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This webinar is being recorded. So we

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will next move to our introductions and

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welcoming remarks. So I will turn it

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over to Fred.

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» Oh, unmute yourself real quick, Fred.

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» Thank you. Uh thank you very much,

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Paige. Uh welcome everyone. My name is

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uh Fred Bon. Um just a little bit of an

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update for you. Since we last spoke, um

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I've accepted sort of a new role with uh

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New York State Parks. Uh about three

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weeks ago, Commissioner Moer named me as

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acting deputy commissioner for

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operations.

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Going to continue with this project. Uh

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tonight's a big night, so I didn't want

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to let go of this project in this new

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role. So uh um I'll just kick it over to

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Kathy in a in a second. Kathy has been

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named as the acting regional director

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for the Fingerlake State Park System. So

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Kathy, would you please be kind and

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introduce yourself?

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» Hello everyone. My name is Kathy

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Nordfanzo and I am the acting regional

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director for the Fingerlakes region.

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Thank you.

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» Uh James

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uh good evening everybody. Um my name is

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James Jeffrey. I'm the park manager for

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Harriet Hollister uh the Honeyway Boat

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Launch and Stony Brook State Park. and

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uh I'm happy to be with you tonight. Uh

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I'll take it over to Zach.

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» Good evening everybody. I'm Zach

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Ballard. I'm the Fingerlakes Regional

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Trail Coordinator. Uh and I will kick

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that over to Charlie or to Elena, I'm

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sorry.

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» Yes. Hello. I'm Elena Burns. I'm the

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assistant district manager of

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environmental stewardship in the

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Fingerlakes. So I'll kick it over to

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Charlie.

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» Hi everyone. My name is Charlie Apaleo,

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Fingerlakes Regional Biologist, and I'll

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kick it over to Lindsay.

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» Hi, I'm Lindseay Donroski. I'm an

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environmental analyst covering the

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Fingerlakes and Central Region, and I

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complete environmental reviews.

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» All right, thank you every

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» Oh, Paige. Yes,

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» The voice, the technology for the

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evening. I am Paige Barnum. I uh lead

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the planning section. Our group is based

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in Albany. we cover statewide. And we

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also have joining us on the call uh

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Chris Morris. I'll give you the mic for

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a second, Chris Morris.

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» Sure. Thank you. Just want to unmute

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myself. Um Chris Morris, I'm the

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planner. Uh work with Paige in our

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Albany office and uh

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cover trails statewide um and work with

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Zach and others in the regions quite

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frequently. Thanks.

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Thanks, Chris.

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» Excellent.

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» Thank Thank you, everyone. Thank you,

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team parks. Um, so a couple of thoughts

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as we we get going. I just want to

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remind everybody sort of the the purpose

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and the goals uh around uh this project.

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Um, and I just want to say I'm

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incredibly proud of uh the state parks

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team that assembled around this review

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of the trail system at Harriet Hollister

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Spencer. Um it has been a a good amount

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of work. It has been thorough work. It

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has been uh processing a lot of your

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feedback and input. Um it's been using

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signs to do evaluation of the park

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infrastructure

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uh the natural areas of the park. So

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it's a been a really thorough

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comprehensive comprehensive review. And

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I'll go back to the original reason for

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for doing this and remind people that

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what we have at Harriet Hollister or

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what we had at Harriet Hollister and

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we're we're we're presenting to to

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tonight. Harriet Hollister had an awful

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lot of recreational trails that were not

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authorized recreational trails. A number

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of a number of folks had uh uh created

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their own trail systems. Not all trails

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were marked. We ran into a public safety

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concern where first responders were

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having difficulty understanding where

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they were in the park, where injured

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individuals were in the park. And so we

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wanted to take a step back and do a sort

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of a comprehensive overview of the

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existing trail structures, see which

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ones made sense and which activities uh

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made sense on that that trail system. So

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really focusing in first and foremost on

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safety. That's core to our mission.

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Um we wanted to eliminate the

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redundancies within the trail system uh

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to manage those trail systems better to

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to make them uh uh available for

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generations to come and respect uh the

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the natural area that we have. Um

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improving environmental stewardship and

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and protecting the resource. One of the

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things that we that came about from this

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is that Harriet Hollister is an

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incredibly special special uh natural

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area and Elena and the biologists will

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get into that in a little bit, but we

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discovered things about this piece of

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property that we had not known prior to

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this project. And then we needed to take

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a look at whether it would be possible

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to uh allow for equestrian use based on

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on requests that we had received. Um,

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and I'll just be clear at the get-go

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here, after considerable uh evaluation,

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taking a look at what that activity

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represents, taking a look at feedback

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from other user groups, uh we have

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determined that that is not a compatible

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use uh within the Harriet Hollister

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property. It's never been allowed within

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the property and after taking a deep

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look into possible ways to try and

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incorporate it uh due to the the the

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challenging natural areas and park

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infrastructure uh we have determined

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that it is not possible to allow

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equestrian use uh at Harriet Hollister.

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Okay. Um so uh let's go to slide six and

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we'll talk about sort of just the

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overview of the property.

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So what we're looking at is and you're

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major users of the property currently uh

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the property is uh just a little over uh

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1500 acres uh as of July. We have a

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significant acquisition, another 117

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acres that's in the queue that we're

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working on the Fingerlakes, a very

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special piece of property uh that faces

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Hanoi uh uh lake. Um and it is a

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fourseason facility. This park operates

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uh all 12 months of the year. Uh it has

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multiple activities, winter activities,

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uh hiking, snowshoeing, mountain biking,

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birding, uh uh cross-country skiing,

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snowmmoiling. It's a really uh

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incredibly valuable uh recreational

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asset to the state park system. Okay.

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So, that was not lost on us and we

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really spent a lot of time uh getting

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feedback from all of those user groups

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and that's what we've used to guide our

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uh our plan moving forward. Okay.

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All right. Thanks, Fred.

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I think I'll take it from here unless

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there's anything you want to add to this

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last slide here.

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» No, you know, and again, no changes to

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the current recreational usage uh

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equestrian usage will not be allowed uh

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on the property. Um just want to make

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sure that's uh uh clear for all.

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» All right. Thanks, Fred. So, as he

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mentioned, you know, we've been along

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this ride for a little bit. We last saw

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all of you um at town hall back in March

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2025. And so what we've got here on the

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screen right now is sort of a

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color-coded timeline to sort of show you

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what's been happening um since last

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year. So of course uh green here sort of

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represents the the basic planning

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activities overview. Um we had our

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public comment period because of course

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we took uh question and comments and had

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sort of a discussion uh town hall then

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back in March 25 and ran our public

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comment period. Um we'll definitely go

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into more detail in the presentation

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about what we heard through public

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comment and how it really shaped um the

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trail plan that we're going to go

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through tonight. Um so thank you to

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everyone that participated. I believe we

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had um over 110 um between individuals

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and organizations participating. So um

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wonderful engagement and we really

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appreciate your feedback because it

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absolutely impacted the outcomes from

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this project. Then we get into spring

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and summer of last year, parsing through

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all those comments, having team

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meetings, talking about the different

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insights and perspectives that you all

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had to offer. Here in orange, we've got

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uh our trails group and sort of what

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they've been up to in the past year.

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They've installed trial counters and did

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some data gathering. They did in-person

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surveys and parking lot observation.

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Perhaps some of you ran into them out on

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the site. Um they were doing that work

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through spring into early last fall. And

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of course they were doing more GIS sort

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of like ground truthing and trail

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condition studies um throughout the year

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because as I'm sure you all know there's

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a very different environment at Harriet

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Hollister in the winter than there is

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the spring versus the summer. And

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finally here we have our stewardship our

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environmental group in the sort of

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purple grape colored um timeline at the

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bottom. You'll hear a lot about vernal

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pools later and the great assessment

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that went into that that really

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influences again um the changes to the

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trail network that we're going to see.

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Um I'm not going to go too in depth on

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this as um we've got some great

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biologists on the call who will give you

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a little bit more detail about the work

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they've been up to, but some more plant

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surveys, invasive species research.

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Uh we have vegetation studies again,

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invasive species treatment and of course

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um year round all of our respective

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disciplines are working on trail

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restoration initiatives tackling

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invasive species. So that's sort of a

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broad overview and now I'm going to kick

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it over to our park manager James who

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will um talk again about sort of you

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know from the outset we really wanted to

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address safety and operational concerns.

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So, I will turn it over to James.

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» Hi everybody. Thank you. Um, if you

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weren't here for our last meeting, uh,

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my name is James. I'm in charge of

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operating and the maintenance at the

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facility and just the daily operations

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of what happens there. Uh, when I took

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this position in, uh, 2022, I did

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realize that there were some challenges

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with the trail system that currently

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existed. Um, it was a little bit complex

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and it kind of lacked the appropriate

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wayfinding market. Um there are a lot of

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trails that weren't blazed in any way.

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Um you know the published map that we

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had line online did not align with what

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was in the field. So there might be a

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trail that you see on the map and then

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you'll be somewhere completely

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different. Um and the existing

271
00:11:23,680 --> 00:11:27,600
infrastructure made it really hard for

272
00:11:25,279 --> 00:11:29,440
me to prioritize, you know, where my

273
00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:31,519
crews go. Say there's storm damage or

274
00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:33,920
hazardous trees. Which trails are the

275
00:11:31,519 --> 00:11:36,720
most used? What's more important? Uh,

276
00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:38,160
and then finally EMS reached out to me

277
00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:40,160
because there was an incident on the

278
00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:41,920
property. They were looking for somebody

279
00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:43,519
and they said, "Please do something

280
00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:45,360
about the facility. We had a really hard

281
00:11:43,519 --> 00:11:47,440
time finding this individual." And I

282
00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:49,519
said, "Of course, I'll work on that."

283
00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:51,279
Uh, but me, I wasn't exactly sure how to

284
00:11:49,519 --> 00:11:52,959
do that right away. So, I have reached

285
00:11:51,279 --> 00:11:55,440
out to the, you know, everybody on the

286
00:11:52,959 --> 00:11:58,320
team here to, uh, try to put a plan

287
00:11:55,440 --> 00:12:00,480
forward. Um, and I think what we have

288
00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:03,440
developed between everybody really

289
00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:05,360
alleviates a lot of these issues. Um,

290
00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:07,760
but to get there, we had to collect a

291
00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:09,279
whole bunch of data uh and find out

292
00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:11,440
things about the facility that we needed

293
00:12:09,279 --> 00:12:14,880
to know. Um, I'm going to kick it over

294
00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:17,519
to Elena to least about the first

295
00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:21,839
environmental process uh of the data

296
00:12:17,519 --> 00:12:24,160
that they found. Thank you.

297
00:12:21,839 --> 00:12:27,600
» Great. Thank you, James.

298
00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:30,160
So, I'd like to provide a brief overview

299
00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:32,880
of Harriet Hollister Spencer. Um the

300
00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:35,440
main parcel is pictured here. You can

301
00:12:32,880 --> 00:12:39,440
see the park boundary in this green

302
00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:42,560
dashed line. Um so this particular map

303
00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:45,680
um denotes the natural communities on

304
00:12:42,560 --> 00:12:48,399
site. So there's several kind of greens

305
00:12:45,680 --> 00:12:51,440
and browns that are lit up in this map.

306
00:12:48,399 --> 00:12:53,839
Uh so the predominant natural community

307
00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:56,480
on this site is the Appalachian oak

308
00:12:53,839 --> 00:12:59,680
hickory forest. Um, and then there's

309
00:12:56,480 --> 00:13:02,800
also Appalachian oak pine forest, which

310
00:12:59,680 --> 00:13:05,360
you can see denoted in sort of a lighter

311
00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:08,079
sandy color in the middle. And to the

312
00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:12,160
south of the park, there's also some

313
00:13:08,079 --> 00:13:14,800
conifer plantations denoted in green,

314
00:13:12,160 --> 00:13:17,440
the light green. And then to the north

315
00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:20,480
and the south, there are hemlock

316
00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:23,120
northern hardwood forests ecosystems.

317
00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:25,279
Those are uh strongly associated with

318
00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:29,040
the riverine systems that eventually

319
00:13:25,279 --> 00:13:31,600
make their way to the Honeyoi inlet. So

320
00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:36,240
just taking a look at this map, you can

321
00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:38,639
see that pretty much the entire uh park

322
00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:40,880
is within a natural state, right? So we

323
00:13:38,639 --> 00:13:43,440
have very limited development at this

324
00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:46,560
park. You can see the parking lot

325
00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:50,160
pictured in a gray coloration and then

326
00:13:46,560 --> 00:13:52,880
the access road, right? So um this is a

327
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:55,120
prominent example of a large expanse of

328
00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:56,959
contiguous natural habitat in the

329
00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:58,880
overall area. I think it's worth

330
00:13:56,959 --> 00:14:01,680
mentioning that the bordering properties

331
00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:04,800
as well are also predominantly

332
00:14:01,680 --> 00:14:07,360
undeveloped. So you know just a a huge

333
00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:08,800
expanse of undeveloped area. So this

334
00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:11,360
contributes to the ecological

335
00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:13,839
significance of this park. And I think

336
00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:16,480
frankly it's it's why this park is so

337
00:14:13,839 --> 00:14:18,720
well loved because of this this natural

338
00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:20,480
state which is pretty pretty impressive,

339
00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:24,399
pretty neat.

340
00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:27,440
And so the next map that I want to show

341
00:14:24,399 --> 00:14:29,680
highlights significant communities

342
00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:32,480
within the park. So again, we've got our

343
00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:35,199
main parcel pictured here and there's

344
00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:37,760
two two natural communities that light

345
00:14:35,199 --> 00:14:41,680
up as being significant. So this

346
00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:43,839
designation of significant uh this comes

347
00:14:41,680 --> 00:14:48,079
from the natural heritage program. So

348
00:14:43,839 --> 00:14:50,160
this is um a group of expert scientists,

349
00:14:48,079 --> 00:14:52,800
zoologologists, ecologists, botnists.

350
00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:54,720
They do work all over the state mapping

351
00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:57,600
and inventoring

352
00:14:54,720 --> 00:15:00,000
um these natural habitats. And so

353
00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:03,519
habitats that they deem to be rare

354
00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:05,199
within the state or of high quality,

355
00:15:03,519 --> 00:15:08,560
they give this designation of

356
00:15:05,199 --> 00:15:10,240
significant. So the two natural

357
00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:12,320
communities that we have within the park

358
00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:15,120
boundaries are the oak hickory and the

359
00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:18,079
oak pine forest um which we saw in the

360
00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:21,760
previous map. I also want to note just

361
00:15:18,079 --> 00:15:24,639
across route 36 here we've got uh the

362
00:15:21,760 --> 00:15:26,720
honeyo inlet uh wetland complex which is

363
00:15:24,639 --> 00:15:29,519
also denoted as a significant natural

364
00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:31,920
community. So again just a really

365
00:15:29,519 --> 00:15:35,920
predominant example of highquality

366
00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:38,320
intact natural communities at this site.

367
00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:41,440
And so another important ecological

368
00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:44,800
aspect of the park is the habitat value

369
00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:47,199
for birds. So um Harriet Hollister

370
00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:50,320
Spencer is within a designated important

371
00:15:47,199 --> 00:15:53,360
breeding area or an IBA.

372
00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:56,079
And so this IBA is designated as a state

373
00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:57,920
priority for important habitats for the

374
00:15:56,079 --> 00:15:59,440
conservation of bird populations. Right?

375
00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:01,759
So it's recognized as being a

376
00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:04,800
significant place for birds to survive

377
00:16:01,759 --> 00:16:06,800
and thrive within the state. Um and one

378
00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:09,120
of the key habitats that defines this

379
00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:13,519
IBA is forested habitats, right? Which

380
00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:16,880
we can see pretty clearly from this map.

381
00:16:13,519 --> 00:16:18,880
And so we've we've talked broadly about

382
00:16:16,880 --> 00:16:21,680
about the eco or the ecological

383
00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:24,320
importance of this site. Um we do want

384
00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:27,279
to take a deep dive into a specific

385
00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:30,160
unique habitat type within the park. Um,

386
00:16:27,279 --> 00:16:32,639
so one feature that makes this site so

387
00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:36,000
special ecologically is the presence of

388
00:16:32,639 --> 00:16:38,399
a large vernal pool complex. And like

389
00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:40,639
Fred mentioned, we have learned a lot

390
00:16:38,399 --> 00:16:44,079
over the past couple years from

391
00:16:40,639 --> 00:16:46,000
extensive survey work and study. And

392
00:16:44,079 --> 00:16:48,560
we'll be presenting some of our findings

393
00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:50,959
tonight. So I will hand it over to

394
00:16:48,560 --> 00:16:53,680
Charlie Epelo, the biologist who

395
00:16:50,959 --> 00:16:56,480
oversees the project to discuss our

396
00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:58,880
findings.

397
00:16:56,480 --> 00:17:01,199
Thank you, Elena. Appreciate it. Um, but

398
00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:03,519
yeah, so Harriet Hollister and the

399
00:17:01,199 --> 00:17:05,600
forest around it are full of small

400
00:17:03,519 --> 00:17:08,000
temporary wetlands called vernal pools.

401
00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:09,919
Um, some of you may have walked right

402
00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:12,240
past some of them without even knowing

403
00:17:09,919 --> 00:17:14,880
it while walking the trails at Harriet

404
00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:17,120
Hollister. Um, but basically a vernal

405
00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:20,319
pool is pretty much just a a little

406
00:17:17,120 --> 00:17:23,280
seasonal wetland. Um they fill up with s

407
00:17:20,319 --> 00:17:25,760
snow melt and uh rain in the spring and

408
00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:28,880
then they dry up over the summer as uh

409
00:17:25,760 --> 00:17:30,640
the temperatures kind of warm up. Um

410
00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:32,799
they typic they're typically very small

411
00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:36,000
and shallow. Um and they're

412
00:17:32,799 --> 00:17:38,160
geographically discreet, meaning they

413
00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:41,039
there's no continuous surface connecting

414
00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:42,720
them to a stream or a lake or any other

415
00:17:41,039 --> 00:17:45,200
permanent water source. They're just

416
00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:47,520
kind of on their own. Um, and because

417
00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:49,679
they dry out every year, uh, they can

418
00:17:47,520 --> 00:17:51,679
hold they can't hold permanent fish,

419
00:17:49,679 --> 00:17:54,000
which is what makes these vernal pools

420
00:17:51,679 --> 00:17:56,160
quite unique, um, and why they're so

421
00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:57,600
important. So, frogs and salamanders and

422
00:17:56,160 --> 00:18:00,080
nudes and a lot of a lot of

423
00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:02,640
invertebrates are high highly vulnerable

424
00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:04,799
to fish, and fish obviously need water

425
00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:06,799
year round. So, a pool that disappears

426
00:18:04,799 --> 00:18:09,039
every summer uh, ends up being one of

427
00:18:06,799 --> 00:18:11,919
the most safest places or the most

428
00:18:09,039 --> 00:18:14,960
safest place. um a lot of these uh

429
00:18:11,919 --> 00:18:17,440
forest uh amphibians uh can lay where

430
00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:19,679
they can lay eggs. Um and then so in

431
00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:23,280
this particular slide here, the first

432
00:18:19,679 --> 00:18:24,960
the top two photos show what uh Harriet

433
00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:27,280
Hollister typically looks like in the

434
00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:29,440
spring. You have full pools and then at

435
00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:32,480
the bottom the bottom two photos here

436
00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:35,200
are um of what it looks like in July

437
00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:39,440
completely dried up. So we're good to go

438
00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:41,760
to the next slide. Um so why do we care?

439
00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:43,600
So, there's three reasons. Uh, first,

440
00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:46,400
they're critical breeding habitat for

441
00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:48,320
amphibians. Um, for a lot of species,

442
00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:51,520
this isn't a preference. It's the only

443
00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:53,679
place they can, uh, reproduce. Um, which

444
00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:55,760
is super important. So, and second, uh,

445
00:18:53,679 --> 00:18:57,600
is the diversity. It's not just for

446
00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:59,120
frogs and salamanders. Um, there's a

447
00:18:57,600 --> 00:19:01,360
whole range of different species that

448
00:18:59,120 --> 00:19:03,919
use these pools for shelter, um, for

449
00:19:01,360 --> 00:19:06,240
food, for habitat, um, and for their

450
00:19:03,919 --> 00:19:09,360
size. They're some of the richest spots

451
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:11,760
in the forest floristically and just

452
00:19:09,360 --> 00:19:14,720
with uh many different species utilizing

453
00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:16,320
them. And then third, um they do a lot

454
00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:19,120
of work for us. So they recharge

455
00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:21,679
groundwater. They help um with flood

456
00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:23,039
control and improve water quality. And

457
00:19:21,679 --> 00:19:26,000
so when you put all of these different

458
00:19:23,039 --> 00:19:28,640
things together, uh you get all of these

459
00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:30,559
different characters and uh it qualifies

460
00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:34,880
as a pretty significant a very

461
00:19:30,559 --> 00:19:37,600
significant community. um uh relative

462
00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:39,679
hot spots for diversity, niche habitat

463
00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:41,360
you don't really find anywhere else. Um

464
00:19:39,679 --> 00:19:43,600
pretty pretty sparse throughout the

465
00:19:41,360 --> 00:19:47,360
state honestly. And um integral breeding

466
00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:48,960
for amphibians is is exactly why we put

467
00:19:47,360 --> 00:19:51,120
this these are the reasons why we put

468
00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:54,320
two years of survey work into

469
00:19:51,120 --> 00:19:56,720
understanding uh what we have here. So

470
00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:59,760
we're good to go to the next slide. Um

471
00:19:56,720 --> 00:20:03,919
and so using grant funding, survey work

472
00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:07,200
ran across the springs of 2025 and 2026.

473
00:20:03,919 --> 00:20:09,840
Um we started mapping, walking through

474
00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:13,200
the property, surveying and locating uh

475
00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:15,520
every pool we could find. Um then egg

476
00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:17,520
mass counts. So our staff counted egg

477
00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:20,320
masses and identified them down to

478
00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:22,559
species. That answers two things things.

479
00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:25,039
Um which species are actually using

480
00:20:22,559 --> 00:20:28,159
these pools and how productive each pool

481
00:20:25,039 --> 00:20:31,120
is. uh for productivity we used the

482
00:20:28,159 --> 00:20:34,000
DEEC's criteria which accounts for the

483
00:20:31,120 --> 00:20:37,679
species present in um and the number of

484
00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:40,880
egg masses that we observed um that were

485
00:20:37,679 --> 00:20:43,360
observed in each pool. Um uh we also

486
00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:46,400
took physical measurements. So maximum

487
00:20:43,360 --> 00:20:50,080
depth uh how long the pool holds water,

488
00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:52,640
the pH, um all these things uh give us a

489
00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:54,559
structure and chemistry of each pool and

490
00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:56,720
that's how we kind of start to

491
00:20:54,559 --> 00:20:59,039
understand what these plants and animals

492
00:20:56,720 --> 00:21:02,240
actually need here at Harry Hollister

493
00:20:59,039 --> 00:21:04,559
specifically. Um and we documented uh

494
00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:06,720
plant communities uh in and around every

495
00:21:04,559 --> 00:21:08,799
pool along with invasive species we came

496
00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:10,480
across. We're good to go to the next

497
00:21:08,799 --> 00:21:12,640
slide.

498
00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:16,320
So, yeah. Um, so what we found, here's

499
00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:18,480
what we found. Um, on a on mapping,

500
00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:21,440
there's significant complex of vernal

501
00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:24,400
pools spread across this property and we

502
00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:26,799
now have a solid picture of where we are

503
00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:28,559
and how they're distributed. Um, our

504
00:21:26,799 --> 00:21:30,320
colleagues at Natural Heritage Program

505
00:21:28,559 --> 00:21:33,200
came out to help with us with that

506
00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:35,280
effort as well. Um, but on egg masses,

507
00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:39,919
we detected eight species using these

508
00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:43,039
pools. In 2025, 58 pools had eggs and 40

509
00:21:39,919 --> 00:21:47,520
of those met uh DEEC's criteria for uh

510
00:21:43,039 --> 00:21:51,360
productive pool. And then in 2026, 65 uh

511
00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:54,320
pools had eggs and uh 55 were deemed

512
00:21:51,360 --> 00:21:57,440
productive. Um so over the two years,

513
00:21:54,320 --> 00:22:00,559
about 60% of every pool we documented

514
00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:03,200
had egg masses in it, which is a is very

515
00:22:00,559 --> 00:22:05,360
high. It's a very productive site. Um,

516
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:08,880
these pools are integral to how local

517
00:22:05,360 --> 00:22:11,440
amphibians reproduce and uh the species

518
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:14,799
we're seeing do well uh with the

519
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:17,280
elevation here and the relatively low

520
00:22:14,799 --> 00:22:18,799
disturbance uh throughout the site as

521
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:20,480
well.

522
00:22:18,799 --> 00:22:22,960
Um the physical measurements are still

523
00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:25,200
being analyzed uh because conditions

524
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:29,679
vary a lot from from pool to pool. But

525
00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:31,919
um in 2025 data points in uh the the

526
00:22:29,679 --> 00:22:34,880
data points in a consist consistent

527
00:22:31,919 --> 00:22:37,919
direction. Um the pools do best uh the

528
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:39,679
pools that are doing best are deeper um

529
00:22:37,919 --> 00:22:43,440
and they hold longer. They're they're

530
00:22:39,679 --> 00:22:45,360
relatively undisturbed. Um and uh the

531
00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:47,280
plant data told a similar story. A lot

532
00:22:45,360 --> 00:22:49,520
of our pools have plant communities

533
00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:52,480
diverse enough to meet uh the standard

534
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:55,039
for significant floral quality.

535
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:57,120
Um, and this is where kind of everything

536
00:22:55,039 --> 00:23:00,720
comes together. So, our highest scoring

537
00:22:57,120 --> 00:23:03,200
pools um are way out into the forest,

538
00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:06,799
well away from any trail. Um, and our

539
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:09,200
lowest scoring pool sits right next uh

540
00:23:06,799 --> 00:23:11,120
right next to the parking lot um where

541
00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:14,720
there's typically a lot of disturbance.

542
00:23:11,120 --> 00:23:18,240
Um, every one of six uh lowest scoring

543
00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:21,840
pools on on this property is uh directly

544
00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:25,039
next to a trail or a parking lot. Um and

545
00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:27,600
that pattern is across the the whole

546
00:23:25,039 --> 00:23:29,679
data set. Um the pools farthest from

547
00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:32,000
disturbance have high the highest

548
00:23:29,679 --> 00:23:33,600
ecological diversity and the lowest

549
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:35,840
occurrence of invasives. And then the

550
00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:38,159
pools closest to the trails have the

551
00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:40,720
lowest diversity and and the most

552
00:23:38,159 --> 00:23:42,320
invasives, which is what makes the

553
00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:44,720
conserving these communities so

554
00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:48,480
important, especially in areas where

555
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:53,320
invasive encroachment is most likely.

556
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:53,320
But um yeah, I'll kick it back to Elena.

557
00:23:54,880 --> 00:24:01,200
» Great. Thank you, Charlie. And yes, big

558
00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:03,120
thank you to Charlie and his team, Abby

559
00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:05,520
Welch, who's sitting next to me right

560
00:24:03,120 --> 00:24:08,240
now. This was a tremendous survey

561
00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:10,640
effort, two-year survey effort. We now

562
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:13,200
have a solid understanding of the

563
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:16,080
ecological significance of this site.

564
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:18,559
So, this is a critical breeding habitat

565
00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:21,840
for amphibians. Um, so one of the

566
00:24:18,559 --> 00:24:25,279
biggest threats facing amphibians today

567
00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:27,440
is habitat loss and habitat degradation.

568
00:24:25,279 --> 00:24:30,000
Um, and as you can see from these

569
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:32,400
photos, some of the existing trails are

570
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:34,720
directly next to or cutting right

571
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:36,640
through vernal pools. And I recall

572
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:39,039
someone mentioning in the previous

573
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:42,799
public meeting that yes, like they they

574
00:24:39,039 --> 00:24:46,559
saw tadpoles like within the proximity

575
00:24:42,799 --> 00:24:48,880
of of that trail system. So um this this

576
00:24:46,559 --> 00:24:50,480
creates impacts uh to the species

577
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:53,360
themselves you know from direct

578
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:56,240
mortality getting crushed um but it also

579
00:24:53,360 --> 00:24:59,200
impacts the breeding habitat. So it

580
00:24:56,240 --> 00:25:02,880
causes issues with water quality, soil

581
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:04,960
compaction and trampling vegetation.

582
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:07,200
So, as Charlie mentioned, our data

583
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:09,200
suggests that there's lower ecological

584
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:12,159
diversity in vernal pools that are

585
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:14,720
closer to trails and higher incidence of

586
00:25:12,159 --> 00:25:20,400
invasive species from that disturbance.

587
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:22,960
So, that makes sense. Um, so overall,

588
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:25,360
um, the site has low incidence of

589
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:29,039
invasive species.

590
00:25:25,360 --> 00:25:31,520
However, where invasive species do occur

591
00:25:29,039 --> 00:25:33,760
is predominantly along trails. So you

592
00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:36,720
can see this map pictured here. We've

593
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:39,679
got the invasive species lit up in this

594
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:42,320
red color. Um so you can see visually

595
00:25:39,679 --> 00:25:44,640
that invasive species are found along

596
00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:47,120
trails somewhat into the interior. We've

597
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:50,400
got some larger infestations, these

598
00:25:47,120 --> 00:25:53,200
polygons. Uh but they tend to spread via

599
00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:56,320
trail systems. And so these were all

600
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:59,600
considerations in the trail planning

601
00:25:56,320 --> 00:26:04,320
process over the past couple years. And

602
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:06,400
our goal during this this process is to

603
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:08,640
achieve a balance right between the

604
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:12,000
recreation and the preservation of this

605
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:14,480
unique site. So I'll summarize some of

606
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:19,000
our conclusions from the ecological

607
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:19,000
assessment on the next slide.

608
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:25,039
So it turns out that the vernal pool

609
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:27,679
complex at Harriet Hollis Hollister

610
00:26:25,039 --> 00:26:32,799
Spencer is much larger than we

611
00:26:27,679 --> 00:26:35,360
previously thought. Um

612
00:26:32,799 --> 00:26:37,840
the egg mass surveys over the past two

613
00:26:35,360 --> 00:26:40,240
years revealed that this is a highly

614
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:43,120
productive site. So we have many many

615
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:45,919
many amphibians coming using these

616
00:26:43,120 --> 00:26:49,039
pools, breeding in these pools. uh so

617
00:26:45,919 --> 00:26:50,880
much so that this site is now recognized

618
00:26:49,039 --> 00:26:54,000
as one of the most important breeding

619
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:56,320
habitats in the state for amphibians.

620
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:58,960
Right? So this is so neat. We have this

621
00:26:56,320 --> 00:27:01,200
incredible ecological feature at this

622
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:04,159
park, right? And we want to ensure that

623
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:06,240
we're protecting this sensitive habitat.

624
00:27:04,159 --> 00:27:09,679
So what an excellent opportunity that we

625
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:12,320
have to do that. And so looking back at

626
00:27:09,679 --> 00:27:14,880
the data, we determined that the trails

627
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:17,679
likely have a negative impact on these

628
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:20,000
vernal pools, right? So like Charlie was

629
00:27:17,679 --> 00:27:22,080
mentioning, uh we found that vernal

630
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:25,440
pools closer to trails have lower

631
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:27,840
biodiversity and lower productivity,

632
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:30,799
right? So in other words, uh we found

633
00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:33,120
less native plant species documented

634
00:27:30,799 --> 00:27:35,600
within those pools closer to trails and

635
00:27:33,120 --> 00:27:38,240
parking lots and amphibians. They're not

636
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:40,480
using those pools as readily. Um, so

637
00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:42,240
we're still assessing whether or not

638
00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:44,640
there are specific features that

639
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:47,200
amphibians key into when it comes to

640
00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:49,520
selecting the vernal pools for breed for

641
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:52,960
uh breeding purposes. Um, but that

642
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:55,200
assessment is still ongoing. Um, and I

643
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:57,440
want to mention we we worked very

644
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:59,760
closely with our partners, our

645
00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:02,799
collaborators at natural heritage

646
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:05,840
program um, on the survey work. They

647
00:28:02,799 --> 00:28:07,600
helped rank the pools. We prioritized

648
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:10,880
areas so that we could make informed

649
00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:13,600
decisions during this process. Um, so we

650
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:15,760
really honed in and focused on several

651
00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:18,399
key modifications that would have the

652
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:20,880
greatest impact towards conserving these

653
00:28:18,399 --> 00:28:22,720
vernal pools and the amphibians that

654
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:24,960
that depend on these, right? This is

655
00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:26,559
their their breeding habitat. As Charlie

656
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:29,279
mentioned, it's it's not a choice,

657
00:28:26,559 --> 00:28:31,039
right? These are critical for um these

658
00:28:29,279 --> 00:28:33,120
populations.

659
00:28:31,039 --> 00:28:35,120
And so our goal was very much

660
00:28:33,120 --> 00:28:37,600
missiondriven, right? Achieving that

661
00:28:35,120 --> 00:28:41,039
balance between recreation and

662
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:44,080
stewardship. Um so to conclude the

663
00:28:41,039 --> 00:28:46,880
stewardship section of the program, uh I

664
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:49,039
wanted to convey that this site is

665
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:51,120
special. This site is unique, right?

666
00:28:49,039 --> 00:28:53,840
It's why we're all here. It's why we

667
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:56,240
love this park. Um, we certainly don't

668
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:59,600
want our activities and recreation to na

669
00:28:56,240 --> 00:29:01,360
negatively impact this unique habitat um

670
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:04,480
and the special critters that that

671
00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:08,080
depend on it. And so I'd like to close

672
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:11,760
this section uh with an invitation and

673
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:14,799
an opportunity to come out and visit a

674
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:18,080
vernal pool and learn firsthand about

675
00:29:14,799 --> 00:29:22,159
these unique habitats. So the tentative

676
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:24,080
date as of now is April 2027. So, this

677
00:29:22,159 --> 00:29:26,880
is the next breeding season for

678
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:30,880
amphibians. Um, so we'll be working

679
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:34,159
closely with Paige and James to ensure

680
00:29:30,880 --> 00:29:36,320
this event is publicized. So, please

681
00:29:34,159 --> 00:29:39,039
come out, bring your families, bring

682
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:43,240
your friends, and we hope to see you out

683
00:29:39,039 --> 00:29:43,240
there. Thank you.

684
00:29:56,159 --> 00:30:02,960
So, uh, again, we're going to go back to

685
00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:05,840
the public feedback that we took. Um, we

686
00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:08,159
had our, uh, attendance in person

687
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:11,360
meeting back, uh, in March, a little

688
00:30:08,159 --> 00:30:14,240
over a year ago. Uh in addition to that

689
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:17,279
we received over 110

690
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:19,919
uh comments uh submitted from

691
00:30:17,279 --> 00:30:23,840
individuals organizations.

692
00:30:19,919 --> 00:30:25,039
Um, and these comments there's I'm not

693
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:29,360
going to go through the whole entire

694
00:30:25,039 --> 00:30:32,559
slide, but it was a very very robust and

695
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:35,679
comprehensive and diverse group of uh

696
00:30:32,559 --> 00:30:38,320
audience that uh that weighed in on uh

697
00:30:35,679 --> 00:30:41,360
what they valued uh with Harriet

698
00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:44,320
Hollister. Okay. So, I do want to make

699
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:46,799
it clear that we received great public

700
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:49,919
comment and that was all taken into

701
00:30:46,799 --> 00:30:53,960
serious consideration as we put our plan

702
00:30:49,919 --> 00:30:53,960
as we put our plan forward.

703
00:30:54,640 --> 00:31:03,039
» Thanks, Fred. I think we'll next go to

704
00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:04,720
Zach who will speak to trails. And I um

705
00:31:03,039 --> 00:31:07,120
think if you go through the

706
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:09,679
presentation, Zach, for your your

707
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:11,039
portion of the presentation, um you'll

708
00:31:09,679 --> 00:31:13,600
really emphasize, you know, the the

709
00:31:11,039 --> 00:31:18,399
impact public feedback had on some of

710
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:21,600
the more trail specific uh decisions.

711
00:31:18,399 --> 00:31:23,520
» Yeah, thanks Paige. Thanks, Fred. Um so

712
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:25,600
yeah,

713
00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:31,440
we have been working for the past two

714
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:33,679
years on developing a plan to,

715
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:37,919
for lack of a better word, simplify the

716
00:31:33,679 --> 00:31:40,399
trail system at Harriet Hollister. Um

717
00:31:37,919 --> 00:31:44,240
we did this through a number of means.

718
00:31:40,399 --> 00:31:46,320
Uh most recently, we we considered your

719
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:48,720
public feedback after our meeting in

720
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:50,399
March. Um, as we mentioned in the

721
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:52,720
beginning of the meeting, we had trail

722
00:31:50,399 --> 00:31:56,399
counters out on the ground to kind of

723
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:58,880
track usage. Um, we talked to folks in

724
00:31:56,399 --> 00:32:01,360
the parking lot. Um, we did some, you

725
00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:04,480
know, kind of impromptu and and, uh,

726
00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:06,960
informal surveys there. Uh, we looked at

727
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:09,840
the submissions that that people handed

728
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:12,799
in after the public meeting and we took

729
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:15,039
all that to heart. Um, you know, to to

730
00:32:12,799 --> 00:32:17,200
reiterate what James had mentioned at

731
00:32:15,039 --> 00:32:20,480
the top of the meeting, a lot of the

732
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:25,600
impetus for this was health and safety

733
00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:28,559
issues. Um, kind of a lack of uh

734
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:30,320
appropriate wayfinding signage. I know a

735
00:32:28,559 --> 00:32:33,200
lot of you are very familiar with the

736
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:35,519
park and very familiar with the trails.

737
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:37,200
um as as

738
00:32:35,519 --> 00:32:39,200
you know land managers here, what we

739
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:41,360
were running into is folks who were

740
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:44,320
visiting Harriet Hollister um who

741
00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:46,080
weren't as familiar were getting lost uh

742
00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:47,679
and they were they were making it known

743
00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:52,240
to us that they were having a difficult

744
00:32:47,679 --> 00:32:54,880
time uh navigating the trails. Um

745
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:56,960
we also took into consideration

746
00:32:54,880 --> 00:33:00,720
uh trail redundancy. So essentially

747
00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:02,799
where we have trails on top of trails,

748
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:05,120
uh trails that run parallel to one

749
00:33:02,799 --> 00:33:07,600
another, um trails that are getting

750
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:09,919
used, trails that aren't getting used,

751
00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:12,640
and trying to focus in on what we can do

752
00:33:09,919 --> 00:33:15,279
to simplify this map, simplify the

753
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:18,640
trails on the ground, so we as a an

754
00:33:15,279 --> 00:33:20,960
agency can direct our attention and and

755
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:23,039
maintain the trail system to the best of

756
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:25,360
our ability.

757
00:33:23,039 --> 00:33:28,399
um and also make it safe for for

758
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:30,799
everybody who is here using the park. Um

759
00:33:28,399 --> 00:33:34,480
what you see on this first slide is the

760
00:33:30,799 --> 00:33:38,399
original map that is on your left. Um in

761
00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:40,159
the center was our first proposed draft.

762
00:33:38,399 --> 00:33:43,600
Um

763
00:33:40,159 --> 00:33:45,919
and on the the right is our finalized

764
00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:47,360
map. And so the differences that we're

765
00:33:45,919 --> 00:33:50,240
going to lay out, the differences that

766
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:52,240
we're going to talk about um are are

767
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:55,600
things that we close. So we we did

768
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:59,039
eliminate some trails. Uh things that we

769
00:33:55,600 --> 00:34:02,159
will retain. Um and a lot of the things

770
00:33:59,039 --> 00:34:04,799
that we are retaining are based directly

771
00:34:02,159 --> 00:34:08,560
on your feedback in the comments that we

772
00:34:04,799 --> 00:34:10,879
got um after our meeting in March and

773
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:15,119
through surveys we conducted uh over the

774
00:34:10,879 --> 00:34:17,119
past year plus. Um we added additional

775
00:34:15,119 --> 00:34:19,280
trails that we had originally removed.

776
00:34:17,119 --> 00:34:22,240
Uh, and that's a direct response to your

777
00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:24,000
comments. And just overall when I put

778
00:34:22,240 --> 00:34:26,560
this map together and when we developed

779
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:30,560
this map, the big thing I was trying to

780
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:34,159
do was to be objective and develop trail

781
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:36,639
loops and trail systems

782
00:34:34,159 --> 00:34:39,280
um that

783
00:34:36,639 --> 00:34:41,440
are going to be usable that hopefully

784
00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:45,440
maintain the trails that are are

785
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:48,159
actively being used um

786
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:50,720
and also aren't having an extreme uh

787
00:34:48,159 --> 00:34:53,760
impact on the stewardship and

788
00:34:50,720 --> 00:34:56,240
environmental concerns um that Elena and

789
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:58,640
Charlie just discussed. Um so we're

790
00:34:56,240 --> 00:35:00,720
going to zero in on a few changes. Uh so

791
00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:03,760
Paige, if you want, you can advance

792
00:35:00,720 --> 00:35:07,119
slides here.

793
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:08,400
So this is a little bit uh I'm going to

794
00:35:07,119 --> 00:35:11,920
say it's a little bit hard to see

795
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:15,359
because we have maps and we have zoomed

796
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:17,920
in areas on maps. Um, so this first area

797
00:35:15,359 --> 00:35:20,240
is the the blue spruce route uh loop or

798
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:23,839
the spruce run. This is a good example

799
00:35:20,240 --> 00:35:26,640
of of trails where these were running

800
00:35:23,839 --> 00:35:30,800
directly through a large vernal pool

801
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:33,680
complex. So after we did that uh draft

802
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:37,119
proposal map that we presented in March,

803
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:40,400
we received a lot of data about vernal

804
00:35:37,119 --> 00:35:42,880
pool complexes and how active those

805
00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:46,480
vernal pool complexes are at Harriet

806
00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:48,560
Hollister. So it was in our best

807
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:52,000
interest and the best interest of the

808
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:54,240
site to to shutter some of those trails.

809
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:57,119
So this slide shows the original map

810
00:35:54,240 --> 00:35:58,960
again on the far left, the proposed

811
00:35:57,119 --> 00:36:02,560
draft that we presented in March in the

812
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:05,359
center and now um the finalized map that

813
00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:09,040
we have on the right. Um so we

814
00:36:05,359 --> 00:36:12,480
eliminated a leg uh of that that loop.

815
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:16,400
Um and and that was again in response to

816
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:18,640
the vernal pool um complex that that was

817
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:21,040
essentially right in the center of of

818
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:23,359
that that uh western leg of the the red

819
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:25,599
spruce sloop. So some of the things we

820
00:36:23,359 --> 00:36:28,240
shut down, some of the things we removed

821
00:36:25,599 --> 00:36:31,760
uh were were there uh were taken away

822
00:36:28,240 --> 00:36:34,240
primarily to protect vernal pools um and

823
00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:38,119
environmental concerns. Okay, we can

824
00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:38,119
move to the next slide.

825
00:36:38,240 --> 00:36:44,640
Um, this is another example of of a a

826
00:36:42,079 --> 00:36:47,599
larger trail loop that was was removed

827
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:51,839
due to vernal pools. This is uh part of

828
00:36:47,599 --> 00:36:54,560
the single track uh loop, the the S6

829
00:36:51,839 --> 00:36:56,960
loop. Um, lot of different names, a lot

830
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:59,520
of different markers for it. Um, but

831
00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:02,800
this runs into again the the western

832
00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:05,920
side of the park. uh and it was an area

833
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:08,079
that was uh directly uh in conflict with

834
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:11,680
with a pretty substantial vernal pool

835
00:37:08,079 --> 00:37:15,200
complex. So um we still tried to

836
00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:17,920
maintain as much of that loop as we

837
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:19,599
could. Um so just kind of removed an

838
00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:22,240
area that was was going to be in

839
00:37:19,599 --> 00:37:24,560
conflict with those vernal pools.

840
00:37:22,240 --> 00:37:26,960
From a trail maintenance perspective,

841
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:29,359
vernal pools often indicate an area is

842
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:32,160
going to be wet, um have a lot of

843
00:37:29,359 --> 00:37:34,320
standing water, uh you know, especially

844
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:36,720
in the shoulder season. So, you know,

845
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:40,480
another thing we looked at is is our

846
00:37:36,720 --> 00:37:42,079
ability to to maintain those areas. Um

847
00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:44,560
you know, one of our goals moving

848
00:37:42,079 --> 00:37:46,880
forward now that we've kind of uh

849
00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:50,160
consolidated the trail system in the map

850
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:52,800
is to to have a more active role in in

851
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:54,240
improving trails. um and and doing

852
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:57,280
maintenance on the trail system that

853
00:37:54,240 --> 00:37:59,200
that we we have moving forward.

854
00:37:57,280 --> 00:38:02,599
All right. So, uh we can move ahead to

855
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:02,599
the next slide.

856
00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:09,040
Uh another example right here. Uh not to

857
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:11,119
get too too crazy with the vernal pools,

858
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:14,000
but you can see it on the map. There's a

859
00:38:11,119 --> 00:38:17,359
big blue [laughter] a big big blue body

860
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:19,359
of water right there. Um this trail

861
00:38:17,359 --> 00:38:21,680
there's a few different alignments that

862
00:38:19,359 --> 00:38:24,240
are are actually on the ground. This

863
00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:27,280
this map really only shows one of them.

864
00:38:24,240 --> 00:38:29,359
Um so this was an area of concern uh due

865
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:31,680
to vernal pool complexes. And if you

866
00:38:29,359 --> 00:38:34,480
want to jump ahead to the next slide um

867
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:37,200
we can show how that's changed. Not a

868
00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:38,720
drastic change. This is essentially uh

869
00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:41,359
you can see it. It's kind of faint on

870
00:38:38,720 --> 00:38:43,280
the map on the left on the draft map. We

871
00:38:41,359 --> 00:38:45,920
essentially just eliminated one section

872
00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:48,240
of trail and realigned it to another

873
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:52,079
section of trail that was I believe

874
00:38:48,240 --> 00:38:54,720
getting used more um you know and and

875
00:38:52,079 --> 00:38:57,200
was an active trail unmapped but still

876
00:38:54,720 --> 00:38:59,599
being used. So you know this is a case

877
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:01,680
where we we didn't actively remove a

878
00:38:59,599 --> 00:39:04,960
section of trail. We essentially

879
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:07,359
realigned it to another um another trail

880
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:09,599
that was unmapped but was still being

881
00:39:07,359 --> 00:39:11,599
used. So this kind of falls into that

882
00:39:09,599 --> 00:39:13,119
category of

883
00:39:11,599 --> 00:39:15,680
trying to protect vernal pool and

884
00:39:13,119 --> 00:39:18,720
environmental assets uh and then trying

885
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:21,920
to eliminate um trail redundancy and

886
00:39:18,720 --> 00:39:24,000
keeping a trail within that that

887
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:26,560
vicinity that that is actively getting

888
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:28,800
used. Um

889
00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:31,800
so all right we can advance to the next

890
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:31,800
slide.

891
00:39:32,240 --> 00:39:38,480
Change number four. This is uh

892
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:42,480
this was an interesting spot. Still is

893
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:44,240
an interesting spot. Um

894
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:46,320
this was a difficult area because

895
00:39:44,240 --> 00:39:49,200
there's a whole lot of trails in there.

896
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:52,240
Um this is the original map. Um there's

897
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:54,480
a lot going on. Um you know, this is a

898
00:39:52,240 --> 00:39:56,720
spot that's heavily used with a lot of

899
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:59,200
crisscrossing trails, a lot of trails

900
00:39:56,720 --> 00:40:02,000
that run parallel to one another. um

901
00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:04,160
trails that are utilized by everybody

902
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:06,560
who comes to the park. Um the

903
00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:09,200
unfortunate thing in this area is that

904
00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:11,920
not all of them were used consistently.

905
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:14,640
Um some of them were mapped and they

906
00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:18,480
appeared to not have been used in who

907
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:20,560
knows how long, years most likely. Um

908
00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:22,720
and this is one of the areas where

909
00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:24,160
people can be uh real close to the

910
00:40:22,720 --> 00:40:26,320
parking lot, but they can walk in

911
00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:28,560
circles until the end of time and have

912
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:33,359
no idea where they are. Uh, so this was

913
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:35,119
a spot we wanted to try to simplify um

914
00:40:33,359 --> 00:40:37,680
if for anything from a a health and

915
00:40:35,119 --> 00:40:39,839
safety perspective to try to make this

916
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:41,359
area more more navigable for people who

917
00:40:39,839 --> 00:40:44,000
aren't completely familiar with the

918
00:40:41,359 --> 00:40:48,720
park. Um, so as you see here in this

919
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:51,680
slide, um, our draft map from March, uh,

920
00:40:48,720 --> 00:40:54,640
we simplified this area. Um but then

921
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:59,040
based on public comments um based on

922
00:40:54,640 --> 00:41:01,839
some feedback on that map uh we we

923
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:04,480
basically altered the loop so we have a

924
00:41:01,839 --> 00:41:07,440
longer run in that section and maintain

925
00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:09,280
certain aspects and certain trails uh

926
00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:12,079
trail alignments that were getting uh

927
00:41:09,280 --> 00:41:14,560
heavily used um that we had originally

928
00:41:12,079 --> 00:41:17,359
um you know kind of taken off the map in

929
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:20,079
the the dra uh draft proposal. Um, so

930
00:41:17,359 --> 00:41:22,160
again, not there there are changes, but

931
00:41:20,079 --> 00:41:24,800
not all of them are are significantly

932
00:41:22,160 --> 00:41:27,839
dramatic. Um, you know, a lot of this is

933
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:29,760
is it's about cleaning up the map more

934
00:41:27,839 --> 00:41:32,160
so than cleaning up a lot of the trails

935
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:34,560
on the ground. There will be trails that

936
00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:36,480
are shuttered um that that have been

937
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:40,560
used historically and are continually

938
00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:44,000
being used. Um, but the the majority of

939
00:41:40,560 --> 00:41:46,160
what has been changed is on paper. what

940
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:49,200
is on the ground is not going to be

941
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:52,720
significantly off uh altered. As I said,

942
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:55,200
I did my best to try to maintain

943
00:41:52,720 --> 00:41:58,079
the loops and the longer loops that were

944
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:59,839
available in the park, trying to create

945
00:41:58,079 --> 00:42:02,319
uh continuity

946
00:41:59,839 --> 00:42:05,839
um within the trail systems uh that we

947
00:42:02,319 --> 00:42:10,000
have as as much as I can and at the same

948
00:42:05,839 --> 00:42:12,640
time um doing our best to to really uh

949
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:14,319
respect those environmental concerns uh

950
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:16,400
that that were brought up over the past

951
00:42:14,319 --> 00:42:18,800
year.

952
00:42:16,400 --> 00:42:22,359
All right. If you'd like, we can uh we

953
00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:22,359
can advance forward.

954
00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:26,880
Then on the bottom, this is another

955
00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:30,160
thing. After evaluating public comments,

956
00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:32,480
uh this map shows an area where there is

957
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:34,000
a a trail. It is a trail that gets used.

958
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:35,440
We all know it gets used. We all know

959
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:38,720
it's there even though it's not on the

960
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:41,680
map. Um originally on our draft map, uh

961
00:42:38,720 --> 00:42:45,040
we can jump forward to our next slide.

962
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:47,520
Um, we had kept that area off the draft

963
00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:51,200
map that's on the left. Um, but after

964
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:52,720
some public feedback, uh, we decided to

965
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:55,280
keep,

966
00:42:52,720 --> 00:42:58,000
I think, the, uh, the Rattler. Um, we're

967
00:42:55,280 --> 00:43:01,440
going to keep that one. And, uh, you

968
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:03,119
know, again, this allows us, it's

969
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:05,440
institutionalized. It's on the map.

970
00:43:03,119 --> 00:43:07,680
we're going to do um a better job with

971
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:10,319
getting in there and trying to again

972
00:43:07,680 --> 00:43:13,520
maintain these trails and and you know

973
00:43:10,319 --> 00:43:15,440
keep them up the snuff so it's uh it's a

974
00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:17,680
safe safe trail for for everybody

975
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:19,920
involved.

976
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:21,839
All right, we can jump ahead from that

977
00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:26,319
slide

978
00:43:21,839 --> 00:43:29,599
and uh moving forward. Um I think James,

979
00:43:26,319 --> 00:43:31,200
are you taking this one on?

980
00:43:29,599 --> 00:43:33,200
» Yep, that's me.

981
00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:34,640
» Yeah. So, uh, I'll kick this over to

982
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:36,640
James.

983
00:43:34,640 --> 00:43:38,640
» All right. Thank you, Zach. Uh,

984
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:41,280
honestly, the the next steps I'm super

985
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:43,280
excited about. Um, you know, we've got

986
00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:46,720
signage in the facility that would be

987
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:49,040
upcoming. Uh, currently the kiosk has,

988
00:43:46,720 --> 00:43:51,760
uh, an image of the map that's posted.

989
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:54,000
Uh, currently all the trails represented

990
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:56,640
on that map. Uh, Zach and the trails

991
00:43:54,000 --> 00:43:59,520
crew put blazes that match the colors.

992
00:43:56,640 --> 00:44:02,640
So, now that data, uh, reflects what you

993
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:05,359
see in the field. Um, Zach had mentioned

994
00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:07,599
that some of the decommissioned trails

995
00:44:05,359 --> 00:44:09,760
still exist on site, but when you come

996
00:44:07,599 --> 00:44:12,640
to an intersection with your map, you

997
00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:15,200
would see this trails marked red, that

998
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:16,800
one has no markings. Uh, and you'd be

999
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:19,760
able to correlate that with your

1000
00:44:16,800 --> 00:44:22,480
directions. Um, during this whole

1001
00:44:19,760 --> 00:44:24,640
process, um, I've, you know, I'm a fan

1002
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:26,000
of interpretive signage, just saying

1003
00:44:24,640 --> 00:44:28,240
things about plants and animals that

1004
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:30,240
live in the park. Uh, and over the past

1005
00:44:28,240 --> 00:44:32,079
couple seasons, there's a lot to say

1006
00:44:30,240 --> 00:44:34,640
about this park. Uh, but I've been

1007
00:44:32,079 --> 00:44:36,720
hesitant to put any of this material out

1008
00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:40,240
before I was confident I had wayfinding

1009
00:44:36,720 --> 00:44:42,800
materials out. Uh, so now that we have a

1010
00:44:40,240 --> 00:44:46,400
clear direction of the facility, I would

1011
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:48,079
like to see um, you know, signs that say

1012
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:50,400
you are here. If you need help, here's

1013
00:44:48,079 --> 00:44:52,800
some information. I'd like to see signs

1014
00:44:50,400 --> 00:44:55,359
about salamanders and ferns and all the

1015
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:57,359
uh you know the natural assets in the

1016
00:44:55,359 --> 00:45:00,160
park uh so people can learn about these

1017
00:44:57,359 --> 00:45:05,040
things um you know in the summer and in

1018
00:45:00,160 --> 00:45:07,359
the winter. Uh and as far as trail rehab

1019
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:10,240
in the future uh now that we can

1020
00:45:07,359 --> 00:45:12,480
prioritize what trails need what and

1021
00:45:10,240 --> 00:45:13,920
what are more important. uh we can

1022
00:45:12,480 --> 00:45:17,119
decide, you know, which ones get more

1023
00:45:13,920 --> 00:45:19,760
gravel or which ones during a uh storm

1024
00:45:17,119 --> 00:45:22,400
event should I have my staff go to first

1025
00:45:19,760 --> 00:45:23,839
and make sure is accessible. Um you

1026
00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:26,640
know, these are all things that I'm

1027
00:45:23,839 --> 00:45:28,240
looking to overall improve the facility

1028
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:31,440
that, you know, I think at the end of

1029
00:45:28,240 --> 00:45:33,200
this uh all of the users will enjoy. Uh

1030
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:36,160
so I'm really excited about the future

1031
00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:41,400
for the facility. Um, and to talk more

1032
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:41,400
about our next slide is uh Lindsay.

1033
00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:51,680
All right, you can probably see and hear

1034
00:45:49,359 --> 00:45:54,720
me. Thank you, Jeff. Um, as the plans

1035
00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:56,960
come together, um, as with all projects

1036
00:45:54,720 --> 00:45:59,599
at state parks, um, the project will

1037
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:04,160
undergo an environmental review of some

1038
00:45:59,599 --> 00:46:07,359
kind. um class uh projects or actions um

1039
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:10,720
are typically classified according to

1040
00:46:07,359 --> 00:46:12,480
uh criteria within secret regulations.

1041
00:46:10,720 --> 00:46:15,440
There's general three types of

1042
00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:17,119
classification. A type two action is

1043
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:19,280
already determined not to have a

1044
00:46:17,119 --> 00:46:22,640
significant impact on the environment.

1045
00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:24,480
An environmental review under SECRA um

1046
00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:26,480
is essentially not move forward at that

1047
00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:28,480
point. Um

1048
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:30,000
a type one action is the opposite of

1049
00:46:28,480 --> 00:46:32,000
that. it's more likely to have a

1050
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:33,920
significant adverse impact on the

1051
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:35,680
environment. And then everything in

1052
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:38,319
between a type two and a type one is an

1053
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:40,079
unlisted action. So that's three

1054
00:46:38,319 --> 00:46:43,280
different ways of thinking about um a

1055
00:46:40,079 --> 00:46:45,839
project or an action under secret.

1056
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:47,440
And even when an action or a project is

1057
00:46:45,839 --> 00:46:49,599
classified as a type two, an

1058
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:51,920
environmental review is still completed.

1059
00:46:49,599 --> 00:46:54,319
So there's various aspects um such as

1060
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:56,960
division uh sorry review by the division

1061
00:46:54,319 --> 00:46:58,400
of historic preservation um permits that

1062
00:46:56,960 --> 00:47:00,960
might be needed depending on what's

1063
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:02,880
proposed um and general alignment with

1064
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:05,440
agency policies or best management

1065
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:07,520
practices that's good to um consider as

1066
00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:10,560
we move forward with the project. And so

1067
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:13,359
I just wanted to touch on that and um

1068
00:47:10,560 --> 00:47:16,359
pass the presentation back to the next

1069
00:47:13,359 --> 00:47:16,359
presenter.

1070
00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:25,440
All right, there we go. Unmuted. Hello

1071
00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:28,400
again. So, we have reached the end of

1072
00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:30,880
our formal presentation, which brings us

1073
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:32,640
to the part I think most of you, now

1074
00:47:30,880 --> 00:47:34,480
that we've gone through it, are excited

1075
00:47:32,640 --> 00:47:36,000
about. You might have some questions or

1076
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:39,839
comments you'd like to make. I've been

1077
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:42,079
trying to keep track of them um here in

1078
00:47:39,839 --> 00:47:44,079
a spreadsheet, and I have them all in

1079
00:47:42,079 --> 00:47:46,000
the chat. So, I'm just going to start

1080
00:47:44,079 --> 00:47:46,720
working my way.

1081
00:47:46,000 --> 00:47:48,800
» Um,

1082
00:47:46,720 --> 00:47:50,400
» Paige, let me let me just interject for

1083
00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:52,640
one one minute. I've been keeping track

1084
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:54,400
of the comments, too, and and I want to

1085
00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:56,960
go back to something and I I forgot to

1086
00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:59,200
say this at the get-go, but you know,

1087
00:47:56,960 --> 00:48:02,160
the the one of the big things that we

1088
00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:04,720
are really hoping to come from this is

1089
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:06,720
that all of the user groups will adopt

1090
00:48:04,720 --> 00:48:09,280
the map that we are presenting this

1091
00:48:06,720 --> 00:48:12,400
evening. so that we've got one common

1092
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:15,119
map that is available for not only park

1093
00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:18,240
staff and user groups but most

1094
00:48:15,119 --> 00:48:20,480
importantly for our first responders and

1095
00:48:18,240 --> 00:48:24,400
uh in case of we of of emergency

1096
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:27,359
situations. So please please please

1097
00:48:24,400 --> 00:48:29,119
stand by the promise you made and let's

1098
00:48:27,359 --> 00:48:31,599
all agree that this is the map that

1099
00:48:29,119 --> 00:48:33,920
we're going to be using moving forward.

1100
00:48:31,599 --> 00:48:36,960
So this is the map for your websites.

1101
00:48:33,920 --> 00:48:40,640
This is the map for when you are running

1102
00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:44,000
events. Uh this is really important for

1103
00:48:40,640 --> 00:48:46,559
us to manage this property in the future

1104
00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:49,280
and to make the improvements that uh uh

1105
00:48:46,559 --> 00:48:51,680
Zach is is is planning on on doing to

1106
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:54,000
the trails uh so that we're putting our

1107
00:48:51,680 --> 00:48:56,160
resources most effectively forward for

1108
00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:59,440
the public's benefit.

1109
00:48:56,160 --> 00:49:01,680
And I'll also go back to the fact that I

1110
00:48:59,440 --> 00:49:04,079
seeing all of the questions and the

1111
00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:06,720
comments about uh horseback riding at

1112
00:49:04,079 --> 00:49:09,599
the facility. It's important to remember

1113
00:49:06,720 --> 00:49:12,079
that that has never been an allowable

1114
00:49:09,599 --> 00:49:14,240
activity at Harriet Hollister. It's

1115
00:49:12,079 --> 00:49:18,000
taken place. We know that it's taken

1116
00:49:14,240 --> 00:49:21,280
place, but uh we were asked to consider

1117
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:25,040
whether it would become an available

1118
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:27,119
activity. And based on our research that

1119
00:49:25,040 --> 00:49:30,000
we've shared with you this evening, the

1120
00:49:27,119 --> 00:49:32,640
comprehensive research that was done

1121
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:35,760
both on uh natural areas, trail

1122
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:37,680
conditions, what the impact of uh

1123
00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:40,000
horseback riding would be in this very

1124
00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:42,960
special place. We have determined that

1125
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:46,240
that is not a compatible activity at

1126
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:48,800
Harriet Hollister. Okay. So, I I I

1127
00:49:46,240 --> 00:49:52,400
apologize for disappointing our

1128
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:55,359
equestrian friends. Uh but um we will

1129
00:49:52,400 --> 00:49:56,880
not be opening up Harry Hollister uh to

1130
00:49:55,359 --> 00:49:59,520
horseback riding. It's never been

1131
00:49:56,880 --> 00:50:03,520
allowed. It's been resigned as not being

1132
00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:05,520
an allowable activity. And uh so uh

1133
00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:08,640
we're just we we've got to maintain that

1134
00:50:05,520 --> 00:50:10,559
line, I'm afraid. Okay. So uh Paige,

1135
00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:12,480
I'll kick it back to you. We can move

1136
00:50:10,559 --> 00:50:14,559
into those questions uh that you were

1137
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:16,720
starting to compile.

1138
00:50:14,559 --> 00:50:19,599
» Sounds good. And I see that we have two

1139
00:50:16,720 --> 00:50:23,200
folks uh with their hands raised. So, I

1140
00:50:19,599 --> 00:50:27,040
think uh I'll call on you first. So, uh

1141
00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:29,280
I see a hand raised by Chris and I am

1142
00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:31,920
going to unmute you and it should pop up

1143
00:50:29,280 --> 00:50:38,760
a little prompt on your screen, Chris.

1144
00:50:31,920 --> 00:50:38,760
Um allowing you to speak. So, give me

1145
00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:44,319
» They tried to shut that down

1146
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:46,160
and um somebody went back to the

1147
00:50:44,319 --> 00:50:49,040
original

1148
00:50:46,160 --> 00:50:50,319
D transfer or whatever that was where it

1149
00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:52,800
gave and it was like

1150
00:50:50,319 --> 00:50:53,920
» I remember Ray like whatever and that's

1151
00:50:52,800 --> 00:50:57,119
why he was going to be

1152
00:50:53,920 --> 00:50:58,640
» Well got the from us for us but it

1153
00:50:57,119 --> 00:51:02,920
was

1154
00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:02,920
from Harriet Hollister

1155
00:51:03,440 --> 00:51:10,880
or it was from the original owners to

1156
00:51:05,839 --> 00:51:13,760
Harry or whatever, but it wasn't

1157
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:16,880
to the state

1158
00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:22,280
where it would have said

1159
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:22,280
um okay, horseback riding is allowed.

1160
00:51:22,960 --> 00:51:26,440
» Thank you, Chris.

1161
00:51:33,359 --> 00:51:38,880
All right. Next in our queue, I believe,

1162
00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:40,800
is Lindsay Labella. I will be unmuting

1163
00:51:38,880 --> 00:51:44,960
your mic.

1164
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:47,599
All right, Lindsay, your mic is live.

1165
00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:50,240
» Hi, Brad. I know you were saying that

1166
00:51:47,599 --> 00:51:52,160
the horsebacks were never allowed. We

1167
00:51:50,240 --> 00:51:56,640
know it happened. I mean, we've been

1168
00:51:52,160 --> 00:51:59,280
riding there for eons. Um, we did

1169
00:51:56,640 --> 00:52:03,520
respectfully get off of the property per

1170
00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:05,760
your request to do this study.

1171
00:52:03,520 --> 00:52:09,040
You have yet to actually state what

1172
00:52:05,760 --> 00:52:11,599
specifically the horse traffic was doing

1173
00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:14,079
that would be worse than the bike or

1174
00:52:11,599 --> 00:52:17,440
foot traffic. Can you please explain the

1175
00:52:14,079 --> 00:52:20,240
exact reasoning with metrics as to why

1176
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:22,960
horse traffic would be so detrimental?

1177
00:52:20,240 --> 00:52:24,960
Sure. So, I'll start and I'll I'll I'll

1178
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:27,359
kick it over to, you know, some of the

1179
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:30,559
other technical experts here, but you

1180
00:52:27,359 --> 00:52:32,559
know, horseback riding is uh more

1181
00:52:30,559 --> 00:52:35,440
damaging to trail infrastructure,

1182
00:52:32,559 --> 00:52:38,880
especially trails that are naturally wet

1183
00:52:35,440 --> 00:52:41,280
areas. Uh uh and so as we were doing

1184
00:52:38,880 --> 00:52:43,599
that assessment, we looked at the impact

1185
00:52:41,280 --> 00:52:46,000
knowing what we do know about horseback

1186
00:52:43,599 --> 00:52:47,520
riding activities and other state park

1187
00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:50,240
facilities

1188
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:53,119
uh and how that could possibly be

1189
00:52:50,240 --> 00:52:56,079
incorporated at Herod Hollister. Uh that

1190
00:52:53,119 --> 00:52:59,040
review, the weight of the courses, the

1191
00:52:56,079 --> 00:53:01,760
impact on the trail surface, uh that's

1192
00:52:59,040 --> 00:53:05,920
what uh allowed us uh to to to make this

1193
00:53:01,760 --> 00:53:07,920
determination. And uh uh Chris Morris,

1194
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:10,480
are you are are you on any comment on

1195
00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:12,880
that to follow up?

1196
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:14,640
» Yeah, I mean I would agree. I think um

1197
00:53:12,880 --> 00:53:18,240
you know some of the items that we

1198
00:53:14,640 --> 00:53:22,400
touched on if uh at the original meeting

1199
00:53:18,240 --> 00:53:24,559
or you know if we are to include this

1200
00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:26,480
activity, right, the conditions that the

1201
00:53:24,559 --> 00:53:28,880
trails need to be in for them to be

1202
00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:32,160
appropriate for equestrian use, right?

1203
00:53:28,880 --> 00:53:33,760
um just because it's a informally um

1204
00:53:32,160 --> 00:53:35,599
unauthorized use that occurs

1205
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:38,079
occasionally. You know, if we are

1206
00:53:35,599 --> 00:53:40,160
opening up trails to a user group, we

1207
00:53:38,079 --> 00:53:43,119
want to make sure that those trails uh

1208
00:53:40,160 --> 00:53:45,760
meet the standards that that we need as

1209
00:53:43,119 --> 00:53:48,079
parks to to welcome that activity.

1210
00:53:45,760 --> 00:53:50,480
Right? So, um I think that's one of the

1211
00:53:48,079 --> 00:53:51,760
considerations here is that the soil

1212
00:53:50,480 --> 00:53:53,920
conditions, the environmental

1213
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:56,400
conditions, the width of the trails, the

1214
00:53:53,920 --> 00:54:00,400
trail networks, um and the existing

1215
00:53:56,400 --> 00:54:04,240
allowed uses uh are all uh not

1216
00:54:00,400 --> 00:54:07,680
compatible with equestrian use.

1217
00:54:04,240 --> 00:54:10,400
I I'm trying to wrap my head around that

1218
00:54:07,680 --> 00:54:12,880
because the park has been doing just

1219
00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:15,599
fine with the equestrian use that you

1220
00:54:12,880 --> 00:54:17,920
can actually expect there already prior

1221
00:54:15,599 --> 00:54:19,599
to the one incident that shed light on

1222
00:54:17,920 --> 00:54:21,280
this issue.

1223
00:54:19,599 --> 00:54:23,440
I mean equestrians are more than happy

1224
00:54:21,280 --> 00:54:27,280
to adjust our time, you know, ride there

1225
00:54:23,440 --> 00:54:29,760
from July to October when the ponds have

1226
00:54:27,280 --> 00:54:32,480
dried up.

1227
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:34,880
We don't have a problem with modifying

1228
00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:37,520
our times to go out there to be included

1229
00:54:34,880 --> 00:54:40,480
in this so we all can enjoy it and you

1230
00:54:37,520 --> 00:54:43,200
can have our support to be able to work

1231
00:54:40,480 --> 00:54:46,839
to protect areas like this versus

1232
00:54:43,200 --> 00:54:46,839
excluding us.

1233
00:54:49,359 --> 00:54:54,480
» Again, I'm I'm standing by my prior

1234
00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:56,480
statement. This was not an allowable

1235
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:59,200
activity. This has not been an allowable

1236
00:54:56,480 --> 00:55:03,119
activity. And when we take a look at

1237
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:05,520
what an increase in that activity would

1238
00:55:03,119 --> 00:55:07,839
represent in the facility should it be

1239
00:55:05,520 --> 00:55:11,680
allowed, it was determined that we

1240
00:55:07,839 --> 00:55:13,599
cannot maintain our roles of being

1241
00:55:11,680 --> 00:55:15,920
stewards to these public lands, these

1242
00:55:13,599 --> 00:55:19,280
very special public lands that we've

1243
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:21,520
come to learn about and accommodate the

1244
00:55:19,280 --> 00:55:24,880
the the user groups that are also using

1245
00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:26,559
it. So, uh we are simply standing by

1246
00:55:24,880 --> 00:55:28,640
what was already in place. We're not

1247
00:55:26,559 --> 00:55:31,040
making any changes. We're simply

1248
00:55:28,640 --> 00:55:33,920
reinforcing what had already been the

1249
00:55:31,040 --> 00:55:36,319
standard practice of of use at Harriet

1250
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:39,839
Hollister.

1251
00:55:36,319 --> 00:55:42,640
» And just so folks know when I I do a

1252
00:55:39,839 --> 00:55:46,440
podcast about this for the area, what is

1253
00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:46,440
the ramifications

1254
00:55:46,960 --> 00:55:51,200
should somebody go over there and trail

1255
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:53,599
ride?

1256
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:56,880
Well, there there is currently there has

1257
00:55:53,599 --> 00:55:58,720
been historically there has been signage

1258
00:55:56,880 --> 00:56:01,920
noting that that's not an allowable

1259
00:55:58,720 --> 00:56:04,559
activity. Um that signage is regularly

1260
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:06,400
removed. Okay. So that's destruction of

1261
00:56:04,559 --> 00:56:09,680
state parks property.

1262
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:11,920
» That's not I'm I'm about I'm about to

1263
00:56:09,680 --> 00:56:15,119
finish I'm about to please Lindsay give

1264
00:56:11,920 --> 00:56:18,720
me a second here. So we have installed

1265
00:56:15,119 --> 00:56:21,200
more permanent signage uh that uh it

1266
00:56:18,720 --> 00:56:23,599
would be very difficult. It would be

1267
00:56:21,200 --> 00:56:25,200
pretty it would be criminal to destroy

1268
00:56:23,599 --> 00:56:28,079
these signs. It is criminal to destroy

1269
00:56:25,200 --> 00:56:30,079
these signs. So you risk you risk uh

1270
00:56:28,079 --> 00:56:33,359
being warned by park police should they

1271
00:56:30,079 --> 00:56:35,520
be on site. Uh and you also risk being

1272
00:56:33,359 --> 00:56:38,559
ticketed by park police should they need

1273
00:56:35,520 --> 00:56:41,119
the uh the the individual uh to be

1274
00:56:38,559 --> 00:56:44,240
non-compliant, non-listing. So there is

1275
00:56:41,119 --> 00:56:46,720
a risk of being of receiving

1276
00:56:44,240 --> 00:56:48,640
» I'm sorry. Go ahead please. My question

1277
00:56:46,720 --> 00:56:49,760
actually is what is that ticket and what

1278
00:56:48,640 --> 00:56:51,440
is the cost?

1279
00:56:49,760 --> 00:56:55,000
» That's at the that's at the discretion

1280
00:56:51,440 --> 00:56:55,000
of park police.

1281
00:56:56,640 --> 00:57:02,079
» They just make up a price.

1282
00:57:00,160 --> 00:57:04,319
» Well, they issue a ticket and then it

1283
00:57:02,079 --> 00:57:07,319
goes to court and the judge determines

1284
00:57:04,319 --> 00:57:07,319
that.

1285
00:57:07,440 --> 00:57:14,079
» That doesn't seem

1286
00:57:10,079 --> 00:57:17,520
lawful. Usually our laws state that you

1287
00:57:14,079 --> 00:57:20,720
have there is a consequence for your

1288
00:57:17,520 --> 00:57:25,319
actions on paper written. I'm just

1289
00:57:20,720 --> 00:57:25,319
curious what that actually is.

1290
00:57:27,680 --> 00:57:34,799
» Again, it would be uh uh not allowed use

1291
00:57:32,079 --> 00:57:37,440
uh trespass perhaps. There's a number of

1292
00:57:34,799 --> 00:57:39,119
of regulations that uh horseback riding

1293
00:57:37,440 --> 00:57:42,720
would be in violation of

1294
00:57:39,119 --> 00:57:45,440
» The park police would determine.

1295
00:57:42,720 --> 00:57:48,240
Go ahead.

1296
00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:50,079
» I will deal it. I will talk to my

1297
00:57:48,240 --> 00:57:52,880
environmental lawyer since you don't

1298
00:57:50,079 --> 00:57:57,280
actually know the answer.

1299
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:59,839
» That's that's fine. Yeah.

1300
00:57:57,280 --> 00:58:01,760
» All right. Thanks, Lindsay. I want to

1301
00:57:59,839 --> 00:58:04,720
get to while we're on the equestrian

1302
00:58:01,760 --> 00:58:06,559
topic, I'll I'll um go back up to our

1303
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:08,000
first question. Just want to sort of

1304
00:58:06,559 --> 00:58:11,200
cover the equestrian questions and then

1305
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:12,960
we'll move on to um some of the trail

1306
00:58:11,200 --> 00:58:17,920
ones.

1307
00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:20,319
So, um comment from Pauline Burns of the

1308
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:22,160
New York State Horse Council.

1309
00:58:20,319 --> 00:58:25,200
Equestrians are not allowed access to

1310
00:58:22,160 --> 00:58:26,559
Harriet Hollister. um says, "Please

1311
00:58:25,200 --> 00:58:28,400
provide a list of other opportunities

1312
00:58:26,559 --> 00:58:30,640
where trail riders might have access to

1313
00:58:28,400 --> 00:58:34,000
trails on public lands. We keep losing

1314
00:58:30,640 --> 00:58:35,599
ground and access to trails." Um so I

1315
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:37,280
don't know if Chris or Fred you want to

1316
00:58:35,599 --> 00:58:39,599
sort of comment on a statewide

1317
00:58:37,280 --> 00:58:42,599
perspective about some other trail

1318
00:58:39,599 --> 00:58:42,599
options.

1319
00:58:43,520 --> 00:58:47,839
» Um yeah, I mean I can feel that one.

1320
00:58:45,119 --> 00:58:49,839
page. Uh, you know, I don't have a map

1321
00:58:47,839 --> 00:58:52,799
in front of me with all of the different

1322
00:58:49,839 --> 00:58:54,480
um potential locations, although we did

1323
00:58:52,799 --> 00:58:55,839
look at that and to see what was

1324
00:58:54,480 --> 00:58:58,400
reasonable distance from Harriet

1325
00:58:55,839 --> 00:59:00,160
Hollister for other uh equestrian

1326
00:58:58,400 --> 00:59:03,200
destinations. I know for parks

1327
00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:05,200
specifically, um, you know, I think the

1328
00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:07,119
closest geographically as the crow flies

1329
00:59:05,200 --> 00:59:09,920
would be Jennese Valley Greenway, which

1330
00:59:07,119 --> 00:59:11,920
uh allows equestrian use. Um, and then

1331
00:59:09,920 --> 00:59:14,240
as you go a little bit further out, uh,

1332
00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:17,839
I think the next closest places are more

1333
00:59:14,240 --> 00:59:21,280
than likely DEEC, um, facilities, uh,

1334
00:59:17,839 --> 00:59:23,680
that allow equestrian use. Um,

1335
00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:26,319
so I don't have a list off the top of my

1336
00:59:23,680 --> 00:59:29,040
head of all the locations nearby that

1337
00:59:26,319 --> 00:59:31,119
could allow that use. Um, but it isn't

1338
00:59:29,040 --> 00:59:32,640
something that blanket, you know, is is

1339
00:59:31,119 --> 00:59:34,319
not allowed. In fact, there's many

1340
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:36,640
places that do allow it both in parks

1341
00:59:34,319 --> 00:59:38,799
and DEEC.

1342
00:59:36,640 --> 00:59:41,359
» Thanks. And I'll I'll add one comment to

1343
00:59:38,799 --> 00:59:44,240
Pauline. I believe on um state parks

1344
00:59:41,359 --> 00:59:46,559
website you can go to um a page and

1345
00:59:44,240 --> 00:59:49,280
filter by activity and you can specially

1346
00:59:46,559 --> 00:59:53,119
select out equestrian use. And I think

1347
00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:55,359
it brings up about 20 25 state park

1348
00:59:53,119 --> 00:59:56,720
facilities. My memory is not spot on on

1349
00:59:55,359 --> 00:59:59,359
that, but definitely check out our

1350
00:59:56,720 --> 01:00:01,119
website where you can um filter out by

1351
00:59:59,359 --> 01:00:03,839
equestrian use and it'll take you to

1352
01:00:01,119 --> 01:00:05,599
that park specific website. Um, I see

1353
01:00:03,839 --> 01:00:08,640
you've got your hand raised, so let me

1354
01:00:05,599 --> 01:00:11,920
unmute your mic.

1355
01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:13,359
All right, Pauline, your mic is

1356
01:00:11,920 --> 01:00:15,520
» Yeah, I had a couple of questions I

1357
01:00:13,359 --> 01:00:18,000
actually just put in the comment box.

1358
01:00:15,520 --> 01:00:19,440
One of them was that in March of 2025,

1359
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:21,680
there was some discussion about

1360
01:00:19,440 --> 01:00:24,720
designing a threemile loop for

1361
01:00:21,680 --> 01:00:27,760
equestrian equestrians and I think that

1362
01:00:24,720 --> 01:00:30,799
got u hopes up that equestrians would be

1363
01:00:27,760 --> 01:00:35,720
allowed. Can you explain why that loop

1364
01:00:30,799 --> 01:00:35,720
um was it ever designed or considered?

1365
01:00:39,839 --> 01:00:44,960
» Uh go ahead, Zach. I was I was Yeah, I

1366
01:00:43,280 --> 01:00:46,480
was trying to fill the void. You got it.

1367
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:49,119
» Yeah. Yeah, we can we can I can take

1368
01:00:46,480 --> 01:00:50,720
this on. So So yeah, Pauline, we we did

1369
01:00:49,119 --> 01:00:54,640
consider that. I mean it was something

1370
01:00:50,720 --> 01:00:58,720
that uh you know we looked at um

1371
01:00:54,640 --> 01:01:02,319
pretty pretty heavily. Um and one of the

1372
01:00:58,720 --> 01:01:06,480
big drivers for this uh and the reason

1373
01:01:02,319 --> 01:01:11,119
why we didn't go with that loop um is is

1374
01:01:06,480 --> 01:01:14,559
the loop we set out uh was it conflicted

1375
01:01:11,119 --> 01:01:18,480
with a lot of these vernal pool areas.

1376
01:01:14,559 --> 01:01:22,079
um that threemile loop, the initial

1377
01:01:18,480 --> 01:01:24,799
design for that was to try to balance a

1378
01:01:22,079 --> 01:01:27,760
longer ride for equestrians at Harriet

1379
01:01:24,799 --> 01:01:31,680
Hollister without having a lot of

1380
01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:33,359
significant impact on other trail users

1381
01:01:31,680 --> 01:01:35,920
essentially

1382
01:01:33,359 --> 01:01:37,760
to make a long loop that would you know

1383
01:01:35,920 --> 01:01:42,559
be worth riding and worth the trip to

1384
01:01:37,760 --> 01:01:44,480
the park um but also not kind of lead to

1385
01:01:42,559 --> 01:01:46,640
conflicts with other user groups.

1386
01:01:44,480 --> 01:01:48,880
Um, you know, the elephant in the room

1387
01:01:46,640 --> 01:01:51,200
right now, I think, is that a lot of the

1388
01:01:48,880 --> 01:01:54,319
public comments, you know, the

1389
01:01:51,200 --> 01:01:57,119
overwhelming bulk of public comments,

1390
01:01:54,319 --> 01:01:58,880
um, requested that we didn't consider

1391
01:01:57,119 --> 01:02:00,880
equestrian use and that we didn't allow

1392
01:01:58,880 --> 01:02:03,760
it, that we kept it as an unallowable

1393
01:02:00,880 --> 01:02:05,599
use in the park. Um, that that guided

1394
01:02:03,760 --> 01:02:08,480
the decision, but, you know, ultimately

1395
01:02:05,599 --> 01:02:10,880
it was that balanced with um the

1396
01:02:08,480 --> 01:02:13,680
environmental concerns that that came to

1397
01:02:10,880 --> 01:02:17,520
light after our meeting in March. Um so

1398
01:02:13,680 --> 01:02:21,200
that that drafted horse loop um you know

1399
01:02:17,520 --> 01:02:23,440
that ran through a lot of the areas that

1400
01:02:21,200 --> 01:02:26,799
uh that have these vernal pool

1401
01:02:23,440 --> 01:02:29,359
complexes. Um it also uh are areas of

1402
01:02:26,799 --> 01:02:32,319
trail sections of trail that we we um

1403
01:02:29,359 --> 01:02:36,240
have decommissioned on on the finalized

1404
01:02:32,319 --> 01:02:38,720
map. So, you know, again, we were trying

1405
01:02:36,240 --> 01:02:41,760
to be as objective as possible, trying

1406
01:02:38,720 --> 01:02:46,160
to consider every bit of information

1407
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:47,920
that we had at our disposal. Um, so

1408
01:02:46,160 --> 01:02:51,040
yeah, you know, the ultimate decision

1409
01:02:47,920 --> 01:02:52,799
was to to maintain um, you know, the

1410
01:02:51,040 --> 01:02:55,799
rule that had had been in place

1411
01:02:52,799 --> 01:02:55,799
historically.

1412
01:02:56,319 --> 01:03:02,240
» Thanks, Zach. All right. I know we're at

1413
01:02:59,760 --> 01:03:04,640
7 o'lock, so I want to keep us moving

1414
01:03:02,240 --> 01:03:07,920
through questions. So, um, can always

1415
01:03:04,640 --> 01:03:11,280
return to a topic. Um, but I want to get

1416
01:03:07,920 --> 01:03:14,400
to some more, uh, trails sort of

1417
01:03:11,280 --> 01:03:16,640
questions we've got. Uh, Craig asks, "Is

1418
01:03:14,400 --> 01:03:18,480
there any talk about adding trails

1419
01:03:16,640 --> 01:03:21,480
further south down by Dutch Hollow

1420
01:03:18,480 --> 01:03:21,480
Road?"

1421
01:03:23,280 --> 01:03:29,119
» Uh, I can feel this one again at the

1422
01:03:26,240 --> 01:03:33,839
moment. Um,

1423
01:03:29,119 --> 01:03:36,400
no. Uh, we have basically been focusing

1424
01:03:33,839 --> 01:03:39,760
most of our attention right now on the

1425
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:43,440
main parcel. Um, you know, we're trying

1426
01:03:39,760 --> 01:03:44,960
to devote our efforts there. Um, you

1427
01:03:43,440 --> 01:03:46,799
know, in the future, it's not to say

1428
01:03:44,960 --> 01:03:49,359
that that's not a possibility, but as of

1429
01:03:46,799 --> 01:03:51,760
now, we're kind of keeping that that

1430
01:03:49,359 --> 01:03:56,319
section of of Harriet Hollister uh as

1431
01:03:51,760 --> 01:03:58,799
is. um because we we've spent a lot of a

1432
01:03:56,319 --> 01:04:01,280
lot of our mental capacity um focusing

1433
01:03:58,799 --> 01:04:04,000
on the main main parcel and James I

1434
01:04:01,280 --> 01:04:07,960
don't know if you have uh additional uh

1435
01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:07,960
information on that but

1436
01:04:09,599 --> 01:04:13,119
you know at the moment you know we've

1437
01:04:11,280 --> 01:04:15,520
been trying to you know through this

1438
01:04:13,119 --> 01:04:18,480
whole process we really discovered you

1439
01:04:15,520 --> 01:04:21,599
know a lot about the facility uh and how

1440
01:04:18,480 --> 01:04:23,839
sensitive some of these places are um

1441
01:04:21,599 --> 01:04:25,520
and Many of the people in this room, you

1442
01:04:23,839 --> 01:04:27,599
know, we're we're advocates for

1443
01:04:25,520 --> 01:04:30,240
recreation. You know, I I'm here to

1444
01:04:27,599 --> 01:04:32,400
promote my facilities and say, you know,

1445
01:04:30,240 --> 01:04:33,920
I these are the amenities I offer.

1446
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:37,200
Please come to this park and do these

1447
01:04:33,920 --> 01:04:40,720
things. Um so, when we're reviewing the

1448
01:04:37,200 --> 01:04:43,599
equestrian question, um that section of

1449
01:04:40,720 --> 01:04:47,359
the property that had very little data

1450
01:04:43,599 --> 01:04:49,839
for it, uh has also ended up having a

1451
01:04:47,359 --> 01:04:51,760
lot of assets that's good for it. Um so

1452
01:04:49,839 --> 01:04:55,520
if we were to develop anything in those

1453
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:58,559
areas certainly what's sensitive and the

1454
01:04:55,520 --> 01:05:02,640
reviews of these uh sections would take

1455
01:04:58,559 --> 01:05:04,960
some time for us to you know process um

1456
01:05:02,640 --> 01:05:07,440
and I think as far as you know

1457
01:05:04,960 --> 01:05:09,760
equestrian or any other user you know

1458
01:05:07,440 --> 01:05:12,720
when we looked at the data and looked at

1459
01:05:09,760 --> 01:05:16,400
the property you know I have to say you

1460
01:05:12,720 --> 01:05:18,319
know once we open up the park to a new

1461
01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:21,119
user group that not had that had not

1462
01:05:18,319 --> 01:05:23,440
already been allowed. We had to be on

1463
01:05:21,119 --> 01:05:26,400
the same page that the facility itself

1464
01:05:23,440 --> 01:05:28,240
could take the impact of now me going

1465
01:05:26,400 --> 01:05:30,000
online and putting on Facebook, come to

1466
01:05:28,240 --> 01:05:32,319
my park. These are the activities I

1467
01:05:30,000 --> 01:05:35,039
provide. And I think once we had all of

1468
01:05:32,319 --> 01:05:37,599
that data collected with the comments

1469
01:05:35,039 --> 01:05:41,200
and all the decision-m sort of is what's

1470
01:05:37,599 --> 01:05:42,960
gearing us is where we can uh you know

1471
01:05:41,200 --> 01:05:45,680
develop certain areas and where we

1472
01:05:42,960 --> 01:05:47,039
can't. Um but you never know if more

1473
01:05:45,680 --> 01:05:48,799
lands are required. There's always

1474
01:05:47,039 --> 01:05:51,440
things that can happen in the future.

1475
01:05:48,799 --> 01:05:53,280
You know, I am still trying to, you

1476
01:05:51,440 --> 01:05:55,760
know, I still would like to invite as

1477
01:05:53,280 --> 01:05:57,680
many users as I can have that safely can

1478
01:05:55,760 --> 01:06:00,319
use the property and follow the mission

1479
01:05:57,680 --> 01:06:02,160
statement of the agency uh for

1480
01:06:00,319 --> 01:06:04,799
recreation and for protecting the

1481
01:06:02,160 --> 01:06:06,400
environment. Um, so really, you know,

1482
01:06:04,799 --> 01:06:08,160
the future's wide open, but at the

1483
01:06:06,400 --> 01:06:11,119
moment we're focused on this specific

1484
01:06:08,160 --> 01:06:13,760
topic. I hope that is my long-winded way

1485
01:06:11,119 --> 01:06:16,160
of answering your question.

1486
01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:18,720
» Thanks, James. All right, Brian's had

1487
01:06:16,160 --> 01:06:22,319
his hand patiently up, so Brian, I'm

1488
01:06:18,720 --> 01:06:24,799
going to unmute your mic.

1489
01:06:22,319 --> 01:06:26,160
» Thank you, Paige. Um, Brian Warwick,

1490
01:06:24,799 --> 01:06:28,559
I've been uh

1491
01:06:26,160 --> 01:06:31,039
» Using the park for about 30 years.

1492
01:06:28,559 --> 01:06:33,119
» I got to say, I I other than the Bear

1493
01:06:31,039 --> 01:06:35,200
Pond, which is what we called that

1494
01:06:33,119 --> 01:06:39,520
vernal pond that the mountain bike trail

1495
01:06:35,200 --> 01:06:42,000
kind of skirts um toward the uh uh

1496
01:06:39,520 --> 01:06:44,240
southern edge of it. I didn't know there

1497
01:06:42,000 --> 01:06:45,839
were that many vernal ponds there. So,

1498
01:06:44,240 --> 01:06:49,119
uh, congratulations for finding every

1499
01:06:45,839 --> 01:06:52,000
one of them. Question about, uh, natural

1500
01:06:49,119 --> 01:06:54,640
heritage and what that might mean for

1501
01:06:52,000 --> 01:06:59,039
the future uses of the park. Do they

1502
01:06:54,640 --> 01:07:01,119
play a role, um, in in influencing uh,

1503
01:06:59,039 --> 01:07:04,880
preservation, stewardship, uh,

1504
01:07:01,119 --> 01:07:07,880
guidelines and and possibly limiting

1505
01:07:04,880 --> 01:07:07,880
use?

1506
01:07:08,720 --> 01:07:15,039
» Yep, I I can take that one. Yeah. So our

1507
01:07:12,319 --> 01:07:18,720
our partnership with natural heritage

1508
01:07:15,039 --> 01:07:21,599
program is such that they play an

1509
01:07:18,720 --> 01:07:25,440
advisory role right. So like we take

1510
01:07:21,599 --> 01:07:29,039
their input and then we decide as the

1511
01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:31,599
agency like with with James with Fred

1512
01:07:29,039 --> 01:07:35,440
with Kathy we decide what's appropriate

1513
01:07:31,599 --> 01:07:36,960
for the site. Um so they they we

1514
01:07:35,440 --> 01:07:39,039
collaborated

1515
01:07:36,960 --> 01:07:41,359
extensively on this particular project

1516
01:07:39,039 --> 01:07:44,559
just because of the significance of this

1517
01:07:41,359 --> 01:07:47,440
site. Um but that doesn't necessarily

1518
01:07:44,559 --> 01:07:50,400
mean that that they will dictate um you

1519
01:07:47,440 --> 01:07:53,520
know how we decide to interpret the data

1520
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:56,319
and and use the site. So as of now I

1521
01:07:53,520 --> 01:07:59,680
think this concept I mentioned like we

1522
01:07:56,319 --> 01:08:01,440
we really honed in. So we were like, you

1523
01:07:59,680 --> 01:08:03,599
know, where are locations where it's

1524
01:08:01,440 --> 01:08:05,520
absolutely missionritical?

1525
01:08:03,599 --> 01:08:07,440
You know, trails that are bisecting

1526
01:08:05,520 --> 01:08:09,839
protective verna pools, like those are

1527
01:08:07,440 --> 01:08:11,440
the ones we we focused on to to take

1528
01:08:09,839 --> 01:08:14,240
offline, right? Because that's going to

1529
01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:17,679
have the biggest ecological impact in

1530
01:08:14,240 --> 01:08:20,799
terms of of restoration. Um, so removing

1531
01:08:17,679 --> 01:08:24,000
some of those sections of trails,

1532
01:08:20,799 --> 01:08:25,279
uh, from our perspective,

1533
01:08:24,000 --> 01:08:27,120
it it's going to have the biggest

1534
01:08:25,279 --> 01:08:28,400
impact. So something we didn't talk much

1535
01:08:27,120 --> 01:08:31,759
about, we talked a lot about the

1536
01:08:28,400 --> 01:08:33,839
breeding habitat, but so these pools are

1537
01:08:31,759 --> 01:08:36,480
all all over the park, very close

1538
01:08:33,839 --> 01:08:39,199
together. So they're a complex,

1539
01:08:36,480 --> 01:08:41,040
right? And so amphibians,

1540
01:08:39,199 --> 01:08:42,880
they're hanging out in the upland

1541
01:08:41,040 --> 01:08:45,040
forest, right? And then in the spring,

1542
01:08:42,880 --> 01:08:46,799
we call that it's an explosive

1543
01:08:45,040 --> 01:08:49,040
migration. And I'm sure folks that live

1544
01:08:46,799 --> 01:08:50,640
in the area, like you see these animals

1545
01:08:49,040 --> 01:08:52,880
on the roads, like they're they're

1546
01:08:50,640 --> 01:08:55,359
coming down in droves. There's just

1547
01:08:52,880 --> 01:08:57,279
thousands. And so they come down to

1548
01:08:55,359 --> 01:08:59,679
these these pools for their breeding.

1549
01:08:57,279 --> 01:09:01,839
And so having trails bicting all these

1550
01:08:59,679 --> 01:09:03,520
vernal pools, that's that's also an

1551
01:09:01,839 --> 01:09:05,199
impact, right? So they're they're trying

1552
01:09:03,520 --> 01:09:07,359
to get from their upland habitat to

1553
01:09:05,199 --> 01:09:09,679
their breeding habitat. So taking

1554
01:09:07,359 --> 01:09:12,080
certain sections offline, that provides

1555
01:09:09,679 --> 01:09:14,239
additional connectivity. You know, we're

1556
01:09:12,080 --> 01:09:17,520
decreasing the impact on the breeding

1557
01:09:14,239 --> 01:09:19,679
habitat as well. So again, we we we

1558
01:09:17,520 --> 01:09:23,319
really tried to focus here so that we

1559
01:09:19,679 --> 01:09:23,319
achieve that balance.

1560
01:09:23,359 --> 01:09:27,520
Well, it looks very well done so far.

1561
01:09:25,359 --> 01:09:30,239
What I've seen looks great. U my other

1562
01:09:27,520 --> 01:09:32,719
two questions are are um trail use wise.

1563
01:09:30,239 --> 01:09:35,040
Uh in the wintertime, uh the trails have

1564
01:09:32,719 --> 01:09:36,560
been well groomed for Nordic skiing by

1565
01:09:35,040 --> 01:09:38,159
the Rochester Cross Country Ski

1566
01:09:36,560 --> 01:09:41,319
Foundation. Is that going to be allowed

1567
01:09:38,159 --> 01:09:41,319
to continue?

1568
01:09:43,359 --> 01:09:48,880
» Uh yes, that activity would be allowed

1569
01:09:45,520 --> 01:09:52,239
to continue. uh we would most likely a

1570
01:09:48,880 --> 01:09:56,480
lot of the core of what is on the trail

1571
01:09:52,239 --> 01:09:58,480
map still uh reflect some of the uh race

1572
01:09:56,480 --> 01:10:00,480
data and some of the you know the

1573
01:09:58,480 --> 01:10:02,320
permits that receive are also the

1574
01:10:00,480 --> 01:10:04,640
highest used of some of these things.

1575
01:10:02,320 --> 01:10:07,199
You know we may have to slightly alter

1576
01:10:04,640 --> 01:10:09,440
uh what paths are getting groomed. Like

1577
01:10:07,199 --> 01:10:12,239
I said we kind of some of the trails

1578
01:10:09,440 --> 01:10:14,000
that we remove parallel of you know

1579
01:10:12,239 --> 01:10:15,840
maybe you would only groom one of the

1580
01:10:14,000 --> 01:10:18,400
two. So there'll probably be a little

1581
01:10:15,840 --> 01:10:21,440
bit of, you know, tweaking of what your

1582
01:10:18,400 --> 01:10:24,880
normal map is. Uh but we expect the

1583
01:10:21,440 --> 01:10:27,520
winter operations to be very similar.

1584
01:10:24,880 --> 01:10:32,480
» Thank you. Uh lastly,

1585
01:10:27,520 --> 01:10:34,560
» Any planned trail works uh in the future

1586
01:10:32,480 --> 01:10:38,560
uh the

1587
01:10:34,560 --> 01:10:40,719
Grock group and a a friend group of that

1588
01:10:38,560 --> 01:10:42,800
I'm part of called the guild. We can

1589
01:10:40,719 --> 01:10:45,120
muster 20 plus bodies to help out

1590
01:10:42,800 --> 01:10:47,360
whenever that happens. So if you need

1591
01:10:45,120 --> 01:10:49,040
that help or you'd like that help, let

1592
01:10:47,360 --> 01:10:50,640
us know.

1593
01:10:49,040 --> 01:10:52,800
» Yeah. And that that'd be excellent. And

1594
01:10:50,640 --> 01:10:56,320
that's one thing I will throw out since

1595
01:10:52,800 --> 01:10:58,320
you mentioned it and I think another uh

1596
01:10:56,320 --> 01:11:02,480
another participant in the meeting had

1597
01:10:58,320 --> 01:11:05,600
asked about this. Uh I am very open to

1598
01:11:02,480 --> 01:11:08,159
having you know volunteer help uh having

1599
01:11:05,600 --> 01:11:10,480
volunteer input um to come in and give

1600
01:11:08,159 --> 01:11:12,480
us a hand. I know, you know, there's

1601
01:11:10,480 --> 01:11:14,640
been a lot of work done on these trails

1602
01:11:12,480 --> 01:11:17,840
and it has been very much a a

1603
01:11:14,640 --> 01:11:20,640
communitymaintained resource. um as we

1604
01:11:17,840 --> 01:11:23,920
we move through the next uh you know few

1605
01:11:20,640 --> 01:11:27,280
months uh and into the next year um I

1606
01:11:23,920 --> 01:11:29,920
will work with with James uh and Paige

1607
01:11:27,280 --> 01:11:32,320
and we can uh get some dates on the

1608
01:11:29,920 --> 01:11:34,880
calendar and get a mechanism you know to

1609
01:11:32,320 --> 01:11:37,120
coordinate some work days uh and get a

1610
01:11:34,880 --> 01:11:38,880
better communication flow between what

1611
01:11:37,120 --> 01:11:41,280
uh my team is doing and what our plans

1612
01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:42,960
are um with you know the greater

1613
01:11:41,280 --> 01:11:46,400
community that's using using Harry

1614
01:11:42,960 --> 01:11:49,280
Hollister um

1615
01:11:46,400 --> 01:11:51,760
when interested feel free to to reach

1616
01:11:49,280 --> 01:11:53,199
out to me and if you're saying hey we

1617
01:11:51,760 --> 01:11:54,960
see this we'd like to do something like

1618
01:11:53,199 --> 01:11:57,199
this you know we can we can work on that

1619
01:11:54,960 --> 01:11:58,239
as well um I think you had another

1620
01:11:57,199 --> 01:12:00,320
question

1621
01:11:58,239 --> 01:12:02,320
» Z let me let me just jump in real quick

1622
01:12:00,320 --> 01:12:04,719
because I I just want to support you in

1623
01:12:02,320 --> 01:12:07,760
this because we do have great experience

1624
01:12:04,719 --> 01:12:10,880
working with Fingerlakes Trail Council

1625
01:12:07,760 --> 01:12:13,040
um Fingerlakes Land Trust uh we've we've

1626
01:12:10,880 --> 01:12:15,440
we've worked with a lot of and Zach

1627
01:12:13,040 --> 01:12:17,360
manages those those those partnerships

1628
01:12:15,440 --> 01:12:19,840
and those improvements incredibly

1629
01:12:17,360 --> 01:12:21,520
incredibly well.

1630
01:12:19,840 --> 01:12:23,120
» Good. Good. I'm I'm sure Zach is

1631
01:12:21,520 --> 01:12:26,400
familiar with anyone who's been trained

1632
01:12:23,120 --> 01:12:28,159
by the inbetral care crew, too. So, we

1633
01:12:26,400 --> 01:12:28,880
we're all schooled by them.

1634
01:12:28,159 --> 01:12:31,760
» Great.

1635
01:12:28,880 --> 01:12:33,920
» Uh Zach, is your email the same? Uh Zack

1636
01:12:31,760 --> 01:12:36,400
Ballard at parks yorkgov.

1637
01:12:33,920 --> 01:12:37,920
» Uh yeah, it's Zachary. Ballard

1638
01:12:36,400 --> 01:12:41,280
parks.gov.

1639
01:12:37,920 --> 01:12:44,719
Yep. and we we have marked both sides of

1640
01:12:41,280 --> 01:12:46,320
of the tree on the trail.

1641
01:12:44,719 --> 01:12:48,480
» All right, great. Thank you.

1642
01:12:46,320 --> 01:12:50,400
» Thanks, Zach. Thanks, Brian. You've done

1643
01:12:48,480 --> 01:12:52,560
a good job, everyone, at sort of

1644
01:12:50,400 --> 01:12:54,080
naturally transitioning. I think we've

1645
01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:56,719
covered

1646
01:12:54,080 --> 01:12:58,159
all of the sort of trails questions. So,

1647
01:12:56,719 --> 01:13:01,120
I want to get us back to a few

1648
01:12:58,159 --> 01:13:02,400
stewardship comments. Um, Kobe writes,

1649
01:13:01,120 --> 01:13:04,320
"I really appreciate the scientific

1650
01:13:02,400 --> 01:13:05,600
assessments and the work the team has

1651
01:13:04,320 --> 01:13:08,800
done."

1652
01:13:05,600 --> 01:13:10,320
Uh, we've got another good comment from

1653
01:13:08,800 --> 01:13:12,880
I think we've got a couple Lindsies on

1654
01:13:10,320 --> 01:13:14,400
the call, but uh, one of our Lindsay has

1655
01:13:12,880 --> 01:13:16,400
joined us. So excited about the research

1656
01:13:14,400 --> 01:13:17,760
regarding amphibians and vernal pools. I

1657
01:13:16,400 --> 01:13:19,760
hope the parking area can have some

1658
01:13:17,760 --> 01:13:22,800
education about vernal pools and

1659
01:13:19,760 --> 01:13:24,239
importance and signs. Walking the closed

1660
01:13:22,800 --> 01:13:26,239
trails, reminding folks of the

1661
01:13:24,239 --> 01:13:29,040
importance. I think James, you spoke to,

1662
01:13:26,239 --> 01:13:31,199
you know, your own enthusiasm for um,

1663
01:13:29,040 --> 01:13:35,520
educational signage and interpretation.

1664
01:13:31,199 --> 01:13:40,560
So, great comment there. Um, one of the

1665
01:13:35,520 --> 01:13:42,320
questions that was uh earlier is do the

1666
01:13:40,560 --> 01:13:44,480
ecological findings affect the

1667
01:13:42,320 --> 01:13:46,719
designation as a recreation area? For

1668
01:13:44,480 --> 01:13:49,199
example, will it become a wildlife

1669
01:13:46,719 --> 01:13:51,520
management area? I don't know if Elena

1670
01:13:49,199 --> 01:13:54,520
or Charlie, um, you want to take that

1671
01:13:51,520 --> 01:13:54,520
on.

1672
01:13:56,239 --> 01:14:02,400
Brad, you might have to help me out on

1673
01:13:58,960 --> 01:14:05,520
this one. Um, I believe the wildlife

1674
01:14:02,400 --> 01:14:08,239
management area, that's a a DEC specific

1675
01:14:05,520 --> 01:14:11,280
agency. I don't believe we have that

1676
01:14:08,239 --> 01:14:13,199
within this agency. Um, so that's my

1677
01:14:11,280 --> 01:14:14,400
understanding is is that's not going to

1678
01:14:13,199 --> 01:14:16,239
change. It's still going to be a

1679
01:14:14,400 --> 01:14:18,080
recreation area.

1680
01:14:16,239 --> 01:14:22,400
» I think that's correct. That's correct,

1681
01:14:18,080 --> 01:14:24,960
Elena. Uh, WAS are are a DEC construct

1682
01:14:22,400 --> 01:14:27,840
designation. Uh, state parks does not

1683
01:14:24,960 --> 01:14:30,640
have similar. So, uh, recreational

1684
01:14:27,840 --> 01:14:34,159
activities. Uh, this is a recreation

1685
01:14:30,640 --> 01:14:35,840
area. Yep.

1686
01:14:34,159 --> 01:14:37,600
» Yeah. Lindsay, the only thing that I can

1687
01:14:35,840 --> 01:14:40,800
think or sorry, Elena, um, the only

1688
01:14:37,600 --> 01:14:44,080
thing that I can, um, we have park

1689
01:14:40,800 --> 01:14:46,800
preserves. Um, and

1690
01:14:44,080 --> 01:14:49,120
this is not a designated park preserve.

1691
01:14:46,800 --> 01:14:51,360
it could potentially receive that

1692
01:14:49,120 --> 01:14:53,360
designation in the future based on, you

1693
01:14:51,360 --> 01:14:55,040
know, the ecological findings that we've

1694
01:14:53,360 --> 01:14:56,880
had, but that's not part of this

1695
01:14:55,040 --> 01:15:01,120
planning exercise

1696
01:14:56,880 --> 01:15:04,239
um at this time. But yeah, WMA is a is a

1697
01:15:01,120 --> 01:15:07,199
DEC designation. Um parks, we generally

1698
01:15:04,239 --> 01:15:10,760
have uh you know less designations than

1699
01:15:07,199 --> 01:15:10,760
DEC does.

1700
01:15:11,520 --> 01:15:16,880
» All right.

1701
01:15:13,360 --> 01:15:19,840
Um, another comment that has popped up a

1702
01:15:16,880 --> 01:15:23,280
couple of times in our chat is what is

1703
01:15:19,840 --> 01:15:27,960
the future of hunting at the site? Will

1704
01:15:23,280 --> 01:15:27,960
it be an allowable use? Will be banned?

1705
01:15:29,679 --> 01:15:35,199
» Uh, there'll be no change in in the the

1706
01:15:32,800 --> 01:15:38,199
hunting activities in the at the at the

1707
01:15:35,199 --> 01:15:38,199
property.

1708
01:15:41,440 --> 01:15:48,159
All right, let's see. Um, skimming

1709
01:15:45,760 --> 01:15:52,560
through my Oh, we've got some other

1710
01:15:48,159 --> 01:15:54,320
comments in the chat. Stina asks, "Zack,

1711
01:15:52,560 --> 01:15:56,960
how are the differences in summer versus

1712
01:15:54,320 --> 01:15:58,640
winter usage of trails considered? And

1713
01:15:56,960 --> 01:16:00,800
was the groomability of the new loops

1714
01:15:58,640 --> 01:16:02,960
for skiing considered? There are places

1715
01:16:00,800 --> 01:16:04,560
where it seems that the single track has

1716
01:16:02,960 --> 01:16:09,239
been retained instead of the wider

1717
01:16:04,560 --> 01:16:09,239
trails, making it impossible to groom.

1718
01:16:09,360 --> 01:16:15,120
Yeah, it was a consideration. Um, again,

1719
01:16:12,800 --> 01:16:18,880
some of some of the things you're seeing

1720
01:16:15,120 --> 01:16:22,480
may be relative to uh vernal pool

1721
01:16:18,880 --> 01:16:25,440
complexes and so we we altered where the

1722
01:16:22,480 --> 01:16:28,480
trail went. Um,

1723
01:16:25,440 --> 01:16:31,679
we have the vernal pools mapped. Uh,

1724
01:16:28,480 --> 01:16:33,679
they aren't on this public map for for a

1725
01:16:31,679 --> 01:16:37,360
number of reasons.

1726
01:16:33,679 --> 01:16:38,880
um kind of a more broader thing to look

1727
01:16:37,360 --> 01:16:43,920
at outside of the environmental

1728
01:16:38,880 --> 01:16:46,960
concerns. Uh I took the the maps that uh

1729
01:16:43,920 --> 01:16:50,960
showed the the uh yearly cross-country

1730
01:16:46,960 --> 01:16:53,679
ski races. You know, we looked at usage

1731
01:16:50,960 --> 01:16:56,080
um and we looked at maps from from the

1732
01:16:53,679 --> 01:16:58,239
cross country ski groups um that weren't

1733
01:16:56,080 --> 01:17:00,000
our maps that weren't state parks maps.

1734
01:16:58,239 --> 01:17:03,040
They were, you know, the the maps

1735
01:17:00,000 --> 01:17:07,280
generated by the groups. um and just

1736
01:17:03,040 --> 01:17:09,280
made an attempt as much as we could um

1737
01:17:07,280 --> 01:17:12,560
to check all of the boxes that we were

1738
01:17:09,280 --> 01:17:14,719
looking at and also maintain the ski

1739
01:17:12,560 --> 01:17:17,760
ability of these trails and and

1740
01:17:14,719 --> 01:17:20,320
hopefully with that maintain

1741
01:17:17,760 --> 01:17:23,840
um you know the ability to maintain

1742
01:17:20,320 --> 01:17:26,080
those in in the winter. Um

1743
01:17:23,840 --> 01:17:28,560
so so yeah it it was it was considered

1744
01:17:26,080 --> 01:17:32,159
and you know again we were looking at a

1745
01:17:28,560 --> 01:17:34,880
a number of different factors. Um but

1746
01:17:32,159 --> 01:17:37,440
being able to maintain uh as much of the

1747
01:17:34,880 --> 01:17:39,840
the the trails that were used in in ski

1748
01:17:37,440 --> 01:17:42,960
races and and crosscountry skiing was

1749
01:17:39,840 --> 01:17:44,960
part of that.

1750
01:17:42,960 --> 01:17:46,080
And as we move into this winter, I think

1751
01:17:44,960 --> 01:17:48,719
a lot of this is going to be the

1752
01:17:46,080 --> 01:17:50,880
conversation with the with the groups

1753
01:17:48,719 --> 01:17:53,120
and with the groomers and, you know,

1754
01:17:50,880 --> 01:17:55,679
finding how his season went. And if we

1755
01:17:53,120 --> 01:17:58,400
have to, you know, tweak the edges of

1756
01:17:55,679 --> 01:18:01,199
things to make that turn radius better,

1757
01:17:58,400 --> 01:18:03,040
um, you know, we're we're open to, you

1758
01:18:01,199 --> 01:18:05,440
know, making sure that some of these

1759
01:18:03,040 --> 01:18:07,120
things align, uh, as long as we're

1760
01:18:05,440 --> 01:18:09,920
sticking within our general structure of

1761
01:18:07,120 --> 01:18:11,440
the the map we've provided.

1762
01:18:09,920 --> 01:18:13,120
» Yeah. And and one of the goals moving

1763
01:18:11,440 --> 01:18:16,480
forward that is I mean we've we've

1764
01:18:13,120 --> 01:18:20,960
alluded to it is that this is

1765
01:18:16,480 --> 01:18:23,040
the start of a process you know moving

1766
01:18:20,960 --> 01:18:26,880
forward we are going to look more

1767
01:18:23,040 --> 01:18:30,320
comprehensively at trail improvements

1768
01:18:26,880 --> 01:18:33,280
um you know maintenance schedules uh you

1769
01:18:30,320 --> 01:18:35,600
know better signage better wayfinding um

1770
01:18:33,280 --> 01:18:38,400
now that we have kind of agreed on the

1771
01:18:35,600 --> 01:18:39,920
map and consolidated the trail

1772
01:18:38,400 --> 01:18:41,760
internally

1773
01:18:39,920 --> 01:18:44,640
um and we're getting that message out to

1774
01:18:41,760 --> 01:18:46,480
you all. Um we can start to move forward

1775
01:18:44,640 --> 01:18:48,000
with the processes that we we have to do

1776
01:18:46,480 --> 01:18:50,719
on our end to to make these things

1777
01:18:48,000 --> 01:18:53,679
happen. Part of that is is again still

1778
01:18:50,719 --> 01:18:55,360
still taking taking your input and you

1779
01:18:53,679 --> 01:19:01,560
know you know we welcome it to to make

1780
01:18:55,360 --> 01:19:01,560
this this park um usable for everybody.

1781
01:19:01,760 --> 01:19:08,320
» Thanks. All right. Um, couple

1782
01:19:05,280 --> 01:19:10,480
stewardship questions and I see folks as

1783
01:19:08,320 --> 01:19:12,320
we are in the last 10 minutes of our

1784
01:19:10,480 --> 01:19:13,679
time together this evening. For those of

1785
01:19:12,320 --> 01:19:15,280
you who have joined us and have to drop

1786
01:19:13,679 --> 01:19:17,440
off, we greatly appreciate your

1787
01:19:15,280 --> 01:19:19,760
attendance this evening and for those of

1788
01:19:17,440 --> 01:19:22,480
you that have volunteered to get

1789
01:19:19,760 --> 01:19:25,120
involved with trail uh stewardship and

1790
01:19:22,480 --> 01:19:28,159
work. Um, very appreciative of that

1791
01:19:25,120 --> 01:19:32,880
support. So Elena, for you and your

1792
01:19:28,159 --> 01:19:35,600
colleagues, we have a question about

1793
01:19:32,880 --> 01:19:37,520
um I lost Albert has a comment. Um we've

1794
01:19:35,600 --> 01:19:41,960
talked a lot about vernal pools. Um what

1795
01:19:37,520 --> 01:19:41,960
about impacts on bird populations?

1796
01:19:42,800 --> 01:19:49,280
» Yes. Yes. Good question. So there's a

1797
01:19:46,719 --> 01:19:52,239
lot of there's a lot of data in the the

1798
01:19:49,280 --> 01:19:55,679
literature that demonstrates that trails

1799
01:19:52,239 --> 01:19:59,120
do have impacts on bird populations.

1800
01:19:55,679 --> 01:20:02,480
um they tend to have lower density

1801
01:19:59,120 --> 01:20:04,159
populations. Um you know, areas within

1802
01:20:02,480 --> 01:20:06,800
forested habitats that are close to

1803
01:20:04,159 --> 01:20:10,239
trails, they're lessly less densely

1804
01:20:06,800 --> 01:20:13,120
populated. Their reproductive success is

1805
01:20:10,239 --> 01:20:15,600
lower. Um so I I think that's well

1806
01:20:13,120 --> 01:20:19,679
understood. Um, in the scientific

1807
01:20:15,600 --> 01:20:22,320
community for this particular exercise,

1808
01:20:19,679 --> 01:20:24,560
we decided to focus on the Bernal pools

1809
01:20:22,320 --> 01:20:27,600
because of the the statewide

1810
01:20:24,560 --> 01:20:30,880
significance that kind of tipped um

1811
01:20:27,600 --> 01:20:34,000
above, you know, that ecological

1812
01:20:30,880 --> 01:20:36,960
concern, but it's absolutely valid. Um,

1813
01:20:34,000 --> 01:20:38,719
the other thing we had to consider uh

1814
01:20:36,960 --> 01:20:41,760
throughout this process, right, is

1815
01:20:38,719 --> 01:20:44,159
finding that balance. So

1816
01:20:41,760 --> 01:20:46,960
really the only way to try to reduce

1817
01:20:44,159 --> 01:20:49,360
impacts on birds is to eliminate uh

1818
01:20:46,960 --> 01:20:51,679
human presence, right? So we'd have to

1819
01:20:49,360 --> 01:20:53,280
further shrink uh the existing

1820
01:20:51,679 --> 01:20:55,120
opportunity that's at the park. So

1821
01:20:53,280 --> 01:20:58,400
again, it's it's trying to find that

1822
01:20:55,120 --> 01:21:00,800
balance. Um so we didn't specifically

1823
01:20:58,400 --> 01:21:03,040
collect any data on that at the site,

1824
01:21:00,800 --> 01:21:06,480
but I I think it's you know, we have an

1825
01:21:03,040 --> 01:21:08,480
understanding that there is an impact.

1826
01:21:06,480 --> 01:21:11,360
» Thanks, Elena. And another surgical

1827
01:21:08,480 --> 01:21:13,920
question from Craig. Is there any plan

1828
01:21:11,360 --> 01:21:15,520
to treat him woolly adelgid? It seems

1829
01:21:13,920 --> 01:21:17,440
like a lot of hemlock are being

1830
01:21:15,520 --> 01:21:21,600
affected.

1831
01:21:17,440 --> 01:21:24,080
» Yes. Yes. Great question. So we are

1832
01:21:21,600 --> 01:21:27,280
currently conducting treatments at

1833
01:21:24,080 --> 01:21:30,000
hemlock or at her hollister. So the the

1834
01:21:27,280 --> 01:21:32,640
southern ravine that kind of hits you

1835
01:21:30,000 --> 01:21:34,159
can see it in the screen here um on the

1836
01:21:32,640 --> 01:21:36,480
southern part of the property that

1837
01:21:34,159 --> 01:21:39,679
hemlock stand has been treated. So

1838
01:21:36,480 --> 01:21:42,159
typically treatments are on a 5 to

1839
01:21:39,679 --> 01:21:44,480
sevenyear cycle.

1840
01:21:42,159 --> 01:21:46,560
And so that was treated I want to say

1841
01:21:44,480 --> 01:21:49,520
maybe two years ago. So we're going to

1842
01:21:46,560 --> 01:21:51,440
go back in probably another two years to

1843
01:21:49,520 --> 01:21:55,120
re-evaluate. And yet you can see it's

1844
01:21:51,440 --> 01:21:57,600
this dark green polygon at at the south

1845
01:21:55,120 --> 01:22:00,639
end. We decided not to treat the

1846
01:21:57,600 --> 01:22:03,040
hemlocks at the north end because we

1847
01:22:00,639 --> 01:22:06,400
just have these two little pieces,

1848
01:22:03,040 --> 01:22:09,760
right? But this is a consideration now

1849
01:22:06,400 --> 01:22:12,639
because this area is is going to be um

1850
01:22:09,760 --> 01:22:14,400
coming online. We're acquiring a parcel

1851
01:22:12,639 --> 01:22:16,639
in this area. So once we get that

1852
01:22:14,400 --> 01:22:19,199
parcel, we'll assess that hemlock stand

1853
01:22:16,639 --> 01:22:21,679
and see if it's appropriate um for

1854
01:22:19,199 --> 01:22:23,600
treatments. But also to the south,

1855
01:22:21,679 --> 01:22:27,600
particularly along Reynolds go, there's

1856
01:22:23,600 --> 01:22:29,760
a really beautiful hemlock stand. Um

1857
01:22:27,600 --> 01:22:32,000
similarly, like we we are treating that

1858
01:22:29,760 --> 01:22:33,840
that's on our radar. So, every seven

1859
01:22:32,000 --> 01:22:36,000
years we'll we'll cycle back and hit

1860
01:22:33,840 --> 01:22:39,000
those trees again. But, yep, great

1861
01:22:36,000 --> 01:22:39,000
question.

1862
01:22:40,400 --> 01:22:47,280
» Thanks, Elena. Um, doing sort of one

1863
01:22:43,199 --> 01:22:48,960
last spin through our comments here and

1864
01:22:47,280 --> 01:22:52,000
Chris Morris, I think you've been sort

1865
01:22:48,960 --> 01:22:54,880
of keeping an eye out to

1866
01:22:52,000 --> 01:22:56,960
um or other folks, them panelists we

1867
01:22:54,880 --> 01:22:59,520
have this evening if there's anything

1868
01:22:56,960 --> 01:23:02,880
we've overlooked. know there's a lot of

1869
01:22:59,520 --> 01:23:06,080
of comments in here. Um not seeing any

1870
01:23:02,880 --> 01:23:08,159
active questions, but if anyone has had

1871
01:23:06,080 --> 01:23:11,199
their question missed, please type that

1872
01:23:08,159 --> 01:23:14,880
into the chat. We're sort of down to our

1873
01:23:11,199 --> 01:23:18,320
our last five minutes. So, um I don't

1874
01:23:14,880 --> 01:23:20,159
know, Fred, uh James, Kathy, if you want

1875
01:23:18,320 --> 01:23:21,840
to have any closing remarks while people

1876
01:23:20,159 --> 01:23:24,320
might be typing any last thoughts they

1877
01:23:21,840 --> 01:23:26,400
have. Greatly appreciate the discussions

1878
01:23:24,320 --> 01:23:28,960
and the chat and and your thoughts are

1879
01:23:26,400 --> 01:23:31,960
all recorded. um in their chat

1880
01:23:28,960 --> 01:23:31,960
transcript.

1881
01:23:32,400 --> 01:23:36,480
» Yeah. Look, James, I'll kick it to you

1882
01:23:34,400 --> 01:23:40,080
and then I I'd like to have last word if

1883
01:23:36,480 --> 01:23:41,840
you're if everybody's okay with that.

1884
01:23:40,080 --> 01:23:44,159
» Sounds good. Um I just wanted to let

1885
01:23:41,840 --> 01:23:46,400
everyone know. Um if you have any

1886
01:23:44,159 --> 01:23:49,120
questions, please feel uh free to reach

1887
01:23:46,400 --> 01:23:50,639
out. Uh it's James Jeffrey at

1888
01:23:49,120 --> 01:23:52,560
parks.ny.gov

1889
01:23:50,639 --> 01:23:55,360
or call the uh number for Stony Brook

1890
01:23:52,560 --> 01:23:57,280
State Park. Uh, I'll be happy to field

1891
01:23:55,360 --> 01:23:58,880
um questions as they come up and I look

1892
01:23:57,280 --> 01:24:01,679
happy I mean I'm happy to be working

1893
01:23:58,880 --> 01:24:02,960
with everybody and I look forward to you

1894
01:24:01,679 --> 01:24:06,080
know where we're going in the future

1895
01:24:02,960 --> 01:24:08,880
here. So, thank you everybody

1896
01:24:06,080 --> 01:24:11,920
» And James thank you. I mean you you and

1897
01:24:08,880 --> 01:24:15,760
your your staff do a phenomenal job of

1898
01:24:11,920 --> 01:24:18,800
of managing this parcel. Um, and I also

1899
01:24:15,760 --> 01:24:21,600
want to just shout out to Elena and

1900
01:24:18,800 --> 01:24:23,760
Zach. uh the the amount of work, the

1901
01:24:21,600 --> 01:24:27,120
collaboration between sort of your two

1902
01:24:23,760 --> 01:24:30,080
desks was really really strong and I'm

1903
01:24:27,120 --> 01:24:32,320
really proud of the balance uh that

1904
01:24:30,080 --> 01:24:34,239
we've been able to strike with our our

1905
01:24:32,320 --> 01:24:36,639
stewardship responsibilities and

1906
01:24:34,239 --> 01:24:39,520
acknowledging the the incredible value

1907
01:24:36,639 --> 01:24:43,679
we have for this as a recreational area.

1908
01:24:39,520 --> 01:24:46,800
Um it's complicated. It's it's it is not

1909
01:24:43,679 --> 01:24:49,360
simple and just everybody from the park

1910
01:24:46,800 --> 01:24:51,760
side did a a great job. So I did want to

1911
01:24:49,360 --> 01:24:55,840
recognize everyone uh publicly for that

1912
01:24:51,760 --> 01:24:58,639
fine fine work. Um again I I I also want

1913
01:24:55,840 --> 01:25:01,760
to thank our users. You know state parks

1914
01:24:58,639 --> 01:25:03,360
we are here to serve you. Uh we want to

1915
01:25:01,760 --> 01:25:05,760
uh to make sure that we are providing

1916
01:25:03,360 --> 01:25:09,040
the best experience, the safest of

1917
01:25:05,760 --> 01:25:12,800
experiences. Um I'm incredibly proud of

1918
01:25:09,040 --> 01:25:14,239
the the the the state park system. Um, I

1919
01:25:12,800 --> 01:25:17,440
think personally I think it's the best

1920
01:25:14,239 --> 01:25:20,320
park system uh in the United States and

1921
01:25:17,440 --> 01:25:23,760
uh Harriet Hollister is a real real gem

1922
01:25:20,320 --> 01:25:26,239
in that in that system. So um please

1923
01:25:23,760 --> 01:25:28,560
come out and use it. Bring your friends.

1924
01:25:26,239 --> 01:25:32,320
Uh this is yours to celebrate and and

1925
01:25:28,560 --> 01:25:34,560
and use within the the structure that uh

1926
01:25:32,320 --> 01:25:37,600
the problem can can accommodate that

1927
01:25:34,560 --> 01:25:39,920
activity. Um don't hesitate to reach out

1928
01:25:37,600 --> 01:25:41,760
to us uh in the future. you know, we

1929
01:25:39,920 --> 01:25:43,760
look forward to the partnerships and in

1930
01:25:41,760 --> 01:25:46,639
terms of the improvements we can make at

1931
01:25:43,760 --> 01:25:48,400
Harriet Hollister. Uh but really uh

1932
01:25:46,639 --> 01:25:51,120
thank you very very much for your time

1933
01:25:48,400 --> 01:25:53,840
this evening and your passion for this

1934
01:25:51,120 --> 01:25:58,120
property um and to work with us in the

1935
01:25:53,840 --> 01:25:58,120
future. Thank you very much.

1936
01:26:03,280 --> 01:26:08,159
» All right, that concludes our

1937
01:26:05,760 --> 01:26:10,719
presentation and comment period for the

1938
01:26:08,159 --> 01:26:12,719
evening. Thanks everyone for joining us

1939
01:26:10,719 --> 01:26:14,080
with this recording. We in the next

1940
01:26:12,719 --> 01:26:16,159
couple of days are going to be working

1941
01:26:14,080 --> 01:26:18,800
on kind of refining the transcript and

1942
01:26:16,159 --> 01:26:22,080
we will get this uploaded to um our

1943
01:26:18,800 --> 01:26:24,400
YouTube page. So if you have friends

1944
01:26:22,080 --> 01:26:26,080
that were hoping to join us tonight were

1945
01:26:24,400 --> 01:26:28,400
unable to make it, you can point them to

1946
01:26:26,080 --> 01:26:30,080
that recording. Um we will be sending

1947
01:26:28,400 --> 01:26:32,320
out to everyone that registered for this

1948
01:26:30,080 --> 01:26:35,199
meeting the direct link to that uh

1949
01:26:32,320 --> 01:26:38,440
video. So thank you again and have a

1950
01:26:35,199 --> 01:26:38,440
nice evening.