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Okay. Oh, you're here. I just want to add that it's not live stream, but it's going to be recorded and uploaded tomorrow.

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Okay.

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Very good. Well, the obvious when Janice gets here, because we'll be able to steer.

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And of course, I thought several people have watched it online, so I guess maybe they won't.

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Yeah, not today.

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Well, that's the biggest.

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All right, well, I think it is.

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My clock says it's six o'clock.

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So, that's good.

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So, I will go ahead and call the planning

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as any commission meeting to order.

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Today is March 29th, 2023.

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Welcome everyone.

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And why don't we begin by establishing a core on please.

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Okay, Mr. Mothers.

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here. Ms. Kirkner, we'll hopefully be here soon. Mr. Lester.

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Here. Mr. Hall. Mr. Kane.

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Mr. Smith. Mr. Gordon. And Secretary Eisenberg. Here.

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Please let the record reflect that five members are present and we do have a form.

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Very good. Thank you. Let's stand for the Pledge of Allegiance, please.

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Pledge of Allegiance to the flag, to the states of America, and to the Republic for which it stands,

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one nation, under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

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We'll move on to item four,

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which is review and approval of the agenda we were sent, a revised agenda on Monday. Do we have any

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the revisions? No, just for a vision that was sent on Monday adding a new item six for

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community solar and the agricultural zone. We just wanted to bring this to your attention and

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bring it into the line item for the statement. Those are the only changes for the agenda.

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All right. So with that, is there a motion to approve the agenda as presented as up Monday?

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I make a motion to approve the agenda as presented. Second. All right. Motion second.

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all in favor. All right, that looks unanimous. Thank you. The agenda will stand approved. We'll move on to item five,

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which is the Administrator for Port. I'll turn it over to Madam Secretary. All right. Good evening, everyone. Thank you for being here.

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And again, as we said earlier, and this will be posted tomorrow. We are recording this meeting.

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The reason is because there's a conflict with one of the commissioners town halls this evening

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So we can't live stream both at the same time

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So those that are participating are participating by signing up from our link on our website and logging in that way

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Also for April 18th meeting

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So this is kind of technically taking the place of our first Wednesday of the month work session

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And then our next meeting will be April 18th, which is our daytime meeting.

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That meeting will be short, and it will only be limited to two items.

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We're going to try to finish up by 11 if we can.

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The reason is, is that the commissioners have their budget.

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At that time in the afternoon, so we want to make sure that we're wrapped up and done

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So the commissioners can have their budget deliberations and meetings, which will actually be in 003.

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three. So that's reason why we've added more items than usual to this evening's agenda.

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And the same will be true for the main meeting as well that first May, I'm going to get to the

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date exactly for the May third evening meeting. That will be a longer similar to this type of meeting

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length and time. And we'll actually have two development review projects on that meeting since we

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on the April 18th.

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So just want to give you an idea of what's coming up

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in the next several meetings.

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And also, unfortunately, as many of you know, Mr. Kosek

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had to step down from his role in the planning commission.

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So we are looking for members.

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So again, if you know anyone, you think

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a big great fit for this planning commission,

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please get the word out.

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I think we'll be doing a press release

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and the commissioners will let folks know as well to apply.

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So that's all I have for this evening.

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Thank you.

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Thank you. Then we'll move on to item six, which is the Community Solar and Agree Cultural

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Zone, Moratorium Overview.

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I'm so this evening we have from us from Landon Resource Management, Brenda Denny. She was the

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main staff person in charge of the Community Solar Text Amendment that happened several

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years ago. I believe the only person on this commission at that time when this was put into

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with Mr. Walther, so you may have some recollection of the extensive process that Brenda and

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her team went through to flesh out the community's solar aspect in the agricultural zone.

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That was in response to the state's pilot study that they had launched at that time, which

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actually, I believe, now I'm correcting if I'm wrong, Brenda, went from pilot to fully, fully

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like the pilot ended in the states going with the community solar allowance for the state.

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Don't happen if the legislation passes the general fund like this term.

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Oh, good. Okay. Yeah, I knew it was that that was something happening. So that's happening.

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And then I'm not sure how many of you have been paying attention and Brenda will go over all of this.

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Some of the community solar projects that now have made their way through our system to some extent

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Because of that pilot program in the state of Maryland, we're going through the development review process.

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And that drew up some concerns from the surrounding communities.

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So in response to that to kind of re-evaluate what our code says.

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The Board of County Commissioners decided to have a six-month moratorium to specifically figure out if there's anything else that we need to do as a county for the code for

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the community solar in the ads on specifically. So with that I'm going to turn it over to

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branded to update you up where we are in the process. We are not to you yet but we wanted to

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give you the heads up that this will be something you'll be seeing in the upcoming months.

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So with that I'm going to turn it over to Brenda, thank you. I do. So I'm going to

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Can I share my screen more for the PowerPoint?

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Thank you.

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Can everybody see that?

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Yes.

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I can see it.

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Thank you.

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Yes, I can too.

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Thank you.

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It's just a beautiful castle.

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Ah, I guess we'll put you.

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There you go.

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There you go.

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Now it's on our screen.

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I think that castle could use a little solar.

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I'm just saying.

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That's where we're going to meet next time.

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Okay, so I'm not here to give you an extensive presentation or anything.

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I really just wanted to as Linda said, give you kind of a heads up.

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This is happening because you'll be part of the process and it will be coming to you to review and

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recommend what you know what's being proposed or provide a recommendation on what's being proposed.

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So I'm just giving you a heads up, as Linda mentioned,

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you know, this moratorium was adopted recently.

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And if Mr. Weathers was the only one that was on the planning commission at the time.

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And you know, it could help to just have a little heads up and maybe get familiar with what's

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but it's currently in place that will be on, you know, subject to revision.

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Excuse me, Brenda, can you do this in full screen mode or presentation modes?

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We can see the full slide.

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We're still seeing the note side on the sidebar.

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Just to make it easier to see.

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And we still kind of show us it too.

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And no, now it's showing another.

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Okay, it just might be the screen situation.

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But that's fine, thank you.

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It's probably because I have two screens.

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So this when we were initially started this process two years ago, solar was allowed commercial

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solar.

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So we have accessory solar and we have commercial solar.

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Accessory solar is you know what somebody might have on their house and we need a form.

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Any property could have it but it's intended basically to serve that property only.

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It's not intended to be a facility that, you know,

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you are actually selling the energy for.

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Commercial solar is just the opposite.

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It's intended for the energy to be, you know,

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a commercial operation.

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It's put back into the grid and sold in some manner of fashion.

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So, community solar is different than sometimes

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commercial solar in that it is a subscription-based operation. So it's much smaller than what

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would typically be considered a utility or large-scale operation.

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And all of the person who

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operates it or the entity to operate the cell subscription to the facility and the subscriptions

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are limited in what you can purchase based on, you know, like your average bill. So you can't

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subscribe to much more than what you would normally be using. So that's a difference between

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the commercial and general and the subset of commercial quality solar.

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So all can any type of

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commercial solar is allowed in commercial industrial homes. But two years ago, the board asked that we come up with a proposal that would allow community solar facilities on remaining portions in the agricultural zone.

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And part of the reason for that was, you know, that probably one of the main reasons for that was a push from the state, you know, the state has energy goals that include renewable energy solar, you know, primarily solar winds that we have to, that they want to reach very quickly.

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So, there's been a lot of pressure for local jurisdictions to have areas available for solar development.

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And every year we've seen stuff come through the legislature, you know, proposing to do this or that,

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and some of it would be mandating, you know, that certain amounts of solar have to be required.

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So part of the effort to get ahead of that and show that we're making a good face effort to actually provide opportunities for some kind of the solar.

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This that was the main emphasis for this effort. So in the fall of 2020.

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We had the concept that we brought out to some stakeholder groups and got their feedback.

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And then went back to the commissioners in December with this concept.

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They gave us some direction on some stages to make.

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And then January, February, we went through the process to review those changes with the planning commission.

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And then the planning commission made a recommendation to the board.

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The board worked through that and then adopted an amendment to the zoning code in May

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of 2021.

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So, although this could completely change, just to give you context, I wanted to just quickly

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review the current requirements that are in the zoning code.

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And so, community solar facilities in Perilf County are limited to two megawatts inside.

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And to a megawatt is roughly five acres, you know, and so to megawatt would be roughly 10 acres of pounds.

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And then there's associated infrastructure.

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But state has used to cap in it to megawatt, and now they're caping it at five megawatt.

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So it's increased as we adopted this, but because we, the commission adopted it at two megawatt,

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it still captured two megawatts for Carol County. There's also a 28- or maximum size of the area

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that used for the solar facility, which includes the panels as well as all associated infrastructure,

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which includes access roads, inverters, landscape buffers, everything associated with the facility.

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There's a requirement because these are on remaining portions, and those

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Most of the remaining portions have already taken a residential development rate, that's why the remaining portions.

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A conservation season is required for the portion of the properties that is not under solar.

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And part of the reason for that, the main reason really was there was a lot of concern about these facilities expanding in the future.

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And the conservation season it was a mechanism to try to address that concern by limiting the ability for its facilities to expand.

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Of course, the site plan is required, it is a commercial use, and so that plan will be going before the planning commission for review and approval.

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So the requirements also say no productive top social year-end news, and there should be no impact in environmental resources.

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One of the requirements that maybe was a little more progresses than we've seen in a lot of other places, at least we think so, is agricultural co-location.

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Since that time, the buzzword is...

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So if you hear terable text, that means that there's a solar facility with an agricultural use on the same space.

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So for our requirements, it had to be, they had either grades, the race and kind of crop, which would probably be wouldn't be a row crop, but it would be a specialty crop, it could be raising sheets.

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or the other option would be to achieve a solar,

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a pollinator-friendly solar designation

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from our own department of natural resources.

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Being in the reason for that being that,

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you know, like agriculture needs be.

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Then it had a requirement for landscape offer,

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which in the regulations that does say it should provide full screening

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at times of installation.

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There's a 40-foot step-back requirement, 15-foot height requirement, and the reason it's

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that high is to allow the grazing underneath the utility lines to be undergrounded, and

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then it requires the decommissioning plan, which also requires a public works of

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agreement and a bond so that if the company is not around when it needs to be removed,

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we use the bond to do that.

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So, the more time is adopted by the Board on March 9th, and as to Linda mentioned, it'll be a fixed month moreatorium, and during that time, we'll be processing review, permitting, and construction of 3D solar energy generating systems in the agricultural zone will be held.

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So the board gave us direction on the March 23rd regarding the applicability, so we're talking

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that community soul only in the agricultural zone.

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The issue that we need to address were identified.

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The Commissioner of Big Leodie has presented a series of points with a number of concerns

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that he put together based on what he has been hearing, and if you're not familiar with those points,

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You can go to that PowerPoint and read what his points for.

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And then as well as some additional staff identified issues that need clarifying.

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So, you know, having been in place for two years now, there are some things that, as it goes to the development review process,

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we realize need some cleaning up or need clarifications, so we'll be doing that at the same time.

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And to do this process, the commissioners asked us to put together a work group and staff

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we're in the process of forming that so that you can provide an input on the concerns

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and then we can go back to the board with the options to consider for the different issues

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that have been concerned.

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The work group, and then this is some more direction, will consist of two members of the

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But Jason's property is to currently propose community solar facility and the CFDGS stands for

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3D Solar Solar Energy Generating Systems, a representative from the solar industry, and then a property owner

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who has a proposed facility on their property.

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And then we have plant staff in those, those three departments, by working on a resource management,

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so myself and this director are facilitating the workgroup and then we'll also have staff from these

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three agencies that we'll be working with us in supporting the effort as well.

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So the process is

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we are on the first blue block there and so we have six months to go and so we're putting the

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workgroup together now. The workgroup holds several meetings to go through and discuss the main points

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to issues, talk about applicability, come up with feedback and options, and we'll go back

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to the commissioners, give them a briefing on where the discussions that are happening,

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get if we get any further direction, we'll go back to the work group for another meeting

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to wrap that up, then back to the commissioners to review what the options are and what's

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discuss and then now give us directions when they're ready to then go take this to you for review and to look at the code change and you see that's the yellow block here.

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So we review the draft code changes and then you'll provide a recommendation to the board and of course that that's requirement under state law that the planning commission has to review any

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zoning code changes and make a recommendation to the board before the board can make any changes.

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So your recommendation then goes back to the board's commissioners.

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They'll review and discuss the proposed amendments and decide what's going to go out to public hearing.

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Public hearing will be held. Then they discuss delivery and decide whether they're going to adopt.

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So that's all happening between now and sometime in early September.

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And so if you have any other questions, I'd be happy to answer them, but you can also find more information.

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It's got an easy URL here.

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It's CarcannyMD.gov slash community solar.

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So we are going to be posting information and updates on the process.

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And then some measures PowerPoints that we've given are there at view the place for the public and anybody to go to the update of them.

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going on with this process or feel free to contact me if you have questions about community

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solar or anything in the process that might help you understand what's going on meeting

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up to us coming back to you with the proposed code revisions.

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David, have a question?

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So, Brenda, that was very helpful.

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I do have a couple of questions.

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The more authoritarian does it, does it have any effect on the commercial solar or is it

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community solar? Well, I just just for clarification, community solar is commercial solar. It's

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just one subset of it. But this particular, the moratorium was only applying to community solar

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and only community solar in agricultural zones. So it will not affect anything that happens

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in the commercial industrial district. Okay. Yeah. My question was a poor question. Thank you.

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I just think it's important for those that are watching this to understand it doesn't.

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It's not a moratorium on all solar everywhere in the county under all circumstances.

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The worker by just had a question on from the agricultural community.

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I didn't quite understand the box.

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Was it folks from the ad community, some that support this and some that are opposed to it?

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There's a balance there.

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Well, that what we were directed to do by the commissioners was to have two members from the

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airfiltro community that opposed solar in airfiltro zone, and they specifically mentioned

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the Farm Bureau.

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So we'll be asking representatives from Farm Bureau to sit on the workgroup.

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Is there any member from the agriculture community that is going to be on the workbird that is in favor of this?

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It just seems you'd want to have a balance there.

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Right, right.

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I think that what the commissioners thought was that the property owner who has a proposed project represents somebody from the agricultural community who supports solar.

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Now, okay,

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that's, I had read in the paper, I think, a comment from somebody and I might

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thought, I read it, I just give it, but I thought there was a comment somewhere that said

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that no one, no farmer in the ad community supported this.

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And I might have gotten that wrong, but in my recollection is, when we were going through

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this process, we heard from a number of people

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in the ag community that were farmers,

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and many were opposed to it,

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but there were also folks that came forward

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that were in favor of it.

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So to the extent,

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anyone thinks that that's the, that it's one-sided.

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My, my recollection is as we heard from the community,

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we were very sensitive for wanting to hear from

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the farming community.

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And my sense, my recollection is we had both sides

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of that argument come to us.

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Matt, you're in the farming community.

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I see you have your green light on.

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Yeah, I would say they're probably more pose and for it,

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but there are some on both sides.

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I'm kind of neutral.

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I mean, I know that as a county, we're worried about what might happen

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if we don't have enough solar and the state mandates something.

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I think that's what the former commissioners were worried about.

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and that's why they went in this direction. So I try to tell them that, but it doesn't mean they're not opposed.

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So I think it'll be pretty easy to find two that are opposed.

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Yeah, you are right about that. We did part of the presentation was

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that if the county wasn't interested in doing this at some point, the state was likely to mandate it

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and the county would have left the voice. Yeah, I mean, what farmers really don't want

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a hundred acre solar farms. And I think the commissioner's view was this might alleviate

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that happening at some point, but you still don't know that because in a lot of counties,

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that's the case. Yeah. Well, I don't think I'll say, I'm sorry, Picohead. Right. You know,

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I'm just going to say, Brendan, did I hear you correct to say that, you know, if you did it all the

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you could get basically one megawatt out of an acre. Is that what I heard you say?

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But basically, I mean, the industry standard is that it roughly takes five acres per

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megawatt of solar panels. Okay, so you know, it's curious to me that we said that you

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a 20-acre, we had a 20-acre max when 10 to 15 would have probably sufficed, assuming that

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topography and everything else worked in that way.

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Was that why we said we made it 20 was to give a little extra cushion there?

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Why did we say 20 and not something more along the lines of 15 to alleviate these fears of

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these mega fields of solar panels.

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Why did we say 20?

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I'm curious.

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Right.

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Well, I mean, whether it was 12 or 22 megawatts

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is it going to take any more space on 12,

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then it will on 20, then it will on 12.

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But yeah, that basically what you said is accurate that,

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you know, in some cases, the facility may not be

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right up against the road.

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So it'll need an access route.

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And that needs to be part of that 20 acre.

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It has to include the landscaping in the inverter and sometimes based on play conditions,

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they may not, there might be a gap between groups of some panels.

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So that's primarily why.

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Okay.

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All right.

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Everything is good for us.

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Go ahead, come, sorry.

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The other potential too is if you want to put certain types of specialty crops underneath the panels.

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Sometimes what they'll do is they'll face the panels out war to allow more sun to get through for those kind of props.

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Right, that makes total sense.

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And then the last thing I'll ask is, can you forward this this presentation to us please?

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I didn't get it in advance of the meeting.

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And I'd love to kind of flip through it again.

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Sure.

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I've Laura has, and I'm sure she can forward it.

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Thank you.

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Thank you very much.

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I can spend the sense that I can support that too soon.

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And we'll also post it on that webpage right there.

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So that'll be another way it can be accessed by you or by anybody else.

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Any other questions for Brenda?

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Well, Brenda, thank you for the presentation.

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It's very helpful.

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And I know the commission will look forward to being part of this process as this moves forward.

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So thank you.

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Well, if we stay on track, and I look forward to seeing you in June.

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Take care. Thank you.

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Okay. Thank you.

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We'll move on to item seven on our agenda, which is water and sewer trianial update,

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and we're getting an intern introduction tonight from Price Wagner.

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Hey, Price. Good morning, or had you good evening, sorry.

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Can I share my screen, please, Laura?

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Yeah, just give me a minute here.

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Okay. Thanks. So yeah, just before, you know, my screen, I'm able to share what I'm going to do is.

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Is that everybody able to see that? Yep.

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You've been for you for the aspect of amendments to our water sewer matter plan.

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Well, this is the trilineal update, which is occurring throughout the every three years.

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And what happens with that is state mandated and is the, so,

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so since everybody except for Mr. Waters is probably this is new to them for the water sewer aspect of things.

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what exactly is the water sewer, you know, what's the master plan? So it's based on

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Title IX, so Title V of the health environmental article of the anti-to-code of

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Maryland and requires a Carroll County to review and adopt a water and sewer

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master plan every three years.

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So the big thing is the Carroll County we don't have a

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central authority overseeing in water and or sewer services. So we work with all the different

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municipalities, aid ovum, as well as the freedom area which the county owns.

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We work with the water sewer service. We work with them to incorporate them into our water sewer master plan.

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And the objective has there's three main ports of the objective. One is to make sure there's an ample water supply to be collected for current development as well as future development. I could occur.

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Also, that there's wastewater is able to be collected and delivered to the points that are

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singed for that distribution and then finally wastewater can be either treated before

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as discharge to state waters and compliance with water quality standards in some cases

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and the city of Westminster just begun this. They are doing a pilot for a water wastewater

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we use program to incorporate and add hopefully a new source of water.

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So the county government requires a developer's plans and we're so the government body is

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we're really the coordinate agencies we work with all the talents and the providers and their

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staff whether it's their planning staff and conjunction also with their water facilities staff

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to get this plan worked on and put together.

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And it's not only public systems,

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but there are some private systems within the county.

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So, you know, why do we update the plan?

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I guess that is required by the state,

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be up there to every three years.

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And the last update was done and adopted

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and approved by the state of Maryland in July of 2019.

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Now, since then, we've done 15 total amendments or if you'll look at this way, we have

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done roughly six five cycles that total 15 of them is each. So we spring a 2020,

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spring a

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and follow 22. So pretty much every twice a year we're always amending the plan and that's

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typically comes from the fact that either a owner has come to us and say that they may not

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want to be a part of a system or they need to get into a system. So we talk with the provider to

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see if there is a variable capacity for that aspect or if the provider comes to us and says

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at this time, we have a new development coming in and they were in future, which is seven to

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10 years out. Then they look at that and say they're ready to go. Let's come and bring them into

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the priority aspect. So we change the service area maps to incorporate a property into where it

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to go as well as update of the charts for the demand as needed. Now, the waters who were

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the plan and Texas amendments, these amendments actually supersede the 2019 plan. So,

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if whatever plan, whatever amendment was done, if it was in, let's say the town of Manchester,

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and it updated the map. If that map now is based off of the newest map there, not the

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map in 2019, as well as the man's in that type of thing.

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So the process, I just

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driven and worked with the towns and distributed their chapters, the water and sewer as

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well as the maps for them to look at the uses data to see how much is being used as well

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as infrastructure projects that are in the works that could potentially expand the system,

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help alleviate what it comes to, sewer, inflow, and infiltration, which is considered,

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which is called I&I, or is water areas that have leaks, where they're pumping more water

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than they're billing for. And you look at the sewer side, you're actually, their flows are higher

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going to the sewer plant, and they are actually being billed for, so that shows you have more water coming from the ground into your system going to the sewer plant.

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So we look at all that, just sort of see what the average daily flows are.

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What the demands are, if any of their wells, if they're on wells, if there have the ability to, if they've been increased or if they're all flying for some reason.

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So we've worked with them to make changes since the last 12-in-L of date and look at all the maps.

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Looking at when it comes to the maps, where the lines are, if the lines are up the date, if a new system has come in,

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the good example is Stone Gate here in the Westminster.

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In 2017, or actually I'm sorry, 2019, that was not a shovel had not hit the ground yet.

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It was just starting, now that is close to being built out.

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So that is now shown more as an existing service area.

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And we have lines that show that they are now

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aligned in the ground.

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Once everybody is comfortable with what has been presented.

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So I would see the information from the towns,

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from the providers, and incorporated in their exact chapters.

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And we send our ass back and forth,

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to make sure that, if they're still with their saying, everything looks good as the same goes

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with the maps. So once we feel everybody is on the same page and says, yes, this is what we

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we're talking about and this is what we are hoping for. Then a week I go in front of their

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their towns, the town councils, or not the county, but the paying commissions, and ask them to

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or five their sections, their chapters, or consistency with their the most recent or most current

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water suit, the most current competent to plan.

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So what have I done so far? All the staff,

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the meeting with municipal staff is complete. I've worked with everyone back and forth multiple times

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to get all the information and make sure everything is concise and I've also made updates to the

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municipal chapters, so the water resource is chapter. Working on demographics,

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the zoning, and reference maps. We have maps that show the areas, the different rock

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formations, different soils, as well as that type of thing. So for, we've presented a three

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three planning commissions, the city of Tony Town, city of Westminster, and town of

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plan. And in the very first slide, you may have seen a small little blur that is the plan

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cover that that was designed for this current section. So what I have coming up next, the

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town of Manchester chapter is pretty much complete. And I'm looking to go in front of them on

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April the 18th, as their planning commission for consistency with their 2018 comprehensive plan.

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And I'm currently working with the Towns of Hamstead, Union Bridge, and about

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area to finalize their texts, maps, and tables.

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And looking to go and find out these talented Union Bridge on the 20th,

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Mount Area of the 24th, and Hamstead on the 26th,

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for their consistent see statements and certifications.

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And at the same time, in the meantime, I am working with our bureau of utilities

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to finalize just the data for pleasant valley water and sewer systems and barcill water

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system and then finalize the data for the hamstered sewer system as well as the freedom

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water and sewer system infrastructures

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and then after all that is done and complete I will

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come in front of the planning commission again on May the 16th or to request certification

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of the entire document, as well as the chapters for Hampstead and Freedom, and those certified

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consistent with our plans and asked for a recommendation to do for that to the County Commission.

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So that is sort of the brief overview of the Water and the sewer master plan of what we're

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what is about and if there's any questions, I'll be more than happy to answer them. Thank you.

436
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Any questions for for price?

437
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:05,060
I I just want to know how you manage to go to so many meetings. It seems like a

438
00:39:05,060 --> 00:39:12,420
Marathon for you to be attending all of these. It can be but I am fortunate enough. I have a

439
00:39:12,420 --> 00:39:16,200
bunch of great colleagues that they have also have

440
00:39:16,700 --> 00:39:20,120
They've all for to from when it comes to the certifications

441
00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:25,160
to learn and if it's called some of the meetings do fall in the same night.

442
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:30,100
So I do have to have the ability to hopefully have some help and I've had,

443
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:35,940
they have said yes they're more than happy and if they're able to do it.

444
00:39:36,540 --> 00:39:40,740
So they actually help and they do this sort of a patient aspect.

445
00:39:40,900 --> 00:39:42,680
I got all the documents, everything falling.

446
00:39:43,500 --> 00:39:46,060
So pretty much when they get there,

447
00:39:46,060 --> 00:39:52,340
VATIS happens to say, here, we just need the certification and all the questions, hopefully,

448
00:39:52,460 --> 00:39:58,820
been answered beforehand. Something in LA, Monday night, I did have new winter certification,

449
00:39:59,380 --> 00:40:04,800
also, at the same time, Tony Town was looking at VATIS, and a question came up in New Winter,

450
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:09,880
and I texted the planner who was going to be talking with Tony Town to say,

451
00:40:10,140 --> 00:40:15,680
if this happens to occur, I gave her some, just what happened to some guidance, and she responded

452
00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:20,340
back. She's like, I wouldn't have no clue what to do in that situation. So thank you for

453
00:40:20,340 --> 00:40:24,780
for letting me, you know, give it that to me, but luckily nothing came out out of the ordinary.

454
00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:30,580
So it can be a marathon, but it's sort of trying to get down to a good science.

455
00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:39,140
Well, the reason I made the comment was that your thoroughness honestly, I think gives us more comfort

456
00:40:39,140 --> 00:40:42,540
when you're bringing it back to us, knowing that you've taken this process of seriously

457
00:40:42,540 --> 00:40:44,440
you're attending these things or your colleagues are,

458
00:40:44,500 --> 00:40:47,160
your answering questions, and it's something

459
00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:49,840
that's done comprehensively and thoroughly and seriously.

460
00:40:51,340 --> 00:40:52,920
So we very much appreciate that, Price.

461
00:40:53,580 --> 00:40:56,660
Yeah, so yeah, I definitely, I, multiple phone calls,

462
00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:00,140
emails back and forth with all their responsibilities

463
00:41:00,140 --> 00:41:01,020
and the providers.

464
00:41:02,180 --> 00:41:04,840
And before I go to their planning commissions,

465
00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:09,320
I send everything to them for one last review

466
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:12,080
to make sure everything looks concise

467
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:13,700
So what they're looking what they sent.

468
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:16,540
And so yeah, I want to make sure I get,

469
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:20,620
we get it done correctly the first time and then.

470
00:41:20,660 --> 00:41:23,560
So when we called to our planning commission,

471
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:28,900
it is not a rubber stamp, but it's a,

472
00:41:28,900 --> 00:41:33,500
they have the, the know-how of, yes, it was done,

473
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:34,860
concise and thorough.

474
00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:40,560
So what is being provided is the very good information.

475
00:41:44,240 --> 00:42:02,540
I would ask one question that seems to be coming up here in the Freedom District and I'm not asking for an answer tonight, but I would just ask you to kind of check your decimal points and everything concerning the data because what's being quite

476
00:42:02,540 --> 00:42:13,020
question here in this area is, has the county in a desire to enable some developers to

477
00:42:13,020 --> 00:42:20,820
have increased density on proposed developments, have we given some of the capacity that

478
00:42:20,820 --> 00:42:30,580
was earmarked towards existing homes that are currently on sewer and they have smaller

479
00:42:30,580 --> 00:42:35,060
to connect to, I don't understand it all, but it's my understanding that they will not have

480
00:42:35,060 --> 00:42:37,600
an option that they're going to have to go on to sewer.

481
00:42:38,600 --> 00:42:45,720
And so if they're in that priority sewer area, you know, is the capacity that was earmarked

482
00:42:45,720 --> 00:42:52,900
for those homes that are going to need sewer access, has that capacity been given to proposed

483
00:42:52,900 --> 00:42:53,620
developments?

484
00:42:53,800 --> 00:42:56,980
And so, I just ask you to repeat, yeah.

485
00:42:56,980 --> 00:43:01,800
We have gone over this multiple times with that community group and specific people.

486
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:05,300
This was specifically addressed in the free and unplanned.

487
00:43:05,660 --> 00:43:09,640
That very thing, yes, we did 100%. I've told Joe Grundy that.

488
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:12,180
I've told other members have to express that concern.

489
00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:14,080
Multiple multiple times.

490
00:43:14,180 --> 00:43:14,920
We absolutely did.

491
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:17,980
We took smaller lots that were unwell in septic.

492
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:25,580
Where we the county have no CIP to extend the lines to those area.

493
00:43:25,580 --> 00:43:40,920
However, what we did do was reserve 20 additional percent capacity in the system if and when the time should come that there is failures because we have not been alerted by the health department or anyone else that there are systemic failures in that system

494
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:54,220
But we do have a safeguard that if something should happen. We the county can look to transfer those folks over and actually we're looking now for future ahead what it would cost to actually put the lines and it's very

495
00:43:54,220 --> 00:43:58,480
owners and we're not taking it lightly because the citizens would have to pay considerable amount

496
00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:03,900
of money to hook up considerable amount, tens of thousands of dollars to hopefully,

497
00:44:04,100 --> 00:44:08,440
truly, in addition to what the millions of dogs have across the county to extend those lines.

498
00:44:08,820 --> 00:44:13,980
So this has been addressed. I'm sorry if I'm coming up a little harsh, but we've talked about this

499
00:44:13,980 --> 00:44:18,820
multiple times. I think even planning commission. I feel like, you know, that this group is beating,

500
00:44:19,100 --> 00:44:23,560
this drum that really isn't there to beat. And so I just wanted to be very clear. We have done

501
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:29,900
you diligence on that? Yeah, and getting an answer like that and having you know prices

502
00:44:29,900 --> 00:44:35,140
well, you know echo that to, I mean, it just, again, that just helps us else as a commission,

503
00:44:35,820 --> 00:44:39,560
you know, answer those questions and say that we've asked, you know, so I appreciate you

504
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:44,560
addressing it, Linda. Thank you. Right, any other questions for a price?

505
00:44:46,570 --> 00:44:47,450
All right, a price?

506
00:44:47,590 --> 00:44:54,350
We can turn you loose tonight. Thank you very much. Thank you. With that, we'll move on to item

507
00:44:55,230 --> 00:44:59,970
8 Manchester annexation number 41 the tap scoon

508
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:07,220
91 LLC, and I think Anna Weber is standing by to present us.

509
00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:07,760
Hello, Hannah.

510
00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:15,800
Yes, I am. I'm the lucky one now. So, as you presented, we are here for a Manchester

511
00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:21,820
annexation with us today. I believe is the Town Administrator of Manchester, Mr.

512
00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:27,880
Paracone, as well as Kelly Shaffer, who is representing the property owner and the

513
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:34,060
of this annexation, they'll be here to answer any of your questions as they come up.

514
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:38,120
Can you guys see my screen, the presentation?

515
00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:44,680
Yes, we can. Okay, perfect. So just for tonight, we have an informational briefing.

516
00:45:45,220 --> 00:45:50,700
I'll be coming back to you all on April 18th for your formal recommendation to the Board of

517
00:45:52,300 --> 00:45:59,060
commissioners. Getting started as we said this is in the town of Manchester. We are like

518
00:45:59,060 --> 00:46:05,400
right in the middle of a residential area. If you follow my cursor, this is the annexation area.

519
00:46:05,940 --> 00:46:13,940
It's approximately 13 acres with access on Jomer Drive through a private drive and then also

520
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:24,480
access on Washington way via via prior way. One thing to note about this annexation is

521
00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:30,700
that it is in an existing on-clave. So as we all know on-claves are a big

522
00:46:30,700 --> 00:46:37,540
note for annexations and you can see the big corporate limits around and this

523
00:46:37,540 --> 00:46:43,020
small donut hole which includes the annexation area. You can see we're in the

524
00:46:43,020 --> 00:46:49,680
other part of the corporate limits of Manchester and the on-clave includes this 13 acre

525
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:57,360
parcel annexation area as well as four other parcels. Going back to this flat, you can see

526
00:46:57,360 --> 00:47:05,620
the annexation number 14 that is surrounding the annexation area was actually enacted in 1977

527
00:47:05,620 --> 00:47:12,400
And then this annexation number 18, which is on Jommer Drive was actually enacted in 1979.

528
00:47:13,460 --> 00:47:18,620
So was nothing that was obviously done recently, and it was probably done before Maryland

529
00:47:18,620 --> 00:47:22,580
State Law prohibited the on-clave rule.

530
00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:30,960
So back to this particular annexation, as we said, it's approximately 13.92 acres.

531
00:47:32,380 --> 00:47:38,740
It's slightly improved with some buildings, but no one resides on the annexation area.

532
00:47:41,230 --> 00:47:47,330
The current zoning of the annexation area is R-40,000 residential and conservation in

533
00:47:47,330 --> 00:47:48,050
the county.

534
00:47:48,990 --> 00:47:54,710
The petitioners have requested the town of Manchester to be placed in the R-10,000 residential

535
00:47:54,710 --> 00:47:57,730
and the public conservation zone as well.

536
00:47:57,730 --> 00:48:08,710
The plan is to keep the conservation zone the same when going into the town and just move the R 40,000 portion to the R 10,000 portion.

537
00:48:09,690 --> 00:48:24,070
So, since the R 10,000 zoning district is 50% more dense than the R 40,000 zoning district in the county is zoning waiver is required for this annexation and it has been requested by the petitioner and the town.

538
00:48:25,990 --> 00:48:29,550
The designated land use is medium density residential.

539
00:48:30,010 --> 00:48:33,710
This is taken from the 2018 Manchester Comprehensive Plan.

540
00:48:36,460 --> 00:48:42,060
This annexation area is actually in the no service area for both water and sewer.

541
00:48:42,060 --> 00:48:44,480
It's kind of uncommon because it's in the growth area.

542
00:48:45,140 --> 00:48:48,900
But as we just heard, Christ Wagner talking about the triennial update.

543
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:57,840
One of the updates for the town of Manchester is going to be to bring the entire annexation area into the priority.

544
00:48:57,840 --> 00:49:03,740
service area for both water and sewer to aid in the development of the property when it is

545
00:49:06,330 --> 00:49:11,510
annexed. So all that we are recommending is the town of Manchester give public notice by

546
00:49:11,510 --> 00:49:16,290
posting the property prior to the date of the public hearing and notifying all of the

547
00:49:16,290 --> 00:49:23,090
adjoining property owners. Next steps as I said we are going to come back before you all on April 18th

548
00:49:23,090 --> 00:49:28,470
for your recommendation to the county commissioners and then we have time reserved on April 20th

549
00:49:28,470 --> 00:49:34,510
in April 27th with the board for their decision on the zoning waiver and comment letter.

550
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:42,600
That does it for me. Jeff, if you want to turn it over to the representatives for the town or

551
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:48,240
Kelly. Yeah, Mr. Pericon or Kelly, do you have anything you want to add?

552
00:49:54,070 --> 00:49:54,610
Kelly, I can see

553
00:49:54,610 --> 00:49:57,890
you talking and your microphone appears beyond, but I can't hear you.

554
00:50:00,980 --> 00:50:02,680
Kelly, check your gear wheel and the

555
00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:08,760
right hand corner and sometimes you need to refresh the microphone.

556
00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:34,500
Anything? Yes, yes, I can hear you

557
00:50:34,500 --> 00:50:41,780
know. Okay, all right, thank you. I appreciate that. Good insight for future meetings. Good evening,

558
00:50:42,220 --> 00:50:47,460
everyone. Kelly Shaper Miller, I'm here tonight on behalf of the applicants or petitioners in this

559
00:50:47,460 --> 00:50:54,960
case, Tapco 91 LLC. I also have Linda Alexander from CLSI and one of the property owners

560
00:50:54,960 --> 00:51:00,880
online to just in case there are any questions. And I know that also Mr. Pericone from Manchester

561
00:51:00,880 --> 00:51:06,200
is on to answer any questions specific to this town. I really don't have much to add,

562
00:51:06,300 --> 00:51:11,360
I think, in a did a great presentation, but I am here and available and happy to answer any questions

563
00:51:12,420 --> 00:51:18,980
that this planning commission has. This has been through the, you know, different municipalities

564
00:51:18,980 --> 00:51:24,760
review these annexations differently before they get to the county for review. So this has been

565
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:30,960
a little bit more of a thorough planning commission and mayor counsel review from the town,

566
00:51:31,160 --> 00:51:37,260
then other municipalities would have, so there's been lots of discussions and hopefully I

567
00:51:37,260 --> 00:51:43,240
have all the answers if you do have any questions tonight. So, the only question I have,

568
00:51:43,320 --> 00:51:48,240
which is the question we typically ask on these things, is has the town taken an official position

569
00:51:48,240 --> 00:51:54,220
on this in support of the annexation or is that still pending or are they against it?

570
00:51:55,260 --> 00:52:10,840
I will let Mr. Pericone chime in if his opinion differs but they I believe that so far the position has been that they support this did go through an amendment it was initially submitted with a request for our 10 over the entire portion of the property.

571
00:52:10,840 --> 00:52:34,040
and through discussions with the Towns Planning Commission and Mayor and Council and just the code clarifications on our part we amended the request to keep the existing conservation zone portion of the property conservation zone and the remainder our ten zone and in doing that we have shown kind of rough concept plans to the town.

572
00:52:34,040 --> 00:52:45,060
that show 14 locks on the R10 portion here, which is my understanding that any approved annexation

573
00:52:45,060 --> 00:52:51,080
will then be subject to kind of a lock maximum at the town through an annexation agreement.

574
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:56,140
So all of that kind of been talked about it and because of all of those discussions and

575
00:52:57,340 --> 00:53:01,920
clarification, I believe it's fair to say that now the town is supported.

576
00:53:01,920 --> 00:53:03,860
Thank you.

577
00:53:03,940 --> 00:53:04,540
Mr. Perry County.

578
00:53:09,140 --> 00:53:11,760
You may have to find your wheel too.

579
00:53:11,980 --> 00:53:14,180
I can't hear you.

580
00:53:17,610 --> 00:53:18,910
No, no, yes.

581
00:53:19,450 --> 00:53:20,430
How about now?

582
00:53:20,830 --> 00:53:21,550
Yes, yes.

583
00:53:21,610 --> 00:53:22,070
Well done.

584
00:53:22,230 --> 00:53:23,370
Well done.

585
00:53:23,390 --> 00:53:24,250
My apologies.

586
00:53:25,610 --> 00:53:25,970
No, no, no, no.

587
00:53:26,090 --> 00:53:28,230
Mr. Perry County for the town of Manchester.

588
00:53:28,670 --> 00:53:34,110
At the December 20th meeting in 22 of the town of Manchester Planning Commission.

589
00:53:34,110 --> 00:53:41,230
They did recommend to the Mayor and Council to accept this annexation with just basically the same points.

590
00:53:42,170 --> 00:53:43,790
Ms. Miller has outlined.

591
00:53:44,510 --> 00:53:52,490
It was accepted in January by the Town Council in Mayer and the scheduled public hearings for it.

592
00:53:52,570 --> 00:53:57,050
I believe we're doing our April 11th Town Council meeting for a public hearing.

593
00:53:57,530 --> 00:54:00,610
Then it will be voted on for final acceptance from the town.

594
00:54:01,190 --> 00:54:02,190
That's not funny.

595
00:54:03,560 --> 00:54:09,440
Good to know. Thank you very much. Any any any any any other comments on this tonight is obviously just

596
00:54:11,500 --> 00:54:16,700
Trying to find it sort of an introduction. I guess we're not taking any action tonight. There's anything else that

597
00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:27,620
Any one would like to add for our information we always appreciate you said this is going to be 14 lots is the plan for this piece of property

598
00:54:29,890 --> 00:54:32,870
That's the concept plan that's been prepared by CLSI.

599
00:54:33,170 --> 00:54:42,890
They haven't gone to the extent of preparing a full site plan or anything, but based on a concept drawing that is what we believe would work.

600
00:54:45,010 --> 00:54:47,870
And I may have missed this part, and if I did, I apologize.

601
00:54:48,150 --> 00:54:58,310
I'm assuming that the town of Manchester is not going to have any, I guess, financial responsibility for extending water and sewer down into.

602
00:54:58,310 --> 00:54:59,590
use lots?

603
00:55:01,890 --> 00:55:05,550
Well, we will work with the town on, you know, resolving all of that,

604
00:55:05,710 --> 00:55:09,910
or any of the site plan process, and there will be public work agreements, and bonding,

605
00:55:09,930 --> 00:55:14,410
and all of that. But yeah, it's my understanding that, you know, the developer will be

606
00:55:14,410 --> 00:55:18,970
out of the cost of extending public water and sewer. Oh, I was right.

607
00:55:22,350 --> 00:55:23,130
Very good.

608
00:55:23,450 --> 00:55:24,150
Even any other questions?

609
00:55:26,190 --> 00:55:30,290
Oh, I'm good. All right. Thank you. Thank you for that. Anyone else?

610
00:55:32,240 --> 00:55:39,100
All right, well, we very much appreciate all of you being here this evening and being available to answer questions

611
00:55:39,100 --> 00:55:46,000
We know everyone's busy and we thank you for making yourselves available for us and providing information to us

612
00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:52,100
So thank you very much, and we'll look forward to seeing this presented at the next meeting. Thank you everyone

613
00:55:52,100 --> 00:55:54,680
Thank you very much

614
00:55:58,300 --> 00:56:02,860
So we will go on now to item nine the transportation

615
00:56:04,160 --> 00:56:06,980
master plan, something we've heard a little bit about.

616
00:56:13,140 --> 00:56:15,100
Claire, we can see you talking, but we can't hear you.

617
00:56:16,360 --> 00:56:18,520
Tell these giraffeele issues, sorry guys.

618
00:56:35,630 --> 00:56:40,290
Yes. Yes. Perfect. Great. Laura, can you do that one more time,

619
00:56:40,390 --> 00:56:42,210
made me a presenter? Sorry.

620
00:56:51,380 --> 00:56:57,180
I figured it out, just kidding. I was going to say it's you already. All right,

621
00:56:57,180 --> 00:56:59,820
So, everyone can see my screen.

622
00:57:01,180 --> 00:57:01,760
Okay, great.

623
00:57:02,700 --> 00:57:02,900
All right.

624
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:04,680
So again, good evening.

625
00:57:05,040 --> 00:57:07,340
Mary Lane and I are with you this evening.

626
00:57:08,340 --> 00:57:12,100
To present or wrap up the plan roadway section.

627
00:57:13,000 --> 00:57:15,660
And this is Chapter 6 of the Transportation Master Plan.

628
00:57:16,180 --> 00:57:18,400
So I'm going to start with Tony Town,

629
00:57:18,420 --> 00:57:24,440
and then Mary is going to wrap up with the new Windsor and Union Bridge areas.

630
00:57:24,440 --> 00:57:27,280
So, just taught me at any point at the questions.

631
00:57:34,450 --> 00:57:38,130
So, the 20-10 is located in the northwestern portion of the county.

632
00:57:38,710 --> 00:57:41,350
The current road-based system provides commuter access,

633
00:57:41,990 --> 00:57:45,590
southeast to Westminster, northwest to Emmetsburg,

634
00:57:46,130 --> 00:57:48,710
west in the Frederick County in North Indepensalvania.

635
00:57:49,910 --> 00:57:52,730
20% of 20-10 residents commute to Westminster,

636
00:57:53,250 --> 00:57:55,990
and 12% to Frederick and Baltimore counties.

637
00:57:55,990 --> 00:58:04,230
25% of 20 town workers traveled from within the sub-area and 25% from Pennsylvania.

638
00:58:05,850 --> 00:58:12,150
20 town's group rate is anticipated to be low when a regional level but the highest rate for the county.

639
00:58:13,290 --> 00:58:15,990
And traffic congestion in the sub-area is modest.

640
00:58:16,830 --> 00:58:25,330
There's light congestion along Maryland 140 in the PM peak hours at Maryland 194 and Grand Drive Chevrolet Drive.

641
00:58:29,230 --> 00:58:35,970
This is staff is recommending 13 roads in the Tone Town area for adoption into the Transportation

642
00:58:35,970 --> 00:58:36,770
Master Plan.

643
00:58:37,370 --> 00:58:42,190
There's one state highway project, four planned major streets, and eight planned neighborhood

644
00:58:42,190 --> 00:58:42,770
connections.

645
00:58:49,190 --> 00:58:54,130
So, our one state highway project is Maryland 77, also known as Middleberg Road.

646
00:58:54,650 --> 00:58:59,850
This is from the Frederick County line to Maryland 194 in Kiemar.

647
00:58:59,850 --> 00:59:07,670
This section of 77 is located Southwest of Tony Town and Northwest of Union Bridge.

648
00:59:08,370 --> 00:59:12,330
It's 1.5 miles of tooling reconstruct.

649
00:59:13,490 --> 00:59:16,750
The highway functions as a principle arterial.

650
00:59:17,510 --> 00:59:20,070
And the project is in state highway administrations.

651
00:59:20,110 --> 00:59:21,910
Highway needs inventory document.

652
00:59:23,130 --> 00:59:27,470
And at this time, the project has not been identified as a priority for the county.

653
00:59:33,100 --> 00:59:39,480
And so we have four plant major streets as I said, an eight plant neighbor who connections included in the plan.

654
00:59:40,160 --> 00:59:46,800
You can see from the map that all of the plan-radways are either within 20 towns for a third area or just outside.

655
00:59:48,160 --> 00:59:57,040
And the county and city staff have met several times since 2021 to discuss the plan and have agreed upon the following raids for inclusion.

656
01:00:00,210 --> 01:00:12,850
So, the first planned major street is keyword crossing. It's located in eastern Tony Town. It's halfway in the city limits and entirely within 20 towns for its area.

657
01:00:14,110 --> 01:00:25,710
It's a half mile of planned roadway from Stunt Town Road to Old Tony Town Pike, crossing over Maryland 140, just east of the circle.

658
01:00:25,710 --> 01:00:29,970
So, from some down to Old Tony Town, crossing over 140.

659
01:00:31,950 --> 01:00:36,190
The road is associated with future residential and commercial development.

660
01:00:37,670 --> 01:00:43,930
It will add to the overall connectivity of the roadway network, providing alternative routes for local vehicles.

661
01:00:44,690 --> 01:00:49,390
Its future plan functional classification is undetermined as of now.

662
01:00:54,440 --> 01:01:00,920
So our second plan major street, Robert Hill Road extended is located in the northern area of

663
01:01:00,920 --> 01:01:06,020
20 town, partially in the city limits and entirely within the growth area.

664
01:01:06,760 --> 01:01:14,860
It's a point four mile extension of the northern terminus of the existing Roberts Mill Road from

665
01:01:14,860 --> 01:01:17,280
pump-house road to horny road.

666
01:01:19,440 --> 01:01:22,380
So this is the existing Robertsville road

667
01:01:22,380 --> 01:01:25,200
from pump-house road to horny road.

668
01:01:26,520 --> 01:01:29,020
The extension will provide access to development,

669
01:01:29,640 --> 01:01:33,840
one adjacent property and provide an alternative east-west connection

670
01:01:35,100 --> 01:01:37,460
between one-nine-four and horny road

671
01:01:37,460 --> 01:01:40,160
parallel to west-view drive.

672
01:01:41,920 --> 01:01:42,680
West-view drive.

673
01:01:43,940 --> 01:01:47,660
And its plan functional classification is a minor collector.

674
01:01:52,250 --> 01:01:56,510
The third plan major street is the 20-town greenway,

675
01:01:56,950 --> 01:02:00,670
also known as the interim boulevard extension.

676
01:02:03,100 --> 01:02:06,820
It is located in the south and western area of the city,

677
01:02:07,200 --> 01:02:11,400
partially within city limits and entirely within 20-town square area.

678
01:02:11,400 --> 01:02:29,520
It is a two and a half mile planned roadway from the terminus of the Entrum Boulevard at Trevannion Road to Maryland 140 northwest of the city square at about the halfway point the road is planned to cross over Maryland 194.

679
01:02:30,740 --> 01:02:37,560
So, starting at the Terminus of Anthem Boulevard, over 1994,

680
01:02:41,120 --> 01:02:43,160
and to Maryland 140.

681
01:02:44,100 --> 01:02:47,380
So, this is the square I'm telling you down right here.

682
01:02:49,360 --> 01:02:54,520
On the project, we'll redirect truck traffic and through traffic away from downtown

683
01:02:54,520 --> 01:02:58,660
and away from the intersection of Maryland 194 and 140.

684
01:02:58,660 --> 01:03:05,100
It will also provide redundancy in the network, improving access and connectivity to a large

685
01:03:05,100 --> 01:03:10,100
amount of undeveloped industrial land, south and southwest of town.

686
01:03:10,700 --> 01:03:15,380
It's plan functional classification is on determined at this time.

687
01:03:16,460 --> 01:03:25,300
And the Tony-Town bypass is included in the approved FY24 priority letter, not as a top priority,

688
01:03:25,300 --> 01:03:41,860
But as a project, which the county is committed, the party letter request and not investigate the efficacy of reevaluating the potential for the 20-time bypass for inclusion in the state's highway needs inventory.

689
01:03:44,820 --> 01:03:49,100
Are there any questions regarding the bypass or greenway?

690
01:03:52,280 --> 01:03:53,420
I don't think so.

691
01:03:53,420 --> 01:03:54,000
Okay,

692
01:03:56,970 --> 01:03:59,570
right moving one, the last planned age of street is

693
01:03:59,570 --> 01:04:01,190
Worthington Boulevard.

694
01:04:01,190 --> 01:04:05,070
It's located in the northern, in northern Tony Town,

695
01:04:05,530 --> 01:04:08,310
partially in the city limits and entirely within the

696
01:04:08,310 --> 01:04:09,050
Growth Area.

697
01:04:10,170 --> 01:04:12,990
It's a 1.4 mile planned roadway from

698
01:04:12,990 --> 01:04:16,910
Franger Road to the future Tony Town Greenway,

699
01:04:17,330 --> 01:04:19,350
Crossing over Harnie Road and 140.

700
01:04:21,310 --> 01:04:24,250
To Franger Road, across the river Harnie,

701
01:04:24,250 --> 01:04:32,280
1-40 and to the 20-town greenway or bypass right here.

702
01:04:34,030 --> 01:04:39,110
And we're thinking bullbard is proposed to serve future development in northern 20-town.

703
01:04:39,410 --> 01:04:46,790
It's intended to be part of an overall roadway network, providing alternative routes for local vehicles.

704
01:04:48,150 --> 01:04:51,150
And its plan functional classification is a collector road.

705
01:04:55,080 --> 01:04:59,800
So, Allen Delane extended is our first planned neighborhood connection.

706
01:05:00,760 --> 01:05:08,520
It's located in southwestern portion of the city, partially incorporated and entirely within the growth area.

707
01:05:09,240 --> 01:05:16,340
It's a point six mile extension of the existing Allen Delane to the proposed 20-town greenway.

708
01:05:16,340 --> 01:05:23,640
So, this is the existing Allen Delling, and then to the green way, which connects into the

709
01:05:23,640 --> 01:05:31,520
ancient boulevard trivia and intersection. This extension will be connecting 194 and 140,

710
01:05:32,200 --> 01:05:38,120
and will provide access for development of the industrial property. It's plan and functional

711
01:05:38,120 --> 01:05:45,000
classification is local red by. And if you recall from chapter five, this plan

712
01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:52,140
roadway, including the short extension, extension two, and triple of art. So the plan

713
01:05:52,140 --> 01:05:58,800
roadway, including this section, is one of the most promising potential improvements.

714
01:06:03,120 --> 01:06:08,280
The second plan neighborhood connection is cross mill road, realignment.

715
01:06:11,240 --> 01:06:11,980
It's

716
01:06:11,980 --> 01:06:17,560
but within the growth area. It's a 300-foot re-alignment of the existing

717
01:06:17,560 --> 01:06:23,580
cross mill road to allow for the suitable intersection with proposed planned

718
01:06:23,580 --> 01:06:29,600
neighborhood connection shower road. So the highlighted road is cross

719
01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:37,060
mill, re-alignment. This dark blue dotted line is shower road, which we'll get to in

720
01:06:37,060 --> 01:06:38,100
couple slides.

721
01:06:41,240 --> 01:06:43,780
The realignment includes the termination of

722
01:06:43,780 --> 01:06:48,100
a cross mill road at a call to sack away from the 194

723
01:06:48,100 --> 01:06:57,460
intersection, so a call to sack possibly right in this area, and then the

724
01:06:57,460 --> 01:07:00,560
functional classification is a local roadway.

725
01:07:06,550 --> 01:07:07,490
So the deal road

726
01:07:10,710 --> 01:07:19,810
located in Eastern Tony Town and is not located with an east of the town, I'm sorry, and is not

727
01:07:19,810 --> 01:07:27,530
located within the growth area or priority funding area. It's a point four mile realignment of the existing

728
01:07:27,530 --> 01:07:34,590
roadway. The existing road has a sharp bend just south of its intersection with Angel Road.

729
01:07:34,590 --> 01:07:40,590
So here's about intersects with Angel, so we'd eliminate this 90 degree bend.

730
01:07:42,190 --> 01:07:48,070
The realignment will create improved geometry at Angel Road, and thereby better the traffic flow.

731
01:07:48,710 --> 01:07:56,330
With continued development in the northeast portion of Tony Town, this improvement will help the safety and overall roadway network.

732
01:07:56,770 --> 01:08:00,890
And its plan functional classification is a local roadway.

733
01:08:03,700 --> 01:08:14,640
Moving on, the fourth plane neighborhood connection is these are road relocated, it's located south of Tony Town and is within the growth area.

734
01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:26,780
It's a .35 mile realignment of the existing road, which goes through a series of sharp bends to the east of its intersection with Autordale Mill Road.

735
01:08:27,640 --> 01:08:33,640
So the intersection right here at the Autordale Mill would it would remove these sharp ends.

736
01:08:34,760 --> 01:08:41,400
To reconstructing this segment of the road will create improved geometry for both through traffic and local residents.

737
01:08:42,360 --> 01:08:46,920
And this road as well has a functional classification of local roadway.

738
01:08:50,160 --> 01:08:59,780
Cell's Mill Road relocated is located in the south eastern portion of Tony Town, just north of the circle.

739
01:09:01,580 --> 01:09:15,160
It's a point to mile-re alignment of the existing road, eliminating the current cell's Mill Road intersection close to the roundabout and moving it to the west, providing a safer traffic situation.

740
01:09:17,970 --> 01:09:27,650
So the road would follow the original line in right here and would just pop out a little more west of the circle and not so not so close.

741
01:09:28,210 --> 01:09:33,790
The project will provide access for development of property adjacent to the roadway.

742
01:09:35,050 --> 01:09:39,970
And it's plan functional classification is local roadway.

743
01:09:44,230 --> 01:10:10,550
next we have shower road connection. Again, this is an area of cross mill road relocated, which is the one that I showed you a couple slides back. Again, located outside of this city, outside of the city limits to the west, but is within the growth area. This is a point to my plan roadway from 194 to the cross mill road realignment.

744
01:10:11,590 --> 01:10:16,230
With the termination and cold-a-sac of cross mill road,

745
01:10:16,770 --> 01:10:19,610
it will provide the needed connection to Maryland 194.

746
01:10:21,530 --> 01:10:28,830
And this intersection relocation is to be done in conjunction with the construction of the 20-town greenway.

747
01:10:29,950 --> 01:10:37,250
So again, that would be cold-a-saccing cross mill and using shower road to reach 194.

748
01:10:38,730 --> 01:10:43,910
And at this time, the plan functional classification is undetermined.

749
01:10:47,130 --> 01:10:52,070
To plan either of a connection number seven is Starboard Drive Extended.

750
01:10:52,770 --> 01:10:55,290
It's located in Southern Tony Town.

751
01:10:55,950 --> 01:11:02,770
If a one tenth of a mile extension of the existing Starboard Drive to Traveignion Road,

752
01:11:04,090 --> 01:11:07,830
so the existing Drive and the Traveignion Road,

753
01:11:09,350 --> 01:11:13,610
The extension will provide new residential access to Traveignion Road.

754
01:11:14,530 --> 01:11:19,910
It also will provide a second access location for the local neighborhood, which currently

755
01:11:19,910 --> 01:11:24,230
only has access off of when the hill is dried.

756
01:11:25,010 --> 01:11:28,290
And I apologize I cut that off, but this is when the hill is dried right here.

757
01:11:28,750 --> 01:11:32,130
And the roadway just loops around the starboard.

758
01:11:32,990 --> 01:11:36,270
And it's plan functional classification is local roadway.

759
01:11:39,440 --> 01:11:46,940
And then our last planned neighborhood connection is Stunktown Road relocated.

760
01:11:46,940 --> 01:11:50,060
It's located in the eastern area of Tony Town.

761
01:11:50,980 --> 01:11:58,840
It is a quarter, a one quarter mile realignment of the existing road to eliminate a 90 degree bend.

762
01:11:59,520 --> 01:12:05,830
Reconstructing this segment of Stunktown will improve geometry and provide better traffic flow

763
01:12:05,830 --> 01:12:14,190
in the area proposed for future residential development and it's plan functional classification is

764
01:12:14,190 --> 01:12:15,770
look over it by.

765
01:12:18,850 --> 01:12:22,790
So those are the four-plan major streets and eight-plan neighborhood connections.

766
01:12:24,250 --> 01:12:34,310
I'm going to move on to the three roads that staff is recommending for removal in the

767
01:12:35,890 --> 01:12:36,690
So

768
01:12:39,890 --> 01:12:43,610
the first is commercial access road.

769
01:12:44,350 --> 01:12:46,450
It's a planned neighborhood connection,

770
01:12:46,810 --> 01:12:49,510
located in southeast 20 town,

771
01:12:49,570 --> 01:12:51,010
just south of the circle.

772
01:12:51,830 --> 01:12:54,990
It's a point two mile connection

773
01:12:54,990 --> 01:12:59,830
and linked to development of the commercial property south of the circle.

774
01:13:01,350 --> 01:13:04,890
The plan right away is being removed by request of city staff

775
01:13:04,890 --> 01:13:12,130
because the property was developed with internal circulation and connectivity that replaces the need for the road.

776
01:13:18,510 --> 01:13:23,210
The second road recommended for removal is Crimson Avenue Extended.

777
01:13:23,950 --> 01:13:28,070
It's a planned neighborhood connection located in Northeast Tony Town.

778
01:13:28,910 --> 01:13:33,930
It is .5 miles from existing Crimson Avenue to Angel Road.

779
01:13:34,650 --> 01:13:39,190
This is the existing Crimson Avenue and the Angel Road right here.

780
01:13:39,190 --> 01:13:48,790
one ninety four. The redway was constructed as part of the meets crossing subdivision and now serves the city as a local redway.

781
01:13:50,330 --> 01:14:00,250
So that one has been completed. And then the third redway recommended for removal is genitive drive extended.

782
01:14:00,690 --> 01:14:08,450
It's a plan neighborhood connection in Southeast 20 town. It's less than one tenth of a mile in length.

783
01:14:08,450 --> 01:14:12,630
In connects existing genitive drive to answer a rule of art.

784
01:14:13,070 --> 01:14:15,330
So it made this connection right here.

785
01:14:16,070 --> 01:14:23,870
It was constructed in conjunction with the commercial properties to aid in connectivity to these commercial properties.

786
01:14:28,520 --> 01:14:29,880
And that's it.

787
01:14:30,460 --> 01:14:36,060
Does anyone have questions before we move on to Mary with Union Bridge and New Windsor?

788
01:14:39,450 --> 01:14:41,950
Doesn't look like anyone has any questions for you, Claire.

789
01:14:42,490 --> 01:14:44,070
Alright, thank you.

790
01:14:44,590 --> 01:14:45,130
Thank you.

791
01:14:45,170 --> 01:14:45,830
Nice presentation.

792
01:14:46,450 --> 01:14:47,890
Yeah, Mary, I'll turn it over to you.

793
01:14:50,160 --> 01:14:51,480
First of all, can you hear me?

794
01:14:52,340 --> 01:14:53,180
We can hear you.

795
01:14:53,460 --> 01:14:53,540
Yes.

796
01:14:53,540 --> 01:14:54,120
Okay, good.

797
01:15:01,120 --> 01:15:14,180
Can you see the presentation? Perfect. Okay. As Claire said, this is the last of the plan major roadways chapter 6 that we've been going over for the last few months.

798
01:15:14,640 --> 01:15:24,540
And this is New Windsor and Union Bridge. As you can see, and as you already know, I'm sure this is in the north western part of the county, as you see in the circled area.

799
01:15:24,540 --> 01:15:30,100
staff is recommending for Maryland State Highway Projects all in the H&I, the Highway Needs in

800
01:15:30,100 --> 01:15:34,860
Ventory, as well as for Plan Major Streets. And as with all of these we have talked to the

801
01:15:34,860 --> 01:15:40,540
municipal staffs about these. And particularly in the case of Union Bridge, there were some

802
01:15:40,540 --> 01:15:46,800
comments that we'll integrate into the plan, although we won't really, it won't really affect

803
01:15:46,800 --> 01:15:51,860
including the road in, but we will be making some comments because they did have some concerns.

804
01:15:52,580 --> 01:16:02,360
So, the four state roads are Maryland, 97, from when 1994 to 75, Maryland, 84 from 75 to

805
01:16:02,360 --> 01:16:07,480
Balschurch Road, Maryland, 31 from the Frederick County line to the town of New Windsor.

806
01:16:07,760 --> 01:16:10,520
And then the last is not a capacity enhancing project.

807
01:16:10,560 --> 01:16:14,340
It's the Maryland, 31 new Windsor streetscape.

808
01:16:14,400 --> 01:16:15,720
And I think we've talked before.

809
01:16:16,040 --> 01:16:20,380
We included when we talked about the Elders Bergeria, the Sykesville streetscape project.

810
01:16:20,380 --> 01:16:27,820
And these will be the last two state streetscape projects in the county that have been going on for at least 20 years.

811
01:16:28,900 --> 01:16:37,560
So the first Maryland 97 from when 94 to 75. This is where Claire left off when she discussed Maryland 97 with the Tony tell presentation.

812
01:16:38,300 --> 01:16:40,120
This is a complete reconstruct.

813
01:16:42,280 --> 01:16:49,020
There's a little bit here that exists. That's middleburg road, but this would all here being mostly new roadway.

814
01:16:49,020 --> 01:16:56,620
would all be new roadway. And in speaking with the plan or for the town of Union Bridge,

815
01:16:56,780 --> 01:17:01,600
there's pretty big concerns that this is no longer feasible because of some ag press,

816
01:17:01,700 --> 01:17:07,420
as well as other constraints on it. It is still in the state's highway needs inventory,

817
01:17:07,740 --> 01:17:12,040
and within the next few years, they may be reassessing it, but we're recommending that because

818
01:17:12,040 --> 01:17:17,500
it is still in the state's plan, we at least leave it in this long range plan. At the very least,

819
01:17:17,500 --> 01:17:21,580
they would like to see the end of it here all the way,

820
01:17:22,900 --> 01:17:24,500
I guess that would be what you're John,

821
01:17:25,100 --> 01:17:28,260
that would help with keeping traffic off of Main Street.

822
01:17:28,960 --> 01:17:33,200
So although this entire improvement may not be made,

823
01:17:33,540 --> 01:17:35,440
there may be a smaller improvement,

824
01:17:35,680 --> 01:17:37,760
still recommended closer to the town.

825
01:17:41,330 --> 01:17:47,650
Second improvement is Maryland 84 from 75 to Balschurch Road.

826
01:17:50,690 --> 01:17:58,510
That is 3.74 miles, it is a rural collector, and this would just be a two-lane upgrade to this.

827
01:17:59,010 --> 01:18:03,250
No work has been performed on this project other than to identify the future need.

828
01:18:03,950 --> 01:18:10,370
And again, as with a lot of things in this area of the county, this may be a problem because it may impact some ag press properties.

829
01:18:11,010 --> 01:18:18,170
But you can see that it goes through the historic town of Union Town north to there.

830
01:18:22,390 --> 01:18:29,190
The next project is Marilyn 31 from the Frederick County line to New Windsor.

831
01:18:29,330 --> 01:18:34,290
This is 2.92 miles. It's a rural minor arterial, a two-lane reconstruct.

832
01:18:35,650 --> 01:18:40,030
And again, there are possibly egg preservation easements located along the alignment here.

833
01:18:40,350 --> 01:18:44,310
And I did look in Frederick County since some of these are impacted by Frederick County

834
01:18:44,310 --> 01:18:49,530
to see if these were in their long range plans or even a priority of theirs.

835
01:18:49,530 --> 01:18:58,310
they are not at this point. So I thought that was of some interest. I think these will have to be reassessed when the H&I is reassessed.

836
01:19:00,850 --> 01:19:08,190
And then the last state project is Maryland 31, the Main Street Street Skate. This is quite a history. It's about half a mile.

837
01:19:08,830 --> 01:19:14,490
It's to enhance the community through improvements to sidewalks, streetscape, pedestrian crossings and system preservation.

838
01:19:14,490 --> 01:19:19,570
this has been a high priority for construction in the county's priority letter. There's a bit

839
01:19:19,570 --> 01:19:27,710
of a history of an effort was made to coordinate with the relocation of some water lines that's taken

840
01:19:27,710 --> 01:19:35,630
years that looks like it's passed back on track. But again, the commissioners just this last week

841
01:19:35,630 --> 01:19:39,790
agreed to continue putting it as a high priority in their priority letter.

842
01:19:43,080 --> 01:19:43,800
So then there's four

843
01:19:43,800 --> 01:19:45,520
planned major streets as well.

844
01:19:45,660 --> 01:19:48,360
The first three are in Union Bridge, the connector road,

845
01:19:48,640 --> 01:19:51,180
George Street extended, Mount Pleasant Boulevard,

846
01:19:51,360 --> 01:19:54,240
and then the fourth one is in the town of New Windsor.

847
01:19:54,600 --> 01:19:57,180
And basically the three Union Bridge projects

848
01:19:57,180 --> 01:19:59,980
are all serving the same purpose.

849
01:20:00,200 --> 01:20:02,300
They're alternatives to going through the town.

850
01:20:02,440 --> 01:20:03,660
They're increasing the connectivity

851
01:20:04,160 --> 01:20:06,860
and they're important because they could keep truck traffic

852
01:20:06,860 --> 01:20:09,480
off the town, out of downtown.

853
01:20:11,530 --> 01:20:13,330
So the first one is the connector road.

854
01:20:13,330 --> 01:20:14,990
This will only be necessary.

855
01:20:15,250 --> 01:20:19,970
You can see this connects Union Bridge to the future Maryland 77, which doesn't exist yet.

856
01:20:20,210 --> 01:20:25,010
This obviously would only be necessary if Maryland 77 is constructed.

857
01:20:25,070 --> 01:20:27,090
And that's the one we just talked about.

858
01:20:27,930 --> 01:20:28,850
But here's Main Street.

859
01:20:29,070 --> 01:20:34,290
And again, the whole purpose of all of these is really to keep traffic off of Main Street.

860
01:20:39,120 --> 01:20:42,100
The next one is called George Street extended.

861
01:20:42,380 --> 01:20:43,960
But it may need to be renamed.

862
01:20:43,960 --> 01:20:48,520
As you can see, it comes off of George Street, avoids the downtown area and connects here.

863
01:20:49,000 --> 01:20:53,400
This is currently industrialized zone and developed as a solar development.

864
01:20:54,400 --> 01:20:58,620
So at the point at which that is decommissioned and something else is developed there,

865
01:20:59,220 --> 01:21:04,100
it's still a possibility but unlikely because of other things that have gone in around here.

866
01:21:04,140 --> 01:21:05,420
We've been informed by the town.

867
01:21:05,920 --> 01:21:12,820
So it's really possible that the connection might come off of wide road and be a smaller connection.

868
01:21:13,360 --> 01:21:19,620
But still they would like to keep a connection in here and they plan on doing that when they do update their plan.

869
01:21:19,800 --> 01:21:23,220
So we may rename this from George Street because it may not come out of George Street.

870
01:21:25,340 --> 01:21:30,020
Um, there's nothing, okay, that's pretty much what you need to know about that.

871
01:21:30,200 --> 01:21:33,000
The third one in Union Bridge is another connection here.

872
01:21:33,140 --> 01:21:35,480
It is from Barkill to Maryland 75.

873
01:21:37,400 --> 01:21:41,620
It is part of the overall roadway network for alternative routes.

874
01:21:41,620 --> 01:21:50,900
And this would eventually be disrupted by the developer of that property if that ever takes place.

875
01:21:52,660 --> 01:21:56,740
So the last plan major street is a new Windsor.

876
01:21:57,020 --> 01:22:03,400
And it is the relocation of Springdale Avenue from, I'm

877
01:22:07,340 --> 01:22:11,000
sorry, it's the realignment of Springdale Avenue with new Windsor Road.

878
01:22:11,000 --> 01:22:16,700
and basically it will get rid of this dangerous intersection here and allow this to happen.

879
01:22:16,960 --> 01:22:20,000
There was at one time a call to sack that was proposed.

880
01:22:20,160 --> 01:22:25,300
That has been taken off the plan, but basically this is in there to provide improved geometry

881
01:22:25,300 --> 01:22:30,620
and better traffic flow at the primary gateway on the east side of town and this is considered

882
01:22:30,620 --> 01:22:36,180
basically a safety improvement. There are no planned neighborhood connections and there's nothing

883
01:22:36,180 --> 01:22:40,210
being taken off the plan in this area. Do you have any questions about this?

884
01:22:43,820 --> 01:22:50,180
Doesn't look like we do, Mary. Okay, then that completes for now. Claire and my assessment

885
01:22:50,180 --> 01:22:55,440
of the plan major streets throughout the county, as I said last time, we'll be coming back to you

886
01:22:55,440 --> 01:23:01,480
with an assessment of the prioritization of the importance of all of them, and we'll be going over

887
01:23:01,480 --> 01:23:06,640
that early in May with you. Well, thank you very much. It's been a big project.

888
01:23:07,400 --> 01:23:08,560
It's still going on.

889
01:23:09,900 --> 01:23:09,980
Yeah.

890
01:23:11,280 --> 01:23:12,480
Well, thank you very much.

891
01:23:12,600 --> 01:23:13,320
Have a great evening.

892
01:23:14,060 --> 01:23:14,640
You too.

893
01:23:16,400 --> 01:23:24,680
So we'll move on to item 10, which is planned commercial center text amendment and introduction.

894
01:23:24,960 --> 01:23:28,900
And I believe Madam Secretary, you're walking us through this.

895
01:23:29,240 --> 01:23:32,100
Yes, I am so.

896
01:23:33,160 --> 01:23:35,200
Let me share my presentation with you.

897
01:23:35,360 --> 01:23:36,380
Can you see my screen?

898
01:23:36,380 --> 01:23:40,140
Yes. Okay. Um,

899
01:23:44,150 --> 01:23:52,350
so this came about because of the Stablow's property plan commercial

900
01:23:52,350 --> 01:24:00,430
center development back in like the late summer of 2022. Um, do you all recall that particular

901
01:24:01,870 --> 01:24:08,890
development case that we had? And at that time, the planning and zoning commission chose to

902
01:24:08,890 --> 01:24:14,090
and I, in that particular case, because of the clause that's in May approved.

903
01:24:15,590 --> 01:24:24,570
And then the property owner, the board of zoning appeals, and this case was then overturned

904
01:24:24,570 --> 01:24:26,390
by the board of zoning appeals.

905
01:24:27,030 --> 01:24:34,850
At that time, the community surrounding that filed an appeal then to the Maryland Circuit

906
01:24:34,850 --> 01:24:37,430
Court, and that was an administrative hearing.

907
01:24:37,430 --> 01:24:39,810
And my understanding and gym almonds on one,

908
01:24:39,810 --> 01:24:41,430
he can better elaborate on this.

909
01:24:41,790 --> 01:24:44,990
My understanding at that time was that this was

910
01:24:44,990 --> 01:24:48,990
an administrative hearing, and all of the,

911
01:24:50,570 --> 01:24:54,570
essentially documents that were presented were not

912
01:24:54,570 --> 01:24:56,890
into the circuit court in time,

913
01:24:57,190 --> 01:24:58,670
and so they dropped the case.

914
01:24:59,930 --> 01:25:04,150
So as of now, this property owner has the right to develop

915
01:25:04,150 --> 01:25:09,370
a Planned Commercial Center with the second story

916
01:25:09,370 --> 01:25:11,030
residential component.

917
01:25:11,970 --> 01:25:14,650
And so what we're here to discuss with you this evening,

918
01:25:15,310 --> 01:25:18,750
as a result of that is many members of the community

919
01:25:18,750 --> 01:25:21,090
backing up to this particular property,

920
01:25:21,610 --> 01:25:26,090
had concerns regarding the residential component

921
01:25:26,810 --> 01:25:28,710
of these Planned Commercial Centers.

922
01:25:29,150 --> 01:25:31,510
And I think a lot of the anxiety comes

923
01:25:31,510 --> 01:25:41,750
from a similar property that's developed closer to the intersection of 26 and 32, referred

924
01:25:41,750 --> 01:25:43,430
to as the Princess Shopping Center.

925
01:25:43,970 --> 01:25:49,450
And so there's a lot of concerns with that particular look and style of residential

926
01:25:49,450 --> 01:25:51,390
development on top of the commercial.

927
01:25:52,290 --> 01:26:00,510
So with that, I'm going to go ahead and change my slide here on October 6, because of letters written

928
01:26:00,510 --> 01:26:08,530
And by the community at large, we're concerned regarding the second story residential option

929
01:26:08,530 --> 01:26:14,910
that the Board of County Commissioners had a meeting at their regularly scheduled open session

930
01:26:14,910 --> 01:26:20,270
and decided to refer this particular section,

931
01:26:20,270 --> 01:26:31,330
section 155.09 to plan commercial centers, they decided to forward the residential portion to

932
01:26:31,330 --> 01:26:38,250
this body, the planning commission for your review and consideration and commenting on if this

933
01:26:38,250 --> 01:26:42,470
should be any further text amendments done to this particular district.

934
01:26:45,210 --> 01:26:46,470
I'm not going to go through

935
01:26:46,470 --> 01:26:56,590
So all of this, this is the code specifically for 155092, and just to be clear, so 155092 plain commercial centers.

936
01:26:56,910 --> 01:27:02,630
The residential is a part of that overall development style.

937
01:27:03,430 --> 01:27:07,990
The plain commercial centers really are our typical strip center that you see.

938
01:27:08,970 --> 01:27:19,510
in the county. So when you have two or three different types of commercial uses in a typical strip set, and that is also a planned commercial center, it's the residential component.

939
01:27:21,290 --> 01:27:33,190
And that's found here in section D of the current code. So I'm going to flip to the next slide, which shows that a little larger. So currently our code allows for, and this is subdivision not zoning.

940
01:27:33,950 --> 01:27:40,530
Allow us for accessory uses, regardless of the underlying zoning district, and these are

941
01:27:40,530 --> 01:27:46,970
allowed and all C1, C2 and C3 that the Planning and Zoning Commission may allow, and this

942
01:27:46,970 --> 01:27:51,630
is the issue that we had during that meeting was that we may allow.

943
01:27:51,850 --> 01:28:00,810
Doesn't say shout, it's as name, that second story structure is not more than a total of two

944
01:28:00,810 --> 01:28:13,310
And that residential units may be providing on that second story of the structure and no residential uses are permitted on the first story of the structure within any claim commercial center.

945
01:28:13,990 --> 01:28:25,630
And then they give some four area limits that the floor area of a residential unit should be not smaller than 600 square feet, but no greater than a thousand square feet in size.

946
01:28:25,630 --> 01:28:28,090
In the area of all residential units,

947
01:28:28,310 --> 01:28:31,690
Shaanotic Seed, 50% of the total area of the structure.

948
01:28:31,950 --> 01:28:37,530
So basically, it has to fit the footprint of the first floor exactly to the second floor.

949
01:28:38,010 --> 01:28:40,010
And it has to for the residential component,

950
01:28:40,190 --> 01:28:42,330
it has to mean all concurrency management standards,

951
01:28:42,410 --> 01:28:45,670
so schools, roads, things like that,

952
01:28:45,670 --> 01:28:50,350
water, sewer, any issues with that, residential development impact these.

953
01:28:51,630 --> 01:28:54,790
And then this has been on the books for decades.

954
01:28:54,790 --> 01:28:59,910
we only have one developed, but then there's a redevelopment clause in here that a plan

955
01:28:59,910 --> 01:29:05,630
commercial center existing after 2007 may be redeveloped to include residential units on the

956
01:29:05,630 --> 01:29:09,910
second sort of any existing structure. And I think Mary found through her research,

957
01:29:09,950 --> 01:29:14,070
this really dates back to 2004, but I believe the first one would have been built around 07.

958
01:29:16,830 --> 01:29:22,330
And then an amended site plan is approved by planning commission if you want to redevelop

959
01:29:22,330 --> 01:29:27,130
and that in compliance with the subdivision chapters.

960
01:29:27,950 --> 01:29:30,190
So that is what is before you this evening.

961
01:29:31,510 --> 01:29:34,470
What we'll be doing is not at the April meaning,

962
01:29:34,510 --> 01:29:37,650
but sometime in May we'll be coming back to you

963
01:29:37,650 --> 01:29:40,650
with some additional information, some suggestions,

964
01:29:41,710 --> 01:29:45,290
and perhaps edits to the code as it stands

965
01:29:45,290 --> 01:29:48,470
if that's the direction that you all want to take with regards

966
01:29:48,470 --> 01:29:51,290
the second story on residences.

967
01:29:52,870 --> 01:29:56,050
I'm going to go ahead and stop sharing my screen.

968
01:30:02,160 --> 01:30:02,980
Okay.

969
01:30:10,350 --> 01:30:11,730
Thank you, booted.

970
01:30:14,080 --> 01:30:22,540
Okay, there we are. All right, got good for a second. So, and I know we have some callers on the line that signed up for this evening to discuss this with you.

971
01:30:22,840 --> 01:30:36,040
I would say this, at this point in time, this legislation would not affect the current development of this fabulous property would not have been given any direction to affect its already in process, but this would be more looking toward the future.

972
01:30:36,740 --> 01:30:51,260
If you all want to remove that secondary residential provision, so I'll let you all discuss for a minute and if you have any direction that you'd like to give us, we won't really give in any direction per say other than let's investigate and research this with you off.

973
01:30:52,520 --> 01:31:03,580
Do we do we know why I may have asked this when we were looking at this project before what the genesis is for having residential on the second story of a planned commercial center.

974
01:31:06,540 --> 01:31:14,840
You know, I can't say why Carol County did it and we don't have any note for any information on why Carol kind of specifically chose to take this.

975
01:31:15,480 --> 01:31:31,040
I would say this though, in the early to mid 2000s that was a favorable development technique of the traditional neighborhood development kind of going back to, you know, like a typical mainstream community or

976
01:31:31,040 --> 01:31:34,000
Shopkeepers would have their residences above,

977
01:31:34,000 --> 01:31:35,240
with maybe their shop below.

978
01:31:35,520 --> 01:31:38,160
This was Carol County's take on that.

979
01:31:38,380 --> 01:31:42,480
And also to try to address within the same development

980
01:31:42,480 --> 01:31:45,740
footprint residential with commercial,

981
01:31:45,980 --> 01:31:51,280
because we don't have a lot of zone land for rental units

982
01:31:51,280 --> 01:31:52,660
and more affordable housing.

983
01:31:52,980 --> 01:31:54,640
We just don't in Carol County.

984
01:31:54,680 --> 01:31:57,320
This is an attempt to try to do something

985
01:31:57,320 --> 01:31:59,760
with expanding the development envelope

986
01:31:59,760 --> 01:32:02,260
to keep it within a similar footprint.

987
01:32:03,820 --> 01:32:05,760
So that's, you know, kind of the,

988
01:32:06,620 --> 01:32:09,980
what maybe, that's the advocating for the way forward is that,

989
01:32:09,980 --> 01:32:11,820
you know, we do have a critical need.

990
01:32:11,960 --> 01:32:13,960
There's a national housing shortage.

991
01:32:14,500 --> 01:32:16,600
Here are counties that spared from that.

992
01:32:16,760 --> 01:32:20,860
And we have residents and citizens that need housing

993
01:32:20,860 --> 01:32:23,320
to live in that they can afford.

994
01:32:24,360 --> 01:32:26,200
And so this is one way to do that.

995
01:32:26,220 --> 01:32:28,660
Potentially, we're not setting the market price on this,

996
01:32:28,660 --> 01:32:33,500
But one would think it would be more affordable being co-located with commercial.

997
01:32:34,840 --> 01:32:37,540
Okay. That's helpful. Matt, you have a question.

998
01:32:38,660 --> 01:32:44,980
While to say, I was adamantly against this project, not because of what it was,

999
01:32:45,040 --> 01:32:49,820
because of where it was more than anything. In the fact that they actually took land

1000
01:32:49,820 --> 01:32:54,590
scraping out of it between the initial and what happened at the end.

1001
01:32:55,210 --> 01:33:00,970
But, I mean, I've been to Urbana, Urbana's got two and three story ones like that, that look great.

1002
01:33:01,810 --> 01:33:10,870
I mean, I just think, you know, location and, you know, I remember asking the question, was this an upper down thing when that came in front of us?

1003
01:33:11,050 --> 01:33:17,450
And we were told it was upper down and then I'd go back and change some stuff to make it see fit in a little bit better in the neighborhood.

1004
01:33:18,930 --> 01:33:39,550
you know, that was my take. I'm not like totally against them. I just think, you know, the way it's wrote, we should have discretion if it fits in that area and it definitely, in my opinion, did not fit in that area. So I was, I was not very happy to turn over, but.

1005
01:33:40,330 --> 01:33:55,630
And it seems to me, you know, Matt, one of the things that, you know, where it's done well, there's, there is, Linda, you're hitting it on the head and we're talking all around it, but there's an architectural element to it.

1006
01:33:55,630 --> 01:33:59,230
there's a street to skate, feel to it, to where,

1007
01:33:59,770 --> 01:34:04,190
you know, it doesn't come across as some motelists

1008
01:34:04,190 --> 01:34:06,230
and a melt, motelish.

1009
01:34:06,630 --> 01:34:11,390
And I don't know how to say it any other way.

1010
01:34:11,590 --> 01:34:13,110
And then one of the complaints

1011
01:34:13,110 --> 01:34:15,730
were getting from the current one that is developed

1012
01:34:15,730 --> 01:34:17,790
at the Princess Center is that, you know,

1013
01:34:17,850 --> 01:34:20,630
people are driving their laundry on the balcony.

1014
01:34:20,830 --> 01:34:23,290
And it's just not that that's not indicative

1015
01:34:23,290 --> 01:34:25,450
of the community that we want to have.

1016
01:34:25,450 --> 01:34:35,130
And so, is there a way for us to create some architectural design elements on this type of development?

1017
01:34:35,510 --> 01:34:38,750
So that it does look more residential.

1018
01:34:40,530 --> 01:34:45,190
You know, the way that was developed, you know, it actually

1019
01:34:45,190 --> 01:34:51,750
Harkens more towards, you know, retail on the first floor and maybe office on the second floor.

1020
01:34:51,870 --> 01:34:53,390
It doesn't really look very residential.

1021
01:34:53,390 --> 01:35:09,790
You know, there's not really yet an apartment feel to it, so that's some of the comments that I'm getting or the comments I would get staff to is that if we could put some architectural guidelines around this, it might be helpful for both the community.

1022
01:35:11,050 --> 01:35:20,270
And it might attract the quality of the development that the community is seeking because what was done is not reflective of what's up in our ban.

1023
01:35:20,270 --> 01:35:26,070
I mean, I know I think I know some of the developments that you're talking about and those mixed

1024
01:35:26,070 --> 01:35:33,470
use when it's done well is really cool. I think y'all are right as a staff to say, you know,

1025
01:35:33,610 --> 01:35:45,050
this is one way to do this. But I think if we don't do it correctly, it's not a good thing for the

1026
01:35:45,050 --> 01:35:55,590
Yeah, I do think that we need to have some kind of architectural requirements, but as far as laundry,

1027
01:35:56,290 --> 01:36:02,890
you know, that would be in the development of the property.

1028
01:36:03,370 --> 01:36:10,430
I mean, that's whoever the owner is of that complex to put up some kind of restrictions.

1029
01:36:10,430 --> 01:36:14,650
And I don't know that we could mandate that.

1030
01:36:15,230 --> 01:36:20,170
I think that's more for the developer to do when he's building up.

1031
01:36:20,670 --> 01:36:24,310
But the architectural requirement would be great.

1032
01:36:25,070 --> 01:36:30,290
And I'm sure we will probably discuss this further at another time.

1033
01:36:30,790 --> 01:36:39,150
Unfortunately, the project that came before us is able to move forward as it is.

1034
01:36:39,150 --> 01:36:39,990
Mike correctly.

1035
01:36:41,050 --> 01:36:41,350
No.

1036
01:36:41,530 --> 01:36:48,270
I mean, so far, there's been no stay or anything for this particular property that the project

1037
01:36:48,270 --> 01:36:50,430
has been overturned.

1038
01:36:50,430 --> 01:36:53,310
So I mean, as of now, it's still moving forward.

1039
01:36:54,270 --> 01:36:59,170
And I think this is a really great discussion to give us guidance to look at architectural

1040
01:36:59,170 --> 01:37:02,330
standards more in depth with this.

1041
01:37:02,330 --> 01:37:06,030
You know, I'll go back to what had happened in the fall was really unfortunate.

1042
01:37:06,030 --> 01:37:17,830
And that project had been heard the year before and during concept that was really the time to say we didn't want the second story residential.

1043
01:37:18,330 --> 01:37:28,590
I think that was really the burden at that time. And then we had a complete change over and planning commission between what it was first heard in second time it came through.

1044
01:37:28,590 --> 01:37:33,220
And then that was a very big challenge that at that point to go back and say,

1045
01:37:34,050 --> 01:37:36,850
what changes do you want me because we're already in final?

1046
01:37:37,830 --> 01:37:40,660
So I think, you know, lesson for all of us, that those are things that

1047
01:37:41,170 --> 01:37:47,910
have been addressed during concepts for all of us moving forward. But again, it did get overturned

1048
01:37:47,910 --> 01:37:52,650
so that it would be a move point anyway with regard to that. And maybe it would have been

1049
01:37:52,650 --> 01:37:57,210
more palatable with better design standards. And I think that's a great thing. I mean,

1050
01:37:57,210 --> 01:38:04,130
books for almost 20 years. We've only had one property. Really. You wouldn't take advantage of it.

1051
01:38:04,270 --> 01:38:08,350
It knows you've been redeveloped that way yet. But that's not just that they wouldn't do it in the future.

1052
01:38:08,890 --> 01:38:13,530
And I think it would look much better. I agree with you, Pete, that we would want to see something

1053
01:38:13,530 --> 01:38:19,230
maybe a little more. Little nicer looking, I guess. So just speaking, I don't agree with the kind of

1054
01:38:19,230 --> 01:38:24,290
that motel feels. Maybe not what we're going for. Maybe more mature. President Chuck scenes some more

1055
01:38:24,290 --> 01:38:29,470
things and the countenance and Montgomery County and stuff like that, so I mean those areas

1056
01:38:29,470 --> 01:38:33,650
they have the first floor, commercial but then the residents or kind of more condoage.

1057
01:38:34,670 --> 01:38:42,390
Yeah, you're exactly right, Linda. And again, I apologize because when you say there's a problem

1058
01:38:42,390 --> 01:38:47,750
with something you ought to have a solution, I really don't have a solution for this. And when you say

1059
01:38:47,750 --> 01:38:52,690
architectural standards, I wouldn't know where to start. I really don't. Other than you know

1060
01:38:52,690 --> 01:38:58,870
when you see it, and that's not it. And so I apologize because I really don't have much,

1061
01:38:59,110 --> 01:39:03,610
you know, one of the things that I kind of think of when Gina said what you did about the laundry,

1062
01:39:04,410 --> 01:39:08,110
I don't necessarily, I agree with her, it would be hard to enforce, you know, that, that hey,

1063
01:39:08,110 --> 01:39:12,550
you went swimming, you know, you went to somebody's pool, you, you put your, your towel,

1064
01:39:12,650 --> 01:39:16,930
that's a dry, I mean, you know, that, that, you know, makes some sense. But, you know,

1065
01:39:16,970 --> 01:39:21,930
if we required laundry hookups in each unit, I don't know, is that something that we want to do?

1066
01:39:21,930 --> 01:39:23,270
I mean, I don't know.

1067
01:39:23,270 --> 01:39:26,170
I really don't know what the solutions are.

1068
01:39:27,230 --> 01:39:30,790
And the other thing I would ask is,

1069
01:39:32,850 --> 01:39:35,650
when we say that anything we do here

1070
01:39:35,650 --> 01:39:37,890
would not apply to this development,

1071
01:39:39,450 --> 01:39:43,290
is that because it's written in the code

1072
01:39:43,290 --> 01:39:47,090
or is that our customary because they've gone through the process

1073
01:39:47,090 --> 01:39:49,930
that they did where everything they were supposed to do,

1074
01:39:49,930 --> 01:39:56,530
it's our fault there's a county that we didn't do things differently. I mean, or is it the case

1075
01:39:56,530 --> 01:40:01,430
that we could say, listen, you know, if you haven't been issued a permit, you haven't put a shovel

1076
01:40:01,430 --> 01:40:10,290
in the ground, you've got to go back and design it this way. What is the statute there that we're

1077
01:40:10,290 --> 01:40:14,290
leaning on where we can't get this stuff to step up and do something better?

1078
01:40:14,290 --> 01:40:19,070
Well, I'll defer to Jim, but Maryland is typically what they call high-vesting state.

1079
01:40:19,650 --> 01:40:29,370
So really, what the standard typically for Maryland has been in the past as shoveling the grounds, kind of thing, or even footers in the grounds, so to speak.

1080
01:40:29,910 --> 01:40:40,490
However, I've seen some recent court cases where vesting has been just investment to a substantial amount, so that's demonstrated that, you know, they have, you know,

1081
01:40:40,490 --> 01:40:47,530
It gone through the entitlement process and other than pulling the permits, and they've spent

1082
01:40:47,530 --> 01:40:54,490
tens of hundreds of thousands of dollars on things, and they have contractors lined up,

1083
01:40:54,550 --> 01:40:59,710
depending on what the next step in the process would be, a court could say, you know, what we do see that.

1084
01:40:59,750 --> 01:41:02,150
I mean, there's no hard and fast rule for investing.

1085
01:41:02,890 --> 01:41:04,570
Jim, I think you'd be better at that.

1086
01:41:04,570 --> 01:41:05,310
It needs to elaborate.

1087
01:41:06,090 --> 01:41:06,690
Right.

1088
01:41:07,330 --> 01:41:08,150
Yes, Mr. Lester.

1089
01:41:08,510 --> 01:41:15,290
So traditionally, Maryland courts have found that a project is vested, and that basically

1090
01:41:15,290 --> 01:41:20,290
means it can move forward no matter what changes are made to the code's subsequent.

1091
01:41:21,910 --> 01:41:29,350
And the courts have found best in traditionally when the project has obtained a development

1092
01:41:29,350 --> 01:41:38,630
right and a permit. So basically approval and the permits and has basically put shovels

1093
01:41:38,630 --> 01:41:45,810
on the ground and moved dirt. If that happens then the project is invested in any subsequent

1094
01:41:45,810 --> 01:41:48,690
changes within the fact that specific project.

1095
01:41:50,710 --> 01:41:54,810
So it really, I guess just depends on the project

1096
01:41:54,810 --> 01:42:00,070
where it is in the actual construction of it.

1097
01:42:03,970 --> 01:42:05,830
Thank you. Thank you very much.

1098
01:42:06,570 --> 01:42:07,470
That's your welcome.

1099
01:42:08,770 --> 01:42:14,730
Yeah, I was just going to say that, you know, I think we need to have some different language

1100
01:42:15,410 --> 01:42:25,770
that gives us the right to, you know, I think it's a good thing to have this in the code.

1101
01:42:25,770 --> 01:42:32,570
But I don't know if, if we're as, also the planning and zoning are going to have any teeth in it.

1102
01:42:33,310 --> 01:42:40,130
I mean, I really think, you know, because like in front of there in her ban, you know, that's where like the main entrance is coming into a development.

1103
01:42:40,790 --> 01:42:54,050
And it's got town homes all around it. It fits. It doesn't fit right beside a state highway that's got a 30 foot back behind it and got, you know, our 40,000 or after there's lots of bigger net back behind it.

1104
01:42:54,050 --> 01:42:58,750
And it doesn't even have, you know, my, my biggest take was, you know, the state roots

1105
01:42:58,750 --> 01:43:03,430
that you're going to put across walk in for people to walk across Route 26, it's very congested,

1106
01:43:03,430 --> 01:43:10,830
right there already. And the fact that he took landscaping out of the project, even though he put

1107
01:43:10,830 --> 01:43:16,630
in the sidewalk out front that didn't connect anything, he took landscaping out when he came to

1108
01:43:16,630 --> 01:43:22,590
final, which, you know, I could hear the people complaining that, you know, it's like,

1109
01:43:23,190 --> 01:43:27,330
but, you know, I think it's something that fits good, but I think it needs to fit in

1110
01:43:27,330 --> 01:43:27,750
right area.

1111
01:43:27,790 --> 01:43:29,070
And I don't think that was a right area.

1112
01:43:29,290 --> 01:43:29,810
That was my taken.

1113
01:43:29,950 --> 01:43:35,050
I don't know if we can craft a language to make it associated with more of a development.

1114
01:43:36,750 --> 01:43:37,790
I don't know.

1115
01:43:40,230 --> 01:43:41,210
I'm Stephen God.

1116
01:43:41,590 --> 01:43:43,570
You know, I agree.

1117
01:43:43,570 --> 01:44:08,510
I mean, to me, this area is, it just, to me, just doesn't make any sense of what you, they're trying to put where they are, I mean, especially with literally across the street you already have commercial development that has a lot of vacancies in it to be honest, so it just seems to me like you're kind of doing the same thing, you're just building another building that, yes, architecture does not fit.

1118
01:44:08,510 --> 01:44:17,830
That obviously, as we've seen from emails, the residents and people in the area are not very welcoming too, so

1119
01:44:17,830 --> 01:44:21,530
Yeah, I agree that it will be nice if we had a little bit more

1120
01:44:21,530 --> 01:44:26,730
Ability to, you know, make some changes, you know, stuff for the architecture and all, because it's just

1121
01:44:26,730 --> 01:44:28,670
To me, it just doesn't make any sense

1122
01:44:28,670 --> 01:44:32,390
Why you're putting this there, I guess

1123
01:44:34,250 --> 01:44:36,370
You know, and my frustration was

1124
01:44:36,370 --> 01:44:45,290
was it seemed like our role with academic and actually fairly useless, because we all

1125
01:44:45,290 --> 01:44:49,210
offered a number of comments, I think we articulated pretty clearly all the things we're talking

1126
01:44:49,210 --> 01:44:53,310
about tonight. We even stepped back and said it's not even just the architecture,

1127
01:44:54,610 --> 01:44:58,630
but Matt to your point, you know, I thought we couldn't have been clearer that we didn't think

1128
01:44:58,630 --> 01:44:59,770
fit with the surrounding community.

1129
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:09,680
It wasn't even consistent with the master plan, all things that are, you know, dead on things we're supposed to consider. And it still makes no difference. And so what's the point, really?

1130
01:45:11,080 --> 01:45:29,300
When, as I've said to Jim before, my frustration is that it just gets appealed to Novo. And then that's it. And the reasons we gave and the community comments that we heard and incorporated really are given away when it goes up.

1131
01:45:29,300 --> 01:45:32,260
And so I think it is a flawed process.

1132
01:45:32,380 --> 01:45:35,540
We can change the statute, but the process is always going to be a problem.

1133
01:45:36,660 --> 01:45:40,200
I think, and when it came to us in concept,

1134
01:45:40,600 --> 01:45:44,880
I was critical of the residences on above.

1135
01:45:45,260 --> 01:45:47,540
And I made it clear that it was a problem for me,

1136
01:45:47,540 --> 01:45:50,140
and it was going to be a problem when they came back.

1137
01:45:50,620 --> 01:45:54,300
And so I encourage them to design it differently, which they didn't.

1138
01:45:54,980 --> 01:45:57,960
And then they just moved it on through, they just shoved it on through.

1139
01:45:57,960 --> 01:46:02,300
And there was really nothing this commission could do about it.

1140
01:46:02,460 --> 01:46:07,240
And so I think no matter how you change the code to accomplish these things,

1141
01:46:07,280 --> 01:46:09,000
which I would be in favor of.

1142
01:46:09,580 --> 01:46:12,660
I don't know that the process makes it any more meaningful.

1143
01:46:13,220 --> 01:46:16,580
I think we'll say we don't like it and we don't approve it,

1144
01:46:16,580 --> 01:46:17,580
and it ought to be different.

1145
01:46:18,300 --> 01:46:21,180
And then it'll go on up and depending on how the hearing goes,

1146
01:46:21,680 --> 01:46:25,500
day and over, new day, nothing we said matters.

1147
01:46:26,460 --> 01:46:33,860
If they can convince the BCA, and this is not a criticism of the BCA at all, it's just the process I'm very critical of.

1148
01:46:34,320 --> 01:46:36,280
So it's like, why do we even bother?

1149
01:46:36,900 --> 01:46:44,260
Now, maybe the lesson learned is that we can be maybe I should have been more aggressive at the concept stage.

1150
01:46:45,560 --> 01:46:51,080
But say the commission that said we don't like it, we don't want residents on it, we don't approve the concept plan.

1151
01:46:51,080 --> 01:46:55,040
And they come back at the next stage full of residences.

1152
01:46:55,940 --> 01:46:57,100
What do we do about it?

1153
01:46:57,680 --> 01:46:59,120
We can say we don't like it again.

1154
01:46:59,300 --> 01:46:59,960
We still don't like it.

1155
01:46:59,960 --> 01:47:00,780
We didn't like it last time.

1156
01:47:00,840 --> 01:47:01,680
We don't like it this time.

1157
01:47:01,780 --> 01:47:02,220
Too bad.

1158
01:47:02,720 --> 01:47:03,560
We deny it.

1159
01:47:03,680 --> 01:47:04,380
They appeal it.

1160
01:47:04,380 --> 01:47:05,240
It goes in.

1161
01:47:06,060 --> 01:47:13,660
So I don't know what the bigger solution is because I think we did a very good job in articulating.

1162
01:47:14,940 --> 01:47:16,540
Well, first of all, listening to the community.

1163
01:47:17,240 --> 01:47:18,420
And then looking at the bigger picture.

1164
01:47:18,420 --> 01:47:25,280
this thing doesn't fit where it's going. It just doesn't. And you can you can dress it up

1165
01:47:25,280 --> 01:47:29,300
and you can decorate it and you can make you put pretty lights on it. It's still in the wrong place

1166
01:47:29,300 --> 01:47:35,700
for the wrong use right now and it isn't safe for the reasons that we said. That's a busy highway

1167
01:47:35,700 --> 01:47:41,460
and there's not even going to be a crosswalk or a walk indicator. I worry that somebody's going

1168
01:47:41,460 --> 01:47:49,860
get hurt or killed there. And yet it's going in. So I have, I don't know, I'm frustrated by

1169
01:47:49,860 --> 01:47:55,060
all this. And Michael, I didn't give you a chance to be, I'm sorry about that. So Michael, did you

1170
01:47:55,060 --> 01:48:00,220
have a comment? I know Pete, you have a comment too. I was, Jeff, I was just going to, you know,

1171
01:48:00,220 --> 01:48:06,660
pretty much say what you were saying. It's frustrating. You know, this was one of my first cases I

1172
01:48:06,660 --> 01:48:31,720
Yes, when I joined the board and specifically remember you wasn't confrontational, but, you know, bringing those guys holding them their feet to the fire and saying, hey, we asked you to do this when you were here and nothing's been done and then they go and change take the landscaping out at the final, you know, kind of it's like okay, why do we have the code?

1173
01:48:31,720 --> 01:48:42,300
And then the BZA to overturn it, despite what the code says or the May, when that May word gives us the power to say,

1174
01:48:42,400 --> 01:48:48,280
no, this has to change. We don't like this blah blah blah. With no regard to that.

1175
01:48:49,020 --> 01:48:54,680
And it's just, it's frustrating. I sense your frustration and you're right. It's like,

1176
01:48:54,680 --> 01:49:15,080
why something else, there's the disconnect somewhere in that appeal between us and the BZA and the BZA, did they review our meeting notes? Did they review the recording of those meetings? Did they review your statements about when it first came through?

1177
01:49:15,080 --> 01:49:21,680
I doubt. Doesn't seem like it. Do they ask for any further input? No.

1178
01:49:22,620 --> 01:49:29,520
That's the disconnect. So what's the purpose of having the code? What's the purpose of having

1179
01:49:31,700 --> 01:49:37,580
these processes in place so that we can offer feedback to the developer and say,

1180
01:49:38,220 --> 01:49:42,140
this isn't going to work here. You need to do this, this, and this, and then for them to ignore it

1181
01:49:42,140 --> 01:49:47,480
or peel it and win, there's that's that just connect that thing between the

1182
01:49:47,480 --> 01:49:50,720
piece of the way and the planings are in the kitchen.

1183
01:49:51,800 --> 01:50:02,460
I guess what I wanted to say is I value and respect the fact that the developer has

1184
01:50:02,460 --> 01:50:07,640
rights to the extent that an appeal is exactly that.

1185
01:50:07,740 --> 01:50:11,800
He's appealing to someone else, you know, can you not take another look at this?

1186
01:50:11,800 --> 01:50:16,700
And so to give them the right of appeal is a great thing.

1187
01:50:17,440 --> 01:50:22,600
Having said that, Jim, I'm wondering if we had language

1188
01:50:22,600 --> 01:50:24,440
and I don't mean to put you on the spot.

1189
01:50:24,940 --> 01:50:26,980
So this doesn't require you to respond.

1190
01:50:27,460 --> 01:50:31,000
But if the language, like I think Michael is kind of headed there,

1191
01:50:31,380 --> 01:50:32,240
the word may.

1192
01:50:32,860 --> 01:50:36,420
I mean, if there were stronger language that in certain circumstances,

1193
01:50:37,660 --> 01:50:44,020
you know, better exceptional or I don't know what it would be. But you know, there's the

1194
01:50:44,020 --> 01:50:50,740
word may open us up to where we're being arbitrary and capricious, you know, or can you

1195
01:50:50,740 --> 01:50:59,420
set a standard that says, look, in certain circumstances, this could be done, but it's going

1196
01:50:59,420 --> 01:51:03,960
to be rare. You know, how do you do that? How do you write that? And so, you know, good look

1197
01:51:03,960 --> 01:51:04,740
with that job.

1198
01:51:05,420 --> 01:51:12,300
The right, very carefully is how you write it, because as you said in this, there are

1199
01:51:12,300 --> 01:51:18,900
a group of arbitrary recesses, and also do processes using constitutional issues with equal

1200
01:51:18,900 --> 01:51:19,480
protection.

1201
01:51:20,760 --> 01:51:27,500
You know, just both the treat everyone the same way, and that goes to developers even, just

1202
01:51:27,500 --> 01:51:33,720
because they make a lot of money doesn't mean they lose a legal protection, so there would

1203
01:51:33,720 --> 01:51:41,680
concerns, there's always concerns when the government has discretion and they use that discretion

1204
01:51:42,640 --> 01:51:51,140
to make differences between person A and person B based on a sort of arbitrary and the

1205
01:51:51,140 --> 01:51:58,240
precious matters you were saying before. So we can certainly explore language to do that, but we'd

1206
01:51:58,240 --> 01:51:59,560
to do it very carefully.

1207
01:52:01,620 --> 01:52:03,920
And then that is where I fall back to,

1208
01:52:04,180 --> 01:52:05,000
and again, I'll be quiet

1209
01:52:05,000 --> 01:52:06,660
because I know that people that wanna talk

1210
01:52:06,660 --> 01:52:07,880
that are citizens.

1211
01:52:08,780 --> 01:52:10,320
And that's where when it gets approved,

1212
01:52:10,820 --> 01:52:12,380
you're gonna, from a landscaping standpoint,

1213
01:52:12,460 --> 01:52:13,560
from a lighting standpoint,

1214
01:52:13,780 --> 01:52:15,380
from a safety and security standpoint,

1215
01:52:16,380 --> 01:52:17,860
from a traffic's pattern standpoint,

1216
01:52:19,260 --> 01:52:22,900
and from an architectural, just being welcoming

1217
01:52:23,440 --> 01:52:27,060
as a residence, it needs to be upgraded

1218
01:52:27,060 --> 01:52:31,680
in certain ways. How we do that? I don't know. I really don't. I wish I wish I didn't.

1219
01:52:34,520 --> 01:52:40,020
My question would be, could we make it where the wording would be as it would be

1220
01:52:40,020 --> 01:52:45,620
part of a community? Because the ones that I've seen that look good are attached to a community.

1221
01:52:46,900 --> 01:52:51,780
I mean, because, you know, if you build a nice, I mean, you know, as you said, we need much more

1222
01:52:51,780 --> 01:52:57,900
or we need more housing and care organic everywhere.

1223
01:52:59,020 --> 01:53:01,240
And if it was attached to a community like some of the ones

1224
01:53:01,240 --> 01:53:04,100
that I've seen, I mean, I think they look good,

1225
01:53:04,540 --> 01:53:08,820
even as long as you have the architect right on the front of it,

1226
01:53:09,140 --> 01:53:12,160
as you're entering a development or kind of a strip

1227
01:53:12,160 --> 01:53:15,340
mall attached to a development, they look good.

1228
01:53:18,050 --> 01:53:18,390
So.

1229
01:53:18,390 --> 01:53:21,890
Yeah, certainly not lying with me, 10 is poor.

1230
01:53:23,630 --> 01:53:27,270
The question I come back to though, even if we do that, I mean, in some ways we did that.

1231
01:53:27,310 --> 01:53:35,290
I mean, here it has to be, I mean, part of what we're required to look at is whatever the project is consistent with the master plan.

1232
01:53:35,330 --> 01:53:37,050
Is it consistent with the surrounding community?

1233
01:53:38,850 --> 01:53:41,510
And we're asked to exercise discretion around that.

1234
01:53:41,650 --> 01:53:43,990
We take input from the community.

1235
01:53:44,350 --> 01:53:46,990
Lots of people came in and talked to us. Lots of people sent us letters.

1236
01:53:47,550 --> 01:53:48,910
We take all of that into account.

1237
01:53:49,490 --> 01:53:55,070
We exercise discretion, we hold up that standard, so we can, you know, would this be better as part of a community?

1238
01:53:55,510 --> 01:53:58,910
How does this fit with the surrounding community, all of those things, which we did?

1239
01:53:59,930 --> 01:54:05,110
We articulated pretty clearly, I think, between all of us as a commission, in holding those standards up,

1240
01:54:05,350 --> 01:54:10,090
why we thought this one was inconsistent, and therefore shouldn't be approved.

1241
01:54:10,690 --> 01:54:15,630
And I know it beat a dead horse here, but the problem, I think, with the process is when it does get a PO,

1242
01:54:15,630 --> 01:54:17,650
And I certainly understand, I'm the property owner.

1243
01:54:17,970 --> 01:54:20,310
I want the right to appeal, and I don't have a problem with that.

1244
01:54:20,570 --> 01:54:23,630
I have a problem with the fact that the process then takes it to an appeal.

1245
01:54:24,750 --> 01:54:26,130
We're none of the community input.

1246
01:54:26,670 --> 01:54:27,950
He is considered by the BCA.

1247
01:54:28,470 --> 01:54:31,490
None of the letters, none of the comments, none of the conversation,

1248
01:54:31,510 --> 01:54:33,230
the community conversation that happened,

1249
01:54:33,510 --> 01:54:39,170
unless they're all going to sort of descend on Moss on the BCA to do it all again,

1250
01:54:39,690 --> 01:54:44,670
as opposed to the BCA being required to consider the record from below.

1251
01:54:44,670 --> 01:54:52,790
So community citizens aren't inconvenience a second time to try to clear their schedules to go say the same thing they already said before when there's a record of it in the first place.

1252
01:54:53,350 --> 01:54:56,010
So I think the process is the inconsiderate to the community.

1253
01:54:56,790 --> 01:54:58,710
I think it's disrespectful to this commission.

1254
01:54:59,370 --> 01:55:00,190
I think it's.

1255
01:55:01,550 --> 01:55:04,170
I just think it's not the best we can do as a community.

1256
01:55:04,490 --> 01:55:08,170
I think it's deficient in a lot of ways and it's so easily fixable.

1257
01:55:08,630 --> 01:55:12,070
All of that work by the community by this commission.

1258
01:55:13,750 --> 01:55:17,850
could be captured if the appeal just had to be on the record so that they did have to take

1259
01:55:17,850 --> 01:55:19,950
consideration of that. Janice, you would have your hand up.

1260
01:55:22,990 --> 01:55:33,950
I do think one place we fell short, we heard the concept plan and I could have sworn we said

1261
01:55:33,950 --> 01:55:40,330
we wanted to see it back, but that was quite some time back and not everybody was a part of the

1262
01:55:40,330 --> 01:55:50,170
mission then, but it came back to us in a final plan. So then we were trying to backtrack

1263
01:55:50,170 --> 01:55:58,750
and tell them what to do and it's the frustration came over and then motions were made

1264
01:55:58,750 --> 01:56:21,070
We said, no, so I think we need to be more cognizant of front and make sure that if it is a concept plan and it appears questionable that we stipulate that we need to see the preliminary before it comes back before final.

1265
01:56:22,150 --> 01:56:30,910
So, yeah, and that's a great question because Janice, or part of you, Linda, from a process

1266
01:56:30,910 --> 01:56:35,910
standpoint, if this something like this were to happen in the future, you know, where we,

1267
01:56:36,110 --> 01:56:40,450
we've seen something and we said a few things and it comes back and they didn't do anything.

1268
01:56:41,170 --> 01:56:48,310
Well, our action this time, we, you know, we denied it.

1269
01:56:48,310 --> 01:56:53,570
could the alternative have been, you were not ready to approve this yet.

1270
01:56:55,130 --> 01:56:58,790
We're not going to deny it, but we're also not going to approve it.

1271
01:56:58,830 --> 01:57:02,290
You need to go back. Could we have done that again to the sky?

1272
01:57:04,650 --> 01:57:07,750
I don't think we could do that, and Jim, please crack me if I'm wrong,

1273
01:57:07,890 --> 01:57:12,010
but I think you could have approved it with additional conditions that you wanted to see

1274
01:57:12,010 --> 01:57:14,170
as far as the landscape being in stuff goes.

1275
01:57:14,170 --> 01:57:23,090
If you thought that was sub-sub-par, so like in your latitude range, you can change signs.

1276
01:57:24,310 --> 01:57:27,590
You can change parking traffic patterns.

1277
01:57:27,910 --> 01:57:29,630
We're interested to do it on our property.

1278
01:57:30,070 --> 01:57:35,210
You can ask for more landscaping and you could have held them to that too.

1279
01:57:36,110 --> 01:57:39,470
I think those are some things that definitely can be done.

1280
01:57:39,670 --> 01:57:44,030
I'm not sure if the idea there's supposed to take your concerns at concept

1281
01:57:44,030 --> 01:57:51,950
and bring them back. And it should, your concern should be what they go from concert to preliminary to final.

1282
01:57:52,390 --> 01:57:54,350
I mean, that really should have been done.

1283
01:57:56,030 --> 01:58:01,890
So my, so then I hear you on that. If I'm a developer and I don't want to do what we're suggesting. I bring it at concept.

1284
01:58:02,470 --> 01:58:08,330
Commission says, you got to change all these things. I leave, I come back.

1285
01:58:08,890 --> 01:58:13,970
I didn't change any of them. I'm now at final. I didn't like any of the commissions ideas or requirements.

1286
01:58:13,970 --> 01:58:18,590
or conditions. So I say, here we are final. I know you had all these conditions. I know you

1287
01:58:18,590 --> 01:58:26,190
wanted all this extra landscaping. I'm not doing it. I'm just not doing it. We deny it. It's

1288
01:58:26,190 --> 01:58:31,510
really sort of what happened here, including at five. No, they even took away some of the landscaping.

1289
01:58:33,290 --> 01:58:37,130
So we get somebody who's just the fire. You know, they come in at concept. We couldn't be clear.

1290
01:58:37,370 --> 01:58:42,290
Yeah, we could have been clear. I get that. Suppose we were. I'm not sure it would have been different.

1291
01:58:42,750 --> 01:58:49,190
I'm pretty sure they would have come back and said, yeah, we heard you with our ears, but we're not doing any of the things that you want.

1292
01:58:49,710 --> 01:58:54,430
Now on the final, now what can we do is a commission at final?

1293
01:58:55,250 --> 01:58:56,550
Yes, we can ask for special report.

1294
01:58:56,670 --> 01:59:01,250
Maybe after they come in a concept, we want a special report that come back at the special report.

1295
01:59:02,930 --> 01:59:04,050
They're still defiant.

1296
01:59:04,470 --> 01:59:07,450
So we want another special report, maybe we want five special reports.

1297
01:59:07,850 --> 01:59:09,930
You know, at some point, we get to the end point.

1298
01:59:09,930 --> 01:59:13,010
And they've either done what we want or they haven't.

1299
01:59:13,550 --> 01:59:16,830
And if they just haven't, what can we do?

1300
01:59:17,070 --> 01:59:19,990
Other than keep adding conditions or, you know,

1301
01:59:20,050 --> 01:59:23,030
say we want a 40 foot bar on the whole place or, you know,

1302
01:59:23,130 --> 01:59:24,210
things like that.

1303
01:59:24,450 --> 01:59:26,730
Ultimately, at some point, it gets across the finish line.

1304
01:59:27,350 --> 01:59:29,970
And then it goes up on the day-no-vo appeal.

1305
01:59:30,690 --> 01:59:34,170
And so it's really, you know, we have the, you know,

1306
01:59:35,480 --> 01:59:40,620
But the fight, I guess, petitioner at concept.

1307
01:59:41,060 --> 01:59:42,100
What do we do as a commission?

1308
01:59:42,240 --> 01:59:43,460
And that's not an answer for tonight.

1309
01:59:43,740 --> 01:59:50,480
It's just, you know, we're working hard to do the things the code says we're supposed to do.

1310
01:59:51,700 --> 01:59:53,860
And we're listening to the community and we're balancing out,

1311
01:59:53,920 --> 01:59:56,500
and we're exercising our discretion consistent with the master plan

1312
01:59:57,520 --> 01:59:59,560
and some around the community and all of those things.

1313
02:00:00,000 --> 02:00:05,960
Community agrees without sometimes they disagree. But we always have taken it seriously. We've always taken all that information.

1314
02:00:06,160 --> 02:00:16,180
And we always consider those things to what end, I guess. So Jim, you have a green light on.

1315
02:00:16,560 --> 02:00:22,940
Yes, I just wanted to follow up on and I understand all of your frustration with the appeal process.

1316
02:00:23,440 --> 02:00:28,800
And I just want to emphasize that is a function of state case law and not the county code.

1317
02:00:29,720 --> 02:00:31,980
No, I know that, because I'd raise the issue with you.

1318
02:00:32,380 --> 02:00:37,740
I used the word as a hard wire in the code and your answer, your legal advice is

1319
02:00:37,740 --> 02:00:39,600
rightly that it is.

1320
02:00:40,080 --> 02:00:42,820
That doesn't mean I have to like it and it doesn't mean I think it's right or fair.

1321
02:00:44,500 --> 02:00:49,600
Because I think it's, I think it's a, I think it's a significant flaw.

1322
02:00:50,840 --> 02:00:54,800
And changing that would, would fix a lot of the things that we're talking about.

1323
02:00:55,960 --> 02:00:57,180
Tonight still gives up fuel rights.

1324
02:00:57,840 --> 02:01:03,760
I just think it would be a more meaningful appeal to everybody involved if we're on the record.

1325
02:01:04,620 --> 02:01:10,020
Because we're doing our work, but the record is of no value is the problem.

1326
02:01:11,320 --> 02:01:19,400
So anyway, why I appreciate everybody's one-less thing to me, Van, which is a lot of worthless thing that's being done.

1327
02:01:20,300 --> 02:01:25,180
But maybe there'll be a way at some point in the future where that could change for the better.

1328
02:01:25,180 --> 02:01:27,840
Stephen, did you have a question or a comment?

1329
02:01:28,020 --> 02:01:28,800
Yeah, no, no.

1330
02:01:28,800 --> 02:01:32,220
I was just kind of commenting on use or to define.

1331
02:01:32,500 --> 02:01:35,320
And I do remember when the developer came in,

1332
02:01:35,400 --> 02:01:38,040
he definitely was very, I guess,

1333
02:01:38,140 --> 02:01:42,380
standoffish was probably the best way to describe his demeanor

1334
02:01:42,380 --> 02:01:45,620
with not only us, but with the members of the public

1335
02:01:45,620 --> 02:01:48,560
that actually came out in mass, you know,

1336
02:01:48,960 --> 02:01:54,280
as the largest amount of citizens come out against anything,

1337
02:01:54,280 --> 02:01:59,780
really, you know, to one of our in-person meetings. I mean, that's just a really good way to describe it because

1338
02:01:59,780 --> 02:02:07,260
it definitely was defined or stand-off-ishness. I guess you get say from the word go.

1339
02:02:08,800 --> 02:02:14,340
Yeah, I think so. And look, that's their prerogative and they can do that. And you know, that's all right.

1340
02:02:16,020 --> 02:02:22,320
I just would like the communities input and our exercise and discretion to be more meaningful,

1341
02:02:22,320 --> 02:02:26,480
I guess, and be part of the consideration as it moves through the process.

1342
02:02:26,840 --> 02:02:32,040
I think the VCA, if I were on the VCA, I would appreciate having that record as opposed to having to

1343
02:02:32,040 --> 02:02:37,560
develop it all from scratch every time. If we're doing our job, their job should be better.

1344
02:02:38,380 --> 02:02:42,440
We should elevate the decision-making process because we're elevating the conversation because we're

1345
02:02:42,440 --> 02:02:46,500
bringing more to the table. Instead, they've got to do all the lifting all the time.

1346
02:02:46,500 --> 02:02:52,640
and it's one person. It's just it's a it's a bad set up for everybody.

1347
02:02:53,180 --> 02:02:58,560
So anyway, I'll get up my high-force and I guess Linda's or anything else on this

1348
02:02:58,560 --> 02:03:00,980
before we open up the general public comment.

1349
02:03:01,060 --> 02:03:07,400
No, that's all we do have a speaker Bill McCormick who actually also sent in a

1350
02:03:07,400 --> 02:03:12,200
comment letter and a petition to the Planning and Zoning Commission earlier this

1351
02:03:12,200 --> 02:03:16,920
So he just wants to comment on the topic.

1352
02:03:17,420 --> 02:03:20,840
So I'm going to turn that over to he and Lord on New York.

1353
02:03:20,980 --> 02:03:22,180
There you go, Bill McCarty.

1354
02:03:23,780 --> 02:03:24,840
Can y'all hear me?

1355
02:03:25,060 --> 02:03:26,030
Yes, yes.

1356
02:03:26,780 --> 02:03:27,100
Great.

1357
02:03:27,680 --> 02:03:31,940
I first want to say that I really appreciate you taking time to listen to the

1358
02:03:31,940 --> 02:03:32,320
concerns.

1359
02:03:33,120 --> 02:03:34,080
I know you do.

1360
02:03:34,360 --> 02:03:35,700
I know you take it seriously.

1361
02:03:36,820 --> 02:03:39,260
So I definitely appreciate that.

1362
02:03:39,260 --> 02:03:54,080
I just, I know it didn't come across this way when whoever said it said it, but I think the phrase was an unfortunate lesson learned from the county perspective and, you know, from our perspective, it's a little bit more than that.

1363
02:03:54,220 --> 02:04:04,660
You know, developers invest money, you know, somebody said tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars, but there are dozens of citizens who have invested tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars.

1364
02:04:04,660 --> 02:04:12,240
They can care all county their home and I believe they have rights too. I believe in if you should should be its own zone

1365
02:04:13,600 --> 02:04:18,900
I can't remember who said it but somebody said this particular topic shouldn't be addressed at this time

1366
02:04:18,900 --> 02:04:21,140
because it would affect every

1367
02:04:21,140 --> 02:04:23,660
commercial property in the county

1368
02:04:24,500 --> 02:04:30,780
I think that's kind of the point nobody should really be able to just laugh apartments in any commercials on in the county

1369
02:04:30,780 --> 02:04:35,420
It's mixed use with its own zone and we're allowed for more transparency within the community.

1370
02:04:35,680 --> 02:04:41,600
It would allow the planning and zoning commission more oversight into ensuring mixed use zones fit with the surrounding community.

1371
02:04:42,460 --> 02:04:48,200
At a minimum, though, I think the code for Plankermerseless Centers needs to be overhauled with regards to access where use.

1372
02:04:49,520 --> 02:04:53,780
The current code is sloppy, seems like apartments are just kind of slapped on as an afterthought.

1373
02:04:54,980 --> 02:04:59,740
Just to kind of quote unquote keep up with what is thought to be the current trend in community development.

1374
02:05:00,440 --> 02:05:17,020
But based on input from at least one source, our previous state delegates, Susan Krebs, what was submitted to the planning and zoning commission to illustrating what mixed use could look like is in no way in no way in the way resembles past projects or currently plan projects.

1375
02:05:17,680 --> 02:05:23,580
Given this estimate that the process was flawed and misguided and definitely misrepresented.

1376
02:05:23,580 --> 02:05:30,740
the current code allows for discretion. However, not all parties that rule on these cases understand

1377
02:05:30,740 --> 02:05:36,240
that or care to use that discretion. Given this mislimant standards should be developed in order

1378
02:05:36,240 --> 02:05:42,100
to maintain a higher standard for our community as a whole. The argument against standards for

1379
02:05:42,100 --> 02:05:47,140
whatever reason is that of property rights. However, property rights do not come with carte wants

1380
02:05:47,140 --> 02:05:52,200
to undertake any endeavor on property that you want. I can't open a bar my basement, I can't open

1381
02:05:52,200 --> 02:05:54,660
of firing range on a half acre of land.

1382
02:05:55,040 --> 02:05:57,720
I can't open a dispensary within certain distance from schools.

1383
02:05:58,200 --> 02:05:59,120
There should be standards.

1384
02:06:00,320 --> 02:06:02,540
Besides, I've mentioned the petition that I submitted,

1385
02:06:02,540 --> 02:06:05,620
I submitted that petition of people who are

1386
02:06:05,620 --> 02:06:07,500
agreed with removing second story apartments

1387
02:06:07,500 --> 02:06:09,160
from plant commercial center code.

1388
02:06:09,700 --> 02:06:12,920
I'd also ask that you take into consideration those who

1389
02:06:12,920 --> 02:06:15,600
have been critical of these types of projects very recently

1390
02:06:15,600 --> 02:06:17,300
by writing into you guys.

1391
02:06:18,740 --> 02:06:30,880
So, somebody mentioned that the projects which are currently underway, it's kind of tough to stop that, and that's kind of confusing, which is kind of the reason we were here.

1392
02:06:31,520 --> 02:06:46,600
I would ask that if you do agree that this particular use should be more thoughtfully executed, that you make your motion, when you decide to, that the code take effect that data is passed for all projects that have not been issued a building permit and broken grounds.

1393
02:06:47,400 --> 02:06:51,100
County Code should not be written in stone. I would ask if it's considered to be

1394
02:06:51,100 --> 02:06:54,440
the second story of apartments from play for Marshall Smith until something that the

1395
02:06:54,440 --> 02:06:59,160
community can be proud of can be thought to be introduced. And then again, thank you

1396
02:06:59,160 --> 02:07:00,300
for listening to me.

1397
02:07:02,450 --> 02:07:09,470
Thank you, Sarah. Is there anyone else that is on the line to offer public comment?

1398
02:07:11,480 --> 02:07:13,840
No, I believe he was the only person that signed up for this evening.

1399
02:07:14,740 --> 02:07:19,200
Okay, very good. Then we've reached the end of our agenda.

1400
02:07:19,200 --> 02:07:25,640
We're on item 12, which is the German. So is there a motion that we adjourn?

1401
02:07:27,460 --> 02:07:32,980
I'll move we adjourn. I'll see you back. All right, motion the second all in favor of adjourn, it's A.

1402
02:07:34,860 --> 02:07:43,200
All right. All right, thank you. Thanks, unanimous. Thank you all very, very much. Great to see you in the evening and we'll see you in the next few minutes.