1 00:04:57,040 --> 00:04:59,440 here. 2 00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:00,639 » Emily Hamburg 3 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:02,400 » Here. 4 00:05:00,639 --> 00:05:03,440 » Brandon Macintosh 5 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:05,600 » Present. 6 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:06,639 » And Mike Proctctor 7 00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:08,479 » Present. 8 00:05:06,639 --> 00:05:10,479 » And you have a quorum. Mayor. 9 00:05:08,479 --> 00:05:12,560 » Thank you. This evening we have Father 10 00:05:10,479 --> 00:05:14,479 Terry Hedrickk from Church of the 11 00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:17,280 Resurrection on 37th Street to lead us 12 00:05:14,479 --> 00:05:20,560 in prayer. Father is pinch hitting. I 13 00:05:17,280 --> 00:05:22,400 had to beg him to come help us. So he he 14 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:23,199 agreed to come help us out today. So 15 00:05:22,400 --> 00:05:26,479 thank you. 16 00:05:23,199 --> 00:05:28,400 » Yes. Well, let's pray together 17 00:05:26,479 --> 00:05:31,520 again. Our God, we gather in the name of 18 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:33,039 your son Jesus, giving you thanks that 19 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:35,600 you're present here now by your Holy 20 00:05:33,039 --> 00:05:37,199 Spirit. And as we gather, Lord, we give 21 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:39,280 thanks that you are a good and gracious 22 00:05:37,199 --> 00:05:40,639 God, abounding in mercy and steadfast 23 00:05:39,280 --> 00:05:42,400 love. 24 00:05:40,639 --> 00:05:45,039 And so Lord, we pray specifically 25 00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:47,199 tonight for the city of Bair again for 26 00:05:45,039 --> 00:05:50,479 the city council, especially for Jim 27 00:05:47,199 --> 00:05:52,560 Bage, the mayor, also the leaders of the 28 00:05:50,479 --> 00:05:56,160 community, but especially for our law 29 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:59,680 enforcement, firefighters, EMS, and all 30 00:05:56,160 --> 00:06:03,039 of our first responders. So tonight, 31 00:05:59,680 --> 00:06:05,120 lead and guide their decisions. We pray 32 00:06:03,039 --> 00:06:06,720 that you will reveal to them the 33 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:08,160 knowledge of your will and all wisdom 34 00:06:06,720 --> 00:06:09,600 and spiritual understanding in order 35 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:12,080 that they may be fruitful in your 36 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:14,800 service. Anoint them with your Holy 37 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:17,280 Spirit, a spirit of wisdom, charity, and 38 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:19,440 justice that with steadfast purpose for 39 00:06:17,280 --> 00:06:22,319 the common good, they may faithfully 40 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:25,199 serve in their offices to promote the 41 00:06:22,319 --> 00:06:27,039 well-being of all people in the Belair 42 00:06:25,199 --> 00:06:29,199 community. 43 00:06:27,039 --> 00:06:32,560 Grant that they may love mercy, do 44 00:06:29,199 --> 00:06:34,319 justice, and walk humbly with you. 45 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:36,560 We ask all of this in the strong and 46 00:06:34,319 --> 00:06:38,240 wonderful name of our savior Jesus who 47 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:40,720 lives and reigns with you and the Holy 48 00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:42,000 Spirit, one God, both now and forever. 49 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:44,800 Amen. 50 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:46,160 » Amen. Thank you. Please join me in the 51 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:49,160 pledge of allegiance to the American 52 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,160 flag 53 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:56,639 to the flag of the United States of 54 00:06:53,919 --> 00:06:59,759 America and to the republic for which it 55 00:06:56,639 --> 00:07:02,240 stands. One nation under God, 56 00:06:59,759 --> 00:07:05,400 indivisible, with liberty and justice 57 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:05,400 for all. 58 00:07:07,919 --> 00:07:11,520 » Next item is to determine agenda 59 00:07:09,759 --> 00:07:13,360 additions. Do we have anything to add to 60 00:07:11,520 --> 00:07:14,560 the agenda? 61 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:15,759 » Mr. Mayor, 62 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:18,160 » Mr. Macintosh, 63 00:07:15,759 --> 00:07:21,039 » I I do have an agenda addition. I'd like 64 00:07:18,160 --> 00:07:22,639 to add a discussion about Woodlon 65 00:07:21,039 --> 00:07:26,720 detour. 66 00:07:22,639 --> 00:07:28,960 » Woodlon detour. Okay. Um, let's put that 67 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:30,720 as item 68 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:31,440 13D. 69 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:34,599 Okay. 70 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:34,599 » Thank you. 71 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:43,759 » Sure. All right. We will we will 72 00:07:40,639 --> 00:07:47,199 consider that. All right. Very good. Any 73 00:07:43,759 --> 00:07:49,280 other additions to the agenda? 74 00:07:47,199 --> 00:07:51,520 There are none. We'll move on to uh the 75 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:53,360 consent agenda. So, it's a nice consent 76 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:55,360 agenda. includes minutes from the 77 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:57,280 previous regular city council meeting 78 00:07:55,360 --> 00:08:01,599 and change order number five for the 79 00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:02,720 2026 street maintenance program. 80 00:08:01,599 --> 00:08:03,919 » Mr. Mayor, 81 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:05,599 » Mr. David, 82 00:08:03,919 --> 00:08:07,120 » A motion to approve the consent agenda 83 00:08:05,599 --> 00:08:08,000 as listed and authorize the mayor to 84 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:09,280 sign. 85 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:11,680 » Second. 86 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:15,360 » Motion by Mr. David, a second by Mr. 87 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:16,800 Dean. Any questions or discussion? 88 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:18,400 Hearing none, I'll call for a vote. All 89 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:19,039 in favor say I. I. 90 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:21,840 » I. 91 00:08:19,039 --> 00:08:23,919 » Any opposed? Motion carries five to 92 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:26,800 zero. 93 00:08:23,919 --> 00:08:28,800 Next item is uh appropriation ordinance. 94 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:31,360 So this encompasses expenses from the 95 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:36,440 July 29th through August 11th uh 96 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:36,440 expenses amount to 673,22. 97 00:08:37,279 --> 00:08:44,159 Uh and of those expenses $245,816 98 00:08:41,839 --> 00:08:46,000 are for infrastructure cost for new 99 00:08:44,159 --> 00:08:49,360 developments and those costs are paid 100 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:50,399 through special assessments. 101 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:51,200 » Mr. Mayor 102 00:08:50,399 --> 00:08:52,560 » Miss Hamburg. 103 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:56,160 » I'm going to make a motion to approve 104 00:08:52,560 --> 00:08:58,880 appropriations ordinance number 26-15. 105 00:08:56,160 --> 00:09:02,560 » Second motion by Miss Hamburg, a second 106 00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:02,880 by Mr. Macintosh. All in favor say I. 107 00:09:02,560 --> 00:09:03,200 » I. 108 00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:03,519 » I. 109 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:06,240 » I. 110 00:09:03,519 --> 00:09:08,320 » Any oppose? Motion carries. Five to 111 00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:10,959 zero. Sorry, I didn't give anybody a 112 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:13,680 chance to ask any questions, so should 113 00:09:10,959 --> 00:09:16,720 have. All right. Next item is uh 114 00:09:13,680 --> 00:09:19,920 citizens concerns. Oh, no. I'm sorry. We 115 00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:21,440 have city requested appearances. So, uh, 116 00:09:19,920 --> 00:09:24,560 PEC traffic engineer Tim 117 00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:26,560 » Azir, am I saying your name right? Azir 118 00:09:24,560 --> 00:09:28,720 » Aer. 119 00:09:26,560 --> 00:09:30,320 Okay, thank you. Uh, he's here tonight 120 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:33,440 to discuss his analysis of the 121 00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:37,480 intersection at 53rd and Oliver and 53rd 122 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:37,480 and Web. So, Mr. 123 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:45,760 Thank you, Mayor and Council. Uh, staff 124 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:48,240 asked us to take a look at those two 125 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:50,480 intersections specifically. We conducted 126 00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:54,000 a traffic count and ran stop sign 127 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:57,120 warrants to see whether a stop sign was 128 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:59,920 warded in in all four directions. Um, 129 00:09:57,120 --> 00:10:01,680 and I think the memo that we provided is 130 00:09:59,920 --> 00:10:03,600 should be part of your packet if I'm not 131 00:10:01,680 --> 00:10:06,720 mistaken. 132 00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:08,959 From memory, we met the crash warrant 133 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:11,600 for both intersections and we were very 134 00:10:08,959 --> 00:10:13,680 close to meeting the eight hour warrant. 135 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:17,200 Basically being over a specific count 136 00:10:13,680 --> 00:10:21,040 for eight hours of the day. You Each 137 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:23,680 intersection met seven clearly and my 138 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:25,120 recollection is the last hour was close 139 00:10:23,680 --> 00:10:28,079 and one of them was close enough that if 140 00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:29,600 we would have counted it a different day 141 00:10:28,079 --> 00:10:31,279 during that week, it may have actually 142 00:10:29,600 --> 00:10:33,839 met. So, we're recommending that both 143 00:10:31,279 --> 00:10:35,839 those intersections be converted to a 144 00:10:33,839 --> 00:10:37,200 four-way stop. One of those has already 145 00:10:35,839 --> 00:10:40,720 been done. We wanted to get that done 146 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:43,040 before school started session and get 147 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:44,399 all of that in place so that it was not 148 00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:46,560 something we were trying to do in the 149 00:10:44,399 --> 00:10:48,000 first few weeks of school. uh that's 150 00:10:46,560 --> 00:10:50,959 been accomplished and that's out there. 151 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:53,680 I'm sure you've seen it. The next one, 152 00:10:50,959 --> 00:10:56,720 um our recommendation would be to do it 153 00:10:53,680 --> 00:10:59,600 as soon as the signage comes down for 154 00:10:56,720 --> 00:11:00,880 the previous intersection. Um not I 155 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:03,839 wouldn't recommend doing both of them at 156 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:08,720 the same time, but doing them staggering 157 00:11:03,839 --> 00:11:11,839 in order so that that new change is 158 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:13,040 still familiar in everyone's minds. It's 159 00:11:11,839 --> 00:11:14,320 not a requirement. It's just a 160 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:16,399 recommendation if you for whatever 161 00:11:14,320 --> 00:11:19,360 reason want to push it off a few months 162 00:11:16,399 --> 00:11:20,959 or however long. My only concern there 163 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:24,320 is we know that it meets because of 164 00:11:20,959 --> 00:11:26,959 crash. So the longer you wait is the the 165 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:28,560 more danger that that will happen again. 166 00:11:26,959 --> 00:11:31,680 Um with that I'll stand for any 167 00:11:28,560 --> 00:11:34,880 questions that you may have. 168 00:11:31,680 --> 00:11:35,920 » Any any have want questions for Mr. 169 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:36,560 » Mr. Mayor? 170 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:38,560 » Mr. Dean 171 00:11:36,560 --> 00:11:39,839 » I did have one question. So, the the two 172 00:11:38,560 --> 00:11:41,760 specific ones you're speaking about 173 00:11:39,839 --> 00:11:43,440 tonight that the memo relates to is 53rd 174 00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:43,920 in Oliver and 53rd and Web. 175 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:47,440 » Yeah. 176 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:48,880 » Um 53rd and Oliver is pretty clear to me 177 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:51,120 because it's very similar to the one we 178 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,560 just converted at Woodlon and 53rd. 53rd 179 00:11:51,120 --> 00:11:54,240 and Web is a completely different 180 00:11:52,560 --> 00:11:57,120 situation because of the fact that it's 181 00:11:54,240 --> 00:12:01,040 a four-way or a four-lane highway or 182 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:04,000 four-lane main road with a two-lane 183 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:05,279 crossing. It was that a fact. Can you 184 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,880 explain how that may have played a 185 00:12:05,279 --> 00:12:07,680 factor in how you analyzed it a little 186 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:09,279 bit? 187 00:12:07,680 --> 00:12:12,480 » That doesn't play as much of a factor in 188 00:12:09,279 --> 00:12:14,399 in meeting the simple warrants. Uh it it 189 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:16,480 it's a more complex situation, I'll 190 00:12:14,399 --> 00:12:19,120 grant you, but the warrants themselves 191 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:21,440 are based on volume. So, 192 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:23,680 » It's something that we can discuss more 193 00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:26,000 and and 194 00:12:23,680 --> 00:12:27,920 work on how that solution should be 195 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:30,800 implemented if that's a concern that 196 00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:31,920 council has. Uh the other one is pretty 197 00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:34,320 straightforward and could probably be 198 00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:36,720 done whenever. Um, but you're right, 199 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:38,800 that's it's a different situation 200 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:40,079 because it's additional lanes. 201 00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:41,440 » Yeah. I mean, one of the things that 202 00:12:40,079 --> 00:12:42,720 comes to mind is a lot of times when you 203 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:44,480 see, and I'm not saying we shouldn't do 204 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:47,120 it. I'm just saying it's obviously a 205 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:49,600 different situation than the last few. 206 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:51,839 Um, usually you see a divided portion of 207 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:53,680 the road with some sort of a median or 208 00:12:51,839 --> 00:12:55,839 something so that there's a there's a 209 00:12:53,680 --> 00:12:58,560 stop sign in the middle as well as on 210 00:12:55,839 --> 00:13:01,200 the sides so that somebody can't just 211 00:12:58,560 --> 00:13:03,519 blow through it or there is at least a 212 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:04,240 blinking light or something overhead so 213 00:13:03,519 --> 00:13:06,000 that it catches 214 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:07,519 » I think not to cut you off but one of 215 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:09,600 the things that we've been doing is 216 00:13:07,519 --> 00:13:11,040 adding the LED border to all the new 217 00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:12,399 stop signs. So, I think that's something 218 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:12,800 that we would recommend also, 219 00:13:12,399 --> 00:13:14,399 » Right? 220 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:16,399 » And that'll help. And we'll have 221 00:13:14,399 --> 00:13:17,760 advanced warning signs coming up to the 222 00:13:16,399 --> 00:13:21,120 intersection in every direction just 223 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:23,519 like the one we put in that says that 224 00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:25,200 there's a stop sign ahead. A stop bar 225 00:13:23,519 --> 00:13:26,320 also will go all the way across both 226 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:27,839 lanes. 227 00:13:26,320 --> 00:13:29,440 » So, there's other indications, but 228 00:13:27,839 --> 00:13:30,959 you're right. It's it's an additional 229 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:31,440 lane that it's not right there next to 230 00:13:30,959 --> 00:13:33,680 you. 231 00:13:31,440 --> 00:13:35,839 » Right. That design just looks and feels 232 00:13:33,680 --> 00:13:38,000 a lot different to me. So, I just wasn't 233 00:13:35,839 --> 00:13:40,240 sure if I know you're recommending it. 234 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:43,760 it meets the warrants, but how much 235 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:45,680 additional leg work are you seeing in a 236 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:48,720 design of converting that? 237 00:13:45,680 --> 00:13:50,399 » There's there's not really room, if I'm 238 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:54,160 not mistaken, to put in a median or 239 00:13:50,399 --> 00:13:56,160 anything. And it's a median is not 240 00:13:54,160 --> 00:13:58,639 required in that situation. I I think 241 00:13:56,160 --> 00:14:00,160 the other thing to probably think about 242 00:13:58,639 --> 00:14:02,880 is 243 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:04,160 is there some sort of and we didn't we 244 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:05,680 weren't asked to look at this, so we 245 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:07,440 haven't looked at it. Is there a need 246 00:14:05,680 --> 00:14:10,639 for a left turn lane in each direction? 247 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:12,079 So that that that inside lane turns into 248 00:14:10,639 --> 00:14:12,560 a left turn lane, which 249 00:14:12,079 --> 00:14:14,560 » Right 250 00:14:12,560 --> 00:14:16,959 » I don't like doing because if you're in 251 00:14:14,560 --> 00:14:18,959 that lane, your your lane just turns for 252 00:14:16,959 --> 00:14:21,279 you and you have to know when to get out 253 00:14:18,959 --> 00:14:23,360 of that lane. But it is a possibility if 254 00:14:21,279 --> 00:14:26,560 it meets warrants and we have the 255 00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:28,959 geometry to do so. Another part of that 256 00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:30,560 equation is what the through volume is 257 00:14:28,959 --> 00:14:32,959 and whether you really need four lanes 258 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:34,880 or not or if you can get by with one 259 00:14:32,959 --> 00:14:37,120 through lane in each direction north and 260 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:40,079 south. 261 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:42,240 » My one concern and I know that um it's 262 00:14:40,079 --> 00:14:45,600 not unheard of to have a stop sign at a 263 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:48,560 55 mph zone a speed limit, but that road 264 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:51,839 is a 55 mph speed limit on at 53rd and 265 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:55,519 web. The web is 55. And I just wonder if 266 00:14:51,839 --> 00:14:57,199 maybe we would be wiser to also consider 267 00:14:55,519 --> 00:14:58,880 reducing that speed limit. I don't know 268 00:14:57,199 --> 00:15:01,360 what that should be, but 269 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:04,480 » I would I would recommend that. Yes. 270 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:06,320 » And it's part of a it's not all that 271 00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:08,399 complex, but a speed study or speed 272 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:12,079 consideration for that to take it down 273 00:15:08,399 --> 00:15:13,279 to 45 in either direction coming up to 274 00:15:12,079 --> 00:15:15,040 that intersection, I think, is 275 00:15:13,279 --> 00:15:16,639 definitely something that would be 276 00:15:15,040 --> 00:15:19,639 advantageous. 277 00:15:16,639 --> 00:15:19,639 » Okay. 278 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:22,880 Okay, 279 00:15:20,959 --> 00:15:25,600 » Mr. Aser, 280 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:30,720 did have you ever experienced with a 281 00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:33,519 four-lane uh stop sign like this where 282 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:36,079 things got worse because a stop sign was 283 00:15:33,519 --> 00:15:39,680 installed? Has that ever been the case? 284 00:15:36,079 --> 00:15:42,079 » Not not that we just installed. I think 285 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:44,480 there are a few locations where an 286 00:15:42,079 --> 00:15:47,839 existing stop sign could have been a 287 00:15:44,480 --> 00:15:52,000 problem. But again, it it often comes 288 00:15:47,839 --> 00:15:54,399 down to volume and speed, both of which 289 00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:56,000 speed we can control. Volume we can't 290 00:15:54,399 --> 00:15:59,440 necessarily, but I don't remember the 291 00:15:56,000 --> 00:16:02,079 volumes being so high that like we were 292 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:03,680 talking even the four laid may not be 293 00:16:02,079 --> 00:16:05,279 required. I don't know the numbers off 294 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:07,360 the top of my head without looking at 295 00:16:05,279 --> 00:16:10,959 them, but 296 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:14,480 generally that's a a much higher volume 297 00:16:10,959 --> 00:16:16,639 and I without knowing what they are, I 298 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:19,040 would be surprised if they were enough 299 00:16:16,639 --> 00:16:22,160 to warrant that for most of the day. So, 300 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:24,639 we could put in less. The the the 301 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:27,120 problem with those less in that 302 00:16:24,639 --> 00:16:29,279 configuration is typically you'd want 303 00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:31,440 those to line up so you don't have a 304 00:16:29,279 --> 00:16:33,759 possibility for a conflict of turning 305 00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:37,199 vehicles opposing each other and it's 306 00:16:33,759 --> 00:16:38,800 clearer to see if you separate them and 307 00:16:37,199 --> 00:16:40,240 set send them across the intersection. 308 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:42,240 Not only is there the opportunity that 309 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:44,800 they could hit each other, but also that 310 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:46,320 car now blocks through traffic in the 311 00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:48,880 other direction, which shouldn't be a 312 00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:52,480 problem at a four-way stop, but it's 313 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:54,880 always something and you can't 314 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:58,320 completely eliminate the the conflict or 315 00:16:54,880 --> 00:17:00,160 the the opportunity for the crash. So, 316 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:02,079 all those are considerations that should 317 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:03,600 be taken into account if we're going to 318 00:17:02,079 --> 00:17:06,000 talk about changing the geometry or the 319 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:08,079 configuration in any way, but it's all 320 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:09,760 something we can look at for you if 321 00:17:08,079 --> 00:17:11,439 that's something that you think is 322 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:14,679 warranted. 323 00:17:11,439 --> 00:17:14,679 » Thank you, 324 00:17:15,679 --> 00:17:21,439 » Mr. Parker. 325 00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:25,360 » Mr. Mayor, uh Mr. Asure. 326 00:17:21,439 --> 00:17:27,919 » Okay. Uh, do we need to do a 327 00:17:25,360 --> 00:17:29,600 uh traffic study to or I guess is this a 328 00:17:27,919 --> 00:17:31,039 traffic study that would you could also 329 00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:33,360 make that recommendation to drop the 330 00:17:31,039 --> 00:17:33,919 speed down 45 or do we need to do more 331 00:17:33,360 --> 00:17:36,160 for that? 332 00:17:33,919 --> 00:17:38,799 » Uh, we could make a recommendation to 333 00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:41,440 staff to do that. Um, I need to look at 334 00:17:38,799 --> 00:17:44,240 it and have conversation with some of my 335 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:46,320 guys to make sure that the information 336 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:49,120 that I'm conjuring in my head right now 337 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:52,080 is accurate. But yes, it's could be 338 00:17:49,120 --> 00:17:56,480 pretty straightforward. 339 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:59,679 Good. Uh, and of course we're not voting 340 00:17:56,480 --> 00:18:02,400 on it, but but it sounds like we'd like 341 00:17:59,679 --> 00:18:02,960 some more uh information on 53rd and 342 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:03,360 web. 343 00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:07,360 » Yeah. 344 00:18:03,360 --> 00:18:10,960 » Um, and I think 53rd and Oliver, we need 345 00:18:07,360 --> 00:18:13,679 to just go do it, right? Okay. Uh, I 346 00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:15,120 think that's within your authority to to 347 00:18:13,679 --> 00:18:16,400 authorize that. Is that correct? 348 00:18:15,120 --> 00:18:18,320 » Yes. 349 00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:21,200 I think I'd like a motion, I think, from 350 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:23,520 the council just to make sure when the 351 00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:26,160 time comes. Um, that would probably be 352 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:29,760 more clean for me. Uh, just with a few 353 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:32,080 traffic four-way stops, it helps uh even 354 00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:32,559 with PR uh that the council made this 355 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:34,640 decision. 356 00:18:32,559 --> 00:18:36,720 » Okay. Well, we we could do that now if 357 00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:40,480 if somebody wants to make that motion. 358 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:42,240 Mr. Proctor. Wow. 359 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:45,679 » Mr. Mr. Mayor, I'd like to make a motion 360 00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:49,360 that we um 361 00:18:45,679 --> 00:18:55,760 put a four-way stop at 53rd and Oliver. 362 00:18:49,360 --> 00:18:58,000 Uh also 53rd and Web and upon the 363 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:59,760 recommendation of the engineering firm 364 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:01,520 uh 365 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:03,120 with their direction recommendation 366 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:06,120 reduce the speed down to 45 miles an 367 00:19:03,120 --> 00:19:06,120 hour. 368 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:21,039 I have Mr. A motion from Mr. Proctor for 369 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:24,160 a four-way stop at 53rd in Oliver and 370 00:19:21,039 --> 00:19:26,240 additional four-way stop at 53rd in web 371 00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:28,720 with uh recommendations from the 372 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:32,400 engineering firm to reduce the speed to 373 00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:36,000 45 miles per hour. 374 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:38,160 Can I repeat that reasonably accurate? 375 00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:40,559 You left out some stuttering. 376 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:44,440 » Okay. I I try not to do that, but I'm 377 00:19:40,559 --> 00:19:44,440 not immune from it. 378 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:49,720 » Do we have a second on that motion? 379 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:58,640 » Okay. Well, Mr. Mayor, 380 00:19:56,559 --> 00:20:00,480 » Go ahead. I I was just going to say 381 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:02,640 after we cleared that that I'd like to 382 00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:05,039 decouple those because I do think until 383 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:07,520 we get more information on 53rd and web 384 00:20:05,039 --> 00:20:08,880 till Tim can come back to us and say, 385 00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:10,640 "Yep, this is the way we'd like to 386 00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:12,880 proceed." I don't want to make a 387 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:15,200 decision on either the four-way stop at 388 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:17,120 53rd and web or the speed limit until we 389 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:19,360 have that additional information. So, 390 00:20:17,120 --> 00:20:21,120 I'll go ahead and motion 391 00:20:19,360 --> 00:20:23,520 uh for us to move forward with 392 00:20:21,120 --> 00:20:24,640 installing a four-way stop at 53rd and 393 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:27,880 Oliver. 394 00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:27,880 » I'll second. 395 00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:39,760 I have a motion by Mr. Dean for four-way 396 00:20:36,799 --> 00:20:42,960 stop at 53rd and Oliver with a second by 397 00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:44,960 Mr. David. 398 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:47,520 » I have one point of discussion 399 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:50,640 » And time for discussion. This is right. 400 00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:54,000 This is the time. Um, I know when we 401 00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:55,840 installed the the four-way stop at 53rd 402 00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:56,400 and Rock, I believe was the most recent 403 00:20:55,840 --> 00:20:58,080 one. 404 00:20:56,400 --> 00:21:00,240 » Most recent one was Woodline, but there 405 00:20:58,080 --> 00:21:02,400 is a four-way stop at Rock as well. 406 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:06,640 » Um, I received several comments from 407 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:09,679 residents about the congestion and how 408 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:13,520 long it takes. Uh, one story was related 409 00:21:09,679 --> 00:21:16,640 to me trying to go north on Rock Road. 410 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:20,720 Um, to get from the quick trip up to the 411 00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:24,240 four-way stop took 45 minutes 412 00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:26,159 for this individual. So, I'd like to 413 00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:27,520 » 45th or at 53rd. 414 00:21:26,159 --> 00:21:28,799 » Sorry, at 45th. 415 00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:31,919 » Okay. 416 00:21:28,799 --> 00:21:33,840 » Unfortunately, 45th and Wood and and 417 00:21:31,919 --> 00:21:35,919 Rock Road is Witchaw's jurisdiction. 418 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:36,400 It's not Bell's jurisdiction. 419 00:21:35,919 --> 00:21:38,559 » Okay. 420 00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:40,720 » Mr. Mayor, I'll also add, Brandon, this 421 00:21:38,559 --> 00:21:42,400 happened last time. Woodlon is supposed 422 00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:44,720 to detour to Oliver, but a lot of people 423 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:46,640 are trying to use that route, and that 424 00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:48,320 has caused a lot of backups. I see them 425 00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:50,480 in the evening as well 426 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:52,720 » Because people are avoiding using the 427 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:55,120 Oliver or Edgemore, like there's 428 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:56,720 multiple routes, but I have noticed that 429 00:21:55,120 --> 00:21:59,039 since we've started the Woodlon 430 00:21:56,720 --> 00:22:01,280 reconstruction that 431 00:21:59,039 --> 00:22:02,880 » It backs up. I know. I've seen it. So, 432 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:04,000 going I'm sorry to interrupt you. 433 00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:06,400 » I've definitely noticed that. One thing 434 00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:09,360 I'd like to know more about is just 435 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:11,280 based on traffic volume, if we install 436 00:22:09,360 --> 00:22:14,240 this four-way stop, are we going to 437 00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:18,000 cause a similar backup now on the west 438 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:19,679 side of our city where people are trying 439 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:21,919 to get through and it's just taking 440 00:22:19,679 --> 00:22:25,360 forever because they're stopping all the 441 00:22:21,919 --> 00:22:27,280 they everybody stops now. I'd like to 442 00:22:25,360 --> 00:22:30,480 understand more about that before we 443 00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:32,960 just go and do it. Um, with the crash 444 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:34,720 data, I understand it's a great idea, 445 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:35,760 but I'd like to understand the impact a 446 00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:37,360 little bit more. 447 00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:40,080 » So, 448 00:22:37,360 --> 00:22:41,440 in general terms, anytime you add a stop 449 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:43,919 sign where there wasn't one before, 450 00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:46,640 you're going to increase delay. That is 451 00:22:43,919 --> 00:22:50,720 simple math. The the difference, I 452 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:52,799 think, is you're forcing that, let's 453 00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:54,320 call it northbound, southbound traffic 454 00:22:52,799 --> 00:22:56,400 because they're all essentially the 455 00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:59,600 same. you're stopping that north south 456 00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:01,919 traffic to allow people from the east 457 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:03,440 west direction to make that movement 458 00:23:01,919 --> 00:23:06,960 safely, whichever movement they're 459 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:07,919 trying to make. That's the angle crashes 460 00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:09,440 that we're seeing at those 461 00:23:07,919 --> 00:23:12,240 intersections. That's what the pro the 462 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:14,559 majority of them are. And that's the 463 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:19,120 problem that we're trying to solve. And 464 00:23:14,559 --> 00:23:21,600 from where we sit, it is 465 00:23:19,120 --> 00:23:23,679 a safer situation to increase the delay 466 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:26,480 on north or southbound traffic to allow 467 00:23:23,679 --> 00:23:28,400 that turn to happen and reduce crashes. 468 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:30,720 Yes. The downside is there is some 469 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:33,440 delay. What you're talking about is 470 00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:35,440 excessive delay, which sounds like it 471 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:37,120 may be for a different reason than the 472 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:38,799 stop sign itself. 473 00:23:37,120 --> 00:23:42,559 » Increased traffic, diverted traffic, 474 00:23:38,799 --> 00:23:46,960 whatever that may be. And we could try 475 00:23:42,559 --> 00:23:48,960 to look at it, but it is a much more 476 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:52,080 complex problem because it's a much 477 00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:54,720 broader area. Um, at some point that 478 00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:57,679 could become a citywide traffic study 479 00:23:54,720 --> 00:24:00,559 that you do not want to pay for. Uh, 480 00:23:57,679 --> 00:24:02,480 happy to do it, but maybe not the best 481 00:24:00,559 --> 00:24:05,120 use of your funds. And it's also a 482 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:06,799 temporary problem. 483 00:24:05,120 --> 00:24:08,720 » So, I don't know if I answered your 484 00:24:06,799 --> 00:24:10,880 question or not, but 485 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:12,000 » You did. Thank you. 486 00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:13,840 Mr. Mayor, 487 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:15,440 » Mr. Dh David, 488 00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:18,000 » I guess I'll ask that question slightly 489 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:20,799 different way. Um, it didn't quite meet 490 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:24,000 the warrant of the 140. So, you got 210 491 00:24:20,799 --> 00:24:27,039 going north and south at least and 140 492 00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:29,120 going east and west. Um, do you know the 493 00:24:27,039 --> 00:24:30,320 ratio of that? Because because like you 494 00:24:29,120 --> 00:24:33,120 said, you're trying to solve the east 495 00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:35,200 and west problem. Give them a chance to 496 00:24:33,120 --> 00:24:36,799 » Yeah, but it's and I don't know the 497 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:39,600 ratio top of my head, but it's a 498 00:24:36,799 --> 00:24:40,960 combination of the total volume. If all 499 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:42,559 your traffic's going to one direction, 500 00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:43,840 you got nobody coming from the other. 501 00:24:42,559 --> 00:24:46,320 Doesn't make any difference because you 502 00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:49,200 don't need anybody. It's it's there's 503 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:50,799 enough coming that wants to turn or go 504 00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:52,000 through and there's enough going the 505 00:24:50,799 --> 00:24:53,600 other direction that it's preventing 506 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:55,200 them from doing so in a reasonable 507 00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:58,080 manner. 508 00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:59,840 » Speed's part of that. Um the high angle 509 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:01,679 crashes are are part of that because 510 00:24:59,840 --> 00:25:03,919 that's the downside of not having enough 511 00:25:01,679 --> 00:25:07,279 gap or sufficient gap to be able to make 512 00:25:03,919 --> 00:25:08,640 that movement safely. Um I I'm not sure 513 00:25:07,279 --> 00:25:09,440 that I understood which question you 514 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:10,559 were asking, but 515 00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:13,679 » I was really going to ask that question 516 00:25:10,559 --> 00:25:15,039 about web, but um it'd be good data to 517 00:25:13,679 --> 00:25:16,080 have for Oliver as well. 518 00:25:15,039 --> 00:25:16,559 » What the cross street, 519 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,159 » You know, 520 00:25:16,559 --> 00:25:19,440 » What the cross street volumes are. 521 00:25:18,159 --> 00:25:21,440 » Yeah. Because if you don't have a high 522 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:23,520 cross street volume, you're really not 523 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:24,960 solving the problem. But but what that 524 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:25,919 memo is telling you is 525 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:28,480 » It is 526 00:25:25,919 --> 00:25:31,360 » I can show you what the counts are, but 527 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:34,000 those counts put into that 528 00:25:31,360 --> 00:25:36,400 warrant actually it meets it at this 529 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,799 current state or it meets seven of eight 530 00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:38,240 hours. 531 00:25:36,799 --> 00:25:40,240 » Yeah, warrant D I thought we didn't 532 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:42,640 quite meet for Oliver, 533 00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:43,760 » But it was close enough. I would say I I 534 00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:44,960 can't remember the numbers off the top 535 00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:47,039 of my head, but 536 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:50,240 » They were both close enough that it was 537 00:25:47,039 --> 00:25:52,960 worth warranting even for just that one 538 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:54,720 warrant without the crashes included as 539 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:56,640 the a separate warrant that's met. 540 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:58,960 » I'm really complaining about the the 541 00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:01,200 warrant. That that data to me doesn't 542 00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:03,039 tell me the whole story. I want to see 543 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:05,279 what the ratio is between the two. 544 00:26:03,039 --> 00:26:06,960 » I we have that data. I can provide it. 545 00:26:05,279 --> 00:26:09,679 Yeah, 546 00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:12,159 I think Oliver obviously warrants it, 547 00:26:09,679 --> 00:26:13,360 but um I'd still like to see those 548 00:26:12,159 --> 00:26:15,200 numbers, especially on 549 00:26:13,360 --> 00:26:17,440 » I think the difference with web is that 550 00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:19,600 not only is that north south traffic not 551 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:21,600 stopping, but also you've got a far a 552 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:24,720 further distance to travel to clear 553 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:27,360 those through lanes creating a 554 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:28,960 » A more unsafe situation and then you 555 00:26:27,360 --> 00:26:32,320 bring speed into it and it takes it up 556 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:34,400 to a yet another level. 557 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,760 » Mr. Mayor, I was also going to say uh 558 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:36,960 you mentioned earlier the volume you 559 00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:38,640 don't really have control. The honest 560 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,880 truth is we're a growing city and 561 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:43,279 growing cities do have more homes and 562 00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:45,440 more homes produce more cars and more 563 00:26:43,279 --> 00:26:48,159 cars produce more traffic and more 564 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:49,520 traffic produces more accidents. And so 565 00:26:48,159 --> 00:26:50,880 part of what we're dealing with and 566 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,960 we're going to continue to deal with is 567 00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:54,960 decisions like this. When is the time 568 00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:56,640 right to do a four-way stop? When is the 569 00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:58,240 time right to do a stoplight? Because 570 00:26:56,640 --> 00:27:00,320 some of our intersections are probably 571 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:03,440 approaching that at some point, right? 572 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:05,279 And so this is not going away. And I 573 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:07,440 have heard the same concerns from a few 574 00:27:05,279 --> 00:27:09,679 folks. I'll say a couple folks, like 575 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:12,720 very few people have reached out to me 576 00:27:09,679 --> 00:27:14,559 also and said, "Please don't put up stop 577 00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:16,880 signs because I don't want this to 578 00:27:14,559 --> 00:27:18,960 inconvenience me." And I've seen enough 579 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:21,360 data in the crash data for the last few 580 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:23,200 years that I am comfortable with Oliver 581 00:27:21,360 --> 00:27:25,760 and I am comfortable with with long beam 582 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:28,720 four-way stops because I know data 583 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:30,960 proves and proved out on rock that we 584 00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:33,360 reduce the crashes. And so to me, this 585 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:35,120 is a no-brainer on Oliver. Um web 586 00:27:33,360 --> 00:27:37,200 remains to be seen just because I think 587 00:27:35,120 --> 00:27:38,880 there's a little bit more how are we 588 00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:40,320 going to actually deal with that if we 589 00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:42,559 move forward with the four-way stop and 590 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:44,880 actually do it safely. And I don't 591 00:27:42,559 --> 00:27:47,840 otherwise I don't think there's any 592 00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:51,039 question to me on Oliver. 593 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:53,520 » Okay. Mr. Bctor, 594 00:27:51,039 --> 00:27:57,279 » Mr. Mayor, some comments I was I figured 595 00:27:53,520 --> 00:28:00,159 I'd offer it is half I I guess Circle 596 00:27:57,279 --> 00:28:03,200 School District starts half a mile east 597 00:28:00,159 --> 00:28:05,919 of Rock Road and and how a lot of those 598 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:07,919 high school kids or uh that are actually 599 00:28:05,919 --> 00:28:09,600 are starting to drive get to school or 600 00:28:07,919 --> 00:28:11,840 could get to school is they can drive 601 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:13,600 over to Circle Greenwich Elementary and 602 00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:16,000 then they and then they get bust on up 603 00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:17,360 the highway. So there there are students 604 00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:19,760 that are crossing going that way. 605 00:28:17,360 --> 00:28:21,120 There's also students that um are 606 00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:23,120 probably using that intersection leaving 607 00:28:21,120 --> 00:28:24,880 the high school right over there and 608 00:28:23,120 --> 00:28:28,000 even as you know someone who's been 609 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:30,640 driving a long time web that's all 610 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:32,240 that's all really uh kind of sketchy but 611 00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:34,000 I'm not really sure what to do about it 612 00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:35,679 even as our like our son starting to 613 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:39,039 drive and he'll be going over at some 614 00:28:35,679 --> 00:28:41,200 point to cross web and I just I I think 615 00:28:39,039 --> 00:28:43,039 about especially new drivers and I don't 616 00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:44,720 know if that's even a data point of the 617 00:28:43,039 --> 00:28:46,799 age of the drivers but I don't know that 618 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:49,919 it's that big of a factor. 619 00:28:46,799 --> 00:28:51,520 It's not something that is part of what 620 00:28:49,919 --> 00:28:55,039 we analyze as part of the warrant. 621 00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:56,559 » Sure. Yeah. But um anyways, just giving 622 00:28:55,039 --> 00:28:58,880 students even a safe way to get across 623 00:28:56,559 --> 00:29:00,720 because I mean it's four lanes 624 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,520 » Split up going both ways pretty quick. 625 00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:05,039 » Yeah, I I get it. I'm I'm a little 626 00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:06,799 concerned about it myself. That's a 627 00:29:05,039 --> 00:29:10,559 that's a wonky intersection because you 628 00:29:06,799 --> 00:29:12,559 got four lanes uh north and south, you 629 00:29:10,559 --> 00:29:14,320 got two lanes on the west side, and you 630 00:29:12,559 --> 00:29:17,679 got three lanes on the east side. So, 631 00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:19,840 it's like that's a it's a ma mix mass of 632 00:29:17,679 --> 00:29:23,039 everything. So, that's that's what 633 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:24,640 pretty wild. But anyway, Miss Hamburg, 634 00:29:23,039 --> 00:29:26,159 » I know we're on Oliver, but I'll make my 635 00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:28,480 web comment too. One other thing I 636 00:29:26,159 --> 00:29:30,720 mentioned to Ted was and just thinking 637 00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:32,159 through how it is four lanes and you got 638 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:35,520 the speed change. We don't know what's 639 00:29:32,159 --> 00:29:37,279 going to happen with 254 and um where 640 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:39,120 the interchange is exactly going to go 641 00:29:37,279 --> 00:29:40,640 and development, but you never know 642 00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:42,720 that. Another thing I mentioned to Ted 643 00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:45,840 was the possibility of a cost sharing 644 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:48,559 with Witchaw at 45th and Web or the 645 00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:50,480 airport authority. I I don't know what 646 00:29:48,559 --> 00:29:53,200 that would entail to study that and and 647 00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:55,039 maybe just do a traffic light there. I 648 00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:56,640 know there's one further south. So So I 649 00:29:55,039 --> 00:29:57,679 don't have a great answer on that, but I 650 00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:00,960 thought it was maybe something worth 651 00:29:57,679 --> 00:30:03,120 pursuing since a four-way stop might be 652 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:05,120 a little more complicated, but I I see 653 00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:07,360 it both ways, but I'm totally in support 654 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:09,440 um of of the Oliver. I've seen so many 655 00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:10,799 crashes and just the issues and the 656 00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:12,640 development up there. So, I'll I'll be 657 00:30:10,799 --> 00:30:14,960 supporting this specific motion. 658 00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:18,000 » The warrant, just for discussion 659 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:21,039 purposes, the warrant for a stop sign is 660 00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:22,640 far lower than what a signal would be. 661 00:30:21,039 --> 00:30:23,840 And I don't know that again, I don't 662 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:26,159 know the numbers off the top of my head, 663 00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:27,679 but I would be surprised if it was 664 00:30:26,159 --> 00:30:29,679 enough to warrant a signal 665 00:30:27,679 --> 00:30:31,840 » At 45th and web. 666 00:30:29,679 --> 00:30:33,679 » Yeah. I I don't know. 667 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:35,279 » I know you guys counted that one. That's 668 00:30:33,679 --> 00:30:36,799 it's an additional thing what I was 669 00:30:35,279 --> 00:30:38,640 » Whether the city had counted it in the 670 00:30:36,799 --> 00:30:40,960 last cycle is what I was trying to 671 00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:42,480 remember and I can't 672 00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,720 » Yeah 673 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:45,520 so if that's a concern we can also look 674 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:46,960 at that 675 00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:50,399 » It was just it was just a thought and if 676 00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:53,919 there was a cost sharing option there so 677 00:30:50,399 --> 00:30:55,760 » Okay I might add we we mainly focused on 678 00:30:53,919 --> 00:30:57,840 Oliver because that's that's where it 679 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:59,440 was but because we had Tim looking at 680 00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:01,120 traffic studies we said hey will you 681 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:02,880 take a look at web so I I know there's 682 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:04,960 more work to do on web especially with 683 00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:07,120 the way it looks out. We'll we'll work 684 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,960 on that and uh come back. And thank you, 685 00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:11,200 Miss uh Council Member Hamburg, for 686 00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:13,679 reminding me of the 45th and web. 687 00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:15,600 There's two intersections on on web, so 688 00:31:13,679 --> 00:31:16,960 we might take a little look at that as 689 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:20,399 well. 690 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:22,720 » Okay. Any other discussion? We have a we 691 00:31:20,399 --> 00:31:24,159 still have a motion to vote on, so I 692 00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:27,120 don't want to cut off discussion if 693 00:31:24,159 --> 00:31:29,279 we've got any more to do. But if not, 694 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:31,279 I'll call for a vote. All in favor say 695 00:31:29,279 --> 00:31:32,960 I. I. I. 696 00:31:31,279 --> 00:31:35,840 » Any opposed? 697 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:38,080 That motion carries five to zero. Thank 698 00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:39,840 you. 699 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:41,679 All right. The next item on the agenda 700 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:43,840 is citizens concerns. Do we have any 701 00:31:41,679 --> 00:31:46,480 citizens here who wish to speak to this 702 00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:49,760 council? Please come to the podium and 703 00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:52,480 state your name, address, and uh we'll 704 00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:54,559 give you three minutes. 705 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:58,880 » Thank you. My name is Keith Erlic. I 706 00:31:54,559 --> 00:32:01,120 live at 4957 East Willow Point Court. 707 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:04,720 And I just read last week, according to 708 00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:08,080 the Witchaw Eagle, that the city of Bair 709 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:11,279 is getting a Sinclair gas station. And I 710 00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:13,840 got to ask why. You're putting a gas 711 00:32:11,279 --> 00:32:17,279 station in the middle of the residential 712 00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:19,279 area at 45th and Woodlon. At 45th and 713 00:32:17,279 --> 00:32:21,840 Woodland, 714 00:32:19,279 --> 00:32:23,519 no businesses have ever done well at 715 00:32:21,840 --> 00:32:26,080 45th and Woodland. So now you're going 716 00:32:23,519 --> 00:32:27,440 to put a business in there that's never 717 00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:29,279 going to make it. And then you're going 718 00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:32,320 to end up with environmental hazards 719 00:32:29,279 --> 00:32:33,519 trying to pull the tanks out. And you're 720 00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:36,960 talking about traffic. You're talking 721 00:32:33,519 --> 00:32:38,399 about a 247 out 247 convenience store 722 00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:40,720 that's going to draw the wrong kind of 723 00:32:38,399 --> 00:32:43,279 people at the wrong time of the day. 724 00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:44,880 It's going to tax our our police 725 00:32:43,279 --> 00:32:47,200 officers who are going to have to be 726 00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:50,720 patrolling that area. The city of Bair 727 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:53,440 is encircled by Quick Trips, Dillons, 728 00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:57,039 Casey's, everything else. Why are we 729 00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:58,799 trying to put a gas station at 45th in 730 00:32:57,039 --> 00:33:00,640 Woodland? 731 00:32:58,799 --> 00:33:02,240 This just does makes absolutely no 732 00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:04,080 sense. I'm sorry. It just makes no 733 00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:06,640 sense. So in the heart of the 734 00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:08,960 residential district of Belair, 735 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:11,360 thank you. And you've got 736 00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:13,600 $500,000 plus homes just a half a mile 737 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:15,279 down the road and you've got the 738 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:17,279 Catholic Life Center. You're talking 739 00:33:15,279 --> 00:33:18,799 about additional traffic, everything 740 00:33:17,279 --> 00:33:21,360 else. this place and you know this 741 00:33:18,799 --> 00:33:22,720 business is never going to succeed and 742 00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:26,080 they're not a cor good corporate 743 00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:28,399 business at they have a store at 21st in 744 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:30,080 Woodlon and they're not a good corporate 745 00:33:28,399 --> 00:33:34,399 business down there and as soon as the 746 00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:37,440 quick trip at 21st and Woodlon is done 747 00:33:34,399 --> 00:33:39,919 that store is going to be done. So why 748 00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:41,760 are we authorizing somebody to build a 749 00:33:39,919 --> 00:33:43,039 building that's never going to make it? 750 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,640 That's all I got to say. Thank you. 751 00:33:43,039 --> 00:33:47,200 » All right. Thank you. I appreciate your 752 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:49,919 comments. So, 753 00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:51,919 any other citizens? 754 00:33:49,919 --> 00:33:55,039 I take it we don't have any others. We 755 00:33:51,919 --> 00:33:57,919 we don't have any comment cards uh 756 00:33:55,039 --> 00:34:00,080 » From the clerk. Okay. Thank you. Well, 757 00:33:57,919 --> 00:34:04,559 we'll move on to council member reports 758 00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:06,720 and we'll start with Mr. uh Macintosh. 759 00:34:04,559 --> 00:34:10,960 » Trying to mix it up a little bit. 760 00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:15,119 » Um we'll we'll cover mine in item 13D. 761 00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:16,480 » Okay. Very good. Mr. Proctor. 762 00:34:15,119 --> 00:34:18,079 No report, Mr. Mayor. 763 00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,599 » Okay, Mr. David. 764 00:34:18,079 --> 00:34:20,720 » No report. Thank you, 765 00:34:19,599 --> 00:34:22,320 » Mr. Dean. 766 00:34:20,720 --> 00:34:25,359 » Mr. Mayor, I do have one quick thing. 767 00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:27,760 Yesterday, our K254 corridor development 768 00:34:25,359 --> 00:34:29,839 association plan implementation 769 00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:32,240 committee, I know that's a mouthful, had 770 00:34:29,839 --> 00:34:34,560 a call uh we visited with several folks 771 00:34:32,240 --> 00:34:37,200 from KOT to continue discussing um 772 00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:38,800 federal grant opportunities and also a 773 00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:41,040 little bit more in depth on what their 774 00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:43,119 state funding options look like. Um 775 00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:46,159 really the whole idea here is to try to 776 00:34:43,119 --> 00:34:47,919 help um move forward some of the smaller 777 00:34:46,159 --> 00:34:49,520 short-term improvements as a part of the 778 00:34:47,919 --> 00:34:51,040 corridor management plan. So we're 779 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,960 trying to learn as much as we can so 780 00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:54,720 that we can share that with our members. 781 00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:56,240 Um I'm excited. There was a couple 782 00:34:54,720 --> 00:34:57,920 really cool things that were shared with 783 00:34:56,240 --> 00:35:02,160 us on the call about some opportunities 784 00:34:57,920 --> 00:35:04,560 that were specific for corridor um 785 00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:06,079 places that have corridor plans. And so 786 00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:07,440 that was exciting and I'm looking 787 00:35:06,079 --> 00:35:09,119 forward to sharing that with some of our 788 00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:11,760 membership on Friday and continuing 789 00:35:09,119 --> 00:35:12,800 discussing option options with KOT. 790 00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:14,480 That's all I have. 791 00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:18,400 » All right. Well, very good. Thank you. 792 00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:20,640 Good to hear that. And uh Miss Hamburg. 793 00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:22,240 » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh nothing report 794 00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:24,240 worthy this evening. Thank you. 795 00:35:22,240 --> 00:35:26,960 » Okay. Well, thank you. We'll move on. 796 00:35:24,240 --> 00:35:29,760 Mayor's report. So on August 12th, I 797 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:33,520 attended the monthly WAMPO meeting and 798 00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:35,599 we approved the fiscal year the federal 799 00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:37,839 fiscal year 2027 through the federal 800 00:35:35,599 --> 00:35:40,240 fiscal year 2030 transportation 801 00:35:37,839 --> 00:35:43,119 improvement program. It's also known as 802 00:35:40,240 --> 00:35:45,359 the tip. Uh projects must be in the tip 803 00:35:43,119 --> 00:35:47,520 to be funded through the WARO process. 804 00:35:45,359 --> 00:35:49,359 So, this tip includes 80% funding for 805 00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:53,359 construction at 45th Street from Wood 806 00:35:49,359 --> 00:35:56,640 Oliver to Woodlon and our bike path uh 807 00:35:53,359 --> 00:35:59,920 trail uh phase one. So, those are both 808 00:35:56,640 --> 00:36:02,000 in the tip. Now, uh WPO will be doing 809 00:35:59,920 --> 00:36:04,800 their annual bicycle pedestrian activity 810 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:06,720 counts on September 16th, 17th, and 19th 811 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:08,720 this year. And they are again looking 812 00:36:06,720 --> 00:36:11,280 for volunteers to help with this. Even 813 00:36:08,720 --> 00:36:14,000 if someone can only do one two-hour 814 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:15,760 shift, uh that would be helpful. So, 815 00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:18,000 more information can be found on the 816 00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:20,240 flyer and I don't know if we got the 817 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:22,160 flyer posted yet, but is it is it 818 00:36:20,240 --> 00:36:24,800 posted? Okay. So, we will have that 819 00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:27,680 posted short uh probably the next day or 820 00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:30,680 two. Uh or you can go to the website 821 00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:30,680 wampo.org/volunteer 822 00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:35,280 and volunteer that way as well, which I 823 00:36:33,599 --> 00:36:38,240 think the flyer does the same thing to 824 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:40,000 get you to that same website. So, um on 825 00:36:38,240 --> 00:36:43,119 August 13th, I attended the REIT 826 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:46,960 meeting. Uh that's regional economic 827 00:36:43,119 --> 00:36:48,800 area partners meeting. Uh so we heard a 828 00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:52,079 wrap-up of the preliminary primary 829 00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:54,000 election by Dr. Eric Ston and we also 830 00:36:52,079 --> 00:36:56,320 briefly discussed whether we should 831 00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:59,200 provide a unified regional legislative 832 00:36:56,320 --> 00:37:02,400 agenda. Um it appears that that was done 833 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:04,720 a few years ago but not in in the very 834 00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:06,400 recent years. So no real decision was 835 00:37:04,720 --> 00:37:08,880 made about that although I do think they 836 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:11,839 are trying to pull some data together to 837 00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:15,359 put put such an agenda together for our 838 00:37:11,839 --> 00:37:19,359 toa um contingency. 839 00:37:15,359 --> 00:37:21,200 So this Friday August 21 the K254 840 00:37:19,359 --> 00:37:23,680 cordial development association will be 841 00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:26,400 meeting at 11:30 at the Benton community 842 00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:28,400 room in Benton Kansas. So I'm sure we'll 843 00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:31,440 be talking more about the things that 844 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:34,480 Mr. Dean talked about at that meeting. 845 00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:37,520 Uh then also a reminder that this 846 00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:40,079 Thursday, a week from Thursday, the 27th 847 00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:42,560 is the local water consult which is part 848 00:37:40,079 --> 00:37:44,240 of the state's regional water planning 849 00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:46,640 effort and that will be from 9:00 a.m. 850 00:37:44,240 --> 00:37:48,880 to noon at the Witchaw Public Library 851 00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:51,680 Advanced Learning Center in downtown 852 00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:53,440 Witchaw. Uh while we are not in any 853 00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:56,640 drought emergency today, is important 854 00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:59,280 that Kansas improve water management for 855 00:37:56,640 --> 00:38:03,400 everyone's future. So, I'll now ask our 856 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:03,400 city attorney for her report. 857 00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:10,000 » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh, a lot of work 858 00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:13,520 on processes has been happening lately. 859 00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:16,640 One specific example, we've had some 860 00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:20,240 civilians contact the city wanting to 861 00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:23,280 know how to pay their citation. becoming 862 00:38:20,240 --> 00:38:25,359 more familiar with Tyler, our system. 863 00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:28,800 One of the most recent ways we've 864 00:38:25,359 --> 00:38:30,560 learned how to pay is an individual can 865 00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:33,200 literally enter into their vehicle 866 00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:35,839 information and the state of that 867 00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:39,119 vehicle, the license number, and they're 868 00:38:35,839 --> 00:38:40,960 able to pay. This has been used uh and 869 00:38:39,119 --> 00:38:43,200 practiced with. It's another way for 870 00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:45,200 individuals to pay online. So, they can 871 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:46,720 just put in their license number and the 872 00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:49,599 state, and they're able to pay through 873 00:38:46,720 --> 00:38:52,240 Tyler. Uh again, this payment online 874 00:38:49,599 --> 00:38:54,240 system is assisting with municipal court 875 00:38:52,240 --> 00:38:57,359 and especially helping with individuals 876 00:38:54,240 --> 00:38:59,280 who receive citations who live outside 877 00:38:57,359 --> 00:39:01,359 the city limits. So if they're here 878 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:03,599 visiting out of state, they don't have 879 00:39:01,359 --> 00:39:04,800 to come all the way back to pay that. Uh 880 00:39:03,599 --> 00:39:07,280 the other thing I would like to mention 881 00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:10,160 is uh next at our next meeting on 882 00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:13,280 September 1, the council will receive an 883 00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:16,560 ordinance regarding a uh the city having 884 00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:20,240 a records management program. It is a 885 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:22,720 really it's a good opportunity for us to 886 00:39:20,240 --> 00:39:25,680 have a consistent practice of record 887 00:39:22,720 --> 00:39:28,400 management organization retention and 888 00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:30,480 ultimate disposition. It will also help 889 00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:32,800 with Kansas open records acts requests 890 00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:34,960 that come in. We will know where these 891 00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:36,800 uh documents are having official 892 00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:39,359 custodians who will be assisted in 893 00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:41,599 training. This has all been led in the 894 00:39:39,359 --> 00:39:43,040 effort of the city manager. uh it's been 895 00:39:41,599 --> 00:39:44,480 very helpful meeting with department 896 00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:47,920 heads to find out what is helping with 897 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:49,520 them as well. And then finally if uh the 898 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:51,599 next ordinance after that would be an 899 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:53,440 update to our Kansas open records act 900 00:39:51,599 --> 00:39:55,200 ordinance which would include new 901 00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:57,760 legislative act enactments that took 902 00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:59,760 place last uh year and then also 903 00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:02,720 incorporate the processes and 904 00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:04,800 definitions from a new city records 905 00:40:02,720 --> 00:40:05,920 management program ordinance. That's all 906 00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:08,640 I have. Thank you. 907 00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:10,960 » Very good. Are just a curiosity 908 00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:13,359 question. Are people able to just go to 909 00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:15,359 the uh police clerk and pay their 910 00:40:13,359 --> 00:40:18,079 traffic fines? Now, 911 00:40:15,359 --> 00:40:18,480 » A person can walk in and pay that as 912 00:40:18,079 --> 00:40:19,440 well. 913 00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:20,640 » Okay. 914 00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:22,160 » Just wanted to make sure that we were 915 00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:23,920 able to do that. Sound like we're 916 00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:26,960 getting all those technology, but some 917 00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:28,160 people just want to pay cash, right? 918 00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:30,160 Okay. 919 00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:31,599 » All right. Very good. Thank you. Uh 920 00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:32,480 we'll move on to our city manager 921 00:40:31,599 --> 00:40:35,760 report. 922 00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:37,680 » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Council, uh hope 923 00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:39,760 you've seen it by now. Woodline update. 924 00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:42,079 Uh we posted yesterday that we're about 925 00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:45,200 ready to complete phase one of the 926 00:40:42,079 --> 00:40:47,440 project. Uh they lay an asphalt today I 927 00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:51,599 believe and we'll finish up uh this week 928 00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:53,280 and open up phase two next Monday. Um 929 00:40:51,599 --> 00:40:56,480 again this too small to read here 930 00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:58,480 tonight but um uh we'll move on to phase 931 00:40:56,480 --> 00:41:00,640 two which is expected to be around six 932 00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:03,200 months. It's a little difficult with how 933 00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:05,920 much they'll have to treat lime that has 934 00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:09,520 a and but we always have those estimates 935 00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:11,280 with weather other delays. So, um that 936 00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:13,119 that's just the best uh the best 937 00:41:11,280 --> 00:41:15,920 estimate we have right now and we'll 938 00:41:13,119 --> 00:41:17,520 we'll try every day to beat that. But, 939 00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:19,680 uh we don't a lot of this is out of our 940 00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:22,960 control. 941 00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:24,400 On September 3rd, we'll have the area 942 00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:26,000 Chamber of Commerce uh will be at 943 00:41:24,400 --> 00:41:28,480 Walton's uh one of our community 944 00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:30,720 businesses and touring that facility. 945 00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:34,400 So, I think that'll be good. As well as 946 00:41:30,720 --> 00:41:36,560 on September 12th, we'll have Art Turn's 947 00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:38,400 memorial dedication. So, just few 948 00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:42,280 updates for the council today and I'm 949 00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:42,280 here stand for questions. 950 00:41:45,119 --> 00:41:50,800 » Any questions for the city manager? All 951 00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:53,359 right. 952 00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:54,880 Um Okay. So, we don't have any 953 00:41:53,359 --> 00:41:57,119 ordinance, resolutions, and file 954 00:41:54,880 --> 00:42:00,000 actions. So, and we do have no need for 955 00:41:57,119 --> 00:42:02,960 an executive session. Uh, so we're ready 956 00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:05,040 to go to discussions, future issues. And 957 00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:07,680 the first thing on that agenda is a 958 00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:10,240 presentation on court code enforcement. 959 00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:12,160 The Bair City Code allows unresolved 960 00:42:10,240 --> 00:42:16,000 code violations to be referred to 961 00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:17,359 municipal court when mun multiple items 962 00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:21,680 to resolve the issue have been 963 00:42:17,359 --> 00:42:24,240 unsuccessful. Um, multiple attempts. Uh 964 00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:25,920 recently staff developed a process for 965 00:42:24,240 --> 00:42:28,079 referring these violations to municipal 966 00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:30,720 court directing community development. 967 00:42:28,079 --> 00:42:32,160 Uh Paula DS is here to discuss the 968 00:42:30,720 --> 00:42:34,720 process and provide additional 969 00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:37,680 information. Miss DS. 970 00:42:34,720 --> 00:42:39,520 » Thank you Mr. Mayor. Basically I just 971 00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:42,079 want to let you all know that currently 972 00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:44,000 in code we do have remedy options and 973 00:42:42,079 --> 00:42:47,760 enforcement options. They just have not 974 00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:49,440 been fully utilized in the past. uh 975 00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:51,599 mostly because we didn't have an 976 00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:53,839 identified process uh behind the scenes 977 00:42:51,599 --> 00:42:56,000 and especially in municipal court. The 978 00:42:53,839 --> 00:42:58,960 city attorney worked very diligently 979 00:42:56,000 --> 00:43:02,000 with court staff, with the prosecutor, 980 00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:03,839 with the judge to identify how these 981 00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:05,839 cases would now be brought and developed 982 00:43:03,839 --> 00:43:07,839 a whole lot of processes. Maria may want 983 00:43:05,839 --> 00:43:09,760 to respond to that, but from behind the 984 00:43:07,839 --> 00:43:13,520 scenes, I wanted you all to know that 985 00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:16,319 those UCCC code uh violation uh reports 986 00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:17,920 and letters will be going to people who 987 00:43:16,319 --> 00:43:20,000 continue to violate code enforcement 988 00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:23,200 outside of the violation remedy 989 00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:25,280 processes. Uh it's very likely that you 990 00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:27,040 will now be receiving a lot of phone 991 00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:29,359 calls wondering why they're getting sent 992 00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:31,359 to municipal court for nuisance and 993 00:43:29,359 --> 00:43:32,960 building code violations. And I always 994 00:43:31,359 --> 00:43:35,520 like to give the council a heads up to 995 00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:37,040 know that those they that's in code now. 996 00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:38,800 We're just going to avail those tools 997 00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:40,400 now that we have implemented processes 998 00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:42,319 behind the scenes and through municipal 999 00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:44,560 court. Happy to answer any questions and 1000 00:43:42,319 --> 00:43:45,920 I know Maria spent a lot of time uh 1001 00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:47,599 working with municipal court to 1002 00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:49,760 establish those processes and I'm sure 1003 00:43:47,599 --> 00:43:52,000 she'll be flexible and answering 1004 00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:55,200 questions also if you have any. 1005 00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:59,200 So I do have a one one concern is what 1006 00:43:55,200 --> 00:44:02,160 is the impact to the court uh about how 1007 00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:04,160 many cases are we looking at concern 1008 00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:05,680 in addition to the cases we're already 1009 00:44:04,160 --> 00:44:06,319 hit that are already hit in municipal 1010 00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:07,839 court. 1011 00:44:06,319 --> 00:44:10,800 » So I can say that our code enforcement 1012 00:44:07,839 --> 00:44:13,680 officer does an excellent job in working 1013 00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:15,440 diligently. When I say diligently I mean 1014 00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:17,680 sometimes it stretches months. If they 1015 00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:19,599 are willing to make progress we are will 1016 00:44:17,680 --> 00:44:23,680 continue to work with them to make 1017 00:44:19,599 --> 00:44:26,480 progress. We do have individuals who do 1018 00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:29,040 not uh 1019 00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:31,280 want to remedy the situation, can't 1020 00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:34,079 remedy the saturation, whatever. We've 1021 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:38,079 continued to work with them and try, but 1022 00:44:34,079 --> 00:44:41,119 those are long-term chronic issues. We 1023 00:44:38,079 --> 00:44:44,960 can guesstimate there might be an impact 1024 00:44:41,119 --> 00:44:46,880 initially of 12 cases or so. Past that, 1025 00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:49,680 I don't know what that would be on a 1026 00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:51,520 monthly basis or per coat court session. 1027 00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:52,240 Hope it's not huge and 12 1028 00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:54,319 » It's not huge. I 1029 00:44:52,240 --> 00:44:56,560 » 12 doesn't seem unreasonable. So, 1030 00:44:54,319 --> 00:44:58,400 » But we are very reasonable. There are 1031 00:44:56,560 --> 00:45:00,400 just some right now that we've been 1032 00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:02,079 trying to work for with months and they 1033 00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:03,680 just they will not comply. So, we're 1034 00:45:02,079 --> 00:45:05,520 going to avail this tool. 1035 00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:08,480 » Okay. Well, I appreciate that. 1036 00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:12,319 » Any other questions for Miss Towns on 1037 00:45:08,480 --> 00:45:14,240 these enforcement actions? 1038 00:45:12,319 --> 00:45:16,240 Unfortunately, we have some that just 1039 00:45:14,240 --> 00:45:18,960 need to need need to go that route, but 1040 00:45:16,240 --> 00:45:20,880 unfortunately, 1041 00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:23,520 » Well, if there's no other questions or 1042 00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:28,079 discussions, we're going to move on to 1043 00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:29,920 the Woodlon detour uh request that Mr. U 1044 00:45:28,079 --> 00:45:32,560 Macintosh asked for. And the reason I'm 1045 00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:34,480 putting it in now is because uh we were 1046 00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:37,280 asked to do that before we start into 1047 00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:40,480 the short-term rental discussion by our 1048 00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:44,880 city manager. So, 1049 00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:46,400 um, so it's your question, so 1050 00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:50,400 it's your turn to speak. 1051 00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:53,119 » All right. Um, 1052 00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:57,760 I think we all received an email from 1053 00:45:53,119 --> 00:46:00,160 uh, Mr. James Small, I believe was his 1054 00:45:57,760 --> 00:46:03,520 name. Uh, he made some good points in 1055 00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:06,160 his email along with some things that I 1056 00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:08,640 have noticed and witnessed just through 1057 00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:11,760 that neighborhood. If you look at the 1058 00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:14,880 map up on the board here, 1059 00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:17,359 phase one is what's currently closed. 1060 00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:20,319 And what we're seeing is the 1061 00:46:17,359 --> 00:46:24,640 neighborhood that is at the top of this 1062 00:46:20,319 --> 00:46:26,960 screen, which is to the west, 1063 00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:31,440 rather than motorists taking the 1064 00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:35,839 official detour along 45th down Oliver 1065 00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:38,880 or along Oliver and then up 37th. 1066 00:46:35,839 --> 00:46:41,200 People are taking a shortcut through 1067 00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:42,800 this neighborhood and we're seeing 1068 00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:45,599 massive 1069 00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:47,839 massive increase in traffic volumes 1070 00:46:45,599 --> 00:46:51,760 through this little neighborhood um 1071 00:46:47,839 --> 00:46:55,760 along Quail Ridge, Edenburgg and then I 1072 00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:58,160 believe it's is it Danbury? 1073 00:46:55,760 --> 00:47:00,960 » Peritton. Thank you. 1074 00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:04,319 Um within a week of phase one being 1075 00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:06,480 closed, um city staff was very quick and 1076 00:47:04,319 --> 00:47:09,119 diligent putting up stop signs at many 1077 00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:13,440 of those intersections. That helped a 1078 00:47:09,119 --> 00:47:15,040 lot with near misses and people just not 1079 00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:16,240 paying attention because those roads 1080 00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:19,760 weren't designed for this kind of 1081 00:47:16,240 --> 00:47:23,520 traffic volume. Um but the volume is 1082 00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:26,800 still there. Um 1083 00:47:23,520 --> 00:47:28,880 according to Mr. smalls email. Traffic 1084 00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:31,760 is a combination of residents and 1085 00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:35,200 trucks, very large trucks, semi-truckss, 1086 00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:38,240 cement mixers, lots of pickup truck uh 1087 00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:42,400 trucks with trailers and equipment, 1088 00:47:38,240 --> 00:47:43,680 and just a ton of mixed traffic that 1089 00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:46,079 should not be going through this 1090 00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:49,359 neighborhood. 1091 00:47:46,079 --> 00:47:52,079 Do we have any means to try and mitigate 1092 00:47:49,359 --> 00:47:54,400 some of this traffic volume? Um, I know 1093 00:47:52,079 --> 00:47:58,680 we've got the official detour signs up. 1094 00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:58,680 Is there anything more we can do? 1095 00:47:59,599 --> 00:48:05,359 » Since these roads are public streets, 1096 00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:08,480 um, there's not a whole lot that I know 1097 00:48:05,359 --> 00:48:12,960 of that we can do because the public is 1098 00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:15,280 allowed to traverse these streets. Um 1099 00:48:12,960 --> 00:48:17,520 there, if I remember correctly, there 1100 00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:20,800 may be weight limits on some of those, 1101 00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:23,599 but our police department does not have 1102 00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:26,640 any way of weighing vehicles at this 1103 00:48:23,599 --> 00:48:28,800 point. Um so that would be something 1104 00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:30,559 that would need to be addressed with the 1105 00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:33,040 police chief. What do you need to start 1106 00:48:30,559 --> 00:48:35,440 weighing these vehicles? Um I'm not sure 1107 00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:39,359 if Miss Shrock has any information but 1108 00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:43,520 whether the city has any codes or um in 1109 00:48:39,359 --> 00:48:47,920 the STTO whether there's any um 1110 00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:50,720 any fines or any kind of measures to 1111 00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:53,440 discourage that. Um but since it is a 1112 00:48:50,720 --> 00:48:55,359 public road, you know, I I do understand 1113 00:48:53,440 --> 00:48:59,040 and I feel for the folks that live along 1114 00:48:55,359 --> 00:49:02,640 there, we do have the official detours 1115 00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:04,800 set up. Um, you know, besides that, I'm 1116 00:49:02,640 --> 00:49:08,559 not sure what we can do. I have been 1117 00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:10,800 told of cement trucks, etc. Um, 1118 00:49:08,559 --> 00:49:12,400 construction vehicles using that. I have 1119 00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:15,119 checked with the contractor and those 1120 00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:17,119 are not Pearson construction vehicles. 1121 00:49:15,119 --> 00:49:18,800 Those are we have a lot of other 1122 00:49:17,119 --> 00:49:20,559 construction going on the city, you 1123 00:49:18,800 --> 00:49:22,480 know, between buildings and folks trying 1124 00:49:20,559 --> 00:49:24,400 to get windows done or sighting or 1125 00:49:22,480 --> 00:49:27,119 whatever have you, you know, normal home 1126 00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:29,200 events and they're most likely 1127 00:49:27,119 --> 00:49:31,920 associated with those and not with the 1128 00:49:29,200 --> 00:49:33,839 Woodlong construction project. So short 1129 00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:35,760 of that being said, you know, I'm not 1130 00:49:33,839 --> 00:49:37,359 sure and kind of working with the city 1131 00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:40,240 attorney and the police chief, I'm 1132 00:49:37,359 --> 00:49:42,720 really not sure what else we can do if 1133 00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:45,599 the council has any concerns and notices 1134 00:49:42,720 --> 00:49:48,160 as we shift into phase 1135 00:49:45,599 --> 00:49:51,040 two. Um, please let me know. You know, 1136 00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:53,200 we can let Ted know. We can also always 1137 00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:55,359 throw some stop signs up. I know the 1138 00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:57,920 police department does do additional 1139 00:49:55,359 --> 00:50:00,079 patrols out in that area. if they see 1140 00:49:57,920 --> 00:50:03,119 unsafe driving behavior, they do make 1141 00:50:00,079 --> 00:50:05,920 sure to to stop that as long as they 1142 00:50:03,119 --> 00:50:07,599 have, you know, the means to do so. 1143 00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:10,480 They're not just going to stop somebody 1144 00:50:07,599 --> 00:50:13,200 because they're going through a street. 1145 00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:15,680 So, because it's not a private street, 1146 00:50:13,200 --> 00:50:18,319 there's, in my understanding, there's 1147 00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:22,680 not a whole lot that can be done. But 1148 00:50:18,319 --> 00:50:22,680 Maria, do you have any other thoughts? 1149 00:50:24,720 --> 00:50:30,319 location. 1150 00:50:27,599 --> 00:50:32,960 » Well, let me let me just say a little 1151 00:50:30,319 --> 00:50:35,280 bit of this is academic because this is 1152 00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:38,960 we're going to phase two Monday. Okay. 1153 00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:39,680 So, that will stop that traffic pattern. 1154 00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:41,359 But 1155 00:50:39,680 --> 00:50:42,240 » There'll be a new traffic pattern. I 1156 00:50:41,359 --> 00:50:43,440 don't know what that's going to look 1157 00:50:42,240 --> 00:50:45,839 like. 1158 00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:47,599 » And so, in in that respect, it's it's 1159 00:50:45,839 --> 00:50:48,960 it's not academic because there going to 1160 00:50:47,599 --> 00:50:50,960 be a new traffic pattern. We just don't 1161 00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:53,040 know what it's going to be. Uh we can 1162 00:50:50,960 --> 00:50:56,800 make some guesses, but we don't know. 1163 00:50:53,040 --> 00:51:00,640 But just a question, would we be wise to 1164 00:50:56,800 --> 00:51:05,119 put up assigned no trucks like at 1165 00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:06,640 Danbury when uh that when that uh moves 1166 00:51:05,119 --> 00:51:08,880 to phase two? 1167 00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:10,640 » That would most likely take council 1168 00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:12,559 action. I am looking at Maria because 1169 00:51:10,640 --> 00:51:15,359 I'm not entirely sure what that would 1170 00:51:12,559 --> 00:51:17,280 take. And 1171 00:51:15,359 --> 00:51:19,680 from my limited understanding, there 1172 00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:22,319 would have to be a definition of truck. 1173 00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:22,960 » Yeah. Well, we don't have I mean, 1174 00:51:22,319 --> 00:51:24,240 » I'm I'm not sure. 1175 00:51:22,960 --> 00:51:26,079 » So, the roads aren't built for 1176 00:51:24,240 --> 00:51:27,280 commercial vehicles. They're built or 1177 00:51:26,079 --> 00:51:29,119 maybe we should say no commercial 1178 00:51:27,280 --> 00:51:31,280 vehicles. I don't know. But they're not 1179 00:51:29,119 --> 00:51:33,119 to to this gentleman's point. I I I did 1180 00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:36,640 not get this email, so I don't I I know 1181 00:51:33,119 --> 00:51:38,720 nothing about it. But, uh 1182 00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:40,880 there those roads are not obviously 1183 00:51:38,720 --> 00:51:44,079 built for continuous use by commercial 1184 00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:45,359 vehicles. So, um maybe that would be an 1185 00:51:44,079 --> 00:51:46,800 appropriate thing to do. I don't know. 1186 00:51:45,359 --> 00:51:48,400 I'm just just throwing out ideas. 1187 00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:50,240 » No. And I I appreciate that. That's 1188 00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:52,720 that's kind of what we want to hear. Um, 1189 00:51:50,240 --> 00:51:55,839 if you guys have ideas, I would 1190 00:51:52,720 --> 00:51:58,240 » Ask just for some time to meet with the 1191 00:51:55,839 --> 00:52:00,400 Maria and the police just to make sure 1192 00:51:58,240 --> 00:52:01,200 that we have definitions correct. 1193 00:52:00,400 --> 00:52:03,760 » Mr. D, 1194 00:52:01,200 --> 00:52:05,280 » I think I I I agree that there's an 1195 00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:06,559 issue there. I think you're right. It's 1196 00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:08,160 going to change. It's going to change 1197 00:52:06,559 --> 00:52:09,440 the pattern. My guess is it's going to 1198 00:52:08,160 --> 00:52:11,040 solve it a little bit because it's going 1199 00:52:09,440 --> 00:52:12,880 to be a lot longer of a travel through 1200 00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:16,160 residential streets. It won't be a quick 1201 00:52:12,880 --> 00:52:18,559 skip and a jump. But I have seen on 1202 00:52:16,160 --> 00:52:20,880 projects a lot of times local traffic 1203 00:52:18,559 --> 00:52:22,720 only signs posted or even a barricade 1204 00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:24,079 that's entering the residential area 1205 00:52:22,720 --> 00:52:26,000 that kind of makes it look like it's 1206 00:52:24,079 --> 00:52:27,520 closed. It doesn't say closed, but it 1207 00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:29,359 then on that barricade says local 1208 00:52:27,520 --> 00:52:31,440 traffic only. I would suggest doing 1209 00:52:29,359 --> 00:52:34,240 something like that, but I think maybe 1210 00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:36,079 we wait till phase two starts and then 1211 00:52:34,240 --> 00:52:38,960 kind of study it a little bit and decide 1212 00:52:36,079 --> 00:52:40,880 where those might need to go. Um or 1213 00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:42,400 maybe we just kind of do it at the 1214 00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:45,680 beginning of phase two just so it's a 1215 00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:48,319 like a new a new process, a new normal 1216 00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:50,240 kind kind of thing. Um 1217 00:52:48,319 --> 00:52:51,680 this happened last time too. The only 1218 00:52:50,240 --> 00:52:53,280 thing that was better about last time, 1219 00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:55,200 I'll just say this from my experience is 1220 00:52:53,280 --> 00:52:56,800 we carried traffic through Woodlon one 1221 00:52:55,200 --> 00:53:00,079 way. It was only one way though. It was 1222 00:52:56,800 --> 00:53:02,640 northbound. So traffic had less of an in 1223 00:53:00,079 --> 00:53:03,680 interest in trying to do this shortcut 1224 00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:04,960 stuff because they would just take 1225 00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:06,240 Woodlon. They just make sure that they 1226 00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:08,880 were on the south side and they could go 1227 00:53:06,240 --> 00:53:11,119 north. Um, but this did happen last 1228 00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:12,960 time. It wasn't as bad as that specific 1229 00:53:11,119 --> 00:53:15,040 section, but when we made the decision 1230 00:53:12,960 --> 00:53:17,040 to fully close it in the effort to try 1231 00:53:15,040 --> 00:53:18,880 to hopefully speed up this 1232 00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:21,359 reconstruction, which would ultimately 1233 00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:23,920 reduce the overall traffic impact on 1234 00:53:21,359 --> 00:53:27,440 everybody. This is just kind of part of 1235 00:53:23,920 --> 00:53:29,440 that issue. I think um last time the 1236 00:53:27,440 --> 00:53:31,200 bigger issue was it seemed like um 1237 00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:32,240 Edgemore got a lot more traffic and 1238 00:53:31,200 --> 00:53:34,400 there was lots of people always 1239 00:53:32,240 --> 00:53:36,480 complaining about how Edgemore cut over 1240 00:53:34,400 --> 00:53:38,400 to 38th or something and then went to 1241 00:53:36,480 --> 00:53:40,640 37th and there was always a backup there 1242 00:53:38,400 --> 00:53:43,920 because people couldn't turn left at 1243 00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:45,599 37th and whatever that road was and so 1244 00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:47,920 people wanted they demanded I had 1245 00:53:45,599 --> 00:53:50,079 several emails demanding you have to put 1246 00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:52,079 up a a stoplight there a temporary 1247 00:53:50,079 --> 00:53:53,599 stoplight and that was a request of 1248 00:53:52,079 --> 00:53:55,760 several folks and it just wasn't 1249 00:53:53,599 --> 00:53:58,240 feasible for the amount traffic that you 1250 00:53:55,760 --> 00:54:00,240 know is on 37th. It was hey follow the 1251 00:53:58,240 --> 00:54:02,640 posted detour then you won't have to sit 1252 00:54:00,240 --> 00:54:04,319 in line like so I think you have to 1253 00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:06,480 balance this a little bit. People have 1254 00:54:04,319 --> 00:54:08,640 to understand that's going to happen if 1255 00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:10,319 people don't follow the posted detour. 1256 00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:13,040 And if people in these neighborhoods are 1257 00:54:10,319 --> 00:54:14,400 doing that you know part of it is it's a 1258 00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:15,599 convenience for them. It makes it a 1259 00:54:14,400 --> 00:54:17,040 little easier to get to their house that 1260 00:54:15,599 --> 00:54:18,319 might just be on the other side versus 1261 00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:21,520 the whole detour. That's probably 1262 00:54:18,319 --> 00:54:23,280 happening too. Um so there's kind of a I 1263 00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:24,720 see this all the time. road projects, 1264 00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:26,400 they're always the same, right? Whether 1265 00:54:24,720 --> 00:54:28,720 you post a detour or not, people don't 1266 00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:30,640 follow it. Uh, but I would like to think 1267 00:54:28,720 --> 00:54:32,319 that we could get construction traffic, 1268 00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:34,000 especially 1269 00:54:32,319 --> 00:54:35,920 dang sure, making sure that the 1270 00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:38,240 contractor on the job knows that that is 1271 00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:39,440 not a construction route at all. You 1272 00:54:38,240 --> 00:54:42,160 need to be driving through the work 1273 00:54:39,440 --> 00:54:44,480 zone. And I think we if we put up some 1274 00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:46,720 local traffic only in barricades type 1275 00:54:44,480 --> 00:54:49,119 like type two type three barricades not 1276 00:54:46,720 --> 00:54:51,280 just a sign something that's right there 1277 00:54:49,119 --> 00:54:52,800 next to the road that makes it a little 1278 00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:55,280 should I be doing just gives a little 1279 00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:56,800 bit more stress I think could help. I 1280 00:54:55,280 --> 00:54:58,720 just don't know if we want to decide now 1281 00:54:56,800 --> 00:55:00,960 just do it put it on the residentials 1282 00:54:58,720 --> 00:55:04,079 around phase two or do we wait and put 1283 00:55:00,960 --> 00:55:05,920 them up when we see a problem. 1284 00:55:04,079 --> 00:55:07,119 But that's my kind of two cents. So, I 1285 00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:11,599 don't think we're going to eliminate it. 1286 00:55:07,119 --> 00:55:14,880 Um, but we that may make it better. 1287 00:55:11,599 --> 00:55:16,319 » Mayor Minaj. Oh, sorry. Uh, this I 1288 00:55:14,880 --> 00:55:17,760 appreciate the conversation. This is 1289 00:55:16,319 --> 00:55:19,520 kind of the precise reason why I have 1290 00:55:17,760 --> 00:55:22,160 staff meetings on Wednesday mornings 1291 00:55:19,520 --> 00:55:24,000 because uh I think when we identified 1292 00:55:22,160 --> 00:55:26,160 kind of the issues with phase one. I had 1293 00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:28,720 Ann, Marty, and Chief in the same room 1294 00:55:26,160 --> 00:55:31,359 and we tried to work out the best 1295 00:55:28,720 --> 00:55:33,520 feasible solution to our problem at 1296 00:55:31,359 --> 00:55:35,440 hand. So, I appreciate the conversation. 1297 00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:37,200 and I'm taking it all down. And uh 1298 00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:39,359 that's something that we will discuss 1299 00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:41,359 tomorrow morning and I'll report back to 1300 00:55:39,359 --> 00:55:44,480 the council and we'll do our best to 1301 00:55:41,359 --> 00:55:47,040 help control somewhat of a almost an 1302 00:55:44,480 --> 00:55:50,799 uncontrollable situation. Uh but we will 1303 00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:53,280 do our best and I hope uh exactly that 1304 00:55:50,799 --> 00:55:53,920 that's a difficult ask but we will do 1305 00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:55,119 our best. 1306 00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:56,640 » Okay, Miss Hamburg, 1307 00:55:55,119 --> 00:55:58,640 » I was just going to say I Council Member 1308 00:55:56,640 --> 00:56:00,400 Dean's suggestion about barricades. They 1309 00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:03,119 had those um they were doing the 1310 00:56:00,400 --> 00:56:05,359 roundabout up Meridian and into Valley 1311 00:56:03,119 --> 00:56:07,280 Center and just visually I don't know 1312 00:56:05,359 --> 00:56:09,520 how it would work on that tighter street 1313 00:56:07,280 --> 00:56:11,359 but where I don't know if that wouldn't 1314 00:56:09,520 --> 00:56:13,920 help with the truck traffic that goes oh 1315 00:56:11,359 --> 00:56:15,520 you know if you're you know a private 1316 00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:17,760 vehicle and you can skirt through there 1317 00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:19,200 if you still want to do that but tearing 1318 00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:21,200 up the streets back there if there was 1319 00:56:19,200 --> 00:56:24,160 an relatively easy way I don't want to 1320 00:56:21,200 --> 00:56:26,079 weigh trucks but you know or even just 1321 00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:28,240 an education component the chief could 1322 00:56:26,079 --> 00:56:30,079 do um but I think the barricades idea is 1323 00:56:28,240 --> 00:56:32,720 kind of good. That might deter enough 1324 00:56:30,079 --> 00:56:34,400 people to slow it down back there. So 1325 00:56:32,720 --> 00:56:37,440 » Yeah, just 1326 00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:40,720 » Mr. Macintosh, 1327 00:56:37,440 --> 00:56:44,000 » I I I concur. I like the barricades idea 1328 00:56:40,720 --> 00:56:45,920 and if we do it, I'd say we do it in 1329 00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:49,280 conjunction with starting phase two. 1330 00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:51,920 Make that happen right away so that 1331 00:56:49,280 --> 00:56:53,599 nobody gets used to the idea of going 1332 00:56:51,920 --> 00:56:54,960 through this neighborhood before those 1333 00:56:53,599 --> 00:56:57,040 go up. 1334 00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:58,400 » I would I would agree. I'd probably tend 1335 00:56:57,040 --> 00:56:59,920 to lean that way. And and just to 1336 00:56:58,400 --> 00:57:01,839 clarify, these would not block the road 1337 00:56:59,920 --> 00:57:04,160 in any way. They would be set kind of 1338 00:57:01,839 --> 00:57:06,400 right next to the curb in the grass like 1339 00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:08,799 in our rightway area. That's usually how 1340 00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:10,319 I've seen it done. Um if you have four 1341 00:57:08,799 --> 00:57:12,160 lanes, a lot of times we'll even block 1342 00:57:10,319 --> 00:57:13,760 the outside lanes and force traffic that 1343 00:57:12,160 --> 00:57:15,520 is local to use just the two lanes. But 1344 00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:16,880 in this case with residential, you won't 1345 00:57:15,520 --> 00:57:18,799 be able to block the street at all. 1346 00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:20,480 » We may be able to block partially block 1347 00:57:18,799 --> 00:57:22,480 like put it halfway in the grass and 1348 00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:23,599 then halfway on the street just to give 1349 00:57:22,480 --> 00:57:24,480 a little bit more of a 1350 00:57:23,599 --> 00:57:25,280 » Little tighter. Yep. 1351 00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:27,760 » Yeah, 1352 00:57:25,280 --> 00:57:28,559 » This one may go both Danbury and 1353 00:57:27,760 --> 00:57:28,880 Edgemore. 1354 00:57:28,559 --> 00:57:30,480 » Correct. 1355 00:57:28,880 --> 00:57:32,799 » We might need to look at both of those. 1356 00:57:30,480 --> 00:57:34,079 So, just we don't know. We just have to 1357 00:57:32,799 --> 00:57:35,760 see what happens. Monday, 1358 00:57:34,079 --> 00:57:36,319 » I have to be flexible and adjust on the 1359 00:57:35,760 --> 00:57:40,400 fly. 1360 00:57:36,319 --> 00:57:45,520 » Right. Okay. All right. Good discussion 1361 00:57:40,400 --> 00:57:48,240 and uh um I know that Ted will work on 1362 00:57:45,520 --> 00:57:49,119 on solutions. So, great. Thank you. 1363 00:57:48,240 --> 00:57:52,319 » Thank you. 1364 00:57:49,119 --> 00:57:54,960 » All right. Uh the next one is a big item 1365 00:57:52,319 --> 00:57:56,640 on the agenda tonight is uh discussion 1366 00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:58,319 presentation of draft document for 1367 00:57:56,640 --> 00:57:59,760 short-term rentals. So staff has 1368 00:57:58,319 --> 00:58:03,200 developed a preliminary draft of 1369 00:57:59,760 --> 00:58:05,200 short-term regulations for review and 1370 00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:06,640 it's the draft is intended to gather 1371 00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:08,559 feedback from planning commission and 1372 00:58:06,640 --> 00:58:11,599 city council before any final 1373 00:58:08,559 --> 00:58:13,920 regulations are proposed. And again Miss 1374 00:58:11,599 --> 00:58:16,880 Downs is here to uh present the 1375 00:58:13,920 --> 00:58:18,880 information and she has my list of 28 1376 00:58:16,880 --> 00:58:20,559 questions. So, 1377 00:58:18,880 --> 00:58:23,520 » Thank you for those 20 questions, Mayor. 1378 00:58:20,559 --> 00:58:25,280 I appreciate it. This document before 1379 00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:26,960 you that was included in your packet is 1380 00:58:25,280 --> 00:58:29,520 really designed to make sure that you 1381 00:58:26,960 --> 00:58:31,200 understand u all the feedback that I've 1382 00:58:29,520 --> 00:58:33,280 received to date. All the questions 1383 00:58:31,200 --> 00:58:35,040 we've received from date to date, the 1384 00:58:33,280 --> 00:58:37,359 research that was completed and some 1385 00:58:35,040 --> 00:58:39,440 best practices items were put together 1386 00:58:37,359 --> 00:58:43,359 collectively into this document. It is a 1387 00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:46,000 really preliminarily working document um 1388 00:58:43,359 --> 00:58:48,000 that still needs to be evaluated in in 1389 00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:49,599 multiple ways. Um, I don't think I need 1390 00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:51,040 to read the staff report, but what I 1391 00:58:49,599 --> 00:58:54,720 wanted to highlight are just a few 1392 00:58:51,040 --> 00:58:56,000 things is that the sections um changed a 1393 00:58:54,720 --> 00:58:58,480 little bit since the last time you've 1394 00:58:56,000 --> 00:59:00,799 seen it. Um, we've updated it. We've 1395 00:58:58,480 --> 00:59:04,160 made um we've captured everything that 1396 00:59:00,799 --> 00:59:06,880 you requested. We also put language to 1397 00:59:04,160 --> 00:59:08,880 that and built it out. The text has been 1398 00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:10,960 much further uh built out as you can 1399 00:59:08,880 --> 00:59:12,559 see. It's grown quite a bit. But that is 1400 00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:15,440 just to give you the opportunity to 1401 00:59:12,559 --> 00:59:17,680 review um what that could look like. 1402 00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:22,400 it's not set in stone. It's not the 1403 00:59:17,680 --> 00:59:26,720 final document. Um and that um um there 1404 00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:29,920 are some legal and order of sections 1405 00:59:26,720 --> 00:59:32,480 that need to be worked out, but also we 1406 00:59:29,920 --> 00:59:34,160 are having to um get some additional 1407 00:59:32,480 --> 00:59:35,920 feedback from you on a couple of key 1408 00:59:34,160 --> 00:59:38,240 issues on whether we should include 1409 00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:40,640 these things that have come up um since 1410 00:59:38,240 --> 00:59:43,599 we've talked last. So, a couple of 1411 00:59:40,640 --> 00:59:45,440 things that we're requesting feedback on 1412 00:59:43,599 --> 00:59:48,160 um are set out in the report. basically 1413 00:59:45,440 --> 00:59:51,280 about whether these ST these short-term 1414 00:59:48,160 --> 00:59:54,000 rentals STRs are able to host gatherings 1415 00:59:51,280 --> 00:59:56,559 or events. Sometimes they'll rent a 1416 00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:58,960 home, they'll have a wedding, they'll 1417 00:59:56,559 --> 01:00:02,640 rent the home that might have a huge 1418 00:59:58,960 --> 01:00:04,319 graduation per you know uh event. So 1419 01:00:02,640 --> 01:00:05,839 whether we want to include that, that's 1420 01:00:04,319 --> 01:00:08,640 a topic that was not discussed before, 1421 01:00:05,839 --> 01:00:11,599 but it appears in several um STR 1422 01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:13,920 regulations across the state. And also I 1423 01:00:11,599 --> 01:00:17,280 want you to know that one of the other 1424 01:00:13,920 --> 01:00:20,640 requests um for feedback was related to 1425 01:00:17,280 --> 01:00:25,760 the overall process related to we're 1426 01:00:20,640 --> 01:00:28,880 still trying to um clarify and define 1427 01:00:25,760 --> 01:00:32,400 what it means to have a public hearing 1428 01:00:28,880 --> 01:00:36,240 an appeal process. It's a little fuzzy 1429 01:00:32,400 --> 01:00:39,040 right now. And so what we did initially 1430 01:00:36,240 --> 01:00:42,000 was think about how a regular case would 1431 01:00:39,040 --> 01:00:43,520 proceed through our codes, which is 1432 01:00:42,000 --> 01:00:44,799 planning commission would review it. 1433 01:00:43,520 --> 01:00:47,599 They'd make a recommendation to city 1434 01:00:44,799 --> 01:00:50,079 council. City council would uh decide on 1435 01:00:47,599 --> 01:00:52,480 the case. Um we're realizing that 1436 01:00:50,079 --> 01:00:54,720 there's a step that has to be resolved 1437 01:00:52,480 --> 01:00:58,000 in the time that I receive an 1438 01:00:54,720 --> 01:01:00,160 application to review. right now if they 1439 01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:02,319 meet all the recommendations or all the 1440 01:01:00,160 --> 01:01:05,839 requirements of the regulations as 1441 01:01:02,319 --> 01:01:08,720 presented it has to be approved. 1442 01:01:05,839 --> 01:01:11,119 The next piece is that they or if I deny 1443 01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:13,359 it then they have an appeal process but 1444 01:01:11,119 --> 01:01:15,920 then how do the surrounding property 1445 01:01:13,359 --> 01:01:19,200 owners potentially be involved in 1446 01:01:15,920 --> 01:01:21,119 protest petition processes? This is a 1447 01:01:19,200 --> 01:01:23,119 still a little unclear. We haven't 1448 01:01:21,119 --> 01:01:25,040 worked that out quite yet. So, I wanted 1449 01:01:23,119 --> 01:01:27,359 to go on record saying that that is not 1450 01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:29,359 a clean section because we're having 1451 01:01:27,359 --> 01:01:31,440 some difficulty trying to figure out how 1452 01:01:29,359 --> 01:01:35,200 to not only set up the process that 1453 01:01:31,440 --> 01:01:39,680 allows that discussion, but also um how 1454 01:01:35,200 --> 01:01:42,079 best to handle that. So, um when this 1455 01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:45,200 document hit, the mayor is correct. He 1456 01:01:42,079 --> 01:01:47,760 he responded and provided some um 1457 01:01:45,200 --> 01:01:50,400 initial comments back. But I also want 1458 01:01:47,760 --> 01:01:54,400 to say that even though the short-term 1459 01:01:50,400 --> 01:01:58,160 rental regulations is a new regulation, 1460 01:01:54,400 --> 01:02:00,559 it also has several elements that are 1461 01:01:58,160 --> 01:02:03,440 contained in other areas of our code. 1462 01:02:00,559 --> 01:02:05,599 So, for example, 1463 01:02:03,440 --> 01:02:07,599 um 1464 01:02:05,599 --> 01:02:09,119 there are I know that I've said this 1465 01:02:07,599 --> 01:02:11,119 before, there are several things that 1466 01:02:09,119 --> 01:02:13,440 are occurring right now. We're updating 1467 01:02:11,119 --> 01:02:15,920 the zoning code. We also are still 1468 01:02:13,440 --> 01:02:19,119 trying to address um the details set 1469 01:02:15,920 --> 01:02:21,359 forth in SP 418 and we are trying to 1470 01:02:19,119 --> 01:02:23,280 write short-term regulations. There are 1471 01:02:21,359 --> 01:02:26,000 some elements in each of those that 1472 01:02:23,280 --> 01:02:28,720 affect each other. So our hope was 1473 01:02:26,000 --> 01:02:31,359 initially to have the STR regulations 1474 01:02:28,720 --> 01:02:33,200 back to you and approved yet this year. 1475 01:02:31,359 --> 01:02:34,799 However, as we've continued to go 1476 01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:36,400 through and start thinking about the 1477 01:02:34,799 --> 01:02:39,839 development of the zoning codes and some 1478 01:02:36,400 --> 01:02:42,000 of those areas, short-term rentals will 1479 01:02:39,839 --> 01:02:44,720 play a role in making modification to 1480 01:02:42,000 --> 01:02:47,440 our zoning code. For example, back to my 1481 01:02:44,720 --> 01:02:49,760 original for example, um the short-term 1482 01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:51,440 rental regulations are going to state 1483 01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:54,240 and we've had discussions that say that 1484 01:02:51,440 --> 01:02:57,839 they will be allowed in single family 1485 01:02:54,240 --> 01:03:00,240 and two family districts. Okay? So we 1486 01:02:57,839 --> 01:03:02,079 can have the regulation, but in the 1487 01:03:00,240 --> 01:03:04,319 section of our code about zoning 1488 01:03:02,079 --> 01:03:06,400 districts, we have to put language in 1489 01:03:04,319 --> 01:03:08,160 there that says this is a permitted use. 1490 01:03:06,400 --> 01:03:10,559 So they are tied together and 1491 01:03:08,160 --> 01:03:13,920 intertwined quite a bit. If we make 1492 01:03:10,559 --> 01:03:16,319 parking requirements, the parking code 1493 01:03:13,920 --> 01:03:17,839 would need to reflect what those parking 1494 01:03:16,319 --> 01:03:19,920 requirements are or we'd have to 1495 01:03:17,839 --> 01:03:22,720 reference it correctly from the 1496 01:03:19,920 --> 01:03:24,880 short-term rental regulations. So it 1497 01:03:22,720 --> 01:03:26,960 will have an administrative component, 1498 01:03:24,880 --> 01:03:28,960 how they submit applications, how the 1499 01:03:26,960 --> 01:03:31,200 applications are reviewed, what we ask 1500 01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:33,119 them to post, and it'll also intertwine 1501 01:03:31,200 --> 01:03:36,000 with what we need to put into the zoning 1502 01:03:33,119 --> 01:03:38,240 regulations. So the document before you 1503 01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:42,160 just to acclimate you has everything in 1504 01:03:38,240 --> 01:03:44,319 it in one place. And once we determine 1505 01:03:42,160 --> 01:03:46,559 what sections stay, what sections may 1506 01:03:44,319 --> 01:03:48,799 need to go, maybe what may not need to 1507 01:03:46,559 --> 01:03:51,920 be there at all, then we will know 1508 01:03:48,799 --> 01:03:53,440 better which part of the code we need to 1509 01:03:51,920 --> 01:03:55,200 modify. 1510 01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:57,680 It's very complex. I'm sorry. I wish I 1511 01:03:55,200 --> 01:04:00,319 could make it simple, but um because the 1512 01:03:57,680 --> 01:04:02,400 administrative piece might fall within 1513 01:04:00,319 --> 01:04:05,039 the business licensing piece or 1514 01:04:02,400 --> 01:04:06,640 permitting piece or it may all go into 1515 01:04:05,039 --> 01:04:09,839 the zoning code regulations and then 1516 01:04:06,640 --> 01:04:12,160 reference other things. So, um, we're 1517 01:04:09,839 --> 01:04:14,079 hoping that we can get some guidance and 1518 01:04:12,160 --> 01:04:15,760 some general discussion here so we can 1519 01:04:14,079 --> 01:04:19,760 continue to refine the document, but 1520 01:04:15,760 --> 01:04:23,280 also let you know that in the flow of 1521 01:04:19,760 --> 01:04:25,280 how these other projects are affecting 1522 01:04:23,280 --> 01:04:29,039 are being affected by each other that we 1523 01:04:25,280 --> 01:04:31,200 will probably be finalizing 1524 01:04:29,039 --> 01:04:32,880 and asking for approval at the same time 1525 01:04:31,200 --> 01:04:34,640 that we're going through the zoning code 1526 01:04:32,880 --> 01:04:36,319 and asking for approval so that all the 1527 01:04:34,640 --> 01:04:37,839 language matches. Part of what we've 1528 01:04:36,319 --> 01:04:39,839 experienced so far, and I think I've 1529 01:04:37,839 --> 01:04:42,319 said this before related to the zoning 1530 01:04:39,839 --> 01:04:44,160 code, is we'll change one section and 1531 01:04:42,319 --> 01:04:46,720 then we don't change the other section 1532 01:04:44,160 --> 01:04:49,039 or we copied and paste and it doesn't 1533 01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:50,240 it's not coherent. And so this time, if 1534 01:04:49,039 --> 01:04:51,599 we're going to start foundationally, I 1535 01:04:50,240 --> 01:04:53,760 want to make sure that it's coherent so 1536 01:04:51,599 --> 01:04:55,839 that if we approve the STRs ahead of the 1537 01:04:53,760 --> 01:04:58,480 zoning code, we're not coming back in 1538 01:04:55,839 --> 01:05:00,240 January modifying the STR codes again or 1539 01:04:58,480 --> 01:05:03,359 the zoning codes again to match that. 1540 01:05:00,240 --> 01:05:06,240 So, I just wanted to set that tone. But 1541 01:05:03,359 --> 01:05:09,359 at this point, I would love to have 1542 01:05:06,240 --> 01:05:11,839 whatever feedback that you have uh 1543 01:05:09,359 --> 01:05:13,760 related to this document and or 1544 01:05:11,839 --> 01:05:15,839 encourage you that if you don't, please 1545 01:05:13,760 --> 01:05:17,200 continue to send that to me behind the 1546 01:05:15,839 --> 01:05:19,680 scenes in an email because it's very 1547 01:05:17,200 --> 01:05:21,599 helpful for consideration. 1548 01:05:19,680 --> 01:05:23,119 » Mr. Mayor, Mr. D, 1549 01:05:21,599 --> 01:05:24,480 » First of all, Paula, thank you very much 1550 01:05:23,119 --> 01:05:26,799 for putting this together because it is 1551 01:05:24,480 --> 01:05:28,160 super comprehensive. Um, it probably has 1552 01:05:26,799 --> 01:05:30,240 everything you probably could have found 1553 01:05:28,160 --> 01:05:31,599 in every bit of research you did, which 1554 01:05:30,240 --> 01:05:33,280 is good because that's a good starting 1555 01:05:31,599 --> 01:05:35,440 point, but won't be where we finish and 1556 01:05:33,280 --> 01:05:36,160 we all know that. May I make a 1557 01:05:35,440 --> 01:05:37,200 suggestion? 1558 01:05:36,160 --> 01:05:39,440 » Absolutely. 1559 01:05:37,200 --> 01:05:41,920 » I have enough comments here and I'm sure 1560 01:05:39,440 --> 01:05:43,680 everybody does and if we really want to 1561 01:05:41,920 --> 01:05:45,680 give you good feedback and get you on 1562 01:05:43,680 --> 01:05:48,160 the way with here's what we want, here's 1563 01:05:45,680 --> 01:05:50,480 what we don't want. We don't need to go 1564 01:05:48,160 --> 01:05:52,640 line by line, but I think at least page 1565 01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:55,680 by page or maybe main section by 1566 01:05:52,640 --> 01:05:57,680 section. So, A, B, C, D, and just kind 1567 01:05:55,680 --> 01:06:00,079 of clear it with everybody to see if 1568 01:05:57,680 --> 01:06:01,680 there's any specific feedback because I 1569 01:06:00,079 --> 01:06:03,119 don't want to be just rattling these 1570 01:06:01,680 --> 01:06:05,920 off. I think it'd be probably more 1571 01:06:03,119 --> 01:06:07,839 efficient if we just all chimed in on 1572 01:06:05,920 --> 01:06:10,240 part A, let you take notes, chimed in on 1573 01:06:07,839 --> 01:06:12,640 part B. Is that Does that make sense? 1574 01:06:10,240 --> 01:06:13,920 Does everybody agree with that approach? 1575 01:06:12,640 --> 01:06:15,520 » Yeah. 1576 01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:16,559 » Otherwise, we could be here a lot 1577 01:06:15,520 --> 01:06:18,400 longer. 1578 01:06:16,559 --> 01:06:20,960 Yeah, we could do that or you could give 1579 01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:23,359 her individually the information, but um 1580 01:06:20,960 --> 01:06:25,920 yeah, that's that I'm okay with that. I 1581 01:06:23,359 --> 01:06:26,240 have mine explained. 1582 01:06:25,920 --> 01:06:27,520 So, 1583 01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:28,480 » I was about to send a really long email, 1584 01:06:27,520 --> 01:06:29,920 but then I was like, you know what, 1585 01:06:28,480 --> 01:06:30,400 we're going to workshop this. I'm just 1586 01:06:29,920 --> 01:06:30,720 gonna 1587 01:06:30,400 --> 01:06:32,480 » Yeah, 1588 01:06:30,720 --> 01:06:34,640 » I'm just going to fire away. 1589 01:06:32,480 --> 01:06:35,920 » But that's kind of where I was 1590 01:06:34,640 --> 01:06:37,920 suggesting. I don't know if anybody has 1591 01:06:35,920 --> 01:06:40,480 any significant changes to that 1592 01:06:37,920 --> 01:06:41,760 recommendation, but 1593 01:06:40,480 --> 01:06:44,559 » Mr. Proctor. 1594 01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:46,319 » Um well, Mr. Mayor, it it sounds like 1595 01:06:44,559 --> 01:06:49,760 you already sent an email that's kind of 1596 01:06:46,319 --> 01:06:53,119 similar to maybe what M Mr. Dean was 1597 01:06:49,760 --> 01:06:55,680 possibly considering. Um I mean it 1598 01:06:53,119 --> 01:06:58,640 sounds like it it it doesn't look to me 1599 01:06:55,680 --> 01:07:00,480 like it's ready for prime time. Um and 1600 01:06:58,640 --> 01:07:04,000 so maybe that would be just a helpful 1601 01:07:00,480 --> 01:07:07,760 next step is just to email suggestions 1602 01:07:04,000 --> 01:07:08,400 around it rather than sit here for 1603 01:07:07,760 --> 01:07:09,839 » Some time. 1604 01:07:08,400 --> 01:07:12,240 » We had a short meeting. I think we just 1605 01:07:09,839 --> 01:07:13,920 hammer through it personally so we can 1606 01:07:12,240 --> 01:07:14,880 get this I think it'll take us at least 1607 01:07:13,920 --> 01:07:16,640 an hour. 1608 01:07:14,880 --> 01:07:17,599 » Personally, if we if we start going 1609 01:07:16,640 --> 01:07:20,559 through it, I think it'll take us at 1610 01:07:17,599 --> 01:07:22,720 least an hour. So, it's it's it's the 1611 01:07:20,559 --> 01:07:24,960 council's call. It's not I I'm okay 1612 01:07:22,720 --> 01:07:26,880 either way, but I appreciate that that 1613 01:07:24,960 --> 01:07:29,359 suggestion. So, um, 1614 01:07:26,880 --> 01:07:31,359 » And I hear your I hear your suggestion, 1615 01:07:29,359 --> 01:07:33,920 but there are folks that are waiting on 1616 01:07:31,359 --> 01:07:36,079 this and I understand you're needing to 1617 01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:37,920 make it line up with zoning and so maybe 1618 01:07:36,079 --> 01:07:40,720 that means this isn't finalized till the 1619 01:07:37,920 --> 01:07:42,559 end of the year or whatever, but there 1620 01:07:40,720 --> 01:07:44,240 are people that are watching and wanting 1621 01:07:42,559 --> 01:07:45,440 these decisions to be made. And I 1622 01:07:44,240 --> 01:07:47,200 actually think it's really healthy for 1623 01:07:45,440 --> 01:07:48,880 us to sit up here and debate each point 1624 01:07:47,200 --> 01:07:50,400 and decide on it and just move it 1625 01:07:48,880 --> 01:07:52,160 forward because Paul at the end of the 1626 01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:54,079 day, she's only going to go as fast as 1627 01:07:52,160 --> 01:07:55,760 we're going to make decisions. And even 1628 01:07:54,079 --> 01:07:57,200 if we keep sending her emails, she's 1629 01:07:55,760 --> 01:07:58,640 gonna try to get consensus, but we're 1630 01:07:57,200 --> 01:07:58,960 still going to be up here at some point 1631 01:07:58,640 --> 01:08:00,000 having 1632 01:07:58,960 --> 01:08:00,400 » At some point. We're gonna have to have 1633 01:08:00,000 --> 01:08:01,839 that. 1634 01:08:00,400 --> 01:08:02,400 » We're just gonna have the debate at some 1635 01:08:01,839 --> 01:08:03,039 point. 1636 01:08:02,400 --> 01:08:05,920 » So, 1637 01:08:03,039 --> 01:08:09,200 » Yeah. But as far as tonight goes, I I 1638 01:08:05,920 --> 01:08:11,119 I'm just maybe throwing out there. If 1639 01:08:09,200 --> 01:08:12,640 there's that many comments to be made, 1640 01:08:11,119 --> 01:08:14,319 » We probably have a dozen, 1641 01:08:12,640 --> 01:08:16,080 » Right? Because I mean, I see a lot of 1642 01:08:14,319 --> 01:08:17,839 red over there. Um 1643 01:08:16,080 --> 01:08:19,199 » I think I can get through it. 1644 01:08:17,839 --> 01:08:20,319 » I'd like to hear what Miss Hamburg has 1645 01:08:19,199 --> 01:08:22,080 to say. 1646 01:08:20,319 --> 01:08:24,400 I just I kind of had a question along 1647 01:08:22,080 --> 01:08:26,960 those lines too that might relate to 1648 01:08:24,400 --> 01:08:28,880 that probably from Miss Shrock. So, one 1649 01:08:26,960 --> 01:08:30,319 comment I got was, "Oh my gosh, this is 1650 01:08:28,880 --> 01:08:31,600 almost 40 pages and we know it's 1651 01:08:30,319 --> 01:08:33,359 preliminary, but if we're going to list 1652 01:08:31,600 --> 01:08:35,600 out this much detail, it is going to be 1653 01:08:33,359 --> 01:08:37,600 long when it's finished." So, like for 1654 01:08:35,600 --> 01:08:39,839 our good neighbor policies, like with 1655 01:08:37,600 --> 01:08:41,359 our fee schedule, we reference the fee 1656 01:08:39,839 --> 01:08:43,120 schedule in the ordinance and then we 1657 01:08:41,359 --> 01:08:44,400 can make changes to that. It doesn't 1658 01:08:43,120 --> 01:08:46,080 make you have to reapprove the 1659 01:08:44,400 --> 01:08:50,319 ordinance. 1660 01:08:46,080 --> 01:08:52,080 Uh, Maria, is there M. Is there a um 1661 01:08:50,319 --> 01:08:53,759 will this just be one gigantic ordinance 1662 01:08:52,080 --> 01:08:55,600 or will there be portions of it that we 1663 01:08:53,759 --> 01:08:56,880 can reference and maybe if once the 1664 01:08:55,600 --> 01:08:58,480 rubber meets the road we can make 1665 01:08:56,880 --> 01:09:01,120 updates without touching the whole 1666 01:08:58,480 --> 01:09:03,199 ordinance again? 1667 01:09:01,120 --> 01:09:06,080 We were literally just talking about 1668 01:09:03,199 --> 01:09:08,799 that earlier today. If there are going 1669 01:09:06,080 --> 01:09:11,199 to be any type of fees 1670 01:09:08,799 --> 01:09:14,000 regarding this ordinance and if council 1671 01:09:11,199 --> 01:09:17,839 wants to put that into a fee schedule, 1672 01:09:14,000 --> 01:09:20,480 then every time that fee changes, then 1673 01:09:17,839 --> 01:09:22,640 the fee schedule would need to change. 1674 01:09:20,480 --> 01:09:25,279 The ordinance would need to change. 1675 01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:29,120 Unfortunately, there's no getting around 1676 01:09:25,279 --> 01:09:31,040 that. Uh but but I meant in ter I was 1677 01:09:29,120 --> 01:09:32,719 just kind of analogous to that. But in 1678 01:09:31,040 --> 01:09:34,239 terms of like some of these nitty-gritty 1679 01:09:32,719 --> 01:09:35,839 things about are you gonna leave your 1680 01:09:34,239 --> 01:09:37,920 porch light on, you know, all the time. 1681 01:09:35,839 --> 01:09:39,359 Are we going to allow that? Like is 1682 01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:41,279 every single detail is going to have to 1683 01:09:39,359 --> 01:09:43,279 be part of the ordinance or is there a 1684 01:09:41,279 --> 01:09:46,319 way we can reference the good neighbor 1685 01:09:43,279 --> 01:09:48,480 policies without touching the ordinance? 1686 01:09:46,319 --> 01:09:50,799 So, I'll just say this generally 1687 01:09:48,480 --> 01:09:52,400 speaking, there there's going to be an 1688 01:09:50,799 --> 01:09:54,320 opportunity in the regulations 1689 01:09:52,400 --> 01:09:56,080 themselves that could potentially 1690 01:09:54,320 --> 01:09:59,360 reference other parts of the code 1691 01:09:56,080 --> 01:10:01,280 without detailing it this. So, I'm 1692 01:09:59,360 --> 01:10:04,000 trying to think. I'm going to throw a 1693 01:10:01,280 --> 01:10:05,520 ridiculous requirement out, but if you 1694 01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:08,560 say 1695 01:10:05,520 --> 01:10:10,080 we I we say in here we talk about water 1696 01:10:08,560 --> 01:10:12,480 and trash service needing to be 1697 01:10:10,080 --> 01:10:15,120 maintained and in what level, but we do 1698 01:10:12,480 --> 01:10:16,800 have a requirement for water to be 1699 01:10:15,120 --> 01:10:19,440 turned on to residences under part of 1700 01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:21,040 the codes. Alls I'm saying is is that's 1701 01:10:19,440 --> 01:10:22,480 important, but we're going to compare it 1702 01:10:21,040 --> 01:10:24,480 to what's in the code to make sure it 1703 01:10:22,480 --> 01:10:25,760 matches. And then what we would say 1704 01:10:24,480 --> 01:10:27,040 because the short-term rental 1705 01:10:25,760 --> 01:10:29,520 regulations I think where this all 1706 01:10:27,040 --> 01:10:31,360 started was do you have short-term 1707 01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:33,679 rental regulations in your code? The 1708 01:10:31,360 --> 01:10:35,840 answer was no. It's peacemilled for this 1709 01:10:33,679 --> 01:10:37,840 will collectively bring it together. And 1710 01:10:35,840 --> 01:10:40,480 I would say that in this short-term 1711 01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:42,560 regulation section, we would say water 1712 01:10:40,480 --> 01:10:46,080 is required to be on at the residence at 1713 01:10:42,560 --> 01:10:48,239 all time per the city code. If that code 1714 01:10:46,080 --> 01:10:50,320 changes, we're not changing this code. 1715 01:10:48,239 --> 01:10:52,000 We're just changing whatever references 1716 01:10:50,320 --> 01:10:54,960 it. So there will be some reference 1717 01:10:52,000 --> 01:10:57,120 points in here. The the language is in 1718 01:10:54,960 --> 01:10:59,120 here just to make sure that there 1719 01:10:57,120 --> 01:11:01,040 doesn't need to be any changes made as 1720 01:10:59,120 --> 01:11:02,560 we're making changes to the zoning code 1721 01:11:01,040 --> 01:11:05,360 related to that. So you will see some 1722 01:11:02,560 --> 01:11:06,640 references, several of them as as a 1723 01:11:05,360 --> 01:11:08,080 matter of fact because we do have other 1724 01:11:06,640 --> 01:11:10,640 codes already in place. We just want to 1725 01:11:08,080 --> 01:11:11,760 make sure they marry up. Does that 1726 01:11:10,640 --> 01:11:13,199 answer your question? 1727 01:11:11,760 --> 01:11:15,040 » Yeah, I think so. Thank you. 1728 01:11:13,199 --> 01:11:18,239 » Welcome. I think the other really 1729 01:11:15,040 --> 01:11:20,480 important section part is um are there 1730 01:11:18,239 --> 01:11:22,159 wholesale sections that need to be 1731 01:11:20,480 --> 01:11:24,080 removed? 1732 01:11:22,159 --> 01:11:27,360 Are there wholesale sections that might 1733 01:11:24,080 --> 01:11:29,199 be missing? Um and I wouldn't anticipate 1734 01:11:27,360 --> 01:11:31,679 that you would want to word smmith every 1735 01:11:29,199 --> 01:11:33,760 section at this juncture, but ask 1736 01:11:31,679 --> 01:11:35,679 questions about, hey, what about this? 1737 01:11:33,760 --> 01:11:37,280 We need better language. Um and the 1738 01:11:35,679 --> 01:11:38,960 mayor did a great job providing like, 1739 01:11:37,280 --> 01:11:40,800 hey, wait a minute, let's talk about the 1740 01:11:38,960 --> 01:11:42,080 language related to this. And that's 1741 01:11:40,800 --> 01:11:43,920 what I'll do. I'll go back and look for 1742 01:11:42,080 --> 01:11:46,000 the language and we'll modify it out. 1743 01:11:43,920 --> 01:11:47,840 But if there are any wholesale ways in 1744 01:11:46,000 --> 01:11:50,159 which we want to re, you know, remove 1745 01:11:47,840 --> 01:11:52,400 something or this is this is way too 1746 01:11:50,159 --> 01:11:54,800 much Paulo or we don't want to have 1747 01:11:52,400 --> 01:11:57,760 gatherings or we do have want to have 1748 01:11:54,800 --> 01:12:01,280 gatherings. Uh we don't care if they 1749 01:11:57,760 --> 01:12:03,360 leave solar lights on their property, 1750 01:12:01,280 --> 01:12:06,239 you know, all the time. Take out that 1751 01:12:03,360 --> 01:12:08,239 language. Right. So, um I guess that's 1752 01:12:06,239 --> 01:12:11,120 would be my initial guidance related to 1753 01:12:08,239 --> 01:12:13,440 this phase of the project. 1754 01:12:11,120 --> 01:12:15,120 Well, I'll get us started then. Um, I 1755 01:12:13,440 --> 01:12:16,800 personally, in my opinion, just kind of 1756 01:12:15,120 --> 01:12:19,199 reading through how detailed the 1757 01:12:16,800 --> 01:12:21,120 gatherings and events section was. It 1758 01:12:19,199 --> 01:12:23,600 was like three pages and we're trying to 1759 01:12:21,120 --> 01:12:25,600 define like four different event types. 1760 01:12:23,600 --> 01:12:28,480 As I read through that, I said, great 1761 01:12:25,600 --> 01:12:31,520 example of too much red tape. I think 1762 01:12:28,480 --> 01:12:33,600 that most Airbnb, VBO, short-term 1763 01:12:31,520 --> 01:12:36,480 rentals even have policies that don't 1764 01:12:33,600 --> 01:12:39,040 allow those or most uh hosts don't allow 1765 01:12:36,480 --> 01:12:42,080 those. Anyway, what I would suggest is 1766 01:12:39,040 --> 01:12:44,159 that we focus more on total occupancy of 1767 01:12:42,080 --> 01:12:45,760 the STR 1768 01:12:44,159 --> 01:12:47,600 uh which I think you did a really love 1769 01:12:45,760 --> 01:12:48,159 really good job of defining that and I 1770 01:12:47,600 --> 01:12:50,560 actually thought that 1771 01:12:48,159 --> 01:12:52,800 » Excuse me, Mr. Dean. U there was there 1772 01:12:50,560 --> 01:12:54,800 was a suggestion that we not go through 1773 01:12:52,800 --> 01:12:57,120 the detail and I want to get a sense of 1774 01:12:54,800 --> 01:13:00,560 the council if we're going to do that or 1775 01:12:57,120 --> 01:13:03,440 if we want to send those comments to 1776 01:13:00,560 --> 01:13:07,440 Paula let her regurgitate all those 1777 01:13:03,440 --> 01:13:09,280 comments try to uh make some estimate or 1778 01:13:07,440 --> 01:13:11,040 some sense of what that might look like 1779 01:13:09,280 --> 01:13:14,320 and then come back to us then we can 1780 01:13:11,040 --> 01:13:16,000 have that discussion uh at a at a later 1781 01:13:14,320 --> 01:13:18,080 time. I'll disagree on this specific 1782 01:13:16,000 --> 01:13:19,600 item only because Paula just directed us 1783 01:13:18,080 --> 01:13:20,960 to say if there's areas you want 1784 01:13:19,600 --> 01:13:22,159 completely removed, that's what I'm 1785 01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:23,679 speaking to right now. 1786 01:13:22,159 --> 01:13:24,320 » I can also offer that 1787 01:13:23,679 --> 01:13:25,840 » Can be done in 1788 01:13:24,320 --> 01:13:27,760 » There's not a detail. It's it's a 1789 01:13:25,840 --> 01:13:28,400 wholesale of that section. I don't think 1790 01:13:27,760 --> 01:13:30,719 it's needed. 1791 01:13:28,400 --> 01:13:31,920 » Okay. I I I appreciate that. U 1792 01:13:30,719 --> 01:13:33,199 » And I can also offer 1793 01:13:31,920 --> 01:13:34,880 » Let me get a sense. 1794 01:13:33,199 --> 01:13:38,239 » Sure. And I can also offer moving 1795 01:13:34,880 --> 01:13:43,280 forward however you decide. I can also 1796 01:13:38,239 --> 01:13:45,199 um provide the um comparison. So this is 1797 01:13:43,280 --> 01:13:46,960 these were all the sections and this was 1798 01:13:45,199 --> 01:13:48,560 the language that was in the original 1799 01:13:46,960 --> 01:13:51,199 document. These are all the comments 1800 01:13:48,560 --> 01:13:52,960 that I heard. So you understand why 1801 01:13:51,199 --> 01:13:55,760 document has also changed. So there'd be 1802 01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:58,159 a comparison. So you may send 15 1803 01:13:55,760 --> 01:14:00,239 comments, mayor might send 20. You might 1804 01:13:58,159 --> 01:14:01,920 not know what those comments are and I I 1805 01:14:00,239 --> 01:14:03,280 will keep up with a comparison so you 1806 01:14:01,920 --> 01:14:06,000 know where they're coming from moving 1807 01:14:03,280 --> 01:14:07,600 forward. So if something's lost and and 1808 01:14:06,000 --> 01:14:09,040 we change the language and the rest of 1809 01:14:07,600 --> 01:14:10,159 the council says, "Wait a minute, we 1810 01:14:09,040 --> 01:14:10,880 want that back." At least you'll know 1811 01:14:10,159 --> 01:14:12,320 what that is. So, 1812 01:14:10,880 --> 01:14:14,000 » Yeah, I don't I don't personally like 1813 01:14:12,320 --> 01:14:15,280 that because I think we're going to get 1814 01:14:14,000 --> 01:14:17,120 to a point where we're just straight up 1815 01:14:15,280 --> 01:14:18,880 debating and I'd rather get the 1816 01:14:17,120 --> 01:14:21,440 wholesale changes agreed to, at least 1817 01:14:18,880 --> 01:14:23,520 the big changes agreed to, uh, sooner 1818 01:14:21,440 --> 01:14:25,280 rather than later instead of sending 1819 01:14:23,520 --> 01:14:27,600 individual emails and then trying to 1820 01:14:25,280 --> 01:14:29,280 track what was removed and what wasn't. 1821 01:14:27,600 --> 01:14:31,120 » Okay, so let's get a sense of the 1822 01:14:29,280 --> 01:14:33,120 council. Do what do we want to do 1823 01:14:31,120 --> 01:14:35,760 tonight? Do we want to go through this 1824 01:14:33,120 --> 01:14:38,480 now section by section or do we want to 1825 01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:40,480 send the email to Paula, let her 1826 01:14:38,480 --> 01:14:42,080 regurgitate all those emails, try to 1827 01:14:40,480 --> 01:14:44,800 come back with a different with an 1828 01:14:42,080 --> 01:14:46,080 updated document and you know just I 1829 01:14:44,800 --> 01:14:47,600 just need to know what the sense of the 1830 01:14:46,080 --> 01:14:48,080 council is before we spend a lot of time 1831 01:14:47,600 --> 01:14:49,520 on it. 1832 01:14:48,080 --> 01:14:50,400 » I'm prepared for discussion. That's 1833 01:14:49,520 --> 01:14:52,400 what's on 1834 01:14:50,400 --> 01:14:53,360 » I understand I understand your point. 1835 01:14:52,400 --> 01:14:54,480 Okay, 1836 01:14:53,360 --> 01:14:55,040 » Let's hear from the other council 1837 01:14:54,480 --> 01:14:56,719 members. 1838 01:14:55,040 --> 01:14:58,480 » I I think we should go through it. I 1839 01:14:56,719 --> 01:15:00,800 think it's important that we do this in 1840 01:14:58,480 --> 01:15:01,600 open meeting when we can all talk about 1841 01:15:00,800 --> 01:15:03,600 it 1842 01:15:01,600 --> 01:15:05,199 » And I think our citizens care about 1843 01:15:03,600 --> 01:15:06,480 this. They want to know we're discussing 1844 01:15:05,199 --> 01:15:07,040 it and they want to hear this 1845 01:15:06,480 --> 01:15:07,679 discussion. 1846 01:15:07,040 --> 01:15:09,120 » Okay. 1847 01:15:07,679 --> 01:15:11,120 » I think we should go through it right 1848 01:15:09,120 --> 01:15:13,920 now even though it may take an hour. 1849 01:15:11,120 --> 01:15:16,320 » Okay, Miss Amber. 1850 01:15:13,920 --> 01:15:17,920 » This is not a rubber stamping kind of 1851 01:15:16,320 --> 01:15:19,600 council. We're we're going to duke it 1852 01:15:17,920 --> 01:15:21,520 out at some point. I suppose now might 1853 01:15:19,600 --> 01:15:23,360 as well it may be not every line by item 1854 01:15:21,520 --> 01:15:26,480 but like you said if it's like consensus 1855 01:15:23,360 --> 01:15:29,120 is hey let's ask this then we can know 1856 01:15:26,480 --> 01:15:31,360 that now and continue to refine it 1857 01:15:29,120 --> 01:15:33,520 » Mr. David 1858 01:15:31,360 --> 01:15:36,000 » I was fine with the email version 1859 01:15:33,520 --> 01:15:38,080 » But uh sounds like we're I'm outvoted 1860 01:15:36,000 --> 01:15:39,120 that's fine we we can go through it 1861 01:15:38,080 --> 01:15:41,120 » Mr. 1862 01:15:39,120 --> 01:15:44,239 Um, my sense of it is it sounds like 1863 01:15:41,120 --> 01:15:46,719 there's enough big things that would an 1864 01:15:44,239 --> 01:15:48,159 email would cut our debate time down 1865 01:15:46,719 --> 01:15:49,280 significantly if we could get those 1866 01:15:48,159 --> 01:15:51,520 resolved. 1867 01:15:49,280 --> 01:15:54,000 » Um, and so maybe have a better starting 1868 01:15:51,520 --> 01:15:55,600 point because Paul has already kind of 1869 01:15:54,000 --> 01:15:57,679 » Said, "Hey, there's some stuff in here 1870 01:15:55,600 --> 01:16:00,159 that it's going to change." 1871 01:15:57,679 --> 01:16:01,520 » Um, so that that would be my suggestion. 1872 01:16:00,159 --> 01:16:04,080 Of course, we're going to talk about it 1873 01:16:01,520 --> 01:16:05,920 in depth. I just, you know, if it's, you 1874 01:16:04,080 --> 01:16:08,080 know, 45 minutes versus a I don't think 1875 01:16:05,920 --> 01:16:09,120 it'll stop at an hour. I I I think it'll 1876 01:16:08,080 --> 01:16:09,920 take longer than that. But 1877 01:16:09,120 --> 01:16:11,679 » Yeah, I 1878 01:16:09,920 --> 01:16:13,679 » I would suggest too that this isn't the 1879 01:16:11,679 --> 01:16:15,760 last draft. We're going to see a couple 1880 01:16:13,679 --> 01:16:17,120 more drafts. So, uh if we can get some 1881 01:16:15,760 --> 01:16:18,960 of the heavy lifting done tonight, at 1882 01:16:17,120 --> 01:16:20,480 least some of the really obvious things 1883 01:16:18,960 --> 01:16:21,679 we can agree on, the next draft will be 1884 01:16:20,480 --> 01:16:22,800 a little bit cleaner. The next draft 1885 01:16:21,679 --> 01:16:25,520 will be a little cleaner. 1886 01:16:22,800 --> 01:16:27,840 » All right. So, the consensus is more of 1887 01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:30,960 like a three to two, but so we'll we'll 1888 01:16:27,840 --> 01:16:33,679 go we'll go through it. Um let's so 1889 01:16:30,960 --> 01:16:34,640 continue on with your uh your statement, 1890 01:16:33,679 --> 01:16:36,400 Mr. Dean. 1891 01:16:34,640 --> 01:16:37,920 » Thank Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So that I 1892 01:16:36,400 --> 01:16:40,000 was just going to start with the the one 1893 01:16:37,920 --> 01:16:43,199 that was kind of most obvious to me just 1894 01:16:40,000 --> 01:16:44,960 to wholesale remove that section and and 1895 01:16:43,199 --> 01:16:46,800 I'll I'll try to remember how I started 1896 01:16:44,960 --> 01:16:48,640 that. But essentially I read through the 1897 01:16:46,800 --> 01:16:50,239 gatherings and events. Um and there's 1898 01:16:48,640 --> 01:16:51,840 like three pages here and I get it 1899 01:16:50,239 --> 01:16:53,280 right. There's lots there's lots of 1900 01:16:51,840 --> 01:16:53,920 cities that decide to be very very 1901 01:16:53,280 --> 01:16:55,600 prescriptive. 1902 01:16:53,920 --> 01:16:56,560 » Can you be specific as to what section 1903 01:16:55,600 --> 01:16:58,080 you're referencing? 1904 01:16:56,560 --> 01:17:00,159 » Sorry. So if you're following along or 1905 01:16:58,080 --> 01:17:01,360 if you've took notes, it's section V as 1906 01:17:00,159 --> 01:17:02,480 in V as in Baker. 1907 01:17:01,360 --> 01:17:06,000 » V as in Victor. 1908 01:17:02,480 --> 01:17:08,880 » V as in Victor started on page 17. 1909 01:17:06,000 --> 01:17:10,239 So, gatherings and events. After reading 1910 01:17:08,880 --> 01:17:12,080 through it, I just thought this is a 1911 01:17:10,239 --> 01:17:13,920 great example of over complicating it, 1912 01:17:12,080 --> 01:17:16,239 and I know other cities do that, and 1913 01:17:13,920 --> 01:17:18,960 we're not one that tends to do that. My 1914 01:17:16,239 --> 01:17:20,640 initial gut reaction to it was most of 1915 01:17:18,960 --> 01:17:22,640 these, and I've, you know, most of us 1916 01:17:20,640 --> 01:17:24,159 have probably used a short-term rental, 1917 01:17:22,640 --> 01:17:25,920 and a lot of them, the host has a 1918 01:17:24,159 --> 01:17:27,440 policy, no gatherings, no parties, all 1919 01:17:25,920 --> 01:17:29,760 that stuff's usually a part of your 1920 01:17:27,440 --> 01:17:32,159 contract with the host. So, it's kind of 1921 01:17:29,760 --> 01:17:33,920 a best practice anyway. But where I go 1922 01:17:32,159 --> 01:17:36,159 with this is if we're going to have a 1923 01:17:33,920 --> 01:17:37,679 short-term rental regulation and Paula, 1924 01:17:36,159 --> 01:17:40,239 you did a great job. I was trying to 1925 01:17:37,679 --> 01:17:42,239 commend you when we got stopped. I 1926 01:17:40,239 --> 01:17:44,159 thought the the the section where you 1927 01:17:42,239 --> 01:17:45,600 did talk about occupancy and numbers 1928 01:17:44,159 --> 01:17:47,920 for, you know, defining a bedroom, 1929 01:17:45,600 --> 01:17:49,760 numbers per bedroom was really well laid 1930 01:17:47,920 --> 01:17:50,960 out. And I don't know the numbers are 1931 01:17:49,760 --> 01:17:53,280 exactly where we'll be, but the 1932 01:17:50,960 --> 01:17:55,280 structure is really good. I tend to 1933 01:17:53,280 --> 01:17:57,280 think that we can simplify this by 1934 01:17:55,280 --> 01:17:59,360 saying no gatherings and that you have 1935 01:17:57,280 --> 01:18:00,960 to meet the occupancy requirement. I 1936 01:17:59,360 --> 01:18:02,560 think there was a couple of different 1937 01:18:00,960 --> 01:18:04,880 deviations to that. There was a 1938 01:18:02,560 --> 01:18:06,880 nighttime occupancy or an overnight 1939 01:18:04,880 --> 01:18:09,040 occupancy and then there was I think a 1940 01:18:06,880 --> 01:18:12,000 reference to like daytime allowing for 1941 01:18:09,040 --> 01:18:14,400 guests like additional people. I I would 1942 01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:16,640 tend to think we just go get rid of a 1943 01:18:14,400 --> 01:18:18,320 gatherings provision altogether and just 1944 01:18:16,640 --> 01:18:22,000 say you have to meet these these 1945 01:18:18,320 --> 01:18:23,679 specific occupancy requirements. And um 1946 01:18:22,000 --> 01:18:25,120 so that's kind of my thought just on 1947 01:18:23,679 --> 01:18:26,719 gatherings. I've got some other thoughts 1948 01:18:25,120 --> 01:18:28,239 on parking that's kind of related but 1949 01:18:26,719 --> 01:18:32,679 it's a different section. So, I'll stop 1950 01:18:28,239 --> 01:18:32,679 there, but that's my two cents. 1951 01:18:33,280 --> 01:18:38,960 » Okay. So, we're looking at section V as 1952 01:18:35,760 --> 01:18:41,760 in Victor and talking about gatherings. 1953 01:18:38,960 --> 01:18:45,840 Uh my only two comments on this were 1954 01:18:41,760 --> 01:18:47,840 that paragraph 4D uh says where's the 1955 01:18:45,840 --> 01:18:50,000 where is the permit defined? Because I 1956 01:18:47,840 --> 01:18:51,760 didn't see that, which is somewhat of a 1957 01:18:50,000 --> 01:18:54,239 a trivia type thing, but needs to be 1958 01:18:51,760 --> 01:18:55,920 looked at. And then this paragraph 1959 01:18:54,239 --> 01:18:57,440 seven, the permits require a lot more 1960 01:18:55,920 --> 01:18:59,760 than seven days from application to 1961 01:18:57,440 --> 01:19:01,440 event date and we need to say how far in 1962 01:18:59,760 --> 01:19:03,280 advance those applications need to be 1963 01:19:01,440 --> 01:19:06,800 made. Those are my only comments about 1964 01:19:03,280 --> 01:19:07,760 section B. But are there other have 1965 01:19:06,800 --> 01:19:09,360 comments? 1966 01:19:07,760 --> 01:19:11,600 » Mr. Mayor, 1967 01:19:09,360 --> 01:19:15,280 » Uh I 1968 01:19:11,600 --> 01:19:18,000 partially agree with Mr. Dean. Um I I 1969 01:19:15,280 --> 01:19:22,719 think section V we could wholesale 1970 01:19:18,000 --> 01:19:24,960 delete. Um we is uh my my note was is 1971 01:19:22,719 --> 01:19:27,199 this section even necessary? We cover 1972 01:19:24,960 --> 01:19:31,199 parking, we cover noise in other 1973 01:19:27,199 --> 01:19:33,440 sections. Um occupancy is part of it, 1974 01:19:31,199 --> 01:19:36,880 but as long as parking and noise are 1975 01:19:33,440 --> 01:19:38,640 covered, do people care about occupancy 1976 01:19:36,880 --> 01:19:40,480 park? They they care that they can still 1977 01:19:38,640 --> 01:19:42,880 get to their home. They care that they 1978 01:19:40,480 --> 01:19:45,199 can enjoy their own space. If parking 1979 01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:48,560 and noise are covered, why do we care 1980 01:19:45,199 --> 01:19:52,159 about gatherings? I I would be a 1981 01:19:48,560 --> 01:19:55,040 proponent of just deleting or very very 1982 01:19:52,159 --> 01:19:59,719 making this a tiny section. Um just 1983 01:19:55,040 --> 01:19:59,719 maybe a paragraph if that. 1984 01:20:02,080 --> 01:20:06,679 » Any other comments on this section? 1985 01:20:06,719 --> 01:20:08,560 » And if not we'll 1986 01:20:07,760 --> 01:20:11,760 » One more. 1987 01:20:08,560 --> 01:20:15,840 » Okay. Um 1988 01:20:11,760 --> 01:20:19,920 the later portion of the gatherings and 1989 01:20:15,840 --> 01:20:24,159 events seem to be more geared toward 1990 01:20:19,920 --> 01:20:25,920 um like almost using an STR as a venue 1991 01:20:24,159 --> 01:20:28,960 space. 1992 01:20:25,920 --> 01:20:31,120 » Does this really fall under STRs? 1993 01:20:28,960 --> 01:20:33,920 Having a venue like if I'm thinking I 1994 01:20:31,120 --> 01:20:36,560 have a 5 acre property that I want to 1995 01:20:33,920 --> 01:20:40,000 lease out to somebody holding a wedding. 1996 01:20:36,560 --> 01:20:42,400 Does this really fall under our STR? 1997 01:20:40,000 --> 01:20:44,400 ordinance. 1998 01:20:42,400 --> 01:20:45,679 » It does now. 1999 01:20:44,400 --> 01:20:46,800 » Okay. 2000 01:20:45,679 --> 01:20:47,520 » I put it in 2001 01:20:46,800 --> 01:20:52,880 » Stays here. 2002 01:20:47,520 --> 01:20:54,880 » I I put it in, but I can look um 2003 01:20:52,880 --> 01:20:57,920 let me let me ponder that just a little 2004 01:20:54,880 --> 01:21:00,320 bit because there is a use issue related 2005 01:20:57,920 --> 01:21:03,360 to properties about how the property can 2006 01:21:00,320 --> 01:21:06,960 be used. And so if they're temporarily 2007 01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:09,760 um renting it, does the city want to 2008 01:21:06,960 --> 01:21:12,080 allow, you know, 500 guests for a 2009 01:21:09,760 --> 01:21:14,080 backyard wedding because they can put 2010 01:21:12,080 --> 01:21:15,360 500 chairs in the backyard? But it goes 2011 01:21:14,080 --> 01:21:17,040 back to what you said are related to 2012 01:21:15,360 --> 01:21:21,840 parking is another issue that they're 2013 01:21:17,040 --> 01:21:24,640 going to have to face. And then um uh 2014 01:21:21,840 --> 01:21:26,320 noise, but can they get an what you're 2015 01:21:24,640 --> 01:21:29,360 really asking is can they get an event 2016 01:21:26,320 --> 01:21:31,280 permit at a residence? So, I'll look at 2017 01:21:29,360 --> 01:21:32,880 that section of the code just to clarify 2018 01:21:31,280 --> 01:21:33,199 what that language might say. 2019 01:21:32,880 --> 01:21:33,760 » Sure. 2020 01:21:33,199 --> 01:21:34,320 » Thank you. 2021 01:21:33,760 --> 01:21:36,640 » So, 2022 01:21:34,320 --> 01:21:38,000 » Yeah, just a good thought. I mean, 2023 01:21:36,640 --> 01:21:38,960 because the venue portion, I was reading 2024 01:21:38,000 --> 01:21:41,760 through that. I was like, does this 2025 01:21:38,960 --> 01:21:44,480 apply? But maybe this section just kind 2026 01:21:41,760 --> 01:21:47,920 of spitballing a little bit is limited 2027 01:21:44,480 --> 01:21:51,520 in the fact that it's very specific to 2028 01:21:47,920 --> 01:21:53,679 large events that would exceed the 2029 01:21:51,520 --> 01:21:55,440 capacity or whatever. And the reason why 2030 01:21:53,679 --> 01:21:57,040 I was going to bring up parking is it is 2031 01:21:55,440 --> 01:21:58,320 it is related. It is. And I think 2032 01:21:57,040 --> 01:22:00,800 occupants and parking are really 2033 01:21:58,320 --> 01:22:03,360 related. But maybe this is a section, 2034 01:22:00,800 --> 01:22:05,679 but it's not allowed unless it's an 2035 01:22:03,360 --> 01:22:06,960 event that's permitted, a venue, you 2036 01:22:05,679 --> 01:22:09,280 know, a venue that's permitted. And 2037 01:22:06,960 --> 01:22:11,840 maybe it's an additional step. Like it's 2038 01:22:09,280 --> 01:22:14,400 not it's under the STR, but maybe it's a 2039 01:22:11,840 --> 01:22:17,199 a separate type of process. But I do 2040 01:22:14,400 --> 01:22:19,760 agree, Paula, there are lots of event 2041 01:22:17,199 --> 01:22:21,120 venues and STRs that kind of go combo, 2042 01:22:19,760 --> 01:22:22,960 right? Like you can rent the house and 2043 01:22:21,120 --> 01:22:24,560 they've got a bar. And I've seen that. 2044 01:22:22,960 --> 01:22:27,600 That's the thing. I don't know that we 2045 01:22:24,560 --> 01:22:30,880 have that in Bair. We may um I also 2046 01:22:27,600 --> 01:22:32,639 would say we can add to this code if we 2047 01:22:30,880 --> 01:22:34,560 start seeing issues. If we have a case 2048 01:22:32,639 --> 01:22:36,560 by case that we keep seeing okay we need 2049 01:22:34,560 --> 01:22:40,000 to we need to amend the code. So we 2050 01:22:36,560 --> 01:22:40,960 don't have to get this 100% perfect. Um 2051 01:22:40,000 --> 01:22:41,440 but 2052 01:22:40,960 --> 01:22:43,679 » Sure 2053 01:22:41,440 --> 01:22:45,840 » I could see maybe having a small blurb 2054 01:22:43,679 --> 01:22:48,840 covering a more of a venue setup. 2055 01:22:45,840 --> 01:22:48,840 » Yes. 2056 01:22:48,880 --> 01:22:55,679 » Any other discussion on section V? 2057 01:22:52,960 --> 01:22:58,320 Mr. Parker? Yeah, I I I second the 2058 01:22:55,679 --> 01:22:59,840 practical approach of if parking's 2059 01:22:58,320 --> 01:23:02,800 addressed and there's some other things 2060 01:22:59,840 --> 01:23:06,239 like, you know, do we need to find more 2061 01:23:02,800 --> 01:23:08,960 things to try to pick apart? 2062 01:23:06,239 --> 01:23:12,239 » Yeah, I I think the spirit of that that 2063 01:23:08,960 --> 01:23:14,400 comment is is I think I agree with it, 2064 01:23:12,239 --> 01:23:16,239 too. I think that it's probably 2065 01:23:14,400 --> 01:23:17,760 overkill. 2066 01:23:16,239 --> 01:23:19,440 So, 2067 01:23:17,760 --> 01:23:21,920 » Want to move on to another item? It 2068 01:23:19,440 --> 01:23:24,000 sounds like gatherings is maybe shot uh 2069 01:23:21,920 --> 01:23:25,360 t parking requirements. My my general 2070 01:23:24,000 --> 01:23:28,480 thought when I read through this was a 2071 01:23:25,360 --> 01:23:30,639 little bit I did start thinking about 2072 01:23:28,480 --> 01:23:33,040 size of house capacity. I did like how 2073 01:23:30,639 --> 01:23:34,480 in the occupancy piece which is a again 2074 01:23:33,040 --> 01:23:36,719 these are kind of related so I'll 2075 01:23:34,480 --> 01:23:38,639 probably talk both a little bit. It 2076 01:23:36,719 --> 01:23:41,840 seems to me that, you know, if you think 2077 01:23:38,639 --> 01:23:44,480 through a normal home, you know, four or 2078 01:23:41,840 --> 01:23:47,840 five bedrooms in Bair and if you have, 2079 01:23:44,480 --> 01:23:49,280 you know, the two occupancy and um you 2080 01:23:47,840 --> 01:23:50,639 have the extra two or three guests, 2081 01:23:49,280 --> 01:23:52,320 whatever you decide, whatever we decide 2082 01:23:50,639 --> 01:23:55,679 there, your average home is going to 2083 01:23:52,320 --> 01:23:58,480 have between 12 and maybe 15 people that 2084 01:23:55,679 --> 01:24:00,159 are permitted to be there overnight. And 2085 01:23:58,480 --> 01:24:03,760 I think there was a suggestion in this 2086 01:24:00,159 --> 01:24:05,840 code that there is a offsite or I'm 2087 01:24:03,760 --> 01:24:08,880 sorry off-site off streetet parking 2088 01:24:05,840 --> 01:24:10,560 requirement per bedroom. So I mean in 2089 01:24:08,880 --> 01:24:12,960 most cases a five you know even if you 2090 01:24:10,560 --> 01:24:15,120 get a sixbedroom you've got a two or 2091 01:24:12,960 --> 01:24:16,960 three car garage. You've got probably a 2092 01:24:15,120 --> 01:24:18,560 driveway that can hold three or four 2093 01:24:16,960 --> 01:24:20,239 cars. Now is it inconvenient for the 2094 01:24:18,560 --> 01:24:22,560 short-term rental person that has to 2095 01:24:20,239 --> 01:24:24,000 move cars around? Yeah. But it's not 2096 01:24:22,560 --> 01:24:25,679 inconvenient for the neighbor that 2097 01:24:24,000 --> 01:24:27,199 doesn't get blocked by the person that's 2098 01:24:25,679 --> 01:24:29,760 renting it. So, there's a little bit of 2099 01:24:27,199 --> 01:24:32,560 that that goes on, but just parking in 2100 01:24:29,760 --> 01:24:34,480 general. I don't really like the idea of 2101 01:24:32,560 --> 01:24:36,800 being super prescriptive and requiring a 2102 01:24:34,480 --> 01:24:38,800 parking plan and going just over 2103 01:24:36,800 --> 01:24:41,040 government on this. I feel like 2104 01:24:38,800 --> 01:24:43,440 occupancy and parking are pretty tied. 2105 01:24:41,040 --> 01:24:47,760 And I think if you set that at a a 2106 01:24:43,440 --> 01:24:50,639 number and you say STR of this size has 2107 01:24:47,760 --> 01:24:52,480 to provide off-site off streetet parking 2108 01:24:50,639 --> 01:24:54,000 and then only their guests, right? You 2109 01:24:52,480 --> 01:24:55,920 can't legally keep people from parking 2110 01:24:54,000 --> 01:24:58,400 on the street, right? there's going to 2111 01:24:55,920 --> 01:25:00,320 be a situation that occurs where there 2112 01:24:58,400 --> 01:25:01,920 are guests that come over and there are 2113 01:25:00,320 --> 01:25:03,920 going to be a few people that park on 2114 01:25:01,920 --> 01:25:04,960 the street legally. Now, if they're 2115 01:25:03,920 --> 01:25:07,280 legally parked, that's a different 2116 01:25:04,960 --> 01:25:08,800 thing. But legally parked on the street, 2117 01:25:07,280 --> 01:25:11,520 I think you're going to have some of 2118 01:25:08,800 --> 01:25:13,679 that. But if you mitigate the size of 2119 01:25:11,520 --> 01:25:16,000 the occupancy, it's not 20 or 30 people 2120 01:25:13,679 --> 01:25:18,400 staying at this place or having a party, 2121 01:25:16,000 --> 01:25:21,120 a massive party. I think a lot of your 2122 01:25:18,400 --> 01:25:23,600 parking issues 2123 01:25:21,120 --> 01:25:25,760 tend to minimize quite a bit and might 2124 01:25:23,600 --> 01:25:27,760 not cover 100% of your cases, but 2125 01:25:25,760 --> 01:25:30,159 probably 90% are going to resolve just 2126 01:25:27,760 --> 01:25:32,320 based on that. So, with that in mind, in 2127 01:25:30,159 --> 01:25:34,239 the spirit of that and simplifying, I 2128 01:25:32,320 --> 01:25:36,239 think the parking requirement section 2129 01:25:34,239 --> 01:25:38,560 should stay, but I think it should be 2130 01:25:36,239 --> 01:25:40,080 referred or referenced back to occupancy 2131 01:25:38,560 --> 01:25:42,480 and let's just come up with a number 2132 01:25:40,080 --> 01:25:44,880 that we feel like maybe covers most 2133 01:25:42,480 --> 01:25:47,520 cases and try to just set that up so 2134 01:25:44,880 --> 01:25:49,040 it's very clear. And I think that'll 2135 01:25:47,520 --> 01:25:52,000 mitigate a lot of problems. It's not 2136 01:25:49,040 --> 01:25:53,520 going to solve every problem, but you 2137 01:25:52,000 --> 01:25:55,199 can't keep people from parking on the 2138 01:25:53,520 --> 01:25:56,800 street. Like it's a public the public 2139 01:25:55,199 --> 01:25:58,480 street will be parked by people that 2140 01:25:56,800 --> 01:26:00,960 want to park there. So, we're not going 2141 01:25:58,480 --> 01:26:03,120 to do that by this STR code, but we 2142 01:26:00,960 --> 01:26:05,520 could probably do better than what has 2143 01:26:03,120 --> 01:26:08,560 been happening. So, that's just just my 2144 01:26:05,520 --> 01:26:10,239 general thought on uh section T parking 2145 01:26:08,560 --> 01:26:13,120 requirements. 2146 01:26:10,239 --> 01:26:16,159 » Yeah. So, I I somewhat disagree with 2147 01:26:13,120 --> 01:26:19,120 that. Um, I know when we've looked at 2148 01:26:16,159 --> 01:26:24,560 special use permits before, we've put in 2149 01:26:19,120 --> 01:26:26,000 places for parking uh plans. And 2150 01:26:24,560 --> 01:26:28,960 unfortunately, this is one of those 2151 01:26:26,000 --> 01:26:31,600 uncontrollables. Uh, you can say, okay, 2152 01:26:28,960 --> 01:26:33,600 you have to have one parking spot for 2153 01:26:31,600 --> 01:26:35,440 every two occupants or something like 2154 01:26:33,600 --> 01:26:38,880 that. You can make some arbitrary thing 2155 01:26:35,440 --> 01:26:41,600 like that in in your code. um or some 2156 01:26:38,880 --> 01:26:42,960 rule like that in your code, but 2157 01:26:41,600 --> 01:26:46,480 every situation is going to be a little 2158 01:26:42,960 --> 01:26:49,520 bit different and I don't think we can 2159 01:26:46,480 --> 01:26:52,560 outguess that in the code. And so I 2160 01:26:49,520 --> 01:26:54,880 think a better way of doing it is just 2161 01:26:52,560 --> 01:26:58,800 give us a parking plan. What is that 2162 01:26:54,880 --> 01:27:00,239 plan? Uh because each house can have a 2163 01:26:58,800 --> 01:27:02,159 different configuration. Some will have 2164 01:27:00,239 --> 01:27:04,320 a threecar garage, some will have a 2165 01:27:02,159 --> 01:27:05,920 two-car garage. you know, they'll have 2166 01:27:04,320 --> 01:27:08,880 different all kinds of different 2167 01:27:05,920 --> 01:27:10,880 configurations and we can't second guess 2168 01:27:08,880 --> 01:27:14,000 that in code. That's just not going to 2169 01:27:10,880 --> 01:27:16,080 happen. So that's I so I think it was 2170 01:27:14,000 --> 01:27:19,639 appropriate to have it in here. That's 2171 01:27:16,080 --> 01:27:19,639 just my two cents. 2172 01:27:20,159 --> 01:27:24,400 » I Mr. 2173 01:27:21,840 --> 01:27:26,719 » I also agree with the parking plan idea. 2174 01:27:24,400 --> 01:27:29,760 Um, I've been I've stayed at a 2175 01:27:26,719 --> 01:27:31,840 short-term rental where um not only was 2176 01:27:29,760 --> 01:27:35,040 there a parking plan, but it was shared 2177 01:27:31,840 --> 01:27:37,520 with me, the renter, and and it was a 2178 01:27:35,040 --> 01:27:39,679 map of the property and said, "Hey, 2179 01:27:37,520 --> 01:27:42,800 here's where you're allowed to park. 2180 01:27:39,679 --> 01:27:45,760 Park in these places." Um, and that was 2181 01:27:42,800 --> 01:27:49,199 great. I knew exactly where I could and 2182 01:27:45,760 --> 01:27:51,360 could not put my car. Um, so I I think 2183 01:27:49,199 --> 01:27:54,080 the parking plan's a great idea. It's 2184 01:27:51,360 --> 01:27:57,440 helpful for guests and it'll be helpful 2185 01:27:54,080 --> 01:28:00,480 to all the neighbors because 2186 01:27:57,440 --> 01:28:02,239 guests will likely comply with that. Um, 2187 01:28:00,480 --> 01:28:05,199 and so the neighbors will see that 2188 01:28:02,239 --> 01:28:10,440 guests always park in these designated 2189 01:28:05,199 --> 01:28:10,440 spots that are fine to park in. 2190 01:28:12,239 --> 01:28:15,199 » Mr. Mayor, 2191 01:28:13,280 --> 01:28:18,719 » Mr. Hamburg, 2192 01:28:15,199 --> 01:28:20,159 » Just thinking about the bigger picture. 2193 01:28:18,719 --> 01:28:22,080 You can't you don't have a crystal ball, 2194 01:28:20,159 --> 01:28:24,320 but we have to think about your your 2195 01:28:22,080 --> 01:28:26,800 time and staff time and going through 2196 01:28:24,320 --> 01:28:29,280 all this. Do you have a sense of how 2197 01:28:26,800 --> 01:28:32,480 many short-term rentals are currently in 2198 01:28:29,280 --> 01:28:34,719 Bair and like how many uh permits you're 2199 01:28:32,480 --> 01:28:40,639 going to have to get through in 60 days? 2200 01:28:34,719 --> 01:28:43,440 » Um I'm aware of 15 currently operating. 2201 01:28:40,639 --> 01:28:45,120 And believe it or not, in the last 2202 01:28:43,440 --> 01:28:47,040 couple months, I've gotten six 2203 01:28:45,120 --> 01:28:48,560 additional calls from people who are 2204 01:28:47,040 --> 01:28:51,440 wanting to buy properties and turn them 2205 01:28:48,560 --> 01:28:53,679 in STRs. And I keep telling them we're 2206 01:28:51,440 --> 01:28:56,000 writing regulations that if they I had a 2207 01:28:53,679 --> 01:28:58,800 call person call me yesterday said 2208 01:28:56,000 --> 01:28:59,920 there's a house uh and we're thinking 2209 01:28:58,800 --> 01:29:01,440 about buying it. We want to know what 2210 01:28:59,920 --> 01:29:03,679 the possibility is. And I was just 2211 01:29:01,440 --> 01:29:05,199 honest. We're not looking at banning 2212 01:29:03,679 --> 01:29:09,040 them. However, they will have 2213 01:29:05,199 --> 01:29:10,719 restrictions. Um, and so you proceed at 2214 01:29:09,040 --> 01:29:13,360 your own 2215 01:29:10,719 --> 01:29:15,280 your own risk at this point, but because 2216 01:29:13,360 --> 01:29:16,800 in lie of that, you have to have a you 2217 01:29:15,280 --> 01:29:19,760 have to have a special use permit right 2218 01:29:16,800 --> 01:29:21,040 now. So I I don't know that I think they 2219 01:29:19,760 --> 01:29:22,719 were going to buy it and sit on it until 2220 01:29:21,040 --> 01:29:24,080 we decided what we were going to do and 2221 01:29:22,719 --> 01:29:25,600 meet the requirements because I did 2222 01:29:24,080 --> 01:29:27,360 share with them that there's likely that 2223 01:29:25,600 --> 01:29:29,440 we'll have density requirements in 2224 01:29:27,360 --> 01:29:32,000 neighborhoods. Is that do you think that 2225 01:29:29,440 --> 01:29:33,920 it's um just the market and they're 2226 01:29:32,000 --> 01:29:35,920 thinking about buying it or is there a 2227 01:29:33,920 --> 01:29:38,560 scramble in here to try to become an 2228 01:29:35,920 --> 01:29:39,520 established STR and get grandfathered 2229 01:29:38,560 --> 01:29:41,280 in? 2230 01:29:39,520 --> 01:29:42,480 » Probably more like they're just they 2231 01:29:41,280 --> 01:29:45,120 were thinking about buying it up here 2232 01:29:42,480 --> 01:29:48,639 and we're curious. Gotcha. 2233 01:29:45,120 --> 01:29:51,360 » Or as maybe an existing STR 2234 01:29:48,639 --> 01:29:53,280 » That I don't know about. Correct. 2235 01:29:51,360 --> 01:29:55,440 » Yep. That's probably true. The only way 2236 01:29:53,280 --> 01:29:58,000 to publicly know is to get on to the 2237 01:29:55,440 --> 01:30:00,080 public sites that advertise. Anything 2238 01:29:58,000 --> 01:30:02,400 short of that, they could be operating 2239 01:30:00,080 --> 01:30:04,080 by word of mouth, by other means. So, 2240 01:30:02,400 --> 01:30:07,040 there could be more. I have no idea, but 2241 01:30:04,080 --> 01:30:09,840 we have at least 15 now and wanting to 2242 01:30:07,040 --> 01:30:11,600 grow. 2243 01:30:09,840 --> 01:30:14,960 » Okay. So, any other discussions 2244 01:30:11,600 --> 01:30:16,400 regarding section T as in the top? 2245 01:30:14,960 --> 01:30:20,080 » One other thought I'll make, and I do 2246 01:30:16,400 --> 01:30:21,760 agree. I like the idea of um the guests 2247 01:30:20,080 --> 01:30:23,520 knowing about the parking requirements, 2248 01:30:21,760 --> 01:30:25,040 whether it's an official parking plan. I 2249 01:30:23,520 --> 01:30:28,159 don't tend to like that idea. I think 2250 01:30:25,040 --> 01:30:30,159 I'd like it to somehow be communicated 2251 01:30:28,159 --> 01:30:32,159 to them through the good neighbor policy 2252 01:30:30,159 --> 01:30:34,400 that's required instead of having a 2253 01:30:32,159 --> 01:30:36,159 specific parking plan. Just have this is 2254 01:30:34,400 --> 01:30:39,360 how many spots they have to all be off 2255 01:30:36,159 --> 01:30:41,840 street like and be very strict with that 2256 01:30:39,360 --> 01:30:44,400 so that there isn't 2257 01:30:41,840 --> 01:30:46,239 a ton of issues with the neighbors being 2258 01:30:44,400 --> 01:30:47,920 inconvenienced. Uh because that does 2259 01:30:46,239 --> 01:30:50,320 tend to happen. It that even honestly 2260 01:30:47,920 --> 01:30:52,159 that even happens just in a regular 2261 01:30:50,320 --> 01:30:54,080 house, not a short-term rental. People 2262 01:30:52,159 --> 01:30:55,920 will try to be more convenient for them 2263 01:30:54,080 --> 01:30:57,840 even if it makes it more inconvenient 2264 01:30:55,920 --> 01:31:00,159 for somebody else. They'll park in a 2265 01:30:57,840 --> 01:31:02,320 spot that just makes it harder. So, but 2266 01:31:00,159 --> 01:31:04,239 again, on a legal street, legal parked, 2267 01:31:02,320 --> 01:31:05,679 can't really do much about it. I don't 2268 01:31:04,239 --> 01:31:07,840 even know if a parking plan would fix 2269 01:31:05,679 --> 01:31:09,440 that because anybody that comes that 2270 01:31:07,840 --> 01:31:11,520 house could legally park on a street 2271 01:31:09,440 --> 01:31:13,679 legally around it. Um I don't know that 2272 01:31:11,520 --> 01:31:16,719 that solves our problem just having a 2273 01:31:13,679 --> 01:31:19,600 parking plan. But I do understand, you 2274 01:31:16,719 --> 01:31:22,400 know, how maybe making it clearer to the 2275 01:31:19,600 --> 01:31:24,320 host and the the guests where the 2276 01:31:22,400 --> 01:31:26,960 parking is 2277 01:31:24,320 --> 01:31:30,199 available. 2278 01:31:26,960 --> 01:31:30,199 Be good. 2279 01:31:32,320 --> 01:31:38,080 All right. Any other comments on section 2280 01:31:35,280 --> 01:31:39,840 T? 2281 01:31:38,080 --> 01:31:42,000 And if not, are there other sections 2282 01:31:39,840 --> 01:31:44,239 that you had outlined, Mr. Dean, that 2283 01:31:42,000 --> 01:31:46,000 you wanted to talk about? So, I had one 2284 01:31:44,239 --> 01:31:49,040 other section that I could just 2285 01:31:46,000 --> 01:31:50,800 wholesale get rid of in my opinion. I 2286 01:31:49,040 --> 01:31:53,520 don't know who who will agree with me or 2287 01:31:50,800 --> 01:31:55,120 not, but uh you unique structures. I 2288 01:31:53,520 --> 01:31:56,639 kind of read through this and yeah, it 2289 01:31:55,120 --> 01:31:58,480 sounds really nice and I'm sure there's 2290 01:31:56,639 --> 01:32:00,480 lots of parts of the country, you know, 2291 01:31:58,480 --> 01:32:01,920 like in Colorado up in the mountains and 2292 01:32:00,480 --> 01:32:04,400 all these other places where it might 2293 01:32:01,920 --> 01:32:06,320 make sense, but this strikes me as a 2294 01:32:04,400 --> 01:32:08,719 section that's not needed. and if we had 2295 01:32:06,320 --> 01:32:11,600 a person that was interested in doing 2296 01:32:08,719 --> 01:32:13,040 something very unique, um, you know, 2297 01:32:11,600 --> 01:32:14,400 they could come to us and we could 2298 01:32:13,040 --> 01:32:16,639 consider it and maybe we could consider 2299 01:32:14,400 --> 01:32:18,400 amending our policy. It doesn't feel 2300 01:32:16,639 --> 01:32:20,639 like this is going to play a lot into 2301 01:32:18,400 --> 01:32:22,480 our STR regulations, at least at this 2302 01:32:20,639 --> 01:32:25,840 point. So, I'd be good with just 2303 01:32:22,480 --> 01:32:28,080 removing it um, in its entirety. U, 2304 01:32:25,840 --> 01:32:31,080 unique structures is the section page 2305 01:32:28,080 --> 01:32:31,080 16. 2306 01:32:31,360 --> 01:32:37,120 Anyone else have any comments about 2307 01:32:33,760 --> 01:32:40,080 section U unique structures? 2308 01:32:37,120 --> 01:32:44,960 » Is there a way we can just make it a 2309 01:32:40,080 --> 01:32:48,880 special permit within the STR? 2310 01:32:44,960 --> 01:32:51,920 » It would be by its very nature an a 2311 01:32:48,880 --> 01:32:54,159 special use no matter what if we didn't 2312 01:32:51,920 --> 01:32:55,920 include it as a consideration in the 2313 01:32:54,159 --> 01:32:58,080 STRS. 2314 01:32:55,920 --> 01:32:59,840 But we had we had, you know, we had lots 2315 01:32:58,080 --> 01:33:02,159 of discussion about this coming up 2316 01:32:59,840 --> 01:33:03,679 because in another city they used a 2317 01:33:02,159 --> 01:33:04,880 covered wagon on their property, 2318 01:33:03,679 --> 01:33:06,639 » Right? 2319 01:33:04,880 --> 01:33:08,800 » And they we've had others where they've 2320 01:33:06,639 --> 01:33:11,600 brought an airstream in because it fits 2321 01:33:08,800 --> 01:33:14,080 on the property. And so that was why it 2322 01:33:11,600 --> 01:33:16,960 got included. Um I don't I can't 2323 01:33:14,080 --> 01:33:19,199 predict, but as we've said before, 2324 01:33:16,960 --> 01:33:21,600 people are very creative and if they 2325 01:33:19,199 --> 01:33:25,280 want to earn an income related to an 2326 01:33:21,600 --> 01:33:28,639 STR, this might be a way to do that. So, 2327 01:33:25,280 --> 01:33:31,040 um, but if they came to me with even 2328 01:33:28,639 --> 01:33:33,120 without a a regulations, the short-term 2329 01:33:31,040 --> 01:33:36,239 rental regulations written, it would be 2330 01:33:33,120 --> 01:33:38,880 a special use permit uh case that would 2331 01:33:36,239 --> 01:33:41,120 go through the normal process. 2332 01:33:38,880 --> 01:33:42,400 » Okay. 2333 01:33:41,120 --> 01:33:43,760 » Then then if I'm understanding that 2334 01:33:42,400 --> 01:33:45,600 correct, I think I agree with Council 2335 01:33:43,760 --> 01:33:47,920 Member Dean. We can just deal with it 2336 01:33:45,600 --> 01:33:50,400 that way and not enumerate it here, I 2337 01:33:47,920 --> 01:33:51,679 guess. 2338 01:33:50,400 --> 01:33:53,679 » Okay. 2339 01:33:51,679 --> 01:33:57,440 That would be would that then become a 2340 01:33:53,679 --> 01:33:58,719 reference to the part of the code? 2341 01:33:57,440 --> 01:34:00,800 » It wouldn't be included in the 2342 01:33:58,719 --> 01:34:02,560 short-term rentals. They would have to 2343 01:34:00,800 --> 01:34:04,000 come to the city in general and say, 2344 01:34:02,560 --> 01:34:06,239 "Hey, I want to put an airirstream on my 2345 01:34:04,000 --> 01:34:07,520 property and turn it into an STR." And I 2346 01:34:06,239 --> 01:34:08,960 would say, "You need to file a special 2347 01:34:07,520 --> 01:34:09,520 use case and it would follow proper 2348 01:34:08,960 --> 01:34:13,719 channels." 2349 01:34:09,520 --> 01:34:13,719 » Okay. Very good. All right. 2350 01:34:13,840 --> 01:34:18,400 » Mr. Dean, did you have any other 2351 01:34:15,280 --> 01:34:20,159 sections you wanted to discuss? 2352 01:34:18,400 --> 01:34:22,639 So, I'm trying to kind of consolidate 2353 01:34:20,159 --> 01:34:24,400 them into the maybe the ones that um are 2354 01:34:22,639 --> 01:34:25,600 bigger chunks. There are there is a 2355 01:34:24,400 --> 01:34:27,840 little bit of word smithing. I'm not 2356 01:34:25,600 --> 01:34:30,159 going to get into that. Uh the other 2357 01:34:27,840 --> 01:34:34,400 thing I noticed, 2358 01:34:30,159 --> 01:34:37,120 sorry, I was trying to mark that off. Um 2359 01:34:34,400 --> 01:34:40,320 under the limited home rental exemption, 2360 01:34:37,120 --> 01:34:41,920 um that's item G, page six. I read 2361 01:34:40,320 --> 01:34:43,679 through that and I remember having this 2362 01:34:41,920 --> 01:34:45,040 discussion and I I actually originally 2363 01:34:43,679 --> 01:34:46,960 was like, "No, I don't really want that 2364 01:34:45,040 --> 01:34:48,560 exception or whatever." But as I read 2365 01:34:46,960 --> 01:34:50,639 through it and as I thought about it and 2366 01:34:48,560 --> 01:34:53,920 did some research and also as folks 2367 01:34:50,639 --> 01:34:57,600 reached out to me about some of their um 2368 01:34:53,920 --> 01:35:00,159 interests in our what we're doing here 2369 01:34:57,600 --> 01:35:01,760 uh to learn more about it. Um, it feels 2370 01:35:00,159 --> 01:35:04,560 to me like some folks, you know, 2371 01:35:01,760 --> 01:35:07,120 obviously as they're retired on fixed in 2372 01:35:04,560 --> 01:35:09,199 income, may travel more, uh, may not 2373 01:35:07,120 --> 01:35:11,920 want to set up a full-fledged short-term 2374 01:35:09,199 --> 01:35:14,080 rental for operation all the time, but 2375 01:35:11,920 --> 01:35:16,159 may take a long vacation for a month or 2376 01:35:14,080 --> 01:35:18,400 may winter in Phoenix and maybe, you 2377 01:35:16,159 --> 01:35:20,320 know, a dozen weekends of the year their 2378 01:35:18,400 --> 01:35:21,920 homes available. And as I thought 2379 01:35:20,320 --> 01:35:23,440 through that, I looked at 14 calendar 2380 01:35:21,920 --> 01:35:25,440 days and like that doesn't really seem 2381 01:35:23,440 --> 01:35:27,600 to me like a great way to help reduce 2382 01:35:25,440 --> 01:35:29,920 the impact of their property rights and 2383 01:35:27,600 --> 01:35:31,840 balance it with the others. Just in the 2384 01:35:29,920 --> 01:35:34,400 kind of 2385 01:35:31,840 --> 01:35:36,239 um kind of thinking in that line of uh 2386 01:35:34,400 --> 01:35:38,000 thinking, I was thinking, you know, 2387 01:35:36,239 --> 01:35:40,400 maybe we should have this exemption. So, 2388 01:35:38,000 --> 01:35:41,920 I'm actually um thinking maybe 14 days 2389 01:35:40,400 --> 01:35:44,800 isn't enough and maybe it's something 2390 01:35:41,920 --> 01:35:47,440 like 30 days just to try to give people 2391 01:35:44,800 --> 01:35:49,440 a more of a chance to as they're retired 2392 01:35:47,440 --> 01:35:50,960 or fixed income to earn some additional 2393 01:35:49,440 --> 01:35:53,520 income while they're traveling. I know a 2394 01:35:50,960 --> 01:35:57,040 lot of people like doing that and I 2395 01:35:53,520 --> 01:35:59,040 think simplifying it for that use case 2396 01:35:57,040 --> 01:36:00,719 uh makes a lot of sense to me. It seemed 2397 01:35:59,040 --> 01:36:02,239 like you had a requirement for a simple 2398 01:36:00,719 --> 01:36:04,159 registration form. So, it's not like the 2399 01:36:02,239 --> 01:36:06,800 city wouldn't know about it if they knew 2400 01:36:04,159 --> 01:36:09,120 about it at least, but it wouldn't be as 2401 01:36:06,800 --> 01:36:10,639 um rigorous. It wouldn't require the 2402 01:36:09,120 --> 01:36:12,080 business license or the permitting. It 2403 01:36:10,639 --> 01:36:14,000 would be a little bit more streamlined 2404 01:36:12,080 --> 01:36:16,560 for those folks that may use it. You 2405 01:36:14,000 --> 01:36:18,400 know, um 30 days is kind of my 2406 01:36:16,560 --> 01:36:20,560 recommendation. I I think 30 days sounds 2407 01:36:18,400 --> 01:36:22,400 like a fair number. Um so, that was kind 2408 01:36:20,560 --> 01:36:25,280 of one major suggestion I had was to 2409 01:36:22,400 --> 01:36:29,159 keep it and to increase the days to 30 2410 01:36:25,280 --> 01:36:29,159 uh days per year. 2411 01:36:30,560 --> 01:36:34,639 » Mr. Mayor, 2412 01:36:31,600 --> 01:36:36,639 » Mr. D great, Mr. David. 2413 01:36:34,639 --> 01:36:39,600 » So, maybe I'm missing it, but whether it 2414 01:36:36,639 --> 01:36:41,600 was 14 days or 30 days, the problems 2415 01:36:39,600 --> 01:36:43,920 from the from the short-term rentals 2416 01:36:41,600 --> 01:36:46,800 that we're trying to address here would 2417 01:36:43,920 --> 01:36:49,199 still exist, no matter the intent of the 2418 01:36:46,800 --> 01:36:49,920 owner or the the reason they're renting 2419 01:36:49,199 --> 01:36:51,840 it. Correct. 2420 01:36:49,920 --> 01:36:54,080 » The parking and all that would still 2421 01:36:51,840 --> 01:36:55,840 exist. And you'd still want all those 2422 01:36:54,080 --> 01:36:57,679 restrictions, wouldn't you? There's 2423 01:36:55,840 --> 01:36:59,520 still, if you read that full section, 2424 01:36:57,679 --> 01:37:01,600 Greg, in its entirety, it still says to 2425 01:36:59,520 --> 01:37:05,840 qualify for the exemption, um, you must 2426 01:37:01,600 --> 01:37:08,560 follow these, um, items. Um, so they're 2427 01:37:05,840 --> 01:37:10,080 still required to follow all of those. 2428 01:37:08,560 --> 01:37:12,239 It's just a little more simple for them 2429 01:37:10,080 --> 01:37:13,360 to get to get going because they're not 2430 01:37:12,239 --> 01:37:16,080 going to be running it as a full 2431 01:37:13,360 --> 01:37:17,600 business. Um, so that's why I'm in 2432 01:37:16,080 --> 01:37:19,520 support of this exemption because they 2433 01:37:17,600 --> 01:37:21,600 still have to require like all those 2434 01:37:19,520 --> 01:37:24,400 items there. The property is is is the 2435 01:37:21,600 --> 01:37:25,920 owner's primary residence. um no more 2436 01:37:24,400 --> 01:37:27,760 than one booking at a time. All rentals 2437 01:37:25,920 --> 01:37:29,760 comply with noise parking occupancy 2438 01:37:27,760 --> 01:37:30,960 nuance nuisance regulations. The 2439 01:37:29,760 --> 01:37:33,760 property owner provides notice to the 2440 01:37:30,960 --> 01:37:36,560 city prior to the first rental. Um I'm 2441 01:37:33,760 --> 01:37:38,880 comfortable with the limited use nature 2442 01:37:36,560 --> 01:37:42,239 of a person that may leave for a month 2443 01:37:38,880 --> 01:37:44,480 at a time or you know for the winter um 2444 01:37:42,239 --> 01:37:46,000 if they have to follow those same deals 2445 01:37:44,480 --> 01:37:48,080 to making it a little easier for those 2446 01:37:46,000 --> 01:37:50,639 folks because the startup I mean most 2447 01:37:48,080 --> 01:37:53,360 people probably wouldn't do that. um 2448 01:37:50,639 --> 01:37:55,920 they wouldn't set up a STR for 14 days, 2449 01:37:53,360 --> 01:37:57,360 right? Um and there's a reason for that 2450 01:37:55,920 --> 01:37:59,199 because it would cost you cost them 2451 01:37:57,360 --> 01:38:01,199 money to set it up and all that, but I'm 2452 01:37:59,199 --> 01:38:02,400 not wanting to take away the requirement 2453 01:38:01,199 --> 01:38:03,520 that they still need to be a good 2454 01:38:02,400 --> 01:38:05,440 neighbor. They still need to follow 2455 01:38:03,520 --> 01:38:08,000 these requirements and if they don't, 2456 01:38:05,440 --> 01:38:10,639 they can still lose that, you know, 2457 01:38:08,000 --> 01:38:13,840 ability. Uh but I do like the idea of 2458 01:38:10,639 --> 01:38:15,119 allowing that to be um available for 2459 01:38:13,840 --> 01:38:17,600 folks that want to do. I don't know if 2460 01:38:15,119 --> 01:38:19,119 everybody will will do that, but it it 2461 01:38:17,600 --> 01:38:22,159 seems like it would make sense for some 2462 01:38:19,119 --> 01:38:25,040 folks um to have that opportunity to do 2463 01:38:22,159 --> 01:38:27,280 it. And you know, one of the questions I 2464 01:38:25,040 --> 01:38:31,440 had on it, Paula, though, was is how 2465 01:38:27,280 --> 01:38:33,119 does it fit in with um the density and 2466 01:38:31,440 --> 01:38:35,360 spacing and I assume all those same 2467 01:38:33,119 --> 01:38:36,480 things will still apply, but I I was 2468 01:38:35,360 --> 01:38:37,920 going to verify that. That was one of 2469 01:38:36,480 --> 01:38:39,440 the notes questions I had. 2470 01:38:37,920 --> 01:38:41,600 » This is one of the more difficult 2471 01:38:39,440 --> 01:38:44,239 sections. Um, and it's in here because 2472 01:38:41,600 --> 01:38:46,560 we had a little bit of uh conversation, 2473 01:38:44,239 --> 01:38:48,080 quite a bit of conversation about it. In 2474 01:38:46,560 --> 01:38:48,960 the first place, if somebody's gone for 2475 01:38:48,080 --> 01:38:49,840 the winter, 2476 01:38:48,960 --> 01:38:51,679 » Right? 2477 01:38:49,840 --> 01:38:53,520 » They're likely going to rent it to 2478 01:38:51,679 --> 01:38:54,159 somebody the entire winter 2479 01:38:53,520 --> 01:38:55,920 » Potentially. 2480 01:38:54,159 --> 01:38:56,960 » Potentially, it could be three, four, 2481 01:38:55,920 --> 01:38:58,719 five months, right? 2482 01:38:56,960 --> 01:39:00,080 » At that point, they are a short-term 2483 01:38:58,719 --> 01:39:01,440 rental. They would they would have 2484 01:39:00,080 --> 01:39:04,320 » Be outside a short 2485 01:39:01,440 --> 01:39:06,400 » If they're gone for no more than 30 2486 01:39:04,320 --> 01:39:08,800 days, which would be one weekend a 2487 01:39:06,400 --> 01:39:11,600 month. Let's just say they want to rent 2488 01:39:08,800 --> 01:39:14,159 out their house for one weekend a month. 2489 01:39:11,600 --> 01:39:17,199 They just can't do it on a public 2490 01:39:14,159 --> 01:39:18,480 advertising site be because the STR 2491 01:39:17,199 --> 01:39:20,400 allows you to do it up to, you know, 2492 01:39:18,480 --> 01:39:21,679 it's less than 28 days a month, but this 2493 01:39:20,400 --> 01:39:22,480 is 30 days a year, 2494 01:39:21,679 --> 01:39:24,719 » Right? 2495 01:39:22,480 --> 01:39:27,760 » Um it it's highly likely we would never 2496 01:39:24,719 --> 01:39:29,199 know if they didn't do it on one of the 2497 01:39:27,760 --> 01:39:32,159 public sites, right? 2498 01:39:29,199 --> 01:39:33,920 » They had a family member that came and 2499 01:39:32,159 --> 01:39:37,440 rented the house for them or whatever. 2500 01:39:33,920 --> 01:39:39,679 So, this is in case we 2501 01:39:37,440 --> 01:39:41,199 uh have somebody call in, a neighbor or 2502 01:39:39,679 --> 01:39:42,400 a budding property owner or somebody 2503 01:39:41,199 --> 01:39:44,480 saying, "Hey, they're renting that 2504 01:39:42,400 --> 01:39:45,920 property out." We're asking them to 2505 01:39:44,480 --> 01:39:47,360 register and just tell us that they're 2506 01:39:45,920 --> 01:39:48,880 going to utilize their property because 2507 01:39:47,360 --> 01:39:50,880 they already know in advance that they 2508 01:39:48,880 --> 01:39:55,440 are going to be gone one month every 2509 01:39:50,880 --> 01:39:57,679 year to Arizona to play golf. Um, but 2510 01:39:55,440 --> 01:40:00,880 whether they do that is a big question 2511 01:39:57,679 --> 01:40:02,400 mark. And how often they do that is 2512 01:40:00,880 --> 01:40:04,480 another big question mark. This is an 2513 01:40:02,400 --> 01:40:05,119 enforcable issue, 2514 01:40:04,480 --> 01:40:06,960 » Right? 2515 01:40:05,119 --> 01:40:09,280 » And we will only be able to enforce or 2516 01:40:06,960 --> 01:40:11,679 change it if we know about it. But it's 2517 01:40:09,280 --> 01:40:13,360 in there as part of a protection to say 2518 01:40:11,679 --> 01:40:14,400 if you're going to do this long term, 2519 01:40:13,360 --> 01:40:17,040 you're going to probably meet the 2520 01:40:14,400 --> 01:40:18,639 standards of an STR and not just I'm 2521 01:40:17,040 --> 01:40:20,320 leaving for five months and I'm renting 2522 01:40:18,639 --> 01:40:23,040 this out. Now, there's nothing that 2523 01:40:20,320 --> 01:40:24,800 prevents them from a long-term rental 2524 01:40:23,040 --> 01:40:26,320 because that's not part of this because 2525 01:40:24,800 --> 01:40:27,600 it's designed to be short-term rental. 2526 01:40:26,320 --> 01:40:29,119 But if they are going to do a short 2527 01:40:27,600 --> 01:40:30,080 short period of time, we put it in 2528 01:40:29,119 --> 01:40:32,080 there. 2529 01:40:30,080 --> 01:40:33,840 » Yep. No, and I agree with it. I mean, I 2530 01:40:32,080 --> 01:40:35,440 think that I was suggesting more days 2531 01:40:33,840 --> 01:40:37,360 because I I could see somebody taking a 2532 01:40:35,440 --> 01:40:38,880 four-week, you know, up to a four-week 2533 01:40:37,360 --> 01:40:40,960 vacation and maybe having it available 2534 01:40:38,880 --> 01:40:42,639 for that whole time for a short rental, 2535 01:40:40,960 --> 01:40:44,400 » Whether it's continuous or whether it's 2536 01:40:42,639 --> 01:40:46,239 just parts of that month that they're 2537 01:40:44,400 --> 01:40:47,119 gone. And I also could see people that 2538 01:40:46,239 --> 01:40:48,719 winter, 2539 01:40:47,119 --> 01:40:50,080 » Maybe their house is available and maybe 2540 01:40:48,719 --> 01:40:52,080 they didn't get it rented, but there 2541 01:40:50,080 --> 01:40:52,480 are, you know, key weekends that 2542 01:40:52,080 --> 01:40:54,159 » Sure 2543 01:40:52,480 --> 01:40:56,320 » Are able to get booked up and it's not 2544 01:40:54,159 --> 01:41:00,320 continuous, but it can't be over a total 2545 01:40:56,320 --> 01:41:01,840 of 30 days in the year. So, but I I was 2546 01:41:00,320 --> 01:41:03,760 kind of curious though, and I don't know 2547 01:41:01,840 --> 01:41:06,320 that you answered it, they still meet 2548 01:41:03,760 --> 01:41:10,400 all the requirements. So, say we had um 2549 01:41:06,320 --> 01:41:12,960 three, you know, permitted short-term 2550 01:41:10,400 --> 01:41:14,320 rentals. If they called up and said, I 2551 01:41:12,960 --> 01:41:16,239 want to do this application and you had 2552 01:41:14,320 --> 01:41:19,520 three short-term rentals within the 2553 01:41:16,239 --> 01:41:22,080 density, it I assume that that form that 2554 01:41:19,520 --> 01:41:23,199 application form would be denied or 2555 01:41:22,080 --> 01:41:24,480 would it? 2556 01:41:23,199 --> 01:41:26,400 » Uh that's a great question to 2557 01:41:24,480 --> 01:41:27,440 operationalize it. It would assume I 2558 01:41:26,400 --> 01:41:29,199 would assume that because of the 2559 01:41:27,440 --> 01:41:30,719 shortness and it because it doesn't 2560 01:41:29,199 --> 01:41:33,119 truly fit the definition of the 2561 01:41:30,719 --> 01:41:35,760 short-term rental that we would not deny 2562 01:41:33,119 --> 01:41:38,560 it from a density perspective, 2563 01:41:35,760 --> 01:41:40,480 » But we could deny it. That's a that's a 2564 01:41:38,560 --> 01:41:42,000 detail that probably we'll have to come 2565 01:41:40,480 --> 01:41:46,280 back for you to 2566 01:41:42,000 --> 01:41:46,280 » To weigh in on. 2567 01:41:46,560 --> 01:41:55,000 » Any other comments on section G, 2568 01:41:50,880 --> 01:41:55,000 limited home rental exemption? 2569 01:41:57,600 --> 01:42:03,280 hearing none. Is that all the sections 2570 01:41:59,679 --> 01:42:05,600 that you had comments on, Mr. Dean? 2571 01:42:03,280 --> 01:42:06,880 » Let's see. I think those are the major 2572 01:42:05,600 --> 01:42:07,199 ones. 2573 01:42:06,880 --> 01:42:10,560 » Okay. 2574 01:42:07,199 --> 01:42:11,760 » Uh the other other item I had u Paula um 2575 01:42:10,560 --> 01:42:14,719 and this is probably open for 2576 01:42:11,760 --> 01:42:17,440 discussion. And maybe people know under 2577 01:42:14,719 --> 01:42:19,040 um section I the separation and density 2578 01:42:17,440 --> 01:42:22,040 requirements 2579 01:42:19,040 --> 01:42:22,040 um 2580 01:42:22,239 --> 01:42:26,000 number two under that item two the 2581 01:42:24,880 --> 01:42:27,679 number of short-term rentals with a 2582 01:42:26,000 --> 01:42:31,199 defined block of subdivision shall not 2583 01:42:27,679 --> 01:42:34,560 exceed 10%. Um just curious where you 2584 01:42:31,199 --> 01:42:36,800 got that number and kind of how that in 2585 01:42:34,560 --> 01:42:39,920 your mind how that would work. So 2586 01:42:36,800 --> 01:42:42,400 density traditionally the two methods in 2587 01:42:39,920 --> 01:42:46,719 which you can control that or define it 2588 01:42:42,400 --> 01:42:50,320 is either a percentage of um it on a 2589 01:42:46,719 --> 01:42:52,719 percentage basis um or 2590 01:42:50,320 --> 01:42:53,119 distance. You can define a distance. 2591 01:42:52,719 --> 01:42:56,320 » Sure. 2592 01:42:53,119 --> 01:42:59,440 » So if you think 250 ft right that might 2593 01:42:56,320 --> 01:43:02,080 be only 2594 01:42:59,440 --> 01:43:03,360 three houses away. So every third house 2595 01:43:02,080 --> 01:43:05,280 or every fourth house in your 2596 01:43:03,360 --> 01:43:08,719 neighborhood could be that 2597 01:43:05,280 --> 01:43:12,000 » Or you can we put the language in here 2598 01:43:08,719 --> 01:43:14,000 is that within a defined block of a 2599 01:43:12,000 --> 01:43:16,080 subdivision shall not exceed. Now it 2600 01:43:14,000 --> 01:43:17,600 could be the subdivision. So if you 2601 01:43:16,080 --> 01:43:19,440 think about a subdivision here or an 2602 01:43:17,600 --> 01:43:23,040 addition how it's platted it could have 2603 01:43:19,440 --> 01:43:24,960 50 homes in that addition. So in that 2604 01:43:23,040 --> 01:43:26,719 addition they couldn't have any more 2605 01:43:24,960 --> 01:43:29,840 than five 2606 01:43:26,719 --> 01:43:32,320 » S strs up to five or it could be 2607 01:43:29,840 --> 01:43:35,520 distance. So, as a starting point, we 2608 01:43:32,320 --> 01:43:36,960 talked about the percentage piece. 2609 01:43:35,520 --> 01:43:39,360 Although percentage is a little bit more 2610 01:43:36,960 --> 01:43:40,639 difficult sometimes to calculate. Um, I 2611 01:43:39,360 --> 01:43:43,600 think the mayor pointed out that if 2612 01:43:40,639 --> 01:43:45,119 there's only three homes in that area 2613 01:43:43,600 --> 01:43:47,280 within that distance, 2614 01:43:45,119 --> 01:43:48,719 » It's Yeah. 2615 01:43:47,280 --> 01:43:50,560 » Now, I don't I don't disagree with 2616 01:43:48,719 --> 01:43:52,239 » It's either distance or percentage. I 2617 01:43:50,560 --> 01:43:54,239 don't disagree with the concept of a 2618 01:43:52,239 --> 01:43:55,520 percentage, but I do, you know, just 2619 01:43:54,239 --> 01:43:57,440 thinking through, you know, a neighbor 2620 01:43:55,520 --> 01:43:58,639 that may have one next to them and then 2621 01:43:57,440 --> 01:43:59,920 all of a sudden they've got two or 2622 01:43:58,639 --> 01:44:03,199 three, but they are inside the 2623 01:43:59,920 --> 01:44:05,119 percentage. I think that a a twoprong 2624 01:44:03,199 --> 01:44:08,239 approach to that makes a lot of sense to 2625 01:44:05,119 --> 01:44:10,080 me because it would avoid 2626 01:44:08,239 --> 01:44:11,760 going over a total percentage and it 2627 01:44:10,080 --> 01:44:13,280 would also avoid three or four being 2628 01:44:11,760 --> 01:44:15,119 right next to each other, right next to 2629 01:44:13,280 --> 01:44:17,600 a person that really doesn't really 2630 01:44:15,119 --> 01:44:19,040 doesn't like that. Um, and again, like 2631 01:44:17,600 --> 01:44:20,320 that's just kind of a concept in my mind 2632 01:44:19,040 --> 01:44:22,320 that I've and I don't know what the 2633 01:44:20,320 --> 01:44:23,679 right number is. The 200 feet seems, you 2634 01:44:22,320 --> 01:44:25,280 know, like you said, that's probably a 2635 01:44:23,679 --> 01:44:27,600 couple at least a couple homes in most 2636 01:44:25,280 --> 01:44:28,880 neighborhoods. Um, I don't know if 2637 01:44:27,600 --> 01:44:32,480 that's the right number, but I do like 2638 01:44:28,880 --> 01:44:33,840 the two-prong approach to it. Um, it is 2639 01:44:32,480 --> 01:44:36,080 kind of wild thinking about it, though. 2640 01:44:33,840 --> 01:44:39,119 I mean, in in our neighborhood, 140 2641 01:44:36,080 --> 01:44:41,520 homes could have up to 14. Uh, will we 2642 01:44:39,119 --> 01:44:44,400 ever see that? Probably not. But that's 2643 01:44:41,520 --> 01:44:46,159 a lot. That's a that's a big number. um 2644 01:44:44,400 --> 01:44:48,800 in the neighborhood I live in. So, I'm 2645 01:44:46,159 --> 01:44:50,159 just trying to visualize how many there 2646 01:44:48,800 --> 01:44:52,080 actually would be, what the density 2647 01:44:50,159 --> 01:44:53,280 would feel like and all that stuff as we 2648 01:44:52,080 --> 01:44:54,480 think through that. But, I like the 2649 01:44:53,280 --> 01:44:55,679 two-prongong approach because I think it 2650 01:44:54,480 --> 01:44:57,600 solves some of that 2651 01:44:55,679 --> 01:44:59,600 » Related to the percentage and the 2652 01:44:57,600 --> 01:45:01,280 separation by distance. Okay. Yep. 2653 01:44:59,600 --> 01:45:03,679 » And you're recommending at least to 2654 01:45:01,280 --> 01:45:05,360 start a 250 2655 01:45:03,679 --> 01:45:08,400 » Distance. I don't mind the 200 feet. I 2656 01:45:05,360 --> 01:45:10,400 think you put in I think item seven or 2657 01:45:08,400 --> 01:45:11,679 number seven item C in that same section 2658 01:45:10,400 --> 01:45:13,280 has 2659 01:45:11,679 --> 01:45:15,280 » If multiple applications are received 2660 01:45:13,280 --> 01:45:17,679 for locations within 200 feet than the 2661 01:45:15,280 --> 01:45:20,080 first application received. So that's 2662 01:45:17,679 --> 01:45:22,159 kind of minimizing how often they can be 2663 01:45:20,080 --> 01:45:23,760 I I don't know that 200 sounds fine to 2664 01:45:22,159 --> 01:45:26,239 me. I don't know if anybody has an 2665 01:45:23,760 --> 01:45:27,679 opinion, but uh I just wanted to state I 2666 01:45:26,239 --> 01:45:29,760 like the two-prong approach because I 2667 01:45:27,679 --> 01:45:30,880 could see that solving, you know, too 2668 01:45:29,760 --> 01:45:33,040 many of them getting right next to each 2669 01:45:30,880 --> 01:45:35,600 other, but still being under, you know, 2670 01:45:33,040 --> 01:45:37,840 a total total density cap that you're 2671 01:45:35,600 --> 01:45:39,199 » I think the distance is a good is a good 2672 01:45:37,840 --> 01:45:40,080 measure, but I don't know what the right 2673 01:45:39,199 --> 01:45:41,040 distance is. 2674 01:45:40,080 --> 01:45:43,199 » I don't know either. 2675 01:45:41,040 --> 01:45:44,239 » I think what I'll do the next tight 2676 01:45:43,199 --> 01:45:45,280 » I think what I'll do is 2677 01:45:44,239 --> 01:45:46,639 » Some neighborhoods that might be too 2678 01:45:45,280 --> 01:45:48,000 far. take your I'll just take your 2679 01:45:46,639 --> 01:45:50,639 neighborhood since you mentioned it and 2680 01:45:48,000 --> 01:45:52,400 look and see what 250 ft distance 2681 01:45:50,639 --> 01:45:54,239 » Because it's a typical lot size 2682 01:45:52,400 --> 01:45:56,239 neighborhood. Okay. 2683 01:45:54,239 --> 01:45:58,639 » Yeah, it's tough. I mean cuz some 2684 01:45:56,239 --> 01:46:00,000 depending on the lot size that could 2685 01:45:58,639 --> 01:46:02,159 between you it could matter. 2686 01:46:00,000 --> 01:46:03,199 » Yeah, your your lot covers 500 feet, 2687 01:46:02,159 --> 01:46:05,280 doesn't it, Tyler? 2688 01:46:03,199 --> 01:46:07,199 » Mine's mine. So that's the thing. Mine 2689 01:46:05,280 --> 01:46:09,360 personally, which I'm not I'm not really 2690 01:46:07,199 --> 01:46:11,760 thinking about using my home as a STR, 2691 01:46:09,360 --> 01:46:14,000 but it's 300 feet on the frontage and 2692 01:46:11,760 --> 01:46:14,239 it's like less than 200 on the back. 2693 01:46:14,000 --> 01:46:15,760 Yeah. 2694 01:46:14,239 --> 01:46:17,760 » So, I mean, obviously it depends on how 2695 01:46:15,760 --> 01:46:19,119 you measure it right in the individual 2696 01:46:17,760 --> 01:46:20,719 property pin 2697 01:46:19,119 --> 01:46:22,320 » Where where it would come from. If it's 2698 01:46:20,719 --> 01:46:23,679 the front, if it's the back, if it's the 2699 01:46:22,320 --> 01:46:25,280 side, 2700 01:46:23,679 --> 01:46:26,560 » It's the distance between you and the 2701 01:46:25,280 --> 01:46:28,239 neighbor next door. So, it wouldn't be 2702 01:46:26,560 --> 01:46:30,080 front or back. It would necessar it 2703 01:46:28,239 --> 01:46:30,320 might like be calculated side by side, 2704 01:46:30,080 --> 01:46:30,880 but 2705 01:46:30,320 --> 01:46:32,159 » Right. 2706 01:46:30,880 --> 01:46:34,159 » We'll let you come up. 2707 01:46:32,159 --> 01:46:35,679 » No, I'm not I'm trying to suggest how to 2708 01:46:34,159 --> 01:46:36,639 do that. It obviously could be measured 2709 01:46:35,679 --> 01:46:37,360 quite a few ways. 2710 01:46:36,639 --> 01:46:40,080 » Okay. 2711 01:46:37,360 --> 01:46:43,040 » Okay. Thank you. 2712 01:46:40,080 --> 01:46:44,560 Okay. Is there any other items sections 2713 01:46:43,040 --> 01:46:46,159 that you wanted to talk about, Tyler, 2714 01:46:44,560 --> 01:46:48,320 and we'll move on to other city council 2715 01:46:46,159 --> 01:46:48,719 members, see what they want to talk 2716 01:46:48,320 --> 01:46:50,080 about? 2717 01:46:48,719 --> 01:46:51,440 » Well, I mean, feel free to chime. I'm 2718 01:46:50,080 --> 01:46:52,639 trying to leave space for everybody to 2719 01:46:51,440 --> 01:46:55,199 chime in. So, hopefully we have some 2720 01:46:52,639 --> 01:46:57,040 consensus. That's what getting this done 2721 01:46:55,199 --> 01:46:58,880 is going to take, just going line by 2722 01:46:57,040 --> 01:47:00,480 line. And 2723 01:46:58,880 --> 01:47:01,679 um 2724 01:47:00,480 --> 01:47:03,119 I don't know. I guess we could talk 2725 01:47:01,679 --> 01:47:06,320 about it. I mean, I mentioned it was 2726 01:47:03,119 --> 01:47:08,159 really well written. item uh W on page 2727 01:47:06,320 --> 01:47:10,719 819, which is the overnight guest 2728 01:47:08,159 --> 01:47:12,880 occupancy and bedroom definition. I 2729 01:47:10,719 --> 01:47:14,639 mean, really detailed, really well 2730 01:47:12,880 --> 01:47:16,320 written up. It's essentially defines 2731 01:47:14,639 --> 01:47:18,400 what a legal bedroom is, which is the 2732 01:47:16,320 --> 01:47:21,360 case in every home. Um, when you certify 2733 01:47:18,400 --> 01:47:24,080 it for bedrooms occupancy wise, it's 2734 01:47:21,360 --> 01:47:27,600 suggesting two guests per bedroom plus 2735 01:47:24,080 --> 01:47:29,760 three additional persons. Um, so, you 2736 01:47:27,600 --> 01:47:32,000 know, I guess we could kind of chat if 2737 01:47:29,760 --> 01:47:34,639 we feel like that's the right number. 2738 01:47:32,000 --> 01:47:36,960 Um, you know, I said earlier just some 2739 01:47:34,639 --> 01:47:39,600 examples of what that would look like on 2740 01:47:36,960 --> 01:47:41,280 a four or fivebedroom home, but uh it 2741 01:47:39,600 --> 01:47:43,119 feels like that number is probably about 2742 01:47:41,280 --> 01:47:45,920 right, but if somebody, you know, 2743 01:47:43,119 --> 01:47:49,880 disagrees, then we can decide if we want 2744 01:47:45,920 --> 01:47:49,880 to make that a different number. 2745 01:47:50,320 --> 01:47:57,199 I I like the number in conjunction with 2746 01:47:53,440 --> 01:48:01,280 the parking spaces per bedroom. I think 2747 01:47:57,199 --> 01:48:03,679 that's a great um 2748 01:48:01,280 --> 01:48:06,000 yeah, those work well together. I think 2749 01:48:03,679 --> 01:48:08,960 that's a great idea. 2750 01:48:06,000 --> 01:48:12,560 » There is a there is on if you look at 2751 01:48:08,960 --> 01:48:16,400 number seven of that section, um that 2752 01:48:12,560 --> 01:48:18,239 information also makes it clear that 2753 01:48:16,400 --> 01:48:20,080 because what happens is in a lot of the 2754 01:48:18,239 --> 01:48:21,440 bedrooms, they'll put three sets of bunk 2755 01:48:20,080 --> 01:48:23,119 beds in there 2756 01:48:21,440 --> 01:48:25,520 » Thinking they can get six people per 2757 01:48:23,119 --> 01:48:28,080 room. So it's kind of on the front end, 2758 01:48:25,520 --> 01:48:30,159 no more than two persons per and even if 2759 01:48:28,080 --> 01:48:31,600 you're using futons and bunk beds and 2760 01:48:30,159 --> 01:48:33,360 all those kinds of things, it doesn't 2761 01:48:31,600 --> 01:48:35,440 increase your occupancy or capacity or 2762 01:48:33,360 --> 01:48:37,040 your real. So that was a little unique 2763 01:48:35,440 --> 01:48:38,800 language that we had not included in 2764 01:48:37,040 --> 01:48:39,679 there before, but probably thought it 2765 01:48:38,800 --> 01:48:41,280 was valuable. 2766 01:48:39,679 --> 01:48:44,080 » Yeah. really I liked how you did the 2767 01:48:41,280 --> 01:48:46,000 overnight occupancy and additional three 2768 01:48:44,080 --> 01:48:48,400 for the whole unit because there are a 2769 01:48:46,000 --> 01:48:49,920 lot of Airbnbs that do have a futon or 2770 01:48:48,400 --> 01:48:52,080 we just don't want it to get excessive 2771 01:48:49,920 --> 01:48:53,600 to the point where we've got 12 cars 2772 01:48:52,080 --> 01:48:56,400 showing up here, you know, kind of 2773 01:48:53,600 --> 01:48:57,760 thing. So, that's good. Uh I can't 2774 01:48:56,400 --> 01:48:59,600 remember where it was, Paula. It was 2775 01:48:57,760 --> 01:49:01,920 related to occupancy, but somewhere I 2776 01:48:59,600 --> 01:49:04,719 read a definition of because there's an 2777 01:49:01,920 --> 01:49:06,159 overnight guest or overnight occupancy 2778 01:49:04,719 --> 01:49:08,159 and then somewhere later I remember 2779 01:49:06,159 --> 01:49:10,080 reading something about daytime 2780 01:49:08,159 --> 01:49:12,159 occupancy and I'm not recalling where 2781 01:49:10,080 --> 01:49:13,600 that came from. Maybe it was in the 2782 01:49:12,159 --> 01:49:15,040 events section. I don't know. 2783 01:49:13,600 --> 01:49:15,920 » It was in the gathering section. 2784 01:49:15,040 --> 01:49:18,080 » Was it? 2785 01:49:15,920 --> 01:49:19,840 » I don't I I think if we get rid of the 2786 01:49:18,080 --> 01:49:22,960 and that's why I put that note. If we 2787 01:49:19,840 --> 01:49:27,360 get rid of the guest event venue, we 2788 01:49:22,960 --> 01:49:30,639 should try to decide here. Do we put a 2789 01:49:27,360 --> 01:49:32,159 daytime occupancy number maximum because 2790 01:49:30,639 --> 01:49:34,960 people will still have people come over 2791 01:49:32,159 --> 01:49:38,080 when they rent a STR, right? And they 2792 01:49:34,960 --> 01:49:41,280 it's up to three additional persons for 2793 01:49:38,080 --> 01:49:43,679 the unit as a whole to stay the night or 2794 01:49:41,280 --> 01:49:46,880 do we want to make any sort of addition 2795 01:49:43,679 --> 01:49:48,719 to what a daytime occupancy would be or 2796 01:49:46,880 --> 01:49:51,760 do we just leave it at this number and 2797 01:49:48,719 --> 01:49:53,360 adjust it just to give some more room? 2798 01:49:51,760 --> 01:49:54,719 That would be my only suggestion. And if 2799 01:49:53,360 --> 01:49:55,920 we got rid of that, how do we manage 2800 01:49:54,719 --> 01:49:57,840 that here? 2801 01:49:55,920 --> 01:50:00,960 » When our first discussion happened, I 2802 01:49:57,840 --> 01:50:04,239 think the initial um short-term rental 2803 01:50:00,960 --> 01:50:06,560 property owner came and said, "I started 2804 01:50:04,239 --> 01:50:08,400 this because of hoops and they have 2805 01:50:06,560 --> 01:50:10,400 basketball tournaments." And the person 2806 01:50:08,400 --> 01:50:11,840 who rents the home or the parents or 2807 01:50:10,400 --> 01:50:14,480 whoever goes in on it, right, could 2808 01:50:11,840 --> 01:50:17,199 legally based on our definition have 15 2809 01:50:14,480 --> 01:50:19,600 people stay overnight. But he said there 2810 01:50:17,199 --> 01:50:22,639 might be more that come over during the 2811 01:50:19,600 --> 01:50:25,119 day in between basketball games to swim, 2812 01:50:22,639 --> 01:50:27,119 to hang out, to order pizza. So you 2813 01:50:25,119 --> 01:50:30,639 might want to and we might want to look 2814 01:50:27,119 --> 01:50:32,239 at some language that allows for 2815 01:50:30,639 --> 01:50:34,159 um 2816 01:50:32,239 --> 01:50:35,760 additional people to be there but not 2817 01:50:34,159 --> 01:50:38,080 stay there, I think, is what you're 2818 01:50:35,760 --> 01:50:40,480 asking. I just don't have those numbers 2819 01:50:38,080 --> 01:50:41,920 in a language, but I can probably 2820 01:50:40,480 --> 01:50:43,440 present something if that's the 2821 01:50:41,920 --> 01:50:45,360 direction you'd like me to go. 2822 01:50:43,440 --> 01:50:46,719 » I think that's appropriate to do. Yeah, 2823 01:50:45,360 --> 01:50:47,760 I think we should do something like 2824 01:50:46,719 --> 01:50:49,040 that. 2825 01:50:47,760 --> 01:50:50,800 » I mean, it's difficult, right? Because 2826 01:50:49,040 --> 01:50:52,719 it does still bring up the total number 2827 01:50:50,800 --> 01:50:54,719 of people and the total parking 2828 01:50:52,719 --> 01:50:56,159 requirement because if guests come over, 2829 01:50:54,719 --> 01:50:57,920 just like anybody's house, whether it's 2830 01:50:56,159 --> 01:51:00,880 short-term rental or not, when you have 2831 01:50:57,920 --> 01:51:03,520 guests come over, your driveway starts 2832 01:51:00,880 --> 01:51:06,000 filling up, right? Or the parking on the 2833 01:51:03,520 --> 01:51:08,080 street for that four hours that you're 2834 01:51:06,000 --> 01:51:10,880 having them over 2835 01:51:08,080 --> 01:51:12,320 um does become a little bit of an 2836 01:51:10,880 --> 01:51:14,480 inconvenience for other people if you 2837 01:51:12,320 --> 01:51:16,320 don't handle that right. um even if 2838 01:51:14,480 --> 01:51:18,320 you're legally parking. So, I don't 2839 01:51:16,320 --> 01:51:21,199 know. There's some thought in my mind 2840 01:51:18,320 --> 01:51:23,199 that maybe maybe that's just too much 2841 01:51:21,199 --> 01:51:25,119 and maybe we should just decide on 2842 01:51:23,199 --> 01:51:26,880 what's the extra guest allowance and 2843 01:51:25,119 --> 01:51:28,639 make it more simple than having a 2844 01:51:26,880 --> 01:51:31,280 daytime and evening time. 2845 01:51:28,639 --> 01:51:35,679 » But I would say also I come from a very 2846 01:51:31,280 --> 01:51:37,840 large family and one holiday event meant 2847 01:51:35,679 --> 01:51:39,760 sometimes 40 people being at my house, 2848 01:51:37,840 --> 01:51:41,520 right? I don't have 40 parking spaces on 2849 01:51:39,760 --> 01:51:43,440 my driveway and they were parked along 2850 01:51:41,520 --> 01:51:44,960 the street during the daytime hours, but 2851 01:51:43,440 --> 01:51:46,239 they weren't spending the night. So, I 2852 01:51:44,960 --> 01:51:48,080 think that there is probably a 2853 01:51:46,239 --> 01:51:50,800 differentiation about 2854 01:51:48,080 --> 01:51:53,199 » Yes, they can park, but can we allow 2855 01:51:50,800 --> 01:51:54,560 them? And we do we want somebody calling 2856 01:51:53,199 --> 01:51:56,719 and saying, "Hey, they're having a big 2857 01:51:54,560 --> 01:51:58,800 party over here." Well, they can. They 2858 01:51:56,719 --> 01:52:01,040 just can't have 45 people stay in the 2859 01:51:58,800 --> 01:52:03,520 night, right? In sleeping bags all over 2860 01:52:01,040 --> 01:52:05,520 the floor. So, let me just see if I can 2861 01:52:03,520 --> 01:52:07,360 find some draft language that might help 2862 01:52:05,520 --> 01:52:09,119 answer that question and see then if 2863 01:52:07,360 --> 01:52:09,920 it's necessary because it's not in here 2864 01:52:09,119 --> 01:52:10,320 now. Yeah. 2865 01:52:09,920 --> 01:52:11,679 » Okay. 2866 01:52:10,320 --> 01:52:13,360 » No, I agree. I think that would be good. 2867 01:52:11,679 --> 01:52:15,599 I mean, if we don't have events at 2868 01:52:13,360 --> 01:52:18,080 parties, which we don't want, we do have 2869 01:52:15,599 --> 01:52:21,040 to have some some sort of way of 2870 01:52:18,080 --> 01:52:23,440 handling that here on a total persons at 2871 01:52:21,040 --> 01:52:24,639 the house at one time. I think that 2872 01:52:23,440 --> 01:52:26,800 makes a lot of sense. It just I don't 2873 01:52:24,639 --> 01:52:30,080 know what the number should be. Well, 2874 01:52:26,800 --> 01:52:32,000 and and you can also say I mean in the 2875 01:52:30,080 --> 01:52:34,480 gathering and events section, even 2876 01:52:32,000 --> 01:52:36,080 though um we don't want that section, 2877 01:52:34,480 --> 01:52:38,400 there is some language that can help 2878 01:52:36,080 --> 01:52:40,400 prompt this conversation, right? Option 2879 01:52:38,400 --> 01:52:43,040 one alone says gatherings of persons 2880 01:52:40,400 --> 01:52:45,840 shall not exceed two times the maximum 2881 01:52:43,040 --> 01:52:46,880 overnight occupancy or 25 guests. 2882 01:52:45,840 --> 01:52:48,960 » Gotcha. 2883 01:52:46,880 --> 01:52:51,040 » During the day, it may not exceed three 2884 01:52:48,960 --> 01:52:53,119 times the maximum maximum occupancy, 2885 01:52:51,040 --> 01:52:54,320 which allows 35 people in a home, right? 2886 01:52:53,119 --> 01:52:55,679 And then they have to go home and they 2887 01:52:54,320 --> 01:52:57,360 can't sleep there. So there might be 2888 01:52:55,679 --> 01:52:59,040 some language that might help satisfy 2889 01:52:57,360 --> 01:53:00,000 that because that would be considered a 2890 01:52:59,040 --> 01:53:00,320 gathering. 2891 01:53:00,000 --> 01:53:02,800 » Yeah. 2892 01:53:00,320 --> 01:53:03,679 » I mean 45 people is a lot of people. 2893 01:53:02,800 --> 01:53:04,800 That's 2894 01:53:03,679 --> 01:53:06,639 » We'll look forward to your 2895 01:53:04,800 --> 01:53:08,239 recommendations which find 2896 01:53:06,639 --> 01:53:09,920 » We'll work on some language. 2897 01:53:08,239 --> 01:53:11,360 » I think that was the main things I had. 2898 01:53:09,920 --> 01:53:13,280 I have other notes and I can send those 2899 01:53:11,360 --> 01:53:15,520 to Paul that are more wordsmith stuff 2900 01:53:13,280 --> 01:53:16,639 and stuff like those are the bigger ones 2901 01:53:15,520 --> 01:53:17,199 that I saw. 2902 01:53:16,639 --> 01:53:19,360 » Thank you. 2903 01:53:17,199 --> 01:53:24,239 » Yep. Um, 2904 01:53:19,360 --> 01:53:26,239 my only big comment, I've got 28 2905 01:53:24,239 --> 01:53:29,920 questions or things here, but the only 2906 01:53:26,239 --> 01:53:33,040 big thing in here is I saw a significant 2907 01:53:29,920 --> 01:53:35,440 inconsistency from getting the permit 2908 01:53:33,040 --> 01:53:37,199 and the appeal process, but you've 2909 01:53:35,440 --> 01:53:40,000 already discussed that. You already 2910 01:53:37,199 --> 01:53:42,239 recognize that issue. So, I'm just want 2911 01:53:40,000 --> 01:53:45,119 to re-emphasize, be careful about that 2912 01:53:42,239 --> 01:53:48,560 because if we have to give notice to 2913 01:53:45,119 --> 01:53:51,199 people, that's a $500 check right there 2914 01:53:48,560 --> 01:53:53,119 minimum to go do that research to get 2915 01:53:51,199 --> 01:53:54,800 the title companies to tell us who those 2916 01:53:53,119 --> 01:53:57,440 people are we have to give notice to and 2917 01:53:54,800 --> 01:53:59,599 all that stuff. And as you know, it's a 2918 01:53:57,440 --> 01:54:02,239 it's a it can be an involved process. 2919 01:53:59,599 --> 01:54:04,560 So, um 2920 01:54:02,239 --> 01:54:07,199 I don't want us to try to push that 2921 01:54:04,560 --> 01:54:08,960 issue. I'd like to avoid that if we can. 2922 01:54:07,199 --> 01:54:11,440 I don't know what the right way to get 2923 01:54:08,960 --> 01:54:13,119 around it is, but I would like to avoid 2924 01:54:11,440 --> 01:54:15,440 that if we can because it's just doesn't 2925 01:54:13,119 --> 01:54:20,400 it seems overly burdensome to me to to 2926 01:54:15,440 --> 01:54:21,920 require that. So, um, but other members, 2927 01:54:20,400 --> 01:54:24,639 council members have any other things 2928 01:54:21,920 --> 01:54:25,760 they want to bring up, burning issues to 2929 01:54:24,639 --> 01:54:26,639 them, 2930 01:54:25,760 --> 01:54:27,920 » Mr. Mayor, 2931 01:54:26,639 --> 01:54:31,599 » Mr. Macintosh, 2932 01:54:27,920 --> 01:54:34,480 » I had just just one more uh in section S 2933 01:54:31,599 --> 01:54:39,360 about pets. 2934 01:54:34,480 --> 01:54:40,719 Um, if I scroll back to it, 2935 01:54:39,360 --> 01:54:42,159 » You said S 2936 01:54:40,719 --> 01:54:43,040 » S as in Sam. 2937 01:54:42,159 --> 01:54:44,719 » Yes. 2938 01:54:43,040 --> 01:54:45,760 » Uh, the pets section. 2939 01:54:44,719 --> 01:54:48,159 » Yes. 2940 01:54:45,760 --> 01:54:51,440 » A lot of this seemed to be a 2941 01:54:48,159 --> 01:54:53,520 regurgitation of ordinances we already 2942 01:54:51,440 --> 01:54:54,719 have in place concerning pets. 2943 01:54:53,520 --> 01:54:57,679 » Yes. 2944 01:54:54,719 --> 01:55:01,119 » Should we just reference our existing 2945 01:54:57,679 --> 01:55:04,639 pet ordinance? Um, as I said at the top 2946 01:55:01,119 --> 01:55:07,520 of the almost hour, yes, there these 2947 01:55:04,639 --> 01:55:09,679 were mentioned. I put them in here, but 2948 01:55:07,520 --> 01:55:11,760 understand that we do probably have some 2949 01:55:09,679 --> 01:55:15,040 other regulations that might govern 2950 01:55:11,760 --> 01:55:17,440 that. A lot of our animal control uh 2951 01:55:15,040 --> 01:55:19,679 type of issues are managed by Cedric 2952 01:55:17,440 --> 01:55:21,599 County by contract. So, I need to look 2953 01:55:19,679 --> 01:55:22,639 and see what we have, what we don't 2954 01:55:21,599 --> 01:55:24,400 have, what they're enforcing, what 2955 01:55:22,639 --> 01:55:26,239 they're not, and see if it makes sense. 2956 01:55:24,400 --> 01:55:28,080 And it could be that some of these just 2957 01:55:26,239 --> 01:55:30,400 are part of the good neighbor policies 2958 01:55:28,080 --> 01:55:31,920 that says follow the codes but 2959 01:55:30,400 --> 01:55:33,840 understand that you need to have your 2960 01:55:31,920 --> 01:55:35,760 pet on a leash or whatever because it's 2961 01:55:33,840 --> 01:55:38,400 going to be hard for them to a person 2962 01:55:35,760 --> 01:55:40,080 renting. I wouldn't I may now now that 2963 01:55:38,400 --> 01:55:41,679 I'm a community development director I 2964 01:55:40,080 --> 01:55:43,199 may rent my next house and go look at 2965 01:55:41,679 --> 01:55:46,239 all their zoning codes make sure I'm in 2966 01:55:43,199 --> 01:55:47,840 compliance but uh they most likely they 2967 01:55:46,239 --> 01:55:50,560 wouldn't know. So unless we're kind of 2968 01:55:47,840 --> 01:55:52,239 giving them some guidance. Yes. So, uh, 2969 01:55:50,560 --> 01:55:54,320 you're right. There there might be some 2970 01:55:52,239 --> 01:55:56,320 other governing that might correct all 2971 01:55:54,320 --> 01:55:58,000 this or or take this into account. 2972 01:55:56,320 --> 01:56:00,239 » Okay. Yeah. And I like that suggestion. 2973 01:55:58,000 --> 01:56:02,159 Maybe put a couple bullet points in the 2974 01:56:00,239 --> 01:56:03,440 good neighbor guidelines that are to be 2975 01:56:02,159 --> 01:56:03,760 posted to the guest. 2976 01:56:03,440 --> 01:56:07,760 » Sure. 2977 01:56:03,760 --> 01:56:08,480 » Um, yeah. Just to kind of condense this 2978 01:56:07,760 --> 01:56:11,480 a little bit. 2979 01:56:08,480 --> 01:56:11,480 » Absolutely. 2980 01:56:11,760 --> 01:56:15,520 » Miss Hamburg, did you have something? 2981 01:56:13,599 --> 01:56:18,320 » I just had a couple of quick items. Just 2982 01:56:15,520 --> 01:56:20,480 big picture thing. you're seeing this as 2983 01:56:18,320 --> 01:56:22,320 complaint driven. Like you're not going 2984 01:56:20,480 --> 01:56:24,159 to stare at Airbnb sites and be like, 2985 01:56:22,320 --> 01:56:25,760 "Oh, I noticed that they they've had 2986 01:56:24,159 --> 01:56:26,400 this up for 6 months instead of three 2987 01:56:25,760 --> 01:56:27,920 months." 2988 01:56:26,400 --> 01:56:28,880 » Yeah. You just your time doesn't even 2989 01:56:27,920 --> 01:56:29,360 allow that. 2990 01:56:28,880 --> 01:56:31,440 » No. 2991 01:56:29,360 --> 01:56:33,360 » The big picture ideas here is to kind of 2992 01:56:31,440 --> 01:56:36,880 have a a stick if you've got a repeat 2993 01:56:33,360 --> 01:56:39,280 offender that's causing problems. So, um 2994 01:56:36,880 --> 01:56:41,440 just along those lines of maybe getting 2995 01:56:39,280 --> 01:56:43,119 too detailed, but still leaving our 2996 01:56:41,440 --> 01:56:47,440 ability to deal with problems. 2997 01:56:43,119 --> 01:56:50,719 » Sure. uh section P, you know, where it 2998 01:56:47,440 --> 01:56:51,440 says uh 2999 01:56:50,719 --> 01:56:52,560 » Trash collection. 3000 01:56:51,440 --> 01:56:54,880 » Number two, 3001 01:56:52,560 --> 01:56:56,960 » You you might require that they they 3002 01:56:54,880 --> 01:56:58,400 show that they have trash service. Well, 3003 01:56:56,960 --> 01:57:00,320 the big deal is is you don't want trash 3004 01:56:58,400 --> 01:57:01,840 piling up and you don't want them using 3005 01:57:00,320 --> 01:57:04,239 the neighbor's trash can. Correct. 3006 01:57:01,840 --> 01:57:07,520 » So, that seems like overkill, but it 3007 01:57:04,239 --> 01:57:09,280 might be a way to deal with them if it 3008 01:57:07,520 --> 01:57:10,400 becomes an issue and to have a path to 3009 01:57:09,280 --> 01:57:10,880 deal with them. Correct. 3010 01:57:10,400 --> 01:57:14,159 » Correct. 3011 01:57:10,880 --> 01:57:16,560 » Yeah. and or it might be that it might 3012 01:57:14,159 --> 01:57:19,679 fit in another 3013 01:57:16,560 --> 01:57:21,280 » Section. I just we just talked about 3014 01:57:19,679 --> 01:57:22,719 making because we had a complaint that 3015 01:57:21,280 --> 01:57:25,280 said they were putting trash and they 3016 01:57:22,719 --> 01:57:27,360 hadn't picked up their trash in days and 3017 01:57:25,280 --> 01:57:29,360 a week after somebody left and they were 3018 01:57:27,360 --> 01:57:31,360 just piling it on the ground. And so we 3019 01:57:29,360 --> 01:57:34,080 were just trying to consider what all 3020 01:57:31,360 --> 01:57:35,520 needs to be in there. And like I said, 3021 01:57:34,080 --> 01:57:37,040 these sections will be modified if 3022 01:57:35,520 --> 01:57:38,960 there's places in the code that are 3023 01:57:37,040 --> 01:57:40,320 accurately reflecting what we want. If 3024 01:57:38,960 --> 01:57:41,199 they aren't, then we're gonna put them 3025 01:57:40,320 --> 01:57:41,599 in here. 3026 01:57:41,199 --> 01:57:42,400 » Yeah. 3027 01:57:41,599 --> 01:57:44,719 » Correct. 3028 01:57:42,400 --> 01:57:46,480 » Okay. And then same goes for like uh 3029 01:57:44,719 --> 01:57:49,599 section Q with the lighting about the 3030 01:57:46,480 --> 01:57:50,719 porch being on overnight. Like I think, 3031 01:57:49,599 --> 01:57:52,639 you know, you can pull something like 3032 01:57:50,719 --> 01:57:53,679 that out, but again, you kind of need to 3033 01:57:52,639 --> 01:57:55,040 write a number of things because you 3034 01:57:53,679 --> 01:57:56,239 can't predict every situation that's 3035 01:57:55,040 --> 01:57:57,920 going to bug your neighbor and actually 3036 01:57:56,239 --> 01:57:59,440 be a long-term problem. So, 3037 01:57:57,920 --> 01:58:01,520 » I think that we're we're going to modify 3038 01:57:59,440 --> 01:58:03,040 that lighting section in the sense that 3039 01:58:01,520 --> 01:58:05,040 we have a lot of people who we don't 3040 01:58:03,040 --> 01:58:06,800 want them to put the big lights up in 3041 01:58:05,040 --> 01:58:08,719 the backyard so they can swim all hours 3042 01:58:06,800 --> 01:58:10,480 of the night, right? or light pollution 3043 01:58:08,719 --> 01:58:11,920 and we just want to make sure that we're 3044 01:58:10,480 --> 01:58:14,480 mindful of that. We have a whole 3045 01:58:11,920 --> 01:58:16,480 lighting uh section. We just want to 3046 01:58:14,480 --> 01:58:18,880 make sure that we're considering what 3047 01:58:16,480 --> 01:58:20,800 might happen in STR which is now 3048 01:58:18,880 --> 01:58:22,639 currently not in considered in our 3049 01:58:20,800 --> 01:58:24,719 existing codes. 3050 01:58:22,639 --> 01:58:26,800 » Okay. Thank you. 3051 01:58:24,719 --> 01:58:28,560 » Mr. Mayor, just a clarification. Do you 3052 01:58:26,800 --> 01:58:30,320 think quiet hours will solve a lot of 3053 01:58:28,560 --> 01:58:32,000 the issues that you kind of just 3054 01:58:30,320 --> 01:58:34,639 described? 3055 01:58:32,000 --> 01:58:37,440 » Oh my goodness, that's a tough question. 3056 01:58:34,639 --> 01:58:38,800 Um, we I mean right now neighbors have 3057 01:58:37,440 --> 01:58:40,320 the right to call the police if there's 3058 01:58:38,800 --> 01:58:43,360 some concern about noise at certain 3059 01:58:40,320 --> 01:58:45,840 hours, right? So, I think it is a good 3060 01:58:43,360 --> 01:58:48,080 neighbor policy for sure and a reminder 3061 01:58:45,840 --> 01:58:51,119 that says, "Please post this because we 3062 01:58:48,080 --> 01:58:54,239 don't want the STR renters assuming that 3063 01:58:51,119 --> 01:58:55,840 they can go all night if they want to." 3064 01:58:54,239 --> 01:58:58,480 Um, they don't know what they don't 3065 01:58:55,840 --> 01:59:02,159 know. And so if we can request them to 3066 01:58:58,480 --> 01:59:04,080 create some written posted whatever 3067 01:59:02,159 --> 01:59:05,920 policy to let them know, then when 3068 01:59:04,080 --> 01:59:07,840 somebody shows up at the door and says, 3069 01:59:05,920 --> 01:59:09,760 um, it's 2 o'clock in the morning, 3070 01:59:07,840 --> 01:59:12,239 you're supposed to shut this down, 3071 01:59:09,760 --> 01:59:14,480 right? Then they know they they should 3072 01:59:12,239 --> 01:59:16,560 have known some way. So some of these 3073 01:59:14,480 --> 01:59:18,800 will fit nicely into the good neighbor 3074 01:59:16,560 --> 01:59:20,480 requirement posting. I'd like to say 3075 01:59:18,800 --> 01:59:21,760 that people don't know what they don't 3076 01:59:20,480 --> 01:59:23,360 know, but if they do know it, they 3077 01:59:21,760 --> 01:59:24,960 better follow it and then we have a 3078 01:59:23,360 --> 01:59:26,639 little bit better opportunity to talk to 3079 01:59:24,960 --> 01:59:29,199 the property owner after the fact. 3080 01:59:26,639 --> 01:59:31,119 » Yeah. No, that makes sense. 3081 01:59:29,199 --> 01:59:33,040 » Mr. Mayor, I did have one more item I 3082 01:59:31,119 --> 01:59:35,599 found since unless anybody else has 3083 01:59:33,040 --> 01:59:38,159 something to bring up. Um I did look at 3084 01:59:35,599 --> 01:59:40,800 the AA section for appeals of short-term 3085 01:59:38,159 --> 01:59:43,360 rental decisions. Um page 27 is where it 3086 01:59:40,800 --> 01:59:45,520 started. Um, and just kind of reading 3087 01:59:43,360 --> 01:59:48,480 through it looks like, so for instance, 3088 01:59:45,520 --> 01:59:49,840 uh, B under administrative appeal, the 3089 01:59:48,480 --> 01:59:51,599 appeal shall include, and there's a 3090 01:59:49,840 --> 01:59:53,679 laundry list there, but it looks to me 3091 01:59:51,599 --> 01:59:55,920 like you're following the zoning, the 3092 01:59:53,679 --> 01:59:57,599 200 feet of the area proposed and the 3093 01:59:55,920 --> 01:59:59,520 10,00 requirement is just straight out 3094 01:59:57,599 --> 02:00:01,599 of what we have to do on zoning cases, 3095 01:59:59,520 --> 02:00:04,880 which is great. I think that's perfect. 3096 02:00:01,599 --> 02:00:07,760 Uh, the next page, item 3097 02:00:04,880 --> 02:00:09,679 D for protest petition. This one got me 3098 02:00:07,760 --> 02:00:12,400 going, got me just thinking a little bit 3099 02:00:09,679 --> 02:00:14,560 of how how this is going to turn from an 3100 02:00:12,400 --> 02:00:17,119 administrative process into a planning 3101 02:00:14,560 --> 02:00:19,679 process very quickly if we don't decide 3102 02:00:17,119 --> 02:00:23,520 on this. And what I mean by that is the 3103 02:00:19,679 --> 02:00:25,360 protest petition um percentage at 20%. 3104 02:00:23,520 --> 02:00:28,800 So if if there was 10 neighbors near 3105 02:00:25,360 --> 02:00:30,880 your uh STR, two only two would have to 3106 02:00:28,800 --> 02:00:32,560 say, "Nope, just don't want an STR next 3107 02:00:30,880 --> 02:00:35,119 to me. Nope, just don't want it. I don't 3108 02:00:32,560 --> 02:00:37,280 care what property rights they want." I 3109 02:00:35,119 --> 02:00:39,199 have a problem with 20%. Seems way too 3110 02:00:37,280 --> 02:00:41,360 low. I know where it comes from. I read 3111 02:00:39,199 --> 02:00:43,599 the it's from the can the c the Kansas 3112 02:00:41,360 --> 02:00:47,040 state statute where if you're have a 3113 02:00:43,599 --> 02:00:49,840 zoning uh protest petition process, it 3114 02:00:47,040 --> 02:00:51,119 it requires a supermajority vote of the 3115 02:00:49,840 --> 02:00:54,400 governing body. I think that's where 3116 02:00:51,119 --> 02:00:56,080 that's pulled from. In this case, I 3117 02:00:54,400 --> 02:00:57,520 think the protest petition should be 3118 02:00:56,080 --> 02:00:59,440 much higher because what you're asking 3119 02:00:57,520 --> 02:01:01,760 is, hey neighborhood, do you really have 3120 02:00:59,440 --> 02:01:02,800 a problem with this? And to me, 20% is 3121 02:01:01,760 --> 02:01:06,000 not the neighborhood having a problem 3122 02:01:02,800 --> 02:01:07,599 with this. 40 or 50% is and at this 3123 02:01:06,000 --> 02:01:09,440 point you're not denying anything. 3124 02:01:07,599 --> 02:01:11,440 You're just requiring another step which 3125 02:01:09,440 --> 02:01:13,520 is then what I what I read is the 3126 02:01:11,440 --> 02:01:16,480 planning commission turns into the 3127 02:01:13,520 --> 02:01:17,760 appeals the final say in the matters. 3128 02:01:16,480 --> 02:01:20,239 Right. So they go through a typical 3129 02:01:17,760 --> 02:01:21,440 zoning process with the um planning 3130 02:01:20,239 --> 02:01:24,880 commission. Correct. 3131 02:01:21,440 --> 02:01:27,040 » Well that at at the top of the hour um I 3132 02:01:24,880 --> 02:01:28,320 said I also said that this is a little 3133 02:01:27,040 --> 02:01:30,000 bit messier. We're gonna have to 3134 02:01:28,320 --> 02:01:32,239 uncouple some things. So, let me just be 3135 02:01:30,000 --> 02:01:36,320 fair and say 3136 02:01:32,239 --> 02:01:38,400 um the application would come to me and 3137 02:01:36,320 --> 02:01:41,440 if they meet all the requirements, I 3138 02:01:38,400 --> 02:01:45,199 approve it. If for some reason I deny 3139 02:01:41,440 --> 02:01:48,000 it, we allow the applicant to file the 3140 02:01:45,199 --> 02:01:50,000 appeal. Right? So, the appeal we're 3141 02:01:48,000 --> 02:01:53,360 trying to mimic and see what that flow 3142 02:01:50,000 --> 02:01:55,520 will be and we will lo we will probably 3143 02:01:53,360 --> 02:01:58,159 pretty closely follow the process for 3144 02:01:55,520 --> 02:02:00,719 any appeal that we would have. Okay. The 3145 02:01:58,159 --> 02:02:02,080 other problem that we have is and we had 3146 02:02:00,719 --> 02:02:04,080 a lot of discussion and this is the 3147 02:02:02,080 --> 02:02:06,560 other messy piece of it is that when I 3148 02:02:04,080 --> 02:02:06,960 receive an application to review it 3149 02:02:06,560 --> 02:02:09,520 » Right 3150 02:02:06,960 --> 02:02:11,440 » For approval or denial and they do meet 3151 02:02:09,520 --> 02:02:13,679 all the expectations 3152 02:02:11,440 --> 02:02:16,639 there's no mechanism that allows or 3153 02:02:13,679 --> 02:02:19,280 provides for the uh neighbors to know 3154 02:02:16,639 --> 02:02:21,199 that this is even going to happen. So I 3155 02:02:19,280 --> 02:02:22,960 have a two-prong problem. What am I 3156 02:02:21,199 --> 02:02:25,840 going to do when I get the application 3157 02:02:22,960 --> 02:02:29,040 to notify neighbors if I need to? And 3158 02:02:25,840 --> 02:02:31,360 what is that burden on them to submit a 3159 02:02:29,040 --> 02:02:37,440 petition or protest, whatever it is, or 3160 02:02:31,360 --> 02:02:40,400 notification? And if I do get uh 3161 02:02:37,440 --> 02:02:43,360 complaints about an STR going in next 3162 02:02:40,400 --> 02:02:46,239 door to the property owners, what do I 3163 02:02:43,360 --> 02:02:49,920 do with it? Is that a condition to deny? 3164 02:02:46,239 --> 02:02:51,520 Right? So, that's one area. If I deny it 3165 02:02:49,920 --> 02:02:54,239 and the applicant doesn't agree with 3166 02:02:51,520 --> 02:02:57,440 that, then I my intent is to follow the 3167 02:02:54,239 --> 02:02:59,840 appropriate appeal process. Now the 3168 02:02:57,440 --> 02:03:01,760 question really becomes does it start 3169 02:02:59,840 --> 02:03:04,320 and stop with the planning commission or 3170 02:03:01,760 --> 02:03:07,520 does it follow the normal process of any 3171 02:03:04,320 --> 02:03:09,040 other which would be planning commission 3172 02:03:07,520 --> 02:03:11,199 makes recommendation to city council, 3173 02:03:09,040 --> 02:03:12,880 city council reviews it. Right? So those 3174 02:03:11,199 --> 02:03:16,320 are the nuances that we're still trying 3175 02:03:12,880 --> 02:03:18,719 to work out. So, um 3176 02:03:16,320 --> 02:03:21,360 um with that being said, I think we'll 3177 02:03:18,719 --> 02:03:24,000 have a clearer, that's a technical word, 3178 02:03:21,360 --> 02:03:26,159 picture of how this process will work as 3179 02:03:24,000 --> 02:03:27,520 we give it some additional thought, 3180 02:03:26,159 --> 02:03:29,360 right? Because when this whole thing 3181 02:03:27,520 --> 02:03:32,159 started, your your question was is that 3182 02:03:29,360 --> 02:03:34,000 I was going to hold the public hearing 3183 02:03:32,159 --> 02:03:37,280 and I can't do that. And the only way 3184 02:03:34,000 --> 02:03:39,520 that I could is if the applicant for the 3185 02:03:37,280 --> 02:03:42,320 STR provides me and pays for the 3186 02:03:39,520 --> 02:03:43,360 ownership list. I notify like we 3187 02:03:42,320 --> 02:03:45,119 normally do, right? 3188 02:03:43,360 --> 02:03:47,040 » And then there's a waiting period of the 3189 02:03:45,119 --> 02:03:48,719 20 days so that people know what's 3190 02:03:47,040 --> 02:03:50,480 happening. But then where are they going 3191 02:03:48,719 --> 02:03:52,159 to go? 3192 02:03:50,480 --> 02:03:55,119 » I I'm not going to be the administrative 3193 02:03:52,159 --> 02:03:56,800 hearing officer deciding whether this 3194 02:03:55,119 --> 02:03:59,440 goes through or not. Right? So those are 3195 02:03:56,800 --> 02:04:01,840 the difficulties um that we have to sort 3196 02:03:59,440 --> 02:04:03,760 of figure out how to 3197 02:04:01,840 --> 02:04:06,719 » Put the appropriate process with the 3198 02:04:03,760 --> 02:04:08,960 appropriate intent. My thing is is that 3199 02:04:06,719 --> 02:04:10,560 if they approve if they meet all the 3200 02:04:08,960 --> 02:04:12,880 requirements that you all have set out 3201 02:04:10,560 --> 02:04:16,800 then I'm going to approve it. If they 3202 02:04:12,880 --> 02:04:18,159 don't then what? And then we're going to 3203 02:04:16,800 --> 02:04:20,159 be hearing from neighbors who said 3204 02:04:18,159 --> 02:04:21,599 nobody ever told us that that 3205 02:04:20,159 --> 02:04:23,440 application was filed and that you 3206 02:04:21,599 --> 02:04:25,199 approved it. Well our code doesn't 3207 02:04:23,440 --> 02:04:28,000 require that. So there's a lot of work 3208 02:04:25,199 --> 02:04:30,080 to be done in that area. 3209 02:04:28,000 --> 02:04:31,599 U we just put the placeholders in there 3210 02:04:30,080 --> 02:04:33,199 because we'd had quite a discussion 3211 02:04:31,599 --> 02:04:35,679 about it previously. 3212 02:04:33,199 --> 02:04:37,360 » Yeah, I I agree with your earlier 3213 02:04:35,679 --> 02:04:38,400 comment that there needs to be some work 3214 02:04:37,360 --> 02:04:40,880 on that. 3215 02:04:38,400 --> 02:04:41,199 » Oh, a lot of work. Let's 3216 02:04:40,880 --> 02:04:42,560 » Pull out. 3217 02:04:41,199 --> 02:04:44,800 » Let's give you a chance to do that and 3218 02:04:42,560 --> 02:04:46,560 and then absolutely can consider what 3219 02:04:44,800 --> 02:04:48,320 what it is. So, I I appreciate that you 3220 02:04:46,560 --> 02:04:50,639 have some comments, but I think that 3221 02:04:48,320 --> 02:04:53,040 it's going to drastically change in this 3222 02:04:50,639 --> 02:04:55,440 area as we start trying to figure out um 3223 02:04:53,040 --> 02:04:58,400 how best to put this through if somebody 3224 02:04:55,440 --> 02:04:59,920 has a issue or complaint or appeal. 3225 02:04:58,400 --> 02:05:01,920 » Okay, 3226 02:04:59,920 --> 02:05:04,080 gotcha. Yep. Nope, that makes sense. And 3227 02:05:01,920 --> 02:05:05,840 I think it'd be helpful to do some more 3228 02:05:04,080 --> 02:05:08,719 research, see what other jurisdictions 3229 02:05:05,840 --> 02:05:11,040 do as far as notifications if if they're 3230 02:05:08,719 --> 02:05:13,679 legally required or not. Some probably 3231 02:05:11,040 --> 02:05:15,199 choose to to post notice somehow or some 3232 02:05:13,679 --> 02:05:17,679 way even if they aren't going to have a 3233 02:05:15,199 --> 02:05:20,080 public hearing. So, nope. That's the 3234 02:05:17,679 --> 02:05:22,000 only other major one I I missed. 3235 02:05:20,080 --> 02:05:24,800 » Mr. Proctor, did you have any sections 3236 02:05:22,000 --> 02:05:27,280 you wanted to discuss? 3237 02:05:24,800 --> 02:05:28,719 » I think the sections I I was maybe a 3238 02:05:27,280 --> 02:05:31,199 little concerned about. We've talked 3239 02:05:28,719 --> 02:05:33,760 about and then um I think you me 3240 02:05:31,199 --> 02:05:35,360 mentioned the discrepancy between like 3241 02:05:33,760 --> 02:05:36,800 the two years and one year, but I kind 3242 02:05:35,360 --> 02:05:37,920 of figured that'd get worked out before 3243 02:05:36,800 --> 02:05:41,119 this is all done anyways. 3244 02:05:37,920 --> 02:05:42,400 » Okay, good. Thank you, Mr. David. Did 3245 02:05:41,119 --> 02:05:43,040 you have any other sections you want to 3246 02:05:42,400 --> 02:05:44,719 talk about? 3247 02:05:43,040 --> 02:05:47,119 » No addition. Just the the general 3248 02:05:44,719 --> 02:05:48,880 consensus that less is more. So, if we 3249 02:05:47,119 --> 02:05:51,199 can condense it and 3250 02:05:48,880 --> 02:05:53,360 » Get rid of things, reference things that 3251 02:05:51,199 --> 02:05:54,080 that don't need to be repeated, that all 3252 02:05:53,360 --> 02:05:55,679 be 3253 02:05:54,080 --> 02:05:58,080 » Improvement. Thanks, 3254 02:05:55,679 --> 02:06:00,000 » Miss Hamburg. Are you satisfied with 3255 02:05:58,080 --> 02:06:02,800 anything? Okay. 3256 02:06:00,000 --> 02:06:04,560 » Okay. So, I guess we've uh pretty much 3257 02:06:02,800 --> 02:06:05,199 covered everything and appreciate all 3258 02:06:04,560 --> 02:06:07,280 the input. 3259 02:06:05,199 --> 02:06:09,920 » Rage, can I make two comments that'll be 3260 02:06:07,280 --> 02:06:13,520 short? I know, I know, but I I just have 3261 02:06:09,920 --> 02:06:14,639 to get this from this conversation. So, 3262 02:06:13,520 --> 02:06:16,960 as you can tell, we're going to spend 3263 02:06:14,639 --> 02:06:20,960 the next three workshops talking about 3264 02:06:16,960 --> 02:06:23,760 codes. And we have this that's 3265 02:06:20,960 --> 02:06:26,800 related that Paula talked about. We also 3266 02:06:23,760 --> 02:06:28,960 have a Senate bill out there that we're 3267 02:06:26,800 --> 02:06:31,760 going to talk about in conjunction. Mhm. 3268 02:06:28,960 --> 02:06:35,119 » So, kind of the the broad plan of staff 3269 02:06:31,760 --> 02:06:37,840 is to make all three of these crescendo 3270 02:06:35,119 --> 02:06:40,480 » Into one. 3271 02:06:37,840 --> 02:06:42,880 There'll be different votes, but as far 3272 02:06:40,480 --> 02:06:45,440 as timing goes, and I I know we were 3273 02:06:42,880 --> 02:06:48,159 looking at fall of this year, and we 3274 02:06:45,440 --> 02:06:50,480 will continue to push, we're dedicating 3275 02:06:48,159 --> 02:06:53,280 all of our workshops to the end of the 3276 02:06:50,480 --> 02:06:56,079 year to zoning matters. Um, so I just 3277 02:06:53,280 --> 02:06:58,079 want to be clear that um, we're we're 3278 02:06:56,079 --> 02:07:01,119 going to work on this as much as we can, 3279 02:06:58,079 --> 02:07:02,719 but it might be tied to some of the 3280 02:07:01,119 --> 02:07:05,280 zoning codes that we're going to discuss 3281 02:07:02,719 --> 02:07:07,199 over the next three workshops. So, I 3282 02:07:05,280 --> 02:07:11,599 just want to be clear on that. The other 3283 02:07:07,199 --> 02:07:12,880 hard part, um, and you know, the 3284 02:07:11,599 --> 02:07:14,960 planning commission makes the 3285 02:07:12,880 --> 02:07:18,639 recommendation and and the council 3286 02:07:14,960 --> 02:07:20,480 approves this matter. Um, 3287 02:07:18,639 --> 02:07:22,159 a lot of times we talk have these 3288 02:07:20,480 --> 02:07:24,159 conversations about big policy and it 3289 02:07:22,159 --> 02:07:25,599 doesn't involve the planning commission. 3290 02:07:24,159 --> 02:07:28,000 I was at the planning commission meeting 3291 02:07:25,599 --> 02:07:29,679 and we presented this and I think a lot 3292 02:07:28,000 --> 02:07:31,360 of them said, "Hey, can we get it in 3293 02:07:29,679 --> 02:07:33,440 word version and make our markups and 3294 02:07:31,360 --> 02:07:37,440 send it to Paula?" Essentially, what 3295 02:07:33,440 --> 02:07:39,520 that does to my staff is sends almost 12 3296 02:07:37,440 --> 02:07:42,800 different versions of the same document 3297 02:07:39,520 --> 02:07:45,360 to one person. And I understand 3298 02:07:42,800 --> 02:07:48,079 um she she can she can navigate those 3299 02:07:45,360 --> 02:07:50,480 waters, but it might be good to think as 3300 02:07:48,079 --> 02:07:52,239 we move to our next workshop of what 3301 02:07:50,480 --> 02:07:53,599 what recommendation you would like from 3302 02:07:52,239 --> 02:07:56,960 the planning commission. Do you want 3303 02:07:53,599 --> 02:08:00,400 them to completely dive themselves into 3304 02:07:56,960 --> 02:08:02,159 this and and and get word by word what 3305 02:08:00,400 --> 02:08:04,079 they want? I I just feel like we owe it 3306 02:08:02,159 --> 02:08:06,239 to the planning commission of, you know, 3307 02:08:04,079 --> 02:08:07,840 h how deep do you want them to go in 3308 02:08:06,239 --> 02:08:09,920 this process? because we're going to go 3309 02:08:07,840 --> 02:08:12,320 really deep this group and if they go 3310 02:08:09,920 --> 02:08:14,320 really deep it's going to be even 3311 02:08:12,320 --> 02:08:16,639 tougher on Paula. So I I don't know if 3312 02:08:14,320 --> 02:08:18,400 I've properly asked this question but I 3313 02:08:16,639 --> 02:08:19,599 would like some guidance to give to our 3314 02:08:18,400 --> 02:08:23,040 » I think I understand your question about 3315 02:08:19,599 --> 02:08:25,360 what my question is what process do you 3316 02:08:23,040 --> 02:08:26,880 think would work best for you 3317 02:08:25,360 --> 02:08:29,199 » Because you're going to get input from 3318 02:08:26,880 --> 02:08:32,159 seven planning commission people and 3319 02:08:29,199 --> 02:08:33,119 from six governing body people. That's a 3320 02:08:32,159 --> 02:08:36,639 big team. 3321 02:08:33,119 --> 02:08:39,040 » It's a huge team. So, up to this point, 3322 02:08:36,639 --> 02:08:41,040 we've workshopped only with you. I 3323 02:08:39,040 --> 02:08:42,719 introduced it because we know that any 3324 02:08:41,040 --> 02:08:45,040 change to the zoning regulations has to 3325 02:08:42,719 --> 02:08:49,840 go through the planning commission. Um, 3326 02:08:45,040 --> 02:08:52,400 I like receiving feedback on a very big 3327 02:08:49,840 --> 02:08:55,280 umbrella. I do not want to spend 3328 02:08:52,400 --> 02:08:57,440 workshop time of anybody's time 3329 02:08:55,280 --> 02:09:00,480 completely word by word going through 3330 02:08:57,440 --> 02:09:02,480 this document and word. 3331 02:09:00,480 --> 02:09:05,840 » Thank you. Because I don't either. Um, 3332 02:09:02,480 --> 02:09:07,040 so I'd like I I mean the in all honesty, 3333 02:09:05,840 --> 02:09:09,679 he didn't say this either, but the 3334 02:09:07,040 --> 02:09:12,480 planning commission requested to have a 3335 02:09:09,679 --> 02:09:15,599 workshop space on their own meetings 3336 02:09:12,480 --> 02:09:17,920 with PEC to talk about all these things 3337 02:09:15,599 --> 02:09:21,040 so they can tell 3338 02:09:17,920 --> 02:09:24,239 um um 3339 02:09:21,040 --> 02:09:25,199 staff PEC what to include in this these 3340 02:09:24,239 --> 02:09:27,440 codes. 3341 02:09:25,199 --> 02:09:29,840 » Okay. So, we said, "No, we're going to 3342 02:09:27,440 --> 02:09:32,880 have joint commission and council 3343 02:09:29,840 --> 02:09:34,480 because um what did we say?" Right? The 3344 02:09:32,880 --> 02:09:36,480 odds are you have to have three votes. 3345 02:09:34,480 --> 02:09:38,639 And so, the thing is is if you're 3346 02:09:36,480 --> 02:09:40,159 rewriting everything and it has nothing 3347 02:09:38,639 --> 02:09:42,159 to do with where the council's direction 3348 02:09:40,159 --> 02:09:44,400 is, who the ultimate governing body for 3349 02:09:42,159 --> 02:09:46,159 approval, um I'm just spinning my 3350 02:09:44,400 --> 02:09:49,040 wheels, right? So, we're not going to 3351 02:09:46,159 --> 02:09:50,960 have any separate, but be prepared that 3352 02:09:49,040 --> 02:09:52,159 from a from the zoning code perspective, 3353 02:09:50,960 --> 02:09:54,159 they're going to come to these workshops 3354 02:09:52,159 --> 02:09:56,880 with a whole laundry list of things they 3355 02:09:54,159 --> 02:09:59,920 think should be included. Um, from the 3356 02:09:56,880 --> 02:10:02,960 STR, they want to look at the document 3357 02:09:59,920 --> 02:10:05,360 and provide guidance. I'm willing to 3358 02:10:02,960 --> 02:10:08,639 take big picture guidance, but not 3359 02:10:05,360 --> 02:10:10,960 rewriting. I'm also not necessarily 3360 02:10:08,639 --> 02:10:12,719 willing to have additional workshops 3361 02:10:10,960 --> 02:10:14,960 just with them. I'd rather bring the 3362 02:10:12,719 --> 02:10:18,480 suggestions back to you all to see what 3363 02:10:14,960 --> 02:10:20,159 fits and what doesn't. Um, and then 3364 02:10:18,480 --> 02:10:21,280 ultimately when the document is defined, 3365 02:10:20,159 --> 02:10:22,800 then we can bring it back through 3366 02:10:21,280 --> 02:10:24,800 planning commission for approval based 3367 02:10:22,800 --> 02:10:27,440 on your recommendations and then move to 3368 02:10:24,800 --> 02:10:29,040 you. So, it's really messy right now. 3369 02:10:27,440 --> 02:10:31,280 Um, and I we'll give some more thought 3370 02:10:29,040 --> 02:10:33,040 to it about what we're going to do, but 3371 02:10:31,280 --> 02:10:36,079 um I just wanted you all to be prepared 3372 02:10:33,040 --> 02:10:38,480 that at most of the the uh zoning code 3373 02:10:36,079 --> 02:10:40,159 update workshops, they have a lot of 3374 02:10:38,480 --> 02:10:41,119 ideas about what they want to see in the 3375 02:10:40,159 --> 02:10:43,040 codes. 3376 02:10:41,119 --> 02:10:44,800 I'm not enamored with the idea of giving 3377 02:10:43,040 --> 02:10:46,639 them the word document and having them 3378 02:10:44,800 --> 02:10:49,280 come back with the changes because I 3379 02:10:46,639 --> 02:10:49,760 could just see that as a huge 3380 02:10:49,280 --> 02:10:51,599 » Pro. 3381 02:10:49,760 --> 02:10:52,960 » It will and it hasn't they requested it 3382 02:10:51,599 --> 02:10:54,000 hasn't been provided. I let them know 3383 02:10:52,960 --> 02:10:55,679 that we were going to be talking to 3384 02:10:54,000 --> 02:10:57,840 council tonight. 3385 02:10:55,679 --> 02:10:59,920 » I mean and and council members please 3386 02:10:57,840 --> 02:11:01,760 speak up if you have any input on that. 3387 02:10:59,920 --> 02:11:05,199 But I just I can just see that just 3388 02:11:01,760 --> 02:11:07,920 being a a horrible burden on her if we 3389 02:11:05,199 --> 02:11:08,800 did that. 3390 02:11:07,920 --> 02:11:12,320 » Mr. Mayor, 3391 02:11:08,800 --> 02:11:15,599 » Mr. McDuck. Uh um I I agree with the 3392 02:11:12,320 --> 02:11:17,679 general sentiment that yeah, if somebody 3393 02:11:15,599 --> 02:11:20,239 gets in there and words smmiths this 3394 02:11:17,679 --> 02:11:22,000 preliminary document, it it just get 3395 02:11:20,239 --> 02:11:24,239 ginormous. 3396 02:11:22,000 --> 02:11:26,960 something that works well in the the 3397 02:11:24,239 --> 02:11:29,440 business that I'm in. Um, we use 3398 02:11:26,960 --> 02:11:34,400 Microsoft 365, 3399 02:11:29,440 --> 02:11:35,920 you can share a review only copy of a 3400 02:11:34,400 --> 02:11:38,320 document 3401 02:11:35,920 --> 02:11:41,599 to allow individuals if they want to 3402 02:11:38,320 --> 02:11:43,520 spend six hours on a document 3403 02:11:41,599 --> 02:11:45,280 reviewing and making comments, but you 3404 02:11:43,520 --> 02:11:47,679 can't actually change the content of the 3405 02:11:45,280 --> 02:11:49,760 document. You can make suggestions that 3406 02:11:47,679 --> 02:11:51,840 are really easy to implement if they're 3407 02:11:49,760 --> 02:11:55,679 good suggestions. 3408 02:11:51,840 --> 02:11:58,000 Um, and they're super quick to review. 3409 02:11:55,679 --> 02:12:00,639 Um, I think some of the input we might 3410 02:11:58,000 --> 02:12:02,719 get from individuals who want to go 3411 02:12:00,639 --> 02:12:04,719 through and spend a lot of time on this 3412 02:12:02,719 --> 02:12:06,159 could be very valuable 3413 02:12:04,719 --> 02:12:09,760 » And we should provide them the 3414 02:12:06,159 --> 02:12:12,960 opportunity to provide that value. 3415 02:12:09,760 --> 02:12:15,119 Um, maybe the right approach is a review 3416 02:12:12,960 --> 02:12:18,320 only version 3417 02:12:15,119 --> 02:12:20,960 of a shared document. Everybody's in the 3418 02:12:18,320 --> 02:12:24,159 same document at the same time. leaving 3419 02:12:20,960 --> 02:12:26,800 comments in the same document. 3420 02:12:24,159 --> 02:12:29,599 Um, if that if you think that would be a 3421 02:12:26,800 --> 02:12:31,920 good idea, that'd be my suggestion. Um, 3422 02:12:29,599 --> 02:12:33,360 but I'll go back to the mayor's comment. 3423 02:12:31,920 --> 02:12:35,119 Whatever is going to be easiest for you, 3424 02:12:33,360 --> 02:12:36,000 Paula, I think is the right approach 3425 02:12:35,119 --> 02:12:38,480 because ultimately 3426 02:12:36,000 --> 02:12:40,159 » And I want to make sure that you if we 3427 02:12:38,480 --> 02:12:42,719 one thing we talked about related to the 3428 02:12:40,159 --> 02:12:45,199 shared document was are we violating the 3429 02:12:42,719 --> 02:12:47,840 the open meetings by them getting into 3430 02:12:45,199 --> 02:12:48,719 the document and exchanging stuff all 3431 02:12:47,840 --> 02:12:50,400 the time because they're going to be 3432 02:12:48,719 --> 02:12:52,079 able to see each other's comments. They 3433 02:12:50,400 --> 02:12:53,760 may be able to put comments in there 3434 02:12:52,079 --> 02:12:56,159 that says, "Hey, I don't like that, but 3435 02:12:53,760 --> 02:12:57,520 let's do that." So, I did not agree to 3436 02:12:56,159 --> 02:12:59,199 that at the time because it was 3437 02:12:57,520 --> 02:13:00,719 suggested and I was concerned about the 3438 02:12:59,199 --> 02:13:03,040 open meetings and the serial meetings. 3439 02:13:00,719 --> 02:13:05,679 So, I'm not inclined to do that. 3440 02:13:03,040 --> 02:13:08,480 However, I'm not opposed to them 3441 02:13:05,679 --> 02:13:11,119 submitting comments and suggestions 3442 02:13:08,480 --> 02:13:15,599 individually to me, but I want a 3443 02:13:11,119 --> 02:13:17,040 mechanism to bring back to you to say, 3444 02:13:15,599 --> 02:13:18,800 do we want to spend time on that? 3445 02:13:17,040 --> 02:13:21,679 Because they may say, well, they can 3446 02:13:18,800 --> 02:13:23,599 have up to 70 days a year if they're not 3447 02:13:21,679 --> 02:13:25,679 going to rent it. Or they may be able to 3448 02:13:23,599 --> 02:13:27,520 have, why can't they have 20 people in 3449 02:13:25,679 --> 02:13:29,280 there? Maybe they want five people 3450 02:13:27,520 --> 02:13:32,320 maximum, right? So, they're gonna 3451 02:13:29,280 --> 02:13:34,560 they're gonna have some really um 3452 02:13:32,320 --> 02:13:36,079 » Good comments, and they might have some 3453 02:13:34,560 --> 02:13:37,599 comments that you don't agree with, and 3454 02:13:36,079 --> 02:13:39,199 I don't want to spend time developing 3455 02:13:37,599 --> 02:13:40,079 full-blown language, but I want you to 3456 02:13:39,199 --> 02:13:42,880 have the 3457 02:13:40,079 --> 02:13:44,480 » The comments and the feedback somehow so 3458 02:13:42,880 --> 02:13:46,239 you can provide direction about whether 3459 02:13:44,480 --> 02:13:47,360 we should go down a certain path or make 3460 02:13:46,239 --> 02:13:50,400 changes. I think I think a certain 3461 02:13:47,360 --> 02:13:53,040 amount of that is you between you and 3462 02:13:50,400 --> 02:13:54,480 and Ted and Maria need to call the balls 3463 02:13:53,040 --> 02:13:56,560 and strikes on what are you going to 3464 02:13:54,480 --> 02:13:59,040 present to council of those re of those 3465 02:13:56,560 --> 02:14:01,679 suggestions because because like some of 3466 02:13:59,040 --> 02:14:04,079 my suggestions are just little editorial 3467 02:14:01,679 --> 02:14:04,800 stuff. It's not does I don't have to 3468 02:14:04,079 --> 02:14:07,199 update all 3469 02:14:04,800 --> 02:14:10,000 » I expect everybody to to even discuss 3470 02:14:07,199 --> 02:14:12,000 that stuff. It's like okay so what you 3471 02:14:10,000 --> 02:14:13,599 and I don't want you coming back to the 3472 02:14:12,000 --> 02:14:17,360 council and say well should we change 3473 02:14:13,599 --> 02:14:19,440 this from the to a 3474 02:14:17,360 --> 02:14:21,199 » Sense this discussion helps Paul and I 3475 02:14:19,440 --> 02:14:22,560 call those balls and strikes is really 3476 02:14:21,199 --> 02:14:24,480 difficult when we don't have this 3477 02:14:22,560 --> 02:14:26,480 discussion and then absolutely 3478 02:14:24,480 --> 02:14:28,560 » So so I appreciate the short discussion 3479 02:14:26,480 --> 02:14:30,880 on this particular topic and I'm I think 3480 02:14:28,560 --> 02:14:32,560 I I know what the council wants. 3481 02:14:30,880 --> 02:14:34,320 » Thank you. 3482 02:14:32,560 --> 02:14:38,159 » Okay. 3483 02:14:34,320 --> 02:14:40,960 Okay. Any other final statements on this 3484 02:14:38,159 --> 02:14:41,520 short-term rental thing or we ready to 3485 02:14:40,960 --> 02:14:45,159 move on? 3486 02:14:41,520 --> 02:14:45,159 » It wasn't so short. 3487 02:14:45,520 --> 02:14:49,520 » Sorry, dad joke. 3488 02:14:46,719 --> 02:14:50,000 » It was almost a exactly an hour. 3489 02:14:49,520 --> 02:14:51,280 » Yep. 3490 02:14:50,000 --> 02:14:51,760 » Check that. 3491 02:14:51,280 --> 02:14:54,239 » Check that out. 3492 02:14:51,760 --> 02:14:56,480 » What I said. 3493 02:14:54,239 --> 02:14:57,199 Okay. If there are none, we can move to 3494 02:14:56,480 --> 02:14:58,159 adjournment. 3495 02:14:57,199 --> 02:14:59,040 » Mr. Mayor, 3496 02:14:58,159 --> 02:15:01,199 » Mr. Dean, 3497 02:14:59,040 --> 02:15:02,000 » I move we adjourn. 3498 02:15:01,199 --> 02:15:04,320 » Second. 3499 02:15:02,000 --> 02:15:05,920 » Sec. Motion by Mr. Dean, a second by Mr. 3500 02:15:04,320 --> 02:15:06,719 David. All in favor say I. 3501 02:15:05,920 --> 02:15:08,639 » I. 3502 02:15:06,719 --> 02:15:10,719 » Any opposed? 3503 02:15:08,639 --> 02:15:13,920 That motion carries 5 to zero. We are 3504 02:15:10,719 --> 02:15:15,920 adjourned. See everybody in two weeks. 3505 02:15:13,920 --> 02:15:20,920 » September 1st. 3506 02:15:15,920 --> 02:15:20,920 » I also didn't go everyone. I was really