[0:02] We're now doing things by Zoom. Uh, do
we need to take RO for our study
[0:06] session? Yes. We should we should get on
the record who's here. So, we can have
[0:09] the city clerk take.
>> Council member Cow
[0:13] » here.
>> Council member Han
[0:16] » Council member Quan.
[0:20] » Mayor Prompu.
>> Yes.
[0:22] » Mayor Ch
>> here. Right. people are on the zoom and
[0:28] » Karen just joined.
>> Okay.
[0:36] So, how many people are on the zoom and
would like to speak uh as to the study
[0:39] session I am
[0:43] Michelle? Do you have any public
comments on
[0:45] » um not yet?
I'm trying to uh it's not allowing me to
[0:53] » Yeah,
>> I don't think we have
[0:55] » attendings
>> to make her a panelist.
[0:58] » Okay, one second. We need to
>> So, while while we're doing this, what
[1:02] I'll do, Michelle, is just for the
people who may want to speak. Well, if
[1:06] you raise your hand and then we'll close
it. The um this because this is the
[1:11] special meeting. This public comment
section will be for the items that are
[1:16] on the special meeting agenda. There
will be additional public comment at 7
[1:19] o'clock. This will only be limited to
items on our study session or close
[1:23] session.
>> I think
[1:27] sir, are you here to speak on the study
session item as well or is it just
[1:31] » I don't know. Yeah, I haven't heard what
you have to say.
[1:34] » Understood.
>> We do take public comments at the
[1:36] beginning. So, that would be the
opportunity to speak if you'd like to
[1:40] speak before we get started.
Well, I assume this is about the drone.
[1:46] I think I had a couple questions. Okay,
let us get this squared away and then
[1:51] we'll we'll take your questions.
[2:09] See if
I can hear.
[2:21] » So, um, we're trying to promote council
member Fan to a panelist so she can
[2:26] participate. We need to send her the
request again. The first one we sent was
[2:30] declined.
So,
[2:34] but she is on. Okay, she's on. Correct.
[2:39] Was there someone in the room who wanted
to make public comments? Okay. And then
[2:42] we have some fine too.
>> We have two.
[2:47] » Let's see.
[2:54] » If there's anybody that wishes to speak
on public comment online, please raise
[2:58] your hand.
[3:07] one hand raised.
>> Okay, we'll have five minutes for the
[3:11] person online and then five minutes for
producer as well.
[3:23] » Devin, please proceed with your public
comment.
[3:37] So he accept the request.
Deon, if you're speaking, you should
[3:41] unmute yourself.
[3:49] Devin, are you with us?
Okay. Technology is amazing. What
[3:55] » we could do is we could have the the
speaker in the room if you have five
[3:59] minutes to speak, sir. Okay. Um
I understood the very brief summary
[4:07] discussion
[4:11] especially today is about civilian and
tactical drone use. Is that correct?
[4:20] No. And are you allowed to answer?
>> So we're not really supposed to. So it's
[4:25] not really a conversation but if you but
you are correct.
[4:28] » Okay. Okay. Well, that's why I was
thinking I would wait until after so I
[4:32] know what my questions were. But, uh, to
the extent that you are contemplating
[4:39] tactical drone use, um, what's the
genesis of that need? That's one of my
[4:46] questions.
Two, are you contemplating that this
[4:50] will be run by a city department such as
the police department or by a third
[4:56] outside agency? Three, do you anticipate
that this tactical use will be
[5:03] coordinated or correlated with the
license plate cameras that are prevalent
[5:10] throughout the session?
Or
[5:14] do you anticipate that the cost of this
is going to be a normal budget item or
[5:20] it's going to be defraed by some outside
entity providing the service and
[5:27] therefore
fraing the cost? Those are my initial
[5:31] questions and I will probably have more
after I hear you all talk and then I'll
[5:36] come back for the next meeting and ask
those questions again.
[5:41] » Yeah. So the four questions I heard uh
what was your name sir?
[5:44] » David Bigalow.
>> Mr. Bigalow. Um
[5:48] just to clarify it is Genesis of Need
run by a city department or an outside
[5:53] agency coordinated or correlated with
the license plate reader and the cost of
[6:00] this is it going to be a budget item or
or something else?
[6:03] » Oh and there is one more question. Um to
the extent that there is civilian use
[6:10] limited or allowed um
is there any
[6:17] feasibility that has been considered for
the areas of the city that are fairly
[6:26] impacted [clears throat] by the San
Gabriel Valley airport. I for example
[6:31] live right under the flight path of the
sustenance that routinely do touches at
[6:38] that airport. So I would be impacted if
either tactical civilian drone use were
[6:44] allowed over a certain height limit.
>> Thank you.
[6:50] » All right. Uh do we have the person
online that would like to speak?
[6:57] » Kevin, are you with us? Did you want to
make a comment?
[7:04] » Are you talking to me,
>> Devin? Oh, that's mayor. Oh, sorry.
[7:09] Council member,
>> I'm sorry, Sharon. We were we were uh we
[7:12] were asking for there's a person online
with the name of Devon that had said
[7:16] originally they wanted to speak.
>> Okay.
[7:21] » Okay, great. Let's have our
presentation.
[7:24] So, this is an item before that we get
to the the police. So, um this is an
[7:29] item that was actually, I believe, asked
for by um council member Cal. We have an
[7:34] item in this year's budget to add drones
in the police department.
[7:39] And there was sort of a general question
on if we're going to be adding them in
[7:42] the police department, what sort of
policies and protocols will there be in
[7:44] the police department? But it also
references in the last couple of months
[7:48] we've had increased number of concerns
about private drone flights or quazi
[7:55] governmental flights that were happening
over um the the wildland areas.
[8:00] Specifically Edison was flying checking
their power lines with drones and kind
[8:05] of was the general question of what are
the rules? Should there be different
[8:09] rules? What are other cities doing about
drones and those types of things? So
[8:14] since it was in the budget, it was a
good time to kind of collectively talk
[8:16] about all that. I think that kind of
characterizes what we understand the
[8:19] question was.
>> Yes sir, city manager. That does
[8:22] characterize what uh what our points
are.
[8:24] » Okay. So we have a presentation if it
going to be led by our acting chief
[8:27] here. Um but uh it also goes it goes
into private and public sector and what
[8:33] the FCC says about all these things. And
I think the presentation automatically
[8:38] includes most of the questions that uh
Mr. Mr. Bigalow had, but we'll make sure
[8:42] to answer all those questions as well.
>> Yes. So, thank you all for allowing us
[8:45] to be here, mayor, council, everyone
else. Um, forgive me while I fumble
[8:49] through this as my first one, but uh if
I mess anything up, please stop me and
[8:53] get me back in line. Um, I have
Lieutenant Ryan Mohal here. He is our
[8:56] subject matter expert for all things
drones. Um, normally when I do these
[9:01] kind of presentations, I don't like to
just talk because I figure I'm talking
[9:05] and I'm not answering your guys'
questions. We'll go through the slides.
[9:08] If there's things that you guys have
questions for, please just interrupt me
[9:11] and we'll address them as it goes on. So
again, um, Lieutenant Mohal put this
[9:15] together with the help of Justine. I
think it's very comprehensive in terms
[9:18] of what it covers. So, um, if it's
something that, uh, you guys want to
[9:22] expand on, we're happy to answer any
questions that you may have.
[9:27] So again, some of the stuff that we'll
talk about tonight, um just an overview
[9:30] of what the federal regulations look
like, what are our restrictions both
[9:34] locally, um what does the FAA have to
say in terms of drone usage, um what can
[9:40] we expect to uh adhere to in terms of
local rules and regulations, and what
[9:45] should we have our our citizens be
familiar with? Um, I think a lot of this
[9:50] pertains to an educational campaign for
our civilians. I'm sorry, for our
[9:55] citizens. Um, so that's kind of going to
be what our uh foundation is here.
[10:04] So, what that says, I know there up
there, but it it's rules for every drone
[10:09] operator. So, um, what is it that a
drone operator needs to understand when
[10:17] they go out and fly a drone? Um,
essentially, when I first understood
[10:22] drones, I thought that the FAA had a
strict set of rules that you came in and
[10:27] I had to abide by those, and if I didn't
abide by those, I was fined. I was put
[10:31] in jail. And there were things that
happened. Come to find out through the
[10:34] research and through the assistance of
Lieutenant Mohal, it's not as clear-cut.
[10:39] » [clears throat]
>> Um there are different categories in
[10:41] terms of drone operators. Um both a
hobbyist and then a professional use.
[10:46] Those are both uh subject to different
restrictions. So in essence um if I'm a
[10:53] 16-year-old kid in my backyard flying a
drone, I can fly it. I don't have to
[10:58] clear it with the FAA. I don't have to
have uh specific rules and regulations.
[11:02] I'm considered a hobbyist. So, I can go
out and I can let that drone fly up and
[11:07] as long as I don't violate state laws
that are in place which pertain to
[11:13] peeping, things like that kind of
prowling. And I think that's where some
[11:16] of the concerns with uh Council Member
Cow came in. As long as we're not
[11:20] violating those specific laws, he's free
to fly. Now, there are certain FAA
[11:27] regulations that come into uh play in
terms of how high that drone can go, but
[11:32] in terms of local enforcement of that,
we as a police department are handcuffed
[11:38] into what we can actually enforce. Since
we can't enforce federal laws, what we
[11:42] do is we would report back to the FAA
the best that we can and then hope that
[11:48] at some point in the FAA's uh time they
get back to following up on our case.
[11:54] So, um it is the federal government and
it does take a while, but that is the
[11:59] hope that we have is that they come back
and and address the issue that we've
[12:02] brought to them.
>> Any questions with any of that so far?
[12:10] So again, the federal framework, we
talked about it a little bit. Um the
[12:15] non-recreational, the small drone
operators, and then there's the
[12:19] recreational use. So um if you're a
non-recreational, so you're a let's call
[12:24] it a real estate agent who's out there
for a purpose, right? Looking to um use
[12:29] the drone for some type of monetary
gain, um you are subject to different
[12:33] regulations. Um, so something like that,
you would have to apply for a what they
[12:38] call a part 107 license. So that is
basically a uh course in FA rules and
[12:46] regulations, how to fly. It talks about
um ceiling heights, things like that.
[12:52] Um, and then you have to take a test at
the end of that course and you then
[12:56] become part 107 certified. So that
allows you as a person who's essentially
[13:01] looking to monetarily gain from the use
of your drone to uh operate it. Um
[13:07] again, as we talked about the hobbyists,
they don't have to uh go and do that
[13:12] part 107 licensing. They're allowed to
go up uh fly. Typically, it's up to a
[13:17] 400 ft level. However, as you'll see in
in uh a future slide, those height
[13:23] restrictions do change based on the
location to our airport to the south of
[13:27] us in Almani. So, the closer you are to
the airport, the lower that ceiling
[13:33] becomes to the point where in some areas
it does reach a 0 foot ceiling. So,
[13:38] essentially, you're not allowed to fly
in that area.
[13:43] And I think another key point on the
recreational versus the business use is
[13:48] recreational people who don't need
licenses and all that. They have to fly
[13:51] the drone with be able to see the drone
at all times. It has to be line of
[13:55] sight. The people with licenses
sometimes can fly them where they can't
[13:58] see them.
>> Yeah, you can get a waiver for that. And
[14:00] and Brian, what is it?
>> Yeah. On visual line of sight, BBO loss.
[14:04] » And that's something you apply for,
correct?
[14:06] » Yes.
>> So that's something you apply for. Um,
[14:08] and essentially like what the city
manager and Lieutenant Warl are saying,
[14:12] it allows you to operate it where you're
not visually uh looking at your drone.
[14:17] Now, does that mean that people file
this and and and get this beyond line of
[14:21] sight uh exemption? No. But again, what
can we enforce and what can we do in
[14:27] terms of locally? Very little.
[14:32] » Uh California drone laws. So, we touched
upon it uh a little bit initially. Um,
[14:39] essentially in in California and then as
it relates more closely to our
[14:44] community, we don't have control over
the airspace. So, the airspace is what
[14:50] you would know it to be. It's everything
above us that would uh facilitate the
[14:55] the flight of drones. Um, that goes to
the FAA. um we have no legal ground to
[15:02] put any rules, ordinances, laws in place
that would restrict a individual's
[15:08] ability to use that airspace. That's all
regulated by the FAA. Um so the some of
[15:15] the things that we can regulate are um
where people can fly them from, city
[15:22] grounds, um where they can take off
from. We can regulate some of those
[15:27] things. We can put some exemptions in to
uh flights over city sponsored events.
[15:34] Um you know the patriotic festival for
example, we could write in an ordinance
[15:38] or an exemption where people would not
be allowed to fly drones over that um
[15:43] city sponsored event. So those are kind
of the limitations that we have in terms
[15:48] of some of the uh enforcement actions.
>> Anything to add on? Well, kind of key to
[15:55] that, it's implied and he sort of
touched on it, but it's an important
[15:58] point, which means from my backyard, I
can throw up a drone and fly that over
[16:04] my neighbor's house. There's nothing we
can do to stop that. But if I fly that
[16:08] drone over my neighbor's house with the
intent on peeping on my neighbor,
[16:11] looking at my neighbor by their swimming
pool, doing the kind of things you can't
[16:15] do from the ground, meaning check them
out kind of in a creepy way, I can be
[16:19] enforced for doing that kind of thing.
It's not a drone violation. It's a
[16:24] peeping tom type of violation.
>> Yeah. In essence, it would be no
[16:28] different than if you had a person
physically in your backyard looking
[16:32] through your window. It's essentially
the same criminal uh statute, sir. So,
[16:38] is there a distinction between our
ability to register or track the
[16:41] ownership of these things limits as
opposed to saying you can't fly it?
[16:47] Does. So if the FAA has occupied the
field regarding anything above your
[16:53] rooftop and we can't do that, but do we
have other avenues of regulation? Not
[16:59] that I think we necessarily want to do
that, but do we have the ability to say
[17:03] if you're going to fly it in the city
then you need to register it with us? Do
[17:07] do we have the ability to do that or
>> Yeah, it'll So, we'll touch on that a
[17:13] little bit um as we move forward and
then again, if I don't address it, then
[17:16] we'll come back to it. But yes, we
>> short answer is yes.
[17:18] » Yes,
>> you can tell them they can't do it, but
[17:20] you can say everybody who flies needs to
be registered with the city.
[17:23] » By the way, every time I don't want to
answer a question, I say to the person,
[17:27] I'm gonna get to that in a minute. And
then they always forget. So, I'll give
[17:32] you that that tip, right?
[17:37] So this is what we were talking about
the uh airspace kind of the ceiling map.
[17:41] So you'll see this is a condensed
version but there is a larger version
[17:44] that can be provided um if necessary but
you'll kind of see uh I'll stand up here
[17:51] the northern end of the city you see we
get to 400t limits. So essentially you
[17:56] can fly up 400 ft without any rules or
restrictions. the further south we get
[18:00] uh north Omani, hence the Omani airport,
we get into a zero foot cap. So
[18:06] essentially, it's a it's a no-fly zone.
So if you're in the north end of town,
[18:10] you've got um a much higher ceiling and
for obvious reasons, the closer you get
[18:14] to an airport, they want to uh avoid any
type of conflict. So you can't fly.
[18:22] So here we talk about some of the
options for the local regulations. And
[18:26] this may be kind of some of the stuff
where we get into um the questions about
[18:31] that you had uh council member. So how
do we regulate locally if that's what
[18:39] we're looking to do? Um some of the
things that we can do is like we talked
[18:44] about we regulate how a drone is used
not where it may fly. So, in how it's
[18:50] used, it's takeoff and landing
locations, um, distances from specific
[18:55] locations. So, you know, in essence, we
could say that you're not allowed to
[19:00] take off a drone within I'm just
throwing numbers out, 50 ft of a
[19:06] specific location within the city. So,
it thereby affords us a little bit of a
[19:11] buffer in terms of areas that we want to
dissuade any type of drone activity.
[19:18] Um, we've talked about the privacy and
kind of the harassment and the
[19:22] trespassing, uh, state laws that apply.
Um, and those are things that that's an
[19:28] intent crime. So, we would have to prove
that that intent exists with the drone
[19:33] operator. Um, so there are steps that we
would have to do. Obviously, identifying
[19:37] where the drone is being flown from,
identifying who's flying it, and then
[19:41] talking to that person and seeing what
their intent was behind the use of their
[19:44] drone. So again, like any criminal
investigation, there are steps that we
[19:48] would have to follow um to try to ensure
a successful prosecution for something
[19:53] like that. Um obviously, anything that
involves an emergency response,
[19:59] wildfires, um there was in the Eaton
fire, I'm sure we all saw the news where
[20:04] they had to cease uh uh water drops
because of uh drone activity. So,
[20:11] anything like that, those are automatic
no- gossos and those are violations that
[20:17] that are enforceable that we can look
at. Um, again, since we have the Sanita
[20:22] Racetrack in town, there are uh rules
and regulations and laws that apply to
[20:27] interfering with the sporting event. So
any private drone use that interferes
[20:31] with a brace uh or any sporting event
that's being held there at the track
[20:37] would again qualify for a uh uh state
statute violation.
[20:44] Is there any questions on that? Does
that kind of address [clears throat]
[20:46] what you were looking for?
>> Um
[20:49] but it would be state law that we're
looking at there, not local law to
[20:53] enforce regarding let's say a
recreational area like Santaita.
[20:56] » State Yeah, state law already is in
existence. Um, I don't know the actual
[21:00] penal code off the top of my head, but
there is a specific statute that um,
[21:04] applies to interference with a sporting
event. Um, [clears throat] and that
[21:07] would fall under that.
>> But you do have the ability to add a
[21:13] recreational registration could be
required.
[21:17] » And all the drones, well, there's a
thing we're going to get to. It's called
[21:21] Real ID, and it's basically, think of it
like a license plate drone. So you can
[21:25] identify the operator and maybe origin.
And that would be one of the options for
[21:29] you all to consider if you want to talk
about one of the ways we'd like to
[21:34] monitor this would be having some type
of registration or permit. And so um
[21:38] real ID um or it requires um sensors for
detection and stuff. And so there's
[21:45] progressive ways to choose what option
would work best for us. We're interested
[21:49] in that. And so, um, they could talk
about that more, but that's one of the
[21:52] ways that you would do kind of
enforcement and help identify if you
[21:55] have a drone that's going rogue or, you
know, violating local laws or state
[22:01] laws. And that that would be the way
that you would try to identify the
[22:03] operator and the perpetrator in that
instance.
[22:06] » And I think Brian, correct me if I'm
wrong, but that requires equipment that
[22:09] we would have to purchase. So, it's it's
not like a public database that that we
[22:14] would have free access for. It would be
equipment that the city would have to
[22:17] purchase that would allow us to uh be
able to identify that drone. And
[22:22] » it's like everything from like a
handheld radar gun kind of looking thing
[22:26] to something that's on all of our
vehicles that automatically is searching
[22:30] the skies and looking for it. Depends on
the level of commitment to
[22:33] [clears throat] that issue.
emergency.
[22:38] » So, these are some of the other cities
just locally that um we looked at in
[22:43] terms of some of the uh ordinances are
already in place. I think if you look at
[22:47] the cities, the albeit a a bigger city,
but the most comparable to us given the
[22:51] fact that it has a a sporting venue is
Pasadena. Um and they've kind of taken a
[22:56] a broader approach to things. Um and so
far from the people that that I've
[23:00] spoken to and that Ryan has spoken to in
Pasadena, it's worked for them given the
[23:04] venues that they have. um their
ordinance obviously it addresses the
[23:10] flight takeoff and landing um like we've
talked about um and then there's other
[23:15] instances where they can get um
approvals [clears throat] for special
[23:19] events, filming things like that. So
there are ways to go around but it's
[23:23] going to take a process and a special
exemption for it. Um again as you look
[23:28] at the the kind of the common theme for
the other cities is the majority of it
[23:33] pertains to takeoff and landing. Where
can you fly these things from? Um, you
[23:39] know, some of it, um, I think again
pertaining to us, we can look at the
[23:45] distance from a specific venue, but the
vast majority of ordinances that are
[23:50] adopted by surrounding cities pertain
strictly to taking off and landing and
[23:54] and us dictating where that happens. And
it seems like no one attempts to try to
[23:59] register ownership that that we've seen
in our surrounding neighbors, right,
[24:04] » Ryan? Nothing. They're required by law,
excuse me, if the drone is manufactured
[24:09] after a certain year, they're required
by law to register that drone with the
[24:14] FAA using remote ID. Remote ID is what
everybody's referring to. That would be
[24:18] able to track the location of where the
drone took off, which is where the
[24:22] remote control should be, which is where
the pilot should also be standing. So,
[24:28] it it is required in in new drones.
>> What year is that?
[24:32] » I believe it was 2024.
But we wouldn't have the ability to
[24:37] monitor it monitor it ourselves unless
we purchase the monitoring equipment.
[24:41] And then would we have the right to do
that or do we have to seek FAA approval
[24:44] for that too?
>> No, you'd be looking at uh installing
[24:47] radar equipment pick up on radio
frequencies and uh infrared from the
[24:52] actual drone flight itself and you'd be
able to track it with the radar.
[24:57] » Is that equipment
possibly utilized for any other purpose?
[25:02] Anything anybody's going to complain
about that we bought this stuff or
[25:07] » complaints? I don't know. Uh would it be
useful for a city, especially on the the
[25:13] 28 coming up? I I do believe there would
be some use to it.
[25:16] » No, he's saying is there anything else
you can use that for other than tracking
[25:19] a drone?
>> I'm sorry. Uh I I've only looked at at
[25:22] drones using it for drones, although I
have heard of other cities using it for
[25:27] different reasons, but I don't recall
what those reasons were.
[25:32] I mean, I'm sure given today's day and
age with the tech savvy of these kids,
[25:36] there's ways that they can be used.
>> You're telling me some 15-year-old is
[25:40] going to find a clever way to uh
[laughter] You sure my 12-year-old son
[25:43] will figure out some way to get that
thing, you know, to track down a pirated
[25:47] movie or something? But
>> what will be the cost?
[25:50] » Sorry,
>> what would be the cost?
[25:51] » I I don't have any estimated costs right
now.
[25:53] » And I think it depends too on how
extensive we utilize this. If we have a
[25:58] few handheld devices, it's going to be
active. we actually equip every cruiser,
[26:02] it's going to be why, right? So, and
these are all things that that if the
[26:07] council elects to to investigate
further, we can go out and get dollar
[26:12] amounts that that can be presented back
to you guys. So, um but yes, you're
[26:16] right. It will range from small to
>> not so small
[26:22] to expensive.
>> And one of the things that you're
[26:25] looking at, there's a lot of location
based things on that list. Uh the other
[26:28] thing that pops up in several cities is
the idea of weaponry. And that doesn't
[26:32] necessarily mean like no no uh
you know uh
[26:39] » ammunitions on the drone does mean that.
But it also means things that look like
[26:43] weapons. So you couldn't have a drone
that kind of scared people kind of
[26:46] looked like a fake gun and freaked
people out. You could just say those are
[26:50] whether or not it was a gun. It if it
looks like a gun, that's an illegal
[26:53] operation of a drone because it has a
potential for inciting riots or what.
[27:03] So, what could some of our uh municipal
code sections look like? Um, again, as
[27:09] we've talked about frequently, the
restriction of landing and takeoffs. Um,
[27:14] would have the ability to restrict
landing and takeoff from any city-owned
[27:17] property. um except in designated areas
or with city authorization. Um again
[27:23] like we talked about specified distance
from city permitted special events. Um
[27:29] obviously active law enforcement, fire,
any emergency response incidents. Um and
[27:33] then private property. So um public
safety and critical facilities, the
[27:39] infrastructure, um restrict your own
use, PD, fire, um you know, water
[27:45] resources, things like that. You know,
these are all things that we would have
[27:49] to roundt as a city with department
heads looking at what those critical
[27:54] infrastructures would be within our city
and then um go back and and write these
[27:59] ordinances so that it would uh entail
and encompass everything. So, it's it
[28:04] would not be a let's decide this on a
Friday and enact it on a Monday type
[28:07] thing. It would take some some planning
and some some thinking to get it done.
[28:12] Um and then obviously al like the uh
city manager talked about any type of
[28:16] reckless activity. Um whether it be the
appearance of a drone um you know using
[28:21] it for property damage, things like
that. Those things are obviously uh
[28:24] things that we would uh enact a
municipal code section to avoid.
[28:28] » Are we able to limit the ability for
these things to carry any kind of like a
[28:32] payload something?
[28:36] No.
[28:39] » Yeah. And I think that's one of those
things. I mean, it's implied in your
[28:42] question, but the Amazons and the
FedEx's and all of that in the next
[28:45] couple years are going to be delivering
food and packages and all of that stuff
[28:49] and all of that will be controlled by
the FAA and not us.
[28:52] » I'm not as worried about them,
[laughter]
[28:55] but no, I'm just thinking about things
like our water supply and stuff like
[28:58] that. And you
>> um it's a matter of concern
[29:02] » and I think it it becomes increasingly a
matter of concern as these become more
[29:07] prevalent. We already see a lot of them,
but you know, you can equate it back to
[29:12] the legal purchase of a firearm. You
know, I know we're getting at extremes,
[29:16] but if it's legally purchased, then it's
legally purchased. And the same thing
[29:19] with a drone. You know, you can legally
purchase a drone. It's just the intent
[29:22] of the person who purchases it. So, um,
so some of the Q&A, um, you know, I
[29:31] don't need to read that verbatim for for
all of you. Um, I think the one of the
[29:37] biggest things to take away from here,
um, is yes, there are already state laws
[29:44] that are in place that allow enforcement
of some of these violations committed by
[29:49] drone operators. Again, it relates to
the the prowling, the trespassing, some
[29:54] of the things that um exist with human
beings going into backyards can also be
[29:58] done by drones. Those things are already
in place. Um, can the police department
[30:04] take down or jam a drone? No. Um, you
know, it's not like the movies where we
[30:09] can go out and, you know, point our
little gun at it and it falls out of the
[30:13] sky and and the world's a happy place.
We have to be realistic about what our
[30:18] capabilities are when it comes to
drones, the usage of it. Um, and I think
[30:23] again, like we said, it would take kind
of a robust education campaign for the
[30:28] public to understand what the intentions
of us as an enforcement arm is and also
[30:34] what the responsibilities of a community
member is using a drone.
[30:42] » Uh, to touch on the police drone
program. So,
[30:46] this is something that uh Lieutenant
Mohal and a couple of our officers uh
[30:50] have delved into um after the approval
of funding for this fiscal year. Um so
[30:57] there is uh $105,500
[31:03] time and then a budgeted $92,600
annually. So, our initial uh short-term
[31:11] objectives is to purchase uh three
drones. Um one, you know, the the I
[31:19] don't like to word use the word tactical
because then it it conjures up all these
[31:23] images of, you know, armies and things
like that. Um when we say, you know, a
[31:28] tactical drone in this thing, it's
basically it's utilized for interior
[31:33] spaces. Um, so an interior drone
provides an exceptional level of safety
[31:40] for officers. It allows us to obviously,
like it says, clear the inside of a
[31:44] location before ever having to send an
officer inside there. Um, and then we'd
[31:48] also like to purchase two outdoor
drones. So the outdoor ones um would
[31:55] work handinhand with our uh contract
with our helicopter. So it would give us
[32:00] a lower view while also maintaining the
ability for the helicopter to provide a
[32:06] much higher uh wider perspective. So
these things work complimentary towards
[32:12] each other um and don't take away from
um the ability and the feasibility of
[32:18] these things to work. Um so with the uh
purchase of the drones, we obviously
[32:23] need people to fly them. um we are not
exempt from the part 107 licensing. So
[32:30] our people will have to go through the
course and be certified as part 107
[32:35] flight um drone operators. So those are
courses that um [clears throat] are
[32:40] difficult. They are not an easy course
to do. Um so it's going to take us
[32:44] finding the right people who are uh
interested in this kind of work and then
[32:49] putting them through the courses and
getting them certified. So, um those are
[32:54] the short-term goals. We're currently
actively researching uh the kind of
[32:59] drones to purchase so that um we get the
most out of the money that you guys have
[33:04] allotted for us. Sir,
>> when you talk about the indoor tactical
[33:06] drone, you're referring to a flying uh
drone or actually like a robotic kind of
[33:12] » No, it's it is a flying drone. It is
essentially any drone that you see
[33:16] outside. There are some modifications
that are made to an interior drone so
[33:20] that um you know it doesn't get the
blades caught in a curtain or something
[33:24] like that. It makes it they're smaller
typically to obviously get into smaller
[33:29] spaces. Um so it on face value is there
a huge difference? No. Um but it is
[33:35] still an uh an unmanned aerial um
>> but as far as building searches on the
[33:42] ground we already have a robot that we
can send in.
[33:45] » We do. Yes, we do have a robot. Um,
again, there are limitations to
[33:49] everything, right? So, these drones in
terms of a police setting would just
[33:53] enhance our capabilities and provide an
extra layer of safety for our officers,
[33:58] but yes, we do already have a a robot
that we use and that is available uh to
[34:03] our people every day. Um, long-term
goals, again, you know, I'm speaking as
[34:09] as the interim sitting here for the
next, you know, 3 weeks and then we're
[34:13] getting somebody else coming in. But,
you know, it's been the um long-term
[34:16] goals of our police department to have a
drone as a first responder program. That
[34:20] takes again a lot of thought and a lot
of uh leg work to get that program up
[34:25] and running. Um so, we've decided to
make that a long-term goal with the
[34:32] hopes of achieving that, but taking the
incremental steps of getting the smaller
[34:37] drone program up and running. Um, so I
fully am in with, you know, Lieutenant
[34:42] Mohal's uh expertise on this and then
the work that our officers are doing. I
[34:47] absolutely 100% believe that within this
fiscal year, we will have the uh smaller
[34:52] drone program up and running. Um, and
then obviously all of this goes into a
[34:59] long-term goal of a real-time crime
center where all of these things can can
[35:03] come back and help combat the overall uh
mission of reducing crime in our city.
[35:08] And what you mean by a drone as first
responder is rather than being mounted
[35:12] in a car or or deployed from a handheld
throwing it up in the air, it's mounted
[35:16] on a central location and then you put
in that we have a crime at 123 Main
[35:21] Street and it immediately deploys to 123
Main Street while our officers are in
[35:26] route and then it can get eyes and ears
on what's going on before we even get
[35:29] there in some occasions.
>> Yeah, I apologize. I take for granted
[35:32] that, you know, we sit here and talk
about these things. I figure everybody
[35:35] else knows about them too, right? No,
the city manager is absolutely right. It
[35:39] is um it's a huge tool and you'll see it
as a force multiplier that's used
[35:43] through um I don't want to say a lot of
agencies in our area, but there are
[35:48] several that have adopted it. Um and you
do see that it provides an added layer
[35:54] of safety again for the officers. Um
real-time intelligence that you can't
[35:59] get while you're in route to some of
these calls. um within a very brief
[36:04] amount of time, you get a live view over
a problem and the person watching that
[36:10] can then relay that information to
officers that are responding. So, it's a
[36:14] very valuable program. Um again, it's
something that we hope to achieve within
[36:20] a reasonable period of time, but again,
like everything, it takes time, effort,
[36:24] and takes money. So, not going to lie
and say that it's cheap. It's not. Um,
[36:29] but it's things for us to look at as we
move forward in in [clears throat] our
[36:32] drone endeavor.
>> And Colin, I don't think we put it on
[36:36] the next slide, so stop me if I if I cut
you off, but we had talked about um
[36:42] policies and protocols and how we'd make
sure, you know, what our
[36:46] » PB requirements would be for operating
the drones and all that. You want to
[36:52] » uh I'm sorry in [clears throat] one more
time, sir. I'm
[36:55] » our policies and protocols for operating
the drones for our employees.
[37:00] » Okay. Um so yeah, as we talked about um
and if I missed some of the specifics
[37:07] you're talking about, interrupt, but
some of the things that we talked about
[37:10] for our employees is the certification.
Um they obviously have to be certified
[37:14] in terms of their licensing in order to
to fly it. Um the you know, we have to
[37:21] abide by FAA rules and regulations also.
Um, so we would have to submit uh plans
[37:28] to the FAA because all of our flying I
said the the majority of our flying
[37:33] would be um beyond line of visual sight.
So we we are not uh exempt from these
[37:40] things. The FAA shows no uh care that
we're a government agency and a police
[37:45] department. we are still mandated to
adhere to the same things that a um in
[37:51] this case a professional drone user or
somebody like that would have to adhere
[37:54] to. So we would have to um submit those
flight plans, submit all the necessary
[37:59] paperwork, get approval from the FAA. Um
and it's not guaranteed. You know, we
[38:05] our proximity to the uh uh St. Gabriel
Valley Airport does pose a little bit of
[38:10] a a hiccup in the road because, you
know, there are flying there are planes
[38:16] that that we see every day that come
over our city. So, we have to navigate
[38:19] that and and we have to comply with the
rules and regulations that the FAA would
[38:22] set forth.
>> I was talking about we have a vetted
[38:26] policy manual that we use for pretty
much everything.
[38:28] » Yes, I'm sorry.
>> Yes. So yeah, Lexiple um Lexiple is our
[38:32] our department policy that covers
everything from drone usage to you name
[38:39] it, you know, time off requests and
things like that. So there are uh
[38:43] policies that are put forth by Lexiple
that um our department would enact and
[38:49] uh be held to answer to just like our uh
people flying them. um the operators,
[38:54] the observers, they would be held to the
lexical policy that would be adopted by
[38:58] um our uh department and then obviously
reviewed by the city attorney um you
[39:04] know how it pertains to our city.
>> Did that answer your question, Dominic?
[39:09] I'm sorry.
>> Sure. Um first of all, Colin, I want to
[39:13] say thank you for an incredible
presentation. Thank you so much,
[39:16] Lieutenant, for also uh being our
subject matter expert. I mean this is a
[39:21] topic that is not easy. Uh it uh it it
involves both uh civil and military
[39:28] uses. Um and so you know I actually have
a plethora of questions uh and with
[39:35] exclamation point triple underline. But
I don't think that this is the right
[39:39] setting for me to ask a plethora of
questions because I think that I think
[39:43] that the scope of this work is actually
a lot because it's going to have to
[39:48] involve civilian and and uh law
enforcement use as well. At the same
[39:53] time, we have to be respectful of our
constitutional rights as well too. So
[39:59] what I like to do is I like to propose a
motion. Uh the motion is to create a
[40:04] subcommittee to be able to uh discuss
this uh help vet this out, work with the
[40:11] police department so that we can really
get a um a really
[40:18] encompassing program that respects what
our uses are from a civilian standpoint
[40:25] to what we need to do as a m force
multiplier, from a law enforcement
[40:31] standpoint as well. and also dealing,
frankly speaking, I've dealt with the
[40:34] FAA and uh getting a 107 certification I
don't think is going to be an easy task.
[40:40] Uh whether it's for uh realators or
whether it's for law enforcement, too.
[40:44] So I like to create a subcommittee and I
like to make a motion that I like to
[40:49] appoint mayor prom David Fu and then
council member John Han to be on that
[40:54] subcommittee so that this way I can ask
my plethora of questions for David and
[40:58] John because they have nothing else to
do in their life. And then this way I
[41:02] won't be bugging I won't be bugging you
guys with my plethora of questions. And
[41:06] then and then this way uh our mayor
prompu and council member John Han can
[41:11] field the questions from all of us and
then be able to work with you to be able
[41:15] to kind of move this ball slowly in an
effective manner. Um I'd like to see if
[41:21] I can get a second for that motion.
>> Before you second the motion, just I
[41:24] need to understand the motion. So you're
not suggesting that you would be on the
[41:28] committee. The committee would still be
a committee of two. Yes, that's right.
[41:31] And just any council member that had
questions could get them to the staff
[41:34] and the could investigate that.
>> Yes. So this way it's it's more
[41:39] efficient.
>> Okay.
[41:40] » It's more efficient for every
[clears throat] keep in mind that we
[41:45] have whenever we have an ad hoc
committee there's serial potential
[41:48] serial meeting issue where they've got
to address the issue. And so, you know,
[41:53] you guys can certainly pose questions to
staff, but ultimately we're going to
[41:57] have to come back in a setting like this
with what they're reporting back. And
[42:01] more information we can get in a setting
like this, the better that works.
[42:05] » 100% agreement. So, just to clarify, my
motion is that questions from council
[42:11] members will go to the city staff and
then the subcommittee will work on this
[42:16] and then report back to us. So, we as a
entire body can make a collective
[42:21] decision. Is is is that your point city
attorney? Okay, great.
[42:26] » Great. I'll second.
>> We have a first and a second. Let's take
[42:29] a vote. Roll call.
>> Council member Cow,
[42:32] » yes.
>> Council member Han,
[42:33] » yes.
>> Council member Quan,
[42:36] » yes.
>> Mayor Promfu,
[42:39] » yes.
>> Mayor Cheng,
[42:40] » yes.
Okay. Well, we're done. Thank you so
[42:44] much. Thank you, Chief. Thank you. And
uh we're going to be close now. We are
[42:51] but starting our council meeting.