02:20:49,120
planned communities and thought out

3772
02:20:49,120 --> 02:20:52,080
zoning and processes uh weren't really

3773
02:20:52,080 --> 02:20:56,240
prevalent and when this home was built I assume that was the case and that at

3774
02:20:56,240 --> 02:20:57,840
the time obviously it conformed to

3775
02:20:57,840 --> 02:21:09,270
whatever requirements were there if any

3776
02:21:09,280 --> 02:21:10,880
Again, all homes do not need to be

3777
02:21:10,880 --> 02:21:12,640
uniform.

3778
02:21:12,640 --> 02:21:14,479
And I'll just end with this. This is an

3779
02:21:14,479 --> 02:21:16,240
example of why land use laws, including

3780
02:21:16,240 --> 02:21:18,240
Alpine's ordinances, allow exceptions to

3781
02:21:18,240 --> 02:21:20,399
a standard zoning and other land use

3782
02:21:20,399 --> 02:21:22,720
ordinances. When a prior building was

3783
02:21:22,720 --> 02:21:24,319
built in compliance with the then

3784
02:21:24,319 --> 02:21:26,399
existing ordinances, or there was no

3785
02:21:26,399 --> 02:21:28,479
applicable ordinance, the zoning or

3786
02:21:28,479 --> 02:21:30,560
ordinance was later changed. And now,

3787
02:21:30,560 --> 02:21:31,920
when it's time to replace an older

3788
02:21:31,920 --> 02:21:34,000
building, a similar use of that property

3789
02:21:34,000 --> 02:21:35,840
can be accommodated under an exception

3790
02:21:35,840 --> 02:21:38,640
or ordinance modification. in this case

3791
02:21:38,640 --> 02:21:40,560
approval of a non-conforming building.

3792
02:21:40,560 --> 02:21:42,160
So for me, I think it meets all the

3793
02:21:42,160 --> 02:21:43,600
criteria.

3794
02:21:43,600 --> 02:21:44,160
>> Thanks.

3795
02:21:44,160 --> 02:21:47,280
>> Okay. So Jessica, I know I asked you for

3796
02:21:47,280 --> 02:21:49,200
a question and you asked your question.

3797
02:21:49,200 --> 02:21:50,560
Did you want to make a comment since

3798
02:21:50,560 --> 02:21:52,720
everybody else did before we move on to

3799
02:21:52,720 --> 02:21:54,960
comments from the adjacent property

3800
02:21:54,960 --> 02:21:58,790
owners?

3801
02:21:58,800 --> 02:22:02,080
» Just my my comment would be regarding

3802
02:22:02,080 --> 02:22:05,280
land use. Um,

3803
02:22:05,280 --> 02:22:08,720
we do have the legislative authority in

3804
02:22:08,720 --> 02:22:12,080
this situation and so it isn't just a

3805
02:22:12,080 --> 02:22:15,200
cut and dry land use issue and we're not

3806
02:22:15,200 --> 02:22:16,800
prohibiting

3807
02:22:16,800 --> 02:22:19,920
the property owner from using the land

3808
02:22:19,920 --> 02:22:22,960
as written by our ordinances. So, it's

3809
02:22:22,960 --> 02:22:25,280
just that that comment. I don't see this

3810
02:22:25,280 --> 02:22:28,000
as prohibiting. I see this there's a

3811
02:22:28,000 --> 02:22:29,359
reason that we have a legislative

3812
02:22:29,359 --> 02:22:32,800
oversight for these exact reasons. I'm

3813
02:22:32,800 --> 02:22:34,399
concerned that we're in the middle of

3814
02:22:34,399 --> 02:22:36,880
evaluating bulk and massing. These are

3815
02:22:36,880 --> 02:22:38,479
things that we've talked about for quite

3816
02:22:38,479 --> 02:22:41,760
a while now of this is just the

3817
02:22:41,760 --> 02:22:45,120
direction that Alpine is going. And so

3818
02:22:45,120 --> 02:22:47,600
right now at each of these crossroads

3819
02:22:47,600 --> 02:22:50,479
we're making decisions for the future

3820
02:22:50,479 --> 02:22:53,280
for 100 years. And so what are those

3821
02:22:53,280 --> 02:22:55,920
decisions we want to make?

3822
02:22:55,920 --> 02:22:57,120
>> And that's my comment.

3823
02:22:57,120 --> 02:22:58,560
>> So was the bulk and massing you were

3824
02:22:58,560 --> 02:22:59,760
looking at was that in commercial

3825
02:22:59,760 --> 02:23:02,479
property or residential?

3826
02:23:02,479 --> 02:23:05,040
um both.

3827
02:23:05,040 --> 02:23:06,880
But because it's not a current

3828
02:23:06,880 --> 02:23:10,560
ordinance, it's not relevant.

3829
02:23:10,560 --> 02:23:12,960
>> But because this is a legislative

3830
02:23:12,960 --> 02:23:16,479
decision, all information is relevant.

3831
02:23:16,479 --> 02:23:18,720
>> I did, and Shane mentioned it, but I did

3832
02:23:18,720 --> 02:23:20,960
fail to note that it was unanimous

3833
02:23:20,960 --> 02:23:22,319
recommendation for approval by the

3834
02:23:22,319 --> 02:23:24,479
planning commission after reviewing the

3835
02:23:24,479 --> 02:23:27,120
same ordinances that we've looked at.

3836
02:23:27,120 --> 02:23:29,520
>> Okay. I'm going to ask um the adjacent

3837
02:23:29,520 --> 02:23:31,280
property owners. We'll go in this order.

3838
02:23:31,280 --> 02:23:33,359
Susan Pacer, then Kelly Workman, and

3839
02:23:33,359 --> 02:23:36,560
then Mike Pacer. If you guys can come up

3840
02:23:36,560 --> 02:23:46,710
with your comments.

3841
02:23:46,720 --> 02:23:48,800
Um, I'm just going to say that I am

3842
02:23:48,800 --> 02:23:52,160
opposed to this and my husband and I

3843
02:23:52,160 --> 02:23:53,840
have discussed this a lot and he has a

3844
02:23:53,840 --> 02:23:56,160
lot more to say about it, but I just

3845
02:23:56,160 --> 02:23:58,319
wanted you to know that I'm opposed.

3846
02:23:58,319 --> 02:24:02,880
I'll let him talk. Okay. Oh, I'm sorry.

3847
02:24:02,880 --> 02:24:04,640
Miss Pacer. Is there any way

3848
02:24:04,640 --> 02:24:06,080
you can come up and state your name and

3849
02:24:06,080 --> 02:24:07,760
the street that you live on? I'm so

3850
02:24:07,760 --> 02:24:08,800
sorry.

3851
02:24:08,800 --> 02:24:09,680
>> Just for the record.

3852
02:24:09,680 --> 02:24:11,359
Yeah. So, sorry if

3853
02:24:11,359 --> 02:24:12,000
And then

3854
02:24:12,000 --> 02:24:15,280
>> most people go too long. You did great.

3855
02:24:15,280 --> 02:24:18,080
>> Susan Pacer is my name and I live at 500

3856
02:24:18,080 --> 02:24:19,600
East 100 South.

3857
02:24:19,600 --> 02:24:23,510
>> Thank you.

3858
02:24:23,520 --> 02:24:25,120
» Yeah. I'm sorry. Yes. three minute

3859
02:24:25,120 --> 02:24:26,960
comment

3860
02:24:26,960 --> 02:24:28,880
but obviously she didn't take so

3861
02:24:28,880 --> 02:24:30,399
>> but yes if you can put three minutes on

3862
02:24:30,399 --> 02:24:32,300
the clock for Miss Workman

3863
02:24:32,300 --> 02:24:34,630
[clears throat]

3864
02:24:34,640 --> 02:24:36,960
» I just wanted you guys this is just

3865
02:24:36,960 --> 02:24:46,309
showing the size

3866
02:24:46,319 --> 02:24:48,240
» my name is Kelly Workman and I live on

3867
02:24:48,240 --> 02:24:52,160
100 um south uh I'm 480 right next to

3868
02:24:52,160 --> 02:24:54,399
this empty lot that's

3869
02:24:54,399 --> 02:24:56,720
And um

3870
02:24:56,720 --> 02:24:58,479
I'd love if you guys put yourself in my

3871
02:24:58,479 --> 02:25:00,880
situation where I you know if you live

3872
02:25:00,880 --> 02:25:06,479
next to this and I um I live in the

3873
02:25:06,479 --> 02:25:08,080
house next to it. I don't know if you

3874
02:25:08,080 --> 02:25:10,160
guys know it was the Beck home. It was

3875
02:25:10,160 --> 02:25:12,479
built in 1895 and it's, you know, an old

3876
02:25:12,479 --> 02:25:14,640
historical home and I worked with the

3877
02:25:14,640 --> 02:25:16,560
Becks for a few years and they sold it

3878
02:25:16,560 --> 02:25:18,000
to me because they didn't want someone

3879
02:25:18,000 --> 02:25:19,840
coming in tearing it down, putting a

3880
02:25:19,840 --> 02:25:21,840
big, you know, big new home on it and so

3881
02:25:21,840 --> 02:25:23,280
they wanted to keep it the way that it

3882
02:25:23,280 --> 02:25:26,880
was and so I was able to get it. Um,

3883
02:25:26,880 --> 02:25:30,000
I I moved here, our family moved here in

3884
02:25:30,000 --> 02:25:32,479
1967, so it's been a lot of years, but I

3885
02:25:32,479 --> 02:25:35,200
bought this home. I bought this home and

3886
02:25:35,200 --> 02:25:37,920
then the lot next door went up for sale

3887
02:25:37,920 --> 02:25:39,439
and it's been for sale two or three

3888
02:25:39,439 --> 02:25:41,280
times and you know Shane says he doesn't

3889
02:25:41,280 --> 02:25:42,720
remember me calling and I'm not sure

3890
02:25:42,720 --> 02:25:45,120
that I talked to him but I called the

3891
02:25:45,120 --> 02:25:47,520
city more than one time asking telling

3892
02:25:47,520 --> 02:25:49,920
them the lot and where it was and if I

3893
02:25:49,920 --> 02:25:52,640
bought it because you can see that my

3894
02:25:52,640 --> 02:25:56,479
property goes back behind that lot. So

3895
02:25:56,479 --> 02:25:58,720
if I added to it, it would be I'm the

3896
02:25:58,720 --> 02:26:00,240
only one that could really do anything

3897
02:26:00,240 --> 02:26:02,800
with it because it's so small.

3898
02:26:02,800 --> 02:26:05,680
And I was told both times that it could

3899
02:26:05,680 --> 02:26:07,760
only be on the same footprint because

3900
02:26:07,760 --> 02:26:10,160
the lot was not the right size that it

3901
02:26:10,160 --> 02:26:12,000
was too it was a non-conforming lot. You

3902
02:26:12,000 --> 02:26:13,200
could not build any bigger than the

3903
02:26:13,200 --> 02:26:15,840
footprint on it. And then my neighbor

3904
02:26:15,840 --> 02:26:18,720
where I lived um up on Peach Tree,

3905
02:26:18,720 --> 02:26:20,560
Sherry Borne, who's been real estate for

3906
02:26:20,560 --> 02:26:22,319
years and years and born and raised

3907
02:26:22,319 --> 02:26:24,240
here. I asked I talked to her about it.

3908
02:26:24,240 --> 02:26:25,680
She says, "Nope, it has to be on the

3909
02:26:25,680 --> 02:26:28,160
same footprint. The lot is too small."

3910
02:26:28,160 --> 02:26:30,960
>> So I just didn't I mean I didn't

3911
02:26:30,960 --> 02:26:33,840
purchase it. you know, because of that.

3912
02:26:33,840 --> 02:26:35,680
Um,

3913
02:26:35,680 --> 02:26:39,120
and then it gets sold to Corey and then

3914
02:26:39,120 --> 02:26:40,560
I just hear, "Oh, they meet the

3915
02:26:40,560 --> 02:26:42,640
setbacks. She can build a house whatever

3916
02:26:42,640 --> 02:26:44,800
size as long as she meets the setbacks."

3917
02:26:44,800 --> 02:26:46,800
That is not at all what I was told. And

3918
02:26:46,800 --> 02:26:50,319
that lot is so small. Um, I know she

3919
02:26:50,319 --> 02:26:51,920
talked about, "Oh, the house is behind

3920
02:26:51,920 --> 02:26:54,560
me." I mean, I'm behind her. The homes

3921
02:26:54,560 --> 02:26:56,640
behind it are River Meadows that you go

3922
02:26:56,640 --> 02:26:58,479
up the road and way behind. That's a

3923
02:26:58,479 --> 02:27:01,280
subdivision newer and all behind there.

3924
02:27:01,280 --> 02:27:04,479
If you just look at 100 South all along

3925
02:27:04,479 --> 02:27:06,479
there, they're only one-story homes.

3926
02:27:06,479 --> 02:27:09,120
Mine has a little dormer, you know, one

3927
02:27:09,120 --> 02:27:13,120
and a half, I guess. And

3928
02:27:13,120 --> 02:27:15,600
you know, we have the park across, but

3929
02:27:15,600 --> 02:27:17,040
there's a couple homes that you guys

3930
02:27:17,040 --> 02:27:18,560
have approved. There's one up on Main

3931
02:27:18,560 --> 02:27:20,560
Street about I think it's about 700

3932
02:27:20,560 --> 02:27:23,120
North that just looks like this huge

3933
02:27:23,120 --> 02:27:25,840
salt box, you know, among the older

3934
02:27:25,840 --> 02:27:29,280
homes, old, you know, the old Terry home

3935
02:27:29,280 --> 02:27:31,280
and this one that just sticks clear up

3936
02:27:31,280 --> 02:27:33,680
in the air. Looks terrible for the

3937
02:27:33,680 --> 02:27:36,240
neighborhood, I think. And that's what,

3938
02:27:36,240 --> 02:27:38,000
you know, this is going to look like. I

3939
02:27:38,000 --> 02:27:40,720
mean, if you look how my lot and the

3940
02:27:40,720 --> 02:27:44,319
home Oh, sorry. And it's only 32. My

3941
02:27:44,319 --> 02:27:47,200
house is 3200 square feet on that big

3942
02:27:47,200 --> 02:27:48,560
lot.

3943
02:27:48,560 --> 02:27:52,240
>> 3700 square feet on that teeny little

3944
02:27:52,240 --> 02:27:52,880
lot.

3945
02:27:52,880 --> 02:27:57,200
>> I'm sorry. That is your time. Um,

3946
02:27:57,200 --> 02:28:00,160
so, you know, there's issues. What she

3947
02:28:00,160 --> 02:28:01,520
told you about the fence, you know,

3948
02:28:01,520 --> 02:28:04,720
isn't correct. And I, you know, would

3949
02:28:04,720 --> 02:28:08,080
like to go over that if there's a before

3950
02:28:08,080 --> 02:28:09,680
she can get a a permit.

3951
02:28:09,680 --> 02:28:12,319
>> Can we ask her one question?

3952
02:28:12,319 --> 02:28:13,280
Do you have any questions?

3953
02:28:13,280 --> 02:28:16,160
>> Do do does she available to do question?

3954
02:28:16,160 --> 02:28:17,680
>> One question. Yes.

3955
02:28:17,680 --> 02:28:19,280
>> Do you see any path to work with the

3956
02:28:19,280 --> 02:28:21,600
homeowner where you guys could find a

3957
02:28:21,600 --> 02:28:24,560
some sort of mutual solution that you

3958
02:28:24,560 --> 02:28:26,399
would both be happy with

3959
02:28:26,399 --> 02:28:28,720
>> regarding the house or the fence?

3960
02:28:28,720 --> 02:28:30,080
>> Both.

3961
02:28:30,080 --> 02:28:33,280
>> I I feel like that I know they say it's

3962
02:28:33,280 --> 02:28:36,080
a civil matter, but you know, it was

3963
02:28:36,080 --> 02:28:38,800
torn down and I and was told that it was

3964
02:28:38,800 --> 02:28:41,200
my fence. So, I feel like I think

3965
02:28:41,200 --> 02:28:42,640
they're open to that one. How about the

3966
02:28:42,640 --> 02:28:43,760
house?

3967
02:28:43,760 --> 02:28:46,240
>> I think that you know how tall that is.

3968
02:28:46,240 --> 02:28:48,720
The chimneys are 44 feet tall.

3969
02:28:48,720 --> 02:28:51,920
>> Does 44 fit into our height ordinance?

3970
02:28:51,920 --> 02:28:53,439
>> That is horrible.

3971
02:28:53,439 --> 02:28:54,160
>> I'm sorry.

3972
02:28:54,160 --> 02:28:55,520
>> This is not going to look This is going

3973
02:28:55,520 --> 02:28:57,359
to look horrible in this neighborhood.

3974
02:28:57,359 --> 02:28:58,560
>> She's not alone on her street of

3975
02:28:58,560 --> 02:28:59,520
bringing these things up with other

3976
02:28:59,520 --> 02:29:00,800
house. But anyways, yeah. Okay, that was

3977
02:29:00,800 --> 02:29:02,399
my question. Thank you for all that you

3978
02:29:02,399 --> 02:29:04,240
>> Thank you. If we can have Mike Pacer

3979
02:29:04,240 --> 02:29:05,920
come up, if you could state your name

3980
02:29:05,920 --> 02:29:09,040
and state your street.

3981
02:29:09,040 --> 02:29:10,960
So, just to be clear on the height, the

3982
02:29:10,960 --> 02:29:13,359
height limit is for 34 feet to the

3983
02:29:13,359 --> 02:29:16,080
midpoint of the roof, but a chimneys and

3984
02:29:16,080 --> 02:29:17,840
other, they call them ancillary

3985
02:29:17,840 --> 02:29:20,560
structures in the ordinance can be

3986
02:29:20,560 --> 02:29:22,319
higher than that. And there's a height.

3987
02:29:22,319 --> 02:29:23,840
I can't remember what it is, but we did

3988
02:29:23,840 --> 02:29:28,389
check it and it's in compliance.

3989
02:29:28,399 --> 02:29:30,328
Mike Pacer,

3990
02:29:30,328 --> 02:29:33,760
[clears throat] 100 South. Uh,

3991
02:29:33,760 --> 02:29:36,560
our property is to the east of where

3992
02:29:36,560 --> 02:29:38,880
this house is going to be built. It'll

3993
02:29:38,880 --> 02:29:41,520
be the same setback is what our house

3994
02:29:41,520 --> 02:29:45,920
is. I have a tree at the back of my

3995
02:29:45,920 --> 02:29:49,040
house that's about 35

3996
02:29:49,040 --> 02:29:54,160
feet tall. When I left this our home at

3997
02:29:54,160 --> 02:29:57,760
20 minutes to 6 this afternoon, the

3998
02:29:57,760 --> 02:30:00,800
shade from that tree covered my whole

3999
02:30:00,800 --> 02:30:04,080
house. My my concern is the height of

4000
02:30:04,080 --> 02:30:09,040
this house. Uh I know it meets all your

4001
02:30:09,040 --> 02:30:12,160
ordinances and regulations, but I'm

4002
02:30:12,160 --> 02:30:15,359
going to be in shade all afternoon or

4003
02:30:15,359 --> 02:30:18,319
evening from this house because of its

4004
02:30:18,319 --> 02:30:19,840
height.

4005
02:30:19,840 --> 02:30:23,600
I I have a a question on the building

4006
02:30:23,600 --> 02:30:25,680
department.

4007
02:30:25,680 --> 02:30:27,520
Is there someone here from the building

4008
02:30:27,520 --> 02:30:28,720
department?

4009
02:30:28,720 --> 02:30:30,960
>> No, we'll we'll do our best to represent

4010
02:30:30,960 --> 02:30:31,520
them.

4011
02:30:31,520 --> 02:30:33,680
>> Okay. [clears throat]

4012
02:30:33,680 --> 02:30:36,560
>> Number one, when when was the permit

4013
02:30:36,560 --> 02:30:38,479
submitted

4014
02:30:38,479 --> 02:30:41,840
or not the permit, the plan submitted

4015
02:30:41,840 --> 02:30:42,960
>> for this home?

4016
02:30:42,960 --> 02:30:44,880
>> Yes.

4017
02:30:44,880 --> 02:30:46,960
It was

4018
02:30:46,960 --> 02:30:49,600
the official submittal I think was like

4019
02:30:49,600 --> 02:30:51,040
two or three weeks ago.

4020
02:30:51,040 --> 02:30:52,000
>> Okay.

4021
02:30:52,000 --> 02:30:53,680
>> Would have been may maybe a month ago.

4022
02:30:53,680 --> 02:30:55,600
We got them on the the first planning

4023
02:30:55,600 --> 02:30:58,319
commission that they could be on.

4024
02:30:58,319 --> 02:31:00,080
>> All right. We met with the building

4025
02:31:00,080 --> 02:31:03,040
department and they said they said that

4026
02:31:03,040 --> 02:31:05,439
it was approved on their last meeting.

4027
02:31:05,439 --> 02:31:06,800
Is that correct?

4028
02:31:06,800 --> 02:31:08,319
>> On March 31st.

4029
02:31:08,319 --> 02:31:09,840
>> March 31st.

4030
02:31:09,840 --> 02:31:11,120
>> Okay.

4031
02:31:11,120 --> 02:31:14,399
Uh, is there any way that this the

4032
02:31:14,399 --> 02:31:17,600
building department could notify

4033
02:31:17,600 --> 02:31:20,880
the adjacent property owners that, you

4034
02:31:20,880 --> 02:31:22,800
know, they're they're going to be

4035
02:31:22,800 --> 02:31:26,080
reviewing the plans that were submitted.

4036
02:31:26,080 --> 02:31:28,800
I' I've worked in construction for 40

4037
02:31:28,800 --> 02:31:32,160
years. I've submitted permits, you know,

4038
02:31:32,160 --> 02:31:36,240
for buildings. Most most of the cities

4039
02:31:36,240 --> 02:31:38,000
around will

4040
02:31:38,000 --> 02:31:41,520
>> notify the adjacent property owners or

4041
02:31:41,520 --> 02:31:44,640
people on the street. Why why does not

4042
02:31:44,640 --> 02:31:46,960
Alpine do that?

4043
02:31:46,960 --> 02:31:49,920
>> We don't do that for home permits if

4044
02:31:49,920 --> 02:31:51,920
it's a commercial building coming in or

4045
02:31:51,920 --> 02:31:53,280
something like that and there's a site

4046
02:31:53,280 --> 02:31:54,880
plan review. We just follow our

4047
02:31:54,880 --> 02:31:58,160
ordinance on on notification.

4048
02:31:58,160 --> 02:32:01,040
>> So the only way only way we'd know would

4049
02:32:01,040 --> 02:32:04,720
be to look at their agenda every every

4050
02:32:04,720 --> 02:32:07,040
twice a month or however they have

4051
02:32:07,040 --> 02:32:09,120
>> a typical home building permit does not

4052
02:32:09,120 --> 02:32:11,760
go on an agenda. It's just reviewed as

4053
02:32:11,760 --> 02:32:13,359
through an administrative process

4054
02:32:13,359 --> 02:32:15,600
through the building department. This

4055
02:32:15,600 --> 02:32:17,200
one only went there because of the

4056
02:32:17,200 --> 02:32:18,720
nonconforming

4057
02:32:18,720 --> 02:32:20,319
issue.

4058
02:32:20,319 --> 02:32:24,560
Well, I I would like, you know, as an as

4059
02:32:24,560 --> 02:32:28,160
a neighbor to this lot, I would and

4060
02:32:28,160 --> 02:32:30,640
other people in Alpine,

4061
02:32:30,640 --> 02:32:33,040
all they have to do is just notify the

4062
02:32:33,040 --> 02:32:34,479
people so they know when they're going

4063
02:32:34,479 --> 02:32:38,319
to be discussing, you know, a home

4064
02:32:38,319 --> 02:32:40,960
that's going to affect the the adjacent

4065
02:32:40,960 --> 02:32:44,160
property owners.

4066
02:32:44,160 --> 02:32:45,680
>> And that's where we just try to follow

4067
02:32:45,680 --> 02:32:47,600
our ordinance because everybody's

4068
02:32:47,600 --> 02:32:50,880
definition of effect is different. And

4069
02:32:50,880 --> 02:32:53,120
so if we follow our ordinance, if our

4070
02:32:53,120 --> 02:32:55,840
council makes a an amendment to our

4071
02:32:55,840 --> 02:32:57,920
ordinance that says for a non-conforming

4072
02:32:57,920 --> 02:33:00,880
use, we need to notify people within X

4073
02:33:00,880 --> 02:33:02,720
feet or

4074
02:33:02,720 --> 02:33:04,800
adjacent or whatever, then we would

4075
02:33:04,800 --> 02:33:07,040
follow that process, but it currently

4076
02:33:07,040 --> 02:33:08,399
does not say that.

4077
02:33:08,399 --> 02:33:09,040
>> Okay.

4078
02:33:09,040 --> 02:33:11,040
>> One thing, uh, Shane, we're we're in

4079
02:33:11,040 --> 02:33:12,960
full respect, we're trying to do things

4080
02:33:12,960 --> 02:33:15,120
like this, but we can't get anything

4081
02:33:15,120 --> 02:33:18,640
through. So, um, any help on these types

4082
02:33:18,640 --> 02:33:20,800
of things that I think would solve this

4083
02:33:20,800 --> 02:33:24,399
situation in both cases will be helpful.

4084
02:33:24,399 --> 02:33:26,240
So, I mean, because we are trying to

4085
02:33:26,240 --> 02:33:28,319
change the ordinances to address these

4086
02:33:28,319 --> 02:33:31,120
types of problems, but we can't get them

4087
02:33:31,120 --> 02:33:32,240
even for a meeting.

4088
02:33:32,240 --> 02:33:35,200
>> We just barely got on board last week.

4089
02:33:35,200 --> 02:33:36,880
So, that's why I say I have a list of

4090
02:33:36,880 --> 02:33:39,040
items that he'll be working on and and

4091
02:33:39,040 --> 02:33:40,479
>> I know, but somehow everyone else gets

4092
02:33:40,479 --> 02:33:42,000
their homes and their fences and every

4093
02:33:42,000 --> 02:33:44,000
other permit through like lickety split.

4094
02:33:44,000 --> 02:33:45,600
And so we're just we just we just want

4095
02:33:45,600 --> 02:33:47,680
the same type of

4096
02:33:47,680 --> 02:33:48,880
>> Well, I mean that's a little bit

4097
02:33:48,880 --> 02:33:50,479
different, right? If you're talking

4098
02:33:50,479 --> 02:33:51,840
about permits, that's a whole different

4099
02:33:51,840 --> 02:33:53,280
department where we're not short

4100
02:33:53,280 --> 02:33:54,720
staffed. But if you're talking about

4101
02:33:54,720 --> 02:33:56,640
changing in ordinances, we were short

4102
02:33:56,640 --> 02:34:00,000
staffed, but even short staffed, we have

4103
02:34:00,000 --> 02:34:02,240
two big ordinance changes today to look

4104
02:34:02,240 --> 02:34:05,359
at cemeteries and uh zoning for business

4105
02:34:05,359 --> 02:34:07,600
commercial. So just say it's just just

4106
02:34:07,600 --> 02:34:09,280
mutual. That's a I'm not asking for

4107
02:34:09,280 --> 02:34:11,520
anything extra.

4108
02:34:11,520 --> 02:34:12,399
>> Thank you.

4109
02:34:12,399 --> 02:34:14,000
sir. So Shane, just as a

4110
02:34:14,000 --> 02:34:15,680
quick followup, if this if this lot were

4111
02:34:15,680 --> 02:34:18,240
1,800 feet bigger and had 10 more feet

4112
02:34:18,240 --> 02:34:19,520
of frontage, it would never have come to

4113
02:34:19,520 --> 02:34:21,920
us, right? They could build this house

4114
02:34:21,920 --> 02:34:23,280
>> if that were the case. That's correct.

4115
02:34:23,280 --> 02:34:25,359
It just happens to be that

4116
02:34:25,359 --> 02:34:28,800
>> back many, many, many years ago, they

4117
02:34:28,800 --> 02:34:30,399
were able to subdivide this lot and have

4118
02:34:30,399 --> 02:34:31,600
a much smaller lot

4119
02:34:31,600 --> 02:34:33,520
>> than is typical in the neighborhood or a

4120
02:34:33,520 --> 02:34:34,720
little bit smaller lot than typical.

4121
02:34:34,720 --> 02:34:36,000
>> It probably happened before we had

4122
02:34:36,000 --> 02:34:36,880
ordinances.

4123
02:34:36,880 --> 02:34:39,280
>> It's basically 18% smaller. If it was a

4124
02:34:39,280 --> 02:34:41,280
little bit bigger, it would never even

4125
02:34:41,280 --> 02:34:43,200
we would never. There were other lots

4126
02:34:43,200 --> 02:34:45,200
for sale that were conforming at the

4127
02:34:45,200 --> 02:34:47,439
same time. So, the owners did buy it

4128
02:34:47,439 --> 02:34:50,000
knowing and yeah, you don't know that. I

4129
02:34:50,000 --> 02:34:50,240
mean,

4130
02:34:50,240 --> 02:34:51,680
>> well, no, there are other lots that are

4131
02:34:51,680 --> 02:34:53,840
10,000 square feet for sale as well.

4132
02:34:53,840 --> 02:34:56,000
>> No, but when this subdivided was what

4133
02:34:56,000 --> 02:34:58,399
I'm saying the this is a

4134
02:34:58,399 --> 02:35:00,080
>> This is an odd This is an odd lot,

4135
02:35:00,080 --> 02:35:00,319
right?

4136
02:35:00,319 --> 02:35:01,280
>> Right. It's an odd

4137
02:35:01,280 --> 02:35:02,240
>> kind of like the last one.

4138
02:35:02,240 --> 02:35:04,640
>> By the way, I loved all of your wise

4139
02:35:04,640 --> 02:35:06,240
Brent comments.

4140
02:35:06,240 --> 02:35:09,520
>> So, thank you. Okay. So, um with that,

4141
02:35:09,520 --> 02:35:11,680
we've heard from the property owners,

4142
02:35:11,680 --> 02:35:14,399
the adjacent prop um and the adjacent

4143
02:35:14,399 --> 02:35:18,560
property owners. Um we have

4144
02:35:18,560 --> 02:35:23,120
um consideration in front of you. Do I

4145
02:35:23,120 --> 02:35:26,000
have a recommended motion?

4146
02:35:26,000 --> 02:35:27,600
>> I'll move to approve the proposed site

4147
02:35:27,600 --> 02:35:28,960
plan, including the reconstruction of

4148
02:35:28,960 --> 02:35:32,319
the home at 480 East 100 South, finding

4149
02:35:32,319 --> 02:35:35,439
that it meets the

4150
02:35:35,439 --> 02:35:36,880
uh

4151
02:35:36,880 --> 02:35:46,870
four conditions noted in 3.22.070.

4152
02:35:46,880 --> 02:35:49,200
» Is that the entirety of your motion?

4153
02:35:49,200 --> 02:35:50,080
>> Uh, yes.

4154
02:35:50,080 --> 02:35:53,120
>> Okay. There is a motion that was

4155
02:35:53,120 --> 02:35:55,520
proposed by Councilman Rumler. Is there

4156
02:35:55,520 --> 02:36:02,070
a second or amendment to the motion?

4157
02:36:02,080 --> 02:36:04,800
» Okay, I'll second it. I was going to say

4158
02:36:04,800 --> 02:36:07,040
it fails, but it doesn't. We have a

4159
02:36:07,040 --> 02:36:11,910
second by Councilwoman Hanaman.

4160
02:36:11,920 --> 02:36:14,720
Um, we've had discussion, so I would

4161
02:36:14,720 --> 02:36:17,439
like to move to a vote.

4162
02:36:17,439 --> 02:36:18,560
>> I'm sorry. Did you say we have

4163
02:36:18,560 --> 02:36:19,680
discussion or no discussion?

4164
02:36:19,680 --> 02:36:21,040
>> No, we already had the discussion.

4165
02:36:21,040 --> 02:36:22,160
>> Okay. I didn't know if you asked for

4166
02:36:22,160 --> 02:36:22,800
more discussion.

4167
02:36:22,800 --> 02:36:25,200
>> No, I was I would have had discussion at

4168
02:36:25,200 --> 02:36:27,520
this time, but I feel like we've had all

4169
02:36:27,520 --> 02:36:29,280
the discussion. Everyone has expressed

4170
02:36:29,280 --> 02:36:31,359
their concerns. I I think there is one

4171
02:36:31,359 --> 02:36:34,240
more point of discussion and looking at

4172
02:36:34,240 --> 02:36:38,560
the zoning actually this house is in a

4173
02:36:38,560 --> 02:36:40,720
different zoning than all the homes that

4174
02:36:40,720 --> 02:36:43,280
are highlighted in most of the homes

4175
02:36:43,280 --> 02:36:45,359
that are highlighted in yellow. So it it

4176
02:36:45,359 --> 02:36:47,840
is [clears throat] a differentiator in

4177
02:36:47,840 --> 02:36:49,600
that the homes highlighted in yellow

4178
02:36:49,600 --> 02:36:52,640
most of those are on a halfacre lot

4179
02:36:52,640 --> 02:36:54,000
and this is again

4180
02:36:54,000 --> 02:36:56,399
>> those are the ones to the north

4181
02:36:56,399 --> 02:36:57,840
>> but not the highlighted ones just south

4182
02:36:57,840 --> 02:36:59,840
of it.

4183
02:36:59,840 --> 02:37:04,309
Well, here's our zoning map.

4184
02:37:04,319 --> 02:37:05,200
» That's it.

4185
02:37:05,200 --> 02:37:07,760
>> Okay. So, with that comment, let's

4186
02:37:07,760 --> 02:37:09,280
proceed with the roll call, though.

4187
02:37:09,280 --> 02:37:10,640
>> Jessica Simuan, no.

4188
02:37:10,640 --> 02:37:13,280
>> Sarah Blackwell, no. Chrissy Haniman,

4189
02:37:13,280 --> 02:37:13,760
yes.

4190
02:37:13,760 --> 02:37:16,560
>> Andrew Young, no. Brent Remler, yes.

4191
02:37:16,560 --> 02:37:18,399
>> Okay, the motion fails.

4192
02:37:18,399 --> 02:37:22,080
>> I can make a follow-up motion.

4193
02:37:22,080 --> 02:37:23,520
>> Do we not make a follow-up motion?

4194
02:37:23,520 --> 02:37:24,319
>> I can do it.

4195
02:37:24,319 --> 02:37:25,120
>> Go ahead.

4196
02:37:25,120 --> 02:37:26,399
>> Don't we have to make a follow-up

4197
02:37:26,399 --> 02:37:26,960
motion?

4198
02:37:26,960 --> 02:37:27,600
>> No. Why?

4199
02:37:27,600 --> 02:37:29,359
>> Oh, never mind then. I apologize. I will

4200
02:37:29,359 --> 02:37:31,040
leave it at that.

4201
02:37:31,040 --> 02:37:33,040
>> Okay, let's move on to

4202
02:37:33,040 --> 02:37:35,840
>> I'm sorry. Do Can I Do should we make a

4203
02:37:35,840 --> 02:37:38,240
follow-up motion to help this situation?

4204
02:37:38,240 --> 02:37:38,800
Does anyone

4205
02:37:38,800 --> 02:37:40,160
>> No, I think it's up to the property

4206
02:37:40,160 --> 02:37:42,800
owners at this point. They

4207
02:37:42,800 --> 02:37:44,240
>> You've expressed what you would like. I

4208
02:37:44,240 --> 02:37:45,200
think the property owners have

4209
02:37:45,200 --> 02:37:45,840
expressed,

4210
02:37:45,840 --> 02:37:47,040
>> why don't you say what you're thinking

4211
02:37:47,040 --> 02:37:47,920
because I do

4212
02:37:47,920 --> 02:37:49,760
>> I mean I have been in many city council

4213
02:37:49,760 --> 02:37:51,760
meetings where a motion hasn't passed

4214
02:37:51,760 --> 02:37:53,600
and then a follow-up motion is made.

4215
02:37:53,600 --> 02:37:55,920
>> We can have totally fine. I didn't say

4216
02:37:55,920 --> 02:37:56,800
you can't have it.

4217
02:37:56,800 --> 02:37:59,600
>> All we did is All we did is say no to

4218
02:37:59,600 --> 02:38:01,520
approving it. Where does this land

4219
02:38:01,520 --> 02:38:03,520
parliamentarian if that's okay?

4220
02:38:03,520 --> 02:38:05,359
>> So they can go to the appeal authority

4221
02:38:05,359 --> 02:38:07,760
or they could submit another they can go

4222
02:38:07,760 --> 02:38:09,280
through the process again with a new

4223
02:38:09,280 --> 02:38:11,280
floor plan. Those are their two options.

4224
02:38:11,280 --> 02:38:14,399
>> My new when we don't approve, does that

4225
02:38:14,399 --> 02:38:16,160
just go forward as a denial or does it

4226
02:38:16,160 --> 02:38:17,840
go forward as just not approved?

4227
02:38:17,840 --> 02:38:18,880
>> It's a denial.

4228
02:38:18,880 --> 02:38:20,560
>> Okay. I didn't know. I apologize. I

4229
02:38:20,560 --> 02:38:22,319
didn't know.

4230
02:38:22,319 --> 02:38:23,359
>> Thank you.

4231
02:38:23,359 --> 02:38:24,960
>> Did you have an alternate motion to

4232
02:38:24,960 --> 02:38:26,960
make? Uh, no. I don't have an alternate

4233
02:38:26,960 --> 02:38:28,000
motion.

4234
02:38:28,000 --> 02:38:29,280
>> Jessica's right. That's That's

4235
02:38:29,280 --> 02:38:30,560
>> No, if he had one, I would have

4236
02:38:30,560 --> 02:38:31,439
entertained it, but

4237
02:38:31,439 --> 02:38:34,160
>> Well, I I do have one.

4238
02:38:34,160 --> 02:38:37,680
>> So, I I move to deny the

4239
02:38:37,680 --> 02:38:40,960
um Can you move? I can't see the motion.

4240
02:38:40,960 --> 02:38:42,960
>> I didn't know we had to deny.

4241
02:38:42,960 --> 02:38:48,469
>> Pardon? Sorry. Sorry, Mayor.

4242
02:38:48,479 --> 02:38:51,520
» To the sample motion. Yeah, I got

4243
02:38:51,520 --> 02:38:54,880
>> Sorry. My apologies.

4244
02:38:54,880 --> 02:38:57,760
Is that what you wanted?

4245
02:38:57,760 --> 02:38:58,560
>> And you would insert

4246
02:38:58,560 --> 02:39:00,399
>> that's the bottom. I I move to recommend

4247
02:39:00,399 --> 02:39:02,399
denial of the proposed based on the

4248
02:39:02,399 --> 02:39:04,479
following findings.

4249
02:39:04,479 --> 02:39:11,429
I'll move back to those four conditions.

4250
02:39:11,439 --> 02:39:13,040
» The

4251
02:39:13,040 --> 02:39:17,120
proposed petition does not meet um item

4252
02:39:17,120 --> 02:39:19,120
number one. The enlargement or extension

4253
02:39:19,120 --> 02:39:21,280
will not significantly alter the

4254
02:39:21,280 --> 02:39:25,040
character of the building or use or its

4255
02:39:25,040 --> 02:39:30,630
impact upon the area.

4256
02:39:30,640 --> 02:39:32,399
Okay. Is there a second?

4257
02:39:32,399 --> 02:39:33,280
>> I second.

4258
02:39:33,280 --> 02:39:35,040
>> It's been moved by Councilwoman Smeu and

4259
02:39:35,040 --> 02:39:38,000
seconded by Councilman Young.

4260
02:39:38,000 --> 02:39:41,040
Any discussion on the motion?

4261
02:39:41,040 --> 02:39:42,880
>> Jessica?

4262
02:39:42,880 --> 02:39:44,640
>> No. Sarah,

4263
02:39:44,640 --> 02:39:46,560
>> did you want to add any of the other

4264
02:39:46,560 --> 02:39:48,640
points on there as well or just point

4265
02:39:48,640 --> 02:39:49,200
one?

4266
02:39:49,200 --> 02:39:50,960
>> Well, it says a finding made by the

4267
02:39:50,960 --> 02:39:52,720
majority vote of the council that and

4268
02:39:52,720 --> 02:39:55,280
there's four items. And so to me, number

4269
02:39:55,280 --> 02:39:58,880
one is the one it's in a different zone

4270
02:39:58,880 --> 02:40:00,960
as the surrounding

4271
02:40:00,960 --> 02:40:02,960
homes. It also

4272
02:40:02,960 --> 02:40:04,479
>> clearly

4273
02:40:04,479 --> 02:40:06,720
um doesn't fit the character of the home

4274
02:40:06,720 --> 02:40:09,439
that it's replacing. And so those things

4275
02:40:09,439 --> 02:40:12,560
are the most definable and measurable.

4276
02:40:12,560 --> 02:40:14,080
>> Okay. Thanks.

4277
02:40:14,080 --> 02:40:16,880
>> Um I think I think you could add four

4278
02:40:16,880 --> 02:40:18,399
just because the incompatibility with

4279
02:40:18,399 --> 02:40:19,840
the neighborhood area that stated the

4280
02:40:19,840 --> 02:40:20,319
objective.

4281
02:40:20,319 --> 02:40:22,080
>> So are you suggesting a substitute to

4282
02:40:22,080 --> 02:40:22,800
the motion or

4283
02:40:22,800 --> 02:40:23,760
>> would you consider adding?

4284
02:40:23,760 --> 02:40:25,520
>> Yeah, I I would amend the motion to

4285
02:40:25,520 --> 02:40:27,520
include item four.

4286
02:40:27,520 --> 02:40:29,760
>> Okay. So there is a

4287
02:40:29,760 --> 02:40:32,960
>> just to be clear. So

4288
02:40:32,960 --> 02:40:34,640
you said that it didn't meet that

4289
02:40:34,640 --> 02:40:37,520
finding number one, but then you added

4290
02:40:37,520 --> 02:40:39,760
stuff after the motion was seconded. Do

4291
02:40:39,760 --> 02:40:42,479
you want that to be part of the motion?

4292
02:40:42,479 --> 02:40:45,760
where you had the specific

4293
02:40:45,760 --> 02:40:48,399
finding about different zone and those

4294
02:40:48,399 --> 02:40:49,439
kinds of things.

4295
02:40:49,439 --> 02:40:51,439
>> Do I need to add that language in this

4296
02:40:51,439 --> 02:40:54,000
motion or is saying number one is

4297
02:40:54,000 --> 02:40:56,000
>> finding I would detail it out.

4298
02:40:56,000 --> 02:40:56,800
>> Okay.

4299
02:40:56,800 --> 02:40:59,040
>> So yes, I would like to include the

4300
02:40:59,040 --> 02:41:01,680
differences in zones

4301
02:41:01,680 --> 02:41:02,479
>> what you said.

4302
02:41:02,479 --> 02:41:03,680
>> Yeah. Yeah.

4303
02:41:03,680 --> 02:41:05,200
>> And then the amendment that I would ask

4304
02:41:05,200 --> 02:41:05,680
for is

4305
02:41:05,680 --> 02:41:08,160
>> and then also include number four

4306
02:41:08,160 --> 02:41:11,040
>> with the with the language incompatible

4307
02:41:11,040 --> 02:41:12,960
with the neighborhood area and the

4308
02:41:12,960 --> 02:41:16,720
stated objective of the zone.

4309
02:41:16,720 --> 02:41:18,240
>> That's number four.

4310
02:41:18,240 --> 02:41:20,319
>> Yes.

4311
02:41:20,319 --> 02:41:23,200
>> Okay. And so and Okay. So we have a

4312
02:41:23,200 --> 02:41:25,280
substitute motion and yes

4313
02:41:25,280 --> 02:41:26,880
>> needs needs to be seconded.

4314
02:41:26,880 --> 02:41:29,520
>> Okay. There is a substitute motion. Is

4315
02:41:29,520 --> 02:41:32,000
there a second to No. Is it substitute

4316
02:41:32,000 --> 02:41:33,600
motion or amended motion?

4317
02:41:33,600 --> 02:41:34,960
>> It's an amended motion.

4318
02:41:34,960 --> 02:41:38,080
>> The amended motion is there. So then I

4319
02:41:38,080 --> 02:41:40,399
need to go to you seconded it, right?

4320
02:41:40,399 --> 02:41:42,800
Someone he suggested. So I just assume

4321
02:41:42,800 --> 02:41:45,120
but yes, formally you're seconding the

4322
02:41:45,120 --> 02:41:47,280
amendment, correct?

4323
02:41:47,280 --> 02:41:50,640
>> Okay. Any you had your discussion. Did

4324
02:41:50,640 --> 02:41:51,920
you have anything you wanted to say

4325
02:41:51,920 --> 02:41:53,359
about this, Chrissy?

4326
02:41:53,359 --> 02:41:54,240
>> I'm done.

4327
02:41:54,240 --> 02:41:56,319
>> Andrew,

4328
02:41:56,319 --> 02:41:57,520
>> okay, then let's proceed with the roll

4329
02:41:57,520 --> 02:41:59,920
call vote. Just to be 100% clear on the

4330
02:41:59,920 --> 02:42:01,840
zoning, there are about seven or eight

4331
02:42:01,840 --> 02:42:04,479
homes south of this lot that are in the

4332
02:42:04,479 --> 02:42:08,630
TR10,000 zone.

4333
02:42:08,640 --> 02:42:10,640
» Just to be 100% clear,

4334
02:42:10,640 --> 02:42:12,399
>> right? And and it was more it was the

4335
02:42:12,399 --> 02:42:14,080
majority of the homes surrounding it,

4336
02:42:14,080 --> 02:42:14,800
not every

4337
02:42:14,800 --> 02:42:16,032
>> the the ones to the north are

4338
02:42:16,032 --> 02:42:17,520
[clears throat] in a different zone, but

4339
02:42:17,520 --> 02:42:19,680
seven or eight homes kind of south and

4340
02:42:19,680 --> 02:42:21,520
behind that lot that are in the

4341
02:42:21,520 --> 02:42:22,319
TR10,000.

4342
02:42:22,319 --> 02:42:23,280
>> Can we pull that up?

4343
02:42:23,280 --> 02:42:25,439
>> Yeah. The document that was given to us

4344
02:42:25,439 --> 02:42:28,160
showed a lot of homes in the west. Yeah.

4345
02:42:28,160 --> 02:42:30,800
>> And a lot of homes in the

4346
02:42:30,800 --> 02:42:32,560
on the culde-sac of

4347
02:42:32,560 --> 02:42:33,920
>> Can you bring up Google maps?

4348
02:42:33,920 --> 02:42:34,880
>> Yes.

4349
02:42:34,880 --> 02:42:39,600
>> Of the three areas, one had

4350
02:42:39,600 --> 02:42:42,399
some had the same zoning.

4351
02:42:42,399 --> 02:42:44,240
>> Heidi, if you go to departments,

4352
02:42:44,240 --> 02:42:46,960
planning and zoning over to the right

4353
02:42:46,960 --> 02:42:49,439
>> and then maps down to the bottom, city

4354
02:42:49,439 --> 02:42:58,550
maps, and then the bottom one is zoning.

4355
02:42:58,560 --> 02:43:00,479
the the lines are the lot lines are

4356
02:43:00,479 --> 02:43:02,800
faint enough on here that it's

4357
02:43:02,800 --> 02:43:04,800
>> not see this. I just want to make sure

4358
02:43:04,800 --> 02:43:05,760
everybody's clear.

4359
02:43:05,760 --> 02:43:09,190
>> You can have conditions.

4360
02:43:09,200 --> 02:43:11,280
» If you zoom in on right in the middle of

4361
02:43:11,280 --> 02:43:14,080
the map there,

4362
02:43:14,080 --> 02:43:15,280
>> it's by Creekite, right?

4363
02:43:15,280 --> 02:43:15,520
>> Yeah,

4364
02:43:15,520 --> 02:43:17,439
>> it's where that says 400 East. It's just

4365
02:43:17,439 --> 02:43:19,760
to the east of there. So, if you maybe

4366
02:43:19,760 --> 02:43:23,600
zoom in a little bit more.

4367
02:43:23,600 --> 02:43:25,040
Don't know.

4368
02:43:25,040 --> 02:43:29,830
>> It does it backwards.

4369
02:43:29,840 --> 02:43:33,200
» Yeah. So, I believe right there under

4370
02:43:33,200 --> 02:43:36,399
the 100 and the 100 South street name is

4371
02:43:36,399 --> 02:43:39,120
the lot that's in question. So, there

4372
02:43:39,120 --> 02:43:41,120
are lots south of there that are in the

4373
02:43:41,120 --> 02:43:44,080
TR10,000 zone, that blue zone.

4374
02:43:44,080 --> 02:43:45,600
>> Okay. If you'd like to remove the number

4375
02:43:45,600 --> 02:43:48,319
four, you can. I don't know if that's

4376
02:43:48,319 --> 02:43:51,520
possible at this point. [laughter]

4377
02:43:51,520 --> 02:43:53,520
>> Wait, you wanted I'm sorry. So, if I'm

4378
02:43:53,520 --> 02:43:56,080
understanding, she's surrounded by the

4379
02:43:56,080 --> 02:43:57,520
new property is surrounded by this

4380
02:43:57,520 --> 02:43:59,279
L-shaped property, which we have full

4381
02:43:59,279 --> 02:44:01,120
visibility of.

4382
02:44:01,120 --> 02:44:03,680
>> Ju just to be clear, I think mayor, it

4383
02:44:03,680 --> 02:44:06,720
might help if Jessica restated her

4384
02:44:06,720 --> 02:44:07,920
motion

4385
02:44:07,920 --> 02:44:10,000
>> with the specific findings that she

4386
02:44:10,000 --> 02:44:11,120
wants to include.

4387
02:44:11,120 --> 02:44:12,399
>> Okay, let's do that.

4388
02:44:12,399 --> 02:44:15,120
>> And there is in number four a and. So,

4389
02:44:15,120 --> 02:44:18,000
it is two separate things. It says the

4390
02:44:18,000 --> 02:44:20,000
proposed enlargement will not result in

4391
02:44:20,000 --> 02:44:22,240
the establishment of a condition

4392
02:44:22,240 --> 02:44:25,760
incompatible with the neighborhood area

4393
02:44:25,760 --> 02:44:28,479
and the stated objective of the zone in

4394
02:44:28,479 --> 02:44:30,399
which it is located.

4395
02:44:30,399 --> 02:44:32,800
>> So it's and well I guess that would be

4396
02:44:32,800 --> 02:44:33,840
>> but we're we're moving.

4397
02:44:33,840 --> 02:44:35,680
>> Okay. Counciloman Smewing, will you

4398
02:44:35,680 --> 02:44:38,720
please restate your motion?

4399
02:44:38,720 --> 02:44:40,800
>> I'm just asking

4400
02:44:40,800 --> 02:44:43,359
council member Young where is the and

4401
02:44:43,359 --> 02:44:45,040
when I read number one I see the

4402
02:44:45,040 --> 02:44:46,479
>> Oh no, I read number four. talking.

4403
02:44:46,479 --> 02:44:47,760
>> So, you don't have to include number

4404
02:44:47,760 --> 02:44:50,080
four since there's two pieces to number

4405
02:44:50,080 --> 02:44:51,760
four if you'd like. The zoning and then

4406
02:44:51,760 --> 02:44:53,200
the neighborhood. I was considering just

4407
02:44:53,200 --> 02:44:55,520
the neighborhood. Uh but when you get to

4408
02:44:55,520 --> 02:44:57,120
zone lines, that changes it. So, you can

4409
02:44:57,120 --> 02:45:02,469
just include number one.

4410
02:45:02,479 --> 02:45:03,920
» I think your original motion,

4411
02:45:03,920 --> 02:45:06,640
>> right? I'm just I'm just looking at for

4412
02:45:06,640 --> 02:45:12,240
um and considering it. Okay. So,

4413
02:45:12,240 --> 02:45:14,399
the language in my motion would be I

4414
02:45:14,399 --> 02:45:17,760
move to deny

4415
02:45:17,760 --> 02:45:20,880
the approval of the non-conforming

4416
02:45:20,880 --> 02:45:24,630
building permit

4417
02:45:24,640 --> 02:45:31,510
based upon the finding that

4418
02:45:31,520 --> 02:45:34,479
the building

4419
02:45:34,479 --> 02:45:36,560
how does the should the language read

4420
02:45:36,560 --> 02:45:42,720
does not meet the finding that the proposed

4421
02:45:42,720 --> 02:45:45,520
enlargement or extension will not

4422
02:45:45,520 --> 02:45:47,600
significantly alter the character of the

4423
02:45:47,600 --> 02:45:49,520
building or

4424
02:45:49,520 --> 02:45:54,640
use or its impact upon the area.

4425
02:45:54,640 --> 02:45:55,840
>> Yeah.

4426
02:45:55,840 --> 02:45:58,319
>> Because the the

4427
02:45:58,319 --> 02:46:01,200
permit the permitted building or the the

4428
02:46:01,200 --> 02:46:04,160
building permit will the proposed just

4429
02:46:04,160 --> 02:46:10,230
take out knock

4430
02:46:10,240 --> 02:46:10,479
Okay.

4431
02:46:10,479 --> 02:46:12,080
>> Did you get that D or do you need her to

4432
02:46:12,080 --> 02:46:13,760
restate it? Can

4433
02:46:13,760 --> 02:46:14,880
>> can we can we discuss?

4434
02:46:14,880 --> 02:46:18,080
>> I think she included the word not in

4435
02:46:18,080 --> 02:46:19,840
Right. She's saying it it that the

4436
02:46:19,840 --> 02:46:21,920
proposed enlargement will significantly

4437
02:46:21,920 --> 02:46:23,680
alter etc. Is that right?

4438
02:46:23,680 --> 02:46:24,000
>> Yes.

4439
02:46:24,000 --> 02:46:27,120
>> Right. But the word significantly isn't

4440
02:46:27,120 --> 02:46:29,279
>> in our ordinance.

4441
02:46:29,279 --> 02:46:32,160
>> It is will not significantly

4442
02:46:32,160 --> 02:46:35,600
>> significant. It is significant.

4443
02:46:35,600 --> 02:46:37,279
>> Right. it will significantly.

4444
02:46:37,279 --> 02:46:39,040
>> Okay. So basically number one

4445
02:46:39,040 --> 02:46:43,750
>> based on the zoning

4446
02:46:43,760 --> 02:46:47,840
» as based upon the zoning in that area.

4447
02:46:47,840 --> 02:46:50,080
>> Okay, that is the motion. Is there a

4448
02:46:50,080 --> 02:46:52,080
second? I believe there's a second.

4449
02:46:52,080 --> 02:46:53,120
>> I second it.

4450
02:46:53,120 --> 02:46:54,960
>> Okay, it's been second by Councilman

4451
02:46:54,960 --> 02:46:55,600
Young.

4452
02:46:55,600 --> 02:46:56,880
>> Zoning.

4453
02:46:56,880 --> 02:46:59,840
>> I It's been seconded. Now, do we discuss

4454
02:46:59,840 --> 02:47:00,479
or amend?

4455
02:47:00,479 --> 02:47:02,080
>> Do we need to remove zoning just because

4456
02:47:02,080 --> 02:47:03,040
it's

4457
02:47:03,040 --> 02:47:05,680
>> makes it ambiguous. confused the part

4458
02:47:05,680 --> 02:47:07,760
even though I believe four is still part

4459
02:47:07,760 --> 02:47:10,240
of it. She's mixed four and one. The

4460
02:47:10,240 --> 02:47:13,200
original motion she made was just on one

4461
02:47:13,200 --> 02:47:15,760
where she said that and I apologize. Is

4462
02:47:15,760 --> 02:47:17,200
there any way you can read back number

4463
02:47:17,200 --> 02:47:18,880
one to her so that she can

4464
02:47:18,880 --> 02:47:20,399
>> No, she has it in front of her.

4465
02:47:20,399 --> 02:47:22,080
>> Oh, okay. Then that would be fine. I

4466
02:47:22,080 --> 02:47:23,200
would just think you should remove

4467
02:47:23,200 --> 02:47:24,960
>> just leave number one as is.

4468
02:47:24,960 --> 02:47:26,560
and use

4469
02:47:26,560 --> 02:47:28,240
number one. Uh that's what I would do.

4470
02:47:28,240 --> 02:47:28,479
But

4471
02:47:28,479 --> 02:47:31,520
>> and remove the mention of zoning.

4472
02:47:31,520 --> 02:47:33,840
>> Correct. and remove not.

4473
02:47:33,840 --> 02:47:37,920
>> So Steve was saying that you should keep

4474
02:47:37,920 --> 02:47:40,160
the zoning in that that what that's why

4475
02:47:40,160 --> 02:47:42,240
it would significantly change it. That

4476
02:47:42,240 --> 02:47:44,000
the finding was that because it's in the

4477
02:47:44,000 --> 02:47:48,000
TR10,000 as opposed to TR 20,000

4478
02:47:48,000 --> 02:47:49,680
>> that what it was being compared against

4479
02:47:49,680 --> 02:47:51,040
that it wasn't correct that if you

4480
02:47:51,040 --> 02:47:52,960
compare it to other TR10,000 that it

4481
02:47:52,960 --> 02:47:55,920
would significantly alter. So I believe

4482
02:47:55,920 --> 02:47:58,160
that was a suggestion from our lawyer.

4483
02:47:58,160 --> 02:48:00,560
So did you want to I mean it's up to

4484
02:48:00,560 --> 02:48:01,760
you. with your motion.

4485
02:48:01,760 --> 02:48:03,600
>> Yeah, but I just want the language to be

4486
02:48:03,600 --> 02:48:05,600
clear and not muddied.

4487
02:48:05,600 --> 02:48:06,000
>> Right.

4488
02:48:06,000 --> 02:48:07,840
>> And so that's why the proposed

4489
02:48:07,840 --> 02:48:10,000
enlargement or extension will

4490
02:48:10,000 --> 02:48:12,560
significantly alter the character of the

4491
02:48:12,560 --> 02:48:15,760
building or use or its impact upon the

4492
02:48:15,760 --> 02:48:19,040
area as found in TR 10,000.

4493
02:48:19,040 --> 02:48:20,240
>> Perfect.

4494
02:48:20,240 --> 02:48:20,960
>> That's good.

4495
02:48:20,960 --> 02:48:22,399
>> Okay.

4496
02:48:22,399 --> 02:48:23,920
>> Did you sec Okay.

4497
02:48:23,920 --> 02:48:25,840
>> There we go.

4498
02:48:25,840 --> 02:48:27,279
>> I have a comment.

4499
02:48:27,279 --> 02:48:27,680
>> Yes, sir.

4500
02:48:27,680 --> 02:48:30,720
>> Because I'm I'm not a legal person. I

4501
02:48:30,720 --> 02:48:32,080
had to look up the definition of

4502
02:48:32,080 --> 02:48:33,040
character.

4503
02:48:33,040 --> 02:48:35,120
>> I do too.

4504
02:48:35,120 --> 02:48:36,479
>> Do you have Do you want to go?

4505
02:48:36,479 --> 02:48:37,120
>> Go ahead. Sorry.

4506
02:48:37,120 --> 02:48:40,160
>> You want So, let's see how reliable this

4507
02:48:40,160 --> 02:48:42,960
is. Steve, you can check me on my um

4508
02:48:42,960 --> 02:48:45,279
skills here, but it says the character

4509
02:48:45,279 --> 02:48:46,960
of the building is defined as the

4510
02:48:46,960 --> 02:48:49,840
combined effect of all visual aspects

4511
02:48:49,840 --> 02:48:51,760
that constitute its appearance, style,

4512
02:48:51,760 --> 02:48:54,720
and identity. And some of the defining

4513
02:48:54,720 --> 02:48:57,279
features could be um the quality of the

4514
02:48:57,279 --> 02:49:01,040
material, craftsmanship and like the um

4515
02:49:01,040 --> 02:49:04,080
building materials, roof form,

4516
02:49:04,080 --> 02:49:06,000
um the building setting including

4517
02:49:06,000 --> 02:49:08,160
landscaping relationship to the street.

4518
02:49:08,160 --> 02:49:10,000
So those are things that I don't

4519
02:49:10,000 --> 02:49:12,479
understand how this does not conform to

4520
02:49:12,479 --> 02:49:15,680
the character to to my in my opinion

4521
02:49:15,680 --> 02:49:18,240
looking at the style of the home. It's

4522
02:49:18,240 --> 02:49:21,760
an uh a style that was popular in over a

4523
02:49:21,760 --> 02:49:23,760
hundred years ago with the roof lines

4524
02:49:23,760 --> 02:49:26,319
and the the little arch that comes over

4525
02:49:26,319 --> 02:49:29,120
the front door. I've been in homes in

4526
02:49:29,120 --> 02:49:31,359
neighborhoods of over a hundred years

4527
02:49:31,359 --> 02:49:33,200
old and that's exactly what those homes

4528
02:49:33,200 --> 02:49:35,439
look like. So, I don't understand how

4529
02:49:35,439 --> 02:49:38,080
the character doesn't fit because we're

4530
02:49:38,080 --> 02:49:40,160
talking about architecture now. If you

4531
02:49:40,160 --> 02:49:41,600
want to talk that this doesn't fit the

4532
02:49:41,600 --> 02:49:44,000
character like that, I I don't agree

4533
02:49:44,000 --> 02:49:45,600
with that. So, I do want you to

4534
02:49:45,600 --> 02:49:48,319
understand why doesn't this house that

4535
02:49:48,319 --> 02:49:49,520
could have been built a hundred years

4536
02:49:49,520 --> 02:49:52,080
ago not fit the character of a home that

4537
02:49:52,080 --> 02:49:53,840
was built a hundred years ago.

4538
02:49:53,840 --> 02:49:55,520
>> And I think that's a really good point.

4539
02:49:55,520 --> 02:49:58,640
And the way I read it is impact upon the

4540
02:49:58,640 --> 02:50:01,040
area. We're looking at an area that is

4541
02:50:01,040 --> 02:50:04,399
existing right now, not a whatif or

4542
02:50:04,399 --> 02:50:07,200
could have been or those architectural

4543
02:50:07,200 --> 02:50:08,960
features. We're looking at neighbors.

4544
02:50:08,960 --> 02:50:11,279
We're looking at a community that's been

4545
02:50:11,279 --> 02:50:13,520
developed.

4546
02:50:13,520 --> 02:50:15,840
>> So, Alpine today. So that's what I'm

4547
02:50:15,840 --> 02:50:18,160
measuring it against, not

4548
02:50:18,160 --> 02:50:20,960
>> not the legal definition of character.

4549
02:50:20,960 --> 02:50:24,479
>> Well, it says character or use or its

4550
02:50:24,479 --> 02:50:26,479
impact upon the area. So it could be

4551
02:50:26,479 --> 02:50:27,120
either or.

4552
02:50:27,120 --> 02:50:28,000
>> And that's why I like,

4553
02:50:28,000 --> 02:50:29,840
>> right? So the impact on the area is it

4554
02:50:29,840 --> 02:50:31,760
is still a single family home.

4555
02:50:31,760 --> 02:50:33,600
>> Yeah. But we have 50,000 square foot

4556
02:50:33,600 --> 02:50:36,319
single family homes. Like we we a single

4557
02:50:36,319 --> 02:50:38,640
family home is very broad. Like where

4558
02:50:38,640 --> 02:50:41,040
this says condition incompatible with

4559
02:50:41,040 --> 02:50:43,040
the neighborhood, that's what's coming.

4560
02:50:43,040 --> 02:50:44,800
That's the number one thing I think it

4561
02:50:44,800 --> 02:50:47,279
faults at is it is not compatible with

4562
02:50:47,279 --> 02:50:48,479
the neighborhood

4563
02:50:48,479 --> 02:50:50,000
>> because it looks like it's 100 years

4564
02:50:50,000 --> 02:50:50,800
old.

4565
02:50:50,800 --> 02:50:53,520
>> No, the the the the size the 3,000 ft

4566
02:50:53,520 --> 02:50:56,240
from 600 square ft the the everything

4567
02:50:56,240 --> 02:50:57,920
you just brought up in character.

4568
02:50:57,920 --> 02:51:00,319
>> But that's not that's not the size is

4569
02:51:00,319 --> 02:51:02,000
not in our ordinances.

4570
02:51:02,000 --> 02:51:03,600
>> Well, it just goes back to bulk and

4571
02:51:03,600 --> 02:51:05,520
massing that you and I drove around.

4572
02:51:05,520 --> 02:51:07,040
>> We don't have we don't have anything to

4573
02:51:07,040 --> 02:51:08,880
rely on that for that yet. It's a high

4574
02:51:08,880 --> 02:51:10,880
priority, but we don't have here yet.

4575
02:51:10,880 --> 02:51:12,960
So, we've had the discussion. We're

4576
02:51:12,960 --> 02:51:15,120
still in the middle of a vote.

4577
02:51:15,120 --> 02:51:16,160
>> Do

4578
02:51:16,160 --> 02:51:16,720
>> true.

4579
02:51:16,720 --> 02:51:19,680
>> Can we still arbitrate a disc like the

4580
02:51:19,680 --> 02:51:22,160
vote while it's happening? It's you're

4581
02:51:22,160 --> 02:51:27,279
>> we're discussing the motion is to not we moved away from zone

4582
02:51:27,279 --> 02:51:28,640
and now no I'm

4583
02:51:28,640 --> 02:51:30,560
>> she's just making a statement that

4584
02:51:30,560 --> 02:51:32,080
>> the character of the building

4585
02:51:32,080 --> 02:51:34,640
>> her opinion is that it's not she's

4586
02:51:34,640 --> 02:51:35,359
saying that

4587
02:51:35,359 --> 02:51:37,120
>> okay and so do we just come in and say

4588
02:51:37,120 --> 02:51:39,600
our opinion is that it does

4589
02:51:39,600 --> 02:51:41,279
>> it's not my opinion it's

4590
02:51:41,279 --> 02:51:45,040
>> clarified by by saying or

4591
02:51:45,040 --> 02:51:46,880
>> its impact upon the area.

4592
02:51:46,880 --> 02:51:49,520
>> Okay. So, so legally when you look at

4593
02:51:49,520 --> 02:51:51,279
the language again, we're legislative.

4594
02:51:51,279 --> 02:51:53,359
We're the land use authority and we're

4595
02:51:53,359 --> 02:51:56,240
making decisions for the city of Alpine,

4596
02:51:56,240 --> 02:51:58,240
>> right? and and what we have is an

4597
02:51:58,240 --> 02:52:00,560
ordinance to rely on and we have

4598
02:52:00,560 --> 02:52:03,680
language in this ordinance that as a

4599
02:52:03,680 --> 02:52:06,800
legislative body we view it

4600
02:52:06,800 --> 02:52:09,520
>> meeting

4601
02:52:09,520 --> 02:52:10,800
that criteria

4602
02:52:10,800 --> 02:52:14,160
>> not character or its impact upon the

4603
02:52:14,160 --> 02:52:17,040
area and again the impact upon the area

4604
02:52:17,040 --> 02:52:18,640
some people may not believe that living

4605
02:52:18,640 --> 02:52:20,640
in a shadow all day long impacts the

4606
02:52:20,640 --> 02:52:23,040
area some people may not believe that

4607
02:52:23,040 --> 02:52:25,120
but other people may believe that not

4608
02:52:25,120 --> 02:52:27,600
seeing the sun all day may impact the

4609
02:52:27,600 --> 02:52:29,920
area. So that's why we're a legislative

4610
02:52:29,920 --> 02:52:31,760
body. That's why we have the ability to

4611
02:52:31,760 --> 02:52:34,560
take all the information in and then

4612
02:52:34,560 --> 02:52:36,720
evaluate it for our city.

4613
02:52:36,720 --> 02:52:41,439
>> But if that if this lot was subdivided

4614
02:52:41,439 --> 02:52:43,520
long long ago at today's standards, we

4615
02:52:43,520 --> 02:52:44,720
would even we wouldn't even be having

4616
02:52:44,720 --> 02:52:45,920
this discussion. They could build this

4617
02:52:45,920 --> 02:52:49,760
house regardless of your feelings of

4618
02:52:49,760 --> 02:52:50,800
what you like.

4619
02:52:50,800 --> 02:52:52,080
>> I don't think feelings is the right

4620
02:52:52,080 --> 02:52:53,439
word. Again, leaning into

4621
02:52:53,439 --> 02:52:56,160
characterization of what's for me, I

4622
02:52:56,160 --> 02:52:56,399
guess.

4623
02:52:56,399 --> 02:52:57,680
>> Well, what we're reading into this

4624
02:52:57,680 --> 02:52:59,439
ordinance, someone will look at it and

4625
02:52:59,439 --> 02:53:01,520
feel like they see that it meets the

4626
02:53:01,520 --> 02:53:03,279
criteria or it doesn't. I think it felt

4627
02:53:03,279 --> 02:53:04,880
on three of them.

4628
02:53:04,880 --> 02:53:06,319
>> So, that's just where I land.

4629
02:53:06,319 --> 02:53:08,160
>> Okay, let's proceed with the

4630
02:53:08,160 --> 02:53:10,560
>> Jessica Smean, yes. Sarah Blackwell,

4631
02:53:10,560 --> 02:53:12,240
yes.

4632
02:53:12,240 --> 02:53:13,359
Chieman, no.

4633
02:53:13,359 --> 02:53:16,080
>> Andrew Young, yes. Brent Rumler, no.

4634
02:53:16,080 --> 02:53:19,359
>> Okay, motion passes. Let's move on. Um,

4635
02:53:19,359 --> 02:53:21,840
item

4636
02:53:21,840 --> 02:53:25,520
>> Where are we at, people?

4637
02:53:25,520 --> 02:53:29,590
Okay. Ordinance 2026-09,

4638
02:53:29,600 --> 02:53:40,790
item B.

4639
02:53:40,800 --> 02:53:43,600
» Okay, Ryan, are you back

4640
02:53:43,600 --> 02:53:45,600
>> or are you still with us?

4641
02:53:45,600 --> 02:53:47,840
>> Yep. Yep, I'm still here.

4642
02:53:47,840 --> 02:53:51,680
>> Wait, so hold on. Um Ryan, thank you for

4643
02:53:51,680 --> 02:53:53,680
being here. just we've got five more

4644
02:53:53,680 --> 02:53:57,120
minutes before 9 and we've got um the

4645
02:53:57,120 --> 02:53:59,279
Lone Peak Public Safety District budget

4646
02:53:59,279 --> 02:54:02,319
which I know we need to go over tonight.

4647
02:54:02,319 --> 02:54:06,160
We um have the American Fork Chamber

4648
02:54:06,160 --> 02:54:08,640
still on and then we also were talking

4649
02:54:08,640 --> 02:54:10,880
about maybe possibly bringing back the

4650
02:54:10,880 --> 02:54:13,680
gateway the Main Street gateway. Um,

4651
02:54:13,680 --> 02:54:15,040
keeping in mind that we do have an

4652
02:54:15,040 --> 02:54:16,240
ordinance that we're supposed to be done

4653
02:54:16,240 --> 02:54:19,760
by 9 supposedly unless there is an

4654
02:54:19,760 --> 02:54:22,479
motion by the council. Um, at this point

4655
02:54:22,479 --> 02:54:26,240
I would like you to number one make a

4656
02:54:26,240 --> 02:54:28,240
motion to extend the meeting and then if

4657
02:54:28,240 --> 02:54:30,160
there's a possibility of postponing some

4658
02:54:30,160 --> 02:54:32,160
of these or tableabling some of these

4659
02:54:32,160 --> 02:54:34,160
items for the next meeting so that we're

4660
02:54:34,160 --> 02:54:36,960
not here forever. I'll make a motion to

4661
02:54:36,960 --> 02:54:38,800
extend the meeting to the extent

4662
02:54:38,800 --> 02:54:44,479
necessary to discuss action item B,

4663
02:54:44,479 --> 02:54:48,319
C, and D, but to skip the additional

4664
02:54:48,319 --> 02:54:50,960
discussion of the Main Street Gateway

4665
02:54:50,960 --> 02:54:54,560
Quarter Master Plan portion and unless

4666
02:54:54,560 --> 02:54:56,240
it's timesensitive,

4667
02:54:56,240 --> 02:54:59,439
the ordinance 202610

4668
02:54:59,439 --> 02:55:02,000
amendments to municipal code 8.04

4669
02:55:02,000 --> 02:55:05,279
cemeteries. Is that is that time of the

4670
02:55:05,279 --> 02:55:06,560
essence to discuss that?

4671
02:55:06,560 --> 02:55:08,880
>> The reason we wanted this and had this

4672
02:55:08,880 --> 02:55:11,760
on the agenda, [clears throat] um we

4673
02:55:11,760 --> 02:55:13,520
wanted to get new signs up before

4674
02:55:13,520 --> 02:55:16,319
Memorial Day and so it was very clear

4675
02:55:16,319 --> 02:55:18,960
the requirements and what's actually

4676
02:55:18,960 --> 02:55:21,200
listed on the sign right now doesn't

4677
02:55:21,200 --> 02:55:23,279
match what's in the ordinance.

4678
02:55:23,279 --> 02:55:26,080
>> Andrew, how long do you think your

4679
02:55:26,080 --> 02:55:27,760
issues will take to discuss that?

4680
02:55:27,760 --> 02:55:29,439
>> It's not just issues. It's just such an

4681
02:55:29,439 --> 02:55:30,560
important thing. thing. I mean, these

4682
02:55:30,560 --> 02:55:33,200
people, this is their deceased family

4683
02:55:33,200 --> 02:55:35,120
members. So, I just wanted to take the

4684
02:55:35,120 --> 02:55:36,640
time to get it right. There there had

4685
02:55:36,640 --> 02:55:39,359
been rare occasions

4686
02:55:39,359 --> 02:55:41,040
where I would ask people what their main

4687
02:55:41,040 --> 02:55:43,040
issue was and it was something in

4688
02:55:43,040 --> 02:55:44,720
regards to the cemetery because their

4689
02:55:44,720 --> 02:55:47,760
daughter or like a family member. So, I

4690
02:55:47,760 --> 02:55:49,840
just I saw a lot of things in there that

4691
02:55:49,840 --> 02:55:51,439
I thought should be discussed more. Not

4692
02:55:51,439 --> 02:55:53,520
that I uh don't like you wanting to put

4693
02:55:53,520 --> 02:55:55,760
up the sign up there, but I actually do

4694
02:55:55,760 --> 02:55:57,600
think it would take 30 minutes to go

4695
02:55:57,600 --> 02:55:59,040
through. There

4696
02:55:59,040 --> 02:56:00,880
there's a lot of verbiage. There's a lot

4697
02:56:00,880 --> 02:56:02,800
of changes, a lot of verbage.

4698
02:56:02,800 --> 02:56:04,720
>> It's It's a lot of And I And I don't

4699
02:56:04,720 --> 02:56:06,479
want you When When is When is Memorial

4700
02:56:06,479 --> 02:56:08,000
Day or How far are we away?

4701
02:56:08,000 --> 02:56:10,720
>> It's May 25th. So, if we talked about it

4702
02:56:10,720 --> 02:56:11,920
next council meeting, would that give

4703
02:56:11,920 --> 02:56:14,160
you enough time to get the signs made

4704
02:56:14,160 --> 02:56:18,070
and installed?

4705
02:56:18,080 --> 02:56:19,439
» Perfect.

4706
02:56:19,439 --> 02:56:21,520
>> Turn around. Maybe I could go through

4707
02:56:21,520 --> 02:56:22,800
any things and give them to you before

4708
02:56:22,800 --> 02:56:25,279
the meeting and try to just have a yes

4709
02:56:25,279 --> 02:56:26,960
no vote because everyone's approved on

4710
02:56:26,960 --> 02:56:30,960
it or any little changes.

4711
02:56:30,960 --> 02:56:32,080
>> I don't mind staying. What's your

4712
02:56:32,080 --> 02:56:33,920
preference?

4713
02:56:33,920 --> 02:56:34,479
>> I

4714
02:56:34,479 --> 02:56:35,120
>> I'm here [clears throat] to tell or

4715
02:56:35,120 --> 02:56:35,680
Fanny.

4716
02:56:35,680 --> 02:56:39,600
>> I'd rather not stay, but also I I know

4717
02:56:39,600 --> 02:56:41,279
the chambers are here, but I don't know

4718
02:56:41,279 --> 02:56:42,640
if either of those are that time

4719
02:56:42,640 --> 02:56:44,720
sensitive either. If we can put off to

4720
02:56:44,720 --> 02:56:47,279
the next meeting. Well, I was going to

4721
02:56:47,279 --> 02:56:49,760
ask, could we just move the chamber to

4722
02:56:49,760 --> 02:56:52,160
the to the next agenda item? Could you

4723
02:56:52,160 --> 02:56:53,200
include that in your motion?

4724
02:56:53,200 --> 02:56:55,040
>> Well, I think the ordinance You don't

4725
02:56:55,040 --> 02:56:56,960
think we should go in order?

4726
02:56:56,960 --> 02:56:58,880
>> I think we should just get it all done.

4727
02:56:58,880 --> 02:57:00,640
>> Yeah, let's just move forward and try

4728
02:57:00,640 --> 02:57:01,520
and limit our comments.

4729
02:57:01,520 --> 02:57:02,960
>> We'll keep the cemetery one on there as

4730
02:57:02,960 --> 02:57:04,080
well.

4731
02:57:04,080 --> 02:57:07,349
>> Okay.

4732
02:57:07,359 --> 02:57:09,040
» Are you withdrawing your motion?

4733
02:57:09,040 --> 02:57:09,439
>> No.

4734
02:57:09,439 --> 02:57:10,160
>> Where's the motion?

4735
02:57:10,160 --> 02:57:12,160
>> I'll restate it if you'd like.

4736
02:57:12,160 --> 02:57:13,840
I move to extend the meeting past the

4737
02:57:13,840 --> 02:57:18,399
nine o'clock legislative deadline um

4738
02:57:18,399 --> 02:57:24,800
to be able to discuss action items B C D

4739
02:57:24,800 --> 02:57:27,920
and also ordinance 202610

4740
02:57:27,920 --> 02:57:30,240
amendments to municip code 8.04

4741
02:57:30,240 --> 02:57:31,760
cemeteries

4742
02:57:31,760 --> 02:57:35,040
and tableabling the proposed discussion

4743
02:57:35,040 --> 02:57:36,880
of the first part of the main street and

4744
02:57:36,880 --> 02:57:38,720
gateway quarter master plan.

4745
02:57:38,720 --> 02:57:43,910
>> I'll second that. Would

4746
02:57:43,920 --> 02:57:47,600
you said tableabling the main street,

4747
02:57:47,600 --> 02:57:49,920
right? Okay. Is that the only thing you

4748
02:57:49,920 --> 02:57:50,720
tabled?

4749
02:57:50,720 --> 02:57:52,399
>> Yes, we can do it. We're going to be

4750
02:57:52,399 --> 02:57:53,920
very disciplined.

4751
02:57:53,920 --> 02:57:55,680
>> I've been up since 1:00 a.m. Just want

4752
02:57:55,680 --> 02:57:57,680
to reiterate that. Okay.

4753
02:57:57,680 --> 02:57:59,840
>> I'm We're happy to put the cemetery on

4754
02:57:59,840 --> 02:58:01,439
the next meeting if Shane's okay with

4755
02:58:01,439 --> 02:58:02,080
that.

4756
02:58:02,080 --> 02:58:03,359
>> No, he's not.

4757
02:58:03,359 --> 02:58:04,080
>> We're going to get through it.

4758
02:58:04,080 --> 02:58:05,439
>> Okay. So, there's been a motion. Is

4759
02:58:05,439 --> 02:58:07,040
there a second?

4760
02:58:07,040 --> 02:58:09,279
>> I'll second. Oh, I'm sorry. Sarah, do

4761
02:58:09,279 --> 02:58:11,200
it. There's been a motion by Councilman

4762
02:58:11,200 --> 02:58:12,800
Rmler, seconded by Councilwoman

4763
02:58:12,800 --> 02:58:15,760
Blackwell to extend the meeting. Um, was

4764
02:58:15,760 --> 02:58:17,040
all in favor?

4765
02:58:17,040 --> 02:58:24,150
>> I Any opposed? Okay,

4766
02:58:24,160 --> 02:58:26,640
there.

4767
02:58:26,640 --> 02:58:33,349
Okay, let's move on to item B.

4768
02:58:33,359 --> 02:58:37,120
Ryan, are you still on?

4769
02:58:37,120 --> 02:58:39,920
>> Yep, I'm still here.

4770
02:58:39,920 --> 02:58:42,880
You're doing this item, right?

4771
02:58:42,880 --> 02:58:44,479
>> The Main Street one. Is that what you

4772
02:58:44,479 --> 02:58:45,040
said?

4773
02:58:45,040 --> 02:58:48,319
>> No, the um

4774
02:58:48,319 --> 02:58:50,960
indoor self storage unit be on action

4775
02:58:50,960 --> 02:58:53,840
items. Yeah, I can I can

4776
02:58:53,840 --> 02:58:56,960
>> um I didn't do the

4777
02:58:56,960 --> 02:58:58,399
we can we can do it.

4778
02:58:58,399 --> 02:58:58,720
>> Okay.

4779
02:58:58,720 --> 02:58:59,359
>> We can take care of

4780
02:58:59,359 --> 02:59:01,520
>> Oh, no. No worries. Whatever you guys

4781
02:59:01,520 --> 02:59:04,399
want, I can. Whatever Whatever is best

4782
02:59:04,399 --> 02:59:05,040
for you guys.

4783
02:59:05,040 --> 02:59:06,479
>> You know what? Shane says he can handle

4784
02:59:06,479 --> 02:59:07,200
it. Thank you.

4785
02:59:07,200 --> 02:59:09,520
>> Yeah. Thanks, Ryan. No worries. Thanks,

4786
02:59:09,520 --> 02:59:10,399
guys. Have a good one.

4787
02:59:10,399 --> 02:59:12,880
>> Thanks, Ryan.

4788
02:59:12,880 --> 02:59:15,840
>> So, we had this item on the agenda two

4789
02:59:15,840 --> 02:59:19,520
weeks ago for discussion. The council,

4790
02:59:19,520 --> 02:59:21,040
you know, spent quite a bit of time

4791
02:59:21,040 --> 02:59:22,640
talking about this. I think some

4792
02:59:22,640 --> 02:59:24,479
residents spoke and [clears throat]

4793
02:59:24,479 --> 02:59:27,840
different things. Um, so now we have it

4794
02:59:27,840 --> 02:59:29,600
back on the agenda at the request of the

4795
02:59:29,600 --> 02:59:31,279
applicant

4796
02:59:31,279 --> 02:59:35,600
um for action. Um,

4797
02:59:35,600 --> 02:59:37,520
uh, let's see. There were, you know, at

4798
02:59:37,520 --> 02:59:39,600
the last meeting there were a few

4799
02:59:39,600 --> 02:59:43,840
concerns uh expressed about this being

4800
02:59:43,840 --> 02:59:45,840
the proper use for the site. Um there

4801
02:59:45,840 --> 02:59:48,399
were both positive and negative uh

4802
02:59:48,399 --> 02:59:52,790
sentiment from council members.

4803
02:59:52,800 --> 02:59:54,720
There also was some discussion about

4804
02:59:54,720 --> 02:59:58,319
this potentially being uh considered as

4805
02:59:58,319 --> 03:00:00,080
an overlay zone as opposed to a

4806
03:00:00,080 --> 03:00:02,319
conditional use permit.

4807
03:00:02,319 --> 03:00:05,040
Um [clears throat] but it was brought

4808
03:00:05,040 --> 03:00:08,080
back. Uh the applicant would like to

4809
03:00:08,080 --> 03:00:10,800
pursue this conditional use permit. And

4810
03:00:10,800 --> 03:00:13,279
again, this is for

4811
03:00:13,279 --> 03:00:14,800
uh

4812
03:00:14,800 --> 03:00:17,279
a code change that would allow these

4813
03:00:17,279 --> 03:00:21,120
luxury uh uh condo luxury garages and

4814
03:00:21,120 --> 03:00:24,800
indoor self- storage units. Um, this is

4815
03:00:24,800 --> 03:00:27,520
a project that's being looked at uh at

4816
03:00:27,520 --> 03:00:29,840
the Purple Mattress, the former Purple

4817
03:00:29,840 --> 03:00:33,359
Mattress building property

4818
03:00:33,359 --> 03:00:37,279
and the applicant is here tonight. Um,

4819
03:00:37,279 --> 03:00:39,439
we can go through more of the staff

4820
03:00:39,439 --> 03:00:41,359
report in more detail if you want to,

4821
03:00:41,359 --> 03:00:44,399
but it was I think it was explained

4822
03:00:44,399 --> 03:00:46,000
quite a bit of detail at the last

4823
03:00:46,000 --> 03:00:47,200
meeting

4824
03:00:47,200 --> 03:00:49,840
>> and discussed. So,

4825
03:00:49,840 --> 03:00:51,920
>> okay, let's go through. Jessica, do you

4826
03:00:51,920 --> 03:00:55,040
have any comments?

4827
03:00:55,040 --> 03:00:56,399
>> Question.

4828
03:00:56,399 --> 03:00:58,160
>> No, if you have I would prefer

4829
03:00:58,160 --> 03:01:01,200
questions, motion, and then comment, but

4830
03:01:01,200 --> 03:01:03,120
>> sure. Yes, we'll ask a question.

4831
03:01:03,120 --> 03:01:05,279
>> Okay, I have no questions at this time.

4832
03:01:05,279 --> 03:01:10,240
>> No questions.

4833
03:01:10,240 --> 03:01:11,840
I have no questions.

4834
03:01:11,840 --> 03:01:13,600
>> Okay, I'll entertain a motion.

4835
03:01:13,600 --> 03:01:16,080
>> Oh, I thought we were going to comment.

4836
03:01:16,080 --> 03:01:17,040
>> Motion and comment.

4837
03:01:17,040 --> 03:01:18,160
>> Motion and then you comment.

4838
03:01:18,160 --> 03:01:19,840
>> I'll make a motion. I move to approve

4839
03:01:19,840 --> 03:01:21,439
the proposed code amendment to allow

4840
03:01:21,439 --> 03:01:24,160
indoor self- storage units and condo

4841
03:01:24,160 --> 03:01:25,520
luxury garages in the business

4842
03:01:25,520 --> 03:01:26,960
commercial zone as presented in the

4843
03:01:26,960 --> 03:01:29,040
staff packet finding that the amendment

4844
03:01:29,040 --> 03:01:30,800
is consistent with the city's general

4845
03:01:30,800 --> 03:01:33,680
plan policies and development code

4846
03:01:33,680 --> 03:01:35,279
standards

4847
03:01:35,279 --> 03:01:37,680
with the use and construction subject to

4848
03:01:37,680 --> 03:01:40,000
future approval of a site plan

4849
03:01:40,000 --> 03:01:42,399
development agreement and CCNRs with

4850
03:01:42,399 --> 03:01:45,040
covenants conditions and restrictions

4851
03:01:45,040 --> 03:01:46,880
that are satisfactory to the city and

4852
03:01:46,880 --> 03:01:48,640
which include the city as a

4853
03:01:48,640 --> 03:01:50,399
or include the city as an expressly

4854
03:01:50,399 --> 03:01:52,479
intended third party beneficiary that

4855
03:01:52,479 --> 03:01:55,680
can enforce the CCNRs.

4856
03:01:55,680 --> 03:01:56,640
Sorry, I just

4857
03:01:56,640 --> 03:01:58,319
>> Is there a second to the motion?

4858
03:01:58,319 --> 03:02:00,000
>> I'll second the motion.

4859
03:02:00,000 --> 03:02:01,680
>> Okay, it's been moved by Councilman

4860
03:02:01,680 --> 03:02:03,040
Remler, seconded by Councilwoman

4861
03:02:03,040 --> 03:02:05,760
Haniman. I'll entertain discussion.

4862
03:02:05,760 --> 03:02:07,920
Let's start with um Councilwoman Smeuan.

4863
03:02:07,920 --> 03:02:09,600
>> Okay. In your motion, you said you found

4864
03:02:09,600 --> 03:02:12,080
it consistent with um Alpine City's

4865
03:02:12,080 --> 03:02:14,800
general plan and can you go into a

4866
03:02:14,800 --> 03:02:18,479
little more detail on that? Yeah, the planning commission looked into that

4867
03:02:18,479 --> 03:02:21,200
as well and unanimous unanimous

4868
03:02:21,200 --> 03:02:25,680
unanimously decided that um that I did

4869
03:02:25,680 --> 03:02:29,840
meet that and recommended approval.

4870
03:02:29,840 --> 03:02:32,560
>> I was at that meeting and I found their

4871
03:02:32,560 --> 03:02:34,800
recommendation was highly subjective and

4872
03:02:34,800 --> 03:02:36,640
on their opinion. They didn't reference

4873
03:02:36,640 --> 03:02:39,680
any verbiage that I found. Correct me if

4874
03:02:39,680 --> 03:02:42,640
I'm wrong. They didn't reference any

4875
03:02:42,640 --> 03:02:44,880
point in the Alpine plan that it

4876
03:02:44,880 --> 03:02:47,040
fulfilled or checked off.

4877
03:02:47,040 --> 03:02:48,640
>> Part of the plan is the zoning. And

4878
03:02:48,640 --> 03:02:50,399
>> the only thing I heard them say was,

4879
03:02:50,399 --> 03:02:52,560
"I'd like one of those."

4880
03:02:52,560 --> 03:02:53,279
>> That's one thing they said.

4881
03:02:53,279 --> 03:02:55,359
>> I I did not find anything that they

4882
03:02:55,359 --> 03:02:57,279
actually referenced in verbiage that met

4883
03:02:57,279 --> 03:02:57,520
it.

4884
03:02:57,520 --> 03:02:58,960
>> Oh, yeah. One member did say that.

4885
03:02:58,960 --> 03:03:00,399
That's correct. But they did have

4886
03:03:00,399 --> 03:03:03,120
several um things that they that they

4887
03:03:03,120 --> 03:03:04,640
found that were

4888
03:03:04,640 --> 03:03:05,359
>> and just to back up.

4889
03:03:05,359 --> 03:03:07,200
>> So Jessica, did you let me let me go

4890
03:03:07,200 --> 03:03:10,319
ahead with that was

4891
03:03:10,319 --> 03:03:12,319
do that when you'll be the last one to

4892
03:03:12,319 --> 03:03:13,600
talk. So let's go ahead.

4893
03:03:13,600 --> 03:03:15,760
>> Okay. And and so just looking at you

4894
03:03:15,760 --> 03:03:17,439
know the purpose of a conditional use

4895
03:03:17,439 --> 03:03:18,960
permit which is what we have in front of

4896
03:03:18,960 --> 03:03:22,240
us right now. and and you know our job

4897
03:03:22,240 --> 03:03:24,800
is to make sure that this conditional

4898
03:03:24,800 --> 03:03:28,080
use permit is compatible with um the

4899
03:03:28,080 --> 03:03:31,920
vision and the community. And so as in

4900
03:03:31,920 --> 03:03:34,399
doing that and looking at compatibility,

4901
03:03:34,399 --> 03:03:37,840
I um looked at our gateway number one, I

4902
03:03:37,840 --> 03:03:39,279
looked at our general plan and in our

4903
03:03:39,279 --> 03:03:42,880
general plan it it pointed to policies

4904
03:03:42,880 --> 03:03:45,439
in our gateway historic zone. And so as

4905
03:03:45,439 --> 03:03:47,760
I went into our gateway historic zone

4906
03:03:47,760 --> 03:03:50,080
and I wanted to again make sure that

4907
03:03:50,080 --> 03:03:52,399
there was compatibility, there were a

4908
03:03:52,399 --> 03:03:55,200
couple of items that stood out and it's

4909
03:03:55,200 --> 03:03:57,040
um number one in relation to the

4910
03:03:57,040 --> 03:03:58,479
surrounding areas and our gateway

4911
03:03:58,479 --> 03:04:02,000
historic is an adopted plan that is part

4912
03:04:02,000 --> 03:04:06,000
of our um city ordinances and in that it

4913
03:04:06,000 --> 03:04:08,000
reads new construction should not be

4914
03:04:08,000 --> 03:04:10,399
dramatically greater in scale than

4915
03:04:10,399 --> 03:04:12,720
surrounding structures in the district.

4916
03:04:12,720 --> 03:04:16,560
So in that scenario, this clearly having

4917
03:04:16,560 --> 03:04:20,319
700 total storage units, 50 of those

4918
03:04:20,319 --> 03:04:25,680
being um condos with an active clubhouse

4919
03:04:25,680 --> 03:04:30,000
clearly did not meet the standard of um

4920
03:04:30,000 --> 03:04:31,520
it should be compatible with the

4921
03:04:31,520 --> 03:04:33,520
surrounding scale and structure. There

4922
03:04:33,520 --> 03:04:36,240
was also an item listed that the

4923
03:04:36,240 --> 03:04:38,800
building form of new construction should

4924
03:04:38,800 --> 03:04:42,000
be similar to surrounding structures but

4925
03:04:42,000 --> 03:04:45,520
should not necessarily be indirect

4926
03:04:45,520 --> 03:04:48,479
imitation. And again, I see that there's

4927
03:04:48,479 --> 03:04:50,560
not a compatibility with this project

4928
03:04:50,560 --> 03:04:55,279
where it is um compatible with what's

4929
03:04:55,279 --> 03:04:58,399
going with I think we have on one side

4930
03:04:58,399 --> 03:05:01,040
we have a historic

4931
03:05:01,040 --> 03:05:03,520
um reconstructed

4932
03:05:03,520 --> 03:05:06,240
event center that looks very much rustic

4933
03:05:06,240 --> 03:05:07,760
and then on the other side we have a

4934
03:05:07,760 --> 03:05:10,160
small dance studio. And so neither one

4935
03:05:10,160 --> 03:05:13,840
of those elements are matched. But I

4936
03:05:13,840 --> 03:05:15,040
wanted to look and see in our

4937
03:05:15,040 --> 03:05:17,120
surrounding communities, is there a

4938
03:05:17,120 --> 03:05:18,960
precedent or are other cities doing

4939
03:05:18,960 --> 03:05:21,040
this? Is this something, you know, maybe

4940
03:05:21,040 --> 03:05:23,520
this is where it's trending? So I looked

4941
03:05:23,520 --> 03:05:26,399
at West Valley and actually West Valley

4942
03:05:26,399 --> 03:05:30,240
has higher restrictive covenants for um

4943
03:05:30,240 --> 03:05:33,040
storage units than what this what we're

4944
03:05:33,040 --> 03:05:34,960
being um con what we're considering

4945
03:05:34,960 --> 03:05:37,760
tonight. I also looked at Haramman. they

4946
03:05:37,760 --> 03:05:40,000
have higher restrictions than what we're

4947
03:05:40,000 --> 03:05:42,800
considering this evening. And I thought,

4948
03:05:42,800 --> 03:05:45,920
okay, we're this project is not moving

4949
03:05:45,920 --> 03:05:48,560
in the right direction. And so lastly, I

4950
03:05:48,560 --> 03:05:50,640
looked at

4951
03:05:50,640 --> 03:05:52,720
cities that

4952
03:05:52,720 --> 03:05:55,120
are similar to Alpine because again,

4953
03:05:55,120 --> 03:06:00,640
maybe this is a way to have low traffic

4954
03:06:00,640 --> 03:06:02,160
because that, you know, is something

4955
03:06:02,160 --> 03:06:04,000
that's important is we don't want a lot

4956
03:06:04,000 --> 03:06:06,000
of traffic. We don't know how much

4957
03:06:06,000 --> 03:06:07,600
traffic it has because we don't have a

4958
03:06:07,600 --> 03:06:10,240
study regarding 50 condo units and we

4959
03:06:10,240 --> 03:06:12,240
don't have a study regarding an active

4960
03:06:12,240 --> 03:06:14,399
clubhouse and what that traffic

4961
03:06:14,399 --> 03:06:18,640
implication is with 650 storage units.

4962
03:06:18,640 --> 03:06:20,160
Agreed. There's probably not a ton of

4963
03:06:20,160 --> 03:06:22,399
traffic. However, Highland doesn't allow

4964
03:06:22,399 --> 03:06:25,279
storage units. Woodland Hills, which is

4965
03:06:25,279 --> 03:06:27,840
also a similar town to Alpine, does not

4966
03:06:27,840 --> 03:06:30,000
allow storage units. Fruit Heights does

4967
03:06:30,000 --> 03:06:32,960
not allow storage units. Mapleton does,

4968
03:06:32,960 --> 03:06:34,720
but only in their industrial and

4969
03:06:34,720 --> 03:06:38,000
manufacturing zones. We're looking at a

4970
03:06:38,000 --> 03:06:39,680
business commercial that will

4971
03:06:39,680 --> 03:06:42,640
potentially become a transition zone per

4972
03:06:42,640 --> 03:06:46,640
our our um small area plan. And so for

4973
03:06:46,640 --> 03:06:51,439
me, um while I while I appreciate the

4974
03:06:51,439 --> 03:06:55,439
motion, I don't see any touch where it

4975
03:06:55,439 --> 03:06:57,120
meets our general plan, where it meets

4976
03:06:57,120 --> 03:06:59,920
our gateway historic. And as a reminder

4977
03:06:59,920 --> 03:07:01,600
to

4978
03:07:01,600 --> 03:07:03,600
council, planning commission is a

4979
03:07:03,600 --> 03:07:06,000
recommending body. They are appointed.

4980
03:07:06,000 --> 03:07:07,680
They're not elected officials. We're

4981
03:07:07,680 --> 03:07:09,279
here to represent the voice of our

4982
03:07:09,279 --> 03:07:11,040
community.

4983
03:07:11,040 --> 03:07:11,600
>> Okay.

4984
03:07:11,600 --> 03:07:12,240
>> Wow.

4985
03:07:12,240 --> 03:07:13,520
>> Sarah.

4986
03:07:13,520 --> 03:07:15,840
>> Um I have probably spent the most amount

4987
03:07:15,840 --> 03:07:19,120
of time studying out this topic because

4988
03:07:19,120 --> 03:07:20,720
when I look at our overall vision and

4989
03:07:20,720 --> 03:07:22,479
land use, there's lots of things that I

4990
03:07:22,479 --> 03:07:25,200
feel like are subjective and you could

4991
03:07:25,200 --> 03:07:28,160
argue one way or the other. um as far as

4992
03:07:28,160 --> 03:07:30,479
like economic development when I look at

4993
03:07:30,479 --> 03:07:33,120
that in our master plan correct me if

4994
03:07:33,120 --> 03:07:35,439
I'm wrong but we do not receive a lot of

4995
03:07:35,439 --> 03:07:38,080
tax revenue from storage units and in

4996
03:07:38,080 --> 03:07:40,080
our business commercial zone that's been

4997
03:07:40,080 --> 03:07:41,840
a concern for me this is zone business

4998
03:07:41,840 --> 03:07:44,080
commercial how does it benefit the city

4999
03:07:44,080 --> 03:07:45,840
financially

5000
03:07:45,840 --> 03:07:48,560
um from a community standpoint

5001
03:07:48,560 --> 03:07:50,640
um aesthetically

5002
03:07:50,640 --> 03:07:53,279
um community engagement and so that's

5003
03:07:53,279 --> 03:07:56,399
kind of where I've been kind of

5004
03:07:56,399 --> 03:07:59,040
struggling going back and forth as to,

5005
03:07:59,040 --> 03:08:00,960
you know, how it falls into those

5006
03:08:00,960 --> 03:08:03,439
categories. Um, so those are some of

5007
03:08:03,439 --> 03:08:05,760
just my thoughts and concerns. That's

5008
03:08:05,760 --> 03:08:06,000
it.

5009
03:08:06,000 --> 03:08:07,359
>> So, a couple of things. You said

5010
03:08:07,359 --> 03:08:10,399
Highland doesn't um allow storage units.

5011
03:08:10,399 --> 03:08:12,240
So, I don't Sounds like it's something

5012
03:08:12,240 --> 03:08:13,279
that's new because they do have the

5013
03:08:13,279 --> 03:08:15,840
Highland hide away, which is a storage

5014
03:08:15,840 --> 03:08:18,560
unit. And then as far as tax revenue,

5015
03:08:18,560 --> 03:08:19,600
um,

5016
03:08:19,600 --> 03:08:21,200
>> you know, if you have storage units,

5017
03:08:21,200 --> 03:08:23,359
it's going to be a business commercial

5018
03:08:23,359 --> 03:08:25,600
building, which is taxed. Excuse me.

5019
03:08:25,600 --> 03:08:27,120
>> I'm sorry. Is that not on the Cedar Hill

5020
03:08:27,120 --> 03:08:27,920
side?

5021
03:08:27,920 --> 03:08:28,880
>> I could.

5022
03:08:28,880 --> 03:08:29,359
>> No,

5023
03:08:29,359 --> 03:08:30,960
>> I must be thinking about the orange one.

5024
03:08:30,960 --> 03:08:31,760
Sorry.

5025
03:08:31,760 --> 03:08:33,200
>> Okay.

5026
03:08:33,200 --> 03:08:36,880
>> So, um, and then as far as, you know,

5027
03:08:36,880 --> 03:08:39,600
revenue for the city, it because it's at

5028
03:08:39,600 --> 03:08:41,760
least the storage units is going to be

5029
03:08:41,760 --> 03:08:44,800
considered a commercial property, wool

5030
03:08:44,800 --> 03:08:47,279
receives um, property tax revenue at

5031
03:08:47,279 --> 03:08:51,359
100% of the value as opposed to when you

5032
03:08:51,359 --> 03:08:53,279
have your primary residence and we

5033
03:08:53,279 --> 03:08:55,680
collect property tax on that. there's a

5034
03:08:55,680 --> 03:08:58,080
45% discount for, you know, for your

5035
03:08:58,080 --> 03:09:00,479
primary um residence. And then my

5036
03:09:00,479 --> 03:09:03,600
understanding with the storage condos,

5037
03:09:03,600 --> 03:09:06,000
those will not be their primary

5038
03:09:06,000 --> 03:09:07,840
residence. So, they'll also be taxed.

5039
03:09:07,840 --> 03:09:10,160
The property tax will be at 100% of the

5040
03:09:10,160 --> 03:09:11,920
value of the unit.

5041
03:09:11,920 --> 03:09:14,479
>> That's a one when they buy that unit. Is

5042
03:09:14,479 --> 03:09:15,760
that a

5043
03:09:15,760 --> 03:09:17,439
>> No, property tax is annual.

5044
03:09:17,439 --> 03:09:19,279
>> Yeah. Right. Okay. But there isn't like

5045
03:09:19,279 --> 03:09:20,800
a Okay. Yeah.

5046
03:09:20,800 --> 03:09:22,560
>> Yeah. So, it's You're right. no sales

5047
03:09:22,560 --> 03:09:24,720
tax revenue, but as far as property tax

5048
03:09:24,720 --> 03:09:26,640
as opposed to whether it's going to be

5049
03:09:26,640 --> 03:09:29,680
residential or nothing, you know,

5050
03:09:29,680 --> 03:09:32,000
there's no income from that at all. If

5051
03:09:32,000 --> 03:09:35,520
it were homes, we would get 55% of the

5052
03:09:35,520 --> 03:09:38,000
value of the home. For property taxes,

5053
03:09:38,000 --> 03:09:39,680
but for business, it's different. You

5054
03:09:39,680 --> 03:09:41,439
get 100%.

5055
03:09:41,439 --> 03:09:44,399
>> Do you feel like that would be

5056
03:09:44,399 --> 03:09:46,880
is that less than what you would get?

5057
03:09:46,880 --> 03:09:48,160
>> Oh, no. That you know, I don't feel one

5058
03:09:48,160 --> 03:09:49,840
way or the other. is just I just wanted

5059
03:09:49,840 --> 03:09:53,359
to clarify as far as you know um as far

5060
03:09:53,359 --> 03:09:58,560
as monetary um benefit to the city that is something to consider but

5061
03:09:58,560 --> 03:10:01,040
whether it outweighs everything that has

5062
03:10:01,040 --> 03:10:02,640
been said that's something you know they

5063
03:10:02,640 --> 03:10:03,600
need to consider right

5064
03:10:03,600 --> 03:10:05,200
>> aren't we already getting that

5065
03:10:05,200 --> 03:10:05,840
>> appreciate that

5066
03:10:05,840 --> 03:10:07,760
>> aren't we already getting that

5067
03:10:07,760 --> 03:10:11,680
>> tax revenue on the business zoning

5068
03:10:11,680 --> 03:10:13,600
>> not because it's not I'm not sure how

5069
03:10:13,600 --> 03:10:15,520
that works when if it's not because

5070
03:10:15,520 --> 03:10:17,840
they've noticed a vacate I think it's

5071
03:10:17,840 --> 03:10:20,000
like a different

5072
03:10:20,000 --> 03:10:21,359
>> they still pay pro

5073
03:10:21,359 --> 03:10:22,960
>> they still have to pay their commercial

5074
03:10:22,960 --> 03:10:23,920
taxes.

5075
03:10:23,920 --> 03:10:25,520
>> They pay property taxes but I think it's

5076
03:10:25,520 --> 03:10:28,240
different if it's because I was

5077
03:10:28,240 --> 03:10:31,120
questioned when um Purple was noticing

5078
03:10:31,120 --> 03:10:32,479
the city because I was getting the

5079
03:10:32,479 --> 03:10:34,080
notices the city was getting the notices

5080
03:10:34,080 --> 03:10:35,680
that they were going to vacate and the

5081
03:10:35,680 --> 03:10:36,880
whole purpose of doing that is to

5082
03:10:36,880 --> 03:10:38,319
protect themselves from their taxes.

5083
03:10:38,319 --> 03:10:39,520
there's some kind of it's a different

5084
03:10:39,520 --> 03:10:41,920
level of taxes

5085
03:10:41,920 --> 03:10:43,680
>> with I I assume with additional

5086
03:10:43,680 --> 03:10:45,920
improvements and those individual condo

5087
03:10:45,920 --> 03:10:47,520
units that the valuation would go up

5088
03:10:47,520 --> 03:10:48,720
significantly

5089
03:10:48,720 --> 03:10:50,880
>> so the tax revenue would go up

5090
03:10:50,880 --> 03:10:51,840
proportionally

5091
03:10:51,840 --> 03:10:53,680
>> right okay did you have anything else

5092
03:10:53,680 --> 03:10:55,680
okay Chrissy

5093
03:10:55,680 --> 03:10:58,800
>> um thank you for your insights I think

5094
03:10:58,800 --> 03:11:01,520
um one of the things that we're bumping

5095
03:11:01,520 --> 03:11:04,800
up against both with the previous uh

5096
03:11:04,800 --> 03:11:07,359
item and this item is the value of our

5097
03:11:07,359 --> 03:11:11,680
land has gone up um to such a point that

5098
03:11:11,680 --> 03:11:16,000
um to make projects pencil even a home

5099
03:11:16,000 --> 03:11:19,200
the cost of the land is driving up what

5100
03:11:19,200 --> 03:11:21,520
is necessary to build [clears throat] um

5101
03:11:21,520 --> 03:11:25,200
there's a formula roughly right that a

5102
03:11:25,200 --> 03:11:26,960
project you'd spend x number of dollars

5103
03:11:26,960 --> 03:11:30,800
on the land and then um the project has

5104
03:11:30,800 --> 03:11:33,520
to earn money in in a commercial zone.

5105
03:11:33,520 --> 03:11:36,479
So every project that has come before us

5106
03:11:36,479 --> 03:11:38,720
that didn't fit any of our uses, you

5107
03:11:38,720 --> 03:11:40,960
know, they're trying to see what could

5108
03:11:40,960 --> 03:11:44,000
work. What are we open to? It just

5109
03:11:44,000 --> 03:11:45,040
didn't pencil [clears throat] because

5110
03:11:45,040 --> 03:11:47,520
the cost of the land is so high. And

5111
03:11:47,520 --> 03:11:49,920
that's not just unique to this property,

5112
03:11:49,920 --> 03:11:51,760
but we're seeing it in our residential

5113
03:11:51,760 --> 03:11:55,359
areas as well, which is why we see like

5114
03:11:55,359 --> 03:11:57,279
things being filled like every square

5115
03:11:57,279 --> 03:11:59,760
inch of the property, which is this is

5116
03:11:59,760 --> 03:12:02,240
happening to this property, too. So I do

5117
03:12:02,240 --> 03:12:04,399
think um when we get to mass and zoning

5118
03:12:04,399 --> 03:12:06,560
ordinances we will address this but at

5119
03:12:06,560 --> 03:12:08,800
this point we we don't have something

5120
03:12:08,800 --> 03:12:12,479
very specific but the history of um this

5121
03:12:12,479 --> 03:12:16,399
specific piece of land um different

5122
03:12:16,399 --> 03:12:18,640
things have been suggested and again

5123
03:12:18,640 --> 03:12:21,439
they don't pencil because of the amount

5124
03:12:21,439 --> 03:12:24,000
the cost of the land. Other things have

5125
03:12:24,000 --> 03:12:26,479
been suggested like um residential units

5126
03:12:26,479 --> 03:12:28,160
but in order to get it to pencil they

5127
03:12:28,160 --> 03:12:30,479
have to go really high which would not

5128
03:12:30,479 --> 03:12:33,600
meet the character of our city. I agree.

5129
03:12:33,600 --> 03:12:35,760
Um and then maybe it would be great to

5130
03:12:35,760 --> 03:12:38,000
expand the cemetery but we don't have $8

5131
03:12:38,000 --> 03:12:44,399
million. So the city coffers I mean our um our fund balance for the cemetery

5132
03:12:44,399 --> 03:12:46,399
is only1 million. So we can't even begin

5133
03:12:46,399 --> 03:12:48,399
to comprehend

5134
03:12:48,399 --> 03:12:50,960
buying this property to you know for the

5135
03:12:50,960 --> 03:12:53,920
city. So looking at all the options, I

5136
03:12:53,920 --> 03:12:57,279
don't think letting it stay vacant um is

5137
03:12:57,279 --> 03:13:00,560
the best best use of our city uh

5138
03:13:00,560 --> 03:13:04,479
resources to sort of have a pie in the

5139
03:13:04,479 --> 03:13:08,319
sky idea that it could be something. I

5140
03:13:08,319 --> 03:13:09,920
don't know what people think it could. I

5141
03:13:09,920 --> 03:13:11,680
mean there's there are things it could

5142
03:13:11,680 --> 03:13:14,000
be, but they're they're not economically

5143
03:13:14,000 --> 03:13:16,880
viable even for public use. Even like

5144
03:13:16,880 --> 03:13:17,920
people have said, "Well, we could

5145
03:13:17,920 --> 03:13:19,600
convert it to a rec center, you know,

5146
03:13:19,600 --> 03:13:21,920
for the city." Well, you you you know,

5147
03:13:21,920 --> 03:13:23,439
we just went over budget. Like, we don't

5148
03:13:23,439 --> 03:13:26,000
have the resources for that. So, I'm not

5149
03:13:26,000 --> 03:13:28,560
trying to like put a square peg in a

5150
03:13:28,560 --> 03:13:30,960
round hole, but I do think in trying to

5151
03:13:30,960 --> 03:13:32,800
use the high find the highest and best

5152
03:13:32,800 --> 03:13:35,200
use for this particular piece of

5153
03:13:35,200 --> 03:13:36,880
property, we need to think out of the

5154
03:13:36,880 --> 03:13:38,880
box, just plain and simple.

5155
03:13:38,880 --> 03:13:39,520
>> Okay.

5156
03:13:39,520 --> 03:13:44,160
>> Yes. Sorry, I have a question. I just I just have a comment. You know,

5157
03:13:44,160 --> 03:13:46,080
the property owner has priced this

5158
03:13:46,080 --> 03:13:48,640
rather high. So my question is why is it

5159
03:13:48,640 --> 03:13:51,520
then our obligation to accommodate based

5160
03:13:51,520 --> 03:13:53,600
off of a choice that he's made to market

5161
03:13:53,600 --> 03:13:55,920
it that high? I don't know. That's

5162
03:13:55,920 --> 03:13:57,680
>> No, I don't I agree with you. No, I

5163
03:13:57,680 --> 03:13:59,279
agree. It's not our job to make sure

5164
03:13:59,279 --> 03:14:02,160
that every piece of property owner um

5165
03:14:02,160 --> 03:14:04,479
like what Brent talks about, they are

5166
03:14:04,479 --> 03:14:07,120
they have owner they have land use

5167
03:14:07,120 --> 03:14:10,160
rights and our job is to not inhibit

5168
03:14:10,160 --> 03:14:13,040
them from the land owners developing the

5169
03:14:13,040 --> 03:14:15,120
property according to our ordinances.

5170
03:14:15,120 --> 03:14:16,800
Well, we don't really have an ordinance

5171
03:14:16,800 --> 03:14:19,920
that can really use this land in a in in

5172
03:14:19,920 --> 03:14:22,239
a way that um in a commercial way,

5173
03:14:22,239 --> 03:14:24,239
right? And we don't have the resources

5174
03:14:24,239 --> 03:14:26,399
to use it in a public way. So, we're

5175
03:14:26,399 --> 03:14:29,200
trying to uh be creative maybe is a good

5176
03:14:29,200 --> 03:14:31,359
word for it and think out of the box and

5177
03:14:31,359 --> 03:14:33,200
try and figure out what can this land be

5178
03:14:33,200 --> 03:14:35,920
used for, not with a goal of enriching

5179
03:14:35,920 --> 03:14:38,640
um the land owners, but this is such a

5180
03:14:38,640 --> 03:14:41,439
big part of our city. If you drive up

5181
03:14:41,439 --> 03:14:43,920
Main Street, you know, all the way, you

5182
03:14:43,920 --> 03:14:45,840
don't stop till you look you're looking

5183
03:14:45,840 --> 03:14:48,640
pretty much it's right there and it's a

5184
03:14:48,640 --> 03:14:50,720
huge piece of property relative to

5185
03:14:50,720 --> 03:14:52,160
everything around it.

5186
03:14:52,160 --> 03:14:54,160
>> So, whatever goes in there is going to

5187
03:14:54,160 --> 03:14:57,279
have a lasting impact on our city. So, I

5188
03:14:57,279 --> 03:14:59,760
think um we're very careful about that.

5189
03:14:59,760 --> 03:15:01,920
So, I do appreciate all of the comments

5190
03:15:01,920 --> 03:15:04,560
that have come through about not wanting

5191
03:15:04,560 --> 03:15:07,359
certain things to happen in our city. We

5192
03:15:07,359 --> 03:15:09,279
are voting tonight on an ordinance, not

5193
03:15:09,279 --> 03:15:12,800
a particular project. So, we have more

5194
03:15:12,800 --> 03:15:15,520
opportunities besides tonight to put

5195
03:15:15,520 --> 03:15:17,359
additional restrictions on what the

5196
03:15:17,359 --> 03:15:19,680
final product looks like. But I do think

5197
03:15:19,680 --> 03:15:22,080
we have to open up the door to something

5198
03:15:22,080 --> 03:15:24,800
different because of um sitting down

5199
03:15:24,800 --> 03:15:26,720
with land people who would like to

5200
03:15:26,720 --> 03:15:28,880
purchase the land and they talk about

5201
03:15:28,880 --> 03:15:30,319
all the constraints they're dealing

5202
03:15:30,319 --> 03:15:32,640
with. There just isn't really a viable

5203
03:15:32,640 --> 03:15:35,359
option and it's already sent sat vacant

5204
03:15:35,359 --> 03:15:38,800
for so long. I am willing to go into a

5205
03:15:38,800 --> 03:15:40,800
different arena and say maybe we need to

5206
03:15:40,800 --> 03:15:42,160
think out of the box about what's

5207
03:15:42,160 --> 03:15:45,600
another way we could use the land. Um

5208
03:15:45,600 --> 03:15:48,800
and that's this to me meets some really

5209
03:15:48,800 --> 03:15:51,040
important factors that um as you know

5210
03:15:51,040 --> 03:15:52,640
we've been involved in the main street

5211
03:15:52,640 --> 03:15:54,560
guidelines. People don't want a lot of

5212
03:15:54,560 --> 03:15:57,920
traffic in our city. This provides that.

5213
03:15:57,920 --> 03:16:01,520
They um don't want people um like with

5214
03:16:01,520 --> 03:16:03,359
really high buildings. I think we just

5215
03:16:03,359 --> 03:16:05,279
heard that we don't want really really

5216
03:16:05,279 --> 03:16:07,520
tall houses. So the buildings are

5217
03:16:07,520 --> 03:16:10,399
actually relatively low compared to what

5218
03:16:10,399 --> 03:16:12,960
um it you know they're not maxing out on

5219
03:16:12,960 --> 03:16:15,279
height in any way. So I thought that was

5220
03:16:15,279 --> 03:16:18,720
important. And then um they seem very

5221
03:16:18,720 --> 03:16:21,680
willing to adjust their site plan which

5222
03:16:21,680 --> 03:16:23,359
again we will see at a later meeting

5223
03:16:23,359 --> 03:16:25,680
that's not under discussion today. Um

5224
03:16:25,680 --> 03:16:28,399
but so we can like you know meet have

5225
03:16:28,399 --> 03:16:31,120
some high expectations about the site

5226
03:16:31,120 --> 03:16:33,760
plan and the CCNR is to keep things you

5227
03:16:33,760 --> 03:16:37,439
know as they promised. So I do believe

5228
03:16:37,439 --> 03:16:39,120
specifically I'm I'm speaking to the

5229
03:16:39,120 --> 03:16:41,680
ordinance here that this is a different

5230
03:16:41,680 --> 03:16:44,399
use. It's a different we don't have an

5231
03:16:44,399 --> 03:16:46,960
allowed storage units in Alpine before

5232
03:16:46,960 --> 03:16:49,120
and because of the it's in the it's in

5233
03:16:49,120 --> 03:16:52,319
the um ordinance that there can be no

5234
03:16:52,319 --> 03:16:55,200
other unit there could be no other

5235
03:16:55,200 --> 03:16:57,439
storage units within a mile and then

5236
03:16:57,439 --> 03:16:59,760
they drill they they did the circle

5237
03:16:59,760 --> 03:17:02,560
around the whole property if if you know

5238
03:17:02,560 --> 03:17:05,359
if this moves forward like we won't end

5239
03:17:05,359 --> 03:17:08,479
up with a city full I think it was um we

5240
03:17:08,479 --> 03:17:11,840
were we were adjusting the the by the

5241
03:17:11,840 --> 03:17:14,479
survey the lines of Alpine City and they

5242
03:17:14,479 --> 03:17:16,720
said we're like two square miles, right?

5243
03:17:16,720 --> 03:17:18,000
Do you remember when we were talking

5244
03:17:18,000 --> 03:17:20,399
about that one? And so if you put this

5245
03:17:20,399 --> 03:17:22,160
particular piece of land, the purple

5246
03:17:22,160 --> 03:17:24,399
property in the middle, it's like the

5247
03:17:24,399 --> 03:17:26,479
whole city is because we're only two

5248
03:17:26,479 --> 03:17:28,960
miles across. So if you do the onem

5249
03:17:28,960 --> 03:17:30,960
radius, we we're we're pretty much not

5250
03:17:30,960 --> 03:17:33,680
going to become a city of storage units

5251
03:17:33,680 --> 03:17:35,680
because of that one restriction, which

5252
03:17:35,680 --> 03:17:37,439
makes me much more comfortable about the

5253
03:17:37,439 --> 03:17:41,040
ordinance. Um, so those that's my

5254
03:17:41,040 --> 03:17:43,600
reasoning or is that I am willing to

5255
03:17:43,600 --> 03:17:45,760
think out of the box because of the

5256
03:17:45,760 --> 03:17:48,319
prominence of this this specific piece

5257
03:17:48,319 --> 03:17:51,120
of land and that I do understand the

5258
03:17:51,120 --> 03:17:53,840
need for it to be economically viable.

5259
03:17:53,840 --> 03:17:55,680
If you don't have economically viable

5260
03:17:55,680 --> 03:17:58,720
projects, I can't. We end up with what

5261
03:17:58,720 --> 03:18:01,439
we have now. There is an empty building

5262
03:18:01,439 --> 03:18:03,040
that's

5263
03:18:03,040 --> 03:18:05,120
not in good shape and nobody's willing

5264
03:18:05,120 --> 03:18:06,960
to invest any money to make it look

5265
03:18:06,960 --> 03:18:09,439
nicer if it's not economically viable.

5266
03:18:09,439 --> 03:18:11,120
>> Well, that's a question I have and maybe

5267
03:18:11,120 --> 03:18:12,800
it's for Steve because it kind of feels

5268
03:18:12,800 --> 03:18:16,000
like it's a fence thing. Is it a is it a

5269
03:18:16,000 --> 03:18:18,479
city council's responsibility to make

5270
03:18:18,479 --> 03:18:20,880
personal property economically viable?

5271
03:18:20,880 --> 03:18:23,520
because I'd like to put a lot of little

5272
03:18:23,520 --> 03:18:27,359
houses on my 1.6 acres and divide it up

5273
03:18:27,359 --> 03:18:30,239
and sell it. So, so are we here to pick

5274
03:18:30,239 --> 03:18:33,120
and choose whose projects pencil?

5275
03:18:33,120 --> 03:18:33,600
>> No.

5276
03:18:33,600 --> 03:18:36,880
>> Are we here to apply? And then secondly,

5277
03:18:36,880 --> 03:18:37,840
>> wait, I have

5278
03:18:37,840 --> 03:18:40,319
>> as far as I like the circle. Well,

5279
03:18:40,319 --> 03:18:41,120
really quick,

5280
03:18:41,120 --> 03:18:42,239
>> will you let her finish her?

5281
03:18:42,239 --> 03:18:44,560
>> Well, this relates to storage units and

5282
03:18:44,560 --> 03:18:46,399
property rights. Let's let Chrissy

5283
03:18:46,399 --> 03:18:48,239
>> Can I ask you about storage units and

5284
03:18:48,239 --> 03:18:51,120
property rights because there is a lot

5285
03:18:51,120 --> 03:18:51,439
of

5286
03:18:51,439 --> 03:18:53,520
>> Can you wait till after her comments and

5287
03:18:53,520 --> 03:18:54,800
then we can proceed.

5288
03:18:54,800 --> 03:18:55,680
>> Yeah,

5289
03:18:55,680 --> 03:18:56,720
>> you take my time.

5290
03:18:56,720 --> 03:18:59,840
>> Yes. I I I think I was wrapping up just

5291
03:18:59,840 --> 03:19:04,000
to say that um this is a unique piece of

5292
03:19:04,000 --> 03:19:06,399
property in our city. It's a in a very

5293
03:19:06,399 --> 03:19:08,880
prominent place of our city. And I've

5294
03:19:08,880 --> 03:19:11,359
sat with different people who thought of

5295
03:19:11,359 --> 03:19:13,120
their best brought forth their best

5296
03:19:13,120 --> 03:19:17,120
ideas about how to use the property and

5297
03:19:17,120 --> 03:19:19,439
it just wasn't economically viable. So I

5298
03:19:19,439 --> 03:19:22,160
I'm not saying it's my job to make sure

5299
03:19:22,160 --> 03:19:25,520
it's econom economically viable, but I

5300
03:19:25,520 --> 03:19:28,080
do think if we're too strict, we will

5301
03:19:28,080 --> 03:19:29,760
end up with a piece of property sitting

5302
03:19:29,760 --> 03:19:32,000
there for, you know, another hundred

5303
03:19:32,000 --> 03:19:36,239
years. So because it's that's that's

5304
03:19:36,239 --> 03:19:37,920
what we're that's that's where I that's

5305
03:19:37,920 --> 03:19:40,239
my personal opinion because the cost of

5306
03:19:40,239 --> 03:19:42,319
the land in Alpine is changing the very

5307
03:19:42,319 --> 03:19:45,120
dynamics of residential and commercial

5308
03:19:45,120 --> 03:19:48,399
use and we have to give some boundaries

5309
03:19:48,399 --> 03:19:50,960
to it but that doesn't mean we can't we

5310
03:19:50,960 --> 03:19:53,359
have to constantly just say what's

5311
03:19:53,359 --> 03:19:55,200
already there is the only thing that's

5312
03:19:55,200 --> 03:19:57,439
acceptable like I'm not that kind of

5313
03:19:57,439 --> 03:19:59,760
person I think we have to look at what

5314
03:19:59,760 --> 03:20:03,120
there was there was is no longer

5315
03:20:03,120 --> 03:20:05,760
acceptable. What does the future look

5316
03:20:05,760 --> 03:20:06,479
like? Okay.

5317
03:20:06,479 --> 03:20:07,760
>> And that's my final comment.

5318
03:20:07,760 --> 03:20:10,800
>> So, Chrissy, are you willing are you um

5319
03:20:10,800 --> 03:20:12,720
willing to entertain a question from

5320
03:20:12,720 --> 03:20:13,439
Jessica?

5321
03:20:13,439 --> 03:20:13,760
>> Sure.

5322
03:20:13,760 --> 03:20:14,080
>> Yes.

5323
03:20:14,080 --> 03:20:16,880
>> Okay. So, you mentioned the circles and

5324
03:20:16,880 --> 03:20:19,920
the storage unit restriction. So, people

5325
03:20:19,920 --> 03:20:21,760
use their property. I think there's a

5326
03:20:21,760 --> 03:20:23,600
couple of different platforms. One's

5327
03:20:23,600 --> 03:20:26,319
called Neighborly and you can store

5328
03:20:26,319 --> 03:20:28,720
boats or other things. So, are we now

5329
03:20:28,720 --> 03:20:30,640
inhibiting other people's personal

5330
03:20:30,640 --> 03:20:32,560
property rights by restricting storage

5331
03:20:32,560 --> 03:20:35,760
units if we create, you know, that zone

5332
03:20:35,760 --> 03:20:37,600
that nobody else can have storage units?

5333
03:20:37,600 --> 03:20:41,520
That's just one thought I had. And then,

5334
03:20:41,520 --> 03:20:44,640
um, this is just a comment. I sat with

5335
03:20:44,640 --> 03:20:46,880
the same people that you sat with and

5336
03:20:46,880 --> 03:20:48,640
they did come up with economically

5337
03:20:48,640 --> 03:20:53,840
viable options for that um property and

5338
03:20:53,840 --> 03:20:55,040
so

5339
03:20:55,040 --> 03:20:56,880
>> that also were non-conforming to our

5340
03:20:56,880 --> 03:20:57,760
uses

5341
03:20:57,760 --> 03:21:00,640
>> and that's why we have the small area

5342
03:21:00,640 --> 03:21:04,080
plan and that's why we met for months

5343
03:21:04,080 --> 03:21:06,399
with the public and asked them what you

5344
03:21:06,399 --> 03:21:09,359
would like to see and of all the hours

5345
03:21:09,359 --> 03:21:12,720
we spent meeting with the public and

5346
03:21:12,720 --> 03:21:14,640
getting their input ood and putting

5347
03:21:14,640 --> 03:21:17,279
post-it notes. Not one of them asked for

5348
03:21:17,279 --> 03:21:20,640
storage units. That that 700 storage

5349
03:21:20,640 --> 03:21:24,399
units, 50 really they're accessory

5350
03:21:24,399 --> 03:21:29,279
units. 50 accessory units in the heart

5351
03:21:29,279 --> 03:21:31,760
of our gateway historic. So that's just

5352
03:21:31,760 --> 03:21:33,760
I also sat in those meetings.

5353
03:21:33,760 --> 03:21:35,359
>> I I I I hear you.

5354
03:21:35,359 --> 03:21:37,279
>> Okay. And did did I hear you correctly

5355
03:21:37,279 --> 03:21:38,720
that you wanted to forgo your comment

5356
03:21:38,720 --> 03:21:39,840
and give it to

5357
03:21:39,840 --> 03:21:42,560
>> you? I want to say something. I said I'd

5358
03:21:42,560 --> 03:21:44,800
give her some of my time.

5359
03:21:44,800 --> 03:21:46,000
I have [clears throat] loved what you

5360
03:21:46,000 --> 03:21:47,520
have all said and to learn your

5361
03:21:47,520 --> 03:21:50,319
perspectives. Um, this is awesome and I

5362
03:21:50,319 --> 03:21:53,439
know they're different. Um, Brent and I

5363
03:21:53,439 --> 03:21:54,880
overlap because this this is discussion

5364
03:21:54,880 --> 03:21:56,720
about his motion. Right.

5365
03:21:56,720 --> 03:21:59,600
>> Brent and I align on a lot of things,

5366
03:21:59,600 --> 03:22:02,399
but this is where we are different. But

5367
03:22:02,399 --> 03:22:05,279
I super appreciate his perspective and I

5368
03:22:05,279 --> 03:22:06,640
hope I can add something to it. Do you

5369
03:22:06,640 --> 03:22:10,000
mind pulling up Heidi the the this is

5370
03:22:10,000 --> 03:22:11,760
from the Utah League of Cities and Towns

5371
03:22:11,760 --> 03:22:14,000
and this shaped my view of property

5372
03:22:14,000 --> 03:22:16,800
rights and it's also why we even have a

5373
03:22:16,800 --> 03:22:18,640
city council.

5374
03:22:18,640 --> 03:22:21,120
>> Sorry. If you go to the uh oh it's just

5375
03:22:21,120 --> 03:22:23,279
property rights right there. If you

5376
03:22:23,279 --> 03:22:25,920
double that. So there's literally no

5377
03:22:25,920 --> 03:22:28,720
purpose for us to exist as a council if

5378
03:22:28,720 --> 03:22:30,800
we just go on property rights. If we

5379
03:22:30,800 --> 03:22:33,120
just go onto a law

5380
03:22:33,120 --> 03:22:35,760
>> why are we even here? like if everyone

5381
03:22:35,760 --> 03:22:37,439
can just buy property and do whatever

5382
03:22:37,439 --> 03:22:39,760
they want with it like and that's

5383
03:22:39,760 --> 03:22:41,120
usually a conservative Republican

5384
03:22:41,120 --> 03:22:43,920
platform where I land politically but

5385
03:22:43,920 --> 03:22:45,920
conservatives also try to conserve land

5386
03:22:45,920 --> 03:22:49,760
conserve identity conserve the nature of

5387
03:22:49,760 --> 03:22:52,319
an community. Okay.

5388
03:22:52,319 --> 03:22:53,920
>> So we're hitting something different

5389
03:22:53,920 --> 03:22:56,560
here. Property rights is yes the owner

5390
03:22:56,560 --> 03:22:58,479
rights to use the land but I have a

5391
03:22:58,479 --> 03:23:00,720
home. I can't divide it the two acres

5392
03:23:00,720 --> 03:23:02,960
and the other one I I can't put a

5393
03:23:02,960 --> 03:23:05,200
pornography store on it. I can't put a

5394
03:23:05,200 --> 03:23:08,479
uh I can't put six horses on it. Why

5395
03:23:08,479 --> 03:23:09,760
can't I do that? I have I own the

5396
03:23:09,760 --> 03:23:10,000
property.

5397
03:23:10,000 --> 03:23:11,439
>> Did I just hear you that you want to

5398
03:23:11,439 --> 03:23:13,439
have a pornography store on your lot? Is

5399
03:23:13,439 --> 03:23:14,800
that

5400
03:23:14,800 --> 03:23:16,640
>> I would never do that. In fact, I work

5401
03:23:16,640 --> 03:23:17,840
day and night to try to help those

5402
03:23:17,840 --> 03:23:18,000
folks.

5403
03:23:18,000 --> 03:23:19,760
>> That's what I heard.

5404
03:23:19,760 --> 03:23:22,160
>> And so what what are we doing about

5405
03:23:22,160 --> 03:23:24,800
property rights? Because we have them.

5406
03:23:24,800 --> 03:23:27,760
Why can't I put a motorcycle park on my

5407
03:23:27,760 --> 03:23:30,880
land? And this this solves it for me.

5408
03:23:30,880 --> 03:23:32,239
And this came from the Utah League of

5409
03:23:32,239 --> 03:23:34,319
Cities and Towns is the whole that we're

5410
03:23:34,319 --> 03:23:36,880
here. We're here to balance the property

5411
03:23:36,880 --> 03:23:39,040
owners rights with the health and

5412
03:23:39,040 --> 03:23:40,800
wellbeing of the community, their peace,

5413
03:23:40,800 --> 03:23:42,239
safety, and happiness, the public

5414
03:23:42,239 --> 03:23:44,000
interest. That's what we're supposed to

5415
03:23:44,000 --> 03:23:45,760
balance. And often it's a legislative

5416
03:23:45,760 --> 03:23:47,680
choice. Often it is something that

5417
03:23:47,680 --> 03:23:50,479
requires

5418
03:23:50,479 --> 03:23:53,200
more art than science, more it doesn't

5419
03:23:53,200 --> 03:23:56,479
just require uh brickandmortar words on

5420
03:23:56,479 --> 03:23:58,080
a paper-like ordinance. And that's why

5421
03:23:58,080 --> 03:23:59,920
they voted for us to do it. We're trying

5422
03:23:59,920 --> 03:24:01,760
to represent the people. When we make a

5423
03:24:01,760 --> 03:24:03,359
decision up here, we're not making a

5424
03:24:03,359 --> 03:24:05,439
decision of what Andrew thinks or what

5425
03:24:05,439 --> 03:24:07,520
we think. We're making the decision of

5426
03:24:07,520 --> 03:24:09,680
what the people think that they we

5427
03:24:09,680 --> 03:24:12,399
represent them in this situation. We've

5428
03:24:12,399 --> 03:24:15,920
heard loud and clear um what they uh

5429
03:24:15,920 --> 03:24:18,640
what they feel about this. So, anyways,

5430
03:24:18,640 --> 03:24:19,760
we're supposed to represent the

5431
03:24:19,760 --> 03:24:21,920
community and the only reason we don't

5432
03:24:21,920 --> 03:24:24,080
just go off the law of property rights

5433
03:24:24,080 --> 03:24:26,239
is we're supposed to decide what the

5434
03:24:26,239 --> 03:24:28,080
look and feel of the city is. When you

5435
03:24:28,080 --> 03:24:30,239
go to Venice, they created it the way

5436
03:24:30,239 --> 03:24:31,920
they did. When you go to Park City, they

5437
03:24:31,920 --> 03:24:33,680
created it the way we did. When we do it

5438
03:24:33,680 --> 03:24:36,080
in Alpine, we're a little bit chaotic.

5439
03:24:36,080 --> 03:24:39,359
We have aired on the side of free reign.

5440
03:24:39,359 --> 03:24:41,760
And we can see that in the bizarre

5441
03:24:41,760 --> 03:24:45,200
one-offs and then the bizarre um

5442
03:24:45,200 --> 03:24:46,720
inongruencies.

5443
03:24:46,720 --> 03:24:49,359
And uh I think we have let it go too far

5444
03:24:49,359 --> 03:24:51,120
where now we have people's negative

5445
03:24:51,120 --> 03:24:52,640
impact growing too large. And we're

5446
03:24:52,640 --> 03:24:54,000
hearing we heard it today. We're hearing

5447
03:24:54,000 --> 03:24:56,000
it every single day. Um I heard it all

5448
03:24:56,000 --> 03:24:59,439
through the campaign. Um, and so is this

5449
03:24:59,439 --> 03:25:01,120
even a property rights issue that we're

5450
03:25:01,120 --> 03:25:02,160
talking about? Because that's where I

5451
03:25:02,160 --> 03:25:03,520
believe Brent is coming from. Am I

5452
03:25:03,520 --> 03:25:05,279
wrong? I I believe that's where you're

5453
03:25:05,279 --> 03:25:07,279
coming from.

5454
03:25:07,279 --> 03:25:08,560
Do you want me to address that now or

5455
03:25:08,560 --> 03:25:09,520
later? Uh, maybe

5456
03:25:09,520 --> 03:25:11,120
>> you know what? Let's wait. You still

5457
03:25:11,120 --> 03:25:12,720
have your comments. So,

5458
03:25:12,720 --> 03:25:14,080
>> I believe this is a property issue.

5459
03:25:14,080 --> 03:25:15,680
>> I'd like to hear your comments and then

5460
03:25:15,680 --> 03:25:16,399
let's move on.

5461
03:25:16,399 --> 03:25:18,319
>> Okay. I believe this is you're coming

5462
03:25:18,319 --> 03:25:20,479
from this as a property rights issue.

5463
03:25:20,479 --> 03:25:22,479
Where I see this completely leaving the

5464
03:25:22,479 --> 03:25:24,239
realm of property rights completely

5465
03:25:24,239 --> 03:25:26,399
after everything I just said is this has

5466
03:25:26,399 --> 03:25:28,720
nothing to do even though I know it's a

5467
03:25:28,720 --> 03:25:30,160
need and a want they have this has

5468
03:25:30,160 --> 03:25:33,120
nothing to do with their storage units.

5469
03:25:33,120 --> 03:25:34,960
We this has everything to do with the

5470
03:25:34,960 --> 03:25:37,439
entire business commercial zone. So we

5471
03:25:37,439 --> 03:25:41,359
are now deciding the property rights of

5472
03:25:41,359 --> 03:25:43,920
every single business every single home

5473
03:25:43,920 --> 03:25:47,279
every single lot in the entire business

5474
03:25:47,279 --> 03:25:48,560
commercial zone. And that's why I think

5475
03:25:48,560 --> 03:25:51,120
this fails completely. It fails because

5476
03:25:51,120 --> 03:25:54,319
we are deciding a blanket decision on a

5477
03:25:54,319 --> 03:25:57,120
zoning decision, not for I wish this was

5478
03:25:57,120 --> 03:25:59,200
a one-off. This would be so much easier

5479
03:25:59,200 --> 03:26:01,120
as a one-off. I wish they would be

5480
03:26:01,120 --> 03:26:03,439
flexible and work with the residents and

5481
03:26:03,439 --> 03:26:05,040
find a happy medium. I drove by it

5482
03:26:05,040 --> 03:26:07,200
today. I cannot imagine that big wall

5483
03:26:07,200 --> 03:26:09,359
living by that. I wish they would work

5484
03:26:09,359 --> 03:26:10,800
with the res. I have received no

5485
03:26:10,800 --> 03:26:13,120
flexibility from anyone. And I love the

5486
03:26:13,120 --> 03:26:14,720
owner and his family. I respect them. I

5487
03:26:14,720 --> 03:26:16,880
love I want to work with these guys. I

5488
03:26:16,880 --> 03:26:19,359
want I want them to do it. There are

5489
03:26:19,359 --> 03:26:20,960
hundreds of way that you can make this

5490
03:26:20,960 --> 03:26:23,680
pencil. Maybe thousands, maybe infinite

5491
03:26:23,680 --> 03:26:25,840
ways you can make this pencil. And we

5492
03:26:25,840 --> 03:26:28,560
have 20 approved ways in the current

5493
03:26:28,560 --> 03:26:30,880
code that you can make this pencil and

5494
03:26:30,880 --> 03:26:32,560
that are already approved. About 10 of

5495
03:26:32,560 --> 03:26:35,200
them are conditional use permits and the

5496
03:26:35,200 --> 03:26:36,800
other ones are blanket permission. I

5497
03:26:36,800 --> 03:26:37,920
could be wrong on that, but it's about

5498
03:26:37,920 --> 03:26:40,160
seven and 10 conditional permit. They

5499
03:26:40,160 --> 03:26:43,120
have multiple multiple options from

5500
03:26:43,120 --> 03:26:45,040
funeral care centers to residential

5501
03:26:45,040 --> 03:26:48,319
houses to um animal things to uh old

5502
03:26:48,319 --> 03:26:51,359
home places to uh um professional

5503
03:26:51,359 --> 03:26:52,960
commercial usage like we have in the

5504
03:26:52,960 --> 03:26:57,520
rest of Alpine. There are dozens and dozens of options about 20

5505
03:26:57,520 --> 03:27:00,000
that are already approved and then we

5506
03:27:00,000 --> 03:27:02,880
are veering out of that in just a way

5507
03:27:02,880 --> 03:27:04,560
that we are setting ourselves up for a

5508
03:27:04,560 --> 03:27:10,720
code that within one mile and 729 and I mean this code is

5509
03:27:10,720 --> 03:27:12,800
so destructive. The minimum lot shall be

5510
03:27:12,800 --> 03:27:14,720
three acres maximum lot area of five

5511
03:27:14,720 --> 03:27:16,800
acres. I mean so that's anywhere within

5512
03:27:16,800 --> 03:27:17,920
three acres. You might as well just say

5513
03:27:17,920 --> 03:27:20,640
that an indoor uh luxury condo garage

5514
03:27:20,640 --> 03:27:22,880
shall not be located within one mile.

5515
03:27:22,880 --> 03:27:25,600
And then it says unless a reduced

5516
03:27:25,600 --> 03:27:28,000
separation distance is recommended. So

5517
03:27:28,000 --> 03:27:30,000
it doesn't even hold up your your circle

5518
03:27:30,000 --> 03:27:32,319
thing. We could just say we we recommend

5519
03:27:32,319 --> 03:27:34,800
a quarter or quarter mile. So it opens

5520
03:27:34,800 --> 03:27:36,880
it up for this is not a decision. The

5521
03:27:36,880 --> 03:27:38,080
more and more I look at this, the more

5522
03:27:38,080 --> 03:27:39,840
and more I read this, this is not a

5523
03:27:39,840 --> 03:27:42,239
decision on this storage unit. It's a

5524
03:27:42,239 --> 03:27:43,760
decision on the zoning of the business

5525
03:27:43,760 --> 03:27:46,720
commercial. And it it does it doesn't

5526
03:27:46,720 --> 03:27:49,840
work. Um the the the the writing of the

5527
03:27:49,840 --> 03:27:53,439
code to change our zone is not uh up to

5528
03:27:53,439 --> 03:27:56,399
snuff. It is uh I see it creating

5529
03:27:56,399 --> 03:27:59,279
massive problems in our future. And I

5530
03:27:59,279 --> 03:28:00,800
would love nothing more than to work

5531
03:28:00,800 --> 03:28:02,720
with them in the future and their

5532
03:28:02,720 --> 03:28:04,560
residents who live near them and the

5533
03:28:04,560 --> 03:28:06,640
current code we have and find an overlap

5534
03:28:06,640 --> 03:28:08,319
that would harmonize. So that's why it

5535
03:28:08,319 --> 03:28:10,399
would be against your motion with

5536
03:28:10,399 --> 03:28:12,479
respect to how you've uh gotten to your

5537
03:28:12,479 --> 03:28:15,760
site as well.

5538
03:28:15,760 --> 03:28:16,160
>> Grant.

5539
03:28:16,160 --> 03:28:18,800
>> Yeah. just just to just to clarify the

5540
03:28:18,800 --> 03:28:21,279
um constitutional right is the high

5541
03:28:21,279 --> 03:28:24,399
level aspect of land use. I completely

5542
03:28:24,399 --> 03:28:27,040
agree with you that the one of the major

5543
03:28:27,040 --> 03:28:31,200
roles of the legislative branch is to

5544
03:28:31,200 --> 03:28:34,239
utilize land use to make a harmonious

5545
03:28:34,239 --> 03:28:36,800
community and to protect rights. And

5546
03:28:36,800 --> 03:28:39,840
that's why I vigorously defended the

5547
03:28:39,840 --> 03:28:42,239
residential zoning for the orchard and

5548
03:28:42,239 --> 03:28:44,319
the parking lot because it was in

5549
03:28:44,319 --> 03:28:46,880
congruent with the established zoning,

5550
03:28:46,880 --> 03:28:49,279
the established legislation in our

5551
03:28:49,279 --> 03:28:50,960
community.

5552
03:28:50,960 --> 03:28:52,560
Some of these irregular lots were

5553
03:28:52,560 --> 03:28:55,040
probably done before we even had a reg a

5554
03:28:55,040 --> 03:28:56,880
normal city council, before we had land

5555
03:28:56,880 --> 03:28:59,279
use, before we had established

5556
03:28:59,279 --> 03:29:01,200
ordinances that regulated land use.

5557
03:29:01,200 --> 03:29:02,319
That's why I think there's a little bit

5558
03:29:02,319 --> 03:29:04,640
of a difference between a little a

5559
03:29:04,640 --> 03:29:06,080
regular lot that's a little bit smaller

5560
03:29:06,080 --> 03:29:08,000
than the surrounding lots that normally

5561
03:29:08,000 --> 03:29:09,439
could have a house but now it can't

5562
03:29:09,439 --> 03:29:13,120
because of a illegal non-conforming use.

5563
03:29:13,120 --> 03:29:15,600
So I've said this before in prior with

5564
03:29:15,600 --> 03:29:16,800
prior city council and I've said it

5565
03:29:16,800 --> 03:29:20,560
before with you present is that we have

5566
03:29:20,560 --> 03:29:22,560
that constitutional right. That's that

5567
03:29:22,560 --> 03:29:25,120
basic right to use to own and use

5568
03:29:25,120 --> 03:29:27,120
property the way you want to and to

5569
03:29:27,120 --> 03:29:29,120
exclude other people from infringing on

5570
03:29:29,120 --> 03:29:31,279
that right.

5571
03:29:31,279 --> 03:29:33,920
120 years ago, New York decided to do

5572
03:29:33,920 --> 03:29:37,040
something called zoning. And the

5573
03:29:37,040 --> 03:29:39,200
legislative branch, like us, made made

5574
03:29:39,200 --> 03:29:41,600
the decision that we're going to

5575
03:29:41,600 --> 03:29:44,560
separate industrial use from residential

5576
03:29:44,560 --> 03:29:45,760
use because we think that's for the

5577
03:29:45,760 --> 03:29:48,000
public good. The judicial branch, as

5578
03:29:48,000 --> 03:29:50,080
everyone knows, is the arbiter of the

5579
03:29:50,080 --> 03:29:52,239
executive branch and the and the

5580
03:29:52,239 --> 03:29:54,479
legislative branch. and the legis and

5581
03:29:54,479 --> 03:29:55,920
the judicial branch has come out and

5582
03:29:55,920 --> 03:29:59,040
said, "Yes, sometimes the city council

5583
03:29:59,040 --> 03:30:01,120
goes too far and we're going to void

5584
03:30:01,120 --> 03:30:02,880
that law." And in other times I say,

5585
03:30:02,880 --> 03:30:04,960
"Yeah, that is for the public good and

5586
03:30:04,960 --> 03:30:07,120
we'll allow that law to stand." So

5587
03:30:07,120 --> 03:30:09,520
that's where we are with our ordinance

5588
03:30:09,520 --> 03:30:11,920
and it's always a work in progress. Our

5589
03:30:11,920 --> 03:30:14,319
ordinances are not perfect. Our land use

5590
03:30:14,319 --> 03:30:16,960
ordinances are not perfect.

5591
03:30:16,960 --> 03:30:20,000
the conditional use lists for our

5592
03:30:20,000 --> 03:30:21,840
business zone, our business use zone

5593
03:30:21,840 --> 03:30:25,520
uses are not complete because we just

5594
03:30:25,520 --> 03:30:27,279
the people who originally enacted those

5595
03:30:27,279 --> 03:30:29,279
ordinances, they couldn't anticipate all

5596
03:30:29,279 --> 03:30:31,200
the potential future uses. So, this is

5597
03:30:31,200 --> 03:30:34,000
what they started with. My understanding

5598
03:30:34,000 --> 03:30:36,720
is we have that list and it has been

5599
03:30:36,720 --> 03:30:40,560
expanded in the past to allow

5600
03:30:40,560 --> 03:30:43,840
um it's the vehicle maintenance

5601
03:30:43,840 --> 03:30:47,520
>> mechanical automotive shops. So I'm not

5602
03:30:47,520 --> 03:30:49,359
saying that I want to approve this just

5603
03:30:49,359 --> 03:30:50,960
because the land use owner wants to do

5604
03:30:50,960 --> 03:30:53,279
it. That's couldn't be further from the

5605
03:30:53,279 --> 03:30:55,920
truth. But that is the overarching

5606
03:30:55,920 --> 03:30:58,640
standard with understanding the rights

5607
03:30:58,640 --> 03:31:01,439
of the legislative branch are limited by

5608
03:31:01,439 --> 03:31:03,200
the constitutionality of their of their

5609
03:31:03,200 --> 03:31:05,920
actions of their statutes.

5610
03:31:05,920 --> 03:31:08,239
So what I so I hope that's clear enough

5611
03:31:08,239 --> 03:31:10,800
that that's where I'm coming from. I I

5612
03:31:10,800 --> 03:31:12,319
don't think we should do it just because

5613
03:31:12,319 --> 03:31:14,800
they want to. That's couldn't be further

5614
03:31:14,800 --> 03:31:17,120
from the truth.

5615
03:31:17,120 --> 03:31:19,040
So this property is owned business

5616
03:31:19,040 --> 03:31:20,560
commercial and it's intended for

5617
03:31:20,560 --> 03:31:23,120
business and commercial use. Several

5618
03:31:23,120 --> 03:31:25,279
years ago, I don't know how long ago, a

5619
03:31:25,279 --> 03:31:27,200
prior legislative

5620
03:31:27,200 --> 03:31:28,960
branch of Alpine government allowed

5621
03:31:28,960 --> 03:31:32,399
manufacturing on this property.

5622
03:31:32,399 --> 03:31:34,239
Um,

5623
03:31:34,239 --> 03:31:36,239
thus the large building was erected and

5624
03:31:36,239 --> 03:31:38,160
used for manufacturing for many, many

5625
03:31:38,160 --> 03:31:40,479
years. Manufacturing, as you know, is

5626
03:31:40,479 --> 03:31:43,520
now a prohibited use in Alpine Code. But

5627
03:31:43,520 --> 03:31:46,000
the manufacturing use on this lot was

5628
03:31:46,000 --> 03:31:47,200
able to continue as a legal

5629
03:31:47,200 --> 03:31:48,479
non-conforming use. I think we've had

5630
03:31:48,479 --> 03:31:50,080
enough discussion about legal

5631
03:31:50,080 --> 03:31:54,469
non-conforming uses today.

5632
03:31:54,479 --> 03:31:56,239
So I'll just note that mandating that

5633
03:31:56,239 --> 03:31:58,720
illegal non-conforming use can continue

5634
03:31:58,720 --> 03:32:01,439
despite land use regulation changes is

5635
03:32:01,439 --> 03:32:03,840
just one example of a limitation on land

5636
03:32:03,840 --> 03:32:06,080
use restrictions governments can impose.

5637
03:32:06,080 --> 03:32:08,880
So legis the judicial branch has said

5638
03:32:08,880 --> 03:32:10,960
you can't force someone to change their

5639
03:32:10,960 --> 03:32:12,319
property use just because you want to

5640
03:32:12,319 --> 03:32:14,319
change the zoning for that property. You

5641
03:32:14,319 --> 03:32:16,560
have to allow legal non-conforming uses

5642
03:32:16,560 --> 03:32:17,920
as long as they continually maintain

5643
03:32:17,920 --> 03:32:20,560
that use. So this is one example of a

5644
03:32:20,560 --> 03:32:23,200
legislative branch saying you can't you

5645
03:32:23,200 --> 03:32:26,479
can't do that governments. The current

5646
03:32:26,479 --> 03:32:29,279
owner lost the legal non-conforming use

5647
03:32:29,279 --> 03:32:32,000
after purple left and sufficient time

5648
03:32:32,000 --> 03:32:34,479
passed so that the legal non-conforming

5649
03:32:34,479 --> 03:32:36,640
use was no longer legal. So that's good

5650
03:32:36,640 --> 03:32:37,840
for us. That's good for residents

5651
03:32:37,840 --> 03:32:39,840
because I know the residents didn't like

5652
03:32:39,840 --> 03:32:41,920
having purple there. It smelled. It was

5653
03:32:41,920 --> 03:32:44,319
noisy. Lots of employees. Lots of people

5654
03:32:44,319 --> 03:32:45,840
parking on the street. People parking in

5655
03:32:45,840 --> 03:32:47,600
my church parking lot. I didn't like

5656
03:32:47,600 --> 03:32:50,720
having purple there. So,

5657
03:32:50,720 --> 03:32:52,960
what for whatever reason, the owner let

5658
03:32:52,960 --> 03:32:54,960
that lapse. That's good for Alpine in my

5659
03:32:54,960 --> 03:32:56,560
opinion because we can't have

5660
03:32:56,560 --> 03:32:58,479
manufacturing there. And I will note

5661
03:32:58,479 --> 03:33:01,279
that last year the owner came and asked

5662
03:33:01,279 --> 03:33:04,000
the legislature asked us to approve

5663
03:33:04,000 --> 03:33:05,760
manufacturing in the business commercial

5664
03:33:05,760 --> 03:33:08,239
zone and we voted it down five to zero

5665
03:33:08,239 --> 03:33:10,000
because we didn't want traffic, noise,

5666
03:33:10,000 --> 03:33:12,160
large trucks coming into Alpine. all the

5667
03:33:12,160 --> 03:33:14,640
things that the reasons we don't want

5668
03:33:14,640 --> 03:33:16,160
manufacturing, why we don't want

5669
03:33:16,160 --> 03:33:17,600
industrial uses in our business

5670
03:33:17,600 --> 03:33:20,720
commercial zone. And I'll clarify the

5671
03:33:20,720 --> 03:33:24,640
industrial use here in a second.

5672
03:33:24,640 --> 03:33:27,520
Um,

5673
03:33:27,520 --> 03:33:30,399
okay, I said that one.

5674
03:33:30,399 --> 03:33:32,800
As Chrissy said, there are very limited

5675
03:33:32,800 --> 03:33:34,479
uses for this property in a perfectly

5676
03:33:34,479 --> 03:33:36,720
good 40,000 square foot building used

5677
03:33:36,720 --> 03:33:38,800
historically for manufacturing. Now, if

5678
03:33:38,800 --> 03:33:41,120
that building wasn't there, there would

5679
03:33:41,120 --> 03:33:42,800
be a different situation with the

5680
03:33:42,800 --> 03:33:44,800
penciling in of of potential uses for

5681
03:33:44,800 --> 03:33:47,760
that property. Um, yeah, they could tear

5682
03:33:47,760 --> 03:33:49,920
it down, but that seems very wasteful to

5683
03:33:49,920 --> 03:33:51,600
tear down a perfectly good large

5684
03:33:51,600 --> 03:33:54,560
building that can have some viable um

5685
03:33:54,560 --> 03:33:56,399
other uses.

5686
03:33:56,399 --> 03:33:58,239
It's quite clear that Alpine residents

5687
03:33:58,239 --> 03:34:01,760
do not want a return of manufacturing

5688
03:34:01,760 --> 03:34:03,359
and the same reason for the same reasons

5689
03:34:03,359 --> 03:34:04,800
residents don't want manufacturing to

5690
03:34:04,800 --> 03:34:06,880
apply to typical industrial uses. And I

5691
03:34:06,880 --> 03:34:09,359
mentioned those increased traffic, large

5692
03:34:09,359 --> 03:34:11,279
vehicles, employee parking, noises, and

5693
03:34:11,279 --> 03:34:13,279
odors. Those are typically associated

5694
03:34:13,279 --> 03:34:15,600
with with what you traditionally called

5695
03:34:15,600 --> 03:34:17,680
industrial uses, things like the storage

5696
03:34:17,680 --> 03:34:20,640
units you see next to the freeway. Maybe

5697
03:34:20,640 --> 03:34:23,200
um it's also not uncommon to expand

5698
03:34:23,200 --> 03:34:24,720
conditional uses in a business

5699
03:34:24,720 --> 03:34:26,880
commercial zone. As a city attorney

5700
03:34:26,880 --> 03:34:29,520
stated in our last meeting,

5701
03:34:29,520 --> 03:34:31,279
decisions had to be made initially on

5702
03:34:31,279 --> 03:34:32,880
what to allow in the business commercial

5703
03:34:32,880 --> 03:34:34,000
zone. I already said this, but I'll

5704
03:34:34,000 --> 03:34:35,840
state it again. based on what that was

5705
03:34:35,840 --> 03:34:37,760
envisioned at the time. Even as you

5706
03:34:37,760 --> 03:34:39,200
mentioned, even adult businesses are

5707
03:34:39,200 --> 03:34:41,200
allowed in certain circumstances as

5708
03:34:41,200 --> 03:34:43,680
required by the US Constitution. And

5709
03:34:43,680 --> 03:34:46,000
then I mentioned that mechanical

5710
03:34:46,000 --> 03:34:47,760
automotive shops were added by a prior

5711
03:34:47,760 --> 03:34:50,640
city council um at some point to bring

5712
03:34:50,640 --> 03:34:52,479
the option for Alpine residents to have

5713
03:34:52,479 --> 03:34:53,920
their vehicles serviced locally in

5714
03:34:53,920 --> 03:34:57,840
Alpine. And I think

5715
03:34:57,840 --> 03:34:59,840
part of the presentation by Stack was

5716
03:34:59,840 --> 03:35:03,200
they think that that this is a viable um

5717
03:35:03,200 --> 03:35:04,560
business for them because they think

5718
03:35:04,560 --> 03:35:06,880
it'll benefit Alpine residents. I've

5719
03:35:06,880 --> 03:35:08,399
heard from several Alpine residents, not

5720
03:35:08,399 --> 03:35:10,319
just people that have emailed all the

5721
03:35:10,319 --> 03:35:11,920
council members, but several other

5722
03:35:11,920 --> 03:35:14,000
Alpine residents who like the idea of

5723
03:35:14,000 --> 03:35:16,399
having indoor controlled storage close

5724
03:35:16,399 --> 03:35:18,640
by and several who are already talking

5725
03:35:18,640 --> 03:35:20,960
about partnering up to buy one of these

5726
03:35:20,960 --> 03:35:23,760
luxury condo units. So, I think it does

5727
03:35:23,760 --> 03:35:26,579
serve the public good in that way. Um,

5728
03:35:26,579 --> 03:35:27,439
[clears throat]

5729
03:35:27,439 --> 03:35:30,160
I know there's different positions on on

5730
03:35:30,160 --> 03:35:33,200
the the planning commission, but they do

5731
03:35:33,200 --> 03:35:35,840
have a lot of experience in and training

5732
03:35:35,840 --> 03:35:37,600
in land use law and understanding the

5733
03:35:37,600 --> 03:35:41,120
city's master plan. And I I sometimes we

5734
03:35:41,120 --> 03:35:42,800
make mistakes and we talk about things

5735
03:35:42,800 --> 03:35:44,720
that we shouldn't and say, "Hey, I might

5736
03:35:44,720 --> 03:35:45,760
even be interested in one of those

5737
03:35:45,760 --> 03:35:47,439
units." I'm not because I can't afford

5738
03:35:47,439 --> 03:35:50,319
it. But so yes, one of the council one

5739
03:35:50,319 --> 03:35:51,760
of the planning commission members said

5740
03:35:51,760 --> 03:35:55,920
that um and that was unfortunate but I

5741
03:35:55,920 --> 03:35:57,760
mean it was I think it was said in

5742
03:35:57,760 --> 03:36:00,634
jester. I I forgive him for that.

5743
03:36:00,634 --> 03:36:02,000
[clears throat]

5744
03:36:02,000 --> 03:36:03,680
And you know they voted unanimously to

5745
03:36:03,680 --> 03:36:05,120
recommend approval. I'll just list some

5746
03:36:05,120 --> 03:36:07,760
of the some of the um things that they

5747
03:36:07,760 --> 03:36:10,479
stated. One is traffic and park parking

5748
03:36:10,479 --> 03:36:13,120
would be very low impact. And they did

5749
03:36:13,120 --> 03:36:15,200
talk about studies for storage units and

5750
03:36:15,200 --> 03:36:18,160
how limited the impact would be on

5751
03:36:18,160 --> 03:36:21,600
traffic and parking. And when you think

5752
03:36:21,600 --> 03:36:23,359
about all the other proposed uses that

5753
03:36:23,359 --> 03:36:25,760
are in our code, I mean, maybe dog

5754
03:36:25,760 --> 03:36:26,960
grooming would be less, but I don't know

5755
03:36:26,960 --> 03:36:28,319
how you're going to do dog grooming in a

5756
03:36:28,319 --> 03:36:31,359
40,000 square foot property. And what I

5757
03:36:31,359 --> 03:36:34,239
will mention too, I forgot to note from

5758
03:36:34,239 --> 03:36:38,800
uh Jessica's statement about it being

5759
03:36:38,800 --> 03:36:41,359
um

5760
03:36:41,359 --> 03:36:46,960
about it being not congruent with um the

5761
03:36:46,960 --> 03:36:49,040
other nearby properties, not in Pine and

5762
03:36:49,040 --> 03:36:50,800
the and the B and the dance studio or

5763
03:36:50,800 --> 03:36:52,560
whatever it is. This is a much larger

5764
03:36:52,560 --> 03:36:55,760
lot and it has that 43,000 foot foot

5765
03:36:55,760 --> 03:36:58,160
property already there. And yes, they

5766
03:36:58,160 --> 03:36:59,760
will be expanding by putting some

5767
03:36:59,760 --> 03:37:03,600
additional buildings. All right. Um they

5768
03:37:03,600 --> 03:37:06,319
also and several nearby residents, even

5769
03:37:06,319 --> 03:37:09,520
the ones closest by when they've learned

5770
03:37:09,520 --> 03:37:11,840
about the proposal as Stack has reached

5771
03:37:11,840 --> 03:37:14,160
out to them and and and explained what

5772
03:37:14,160 --> 03:37:17,040
they're doing and knowing what the

5773
03:37:17,040 --> 03:37:19,680
manufacturing use was in the past, they

5774
03:37:19,680 --> 03:37:22,319
do not want the traffic that the prior

5775
03:37:22,319 --> 03:37:24,080
proposals would have brought. and those

5776
03:37:24,080 --> 03:37:26,560
were high density mixeduse residential,

5777
03:37:26,560 --> 03:37:28,560
commercial, and manufacturing uses.

5778
03:37:28,560 --> 03:37:29,840
Those are the only ones that I know of

5779
03:37:29,840 --> 03:37:31,600
that have been officially proposed to

5780
03:37:31,600 --> 03:37:33,520
the city council.

5781
03:37:33,520 --> 03:37:35,120
Um, they also mentioned that the city

5782
03:37:35,120 --> 03:37:37,520
must approve the CCNRs that will further

5783
03:37:37,520 --> 03:37:39,920
control use of the property.

5784
03:37:39,920 --> 03:37:42,479
There's an anticipated community benefit

5785
03:37:42,479 --> 03:37:44,479
not being currently met, similar to what

5786
03:37:44,479 --> 03:37:47,279
the automotive repair place did whenever

5787
03:37:47,279 --> 03:37:49,840
that was approved. It's solving a

5788
03:37:49,840 --> 03:37:52,319
problem that is that this property of

5789
03:37:52,319 --> 03:37:54,560
this property being an eyesore. I'm like

5790
03:37:54,560 --> 03:37:58,239
Chrissy. I see that I because of my

5791
03:37:58,239 --> 03:37:59,760
church responsibilities. I see that

5792
03:37:59,760 --> 03:38:02,640
building probably three times a week and

5793
03:38:02,640 --> 03:38:06,630
it's very ugly.

5794
03:38:06,640 --> 03:38:08,239
Um the last thing they mentioned was a

5795
03:38:08,239 --> 03:38:10,319
developer must follow the Gateway

5796
03:38:10,319 --> 03:38:11,920
historic design guidelines. Their

5797
03:38:11,920 --> 03:38:13,680
architectural rendering I think looks

5798
03:38:13,680 --> 03:38:16,399
beautiful. Um but that's all to be

5799
03:38:16,399 --> 03:38:19,439
decided by us in the future when we talk

5800
03:38:19,439 --> 03:38:26,479
about um the development agreement and such. Uh the city can this is what

5801
03:38:26,479 --> 03:38:27,520
they said the city can impose

5802
03:38:27,520 --> 03:38:28,960
requirements to for an attractive

5803
03:38:28,960 --> 03:38:30,560
facade, landscaping, buffering,

5804
03:38:30,560 --> 03:38:32,000
screening for adjacent residential

5805
03:38:32,000 --> 03:38:34,720
neighbors, hours of operation, etc. And

5806
03:38:34,720 --> 03:38:36,319
the developer must comply with height

5807
03:38:36,319 --> 03:38:37,680
restrictions and setback requirements.

5808
03:38:37,680 --> 03:38:39,760
And Chris already noted that it's going

5809
03:38:39,760 --> 03:38:42,319
to be shorter. It's going to be lower

5810
03:38:42,319 --> 03:38:45,120
than Mountain Pine. It's going to be 13

5811
03:38:45,120 --> 03:38:47,200
in feet lower than what is required. At

5812
03:38:47,200 --> 03:38:49,840
least that's the proposal.

5813
03:38:49,840 --> 03:38:51,600
I'm almost done. Three more pages.

5814
03:38:51,600 --> 03:38:52,800
>> Any more? No,

5815
03:38:52,800 --> 03:38:53,680
>> no, it's not. That's not

5816
03:38:53,680 --> 03:38:54,560
>> No. Come on. Let's wrap it up.

5817
03:38:54,560 --> 03:38:55,760
>> All right. I'll be quick.

5818
03:38:55,760 --> 03:38:57,680
>> Um I mentioned this in my motion, but

5819
03:38:57,680 --> 03:39:00,080
our city attorney last meeting clarified

5820
03:39:00,080 --> 03:39:02,479
that um the city will require approval

5821
03:39:02,479 --> 03:39:04,080
of a site plan development agreement and

5822
03:39:04,080 --> 03:39:06,560
CCNRs to impose conditions to mitigate

5823
03:39:06,560 --> 03:39:08,720
reasonably anticipated detrimental

5824
03:39:08,720 --> 03:39:11,200
effects of the use. and that the city

5825
03:39:11,200 --> 03:39:14,319
can be a party to the CCR, CCNRs or an

5826
03:39:14,319 --> 03:39:15,600
expressly intended thirdparty

5827
03:39:15,600 --> 03:39:17,840
beneficiary to be able to enforce those

5828
03:39:17,840 --> 03:39:19,600
covenants, conditions, and restrictions

5829
03:39:19,600 --> 03:39:22,000
moving forward.

5830
03:39:22,000 --> 03:39:24,239
Um, the proposal results in a much lower

5831
03:39:24,239 --> 03:39:25,520
impact to the residents over many

5832
03:39:25,520 --> 03:39:26,880
options that are currently authorized in

5833
03:39:26,880 --> 03:39:29,359
the zone and proposals. As I mentioned,

5834
03:39:29,359 --> 03:39:32,399
some of those potential options include

5835
03:39:32,399 --> 03:39:33,680
planned commercial developments,

5836
03:39:33,680 --> 03:39:35,520
commercial condominium projects, nursing

5837
03:39:35,520 --> 03:39:38,880
homes, um restaurants, even mechanic

5838
03:39:38,880 --> 03:39:40,720
mechanical automotive shops. Most of

5839
03:39:40,720 --> 03:39:42,080
those things wouldn't fit on such a

5840
03:39:42,080 --> 03:39:44,960
large lot, and especially if you um

5841
03:39:44,960 --> 03:39:47,200
don't anticipate them needing to tear

5842
03:39:47,200 --> 03:39:50,560
down that large usable building.

5843
03:39:50,560 --> 03:39:52,160
I really like the developer has a

5844
03:39:52,160 --> 03:39:53,760
screening and buffering plan to protect

5845
03:39:53,760 --> 03:39:55,359
adjacent residential neighbors. They've

5846
03:39:55,359 --> 03:39:57,359
gone above and beyond what others have

5847
03:39:57,359 --> 03:40:00,880
done in in that in that effort. There's

5848
03:40:00,880 --> 03:40:02,160
going to be sufficient off- streetet

5849
03:40:02,160 --> 03:40:04,080
parking required. So there's no need for

5850
03:40:04,080 --> 03:40:07,040
off off on street parking

5851
03:40:07,040 --> 03:40:08,720
and

5852
03:40:08,720 --> 03:40:12,319
having the entrance to the self storage

5853
03:40:12,319 --> 03:40:13,920
on the east side with only one entrance.

5854
03:40:13,920 --> 03:40:15,439
There would I can't imagine any reason

5855
03:40:15,439 --> 03:40:17,520
why anyone would be parking on the

5856
03:40:17,520 --> 03:40:20,239
street for any significant use. They

5857
03:40:20,239 --> 03:40:21,279
they're going to use low impact

5858
03:40:21,279 --> 03:40:22,800
lighting.

5859
03:40:22,800 --> 03:40:24,479
Um there's no storage outside and no

5860
03:40:24,479 --> 03:40:27,680
garage doors will face outward.

5861
03:40:27,680 --> 03:40:30,080
Another thought that I had today and

5862
03:40:30,080 --> 03:40:31,840
it's it's come up in our discussion

5863
03:40:31,840 --> 03:40:35,200
today is the higher lot coverage ratio

5864
03:40:35,200 --> 03:40:38,880
or or what was termed um massing and

5865
03:40:38,880 --> 03:40:40,080
what was it? Bulan

5866
03:40:40,080 --> 03:40:43,439
>> Bulan Massing is that several residents

5867
03:40:43,439 --> 03:40:46,560
have commented that they've been

5868
03:40:46,560 --> 03:40:49,120
anticipating building uh accessory

5869
03:40:49,120 --> 03:40:50,640
structures on their property to store

5870
03:40:50,640 --> 03:40:54,880
their toys, their things. and how having

5871
03:40:54,880 --> 03:40:57,200
this option to be able to purchase these

5872
03:40:57,200 --> 03:41:01,760
luxury condos may limit the number of an

5873
03:41:01,760 --> 03:41:04,640
uh auxil accessory structures that that

5874
03:41:04,640 --> 03:41:08,000
are requested to build on property that

5875
03:41:08,000 --> 03:41:09,920
would create issues related to views and

5876
03:41:09,920 --> 03:41:14,160
that higher lot coverage ratio. Finally,

5877
03:41:14,160 --> 03:41:16,348
that's the word Cara was waiting for.

5878
03:41:16,348 --> 03:41:17,279
[laughter]

5879
03:41:17,279 --> 03:41:18,880
I really understand and appreciate the

5880
03:41:18,880 --> 03:41:20,720
concerns that some re residents have

5881
03:41:20,720 --> 03:41:22,080
expressed when reaching out to the city

5882
03:41:22,080 --> 03:41:23,680
council members about this proposal.

5883
03:41:23,680 --> 03:41:25,359
Most of those comments came as a result

5884
03:41:25,359 --> 03:41:27,520
of a Facebook post early on after the

5885
03:41:27,520 --> 03:41:29,439
planning commission met and the Facebook

5886
03:41:29,439 --> 03:41:31,359
post talked about storage sheds and we

5887
03:41:31,359 --> 03:41:33,279
do not want storage sheds in Alpine and

5888
03:41:33,279 --> 03:41:34,640
I agree. We don't want storage sheds in

5889
03:41:34,640 --> 03:41:37,840
Alpine. We don't want the traditional

5890
03:41:37,840 --> 03:41:40,560
flat building with orange doors and

5891
03:41:40,560 --> 03:41:43,200
barbed wire fence. I would absolutely

5892
03:41:43,200 --> 03:41:45,680
nix that no matter my constitutional

5893
03:41:45,680 --> 03:41:47,359
conservatism.

5894
03:41:47,359 --> 03:41:50,239
>> How would you have n that

5895
03:41:50,239 --> 03:41:52,239
>> because it doesn't meet the it doesn't

5896
03:41:52,239 --> 03:41:54,319
meet the guidelines of our historic

5897
03:41:54,319 --> 03:41:55,200
gateway.

5898
03:41:55,200 --> 03:41:56,800
>> I just destroyed your argument.

5899
03:41:56,800 --> 03:41:57,760
>> No, you didn't.

5900
03:41:57,760 --> 03:41:59,680
>> No, I'm ahead. All right.

5901
03:41:59,680 --> 03:42:02,239
>> Can you Okay.

5902
03:42:02,239 --> 03:42:04,080
>> Um, Chris, you already mentioned this,

5903
03:42:04,080 --> 03:42:05,359
too. A lot of people have expressed a

5904
03:42:05,359 --> 03:42:07,680
desire to have the city buy the buy the

5905
03:42:07,680 --> 03:42:09,120
lot and use it for various public

5906
03:42:09,120 --> 03:42:11,600
purposes. I responded to everyone who

5907
03:42:11,600 --> 03:42:13,040
wrote to me except for one person who

5908
03:42:13,040 --> 03:42:14,239
wrote to me late today. I just didn't

5909
03:42:14,239 --> 03:42:16,880
have time. Kind of explaining the land

5910
03:42:16,880 --> 03:42:22,239
use stuff that I just talked about and um

5911
03:42:22,239 --> 03:42:24,800
the limitation on on our budget that we

5912
03:42:24,800 --> 03:42:26,479
really just don't have the budget. We

5913
03:42:26,479 --> 03:42:29,040
would basically be sacrificing our

5914
03:42:29,040 --> 03:42:30,560
discretionary

5915
03:42:30,560 --> 03:42:32,239
budget

5916
03:42:32,239 --> 03:42:34,399
for years and years to come if we wanted

5917
03:42:34,399 --> 03:42:36,080
to buy this property and we could only

5918
03:42:36,080 --> 03:42:39,600
do afford it through bonding. Um, many

5919
03:42:39,600 --> 03:42:41,359
pe many of those people didn't reply to

5920
03:42:41,359 --> 03:42:42,560
me, but those who did basically said,

5921
03:42:42,560 --> 03:42:44,560
"Thank you." Some of them said, "Now

5922
03:42:44,560 --> 03:42:46,319
that I understand the different options,

5923
03:42:46,319 --> 03:42:48,880
even one that lives really close, said,

5924
03:42:48,880 --> 03:42:50,880
"I'd much rather have this than what

5925
03:42:50,880 --> 03:42:52,720
some of the other options are." And then

5926
03:42:52,720 --> 03:42:54,399
some people did express continue to

5927
03:42:54,399 --> 03:42:56,319
express opposition and even said they

5928
03:42:56,319 --> 03:42:57,680
would rather see it remain vacant than

5929
03:42:57,680 --> 03:43:02,160
to have um storage condos.

5930
03:43:02,160 --> 03:43:03,200
All right, that's it.

5931
03:43:03,200 --> 03:43:05,439
>> Okay, thank you. Okay, with all the

5932
03:43:05,439 --> 03:43:08,479
comments completed, I will let's proceed

5933
03:43:08,479 --> 03:43:12,469
with the roll call vote.

5934
03:43:12,479 --> 03:43:14,640
» Yeah, I thought no, Brent made a motion

5935
03:43:14,640 --> 03:43:17,199
and Chrissy seconded. Our discussion was

5936
03:43:17,199 --> 03:43:18,560
on the motion. So,

5937
03:43:18,560 --> 03:43:19,279
>> okay.

5938
03:43:19,279 --> 03:43:20,479
>> Councilwoman Smean.

5939
03:43:20,479 --> 03:43:23,359
>> Jessica Custom, no.

5940
03:43:23,359 --> 03:43:25,279
>> Sarah Blackwell, no.

5941
03:43:25,279 --> 03:43:26,640
>> Chrissy Hanaman, yes.

5942
03:43:26,640 --> 03:43:29,120
>> Andrew Young, no. Brent Rmler, yes.

5943
03:43:29,120 --> 03:43:32,160
>> Okay, motion fails.

5944
03:43:32,160 --> 03:43:34,800
Okay, I have a motion. I move to deny

5945
03:43:34,800 --> 03:43:36,560
the proposed code amendment to allow

5946
03:43:36,560 --> 03:43:39,199
indoor self- storage units and condo

5947
03:43:39,199 --> 03:43:40,800
luxury garages in the business

5948
03:43:40,800 --> 03:43:43,279
commercial zone, finding that the

5949
03:43:43,279 --> 03:43:45,840
amendment is not consistent with the

5950
03:43:45,840 --> 03:43:48,399
city's general plan policies,

5951
03:43:48,399 --> 03:43:50,560
development code, and gateway historic

5952
03:43:50,560 --> 03:43:52,319
guidelines.

5953
03:43:52,319 --> 03:43:54,640
>> Is there a second?

5954
03:43:54,640 --> 03:43:55,920
>> I'll second.

5955
03:43:55,920 --> 03:43:57,439
>> There's been a motion by Councilwoman

5956
03:43:57,439 --> 03:44:02,239
SMU, seconded by Councilman V. Any

5957
03:44:02,239 --> 03:44:04,880
discussion?

5958
03:44:04,880 --> 03:44:07,199
>> We discuss. Again,

5959
03:44:07,199 --> 03:44:09,279
>> it's a motion. So, yes, I will call for

5960
03:44:09,279 --> 03:44:10,560
discussion on the motion. If there

5961
03:44:10,560 --> 03:44:12,080
isn't, let's proceed with the roll.

5962
03:44:12,080 --> 03:44:13,920
>> My only discussion, which I fully

5963
03:44:13,920 --> 03:44:17,359
support the motion, is a plea to work

5964
03:44:17,359 --> 03:44:19,680
with the owner and stack to find a

5965
03:44:19,680 --> 03:44:23,600
balance between I think you are so close

5966
03:44:23,600 --> 03:44:26,160
to making this happen. It's not there.

5967
03:44:26,160 --> 03:44:28,640
To not give up, to try to be some flex

5968
03:44:28,640 --> 03:44:31,359
flexible. You heard Brent say what he

5969
03:44:31,359 --> 03:44:32,960
would and wouldn't do. He talked

5970
03:44:32,960 --> 03:44:35,040
constitutional, but then as soon as it

5971
03:44:35,040 --> 03:44:37,120
got ugly, he said, "No, I would deny

5972
03:44:37,120 --> 03:44:41,279
that." His line is just a different

5973
03:44:41,279 --> 03:44:44,000
50ard line than mine. You can make it

5974
03:44:44,000 --> 03:44:46,239
work with the residents. This can be

5975
03:44:46,239 --> 03:44:48,479
done. It can work. You can pencil it.

5976
03:44:48,479 --> 03:44:50,479
Let's do it. This is just not the right

5977
03:44:50,479 --> 03:44:52,080
way. That's my discussion, but I support

5978
03:44:52,080 --> 03:44:53,520
the motion.

5979
03:44:53,520 --> 03:44:55,359
>> Are you seconding it or would you

5980
03:44:55,359 --> 03:44:57,120
>> I seconded it. already said he already

5981
03:44:57,120 --> 03:44:57,600
did.

5982
03:44:57,600 --> 03:44:59,840
>> He's making a comment discussion item.

5983
03:44:59,840 --> 03:45:01,279
Let's just proceed with the roll call

5984
03:45:01,279 --> 03:45:01,600
vote.

5985
03:45:01,600 --> 03:45:03,359
>> Um Jessica, yes.

5986
03:45:03,359 --> 03:45:06,080
>> Sir Bachwell, yes. Chrissy Hanaman, no.

5987
03:45:06,080 --> 03:45:09,359
>> Andrew Young, yes. Brent Relmer, no.

5988
03:45:09,359 --> 03:45:11,680
>> Okay, let's move on to item C.

5989
03:45:11,680 --> 03:45:15,426
>> Can I Can I pro? Can I do what? Oh, deny

5990
03:45:15,426 --> 03:45:16,640
[clears throat] is an action. Okay,

5991
03:45:16,640 --> 03:45:28,389
never mind. It's not a failure. Okay.

5992
03:45:28,399 --> 03:45:32,640
Um, so two weeks ago,

5993
03:45:32,640 --> 03:45:34,319
sorry, I think it was three weeks ago if

5994
03:45:34,319 --> 03:45:36,080
we had a fifth Tuesday in there, right?

5995
03:45:36,080 --> 03:45:37,439
Mhm.

5996
03:45:37,439 --> 03:45:38,960
>> Uh [clears throat]

5997
03:45:38,960 --> 03:45:41,040
representatives of both American Fork

5998
03:45:41,040 --> 03:45:44,080
and the uh out the Highland Alpine

5999
03:45:44,080 --> 03:45:46,319
Chamber of Commerce attended the city

6000
03:45:46,319 --> 03:45:48,800
council meeting made a presentation and

6001
03:45:48,800 --> 03:45:51,920
kind of uh show what their organization

6002
03:45:51,920 --> 03:45:54,880
was about and what the benefits were. Um

6003
03:45:54,880 --> 03:45:57,199
it's been requested that we bring this

6004
03:45:57,199 --> 03:46:01,040
back for an action item to determine um

6005
03:46:01,040 --> 03:46:02,319
you know if there's a certain direction

6006
03:46:02,319 --> 03:46:04,960
that the city wants to go uh with one

6007
03:46:04,960 --> 03:46:07,680
organ organization or the other or I

6008
03:46:07,680 --> 03:46:10,319
guess there is the alternative of being

6009
03:46:10,319 --> 03:46:13,760
part of both or worst case for those

6010
03:46:13,760 --> 03:46:17,040
guys uh none of them. So um that's what

6011
03:46:17,040 --> 03:46:20,000
the council has before you tonight um to

6012
03:46:20,000 --> 03:46:23,830
consider that.

6013
03:46:23,840 --> 03:46:26,560
Okay, Jessica, do you have any questions

6014
03:46:26,560 --> 03:46:27,120
regarding

6015
03:46:27,120 --> 03:46:29,120
>> or just comment? I went um a couple

6016
03:46:29,120 --> 03:46:30,800
weeks ago to the lunchon at the Pizza

6017
03:46:30,800 --> 03:46:33,840
Pie Cafe. It was really well attended.

6018
03:46:33,840 --> 03:46:36,160
Um business owners here in Alpine and in

6019
03:46:36,160 --> 03:46:38,640
Highland are excited about having a

6020
03:46:38,640 --> 03:46:40,960
chamber that is closer to home and

6021
03:46:40,960 --> 03:46:42,880
represents, you know, some of the things

6022
03:46:42,880 --> 03:46:45,279
that they need, which is um you know,

6023
03:46:45,279 --> 03:46:47,600
maybe the small business owner that that

6024
03:46:47,600 --> 03:46:49,359
is working out of the house and and

6025
03:46:49,359 --> 03:46:52,720
wanting to get more um exposure. I do

6026
03:46:52,720 --> 03:46:54,560
recognize that Josh is here and they've

6027
03:46:54,560 --> 03:46:57,359
been awesome um to work with as a

6028
03:46:57,359 --> 03:46:59,600
chamber over the years, but you know, as

6029
03:46:59,600 --> 03:47:02,239
we're growing and businesses growing in

6030
03:47:02,239 --> 03:47:04,560
Alpine and Highland, there's just a need

6031
03:47:04,560 --> 03:47:08,160
to bring that networking and proximity

6032
03:47:08,160 --> 03:47:13,830
closer to Alpine and Highland.

6033
03:47:13,840 --> 03:47:17,359
» Um comments, right? Sure. Or questions.

6034
03:47:17,359 --> 03:47:20,640
>> Okay. So, um

6035
03:47:20,640 --> 03:47:23,439
I I'm trying to evaluate like the value

6036
03:47:23,439 --> 03:47:25,279
out of being the city being part of the

6037
03:47:25,279 --> 03:47:27,760
chamber and I know that they could help

6038
03:47:27,760 --> 03:47:29,840
with, you know, some of our in the past

6039
03:47:29,840 --> 03:47:31,520
the American Fork Chambers helped with

6040
03:47:31,520 --> 03:47:35,680
our trick-or- treat um street. I I fully

6041
03:47:35,680 --> 03:47:38,560
encourage any business to join a chamber

6042
03:47:38,560 --> 03:47:41,120
and I do think that like a local chamber

6043
03:47:41,120 --> 03:47:43,680
in my opinion makes more sense. So, the

6044
03:47:43,680 --> 03:47:45,920
Highland Alpine Chamber to me makes more

6045
03:47:45,920 --> 03:47:49,120
sense. Um, however, I still kind of am

6046
03:47:49,120 --> 03:47:51,120
on the fence as to whether as a city we

6047
03:47:51,120 --> 03:47:54,720
really need to be part of a chamber. Um,

6048
03:47:54,720 --> 03:47:57,199
I feel like a lot of the things I'm on

6049
03:47:57,199 --> 03:48:00,800
the the the chamber committee and in

6050
03:48:00,800 --> 03:48:02,720
talking to Heidi who does a lot of

6051
03:48:02,720 --> 03:48:05,920
events, we've discussed that maybe we

6052
03:48:05,920 --> 03:48:07,760
could use that money that we would use

6053
03:48:07,760 --> 03:48:10,160
to be part of a chamber to do it on our

6054
03:48:10,160 --> 03:48:13,040
own and work together. So, that is just

6055
03:48:13,040 --> 03:48:15,040
another idea that I'd like to just throw

6056
03:48:15,040 --> 03:48:18,160
out there. Um, but whatever the council

6057
03:48:18,160 --> 03:48:20,160
decides, if it's to be part of a

6058
03:48:20,160 --> 03:48:23,600
chamber, I will jump in

6059
03:48:23,600 --> 03:48:26,239
full full throttle and

6060
03:48:26,239 --> 03:48:27,760
>> I just have a comment to that.

6061
03:48:27,760 --> 03:48:30,080
Oftentimes, it's not funding that keeps

6062
03:48:30,080 --> 03:48:32,000
us from being able to do things. It's

6063
03:48:32,000 --> 03:48:35,199
actually manpower. And so the chamber

6064
03:48:35,199 --> 03:48:39,040
for that price is an extension and an

6065
03:48:39,040 --> 03:48:42,319
ability to expand the work that we can't

6066
03:48:42,319 --> 03:48:46,080
get done with our limited staff. So,

6067
03:48:46,080 --> 03:48:48,399
>> what do you feel like they could do for

6068
03:48:48,399 --> 03:48:49,120
us that

6069
03:48:49,120 --> 03:48:51,359
>> So, a couple of things they can they'll

6070
03:48:51,359 --> 03:48:53,279
work closely with businesses. I know

6071
03:48:53,279 --> 03:48:56,160
that we collect a licensing fee every

6072
03:48:56,160 --> 03:48:59,600
year and it is administratively

6073
03:48:59,600 --> 03:49:02,880
um takes time to stay on top of have we

6074
03:49:02,880 --> 03:49:06,319
collected the $50, what businesses are

6075
03:49:06,319 --> 03:49:08,319
currently active, what aren't, you know,

6076
03:49:08,319 --> 03:49:10,479
so they could help us keep an active

6077
03:49:10,479 --> 03:49:13,439
business file or um so that we can work

6078
03:49:13,439 --> 03:49:15,199
with them and collect fees. But I also

6079
03:49:15,199 --> 03:49:18,640
think there's um

6080
03:49:18,640 --> 03:49:21,120
the Halloween Main Street

6081
03:49:21,120 --> 03:49:24,479
trick-or-treating. Again, Heidi has a

6082
03:49:24,479 --> 03:49:27,520
lot on her plate and all those smaller

6083
03:49:27,520 --> 03:49:31,120
things that we can have support is going

6084
03:49:31,120 --> 03:49:32,960
to make a big difference in staffing and

6085
03:49:32,960 --> 03:49:35,439
we'll be able to start to do probably

6086
03:49:35,439 --> 03:49:37,840
even more chamber events. Like I've been

6087
03:49:37,840 --> 03:49:40,720
to chamber meetings in other cities

6088
03:49:40,720 --> 03:49:44,080
where they host state of the city and so

6089
03:49:44,080 --> 03:49:46,000
state of the city hosted by our chamber

6090
03:49:46,000 --> 03:49:48,479
in partnership with Alpine and Highland

6091
03:49:48,479 --> 03:49:51,040
really again brings that communication

6092
03:49:51,040 --> 03:49:53,199
piece back to what's relevant and

6093
03:49:53,199 --> 03:49:55,520
happening in our communities.

6094
03:49:55,520 --> 03:49:57,840
>> And thank you Jessica. I appreciate that

6095
03:49:57,840 --> 03:50:00,960
insight. Um Deianne correct me if I'm

6096
03:50:00,960 --> 03:50:03,359
wrong but do we already keep track of

6097
03:50:03,359 --> 03:50:05,920
all the businesses in Alpine? like is

6098
03:50:05,920 --> 03:50:07,840
that a possibility for us to still have

6099
03:50:07,840 --> 03:50:09,439
that on record?

6100
03:50:09,439 --> 03:50:11,760
>> We have a record of all the registered

6101
03:50:11,760 --> 03:50:14,560
businesses. So commercial and home

6102
03:50:14,560 --> 03:50:16,960
occupation, everybody who complies with

6103
03:50:16,960 --> 03:50:19,040
the rules and registers their business.

6104
03:50:19,040 --> 03:50:20,560
Yeah, I have all of that.

6105
03:50:20,560 --> 03:50:23,439
>> Thank you. And then Heidi, do you mind

6106
03:50:23,439 --> 03:50:25,359
just can I ask Heidi to share her

6107
03:50:25,359 --> 03:50:27,439
opinion and thoughts?

6108
03:50:27,439 --> 03:50:29,840
>> Is that not to put you on the spot,

6109
03:50:29,840 --> 03:50:31,120
Heidi?

6110
03:50:31,120 --> 03:50:32,880
>> Well, I was say I don't know that I've

6111
03:50:32,880 --> 03:50:36,800
cooked this. I we had a discussion um

6112
03:50:36,800 --> 03:50:38,800
the only real benefit that I've seen

6113
03:50:38,800 --> 03:50:42,239
historically has been the trick or treat

6114
03:50:42,239 --> 03:50:45,520
help in that. Could we put that on on

6115
03:50:45,520 --> 03:50:48,479
ourselves? Absolutely. I mean we do have

6116
03:50:48,479 --> 03:50:52,080
the bandwidth to do that. Um in the past

6117
03:50:52,080 --> 03:50:54,399
I feel like our city has been under

6118
03:50:54,399 --> 03:50:58,080
reppresented in this in this world.

6119
03:50:58,080 --> 03:51:01,680
um if there was a proactive help. I mean

6120
03:51:01,680 --> 03:51:05,120
there was some lines about um Alpine

6121
03:51:05,120 --> 03:51:08,319
days and things and I felt like my my

6122
03:51:08,319 --> 03:51:10,399
support from the group has been less

6123
03:51:10,399 --> 03:51:11,920
than

6124
03:51:11,920 --> 03:51:16,479
um than I asked for. Um that said, I

6125
03:51:16,479 --> 03:51:18,640
mean I don't again it's it's kind of one

6126
03:51:18,640 --> 03:51:20,880
of those things in my realm. I have not

6127
03:51:20,880 --> 03:51:22,560
received

6128
03:51:22,560 --> 03:51:26,640
a ton of of life-changing help. Um, that

6129
03:51:26,640 --> 03:51:29,120
said, any help is is welcome. So, I

6130
03:51:29,120 --> 03:51:31,680
don't I don't turn down when I get

6131
03:51:31,680 --> 03:51:34,560
assistance in any in any form. Um, but

6132
03:51:34,560 --> 03:51:37,279
at the same time, up to this point, I

6133
03:51:37,279 --> 03:51:40,479
have not received um anything that has

6134
03:51:40,479 --> 03:51:43,120
really changed the the the look and feel

6135
03:51:43,120 --> 03:51:46,000
of the city. So, thank you.

6136
03:51:46,000 --> 03:51:47,279
>> Yes, that is helpful. Thanks for

6137
03:51:47,279 --> 03:51:48,800
weighing in. I guess those are kind of

6138
03:51:48,800 --> 03:51:51,120
my only thoughts and comments.

6139
03:51:51,120 --> 03:51:53,199
>> Okay. Sorry, I wasn't expecting to make

6140
03:51:53,199 --> 03:51:56,880
a comment, but I do want to share um

6141
03:51:56,880 --> 03:51:59,920
because of my career, I have had to

6142
03:51:59,920 --> 03:52:02,185
spend many time, many hours in in

6143
03:52:02,185 --> 03:52:03,359
[clears throat] different chamber of

6144
03:52:03,359 --> 03:52:06,160
commerce. Salt Lake City, um Utah

6145
03:52:06,160 --> 03:52:09,199
County, Point of the Mountain, um

6146
03:52:09,199 --> 03:52:11,439
there's another one,

6147
03:52:11,439 --> 03:52:13,120
I can't remember what that one was. It

6148
03:52:13,120 --> 03:52:15,120
was up in Salt Lake because I worked in

6149
03:52:15,120 --> 03:52:16,595
the downtown for a while.

6150
03:52:16,595 --> 03:52:16,720
>> [snorts]

6151
03:52:16,720 --> 03:52:18,560
>> And the purpose of uh chamber of

6152
03:52:18,560 --> 03:52:21,199
commerce are not directed specifically

6153
03:52:21,199 --> 03:52:24,080
to us. So they are there to benefit the

6154
03:52:24,080 --> 03:52:27,199
members who are primarily businesses.

6155
03:52:27,199 --> 03:52:29,359
And I think as a city council we need to

6156
03:52:29,359 --> 03:52:30,960
recognize that businesses are our

6157
03:52:30,960 --> 03:52:34,560
partners that they carry um a role in

6158
03:52:34,560 --> 03:52:37,600
our city. And um despite the fact we

6159
03:52:37,600 --> 03:52:40,560
don't maybe vote for their project that

6160
03:52:40,560 --> 03:52:43,120
just happened, we do want viable

6161
03:52:43,120 --> 03:52:45,359
business in our city.

6162
03:52:45,359 --> 03:52:49,439
um that whether it it's not just their

6163
03:52:49,439 --> 03:52:51,840
property tax that they bring but

6164
03:52:51,840 --> 03:52:55,920
employment for our families and um just

6165
03:52:55,920 --> 03:52:59,120
partnering maybe like in the parade or

6166
03:52:59,120 --> 03:53:02,239
other ways they partner. So we have to

6167
03:53:02,239 --> 03:53:07,680
think about not in this case what's best for us as council members

6168
03:53:07,680 --> 03:53:10,160
per se but like what's the best for our

6169
03:53:10,160 --> 03:53:13,040
residents who want to participate in a

6170
03:53:13,040 --> 03:53:15,600
chamber of count the chamber of commerce

6171
03:53:15,600 --> 03:53:19,439
and who who um how will that

6172
03:53:19,439 --> 03:53:21,680
organization that we want to support

6173
03:53:21,680 --> 03:53:24,080
we're supporting them in their bigger

6174
03:53:24,080 --> 03:53:25,600
purpose which is to support the

6175
03:53:25,600 --> 03:53:28,640
businesses. So um like you said we are

6176
03:53:28,640 --> 03:53:32,640
short staffed so they they other larger

6177
03:53:32,640 --> 03:53:35,040
cities even have economic development

6178
03:53:35,040 --> 03:53:37,439
departments like just to bring in new

6179
03:53:37,439 --> 03:53:41,600
business into their city like that's a real responsibility that we

6180
03:53:41,600 --> 03:53:44,239
have is to not underestimate the value

6181
03:53:44,239 --> 03:53:47,920
of businesses in our city and that

6182
03:53:47,920 --> 03:53:51,120
doesn't just mean retail. So um I think

6183
03:53:51,120 --> 03:53:54,640
that uh what I what would with that

6184
03:53:54,640 --> 03:53:56,160
perspective knowing where I'm coming

6185
03:53:56,160 --> 03:53:59,600
from um a lot of what the chamber events

6186
03:53:59,600 --> 03:54:02,960
are is to help again the business people

6187
03:54:02,960 --> 03:54:06,239
to network with each other to um to

6188
03:54:06,239 --> 03:54:09,359
understand like the uh who each other

6189
03:54:09,359 --> 03:54:12,000
are and like uh help serve each other.

6190
03:54:12,000 --> 03:54:14,239
Um like lean on each other like if you

6191
03:54:14,239 --> 03:54:16,239
need a new bank banker or you need your

6192
03:54:16,239 --> 03:54:18,560
car fixed things like that. somewhat

6193
03:54:18,560 --> 03:54:21,760
local um or if you need an expertise in

6194
03:54:21,760 --> 03:54:24,800
something um and so it's to help you

6195
03:54:24,800 --> 03:54:26,640
know build

6196
03:54:26,640 --> 03:54:29,199
our businesses owners. It's not

6197
03:54:29,199 --> 03:54:31,120
necessarily they don't ex the chamber of

6198
03:54:31,120 --> 03:54:33,359
commerce does not exist to benefit the

6199
03:54:33,359 --> 03:54:37,199
city officials and elected officials. So

6200
03:54:37,199 --> 03:54:39,520
to me we're we're just supporting a very

6201
03:54:39,520 --> 03:54:43,359
good um a very

6202
03:54:43,359 --> 03:54:44,960
uh what do I want to say? We're

6203
03:54:44,960 --> 03:54:47,600
promoting, we're being businessfriendly

6204
03:54:47,600 --> 03:54:50,399
in our city. So whether each either one

6205
03:54:50,399 --> 03:54:52,640
I don't really have a strong opinion,

6206
03:54:52,640 --> 03:54:55,680
but I did I did take interest in how

6207
03:54:55,680 --> 03:54:58,000
well Alpine was represented in the new

6208
03:54:58,000 --> 03:55:00,239
one compared to American Fork that there

6209
03:55:00,239 --> 03:55:03,040
was a lot more interest per se. So I

6210
03:55:03,040 --> 03:55:05,920
measure my interest by the people uh the

6211
03:55:05,920 --> 03:55:08,399
Alpine residents who chose to go that a

6212
03:55:08,399 --> 03:55:10,960
new direction that maybe that is for

6213
03:55:10,960 --> 03:55:12,960
whatever they think that is going to

6214
03:55:12,960 --> 03:55:15,040
serve them better. I would favor that

6215
03:55:15,040 --> 03:55:17,520
one, but again, I don't um I have just

6216
03:55:17,520 --> 03:55:19,680
that's my perspective is what's best for

6217
03:55:19,680 --> 03:55:23,439
the Alpine uh business owners. They're

6218
03:55:23,439 --> 03:55:25,840
telling me what they value and that it

6219
03:55:25,840 --> 03:55:27,439
helps make my decision.

6220
03:55:27,439 --> 03:55:29,520
>> Thanks for that education.

6221
03:55:29,520 --> 03:55:32,160
>> That was really nice. Uh I found that

6222
03:55:32,160 --> 03:55:34,640
there is one thing more valuable than

6223
03:55:34,640 --> 03:55:38,239
money and commerce and business. And you

6224
03:55:38,239 --> 03:55:39,760
know this because people with a lot of

6225
03:55:39,760 --> 03:55:43,439
money, this is where they go. peace and

6226
03:55:43,439 --> 03:55:45,040
quiet,

6227
03:55:45,040 --> 03:55:46,800
right?

6228
03:55:46,800 --> 03:55:48,479
You go, you want business, you want

6229
03:55:48,479 --> 03:55:50,479
commercial, you want all this stuff, you

6230
03:55:50,479 --> 03:55:53,359
get it. Where do people go that have it?

6231
03:55:53,359 --> 03:55:55,439
They go for peace and quiet. And they go

6232
03:55:55,439 --> 03:55:57,359
as far away from the industrial areas as

6233
03:55:57,359 --> 03:55:58,960
they can because they realize how

6234
03:55:58,960 --> 03:56:01,920
valuable it is. We have it. Okay? So,

6235
03:56:01,920 --> 03:56:03,359
that's an important thing. We have it.

6236
03:56:03,359 --> 03:56:06,000
And once it's gone, it's gone. And you

6237
03:56:06,000 --> 03:56:08,080
don't get it back. And people go from

6238
03:56:08,080 --> 03:56:09,760
one place to one place to try to find

6239
03:56:09,760 --> 03:56:11,279
it. When they lose it there, they go to

6240
03:56:11,279 --> 03:56:12,960
the next place. Wyomi's almost gone and

6241
03:56:12,960 --> 03:56:15,520
Heber's almost gone and Aahu's almost

6242
03:56:15,520 --> 03:56:16,720
gone and so they're trying to figure out

6243
03:56:16,720 --> 03:56:18,479
other places but Alpine still has it so

6244
03:56:18,479 --> 03:56:20,640
that's what we're trying to protect. Um

6245
03:56:20,640 --> 03:56:22,560
no that was you don't have to take any

6246
03:56:22,560 --> 03:56:25,760
of that if you don't want but um in in

6247
03:56:25,760 --> 03:56:28,319
regards to this commerce

6248
03:56:28,319 --> 03:56:32,560
um I'm I'm for the Highland uh Chamber

6249
03:56:32,560 --> 03:56:34,399
of Commerce

6250
03:56:34,399 --> 03:56:36,479
>> Highland Alpine Chamber of Commerce

6251
03:56:36,479 --> 03:56:39,680
under and I have I love American Fork as

6252
03:56:39,680 --> 03:56:42,399
well. I have a stained glass window of

6253
03:56:42,399 --> 03:56:44,319
Jesus in American Fork. I don't know if

6254
03:56:44,319 --> 03:56:46,239
you've seen it when you go Yeah. I built

6255
03:56:46,239 --> 03:56:47,680
a stained glass window of Jesus in

6256
03:56:47,680 --> 03:56:49,439
American Fork. So I I feel a great

6257
03:56:49,439 --> 03:56:51,439
connection to American Fork in the uh

6258
03:56:51,439 --> 03:56:53,680
Presbyterian church right by the Yeah.

6259
03:56:53,680 --> 03:56:56,080
You know the one of Jesus? Yeah. Yeah.

6260
03:56:56,080 --> 03:56:58,000
So I I really love American Fork. So

6261
03:56:58,000 --> 03:57:00,160
this has nothing to do with me not

6262
03:57:00,160 --> 03:57:01,760
thinking American Fork is a wonderful

6263
03:57:01,760 --> 03:57:04,720
place and it's like a brother. But

6264
03:57:04,720 --> 03:57:08,960
Highland is cheaper and it's closer. And

6265
03:57:08,960 --> 03:57:11,199
if they will guarantee a three-year lock

6266
03:57:11,199 --> 03:57:14,399
in the price and an evaluation on a per

6267
03:57:14,399 --> 03:57:17,279
year basis, they have my full support in

6268
03:57:17,279 --> 03:57:19,680
um being part of the uh Highland Chamber

6269
03:57:19,680 --> 03:57:20,960
of Commerce. But I would also like a

6270
03:57:20,960 --> 03:57:23,359
linewritten document that says they will

6271
03:57:23,359 --> 03:57:26,000
also help Alpine preserve its plan, its

6272
03:57:26,000 --> 03:57:28,560
Alpine plan in building peace and quiet,

6273
03:57:28,560 --> 03:57:30,880
preserving views as well as protecting

6274
03:57:30,880 --> 03:57:33,199
businesses. So if you can give me that,

6275
03:57:33,199 --> 03:57:36,080
I am your number one supporter.

6276
03:57:36,080 --> 03:57:39,670
That's all I got.

6277
03:57:39,680 --> 03:57:41,920
» So the purp Okay. So I'm a little bit

6278
03:57:41,920 --> 03:57:42,640
confused.

6279
03:57:42,640 --> 03:57:43,840
>> Were we just discussing?

6280
03:57:43,840 --> 03:57:45,520
>> No, no, no, no. I am. I just want

6281
03:57:45,520 --> 03:57:47,520
clarification. So you're saying that um

6282
03:57:47,520 --> 03:57:49,840
you support the Highland Chamber

6283
03:57:49,840 --> 03:57:52,399
>> because um because the whole purpose, my

6284
03:57:52,399 --> 03:57:54,080
understanding is to help our businesses

6285
03:57:54,080 --> 03:57:56,080
to grow their businesses. So you have

6286
03:57:56,080 --> 03:57:56,800
more

6287
03:57:56,800 --> 03:57:57,199
>> Yes.

6288
03:57:57,199 --> 03:57:59,359
>> business and commerce going on. But

6289
03:57:59,359 --> 03:58:00,960
you're saying at the same time you want

6290
03:58:00,960 --> 03:58:02,880
them to commit to keeping Alpine small

6291
03:58:02,880 --> 03:58:04,319
and quiet. I want them to balance and

6292
03:58:04,319 --> 03:58:05,920
not [clears throat] encourage commerce.

6293
03:58:05,920 --> 03:58:07,680
>> No. No. You Okay, I'll say it again.

6294
03:58:07,680 --> 03:58:08,800
>> I'm just confused.

6295
03:58:08,800 --> 03:58:10,880
>> I want them to have a line item that if

6296
03:58:10,880 --> 03:58:12,080
we're going to be part of this, they

6297
03:58:12,080 --> 03:58:14,560
will also help Alpine preserve its plan

6298
03:58:14,560 --> 03:58:16,239
in building peace, quiet, and protecting

6299
03:58:16,239 --> 03:58:18,720
views and supporting business. There is

6300
03:58:18,720 --> 03:58:20,640
a way to do it together. And the best

6301
03:58:20,640 --> 03:58:22,239
communities balance that. They don't

6302
03:58:22,239 --> 03:58:24,000
overrun one or the other. They don't

6303
03:58:24,000 --> 03:58:26,160
push out businesses, but they also don't

6304
03:58:26,160 --> 03:58:27,760
destroy their peace and quiet. And

6305
03:58:27,760 --> 03:58:28,960
that's what we have right now. We've

6306
03:58:28,960 --> 03:58:30,319
been You've done a great job in your

6307
03:58:30,319 --> 03:58:31,920
history doing this. So, it's just to

6308
03:58:31,920 --> 03:58:33,600
continue that.

6309
03:58:33,600 --> 03:58:34,800
>> Okay. Did you have anything else you

6310
03:58:34,800 --> 03:58:35,279
wanted?

6311
03:58:35,279 --> 03:58:36,880
>> No, I Hey, you brought it back up.

6312
03:58:36,880 --> 03:58:37,600
>> Right.

6313
03:58:37,600 --> 03:58:39,040
>> I really appreciate the comments. That

6314
03:58:39,040 --> 03:58:40,960
was very helpful. I didn't have a one

6315
03:58:40,960 --> 03:58:43,199
way the other as far as whether we

6316
03:58:43,199 --> 03:58:45,600
continued a business alliance or

6317
03:58:45,600 --> 03:58:47,199
business partnership at all.

6318
03:58:47,199 --> 03:58:49,279
>> But, um, I think it would be worth and

6319
03:58:49,279 --> 03:58:52,239
go going to uh Sarah's point, what is

6320
03:58:52,239 --> 03:58:54,239
the value? I think it's I think it's

6321
03:58:54,239 --> 03:58:58,080
worth it to try and see. Um, I like the

6322
03:58:58,080 --> 03:59:01,120
energy of the Alpine Highland folks. I

6323
03:59:01,120 --> 03:59:02,960
like that more of our businesses are

6324
03:59:02,960 --> 03:59:04,960
already participating than what seems to

6325
03:59:04,960 --> 03:59:07,439
be seem to have been participating

6326
03:59:07,439 --> 03:59:11,600
in the other one. Um,

6327
03:59:11,600 --> 03:59:16,640
I know we have a list, but I like their idea of publicizing that list to

6328
03:59:16,640 --> 03:59:19,040
our and letting the Alpine residents

6329
03:59:19,040 --> 03:59:21,600
know what our businesses are so we can

6330
03:59:21,600 --> 03:59:25,279
try and patronize them more. Um, so if I

6331
03:59:25,279 --> 03:59:28,000
would I would support

6332
03:59:28,000 --> 03:59:30,319
trying this to see how it goes and I

6333
03:59:30,319 --> 03:59:32,399
think it's a very low investment and

6334
03:59:32,399 --> 03:59:35,600
potential good return on our money.

6335
03:59:35,600 --> 03:59:39,120
So, um,

6336
03:59:39,120 --> 03:59:41,279
for me with my personal experience and

6337
03:59:41,279 --> 03:59:43,760
going to various meetings with, um,

6338
03:59:43,760 --> 03:59:48,160
various chambers in the county, um,

6339
03:59:48,160 --> 03:59:50,160
I can see the value of going to a

6340
03:59:50,160 --> 03:59:53,760
smaller, more local, um, chamber, but I

6341
03:59:53,760 --> 03:59:55,520
also see the value of going with a

6342
03:59:55,520 --> 03:59:57,520
chamber that has been around for more

6343
03:59:57,520 --> 04:00:01,120
than 80 years, that they have a strong

6344
04:00:01,120 --> 04:00:03,600
um, heritage

6345
04:00:03,600 --> 04:00:06,399
that um you know they understand

6346
04:00:06,399 --> 04:00:08,800
business in this area and that they

6347
04:00:08,800 --> 04:00:11,520
offer a larger network and a bigger

6348
04:00:11,520 --> 04:00:15,040
community and so even though the numbers

6349
04:00:15,040 --> 04:00:17,120
have been few that have participated in

6350
04:00:17,120 --> 04:00:19,520
American Fork Chamber I feel like the

6351
04:00:19,520 --> 04:00:22,239
ones that have started have gone and it

6352
04:00:22,239 --> 04:00:24,080
had they have helped them you know you

6353
04:00:24,080 --> 04:00:26,000
look at the all the workshops that they

6354
04:00:26,000 --> 04:00:29,439
provide um and granted hopefully you

6355
04:00:29,439 --> 04:00:31,120
know the Highland Alpine Chamber will

6356
04:00:31,120 --> 04:00:34,319
get there at some point um and than you

6357
04:00:34,319 --> 04:00:37,520
know even going to and working with

6358
04:00:37,520 --> 04:00:39,439
other chambers and having joint events

6359
04:00:39,439 --> 04:00:41,680
and you know they have chamber has gone

6360
04:00:41,680 --> 04:00:43,120
to the point where they're offering you

6361
04:00:43,120 --> 04:00:46,560
know even specific classes and specific

6362
04:00:46,560 --> 04:00:48,560
sessions just for women in business you

6363
04:00:48,560 --> 04:00:50,640
know it's not just for plain businesses

6364
04:00:50,640 --> 04:00:54,080
and they've segmented it so much more um

6365
04:00:54,080 --> 04:00:56,640
I mean ultimately it's up to both but I

6366
04:00:56,640 --> 04:01:00,960
mean maybe what you do is

6367
04:01:00,960 --> 04:01:03,120
from my understanding is that our

6368
04:01:03,120 --> 04:01:05,359
businesses can still join the Highland

6369
04:01:05,359 --> 04:01:07,279
Alpine Chamber whether the city supports

6370
04:01:07,279 --> 04:01:09,199
it or not.

6371
04:01:09,199 --> 04:01:13,279
Maybe just let our businesses

6372
04:01:13,279 --> 04:01:15,520
choose for themselves where they go and

6373
04:01:15,520 --> 04:01:18,479
then maybe after a year recess or you

6374
04:01:18,479 --> 04:01:21,040
know you can go ahead and move forward.

6375
04:01:21,040 --> 04:01:23,840
But to me the value in the chamber is to

6376
04:01:23,840 --> 04:01:25,279
get the support and increase your

6377
04:01:25,279 --> 04:01:30,239
network where I feel like the AF chamber

6378
04:01:30,239 --> 04:01:32,479
that's what they have already. They have

6379
04:01:32,479 --> 04:01:36,640
a vast network to be able to um provide

6380
04:01:36,640 --> 04:01:38,560
an audience for our businesses that want

6381
04:01:38,560 --> 04:01:39,279
it.

6382
04:01:39,279 --> 04:01:41,040
>> Mayor, can I ask you a question?

6383
04:01:41,040 --> 04:01:42,800
>> If we were to exit the American Fort

6384
04:01:42,800 --> 04:01:44,000
Chamber and go with the Highland

6385
04:01:44,000 --> 04:01:44,880
Chamber,

6386
04:01:44,880 --> 04:01:48,319
>> could we earn uh the business back of

6387
04:01:48,319 --> 04:01:49,840
the American for Chamber and switch back

6388
04:01:49,840 --> 04:01:50,640
at any point?

6389
04:01:50,640 --> 04:01:52,720
>> That I don't know. Is that is that an

6390
04:01:52,720 --> 04:01:56,870
option?

6391
04:01:56,880 --> 04:01:58,880
» Put you in a very

6392
04:01:58,880 --> 04:02:07,910
>> Okay. Okay. There you go.

6393
04:02:07,920 --> 04:02:09,199
There are some people that signed up for

6394
04:02:09,199 --> 04:02:10,960
public comment on in relation to this

6395
04:02:10,960 --> 04:02:13,120
subject. When does that happen? Just a

6396
04:02:13,120 --> 04:02:13,840
question.

6397
04:02:13,840 --> 04:02:15,279
>> Oh, you don't want I don't think we're

6398
04:02:15,279 --> 04:02:16,640
going to take public comment on this. I

6399
04:02:16,640 --> 04:02:17,840
think we were just going to talk about

6400
04:02:17,840 --> 04:02:23,439
it, but there was I got one, but it's

6401
04:02:23,439 --> 04:02:23,920
>> it was

6402
04:02:23,920 --> 04:02:25,359
>> someone's waited like three hours. It's

6403
04:02:25,359 --> 04:02:26,239
probably worth it.

6404
04:02:26,239 --> 04:02:27,680
>> What was a Highland resident?

6405
04:02:27,680 --> 04:02:28,640
>> Oh, it was a Highland res.

6406
04:02:28,640 --> 04:02:29,600
>> Yeah, it wasn't an Alpine.

6407
04:02:29,600 --> 04:02:32,560
>> I'm sorry. I would know who it is. Is it

6408
04:02:32,560 --> 04:02:34,000
pertinent information that would be

6409
04:02:34,000 --> 04:02:41,670
helpful?

6410
04:02:41,680 --> 04:02:44,479
» I think it's up to the mayor.

6411
04:02:44,479 --> 04:02:46,319
>> I think, you know, it sounds like people

6412
04:02:46,319 --> 04:02:49,439
are made up. If if you guys, you know, I

6413
04:02:49,439 --> 04:02:50,720
think, you know, your question was

6414
04:02:50,720 --> 04:02:52,720
valid. You know, if you choose to leave,

6415
04:02:52,720 --> 04:02:54,399
can we come back? I think we had that

6416
04:02:54,399 --> 04:02:57,760
answered. Does anybody have questions

6417
04:02:57,760 --> 04:03:00,000
specifically on what each chamber can

6418
04:03:00,000 --> 04:03:02,880
provide the city and its um business

6419
04:03:02,880 --> 04:03:05,840
owners um and what kind of programs? But

6420
04:03:05,840 --> 04:03:08,720
if not, it sounds like,

6421
04:03:08,720 --> 04:03:11,359
you know, we can move forward. I think

6422
04:03:11,359 --> 04:03:13,520
they both gave pretty thorough

6423
04:03:13,520 --> 04:03:15,120
presentations the last time they were

6424
04:03:15,120 --> 04:03:17,359
here. So, I have a motion.

6425
04:03:17,359 --> 04:03:21,199
>> Okay. I move to approve membership in

6426
04:03:21,199 --> 04:03:23,439
the Highland Alpine Chamber of Commerce

6427
04:03:23,439 --> 04:03:26,160
and instruct staff to budget funds to

6428
04:03:26,160 --> 04:03:28,239
cover the expense

6429
04:03:28,239 --> 04:03:30,000
with

6430
04:03:30,000 --> 04:03:33,040
um the renewal or actually with

6431
04:03:33,040 --> 04:03:35,600
evaluation

6432
04:03:35,600 --> 04:03:39,040
in the following year to determine the

6433
04:03:39,040 --> 04:03:43,760
continuation of our chamber membership.

6434
04:03:43,760 --> 04:03:45,840
>> We have a motion by Councilwoman Smeuan.

6435
04:03:45,840 --> 04:03:48,239
Is there a second? Uh well, can I amend

6436
04:03:48,239 --> 04:03:50,239
the motion to add two things?

6437
04:03:50,239 --> 04:03:51,120
>> A second.

6438
04:03:51,120 --> 04:03:52,960
>> We need a second to the motion.

6439
04:03:52,960 --> 04:03:53,760
>> I second it.

6440
04:03:53,760 --> 04:03:54,880
>> Okay.

6441
04:03:54,880 --> 04:03:58,160
May I add a potential amendment to the

6442
04:03:58,160 --> 04:04:01,040
uh motion to add a three-year lock in

6443
04:04:01,040 --> 04:04:02,880
the price

6444
04:04:02,880 --> 04:04:07,840
uh and a written document that uh the

6445
04:04:07,840 --> 04:04:10,800
that showcases the vision of the

6446
04:04:10,800 --> 04:04:12,880
Highland Alpine

6447
04:04:12,880 --> 04:04:19,359
Chamber of Commerce to also preserve or to also

6448
04:04:19,359 --> 04:04:22,399
uphold the Alpine plan in preserving

6449
04:04:22,399 --> 04:04:24,080
peace, quiet and views.

6450
04:04:24,080 --> 04:04:25,760
while supporting businesses.

6451
04:04:25,760 --> 04:04:28,160
>> Did you want to entertain that

6452
04:04:28,160 --> 04:04:29,120
amendment?

6453
04:04:29,120 --> 04:04:31,600
>> Well, I want to include the three-year

6454
04:04:31,600 --> 04:04:35,279
price, but would that be a memorandum

6455
04:04:35,279 --> 04:04:36,479
of understanding?

6456
04:04:36,479 --> 04:04:38,880
>> No, just a lock that it couldn't raise.

6457
04:04:38,880 --> 04:04:41,199
>> No, no, no. I'm talking about the other

6458
04:04:41,199 --> 04:04:41,600
part.

6459
04:04:41,600 --> 04:04:42,399
>> The other part.

6460
04:04:42,399 --> 04:04:44,160
>> Oh,

6461
04:04:44,160 --> 04:04:47,120
>> so did So, he proposed an amendment to

6462
04:04:47,120 --> 04:04:50,960
your motion. Do you accept that?

6463
04:04:50,960 --> 04:04:52,880
I'm just asking for clarification

6464
04:04:52,880 --> 04:04:55,359
because I do know that they are working

6465
04:04:55,359 --> 04:04:57,760
with the city of Highland to create I'm

6466
04:04:57,760 --> 04:04:59,279
not sure is it a memorandum of

6467
04:04:59,279 --> 04:05:01,920
understanding. Yeah. So if there is a

6468
04:05:01,920 --> 04:05:03,920
memorandum of understanding we'd like to

6469
04:05:03,920 --> 04:05:06,239
include with our membership I think that

6470
04:05:06,239 --> 04:05:07,439
would be important

6471
04:05:07,439 --> 04:05:10,479
>> but you don't want but do you want to

6472
04:05:10,479 --> 04:05:13,439
put that in your amendment to the motion

6473
04:05:13,439 --> 04:05:15,040
>> or are you saying that you would rather

6474
04:05:15,040 --> 04:05:15,439
include

6475
04:05:15,439 --> 04:05:17,040
>> I would rather have that as a separate

6476
04:05:17,040 --> 04:05:18,640
>> Okay. So, you're accepting you're

6477
04:05:18,640 --> 04:05:20,800
accepting me the amendment for a

6478
04:05:20,800 --> 04:05:23,120
three-year lock on the price if we

6479
04:05:23,120 --> 04:05:24,880
choose to stay in.

6480
04:05:24,880 --> 04:05:26,720
>> Um,

6481
04:05:26,720 --> 04:05:28,160
are you okay with that?

6482
04:05:28,160 --> 04:05:28,560
>> Yeah.

6483
04:05:28,560 --> 04:05:30,000
>> Or do you want to make a substitute

6484
04:05:30,000 --> 04:05:30,560
motion?

6485
04:05:30,560 --> 04:05:32,319
>> No, that's Do we need to include the

6486
04:05:32,319 --> 04:05:33,840
memorandum part or No,

6487
04:05:33,840 --> 04:05:35,120
>> not in the motion.

6488
04:05:35,120 --> 04:05:37,359
>> Then I'm happy with it. Thank you.

6489
04:05:37,359 --> 04:05:37,760
>> Okay.

6490
04:05:37,760 --> 04:05:38,880
>> Still support it. I still

6491
04:05:38,880 --> 04:05:42,720
>> there. Any discussion on the motion,

6492
04:05:42,720 --> 04:05:45,279
>> Chrissy?

6493
04:05:45,279 --> 04:05:47,920
I was g maybe I was misinformed. But I

6494
04:05:47,920 --> 04:05:50,000
was looking at the website and maybe we

6495
04:05:50,000 --> 04:05:52,399
can ask a question cuz I thought this

6496
04:05:52,399 --> 04:05:54,319
was listing everyone who is members but

6497
04:05:54,319 --> 04:05:55,840
when I looked at it again I think it's

6498
04:05:55,840 --> 04:05:58,640
every business in Alpine or everyone on

6499
04:05:58,640 --> 04:06:01,439
your website is a member.

6500
04:06:01,439 --> 04:06:02,800
>> There's two different sections.

6501
04:06:02,800 --> 04:06:06,389
>> Sorry

6502
04:06:06,399 --> 04:06:10,800
there on the website there is oh sorry

6503
04:06:10,800 --> 04:06:12,800
my name is Rob Cwley. I am the chair of

6504
04:06:12,800 --> 04:06:15,600
the Highland Alpine Chamber of Commerce.

6505
04:06:15,600 --> 04:06:18,479
So on the website there is the the most

6506
04:06:18,479 --> 04:06:20,960
prominent place it says member companies

6507
04:06:20,960 --> 04:06:22,399
and if you click on that it shows all

6508
04:06:22,399 --> 04:06:24,960
the member companies but below that

6509
04:06:24,960 --> 04:06:27,120
there's all Alpine businesses and all

6510
04:06:27,120 --> 04:06:29,199
Highland businesses because we feel like

6511
04:06:29,199 --> 04:06:31,600
it's very beneficial to this residents

6512
04:06:31,600 --> 04:06:34,239
of Highland and Alpine to be able to see

6513
04:06:34,239 --> 04:06:36,239
all the businesses. Of course if they're

6514
04:06:36,239 --> 04:06:37,680
chamber members then you know that

6515
04:06:37,680 --> 04:06:39,120
they're supporting the community.

6516
04:06:39,120 --> 04:06:40,960
They're more active in the community.

6517
04:06:40,960 --> 04:06:42,319
I'd be more inclined to go with the

6518
04:06:42,319 --> 04:06:44,319
chamber member, but I also want to see

6519
04:06:44,319 --> 04:06:46,399
all the businesses and be able to find

6520
04:06:46,399 --> 04:06:48,880
all the businesses there on the website.

6521
04:06:48,880 --> 04:06:49,279
So

6522
04:06:49,279 --> 04:06:52,340
>> So when you when you go to um the

6523
04:06:52,340 --> 04:06:53,920
[clears throat] al what what

6524
04:06:53,920 --> 04:06:56,080
>> highlandalpine chamber.com,

6525
04:06:56,080 --> 04:06:57,920
>> right, that's where I am. The view all

6526
04:06:57,920 --> 04:06:59,920
Highland businesses, view all alpine

6527
04:06:59,920 --> 04:07:01,840
businesses. They've already done what

6528
04:07:01,840 --> 04:07:03,680
Sarah asked, which is to find every

6529
04:07:03,680 --> 04:07:05,760
business that's registered in the city.

6530
04:07:05,760 --> 04:07:10,640
Where did you get your list? Um, we've gone throughout the city and any

6531
04:07:10,640 --> 04:07:13,040
that we can find that are visible, we've

6532
04:07:13,040 --> 04:07:14,880
included those. I don't think we've got

6533
04:07:14,880 --> 04:07:16,720
a list yet from the city. So, we're

6534
04:07:16,720 --> 04:07:18,640
going to add those also.

6535
04:07:18,640 --> 04:07:19,040
>> Okay.

6536
04:07:19,040 --> 04:07:21,920
>> Um, but also just keeping our eyes open

6537
04:07:21,920 --> 04:07:23,040
to find any other.

6538
04:07:23,040 --> 04:07:26,000
>> So, when it says like you have 56, you

6539
04:07:26,000 --> 04:07:29,120
have 66 member companies in Highland

6540
04:07:29,120 --> 04:07:30,080
>> and Alpine

6541
04:07:30,080 --> 04:07:32,399
>> and then Highland and Alpine.

6542
04:07:32,399 --> 04:07:34,399
>> Those are all combined all the member

6543
04:07:34,399 --> 04:07:34,960
companies.

6544
04:07:34,960 --> 04:07:38,319
>> Okay. So 66 and then the remaining 56

6545
04:07:38,319 --> 04:07:40,880
other are not members. Is that what this

6546
04:07:40,880 --> 04:07:42,800
your your lists are?

6547
04:07:42,800 --> 04:07:45,760
>> Well, it depends. So if you go if go

6548
04:07:45,760 --> 04:07:47,840
back to the main site and you click on

6549
04:07:47,840 --> 04:07:51,359
chamber members and that is less than 66

6550
04:07:51,359 --> 04:07:52,479
because we don't have that many members

6551
04:07:52,479 --> 04:07:54,800
yet. I wish we did. We're closer to 30

6552
04:07:54,800 --> 04:07:55,840
to 35 right now.

6553
04:07:55,840 --> 04:07:57,359
>> Okay. The member directory.

6554
04:07:57,359 --> 04:08:00,000
>> Yeah. So that lists all the members and

6555
04:08:00,000 --> 04:08:02,319
then um then if you want to see all the

6556
04:08:02,319 --> 04:08:05,040
other businesses then we have list of

6557
04:08:05,040 --> 04:08:06,960
all businesses on the other page.

6558
04:08:06,960 --> 04:08:09,279
>> So how many Alpine businesses do you

6559
04:08:09,279 --> 04:08:11,199
have that are currently members? So I

6560
04:08:11,199 --> 04:08:12,720
assume they've signed up and they've

6561
04:08:12,720 --> 04:08:13,600
paid their dues.

6562
04:08:13,600 --> 04:08:15,199
>> Right. Right. There's four that have

6563
04:08:15,199 --> 04:08:16,560
signed up and paid their dues. There's

6564
04:08:16,560 --> 04:08:17,680
three that have committed that we

6565
04:08:17,680 --> 04:08:19,600
haven't quite got the signature on the

6566
04:08:19,600 --> 04:08:22,000
documents yet. So we're up to four

6567
04:08:22,000 --> 04:08:23,920
committed or three committed, four

6568
04:08:23,920 --> 04:08:26,399
signed up. There were several waiting on

6569
04:08:26,399 --> 04:08:27,680
if we were going to join, right?

6570
04:08:27,680 --> 04:08:30,319
>> Um I I have the impression that several

6571
04:08:30,319 --> 04:08:33,120
are waiting to see if Alpine City

6572
04:08:33,120 --> 04:08:34,319
supports it. Yeah.

6573
04:08:34,319 --> 04:08:37,279
>> And then can I ask the AF chamber? How

6574
04:08:37,279 --> 04:08:40,080
many businesses? If you if one of you

6575
04:08:40,080 --> 04:08:41,439
guys can come, how many Alpine

6576
04:08:41,439 --> 04:08:44,319
businesses do we have um that's part of

6577
04:08:44,319 --> 04:08:45,920
the chamber? And then how many total

6578
04:08:45,920 --> 04:08:47,680
businesses do you guys have that are

6579
04:08:47,680 --> 04:08:50,080
member of the AF chamber?

6580
04:08:50,080 --> 04:08:52,000
>> Brad Frost with the American For

6581
04:08:52,000 --> 04:08:53,439
Chamber.

6582
04:08:53,439 --> 04:08:58,239
We have at last count about 287

6583
04:08:58,239 --> 04:09:00,000
businesses in our chamber.

6584
04:09:00,000 --> 04:09:01,279
>> And then how many of those are from

6585
04:09:01,279 --> 04:09:01,920
Alpine?

6586
04:09:01,920 --> 04:09:05,510
>> I'm going to

6587
04:09:05,520 --> 04:09:07,439
» probably less than number.

6588
04:09:07,439 --> 04:09:09,199
>> Yes.

6589
04:09:09,199 --> 04:09:11,040
>> Okay. And Jessica, your motion doesn't

6590
04:09:11,040 --> 04:09:12,720
remove us from the American Fork

6591
04:09:12,720 --> 04:09:16,800
Chamber. Correct. Actually, it is to um

6592
04:09:16,800 --> 04:09:19,120
just to approve the membership because

6593
04:09:19,120 --> 04:09:21,359
right now we haven't approved the

6594
04:09:21,359 --> 04:09:23,920
membership in the AF chamber. Correct.

6595
04:09:23,920 --> 04:09:25,760
>> Okay.

6596
04:09:25,760 --> 04:09:26,479
>> Well, I think

6597
04:09:26,479 --> 04:09:27,760
>> I thought we were already part of the

6598
04:09:27,760 --> 04:09:29,040
>> They did were already part of it and

6599
04:09:29,040 --> 04:09:29,359
it's

6600
04:09:29,359 --> 04:09:30,479
>> I believe we're already part of it,

6601
04:09:30,479 --> 04:09:32,160
>> but Oh, I thought we were up for renewal

6602
04:09:32,160 --> 04:09:33,680
and we were looking at our budget.

6603
04:09:33,680 --> 04:09:35,359
>> No, that comes later, right? Doesn't

6604
04:09:35,359 --> 04:09:36,640
that come

6605
04:09:36,640 --> 04:09:37,120
>> Yeah.

6606
04:09:37,120 --> 04:09:38,720
>> So, it won't come till months away.

6607
04:09:38,720 --> 04:09:40,720
>> It'll come in like July 1st is the

6608
04:09:40,720 --> 04:09:43,520
renewal. Is that an automatic renewal?

6609
04:09:43,520 --> 04:09:45,760
>> It has been. Yeah. Since we joined like

6610
04:09:45,760 --> 04:09:47,600
what?

6611
04:09:47,600 --> 04:09:48,640
>> Yeah, it's been a while.

6612
04:09:48,640 --> 04:09:51,600
>> Okay. So, I would amend my motion to

6613
04:09:51,600 --> 04:09:56,160
include then to not renew the AF chamber

6614
04:09:56,160 --> 04:09:58,080
membership.

6615
04:09:58,080 --> 04:10:00,080
>> Do you second that because you're it's

6616
04:10:00,080 --> 04:10:01,680
part of the original motion.

6617
04:10:01,680 --> 04:10:05,600
>> Would you mind saying to re-evaluate it

6618
04:10:05,600 --> 04:10:07,680
in the coming months?

6619
04:10:07,680 --> 04:10:09,840
>> Absolutely. Yeah, I would reevaluate. I

6620
04:10:09,840 --> 04:10:11,279
just don't want an autorenew. I didn't

6621
04:10:11,279 --> 04:10:12,479
know we auto renewed.

6622
04:10:12,479 --> 04:10:15,439
>> Yeah, I turn auto evaluated every year.

6623
04:10:15,439 --> 04:10:17,279
>> It's never No, because we've never voted

6624
04:10:17,279 --> 04:10:18,080
on it since

6625
04:10:18,080 --> 04:10:20,399
>> about Jessica to reeal

6626
04:10:20,399 --> 04:10:21,520
until we have to make the decision,

6627
04:10:21,520 --> 04:10:23,680
>> right? Because I still think there is

6628
04:10:23,680 --> 04:10:24,560
one time.

6629
04:10:24,560 --> 04:10:26,239
>> Pardon? I apologize. Go ahead.

6630
04:10:26,239 --> 04:10:27,840
>> Okay. What was that?

6631
04:10:27,840 --> 04:10:30,080
>> To reevaluate upon renewal.

6632
04:10:30,080 --> 04:10:31,680
>> I would be in second of that

6633
04:10:31,680 --> 04:10:33,920
>> before renewal.

6634
04:10:33,920 --> 04:10:36,479
>> At renewal. To re-evaluate at renewal.

6635
04:10:36,479 --> 04:10:38,399
>> Right.

6636
04:10:38,399 --> 04:10:39,760
>> Okay. So is she saying

6637
04:10:39,760 --> 04:10:41,600
>> will you restate your motion? Does the

6638
04:10:41,600 --> 04:10:44,399
complete motion including the amendment

6639
04:10:44,399 --> 04:10:46,239
>> membership in the Highland Alpine

6640
04:10:46,239 --> 04:10:48,720
Chamber of Commerce and instruct staff

6641
04:10:48,720 --> 04:10:55,750
to budget funds to cover the expense

6642
04:10:55,760 --> 04:10:59,439
and to evaluate.

6643
04:10:59,439 --> 04:11:02,479
talk about the threeyear lock on

6644
04:11:02,479 --> 04:11:04,880
>> and to lock the three-year pricing and

6645
04:11:04,880 --> 04:11:07,199
to lock the membership rate for the next

6646
04:11:07,199 --> 04:11:13,040
three years and to evaluate

6647
04:11:13,040 --> 04:11:15,439
the American Fork Chamber membership at

6648
04:11:15,439 --> 04:11:17,199
the time of renewal.

6649
04:11:17,199 --> 04:11:18,160
>> I second that.

6650
04:11:18,160 --> 04:11:18,960
>> Okay.

6651
04:11:18,960 --> 04:11:21,439
Got a motion by Councilwoman

6652
04:11:21,439 --> 04:11:24,319
Smeuan, seconded by Councilman

6653
04:11:24,319 --> 04:11:26,720
Young.

6654
04:11:26,720 --> 04:11:28,560
Let's I'm gonna assume I'm going to call

6655
04:11:28,560 --> 04:11:31,279
for a vote. Sorry. Go ahead. Jessica

6656
04:11:31,279 --> 04:11:33,760
Simone, yes. Sarah Blackwell, no.

6657
04:11:33,760 --> 04:11:35,359
>> Chrissy Hammond, no.

6658
04:11:35,359 --> 04:11:37,279
>> Andrew Young, yes.

6659
04:11:37,279 --> 04:11:39,680
>> Brent Rmler, yes.

6660
04:11:39,680 --> 04:11:42,239
>> Okay, motion passes.

6661
04:11:42,239 --> 04:11:45,680
Um, let's see. Public safety district

6662
04:11:45,680 --> 04:11:51,990
budget. We're moving on.

6663
04:11:52,000 --> 04:11:53,520
» Thank you for staying through a long

6664
04:11:53,520 --> 04:12:01,830
meeting.

6665
04:12:01,840 --> 04:12:05,520
No, we got to get through this.

6666
04:12:05,520 --> 04:12:08,720
>> Okay, Shane.

6667
04:12:08,720 --> 04:12:15,910
>> She can.

6668
04:12:15,920 --> 04:12:18,534
» Yeah. Lone peak budget.

6669
04:12:18,534 --> 04:12:21,269
[clears throat]

6670
04:12:21,279 --> 04:12:24,000
is the

6671
04:12:24,000 --> 04:12:26,399
MVP of this meeting.

6672
04:12:26,399 --> 04:12:27,760
>> Okay, you ready, Mayor?

6673
04:12:27,760 --> 04:12:29,439
>> Yes. Let's move on.

6674
04:12:29,439 --> 04:12:32,239
>> Okay. Uh at the April 1st uh board

6675
04:12:32,239 --> 04:12:33,920
meeting, Lone Peak Public Safety

6676
04:12:33,920 --> 04:12:37,199
District uh heard a proposal for the

6677
04:12:37,199 --> 04:12:41,840
FY27 tenative budget. Um, this included

6678
04:12:41,840 --> 04:12:44,800
the board approved a motion

6679
04:12:44,800 --> 04:12:47,120
uh which included a 5% wage increase,

6680
04:12:47,120 --> 04:12:49,840
funding for a sergeant position,

6681
04:12:49,840 --> 04:12:52,800
and an additional 20,000 for

6682
04:12:52,800 --> 04:12:55,680
implementing AI technology into police

6683
04:12:55,680 --> 04:12:57,520
reports.

6684
04:12:57,520 --> 04:13:00,080
Um, we've included the staff report uh

6685
04:13:00,080 --> 04:13:04,239
from the Lone Peak uh meeting in this

6686
04:13:04,239 --> 04:13:06,159
packet.

6687
04:13:06,159 --> 04:13:09,439
Um this budget will be the first one

6688
04:13:09,439 --> 04:13:11,760
where the new fire funding formula takes

6689
04:13:11,760 --> 04:13:14,560
place. And if you remember um it was

6690
04:13:14,560 --> 04:13:16,880
agreed to

6691
04:13:16,880 --> 04:13:21,359
do a a 50% step in uh to this so that

6692
04:13:21,359 --> 04:13:24,319
there'll be a little less impact to us

6693
04:13:24,319 --> 04:13:26,880
uh the first year because it will be an

6694
04:13:26,880 --> 04:13:29,040
increase for us.

6695
04:13:29,040 --> 04:13:31,439
Um, and the way that is proposed to be

6696
04:13:31,439 --> 04:13:34,640
handled is that uh each city would

6697
04:13:34,640 --> 04:13:38,720
receive a check for uh we we'd receive a

6698
04:13:38,720 --> 04:13:41,040
check for 50% of our increase for this

6699
04:13:41,040 --> 04:13:43,760
year if we're comparing the previous

6700
04:13:43,760 --> 04:13:46,800
funding formula to to the newly adopted

6701
04:13:46,800 --> 04:13:49,840
one. And then Highland would receive a

6702
04:13:49,840 --> 04:13:51,920
check from the Lone Peak fund balance

6703
04:13:51,920 --> 04:13:55,680
for uh kind of a prorated share of that

6704
04:13:55,680 --> 04:13:58,319
compared to what they have put in uh

6705
04:13:58,319 --> 04:14:00,159
previously

6706
04:14:00,159 --> 04:14:03,359
uh through their funding.

6707
04:14:03,359 --> 04:14:05,120
Um

6708
04:14:05,120 --> 04:14:06,720
compared to the the current year's

6709
04:14:06,720 --> 04:14:08,479
budget, the assessment for

6710
04:14:08,479 --> 04:14:11,279
administration for Alpine will increase

6711
04:14:11,279 --> 04:14:15,680
by uh 18,659

6712
04:14:15,680 --> 04:14:19,359
or for a 15.4% 4% increase. Police will

6713
04:14:19,359 --> 04:14:22,399
increase by 74,787

6714
04:14:22,399 --> 04:14:26,640
for a 4.9% increase. And fire would

6715
04:14:26,640 --> 04:14:31,670
increase by 361,962.

6716
04:14:31,680 --> 04:14:35,040
That does not include the 50% check that

6717
04:14:35,040 --> 04:14:38,399
will be cut back. Um

6718
04:14:38,399 --> 04:14:42,640
so the total combined increase 45548

6719
04:14:42,640 --> 04:14:46,960
which again is we'll we'll get about

6720
04:14:46,960 --> 04:14:49,199
Uh

6721
04:14:49,199 --> 04:14:51,760
I think it's about 180,000

6722
04:14:51,760 --> 04:14:55,680
back 143. Yeah.

6723
04:14:55,680 --> 04:14:58,319
Okay. Um

6724
04:14:58,319 --> 04:15:00,080
so the reason this is here in the

6725
04:15:00,080 --> 04:15:02,319
interlocal agreement there's a a

6726
04:15:02,319 --> 04:15:04,960
provision that uh states the annual

6727
04:15:04,960 --> 04:15:06,720
budget increase or decrease for the

6728
04:15:06,720 --> 04:15:08,319
district shall not exceed the average

6729
04:15:08,319 --> 04:15:10,000
property tax revenue increase or

6730
04:15:10,000 --> 04:15:13,359
decrease for both cities budgets of the

6731
04:15:13,359 --> 04:15:15,920
previous fiscal year excluding any new

6732
04:15:15,920 --> 04:15:18,560
revenue increases without the majority

6733
04:15:18,560 --> 04:15:22,000
vote of each city council. said vote of

6734
04:15:22,000 --> 04:15:24,159
each city council shall occur prior to

6735
04:15:24,159 --> 04:15:26,800
the adoption of the final budget. Um so

6736
04:15:26,800 --> 04:15:29,359
we're a month in ad with lone peak we're

6737
04:15:29,359 --> 04:15:31,279
a month in advance of our city budgets

6738
04:15:31,279 --> 04:15:33,279
and that's so that we can have those

6739
04:15:33,279 --> 04:15:37,520
numbers um for our tenative and final

6740
04:15:37,520 --> 04:15:40,479
budget.

6741
04:15:40,479 --> 04:15:42,720
Um

6742
04:15:42,720 --> 04:15:44,960
so this is before our council tonight.

6743
04:15:44,960 --> 04:15:47,359
It will be before the Highland City

6744
04:15:47,359 --> 04:15:48,960
Council on the 21st. Is that still

6745
04:15:48,960 --> 04:15:52,080
correct, Aaron? And Aaron is here. Um,

6746
04:15:52,080 --> 04:15:55,520
she she knows the most about the very

6747
04:15:55,520 --> 04:16:00,880
intricate details of this. Um, so the

6748
04:16:00,880 --> 04:16:05,120
budget is in the in the packet

6749
04:16:05,120 --> 04:16:08,720
um that was edited just a little bit uh

6750
04:16:08,720 --> 04:16:11,040
after the meeting after it was approved

6751
04:16:11,040 --> 04:16:14,880
to include a couple of changes. So, um,

6752
04:16:14,880 --> 04:16:17,279
you're seeing what was approved that day

6753
04:16:17,279 --> 04:16:22,000
and the numbers related to it.

6754
04:16:22,000 --> 04:16:23,520
Erin,

6755
04:16:23,520 --> 04:16:25,199
she just came out of a long meeting,

6756
04:16:25,199 --> 04:16:28,319
too. So,

6757
04:16:28,319 --> 04:16:29,760
>> yeah. [laughter]

6758
04:16:29,760 --> 04:16:32,640
>> Not as long as ours.

6759
04:16:32,640 --> 04:16:34,479
>> Who knows? Maybe they started at four.

6760
04:16:34,479 --> 04:16:37,040
Who knows?

6761
04:16:37,040 --> 04:16:39,840
>> We could move ours to four.

6762
04:16:39,840 --> 04:16:45,030
>> I'd be for it.

6763
04:16:45,040 --> 04:16:47,120
Is there any questions related to this

6764
04:16:47,120 --> 04:16:48,880
budget or Erin, do you have anything to

6765
04:16:48,880 --> 04:16:55,189
add? Chief,

6766
04:16:55,199 --> 04:16:57,359
» hey, Jessica's not here, so we'll start

6767
04:16:57,359 --> 04:16:58,319
with Sarah.

6768
04:16:58,319 --> 04:16:59,680
>> Okay. First of all, I just have to

6769
04:16:59,680 --> 04:17:01,279
commend the council members serving on

6770
04:17:01,279 --> 04:17:02,960
the Lone Peak Safety District. I

6771
04:17:02,960 --> 04:17:04,399
attended the meeting where this was

6772
04:17:04,399 --> 04:17:07,279
discussed and I understand that um we

6773
04:17:07,279 --> 04:17:10,159
are all on the same team like the city,

6774
04:17:10,159 --> 04:17:12,560
the elected officials, the police, the

6775
04:17:12,560 --> 04:17:15,359
fire, any city employee, we're all just

6776
04:17:15,359 --> 04:17:16,800
trying to do our best and make sure that

6777
04:17:16,800 --> 04:17:19,520
the cities are safe and that things are

6778
04:17:19,520 --> 04:17:21,840
working. And so when we get to these

6779
04:17:21,840 --> 04:17:23,840
types of discussions, it can be a little

6780
04:17:23,840 --> 04:17:26,319
emotional, maybe sensitive. And so I

6781
04:17:26,319 --> 04:17:28,399
just really appreciate the due diligence

6782
04:17:28,399 --> 04:17:31,680
of um Councilman Rumbler and

6783
04:17:31,680 --> 04:17:33,199
Councilwoman

6784
04:17:33,199 --> 04:17:36,319
um Haniman. Um they did a great job

6785
04:17:36,319 --> 04:17:38,800
representing our city at that meeting.

6786
04:17:38,800 --> 04:17:41,439
Um I know that an 8% was what was

6787
04:17:41,439 --> 04:17:45,840
proposed and they were able to um

6788
04:17:45,840 --> 04:17:48,239
discuss a 5%.

6789
04:17:48,239 --> 04:17:52,800
I I really admire and respect all of the

6790
04:17:52,800 --> 04:17:55,840
city officials and workers. I just when

6791
04:17:55,840 --> 04:17:58,880
I look at what the cola is, 5% still

6792
04:17:58,880 --> 04:18:04,800
seems a little high. And so I um I don't

6793
04:18:04,800 --> 04:18:07,120
want to discount what they do and I

6794
04:18:07,120 --> 04:18:09,279
don't want to discount the work that

6795
04:18:09,279 --> 04:18:11,680
these two council members put in in in

6796
04:18:11,680 --> 04:18:13,760
their educating themselves and then

6797
04:18:13,760 --> 04:18:15,279
negotiations.

6798
04:18:15,279 --> 04:18:18,000
I just still feel like and there's

6799
04:18:18,000 --> 04:18:21,120
pieces of information that we don't

6800
04:18:21,120 --> 04:18:23,359
have. We were comparing starting

6801
04:18:23,359 --> 04:18:25,520
salaries. we weren't looking at the

6802
04:18:25,520 --> 04:18:29,680
whole step in grade. The timing of the

6803
04:18:29,680 --> 04:18:32,159
proposal for a budget increase didn't

6804
04:18:32,159 --> 04:18:35,439
allow for a lot of um a lot of that

6805
04:18:35,439 --> 04:18:37,840
research to be done. So I mean one

6806
04:18:37,840 --> 04:18:39,439
thought I would have and I don't know if

6807
04:18:39,439 --> 04:18:43,359
this is even feasible is to have these

6808
04:18:43,359 --> 04:18:46,080
budget propo increases

6809
04:18:46,080 --> 04:18:50,080
um proposed a lot earlier so that there

6810
04:18:50,080 --> 04:18:52,000
can be enough due diligence and making

6811
04:18:52,000 --> 04:18:53,840
sure that we are comparing apples to

6812
04:18:53,840 --> 04:18:56,640
apples when we're comparing um to other

6813
04:18:56,640 --> 04:18:59,840
cities and other departments.

6814
04:18:59,840 --> 04:19:01,359
And

6815
04:19:01,359 --> 04:19:03,520
yeah so those are those are my comments.

6816
04:19:03,520 --> 04:19:06,720
I I I

6817
04:19:06,720 --> 04:19:08,640
feel like I lack enough information to

6818
04:19:08,640 --> 04:19:12,080
really make a a well- educated decision

6819
04:19:12,080 --> 04:19:15,120
on this because I haven't had enough

6820
04:19:15,120 --> 04:19:17,040
time to do as much due diligence as I

6821
04:19:17,040 --> 04:19:20,720
would have liked. So, I mean 5% still

6822
04:19:20,720 --> 04:19:24,800
seems pretty high. So, those are my

6823
04:19:24,800 --> 04:19:27,680
thoughts, but maybe Councilwoman Haniman

6824
04:19:27,680 --> 04:19:30,159
and Councilman Rumbler could, you know,

6825
04:19:30,159 --> 04:19:32,000
provide some insight and education for

6826
04:19:32,000 --> 04:19:33,920
me.

6827
04:19:33,920 --> 04:19:35,520
I see.

6828
04:19:35,520 --> 04:19:38,880
>> Okay. Um I appreciated all the work that

6829
04:19:38,880 --> 04:19:41,840
went into um coming up with what how we

6830
04:19:41,840 --> 04:19:43,520
handled it was there was an option one

6831
04:19:43,520 --> 04:19:45,920
which Sarah has referred to which was um

6832
04:19:45,920 --> 04:19:48,960
the original proposal by our staff and

6833
04:19:48,960 --> 04:19:50,640
then we just asked for what would it

6834
04:19:50,640 --> 04:19:52,800
look like if we took down just the cola

6835
04:19:52,800 --> 04:19:55,680
and did everything else um that was that

6836
04:19:55,680 --> 04:19:57,920
was requested. And so that was really

6837
04:19:57,920 --> 04:20:00,640
the only main difference um with a

6838
04:20:00,640 --> 04:20:04,800
couple of minor things in presentation

6839
04:20:04,800 --> 04:20:07,279
um at the meeting for those of you that

6840
04:20:07,279 --> 04:20:09,760
weren't there and I know Carla missed it

6841
04:20:09,760 --> 04:20:11,760
and you are a integral part of that

6842
04:20:11,760 --> 04:20:16,239
board um was that um I asked for

6843
04:20:16,239 --> 04:20:18,399
everyone to talk about how we were doing

6844
04:20:18,399 --> 04:20:20,720
the the repayment back because there

6845
04:20:20,720 --> 04:20:23,120
when I made the motion to approve the

6846
04:20:23,120 --> 04:20:24,720
change in the interlocal agreement we

6847
04:20:24,720 --> 04:20:27,920
said we'd uh take one year to step into

6848
04:20:27,920 --> 04:20:30,800
that by using fund balance. And so um

6849
04:20:30,800 --> 04:20:33,680
that was how that was fulfilled. Um and

6850
04:20:33,680 --> 04:20:36,560
it was so everyone agreed to that. And

6851
04:20:36,560 --> 04:20:38,880
then another thing was they talked about

6852
04:20:38,880 --> 04:20:41,920
was staffing. And so the police had um

6853
04:20:41,920 --> 04:20:44,159
looked originally their proposal was to

6854
04:20:44,159 --> 04:20:47,040
add two staff members but in the end

6855
04:20:47,040 --> 04:20:48,800
they went back and looked at some data

6856
04:20:48,800 --> 04:20:51,359
and came back with one would be good and

6857
04:20:51,359 --> 04:20:53,279
so everyone supported the additional

6858
04:20:53,279 --> 04:20:56,319
staff person. So part of the increase in

6859
04:20:56,319 --> 04:20:59,520
our funding um oh and then um what was

6860
04:20:59,520 --> 04:21:01,040
the other thing? So the those were the

6861
04:21:01,040 --> 04:21:03,760
three things um the change in the

6862
04:21:03,760 --> 04:21:07,279
interlocal agreement the the across the

6863
04:21:07,279 --> 04:21:09,680
board percentage increase and then the

6864
04:21:09,680 --> 04:21:12,159
staffing change and so all of those

6865
04:21:12,159 --> 04:21:15,120
things were uh supported um by the full

6866
04:21:15,120 --> 04:21:18,399
board. We were unanimous. So, one of the

6867
04:21:18,399 --> 04:21:19,760
thing that came out through the

6868
04:21:19,760 --> 04:21:23,600
discussion was um to look to the future

6869
04:21:23,600 --> 04:21:27,279
a little bit. And um the four things we

6870
04:21:27,279 --> 04:21:30,000
were going to look at was um our police

6871
04:21:30,000 --> 04:21:32,720
our our fire department has like a step

6872
04:21:32,720 --> 04:21:34,880
and grade chart so we can know what to

6873
04:21:34,880 --> 04:21:37,600
expect from year to year if everybody

6874
04:21:37,600 --> 04:21:40,159
stays in their current roles. And then

6875
04:21:40,159 --> 04:21:42,000
we asked the police to mirror that so

6876
04:21:42,000 --> 04:21:44,319
that we're sort of dealing with the same

6877
04:21:44,319 --> 04:21:46,720
discussion. Um and they're not just sort

6878
04:21:46,720 --> 04:21:50,399
of uh we're just in parallel. I guess we

6879
04:21:50,399 --> 04:21:52,000
also looked at we wanted to look at

6880
04:21:52,000 --> 04:21:55,040
benefits. Um I did notice in the

6881
04:21:55,040 --> 04:21:57,840
Highland city that they were actually um

6882
04:21:57,840 --> 04:21:59,199
looking I don't know what their final

6883
04:21:59,199 --> 04:22:02,640
vote was looking even at the 401k making

6884
04:22:02,640 --> 04:22:06,080
an opt out. Um, so that might be

6885
04:22:06,080 --> 04:22:08,239
something we were going to specifically

6886
04:22:08,239 --> 04:22:10,399
look at health benefits, but we might

6887
04:22:10,399 --> 04:22:12,319
look beyond that. I don't know. We'll

6888
04:22:12,319 --> 04:22:15,199
see. Um, another thing was just like we

6889
04:22:15,199 --> 04:22:16,319
went over our budget where we have

6890
04:22:16,319 --> 04:22:20,880
capital projects in a separate fund. We don't have that structure in our

6891
04:22:20,880 --> 04:22:23,760
budgeting at the Lone Peak um safety

6892
04:22:23,760 --> 04:22:25,120
district. So, we're going to go in that

6893
04:22:25,120 --> 04:22:27,920
direction too in the next year. And then

6894
04:22:27,920 --> 04:22:30,880
um quite a bit of discussion has been at

6895
04:22:30,880 --> 04:22:32,800
the end of the year talking about fund

6896
04:22:32,800 --> 04:22:34,896
balance and and ways to best

6897
04:22:34,896 --> 04:22:36,479
[clears throat] utilize that. So we're

6898
04:22:36,479 --> 04:22:38,560
going to look at that as well. So I do

6899
04:22:38,560 --> 04:22:40,560
think we accomplished a lot given our

6900
04:22:40,560 --> 04:22:44,159
short time frame and um that we're going

6901
04:22:44,159 --> 04:22:46,479
to try and set set ourselves up for a

6902
04:22:46,479 --> 04:22:53,359
better um expectation so to speak um and smooth out the process a little bit

6903
04:22:53,359 --> 04:22:55,439
better. I did want to point out I did

6904
04:22:55,439 --> 04:22:58,239
ask Aaron for this information and she

6905
04:22:58,239 --> 04:22:59,840
gave me the dollar value but the way

6906
04:22:59,840 --> 04:23:01,600
that this has been written up here in

6907
04:23:01,600 --> 04:23:04,080
our city I'll just use this because it's

6908
04:23:04,080 --> 04:23:08,479
handy. Um so this third paragraph if you

6909
04:23:08,479 --> 04:23:11,359
can you already showing that. So um

6910
04:23:11,359 --> 04:23:12,720
compared to the current year's budget

6911
04:23:12,720 --> 04:23:14,239
the assessment for administration will

6912
04:23:14,239 --> 04:23:17,439
be increased by a small amount which is

6913
04:23:17,439 --> 04:23:21,359
just a 15% increase. Um there's that

6914
04:23:21,359 --> 04:23:23,920
includes the 5% for wages and some other

6915
04:23:23,920 --> 04:23:26,479
services that went up. Then the police

6916
04:23:26,479 --> 04:23:30,880
will in be increased by that 74,000.

6917
04:23:30,880 --> 04:23:33,847
Um and that is for both um

6918
04:23:33,847 --> 04:23:36,000
[clears throat] that is for both the the

6919
04:23:36,000 --> 04:23:39,120
um staffing and the percentage increase.

6920
04:23:39,120 --> 04:23:41,120
And then fire is this huge whopping

6921
04:23:41,120 --> 04:23:43,359
number. But I want you guys to realize

6922
04:23:43,359 --> 04:23:46,479
that what Shane pointed out is that some

6923
04:23:46,479 --> 04:23:48,080
of that is because of the formula

6924
04:23:48,080 --> 04:23:50,800
change. Okay. So, and we're not eating

6925
04:23:50,800 --> 04:23:52,560
or or we're not absorbing all that in

6926
04:23:52,560 --> 04:23:53,840
this first year. We're getting this

6927
04:23:53,840 --> 04:23:55,840
refund that he mentioned. So, in

6928
04:23:55,840 --> 04:23:59,120
actuality, the the fire department is

6929
04:23:59,120 --> 04:24:02,239
only increasing 14.4%.

6930
04:24:02,239 --> 04:24:05,600
If you pull out um our refund, like

6931
04:24:05,600 --> 04:24:08,800
comparing more apples to apples without

6932
04:24:08,800 --> 04:24:10,560
the funding change, I should say without

6933
04:24:10,560 --> 04:24:12,159
the formula change, we would have only

6934
04:24:12,159 --> 04:24:13,760
it would have been mirrored to what the

6935
04:24:13,760 --> 04:24:15,199
police are getting is what I was trying

6936
04:24:15,199 --> 04:24:17,920
to say. Or closer, not not mirrored.

6937
04:24:17,920 --> 04:24:22,000
Okay. Um, and that was it. I think, uh,

6938
04:24:22,000 --> 04:24:24,080
I've learned a lot about police and

6939
04:24:24,080 --> 04:24:25,600
fire. Like I said in the meeting, I

6940
04:24:25,600 --> 04:24:26,880
don't have a lot of experience in this

6941
04:24:26,880 --> 04:24:29,120
at all. And I appreciate I went and

6942
04:24:29,120 --> 04:24:31,680
visited each of the stations and saw,

6943
04:24:31,680 --> 04:24:32,720
you know, just the day-to-day

6944
04:24:32,720 --> 04:24:34,640
operations, and they're very efficient,

6945
04:24:34,640 --> 04:24:36,720
and there's a lot of good camaraderie,

6946
04:24:36,720 --> 04:24:38,960
which is something that money can't buy.

6947
04:24:38,960 --> 04:24:40,880
And I appreciate the leadership of these

6948
04:24:40,880 --> 04:24:43,279
two men here. They sit here quietly,

6949
04:24:43,279 --> 04:24:46,720
patiently through our meetings

6950
04:24:46,720 --> 04:24:49,359
and they do a lot of good work. Um, like

6951
04:24:49,359 --> 04:24:51,120
I've said before, the most important

6952
04:24:51,120 --> 04:24:53,520
part of um, you know, whether I was

6953
04:24:53,520 --> 04:24:55,439
talking about businesses that it's uh,

6954
04:24:55,439 --> 04:24:57,920
that creating employment is most

6955
04:24:57,920 --> 04:24:59,840
important part of a business, but

6956
04:24:59,840 --> 04:25:02,080
creating a place that a place that

6957
04:25:02,080 --> 04:25:04,560
people want to work is really important

6958
04:25:04,560 --> 04:25:07,279
in public service. And that is a a good

6959
04:25:07,279 --> 04:25:09,520
big part of what they do. and I didn't

6960
04:25:09,520 --> 04:25:11,279
want to them to feel like that we were

6961
04:25:11,279 --> 04:25:14,080
diminishing their um success by the

6962
04:25:14,080 --> 04:25:15,920
percentage and I feel like it's been

6963
04:25:15,920 --> 04:25:17,920
accept it's been acceptable that way.

6964
04:25:17,920 --> 04:25:21,268
So, thank you guys. And that's it.

6965
04:25:21,268 --> 04:25:22,560
[clears throat] And thank Aaron for all

6966
04:25:22,560 --> 04:25:25,199
her work. She's she like Shane is

6967
04:25:25,199 --> 04:25:27,600
understaffed and so she's filling

6968
04:25:27,600 --> 04:25:30,960
wearing lots of hats. So, I I appreciate

6969
04:25:30,960 --> 04:25:32,560
our city employees for being so

6970
04:25:32,560 --> 04:25:33,920
talented, such talented people.

6971
04:25:33,920 --> 04:25:35,678
>> I agree. I agree. That's really nice.

6972
04:25:35,678 --> 04:25:36,319
[clears throat]

6973
04:25:36,319 --> 04:25:39,439
Um just a couple things. I know this. I

6974
04:25:39,439 --> 04:25:41,680
know why they want the money increase

6975
04:25:41,680 --> 04:25:43,120
because they have to sit through these

6976
04:25:43,120 --> 04:25:46,319
meetings every week as a joke. They're

6977
04:25:46,319 --> 04:25:49,359
not laughing. No, I'm kidding. Um yeah,

6978
04:25:49,359 --> 04:25:52,080
I really appreciate you guys uh um

6979
04:25:52,080 --> 04:25:54,159
everything you've done. Uh I have a

6980
04:25:54,159 --> 04:25:55,920
couple questions for him. Is that okay

6981
04:25:55,920 --> 04:25:59,040
to ask you guys? Is that okay? They're

6982
04:25:59,040 --> 04:26:00,640
looking at me like

6983
04:26:00,640 --> 04:26:02,800
>> uh you don't have to. If you It's up to

6984
04:26:02,800 --> 04:26:03,840
you.

6985
04:26:03,840 --> 04:26:05,520
>> Um

6986
04:26:05,520 --> 04:26:07,680
>> if you don't want to, you don't have to.

6987
04:26:07,680 --> 04:26:09,920
It's not recorded in our like

6988
04:26:09,920 --> 04:26:11,920
>> I'm born and raised to respect police

6989
04:26:11,920 --> 04:26:14,640
officers and fire chiefs. So, if you'd

6990
04:26:14,640 --> 04:26:16,239
be willing, I'd just love to ask a

6991
04:26:16,239 --> 04:26:17,279
couple things that will help me

6992
04:26:17,279 --> 04:26:19,279
understand this. Um, feel free to come

6993
04:26:19,279 --> 04:26:22,239
up if you want to answer them. Um, like

6994
04:26:22,239 --> 04:26:28,960
at the end of everything uh like maybe you could tell us why what

6995
04:26:28,960 --> 04:26:31,520
you want why you need this why why we

6996
04:26:31,520 --> 04:26:35,359
need this uh increase. Uh because we had

6997
04:26:35,359 --> 04:26:37,199
a meeting before

6998
04:26:37,199 --> 04:26:39,040
you know, our first meeting, which I

6999
04:26:39,040 --> 04:26:41,840
think is aging really well, um, and

7000
04:26:41,840 --> 04:26:43,680
everything that was said when the when

7001
04:26:43,680 --> 04:26:45,520
the ILA

7002
04:26:45,520 --> 04:26:48,960
came up, I I I recommend watching that

7003
04:26:48,960 --> 04:26:51,439
because here we are again. Um, and it

7004
04:26:51,439 --> 04:26:52,560
keeps happening and I think it's

7005
04:26:52,560 --> 04:26:54,560
happening over and over. Anyways, tell

7006
04:26:54,560 --> 04:26:58,000
us what tell us what the increase helps.

7007
04:26:58,000 --> 04:26:59,920
So, uh, the the two big things that

7008
04:26:59,920 --> 04:27:02,000
we're asking for in the police budget is

7009
04:27:02,000 --> 04:27:03,920
an increase in staffing, and that one

7010
04:27:03,920 --> 04:27:06,560
person is a a first-line supervisor

7011
04:27:06,560 --> 04:27:08,080
position

7012
04:27:08,080 --> 04:27:10,399
or a sergeant position in our case that

7013
04:27:10,399 --> 04:27:12,080
would be in uniform and would be out

7014
04:27:12,080 --> 04:27:15,040
supervising or be available to offer um

7015
04:27:15,040 --> 04:27:19,279
supervision and um recommendations and

7016
04:27:19,279 --> 04:27:21,439
be able to um keep us out of some

7017
04:27:21,439 --> 04:27:24,000
lawsuits. Hopefully uh they come with

7018
04:27:24,000 --> 04:27:25,760
experience, but this is a supervisory

7019
04:27:25,760 --> 04:27:27,680
position that would be in uniform uh

7020
04:27:27,680 --> 04:27:29,359
that would be supervising the the

7021
04:27:29,359 --> 04:27:31,040
officers on the road.

7022
04:27:31,040 --> 04:27:33,680
>> We currently have three patrol sergeants

7023
04:27:33,680 --> 04:27:39,439
and we are lacking about 54 hours in the week where we have no supervision

7024
04:27:39,439 --> 04:27:42,159
on the road. And so this is allowing us

7025
04:27:42,159 --> 04:27:45,840
to cover at least 40 of those 54 hours.

7026
04:27:45,840 --> 04:27:48,960
And so um we will revamp our schedule to

7027
04:27:48,960 --> 04:27:51,279
be able to close that gap. That's the

7028
04:27:51,279 --> 04:27:54,960
increase in that position there. The 5%

7029
04:27:54,960 --> 04:27:57,279
increase. Again, we came with an eight.

7030
04:27:57,279 --> 04:28:00,399
I think it was 8.7 is what we asked for.

7031
04:28:00,399 --> 04:28:02,080
8.4.

7032
04:28:02,080 --> 04:28:03,520
Again, it's late. You guys are keeping

7033
04:28:03,520 --> 04:28:06,800
us up late. It's past 10 o'clock. Um

7034
04:28:06,800 --> 04:28:09,520
when initially we asked for 8.4 uh%

7035
04:28:09,520 --> 04:28:12,399
which would get us to average

7036
04:28:12,399 --> 04:28:14,880
compared to our neighbors, meaning wage

7037
04:28:14,880 --> 04:28:17,439
wise. So, currently we find ourselves

7038
04:28:17,439 --> 04:28:21,840
8.4% behind our neighbors. And uh we've

7039
04:28:21,840 --> 04:28:24,319
been fortunate. There was a time during

7040
04:28:24,319 --> 04:28:28,560
um 2021 2022 where we were down 30% of

7041
04:28:28,560 --> 04:28:31,359
our staffing in the police department.

7042
04:28:31,359 --> 04:28:34,000
And so we've been able over that time

7043
04:28:34,000 --> 04:28:35,840
with the help of both city councils and

7044
04:28:35,840 --> 04:28:38,080
the and the board to be able to increase

7045
04:28:38,080 --> 04:28:40,159
our wages to to become competitive and

7046
04:28:40,159 --> 04:28:41,760
stay competitive where we aren't become

7047
04:28:41,760 --> 04:28:43,359
we are not a training ground where we're

7048
04:28:43,359 --> 04:28:47,040
losing officers to um other agencies.

7049
04:28:47,040 --> 04:28:48,880
And so what we're trying to do with this

7050
04:28:48,880 --> 04:28:51,359
increase of the 8.4% is stay competitive

7051
04:28:51,359 --> 04:28:55,920
so we're not losing people. Now we're at 5%. I think that's something

7052
04:28:55,920 --> 04:28:58,800
that we can deal with. I think as was

7053
04:28:58,800 --> 04:29:00,479
mentioned before, culture is a big part

7054
04:29:00,479 --> 04:29:02,800
of it. And I'm not saying we're the best

7055
04:29:02,800 --> 04:29:05,359
at everything, but I think we do an okay

7056
04:29:05,359 --> 04:29:07,600
job. Uh we have a great relationship

7057
04:29:07,600 --> 04:29:09,920
with the fire department. Uh we like to

7058
04:29:09,920 --> 04:29:12,239
poke and jab at each other and you know,

7059
04:29:12,239 --> 04:29:14,239
but we do have a wonderful working

7060
04:29:14,239 --> 04:29:17,439
relationship and that's important. Um

7061
04:29:17,439 --> 04:29:19,120
but those are the those are the asks

7062
04:29:19,120 --> 04:29:21,359
that we have and increasing a staff

7063
04:29:21,359 --> 04:29:23,120
member by one. Also there are onetime

7064
04:29:23,120 --> 04:29:27,279
costs with un uh with that are equipment

7065
04:29:27,279 --> 04:29:28,960
costs that come along with that that

7066
04:29:28,960 --> 04:29:30,319
will be included in this and that

7067
04:29:30,319 --> 04:29:31,439
includes one vehicle.

7068
04:29:31,439 --> 04:29:34,399
>> So does the 455 am I reading this right?

7069
04:29:34,399 --> 04:29:36,319
The 455k

7070
04:29:36,319 --> 04:29:39,920
increase the 14.4 increase that gets one

7071
04:29:39,920 --> 04:29:41,760
additional police officer and then a

7072
04:29:41,760 --> 04:29:43,680
raise of 5%.

7073
04:29:43,680 --> 04:29:45,600
>> Correct.

7074
04:29:45,600 --> 04:29:47,439
administration and a lot of other folks.

7075
04:29:47,439 --> 04:29:50,159
>> Yeah, let me be clear. So, the 5% is

7076
04:29:50,159 --> 04:29:52,720
average across the board. I think it

7077
04:29:52,720 --> 04:29:55,120
will be 5% on average. Some will get a

7078
04:29:55,120 --> 04:29:56,560
little more, some will get a bit a

7079
04:29:56,560 --> 04:29:58,560
little bit less depending on what their

7080
04:29:58,560 --> 04:29:59,279
positions are.

7081
04:29:59,279 --> 04:30:00,080
>> I've seen that

7082
04:30:00,080 --> 04:30:01,840
>> uh we did a wage study and we're going

7083
04:30:01,840 --> 04:30:04,399
to try and keep those

7084
04:30:04,399 --> 04:30:06,800
>> um comparative to where we were the

7085
04:30:06,800 --> 04:30:09,439
8.4%. Not everybody was going to get an

7086
04:30:09,439 --> 04:30:11,600
8.4% increase, but that was the average

7087
04:30:11,600 --> 04:30:13,520
of what we were looking for. So, we'll

7088
04:30:13,520 --> 04:30:15,120
be doing the same thing with the 5%.

7089
04:30:15,120 --> 04:30:18,319
>> Uh, the last questions are, um,

7090
04:30:18,319 --> 04:30:20,880
does this increase our ability to slow

7091
04:30:20,880 --> 04:30:23,199
traffic and ticket it? Like, do we get

7092
04:30:23,199 --> 04:30:25,040
our designated police officer that's up

7093
04:30:25,040 --> 04:30:28,560
here in Alpine just managing traffic?

7094
04:30:28,560 --> 04:30:30,239
>> So, again, this is a supervisory

7095
04:30:30,239 --> 04:30:33,439
position that when we had these

7096
04:30:33,439 --> 04:30:35,840
discussions before, his availability to

7097
04:30:35,840 --> 04:30:37,520
be on the road and take calls and

7098
04:30:37,520 --> 04:30:40,640
enforce traffic will be about 40%. The

7099
04:30:40,640 --> 04:30:42,960
rest of it will be in a supervisory

7100
04:30:42,960 --> 04:30:46,319
capacity approving reports, offering um

7101
04:30:46,319 --> 04:30:48,479
you know being on scene and with the

7102
04:30:48,479 --> 04:30:52,399
other officers and giving direction and making sure that things are working

7103
04:30:52,399 --> 04:30:53,600
the way they should be.

7104
04:30:53,600 --> 04:30:55,040
>> I know a lot of the residents were

7105
04:30:55,040 --> 04:30:57,199
asking for just one police officer even

7106
04:30:57,199 --> 04:30:59,359
we could hire them part-time to just

7107
04:30:59,359 --> 04:31:01,279
patrol traffic, try to help it slow down

7108
04:31:01,279 --> 04:31:02,880
like basically enforce it.

7109
04:31:02,880 --> 04:31:04,319
>> And we Yeah, we talked about this a

7110
04:31:04,319 --> 04:31:05,920
couple of months ago and again

7111
04:31:05,920 --> 04:31:07,040
>> and I appreciate everything you've done.

7112
04:31:07,040 --> 04:31:07,439
You

7113
04:31:07,439 --> 04:31:09,120
>> talk with that on a one-off. We we can

7114
04:31:09,120 --> 04:31:10,720
certainly have that discussion. So,

7115
04:31:10,720 --> 04:31:12,800
>> uh I was hoping this would do it, but uh

7116
04:31:12,800 --> 04:31:14,720
um does this increase our ability to do

7117
04:31:14,720 --> 04:31:17,040
fire mitigation at scale or is this just

7118
04:31:17,040 --> 04:31:18,399
on the police side?

7119
04:31:18,399 --> 04:31:21,600
>> So, uh I'm going to ask Chief Patton to

7120
04:31:21,600 --> 04:31:23,520
talk about fire. If I could just take

7121
04:31:23,520 --> 04:31:26,239
two seconds and just correct something.

7122
04:31:26,239 --> 04:31:26,880
>> Yeah, correct.

7123
04:31:26,880 --> 04:31:29,439
>> Councilwoman Hanman mentioned about uh

7124
04:31:29,439 --> 04:31:33,520
the 401k. So,

7125
04:31:33,520 --> 04:31:35,520
Loone Peak does not pay into social

7126
04:31:35,520 --> 04:31:37,920
security and there's not there's nothing

7127
04:31:37,920 --> 04:31:40,399
there for social security for us and our

7128
04:31:40,399 --> 04:31:43,199
employees. So, uh we do have a 401k

7129
04:31:43,199 --> 04:31:46,560
match that was offered several years ago

7130
04:31:46,560 --> 04:31:50,239
to kind of help bridge that gap. The

7131
04:31:50,239 --> 04:31:53,120
idea I think we're crossing paths here a

7132
04:31:53,120 --> 04:31:55,199
little bit. We're not asking I don't

7133
04:31:55,199 --> 04:31:56,800
think Highland City is asking to get rid

7134
04:31:56,800 --> 04:31:58,800
of the 401k and I think Erin might be

7135
04:31:58,800 --> 04:32:00,479
able to speak to this better, but having

7136
04:32:00,479 --> 04:32:02,239
been in part of those discussions. We

7137
04:32:02,239 --> 04:32:04,080
have employees that not that are not

7138
04:32:04,080 --> 04:32:06,880
taking advantage of that those funds.

7139
04:32:06,880 --> 04:32:09,199
And so we were going to ask we were

7140
04:32:09,199 --> 04:32:11,359
going to opt them in automatically and

7141
04:32:11,359 --> 04:32:13,680
they would have to request to opt out of

7142
04:32:13,680 --> 04:32:16,720
it, but I think that that option was

7143
04:32:16,720 --> 04:32:19,040
removed. Is that correct, Erin? Okay.

7144
04:32:19,040 --> 04:32:19,840
Yeah. So just

7145
04:32:19,840 --> 04:32:21,600
>> Yeah, I understood that. I didn't say it

7146
04:32:21,600 --> 04:32:23,279
very well. Thank you for explaining.

7147
04:32:23,279 --> 04:32:24,960
Yeah, I understood what was the

7148
04:32:24,960 --> 04:32:26,159
objective, but I don't know if it

7149
04:32:26,159 --> 04:32:26,720
passed.

7150
04:32:26,720 --> 04:32:27,520
>> Any other questions?

7151
04:32:27,520 --> 04:32:29,120
>> Oh, it did not pass. Okay, thank you.

7152
04:32:29,120 --> 04:32:30,560
>> The only one that was the only one I had

7153
04:32:30,560 --> 04:32:33,439
really like I mean I really respect you

7154
04:32:33,439 --> 04:32:38,399
and uh Chief Patton and uh um I I don't

7155
04:32:38,399 --> 04:32:41,199
see 5% raises in my industry just

7156
04:32:41,199 --> 04:32:42,720
automatically across the board. It's

7157
04:32:42,720 --> 04:32:44,479
always merit-based.

7158
04:32:44,479 --> 04:32:46,720
>> Like I come to them, oh, you want that?

7159
04:32:46,720 --> 04:32:49,120
Get us this. Um so that's the world I

7160
04:32:49,120 --> 04:32:50,880
live in. So I don't know much else. It's

7161
04:32:50,880 --> 04:32:52,000
actually worse than that. There usually

7162
04:32:52,000 --> 04:32:54,000
some curse words in the middle of it. Uh

7163
04:32:54,000 --> 04:32:58,159
but um at the end of it, what I am

7164
04:32:58,159 --> 04:33:02,159
getting an earful from every day is why

7165
04:33:02,159 --> 04:33:05,039
are these people speeding? So if this

7166
04:33:05,039 --> 04:33:07,279
doesn't help that tremendously, I don't

7167
04:33:07,279 --> 04:33:09,520
know how I can support it. If it does,

7168
04:33:09,520 --> 04:33:13,840
that's a easy it's an easy yes. Uh the

7169
04:33:13,840 --> 04:33:17,680
next one is the fear of fire uh coming

7170
04:33:17,680 --> 04:33:21,279
and the danger that we're arriving at.

7171
04:33:21,279 --> 04:33:24,480
Um does this give us like more resources

7172
04:33:24,480 --> 04:33:28,320
to do fire prevention because right now

7173
04:33:28,320 --> 04:33:31,199
we're like a tinder box um waiting to

7174
04:33:31,199 --> 04:33:34,639
strike um and we are getting rain which

7175
04:33:34,639 --> 04:33:36,799
makes this summer even more dangerous

7176
04:33:36,799 --> 04:33:39,119
but helpful for water. But, uh, so those

7177
04:33:39,119 --> 04:33:40,480
are like my two things that we're

7178
04:33:40,480 --> 04:33:42,639
looking well that I'm getting an earful

7179
04:33:42,639 --> 04:33:44,639
from. And so that would be the thing I

7180
04:33:44,639 --> 04:33:46,480
would have to tell the residents, hey,

7181
04:33:46,480 --> 04:33:50,480
look, the reason the police deserve, not

7182
04:33:50,480 --> 04:33:53,279
because you are amazing, just that and I

7183
04:33:53,279 --> 04:33:54,879
appreciate all the time you spent, but

7184
04:33:54,879 --> 04:33:56,480
not because of that, but because they

7185
04:33:56,480 --> 04:33:58,561
are solving the problem that you are

7186
04:33:58,561 --> 04:34:00,799
asking for, which is the speeding on

7187
04:34:00,799 --> 04:34:03,039
Alpine Highway or the Canyon Crest. And

7188
04:34:03,039 --> 04:34:04,959
they've done it so well that they not

7189
04:34:04,959 --> 04:34:07,119
only deserve this raise, but a bonus.

7190
04:34:07,119 --> 04:34:09,119
So, I I I will let Chief Patton address

7191
04:34:09,119 --> 04:34:11,199
the fire mitigation. Let me let me just

7192
04:34:11,199 --> 04:34:12,639
address the one other thing that's in

7193
04:34:12,639 --> 04:34:14,480
the budget, and that was um some money

7194
04:34:14,480 --> 04:34:16,480
that's been set aside for

7195
04:34:16,480 --> 04:34:20,719
>> some uh AI uh software that would allow

7196
04:34:20,719 --> 04:34:22,879
officers to be able to write the reports

7197
04:34:22,879 --> 04:34:24,719
in a much more efficient

7198
04:34:24,719 --> 04:34:27,439
>> fashion. I AI's obviously we're all

7199
04:34:27,439 --> 04:34:28,959
moving toward AI and that's hitting our

7200
04:34:28,959 --> 04:34:30,719
industry as well. Now, that's something

7201
04:34:30,719 --> 04:34:33,439
that's going to free up officers time

7202
04:34:33,439 --> 04:34:35,760
and in in so doing, they'll be able to

7203
04:34:35,760 --> 04:34:39,039
spend more time enforcing traffic. Um,

7204
04:34:39,039 --> 04:34:41,600
>> well, if that happens, so if that

7205
04:34:41,600 --> 04:34:43,039
happens, I'm your biggest advocate for

7206
04:34:43,039 --> 04:34:43,680
raises.

7207
04:34:43,680 --> 04:34:46,080
>> So, that's a that is a that will help us

7208
04:34:46,080 --> 04:34:47,920
do that. It's a force multiplier and

7209
04:34:47,920 --> 04:34:49,199
that's another thing that's been added

7210
04:34:49,199 --> 04:34:50,480
into this budget. So,

7211
04:34:50,480 --> 04:34:52,561
>> thank you, Chief. And thank you for find

7212
04:34:52,561 --> 04:34:54,879
helping find that boy who got lost this

7213
04:34:54,879 --> 04:34:56,160
week. Thank you for your team.

7214
04:34:56,160 --> 04:34:58,000
>> I did that myself. Yeah, you're welcome.

7215
04:34:58,000 --> 04:34:59,920
No, I had nothing to do with my folks.

7216
04:34:59,920 --> 04:35:01,359
>> I'm serious. We had an Alpine resident.

7217
04:35:01,359 --> 04:35:02,799
>> I still Brent. Okay.

7218
04:35:02,799 --> 04:35:05,119
>> On the wage study. Can that be converted

7219
04:35:05,119 --> 04:35:07,520
into a step and grade plan?

7220
04:35:07,520 --> 04:35:09,520
>> I I just feel like step and grade it

7221
04:35:09,520 --> 04:35:12,240
again. It gives us the ability to plan.

7222
04:35:12,240 --> 04:35:15,359
We don't have to get into

7223
04:35:15,359 --> 04:35:18,480
is it is it worth it? It's just a known.

7224
04:35:18,480 --> 04:35:20,959
>> So many many uh let me just quickly

7225
04:35:20,959 --> 04:35:22,719
address the step and grade plan. I have

7226
04:35:22,719 --> 04:35:25,119
put together not as comprehensive as

7227
04:35:25,119 --> 04:35:26,639
what the fire is having, but I put

7228
04:35:26,639 --> 04:35:28,799
together pay scales and stepping grade

7229
04:35:28,799 --> 04:35:31,039
twice since I've been the chief and

7230
04:35:31,039 --> 04:35:33,439
they've lasted for about two years and

7231
04:35:33,439 --> 04:35:35,439
then they've gotten rid of them. So, I

7232
04:35:35,439 --> 04:35:37,439
just quit doing them because we were

7233
04:35:37,439 --> 04:35:38,879
putting a lot of effort and time into

7234
04:35:38,879 --> 04:35:41,279
them and then they wasn't affordable and

7235
04:35:41,279 --> 04:35:42,561
it was something that they didn't want

7236
04:35:42,561 --> 04:35:45,359
to pay attention to anymore and so I

7237
04:35:45,359 --> 04:35:47,119
just got away from doing it. That's that

7238
04:35:47,119 --> 04:35:48,959
is something that we are working on.

7239
04:35:48,959 --> 04:35:51,199
Well, we'll be working on for next year.

7240
04:35:51,199 --> 04:35:53,039
we will come back with a step and grade.

7241
04:35:53,039 --> 04:35:54,959
>> Okay. And then when you talk about the

7242
04:35:54,959 --> 04:35:59,359
8.7 average, does that include the full

7243
04:35:59,359 --> 04:36:01,600
package? You know, you're saying to be

7244
04:36:01,600 --> 04:36:04,000
competitive, but we offer

7245
04:36:04,000 --> 04:36:05,920
>> that's just wages. That's not total

7246
04:36:05,920 --> 04:36:07,840
compensation. That's just wages.

7247
04:36:07,840 --> 04:36:09,439
>> Yeah. And I think just moving forward in

7248
04:36:09,439 --> 04:36:11,199
the future, it would be easier to

7249
04:36:11,199 --> 04:36:13,760
understand the full package.

7250
04:36:13,760 --> 04:36:15,760
>> I I agree with you. And that's that's a

7251
04:36:15,760 --> 04:36:21,199
part of the discussion that we had and I have it on my computer when we when I

7252
04:36:21,199 --> 04:36:23,359
left that meeting a couple of weeks ago.

7253
04:36:23,359 --> 04:36:25,600
Uh we started putting together a total

7254
04:36:25,600 --> 04:36:28,160
compensation package and I've got about

7255
04:36:28,160 --> 04:36:31,279
15 agencies that we've already gotten

7256
04:36:31,279 --> 04:36:32,561
information back from. But that's

7257
04:36:32,561 --> 04:36:35,119
>> just the cost of insurance just what

7258
04:36:35,119 --> 04:36:37,359
that's looking like and then balancing

7259
04:36:37,359 --> 04:36:40,561
it out. But my only comment is you you

7260
04:36:40,561 --> 04:36:42,639
know I appreciate both council members.

7261
04:36:42,639 --> 04:36:44,959
They spend a tremendous amount of time

7262
04:36:44,959 --> 04:36:47,920
and the mayor does too. And if I'm

7263
04:36:47,920 --> 04:36:49,439
understanding right, you all approve the

7264
04:36:49,439 --> 04:36:51,840
5% and you're just bringing it to us.

7265
04:36:51,840 --> 04:36:55,199
Yeah. So, I support um them in this

7266
04:36:55,199 --> 04:36:57,039
number if that's what they have

7267
04:36:57,039 --> 04:36:59,199
evaluated and said it's where we need to

7268
04:36:59,199 --> 04:37:03,269
be. So,

7269
04:37:03,279 --> 04:37:04,959
» yes, go ahead. After

7270
04:37:04,959 --> 04:37:05,840
>> Sorry.

7271
04:37:05,840 --> 04:37:07,760
>> And I wasn't planning I was going to

7272
04:37:07,760 --> 04:37:08,879
talk to you about this separately, but I

7273
04:37:08,879 --> 04:37:10,240
thought I'd just do it here. What's your

7274
04:37:10,240 --> 04:37:12,080
policy as far as where your officers

7275
04:37:12,080 --> 04:37:15,039
write reports? And the reason I ask is

7276
04:37:15,039 --> 04:37:17,680
I've seen them just a few times in the

7277
04:37:17,680 --> 04:37:18,879
last couple weeks where they're kind of

7278
04:37:18,879 --> 04:37:21,199
off the beaten path sitting. I'm I

7279
04:37:21,199 --> 04:37:22,320
assume that's where they're doing their

7280
04:37:22,320 --> 04:37:24,639
reports. Is it feasible for them to do

7281
04:37:24,639 --> 04:37:26,799
it in a place where they're visible as a

7282
04:37:26,799 --> 04:37:29,359
traffic speeding deterrent?

7283
04:37:29,359 --> 04:37:31,439
>> Yeah. And and some of them do do that.

7284
04:37:31,439 --> 04:37:34,561
When I was on patrol, I would sit uh on,

7285
04:37:34,561 --> 04:37:36,320
for example, I'd sit on Main Street and

7286
04:37:36,320 --> 04:37:38,879
try and catch up on reports. Um,

7287
04:37:38,879 --> 04:37:42,240
depending on what needs to be put into

7288
04:37:42,240 --> 04:37:43,920
the report, sometimes you can type type

7289
04:37:43,920 --> 04:37:46,080
a quick report while you're sitting, you

7290
04:37:46,080 --> 04:37:48,240
know, a little bit twisted like a

7291
04:37:48,240 --> 04:37:49,680
pretzel to type that out. But if you've

7292
04:37:49,680 --> 04:37:51,279
got something lengthy that we usually

7293
04:37:51,279 --> 04:37:53,199
have them come back to the the station

7294
04:37:53,199 --> 04:37:54,160
and do that, there's a few more

7295
04:37:54,160 --> 04:37:55,680
resources to be able to do that. But

7296
04:37:55,680 --> 04:37:58,400
there are there are ways to have them do

7297
04:37:58,400 --> 04:38:00,240
that while they're sitting where they're

7298
04:38:00,240 --> 04:38:02,160
visible and slowing slowing traffic

7299
04:38:02,160 --> 04:38:03,279
down. Yeah, I just happened to notice

7300
04:38:03,279 --> 04:38:05,600
the last two weeks one Highland as I was

7301
04:38:05,600 --> 04:38:07,920
driving home up on Alpine Highway, he he

7302
04:38:07,920 --> 04:38:10,639
the officer was quite a ways in and just

7303
04:38:10,639 --> 04:38:13,359
sitting. So clearly wasn't doing any

7304
04:38:13,359 --> 04:38:15,520
enforcement on Alpine Highway. And then

7305
04:38:15,520 --> 04:38:17,039
just last week there was one on Baitman

7306
04:38:17,039 --> 04:38:20,000
Lane up at the top by Cascade

7307
04:38:20,000 --> 04:38:22,000
>> where there's no enforcement to be done.

7308
04:38:22,000 --> 04:38:23,840
I assume there was a writing report. I

7309
04:38:23,840 --> 04:38:25,760
was wondering why they couldn't do it in

7310
04:38:25,760 --> 04:38:27,119
a place where there'd be at least a

7311
04:38:27,119 --> 04:38:27,920
traffic deter.

7312
04:38:27,920 --> 04:38:30,400
>> Yeah, you know that's cops are weird.

7313
04:38:30,400 --> 04:38:31,920
They don't like people sneaking up on

7314
04:38:31,920 --> 04:38:33,680
them and and so they they'll find a

7315
04:38:33,680 --> 04:38:34,959
place to back in

7316
04:38:34,959 --> 04:38:36,240
>> and it wasn't backed in. They don't want

7317
04:38:36,240 --> 04:38:38,639
to be it's just you have those and you

7318
04:38:38,639 --> 04:38:39,920
know as well as I do you play those

7319
04:38:39,920 --> 04:38:41,359
games you have the what if what ifs

7320
04:38:41,359 --> 04:38:42,000
whatifs

7321
04:38:42,000 --> 04:38:43,760
>> and the ambushing that goes on. Not that

7322
04:38:43,760 --> 04:38:45,199
it would ever happen here but that's

7323
04:38:45,199 --> 04:38:46,400
those are some games that they play but

7324
04:38:46,400 --> 04:38:46,879
there are certain

7325
04:38:46,879 --> 04:38:48,320
>> might be less likely on a busy street

7326
04:38:48,320 --> 04:38:50,320
than than true. Well

7327
04:38:50,320 --> 04:38:52,400
>> on a side street. I don't I'm trying not

7328
04:38:52,400 --> 04:38:53,600
trying to tell you how to do your job. I

7329
04:38:53,600 --> 04:38:54,240
just

7330
04:38:54,240 --> 04:38:55,359
>> I know that's a good that's a good

7331
04:38:55,359 --> 04:38:57,840
question though. We do and we do um ask

7332
04:38:57,840 --> 04:39:00,080
them to stay out as often as they can.

7333
04:39:00,080 --> 04:39:02,561
You know, having the doors visible,

7334
04:39:02,561 --> 04:39:04,160
especially on a street, certainly slows

7335
04:39:04,160 --> 04:39:05,119
traffic down

7336
04:39:05,119 --> 04:39:06,480
>> whether they're doing enforcement there

7337
04:39:06,480 --> 04:39:07,039
or not.

7338
04:39:07,039 --> 04:39:09,279
>> Exactly. All right. Thanks.

7339
04:39:09,279 --> 04:39:11,039
>> Okay. Any other Oh,

7340
04:39:11,039 --> 04:39:12,240
>> sorry. Sorry. Since you have one more

7341
04:39:12,240 --> 04:39:12,639
question.

7342
04:39:12,639 --> 04:39:15,520
>> Sorry, just one more question. Um with

7343
04:39:15,520 --> 04:39:18,160
this 5% increase, do you anticipate the

7344
04:39:18,160 --> 04:39:20,160
same increase year after year or just

7345
04:39:20,160 --> 04:39:22,639
till you get to like comparable?

7346
04:39:22,639 --> 04:39:25,039
>> We would like to get to average. So it

7347
04:39:25,039 --> 04:39:28,561
depends on what other now we were we

7348
04:39:28,561 --> 04:39:31,920
found ourselves 8.4% behind this year

7349
04:39:31,920 --> 04:39:34,480
>> fully expect every other every all of

7350
04:39:34,480 --> 04:39:36,320
our neighbors are going to move in July

7351
04:39:36,320 --> 04:39:38,718
like we are but what that number is I

7352
04:39:38,718 --> 04:39:44,000
guess we'll find out after July. So it certainly beats the 12 and 13% that

7353
04:39:44,000 --> 04:39:47,760
we were looking at back in 21 and 22. So

7354
04:39:47,760 --> 04:39:49,280
>> yeah, thank you. Appreciate that. Is

7355
04:39:49,280 --> 04:39:51,760
that the same for fire?

7356
04:39:51,760 --> 04:39:53,360
>> Thank you for your support while I'm up

7357
04:39:53,360 --> 04:39:54,878
here. Thank you for your support. It's

7358
04:39:54,878 --> 04:39:57,360
good to be in your council meetings

7359
04:39:57,360 --> 04:40:01,680
before 9:00 after that. And yeah,

7360
04:40:01,680 --> 04:40:03,760
>> thank you, Chief. Okay. Any questions

7361
04:40:03,760 --> 04:40:05,360
for the fire chief? Let's start with

7362
04:40:05,360 --> 04:40:06,560
Jessica.

7363
04:40:06,560 --> 04:40:08,718
>> Nope.

7364
04:40:08,718 --> 04:40:11,040
>> I guess the same thing. Is this a total

7365
04:40:11,040 --> 04:40:12,878
benefits package so that we're actually

7366
04:40:12,878 --> 04:40:14,718
comparing

7367
04:40:14,718 --> 04:40:17,360
averages including health insurance,

7368
04:40:17,360 --> 04:40:18,958
including retirement when we're looking

7369
04:40:18,958 --> 04:40:22,320
at bringing our departments up to

7370
04:40:22,320 --> 04:40:24,958
>> No, but Um, we haven't done that to that

7371
04:40:24,958 --> 04:40:28,160
to this point, but I'm looking forward

7372
04:40:28,160 --> 04:40:28,718
to it.

7373
04:40:28,718 --> 04:40:29,920
>> Okay.

7374
04:40:29,920 --> 04:40:33,360
>> So, um, can I just say something?

7375
04:40:33,360 --> 04:40:36,638
>> I know this is question time, but in six

7376
04:40:36,638 --> 04:40:38,480
days I will have been here for five

7377
04:40:38,480 --> 04:40:42,080
years as the chief kind of. That's when

7378
04:40:42,080 --> 04:40:44,000
I took over.

7379
04:40:44,000 --> 04:40:46,320
>> For five years, we have been chasing

7380
04:40:46,320 --> 04:40:49,440
wages. We had we were losing people in

7381
04:40:49,440 --> 04:40:53,360
droves. We have done so much work over

7382
04:40:53,360 --> 04:40:57,200
the past five years to get in the realm

7383
04:40:57,200 --> 04:41:01,840
of average. I have 2% five years never

7384
04:41:01,840 --> 04:41:03,760
wants a cola. We have been trying to

7385
04:41:03,760 --> 04:41:06,240
market adjust

7386
04:41:06,240 --> 04:41:09,600
on top of our wage scale to get to

7387
04:41:09,600 --> 04:41:12,240
average.

7388
04:41:12,240 --> 04:41:16,798
We will be I mean at 5% we're 5% behind.

7389
04:41:16,798 --> 04:41:19,680
So depending on how things move, we'll

7390
04:41:19,680 --> 04:41:21,760
be that far behind. I'll get those

7391
04:41:21,760 --> 04:41:24,400
numbers to you as as early as I mean

7392
04:41:24,400 --> 04:41:26,320
probably August, right? We'll know

7393
04:41:26,320 --> 04:41:27,840
exactly where we're at wage-wise in

7394
04:41:27,840 --> 04:41:31,190
August.

7395
04:41:31,200 --> 04:41:33,760
Having officers on the street, meaning

7396
04:41:33,760 --> 04:41:36,160
not being down 30%, having firefighters

7397
04:41:36,160 --> 04:41:37,680
in your fire station to fight your

7398
04:41:37,680 --> 04:41:39,200
fires,

7399
04:41:39,200 --> 04:41:41,200
that's the wage. That's the wage thing,

7400
04:41:41,200 --> 04:41:44,160
right? We're not creating what's

7401
04:41:44,160 --> 04:41:45,280
happening here. We're just trying to

7402
04:41:45,280 --> 04:41:46,638
deal with it. We're trying to keep

7403
04:41:46,638 --> 04:41:50,400
staffing at average. That's that's the

7404
04:41:50,400 --> 04:41:51,840
whole thing. I don't want to come with

7405
04:41:51,840 --> 04:41:54,560
5%. I don't want to come with 8% or 10%

7406
04:41:54,560 --> 04:41:57,360
or 12% like we were.

7407
04:41:57,360 --> 04:42:00,000
If we want to have firefighters,

7408
04:42:00,000 --> 04:42:01,920
we got to compete in the market. When

7409
04:42:01,920 --> 04:42:04,718
you can go next door and get a $15,000 a

7410
04:42:04,718 --> 04:42:07,760
year raise, it's irresponsible

7411
04:42:07,760 --> 04:42:11,520
for my firefighters to not do that. So,

7412
04:42:11,520 --> 04:42:14,240
just that's where we're coming from.

7413
04:42:14,240 --> 04:42:16,160
whatever whatever we want to call it,

7414
04:42:16,160 --> 04:42:18,240
whether it's a total compensation,

7415
04:42:18,240 --> 04:42:19,840
whether it's we're just looking at

7416
04:42:19,840 --> 04:42:22,400
wages, whatever it is, we need to be

7417
04:42:22,400 --> 04:42:24,240
able to be competitive if we want to

7418
04:42:24,240 --> 04:42:26,080
have these services [snorts] to offer

7419
04:42:26,080 --> 04:42:27,120
the residents.

7420
04:42:27,120 --> 04:42:29,440
>> You because that they they leave if you

7421
04:42:29,440 --> 04:42:30,160
don't pay them.

7422
04:42:30,160 --> 04:42:32,798
>> Absolutely. How can they not? It's the

7423
04:42:32,798 --> 04:42:35,520
same job. Lehi is the same job. More

7424
04:42:35,520 --> 04:42:39,600
manpower, safer environment, more calls.

7425
04:42:39,600 --> 04:42:42,000
like everything's I mean when you start

7426
04:42:42,000 --> 04:42:44,080
looking at your positives

7427
04:42:44,080 --> 04:42:47,280
plus you know10 to 15,000 more a year I

7428
04:42:47,280 --> 04:42:50,080
don't know why they're here right this

7429
04:42:50,080 --> 04:42:53,520
is not a safe operating environment in

7430
04:42:53,520 --> 04:42:55,040
the fire world

7431
04:42:55,040 --> 04:42:57,600
>> right we're going at it wildly

7432
04:42:57,600 --> 04:43:00,080
understaffed

7433
04:43:00,080 --> 04:43:04,320
I mean 40 50,000 square foot homes in

7434
04:43:04,320 --> 04:43:05,680
the urban interface

7435
04:43:05,680 --> 04:43:06,240
>> yeah I know

7436
04:43:06,240 --> 04:43:08,000
>> there's not another city around us

7437
04:43:08,000 --> 04:43:09,440
that's dealing with the issues isues

7438
04:43:09,440 --> 04:43:11,200
that we're dealing with it and we're

7439
04:43:11,200 --> 04:43:15,280
dealing with it understaffed way way

7440
04:43:15,280 --> 04:43:17,840
more dangerous. I mean, I fought I

7441
04:43:17,840 --> 04:43:19,760
fought fire in Pleasant Grove for 21

7442
04:43:19,760 --> 04:43:21,520
years.

7443
04:43:21,520 --> 04:43:23,760
Maybe a five or six thousand square foot

7444
04:43:23,760 --> 04:43:25,520
home is the biggest thing I've ever been

7445
04:43:25,520 --> 04:43:29,360
in as far as a as a firefight. And it's

7446
04:43:29,360 --> 04:43:31,120
five or six thousand square feet is a

7447
04:43:31,120 --> 04:43:32,160
big firefight.

7448
04:43:32,160 --> 04:43:33,040
>> Yeah.

7449
04:43:33,040 --> 04:43:36,798
>> Right. And our staffing was seven at the

7450
04:43:36,798 --> 04:43:37,840
station.

7451
04:43:37,840 --> 04:43:40,000
>> Would you guys Oh, sorry. It's not my

7452
04:43:40,000 --> 04:43:40,878
question time. Go ahead.

7453
04:43:40,878 --> 04:43:42,400
>> I don't know if he's done.

7454
04:43:42,400 --> 04:43:49,200
>> Anyways, we have 3% in merit, 2% or the original 5% that we were asking for.

7455
04:43:49,200 --> 04:43:51,600
We knew it was going to land us below

7456
04:43:51,600 --> 04:43:54,080
average right after [clears throat] on

7457
04:43:54,080 --> 04:43:58,240
July 2nd if you will, but 2% is going

7458
04:43:58,240 --> 04:43:59,840
towards

7459
04:43:59,840 --> 04:44:01,920
trying to I mean we'll put it where we

7460
04:44:01,920 --> 04:44:05,280
can as far as market to try to stay you

7461
04:44:05,280 --> 04:44:07,040
know we've got some some that are lower

7462
04:44:07,040 --> 04:44:08,958
than others and we'll put the put a

7463
04:44:08,958 --> 04:44:10,320
little bit more money in the low ones

7464
04:44:10,320 --> 04:44:14,080
and you know so

7465
04:44:14,080 --> 04:44:16,000
>> if I can just explain a little bit of

7466
04:44:16,000 --> 04:44:18,000
the difference between a step in grade

7467
04:44:18,000 --> 04:44:20,160
and cost of living allowance increases

7468
04:44:20,160 --> 04:44:22,400
as coming from the federal government

7469
04:44:22,400 --> 04:44:24,400
where there was a step in grade process

7470
04:44:24,400 --> 04:44:26,878
and you had in our case there were

7471
04:44:26,878 --> 04:44:28,480
automatic grazes that were built into

7472
04:44:28,480 --> 04:44:29,920
the budget for these departments. So for

7473
04:44:29,920 --> 04:44:32,320
example the FBI if I increase from a

7474
04:44:32,320 --> 04:44:36,320
grade 12 to 13 step one and then the

7475
04:44:36,320 --> 04:44:38,400
next year to step two that's automatic

7476
04:44:38,400 --> 04:44:40,320
their grade step and grade system is not

7477
04:44:40,320 --> 04:44:41,680
automatic. It's dependent on these

7478
04:44:41,680 --> 04:44:44,480
raises. So, I also, as a federal

7479
04:44:44,480 --> 04:44:46,718
employee, got cost of living raises, and

7480
04:44:46,718 --> 04:44:48,320
that's determined by Congress and the

7481
04:44:48,320 --> 04:44:50,878
president. This year, the president is

7482
04:44:50,878 --> 04:44:53,120
uh proposing 0% is probably what it's

7483
04:44:53,120 --> 04:44:56,480
going to be. Um, but there's still that

7484
04:44:56,480 --> 04:44:59,120
step in grade increase. Now, the step-in

7485
04:44:59,120 --> 04:45:01,920
grade increase is only applicable every

7486
04:45:01,920 --> 04:45:04,000
year for steps one through three, and

7487
04:45:04,000 --> 04:45:06,080
then it's every two years for four

7488
04:45:06,080 --> 04:45:09,600
through seven or six, four, five, six or

7489
04:45:09,600 --> 04:45:12,240
seven. And then it's every three years

7490
04:45:12,240 --> 04:45:14,638
for up to step 10 in the grade you're

7491
04:45:14,638 --> 04:45:17,360
in. So, as I explained in the meeting

7492
04:45:17,360 --> 04:45:20,240
last a couple weeks ago, for my last

7493
04:45:20,240 --> 04:45:22,480
eight years, I was maxed out because I

7494
04:45:22,480 --> 04:45:24,560
took the transfer to Salt Lake City out

7495
04:45:24,560 --> 04:45:26,320
of Denver that required me to step down

7496
04:45:26,320 --> 04:45:28,320
out of my management position and I was

7497
04:45:28,320 --> 04:45:31,200
at a 13 grade step 10. So, I didn't get

7498
04:45:31,200 --> 04:45:33,760
any step increases for eight years, but

7499
04:45:33,760 --> 04:45:35,680
I got the cost of living raises and they

7500
04:45:35,680 --> 04:45:37,200
were very, very meager for those 10

7501
04:45:37,200 --> 04:45:38,718
years. or eight years from now in the

7502
04:45:38,718 --> 04:45:40,718
last couple years by me except during co

7503
04:45:40,718 --> 04:45:42,718
when inflation increased and congress

7504
04:45:42,718 --> 04:45:45,200
gave them higher so just understanding

7505
04:45:45,200 --> 04:45:48,240
the difference yes 5% seems like a lot

7506
04:45:48,240 --> 04:45:51,280
as a cola based

7507
04:45:51,280 --> 04:45:53,360
and you do we do I think we also should

7508
04:45:53,360 --> 04:45:56,480
compare it to the the public sector be

7509
04:45:56,480 --> 04:45:58,718
the private sector because they also

7510
04:45:58,718 --> 04:46:06,560
have to look at experience levels and increases in wages and benefits for experience increases and that's what

7511
04:46:06,560 --> 04:46:10,798
that stepping grade is it's you're compensating more for increases

7512
04:46:10,798 --> 04:46:13,440
in experience. So, it's not just cola,

7513
04:46:13,440 --> 04:46:16,080
it's it's a firefighter who has taken

7514
04:46:16,080 --> 04:46:18,080
the requisite steps, additional

7515
04:46:18,080 --> 04:46:20,638
training, um additional collateral or

7516
04:46:20,638 --> 04:46:24,160
extra duties um to get to that next step

7517
04:46:24,160 --> 04:46:27,040
in in their step in grade process. So,

7518
04:46:27,040 --> 04:46:28,320
it's important to understand the

7519
04:46:28,320 --> 04:46:32,000
difference between the private sector um

7520
04:46:32,000 --> 04:46:33,520
where you're just looking at average

7521
04:46:33,520 --> 04:46:37,280
wages and looking at compensating for

7522
04:46:37,280 --> 04:46:40,400
increases in in value to the community

7523
04:46:40,400 --> 04:46:42,638
as well as the cost of living increases.

7524
04:46:42,638 --> 04:46:44,798
Does that make sense? Okay. I just

7525
04:46:44,798 --> 04:46:47,040
wanted to clarify that. And so asking

7526
04:46:47,040 --> 04:46:48,638
the police to come up with that step in

7527
04:46:48,638 --> 04:46:51,360
grade system which was my idea or what

7528
04:46:51,360 --> 04:46:53,440
combined with some others is that it

7529
04:46:53,440 --> 04:46:57,280
gives some more clarity for for planning

7530
04:46:57,280 --> 04:47:00,080
for wage increases that relates to

7531
04:47:00,080 --> 04:47:03,600
experience levels and added value to our

7532
04:47:03,600 --> 04:47:06,080
communities. But it's also dependent on

7533
04:47:06,080 --> 04:47:09,200
the board and the and the and the

7534
04:47:09,200 --> 04:47:11,840
councils to approve those increases.

7535
04:47:11,840 --> 04:47:13,200
It's not automatic like the federal

7536
04:47:13,200 --> 04:47:16,948
government is.

7537
04:47:16,958 --> 04:47:18,320
could be automatic.

7538
04:47:18,320 --> 04:47:20,480
>> It could be if we chose to, right? The

7539
04:47:20,480 --> 04:47:22,480
two questions. Uh, you keep going.

7540
04:47:22,480 --> 04:47:24,480
>> Okay. I think we're No, she has

7541
04:47:24,480 --> 04:47:26,320
>> I still have my comment time. So, yeah.

7542
04:47:26,320 --> 04:47:29,360
>> Can I just say one thing real quick? Me

7543
04:47:29,360 --> 04:47:30,718
personally, I would never go to

7544
04:47:30,718 --> 04:47:32,798
automatic because I mean, if I've got

7545
04:47:32,798 --> 04:47:35,840
people that don't want to do the things,

7546
04:47:35,840 --> 04:47:38,000
>> that's that's their choice.

7547
04:47:38,000 --> 04:47:40,958
>> A caveat caveat is you at least had to

7548
04:47:40,958 --> 04:47:42,320
perform at a satisfactory level.

7549
04:47:42,320 --> 04:47:43,680
>> Yeah. If you performance improvement

7550
04:47:43,680 --> 04:47:44,400
plan, you didn't get

7551
04:47:44,400 --> 04:47:46,160
>> and we do. We have we have that where

7552
04:47:46,160 --> 04:47:48,560
they but if they want to level up and I

7553
04:47:48,560 --> 04:47:49,840
mean there's a whole load of

7554
04:47:49,840 --> 04:47:51,440
certifications and when we went to this

7555
04:47:51,440 --> 04:47:53,280
one of the one of the reasons just

7556
04:47:53,280 --> 04:47:56,718
history um we went to it is we were we

7557
04:47:56,718 --> 04:47:58,798
were basically and most of the fire

7558
04:47:58,798 --> 04:48:00,798
service still functions this way where I

7559
04:48:00,798 --> 04:48:02,400
would go to my employees and say I need

7560
04:48:02,400 --> 04:48:04,480
you to get this certification I need you

7561
04:48:04,480 --> 04:48:07,200
to go to a you know eightweek class at

7562
04:48:07,200 --> 04:48:09,680
you know twice twice a week at night and

7563
04:48:09,680 --> 04:48:12,240
maybe a Saturday here and there and

7564
04:48:12,240 --> 04:48:14,560
because I'm

7565
04:48:14,560 --> 04:48:16,638
mandating it. I need them to get that

7566
04:48:16,638 --> 04:48:19,120
certification. Now I'm into overtime,

7567
04:48:19,120 --> 04:48:20,480
right? I'm going to have to pay them

7568
04:48:20,480 --> 04:48:22,400
when they're off duty to go to this

7569
04:48:22,400 --> 04:48:23,840
class because I'm the one that, you

7570
04:48:23,840 --> 04:48:25,440
know, as the fire department wants them

7571
04:48:25,440 --> 04:48:27,360
to do it. When we came up with this

7572
04:48:27,360 --> 04:48:30,080
system, essentially

7573
04:48:30,080 --> 04:48:32,480
we we that we we still have some

7574
04:48:32,480 --> 04:48:34,878
mandatory certifications that are very,

7575
04:48:34,878 --> 04:48:36,320
you know, in like that first year of

7576
04:48:36,320 --> 04:48:40,080
their career, but beyond that, when they

7577
04:48:40,080 --> 04:48:42,000
go to a class, they choose to go to, we

7578
04:48:42,000 --> 04:48:44,160
don't mandate anything. They choose to

7579
04:48:44,160 --> 04:48:47,120
go. We don't pay them to go, but that's

7580
04:48:47,120 --> 04:48:48,480
how they're going to get their raises.

7581
04:48:48,480 --> 04:48:49,680
So, they I mean, they're going to get

7582
04:48:49,680 --> 04:48:51,760
paid on the backside.

7583
04:48:51,760 --> 04:48:53,840
And it's it's actually been a really

7584
04:48:53,840 --> 04:48:58,718
amazing program because now rather than,

7585
04:48:58,718 --> 04:49:00,798
you know, this happened to me right

7586
04:49:00,798 --> 04:49:02,878
before I became the chief, getting told

7587
04:49:02,878 --> 04:49:04,798
I was going to a class, getting told to

7588
04:49:04,798 --> 04:49:08,000
cancel trips, getting told and me being

7589
04:49:08,000 --> 04:49:10,160
pissed off. Now we got people standing

7590
04:49:10,160 --> 04:49:11,760
in line because they're trying to get

7591
04:49:11,760 --> 04:49:13,680
their classes done so that they can get

7592
04:49:13,680 --> 04:49:15,920
their raises when they It's worked out

7593
04:49:15,920 --> 04:49:18,480
really well. So, but there was a a money

7594
04:49:18,480 --> 04:49:20,958
savings, you know, on the not paying

7595
04:49:20,958 --> 04:49:23,440
overtime for man for mandating classes

7596
04:49:23,440 --> 04:49:26,638
that it it worked out really well. Plus,

7597
04:49:26,638 --> 04:49:28,240
you know, we've got some high performers

7598
04:49:28,240 --> 04:49:30,240
and they're going to ascend faster and

7599
04:49:30,240 --> 04:49:31,920
we've got some that are they're great

7600
04:49:31,920 --> 04:49:33,360
employees, but they're maybe they don't

7601
04:49:33,360 --> 04:49:35,360
want to read the books or do I mean, we

7602
04:49:35,360 --> 04:49:38,798
got some maybe weird things in our

7603
04:49:38,798 --> 04:49:39,920
>> That's what I really like about your

7604
04:49:39,920 --> 04:49:43,120
system is it it incentivize incentivizes

7605
04:49:43,120 --> 04:49:45,680
initiative and prog progress. And then

7606
04:49:45,680 --> 04:49:47,760
when I part of the reason I suggested

7607
04:49:47,760 --> 04:49:49,200
that for the police department is Chief

7608
04:49:49,200 --> 04:49:51,600
William let me know that uh they pay

7609
04:49:51,600 --> 04:49:53,200
extra for extra duties. We call them

7610
04:49:53,200 --> 04:49:54,878
collateral duties in the FBI serving on

7611
04:49:54,878 --> 04:49:56,480
the evidence response team or SWAT or

7612
04:49:56,480 --> 04:49:58,718
something else. But I like the idea of

7613
04:49:58,718 --> 04:50:00,638
and to promote to a supervisor I had to

7614
04:50:00,638 --> 04:50:02,798
have done those things to be competitive

7615
04:50:02,798 --> 04:50:05,600
for those positions. So I like the idea

7616
04:50:05,600 --> 04:50:08,480
of incentivizing that through the paying

7617
04:50:08,480 --> 04:50:10,000
grade system or the stepping grade

7618
04:50:10,000 --> 04:50:11,840
system. Well, and it was kind of a rude

7619
04:50:11,840 --> 04:50:13,840
awakening when we had the engineer test

7620
04:50:13,840 --> 04:50:15,360
because there were people who had

7621
04:50:15,360 --> 04:50:17,040
drugged their feet and didn't and they

7622
04:50:17,040 --> 04:50:18,958
weren't qualified all of a sudden. They

7623
04:50:18,958 --> 04:50:21,760
had plenty of time, but they just they

7624
04:50:21,760 --> 04:50:23,040
didn't they didn't get their stuff done.

7625
04:50:23,040 --> 04:50:25,280
And so all of a sudden, we go to, you

7626
04:50:25,280 --> 04:50:27,840
know, we do a test and we got people who

7627
04:50:27,840 --> 04:50:30,320
they should be there. They, you know,

7628
04:50:30,320 --> 04:50:32,160
they're they're more than qualified, but

7629
04:50:32,160 --> 04:50:38,080
they didn't have the certifications and it was on them. So,

7630
04:50:38,080 --> 04:50:38,480
>> Sarah,

7631
04:50:38,480 --> 04:50:40,560
>> my turn. Oh, okay. First of all, I just

7632
04:50:40,560 --> 04:50:42,320
want to say for Chief Patton and Chief

7633
04:50:42,320 --> 04:50:43,600
Williams, any of the questions,

7634
04:50:43,600 --> 04:50:45,520
comments, thoughts I have are not

7635
04:50:45,520 --> 04:50:47,440
intended to be insulting. It's just

7636
04:50:47,440 --> 04:50:49,200
probably a lack of my understanding. So,

7637
04:50:49,200 --> 04:50:50,798
I appreciate you being here to answer

7638
04:50:50,798 --> 04:50:54,240
questions. Um, you said in five years

7639
04:50:54,240 --> 04:50:56,638
something about never had a cola. Can

7640
04:50:56,638 --> 04:50:58,480
you elaborate on what you meant by that?

7641
04:50:58,480 --> 04:51:01,280
>> So, we've been trying to adjust the what

7642
04:51:01,280 --> 04:51:03,280
I would call a market adjustment,

7643
04:51:03,280 --> 04:51:05,840
meaning to get in the range. Right. A

7644
04:51:05,840 --> 04:51:08,718
cola in my mind is

7645
04:51:08,718 --> 04:51:10,958
we've got our merit increase, we're in

7646
04:51:10,958 --> 04:51:13,280
range, and then we're we're looking at

7647
04:51:13,280 --> 04:51:14,958
adjusting for the cost of living or

7648
04:51:14,958 --> 04:51:16,958
inflation or something like that. We've

7649
04:51:16,958 --> 04:51:18,798
never actually got to that point because

7650
04:51:18,798 --> 04:51:21,040
we've never got to that average mark

7651
04:51:21,040 --> 04:51:24,480
where we can say, so it's probably as

7652
04:51:24,480 --> 04:51:26,798
much verbiage as anything, but when I'm

7653
04:51:26,798 --> 04:51:28,480
looking at it, I don't look at what I

7654
04:51:28,480 --> 04:51:29,680
think the cost of living is going to be.

7655
04:51:29,680 --> 04:51:31,840
I look at where we're at comparative to

7656
04:51:31,840 --> 04:51:35,680
other departments. And I and so that 5%

7657
04:51:35,680 --> 04:51:40,798
proposed was to adjust wage ranges to

7658
04:51:40,798 --> 04:51:42,240
get us in market. Okay.

7659
04:51:42,240 --> 04:51:43,600
>> Rather than a cost of living.

7660
04:51:43,600 --> 04:51:45,840
>> And it's kind of just a how it's named.

7661
04:51:45,840 --> 04:51:46,638
>> Yeah. And that's

7662
04:51:46,638 --> 04:51:48,798
>> merit versus cola. It's all based

7663
04:51:48,798 --> 04:51:52,160
relatively on infla wage inflation and overall inflation.

7664
04:51:52,160 --> 04:51:54,560
>> I mean we're I'm looking at the the

7665
04:51:54,560 --> 04:51:56,480
surrounding departments have increased

7666
04:51:56,480 --> 04:51:59,040
their wages. So yeah, call it cola call

7667
04:51:59,040 --> 04:51:59,840
it

7668
04:51:59,840 --> 04:52:02,400
>> merit. On the back side, I I look at it

7669
04:52:02,400 --> 04:52:04,480
as a as wage adjustment

7670
04:52:04,480 --> 04:52:05,040
>> market

7671
04:52:05,040 --> 04:52:06,080
>> or market adjustment

7672
04:52:06,080 --> 04:52:06,958
>> adjustment

7673
04:52:06,958 --> 04:52:09,360
>> to try to get in to keep us in range

7674
04:52:09,360 --> 04:52:12,480
rather than looking at a cost of living

7675
04:52:12,480 --> 04:52:14,400
>> and and you're just strictly compar

7676
04:52:14,400 --> 04:52:16,798
comparing salaries, not like salaries

7677
04:52:16,798 --> 04:52:18,480
plus benefits. Is that No,

7678
04:52:18,480 --> 04:52:20,000
>> no, you're comparing the whole thing.

7679
04:52:20,000 --> 04:52:22,000
>> No, no, no. We're we've never done that

7680
04:52:22,000 --> 04:52:24,080
before. We're doing salaries in the

7681
04:52:24,080 --> 04:52:26,160
future. We want to start comparing it

7682
04:52:26,160 --> 04:52:27,280
all, I guess. Okay.

7683
04:52:27,280 --> 04:52:28,638
>> That was the request that I made in

7684
04:52:28,638 --> 04:52:31,280
January at our meeting. that we need to

7685
04:52:31,280 --> 04:52:32,878
like you said compare apples to apples

7686
04:52:32,878 --> 04:52:34,878
overall compensation and we had some

7687
04:52:34,878 --> 04:52:37,760
issues with uh an a situation a family

7688
04:52:37,760 --> 04:52:40,240
situation with their highlands finance

7689
04:52:40,240 --> 04:52:42,798
manager but we got the 10 or so

7690
04:52:42,798 --> 04:52:44,798
comparisons of salaries and it was just

7691
04:52:44,798 --> 04:52:47,280
based on entry level salaries so one ask

7692
04:52:47,280 --> 04:52:50,160
for next year is to compare all the

7693
04:52:50,160 --> 04:52:51,680
steps and grades and that might come out

7694
04:52:51,680 --> 04:52:53,600
better for them the comparison might

7695
04:52:53,600 --> 04:52:55,760
come out but I we we just need to make

7696
04:52:55,760 --> 04:52:56,718
informed decisions

7697
04:52:56,718 --> 04:52:57,200
>> sure

7698
04:52:57,200 --> 04:52:59,360
>> and the other thing was we need to

7699
04:52:59,360 --> 04:53:01,520
compare the complete compensation

7700
04:53:01,520 --> 04:53:04,080
overall compensation that would include

7701
04:53:04,080 --> 04:53:05,440
the benefits and that's what I asked

7702
04:53:05,440 --> 04:53:07,920
for. So we got a list of 10 comparisons

7703
04:53:07,920 --> 04:53:10,480
but only two were were from the other

7704
04:53:10,480 --> 04:53:12,400
list. So it's you just couldn't compare

7705
04:53:12,400 --> 04:53:12,798
them.

7706
04:53:12,798 --> 04:53:13,120
>> Yeah.

7707
04:53:13,120 --> 04:53:16,320
>> And of those 10 only two others provided

7708
04:53:16,320 --> 04:53:19,280
100% of the health insurance benefits.

7709
04:53:19,280 --> 04:53:22,000
Most of them were 70 to 80% in in that

7710
04:53:22,000 --> 04:53:26,000
range. So going forward again we were

7711
04:53:26,000 --> 04:53:28,160
that was January and then we had the the

7712
04:53:28,160 --> 04:53:31,040
situation with the with the and then

7713
04:53:31,040 --> 04:53:32,798
just the timing it's it was hard to get

7714
04:53:32,798 --> 04:53:34,240
but that's what we've requested going

7715
04:53:34,240 --> 04:53:37,040
forward is having an overall

7716
04:53:37,040 --> 04:53:39,280
compensation and for our staff if we're

7717
04:53:39,280 --> 04:53:42,638
going to use comparable salaries from

7718
04:53:42,638 --> 04:53:44,958
other cities we should have the same

7719
04:53:44,958 --> 04:53:46,320
expect the same thing

7720
04:53:46,320 --> 04:53:48,240
>> an overall comparison because in Alpine

7721
04:53:48,240 --> 04:53:51,360
we we contribute 100% of their health

7722
04:53:51,360 --> 04:53:53,120
insurance benefits So when we compare

7723
04:53:53,120 --> 04:53:54,240
salaries, we also have to compare

7724
04:53:54,240 --> 04:53:56,320
overall benefits is my my thought.

7725
04:53:56,320 --> 04:53:57,920
>> Appreciate that. I agree.

7726
04:53:57,920 --> 04:53:59,040
>> Can I add something?

7727
04:53:59,040 --> 04:53:59,440
>> Yes.

7728
04:53:59,440 --> 04:54:01,360
>> Aaron Wells, um, executive director for

7729
04:54:01,360 --> 04:54:04,480
Loone Peak. So um, and and to Council

7730
04:54:04,480 --> 04:54:06,160
Member Remler's point, we absolutely

7731
04:54:06,160 --> 04:54:08,160
wanted to try to provide that and we

7732
04:54:08,160 --> 04:54:10,798
just, um, salaries are very easy for us

7733
04:54:10,798 --> 04:54:12,320
to pull because there's a database out

7734
04:54:12,320 --> 04:54:14,160
there. I can go log in, download it,

7735
04:54:14,160 --> 04:54:15,680
right, and I can run the reports for

7736
04:54:15,680 --> 04:54:18,798
you. Benefits is a very timeintensive. I

7737
04:54:18,798 --> 04:54:20,798
have to somebody has to make a lot of

7738
04:54:20,798 --> 04:54:23,600
phone calls. uh do a lot of data and do

7739
04:54:23,600 --> 04:54:25,040
a lot of digging to make sure that we

7740
04:54:25,040 --> 04:54:26,798
are truly comparing apples to apples

7741
04:54:26,798 --> 04:54:30,480
because um you've got all the different

7742
04:54:30,480 --> 04:54:32,798
positions and then within that you've

7743
04:54:32,798 --> 04:54:34,560
got tier one and tier two and are you

7744
04:54:34,560 --> 04:54:36,000
talking about a match or are you doing

7745
04:54:36,000 --> 04:54:37,600
social security and all of those things

7746
04:54:37,600 --> 04:54:40,878
and so we tried to do it in an easy way

7747
04:54:40,878 --> 04:54:42,560
and that we created a spreadsheet sent

7748
04:54:42,560 --> 04:54:44,320
it out to our HR folks and unfortunately

7749
04:54:44,320 --> 04:54:45,840
did not get the response we were hoping

7750
04:54:45,840 --> 04:54:49,120
for so it wasn't I we heard the request

7751
04:54:49,120 --> 04:54:50,480
from the board and unfortunately just

7752
04:54:50,480 --> 04:54:52,958
weren't able to fulfill it um because of

7753
04:54:52,958 --> 04:54:54,160
all the things that council member

7754
04:54:54,160 --> 04:54:56,560
Rumbler talked about. Um one other thing

7755
04:54:56,560 --> 04:54:58,480
I think to add to what Chief Patton was

7756
04:54:58,480 --> 04:55:01,600
saying about um cola versus market, I

7757
04:55:01,600 --> 04:55:03,040
think it's important to remember that

7758
04:55:03,040 --> 04:55:05,040
and when this has been true for all of

7759
04:55:05,040 --> 04:55:07,040
the market adjustments that the chiefs

7760
04:55:07,040 --> 04:55:09,680
have um requested over the years is that

7761
04:55:09,680 --> 04:55:12,080
they've been position specific, right?

7762
04:55:12,080 --> 04:55:14,878
It's not like every um employee would

7763
04:55:14,878 --> 04:55:17,040
have gotten a 5%. um some of the

7764
04:55:17,040 --> 04:55:18,798
employees in a certain category were

7765
04:55:18,798 --> 04:55:20,080
going to get no market adjustment

7766
04:55:20,080 --> 04:55:22,718
because they were within market range

7767
04:55:22,718 --> 04:55:25,200
whereas other employees needed more

7768
04:55:25,200 --> 04:55:27,280
right so that's how it ended up at the

7769
04:55:27,280 --> 04:55:30,798
5% um there was a third thing but my

7770
04:55:30,798 --> 04:55:33,360
brain has turned to mush so mine's about

7771
04:55:33,360 --> 04:55:33,600
there

7772
04:55:33,600 --> 04:55:34,718
>> we'll stay up there I think they're

7773
04:55:34,718 --> 04:55:35,360
going to do more

7774
04:55:35,360 --> 04:55:36,638
>> and when you do comparables you're

7775
04:55:36,638 --> 04:55:39,920
comparing within Utah county within Utah

7776
04:55:39,920 --> 04:55:41,920
I mean nationwide

7777
04:55:41,920 --> 04:55:43,600
>> we've gone back and forth as to what the

7778
04:55:43,600 --> 04:55:45,520
best way is to compare to right and so

7779
04:55:45,520 --> 04:55:47,600
what we've landed on at this point is

7780
04:55:47,600 --> 04:55:48,400
Utah County,

7781
04:55:48,400 --> 04:55:49,920
>> LA County,

7782
04:55:49,920 --> 04:55:50,638
>> no [gasps]

7783
04:55:50,638 --> 04:55:51,840
is Utah County,

7784
04:55:51,840 --> 04:55:52,958
>> Northern California,

7785
04:55:52,958 --> 04:55:56,240
>> and our um uh South Salt Lake County.

7786
04:55:56,240 --> 04:55:58,878
So, we include like Draper and um

7787
04:55:58,878 --> 04:56:00,560
Bluffdale. I can't remember exactly, but

7788
04:56:00,560 --> 04:56:02,240
it's it's Utah County and then the our

7789
04:56:02,240 --> 04:56:04,798
bordering Salt Lake County ones.

7790
04:56:04,798 --> 04:56:06,560
>> Thank you. Thanks for all your effort,

7791
04:56:06,560 --> 04:56:06,798
too.

7792
04:56:06,798 --> 04:56:08,320
>> Oh, absolutely. And I'd say one thing

7793
04:56:08,320 --> 04:56:09,840
that the board did request that we do

7794
04:56:09,840 --> 04:56:11,760
this year is usually it's the chiefs who

7795
04:56:11,760 --> 04:56:13,440
are pulling the salary numbers and

7796
04:56:13,440 --> 04:56:15,440
actually HR and admin did it this time

7797
04:56:15,440 --> 04:56:18,000
just so that you could understand. I

7798
04:56:18,000 --> 04:56:19,520
mean not that I think that the chiefs

7799
04:56:19,520 --> 04:56:21,360
were giving you bad data by any means

7800
04:56:21,360 --> 04:56:23,760
but you know it's coming from a place of

7801
04:56:23,760 --> 04:56:24,480
neutrality.

7802
04:56:24,480 --> 04:56:25,920
>> For reals their data was better.

7803
04:56:25,920 --> 04:56:27,440
>> That's true. Mine was higher.

7804
04:56:27,440 --> 04:56:29,360
>> Not not for you but better [laughter]

7805
04:56:29,360 --> 04:56:31,040
for me. You guys like that.

7806
04:56:31,040 --> 04:56:32,638
>> Yes. It was coming from a place of

7807
04:56:32,638 --> 04:56:33,920
neutrality for that.

7808
04:56:33,920 --> 04:56:34,958
>> Thank you.

7809
04:56:34,958 --> 04:56:36,560
>> Um sorry I just have a few more

7810
04:56:36,560 --> 04:56:38,560
questions. I promise I'll be quick. So,

7811
04:56:38,560 --> 04:56:40,400
Chief Patton, how many firefighters have

7812
04:56:40,400 --> 04:56:44,240
you lost in this last year due to um

7813
04:56:44,240 --> 04:56:46,000
other fire departments with higher

7814
04:56:46,000 --> 04:56:48,320
wages? I know you lost, didn't you lose

7815
04:56:48,320 --> 04:56:51,280
a captain out to Saratoga Springs?

7816
04:56:51,280 --> 04:56:53,600
>> Um, that's the only one.

7817
04:56:53,600 --> 04:56:56,000
>> Okay. And then how many positions have

7818
04:56:56,000 --> 04:56:58,638
you hired for?

7819
04:56:58,638 --> 04:56:59,280
>> Two. [clears throat]

7820
04:56:59,280 --> 04:57:01,040
>> And how many applicants did you have for

7821
04:57:01,040 --> 04:57:02,240
each of those?

7822
04:57:02,240 --> 04:57:03,760
>> You want qualified applicants or

7823
04:57:03,760 --> 04:57:05,680
justified

7824
04:57:05,680 --> 04:57:07,520
applicants? qualified applicants.

7825
04:57:07,520 --> 04:57:09,280
>> I think we had 17.

7826
04:57:09,280 --> 04:57:10,958
>> Okay.

7827
04:57:10,958 --> 04:57:12,000
And um

7828
04:57:12,000 --> 04:57:14,000
>> and for the first time, I will say this,

7829
04:57:14,000 --> 04:57:15,840
for the first time in my five years, we

7830
04:57:15,840 --> 04:57:22,070
had two paramedics that applied.

7831
04:57:22,080 --> 04:57:25,280
» Okay. And then just kind of the same

7832
04:57:25,280 --> 04:57:27,040
question, but this is my last question I

7833
04:57:27,040 --> 04:57:30,480
asked Chief Williams is, you know, once

7834
04:57:30,480 --> 04:57:33,040
we get to that market where we have a

7835
04:57:33,040 --> 04:57:35,840
comparable, you know, compensation

7836
04:57:35,840 --> 04:57:39,360
I mean, do you anticipate

7837
04:57:39,360 --> 04:57:42,718
asking for like

7838
04:57:42,718 --> 04:57:45,360
>> five to eight% every year or are we just

7839
04:57:45,360 --> 04:57:47,440
trying to get to comparable market so

7840
04:57:47,440 --> 04:57:49,520
we're competitive

7841
04:57:49,520 --> 04:57:49,920
>> or

7842
04:57:49,920 --> 04:57:52,080
>> so I I would love to get us into a place

7843
04:57:52,080 --> 04:57:53,920
I mean if you're looking at probably on

7844
04:57:53,920 --> 04:57:55,920
the average somewhere around 3% on your

7845
04:57:55,920 --> 04:57:58,638
merit right you're you're in scale

7846
04:57:58,638 --> 04:58:01,120
you're going to see see now I feel like

7847
04:58:01,120 --> 04:58:03,040
we're talking colas right now you're

7848
04:58:03,040 --> 04:58:07,280
going to see a two to 5% % around us

7849
04:58:07,280 --> 04:58:10,560
that we would want to stay right with.

7850
04:58:10,560 --> 04:58:10,878
>> Okay.

7851
04:58:10,878 --> 04:58:14,480
>> So, yeah, maybe 5% based on but that and

7852
04:58:14,480 --> 04:58:15,920
that's the hard part is we've got to get

7853
04:58:15,920 --> 04:58:17,520
there, right? So, the market has slowed

7854
04:58:17,520 --> 04:58:20,400
down and it's it's not fun to talk about

7855
04:58:20,400 --> 04:58:22,718
us still kind of keeping the pedal down,

7856
04:58:22,718 --> 04:58:24,878
but this is our chance to catch up

7857
04:58:24,878 --> 04:58:25,920
because,

7858
04:58:25,920 --> 04:58:27,200
>> you know, when inflation was going

7859
04:58:27,200 --> 04:58:28,560
crazy,

7860
04:58:28,560 --> 04:58:29,440
>> you know.

7861
04:58:29,440 --> 04:58:31,200
>> Yeah. I'm just looking at from like a

7862
04:58:31,200 --> 04:58:34,718
finance position as as a council member

7863
04:58:34,718 --> 04:58:37,920
just how sustainable is 5% every year. I

7864
04:58:37,920 --> 04:58:39,840
don't know like I don't I don't know.

7865
04:58:39,840 --> 04:58:41,520
That's why I was just curious and that's

7866
04:58:41,520 --> 04:58:43,840
why I'm asking. I I'm not saying that I

7867
04:58:43,840 --> 04:58:45,440
don't feel like you don't deserve it or

7868
04:58:45,440 --> 04:58:47,120
anything like that. I'm just

7869
04:58:47,120 --> 04:58:50,000
>> just trying to get the data. So yeah,

7870
04:58:50,000 --> 04:58:52,878
>> those are my only questions.

7871
04:58:52,878 --> 04:58:55,360
>> Chrissy, did you have any questions?

7872
04:58:55,360 --> 04:58:57,600
>> Um

7873
04:58:57,600 --> 04:59:00,480
I did. I don't have a question for you,

7874
04:59:00,480 --> 04:59:04,080
but thank you. I did miss this point and

7875
04:59:04,080 --> 04:59:09,040
I know um Shane covered it, but um

7876
04:59:09,040 --> 04:59:10,798
I think it's important to understand the

7877
04:59:10,798 --> 04:59:12,480
needs. Like I was saying, I don't know

7878
04:59:12,480 --> 04:59:14,638
where we talked about this. It's a long

7879
04:59:14,638 --> 04:59:16,400
night. if I've already said this, but

7880
04:59:16,400 --> 04:59:17,920
it's important to understand the needs

7881
04:59:17,920 --> 04:59:21,120
and then um

7882
04:59:21,120 --> 04:59:24,878
if we're not keeping up and we're not um

7883
04:59:24,878 --> 04:59:27,920
able to keep a full staff and all the

7884
04:59:27,920 --> 04:59:31,280
things that make our fire pe our fire

7885
04:59:31,280 --> 04:59:32,638
department and police department

7886
04:59:32,638 --> 04:59:35,600
function well, then that falls to us to

7887
04:59:35,600 --> 04:59:38,798
find the the resources to help them meet

7888
04:59:38,798 --> 04:59:41,520
their needs. And so that was more my

7889
04:59:41,520 --> 04:59:44,080
perspective is like what are our revenue

7890
04:59:44,080 --> 04:59:47,280
sources? And so um in the packet that we

7891
04:59:47,280 --> 04:59:50,160
were given and Shane has repeated it in

7892
04:59:50,160 --> 04:59:53,200
our um is that there's a in our

7893
04:59:53,200 --> 04:59:54,718
interlocal agreement it says the annual

7894
04:59:54,718 --> 04:59:56,718
budget increase or decrease for the

7895
04:59:56,718 --> 04:59:59,200
district shall not exceed the average

7896
04:59:59,200 --> 05:00:01,600
property tax revenue increase or

7897
05:00:01,600 --> 05:00:04,160
decrease for both cities budgets of the

7898
05:00:04,160 --> 05:00:06,878
previous fiscal year. So that um

7899
05:00:06,878 --> 05:00:08,878
somebody and then you could keep reading

7900
05:00:08,878 --> 05:00:10,878
but excluding any new revenue increases

7901
05:00:10,878 --> 05:00:13,600
without majority vote of city council.

7902
05:00:13,600 --> 05:00:16,160
So that's what's happening is this um

7903
05:00:16,160 --> 05:00:18,560
and it goes on and explains that this

7904
05:00:18,560 --> 05:00:20,958
year we're there the increase is above

7905
05:00:20,958 --> 05:00:23,200
our property tax increase. Well property

7906
05:00:23,200 --> 05:00:25,520
tax isn't our only source of revenue. We

7907
05:00:25,520 --> 05:00:27,200
you know Shane presented tonight that

7908
05:00:27,200 --> 05:00:29,600
our sales tax is increasing. We have

7909
05:00:29,600 --> 05:00:32,080
other revenues we can use. But somebody

7910
05:00:32,080 --> 05:00:34,080
in creating the interlocal agreement

7911
05:00:34,080 --> 05:00:36,400
realized that we can't really force one

7912
05:00:36,400 --> 05:00:38,958
city or another to raise property taxes

7913
05:00:38,958 --> 05:00:41,040
because that is an act of the city. Like

7914
05:00:41,040 --> 05:00:43,200
we can't really control our sales tax

7915
05:00:43,200 --> 05:00:44,638
increase, but we can control property

7916
05:00:44,638 --> 05:00:46,480
tax through the truth and taxation

7917
05:00:46,480 --> 05:00:48,878
program. So, I think it's really

7918
05:00:48,878 --> 05:00:50,400
important to hear from these men to

7919
05:00:50,400 --> 05:00:52,718
understand when the when they're we

7920
05:00:52,718 --> 05:00:55,200
can't meet their needs. Like now it's

7921
05:00:55,200 --> 05:00:57,040
our responsibility to get the resources

7922
05:00:57,040 --> 05:00:59,600
to meet their needs. And so I'm really

7923
05:00:59,600 --> 05:01:01,600
grateful for the extra time you spent. I

7924
05:01:01,600 --> 05:01:03,120
think this is the most you you two have

7925
05:01:03,120 --> 05:01:05,280
ever said at any city council meeting in

7926
05:01:05,280 --> 05:01:07,520
the two years I've ever been here. So I

7927
05:01:07,520 --> 05:01:10,798
really appreciate your input and um

7928
05:01:10,798 --> 05:01:12,878
that's our role is they tell us what

7929
05:01:12,878 --> 05:01:15,200
they need and we figure out how to get

7930
05:01:15,200 --> 05:01:18,400
those needs met. Um, and that may mean

7931
05:01:18,400 --> 05:01:21,360
that we have to look at a property tax

7932
05:01:21,360 --> 05:01:23,280
change. And Carla said that at one

7933
05:01:23,280 --> 05:01:25,680
point, maybe it maybe it was one either

7934
05:01:25,680 --> 05:01:27,600
one of you were still here when we

7935
05:01:27,600 --> 05:01:29,280
weren't meeting those needs. We couldn't

7936
05:01:29,280 --> 05:01:32,000
keep staff and we had to change we had

7937
05:01:32,000 --> 05:01:33,200
to increase our property taxes

7938
05:01:33,200 --> 05:01:35,840
specifically for Lone Peak Safety. So,

7939
05:01:35,840 --> 05:01:38,400
this is a year maybe we're if we fall

7940
05:01:38,400 --> 05:01:40,080
behind like it's something to we're

7941
05:01:40,080 --> 05:01:42,000
kicking the can down the road. That I

7942
05:01:42,000 --> 05:01:43,280
think that's the message I'm getting

7943
05:01:43,280 --> 05:01:44,878
from them is we're kicking the can down

7944
05:01:44,878 --> 05:01:46,400
the road. So, that may be something

7945
05:01:46,400 --> 05:01:47,920
we're talking about next year. I just

7946
05:01:47,920 --> 05:01:49,520
want to bring that to your attention

7947
05:01:49,520 --> 05:01:51,600
that it's our job to provide the

7948
05:01:51,600 --> 05:01:54,000
resources if when they have needs. And

7949
05:01:54,000 --> 05:01:57,040
it's a two-way thing, right? And so, um,

7950
05:01:57,040 --> 05:01:59,440
I understand that and thank you.

7951
05:01:59,440 --> 05:02:01,360
>> We were both here. I know for me

7952
05:02:01,360 --> 05:02:02,798
personally, it was pretty traumatizing.

7953
05:02:02,798 --> 05:02:04,320
That's why I'm pretty protective of us

7954
05:02:04,320 --> 05:02:05,440
like just like let's just

7955
05:02:05,440 --> 05:02:08,400
>> falling behind. Let's just keep, you

7956
05:02:08,400 --> 05:02:10,160
know,

7957
05:02:10,160 --> 05:02:11,680
taking off small bites rather the

7958
05:02:11,680 --> 05:02:13,520
because when we took the big bite, it

7959
05:02:13,520 --> 05:02:15,840
was a big pain in the

7960
05:02:15,840 --> 05:02:18,000
>> right.

7961
05:02:18,000 --> 05:02:19,600
>> Can some of the funding come from the

7962
05:02:19,600 --> 05:02:21,600
general fund, too. Again, it's just less

7963
05:02:21,600 --> 05:02:23,360
projects, right? Well, everything that

7964
05:02:23,360 --> 05:02:25,280
goes into the general fund is fungeible.

7965
05:02:25,280 --> 05:02:28,480
Like this is somebody tied it to before

7966
05:02:28,480 --> 05:02:31,040
my day and era, somebody tied it to that

7967
05:02:31,040 --> 05:02:34,080
property tax. But we once the money hits

7968
05:02:34,080 --> 05:02:36,000
the general fund, we use it on parks. We

7969
05:02:36,000 --> 05:02:37,920
can use it on public safety. We can use

7970
05:02:37,920 --> 05:02:39,200
it on water.

7971
05:02:39,200 --> 05:02:40,638
>> It all comes from the general fund.

7972
05:02:40,638 --> 05:02:42,638
So

7973
05:02:42,638 --> 05:02:44,400
somebody tied it to property tax, but

7974
05:02:44,400 --> 05:02:45,520
that doesn't mean we have that

7975
05:02:45,520 --> 05:02:49,190
limitation.

7976
05:02:49,200 --> 05:02:51,440
» Okay. Did you have any questions for

7977
05:02:51,440 --> 05:02:54,320
>> No, I I I love you guys. I respect you

7978
05:02:54,320 --> 05:02:57,770
guys, but I you're not going to like me

7979
05:02:57,770 --> 05:02:58,320
[laughter]

7980
05:02:58,320 --> 05:03:01,040
and I Sorry. Uh, so I'm I'm a little

7981
05:03:01,040 --> 05:03:02,798
different in the view than what you

7982
05:03:02,798 --> 05:03:05,520
heard. I I don't feel like I'm and don't

7983
05:03:05,520 --> 05:03:06,718
take this the wrong way. I'm not

7984
05:03:06,718 --> 05:03:08,240
supposed to meet your guys' needs. I'm

7985
05:03:08,240 --> 05:03:09,280
supposed to meet the needs of the

7986
05:03:09,280 --> 05:03:13,040
residents. Um, and it's not happening

7987
05:03:13,040 --> 05:03:14,958
with the traffic and the fire

7988
05:03:14,958 --> 05:03:16,480
mitigation.

7989
05:03:16,480 --> 05:03:18,560
Um, and when we compare our salary,

7990
05:03:18,560 --> 05:03:20,000
sorry, this is just one I'm taking. Take

7991
05:03:20,000 --> 05:03:21,760
it or leave it. Um, and I know you have

7992
05:03:21,760 --> 05:03:23,200
an axe and a gun, so I'm trying to be

7993
05:03:23,200 --> 05:03:25,440
gentle.

7994
05:03:25,440 --> 05:03:27,600
That's a joke. We I get goofier as it

7995
05:03:27,600 --> 05:03:29,440
gets late. I don't know how you guys

7996
05:03:29,440 --> 05:03:33,200
get, but anyways. Um it's it's hard to

7997
05:03:33,200 --> 05:03:35,840
compare us with fire departments in like

7998
05:03:35,840 --> 05:03:40,400
Bluffell or Highland or um

7999
05:03:40,400 --> 05:03:43,920
uh we are not the same entity in

8000
05:03:43,920 --> 05:03:47,440
population, in demographic,

8001
05:03:47,440 --> 05:03:50,080
in amount of crime,

8002
05:03:50,080 --> 05:03:54,718
um in we have like a really unique thing

8003
05:03:54,718 --> 05:03:57,520
and the current situation I'm just

8004
05:03:57,520 --> 05:03:59,040
realizing more and I realize this

8005
05:03:59,040 --> 05:04:01,520
usually I'm pretty right on the onset

8006
05:04:01,520 --> 05:04:03,680
and I questioned myself, but right away

8007
05:04:03,680 --> 05:04:06,000
when this first came up, the ILA, I

8008
05:04:06,000 --> 05:04:08,958
researched it and realized

8009
05:04:08,958 --> 05:04:11,840
this system is not sustainable,

8010
05:04:11,840 --> 05:04:14,160
and it's not a right fit. I'm not saying

8011
05:04:14,160 --> 05:04:16,400
you guys aren't amazing, but it's not

8012
05:04:16,400 --> 05:04:19,520
the right fit. like the the current

8013
05:04:19,520 --> 05:04:22,160
system we have for fighting fires,

8014
05:04:22,160 --> 05:04:24,080
taking people in an ambulance,

8015
05:04:24,080 --> 05:04:27,360
addressing crime, and addressing traffic

8016
05:04:27,360 --> 05:04:30,080
is a model that works in like South Salt

8017
05:04:30,080 --> 05:04:33,600
Lake or parts of Utah County. That's the

8018
05:04:33,600 --> 05:04:35,360
only reason I would not vote for this.

8019
05:04:35,360 --> 05:04:38,240
5% is too much. No other industry is

8020
05:04:38,240 --> 05:04:40,798
getting that. Um

8021
05:04:40,798 --> 05:04:42,638
uh I don't think this fits the identity

8022
05:04:42,638 --> 05:04:44,480
and the needs of Alpine. I think the

8023
05:04:44,480 --> 05:04:46,718
needs of Alpine are fire prevention. we

8024
05:04:46,718 --> 05:04:48,638
don't get any or we have to get it. I'm

8025
05:04:48,638 --> 05:04:51,440
trying to get it and traffic calming and

8026
05:04:51,440 --> 05:04:53,520
I know we have a lot of older population

8027
05:04:53,520 --> 05:04:57,680
for ambulance service uh and their

8028
05:04:57,680 --> 05:05:00,000
property tax is already too high. So

8029
05:05:00,000 --> 05:05:01,920
they like die one way or the other or

8030
05:05:01,920 --> 05:05:05,760
they have a pain one way or the other. I just feel like the reason I can't

8031
05:05:05,760 --> 05:05:07,520
support this like I did at the beginning

8032
05:05:07,520 --> 05:05:09,360
is because just this model isn't there

8033
05:05:09,360 --> 05:05:11,840
needs to be a change. Ever since I was

8034
05:05:11,840 --> 05:05:13,440
young coming here, the fire department's

8035
05:05:13,440 --> 05:05:15,520
been coming here asking for more money.

8036
05:05:15,520 --> 05:05:17,040
It's never enough. It's never enough.

8037
05:05:17,040 --> 05:05:18,240
Just like the

8038
05:05:18,240 --> 05:05:22,240
schools, it's never enough. It's never enough. But we don't

8039
05:05:22,240 --> 05:05:24,080
see a quality change or we don't see a

8040
05:05:24,080 --> 05:05:29,680
substantial change in the results. Uh I think there just needs to be changes.

8041
05:05:29,680 --> 05:05:31,040
That's all. And I hope it's with you

8042
05:05:31,040 --> 05:05:32,638
guys.

8043
05:05:32,638 --> 05:05:33,680
>> I'm sorry if you're mad.

8044
05:05:33,680 --> 05:05:35,200
>> Do you hope it's with us? Yes. Like you

8045
05:05:35,200 --> 05:05:36,400
want me to leave?

8046
05:05:36,400 --> 05:05:38,878
>> No, I want you to I want I don't want

8047
05:05:38,878 --> 05:05:40,400
you to leave, but the model isn't

8048
05:05:40,400 --> 05:05:42,160
working just currently.

8049
05:05:42,160 --> 05:05:45,120
>> When's the last time you had a big fire?

8050
05:05:45,120 --> 05:05:46,560
201

8051
05:05:46,560 --> 05:05:48,560
>> 12 Yes, 2012.

8052
05:05:48,560 --> 05:05:49,520
>> You're welcome.

8053
05:05:49,520 --> 05:05:53,520
>> No, I I'm not dis I am not discounting

8054
05:05:53,520 --> 05:05:55,440
that. But just so you know,

8055
05:05:55,440 --> 05:05:56,480
>> well, when you say that you're not

8056
05:05:56,480 --> 05:05:59,040
seeing the change, how would you see the

8057
05:05:59,040 --> 05:05:59,440
change?

8058
05:05:59,440 --> 05:06:01,280
>> I would see the change by getting in

8059
05:06:01,280 --> 05:06:03,760
front of that fire before it happened

8060
05:06:03,760 --> 05:06:05,440
and doing the correct fire mitigation

8061
05:06:05,440 --> 05:06:08,000
that we're pleading for already. That we

8062
05:06:08,000 --> 05:06:08,798
made it.

8063
05:06:08,798 --> 05:06:10,240
>> We need to have that conversation like

8064
05:06:10,240 --> 05:06:11,840
three months ago. I had it three months

8065
05:06:11,840 --> 05:06:12,878
ago. I'm a fire.

8066
05:06:12,878 --> 05:06:14,320
>> I'm doing it three and six and seven

8067
05:06:14,320 --> 05:06:14,958
months ago.

8068
05:06:14,958 --> 05:06:16,878
>> We I know you're out there doing it. If

8069
05:06:16,878 --> 05:06:18,320
you want me to do it,

8070
05:06:18,320 --> 05:06:21,200
>> then I need a whole another arm of my

8071
05:06:21,200 --> 05:06:23,920
fire department. I employ firefighters,

8072
05:06:23,920 --> 05:06:24,638
>> right? And

8073
05:06:24,638 --> 05:06:26,400
>> not fire mitigators.

8074
05:06:26,400 --> 05:06:29,200
>> But I I I agree. And if we're

8075
05:06:29,200 --> 05:06:30,160
>> We can talk about that.

8076
05:06:30,160 --> 05:06:30,798
>> I

8077
05:06:30,798 --> 05:06:32,080
>> But that's not going to bring your cost

8078
05:06:32,080 --> 05:06:33,120
down.

8079
05:06:33,120 --> 05:06:36,320
>> Well, it can if we prioritize that.

8080
05:06:36,320 --> 05:06:39,040
Right now, we don't prioritize that. But

8081
05:06:39,040 --> 05:06:41,520
you're right. We will have another fire.

8082
05:06:41,520 --> 05:06:43,040
It's only a matter of time just like

8083
05:06:43,040 --> 05:06:45,840
that if we don't do fire mitigation.

8084
05:06:45,840 --> 05:06:47,360
Now, after that fire happened, the fire

8085
05:06:47,360 --> 05:06:49,200
he's talking about, the 2012, what they

8086
05:06:49,200 --> 05:06:51,520
did is they went on the irrigation ditch

8087
05:06:51,520 --> 05:06:54,400
and they made a fire break, maybe the

8088
05:06:54,400 --> 05:06:56,320
month after, and they made it during the

8089
05:06:56,320 --> 05:06:59,120
fire. It's all overgrown now. It's all

8090
05:06:59,120 --> 05:07:01,280
overgrown. I'm the one digging it out

8091
05:07:01,280 --> 05:07:02,798
right now. Me and a couple friends, and

8092
05:07:02,798 --> 05:07:05,360
we go up and we're digging it out, but

8093
05:07:05,360 --> 05:07:07,680
no one does it until there's a fire. And

8094
05:07:07,680 --> 05:07:09,600
so, the model's not working. Um, the

8095
05:07:09,600 --> 05:07:10,958
funds aren't going to the right space.

8096
05:07:10,958 --> 05:07:12,958
If I could somehow get us to convert to

8097
05:07:12,958 --> 05:07:15,680
traffic safety and to fire mitigation, I

8098
05:07:15,680 --> 05:07:18,160
think we would avoid that fire where you

8099
05:07:18,160 --> 05:07:19,520
guys wouldn't have to be risking your

8100
05:07:19,520 --> 05:07:22,958
lives and everyone else's. I'm sorry.

8101
05:07:22,958 --> 05:07:24,560
You're not risking them. The fire is

8102
05:07:24,560 --> 05:07:26,560
risking your life and everyone else's.

8103
05:07:26,560 --> 05:07:29,040
It's not your fault. But uh I think the

8104
05:07:29,040 --> 05:07:30,320
model could just change. That's the only

8105
05:07:30,320 --> 05:07:32,080
reason I'm not with you. I That's the

8106
05:07:32,080 --> 05:07:33,600
only reason is um

8107
05:07:33,600 --> 05:07:34,958
>> Well, no. What I'm hearing is you want

8108
05:07:34,958 --> 05:07:36,638
to pour more money into the fire

8109
05:07:36,638 --> 05:07:37,920
department. But let me ask you this

8110
05:07:37,920 --> 05:07:40,560
question. You practice safe driving,

8111
05:07:40,560 --> 05:07:41,200
>> right?

8112
05:07:41,200 --> 05:07:43,040
>> You don't speed, obviously.

8113
05:07:43,040 --> 05:07:45,440
>> I I am a little bit amazed that the all

8114
05:07:45,440 --> 05:07:48,320
of Alpine complains about speeding.

8115
05:07:48,320 --> 05:07:49,840
>> Who are they complaining about?

8116
05:07:49,840 --> 05:07:51,200
>> Their neighbors and trucks.

8117
05:07:51,200 --> 05:07:51,680
>> Yeah, them.

8118
05:07:51,680 --> 05:07:52,400
>> Well, hold on.

8119
05:07:52,400 --> 05:07:54,160
>> Themselves, right? This is a dead end.

8120
05:07:54,160 --> 05:07:54,958
>> We've been doing [clears throat] it now.

8121
05:07:54,958 --> 05:07:57,120
>> I'm just I'm just saying with a safe

8122
05:07:57,120 --> 05:07:58,958
driver. You practice safe driving. You

8123
05:07:58,958 --> 05:07:59,920
do all the things. You got car

8124
05:07:59,920 --> 05:08:00,798
insurance.

8125
05:08:00,798 --> 05:08:01,200
>> Yes.

8126
05:08:01,200 --> 05:08:02,240
>> Why?

8127
05:08:02,240 --> 05:08:04,560
>> For disasters.

8128
05:08:04,560 --> 05:08:06,798
>> No, I know you are insurance. You

8129
05:08:06,798 --> 05:08:08,080
>> So you can mitigate. we can go out and

8130
05:08:08,080 --> 05:08:09,840
mitigate and I'm happy to help you,

8131
05:08:09,840 --> 05:08:11,760
right? It's going to cost money,

8132
05:08:11,760 --> 05:08:13,440
>> but it doesn't negate the fact that

8133
05:08:13,440 --> 05:08:14,798
you're still going to have a disaster.

8134
05:08:14,798 --> 05:08:16,480
You're still going to have some other

8135
05:08:16,480 --> 05:08:18,480
force is going to

8136
05:08:18,480 --> 05:08:20,320
>> I agree. So, basically what I'm asking

8137
05:08:20,320 --> 05:08:25,280
is a slight insurance cost reduction

8138
05:08:25,280 --> 05:08:28,160
and then a rep prioritizing from crisis

8139
05:08:28,160 --> 05:08:30,958
control to prevention.

8140
05:08:30,958 --> 05:08:31,680
>> That'd be great.

8141
05:08:31,680 --> 05:08:33,040
>> Andrew, when's the last time you called

8142
05:08:33,040 --> 05:08:34,480
your insurance company and asked them to

8143
05:08:34,480 --> 05:08:35,680
reduce your rates?

8144
05:08:35,680 --> 05:08:37,520
>> Every year. And what they do is they

8145
05:08:37,520 --> 05:08:38,878
say, "Oh, I'm sorry. I can't do anything

8146
05:08:38,878 --> 05:08:41,120
about I'm switching." And I switch every

8147
05:08:41,120 --> 05:08:41,440
year.

8148
05:08:41,440 --> 05:08:42,718
>> And you also have to remember that.

8149
05:08:42,718 --> 05:08:44,160
>> And I get them, by the way, and I get

8150
05:08:44,160 --> 05:08:46,320
them reduced every year.

8151
05:08:46,320 --> 05:08:48,080
>> And so can you by switching.

8152
05:08:48,080 --> 05:08:50,958
>> I mean, firefighters,

8153
05:08:50,958 --> 05:08:52,400
the vast majority of what they do is

8154
05:08:52,400 --> 05:08:54,320
emergency response accidents and medical

8155
05:08:54,320 --> 05:08:56,240
emergencies. Yes, they're there to fight

8156
05:08:56,240 --> 05:08:58,638
fires. In Pleasant Grove, it's going to

8157
05:08:58,638 --> 05:09:01,440
be structure fires, right? So those you

8158
05:09:01,440 --> 05:09:02,480
have no control over. There's no

8159
05:09:02,480 --> 05:09:04,000
mitigation. It's just structure fires

8160
05:09:04,000 --> 05:09:05,840
happen because electrical things or a

8161
05:09:05,840 --> 05:09:07,760
kid lights a match or whatever else.

8162
05:09:07,760 --> 05:09:09,360
That's just going to happen. Yes, we

8163
05:09:09,360 --> 05:09:11,600
have the wildland interface. That's a

8164
05:09:11,600 --> 05:09:13,760
different thing. And there is room for

8165
05:09:13,760 --> 05:09:15,440
mitigation. And there are lots of

8166
05:09:15,440 --> 05:09:17,520
programs we've determined of of doing

8167
05:09:17,520 --> 05:09:20,320
that volunteer work, grants, and things

8168
05:09:20,320 --> 05:09:21,840
like that. That's not [clears throat]

8169
05:09:21,840 --> 05:09:23,840
the firefighters primary role. And yes,

8170
05:09:23,840 --> 05:09:25,280
they can consult and they can

8171
05:09:25,280 --> 05:09:27,520
participate and and and give ideas and

8172
05:09:27,520 --> 05:09:28,718
things. Well, I know it's not their

8173
05:09:28,718 --> 05:09:29,840
primary role, but it's our primary.

8174
05:09:29,840 --> 05:09:31,360
>> But they have to be available when

8175
05:09:31,360 --> 05:09:32,878
they're on duty need,

8176
05:09:32,878 --> 05:09:34,240
>> but when when they're on duty, they have

8177
05:09:34,240 --> 05:09:36,480
to be available for those.

8178
05:09:36,480 --> 05:09:37,600
>> What is what would you say the

8179
05:09:37,600 --> 05:09:39,520
percentages of your calls are medical

8180
05:09:39,520 --> 05:09:41,280
emergencies and vehicle accidents?

8181
05:09:41,280 --> 05:09:42,160
>> Well, most of them, right?

8182
05:09:42,160 --> 05:09:43,760
>> 80 80 85.

8183
05:09:43,760 --> 05:09:44,160
>> Yeah.

8184
05:09:44,160 --> 05:09:45,840
>> I know up here, but that's the model.

8185
05:09:45,840 --> 05:09:47,360
>> They have you have to be ready for that.

8186
05:09:47,360 --> 05:09:48,718
And if you're out doing mitigation

8187
05:09:48,718 --> 05:09:50,080
during your work shift, you just can't

8188
05:09:50,080 --> 05:09:50,958
be available for that room.

8189
05:09:50,958 --> 05:09:52,400
>> I know that's the model for South Salt

8190
05:09:52,400 --> 05:09:53,680
Lake Utah.

8191
05:09:53,680 --> 05:09:54,958
>> It's the model for everywhere. I know,

8192
05:09:54,958 --> 05:09:56,320
but we have a slightly different need

8193
05:09:56,320 --> 05:09:58,798
just by geographic location and uh

8194
05:09:58,798 --> 05:10:01,360
demographic and uh like you said, the

8195
05:10:01,360 --> 05:10:04,160
50,000 foot house right into the uh

8196
05:10:04,160 --> 05:10:05,440
forestry. [clears throat]

8197
05:10:05,440 --> 05:10:07,040
It it just it's just slightly different.

8198
05:10:07,040 --> 05:10:09,360
If we pivot a little bit, I hate to use

8199
05:10:09,360 --> 05:10:10,878
this example, but Disneyland had to do

8200
05:10:10,878 --> 05:10:12,320
this. When Disneyland opened, they used

8201
05:10:12,320 --> 05:10:14,638
a normal structure of police and fire,

8202
05:10:14,638 --> 05:10:16,240
and they realized right away it didn't

8203
05:10:16,240 --> 05:10:18,560
work. And so, they had to pivot it to be

8204
05:10:18,560 --> 05:10:20,480
a Disneylandesque

8205
05:10:20,480 --> 05:10:22,400
fire and police, and it worked. It It

8206
05:10:22,400 --> 05:10:23,760
was a different scenario. was a

8207
05:10:23,760 --> 05:10:27,040
different uh need and and they were able

8208
05:10:27,040 --> 05:10:28,638
to make it work. I think we have just a

8209
05:10:28,638 --> 05:10:30,958
little bit of that going on.

8210
05:10:30,958 --> 05:10:31,760
>> That's I I've said

8211
05:10:31,760 --> 05:10:33,280
>> the interesting thing is we have we have

8212
05:10:33,280 --> 05:10:35,360
a greater need I think here for that

8213
05:10:35,360 --> 05:10:36,718
insurance and that protection. That's

8214
05:10:36,718 --> 05:10:39,040
why the chief when they've been

8215
05:10:39,040 --> 05:10:41,760
understaffed under OSHA standards he's

8216
05:10:41,760 --> 05:10:42,798
made the decision to have four

8217
05:10:42,798 --> 05:10:44,798
firefighters in Alpine versus three in

8218
05:10:44,798 --> 05:10:46,400
Highland even though Highland was

8219
05:10:46,400 --> 05:10:48,718
getting paid the majority of their of

8220
05:10:48,718 --> 05:10:50,080
the cost. I'm with you on that

8221
05:10:50,080 --> 05:10:53,520
>> because we have an elderly population

8222
05:10:53,520 --> 05:10:54,958
and there are more calls, emergency

8223
05:10:54,958 --> 05:10:56,560
calls with the elderly population and

8224
05:10:56,560 --> 05:10:58,798
the fire risk is what he's trying to

8225
05:10:58,798 --> 05:11:00,638
mitigate against.

8226
05:11:00,638 --> 05:11:01,920
>> No, I'm with you on that. I'm just

8227
05:11:01,920 --> 05:11:03,680
looking for the prevention side. That's

8228
05:11:03,680 --> 05:11:04,958
>> Mayor, can I say something on the

8229
05:11:04,958 --> 05:11:06,000
prevention? Please do.

8230
05:11:06,000 --> 05:11:08,320
>> So, one thing to remember also, the

8231
05:11:08,320 --> 05:11:09,920
firefighters didn't ask for all these

8232
05:11:09,920 --> 05:11:11,600
open space subdivisions that we have in

8233
05:11:11,600 --> 05:11:13,680
Alpine. That's something that actually

8234
05:11:13,680 --> 05:11:16,160
was required for many years. It's

8235
05:11:16,160 --> 05:11:19,520
changed now by our ordinance. If you had

8236
05:11:19,520 --> 05:11:22,160
property proposed for development that

8237
05:11:22,160 --> 05:11:25,200
contained any of the geologic hazards,

8238
05:11:25,200 --> 05:11:27,200
it had to be a PRD, which means

8239
05:11:27,200 --> 05:11:30,000
automatically 25% open space right off

8240
05:11:30,000 --> 05:11:33,920
the top and sometimes more. So, Willow

8241
05:11:33,920 --> 05:11:35,920
Canyon, Healey Heights, a lot of these

8242
05:11:35,920 --> 05:11:38,878
subdivisions like that, Silver Leaf,

8243
05:11:38,878 --> 05:11:41,840
they have open space because the

8244
05:11:41,840 --> 05:11:44,878
developer is forced by city ordinance

8245
05:11:44,878 --> 05:11:47,760
that was passed by the city council.

8246
05:11:47,760 --> 05:11:50,638
And so they didn't ask for any of these

8247
05:11:50,638 --> 05:11:53,120
open spaces. We took on 500 acres of

8248
05:11:53,120 --> 05:11:56,480
public open space in Three Falls. Um,

8249
05:11:56,480 --> 05:11:58,958
you know, we have Lambert Park. We and

8250
05:11:58,958 --> 05:12:00,798
all these open spaces have mountain bike

8251
05:12:00,798 --> 05:12:04,000
trails through them, which

8252
05:12:04,000 --> 05:12:06,400
a lot of the residents enjoy and they

8253
05:12:06,400 --> 05:12:09,200
like them. Um, but these guys didn't ask

8254
05:12:09,200 --> 05:12:11,280
for any of that. And so those are the

8255
05:12:11,280 --> 05:12:13,920
open spaces that you're talking about

8256
05:12:13,920 --> 05:12:16,320
cleaning up. They didn't create the need

8257
05:12:16,320 --> 05:12:19,680
for any of it. It was created by a lot

8258
05:12:19,680 --> 05:12:22,160
of it by city ordinance.

8259
05:12:22,160 --> 05:12:24,160
>> And what we talked about before is sorry

8260
05:12:24,160 --> 05:12:24,718
just real quick. No,

8261
05:12:24,718 --> 05:12:25,120
>> thank you Shane.

8262
05:12:25,120 --> 05:12:27,120
>> What we talked about before is that's

8263
05:12:27,120 --> 05:12:29,200
private land. that's a part of an HOA

8264
05:12:29,200 --> 05:12:31,680
and that's their responsibility to take

8265
05:12:31,680 --> 05:12:35,120
the fire mitigation steps and we talked

8266
05:12:35,120 --> 05:12:37,120
about yeah we can set the example and do

8267
05:12:37,120 --> 05:12:39,440
that in our in our public property and

8268
05:12:39,440 --> 05:12:41,680
we should making be making sure we do

8269
05:12:41,680 --> 05:12:43,040
that in consultation with the fire

8270
05:12:43,040 --> 05:12:44,400
department making sure we're doing it

8271
05:12:44,400 --> 05:12:46,958
correctly and then ed maybe trying to

8272
05:12:46,958 --> 05:12:48,798
educate those HOAs that it's their

8273
05:12:48,798 --> 05:12:50,718
responsibility to do that.

8274
05:12:50,718 --> 05:12:52,718
>> Yeah, that was my question is like whose

8275
05:12:52,718 --> 05:12:54,160
responsibility is it to do the fire

8276
05:12:54,160 --> 05:12:55,520
mitigation? I know that was on our

8277
05:12:55,520 --> 05:12:57,920
project budget like fire mitigation. Is

8278
05:12:57,920 --> 05:13:00,480
that something the city does or does

8279
05:13:00,480 --> 05:13:02,718
that is that the fire department or

8280
05:13:02,718 --> 05:13:04,798
>> No, it's the private it's the pro the

8281
05:13:04,798 --> 05:13:06,878
property owners, right? I mean, we can't

8282
05:13:06,878 --> 05:13:08,638
go in and force people. We can't just go

8283
05:13:08,638 --> 05:13:12,400
into people's houses and start cutting

8284
05:13:12,400 --> 05:13:14,240
down their trees and mucking out their

8285
05:13:14,240 --> 05:13:15,040
brush.

8286
05:13:15,040 --> 05:13:16,718
>> See, but here's the hard part. We we

8287
05:13:16,718 --> 05:13:20,560
can't do that, but we can force to take

8288
05:13:20,560 --> 05:13:22,480
private property money from them. So,

8289
05:13:22,480 --> 05:13:23,760
this is where I see the wall not

8290
05:13:23,760 --> 05:13:25,600
working. We can't help them out with

8291
05:13:25,600 --> 05:13:28,000
mitigation because it's private. We

8292
05:13:28,000 --> 05:13:30,878
can't help them with what they need, but

8293
05:13:30,878 --> 05:13:33,200
we can fund it all by taking from their

8294
05:13:33,200 --> 05:13:35,600
property taxes. So, it's like a one-way

8295
05:13:35,600 --> 05:13:38,080
direction. We break that wall into the

8296
05:13:38,080 --> 05:13:40,240
private sector and do property taxes

8297
05:13:40,240 --> 05:13:42,400
every day, but we don't break it to help

8298
05:13:42,400 --> 05:13:44,240
them. That that doesn't

8299
05:13:44,240 --> 05:13:45,920
>> help them. If we have a fire, they're

8300
05:13:45,920 --> 05:13:47,840
there. If they have a medical emergency,

8301
05:13:47,840 --> 05:13:49,600
>> I'm talking about the mit mitigation.

8302
05:13:49,600 --> 05:13:52,160
And the prevention again is a hundred

8303
05:13:52,160 --> 05:13:54,958
times cheaper and better than the crisis

8304
05:13:54,958 --> 05:13:55,920
control.

8305
05:13:55,920 --> 05:13:56,718
>> So is there

8306
05:13:56,718 --> 05:13:59,040
>> we can we can help them. We just can't

8307
05:13:59,040 --> 05:14:01,840
force them. There is state law coming

8308
05:14:01,840 --> 05:14:04,400
that's going to take effect January of

8309
05:14:04,400 --> 05:14:07,840
27, House Bill 41. that they can't

8310
05:14:07,840 --> 05:14:10,080
>> essentially is going to designate the

8311
05:14:10,080 --> 05:14:13,120
urban interface and it is going to

8312
05:14:13,120 --> 05:14:16,000
somewhat and I don't know I mean again I

8313
05:14:16,000 --> 05:14:16,878
don't know how the state's going to

8314
05:14:16,878 --> 05:14:18,320
force this but it's going to be in

8315
05:14:18,320 --> 05:14:20,878
conjunction with insurance as far as

8316
05:14:20,878 --> 05:14:23,280
what people need to do on their private

8317
05:14:23,280 --> 05:14:24,718
properties

8318
05:14:24,718 --> 05:14:25,760
>> to make them

8319
05:14:25,760 --> 05:14:27,040
>> I think they've already done that in St.

8320
05:14:27,040 --> 05:14:27,440
George

8321
05:14:27,440 --> 05:14:28,560
>> better.

8322
05:14:28,560 --> 05:14:30,560
>> So chief, would you would you guys chief

8323
05:14:30,560 --> 05:14:32,320
and police chief would you guys meet in

8324
05:14:32,320 --> 05:14:34,160
the middle at around 3% which is the

8325
05:14:34,160 --> 05:14:37,120
kind of the standard around everywhere?

8326
05:14:37,120 --> 05:14:37,840
>> Eight.

8327
05:14:37,840 --> 05:14:38,480
>> No, three

8328
05:14:38,480 --> 05:14:39,520
>> 3% increase.

8329
05:14:39,520 --> 05:14:40,000
>> Yeah,

8330
05:14:40,000 --> 05:14:42,556
>> I'd go to eight.

8331
05:14:42,556 --> 05:14:42,638
[clears throat]

8332
05:14:42,638 --> 05:14:44,160
>> Okay.

8333
05:14:44,160 --> 05:14:45,200
>> We've already met in the middle. We're

8334
05:14:45,200 --> 05:14:47,200
already falling behind. If you if you

8335
05:14:47,200 --> 05:14:47,760
don't want

8336
05:14:47,760 --> 05:14:48,798
>> that was a genuine question.

8337
05:14:48,798 --> 05:14:50,080
>> I'm going to call for a vote.

8338
05:14:50,080 --> 05:14:51,200
>> The answer is no.

8339
05:14:51,200 --> 05:14:52,798
>> Can I not a vote? I'm sorry. I'll

8340
05:14:52,798 --> 05:14:54,000
entertain a motion. and I feel like

8341
05:14:54,000 --> 05:14:55,360
we've had enough discussion on it and

8342
05:14:55,360 --> 05:14:56,878
we're going around in circles. Thank

8343
05:14:56,878 --> 05:14:59,120
you. My comment is thank you so much for

8344
05:14:59,120 --> 05:14:59,840
all you do.

8345
05:14:59,840 --> 05:15:00,718
>> Yes, thank you.

8346
05:15:00,718 --> 05:15:04,080
>> I will add that there's wage and general

8347
05:15:04,080 --> 05:15:06,400
inflation in all industries. Everyone

8348
05:15:06,400 --> 05:15:08,080
gets raises, not all the time, not as

8349
05:15:08,080 --> 05:15:11,440
big and there are factors to consider as

8350
05:15:11,440 --> 05:15:15,120
far as competitive being competitive um

8351
05:15:15,120 --> 05:15:18,160
just like a private company has to do.

8352
05:15:18,160 --> 05:15:19,600
They they have to worry about losing

8353
05:15:19,600 --> 05:15:21,760
their engineers and their software

8354
05:15:21,760 --> 05:15:24,080
people and their IT people if they're

8355
05:15:24,080 --> 05:15:24,798
not competitive

8356
05:15:24,798 --> 05:15:29,120
>> and their accountants and their lawyers

8357
05:15:29,120 --> 05:15:31,680
>> and this was part of the going to be

8358
05:15:31,680 --> 05:15:33,120
part of the budget discussion. Just one

8359
05:15:33,120 --> 05:15:36,000
last really quick thing is the primary

8360
05:15:36,000 --> 05:15:38,000
responsibility of government is public

8361
05:15:38,000 --> 05:15:41,040
safety and infrastructure utilities.

8362
05:15:41,040 --> 05:15:42,958
Everything else is fluff. All right.

8363
05:15:42,958 --> 05:15:47,200
Everything else can be set aside. And

8364
05:15:47,200 --> 05:15:50,160
we talk about a PD staffing increase of

8365
05:15:50,160 --> 05:15:51,520
one full-time employee that hasn't

8366
05:15:51,520 --> 05:15:53,920
happened in 10 to 12 years. We've had an

8367
05:15:53,920 --> 05:15:55,840
increase in population.

8368
05:15:55,840 --> 05:15:57,760
Fire department staffing to meet minimum

8369
05:15:57,760 --> 05:15:59,440
OSHA standards I think is critical for

8370
05:15:59,440 --> 05:16:01,920
Alpine and having professional

8371
05:16:01,920 --> 05:16:05,120
firefighters here and fire and police

8372
05:16:05,120 --> 05:16:06,560
department staff reasonable wage

8373
05:16:06,560 --> 05:16:10,000
increases to stay competitive based on

8374
05:16:10,000 --> 05:16:11,680
the all the data that we want for next

8375
05:16:11,680 --> 05:16:16,320
year and a safe and appropriate fire

8376
05:16:16,320 --> 05:16:18,320
station in this budget. That's it.

8377
05:16:18,320 --> 05:16:20,160
>> Do you need a motion?

8378
05:16:20,160 --> 05:16:22,718
>> Yes. I move to approve the Lone Peak

8379
05:16:22,718 --> 05:16:24,798
Public Safety District

8380
05:16:24,798 --> 05:16:26,958
budget as proposed for fiscal year

8381
05:16:26,958 --> 05:16:28,958
tenative budget as proposed for fiscal

8382
05:16:28,958 --> 05:16:30,958
year 2026 2027.

8383
05:16:30,958 --> 05:16:38,150
>> Is there a second?

8384
05:16:38,160 --> 05:16:38,798
» Go for it.

8385
05:16:38,798 --> 05:16:40,160
>> I will second the motion. It's

8386
05:16:40,160 --> 05:16:41,840
>> been moved by Councilman Rmler, seconded

8387
05:16:41,840 --> 05:16:44,798
by Councilwoman Haniman to approve um

8388
05:16:44,798 --> 05:16:46,638
the Lone Peak Public Safety District

8389
05:16:46,638 --> 05:16:48,400
budgets proposed for fiscal year

8390
05:16:48,400 --> 05:16:51,430
2026-2027.

8391
05:16:51,440 --> 05:16:53,920
Um, I feel like we've already hashed

8392
05:16:53,920 --> 05:16:55,680
this out, so let's proceed with a roll

8393
05:16:55,680 --> 05:16:56,320
call vote.

8394
05:16:56,320 --> 05:16:58,320
>> Jessica, yes.

8395
05:16:58,320 --> 05:16:59,440
>> Sarah Blackwell, yes.

8396
05:16:59,440 --> 05:17:00,638
>> Chrissy Henman, yes.

8397
05:17:00,638 --> 05:17:02,480
>> Andrew Young, no. Brad Wler, yes.

8398
05:17:02,480 --> 05:17:05,440
>> Okay, motion passes. Okay, what do we

8399
05:17:05,440 --> 05:17:07,520
have? We've got the cemetery and we also

8400
05:17:07,520 --> 05:17:09,360
have

8401
05:17:09,360 --> 05:17:13,270
>> That's it.

8402
05:17:13,280 --> 05:17:14,958
» Oh, we're That's right. We've Okay,

8403
05:17:14,958 --> 05:17:16,320
sorry.

8404
05:17:16,320 --> 05:17:17,200
>> Okay,

8405
05:17:17,200 --> 05:17:17,920
>> thanks for coming.

8406
05:17:17,920 --> 05:17:21,120
>> Thank you, Erin. Um, let's

8407
05:17:21,120 --> 05:17:25,040
talk about the consent item item B. No,

8408
05:17:25,040 --> 05:17:30,160
not B, F, which is ordinance 2026-10,

8409
05:17:30,160 --> 05:17:33,120
municipal code for cemeteries. Shane.

8410
05:17:33,120 --> 05:17:36,240
>> Yeah. So, um, just so you know, this was

8411
05:17:36,240 --> 05:17:38,160
not put together by the planner. This

8412
05:17:38,160 --> 05:17:41,280
was not put together by me. It was, uh,

8413
05:17:41,280 --> 05:17:44,480
looked at by our cemetery, Sexton, and

8414
05:17:44,480 --> 05:17:46,400
those that take care of the cemetery.

8415
05:17:46,400 --> 05:17:49,200
So, that's how it was able to get done

8416
05:17:49,200 --> 05:17:51,280
this quick. They don't deal with some of

8417
05:17:51,280 --> 05:17:52,878
these other ordinances and things that

8418
05:17:52,878 --> 05:17:56,480
are are proposed. Um, but basically what

8419
05:17:56,480 --> 05:17:58,638
we have here [clears throat]

8420
05:17:58,638 --> 05:18:01,280
are some amendments u to our municipal

8421
05:18:01,280 --> 05:18:06,878
code, the cemetery section in 8.04.

8422
05:18:06,878 --> 05:18:10,240
Um, clarifying a few things and then

8423
05:18:10,240 --> 05:18:13,200
kind of bringing others into line uh in

8424
05:18:13,200 --> 05:18:19,600
line with current operations. Um, so the highlights of the changes clarify

8425
05:18:19,600 --> 05:18:22,160
requirements for grave markers. I mean,

8426
05:18:22,160 --> 05:18:24,000
it says in there that if somebody

8427
05:18:24,000 --> 05:18:25,840
doesn't have one one within a certain

8428
05:18:25,840 --> 05:18:27,920
time that we go get one for them and

8429
05:18:27,920 --> 05:18:29,680
charge them for it. We've never done

8430
05:18:29,680 --> 05:18:31,360
that

8431
05:18:31,360 --> 05:18:35,200
and don't really want to. Okay. Uh,

8432
05:18:35,200 --> 05:18:37,280
clarify requirements for flat headstones

8433
05:18:37,280 --> 05:18:40,000
in certain sections and other items

8434
05:18:40,000 --> 05:18:42,000
related to that. Clarify requirements

8435
05:18:42,000 --> 05:18:44,560
for raised headstones. clarify the

8436
05:18:44,560 --> 05:18:46,560
number of individuals and types of

8437
05:18:46,560 --> 05:18:49,760
interments uh allowed in an individual

8438
05:18:49,760 --> 05:18:51,760
grave.

8439
05:18:51,760 --> 05:18:54,240
Um and then clarify rules for

8440
05:18:54,240 --> 05:18:55,760
decorations.

8441
05:18:55,760 --> 05:18:58,320
Um and as I mentioned here, we're just

8442
05:18:58,320 --> 05:19:00,958
trying to get ahead of Memorial Day and

8443
05:19:00,958 --> 05:19:03,120
um we'd like to get new signage up there

8444
05:19:03,120 --> 05:19:08,320
and and clarify some some of that. So

8445
05:19:08,320 --> 05:19:12,560
um I I don't see it as major changes in

8446
05:19:12,560 --> 05:19:14,400
here. So, I'm interested to see what you

8447
05:19:14,400 --> 05:19:17,040
see as major chang.

8448
05:19:17,040 --> 05:19:18,638
>> You know what? Let's just go with our Go

8449
05:19:18,638 --> 05:19:18,958
ahead.

8450
05:19:18,958 --> 05:19:21,600
>> And then

8451
05:19:21,600 --> 05:19:24,240
I think my input is just making sure

8452
05:19:24,240 --> 05:19:29,670
that after Memorial Day's

8453
05:19:29,680 --> 05:19:31,520
» Sorry, I don't have it. Can you pull up

8454
05:19:31,520 --> 05:19:34,160
the Memorial Day part? Just that after

8455
05:19:34,160 --> 05:19:36,240
Memorial Day, what was the timeline on

8456
05:19:36,240 --> 05:19:38,798
that? I just want to make sure that they

8457
05:19:38,798 --> 05:19:51,670
that people can have

8458
05:19:51,680 --> 05:19:54,400
Yeah, starting Wednesday before

8459
05:19:54,400 --> 05:19:57,280
for one week. Um, you know, I would like

8460
05:19:57,280 --> 05:20:01,830
to see that extended if possible.

8461
05:20:01,840 --> 05:20:03,840
» So, I'll tell you, can I just take one

8462
05:20:03,840 --> 05:20:05,680
second and just tell you what we have on

8463
05:20:05,680 --> 05:20:08,480
the books and what the sign says. So, I

8464
05:20:08,480 --> 05:20:09,760
think there was a misunderstanding

8465
05:20:09,760 --> 05:20:11,600
whenever the sign was made, and it's

8466
05:20:11,600 --> 05:20:13,600
been up for a long time. If you look at

8467
05:20:13,600 --> 05:20:16,240
it, you can tell. Um, so in the

8468
05:20:16,240 --> 05:20:19,440
ordinance, it actually says,

8469
05:20:19,440 --> 05:20:22,160
uh, let's see. Gosh, I just looked at it

8470
05:20:22,160 --> 05:20:25,280
and I lost it.

8471
05:20:25,280 --> 05:20:28,560
>> Um, okay.

8472
05:20:28,560 --> 05:20:30,718
You can put it there starting the

8473
05:20:30,718 --> 05:20:33,440
Wednesday before Memorial Day and may be

8474
05:20:33,440 --> 05:20:35,840
left for up to one week after Memorial

8475
05:20:35,840 --> 05:20:39,440
Day. So that's the Monday, it's a week.

8476
05:20:39,440 --> 05:20:42,240
Okay. The signs say the second Monday

8477
05:20:42,240 --> 05:20:44,958
after Memorial Day, right?

8478
05:20:44,958 --> 05:20:46,638
>> Yeah. Which ends up being two and a half

8479
05:20:46,638 --> 05:20:47,280
weeks of no

8480
05:20:47,280 --> 05:20:49,520
>> more flowers.

8481
05:20:49,520 --> 05:20:52,798
>> So it ends up looking terrible by that

8482
05:20:52,798 --> 05:20:56,560
time. And and even when we clear stuff

8483
05:20:56,560 --> 05:20:58,958
then people

8484
05:20:58,958 --> 05:21:00,000
>> get

8485
05:21:00,000 --> 05:21:02,718
>> they they leave stuff up there and

8486
05:21:02,718 --> 05:21:05,280
aren't happy when we take it away. But

8487
05:21:05,280 --> 05:21:07,200
they can't maintain the cemetery with

8488
05:21:07,200 --> 05:21:10,638
all of that there and it ends up looking

8489
05:21:10,638 --> 05:21:11,600
really bad.

8490
05:21:11,600 --> 05:21:13,200
>> I guess I don't understand why they

8491
05:21:13,200 --> 05:21:15,440
can't maintain the cemetery. They can't

8492
05:21:15,440 --> 05:21:17,280
perfectly manicure it around the

8493
05:21:17,280 --> 05:21:21,040
headstones, but they can still mow the

8494
05:21:21,040 --> 05:21:24,878
space in between everything.

8495
05:21:24,878 --> 05:21:26,560
>> Not necessarily. Have you been there

8496
05:21:26,560 --> 05:21:28,958
after Memorial Day?

8497
05:21:28,958 --> 05:21:30,160
Look, I

8498
05:21:30,160 --> 05:21:31,760
>> Yeah, it says that you have to put

8499
05:21:31,760 --> 05:21:32,798
>> You're talking about something that's

8500
05:21:32,798 --> 05:21:34,958
very close to my heart and very near.

8501
05:21:34,958 --> 05:21:35,600
Yes, that's true.

8502
05:21:35,600 --> 05:21:38,958
>> And I get it. Um I've been there after

8503
05:21:38,958 --> 05:21:41,840
Memorial Day. Um you know, sometimes I

8504
05:21:41,840 --> 05:21:43,600
look at I go, "This is really amazing

8505
05:21:43,600 --> 05:21:45,920
that there's all this outpouring of love

8506
05:21:45,920 --> 05:21:48,560
and everything, but it's not necessarily

8507
05:21:48,560 --> 05:21:51,280
just on the marker. It's all over." So

8508
05:21:51,280 --> 05:21:53,200
realistically, if you look at it and

8509
05:21:53,200 --> 05:21:54,320
it's like, oh, they should be able to

8510
05:21:54,320 --> 05:21:55,600
mow it if everyone just lays their

8511
05:21:55,600 --> 05:21:58,320
flowers right over the headstone,

8512
05:21:58,320 --> 05:22:01,440
>> but that's not what happens. Um, I was

8513
05:22:01,440 --> 05:22:02,798
looking up really quick other cities

8514
05:22:02,798 --> 05:22:04,878
what they do. We're within, you know,

8515
05:22:04,878 --> 05:22:06,718
I've just looked up American Fork and

8516
05:22:06,718 --> 05:22:09,120
it's the Monday following Memorial Day.

8517
05:22:09,120 --> 05:22:10,958
Highland, I think, um, gives them an

8518
05:22:10,958 --> 05:22:14,638
extra week. Um, but I think that's kind

8519
05:22:14,638 --> 05:22:16,878
of within the standard. Um, clearing it

8520
05:22:16,878 --> 05:22:20,000
after one week is not out of the norm.

8521
05:22:20,000 --> 05:22:20,958
um

8522
05:22:20,958 --> 05:22:22,080
>> as far as

8523
05:22:22,080 --> 05:22:24,320
>> and I know like a lot of people will go

8524
05:22:24,320 --> 05:22:27,680
and like steal flowers from the cemetery

8525
05:22:27,680 --> 05:22:29,920
>> which I don't like. I think I would

8526
05:22:29,920 --> 05:22:31,280
almost [laughter] rather have them just

8527
05:22:31,280 --> 05:22:32,718
remove it. But

8528
05:22:32,718 --> 05:22:34,958
>> anyways, it's

8529
05:22:34,958 --> 05:22:36,878
and the language is and may be left up

8530
05:22:36,878 --> 05:22:38,878
for one week.

8531
05:22:38,878 --> 05:22:41,200
So it's mowing.

8532
05:22:41,200 --> 05:22:43,920
They have the Thursday before.

8533
05:22:43,920 --> 05:22:46,000
>> What's wrong with the Wednesday before?

8534
05:22:46,000 --> 05:22:49,360
So, Wednesday is the day that they

8535
05:22:49,360 --> 05:22:50,000
cemetery.

8536
05:22:50,000 --> 05:22:51,840
>> Okay.

8537
05:22:51,840 --> 05:22:53,600
>> Um, just since you're on this topic,

8538
05:22:53,600 --> 05:22:55,120
this is one of the ones I was going to

8539
05:22:55,120 --> 05:22:56,080
bring up.

8540
05:22:56,080 --> 05:22:58,320
>> I felt that one week was just too short

8541
05:22:58,320 --> 05:23:00,638
and I was going to I was this was what

8542
05:23:00,638 --> 05:23:02,638
this is I have all my notes here. One of

8543
05:23:02,638 --> 05:23:04,320
the recommendations was just to put two

8544
05:23:04,320 --> 05:23:06,718
weeks rather than one week.

8545
05:23:06,718 --> 05:23:08,240
>> That's my only comment. I'll wait and

8546
05:23:08,240 --> 05:23:10,000
see what you say, but everything else.

8547
05:23:10,000 --> 05:23:11,520
>> So, on that, we're actually not asking

8548
05:23:11,520 --> 05:23:13,520
for a change because it's already set.

8549
05:23:13,520 --> 05:23:15,040
>> Is it already set for two weeks? The

8550
05:23:15,040 --> 05:23:17,200
sign just says different. No, it says

8551
05:23:17,200 --> 05:23:18,160
one week,

8552
05:23:18,160 --> 05:23:20,160
>> but the sign reads different at the

8553
05:23:20,160 --> 05:23:22,400
cemetery. So, it's not in line with what

8554
05:23:22,400 --> 05:23:22,958
our order is.

8555
05:23:22,958 --> 05:23:24,560
>> Okay. Yeah, I think two weeks would be a

8556
05:23:24,560 --> 05:23:25,520
proper amount.

8557
05:23:25,520 --> 05:23:26,400
>> So,

8558
05:23:26,400 --> 05:23:28,000
>> we want to update it because it's like

8559
05:23:28,000 --> 05:23:29,440
>> guys, if you think about it, at least

8560
05:23:29,440 --> 05:23:32,958
the flowers that I take to the cemetery

8561
05:23:32,958 --> 05:23:35,840
here and up in Salt Lake on Memorial Day

8562
05:23:35,840 --> 05:23:40,400
and the week of or whatnot, um,

8563
05:23:40,400 --> 05:23:42,160
nothing that I've taken lasts more than

8564
05:23:42,160 --> 05:23:45,840
a week. You're really looking just at

8565
05:23:45,840 --> 05:23:47,520
dead

8566
05:23:47,520 --> 05:23:49,840
flowers at that point.

8567
05:23:49,840 --> 05:23:53,200
>> Well, it's Yeah, it's little things

8568
05:23:53,200 --> 05:23:54,958
butterf I don't know. They

8569
05:23:54,958 --> 05:23:57,120
>> Yeah, there's little wind things. Yes,

8570
05:23:57,120 --> 05:23:58,638
>> people leave things

8571
05:23:58,638 --> 05:23:59,120
>> money

8572
05:23:59,120 --> 05:24:02,560
>> that are meaningful to them and you know

8573
05:24:02,560 --> 05:24:06,878
we don't Alpine is different and I think

8574
05:24:06,878 --> 05:24:09,120
you know if our residents this is really

8575
05:24:09,120 --> 05:24:13,440
important to them one more week is

8576
05:24:13,440 --> 05:24:16,000
really nothing to us. Like I guess I

8577
05:24:16,000 --> 05:24:18,320
don't understand the why.

8578
05:24:18,320 --> 05:24:19,920
>> No, I think for me, we'll probably get

8579
05:24:19,920 --> 05:24:21,440
more complaints about why we're not

8580
05:24:21,440 --> 05:24:23,600
maintaining the cemetery, honestly.

8581
05:24:23,600 --> 05:24:25,840
>> But those will probably be Well, you I

8582
05:24:25,840 --> 05:24:28,320
yield to your in totally respect, mayor,

8583
05:24:28,320 --> 05:24:30,798
uh given you what you've talked about.

8584
05:24:30,798 --> 05:24:33,200
>> Um sorry, it's not my turn.

8585
05:24:33,200 --> 05:24:34,320
>> I don't think it's good or bad.

8586
05:24:34,320 --> 05:24:35,360
>> Just on the same topic. I just don't

8587
05:24:35,360 --> 05:24:36,320
want to be I don't want to sound

8588
05:24:36,320 --> 05:24:39,200
insensitive or be insensitive, but if

8589
05:24:39,200 --> 05:24:41,360
you're coming from a another state or

8590
05:24:41,360 --> 05:24:42,718
something and you're putting on a

8591
05:24:42,718 --> 05:24:44,400
graveyard, you're not going to be there

8592
05:24:44,400 --> 05:24:46,718
to know if it's removed anyway. If you

8593
05:24:46,718 --> 05:24:48,160
live close enough that it's important to

8594
05:24:48,160 --> 05:24:50,080
you, then you can come pick it up and

8595
05:24:50,080 --> 05:24:52,000
then put it back down, right?

8596
05:24:52,000 --> 05:24:53,440
>> Wait, what?

8597
05:24:53,440 --> 05:24:55,600
>> You you can pick it up and then put it

8598
05:24:55,600 --> 05:24:55,840
back.

8599
05:24:55,840 --> 05:24:56,240
>> Yeah.

8600
05:24:56,240 --> 05:24:58,000
So, this is common and a lot of

8601
05:24:58,000 --> 05:25:00,240
the families that live close,

8602
05:25:00,240 --> 05:25:02,798
>> they know that they can they can move

8603
05:25:02,798 --> 05:25:04,000
their things. They take them home,

8604
05:25:04,000 --> 05:25:05,360
especially like the wood things or the

8605
05:25:05,360 --> 05:25:06,480
metal ornaments, things like that

8606
05:25:06,480 --> 05:25:07,440
>> on like a Wednesday,

8607
05:25:07,440 --> 05:25:09,600
>> they take them home and then they the

8608
05:25:09,600 --> 05:25:10,958
cemetery gets clean. This is what I do

8609
05:25:10,958 --> 05:25:12,160
in American Fork. They have the same

8610
05:25:12,160 --> 05:25:14,320
exact rules from my parents.

8611
05:25:14,320 --> 05:25:16,160
>> They they do the entire cemetery.

8612
05:25:16,160 --> 05:25:17,440
Everything gets thrown away that hasn't

8613
05:25:17,440 --> 05:25:19,280
been picked up and then you you can go

8614
05:25:19,280 --> 05:25:20,638
back and put it. So if you want to keep

8615
05:25:20,638 --> 05:25:22,798
it, you go get it. That's why we want it

8616
05:25:22,798 --> 05:25:24,878
on the sign. Very clear. And then they

8617
05:25:24,878 --> 05:25:26,798
can they then they're out for months

8618
05:25:26,798 --> 05:25:28,718
until that next quarterly cleanup that's

8619
05:25:28,718 --> 05:25:29,200
proposed.

8620
05:25:29,200 --> 05:25:31,120
>> I didn't if they're visiting from afar,

8621
05:25:31,120 --> 05:25:33,040
then they really don't even know. So

8622
05:25:33,040 --> 05:25:34,718
right,

8623
05:25:34,718 --> 05:25:36,160
>> but that's very helpful. Thank you,

8624
05:25:36,160 --> 05:25:39,430
Deian.

8625
05:25:39,440 --> 05:25:41,120
This is just to make it clear so that

8626
05:25:41,120 --> 05:25:44,000
our ordinances and what the signs say

8627
05:25:44,000 --> 05:25:47,120
that it there's no confusion. And I

8628
05:25:47,120 --> 05:25:49,360
think to your point once people are

8629
05:25:49,360 --> 05:25:51,440
educated the signs and our ordinances

8630
05:25:51,440 --> 05:25:56,560
are aligned then people will do you know you know what the rules are if

8631
05:25:56,560 --> 05:25:58,240
you really are visiting it and you're

8632
05:25:58,240 --> 05:26:00,080
really paying attention or talking to

8633
05:26:00,080 --> 05:26:02,400
the city staff and whatnot. everybody's

8634
05:26:02,400 --> 05:26:06,560
aware of what the schedule is that um

8635
05:26:06,560 --> 05:26:07,120
you know

8636
05:26:07,120 --> 05:26:07,600
>> Yeah.

8637
05:26:07,600 --> 05:26:09,200
>> And if it's important to you, you can

8638
05:26:09,200 --> 05:26:11,360
take it the especially the people that

8639
05:26:11,360 --> 05:26:13,440
live in Alpine and they do it. Not

8640
05:26:13,440 --> 05:26:15,280
everybody, but there are people if you

8641
05:26:15,280 --> 05:26:16,400
go up there, you'll see it.

8642
05:26:16,400 --> 05:26:17,440
>> Yeah. No, I didn't know.

8643
05:26:17,440 --> 05:26:19,360
>> And if it's important to them to have it

8644
05:26:19,360 --> 05:26:20,958
there longer, then they would come pick

8645
05:26:20,958 --> 05:26:22,798
it up, I would imagine. Otherwise,

8646
05:26:22,798 --> 05:26:23,920
they're not coming back to the grave,

8647
05:26:23,920 --> 05:26:25,200
and so they don't even know that it's

8648
05:26:25,200 --> 05:26:27,120
not there.

8649
05:26:27,120 --> 05:26:30,718
>> Okay. I think it's Sarah. I I think um

8650
05:26:30,718 --> 05:26:32,560
it's 11:25

8651
05:26:32,560 --> 05:26:35,440
and as a council we spend so much time

8652
05:26:35,440 --> 05:26:37,360
getting into other people's business. We

8653
05:26:37,360 --> 05:26:39,040
need to understand our role as a

8654
05:26:39,040 --> 05:26:41,920
governing board, a governing body that

8655
05:26:41,920 --> 05:26:44,560
we don't get to control everything. And

8656
05:26:44,560 --> 05:26:48,240
this is getting very tedious. So I hope

8657
05:26:48,240 --> 05:26:51,120
that we'll start learning our role to

8658
05:26:51,120 --> 05:26:55,280
govern and not to micromanage.

8659
05:26:55,280 --> 05:26:58,080
Um, I met with Deian yesterday and she

8660
05:26:58,080 --> 05:26:59,600
answered all my questions. So, I don't

8661
05:26:59,600 --> 05:27:01,360
have any questions or comments. I'm

8662
05:27:01,360 --> 05:27:03,440
ready for a motion, but I'll let

8663
05:27:03,440 --> 05:27:04,878
>> Well, wait. We haven't gone down.

8664
05:27:04,878 --> 05:27:06,560
>> I know. I'm just saying I'm ready, but

8665
05:27:06,560 --> 05:27:09,120
>> pass. Okay, Andrew, go ahead. I'm going

8666
05:27:09,120 --> 05:27:11,840
to give you three minutes.

8667
05:27:11,840 --> 05:27:12,718
>> The cemetery.

8668
05:27:12,718 --> 05:27:13,840
>> It's 11:30.

8669
05:27:13,840 --> 05:27:15,920
>> Is there any way So, I read through it

8670
05:27:15,920 --> 05:27:18,718
all. Is there any way or any reason why

8671
05:27:18,718 --> 05:27:21,600
we have to have uh flat monuments? I

8672
05:27:21,600 --> 05:27:24,160
don't understand why on the north it's

8673
05:27:24,160 --> 05:27:26,160
put in code that we only have flat

8674
05:27:26,160 --> 05:27:30,080
monuments. Do I am I missing something?

8675
05:27:30,080 --> 05:27:32,878
>> Yeah. Um

8676
05:27:32,878 --> 05:27:34,718
>> why can't people have upright?

8677
05:27:34,718 --> 05:27:37,120
>> I'll answer that question. It was when

8678
05:27:37,120 --> 05:27:38,718
we did the expansion. The reason you

8679
05:27:38,718 --> 05:27:40,706
have just flat monuments is it's much

8680
05:27:40,706 --> 05:27:41,840
[clears throat] quicker and easier to

8681
05:27:41,840 --> 05:27:43,040
mow.

8682
05:27:43,040 --> 05:27:45,840
>> Um people still have Yes.

8683
05:27:45,840 --> 05:27:48,000
>> So you still have the option. There are

8684
05:27:48,000 --> 05:27:50,320
still plots in the old section and if

8685
05:27:50,320 --> 05:27:52,080
you want a monument then you can still

8686
05:27:52,080 --> 05:27:54,958
purchase a lot. I'm sorry. Plot not a

8687
05:27:54,958 --> 05:27:57,082
lot.

8688
05:27:57,082 --> 05:27:57,760
[clears throat and cough]

8689
05:27:57,760 --> 05:27:59,440
>> Oh, are they? Oh, I thought they were

8690
05:27:59,440 --> 05:28:01,360
>> I will gladly buy those tomorrow when I

8691
05:28:01,360 --> 05:28:02,480
call you. I did not know there were any

8692
05:28:02,480 --> 05:28:02,958
available.

8693
05:28:02,958 --> 05:28:04,320
>> It's also the grade.

8694
05:28:04,320 --> 05:28:05,200
>> What did you say?

8695
05:28:05,200 --> 05:28:07,360
>> The and there No, they did. I mean, is

8696
05:28:07,360 --> 05:28:09,040
it partially the grade? But part

8697
05:28:09,040 --> 05:28:10,160
>> issue too because

8698
05:28:10,160 --> 05:28:12,080
>> because there's more of a slope in that

8699
05:28:12,080 --> 05:28:12,638
section.

8700
05:28:12,638 --> 05:28:14,480
>> Okay. To quicken do your three minutes.

8701
05:28:14,480 --> 05:28:16,718
That was my first question. Thank you. I

8702
05:28:16,718 --> 05:28:18,718
had hoped we could change it to include

8703
05:28:18,718 --> 05:28:20,240
uprights. It sounds like that's not an

8704
05:28:20,240 --> 05:28:22,878
option. The the other question was in

8705
05:28:22,878 --> 05:28:27,280
our code we include it to be uh double

8706
05:28:27,280 --> 05:28:31,280
deep cast double deep casket/vault

8707
05:28:31,280 --> 05:28:33,680
burials are not allowed in the alpine

8708
05:28:33,680 --> 05:28:36,240
cemetery and every cemetery I've been to

8709
05:28:36,240 --> 05:28:38,480
this is the case but I haven't been to a

8710
05:28:38,480 --> 05:28:41,520
lot where double is the norm where

8711
05:28:41,520 --> 05:28:43,760
usually a husband and wife are in the

8712
05:28:43,760 --> 05:28:45,840
same place. Is there a reason why we

8713
05:28:45,840 --> 05:28:47,280
don't do that? Now, I understand we

8714
05:28:47,280 --> 05:28:50,400
allow in the code to have one adult and

8715
05:28:50,400 --> 05:28:52,160
two children. Is that correct?

8716
05:28:52,160 --> 05:28:52,958
>> Infants are

8717
05:28:52,958 --> 05:28:53,680
>> no infants.

8718
05:28:53,680 --> 05:28:55,040
>> Infants are created.

8719
05:28:55,040 --> 05:28:57,360
>> Is there no way to allow folks to have

8720
05:28:57,360 --> 05:29:00,240
two people? Would that not help uh

8721
05:29:00,240 --> 05:29:02,400
increase capacity into the cemetery?

8722
05:29:02,400 --> 05:29:03,680
>> I think there was something to do with

8723
05:29:03,680 --> 05:29:05,520
>> it would, but it's a safety issue with

8724
05:29:05,520 --> 05:29:07,360
the type of soils that are up there.

8725
05:29:07,360 --> 05:29:08,400
>> Okay. I didn't know.

8726
05:29:08,400 --> 05:29:10,080
>> You know, you have to to put two, you

8727
05:29:10,080 --> 05:29:11,680
have to dig deeper.

8728
05:29:11,680 --> 05:29:15,120
>> Oh, okay. So it doesn't work up here. We

8729
05:29:15,120 --> 05:29:16,878
don't know how we can do it safely and

8730
05:29:16,878 --> 05:29:18,878
meet OSHA requirements.

8731
05:29:18,878 --> 05:29:21,840
>> Okay. Uh that that those were let me see

8732
05:29:21,840 --> 05:29:25,440
the 18 inches in height for the flowers.

8733
05:29:25,440 --> 05:29:26,958
Do you think people will actually

8734
05:29:26,958 --> 05:29:28,240
measure and like we'll be able to

8735
05:29:28,240 --> 05:29:29,920
enforce that?

8736
05:29:29,920 --> 05:29:31,360
>> I don't think you'll see any of us out

8737
05:29:31,360 --> 05:29:33,120
there at the table. But

8738
05:29:33,120 --> 05:29:34,558
>> is there a reason why we include it?

8739
05:29:34,558 --> 05:29:37,680
Should we include it or get rid of it?

8740
05:29:37,680 --> 05:29:39,680
>> I think it's pretty standard. When I was

8741
05:29:39,680 --> 05:29:41,760
reading through, I felt like it would be

8742
05:29:41,760 --> 05:29:43,120
so restrictive to folks.

8743
05:29:43,120 --> 05:29:44,638
>> I think it's just a standard. I don't

8744
05:29:44,638 --> 05:29:47,200
think I've never seen them, you know,

8745
05:29:47,200 --> 05:29:49,280
especially on days like Memorial Day and

8746
05:29:49,280 --> 05:29:49,680
whatnot.

8747
05:29:49,680 --> 05:29:51,040
>> Well, do you want to keep it or just get

8748
05:29:51,040 --> 05:29:52,480
rid of it or just

8749
05:29:52,480 --> 05:29:53,680
>> does it just bar?

8750
05:29:53,680 --> 05:29:55,280
>> I mean, I think it's just so that people

8751
05:29:55,280 --> 05:29:57,440
won't go I mean I

8752
05:29:57,440 --> 05:29:59,280
>> Okay. And I understand, you know, people

8753
05:29:59,280 --> 05:30:01,360
that are grieving, um, they deal with

8754
05:30:01,360 --> 05:30:03,600
things differently and sometimes that is

8755
05:30:03,600 --> 05:30:06,638
the way that they are grieving is to

8756
05:30:06,638 --> 05:30:09,680
pour everything onto where their loved

8757
05:30:09,680 --> 05:30:13,200
one is. Um but I think also you know

8758
05:30:13,200 --> 05:30:15,280
part of administratively you have to

8759
05:30:15,280 --> 05:30:18,480
look at it that way as to we can still

8760
05:30:18,480 --> 05:30:20,958
allow them to show that but within

8761
05:30:20,958 --> 05:30:23,600
reason without infringing on

8762
05:30:23,600 --> 05:30:25,440
>> neighboring grave sites without I think

8763
05:30:25,440 --> 05:30:26,958
that's part of as it falls over it's

8764
05:30:26,958 --> 05:30:28,798
going to go onto somebody else's plot.

8765
05:30:28,798 --> 05:30:29,360
It's

8766
05:30:29,360 --> 05:30:31,840
>> okay. So yeah I it feels the whole thing

8767
05:30:31,840 --> 05:30:33,440
>> I don't see them changing it but I think

8768
05:30:33,440 --> 05:30:35,120
it's just to keep it from getting out of

8769
05:30:35,120 --> 05:30:35,520
hand.

8770
05:30:35,520 --> 05:30:37,280
>> Okay. I I mean I had like three or four

8771
05:30:37,280 --> 05:30:38,798
corrections. When the motion happens I

8772
05:30:38,798 --> 05:30:40,718
can add them. you guys can deny or or

8773
05:30:40,718 --> 05:30:42,718
keep them. The whole thing feels really

8774
05:30:42,718 --> 05:30:44,718
restrictive and aggressive. That's just

8775
05:30:44,718 --> 05:30:46,638
that was just the general takeaway. Like

8776
05:30:46,638 --> 05:30:48,320
the first Monday in March, the first

8777
05:30:48,320 --> 05:30:50,718
Monday in June, 18 in April 1st to

8778
05:30:50,718 --> 05:30:53,200
October 31st, one week. So, I was trying

8779
05:30:53,200 --> 05:30:55,520
to mellow it out a little bit. So, I had

8780
05:30:55,520 --> 05:30:57,280
two additions that I thought would

8781
05:30:57,280 --> 05:30:59,440
mellow it out given that those other

8782
05:30:59,440 --> 05:31:01,040
things are not allowed, the the double

8783
05:31:01,040 --> 05:31:03,600
burial or the upright. Um, and that was

8784
05:31:03,600 --> 05:31:05,440
change it from one week to two weeks

8785
05:31:05,440 --> 05:31:06,798
just so people had a little bit more

8786
05:31:06,798 --> 05:31:08,320
leeway. If you don't want that, we don't

8787
05:31:08,320 --> 05:31:09,920
have to, but I think it would I think it

8788
05:31:09,920 --> 05:31:11,840
would be easier for people two weeks.

8789
05:31:11,840 --> 05:31:13,360
They've got a little bit more span of

8790
05:31:13,360 --> 05:31:15,840
time before things get cleaned up. Um,

8791
05:31:15,840 --> 05:31:17,920
and then where it says 18 inches in

8792
05:31:17,920 --> 05:31:20,160
height, any items left on the grass or

8793
05:31:20,160 --> 05:31:22,718
items that obstruct maintenance will be

8794
05:31:22,718 --> 05:31:24,798
removed and disposed of without prior

8795
05:31:24,798 --> 05:31:26,558
notice. Meaning, if they don't put them

8796
05:31:26,558 --> 05:31:29,280
close enough to the gravestone head,

8797
05:31:29,280 --> 05:31:32,080
they'll just be removed. I felt like

8798
05:31:32,080 --> 05:31:34,000
language could be better if not able to

8799
05:31:34,000 --> 05:31:36,480
be reasonably placed on the monument's

8800
05:31:36,480 --> 05:31:38,798
headstone or cement border. Meaning if

8801
05:31:38,798 --> 05:31:40,718
it is on the grass and it's not

8802
05:31:40,718 --> 05:31:43,280
reasonable just to scoot it up to the

8803
05:31:43,280 --> 05:31:45,520
headstone that it could be removed. So

8804
05:31:45,520 --> 05:31:48,080
just something where I understand a

8805
05:31:48,080 --> 05:31:50,320
mower has got a mow but something where

8806
05:31:50,320 --> 05:31:52,080
if the mower can just reasonably scooch

8807
05:31:52,080 --> 05:31:55,040
it just just scooch it that that the

8808
05:31:55,040 --> 05:31:56,878
language is if not able to be reasonably

8809
05:31:56,878 --> 05:31:59,120
placed on the monument's headstone or

8810
05:31:59,120 --> 05:32:01,680
cement border. So, those are I'd be

8811
05:32:01,680 --> 05:32:04,160
happy with two weeks and a reasonable

8812
05:32:04,160 --> 05:32:06,558
clause of putting things in the right

8813
05:32:06,558 --> 05:32:08,638
spot. If no one likes that, I'm alone.

8814
05:32:08,638 --> 05:32:08,958
>> Okay.

8815
05:32:08,958 --> 05:32:12,080
>> Brent, did you have any comments? Okay.

8816
05:32:12,080 --> 05:32:13,680
Um, with no further comment, I'll

8817
05:32:13,680 --> 05:32:15,600
entertain a motion.

8818
05:32:15,600 --> 05:32:18,558
>> Oh, I move to approve ordinance number

8819
05:32:18,558 --> 05:32:21,360
2026-10, including amendments to

8820
05:32:21,360 --> 05:32:24,798
sections 8.04.06

8821
05:32:24,798 --> 05:32:26,878
and 8.04090

8822
05:32:26,878 --> 05:32:29,680
of the Alpine Municipal Code. Is there a

8823
05:32:29,680 --> 05:32:30,160
second?

8824
05:32:30,160 --> 05:32:31,360
>> I'll second.

8825
05:32:31,360 --> 05:32:33,280
>> So moved by Councilwoman Blackwell,

8826
05:32:33,280 --> 05:32:35,760
seconded by Councilman Rumler.

8827
05:32:35,760 --> 05:32:38,958
>> Would you accept an amendment to it?

8828
05:32:38,958 --> 05:32:40,638
>> I can I propose an amendment and feel

8829
05:32:40,638 --> 05:32:42,240
free to deny or accept. The amendment

8830
05:32:42,240 --> 05:32:44,558
would move it up to one week to up to

8831
05:32:44,558 --> 05:32:47,520
two weeks after internment. That's one

8832
05:32:47,520 --> 05:32:49,440
amendment that you can deny or accept.

8833
05:32:49,440 --> 05:32:52,558
And the other amendment is in number one

8834
05:32:52,558 --> 05:32:54,718
on the decor decoration policy to

8835
05:32:54,718 --> 05:32:58,080
include the verbiage after disposed or

8836
05:32:58,080 --> 05:33:00,638
without prior notice if not able to be

8837
05:33:00,638 --> 05:33:02,400
reasonably placed on the monument's

8838
05:33:02,400 --> 05:33:04,320
headstone or cement border.

8839
05:33:04,320 --> 05:33:06,080
>> Where where's the other one located that

8840
05:33:06,080 --> 05:33:07,040
you just read?

8841
05:33:07,040 --> 05:33:08,718
>> Um I believe it's

8842
05:33:08,718 --> 05:33:10,480
>> so it said that

8843
05:33:10,480 --> 05:33:11,760
>> the way that it's stated it's saying

8844
05:33:11,760 --> 05:33:14,000
that if it's not on the headstone it

8845
05:33:14,000 --> 05:33:16,080
will be disposed of and he's saying that

8846
05:33:16,080 --> 05:33:18,558
it needs to be placed on the headstone.

8847
05:33:18,558 --> 05:33:20,718
So the question for you is are you do

8848
05:33:20,718 --> 05:33:23,280
you accept the amendment? Yes or no? If

8849
05:33:23,280 --> 05:33:25,760
you accept it then we'll ask the second

8850
05:33:25,760 --> 05:33:28,000
if he you know if he accepts the second

8851
05:33:28,000 --> 05:33:30,160
otherwise we could do a substitute

8852
05:33:30,160 --> 05:33:32,320
motion but it's up to you as the

8853
05:33:32,320 --> 05:33:33,920
original um

8854
05:33:33,920 --> 05:33:34,718
>> motion provider

8855
05:33:34,718 --> 05:33:37,686
>> motion person owner of the motion.

8856
05:33:37,686 --> 05:33:38,558
[laughter]

8857
05:33:38,558 --> 05:33:40,160
>> Oh my gosh you guys I've been up for

8858
05:33:40,160 --> 05:33:41,840
almost 24 hours.

8859
05:33:41,840 --> 05:33:46,160
>> The one week to two week I'm I I don't

8860
05:33:46,160 --> 05:33:49,520
know. I I feel like

8861
05:33:49,520 --> 05:33:51,840
I Sorry, Andrew. I think I

8862
05:33:51,840 --> 05:33:54,000
>> I feel like the people who who deal with

8863
05:33:54,000 --> 05:33:57,440
or not deal with care for our cemetery

8864
05:33:57,440 --> 05:33:59,680
know best. And I I don't know why we're

8865
05:33:59,680 --> 05:34:02,080
inserting that ourselves into what they

8866
05:34:02,080 --> 05:34:03,600
think is best.

8867
05:34:03,600 --> 05:34:05,360
>> Well, I just since you're questioning

8868
05:34:05,360 --> 05:34:07,280
it, the reasoning behind it, it's just

8869
05:34:07,280 --> 05:34:08,240
because

8870
05:34:08,240 --> 05:34:10,160
>> No, I understand you're trying to be

8871
05:34:10,160 --> 05:34:12,320
considerate. I I really do. I No, that

8872
05:34:12,320 --> 05:34:13,200
wasn't what I was going to say that

8873
05:34:13,200 --> 05:34:14,400
you're trying to be considerate of. I

8874
05:34:14,400 --> 05:34:15,680
think our staff is trying to be

8875
05:34:15,680 --> 05:34:17,120
considerate too.

8876
05:34:17,120 --> 05:34:19,360
>> No, no, I totally get it. So I the

8877
05:34:19,360 --> 05:34:21,360
question at hand though is do you accept

8878
05:34:21,360 --> 05:34:24,080
this um the amendments?

8879
05:34:24,080 --> 05:34:24,718
>> Um

8880
05:34:24,718 --> 05:34:27,360
>> I'm sorry I'm [laughter] like literally

8881
05:34:27,360 --> 05:34:29,360
>> Well, is there since there was a defense

8882
05:34:29,360 --> 05:34:32,160
of it that the verbal I know I respect

8883
05:34:32,160 --> 05:34:32,878
your

8884
05:34:32,878 --> 05:34:33,760
>> Hold on just a second.

8885
05:34:33,760 --> 05:34:36,160
>> I I feel pretty confident what with what

8886
05:34:36,160 --> 05:34:40,160
I've read here and and so sorry Andrew

8887
05:34:40,160 --> 05:34:41,520
>> on neither.

8888
05:34:41,520 --> 05:34:44,080
>> Yeah. So I have I have one. Would you

8889
05:34:44,080 --> 05:34:46,638
accept removing the 18 inches? That

8890
05:34:46,638 --> 05:34:48,798
feels micromanagy

8891
05:34:48,798 --> 05:34:51,200
>> like to tell people that are grieving

8892
05:34:51,200 --> 05:34:54,240
like you can't exceed something more

8893
05:34:54,240 --> 05:34:57,040
than 18 in like that feels.

8894
05:34:57,040 --> 05:34:58,798
>> Was there what's the reasoning behind

8895
05:34:58,798 --> 05:35:00,080
that? Is it just

8896
05:35:00,080 --> 05:35:02,160
>> so there's not massive like flowers or

8897
05:35:02,160 --> 05:35:02,798
something?

8898
05:35:02,798 --> 05:35:03,760
>> Oh

8899
05:35:03,760 --> 05:35:05,360
>> yeah. I'd be open to that.

8900
05:35:05,360 --> 05:35:07,440
>> I haven't heard a response to your

8901
05:35:07,440 --> 05:35:07,600
question.

8902
05:35:07,600 --> 05:35:09,760
>> I know. Deion was there.

8903
05:35:09,760 --> 05:35:12,080
So, for me personally, when I read it

8904
05:35:12,080 --> 05:35:15,360
and I went to other cities, it's almost

8905
05:35:15,360 --> 05:35:17,280
exactly the same. That's the thing.

8906
05:35:17,280 --> 05:35:19,440
Like, if it was something that I felt

8907
05:35:19,440 --> 05:35:21,440
like no other city did only, I'd be

8908
05:35:21,440 --> 05:35:24,558
like, "Hey, um, we're being a little too

8909
05:35:24,558 --> 05:35:26,320
specific."

8910
05:35:26,320 --> 05:35:28,958
But I but I really don't know. I My

8911
05:35:28,958 --> 05:35:31,440
guess is that they didn't want to get

8912
05:35:31,440 --> 05:35:32,638
But I'm

8913
05:35:32,638 --> 05:35:34,558
>> just for consistency. And like I

8914
05:35:34,558 --> 05:35:36,958
appreciate what Chrissy said because

8915
05:35:36,958 --> 05:35:39,360
Troy and I are the ones with the most

8916
05:35:39,360 --> 05:35:42,000
numbers of phone calls and and questions

8917
05:35:42,000 --> 05:35:43,680
and issues and people who decorate the

8918
05:35:43,680 --> 05:35:45,040
entire grass space and then you're

8919
05:35:45,040 --> 05:35:47,440
trying to prepare a grave and you don't

8920
05:35:47,440 --> 05:35:49,040
want to drive over their decoration. You

8921
05:35:49,040 --> 05:35:50,080
know what I mean? There's just a

8922
05:35:50,080 --> 05:35:53,440
thousand issues. And so before we went

8923
05:35:53,440 --> 05:35:55,360
over this every single word, I

8924
05:35:55,360 --> 05:35:57,200
researched all the cemeteries around us.

8925
05:35:57,200 --> 05:35:59,120
It is like the mayor said, very standard

8926
05:35:59,120 --> 05:36:01,200
language. And we're trying to just

8927
05:36:01,200 --> 05:36:04,480
confine the decorations to allow them to

8928
05:36:04,480 --> 05:36:06,958
memorialize their loved ones but on the

8929
05:36:06,958 --> 05:36:08,558
headstone and the border because then

8930
05:36:08,558 --> 05:36:11,520
the mowers can h you know move the next

8931
05:36:11,520 --> 05:36:13,760
burials can happen other visitors can

8932
05:36:13,760 --> 05:36:15,920
come through and it's not encroaching

8933
05:36:15,920 --> 05:36:18,480
and then we're not judging oh these are

8934
05:36:18,480 --> 05:36:20,400
really cute so we'll leave those in the

8935
05:36:20,400 --> 05:36:23,040
grass but your annoying windmills are

8936
05:36:23,040 --> 05:36:25,840
going or your shepherd's hooks that got

8937
05:36:25,840 --> 05:36:27,680
flung into the mower. Do you know what I

8938
05:36:27,680 --> 05:36:28,958
mean? There's just all these other

8939
05:36:28,958 --> 05:36:30,160
issues

8940
05:36:30,160 --> 05:36:32,080
>> that we're dealing with with maintenance

8941
05:36:32,080 --> 05:36:35,280
and other burials and delays because

8942
05:36:35,280 --> 05:36:37,840
there's things in the way. So, it isn't

8943
05:36:37,840 --> 05:36:40,558
an arbitrary decision. It's based on how

8944
05:36:40,558 --> 05:36:41,920
everybody's kind of handling their

8945
05:36:41,920 --> 05:36:43,200
cemeteries

8946
05:36:43,200 --> 05:36:45,440
>> and trying to let people know ahead of

8947
05:36:45,440 --> 05:36:46,878
time so they're not

8948
05:36:46,878 --> 05:36:48,798
>> surprised and upset. We're not trying to

8949
05:36:48,798 --> 05:36:50,638
take their their decorations. We just

8950
05:36:50,638 --> 05:36:53,120
want them on the headstone. And then for

8951
05:36:53,120 --> 05:36:53,600
cleanup,

8952
05:36:53,600 --> 05:36:55,200
>> all of that made sense. It was just the

8953
05:36:55,200 --> 05:36:58,160
18 in like standard leaving and then it

8954
05:36:58,160 --> 05:37:00,240
was and I'm a rules follower and I'm

8955
05:37:00,240 --> 05:37:02,480
like wait the flowers we've got to cut

8956
05:37:02,480 --> 05:37:04,240
them

8957
05:37:04,240 --> 05:37:08,160
adds like this extra layer of anxiety

8958
05:37:08,160 --> 05:37:10,638
>> if I'm a person that reads things and

8959
05:37:10,638 --> 05:37:11,680
says

8960
05:37:11,680 --> 05:37:14,320
>> oh wait um everybody brought their

8961
05:37:14,320 --> 05:37:15,600
flowers

8962
05:37:15,600 --> 05:37:18,160
>> but there's no enforcement I mean it's just a courtesy

8963
05:37:18,160 --> 05:37:19,840
>> why would we include it if there's no

8964
05:37:19,840 --> 05:37:22,480
enforcement why it's a courtesy

8965
05:37:22,480 --> 05:37:25,680
>> I was just at a graveside and if they

8966
05:37:25,680 --> 05:37:26,480
had

8967
05:37:26,480 --> 05:37:29,120
>> had to have that extra pressure of

8968
05:37:29,120 --> 05:37:31,360
making sure everything was 18 in that

8969
05:37:31,360 --> 05:37:32,080
just

8970
05:37:32,080 --> 05:37:32,832
>> I think they're doing it.

8971
05:37:32,832 --> 05:37:34,160
[clears throat] So Andrew, I think the

8972
05:37:34,160 --> 05:37:35,280
reason that they have it though,

8973
05:37:35,280 --> 05:37:37,360
honestly, is to prevent, you know, you

8974
05:37:37,360 --> 05:37:39,440
talked about these ordinances and trying

8975
05:37:39,440 --> 05:37:41,348
to look and kind of mitigate

8976
05:37:41,348 --> 05:37:42,160
[clears throat]

8977
05:37:42,160 --> 05:37:44,638
possible future issues and whatnot.

8978
05:37:44,638 --> 05:37:44,958
>> Right.

8979
05:37:44,958 --> 05:37:47,120
>> I think long as with it like it's within

8980
05:37:47,120 --> 05:37:48,798
reason. But, you know, if you do have

8981
05:37:48,798 --> 05:37:50,480
somebody that is excessive all the time

8982
05:37:50,480 --> 05:37:53,280
and is infringing on others people's on

8983
05:37:53,280 --> 05:37:55,440
other people's

8984
05:37:55,440 --> 05:37:59,440
grieving time or other um

8985
05:37:59,440 --> 05:38:01,600
>> if you know if they're digging another

8986
05:38:01,600 --> 05:38:03,600
grave site and impinging on somebody

8987
05:38:03,600 --> 05:38:06,718
else being able to celebrate and mourn

8988
05:38:06,718 --> 05:38:08,878
for their loved ones at the cost and

8989
05:38:08,878 --> 05:38:12,160
delay. I I'm not saying that it happens

8990
05:38:12,160 --> 05:38:13,760
all the time, but I think it's something

8991
05:38:13,760 --> 05:38:15,840
that they can say and say, and I don't

8992
05:38:15,840 --> 05:38:17,120
think, like I said, they're not going to

8993
05:38:17,120 --> 05:38:19,360
go, "Oh, this is 19 inches.

8994
05:38:19,360 --> 05:38:20,718
>> We're throwing it out."

8995
05:38:20,718 --> 05:38:22,718
>> I think it's if they see an excess and

8996
05:38:22,718 --> 05:38:25,280
it's infringing on other people and it's

8997
05:38:25,280 --> 05:38:26,958
infringing on our staff's ability to do

8998
05:38:26,958 --> 05:38:29,440
their job. I think then we could say,

8999
05:38:29,440 --> 05:38:31,520
"Hey, our ordinance says this, is there

9000
05:38:31,520 --> 05:38:33,920
any way do you know what I'm saying? I

9001
05:38:33,920 --> 05:38:36,320
totally get only if it's abused. I don't

9002
05:38:36,320 --> 05:38:38,558
see we don't have the bandwidth to go

9003
05:38:38,558 --> 05:38:41,600
and measure every single It's just it's

9004
05:38:41,600 --> 05:38:43,680
just really restrictive and strict.

9005
05:38:43,680 --> 05:38:44,638
That's where I'm not.

9006
05:38:44,638 --> 05:38:46,160
>> I think it's just really to mitigate and

9007
05:38:46,160 --> 05:38:47,680
to your point like what you said about

9008
05:38:47,680 --> 05:38:49,120
the ordinances, it's like, hey, why

9009
05:38:49,120 --> 05:38:51,840
can't we think of future situations and

9010
05:38:51,840 --> 05:38:54,400
try to do it and knowing that this could

9011
05:38:54,400 --> 05:38:58,958
be restrictive? But in the case that if if it does get excessive, we have

9012
05:38:58,958 --> 05:39:00,638
something otherwise we have to let him

9013
05:39:00,638 --> 05:39:01,760
do it because we don't have anything

9014
05:39:01,760 --> 05:39:02,958
that limits.

9015
05:39:02,958 --> 05:39:04,240
>> Sarah, would you accept it? Well, at

9016
05:39:04,240 --> 05:39:06,000
first you think you have to either deny

9017
05:39:06,000 --> 05:39:07,440
or accept hers.

9018
05:39:07,440 --> 05:39:09,840
>> Did you? I think as of now I this is

9019
05:39:09,840 --> 05:39:12,798
I'll just keep the motion to what I

9020
05:39:12,798 --> 05:39:15,440
>> You're denying Jessica's.

9021
05:39:15,440 --> 05:39:17,280
>> Okay, let's proceed with the roll call

9022
05:39:17,280 --> 05:39:18,240
vote.

9023
05:39:18,240 --> 05:39:20,320
>> Jessica, yes.

9024
05:39:20,320 --> 05:39:21,360
>> Sarah Blackwell, yes.

9025
05:39:21,360 --> 05:39:22,240
>> Chrissy, yes.

9026
05:39:22,240 --> 05:39:24,240
>> Andrew Young, no. Brent Remler, yes.

9027
05:39:24,240 --> 05:39:26,638
>> Okay, motion passes. Is that it? Okay.

9028
05:39:26,638 --> 05:39:28,718
Oh, we still have staff communications.

9029
05:39:28,718 --> 05:39:31,120
Okay, staff communications. Um, I just

9030
05:39:31,120 --> 05:39:34,000
wanted to say, um,

9031
05:39:34,000 --> 05:39:37,520
let's proceed with I'm sorry, I am a

9032
05:39:37,520 --> 05:39:39,760
little bit delirious right now. Chiefs,

9033
05:39:39,760 --> 05:39:41,680
did you have anything to report?

9034
05:39:41,680 --> 05:39:43,834
>> So many things.

9035
05:39:43,834 --> 05:39:44,240
[laughter]

9036
05:39:44,240 --> 05:39:46,000
>> I appreciate you guys coming and

9037
05:39:46,000 --> 05:39:49,200
representing your departments. Um, let's

9038
05:39:49,200 --> 05:39:50,878
see.

9039
05:39:50,878 --> 05:39:52,878
Again, Kaden, welcome, but I'm going to

9040
05:39:52,878 --> 05:39:54,798
skip you if you don't mind. Shane, do

9041
05:39:54,798 --> 05:39:55,840
you have anything for us?

9042
05:39:55,840 --> 05:39:57,440
>> I'll send you an email tomorrow.

9043
05:39:57,440 --> 05:39:58,240
>> Okay, Brent.

9044
05:39:58,240 --> 05:39:59,520
>> Yeah, attend the drill.

9045
05:39:59,520 --> 05:40:01,040
>> Oh, I'm sorry. I was going to say before

9046
05:40:01,040 --> 05:40:02,958
we go to council communications, you

9047
05:40:02,958 --> 05:40:05,600
guys, this is the time like Brent was

9048
05:40:05,600 --> 05:40:07,600
starting. I'm sorry to, but council

9049
05:40:07,600 --> 05:40:09,360
communications is really a time for you

9050
05:40:09,360 --> 05:40:11,760
guys to update us on your council

9051
05:40:11,760 --> 05:40:14,240
assignments. The, you know, the

9052
05:40:14,240 --> 05:40:15,920
committees that you meet with and moving

9053
05:40:15,920 --> 05:40:18,718
forward with that. If you have ideas for

9054
05:40:18,718 --> 05:40:20,480
projects or anything else like that,

9055
05:40:20,480 --> 05:40:22,000
that's something that we have a process

9056
05:40:22,000 --> 05:40:24,400
for that. you get another council person

9057
05:40:24,400 --> 05:40:26,000
and you get it put on the agenda and

9058
05:40:26,000 --> 05:40:28,000
we'll move forward with discussions and

9059
05:40:28,000 --> 05:40:31,040
then forward after that. So, just wanted

9060
05:40:31,040 --> 05:40:33,280
to kind of clarify that. Okay. Go ahead,

9061
05:40:33,280 --> 05:40:34,080
Brent. Sorry.

9062
05:40:34,080 --> 05:40:36,558
>> I only have 23 words.

9063
05:40:36,558 --> 05:40:38,958
>> Oh, I attended that. [laughter]

9064
05:40:38,958 --> 05:40:40,878
>> Uh the trails committee, just a

9065
05:40:40,878 --> 05:40:43,120
reminder, this this coming Saturday, 8

9066
05:40:43,120 --> 05:40:45,360
a.m. is the first trail service day. You

9067
05:40:45,360 --> 05:40:47,360
can sign up on the spreadsheet for a

9068
05:40:47,360 --> 05:40:49,280
specific assignment or just show up at

9069
05:40:49,280 --> 05:40:52,000
the Lambert Park Bowery at 8 am and

9070
05:40:52,000 --> 05:40:53,920
there'll be donuts afterwards.

9071
05:40:53,920 --> 05:40:54,400
>> Thank you.

9072
05:40:54,400 --> 05:40:55,520
>> So, we'll see you out there on the

9073
05:40:55,520 --> 05:40:56,480
trails.

9074
05:40:56,480 --> 05:40:57,760
>> I don't have anything.

9075
05:40:57,760 --> 05:40:59,920
>> Oh, did they see where you said bow?

9076
05:40:59,920 --> 05:41:01,600
>> All right. Okay. I'm sorry. Go ahead,

9077
05:41:01,600 --> 05:41:02,320
Sarah.

9078
05:41:02,320 --> 05:41:04,718
>> Um, uh, with regards to the Chamber of

9079
05:41:04,718 --> 05:41:06,798
Commerce, I guess I will start doing

9080
05:41:06,798 --> 05:41:08,718
more with that now that we know which

9081
05:41:08,718 --> 05:41:10,558
direction we are headed with that

9082
05:41:10,558 --> 05:41:13,120
history committee. Um,

9083
05:41:13,120 --> 05:41:17,040
>> I was over spring break I was at the

9084
05:41:17,040 --> 05:41:19,760
>> Olsen home almost every day cleaning it

9085
05:41:19,760 --> 05:41:22,718
out looking for um artifacts and things

9086
05:41:22,718 --> 05:41:25,520
that maybe we could put in our senior

9087
05:41:25,520 --> 05:41:27,600
center. I found some really interesting

9088
05:41:27,600 --> 05:41:29,760
things and some really cool letters and

9089
05:41:29,760 --> 05:41:32,718
things like that. So I um just been

9090
05:41:32,718 --> 05:41:34,480
helping with that. We're hoping Jessica

9091
05:41:34,480 --> 05:41:36,638
and I or Councilwoman Muan and I are

9092
05:41:36,638 --> 05:41:37,760
hoping to

9093
05:41:37,760 --> 05:41:39,600
>> you know get going I think on the

9094
05:41:39,600 --> 05:41:42,718
committee. I I I'm I think Jessica's the

9095
05:41:42,718 --> 05:41:45,666
head and I'm the the assistant. I'm

9096
05:41:45,666 --> 05:41:46,000
[laughter]

9097
05:41:46,000 --> 05:41:48,080
>> And then with water committee work.

9098
05:41:48,080 --> 05:41:49,120
>> Um

9099
05:41:49,120 --> 05:41:50,798
>> yeah, we've been meeting every week like

9100
05:41:50,798 --> 05:41:53,840
Chrissy or Councilwoman Hannimman said.

9101
05:41:53,840 --> 05:41:55,280
Um I think that's going really well.

9102
05:41:55,280 --> 05:41:57,040
We're right now working on some positive

9103
05:41:57,040 --> 05:41:58,558
messaging and education for the

9104
05:41:58,558 --> 05:42:02,958
residents. Um Chrissy's been great. Um,

9105
05:42:02,958 --> 05:42:04,400
in fact, she should probably stay on

9106
05:42:04,400 --> 05:42:06,798
there, [laughter] but she's been really

9107
05:42:06,798 --> 05:42:09,680
great with um some marketing ideas and

9108
05:42:09,680 --> 05:42:10,958
things like that. So, we're hoping

9109
05:42:10,958 --> 05:42:13,200
that's moving in a good direction. Um,

9110
05:42:13,200 --> 05:42:14,718
AYC

9111
05:42:14,718 --> 05:42:18,160
um we meet tomorrow at 10:00 a.m. We

9112
05:42:18,160 --> 05:42:20,400
we're kind of doing a little bit of a

9113
05:42:20,400 --> 05:42:23,280
shift as far as like our goals and

9114
05:42:23,280 --> 05:42:24,718
things like that. So, I'm excited to

9115
05:42:24,718 --> 05:42:26,958
talk to AYC about some of the changes

9116
05:42:26,958 --> 05:42:30,708
that were going to be made.

9117
05:42:30,718 --> 05:42:34,000
» Okay. Thank you. Um, as far as the water

9118
05:42:34,000 --> 05:42:36,958
committee, we um are having a public

9119
05:42:36,958 --> 05:42:39,680
night

9120
05:42:39,680 --> 05:42:42,080
and we'll Heidi knows the date.

9121
05:42:42,080 --> 05:42:42,558
>> May 6th.

9122
05:42:42,558 --> 05:42:43,520
>> I think it's May 6th.

9123
05:42:43,520 --> 05:42:46,958
>> Thank you. May 6th. So, um I know that

9124
05:42:46,958 --> 05:42:49,040
we're using all the messaging options we

9125
05:42:49,040 --> 05:42:51,360
have, but sometimes just a text from

9126
05:42:51,360 --> 05:42:53,520
your neighbor works best. So, send out

9127
05:42:53,520 --> 05:42:56,558
your text um to if anyone has questions

9128
05:42:56,558 --> 05:42:59,200
about water and wants to know more. Um,

9129
05:42:59,200 --> 05:43:02,160
the other thing is, uh, we have our I

9130
05:43:02,160 --> 05:43:04,958
was looking up the dates and but you

9131
05:43:04,958 --> 05:43:06,638
guys probably are better at this than

9132
05:43:06,638 --> 05:43:09,280
me. Um,

9133
05:43:09,280 --> 05:43:12,718
April 23rd and 24th is the Utah League

9134
05:43:12,718 --> 05:43:15,760
of City and Towns um, training in St.

9135
05:43:15,760 --> 05:43:17,760
George

9136
05:43:17,760 --> 05:43:21,680
>> and then uh, the 23rd and 24th. So

9137
05:43:21,680 --> 05:43:24,240
anyways, I those are the things I'm

9138
05:43:24,240 --> 05:43:25,520
reporting on and that's it.

9139
05:43:25,520 --> 05:43:26,320
>> Andrew,

9140
05:43:26,320 --> 05:43:28,480
>> yes. Uh

9141
05:43:28,480 --> 05:43:31,120
um the water will you pull up one things

9142
05:43:31,120 --> 05:43:35,440
for the water PI uh committee group what

9143
05:43:35,440 --> 05:43:38,320
do we call it the pressurized irrigation

9144
05:43:38,320 --> 05:43:40,798
>> the committee

9145
05:43:40,798 --> 05:43:43,440
>> it would be in water um

9146
05:43:43,440 --> 05:43:44,878
>> is he talking about the alpine water

9147
05:43:44,878 --> 05:43:45,360
district

9148
05:43:45,360 --> 05:43:47,600
>> grass water yeah alpine water if you

9149
05:43:47,600 --> 05:43:50,240
look up the uh uh the green grass

9150
05:43:50,240 --> 05:43:51,440
drought

9151
05:43:51,440 --> 05:43:58,070
>> um

9152
05:43:58,080 --> 05:44:00,160
Oh yes, thank you. Westfield

9153
05:44:00,160 --> 05:44:01,200
>> the public meeting

9154
05:44:01,200 --> 05:44:04,000
>> just we we had a vote to um start the

9155
05:44:04,000 --> 05:44:07,760
pressurized irrigation on this tomorrow

9156
05:44:07,760 --> 05:44:09,680
>> and we're really I was really it's a

9157
05:44:09,680 --> 05:44:11,360
really great group. Um and so that's

9158
05:44:11,360 --> 05:44:13,040
happening tomorrow and this is some of

9159
05:44:13,040 --> 05:44:15,520
the uh plans that I've been working on

9160
05:44:15,520 --> 05:44:18,160
with some residents to try to help them

9161
05:44:18,160 --> 05:44:20,480
through this year with water. Some of

9162
05:44:20,480 --> 05:44:22,400
the ideas come from Brent cleaning out

9163
05:44:22,400 --> 05:44:25,360
the uh um secondary water filter. And

9164
05:44:25,360 --> 05:44:26,798
then we have a video that's coming out

9165
05:44:26,798 --> 05:44:28,240
to help folks. I'll send it to you guys

9166
05:44:28,240 --> 05:44:30,320
if you have any problems with it. Let me

9167
05:44:30,320 --> 05:44:32,638
know what you think would be better. Um

9168
05:44:32,638 --> 05:44:35,360
>> so I think that's something the water

9169
05:44:35,360 --> 05:44:36,718
committee is working on.

9170
05:44:36,718 --> 05:44:39,040
>> Yeah, I can send it to you. Feel free to

9171
05:44:39,040 --> 05:44:41,840
all the resources. Y take it.

9172
05:44:41,840 --> 05:44:44,638
>> No, I know similar to a lot of the stuff

9173
05:44:44,638 --> 05:44:44,878
that

9174
05:44:44,878 --> 05:44:46,320
>> I'll give you. And then all the files

9175
05:44:46,320 --> 05:44:48,000
are included if she

9176
05:44:48,000 --> 05:44:49,440
>> This looks really, like I said, this

9177
05:44:49,440 --> 05:44:50,798
looks really similar to what I was

9178
05:44:50,798 --> 05:44:52,718
reading that um Mr. Burroughs and

9179
05:44:52,718 --> 05:44:53,680
Christy sent.

9180
05:44:53,680 --> 05:44:54,558
>> You can X out of that.

9181
05:44:54,558 --> 05:44:56,878
>> Instead of doubling on efforts, it'll

9182
05:44:56,878 --> 05:44:58,718
probably be better. It has all the His

9183
05:44:58,718 --> 05:45:01,520
is much more artistic. I didn't make No,

9184
05:45:01,520 --> 05:45:04,160
what I'm saying is work together.

9185
05:45:04,160 --> 05:45:06,000
>> We We really are on two committees that

9186
05:45:06,000 --> 05:45:08,638
are like married. Um we're on the I'm on

9187
05:45:08,638 --> 05:45:09,360
the one with a lot

9188
05:45:09,360 --> 05:45:10,000
>> We're separated.

9189
05:45:10,000 --> 05:45:11,360
>> I'm like on the one with a lot of old

9190
05:45:11,360 --> 05:45:12,638
guys and you're the on the one with like

9191
05:45:12,638 --> 05:45:15,360
a young girls. So, um, anyways, I'll

9192
05:45:15,360 --> 05:45:16,958
send those. And then on that is that you

9193
05:45:16,958 --> 05:45:18,480
can store water barrels up to 2500.

9194
05:45:18,480 --> 05:45:19,760
That's all on that.

9195
05:45:19,760 --> 05:45:20,320
>> Greg,

9196
05:45:20,320 --> 05:45:22,638
>> do we allow that?

9197
05:45:22,638 --> 05:45:24,240
No, because I know like in there was

9198
05:45:24,240 --> 05:45:25,920
that lawsuit in the state of Washington.

9199
05:45:25,920 --> 05:45:27,440
Remember that guy who collected the

9200
05:45:27,440 --> 05:45:30,718
rainwaters and then he created No, no, He did.

9201
05:45:30,718 --> 05:45:32,558
>> Remember that we governed Can we save

9202
05:45:32,558 --> 05:45:34,000
this discussion for offline?

9203
05:45:34,000 --> 05:45:35,360
>> We can save it offline. I'm sorry. Yeah,

9204
05:45:35,360 --> 05:45:37,120
let's skip this. So, okay. You

9205
05:45:37,120 --> 05:45:39,760
>> I'll for you reported on the meeting.

9206
05:45:39,760 --> 05:45:41,120
They did it. That's great.

9207
05:45:41,120 --> 05:45:42,320
>> Okay. So, anything else?

9208
05:45:42,320 --> 05:45:43,200
>> Yes. Yes. Very quick. What other

9209
05:45:43,200 --> 05:45:43,600
committee?

9210
05:45:43,600 --> 05:45:45,440
>> Greg Kamich, the water people are asking

9211
05:45:45,440 --> 05:45:47,600
for decals on their trucks like American

9212
05:45:47,600 --> 05:45:49,280
Fork and Highland Half. I would love to

9213
05:45:49,280 --> 05:45:50,558
help. If you want me to put the logos

9214
05:45:50,558 --> 05:45:52,160
and get a sticker, I'll do it. If you

9215
05:45:52,160 --> 05:45:53,680
just want to do it, let me know.

9216
05:45:53,680 --> 05:45:55,360
>> Are you talking about a larger logo? Cuz

9217
05:45:55,360 --> 05:45:56,480
right now they

9218
05:45:56,480 --> 05:45:58,000
>> right now on their water trucks, it's

9219
05:45:58,000 --> 05:46:00,000
too small. We used to have the larger

9220
05:46:00,000 --> 05:46:02,240
logos. Who Why did we go to the smaller

9221
05:46:02,240 --> 05:46:03,680
logos? Wasn't there a reason?

9222
05:46:03,680 --> 05:46:04,878
>> Like basically the logo on our screen.

9223
05:46:04,878 --> 05:46:05,600
They like

9224
05:46:05,600 --> 05:46:07,440
>> Can we focus on governance issues? This

9225
05:46:07,440 --> 05:46:08,558
is can be put in an email.

9226
05:46:08,558 --> 05:46:09,920
>> This is the water stuff I'm talking

9227
05:46:09,920 --> 05:46:11,360
about. I'm I'm trying to go.

9228
05:46:11,360 --> 05:46:12,958
>> Let's Yeah. No, let's take that offline.

9229
05:46:12,958 --> 05:46:15,440
Is there any other committee updates?

9230
05:46:15,440 --> 05:46:15,840
>> Yes.

9231
05:46:15,840 --> 05:46:16,480
>> What was that?

9232
05:46:16,480 --> 05:46:16,958
>> There are

9233
05:46:16,958 --> 05:46:18,718
>> Yeah, I think we all do.

9234
05:46:18,718 --> 05:46:21,040
>> Well, this is sort of a committee, but

9235
05:46:21,040 --> 05:46:22,958
it's it involves money. So, I need to

9236
05:46:22,958 --> 05:46:25,760
ask you guys the the the people who and

9237
05:46:25,760 --> 05:46:26,558
I don't know if this is supposed to be

9238
05:46:26,558 --> 05:46:29,440
in closed doors, so I'll ask it gently.

9239
05:46:29,440 --> 05:46:31,760
The people who the easement off of

9240
05:46:31,760 --> 05:46:35,520
Alpine Highway has been looked into by a

9241
05:46:35,520 --> 05:46:37,520
uh title company.

9242
05:46:37,520 --> 05:46:39,600
>> Right. So, I saw that email. So, that's

9243
05:46:39,600 --> 05:46:40,958
something if you want permission to

9244
05:46:40,958 --> 05:46:42,480
spend money that you need to bring it

9245
05:46:42,480 --> 05:46:43,360
before council.

9246
05:46:43,360 --> 05:46:44,480
>> Well, I just want to see if you wanted

9247
05:46:44,480 --> 05:46:45,920
me to even bring it before council or if

9248
05:46:45,920 --> 05:46:46,160
you

9249
05:46:46,160 --> 05:46:47,840
>> Well, and I had a question. Don't we

9250
05:46:47,840 --> 05:46:51,680
have um our own discretionary budget as

9251
05:46:51,680 --> 05:46:53,680
city council members? Like, do we really

9252
05:46:53,680 --> 05:46:56,718
have to bring I think it's $2,000?

9253
05:46:56,718 --> 05:46:59,040
Well, it was initially, but there's I

9254
05:46:59,040 --> 05:47:00,718
think this is going to take a lot more

9255
05:47:00,718 --> 05:47:02,320
than what they initially think it is

9256
05:47:02,320 --> 05:47:04,160
because there's layers and layers and

9257
05:47:04,160 --> 05:47:05,360
there's like a

9258
05:47:05,360 --> 05:47:06,080
>> Well, just

9259
05:47:06,080 --> 05:47:07,920
>> but if we have discretionary money that

9260
05:47:07,920 --> 05:47:10,480
we can choose to spend, we could say, I

9261
05:47:10,480 --> 05:47:13,200
want to put this much toward it and see

9262
05:47:13,200 --> 05:47:14,240
how far we can get,

9263
05:47:14,240 --> 05:47:15,840
>> right? But it's still something that you

9264
05:47:15,840 --> 05:47:17,360
need to talk about in an open public

9265
05:47:17,360 --> 05:47:18,958
meeting that needs to be noticed.

9266
05:47:18,958 --> 05:47:20,718
>> Maybe just message me if you want me to

9267
05:47:20,718 --> 05:47:22,400
bring it up. Last two things very

9268
05:47:22,400 --> 05:47:24,718
briefly. They're together. Uh Shane,

9269
05:47:24,718 --> 05:47:27,520
would you be willing to send me the

9270
05:47:27,520 --> 05:47:30,638
contact of the uh developer who's

9271
05:47:30,638 --> 05:47:34,080
working on the um Highbench Healey

9272
05:47:34,080 --> 05:47:35,600
Corner development just because some

9273
05:47:35,600 --> 05:47:36,878
residents just want to reach out and

9274
05:47:36,878 --> 05:47:38,160
have a connection meeting and I don't

9275
05:47:38,160 --> 05:47:39,920
know who it is. I think I think his name

9276
05:47:39,920 --> 05:47:41,840
is Greg or something. I don't know if he

9277
05:47:41,840 --> 05:47:44,240
works with Ross. If you have the

9278
05:47:44,240 --> 05:47:45,680
contact, he was the one that proposed in

9279
05:47:45,680 --> 05:47:47,200
the planning commission. If you have it,

9280
05:47:47,200 --> 05:47:48,958
that's fine. I can follow up. I

9281
05:47:48,958 --> 05:47:50,878
>> think Bobby Patter was there. I heard.

9282
05:47:50,878 --> 05:47:52,638
>> Okay, I'll I'll ask him. Um, and the

9283
05:47:52,638 --> 05:47:56,160
last one is that there uh the uh there's

9284
05:47:56,160 --> 05:47:58,480
several residents asking for information

9285
05:47:58,480 --> 05:48:00,878
on the Healey development and so if you

9286
05:48:00,878 --> 05:48:02,160
could just send me any information you

9287
05:48:02,160 --> 05:48:03,280
have on that so I can forward it to

9288
05:48:03,280 --> 05:48:03,920
them. That's it.

9289
05:48:03,920 --> 05:48:04,480
>> Okay.

9290
05:48:04,480 --> 05:48:05,920
>> Just in the future for that kind of

9291
05:48:05,920 --> 05:48:07,600
stuff, you can email him directly

9292
05:48:07,600 --> 05:48:08,480
instead.

9293
05:48:08,480 --> 05:48:09,120
>> I'll email you.

9294
05:48:09,120 --> 05:48:11,040
>> Okay. I do have one

9295
05:48:11,040 --> 05:48:14,400
>> ask. My husband was going to install the

9296
05:48:14,400 --> 05:48:17,440
um game cam or what are they called? My

9297
05:48:17,440 --> 05:48:20,240
mind is not working. Trail cams. um he

9298
05:48:20,240 --> 05:48:22,400
is having major issues with his back and

9299
05:48:22,400 --> 05:48:25,120
I he is no longer able to do that. We

9300
05:48:25,120 --> 05:48:26,558
have the trail camera. So if you know

9301
05:48:26,558 --> 05:48:30,080
anyone who would like to be or who would

9302
05:48:30,080 --> 05:48:33,040
be willing and able to install

9303
05:48:33,040 --> 05:48:35,520
um I can put you know I can put them all

9304
05:48:35,520 --> 05:48:37,280
together. We have all the batteries. We

9305
05:48:37,280 --> 05:48:40,320
have the you know the SD cards for it.

9306
05:48:40,320 --> 05:48:42,160
They just need to be installed.

9307
05:48:42,160 --> 05:48:42,558
>> Cool.

9308
05:48:42,558 --> 05:48:44,480
>> So if you have suggestion for anybody

9309
05:48:44,480 --> 05:48:46,718
please let me know. Brent,

9310
05:48:46,718 --> 05:48:48,000
>> Jeff,

9311
05:48:48,000 --> 05:48:49,520
>> he was the first one that I thought of,

9312
05:48:49,520 --> 05:48:50,878
but I know he's doing other stuff

9313
05:48:50,878 --> 05:48:52,480
already, but I'll ask him. But if

9314
05:48:52,480 --> 05:48:53,600
there's anybody else you can think of,

9315
05:48:53,600 --> 05:48:56,480
please let me know. I Well, um Okay,

9316
05:48:56,480 --> 05:48:59,282
I'll entertain a motion to adjurnn.

9317
05:48:59,282 --> 05:48:59,600
[clears throat]

9318
05:48:59,600 --> 05:49:02,556
>> I want to talk about the gateway plan.

9319
05:49:02,556 --> 05:49:03,040
[laughter]

9320
05:49:03,040 --> 05:49:04,480
>> Motion to adjurnn.

9321
05:49:04,480 --> 05:49:05,760
>> I'll make the motion to adjurnn.

9322
05:49:05,760 --> 05:49:07,760
>> Second. I'll second that.

9323
05:49:07,760 --> 05:49:09,040
>> Okay. All in favor?

9324
05:49:09,040 --> 05:49:10,878
>> I

9325
05:49:10,878 --> 05:49:14,310
>> adjourn.

9326
05:49:14,320 --> 05:49:16,958
water. I was