[0:07] Good morning. Good morning. Good
morning, everyone.
[0:10] I am Councilwoman Felicia Porter
representing the 10th district and
[0:13] chairperson for the committee. Um, this
is a reminder to please turn off your
[0:18] cell phones. Um, today we have joining
us council members Odette Ramos from the
[0:24] 14th district. And we also have some
wonderful interns um from John's Hopkins
[0:30] University and also from Talson
University today in the chambers. And
[0:35] then we also have several
representatives from the mayor's office
[0:38] and city council president and committee
staff is Margaret Kern. The committee is
[0:44] reconvening the hearing for legislative
oversight LO25-0024
[0:49] oversight of recovery homes and
substance abuse clinics and mental
[0:52] health substance abuse clinics in
Baltimore City. This is an opportunity
[0:57] for um council members and public to
further ask questions about ensuring
[1:02] that individuals in recovery have access
to highquality, safe and well-regulated
[1:07] recovery homes and substance abuse
clinics. This is also an opportunity to
[1:11] evaluate existing policies, access
provider accountability, and explore
[1:15] opportunities to enhance support systems
for individuals in recovery. This
[1:20] discussion will continue to prioritize
community concerns, patient safety, and
[1:24] equitable distribution of recovery
resources in the city. I'm now going to
[1:29] turn it over to our public testimony.
Um, for all that do not know, we have
[1:35] public testimony at the beginning of our
hearings because agencies I want you all
[1:40] to hear what some of the uh community
are going through so that you can alter
[1:44] your presentations um once you all have
the opportunity. So, we're going to now
[1:49] go into public testimony. We're going to
have Kim lead us into public testimony.
[1:54] You're going to have five minutes. And
so,
[1:58] we have a new technology in the chamber
today. Okay. And so you'll see on your
[2:04] deis, it's going to blink yellow when it
is um 15 seconds left. And so we just
[2:10] ask that you wrap up when you see the
blinking yellow light. All right.
[2:14] All right. Very good.
[2:22] And if and if you could tap your
microphone. Is it on?
[2:26] » Perfect. This echo. All right. Kim
Wyman. I'm president of Power Recovery
[2:31] Center. Delighted to be here. Thank you,
Chair Porter, for the opportunity to
[2:34] testify.
Lure is the foundation for protecting
[2:38] client safety and treatment quality,
which I'm sure you'll be discussing
[2:42] today. After lure, most systems can
count admissions, service delivered,
[2:48] discharges, and length of stay, and
other measures. Those measures matter,
[2:54] but they don't move from activity to
impact. They don't answer the harder
[3:00] question. After treatment, are people
safer, more stable, and experiencing a
[3:05] better quality of life? We need a
practical way to see the whole picture
[3:09] across all the varied fragmented
systems, not a monthly report, not a
[3:15] report a month later about some static
measure.
[3:19] We need to intervene earlier, improve
treatment, and make smarter public
[3:25] investments.
PRC is building a platform that connects
[3:29] those scattered and fragmented systems
into one usable longitudinal view of a
[3:35] client's recovery. Instead of looking
only at a treatment episode,
[3:41] PAL can now look at uh across systems
and across time. By this I mean we can
[3:47] examine Crisp ED and EMS and public
court involvement, the 12 months prior
[3:53] to treatment and the 12 months after
treatment as two key factors and two key
[3:59] systems to connect with treatment to
help us see whether treatment is
[4:05] changing health safety, stability, and
the quality of life of our clients over
[4:09] time.
Next, we're going to pilot primary care
[4:13] connection and housing stability because
we see those along the continuum as
[4:19] critical factors in quality of life for
our clients. A longitudinal view of all
[4:25] of the fragmented systems combined with
claims data and clinical data in an
[4:30] electronic health record can examine
outcomes in our system for an
[4:35] individual, for a group that's defined,
or for the larger system as a whole.
[4:40] This platform isn't just a management
tool for PAL. Let me be clear. We want
[4:45] to change public health. It's a working
model for treatment outcomes that
[4:50] provides intelligence that could help
communities move from struggling to
[4:56] count the basics to transparency across
multiple systems and services over a
[5:02] defined period of time. It can tell us
who may need help now, what providers
[5:08] can improve next, and whether people are
doing better over time. Again, we want
[5:14] to change public health, and we want to
ask for your partnership. Thank you.
[5:19] » Thank you so much, Kim. All right. Next,
we're going to have Jan Elyn.
[5:30] » I'm a little shorter.
Thank you. I apologize if I have to take
[5:35] sips of water. The air quality is not
helping my voice.
[5:39] [clears throat] My name is Jan Eland. I
am a resident of Brooklyn in Baltimore
[5:45] City. I am here on behalf of the
Brooklyn Curtis Bay community. Um we
[5:51] have uh recently gotten a group of
neighbors together regarding this
[5:56] problem and started a task force. Um and
we are looking of course at two things.
[6:02] The distribution of the recovery centers
and community concerns. One of our
[6:08] community members has written I think uh
an excellent set of comments that I
[6:14] would like to read.
[clears throat]
[6:17] This neighbor lives across the street
from Garrett Park, one of our parks, and
[6:22] immediately next to our library.
No one should have to feel that. Oops.
[6:29] Sorry, I'm starting with page two.
That's bad. In December 2023,
[6:35] I purchased my very first home in
Brooklyn, Maryland, Baltimore City. I
[6:39] was single, had no children, and was
incredibly proud and excited to become a
[6:42] homeowner. It was a milestone I had
worked hard to achieve. When I moved in,
[6:47] I felt hopeful about the future. My
block was quiet, my neighbors were
[6:51] friendly and respectful. Across the
street was a beautiful park right next
[6:55] door to a thriving Boys and Girls Club
and just steps away from the Baltimore
[6:59] City Library. As an educator, seeing
children, families, and community
[7:03] resources so close to my home made me
feel proud to become part of the
[7:06] neighborhood. Unfortunately, as winter
turned into spring and spring into
[7:11] summer, that sense of pride and security
began to disappear. I started witnessing
[7:16] drug transactions directly behind my
home. Some captured on my security
[7:21] cameras, others with my own eyes. I
watched individuals struggling with
[7:25] addiction gather in the alleyways, on
the sidewalks, on the steps of the Boys
[7:29] and Girls Club, and outside the library.
Sometimes they simply sat there. Other
[7:35] times, the effects of the drugs they
were using were heartbreaking to
[7:38] witness. I heard moaning, screaming,
crying, and watched people throw
[7:42] themselves into the street, roll on the
payment, and cry out for help. These are
[7:47] human beings in crisis, but they are
also cerating an environment where
[7:51] families no longer feel safe.
[clears throat]
[7:56] One evening, I came home to find someone
charging a phone using the electrical
[8:00] outlet on the front of my house. The
phone was sitting on my steps, blocking
[8:05] the entrance to my home. When I arrived,
the individual ran over and claimed it
[8:09] was his. I firmly but respectfully asked
him never to use my property again and
[8:15] to find somewhere else to charge his
phone. I recognized him as one of the
[8:18] many individuals battling addiction in
the neighborhood. The encounter shook
[8:22] me. It made me anxious every time I
leave my house wondering if someone
[8:26] would be waiting on my porch when I
returned. No homeowner should have to
[8:30] live with that level of uncertainty.
Then one morning I was leaving for work.
[8:34] I discovered my car had been broken
into. Personal belongings had been
[8:38] stolen. The electrical panel had been
removed as though someone was attempting
[8:43] to hotwire the vehicle. Thankfully, I
use a steering wheel lock, so they were
[8:47] unsuccessful in stealing it. After
reviewing my security footage, I watched
[8:52] multiple individuals, people I
recognized from my own neighborhood,
[8:56] take turns entering and searching my
car. The feeling of violation is
[9:01] difficult to put into words. Knowing
strangers had been inside my vehicle,
[9:05] not knowing what they touched or what
their intentions truly were, made me
[9:09] physical sick. It also forced me to ask
myself questions I never imagined asking
[9:14] after purchasing my first home. Do I
need a firearm to protect myself? If
[9:19] someone is willing to break into my car,
what is stopping them from trying to
[9:23] break into my home?
[9:27] No one should have to feel this way in a
place they work so hard to own. Today,
[9:32] there are 34 drug treatment and rehab
centers located within the Brooklyn,
[9:37] Brooklyn Park, and Curtis Bay
communities. 34. Let that sink in. As
[9:43] residents, we deserve answers.
How [clears throat] are these facilities
[9:47] regulated? Are they all meeting state
and federal standards? Are they
[9:50] providing effective treatment and
long-term recovery? or are they simply
[9:54] contributing to a revolving door that
leaves both clients and surrounding
[9:58] neighborhoods struggling? Residents
regularly witness drug dealers waiting
[10:02] in the alley behind Third and Horton
Avenue for methanone doses to wear off
[10:06] so they can sell drugs to vulnerable
individuals. How is this acceptable? How
[10:11] has this become normal?
[clears throat] I also have to ask our
[10:15] elected officials, why are there so many
treatment facilities concentrated in our
[10:20] communities? Why aren't these same
facilities distributed more equitably
[10:23] throughout surrounding areas, including
places like Annapolis, Canton, or other
[10:28] communities with the resources to help
share the responsibility. The people who
[10:32] live in Brooklyn, Brooklyn Park, and
Curtis Bay, matter. We are hardworking
[10:37] people. We are homeowners. We are
parents, grandparents, educators,
[10:41] veterans, and small business owners. We
work every day to provide for our
[10:45] families and invest in our community. We
deserve to feel safe when we walk
[10:49] outside, when our children play in the
park, and when we come home after a long
[10:52] day of work. This is not about lacking
compassion for those battling addiction.
[10:57] They deserve access to treatment,
dignity, and every opportunity to
[11:01] recover, but compassion for those
struggling with addiction should never
[11:05] come at the expense of the safety,
peace, and quality of life of the
[11:09] residents who call these neighborhoods
home. I will continue standing alongside
[11:14] my neighbors and speaking up for our
community because we deserve better. So
[11:18] I ask our elected leaders and decision
makers, what are your solutions? Please
[11:23] don't tell us nothing can be done
because of laws and regulations.
[11:28] Communities across the country have
found ways to balance treatment
[11:31] accountability and neighborhood safety.
We deserve that same commitment. The
[11:36] people of Brooklyn, Brooklyn Park, and
Curtis Bay have waited long enough.
[11:42] » [clears throat]
>> That is one of my neighbors. I have
[11:46] comments from another neighbor, but I
see I have 56 seconds. Um, so I will
[11:51] just stress uh the 34 drug treatment
centers. Apparently, the state of
[11:55] Maryland is not aware there are 34.
Their census doesn't seem to include
[11:59] them. And the last time they testified
before this committee, they came up with
[12:02] six. And we having eyes can see 34.
Um [clears throat] the community
[12:10] concerns of course are one particular
center 800 patients per day coming into
[12:16] our community many coming from outside
and it's next to the park one block from
[12:22] an elementary school and half a block
from a high drug traffic intersection.
[12:27] We ask that the city council and our
elected officials take action with
[12:32] respect to these problems. Thank you.
>> Thank you Jan. All right. Is there
[12:37] anyone else that would like to testify
today? Vin McCormack.
[12:43] » Good morning, Madam Chair, and
[clears throat] fellow attending members
[12:47] uh of city council. My name is Vim
McCormack. Uh I'll Is it three minutes?
[12:51] Three minutes. Okay.
>> It's a great honor to be down here to
[12:56] talk about recovery houses in Baltimore
City. I'm going to make an admission uh
[13:00] before the council. Uh I've been
operational
[13:04] since 2019.
uh I took some advice, some suggestions
[13:10] from some fellow providers who had a
housing element attached to them. Uh so
[13:15] I opened up some recovery houses and we
were 2.1
[13:19] and uh OP and IOP initially. Uh I
learned after a few years that I was out
[13:27] of order. In fact, uh, Optum at the time
had set out put out a, uh, an alert that
[13:36] if you were operating in 2.1 IOP, you
were not supposed to have housing
[13:42] attached.
Now, I can tell you that
[13:47] many providers who have IOP have housing
attached. Of course, I won't say their
[13:53] names because they say snitches get
stitches. But I'll tell you what I did
[13:57] was because I sought
to be in order and do what's expected of
[14:03] me as a provider. I took the time, the
money, and the effort to go and get 3.1
[14:09] and 3.3 residential treatment, which is
what's supposed to happen.
[14:13] » So, we went ahead and did that. Um, and
we also took the time I was I was not
[14:19] advised by some of the fellow providers
uh that I took uh suggestions from that
[14:23] you're supposed to go down to the permit
office and get reasonable accommodations
[14:27] through those wonderful folks and they
come out and do a proper inspection and
[14:31] then at which you can operate uh as an
entity having more than four unrelated
[14:37] people in your house. I didn't know
that. I was taking suggestions from some
[14:41] people who was doing it before me. What
does that say?
[14:46] That says you got to be careful where
you get your resources from and your
[14:49] information. So I can tell you that
since that time I take great pains to
[14:53] make sure that the houses we have
currently recovery houses in east and
[14:57] west Baltimore are residential
properties meaning they're under the
[15:00] residential license uh under Caroline
and BHA. They also have taken we've
[15:05] taken the time to go through the proper
process to get reasonable accommodations
[15:08] through the permit office. Now I'm I'm
really glad that we're having this
[15:12] conversation. We're going to have I
think we're going to have to have more
[15:14] than this meeting T Porter because it's
it's a broad it's something that's
[15:18] happening. You and I talk about it quite
a bit. So I appreciate the effort uh and
[15:22] just putting the spotlight on it because
it starts and ends with the provider. If
[15:26] you're in the neighborhood, you have
recovery house.
[15:28] » The neighborhood and I appreciate this
lady sharing. The neighborhood shouldn't
[15:31] know. I think that you're you should
your footprint should be liked and it
[15:35] should make the you should make that
neighborhood better because you're
[15:39] there, not worse. Thank you for the
time. Thank you so much, Vinn.
[15:44] All right. Does anybody else would like
to testify before we transition into
[15:48] agency reports?
>> Yes, ma'am. Thank you.
[15:57] » Hello. My name is Tanya Richardson.
>> Yes, ma'am. If you can pull the mic
[16:01] down, please.
>> Yes. My name is Tanya Richardson and I
[16:06] um am administrative director for a
behavioral health program. Um the change
[16:12] came about the housing. When a change
came about the housing, I have been down
[16:19] to housing on Fed Street plenty of
times. The application is so complicated
[16:25] sometimes and it's no help. They say
that they help you. They give you a
[16:29] packet. They highlight some stuff. if I
go through it and then the packet
[16:33] doesn't even look like what's on the
screen and then you wait too late for
[16:37] the special accommodation and then they
cancel it then you have to go back down
[16:40] there. I feel like if we're going to
follow the law that maybe we should get
[16:47] some support. It's no one down there
that's going to do the application. I'm
[16:51] not familiar with the application. So, I
do the best that I can and the one
[16:56] application that I keep trying to do
keep getting cancelled because I don't
[17:00] know exactly how to fill all the
information out
[17:04] » and I think they give you like two days
to finish the special accommodation that
[17:10] they don't even tell you that you have
to do. You just keep checking the email
[17:13] and then all of a sudden it pops up. Oh,
I have a special accommodation. I think
[17:18] that it's like
helping some individuals to feel
[17:24] defeated in the situation when they're
trying to do the right thing.
[17:28] » So that's
>> No, I appreciate that. I appreciate that
[17:31] an aspect and and just to you know, I've
been on the side of being a consultant
[17:36] for for many uh clinics and so one one
of the thing that I encourage is one to
[17:42] get a mentor. uh getting with
like-minded people um within the
[17:46] industry that can help you kind of
navigate, but then also um making sure
[17:51] that you are um you're crossing your
tees and dotting your eyes because
[17:55] unfortunately
uh lack of knowledge or lack of support
[17:59] is by no means any type of um excuse for
not following the law. And so, you know,
[18:06] we we have that built in. We're going to
be, you know, sharing some of that
[18:09] technical assistance because I hear that
quite often. um and you shouldn't have
[18:14] to hire a very expensive consultant to
um provide that technical assistance for
[18:19] you. So, totally agree with you. Um and
I look forward if you know I'll stay
[18:23] after the hearing and I look forward to
helping where I can.
[18:26] » Okay.
>> All right. Thank you so much, ma'am.
[18:28] » All right. We're going to now turn it
over to BHSB for your presentation.
[18:35] » Great. Thanks, Councilwoman. Good
morning, everyone. Uh, council, uh,
[18:40] committee members, madam chair, for the
record, my name is Dan Rabbit. I'm the
[18:44] policy director at Behavioral Health
System Baltimore. It's good to be with
[18:48] you.
[18:53] Um, so what I want to do today is go
over just sort of the the framework and
[18:58] the regulations that govern substance
use disorder clinics and recovery homes
[19:04] in the city uh, and in Maryland. share
just some updates from some that have
[19:09] occurred since the last time I came and
um you answer any questions that folks
[19:14] have. Um before I get into my
presentation, I I do just want to um
[19:19] share you might have seen a article in
the Baltimore banner like last week um
[19:26] news around budget cuts that were coming
to Baltimore. Um and so I just wanted to
[19:32] share that um that is happening. Uh it's
across the state. It's not just
[19:37] Baltimore. Um BHA, the behavioral health
administration shared that all local
[19:43] behavioral health authorities need to
cut uh 13% from their grants and
[19:48] operations. So that is happening. Um we
are working you know ultimately BHA
[19:53] makes the decision. We are working to
develop recommendations on where we
[19:57] think that uh those cuts can be made. Uh
but no decisions have been made at this
[20:02] time. We're happy to come back uh in a
you know two months or something to
[20:06] share where things landed if that would
be of interest.
[20:09] Um but that's not exactly what we're
talking about today. Just wanted to put
[20:12] that out there first. Um where should I
point it?
[20:30] Sorry.
[20:37] Could Are you able to advance it? Can I
just ask the Okay, just since got
[20:43] technical difficulties.
[20:47] Yep. Yes. The next slide, please.
Um, just as a reminder, behavioral
[20:51] health system Baltimore has been around
since 1986. We merged uh with the
[20:56] substance uh use system in 2013 and have
been the local behavioral health
[21:02] authority since then. We're an
independent nonprofit uh that serves in
[21:06] that role. Next slide, please. Um local
behavioral health authorities uh fulfill
[21:12] a number of functions. We manage public
funds. We contract with providers to
[21:16] provide mental health and substance
services, provide public education on
[21:20] behavioral health, um and oversee the
system. and um providers to some extent.
[21:26] Next slide, please.
And so want to go over substance use
[21:32] disorder programs and recovery
residences. Those are two separate
[21:36] things. Um and so it's important to keep
that in mind. It's a little technical.
[21:41] Members of the community, you know, may
not be able to tell the difference
[21:44] between one and the other, but regul
from a regulatory perspective, they're
[21:49] two separate types of programs. Next
slide, please.
[21:53] So, substance use disorder clinics must
be licensed by the Maryland Department
[21:59] of Health. They must uh obtain an
agreement to cooperate with the local
[22:03] behavioral health authority. And um they
are regulated by uh COMAR 1063.
[22:12] Um and they're traditionally what you
think of when you think of like clinical
[22:15] treatment for substance use disorder. We
have outpatient programs, we have
[22:18] residential programs, we have opioid
treatment programs, which often called
[22:23] methadone clinics. Um, and so all of
those clinics, we know where all of
[22:28] those clinics are. They have a license
with the state if they are billing
[22:32] Medicaid for any services and they have
an agreement to cooperate with us. Um
[22:37] and so we have a better sense of where
these programs are and um you more
[22:44] access to to what um to what sort of
services are being provided there. Uh
[22:50] next slide.
um certain programs uh psych uh psych
[22:57] rehabilitation programs, PRPs,
um substance use partial hospitalization
[23:02] programs, PHPs, and substance use
intensive outpatient programs, IOPS have
[23:09] had a pause on new enrollments with
Medicaid for those three provider types.
[23:15] That pause has been in effect since July
1st, 2024 and was recently extended
[23:20] through December 31st, 2026. So that's
two and a half years of a pause that the
[23:26] state has uh put in effect and gotten
permission from the federal government
[23:30] to put in effect to try to figure out
what's going on with these sorts of
[23:34] programs and uh put in place new
regulations to address concerns about um
[23:41] you know a proliferation of these types
of programs and a big increase in
[23:45] spending and reimbursement for these
sorts of programs. Um and some things
[23:50] have been put in place and uh you know
we hope that they will help kind of uh
[23:57] prevent so many of these sorts of
programs from opening up. Next slide
[24:01] please.
Recovery residences on the other hand
[24:05] are not clinical treatment. They do not
need to receive a license from BHA. They
[24:09] do not need an agreement to cooperate
with us. Um they can uh receive
[24:15] certification from the state. Um but
that is a a less rigorous process than
[24:20] lensure and they don't have to and also
like at the end of the day a recovery
[24:26] residence is just a house. Um clinical
treatment is not being provided. They
[24:31] may market themselves as a safe and
appropriate place for uh people early in
[24:38] recovery. Um but it's essentially just a
house. And um if they want to receive
[24:44] funding from the state, they need to be
certified. And certified recovery
[24:49] residences do receive an inspection from
the state um every year or two depending
[24:55] on the circumstances. Um but they are
sort of um a parallel thing to licensed
[25:04] uh clinical substance use treatment.
Um next slide please.
[25:10] One thing just I wanted to lift up is
that there is a new we have sort of
[25:15] rebranded a existing program. It was
called the substance use crisis
[25:21] stabilization center. It is now called
the substance use urgent care center to
[25:26] better align sort of the nomenclature
and the regulations that exist in the
[25:31] state. Um this uh urgent care center uh
accepts walk-ins. It's open 24/7 and
[25:37] this is where someone can go who needs
immediate support with a substance use
[25:42] need. They can go they can uh receive,
you know, meals somewhere place safe to
[25:48] stay, referrals to ongoing treatment. Um
and so we just want to let you all know
[25:54] that that exists. That is a a licensed
program um and a really important, you
[26:00] know, kind of component to the continuum
of services we provide. Next slide.
[26:07] Um, one of the main things the state is
doing to try to address some of the
[26:12] concerns around PHPs, PRPs, and IOPS is
updating the Comar 1063 regulations.
[26:19] Next slide, please.
These regulations uh govern lensure and
[26:25] accountability and oversight for uh the
public behavioral health system. Um, and
[26:30] the revisions are putting in place a
number of new expectations,
[26:35] new tools for system accountability, and
they also require all recovery
[26:40] residences to get certified. So, we're
excited about this. Um, and, um, you
[26:46] know, it's been an ongoing process. It's
been going on since, uh, again, July
[26:49] 2024. Next slide, please.
Um, you know, just looking through the
[26:56] timeline, um, an official draft was
issued in May of 2025.
[27:02] Um, there were a lot of concerns about
that draft and then the state rescended
[27:07] the those draft regulations and then
worked more intently with uh
[27:11] stakeholders to develop sort of a new
draft. A new draft was um has been
[27:18] shared and updated over the last you
know uh year. And um next slide please.
[27:25] And at this stage we are happy to say
that the the most recent draft was
[27:29] shared with the committee for
administrative executive and legislative
[27:33] review uh at the state level at the in
the state legislature. AALR. This is
[27:38] sort of the first like the step that
happens before draft rags are published
[27:43] in the register. um they must be
submitted at least 15 days before
[27:49] publication.
So they were submitted July 10th last
[27:54] week. So maybe 2 3 weeks from then uh we
might see them published in the register
[28:01] at which point there is a 30-day comment
period and then um the formal
[28:06] promulgation. So we might see these new
regs in place done and and in effect
[28:12] maybe two months from now which is nice.
We've been on quite a quite a journey.
[28:17] So so that's some news to to share share
with the committee.
[28:22] Next slide please.
Um, and I just want to go over once
[28:26] again like the provider accountability
um, functions that BHSB provides. And
[28:33] um, again just really emphasize our our
interest in partnering with the
[28:38] community, with this committee, with the
city council to make sure that any
[28:43] provider in Baltimore City that is
licensed and billing Medicaid and
[28:47] serving our residents is providing
highquality services. you we want to be
[28:51] a partner and we want to you know help
however we can to make sure that that's
[28:55] occurring. Um next slide please.
Um
[29:01] the main again we um conduct regular
audits and site visits to certain
[29:07] provider types. Um we work with the
state on corrective action plans,
[29:12] performance improvement plans. Um we
have to get a or providers have to get
[29:18] an agreement to cooperate with us before
they can seek lensure and we track and
[29:24] respond to critical incidents and formal
complaints.
[29:28] Next slide please.
Um we also have a provider relations
[29:32] manager and team that you know goes
beyond reactions to issues to providing
[29:39] best practices and meeting with licensed
providers a quarterly basis. We um
[29:45] attempt to meet directly with any
organizations seeking lensure. Uh we
[29:51] provide trainings um and update the
provider network on any any changes that
[29:57] are coming. Uh next slide please.
And you know the one thing we want to
[30:03] emphasize with this group and with any
community members is that if there is a
[30:08] concern about a licensed behavioral
health provider, please submit a
[30:11] complaint. We have a team that responds
to those complaints and investigates
[30:15] them. You can scan that QR code. You can
also go to our website. You can also
[30:20] email any member of the BHSB team for
support and we will enter that
[30:25] complaint. It will be investigated and
any findings will be kind of sent up the
[30:30] chain to the state which is where uh any
uh corrective action would occur. Um and
[30:36] so so that's like the main like one of
the main ways that we get information
[30:40] about what's going on in the community.
So we encourage uh folks to use that
[30:44] that complaint portal. Next slide,
please.
[30:49] And so that's sort of just an overview
of our role um and what's what's been
[30:54] going on and some news since the last
time we we came to present. Um, again,
[30:58] just want to emphasize that we want to
be a partner in addressing concerns
[31:03] about whether providers are being good
neighbors and providing high quality
[31:07] services.
>> Thank you so much, Dan. Um, I really
[31:10] appreciate it. And and colleagues, I
know that these hearings have been um
[31:14] very long and and arduous process, but
it seems like we're almost to the finish
[31:20] line. Um, Komar63 has been something
that I know I've worked on for the past
[31:26] few years. Um and so it's really
exciting um that we are close to the
[31:30] finish line and it'll finally give us um
some opportunities within our roles um
[31:36] to really um have the the type of
quality of life issues that we're seeing
[31:40] in community actually to be seen and
heard um and also being taken accounted
[31:45] for. [snorts] Um so I'm going to start
colleagues we're going to have um DHCD I
[31:51] know you all don't have a presentation
but would you like to provide any
[31:54] comment before we go into our round of
questioning?
[32:01] I'd like to ask a question if I could.
>> Sure.
[32:04] » Um, with the recovery homes being
certified,
[32:08] » what role will you guys provide with
that? Um, is it anything similar to what
[32:13] you provide now for licensed?
>> No. So, um, recovery residences are
[32:20] handled more centrally at the state
level. They do the certification. They
[32:24] maintain the list of recovery homes.
They respond to complaints. They do the
[32:30] inspections. I think we we hope that we
will we will have an opportunity to work
[32:36] with the state on getting the word out
on um educating community recovery
[32:43] residences providers about the changes
that are occurring in Comar 1063. So, we
[32:48] want to be a partner and we hope that we
will be a partner with the state, but
[32:51] recovery residences are just more
managed more centrally.
[32:55] » Yeah. So, that's what I figured was
going to be the answer. And and so DHC's
[33:00] comments would be that, you know, Miss
Evelyn testified about um one neighbor
[33:06] and and the impact that the recovery
homes have on that neighbor and the
[33:10] neighborhood. And uh DHCD he's hears
this constantly and we're expected to
[33:16] step up and do enforcement on these
homes and pull their permits or stop
[33:22] them from, you know, getting the zoning
>> um cite them, you know, take them to
[33:28] court. And really,
>> most of what goes on is outside of
[33:34] DHCD's control or oversight or ability
to regulate. Um, and I would have hoped
[33:41] that the state in in doing the
regulations for um, 6310
[33:47] would have actually pushed recovery
houses to that licensed status
[33:52] » because I think that then gets you to
the point where
[33:56] » there is someone
>> who can deal with these problems. And
[34:01] when the complaints come into DAC and
we're going out and sending inspectors
[34:04] and all we can do is sight for the trash
or the high grass or um you know
[34:11] [clears throat] make sure they're
properly permitted.
[34:14] » Can't shut them down, but we can get
them to to have the right permits in
[34:18] place
>> usually, but that there would be someone
[34:21] that those referrals could go to that
would then
[34:24] » be able to revoke a license and shut a
place down
[34:27] » if they're needing to be shut down. Um,
and that's the frustration we share with
[34:33] the community in that we're here to try
and help and serve and make better
[34:38] Baltimore, make Baltimore a better
place.
[34:41] » Um, and a lot of times our hands are
tied and it is very difficult for us to
[34:47] then,
>> you know, properly respond without
[34:51] » being the the fall guy.
>> Yeah. No, Jason, I appreciate that. And
[34:55] and I want to just take that a little
bit further. And um I I want to take
[35:00] that a little bit further because I I I
think that
[35:07] outside of citation and high grass and
weeds, I think that there are things
[35:11] that DHCD could be doing. So we could
possibly revoke their rental license. we
[35:15] could possibly um you know have some
sort of connectivity with BHSB to say
[35:21] hey this is um a site that we haven't
seen that is registered you know have we
[35:27] looked into do they have any Medicaid
complaints do they have any complaints
[35:31] with the state like I want us to think a
little bit more strategically than
[35:36] exactly what is on paper because again
and this kind of flows into my first
[35:41] question how do you all and I suspect
from your answer that there's not much
[35:46] that has been done, but like how do you
all handle any type of 311 complaints um
[35:51] that come in related to said uh said
residences? Like walk me through that
[35:57] process and walk me through how you all
are um again citation or fines or
[36:07] anything. How how do you all walk
through that process?
[36:10] » Sure. So I it does depend on what kind
of complaints are coming in. So, if it's
[36:15] just the standard um sanitation related
complaints, that usually lands with uh
[36:22] um the property maintenance inspections
division and they will respond like they
[36:26] respond to any home.
>> Um if they see trash or high grass and
[36:30] weeds or other sanitation issues, they
would issue a citation
[36:33] » and that really is the the end of that
until there's another complaint. um if
[36:38] it does rise to that level where it's
egregious, then it may get referred to
[36:43] the legal section to do a pattern
practice case or something.
[36:46] » And how how many do you know like what
is the threshold for the legal section?
[36:51] Um because I mean for example in
Brooklyn and Curtis Bay, there are key
[36:56] um key sites that I know on the over the
past 5 years that have been cited and
[37:02] pushed through 311, but they haven't hit
that legal threshold yet.
[37:05] » Yeah. I mean, there's not a set number,
but it's the where the complaints are
[37:10] and the citations exist and then the
citations aren't getting a response. So,
[37:16] when we take a case like that to court,
usually we're looking at multiple
[37:19] citations within a three-month period.
>> Um, not something that has dragged out
[37:24] over, you know, like three citations in
three years would not be a a place that
[37:30] would rise to that level. But when
you're getting um regular calls and
[37:34] going out and seeing the same issue that
isn't being addressed by the property
[37:39] owner or the property manager, whoever
may be in responsible, that's that's
[37:44] when those things can be elevated. Um
>> but if they're not enough inspectors or
[37:48] only minimal inspectors that kind of
handle a quadrant, um how are they going
[37:54] to get out the repeated, you know, how
how are they going to get out there to
[37:57] the repeated calls if they're going to
other places? And so like that three
[38:01] month
>> it
[38:02] » yeah it is a constant challenge. Um they
311 calls are um prioritized you know so
[38:11] where things fall off more is when it's
reinspections and violation notices and
[38:15] those things but they do go out
>> um and if there is a violation we'll
[38:19] issue the citation or a notice as
appropriate. Um,
[38:24] » what would happen if we pull a
reasonable accommodation from a
[38:27] residence?
[38:32] » The reasonable accommodation itself,
[38:38] » nothing really.
>> So, they wouldn't have to shut down. So,
[38:40] in order for them to
>> we'd have to pull the use permit.
[38:44] » The use permit. So, yeah. What would it
be if we pull even even if we pulled the
[38:47] use permit, what would that would that
shut them down?
[38:51] um they they would be operating without
a use at that point,
[38:55] » which would be a violation.
>> Which would be a violation. And then
[38:58] » um you our our revocation of a use
permit is not the same as health
[39:03] department shutting down a restaurant
for code violation or even the fire
[39:08] department like shutting down. It's it's
not immediate in that sense. So if they
[39:12] continue to operate, they'd be operating
illegally and then we would take them to
[39:16] court. We could also find them and other
things, but
[39:19] » And what's the uh duration um from for
when we take them to court?
[39:24] » Uh
>> are we looking at a three month, six
[39:26] month? What are we looking at?
>> Yeah, the court process is usually we
[39:31] would get into court within four to six
weeks
[39:33] » and then they could ask for
postponements.
[39:36] » So it could be three months, six months,
you know, just
[39:40] » depends on the case and then to an
appeal.
[39:43] » Yeah. And so Trey, I I had asked the
last hearing, I asked for a tiger team
[39:47] related to to this. Have you all
developed this tiger team? And do you
[39:50] all have any outputs for today's
hearing?
[39:54] » Uh, thank you for the question,
Councilwoman Porter. Uh, I'm not 100%
[39:57] sure. Um, however, I can take it back uh
um to Tylure and uh and also ask Isaiah
[40:03] if he has any insight on that.
>> Yeah. And so I would just love to know
[40:07] the status of that Tiger team and any
type of report out if we can get a um a
[40:12] formal response within a week. Um that
would be great to the committee.
[40:17] » Colleague Billy,
>> thank you colleagues. I'm going to um
[40:20] turn it over to you all um for your line
of question. I'm going to start with
[40:23] Councilman uh Conway.
[clears throat]
[40:26] » Thank you, Madam Chair, and I appreciate
you continuing to focus on this issue.
[40:30] Um, as everyone knows here, this is a
pretty nuanced issue in our communities
[40:35] and we're trying to make sure that we
address it appropriately and so I
[40:39] appreciate uh all the leadership from
BHSB um and the work you guys are doing.
[40:44] Uh, I I had a question um
uh very recently there was a a treatment
[40:51] center that opened up in my district and
I did not know about it [clears throat]
[40:55] and it sort of sparked a question for
myself.
[40:58] um about how that could happen. Are
there instances in which folks may not
[41:05] necessarily have to go through certain
procedures in order to open a treatment
[41:08] center? Um, for instance, if they're not
um is there are there instances in which
[41:16] they don't necessarily need a license in
order to open or
[41:20] » uh if they want to be a licensed
behavioral health provider in the public
[41:25] behavioral health system and bill
Medicaid, they have to then no, they
[41:29] they need a license. Okay. if they are
not providing clinical behavioral health
[41:33] services. If they're you know providing
mentorship or
[41:38] » um [clears throat] you know after school
care like there's a variety of different
[41:41] you know kind of social services or
health and human services that an entity
[41:45] might provide um in which case like that
that that's not going through the
[41:50] Maryland Department of Health behavioral
health license process. Um, but if they
[41:55] are billing Medicaid for behavioral
health services, then no, they need to
[41:58] get a license from us and then we we
email y'all um every other month with
[42:04] with new um licensed providers that open
up in your uh district.
[42:09] » And if they weren't billing Medicaid,
>> then then no. But but at that point,
[42:17] like what are they doing? You know, like
how are they serving people? I guess
[42:21] they could they might if they're just
billing private insurance, maybe if if
[42:27] they have a grant to do something
outside of the public behavioral health
[42:30] system, then maybe. But um but if
they're providing mental health or
[42:35] substance use services, then they
essentially need to be licensed. Would
[42:40] you guys be notified in those instances
or
[42:44] » No, we're, you know, there's there's a
wide range of different sorts of, you
[42:49] know, social services that could be
provided and so we we're only involved
[42:53] with uh licensed behavioral health
providers and um and other and and the
[42:59] folks that we directly contract with.
>> Got it. Um, and then I guess there's a a
[43:05] broader question um for the
um for the services that we end up
[43:11] having these issues that the folks have
testified earlier today about um
[43:18] are these folks that only are receiving
Medicaid or are the ones that are maybe
[43:22] only relying on private insurance or out
of pocket um do they don't they have the
[43:28] same issues? Um, and in light of those
issues, should we also be making sure
[43:34] that we know when they open up in order
that we can make sure we better support
[43:40] our communities in those instances as
well? I don't have the answers to those
[43:43] questions, but that's one of the things
that came to mind for myself. Um, so I
[43:48] don't know if you want to add anything
to that.
[43:51] Um,
yeah. I think
[43:57] it's just hard for me to like it's hard
for me to
[44:01] envision like what these entities are
doing if they didn't get a license like
[44:06] um
you know like a someone can call
[44:11] themselves whatever they they want. Um
but
[44:14] » and I I think we we did respond like we
worked with your office on on this one
[44:18] particular uh program that you had
concerns about that the the um community
[44:24] had concerns about and they just weren't
providing mental health and substance
[44:28] use treatment. They were doing other
things. Um, and so, um, I think we're
[44:34] we're happy to to to
to get involved and to to help help
[44:39] figure out what's going on in any
instance, but but it's just hard to know
[44:42] like how we would how we would get
informed in the first place if they're
[44:45] not like applying for lensure or
something.
[44:48] » I appreciate I I'll follow up with you
guys about the one that I have in mind.
[44:52] Um I I don't know how they're being paid
if they apply for a license or otherwise
[44:59] and but I I'll follow up with you guys
on that and figure out if this is one of
[45:02] those instances. But I was curious like
how it kind of slipped through the
[45:06] cracks and we didn't get that
notification.
[45:09] » But thank you Madam Chair.
>> Sure.
[45:11] » Thank you so much. Any other questions,
colleagues?
[45:14] » Councilman Bullock.
>> Madam Chair. Um, not so much a question,
[45:17] but just um, thank you um, Chair Porter
for holding this hearing again and just
[45:21] thank you for everyone here today. Um,
one of the things that's not lost on me
[45:24] and it's also driven by your line of
questioning as as well as that of uh,
[45:28] Councilman Conway. Uh, the reality is
that's a difficult situation for us to
[45:32] navigate and on one side we're trying to
make sure that folks are getting the
[45:35] help and the care they need at the same
time trying to balance that with some of
[45:39] the quality of life concerns that you
mentioned within our neighborhoods. So
[45:42] again, appreciate housing, but also
appreciate uh BHSB and uh Council Member
[45:46] Porter again, just as we emphasize
trying to balance these issues and what
[45:50] we could do in terms of the state
regulations as well. So it is much more
[45:53] complicated than folks realize and all
of our districts are impacted by it. Um
[45:57] it's evidenced by some of the questions
and comments, too. So thank you for
[46:00] doing this.
>> Thank you so much, Councilman. All
[46:02] right, Councilwoman Ramos.
>> Uh thank you, Madam Chair. Uh and thank
[46:08] you again for your attention to this
issue in the committee. Um I had a
[46:13] couple of questions. One is uh the last
hearing we asked for specific lists from
[46:18] DHCD about um the uh I guess they're
called recovery homes um that uh have
[46:27] reasonable accommodation. Uh the answer
was we don't have that list. Uh the
[46:32] other uh request was how many um of
these uh homes are uh classified under
[46:41] the bill that we uh passed several years
ago around the supportive housing. Um
[46:48] and uh the answer was we don't have that
list. And so uh I think there's two
[46:54] things happening here. One is there may
be a confidentiality HIPPA issue I
[46:59] guess. Um and if that is the case, that
should have been the answer. Uh but the
[47:05] other answer may be that um for some
reason we're not collecting the data
[47:10] after we're approving these reasonable
accommodations, which does not make any
[47:15] sense to me. Um I I think it should be
done in a way that is uh similar to what
[47:21] we do with rental licensing uh but maybe
not as public because there could be
[47:25] some HIPPA issues. Um but more around
like you know we we need to know where
[47:32] where some of these are so that we can h
have conversations with BHSB
[47:37] uh and the state uh as to the challenges
that we're seeing and um so I just want
[47:44] to hear a little bit more from DHCD
about this issue. Uh again I I'm trying
[47:50] to approach this as a client- centered
approach. I mean, yes, we care about our
[47:54] neighborhoods, but I don't think we'll
be able to legislate anything unless
[47:57] we're really concentrating on making
sure that the clients are getting the
[48:01] care that they need. Um, so we don't
have these lists, even though we're
[48:06] asking people to certify themselves or
apply for these um these these issues.
[48:16] » So, the the reasonable accommodation
process, I don't remember the exact time
[48:22] frame, but when it was created, it was
created post litigation when the city
[48:28] had been um denying permits for more
than four individuals in a property, use
[48:35] permits for more than four individuals
in a property. And that was deemed
[48:41] discriminatory. And um one of the
resolutions was to create the reasonable
[48:47] accommodation process so that we could
grant an exception to the no more than
[48:54] four unrelated people in a property
based off of a legitimate need um to to
[49:01] have that reasonable accommodation. Um
so they
[49:06] at the time it was never um thought of
as a tracking method. it was just a
[49:12] check and balance to issuing a use
permit. Um, so we're we did pull and
[49:19] we're able to pull um from the use
permit data any use permits where it
[49:26] mentions reasonable accommodation or um
residential treatment or substance abuse
[49:32] treatment. So that all by word search
for you know lack of a better term
[49:37] » that can be done but
>> to the best of my knowledge no list was
[49:43] ever generated because also um the
reasonable accommodations come in um but
[49:50] they may not actually go through with it
and get the actual use permit to do
[49:55] that. So sometimes they fall off or they
they go through they open up and then
[49:59] they close down. And so there's
they just never created a list,
[50:05] » right?
>> Simple.
[50:06] » And so I think we we I think we're going
to need that in the new format relative
[50:11] to, you know, especially if we're going
to have these certified. Um and again,
[50:16] we can talk about whether or not they're
private or public in terms of who has
[50:20] access. Uh but because also there's ADA
and fair housing concerns. Um, but I
[50:27] also know that um, you know, we want to
figure out um, how to how to do that.
[50:33] And I did see the the outline on the
spreadsheet where you did have, you
[50:36] know, based on whatever the permit was
uh, but it was, you know, it's not
[50:40] necessarily a consolidated list as well
as uh, sometimes in the an early list
[50:46] that I saw at the beginning of my uh,
being a council person, these were like
[50:50] historic. I mean, they they may not be,
you know, reasonable accommodation
[50:55] anymore. I just think we don't we don't
we haven't built that kind of
[50:58] infrastructure yet. And so, um, I think
we're going to have to, and that might
[51:02] be part of the tiger team that Madam
Chair is suggesting is sort of a soup to
[51:07] nuts approach, um, to figuring out how
we're, um, having a better
[51:13] accountability for making sure that the
care that people are getting is the high
[51:17] quality care that they're supposed to
get. Um, so I will follow up um I guess
[51:22] with you on that because I think that we
do need to have you know something like
[51:25] that. And then the the um and that's
probably the same for the other piece
[51:31] around a bill that we passed um in terms
of figuring out the um supportive
[51:36] housing um bill uh and making sure that
we're actually figuring out what
[51:42] properties are under that bill um and go
from there. So, um, be happy to to work
[51:49] with you on that because that's going to
be critical information for resident for
[51:52] us, um, as well. And we do I I
understand the the confidentiality
[51:57] concerns. Uh, but I do think that we've
got to have some way of talking about
[52:01] it. And then um I'd like to add and
maybe this is a committee request um for
[52:08] uh the um person who came in to talk
about all the information that she did
[52:14] not have uh to try to address this. I
mean that's information not just for
[52:18] providers but for the public to know so
that we know what to expect um and what
[52:23] certifications are needed for certain
things if people are seeing things in
[52:27] the neighborhood. And so we may want to
develop uh that kind of public
[52:32] information. Uh and madam chair, I don't
know if you want to add that to the
[52:35] tiger team work or if that's something
to add as a committee request.
[52:40] » Yeah. So I'm going to help her navigate
because BHSB actually does that and so
[52:44] I'm going to help her navigate through
that process. Yep. Thank you.
[52:47] » Sure. Sure. Um well I was also thinking
that there could be you know um some of
[52:51] this as well. And then the last thing
I'll say is that you know my um you can
[52:57] anticipate that um one of my
neighborhoods does have a concentration
[53:01] of uh these places and we hear from them
a lot and uh I'd like to try to get some
[53:08] folks together to really look at each
one because sometimes it may not be that
[53:13] and sometimes it is and we want to make
sure that folks are are really taken
[53:17] care of. So, I'll bring be pulling
people together to to take a look at I
[53:22] mean, they may not let us in, but at
least we can knock um and and see see
[53:27] what happens. Um so, thank you. And
Madam Chair, I'm sorry I have to excuse
[53:30] myself. I have to represent us uh at
Mako um this morning.
[53:34] » That's fine. Thank you so much. All
right, Councilman Blanchard.
[53:42] » Thank you, Madam Chair. Uh thank you,
everyone. I before my question, I'll
[53:45] just briefly say to uh the chair's point
about the mentor program. Um recently I
[53:52] had a um uh inpatient recovery facility
in the district that had had some some
[53:59] constituents were reaching out about it.
Um you know, I'm not sure if that was
[54:02] accurate or if it was stereotyping or
whatever, but reached out, had a meeting
[54:06] with the owners. They they were
definitely reluctant to talk, but once
[54:09] we talked and we had a you know decent
conversation and then they had I think
[54:13] it was a paid consultant but it is
someone else who does this work and so
[54:18] like well let me put you in touch with
him and like talked to him and like 2
[54:22] days later they had a here's our good
neighbor policy here's our like here's
[54:27] the line of contact here's like a
program description like do you want us
[54:30] to come talk at like a neighborhood
assessment and I was like why why can't
[54:35] it always be this Um, and and so I think
I think there was like one slight change
[54:39] that they made. And obviously some of
these entities are bad actors that are
[54:44] being predatory and negligent of their
neighbors, but I think a lot of times
[54:48] it's not the case. And so I was that was
just really interesting to me because
[54:51] that is not often my experience in in a
situation like this. So that was really
[54:56] interesting. Um, my question is for I
believe it's Mr. T, so it might be for
[55:01] the deputy commissioner Hler. Um so
under Baltimore zoning code res recovery
[55:05] residences fall under the residential
care facility use uh which covers not
[55:09] just addiction rehab but also other
residential facilities where supervision
[55:12] is required. In 2017 under transform
Baltimore and to my understanding under
[55:18] the guidance of a lawsuit settlement
exits the city. Our zoning code was
[55:22] changed to allow these facilities in
every residential area with effectively
[55:26] no restrictions. This is in a very
significant contrast with other major
[55:31] jurisdictions in the state like PG
County which has bed caps in Montgomery
[55:35] County which has a lot size requirement
for bed. Um, I think this lack of
[55:39] regulation becomes a particular problem
in neighborhoods where the property
[55:45] values are lower because then it ends up
being the highest and best use where
[55:49] you're seeing this and I think this has
to do with the the overconentration that
[55:53] we're hearing about and this concern
that we're hearing about in so many of
[55:56] our communities. Um, had these
regulations been reviewed and changes
[56:00] proposed over the last I guess it's 9
years since um, you know, transform
[56:07] Baltimore has come into place and as as
the effects have become clearer.
[56:14] » Uh, good morning madam chair, members of
the committee, Eric Tiso for the
[56:16] department of planning. Um there has not
been changes recently and uh if other
[56:21] jurisdictions have found a way to uh add
additional requirements that we are not
[56:26] doing. I would want to defer that to the
law department to see if we can apply
[56:30] that here. Um so that would be the the
first thing that we would want to check
[56:34] with. Um, yeah, we share similar
concerns where some of our middle market
[56:38] uh neighborhoods have homes that are
just big enough uh to meet the needs for
[56:43] residential care facilities uh but are
also just affordable enough uh to meet
[56:46] their needs and that is a competition
factor that we are aware of. So, I'm
[56:51] happy to to look into that as well. U
we're also aware of um what could
[56:56] potentially be uses that try to fit into
other land use categories. Right. I was
[57:02] a few minutes late to this hearing
because I was actually answering a
[57:05] question for someone else about a use
that may fit that filed for a permit for
[57:09] one thing but may fit under another but
that use is not available so they're
[57:14] applying under the use that they may fit
through. Um, so this happens with some
[57:21] degree of frequency and so we'd be happy
to to help with that. And I think the
[57:25] concerns that we have more are not
licensed facilities because there's an
[57:30] avenue of getting at those, right?
Zoning is more like a hammer than a
[57:33] scalpel. Um, it's the supportive housing
that is not licensed, that is not
[57:38] medical, that is, you know, something to
that effect that is difficult to address
[57:43] in any meaningful way in zoning. um
without another more specific tool that
[57:50] does not then get at protected classes.
>> Sure. And and thank you, Mr. Chie. So, a
[57:54] specific followup uh regarding the um
the zoning as it compares to to other
[58:01] counties. Um and I know there's an
important, you know, set of legal
[58:05] questions based off the lawsuit and
concerns around that and whatnot. Um,
[58:11] have you ever seen an example where like
Baltimore City couldn't do something in
[58:17] the zoning code that other counties were
doing in the zoning code? Like in the
[58:21] state of Maryland?
>> Uh, I've not looked at that specific
[58:25] angle before. Um, Maryland is an
interesting state where it has three
[58:29] different categories of county that have
different rights and privileges to them
[58:34] and land use specifically is delegated
in different ways. Baltimore City is in
[58:38] its own subcategory of the land use
article under the state. Um so in some
[58:43] ways this is apples and orangutangs in
comparison. U but again I would need to
[58:48] get some help from the law department to
see if there's a tool that someone else
[58:51] has that we have not looked at.
>> Okay. Yeah. because I've had this
[58:56] conversation with law before and I I
just
[58:59] I personally struggle to sort of imagine
a situation where other large counties
[59:03] are doing something with their zoning
code that we can't just also do in our
[59:08] zoning code. Um, thank you, Madam Chair.
>> Thank you so much, Councilman Parker.
[59:13] » No. All right. Any other questions? All
right. I'm going to go back um to DHCD.
[59:19] Just want to um ask one final question
related to um inter agency coordination
[59:24] with the health department um the
environmental control board and how you
[59:28] all handle some of these issues. So like
if you see a recovery home um in the
[59:34] district it has various citations. Are
you all sharing that data uh with other
[59:41] agencies so that they can also add on
their particular realm or scope of
[59:46] practice from a citation perspective?
>> Um
[59:54] not particular to recovery homes but in
but in general. Yes. Um and actually
[1:00:03] we DHD pushed um the mayor's office uh
to create the multi- agency task force.
[1:00:10] Um that was something that um we felt
like a lot of times we were calling the
[1:00:15] other agencies for support. And so we
felt it was better that it be led by the
[1:00:20] mayor's office. And so um that's a group
that meets every Thursday and tackles
[1:00:26] some problems that are really cross
agency. Mhm.
[1:00:30] » Um so we'll work with department
transportation, uh fire department,
[1:00:35] health department, uh liquor board.
>> So the reason Yeah. The reason why I
[1:00:40] asked this because I have a um specific
list of SRS um that I would love to see
[1:00:45] um I would love to see if they've been
discussed within the MAFE. Um because
[1:00:50] there hasn't been really there hasn't
been much um movement on those SRs. They
[1:00:55] were just closed. If you want to send I
don't need the SRS but the addresses.
[1:00:59] » The addresses. Okay. Perfect.
>> Send those over to us and we can take a
[1:01:02] look at them.
>> Okay. Perfect. And I mean even some that
[1:01:04] were mentioned today within Brooklyn and
Curtis Bay. I would love to see I mean
[1:01:07] those are just addresses right off the
top of my head without going to the
[1:01:10] office.
>> Having the addresses would be
[1:01:12] » okay. Perfect.
>> Any other questions colleagues?
[1:01:15] » All right. Hearing and seeing none.
Thank you all so much for joining us
[1:01:18] today. Um I really appreciate it. Um I
believe we have just one second. I
[1:01:22] believe we have one more person. Um,
Janet Allen that wanted to provide
[1:01:27] testimony.
I'll allow uh two minutes. Miss Janet.
[1:01:40] Miss Janet.
[1:01:45] Miss Janet.
[1:01:49] All right. If you are on mute, you're
you need to unmute, Miss Janet.
[1:01:57] Okay. All right. Um well, we're going to
close out um public testimony for the
[1:02:01] second time. And thank you all so much
for joining us today. Have a great day.