[This transcript was generated automatically from audio using AI and hasn't been reviewed by a person -- it can contain mistakes, including plausible-sounding sentences that were never actually said. Treat it as a starting point, not a verbatim record.]

[0:00] Dan, will you call the roll please?
[0:06] Council Member Rebecca Chase Williams is absent.
[0:10] Council Member Jim Iyer, District 2.
[0:13] Here.
[0:14] Council Member Bates Madison, District 3.
[0:16] Here.
[0:17] Council Member Joe Gevia, District 4.
[0:20] Present.
[0:20] Mayor Davis, we have a quorum.
[0:22] All right.
[0:25] No opening remarks.
[0:28] Agenda meeting agenda review.
[0:30] Regular meeting agenda review.
[0:43] Again.
[0:44] There we go.
[0:44] All right, Mr. Mayor and council members, on the, I'll
[0:53] go to the city council agenda
[0:54] and then we'll swing back around.
[0:57] Rebecca's here.
[1:08] We have a very short city council agenda this evening and I'll just run through that
[1:14] quickly.
[1:15] You do have meeting minutes from October the 8th, both the work session and of
[1:20] course the regular council meeting.
[1:22] The third item on the Consent Agenda is to ask the Council to please authorize the Mayor
[1:29] to execute the contract for Buford Highway Improvement Plan and Economic Development
[1:33] Strategy.
[1:34] That is to enable us to move the project forward so that we can get the public engaged
[1:40] and have a kickoff meeting.
[1:41] We're looking at a kickoff meeting in early November.
[1:44] What I would like to do is I'm negotiating currently the cost for that and I would like to send that back to you all.
[1:55] Right now we have a budget estimate that is still being negotiated and not agreed to at this point of $121,000 to cover the cost of those services
[2:05] and that includes three different consulting firms that make up that firm.
[2:10] So we're working on that.
[2:12] We're looking at the number of meetings, looking at the deliverables.
[2:15] So that would be the threshold not to exceed, but working hard to lower that.
[2:21] So we'll be asking you this evening, just in an effort to be able to launch this plan to move forward,
[2:30] give the mayor authorization to execute the contract.
[2:33] I expect that we should be finished with that probably sometime early next week if not by
[2:41] the end of this week and then once we have that we'll go to contract and that'll be turned
[2:46] over to the city attorney to prepare the contract.
[2:48] They are providing to me their customary contract which Tom will be taking a look
[2:54] at but in the interim there may be some tweaks to that that he may advise us on.
[3:00] And so this is just to be able to move it along to stay on time with what we're trying
[3:06] to do to be able to deliver the Buford Highway Improvement Plan in the spring.
[3:11] And again, we're trying not to get too deep into the holidays either because we'd like
[3:15] to have the kickoff meeting before that.
[3:17] And remember, we'll be kicking off the comp plan, the transportation plan, and
[3:22] the parks and rec plan in December.
[3:26] So that's that.
[3:27] The other item on the agenda.
[3:29] The last item on the agenda is under announcements.
[3:32] We have a new formation of a group called the Friends of Brookhaven.
[3:37] Shannon Cameron, who serves on our Planning Commission, has been elected the President there 501c3.
[3:43] And they really are, I would call them, they almost serve as a booster,
[3:49] a city booster for the community and are looking for ways to partner with the city.
[3:54] one initiative that they have agreed with us to partner on is to fundraise within the
[4:01] community so that we can purchase defibrillators for each of our police officers so they can
[4:06] have that in their cars as well as additional defibrillators that will be in City Hall and
[4:11] in the parks buildings. So they are moving forward on this and are very excited to
[4:17] be a part of it. The program that we put together is that they are expecting to
[4:22] raise $30,000 and we will fund $30,000 to match that through the city's budget.
[4:29] You'll be seeing that later on when we get into budget hearings and I'll point that out
[4:32] to you on where we have some community initiatives.
[4:36] This is truly a piece of valuable equipment for the police officers.
[4:40] So we're thrilled that the community is stepping forward and wants to engage in that.
[4:46] Their participation is only to fundraise.
[4:49] The chief will be specking out what those defibrillators will be.
[4:55] They will not be purchasing the defibrillators.
[4:57] They're not going to be donating any defibrillators.
[4:59] Their job is just to raise funds, present those to the city.
[5:03] We're planning on that during the city's one-year celebration week in December,
[5:08] and it's expected that they will present a check to the city.
[5:11] So this will be an introduction of Ms. Cameron and what the efforts of her group are.
[5:16] friends of Brookhaven and discussing the launch of their first initiative in partnership with the city.
[5:27] Is
[5:30] the end of the agenda.
[5:33] All right.
[5:35] I have a question on the consent, and I guess it's really more a question for council.
[5:40] Are we prepared to move forward on item number three tonight without, I guess I'd like that.
[5:46] I was hoping we'd see more of what the scope of work and deliverables were going to be before
[5:52] we approve this.
[5:54] And without that, I'm not comfortable with the kind of dollars you're talking about
[5:59] moving forward with this as a consent agenda item.
[6:02] Well, I can go over what the mandatory requirements are for the deliverables because
[6:07] that was part of the request for qualifications and proposals that they had.
[6:12] I mean, we were very clear on what the plan would include and what is we're calling mandatory.
[6:18] I mean, we specified that in terms of being mandatory requirements.
[6:22] So I can go over that list for you right now.
[6:26] Definitely looking at an economic development strategy developing that,
[6:30] funding sources to stimulate economic development and economic growth,
[6:34] business expansion, corporate recruitment, job creation and retention,
[6:38] housing initiatives and workforce housing and sustainable practices.
[6:43] What we expect to come out of each of these requirements will be, and in the presentation of the firms,
[6:50] we're basically this, that there will be a full analysis of the built environment with the infrastructure along Buford Highway.
[6:59] That will be all of the water, the sewer, what capacities are available and can be expanded upon for new development.
[7:06] the road improvements along Buford Highway incorporating those design elements that DOT is now installing,
[7:13] but also to take a look at those core intersections, the nodes themselves, where we have the major arterials
[7:21] and collector roads that are emptying into and intersecting with Buford Highway,
[7:25] and to see if there's a way to accept the DOT plans or if there's a way to soften it,
[7:30] to allow pedestrian traffic to enter into those sidewalks in addition to the vehicles
[7:38] that are using those areas.
[7:39] Looking at funding sources, that's going to include a number of grants.
[7:45] I've talked with you about an enterprise zone, opportunity zone, looking at some tax abatements
[7:51] to incentivize opportunities for recruitment, especially in the employment-based side.
[7:57] We also want to take a look at, and this is in conjunction with the apartment inspection program that we're conducting right now,
[8:04] and that is to look at what is the viability of the current housing that is located along Buford Highway,
[8:15] and the type of housing, and most importantly the occupant.
[8:18] We have a very high rental occupants along Buford Highway.
[8:24] We wanted to take a look at the ability that if there were some tear-downs and taking analysis of what we're finding on our apartment inspections.
[8:33] From the standpoint is, is there a market and could we support owner-occupied units, whether they're attached or even detached?
[8:40] So we're looking at a combination of those as well as examining the workforce housing.
[8:45] As you know, I'm working with DeKalb County and they are providing funds to us and those
[8:51] funds have been committed to us to look at a further incentive program to our owners
[8:57] landlords of the apartment so that we can help them accelerate the code issues that
[9:03] we're finding in the inspections so that they can bring their properties up to code.
[9:08] Corporate recruitment, there will be an identification of all the businesses that
[9:11] are currently there. And then a listing of support services and businesses or even the
[9:17] expansion of businesses related to the core businesses along Buford Highway so that we
[9:22] have a real recruitment plan. Who are we going to try and go after? The firm that we have
[9:26] selected has a great history and success rate on identifying even down to the restaurant
[9:31] type that would be able to be supported locating along Buford Highway. So we're
[9:38] excited about that. Again, this would relate back to job creation and retention. How do
[9:43] we retain that? The Department of Community Affairs has a very aggressive job opportunities
[9:48] program and there's a tiering effect and there's a way that certain employment taxes
[9:55] can be waived or abated or reduced over time if improvements or expansion of jobs
[10:02] are created and even those that are retained. So we're going to be examining and investigating
[10:07] I mentioned already workforce housing, again looking at a stronger partnership with DeKalb County Housing Initiatives.
[10:15] And this is not all about multi-family attached housing or rent or occupied.
[10:19] It's how do we mix other types of uses and opportunities.
[10:23] And we have a number of owner occupied residences that are out that sit behind many of these apartment communities.
[10:30] So we want to look at that and look at opportunities there for furthering those types of housing
[10:36] product.
[10:38] Sustainable practices.
[10:40] There will be a listing and recommendations and many of the recommendations that will
[10:44] come out of this will then take us to a next step that will be to enable the plan to
[10:51] be developed.
[10:51] That will be codification of our zoning ordinance.
[10:54] It might be development and creation of standards and practices on streetscape of what we want
[11:01] to see.
[11:01] How do we create a theme, if you will, so that it's easily recognizable along Buford
[11:06] Highway so that there are points of demarcation as you follow along Buford Highway, whether
[11:12] that's street lights or planters or benches and how do we coordinate and work with
[11:17] Marta on improving the bus stops that are out there and how do we provide connectivity.
[11:22] There was a lot of discussion in the interviews, presentations about the connectivity to Buford
[11:27] Highway back deep into the residential communities, tying in the cross keys initiative, which
[11:31] is a very strong initiative with DeKalb County, and will enable us to further our participation
[11:37] with them on this first $500,000 that they're going to be providing to us.
[11:41] So I'm very confident on the deliverables.
[11:46] They are listed as mandatory.
[11:47] They will be part and parcel to the contract that the city attorney is going to prepare
[11:51] because if they fail to perform, they will not be paid.
[11:55] So this is going to be a plan that will be shepherd by Susan Cannon in her department
[12:02] because it will come under the umbrella of community development as a tool,
[12:06] again, when we get to the point of codifying, but it will be a valuable tool
[12:11] for the development authority to use as they promote all opportunities
[12:17] for engagement with our development community along Buford Highway.
[12:20] So the cap is 121,000.
[12:24] I'm working hard to lower that because I think there is some room to trim.
[12:30] But I don't see us and nor would I recommend that we exceed that amount.
[12:36] Another question about the, we discussed adding a member of sort of a third member to their team.
[12:45] the guy, I forget his name, senior fellow at the Brookings Institute, a real thought leader
[12:52] in urban planning.
[12:52] Yes, he's part of that.
[12:54] Yes.
[12:55] He is part of that.
[12:56] That will ultimately be part of the same team.
[12:59] And they're under the umbrella of Prancing Engineering, Urban Partners, and then the
[13:03] Jaeger group.
[13:04] Right.
[13:06] Great.
[13:06] Because I think it's a really fantastic team, and I can tell you from having sat
[13:10] in all the interviews for that team that was chosen.
[13:17] They've got a tremendous wealth of experience and in their proposal,
[13:24] they have a step-by-step sequence of all of the stages that they'll be going through
[13:29] in this process of developing essentially a master plan for the Beaverd Highway corridor improvement.
[13:36] So I don't know if we have that document, their proposal, public on the website yet,
[13:42] or I don't know if the council has it.
[13:45] But it may be something that we can do.
[13:48] I'm happy to provide that.
[13:50] In those documents, we had nine vendors submit proposals to us,
[13:54] and some of the council members picked those up, had copies of them and reviewed,
[13:58] and I got some input from some of you all.
[14:00] The last thing I do want to say about it is that this is a time sensitive issue and some
[14:07] of the issues that we face, even on the zoning decisions we make up here, we're flying by
[14:13] the seat of our pants in some of the decisions and not having a well thought out plan before
[14:19] us.
[14:20] This process will take, what, four months to develop the results.
[14:25] the sooner we can get started on it the better and that's why I'd urge moving
[14:31] forward and giving authority to the mayor and Maureen to execute this
[14:37] contract when it's finalized because we are going to have redevelopment
[14:42] opportunities that we're going to have to deal with on Beaverd Highway as part
[14:46] of this apartment inspections program and the sooner we have a plan to have
[14:53] a well thought out vision for what, you know, how we make the best, highest and best use
[14:58] on Beaver to Hire.
[15:00] By the way, the better will be.
[15:02] Jim, do you have any more questions about that or any comment about that?
[15:05] No, I just, I guess conceptually, and whether it's this or other, I just, I still have a problem approving things that aren't fully feted and fully, the contract hadn't been finalized and for council to approve something that is not full and complete is an issue with me.
[15:26] Well, I think I guess that we kind of trust our city manager to vet.
[15:32] I mean, if I'm wrong here, we'll make sure.
[15:35] But if we kind of give a general instruction and then we trust Marie to do what she does,
[15:42] I think that's what we should do.
[15:46] When do you think you will have the final contract?
[15:52] Well, it's not so much the final contract,
[15:54] The final contract will rest with our city attorney.
[15:56] It's the dollar amount.
[15:58] All of the deliverables are met.
[15:59] Susan and I have already met with the team
[16:01] to go over the meetings that they're going to have,
[16:04] the engagement process,
[16:06] and what deliverables will be completed
[16:08] in the 16-week period,
[16:11] and even leading that to when we'll start holding
[16:13] public hearings for the Planning Commission,
[16:15] for the Council, to the point of adoption.
[16:18] It's really down to the final number.
[16:21] And once I get to that final number,
[16:23] which will either be by the end of this week
[16:25] or Monday or Tuesday, no later than,
[16:27] because I need to include it in the budget.
[16:29] And that's my issue.
[16:31] I have $121,000 in the budget.
[16:33] I think that we can get it for less.
[16:35] And I think there are ways to trim down that amount
[16:38] without diminishing the end product.
[16:41] Once I get that final number, it's a phone call to Tom
[16:46] and it's to transmit their customary contract
[16:49] that they use and for him to take a look at it.
[16:52] And so, you know, a week, 10 days, maybe at the most, if it's that long, I mean, I'm
[16:57] certain there would be communication back before between him and their attorney.
[17:01] If they're proposing their form of agreement, then the review would be within a week and
[17:12] possibly quicker than that.
[17:13] So you're just wanting approval so that that can happen quickly.
[17:16] So 121 is the cap?
[17:17] It's the cap.
[17:18] I don't want it to exceed that.
[17:19] That's what they're at right now.
[17:21] Susan and I have both looked at it. I do think that there's a way to come down on that.
[17:26] And frankly, if it's $80,000 or $121,000, the requirements are that they must provide each of those deliverables that I've just reviewed.
[17:38] There is no out on that, or otherwise we need to go to another firm.
[17:42] Which is the firm that we're in charge of?
[17:44] The Yeager Group, who is in partnership with Urban Partners, as well as Cranston Engineering.
[17:51] Cranston Engineering has a very minor role.
[17:54] It's examining the Buford Highway improvements, but the Cranston, excuse me, Urban Partners
[18:02] is really going to be doing the market analysis and the study of who do we get, what should
[18:07] be the incentives or the listing of the types of incentives.
[18:10] I mean, ultimately, you all have to make those decisions and recommendations will come from the development authority.
[18:17] This is just a valuable tool for them to go out and recruit.
[18:20] And to be able to say when XYZ Corporation comes and looks for bond inducement that this is what we're expecting.
[18:27] And it's not just what we're giving away.
[18:29] Part of this plan on our side will be here are the thresholds you have to meet.
[18:33] You have to create jobs to get this amount of bond inducement.
[18:37] You have to retain these kind of jobs.
[18:38] if you, you know, expect to receive any other improvements or assistance.
[18:43] So it really will be almost like a business plan model for us to use to promote Buford Highway.
[18:50] And I think it will give us a great step forward as we look at promoting other parts of the city,
[18:56] because we'll have the outline to do that. We'll just have to tweak it depending on if it's North Jewett Hills
[19:03] or it's Ashford Dunwoody or it's Peachtree Road.
[19:06] I mean, we'll have a good exercise in establishing what that framework should be.
[19:12] The list of deliverables that you just read off.
[19:15] And you said you've talked about a list of meetings and process.
[19:20] Is that in writing somewhere that we could get copies of that?
[19:23] Yes, it's still in a draft form because we're going through that.
[19:26] I mean, I'm happy to supply it to you.
[19:29] But until we are really confident of what the meetings are,
[19:35] because each meeting has a certain price to it.
[19:37] And I think what we can do is we can collapse some of those meetings
[19:40] and still achieve the same outcome.
[19:43] I mean, I share some of Jim's concern of just signing off
[19:47] on $120,000 without having something more
[19:50] in writing in front of me.
[19:51] But I like what I hear.
[19:54] I hear the need to go forward on this.
[19:59] I just want to make sure that we've vetted it as much as we possibly can.
[20:05] We trust you to carry this ball forward, but it's $120,000.
[20:10] It is, and the budget that I have budgeted is anywhere from $100,000 to $105,000,
[20:16] so we're looking at ways to trim that.
[20:21] Did I hear that Chris Leinberg is going to be part of that team?
[20:26] He is going to be a consultant to them.
[20:28] To Jager.
[20:29] Right.
[20:29] But you're not going to see a lot of him.
[20:32] It's really internal to their operation of what they'll solicit from him and review
[20:37] and suggestions.
[20:41] All right.
[20:43] Go ahead.
[20:44] Well, I guess what I'd ask though is if we can, and again this is a question
[20:50] in the council really procedurally when we get into the meeting, but we can pull this
[20:54] off the consent agenda and add it to the regular so that we can change and add the cap that
[20:59] City Manager, so that what we approve does have a price tag attached to it rather than
[21:03] just a general approval as it's written in the consent agreement.
[21:09] Yeah, I like that.
[21:10] That's fine.
[21:11] Okay.
[21:12] I like that.
[21:13] Just make that motion when we get there.
[21:16] All right, next.
[21:18] Okay.
[21:18] That is the council agenda, and then we'll go over to the work session agenda, beginning with item E, an update on sidewalks and council districts.
[21:32] I will be sending to you a list of sidewalks. Well, first of all, let me back up. You'll remember when we had amended the budget.
[21:41] I guess six weeks ago now maybe we're in the next budget season so I'm trying to
[21:49] remember when that was but sometime in the last within the last two months in
[21:54] that I included funds for sidewalks $400,000 and that includes enough
[22:03] funding to provide a thousand feet of sidewalk improvements in each of your
[22:08] districts and then the mayor also has funding that is available to him
[22:13] whether to provide yet a new connection of sidewalk or to piggyback off of perhaps one
[22:18] of your projects.
[22:20] I have been working with the Public Works Director and as you know when we were doing
[22:25] the laser truck and looking at all street improvements and the conditions of those roads,
[22:30] he also launched a review of all the sidewalks and the conditions thereof and he has a
[22:35] grading system.
[22:39] Many of the sidewalks that are on that list that have, in his opinion, a sense of urgency that we can connect the dots,
[22:46] or that there's a lot of foot traffic in particular areas that we should create a sidewalk.
[22:52] He has listed those, and I want to send those out to you all so that it might give you a good idea not to keep you within the bounds of that list
[23:01] because you know your district's better than anybody as to perhaps there might be a better location for a sidewalk.
[23:08] What we're looking at, and I'll just give you an example, I went out to Jim's district
[23:14] and we looked at a segment where it will connect two streets.
[23:21] And this particular sidewalk because of the shoulders that are there will require very little work from the standpoint of engineering.
[23:31] It can almost just be, you know, footings dug out and, you know, bring the concrete and pour it and go.
[23:37] So that's what we're looking for because we don't want to get into a lot of heavy design because that will hold up the project.
[23:44] The reason behind the funding in the amended budget was to allow you to have some visible impact this year.
[23:50] We'd like to make it before Christmas. At least it's going to be well underway at Christmas.
[23:55] And so when you see the rankings of this list that I'll send to you for just your review and consideration,
[24:05] it will show, you know, how many feet are there and what the estimated cost is.
[24:12] Is this a new sidewalk?
[24:13] This would be like a new sidewalk.
[24:15] It could be repairs.
[24:16] Again, it's up to each of you on what you would like to do, but what you're finding.
[24:20] So what makes this, is there already a separate budget for repair of sidewalks?
[24:25] Yes, we have that.
[24:26] And we're adding to that also for the 2014.
[24:30] This is just a one-time deal that we wanted to do something to give something back to
[24:36] the public through the host tax dollars, and it is permissible under the requirements
[24:41] of host and its infrastructures improvement.
[24:43] So we thought we could get out very quick, very early, and have some demonstration of work being done.
[24:51] And to be able to provide you a way to answer, I know, the calls and requests that you get from your constituents
[24:56] on what about this missing gap? It doesn't have to be a missing gap.
[25:00] It could be an extension of what's already there.
[25:03] And maybe we create yet a missing, you know, another gap by the extension of a sidewalk,
[25:08] but that's good too because it'll fit into our plan for improvements.
[25:12] I'd like to see this as, and you'll see it in the 2014 budget, I'd like to see this as
[25:18] a customary budgeted item that gives you the ability to do something in your particular
[25:24] districts as we do something, you know, city-wide.
[25:27] So we're really excited about it.
[25:29] What we're going to do is have a bid process that will be on a per-unit basis.
[25:36] We were looking at a lump sum, you know, just X thousand a feet of sidewalk.
[25:40] What width?
[25:42] We're looking at a minimum of five feet, but again, it just depends on where your sidewalk improvement will be.
[25:48] In Jim's district, and he and I have not talked about this, but when I went down the hill looking at it more closely,
[25:55] we've got a catch base in top that we've got to address, but good news is that's just the top.
[26:00] We don't have to fool around with the basin itself.
[26:03] But it might be a few of those things.
[26:05] Another example in his area, there is a very short stretch where we'll probably have to put a retaining wall in
[26:10] in some handrails, but the majority of that area, and just again to give you an example,
[26:16] it doesn't have to fit within your guidelines for your particular district, but his is literally
[26:22] digging out six inches, forming it and pouring, I mean, and that is a few days project, I
[26:31] mean.
[26:31] Which is why I drugged you over there to look at it, and thank you for taking the
[26:35] time.
[26:35] Yeah.
[26:36] Have we already bid it?
[26:37] I mean, so that once the list is approved, we can begin construction, or are we going to?
[26:41] Where are we with the contractor?
[26:41] Well, what we're trying to do, Richard is just waiting.
[26:45] Is he here?
[26:45] I'm here.
[26:46] There you go.
[26:47] As any engineer, he's very eager to get started,
[26:52] and he has his priority listing, but he understands that this is your priority.
[26:57] And we will bid these out.
[26:59] How we package them depends on the sections,
[27:02] and whether we are going to need some level of plans or details,
[27:06] but also, you know, the preference would be to unicost bitum, you know, per cubic yard of concrete,
[27:14] or square yard of concrete, linear foot of handrail.
[27:17] So, curb and gutter, those kind of things we have to look at to see when we, in each of these sections,
[27:24] you know, like in the section she's talking about with yours, we don't need to do curb and gutter,
[27:29] but we probably need to do handrail.
[27:31] You know, erosion control items are a thing we still have to follow erosion control guidelines,
[27:36] you know, grassing, even just the cost for grassing afterwards, things like that.
[27:42] There's lots of free pines for author. You can reuse some of that.
[27:45] Yeah. So those are things, you know, the ideal would be to do more of a unit cost,
[27:50] that way if we're only paying for what we actually put in and do some estimates.
[27:56] Do you have your list up and can you meet with Council beginning when?
[28:00] I'm available. I've been, I think Marie has asked you all to get with me,
[28:05] and so I know my calendar, both tomorrow and Thursday, is pretty wide open as far as if,
[28:12] you know, and I think she's directed that it's okay to meet with me on this issue.
[28:17] Council, I would strongly encourage you to meet as soon as you can,
[28:20] because it's November, weather changes, and it's going to take a little bit of time,
[28:24] So we want this in by the end of the year, which I do, you know, I'd like to see this
[28:30] White new concrete in throughout the city by the end of the year
[28:34] Please take it the time this week or early next week to get with Richard so that we can come up with a final
[28:40] List and he can do what he needs to get it installed because it it's a relatively easy project
[28:44] But it's not going to happen overnight just simply because of the hoops that we have to jump through to get it done
[28:48] Richard, your report on the sidewalks just to clarify, it shows the status of the condition as they stand today plus where the gaps are.
[28:59] Mainly this list that she has is mainly the gaps. I mean, there's a couple on them where when we did it, we just kind of listed like Dresden and Northford are the two where we just said general sidewalk repairs.
[29:10] but I was focusing more on new sidewalks, so most of the detailed ones on the list
[29:16] are where there's gaps in the sidewalk anywhere from 400 to 1,000 foot.
[29:22] Try to pick ones that were things that could be relatively easy to build,
[29:27] although there are some really difficult ones that are going to need some real detailed
[29:32] survey and engineering in order to build those segments.
[29:37] But in those are reflected somewhat in the cost too.
[29:40] When you see the costs, I kind of took a stab as,
[29:44] okay, this one's going to need a little bit more work,
[29:46] so I'm going to bump the cost up a little bit on that.
[29:49] So when you divide it out on a cost per foot or cost per 1,000 foot,
[29:53] you're going to get a higher cost per foot for some of those.
[29:57] So this list is where?
[29:58] Thank you.
[29:59] Thank you.
[30:00] I have it. I'm going to send it.
[30:00] The city manager will send that to you.
[30:02] Tonight.
[30:03] Tonight. Okay, great. Thanks.
[30:05] Richard, is there a standard for the entire city that we can look at for what the handrails
[30:13] would look like, and sometimes concrete has a gray shade to it, or is there some more
[30:20] we can…
[30:20] The simple detail would be used, what a Georgia DOT detail for a handrail is, which is a kind
[30:27] of a, I guess, steel.
[30:30] It's an inch and a half, two line pipe rail.
[30:32] It's basically pipe rail, which I guess is about four foot high, and it's got a pipe rail
[30:38] in the middle, and it's got, I think, I can't remember, it's like four to five foot
[30:41] post every four to five feet.
[30:43] That's kind of the standard for just a kind of standard generic hand rail,
[30:47] and that's usually like aluminum.
[30:50] The kind of aluminum steel, the gray coating of it.
[30:52] I mean, if we wanted, there are other places that get, and of course it gets into a cost
[30:57] thing where you get into, you can spec that if you wanted green or black instead of the,
[31:05] you know, where they can do that, obviously there's going to be a more expensive cost.
[31:09] We haven't developed a standard.
[31:10] I mean, you know, some of this is going to depend on what the costs we can adhere
[31:17] to.
[31:17] And we only have to put handrail in where the slope drops off right behind the sidewalk.
[31:21] We do have to put the handrail in that is going to be a requirement.
[31:24] I don't think there's going to be a lot of handrail or Brooklyn,
[31:27] but I'd like to see what the options are.
[31:31] If there's something that's a little better,
[31:32] or they're nicer looking and more aesthetically pleasing
[31:34] just to see what the cost benefit would be.
[31:37] We could do that.
[31:39] I knew we had to put handrail in.
[31:41] I hadn't gotten into some of those details yet as far as that goes.
[31:45] We want to be sensitive too as to where the sidewalk is.
[31:49] if there's already some kind of decorative finishes or we want to mimic that and repeat
[31:54] that we don't want to come in with something that's so different.
[31:58] Where Jim is on his project, that railing will be perfect, it'll fit perfectly in the environment
[32:05] and what's so nice there we're not going to have to ask for slope easements from anybody
[32:09] because it's ours.
[32:11] It's cheap and easy.
[32:13] What road is it?
[32:14] Byrdwood Way.
[32:17] Richard, do I understand that the sidewalk survey map is in fact on our GIS system?
[32:23] The existing sidewalk, there is a layer where all the existing sidewalk is shown on our GIS.
[32:29] And so you can pull that up and look at, it will tell you where there's existing sidewalks.
[32:35] And that was how one of the ways we used to identify where the gaps are,
[32:38] because you can easily see if you're going along.
[32:40] And mainly I looked at the more, obviously more major roads in the city,
[32:46] not getting into the neighborhoods that much with that list
[32:50] and to kind of fill the gaps on the main roads of the city.
[32:54] But where that is shown, there is a layer that you can pull into the GIS map that is the sidewalks.
[33:00] And that covers from your survey?
[33:03] Yes, from our surveys, yes.
[33:04] Is there a weather aspect to, is there a temperature cutoff of how we can pork?
[33:14] What temperature?
[33:15] For concrete, you got a lot more leeway with concrete.
[33:19] You know, yes, if we had, if our highs were only getting into the 30s,
[33:23] it would be, which is not that common here.
[33:26] We can do sidewalk construction in the wintertime because it's the,
[33:34] Stained rain periods makes it difficult with the cutting grating or I think but sporadic
[33:38] rain.
[33:38] You can even pour concrete relatively easily in the rain too.
[33:41] So we're not as sensitive to weather in the wintertime with sidewalks as we are with, say,
[33:48] resurfacing.
[33:49] Great.
[33:51] What about crosswalks as a part of this?
[33:55] Is that not a part of this?
[33:56] My intent is to include where the sidewalk segments touch existing roads and crosswalks
[34:05] crossings is to also include ADA upgrades on all the corners that affected and crosswalk
[34:12] striping, upgraded crosswalk striping on all the crosswalks for all the corners, all the
[34:17] legs that touched you.
[34:18] So if we did an intersection, for example, one of the ones on the list that I have is
[34:24] North Druid Hills in front of Crosskeys High School.
[34:26] That touches the intersection with North Druid in Curtis and North Druid with North
[34:31] Cliff Valley.
[34:32] the intent would be on all four corners of those intersections to upgrade the ADA
[34:37] and upgrade the crosswalks while we're doing this.
[34:41] What about a little bit out of the purview of this, but my intent has come back to you on the Woodward Elementary School,
[34:48] and we also need flashing lights for notification of crosswalks right by the sidewalks,
[34:54] and as well as maybe a ribbed road around the curb to alert drivers,
[35:00] you know, there's a dangerous curve.
[35:02] That's kind of what I was interested in, you know, enhancing the crosswalks we have,
[35:06] or, you know, where is that? Is this in the same?
[35:10] How about if we just use these funds to maybe do a project that if the cross is over?
[35:13] Correct.
[35:14] Yeah, we could look at...
[35:15] I'm sorry, you're allotted a certain amount per year district, so if it can capture
[35:21] that, then absolutely we can do that turnkey.
[35:25] The mayor also has funds, and he is going to select an area for himself, but if there's any money left over, those monies then could be made available to, you know, in working together.
[35:38] We're hoping that perhaps where your district ends or sidewalk ends, that maybe there is cooperation to pick it up and continue it on so it becomes a longer segment.
[35:48] And there are some opportunities on the list to do that,
[35:53] especially where you share borders.
[35:55] You know, the road, you might be able to get a lot of bang out of the buck there.
[36:00] So that's why we'd like to sit down with you and go over that
[36:03] and happy to go out and walk it and take a look at it.
[36:07] Well, the mayor's already told me I'm his favorite councilman,
[36:10] so I'm putting my jibbies on that money.
[36:17] What about the park funds?
[36:21] The park funds are also, that was part of the amended budget, so there's a difference between that and what we're doing for 2014.
[36:30] There's $200,000 in that, and that is set up so that you and I will review any request for funding.
[36:40] And I'll give you a little bit of history of why that's being set up that way.
[36:46] In talking with a couple of the friends of certain parks in the community in the past,
[36:51] they've been accustomed to filing park pride applications or filing to the county for assistance.
[36:58] And there was a gate fee to be able to belong to park pride,
[37:03] but there's no guarantee if you pay that fee that you will even be considered for an application.
[37:09] And I felt that going through that exercise for the community and not having assurances
[37:16] that they would even receive anything, and of course the gate fee would have to be paid by the city,
[37:21] which I think was $15,000, wouldn't that money be better served in making an improvement
[37:27] in a park that the community could enjoy?
[37:30] So in talking with these, there's a couple of different friends groups that were preparing themselves to make applications.
[37:37] They have continued that and are readying that to submit to the city, along with your suggestions as well of what you want to do.
[37:46] And then we'll review that and then make a determination on where we can not only afford that improvement,
[37:54] but how quickly can we see it come out of the ground so that the community can enjoy it.
[37:58] And that's another recurring fee that I hope the finance director is listening that I want to build on each year
[38:04] so that we'll have our own park improvements, our own capital improvement plan that will
[38:08] get out of the Parks and Recreation Master Plan, but I still want to set up a separate
[38:12] fund where we can launch quick projects.
[38:15] The community can see them quickly and be able to enjoy them in a short order.
[38:20] Well, we need to know from some of the friends groups or what areas in their parks they'd
[38:27] like to see.
[38:27] I know some of us have been looking at parks.
[38:29] I've been asking around and Murphy-Kammer for both the athletic and the natural
[38:32] side and I've gotten a few ideas and I know there's obviously a lot of activity at Broward
[38:37] Park.
[38:37] I'm sure there's some stuff at Ashford Park and Blackburn, but we need to know.
[38:41] So we've got a council that's got to start asking around too.
[38:45] Have you been asking anybody about just the $10,000 or $15,000 project that we can
[38:50] The concern I have is there has been discussion among some of the friends groups or just
[38:54] park people of like painting a pavilion or repairing some things and it seems to
[38:59] That's the kind of thing the city really ought to be doing or might come on you know
[39:04] We'll eventually we might even replace some of those pavilions that are rotten and whatever
[39:08] So I almost hate to encourage them to spend their money on something like that
[39:13] So I would hope that we would well what I've been asking is
[39:17] identify a project that we can match funds with y'all on and
[39:23] Then we'll see if we can move forward
[39:25] but I just don't want to make an improvement to a park
[39:28] that really nobody cares about or wants.
[39:29] And I want the neighbors to kind of tell us
[39:32] what they want to see or what project they can,
[39:34] and it doesn't have to be a master plan.
[39:36] I was just going to say, we've got to be careful
[39:38] that we don't do something that's going to be
[39:42] in contradiction to what that master plan
[39:45] is going to show and what those capital improvements are.
[39:48] Well, this money's got to be spent this year though,
[39:49] right?
[39:50] Right.
[39:50] I don't want to carry that over.
[39:52] I'd like to see some improvements this year.
[39:54] And again, the whole thing.
[39:55] So if we don't have a master plan yet,
[39:57] I mean, there gotta be some things
[39:58] that can improve the parks in a basic manner that people.
[40:02] Well, you know, there's some examples of taking down
[40:07] the razor wire on a fence and making some improvements
[40:11] or creating more of an improved gateway or an entrance.
[40:15] It could also be, you know, dressing up
[40:19] some of the playground equipment that, you know,
[40:21] something that's already there that needs to be replaced
[40:23] that would not be out of character to what could come about through the engagement of the community
[40:30] and creating this master plan. So it's those sorts of things.
[40:34] Rebecca's right. You don't want to go in and fix a pavilion that really should be torn down,
[40:39] but you might want to replace it.
[40:40] Or you could use some of Prasidwax in a park.
[40:42] You could use Prasidwax. Or replacing batting cages.
[40:46] Or trails.
[40:46] There are lots of things that can be done with the funds,
[40:49] And it doesn't necessarily have to be depending on I guess of course on the project size and again. This is limited money
[40:56] So it's not a lot, but it doesn't necessarily have to be a project that requires a match
[41:01] It could be a $15,000 project and we could handle that what what amount of money are we talking about I have
[41:08] 200,000 I wonder if it would be helpful if we would
[41:12] identify just like you said the razor wire or some other projects that
[41:17] we can suggest to them because they may not be thinking along the same lines as we are
[41:22] so that we don't do all the things we just talked about.
[41:26] Right, exactly. And I'd like to solicit that from you all.
[41:30] Mr. Gebbia doesn't have a park in his district, but there are some efforts.
[41:35] Maybe there's a derelict house that's for sale for $15,000 that can tear down and make an acre park.
[41:40] We know a lot that we'd like to get.
[41:42] How much is it? Let's see how much it is.
[41:43] Well, it begs the question.
[41:48] Can you give me any update on where we stand with the Cap County School Board in trying to do a land grant and share?
[41:54] Because once that's done, I'm not going to have any trouble spending any of that money.
[41:58] I will tell you, I did have a meeting with them last week and they were not as cooperative as I had hoped.
[42:09] They basically requested that they get a full plan on what exactly we intend to do.
[42:17] When I asked for copies of the site plan they said they were available down the hall
[42:21] but they didn't know if the guy was available to provide them.
[42:26] So where I am right now is they said that this would have to travel all the way
[42:31] to the school board for final approval.
[42:34] What I want to be careful of, especially in your district, there was mention made that
[42:39] there are splaus funds that they're intending to use.
[42:42] And I said, well, I'd like the list of the capital improvements that you're planning
[42:45] to make.
[42:45] And they suggested that we visit the website to look at that.
[42:50] So what really needs to happen is you and I need to sit down with the principals
[42:54] and find out what's going on there.
[42:57] The school, according to them, is heavily used, but there was no familiarity with
[43:04] where it was. So there's a lot of opportunity there. I think what we need to do is I do want to
[43:15] contact Mr. Thurman's office so that he understands that there's a level of seriousness from us
[43:21] that we'd like to do something, but there needs to be a conversation with the principals.
[43:27] I'd like to get Marshall involved in this too.
[43:29] We can do that.
[43:29] You all know what we're talking about here?
[43:31] No.
[43:31] Well, the idea is to do a land share agreement between City of Brookhaven and DeKalb County
[43:39] School where the city would have the right to use the land on Cross Keys High School
[43:44] as a park during the weekends.
[43:46] And then that would allow us to make necessary improvements in the park for a situation that
[43:53] you're talking about.
[43:54] You're talking about the athletic fields behind the screen.
[43:56] I'm talking about the athletic field.
[43:58] We're talking about everything.
[43:59] Lighting, track, putting in, you know, preparing the field for soccer play, things that, you know, for weekend use.
[44:10] Is the why not participating? Didn't they have a program where they were...
[44:14] No, I think that was turned over to Crossfire, wasn't it?
[44:17] Crossfire? Was it at a concord?
[44:19] A concord, yeah.
[44:20] A concord. And they were actually handed the baseball field if I'm not mistaken, which was down the road from Woodward off of Curtis.
[44:28] But, you know, we're in a dire situation with no funding at all being put into that school for the most part.
[44:34] So this was a good way to not only bring it to the community and allow it to be used as a park,
[44:39] which would be the first park in the fourth district.
[44:42] But at the same time, we could be making some very valuable improvements
[44:45] that would not only benefit the residents from a park standpoint,
[44:48] but also the students from a school standpoint.
[44:50] They'd have a double whammy.
[44:53] Is it just the sacrophil, the athletic field behind cross keys that you're talking about?
[45:00] As I envision it right now, it could also include that I need to get a further understanding of what's going on with that baseball field.
[45:07] Because that could be a key area for activity.
[45:11] But Murray, we will talk on this. I would like to work with you putting that proposal together, finalizing it,
[45:18] and also working with the school to find out what kind of commitment they have for those on weekends.
[45:22] I don't see anything ever really going on there when I go by.
[45:25] I need to get superintendent Thurman.
[45:28] I wouldn't, I would, I'd go, like, have a marshal,
[45:30] but I don't have the superintendent.
[45:32] Yeah, and that's, well, that's where I started
[45:33] and then was directed from his office.
[45:36] Yeah, go back up.
[45:37] Exactly, that's what I was just telling the city attorney.
[45:39] It was a courtesy call.
[45:40] And so I'll go back to that.
[45:43] But just for the record, you know,
[45:48] what we're talking about is a joint use agreement,
[45:50] but it is not for a fixed term.
[45:53] It is for in perpetuity is what we're talking about city of Roswell does a great job doing that with their schools
[45:59] In fact, they do a fabulous job
[46:02] With that and really have set the example and I explained that to this group that I was talking to that
[46:07] That's what we're trying to do is to enhance and be able to use
[46:10] They're more accustomed to dealing with the YMCA on a one-year
[46:14] fixed-term
[46:16] Agreement that you come in and you provide soccer and that's just what they understand learning curve for everybody
[46:23] So, you know, in fairness to them, we want to give them an opportunity to benefit from
[46:27] our interest in doing something there.
[46:30] But we do need to be wise to what their splossed intentions are because we don't want to provide
[46:36] something that the citizens are already paying for, that they need to perform and where
[46:40] we can enhance that.
[46:41] We certainly can and how we can make improvements that everybody can benefit from.
[46:48] I saw a post on the Brookhaven Post about basketball leagues at Linnwood Park.
[46:57] Is that something that Eric knows about?
[46:59] Yes.
[46:59] It is, okay.
[47:00] Yes.
[47:02] All right.
[47:02] And I guess I'd like to get with Eric about maybe some things he sees that I'd like to do in concert with him.
[47:10] Because we have $200,000 and although it's not a lot of money, it's more than they've been having in the past.
[47:15] and you know with 11 parks you know we could probably do something in every park
[47:20] or a little bit more than some of the bigger ones I just think that they all
[47:22] need to be addressed and there's got to be some desire some ideas from some of
[47:28] the communities that surround these parks hey we'd like a water fountain or
[47:31] like a bathroom or we'd like a you know a fence something I just but we have to
[47:37] know that now we need to know it quickly just like the sidewalk program
[47:39] right so I can tell you that the Murphy Candler Conservancy one of
[47:45] the first things they did was put out a poll and asked people what they thought was needed
[47:51] in Murphy Candler.
[47:52] And so they've actually collected some pretty good numbers.
[47:55] And I was interested in the fact that, besides the erosion on the lake, which is a constant
[48:00] concern probably way outside the purview of this, there's no bathrooms on the west
[48:05] side of the lake.
[48:06] And in fact, if you have an event over in one of those pavilions, you have to
[48:10] agree to rent a Porta John or something.
[48:13] So it could be that maybe even something like that.
[48:17] Of course that might be more expensive than we can afford when she gets into plumbing and sewers and stuff.
[48:22] But I know for sure that they've done an assessment.
[48:26] Yeah, I'd love to see that.
[48:28] Definitely.
[48:29] Because time is of the essence here.
[48:32] Do you have anything?
[48:34] Yeah.
[48:34] Do we have an electronic PDF copy of the Governors' Commission report on parks and recreation?
[48:44] I don't think so.
[48:46] I've emailed one of there.
[48:51] You've got the report on your website?
[48:54] Great.
[48:55] On your website?
[48:56] Great.
[48:58] I think that the way to go would be on the spot.
[49:03] The reason is that I...
[49:04] Trace, speak into the mic, please.
[49:08] The reason is that I know a lot of those things were part of the discussions and that you've
[49:15] got a lot of active citizens who thought and got very engaged in that process while we
[49:21] were all knocking on doors.
[49:23] These particular, you know, and that reports all the parts of REC people putting forth
[49:28] their ideas.
[49:29] So it'd be a good starting point for us to look at.
[49:31] And the second thing is that as we as we move down the path as a city to get to this point where we're, you know,
[49:40] reinvesting into the taxpayers money into their own city and choosing the areas for sidewalks and parks improvements,
[49:48] I'd like the communications department to consider as the website's redeveloped.
[49:55] Just one of the things that we've talked about is figuring out a way that we can have an electronic
[50:01] dashboard through our website that actually provides an opportunity for citizens to sort
[50:09] of give those opinion polls, you know, how do you think we're doing as a city, what, you
[50:16] know, maybe we pop up different surveys that we can sort of train our citizens that
[50:23] This is a good, easy point to go to for our city to provide feedback to us that allows
[50:29] us to make better decisions.
[50:32] Just I know in the website redevelopment I think it would be nice for them to have that
[50:38] consideration back there.
[50:39] I think that's a good idea and something that we'll want to solicit.
[50:45] We need to provide all sorts of venues for the community to make comment and we're
[50:52] We're getting ready to launch now four plans, and we're going to be engaging the community.
[50:57] But it needs to be more of an outreach than just come to this meeting.
[51:01] If you can't, we still want to hear from you, and maybe that is the vehicle that they
[51:05] do it through.
[51:06] Right.
[51:07] Here's where we are, almost like chapters, if you will.
[51:09] This is the chapter we're on and what we're doing now in the comp plan or the
[51:13] rec plan or the transportation plan and get some of that input.
[51:18] But my biggest concern is, and it's not a lot of money, $200,000, I think the criteria
[51:25] should be what is the quickest and most visible impact and usage that the community can receive
[51:31] out of this improvement without taking away from the efforts of the committees that launched
[51:36] the survey of recreational needs and be able to engage the public again.
[51:43] And now that they're here a year with us too as city residents, and what do they see and
[51:49] what would they like?
[51:50] So, you know, the goal is, I think, you know, and if we can just be a little bit patient
[51:55] on this, I think what we can see is you'll see a quicker launch of the sidewalks.
[52:01] But we, and completing those sidewalks, we have the ability to complete many of,
[52:06] you know, the sidewalks that you'll be coming up with, hopefully we'll be able
[52:10] to complete some of the park improvements.
[52:14] But the goal is to have every one of them
[52:16] under construction in some way or form
[52:18] so that we can see that.
[52:20] And hopefully if we make it to the end of the year
[52:21] with all of them, that's certainly
[52:24] that's going to be the priority.
[52:25] But some of them may be a little bit larger
[52:27] and they may carry over a few more months,
[52:30] but they'll be funded out of the 2013 budget.
[52:34] So that's it.
[52:35] So speaking of visible improvements,
[52:36] Where are we on signage for the city?
[52:41] Signage on the city is being worked on between communications and public works.
[52:46] The roadworks group is, is it roadworks that's doing it or who's the fabricator?
[52:51] Roadworks we're in the fabricator but we're still working on designs.
[52:56] And those designs are going to come back before the council to take a look at
[53:00] and we'll bring those back in a work session so you all can see what's the time frame on that.
[53:06] Are we talking about in the next Council meeting or when?
[53:09] You should be about the next Council meeting.
[53:10] Okay.
[53:10] Okay.
[53:12] Okay.
[53:13] Okay.
[53:14] Great.
[53:15] All right.
[53:15] Thank you.
[53:16] Next.
[53:17] Okay.
[53:17] Update on the budget process.
[53:19] You all are going to be experts by the end of this year.
[53:22] All right.
[53:23] Okay.
[53:24] This is your third go at it.
[53:26] And I'm excited about what the 2014 numbers are looking like.
[53:32] This report is not to go into the details of the numbers right now, but just to go through the process for you.
[53:38] I would like to set up many times with each of you if you could plan from 45 minutes to an hour so that I can sit down, go over the budget.
[53:46] It is still a work in progress.
[53:49] I do want to come back to you all, and I haven't even discussed it yet with our city attorney.
[53:56] early on in the formation of the city there were a number of policies and
[54:00] ordinances that were being presented, many in bulk.
[54:05] And one of them was the requirement that the budget be provided
[54:12] and made available to the public 60 days prior to the adoption date.
[54:16] Well that makes it a little difficult, especially our fiscal year is
[54:20] January to December, you know revenues are starting to come in
[54:24] with tax dollars, host is always a moving target and so we're trying to get our numbers
[54:29] on that and we also have vendors and their contracts parallel the city's fiscal year
[54:35] and so that requires negotiating or rebidding.
[54:39] So with all that said I'd like to come back very soon with an ordinance because it was
[54:45] adopted.
[54:45] I thought it was a policy but it was an ordinance that requires a 60-day notice
[54:50] and that is in conflict with your charter.
[54:52] The Charter says it has to be presented 30 days prior to the adoption.
[54:56] So I would like to go back and not during this process because we're going to follow
[55:00] the process that we've established.
[55:03] But for next year, I want to be sure we've got more time to be able to look at some
[55:08] of the numbers that have been moving targets.
[55:10] So we'll be coming back, I hope that we can do that in November.
[55:14] That's my plan and that will be for the 2015 budget cycle.
[55:19] However, getting back to where we are right now for 2014.
[55:23] We have scheduled November the 12th and the 26th as public hearings.
[55:29] That will be your council dates, your regular scheduled council meeting,
[55:32] so we'll have a separate public hearing to go over the budget.
[55:36] We are looking very good.
[55:38] In fact, we're just a little bit higher.
[55:39] We've exceeded what the Carl Vinson Institute expected and projected for funds coming in.
[55:44] We have a lot of expenses too.
[55:48] So we will hear that twice in public hearings, and then on December the 10th will be your decision date,
[55:57] and that is also a council hearing date, so we'll have that as an agenda item.
[56:01] If you feel like we need a third public hearing, we can do it on that night and then move forward to adopt the budget.
[56:09] So I will be reaching out to you all to sit down and meet with you.
[56:14] you all have Bonnie with me so that we can go through the numbers, tell you the origin
[56:18] of the numbers, what our expectations are. I will, and if you will be patient with me,
[56:24] the number on administrative services, which are the vendors, that's still a number that's
[56:31] being refined. I'm negotiating with the vendors now. I have one more, one left to
[56:36] do tomorrow. And then there's another round of meetings that I will have with
[56:42] them to fine-tune those numbers and hopefully we'll be able to do that in a negotiated setting
[56:50] versus bidding them out, but I am prepared to bid them out as well.
[56:55] So I'll go over in great detail what that is.
[56:58] I'll be talking to you about some of the expenditures that we're expecting in each
[57:04] of the departments.
[57:05] Some of the departments are growing and I'll explain to you why and what the
[57:09] reason behind that is and why the need is to have certain revenues in those departments.
[57:16] We're going to go over where your actual revenues are coming from and what we think for 2014,
[57:24] these are very conservative estimates.
[57:26] They could change.
[57:27] We're hoping they'll go up, but we're trying to at least come in with a figure.
[57:31] We have some confidence and so that's where we are and like I said, I'll be getting
[57:37] with you very soon to go over that, and you'll be getting updates as this gets refined so
[57:44] that one, you can have some input where you see some adjustments.
[57:48] I want to hear what that is, and then continue having some dialogue as we move through the
[57:55] process of these vendor agreements.
[57:58] That's one of the biggest matters that has to be addressed, and then finalized.
[58:03] I'm hopeful that within the next two weeks we'll have that finalized or I will inform
[58:10] you that we're bidding it out, whatever service that might be.
[58:17] Let me see if there's anything else I wanted to go over.
[58:20] So in two weeks you'll know if you're going to bid it out and then if you bid it out
[58:24] it's another 30-day process?
[58:25] Correct.
[58:26] Okay, so we'll be into December, minimally.
[58:30] Right.
[58:32] And that number will still be a floating number.
[58:35] Right, but I do know the worst case scenario.
[58:37] And that's what I've put in there, so it only can be improved upon.
[58:41] Is the worst case scenario based upon with the previous holder of that?
[58:44] Yes, with escalation numbers in it, which I'm not recommending approval on at all.
[58:50] So just as a guidance here, what is your drop-dead date for hopefully coming to a conclusion with all of the vendors?
[58:56] Well, I'm glad the vendors are here because they can hear this too.
[59:01] So we're all on the same page.
[59:03] My drop-dead date will
[59:15] be probably October the 30th.
[59:27] So let me make clear, when do you want to start meeting with us this next week?
[59:31] I would like to next week.
[59:32] Okay.
[59:32] I really would because there's a lot in here because as these numbers change I want
[59:36] you to recognize.
[59:38] I don't want the other stuff.
[59:38] Exactly.
[59:39] I want you to recognize that.
[59:40] So it might be, you know, we'll have our first initial meeting next week, but if you could be available to me during this process,
[59:48] because as these numbers change, I want to give you full explanations.
[59:52] So as your constituents ask, you have a full understanding of what that is.
[59:56] And there may be opportunities for yourself too, as we...
[1:00:00] Get through this a couple of times that maybe there are still a few questions and you certainly
[1:00:04] meet with Bonnie on that so that you can get some better answers. But, you know, the goal
[1:00:09] is for she and I to be sure you understand the origin of the revenues and the reason for
[1:00:15] the expenditures. And, you know, we're looking at creating a capital improvement plan. And
[1:00:20] remember, we're going to have for 2014 just thinking ahead when we get to mid-year
[1:00:27] budget adjustment, which we will do that early. We're going to do that in month six.
[1:00:33] So that way we can see a six-month history of activity and what we see moving forward
[1:00:40] to the end of the fiscal year. And then we're also going to be looking at, in that mid-year
[1:00:45] budget adjustment, creating a more firm and confident capital improvement plan because
[1:00:50] we'll have three of our plans completed by then. We'll have the Buford Highway
[1:00:54] improvement plan, the transportation plan, and the parks and recreation plan, all of
[1:00:59] which will have capital improvement elements to it in a short-term version as well as
[1:01:04] long-term planning purposes.
[1:01:08] As part of that budgeting cycle to get to the amendment to the mid-year budget adjustment,
[1:01:14] I want us to have a retreat before that time period so that you can hear from the
[1:01:20] the department has what's going on in their department so that you'll have some familiarity
[1:01:24] with some of the adjustments that we'll be proposing.
[1:01:30] So we adopt a budget once a year but we work on it every day constantly with certain demarcation
[1:01:38] points.
[1:01:41] Certainly it's nice to see a full year's budget.
[1:01:43] Yeah.
[1:01:44] Well, I tell you that number is asleep.
[1:01:46] With some predictability.
[1:01:47] Yeah, really.
[1:01:48] And I'm glad to hear that that's a conservative estimate on your part.
[1:01:52] How much is in this rough budget and for contingency?
[1:01:58] Currently we're at, we have a million in contingency reserve for this one.
[1:02:03] Two million.
[1:02:03] Okay.
[1:02:04] Does that include the million dollars put aside for this year?
[1:02:07] No.
[1:02:08] Okay, great.
[1:02:09] We want to build on that.
[1:02:10] Yes.
[1:02:11] And that's what I, when I sit down with you individually I want to talk to you about
[1:02:14] opportunities of how I think I can grow that for you.
[1:02:17] Since we're talking about that I'd just like to make a recommendation that we minimally set
[1:02:20] side a minimum of four months up to six months max as a guideline and I'd like
[1:02:26] to open that up to conversation here yes operating costs are you talking about
[1:02:33] correct yeah that's I think that's a good measure mm-hmm I think we need to
[1:02:37] set a goal we need to have an objective that we want to achieve and it is
[1:02:41] achievable and I think it's nice to have a million dollars but I think we
[1:02:45] need to have that comfort level that's really going to make sure that we
[1:02:47] are protected as a city. Right and the other thing that we're looking at too is
[1:02:51] we never know what kind of inclement weather we're going to have and what
[1:02:57] kind of storms are going to come through and you know we have to plan you
[1:03:00] know for worst-case scenarios and so we have some dollars set aside for storm
[1:03:05] cleanup or who knows what maybe there's a recall on some of our police
[1:03:11] cars and they may have to be completely replaced. So, you know, I want to have that in there
[1:03:18] as well and looking for those kind of opportunities. The idea of rolling funds over that are unspent,
[1:03:25] I'd like to tuck those into our reserve. You know, if we haven't spent it, that's
[1:03:28] where I'd like it to go. And when a big project comes up, we have a source in which to
[1:03:32] go to. So you'll hear all of that when we sit down and go over this.
[1:03:37] Is there a – I was just – I'm not trying to quiz you on the budget because it's not official or yet, right?
[1:03:45] Here she is.
[1:03:47] For Parks and Rec, is there a capital improvement portion for the Parks and Rec or no?
[1:03:53] Not really, at this point.
[1:03:55] Yeah, I mean, but not to the point of what we are expecting in our Parks and Rec plan.
[1:04:00] Okay.
[1:04:03] That's part of what we're doing, so we know.
[1:04:06] Right.
[1:04:07] The second to the last page.
[1:04:08] Okay.
[1:04:09] What's it on there again?
[1:04:10] Capital.
[1:04:11] Capital button.
[1:04:12] Right.
[1:04:13] Okay, thank you.
[1:04:14] But remember, don't get stuck on that.
[1:04:16] Not getting stuck on it this morning.
[1:04:18] Okay.
[1:04:18] Just got to start thinking.
[1:04:20] Okay.
[1:04:20] All right.
[1:04:21] I also want to go back to Councilman Gebbia's comment about the four months.
[1:04:25] I think we need to also remember that those are two separate funds.
[1:04:28] Yes.
[1:04:28] The city manager mentioned reserves versus contingency.
[1:04:32] I agree with you that the contingency is four to six months of operating costs,
[1:04:37] but we also have our reserves that are in addition to that, so we don't need...
[1:04:41] Thank you for bringing that up. One's a savings account and one's an emergency account.
[1:04:45] Exactly. And we need to build the savings account for long-term capital projects,
[1:04:50] or also if and when we do decide we need some bonding capacity,
[1:04:55] that money will be very valuable when it comes to establishing ratings and those types of things.
[1:05:00] So let's make sure we have our funds straight and that, yeah, I agree that four to six months for contingency,
[1:05:06] but we also have reserves that we need to continue to build as quickly and as strongly as we can.
[1:05:12] And I'm so glad you brought that up because, again, and we've talked about this before,
[1:05:17] but this really is a tool in preparation.
[1:05:20] And hopefully by year three or four, we'll ask for a bond rating.
[1:05:25] And I think we'll be in very good stead to secure a very good rating.
[1:05:30] But Jim is correct.
[1:05:33] And we'll be reviewing that and going over what the difference is and how important that is to what we're doing.
[1:05:42] All right. Well, thank you.
[1:05:43] One last point on the budgeting.
[1:05:47] As you reviewed the vendor contracts,
[1:05:51] We've talked about it in the past, if we can find ways to create a mutually beneficial
[1:05:58] incentive for these vendors so that if they come in under budget they get some kind of
[1:06:04] incentive and a bonus in building that, creating an incentive for them to be more
[1:06:13] cost-conscious within the cost that they build to the city or so.
[1:06:18] So I don't know how you do that, but it loves to have that built in so that they don't go
[1:06:26] all the way up to their contract amounts.
[1:06:28] They really do have an incentive to try and find efficiencies within their own operations.
[1:06:33] And I am looking forward to having that conversation with each of you.
[1:06:39] Looking forward to it.
[1:06:41] Is that part of it now, or is this something that will be novel with the new contracts?
[1:06:45] We're going to be making some changes on how the contract is established and what the parameters are.
[1:07:02] Right now we have a lump sum contract and I am moving towards a time and materials contract so that we can be...
[1:07:12] We have more predictability and we have a better delivery of service for what you all are agreeing to pay for.
[1:07:23] I'd just like to make one more suggestion. It was a conversation pretty much spurred by Councilman Iyer.
[1:07:29] Jim, this is in relationship to the – we were talking about the three plans that are coming down the pike here,
[1:07:36] on the Buford Highway, the transportation in the parks, and the suggestion that Jim
[1:07:40] that you came up with for creating a fourth plan, which would be probably just taking
[1:07:46] the Marta Station, and have that be as a separate plan, a PDF plan, not a PDF plan.
[1:07:52] Or I get, Joe and I were talking about, you know, how do we as a council better
[1:07:59] understand what water opportunities are, and obviously we're going to end that conversation
[1:08:02] but there might be an opportunity, and in my mind,
[1:08:08] and you may have a better idea, there might be an opportunity
[1:08:11] to include as a component of the comprehensive master plan
[1:08:18] a component that more closely looks at the Martyr Station,
[1:08:21] what's happening in a meeting around it,
[1:08:22] so that we're not adding, you know, obviously the shred,
[1:08:26] you know, basically it builds on what's happening with the shred,
[1:08:27] But it becomes something that is better tailored to what Brookhaven, what the council, what the citizens want.
[1:08:38] And we're trying to figure out do we do it now, do we do it later.
[1:08:41] My suggestion was that may be a specific component of the comprehensive master plan,
[1:08:47] not adding another plan per se, but just making sure that that character area is looked at even a little more closely
[1:08:56] than the other areas that we're going to be looking at through the process.
[1:09:00] I think that's a very good idea and I think, and we'll be talking about that in just a
[1:09:05] moment, but at least take the opportunity now to make mention of one of the most important
[1:09:12] ingredients in that plan is to have an established, identified, and committed relationship with
[1:09:19] Marta.
[1:09:22] We've seen and heard different commentary coming out of the charrette and who's representing
[1:09:28] who and who truly is not. I don't want there to be any kind of false sense of an expectation
[1:09:36] that can't be delivered upon by a group who's not authorized. So the idea of focusing
[1:09:44] seeing on that as a character area all by itself, and what does that mean as part of
[1:09:50] the overlay, part of the city, how does that drive the bus, if you will, and no pun intended
[1:09:56] that it's marra, but truly, you know, that whatever happens there is going to have
[1:10:04] a ripple effect, and we need to understand how far out that ripple goes and what that
[1:10:08] means and what that determines for many. And I think that's an excellent idea. And we can
[1:10:16] include that in our conversations when we start interviewing the different firms, absolutely.
[1:10:23] I would like to get on board with that one.
[1:10:25] From a timing standpoint, well, first of all, let me just say I'm in favor of this for
[1:10:30] a couple of reasons. One is because what happens over at the modern station is probably
[1:10:33] probably going to be a defining statement from all of us on what we think and what happens
[1:10:38] here in the city of Brookhaven. I think what we really want to make sure that we're doing
[1:10:44] is that we're working in concert with the folks from MOTOR and we want to do it loudly
[1:10:52] with commitment, with purpose, with performance. I think by separating or having this be
[1:10:57] a part of the master plan, it allows us to really identify that, to be able to
[1:11:01] speak very, very specifically towards that concept.
[1:11:06] You had mentioned something before about people making
[1:11:09] expectations that can't be fulfilled. One of the concerns I have is having
[1:11:13] expectations that are too low. So it's the other side of the coin.
[1:11:17] We have one time to do this right and I would very much
[1:11:22] encourage us as a city to step out on our own
[1:11:27] and compliment any other work that's being done out there and take the best
[1:11:30] for both ideas. So from a timing standpoint, I think the shreds due to the finish in six
[1:11:38] months, which probably takes it March, April, maybe May at the latest, and I think we'd want
[1:11:44] to be timed accordingly.
[1:11:48] Well, you know, I mean, that's probably too soon. But because
[1:11:52] it's a clock ticking, if this is something that we agree on, and we probably want
[1:11:58] to be moving ahead in full earnest?
[1:12:00] Well, I mean, there's a lot of moving parts to all of this
[1:12:05] and to the shred that's occurring right now.
[1:12:09] Jim's idea of focusing on the mortar station
[1:12:13] and how that affects and impacts the rest of the area.
[1:12:18] And we need to identify what that area is.
[1:12:20] I mean, how far out does the ripple effect occur?
[1:12:24] But what is going to be critical,
[1:12:25] what is going to be absolutely critical to the success of whatever happens there at the Marta Station
[1:12:31] is to come to an agreement and an understanding on both sides.
[1:12:36] We have a quasi-government that's Marta that receives federal funds that owns the station,
[1:12:42] that owns the land surrounding it, and that they have certain desires.
[1:12:46] My understanding is they don't want to sell it, but they will do a land lease
[1:12:49] and that they have certain expectations on their own.
[1:12:52] But I think we need to be clear with them, too, that we want to partner with them,
[1:12:57] but that whatever their desires are have to be enabled by this body through zoning,
[1:13:03] through site plans, through density entitlements.
[1:13:06] All of that has to be because at the end of the day, your job and my job in working with you all
[1:13:12] is to ensure that we can afford delivering services at the same level this citizenry has come to expect
[1:13:19] and demand of you all and we've got to be assured that whatever is being
[1:13:25] entitled and agreed upon can be paid for because it's not Marta's job to police
[1:13:31] it. It will be the city of Brookhaven's job to police it. It's not Marta's job
[1:13:35] to address, protect, or prevent precedents that are setting. It will
[1:13:44] be your job to do that so that whatever is coming out of whether it's
[1:13:48] this charrette or whether it's Marta doing something, they can't do it in a
[1:13:53] vacuum. They have to do it in partnership because you are the authority by
[1:13:58] charter and creation of the city that you have the police powers over planning
[1:14:03] and zoning. And that's where it rests. And so it is just imperative to the
[1:14:11] success of any property owner, whether they're Marta or their Mr. Developer in
[1:14:16] and some other part of the city,
[1:14:17] they can't do anything unless the park is so entitled
[1:14:20] and that entitlement is delivered by the elected body.
[1:14:24] So I love the idea of focusing on that
[1:14:29] and making it part of the comp plan.
[1:14:30] I think it needs to be a focus too
[1:14:32] when we do the transportation plan as well.
[1:14:34] And yet another focus when we do the parks and rec plan
[1:14:37] because if we've got people living there,
[1:14:38] they're gonna wanna recreate.
[1:14:40] And the closest park is Brookhaven.
[1:14:42] How much capacity can that park take?
[1:14:44] What is its capacity? What's its bandwidth? So we're going to have to look at all of that.
[1:14:48] So I'm saying I like the idea and I'd love to take that focus all the way through all the plans
[1:14:54] because we can't look at it with blinders. We have to be open to how that's going to affect
[1:15:00] All services and impact, all the cost of delivering services for the city.
[1:15:06] This may be premature because I think we're going to talk about the charrette.
[1:15:11] Bates and I were just at a charrette before we came here.
[1:15:15] And the gal who's the staff person for the city of Decatur for the
[1:15:19] Downtown Development Authority was speaking to the group,
[1:15:22] to the development authority folks about how they operate.
[1:15:27] And she kept saying, you know, we have a plan and every day we work the plan.
[1:15:32] We said, well, what plan is that?
[1:15:33] And she said, it's a strategic plan.
[1:15:36] We do, you know, we update it every five years.
[1:15:38] And it's the result of a vision of the community that's come together.
[1:15:44] And I guess that's been my concern on this charrette thing,
[1:15:48] is that the comp plan hasn't been done yet.
[1:15:51] And the comp plan is really going to be our strategic vision.
[1:15:54] And that's why if you're suggesting that the two need to mesh, absolutely, because I have
[1:16:02] a little bit of a fear that there's one train going down this track right now, and it's a
[1:16:07] little bit ahead of us.
[1:16:08] I agree.
[1:16:09] And people are making decisions.
[1:16:11] I mean, the one group I sat in today was deciding on terminology to use in the RFQ.
[1:16:18] Right, and that authority does not rest with them.
[1:16:24] This is just a charrette that was brought to us and funded by another part of the city
[1:16:29] is not paying for it.
[1:16:31] Yes, but I have to ask.
[1:16:32] It's good ideas, maybe, and we'll, I will tell you that they, they have, I heard it
[1:16:38] again today.
[1:16:39] They said we have partnered with the city and we are working for the city and we
[1:16:45] Who's, who's saying this?
[1:16:46] Robert Reed.
[1:16:48] Well, that's Robert.
[1:16:49] He's South Face.
[1:16:50] But you know.
[1:16:51] Yeah, but that's not who's going to be taking advantage of it or making use of it.
[1:16:55] Those are the ones you want to partner with.
[1:16:59] Going back to the RFQ, I mean, ultimately, I think what they were discussing was Marta's RFQ for developers for the property.
[1:17:07] And I don't know that we as a city right now have much say in that.
[1:17:13] We can see it after the fact.
[1:17:15] I mean, once they've selected their developer, then obviously we've got a regulatory role.
[1:17:20] But, you know, as I understand it, Decatur has done sort of an IGA, which I don't know how – I think it's beginning to fall apart a little bit, just simply because Marnay is taking a little bit different direction.
[1:17:33] So, you know, I guess at the end of the day, where our – what my concern is and where I believe our preparation needs to be is on the regulatory side to make sure that we are prepared to ask for and fully review whatever it is that we feel is necessary.
[1:17:49] to get a full picture of what's happening out there.
[1:17:52] At the end of the day, when they come back in for rezoning,
[1:17:55] that's going to be our first and best chance to make all of this happen.
[1:18:00] Obviously, there's going to be, as things are developed along the way,
[1:18:03] but we've got to be prepared as a council.
[1:18:06] We've got to be prepared as a city to accept those plans
[1:18:11] and understand what it is that we want those plans to look like
[1:18:14] so that we can then deliver back to them our vision
[1:18:17] and then make sure that we're in sync from that standpoint
[1:18:19] because the rezoning is going to be where we get to see
[1:18:23] and where we get to exert any.
[1:18:25] Murray, do you want to discuss what we talked about
[1:18:29] and are you're reaching out to Marta?
[1:18:32] Yes, I was just, thank you.
[1:18:34] I have, I shared with all of you last week
[1:18:36] the letter I received from Marta giving everybody notice
[1:18:41] that others will not plan for them,
[1:18:43] they will plan for themselves
[1:18:44] and that the authority rests with them on what they're going to do with their own property.
[1:18:49] You know, as a result of what I'm hearing from the public too,
[1:18:54] that South Face is saying they're partnering with the city and they're representing us.
[1:19:00] There's a whole host of concerns that get conjured up with that.
[1:19:04] You know, we don't want the community to be misled that certain things are going to occur when we don't know what those are yet.
[1:19:10] But I have contacted Marta and I've left a message asking for a meeting and Bates and
[1:19:17] I were talking about it today that, you know, to even get with the general manager of Marta
[1:19:21] and just say, look, you know, we want to partner with you and just describe exactly
[1:19:25] what I just went over with you all that there has to be an acceptance that Marta and the
[1:19:33] city need each other. Like it or not, good or bad, they need each other to help enable
[1:19:41] what they'd like to do and help prepare the city for how they serve. And so that call
[1:19:48] has been made and a request has been made because I think, you know, at this point,
[1:19:53] obviously there was some frustration on Margaret's part, otherwise they wouldn't have written
[1:19:57] that letter to set the ground rules of who's in charge. And that's basically what
[1:20:01] It was a who's in charge letter and they said they were in charge of the property they own.
[1:20:07] So I think that that is a supreme opportunity on our part to say we'd like to sit down.
[1:20:12] We want to partner with you. We want to work with you.
[1:20:15] They're going to need us at some point in time and I think going to where Jim was headed with his comments.
[1:20:20] Let's make that early rather than later because I really don't want you to be engaged at the time that they've prepared their plans and you're reacting.
[1:20:28] I want you to be in a proactive role that you're part of in the term to determine what
[1:20:33] is best for the city and what complements their needs and their desires because you've
[1:20:40] got a whole lot of overlay left over with the community and there's properties that
[1:20:46] are only under contract that I've been informed of that have a desire to do something similar
[1:20:52] to what Marta's talking about and the question now is begged and asking
[1:20:59] is there enough capacity do we need that do we how much do we have of multi
[1:21:03] family in the city you know so it's a perfect time right now to have that
[1:21:10] that engagement with them and and to be able to walk together because I'd like
[1:21:15] to see them as a part of our overall plan I mean I want them involved in
[1:21:18] the Buford Highway plan let's take a look at the bus stops that are along
[1:21:22] How do we get them to the Marta Station? How do we get them, how do we, if we're going
[1:21:25] to talk about workforce housing and we're going to try and get corporate America to locate,
[1:21:30] how do we transport the employees if their first choice is not going to be by car? How
[1:21:36] do we do that? So they've got to be a part of all of this. So that's part of my offering
[1:21:40] to them is, we need your help and you need ours.
[1:21:44] Yeah, and that was part of Jager's proposal on view of Marta Station.
[1:21:51] I just want to reiterate that every indication from martyrs so far, all of their officials,
[1:21:58] has been that they are very much looking to partner with the city of Brookhaven and work
[1:22:03] in a cooperative fashion to get our input in how we make the best use for that site.
[1:22:11] Well, one of the things that we talked about in the charrette today was that we had a number
[1:22:16] of members of our development authority.
[1:22:18] And I reminded them that development authority, not MARTA, has tools for bond inducement, tax abatements, some things that would be great incentives to attract developers.
[1:22:34] And so in the same way that Invest Atlanta has been vital in the whole stadium developments, we have some things that they don't have.
[1:22:43] And so we thought all along that our development authority was needed to be stood up in order
[1:22:49] to be ready for this opportunity.
[1:22:52] Now as you know they've asked to present to us their final findings on Thursday morning
[1:22:58] and I know there's a conflict with some other things going on.
[1:23:02] Can we find another time or should we just – what do we want to do about this?
[1:23:09] I would hope that we could keep that time. I'm not sure if we need to talk about this further.
[1:23:16] I think it's important for us to hear, from what I understand, they've brought all the consultants together for that time.
[1:23:25] If not all of these, there will be representatives from each of the groups or each of the study groups making presentations to us
[1:23:33] so that we as a council can have a better understanding of what's going on.
[1:23:37] And I think it would be important for us to have that opportunity to not only see what
[1:23:43] they've presented, but also have a frank and open discussion about it.
[1:23:48] Later that evening, Thursday evening, they're obviously doing the public presentation, which,
[1:23:53] you know, while that's going to be some of the same information, I think it, for me,
[1:23:59] I think it's very important for us to see that prior to the public presentation so
[1:24:03] that if there are some expectations that maybe may need some adjustments or if there are some
[1:24:09] things that may need to be realigned, then we have that opportunity to do that.
[1:24:14] Also, we have an opportunity to see what's going on and what will, in fact, be presented.
[1:24:19] So, you know, I hope that that Thursday morning we are or can be available because I think
[1:24:27] this is important.
[1:24:28] It's an important first step for us to understand what's going on and also provide
[1:24:33] into the process before the final presentation is made that evening.
[1:24:38] Well, there is a conflict for that morning and I would just say that, you know,
[1:24:46] this is what you want to do and schedule a special call.
[1:24:50] Right, I was going to say that.
[1:24:51] Is the charrette open in the afternoon?
[1:24:53] I mean, could we carry this over because the conflict can't last all day?
[1:24:58] No, it's in the morning.
[1:24:59] It's in the morning, so by the charrettes there, I think, till 3 o'clock.
[1:25:03] What if we worked with Robert Reed to see if we could do it for the afternoon?
[1:25:09] Let's try that just for clarification purposes for people who are not really sure what we're talking about.
[1:25:15] There was the second court case on the Century Center taking place at Superior Court on Thursday morning.
[1:25:23] And it's going to involve city staff, which was important that they also be a part of the city council meeting here.
[1:25:29] Trey, are you going to be filming at the courthouse? Do you have the ability to also film at the same time?
[1:25:36] Do you get permission for that?
[1:25:37] Yeah, he did last time.
[1:25:39] Do you also have the ability to film a city council meeting at the same time, personnel and equipment-wise?
[1:25:47] Well, you know, two different people, two different cameras.
[1:25:50] We never own.
[1:25:52] Okay, great. Okay, good.
[1:25:55] Okay, thanks.
[1:25:56] Do we know if that's just the court calendar at 9 o'clock, or do we think that our arguments
[1:26:01] are actually scheduled for 9 o'clock?
[1:26:03] 9.30.
[1:26:04] I've been told it's been 9.30.
[1:26:06] Okay.
[1:26:06] Do they say specially set?
[1:26:09] In talking with Lenny, I asked him specifically what time, and he said 9.30.
[1:26:16] Okay.
[1:26:17] Because you can go down the floor.
[1:26:20] Yeah, right.
[1:26:22] Are any of us going to testify or anything?
[1:26:24] Well, I ask about that.
[1:26:25] You know they're not planning on it, but they they could and so I'm planning to bring the boards and everything just in case
[1:26:37] Okay, so who is gonna talk to Robert?
[1:26:40] about rescheduling
[1:26:42] okay, calm and
[1:26:45] Early afternoon is good for the count. Excuse me. It's good for the council if they scheduled it say
[1:26:49] One one thirty thirties afternoon. Is that I think that'd be good. Is that good for council?
[1:26:56] 24th
[1:27:00] It's fine for me.
[1:27:04] Marie was yesterday or Sunday?
[1:27:08] For me.
[1:27:08] When was your birthday?
[1:27:10] Sunday.
[1:27:11] Saturday.
[1:27:12] Sunday.
[1:27:13] Sunday.
[1:27:13] Does it pass?
[1:27:14] Happy birthday.
[1:27:15] Is it passed or coming?
[1:27:16] Past.
[1:27:17] Birthday.
[1:27:18] We all missed it.
[1:27:19] Everyone of us.
[1:27:22] That's why we need to have all those birthdays on our outlet.
[1:27:25] They are.
[1:27:25] Our Brookhaven calendar.
[1:27:26] I think we do have it.
[1:27:28] They did give us a list.
[1:27:29] It's on the list, but it's not on our calendar calendar.
[1:27:34] I'm good. So, you know, Daniel, if you want to try, say, 1.30, 30th afternoon, we'll...
[1:27:41] I'm going to just say it. I have a conflict at 2 o'clock. I will try and move that.
[1:27:47] Well, let's say 1 o'clock, then.
[1:27:49] Yeah, I mean, 1 o'clock would be perfect as long as I can leave and get there for the 2 o'clock.
[1:27:55] It's an on-site meeting.
[1:28:00] Let's see what we can do.
[1:28:07] Well, check the various times. It may even be later than that, that it could be available
[1:28:10] like 3 o'clock work for you if you could do it.
[1:28:12] Yeah, that would work. I'm going to try and move the meeting if I can.
[1:28:16] Basically, we're all available all day if we have to be on Thursday for this.
[1:28:20] Okay. Are you looking at just one hour? Is that what you're looking at as a presentation
[1:28:24] of their findings?
[1:28:25] They had a two hour block but whatever, I mean an hour and a half.
[1:28:33] All right, next?
[1:28:38] I wanted to just give you an update to our apartment inspections.
[1:28:42] Susan has been managing that.
[1:28:47] Well, the inspection program is going very well.
[1:28:49] As you know, we have 66 apartments that we're doing the inspection on.
[1:28:53] We are beginning inspection number 12 this week.
[1:28:57] And as a matter of policy, what we do is create a notebook on each apartment complex that we inspect.
[1:29:03] The reports that we're seeing range anywhere from 20 pages to 500 pages, so they vary in length.
[1:29:09] All of the reports include photographic inventory as well as the code section that are being reviewed.
[1:29:16] We've had two complexes that we have had to issue a court citations for.
[1:29:20] One has already had a court date, and that was dismissed, and they're about 75% complete with the corrections they needed to make.
[1:29:27] We have an additional apartment complex that will be going to court in November, the first week of November.
[1:29:32] We do have one that now is fully compliant.
[1:29:35] And I do meet with the inspector every Monday morning, and then he is now beginning to provide a report to me every Friday.
[1:29:42] He had to have something to report on, so every Friday I do receive a report from him.
[1:29:47] I feel like we're really on schedule.
[1:29:50] We did receive, by the way, this week a request for a demo of an apartment complex.
[1:29:56] So we're hearing a lot of different things about...
[1:29:58] Where is that?
[1:30:00] Claremont Cove, which is north of Dresden and west of Claremont, north of Beaver Highway.
[1:30:08] So we haven't completed the process of that, but we do have a request in for demolition
[1:30:14] of that apartment complex.
[1:30:15] How big is that, do you know?
[1:30:16] I don't remember the number of units. I apologize. I think it's fairly small, fairly small.
[1:30:20] Is the one that's coming on the court in November, is that a result of a continuance
[1:30:25] or is that just a later court date set?
[1:30:26] No, that is a new court date for that particular complex.
[1:30:30] We've only had two, and they're different complexes.
[1:30:36] We're moving right along as planned.
[1:30:39] I think our inspector is doing a very good job.
[1:30:45] I have not received any complaints from the field directly to me about him.
[1:30:50] I did receive one complaint about not knowing that he was there.
[1:30:56] So at this point, we're actually a little bit ahead of schedule.
[1:31:03] The Claymore Cove, is that the Archway project?
[1:31:06] Yes, it is.
[1:31:07] Okay, thank you.
[1:31:11] So this book, these reports, are they available at your office for us to look at?
[1:31:15] We are maintaining two copies on each complex.
[1:31:18] And of course, yes, they are available.
[1:31:20] They're updated repeatedly because as things are corrected, that goes in the book as well.
[1:31:25] So it includes the notice, what happened, everything that's going on, we're keeping a public record on what's occurring in each complex.
[1:31:33] Susan, would it be possible for us to go out with the inspector on a typical inspection?
[1:31:38] Not necessarily, I don't know how long they last if they're one day, five days, whatever.
[1:31:42] Just to get a better feel for what they're looking at.
[1:31:46] I'm sure he wouldn't have a problem with that.
[1:31:48] We would just need to know when you'd want to do that.
[1:31:51] The next inspection will be this Thursday.
[1:31:55] We can certainly coordinate that for you.
[1:31:58] As you've been meeting and reviewed, are we getting,
[1:32:02] are we maintaining a consistency from complex to complex
[1:32:06] so that we're now sort of looking at the same things
[1:32:09] and are we getting tougher or are we backing off on some things?
[1:32:13] What's sort of the focus and what do you see as you look at the reports?
[1:32:17] What are some of the violations or the enforcement issues that seem to be coming time and time again?
[1:32:26] Well, I think with anything, there's a learning curve as you take on something new.
[1:32:31] But he does have a checklist that he follows that everyone was provided.
[1:32:35] And I do think he's consistent in his approach.
[1:32:38] Those things that are life safety matters, we do not waste time on,
[1:32:43] because it's important to deal with life safety issues.
[1:32:45] And we are granting flexibility for things that require bidding, and we're aware of that.
[1:32:51] So, I mean, everything can't just be black and white.
[1:32:55] You try to make it black and white where you can.
[1:32:57] But there are things that we have to give a little bit of leniency to,
[1:33:01] and courtesy to, as long as it's not a life safety issue.
[1:33:03] Is there a process for requesting extensions, or how does that work?
[1:33:08] If somebody needs, wants to get the list, and they go through it,
[1:33:11] they feel they need additional time.
[1:33:14] Well, the inspector has been working with them in the field, and actually the latest
[1:33:18] update I have indicates that he's provided extensions to some, and some of them are going
[1:33:23] out until December. It depends on the nature of what it is. If they're having to re-roof
[1:33:29] an entire complex and they have to go out to get bids to do that, they need time to
[1:33:34] do that. But if they need to put up a guardrail along a sidewalk where somebody could fall
[1:33:38] They need to get that done. So there's a degree of subjectiveness that has to occur.
[1:33:46] I've heard from one group that they were hoping to extend some of the things that weren't life-saving to you,
[1:33:52] but they were hoping to extend some of the things into the next fiscal year, which obviously is beyond December.
[1:33:58] Are we looking at things like that when people are requesting extensions?
[1:34:03] I mean, if they come in with a, if the request is more of a budgetary than anything else,
[1:34:12] they would push these improvements into the 2014 budget rather than the 2013 budget.
[1:34:18] Are we working with them on that level?
[1:34:21] Well, I haven't been approached in that regard.
[1:34:23] I don't know that the inspector has, and until it's brought to my attention,
[1:34:26] I don't know about that.
[1:34:27] But certainly, we need to look at those things.
[1:34:31] We need to make sure that they truly are moving forward with progress.
[1:34:35] And if we see that it's a stall tactic, the goal here is to make a better quality of life situation for all of the folks that live in these apartment complexes.
[1:34:46] And if we see that it's a stall tactic, we're going to do what we can to motivate them to move forward.
[1:34:54] That's the best way to know how to answer your question.
[1:34:56] Yeah, and that's what I was looking for.
[1:35:01] There will be special situations, but I also agree that it could be used as a stalled type
[1:35:06] of extent.
[1:35:07] Right.
[1:35:07] And if I don't know about the situation, there's not a thing I can do about it.
[1:35:11] Do you know any more details about the citation that was dismissed in court?
[1:35:19] My recollection is that the one that was dismissed in court, they were actively moving
[1:35:24] forward and they were showing, demonstrating that they were 75 percent into the corrective
[1:35:29] measures. And today, that was the last report. Today, they're probably even further along.
[1:35:36] So that's what I know about that.
[1:35:38] Because I assumed a citation is kind of the last resort.
[1:35:40] Yes.
[1:35:41] Okay.
[1:35:43] In one other question, I know that there was, I understood that that fire that occurred
[1:35:48] at Parktown North happened shortly after we had finished our inspection there and
[1:35:52] come up with probably one of those 500-page reports. Do you know if we reflected
[1:35:58] Did potentially fire safety hazards there or was that just somebody actually started the fire?
[1:36:05] All of the life safety issues in that particular complex were corrected prior to that fire.
[1:36:15] Any other questions?
[1:36:17] Thank you.
[1:36:18] Thank you.
[1:36:20] Mr. Mayor, the next item is the Marta Charette, and we've already covered that unless there's any other questions.
[1:36:27] That's enough.
[1:36:28] I just want to thank city staff for getting that schedule up on the homepage of the website.
[1:36:36] Let's public know what times and dates they can go for public input in that process.
[1:36:44] All right.
[1:36:44] Thank you.
[1:36:45] Announcements?
[1:36:46] Am I having announcements?
[1:36:49] 29th of October at Croskies High School, Michael Thurman is going to be there with Marshall.
[1:36:58] and they're putting on a public meeting and I would encourage all of us to be there
[1:37:06] because it's going to be a great time for us to be making our statements
[1:37:10] for the type of support that we want for our school systems.
[1:37:13] It's particularly the only high school that we have in the city of Brookhaven.
[1:37:20] I believe it's set for either 6.30 or 7.
[1:37:23] Maybe a corner of about the Croskies Park thing.
[1:37:26] Well, we can do everything. Now, it appears that this has not been a well advertised event.
[1:37:34] So I'm making sure it gets advertised.
[1:37:37] Yes. It's next Tuesday.
[1:37:42] All right. I have a little bit of announcement just to give everybody a little update.
[1:37:48] Joe and I attended a roundtable last Wednesday, Joe.
[1:37:57] with citizens concerned about our SOB ordinance and it went very well. Everybody was well
[1:38:06] behaved. It was probably, what did you say, 25 or 30 people there, Joe?
[1:38:10] No, there were a lot more than that.
[1:38:11] Were there?
[1:38:12] Probably closer to 60.
[1:38:13] 60 folks, okay. Maybe 70, I don't know.
[1:38:19] And there were a lot of folks there and there
[1:38:21] were a lot, there was a lot of thoughtful discussion and there were some very good
[1:38:24] questions because some of the questions we didn't know the answer to but there
[1:38:27] were some good points brought up and I've asked a couple of them but I've also
[1:38:34] asked the citizens to please email some of the ideas and questions they had
[1:38:39] about our SOB. One idea that did come out that Joe and I kind of thought was a
[1:38:43] good idea and of course this would be done in concert with Tom and Marie and
[1:38:47] you know the council of course is they had asked one of the questions was
[1:38:53] do we have different opinions from attorneys, from different attorneys, when we were debating
[1:39:00] our SOV and I, of course, answered we had. We had, Mr. Kerr was one of them, we had Bob
[1:39:05] Dallas and we had, of course, Scott Berkhold. I think the desire from these citizens was
[1:39:11] that we kind of reach out a little further and see if we can have some consultation
[1:39:15] for some one or two more attorneys with some experience in the field. And I thought
[1:39:21] that was a good idea just to either reiterate our ordinance and kind of give us a more firm
[1:39:28] ground on what we've done and what we're doing and give us confidence in that that what we're
[1:39:33] doing is the right thing or to possibly give us ideas about other options that may be
[1:39:38] out there that we didn't want to wear out. So it's just a suggestion that we kind of
[1:39:44] affirm or open up our understanding of what our SOB is.
[1:39:51] And I thought that was a good idea and I think Joe did too.
[1:39:53] I definitely did.
[1:39:54] So I'd like to say in the next couple of weeks,
[1:39:58] I'd like to coordinate with Tom and see if we can get some one
[1:40:04] or two more attorneys to kind of give us their perspective
[1:40:06] on our ordinance where they either affirm what we've done
[1:40:09] or say maybe we could tweak this or that or strategy
[1:40:14] I would like to suggest that Tom, you present us with people that you think that we should
[1:40:20] open this up to, let us have a review of who they are so we can assess their professionalism
[1:40:26] in the area and give us maybe several suggestions and let us choose from amongst those.
[1:40:33] I have a bit of an objection to this.
[1:40:35] I personally think that we reached out early on and have presentations at a work session
[1:40:43] of this.
[1:40:44] We also reached out to Wendell Willard and some other, you know, city attorneys as well.
[1:40:50] We've made our commitment.
[1:40:52] We're in a lawsuit.
[1:40:53] I think if we have any doubts then we ought to just rescind our SOB ordinance.
[1:41:00] But I mean, I think we've made our commitment.
[1:41:03] I don't agree that we have any doubts. We should resend our ordinance.
[1:41:07] There were some questions that came up that I think we need answers to
[1:41:10] in order to affirm what we've done in a more positive manner.
[1:41:15] We had members of the community come up to us and consistently state this point
[1:41:21] and I think as representatives of the citizens that we have an obligation to fulfill.
[1:41:26] I don't really think it has anything to do about what our current stance is
[1:41:34] or backing out of this, I think we just need to follow through on it and see.
[1:41:38] And if the general consensus of a room full of attorneys is that we're heading down the right path,
[1:41:43] do you think that's going to change any of the comments that you received from the...
[1:41:48] You know, I don't know, but...
[1:41:49] Are you looking for opinions till we find something they agree with?
[1:41:51] No, no, I think it might address some of the questions that I didn't have the answer to
[1:41:57] that I'd like to have answers to and, you know, Tom could probably provide some of them.
[1:42:01] Oh, if, you know, if there are specific questions, then yes, but I need to provide a general review.
[1:42:06] I think I started off by saying there were some questions that I didn't have the answer to
[1:42:10] that I think would be good to have answered and that we had some differing opinions on it.
[1:42:15] I think it would be good for us to give us a more full understanding of a way to defend what we've done.
[1:42:21] But if there are things that are indefensible, they need to be pointed out
[1:42:25] For purposes of our strategy going forward, my message to the constituency is that we took
[1:42:31] a measured, through these folks, we took a measured careful decision on adopting our
[1:42:35] SOB, which I support, and Joe supports, and I think we all support, and I was very clear
[1:42:41] about that.
[1:42:42] And I said, if there are any questions or concerns that maybe we hadn't heard of
[1:42:47] or considered, we'd like to hear them.
[1:42:49] And frankly, there were a couple of things that I didn't have answers for that I want
[1:42:53] answers to, and I'm not talking about having a consortium of attorneys come up, just one
[1:43:00] or two possibly, maybe one, to kind of address those questions from a different perspective,
[1:43:06] not to undermine our ordinance or undermine our understanding of our legal position,
[1:43:13] but just when we have questions about these things in the future, we have given a lot
[1:43:18] of consideration to things that we didn't necessarily consider before, and we now know
[1:43:22] why we why the answer is what it is just more informing our decision is my
[1:43:28] opinion it would have to be somebody with no vested interest in what's going on
[1:43:32] here or definitely nobody that has a perceived agenda and I think that would
[1:43:37] satisfy a lot of a lot of concerns and in the in the community yeah I'd like to
[1:43:44] just provide a little bit of clarity I did watch the video of the discussion
[1:43:51] I commend you all for going and listening to the citizens.
[1:43:57] It probably took guts, and I know that this is a sensitive issue because it is an active litigation.
[1:44:03] But from a public perception, I commend you for listening to the public and showing that they elected us to hear their voice.
[1:44:14] The issue that I heard resoundingly was that the citizens are concerned about the cost that the city is embarking upon in addressing this issue.
[1:44:25] And if we can look at solutions that minimize the cost of the city but produce the same results, let's look at those options.
[1:44:36] I think the ordinance we have is a well thought out,
[1:44:41] constitutionally upholdable ordinance which protects our citizens.
[1:44:45] But we also have the reality of that we're dealing with a litigation matter that is costing the taxpayers money.
[1:44:54] So are there solutions out there which can protect the city of Brookhaven?
[1:45:00] Ultimately, achieve the same results as the course that we're currently going down, but
[1:45:05] minimizes that cost to the citizens. And I think that that's what the citizens want to
[1:45:10] see this city move forward with, is exploring those opportunities that minimize the costs
[1:45:17] and yet still achieve the same results that is protecting the future value of the city
[1:45:26] of Brookhaven.
[1:45:27] But I guess at the end of the day I'm confused because I'm not sure how short of changing
[1:45:32] our ordinance we can minimize those costs.
[1:45:34] We're not driving that cost right now.
[1:45:36] We've not chosen to file a lawsuit, we're just simply responding to it.
[1:45:40] So at this point we're responding.
[1:45:44] We've made our position and I'm not an attorney nor have I played one on TV, but the costs
[1:45:54] are what they are.
[1:45:54] I mean, what a little bit I know of the legal system is that we're sort of on a train that
[1:46:00] has left the station and sort of pulling into a siding that we choose to pull into, it's
[1:46:07] going down the track.
[1:46:09] So I'm not sure that while I understand and appreciate what you're saying, I just
[1:46:14] don't know that we have an opportunity or we have an option to mitigate the cost because
[1:46:21] we're not driving those costs.
[1:46:22] Well, we're responding.
[1:46:23] I'd also like a reconformation of what the litigation cost is.
[1:46:28] You know, when we first discussed this, we talked, we were told that our max cost is going to be this issue cost city 75 grand and it'll be over in nine months.
[1:46:39] It's nine months now, we've spent 40 grand on this issue and we haven't even gotten to the courthouse.
[1:46:45] Well, we actually, we have gotten to the courthouse.
[1:46:47] We've been heard, the briefs are filed, we're now waiting for an answer.
[1:46:50] It's not a long-lengthly trial, and it's not 40,000.
[1:46:54] Half of that was spent for lawyers to create the ordinance
[1:46:58] and show up at the council meetings.
[1:47:01] I've never, you know, I know the cost of litigation,
[1:47:06] and the city will be paying the cost of litigation.
[1:47:10] There will be a tremendous amount of prep time prior to that,
[1:47:14] and there will also be appeal, possibly numerous appeals.
[1:47:19] So I would like to see, you know, I frankly don't believe the quotes that we were given
[1:47:27] about the total cost of...
[1:47:30] Let me just wrap this up.
[1:47:31] But basically I think we're getting a little off track from what I was suggesting was not
[1:47:36] that we repeal our ordinance.
[1:47:40] It wasn't suggesting that we, you know, the cost was something that did come up.
[1:47:44] But to me, if we better understand our position thoroughly from top to bottom, I think in our options,
[1:47:54] but mainly our position as to why we did what we did, which I think we did the right thing,
[1:47:58] if we better understand that, I think it benefits our citizenry in knowing that their elected officials
[1:48:04] have researched every in and out of this area.
[1:48:09] We had a lot of testimony on it. We did have a lot of consultation on this.
[1:48:15] We did hear from some other attorneys.
[1:48:18] And all I'm saying is there's some new questions that came up that I didn't know the answer to,
[1:48:22] and I frankly would like to have those answered.
[1:48:25] And having consultation with attorneys not necessarily involved in this suit
[1:48:30] would help me better defend our ordinance if those questions are answered in such a way that I'm comfortable with them.
[1:48:38] So, again, I was very clear and Joe was clear that we supported our ordinance and we thought
[1:48:44] our ordinance was the right thing to do and we still do think that.
[1:48:48] There were some questions that weren't brought up when we were researching this and when we
[1:48:51] were consulting and voting on it that I wanted to have.
[1:48:55] I think we need to have answered.
[1:48:56] And if you'd go back and watch the meeting, I think you'll see just one or two very
[1:49:02] very cogent questions that I think will help us better understand the impact of our ordinance
[1:49:09] and better defend it to our constituents, to let them know, because my whole purpose
[1:49:14] for going to that meeting was to let the people know that we took a lot of time with
[1:49:18] this decision. There was rational thought behind it, and I think they were appreciative
[1:49:22] of that. But there were some very intelligent questions about our ordinance that I think
[1:49:27] need to be answered and I don't like you your point to your point Rebecca that you know keep searching keep getting answers
[1:49:35] You know and then they'll have new ones to come up that you know we keep not that's not what I'm talking about just
[1:49:40] You know part of being an attorney or a part of being an elected official or just a business venue
[1:49:44] You know you
[1:49:46] review every so often your policies and procedures and to make sure that they're
[1:49:50] Doing what they're intended to do and I think to have the full more full confidence in what we've done
[1:49:55] I think is wise on our part and I don't want I don't want to give the wrong
[1:50:02] impression again I support our ordinance I think our council supports our
[1:50:07] ordinance I think it's the right thing to do I just want to be even more
[1:50:11] certain of that and getting some questions answered I think will help us
[1:50:14] convey that to our constituents even better. Mr. Mayor if I may just two
[1:50:18] points one is I'd like to suggest to all of us there is a court case
[1:50:24] coming up. So pretty much what happens after that court case is going to predict what avenue
[1:50:32] we go down. I'm very much in favor of following through on this. I'm going to suggest that
[1:50:36] we pick this conversation up after that court date and it'll make a lot more sense what
[1:50:41] we can or should be doing in regards to how we handle this issue, if you agree. And
[1:50:46] then secondly, I just want to make the comment about that evening. One of the
[1:50:52] valuable outcomes of it. People were just generally satisfied to have us there to have
[1:50:57] a conversation. Up to this point, we pretty much have been muscled on this issue. We
[1:51:02] all ran on the basis of transparency. That was transparency. We needed to do that.
[1:51:09] They had the right to have that conversation with us. It was valuable. We came back
[1:51:14] with information that we didn't have before, which opened our eyes and we're sharing
[1:51:19] some of that with you now. That was a lesson. I mean, you can get caught in this rut sometimes,
[1:51:26] and I very much appreciated the opportunity to do that. But I'd suggest that we pick
[1:51:31] this back up after the, whatever, instead of deferring it whenever the court date is
[1:51:35] had.
[1:51:36] Well, it's not what we're waiting for is a ruling from the court. There's no time
[1:51:40] certain of that.
[1:51:40] Yeah, I mean, we can do it, and we can have this discussion in the executive
[1:51:43] session.
[1:51:44] Okay.
[1:51:45] That's what I would recommend that we do since we are talking about ongoing litigation, let's take it.
[1:51:52] But also in the meantime from an education standpoint, and I'll let the attorney decide.
[1:51:58] If you look at our ordinance, there are pages and pages of citations of cases that we use to make our decision on.
[1:52:05] I would like to make those cases readily available.
[1:52:07] I'd like, you know, we got a disk with a bunch of information on it to the extent we can put all of that information
[1:52:12] or as much as we can available on the website, I'd like to have that out there.
[1:52:17] So if somebody wants to take the time to do the research that we did to come up with that decision,
[1:52:22] that they don't have to go through and search case by case or, you know, unpack.
[1:52:28] But, you know, let's take what we referenced in the ordinance and make it available
[1:52:32] So, if somebody is interested in reading through it, they have that opportunity to do so without having to find it wherever it is that they can find it.
[1:52:40] Also, the preamble to the ordinance does cite a number of those cases, Ms. Dreyer.
[1:52:46] So, it's there and everybody wants it.
[1:52:48] But let's make it easy for people to find that.
[1:52:52] But let's us create a link somehow to that information so that if they can go to one source
[1:52:58] per KBGA.gov and go from there to find that information.
[1:53:04] I think what you're talking about is educating the public of why we made the decision we
[1:53:09] made.
[1:53:10] And I don't know that putting forth a bunch of legal court cases, the general public
[1:53:14] is not going to spend the hours that we spent reading those things.
[1:53:19] What you're really talking about is getting more proactive information out there to the
[1:53:26] public and educating them on why the city moved in the direction it moved in.
[1:53:33] We have been very silent in supporting the decisions or really explaining the decisions
[1:53:42] that we, you know, the details of why we acted the way we acted in acting the ordinance.
[1:53:50] If, you know, if you want to do that, I think that would be a very good thing to do.
[1:53:58] And I think that was one of the things that came up out of that meeting,
[1:54:00] is I saw that J. and Joe did address the public and sort of give a little bit more background
[1:54:08] in context of why we went down the way, you know, why we had to have an ordinance because
[1:54:14] of constitutional issues, defects in the cap county ordinance.
[1:54:18] You know the point, you're bringing up baits that are not mutually exclusive.
[1:54:21] I think both of those categories probably need to be had a separate tab, I think,
[1:54:26] for those that want to do the research on this and be educated, you should be
[1:54:30] afforded to them in the full, in the full Monty here.
[1:54:33] And if we do it in progression of how we...
[1:54:38] If we do it in the progression of how we actually did it during council meetings in chronological
[1:54:44] order, let them see how we evolved in our decision.
[1:54:47] And then a more proactive part of the city here to communicate out, I think, is definitely
[1:54:55] welcome.
[1:54:56] It became apparent from the information that we shared that night that of that survey
[1:55:01] it was either 40 or 60 percent, it was a higher percent of people that had never heard
[1:55:04] that we were even in a position of controversy with the 41% have not heard of the issue yet.
[1:55:10] And yet, within a five-minute conversation, apparently the majority of them were saying
[1:55:16] that it's something that we shouldn't be doing.
[1:55:18] And I brought up the point and said, I think I brought it up.
[1:55:20] And if I didn't, I meant to.
[1:55:23] That we worked countless hours on this coming up with our decision.
[1:55:28] And now we're looking at a person who made a decision in less than five minutes
[1:55:33] based upon a survey. And my premise has always been if you need to know the facts before you
[1:55:40] make a decision. So I'm supportive of making sure we get the facts out there for anybody who
[1:55:44] really wants to go as far as they want to go to learn what we did and why we did it.
[1:55:50] All right. Thank you. We don't need executive session, do we?
[1:55:55] Yes, we do. Real estate and legal.
[1:55:57] Okay. Do we want to do it now or after the council meeting?
[1:56:02] Do we have enough time?
[1:56:04] Yeah.
[1:56:04] Okay.
[1:56:06] For a motion?
[1:56:07] I make a motion that we go into executive session.
[1:56:10] Is there a second?
[1:56:12] For a real estate matter.
[1:56:14] And litigation.
[1:56:15] And a litigation matter.
[1:56:16] Is there a second?
[1:56:17] Anything else?
[1:56:20] Is there a second?
[1:56:21] A second.
[1:56:23] Any discussion?
[1:56:24] All in favor of adjourning to executive session signify so by saying aye.
[1:56:27] Aye.
[1:56:27] All opposed?
[1:57:28] All right. Hello. All right. Is there a motion?
[1:57:30] Mr. Mayor, it moves that we adjourn executive session.
[1:57:33] Second. Is there a discussion?
[1:57:35] All in favor of coming out of executive session,
[1:57:37] signify so by saying aye.
[1:57:39] Aye. All opposed?
[1:57:40] All right. We're out of executive session.
[1:57:42] Just a minute. It moves that we adjourn the meeting.
[1:57:45] Aye. Second.
[1:57:47] Any discussion?
[1:57:49] All in favor of adjournment of the work session,
[1:57:51] signify so by saying aye.
[1:57:52] Aye. Aye. All opposed?
[1:57:53] All right, we're adjourned.
[1:57:58] Okay, welcome to the...