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Welcome everyone to a Centerville City

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Council meeting being held on the

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earliest day of the month as possible

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since September 1st is calling on

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Tuesday. We have a first and third. This

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is as early as we get it. So, we welcome

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everybody here. Um we welcome staff. We

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welcome uh the public that might be with

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us in person or by Zoom. Uh we welcome

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council members. Um and thank you for

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making the time. Uh we're going to do uh the call to order uh part of the

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agenda. We'll do a roll call. We'll have

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a legislative thought from Council

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Member Haymon. We'll have legislative

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prayer from myself. And then we'll have

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a pledge of allegiance led by Councilman

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Bangader. So, let's do a roll call

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starting with Councilwoman Mikum.

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>> Mikum present.

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>> Vangar present.

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>> Heman present. Hurst present.

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>> Plumber present.

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>> All five council members present. Uh

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thank you council members for being here

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this night. All right. So, let's do a

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legislative thought from Council Member

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Haymon.

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>> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um, I have always

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appreciated the opportunity that our

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mayor extends to council members to

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share legislative thoughts while I've

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been up here. Um, I've heard a lot of

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different thoughts and I think that

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they're always really interesting.

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Today, I want to address the elephant in

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the room and that's my pride flag. In

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the last few months, I've taken quite a

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bit of heat over this flag. I have been

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called narcissistic,

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childish. I've had people suggest that I

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should resign, that I should be removed

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from office, and that I should be thrown

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in jail.

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All for exercising my first amendment

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right to display a little pride flag on

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this council dis which the state auditor

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has now confirmed I have every right to

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do. But I want to say this.

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For every negative comment that I have

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received, I have received significantly

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more outpouring of support from

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residents, from former residents, from

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people all over the state. And these are

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people who have shared some of the most

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heartbreaking and heartwarming stories

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with me that have really touched my

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heart. people who have shared personal

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experiences that affirm to me the

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importance for standing up for what I

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think is right. Now I know that what I

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am doing makes some people

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uncomfortable. It makes some of the

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people sitting up here with me

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uncomfortable and I would posit to you

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all that history is replete with

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examples of people whose exercise of

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first amendment rights have made others

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uncomfortable. The women who took to the

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streets more than a hundred years ago to

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march and advocate for their right to

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vote made a lot of men really

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uncomfortable.

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Black men and women who had the bravery

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to sit at restaurant lunch counters and

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who refused to leave, all advocating for

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the rights, the same rights as their

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white neighbors and friends. That made

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some people uncomfortable.

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I am not trying to equate my little

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pride flag with those important

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movements. But all of those movements

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share a common thread. Those actions

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made others uncomfortable.

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And I I would suggest to us all that

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sometimes we need a little discomfort to

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effectuate meaningful change.

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HB477

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started as a law that was aimed at

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keeping pride flags like this out of

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schools and out of government buildings.

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And I think and I've said on the record,

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I think it was wrong and offensive and

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unnecessary.

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that in an effort to prevent cities like

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ours from allowing pride flags to be in

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government buildings, the legislature

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cast their net wider. They cast it so

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broad that it's prohibited

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municipalities from displaying all kinds

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of flags. And I thought that you might

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be interested to know. It's led to

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complaints with the state auditor, not

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just about my pride flag.

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People have raised a complaint, at least

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one person raised a complaint about a

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thin blue line flag that a Salt Lake

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City police detective put on his desk.

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State auditors received a complaint

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about flags that were part of a

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temporary set decoration at UVU that

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were put up by a faculty-led academic

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film project. Complaint was raised about

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a Granite School District employee who

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was displaying Salt Lake City's

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municipal sealilly flag in his

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classroom. A U DOT employee received a

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complaint because he had put up a Trump

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flag in a maintenance shed.

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The East High School resource officer

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was displaying a back the blue flag next

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to a framed photo of the president

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inside his office. East High School got

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a complaint about that. The SJ Quinny

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College of Law got a complaint that they

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were displaying complainant didn't even

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say what kind of flag, just a

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non-compliant flag.

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And I pointed out earlier, we had a

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gentleman here with a really lovely um

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flag that was a circle with the 13 stars

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and inside of it, it said 250th to

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celebrate our nation's 250th birthday.

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It was a really impressive looking flag.

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And the state law would prohibit our

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city from flying even that one.

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I have been asked politely by some

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people, "Hey, Council Member Haymon,

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haven't you made your point? Won't you

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take down your flag?" I want to be

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really clear about something. I wish it

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wasn't necessary that I display my flag.

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I wish there wasn't a law on the books

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that dictates right now what flag cities

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can and can't put up in their own

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buildings. I wish our legislature didn't

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feel like they needed to tell cities

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like ours what we can and can't do in

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this regard. But the law is on the books

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and the legislature has chosen to

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exercise its power to force cities like

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ours to bow to its demands. So as long

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as the flag ban statute is still law, I

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am going to tell you respectfully no. I

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haven't made my point and I won't take

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down my flag. And that's true even if it

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makes some people uncomfortable.

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Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

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[clears throat]

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>> I'll do a legislative prayer. Our father

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in heaven, we're very grateful that we

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can be here this night. We're thankful

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for the freedoms that allow us to be

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here. We're mindful that we will discuss

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some things tonight that affect

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residents of our community. We ask that

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we be mindful of not only input that we

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have received from those that have

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reached out but maybe others that uh

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don't pay attention to what's going in

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the city or may be a little timid that

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we may be able to have a good pulse on

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what our community might be looking for.

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Uh we ask that we may be civil in our

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comments. We are grateful for uh all the

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employees of the uh the city that work

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so hard to uh provide a fun and a safe

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uh and a wholesome environment. We ask

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that thou may bless uh all those that

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are are striving to

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um serve uh our community that they may

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be blessed in their efforts. And uh this

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we say in the name of thy son Jesus

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Christ. Amen.

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>> Amen.

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>> Councilman Vagger,

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>> I'll repeat the pledge of allegiance to

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the United States of America flag with

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me.

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>> I pledge algiance to the flag of the

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United States of America and to the

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republic for which it stands. One nation

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under God, indivisible, with liberty and

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justice for all.

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>> Thank you.

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All right, the next thing is the open

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session. Uh this is a session that

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allows uh any member of the uh community

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uh that to come and comment uh up up

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front here at the podium. I ask you to

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keep your comments to three minutes um

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and identify where you're from uh and um

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uh what your name is. So, we do have

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some public hearing matters, though. So,

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I'm going to uh tell you what those are.

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We got the DADUs, the detached accessory

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dwelling unit. We have the S of a fee

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schedule amendments.

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Um, and it looks like uh I haven't

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missed any that that those are the

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public hearing. So, we'll hear from you

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more on those. If you're here to comment

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on those, you don't need to comment uh

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here in the uh open session. you could

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comment on those at that point in time.

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But outside of that, uh just please uh

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keep your comments three minutes,

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identify who you are, where you're from,

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microphone. Okay. Hello, [clears throat]

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I am Dr. Trent Larson from Centerville.

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Uh my question, first question is uh how

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do you make a small fortune with

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cryptocurrency?

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you start with a large fortune.

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But that being said, I do not please try

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and restrict crypto ATMs or

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cryptocurrency or other technologies

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qualifications. I have a computer

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science PhD from BYU. I also have a U of

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degree, so that I'm okay. I got a job

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working in cryptocurrency in 2014 for

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Medici Ventures. I wish I'd invested,

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but I'm still hustling for money because

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my family didn't believe in it as much

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as me. Let's talk benefits. At my

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cryptocurrency job, we applied crypto

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for the benefit of third world countries

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like Rwanda. I visited Zambia to see

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their insecure land rights and discuss

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how we could use tech to help them. I've

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paid rotary dues with cryptocurrency.

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I've used it at the bountiful farmers

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market. The plus seven local store down

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here takes Bitcoin. A local voluntarist

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group that I attend near here every

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Saturday provides breakfast with

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cryptocurrency. You all are invited.

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Did you know that there are many uses of

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crypto tokens, including ones intended

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to directly support lower incomes, not

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even meant for some of the speculation

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and trading for money? Do you know it

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provides a type of security that not

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even banks provide? This is integral to

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our future. There are downsides. So, I

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would never advise anyone to use a

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crypto ATM. The fees are too high. There

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are better ways. But I've used them

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because there were times when they were

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my best option. So almost all

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cryptocurrencies are scams. But as I've

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pointed out, there are many applications

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that are not available through any other

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means. ATMs simply a tool. And taking

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them doesn't remove the underlying scam,

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just moves it. So solutions. The way to

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protect ourselves and our family and

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neighbors and friends is empowerment,

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education, communication, and even

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exposure without stigma. I'm sorry for

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those who have lost and been scammed.

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I'm part of that group. But the fixes

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for these crimes are the same as fixes

273
00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:21,200
for other finance crimes. Education

274
00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:22,959
about patience, communication,

275
00:11:22,959 --> 00:11:25,839
curiosity, long-term thinking, the hard

276
00:11:25,839 --> 00:11:27,600
skills that involve interpersonal

277
00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:30,079
involvement and support. I hereby

278
00:11:30,079 --> 00:11:31,680
volunteer to help anyone understand

279
00:11:31,680 --> 00:11:34,079
more, including the risks, and even to

280
00:11:34,079 --> 00:11:35,519
help individuals and families with their

281
00:11:35,519 --> 00:11:37,760
own situation with free advice for

282
00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:39,920
voluntary efforts. I invite all

283
00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:41,920
listening to contact me as I have no

284
00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:44,880
shortage of facts and strong opinions.

285
00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:46,320
Maybe we can even find ways to make

286
00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:48,880
Centerville more of a tech hub. Uh Gina

287
00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:51,040
and the chief of police have my number.

288
00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:53,200
Don't ask why.

289
00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:55,519
So, you want to hear a joke? [sighs]

290
00:11:55,519 --> 00:11:57,839
Profits.

291
00:11:57,839 --> 00:11:59,680
Yeah, you may not get it, but I I don't

292
00:11:59,680 --> 00:12:01,680
get it either.

293
00:12:01,680 --> 00:12:05,279
Um but please stop with ideas from the

294
00:12:05,279 --> 00:12:07,760
nanny state. Uh, institutional force and

295
00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:09,920
stigma hurt more than they fix, causing

296
00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:12,480
ignorance, lost opportunity, and other

297
00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:14,720
unintended consequences. Tech

298
00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:17,279
restrictions hurt our future selves, old

299
00:12:17,279 --> 00:12:19,600
and young. Please do not use any city

300
00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:21,680
force to punish or limit technological

301
00:12:21,680 --> 00:12:24,320
and financial innovation and

302
00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:26,560
experimentation. Thank you very much.

303
00:12:26,560 --> 00:12:27,440
>> Thank you, Jan.

304
00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:29,680
>> Mr. Mayor, can I ask a question?

305
00:12:29,680 --> 00:12:32,079
>> Sure. is that I'm just curious with your

306
00:12:32,079 --> 00:12:33,760
background in cryptocurrency. I I

307
00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:35,040
understand that there are a lot of ways

308
00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,040
that you can exchange and and get

309
00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:39,680
cryptocurrency. Why protect kiosks and

310
00:12:39,680 --> 00:12:41,440
why aren't the other methods that are

311
00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:43,200
out there, why aren't those sufficient?

312
00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:45,279
Why are you advocating to to keep kiosks

313
00:12:45,279 --> 00:12:46,000
specifically?

314
00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:47,839
>> Good question. I was on my way to an

315
00:12:47,839 --> 00:12:50,160
event where I wanted to use some of the

316
00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,000
crypto and I didn't have the kind that I

317
00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:54,000
wanted. And so in that emergency

318
00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:57,120
situation, yes, I paid a premium for

319
00:12:57,120 --> 00:12:59,839
what I could get right there at the

320
00:12:59,839 --> 00:13:03,200
crypto ATM.

321
00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:04,000
>> Thank you.

322
00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:05,360
>> Okay. Thank you.

323
00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:12,870
>> Appreciate it, Trent. Others.

324
00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:14,800
» All right. See nobody, nobody online,

325
00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:18,160
right? See nobody else, we will uh move

326
00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:21,279
from the open session and we will go to

327
00:13:21,279 --> 00:13:24,800
our first business items. Uh this is an

328
00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:31,680
item uh uh that's um we've had uh Mike

329
00:13:31,680 --> 00:13:34,160
Egget involved with and Councilwoman

330
00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:36,720
Hirs has been quite involved with. So

331
00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:39,920
this is the South Davis Greenway

332
00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:42,959
feasibil feasibility study and report

333
00:13:42,959 --> 00:13:45,519
and I am grateful to those two that have

334
00:13:45,519 --> 00:13:48,000
been involved and if I'm missing anybody

335
00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:51,120
I apologize because it's been uh

336
00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:53,760
something uh that is of great interest

337
00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:57,920
to me but uh I haven't been able to find

338
00:13:57,920 --> 00:13:59,839
the time to be involved with it. So

339
00:13:59,839 --> 00:14:02,320
thank you Mike and Gina. So, we look

340
00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:04,959
forward to you give us more background

341
00:14:04,959 --> 00:14:07,040
besides what we have in our material.

342
00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:07,760
>> Yeah.

343
00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:08,720
>> Take it away, Mike.

344
00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:12,959
>> Thanks, Mayor. So, uh, as u, as

345
00:14:12,959 --> 00:14:15,279
referenced in the packet, I provided a

346
00:14:15,279 --> 00:14:17,600
whole history of where we started and

347
00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:19,680
how we ended up where we are today. I

348
00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:21,680
felt like that that was relevant because

349
00:14:21,680 --> 00:14:24,079
maybe not all council members know the

350
00:14:24,079 --> 00:14:25,680
history. Maybe not all council members

351
00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:27,519
know what some of the expenses or costs

352
00:14:27,519 --> 00:14:29,760
were when we started the project and

353
00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:32,639
what all has been involved in this. Um

354
00:14:32,639 --> 00:14:35,120
there's a lot. Yeah, you're welcome. Um

355
00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:38,240
so this this endeavor, the shared

356
00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:39,760
endeavor between communities started in

357
00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:42,079
May of 2025.

358
00:14:42,079 --> 00:14:43,839
um where we were approached by other

359
00:14:43,839 --> 00:14:46,720
neighboring South Davis communities and

360
00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:50,480
we brought uh a request of grant monies

361
00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:52,480
that are available through the WFRC

362
00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:54,720
transportation and land use connection

363
00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:57,279
um program to the council at that time.

364
00:14:57,279 --> 00:14:58,880
Each city concurrently did the same

365
00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:00,639
thing. Um there was a letter of

366
00:15:00,639 --> 00:15:02,160
concurrence and match agreement with

367
00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:05,279
WFRC uh uh signed and approved on July

368
00:15:05,279 --> 00:15:08,240
5th. Um, and the city's portion of

369
00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:10,880
contribution was was only $7,500. That

370
00:15:10,880 --> 00:15:12,480
was per each of the four cities that

371
00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:14,000
were participating, which is us, North

372
00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:16,000
Salt Lake, Bountiful, and Farmington.

373
00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:19,440
And then the TLC grant funded 115,000

374
00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:21,839
towards the entirety of the project. So,

375
00:15:21,839 --> 00:15:23,920
uh, it was a planning study that was,

376
00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,800
uh, fully almost completely funded by

377
00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:29,519
these TLC grant monies, which was, I

378
00:15:29,519 --> 00:15:31,920
thought, a great thing. Um throughout

379
00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:34,480
the month of of July and August, we

380
00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:36,480
worked through the selection committee

381
00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:38,800
process to screen applicants who had

382
00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:40,639
applied for it. We had four interested

383
00:15:40,639 --> 00:15:43,120
parties who applied. Um there were two

384
00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:44,959
finalists. We asked them to come back,

385
00:15:44,959 --> 00:15:47,519
did some interviews and ultimately

386
00:15:47,519 --> 00:15:49,120
selected Kimberly Horn as the

387
00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:51,199
representative entity for the project.

388
00:15:51,199 --> 00:15:54,560
Um we did some amendments of their final

389
00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:57,759
um scope of work document in August and

390
00:15:57,759 --> 00:16:01,279
we went with Kimly Horn as a group in in

391
00:16:01,279 --> 00:16:03,759
working forward on this project. Um the

392
00:16:03,759 --> 00:16:05,680
project actually started in midepptember

393
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:10,240
of 2025 wherein we had a um group

394
00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:13,440
steering committee of planning staff and

395
00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:15,440
WFRC representatives and then obviously

396
00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:17,519
the Kimley Horn team and we met once a

397
00:16:17,519 --> 00:16:19,839
month at that time. Um, from that time

398
00:16:19,839 --> 00:16:23,759
forward, we um discussed ways to gather

399
00:16:23,759 --> 00:16:25,440
the city together, all the

400
00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:27,680
representatives of the city, and what

401
00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:29,199
would be in the best interest of having

402
00:16:29,199 --> 00:16:31,199
that reflected as part of this. And and

403
00:16:31,199 --> 00:16:33,440
what was decided was about six members

404
00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:35,759
per city would be in the best interest

405
00:16:35,759 --> 00:16:38,880
to to hear from all collective voices of

406
00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:40,160
each of the communities as well as

407
00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:45,199
inviting uh UD do and um Davis County to

408
00:16:45,199 --> 00:16:47,199
be a part of it. And the reason for that

409
00:16:47,199 --> 00:16:49,040
is sometimes you do Davis County have

410
00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:51,519
ideas and opportunities for grant

411
00:16:51,519 --> 00:16:54,399
funding and other partnershiping uh for

412
00:16:54,399 --> 00:16:56,639
next steps as well as aligning their

413
00:16:56,639 --> 00:16:58,560
voice to be part of the process and and

414
00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:01,120
clearly we have a major project with UD

415
00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:03,199
do that is affecting Centerville and

416
00:17:03,199 --> 00:17:04,799
other communities that that made it even

417
00:17:04,799 --> 00:17:06,240
more pertinent to have be part of this

418
00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:09,120
conversation. So, uh, the the

419
00:17:09,120 --> 00:17:11,520
representation from Centerville City

420
00:17:11,520 --> 00:17:13,919
proper was as noted by the mayor,

421
00:17:13,919 --> 00:17:15,600
Council Member Hurst, uh, planning

422
00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:18,079
commissioner Gary Woodward, uh, Kevin

423
00:17:18,079 --> 00:17:20,400
Campbell, myself, Sydney Dwise, and then

424
00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:22,480
Mitsy White from the trail committee.

425
00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:25,120
Um, and that the first project

426
00:17:25,120 --> 00:17:26,799
management team started on November

427
00:17:26,799 --> 00:17:30,240
10th, 2025. And we met once about once

428
00:17:30,240 --> 00:17:32,000
every two months. I said two weeks,

429
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:33,600
that's a typo. It should be once every

430
00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:35,840
two months. So, I apologize for that.

431
00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:37,280
And then the steering committee we met

432
00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:39,440
once every month u to can you forward

433
00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:41,760
with that program as we rolled it out

434
00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:43,679
and there was a lot of discussions about

435
00:17:43,679 --> 00:17:44,880
what is the best route for each

436
00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:46,320
community. How do you connect to all the

437
00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:48,080
communities? What kind of utility

438
00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:49,039
impacts are there? What kind of

439
00:17:49,039 --> 00:17:50,320
residential impacts? What kind of

440
00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:52,320
residential benefits are provided? Are

441
00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:54,880
there ways to get uh UD do funding to be

442
00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:56,799
in play? All sorts of things. What kind

443
00:17:56,799 --> 00:17:58,240
of grant opportunities will there be

444
00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:00,559
down the road? as you look at obviously

445
00:18:00,559 --> 00:18:03,280
the the way up in the sky, way up in

446
00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:05,760
space vision of what this might look

447
00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:07,760
like. Um, and so that would be the first

448
00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:10,480
phase of the project. And one of the big

449
00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:12,160
key elements of that discussion clearly

450
00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:16,480
was the public involvement because there are residential properties and

451
00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:18,240
business properties along whatever route

452
00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:20,720
you select that will be either benefited

453
00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:22,720
or maybe even feel impacted depending on

454
00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:24,480
the perspective of each and every

455
00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:26,480
property owner throughout this process.

456
00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:29,120
So, um there were three uh public

457
00:18:29,120 --> 00:18:31,919
outreach efforts that were um decided

458
00:18:31,919 --> 00:18:34,240
upon and and selected as part of the the

459
00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,559
processing. The first was in January of

460
00:18:36,559 --> 00:18:40,160
2026. There were was uh large poster set

461
00:18:40,160 --> 00:18:42,400
up at the South Davis Recreation Center

462
00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:44,960
and there were ground decals set um in

463
00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:46,880
front of key locations. Our two

464
00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:48,720
locations were Centerville Community

465
00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:51,600
Park and then um in front of the public

466
00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:53,039
library. There was also, I think, a

467
00:18:53,039 --> 00:18:54,160
poster post in front of the public

468
00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:56,400
library for a while that directed people

469
00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:59,039
to go to the the website which is south

470
00:18:59,039 --> 00:19:01,440
daves greenway.org as well as there were

471
00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:03,679
videos that were produced that had

472
00:19:03,679 --> 00:19:05,520
represents from each community be a part

473
00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:06,880
of those videos and they were posted on

474
00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:08,480
the website if you remember back in I

475
00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:10,080
think it was January February we we

476
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,039
shared a clip of that and council member

477
00:19:13,039 --> 00:19:14,960
Hurst was our representative in that

478
00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:18,400
video. Um, in midFebruary, we sent out

479
00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:20,240
flyers to all the property owners that

480
00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:22,880
were along the trail greenway route to

481
00:19:22,880 --> 00:19:24,240
make sure they were fully notified and

482
00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:26,240
directed to go to the website. On the

483
00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:28,320
website, there were um opportunities to

484
00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:30,400
share comments and comments were

485
00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:32,720
starting to come in as well as our

486
00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:35,039
communications team did also direct

487
00:19:35,039 --> 00:19:36,880
people to the website who had just

488
00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,679
general interest from the community. Um

489
00:19:39,679 --> 00:19:43,200
and then as the um as the study

490
00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:45,440
continued forward and we contin have the

491
00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:48,640
meetings and um we got closer and closer

492
00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:50,799
to completion of the feasibility study,

493
00:19:50,799 --> 00:19:52,720
the discussion was that there needed to

494
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:54,799
be the final public event. And so public

495
00:19:54,799 --> 00:19:56,640
event flyers were were sent out for an

496
00:19:56,640 --> 00:20:00,160
outdoor openhouse event including a I

497
00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:01,919
guess you would call it a a mock or an

498
00:20:01,919 --> 00:20:04,320
exemplar of what a greenway area might

499
00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:06,480
look like. and that was held at the

500
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:09,919
South Davis Recreation Center area

501
00:20:09,919 --> 00:20:11,679
park during the Bountiful concert night

502
00:20:11,679 --> 00:20:14,960
event. Um, we did have and that was held

503
00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:17,919
on June 26th of this year. We did have

504
00:20:17,919 --> 00:20:20,160
residents from Centerville show up. Uh,

505
00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:21,600
there was a large group of residents

506
00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:23,919
which I had heard probably a week or two

507
00:20:23,919 --> 00:20:26,480
before some concern that were along

508
00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:30,080
Chase Lane that it indicated just what

509
00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:31,919
are the impacts? How do we voice our

510
00:20:31,919 --> 00:20:35,120
opinions? um some strong feelings were

511
00:20:35,120 --> 00:20:38,480
directed um and shared and uh both prior

512
00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:40,480
and then during the event as well as

513
00:20:40,480 --> 00:20:42,080
residents who were in support of it not

514
00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:43,440
on Chase Lane. There were residents

515
00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:44,880
along the route itself that were

516
00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:46,799
actually in favor. There was a a

517
00:20:46,799 --> 00:20:51,039
resident just off of the route um in um

518
00:20:51,039 --> 00:20:52,880
the the historical district that had

519
00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:55,360
come and and he was a biker and he was

520
00:20:55,360 --> 00:20:57,600
very supportive. So there was there was

521
00:20:57,600 --> 00:20:59,600
some mixed commentary even in favor and

522
00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:01,520
against um and their comments were

523
00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:04,000
shared and and left there. And then

524
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,880
following that um council member Hurst

525
00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:09,039
had had quite a bit of communication

526
00:21:09,039 --> 00:21:12,080
into uh the month of July with the

527
00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:14,720
residents along the route um and was

528
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:17,919
seeking to hold a meeting. Um we we held

529
00:21:17,919 --> 00:21:19,679
a meeting with them on August 13th which

530
00:21:19,679 --> 00:21:20,880
happened to be the same day that the

531
00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:22,640
final draft of the feasibility study was

532
00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:25,039
completed and the meeting went very

533
00:21:25,039 --> 00:21:26,720
well. There were some misconceptions

534
00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:28,799
that were being established prior to

535
00:21:28,799 --> 00:21:30,559
that meeting that I think we we

536
00:21:30,559 --> 00:21:33,440
clarified as well as we heard the input

537
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:35,600
and and the route actually was moved

538
00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:37,200
from the south side impacting their

539
00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:40,000
properties to the north side um in order

540
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:41,840
to not impact their properties which the

541
00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:43,520
residents were pretty pretty favorable

542
00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:45,600
to. And so

543
00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:47,600
>> Mike, was that the only residence that

544
00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:49,120
showed was on the one road?

545
00:21:49,120 --> 00:21:50,640
>> It was only the Chase Bank residence

546
00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:52,240
that I I called. There might have been

547
00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:54,400
one one from 400 West. I think there was

548
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:57,120
one that lived on 400 West, but

549
00:21:57,120 --> 00:21:57,840
>> I think she

550
00:21:57,840 --> 00:21:59,600
>> for the most part, the people that have

551
00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:03,919
reached out to me from 400 West are

552
00:22:03,919 --> 00:22:05,760
>> there there have been a couple of

553
00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,280
questions about it, but for the most

554
00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:08,880
part very supportive.

555
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:09,520
>> Same with me.

556
00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:10,960
>> You know, how is it going to impact

557
00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:13,120
park? One of the things about this is

558
00:22:13,120 --> 00:22:15,360
that it would limit parking on one side

559
00:22:15,360 --> 00:22:16,400
of the road.

560
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:17,919
>> So,

561
00:22:17,919 --> 00:22:20,880
>> that I think has been somewhat of the

562
00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:24,720
concern. Um, and I think I think Chase

563
00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:28,960
Lane is um they mainly why we held the

564
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,039
meeting as August is I wanted to make

565
00:22:31,039 --> 00:22:34,799
sure that sometimes this gets like this

566
00:22:34,799 --> 00:22:37,039
is a study. There's no funding for it at

567
00:22:37,039 --> 00:22:39,919
the moment. As we move towards potential

568
00:22:39,919 --> 00:22:42,480
funding, I just wanted their concerns

569
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:44,400
documented. They were thoughtfully

570
00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:46,240
engaged in the process and they had a

571
00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:48,080
lot of really good questions

572
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:50,000
>> and I didn't want that to get lost. I

573
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:52,159
may not be on city council when it comes

574
00:22:52,159 --> 00:22:55,200
back to actually, you know, become a a

575
00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:58,400
project if it does. And so mainly we

576
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:00,320
were trying to make sure that they're we

577
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:03,120
recorded the meeting so that Jennifer

578
00:23:03,120 --> 00:23:06,000
has that in the documentation and I just

579
00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:07,440
wanted to make sure that they felt like

580
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:10,080
they had that they hadn't made all this

581
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:13,760
effort and then it just fell flat. I

582
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:17,120
will say this, it is a study. So this is

583
00:23:17,120 --> 00:23:19,919
so conceptual like there are so much

584
00:23:19,919 --> 00:23:22,320
road to ho before

585
00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:24,720
um we would know exactly where an

586
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:27,120
alignment could go for this trail. I

587
00:23:27,120 --> 00:23:30,799
think um I think the frontage road is

588
00:23:30,799 --> 00:23:33,280
likely the does it say that's phase

589
00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:34,640
zero?

590
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:35,840
>> It it's in the it's

591
00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:37,600
>> Yeah, it's on page if you guys look on

592
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:39,440
page 3.

593
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:40,799
>> Yeah, it's in the finding document

594
00:23:40,799 --> 00:23:44,240
itself. It's on 38, I believe. Page 38,

595
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:47,600
it shows you kind of the kind of the

596
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,480
timing of and um and then the page just

597
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:52,480
below it is the estimated probable

598
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:54,799
construction cost. These are the types

599
00:23:54,799 --> 00:23:57,280
of information you need to have to go

600
00:23:57,280 --> 00:24:00,000
and start looking for funding and and

601
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:01,600
you know, there would have to be a

602
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:04,640
pretty detailed engineering plan that

603
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:06,960
would, you know, identify right of way

604
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:08,640
and there's power poles that would have

605
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:10,799
to be moved. It's there's a there's a

606
00:24:10,799 --> 00:24:12,960
lot of things that need to still happen.

607
00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:13,279
So

608
00:24:13,279 --> 00:24:14,960
>> that's why the said this is from space

609
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:15,679
level.

610
00:24:15,679 --> 00:24:18,960
>> Yeah. So, so the way it started is is we

611
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:21,120
would go and meet together and they

612
00:24:21,120 --> 00:24:22,559
they'd meet with us for a few minutes

613
00:24:22,559 --> 00:24:24,640
and then they would roll these big long

614
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:26,880
maps out that were, you know, entire

615
00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:29,679
length of our city and we would go in

616
00:24:29,679 --> 00:24:32,000
and identify, you know, Kevin Campbell

617
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:34,720
was there. Obviously, Mike and Sydney

618
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:36,880
were there and we just kind of were

619
00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:40,799
trying to figure out a really high

620
00:24:40,799 --> 00:24:42,640
level, you know, which side of the road

621
00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:44,960
should it go on. Um, one of the reasons

622
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:46,720
the frontage road was selected is

623
00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:48,960
because, um, we knew that UD do was

624
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:51,440
going to be doing some

625
00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:53,279
improvements right there anyway, and

626
00:24:53,279 --> 00:24:56,240
that's was a way to, you know, hopefully

627
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,880
save some tax dollars for to be used

628
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:02,080
somewhere else at some point. Um, and we

629
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:04,159
weren't the only ones. Farmington jumped

630
00:25:04,159 --> 00:25:05,440
right on that, too. So, it was

631
00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:06,640
interesting. We'd meet separately and

632
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:09,840
then we'd come back together and try to

633
00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:13,600
identify what worked best. um especially

634
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:15,600
where we connect with Farmington and

635
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:18,640
Bountiful. So anyway, it's not it's not

636
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:20,799
a done deal. This doesn't mean that it's

637
00:25:20,799 --> 00:25:22,640
set for one side or the other. We just

638
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,440
tried to look at it, but there's a lot

639
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:28,000
to be done before an actual alignment

640
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:31,279
would be completely set up. And

641
00:25:31,279 --> 00:25:32,640
>> yeah, and to be clear, there's no

642
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:35,520
funding, but this the the last document

643
00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:37,600
in the packet is the actual Greenway

644
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:39,919
feasibility study letter of support. If

645
00:25:39,919 --> 00:25:41,600
the council were in favor of accepting

646
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:43,120
the study, then that would authorize the

647
00:25:43,120 --> 00:25:46,240
mayor to sign that. That being signed is

648
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:47,679
important because then we can provide it

649
00:25:47,679 --> 00:25:49,760
to the Utah State Utah Trail Network

650
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,720
system and pursue grant grant funding.

651
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:54,480
And that's a large pod of money. I can't

652
00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:56,159
remember. Nick, you might have to help

653
00:25:56,159 --> 00:25:57,760
me on this, but I think it's like 10

654
00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:00,320
million a year. That sound right?

655
00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:00,960
>> 50 million.

656
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:02,080
a year.

657
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:03,120
>> I say I thought it was

658
00:26:03,120 --> 00:26:04,720
>> 50 million a year. So, it's quite a big

659
00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:06,640
bank. Yeah. which is kind of what

660
00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:09,039
precipitated that it was talked about

661
00:26:09,039 --> 00:26:12,320
doing this regional type urban trail.

662
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,679
This is this is to help people

663
00:26:15,679 --> 00:26:18,880
um that maybe don't drive but need to

664
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:21,440
get to, you know, very specifically

665
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:23,679
locations were picked throughout cities

666
00:26:23,679 --> 00:26:27,600
that included parks, um the library,

667
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:28,799
like you'll notice

668
00:26:28,799 --> 00:26:29,679
>> schools.

669
00:26:29,679 --> 00:26:31,840
>> Yeah. But it really is a backbone, too.

670
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:33,919
It's not meant to go through the whole

671
00:26:33,919 --> 00:26:37,039
city. It's just meant to be a spine

672
00:26:37,039 --> 00:26:39,360
that then we can add. You know, I'm

673
00:26:39,360 --> 00:26:42,400
thinking of the little path that we just

674
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:44,720
got approved with county funding. Um,

675
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:45,440
Porter Lane.

676
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:46,960
>> Yeah, that's a good Yeah, West.

677
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:49,840
>> That's already one leg off of this

678
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:51,440
potential.

679
00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:53,919
Um anyway, I've had a lot of people

680
00:26:53,919 --> 00:26:56,000
reach out and be supportive and I think

681
00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:58,480
we, you know, in addition to that, which

682
00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:00,080
was surprising to me at this early

683
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:02,240
stage, but also in addition, we did try

684
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:05,039
to make sure that we ran a fairly

685
00:27:05,039 --> 00:27:06,880
aggressive make sure we collect and

686
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:09,279
document concerns for future

687
00:27:09,279 --> 00:27:11,120
>> and their comments again on Chase Lane

688
00:27:11,120 --> 00:27:13,440
did affect what alternate alignment was

689
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,080
selected for Chase Lane. So the there

690
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:18,240
was public commentary that guided a

691
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:20,159
change, an alteration that was accepted

692
00:27:20,159 --> 00:27:22,080
and and became part of the final draft

693
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:23,200
you have in your packet.

694
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:24,720
>> Were any of the people on the other side

695
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:26,720
of the road at the meeting?

696
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:28,080
>> There was only there only

697
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:29,520
>> there's one gentleman that was there

698
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:32,799
that lives on the north side. He did not

699
00:27:32,799 --> 00:27:34,960
say a whole lot. So I and I'm not sure

700
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,679
who he was. He didn't he came in late. I

701
00:27:37,679 --> 00:27:39,200
don't think we ended up catching his

702
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:40,159
name. And then

703
00:27:40,159 --> 00:27:41,760
>> I don't know. He said

704
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:43,600
>> um and the and the reason I know he

705
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:44,960
lives on the other side of the street is

706
00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:46,799
I've walked past and seen him in his

707
00:27:46,799 --> 00:27:48,799
yard. So that's how I know he's on the

708
00:27:48,799 --> 00:27:50,960
other side. But the others were on the

709
00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:52,720
south side of the street.

710
00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:54,960
>> There are four homes on the north side

711
00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:57,200
and 10 or 11 homes on the south side,

712
00:27:57,200 --> 00:27:59,120
too. So

713
00:27:59,120 --> 00:28:01,520
>> um but I know uh the resident that was

714
00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:02,559
kind of taking up the charge of

715
00:28:02,559 --> 00:28:04,559
informing did inform pretty much

716
00:28:04,559 --> 00:28:06,320
everybody up and down Chase Lane and

717
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:08,320
>> and quite a bit of 400 West. Yeah, she

718
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:09,919
did. I mean, I don't I don't know how

719
00:28:09,919 --> 00:28:12,399
far she went along 400 West, but I

720
00:28:12,399 --> 00:28:15,840
suspect she said she had sent the flyer

721
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:17,440
out to several people.

722
00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:19,360
>> Mike, I am supportive of this and I

723
00:28:19,360 --> 00:28:20,880
really appreciate cities for being

724
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:22,960
proactive from a planning perspective.

725
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:25,360
This is exactly what I want cities to do

726
00:28:25,360 --> 00:28:27,760
when thinking about planning. This is,

727
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,480
and this is like going to be off a

728
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:32,000
little ways. I just I was honestly

729
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:33,279
curious as I was looking at the

730
00:28:33,279 --> 00:28:34,799
PowerPoint presentation and it was

731
00:28:34,799 --> 00:28:36,559
breaking down the cost by phase and

732
00:28:36,559 --> 00:28:38,799
jurisdiction. It it's slated that it

733
00:28:38,799 --> 00:28:40,799
would cost in 2026 dollars, right?

734
00:28:40,799 --> 00:28:42,799
Centerville about 10 million, North Salt

735
00:28:42,799 --> 00:28:44,799
Lake 9 million, Bountiful 22 million,

736
00:28:44,799 --> 00:28:47,520
and Farmington 1.3 million. Why are they

737
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:48,240
so much?

738
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:51,600
>> Because their their route is very

739
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:54,480
non-impactful. They they actually go

740
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:56,640
along a street into a trail system they

741
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:57,760
already have.

742
00:28:57,760 --> 00:28:59,840
>> That's off of I don't know what the

743
00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:01,919
north or the east west road is there,

744
00:29:01,919 --> 00:29:03,600
but when you go past the junior high and

745
00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:05,360
you go to the intersection, their trail

746
00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:07,520
would continue north down to a river

747
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,760
trail that's already there. Continue

748
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:11,919
along and then go along the front of of

749
00:29:11,919 --> 00:29:14,240
Lagoon and work its way over to Smith

750
00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:16,159
along unimproved areas.

751
00:29:16,159 --> 00:29:18,080
>> But well, since we're while we're on

752
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,000
that, Were you done? I'm sorry.

753
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:22,240
>> Yes, I'm good. I I don't want to cut in

754
00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,159
your presentation to Are you Did you

755
00:29:24,159 --> 00:29:24,640
have more?

756
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:26,240
>> I was just going to say I I I know we

757
00:29:26,240 --> 00:29:28,320
have a presenter. So, I think I provided

758
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:29,600
all I need to, Mayor.

759
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:30,480
>> Oh, okay.

760
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:32,159
>> Oh, I'm sorry if I put carpet.

761
00:29:32,159 --> 00:29:33,600
>> No, it's okay.

762
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:37,840
>> So, uh do do we have a presenter

763
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:39,520
parks with Kimney Horn is actually here

764
00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:41,279
for the slide show and I might have

765
00:29:41,279 --> 00:29:42,720
covered a lot of what he would have

766
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:43,919
covered, but I

767
00:29:43,919 --> 00:29:45,279
>> I probably did, too. So,

768
00:29:45,279 --> 00:29:46,799
>> I wanted to be very comprehensive

769
00:29:46,799 --> 00:29:48,080
because I think there's a lot here to

770
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:50,159
unpack. So, I appreciate you indulging

771
00:29:50,159 --> 00:29:52,000
me, but if you're welcome or if you're

772
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:53,919
open to it, mayor, I'd have Mr. Parks

773
00:29:53,919 --> 00:29:54,480
take over.

774
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:56,480
>> Nobody get with ties gets respects

775
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,840
anymore, you know. Thanks for coming.

776
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:01,200
>> Go, take it away.

777
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:06,950
>> Thanks for having me.

778
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:09,120
» So, I'm I'm Nick Parks. I'm a civil

779
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:10,720
engineer and I had the privilege of

780
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:12,559
working on this project throughout it

781
00:30:12,559 --> 00:30:14,960
since last September. Um I work for

782
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:18,480
Kimley Horn and um yeah so I wanted to

783
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:20,399
give an overview of the project. I know

784
00:30:20,399 --> 00:30:25,990
Mike did a great job going through

785
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:27,760
um there's a lot of collaboration

786
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:31,200
obviously between the the four cities

787
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:34,720
and um we have the legacy parkway trail

788
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:36,640
to the west of I15. So, this was filling

789
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:40,571
a gap on the east side of I-15.

790
00:30:40,571 --> 00:30:42,399
[clears throat] And we really wanted to

791
00:30:42,399 --> 00:30:44,640
establish a route, an alignment, cost

792
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:46,880
estimate, and to set it up for the Utah

793
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:49,200
Trail Network funding um and your

794
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:55,750
acceptance of that.

795
00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:57,760
» Many of you all might know by now a

796
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:00,559
greenway, another name for a shared use

797
00:31:00,559 --> 00:31:03,440
path. um popular for recreating,

798
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:06,320
commuting, um improving quality of life

799
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:08,399
in your in your local community. It's

800
00:31:08,399 --> 00:31:11,600
supposed to be low stress, high comfort

801
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:14,960
facility. That was the goal. Separated

802
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:20,320
from traffic, we aimed to have a four to six foot buffer pretty much

803
00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:23,039
along the entire stretch. Um unless it

804
00:31:23,039 --> 00:31:29,110
was a really constrained area.

805
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:31,039
These are two examples. The nine line in

806
00:31:31,039 --> 00:31:32,559
Salt Lake City if you're familiar and

807
00:31:32,559 --> 00:31:36,399
then in Provo um along State Street. And

808
00:31:36,399 --> 00:31:39,279
I like these examples because

809
00:31:39,279 --> 00:31:42,240
for example, lots of driveways along it.

810
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:44,399
And that is something that comes up um

811
00:31:44,399 --> 00:31:46,399
through Centerville, through Bountiful,

812
00:31:46,399 --> 00:31:48,640
really the whole the whole way up to

813
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:52,799
Farmington. And um Neline is kind of a

814
00:31:52,799 --> 00:31:56,320
demonstration of it. It does work. And

815
00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:59,919
then in on State Street in Provo with

816
00:31:59,919 --> 00:32:03,039
all the utility lines and dodging

817
00:32:03,039 --> 00:32:05,360
utilities down State Street, I think is

818
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:07,760
another example of of being able to make

819
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:11,200
a shared use path like this work.

820
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,360
>> Do you take any private property to do

821
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:14,960
this?

822
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:18,399
>> Um, we tried to avoid private property

823
00:32:18,399 --> 00:32:22,000
throughout the corridor. Um, so there

824
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,480
were no right-of-way impacts uh through

825
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:27,360
Centerville. There there are two two

826
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:29,120
potential well they would be private

827
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:33,519
property uh impacts to um Chipotle and

828
00:32:33,519 --> 00:32:35,919
um I can't think of

829
00:32:35,919 --> 00:32:37,600
>> oh there's a quick

830
00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:41,200
>> quick and then colonial lumber or be

831
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:43,360
there could be slight frontage impacts

832
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:44,960
and the reason for that is we originally

833
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:48,480
had it on the west side but because of

834
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:50,159
the just the wid brand new widening

835
00:32:50,159 --> 00:32:52,240
project it didn't make sense to then go

836
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:54,799
and take back the real estate that that

837
00:32:54,799 --> 00:32:58,799
we had expanded for the fourth west uh

838
00:32:58,799 --> 00:33:00,880
parish lane

839
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:02,880
I guess I don't want to call interchange

840
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:06,320
what's a transition anyway and so Kevin

841
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:08,000
actually recommended that we move it to

842
00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:11,200
the east on that side and try to not

843
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:12,720
impact those properties as much as

844
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:14,960
possible and then go to the crosswalk

845
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:19,279
towards the the theater um so that we

846
00:33:19,279 --> 00:33:20,799
don't impact the intersection all those

847
00:33:20,799 --> 00:33:22,000
improvements that had been done just

848
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:24,080
recently

849
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:27,190
So

850
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:29,440
» continue, Nick. I want uh

851
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:30,640
>> I want you to be able to get through

852
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:31,279
your presence.

853
00:33:31,279 --> 00:33:31,919
>> Sorry.

854
00:33:31,919 --> 00:33:34,080
>> Yes. And we cross back. So yeah, we're

855
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:35,919
along the east side and cross back. I

856
00:33:35,919 --> 00:33:37,200
think there's a pedestrian hybrid

857
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,760
beacon. There is there cross back to the

858
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:40,880
west side,

859
00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:43,519
>> but I want qu question from council, but

860
00:33:43,519 --> 00:33:44,799
I want him to be able to get through

861
00:33:44,799 --> 00:33:48,320
this as well, too. So

862
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:50,399
>> carrying on, this is the alignment the

863
00:33:50,399 --> 00:33:52,799
entire way um from North Salt Lake to

864
00:33:52,799 --> 00:33:54,799
Farmington. And you can see the

865
00:33:54,799 --> 00:33:57,919
Centerville segment is about 3.2 miles,

866
00:33:57,919 --> 00:34:00,159
but a good portion of that is part of

867
00:34:00,159 --> 00:34:03,360
the I-15 widening. Um it'll be taken

868
00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:05,360
care of in theory as part of that

869
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:07,600
project, which would be very nice. Um

870
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:11,599
for pocketbooks and uh the funding, if

871
00:34:11,599 --> 00:34:13,119
you haven't been to the website, I know

872
00:34:13,119 --> 00:34:16,800
Mike also plugged it. Um it's it's a

873
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:18,960
nice spot to check out um with Ariel

874
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:20,480
kind of which side of the road and where

875
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:26,389
the crossings are. Um if you're curious,

876
00:34:26,399 --> 00:34:28,879
this is the widening project that we've

877
00:34:28,879 --> 00:34:32,000
addressed. Um

878
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,960
I think I'll I'll move on.

879
00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:38,079
There are two cross sections mainly and

880
00:34:38,079 --> 00:34:40,000
I know this is something that came up at

881
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:41,520
our public involvement events is

882
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:44,480
parking. And so one of the crosssections

883
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:48,159
we have um to the north and the very um

884
00:34:48,159 --> 00:34:52,480
south of our our centerville segment is

885
00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:54,480
two lanes with on street parking on one

886
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:56,320
side of the road and then on the

887
00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:57,680
opposite side of the road would be the

888
00:34:57,680 --> 00:34:59,839
trail um that's buffered from the

889
00:34:59,839 --> 00:35:02,320
roadway. And I think it's important to

890
00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:05,760
note that um we're only trying to impact

891
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:08,160
one side of the roadway just to limit

892
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:10,880
impact. So, one side would stay as

893
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:12,560
existing and the other side would be

894
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:17,990
improved by this greenway.

895
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:20,000
The other cross-section

896
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:21,440
um like we were just talking about with

897
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:25,920
Mike is 400 South to Parish. Um

898
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:29,920
this is where we have three lanes and there's quite a bit of center

899
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:31,599
two-way left turn lane throughout this

900
00:35:31,599 --> 00:35:38,230
section um with no parking.

901
00:35:38,240 --> 00:35:40,079
This is a nice visual. Gives you an idea

902
00:35:40,079 --> 00:35:42,320
as to what they could potentially look

903
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:46,079
like. We had a few of these at the

904
00:35:46,079 --> 00:35:51,510
public open house.

905
00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:53,040
One of the main considerations through

906
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:56,240
Centerville are all the utility poles.

907
00:35:56,240 --> 00:35:57,599
Um so there would be have to be

908
00:35:57,599 --> 00:35:59,760
relocations or undergrounding is what we

909
00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:02,880
accounted for in the cost estimates. And

910
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:06,400
so those are all those um teal

911
00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:09,119
uh sorry magenta dots

912
00:36:09,119 --> 00:36:12,000
>> and then all the teal dots are driveway

913
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:14,720
tie-ins. Um and there are a lot of

914
00:36:14,720 --> 00:36:17,440
driveways along the corridor.

915
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:19,680
I also didn't we didn't draw in all the

916
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:21,920
minor streets. So the dark blue dots

917
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:23,599
that you see in the plans are all the

918
00:36:23,599 --> 00:36:29,589
minor street tieins.

919
00:36:29,599 --> 00:36:33,119
Passes the community library. Um parks.

920
00:36:33,119 --> 00:36:35,280
That was the idea of the alignment being

921
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:36,800
um on certain side of the road to

922
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:39,119
address, you know, access to these

923
00:36:39,119 --> 00:36:43,750
destinations.

924
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:45,680
This is where we have the right ofway

925
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,200
impacts to Chipotle and Quickquack.

926
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:51,200
And then yes, the colonial building

927
00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:57,109
sign,

928
00:36:57,119 --> 00:37:00,480
some more driveways. And then this is

929
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:04,079
where um to the north side of Chase Lane

930
00:37:04,079 --> 00:37:07,040
is where the trail got relocated to we

931
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:08,960
talked about earlier. And then we

932
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:20,550
connect to the I-15 widening project.

933
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:22,160
talked about earlier, public outreach

934
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:24,000
was a big part of this project and

935
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:26,320
getting the thoughts and comments back

936
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:28,640
from the public and giving them a sense

937
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:31,280
of what it it could feel like. Um, so

938
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:33,359
getting them out there, seeing the

939
00:37:33,359 --> 00:37:36,079
buffer, seeing how much space there

940
00:37:36,079 --> 00:37:38,000
would be with a with a 12oot trail out

941
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:39,599
there and the comfort that would provide

942
00:37:39,599 --> 00:37:44,790
them.

943
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:47,599
And then phasing. So yeah, the I215 or

944
00:37:47,599 --> 00:37:49,599
I-15 widening project would be part of

945
00:37:49,599 --> 00:37:54,800
phase zero and um followed up by the

946
00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,440
phase one in North Salt Lake and then

947
00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:00,640
phase two would be um your section in

948
00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:03,839
Centerville before finishing out phase

949
00:38:03,839 --> 00:38:06,880
three um in DAL.

950
00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:09,599
>> How's that order determined?

951
00:38:09,599 --> 00:38:12,640
It was determined we we started with the

952
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:15,920
I-15 widening as kind of like the base

953
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:19,200
and then um they're also doing a Beck

954
00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:21,920
Street trail that's connecting from

955
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:25,119
North Salt Lake to Salt Lake City. Um so

956
00:38:25,119 --> 00:38:27,200
that's all the way to the south. And so

957
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:29,839
the idea there was to pick up from that

958
00:38:29,839 --> 00:38:32,320
new Beck Street Trail and continue it

959
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:34,000
north

960
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:37,680
and then um

961
00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:41,359
tie into the I-15 widening project and

962
00:38:41,359 --> 00:38:45,200
carry it south. Um so basically work our

963
00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:47,280
way off of the widening project to

964
00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:52,390
either end. Make sense?

965
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:56,880
Also from a standpoint of future funding and

966
00:38:56,880 --> 00:38:59,119
implementation,

967
00:38:59,119 --> 00:39:02,240
if you leave a gap like that, you know,

968
00:39:02,240 --> 00:39:04,400
it's very necessary to close the gap.

969
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:07,040
So, um I I think it helps the argument

970
00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:09,359
to work kind of from either end and work

971
00:39:09,359 --> 00:39:15,910
your way towards the middle. Yeah.

972
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:20,000
The cost um yeah, $10 million, but not

973
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,800
out of Centerville's pocket. Um, so

974
00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:25,599
there's funding opportunities for that

975
00:39:25,599 --> 00:39:27,760
and and not to get sticker shock by the

976
00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:30,320
10 million. That would come all in one

977
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:32,160
phase.

978
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:34,240
>> And you said that included some of the

979
00:39:34,240 --> 00:39:36,720
utilities uh being placed underground.

980
00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:38,320
That number right there.

981
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:41,359
>> Yeah, that would include undergrounding

982
00:39:41,359 --> 00:39:42,640
>> thoughts [clears throat] that you had on

983
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:43,920
400 West.

984
00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:47,599
>> Yeah. and any drainage improvements,

985
00:39:47,599 --> 00:39:51,040
um new inlets, bringing manholes,

986
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:54,400
everything to grade, lighting, um

987
00:39:54,400 --> 00:39:56,000
lighting

988
00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:58,320
considered this is also a design and

989
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:08,950
construction cost. So combined

990
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:10,480
funding sources like we talked about

991
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:13,119
Utah trail network is really really the

992
00:40:13,119 --> 00:40:16,240
goal here. Um the rest of these are

993
00:40:16,240 --> 00:40:19,040
secondary sources and definitely

994
00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:22,320
feasible options to pursue if we don't

995
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:25,520
get Utah trail network funding. Um but

996
00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:28,320
that is the priority priority and uh

997
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:35,750
what we're seeking today

998
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:39,520
and yeah

999
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:41,280
acceptance is not a commitment of funds

1000
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:44,960
that is very important. So um just want

1001
00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:48,079
to provide options for the future that's

1002
00:40:48,079 --> 00:40:49,040
thank you.

1003
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:52,400
>> Thank you. Can we ask questions yet?

1004
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:53,839
>> You guys,

1005
00:40:53,839 --> 00:40:55,920
>> huh? a little but

1006
00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:58,640
>> no can can we are you guys done

1007
00:40:58,640 --> 00:40:59,119
presenting

1008
00:40:59,119 --> 00:41:01,599
>> oh yes that is the good

1009
00:41:01,599 --> 00:41:04,640
>> uh okay a couple things I saw 10.1

1010
00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:07,359
million on I left 11.8 8 million 5 years

1011
00:41:07,359 --> 00:41:10,720
later. Is there two phases of this?

1012
00:41:10,720 --> 00:41:13,359
>> Uh it accounts for inflation.

1013
00:41:13,359 --> 00:41:18,870
>> Okay. And uh

1014
00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:20,880
well, I guess maybe Councilman Plamer

1015
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:23,040
asked that question that putting things

1016
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:24,560
underground because I can't imagine

1017
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:26,480
pavement costing that much, you know? I

1018
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:30,000
mean, uh or we're projecting some

1019
00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:32,400
serious inflation. Okay. So, maybe maybe

1020
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:33,839
that answers the question. There's more

1021
00:41:33,839 --> 00:41:35,200
than just pay. Yeah, the utilities are a

1022
00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:37,040
big portion of the cost for Centerville.

1023
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:41,280
>> So, uh h having traveled a bit recently,

1024
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:45,119
uh walking, biking, uh pass are pretty

1025
00:41:45,119 --> 00:41:46,640
critical, especially as our city's

1026
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:50,480
grown. So, so uh I I think this is this

1027
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:52,560
is definitely something we need because

1028
00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:55,760
um uh I don't know where we're going to

1029
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:59,200
put more more roads. So,

1030
00:41:59,200 --> 00:42:01,040
you you got to have you got to have

1031
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:05,520
this. But I do do ask you this. Do we do

1032
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:07,839
is there any projections on use on this?

1033
00:42:07,839 --> 00:42:10,079
Because as Utons, we won't give up our

1034
00:42:10,079 --> 00:42:11,839
cars, I'll tell you. But maybe we'll

1035
00:42:11,839 --> 00:42:14,319
have to, you know, we'll be down to one

1036
00:42:14,319 --> 00:42:16,800
car families finally, you know, at some

1037
00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:19,200
point in time. But is there any

1038
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:21,280
projections? Just out of curiosity.

1039
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:23,680
>> I do not have projections.

1040
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:26,000
We talked about that. Can I ask with

1041
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:28,160
maybe going along with projections, what

1042
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:32,800
are the types of um

1043
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:35,839
vehicles or that are allowed on this

1044
00:42:35,839 --> 00:42:38,960
trail? I mean, obviously people can ride

1045
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:42,800
bikes or walk. Uh do the other cities

1046
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:46,720
limit those um

1047
00:42:46,720 --> 00:42:50,720
>> other bikes to Can ebikes go on it? Can

1048
00:42:50,720 --> 00:42:52,960
golf carts go on it? I think what he's

1049
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:55,599
asking there is what roll what's rolling

1050
00:42:55,599 --> 00:42:57,520
defined as because it says walking,

1051
00:42:57,520 --> 00:42:58,720
biking, and rolling.

1052
00:42:58,720 --> 00:43:00,480
>> There you go. So, what's rolling?

1053
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:02,160
>> I'll share what I think we've talked

1054
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:03,920
about that that is

1055
00:43:03,920 --> 00:43:05,599
>> undetermined at this time. It's

1056
00:43:05,599 --> 00:43:08,079
indeterminate. Um, and that's because no

1057
00:43:08,079 --> 00:43:09,599
policies have been established. We're

1058
00:43:09,599 --> 00:43:11,440
not quite to that point, but that

1059
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:14,000
clearly could be a policy discussion. If

1060
00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:15,599
the council were to accept this, then I

1061
00:43:15,599 --> 00:43:17,040
would continue participating in these

1062
00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:18,880
committees with the other cities to have

1063
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:21,440
those very conversations. And if I got

1064
00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:22,800
feedback from the council that says,

1065
00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:26,000
"Hey, my council does not want motorized

1066
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:28,079
vehicles in these corridors, I can bring

1067
00:43:28,079 --> 00:43:29,440
that to the table to represent

1068
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:30,960
Centerville's interest for that if

1069
00:43:30,960 --> 00:43:32,880
that's the the desire." So those

1070
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:34,400
conversations still need to be had.

1071
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:35,119
Let's put it that way.

1072
00:43:35,119 --> 00:43:36,960
>> So what are we saying? Rolling is

1073
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:39,440
>> rolling would be like strollers, wagons,

1074
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:40,640
I guess, you know,

1075
00:43:40,640 --> 00:43:41,680
>> roller blading,

1076
00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:42,800
>> roller blades,

1077
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:44,960
>> roller skates, I mean to me it could be

1078
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:45,520
scooters

1079
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:48,640
>> with wheels, you know. So,

1080
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:50,640
>> and I did I did have Sorry, I didn't

1081
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:51,920
mean to cut you out. I just was going to

1082
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:53,760
add to that. I did have one resident in

1083
00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:55,359
particular on Northwest that was really

1084
00:43:55,359 --> 00:43:56,800
excited about the idea of it even in

1085
00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:58,160
front of their house because they have

1086
00:43:58,160 --> 00:43:59,520
young children and they like the idea of

1087
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:01,440
being able to have their kids go outside

1088
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:04,319
and feel safe rolling back and forth

1089
00:44:04,319 --> 00:44:05,680
between friends house and just being

1090
00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:07,520
able to recreate. So,

1091
00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:09,280
>> can I piggyback on mayor's question with

1092
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:11,280
regard to the cost? So some of it would

1093
00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:12,640
be burying underground lines, but I want

1094
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:14,079
to look at this example that you have up

1095
00:44:14,079 --> 00:44:15,520
on this board right now because

1096
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:18,000
currently this where this trail is, it's

1097
00:44:18,000 --> 00:44:20,560
just grass, right? But in this picture,

1098
00:44:20,560 --> 00:44:22,640
I see lovely trees and landscaping there

1099
00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:24,720
on the left hand side. Would the 10

1100
00:44:24,720 --> 00:44:27,359
million also go to aesthetically

1101
00:44:27,359 --> 00:44:29,440
beautifying this area as well, adding

1102
00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:30,240
trees and such.

1103
00:44:30,240 --> 00:44:32,319
>> I love trees. And that's another

1104
00:44:32,319 --> 00:44:35,119
indeterminate discussion um that came up

1105
00:44:35,119 --> 00:44:37,440
relative to landscaping just because it

1106
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:40,400
shows this obviously if we feel like

1107
00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:42,240
maintenance of trees or other things in

1108
00:44:42,240 --> 00:44:44,480
the parkrip area are difficult to

1109
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:46,880
achieve. It can be definitely more

1110
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:50,240
drought tolerant plantings. Um it can be

1111
00:44:50,240 --> 00:44:51,839
different kinds of mulches or other

1112
00:44:51,839 --> 00:44:53,440
things. That's another thing that would

1113
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:55,920
be discussed with future discussion

1114
00:44:55,920 --> 00:44:58,079
between the cities as far as what could

1115
00:44:58,079 --> 00:45:00,079
be a design or an aesthetic. And each

1116
00:45:00,079 --> 00:45:01,680
city can have its own independent

1117
00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:03,760
aesthetic as well. So you kind of know

1118
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:05,119
when you're going from one community to

1119
00:45:05,119 --> 00:45:06,480
another if you want your own unique

1120
00:45:06,480 --> 00:45:08,880
identity, if you want to kind of have

1121
00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:10,960
some unique or you could have

1122
00:45:10,960 --> 00:45:11,520
>> cohesion,

1123
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:13,040
>> seamless cohesion, too. Maybe you have

1124
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:15,599
similar colorations on the actual path,

1125
00:45:15,599 --> 00:45:17,680
but then the park strip plantings are a

1126
00:45:17,680 --> 00:45:18,720
little bit unique and different with

1127
00:45:18,720 --> 00:45:21,920
some welcome to Centerville type signage

1128
00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:23,119
or whatever, right? You could do

1129
00:45:23,119 --> 00:45:24,480
different things that kind might be fun

1130
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:26,880
and unique. So those conversations have

1131
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:28,160
not happened yet. That's that's coming

1132
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:29,760
out of space and coming more into the

1133
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:30,880
atmosphere with those kind of

1134
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:31,599
conversations.

1135
00:45:31,599 --> 00:45:33,520
>> Yeah.

1136
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:35,920
>> And here's a unique question and I don't

1137
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:37,280
know if Councilwoman Hurst thought of

1138
00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:40,079
it, but five years ago I was talking an

1139
00:45:40,079 --> 00:45:43,040
awful lot with UTA about BRT going

1140
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:46,880
through our uh roads where our

1141
00:45:46,880 --> 00:45:50,319
businesses are. Well, 400 West does uh

1142
00:45:50,319 --> 00:45:52,319
where your your route is. I mean, is

1143
00:45:52,319 --> 00:45:55,040
does it affect I don't know that UTA

1144
00:45:55,040 --> 00:45:56,480
would ever go there. I mean, they said

1145
00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:58,560
they'd entertain it, but would it affect

1146
00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:00,640
the BRT going there rather than on Main

1147
00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:01,119
Street? It

1148
00:46:01,119 --> 00:46:02,560
>> it could that's probably more of a coven

1149
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:04,079
question, but I can tell you from from

1150
00:46:04,079 --> 00:46:06,000
my perspective and even as we've talked

1151
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:07,599
about like some of the general plan

1152
00:46:07,599 --> 00:46:10,026
discussions and stuff, yes, because

1153
00:46:10,026 --> 00:46:11,599
[snorts] the way the BRT works, it

1154
00:46:11,599 --> 00:46:13,520
becomes an added lane in the middle, has

1155
00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:15,040
to have the park islands where people

1156
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:18,720
can go and safely wait. So, this could

1157
00:46:18,720 --> 00:46:20,800
impact that route for being used for

1158
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:22,079
BRT.

1159
00:46:22,079 --> 00:46:24,800
>> But, uh, of course, those are our roads,

1160
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:26,720
right? I mean, you could dig and do what

1161
00:46:26,720 --> 00:46:28,400
they want, but we've always said

1162
00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:30,400
>> Main Street's really not our road. So,

1163
00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:31,920
just just curiosity. So,

1164
00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:33,040
>> yeah, that's a fair question.

1165
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:36,319
>> I mean, it's it's it's I am so thrilled

1166
00:46:36,319 --> 00:46:40,240
that personally that that uh you all

1167
00:46:40,240 --> 00:46:41,760
have been working on it so hard, you

1168
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:42,880
know, and like I said, I would have

1169
00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:46,640
liked to been there as well, too, but I wasn't. But, so, thank you. Thank you

1170
00:46:46,640 --> 00:46:48,400
for all that you've been doing. That's

1171
00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:50,319
the questions I have uh right now.

1172
00:46:50,319 --> 00:46:51,520
Council, any

1173
00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:53,839
>> I have a couple, please. and and I I'd

1174
00:46:53,839 --> 00:46:56,319
like the idea too. I think it's a great

1175
00:46:56,319 --> 00:46:59,920
enhancement and would be very utilized,

1176
00:46:59,920 --> 00:47:02,880
but uh couple of things. I'm a little

1177
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:04,400
worried about those three businesses,

1178
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:07,200
Colonial Lumber, Quickquack, and and

1179
00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:09,200
have they specifically weighed in on

1180
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:10,720
this? Where are they at with this?

1181
00:47:10,720 --> 00:47:12,560
>> We we sent them the notification like we

1182
00:47:12,560 --> 00:47:14,480
did any other property owner along 400

1183
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:15,760
West, but we have not heard anything

1184
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:17,839
from At least I haven't. I don't know if

1185
00:47:17,839 --> 00:47:18,319
you're

1186
00:47:18,319 --> 00:47:20,000
>> I didn't hear I didn't hear anything

1187
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:20,480
from

1188
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:25,119
>> that. particularly concerns me because I I think of that situation quick is

1189
00:47:25,119 --> 00:47:27,280
such a tight to for them to give up any

1190
00:47:27,280 --> 00:47:28,800
frontage there. We already have a

1191
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:31,040
traffic issue with the amount of traffic

1192
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:35,440
coming out of there and I I would be I'd

1193
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:39,119
be shocked if they're pleased with this.

1194
00:47:39,119 --> 00:47:40,640
Colonial might have a little more

1195
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:44,079
latitude there. Uh but and and we did

1196
00:47:44,079 --> 00:47:45,280
have the option on the other side of the

1197
00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:47,119
road. The original alignment was

1198
00:47:47,119 --> 00:47:49,520
crossing to the west, but city engineer

1199
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:51,119
felt like that that would be impactful

1200
00:47:51,119 --> 00:47:52,720
and has to go to the east and

1201
00:47:52,720 --> 00:47:55,760
>> impactful for other reasons, but but uh

1202
00:47:55,760 --> 00:47:57,599
they both have their impacts. I just

1203
00:47:57,599 --> 00:47:58,960
that concerns me.

1204
00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:00,640
>> I I think that's a good point that you

1205
00:48:00,640 --> 00:48:02,800
bring up and definitely if this gets to

1206
00:48:02,800 --> 00:48:04,079
the stage where there's going to be

1207
00:48:04,079 --> 00:48:06,560
plans drawn up, of course, you'd have to

1208
00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:08,160
have some discussions with them, right?

1209
00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:11,680
And I I think you know what the reason I

1210
00:48:11,680 --> 00:48:13,599
said, "Hey, we laid this out. I just

1211
00:48:13,599 --> 00:48:15,839
wanted you to know like we tried to pick

1212
00:48:15,839 --> 00:48:17,040
what we thought might be a good

1213
00:48:17,040 --> 00:48:18,560
alignment." That doesn't mean we caught

1214
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:21,839
the right alignment. So I do I do think

1215
00:48:21,839 --> 00:48:23,680
you know if that is problematic and it

1216
00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:26,000
makes it so a business can't actually

1217
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:27,599
function as a business. Then we have to

1218
00:48:27,599 --> 00:48:29,280
look at and say, "Well, can we put it to

1219
00:48:29,280 --> 00:48:30,800
the other side?" Right.

1220
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:32,640
>> Yeah. I think I think acceptance of the

1221
00:48:32,640 --> 00:48:35,680
alignment is saying that we think we're

1222
00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:37,920
there, but again, it also allows the

1223
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:39,280
committee to keep meeting to talk about

1224
00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:41,520
it. And to your point, uh, Council

1225
00:48:41,520 --> 00:48:44,800
Member Banger, if there's an evaluation

1226
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:46,880
as we get deeper and more coming down

1227
00:48:46,880 --> 00:48:50,240
closer to to land on this, we look at

1228
00:48:50,240 --> 00:48:51,920
the cost, we look at the impacts, and we

1229
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:53,920
determine, hey, the Westside still is

1230
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:57,119
the better option. That plan can be

1231
00:48:57,119 --> 00:49:00,559
revised to match that out. I think one

1232
00:49:00,559 --> 00:49:02,319
more thing to think about is you're

1233
00:49:02,319 --> 00:49:05,680
looking at this picture and it's a 12 12

1234
00:49:05,680 --> 00:49:08,480
foot wide path. Correct. It's a 12 foot

1235
00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:11,599
wide path and a 4 to 6 foot wide park

1236
00:49:11,599 --> 00:49:14,160
strip that could potentially also be

1237
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:15,839
narrowed a little where it's maybe you

1238
00:49:15,839 --> 00:49:17,440
know I mean I think we're talking about

1239
00:49:17,440 --> 00:49:19,520
a choke point which is why it could

1240
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:20,480
impact

1241
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:22,079
>> those three businesses because that

1242
00:49:22,079 --> 00:49:24,400
right of way is a little bit tighter.

1243
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:25,040
Um,

1244
00:49:25,040 --> 00:49:27,599
>> in a lot of cases we kind of showed

1245
00:49:27,599 --> 00:49:30,160
worst case most amount of conflict,

1246
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:31,920
worst case scenario. So,

1247
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:33,839
>> yeah. So, it could also maybe be

1248
00:49:33,839 --> 00:49:35,359
narrowed a little right there and it

1249
00:49:35,359 --> 00:49:37,680
would be fine. I think there's that's

1250
00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:39,440
why I say I think there's a lot that has

1251
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:42,240
to be looked at before you finalize that

1252
00:49:42,240 --> 00:49:43,440
actual plan.

1253
00:49:43,440 --> 00:49:44,720
>> And that's good to hear. I appreciate

1254
00:49:44,720 --> 00:49:46,240
that because that leads into my next

1255
00:49:46,240 --> 00:49:49,520
question which was I [clears throat] I

1256
00:49:49,520 --> 00:49:52,480
would be shocked actually that the

1257
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,280
fourth west portion that when people

1258
00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:57,680
really realize that if they're on that

1259
00:49:57,680 --> 00:50:00,319
side of the road, grandma and grandpa,

1260
00:50:00,319 --> 00:50:01,599
your son's not going to be able to park

1261
00:50:01,599 --> 00:50:03,520
in front of your house anymore.

1262
00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:05,680
>> And and that's a big impact. And to the

1263
00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:07,920
mayor's point,

1264
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:09,119
center residents aren't going to give up

1265
00:50:09,119 --> 00:50:11,200
their cars. Well, we're giving up a lot

1266
00:50:11,200 --> 00:50:14,160
of parking and that for this, but you

1267
00:50:14,160 --> 00:50:16,160
know, so I so I just wonder alignment

1268
00:50:16,160 --> 00:50:19,839
wise. So like like Chase Light enough

1269
00:50:19,839 --> 00:50:21,599
residents had an issue with it being on

1270
00:50:21,599 --> 00:50:23,680
that side. you guys have moved it which

1271
00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:26,480
great but if that comes up later with

1272
00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:30,400
fourth west if if when people really

1273
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:32,319
and so maybe we could move it to the

1274
00:50:32,319 --> 00:50:34,079
other side and I know we don't want to

1275
00:50:34,079 --> 00:50:35,920
be jumping back and forth that didn't

1276
00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:36,319
work

1277
00:50:36,319 --> 00:50:38,559
>> I will say interestingly enough so that

1278
00:50:38,559 --> 00:50:42,480
is right by where I live happens to be

1279
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:43,839
>> the chase lane part

1280
00:50:43,839 --> 00:50:47,200
>> well have no cha chase lane is not I

1281
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:49,920
mean the 400 west between Chase Lane and

1282
00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:52,960
that um red brick church house on 400

1283
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:53,839
West.

1284
00:50:53,839 --> 00:50:54,160
>> Okay,

1285
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:56,079
>> that happens to just be my I know all

1286
00:50:56,079 --> 00:50:58,079
those people that used to be some of

1287
00:50:58,079 --> 00:50:59,359
that used to be my word. Some of it

1288
00:50:59,359 --> 00:51:02,079
still currently is my ward. So, I've

1289
00:51:02,079 --> 00:51:03,760
actually talked to several of those

1290
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:07,280
people and I think um and I'm not so

1291
00:51:07,280 --> 00:51:08,960
sure we're not seeing some of that

1292
00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:11,040
coming around with Chase Lane a little

1293
00:51:11,040 --> 00:51:13,040
bit, but these are really wide roads and

1294
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:14,720
there's a lot of speeding that happens

1295
00:51:14,720 --> 00:51:16,880
when you're on a wider road. These will

1296
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:18,640
narrow those roads down and it will

1297
00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:20,960
provide a natural

1298
00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:22,480
just in your mind when you're driving on

1299
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:24,480
a narrow road, you tend to drive slower.

1300
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:27,440
So, I've actually had several of those

1301
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:29,839
residents say to me, "I'm very excited

1302
00:51:29,839 --> 00:51:32,000
about this because it will slow the

1303
00:51:32,000 --> 00:51:34,960
traffic down." So, I there's there's

1304
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:36,880
pros and cons. I'm not disagreeing with

1305
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:39,599
you. And I think that sometimes it's

1306
00:51:39,599 --> 00:51:41,839
really hard to get the word out. They

1307
00:51:41,839 --> 00:51:43,760
got a letter.

1308
00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:45,760
I asked a few of them, you know, anyone

1309
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:47,920
I saw I was asking, you know, how they

1310
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:50,000
felt about it, but sometimes things

1311
00:51:50,000 --> 00:51:52,400
don't always settle in and register

1312
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:54,000
until they've heard about it two or

1313
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:56,400
three times. And so it could, you're

1314
00:51:56,400 --> 00:51:58,400
right, there could be more concerns for

1315
00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:01,200
sure. Well, I love this. It's beautiful.

1316
00:52:01,200 --> 00:52:03,839
And there were so many ebikes and esers

1317
00:52:03,839 --> 00:52:05,839
and I mean, we just keep hearing about

1318
00:52:05,839 --> 00:52:07,599
more accidents. So to get them off the

1319
00:52:07,599 --> 00:52:10,400
road, I think is great. If it saves one

1320
00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:12,800
person's life, I think that's great. I

1321
00:52:12,800 --> 00:52:14,559
am a little concerned about the mayor's

1322
00:52:14,559 --> 00:52:17,359
question. I would hate to see that this

1323
00:52:17,359 --> 00:52:19,359
would make the impact of us having to

1324
00:52:19,359 --> 00:52:21,359
have BRT up on Main Street rather than

1325
00:52:21,359 --> 00:52:23,760
down Northwest after we'd worked so hard

1326
00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:25,920
to try to talk them into looking at I

1327
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:28,319
mean we go and we say please West you've

1328
00:52:28,319 --> 00:52:30,160
been there. I was there. Spencer was

1329
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:31,920
there. We all told them we thought

1330
00:52:31,920 --> 00:52:35,359
Northwest was a better

1331
00:52:35,359 --> 00:52:37,760
alternative. And now they come back and

1332
00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:39,680
maybe offer that to us and we say, "Oh,

1333
00:52:39,680 --> 00:52:41,119
whoops. We we went a different

1334
00:52:41,119 --> 00:52:47,670
direction.

1335
00:52:47,680 --> 00:52:50,480
» I don't know that uh you

1336
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:51,920
>> I don't know either. I just

1337
00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:53,200
>> I was going to say I don't know.

1338
00:52:53,200 --> 00:52:55,119
>> I was going to go that route anyway. You

1339
00:52:55,119 --> 00:52:59,760
know that that was on a napkin at uh uh

1340
00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:00,480
that

1341
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:02,319
>> we actually put it on their maps and

1342
00:53:02,319 --> 00:53:04,640
everything up in when we met with them.

1343
00:53:04,640 --> 00:53:06,640
Gina and me and Spencer all put that on

1344
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:09,119
their on their maps. I certainly don't

1345
00:53:09,119 --> 00:53:12,480
want to kill over that all this the time

1346
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:15,040
and effort that's been put put into this

1347
00:53:15,040 --> 00:53:17,760
and what you come up with. So, you know,

1348
00:53:17,760 --> 00:53:20,079
uh this gets the ball rolling. I I know

1349
00:53:20,079 --> 00:53:21,520
that once you approve even a phys v

1350
00:53:21,520 --> 00:53:24,240
physibility study, I mean the ball is

1351
00:53:24,240 --> 00:53:27,440
rolling, but uh uh I also don't want to

1352
00:53:27,440 --> 00:53:28,960
be

1353
00:53:28,960 --> 00:53:31,520
uh the one we already are on the hill

1354
00:53:31,520 --> 00:53:34,079
with our trails that that boom, all of a

1355
00:53:34,079 --> 00:53:36,720
sudden the trail ends. I mean, uh, we

1356
00:53:36,720 --> 00:53:38,480
got to be team players and conduct

1357
00:53:38,480 --> 00:53:40,640
>> and this isn't going to cost us anything

1358
00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:44,240
>> to go onto the feasibility study.

1359
00:53:44,240 --> 00:53:47,359
>> I mean, you know, I So, I don't think

1360
00:53:47,359 --> 00:53:49,200
we're being asked to commit to any funds

1361
00:53:49,200 --> 00:53:50,480
because they're going to go try and do

1362
00:53:50,480 --> 00:53:52,319
their very best to get it fully funded.

1363
00:53:52,319 --> 00:53:53,920
Does that mean that we will never be

1364
00:53:53,920 --> 00:53:55,280
asked? I'm not going to promise that

1365
00:53:55,280 --> 00:53:56,160
because I don't know.

1366
00:53:56,160 --> 00:53:58,319
>> But we're not committing to anything.

1367
00:53:58,319 --> 00:54:00,480
>> Exactly. Exactly. That would be a

1368
00:54:00,480 --> 00:54:03,119
decision at that point. So, you know, I

1369
00:54:03,119 --> 00:54:05,599
think that they're confident that there

1370
00:54:05,599 --> 00:54:07,839
are many opportunities out there. Can we

1371
00:54:07,839 --> 00:54:09,839
be the ones that qualify? I think

1372
00:54:09,839 --> 00:54:12,480
there's a really good chance. I mean, I

1373
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:14,079
think Kimley Horn feels like there's a

1374
00:54:14,079 --> 00:54:15,680
really good chance, especially where is

1375
00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:19,280
a more re it's multiple communities and

1376
00:54:19,280 --> 00:54:21,200
this is going to tie into a trail that,

1377
00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:23,280
you know, really if people want to ride

1378
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:25,680
their bike to work in downtown Salt

1379
00:54:25,680 --> 00:54:26,960
Lake, they'll be able to.

1380
00:54:26,960 --> 00:54:29,440
>> Yeah, I love it. I love that stuff. So,

1381
00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:31,680
I think there's lots to love about it.

1382
00:54:31,680 --> 00:54:33,520
Um, I think it's important to remember,

1383
00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:35,839
too, as you look at this picture, I'm

1384
00:54:35,839 --> 00:54:38,240
not sure like we put the people on it,

1385
00:54:38,240 --> 00:54:41,680
right? I This is a 12 foot wide path.

1386
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:44,720
That's a traffic lane and it's a wide

1387
00:54:44,720 --> 00:54:47,920
traffic lane. We have we have lanes of

1388
00:54:47,920 --> 00:54:50,480
traffic that are 11 ft. So,

1389
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:52,720
>> this is a really big nice path. And yes,

1390
00:54:52,720 --> 00:54:55,040
to your point, Robin, I think it would,

1391
00:54:55,040 --> 00:54:57,599
you know, give lots of opportunity for,

1392
00:54:57,599 --> 00:55:02,720
you know, depending on how we decide on those rolling ebikes and whatnot. I

1393
00:55:02,720 --> 00:55:04,000
do think there's I think there's going

1394
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:05,760
to have to be some considerations about

1395
00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:06,559
what is

1396
00:55:06,559 --> 00:55:07,440
>> there will,

1397
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:09,040
>> you know, how you how you share that

1398
00:55:09,040 --> 00:55:11,280
space, but it's a really big wide path.

1399
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:13,200
So, it's it's really nice.

1400
00:55:13,200 --> 00:55:15,359
>> And and I think to that point, the

1401
00:55:15,359 --> 00:55:17,280
council will be involved on whatever

1402
00:55:17,280 --> 00:55:19,440
next steps happen. In my mind, as I've

1403
00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:20,400
talked about and we talked to the

1404
00:55:20,400 --> 00:55:22,319
residents, it feels like there's still

1405
00:55:22,319 --> 00:55:24,400
two or three more steps to this thing,

1406
00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:26,079
you know, there's still the the design

1407
00:55:26,079 --> 00:55:29,359
and the engineering and then there's the implementation, the construction.

1408
00:55:29,359 --> 00:55:32,160
So, this is the first of probably a four

1409
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:35,920
step or plus project um even to get to

1410
00:55:35,920 --> 00:55:37,440
that point. So

1411
00:55:37,440 --> 00:55:38,800
>> that's another thing that there will be

1412
00:55:38,800 --> 00:55:40,559
plenty of conversation with the council

1413
00:55:40,559 --> 00:55:42,079
to make sure if there's something wrong

1414
00:55:42,079 --> 00:55:44,079
or it feels off or maybe even with the

1415
00:55:44,079 --> 00:55:45,599
designer engineering it's like this part

1416
00:55:45,599 --> 00:55:47,200
of the route is not working and here's

1417
00:55:47,200 --> 00:55:49,119
why we need to look at it. So I think

1418
00:55:49,119 --> 00:55:50,960
that it's a very evolutionary process

1419
00:55:50,960 --> 00:55:52,880
anyway even even at where it is right

1420
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:54,559
now. Mhm.

1421
00:55:54,559 --> 00:55:58,720
>> Can I ask if our our police chief and

1422
00:55:58,720 --> 00:56:01,280
public safety officials have any take on

1423
00:56:01,280 --> 00:56:03,200
this as far from a safety perspective

1424
00:56:03,200 --> 00:56:06,480
and speed limits and traffic management

1425
00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:11,030
on those routes? I just curious.

1426
00:56:11,040 --> 00:56:13,680
» Yeah, Mike and I were just chatting

1427
00:56:13,680 --> 00:56:15,760
about

1428
00:56:15,760 --> 00:56:20,150
safety wise.

1429
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:23,359
Yeah, I I liked uh Councilwoman Hurst's

1430
00:56:23,359 --> 00:56:25,760
comments about uh traffic calming

1431
00:56:25,760 --> 00:56:29,040
through narrowing not removing lanes but

1432
00:56:29,040 --> 00:56:31,839
narrowing things down. Uh right now it

1433
00:56:31,839 --> 00:56:35,200
is kind of a wide open

1434
00:56:35,200 --> 00:56:37,200
uh road that has a low speed limit and

1435
00:56:37,200 --> 00:56:41,839
so it does tend to drive speeds up.

1436
00:56:41,839 --> 00:56:46,000
Um so I I'm a fan of getting pedestrians

1437
00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:48,319
and cyclists off the roadway. give them

1438
00:56:48,319 --> 00:56:50,799
a little bit of a buffer. As we know

1439
00:56:50,799 --> 00:56:52,720
from previous

1440
00:56:52,720 --> 00:56:54,799
uh meetings, I'm a fan of sidewalks and

1441
00:56:54,799 --> 00:56:59,359
you know, pathways off the roadway. So,

1442
00:56:59,359 --> 00:57:01,119
specifically, Chief, what about all the

1443
00:57:01,119 --> 00:57:03,680
residents who would be backing across

1444
00:57:03,680 --> 00:57:06,079
this to to leave to get out ingress and

1445
00:57:06,079 --> 00:57:11,680
egress from their properties with two lanes to clear bikes and pedestrians

1446
00:57:11,680 --> 00:57:14,640
here and then another clearing? I'm just

1447
00:57:14,640 --> 00:57:16,880
thoughts on that.

1448
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:18,160
We gonna have more accidents. We going

1449
00:57:18,160 --> 00:57:21,599
to have pedestrian accidents less.

1450
00:57:21,599 --> 00:57:24,240
>> I I don't know. I I don't know how that

1451
00:57:24,240 --> 00:57:27,119
it would work and how it line up with,

1452
00:57:27,119 --> 00:57:29,599
you know, trees blocking sign. You know,

1453
00:57:29,599 --> 00:57:32,480
you have line of sight. And so it's it's

1454
00:57:32,480 --> 00:57:35,760
possible with the travel lane closer to

1455
00:57:35,760 --> 00:57:38,319
the the homes that they have a better

1456
00:57:38,319 --> 00:57:41,760
side of pedestrians and cyclists there

1457
00:57:41,760 --> 00:57:43,680
rather than on the other side of the

1458
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:45,359
park strip where you got trees and other

1459
00:57:45,359 --> 00:57:48,559
things blocking it. Um I don't know if

1460
00:57:48,559 --> 00:57:50,799
there anyone's Yeah, I I really don't

1461
00:57:50,799 --> 00:57:53,760
have a professional opinion on that.

1462
00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:54,880
Sorry.

1463
00:57:54,880 --> 00:57:57,440
>> You would hope that uh people knowing

1464
00:57:57,440 --> 00:57:59,200
that those

1465
00:57:59,200 --> 00:58:01,920
paths are there, they would drive safer,

1466
00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:04,000
>> right? My my concern though would be

1467
00:58:04,000 --> 00:58:05,359
with

1468
00:58:05,359 --> 00:58:08,160
>> cyclists maybe going too fast

1469
00:58:08,160 --> 00:58:11,280
>> on a sidewalk and not doing giving due

1470
00:58:11,280 --> 00:58:14,319
uh care to motors pulling in and out

1471
00:58:14,319 --> 00:58:16,079
which is a lot of times we we'll see

1472
00:58:16,079 --> 00:58:18,720
that on crashes like that where it's

1473
00:58:18,720 --> 00:58:21,440
this cyclist going really fast on a

1474
00:58:21,440 --> 00:58:24,880
sidewalk and end up getting getting hit.

1475
00:58:24,880 --> 00:58:28,720
Is there a perhaps a a speed limit on

1476
00:58:28,720 --> 00:58:32,240
those two examples that you showed us

1477
00:58:32,240 --> 00:58:34,640
that you know of like a

1478
00:58:34,640 --> 00:58:36,480
>> on the on the path itself?

1479
00:58:36,480 --> 00:58:37,359
>> Yeah.

1480
00:58:37,359 --> 00:58:39,920
>> Um we didn't establish a speed limit as

1481
00:58:39,920 --> 00:58:42,400
part of this. Um and also goes back to

1482
00:58:42,400 --> 00:58:46,079
enforcement. It's rather difficult to I

1483
00:58:46,079 --> 00:58:48,000
guess enforce the speed on these shared

1484
00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:51,599
use paths. Um, and so I think that's

1485
00:58:51,599 --> 00:58:53,359
something that would

1486
00:58:53,359 --> 00:58:55,440
>> come a little bit later. Um,

1487
00:58:55,440 --> 00:58:59,359
>> do you know of one though?

1488
00:58:59,359 --> 00:59:02,319
>> Oh, like posted on those. Um, not that I

1489
00:59:02,319 --> 00:59:04,400
know of. Not on the nine line. Um, I

1490
00:59:04,400 --> 00:59:06,319
frequent that one.

1491
00:59:06,319 --> 00:59:07,760
>> And I'm sorry. And maybe I missed that

1492
00:59:07,760 --> 00:59:09,440
part of conversation about electronic

1493
00:59:09,440 --> 00:59:11,040
devices on these

1494
00:59:11,040 --> 00:59:13,760
>> these bikes ebikes and stuff there.

1495
00:59:13,760 --> 00:59:16,319
>> Well, a regular bike can go about what

1496
00:59:16,319 --> 00:59:18,000
15 miles per hour if you're really

1497
00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:21,119
pedaling. And then an ebike we you said

1498
00:59:21,119 --> 00:59:22,640
could go upwards of

1499
00:59:22,640 --> 00:59:24,640
>> uh 20 to 28

1500
00:59:24,640 --> 00:59:26,640
>> depending on the class.

1501
00:59:26,640 --> 00:59:28,960
>> So that's kind of fast on

1502
00:59:28,960 --> 00:59:30,640
>> Yeah.

1503
00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:34,150
>> Half like that.

1504
00:59:34,160 --> 00:59:36,079
» I'm actually in favor of this as well. I

1505
00:59:36,079 --> 00:59:37,520
just

1506
00:59:37,520 --> 00:59:38,960
>> kind of looking at

1507
00:59:38,960 --> 00:59:40,559
>> the concerns that I have.

1508
00:59:40,559 --> 00:59:44,000
>> And a note on the driveways as well.

1509
00:59:44,000 --> 00:59:46,480
It's also like existing right now.

1510
00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:48,319
people are backing out and you've got

1511
00:59:48,319 --> 00:59:51,280
cyclists going down the shoulder. But I

1512
00:59:51,280 --> 00:59:52,000
think it's a

1513
00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:54,640
>> Yeah, I So that did come up with the

1514
00:59:54,640 --> 00:59:56,720
chase lane residence of course and that

1515
00:59:56,720 --> 00:59:58,720
was and that is one of the reasons that

1516
00:59:58,720 --> 01:00:00,799
we moved it to the north side because

1517
01:00:00,799 --> 01:00:04,319
there's way way like four driveways

1518
01:00:04,319 --> 01:00:07,440
versus like 11 or 12. It was it was a

1519
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:10,000
high number. Um, and so yeah, of course

1520
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:12,559
we want to look for ways to avoid

1521
01:00:12,559 --> 01:00:15,760
potential conflicts. But as I was

1522
01:00:15,760 --> 01:00:17,520
thinking about it and thinking about,

1523
01:00:17,520 --> 01:00:19,680
you know, backing out of a driveway, I'm

1524
01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:21,839
like, you're still on Chase Lane. If

1525
01:00:21,839 --> 01:00:23,440
you're backing out, it's a really wide

1526
01:00:23,440 --> 01:00:25,680
road. You're still you still got to

1527
01:00:25,680 --> 01:00:27,119
watch the sidewalk when you're backing

1528
01:00:27,119 --> 01:00:28,480
out. You still got to watch the

1529
01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:30,240
shoulder, which has the bicyclists in

1530
01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:31,680
it, and you still got to watch for

1531
01:00:31,680 --> 01:00:35,760
traffic. And so I'm not I I don't know.

1532
01:00:35,760 --> 01:00:36,960
I don't I don't understand

1533
01:00:36,960 --> 01:00:38,880
professionally how that may, you know,

1534
01:00:38,880 --> 01:00:40,640
impact to suddenly move everything into

1535
01:00:40,640 --> 01:00:43,280
one 12T lane. But I I think it is what

1536
01:00:43,280 --> 01:00:46,880
the mayor said. We just have to be

1537
01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:49,359
if you're backing up into a sidewalk or

1538
01:00:49,359 --> 01:00:52,240
a pathway, we always need to be careful.

1539
01:00:52,240 --> 01:00:54,880
>> It does concern me a little bit because

1540
01:00:54,880 --> 01:00:57,440
I'm out there and I see these ebikes.

1541
01:00:57,440 --> 01:00:59,359
Not sure they don't more go more than 28

1542
01:00:59,359 --> 01:01:02,079
miles an hour. That would be my concern

1543
01:01:02,079 --> 01:01:05,760
is this seems like a straight shot where

1544
01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:07,520
on the shoulder they're kind of moving

1545
01:01:07,520 --> 01:01:09,920
in and out, cars are pulling in and out.

1546
01:01:09,920 --> 01:01:11,760
I think they'd be a little more I mean,

1547
01:01:11,760 --> 01:01:13,680
I could get on that and think, hey, I go

1548
01:01:13,680 --> 01:01:16,240
to North Salt Lake with, you know, I'm

1549
01:01:16,240 --> 01:01:17,920
going to put this out to full gear and

1550
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:20,400
on I go. I I don't know either. I'm

1551
01:01:20,400 --> 01:01:22,960
supportive of this. I could just want as

1552
01:01:22,960 --> 01:01:24,720
we're looking at it those things to be

1553
01:01:24,720 --> 01:01:26,720
taken into consideration. I don't want

1554
01:01:26,720 --> 01:01:28,240
to put that much money into it and then

1555
01:01:28,240 --> 01:01:30,240
have them say, "Ah, we can't have

1556
01:01:30,240 --> 01:01:32,319
bicycles on it or we can't have ebikes

1557
01:01:32,319 --> 01:01:35,359
on it." Because that it'd be my concern

1558
01:01:35,359 --> 01:01:37,760
is it does look like a straight shot. If

1559
01:01:37,760 --> 01:01:39,920
you, you know, if you're 12 years old

1560
01:01:39,920 --> 01:01:41,680
and you get your ebike going down there

1561
01:01:41,680 --> 01:01:43,920
28 miles an hour,

1562
01:01:43,920 --> 01:01:46,880
>> are you stopping or slowing down at each

1563
01:01:46,880 --> 01:01:49,520
>> at each driveway?

1564
01:01:49,520 --> 01:01:51,119
>> Well, we've had good discussion. We got

1565
01:01:51,119 --> 01:01:54,400
a lot on our agenda. Uh and and uh so we

1566
01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:56,480
pro probably are looking at some sort of

1567
01:01:56,480 --> 01:01:58,400
there there's a couple sample motions in

1568
01:01:58,400 --> 01:02:00,319
your packet or you can make up your own

1569
01:02:00,319 --> 01:02:04,319
motion uh on this uh if anybody is so

1570
01:02:04,319 --> 01:02:05,520
inclined to

1571
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:08,400
>> Gina. Do you want to or this is your b

1572
01:02:08,400 --> 01:02:10,319
this is kind of your baby so I want to

1573
01:02:10,319 --> 01:02:10,960
give you

1574
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:12,880
>> well I'm I'm happy if someone else wants

1575
01:02:12,880 --> 01:02:14,559
to make it. very supportive of the

1576
01:02:14,559 --> 01:02:17,680
project. Um, just at least to provide

1577
01:02:17,680 --> 01:02:20,319
the option for the future, right? Like

1578
01:02:20,319 --> 01:02:22,240
respectfully agree with all the things

1579
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:24,000
that have been stated, but I'd love to

1580
01:02:24,000 --> 01:02:24,880
see this.

1581
01:02:24,880 --> 01:02:26,960
>> And I will make a motion that the city

1582
01:02:26,960 --> 01:02:29,040
council accept the results of the South

1583
01:02:29,040 --> 01:02:30,880
Davis Greenway feasibility study and

1584
01:02:30,880 --> 01:02:37,349
associated completed documentation.

1585
01:02:37,359 --> 01:02:38,640
» Have a second.

1586
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:40,640
>> Second.

1587
01:02:40,640 --> 01:02:42,400
>> All right. Got a motion and a second.

1588
01:02:42,400 --> 01:02:44,559
We'll start with Councilman Banger going

1589
01:02:44,559 --> 01:02:45,520
to the right.

1590
01:02:45,520 --> 01:02:47,200
>> I I

1591
01:02:47,200 --> 01:02:48,720
>> I

1592
01:02:48,720 --> 01:02:50,720
>> All right, that pass unanimously. Thank

1593
01:02:50,720 --> 01:02:52,400
you, Mike. Thanks, Dick, for coming.

1594
01:02:52,400 --> 01:02:54,160
Appreciate it. All right, let's go to

1595
01:02:54,160 --> 01:02:56,400
our uh one of our public hearing

1596
01:02:56,400 --> 01:03:00,400
matters. This is a public hearing uh

1597
01:03:00,400 --> 01:03:04,000
related to DATUS detached access

1598
01:03:04,000 --> 01:03:07,280
accessory dwelling units and this has

1599
01:03:07,280 --> 01:03:10,240
gone through planning commission uh

1600
01:03:10,240 --> 01:03:13,040
three sessions and Mike will tell us

1601
01:03:13,040 --> 01:03:15,839
some [snorts] about that as well as uh

1602
01:03:15,839 --> 01:03:18,240
other things

1603
01:03:18,240 --> 01:03:21,520
that uh this is one of those deals again

1604
01:03:21,520 --> 01:03:24,720
I believe Mike that we have legislators

1605
01:03:24,720 --> 01:03:26,960
saying saying we need to submit

1606
01:03:26,960 --> 01:03:28,559
something right by October 1.

1607
01:03:28,559 --> 01:03:29,760
>> Correct.

1608
01:03:29,760 --> 01:03:31,599
>> Yeah. Um, [clears throat] thank you,

1609
01:03:31,599 --> 01:03:34,880
Mayor, Council. Um, so this is Yeah,

1610
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:37,200
this is a a little bit of a a

1611
01:03:37,200 --> 01:03:38,799
challenging discussion, I know, for

1612
01:03:38,799 --> 01:03:41,599
everybody. Uh, as the mayor said, um,

1613
01:03:41,599 --> 01:03:44,720
per state code,

1614
01:03:44,720 --> 01:03:49,510
let's see which one it was. It was

1615
01:03:49,520 --> 01:03:51,280
Senate Bill 284. That's what it was.

1616
01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:53,359
Local land and water modifications,

1617
01:03:53,359 --> 01:03:56,400
which the governor signed on March 18th.

1618
01:03:56,400 --> 01:03:59,680
The state legislature approved this bill

1619
01:03:59,680 --> 01:04:02,720
that codified um detach accessory

1620
01:04:02,720 --> 01:04:05,200
dwelling units as found in in Utah state

1621
01:04:05,200 --> 01:04:07,839
code 10-21-304.

1622
01:04:07,839 --> 01:04:10,480
Um one of the requirements for this

1623
01:04:10,480 --> 01:04:14,559
detached ADU language is that each city

1624
01:04:14,559 --> 01:04:18,240
have the a code standard in place by

1625
01:04:18,240 --> 01:04:20,079
October 1st in their communities to

1626
01:04:20,079 --> 01:04:22,079
continue to be in compliance with state

1627
01:04:22,079 --> 01:04:28,160
requirements. Um, so we started after I

1628
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:29,520
guess to give you a quick history on

1629
01:04:29,520 --> 01:04:31,680
this after the governor signed it and

1630
01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:34,319
things rolled out. Um, we started to get

1631
01:04:34,319 --> 01:04:36,079
information as cities from the Utah

1632
01:04:36,079 --> 01:04:38,079
League of Cities and towns relative to

1633
01:04:38,079 --> 01:04:40,400
how do you tackle the detached accessory

1634
01:04:40,400 --> 01:04:42,799
dwelling requirements? and I

1635
01:04:42,799 --> 01:04:45,280
participated in those sessions in April

1636
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:48,000
and even into May um and got the

1637
01:04:48,000 --> 01:04:50,720
guidance necessary regarding

1638
01:04:50,720 --> 01:04:52,319
what you have to have in a detached

1639
01:04:52,319 --> 01:04:54,400
accessory dwelling unit, what you can

1640
01:04:54,400 --> 01:04:56,079
have optionally in detach accessory

1641
01:04:56,079 --> 01:04:58,559
dwelling unit code um and what you can

1642
01:04:58,559 --> 01:05:00,079
what are you you basically are not

1643
01:05:00,079 --> 01:05:08,559
allowed to regulate. So there were three um things that had to be evaluated

1644
01:05:08,559 --> 01:05:10,960
when looking at how you establish this

1645
01:05:10,960 --> 01:05:14,240
code. And so it was a big animal and

1646
01:05:14,240 --> 01:05:16,160
there are not there are not very many

1647
01:05:16,160 --> 01:05:18,880
cities that I found through my research

1648
01:05:18,880 --> 01:05:22,160
during May and June in Davis County that

1649
01:05:22,160 --> 01:05:23,839
have detached accessory growing and it's

1650
01:05:23,839 --> 01:05:26,960
currently existing. And so

1651
01:05:26,960 --> 01:05:29,920
um I went and I did uh the research

1652
01:05:29,920 --> 01:05:33,039
necessary looking at the ones that we

1653
01:05:33,039 --> 01:05:36,000
had neighboring um Farmington. I don't

1654
01:05:36,000 --> 01:05:37,839
think we wanted to reflect their codes.

1655
01:05:37,839 --> 01:05:39,200
I didn't give it a lot of credence

1656
01:05:39,200 --> 01:05:40,799
because they have kind of a more of a

1657
01:05:40,799 --> 01:05:42,480
pioneering concept that I don't think is

1658
01:05:42,480 --> 01:05:43,839
conducive to what Centerville is

1659
01:05:43,839 --> 01:05:46,160
seeking. Um, and Bountiful has one.

1660
01:05:46,160 --> 01:05:48,720
They've had theirs in place since 2008.

1661
01:05:48,720 --> 01:05:50,720
So, I looked to them. Uh, I did look at

1662
01:05:50,720 --> 01:05:52,559
North Salt Lake. And I kind of tried to

1663
01:05:52,559 --> 01:05:54,000
look at comparable cities. I think I

1664
01:05:54,000 --> 01:05:57,200
pulled in West Point and uh, obviously I

1665
01:05:57,200 --> 01:05:59,200
pulled in Mil Creek. Um, I looked at

1666
01:05:59,200 --> 01:06:00,880
South Salt Lake or Salt Lake County

1667
01:06:00,880 --> 01:06:02,160
because I thought theirs was had some

1668
01:06:02,160 --> 01:06:04,079
unique features that match some of the

1669
01:06:04,079 --> 01:06:06,000
things we might be looking for and also

1670
01:06:06,000 --> 01:06:08,240
seem to match state compliance as well

1671
01:06:08,240 --> 01:06:10,559
as even as far as Eagle Mountain and and

1672
01:06:10,559 --> 01:06:12,000
the reason for that is again just to try

1673
01:06:12,000 --> 01:06:14,559
to get a broad enough survey but uh some

1674
01:06:14,559 --> 01:06:16,559
of the other areas like Leighton had one

1675
01:06:16,559 --> 01:06:18,079
but again it wasn't conducive to the

1676
01:06:18,079 --> 01:06:20,079
city. Anyway, so throughout the month of

1677
01:06:20,079 --> 01:06:22,079
June, I did the survey and I had talked

1678
01:06:22,079 --> 01:06:23,839
to the planning commission about the

1679
01:06:23,839 --> 01:06:25,359
need to bring this forward in order to

1680
01:06:25,359 --> 01:06:26,720
hit the timelines. Looking at calendar

1681
01:06:26,720 --> 01:06:28,640
clearly to hit everything, it would

1682
01:06:28,640 --> 01:06:29,839
require some time with the planning

1683
01:06:29,839 --> 01:06:32,160
commission and uh public hearings that

1684
01:06:32,160 --> 01:06:33,839
are required as well as bring it to the

1685
01:06:33,839 --> 01:06:36,640
council. So, we did have um our first

1686
01:06:36,640 --> 01:06:37,839
discussion with the planning commission

1687
01:06:37,839 --> 01:06:39,920
on June 8th. I brought forward the first

1688
01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:41,680
survey. I brought forward state code

1689
01:06:41,680 --> 01:06:44,480
requirements. I'm not sure if we had the

1690
01:06:44,480 --> 01:06:46,559
one pager from the Utah and cities and

1691
01:06:46,559 --> 01:06:49,440
town available at that point. Um but and

1692
01:06:49,440 --> 01:06:54,319
I brought forward uh a first draft of a

1693
01:06:54,319 --> 01:06:57,119
detached ADU ordinance that seemed to be

1694
01:06:57,119 --> 01:06:58,880
a good starting point which was the Mil

1695
01:06:58,880 --> 01:07:01,280
Creek one. And what I did is I brought

1696
01:07:01,280 --> 01:07:03,440
in code sections that we had already

1697
01:07:03,440 --> 01:07:05,280
established in our internal ADU

1698
01:07:05,280 --> 01:07:07,359
ordinance as well and pushed those

1699
01:07:07,359 --> 01:07:08,960
things in that seem to think be things

1700
01:07:08,960 --> 01:07:10,799
we already had wanted and are utilizing

1701
01:07:10,799 --> 01:07:13,200
with the internal accessory drawing unit

1702
01:07:13,200 --> 01:07:16,319
in addition to the new creek code to to

1703
01:07:16,319 --> 01:07:18,400
have that starting point. And then I got

1704
01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:19,680
direction from the planning commission

1705
01:07:19,680 --> 01:07:22,160
during the July 8th meeting. Um did some

1706
01:07:22,160 --> 01:07:24,400
more investigation and revisions.

1707
01:07:24,400 --> 01:07:26,720
further went and looked at um things

1708
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:29,039
that were in other city codes that

1709
01:07:29,039 --> 01:07:32,000
optionally could further be researched

1710
01:07:32,000 --> 01:07:34,559
or evaluated by the planning commission

1711
01:07:34,559 --> 01:07:38,880
um and staff of ways to um

1712
01:07:38,880 --> 01:07:41,039
if if directed to do so or evaluated to

1713
01:07:41,039 --> 01:07:44,319
do so adjust into the code um that was

1714
01:07:44,319 --> 01:07:47,119
the draft those concepts. Um, I did

1715
01:07:47,119 --> 01:07:50,640
provide the the state requirements from

1716
01:07:50,640 --> 01:07:52,480
the Utah League of Cities and Towns in

1717
01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:54,079
that packet and we discussed that at

1718
01:07:54,079 --> 01:07:56,799
length. Um, and that was brought forward

1719
01:07:56,799 --> 01:07:58,559
to the July 22nd meeting that I'm

1720
01:07:58,559 --> 01:08:01,760
evidencing here in the packet. um and we

1721
01:08:01,760 --> 01:08:04,640
started to refine these concepts and

1722
01:08:04,640 --> 01:08:06,559
then um they set the public hearing for

1723
01:08:06,559 --> 01:08:09,119
August 12th and they still had

1724
01:08:09,119 --> 01:08:12,319
additional questions that came as you probably saw in the packet an email

1725
01:08:12,319 --> 01:08:14,319
conversation and some responses to that

1726
01:08:14,319 --> 01:08:16,000
email conversation as well as they asked

1727
01:08:16,000 --> 01:08:19,440
me to research from Bountiful City um

1728
01:08:19,440 --> 01:08:21,440
how many existing detached accessory

1729
01:08:21,440 --> 01:08:23,600
dwelling unit permits they had what kind

1730
01:08:23,600 --> 01:08:26,480
of um requests they're getting is it is

1731
01:08:26,480 --> 01:08:28,560
it an active program and you can see the

1732
01:08:28,560 --> 01:08:30,239
responses in there but what was really

1733
01:08:30,239 --> 01:08:31,440
interesting is they started their

1734
01:08:31,440 --> 01:08:34,080
program in 2008 and they only evidenced

1735
01:08:34,080 --> 01:08:37,759
27 uh known

1736
01:08:37,759 --> 01:08:39,839
uh applications that are are processed

1737
01:08:39,839 --> 01:08:41,520
and existing in their community. That

1738
01:08:41,520 --> 01:08:43,199
doesn't mean there aren't others, but

1739
01:08:43,199 --> 01:08:44,799
following the city requirements, they

1740
01:08:44,799 --> 01:08:46,880
have on record 27. So, that was an

1741
01:08:46,880 --> 01:08:50,239
interesting finding. Um, one thing I I

1742
01:08:50,239 --> 01:08:53,679
also want to note, um, is that as we

1743
01:08:53,679 --> 01:08:54,960
talked with the planning commission

1744
01:08:54,960 --> 01:08:57,839
about key features and and I'll come

1745
01:08:57,839 --> 01:09:00,400
back quickly um, and go over what state

1746
01:09:00,400 --> 01:09:05,040
requirements are specifically, but um,

1747
01:09:05,040 --> 01:09:08,239
the planning commission had to evaluate

1748
01:09:08,239 --> 01:09:09,759
things that the state code didn't drive

1749
01:09:09,759 --> 01:09:11,920
like what is what should be the setback

1750
01:09:11,920 --> 01:09:14,319
for it, how tall should it be, are there

1751
01:09:14,319 --> 01:09:15,679
going to be second stories allowed, are

1752
01:09:15,679 --> 01:09:18,239
there going to be basements? um what

1753
01:09:18,239 --> 01:09:21,279
size of units um those sorts of things

1754
01:09:21,279 --> 01:09:24,560
were things that the state had no real

1755
01:09:24,560 --> 01:09:27,839
commentary on and so the the planning

1756
01:09:27,839 --> 01:09:29,199
commission had to evaluate those options

1757
01:09:29,199 --> 01:09:32,000
but anyway let me share with you if if

1758
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:34,400
you'll just indulge me uh the statutory

1759
01:09:34,400 --> 01:09:37,279
requirements so um this is per Utah

1760
01:09:37,279 --> 01:09:39,440
legacies and towns and this is found in

1761
01:09:39,440 --> 01:09:40,960
10-21-304

1762
01:09:40,960 --> 01:09:43,359
of the state code um to be compliant

1763
01:09:43,359 --> 01:09:45,199
with state law city data's ordinance

1764
01:09:45,199 --> 01:09:47,440
must have must allow

1765
01:09:47,440 --> 01:09:49,600
dad who's on lots larger than 11,000

1766
01:09:49,600 --> 01:09:51,040
square ft with single family dwellings.

1767
01:09:51,040 --> 01:09:52,640
Now, you can optionally go lower than

1768
01:09:52,640 --> 01:09:54,640
that, but that's the starting point. You

1769
01:09:54,640 --> 01:09:56,320
can't make them any you can't go half

1770
01:09:56,320 --> 01:09:57,920
acre and say we're not accepting unless

1771
01:09:57,920 --> 01:10:00,400
they're halfacre. Require DADUs to

1772
01:10:00,400 --> 01:10:01,840
comply with all applicable building

1773
01:10:01,840 --> 01:10:03,280
health and fire codes. So, you must have

1774
01:10:03,280 --> 01:10:05,520
language that says that you must include

1775
01:10:05,520 --> 01:10:07,520
a process for conversion of a legally

1776
01:10:07,520 --> 01:10:09,120
constructed accessory structure to a

1777
01:10:09,120 --> 01:10:10,880
DATU subject to dwelling accessory

1778
01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:13,920
structure setback requirements. So, if

1779
01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:17,120
someone has a garage in the backyard,

1780
01:10:17,120 --> 01:10:18,880
you need to provide an opportunity for

1781
01:10:18,880 --> 01:10:20,320
them to be able to equip that garage

1782
01:10:20,320 --> 01:10:22,480
into potential daddy. As long as they

1783
01:10:22,480 --> 01:10:24,640
still meet your your setback

1784
01:10:24,640 --> 01:10:26,320
requirements and your other requirements

1785
01:10:26,320 --> 01:10:28,880
for that structure. So, if someone's 3

1786
01:10:28,880 --> 01:10:30,960
ft from the property line, they will

1787
01:10:30,960 --> 01:10:33,040
still qualify if your setback standard

1788
01:10:33,040 --> 01:10:35,520
and your code is 8 feet, for instance.

1789
01:10:35,520 --> 01:10:38,239
So, that that's what the state said

1790
01:10:38,239 --> 01:10:40,159
there. Um,

1791
01:10:40,159 --> 01:10:41,679
to be compliant with state law, your

1792
01:10:41,679 --> 01:10:43,440
city da city city's data's ordinance

1793
01:10:43,440 --> 01:10:45,360
must not require a conditional use

1794
01:10:45,360 --> 01:10:46,880
permit for a daddy proposed in the

1795
01:10:46,880 --> 01:10:49,360
primarily residential zone, require more

1796
01:10:49,360 --> 01:10:51,199
than one parking spot for a daddy less

1797
01:10:51,199 --> 01:10:53,360
than 650 ft or more than two parking

1798
01:10:53,360 --> 01:10:55,360
spots for all daddies, and include

1799
01:10:55,360 --> 01:10:57,199
design standards that conflict with

1800
01:10:57,199 --> 01:10:58,719
10-20-618,

1801
01:10:58,719 --> 01:11:01,360
which says you can't regulate the

1802
01:11:01,360 --> 01:11:03,280
exterior of a structure by telling what

1803
01:11:03,280 --> 01:11:04,800
colors it must have and what materials

1804
01:11:04,800 --> 01:11:06,800
it has to have and how the windows

1805
01:11:06,800 --> 01:11:08,640
should be designed. that that the state

1806
01:11:08,640 --> 01:11:10,400
code has said you can't require those

1807
01:11:10,400 --> 01:11:14,400
kind of of controls but but you can

1808
01:11:14,400 --> 01:11:18,560
still require you can still optionally

1809
01:11:18,560 --> 01:11:20,719
um require datadus to have a consistent

1810
01:11:20,719 --> 01:11:22,560
design with the single family dwelling

1811
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:24,239
in trade. So that's what they said

1812
01:11:24,239 --> 01:11:26,159
there. Now these are the things that you

1813
01:11:26,159 --> 01:11:29,280
can consider but you don't have to. Um

1814
01:11:29,280 --> 01:11:30,800
prohibiting datadus in areas with

1815
01:11:30,800 --> 01:11:33,120
inadequate access to utilities and or

1816
01:11:33,120 --> 01:11:34,880
insufficient infrastructure capacity on

1817
01:11:34,880 --> 01:11:36,960
a project and system level for sewer,

1818
01:11:36,960 --> 01:11:40,000
water, electric, storm water. Regulating

1819
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:42,320
size um individually in relation to the

1820
01:11:42,320 --> 01:11:44,480
single family dwelling dimension height,

1821
01:11:44,480 --> 01:11:45,840
maximum lot coverage, and setback

1822
01:11:45,840 --> 01:11:48,239
requirements. Prohibiting daddies from

1823
01:11:48,239 --> 01:11:49,760
being in front yards and public utility

1824
01:11:49,760 --> 01:11:51,600
easements. Prohibiting daddies from

1825
01:11:51,600 --> 01:11:52,800
being rented for less than 90

1826
01:11:52,800 --> 01:11:55,120
consecutive days. requiring the owner to

1827
01:11:55,120 --> 01:11:56,400
live in the single family dwelling or

1828
01:11:56,400 --> 01:11:58,960
the D-ADU. Requiring replacement of

1829
01:11:58,960 --> 01:12:00,800
on-site parking spaces when a garage is

1830
01:12:00,800 --> 01:12:03,280
converted to a DADU. Uh limiting a

1831
01:12:03,280 --> 01:12:05,040
property owner from having both a DADU

1832
01:12:05,040 --> 01:12:06,880
and an internal ADU on the same lot,

1833
01:12:06,880 --> 01:12:08,400
giving the property owner the choice to

1834
01:12:08,400 --> 01:12:11,280
have one or the other. Um they they must

1835
01:12:11,280 --> 01:12:13,360
still be permitted by city code, but the

1836
01:12:13,360 --> 01:12:14,800
city code may require property owner to

1837
01:12:14,800 --> 01:12:17,120
choose either one or the other. And then

1838
01:12:17,120 --> 01:12:18,800
you may require compliance with all

1839
01:12:18,800 --> 01:12:20,239
other the land use ordinances of the

1840
01:12:20,239 --> 01:12:21,679
city, including business licenses,

1841
01:12:21,679 --> 01:12:23,199
utility meters, mailing addresses, and

1842
01:12:23,199 --> 01:12:24,960
more. The reason I share all that with

1843
01:12:24,960 --> 01:12:28,480
you is that helps to understand the the

1844
01:12:28,480 --> 01:12:29,920
mindset the planning commission was

1845
01:12:29,920 --> 01:12:32,159
dealing with when evaluating all the

1846
01:12:32,159 --> 01:12:33,840
options that were on the table and what

1847
01:12:33,840 --> 01:12:36,640
the state was saying you have to do. And

1848
01:12:36,640 --> 01:12:39,280
one of the things that I will say staff

1849
01:12:39,280 --> 01:12:42,080
was trying to say is now look the state

1850
01:12:42,080 --> 01:12:44,560
of Utah says 11,000 ft is a starting

1851
01:12:44,560 --> 01:12:46,400
point. You don't have to go smaller. the

1852
01:12:46,400 --> 01:12:47,679
planning commission did opt to go

1853
01:12:47,679 --> 01:12:50,480
smaller as evidenced in their minutes um

1854
01:12:50,480 --> 01:12:53,760
for purposes that the minutes reflect um

1855
01:12:53,760 --> 01:12:55,440
that was a decision that they they

1856
01:12:55,440 --> 01:12:57,600
recommended as well as the size of the

1857
01:12:57,600 --> 01:12:59,840
structure like I said um they're the

1858
01:12:59,840 --> 01:13:02,080
ones that I think they picked I think it

1859
01:13:02,080 --> 01:13:04,640
it's 600 f feet or 500 feet I read it

1860
01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:06,640
earlier but I don't remember up to I

1861
01:13:06,640 --> 01:13:10,000
think it was 1,200 square ft um but one

1862
01:13:10,000 --> 01:13:11,840
floor could only be a maximum of 800

1863
01:13:11,840 --> 01:13:13,840
square f feet um and then obviously the

1864
01:13:13,840 --> 01:13:15,120
other space could be that differential

1865
01:13:15,120 --> 01:13:19,520
up to that 1,200. So anyway, there were nuances there. The reason

1866
01:13:19,520 --> 01:13:23,199
that um the setback was set at 8 ft was

1867
01:13:23,199 --> 01:13:25,760
because existing uh single family

1868
01:13:25,760 --> 01:13:27,840
residential dwellings in the sideyard

1869
01:13:27,840 --> 01:13:30,480
are set back at a 8 ft minimum standard

1870
01:13:30,480 --> 01:13:34,400
combined 10. And also your P your POE is

1871
01:13:34,400 --> 01:13:36,960
a 7 foot pee on the sideyards and even

1872
01:13:36,960 --> 01:13:39,120
the rear yard. And so the thought was 8

1873
01:13:39,120 --> 01:13:42,320
foot was a consistent application for

1874
01:13:42,320 --> 01:13:44,719
DADU of that location to stay off the

1875
01:13:44,719 --> 01:13:47,280
pee and also match up with uh

1876
01:13:47,280 --> 01:13:48,719
consistency with the single family

1877
01:13:48,719 --> 01:13:51,760
dwelling. So I know I've said a lot. Um

1878
01:13:51,760 --> 01:13:53,520
I just want to note that there are

1879
01:13:53,520 --> 01:13:56,080
multiple documents in your packet that

1880
01:13:56,080 --> 01:13:59,360
further I hopefully hopefully provide

1881
01:13:59,360 --> 01:14:01,280
the full body of of research and

1882
01:14:01,280 --> 01:14:03,040
discussion and information that has been

1883
01:14:03,040 --> 01:14:05,040
provided and and brought forward over

1884
01:14:05,040 --> 01:14:07,520
the months to get to this point. And I

1885
01:14:07,520 --> 01:14:09,679
know it's not the the best most exciting

1886
01:14:09,679 --> 01:14:12,000
place to be, but we do have to try to

1887
01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:13,840
figure out what direction we want to go

1888
01:14:13,840 --> 01:14:16,560
at least for the October 1st deadline.

1889
01:14:16,560 --> 01:14:18,640
That doesn't mean that we can't bring

1890
01:14:18,640 --> 01:14:20,640
back other ideas and concepts that we

1891
01:14:20,640 --> 01:14:23,679
want to explore further as a city um

1892
01:14:23,679 --> 01:14:25,920
either given direction from the council

1893
01:14:25,920 --> 01:14:27,440
andor in discussion with the planning

1894
01:14:27,440 --> 01:14:29,280
commission to further refine things that

1895
01:14:29,280 --> 01:14:31,600
are really desirable or need further

1896
01:14:31,600 --> 01:14:34,239
refining within the code to make it more

1897
01:14:34,239 --> 01:14:37,440
what the city wants to see. Um, so I

1898
01:14:37,440 --> 01:14:38,800
guess what I'm saying is we would have

1899
01:14:38,800 --> 01:14:41,199
more time after to go and do that

1900
01:14:41,199 --> 01:14:44,480
research and further refine the the the

1901
01:14:44,480 --> 01:14:51,120
um code with whatever version might be approved by October 1st. So with

1902
01:14:51,120 --> 01:14:52,640
that, hopefully that gives you enough

1903
01:14:52,640 --> 01:14:54,080
information and and I appreciate your

1904
01:14:54,080 --> 01:14:55,520
indulgence and patience with me sharing

1905
01:14:55,520 --> 01:14:58,000
that, mayor and council. Thank you.

1906
01:14:58,000 --> 01:15:00,080
>> Sure. So this is public hearing but

1907
01:15:00,080 --> 01:15:02,080
questions for Mike before we do a public

1908
01:15:02,080 --> 01:15:04,320
hearing on anything he said or what you

1909
01:15:04,320 --> 01:15:06,560
have in your packet. I appreciate

1910
01:15:06,560 --> 01:15:08,560
council. You got a big packet this time.

1911
01:15:08,560 --> 01:15:11,840
So appreciate uh all of you for reading

1912
01:15:11,840 --> 01:15:15,679
every page. But um so fire if you have

1913
01:15:15,679 --> 01:15:17,040
any questions for Mike before we do a

1914
01:15:17,040 --> 01:15:19,920
public hearing. If I got Mario, so

1915
01:15:19,920 --> 01:15:22,000
Spencer Summer Hayes submitted to the

1916
01:15:22,000 --> 01:15:23,760
city council in advance of this meeting

1917
01:15:23,760 --> 01:15:25,360
some thoughts and it looks like he had a

1918
01:15:25,360 --> 01:15:27,760
conversation with you um in advance of

1919
01:15:27,760 --> 01:15:30,239
the city council meeting. Are are you

1920
01:15:30,239 --> 01:15:33,120
prepared to address the comments today

1921
01:15:33,120 --> 01:15:34,880
that he has submitted or would you

1922
01:15:34,880 --> 01:15:37,760
propose that we pass the ordinance as

1923
01:15:37,760 --> 01:15:40,239
proposed by the planning commission or

1924
01:15:40,239 --> 01:15:41,360
as recommended by the planning

1925
01:15:41,360 --> 01:15:44,000
commission and come back to us with more

1926
01:15:44,000 --> 01:15:46,719
cogent responses to Spencer's

1927
01:15:46,719 --> 01:15:49,199
suggestions? I I think when it comes to

1928
01:15:49,199 --> 01:15:51,520
the second story, there's three points

1929
01:15:51,520 --> 01:15:53,920
that very clearly states that second

1930
01:15:53,920 --> 01:15:57,280
story development of of an accessory

1931
01:15:57,280 --> 01:15:59,840
building is not available for DDU uh

1932
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:02,000
use. I mean, if we needed to further

1933
01:16:02,000 --> 01:16:07,679
clarify with his statement about attic or eaves, further defining what

1934
01:16:07,679 --> 01:16:09,600
that means, that would not take much to

1935
01:16:09,600 --> 01:16:11,280
do that if if directed to do so by

1936
01:16:11,280 --> 01:16:14,239
council. Um, I don't know how to comment

1937
01:16:14,239 --> 01:16:17,120
on the the four corners discussion.

1938
01:16:17,120 --> 01:16:20,000
Again, I mean, eight feet seems to be

1939
01:16:20,000 --> 01:16:21,760
similar to a single family dwelling.

1940
01:16:21,760 --> 01:16:23,600
Could Could four property owners all

1941
01:16:23,600 --> 01:16:27,360
have a detached ADU? Certainly. I don't

1942
01:16:27,360 --> 01:16:29,679
know if if Bountiful statistics are tell

1943
01:16:29,679 --> 01:16:31,120
of how many people will employ in

1944
01:16:31,120 --> 01:16:33,040
Centerville, but again, it's been in

1945
01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:36,560
place in in Bountiful for 18 years and

1946
01:16:36,560 --> 01:16:40,880
there's 27 known accepted DADU. So I

1947
01:16:40,880 --> 01:16:42,640
guess what I'm getting at there is the

1948
01:16:42,640 --> 01:16:45,440
likelihood of four neighbors doing what

1949
01:16:45,440 --> 01:16:48,880
he he proposes is probably

1950
01:16:48,880 --> 01:16:52,239
unlikely unlikely but not impossible. Um

1951
01:16:52,239 --> 01:16:53,760
so I don't know how to comment on that

1952
01:16:53,760 --> 01:16:55,120
other than that. I guess the only thing

1953
01:16:55,120 --> 01:16:57,760
you could do in that scenario is you can

1954
01:16:57,760 --> 01:17:00,239
make setbacks even more stringent. Say

1955
01:17:00,239 --> 01:17:04,800
10 feet or say if it's over 15 feet for

1956
01:17:04,800 --> 01:17:07,199
every foot or two it it has to be set

1957
01:17:07,199 --> 01:17:09,199
back even further inside 10 ft up to 12

1958
01:17:09,199 --> 01:17:10,560
feet or something. I suppose you could

1959
01:17:10,560 --> 01:17:12,320
do something like that in response to

1960
01:17:12,320 --> 01:17:13,440
his comment. But I

1961
01:17:13,440 --> 01:17:15,040
>> I guess that was my question because he

1962
01:17:15,040 --> 01:17:17,360
raises I think some interesting points

1963
01:17:17,360 --> 01:17:18,800
particularly with regard to urban

1964
01:17:18,800 --> 01:17:20,239
shadows and things like that. But I just

1965
01:17:20,239 --> 01:17:22,159
I was wondering are we are we at a point

1966
01:17:22,159 --> 01:17:24,080
where we could actually like get in and

1967
01:17:24,080 --> 01:17:25,440
make those changes to what's been

1968
01:17:25,440 --> 01:17:26,719
proposed right now or is that something

1969
01:17:26,719 --> 01:17:28,719
that we should certainly think about but

1970
01:17:28,719 --> 01:17:30,560
maybe in a

1971
01:17:30,560 --> 01:17:32,000
>> it's probably the latter with the

1972
01:17:32,000 --> 01:17:34,080
exception again of of attic and eface

1973
01:17:34,080 --> 01:17:35,760
that would not be hard to add but I

1974
01:17:35,760 --> 01:17:37,280
think the other conversations are are

1975
01:17:37,280 --> 01:17:38,000
definitely much

1976
01:17:38,000 --> 01:17:39,440
>> so I always get afraid of bringing in

1977
01:17:39,440 --> 01:17:41,600
comments so somebody that's emailed us

1978
01:17:41,600 --> 01:17:44,000
something uh if if all members of

1979
01:17:44,000 --> 01:17:45,280
council haven't seen

1980
01:17:45,280 --> 01:17:46,239
>> I have seen it

1981
01:17:46,239 --> 01:17:48,159
>> it was sent out to everyone I think

1982
01:17:48,159 --> 01:17:50,880
>> and I I appreciated what he sent. So, I

1983
01:17:50,880 --> 01:17:52,960
appreciate uh Council Member Haymon

1984
01:17:52,960 --> 01:17:54,800
bringing it up because I think it was

1985
01:17:54,800 --> 01:17:55,199
important.

1986
01:17:55,199 --> 01:17:57,040
>> Can I can I ask another clarifying

1987
01:17:57,040 --> 01:17:59,600
question? So, I did I did reach out I

1988
01:17:59,600 --> 01:18:01,440
reached out to who I could quickly on

1989
01:18:01,440 --> 01:18:03,520
some of those emails. I I did miss one

1990
01:18:03,520 --> 01:18:06,000
person, but he mentioned the 20 foot

1991
01:18:06,000 --> 01:18:09,600
height. It says a maximum of 20 feet. Is

1992
01:18:09,600 --> 01:18:13,199
that I know when we take a height for a

1993
01:18:13,199 --> 01:18:15,280
building, we go from the bottom of the

1994
01:18:15,280 --> 01:18:18,159
curb that they Yeah.

1995
01:18:18,159 --> 01:18:20,960
>> Yeah. And then we go something like the

1996
01:18:20,960 --> 01:18:24,159
rain like there's there's an average

1997
01:18:24,159 --> 01:18:27,199
going on. Is this 20 ft to the peak of

1998
01:18:27,199 --> 01:18:27,920
the roof?

1999
01:18:27,920 --> 01:18:28,159
>> No.

2000
01:18:28,159 --> 01:18:29,679
It's measured. It could be

2001
01:18:29,679 --> 01:18:31,760
significantly.

2002
01:18:31,760 --> 01:18:34,089
>> So So the average would be here.

2003
01:18:34,089 --> 01:18:34,400
[laughter]

2004
01:18:34,400 --> 01:18:36,080
>> Planning Commission did discuss that and

2005
01:18:36,080 --> 01:18:38,000
staff's recommendation is that if we

2006
01:18:38,000 --> 01:18:40,400
already have a measurement or a

2007
01:18:40,400 --> 01:18:42,480
provision in our code that we stick with

2008
01:18:42,480 --> 01:18:44,719
that because we don't want separate, you

2009
01:18:44,719 --> 01:18:46,719
know, calculations.

2010
01:18:46,719 --> 01:18:48,159
um if you need to look at your height

2011
01:18:48,159 --> 01:18:51,040
calculation in general. Um yeah, but I

2012
01:18:51,040 --> 01:18:52,480
did want to say that

2013
01:18:52,480 --> 01:18:54,960
>> just for the record, we did receive two

2014
01:18:54,960 --> 01:18:57,600
written public comments and um I think

2015
01:18:57,600 --> 01:18:59,440
most of those went to the city council.

2016
01:18:59,440 --> 01:19:01,520
They will be or should be included as

2017
01:19:01,520 --> 01:19:04,000
part of the record. Um whether those

2018
01:19:04,000 --> 01:19:05,679
people speak in this public hearing or

2019
01:19:05,679 --> 01:19:07,840
not, it's written public comment that

2020
01:19:07,840 --> 01:19:09,280
will be part of the record. So

2021
01:19:09,280 --> 01:19:10,800
>> that's what I was going to say. We can

2022
01:19:10,800 --> 01:19:12,640
we that's got to be in front of the

2023
01:19:12,640 --> 01:19:14,400
public as well too. if you're talking

2024
01:19:14,400 --> 01:19:16,000
about something here the public hasn't

2025
01:19:16,000 --> 01:19:16,480
seen.

2026
01:19:16,480 --> 01:19:18,480
>> Right. And I do want to say

2027
01:19:18,480 --> 01:19:20,320
>> are those in the are they included in

2028
01:19:20,320 --> 01:19:21,600
the packet? I know I got the email.

2029
01:19:21,600 --> 01:19:22,800
>> They were not because they came in

2030
01:19:22,800 --> 01:19:24,000
later.

2031
01:19:24,000 --> 01:19:24,560
>> Absolutely.

2032
01:19:24,560 --> 01:19:26,800
>> I think today so we maybe need to table

2033
01:19:26,800 --> 01:19:27,360
and

2034
01:19:27,360 --> 01:19:29,760
>> Right. You can certainly table. Um but I

2035
01:19:29,760 --> 01:19:31,199
just wanted to make a comment as well. I

2036
01:19:31,199 --> 01:19:33,040
think Mike has done a good job, you

2037
01:19:33,040 --> 01:19:34,400
know, seeing what other cities that have

2038
01:19:34,400 --> 01:19:36,239
these ordinances in place and also

2039
01:19:36,239 --> 01:19:37,840
trying to address, you know, the ne

2040
01:19:37,840 --> 01:19:40,560
unique circumstances of Centerville. Um

2041
01:19:40,560 --> 01:19:42,400
staff's recommendation at the planning

2042
01:19:42,400 --> 01:19:45,360
commission level was just go with the

2043
01:19:45,360 --> 01:19:47,840
state requirements. We don't need to get

2044
01:19:47,840 --> 01:19:52,000
creative at this level. This is a new um

2045
01:19:52,000 --> 01:19:54,800
you know type of structure in our city.

2046
01:19:54,800 --> 01:19:57,120
And so you know trying to start out

2047
01:19:57,120 --> 01:19:59,199
conservative rather than you know

2048
01:19:59,199 --> 01:20:01,520
getting creative. And so the two areas

2049
01:20:01,520 --> 01:20:03,440
that I see the planning commission went

2050
01:20:03,440 --> 01:20:05,360
less restrictive than state law is the

2051
01:20:05,360 --> 01:20:07,440
size of the lot. So they're recommending

2052
01:20:07,440 --> 01:20:10,080
8,500 and above. state law only requires

2053
01:20:10,080 --> 01:20:12,960
you to do 11,000 square feet and above

2054
01:20:12,960 --> 01:20:16,400
to allow these types um of units. And I

2055
01:20:16,400 --> 01:20:17,679
also think that there was some

2056
01:20:17,679 --> 01:20:19,920
discussion and the planning commission

2057
01:20:19,920 --> 01:20:22,960
recommended allowing basements and other

2058
01:20:22,960 --> 01:20:25,040
cities do not allow a basement for

2059
01:20:25,040 --> 01:20:27,120
these. Now, we haven't done the research

2060
01:20:27,120 --> 01:20:29,679
on that, but basement do create

2061
01:20:29,679 --> 01:20:31,280
additional issues here in Centerville

2062
01:20:31,280 --> 01:20:33,840
with groundwater and and other, you

2063
01:20:33,840 --> 01:20:36,560
know, concerns and maybe building codes,

2064
01:20:36,560 --> 01:20:38,480
etc. It also makes it a bigger

2065
01:20:38,480 --> 01:20:40,960
structure. So, those were the two things

2066
01:20:40,960 --> 01:20:43,760
in re-reviewing the the ordinance today

2067
01:20:43,760 --> 01:20:46,000
that I think the planning commission's

2068
01:20:46,000 --> 01:20:48,800
recommendation is slightly more lenient

2069
01:20:48,800 --> 01:20:50,960
than what the state code requires. There

2070
01:20:50,960 --> 01:20:52,800
may be other provisions, but those came

2071
01:20:52,800 --> 01:20:55,120
to mind. So, I wanted to highlight that.

2072
01:20:55,120 --> 01:20:57,840
Um, as well as

2073
01:20:57,840 --> 01:20:59,600
just yeah, understanding you can

2074
01:20:59,600 --> 01:21:01,280
certainly table this, take the public

2075
01:21:01,280 --> 01:21:03,520
comment. We have one more meeting. This

2076
01:21:03,520 --> 01:21:05,520
has been calendared out so that we can

2077
01:21:05,520 --> 01:21:09,840
meet this. But um it is a lengthy

2078
01:21:09,840 --> 01:21:11,679
ordinance but I think most of the

2079
01:21:11,679 --> 01:21:13,920
additional regulations are trying to you

2080
01:21:13,920 --> 01:21:16,480
know tighten it and address these these

2081
01:21:16,480 --> 01:21:18,640
discretionary issues that the state

2082
01:21:18,640 --> 01:21:23,360
allows municipalities to address. So um

2083
01:21:23,360 --> 01:21:26,159
>> I I have a number of comments to address

2084
01:21:26,159 --> 01:21:28,000
but I think we need to have the public

2085
01:21:28,000 --> 01:21:31,440
hearing. Is there anybody online?

2086
01:21:31,440 --> 01:21:33,520
Well, we'll I'll go to public hearing

2087
01:21:33,520 --> 01:21:35,600
generally in following the process we

2088
01:21:35,600 --> 01:21:37,840
use. We ask questions of staff. If

2089
01:21:37,840 --> 01:21:39,840
you're done with staff, then we go to

2090
01:21:39,840 --> 01:21:41,520
public hearing. You can come back and

2091
01:21:41,520 --> 01:21:43,840
ask more questions too. Anything from

2092
01:21:43,840 --> 01:21:45,760
the public hearing that or anything from

2093
01:21:45,760 --> 01:21:46,239
the staff.

2094
01:21:46,239 --> 01:21:47,679
>> Just one clarification, Lisa. I did

2095
01:21:47,679 --> 01:21:49,120
check with Bountiful. They do allow

2096
01:21:49,120 --> 01:21:51,280
basement in and D just for

2097
01:21:51,280 --> 01:21:52,800
clarification.

2098
01:21:52,800 --> 01:21:54,239
>> Okay. Some of this is addressed to

2099
01:21:54,239 --> 01:21:57,141
staff. Let me let me go there. Uh, first

2100
01:21:57,141 --> 01:21:58,239
[clears throat] of all, I'll I'll just

2101
01:21:58,239 --> 01:22:01,440
identify that that this council member

2102
01:22:01,440 --> 01:22:04,880
is very amanable to ADUs and

2103
01:22:04,880 --> 01:22:08,000
specifically detached ADUs. And I've

2104
01:22:08,000 --> 01:22:10,320
recently been through an election where

2105
01:22:10,320 --> 01:22:13,600
it was brought up repeatedly. And I am

2106
01:22:13,600 --> 01:22:17,360
confident that a vast number of our

2107
01:22:17,360 --> 01:22:20,239
residents support this idea as a way to

2108
01:22:20,239 --> 01:22:23,280
provide some more affordable moderate

2109
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:26,320
housing for residents in need. That's

2110
01:22:26,320 --> 01:22:28,239
been identified extensively as we've

2111
01:22:28,239 --> 01:22:33,840
been looking at general plan stuff. So, I'm I'm I'm pleased the state's taken

2112
01:22:33,840 --> 01:22:37,199
some action. I'm a little concerned and

2113
01:22:37,199 --> 01:22:39,920
I want to understand what is the penalty

2114
01:22:39,920 --> 01:22:41,920
and I want to be ready before October

2115
01:22:41,920 --> 01:22:43,679
1st. But what's the penalty if we

2116
01:22:43,679 --> 01:22:47,990
weren't what what would that mean?

2117
01:22:48,000 --> 01:22:49,760
» I would think somebody could probably do

2118
01:22:49,760 --> 01:22:51,600
it without

2119
01:22:51,600 --> 01:22:53,280
>> we don't have any ordinance in place and

2120
01:22:53,280 --> 01:22:56,400
it becomes legal on October 1st. So we

2121
01:22:56,400 --> 01:22:58,560
would lose our rights of saying you can

2122
01:22:58,560 --> 01:23:00,400
only be this high, you can do this, you

2123
01:23:00,400 --> 01:23:02,080
can do that. We have to have that in

2124
01:23:02,080 --> 01:23:05,199
place because on se on October 1st it's

2125
01:23:05,199 --> 01:23:07,120
going to be the state. Am I wrong?

2126
01:23:07,120 --> 01:23:07,520
>> Yeah.

2127
01:23:07,520 --> 01:23:08,560
>> Okay.

2128
01:23:08,560 --> 01:23:09,360
>> That's the risk.

2129
01:23:09,360 --> 01:23:11,440
>> That would that would be my my fear is

2130
01:23:11,440 --> 01:23:14,080
that we'd have somebody come in and do

2131
01:23:14,080 --> 01:23:14,639
um

2132
01:23:14,639 --> 01:23:16,239
>> we would just be subject to the state

2133
01:23:16,239 --> 01:23:18,080
law mandates.

2134
01:23:18,080 --> 01:23:19,760
>> Okay. That helps. And it it it seems

2135
01:23:19,760 --> 01:23:22,000
like we're right down to the wire. And I

2136
01:23:22,000 --> 01:23:23,760
understand staff, you've been

2137
01:23:23,760 --> 01:23:26,480
overburdened and and it has been

2138
01:23:26,480 --> 01:23:28,400
cumbersome to know what the league was

2139
01:23:28,400 --> 01:23:30,000
going to suggest all those things. I

2140
01:23:30,000 --> 01:23:31,280
totally get that. I think planning

2141
01:23:31,280 --> 01:23:34,400
commission identified that. Uh I I do

2142
01:23:34,400 --> 01:23:38,000
want to identify that uh I listened

2143
01:23:38,000 --> 01:23:40,239
intently from Alaska to that planning

2144
01:23:40,239 --> 01:23:43,760
commission meeting. I was all ears and

2145
01:23:43,760 --> 01:23:47,760
uh uh it was clear that there was some

2146
01:23:47,760 --> 01:23:50,239
public comment brought forward to them

2147
01:23:50,239 --> 01:23:55,360
by the Riley's and other gal there and we've had other public comments

2148
01:23:55,360 --> 01:23:57,840
since then in writing. We gave a fair

2149
01:23:57,840 --> 01:23:59,280
amount of attention just now to Mr.

2150
01:23:59,280 --> 01:24:02,000
Summer Haz's comments and probably ought

2151
01:24:02,000 --> 01:24:06,239
to be equally dispersed in what but but that's that's just something I

2152
01:24:06,239 --> 01:24:10,080
wanted to point out and I do want to point out it wasn't addressed in

2153
01:24:10,080 --> 01:24:11,840
the draft minutes that are in our packet

2154
01:24:11,840 --> 01:24:16,239
from the planning commission but but uh

2155
01:24:16,239 --> 01:24:17,840
commission

2156
01:24:17,840 --> 01:24:21,840
chair ma mason care and I need to quote

2157
01:24:21,840 --> 01:24:23,280
this because because if you didn't if

2158
01:24:23,280 --> 01:24:24,639
you haven't listened to that I think

2159
01:24:24,639 --> 01:24:28,320
this is critical to our our timing here.

2160
01:24:28,320 --> 01:24:31,040
He said after thanking staff profu

2161
01:24:31,040 --> 01:24:33,440
profusely for the hard work

2162
01:24:33,440 --> 01:24:35,760
appropriately so to set this to get to

2163
01:24:35,760 --> 01:24:39,040
this point he said I'm going to say this

2164
01:24:39,040 --> 01:24:40,880
that I would like us to work on

2165
01:24:40,880 --> 01:24:43,040
modifying the code I just moved to

2166
01:24:43,040 --> 01:24:46,239
authorize which got a unanimous approval

2167
01:24:46,239 --> 01:24:48,400
with positive recommendation that we

2168
01:24:48,400 --> 01:24:50,719
address these situations the public

2169
01:24:50,719 --> 01:24:54,320
comment uh where it seems like to meet

2170
01:24:54,320 --> 01:24:57,120
the spirit and intent of the datadus

2171
01:24:57,120 --> 01:24:59,280
would be to allow allow a dad in these

2172
01:24:59,280 --> 01:25:02,800
situations in a front yard. Uh that

2173
01:25:02,800 --> 01:25:05,520
would make a lot of sense to me. At

2174
01:25:05,520 --> 01:25:07,199
least that would be the underlying

2175
01:25:07,199 --> 01:25:09,679
policy, I'm quoting him directly, behind

2176
01:25:09,679 --> 01:25:12,320
why we would want a DAU code to address

2177
01:25:12,320 --> 01:25:15,199
these situations, these few that that

2178
01:25:15,199 --> 01:25:18,000
created a challenge, but I want to do it

2179
01:25:18,000 --> 01:25:19,920
in a way that makes a lot of sense.

2180
01:25:19,920 --> 01:25:22,000
Yeah. I don't know what that looks like

2181
01:25:22,000 --> 01:25:25,040
yet, but it makes sense for everybody

2182
01:25:25,040 --> 01:25:26,639
with that direction. But does it make

2183
01:25:26,639 --> 01:25:28,480
sense for everybody? are you open to

2184
01:25:28,480 --> 01:25:30,560
other alternative

2185
01:25:30,560 --> 01:25:34,239
uh land use discussions? The the

2186
01:25:34,239 --> 01:25:35,760
planning commission said totally and

2187
01:25:35,760 --> 01:25:38,560
Mike agreed totally appropriately. And

2188
01:25:38,560 --> 01:25:41,600
then he says uh yeah, I would like that.

2189
01:25:41,600 --> 01:25:43,520
Sorry to saddle the staff with more

2190
01:25:43,520 --> 01:25:48,400
workload, but I feel quite strongly that is something we should address in

2191
01:25:48,400 --> 01:25:50,719
the near future. And it seems like

2192
01:25:50,719 --> 01:25:53,920
residents are waiting that wanting that

2193
01:25:53,920 --> 01:25:58,080
as the state does. Okay. So the planning

2194
01:25:58,080 --> 01:26:00,000
commission was was really strong on

2195
01:26:00,000 --> 01:26:02,320
that. It didn't reflect in the minutes

2196
01:26:02,320 --> 01:26:04,800
that they they agreed there were some

2197
01:26:04,800 --> 01:26:07,600
exceptions here that those those people

2198
01:26:07,600 --> 01:26:08,560
identified

2199
01:26:08,560 --> 01:26:10,800
>> and we're under a timeline, but but

2200
01:26:10,800 --> 01:26:14,880
let's do it quickly. I I suggest, you

2201
01:26:14,880 --> 01:26:18,880
know, we have a month. Well, we have two

2202
01:26:18,880 --> 01:26:20,639
weeks until our our next council

2203
01:26:20,639 --> 01:26:23,679
meeting. Uh so obviously I'm going to be

2204
01:26:23,679 --> 01:26:26,800
motioning to table this but in that time

2205
01:26:26,800 --> 01:26:28,320
there's another planning commission

2206
01:26:28,320 --> 01:26:30,719
meeting they can if we give them some

2207
01:26:30,719 --> 01:26:32,800
specific direction I would love to hear

2208
01:26:32,800 --> 01:26:34,560
seven planning commission members

2209
01:26:34,560 --> 01:26:36,639
feedback on some of the issues raised by

2210
01:26:36,639 --> 01:26:38,639
these public comments by Mr. summarized

2211
01:26:38,639 --> 01:26:41,920
by others and Mike staff's feedback on

2212
01:26:41,920 --> 01:26:45,679
that and then let's not say okay we're

2213
01:26:45,679 --> 01:26:47,280
to this point it's pretty good and it is

2214
01:26:47,280 --> 01:26:50,239
pretty good really good but but we're in

2215
01:26:50,239 --> 01:26:53,120
the process we're doing the public the

2216
01:26:53,120 --> 01:26:56,159
citizens work now the Riley's for

2217
01:26:56,159 --> 01:26:58,960
example they've they presented to this

2218
01:26:58,960 --> 01:27:02,000
city council in a very professional

2219
01:27:02,000 --> 01:27:04,000
concise

2220
01:27:04,000 --> 01:27:06,000
understandable way that I think all of

2221
01:27:06,000 --> 01:27:07,840
us I can't speak for all of us but

2222
01:27:07,840 --> 01:27:10,719
Everybody was impress that was February.

2223
01:27:10,719 --> 01:27:13,040
They've been waiting since now we're at

2224
01:27:13,040 --> 01:27:15,600
the point they've suggested that here

2225
01:27:15,600 --> 01:27:18,159
you are president doing a resolution or

2226
01:27:18,159 --> 01:27:20,880
an ordinance changing code. Let's

2227
01:27:20,880 --> 01:27:22,960
include these things. Let's get some

2228
01:27:22,960 --> 01:27:26,159
direction. And I agree we we can spend a

2229
01:27:26,159 --> 01:27:28,239
little later tonight or next week in

2230
01:27:28,239 --> 01:27:30,880
planning commission or the next meeting.

2231
01:27:30,880 --> 01:27:33,199
Let's not just say that that we've we've

2232
01:27:33,199 --> 01:27:34,480
done good to here. that's good enough

2233
01:27:34,480 --> 01:27:36,639
and then we're going to address it soon

2234
01:27:36,639 --> 01:27:38,239
because

2235
01:27:38,239 --> 01:27:40,400
that's frustrating to residents and and

2236
01:27:40,400 --> 01:27:42,560
I I think we can do better. And so

2237
01:27:42,560 --> 01:27:44,719
that's my plea. I I think it's

2238
01:27:44,719 --> 01:27:45,920
important. I think there's some

2239
01:27:45,920 --> 01:27:48,080
excellent issues brought up by this

2240
01:27:48,080 --> 01:27:49,600
additional public comment we've

2241
01:27:49,600 --> 01:27:51,920
received. I would like to be able to

2242
01:27:51,920 --> 01:27:54,159
address some of that. I don't think

2243
01:27:54,159 --> 01:27:56,560
we're going to get all of it done, but I

2244
01:27:56,560 --> 01:27:58,480
think we can get a substantial amount of

2245
01:27:58,480 --> 01:28:02,960
it agreed upon and voted upon uh yet

2246
01:28:02,960 --> 01:28:05,280
this month and be in compliance.

2247
01:28:05,280 --> 01:28:07,120
>> The the challenge with that is council

2248
01:28:07,120 --> 01:28:08,719
member Banger is you do have to have a

2249
01:28:08,719 --> 01:28:11,440
public hearing for new code and that's

2250
01:28:11,440 --> 01:28:13,520
where we'll run into timing issues with

2251
01:28:13,520 --> 01:28:16,719
that idea. I'm fine with that idea, but

2252
01:28:16,719 --> 01:28:18,239
it would it would put us to a point

2253
01:28:18,239 --> 01:28:19,760
where we would be on the October 1st

2254
01:28:19,760 --> 01:28:21,199
deadline and bring it back to the

2255
01:28:21,199 --> 01:28:21,840
council with

2256
01:28:21,840 --> 01:28:24,239
>> why can't we notice a public hearing

2257
01:28:24,239 --> 01:28:26,080
enough time for planning commission to

2258
01:28:26,080 --> 01:28:28,159
review and have the appropriate

2259
01:28:28,159 --> 01:28:30,800
notification public hearings

2260
01:28:30,800 --> 01:28:32,400
>> puts our back up against the wall. I'm

2261
01:28:32,400 --> 01:28:35,840
not really pleased about that, but I'm

2262
01:28:35,840 --> 01:28:38,480
with you. Let's table this now. I have

2263
01:28:38,480 --> 01:28:41,440
some concerns about the uh way it's

2264
01:28:41,440 --> 01:28:45,040
written right now. I feel like we're we're cutting it off rather

2265
01:28:45,040 --> 01:28:49,840
arbitrarily at 8,500. I've uh been in

2266
01:28:49,840 --> 01:28:52,239
places in St. George where they have

2267
01:28:52,239 --> 01:28:55,199
lots that are a tenth of an acre and

2268
01:28:55,199 --> 01:28:58,880
have a cassita detached ADU in the

2269
01:28:58,880 --> 01:28:59,600
backyard.

2270
01:28:59,600 --> 01:29:01,040
>> A tenth of an acre.

2271
01:29:01,040 --> 01:29:02,800
Wow.

2272
01:29:02,800 --> 01:29:05,920
>> So, it is possible to have uh these

2273
01:29:05,920 --> 01:29:07,040
>> 4,500 ft.

2274
01:29:07,040 --> 01:29:07,760
>> That is correct.

2275
01:29:07,760 --> 01:29:08,960
>> That would be

2276
01:29:08,960 --> 01:29:12,000
>> okay. I I don't [laughter] that's going

2277
01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:14,639
to be tied. I don't know.

2278
01:29:14,639 --> 01:29:17,440
>> I I'll show you the pictures on that on

2279
01:29:17,440 --> 01:29:18,000
that. There are pictures.

2280
01:29:18,000 --> 01:29:19,360
>> I was in Yuma. We had them, too. So, I'm

2281
01:29:19,360 --> 01:29:19,920
not disagreeing.

2282
01:29:19,920 --> 01:29:22,080
>> There are pictures and I and they are

2283
01:29:22,080 --> 01:29:22,719
very

2284
01:29:22,719 --> 01:29:24,400
>> I do think that would be helpful.

2285
01:29:24,400 --> 01:29:26,239
>> I went to a small home manufacturer in

2286
01:29:26,239 --> 01:29:29,280
St. George. Beautiful place and went out

2287
01:29:29,280 --> 01:29:32,880
to five subdivisions that uh they do.

2288
01:29:32,880 --> 01:29:35,360
Very nice places. I think we can have a

2289
01:29:35,360 --> 01:29:39,280
really good uh product for people with

2290
01:29:39,280 --> 01:29:41,600
all size lots. We shouldn't limit it to

2291
01:29:41,600 --> 01:29:45,040
just the upper uh sized lots and that

2292
01:29:45,040 --> 01:29:47,920
corners really do need to be looked at a

2293
01:29:47,920 --> 01:29:50,159
little bit more carefully

2294
01:29:50,159 --> 01:29:55,679
as we uh talk about uh these um datadus.

2295
01:29:55,679 --> 01:29:59,920
So I supportive of putting it off for a

2296
01:29:59,920 --> 01:30:01,920
couple weeks. But I I I need to

2297
01:30:01,920 --> 01:30:03,600
understand though the public hearing

2298
01:30:03,600 --> 01:30:06,080
part. Can we can we extend the public

2299
01:30:06,080 --> 01:30:08,639
hearing today so that we're we

2300
01:30:08,639 --> 01:30:10,639
>> it's not our public hearing. It's the

2301
01:30:10,639 --> 01:30:12,000
planning commission's public hearing.

2302
01:30:12,000 --> 01:30:14,320
You there's not enough notification time

2303
01:30:14,320 --> 01:30:17,760
between now and their next meeting.

2304
01:30:17,760 --> 01:30:19,600
>> That's that's what the issue is.

2305
01:30:19,600 --> 01:30:20,000
>> Yeah.

2306
01:30:20,000 --> 01:30:23,440
>> Um I I don't disagree with anything

2307
01:30:23,440 --> 01:30:25,360
you're saying. I'm not sure that I

2308
01:30:25,360 --> 01:30:31,120
totally agree that I mean by I I'm

2309
01:30:31,120 --> 01:30:33,040
concerned about the setbacks. When you

2310
01:30:33,040 --> 01:30:35,760
talk about moving the ADU to the front

2311
01:30:35,760 --> 01:30:38,960
yard, then you're building potentially a

2312
01:30:38,960 --> 01:30:41,840
larger home behind

2313
01:30:41,840 --> 01:30:44,400
>> and if you have an 8ft setback, that

2314
01:30:44,400 --> 01:30:46,880
concerns me that that maybe isn't the

2315
01:30:46,880 --> 01:30:49,679
same. Like the idea is to keep the

2316
01:30:49,679 --> 01:30:51,520
single family residential neighborhoods

2317
01:30:51,520 --> 01:30:54,159
to feel like single family residential

2318
01:30:54,159 --> 01:30:56,880
neighborhoods. So, I think that the

2319
01:30:56,880 --> 01:30:59,679
setbacks are potentially different if

2320
01:30:59,679 --> 01:31:01,440
you're saying we're going to let that be

2321
01:31:01,440 --> 01:31:04,560
flopped. In my mind, it would be

2322
01:31:04,560 --> 01:31:06,639
>> would be different on a corner a corner

2323
01:31:06,639 --> 01:31:09,520
lot, but a corner lot might be

2324
01:31:09,520 --> 01:31:11,600
different, but a regular lot would be

2325
01:31:11,600 --> 01:31:13,679
>> a regular lot. I just think we need to

2326
01:31:13,679 --> 01:31:16,239
consider, you know, right now you can

2327
01:31:16,239 --> 01:31:19,120
have a home and have a 10 foot a 10ft

2328
01:31:19,120 --> 01:31:21,920
side, correct? And an 8t minimum and 10.

2329
01:31:21,920 --> 01:31:22,159
Yeah.

2330
01:31:22,159 --> 01:31:24,560
>> Eight and 10. You've got to have 18 ft.

2331
01:31:24,560 --> 01:31:26,560
Correct. And then what's the backyard on

2332
01:31:26,560 --> 01:31:27,520
just

2333
01:31:27,520 --> 01:31:28,800
>> is 25.

2334
01:31:28,800 --> 01:31:30,800
>> Okay. I mean, could it be less than

2335
01:31:30,800 --> 01:31:33,199
that? I don't know. I want to see how

2336
01:31:33,199 --> 01:31:36,400
these heights impact, you know, because

2337
01:31:36,400 --> 01:31:38,719
there is I'm a firm believer in private

2338
01:31:38,719 --> 01:31:41,120
property rights, but it's not just the

2339
01:31:41,120 --> 01:31:43,760
homeowner with the ADU. It's the home

2340
01:31:43,760 --> 01:31:46,560
next to the ADU. And I want to make sure

2341
01:31:46,560 --> 01:31:48,639
we get that right so that we are not

2342
01:31:48,639 --> 01:31:51,840
harming neighbors. So, I don't disagree

2343
01:31:51,840 --> 01:31:54,000
with you. I absolutely but I think the

2344
01:31:54,000 --> 01:31:56,800
definition might be slightly to me that

2345
01:31:56,800 --> 01:32:00,719
seems like a flag lot and that if you

2346
01:32:00,719 --> 01:32:02,960
differentiated the two it gives

2347
01:32:02,960 --> 01:32:06,320
homeowners more options

2348
01:32:06,320 --> 01:32:09,840
you know to to do the right thing for

2349
01:32:09,840 --> 01:32:14,080
their particular situation. Let let me just remind you though that the

2350
01:32:14,080 --> 01:32:16,159
entirety of the planning commission,

2351
01:32:16,159 --> 01:32:18,480
seven members who we give a lot of

2352
01:32:18,480 --> 01:32:20,080
credit and confidence and appreciation

2353
01:32:20,080 --> 01:32:20,560
to

2354
01:32:20,560 --> 01:32:21,120
>> for sure,

2355
01:32:21,120 --> 01:32:23,840
>> they agreed that we need to look at some

2356
01:32:23,840 --> 01:32:24,800
of these specific

2357
01:32:24,800 --> 01:32:26,480
>> I'm not saying we don't.

2358
01:32:26,480 --> 01:32:28,400
>> And so I just Okay,

2359
01:32:28,400 --> 01:32:30,400
>> I'm in agreement with you, but I'm not I

2360
01:32:30,400 --> 01:32:32,080
don't know that I'm comfortable with an

2361
01:32:32,080 --> 01:32:34,480
8 foot setback

2362
01:32:34,480 --> 01:32:37,040
if it's now now the way it's written

2363
01:32:37,040 --> 01:32:39,280
right now, you can't do a twotory. So

2364
01:32:39,280 --> 01:32:41,040
then maybe it's okay.

2365
01:32:41,040 --> 01:32:42,560
And the windows they did talk about if

2366
01:32:42,560 --> 01:32:44,320
they're within 15 ft of a dwelling they

2367
01:32:44,320 --> 01:32:45,760
have to be translucent which basically

2368
01:32:45,760 --> 01:32:47,120
means opaque.

2369
01:32:47,120 --> 01:32:51,440
>> I we there was just an article in

2370
01:32:51,440 --> 01:32:53,840
a I think it was the Desert News. I I

2371
01:32:53,840 --> 01:32:55,280
was going to go back and find it and I

2372
01:32:55,280 --> 01:32:56,880
didn't but there was an article there

2373
01:32:56,880 --> 01:32:58,880
has been some issues down in Utah

2374
01:32:58,880 --> 01:33:01,600
County. I believe it was American Fork

2375
01:33:01,600 --> 01:33:03,120
and Pleasant Grove where they were very

2376
01:33:03,120 --> 01:33:04,880
unhap the residents were very unhappy

2377
01:33:04,880 --> 01:33:06,800
with larger

2378
01:33:06,800 --> 01:33:10,159
ADUs being built in the backyards.

2379
01:33:10,159 --> 01:33:13,199
I 100% think that somebody that's got a

2380
01:33:13,199 --> 01:33:15,280
yard that they can fit if they can build

2381
01:33:15,280 --> 01:33:17,679
a bigger home back there. I I want to

2382
01:33:17,679 --> 01:33:19,199
figure out how to help them do it and

2383
01:33:19,199 --> 01:33:21,120
make it happen. I'm not in disagreement

2384
01:33:21,120 --> 01:33:23,199
with you at all, but I'm not going to

2385
01:33:23,199 --> 01:33:25,520
rush through it and make a mistake that

2386
01:33:25,520 --> 01:33:28,000
impacts all the neighbors around them

2387
01:33:28,000 --> 01:33:29,920
either. And lot coverage still comes

2388
01:33:29,920 --> 01:33:33,199
into play as well, which is 60% maximum

2389
01:33:33,199 --> 01:33:36,400
on any lot regardless of size. So lot

2390
01:33:36,400 --> 01:33:38,560
coverage is clearly it's the the total

2391
01:33:38,560 --> 01:33:40,800
impervious coverage of the home, all

2392
01:33:40,800 --> 01:33:42,239
your impervious surfaces, so your

2393
01:33:42,239 --> 01:33:44,080
driveways, your concrete patios, and any

2394
01:33:44,080 --> 01:33:46,159
accessory structures you have. So that

2395
01:33:46,159 --> 01:33:48,960
lot coverage still is in full force and

2396
01:33:48,960 --> 01:33:52,800
effect in this scenario as well. So I

2397
01:33:52,800 --> 01:33:54,560
don't know if that's good or bad or

2398
01:33:54,560 --> 01:33:57,920
something. Again, we want to unpack more

2399
01:33:57,920 --> 01:33:59,760
uh in the near future. We may not be

2400
01:33:59,760 --> 01:34:01,920
able to do it by October 1st, but there

2401
01:34:01,920 --> 01:34:04,080
are still other things that that we're

2402
01:34:04,080 --> 01:34:04,560
looking at.

2403
01:34:04,560 --> 01:34:06,400
>> And I and I'm supportive of getting this

2404
01:34:06,400 --> 01:34:08,719
done quickly. I just think October 1st

2405
01:34:08,719 --> 01:34:12,080
is going to be a little a little tight.

2406
01:34:12,080 --> 01:34:13,360
>> Well, we're going to have we're going to

2407
01:34:13,360 --> 01:34:15,040
have to do our best by October first

2408
01:34:15,040 --> 01:34:16,239
because like I said, otherwise you're

2409
01:34:16,239 --> 01:34:17,280
opening the door and they can do

2410
01:34:17,280 --> 01:34:18,000
whatever they

2411
01:34:18,000 --> 01:34:19,360
>> got to pass something. But I'm just

2412
01:34:19,360 --> 01:34:21,280
saying I'm comfortable with saying let's

2413
01:34:21,280 --> 01:34:23,520
get the ADU ordinance passed and let's

2414
01:34:23,520 --> 01:34:24,480
do

2415
01:34:24,480 --> 01:34:27,280
>> as much as we can. But I'm I think when

2416
01:34:27,280 --> 01:34:29,920
you start talking about flopping the you

2417
01:34:29,920 --> 01:34:31,679
know flopping what's in front and what's

2418
01:34:31,679 --> 01:34:32,880
behind

2419
01:34:32,880 --> 01:34:35,920
>> I just I just had you know AI produce a

2420
01:34:35,920 --> 01:34:38,080
little drawing so I could get a feel for

2421
01:34:38,080 --> 01:34:41,679
you know an 8,000 foot lot with a with a

2422
01:34:41,679 --> 01:34:44,400
I said a 2,000T home cuz that's I mean

2423
01:34:44,400 --> 01:34:46,000
that's a pretty big home but you know

2424
01:34:46,000 --> 01:34:47,920
let's just say it's a big home. And then

2425
01:34:47,920 --> 01:34:50,159
I said, "And then give me the maximum

2426
01:34:50,159 --> 01:34:51,600
that you had said the

2427
01:34:51,600 --> 01:34:52,320
>> 60%

2428
01:34:52,320 --> 01:34:54,960
>> six." No, not that. Um

2429
01:34:54,960 --> 01:34:55,600
>> 1,200

2430
01:34:55,600 --> 01:34:57,520
>> the,200 square feet. I said the eight

2431
01:34:57,520 --> 01:34:59,920
the cassita's got to be 1,200 square

2432
01:34:59,920 --> 01:35:02,800
feet. It needs to be 8 foot setbacks

2433
01:35:02,800 --> 01:35:04,800
>> and and this is the width of the lot and

2434
01:35:04,800 --> 01:35:07,520
the depth. I did something similar to

2435
01:35:07,520 --> 01:35:10,159
what I had and it I mean it looks fine.

2436
01:35:10,159 --> 01:35:14,080
It looks okay, but I would want to start

2437
01:35:14,080 --> 01:35:16,000
looking at some scenarios because I want

2438
01:35:16,000 --> 01:35:19,760
to make sure that we're just not I mean,

2439
01:35:19,760 --> 01:35:22,000
we can't figure out every situation.

2440
01:35:22,000 --> 01:35:24,000
We'll see. But that's the that's the

2441
01:35:24,000 --> 01:35:27,280
conundrum with ordinances. We never It's

2442
01:35:27,280 --> 01:35:29,199
what didn't we think about and then it

2443
01:35:29,199 --> 01:35:31,360
impacts another homeowner.

2444
01:35:31,360 --> 01:35:33,280
>> Okay. So, I have a I have a couple of

2445
01:35:33,280 --> 01:35:35,520
things. I'm all in favor of tableabling

2446
01:35:35,520 --> 01:35:38,000
this, too, but I think some ideas. We

2447
01:35:38,000 --> 01:35:39,679
kind of need to know where each council

2448
01:35:39,679 --> 01:35:42,639
member's ideas are so that we can go

2449
01:35:42,639 --> 01:35:44,639
home and do our homework and and figure

2450
01:35:44,639 --> 01:35:47,120
out, you know, I've had things said to

2451
01:35:47,120 --> 01:35:49,360
me today that's changed my mind. I'm

2452
01:35:49,360 --> 01:35:53,520
very supportive of it. Um I think 20T is

2453
01:35:53,520 --> 01:35:55,760
too high. You can actually get a

2454
01:35:55,760 --> 01:36:00,400
twotory. Now here I know of of uh

2455
01:36:00,400 --> 01:36:01,920
something that was built here in

2456
01:36:01,920 --> 01:36:04,080
Centerville. They put a little walkway

2457
01:36:04,080 --> 01:36:05,600
through so they could say it was an

2458
01:36:05,600 --> 01:36:08,960
addition. But I know, and it was before

2459
01:36:08,960 --> 01:36:11,920
Mike came, the planning commission, the

2460
01:36:11,920 --> 01:36:14,880
building inspectors were like, "We can't

2461
01:36:14,880 --> 01:36:17,199
do anything on it because they're

2462
01:36:17,199 --> 01:36:19,040
telling us one thing, but the minute

2463
01:36:19,040 --> 01:36:20,880
they close, we know they're going to do

2464
01:36:20,880 --> 01:36:23,280
this." And you can't do that. If you're

2465
01:36:23,280 --> 01:36:25,040
giving them 20 ft, they're going to say,

2466
01:36:25,040 --> 01:36:27,360
"Oh, that's just the attic." And then

2467
01:36:27,360 --> 01:36:29,600
the minute our building inspector

2468
01:36:29,600 --> 01:36:33,040
leaves, they move the upstairs. 20 feet

2469
01:36:33,040 --> 01:36:36,320
is is too high. You could actually I

2470
01:36:36,320 --> 01:36:39,040
mean you can actually have a 12 foot.

2471
01:36:39,040 --> 01:36:41,840
Now I think to go 15 feet would probably

2472
01:36:41,840 --> 01:36:43,679
be that's going to make it to where you

2473
01:36:43,679 --> 01:36:46,639
could have a really nice onetory but

2474
01:36:46,639 --> 01:36:49,600
you're not going to go two stories

2475
01:36:49,600 --> 01:36:51,760
because we've talked about the roof and

2476
01:36:51,760 --> 01:36:54,400
so it is not measured the same. It is

2477
01:36:54,400 --> 01:36:56,639
actually higher than that. I actually

2478
01:36:56,639 --> 01:36:59,119
have been sent a picture here. It's very

2479
01:36:59,119 --> 01:37:00,719
interesting of one that's going on in

2480
01:37:00,719 --> 01:37:02,800
Cisville. I don't we wanted to I could

2481
01:37:02,800 --> 01:37:04,639
send it to Brandt. He could give it to

2482
01:37:04,639 --> 01:37:06,560
Jennifer to put out there. But that's

2483
01:37:06,560 --> 01:37:09,679
one of my concerns. Uh another concern

2484
01:37:09,679 --> 01:37:12,880
is the meters. Uh the state was

2485
01:37:12,880 --> 01:37:15,920
suggesting that we let them use the same

2486
01:37:15,920 --> 01:37:21,040
meters. So when we're saying we want to,

2487
01:37:21,040 --> 01:37:24,480
you know, not not go more restrictive,

2488
01:37:24,480 --> 01:37:26,719
I don't want to have separate meters for

2489
01:37:26,719 --> 01:37:28,639
the reasoning that we've got a

2490
01:37:28,639 --> 01:37:31,440
neighboring city here who after two

2491
01:37:31,440 --> 01:37:35,199
years of having a ADU, they can sell the

2492
01:37:35,199 --> 01:37:36,880
ADU.

2493
01:37:36,880 --> 01:37:39,600
Now, I can't bind further councils by

2494
01:37:39,600 --> 01:37:41,119
saying you can have an ADU, but you

2495
01:37:41,119 --> 01:37:43,119
can't ever sell it. But if it doesn't

2496
01:37:43,119 --> 01:37:44,880
have its own meter, it's going to be a

2497
01:37:44,880 --> 01:37:47,679
whole lot harder to sell. And so for

2498
01:37:47,679 --> 01:37:50,159
that reason, I don't think our citizens

2499
01:37:50,159 --> 01:37:52,560
would be really

2500
01:37:52,560 --> 01:37:55,760
I mean, you're doubling the size now.

2501
01:37:55,760 --> 01:37:57,840
Um,

2502
01:37:57,840 --> 01:38:00,480
you know, you've got to decide uh what

2503
01:38:00,480 --> 01:38:02,480
the value of privacy in people's

2504
01:38:02,480 --> 01:38:04,639
backyards is as we're looking as at the

2505
01:38:04,639 --> 01:38:07,199
height. Um, if we're saying that on a

2506
01:38:07,199 --> 01:38:09,360
home right now it's 10 feet on one side

2507
01:38:09,360 --> 01:38:11,520
and eight on the other, maybe we're

2508
01:38:11,520 --> 01:38:14,960
going to want 10 on both sides. it. I

2509
01:38:14,960 --> 01:38:17,119
mean, right now you've got to have 10 on

2510
01:38:17,119 --> 01:38:19,360
one of them on a regular house. And now

2511
01:38:19,360 --> 01:38:20,880
we're putting something in someone's

2512
01:38:20,880 --> 01:38:22,639
backyard. Like Spencer said, you could

2513
01:38:22,639 --> 01:38:27,119
have two or three. So, I do know of a

2514
01:38:27,119 --> 01:38:28,960
there's been several projects that

2515
01:38:28,960 --> 01:38:30,800
especially down in St. George. They're

2516
01:38:30,800 --> 01:38:33,440
building whole subdivisions

2517
01:38:33,440 --> 01:38:36,159
of homes with ADUs.

2518
01:38:36,159 --> 01:38:38,880
We have had a property here in

2519
01:38:38,880 --> 01:38:41,360
Centerville that has been zoned for

2520
01:38:41,360 --> 01:38:44,560
single family homes that the neighbors

2521
01:38:44,560 --> 01:38:46,800
have been told that they held off

2522
01:38:46,800 --> 01:38:49,040
building because they want to build it

2523
01:38:49,040 --> 01:38:51,280
that way. So, we want to be careful

2524
01:38:51,280 --> 01:38:53,040
because if we say, "Well, we're going to

2525
01:38:53,040 --> 01:38:56,159
just do this preliminary and then they

2526
01:38:56,159 --> 01:38:58,800
could come in before we get it to where

2527
01:38:58,800 --> 01:39:01,600
we want it." So, I think we need to be

2528
01:39:01,600 --> 01:39:03,199
careful. We need to go lower on our

2529
01:39:03,199 --> 01:39:04,800
heights and things like that. Then if we

2530
01:39:04,800 --> 01:39:07,199
want to bring them back up, great. But I

2531
01:39:07,199 --> 01:39:08,719
want to be careful because I do think

2532
01:39:08,719 --> 01:39:10,719
there is possibly people watching us

2533
01:39:10,719 --> 01:39:14,400
right now waiting to build

2534
01:39:14,400 --> 01:39:16,320
not something in somebody's backyard,

2535
01:39:16,320 --> 01:39:19,600
but new homes with ADUs, which is great.

2536
01:39:19,600 --> 01:39:22,320
I mean, I think, you know, that may help

2537
01:39:22,320 --> 01:39:24,080
people be able to get into a house if

2538
01:39:24,080 --> 01:39:27,360
you can put an ADU back there and and do

2539
01:39:27,360 --> 01:39:30,159
that. But I think we need to definitely

2540
01:39:30,159 --> 01:39:32,719
think about it. Um, another thing while

2541
01:39:32,719 --> 01:39:36,560
I've been on the council, we had a

2542
01:39:36,560 --> 01:39:39,440
was it called a but it was basically an

2543
01:39:39,440 --> 01:39:43,360
ADU built up in North Centerville

2544
01:39:43,360 --> 01:39:45,040
because you can only have it a

2545
01:39:45,040 --> 01:39:47,679
percentage of the ground, but they owned

2546
01:39:47,679 --> 01:39:50,800
the whole hill behind them.

2547
01:39:50,800 --> 01:39:53,119
They were able to count that as their

2548
01:39:53,119 --> 01:39:56,000
property. So literally they built a

2549
01:39:56,000 --> 01:39:58,400
building that took their whole backyard,

2550
01:39:58,400 --> 01:40:00,960
shaded other people's homes, looked into

2551
01:40:00,960 --> 01:40:03,199
other people's windows. I was up there

2552
01:40:03,199 --> 01:40:05,520
several times as a council member, our

2553
01:40:05,520 --> 01:40:07,040
planning commission. I don't know if you

2554
01:40:07,040 --> 01:40:10,159
know which one it was, but so it created

2555
01:40:10,159 --> 01:40:12,480
I think we need to be careful and say

2556
01:40:12,480 --> 01:40:15,119
that anything with more than a 30% slope

2557
01:40:15,119 --> 01:40:18,560
cannot be counted into that amount of

2558
01:40:18,560 --> 01:40:22,239
property. cuz if you have your home and

2559
01:40:22,239 --> 01:40:24,000
this little tiny backyard and then a

2560
01:40:24,000 --> 01:40:25,600
hill that goes like this, it's really

2561
01:40:25,600 --> 01:40:27,280
not good for anything. You could take

2562
01:40:27,280 --> 01:40:29,280
that whole backyard and they did do

2563
01:40:29,280 --> 01:40:32,000
that. Um, so I think that's something

2564
01:40:32,000 --> 01:40:37,199
else that we need to do. Like I said, I feel very

2565
01:40:37,199 --> 01:40:39,119
strongly that I would like them to share

2566
01:40:39,119 --> 01:40:42,960
utilities. We're trying to give people

2567
01:40:42,960 --> 01:40:46,239
more for their property. So I right now

2568
01:40:46,239 --> 01:40:48,080
they can't have anything. Now we're

2569
01:40:48,080 --> 01:40:50,159
giving him an ADU. So I don't have a

2570
01:40:50,159 --> 01:40:52,560
problem with putting some restrictions

2571
01:40:52,560 --> 01:40:54,639
on it. It's not like they bought it with

2572
01:40:54,639 --> 01:40:56,320
the idea they could build the ADU and

2573
01:40:56,320 --> 01:40:57,760
then all of a sudden we bring these

2574
01:40:57,760 --> 01:41:01,679
restrictions in. But like I said, I'm I

2575
01:41:01,679 --> 01:41:04,960
would definitely want to bring the the

2576
01:41:04,960 --> 01:41:13,990
height down to at least 15. Um

2577
01:41:14,000 --> 01:41:16,159
» yeah, I'm supportive of that utilities.

2578
01:41:16,159 --> 01:41:21,760
Uh the an accessory is to be part of the

2579
01:41:21,760 --> 01:41:22,800
main, right?

2580
01:41:22,800 --> 01:41:24,880
>> If we're giving and separating those

2581
01:41:24,880 --> 01:41:27,119
utilities, it really feels like it's a

2582
01:41:27,119 --> 01:41:28,159
separate animal. So,

2583
01:41:28,159 --> 01:41:30,560
>> right. So, the I I only want to push

2584
01:41:30,560 --> 01:41:32,719
back on one thing on that and and it's

2585
01:41:32,719 --> 01:41:34,960
this. at at some point in time. I built

2586
01:41:34,960 --> 01:41:36,639
my house 25 years ago and then

2587
01:41:36,639 --> 01:41:38,480
eventually somebody else came and built

2588
01:41:38,480 --> 01:41:40,800
another home in my neighborhood and he

2589
01:41:40,800 --> 01:41:44,960
one day just in passing said, "Hey,

2590
01:41:44,960 --> 01:41:47,040
do you did they make you put in a 1-in

2591
01:41:47,040 --> 01:41:48,719
connection on your house?" And I was

2592
01:41:48,719 --> 01:41:52,880
like, "No, it's a 3/4 in." And and

2593
01:41:52,880 --> 01:41:54,800
his house doesn't really look that much

2594
01:41:54,800 --> 01:41:57,119
bigger than my house, but because of the

2595
01:41:57,119 --> 01:41:59,199
number of fixtures,

2596
01:41:59,199 --> 01:42:02,320
>> suddenly it 3/4 wasn't enough. I one of

2597
01:42:02,320 --> 01:42:04,880
the concerns I would have with swapping

2598
01:42:04,880 --> 01:42:07,280
the front and the back ADU and not

2599
01:42:07,280 --> 01:42:10,800
having a separate meter is that there's

2600
01:42:10,800 --> 01:42:12,639
a very high likelihood if that house is

2601
01:42:12,639 --> 01:42:14,080
bigger than the house in front and the

2602
01:42:14,080 --> 01:42:17,119
house in front's not 1,200 square f feet

2603
01:42:17,119 --> 01:42:20,880
total um that you may not have enough

2604
01:42:20,880 --> 01:42:23,760
water pressure you get you lose as it is

2605
01:42:23,760 --> 01:42:25,760
the longer the pipe goes and the smaller

2606
01:42:25,760 --> 01:42:28,239
it is there's more friction and you lose

2607
01:42:28,239 --> 01:42:31,679
so I'm a little concerned about

2608
01:42:31,679 --> 01:42:32,320
that.

2609
01:42:32,320 --> 01:42:33,840
>> Well, I talked to our water department

2610
01:42:33,840 --> 01:42:34,960
about that today.

2611
01:42:34,960 --> 01:42:36,560
>> Well, they seem to want the water

2612
01:42:36,560 --> 01:42:38,000
department seems to want separate

2613
01:42:38,000 --> 01:42:38,560
meters.

2614
01:42:38,560 --> 01:42:40,400
>> No, they were I think they were okay

2615
01:42:40,400 --> 01:42:41,840
after I talked to them. We can talk to

2616
01:42:41,840 --> 01:42:42,800
them.

2617
01:42:42,800 --> 01:42:45,199
>> But so the concern would be is if you

2618
01:42:45,199 --> 01:42:46,480
have more fixtures, you're going to have

2619
01:42:46,480 --> 01:42:49,440
to put in a 1inch line.

2620
01:42:49,440 --> 01:42:50,880
>> I mean, that's what it is. You're going

2621
01:42:50,880 --> 01:42:52,800
to put this in. It gives you more fix

2622
01:42:52,800 --> 01:42:54,960
more fixtures. You're going to have to

2623
01:42:54,960 --> 01:42:56,400
It's going to be more expensive. You're

2624
01:42:56,400 --> 01:42:58,719
going to put the one in line. Sewer. I

2625
01:42:58,719 --> 01:43:00,080
checked with them. They said that

2626
01:43:00,080 --> 01:43:01,280
they're great with

2627
01:43:01,280 --> 01:43:04,800
>> No, they're not. I'm on I'm I I passed I

2628
01:43:04,800 --> 01:43:05,920
passed or the

2629
01:43:05,920 --> 01:43:06,639
>> think

2630
01:43:06,639 --> 01:43:09,119
>> the sewer is required. If you have a

2631
01:43:09,119 --> 01:43:11,360
detached ADU, it is a separate

2632
01:43:11,360 --> 01:43:12,719
connection.

2633
01:43:12,719 --> 01:43:14,159
>> I don't think so.

2634
01:43:14,159 --> 01:43:16,080
>> Well, I just texted Matt Myers before

2635
01:43:16,080 --> 01:43:17,520
this meeting. If he doesn't know, I

2636
01:43:17,520 --> 01:43:18,960
don't know who else would know.

2637
01:43:18,960 --> 01:43:19,280
>> Okay.

2638
01:43:19,280 --> 01:43:21,280
>> He's the general manager of the sewer

2639
01:43:21,280 --> 01:43:23,199
district.

2640
01:43:23,199 --> 01:43:26,960
So I I'm telling you that's a fairly new

2641
01:43:26,960 --> 01:43:30,320
thing, but it is a separate connection.

2642
01:43:30,320 --> 01:43:31,920
Another reason we need to readress it

2643
01:43:31,920 --> 01:43:34,719
and table this, but I I also

2644
01:43:34,719 --> 01:43:37,440
>> am supportive of giving people who

2645
01:43:37,440 --> 01:43:40,639
decide to do that the option to have

2646
01:43:40,639 --> 01:43:42,719
within legal limits. If the sewer

2647
01:43:42,719 --> 01:43:44,480
district requires it, that'd be part of

2648
01:43:44,480 --> 01:43:46,080
your cost. You'd have to do it. But

2649
01:43:46,080 --> 01:43:47,600
there may be circumstance. I don't think

2650
01:43:47,600 --> 01:43:50,239
we ought to require meters or separate

2651
01:43:50,239 --> 01:43:53,199
connections unless the homeowner finds

2652
01:43:53,199 --> 01:43:55,440
it necessary to get his building permit

2653
01:43:55,440 --> 01:43:58,080
to do it. But I I mean that's my take

2654
01:43:58,080 --> 01:43:59,760
that's got to be addressed with further

2655
01:43:59,760 --> 01:44:01,920
information before we meet again.

2656
01:44:01,920 --> 01:44:04,239
>> So it sounds like we're headed to to

2657
01:44:04,239 --> 01:44:07,040
tableabling. But the dilemma I have with

2658
01:44:07,040 --> 01:44:09,280
just tableabling

2659
01:44:09,280 --> 01:44:11,520
uh without getting some of this out.

2660
01:44:11,520 --> 01:44:12,800
That's why I was letting Councilwoman

2661
01:44:12,800 --> 01:44:15,600
Meek go and Councilwoman Hir is is if we

2662
01:44:15,600 --> 01:44:18,080
just come back the next week, then we're

2663
01:44:18,080 --> 01:44:19,360
doing this the next week. We're not

2664
01:44:19,360 --> 01:44:20,320
going to be full.

2665
01:44:20,320 --> 01:44:22,320
>> We got to come back two weeks to have

2666
01:44:22,320 --> 01:44:23,360
something that we're

2667
01:44:23,360 --> 01:44:25,679
>> and I want this out so the public

2668
01:44:25,679 --> 01:44:27,520
interested could hear and know how we

2669
01:44:27,520 --> 01:44:29,600
feel and what we're talking about so

2670
01:44:29,600 --> 01:44:31,600
they can contact us and say, "Hey, I

2671
01:44:31,600 --> 01:44:34,719
agree. I do want meters or no meters.

2672
01:44:34,719 --> 01:44:36,239
Hey, I don't want it, you know, I'm

2673
01:44:36,239 --> 01:44:38,000
great with ADUs, but I don't want it

2674
01:44:38,000 --> 01:44:40,159
that high." I mean, like I said, I've

2675
01:44:40,159 --> 01:44:42,320
been sent a picture of one from Kisville

2676
01:44:42,320 --> 01:44:44,800
and it's literally going to affect the

2677
01:44:44,800 --> 01:44:46,400
lighting in the neighborhood of three

2678
01:44:46,400 --> 01:44:49,280
homes and it's only 20 ft high than the

2679
01:44:49,280 --> 01:44:52,639
roof. So, I don't want to affect people.

2680
01:44:52,639 --> 01:44:55,280
You know, you've got a garden, you get

2681
01:44:55,280 --> 01:44:56,800
one of those next to it, you're going to

2682
01:44:56,800 --> 01:45:00,000
be in trouble. So, and I appreciate what

2683
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:01,840
Spencer says where you could get two,

2684
01:45:01,840 --> 01:45:03,199
three,

2685
01:45:03,199 --> 01:45:05,360
>> all especially if you do have a builder

2686
01:45:05,360 --> 01:45:08,400
that comes in and is going to build

2687
01:45:08,400 --> 01:45:09,760
>> like you have a little bigger personal

2688
01:45:09,760 --> 01:45:11,360
and they build four homes.

2689
01:45:11,360 --> 01:45:12,719
>> Well, yeah, but they're built. I mean,

2690
01:45:12,719 --> 01:45:15,360
we have an acre property now that could

2691
01:45:15,360 --> 01:45:18,239
put four in, but they could put a ADU on

2692
01:45:18,239 --> 01:45:20,800
all four prop on all four of those.

2693
01:45:20,800 --> 01:45:23,199
>> Mayor, I I appreciate your concern, but

2694
01:45:23,199 --> 01:45:25,360
I I believe that it's obvious the

2695
01:45:25,360 --> 01:45:27,199
sentiment here. This council wants to

2696
01:45:27,199 --> 01:45:29,119
pass something before October 1st. So, I

2697
01:45:29,119 --> 01:45:31,119
think in two weeks we'll be passing

2698
01:45:31,119 --> 01:45:34,880
something. My my point is I think we can

2699
01:45:34,880 --> 01:45:37,679
get it a little closer to what we think

2700
01:45:37,679 --> 01:45:40,560
it is in those two weeks by tableabling

2701
01:45:40,560 --> 01:45:42,639
it, make some adjustments to some of the

2702
01:45:42,639 --> 01:45:43,840
things the planning commission has

2703
01:45:43,840 --> 01:45:46,880
recommended and we can have a document.

2704
01:45:46,880 --> 01:45:48,159
I'm committed to do that.

2705
01:45:48,159 --> 01:45:49,920
>> But we have council members recommending

2706
01:45:49,920 --> 01:45:51,760
things. How do we get that that

2707
01:45:51,760 --> 01:45:54,080
>> but that's what we're talking to Mike if

2708
01:45:54,080 --> 01:45:55,280
we don't talk about it right now.

2709
01:45:55,280 --> 01:45:56,639
>> Right. We need to talk about it now and

2710
01:45:56,639 --> 01:45:59,679
we need to say to Mike, we we maybe when

2711
01:45:59,679 --> 01:46:02,000
you bring it back, we want it shorter.

2712
01:46:02,000 --> 01:46:04,639
20 is way too high. I mean, I think each

2713
01:46:04,639 --> 01:46:07,199
council member needs to say to Mike,

2714
01:46:07,199 --> 01:46:08,719
>> you know,

2715
01:46:08,719 --> 01:46:10,320
>> that's fine. We have planning commission

2716
01:46:10,320 --> 01:46:12,000
members, but uh

2717
01:46:12,000 --> 01:46:13,119
>> well, they're not going to see

2718
01:46:13,119 --> 01:46:14,960
>> council members will want to have input

2719
01:46:14,960 --> 01:46:17,280
as well too for for the ordinance that

2720
01:46:17,280 --> 01:46:18,080
comes back to us,

2721
01:46:18,080 --> 01:46:21,199
>> right? Lisa, does it have to go back to

2722
01:46:21,199 --> 01:46:22,960
planning commission to change anything

2723
01:46:22,960 --> 01:46:24,719
in the resolution or the ordinance

2724
01:46:24,719 --> 01:46:25,520
before us?

2725
01:46:25,520 --> 01:46:26,000
>> No.

2726
01:46:26,000 --> 01:46:29,360
>> So, so we can we can do that, mayor, in

2727
01:46:29,360 --> 01:46:31,520
two weeks. We can sh We can

2728
01:46:31,520 --> 01:46:33,760
>> I get it, Rick. But we have planning

2729
01:46:33,760 --> 01:46:35,440
commission comments in front of us.

2730
01:46:35,440 --> 01:46:37,119
There's more than planning commission.

2731
01:46:37,119 --> 01:46:38,800
How do you propose we get council

2732
01:46:38,800 --> 01:46:40,880
members comments in front of us? Unless

2733
01:46:40,880 --> 01:46:42,639
we have this discussion, unless you

2734
01:46:42,639 --> 01:46:44,560
unless we say, "Hey, every everybody

2735
01:46:44,560 --> 01:46:46,320
submit some things in the next few

2736
01:46:46,320 --> 01:46:49,119
days." We continue this debate in two

2737
01:46:49,119 --> 01:46:51,440
weeks and then we vote and we've we've

2738
01:46:51,440 --> 01:46:54,080
got an ordinance before us and we say

2739
01:46:54,080 --> 01:46:57,360
maybe uh we're going to change to

2740
01:46:57,360 --> 01:47:01,440
requiring meters separate meters to

2741
01:47:01,440 --> 01:47:03,840
allow either separate meter.

2742
01:47:03,840 --> 01:47:06,960
>> But what Robin just said G Yeah. Because

2743
01:47:06,960 --> 01:47:08,960
that was brought up speech separate

2744
01:47:08,960 --> 01:47:10,719
meters. If it hadn't been brought up

2745
01:47:10,719 --> 01:47:12,320
tonight, we wouldn't have known that was

2746
01:47:12,320 --> 01:47:14,560
there. and and and it gives you guys two

2747
01:47:14,560 --> 01:47:21,280
weeks to say, "Hey, are we okay going uh on a lower footage as far as how high

2748
01:47:21,280 --> 01:47:24,000
it is and that sort of thing." I mean,

2749
01:47:24,000 --> 01:47:25,360
>> yeah, I don't want to continue it till

2750
01:47:25,360 --> 01:47:26,960
midnight tonight, but uh

2751
01:47:26,960 --> 01:47:28,239
>> No, I do.

2752
01:47:28,239 --> 01:47:30,320
>> We need to get the ideas out there. No,

2753
01:47:30,320 --> 01:47:31,760
we don't have to debate them. I'll agree

2754
01:47:31,760 --> 01:47:33,760
with you that, but throw out the ideas

2755
01:47:33,760 --> 01:47:35,280
so people can think about it.

2756
01:47:35,280 --> 01:47:37,520
>> I'm even with some debate. I'm here to

2757
01:47:37,520 --> 01:47:39,040
get the business done. And the business

2758
01:47:39,040 --> 01:47:41,119
is is that people have been waiting for

2759
01:47:41,119 --> 01:47:44,080
this ordinance for quite some time. So,

2760
01:47:44,080 --> 01:47:46,000
I'm fine to have the discussion tonight

2761
01:47:46,000 --> 01:47:47,679
and I'm fine to table it and have it

2762
01:47:47,679 --> 01:47:49,760
again in two weeks, but like it's

2763
01:47:49,760 --> 01:47:51,440
helpful for me to have just heard what

2764
01:47:51,440 --> 01:47:54,239
Robin's concerns are. Um, can I I still

2765
01:47:54,239 --> 01:47:56,800
am like hanging on to an answer from

2766
01:47:56,800 --> 01:47:59,600
Mike about metering.

2767
01:47:59,600 --> 01:48:01,440
Can like can we just because you brought

2768
01:48:01,440 --> 01:48:03,440
that up, I would like to get a little

2769
01:48:03,440 --> 01:48:04,639
more information.

2770
01:48:04,639 --> 01:48:07,040
>> We have no code basically to be totally

2771
01:48:07,040 --> 01:48:08,800
honest. A couple things that you have to

2772
01:48:08,800 --> 01:48:11,360
remember is this. Our park shifts are

2773
01:48:11,360 --> 01:48:14,639
full. So if you have say that you allow

2774
01:48:14,639 --> 01:48:16,960
it and they put a separate driveway in,

2775
01:48:16,960 --> 01:48:19,440
where are you going to put the meters?

2776
01:48:19,440 --> 01:48:19,840
>> Okay.

2777
01:48:19,840 --> 01:48:23,760
>> Out of the way basically. So that's one

2778
01:48:23,760 --> 01:48:25,199
of the problems. The good thing about

2779
01:48:25,199 --> 01:48:28,320
that is if the back unit is out of

2780
01:48:28,320 --> 01:48:30,719
water, the front unit's not. If say I

2781
01:48:30,719 --> 01:48:32,320
have to shut it off for some reason,

2782
01:48:32,320 --> 01:48:35,119
non-payment or what have you. Or if you

2783
01:48:35,119 --> 01:48:37,040
do have non-payment, it's one meter and

2784
01:48:37,040 --> 01:48:38,639
it is non-payment, you're shutting off

2785
01:48:38,639 --> 01:48:40,080
both homes,

2786
01:48:40,080 --> 01:48:42,320
>> it's kind of a problem that can occur.

2787
01:48:42,320 --> 01:48:45,040
So, as I was explaining to you, you have

2788
01:48:45,040 --> 01:48:48,000
32 fixture counts that you can have. So,

2789
01:48:48,000 --> 01:48:50,320
just an example, if you have a two hose

2790
01:48:50,320 --> 01:48:52,719
bibs, that's two and a half. So, that's

2791
01:48:52,719 --> 01:48:56,080
five of your fixture counts right there.

2792
01:48:56,080 --> 01:48:57,840
So, that's five gone. So, when you start

2793
01:48:57,840 --> 01:48:59,920
adding your toilets and everything else,

2794
01:48:59,920 --> 01:49:01,360
so there's a good chance that you're

2795
01:49:01,360 --> 01:49:02,639
going to have to go back out in the

2796
01:49:02,639 --> 01:49:04,960
road, dig down in the road, put a 1-in

2797
01:49:04,960 --> 01:49:07,360
service line coming in, and then you got

2798
01:49:07,360 --> 01:49:09,440
to come up with the dilemma. Do you tie

2799
01:49:09,440 --> 01:49:11,520
onto the back of the house? So,

2800
01:49:11,520 --> 01:49:13,360
basically, you have the water meter, it

2801
01:49:13,360 --> 01:49:14,719
comes into the house, you have a

2802
01:49:14,719 --> 01:49:17,119
pressure reducing valve inside the

2803
01:49:17,119 --> 01:49:19,199
house. So, plumbing code requires that

2804
01:49:19,199 --> 01:49:22,719
you have to have a 1 in line from the

2805
01:49:22,719 --> 01:49:25,360
pressure regulator to the water heater.

2806
01:49:25,360 --> 01:49:28,080
So now if you have one more water heater

2807
01:49:28,080 --> 01:49:30,480
out in the back unit, do we make them

2808
01:49:30,480 --> 01:49:32,080
run a 1-in line? There's a lot of

2809
01:49:32,080 --> 01:49:33,600
questions in that. That's a plumbing

2810
01:49:33,600 --> 01:49:35,600
code question. You know, once it gets

2811
01:49:35,600 --> 01:49:37,520
inside the house, I'm out of it. But

2812
01:49:37,520 --> 01:49:40,560
plumbing code does require a 1-in line

2813
01:49:40,560 --> 01:49:43,840
to a water heater. So there's plumbing

2814
01:49:43,840 --> 01:49:45,520
demographics and everything. You know,

2815
01:49:45,520 --> 01:49:47,440
if this one size fit all, I don't think

2816
01:49:47,440 --> 01:49:50,560
so. You know, in some cases, one service

2817
01:49:50,560 --> 01:49:52,239
line would probably work out fine

2818
01:49:52,239 --> 01:49:55,199
depending on how big the unit is. But my

2819
01:49:55,199 --> 01:49:57,199
feeling is is most houses when you add

2820
01:49:57,199 --> 01:49:58,239
another unit, they're going to be

2821
01:49:58,239 --> 01:49:59,760
digging up the road, putting a 1-in

2822
01:49:59,760 --> 01:50:01,440
service in. So they're going to pay

2823
01:50:01,440 --> 01:50:03,360
impact fees, then they're going to pay

2824
01:50:03,360 --> 01:50:06,320
for a bigger meter size, an ongoing 1 in

2825
01:50:06,320 --> 01:50:09,920
line, meter base rate plus water usage.

2826
01:50:09,920 --> 01:50:11,840
So I mean, there's a lot when you start

2827
01:50:11,840 --> 01:50:14,159
talking about it. So I talked down at

2828
01:50:14,159 --> 01:50:16,639
the sewer district, too. Maybe we need

2829
01:50:16,639 --> 01:50:19,280
to get back with Matt on that because I

2830
01:50:19,280 --> 01:50:22,159
got told by Brandon that it comes if it

2831
01:50:22,159 --> 01:50:27,920
the main line from the street out to the main line. So the service line to

2832
01:50:27,920 --> 01:50:30,800
the main line they're allowed to connect

2833
01:50:30,800 --> 01:50:32,800
onto. So you have the two services

2834
01:50:32,800 --> 01:50:34,800
connecting on. Then when it gets to the

2835
01:50:34,800 --> 01:50:36,800
back of the sidewalk it can go to one.

2836
01:50:36,800 --> 01:50:38,639
That's what I got told today and

2837
01:50:38,639 --> 01:50:40,639
checking it out. So

2838
01:50:40,639 --> 01:50:44,719
>> I as far as I I mean and maybe and maybe

2839
01:50:44,719 --> 01:50:47,440
what he thought I was asking him was

2840
01:50:47,440 --> 01:50:49,760
will there be two bills?

2841
01:50:49,760 --> 01:50:53,679
>> You know they don't actually need

2842
01:50:53,679 --> 01:50:56,159
>> that may

2843
01:50:56,159 --> 01:50:57,760
there may be that may

2844
01:50:57,760 --> 01:50:58,639
>> that's probably what it is

2845
01:50:58,639 --> 01:50:59,760
>> that they're getting two bills because

2846
01:50:59,760 --> 01:51:01,920
you're not really measuring

2847
01:51:01,920 --> 01:51:03,760
>> like the sewer is not getting measured

2848
01:51:03,760 --> 01:51:06,320
by a meter. No, it's not. But that's how

2849
01:51:06,320 --> 01:51:08,480
they collect their usage is they would

2850
01:51:08,480 --> 01:51:11,119
have they that lot would get charged two

2851
01:51:11,119 --> 01:51:15,199
>> they get charged for two and they and I think it's just you know it just

2852
01:51:15,199 --> 01:51:16,960
goes to whatever the address is.

2853
01:51:16,960 --> 01:51:18,560
>> So I mean I guess what I'm trying to say

2854
01:51:18,560 --> 01:51:19,840
I'm kind of feel like I'm caught in the

2855
01:51:19,840 --> 01:51:21,600
middle a little bit. But the bottom line

2856
01:51:21,600 --> 01:51:22,960
is there's pros and cons.

2857
01:51:22,960 --> 01:51:24,159
>> I didn't mean to catch you in the

2858
01:51:24,159 --> 01:51:24,560
middle.

2859
01:51:24,560 --> 01:51:27,040
>> I can see I can Yeah, I'm very good at

2860
01:51:27,040 --> 01:51:28,719
dancing in the middle.

2861
01:51:28,719 --> 01:51:31,280
>> So I can see the one line being okay,

2862
01:51:31,280 --> 01:51:33,280
but I can see the two lines being okay,

2863
01:51:33,280 --> 01:51:35,360
too. But it's just like, you know, where

2864
01:51:35,360 --> 01:51:36,960
do you go? What do you do? There there's

2865
01:51:36,960 --> 01:51:40,000
really not a code uh that you can really

2866
01:51:40,000 --> 01:51:40,719
go to.

2867
01:51:40,719 --> 01:51:43,360
>> I will say this, in the case of a

2868
01:51:43,360 --> 01:51:46,480
pressurized water line and you know,

2869
01:51:46,480 --> 01:51:48,239
like you said, you get in the house and

2870
01:51:48,239 --> 01:51:49,440
then you've got to go out to the

2871
01:51:49,440 --> 01:51:52,719
backyard. I am worried about flow rate

2872
01:51:52,719 --> 01:51:54,239
with that. A sewer line's a little

2873
01:51:54,239 --> 01:51:56,080
different because it's gravity

2874
01:51:56,080 --> 01:51:58,560
>> flow. So, it's a different

2875
01:51:58,560 --> 01:52:02,080
>> Well, so let's just use as

2876
01:52:02,080 --> 01:52:03,760
quick example because I know we're in a

2877
01:52:03,760 --> 01:52:06,080
hurry tonight, but you have say there is

2878
01:52:06,080 --> 01:52:07,840
a little bit of an elevation difference.

2879
01:52:07,840 --> 01:52:10,880
So, the water line comes in, they reduce

2880
01:52:10,880 --> 01:52:14,080
it to say 60 lb cuz that's most houses

2881
01:52:14,080 --> 01:52:16,719
go from 60 to 75 lbs. So, you're not

2882
01:52:16,719 --> 01:52:18,880
blowing your plumbing fixtures apart. So

2883
01:52:18,880 --> 01:52:21,199
if you're going out and coming back out

2884
01:52:21,199 --> 01:52:24,239
a little bit further, you are having,

2885
01:52:24,239 --> 01:52:26,000
you know, pressure problems because the

2886
01:52:26,000 --> 01:52:27,760
further you go, the less pressure you

2887
01:52:27,760 --> 01:52:28,560
get.

2888
01:52:28,560 --> 01:52:30,239
>> You know, it's kind of like Island View.

2889
01:52:30,239 --> 01:52:32,880
Yeah. Island View Tank and Oakidge tank.

2890
01:52:32,880 --> 01:52:34,560
Oakidge tank's going to take us a lot

2891
01:52:34,560 --> 01:52:36,320
longer to fill up because we have all

2892
01:52:36,320 --> 01:52:38,880
the head loss from Weaver Basin all the

2893
01:52:38,880 --> 01:52:40,960
way to that point. So it's a similar

2894
01:52:40,960 --> 01:52:43,599
deal. And you know, I it's not a real

2895
01:52:43,599 --> 01:52:45,840
easy decision on you know what way to

2896
01:52:45,840 --> 01:52:48,719
go. You know, for me, having one meter

2897
01:52:48,719 --> 01:52:51,280
in a park strip for one lot is

2898
01:52:51,280 --> 01:52:53,760
desirable, especially if you add another

2899
01:52:53,760 --> 01:52:56,400
driveway, you know, because our drive

2900
01:52:56,400 --> 01:52:59,040
our you run into it all the time, you

2901
01:52:59,040 --> 01:53:00,560
know. Yeah, you could make them dig down

2902
01:53:00,560 --> 01:53:03,440
and put a dual meter in and run off one

2903
01:53:03,440 --> 01:53:06,239
to each one and be coupled there. I

2904
01:53:06,239 --> 01:53:08,000
mean, there are alternatives, but you

2905
01:53:08,000 --> 01:53:10,320
know, what's the right way to go is what

2906
01:53:10,320 --> 01:53:12,159
you guys get to decide. I just get a

2907
01:53:12,159 --> 01:53:12,960
counsel with you.

2908
01:53:12,960 --> 01:53:14,880
>> I I'm not and I'm not saying I have an

2909
01:53:14,880 --> 01:53:16,719
opinion. I just because I'm I'm only

2910
01:53:16,719 --> 01:53:18,080
pushing back because I have some

2911
01:53:18,080 --> 01:53:19,199
concerns about

2912
01:53:19,199 --> 01:53:21,199
>> Well, I was gonna say maybe it'll be

2913
01:53:21,199 --> 01:53:22,880
different on each plate of housing.

2914
01:53:22,880 --> 01:53:25,280
Maybe we need to give them both options.

2915
01:53:25,280 --> 01:53:27,199
But I just don't want to take that

2916
01:53:27,199 --> 01:53:29,760
totally off the table because I really

2917
01:53:29,760 --> 01:53:32,400
do worry that I do think the state's

2918
01:53:32,400 --> 01:53:33,840
going to take things over someday. And I

2919
01:53:33,840 --> 01:53:35,280
don't want them to come out and say we

2920
01:53:35,280 --> 01:53:38,159
have to allow all of our ADUs to be sold

2921
01:53:38,159 --> 01:53:40,639
if they want to. What other ideas for

2922
01:53:40,639 --> 01:53:42,560
council members to think about besides

2923
01:53:42,560 --> 01:53:45,679
meters and height that we just the size

2924
01:53:45,679 --> 01:53:50,880
of the lot, the corner lots and um

2925
01:53:50,880 --> 01:53:53,040
uh

2926
01:53:53,040 --> 01:53:55,040
>> so Brian you you're con you're saying

2927
01:53:55,040 --> 01:53:57,280
hey we should look at smaller lots than

2928
01:53:57,280 --> 01:53:58,639
8500. Okay

2929
01:53:58,639 --> 01:54:00,719
>> absolutely for the sake of debate the

2930
01:54:00,719 --> 01:54:03,520
internal ADUs allow 6,000 ft minimum lot

2931
01:54:03,520 --> 01:54:05,199
size for an internal ADU.

2932
01:54:05,199 --> 01:54:05,599
>> Okay.

2933
01:54:05,599 --> 01:54:07,199
>> Correct. And I also think that we should

2934
01:54:07,199 --> 01:54:09,280
take that into consideration as well is

2935
01:54:09,280 --> 01:54:14,000
that if you want you can have an ADU and

2936
01:54:14,000 --> 01:54:16,400
a DADU.

2937
01:54:16,400 --> 01:54:19,360
>> So I think that that again yes you can

2938
01:54:19,360 --> 01:54:26,159
qualify but I'm looking Yeah, you can fit these little uh residences

2939
01:54:26,159 --> 01:54:30,000
on a small lot and it looks very nice.

2940
01:54:30,000 --> 01:54:30,400
It does

2941
01:54:30,400 --> 01:54:33,440
>> and it provides uh that exactly what

2942
01:54:33,440 --> 01:54:35,119
we're talking about which is the

2943
01:54:35,119 --> 01:54:37,840
moderate income housing for family

2944
01:54:37,840 --> 01:54:42,159
members that uh I think is only going to

2945
01:54:42,159 --> 01:54:45,280
grow in demand that

2946
01:54:45,280 --> 01:54:48,000
and all of the the expenses all the

2947
01:54:48,000 --> 01:54:50,080
costs that you just mentioned about the

2948
01:54:50,080 --> 01:54:52,719
all the connections these are all less

2949
01:54:52,719 --> 01:54:56,719
than a new house currently. So I think

2950
01:54:56,719 --> 01:54:58,320
that's to be considered

2951
01:54:58,320 --> 01:55:00,400
>> and and on a smaller lot you are going

2952
01:55:00,400 --> 01:55:02,719
to restrict somewhat of it because of

2953
01:55:02,719 --> 01:55:04,960
the permeable surface it can only be

2954
01:55:04,960 --> 01:55:07,599
60%. So if you have a tiny lot and a

2955
01:55:07,599 --> 01:55:09,840
pretty goodiz house there's no way you

2956
01:55:09,840 --> 01:55:11,920
could ever put on

2957
01:55:11,920 --> 01:55:13,199
>> a larger building.

2958
01:55:13,199 --> 01:55:15,840
>> But if you had a a little top lot and a

2959
01:55:15,840 --> 01:55:17,599
little house then you could maybe get on

2960
01:55:17,599 --> 01:55:19,280
a little house again another little

2961
01:55:19,280 --> 01:55:20,080
house. Yes

2962
01:55:20,080 --> 01:55:22,239
>> because we do have that as a backup. And

2963
01:55:22,239 --> 01:55:24,159
some of that is the beauty of the way

2964
01:55:24,159 --> 01:55:26,480
that this ordinance has been done is

2965
01:55:26,480 --> 01:55:29,199
that it does provide the freedom for

2966
01:55:29,199 --> 01:55:31,920
someone to look into that. But then, you

2967
01:55:31,920 --> 01:55:34,080
know, they still have to meet all of the

2968
01:55:34,080 --> 01:55:37,040
like the the 60% impervious surface

2969
01:55:37,040 --> 01:55:39,199
protects everyone, right? It's not

2970
01:55:39,199 --> 01:55:42,480
running into somebody else's yard. So, I

2971
01:55:42,480 --> 01:55:42,960
do

2972
01:55:42,960 --> 01:55:45,280
>> there other is there other things that

2973
01:55:45,280 --> 01:55:46,000
so

2974
01:55:46,000 --> 01:55:48,159
>> the side this the setbacks.

2975
01:55:48,159 --> 01:55:49,679
>> Okay. Councilman Banger.

2976
01:55:49,679 --> 01:55:51,199
>> Okay. In addition to those that have

2977
01:55:51,199 --> 01:55:52,719
been mentioned, I hope somebody's got

2978
01:55:52,719 --> 01:55:56,400
notes here. I just pull them off. Okay.

2979
01:55:56,400 --> 01:55:59,040
>> Uh I I would like to look at size

2980
01:55:59,040 --> 01:56:02,239
allowed for the for the

2981
01:56:02,239 --> 01:56:04,639
accessory dwelling unit proportional to

2982
01:56:04,639 --> 01:56:06,719
lot size to some degree. It doesn't need

2983
01:56:06,719 --> 01:56:11,840
to be limited to,50 square feet if if

2984
01:56:11,840 --> 01:56:13,599
they're on a big lot. That that's

2985
01:56:13,599 --> 01:56:15,040
something I think we need to look at

2986
01:56:15,040 --> 01:56:18,880
specifically. Also, I have no problem uh

2987
01:56:18,880 --> 01:56:20,560
it's limited right now if you have one

2988
01:56:20,560 --> 01:56:23,360
ADU may may not have another. I don't

2989
01:56:23,360 --> 01:56:25,119
think that that doesn't make sense to

2990
01:56:25,119 --> 01:56:27,040
me. If you've got an internal ADU for

2991
01:56:27,040 --> 01:56:30,800
grandma and and it's very slightly

2992
01:56:30,800 --> 01:56:34,400
impactful, what's the what's the dilemma

2993
01:56:34,400 --> 01:56:38,159
to have a nicer larger ADU in the

2994
01:56:38,159 --> 01:56:40,960
backyard as well or wherever works on

2995
01:56:40,960 --> 01:56:43,440
the the property to increase our

2996
01:56:43,440 --> 01:56:46,800
affordable housing to make it to make it

2997
01:56:46,800 --> 01:56:50,480
uh feasible for a property owner to make

2998
01:56:50,480 --> 01:56:53,520
these improvements to to to be able to

2999
01:56:53,520 --> 01:56:56,239
accommodate the kids in the backyard who

3000
01:56:56,239 --> 01:56:57,920
have just got married with grandma in

3001
01:56:57,920 --> 01:56:59,679
the basement. So, I want to look

3002
01:56:59,679 --> 01:57:01,760
specifically at that. I don't think I I

3003
01:57:01,760 --> 01:57:03,840
don't think we should have two ADUs on a

3004
01:57:03,840 --> 01:57:05,760
property. I don't think we should have

3005
01:57:05,760 --> 01:57:08,880
two in internal, but I think limiting it

3006
01:57:08,880 --> 01:57:11,280
to one or the other, I don't agree with

3007
01:57:11,280 --> 01:57:13,599
it. It should we could give the

3008
01:57:13,599 --> 01:57:16,080
allowance of one of each.

3009
01:57:16,080 --> 01:57:18,000
>> But if you had a basement, your whole

3010
01:57:18,000 --> 01:57:20,080
basement, you could be renting to a

3011
01:57:20,080 --> 01:57:21,679
family with five children.

3012
01:57:21,679 --> 01:57:23,520
>> That's a pretty restrictive scenario.

3013
01:57:23,520 --> 01:57:26,400
You could have your your daughter and

3014
01:57:26,400 --> 01:57:27,760
husband with two kids in the basement

3015
01:57:27,760 --> 01:57:29,920
and then the same thing outside. So

3016
01:57:29,920 --> 01:57:32,000
>> you now have potentially eight to 10

3017
01:57:32,000 --> 01:57:33,440
people on that property and the impact

3018
01:57:33,440 --> 01:57:33,920
it had.

3019
01:57:33,920 --> 01:57:35,280
>> Okay, that's something that needs to be

3020
01:57:35,280 --> 01:57:36,560
debated into.

3021
01:57:36,560 --> 01:57:37,520
>> So that's what I'm saying. You took one

3022
01:57:37,520 --> 01:57:38,480
good scenario, but there's

3023
01:57:38,480 --> 01:57:40,080
>> love to hear the pros and cons. That's

3024
01:57:40,080 --> 01:57:40,800
how we'll best

3025
01:57:40,800 --> 01:57:41,920
>> and again some of these elements don't

3026
01:57:41,920 --> 01:57:43,199
have to be decided right then. We could

3027
01:57:43,199 --> 01:57:45,440
take it back even a month or two later

3028
01:57:45,440 --> 01:57:47,679
and get those things right now

3029
01:57:47,679 --> 01:57:49,679
>> aggressively if we need. I do I do want

3030
01:57:49,679 --> 01:57:52,560
to bring up an example that was I this

3031
01:57:52,560 --> 01:57:54,080
would never work in Centerville because

3032
01:57:54,080 --> 01:57:55,440
we're not heading that way and this

3033
01:57:55,440 --> 01:57:58,480
isn't our um exact situation, but my son

3034
01:57:58,480 --> 01:58:00,239
when he first got married lived in an

3035
01:58:00,239 --> 01:58:03,599
ADU. It was over a garage, an accessory

3036
01:58:03,599 --> 01:58:07,920
garage. So, this home had an ADU above

3037
01:58:07,920 --> 01:58:10,960
its garage for the house. It had an ADU

3038
01:58:10,960 --> 01:58:13,920
in the basement. It had an ADU over a

3039
01:58:13,920 --> 01:58:16,480
detached garage. And they had a swimming

3040
01:58:16,480 --> 01:58:19,040
pool. And it was a beautiful

3041
01:58:19,040 --> 01:58:21,360
neighborhood and several of the homes in

3042
01:58:21,360 --> 01:58:23,840
that area had 80 use

3043
01:58:23,840 --> 01:58:25,599
>> and and I can agree with that. But yet

3044
01:58:25,599 --> 01:58:28,080
if I was neighbor and I spent a lot of

3045
01:58:28,080 --> 01:58:28,800
money

3046
01:58:28,800 --> 01:58:31,440
>> and now I'm living next to a forplex or

3047
01:58:31,440 --> 01:58:33,599
a fiveplex in a single family home.

3048
01:58:33,599 --> 01:58:35,280
>> I'm not saying that that was is

3049
01:58:35,280 --> 01:58:37,119
appropriate for Centerville. What I'm

3050
01:58:37,119 --> 01:58:39,440
saying is is I sort of agree with what

3051
01:58:39,440 --> 01:58:42,159
you're saying, Councilman Bangader, that

3052
01:58:42,159 --> 01:58:44,639
I mean I think you can have more than

3053
01:58:44,639 --> 01:58:47,679
one and if you can provide the parking,

3054
01:58:47,679 --> 01:58:48,320
>> right,

3055
01:58:48,320 --> 01:58:50,000
>> then I mean I agree you've got to have

3056
01:58:50,000 --> 01:58:51,360
the there's got to be rules

3057
01:58:51,360 --> 01:58:53,440
>> requirements to qualify. But yeah,

3058
01:58:53,440 --> 01:58:55,440
>> but but I think there's some options

3059
01:58:55,440 --> 01:58:57,440
that it works and you're right,

3060
01:58:57,440 --> 01:59:00,000
grandma's in one part and you know then

3061
01:59:00,000 --> 01:59:02,320
and some

3062
01:59:02,320 --> 01:59:04,159
>> but you can't do it on that. You've got

3063
01:59:04,159 --> 01:59:06,320
to be all right with a family of five.

3064
01:59:06,320 --> 01:59:08,719
Not grandma. I'm not against it. I'm

3065
01:59:08,719 --> 01:59:09,119
just saying

3066
01:59:09,119 --> 01:59:11,599
>> but they were empty nesters. So know

3067
01:59:11,599 --> 01:59:13,280
that there was more than about six

3068
01:59:13,280 --> 01:59:14,639
people on that.

3069
01:59:14,639 --> 01:59:16,320
>> But but if you're going to open it up,

3070
01:59:16,320 --> 01:59:18,239
you've got to know that a whole basement

3071
01:59:18,239 --> 01:59:21,440
could be rented out to a family of five.

3072
01:59:21,440 --> 01:59:24,400
Um my only other thing is and this could

3073
01:59:24,400 --> 01:59:26,239
be looked at later, but I'd like to

3074
01:59:26,239 --> 01:59:28,639
consider it in the historic area of

3075
01:59:28,639 --> 01:59:31,679
Centerville. I know of three or four

3076
01:59:31,679 --> 01:59:34,320
historic buildings that would probably

3077
01:59:34,320 --> 01:59:37,599
they're not in people's backyards.

3078
01:59:37,599 --> 01:59:40,880
I think they're all on corner lots,

3079
01:59:40,880 --> 01:59:43,840
but I would like to see those preserved.

3080
01:59:43,840 --> 01:59:46,719
The old post office, which is where I

3081
01:59:46,719 --> 01:59:48,639
started going to the post office.

3082
01:59:48,639 --> 01:59:51,920
>> Those would make really cute ADUs. And

3083
01:59:51,920 --> 01:59:55,520
so maybe if it's a historic building,

3084
01:59:55,520 --> 01:59:56,719
it's not going to affect the

3085
01:59:56,719 --> 01:59:57,920
neighborhood. you're not building

3086
01:59:57,920 --> 01:59:59,440
anything if they don't want to change

3087
01:59:59,440 --> 02:00:01,360
the footprint of it

3088
02:00:01,360 --> 02:00:03,440
>> that I would like to consider letting

3089
02:00:03,440 --> 02:00:04,639
maybe some of those have

3090
02:00:04,639 --> 02:00:05,840
>> ADUs

3091
02:00:05,840 --> 02:00:07,679
>> and in that situation it might not

3092
02:00:07,679 --> 02:00:11,679
require that the facade of the historic

3093
02:00:11,679 --> 02:00:14,960
building histori match the primary

3094
02:00:14,960 --> 02:00:16,639
building that's applying

3095
02:00:16,639 --> 02:00:19,199
>> historic sites was not considered in

3096
02:00:19,199 --> 02:00:22,239
this ordinance at all and I think some

3097
02:00:22,239 --> 02:00:23,760
public comment made some good argument

3098
02:00:23,760 --> 02:00:25,280
that it should be I agree

3099
02:00:25,280 --> 02:00:27,199
>> right the old post office is white

3100
02:00:27,199 --> 02:00:29,119
clapboard and the home I think is

3101
02:00:29,119 --> 02:00:31,520
stucco. I mean, it's very old, too, but

3102
02:00:31,520 --> 02:00:33,760
they're not the same. But like I said,

3103
02:00:33,760 --> 02:00:35,280
it wouldn't affect the neighborhood cuz

3104
02:00:35,280 --> 02:00:37,040
it's already there. I wouldn't want to

3105
02:00:37,040 --> 02:00:37,679
change that.

3106
02:00:37,679 --> 02:00:40,080
>> No, I agree. Maybe that does need to be

3107
02:00:40,080 --> 02:00:41,520
addressed that we need to have a little

3108
02:00:41,520 --> 02:00:44,880
historic paragraph that

3109
02:00:44,880 --> 02:00:47,040
>> any other concepts, Councilman Banger,

3110
02:00:47,040 --> 02:00:47,760
that you have.

3111
02:00:47,760 --> 02:00:49,040
>> I just want to make sure we get

3112
02:00:49,040 --> 02:00:55,440
Councilman Plameumber mentioned the uh the corner lots that that needs to be

3113
02:00:55,440 --> 02:00:56,880
addressed. It does.

3114
02:00:56,880 --> 02:00:57,520
>> Okay.

3115
02:00:57,520 --> 02:01:00,159
What other concepts? So, council

3116
02:01:00,159 --> 02:01:02,639
members or do we did you cover what's on

3117
02:01:02,639 --> 02:01:04,880
>> I I just want to add in I am concerned

3118
02:01:04,880 --> 02:01:07,440
about height as well. I mean, we're

3119
02:01:07,440 --> 02:01:09,520
trying to match a roof line, right? And

3120
02:01:09,520 --> 02:01:12,719
so, I just want to make sure that I I

3121
02:01:12,719 --> 02:01:14,480
the reason I did the AI is because I was

3122
02:01:14,480 --> 02:01:16,880
having a hard time envisioning that 20

3123
02:01:16,880 --> 02:01:20,400
foot height. I I just wanted I obviously

3124
02:01:20,400 --> 02:01:21,679
the planning commission spent

3125
02:01:21,679 --> 02:01:23,199
significant amounts of time. I think

3126
02:01:23,199 --> 02:01:25,119
they did a great job. I think they made

3127
02:01:25,119 --> 02:01:28,000
some really good decisions and I'm

3128
02:01:28,000 --> 02:01:30,480
supportive of it. I'm also fine to go,

3129
02:01:30,480 --> 02:01:31,920
you know, look at these other things. I

3130
02:01:31,920 --> 02:01:33,119
think these are all

3131
02:01:33,119 --> 02:01:35,280
>> one city did have 16 ft. So when you

3132
02:01:35,280 --> 02:01:38,159
said 15 ft, council member was matching

3133
02:01:38,159 --> 02:01:40,560
another city's height at 16 ft.

3134
02:01:40,560 --> 02:01:43,040
>> My can I add too I with regard to the

3135
02:01:43,040 --> 02:01:44,800
height I mean I am concerned about this

3136
02:01:44,800 --> 02:01:46,960
idea of urban shadows, right? um

3137
02:01:46,960 --> 02:01:49,040
building a huge structure that's going

3138
02:01:49,040 --> 02:01:51,760
to overlook a nearby area and I don't

3139
02:01:51,760 --> 02:01:53,840
necessarily have a problem with 20 feet

3140
02:01:53,840 --> 02:01:55,119
per se because you might have a big

3141
02:01:55,119 --> 02:01:56,960
enough lot that it would support it but

3142
02:01:56,960 --> 02:01:58,719
this concept that's been floated about

3143
02:01:58,719 --> 02:02:00,639
maybe the higher it is the more the

3144
02:02:00,639 --> 02:02:02,239
setback has to be I would just love for

3145
02:02:02,239 --> 02:02:04,800
you guys to look to like give some some

3146
02:02:04,800 --> 02:02:07,199
thought to that idea the other thing was

3147
02:02:07,199 --> 02:02:09,679
Lisa had brought up that our ordinance

3148
02:02:09,679 --> 02:02:11,440
does something that state law doesn't

3149
02:02:11,440 --> 02:02:13,360
require and that's allow for basements

3150
02:02:13,360 --> 02:02:15,040
and I don't necessarily have a problem

3151
02:02:15,040 --> 02:02:18,639
with basements But if it's a 350 foot

3152
02:02:18,639 --> 02:02:20,960
square print and we have a a basement in

3153
02:02:20,960 --> 02:02:22,960
that I mean that feels like a super tiny

3154
02:02:22,960 --> 02:02:25,520
little basement to me. Is that really

3155
02:02:25,520 --> 02:02:27,119
what we want? And do you have any

3156
02:02:27,119 --> 02:02:30,239
concerns with regard to basement at all?

3157
02:02:30,239 --> 02:02:31,804
I mean even in like a little 350

3158
02:02:31,804 --> 02:02:33,199
[clears throat] square foot

3159
02:02:33,199 --> 02:02:35,280
>> I think the minimum was 500 square ft.

3160
02:02:35,280 --> 02:02:37,520
So it wouldn't be that smaller or 600

3161
02:02:37,520 --> 02:02:39,679
square ft. But uh I mean I look at

3162
02:02:39,679 --> 02:02:41,599
building but again groundwater I mean

3163
02:02:41,599 --> 02:02:42,960
that's that but we would require them to

3164
02:02:42,960 --> 02:02:44,560
do a geotech. they'd have to go through

3165
02:02:44,560 --> 02:02:46,960
a permitted use review anyway. So that

3166
02:02:46,960 --> 02:02:48,960
would be evaluated. So I think I think

3167
02:02:48,960 --> 02:02:50,400
just if they went through the process,

3168
02:02:50,400 --> 02:02:52,320
the site would determine whether or not

3169
02:02:52,320 --> 02:02:54,000
they could even qualify for a basement

3170
02:02:54,000 --> 02:02:55,280
based on geotech strata

3171
02:02:55,280 --> 02:02:57,920
>> there. I and I'm generally supportive if

3172
02:02:57,920 --> 02:03:01,840
it will if it's safe and whatever.

3173
02:03:01,840 --> 02:03:03,280
That's it for me.

3174
02:03:03,280 --> 02:03:04,480
>> All right. I'm going to do a public

3175
02:03:04,480 --> 02:03:08,080
hearing because we uh did agenda it and

3176
02:03:08,080 --> 02:03:09,840
I don't want anybody's coming back

3177
02:03:09,840 --> 02:03:12,239
saying uh we didn't do a public hearing.

3178
02:03:12,239 --> 02:03:14,239
So, this is a public hearing on zoning

3179
02:03:14,239 --> 02:03:17,280
cone amendments uh regards to uh

3180
02:03:17,280 --> 02:03:20,480
detached uh accessory dwelling units.

3181
02:03:20,480 --> 02:03:22,560
Anybody that wants to comment, just

3182
02:03:22,560 --> 02:03:25,119
state your name and um where you're

3183
02:03:25,119 --> 02:03:33,189
from. That public hearing is now open.

3184
02:03:33,199 --> 02:03:35,199
» Anybody online?

3185
02:03:35,199 --> 02:03:37,199
Okay, that uh public hearing is now

3186
02:03:37,199 --> 02:03:40,960
closed. Now, I would uh um I would

3187
02:03:40,960 --> 02:03:43,360
council uh this is kind of a unique

3188
02:03:43,360 --> 02:03:44,960
situation because we had more public

3189
02:03:44,960 --> 02:03:46,400
hearing of the planning commission than

3190
02:03:46,400 --> 02:03:48,080
we did a council meeting. Usually, it's

3191
02:03:48,080 --> 02:03:50,880
not that way. So, so if you want some

3192
02:03:50,880 --> 02:03:52,639
more public hearing comments in addition

3193
02:03:52,639 --> 02:03:54,960
to the two comments uh you've re

3194
02:03:54,960 --> 02:03:57,679
received in the last 24 hours, you might

3195
02:03:57,679 --> 02:03:59,280
want to go back and look at some of the

3196
02:03:59,280 --> 02:04:06,800
public hearing comments uh uh from the the planning commission meeting. Um,

3197
02:04:06,800 --> 02:04:08,400
what else was I going to say? I think

3198
02:04:08,400 --> 02:04:11,119
that's it. So, do do I have any type of

3199
02:04:11,119 --> 02:04:12,960
uh motion?

3200
02:04:12,960 --> 02:04:14,719
>> Are we going to accept further public

3201
02:04:14,719 --> 02:04:17,040
comment until we meet in two weeks?

3202
02:04:17,040 --> 02:04:17,599
>> Uh,

3203
02:04:17,599 --> 02:04:18,320
>> by mail.

3204
02:04:18,320 --> 02:04:19,840
>> I think we should. I think we should.

3205
02:04:19,840 --> 02:04:20,480
>> I do.

3206
02:04:20,480 --> 02:04:21,679
>> What's wrong? I think that's a great

3207
02:04:21,679 --> 02:04:23,520
idea. That's a great idea.

3208
02:04:23,520 --> 02:04:24,960
>> Do you want me to make a motion?

3209
02:04:24,960 --> 02:04:27,840
>> Sure. I'll make a motion that we table

3210
02:04:27,840 --> 02:04:31,760
um the detached accessory dwelling unit

3211
02:04:31,760 --> 02:04:35,520
discussion Centerville zoning code 12.58

3212
02:04:35,520 --> 02:04:38,800
um until two weeks from tonight. Uh

3213
02:04:38,800 --> 02:04:40,880
we'll leave the public hearing open.

3214
02:04:40,880 --> 02:04:44,080
Residents may comment through email

3215
02:04:44,080 --> 02:04:45,599
um

3216
02:04:45,599 --> 02:04:47,679
or they may be here at the next meeting

3217
02:04:47,679 --> 02:04:51,119
to provide comment.

3218
02:04:51,119 --> 02:04:52,560
>> Second.

3219
02:04:52,560 --> 02:04:55,440
>> Motion to second. Uh, Councilwoman

3220
02:04:55,440 --> 02:04:56,800
Haymon, going to my right.

3221
02:04:56,800 --> 02:05:00,159
>> I

3222
02:05:00,159 --> 02:05:02,560
>> All right. Thank you. So, uh, be ready

3223
02:05:02,560 --> 02:05:05,760
in two weeks. Uh, we'll convene at noon

3224
02:05:05,760 --> 02:05:07,119
because it's going to be a 12-hour

3225
02:05:07,119 --> 02:05:13,510
discussion. [laughter]

3226
02:05:13,520 --> 02:05:16,719
» All right. So, uh, we do have of our

3227
02:05:16,719 --> 02:05:18,080
things left. We've discussed three of

3228
02:05:18,080 --> 02:05:19,760
them previously, so hopefully we don't

3229
02:05:19,760 --> 02:05:21,199
have to go into too much on that. So,

3230
02:05:21,199 --> 02:05:23,440
let's go to item number three. Uh,

3231
02:05:23,440 --> 02:05:25,440
Centerville fee schedule amendments.

3232
02:05:25,440 --> 02:05:28,000
This is a public hearing resolution

3233
02:05:28,000 --> 02:05:30,639
2026-04.

3234
02:05:30,639 --> 02:05:33,920
And Haley, I was kept looking back

3235
02:05:33,920 --> 02:05:35,840
there. You were Were you hiding behind

3236
02:05:35,840 --> 02:05:37,679
Mike

3237
02:05:37,679 --> 02:05:38,639
little bit?

3238
02:05:38,639 --> 02:05:42,639
>> Okay, thank you. Haley, take it away.

3239
02:05:42,639 --> 02:05:46,400
>> Okay. Uh, fee schedules. Um, so yeah,

3240
02:05:46,400 --> 02:05:48,560
this is what I uh we did have a work

3241
02:05:48,560 --> 02:05:51,920
session on this. Um, seemed like we had

3242
02:05:51,920 --> 02:05:53,599
some positive feedback and support for

3243
02:05:53,599 --> 02:05:55,040
that. We haven't changed any of the

3244
02:05:55,040 --> 02:05:58,880
numbers since we last met.

3245
02:05:58,880 --> 02:06:06,629
You guys have questions for me?

3246
02:06:06,639 --> 02:06:10,800
» Any questions or anything?

3247
02:06:10,800 --> 02:06:13,119
>> Do we have

3248
02:06:13,119 --> 02:06:16,080
we had that contract with uh youth

3249
02:06:16,080 --> 02:06:17,599
football? Mhm.

3250
02:06:17,599 --> 02:06:20,320
>> Do we have when that contract is not in

3251
02:06:20,320 --> 02:06:24,639
place, is there an ability to have a fee

3252
02:06:24,639 --> 02:06:27,920
utilize that space to

3253
02:06:27,920 --> 02:06:30,159
do the same thing they're doing? Is that

3254
02:06:30,159 --> 02:06:31,040
>> concessions?

3255
02:06:31,040 --> 02:06:32,000
>> Yes.

3256
02:06:32,000 --> 02:06:36,790
>> We don't have anything outlined.

3257
02:06:36,800 --> 02:06:39,520
» I wonder if that would be

3258
02:06:39,520 --> 02:06:41,760
>> something we could talk about at another

3259
02:06:41,760 --> 02:06:42,880
time. But um

3260
02:06:42,880 --> 02:06:45,280
>> yeah, with it being

3261
02:06:45,280 --> 02:06:47,760
a building where we have a lot of our

3262
02:06:47,760 --> 02:06:50,239
own amenities in there,

3263
02:06:50,239 --> 02:06:53,360
>> I would never just want to like have a

3264
02:06:53,360 --> 02:06:55,040
blank fee for people to come in. It's

3265
02:06:55,040 --> 02:06:56,320
something I would always want to have an

3266
02:06:56,320 --> 02:06:57,920
agreement with because of our own

3267
02:06:57,920 --> 02:07:00,400
amenities that we've used city funding

3268
02:07:00,400 --> 02:07:03,520
to provide. Um so if there was another

3269
02:07:03,520 --> 02:07:05,760
interested group, um we have put it out

3270
02:07:05,760 --> 02:07:08,880
to RFP before. Um, so that's the same

3271
02:07:08,880 --> 02:07:10,880
kind of process we would do to lease

3272
02:07:10,880 --> 02:07:12,000
that space.

3273
02:07:12,000 --> 02:07:12,880
>> Okay.

3274
02:07:12,880 --> 02:07:16,079
>> This is all field use fee in this uh

3275
02:07:16,079 --> 02:07:17,760
resolution though, right? Or ordinance,

3276
02:07:17,760 --> 02:07:19,920
>> correct? Yeah. Field use fee specific.

3277
02:07:19,920 --> 02:07:23,119
Nothing with pavilions or our buildings.

3278
02:07:23,119 --> 02:07:25,280
>> Okay. They're all there in front of you.

3279
02:07:25,280 --> 02:07:28,480
Um, I think you guys have discussed it

3280
02:07:28,480 --> 02:07:31,040
before as well too. So,

3281
02:07:31,040 --> 02:07:34,560
um, any more questions? Motion.

3282
02:07:34,560 --> 02:07:37,199
>> Can I ask you a question, mayor? Uh

3283
02:07:37,199 --> 02:07:40,719
well, when I you asked for a list when

3284
02:07:40,719 --> 02:07:44,000
we f when first of the year of things, I

3285
02:07:44,000 --> 02:07:46,960
suggested one item on that list be that

3286
02:07:46,960 --> 02:07:51,199
we not raise any fees not without having

3287
02:07:51,199 --> 02:07:55,760
a public hearing and uh and I uh I know

3288
02:07:55,760 --> 02:07:58,719
we are required to do that for taxation

3289
02:07:58,719 --> 02:08:02,320
and we had our public hearing. I just I

3290
02:08:02,320 --> 02:08:04,560
don't have a problem with this. I'm

3291
02:08:04,560 --> 02:08:07,199
totally supportive. I understand that.

3292
02:08:07,199 --> 02:08:11,119
But I would like to conform to a strong

3293
02:08:11,119 --> 02:08:14,719
feeling I have that uh fees should not

3294
02:08:14,719 --> 02:08:18,159
be released raised in the city, water,

3295
02:08:18,159 --> 02:08:20,560
storm drain, anything without a public

3296
02:08:20,560 --> 02:08:22,960
hearing. And so I would I'd like to

3297
02:08:22,960 --> 02:08:25,119
suggest that we include that. And I'm

3298
02:08:25,119 --> 02:08:25,440
sorry.

3299
02:08:25,440 --> 02:08:28,079
>> This is a public hearing.

3300
02:08:28,079 --> 02:08:29,119
>> It is a public hearing.

3301
02:08:29,119 --> 02:08:31,599
>> We are doing public hearing on this.

3302
02:08:31,599 --> 02:08:32,719
>> I'm sorry.

3303
02:08:32,719 --> 02:08:35,920
>> Okay, you're good. All right. So uh we

3304
02:08:35,920 --> 02:08:36,400
will go to

3305
02:08:36,400 --> 02:08:37,280
>> we liked your suggestion.

3306
02:08:37,280 --> 02:08:40,079
>> I was in total [laughter] support.

3307
02:08:40,079 --> 02:08:42,000
>> We will go to the public hearing portion

3308
02:08:42,000 --> 02:08:44,880
then seeing no further comment. So this

3309
02:08:44,880 --> 02:08:47,199
is a public hearing uh regarding the

3310
02:08:47,199 --> 02:08:48,960
centerville fee schedule amendments.

3311
02:08:48,960 --> 02:08:52,320
It's resolution number 2026-4.

3312
02:08:52,320 --> 02:08:54,800
Any uhbody from the public can comment.

3313
02:08:54,800 --> 02:08:56,079
Just state your name and where you're

3314
02:08:56,079 --> 02:09:02,550
from. That public hearing is now open.

3315
02:09:02,560 --> 02:09:05,840
Anybody online? Seeing no comments, we

3316
02:09:05,840 --> 02:09:07,760
will close that public hearing and come

3317
02:09:07,760 --> 02:09:11,840
back to uh if there's any uh quick

3318
02:09:11,840 --> 02:09:13,599
questions. Otherwise, I'll look for a

3319
02:09:13,599 --> 02:09:14,400
motion.

3320
02:09:14,400 --> 02:09:15,920
>> I'll move that we approve resolution

3321
02:09:15,920 --> 02:09:18,480
number 2026-04 amending the Centerville

3322
02:09:18,480 --> 02:09:20,400
fees schedule to increase field use fees

3323
02:09:20,400 --> 02:09:23,440
as set forth in section 15.030.

3324
02:09:23,440 --> 02:09:25,760
The one um amendment that I would make

3325
02:09:25,760 --> 02:09:28,239
is I think this was just a carryover. Uh

3326
02:09:28,239 --> 02:09:30,880
the proposed packet resolution says

3327
02:09:30,880 --> 02:09:33,280
adopted on the 18th day of August. I

3328
02:09:33,280 --> 02:09:37,920
would just update that to September 1st.

3329
02:09:37,920 --> 02:09:40,239
>> Okay. Do I have a second to that?

3330
02:09:40,239 --> 02:09:40,800
>> Second.

3331
02:09:40,800 --> 02:09:42,960
>> I have a second. Councilman Hurst going

3332
02:09:42,960 --> 02:09:43,760
to the right.

3333
02:09:43,760 --> 02:09:46,800
>> I

3334
02:09:46,800 --> 02:09:48,960
>> That passes unanimously. Thank you. Item

3335
02:09:48,960 --> 02:09:51,760
number four. This is field use prior uh

3336
02:09:51,760 --> 02:09:54,719
field use priority of use and uh PE

3337
02:09:54,719 --> 02:09:58,400
policy discussion. Hey. Yes. Um so we

3338
02:09:58,400 --> 02:10:00,239
also discussed this when we were

3339
02:10:00,239 --> 02:10:03,199
discussing the increase for use of the

3340
02:10:03,199 --> 02:10:07,199
fields. Um just to create a priority use

3341
02:10:07,199 --> 02:10:10,560
um so as user groups are looking to our

3342
02:10:10,560 --> 02:10:13,040
facilities, we can take them in a

3343
02:10:13,040 --> 02:10:16,960
priority listed option here. Um

3344
02:10:16,960 --> 02:10:19,360
obviously creating our own programs and

3345
02:10:19,360 --> 02:10:21,840
events come first, then our partnerships

3346
02:10:21,840 --> 02:10:23,920
and then everybody else just so we are

3347
02:10:23,920 --> 02:10:27,440
treating people the same.

3348
02:10:27,440 --> 02:10:29,679
Um so yeah,

3349
02:10:29,679 --> 02:10:33,119
with this um priority usage, it does

3350
02:10:33,119 --> 02:10:35,679
just help us clarify

3351
02:10:35,679 --> 02:10:40,239
how we take rentals. Um we don't have

3352
02:10:40,239 --> 02:10:43,760
a we're not overrun with requests in

3353
02:10:43,760 --> 02:10:48,400
terms of our rentals. Like we have three

3354
02:10:48,400 --> 02:10:50,880
big user groups. South Davis Recreation

3355
02:10:50,880 --> 02:10:53,840
District, their soccer program, the U

3356
02:10:53,840 --> 02:10:55,760
Conference Tackle Football. We also have

3357
02:10:55,760 --> 02:10:58,079
an allability soccer program that we

3358
02:10:58,079 --> 02:11:02,480
lease to. Um I did discuss the um

3359
02:11:02,480 --> 02:11:05,360
subsidies fees with this new amended fee

3360
02:11:05,360 --> 02:11:07,520
schedule, how that would impact them um

3361
02:11:07,520 --> 02:11:08,800
because that was something council

3362
02:11:08,800 --> 02:11:11,119
wanted me to address. So I did reach out

3363
02:11:11,119 --> 02:11:14,960
to our big user groups on that. Um they

3364
02:11:14,960 --> 02:11:17,599
do there would be some fees passed on to

3365
02:11:17,599 --> 02:11:21,360
users, but they also do have ways to um

3366
02:11:21,360 --> 02:11:25,280
subsidize it themselves as well.

3367
02:11:25,280 --> 02:11:26,960
So, I thought that was kind of an

3368
02:11:26,960 --> 02:11:28,960
important touch note. I know that, Gina,

3369
02:11:28,960 --> 02:11:30,239
that was something you were concerned

3370
02:11:30,239 --> 02:11:32,400
about. So, I did reach out to them. Um,

3371
02:11:32,400 --> 02:11:34,560
and then our other users outside of

3372
02:11:34,560 --> 02:11:38,159
those big groups are really um teams

3373
02:11:38,159 --> 02:11:40,639
coming in for a practice. And it's

3374
02:11:40,639 --> 02:11:44,239
nothing as regular or as organized as

3375
02:11:44,239 --> 02:11:47,360
our community partners are. It's, you

3376
02:11:47,360 --> 02:11:49,599
know, a football team who wants three

3377
02:11:49,599 --> 02:11:50,960
nights committed and so they want to

3378
02:11:50,960 --> 02:11:52,320
have that reserve so they can come in

3379
02:11:52,320 --> 02:11:55,520
and practice. Um, so this new priority

3380
02:11:55,520 --> 02:11:58,400
usage really helps

3381
02:11:58,400 --> 02:11:59,840
people kind of know where they stand

3382
02:11:59,840 --> 02:12:03,760
when they're looking for field space.

3383
02:12:03,760 --> 02:12:06,880
>> So, uh, you I don't see anywhere that

3384
02:12:06,880 --> 02:12:08,480
we're approving anything. Are we just

3385
02:12:08,480 --> 02:12:11,440
discussing this or do we want to do some

3386
02:12:11,440 --> 02:12:15,280
approval on this or

3387
02:12:15,280 --> 02:12:16,800
>> just discussing and getting feedback,

3388
02:12:16,800 --> 02:12:17,199
mayor?

3389
02:12:17,199 --> 02:12:17,520
>> Yeah,

3390
02:12:17,520 --> 02:12:18,639
>> that's the intent of this

3391
02:12:18,639 --> 02:12:21,360
>> suggestions for Haley on uh Haley on

3392
02:12:21,360 --> 02:12:24,719
this uh number background one proposed

3393
02:12:24,719 --> 02:12:27,599
rental priority or subsidy levels.

3394
02:12:27,599 --> 02:12:30,320
>> I'm just curious if if there's a local

3395
02:12:30,320 --> 02:12:32,960
group that's from Centerville and wants

3396
02:12:32,960 --> 02:12:36,000
to use it as opposed to, you know, a

3397
02:12:36,000 --> 02:12:38,400
church group or a

3398
02:12:38,400 --> 02:12:40,719
boys club or

3399
02:12:40,719 --> 02:12:42,800
are they would they have priority over

3400
02:12:42,800 --> 02:12:45,679
somebody from outside the city?

3401
02:12:45,679 --> 02:12:49,040
Um, right now as it is spelled out, no.

3402
02:12:49,040 --> 02:12:51,360
Unless they are our community partner

3403
02:12:51,360 --> 02:12:52,960
like with South Davis Recreation

3404
02:12:52,960 --> 02:12:57,360
District or the Ute Conference. Um, we do partner with them because they

3405
02:12:57,360 --> 02:12:59,679
provide programming. We don't. Um, so

3406
02:12:59,679 --> 02:13:03,280
for them to get priority usage over

3407
02:13:03,280 --> 02:13:05,840
another group, we would have to find an

3408
02:13:05,840 --> 02:13:06,719
agreement with them.

3409
02:13:06,719 --> 02:13:09,199
>> But those groups have an agreement with

3410
02:13:09,199 --> 02:13:10,000
this.

3411
02:13:10,000 --> 02:13:12,320
>> Correct. So

3412
02:13:12,320 --> 02:13:14,639
they would have they should have prior

3413
02:13:14,639 --> 02:13:16,880
usage over anybody that doesn't have an

3414
02:13:16,880 --> 02:13:18,159
agreement with this, right?

3415
02:13:18,159 --> 02:13:21,040
>> Yes. Um obviously they can't take it if

3416
02:13:21,040 --> 02:13:23,040
you have it booked all fall for you

3417
02:13:23,040 --> 02:13:24,800
conference football or

3418
02:13:24,800 --> 02:13:27,040
>> right soccer fields are booked.

3419
02:13:27,040 --> 02:13:28,719
>> Yeah. And right now, I think what's kind

3420
02:13:28,719 --> 02:13:30,880
of prompted on the priority usage for me

3421
02:13:30,880 --> 02:13:34,000
is that um our own interlocal agreement

3422
02:13:34,000 --> 02:13:36,800
with South Davis expired um a couple

3423
02:13:36,800 --> 02:13:39,520
years ago when they paid off their their

3424
02:13:39,520 --> 02:13:42,000
lease from us to to finish the soccer

3425
02:13:42,000 --> 02:13:44,800
fields. Um so it's really a a benefit

3426
02:13:44,800 --> 02:13:47,040
for them that they can reserve it for

3427
02:13:47,040 --> 02:13:49,520
their league who serves our citizens as

3428
02:13:49,520 --> 02:13:52,880
well. Um, so there to I guess back to

3429
02:13:52,880 --> 02:13:55,840
your point, mayor, is we don't currently

3430
02:13:55,840 --> 02:13:58,560
have an agreement with them and we were

3431
02:13:58,560 --> 02:14:00,159
kind of waiting to put something into

3432
02:14:00,159 --> 02:14:01,360
place because we don't want to enter

3433
02:14:01,360 --> 02:14:03,679
into another multi-year agreement. We

3434
02:14:03,679 --> 02:14:05,440
want to be able to take it yearbyear,

3435
02:14:05,440 --> 02:14:07,360
but by having something outlined as

3436
02:14:07,360 --> 02:14:09,920
priority usage, it's well, we're not

3437
02:14:09,920 --> 02:14:11,599
going to rent it to a private soccer

3438
02:14:11,599 --> 02:14:15,119
club over the recck district that serves

3439
02:14:15,119 --> 02:14:17,599
our community.

3440
02:14:17,599 --> 02:14:20,560
You would be still able to rent it as a

3441
02:14:20,560 --> 02:14:22,400
soccer club. You would just be in the

3442
02:14:22,400 --> 02:14:24,639
third priority versus the second

3443
02:14:24,639 --> 02:14:25,440
priority.

3444
02:14:25,440 --> 02:14:28,000
>> Exactly. Yeah. And leaving the subsidy

3445
02:14:28,000 --> 02:14:30,719
up to council to decide on how much are

3446
02:14:30,719 --> 02:14:32,480
we able to support this program with the

3447
02:14:32,480 --> 02:14:34,719
subsidy.

3448
02:14:34,719 --> 02:14:38,400
And Haley, I I assume the priority means

3449
02:14:38,400 --> 02:14:40,719
scheduling like like if a third priority

3450
02:14:40,719 --> 02:14:45,920
group gets the 15th of September scheduled, a

3451
02:14:45,920 --> 02:14:48,400
first priority group later decides they

3452
02:14:48,400 --> 02:14:50,159
want that, they can't bump that third

3453
02:14:50,159 --> 02:14:51,520
priority group who already had it

3454
02:14:51,520 --> 02:14:53,679
scheduled, right? Or can they?

3455
02:14:53,679 --> 02:14:56,079
>> Um, so we kind of schedule out for a

3456
02:14:56,079 --> 02:14:59,280
year a calendar year block at a time. Um

3457
02:14:59,280 --> 02:15:02,480
so they that first priority that or that

3458
02:15:02,480 --> 02:15:04,480
second priority user group they would

3459
02:15:04,480 --> 02:15:06,400
come first. Um so if you're in that

3460
02:15:06,400 --> 02:15:08,800
group and you wanted time then we would

3461
02:15:08,800 --> 02:15:10,480
look at that at the calendar for when

3462
02:15:10,480 --> 02:15:13,760
it's available and you you give be given

3463
02:15:13,760 --> 02:15:16,000
that time but that's within our control

3464
02:15:16,000 --> 02:15:18,560
over who we choose to partner with. But

3465
02:15:18,560 --> 02:15:20,719
I think what he's saying is, okay, you

3466
02:15:20,719 --> 02:15:22,560
put your calendar out and these people

3467
02:15:22,560 --> 02:15:24,239
have taken this, these people have taken

3468
02:15:24,239 --> 02:15:25,520
this and you've got

3469
02:15:25,520 --> 02:15:27,440
>> two weeks right here that's open and I

3470
02:15:27,440 --> 02:15:30,960
decide I want it and so I'm third, but I

3471
02:15:30,960 --> 02:15:32,560
take that because everybody else has

3472
02:15:32,560 --> 02:15:34,960
chose. Then number one or number two

3473
02:15:34,960 --> 02:15:36,800
couldn't decide they want that and bump

3474
02:15:36,800 --> 02:15:37,280
me.

3475
02:15:37,280 --> 02:15:37,920
>> Correct.

3476
02:15:37,920 --> 02:15:40,079
>> Okay, that's that was that was

3477
02:15:40,079 --> 02:15:46,390
>> Yeah. Thank you.

3478
02:15:46,400 --> 02:15:50,159
» Okay. Uh you you like it. Do you have

3479
02:15:50,159 --> 02:15:56,790
good other ideas to add to her?

3480
02:15:56,800 --> 02:15:59,040
» There's one more thing that I would like

3481
02:15:59,040 --> 02:16:01,119
to add in here which I neglected to put

3482
02:16:01,119 --> 02:16:03,199
in there which was the school district.

3483
02:16:03,199 --> 02:16:06,320
Um historically in the past we we have

3484
02:16:06,320 --> 02:16:08,159
not charged them anything for a rental.

3485
02:16:08,159 --> 02:16:10,480
I think that that should continue. Um,

3486
02:16:10,480 --> 02:16:13,440
so they would kind of be that one a if

3487
02:16:13,440 --> 02:16:16,159
you will in this priority usage of they

3488
02:16:16,159 --> 02:16:18,239
kind of come next to just behind our

3489
02:16:18,239 --> 02:16:21,440
city events. Um, and I when I was

3490
02:16:21,440 --> 02:16:23,119
looking over this I had completely

3491
02:16:23,119 --> 02:16:25,520
neglected to include them in this. So I

3492
02:16:25,520 --> 02:16:26,800
think that would be a good thing to add

3493
02:16:26,800 --> 02:16:28,000
in there.

3494
02:16:28,000 --> 02:16:28,960
>> School district.

3495
02:16:28,960 --> 02:16:32,080
>> Yeah. What's an example? Um example is

3496
02:16:32,080 --> 02:16:34,479
for example this summer the soccer field

3497
02:16:34,479 --> 02:16:36,880
was being renovated and so they used our

3498
02:16:36,880 --> 02:16:38,639
soccer fields in the morning for an hour

3499
02:16:38,639 --> 02:16:41,200
for it was about eight weeks. So being

3500
02:16:41,200 --> 02:16:42,800
able to accommodate them and support

3501
02:16:42,800 --> 02:16:46,319
them in that I feel is important. Um or

3502
02:16:46,319 --> 02:16:49,359
we'll have you know football team wants

3503
02:16:49,359 --> 02:16:50,800
to use our pavilion. We're not going to

3504
02:16:50,800 --> 02:16:53,519
charge them for that. Um because our

3505
02:16:53,519 --> 02:16:57,359
taxes kind of go to both places right?

3506
02:16:57,359 --> 02:16:59,689
>> No they get a lot more than we do.

3507
02:16:59,689 --> 02:17:01,040
[laughter] Right. But we don't want to

3508
02:17:01,040 --> 02:17:02,479
double charge them.

3509
02:17:02,479 --> 02:17:04,800
>> Do you know do other cities do the same?

3510
02:17:04,800 --> 02:17:06,559
They provide facilities to school

3511
02:17:06,559 --> 02:17:07,840
districts without charge.

3512
02:17:07,840 --> 02:17:08,559
>> Yes.

3513
02:17:08,559 --> 02:17:11,200
>> It's interesting just because the um

3514
02:17:11,200 --> 02:17:14,000
recreck district is not able to do that

3515
02:17:14,000 --> 02:17:16,880
obviously with the pool time and and ice

3516
02:17:16,880 --> 02:17:17,679
time. There are

3517
02:17:17,679 --> 02:17:20,160
>> they exchange gym space for pool space.

3518
02:17:20,160 --> 02:17:22,240
So the schools support their junior jazz

3519
02:17:22,240 --> 02:17:24,160
program and then they support all the

3520
02:17:24,160 --> 02:17:26,000
schools with their pool space. slightly

3521
02:17:26,000 --> 02:17:28,160
changing though and there is because of

3522
02:17:28,160 --> 02:17:31,040
the the amount of students using the

3523
02:17:31,040 --> 02:17:33,519
pool there is there are fees now being

3524
02:17:33,519 --> 02:17:35,920
charged like they're paying

3525
02:17:35,920 --> 02:17:38,240
>> and we could include them in our tier 2

3526
02:17:38,240 --> 02:17:40,080
and require them to pay whatever

3527
02:17:40,080 --> 02:17:40,800
percentage

3528
02:17:40,800 --> 02:17:42,880
>> I'm not I'm not saying we should I'm

3529
02:17:42,880 --> 02:17:45,760
just um just pointing out that that has

3530
02:17:45,760 --> 02:17:48,240
changed at the rec district a little bit

3531
02:17:48,240 --> 02:17:50,479
>> out of sheer curiosity does it work both

3532
02:17:50,479 --> 02:17:52,319
ways if we need to borrow school

3533
02:17:52,319 --> 02:17:54,240
property do they allow us to use their

3534
02:17:54,240 --> 02:17:56,559
facilities for free.

3535
02:17:56,559 --> 02:17:59,359
>> Yes, but it doesn't come up very often

3536
02:17:59,359 --> 02:18:01,439
for us, but for example, if we wanted

3537
02:18:01,439 --> 02:18:04,319
indoor space, um we don't have anything

3538
02:18:04,319 --> 02:18:06,319
in Centerville that can accommodate us

3539
02:18:06,319 --> 02:18:09,920
indoor. Um and we I I'm happy to say,

3540
02:18:09,920 --> 02:18:12,000
hey, we're looking at this agreement. We

3541
02:18:12,000 --> 02:18:14,800
want to make sure it's a partnership and

3542
02:18:14,800 --> 02:18:16,800
not one way, one-sided.

3543
02:18:16,800 --> 02:18:19,200
>> It used to come up. I can think of one

3544
02:18:19,200 --> 02:18:21,679
instance uh when the quilt show was held

3545
02:18:21,679 --> 02:18:23,679
in this elementary school over here. And

3546
02:18:23,679 --> 02:18:25,439
I'm assuming they allowed us to use it

3547
02:18:25,439 --> 02:18:28,080
for free back then.

3548
02:18:28,080 --> 02:18:30,800
>> What about another thing I think that I

3549
02:18:30,800 --> 02:18:32,639
I'm not sure how this works right now,

3550
02:18:32,639 --> 02:18:34,880
but Centerville has a day of service

3551
02:18:34,880 --> 02:18:37,280
which is communitywide and they do that

3552
02:18:37,280 --> 02:18:40,000
most of that at the junior high. Do they

3553
02:18:40,000 --> 02:18:41,840
maybe they allow the building to be used

3554
02:18:41,840 --> 02:18:45,599
for free and they pay for some

3555
02:18:45,599 --> 02:18:46,319
>> um

3556
02:18:46,319 --> 02:18:48,319
>> but that's not the city custodial.

3557
02:18:48,319 --> 02:18:48,800
>> Yeah.

3558
02:18:48,800 --> 02:18:50,559
I know when we've done like our

3559
02:18:50,559 --> 02:18:53,200
Arbor Day art with the treeboard, um

3560
02:18:53,200 --> 02:18:55,040
we've always used Centerville Elementary

3561
02:18:55,040 --> 02:18:58,000
for that and it has been free space. So,

3562
02:18:58,000 --> 02:18:58,319
okay.

3563
02:18:58,319 --> 02:19:01,599
>> We do have a history of of that.

3564
02:19:01,599 --> 02:19:04,950
>> Okay.

3565
02:19:04,960 --> 02:19:08,319
» All right. Great. Thank you, Haley.

3566
02:19:08,319 --> 02:19:09,359
>> Appreciate you.

3567
02:19:09,359 --> 02:19:10,479
>> Thanks.

3568
02:19:10,479 --> 02:19:13,040
>> All right. Let's go back to center of

3569
02:19:13,040 --> 02:19:15,280
municipal code amendments virtual

3570
02:19:15,280 --> 02:19:21,110
currency kiosk ordinance 2026-9.

3571
02:19:21,120 --> 02:19:22,880
Um

3572
02:19:22,880 --> 02:19:26,800
do u we need further discussion on this

3573
02:19:26,800 --> 02:19:28,800
for the public. We probably should have

3574
02:19:28,800 --> 02:19:31,679
a little bit. Uh so you have in the

3575
02:19:31,679 --> 02:19:33,679
public has in front of them the packet

3576
02:19:33,679 --> 02:19:37,280
that's been put out by uh chief of

3577
02:19:37,280 --> 02:19:43,040
police and Sergeant Dingman. But um uh

3578
02:19:43,040 --> 02:19:46,399
anything else a quick summary since

3579
02:19:46,399 --> 02:19:50,640
uh in addition to the packet?

3580
02:19:50,640 --> 02:19:52,319
>> We do need a presentation for the

3581
02:19:52,319 --> 02:19:52,960
record.

3582
02:19:52,960 --> 02:19:55,120
>> Yes. That's why I'm asking them to bring

3583
02:19:55,120 --> 02:19:55,920
something up.

3584
02:19:55,920 --> 02:19:56,960
>> Yeah.

3585
02:19:56,960 --> 02:19:58,080
>> You like to go through your quick

3586
02:19:58,080 --> 02:20:01,280
presentation? You can go through it in

3587
02:20:01,280 --> 02:20:03,840
>> five minutes or less.

3588
02:20:03,840 --> 02:20:11,190
>> Yeah.

3589
02:20:11,200 --> 02:20:14,720
Okay. Um, so we'll This isn't very long,

3590
02:20:14,720 --> 02:20:16,560
so I should be able to get through

3591
02:20:16,560 --> 02:20:19,680
quickly. Uh, virtual currency kiosks,

3592
02:20:19,680 --> 02:20:22,960
you'll hear them by Bitcoin ATMs, crypto

3593
02:20:22,960 --> 02:20:24,479
ATMs, you name it. There's a bunch of

3594
02:20:24,479 --> 02:20:25,600
different names for them. They're all

3595
02:20:25,600 --> 02:20:28,000
synonymous, but the way the codes and

3596
02:20:28,000 --> 02:20:29,680
some of the statutes that are being

3597
02:20:29,680 --> 02:20:31,840
written are actually calling them and

3598
02:20:31,840 --> 02:20:33,760
referring them to them as the virtual

3599
02:20:33,760 --> 02:20:38,000
currency kiosks. So what is crypto

3600
02:20:38,000 --> 02:20:41,280
currency? Really really basic overview.

3601
02:20:41,280 --> 02:20:44,880
Uh digital currency uh it's a digital

3602
02:20:44,880 --> 02:20:48,560
asset that people can buy uh all online

3603
02:20:48,560 --> 02:20:51,840
all in their own ecosystem through the

3604
02:20:51,840 --> 02:20:55,680
blockchain. Uh the Bitcoin ATMs are kind

3605
02:20:55,680 --> 02:20:57,840
of a point of sale

3606
02:20:57,840 --> 02:21:00,640
um kiosks where people can purchase

3607
02:21:00,640 --> 02:21:02,960
different types. There is a whole bunch

3608
02:21:02,960 --> 02:21:04,960
of different types of uh cryptocurrency,

3609
02:21:04,960 --> 02:21:06,399
not just Bitcoin. That's kind of the big

3610
02:21:06,399 --> 02:21:09,040
one that everybody hears. Uh when

3611
02:21:09,040 --> 02:21:12,319
currency is purchased, it enters into a

3612
02:21:12,319 --> 02:21:15,439
wallet. Uh there is an exchange in there

3613
02:21:15,439 --> 02:21:17,040
also when they're moving the

3614
02:21:17,040 --> 02:21:20,720
cryptocurrency between wallets. Um the

3615
02:21:20,720 --> 02:21:21,920
reason I kind of threw the freeze in

3616
02:21:21,920 --> 02:21:23,359
there for the preservation orders for

3617
02:21:23,359 --> 02:21:26,399
us, that's the best place that we can

3618
02:21:26,399 --> 02:21:29,200
catch that. If it hits the exchange and

3619
02:21:29,200 --> 02:21:31,040
it's still there, that is where we can

3620
02:21:31,040 --> 02:21:33,359
get preservation orders and get holds on

3621
02:21:33,359 --> 02:21:35,840
some of those things. Um, if it's gone

3622
02:21:35,840 --> 02:21:38,560
into a wallet, it's almost impossible

3623
02:21:38,560 --> 02:21:41,280
for us to get. So, anytime we have a

3624
02:21:41,280 --> 02:21:43,920
fraud, and not just with ATMs, but

3625
02:21:43,920 --> 02:21:45,840
that's what we're focused on. Any crypto

3626
02:21:45,840 --> 02:21:48,160
frauds, if we don't get on them

3627
02:21:48,160 --> 02:21:50,640
extremely quickly, tracing them and

3628
02:21:50,640 --> 02:21:52,160
being able to put freezes on any money

3629
02:21:52,160 --> 02:21:54,720
is extremely difficult. So that's

3630
02:21:54,720 --> 02:21:58,240
another reason why we're looking at this

3631
02:21:58,240 --> 02:22:00,319
uh the kiosks.

3632
02:22:00,319 --> 02:22:02,399
Uh virtual currency kiosks are again

3633
02:22:02,399 --> 02:22:05,280
they act kind of like an ATM. Um it's

3634
02:22:05,280 --> 02:22:07,760
more of a you put money in and you get

3635
02:22:07,760 --> 02:22:09,600
your digital currency in your digital

3636
02:22:09,600 --> 02:22:11,680
wallet. You don't get the money out of

3637
02:22:11,680 --> 02:22:14,399
it physically. Um

3638
02:22:14,399 --> 02:22:16,720
down at the bottom there uh the crypto

3639
02:22:16,720 --> 02:22:18,399
counter service. There is an option

3640
02:22:18,399 --> 02:22:20,240
where you don't have to use the ATM.

3641
02:22:20,240 --> 02:22:23,680
Some um gas stations and other places

3642
02:22:23,680 --> 02:22:25,040
have point of sale setup where you can

3643
02:22:25,040 --> 02:22:27,439
actually buy it right at the counter.

3644
02:22:27,439 --> 02:22:29,600
So, we're kind of looking at the kiosks

3645
02:22:29,600 --> 02:22:31,040
more than anything. Currently, right

3646
02:22:31,040 --> 02:22:34,160
now, Centerville has two. One is

3647
02:22:34,160 --> 02:22:36,800
currently out of service because the uh

3648
02:22:36,800 --> 02:22:39,760
Bitcoin depot has gone under.

3649
02:22:39,760 --> 02:22:42,160
So, we have that one that is still there

3650
02:22:42,160 --> 02:22:45,359
and the second one is at the top stop uh

3651
02:22:45,359 --> 02:22:49,200
right on the frontage road. uh we had

3652
02:22:49,200 --> 02:22:51,439
starting to see a lot of the uh crimes

3653
02:22:51,439 --> 02:22:53,040
and the different frauds that we were

3654
02:22:53,040 --> 02:22:55,920
seeing. We put up warnings attached to

3655
02:22:55,920 --> 02:22:57,120
each of those. You can actually see them

3656
02:22:57,120 --> 02:23:00,880
still taped to those. Uh trying to get

3657
02:23:00,880 --> 02:23:03,280
anybody coming in here, take a second,

3658
02:23:03,280 --> 02:23:04,640
read it first before you start putting

3659
02:23:04,640 --> 02:23:06,800
your money in it because odds are if

3660
02:23:06,800 --> 02:23:08,240
you're on the phone with somebody,

3661
02:23:08,240 --> 02:23:09,359
there's a lot of urgency. They're

3662
02:23:09,359 --> 02:23:11,359
telling you to do this. It's a fraud.

3663
02:23:11,359 --> 02:23:15,200
So, we tried our best uh since 2024

3664
02:23:15,200 --> 02:23:18,319
with those on those ATMs.

3665
02:23:18,319 --> 02:23:21,200
Um these are just a list of some of the

3666
02:23:21,200 --> 02:23:24,319
frauds that we have seen specifically

3667
02:23:24,319 --> 02:23:28,399
connected to the kiosks. The big ones

3668
02:23:28,399 --> 02:23:31,680
were the jury duties, warrants. Get

3669
02:23:31,680 --> 02:23:33,439
phone call from somebody saying, "Hey,

3670
02:23:33,439 --> 02:23:36,080
I'm Sergeant so and so from Davis

3671
02:23:36,080 --> 02:23:37,359
County. You have a warrant for your

3672
02:23:37,359 --> 02:23:39,520
arrest. You need to go pay the fine

3673
02:23:39,520 --> 02:23:42,399
through Bitcoin. That's a big one. Um,

3674
02:23:42,399 --> 02:23:44,960
romance scam is also a big one. Hey, I

3675
02:23:44,960 --> 02:23:46,720
love you, but I'm in the Czech Republic.

3676
02:23:46,720 --> 02:23:48,880
Will you send me Bitcoin? Sure. And

3677
02:23:48,880 --> 02:23:51,280
people fall for it and they do it. Um,

3678
02:23:51,280 --> 02:23:54,319
tech help, Sextorion. Uh, we've had a

3679
02:23:54,319 --> 02:23:56,319
lot of these, but these are just some of

3680
02:23:56,319 --> 02:23:58,000
the ones that we know for sure that have

3681
02:23:58,000 --> 02:23:59,600
affected

3682
02:23:59,600 --> 02:24:02,880
citizens of Centerville at the kiosk

3683
02:24:02,880 --> 02:24:04,800
specifically. [snorts]

3684
02:24:04,800 --> 02:24:09,359
Um, fraud is going up. Um we started

3685
02:24:09,359 --> 02:24:11,760
tracking these 2021

3686
02:24:11,760 --> 02:24:15,680
from 2024 just to 2025 massive increase

3687
02:24:15,680 --> 02:24:18,960
and this is uh coming from the FDC the

3688
02:24:18,960 --> 02:24:21,439
FBI the IC3

3689
02:24:21,439 --> 02:24:22,720
uh documents I believe that are in the

3690
02:24:22,720 --> 02:24:25,200
packet has a lot of these same numbers

3691
02:24:25,200 --> 02:24:29,600
showing that uh they've gone 13,000 134

3692
02:24:29,600 --> 02:24:33,760
thou 13,400 complaints just in 2025

3693
02:24:33,760 --> 02:24:37,040
contributed just to these ATMs.

3694
02:24:37,040 --> 02:24:41,200
um 58% increase just over one year. So

3695
02:24:41,200 --> 02:24:44,399
these are continuing to go up. Big one

3696
02:24:44,399 --> 02:24:47,439
for us and our numbers kind of coincide

3697
02:24:47,439 --> 02:24:49,359
with the national trends of who is being

3698
02:24:49,359 --> 02:24:53,680
affected most by these. Um older adults

3699
02:24:53,680 --> 02:24:56,160
are taking the brunt of this. A lot of

3700
02:24:56,160 --> 02:24:58,880
that is because the the naive to what

3701
02:24:58,880 --> 02:25:00,880
crypto is, how they use it, why they use

3702
02:25:00,880 --> 02:25:03,920
it. They're kind of the target that a

3703
02:25:03,920 --> 02:25:08,160
lot of these guys go after. Um 68% were

3704
02:25:08,160 --> 02:25:11,280
people of over 50 of ours. I believe of

3705
02:25:11,280 --> 02:25:12,880
the ones that here in just a minute when

3706
02:25:12,880 --> 02:25:15,120
I get to the list of all of our cases,

3707
02:25:15,120 --> 02:25:17,200
uh only one of them was under 40 years

3708
02:25:17,200 --> 02:25:19,760
old. Everybody else is over 40. Most of

3709
02:25:19,760 --> 02:25:22,640
them are well over 50, 60. I think our

3710
02:25:22,640 --> 02:25:26,560
oldest was 85, I believe.

3711
02:25:26,560 --> 02:25:29,200
Um these are our specific cases that we

3712
02:25:29,200 --> 02:25:32,800
have. um shows our our total loss there

3713
02:25:32,800 --> 02:25:35,600
of you know almost $95,000

3714
02:25:35,600 --> 02:25:37,520
I personally think and I have a very

3715
02:25:37,520 --> 02:25:40,080
strong feeling that that's low. We have

3716
02:25:40,080 --> 02:25:41,680
a lot of these frauds that are also tied

3717
02:25:41,680 --> 02:25:44,800
into other types of frauds. So they went

3718
02:25:44,800 --> 02:25:47,439
under different classifications but

3719
02:25:47,439 --> 02:25:50,160
specifically ours that I could uh pull

3720
02:25:50,160 --> 02:25:52,640
out just from crypto ATMs and nothing

3721
02:25:52,640 --> 02:25:56,240
else was at least the 949.

3722
02:25:56,240 --> 02:25:58,399
Uh we've only been able to stop a small

3723
02:25:58,399 --> 02:26:01,680
handful of these in process. The three

3724
02:26:01,680 --> 02:26:03,280
case numbers we have up there were ones

3725
02:26:03,280 --> 02:26:05,280
that we actually had victims that were

3726
02:26:05,280 --> 02:26:06,960
willing to talk to us. We've had several

3727
02:26:06,960 --> 02:26:09,040
We've had people walk in here and say,

3728
02:26:09,040 --> 02:26:11,120
"Hey, this is what's going on. This what

3729
02:26:11,120 --> 02:26:13,200
I had." And say, "Okay, it's a fraud."

3730
02:26:13,200 --> 02:26:14,560
And they say, "I don't want to do

3731
02:26:14,560 --> 02:26:16,160
anything. Wouldn't leave names, no

3732
02:26:16,160 --> 02:26:17,680
amounts, nothing." So, we don't even

3733
02:26:17,680 --> 02:26:20,240
have documentation of some of those.

3734
02:26:20,240 --> 02:26:21,600
>> Um the one gentleman,

3735
02:26:21,600 --> 02:26:23,040
>> you stopped him before they used the

3736
02:26:23,040 --> 02:26:23,359
key.

3737
02:26:23,359 --> 02:26:24,000
>> Correct.

3738
02:26:24,000 --> 02:26:26,479
The two there, the 14,000 each

3739
02:26:26,479 --> 02:26:28,240
on the right side.

3740
02:26:28,240 --> 02:26:32,399
>> Those two were from the teller at the

3741
02:26:32,399 --> 02:26:34,160
gas station calling us saying, "We've

3742
02:26:34,160 --> 02:26:36,080
got a guy here. He won't listen to us.

3743
02:26:36,080 --> 02:26:38,080
We come talk to him." So, we walk in,

3744
02:26:38,080 --> 02:26:40,000
finally get him to convince. Hang up the

3745
02:26:40,000 --> 02:26:42,640
phone. It's not your grandson. Please

3746
02:26:42,640 --> 02:26:44,479
hang up the phone. Talk to us. And we

3747
02:26:44,479 --> 02:26:46,880
were able to stop those two, but that's

3748
02:26:46,880 --> 02:26:50,560
rare. [clears throat] So, yep. Um, yeah,

3749
02:26:50,560 --> 02:26:52,880
we did have one gentleman that uh, you

3750
02:26:52,880 --> 02:26:55,040
know, the $6,700 loss doesn't seem like

3751
02:26:55,040 --> 02:26:58,800
a lot, but to him that was a he's a 71y

3752
02:26:58,800 --> 02:27:02,080
old gentleman. Um, that impacted him

3753
02:27:02,080 --> 02:27:04,560
with his family, drove to one of our

3754
02:27:04,560 --> 02:27:06,800
churches and decided to take his own

3755
02:27:06,800 --> 02:27:08,880
life. So,

3756
02:27:08,880 --> 02:27:10,880
not just money loss that we're looking

3757
02:27:10,880 --> 02:27:11,680
at. Um,

3758
02:27:11,680 --> 02:27:13,359
>> can I ask you to clarify with regard to

3759
02:27:13,359 --> 02:27:15,920
that last slide? Sure. almost $100,000

3760
02:27:15,920 --> 02:27:18,880
lost just between those two

3761
02:27:18,880 --> 02:27:22,640
>> crypto kiosks that are existing now. One

3762
02:27:22,640 --> 02:27:23,840
of them is out of order and I don't know

3763
02:27:23,840 --> 02:27:25,359
how long it's been out of order, but

3764
02:27:25,359 --> 02:27:27,280
that's just from two kiosks.

3765
02:27:27,280 --> 02:27:30,000
>> Yes, that is correct. Yep.

3766
02:27:30,000 --> 02:27:33,120
Um this is not just a Centerville issue.

3767
02:27:33,120 --> 02:27:37,120
Davis County uh also across the board

3768
02:27:37,120 --> 02:27:40,479
just from 21 to 25 162 plus cases and

3769
02:27:40,479 --> 02:27:42,720
that's only increased since these last

3770
02:27:42,720 --> 02:27:45,920
stats were pulled in 25. Uh Leighton

3771
02:27:45,920 --> 02:27:49,439
City alone had 74 with a cost of 1.8

3772
02:27:49,439 --> 02:27:52,000
million. Uh they were the first to

3773
02:27:52,000 --> 02:27:54,800
actually take the stance of trying to

3774
02:27:54,800 --> 02:27:56,800
ban these and were successful and they

3775
02:27:56,800 --> 02:27:59,359
passed their own

3776
02:27:59,359 --> 02:28:02,240
u ordinances to get theirs banned. Since

3777
02:28:02,240 --> 02:28:05,359
then, Provo, Brigham City, Heber, and I

3778
02:28:05,359 --> 02:28:08,000
believe Tremont as well has jumped on

3779
02:28:08,000 --> 02:28:09,760
board and they're also looking the same

3780
02:28:09,760 --> 02:28:13,200
route, passing the same type of um

3781
02:28:13,200 --> 02:28:16,319
things to go forward. So, that's kind of

3782
02:28:16,319 --> 02:28:18,080
where that part of that presentation

3783
02:28:18,080 --> 02:28:20,160
ends. So, if you're if you have any

3784
02:28:20,160 --> 02:28:21,760
other questions on there, I can go back

3785
02:28:21,760 --> 02:28:23,040
through them. I know I blew through that

3786
02:28:23,040 --> 02:28:24,800
really quick, but I know it's in your

3787
02:28:24,800 --> 02:28:26,800
packet, too.

3788
02:28:26,800 --> 02:28:30,080
>> Excellent and helpful presentation. Uh,

3789
02:28:30,080 --> 02:28:31,760
can I just ask you? Sure.

3790
02:28:31,760 --> 02:28:33,680
>> I I believe you were here when we had a

3791
02:28:33,680 --> 02:28:37,280
public commenter about this. Mr.

3792
02:28:37,280 --> 02:28:39,040
>> Trent Larson.

3793
02:28:39,040 --> 02:28:39,600
>> Yes.

3794
02:28:39,600 --> 02:28:44,080
>> Do you have any uh comment feedback from

3795
02:28:44,080 --> 02:28:45,760
things he presented? Would you like to

3796
02:28:45,760 --> 02:28:48,000
>> He absolutely hit the nail on the head.

3797
02:28:48,000 --> 02:28:51,680
This there are legit uses for these. I

3798
02:28:51,680 --> 02:28:54,080
there's I think even in my slide, I'm

3799
02:28:54,080 --> 02:28:56,080
not saying there isn't. I that's not our

3800
02:28:56,080 --> 02:28:59,760
stance whatsoever. Um, however, from our

3801
02:28:59,760 --> 02:29:01,600
stance, just me as the one that has to

3802
02:29:01,600 --> 02:29:03,920
investigate a lot of these, I see a

3803
02:29:03,920 --> 02:29:06,479
massive disproportionate from legitimate

3804
02:29:06,479 --> 02:29:08,560
use to things that are affecting our

3805
02:29:08,560 --> 02:29:10,319
citizens.

3806
02:29:10,319 --> 02:29:12,560
But yeah, I 100% agree with all the

3807
02:29:12,560 --> 02:29:13,200
stuff he's talking.

3808
02:29:13,200 --> 02:29:14,800
>> I pictured when he's talking, I'm

3809
02:29:14,800 --> 02:29:18,720
sitting there thinking, okay, uh, I've

3810
02:29:18,720 --> 02:29:20,240
been

3811
02:29:20,240 --> 02:29:22,160
when I'm out of the country or when I'm

3812
02:29:22,160 --> 02:29:24,479
in ATM that's not my bank, I go to them.

3813
02:29:24,479 --> 02:29:26,080
They charge you exorbitant fees

3814
02:29:26,080 --> 02:29:27,520
sometimes. Yes.

3815
02:29:27,520 --> 02:29:30,319
>> Uh at least you're getting cash so

3816
02:29:30,319 --> 02:29:31,680
you're not transferred to somebody

3817
02:29:31,680 --> 02:29:34,880
else's wallet. But he's obviously one

3818
02:29:34,880 --> 02:29:37,680
that started using virtual currency. I

3819
02:29:37,680 --> 02:29:39,120
don't want to speak for him, but he's

3820
02:29:39,120 --> 02:29:41,040
afraid that the dollar system's not

3821
02:29:41,040 --> 02:29:42,880
going to hold up or what it is, but some

3822
02:29:42,880 --> 02:29:45,120
people are that way. So they use virtual

3823
02:29:45,120 --> 02:29:46,720
currency. He said he paid ver with

3824
02:29:46,720 --> 02:29:49,120
virtual currency his rotary dues. And so

3825
02:29:49,120 --> 02:29:51,680
he stopped by to put money in cuz he

3826
02:29:51,680 --> 02:29:53,760
needed to pay a bill with virtual

3827
02:29:53,760 --> 02:29:57,040
currency. That's what he does. And so

3828
02:29:57,040 --> 02:29:58,000
Councilman [clears throat] Banger asked

3829
02:29:58,000 --> 02:29:59,520
a great question. That got me thinking

3830
02:29:59,520 --> 02:30:01,920
as well, too. That's the form of

3831
02:30:01,920 --> 02:30:03,359
currency that he's using.

3832
02:30:03,359 --> 02:30:03,680
>> Sure.

3833
02:30:03,680 --> 02:30:04,880
>> You know,

3834
02:30:04,880 --> 02:30:05,439
>> so

3835
02:30:05,439 --> 02:30:07,200
>> yeah, it's not going away. That's for

3836
02:30:07,200 --> 02:30:08,960
sure. It's we're seeing more and more

3837
02:30:08,960 --> 02:30:10,080
use of it across the

3838
02:30:10,080 --> 02:30:12,080
>> But it's a lot easier to commit fraud

3839
02:30:12,080 --> 02:30:14,880
with that be uh because you transfer

3840
02:30:14,880 --> 02:30:16,399
somebody's wallet and then it's gone,

3841
02:30:16,399 --> 02:30:18,160
you know.

3842
02:30:18,160 --> 02:30:18,880
I

3843
02:30:18,880 --> 02:30:20,880
>> versus somebody talking into, hey, your

3844
02:30:20,880 --> 02:30:23,920
we have your grandkid son kidnapped and

3845
02:30:23,920 --> 02:30:25,439
transfer this money to this bank

3846
02:30:25,439 --> 02:30:27,040
account, right?

3847
02:30:27,040 --> 02:30:28,880
>> Oh, yes. Correct. Of all of our cases,

3848
02:30:28,880 --> 02:30:30,319
like I said, we have not been able to

3849
02:30:30,319 --> 02:30:33,840
seize any of of all of our losses, we

3850
02:30:33,840 --> 02:30:35,200
have not been able to catch them fast

3851
02:30:35,200 --> 02:30:37,920
enough. trying to get the trace done

3852
02:30:37,920 --> 02:30:39,840
fast enough

3853
02:30:39,840 --> 02:30:41,600
by the time we get the trace back where

3854
02:30:41,600 --> 02:30:43,840
we can figure out which exchange it hit,

3855
02:30:43,840 --> 02:30:46,240
it's gone out of that exchange to four

3856
02:30:46,240 --> 02:30:48,399
or five or 20 different wallets and then

3857
02:30:48,399 --> 02:30:50,560
onto another exchange more wallets. Like

3858
02:30:50,560 --> 02:30:52,160
it's

3859
02:30:52,160 --> 02:30:53,920
we have not been able to seize any of

3860
02:30:53,920 --> 02:30:55,439
them. We've been lucky and we've been

3861
02:30:55,439 --> 02:30:57,359
able to catch the handful that we've

3862
02:30:57,359 --> 02:30:59,040
been able to stop them in the process.

3863
02:30:59,040 --> 02:31:02,160
But trying to actually get them back is

3864
02:31:02,160 --> 02:31:03,680
that's the next step that we're hoping

3865
02:31:03,680 --> 02:31:06,160
to start being able to snag some of that

3866
02:31:06,160 --> 02:31:08,160
when we can get on them. But if we don't

3867
02:31:08,160 --> 02:31:11,840
get the report immediately,

3868
02:31:11,840 --> 02:31:14,319
us trying to get we're we're way behind

3869
02:31:14,319 --> 02:31:15,840
trying to catch up. So

3870
02:31:15,840 --> 02:31:18,399
>> So the state took a stance because you

3871
02:31:18,399 --> 02:31:20,479
on the last uh slide here that you

3872
02:31:20,479 --> 02:31:22,880
didn't go over, we have HB72. They put

3873
02:31:22,880 --> 02:31:28,880
transition transaction limits. So they must feel okay about them, but

3874
02:31:28,880 --> 02:31:30,560
they're not doing anything firmer.

3875
02:31:30,560 --> 02:31:32,399
>> Yeah, I think the state took a

3876
02:31:32,399 --> 02:31:34,880
realization that they are an issue, so

3877
02:31:34,880 --> 02:31:36,319
had to come in with some sort of a

3878
02:31:36,319 --> 02:31:39,760
legislation to put down on it. Um, a lot

3879
02:31:39,760 --> 02:31:41,920
of that it has the same restrictions

3880
02:31:41,920 --> 02:31:44,319
that we were trying has warnings put on

3881
02:31:44,319 --> 02:31:48,319
them. We tried that from 2024 and we

3882
02:31:48,319 --> 02:31:51,760
didn't see a change. Um the one thing

3883
02:31:51,760 --> 02:31:54,319
that we we also have some more with that

3884
02:31:54,319 --> 02:31:56,640
same hospital that went through we have

3885
02:31:56,640 --> 02:31:58,399
restrictions on us things that we need

3886
02:31:58,399 --> 02:32:01,600
to also report back to the state. Every

3887
02:32:01,600 --> 02:32:03,200
crypto case that we're doing quarterly

3888
02:32:03,200 --> 02:32:06,080
we report back to them. I think it is a

3889
02:32:06,080 --> 02:32:08,000
trying to dig for more information to

3890
02:32:08,000 --> 02:32:11,040
get more details to see if there is more

3891
02:32:11,040 --> 02:32:12,880
legislation they need to do. I don't I'm

3892
02:32:12,880 --> 02:32:14,240
not trying to think for them but that's

3893
02:32:14,240 --> 02:32:16,000
where my head was of why those

3894
02:32:16,000 --> 02:32:19,120
restrictions were. So we had the cap in

3895
02:32:19,120 --> 02:32:19,920
the state law,

3896
02:32:19,920 --> 02:32:21,200
>> correct?

3897
02:32:21,200 --> 02:32:24,160
>> Is that a cap on a machine or is that a

3898
02:32:24,160 --> 02:32:26,960
cap on the transfer for a daily

3899
02:32:26,960 --> 02:32:31,200
transfer? You can't go from machine to machine to machine and do

3900
02:32:31,200 --> 02:32:34,000
2,000 in every machine or is and how do

3901
02:32:34,000 --> 02:32:37,280
they track that for 2,000 if it is for

3902
02:32:37,280 --> 02:32:38,160
the day?

3903
02:32:38,160 --> 02:32:39,359
>> That's the a lot of the same questions

3904
02:32:39,359 --> 02:32:42,000
we have too of how are you tracking that

3905
02:32:42,000 --> 02:32:43,520
because yeah, you put the restrictions

3906
02:32:43,520 --> 02:32:45,760
on there. say you can only go pull 2,000

3907
02:32:45,760 --> 02:32:47,920
out today, 2,000 out tomorrow. My

3908
02:32:47,920 --> 02:32:50,080
understanding is per machine.

3909
02:32:50,080 --> 02:32:52,000
>> So they could bounce around. I could be

3910
02:32:52,000 --> 02:32:53,680
wrong, but that is my understanding of

3911
02:32:53,680 --> 02:32:55,680
they could bounce around, send them from

3912
02:32:55,680 --> 02:32:59,120
here to West Battle to Syracuse to

3913
02:32:59,120 --> 02:33:02,160
wherever bouncing around, but it's 2,000

3914
02:33:02,160 --> 02:33:05,200
per person per day and then the next day

3915
02:33:05,200 --> 02:33:06,880
2,000, the next day 2,000, then after

3916
02:33:06,880 --> 02:33:09,680
that it bumps to five. So that's the

3917
02:33:09,680 --> 02:33:10,880
current ones that they've put in place

3918
02:33:10,880 --> 02:33:14,240
so far. How long has that been in place?

3919
02:33:14,240 --> 02:33:15,520
>> When was that? Past

3920
02:33:15,520 --> 02:33:17,840
>> May. So, fairly recent. I was going to

3921
02:33:17,840 --> 02:33:19,520
say obviously there's not a report on

3922
02:33:19,520 --> 02:33:22,319
here that is less than 2000. So, these

3923
02:33:22,319 --> 02:33:23,760
are all

3924
02:33:23,760 --> 02:33:25,439
>> a prior to that or B they're not

3925
02:33:25,439 --> 02:33:26,319
following that.

3926
02:33:26,319 --> 02:33:28,000
>> There's only there's I think we only had

3927
02:33:28,000 --> 02:33:30,160
one that was under $1,000 like

3928
02:33:30,160 --> 02:33:32,880
>> Yeah.

3929
02:33:32,880 --> 02:33:33,280
>> thousand.

3930
02:33:33,280 --> 02:33:35,680
>> Yeah. So there's other ways besides

3931
02:33:35,680 --> 02:33:38,240
kiosk to transfer you could transfer

3932
02:33:38,240 --> 02:33:41,200
money uh to to to your wallet or

3933
02:33:41,200 --> 02:33:43,120
somebody else wallet do at the computer.

3934
02:33:43,120 --> 02:33:43,600
>> Absolutely.

3935
02:33:43,600 --> 02:33:46,160
>> Uh sitting in your home. Uh

3936
02:33:46,160 --> 02:33:48,000
>> are those easier to track than through

3937
02:33:48,000 --> 02:33:48,880
the kiosk?

3938
02:33:48,880 --> 02:33:50,479
>> No.

3939
02:33:50,479 --> 02:33:51,760
>> So we could have

3940
02:33:51,760 --> 02:33:53,200
>> unless I have the keys to your wallet.

3941
02:33:53,200 --> 02:33:54,720
No.

3942
02:33:54,720 --> 02:33:56,720
>> We could we could have somebody being

3943
02:33:56,720 --> 02:34:00,640
defrauded and have cases that coming out

3944
02:34:00,640 --> 02:34:02,560
our ears on something like that.

3945
02:34:02,560 --> 02:34:04,160
>> And they do. I mean, like I said, this

3946
02:34:04,160 --> 02:34:07,200
is very focused just on these crypto

3947
02:34:07,200 --> 02:34:08,240
ATMs.

3948
02:34:08,240 --> 02:34:10,640
>> I have Yes. a lot of other cases that

3949
02:34:10,640 --> 02:34:12,960
are involving other types of crypto

3950
02:34:12,960 --> 02:34:15,200
fraud, not crypto ATMs. This is very

3951
02:34:15,200 --> 02:34:16,720
specific to this.

3952
02:34:16,720 --> 02:34:18,240
>> Yes.

3953
02:34:18,240 --> 02:34:20,000
>> With Go ahead.

3954
02:34:20,000 --> 02:34:21,920
>> Go ahead. With regard to the warnings,

3955
02:34:21,920 --> 02:34:23,520
you had a picture of the warning that

3956
02:34:23,520 --> 02:34:25,920
looks like we as Centerbell Police put

3957
02:34:25,920 --> 02:34:28,000
on the ATM and it sounds like we were

3958
02:34:28,000 --> 02:34:30,000
proactive in getting out ahead of

3959
02:34:30,000 --> 02:34:32,000
putting warnings on machines before the

3960
02:34:32,000 --> 02:34:34,080
state mandated these disclosures listed

3961
02:34:34,080 --> 02:34:38,240
in HB72. Yes. With regard to people who

3962
02:34:38,240 --> 02:34:40,479
were defrauded, do we know at the time

3963
02:34:40,479 --> 02:34:42,960
that they put their money into it that

3964
02:34:42,960 --> 02:34:44,880
the sign was still up like our little

3965
02:34:44,880 --> 02:34:47,040
our voluntary sign or is it possible

3966
02:34:47,040 --> 02:34:48,800
that at the time that they put their

3967
02:34:48,800 --> 02:34:50,560
money in our sign had been removed by

3968
02:34:50,560 --> 02:34:52,479
the owner or by somebody else? Right.

3969
02:34:52,479 --> 02:34:54,080
Because it's not statemandated. It's

3970
02:34:54,080 --> 02:34:55,920
just something we had voluntarily done.

3971
02:34:55,920 --> 02:34:58,720
>> Yes. Um I can get I don't have the exact

3972
02:34:58,720 --> 02:35:01,120
numbers but I know for a fact there were

3973
02:35:01,120 --> 02:35:03,600
multiple times at least with one of the

3974
02:35:03,600 --> 02:35:07,120
um kiosks where the owners the actual

3975
02:35:07,120 --> 02:35:08,720
owner of the kiosk not the business

3976
02:35:08,720 --> 02:35:10,880
owner that houses it the owner of the

3977
02:35:10,880 --> 02:35:14,000
kiosk removed our warnings. One of those

3978
02:35:14,000 --> 02:35:15,359
was the gentleman that committed

3979
02:35:15,359 --> 02:35:17,600
suicide. It had been taken down two

3980
02:35:17,600 --> 02:35:20,240
weeks prior.

3981
02:35:20,240 --> 02:35:22,399
>> Do we know do we know as to the others?

3982
02:35:22,399 --> 02:35:25,120
I guess my question for you is is our

3983
02:35:25,120 --> 02:35:27,200
warning working when it's up and people

3984
02:35:27,200 --> 02:35:29,439
are being defrauded when the sign gets

3985
02:35:29,439 --> 02:35:30,880
taken down because now of course the

3986
02:35:30,880 --> 02:35:33,359
state mandates that these warnings are

3987
02:35:33,359 --> 02:35:34,880
up there and so I'm trying to get a

3988
02:35:34,880 --> 02:35:37,280
census to if we know if do we have

3989
02:35:37,280 --> 02:35:39,359
evidence either way. I would have to go

3990
02:35:39,359 --> 02:35:41,200
back and look through the some of the

3991
02:35:41,200 --> 02:35:42,880
reports to get the full number of those,

3992
02:35:42,880 --> 02:35:45,680
but I know and I could speak with pretty

3993
02:35:45,680 --> 02:35:48,080
good confidence that there were several

3994
02:35:48,080 --> 02:35:50,080
where they were sitting right there when

3995
02:35:50,080 --> 02:35:51,520
the officers went in there to get the

3996
02:35:51,520 --> 02:35:53,680
receipt from them that was right there.

3997
02:35:53,680 --> 02:35:55,439
>> Shayen, we've actually had police

3998
02:35:55,439 --> 02:35:58,160
officers on site not be able to stop the

3999
02:35:58,160 --> 02:36:00,319
people from doing it. Sitting right here

4000
02:36:00,319 --> 02:36:03,200
saying, "Shayen, this is a scam. Don't

4001
02:36:03,200 --> 02:36:05,359
put your money in." And them going, "I

4002
02:36:05,359 --> 02:36:10,950
have to.

4003
02:36:10,960 --> 02:36:14,800
And can I ask you, do do would somebody

4004
02:36:14,800 --> 02:36:19,520
in Centerville have an option close by

4005
02:36:19,520 --> 02:36:21,680
from neighboring cities? Do do we know

4006
02:36:21,680 --> 02:36:24,319
do neighboring cities have some of these

4007
02:36:24,319 --> 02:36:27,040
close by? And and to what quantity do

4008
02:36:27,040 --> 02:36:28,880
some of our neighbors allow some of

4009
02:36:28,880 --> 02:36:30,479
these or [sighs]

4010
02:36:30,479 --> 02:36:32,319
>> I can't give you the full numbers. I

4011
02:36:32,319 --> 02:36:33,840
there is a website you can pull up and

4012
02:36:33,840 --> 02:36:35,280
it'll show you exactly where every one

4013
02:36:35,280 --> 02:36:38,000
of them is. Uh that's how a lot of them

4014
02:36:38,000 --> 02:36:39,920
at least the when they perpetrate the

4015
02:36:39,920 --> 02:36:41,120
fraud that's how a lot of them are doing

4016
02:36:41,120 --> 02:36:42,560
it. They'll call them and they'll

4017
02:36:42,560 --> 02:36:44,080
already have go to this address and

4018
02:36:44,080 --> 02:36:45,520
there's an ATM right here and use that

4019
02:36:45,520 --> 02:36:48,720
one. Um yeah we have several of them in

4020
02:36:48,720 --> 02:36:51,439
surrounding agencies um different cities

4021
02:36:51,439 --> 02:36:54,240
around us. Um I think in the one of the

4022
02:36:54,240 --> 02:36:55,680
slides I had several of the cities that

4023
02:36:55,680 --> 02:36:57,600
were listed on there that pulled all of

4024
02:36:57,600 --> 02:37:00,640
their stats. Um I can find it for you

4025
02:37:00,640 --> 02:37:02,319
right now. Yes, there are several around

4026
02:37:02,319 --> 02:37:04,880
us that are still operational. And

4027
02:37:04,880 --> 02:37:08,080
that's with Leighton's

4028
02:37:08,080 --> 02:37:10,880
with their decision to do what they did.

4029
02:37:10,880 --> 02:37:12,800
That's been a discussion that we've had

4030
02:37:12,800 --> 02:37:15,359
as investigators of are we going to now

4031
02:37:15,359 --> 02:37:16,800
start seeing these popping up in our

4032
02:37:16,800 --> 02:37:18,399
cities that are being moved out of

4033
02:37:18,399 --> 02:37:20,880
Leighton to come to us.

4034
02:37:20,880 --> 02:37:22,640
>> So, that's that's something that we've

4035
02:37:22,640 --> 02:37:24,000
been asking all of our surrounding

4036
02:37:24,000 --> 02:37:25,840
agencies. We meet once a week and talk

4037
02:37:25,840 --> 02:37:27,439
to other investigators and say, "Go

4038
02:37:27,439 --> 02:37:28,800
check your stores and if they're popping

4039
02:37:28,800 --> 02:37:30,800
up, let us know because some of our

4040
02:37:30,800 --> 02:37:32,000
victims are probably going to end up in

4041
02:37:32,000 --> 02:37:34,160
your city, too." But I don't have the

4042
02:37:34,160 --> 02:37:36,399
exact numbers, but yes, there are quite

4043
02:37:36,399 --> 02:37:40,319
a few around us. And coupled on that, I

4044
02:37:40,319 --> 02:37:42,319
this may be just rhetorical in the sense

4045
02:37:42,319 --> 02:37:45,040
that you may not know, but I would be

4046
02:37:45,040 --> 02:37:48,880
curious as to know how many

4047
02:37:48,880 --> 02:37:52,240
users go to the ATM, the crypto ATM

4048
02:37:52,240 --> 02:37:55,520
every day. Is what is this the demand to

4049
02:37:55,520 --> 02:37:58,880
that? I can see that cutting down the

4050
02:37:58,880 --> 02:38:01,920
supply in one city would push the demand

4051
02:38:01,920 --> 02:38:04,319
someplace else, but what is that demand?

4052
02:38:04,319 --> 02:38:05,520
Is it

4053
02:38:05,520 --> 02:38:07,600
>> uh I haven't been able to pull the full

4054
02:38:07,600 --> 02:38:10,240
numbers of every single transactions

4055
02:38:10,240 --> 02:38:12,720
gone through our two ATMs. So that's a

4056
02:38:12,720 --> 02:38:15,520
question I don't have a 100% answer for.

4057
02:38:15,520 --> 02:38:19,040
Um I will I think the only thing I can

4058
02:38:19,040 --> 02:38:20,960
show is our numbers of the times we do

4059
02:38:20,960 --> 02:38:22,960
get called. But that's again I think

4060
02:38:22,960 --> 02:38:24,880
it's way under represented from what's

4061
02:38:24,880 --> 02:38:27,040
actually going on. But I don't have the

4062
02:38:27,040 --> 02:38:28,960
full numbers in front of me. I don't

4063
02:38:28,960 --> 02:38:31,120
>> I mean you had like 10 incidents there.

4064
02:38:31,120 --> 02:38:33,600
if you had 20 uses, you know, that's

4065
02:38:33,600 --> 02:38:37,439
half. But I I think if we had the full

4066
02:38:37,439 --> 02:38:39,439
scope of how many people were using

4067
02:38:39,439 --> 02:38:41,600
this, I I wonder if it's not just a very

4068
02:38:41,600 --> 02:38:44,240
small percentage, albeit that we may not

4069
02:38:44,240 --> 02:38:46,479
be getting all of the the reports.

4070
02:38:46,479 --> 02:38:50,800
>> I Yeah, it very well could be. Sure.

4071
02:38:50,800 --> 02:38:54,000
>> Yeah. I think this um

4072
02:38:54,000 --> 02:38:55,920
yeah the the numbers I've seen is

4073
02:38:55,920 --> 02:38:58,560
anywhere between 90 here in Utah like

4074
02:38:58,560 --> 02:39:01,359
90% of the transactions are are based on

4075
02:39:01,359 --> 02:39:02,800
frauds

4076
02:39:02,800 --> 02:39:08,950
>> and Iowa did a study and theirs was 98%.

4077
02:39:08,960 --> 02:39:12,560
» So I'm still curious about this uh this

4078
02:39:12,560 --> 02:39:15,280
model that 71 does. Is that something

4079
02:39:15,280 --> 02:39:16,960
that is

4080
02:39:16,960 --> 02:39:19,760
>> prominent in a lot of symbol? I haven't

4081
02:39:19,760 --> 02:39:21,439
I guess I haven't gone to a 7-Eleven

4082
02:39:21,439 --> 02:39:22,080
recently.

4083
02:39:22,080 --> 02:39:23,600
>> That was that was something that was new

4084
02:39:23,600 --> 02:39:25,280
to me as well cuz I hadn't heard of

4085
02:39:25,280 --> 02:39:27,600
that. One of our officers says, "Hey, I

4086
02:39:27,600 --> 02:39:29,280
think 7-Eleven allows you to do it." So,

4087
02:39:29,280 --> 02:39:30,560
I walked in and talked to the owner

4088
02:39:30,560 --> 02:39:31,840
said, "Hey, is this something you do?"

4089
02:39:31,840 --> 02:39:33,760
And he said, "We're not set up for it,

4090
02:39:33,760 --> 02:39:36,000
>> but there are other 7-Elevens around in

4091
02:39:36,000 --> 02:39:37,920
other cities." Okay. But yes, they will

4092
02:39:37,920 --> 02:39:39,600
absolutely take that right over the

4093
02:39:39,600 --> 02:39:41,359
counter. I I was sitting back doing some

4094
02:39:41,359 --> 02:39:44,000
research uh earlier during the

4095
02:39:44,000 --> 02:39:45,439
>> looked like uh there's a lot of places

4096
02:39:45,439 --> 02:39:47,040
kind of like money gram those kind of

4097
02:39:47,040 --> 02:39:48,880
places that were also that also allow

4098
02:39:48,880 --> 02:39:51,840
you to do it in person. I believe I was

4099
02:39:51,840 --> 02:39:53,520
reading Walmart can do it too but

4100
02:39:53,520 --> 02:39:56,160
they're you know there little check

4101
02:39:56,160 --> 02:39:57,840
cashing area where they do those

4102
02:39:57,840 --> 02:39:59,840
financial transactions.

4103
02:39:59,840 --> 02:40:01,359
>> You can you can do those things in

4104
02:40:01,359 --> 02:40:01,840
person.

4105
02:40:01,840 --> 02:40:04,000
>> Now I wonder if the the state

4106
02:40:04,000 --> 02:40:06,720
legislature wouldn't want to cap those

4107
02:40:06,720 --> 02:40:09,200
as well though. That to me is

4108
02:40:09,200 --> 02:40:11,600
>> yeah, you know, and but the thing is I

4109
02:40:11,600 --> 02:40:13,840
don't think we've taken any cases that

4110
02:40:13,840 --> 02:40:16,000
have originated from one of those

4111
02:40:16,000 --> 02:40:18,960
in-person transaction. It's all based on

4112
02:40:18,960 --> 02:40:22,240
the teller and and and to your point,

4113
02:40:22,240 --> 02:40:23,840
mayor, um when we were talking, you

4114
02:40:23,840 --> 02:40:26,000
know, about Trent Larson's

4115
02:40:26,000 --> 02:40:28,560
concerns and and I fully appreciate that

4116
02:40:28,560 --> 02:40:31,040
and uh Trent and I had a conversation

4117
02:40:31,040 --> 02:40:33,280
before the meeting quite extensively

4118
02:40:33,280 --> 02:40:37,200
about it. Again, I I think the problem I

4119
02:40:37,200 --> 02:40:40,080
have with these machines is they're

4120
02:40:40,080 --> 02:40:43,920
almost solely being used for

4121
02:40:43,920 --> 02:40:47,120
perpetrator fraud and to transfer money

4122
02:40:47,120 --> 02:40:50,000
from a victim to a perpetrator. And

4123
02:40:50,000 --> 02:40:55,439
there are a few select there are some circumstances where you got

4124
02:40:55,439 --> 02:40:57,040
legitimate use, but I think they're

4125
02:40:57,040 --> 02:40:59,439
really kind of far and few between. And

4126
02:40:59,439 --> 02:41:03,520
any um real user of crypto

4127
02:41:03,520 --> 02:41:05,680
probably has better ways to get their

4128
02:41:05,680 --> 02:41:08,640
money into crypto than through an ATM

4129
02:41:08,640 --> 02:41:14,000
that charges the exorbitant fees and but

4130
02:41:14,000 --> 02:41:15,520
we do recognize there are legitimate

4131
02:41:15,520 --> 02:41:17,120
uses and this is a trade-off, right? We

4132
02:41:17,120 --> 02:41:19,200
do realize there there could be c could

4133
02:41:19,200 --> 02:41:20,880
be circumstances where we could be

4134
02:41:20,880 --> 02:41:23,680
limiting some of our residents ability

4135
02:41:23,680 --> 02:41:26,960
to turn cash into crypto

4136
02:41:26,960 --> 02:41:29,200
in exchange for protecting the more

4137
02:41:29,200 --> 02:41:32,960
vulnerable part of our population.

4138
02:41:32,960 --> 02:41:34,640
So it's kind of a trade-off.

4139
02:41:34,640 --> 02:41:36,960
>> Chief, you say that it's mostly being

4140
02:41:36,960 --> 02:41:39,040
these kiosks are mostly being used to

4141
02:41:39,040 --> 02:41:40,479
perpetrate fraud. So I'm going to push

4142
02:41:40,479 --> 02:41:43,040
you a little bit. What evidence are you

4143
02:41:43,040 --> 02:41:46,160
basing that opinion on? uh the

4144
02:41:46,160 --> 02:41:48,160
>> those two legitimate uses.

4145
02:41:48,160 --> 02:41:48,640
>> Sure.

4146
02:41:48,640 --> 02:41:50,240
>> Right.

4147
02:41:50,240 --> 02:41:54,080
Um I know there's studies by the

4148
02:41:54,080 --> 02:41:55,680
and by Iowa.

4149
02:41:55,680 --> 02:41:57,120
>> Yeah. I'm trying to find a couple of

4150
02:41:57,120 --> 02:41:58,560
them that we included.

4151
02:41:58,560 --> 02:42:01,359
>> I think we had some in the stats in the packet.

4152
02:42:01,359 --> 02:42:02,960
>> Yeah, there is some in the packet that

4153
02:42:02,960 --> 02:42:05,200
was I believe that came through that has

4154
02:42:05,200 --> 02:42:13,190
the number

4155
02:42:13,200 --> 02:42:21,030
one

4156
02:42:21,040 --> 02:42:22,720
Chief, is this what you're looking for?

4157
02:42:22,720 --> 02:42:25,600
What's on the screen?

4158
02:42:25,600 --> 02:42:27,760
>> That's one of them. There's one of them

4159
02:42:27,760 --> 02:42:30,240
from Iowa.

4160
02:42:30,240 --> 02:42:32,640
Is that the crypto statistics?

4161
02:42:32,640 --> 02:42:35,120
>> Yes.

4162
02:42:35,120 --> 02:42:37,200
>> That the FBI one.

4163
02:42:37,200 --> 02:42:40,000
>> There's both

4164
02:42:40,000 --> 02:42:41,520
the other one had the 98%.

4165
02:42:41,520 --> 02:42:43,760
>> Yeah. The Iowa said ones that said 98%

4166
02:42:43,760 --> 02:42:44,640
on the right hand side.

4167
02:42:44,640 --> 02:42:49,190
>> Yeah. Go back to the other one.

4168
02:42:49,200 --> 02:42:50,720
» Oh, and there's there's a lot more that

4169
02:42:50,720 --> 02:42:52,160
are it's not just frauds.

4170
02:42:52,160 --> 02:42:54,800
>> Yeah. Right there.

4171
02:42:54,800 --> 02:42:57,200
>> So, in some of that supporting documents

4172
02:42:57,200 --> 02:43:00,319
that you guys have also there's a lot of

4173
02:43:00,319 --> 02:43:02,240
the cases are being used for human

4174
02:43:02,240 --> 02:43:04,560
trafficking for

4175
02:43:04,560 --> 02:43:07,359
um controlled substance sales. People

4176
02:43:07,359 --> 02:43:08,800
don't want to drive around with a large

4177
02:43:08,800 --> 02:43:10,640
amount of cash. So that's an easy stop

4178
02:43:10,640 --> 02:43:13,280
off to buy crypto to get rid of the cash

4179
02:43:13,280 --> 02:43:16,000
very quickly. That's been supported I

4180
02:43:16,000 --> 02:43:17,439
think in the some of the FBI data, the

4181
02:43:17,439 --> 02:43:21,760
IC3 data. So there's yeah, there's quite

4182
02:43:21,760 --> 02:43:31,429
a bit in there.

4183
02:43:31,439 --> 02:43:32,880
» Yeah, I'm looking for that. I read that

4184
02:43:32,880 --> 02:43:35,200
90% stat and I'm trying to find it right

4185
02:43:35,200 --> 02:43:38,800
now. I apologize. Was that the other one

4186
02:43:38,800 --> 02:43:40,640
that she put up, the federal one, or was

4187
02:43:40,640 --> 02:43:42,880
that something else?

4188
02:43:42,880 --> 02:43:45,120
>> Well, this this graph on the screen says

4189
02:43:45,120 --> 02:43:47,200
that at least according to this Iowa

4190
02:43:47,200 --> 02:43:50,080
investigation, the Bitcoin Depot kiosk,

4191
02:43:50,080 --> 02:43:53,600
it was 98% of the transactions were scam

4192
02:43:53,600 --> 02:43:57,680
and the coin flip kiosks, 94%

4193
02:43:57,680 --> 02:44:01,040
were scams. That's a pretty significant

4194
02:44:01,040 --> 02:44:03,760
>> number. I think that Bitcoin Depot, the

4195
02:44:03,760 --> 02:44:05,600
one that they found that there, that

4196
02:44:05,600 --> 02:44:07,279
98%, there's the one that was in our

4197
02:44:07,279 --> 02:44:10,319
city that is now defunct. I think that

4198
02:44:10,319 --> 02:44:22,070
shows their business model.

4199
02:44:22,080 --> 02:44:25,760
» Uh, he can continue to search for any

4200
02:44:25,760 --> 02:44:28,479
other questions up. Well, they give you

4201
02:44:28,479 --> 02:44:30,560
the

4202
02:44:30,560 --> 02:44:32,000
>> Maybe we should include that as a

4203
02:44:32,000 --> 02:44:36,389
whereas in the resolution

4204
02:44:36,399 --> 02:44:44,550
» those statistics from Iowa

4205
02:44:44,560 --> 02:44:48,550
» I'm just

4206
02:44:48,560 --> 02:44:50,399
» I think it's a good idea.

4207
02:44:50,399 --> 02:44:52,560
Well, certainly chief has indicated that

4208
02:44:52,560 --> 02:44:54,080
here

4209
02:44:54,080 --> 02:44:56,960
um that his his observations would be

4210
02:44:56,960 --> 02:44:59,920
consistent with this study, right? You

4211
02:44:59,920 --> 02:45:02,160
have no evidence to believe that our use

4212
02:45:02,160 --> 02:45:04,479
of our kiosks would differ in any way

4213
02:45:04,479 --> 02:45:07,359
from this in this Iowa investigative

4214
02:45:07,359 --> 02:45:08,319
study.

4215
02:45:08,319 --> 02:45:10,080
>> Correct.

4216
02:45:10,080 --> 02:45:11,359
>> Thank you.

4217
02:45:11,359 --> 02:45:15,040
I mean, there are other options for

4218
02:45:15,040 --> 02:45:17,600
cash

4219
02:45:17,600 --> 02:45:21,520
um users to transfer the cash into

4220
02:45:21,520 --> 02:45:22,319
crypto.

4221
02:45:22,319 --> 02:45:22,880
>> Yeah.

4222
02:45:22,880 --> 02:45:24,960
>> Outside of the kiosks

4223
02:45:24,960 --> 02:45:28,080
>> that would require a person,

4224
02:45:28,080 --> 02:45:30,800
a teller, if you will,

4225
02:45:30,800 --> 02:45:35,439
>> that would be able to hopefully identify

4226
02:45:35,439 --> 02:45:38,240
an active fraud.

4227
02:45:38,240 --> 02:45:41,359
that would be the reason to have a

4228
02:45:41,359 --> 02:45:44,880
person a middleman.

4229
02:45:44,880 --> 02:45:46,720
>> Well, I think it is also significant

4230
02:45:46,720 --> 02:45:49,439
that it appears from the warning that

4231
02:45:49,439 --> 02:45:51,680
you've included in your packet that the

4232
02:45:51,680 --> 02:45:54,319
warning that we center have created is a

4233
02:45:54,319 --> 02:45:56,560
more robust warning than what the

4234
02:45:56,560 --> 02:45:59,439
state's warning is currently mandated.

4235
02:45:59,439 --> 02:46:04,319
And even a more robust warning is not

4236
02:46:04,319 --> 02:46:06,080
preventing the fraud. Right? people are

4237
02:46:06,080 --> 02:46:08,399
even with that more robust warning, we

4238
02:46:08,399 --> 02:46:09,760
still have residents who are being

4239
02:46:09,760 --> 02:46:12,479
scammed to the tune of almost $100,000

4240
02:46:12,479 --> 02:46:15,359
out of just two machines, one of which

4241
02:46:15,359 --> 02:46:18,080
is out of business over a brief two-year

4242
02:46:18,080 --> 02:46:20,720
period.

4243
02:46:20,720 --> 02:46:21,279
>> Y

4244
02:46:21,279 --> 02:46:24,080
>> yeah, we definitely have cases where the

4245
02:46:24,080 --> 02:46:25,680
fraudsters are on the phone with them

4246
02:46:25,680 --> 02:46:27,600
and they'll say, "Okay, go up this ATM

4247
02:46:27,600 --> 02:46:28,880
here and you're going to see some

4248
02:46:28,880 --> 02:46:30,800
warnings on there. They don't apply to

4249
02:46:30,800 --> 02:46:32,399
you, right? This is a whole different

4250
02:46:32,399 --> 02:46:34,720
it's for this is for fraud stuff. this

4251
02:46:34,720 --> 02:46:36,080
isn't dealing with what you have in

4252
02:46:36,080 --> 02:46:38,880
there. They are very convincing on the

4253
02:46:38,880 --> 02:46:42,080
phone with with our victims and talking,

4254
02:46:42,080 --> 02:46:45,920
you know, to the to what uh Council Me

4255
02:46:45,920 --> 02:46:47,760
was saying where they won't even believe

4256
02:46:47,760 --> 02:46:49,359
the police

4257
02:46:49,359 --> 02:46:51,920
>> are right and we'll try and tell them

4258
02:46:51,920 --> 02:46:54,399
it's a fraud and they won't believe us.

4259
02:46:54,399 --> 02:46:56,640
>> Have them argue with our officers who

4260
02:46:56,640 --> 02:46:58,080
are standing right there saying, "I

4261
02:46:58,080 --> 02:47:00,560
promise you this is fraud. No, it's not.

4262
02:47:00,560 --> 02:47:02,000
I have to do this or they're going to

4263
02:47:02,000 --> 02:47:03,600
hurt my grandson or they're going to do

4264
02:47:03,600 --> 02:47:05,359
whatever.

4265
02:47:05,359 --> 02:47:07,920
>> So, yes, we've had that verbal

4266
02:47:07,920 --> 02:47:09,200
altercations with people trying to

4267
02:47:09,200 --> 02:47:10,319
convince them that they're being

4268
02:47:10,319 --> 02:47:13,040
defrauded. And from what I've seen, it

4269
02:47:13,040 --> 02:47:15,279
looks like kiosks are presenting a

4270
02:47:15,279 --> 02:47:18,309
particular

4271
02:47:18,319 --> 02:47:21,040
a particularly easy way for fraudsters

4272
02:47:21,040 --> 02:47:24,399
to defraud our residents, which is not

4273
02:47:24,399 --> 02:47:26,399
to say and which is not to what I'm

4274
02:47:26,399 --> 02:47:27,680
suggesting is there are a lot of other

4275
02:47:27,680 --> 02:47:30,000
ways that our residents could trade in

4276
02:47:30,000 --> 02:47:32,720
cryptocurrency if they want to through

4277
02:47:32,720 --> 02:47:38,880
more secure means, but that the kiosk is really pretty targeted at scams in

4278
02:47:38,880 --> 02:47:40,640
particular. So, it's not really serving

4279
02:47:40,640 --> 02:47:42,240
a purpose and in fact it's it's a

4280
02:47:42,240 --> 02:47:45,520
detriment and a harm to our residents.

4281
02:47:45,520 --> 02:47:47,359
>> It's definitely a much easier way for

4282
02:47:47,359 --> 02:47:49,520
them to do that for sure. and and crypto

4283
02:47:49,520 --> 02:47:50,960
is still something that's that's

4284
02:47:50,960 --> 02:47:54,240
evolving and and changing and and um I

4285
02:47:54,240 --> 02:47:56,479
suspect as time if crypto does stay on

4286
02:47:56,479 --> 02:47:59,120
as a as a currency that they'll figure

4287
02:47:59,120 --> 02:48:03,120
out better ways to to manage crypto and

4288
02:48:03,120 --> 02:48:06,720
to do it more you know so less so it

4289
02:48:06,720 --> 02:48:08,880
won't be used so much as a as a fraud

4290
02:48:08,880 --> 02:48:10,560
technique because I I think the people

4291
02:48:10,560 --> 02:48:13,840
who actually use crypto as a currency

4292
02:48:13,840 --> 02:48:18,880
they probably don't like that their foreign currency

4293
02:48:18,880 --> 02:48:21,520
and ATMs are being used to defraud so

4294
02:48:21,520 --> 02:48:23,279
many people and getting such a bad name.

4295
02:48:23,279 --> 02:48:26,960
And so I I suspect I suspect if the if

4296
02:48:26,960 --> 02:48:30,560
the cryptocurrency

4297
02:48:30,560 --> 02:48:33,760
kiosks, the manufacturers them wanted to

4298
02:48:33,760 --> 02:48:35,840
stay in business and wanted more they

4299
02:48:35,840 --> 02:48:37,359
would find ways to do it where it would

4300
02:48:37,359 --> 02:48:41,120
be more difficult to be used as a tools

4301
02:48:41,120 --> 02:48:44,479
of fraud. And right now I I believe that

4302
02:48:44,479 --> 02:48:45,680
that's how they're making all their

4303
02:48:45,680 --> 02:48:46,960
money.

4304
02:48:46,960 --> 02:48:49,200
>> Right. As soon as the as soon as the

4305
02:48:49,200 --> 02:48:51,600
state cracked down on uh daily

4306
02:48:51,600 --> 02:48:54,160
transaction limits,

4307
02:48:54,160 --> 02:48:55,920
um right after that, one of our kiosks

4308
02:48:55,920 --> 02:48:58,720
went out of business.

4309
02:48:58,720 --> 02:49:01,600
>> And there there isn't in in your view, I

4310
02:49:01,600 --> 02:49:04,000
mean, is is there a place that we could

4311
02:49:04,000 --> 02:49:08,399
put kiosks that would

4312
02:49:08,399 --> 02:49:10,319
make residents less? It doesn't feel

4313
02:49:10,319 --> 02:49:12,800
like to me that if we move a kiosk from

4314
02:49:12,800 --> 02:49:16,399
currently gas stations and wherever else

4315
02:49:16,399 --> 02:49:18,000
they're just gas stations right now. I

4316
02:49:18,000 --> 02:49:20,240
mean, I can't think of any location

4317
02:49:20,240 --> 02:49:24,160
restriction that would address the any

4318
02:49:24,160 --> 02:49:26,800
of the concerns that you've raised.

4319
02:49:26,800 --> 02:49:27,200
>> A big

4320
02:49:27,200 --> 02:49:29,680
>> I like your idea of the police station,

4321
02:49:29,680 --> 02:49:31,359
>> right? Yeah. Outside of putting it in

4322
02:49:31,359 --> 02:49:33,200
the the lobby of the police department

4323
02:49:33,200 --> 02:49:33,840
or

4324
02:49:33,840 --> 02:49:35,760
>> which I don't think we could legally

4325
02:49:35,760 --> 02:49:38,800
restrict. So I mean outside of that

4326
02:49:38,800 --> 02:49:41,279
right I just I don't see a mechanism by

4327
02:49:41,279 --> 02:49:45,590
which we could

4328
02:49:45,600 --> 02:49:47,520
» impose some kind of a location

4329
02:49:47,520 --> 02:49:50,800
restriction or or other you know hour

4330
02:49:50,800 --> 02:49:52,160
restriction. I mean these people are

4331
02:49:52,160 --> 02:49:53,680
going to call when they call and people

4332
02:49:53,680 --> 02:49:55,120
are going to access machines and they

4333
02:49:55,120 --> 02:49:59,359
access machines. What would happen if a

4334
02:49:59,359 --> 02:50:01,680
there was a crypto bank that opened and

4335
02:50:01,680 --> 02:50:05,200
wanted to open and put in kiosks or an

4336
02:50:05,200 --> 02:50:11,840
ATM if you will that uh the crypto barn or some company

4337
02:50:11,840 --> 02:50:16,880
that or Coinbase um Robin Hood these are

4338
02:50:16,880 --> 02:50:20,319
companies that are uh have actual online

4339
02:50:20,319 --> 02:50:24,000
websites that transfer Bitcoin.

4340
02:50:24,000 --> 02:50:26,800
Can they come in and open a

4341
02:50:26,800 --> 02:50:30,880
brickandmortar uh location and have Why

4342
02:50:30,880 --> 02:50:32,479
wouldn't they be able to?

4343
02:50:32,479 --> 02:50:34,319
>> Not if we say that they can't have them

4344
02:50:34,319 --> 02:50:35,680
here in Centerville,

4345
02:50:35,680 --> 02:50:36,080
>> right?

4346
02:50:36,080 --> 02:50:37,680
>> Not not the way the ordinance is

4347
02:50:37,680 --> 02:50:38,960
drafted.

4348
02:50:38,960 --> 02:50:40,000
>> So that I think that would

4349
02:50:40,000 --> 02:50:41,840
>> Are you talking non- kiosk, Councilman

4350
02:50:41,840 --> 02:50:42,560
Clover?

4351
02:50:42,560 --> 02:50:44,800
>> Uh

4352
02:50:44,800 --> 02:50:45,200
I mean,

4353
02:50:45,200 --> 02:50:46,800
>> yeah, my comment was only if they wanted

4354
02:50:46,800 --> 02:50:48,720
to open up a kiosk. They can certainly

4355
02:50:48,720 --> 02:50:51,200
we cannot restrict transfer of

4356
02:50:51,200 --> 02:50:53,680
cryptocurrencies or holding a wallet or

4357
02:50:53,680 --> 02:50:56,640
transacting. It's just the kiosks.

4358
02:50:56,640 --> 02:51:00,000
>> Just the kiosks. Not necessarily a

4359
02:51:00,000 --> 02:51:03,120
brickandmortar Coinbase bank, if you

4360
02:51:03,120 --> 02:51:05,279
will, coming into Centerville, setting

4361
02:51:05,279 --> 02:51:10,240
up shop, and putting in an ATM on their property.

4362
02:51:10,240 --> 02:51:11,680
>> Well, I think they would not be able to

4363
02:51:11,680 --> 02:51:13,680
put the ATM on their property. they

4364
02:51:13,680 --> 02:51:15,279
wouldn't be able to do the kiosk, but

4365
02:51:15,279 --> 02:51:18,319
they could do trading if they have some

4366
02:51:18,319 --> 02:51:20,000
other way to do it.

4367
02:51:20,000 --> 02:51:22,000
>> For for what it's worth, Council Member

4368
02:51:22,000 --> 02:51:23,680
Plamer, I I get totally get where you're

4369
02:51:23,680 --> 02:51:26,000
going with this. Um I think right now

4370
02:51:26,000 --> 02:51:28,640
such kiosks don't exist. So I think for

4371
02:51:28,640 --> 02:51:30,640
right now the the types of kiosks that

4372
02:51:30,640 --> 02:51:32,399
we're dealing with according to the

4373
02:51:32,399 --> 02:51:34,399
evidence that we have in front of us is

4374
02:51:34,399 --> 02:51:36,399
that they're almost exclusively used for

4375
02:51:36,399 --> 02:51:38,880
fraud. So certainly if this type of

4376
02:51:38,880 --> 02:51:40,880
kiosk that you're envisioning starts to

4377
02:51:40,880 --> 02:51:43,359
become of use, I think that we as a city

4378
02:51:43,359 --> 02:51:46,000
council could certainly re-examine what

4379
02:51:46,000 --> 02:51:47,600
you know the ordinance that we have. But

4380
02:51:47,600 --> 02:51:49,520
given right now that the only kiosks

4381
02:51:49,520 --> 02:51:51,840
that are sort of in existence that we're

4382
02:51:51,840 --> 02:51:53,200
trying to address are these ones that

4383
02:51:53,200 --> 02:51:55,680
are used predominantly almost

4384
02:51:55,680 --> 02:51:58,319
exclusively for fraud, I think I'm I'm

4385
02:51:58,319 --> 02:52:01,439
inclined to to to look at the ordinance

4386
02:52:01,439 --> 02:52:03,200
with that

4387
02:52:03,200 --> 02:52:05,439
sort of factual bound foundation right

4388
02:52:05,439 --> 02:52:06,880
now. and you know we can look at

4389
02:52:06,880 --> 02:52:08,640
something if if things change down the

4390
02:52:08,640 --> 02:52:13,110
road.

4391
02:52:13,120 --> 02:52:16,800
» All right. Uh anybody ready to make a

4392
02:52:16,800 --> 02:52:18,720
motion?

4393
02:52:18,720 --> 02:52:20,720
>> I did have some good comments from the

4394
02:52:20,720 --> 02:52:22,880
council on potentially, you know,

4395
02:52:22,880 --> 02:52:25,359
additional whereas clauses if you wanted

4396
02:52:25,359 --> 02:52:28,080
to add them to a motion. One was a

4397
02:52:28,080 --> 02:52:29,840
suggestion to add a whereas clause about

4398
02:52:29,840 --> 02:52:34,000
the Iowa statistics on the 98% on

4399
02:52:34,000 --> 02:52:37,359
Bitcoin depot machines and 94%

4400
02:52:37,359 --> 02:52:40,560
um coin flip or scam transactions.

4401
02:52:40,560 --> 02:52:42,240
um and that there are other alternatives

4402
02:52:42,240 --> 02:52:45,760
for u converting cash to crypto um

4403
02:52:45,760 --> 02:52:47,760
through businesses that may have teller

4404
02:52:47,760 --> 02:52:51,920
transaction options and

4405
02:52:51,920 --> 02:52:54,640
that Centerville City Police Department

4406
02:52:54,640 --> 02:52:57,520
had put up warning sign on our kiosks uh

4407
02:52:57,520 --> 02:52:59,439
that were more robust than the state

4408
02:52:59,439 --> 02:53:01,520
requirements currently and it still

4409
02:53:01,520 --> 02:53:04,319
didn't work over a two-year period um

4410
02:53:04,319 --> 02:53:06,880
even considering that our signs were up

4411
02:53:06,880 --> 02:53:08,800
before the state regulations went into

4412
02:53:08,800 --> 02:53:11,680
effect and that there are other ways to

4413
02:53:11,680 --> 02:53:14,560
trade uh cryptocurrency outside of kiosk

4414
02:53:14,560 --> 02:53:16,399
and that the kiosks are a detriment and

4415
02:53:16,399 --> 02:53:18,160
harm to our residents.

4416
02:53:18,160 --> 02:53:20,160
>> Yeah. How would you feel about adding

4417
02:53:20,160 --> 02:53:22,160
with regard to the Iowa study that our

4418
02:53:22,160 --> 02:53:24,000
chief of police has indicated that based

4419
02:53:24,000 --> 02:53:26,000
on his observations the use of our

4420
02:53:26,000 --> 02:53:29,040
kiosks would be consistent with the iOS

4421
02:53:29,040 --> 02:53:33,750
study?

4422
02:53:33,760 --> 02:53:51,910
» Yes.

4423
02:53:51,920 --> 02:53:54,800
Are you looking for a motion?

4424
02:53:54,800 --> 02:53:56,240
>> Yeah, I was waiting.

4425
02:53:56,240 --> 02:53:57,279
>> Yep.

4426
02:53:57,279 --> 02:53:59,120
>> Waiting for an answer from her.

4427
02:53:59,120 --> 02:53:59,920
>> You good, Lisa?

4428
02:53:59,920 --> 02:54:00,560
>> Oh, yes.

4429
02:54:00,560 --> 02:54:02,399
>> Yeah, I was just adding that. Then I am

4430
02:54:02,399 --> 02:54:04,000
going to move that we approve ordinance

4431
02:54:04,000 --> 02:54:05,760
number 2026-9

4432
02:54:05,760 --> 02:54:09,840
enacting chapter 7-10 or 7.10 of the

4433
02:54:09,840 --> 02:54:11,439
Centerville municipal code regarding

4434
02:54:11,439 --> 02:54:14,000
virtual currency kiosks and prohibiting

4435
02:54:14,000 --> 02:54:15,760
the operation placement and maintenance

4436
02:54:15,760 --> 02:54:18,160
of virtual currency kiosks within the

4437
02:54:18,160 --> 02:54:20,640
city as set forth in the proposed

4438
02:54:20,640 --> 02:54:23,040
ordinance in the packet and the

4439
02:54:23,040 --> 02:54:26,160
additional whereas clauses um that Lisa

4440
02:54:26,160 --> 02:54:29,120
has just identified.

4441
02:54:29,120 --> 02:54:32,319
>> Second. Got a motion, a second. Council

4442
02:54:32,319 --> 02:54:33,040
Mikum.

4443
02:54:33,040 --> 02:54:38,550
>> I

4444
02:54:38,560 --> 02:54:39,840
» Councilman Palmer,

4445
02:54:39,840 --> 02:54:44,479
>> uh can I ask what's going to happen to

4446
02:54:44,479 --> 02:54:46,319
when this goes into place? What will

4447
02:54:46,319 --> 02:54:50,240
happen to the existing is it uh the

4448
02:54:50,240 --> 02:54:52,720
existing kiosk that's in operation at

4449
02:54:52,720 --> 02:54:56,399
this time? Is it um are we giving it a

4450
02:54:56,399 --> 02:54:58,399
period of time or is it needing to be

4451
02:54:58,399 --> 02:55:00,720
shut down as soon as this is passed?

4452
02:55:00,720 --> 02:55:03,359
>> 60 days. 60 days.

4453
02:55:03,359 --> 02:55:05,120
>> The ordinance provides a 60-day

4454
02:55:05,120 --> 02:55:06,080
transition

4455
02:55:06,080 --> 02:55:08,319
>> and and the owner is aware this is

4456
02:55:08,319 --> 02:55:09,920
potentially coming. They were actually

4457
02:55:09,920 --> 02:55:12,560
offered an opportunity to come and speak

4458
02:55:12,560 --> 02:55:15,200
on behalf if they wanted to the the

4459
02:55:15,200 --> 02:55:18,160
owner of the the gas station. Okay.

4460
02:55:18,160 --> 02:55:19,840
>> And they are they are anticipating this

4461
02:55:19,840 --> 02:55:23,760
coming and ready to act. Okay. Great.

4462
02:55:23,760 --> 02:55:25,040
Hi.

4463
02:55:25,040 --> 02:55:28,560
>> All right. Four to zero. Thank you. All

4464
02:55:28,560 --> 02:55:31,359
right. Thank you. Um, you guys ready to

4465
02:55:31,359 --> 02:55:34,560
move on or anybody need a break?

4466
02:55:34,560 --> 02:55:36,640
Keep going.

4467
02:55:36,640 --> 02:55:39,359
You good to go? Okay. Let's go then to

4468
02:55:39,359 --> 02:55:41,120
uh personnel.

4469
02:55:41,120 --> 02:55:44,000
Yeah. Yeah. Personnel policies. CDL

4470
02:55:44,000 --> 02:55:45,840
training and reimbursement resolution

4471
02:55:45,840 --> 02:55:48,240
2026

4472
02:55:48,240 --> 02:55:50,720
uh-

4473
02:55:50,720 --> 02:55:52,640
27.

4474
02:55:52,640 --> 02:55:55,439
uh just come quick give a quick summary.

4475
02:55:55,439 --> 02:55:58,240
I know you gave one in work session to

4476
02:55:58,240 --> 02:56:01,359
the public.

4477
02:56:01,359 --> 02:56:03,439
Again, thank you for letting me take a

4478
02:56:03,439 --> 02:56:05,200
second. So, this was just brought forth

4479
02:56:05,200 --> 02:56:08,720
so that we could uh encourage our growth

4480
02:56:08,720 --> 02:56:11,840
of our employees as we support them in

4481
02:56:11,840 --> 02:56:14,000
obtaining the CDL, which is a mutual

4482
02:56:14,000 --> 02:56:16,880
benefit for us as well as them. And so

4483
02:56:16,880 --> 02:56:19,040
we're just looking for support that we

4484
02:56:19,040 --> 02:56:21,600
can uh do this reimbursement program

4485
02:56:21,600 --> 02:56:23,600
over the course of a 2-year period after

4486
02:56:23,600 --> 02:56:27,520
they obtain the CDL and uh to help us

4487
02:56:27,520 --> 02:56:31,120
with the retention and growth of those

4488
02:56:31,120 --> 02:56:32,479
youngsters. So

4489
02:56:32,479 --> 02:56:34,720
>> is your the is yours the only department

4490
02:56:34,720 --> 02:56:37,040
that will use this?

4491
02:56:37,040 --> 02:56:39,600
Uh, I think we are the only ones that do

4492
02:56:39,600 --> 02:56:41,840
have equipment that would require this

4493
02:56:41,840 --> 02:56:42,319
kind of

4494
02:56:42,319 --> 02:56:47,670
>> license.

4495
02:56:47,680 --> 02:56:49,359
» Oh, yes. Sorry. The parks department

4496
02:56:49,359 --> 02:56:52,160
does as well. Yeah, they have operators

4497
02:56:52,160 --> 02:56:53,920
currently because they utilize the dump

4498
02:56:53,920 --> 02:56:56,479
trucks and that as well.

4499
02:56:56,479 --> 02:56:59,760
>> So, are we limiting the opportunity to

4500
02:56:59,760 --> 02:57:01,359
those departments? Because could a

4501
02:57:01,359 --> 02:57:03,680
police officer say, "I'd like to get my

4502
02:57:03,680 --> 02:57:06,080
CDL license." So, it is limited to those

4503
02:57:06,080 --> 02:57:08,880
that it's uh as it's stated is limited

4504
02:57:08,880 --> 02:57:10,800
to those that it's required by their job

4505
02:57:10,800 --> 02:57:16,710
description.

4506
02:57:16,720 --> 02:57:19,359
» Further questions?

4507
02:57:19,359 --> 02:57:21,120
I would like to make a motion that we

4508
02:57:21,120 --> 02:57:24,080
approve that resolution

4509
02:57:24,080 --> 02:57:28,240
with the uh amendment

4510
02:57:28,240 --> 02:57:33,200
that we reduce the amount to 80%

4511
02:57:33,200 --> 02:57:42,319
of the cost incurred by an employee to so incur that lensure.

4512
02:57:42,319 --> 02:57:44,800
Keeping the table the same as far as

4513
02:57:44,800 --> 02:57:46,880
employment period.

4514
02:57:46,880 --> 02:57:50,720
The six 0 to 6 6 to 12 to 18 24. Okay,

4515
02:57:50,720 --> 02:57:53,120
>> I like that.

4516
02:57:53,120 --> 02:57:56,479
>> Do we have a second of that motion?

4517
02:57:56,479 --> 02:58:00,160
>> Sorry. 80% of what?

4518
02:58:00,160 --> 02:58:00,800
>> So, you want

4519
02:58:00,800 --> 02:58:02,240
>> I don't know how to word it. I'm sorry

4520
02:58:02,240 --> 02:58:04,240
I'm so poor at that. But we're we're

4521
02:58:04,240 --> 02:58:07,600
suggesting we'll pay 100% up to $4,000.

4522
02:58:07,600 --> 02:58:10,880
I would say we pay 80% of the cost up to

4523
02:58:10,880 --> 02:58:17,510
>> that they pay 20%.

4524
02:58:17,520 --> 02:58:20,080
» So as it's written then

4525
02:58:20,080 --> 02:58:21,520
right now it's written that we'll pay

4526
02:58:21,520 --> 02:58:23,040
the upfront cost and they're doing a

4527
02:58:23,040 --> 02:58:24,640
reimbursement. So we'd need to go back

4528
02:58:24,640 --> 02:58:27,200
and rewrite what this looks like. Is

4529
02:58:27,200 --> 02:58:29,279
that correct? because then we're asking

4530
02:58:29,279 --> 02:58:30,319
for

4531
02:58:30,319 --> 02:58:34,319
>> for upfront cash from those employees or

4532
02:58:34,319 --> 02:58:36,640
else be saying we would only reimburse

4533
02:58:36,640 --> 02:58:39,359
up to that percentage and they just have

4534
02:58:39,359 --> 02:58:42,479
to know that they absorb the 20%.

4535
02:58:42,479 --> 02:58:44,720
>> My argument is whenever we required in

4536
02:58:44,720 --> 02:58:46,319
their job description we should be

4537
02:58:46,319 --> 02:58:48,720
funding that and not putting it solely

4538
02:58:48,720 --> 02:58:50,160
on the employee. So if it's a

4539
02:58:50,160 --> 02:58:52,800
requirement of the job my argument is

4540
02:58:52,800 --> 02:58:54,399
the city should be funding that

4541
02:58:54,399 --> 02:58:55,840
requirement. Now,

4542
02:58:55,840 --> 02:58:56,960
>> could be having all this further

4543
02:58:56,960 --> 02:58:59,120
discussion before we get a second on the

4544
02:58:59,120 --> 02:59:02,319
motion or not?

4545
02:59:02,319 --> 02:59:04,240
>> Just just a question. It seems like to

4546
02:59:04,240 --> 02:59:07,840
me that you you don't know necessarily

4547
02:59:07,840 --> 02:59:09,680
go into further discussion. If if you

4548
02:59:09,680 --> 02:59:11,120
don't get a second, then that motion

4549
02:59:11,120 --> 02:59:12,880
fails. Then we'll get further

4550
02:59:12,880 --> 02:59:14,319
discussion. If you get a second, then

4551
02:59:14,319 --> 02:59:15,920
I'll give further discussion. You can

4552
02:59:15,920 --> 02:59:19,760
discuss at that point in time.

4553
02:59:19,760 --> 02:59:22,880
Is there any second?

4554
02:59:22,880 --> 02:59:24,399
Not hearing any second. That motion

4555
02:59:24,399 --> 02:59:26,240
fails. So we can have further discussion

4556
02:59:26,240 --> 02:59:29,040
now.

4557
02:59:29,040 --> 02:59:30,720
>> Well, I will just approve resolution

4558
02:59:30,720 --> 02:59:33,359
number 2026-27

4559
02:59:33,359 --> 02:59:36,640
um as proposed in staff report.

4560
02:59:36,640 --> 02:59:38,800
>> I'll second that.

4561
02:59:38,800 --> 02:59:40,240
>> Okay, we have a motion to second to

4562
02:59:40,240 --> 02:59:44,870
that. Further discussion on that one.

4563
02:59:44,880 --> 02:59:47,520
Okay. Uh

4564
02:59:47,520 --> 02:59:50,479
Councilman Palmer, go on the right. I

4565
02:59:50,479 --> 02:59:52,880
>> I

4566
02:59:52,880 --> 02:59:55,680
>> nay simply because I would appreciate

4567
02:59:55,680 --> 02:59:58,240
the employee having a little skin in the

4568
02:59:58,240 --> 02:59:59,840
game.

4569
02:59:59,840 --> 03:00:03,990
>> I

4570
03:00:04,000 --> 03:00:05,120
» You want to vote or abstain?

4571
03:00:05,120 --> 03:00:06,000
>> I'm going to abstain [clears throat]

4572
03:00:06,000 --> 03:00:07,920
because I'm not even sure which item

4573
03:00:07,920 --> 03:00:10,160
we're on and I apologize.

4574
03:00:10,160 --> 03:00:12,399
>> That uh

4575
03:00:12,399 --> 03:00:13,359
>> it was this

4576
03:00:13,359 --> 03:00:13,840
>> we had

4577
03:00:13,840 --> 03:00:15,120
>> it was the one I thought.

4578
03:00:15,120 --> 03:00:15,920
>> Yeah.

4579
03:00:15,920 --> 03:00:18,160
>> Oh, okay. I'm fine to say I on that.

4580
03:00:18,160 --> 03:00:18,640
Sorry.

4581
03:00:18,640 --> 03:00:21,279
>> Okay. So that motion pass is 4 to one.

4582
03:00:21,279 --> 03:00:22,240
Thank you, Dave.

4583
03:00:22,240 --> 03:00:22,720
>> Thank you.

4584
03:00:22,720 --> 03:00:30,070
>> Appreciate it. All right. Uh let's go to

4585
03:00:30,080 --> 03:00:33,439
probos probationary employment period

4586
03:00:33,439 --> 03:00:36,800
resolution 2026-

4587
03:00:36,800 --> 03:00:40,550
26.

4588
03:00:40,560 --> 03:00:42,720
Who wants to handle that?

4589
03:00:42,720 --> 03:00:44,720
>> I'm happy to talk about that, mayor.

4590
03:00:44,720 --> 03:00:48,080
>> Okay. Um, we have proposed amendments to

4591
03:00:48,080 --> 03:00:50,640
our personnel policies before you

4592
03:00:50,640 --> 03:00:52,160
regarding

4593
03:00:52,160 --> 03:00:54,880
um, probationary periods. So, previously

4594
03:00:54,880 --> 03:00:57,520
in our or our policies, we refer to this

4595
03:00:57,520 --> 03:01:00,080
as your introductory period. It's a

4596
03:01:00,080 --> 03:01:02,000
12-month period when you're first hired

4597
03:01:02,000 --> 03:01:06,080
on with the city um, to review your

4598
03:01:06,080 --> 03:01:10,000
ability to do the job. And we had talked

4599
03:01:10,000 --> 03:01:12,479
about reducing that amount of time, but

4600
03:01:12,479 --> 03:01:14,160
a number of the departments actually

4601
03:01:14,160 --> 03:01:15,680
need that. for instance, police

4602
03:01:15,680 --> 03:01:18,080
department, um public works, sometimes

4603
03:01:18,080 --> 03:01:20,640
it takes up to a year to re obtain these

4604
03:01:20,640 --> 03:01:22,240
certifications.

4605
03:01:22,240 --> 03:01:24,880
So, as staff, our recommendation is

4606
03:01:24,880 --> 03:01:28,800
let's keep it at the um 12 months for

4607
03:01:28,800 --> 03:01:31,279
the introductory period. We're also

4608
03:01:31,279 --> 03:01:33,120
recommending that we change the name of

4609
03:01:33,120 --> 03:01:35,439
that to probationary period because that

4610
03:01:35,439 --> 03:01:37,439
is the language and the term that the

4611
03:01:37,439 --> 03:01:40,720
state statute uses when defining um

4612
03:01:40,720 --> 03:01:43,120
employees in 103105

4613
03:01:43,120 --> 03:01:45,680
what we refer to as at will employees

4614
03:01:45,680 --> 03:01:47,760
during their probationary period. So we

4615
03:01:47,760 --> 03:01:50,000
wanted to be consistent with that. The

4616
03:01:50,000 --> 03:01:52,800
next thing we wanted to address is that

4617
03:01:52,800 --> 03:01:54,960
our current policy says that the first

4618
03:01:54,960 --> 03:01:57,760
12 months of employment with the city um

4619
03:01:57,760 --> 03:02:01,200
in any position or a transfer to a new

4620
03:02:01,200 --> 03:02:04,640
position or a promotion within the city,

4621
03:02:04,640 --> 03:02:06,399
you're subject to another introductory

4622
03:02:06,399 --> 03:02:09,040
period. Well, there are some legal

4623
03:02:09,040 --> 03:02:11,200
concerns with saying you have been with

4624
03:02:11,200 --> 03:02:15,680
the city for 18 years and you are now a

4625
03:02:15,680 --> 03:02:17,920
merit employee, but if you're moving

4626
03:02:17,920 --> 03:02:20,560
into this new position, we're going to

4627
03:02:20,560 --> 03:02:24,720
make you be at will again for 12 months,

4628
03:02:24,720 --> 03:02:27,680
up to 12 months. So, we're proposing

4629
03:02:27,680 --> 03:02:31,040
that we distinguish between

4630
03:02:31,040 --> 03:02:35,200
um a probationary new hire employee and

4631
03:02:35,200 --> 03:02:39,359
a promotion. Um and I think this is also

4632
03:02:39,359 --> 03:02:44,240
a um helpful to now call this the pro

4633
03:02:44,240 --> 03:02:47,279
promotional evaluation period and having

4634
03:02:47,279 --> 03:02:49,840
a distinction between these two things

4635
03:02:49,840 --> 03:02:52,240
and trying to explain that in your

4636
03:02:52,240 --> 03:02:54,720
promotional period if you're going from

4637
03:02:54,720 --> 03:02:58,160
a merit employee meaning you hold your

4638
03:02:58,160 --> 03:03:01,359
position without limitation of time that

4639
03:03:01,359 --> 03:03:03,040
if you're going from merit position to

4640
03:03:03,040 --> 03:03:07,040
merit position that you retain ain that

4641
03:03:07,040 --> 03:03:08,800
merit. You don't have to do another at

4642
03:03:08,800 --> 03:03:11,680
will. But if you get promoted from a

4643
03:03:11,680 --> 03:03:14,399
merit position to an atill position,

4644
03:03:14,399 --> 03:03:16,399
unfortunately you are now you're at

4645
03:03:16,399 --> 03:03:19,840
will. It's not a probationary period.

4646
03:03:19,840 --> 03:03:22,080
It's because under the law, you have now

4647
03:03:22,080 --> 03:03:24,399
moved into an atill position. So, just

4648
03:03:24,399 --> 03:03:26,319
to give you an example, when the police

4649
03:03:26,319 --> 03:03:29,359
chief goes from lieutenant perhaps or to

4650
03:03:29,359 --> 03:03:32,399
chief um or maybe someone moves into one

4651
03:03:32,399 --> 03:03:34,240
of our director uh department head

4652
03:03:34,240 --> 03:03:36,720
positions in a promotion, if they are

4653
03:03:36,720 --> 03:03:39,600
going from merit to at will, then

4654
03:03:39,600 --> 03:03:42,080
they're now at will in that new position

4655
03:03:42,080 --> 03:03:44,720
and that is the voluntary decision that

4656
03:03:44,720 --> 03:03:47,359
they're making um for that that

4657
03:03:47,359 --> 03:03:50,000
promotion. So, also with this, I thought

4658
03:03:50,000 --> 03:03:52,560
it would be helpful to try and define

4659
03:03:52,560 --> 03:03:55,040
merit versus at will. And I went back

4660
03:03:55,040 --> 03:03:58,000
and reviewed the Utah case law. Um, the

4661
03:03:58,000 --> 03:04:01,120
Utah courts refer to this, as I'm

4662
03:04:01,120 --> 03:04:05,680
saying, the title 103 1105 and 1106 as

4663
03:04:05,680 --> 03:04:09,520
the merit protection statute. And so, I

4664
03:04:09,520 --> 03:04:11,279
would like to try and describe for

4665
03:04:11,279 --> 03:04:14,000
employees, you are a merit employee. And

4666
03:04:14,000 --> 03:04:15,680
here's what it means. you know, once

4667
03:04:15,680 --> 03:04:17,840
you've finished this 12-month in uh

4668
03:04:17,840 --> 03:04:20,240
probationary period, you know, you now

4669
03:04:20,240 --> 03:04:22,479
hold your position without limitation of

4670
03:04:22,479 --> 03:04:25,200
time subject to, you know, some due

4671
03:04:25,200 --> 03:04:27,520
process. Um, it doesn't mean we can't

4672
03:04:27,520 --> 03:04:29,840
terminate those employees for cause. We

4673
03:04:29,840 --> 03:04:32,000
certainly can. It's just that they have

4674
03:04:32,000 --> 03:04:34,319
more due process in their job, which is

4675
03:04:34,319 --> 03:04:37,120
different than private employment. This

4676
03:04:37,120 --> 03:04:40,479
is just for uh government employees. Um

4677
03:04:40,479 --> 03:04:43,120
and then also defining at will which

4678
03:04:43,120 --> 03:04:45,439
means we can terminate you generally

4679
03:04:45,439 --> 03:04:47,600
with or without cause and this is all of

4680
03:04:47,600 --> 03:04:50,640
your department heads any um appointed

4681
03:04:50,640 --> 03:04:54,080
position like the city treasurer um city

4682
03:04:54,080 --> 03:04:58,560
manager etc. So um I don't know we're

4683
03:04:58,560 --> 03:05:00,319
excited about this new direction and

4684
03:05:00,319 --> 03:05:02,640
making it a lot hopefully clearer in our

4685
03:05:02,640 --> 03:05:04,800
policies for employees and we'll we'll

4686
03:05:04,800 --> 03:05:07,279
certainly have to do some explanation of

4687
03:05:07,279 --> 03:05:10,240
these edits. Um we have reviewed these

4688
03:05:10,240 --> 03:05:15,040
with our um department heads and um I

4689
03:05:15,040 --> 03:05:17,520
think we're recommending approval of

4690
03:05:17,520 --> 03:05:21,760
these um to bring our policies more in

4691
03:05:21,760 --> 03:05:24,160
line I think with with state law and the

4692
03:05:24,160 --> 03:05:26,399
case law development of merit and and at

4693
03:05:26,399 --> 03:05:27,359
will employees

4694
03:05:27,359 --> 03:05:29,520
>> and we reduced it from 12 months to six

4695
03:05:29,520 --> 03:05:29,920
months.

4696
03:05:29,920 --> 03:05:33,120
>> Right. And so for the pro uh probate for

4697
03:05:33,120 --> 03:05:37,120
the um promotional evaluation period, we

4698
03:05:37,120 --> 03:05:39,600
have reduced that from 12 months to 6

4699
03:05:39,600 --> 03:05:42,160
months because we know you know this is

4700
03:05:42,160 --> 03:05:44,240
has been an employee that's been with us

4701
03:05:44,240 --> 03:05:46,399
and they may just be transferring or

4702
03:05:46,399 --> 03:05:50,319
promoted and so the six months does make

4703
03:05:50,319 --> 03:05:54,160
more sense in that situation.

4704
03:05:54,160 --> 03:05:57,349
So

4705
03:05:57,359 --> 03:06:00,160
any comments or questions?

4706
03:06:00,160 --> 03:06:02,080
I'm supportive of Alisa, but I have a

4707
03:06:02,080 --> 03:06:03,520
nerdy recommendation.

4708
03:06:03,520 --> 03:06:04,000
>> Okay.

4709
03:06:04,000 --> 03:06:06,240
>> In your definition of at will employee

4710
03:06:06,240 --> 03:06:08,319
in subsection B, the last sentence

4711
03:06:08,319 --> 03:06:10,319
indicates nothing here and authorizes

4712
03:06:10,319 --> 03:06:12,399
termination of an at will employee

4713
03:06:12,399 --> 03:06:15,200
unlawful reasons and then we proceed to

4714
03:06:15,200 --> 03:06:18,000
list examples of unlawful reasons such

4715
03:06:18,000 --> 03:06:20,240
as discrimination, retaliation, equal

4716
03:06:20,240 --> 03:06:22,640
protection, etc. I don't like the

4717
03:06:22,640 --> 03:06:25,520
inclusion of those examples for two

4718
03:06:25,520 --> 03:06:27,520
reasons. one they're focusing really

4719
03:06:27,520 --> 03:06:31,279
more on equal protection type protected

4720
03:06:31,279 --> 03:06:33,279
status discrimination. And there are a

4721
03:06:33,279 --> 03:06:34,560
lot of other unlawful reasons that you

4722
03:06:34,560 --> 03:06:35,920
can terminate an employee. Wrongful

4723
03:06:35,920 --> 03:06:37,520
termination and violation of religion

4724
03:06:37,520 --> 03:06:39,680
policy,

4725
03:06:39,680 --> 03:06:41,920
right? That for those who don't know,

4726
03:06:41,920 --> 03:06:43,359
the Utah Public Protection and

4727
03:06:43,359 --> 03:06:46,319
Employment Act. So I would and and I

4728
03:06:46,319 --> 03:06:48,560
also don't like those terms because

4729
03:06:48,560 --> 03:06:50,880
while they can be used in a legal sense,

4730
03:06:50,880 --> 03:06:53,600
discrimination, retaliation, I can also

4731
03:06:53,600 --> 03:06:55,040
discriminate and retaliate against

4732
03:06:55,040 --> 03:06:57,760
people for perfectly lawful reasons that

4733
03:06:57,760 --> 03:07:00,240
are not prohibited by law. So just to

4734
03:07:00,240 --> 03:07:03,279
avoid any um Yeah. Like I can I can

4735
03:07:03,279 --> 03:07:04,960
discriminate against somebody because

4736
03:07:04,960 --> 03:07:08,319
they wear red socks and not blue socks.

4737
03:07:08,319 --> 03:07:09,840
That's not unlawful, but it would be

4738
03:07:09,840 --> 03:07:12,319
discrimination, right? So I would just

4739
03:07:12,319 --> 03:07:15,439
change that because I am me. And I would

4740
03:07:15,439 --> 03:07:16,960
just say nothing here and authorizes

4741
03:07:16,960 --> 03:07:18,880
termination of an at will employee for

4742
03:07:18,880 --> 03:07:21,439
reasons prohibited by law. Period.

4743
03:07:21,439 --> 03:07:24,080
>> And not identify any examples. I know

4744
03:07:24,080 --> 03:07:26,240
you were trying to be helpful, but it

4745
03:07:26,240 --> 03:07:28,319
could create ambiguity.

4746
03:07:28,319 --> 03:07:30,720
>> Okay,

4747
03:07:30,720 --> 03:07:34,240
good suggestion. We know that

4748
03:07:34,240 --> 03:07:37,520
>> for reasons prohibited by law.

4749
03:07:37,520 --> 03:07:40,560
>> Yeah, it was a lot more difficult to

4750
03:07:40,560 --> 03:07:44,319
define these than I thought, but

4751
03:07:44,319 --> 03:07:45,840
>> that was my only comment.

4752
03:07:45,840 --> 03:07:47,359
>> Okay,

4753
03:07:47,359 --> 03:07:49,760
>> at least gave an exciting presentation.

4754
03:07:49,760 --> 03:07:52,000
She was No, you did. You were

4755
03:07:52,000 --> 03:07:53,359
passionate.

4756
03:07:53,359 --> 03:07:56,000
>> So, do you have more questions for her

4757
03:07:56,000 --> 03:07:58,574
for that passion?

4758
03:07:58,574 --> 03:08:00,800
[laughter] Anybody

4759
03:08:00,800 --> 03:08:03,600
else?

4760
03:08:03,600 --> 03:08:05,359
>> I appreciate you doing it, Lisa. I think

4761
03:08:05,359 --> 03:08:06,880
you've done a great job and I appreciate

4762
03:08:06,880 --> 03:08:07,600
that a lot.

4763
03:08:07,600 --> 03:08:09,760
>> And I and I do like that we are

4764
03:08:09,760 --> 03:08:12,319
resolving this. That seems very common

4765
03:08:12,319 --> 03:08:13,920
sense. So,

4766
03:08:13,920 --> 03:08:15,439
>> we're going to see a theme. I mean, we

4767
03:08:15,439 --> 03:08:16,800
really are looking into our personnel

4768
03:08:16,800 --> 03:08:19,040
policy manual and Bryce and Lisa have

4769
03:08:19,040 --> 03:08:20,800
done a really good job, but you're going

4770
03:08:20,800 --> 03:08:23,279
to see probably maybe every meeting some

4771
03:08:23,279 --> 03:08:25,760
tweak or change um that we need to do.

4772
03:08:25,760 --> 03:08:26,800
So, anyway,

4773
03:08:26,800 --> 03:08:27,680
>> appreciate the work.

4774
03:08:27,680 --> 03:08:29,120
>> That's our goal. That's our goal.

4775
03:08:29,120 --> 03:08:30,800
>> Okay. So,

4776
03:08:30,800 --> 03:08:32,880
>> council a motion.

4777
03:08:32,880 --> 03:08:33,439
>> Go ahead.

4778
03:08:33,439 --> 03:08:34,560
>> I was going to say I'll make a motion

4779
03:08:34,560 --> 03:08:36,160
that we approve resolution number

4780
03:08:36,160 --> 03:08:38,240
2026-26

4781
03:08:38,240 --> 03:08:40,000
regarding personnel policy amendments

4782
03:08:40,000 --> 03:08:42,000
for new employee probationary periods

4783
03:08:42,000 --> 03:08:44,240
and promotional evaluation periods for

4784
03:08:44,240 --> 03:08:46,880
existing employees who are internally

4785
03:08:46,880 --> 03:08:48,479
promoted or transferred to a new

4786
03:08:48,479 --> 03:08:51,439
position and other relevant amendments.

4787
03:08:51,439 --> 03:08:53,760
>> Modification that I made. Yes, with the

4788
03:08:53,760 --> 03:08:57,279
modification that Shayen made and

4789
03:08:57,279 --> 03:08:58,720
I'm not going to try and repeat that,

4790
03:08:58,720 --> 03:09:00,800
but I think we've got it right.

4791
03:09:00,800 --> 03:09:03,420
>> I'll second it.

4792
03:09:03,420 --> 03:09:04,319
[cough]

4793
03:09:04,319 --> 03:09:07,600
>> A motion to second. Uh for discussion,

4794
03:09:07,600 --> 03:09:10,000
Councilman Banger going to the right.

4795
03:09:10,000 --> 03:09:12,399
>> I [clears throat]

4796
03:09:12,399 --> 03:09:17,040
>> I motion passes 5. Thank you. Let's go

4797
03:09:17,040 --> 03:09:19,120
to Utah Property Acquisitions along

4798
03:09:19,120 --> 03:09:21,920
frontage road. Uh Brandt, do you want to

4799
03:09:21,920 --> 03:09:23,359
give us a quick summary on that?

4800
03:09:23,359 --> 03:09:24,720
>> Yes. Thanks, Mr. Mayor, Mayor and

4801
03:09:24,720 --> 03:09:26,560
Council. So, as we we've discussed and

4802
03:09:26,560 --> 03:09:28,640
we've been working on this for the last,

4803
03:09:28,640 --> 03:09:32,000
I would say two years. Uh UD do as they

4804
03:09:32,000 --> 03:09:34,319
are widening I-15 is needing to acquire

4805
03:09:34,319 --> 03:09:36,399
property along our frontage road. That

4806
03:09:36,399 --> 03:09:38,240
property primarily serves as our

4807
03:09:38,240 --> 03:09:40,479
drainage. Most of the property primarily

4808
03:09:40,479 --> 03:09:43,439
serves as retention or detention basins,

4809
03:09:43,439 --> 03:09:46,399
drainage swells along the frontage road.

4810
03:09:46,399 --> 03:09:48,479
So, we've they've been interested in

4811
03:09:48,479 --> 03:09:50,080
acquiring this property. on to purchase

4812
03:09:50,080 --> 03:09:53,279
it, but also to to uh do some temporary

4813
03:09:53,279 --> 03:09:54,960
construction easements on that property.

4814
03:09:54,960 --> 03:09:57,359
We've been negotiating with UD do and

4815
03:09:57,359 --> 03:09:59,359
we've worked closely with them to find a

4816
03:09:59,359 --> 03:10:00,720
fair balance. One of the biggest

4817
03:10:00,720 --> 03:10:03,600
concerns and uh is making sure that our

4818
03:10:03,600 --> 03:10:05,520
drainage infrastructure and our drainage

4819
03:10:05,520 --> 03:10:08,399
system still operates properly. So, this

4820
03:10:08,399 --> 03:10:09,760
has been delayed because we wanted to

4821
03:10:09,760 --> 03:10:11,279
make sure we had that drainage agreement

4822
03:10:11,279 --> 03:10:12,960
in place that was approved at the last

4823
03:10:12,960 --> 03:10:15,120
meeting. UD [snorts] do has agreed to

4824
03:10:15,120 --> 03:10:16,880
construct approximately $10 million

4825
03:10:16,880 --> 03:10:18,319
worth of drainage infrastructure

4826
03:10:18,319 --> 03:10:20,640
underneath the freeway, whether it's a

4827
03:10:20,640 --> 03:10:23,279
new pipes, upgraded pipes to handle all

4828
03:10:23,279 --> 03:10:25,520
of our flows to make it to the west side

4829
03:10:25,520 --> 03:10:27,920
of the freeway and legacy. So with that

4830
03:10:27,920 --> 03:10:31,520
before you are 10 contracts, uh 10

4831
03:10:31,520 --> 03:10:33,520
parcels of land they're requiring

4832
03:10:33,520 --> 03:10:36,880
interested in purchasing uh or

4833
03:10:36,880 --> 03:10:38,479
purchasing easements on those

4834
03:10:38,479 --> 03:10:42,399
properties. And those 10 contracts uh

4835
03:10:42,399 --> 03:10:47,349
total $1,969,675,000.

4836
03:10:47,359 --> 03:10:49,760
Again, as I shared have shared that it's

4837
03:10:49,760 --> 03:10:51,680
important for us to actually retain and

4838
03:10:51,680 --> 03:10:53,359
hold on to this funding that we're

4839
03:10:53,359 --> 03:10:55,520
receiving because we'll also need to

4840
03:10:55,520 --> 03:10:57,439
come back in and do the betterments and

4841
03:10:57,439 --> 03:11:00,000
improve the properties once they leave.

4842
03:11:00,000 --> 03:11:01,520
The cost that they're giving us does

4843
03:11:01,520 --> 03:11:03,279
account for that. there might be

4844
03:11:03,279 --> 03:11:05,120
opportunities for betterments or trails

4845
03:11:05,120 --> 03:11:07,279
or any other open space we might be

4846
03:11:07,279 --> 03:11:09,040
interested in, but also we might need to

4847
03:11:09,040 --> 03:11:11,439
invest more into the drainage

4848
03:11:11,439 --> 03:11:14,080
infrastructure uh on the west side of

4849
03:11:14,080 --> 03:11:16,319
the freeway. So, the recommendation is

4850
03:11:16,319 --> 03:11:18,960
to hold on to those funds for until the

4851
03:11:18,960 --> 03:11:21,439
completion of the I-15 widening project

4852
03:11:21,439 --> 03:11:22,880
and then we have discussions in the

4853
03:11:22,880 --> 03:11:25,600
future of what to do with those funds.

4854
03:11:25,600 --> 03:11:27,120
Are there any questions from me?

4855
03:11:27,120 --> 03:11:30,080
>> We think that'll be about Did you say 20

4856
03:11:30,080 --> 03:11:31,200
31 32?

4857
03:11:31,200 --> 03:11:33,760
>> Yeah. Mike, what what was UD do

4858
03:11:33,760 --> 03:11:35,920
anticipated the completion of the I-15

4859
03:11:35,920 --> 03:11:37,680
winding? I want to say it was 2031 or

4860
03:11:37,680 --> 03:11:39,840
2032. Is that about right?

4861
03:11:39,840 --> 03:11:41,520
>> I mean, the goal of course is prior to

4862
03:11:41,520 --> 03:11:45,279
the Olympics, so definitely before 2034.

4863
03:11:45,279 --> 03:11:47,200
If they don't, then we we've messed up

4864
03:11:47,200 --> 03:11:48,800
big time.

4865
03:11:48,800 --> 03:11:50,399
So

4866
03:11:50,399 --> 03:11:53,510
yeah,

4867
03:11:53,520 --> 03:11:55,279
» I was just going to mention that I do

4868
03:11:55,279 --> 03:11:58,560
work for Horox, which they do have some

4869
03:11:58,560 --> 03:12:01,359
involvement with um this freeway

4870
03:12:01,359 --> 03:12:05,600
expansion project. So I I have no

4871
03:12:05,600 --> 03:12:07,760
decision making on the process of right

4872
03:12:07,760 --> 03:12:10,560
away within Horox or any advantage

4873
03:12:10,560 --> 03:12:12,640
financially but I do want to state that

4874
03:12:12,640 --> 03:12:14,160
I am an employee of Horox

4875
03:12:14,160 --> 03:12:16,640
>> and I share we've been working with HDR

4876
03:12:16,640 --> 03:12:18,720
as the consultant who's you know the

4877
03:12:18,720 --> 03:12:21,279
consult to negotiate for our [snorts]

4878
03:12:21,279 --> 03:12:24,560
parcels. So HDR is the firm.

4879
03:12:24,560 --> 03:12:26,399
>> Sounds like you're not cancelled then.

4880
03:12:26,399 --> 03:12:28,399
>> I'm not cancelled. I just want I just

4881
03:12:28,399 --> 03:12:31,040
want to be very clear about that in any

4882
03:12:31,040 --> 03:12:34,000
dot decisions at the moment. So,

4883
03:12:34,000 --> 03:12:36,479
>> all right. Further discussions or

4884
03:12:36,479 --> 03:12:39,040
further questions for Brent?

4885
03:12:39,040 --> 03:12:41,760
>> A motion or sorry, it's not Yeah. Well,

4886
03:12:41,760 --> 03:12:44,399
it is a motion. It's but it's not a

4887
03:12:44,399 --> 03:12:48,479
resolution or ordinance. It's just uh

4888
03:12:48,479 --> 03:12:50,240
allowing the mayor and appropriate city

4889
03:12:50,240 --> 03:12:52,399
officials to execute contracts and

4890
03:12:52,399 --> 03:12:55,120
associated closing documents subject to

4891
03:12:55,120 --> 03:12:57,359
final review and non-material

4892
03:12:57,359 --> 03:12:59,040
corrections or however you want to say

4893
03:12:59,040 --> 03:12:59,878
it.

4894
03:12:59,878 --> 03:13:00,399
>> [laughter]

4895
03:13:00,399 --> 03:13:02,000
>> I'll move that we approve the U dot

4896
03:13:02,000 --> 03:13:03,920
rightway contracts for the parcels

4897
03:13:03,920 --> 03:13:06,319
identified in staff report for the total

4898
03:13:06,319 --> 03:13:08,479
compensation identified in staff report

4899
03:13:08,479 --> 03:13:10,800
and authorize the mayor and appropriate

4900
03:13:10,800 --> 03:13:12,640
city officials to execute the contracts

4901
03:13:12,640 --> 03:13:14,800
and associated closing documents subject

4902
03:13:14,800 --> 03:13:18,080
to final legal review and non-materials.

4903
03:13:18,080 --> 03:13:19,279
>> I'll second that.

4904
03:13:19,279 --> 03:13:23,200
>> Got a motion to second. Uh Counciloman

4905
03:13:23,200 --> 03:13:24,560
Haymon going to my right.

4906
03:13:24,560 --> 03:13:25,920
>> I I

4907
03:13:25,920 --> 03:13:28,239
>> I

4908
03:13:28,239 --> 03:13:31,439
>> Thank you. That post is 50.

4909
03:13:31,439 --> 03:13:34,880
All right, we've kept Bruce Caul up past

4910
03:13:34,880 --> 03:13:36,880
10:00 when his lights go off at the

4911
03:13:36,880 --> 03:13:38,960
parks. That's your bedtime usually,

4912
03:13:38,960 --> 03:13:40,479
right? When the lights go off at the

4913
03:13:40,479 --> 03:13:42,080
pickle ball court and the tennis courts.

4914
03:13:42,080 --> 03:13:44,960
But come on up here. Uh cuz we're we're

4915
03:13:44,960 --> 03:13:47,680
talking about the the the Hot Wheels

4916
03:13:47,680 --> 03:13:49,680
park discussion or the all wheels,

4917
03:13:49,680 --> 03:13:50,319
excuse me.

4918
03:13:50,319 --> 03:13:53,910
>> Hot Wheels. [laughter]

4919
03:13:53,920 --> 03:13:55,439
» Just just can't help but think of my

4920
03:13:55,439 --> 03:13:58,000
days of Hot Wheels and Matchboxes. This

4921
03:13:58,000 --> 03:14:02,239
doesn't need to be a discussion. Just tell me what location.

4922
03:14:02,239 --> 03:14:04,160
>> Oh, I just thought you might want to say

4923
03:14:04,160 --> 03:14:07,279
that since we since we last met, unless

4924
03:14:07,279 --> 03:14:08,399
you want me to read it.

4925
03:14:08,399 --> 03:14:08,880
>> Oh, yeah.

4926
03:14:08,880 --> 03:14:12,640
>> That that that you're uh you got to the

4927
03:14:12,640 --> 03:14:13,840
trails committee got together,

4928
03:14:13,840 --> 03:14:14,720
>> right? Oh, okay.

4929
03:14:14,720 --> 03:14:17,120
>> I I didn't know or or she could say it.

4930
03:14:17,120 --> 03:14:17,920
>> We were both there. Yeah.

4931
03:14:17,920 --> 03:14:19,520
>> I didn't want to steal any thunder.

4932
03:14:19,520 --> 03:14:20,000
>> Oh,

4933
03:14:20,000 --> 03:14:22,960
>> okay. The trails committee met last

4934
03:14:22,960 --> 03:14:25,040
Thursday evening and unanimous

4935
03:14:25,040 --> 03:14:29,920
unanimously after uh some discussion uh

4936
03:14:29,920 --> 03:14:32,239
decided to recommend to the city council

4937
03:14:32,239 --> 03:14:35,439
that they have the design of the pump

4938
03:14:35,439 --> 03:14:38,960
track be done for the Porter Walton Park

4939
03:14:38,960 --> 03:14:40,319
location.

4940
03:14:40,319 --> 03:14:42,479
>> All right. I could have read that, but

4941
03:14:42,479 --> 03:14:45,120
uh [laughter] I thought maybe

4942
03:14:45,120 --> 03:14:46,720
>> I I thought you did, but

4943
03:14:46,720 --> 03:14:49,120
>> it was not a close call. I mean, it was

4944
03:14:49,120 --> 03:14:51,279
such a unanimous decision and I don't

4945
03:14:51,279 --> 03:14:52,399
think that they had really thought about

4946
03:14:52,399 --> 03:14:54,319
it before we as a city council

4947
03:14:54,319 --> 03:14:56,080
recommended it and they said, "Oh my

4948
03:14:56,080 --> 03:14:57,920
gosh." Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

4949
03:14:57,920 --> 03:14:58,239
So,

4950
03:14:58,239 --> 03:15:00,640
>> yeah, with the greenway that they talked

4951
03:15:00,640 --> 03:15:02,640
about earlier today running right past

4952
03:15:02,640 --> 03:15:05,359
that park, uh the visibility, it's a

4953
03:15:05,359 --> 03:15:08,720
safe route to school for junior high. Um

4954
03:15:08,720 --> 03:15:10,560
it's a great location for our

4955
03:15:10,560 --> 03:15:12,880
neighboring West Bountiful and Bountiful

4956
03:15:12,880 --> 03:15:15,040
communities to be able to also enjoy the

4957
03:15:15,040 --> 03:15:17,040
amenities. Uh there's there's lots of

4958
03:15:17,040 --> 03:15:19,600
pluses for sure. There's there's it's a

4959
03:15:19,600 --> 03:15:23,680
three acre parcel. Um and I think a a

4960
03:15:23,680 --> 03:15:26,960
one acre of it would be very usable um

4961
03:15:26,960 --> 03:15:30,319
for for design and uh still keeping a a

4962
03:15:30,319 --> 03:15:32,640
green buffer around the perimeter and

4963
03:15:32,640 --> 03:15:36,239
all of the park that's there um uh as

4964
03:15:36,239 --> 03:15:38,319
far as basketball court, playground,

4965
03:15:38,319 --> 03:15:41,279
pavilion, um those things. So I I I

4966
03:15:41,279 --> 03:15:42,720
think there's a lot of pluses for that

4967
03:15:42,720 --> 03:15:44,640
location. So, are you going to

4968
03:15:44,640 --> 03:15:47,600
specifically recommend they only design

4969
03:15:47,600 --> 03:15:49,920
for one particular acre of it?

4970
03:15:49,920 --> 03:15:51,840
>> That that's what I would I've already

4971
03:15:51,840 --> 03:15:53,200
actually Yeah, that's what I would

4972
03:15:53,200 --> 03:15:55,600
recommend that they keep their design

4973
03:15:55,600 --> 03:15:58,239
within that acre or so to not they could

4974
03:15:58,239 --> 03:16:00,319
give other options if for you to look at

4975
03:16:00,319 --> 03:16:02,800
and I I think I will recommend too, hey,

4976
03:16:02,800 --> 03:16:04,239
why don't you give us a couple of

4977
03:16:04,239 --> 03:16:06,319
different options for us to look at and

4978
03:16:06,319 --> 03:16:08,479
pick and choose the things we like and

4979
03:16:08,479 --> 03:16:10,800
dislike. But, uh yeah, there's a blank

4980
03:16:10,800 --> 03:16:14,080
canvas easily of an acre. they could

4981
03:16:14,080 --> 03:16:16,239
stretch that to an acre and a half at

4982
03:16:16,239 --> 03:16:18,560
most probably and still keep what I

4983
03:16:18,560 --> 03:16:21,439
think uh without having to take out it

4984
03:16:21,439 --> 03:16:23,040
take away anything that the park already

4985
03:16:23,040 --> 03:16:24,000
has.

4986
03:16:24,000 --> 03:16:26,479
>> Yeah, I council to be aware I took a

4987
03:16:26,479 --> 03:16:28,399
little drive by with Bruce and Bruce I

4988
03:16:28,399 --> 03:16:31,279
liked that idea of maybe coming along

4989
03:16:31,279 --> 03:16:33,359
the the where the parkway would be and

4990
03:16:33,359 --> 03:16:35,680
having a stretch of that park being a

4991
03:16:35,680 --> 03:16:38,720
little longer instead of so circular or

4992
03:16:38,720 --> 03:16:41,600
something. We talked about that. I just

4993
03:16:41,600 --> 03:16:42,640
>> Yeah.

4994
03:16:42,640 --> 03:16:44,000
and and hopefully that'll be

4995
03:16:44,000 --> 03:16:45,680
incorporated within maybe an acre. Maybe

4996
03:16:45,680 --> 03:16:47,920
that' be a little bit more. But I that

4997
03:16:47,920 --> 03:16:52,790
was my take.

4998
03:16:52,800 --> 03:16:54,880
» That sounds good.

4999
03:16:54,880 --> 03:16:59,600
>> Well, you like that uh

5000
03:16:59,600 --> 03:17:02,080
um

5001
03:17:02,080 --> 03:17:04,239
do you want to approve a preliminary

5002
03:17:04,239 --> 03:17:06,800
design for that park that he brings back

5003
03:17:06,800 --> 03:17:09,279
to us or what do you want to do?

5004
03:17:09,279 --> 03:17:11,040
Or didn't you just need our go-ahhead to

5005
03:17:11,040 --> 03:17:13,040
say, "Yep, go plan for that location."

5006
03:17:13,040 --> 03:17:15,120
>> A location. Yeah. If you choose the

5007
03:17:15,120 --> 03:17:17,840
location for them to design for that

5008
03:17:17,840 --> 03:17:19,920
will give give them the opportunity to

5009
03:17:19,920 --> 03:17:23,120
do specific design to that location. U

5010
03:17:23,120 --> 03:17:24,560
knowing the grades and they can give

5011
03:17:24,560 --> 03:17:27,040
much better cost estimates which I will

5012
03:17:27,040 --> 03:17:29,200
use to then apply for a construction

5013
03:17:29,200 --> 03:17:33,359
grant um early early next year that um

5014
03:17:33,359 --> 03:17:35,520
could be a matching grant that pays for

5015
03:17:35,520 --> 03:17:37,200
half the cost if we're if we're

5016
03:17:37,200 --> 03:17:38,399
successful.

5017
03:17:38,399 --> 03:17:40,319
>> Mr. Mr. Mayor, I if it's possible a

5018
03:17:40,319 --> 03:17:41,600
motion would be awesome.

5019
03:17:41,600 --> 03:17:43,279
>> I'll move that we approve a loc approve

5020
03:17:43,279 --> 03:17:45,040
a location for the preliminary design

5021
03:17:45,040 --> 03:17:49,200
for an alls park at Porter Walton Park.

5022
03:17:49,200 --> 03:17:50,000
>> Second.

5023
03:17:50,000 --> 03:17:51,359
>> All in favor? I

5024
03:17:51,359 --> 03:17:52,319
>> I

5025
03:17:52,319 --> 03:17:54,000
>> post

5026
03:17:54,000 --> 03:17:56,560
unanimous. Thanks, Bruce. All right,

5027
03:17:56,560 --> 03:17:59,200
let's go to

5028
03:17:59,200 --> 03:18:04,319
uh bond reduction Porter Lane Estates.

5029
03:18:04,319 --> 03:18:06,880
Uh this is on the summary action

5030
03:18:06,880 --> 03:18:08,319
calendar.

5031
03:18:08,319 --> 03:18:10,000
Uh

5032
03:18:10,000 --> 03:18:12,720
there's a bond reduction um for Lane

5033
03:18:12,720 --> 03:18:15,760
states amount of 40,773.

5034
03:18:15,760 --> 03:18:23,030
Anybody have questions on that?

5035
03:18:23,040 --> 03:18:27,439
» Okay. If not, uh motion to approve that.

5036
03:18:27,439 --> 03:18:28,880
>> So moved.

5037
03:18:28,880 --> 03:18:30,880
>> Second.

5038
03:18:30,880 --> 03:18:33,520
>> A motion to second to Councilwoman Hurst

5039
03:18:33,520 --> 03:18:35,680
going to my right.

5040
03:18:35,680 --> 03:18:36,479
I

5041
03:18:36,479 --> 03:18:39,439
>> I

5042
03:18:39,439 --> 03:18:41,439
>> That passes unanimously. Thank you.

5043
03:18:41,439 --> 03:18:44,720
Let's go to minutes review and approval.

5044
03:18:44,720 --> 03:18:47,680
August 18th work session and August 18th

5045
03:18:47,680 --> 03:18:51,120
city council minutes. Did you see

5046
03:18:51,120 --> 03:18:53,279
anything of those minutes that you would

5047
03:18:53,279 --> 03:18:58,880
like to uh make a change to?

5048
03:18:58,880 --> 03:19:03,279
>> If not, so moved.

5049
03:19:03,279 --> 03:19:05,680
>> All right. We have a motion to accept

5050
03:19:05,680 --> 03:19:07,120
the minutes as written.

5051
03:19:07,120 --> 03:19:08,000
>> Second.

5052
03:19:08,000 --> 03:19:09,279
>> All in favor? I

5053
03:19:09,279 --> 03:19:10,319
>> I

5054
03:19:10,319 --> 03:19:11,520
>> posed.

5055
03:19:11,520 --> 03:19:14,080
>> Thank you. All right, let's go to uh

5056
03:19:14,080 --> 03:19:16,800
council member report. It uh it's it's

5057
03:19:16,800 --> 03:19:19,520
count counciloman Gina Hurst tonight.

5058
03:19:19,520 --> 03:19:23,760
>> I do not have a whole lot. Um

5059
03:19:23,760 --> 03:19:26,640
our uh parks and recck committee is

5060
03:19:26,640 --> 03:19:29,600
working on kind of um they've been

5061
03:19:29,600 --> 03:19:31,840
working on the master plan and I think

5062
03:19:31,840 --> 03:19:34,080
that's going to be a real drive over the

5063
03:19:34,080 --> 03:19:36,479
next

5064
03:19:36,479 --> 03:19:40,319
month or two. Brian, do you have any

5065
03:19:40,319 --> 03:19:42,000
do you want to add anything to that

5066
03:19:42,000 --> 03:19:44,160
since [clears throat] you kind of

5067
03:19:44,160 --> 03:19:47,040
co-leas that with me? Yeah, that's uh

5068
03:19:47,040 --> 03:19:51,520
it's really it's they're focused on

5069
03:19:51,520 --> 03:19:55,279
getting that um that plan put together

5070
03:19:55,279 --> 03:19:57,760
the report or their [clears throat]

5071
03:19:57,760 --> 03:19:59,520
document, but I think they have

5072
03:19:59,520 --> 03:20:03,359
requested to inquire about funding for

5073
03:20:03,359 --> 03:20:03,760
that.

5074
03:20:03,760 --> 03:20:07,040
>> Yeah. Yeah. They they may need a little

5075
03:20:07,040 --> 03:20:10,880
bit of funding um just to kind of finish

5076
03:20:10,880 --> 03:20:13,840
it off and get it into a nice looking

5077
03:20:13,840 --> 03:20:16,080
format. I'm

5078
03:20:16,080 --> 03:20:18,000
It's possible that city staff can help

5079
03:20:18,000 --> 03:20:20,000
with that as well, but um

5080
03:20:20,000 --> 03:20:21,680
>> we had allocated money for it.

5081
03:20:21,680 --> 03:20:23,840
>> We had allocated money. It did not get

5082
03:20:23,840 --> 03:20:25,520
spent in the last fiscal year and did

5083
03:20:25,520 --> 03:20:30,560
not get pushed forward. So I the reason I think it's important to

5084
03:20:30,560 --> 03:20:33,200
bring that up is just they you know

5085
03:20:33,200 --> 03:20:35,200
these volunteer organizations I think

5086
03:20:35,200 --> 03:20:37,359
that was above and beyond

5087
03:20:37,359 --> 03:20:40,479
>> the call of the call of duty and they

5088
03:20:40,479 --> 03:20:42,239
have done

5089
03:20:42,239 --> 03:20:44,479
everything that I've seen so far like

5090
03:20:44,479 --> 03:20:47,840
it's they have done a really good job.

5091
03:20:47,840 --> 03:20:49,840
They've worked really hard to, you know,

5092
03:20:49,840 --> 03:20:53,359
put that together and I'm I'm impressed

5093
03:20:53,359 --> 03:20:56,560
and so and they they uh they're a really

5094
03:20:56,560 --> 03:20:58,640
great group of people. They work well

5095
03:20:58,640 --> 03:21:02,479
together. Just impressive. So, um I

5096
03:21:02,479 --> 03:21:03,680
think that's all I have there. They're

5097
03:21:03,680 --> 03:21:05,359
kind of wrapped up with movies in the

5098
03:21:05,359 --> 03:21:08,399
park for the summer. um

5099
03:21:08,399 --> 03:21:11,359
South Davis Recreation District. We are

5100
03:21:11,359 --> 03:21:13,439
currently um in the next couple of

5101
03:21:13,439 --> 03:21:15,359
weeks, we'll be holding interviews for

5102
03:21:15,359 --> 03:21:19,600
the two at positions that are not

5103
03:21:19,600 --> 03:21:21,680
elected officials in the community.

5104
03:21:21,680 --> 03:21:24,399
They're the ones that apply and then

5105
03:21:24,399 --> 03:21:28,960
they're interviewed. So I the two that

5106
03:21:28,960 --> 03:21:31,200
are currently sitting on the board did

5107
03:21:31,200 --> 03:21:33,359
reapply and then we've also got one

5108
03:21:33,359 --> 03:21:35,359
resident from Centerville that applied.

5109
03:21:35,359 --> 03:21:37,920
So anyway, I'll let you know how that

5110
03:21:37,920 --> 03:21:39,439
goes when those interviews are.

5111
03:21:39,439 --> 03:21:40,960
>> Did you mean at large?

5112
03:21:40,960 --> 03:21:43,760
>> At large. Yeah. Not at will. Sorry.

5113
03:21:43,760 --> 03:21:45,194
>> Like they're hiring new people.

5114
03:21:45,194 --> 03:21:45,680
[laughter]

5115
03:21:45,680 --> 03:21:46,479
>> Yeah. I

5116
03:21:46,479 --> 03:21:48,960
>> just want to clarify. Okay.

5117
03:21:48,960 --> 03:21:50,720
>> Thank you for the correction. [laughter]

5118
03:21:50,720 --> 03:21:52,479
It's getting late and I'm tired, I

5119
03:21:52,479 --> 03:21:53,200
guess.

5120
03:21:53,200 --> 03:21:54,560
>> Didn't mean to.

5121
03:21:54,560 --> 03:21:56,640
>> No, I'm glad you did. That didn't sound

5122
03:21:56,640 --> 03:22:01,359
right. Um the the South Davis Sewer

5123
03:22:01,359 --> 03:22:04,239
District, they continue to work on um

5124
03:22:04,239 --> 03:22:08,080
the construction of the North plant. Um

5125
03:22:08,080 --> 03:22:11,120
I'll be sitting down um in a couple of

5126
03:22:11,120 --> 03:22:14,000
weeks uh to talk about all of the

5127
03:22:14,000 --> 03:22:16,720
upcoming engineering projects. One would

5128
03:22:16,720 --> 03:22:18,960
think that we would be done with

5129
03:22:18,960 --> 03:22:21,359
infrastructure forever more on the sewer

5130
03:22:21,359 --> 03:22:26,080
plan, but in fact, we will not be. many

5131
03:22:26,080 --> 03:22:28,160
like it's time to start looking at what

5132
03:22:28,160 --> 03:22:31,600
the future needs are as far as um

5133
03:22:31,600 --> 03:22:33,920
updates. So I unfortunately I don't have

5134
03:22:33,920 --> 03:22:35,359
a lot to tell you about that right now,

5135
03:22:35,359 --> 03:22:38,160
but I'll get some more information and

5136
03:22:38,160 --> 03:22:40,960
that's more of a long-term you know I

5137
03:22:40,960 --> 03:22:43,200
will be good for a few years with the

5138
03:22:43,200 --> 03:22:47,279
current changes. But I I do appreciate

5139
03:22:47,279 --> 03:22:49,040
that they're looking ahead and making

5140
03:22:49,040 --> 03:22:56,080
sure that we're ready for the next items that are needed to keep

5141
03:22:56,080 --> 03:23:01,920
the the sewage flowing away from us. So,

5142
03:23:01,920 --> 03:23:04,479
um I think that's everything. Mayor Oh,

5143
03:23:04,479 --> 03:23:07,279
LPC started again. So, we're we're back

5144
03:23:07,279 --> 03:23:09,680
to we're starting on monthly meetings

5145
03:23:09,680 --> 03:23:12,880
right now and then we'll move into the

5146
03:23:12,880 --> 03:23:14,960
weekly as soon as the session starts.

5147
03:23:14,960 --> 03:23:17,200
So, [clears throat] before we know it,

5148
03:23:17,200 --> 03:23:19,040
the legislative

5149
03:23:19,040 --> 03:23:22,160
people are going to be back to work.

5150
03:23:22,160 --> 03:23:24,239
>> Thanks, Council Member. And, uh, I'll

5151
03:23:24,239 --> 03:23:25,920
follow up my report. I just have a

5152
03:23:25,920 --> 03:23:29,520
couple things. LPC, we discussed uh,

5153
03:23:29,520 --> 03:23:31,680
Florida actually has a bill out there to

5154
03:23:31,680 --> 03:23:33,760
eliminate property tax. and they say

5155
03:23:33,760 --> 03:23:36,000
it'll be decided by their state house

5156
03:23:36,000 --> 03:23:37,600
and senate. I don't know they voted on

5157
03:23:37,600 --> 03:23:39,920
it yet, but so they're seeing what's

5158
03:23:39,920 --> 03:23:41,520
happening there. So they expect a lot of

5159
03:23:41,520 --> 03:23:44,239
property tax bills here. Expect water

5160
03:23:44,239 --> 03:23:48,560
bills. They expect uh obviously always

5161
03:23:48,560 --> 03:23:52,239
building bills, right? And our own uh

5162
03:23:52,239 --> 03:23:54,880
beloved representatives has introduced

5163
03:23:54,880 --> 03:23:58,319
some bill defining MA and its terms and

5164
03:23:58,319 --> 03:24:00,080
that sort of thing. Did you see that?

5165
03:24:00,080 --> 03:24:05,120
>> Yeah. that uh um is is out there as well

5166
03:24:05,120 --> 03:24:07,680
too. I just threw that out because Paul

5167
03:24:07,680 --> 03:24:10,000
was working with the league and others

5168
03:24:10,000 --> 03:24:12,560
on that. So um so that's some of the

5169
03:24:12,560 --> 03:24:14,800
things that are coming up. Like uh Gina

5170
03:24:14,800 --> 03:24:17,120
says, you'll start seeing bills coming

5171
03:24:17,120 --> 03:24:18,720
out of committee. We didn't discuss a

5172
03:24:18,720 --> 03:24:22,080
lot of specific bills, uh but we will at

5173
03:24:22,080 --> 03:24:24,640
our next meetings. And then South Davis

5174
03:24:24,640 --> 03:24:26,960
Metro Fire Service, they they scheduled

5175
03:24:26,960 --> 03:24:30,399
a meeting off of the C

5176
03:24:30,399 --> 03:24:33,600
off of our normal time. Uh yesterday I I

5177
03:24:33,600 --> 03:24:36,000
had a business meeting in Denver and

5178
03:24:36,000 --> 03:24:38,720
which I scheduled for three months right

5179
03:24:38,720 --> 03:24:42,160
at that time. But um Brent listened in

5180
03:24:42,160 --> 03:24:46,319
and uh the it's a discussion about how

5181
03:24:46,319 --> 03:24:48,800
they what they if they keep the admin

5182
03:24:48,800 --> 03:24:50,479
committee the same or if they do some

5183
03:24:50,479 --> 03:24:53,520
other things with it. proposal

5184
03:24:53,520 --> 03:24:56,000
thrown out there for two city managers

5185
03:24:56,000 --> 03:24:57,520
to

5186
03:24:57,520 --> 03:25:01,680
uh mayors and somebody from the county

5187
03:25:01,680 --> 03:25:03,920
prank can maybe tell you more in his

5188
03:25:03,920 --> 03:25:06,160
report but I met but no vote was taken

5189
03:25:06,160 --> 03:25:08,560
so I guess we'll be uh taking that up

5190
03:25:08,560 --> 03:25:10,720
more and I look forward to that

5191
03:25:10,720 --> 03:25:14,080
discussion at our future meeting um I

5192
03:25:14,080 --> 03:25:16,239
guess I'll be careful but I'm kind of

5193
03:25:16,239 --> 03:25:21,120
perturbed at South As. So anyway, uh the

5194
03:25:21,120 --> 03:25:23,312
we'll go to Brandt for his report.

5195
03:25:23,312 --> 03:25:23,680
[snorts]

5196
03:25:23,680 --> 03:25:24,640
>> Thanks, Mr. [clears throat] Mayor. So,

5197
03:25:24,640 --> 03:25:26,399
yeah, I do have that on my list to give

5198
03:25:26,399 --> 03:25:28,160
you an update on. I know we've been

5199
03:25:28,160 --> 03:25:30,080
talking about South Davis Fire for the

5200
03:25:30,080 --> 03:25:32,880
last, I don't know, 10 years, it feels

5201
03:25:32,880 --> 03:25:35,359
like, um for the last little bit with

5202
03:25:35,359 --> 03:25:38,160
the budget. Um this has been some

5203
03:25:38,160 --> 03:25:41,359
challenging conversations. Uh since

5204
03:25:41,359 --> 03:25:44,000
Chief Stewart's passing, um a couple of

5205
03:25:44,000 --> 03:25:46,239
the mayors have conducted an

5206
03:25:46,239 --> 03:25:48,960
investigation to understand why the

5207
03:25:48,960 --> 03:25:51,359
potential passing of Chief Stew is the

5208
03:25:51,359 --> 03:25:54,000
stress of the job. U but unfortunately

5209
03:25:54,000 --> 03:25:57,439
the admin committee is being blamed as

5210
03:25:57,439 --> 03:25:59,439
one of the reasons for the hire. Mayor,

5211
03:25:59,439 --> 03:26:00,800
you could stop me if I'm saying too

5212
03:26:00,800 --> 03:26:03,600
much. Um I'm I'm being very candid

5213
03:26:03,600 --> 03:26:04,239
because

5214
03:26:04,239 --> 03:26:05,920
>> No, I probably I would probably say it

5215
03:26:05,920 --> 03:26:08,239
too. So I'll probably I'll probably pile

5216
03:26:08,239 --> 03:26:11,200
on. go down together. So, [laughter] but

5217
03:26:11,200 --> 03:26:13,040
ultimately the frustration is and yeah

5218
03:26:13,040 --> 03:26:14,720
the working with the city managers the

5219
03:26:14,720 --> 03:26:16,319
five city managers and a representative

5220
03:26:16,319 --> 03:26:18,000
from the county is tough but we are the

5221
03:26:18,000 --> 03:26:20,560
budget officer. So just so you know when

5222
03:26:20,560 --> 03:26:24,319
this was formed when the area was formed

5223
03:26:24,319 --> 03:26:25,840
the five city managers and

5224
03:26:25,840 --> 03:26:27,120
representative from the county are the

5225
03:26:27,120 --> 03:26:29,040
budget officers. So we manage the budget

5226
03:26:29,040 --> 03:26:31,359
we present the budget and that was the

5227
03:26:31,359 --> 03:26:32,479
agreement saying if we're going to do

5228
03:26:32,479 --> 03:26:36,399
this this is how we want to do it. So,

5229
03:26:36,399 --> 03:26:38,160
we are not necessarily we don't feel

5230
03:26:38,160 --> 03:26:40,319
like we're hard on the board, but we do

5231
03:26:40,319 --> 03:26:42,160
feel like we hold them accountable. I

5232
03:26:42,160 --> 03:26:43,840
can't imagine what the property taxes

5233
03:26:43,840 --> 03:26:45,520
would be if if we weren't there saying

5234
03:26:45,520 --> 03:26:48,560
you can't have all your new toys because

5235
03:26:48,560 --> 03:26:50,720
public safety likes their new toys. It's

5236
03:26:50,720 --> 03:26:55,840
good thing he's distracted. So, there are those conversations [laughter]

5237
03:26:55,840 --> 03:26:57,680
and it's and they're their toys are

5238
03:26:57,680 --> 03:26:59,760
expensive. Fire engines are million

5239
03:26:59,760 --> 03:27:01,760
dollars, right? So,

5240
03:27:01,760 --> 03:27:03,439
>> Oh, yeah. But we've helped develop

5241
03:27:03,439 --> 03:27:05,120
reserve policies to make sure they have

5242
03:27:05,120 --> 03:27:06,880
enough cash on hand. Before they they

5243
03:27:06,880 --> 03:27:09,600
didn't have any re minimums of what to

5244
03:27:09,600 --> 03:27:11,760
have in savings. They they they were

5245
03:27:11,760 --> 03:27:14,319
just spending. Um so we've done a lot of

5246
03:27:14,319 --> 03:27:15,920
good to help them and the conversations

5247
03:27:15,920 --> 03:27:17,439
are difficult because five cities have

5248
03:27:17,439 --> 03:27:18,560
five different ways of doing their

5249
03:27:18,560 --> 03:27:20,560
budget. So I can appreciate the stress

5250
03:27:20,560 --> 03:27:22,960
that's going on there. but blowing up

5251
03:27:22,960 --> 03:27:24,800
the admin committee saying let's just

5252
03:27:24,800 --> 03:27:28,960
get rid of it or then you put all the

5253
03:27:28,960 --> 03:27:30,560
budget authority in the hands of the

5254
03:27:30,560 --> 03:27:33,840
mayors and and they get to decide you

5255
03:27:33,840 --> 03:27:36,080
know how this works that what's being

5256
03:27:36,080 --> 03:27:37,920
proposed is two city managers would

5257
03:27:37,920 --> 03:27:39,760
serve a three-year term two mayors would

5258
03:27:39,760 --> 03:27:41,040
serve a three-year term and then

5259
03:27:41,040 --> 03:27:42,560
somebody from the county and you'd have

5260
03:27:42,560 --> 03:27:44,960
staggering terms I'm just telling you

5261
03:27:44,960 --> 03:27:46,239
that's not going to be in a very

5262
03:27:46,239 --> 03:27:48,479
effective conversation with elected

5263
03:27:48,479 --> 03:27:50,399
officials with administration and and

5264
03:27:50,399 --> 03:27:57,200
trying to find that balance And um so I think some things need to happen. Um

5265
03:27:57,200 --> 03:27:59,279
another city manager is convinced that

5266
03:27:59,279 --> 03:28:01,520
if you change the bylaws to South Davis

5267
03:28:01,520 --> 03:28:03,760
Fire that it needs to come before all

5268
03:28:03,760 --> 03:28:06,319
five cities to redo those bylaws. I'm

5269
03:28:06,319 --> 03:28:07,760
not sure from the legal standpoint if

5270
03:28:07,760 --> 03:28:10,080
that's true or not, if that's required.

5271
03:28:10,080 --> 03:28:11,520
But that's what I'm spending my time on

5272
03:28:11,520 --> 03:28:13,760
right now is a deep dive into

5273
03:28:13,760 --> 03:28:16,000
understanding the bylaws, the formation

5274
03:28:16,000 --> 03:28:19,279
documents to see really what's the

5275
03:28:19,279 --> 03:28:21,600
process it should take. Um, if you talk

5276
03:28:21,600 --> 03:28:24,720
to Chief Larson or again, I'm not quite

5277
03:28:24,720 --> 03:28:26,160
sure how they feel. I think they are

5278
03:28:26,160 --> 03:28:28,160
frustrated with the admin committee, but

5279
03:28:28,160 --> 03:28:31,600
it's because we hold them accountable.

5280
03:28:31,600 --> 03:28:33,520
So, I think we're doing our job,

5281
03:28:33,520 --> 03:28:35,359
>> but we don't want to lose that. So, what

5282
03:28:35,359 --> 03:28:39,120
is it? We can do that now. Well, where I've perturbed uh going along with

5283
03:28:39,120 --> 03:28:41,600
Grant uh I just threw that out at the

5284
03:28:41,600 --> 03:28:46,080
end is that um uh they scheduled this

5285
03:28:46,080 --> 03:28:49,439
meeting and uh I didn't didn't know

5286
03:28:49,439 --> 03:28:51,520
about it. I found out last minute and so

5287
03:28:51,520 --> 03:28:53,840
I went to sat down with Mayor Westergard

5288
03:28:53,840 --> 03:28:55,760
who's the chair. I told him I'm

5289
03:28:55,760 --> 03:28:57,520
definitely against getting rid of the

5290
03:28:57,520 --> 03:28:58,960
admin committee and I want you to

5291
03:28:58,960 --> 03:29:01,439
express that. Uh and I don't know that

5292
03:29:01,439 --> 03:29:04,160
he did fully. Um, but I'm definitely

5293
03:29:04,160 --> 03:29:06,160
against not removing the admin committee

5294
03:29:06,160 --> 03:29:10,560
because uh of uh one probably the

5295
03:29:10,560 --> 03:29:14,720
biggest reason is uh our assessment that

5296
03:29:14,720 --> 03:29:22,319
we get of a million bucks right uh and um and and also my my CPA background

5297
03:29:22,319 --> 03:29:23,600
always says you have checks and

5298
03:29:23,600 --> 03:29:26,640
balances. They have uh one accounting

5299
03:29:26,640 --> 03:29:30,160
staff and a second one uh that that ju

5300
03:29:30,160 --> 03:29:32,720
just does some little bookkeeping. So,

5301
03:29:32,720 --> 03:29:34,720
you're not going to have five mayors

5302
03:29:34,720 --> 03:29:38,000
checking out uh in the detail that the

5303
03:29:38,000 --> 03:29:41,920
admin committee does. Uh um and in all

5304
03:29:41,920 --> 03:29:44,800
fairness to Chief Larson, uh love the

5305
03:29:44,800 --> 03:29:46,239
man. I've known him since he was a

5306
03:29:46,239 --> 03:29:50,479
teenager. Um uh he's not necessarily and

5307
03:29:50,479 --> 03:29:52,800
he'll say it too, and none of them were

5308
03:29:52,800 --> 03:29:55,760
are accountants. So they totally rely on

5309
03:29:55,760 --> 03:29:58,080
the one staff person. And so where's the

5310
03:29:58,080 --> 03:30:00,399
checks and balances? I mean, you always

5311
03:30:00,399 --> 03:30:03,279
have to have checks and balances when it

5312
03:30:03,279 --> 03:30:05,359
comes to accounting. And that's what we

5313
03:30:05,359 --> 03:30:08,960
get with the city managers. Now, if you

5314
03:30:08,960 --> 03:30:11,439
know all these five city managers,

5315
03:30:11,439 --> 03:30:14,560
they're all pretty driven guys, but they

5316
03:30:14,560 --> 03:30:16,239
don't necessarily always agree, but they

5317
03:30:16,239 --> 03:30:18,399
all work together, like each other. But

5318
03:30:18,399 --> 03:30:22,960
uh and uh um I and I like that. I I like

5319
03:30:22,960 --> 03:30:25,439
that oversight that the that they bring

5320
03:30:25,439 --> 03:30:30,319
in in addition to the mayors and I just think you'll you'll lose an awful

5321
03:30:30,319 --> 03:30:33,760
lot if uh you went to this proposal they

5322
03:30:33,760 --> 03:30:35,760
said or you did away with the adment

5323
03:30:35,760 --> 03:30:36,560
committee. So

5324
03:30:36,560 --> 03:30:39,920
>> who gets to vote who gets to decide that

5325
03:30:39,920 --> 03:30:41,279
>> that's what he was just saying.

5326
03:30:41,279 --> 03:30:43,680
>> Yeah. So the bylaw that's where it gets

5327
03:30:43,680 --> 03:30:45,200
kind of interesting for sure. So

5328
03:30:45,200 --> 03:30:46,880
Bountiful has had their own work session

5329
03:30:46,880 --> 03:30:49,840
about this. Um, I haven't necessarily

5330
03:30:49,840 --> 03:30:52,319
felt the need just yet, mayor. And I

5331
03:30:52,319 --> 03:30:54,000
mean,

5332
03:30:54,000 --> 03:30:55,600
I think we got to work on that way. So,

5333
03:30:55,600 --> 03:30:58,000
who votes on it? This is the

5334
03:30:58,000 --> 03:31:00,239
technicality of the whole thing is the

5335
03:31:00,239 --> 03:31:02,319
board does. The mayor's vote on whether

5336
03:31:02,319 --> 03:31:03,760
or not to change the bylaws. At least

5337
03:31:03,760 --> 03:31:05,680
that's what's being recommended. The

5338
03:31:05,680 --> 03:31:09,120
complication in this is any one of the

5339
03:31:09,120 --> 03:31:12,479
mayors can invoke a weighted vote.

5340
03:31:12,479 --> 03:31:16,720
And so you can see that the votes

5341
03:31:16,720 --> 03:31:19,680
one city or has more votes and weight

5342
03:31:19,680 --> 03:31:22,720
than another city and so that creates

5343
03:31:22,720 --> 03:31:24,080
disproportionate. So we don't treat it

5344
03:31:24,080 --> 03:31:26,239
that way but any mayor can invoke that.

5345
03:31:26,239 --> 03:31:27,920
>> I don't know what that means.

5346
03:31:27,920 --> 03:31:29,840
>> So Bountiful has more population so they

5347
03:31:29,840 --> 03:31:32,399
have more votes. Woodscross has a

5348
03:31:32,399 --> 03:31:35,359
smaller city so they have less votes.

5349
03:31:35,359 --> 03:31:36,720
So, it's a weighted vote instead of just

5350
03:31:36,720 --> 03:31:38,800
being one for one and a majority, you

5351
03:31:38,800 --> 03:31:40,800
would take into account the essentially

5352
03:31:40,800 --> 03:31:42,960
the assessment

5353
03:31:42,960 --> 03:31:44,399
and who pays the most has that many

5354
03:31:44,399 --> 03:31:46,640
votes. So, um it does create a

5355
03:31:46,640 --> 03:31:48,880
complication if that was invoked, which

5356
03:31:48,880 --> 03:31:50,640
any mayor can do that at any time

5357
03:31:50,640 --> 03:31:54,560
without question. So, it it creates some

5358
03:31:54,560 --> 03:31:56,800
challenges. So, this week admin

5359
03:31:56,800 --> 03:31:59,120
committee has a meeting. I don't know if

5360
03:31:59,120 --> 03:32:00,640
it's on the agenda just yet, but our

5361
03:32:00,640 --> 03:32:02,479
hope is to actually discuss what's being

5362
03:32:02,479 --> 03:32:05,520
proposed to the mayors so we can be

5363
03:32:05,520 --> 03:32:07,200
constructive and come back with saying

5364
03:32:07,200 --> 03:32:09,600
we recognize evolution needs to occur,

5365
03:32:09,600 --> 03:32:11,439
but blowing it up is not the right

5366
03:32:11,439 --> 03:32:16,640
approach to solving this. So, we'll get together and figure out a

5367
03:32:16,640 --> 03:32:18,960
recommendation to the mayors because it

5368
03:32:18,960 --> 03:32:21,279
is split. You have two mayors um three

5369
03:32:21,279 --> 03:32:23,680
mayors that are pretty confident they'd

5370
03:32:23,680 --> 03:32:26,399
like to see city managers stay. Uh, one

5371
03:32:26,399 --> 03:32:28,399
mayor would like to see the change and

5372
03:32:28,399 --> 03:32:30,319
another mayor I don't know how the other

5373
03:32:30,319 --> 03:32:33,200
mayor feels. Mayor, I think they're they

5374
03:32:33,200 --> 03:32:36,319
can go either way. So, it's kind of an

5375
03:32:36,319 --> 03:32:37,439
interesting boat.

5376
03:32:37,439 --> 03:32:39,200
>> Yeah, I was a little frustrated because

5377
03:32:39,200 --> 03:32:41,439
uh the couple mayors that spoke spoke

5378
03:32:41,439 --> 03:32:44,239
out about keeping as well, but I think

5379
03:32:44,239 --> 03:32:46,800
uh with me being there could have helped

5380
03:32:46,800 --> 03:32:48,560
as well too. Maybe I'm giving myself too

5381
03:32:48,560 --> 03:32:51,439
much credit, but um but the way I look

5382
03:32:51,439 --> 03:32:54,080
at it is uh we our department heads are

5383
03:32:54,080 --> 03:32:56,319
great. They put their budgets together,

5384
03:32:56,319 --> 03:33:00,640
but then they they work with uh um Brent

5385
03:33:00,640 --> 03:33:06,880
and they they work with Nate and uh who have background in in in the finance

5386
03:33:06,880 --> 03:33:10,479
area to help him out. And so great, I

5387
03:33:10,479 --> 03:33:11,920
want Chief Larson to put his budget

5388
03:33:11,920 --> 03:33:14,960
together, but uh we we need more than

5389
03:33:14,960 --> 03:33:17,279
just uh Jessica

5390
03:33:17,279 --> 03:33:20,000
uh look looking at that budget,

5391
03:33:20,000 --> 03:33:21,120
especially when we're getting

5392
03:33:21,120 --> 03:33:22,479
assessments,

5393
03:33:22,479 --> 03:33:23,760
>> you know, for our cities.

5394
03:33:23,760 --> 03:33:26,000
>> And Mayor Hor said it best. We really do

5395
03:33:26,000 --> 03:33:28,399
have an a pretty awesome fire department

5396
03:33:28,399 --> 03:33:29,359
that

5397
03:33:29,359 --> 03:33:31,840
>> services our city, but Mayor Hor said it

5398
03:33:31,840 --> 03:33:33,600
best. Instead of being an awesome

5399
03:33:33,600 --> 03:33:35,200
department, maybe we're a great

5400
03:33:35,200 --> 03:33:37,359
department, right? So, we're still

5401
03:33:37,359 --> 03:33:40,319
awesome, but it's it's pretty expensive

5402
03:33:40,319 --> 03:33:42,239
to to function these public safety

5403
03:33:42,239 --> 03:33:44,960
organizations and and uh maybe we do

5404
03:33:44,960 --> 03:33:46,399
need to cut back a little bit in certain

5405
03:33:46,399 --> 03:33:48,080
areas. You can't have everything you

5406
03:33:48,080 --> 03:33:50,560
want. Um and that's what we try to do as

5407
03:33:50,560 --> 03:33:52,880
the city managers to be that gatekeeper

5408
03:33:52,880 --> 03:33:57,200
and watch what the spending is. So,

5409
03:33:57,200 --> 03:33:58,720
anyway, that's

5410
03:33:58,720 --> 03:34:00,080
>> Anything else in your report?

5411
03:34:00,080 --> 03:34:01,920
>> Well, uh I'll just throw it out there,

5412
03:34:01,920 --> 03:34:04,080
Mayor. Uh, we need to get together and

5413
03:34:04,080 --> 03:34:06,080
figure out a schedule for the general

5414
03:34:06,080 --> 03:34:09,279
plan. I I know you don't I know we've

5415
03:34:09,279 --> 03:34:10,319
forgotten about it because we're dealing

5416
03:34:10,319 --> 03:34:11,840
with everything else, but yeah, we got

5417
03:34:11,840 --> 03:34:12,960
to figure out the general.

5418
03:34:12,960 --> 03:34:14,080
>> So, thank you for bringing [laughter]

5419
03:34:14,080 --> 03:34:17,120
that up. So, are we still sitting to

5420
03:34:17,120 --> 03:34:18,880
where we want to do a couple separate

5421
03:34:18,880 --> 03:34:19,520
sessions?

5422
03:34:19,520 --> 03:34:22,160
>> If we tenatively have booked the 22nd

5423
03:34:22,160 --> 03:34:24,399
and the 29th of September for funsies,

5424
03:34:24,399 --> 03:34:27,439
but we that's definitely not set in

5425
03:34:27,439 --> 03:34:30,960
stone. But we do need some off nights so

5426
03:34:30,960 --> 03:34:33,840
we can focus maybe three hours. I like

5427
03:34:33,840 --> 03:34:35,600
the idea of focusing on, you know,

5428
03:34:35,600 --> 03:34:37,439
chapter one or chapter two just on

5429
03:34:37,439 --> 03:34:41,120
sessions and see where we go. Um I don't

5430
03:34:41,120 --> 03:34:42,960
know how we coordinate that. Mayor, I

5431
03:34:42,960 --> 03:34:44,479
don't know if we can solve that tonight.

5432
03:34:44,479 --> 03:34:45,920
I I don't know if we have the brain

5433
03:34:45,920 --> 03:34:48,000
capacity, the mental capacity to do that

5434
03:34:48,000 --> 03:34:49,200
right now.

5435
03:34:49,200 --> 03:34:51,279
>> Well, let me just throw up there. Do you

5436
03:34:51,279 --> 03:34:55,040
like the idea of uh doing it similar

5437
03:34:55,040 --> 03:34:57,520
like what we did with the budget session

5438
03:34:57,520 --> 03:35:00,880
in in separate meetings rather than

5439
03:35:00,880 --> 03:35:03,600
trying to do it in council meetings? I

5440
03:35:03,600 --> 03:35:05,120
mean we're going to bring it to council

5441
03:35:05,120 --> 03:35:07,600
meetings obviously.

5442
03:35:07,600 --> 03:35:11,040
Uh I mean the separate meetings are open

5443
03:35:11,040 --> 03:35:12,319
to the public as well too and we'll

5444
03:35:12,319 --> 03:35:14,720
bring it to council meetings for a vote

5445
03:35:14,720 --> 03:35:16,800
and that sort of thing. We don't do that

5446
03:35:16,800 --> 03:35:19,040
in the in the work sessions obviously

5447
03:35:19,040 --> 03:35:19,840
the but

5448
03:35:19,840 --> 03:35:22,000
>> but they would be work sessions

5449
03:35:22,000 --> 03:35:23,439
>> special sessions special

5450
03:35:23,439 --> 03:35:25,359
>> work session

5451
03:35:25,359 --> 03:35:29,200
>> and it'd be later like evening not early

5452
03:35:29,200 --> 03:35:30,080
afternoon right

5453
03:35:30,080 --> 03:35:32,319
>> correct

5454
03:35:32,319 --> 03:35:34,720
>> I am going to identify that last week of

5455
03:35:34,720 --> 03:35:37,520
September I will be out of town

5456
03:35:37,520 --> 03:35:39,279
>> okay

5457
03:35:39,279 --> 03:35:41,200
>> well [clears throat] mayor why don't um

5458
03:35:41,200 --> 03:35:43,279
at our Thursday meeting we throw out

5459
03:35:43,279 --> 03:35:44,960
some potential dates and Jennifer can

5460
03:35:44,960 --> 03:35:46,239
help us coordinate

5461
03:35:46,239 --> 03:35:50,239
Yeah, maybe we'll do a a poll or

5462
03:35:50,239 --> 03:35:52,399
something. See, because we'd obviously

5463
03:35:52,399 --> 03:35:54,399
would like to to have you all there.

5464
03:35:54,399 --> 03:35:55,760
>> So, you're thinking very end of

5465
03:35:55,760 --> 03:35:58,880
September, 1st of October.

5466
03:35:58,880 --> 03:36:01,439
>> Well, Councilman Banger's gone that

5467
03:36:01,439 --> 03:36:02,080
week, you said.

5468
03:36:02,080 --> 03:36:04,720
>> So, probably into October before.

5469
03:36:04,720 --> 03:36:06,720
>> Robin, are you okay with doing a deep

5470
03:36:06,720 --> 03:36:08,720
dive? I think maybe I'm misremembering.

5471
03:36:08,720 --> 03:36:10,319
I thought you wanted to do like little

5472
03:36:10,319 --> 03:36:13,200
sections. I well I'm okay as long as we

5473
03:36:13,200 --> 03:36:15,680
just go through it section by section. I

5474
03:36:15,680 --> 03:36:16,880
mean

5475
03:36:16,880 --> 03:36:18,479
>> I literally want to go through it page

5476
03:36:18,479 --> 03:36:20,080
by page. Now that doesn't mean we've got

5477
03:36:20,080 --> 03:36:22,560
something on every page, but I think

5478
03:36:22,560 --> 03:36:24,479
it's I think it's important enough that

5479
03:36:24,479 --> 03:36:28,160
we you know but I'm glad to do it all.

5480
03:36:28,160 --> 03:36:30,160
>> So we're working the week of the 20 1st

5481
03:36:30,160 --> 03:36:32,239
to the 25th of September. Councilman

5482
03:36:32,239 --> 03:36:36,880
Bangers out the 28th to the uh 2nd. Uh

5483
03:36:36,880 --> 03:36:43,600
so then then it would fall over into the 5th through the 9th of October. I

5484
03:36:43,600 --> 03:36:45,920
guess we have a council on the 6th that

5485
03:36:45,920 --> 03:36:47,920
night. So

5486
03:36:47,920 --> 03:36:50,239
anyway, that's

5487
03:36:50,239 --> 03:36:53,120
uh we'll we'll coordinate. But that's

5488
03:36:53,120 --> 03:36:55,359
probably uh we we got to get going on

5489
03:36:55,359 --> 03:36:56,399
that. So

5490
03:36:56,399 --> 03:36:57,200
>> yeah, we do.

5491
03:36:57,200 --> 03:37:00,239
>> Brent, sorry if I was taking your your

5492
03:37:00,239 --> 03:37:02,205
steam there.

5493
03:37:02,205 --> 03:37:02,640
[laughter]

5494
03:37:02,640 --> 03:37:05,680
>> You're good, mate.

5495
03:37:05,680 --> 03:37:10,080
Okay. All right. Uh any questions for uh

5496
03:37:10,080 --> 03:37:13,279
or anything else to bring up? Okay. We

5497
03:37:13,279 --> 03:37:15,840
have one last thing, but it's a close

5498
03:37:15,840 --> 03:37:19,040
session. So, I need a motion.

5499
03:37:19,040 --> 03:37:22,800
I'll make a motion that we um go into a

5500
03:37:22,800 --> 03:37:25,359
close session uh to discuss the

5501
03:37:25,359 --> 03:37:27,520
purchase, sale, exchange, or lease of

5502
03:37:27,520 --> 03:37:30,960
real property is um according to the

5503
03:37:30,960 --> 03:37:33,439
Utah code for the public for open and

5504
03:37:33,439 --> 03:37:35,520
public meetings act with no intent to

5505
03:37:35,520 --> 03:37:37,760
return to the public meeting.

5506
03:37:37,760 --> 03:37:40,319
>> Second location

5507
03:37:40,319 --> 03:37:42,880
and the location is city hall 250 North

5508
03:37:42,880 --> 03:37:45,200
Main and Senator B.

5509
03:37:45,200 --> 03:37:47,760
>> We have a second. It's a vote. Council

5510
03:37:47,760 --> 03:37:48,160
>> second.

5511
03:37:48,160 --> 03:37:54,239
>> I

5512
03:37:54,239 --> 03:37:56,160
council J. Thank you.

5513
03:37:56,160 --> 03:37:59,279
>> Need a quick breakfast.