All right. Uh, welcome back everyone.
Thanks for joining us tonight. Uh,
council's returning our first, uh,
meeting since we had our summer break.
So, thank you for being here tonight.
Uh, council, everyone's here except for
Cheryl Dean Dehaney. Councelor Dehaney
is going to join us virtually. She's
under the weather, so she with us then.
So I'll call the meeting to order at
7:01 and I'll read a land
acknowledgement. As vis on this land,
the town of Bradford acknowledges that
the land on which we gather today is the
traditional territory of the Ishnabek
nation which includes Ojiway, Odawa and
Pawami nation collecting known as three
fires confederacy. We recognize the
Hernand Chippoa and Hodeni nations have
walked on this territory over time in
times of great change. We recognize more
than ever the importance of honoring
indigenous history and culture and are
committed to moving forward the spirit
of reconciliation, respect, and good
health with all First Nation, Matei, and
Inuit people.
Okay, we're on to number two. We've got
uh recommendation that the regular
council committee whole agenda dated
August 5th, 2025 be adopted as amended.
Move second. Moved by councelor Dyke,
seconded by councelor Question,
concerns?
Seeing none, all in favor?
Thank you
declaration pecular interest in the
general nature you declare it now or if
you find when you get to an issue if you
find yourself in that position you can
declare then seeing none right now we'll
move on then so we're going to move to
number four and tonight we have a
special presentation I'll just read the
bio right now and then I'll call the
gentleman up so Art J citizen of the
year Art J was devoted has devoted his
life to preserving history and improving
the infrastructure of Bradford
through published works, archival uh
archival efforts, and decades of public
service. His leadership and dedication
has left a legacy, making him a true
exceptional citizen of the year. A
lifelong contributor to Bradford
Glumbry, Art has preserved and promoted
the region's history through three
published books, the creation of the
Holland Marsh Centennial Calendar, and
the archiving of nearly a century's
worth of records, and over 6,000
historical photos. Art's legacy also
includes decades of public service
serving as counselor, chief building
official, and project manager for key
infrastructure projects, including the
life-saving relocation of the North
Canal. He is a founding member and past
president of Drainage Superintendent
Association of Ontario and continues to
share his knowledge as a speaker and
community advocate. Art Jans's passion,
leadership, and dedication has left a
lasting mark on Bradro Glumbry, making
him truly an exceptional citizen of the
year. So congratulations Mr. Jance.
» Thank you for coming tonight.
[Applause]
Thank you very much.
I should I think
so.
[Applause]
Thank you, sir.
All right, council. We're uh thank you
everyone for allowing us that
opportunity to share that uh citizen of
the year award with Mr. Art Jance.
Okay, we're on to deputations. There is
none. We're at six. It's open form and I
have right now I have one person signed
up for open form and we have a written
comment from form. So we'll start with
uh Linda Usher
from Bonhead. Come on up. It's in the
Bonhead district. Von Head Heritage
District topic
and when you're ready, just hit the big
purple button.
>> Just Just put Nope. Push it. It's on
» Just Just put Nope. Push it. It's on
now.
>> Thank you.
Good evening, Mayor Leuk and council
members. My name is Linda Usher and I am
here to address item 94, Bond Head
Heritage District on your council
agenda. Being a resident of this
fabulous community for over 50 years, I
sincerely hope that council will approve
of this motion as it has been several
years in the development. There are many
reasons to support this declaration. The
famous suns associated with Bondad being
one of the oldest hamlets in Simco
County, the heritage buildings, special
events and celebrations and public book
publications.
First four historians are Sir Francis
Bondhead, sixth lieutenant governor of
Upper Canada and a local resident named
the hamlet after him in his honor after
the rebellion of 1837.
It was originally called Rags Corners,
named after the first settler who
arrived in 1829.
Sir William Mu, Postmaster General of
Canada. The Honorable Earl Row,
Lieutenant Governor of Toronto and Chief
Justice of Ontario and Vice Chancellor
of the University of Toronto. He is
actually a resident of Newton Robinson,
but that is a very close neighbor to us.
Sir William Oler, founder of modern
diagnostic medicine. He is recognized
internationally throughout the world. He
has buildings named after him in various
countries and we've even had people come
from dist great distances to visit his
memorial plaque on line 7. In 2012 it
was declared one of the oldest hamlets
in Simco County. And for that special
recognition, a group of five volunteers,
Pat Cranston, Bev Ferguson, Barry James,
Mickey Nanowski, and myself as the
chairperson put on a 3day festival in
June to recognize our 175th anniversary
of this hamlet. All three levels of
government supported this special event.
And what an event it was. heritage
building walking tour. A span special
banner, the first banner for our hamlet
by the way, on the lamp post. A bond
head stamp.
I don't know whether you're aware of
that or not, but we actually have a
stamp that was published that year. Um,
sorry. A dignitaries came, lots of
activities and entertainment and even a
professor heaven Hutchkins came all the
way from British Columbia and an
interfaith community service on Sunday
made it possible for a donation for the
Bradford Food Bank and Matthews House
Hospice. Also, it was the first
development of the Heritage plaques. Um,
I understand that was in the newspaper
recently and I do believe we had the
first ones. There's that banner, by the
way, in case you haven't seen it. It was
in Bond Head and this was a stamp what
it looked like. Okay. And um as I said,
plaques were on the houses. You still
see them there on the houses in Bond
Head as well. The volunteer um committee
organized the Oler bench uh dedication
and a Bond Head bench and ginkle tree
dedication and an old-fashioned picnic.
Also there was a book entitled
History of Bond Head Area 175 years.
First printing was in 2020.
This was uh headed by Vera Stewart and
volunt sorry Vera Stoddard and uh they
had volunteers that helped her. I was
one of them. Another smaller book was
entitled, and I know I have it here
somewhere, but I'll find it. Um, about
the plaque about the um old um plank
road. It seemed to have misplaced it,
I'm sorry. But it talked about the fact
that I think we had the first plank road
in Ontario just outside of Bonhead
leading into Bradford.
That was published in 1984.
Also, were you aware that Bon Head held
the first Santa Claus parade in the area
of Bradford, Tottenham, Beaton, and
Alist 50 years ago. And as well, there's
a Bondhead song written and music by Joe
Papino in 1974.
And finally, most important are the
heritage buildings with two that are are
uh proincially designated and I believe
there's 17 on the BWG registry. There
may be others as there are 40 who are
considered 100 years old and several 150
years old in this community. The Hamlet
of Bondhead is a remarkable survivor
being 188 years old this year. I hope
that the extensive research over the
past several years recommends this
designation and BW council proceeds with
the needed bylaw to declare the heritage
conservation district. Definitely Bond
Head is a historical heritage gym within
the town of BWG. It needs to be
preserved, protected, its heritage, its
history and identity. Thank you.
>> Oh, thank you, Linda, for that. a
» Oh, thank you, Linda, for that. a
wonderful history lesson we had there
and I it was perfect. It was wonderful.
Good me. Oh, you found the book.
>> Life on the old plank road. It um gosh
» Life on the old plank road. It um gosh
it was put out by the Toson West
Willberry Historic Historical Society
1984.
» Were we the first toll road in Ontario?
>> I think it was if I correctly. Yes. The
» I think it was if I correctly. Yes. The
history says the first road
>> and I think it went all the way to um
» and I think it went all the way to um
>> uh they're saying I think all the way to
» uh they're saying I think all the way to
just out Bradford.
>> Yeah.
» Yeah.
>> Yeah.
» Yeah.
>> Yeah. Great history there.
» Yeah. Great history there.
>> So we're dealing with that later on our
» So we're dealing with that later on our
agenda and if you're around and if
council has any questions or whatever
they'd like to ask this she's such an
expert in Bonhead that we would more
than welcome you up if you would uh have
any questions.
>> The people you had looking after that
» The people you had looking after that
did great research. had a lot of
meetings and they even had a walkabout
as well that I took part in.
>> There's a great report coming to our
» There's a great report coming to our
council on 9.4 and we look forward to
that. So, thank you, Linda, for that.
Appreciate that very much. And then we
have a written submission. So, I'll have
the clerk read that.
» Yeah, we've received a written submit
submission submit
written submission from Brent Felman.
So, I'll read that on his behalf. My
name is Brent Felman. I think of mo most
of you know me. I would have come in
person, but it is my son's birthday and
family comes before politics. Digital
voting may be convenient, but it's not
trustworthy or transparent. Canadians
are increasingly losing confidence in
our democratic processes, and continuing
to use blackbox systems without a paper
trail only fuels that distrust. A 2023
ledger poll found that just 43% of
Canadians trust elections, a sharp drop
from 58% the year before.
In 2018, 51 Ontario municipalities using
Dominion voting systems suffered major
disruptions when a bandwidth cap locked
voters out of online voting. Canada has
seen serious cyber security failures,
including 11,000 plus CRA accounts
hacked in 2020. Global Affairs Canada
cyber attack in 2022. major hospital and
RCMP systems targeted. If our federal
and provincial systems aren't secure,
how can we expect municipal digital
elections to be online voting also
removes public transparency? With paper
ballots, scrutiners and candidates can
observe the process. With digital
voting, the system counts itself, and
there's no way for the average voter to
verify their vote was counted correctly.
Council, you have the power to restore
public confidence. Please say no to
online and telephone voting. Bring back
paper ballots. the gold standard of
transparent verifiable elections.
Respectfully, Brent Felman.
>> All right. Thank you for that. That's uh
» All right. Thank you for that. That's uh
dealing with we'll be dealing with that
later on at 9.8 in our agenda. And
there's no further open form
submissions.
Okay. So, we're on to uh seven, adoption
of the minutes and committee hold
recommendations. So I have 7.1
recommendation that the minutes of the
regular council meeting dated June 17
2025 be adopted as printed moving a
second please by deputy mayor seconded
by councelor farini question concerns
councelor Scott thanks m just a quick
one to the cio we referred the line 8
report and the delegation of authority
bylaw report but we didn't specify in
the motion when we wanted them to come
back I think we said as quickly as
possible but would we be able to confirm
a timeline on those, please.
» Thank you. Uh we expect to have both of
those reports in front of council in
September.
Okay. Any further questions, comments
with the minutes? Seeing none, all in
favor?
Carrie. Thank you. 7.2 adoption of
special council minutes. Recommendation
of the minutes of the special meeting of
council dated July 2nd, 2025 be adopted
as printed. Move a second, please.
Councelor Scott, second by councelor
Dyke. Question or concerns with these
minutes?
Seeing none, all in favor? Carried.
Thank you. We're into correspondence. We
have uh two items on correspondence. We
have 8.1, the integrity commissioner
periodic report 2025. So, the
recommendation that council receive the
2025 integrity commissioners periodic
report for information. I move second on
the floor by councelor Dyke, councelor
Bkite, seconded by councelor Harper.
questions, concerns with the report.
Oh, okay. Councelor Scott and Councelor
Harper.
>> Thank you again. I I'll just comment. I
» Thank you again. I I'll just comment. I
didn't want this to go unnoticed. Uh
first, thank you to our integrity
commissioners for this thoughtful
update. We've had conversations several
times both in public and in private
around what they're raising in the
report. And I think it's worth just
dwelling on the fact that we have the
integrity commissioner formally
reminding us of what is expected of the
mayor and what's expected of council.
Tone at the top really matters and
respect isn't just a word that we teach
children in school. It's how we're
expected to operate in a professional
workplace. This isn't about politics.
It's about setting standards. And the
public deserves a council that leads by
example, that listens, respects
boundaries, and models the kind of
conduct we want to see throughout the
organization. So our job notwithstanding
so-called strong mayor powers is to set
the strategic direction and provide
oversight and we work collaboratively
with each other and with our staff to do
that. So it's important that staff know
that there to give frank advice and
loyal implementation as the saying goes
and that council's got to respect that
frank advice and has to expect the loyal
implementation. We employ you to be
experts and we need to hear your advice.
We're not always going to agree as a
council and that's fine. But we can
disagree without crossing lines. We can
keep calm, act professionally, and when
we are confused or unsure about
something, we can seek guidance rather
than getting angry, whether that's about
a policy question or a procedural one.
This report's timely. A year from now,
we'll be electing a new council. But for
the remainder of this term, staff and
the public deserve to have confidence
that council wants to set a good tone at
the top, that the character of our
elected officials matter, and that this
is a professional workplace where
everyone deserves to be safe and
respected. So once again, I think the
integrity commissioner has given us a
timely update on what is expected of
members of council and uh I trust the
public will hold us accountable to those
standards.
>> Thank you, Councelor Harper.
» Thank you, Councelor Harper.
Thank you, mayor. I appreciate the
report from integrity commissioner on
this uh from principles integrity. Uh I
I understand the aim that was to promote
ethical behavior in municipal government
uh raise public trust in in elected
officials and encourage accountability,
transparency, and respect within the
council and local boards. I took a
little bit uh of confusing
um remarks from it when they failed to
actually
report more transparency in regards to
the amount they gave us the amount of
conduct or or amount of investigations.
And while I understand the positive and
fostering respect and professionalism to
try to make ethical governance uh whole
in regards to informal processes and
that's fine, but I believe it lacks a
little bit of transparency and and hard
performance data that the public
deserves to know. If the if the
objective is to informally resolve most
things and that's their goal as it says
in the report, I understand that
direction and that's okay if it can
formally resolve. But the matters of
what types of occurrences and maybe
that's reflective in the type of
material that's being transparent to us
in regards to what they would like to
portray in the in the the messaging, but
without fully being transparent, it it
certainly I I would think some would
take it as like a lack of transparency
and I would hope that they could come
back and give us a little bit more
detail the data and the transparency of
what happens. um the the particular
details don't matter, but it's about
outlining the types of like things that
they did solve.
So, I'll just leave it at that.
Okay. Thank you, Councini.
Thank you. Um
so, this is this has been my third term
on council and I'll be honest that I was
kind of disappointed when I read this
report uh that they put forward.
Councelor Scott hit on quite a few
things and he and he put it nicely. When
I read this, I almost felt like it was
um it was like a parent scolding a child
when this came forward to me because it
was reminding council to play nice in
the sandbox with everybody. Working
together. We're here as a group and
we're supposed to work together. We can
we can um disagree. That's what it's all
about. We can debate. It's all it's all
about. But when it goes that step
further, it's not right. And that's not
what council is about. Uh there was a
section about non-disparagement and it
had to remind council that it's healthy
to debate and disagree, but it's a
reminder not to attack other members of
council and name call. Uh there was a
section about social media posts and a
reminder about non-disparagement on
there to call out members of council
because it could be and would be
recorded.
Uh one of the other areas uh of concern
that continue to arise relates to
members of councils overstepping their
role attempting to take the reigns or
fix a constituent's problem or directing
staff how to do their job. So the
elected officials our job as a council
and we had to be reminded in this is
that we don't have role we don't have a
role in the daytoday administration of
municipal government government unless
we're specifically authorized by the
stat the statute. So when residents come
to us obviously we are to be the voice
and we are to bring those forward and
tell and ask staff or tell staff here's
a concern where can we look at this and
staff bring us their professional
expertise and we can make decisions
based on reports that are brought to us.
We set policies similar to what
councelor Scott was bringing up. We set
policies and we work with the budget to
make sure that we spend taxpayers
dollars wisely. But that's the role of
council. No further than that. So, it
was kind of disappointing to me reading
this report and having to have these
reminders, especially coming to the end
of our term right now. It just kind of
it was almost like a little salt on the
wound reading that one and I I didn't
like it, but I appreciate that came
forward.
» Okay. Thank you. Maybe I'll I'll comment
too on it. It's a it's a you know, it's
a disturbing report in a sense. We have
I've never seen this many uh reports IC
IC reports before. I've been here five
terms now and this is the most I've ever
seen for this council and Bradford
McGomery. So, um but I will say that,
you know, we we've had our differences
at council and that's fine. It's it's
okay to have those differences and not
uh not agree with everybody at the same
time. That's that's fine, too. Um I can
tell you though, there are a lot of
councils out there and speaking with the
integrity commissioners, there's a lot
of councils out there that have a lot of
problems and we are pretty lucky to be
the council we are because we actually
do work very well together and we get
things done. That's the key is getting
things done. And so, uh, there are some
councils out there that are in serious
trouble. I mean, the province stepped
into the Mathan Black River and removed
that council, took over that one. And
the Pickering Council has problems and
there's all sorts of problems right
across this country. It has gotten much
more difficult to be a politician in
this country. So, it's a difficult
thing, but uh it's a great report in a
sense that it keeps us uh it lets us
understand some of the things we need to
do better and uh I as a leader will do
my best to do better and make sure that
we uh follow the rules and make sure
that we deliver what we need to do when
it comes to council and serve our
residents the best we can. So, that's my
uh promise to everyone is to make sure I
do a better job myself. So, okay. So, I
have Yeah, go ahead.
>> So, I'm glad we got to have a bit of a
» So, I'm glad we got to have a bit of a
discussion there. Um the mayor just said
the key thing is getting things done. I
agree getting things done properly is
the next part of that sentence and it's
equally as important and uh yes there
are councils that have a lot of problems
but we have to hold ourselves to a high
standard because our our public is
watching and so it it it doesn't satisfy
to be know to know that we're better
than Pickering and the problems they're
having there.
>> Okay. Thank you. All right. We'll uh
» Okay. Thank you. All right. We'll uh
call for the vote. I've got a mover or a
second on this. So, all in favor?
Carried. Thank you. Uh, we're on to the
second one. The Township of Georgian Bay
Regulation for floating accommodations.
I have recommendation that council
receive and support the Township of
Georgian Bay resolution dated June 2nd
25 regarding the regulation of floating
accommodations. Move a second. Please
put this on the floor
by councelor Scott. Second by councelor
Harper. Questions or concerns? Councelor
Thank you, Mayor. Can I get a point of
clarification regards to what it's
asking us to do in this report? There's
two options. Uh, one is to just
basically deny flotation and the other
one is to support it with moorings and
stuff. So, could I add clarification as
to what it's asking us to confirm?
» Yeah. So George and BA's uh their their
recommendation is that now they're so it
says whereas flotation accommodations
position paper April 2025 provides
detailed guidance to Ontario mispalities
on the regulation of floating
accommodations highlighted critical
legal and environmental challenges. And
whereas the document uh identifies
significant gaps in current provincial
and federal frameworks that
municipalities are best positioned to
address through zoning and land use
bylaws. And whereas the paper recommends
proactive municipal action based on
successful case studies and legal
precedences such as the Gillespie versus
Ontario decision. And whereas Georgian
Bay Township has already taken steps to
address floating accommodations has and
has an interest in promoting inter
municipal collaboration on this issue.
Now therefore be resolved that council
receive the floating accommodation paper
position paper May 2025 for
informationational purposes and that the
clerk be further directed to forward the
document and this resolution to
association pala and members for
consideration of potential provincial
advocacy.
Yeah, go ahead.
>> Thank you, mayor. Uh when while I read
» Thank you, mayor. Uh when while I read
that too, there still didn't tell us
which one which option we want to do,
one or two in this report. So that's why
I'm asking for a clarification. Which
way are we headed on this? It looks more
like number two, which definitely
supports uh restricted floating
accommodations to fixed and permanent
moorings because then those will be held
to more collaborative bylaws, municipal
guidelines and and municipal zoning
bylaws as well. So, am I correct to
assume that?
>> I think you're correct to assume that.
» I think you're correct to assume that.
It's actually two. I'm sorry.
>> Thank you.
» Thank you.
>> It's actually two. Uh, but it'll be at
» It's actually two. Uh, but it'll be at
AMO. We'll push it through AMO.
Hopefully with councelor Dehane support
at AMO, we'll be able to push that
through and I think it's something that
we all have to be aware of.
>> Thank you. So, thank you. Okay. Further
» Thank you. So, thank you. Okay. Further
comments or questions? Seeing none,
we'll call for the vote. All in favor?
Carried. Thank you.
Okay, we're into
number nine staff reports 9.1. So our
first staff report is a community
improvement plan CIP program uh options
EOD EDO2 2025-3 and we have a
presentation by Jonathan Hack from Sarah
Planning. So
on up.
Good evening.
» Um,
so we have a quick presentation and it
uh it summarizes what was a fairly big
and lengthy report from us as
consultants in your package along with a
staff report. So I'll just get straight
into it
if I have the technology to be able to
do that. Next slide.
There you go. I won't waste much time on
what is a CIP. you've um obviously the
this particular council has heard from
us several times but just to go through
that history for everyone's benefit. So
in uh the last sort of updates were 2022
to the programs currently on hiatus. The
seniors housing which was a successful
CIP is has essentially been on hiatus
and I think now is a recommendation to
to remove that. Um but uh since then in
December of 2023 we came forward with
sort of a comprehensive set of
performance metrics how they've how
these CIPs have performed both the
downtown and the industrial and um and
then um in the fall of of last year we
had a a roundt facilitation which I
really appreciated everyone in on
council being able to give some of their
opinions and I think the opinions help
shape what we've put into the uh into
the both the reporting that we provided
we summarize the the book ends of of
opinion and I think uh the programs that
we're suggesting go forward in different
phases uh reflect that so the CIP has
sort of been under the microscope and
this is the next iteration of that with
with some recommendations before you if
you can just go to the next slide
please.
Yeah. So that really summarizes all of
the various changes uh that have been
put in place. So you can go through to
the next slide.
So
thank you. So just to you know one of
the things we do want to we we recognize
there is there are considerations and
council's been very clear about it of
how best to use for example various
programs in effect for downtown and then
for the industrial CIP. How can we
change it? How can we make sure that the
money that you are spending through the
public purse is is is going to generate
maximum impact. So the next couple of
slides just give you an indication of
you know whether there's some staying
power some of the some of these
programs. So irregardless of whether the
DI the downtown CIP is bigger held in
obeyance whatever it might be the types
of programs that remain relevant are
itemized there. So, facade improvement
grant, that's the one that is the most
visual. Uh, but there again, you're not
in the business of essentially providing
benefits to particular tenencies and
leaseold improvements and using
corporate signage. You're looking for
improvements to the building, sand
blasting the brick, you know, going with
the right kind of uh guidelines
and and so that has, as long as that's
in place, that still has some merit. uh
particularly for the for the older stock
uh in town the building restoration
renovation and improvement grant. So
just for everyone's uh recollection that
was a sort of a bigger budget grant that
could be used for internal renovations
to improve the the capability of these
commercial buildings and could include
some upper floor um residential
conversions. Council has had some
concerns over the years with how the
money is allocated to best effect.
You're not critiquing the particulars,
but the idea is that you want to make
sure that whatever money is put in goes
to the long-term sustainability of the
building and not uh what you generally
call as as property owners
responsibility for life cycle
maintenance and all the usual things
that we all have to have to fund. So,
uh, that's still, as long as that is the
case, that's that fund if it's used
surgically can still be of some benefit.
Planning fees and building permits,
they're often used, you know, they don't
have great leverage power because
they're not huge amounts of money, but
they are money that you have to find
from a CIP reserve. So, they are money
coming out of the tax base and it's
really an opportunity to signal a
continued open for business um, uh,
role. So it goes alongside some of the
other programs and strategies that the
town is putting in place. Development
charges are, you know, they've been
subject to considerable legislative
changes. So we continue to try and sort
of play catchup. But as it relates to
commercial, leaving housing aside for a
moment, there's some some potential to
be used for development charges, but
nothing like as it was in the past as it
relates to industrial, for example. Um,
so that last one, development charge
equivalent grant, we're really not using
that anymore and not not proposing that
for for the uh industrial CIP either.
Uh, next slide, please.
Some you know other matters that council
has weighed in on and that we've we've
got some considerations in the report
and and the recommendations.
Agricultural businesses, what what's the
nature of the issue to be solved? How
should you or um assist is there a role
for a community improvement plan? Um the
historic nature of properties in some of
the urban and rural areas, particularly
bond heads. So we've addressed that. The
whole matter of using tax increment
grants, try and make it as effective as
possible. It's still tax money that is
owed to the municipality that is granted
back. So although it's deferred revenue,
it needs to be looked at as that
deferred revenue. You still have the
cooperating costs for municipal services
that taxes are meant to support. So if
you're giving taxes back, it has to be
effectively uh uh getting the the
impacts that you want in terms of
economic development. Then a number of
other ones which are not on the slate
for consideration right now, but uh in a
if council um or even a future council
wants to consider it, uh looking at um
housing elements of a community
improvement plan. Very complicated.
again got to be very careful in terms of
uh matching the funding to the the
realistic outcomes that you can you can
achieve. Uh but that there's a number of
different uh programs that can be put in
place there. And then you know the idea
that in the future there is the
opportunity to to use CIPs in a very uh
strategic way for example to get
particular kinds of development. Hotel
is a good example of of that one. Next
slide please.
So, I won't go through too much of the
detail here. It is covered off in the
staffing um report, but as it relates to
the industrial areas CIP, and I I should
just take a moment just to to note that,
you know, Bradford was one of the first
to put an industrial areas CIP in place
and it was generously funded for a
number of years and it's been extreme.
If you look at the metrics of money in
versus the the leveraged amount that
it's provided, it's been very
successful. Um, so we wanted to
continue. It's certainly a consultant's
recommendation that it's got a lot of
merit and it goes alongside the
recommendation that we think that for a
range of reasons but being most
practical uh expanding the community
improvement project area to the entirety
of the municipality is is it's
essentially an administrative step. Um
I'll be happy to take any questions on
it but what it does is allows you to for
example look at employment wherever
employment is happening. So, we've had
conversations about do you or do you not
incentivize Highway 400 lands, for
example. And I think what we're trying
to do here is say that um you need to
and and council was very clear the last
time we were here, whatever assistance
you give to industry has to be that
which is going to make a significant
difference. And so, it's focusing on
larger employers, larger floor space.
You see on the right side of the page
there, it should be geared to higher
order land use in in industrial terms.
So that's manufacturing, logistics,
technology, the kinds of things that are
going to end up coming out of the
separate industrial land strategy that
is currently underway by Averson Young.
So this this is this is an important one
and it's going to be using a tax
increment grant um using the municipal
tax uh for a for a maximum of seven
years and at a rate of 50%. So
potentially given the industrial tax
rates that's a sizable uh amount. So
there's some if council moves forward
with moving on and Rick bringing back
the IAIP taking it off hiatus status
then I think there's some number
crunching that needs to be done to just
give council the advice of exactly what
you might be in for in terms of foregone
revenues because as I said tax taxes tax
increment grants are you know they they
look good and they are good but they're
still public money which is being
utilized so we have to do a very good
job
assessing the merit on each application.
Next slide. Thanks.
Thanks. For the DCIP for downtown, the
essential um restructuring of that is to
uh make sure and the last bullet on the
on the left hand side, make sure
buildings are improved with long-term
viability as a commercial premises to
meet all code and modern accessibility
standards. So make it as impactful as
possible. That's true for facade
improvements as it is for any of the
other programs. But try and align this
in terms of timing with the uh potential
the reconstruction that's happening with
Holland Street. There are some
opportunities to defer then until we
have a second phase for that. Next
slide.
Thanks. Just continuing on, there's
still a role for planning and building
fee grants um to um be able to provide
um a smaller level of assistance to
plans for uh investment in downtown that
do require uh planning applications to
be made and building permits to be to be
filed. And then the public art and mural
grant program is really uh one where
we're uh you know recommending continue
it under current guidelines but updated
and potentially incorporated into a new
DCIP if that were to happen in the next
year year or so. Next slide.
I do think again this this is this is
really um not part of the
recommendations for this evening but
just looking forward if you're going to
uh if council has a wish to get into
housing um and to look at more specific
forms of assistance that can assist
general um housing development. Then
things like having an environmental site
assessment grant can be helpful. That's
with uh with regard to contaminated
lands cleanup. And then of course you've
got a range of housing uh project
housing uh affordability measures that
can be put in place to some degree and
then also looking at bondhead in terms
of commercial properties for the
improvements there as well. On the a on
the tourism on the agriculture side
we've moved in the direction of really
focus on tourism to the extent that
there is a tourism market to be served
as opposed to assisting general
agricultural operations. uh because it's
um I think that's the thin end of a very
big uh issue and uh again if we're
trying to do everything the CIP will be
washed out pretty quickly. So council's
going to have to make some choices as to
where it focuses its attention. Next
slide.
Um, I'm not going to read through these,
but there the the work that's being done
to phase any improvements to the CIP
both before the new council and after
when there's a new council in place at
the end of 2026 is all hinged upon a
range of things that have been uh
undertaken and are ongoing uh within the
municipality. So, they're listed there.
You know, we could add to that the
heritage conservation district work
which I know which is is upcoming this
evening as it relates to bond head and
the housing needs uh in particular and
concierge program as it relates to
focusing on the benefits of uh
employment development.
Next slide.
So you you do have a staff report in in
front of you which summarizes a lot of
this but just to sort of
uh consolidate everything I've been
saying. The first there's a number of
phases. The first of which which is to
reactivate the industrial areas
community improvement plan and to do so
with council approve approval to work on
those programs that I had outlined and
to determine the relative size of budget
that is required and look for any
sources of funding that may be there to
assist. Um the second phase which is uh
sort of second quarter 2026 through to
the end of the year and into 2027
would be to reconsider the downtown
community improvement plan based on the
commentary that we've heard from council
uh when we facilitate facilitated that
session back in October of last year.
third phase if you were to move forward
again similar timelines would be to
address um housing and that would
dovetail with presumably the conclusion
of some of the other housing strategy
work that's being done so it's premature
now but it's appropriate then and then
the fourth phase I think is to uh to
look at any potential for the
agricultural areas and that's put there
because in terms of our priorities we're
clear on it we see it as a lesser
priority than the other aspects that you
have before you. So that is uh that is
the plan in a nutshell. Um and uh I'd be
happy to take any questions if I can
hand it back to you, Mr. May. All right.
Thank you, Mr. Hack, for that
presentation.
All right, council. I open the floor up
for any questions to the presentation or
to the ECD. We have a report that has a
couple of options here.
So,
anybody want to put an option on the
floor? Councelor Viky,
>> I guess I'm going put to option number
» I guess I'm going put to option number
one. Um, I would like to see the I see
all the benefits and I see industrial
benefits that's taking place and I've
seen a few benefits definitely and in
some of the um storefronts and various
different uh projects. But I think in
these financial times uh until we see
the budget for this fall, I would I
would be very cautious. I know that you
put money at at different things, it
could be very beneficial, but I just uh
you know, I just worried what with all
the big financial capital that's needed
uh in the future. How much can we really
afford? So, I'm just I'm just trying to
be uh just trying to be um um I guess
penny penny tight in in a sense because
there's a lot of things need to be done.
I know that there's a lot of buildings
accessibility
um openings and and storefronts and
access be behind or construction.
There's a lot of things that will
benefit but but I feel that until we
look at the budget uh um to see what we
can afford and what we can't afford.
That's I'm just speaking myself
personally.
Okay. Thank you. Uh so I've got option
one, but we'll just go around a little
bit to see and then we'll get a sense of
what we want. You want to second it?
Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay, I' got that's
what you're seconding. Okay, we have a
second for that uh on the table option
one. So now I'll go to more comments. I
had you had your councelor Harper first
and I'll come across this way. Thank
you.
>> Thank you, Mayor. Uh I appreciate my
» Thank you, Mayor. Uh I appreciate my
colleagues representing option one with
a second motion from my uh colleague
from W three. I I I I have to support
that um the phases in which you brought
forward and the amount of results when I
came to council this DCIP and CIP and
the industrial
um CIP program were already in place. I
supported and supported council's
decision from past decisions to the best
of my ability. there were people that
did benefit from it and there were
concerns uh about it but I didn't see a
vast improvement that I would have hoped
that these CIP programs would have
created would have been huge
transformations but I didn't see huge
uh I saw loopholes that people were were
taking were using and helping their
businesses and I'm happy to oblige u
because they follow the guidelines that
were set in place no harm no foul but I
believe that it didn't give us the exact
amount of return on the investment that
was put into it and that's my opinion.
The other part of this is that you have
a phase in there regarding affordable
housing and that part without actually
taking into account of any polling or
any data support of the residents that
come to Bradford for the feel and look
and feel of this community. that type of
phase would actually detrimentally
change the look and feel of what people
buy here for. And that part I don't
like. Um, so it would need some work.
I'm not opposed to, you know, the actual
premise of affordable housing. I just
see that there's some challenges with
that phase.
So I believe I'm going to support option
one on this and I appreciate your
efforts and the work you've done so far.
Thank you very much.
Okay, thank you. I have now uh councelor
Sandu, councelor Perin, and councelor
Dehanei.
» Thank you, your worship, Mr. Hack. Thank
you, Mr. Gillis. Thanks for your
presentation and your report.
When we started the CIP program years
ago, I I believed in it and and I still
think it's a good program, but I also uh
think this council was right when we put
it on. Here it is. Uh to hit a pause
button on it and I still think right now
is not the time to activate it. Um I
agree with option one. Um there's lots
of good stuff in this report, but
there's also more work that needs to be
done. like phase three, we're talking
about affordable housing and other
housing on options, but there's other
levels of government that we should be
exploring and seeing what partnership we
can get. Um I either I missed it or I
don't see that in the report. Um there's
uh downtown CIP. Um we had many concerns
um when the applications came forward
and we addressed some some are still
outstanding. Um and based on it comes
down to dollar
report says that as of January 1st 2026
we will have $65,000 in that reserve.
That's not even enough to fund one
project. and and it says to put more
money into it at the budget time but
there's other hot issues that we need to
deal with. This is uh nice to have but
not must in my mind and right now I
would support option one.
>> Thank you and thank you to members of
» Thank you and thank you to members of
council that have spoken. Just a couple
of issues just to give a little bit of
context on maybe I'll deal with that one
first. So 65,000 and yeah it's not a lot
of budget. The approach I would look at
though if you were to go down the track
of reopening the industrial areas CIP
is the focus essentially is on a tax
increment grant. So that again as I
hopefully I've been very clear it's
still public money but it's not a draw
on the reserve unless you choose it to
be a draw on the reserve. So you can
take the money in and then rebate it
back at the rate of 50% for you know
whatever the eligible costs are. Maybe
it's seven years, maybe it's three
years, depends on the application. So I
would not necessarily align the the low
budget that exists in the reserve now
with the with uh a reason as to not do
the um industrial area CIP unless you
think that 65 can be better spent
elsewhere. That's obviously council's
decision. So that's one thing on the uh
on the housing side of things. I think
it's really important to to recognize we
we haven't put forward a plan in any
way. We haven't done the research. All
we've done is give an indication of what
programs are in effect elsewhere and
some of those locations like a Barry or
G are where they have significant funds
through the housing accelerator fund
that they obtained. questions about
planning prudence on this and whether
it's a good thing. Those are things you
would get into if you commissioned to
look at a plan. So, I just want to be
clear that we're not uh we're not
actually recommending any one program at
this point. We're just saying phase
three, if you had a mind to do it,
that's the period at which that's that's
when you would focus on it um within the
the work plan. Thank you. Comment
>> that that is why Mr. hack. I'm saying we
» that that is why Mr. hack. I'm saying we
hit the continue to hit the pause and
not just a straight no. I and I agree
with you what you're saying, but I still
believe it's not the right time right
now.
» Thank you. Um I'm also the opinion of
going to option one and putting this on
hiatus. Um we we had stopped uh putting
money into it in 2023. The remaining in
the budget based on the report the
remaining in the budget would be to move
forward with the phase one of
implementing this and then we would be
looking at putting 100 to 300 and then
another section said 250 to 350,000 per
year um as our budget for the CIP
as commented around this table. We have
so many things coming up for the budget
and to add this now or to even look at
adding this right now, I'm not in favor
of that. Many things have come forward
and I know things can be tweaked, but
when we originally started this the
whole the whole the CIP program, we
originally started with the um seniors
housing living styles and we got those
which worked out beautiful. And then for
the downtown CIP, we saw it be utilized
at the beginning and buildings were
starting to look great and and I saw the
investment going there and it was making
our downtown look good. Then it came to
the point where it was getting a little
frustrating for me to approve, but they
were following the rules. It started to
look like a cost of doing business,
which most businesses should be doing on
their own anyways based on what they
want to do with their business. Um,
the one question that I do have because
I am in favor of putting this on hiatus.
I don't want to be putting any more
money into the CIP, but in regards to
the industrial,
if there was a potential to have a big
player come to our municipality and they
were looking for a DC deferral, could
that not just come directly to council?
Would we have to have a CIP program in
place? because that one there is one
that I could support because we still we
don't lose any money. We get our money
in the end, but because the DC charges,
we have asked for relief over time and
they have been paid back. So, that one,
as long as that can still come to
council, I'm totally good with just
putting the rest of the CIP programs on
uh hiatus.
» I'll turn it to our CEO to have a
comment on that.
>> Thanks, your worship. With respect to
» Thanks, your worship. With respect to
the uh development charge deferrals,
council um is entitled to at its
discretion entertain those at any time.
There does not need to be a CA CIP
program in place for that.
» Okay. Thank you. I have councelor de and
councelorano next.
» Thank you mayor. Um Jonathan, thank you
so much for that thorough presentation
and I am going to lean to option one.
And my reason being is um for fairness
for all especially the small businesses
and the homebased businesses in our
community. Often times we see those
businesses are being left behind. Um we
know that it's very important to you
know create opportunities for the
agriculture housing and development but
at this time I believe to be fair for
everyone is to continue pausing it. Also
another thing um this is taxpayers money
and I believe you want to hear more from
those entrepreneurs especially those
businesses you know what I mean who are
selling application right to help with
their businesses to thrive I believe we
should open up the um consultation so
I'm going to recommend that we open up
the consultation for the public to come
in right even those aspiring
entrepreneurs to hear what are their
challenges how can or what can we to how
can we improve the CIP program so that
their businesses can thrive. So at this
time that's what I am definitely
recommending and leaning on because we
need to know what are their challenges
because the CIP program is there to help
businesses thrive in our community not
to just issue and dash out money right
because it is there want to make sure
that we're utilizing it fairly and that
we are helping businesses to thrive
especially the small guys and the
homebased businesses. So um that's my
two cents. uh mayor, how do I do the
recommendation to staff to have a public
consultation to connect with those
entrepreneurs and those aspired
from this um about the CIB program.
>> So councelor, I would probably ask uh
» So councelor, I would probably ask uh
our CEO next week uh to ask for staff
report the next council meeting. We'll
bring it as a staff report. You can ask
for staff report to have that happen and
have ecdev go and look at that in the
future for staff. So I'd ask our CEO
just he'll be on vacation so you can go
through our deputy CO and we'll get that
as a staff report. You can they'll bring
in as a staff report for the next
meeting. All right.
>> Sorry. Um staff report to recommend a
» Sorry. Um staff report to recommend a
consultation for the public.
>> Yes. Yes. We'll do it through a staff
» Yes. Yes. We'll do it through a staff
report.
>> Awesome. Thank you.
» Awesome. Thank you.
>> Okay. Thanks.
» Councelor Dano next.
Thank you. So I I do appreciate all the
colleagues comments. Um I I was
definitely leaning more towards option
one and uh but there is there is
something that I want to be mindful of
is in this in this economic climate we
need to give as many tools as possible
to our economic development team. U
there's a lot of opportunities even with
all this disruption in the uh the
economy for people to relocate make make
financial decisions with their
businesses and whatnot. So, I I do feel
that uh putting on a hiatus is the right
decision because we're lacking or we're
on the verge of having some of those
strategies come forward that this would
then partner up with. But at this point
in time, um you know, I think some
people have mentioned it that we've seen
some sort of uh especially in the DCIP,
we've seen a lot of people use it for
leaseold improvements in a way that
maybe wasn't the intention, but it still
fit within the guidelines. Um so, I I
definitely would love a stronger DCIP.
um not just for let's call it light
restoration. I would love to see pretty
significant restoration addition or new
construction uh or transformation of the
downtown. So I would love to have
additional incentiv incentification for
the downtown core to do something more
than just upgrading a building. I'm
talking take the building down or
preserve the heritage of the facade and
and reconstruct something that maybe is
um you know a multi-use development type
project. That's where I see the DCIP
really going. Um, in add uh one of the
other concerns I have is and and uh you
you kind of took my question there which
was the in the in the industrial zones
if people are going to come to the
industrial zones and we have a
significant business that comes there.
Yeah, absolutely. We need to look at it.
What I'm concerned with is that with all
the industrial autom um you know it's
the automation that's taking place. A
lot of this is massive massive buildings
with very little amount of employees in
there. So yeah, we might get a little
bit of that, you know, the tax
incentives from having those types of
businesses here, but really those types
of businesses don't drive tons of
economic growth to our actual
businesses. They're not going out for
lunches. They're not shopping locally.
there's, you know, a handful of
employees working in a massive massive
factory and warehouse. And it's a lot of
boxes and and shipping logistics moving
in and out. So, I'd like to see, you
know, um a lot more consideration for
other types of um businesses in the
industrial area off the 400, which I
think that there's a lot of people
looking around, which is really good.
And we're definitely motivated to work
with those types of businesses. The last
thing I want to say is uh when it comes
to housing, one of the concerns that I
have is a lot of people are taking
Bradford and and coming up here and
carving up homes and turning it into a
uh a nice little uh program for them to
uh you know, run multiple uh little
residents out of it and and earn income.
So, if if it does come down to some
types of housing, again, it needs to be
with the strategy. We need to identify
what type of housing that we're
interested in doing, how we're going to
fund it, if we are going to fund it. But
I'm not interested in making a bunch of
people, you know, landlords. That's not
that's not my goal. My goal is to to
transform the downtown area. And I think
that that's really important. So
ultimately, yeah, I support the council
with with going on a hiatus, but I I
think or continuing the hiatus, but I
think we really need to shape this and
give the tools to our economic
development team as quickly as possible
so we can maximize the markets right
now. I think there's a lot of
opportunity even with all the disruption
to really reach out and have people
reach out. So, it's a it's a little bit
of a shame that we can't, you know,
continue with something at this point,
but I I think we need those tools in our
toolbox. And maybe you can address some
of that.
>> Just through you, Mr. Mayor. I was just
» Just through you, Mr. Mayor. I was just
going to say, yeah, you know, whether
it's on a hiatus or you operate it, but
you choose not to fund the programs at
six or one, half of the other, half
dozen or the other, it is still there to
be used. So, if you did have a big
opportunity that comes in and you did
the homework on what the balance of of
benefit is, whether it's employment or
just square footage and taxes paid, you
could turn the CIP back on very quickly.
Um, I don't think unless you made major
changes, you would have to go back
through public process, but that would
be your choice. But even if you did, you
could expedite that.
C Scott next.
>> Thank you for the presentation and the
» Thank you for the presentation and the
work that went into it.
I want to make a few comments uh and try
and pick up on some of what was said
because I I I agree with a lot of it.
uh council fari talked about
over time the downtown CIP started to
look like the cost of doing business and
one of the things that I think we
recognize is there's the cost of doing
business on the municipality as well and
what I mean by that is when I worked in
the premier's office and we were putting
major grants to attract big employers
you were looking for the municipality or
the region to match it to help
incentivize so we could compete with
upper New York state Ohio, what have
you. And uh we've seen some major
employers come to town, renovate uh in
my ward, in the industrial area, and
elsewhere in town, and we've secured
those local jobs. But it's become this
sort of arms race of everyone's doing
it, so everyone has to do it, and we're
here to have value for our taxpayers
money. And in the past, councelor
Gordano has talked about, and I think
you referenced it tonight as well, the
downtown has to be big enough to be
meaningful. uh when it first started we
saw a lot of facade improvements and it
looked like it had momentum. We've seen
much more leaseold improvements lately.
So I think we need a program to provide
grants as an economic development tool
so that we can be attracting business to
town. My frustration is I don't know how
that fits into a budget. With the strong
mayor budget, we have a presumed 3%
increase pursuant to a mayoral direction
to do that without understanding what
the needs are from the department heads.
So I have no idea where a $300,000
economic development line item fits into
a budget designed to meet a political
percentage target. So that's a
frustration that I have sitting here
today four or five months in advance of
our budget coming to council because
it's being reverse engineered to hit a
political target rather than to identify
the needs. I think keeping the project
on hiatus is the only responsible thing
to do in that context, not knowing how
the budget's going to turn out. But I
don't like the second half of that
recommendation that says no further
action will be taken. I'd actually like
you to put together a thorough
plan that addresses industrial downtown
bond head and diversification of
agriculture. Agriculture remains our
number one job base. And so I'd want to
have a CIP program continue to be
developed perhaps for next term to
review that looks at how can we actually
do this in a meaningful way that
addresses our key economic drivers,
other public policy goals like downtown
revitalization, energy efficiency,
heritage preservation, affordable
housing. But I need to see that complete
picture because you said earlier, Mr.
Hack, you're prioritizing industrial,
not agriculture. I might make the
opposite choice depending on the needs,
depending on how the economy is shaping
out. But ultimately, sitting here today,
keeping it on hiatus, but continuing to
do the homework, that's how I feel I
have to vote tonight, not knowing how
this budget process is going to unfold
the way it's been set up.
» Okay, I'll get back to you. Uh, okay.
Yeah, you just seconded, so I'll let you
go first.
Yeah, I uh I'd actually like to see the
CIP program dropped because I just think
it's it's putting too much time on our
staff. I'd rather see our ectdom
economic development actually go and
further enhance the concert program and
attract business and market our town and
do those things and stop doing all these
studies about CIPs and all this stuff.
If we need to do an improvement or if we
need to do an incentive for for for a
company to come here for growth, we can
look at that on a one oneonone basis. Um
but to just continuously if we see a
real need like with the downtown core
the the improvements there was a
definite need when we had seniors
housing a definite need we created a CIP
program for it but I don't see the need
right now for a CIP program but I'm
going to I seconded option one and let's
just keep it on hold.
So, Mr. You want to comment on the uh
investment opportunity like the oneonone
investment option. You want to comment
on that? I I think
>> No, no. What councelor Kite just said he
» No, no. What councelor Kite just said he
would like to put the he said we can
look at it on oneonone basis where we
can incentify. I I assume that's against
original.
>> I can't speak to the issue of staff time
» I can't speak to the issue of staff time
and how it's being used elsewhere. But
just thinking at face value that that
you know it's always at a premium and
you want to use staff effectively what
you have currently is you have two cip
downtown cip and an industrial cip which
are both they're in existence right and
so you can you have not chosen to end
them you've chosen to leave them on
hiatus. Um I I'll say again my only
comment if if budget issues are are uh
are going to be you know they're
uncertain at this time is that on the
industrial side if you rested on the tax
increment grant as an option you could
leave that one as open because that is a
tax increment grant no other funding
from a CIP reserve would be required. So
in theory uh it would remain budgeted
only if an application were to come
forward to get development and and then
approved and then impact reassesses it.
So it could be several years down the
road. That's a that's a matter for
senior management to determine what the
fiscal impact would be on that because
as I said it's not nothing. But that's
one way you could do it. But I think the
um uh the fact is that you if you put
the plans on hiatus, they still exist as
plans and so you can choose to bring
them back um at your uh at your
discretion
>> or develop them I should say.
» or develop them I should say.
>> Thanks. So I just wanted to say you know
» Thanks. So I just wanted to say you know
thank you very much for the
presentation. Uh great work and to our
staff the economic don office great work
on the CIPs. I I wanted to listen to
council first before I I put my comments
out there. And I I still think the CIP's
did a great job, especially the
industrial CIP. It actually reaped about
$200 million worth of growth within our
community when it comes to what we did
in in the on reagents and other areas
within our community. So to me, the
industrial CIP is is a is a real tool
that can help our our existing business.
And I and I would certainly love to see
that carry on with a tax grant. So a TIG
do a tax increment grant system uh where
it doesn't really hit our budget.
There's no budget implication at that
point in time. It allows us to offer it
up to our existing business in our
community. So it keeps that program
alive and it keeps it in the toolbox so
that when we have businesses call us and
let's say you know a lot of business and
we lost DSV the 1.3 million square foot
building. We lost DSV. They went to
Inisville. They were looking here and
they didn't come here. I don't know if
they communicated with our staff or not
but that's where I want them to pick up
the phone. I want them to pick up our
phone and and ask what is this? What is
the CIP? What does this do for our
business? How does this help us? That's
where we get the conversation. When they
go on our website, they look at our
economic development website and they
they search that site. If they don't
reach out to us, we actually don't know
they were here. So, having something in
the toolbox makes them hopefully pick up
the phone and call us and say, you know,
what is that? What can we do here? Can
we can we invest in Bradford or not? Is
it worth it? So, it just gives us a
chance to do that. And so option two
would have been straightforward that
it's the the industrial CIP that I would
love to see move forward with a tax
grant only. So move the tax grant there.
You know, the deferred DCs, we can do
that anytime we want. That's a council
initiative. We can do that anytime we
want. But that's what I would love to
see. Uh I understand, I agree with
council. Uh the the downtown uh CIP, I
would say put it on hiatus. Leave it
there. Other CIPs, this talks about
bringing future options. We will have
that budget discussion coming soon.
There's nothing surprising about the
budget. It's been done this way for the
whole term. It uh it was a director for
me that gave a 3.5% average increase
across our term here. So, it's average.
That's what our average is going to be,
our tax increase over the three uh the
four years that we're here at council.
So, it's nothing surprising. Uh staff
are building that budget. I have been
given that responsibility by the
province and I uh gave that directive
and that's it. And it's up to council.
It's your budget. You do what you want
with it. You want tax to go up, you do
that. You want tax go down, you do that.
But it's your budget. you'll work
through it and you'll have that
opportunity to do that. I'm just giving
a directive, setting it in motion and
staff will build that budget and they'll
come back and then it'll be up to you
folks to see what you want to do with
that budget. If you'd like the number,
you stay with it. If you don't like the
number, move on. But that's got nothing
to do with option two. We don't need to
build in budget because it's a tax
grant. So, it doesn't impact us at this
point in time. So, we would move that
and then the rest of this would come
through in phase two and four back in 26
27 when we know more about it. So, I'll
go back to to council members. Councelor
Scott and I got Councelor Harper.
>> Yeah, just just to do a little bit of
» Yeah, just just to do a little bit of
correction there. Uh strong mayor powers
were introduced in the second year of
our term and staff are building a
budget, as I said, against a political
target without knowing the full needs.
That's not something I really care to
dispute. It's just the facts of the
situation. So staff aren't building a
budget in isolation. They're building a
budget against an arbitrary political
target of what one individual member of
council has determined he wants the tax
increase to be. Tax increase hopefully
will be less than that. All that being
said, I appreciate what you said about
the tax increment grant and understood
the point that it doesn't hit the budget
as much as the recommendation for the
300,000 or x00,000 that you suggested.
It still has an impact and I'm not
prepared to make a decision tonight in
the context of a budget that as the
mayor just said, council can increase it
or council can decrease it. We haven't
seen it yet and staff are telling us
what their needs are within a context
that puts uh the cart before the horse.
So, as much as I'd like to see tools in
the toolbox for economic development, I
think I need to see it, as I mentioned
earlier, in a holistic way so that I can
make a decision. And I I'll say it again
because I think councelor Jordano has
been right about this. It's got to be
big enough to be meaningful. And a
little bit of money here and there, I
think stopped being meaningful over the
past three or four years.
Our
biggest uh industrial application was
for med relief at that time and it was
$98 million and they brought in 300 jobs
and we paid $98,000.
So it's good. I I'm chairing the
meeting. I'm just talking about
opportunities out there. So just letting
it go. Uh councelor Harper.
Thank you mayor. Um, in hopes of
collaboration and clarity, I'm going to
use uh council fari's tactic here in
regards to this question. The tax
incentive for industrial um CIP or
industrial businesses that like to come
here, could they not be come to us on a
onetoone basis as well? And that may be
a question for the CEO to answer. help
us me clarify that so that way it seems
like we're want to put it on hiatus but
we don't want to we want to have the
tools in the box. Could that not come to
us on a onetoone and a you know
discretionary
utilization for ECDEV to negotiate with
industries that would like to come to
our town and then they have that to be
like well we could bring that to council
and you know offer that tax incentive if
you say it doesn't hit the tax bracket
why do we need a CIP for that so I'd
like to ask that question
» thanks your worship
uh In Ontario, municipalities are
prohibited from providing financial
incentives to any commercial or
profitable enterprise in an effort to u
either support them or entice them to to
come to municipality with a few
exceptions. One of those exceptions is a
community improvement program or plan
that sets out the the parameters under
which the the assistance would be
provided uh is prepared within a public
forum and is available to any applicant
to apply and and um explain how they
would meet those criteria. So when Mr.
hack talks about um keeping our CIP
in a um
uh
dormant state um and activating at some
point in the future if the need arises.
Um in in my view
those conditions would be um there's a
um some demand from a number of parties
that that are of interest to council.
you would open it up for a period of
time not just to deal with that
individual company because that is kind
of circumventing the rules of province
it out for us um and then entertain any
applications within that time frame um
to receive the assistance so it's it's
not a onetoone thing it'd be creating
another period of time that the CIP
program would be alive
» okay answer your
comment. Okay, go ahead.
>> Uh thank you uh thank you mayor and uh
» Uh thank you uh thank you mayor and uh
CEO for those comments and uh
recollection of the process. There's a
lot of procedures that uh are easily
weighed upon or or or forgotten. But um
I remember hearing that now a couple
years ago when I asked that question and
it's great to recall that and I'm glad I
asked it for for clarification.
Um, it definitely makes things a little
bit more tricky in regards to the
guidelines and the in regards to the
actual
uh restrictions municipalities have in
regards to um attracting certain types
of businesses. So, u I'm going to have
to leave my comments there and maybe
weigh in, but it's definitely giving me
a ponder to think about right now for a
decision.
>> Thank you for the comments. I've got
» Thank you for the comments. I've got
councelor Jordano.
That'll be quick so we can move on to
the vote. Um, so yeah, when I was
talking earlier about the tools in the
toolbox, and I think the mayor kind of
alluded to that, CEO's comments about
that we can't just open it for one, we
have to open it to review. Um, my
question is, can we have it on our
website saying that the CIP is currently
accepting applications for consideration
and in future budgets like the one that
will be coming up, we can decide and
allocate if at that point at the budget
we see a need to add some funds to that
or vice versa, maybe we have a quarterly
opportunity to revisit the CIP.
Therefore signaling to the business
community we are actively looking at
this but we're welcoming your
applications in the meantime
» if I can I think thank you for to your
worship um I certainly appreciate the
comment I think in in all respects you
have to act in good faith um and so if
it's on hiatus or whether it's
operational but unfunded it's it's it's
the rose by another name it is that's
what it is you not be able to distribute
funds. Um I think we all have to
remember that the C the provision of
public funds through a CIP is entirely
discretionary. You can set out rules.
You can judge applicants based on that,
but there's no entitlement here. So you
have the ability to to moderate, but
again you have to act in good faith. you
can't draw people in and then then you
know when it's clearly a good
opportunity meets all the rules you have
to act in good faith so I think it comes
back to you know if it's on hiatus it's
on hiatus that's the approach
so my thoughts on that is that if we
open up the the IIA and we we you know
had parameters that talked about job
jobs of a specific number square footage
I mean we do allow ourselves to get
calls and get those get those questions
and the issue is that it does come to
council and we have the ability then to
make that decision when we want to and
if it means that we have to actually add
something into the CIP to fund that
project because it is of great value to
our community we have the right and at
time to do that we can do that at that
time to fund that in the budget so to me
leaving uh you know leaving the IIA open
is uh critical I think it's something
that we shouldn't be uh shutting down
because uh we have the right as a
council to make those decisions in the
end so to to me. Uh it's important
because this is about job creation and
I've seen it work in our industrial
program already on reagents and in our
community and it has valued over $200
million in in money and it you know one
facility created 300 jobs. So there is
an opportunity for us to benefit from
that. So that's where I'm at with option
two. Council Harper.
Thank you mayor. I think we're I don't
we don't want to actually, you know, cut
off the circulation regards to some of
this. I would be open to option one with
an amendment that all the other plans to
go on hiatus except the IIA, but to come
back to us in regards to what that looks
like on the IIA. I don't agree with the
rest of option two. Um, but definitely
having that on there and seeing the
restrictions that uh face our
municipality, I would not want a
business to overlook us because of an
oversight like this. And I think if we
leave it open there, funded or not, we
still say that we do have an IIA CIP.
Um, and that could be a beneficial thing
for us. Who knows what comes in the
door. So I would like to add um an
amendment friendly amendment to the to
my my colleagues initial option one that
we add um the IAIP
stay up.
>> No, there's other stuff there. So
» No, there's other stuff there. So
So I was just councilor Harper, if you
want to make an amendment, we can. And I
was just going to suggest that if you're
okay with that option that we you take
option two that council approves a
proceeding of phase one implementation
industrial human improvement plan IIA as
outlined in the report and that staff
bey utilize the existing CIP reserve at
phase one implementation and that the
rest of the CIPs stay on an hiatus. So
it's the same thing kind of we're just
juggling it around and we're getting rid
of two and four. you you're not, you
know, you're not liking to enforce it,
remove that and just put the downtown
CIP uh on hiatus and the seniors housing
on hiatus. Keep them there and just do
the IIA for the IIA one. And we have
65,000 that is in that budget already.
It's not we're not asking to add more
right now. We're just saying use that
money. If something comes along and we
can as council endorse it, we endorse it
and we'll the program will come back
with the identified TIG and things like
that for for that. Yeah, please. I'm
okay with the way you put that um in
regards to this before we move to the
phase one of implementation and I know
um sir you were talking about whenever
we give you a go- ahead you would come
back to us with certain elements of what
that looks like was that what we we
would come back to us then we would see
what option or phase one looks like
before we even move forward then
>> you Mr. No, I'll just confirm exactly
» you Mr. No, I'll just confirm exactly
that. Yeah. So, so phase one final slide
we had uh phase one Q3. So, September
onwards of this year into the end of the
year, draft the AICP programs. So, as I
said, and this is just for food for
thought again, if you were to maintain
the option of having an open industrial
area CIP,
uh, with a tax increment grant there for
discretionary use, then then that's the
program that gets written.
So, mayor that I I have to basically um
bow to the first option that that was
given to uh my colleague here to see
whether he wishes to resend or and then
make changes or wishes to proceed. So,
up to you to proceed.
>> Okay, I'll go back. I've got councelor
» Okay, I'll go back. I've got councelor
Henny first and then I'll go back to the
asking about what we want to do options.
Councelor Dehaney,
you're muted. that councelor.
>> Thank you. So, I am not going to support
» Thank you. So, I am not going to support
the amendment. I'm going to stick with
option one. Um, is you know, we're going
to support all or we're not going to
support them. We have to be fair. We
cannot pick and choose who we're going
to support or who we're going to um open
the door to. I think it is we're not
canceling the CIP. We're just pausing it
for a bit. And nothing is wrong with
understanding that. I think we need to
make meaningful discuss this decision
and not polit and don't be too political
driven with our decision right and
majority of us already see option one I
really don't see why I understand that
having healthy dialogue is very
important but I don't see why we should
be going around and around and around
until we please you know people and come
up with an answer confusing the whole
body of everyone right majority of
person said option one let us pause it
for a And I think it's very manipulative
for us to be continuing this way and
leading into these decision you know
which you know persons now maybe double
thinking it's only fair if we're not
going to be fair to everyone I don't
think we should pick and choose who
we're going to open it to option one was
on the table and I believe I will
definitely continue supporting option
one until we go to budget and if there's
any extras or you know seeing ways that
we can open up the program to more right
that was on the table then we do so but
nothing is wrong with saying pause for a
bit and respect that and move on to the
next agenda
okay thank you for those comments okay I
do have uh option one on the floor so
wondered if uh I've got my mover was
councelor Dyke and councelor
>> Vike call for a vote
» Vike call for a vote
>> you're going to call for a vote okay
and look at the amendments. I think it's
a vote.
>> So, the mover doesn't want to move it
» So, the mover doesn't want to move it
anymore. Okay. So, I'm going to opt uh
put another Who would like to move
option two? As stated, we remove the
staff report back, you know, get rid of
options two and four.
» He he can.
>> Madam clerk, can he can he pull his uh
» Madam clerk, can he can he pull his uh
>> debating?
Give her a moment to look that up, but
that we could go to the feet vote. Yeah,
we could uh we'll just see if he can
» you worship while we're waiting for the
clerk. If the mover has rescended, I'm
prepared to move that and if I still
have the sec second or unless clerk
tells us otherwise, I I still agree with
option one.
Okay, we'll just wait and see.
I can move option one if you don't have
a mover.
>> We have a few of them apparently.
» We have a few of them apparently.
>> Thank you.
Okay. With with respect to the um motion
being withdrawn. So, a motion that has
been duly seconded may be drawn subject
to um the consent of councel.
Um if no member objects to the
withdrawal of the motion, the motion
shall be considered withdrawn. If a
member objects to the withdrawal of a
motion, the withdrawal a withdrawal
motion shall be entertained. And if such
motion receives a seconder, it shall be
decided prior to consideration of any
other motion.
And if a motion is withdrawn, the effect
is the same as if had never been made.
So, we would need the
consent of council.
>> It's okay. So, we need So, I I I I'm
» It's okay. So, we need So, I I I I'm
sure council has will want to hear the
motion because I've had a few say they
want to second it again or move it. So,
we have a motion on the floor. Option
one, moved by councelor Dy, seconded by
councelor We'll vote on option one
uh to see that's what we'll vote on. And
if that passes, if not, we move on and
we we bring up another option. So, okay.
So, all in favor of option one,
one, two, three.
>> Mayor, one second. Just a second,
» Mayor, one second. Just a second,
please. Cuz I want to make sure that I
know what I'm voting on cuz there has
been a lot of changes in between. Are we
voting on option one as original without
any amendment, without any motion? So, I
want to make sure that I am voting on
what was presented initially without all
these chaos and stuff before it started.
So can you please read what we are voted
on please and thank you.
>> Option one that the community
» Option one that the community
improvement uh plan programs remain on
hiatus and no further action be taken at
this time.
>> Okay, perfect. I am voting for that.
vote.
» We're ready.
>> Yeah, I'm ready. We're ready.
Okay. For a recorded vote for um option
one for the CIP program
yes in support and no in opposition.
We'll start with councelor Harper.
To clarify is to put it on hiatus and I
say no.
Sorry. You're looking to clarify the the
motion.
>> Yeah. You said it was to keep this CIP
» Yeah. You said it was to keep this CIP
and put a You didn't mention that it was
to put it on hiatus.
» Let me put the motion on the screen so
everybody has it in front of them.
Okay. So, for a recorded vote for the
motion that's in front of council,
do you want do you want me to read the
motion?
>> Yeah, please read it out for everybody.
» Yeah, please read it out for everybody.
that report EDO 2025-3 titled 2026
community improvement plan CIP program
options be received and that council
endorses a community improvement plan
comprehensive update report prepared by
CR Planning and Management and that
council approve proceeding with the IAIP
the community improvement plan programs
remain on hiatus and no further action
be taken at this time.
» Yes, sir. You you it's option one. It's
just option one. the community
improvement program uh improvement plan
program remains on hiatus and no further
action be taken at this time. So we
didn't actually put um the IAIP in
there.
>> That's just straightforward option one.
» That's just straightforward option one.
They all say once
she's just going to put on screen again.
It's she's going to rewrite it. It's the
original motion. It's going the original
motion option one. It's on hiatus all.
Go ahead. Ask.
There we are. That's good.
Okay.
>> Apologies. Is that correct?
» Apologies. Is that correct?
>> Yeah, that's correct. Thank you.
» Yeah, that's correct. Thank you.
>> Okay, everybody reads it. We read again
» Okay, everybody reads it. We read again
or we're okay.
>> Okay. So, go ahead.
» Okay. So, go ahead.
>> And now I will call the recorded vote
» And now I will call the recorded vote
starting with councelor Harper. Um,
state yes in support and no in
opposition, please.
» Uh, no. Thank you. Councelor
Dehaney.
» Yes. I support option one that the
community improvement plan program
remain an iatus and move further action
be taken at this time.
>> Councelor Dying.
» Councelor Dying.
>> Councelor Farerini.
» Councelor Farerini.
>> Yes.
» Yes.
>> Councelor Geodeno.
» Councelor Geodeno.
>> Yes.
» Yes.
>> Councelor Scott.
» Councelor Scott.
>> Councelor Vike.
» Councelor Vike.
Deputy Mayor Sandu.
>> Yes.
» Yes.
>> Mayor Leuk.
» Mayor Leuk.
>> The motion.
» The motion.
>> The motion is carried.
» Okay. Thank you. We are on to uh 9.2 now
then. And it's update on Bradford on
demand transit. Uh our presentation from
our deputy CEO Mahesh Ramdeo. Floor is
yours.
Thank you, Mayor Luk.
Just give a few minutes, a few seconds.
So, uh, again, thank you, Mayor Luk,
Deputy Mayor Sandu, members of council.
Good evening, Mr. CEO. Good evening.
First time ever somebody's uh
uh thank you all for um having me here
this evening and I wish to start by
thanking council for their support on
this the on demand pilot that we've got
so far um and also to thank staff uh
especially Paul Dubinak, Joe Coleman,
Tony D. Ro, Vanessa Morum, Karen
McKenna, senior management, and
definitely my communication team who's
been helping in terms of the
communication with the public and with
this presentation. So, thanks to all of
them.
In many ways, what I'm going to present
tonight is
uh a story of success and challenges
that really come with success. Um, and
that's what this this story is about
this evening.
Tara, could you?
Okay.
I'd like to start with where we began
what we began with and where we are
today and some of the the the
recommendations
out of our 2031 transit master plan.
Prior to the on demand pilot, we had a
fixed bus system, a fixed transit system
with three routes.
We saw in 2024, we saw about 60,000
annual rides. And on April 2nd, the day
before we started the on demand transit,
we had 13 174
rides on the system.
The 2031 transit master plan had
highlighted a gap in the system of
not full coverage of the urban areas of
Bradford, not full coverage of Bradford
and made some recommendations going out
to 2031. Those recommendations required
17 buses. The transit master plan did
not cost out the capital. I worked it
out to 1.6 million annual cost. It
estimated an operating cost of about
five of 4.5 million for a total cost of
6.1.
That for us poses a constraint. Um
Bradford as a town would be challenged
to fund that.
residents had had indicated that they
prefer full coverage to the low um the
areas of low coverage within the
community an increase in the number of
routes increased frequency and
definitely uh connections to the the
higher level transit of go and the
links.
So the challenge for us is how do we
deliver how could we deliver on that um
given the constraints that we had.
So
what would be the benefits of delivering
on that a better m public system public
transit system?
The 2031 transit master plan had
suggested that if we got to 420,000
rides in 2031 we could see upwards of
16.5 million in economic benefit.
That is in straight up economic benefit
and savings to the individuals that
could be spent within the community.
The Canadian Public Health Association
in 2019 had said that people who live in
communities with good transit drive half
as much and could save up to $10,000 per
year per household.
David Suzuki Foundation said it improves
quality of life.
I'd like you to to put the 10,000 into
context and to
imagine a future where we could create
where residents would not need multiple
cars would be able to save that kind of
money. Reduce cost of living within
Bradford hopefully becomes one of the
attracting tools to Bradford. More
people coming here, more labor coming
here, increases in the labor force could
have a a follow on effect of employers
moving here because there is the labor
force. The cost of doing business here
is lower lower. That means more economic
development, more jobs, more benefits.
That's the future that I think we could
get to. Next one, please.
So in November 2024,
council endorsed a shift from the the
fixed transit system to an on demand
pilot.
Just to go back a little bit what an
ondemand service really is. It's a
service where riders could choose could
call a ride via an app or a phone call.
Um and it will be they'll be serviced in
real time rather than following a fixed
route system that's on a schedule. Um,
it could allow for a more personalized
service, uh, flexible pickup near their
where they pick up and drop off near
where they're going, making it more
convenient. And in an area like Bradford
where you've got um lower ridership
and somewhat inefficient fixed transit,
it could improve your efficiencies.
Um, it has the potential of serving all
of Bradford at a lower cost. um
increasing frequencies and connecting to
the trans the higher level transit.
When we put the system together, our
thought process was we're starting at
60,000 rights per year. We could most
definitely achieve what Inisville has
with a shared ride service. That is
95,000 rides per year.
A number to keep in mind is that 95,000
rides equates to about 300 rides per
day.
We started at 174 on April 2nd. I can
tell you on April 28th, which is when I
put this presentation together, we did
427 rights that day. So, we are
definitely in four months ahead of what
we had planned for. That's the success
and the challenge that comes with that
success. Next one, please.
Don't take it from me. Listen to some of
the writers.
My name is Greg K. I've lived in
Bradford for 14 years.
>> Name's Bonnie Walker. I was born and
» Name's Bonnie Walker. I was born and
raised here.
» What was it like before Fargo?
>> Quite expensive to go to hospital for
» Quite expensive to go to hospital for
treatment in it. 65 $85 one way.
>> She had to wait for a while for taxis.
» She had to wait for a while for taxis.
So there were nights where I might walk
about 45 plus minutes home.
>> Do you happen to like to wait in the
» Do you happen to like to wait in the
winter time? You like to wait for half
an hour cuz you just missed the bus.
Enjoy.
Before Argo, a lot of my staff would use
a ride sharing type service. They now
have the opportunity to get that
doortodoor service. Usually when I go to
concerts, we order the artgo and we go
to the station and then we take the
train and it's wonderful.
I use it like five times the same day.
With a I save a lot of money.
>> It's a phenomenal service. I get my card
» It's a phenomenal service. I get my card
on the bus and I can travel all day long
delivering honey and it cost me $7
because it's an hour and a half for a
dollar. The app is absolutely fantastic.
They're extremely good drivers. I like
the door to door service especially come
like the winter time. You can stay in
your house. You can look out your window
instead of crossing a busy intersection
with my two kids who both have autism.
So have the Argo service. It's just a
safer way of transportation.
The bus has been a godsend for me.
That's really opened up the doors for me
and others here.
[Music]
It makes me happy. They can go places
that they wouldn't be able to go. Argo
have made significant difference in the
communities.
» Because of Argo, it's been a different
way of life.
Go to the next slide, please.
Thank you.
In the 2031 transit master plan, one of
the themes, the common themes that kept
coming up was to increase service to
the urban core to the Bradford area.
What you're looking at here is a
comparison.
On the left are the air the stops on the
fixed transit system. on the right
represents one month worth of data
really late June into July of all the
stops, all the pickups, all the drop
offs within the community.
That is a full coverage.
We then took that one step further. What
we did was to take the the trips on the
right and imagine what h what would
happen if those were with fixed transit.
And we computed what the the wait time
would be, what the right time would be,
what the walking time would be. And what
you see the numbers below are the
comparison of the median rides on fixed
transit.
The median trip time, total trip time
would be 69 minutes.
The median trip time on on demand
transit was close to 26 minutes.
So there is a benefit, but there are
challenges with it. Did you go to the
next one?
Uh, something is supposed to come up
here. One more, please.
Yeah, there we go.
There we go.
This one I'm going to blame on it slow
systems.
Um, challenges. In July,
we did just over 9,100 trips to when I
put this presentation together.
We had 57 complaints. Of that 57
complaints, half of it was for weight
times, and I'll speak to that in a
second. 30% of it were about the app and
primarily about
not being sure where the pickup location
would be and where the drop off
location, how to get there. Um, some
were on driver. We did some
investigation there. Um a fair number of
those were actually customer
interaction complaints.
Um could you go forward please?
So how were we addressing the weight
times?
One of the things that we heard from the
residents
um around wait time was not so much that
they had to wait a long time and to be
to be transparent to everyone in our
peak periods which is generally in the
afternoons wait times what we call the
P95 wait time which is 95 5% of the
weight time could approach an hour
that is a direct indication of demand
outstripping supply. So you have to wait
until the bus becomes available. Um
around that as well, some of the
concern, some of the anxiety was needing
to get somewhere by a specific time and
not being sure
um if you're going to get there by that
time.
So as a team we've looked at how can we
resolve this and one of the improve
improvements that will be coming out
within the next month in September would
be around predictability of your ride.
If you plan ahead you can get to your
location at the time you want. So how
are we going to do that?
We'll allow so the the update that's
coming is to preschedu your ride. book
it in advance and you can book days in
advance and you can book repeated rides
every day. Um and the system will track
those for you one hour in advance of
that ride. You will get a reminder your
ride is in coming in an hour. Please
reconfirm. If you've reconfirmed that we
will guarantee that you will arrive
within on that time.
So that will give the predictability
that riders are looking for. Um, yes,
there is a catch that could end up
everybody prescheduling. We don't
believe we will get there. Um, but what
we're allowing is that with planning
ahead, you can have full control of what
is it you want to do. And that's where
we're going with this one. So, that's in
September.
Could you go to the next one, please?
The other complaints that we did receive
on the app was
not knowing or not knowing how to get to
the location of pickup. Um, right now
the app does show you a way to get
there. It could be improved. So within
the next two weeks, you will get that
walking direction on the app to get
there.
So that's coming in September. Another
roll out will be if you're going to the
GO station,
the app will show you the trip time, the
scheduled trip times for the transit
there.
So you you'll be able to plan your trip
with planning ahead. You'll be able to
plan your your trips out. That's where
we're going with this. And these are
coming in September. So again, if you're
willing to plan at least an hour ahead,
you can have control of your experience.
And that's what this is about.
Go ahead, please.
So, what are we projecting?
This projection here is a measured
approach of where we think we can go
towards building to the 420,000
annual rise that the 2031 master plan
had recommended. And that was 2031.
Why is it a measured approach like this?
Two reasons
staff internally we've discussed that it
is better to grow into the demand,
manage our resources to get there, drive
efficiencies to get there versus
expanding the system right now and
taking and growing those inefficiencies.
So this is a measured growth to get
there. Um also to grow to this level
would require a fair bit of
infrastructure that we don't today have.
We will have to build that if we get
there. Um so this takes a measured
approach to get there. What I'm looking
for um
going forward is procurement process
that allows us to do this and allows us
to do this in the most cost effective
way.
The challenge with getting to what I
just showed you is funding it. How do we
fund it? Honestly, Bradford as a
community, unless we do some massive
um internal revenue generation would be
a challenge. We need a partner on this.
We've reached out to the province. We've
had initial conversations with the
province. We've shared with them a draft
application and we've had discussions of
that draft applications and they've
given us feedback.
That process or that funding window
is for a five-year fund
that allows us to set the system and
grow our own internal revenues through
various means so that at the end of five
years it is sustainable. So they will
fund the gap up to that point. Our
thinking to fund um sustainability will
be a number of things that will be
subject to to council's endorsement.
The ideas that we're looking at right
now are targeted uh fair increases. I
say targeted because
it would be to the demographic that can
afford it. We are looking at um
we are looking at um revenue growth
through sponsorship through advertising.
We are looking at revenue growth through
um
assessment growth that this will drive
um a number of different ways to get to
that sustainable measures. But that's
where we need to get to.
We're also looking at other funding
sources such as the green fund and
anything that comes up we are targeting.
But the idea is to target consistent
repeatable funding sources to augment.
We already have one that will last for
10 years. This is for capital. We'll be
looking for more like those. Um the last
one that will drive that will happen to
us is that if we can drive our ridership
from 60,000 to 350 400,000 it will
result in an increase in the Canada
community uh benefits fund the gas tax
and that will be a funding source for us
going up as well. We see that we can get
to sustainability in five to six years.
We see a path to that. Next one please.
So, this is what we're looking to do
over the next uh a few months.
Release start a procurement process for
a five-year TR uh contract. And why a
five-year contract?
Anybody who's coming in um and I can't
predicate what I'm doing that's saying
the pilot will continue. No, it's not
that. This is going to a competitive
procurement process that there is a
potential that it could be somebody new.
Whoever is coming
will need to invest a significant amount
in terms of startup costs. They need to
recover that. If the procurement period,
if the the contract period is short,
they will look to recover that in that
short period. Higher annual cost to us.
So this is looking at a reasonable way
for them to spread that. So we get the
the the biggest benefit from that.
It would be based on options.
One is we get the full funding from the
province and therefore it could be
funded and going forward. But a second
option would be we don't get that
funding and we need to work within our
own funding source. If that happens, we
would have to look back at the
writership numbers and how we get to
that and what we could internally
afford.
The RFP, we're looking to release it
later in August, close it in October,
evaluate and have something by the end
of October, early November. Um, and we
would have to come to council for that
award. That's not something that's going
to be at a staff level. So it'll be here
back at council for the discussion in
terms of funding where we're going and
how we're paying for it all. Um
that period will allow six months that
assuming that it's it could potentially
be someone new
allowing that mobilization period for
them to get their act and get their
resources here and that's what it is and
that brings me to the end.
>> All right. Thank you very much for that
» All right. Thank you very much for that
report. I have a few people that went
right away. So I will go right. The
first one that hit me was councelor
and then councelor Jordano next.
So
the comments that I've received from so
many residents is that this system is a
gamecher for them and it's also from
what I'm seeing on the map the fixed
routes
only serve maybe half the population in
town because the fixed roots were over
here over here. But if you lived over
here, you'd have to walk 20 minutes or
15 minutes to get to the bus. That
didn't make any sense at all. And then
if the fixed route didn't take you to
where you needed to go, you'd have to
walk it. So that made no sense. It was
just as well, you might as well just
walk the uh half an hour to get to where
you needed to go. So the tra public
transit system only served a small small
percentage of the town. And you had
three buses going around. they were
always empty. Maybe they had two or
three people in there. So, we were
basically just wasting money. Um, so I
would like to move to support this
recommendation, but I do have a couple
questions. Um, how do we overcome the
budget? like how do if if we want to
award the contract in November 2025, we
haven't completed the budget process,
wouldn't it make more sense to award the
contract after we've completed our
budget
uh through Mayor Lukai.
Fair point. Um the hope is at that point
in time we would have received word on
the provincial funding so we'll know the
funding sources that we've got and we
could come to you and say okay here are
the funding sources here how we can fund
this without impacting the tax base.
That's the hope.
>> And if we don't then
» And if we don't then
>> plan B,
» plan B,
>> what's plan B?
» what's plan B?
>> Coming back to to you for to council to
» Coming back to to you for to council to
evaluate an option that stays within
what is it we can afford to fund.
» Okay, I've got councelor Gordano and
then councelor Scott.
>> Well, thanks for the presentation. I
» Well, thanks for the presentation. I
know we've been talking a lot back and
forth over email as this thing rolled
out. So, I just want to start off by
saying I I really want uh this this kind
of on demand system to work. I I think
my wife doesn't drive. I have uh
children that don't drive yet. It's it
is a game changer. Um when it works and
um I definitely endorse the pilot. Um
there's a few things I just want to talk
about. So, I don't know if you want to
write these down and then maybe it's
easier if I just go through them all and
then you can answer back. Um but the one
thing was the presentation. Like we
didn't have access to that video ahead
of time. It didn't work in our uh in our
system here to view it, but I did find
that it was very handpicked advantageous
promotional video. It wasn't really uh
it was just only showcasing lovers of
the system. Um I I would have liked
something maybe a little more
transparent and uh showing not just the
people that are loving it, but also
maybe some of the challenges that
they're working through. Um like there's
one gentleman who's actually running a
business uh being subsidized a dollar a
ride to deliver products. I don't think
that was the intent of this. This is a
public transportation system, not to
subsidize somebody's business. Um,
anyways,
um, a few things that I want to talk
about. Like I know we're talking about
successes, but realistically I don't
think we're able to raise the flag of
success yet. Although it it works
fantastically, there's a few concerns
that we've had. And just remember that
the public didn't have access to this.
Only a select few people had access to
this and we slowly started rolling it
out. Heck, I had to constantly mail the
deputy CEO to try to get users on it.
like that's not in my opinion a pilot. I
think we're way too premature to say
that it's a successful pilot at this
point. Um,
so at the end of the day, we still
haven't rolled out the app there. People
are are having to walk to a station
needing a cell phone in order to call to
say, "Hey, I need a I need a a bus
pickup." Oh, okay. It'll be there in 20
minutes. Okay, great. Now, when the bus
when you have the app, the bus says,
"Oh, I'm being delayed, so it'll come in
another 3540 minutes." But the people
who are at the bus, they don't know
that. So now they're sitting there
waiting and then they got to call back.
Oh, sorry. It's delay another 20
minutes. So they've already been outside
for 40 minutes, waiting for uh the bus
to come. So these are the gaps that we
need to get solved. Um because right now
those types of situations, people are
like, I might as well just walk at this
point right now. When it does come
relatively quickly or on time, it's
fantastic. It's door-todoor service a
lot of cases. And I agree, when you look
at the coverage, it's far better than
what we've had in the past. So, I I do I
do want to say some of that, but I think
we need to roll out this pilot longer
and collect more actual data. Um, again,
the wait times, it's caused people to
miss uh meetings. There's lots of people
that I've spoken to me saying like, I
love it, but then the odd time I just I
I can't get there on time or delays me,
delays me, delays me, and I'm stuck, you
know, missing an appointment or being
charged for an appointment that I
couldn't get to in time. Uh, the the on
demand pre-booking, that's a gamecher. I
think that's huge. I love that and I
think that's the future to probably make
this more successful than what it is
right now. U but my concern is is that
you made a guarantee. You said that
there's a guarantee to get you on time.
I want to know more about this guarantee
because I'll tell you right now, if you
have a snowstorm, if there's an
accident, if there's just heavy demand,
what guarantee are we giving people?
That's a that's a that's something that
needs to be addressed that you didn't do
it in your presentation. Um, I want to
see the app actually rolled out to
everybody to the the public because
right now it's only been selected given.
So, the last thing is that we haven't
even ran these buses in the winter time.
We don't even know if these buses can go
through 4 inches of snow. We don't know
any of this data. It's got little
wheels. It's low to the ground. It's
battery powered. We don't know how these
things will perform. I'd like to at
least go through the winter time and see
the performance before we go ahead and
and say, "Let's do a 5-year contract and
roll it out." These are all important
pieces of data that's missing from your
so-called successful pilot. We're not
there yet. We said a one-year pilot. I
want to count one year when it rolls out
to the public, not from the day we
started and we slowly drip drip drip
drip drip to people. It has to be one
year as an actual transit system in
order for me to have the data to say
that this is fully supported. Um, and
then the last thing I want to say,
whether it's our old transit system, new
transit system, this transit system, we
need to connect to Henderson Park.
I I think I think at some point we need
to figure out how to do that as soon as
possible. That that place is an absolute
gem and it's not being connected and we
can't get there safely. Nobody can ride
their bikes or walk there and like
there's so many families that would
utilize that place so much more during
the day. So that's a priority for me for
this transit system. Thank you.
» You want to respond to any questions?
Sure.
>> Um
» Um
I wrote them down so I'll I'll go
through all of them. One of them I might
need some help. Um
the video you mentioned the challenges
that is exactly why I had the subsequent
slide on the challenges. It this is
about transparency. Um whilst 9,100 plus
rides happened from July 1st to July 28
when I put this together, we had 57
complaints. And that's why I wanted to
put that out there.
um what those complaints were, the
general categories because it's it's
about transparency,
bus delays. Um first of all, the app,
everybody has access to the app. Um
» just let let him finish.
Everybody has access to the app and when
it comes as I said in the presentation
when it comes to
wait time that is happening when the
demand for the service exceeds the
capacity of the service. Um and that's a
resource issue and that's something
we're hoping that with the provincial
help we'll be able to resolve. It's not
something to be honest, it's not
something that we've got as a town.
We've got the resources to put to that.
Um, so we we do need some help. Why is
it a benefit that we've been telling the
province? It drives economic growth. Not
only does it drive quality of life, it
drives economic growth. When it
something drives economic growth, the
province benefits, the feds benefit more
so than we do. Um, so we need them to
come to the table as well. And that's
been the conversation. They've been good
in that they've come to the table.
They've looked at what is it we've
proposed. They've um they've given us
feedback and they've asked for a
resubmitt. So, we'll at least they're
talking to us as opposed to reviewing
and that's the end of it. So, we're I am
hopeful. I'm on that particular part. Um
you mentioned missing meetings, you also
mentioned the the app in terms of the
being able to plan ahead. Yes, that will
be a game changer. um it'll roll out
next month. So, we'll see where that
goes and how that goes. Um
why coming now for an update and saying
we need to go forward? I can't make a
decision assuming that it will be the
same provider going forward. I have to
consider that there is a potential that
someone else some other firm could be
successful and if they were successful
they would need time to remobilize time
to set up their infrastructure to start
on April 1st. They need timing ahead of
that. If I were to wait to the end of
the pilot which is April f March 31st
then they would not have that time to
mobilize. Um that would be a challenge
for us. So that is why I'm here now. Um
Henderson Park. Yeah, it would be nice
to have right resourcing. So with the
province help, maybe we can do that.
» Yeah, good answer. So sorry, I I I was
misspoken. There was the app that just
recently was made available to everyone.
What date was that?
>> Uh uh little
» Yeah, early July.
>> Right. So about a month.
» Right. So about a month.
>> So that's how I look at a pilot. we'd
» So that's how I look at a pilot. we'd
really only have the public available
for a month to really use this. We've
had a select bunch of people slowly
getting dripped onto it. Um me
personally, is there an opportunity for
us to extend the pilot till maybe July
of next year, therefore giving you a
whole year's worth of users data in
order to understand and to shape and
look at it. Why are we rushing right
away for an April 1 arbitrary deadline?
I think we can extend the uh the pilot
or at least go through the full winter
and utilize that. I'm not comfortable
any transit system that's a pilot from a
brand new concept that doesn't really
exist in in Ontario that I'm aware of. I
think there there's one or two people
are trying it out as well. But the point
is is that we we got to be careful
before we go all in on anything. And I'd
like to see more data personally. I'd
like to see more user experience
information and and frankly, you know,
get the bugs and figured out not just
from this company, but from in general
because there might be other things
throughout the winter that we might
understand because these these buses,
although they're electric, they're also
equipped with a diesel engine. Correct.
That also helps maybe the heating
systems or something like that in the
winter time or I'm not sure how that
works, but I want to see how that
performs as well. I want to understand
what it's like in, you know, with with
the icy or snowy weather. How much
longer does it take for on demand
service to work? I think this is
important data. I don't want to rush
this.
Okay, thank you. You are you responding
to anything or
>> I can respond to the last part if if you
» I can respond to the last part if if you
wishes. Um again through you mayor Luk.
Uh we do have some Arargo folks here who
can speak to you in terms of the
performance of the buses during winter.
Um we did start on April 3rd that first
half of April it was operating and
weather down to minus 7 minus five those
right. Um so it was operating in terms
of these buses have been used in Halifax
have been used in Oakville for at least
for the last winter probably two
winters. Um if you're looking for data
on in how it's performed there we can
get that to you right I can you wish it
now Argo is here or we can give you that
data later.
Okay thank you I've got councelor Scott
next and councelor Harper.
Um, thank you uh to the deputy CEO, all
the staff and the team from Argo. This
has been an innovative project and the
roll out started off frankly better than
I expected with the initial transit
riders then phasing into the app opening
this summer. Ridership more than
doubling over the first few months is
huge. We've expanded coverage as council
said additional hours. We're
reaching more residents more often and
we were one of the first anywhere to
launch a fully electric app-based on
demand transit system and I think that's
something we should be proud of. The
success has brought inevitable pressure.
demand is outpacing supply, especially
during peak hours as was referenced. And
it's the wait time variability that I
think's become a real concern. And we've
started to hear it may have been 57
complaints, but I think we heard every
all 57 of them. So, I'm I'm glad to see
staff looking into the pre-booking
options for people with set uh
schedules. I I think that'll help
commuters. Getting ahead of the back to
school season where I think we're going
to see demand spike during peak hours is
also going to be huge. So, I support
that direction. I think that's another
innovative innovative tweak to try and
improve the app. And Uber to an extent
has that feature. Um, I like where we're
going there. It's going to go a long way
to improving reliability and confidence
in the system if you know that you can
book to get to work or get to school. Uh
I do think we still have opportunities
to really integrate with the county's
links bus system. That's what serves
bond head to some extent right now and
other parts of the highway 400 uh jobs
corridor and trying to find a way to
almost do a handoff between someone
coming from Bondad into Bradford. I'd
like to see that and the same with the
go bus because that serves our our rural
Young Street corridor and and
integrating between the intra regional,
the regional and the local transit is is
something that I don't really think many
municipalities do well. The TTC maybe in
the Tobico but less so in Scar Bro. Uh
so trying to fix that would be huge. Um
just a few questions. You you mentioned
advertising. We had an ad program on the
fixed route bus. So, what happened to
that? How quickly can we bring it back?
It is a fullear pilot. Uh, I too want to
see how it works in wintertime. Uh, and
a 5-year contract launching for the RFP.
Why five years? Uh, why not 10 or some
other number? And then we're essentially
talking about a public private
partnership here. and and I know our our
previous bus system we contracted with a
a bus company, but are we sure that
federal or provincial grants apply here
uh when we're basically contracting the
service? So, those are my questions. I
mean, I I I see the two or three
opportunities the deputy CEO's outlined
as as good attempts uh that will help
write the next chapter in the
transformation. We're iterating the app
as we go and I I like to see that. Uh
but we need to scale it up, improve
predictability and connect more
seamlessly to the regional network. I'd
say those are the three opportunities to
really improve. And then those two or
three questions I asked as well, please
you may lupa councelor uh Scott
start with um your second question.
Would the province and federal funding
apply? The province has said yes. Right.
Last Wednesday we met and this was one
of the questions. Um why fiveyear?
The I'm not going to say the firm
conversation was around fiveyear.
The decision on fiveyear
seemed long enough that allows the
whoever that proponent is to be able to
reasonably recover their investment and
not really tie the municipality. Can we
look at five plus an option? Yes, that's
that would be a good good way to look at
it. Um and we'll take that back from
you. Um connect to other higher levels
of levels of transit. Two things are
happening in that front. One is we
showed on the app the ability to to see
what's coming. Um to be able to pre-plan
something from here, let's say to Alison
connecting to the links and going
forward where you seamlessly walk. I
think the most we'll be able to do is
show when the bus is coming. So you able
to connect, you're there in time for it.
Um but it wouldn't be like an aircraft
where your stuff wouldn't be like that.
But you'll need to be able to do that.
The second thing that staff and I are
looking at is in terms of links. What
are the how more can we leverage links
within the community? It is something
that we pay for already. So we want to
be able to leverage that that resource
that's available to us. Not to replace
but to augment what is it we have right
now. And specifically we're looking at
things like increasing frequency. We
they they've already made that decision.
And we're looking at their accessible
service as well. So those are ways that
we can connect and leverage.
>> Thank you. Just quick follow-ups. Uh I
» Thank you. Just quick follow-ups. Uh I
do think links and go are key. Lynx runs
right down the center spine of town. It
could I think relieve some pressure at
some times. Go train runs, you know,
Young Street, Berry Street along Holland
Street as well. It it actually
duplicates more than it should with
links. Perhaps we could hire that out.
We're going to run an open fair RFP
process. The manager of procurement's
nodding at me. We're going to follow
every procurement rules. That being
said, I just want to say to the Argo
folks, we've been your guinea pig for
the past number of months. You're a tech
company. I like to think of us as
something as a founder. It would not be
good if you didn't win our business back
for your own expansion. So, I just keep
hope you keep that in mind when you're
tailoring your response to the RFP that
a a founders's deal would go over very
nicely.
And just a comment on on the uh
integrating better with links. Uh the
county is going through a transit plan
right now and we're there's a survey out
there. So we should all we should all
buy into that survey. Okay. So right now
I have uh councelor Harour next and then
councelor dyiky and then I'm going to go
dep council
and then councelor shared tahaney.
Sorry.
Thank you, mayor.
Deputy CEO, thank you very much for
presentation. Um, I'm speaking today not
really to dispute progress. Um, but I'd
like to question preparedness
on four points. Let's talk about some
highlights that a lot of people have
talked about here. The on demand transit
pilot has made some clear strides. It's
great. Coverage has expanded. clearly
illustrated that ridership has more than
doubled. Public feedback is cautiously
optimistic. I'll be positive on that.
We've gone from 174 daily trips to over
400.
That's commendable.
But on a dollar a ride,
we rode we put the the transit system to
a dollar because we had low ridership
before, but we have the wrership now. we
increase that. What does that look like?
A pilot is used for certain aspects like
that and to control and to also make
offset costs back to the public.
Progress without accountability is risk.
And before I'm prepared to endorse a
long-term service provider, you have not
provided proof. You provided hearsay
when you mentioned Argo has winterized
readiness but failed to provide that to
us here today. If you had that, why
didn't you provide it to us? I don't
like that. We live in Bradford, West
Wilbury, not Southern California, not
Vancouver. This David Suzuki plugged
with 2.8 million people. This is
Bradford, West Wilbury. We've approved a
system that's entirely vehicle-based,
door-todoor, weather sensitive. Yet,
across all three reports that you
presented and the presentation, you have
zero evidence of operational reliability
in winter conditions.
Why?
Why leave that out? Why rush for the
November? I understand the concepts you
pushed and why for April,
but what happens during snow squalls
here in Bradford that shuts down for
days. We had a really bad one. It was
like three days people couldn't move. I
had I had whole subdivisions
complaining because we couldn't even get
plows down there. What is that going to
do for transit?
Are the vehicles winterized and
equipped? said they are, but again,
there's no proof.
Will there be service delays, worse
shutdowns? We're already seeing some
delays here. And you're talking about
new features to roll out, which is
great. I use tech companies all the
time, and they say, "Yeah, Q4, we're
going to roll out new features, but
they're untested still, and they will
provide more necessary needs that like
we'll have other fixes for their fixes.
It's like updates, but we don't have
those data. We don't have that data of
what it looks like. It's great that
you're creating those fixes right now
for those technological delays and and
those new features that you want to roll
out, but during that pilot, we need
these this data to give us a more
informed like decision. Do I think that
we are going to be moving towards this
in the long term? Yes. But I think we
need to do it more um cautiously and
right from the beginning. That's a red
flag. You want to have a five-year deal
and then you're talking about provincial
funding. If we don't get it, you just
said it's on the taxpayers.
Well, I gave it a solution in regards to
cost per ride that could help offset
that. Um, but we're banking on this
provincial thing and then we have to go
to plan B. Again, that we don't know
what plan B is. We just know that
there's plan B. So, when I say
preparedness, I need that information.
you know, um do we raise taxes to fund
it? Uh do we scale back service? There's
a lot of options there. Third point was
peak hour wait times and accountability.
We've talked a lot about that. My my uh
colleagues have talked about it right
now. Again, you've got new features
coming out to try to, you know,
circumvent that. But we don't even have
full ridership that's only just been
opened up for less than a month. And
then we want to go to full RFP.
So, I'm not saying I don't support the
modern responsive transit. I think we
do. I think, you know, when this
initially came, I wasn't against the
system. I was against the business plan.
And I think that's still where we're at
because it's going to come down to that
RFP. That'll be a business plan. We have
been guinea pigs for the founder. But
let's do this right. We need to demand
new features that are untested and have
the measures, the data to provide us
that they're working. They're They're
solving those solutions
so far. They've been able to curb a lot
of um barriers that have been thrown at
them with with maneuvering their tech
and updating their code, which is great.
That transparency is something that I
know about just but the updates that
we've been get communicated back and
forth and talking with yourself. That's
great transparency to know that the tech
company can implement those at a pretty
rapid rate and that's great. But all
these other new features need to be the
be tested as well. And they might need
they might even create other new
features that we don't even see coming
yet. And I think that's probably going
to be the lifespan of of uh this type of
app service or this type of transit
service that we'll create those because
things change all the time. even whether
if we update the the coverage area, the
zoning, or the scheduling, or even more
buses.
So, what I'd like to see is that we have
that tech transparency data, proof of
winter readiness, financial contingency,
whether the PR providence rolls out on
it. If we wait and we we delay the RFP,
we'll have a word from the pro province.
We'll have our winter readiness in
regards to proof how it relies on our
and and we'll know about the
accountability of wait times and how
we've actually circumvented uh those
barriers and problems here in this town
and then we'll be able to actually give
a more profound choice of this on demand
service. I don't think it's not going to
go anywhere. I think it's something it's
going to be here to stay, but let's do
it right. Can't support it right now,
but I I'm very optimistic that we can
get there in the long term.
Okay, thank you. Uh, I'm on to councelor
Dyke.
>> Well, I must say it's, you know, I watch
» Well, I must say it's, you know, I watch
I watch the bus go many times past my
door every day and and I'm very
impressed that how we have increased the
ridership. A dollar a ride is very
affordable. I I really um I'm impressed
with the accessibility of people with uh
that have walkers and shoulders and
wheelchairs now they can afford to get
around this town which which means a lot
and I know there's a lot of bugs and
there has been a lot of bugs and there's
still still a few bugs out there and I
and I still have people on a daily basis
come in they're scared they're still
scared of the app they're scared of the
information going through the app there
many many things I don't even want to
discuss this you know, between uh I'll
send it forward to you. But I have I
have a few people seniors that they tell
me they don't have a phone and then they
find it very still awkward yet. So
that's only maybe 1% that don't have the
phones, but there's little things that
we need to continue to work out. I'd
like to see this pile pilot project go a
little longer and uh especially winter
time to see the snow, the coldness, how
these batteries are going to operate.
But you know, I know when it comes to
it, I have confidence in the in and the
partners that can make this software
work and uh they have the experience by
just by talking to them uh the day they
give us a ride. They come from a
background that they know how to do
these programs that that could help us
in municipality. Long term u the finance
business plan is going to be quite
challenging. Um I hope that we get
funding from the provincial government
uh and uh means of help find this
because at the end of the day I don't
know if with the plan I see I don't know
if we can afford the taxpayers to afford
the high demand of of this program it's
very successful for users but what's the
overall cost dollars for dollars so so
I'd like to see more of the business
plan and I hope that the problems come
through but uh but you know mahash
yourself your team everyone behind
trying to work very hard to deliver this
and I give I commend everybody for
bringing something new to Bradford but I
feel that we need to spend more time
with this before we jump into it but
it's rolling out I think we're maybe 70%
there but we got to keep on going so
>> okay thank you for that uh next up I
» okay thank you for that uh next up I
have uh councelor or deput
thank you worship Mr. Rando, thank you.
Perine, thank you to your team and our
staff.
You know, it's encouraging to see that
the wrership more than doubled in in
such short time. Um, as you said, 9,00
trips, less than 1% complaints, but
still 57 complaints is too many.
Um,
I'm one of those people that always look
at the glass half full rather than
empty.
I would be concerned if the complaints
weren't handled or there was no plan to
address those complaints. And it looks
like you're addressing them. So that's
good.
I also like the
plan that we're planning now so we're in
place come next year that we're ready to
go. Doesn't mean that the current um
partner will be there. It could be
someone else like you said. at least
we're ready. Um, but I also understand
the questions from my colleagues about
winter and and those answers uh need to
be um given to us and and the public.
There's lots of um people that that
really like this. Um I know a comment
was made about subsiding someone's
vehicle um business. as long as they're
taking the ride and and paying what we
have set up in the system, they're just
using the service that we provide.
Um, so I don't have a problem with that.
That's why we have this. Um, I met many
PSWs that were paying lots of monies to
go from their home to Loft or to
Bradford Valley or somewhere else that
are saving money and they're not making
too much money. Trust me, I have many
family members that are in that uh
field.
Um so this is a good thing. The
questions I have is um in your in your
report you mentioned six items that that
or six points that would be used for
RFP.
I think three addresses my question but
I want to hear it in detail. Um if
they can't make the time guarantees
um what is the penalty or what is the
um of our safeguard that we have in
place that we would be compensated for
that or or corrected if you can talk to
that. Also your projections chart show
us going from 3.3 passengers per capita
to six uh is it 6.4 or five uh by 2031.
That's that's uh wrership increases.
What does that equate into gas tax
funding that we would get an increase
annually? Because we used to only get
based on what we had, we doubled in
short time. That means the funding that
we're going to get apart from what
you're working on on the expansion, it's
going to go increased. Do we have that
idea or any number? Thank you.
I'll start with the community benefits
um the gas tax. My projection and this
is my projection based upon how I
believe
the calculation happens. I'm not privy
to the actual formula is that we should
see a 50% increase in that revenue. Um
that was done based upon what other
communities our size
who have wrership that's close to what
we're projecting or slightly above and
try to come up with a an a formula.
So about a 50% increase. Your second
question in terms of what happens if
the proponent does not meet those
guarantees.
I don't believe we can put a penalty per
se in the and Vanessa if I misspe please
um in the RFP what we could do is your
payments we could set up a system where
the payments to the the proponent
is actually lower. So if you can't meet
the service level that you committed to
you get paid at a different rate for a
lower service level we can put that into
the RFP and we can set that up. That is
something that we have not settled on
the formula for that but it's it's
definitely the way that we we believe
that we need to go to.
» So penalties in a commercial contract
are actually not enforceable at law. So
we can't call it a penalty. We do have
to come up with something that's
reasonable um that the town would pay
out if those service levels aren't met.
So we have to develop that in the back
end before we even go to market.
Okay. Okay. Great questions. Uh on to uh
councelor Farji next.
Thank you. Um I'm just going to go
through the comments that I made while I
was writing the report. I added a few
while you were having the presentation
um because I might regurgitate some of
the stuff that said, but I didn't do too
too much. Um, so basically this report
wants us to endorse the staff plan to
procure a long-term service provider for
its ondemand transit services, but from
what I've seen, it's been mentioned at
the table. Some say it's been amazing. I
I know it has been amazing for some
people, but there are still so many bugs
and questions at this point. Um, and the
pro the project's still evolving. Like
tonight alone, you said in two weeks
you're going to have a better route
showing up on the app and in September
you're going to have uh to the go
station there's going to be a roll out.
Um the the pre-booking stuff like I mean
this stuff should be all part of the
pilot. We should be rolling with this
already. Uh the issues that we're having
with people getting online to the app,
it's been the last month they're finally
able to get it everybody. So there's
been uh multiple complaints on social
media slagging on the system which I
don't think is fair because it wasn't at
a full capacity yet and it wasn't be
able to use by everybody. But at the
same time these are complaints that have
happened and the town hasn't had the
full service yet for people. So I don't
to Joe's point or sorry councelor
Gioano's point um I don't consider it a
full pilot at this point. Um in the
report it says that there are two ways
to reduce the weight times as well to
iterate uh the routting technology to
make it as efficient as possible and to
increase the number of available
vehicles. So why hasn't this already
been worked out into the pilot project?
Why hasn't this already been worked out
into a program that we can see how it
actually plays out? Staff submitted a
draft funding application to the
province. You've already mentioned that
a few times in your presentation and now
uh and had conversation conversations
with the Ministry of Transportation
staff on the funding possibilities. The
potential provincial funding envelope is
for 5 years. So we have the funding
potentially we can get the funding and
then it's ex then we are expected to
achieve financial self- sustaining
status after year five because that
funding is gone through in the report
you have it as self-sufficient to become
self-sufficient through increases in
ridership fair revenues gas tax revenues
assessment growth and small taxation
increases I don't know how small it's
going to be when you're shooting for 17
buses
Not sure on those numbers. I saw the the
main numbers that you threw up there,
but I just
it there's still a lot of questions to
that in my mind. Uh and then in tonight,
you even mentioned there would be
increases to fairs to those that can
afford it. So, I don't know if you want
to clarify on that after uh I finished
asking my questions because who can
afford it? Like where where do you draw
the line? Where do you separate people
to who can and cannot afford it? How
would that work? Um, and then the RFP
that you had written out, it'll have
pricing uh based on batches of 25,000
annual rides. So yet apparently we had
almost 10,000 in July, which has been
mentioned, and we're presuming to reach
420,000 rides in 2031. So why would
there be such a low expectation for the
RFP in pricing? That was a question that
came up while I was reading it. And it's
obviously that it will not be enough
amount. This will obviously not be
enough for the amount of rides the town
is expecting and will cause more issues
or have the provider request more
compensation, provide more transit. So
basically I was saying that here we are
going for a lower ride annual ride
pricing on the RFP which we're not
expecting that at all. We're expecting
much more. So it's going to be really
interesting to see what kind of numbers
would come up. uh in regards to you had
mentioned a few times about potentially
somebody else taking over uh as opposed
to Argo.
Who else does this right now? What other
options are there? How many other
companies do this? Because as far as I
know, this was one of the first Argo was
one of the first for communities for
municipalities. We were one of the
guinea pigs, one of the first guinea
pigs to try it out. So, this RFP, is
this being written for Argo or are there
other options out there? I'm curious
about that as well.
Uh through you, Mayor Lidduk to
councelor Farerini.
Start with your last question.
when we were putting this together
um there are there were other vendors
who claimed that they could replicate
the service they could replicate what
Argo is doing um
but they were unable to bring the
fullness of the picture to the table we
believe that they've evolved since then
um two definitely come to mind that I
prefer not to name here um they've
evolved since in and I believe that when
we go to market we are likely to I'm
confident that we're likely to get
multiple proponents.
What
I will be guarded and and Vanessa miss
morum will definitely ensure that I'm
guarded on this one is not to set an RFP
where there's really only one proponent
that can meet it. Um, so it has to be
performance-based aso as opposed to very
specific criteria such as electric buses
or you must have an app that does A, B,
C, and D. No, it has to be this is what
we want you to achieve. You have to
demonstrate how you'll achieve that to
us. Um, so it has to be a
performance-based RFP and that's where
we're going on this particular one.
Mentioned 25 batches of 25,000.
The RFP will not be for 25,000 rides but
will be for multiple batches of 25,000
depending or a combination thereof
depending on the ridership total that
we're targeting. So for example, if in
year one we're targeting 150,000 rides
per year, then we're paying you for
batches of six times 100 six times
25,000 rights. So that's what it'll be.
and that will iterate every year go up
accordingly and that's the idea again it
will be to the propon the proponent to
tell us how they will achieve that
within the service parameters that we
will set um so that's where we're going
on this
you spoke about the algorithm um and the
resources
one of the things that I will commend
Argo and being the current vendor
iteration on algor Algorithm iteration
on ideas to improve the system
is literally in real time.
P or trial uh an update today, it works,
great. It needs tweaking, it it's
tweaked tonight.
Trial something today, it doesn't work,
go back to square one tonight. It's that
quick with them. Um, and those have over
the the the four months, and keep in
mind that we're at four months. We're at
four months and two days into this,
that is how we've been able to drive the
efficiency to be able to open the app
with the resourcing that we've got. Um,
and achieve 427. Now, we've been doing
400 plus writes consistently
since the app went open. Um, and I've
been seeing the the weight times, the
P95 weight time, the maximum weight time
during the the peak demand periods
actually come down slightly. And that
shows that each individual tweak of the
algorithm is paying dividends. Does all
of it work? No. But it's trying the
ideas to see what will work to drive
efficiency and that and that's a
consistent process.
How do we get down the weight times to
something s the peak time wait hour wait
times um
to something quite low that's resourcing
and that is something that will require
additional buses
um as the demand grows as I said many
times in the presentation
we need help for that one and that's
where we're at with the province um I am
hopeful as I said staff at the province
have been working with us which is we've
applied for many many many
funding programs. This is the one the
only one in my memory where staff have
work are working with us. So I would
like to think that they see something
there.
Are we there? No, we're not. Do I expect
to be there tomorrow? No, I don't. But
we're working through it. I hope I
didn't miss anything.
But I would like to reiterate what you
just said, too. It's only been four
months.
>> This hasn't been a one-year pilot
» This hasn't been a one-year pilot
project which we all agreed to go
through. So to jump on a five-year now
to go to procurement to get this
happening within the next couple of
months to me just not comfortable doing
that yet.
» Okay. I've got uh councelor Dehaney
next. Myself and then councelor
Thank you mayor. Thank you um deputy co
for your presentation. I believe the
writership has exceeded our expectation
and of course as you mentioned over and
over and over the challenges and of
course with anything at all in life
we're going to have challenges right but
when come when we do have challenges we
find ways to navigate those challenges
and with the increase of ridership
definitely we're going to definitely
need more buses right on the street. We
started with a million dollar um a
million dollar um budget right which was
the same as the older system but now the
wrership has increased it is more the
demand is greater now right so of course
it's it's it's only common it's only
common sense that we're definitely going
to need more buses on the street so at
this point coming with a re um for for
evaluation
right and how do we continue this pilot
program is very timely. I am definitely
going to support this and I want to
encourage the residents, the writers to
continue coming with your with with with
the with your comments, your ideas, your
suggestions and the challenges that
you're facing so that you know we can
improve on this system right because I'm
telling you the wrership comparing to
the older service that we had before it
is greater. So what we're experiencing
right now is normal. It is going to be
normal because the wrership is greater.
Are we going to sit in it or are we
going to go to the drawing board and
we're going to maybe get another bus on
the street? We definitely going to need
another bus. I don't know how we're
going to do this mahish until April
because of course with the buses that
we're having right now, we're definitely
going to have more issues. We're going
to have more problems if we don't get
another bus on it. Right. It has
exceeded our expectation. People are
loving the service and for the people
definitely I'm advocating for the people
because I've been hearing people they
love the service. However, the glitches
and again the glitches is because the
ridership has exceeded the expectation.
We did not expect that the ridership was
going to be this great which is very
good. Right. But I have one ask for you
um deputy CEO. So I have residents
reaching out that goes to Henderson Park
and I believe the bus only stops at the
Elden.
I know right now there's no route around
that area, but if the bus could even do
one maybe one stop over the light
because there's no stop light. There's
no sidewalks I should say. Sorry. So if
the bus could maybe just go over that
one light, right? same route, but just
bring the the children, the youth, the
vulnerables, right, over that light cuz
there's no sidewalk, right? During this
pilot program, the residents will be
very happy.
So, if that's something that we can look
into during this pilot program, we're
not changing route. We're on the same
route because I'm sure the bus has to
maybe go over the light to make a
U-turn, right, to continue its journey.
So if we can maybe look at one stop over
the light just to take them over the
light and we're talking about the people
the vulnerables the youth right people
that depends on this service but I'm
very much in support of the report and
of course if the wrership is going to
increase we definitely know that the
budget has to be visited it does not
take a brainer to know that right so the
wrership has exceeded our expectation
and now it's time to act because now
Argo is doing better than what the other
service was doing. The other service was
doing great. It did its time. Now we see
that there's more people that are
depending on the public transit. Are we
going backwards or are we going forward?
Well, I believe we want to go forward
and I believe the community want to go
forward. So, if Argo can fix some of
those glitches and again it's four
months in, we need to hear the problems
so that we can fix them, right? so that
we can improve the service to better
serve our BWG
residents. Thank you again. Um, deputy
CEO,
» you want to respond to it all or
» I've heard from councelor Jordano on
Henderson. I've heard from councelor
Dhanei. Um, I'll say to both of you,
leave it with me to discuss it with
Argo, to discuss it internally with our
transit folks to see what solution we
can come up with, shape or form, and
I'll get back to both of you.
Okay. Thank you. I I'm going to comment
now if you don't mind, and I I um
appreciate everybody's comments, and I I
really want to say thank you to the
residents that are actually sending in
comments and suggestions to us. I think
that's I think that helps us because you
know what it is a pilot program and it
is something that if they weren't ch
making changes all the time. I mean I'd
be afraid then technology and AI is
advancing so fast that this is this is
helping them and and I think the biggest
one you made uh deput was the fact that
they're doing it in real time and we're
we're we're bettering the service we're
increasing the service and I and I the
ridership has increased and that is
absolutely a supply and demand issue
right there. I mean, there's no
offensive bus. We had three buses
before. We're up to four. I mean, we
know we're going to need more. It's
about setting this program up. I think
this is I think this is an absolute gem
for us. Uh a dollar a ride. I would love
to see us uh have hit those targets
where you have 420,000 rides a year. I
would love to see those targets hit for
sure. I think this is uh uh something
that I'm going to absolutely 100%
support because I think it is a benefit
to our residents. It's it's a real
affordability issue. It's a real quality
of life issue for them and we will get
this right with their feedback. We will
get this right. Come to us directly.
Don't use Facebook as your platform for
telling us what we're doing wrong. Come
to us directly. Please come to every
counselor directly. Come to their
accounts. Ask them to get this to the
people that are that are making the
changes. We'll do better. We'll
absolutely do better because they are
doing better every day. I'll tell you, I
we we start off some issues, but we have
cleaned up a lot of those issues and
this program is moving a lot faster than
thought. And I am absolutely 100% not
afraid of those buses being out there in
the winter. Tesla's been around for a
long time. Electric batteries. We've had
electric cars on the road for a long
time. It's got nothing to do with the
batteries failing in the winter. It's
the driving ability of everybody in the
winter. 50% of the drivers in Ontario
for grant in the winter can't drive.
It's ridiculous. But these buses are
built. They've passed quality asurances
to get into Canada to be sold in Canada.
So, I'm I'm absolutely 100% uh in favor
of them or supportive of them being a
bus that can drive in the winter. I have
no issue with that. If it's a blizzard
or a snowstorm, you're getting off the
road anyways. Most of most of the things
are getting off the road anyways. So, I
mean, we're not This is a system that I
think will work. Uh the buses are
manufactured in Turkey. The system
worked because we had the bus
manufacturer and the tech people get
together and drive this program. That's
where we got this program from. And I'm
100% support. I've seen I've seen it
advance. So, I'm going to support this.
We need to go out and get a 5-year
contract. I think we can do that. There
is there is other alternative suppliers
out there. You're seeing it uh go
forward. We're seeing this this pick up
across the province. You you've seen
other communities pick up on what we're
doing. We have uh BMPon and a few other
communities that are actually advancing
this. I' I've got calls from many mayors
throughout Ontario asking me, "How'd you
do this?" We've got other providers
coming in saying, "Hey, can you help us
out?" So, I I'm in support of this. I
think it's a great program and I and I
commend everybody for giving us those
comments because that's what makes us
better. We know this is a pilot. We know
there was going to be issues, but I'll
tell you what, 57 complaints is not a
huge number, but it's perfect to help us
make this system better. And and I want
to hear I want to hear that feedback. I
want to see that feedback because we can
do better. They are doing better. And I
I commend your team, Mesh, all of our
our staff, the uh Argo staff, wonderful
working together. They're very
responsive. So, we can do this and I'm
I'm looking forward to this service
becoming a full-time service and I I
will support the report. So, I uh I'll
turn it back to I got councelor Jano
next. Anybody else?
Yeah, I can't remember now, but I'd like
to put a motion on to uh extend the
pilot before we make a decision. I'm not
sure if that's been tabled yet. Um also,
a few more points. Um I think I I heard
from the deput all the more reason to
wait. Um you're saying that more and
more uh other competitors or other
companies are catching up. So why are we
rushing to go to market with maybe in
the next 6 months to a year there could
be all kinds of options and different
pricing and everything else. You never
necessarily want to go first to market
with anyone because you're not getting
as competitiveness when it looks at the
landscape of opportunities. So just as
you were saying every single day things
are changing and advancing. That's more
of a reason to wait and and extend our
pilot. um as a business person and I'm
not uh speaking as um you know uh you
know someone out of emotion it's it's
based on strategic right so when you
look at your business plan you you don't
turn around and say well I'm going to
pigeon hole myself into a potential
option knowing that in six months to a
year there could be a way you know
larger landscape of opportunity um so
the other thing too is we keep saying we
need other buses and everything else
yeah like I think this service is
fantastic what's the cost what's the
cost of those increased buses who's
paying for those costs
Right. To councelor Harper's point, why
a dollar? Just because we want to make
it affordable for everybody. Okay. Well,
and then you mentioned about having, you
know, those who could affordable will
pay more. Well, isn't that a human
rights tribunal nightmare right there
all of a sudden saying, "Well, you're
going to pay more because you can afford
it, but no, you you don't deserve to pay
as much as somebody else." Like, I I
don't understand how that even comes
into play. So, like again, these are all
things that I'm hearing for the first
time now, and I want more clarification
on some of this information. Um, and I
believe there was also some complaints
about accessibility issues that these
these buses did meet certain criteria,
but we've been modifying the buses in
order to accommodate that. Is that real
or is that true? Uh, maybe you can just
address that. And then lastly, uh, the
mayor brought this up and it was
something I didn't want to bring up
today, but I'm going to say it now. Um,
I I would be much more comfortable if
this these were Canadian manufacturer
vehicles and not from Turkey or
somewhere else overseas. We are in a
massive manufacturing war globally. We
have the companies and the ability
locally to build this and we're going
across the world to get these things. I
I you know, at the end of the day,
they're just down the street. They're
just up the street. We can we can get
access to Canadian manufacturing.
>> Okay. Thank you. I've got Council Kite
» Okay. Thank you. I've got Council Kite
next. And then actually, I don't have
recommendation on the floor yet, do I?
I've been debating that. So, okay. So,
you you you said you wanted to put a
recommendation on the floor.
So madam
» okay speak
so I guess my question is
uh we're all kind of yeah most some of
us are worried about winter operation
I'm not but uh that is the biggest
concern I'm hearing here and also that
the pilot hasn't really fully
been
gone through the stages yet. So
I see in the on page 12 of your report
or presentation the request for
proposals
to award the contract in November of
2025
and but getting the getting the RFP done
in October. So what I'm trying to say is
we do need the pricing before budget
time.
So could we do all that but then can we
find out if Argo can give us a two
threemonth extension
so that we don't award the contract
until
February
and then the contract begins in say May
and then we can get the process going
for the RFP and get the pricing.
But I don't know you can I don't think
you can answer the question whether Argo
was willing to give us a two or three
month extension on the U
pilot program
» uh through you mayor Loop to councel
Vike um the extension.
Would you like to ask the question?
>> Sorry
» Sorry
for I didn't hear you. Did you say that
they will give us an extension?
I didn't get there yet.
Um, in terms of the extension, it's
something I'm I'm sure that we can
raise, not I'm sure, I know we can raise
with them and have that conversation.
What I will suggest is that any
extension will need to give us enough
time from the award to the start, I
would recommend six months. Um, simply
in the event that it's a different
vendor who would need to replicate the
systems that they've put in place. Um,
so you'll need that six months um, in
terms of that. So whatever extension
we're looking at, work backwards plus my
RFP time, you're looking at about nine,
eight to nine months, right?
>> So my follow-up question is, we don't
» So my follow-up question is, we don't
approve this tonight and ask for it to
be deferred to or I guess our next
meeting is in September. How does that
affect
the timing? Will we still be able
September to make a decision?
Um, Argo is here. We can put them put
them on the spot. Um,
No, it's if we're if we're looking at an
extension if we're looking at an
extension, is that to
prove that the buses can work in the
winter? Is that what we're looking for?
>> No. No. Uh, some are. I'm not. But the
» No. No. Uh, some are. I'm not. But the
other request for an extension was to
more fully test the pilot to get more
confidence in in what's happening.
But my question right now is if we we
can't get those answers tonight, then
can we delay the decision to September
and still move forward properly?
through you, Mayor Luk, to move forward
and give any potential
other vendor a fair shot at mobilizing.
We'll need to move the end of pilot
completion date. Otherwise, what we will
end up stacking is in favor of Argo,
I'll be honest. Um, and from a
procurement perspective, that's not
advisable.
So, the first thing would be ask Argo,
can we get an extension? How many months
we're looking for? Um, based upon what
I've heard around the table, you're
probably looking, as you're right, at
least a three-month extension, probably
a little longer, and what would be the
terms of that. Um, so that's the first
part. Um, and then work it backwards and
see what is it we can provide to that.
So, that's something I can definitely
raise. I will not suggest that based
upon the full sum of the conversation
that we're back in September. It's
probably back later than that, right?
So then we can Have you got time? So my
concern is if you if we drive this
extension and we don't change the buses,
you're just going to build the
complaints. So if we're driving
extension, it means we're driving more
cost. They've got to bring more buses
in. I mean, you can't you can't work
with the four buses. The ridership is
going up. That's what's driving your
complaints, that peak demand. We can't
manage the system on four buses. The
idea is we need to get our bus services
up. So, I'm I'm concerned if we drive an
extension now. So, that's a question.
So, can we defer this? Is this something
that we can defer and move to answer
those questions through that extension?
Um, I would put one more risk out there,
Mr. Mayor. What happens if Argo says no?
then we are in a situation where it's
very tight. We'll h handicap the next
proponent
um in terms of their mobilization and
that's the challenge. Um
in terms of we've all agreed that on
demand transit shows that it has the
benefit of what we thought it would.
Couple of things. One is
there's nothing that's guaranteeing that
it will be hard. There's nothing that's
guaranteeing that it will be these
electric buses. It could be something
different, right? And that's where we
need the conversation needs to be. The
way that the manager of procurement and
I have been talking about the RFP, it
has to be performance-based.
We're not specking you need x number of
buses and no it's for them to figure
that out. Whoever can be efficient on
if we've got a concern that the buses
must be able to to work in x centimeters
of snow. That's a performance criteria.
We put that into the RFP.
That's what that's the that's the
solution I would recommend. Um
we want council Jordano mentioned we
wanted uh the preferences for buses
manufactured here that can be in the or
finished here that can be in the RFP and
these buses are finished here. So
they've got manufactured content in
Canada. um all all all those issues can
be put as performance in the RFP and
that's where we're going with um all of
the concerns raised all of the the
challenges um that you've that you have
in your mind can be reflected in a
performance-based RFP today.
>> Okay, I've got councelor Dehaney next.
You're on mute again. And then I want to
put a recommendation on the floor. I got
to put the recommendation from the
report on the floor so we can
>> Sorry.
» Sorry.
>> We're muted.
» We're muted.
>> Okay. So, um, if we're going to extend
» Okay. So, um, if we're going to extend
the pilot program and if Argo say yes or
no, um, to what mayor mentioned, we
definitely going to need another bus on
the on the road for sure. But again, it
all depends on Argo. So, Mahes, is Argo
there in the house tonight?
I believe you said that they're here.
Can they come forward and maybe answer
to some of the questions like will they
be okay to the pilot program or would
they need more time to think about it?
And if they do agree, say tonight, and
said yes, we can consider the pilot
program being extended, will they be
open to, and again,
>> point of order? I don't think that's
» point of order? I don't think that's
appropriate. I don't think we should be
asking to do business negotiations at a
council table during a council meeting.
>> Excuse me.
» Excuse me.
>> It's it's un excuse. It's a point it's a
» It's it's un excuse. It's a point it's a
point of order. For
>> a second, please interrupt me. Thank
» a second, please interrupt me. Thank
you.
>> Councelor Dehaney and councelor
» Councelor Dehaney and councelor
Gerardano. I'm the chair. I will I will
take over this. Yes, you can't you can't
negotiate something at the table right
now.
>> One second. I am not one second, mayor.
» One second. I am not one second, mayor.
Please and thank you. I'm asking a
question and I would appreciate if
persons would listen keenly before
allowing their
>> Please ask the question.
» Please ask the question.
>> I did ask my question, mayor. Can you
» I did ask my question, mayor. Can you
allow me to speak? I was elected just
like everyone else to represent the
people of Bradford. Whether you like me
or not, the people do. That's why I'm
here. And I have the fair choice and
right like everyone else to speak as
lengthy as I choose just as everyone
else. So let me go back to my question
before I was interrupted. Thank you. So
deputy CEO
you said that Argo was in the house.
If Argo is okay to come forward, if they
maybe need more time to answer the
questions that we're asking, will they
be open to let us know? Okay. Will they
be able to provide an extra bus or will
they be open to the exp extension of the
pilot program, please? That's my
question before I was rudely
interrupted. Thank you. I
>> have uh our manager procurement come up
» have uh our manager procurement come up
and speak to this.
Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Thank you for your
question, councelor Dhaney. Um, at this
time, we are unable to ask Argo to come
forward to have any discussion with
respect to the contract. This is
confidential discussions that we would
be having offline and Mahesh and I will
take that on if that is council's desire
after this meeting.
Thank you so much, Vanessa, for
clarifying my question. Thank you. Thank
you, mayor.
>> Yes. Thank you. All right. I've got to
» Yes. Thank you. All right. I've got to
councelor Scott for the last comment
before we move on. Thanks for your
worship. I just want to go back.
I hear everyone's comments and the
report itself doesn't outline the RFP
timeline the way the slideshow
presentation does, but the initial
report that we endorsed when we made the
switch to on demand transit said there
would be a request for proposals in Q3
2025 to procure a multi-year service
provider to enable a shift to permanent
ondemand transit from April 1st, 2026.
So,
we're not being asked to do anything
tonight that we didn't contemplate doing
when we launched this pilot. The only
concern is whether we've had enough time
of the pilot rolling out to make an
informed decision,
which is a fair comment, but we're not
being asked to make a decision to award
the contract
until the end of this year. So, we have
another three or four months until we're
being asked to make a decision. All
we're being asked to do tonight is
launch the RFP process. So hopefully
that gives some people some assurance.
We we don't have a gun to our head, so
to speak, tonight. We're just being
asked to take the next stage of a
process that we control and would still
make a final decision on in keeping with
the timeline that was outlined when we
first launched the pilot.
>> We have Frank move that we approve the
» We have Frank move that we approve the
recommendation.
It hasn't been seconded. So,
>> uh,
» uh,
his motion was to What was your motion
again?
>> So, I need I need the clerk to rule
» So, I need I need the clerk to rule
here. Please rule first.
» We have not put the motion um from the
agenda, the recommendation of the report
onto the floor yet. So, we'll do that
first and then amendments can come from
there.
Also,
>> okay,
» okay,
>> hold on. Point of order,
» hold on. Point of order,
>> mayor, for clarification. You asked
» mayor, for clarification. You asked
councelor Jordano to let councelor
speak and then you would go back to his
recommendation. You have not done that.
I I wanted to clar clarify with the
clerk. The clerk has clarified how it
works. We put the motion on the floor.
If now I'll go back to councelor Jordano
if he wants to amend it. It's moved and
seconded. I'm going back to him for an
amendment if you'd like. So, councelor
Jordano, would you like to amend it?
I'd like to amend it to ask staff to ask
for a um six-month extension on the
pilot program.
Therefore, giving us some time I I
believe it would be would that be
December instead of September for us to
start the RFQ process. But I want to do
it in one year from the day that we
actually open it up to the actual town.
So, what date was that? Can you remind
me?
through you to um council Jano opening
the app.
>> I believe it was July
» I believe it was July
7th or
so, you know, I would like to be going
to RFQ probably sometime in the
springtime, make a decision one year
after the pilot has actually been
available to the community. So you guys
are going to have to work the math back
on when what what what that extension
looks like. But that's something that
I'd like to defer this until we get
answers back about the extension of
this. Um well, you can ask for it and
then all of a sudden it doesn't come
back. We have to unmothball our uh
>> are you putting an amendment or
» are you putting an amendment or
>> Okay, I'll put the amendment. I'll put
» Okay, I'll put the amendment. I'll put
the amendment. So we're gonna we're
gonna ask for extension. So then
therefore the procurement takes place
one year from the date that it was
available to the public.
Okay. Seconded. So it's amendment that
it is procurement is one year from July
7th. That was the date, right?
>> Hey,
» Hey,
>> I know it's a totally different
» I know it's a totally different
resolution, but
>> let's just get it on the floor and get
» let's just get it on the floor and get
it over with and we can move on to the
resol recommendation. So we have a mover
and a seconder. Further comments on
that?
Okay, seeing none, do you want to vote
on that amendment? All in for the All in
support of the amendment.
One, two, three, four. Okay. Opposed.
>> Mayor, I don't know what I am agreeing
» Mayor, I don't know what I am agreeing
to.
>> He put an amendment. He put a a a new
» He put an amendment. He put a a a new
motion on the floor to make an extension
and the to do the uh RFQ or the RFP 12
months later. So, if you're in support
of this recommendation,
the one on the table, he's amending it.
the one on the on the report he's
amended.
>> It's kind of difficult to since what
» It's kind of difficult to since what
what Vanessa mentioned just now that we
cannot do anything or say anything. Argo
cannot speak on anything. So I find it
very weird for me to I don't even know
what to agree on.
>> Okay. So
» Okay. So
>> I'm out of it.
» I'm out of it.
>> You're abstaining from the vote. Thank
» You're abstaining from the vote. Thank
you.
>> I don't know what this is.
» I don't know what this is.
>> Thank you. So that's defeated.
So the motion on the floor is and I'll
read it and it was moved by reccomation
of staff report DCAO 2025-8 titled
update on Bradford Glenbury demand
transit be received for information and
the council endorse the staff plan to
procure a long-term service provider for
its ondemand transit service moved by
and it was moved by council kite
seconded by deputy mayor that's on the
floor now all right
>> mayor I got a point of order
» mayor I got a point of order
>> point of order
» point of order
>> I'd like to recommend the deferral which
» I'd like to recommend the deferral which
superseds es the recommendation.
Okay. You have a deferral. Does it
supersede the recommendation? He's
asking for a deferral. Okay.
>> No, seriously. A deferral pushes it off
» No, seriously. A deferral pushes it off
indefinitely. A referral sends it back
to staff seeking more information to
come back at a specific time.
» Okay. So, what are we putting on the
floor? A deferral or referral?
>> Referral doesn't have the same
» Referral doesn't have the same
superseding as the deferral.
>> No, it's debatable.
» No, it's debatable.
>> It's debatable.
» It's debatable.
That's okay. You can put referral on.
Have you got
>> I'm okay with referral, too. But like as
» I'm okay with referral, too. But like as
long as we get the answers quickly
because I liked what councelor Vai was
talking about getting the decisions. If
we know that, then it basically it only
will jump the timelines only shortly
because I know the connections that the
deputy CEO has with Argo
>> will get us the answers we need. And I'm
» will get us the answers we need. And I'm
okay with that. And if we have that, you
know what? It's not like in saying I
just really would want the winter stuff,
but like we know we're probably going to
be going towards this, but we just want
to make sure that we do it right.
Referral would make that happen.
>> We have a referral. Do we have a
» We have a referral. Do we have a
seconder for that? Right there. Okay.
Now, we can debate that. We're good.
Councelor Scott,
>> I will support a referral if we specify
» I will support a referral if we specify
in the motion that it comes back
in September with the questions asked
tonight
contemplate or responded to in that
report. So, a referral motion, you can
specify the time you want it to come
back and the conditions under which you
want it to come back and hopefully the
mover and secondary agree with that
timing and that condition.
Mayor, I agree to those conditions.
Obviously, September is a good timeline.
I think u you know, Council K said that
well. September will give us those
answers and I think we'll have to make a
hard choice, but I believe it may be
give the opportunity to get that proof
that we were looking for as well. He
said he had it, so maybe I'll give time
to give us that as well and satisfy the
need of that information.
>> Okay, the referral has come back in
» Okay, the referral has come back in
September with some answers to those
questions. Deputy CEO, you go ahead
comment. A quick clarity
question is around winter operation.
» I'm going to go to the deputy uh mayor
and then to councelor Trano and that's
it. Vote. This doesn't seem like it's
clear enough. I hear questions around
winter maintenance. Then I hear
everything we've been discussing for
last hour and a half. what is that
everything that that's that's not clear
and if we don't provide clear direction
they can't give us the accurate
information. So let's be clear what
we're asking then if they can do it by
next September they can let us know
staff can let us know otherwise we're
just going in circles.
Okay Jordano
yeah that's what I was going to say. So
I it's not winter is only one of the ma
major things that we discussed today. So
um to your point deputy mayor I think
some of the other takeaways was number
one how can you maximize your
procurement with vendors that are just
um updating their systems now and
everything else. So obviously we wanted
to extend the timeline as much as
possible to give those other
opportunities to come on board. Number
two there was the ability of um the
guarantee that we were saying. So, how
does that
Yeah, funding is another one. And then
apparently we we have to put another bus
on the road or multiple buses. I want to
know what the cost is. And then there's
another discussion about a dollar a ride
versus $3 a ride versus whatever it is.
Well, what does that look like? Well, we
don't have any pricing modeling on what
does this look like on for us to roll
this this transit system out. Yeah,
there's talks about people want to give
away the transit for free. Well, what
does that cost taxpayers? I don't have
any of that information. And you guys
want to go into procurement and secure
something for the next 5 years based on
what? Like I I need to see financial
modeling too. Like we can't just make
these decisions and say yeah let's go to
go to market. Don't forget we still have
our buses on mothballs right now. So you
know we always have an option B or C in
the works and maybe we should have an
option B or C that comes to the table.
We don't have an if and what sit uh
solution right now and I get it but you
know maybe we should have a bit of a
wargaming situation where it comes to
like okay this is one option for on
demand or if we don't do a full on
demand system we have a a subsidized on
demand system or we have a we just have
one and done that's it. So those are
some of the things that were being
discussed today. Um, there's also a few
other things that I don't think we got
full answers on, like for example, are
these buses fully accessible, right? Or
have they meet all the accessibility
criteria that's required for a transit
system like they have in Toronto and
some of those other ones? Um, I've heard
some yes or we've made modifications in
the short term. Like I don't I didn't
get answers on that yet. So, that's
another answer that I would like to
have. And then the last one, um, hold
on. I'm just trying to scroll through
all these notes here. Oh yeah, the
Canadian manufacturing ability. Right.
When you say finished, I could slap a
sticker on, screw in a little uh digital
box and say it's assembled in Canada. I
want to know how much percentage of the
vehicle is manufactured in Canada in the
procurement process as well for
consideration.
Okay. Anybody else want anything else
about this in referral? Did we miss
anything?
Okay. So, it's a a referral.
Yeah.
Mr. Mayor, based upon those points
raised, if all of those are to be
addressed,
um that we will not be able to make
September. I'll tell you that.
>> No, I was pretty sure you weren't.
» No, I was pretty sure you weren't.
That's why I didn't I didn't think I had
to explain it. Okay, the referral's on
the table. So, all in favor of the
referral back to staff, all in favor of
the referral back to staff.
>> It Well, it's September. We we have
» It Well, it's September. We we have
September with all those September with
all those requests. That was what they
wanted. We're not waiting September with
all those issues. In favor of the
referral,
>> I vote yes or no.
» Okay. Two in favor. Those opposed
carried. Okay. Back to the
recommendation on the floor. We have a
mover to second. All in favor of the
recommendation.
One, two, three. Where are we? Four,
five.
Opposed.
1 2 3 4 carried. Thank you.
Okay, council. Uh, it's 10 after 10.
We're not going to get through this
agenda tonight, I don't think. If you
guys want to go past midnight,
>> can you can you jump to the bonhead one
» can you can you jump to the bonhead one
just because of the people the residents
who are here for that one?
>> That's at number four.
» That's at number four.
>> We can get there in a second if you
» We can get there in a second if you
want. I don't think this servicing
agreement is a big issue.
I was just going to say if you wanted a
break, bathroom break,
» so I'll go. We didn't readjust the
schedule. So,
>> okay. 93. Let's do 93. Request for
» okay. 93. Let's do 93. Request for
pre-ervice agreement. I've got a
recommendation that report NG2025-10
titled request for pre-ervice agreement
low parcel external sanitary sanitary be
received foration and the necessary by
representative council to authorize the
mayor and clerk to enter into a
pres-erviceing agreement mover and a
second or puts on the floor please moved
by deputy mayor seconded by councelor
Perageni questions and concerns with
this one it's a good one it's in our uh
southern quadrant it's hoping that we
get some servicing done then get the
rest of that uh uh servicing up through
our employment lands
Okay, no questions or concerns. All in
favor carried. Thank you. Okay. 9.4.
That's the uh Bonnet Heritage.
We will do that and then we'll take a
break after if that's okay with
everyone. Okay. Bonnet Heritage
Conservation District recommendation PLN
2025-37. I have a recommendation that
PLN 202537
be received and that accordance with
section 40 41 of the Ontario Heritage
Act, council designate by bylaw the area
shown in attachment 71 appended to
report PLN 2025-37
as the Bonhead heritage conservation
district and the council adopt the uh by
bylaw the Bonhead heritage conservation
district plan as as the district plan
for Bonhead heritage conservation
district in accordance with section 411
of the Ontario Heritage Act attached as
attachment 72 appended to report PLN
2025-37
and the council approve a heritage
permit process uh for parts four and
five designated uh properties in
Bradford Westbury with an effective date
of January 1st 2026
moved by councelor seconded by
councelor Scott. Question concerns
We got it. We okay with the secondary?
Okay. Question concerns with this. I'm
going to go to councelor Harper has his
hand up first and councelor Scott.
>> Thanks, mayor. I while I like the
» Thanks, mayor. I while I like the
proposal that marks a significant step
in uh formally recognizing protecting
the heritage fabric of Bond Head. Um,
I'd hope that the the HCD plan, if
passed, it comes with the right supports
in place for our residents. Um, being in
in an area that does have um some
heritage as well in W six, the downtown
core, I hope that it just balances a lot
of the goals of preservation with
homeowner rights, affordability, and
clarity of the implementation. My key
concerns are around the administrative
burden part of that or potential cost to
residents and then effect flexibility to
accommodate the evolving housing needs.
So
I don't know exactly what the plan sorry
I do know what the plan entails and but
I hope that it does have the right
supports in place for our residents.
That's my comments.
>> Thank you uh counc.
» Thank you uh counc.
Well, thank you to the consultant team,
town staff, especially uh Thomas Dystra
and the heritage advisory committee this
term, last term, and I think the term
before for their work on this
initiative. This is a long time coming.
It's the result of, I think, careful
planning, years of consultation, and a
lot of community engagement over those
years. It's going to preserve the
character and charm of the village of
Bond Head. Even as the village evolves,
it provides tools to guide change and to
ensure the story of this village
continues to be visible and valued. I
want to especially acknowledge the work
of the heritage committee under
councelor Bkite's chairmanship. I
believe we've done more this term than
practically ever before to protect
heritage buildings and recognize our
heritage. Uh to councelor Harper's
questions, there are some very
straightforward triaged processes in
this plan. there's the opportunity for
property tax abatement uh for designated
heritage properties and uh I think it
puts a very good package together to
preserve the the character of the
village and ultimately it's about more
than the buildings. It's about
storytelling across generations, our
identity and keeping a sense of place
even as we grow. So I'm I'm really happy
to see this hopefully coming to fruition
tonight.
>> Thank you. Further comments? Councelor
» Thank you. Further comments? Councelor
Ferdini next.
>> Thank you. Um, yeah, this started back
» Thank you. Um, yeah, this started back
in 2018, so it's been a long time coming
that we've had discussions with the
public and constantly going over
presentations through different
committees and such. So, it's great to
finally see this come to us in person.
Um,
Bond Head is a gem. Um, Miss Usher was
up here and she was talking about it. We
all we we know that there's such a um
such an untapped resource in that in
that hamlet and with the uh with the
heritage designation this this place
could be well sorry it is but I mean
uh be even more beautiful. Dr. Chambers
had already me always mentioned about
people coming to visit Bonhead always
talked about them coming to visit
Bonhead. And what this does is uh if we
keep that if we keep that feel and we
keep that aspect to what Bonhead
actually is, it's only just going to get
bigger and better.
>> Thank you. I've got Council Kite next.
» Thank you. I've got Council Kite next.
>> Yeah, I'd really like to thank all the
» Yeah, I'd really like to thank all the
work that the staff put in on this,
Thomas Daart, and uh everyone else and
even the previous planner that worked on
it. I can't quite
>> remember.
Yeah. So, um, yeah, it's been a it's
been a long time coming. I we we this
plan is on the light side, especially
for the supporting properties that
aren't historical. There's very little
that they have to do differently
except for that they can't just tear
their building down and put some art
deco, some thing that doesn't blend in
with the with the heritage district. And
it's also going to put some onus on new
development against those homes. They
can't go like five stories high. So,
it's going to offer a lot of protection
and not put a lot of onus on the
existing residents that are in the
district. So, it's it's I think it's a
win-win and uh yeah, I hope we approve
it tonight.
Further comments uh Deputy Mayor Sandu.
>> Thank you, Worship. Um I'm very happy to
» Thank you, Worship. Um I'm very happy to
support this. As others mentioned, this
has been long time coming. I remember it
was about 20 years ago, we were doing
fundraising for William Osler Hospital
in Bmpton. And some of the staff did not
even know where the home place was. And
when I told them um they said, "Oh,
we're going to take a drive up there and
see. This is a gym." You said it
rightfully. And Miss Usher, when you
mentioned the parade, I still remember
that. And I have those pictures here.
This is one of my best pictures, I
think, as a sheriff
when we dressed up uh as as time period
and and I still have pictures from that
parade and it was the best parade and
all the hard work that the committee did
and not to mention the the work about
this. Many residents contributed. Dr.
Chambers who's now with us, he was
spearheading it and some of our staff,
they they did an excellent job and I'm
very thankful and I'm hopeful that this
will get passed today and we get the
work beginning.
» Council, as everybody mentioned, a lot
of work, a lot of history, and and I'm
glad that this is going to come to
tuition and uh and uh there's a lot of
comp there's a lot of passion in the
community and and great history that you
know uh that's going to live on. You
know, we have new growth and but we have
to preserve what what what's already
there and uh and I think this is a good
a good plan. So, looking forward to the
vote.
Excellent. Further comments or
questions? Seeing none. All right. I'm
just com I'm going to comment. Linda,
thank you so much for coming up earlier
tonight. That was great to see. And the
chambers for being here today. Thank you
so much. It is a big moment. Uh this has
been gone ongoing since 2007 and we're
finally here. And uh you know, Mr.
Chambers, Dr. Chambers is not here with
us, but I think you'll be uh quite
excited tonight hopefully with the with
the vote going through because I think
it is a it is a positive step forward.
Uh you know, we'll hopefully see the
next uh let's say Unionville or
Kleinberg, something like that. I mean,
there is great potential and there's
some beautiful beautiful uh areas across
the province that has these, you know,
unique settings within their community.
So, uh look forward to seeing that
happen. Bonhead has a special place in
everybody's heart. So, uh, the history
there is fantastic. So, look forward to,
uh, having a positive vote here tonight.
All right. So, I'm actually going to
call the vote now. All in favor of the
of the recommendation. Two, three, four,
five. Unanimous. We'll call it
unanimous. We've got everybody in here.
Unanimously supported.
Excellent.
We had councelor Dhaney. She voted. Yes,
she was in favor. It was unanimous. We
had everybody unanimous. So,
>> yes, I was in favor. Thank you, Mayor.
» yes, I was in favor. Thank you, Mayor.
Yeah. Yeah. We had everybody there. So,
okay. So, council, do you want to take a
break?
>> Okay. So, uh can we pause for five? What
» Okay. So, uh can we pause for five? What
time is it? 10. So, be back at 10:25,
please. So, we can move on because we've
got till 11 before we have to uh do
another recommendation.
Okay, welcome back everyone. We're at
9.5 of the agenda. Side road tennis swar
street naming proposed uh consultation.
It's a recommendation that PLN2025-40
be received and that the consultation
plan proposed for the renaming of side
road 10 from line 6 to county road 89 as
outlined in report PLN2025-40
be endorsed with staff reporting back to
council on the results of the
consultation at the earliest opportunity
and the council endorsed staff plan to
begin the solicitation of road names uh
through public consultation as described
in report PLN2025-40
on the renaming of select
select roads in the area surrounding the
SWAR as described in report PLN225-40
with staff reporting back to council on
the results of the consultation at its
earliest opportunity.
Who's moving it?
Okay. Moved by councelor Scott, seconded
by Mayor Sandu.
Questions? Go ahead. Council. So my
question is
uh on the swar street naming proposed
consultation. totally agree with with
with that and that's the right process
to go for and council's not voted on
anything yet. But my concern is on side
road 10 council two years ago approved
the road renaming. So how can what what
kind of consultation process are we
doing? It's after the fact. It's like
we've approved a subdivision and it's
half built and we're going to have a
planning meeting for it. Like it doesn't
make any sense. It's backwards.
Does it work if we've already approved
it?
Okay, maybe I can have Allan ask that
question or Alan, can you answer that or
can Thomas? Who wants to take it first?
Not me. Not me. Not me.
>> Thank you, worship. Uh through you to
» Thank you, worship. Uh through you to
councelor Vik. And I think it's maybe a
tendency of um willing to let the other
go first and speak. Um
so further to uh the question that
councelor Vik has posed
um the contents of the report are meant
to try to strike a balance between two
directions that staff have received from
council. Uh on the one hand, as you've
indicated, council's given direction to
advance the renaming for side road 10
from line 6 through to County Road 89 uh
to Middleton.
My apologies.
I know the report also includes historic
evidence of Middleton and Middletown, so
my apologies to have uh used the wrong
one. Um and uh similarly there's also
the direction to uh in accordance with
the street renaming guideline uh to
consult with the public in the event of
renaming of a public street. Uh to date
um members of the public have not been
notified through the implementation of
the renaming guideline with regard to
the side 10 renaming direction. Uh and
therefore the balance the report seeks
to strike is uh to use a um essentially
a consultation light uh program as
proposed to to use that as the vehicle
to notify the public and uh and welcome
feedback which we would include as part
of a further report to council and that
said defer to Mr. Daart for any further
commentary.
I also would like to add that I think as
part of the consultation when we come
back to council with a recommendation to
rename Middletown Side Road, um council
has full accounting of the public's
thoughts, the financial implications, um
anything that we have to do at the
county level to rename the road that's
not under the jurisdiction of the town.
So, it would be just a full cost
accounting of what everyone thinks about
the about the proposal.
>> Does that help you uh council kite a
» Does that help you uh council kite a
little bit?
Yeah. Okay. I've got councelor Scott
next.
>> So, I just want to build on council me's
» So, I just want to build on council me's
question and those answers. The only
thing that I would add is council
approved renaming Middletown Road or
Middletown Side Road from 10 side road
two years ago. Nine months later, we
created a street renaming framework. I
have no problem with doing consultation
light, but the decision's already been
made. It's more I think about how it
would be implemented and what we can do
through the implementation. The policy
comes in after the decision was made and
so the decision was made without a
policy in place at the time. We can try
and reverse engineer it. I like the
phrase consultation light, but council
already made the decision.
That being said, more generally, I think
it's a simple and practical initiative
that honors our heritage and enhances
public safety because the report talks
about Middletown Side Road. It's
something that's colloquially known.
It's more than that. It's a name that's
been around for generations. It's on old
maps. It's still in common use. It's
actually on a series of the signs up on
the road today. It's on Google Maps
today. and it reflects the uh heritage
of Middletown or more rarely Middleton
uh which was a a crossroads community uh
at the at the beginning of Bradford Bond
Head and and the general area. So, this
isn't just about honoring the past. It's
also about reducing confusion,
especially with emergencies. Today, GPS,
I think, helps a fair bit, but I I've
heard stories of residents calling 911
saying, "I'm at such and such Middletown
Road." and the dispatcher not knowing
where Middletown Side Road is because
technically the name is 10 Side Road and
the CIO and I were talking about this.
No one calls it 10 Side Road. They might
call it Tent Side Road or Side Road 10
or Middletown Side Road, but fixing this
is a good idea so that the name actually
matches what people know it as. Uh like
I said, it's been endorsed by council
already in the heritage committee. So,
I'm all in favor of getting it done
consultation light. Talk to people so
they understand what's coming. um if we
have to do some modest um
support for the cost of changing an
address, we can look at that. But that I
I think modest being the key word
because we're not really changing a name
so much as we're standardizing the
common usage in what half our street or
some percentage of our street signs and
what Google Maps already says. As for
the SWAR, we've effectively thanks to
that traffic circle created new roads.
you know, line five east doesn't connect
to line five west anymore. So, I I I
think trying to sort that out is is not
only clarifying things, but it's also a
nice opportunity to find more ways to
honor our heritage. And one of those
streets uh is on the Highway 400
interchange now. So, it's a bit of a
entrance to town. So, all in all, I
think this is uh something that will
improve clarity on our past and help
keep us keep keep people safe. And I'm
I'm all in favor of moving full steam
ahead on both aspects.
Thank you. I've got Deputy Mayor.
>> Thank you, your worship.
» Thank you, your worship.
Not to repeat the comments that uh
already been mentioned by uh the two
counselors. Um last time we discussed
this was and approved by council was
August 1st, 2023.
I know other priorities take over,
staff's busy. It took us two years to
get to this point. In the recommendation
itself, it says earliest opportunity.
I fully know what that earliest
opportunity could be. Could be a month,
it could be 6 months, it could be a year
based on your workload, which I
recognize can change depending on um hot
issues and stuff. I would like to have
some sort of a date for this to come
back with public consultation whether
it's a month or two months um but not
this is not a um timeline to go into
next year. Those are my comments.
Okay, perfect. Uh further comments or
questions? Seeing none. Okay. I would
like uh folks, if you're okay with this,
I'd like to extend the SWAR renaming to
side road five.
It goes only to uh recognition goes only
to the um east side of the bridge.
>> I'd like to carry it right through to to
» I'd like to carry it right through to to
the fifth side road because well, I'll
get hang on. You got to wait for me to
say you can give me a chance. Uh I would
like to get to there because in the end
on the highway, you'll see one road
naming coming off. So otherwise you see
whatever you call it and then line five
also. So
>> side road. So so side road five the the
» side road. So so side road five the the
I would say the east side of it to back
all the way back. You know what I mean?
Side road five is the interchange. It's
the lights right there at side five and
line five. Five and line five. We only
go to the bridge. We go to the east side
of the bridge. And then you've got this
little piece of line five to the light
and then line five to 27. I'm saying
just a side road five. Make that
consistent. Then you got side then you
got line five from side road five to 27
to new tech. That's what I was uh
getting at. It makes it more easy and
consistent. Otherwise you just go name
change name change name change. So
council kite. So not that this is
relevant to this mo this recommendation
and that would be part of the
consultation process. The problem is
when people want to go to line five and
they want to go to line five and whether
it's in BWG or new tech, they're going
to be going down and where's the sign
for line five? They're going to get
anyways. We can talk about that when
we're in the consultation process. GPS
will help you with that or like some of
those funny videos your wife will tell
you where it is.
So now it'll be there. it'll uh I'm just
saying for consistency, but through the
consultation, I guess that could be, you
know, talked about. Maybe some people
say because if you come up the highway,
you'll see coming up 400, it'll be two
roads, right? So, just just that's what
I'd like to see it go to uh the side
road five. So, if that's something that
council could support, that's not in the
report, so I don't know how to put it in
there because it only goes to the east
side of the 400, correct? Report. So, is
that something council can support to
push further or you want to leave the
report the report as is?
Let's uh through consultation we can
find out if people are okay with it. All
right. Thank you. Okay. So, we're okay
with uh any more comments. Seeing none,
all in favor?
Three four. Yep. Carried. Thank you. On
to 9.6. recommendation file uh
recommendation that report PLN2025-36
title recommendation report file number
D14-25-5
and D12505 for blocks 102 plan 51M 1138
and part of lot 15 concession 5 be
received that all written submissions
received in regard to the applications
and all oral submissions made to the
public meeting held on June 10th related
to the applications have been taken into
consideration as part of the
deliberations and final discussions
finally decision. Sorry. that pursuant
to section 3417 planning act, no further
public notification is required, that
the sight specific zoning bylaw
amendment D14-25-05
be approved for lands known as block 102
plan 51m 1138 and part of lot 15
concession 5 and that the corresponding
bylaws be brought forward for enactment
and that draft plan of subdivision
D12-25-5
dated January 21st, 2025 be given draft
approval subject to conditions as
pendant to report PLN20-36
including that draft approval lapse
after three years if final approval is
not achieved within that period. Move
second please
by councelor Scott seconded by councelor
Dyiky. Question concerns we have our
planning staff up here with us.
Oh,
» thank you worship. Just for context as
well, I do believe we have a planning
consultant from KLM here on behalf of
Bay View Wellington and the event
council has questions.
>> I know we've got everybody here and it's
» I know we've got everybody here and it's
late at night. Okay, no questions or
concerns. So,
>> I will call the vote. All in favor?
» I will call the vote. All in favor?
Carrie. Thank you. Thank you very much.
We apologize for that. procurement
activities uh for 2025 first second
quarters. So I have a report
recommendation that report LEG 2024-6
entitled procurement activities 2025
first and second quarters be received
for information moving a second by
deputy mayor seconded by councelor
Perageni
question concerns with the report
okay seeing none all in favor
carried thank you uh we're on to 9.8 8 m
elections voting method. So
recommendation that report CLK-20225-5
titled 2026 mal election voting method
be received for information and the
council confirm the use of internet and
telephone voting as the voting method
for the 2026 mal election put on the
floor. Moved by council Gordano. Second
by councelor Peragini. Question or
concerns with this? Okay. I'm going to
go over this side first. Councelor
Jordano.
>> I'd like to move to defer this to next
» I'd like to move to defer this to next
council meeting. I think this might be a
long conversation. It's already getting
pretty late.
>> A deferral. Okay. You moved it. You're
» A deferral. Okay. You moved it. You're
deferring. You're going to deferral.
You're seconding that. No, no debate on
the deferral. So, you want to defer it.
That means it
so you have a you have a date that you
want it back next me
» next agenda.
>> Okay, let's uh no debate. So we'll vote
» Okay, let's uh no debate. So we'll vote
on the def on the deferral.
» I wasn't expecting this question.
Um yeah, we can postpone definitely. aka
deferral if you state another um meeting
that you want the report to come back
to. Sort of the same idea as
>> deferral.
» deferral.
>> So we're deferring it to the next
» So we're deferring it to the next
meeting
>> if that's what you choose. Yes.
» if that's what you choose. Yes.
>> Yes.
» Yes.
>> What I heard
» What I heard
>> because it's going to be a long debate.
» because it's going to be a long debate.
He said he doesn't
>> I don't think it's going to be a long
» I don't think it's going to be a long
debate but let's vote on the deferral
and if it defers it's okay. So all in
favor of deferral the next meeting
two. Okay. That's defeated. Uh, all all
oppose the deferral. I'm sure I'm sorry
I didn't call that yet. Opposed. Okay.
So, we're it's defeated.
» She's gone. She's gone right now. Okay.
So, uh, this is back on the table. So,
comments or questions in guard in
regards to the report? Council councelor
Rike.
I would always prefer a paper ballot.
Uh but this works well. It's been proven
uh the last bi-election and the um last
election. My only question is do we have
an idea or if we don't can we get get a
cost based on the 2014 numbers for the
cost of the election multiply it by the
increase in population and put in an
inflation factor just to show us how
much would cost to do a paper ballot. So
when the public asks us how come we're
not doing a paper ballot, we can say
well your taxes would go up point 1%. So
do you want to pay that money for a
paper ballot
through you uh your worship to councel
Um I don't have those numbers
right at my fingertips. Um I didn't get
a specific costing in today's numbers
for what tabulators um and all the
additional equipment for a paper ballot
election would cost. Um but certainly I
can provide those I can get some quotes
on those and provide those those numbers
to council or as you said extrapolate
from a previous election and provide
those.
>> Okay. Thank you. We'll get those numbers
» Okay. Thank you. We'll get those numbers
then. Okay. Further comments questions
counci.
I got councelor harper.
Um, I'm okay with uh sticking with the
voting method that we used in the last
election. I found that a lot of
residents were actually very thankful
for that. They didn't have to stand in
lines. They didn't have to wait. It was
very quick. They were amazed. They were
like, "Wow, I can't believe how fast
that was." It unfortunately didn't
really bring our voting numbers up,
which kind of sucked because I figured,
especially being at fingertips that
you're on all the time, it would have
been a lot easier to vote and get
everybody to do it that the vote the
vote turnout was still pretty much the
same as we went to the uh as it was when
we were doing the paper. I think it was
the 30s. It was in the 30s and I think
that's the same as what we were getting
with the papers, too. So, I like the
convenience of it. A lot of people told
me they like the convenience of it and
uh yeah, I would leave it the way it is
now.
>> Okay. Thank you for that. I've got
» Okay. Thank you for that. I've got
councelor Harper and then councelor
Dyke.
Councelor D next. Okay.
>> Thank you, Mayor. Uh let's talk about
» Thank you, Mayor. Uh let's talk about
some hard numbers here. 82%
82.5% of people use the internet for
voting. Um 6.6% was telephone. 10.9% use
the kiosk. It's a hard telling fact. Uh
numbers provided by the CEO. Thank you
very much for this information.
Concerning part of that is I'm I would
be okay with this, but I would like to
explore some more security measures in
regards to um
Oh, I had the word. Oh my god.
What's the kind of word when you like to
verify or Yeah, like some verification
sort of thing.
Um
no because when I look at the voter
turnout and I have it pretty broken down
um there was 73 people from United
States, six from India, two from France,
two from Japan, two from Portugal, two
from Israel, two from UK, the list goes
on. Then there's 623
that were not captured because it was
due to telephone but it doesn't tell us
where they were from, where they were.
So like when I say I need some more
security measures put in place for this
stuff, I think that would ratify a lot
of the points that are being brought
over when people talk about paper
ballots because you know who they are.
But verification stuff like you have to
do authenticator apps and stuff like
that for a lot of things or two or
twoouch uh verification um things are
going in because of fraud and all that
stuff. So, I like those that it explored
in regards to options to basically
ensure voter um
verification processes is in line with
like the most recent updates of the
updates of that as well.
I think I basically proved my point that
people from all over the world are
voting in a municipal election and then
623 from telephone. We don't know where
they came from.
So
>> and I get that. Yeah. From vacation and
» and I get that. Yeah. From vacation and
stuff.
>> Just to I can confirm your two your two
» Just to I can confirm your two your two
Japan.
>> Yeah.
» Yeah.
>> Yes. I know. They called me.
» Yes. I know. They called me.
>> Okay.
» Okay.
>> Two two people were in Japan. They
» Two two people were in Japan. They
called me that night. They voted that
you're seeing it around the world
because people are able to vote from
anywhere.
>> No, I get that. But I'm saying if we
» No, I get that. But I'm saying if we
still have some more authentication and
security measures upgraded, I would be
I'm okay with that. I'm really okay with
I just want to say that I can confir
>> No, I know some people that that that
» No, I know some people that that that
did vote across from other countries too
in this list, but my point being is that
we need those certific measures and
authentications to match the local times
and if the banks do it, all the apps are
doing it. Everything's asking you for
two interfacing like, you know, two push
uh notifications, stuff like that. Yeah,
that's where we should be going and I'
I'd like to see that come back after
this report to just upgrade with the
times.
Um, point point well taken. Thank you,
counselor. Um, that's something we can
certainly explore with the the vendor um
and see how that that works and what you
know I can also report back on on all
the security measures in place and
procedures for um the system itself. Um,
further reports will be coming to you as
we go through this process. You know, I
realize it's early now. It's uh I think
it's 447 days away. So 477, maybe 447. I
looked it up today, but um you know,
we're out a little bit, but it's still
coming close. So um certainly I'll be
providing more reports to council as as
more information um as we go through the
process and more things develop. But I
can certainly take that point away. as
far as people voting from, you know, you
see people from other countries voting.
It it is the method that's in place that
allows people to vote from anywhere
literally um you know, 24 hours 24/7
sort of thing from from any country. So,
they could be traveling, they could be
on vacation. It still allows them to
vote in our municipal election.
>> Okay, good point. Okay. Uh Councelor Di,
» Okay, good point. Okay. Uh Councelor Di,
I had the same uh same concerns. uh just
upgrade to security. Uh I like the fact
that we don't have I'm old fashioned
too. I'd like to I would have liked to
see the ballot, but on the other hand um
and I'm disappointed to see not as
people I was hoping to see more people
uh vote uh versus last time. But at the
end of the day um as we have it's an
internet phone and u you know maybe in
look at opportunities in in the seniors
um senior centers um maybe there's maybe
some ballots or whatever the case may be
but at the end of the day they would I I
had a few people after election come to
me and said to me they would have
preferred to see ballots too but that
was only a a few uh comments I got but
what I didn't like is where I have seen
candidates go to the
and then trying to convince the people
to to vote. They would go into the
person's house and say, you know, uh
here's a here's a card. Please vote for
me. And and they would force their way
almost convince their way in. And uh I
asked them to come forward to speak to
you, Tara. But at the end of the day,
this this could go on. I just hope that
we could come up with a better way of of
security. That's that's why I was hoping
to to air all these items out.
>> Thank you, Mr. Dano.
» Thank you, Mr. Dano.
Thank you, Kaisky. That was uh that was
exactly what I was going to start off my
conversation with. The problem is in and
I'm going to be the devil's advocate to
everyone here. Yeah, I like the
convenience factor, but what do we get
in return? We got no improvement really
when it came to our turnout, but what we
did do is we have the stronger ability
for people to force or intimidate people
to vote certain ways. I saw myself. I a
lot of people come forward saying that
people walk into a house and they're
like, "Oh, sign sign. You know, vote
here. Oh, let me help you." Oh, oh,
yeah, that's my name over there. the
next thing you know they're getting all
the votes. So I'm a traditionalist. I
like proper vote. It's the gold standard
for a reason because you have to show
up. You have to show proper ID. My
biggest concern is actually how do
people get their voter cards. I'm not a
big fan of just providing a phone bill
or something else. And I was like, "Oh
yeah, okay. Here you go. Go ahead and
vote." Right? No, you got to be able and
eligible to vote. And I think we need to
tighten that up, too, because I think
it's a little too loose right now. And
there's so many people taking advantage
of that. It's happening across Canada,
the US, and around the world. So, you
know, we we're only in control of our
little municipality. Let's make sure we
do it right in the gold standard. So,
I'm not in support of going this. And I
and I will I will I will say that the
convenience factor is fantastic. I think
it's great, but I'm not willing to give
up or erode our democracy when it comes
to proper vetting of how we do things.
And I don't like the intimidation
factor. Those are two things that
influence people and they feel pressure.
And I I didn't like it. I didn't like it
when I see it. I would never do that.
And and frankly, I think you having
somebody go and commit, that's that's
our given right. You know, people around
the world are coming to Canada because
they love they love our laws and and our
freedoms and everything else. And we're
trying to make it more convenient, which
is great. It's not yielding better
results, but all it's it's also creating
these other problems. So, I'd like to
get rid of that and go back to
traditional voting.
>> Okay. Thank you. I've got uh Councelor
» Okay. Thank you. I've got uh Councelor
Scott next.
>> So, just a couple of comments in
» So, just a couple of comments in
response to some of what's been raised.
I've had the benefit of running a
mayoral campaign under the paper ballot
system and then running in the two
online elections, the bi-election and
then the general election. The the paper
system had its benefits, the vote
everywhere, but we had to run multiple I
think it was seven polling stations that
had to be staffed and they were only
open on specific days. So you you had
the two or three days of advanced polls
and then e day. I like the online voting
because it essentially has 10 days of an
election. It's true that voter turnout
didn't go up, but the collar to that is
it didn't go down. In fact, my
bi-election had seven more votes than
the general the year prior. And perhaps
that's because it was a a competitive
seven person race. Perhaps it's because
we made it easier for people. And unlike
other municipalities, we didn't see a
drop. So hard to prove the negative, but
I I think the fact that it's maintained
and I would say with without really a
competitive uh race at the top of the
ticket last election, the fact that it
stayed where it was, that was uh that
was pretty helpful. So uh I think it
works as to the concern about
uh
vote or manipulating the will of the
elector. The the Municipal Elections Act
is clear what you can or cannot do uh to
assist someone in voting. And that's
true in person or online. Uh and uh
certainly anyone who tried that I like
to think isn't sitting at this table. So
it also didn't work.
Okay.
Councelor Harper again. Thanks Mayor. I
have a with me R. I have an hourly
voting uh heat map here of the 10 days
and a lot of the voting really either
happened on the first day or within the
final day.
Does it have to be 10 days?
» Through your worship to uh council
Harper. No, the voting period does not
have to be 10 days. Um it's just just
allows that opportunity for people to
have
time even though you generally speaking.
Um in any election people will show up
when it first opens even with paper
ballots at voting locations and then
we'll wait till the very last minute to
to vote as well. So, um, but allowing
allowing that sort of time frame just
does increase the convenience time. Um,
the opportunity for people to cast their
votes. Um, it just allows that extra
time. Well, we have our voter help
centers in operation during that time.
So, we've got, you know, hours in the
evening, weekend days, um, variety of
hours for people to come in and get that
assistance if they need it. Um, so we do
like to to keep that. Um the vendors I
think generally recommend a 12 to 14 day
um voting period with internet and phone
voting. So um it does seem like a a long
time but it's also um
you know just that opportunity for
people to to cast their ballots.
» So what would the process look like for
us to either shorten that or extend
that? Do we have to go through this
vendor or can we make that
recommendation?
Because certainly when you're looking at
this data that I bought out in like
beautiful colors and everything down to
the minute or the hour,
you can clearly see that there's some
room for adaptation here. And if we run
it two cycles already and we don't
change it based on the projections, then
maybe we could and make it more
streamlined and efficient.
>> Again, a point well well taken. That's
» Again, a point well well taken. That's
something we can we can look at a little
more closely. Um it would be up to the
election administrators to determine,
you know, those those time frames and
that that voting that voting period per
se and when we have the voter help
center. So looking at previous
statistics will help us determine that
and and we will take that into account
for sure in planning.
got uh depor sand. I've got uh councelor
and councelor Scott. We're at 1056.
So um if we can get that done in four
minutes, otherwise we have to do a
procedural bylaw procedural uh
>> Okay, I'll I'll be quick. Um I agree
» Okay, I'll I'll be quick. Um I agree
with this report. I I'm in favor of the
method we used last election. I don't
understand what the fear is of having 14
days. Uh it's just um look at the
numbers uh on those days. If we took
those out, those people might not vote
the other days. So I don't have an issue
sticking with what's proposed to us.
Hey, it's giving more days and
opportunities for for democratic process
to work. People come out and vote. So I
don't have an issue with this report.
Thank you.
» Okay. Thank you. Uh go ahead, Coun. just
are are we not trying to be consistent
too with New Tech, Inisville, ESSA, and
Agela? Like it's all pretty well the
same time frame and they're doing we're
doing joint advertising.
» Yeah, with respect to the joint
advertising council for kite that's
generally um promoting that the
municipal election is happening. Um it
doesn't because we are doing SEO
countywide
um with respect to those specific ads.
Um we don't get into sort of the details
of each municipality's um separate
election details, but we do encourage
people the mil municipal election is
happening and um give them enough
information that they know to go to
their local municipalities to check the
information to to be able to vote.
» Okay. I I should do this first before we
go any further. Okay. So we don't So
council I got to put on the floor that
council move to extend the meeting
beyond 11 p.m. until such time as all
remaining items on the agenda are are
addressed. So are we good with that? I
need a move or a second move by
councelor K. Second by councelor Scott.
All in favor
carried. Okay.
All right. Councelor Scott.
>> Yeah. Just very briefly to councelor
» Yeah. Just very briefly to councelor
Harper's question about 10 days being
too long. It's a third of what you have
fedally and proincially where the
returning office is open every day of
the right for you to go vote.
» Okay. Further uh comments or questions?
Okay. Seeing none, we will call for the
vote on the recommendation. So all in
favor the recommendation
one, two, three. I'd like
>> to call a quarter vote on this.
» to call a quarter vote on this.
>> Okay.
Okay. So, in
favor of moving forward
with the voting methods for the 2026
municipal election.
Um,
we'll start with councelor Gerardano.
Please say yes in favor or no in
opposition.
>> No. Councelor
Peter Dy.
>> Councelor Perigini.
» Councelor Perigini.
>> No.
» No.
>> Councelor Harper.
» Councelor Harper.
>> Yes.
» Yes.
>> Councelor Scott.
» Councelor Scott.
>> Councelor Verkike.
» Councelor Verkike.
>> Yes.
» Yes.
>> Deputy Mayor Sandeu.
» Deputy Mayor Sandeu.
>> Yes.
» Yes.
>> And Mayor Leuk.
» And Mayor Leuk.
>> Yes.
Okay. So that uh passes. The motion is
carried.
>> Okay. Thank you.
» Okay. Thank you.
We are moving on to 9.9.
Mayor and Council Golf Classic Summary.
A recommendation that report CAO 2025-3
titled the 2025 mayor and council golf
classic summary be received for
information and the golf committee
reconvenes in January 26 to commence the
planning process for the 2026 mayor and
uh council golf classic. Move second put
this on the floor please by deputy mayor
seconded by councelor Dyke. Question
concerns with the report
councelor Scott and councelor
>> Thanks Mr. Mayor. So, this was a fun
» Thanks Mr. Mayor. So, this was a fun
event and I want to thank staff, the
organizing committee and the sponsors uh
for making it happen. And I also want to
thank the CEO for answering my questions
earlier today. I was trying to reconcile
the funds raised this year, but also
over the past two years with the
publicly stated commitments to various
events. I'm just going to focus on this
year because I I had satisfactory
answers to past years. Unfortunately,
there seems to be a gap between what was
communicated to the public about the
2025 proceeds and the actual impact.
Promotions in advance, the postevent
news release, and this report said the
funds would go to quote essential
upgrades to various parks such as Rotary
Park. In reality, the tournament
contributed $40,000 solely to Rotary
Park. Rotary Park was only already fully
funded and approved in the 2025 budget
at $135,000.
So the tournament offset about one
quarter of its cost again which was
already budgeted. This perhaps could
free up that amount for for future
upgrades which is welcome but it's a
very different story than suggesting the
event directly funded the project in
addition to funding upgrades to various
whatever that meant other parks. So in
reality we funded a quarter of one park
not multiple park projects.
Any additional funding is a good thing.
I'm not questioning that. But I I do
worry about approving this until we have
more transparency around the numbers. I
I think councelor and perhaps
councelor Gardano had asked last year
about transparency as to the revenue,
the donation side. I'm asking about the
expenses side. So, I'm going to move
that this report be referred back to
staff with a request to return by early
fall with a breakdown for 2023, 2024,
and 2025 showing gross revenue from
registrations and sponsorship, event
expenses, net proceeds, how those funds
have been spent or committed over the
past three years, and what percentage of
the projects were then funded by the
tournament. And I I emailed the clerk in
advance, so they have this. I think we
owe it to the public to tidy this up if
there if there was an overcommitment or
uh some enthusiasm that wasn't realized
in in the actual accounting afterwards
because this carries the town's name. I
think we branded it the mayor and
council tournament. It certainly uses
town resources and supports important
local causes over the years. So, I'd
like to uh refer this back to get that
additional information. I think it will
uh tidy things up and uh if mistakes
happen they happen but um funding one
park when the commitment was to fund
various parks and the funding for that
one park was just a quarter of the total
costs that wasn't as advertised.
Okay. Thank you, councelor Dyiky.
As a as a word counselor that uh had the
the road uh park upgraded and I must say
I I received many calls on the problem
with the old um pavilion and the people
living in it and and all the problems it
causes for the neighbors for Jury Street
and and Holland Court. I I just want to
thank the committee. I know there was a
lot of funds that went to various
positive things, Scan Creek and the
whole whole nine yards, but I I just
want to thank u for benefit. I know it
was in the budget, but I haven't seen
all those final numbers as well when it
came to the to Rotary Park, but I think
at the end of the day that it's a big
improvement of downtown. So, private
funding and and taxation, it really
benefited old part of town. So, I just
wanted to thank your mayor and and the
many councils, Karen, and everybody that
sits on the committee, and it's not easy
to fund raise uh these projects,
especially with golf course uh golf
tournaments. It's not easy to get the
funds.
>> So, I have a point of order. I moved a
» So, I have a point of order. I moved a
referral and I would need a seconder,
but that would then have to take
precedence over general debate.
>> Moved a referral. Okay. I thought you
» Moved a referral. Okay. I thought you
made an amendment to the motion.
>> No, Mr. Mayor. I clearly stated that I'd
» No, Mr. Mayor. I clearly stated that I'd
like to refer it back to staff. I
specified when and the items I'd want. I
need a seconder on a referral motion and
then that takes precedent but it is
debatable.
>> We've been through this twice tonight.
» We've been through this twice tonight.
>> No problem. Good for you. Okay. So, we
» No problem. Good for you. Okay. So, we
need a seconder for that.
>> Your your second.
» Your your second.
>> I'll second it. But can I add uh will
» I'll second it. But can I add uh will
there be debate so I can ask for further
information on other things?
>> Yes, absolutely. Ask away.
So I guess if if possible, we have the
event sponsor, we have platinum
sponsors.
Uh these major sponsors are
uh they're putting their name out there
at the event, I believe, and I don't see
why they're not listed in a in this
report who's who's donating what. Um,
you know, it's they're not hiding it
because I believe that they're putting
it out there during the the event. So,
it's not private information, but it's
not very transparent to the public.
>> I'd consider that friendly to my
» I'd consider that friendly to my
referral motion.
» Okay.
>> Yeah. Councelor Jam, go ahead.
» Yeah. Councelor Jam, go ahead.
>> Yeah. Yeah, at the end of the day, I I
» Yeah. Yeah, at the end of the day, I I
we've had some discussions offline about
this in some of the emails and um yeah,
this is the type of information that
when it comes to building trust with the
community and everything else, it's good
to know what the only concern I have is
that you don't want to scare away. Um u
but you know, if they're putting their
logo out there and they're saying, "Hey,
I'm a platinum sponsor or I'm a gold
spot of a whole sponsor." There's a rate
card. It's well advertised. So I I would
say that that's pretty fair game to at
least detail that or at least have it in
buckets, right? So some some sort of
transparency that shows that I wouldn't
want to, you know, promote that and
throw it out all across, you know, u for
everyone to see, but at the same time,
when you sign up for a municipal uh
anything and you're giving donations, it
should be a lot more transparent than we
have it right now.
» Yeah. Craber.
Thanks, Mayor.
This This is kind of a bit bugging me.
It's almost like we're on a witch hunt
here or something, but can I get a
clarification? Like, is there a
requirement that we have to like
transparently show who donates
privately? Do we have to reach out then
to to these donors to get their consent
to put put it publicly? Like, did we put
it in any any position where we would
tell the public that they would be doing
this? I mean, it was a council mayor and
council golf tournament, but like where
where do we stand on this? Like, do we
have to have them like I just want to
know what what the actual
ruling is on this because it's a bit
confusing and it just like
you know, councelor J, you put it right.
You don't want to scare anybody off
here, but like that a port like this is
exactly what he might do. and we're
actually getting a lot of things done in
this this town. And I and I understand
councelor Scott, you know, wanting to
make sure that the proper places or
things were were funded. And that part I
don't mind with seeing where it went,
but like we're tracking down and and
name calling donors now and stuff. It
just seems a little bit farfetched here.
I'd like the ruling on that. Like do we
have a process?
>> No, I don't know if we have a process,
» No, I don't know if we have a process,
but we'll look through it. look through
it. It's it's everything's fair game.
This is council and mayor's golf event.
So there are there is a committee we set
up and uh we have members on that
committee and every year we've changed
them where we've asked people to come on
that committee. This information is all
available. Um the money's been spent on
like it's almost like we're saying that
I'm hiding something whatever. I'm not
hiding anything. I I don't know why we
think it's me. This is a mayor and
council event. Some of you has actually
come some of you come for photos and
leave. But some of you come and play
golf, some don't. But that's okay. I
mean, that's this is our this is our
event. I do a lot of work to get this
event off. I do a lot of fundraising for
it. Yeah. But I we've supported the
100th RCAF event. We've supported the
100th anniversary hall of Marsh, the
Rotary Park. We supported money for our
town hall for when uh our town hall is
built. Council have money to do what
they want in the foyer to put some
extras in there. That's all going to be
in the account. Everything is accounted
for. We There's nothing unaccounted for
here. There's nothing there's no hidden
magic thing here. We are a a town. We're
accountable. If you want a friends that
got it, we can give you friends that got
it. I have nothing to hide. There's
nothing to hide. I sent a I sent a an
Excel spreadsheet that the same
spreadsheet that we do every year.
Members of council see that. I don't
know what the big idea is that we have
to express who was the va who was at the
uh who was the donor or whatever. I
mean, they're at the golf event. They're
they're on the cards. They're there. you
know who they are.
If you want to tell the public, go ahead
and tell the public. They they probably
won't do it again.
So, I'm I'm I'm good with not even
running a tournament again. Let's let's
not do it. Let's save the time and
effort because this is going to cost
staff time. They're the ones that have
to put this all together. We have it on
spreadsheets, but Okay. So, Councelor
Scott, go ahead.
>> Thanks, your worship. Okay. I uh I think
» Thanks, your worship. Okay. I uh I think
it's fair game to ask for transparency
and I I hear your defensiveness and
that's fair and fine, but I wouldn't be
asking for something if the advertising,
the news release and this report didn't
say that we funded multiple parks when
we funded a quarter of one. That's my
question. Councelor Vike then asked for
more information about the donors and
I'm in favor of more transparency, not
less. But, uh, councelor Harper said,
"It feels like a witch hunt." I wouldn't
be here if there wasn't a discrepancy
between what was advertised, stated in
the news release, and stated in the
report that we funded various park
upgrades, including Rotary Park, when in
the end, we funded a quarter of Rotary
Park. That's the main thing I was asking
for. I I think I think and and councelor
Hyper said that piece is fair. I'll let
councelor Bkite out if he wants on the
donations, but I thought more
transparency, not less, is a good thing.
Council,
>> my my question is not directed at the
» my my question is not directed at the
mayor. I direct my question is directed
at staff uh to add this to the report.
if staff consider that it's not
appropriate that staff cons do that but
I can ask the question
not directed at this is a mayor and
council culture so as a counselor I
should be able to ask these questions
certainly you can ask any question you
want okay so we got a referral back on
and they're and you have the uh reasons
you have everything documented on what
they want referred all the information
that they're asking before they have it.
Make sure you have it because I don't
want to miss any. Okay. So, we're uh
we're voting on that a referral. So, all
in favor?
Okay. Thank you. Supported.
Moving on. We're on to staff request for
staff reports. Any request for staff
report tonight?
>> Yes, sir.
» Yes, sir.
>> Yep. Go ahead.
» Yep. Go ahead.
>> Thank you again. Um, so I have a request
» Thank you again. Um, so I have a request
that I hope council will support. Uh, it
reflects concerns we've heard recently
or directly over many years from
residents and it also follows a
precedent council established last year.
So, I'd first like to ask staff to
report back on whether there are cost
efficiencies or other benefits to
expanding the current Britannia Avenue
resurfacing project to include Wood
Crescent, Julie Court, and Jennifer
Court. These are some of the older roads
and among the worst condition. I mention
them often, but because of lower traffic
volumes, they're get they keep getting
pushed back down the priority list.
We've had success in the past bundling
roads like these into nearby projects to
get them done more efficiently. In my
word, Patrician Court got done a few
years ago that way last year around this
time. Uh the mayor had a good idea, I
thought, and brought forward a similar
request to this to add Ryagens
Industrial Parkway to the Line 8
reservicing after business owners had
raised concerns. This is the a similar
case, just it's dozens of residents
asking. Um, sorry, I'll wrap up quickly.
The roads I'm raising are already in the
capital asset renewal plan slotted for
future years at a cost of $555,000.
Very similar in dollar scope to reagens
last year. If we accelerate the work and
achieve cost savings by combining it
with Britannia now, I think that's worth
exploring. So, I I'd like to see us ask
staff to report back on this at a
meeting in September. And then second,
I'm also going to ask staff to review
whether two small and seemingly
overlapping reserve funds, the parking
lot reserve fund and the capital
facilities reserve fund could be
consolidated into our capital asset
renewal reserve fund. Uh this would
streamline planning and capital uh
projects. It would add roughly half a
million dollars, which is incidentally
roughly the cost of the road projects
I'm asking to look into accelerating
into the capital asset plan. So
hopefully those are uh two practical
proposals that I'd like uh staff to
report on so we can make a decision. I'm
not saying we need to say yes or no to
either thing tonight, but I'd like uh
the information brought back, please.
» Sorry, point of order. I just have to uh
declare a conflict on the Bratannu. So
if you could split the vote.
>> Okay.
Okay. Moved by Council G. So Okay.
Second. So, we have that. You've heard
what councelor
Scott wants on questions? Yeah,
>> sure. So,
» sure. So,
when the reports come back, it would
would like staff to highlight if it's
going to push any other regularly
scheduled projects back, regardless of
where the savings are and how we're
doing it. If it's going to and which
projects are going to push be pushed
back. That way we can decide at that
time whether we're going to go through
with this or not.
» So yeah, I want I want to support it's
always best to do due diligence when it
looks at optimization of any type of
project, but I agree with the deputy
mayor 100%. I I wouldn't want to
sacrifice or push back another project
that is uh maybe on a higher priority
list or something else, but I find that
there's always ways to to look at
scenarios. So I I look forward to the
solutioning that they bring back and
seeing how that plays.
Okay. So, we're not we we can split the
vote then if you want. Okay. So, we'll
just vote on the re on the uh report for
looking for resurfacing of the roads to
start.
Okay. Okay. And then we'll do the the
one with consolidating the reserve
funds. Okay. So, uh all in favor of the
report for the consolidation of the
roads repaving.
Okay. Carried.
Next one is on the consolidation a
report for the consolidation of the two
reserve uh funds to be moved into the
capital expenditure reserve. Okay,
that's carried to reports are coming.
>> Same.
» Same.
>> Oh, move second. Well, the same move
» Oh, move second. Well, the same move
secondary. Yeah, sorry.
>> Okay, good. Any further request for
» Okay, good. Any further request for
staff reports? Don't have any. Nobody
came to the
Oh, yeah.
» Yeah. Okay.
>> I could have brought it up for her.
» I could have brought it up for her.
>> It's okay. I let go. Okay. Yeah, because
» It's okay. I let go. Okay. Yeah, because
she didn't. She has to go through CF.
Okay. There's no committee hall. We're
on to Let's move on.
Section 12, committee minutes and
recommendations. Recommendation. The
committee minutes uh and recommendations
item 121 inclusive be received and
approved. Move. Second, please. Move by
councelor Vike. Second by councelor
Dyke. Question, concerns with any
amendments and recommendations. All
right. Seeing none, all in favor?
Carried. Thank you. We are on to uh no
new business. 14 bylaws. Recommendation
that bylaws 2025, 81, 82, and 84 be
passed. Uh 81 is a zoning uh bylaw
amendment, and 82 is a building
inspector appointment bylaw. uh Lumang
Yang. So, welcome to our our uh building
department and then a pres-ervice
agreement with Bond Head uh properties
8. So, move a second to put this on the
floor. Moved by Deputy Mayor, seconded
by Councelor Farerini.
Question or concerns? Seeing none, all
in favor? Carried. Thank you.
Uh announcements. We don't have uh we
have general announcements, so let's get
through that. I'll try and speed read
today.
Um, no, maybe I'll take my time.
» Okay, so we got council announcements.
Proclamations and flag raisings. We have
several uh in August. Fier Simco Pride,
we did that today. Jamaican Independence
Day on August 6th. National Peacekeepers
Day August 9th. Pakistani Independence
Day August 14th. Indian Independence Day
August 15th. Ukraine indep independence
day August 24th.
On to the next slide.
We have uh
council uh up and cominging events. We
have outdoor movies happening in August.
So uh every Tuesday in August we have
movies. Check that out please. And then
we have Carro Fest that is uh happening
on August uh 15th and 16th. So please
come out and enjoy Carefest with us.
Next slide. Council announcements, other
events and campaigns. We have the
community grant application that's
opened now. Please deadline to apply is
by October 1st. We also have the youth
council design contest. So, please uh
share that out. And there's a $150 gift
card for the the best design. And then
we have take our accessibility survey.
So, please uh share that as much as
possible to share that accessibility
survey. Uh other ones we have uh events
and campaigns. So, we have an open air
fire burn uh fireworks ban right now.
So, fire burning and fireworks ban is in
effect immediately. So, please do not
have any open air fires or fireworks
uh until the uh ban is lifted. The uh
last one is our connected edition. It's
out now. Our It's out digitally and our
copies will be in our buildings uh very
soon. So, look for the summer connected
edition. It has lots of information in
there for council. Was that fast enough
council?
>> Record. Eh, very good. Oh, yes.
» Record. Eh, very good. Oh, yes.
Councelor Jordano. I think in the past
you've promoted other counselor's
events. Um, but I don't see my event on
here and we don't have another council
meeting until the event.
>> Oh, okay. I was hoping to have the
» Oh, okay. I was hoping to have the
graphic and everything else like
everybody else. Okay. So, uh, August
23rd retro block party. Um, is it open
to the entire town to purchase tickets?
You can go to www.vipbwg.ca.
Thank you.
>> Sorry, we didn't mean to miss that. We
» Sorry, we didn't mean to miss that. We
uh, we forgot it. I I apologize about
that. Okay. 17. Confirmed proceedings.
Recommendation that bylaw 2022-83 a
bylaw to confirm proceedings of the
regular council and committee hall
meeting dated August 5th 2023 be
enacted. Moved by councelor Dy. Second
by councelor Harper. All in favor?
Carried. Thank you. Ajournment
recommendation of the meeting hereby
journ at what time is it? 11:20 moved by
councelor Kite. Seconded by councelor
Jordano. All in favor? Carried. Thank
you. Have a great evening everyone.
Thank you for join joining