1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:02,520 Thank you. Mr. Floor has anything. 2 00:00:02,900 --> 00:00:09,600 Just thank you to the team and budget, Francine and Gordon for pulling that all together and commissioners for your comments and feedbacks. 3 00:00:09,700 --> 00:00:12,520 We can, like said, move forward and bring some things back to you. Thank you. 4 00:00:12,620 --> 00:00:13,060 There's an open. 5 00:00:13,300 --> 00:00:15,380 I do have a comment. That's why I remind of you. 6 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:22,420 I have an answer to your question that you raised and it's right off of the property of Fraser's webpage. 7 00:00:23,080 --> 00:00:27,920 It says homeowners continue to receive the homestead exemption as well as save our homes cap. 8 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:32,360 as long as they don't claim home-study exemption elsewhere on a different 9 00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:37,100 lot until they are while they rebuild and repair their damage property. 10 00:00:37,900 --> 00:00:39,180 And there's a statutory reference. 11 00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:45,060 Okay, but does it go on to talk about once they've rebuilt? 12 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:46,640 It does. 13 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:49,340 It's all on his, the front page of his web page. 14 00:00:49,480 --> 00:00:54,100 It depends on how many, the percentage of the new building that's built. 15 00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:55,920 So it's all posted online. 16 00:00:56,920 --> 00:00:57,200 Very good. 17 00:00:57,780 --> 00:01:01,240 It's different if it's a repair versus a rebuild. 18 00:01:02,180 --> 00:01:04,900 Right, right, gotcha, thank you. 19 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:06,020 Commissioner Doigt, any comments? 20 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:07,280 Commissioner Drex? 21 00:01:07,500 --> 00:01:08,660 I have no comments, Commissioner Constance. 22 00:01:08,700 --> 00:01:09,120 Nothing, sir. 23 00:01:09,220 --> 00:01:09,700 Commissioner Doigt. 24 00:01:09,900 --> 00:01:10,560 Just good workshop. 25 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:12,280 Good news on the reserves. 26 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:13,640 Thank you. 27 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:14,100 Yep, absolutely. 28 00:01:14,860 --> 00:01:24,100 Okay, I will go in ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the 230 Charlotte County Board of 29 00:01:24,100 --> 00:01:30,000 Missioners board workshop on transportation left the record show all commissioners are still present and 30 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:31,980 Mr. Elias will you be 31 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:36,860 pledge. Oh, we're gonna do the pledge again. This talk. Okay. Yes 32 00:01:39,500 --> 00:01:47,300 I'm pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it says one nation 33 00:01:48,700 --> 00:01:54,840 Invisible liberty and justice for all you can never say the pledge enough 34 00:01:56,240 --> 00:02:00,980 Mr. Elias, you're a recognized good 35 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:07,140 afternoon commission for the record John Elias Public Works Director will be 36 00:02:07,140 --> 00:02:12,140 I'll be co-presenting this with the county engineer, Joanne Vernon. We're kind of excited about this. 37 00:02:12,280 --> 00:02:23,460 This is based on feedback that we've gotten from previous discussions with the board and Emily and administration thought that this would be a perfect opportunity to kind of kick these off and we'll do this quarterly. 38 00:02:23,460 --> 00:02:29,980 We'll have all things transportation and we can bring back anything that we get feedback or any hot topic 39 00:02:29,980 --> 00:02:37,780 We can bring it up during these discussions. So again, what we're going to be talking about today is just an overarching view of transportation 40 00:02:37,780 --> 00:02:43,340 Pretty pretty high level, but it will provide some detail and it'll also I think 41 00:02:43,340 --> 00:02:50,620 Hopefully lay out some strategies that we that we're employing and let the public know how we do these things and how they come to fruition 42 00:02:50,620 --> 00:02:53,500 And so with that, I'm kicking off with transportation. 43 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:59,540 We're going to discuss data collection and analysis, concurrency and widening projects, intersection 44 00:02:59,540 --> 00:03:02,120 improvements, and current projects and budgets. 45 00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:08,440 The first thing I would like to discuss is what we're calling roadway functional classifications. 46 00:03:09,300 --> 00:03:13,460 This is the process when streets and highways are grouped in the classes or systems, according 47 00:03:13,460 --> 00:03:15,760 to the characteristics or service they provide. 48 00:03:16,540 --> 00:03:19,920 The Florida Department of Transportation is who conducts this and they do it about 49 00:03:19,920 --> 00:03:21,560 ten years right after the census. 50 00:03:24,770 --> 00:03:27,750 The functional classifications of roadway consists of these two 51 00:03:27,750 --> 00:03:33,910 categories with the urban roadway and rural roadways having very similar classifications. Principal 52 00:03:33,910 --> 00:03:38,750 arterial, minor arterial, major collector, minor collector and local. 53 00:03:41,670 --> 00:03:42,450 As we get into this, 54 00:03:42,510 --> 00:03:46,210 we're going to provide some maps, and I want to just say that if you're the public and you're 55 00:03:46,210 --> 00:03:53,670 watching us, all the backup material has these maps, and they have blown up maps that are 56 00:03:53,670 --> 00:03:56,990 We didn't want to have so many slides, but you'll see in these maps too. 57 00:03:57,630 --> 00:04:01,810 So arterial roadways, the arterial roadway system serves as the highest degree of 58 00:04:01,810 --> 00:04:04,510 through traffic movement and the largest proportion of total travel. 59 00:04:04,830 --> 00:04:06,210 Think interstate highway systems. 60 00:04:06,770 --> 00:04:10,750 Arturials generally have higher design standards, larger lane widths and needs. 61 00:04:11,590 --> 00:04:15,750 Also, because they move that much traffic, when one gets down like it does yesterday, 62 00:04:16,050 --> 00:04:19,890 you see the effects on all the arterial and collector roads throughout the county. 63 00:04:21,430 --> 00:04:25,990 Collecter roadways are typically designed for travel at lower speeds and for shorter distances. 64 00:04:26,770 --> 00:04:31,030 Usually two lane roads that collect and distribute traffic to and from the arterial system, 65 00:04:31,390 --> 00:04:35,710 minor collectors can connect two major collector roadways and local roads. 66 00:04:36,430 --> 00:04:39,830 All roads below the collector system are considered local. 67 00:04:40,170 --> 00:04:44,570 Local roads provide the basic access between residential properties and collectors. 68 00:04:46,010 --> 00:04:49,770 Local roads represent the largest percentage of all roadways in terms of mileage. 69 00:04:49,770 --> 00:04:53,150 These are just your neighborhood road roads in front of your house. 70 00:04:56,010 --> 00:05:01,590 This map here illustrates the classification of the roadways that we have in our county. 71 00:05:01,770 --> 00:05:06,850 And again, we have this blown out in the back up material zoomed in on each portion of the county. 72 00:05:09,380 --> 00:05:12,960 With that, I'm going to turn it over to Joanne and she's going to talk about some of the data that we collect. 73 00:05:15,180 --> 00:05:16,700 Good afternoon, Joanne, for the record. 74 00:05:17,460 --> 00:05:23,780 We just wanted to kind of give you some input as to what goes into our planning process and engineering. 75 00:05:23,780 --> 00:05:26,720 So, we do some annual data collection. 76 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:31,600 We conduct traffic counts once per year on all of our collector roads. 77 00:05:31,660 --> 00:05:36,080 And we do this in segments because not all segments of any given roadway 78 00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:38,120 will have the same amount of traffic. 79 00:05:40,420 --> 00:05:42,420 We also do them on some. 80 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:44,780 If you can see we do it on 417-776. 81 00:05:45,480 --> 00:05:46,340 Those are state roads. 82 00:05:46,700 --> 00:05:50,680 We do that just so we have a better understanding of where the traffic 83 00:05:50,680 --> 00:06:00,060 going in the county with our own data. This is a map of and with the lists in that, yeah, 84 00:06:00,200 --> 00:06:05,780 the table there. But again, these are in your background information and they are blown 85 00:06:05,780 --> 00:06:12,880 up so you can tell a little better. Next we're going to go into roadway level service. It's 86 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:18,420 not the typical level service, so I want to make sure everyone understands. This is a qualitative 87 00:06:18,420 --> 00:06:24,160 that describes the operating condition of a road based on traffic volume, link capacity, and geometric 88 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:27,360 design of the road. So it basically is how full the road is. 89 00:06:27,620 --> 00:06:27,860 Yeah, Commissioner. 90 00:06:29,340 --> 00:06:32,080 Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I need you to back up a little bit. 91 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:33,860 I'll talk about classification. 92 00:06:34,460 --> 00:06:39,060 I just want to kind of spend a little time on that. 93 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:41,140 Maybe the whole category. 94 00:06:41,140 --> 00:06:49,240 I understand you, which said every 10 years, FDOT looks at the system and defines whether 95 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:55,540 they move from minor collector to major collector, arterial, whatever. 96 00:06:57,220 --> 00:06:59,080 It all kind of boils down to funding. 97 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:00,060 This is where I'm headed. 98 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:08,920 The classification is so critical as to where the revenues are going to come from to take care 99 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:16,120 that particular road. 40 something years ago, what we did annually, is check all the roads 100 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:22,680 that we were suspicious were going from a local road classification, which is probably 101 00:07:22,680 --> 00:07:28,680 somewhere under 10,000, 80, you know, average annual daily traffic. 102 00:07:29,020 --> 00:07:33,060 Once it hit 10,000, it jumped into our collector road status. 103 00:07:33,060 --> 00:07:36,840 Not, it became a road and bird road, yes, that's right. 104 00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:44,720 So, what do we do now relative to, what triggers it to go from a local street to a collector 105 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:44,900 road? 106 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,020 So, I should have mentioned it. 107 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:52,200 When I went and said we did collections on all of our collector roads, we do an additional 108 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:55,040 account on some of those roads exactly what you're talking about. 109 00:07:55,040 --> 00:08:01,140 We see a district, we see a district traffic, and we have input, when FDOT does this, we 110 00:08:01,140 --> 00:08:06,840 have input and we have said to them, hey, let's look at this road, here's our numbers that 111 00:08:06,840 --> 00:08:09,500 we're getting should this not be a collector road. 112 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:16,760 So we do provide input to DOT at the time when they're doing their process. 113 00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:22,940 I guess what I'm trying to head to is that looking at the revenues for gas taxes, they're 114 00:08:22,940 --> 00:08:30,200 not looking very good, what can we do relative to changing the methodology for this? 115 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:54,720 Because, I think, quite honestly, we've got within neighborhoods, and I can identify certain roads in D-create as an example, that might be maintained now under the road and bridge, or gas tax funding, that might be better off being classified as a, I'm going to call it a local collector as opposed to an FDOT collector, which would be funded then out of the MSVU system. 116 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:56,480 D-create is exactly. 117 00:08:56,900 --> 00:08:59,840 Was Anglewood East Gulf Stream? 118 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:00,520 Gulf Stream? 119 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:02,700 Which is very sunny, bro, it's been a curve. 120 00:09:02,980 --> 00:09:05,140 Maybe you're funding now, their gas tax road. 121 00:09:05,260 --> 00:09:05,980 Some of them are. 122 00:09:05,980 --> 00:09:06,700 Some of them are. 123 00:09:06,700 --> 00:09:07,060 So what? 124 00:09:07,340 --> 00:09:10,880 Because we're such, so challenge with the revenues and gas taxes commissioners, 125 00:09:10,980 --> 00:09:13,580 I'm just trying to think of a way to do some shifting on that. 126 00:09:13,780 --> 00:09:14,000 That's all. 127 00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:15,260 So if I could speak to that. 128 00:09:15,740 --> 00:09:17,140 So to your very point, 129 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:20,280 there's this little clause in the ordinance, 130 00:09:20,700 --> 00:09:22,440 which was weird when I first got in this position. 131 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:26,600 Basically, Joanne or I can classify a road as a road and bridge road. 132 00:09:27,940 --> 00:09:31,140 No other determination, like it's that. 133 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:33,200 So what's happened over the years? 134 00:09:33,500 --> 00:09:35,660 And we started to take a deep dive into this. 135 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:38,460 I'm going to say two years before I got this job. 136 00:09:38,580 --> 00:09:43,900 We were like, hey, let's look at this because the funding was coming in so flat on road and bridge roads. 137 00:09:44,340 --> 00:09:46,880 And Gordon's made some adjustments that really helped us on that. 138 00:09:47,120 --> 00:09:51,900 But what was happening is we had roads that just get put into a road and bridge classification. 139 00:09:51,900 --> 00:09:58,340 and nobody, like, looked at it, I can sailor's way over there between 776, it comes up, oh yeah, 140 00:09:58,420 --> 00:10:00,020 that's a road and bridge road. 141 00:10:00,460 --> 00:10:06,080 It's like, and it's just kind of weird, but it does connect, it does connect to two major roads. 142 00:10:06,460 --> 00:10:12,420 Yeah, there was some logic to it, but when we started to get on this route, at the time, the fun 143 00:10:12,420 --> 00:10:18,500 was so restricted that our concern was that we were going to add more to the inventory and possibly 144 00:10:18,500 --> 00:10:23,420 take some off, but the reality is, we didn't have the funding, it was so flat that it wouldn't 145 00:10:23,420 --> 00:10:24,280 have made sense to do that. 146 00:10:24,460 --> 00:10:30,580 So are you an agreement, though, that if, in fact, we can look at classification on some 147 00:10:30,580 --> 00:10:34,840 of these rows that are currently classified as collector roads, road and bridge roads, 148 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:41,880 gas tax roads, but might be able to be shifted into a local collector category as opposed 149 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:43,640 to an FDOT classification. 150 00:10:44,780 --> 00:10:45,680 I don't know if you can do that. 151 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:47,260 We're in complete agreement on that. 152 00:10:47,260 --> 00:10:49,960 to take them off that load for gas taxes. 153 00:10:50,020 --> 00:10:50,940 Yes, for sure. 154 00:10:51,340 --> 00:10:52,600 But further to your point, 155 00:10:52,680 --> 00:10:54,240 and we've had this discussion previously, 156 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:57,340 where we look at roads like, 157 00:10:57,460 --> 00:10:58,840 just if you live in Port Charlotte, 158 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:01,240 you got Dorchester, Kensington, 159 00:11:01,820 --> 00:11:04,960 Beacon, all those roads, Orlando, Santa. 160 00:11:05,380 --> 00:11:05,900 Yeah, quesada. 161 00:11:06,560 --> 00:11:08,540 All those roads are collectors, 162 00:11:09,520 --> 00:11:12,580 but in theory, they're not necessarily, 163 00:11:12,780 --> 00:11:14,460 but we're taking counts on them in monitor, 164 00:11:14,660 --> 00:11:17,100 but they're what I would call a local collect. 165 00:11:17,100 --> 00:11:22,340 that's what we would be funded by an MSPU, possibly as opposed to Chris, but they're currently 166 00:11:22,340 --> 00:11:23,180 maintained by a guy. 167 00:11:24,140 --> 00:11:24,580 Some of them. 168 00:11:24,580 --> 00:11:25,220 Some of them aren't. 169 00:11:25,300 --> 00:11:25,680 Some of them aren't. 170 00:11:26,700 --> 00:11:27,200 Sorry, Commissioner. 171 00:11:28,060 --> 00:11:31,880 That's where I'm heading though, is there's a revenue problem with the road and bridge, right? 172 00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:34,220 So can we solve that somehow? 173 00:11:34,560 --> 00:11:35,500 A roadway classification. 174 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:40,640 Well, and again, Gordon would that shift to take some of the stuff that we were charging 175 00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:44,380 out of that and he's made a several adjustments to help us with that, but I still don't 176 00:11:44,380 --> 00:11:47,000 think that it's going to end up having what we can add a bunch of roads. 177 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:51,700 under the road and bridge. That's what I was feeling. Thank you very much. 178 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:53,680 Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 179 00:11:54,560 --> 00:12:01,180 To the revenue side, there is discussion in Washington about figuring out a way to 180 00:12:01,180 --> 00:12:06,220 tax electric vehicles where we don't get the gas tax now. So I don't think it's going 181 00:12:06,220 --> 00:12:10,180 to happen this year, but we should keep our eye on that language to see what it says to 182 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:16,280 require. You know, we have to have in place to be able to collect that. 183 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:17,720 What are requirements going to be? 184 00:12:18,100 --> 00:12:19,740 Because there may be something totally different 185 00:12:19,740 --> 00:12:21,740 that maybe we need more collector roads 186 00:12:21,740 --> 00:12:23,380 or maybe I don't know. 187 00:12:23,740 --> 00:12:25,940 The interesting thing is it relates to electric vehicles. 188 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:29,560 You're seeing a big shift in FDOD design standards. 189 00:12:29,980 --> 00:12:31,800 They're having a reevaluate guardrail systems. 190 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:33,120 They're much heavier and lower. 191 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:35,240 And they sweep right through guardrails with it. 192 00:12:35,340 --> 00:12:36,800 We're historically stopping cars. 193 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:39,140 So they're having to look at all those type of things. 194 00:12:39,460 --> 00:12:40,040 Virges too. 195 00:12:40,140 --> 00:12:40,720 Virges too. 196 00:12:41,240 --> 00:12:43,200 We'll be having two guardrails. 197 00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:44,180 Yeah, yeah. 198 00:12:44,560 --> 00:12:44,960 Let's go ahead. 199 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:52,660 You guys can be more proactive in setting your definitions and we've done that. 200 00:12:53,040 --> 00:12:59,800 One of the examples I think was Cornelius, Cornelius was becoming like a local collector 201 00:12:59,800 --> 00:13:09,320 because we had trucks taking a little bit of a shortcut going from 776 to 41 or from 41 to 776. 202 00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:17,160 And then we change that in response to the neighbors, we change that, and we put no more trucks. 203 00:13:18,060 --> 00:13:20,480 Now, does that change the definition of the road? 204 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:26,680 Or is that, you know, that could be part of our plan until the area builds out heavily, 205 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:29,500 and then the traffic is going to automatically increase. 206 00:13:29,820 --> 00:13:32,360 But how do you approach that pragmatically? 207 00:13:32,860 --> 00:13:36,720 So I think that's what this, the beauty of what these presentations are going to do. 208 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:40,000 We're going to kind of talk about all that on high level and then we can get into the 209 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:43,540 weeds in future topics about like, hey, how we're going to address this. 210 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:49,160 So you take the example you gave Cornelius, was one Biscayne Chamberlain, Zeml, all those 211 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:53,540 roads over time become kind of like major roads to get you through areas. 212 00:13:53,860 --> 00:13:55,360 So all that we have to look at. 213 00:13:55,540 --> 00:13:58,540 And Commissioner Dordi had brought this up at a previous meeting. 214 00:13:59,380 --> 00:14:05,800 And the challenge we have, the huge challenge we have besides the funding, which we kind 215 00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:10,460 to touch on is that our whole areas you can see in this map is plated and laid out. 216 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:15,640 Now, GD did think of areas where they have like harbor boulevard, where you got those 217 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:21,080 hundred foot, hundred, twenty foot rightaways, sand hill, places like that where the premise 218 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:24,920 was probably like, hey, this is going to be something that we can expand in the future. 219 00:14:25,260 --> 00:14:31,000 But the vast majority of the county is a local road and unless you're going in to buy swallows 220 00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:35,480 of houses to expand a road, that's the challenge we're impacted by right now. 221 00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:41,160 But you guys, you have to be on the top of your game because things are going to change. 222 00:14:41,900 --> 00:14:46,880 And a major road project, and we know this, whether we're looking at Edgewater, or whether we're 223 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:50,800 hovering, you know, major road changes take a lot of years. 224 00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:57,880 Right now we should be looking on the drawing board at widening Harbour Boulevard from 41. 225 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:10,780 Now, just to edgeward all the way, the beach complex, because in what three, four, five years, the beach complex is going to be rebuilt and barring another major hurricane. 226 00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:19,360 It's going to be up and running, and with a new full and with a new center that the community is going to be using, and we can straighten out a few curves. 227 00:15:19,700 --> 00:15:29,860 But if we want to see that happen in 10 years, we have to start it now. So you sort of need a crystal ball. And I'll take, and I think I may have said this well, an MPO meeting. 228 00:15:29,860 --> 00:15:36,700 not here. The access road on 41 is not going to be there in 25 years. We all know that. 229 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:41,320 At some point, that's going to be gone. You know, put to the court, it's got a problem. What 230 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:45,920 happens on the traffic gets over the bridge, and we've talked about something so that too. 231 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:52,500 But so I don't know how you keep ahead of it other than traffic counts and looking at new 232 00:15:52,500 --> 00:15:57,440 developments. So Commissioner, to first off respond, we are definitely on our game. We're going 233 00:15:57,440 --> 00:16:02,500 present that in this presentation and we're going to kind of walk through why how we plan 234 00:16:02,500 --> 00:16:03,040 it. 235 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:08,840 What steps we take in the plan and then the challenge you all have is balancing the funding 236 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:14,740 of 200, 300 million dollars worth of road projects versus fire stations, parks and utilities 237 00:16:14,740 --> 00:16:15,160 stuff. 238 00:16:15,420 --> 00:16:17,840 So that's literally what this presentation will walk through. 239 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:19,400 We're not putting a toll both. 240 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:23,000 I told you from one of the roads also in the place. 241 00:16:23,260 --> 00:16:24,000 Do we cover this up? 242 00:16:30,540 --> 00:16:30,800 Yeah. 243 00:16:30,800 --> 00:16:33,260 OK, so back to roadway level service. 244 00:16:33,860 --> 00:16:36,820 So again, the roadway level service really boils down 245 00:16:36,820 --> 00:16:38,220 to how full the road is. 246 00:16:38,820 --> 00:16:41,520 And the level service of a facility of a roadway 247 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:43,640 is designated with the letter of A to F, 248 00:16:43,860 --> 00:16:46,220 with A representing the best and F being the worst. 249 00:16:46,820 --> 00:16:48,240 This is a national standard. 250 00:16:49,340 --> 00:16:52,800 Ironically, DOT really only for the most part 251 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:55,320 does C and D and I'll explain that in a bit. 252 00:16:56,020 --> 00:16:58,160 Charlotte County adopted the level service D, 253 00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:02,200 and staff uses the FDOT methods that determine the level of service. 254 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:05,900 We do this for both the current level of service and for projecting 255 00:17:05,900 --> 00:17:08,340 for failure level of service roadway segments. 256 00:17:10,700 --> 00:17:13,320 This, I know this is hard to read and I apologize again. 257 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:17,840 This is a list of all the roads where we collect the data. 258 00:17:18,540 --> 00:17:20,040 This is in your packet. 259 00:17:20,300 --> 00:17:22,740 I just want to blow it up enough to maybe be able to see. 260 00:17:23,460 --> 00:17:26,840 So we collect the raw data on all these road segments. 261 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:33,960 And then there's a fun calculation that you do to get the average annual daily trip. 262 00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:39,500 And then from there, there's another calculation you do to get the peak hour and that's when you go by. 263 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:45,940 And then from the peak hour of every segment, you look and see what you get for the level C, 264 00:17:46,380 --> 00:17:49,140 or the level of service C and level of service D. 265 00:17:49,740 --> 00:17:55,220 And you can determine where you are in your cycle. 266 00:17:55,220 --> 00:18:01,160 So here we also give a percentage of capacity for each roadway of that peak hour. 267 00:18:02,380 --> 00:18:09,940 Now, because DOT basically only does level service C&D, most of our roadways are actually 268 00:18:09,940 --> 00:18:14,480 better than C, but if you look, they say level C. It's a sub-memic sense. 269 00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:21,240 So they're basically saying, if it's better than C, you're in good shape, why even be concerned 270 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:21,900 about it. 271 00:18:23,380 --> 00:18:29,280 So, we did want to mention that roadways may temporarily fall below a doctor level service. 272 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:31,760 Traffic patterns could change into various reasons. 273 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:35,800 A good example is when we did edge water, the roadway was closed for several years. 274 00:18:36,180 --> 00:18:37,740 That traffic had to go somewhere else. 275 00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:43,560 And during that time, midway had a lot more traffic than it currently sees now. 276 00:18:45,460 --> 00:18:49,000 Again, segments of roadways can fall below the level of service. 277 00:18:49,020 --> 00:18:50,980 They're not all the same, which is why we do segments. 278 00:18:50,980 --> 00:18:53,440 And that's an example of Edgewater completely. 279 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:55,360 We've done them in phases. 280 00:18:56,140 --> 00:18:57,180 It's not all done at once. 281 00:18:58,460 --> 00:19:00,560 And the last thing is just because of Roeway Falls, 282 00:19:00,980 --> 00:19:02,520 below a Dr. Level Service immediately, 283 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:04,320 what doesn't mean we have to take action. 284 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:06,080 It's a planning tool. 285 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:09,040 And we don't just look at that completely. 286 00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:11,140 We kind of look at that over a couple of years 287 00:19:11,140 --> 00:19:12,740 to make sure there was nothing else going on 288 00:19:12,740 --> 00:19:14,620 at the time that maybe we collected the data 289 00:19:15,500 --> 00:19:17,380 and we plan accordingly. 290 00:19:18,500 --> 00:19:21,160 Why do we look at projected roadway of services? 291 00:19:22,280 --> 00:19:27,820 So how we do this is, projects are done based on the current level of service and then a calculation with the projection factor. 292 00:19:28,220 --> 00:19:34,360 The projection factor is different based on the area where the roadway is. 293 00:19:34,700 --> 00:19:37,140 For example, right now, burnt store road. 294 00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:39,940 We all know there's a bunch of developments going there. 295 00:19:40,180 --> 00:19:43,140 So that projection factor is way higher than in other areas of the county. 296 00:19:44,360 --> 00:19:52,480 We evaluate the projected level service yearly to make sure that as market change, if you remember, at one point, 297 00:19:52,860 --> 00:20:01,020 Brent Saw Road is going to fail a long time ago, and then the market crashed, that expanded the life of the roadway further. 298 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:09,080 So we keep looking at it to make sure. When we do these projected levels of service, this is how we get the information to put on our CNA. 299 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:19,160 So it goes on the CNA based on projections and then we still keep an eye on it and keep an eye on it and then as we get closer and we have a better understanding than it gets on our CIP. 300 00:20:21,750 --> 00:20:27,850 So currently, Charlotte County has two roadway segments that fall below the adoptive level service. 301 00:20:27,970 --> 00:20:38,870 It's King's Highway between San Hill and the Soto County line and San Hill between King's Highway Deep Creek and we currently have projects where they're under design and we'll go to construction on these. 302 00:20:39,970 --> 00:20:47,290 We also have seven roadways segments that are projected to fail in the next 15 years. 303 00:20:47,650 --> 00:20:50,070 It's edge water between midway and calling swim. 304 00:20:50,370 --> 00:20:52,270 Edge water between calling swim 76. 305 00:20:53,810 --> 00:20:56,450 Harborview, phase one and phase two. 306 00:20:57,070 --> 00:20:59,950 In 2030, Bert's sort of road is projected to fail. 307 00:21:00,070 --> 00:21:02,270 This is when we bring on the East West connector. 308 00:21:02,990 --> 00:21:06,610 That will alleviate the traffic on Brent's sort of road. 309 00:21:06,610 --> 00:21:11,250 But then it will again fail in 2040 and that's only six-lane it and Taylor wrote a 310 00:21:11,250 --> 00:21:12,950 projected to fail in 2034. 311 00:21:14,730 --> 00:21:14,730 So, 312 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:20,160 so before we move on to intersection improvements just to touch on this. 313 00:21:20,460 --> 00:21:25,320 So what you see by the data that we collect, we are looking at all those things to your point 314 00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:29,440 commissioner do it and we're looking at projections and adding that into the mix. 315 00:21:30,060 --> 00:21:33,960 Something that commissioner to say it said previously and I'm not trying to be like, 316 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:38,820 I just want to manage the public's expectation here is that if you've lived here in a 317 00:21:38,820 --> 00:21:44,260 amount of time, I've worked for the county for 36 years, lived here since 83, it's never 318 00:21:44,260 --> 00:21:50,280 going to be like it was in the 80s, it's never going to be like it's in the 90s and yesterday 319 00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:54,440 is a prime example, when there's an accident on the interstate and all that traffic gets pushed, 320 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:59,840 our people are scrambling to get signal timings open so that it prioritizes veterans and 41 in 321 00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:06,900 areas, but traffic is worse than it's ever been and it's only going to get more congestion 322 00:22:06,900 --> 00:22:11,560 as we move forward. So that's why it's important that we're taking the time to look at 323 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:17,560 this data and build these roadways ahead of it. And I say ahead of it, probably incorrectly, 324 00:22:17,820 --> 00:22:22,120 because that's another thing I want to touch on. Commissioner that you had mentioned that we 325 00:22:22,120 --> 00:22:27,020 need to be thinking ahead, we're definitely thinking ahead. But if we think too far ahead, 326 00:22:27,020 --> 00:22:32,380 the challenge that we have as an agency and specifically with us is we don't want to try to 327 00:22:32,380 --> 00:22:37,040 build a road ahead of development. That seems like somebody would be like hey, the reality is 328 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:40,620 you're putting the burden on the people that live here to build the road instead of having the 329 00:22:40,620 --> 00:22:46,240 development that's going to impact it pay for those things. So it's a balance and then further you're 330 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:51,360 going to see further in the presentation. The other element that comes into play here is funding. 331 00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:56,440 You just talk, the roads we're talking about just on this page right here, well, probably 332 00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:57,740 in excess of $300 million. 333 00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:01,580 So there's significant funding challenges that come with this. 334 00:23:01,660 --> 00:23:07,080 And again, striking the balance of when it's, when we can do it versus how we're funding 335 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:10,860 it and making the development that's impacting it, do impact these pay first up. 336 00:23:11,580 --> 00:23:16,440 The other thing that I want to just come back and stress on one more time is, again, with 337 00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:17,740 the way that we're laid out. 338 00:23:17,740 --> 00:23:24,700 And I always use this example, where my daughter lives in North Carolina, it's has the same population 339 00:23:24,700 --> 00:23:29,420 explosion that we're experiencing here, but there's nothing planet, so planned developments come in 340 00:23:30,260 --> 00:23:35,100 and they build these major corridors between everything, shopping centers and all that. We're 341 00:23:35,100 --> 00:23:38,940 settled with the developed and you mentioned it in the last presentation. We have all these undeveloped 342 00:23:38,940 --> 00:23:44,240 lots and as they infill, unless we're buying up those lots and just planning major roads to them, 343 00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:48,020 we can't we can't put roads where there's already planned houses unless we're planning on 344 00:23:48,020 --> 00:23:52,180 buying houses. So that is that is another challenge that we face as a community with the 345 00:23:52,180 --> 00:23:55,980 way this community was planted. So I just wanted to stress that. 346 00:23:56,040 --> 00:24:01,040 Yeah, I had a question for you, John. A lot of these on this slide, I mean, a lot of these things 347 00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:05,700 were addressing. So I mean, which is the good news isn't the hopper. I mean, we're pulling 348 00:24:05,700 --> 00:24:13,120 together funding sources. This was before my time, but Burnstore Road, this six-lane. I'm going 349 00:24:13,120 --> 00:24:18,360 I guess that that's coming out of the existing median and you've already provided for stormwater. 350 00:24:18,980 --> 00:24:23,600 So, Commissioner to your point, that's what we want to illustrate with these slides, is the 351 00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:27,200 roads that are in failure, we've already got projects planned for, the roads that are in 352 00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,720 eminent failure, we've got projects that are already in queue and to your point when we built 353 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:37,160 burnt store, we literally designed it so that the lanes can be built within and the stormwater 354 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:39,840 is already addressed and it can just be added to the existing template. 355 00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:44,080 You know, talking about saving tens of millions of dollars, that's huge. 356 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:45,220 That's good to hear. 357 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:46,080 Thank you, sir. 358 00:24:48,940 --> 00:24:49,100 Okay. 359 00:24:49,360 --> 00:24:53,340 So next, the other thing that we review and plan for intersection improvements. 360 00:24:54,620 --> 00:24:56,660 So intersections are study for a variety of reasons. 361 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:02,680 And the studies that I'm talking about are studies that we do based on regular traffic 362 00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:07,720 or the inflow, not the same studies that this developments do as they come in 363 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:13,060 and have to provide improvements based on their own development impacts. 364 00:25:14,140 --> 00:25:15,100 So why do we do this? 365 00:25:15,140 --> 00:25:19,980 We do this when we see traffic volumes increase and crash volumes increase 366 00:25:19,980 --> 00:25:21,480 or we get complaints from citizens. 367 00:25:23,950 --> 00:25:24,770 What goes into it? 368 00:25:24,770 --> 00:25:25,790 We collect some data. 369 00:25:26,650 --> 00:25:31,390 We do traffic counts, turning motions, crashes, how many and what type 370 00:25:31,390 --> 00:25:33,370 and pedestrian and bicycle movements. 371 00:25:34,010 --> 00:25:35,430 And then we analyze the data. 372 00:25:35,430 --> 00:25:43,650 These standard transportation engineering practices and FDOC guidelines and out of that will come recommendations some of the recommendations may be nothing 373 00:25:43,650 --> 00:25:45,370 needed at the time or 374 00:25:45,370 --> 00:25:47,070 recommendations of 375 00:25:47,610 --> 00:25:52,910 Whatever might come out of it. I also did want to mention that staff is looking into AI software 376 00:25:52,910 --> 00:25:56,730 To help with this planning and alternatives. It's come a long way 377 00:25:56,730 --> 00:26:03,170 We're not sure it's completely there yet, but we'd but it we'd like everything where the data is all inputted 378 00:26:03,170 --> 00:26:09,410 It's all in one place, and they spit out some recommendations that we can look into and see if it's viable. 379 00:26:10,250 --> 00:26:22,370 Just as an example, though, some of the software that we're already utilizing is, in the day, when you had a personal analyzing and intersection, it was a physical person sitting there and taking counts and turn movements and what types of vehicles. 380 00:26:22,770 --> 00:26:29,830 We have software now in cameras that analyze all that, give you pedestrian movements, what's happening, and it spits that into a category. 381 00:26:29,830 --> 00:26:36,830 The stuff we're talking about is for future is even stuff like intersections that are doing real-time micro adjustments to stuff 382 00:26:36,830 --> 00:26:41,030 And again, the technologies there, but we don't want to be the cutting edge of it 383 00:26:41,030 --> 00:26:44,450 We want to make sure that it works for us and we're managing it appropriately 384 00:26:45,690 --> 00:26:46,990 Can you make me come? 385 00:26:47,290 --> 00:26:49,010 Yes, yes, thank you, Mr. Chair 386 00:26:49,010 --> 00:26:58,410 I agree. I'm never a bleeding edge person, but I am a leading edge person and I got to tell you this is the one area where I believe we need to be leaning in 387 00:26:58,410 --> 00:27:08,430 We really do because I'm a victim of bad traffic light timing of just I see problems all the time 388 00:27:08,430 --> 00:27:14,450 I'm you know, I don't like to bother you. I you know when I do I always like tell Hector I'm bothering John again 389 00:27:14,450 --> 00:27:19,910 But I just think it's important, you know, the five of us drive around and you're staff driver 390 00:27:19,910 --> 00:27:24,390 When you start seeing things, you know, reporting back. We have to be the eyes and ears 391 00:27:24,390 --> 00:27:31,770 But there's got to be a better way, and five years ago, or more, because when we were doing 392 00:27:31,770 --> 00:27:39,130 MCORES, which went nowhere, we did have a lot of really good people weighing in on the technology 393 00:27:39,130 --> 00:27:46,450 and stuff that they were doing back then, I mean, it absolutely, now what's going on, that 394 00:27:46,450 --> 00:27:51,250 pales and comparison to what is now available that we've gotten into this AI stuff. 395 00:27:51,250 --> 00:28:01,610 So, and we've seen all kinds of interesting things talk about pedestrians and pedestrian tracking and vehicle tracking and all the stuff that can be done on the law enforcement side. 396 00:28:02,210 --> 00:28:13,150 So, it's so sophisticated now that I really think, again, we should be leaning in to try to figure out, especially for hotspots. 397 00:28:13,150 --> 00:28:20,070 You know, talking about sandhill and King's Highway and 75 in those areas up there, a better job has to be done. 398 00:28:20,250 --> 00:28:25,210 I mean, I guess the volumes are so high, you can just, at certain points, just do timing, 399 00:28:25,430 --> 00:28:30,710 because you're never going to have a death of vehicles, but there's other things on 41, 400 00:28:31,090 --> 00:28:35,970 where we're doing those timing changes, where we hit night hours, 401 00:28:36,410 --> 00:28:41,670 where I just think we could be doing a better job with sensors, showing and anticipating, 402 00:28:41,670 --> 00:28:47,390 and setting it up so that there are, you know, movements of cars coming through where you don't 403 00:28:47,390 --> 00:28:54,170 allow the side card to trip just yet on demand until the bulk of cars comes through and then you can 404 00:28:54,170 --> 00:28:58,110 trip a whole bunch of them because there's no cars coming. Let all that's, you know, so we're not 405 00:28:58,110 --> 00:29:02,150 doing that. We're not taking advantage of it. And it just thinks that that's something that would 406 00:29:02,150 --> 00:29:06,710 improve quality of life. Commissioner, we couldn't, I couldn't agree more. Some of the challenges 407 00:29:06,710 --> 00:29:10,450 that are making sure that FDOT is on board with the program because a lot of those 408 00:29:10,450 --> 00:29:12,730 intersection you're talking about are FEOT controlled through. 409 00:29:12,970 --> 00:29:15,810 The other element to that is, 410 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,160 I was at my office over here around the corner just for 411 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:24,680 pre-agenda and I had to get over here and I'm like, I should have plenty of time. 412 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:28,740 I got this in the intersection and there's a person sitting between both lanes. 413 00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:31,420 It's not sure whether they're going to go and just went through a cycle of lights waiting 414 00:29:31,420 --> 00:29:32,900 to figure out where he was going to go. 415 00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:34,680 Well, I'm going to go back losing my mind. 416 00:29:36,020 --> 00:29:42,480 So there's always going to be the element that the human factors can put a wrench in 417 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:48,300 pedestrian movements, talking with chief about emergency priority vehicles, that can 418 00:29:48,300 --> 00:29:52,080 be that concept things up, but I couldn't agree more of the other challenge that we've 419 00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:57,800 had that just seems like we keep getting beat down is hurricanes require all new equipment 420 00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,980 and then making sure that the equipment... 421 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:04,060 And when we do get this new technology, it's inevitable as the equipment we have, where if there 422 00:30:04,060 --> 00:30:08,800 is a power surge, it's ugly, the lights go in flash, but they automatically reset themselves 423 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:12,380 and with the new technology, a lot of it's more sensitive, so we want to make sure that 424 00:30:12,380 --> 00:30:15,720 that stuff works appropriately. Sorry, but we couldn't agree with you more. 425 00:30:15,860 --> 00:30:22,700 I appreciate it. So I mean, if you can, as options come forward, sort of stay in touch with 426 00:30:22,700 --> 00:30:28,240 us, and even I may bring this up on the 31st at the MPO meeting, as I think, to your point, 427 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:33,960 FDOT needs to be aware that we're ready to be sort of a little more on the leading edge here. 428 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:39,220 Just if it's out there, we don't mind being in the test case if they want to try some stuff out. 429 00:30:39,780 --> 00:30:40,180 So, thank you. 430 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:40,900 Thank you. 431 00:30:40,900 --> 00:30:41,820 Mr. Rooker, 432 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:50,600 I think we have to keep on FDOT to keep up the signification. 433 00:30:50,660 --> 00:30:53,720 It should be changed, for example, on 41 for weekends. 434 00:30:54,980 --> 00:30:58,660 And, you know, the three or four bad locations we keep talking about, 435 00:30:58,660 --> 00:31:03,880 and they back up and, you know, and I can mention them, but you've heard them a lot 436 00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:09,640 of where there is forest Nelson and 41, or whether it's copper or 776 in Flamingo. 437 00:31:09,900 --> 00:31:14,260 I mean, that lights like two and a half minutes. When you make the turn in Flamingo straight, 438 00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:19,460 it's red. It's going to still be red, but if I need to write down the road, you know, 439 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:25,220 so, but I think we have to keep afloat. And the other question I have, it's a challenge and I 440 00:31:25,220 --> 00:31:28,700 I wonder how you can do this also by signification perhaps. 441 00:31:29,540 --> 00:31:35,060 Do we make any adjustments in your planning for the fact 442 00:31:35,060 --> 00:31:40,380 that we have intensity of traffic on our roads, 443 00:31:40,660 --> 00:31:42,220 various, for example? 444 00:31:42,540 --> 00:31:46,660 It's pretty not bad driver around here between the end of May 445 00:31:46,660 --> 00:31:51,040 and the end of August, driving is pretty not really bad at all. 446 00:31:51,700 --> 00:31:54,880 Do we try to consider that and make any adjustments 447 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:57,000 and what we do for the snowboard traffic. 448 00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,000 In short, of course we do, for sure. 449 00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:01,120 The other thing I would just like to touch on 450 00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:02,580 is in the one you bring up was like, 451 00:32:02,660 --> 00:32:06,760 Flamingo, again, contingent 452 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:08,000 of hung where you're coming from, 453 00:32:08,140 --> 00:32:09,580 as you're approaching 776, 454 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:11,420 you're like, I've waited two and a half minutes 455 00:32:11,420 --> 00:32:12,080 for this light. 456 00:32:12,380 --> 00:32:15,580 If you're on 776, you're one in the movement 457 00:32:15,580 --> 00:32:18,580 on 776 to be the priority over the singular road 458 00:32:18,580 --> 00:32:19,900 off Flamingo coming off of it. 459 00:32:20,020 --> 00:32:22,180 So it's striking that balance to get traffic moving, 460 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:24,200 but to not hold traffic up on the major quarter. 461 00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:31,320 but the light, a cauldron, with traffic heading west, controls that and if somehow they could talk 462 00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:37,020 to each other, when there is, because I've sat there many times and there's like no traffic 463 00:32:37,020 --> 00:32:39,740 and the light's still red, the same as far as Nelson. 464 00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:44,520 And when the schools get out, for example, you know, they have the Christian school up 465 00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:45,920 at far as Nelson and Crossella. 466 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:53,760 So, and I've been there on occasion, you know, and this 1015 cars waiting to get on to 41 467 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,420 And you'll look and see, maybe one or two cars are going by, I'm 41. 468 00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:01,820 And it's pressure to, you know, with the intelligence we have now. 469 00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:03,580 We can gather that material. 470 00:33:04,740 --> 00:33:09,220 And lastly, you know, we talk about our automated cars. 471 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:13,980 We've been talking about this for a while, maybe not moving as quickly as we think is. 472 00:33:14,300 --> 00:33:19,980 How is that, how do you work that in, in future planning, and how do you deal with that 473 00:33:19,980 --> 00:33:22,000 when we really don't know what's happening? 474 00:33:22,540 --> 00:33:28,880 We're not diving into the automated cars in this presentation, but I will say that you'd 475 00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:34,220 be surprised that data that we collect, that we get from cars that the cars are already 476 00:33:34,220 --> 00:33:38,000 talking with the equipment that we have, so that that stuff is already built in the cars 477 00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:42,060 right now, and it only gets more advanced as time goes by. 478 00:33:44,990 --> 00:33:49,610 Well speaking of 776, the turn lanes can't get installed fast enough at the stadium. 479 00:33:49,610 --> 00:33:57,350 it is, it is a mess during game time and on another note if I'm observing what I think I'm 480 00:33:57,350 --> 00:34:02,330 observing, we're going to have new signalizations, well at least the state will, to coordinate 481 00:34:02,330 --> 00:34:08,310 in front of Sunseek. I saw one foundation for a master arm go in in front of Sunseek or 482 00:34:08,310 --> 00:34:12,250 they're working on the other one today across the street, so that's going to come online, 483 00:34:12,590 --> 00:34:16,270 sit very shortly. And if you all remember, we have a study that we're going to be doing between 484 00:34:16,270 --> 00:34:20,350 I went in the bridge and it'll probably be set coming up here in the next couple months. 485 00:34:20,430 --> 00:34:20,970 I'll be on the way. 486 00:34:21,410 --> 00:34:21,570 Thanks. 487 00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:24,160 Okay. 488 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:27,340 So this is just an example of a map. 489 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:35,660 This was actually done as part of the MPO initiative that they got a grant for safe for all grant. 490 00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,940 And included in your packet, it wasn't just automobiles. 491 00:34:39,020 --> 00:34:46,300 There was one for motorcycles, pedestrians, and bicycles, but as much as I hate this map. 492 00:34:46,300 --> 00:34:55,700 It also is a good show and a visual of where we can see where the issues are and helps us with our data collection. 493 00:34:57,100 --> 00:34:59,960 So how do we prioritize intersection improvements? 494 00:35:00,420 --> 00:35:02,020 We do that by traffic volumes. 495 00:35:02,580 --> 00:35:04,320 We want to move traffic as much as possible. 496 00:35:04,980 --> 00:35:05,720 Crash data. 497 00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:07,460 We want to keep people safe as possible. 498 00:35:08,260 --> 00:35:09,620 We, of course, we have to look at the funding. 499 00:35:09,620 --> 00:35:16,820 And then we also take into account policy changes and FDOT design standards, changes, that just 500 00:35:16,820 --> 00:35:22,580 means that DOT obviously sometimes they change their design standards and that may change 501 00:35:22,580 --> 00:35:28,500 what we do to an intersection, but also they may have policy changes on how they interpret 502 00:35:28,500 --> 00:35:31,740 some of the data and that helps us in our process. 503 00:35:32,720 --> 00:35:42,480 This is our priority list for intersection improvements that is currently in our CIP, so it is for the next six years. 504 00:35:46,510 --> 00:35:49,650 And then I have one more thing to talk about before I hand it over to Gordon for the budget. 505 00:35:50,090 --> 00:35:51,430 Go back to that slide. 506 00:35:52,650 --> 00:35:57,830 I thought on the priority list we had veterans at Norman Turnling. We also had an archive. 507 00:36:00,530 --> 00:36:05,150 That may not be in the next six years. I'll go double check on that. 508 00:36:05,890 --> 00:36:10,530 I thought that would be out of the, I will double tell you in the conclusion. 509 00:36:11,030 --> 00:36:13,450 Yeah, I know, but this was being our cut, too. 510 00:36:13,690 --> 00:36:14,190 I'll double tell you. 511 00:36:14,190 --> 00:36:16,070 Yeah, that's what I was questioning, thank you. 512 00:36:17,410 --> 00:36:22,090 If I can, before we get into the, I'll let go of joint touch on this, but the other thing 513 00:36:22,090 --> 00:36:23,390 I want to touch on with intersections, 514 00:36:25,510 --> 00:36:27,450 we hear the public when they're saying, hey, we 515 00:36:27,450 --> 00:36:35,130 need intersection here, the thing that we want to impress upon folks, we know that you 516 00:36:35,130 --> 00:36:38,970 You hear this all the time how many people are going to have to get injured before we build an intersection 517 00:36:38,970 --> 00:36:43,610 We're we're looking way ahead of intersections and we don't base it on how many people are getting hurt 518 00:36:43,610 --> 00:36:48,450 The reality is if you look at that heat map people get hurt at signalized intersections every day 519 00:36:48,450 --> 00:36:54,810 So that's another thing that if we want people to understand that it that there are like against the roundabouts for example 520 00:36:55,350 --> 00:37:03,050 Roundabouts whether you like a marheadum the data supports that you don't have the tea bone collisions that are much higher injury rates 521 00:37:03,050 --> 00:37:04,430 They're glancing blows 522 00:37:04,950 --> 00:37:09,810 So, a lot of the diverging diamond intersections that you're seeing, that freak people out, 523 00:37:10,050 --> 00:37:11,670 the reality is the data supports that. 524 00:37:11,770 --> 00:37:14,470 It moves traffic and it makes accidents less critical. 525 00:37:15,010 --> 00:37:15,730 Thank you. 526 00:37:15,830 --> 00:37:16,590 Thank you. 527 00:37:16,810 --> 00:37:29,000 One thing I think needs to be on here is Toledo Blade at 41, and going southbound. 528 00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:34,140 We really need to have, I mean, I guess I haven't gotten caught there yet, but it seems 529 00:37:34,140 --> 00:37:39,680 like that traffic backs up considerably when people are going left turn, and that single 530 00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:44,840 arrow is not going to be enough in the, you know, in the very near future, I think, and 531 00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:50,580 then what the problem is is to take over real estate, you're going to have to cannibalize 532 00:37:50,580 --> 00:37:55,140 that median with those big trees in there, but we're going to have to do something because 533 00:37:55,140 --> 00:38:02,060 we certainly have plenty of accepting lane way to put two turn lanes, and I think that's 534 00:38:02,060 --> 00:38:05,600 to be in the calculus, and it really should be something that we're... 535 00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:10,120 I believe that's being looked at currently, so we are analyzing that now, so... 536 00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:15,080 I mean, I know Toledo Blades is going to get improved for lanes, finally, but that Northern 537 00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:23,200 side is not going to be part of the requirement of the developer, and it needs to be done independently 538 00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:28,320 because that Northern portion of the geometry for that intersection isn't really going to have 539 00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:33,860 bearing on what's happening to the south. And most of the southern term portion coming up into 540 00:38:33,860 --> 00:38:40,500 41 seems to already be fairly correct. I have to go back and look at it again, but it seems 541 00:38:40,500 --> 00:38:46,900 like there's plenty of capacity to get out of there once the lanes are set to be foreland at 542 00:38:46,900 --> 00:38:50,580 that area there. I'm eager to agree with you, but I want to confirm we're talking about the 543 00:38:50,580 --> 00:38:54,900 same place. Toledo blade, if you're coming on a north board coming on to 41 that singular lane 544 00:38:54,900 --> 00:38:55,680 It stacks way. 545 00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:56,300 Yes, sir. 546 00:38:56,540 --> 00:38:57,000 That's way back. 547 00:38:57,220 --> 00:38:58,580 There's just no way there's going to be different. 548 00:38:59,060 --> 00:38:59,080 Yeah. 549 00:38:59,940 --> 00:39:00,520 It definitely. 550 00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:01,860 It's a nice, long lane. 551 00:39:02,580 --> 00:39:03,500 But it'll stack. 552 00:39:03,780 --> 00:39:06,900 But you're going to wait for signals and we can probably be more efficient in moving those 553 00:39:06,900 --> 00:39:09,000 cars through because it's plenty to accept. 554 00:39:09,460 --> 00:39:10,620 And it's in a three lane roadway. 555 00:39:11,220 --> 00:39:11,680 Thank you. 556 00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:16,400 Speaking of it, it's a little blade on the portion that the developers responsible for. 557 00:39:17,020 --> 00:39:23,540 Is he using what standards is he using and since that's a county road, do we get 558 00:39:23,540 --> 00:39:30,680 put to say we want to see double lanes here. We want to see this. We've met with the previous set 559 00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:36,000 up. We kind of had a rough plan set up and we work with you. We're working, yes, we're working with them. 560 00:39:37,260 --> 00:39:42,600 We can say and we can require what their development and what current standards are. 561 00:39:42,980 --> 00:39:47,040 And I don't know what that is, but I can't remember off the top of my head, but I can definitely 562 00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:52,020 want to make sure we take a real close look at that because now's the time to do it, not have 563 00:39:52,020 --> 00:39:57,200 something go in and we realize, oh geez, we should have just made these adjustments to the geometry. 564 00:39:58,840 --> 00:39:59,500 One hundred percent. 565 00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:04,800 Will that come back to the board? 566 00:40:05,620 --> 00:40:09,500 Well, the final road design for Toledo Blade. 567 00:40:11,590 --> 00:40:13,050 No, typically doesn't. 568 00:40:13,090 --> 00:40:15,170 Not the way it's being done. 569 00:40:16,190 --> 00:40:23,450 Well, if you can, if the board doesn't object, I mean, I'd like to at least through a one-on-one session once that you're working on that. 570 00:40:23,450 --> 00:40:30,430 I want to see what's being proposed, so I can at least comment to staff on any feedback, yeah, thank you very much. 571 00:40:31,130 --> 00:40:31,690 Okay. 572 00:40:33,630 --> 00:40:43,070 So we have had some interests in several developers out in the burnt store area where they are considering building the road. 573 00:40:43,370 --> 00:40:45,470 The East West connector for impact fee credits. 574 00:40:47,430 --> 00:40:52,230 If we were to consider this we would need to start the design as soon as possible. 575 00:40:52,230 --> 00:40:58,010 That would be to meet their timelines right now there in some of them are a little further along and others 576 00:40:58,010 --> 00:41:00,730 But some of them are just starting design some of them are starting construction 577 00:41:00,730 --> 00:41:06,310 But in order for them to be at the same time when they're out there doing construction. We would need to start design as soon as possible 578 00:41:07,330 --> 00:41:09,470 We've considered this multiple ways 579 00:41:10,930 --> 00:41:14,050 We think it would be beneficial to the county because 580 00:41:14,750 --> 00:41:20,430 They could do it faster cheaper than we can and they would just use their impact fee credits 581 00:41:20,430 --> 00:41:25,910 which we would be using to build a road later, but we also looked at as what if it didn't 582 00:41:25,910 --> 00:41:26,410 work out. 583 00:41:26,430 --> 00:41:30,010 What if we did this and we moved up the design and then it didn't work out. 584 00:41:30,650 --> 00:41:35,490 We feel that the only thing we'd be out is moving those design costs up because we would 585 00:41:35,490 --> 00:41:42,450 have to start design in two years anyway in order to move through this process and we could 586 00:41:42,450 --> 00:41:47,070 use the design and just build it in 30 if that doesn't work. 587 00:41:47,070 --> 00:41:52,950 So we would like you to consider moving up the design costs of the East West connector and 588 00:41:52,950 --> 00:41:54,270 let us start on that design now. 589 00:41:54,650 --> 00:41:58,910 Do we have an impact fee credit coordinator here in Nader? 590 00:41:58,970 --> 00:41:59,510 Yeah, coordinator. 591 00:41:59,750 --> 00:42:04,910 Typically, when you issue impact fee credits, or somebody at the county level who would coordinate 592 00:42:04,910 --> 00:42:10,170 of somebody, if they wanted to sell those to another party at some point, they come in and 593 00:42:10,170 --> 00:42:13,770 somebody is keeping track of the credits and it's coordinated with- 594 00:42:13,770 --> 00:42:15,190 I'm not sure if we have that. 595 00:42:15,190 --> 00:42:20,210 But that would be done in, there would be agreements that would be done. 596 00:42:20,390 --> 00:42:23,370 We were just in the very preliminary stages of this. 597 00:42:23,570 --> 00:42:25,130 We just wanted to kind of get it started. 598 00:42:25,490 --> 00:42:27,390 And then we could work through the process with them. 599 00:42:27,390 --> 00:42:28,650 And that would all have come for the board. 600 00:42:29,150 --> 00:42:31,450 Yeah, I don't know if we could give direction today, 601 00:42:31,530 --> 00:42:36,350 but I would certainly support looking at impact fee credits 602 00:42:36,350 --> 00:42:36,950 for the road. 603 00:42:37,230 --> 00:42:39,610 I have some experience with that down in Lee County. 604 00:42:39,830 --> 00:42:41,430 It's a very successful program. 605 00:42:41,970 --> 00:42:44,010 And it really expedited a lot of jobs 606 00:42:44,010 --> 00:42:49,390 to your point at a great savings to the county and you're letting the private sector handle it. 607 00:42:49,670 --> 00:42:54,230 And what's in it for us will maybe there's some design costs, but also just managing the 608 00:42:54,230 --> 00:42:54,850 impact fee credits. 609 00:42:55,170 --> 00:42:56,290 Commissioner Dora, you're in the case here. 610 00:42:56,410 --> 00:43:01,650 Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Why not do a developer's agreement that includes there? 611 00:43:01,650 --> 00:43:03,990 They're doing the design permitting and construction. 612 00:43:04,570 --> 00:43:07,490 We can ask them when we had talked about it before. 613 00:43:07,650 --> 00:43:12,430 Their preference was that we would be their preference, but what I'm saying is we could know 614 00:43:13,030 --> 00:43:22,010 I have seen that done and years and years ago. It is very successful Mr. Chairman. It's 615 00:43:22,010 --> 00:43:26,790 pipe lining the dollars to something we need done, especially with the East West connector 616 00:43:26,790 --> 00:43:29,050 being something that's not that far down the road. 617 00:43:29,950 --> 00:43:36,350 So to speak. So I mean, I'd be interested if they're interested in doing the whole package. 618 00:43:36,490 --> 00:43:37,890 Let me put it that way. Perfect. 619 00:43:38,090 --> 00:43:38,610 Thank you. 620 00:43:38,610 --> 00:43:41,190 Yeah, I would say nobody's in the queue so I'll jump in again. 621 00:43:42,290 --> 00:43:50,190 Most developers look at it, number one, it's an expedited way to bring value to their property precisely and get their projects online quicker. 622 00:43:51,250 --> 00:43:55,270 So, you know, it's definitely incentive for them to move on this stuff. 623 00:43:55,750 --> 00:43:57,610 And that's my experience with it. 624 00:43:57,610 --> 00:44:03,650 You know, that's why they look for these credits because they'll jump on it and bring instant value to their property. 625 00:44:04,050 --> 00:44:05,530 So, it's a win-win. 626 00:44:05,990 --> 00:44:14,790 Mr. Chair, if I get on, I just got a reminder we do have an impact the administrator in the community development, so they try to get it soon. 627 00:44:15,590 --> 00:44:16,730 Okay, thank you. Great. 628 00:44:17,050 --> 00:44:18,950 Sounds like we have some of the infrastructure in place. 629 00:44:19,590 --> 00:44:20,170 No pun intended. 630 00:44:21,710 --> 00:44:22,810 So, let's be. 631 00:44:28,210 --> 00:44:29,190 Good afternoon, Commissioner. 632 00:44:29,370 --> 00:44:30,630 It's Rick Arthur, musical services. 633 00:44:31,450 --> 00:44:33,970 I'm just bringing back slides you've actually already seen. 634 00:44:34,150 --> 00:44:36,690 Gordon went through these with you in a workshop back in November. 635 00:44:36,690 --> 00:44:47,890 What we did is we updated the cost based on the updated amounts that were added through the C&A process, so. 636 00:44:47,890 --> 00:44:48,390 Indices. 637 00:44:49,150 --> 00:44:50,910 Yes, yeah, that's the other thing. 638 00:44:51,170 --> 00:44:52,710 So when we're looking back at the slides, 639 00:44:53,010 --> 00:44:59,910 they're not all of them that we presented last time had the correct info in the inflationary amount to include in the how. 640 00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:29,980 So this is all updated. This should match what you saw back in February at the CNA workshop. And we just really wanted to highlight again. You guys have some great discussion in November around this and the shortfall that we have here. The shortfall's grown. So I'll just get to you. You've got your expenses here for edge water, harbor view, and the east west connector. And then you've got the revenues here. And so when you line up, particularly edge water and harbor view, 641 00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:35,980 Here's where it's showing you the shore falls growing from I think it was 60 million at the time that we looked at it before now 642 00:45:35,980 --> 00:45:39,420 It's up to 90 million. So we wanted to provide you that update 643 00:45:39,420 --> 00:45:42,140 Additionally, we wanted to let you know 644 00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:45,900 hilltop securities is got to work on 645 00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:56,300 Substrategy some financing strategies and they're actually going to bring some suggestions back to the finance committee meeting. That's scheduled for March 646 00:45:56,300 --> 00:45:57,000 26 647 00:45:58,260 --> 00:46:03,620 And talk about, you know, what might be some options, bindings probably not going to be the best, 648 00:46:03,740 --> 00:46:10,240 but maybe some other options that won't be so restrictive on us, where we might be able 649 00:46:10,240 --> 00:46:16,200 to take those impact fee revenues that we're seeing out in the out-years here and use that 650 00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:19,460 as a funding source to repay some kind of debt instrument. 651 00:46:20,740 --> 00:46:24,640 So just wanted to give you update on that, show you where we're at, where it stands now, 652 00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:30,080 the shortfall and let you know that we've got our financial consultants working on it now to bring 653 00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:32,920 back some options at that finance committee meeting. 654 00:46:36,250 --> 00:46:37,910 Any questions? That's all I had. 655 00:46:38,150 --> 00:46:42,990 You had one more slide, South County. Oh, yeah, okay. So this this just shows the where we are 656 00:46:42,990 --> 00:46:47,590 out with that east-west connector, which I think this is the project that they were referring to. 657 00:46:48,430 --> 00:46:54,070 So we've got a shortfall here as well, but maybe that impact be credit might be a 658 00:46:54,070 --> 00:47:02,050 good option for that. Thank you sir. All right. No questions. Okay. Okay. Okay. All right. 659 00:47:02,210 --> 00:47:06,570 We're that brings us two comments. It's like deja vu all over again Mr. Flores. 660 00:47:07,110 --> 00:47:10,570 None at this time. Thank you. This is no. I don't have anything. Thank you. 661 00:47:10,730 --> 00:47:13,530 I'll start to my right commissioner Dori. I'll set sir. Thank you. 662 00:47:13,750 --> 00:47:18,550 Commissioner Constance. Well, do we want to talk about Washington or you want to wait till Tuesday? 663 00:47:19,110 --> 00:47:22,750 Tuesday. Okay. And when is the next finance committee meeting? 664 00:47:27,530 --> 00:47:33,630 March 26th, Wednesday March 26th, I think it's that like 8 a.m., okay 9 a.m., give me one 665 00:47:33,630 --> 00:47:34,810 second I'll tell you exactly. 666 00:47:39,670 --> 00:47:42,230 8 a.m., or if you want to say this. Thank you very much, thanks. 667 00:47:42,510 --> 00:47:45,270 Okay, we should do X. Missionary Doitch. 668 00:47:45,930 --> 00:47:50,530 And I have nothing. We've completed our agenda gentleman. This meeting is adjourned.