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So good. The date is February 4th. The hour is 6 p.m. City clerk, may we have a roll call, please.

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Council Member Eisenberg. Present. Council Member Cooper. Present. Council Member Gift. Present. Vice Mayor Lopez Ortega. Present. Mayor Williams. Present. Please join us in the pledge of allegiance.

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Since our last meeting, in fact, we met yesterday on a closed session regarding a personnel

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issue with City Manager, and from that meeting, there's no reportable action.

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Next item on the agenda is oral communication on consent or non-agenda items.

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At this time, the council welcomes comments from the public regarding matters on the consent

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calendar or of municipal concern not on the agenda.

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The speaking time allowed is three minutes, please note the city clerk's time clock to your

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left. According to the Brown Act, the Council does not permit it to discuss issues or answer

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questions at this time. In other words, the public may speak, but the Council cannot. Council

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members, however, are free to discuss issues with the public apart from the Council meetings.

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Would anybody like to address the Council on a consent item or a non-agenda item?

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This is non-agenda item.

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Good evening, council.

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I've asked before I'd like you always to consider a path to home ownership when thinking

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about housing for the residents here in town.

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And what brings that to mind very strongly to me is when I understand that there are hotel

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I tell rooms here for rent for $2,000 plus dollars, and we are building affordable housing essentially for poor people.

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And what we're doing in that way is we're subsidizing corporate profits that leave this town.

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I understand that all of these businesses pay fees and they pay taxes to town.

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But I'd like to know that when the council is making housing decisions, building housing for residents here in town,

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that you're thinking about a path to home ownership always and not simply rentals or affordable housing or low income housing.

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I don't like the idea of keeping people poor so that corporations can profit and take their profits out of the community.

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So thank you.

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Thank you.

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Carrier, 1720, Renard Lane.

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This is in regards to, I'm not sure that the public is aware that this city subsidizes

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$550,000 to the Chamber, which is taxpayer money.

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And I've asked before if there was, there's been an audit on how that money's being spent

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and I've never been answered that answer.

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But one thing that really I've talked to a couple other business owners.

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I've owned my own business for 38 years.

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Christmas, the tractor parade is one of the biggest events in this town.

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The chamber did not even have Christmas lights in their window.

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For $550,000, they didn't walk around and ask everybody to maybe put two strings

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by two boxes of lights for every business.

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I mean, I drove around town for the four days before the tractor parade.

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This place should look like a hallmark movie.

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If we're going to have 6 to 10,000 people in town, then that's how it should look.

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But it doesn't look.

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It doesn't look like that.

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There's no Christmas decorations hanging from the poles.

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I mean, when I was a kid, this town was decorated.

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We didn't have a tractor parade.

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I just find it, I just find that nobody's keeping shop.

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And I've said it to many people.

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I think it's time that you think about the citizens who are also here, not just all the people coming.

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I mean, we drive through town every night before the tractor parade.

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I drove up and down Lincoln Avenue.

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There was only seven businesses at a 22 on one side that even had lights and Christmas lights on.

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I mean, I just, I'm just baffled.

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I'm baffled why nothing else gets done.

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And I hope this council will hopefully talk to the CEO of the Chamber and say listen, people are asking questions.

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I'll go talk to them myself, but when you don't find a door open and you don't find any lights on, nobody's really home.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Good evening.

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Tim Wilkes, 1517 Cedar Street.

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This is regarding the consent calendar item 5.6.

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Whatever Calistokans thought we were getting with the fairgrounds acquisition, I think it's fair to say that reinstating Sprint car racing was not what we were envisioning.

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Charging ahead with this agreement has left a bitter aftertaste in a significant number of those Calistokans who supported the acquisition of the fairgrounds.

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On that, I would just ask and I know I'm whistling in the wind that you pull this item from the consent and reconsider it.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Good evening, Mayor.

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Council members and staff.

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I'm Jenny Okone with the executive director of the Up Valley Family Sunners.

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I think most of you are familiar with our nonprofit here in town.

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We serve the entire Up Valley region providing an array of social services to the community.

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I am here because we just in collaboration with organizations, countywide launched a website called Napa Valley together.

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It has a lot of resources for our community members in particular, our immigrant community members.

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And I am here on behalf of our staff and the people that we serve to request that the city of Calistoga issue a public statement that expresses support, protection,

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an inclusion of historically marginalized communities who are feeling increasingly under attack

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and worried for their safety in our current environment.

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Your leadership matters, a statement similar to the one adopted by the Napa County Board

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of Supervisors can help residents in our community to feel safer, to attend school, or work, to seek

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medical care, to attend faith services, and to engage in civic daily life with their neighbors,

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members, friends, and families.

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Public statement will also help to shore up trust between vulnerable community members and

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city offices and departments.

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At Valley Family Centers, we have an immigration program that is working diligently to provide

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education and resources to community members through workshops and individual consultations.

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In these sessions, sharing a statement from the City of Calistoga will let community members

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know that the city values them.

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In addition, just an announcement that we will be holding a know your right session here in this room tomorrow evening.

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I'm going to leave flyers out on the back table for anyone who wishes to attend.

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Thank you.

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Would anybody else in the chamber tonight like to address the council or city clerk?

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Is there anyone online?

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As you can tell, our Zoom is having technical difficulties.

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Okay.

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There's a hand raised, but I believe it's due to the video not working.

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Okay. Okay. Let's double check. Yeah.

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So let's see where Michelle. Can you hear us? Yes. I can hear you. Can you hear me? Yes. Okay. Great. Thanks so much. My name is Michelle groupie. I'm the director of the community leaders coalition.

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The community leaders coalition was founded following the 2016 election as a grassroots

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initiative to address growing concerns within Napa County, particularly regarding our

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BIPOC LGBTQ plus and immigrant populations.

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Our collaborative is a space for community leaders to engage in advocacy and collective problem-solving.

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Our vision today remains the same as when we first came together, fostering a community

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that is inclusive, equitable, and vibrant, prioritizing trust, safety, health, education,

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and empowerment as shared responsibilities. We have successfully worked across the valley

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on projects under voter engagement in education, the 2020 census outreach in education,

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testing vaccine outreach in education, and language access advocacy. Based on our experience during

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President Trump's first administration.

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We have the drive knowledge and commitment from our members to respond with proven strategies

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to support our community with accurate information from trusted messengers.

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We've been working in partnership with the Up Valley Family Centers as one of our members

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and working with them and the other partners on the Napa Valley together website that Jenny

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And we have been requesting of our local municipalities and our local leaders to issue a statement of support for our immigrant population.

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So I'm here tonight representing the countywide community leaders coalition and supporting the Valley Family Centers request for a statement of support for the community.

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Thank you.

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Thank you for addressing us on that topic.

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Yes.

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City clerk, is there anyone else online perhaps?

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No more online.

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Okay.

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I want to welcome, by the way, those who are watching us on the screen as well, we're

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glad you're with us.

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How about here in the chamber tonight?

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But anybody else would like to address the council on a consent calendar item or an item

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of municipal concern that's not on the agenda?

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Okay.

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There's close public comment in that case and we'll proceed to the report from our city

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manager.

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Thank you, Mayor.

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So thank you, welcome and thank you to all of you who are here in this room who have made it through the torrential rains.

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It has been quite busy, including this afternoon doing a lot of flood monitoring, but we seem to be with the rain stopping, okay, locally, hyper-locally.

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I get to do one of my favorite things tonight. I get to welcome a new staff member.

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So, tonight I have the pleasure of welcoming the newest staff member to the Calistoga Police

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Department.

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It's Officer Maria Gutierrez.

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Today is only her second day in the job, but since she was raised here in Calistoga, that

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will certainly help shorten her learning curve.

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She earned her bachelor's degree in criminal justice from the University of Las Vegas, and

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is joining us after having already had some direct experience while working for the Nevada

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Police Department.

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Officer Gutierrez is passionate about community involvement, especially eager to make a meaningful

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impact here in Calistoga. Outside of work, she enjoys spending time with her family, gardening,

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and hiking. She's married with three children and values family life deeply. Again, please join

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us in welcoming Officer Gutierrez. Welcome.

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The mic is already on. Thank you for having me here.

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I am very honored to serve my community. I was born here in St. Helena and raised here in

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Cal Stoga. This has always been my dream to work in my community that I grew up. I remember

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Mr. Eisenberg, you are my principal at the moment you're school. I am very honored and

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very thankful for this opportunity and to be serving my community. Thank you.

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Officer, welcome.

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So

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in addition I'd also like to welcome back our fire personnel who came home safely after 16 days from Southern California helping fight two different fires there.

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So that was also good news they were able to come back late last week.

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I would also I this is a little bit repetitive at this point, but I wanted to be sure to encourage our community members to work with a Valley Family Centers.

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As they have helped form this new coalition of non-profits responding to the concerns

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that so many have about immigration and the new presidential administration.

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And as was already mentioned, there's a series of informational and training opportunities

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and one of them is here tomorrow night in this room.

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I would also like to invite everybody to a grand opening, to a ribbon cutting.

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We're going to be celebrating the new playground at Lovie Park on Wednesday.

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this is quite a ways away still, but Wednesday March the 12th at 3pm.

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So bring the family, explore the new play area, try out the botchy courts, and have some

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light refreshments as we cut the ribbon for the new additions to the park, and we're

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especially grateful to the Adelante group for their support in making this project a reality.

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As an additional update, I have some good news about what is called a pilot project or a

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soft opening for the RV park.

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PG&E has reached out to us that they have some of their workers in the wildfire safety program

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who would like to stay at the RV park under the rules that we already have established.

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And we will be allowing them to stay there with payments.

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And what not, and what is going to provide for us is to be able to test the repairs that we have made, make sure that the water systems are working and electrical systems are working and that kind of thing. While we continue to work on some issues around having a host, at which point we can then open it fully to the public. So at the moment you will see some RVs there, their contractors working for PG&E. And lastly, we have had the impact of the rain may require us to

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move our agenda around a little bit, but we will have an update on that as we get closer to the public hearing items.

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Okay. Thank you.

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Thank you, seated manager.

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Council members, any questions of our city manager?

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All righty, very good.

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Let's see, we have a presentation tonight.

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Let's see, presentation regarding the Calisoga Library and the presenters are Stephanie Allen and Jacqueline Flores.

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As welcome

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ladies to Calistoga and we look forward to your presentation.

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Thank you.

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Actually Stephanie wasn't able to make it into the rain.

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So I have Adriana here joining me from the library as well.

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I'm Jacqueline Flores.

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Adriana Ramos.

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Okay, welcome.

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Thank you.

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So we just want to touch on a couple of things to kind of give you an overview of

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how we've been doing as a library.

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One highlight, we did add a new role, which actually my co-partner here now fills as a Spanish librarian.

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So she gets to focus a little bit more on outreach in the community.

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And as a reminder, our branch, all of our staff are bilingual.

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It is a requirement to work in our branch, as we're all bilingual.

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over the summer, one of our biggest programs, over the summer, one of our biggest programs

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we have is summer reading. This year we were very excited to partner with the elementary

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school, so we had over 200 attendees come to our story times, our crafts, we did class

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visits, we had performers, and we had an end of the year summer party, so we were really

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excited to have the school join us with that and the community.

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And then just a touch on like other services that our library provides.

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Hot spots, Chromebooks, which hotspots in particular I want to highlight

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for the reason that we do have to, you know, base power outages quite frequently.

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So those are really critical and actually quite recently.

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We had additional hotspots added, so the wait times have been much shorter now.

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In terms of like other things that we provide in addition to books, also guitars, coloring

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books, baking kits, so much more than just books.

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And the last time we presented here to the council was during the pandemic.

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Thanks to the pandemic, a lot of people are now using online services.

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I wanted to highlight a couple of the services that we have.

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Libby and Hoopla are things that you can read and listen to audiobooks or e-books.

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BrainFuse is homework help. We have live tutors every day for free.

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So for students, anyone needing help with homework or even adults, anybody that's taking a class can use brainFuse.

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We also have the job now which is help to find jobs, resumes, cover letters.

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We offer California State Parks Pass, which means you can rent this park pass for free and go to any California State Park entrance day for free.

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I also want to highlight that anything you do at the library is always free. Anything you get from the library is free.

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I just want everyone to be aware of that and please spread the word.

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And another really important part this year, probably our favorite was the 100th year celebration.

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October 19th of 2024. We had over 200 people in attendance and had the opportunity to have a taco truck, a taco felice,

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and also had visits from Mike Thompson and Control,

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got to partner with the Friends of the Library here locally

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and as well as the Sharp Scene Museum

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and the Calistoga Art Center.

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Here's some pictures.

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Maybe you recognize some of these faces.

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These are some of the staff members

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that you'll see inside the library.

221
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And we just wanted to make one more thing

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that the friends of the library are always looking for volunteers.

223
00:19:59,350 --> 00:20:04,010
If you're not familiar with the friends, they are a volunteering group that helps support

224
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the library.

225
00:20:05,290 --> 00:20:09,290
So if you're ever interested in volunteering, it can mean just coming in for an hour

226
00:20:09,290 --> 00:20:14,430
to sort books, it could mean helping with the program, anything if you're interested, come

227
00:20:14,430 --> 00:20:16,170
to the library or add them on Facebook.

228
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Thank you.

229
00:20:18,450 --> 00:20:18,570
Thank you.

230
00:20:18,890 --> 00:20:19,230
Thank you.

231
00:20:19,470 --> 00:20:20,510
Thank you for the presentation.

232
00:20:23,510 --> 00:20:26,890
We have just a couple of questions before you go away.

233
00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:38,600
I just wanted to check, do many students take advantage of the opportunity to take advantage

234
00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:40,480
of the help that's available for them?

235
00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:45,140
Unfortunately, not that I see, and that's why we really wanted to highlight that, to let

236
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people be aware of it, and I feel like telling parents is the best thing, because a student

237
00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:54,540
won't tell their parent, but the parent will tell the student, so I really hope that people

238
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We'll take advantage of what we have to offer.

239
00:20:57,040 --> 00:21:01,840
Great, and could you remind us again, and I'm embarrassed I have to ask, but what are the hours of the library?

240
00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:03,000
Oh, no problem.

241
00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:08,540
The library's open Monday through Saturday, 10 to 6, Wednesdays 11 or 12 to 8.

242
00:21:08,740 --> 00:21:09,400
Yes, 12 to 8.

243
00:21:09,660 --> 00:21:09,800
Yes.

244
00:21:10,180 --> 00:21:11,880
And so into the evening on Wednesdays?

245
00:21:11,940 --> 00:21:12,100
Yes.

246
00:21:12,740 --> 00:21:13,360
Council members?

247
00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:13,860
Yes.

248
00:21:14,620 --> 00:21:16,640
Not really a question, just a comment.

249
00:21:17,380 --> 00:21:19,300
Libby and I are close friends.

250
00:21:19,300 --> 00:21:27,340
I always have a book on my iPad from the library on Libby and it's just a great

251
00:21:27,340 --> 00:21:32,620
way to have my book with me and I don't even need to go out in the rain to get

252
00:21:32,620 --> 00:21:38,440
it. Yes, that's very true. Thank you for having the online digital books. Thank

253
00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:44,420
you. Regarding the classes, the guitar classes that you offer are there group

254
00:21:44,420 --> 00:21:53,020
classes or individuals saying how that was you need to make an appointment or no their group but

255
00:21:53,020 --> 00:21:58,800
technically they're individual because no one shows up so for the first Saturday of the month

256
00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:06,780
it's for children at 10 a.m. and the third Saturday of the month is is adults and teens okay all right

257
00:22:06,780 --> 00:22:12,220
thank you I just had a question or idea the mothers and sisters the monastery do a lot of tutoring

258
00:22:12,220 --> 00:22:15,060
for the kids. So how do you thought about collaborating with them to some

259
00:22:15,060 --> 00:22:18,700
degrees? An idea? No, we have not. They recently have started to attend our

260
00:22:18,700 --> 00:22:22,900
programming. So that is going to be a great partnership. Hopefully, thank you for

261
00:22:22,900 --> 00:22:27,300
the suggestion. Yeah, because we are always looking for tutors. We currently only

262
00:22:27,300 --> 00:22:32,420
have one. Well, good. Well, thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I just want to thank you

263
00:22:32,420 --> 00:22:36,680
lady so much. I mean, you know how often Finn and I are in there. Like it's our

264
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:41,160
second home. And we are so lucky in our community to have such a robust library

265
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:46,520
with so many offerings I mean everything from like we're saying games or like pickle ball like

266
00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:52,760
that's a thing now apparently yeah it was it's awesome and in better news I found my two missing books

267
00:22:54,220 --> 00:23:00,520
we did get away from collection finds so now only if you really lose the item you have to pay if

268
00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:07,040
you don't lose it you don't have to pay anything thank you like you never lose an online book

269
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:29,200
Great. Thank you. Yes, thank you to the to the fun party for the celebration. I also went to the cooking class the other night, and that was really fun. Yeah, I hope there's more cooking classes. Yeah, that's the impossible. Yeah. Oh, thank you. Yes, while I was returning my my past to both A.

270
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:41,140
Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for your presentation. I think Miss Allen also she represents Kalasoga on the library.

271
00:23:41,140 --> 00:23:43,340
Board, so her service is appreciated.

272
00:23:43,660 --> 00:23:44,500
I will thank you.

273
00:23:44,700 --> 00:23:45,200
Thank you.

274
00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:52,480
The next item before us is the items on the consent calendar, and I'll entertain a motion

275
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:55,120
to adopt unless anybody wants to pull any of those items.

276
00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:56,320
Yes, Council Member Giff.

277
00:23:56,480 --> 00:24:00,220
Yes, can I please pull item 5.4 and 5.6?

278
00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:04,260
5.4 and 5.6, certainly,

279
00:24:06,850 --> 00:24:12,450
then is there a motion to approve the remaining items with the exception

280
00:24:12,450 --> 00:24:13,710
motion to 5, 4, and 5, 6.

281
00:24:14,430 --> 00:24:15,170
So moved.

282
00:24:15,470 --> 00:24:15,930
Second.

283
00:24:16,450 --> 00:24:17,810
Motion and second.

284
00:24:18,210 --> 00:24:18,770
All in favor?

285
00:24:19,190 --> 00:24:19,410
Aye.

286
00:24:20,470 --> 00:24:21,150
Opposed?

287
00:24:21,670 --> 00:24:22,570
It passes.

288
00:24:23,070 --> 00:24:26,190
Let's go to 5.4.

289
00:24:28,090 --> 00:24:30,710
And this is, let's see, just to,

290
00:24:32,090 --> 00:24:36,270
this is a consultant services agreement amendment.

291
00:24:38,190 --> 00:24:43,650
And a paying director, Desmond, could you summarize this for us?

292
00:24:44,650 --> 00:24:46,350
Of course, good evening, Council.

293
00:24:47,610 --> 00:24:54,210
This item is related to the Yellow Rose projects more specifically to the Sequa Analysis of

294
00:24:54,210 --> 00:24:55,070
that project.

295
00:24:56,460 --> 00:25:04,350
The ask is an amendment to the existing contract for the sum of $60,000 roughly.

296
00:25:04,350 --> 00:25:12,930
And again, it's for the Secret Environmental Review of the Yellow Rose Project.

297
00:25:14,770 --> 00:25:21,150
The actual request is based on the amount of time it's taken to process this application.

298
00:25:22,270 --> 00:25:25,890
And that is primarily been driven by the applicant themselves.

299
00:25:28,390 --> 00:25:33,070
So I'm not sure what the questions you may have, but I'm happy to answer specific questions.

300
00:25:33,070 --> 00:25:36,930
Thank you guys, and thank you for letting me pull this item.

301
00:25:37,210 --> 00:25:39,770
I just am curious, so this is back.

302
00:25:39,930 --> 00:25:43,130
So this project kind of was stalled for a little while, and now is back.

303
00:25:43,570 --> 00:25:50,370
And just to clarify, this is the project that is at Yellow Rose, the 46-acre parcel.

304
00:25:50,970 --> 00:25:56,430
And the proposal is for 46 single-family homes on these lots.

305
00:25:57,030 --> 00:26:01,130
My other question is, it looks like it's 20,000 square foot lots.

306
00:26:01,130 --> 00:26:06,170
but my understanding of rural residential zoning was that it was one house per acre.

307
00:26:06,430 --> 00:26:09,910
Is that not how zoning is in a rural residential in our community?

308
00:26:10,230 --> 00:26:15,630
Well, I'm not prepared to analyze or go over the projects for specifics because that's not the item.

309
00:26:18,390 --> 00:26:24,570
The only question I guess would be then this is coming back to us after having the project

310
00:26:24,570 --> 00:26:27,370
to have installed and just continuing that CEQA process then.

311
00:26:27,550 --> 00:26:27,990
That's correct.

312
00:26:28,450 --> 00:26:36,130
It's come back and you guys will be seeing basically this will wrap up the CEQA document.

313
00:26:36,370 --> 00:26:41,730
Then we can have hearings with the planning commission and I'll eventually come back to you guys.

314
00:26:42,290 --> 00:26:42,870
That's all.

315
00:26:43,430 --> 00:26:44,230
Thank you very much.

316
00:26:44,490 --> 00:26:45,010
Thank you.

317
00:26:45,570 --> 00:26:48,630
Is there any other council member comment or question on this item?

318
00:26:50,210 --> 00:26:50,310
Yes.

319
00:26:50,310 --> 00:27:01,710
Yes, just regarding the fees for this report, the developer will be responsible for.

320
00:27:02,570 --> 00:27:03,150
That's correct.

321
00:27:03,390 --> 00:27:09,390
The entirety of the environmental document fees will be paid by the developer.

322
00:27:09,950 --> 00:27:10,210
Okay.

323
00:27:11,090 --> 00:27:11,410
All right.

324
00:27:11,770 --> 00:27:12,230
Thank you.

325
00:27:13,670 --> 00:27:16,130
Can you give to move that we adopt this one?

326
00:27:16,430 --> 00:27:17,430
Yes, I move that we adopt.

327
00:27:17,790 --> 00:27:18,430
And a second.

328
00:27:18,790 --> 00:27:19,390
I second.

329
00:27:19,390 --> 00:27:19,990
Thank you.

330
00:27:20,190 --> 00:27:20,950
All in favor?

331
00:27:21,610 --> 00:27:21,770
Aye.

332
00:27:22,330 --> 00:27:22,850
Opposed?

333
00:27:23,310 --> 00:27:24,050
It passes.

334
00:27:24,470 --> 00:27:26,510
Let's go to 5.6.

335
00:27:31,180 --> 00:27:39,720
The subject of this one is a license agreement with Hunter Motorsports Concepts LLC for non-exclusive

336
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:40,680
sprint car racing.

337
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:43,280
And let's see.

338
00:27:43,460 --> 00:27:46,620
We have a fairground revitalization director or shall you write?

339
00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:47,000
Welcome.

340
00:27:47,620 --> 00:27:48,200
Thank you, Mayor.

341
00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:49,240
Council members.

342
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:58,520
Back on November 19th, 2024, you asked me to negotiate a sprint car contract with Hunt Motorsports.

343
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:05,540
I believe you will find that the proposed contract is more than fair for the City of Calistoga.

344
00:28:06,100 --> 00:28:12,140
In this contract, please note that the City of Calistoga retains all alcohol rights for

345
00:28:12,140 --> 00:28:18,140
the duration of the contract during race days and all RV overnight stays.

346
00:28:18,140 --> 00:28:24,860
Hunt Motorsports retains food concession rights, parking, and ticket sales.

347
00:28:25,220 --> 00:28:31,100
And they are entitled to a Friday night pre-race event in the Tubs building.

348
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:37,040
Most importantly, Hunt Motorsports must provide for the repair and

349
00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:40,940
sign off of the grandstands before racing use.

350
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,780
I ask that you authorize execution of this contract.

351
00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:46,540
Thank you.

352
00:28:47,020 --> 00:28:47,820
Council member gift.

353
00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:53,760
Yes, so I just had two kind of specific questions about this item while under contract

354
00:28:54,180 --> 00:28:58,780
is this portion of the Fairgrounds property available for other uses while races are

355
00:28:58,780 --> 00:29:00,600
not taking place or is it an exclusive?

356
00:29:01,260 --> 00:29:02,420
Yes, yes it is.

357
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:05,240
The grounds will be available for other use.

358
00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:11,540
There's a provision in the contract to get a schedule, an agreeable schedule with Mr.

359
00:29:11,540 --> 00:29:16,100
Hunter Hunt and we will be able to move forward after that schedule.

360
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:17,000
Okay, great.

361
00:29:17,260 --> 00:29:24,600
And my next question is the potential revenue that you're projecting here.

362
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:29,900
Is that including any sort of inflation as the last historical data we have is from 2019?

363
00:29:31,340 --> 00:29:32,240
Yes, it is.

364
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:40,340
Actually the alcohol sales I brought over from an estimate of attendance from the other

365
00:29:40,340 --> 00:29:46,100
place that I worked. Great, thank you. And I don't maybe, I can't ask this question because it's

366
00:29:46,100 --> 00:29:53,120
not in here, but do we have any suggested ideas about how we will handle the alcohol sales?

367
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:59,960
Absolutely. My suggestion would be to hire a professional alcohol company that comes with the

368
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:29,280
For trailers, they actually have scan machines for IDs, so it makes for quick sales. They have a purchase of service system in place so that you automatically get nightly reports on the total amount of sales for that evening and are easily able to calculate your percentage with regard to that. Again, like the license agreement with Hunt Motorsports, it would be a negotiated contract.

369
00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:39,260
But I am aware of multiple professional companies that I used in previous fairgrounds that would be appropriate for that.

370
00:30:39,620 --> 00:30:40,520
Great, thank you so much, Shelley.

371
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:46,480
I also wanted to address Mr. Wilkes's concerns and comments about the timing and this.

372
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:52,120
I think this is a perfect example why it's really important to confirm the committee and the survey today.

373
00:30:52,120 --> 00:31:02,880
There is certainly a group of concerned citizens who voice their opinion against it, and then there's also a group of I think a larger group of folks who in support of it

374
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:09,740
I personally support it and I support the benefits it's going to bring to the city for the rest grounds for the businesses for the RV part for many many reasons

375
00:31:09,740 --> 00:31:15,440
I think that overcomes the concern about noise once or twice or three times a year, but again

376
00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:21,600
I think it's important that we focus on this committee and on this survey so we can really get to the bottom

377
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:25,140
I'm statistically of how many people in town really do care about this.

378
00:31:25,780 --> 00:31:27,900
So just comments and appreciation for Mr. Wilkes.

379
00:31:28,180 --> 00:31:30,100
Thank you, Mr. Councilmember Cooper.

380
00:31:30,340 --> 00:31:31,060
Councilmember Rosenberg.

381
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,080
So in reference to the alcohol sales.

382
00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:45,480
In the past, there have been times when we've had service organizations volunteer to do alcohol sales.

383
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:53,320
they made a portion of the beer sales and to support the good works of those organizations.

384
00:31:54,260 --> 00:31:59,540
And I understand your reasons for wanting a professional and it certainly seems easier

385
00:31:59,930 --> 00:32:06,740
and more foolproof, but our service organizations do an amazing amount of good and I was wondering

386
00:32:06,740 --> 00:32:09,240
if you had thought about that as another option.

387
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:14,400
I actually have thought about that Council Member Eisenberg.

388
00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:21,860
What I found at the last fairground that I worked at is that when I switched from I actually

389
00:32:21,860 --> 00:32:29,480
put a proposal that went out to bid for alcohol sales and when we switched from a local service

390
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:36,840
organization to a professional company who brought in all of the instruments needed for

391
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:47,420
the alcohols, our sales were up 35%, and we had less issues with regard to ABC issues

392
00:32:47,420 --> 00:32:50,660
on the grounds, so law enforcement issues

393
00:32:54,340 --> 00:32:57,920
because it's a professional company so they don't

394
00:32:57,920 --> 00:32:59,640
know any of the people that they're serving.

395
00:33:01,490 --> 00:33:04,110
I have a question on the grandstands.

396
00:33:04,130 --> 00:33:11,710
Are there criteria established, which have to be satisfied in order to, or what are the

397
00:33:11,710 --> 00:33:13,210
criteria, how are they established?

398
00:33:13,550 --> 00:33:19,150
Who decides who determines when the grandstands are structurally sound and safe?

399
00:33:19,810 --> 00:33:24,990
And does the improvements extend to cosmetic changes?

400
00:33:25,590 --> 00:33:28,110
Or are they primarily structural?

401
00:33:28,610 --> 00:33:33,050
So they are structural components that both grandstands need.

402
00:33:33,410 --> 00:33:38,810
And a structural engineer will need to be able to write a letter to the city,

403
00:33:38,810 --> 00:33:46,390
We will then review that will let us know that the grandstands repairs have been fixed.

404
00:33:46,690 --> 00:33:53,850
I can tell you that Mr. Hunt has been in contact with ZFA structural engineers,

405
00:33:54,470 --> 00:33:59,730
the ones that wrote the report that were attached to the original staff report

406
00:33:59,950 --> 00:34:04,130
with regard to the racing at the fairgrounds.

407
00:34:04,130 --> 00:34:14,550
And I believe that there has been conversations towards how and what to do with regard to fixing those grandstands.

408
00:34:15,070 --> 00:34:21,650
Thank you and we're talking about both the fixed grandstands and the auxiliary stands.

409
00:34:23,610 --> 00:34:29,310
Correct, both sets of stands needed different components repaired.

410
00:34:29,310 --> 00:34:56,650
Thank you. Other council members, questions? Yes. One thing is safety of the community or the people who will attend and you talk about that. That was one of my concerns before anything happened there before any races down. We had to be 100% sure that we don't want to have any safety issues.

411
00:34:56,650 --> 00:35:07,510
And the other one is to, I agree with, to conduct a study for pollution during the

412
00:35:07,510 --> 00:35:15,750
race so that way we can have an accurate information for the purpose of the decided of

413
00:35:15,750 --> 00:35:16,630
the Green Committee.

414
00:35:17,310 --> 00:35:21,310
So we don't have any information regarding that.

415
00:35:21,310 --> 00:35:26,350
So I think it's important to have the information available.

416
00:35:26,970 --> 00:35:29,550
So for the peace on mind of everybody.

417
00:35:30,870 --> 00:35:31,230
Sure.

418
00:35:31,390 --> 00:35:37,290
Can I go ahead and talk a little bit about the comment with regard to racing and pollution?

419
00:35:37,910 --> 00:35:38,110
Sure.

420
00:35:38,610 --> 00:35:38,830
Okay.

421
00:35:38,950 --> 00:35:39,110
Please.

422
00:35:39,550 --> 00:35:45,250
So you may not be aware, but race cars are exempt from the Clean Air Act.

423
00:35:46,030 --> 00:35:54,990
Sprint cars in particular use methanol, not gas or diesel, and that fuel source can be

424
00:35:54,990 --> 00:35:59,850
made from a various of products cornwood among other things.

425
00:36:00,270 --> 00:36:06,410
It's considered a cleaner fuel than gas or diesel, and it's actually blended with gas

426
00:36:06,410 --> 00:36:07,750
to reduce emissions.

427
00:36:08,770 --> 00:36:14,670
It should be noted that there have been movements in the race car industry, most notably with

428
00:36:14,670 --> 00:36:21,630
NASCAR, working towards greener racing, but you got to remember that NASCAR does 500 plus

429
00:36:21,630 --> 00:36:28,170
laps on a track. That doesn't happen here with sprint cars. This is not very often. We're

430
00:36:28,170 --> 00:36:35,370
talking about four race weekends a year in this particular contract. And most of the work

431
00:36:36,430 --> 00:36:44,130
towards net zero operating emissions that NASCAR and other racing communities are working towards

432
00:36:44,130 --> 00:36:50,830
is working towards the carbon measurement of the things they can control,

433
00:36:51,050 --> 00:36:58,930
like the vehicles going to the track, like solar with regard to infrastructure uses at large race tracks.

434
00:36:59,810 --> 00:37:04,990
EV charging sites at the facilities that have these tracks,

435
00:37:05,230 --> 00:37:08,270
expanded recycling measures, those kind of things.

436
00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:12,060
Thank you. Good questions.

437
00:37:13,140 --> 00:37:20,240
This is public comment and would anybody here in the chambers like to comment on this item before we take a vote?

438
00:37:27,700 --> 00:37:29,000
Yes, sir, and welcome.

439
00:37:29,820 --> 00:37:30,420
I don't.

440
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:31,460
Ken Flynn, Callestoga.

441
00:37:33,260 --> 00:37:37,080
I just want to highly urge the council to approve this.

442
00:37:37,660 --> 00:37:39,260
I'm very surprised when we got it.

443
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:43,980
Two years with erasing with the amount of financial outlay that he has to do to get the stand fixed.

444
00:37:43,980 --> 00:38:06,960
But one thing I did want to address is after the last meeting, the marathon meeting we had over there, about this issue, there seemed to be a lot of confusion with the public as far as if we have races, then will that be in one of the councilmember over here addressed it earlier, would that make it exclusively for racing?

445
00:38:07,540 --> 00:38:14,160
absolutely not, the facility is going to be used for everything, but the point being

446
00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:21,080
is that with what the racing community has to put into this to make it usable, it will

447
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:22,640
make it usable for everybody.

448
00:38:23,140 --> 00:38:29,400
So the rodeos, whatever other events you want to have there, now those grandstands will

449
00:38:29,400 --> 00:38:31,560
be up to spec and be able to be used.

450
00:38:33,060 --> 00:38:36,540
I just wanted to point that out because it seemed to be a lot of confusion with the questions

451
00:38:36,540 --> 00:38:44,460
some of the letters to the newspaper and other things like that that I've read seem like people just thought that if there's going to be a racing here, we're not going to have anything else.

452
00:38:45,020 --> 00:38:48,440
The racing is going to enable or help enable everything else.

453
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:50,880
So I just want to make sure that kind of got addressed.

454
00:38:52,240 --> 00:38:56,800
And I think you address the spring cards line on the math and all super clean fuel.

455
00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:00,240
That's, you know, that's not an issue.

456
00:39:00,240 --> 00:39:04,640
But anyway, just I urge you to vote yes on this and hopefully this will

457
00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:07,080
Make the fairgrounds go and

458
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:10,560
Help everything go and we'll have this for many years to come

459
00:39:11,020 --> 00:39:11,920
Thank you, Mr. Flynn

460
00:39:19,790 --> 00:39:21,470
Tim Moore Maggie Avenue

461
00:39:22,550 --> 00:39:28,250
I'd just like to say I would encourage you to approve it. I think it's a win-win for the fairgrounds

462
00:39:28,250 --> 00:39:32,930
It's a two-year contract. They're gonna get a lot of improvements a lot of use a lot of

463
00:39:33,710 --> 00:39:37,190
Publicity, I think it's just a win-win and I think it's a great deal.

464
00:39:38,130 --> 00:39:39,730
Move on before with this thing.

465
00:39:40,470 --> 00:39:40,870
Thank you.

466
00:39:44,140 --> 00:39:48,380
Is there anybody, City Clerk online, by any chance?

467
00:39:49,220 --> 00:39:49,720
No, no, no, no.

468
00:39:49,980 --> 00:39:50,320
Okay.

469
00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:55,500
Kerry Abreaux, 1720, Renard Lane.

470
00:39:56,620 --> 00:40:05,040
I would just like to also emphasize that many years ago under passes,

471
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:12,920
Council, and even the CEO of the Chamber years ago was very opposed to racing.

472
00:40:13,900 --> 00:40:20,640
And there were many facts laid out during that time that Bill Shaw, who owns CalMart,

473
00:40:20,740 --> 00:40:25,720
will tell you the two-day races in Calistoga, which happened on Memorial Day and Labor Day,

474
00:40:26,100 --> 00:40:29,020
were his best weekends of the year.

475
00:40:29,020 --> 00:40:31,740
because the campground was full of campers.

476
00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:36,500
The Great Lawn was full of huge RVs.

477
00:40:37,020 --> 00:40:40,520
Women came down and shopped, men followed them to have lunch.

478
00:40:41,260 --> 00:40:44,200
I mean, it really, it wasn't because there's loud noise

479
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:45,980
that happens for three hours at night.

480
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:48,860
That's number one.

481
00:40:49,720 --> 00:40:54,920
Many of the hotels, which I had asked this of the chamber years ago,

482
00:40:55,260 --> 00:40:58,120
did you go around and do a survey about how many people go

483
00:40:58,120 --> 00:41:01,560
go to the races, stay in the hotels, and the answer was no.

484
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:04,520
And I said, well, there's a lot of race fans that have always stayed here.

485
00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:08,520
You know, they come here, they stay here, they like Calisoga for more reasons in racing.

486
00:41:08,780 --> 00:41:09,640
Racing's just a plus.

487
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:10,940
It's a plus.

488
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:15,240
You can get 5,000 people in the stands, they got to buy gas, they're going to buy food.

489
00:41:15,820 --> 00:41:21,100
I mean, I think we need to look at it as this is something that I was walking to the races

490
00:41:21,820 --> 00:41:26,780
back in 17, and a gentleman coming out of the Golden Haven goes, what's that noise?

491
00:41:26,780 --> 00:41:32,020
I said, oh, that's open wheel racing over at the racetrack and he goes, oh my gosh, are there tickets available?

492
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:33,800
I'll go, yeah, probably and he goes, I'm going to go.

493
00:41:34,120 --> 00:41:35,580
I mean, he just showed up and heard that.

494
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:37,520
So I think you have to give it a chance.

495
00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:43,700
I mean, I'm not saying that we shouldn't be considered of the people around that hear it.

496
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:46,240
When the wind blows, you can hear it in Knights Valley.

497
00:41:46,580 --> 00:41:48,760
When the wind blows, you can hear it at Tucker Farm Center.

498
00:41:49,300 --> 00:41:55,340
But that's just one more thing that we do here that adds some more diversity to what this community can offer.

499
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:56,180
Thank you.

500
00:41:56,180 --> 00:41:56,900
Thank you

501
00:42:01,510 --> 00:42:03,450
public comment is still open

502
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:20,080
evening. I'm Y Ferris 1820 Grand Street. I've been here for a year and a half two years now with you guys and I'm just it's really excited.

503
00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:35,620
Firstly, I want to thank you for allowing us to get to this point. We've spent all spent a lot of time out there and I've been fortunate enough to know the hunt since I was a little kid just because they are the promoters of this, you know, the Louis and I've been on the facility

504
00:42:35,620 --> 00:42:40,080
and had them pull in multiple times in the last couple of months and can see how much

505
00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:45,040
they are, you know, interested in doing this here. They could put all this time in a

506
00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:49,560
gene effort into somewhere else and they're not. They're doing it here. They're willing

507
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:54,740
to take on a lot that's going to help us improve this place dramatically just to have the race

508
00:42:54,740 --> 00:43:00,780
in Calisoga. So it's more than just an event for them and when someone's willing to back

509
00:43:00,780 --> 00:43:04,560
back our little town that much, I'm in support of it, so yes for me.

510
00:43:05,220 --> 00:43:05,780
Thank you.

511
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:16,860
The topic is the consideration of the license agreement with motor sports concepts for

512
00:43:16,860 --> 00:43:18,500
the not-exclusive spring car racing.

513
00:43:18,720 --> 00:43:20,820
Is there any other public comment on this topic?

514
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:25,220
Okay, let's close public.

515
00:43:25,720 --> 00:43:25,760
Yes.

516
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:27,220
There, we have just one more personal comment.

517
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:29,420
All right, just go to the online comment.

518
00:43:34,420 --> 00:43:35,720
Craig, do you hear us?

519
00:43:36,780 --> 00:43:37,840
I do, yeah, thank you.

520
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:42,940
So this is Craig Freeders and we're currently rebuilding it 4530 Silverado Trail.

521
00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:49,260
So we're technically not in the city of Calistoga, but I've been monitoring this item for

522
00:43:49,260 --> 00:43:54,120
quite some time and we support this for the city of Calistoga because we think there

523
00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:56,660
needs to be another family friendly event.

524
00:43:57,460 --> 00:44:04,240
I've got twins that are 14 and when we attended prior to COVID, it was a great family experience.

525
00:44:04,240 --> 00:44:09,200
and yeah, we like the wine, we like the mud baths, we like the food, we like the community,

526
00:44:09,200 --> 00:44:16,120
but it's great to have another event that families in our town as well as in the area that can

527
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:21,680
come to. So we just wanted to support that and let you guys know. Thank you very much.

528
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:34,220
Thank you, Mr. Frieders, for checking in on with us. So let's welcome. One last call here in the

529
00:44:34,220 --> 00:44:35,780
City Clerk, anybody else online?

530
00:44:36,080 --> 00:44:36,720
No, no, no.

531
00:44:36,780 --> 00:44:44,400
Okay, let's close public comment on this one, and entertain a motion regarding this item.

532
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:47,380
I would like to approve this item, I might make a motion.

533
00:44:47,500 --> 00:44:47,980
We have a motion.

534
00:44:48,240 --> 00:44:48,600
Thank you.

535
00:44:49,460 --> 00:44:50,180
A second.

536
00:44:51,540 --> 00:44:52,320
I second.

537
00:44:52,660 --> 00:44:53,000
Thank you.

538
00:44:54,140 --> 00:44:55,420
A second roll call, please.

539
00:45:02,290 --> 00:45:32,070
Council Member Eisenberg? Aye. Council Member Cooper? Aye. Council Member Gift? Aye. Vice Mayor Lopez-Rotega? Aye. Mayor Williams? Aye. Thank you, Council. Thank you, members of the public for your contributions, your comments. We're on to public hearing, item 6.1. May I request that we address item 6.2 first in case some consultants can get here for the first item? Okay.

540
00:45:32,070 --> 00:45:33,430
Okay, all right, so we have-

541
00:45:33,430 --> 00:45:38,030
It's on mobile vending, so we just would like to swap the order of the two public hearing items.

542
00:45:38,590 --> 00:45:44,250
Okay, so let's see, so you're suggesting a 6.2 pre-c, 6.1?

543
00:45:44,470 --> 00:45:44,690
Correct.

544
00:45:46,090 --> 00:45:50,950
I'm fine with that, then we have somebody coming to help us with 6.1, who's not here yet?

545
00:45:51,110 --> 00:45:51,310
Correct.

546
00:45:51,710 --> 00:46:01,010
Okay, all right, let's do that then, council, let's skip over to 6.2, and

547
00:46:01,010 --> 00:46:08,570
And this is about street and sidewalk vending ordinance, and Director Desmond is here.

548
00:46:08,930 --> 00:46:09,630
Good evening, Council.

549
00:46:10,170 --> 00:46:15,750
Yes, and Council heard this item on December 3rd of 2024.

550
00:46:16,830 --> 00:46:22,690
And the purpose of this item is to establish a comprehensive program for sidewalk and

551
00:46:22,690 --> 00:46:28,530
street vending that aims to benefit the entire city by promoting an entrepreneurship and

552
00:46:28,530 --> 00:46:34,110
creating economic opportunities for individuals to support themselves and their families.

553
00:46:35,870 --> 00:46:45,870
And as we outlined on December 3rd, we've spent quite a bit of time on our mobile food

554
00:46:45,870 --> 00:46:53,670
vending ordinance related to food trucks, one of the things we did not do is build into that

555
00:46:53,670 --> 00:47:00,710
provisions for other types of vending and particular cart vending.

556
00:47:01,010 --> 00:47:05,670
So the purpose of this item is to address all of those items and

557
00:47:05,670 --> 00:47:12,910
to make sure that those vendors have the appropriate permits in place so

558
00:47:12,910 --> 00:47:19,210
that we confirm that those uses are following all city ordinances.

559
00:47:19,210 --> 00:47:28,110
This is specifically one of the issues we've had a lot of trouble with is vendors who are operating outside of our foodware ordinance.

560
00:47:28,890 --> 00:47:32,830
So as a result, that's what this ordinance does.

561
00:47:33,390 --> 00:47:43,590
We also did some tune-ups from the December 3rd item to clarify what happens in the cow trans rights away.

562
00:47:43,590 --> 00:47:53,130
today and also provide some additional clarity around when mobile food trucks can operate

563
00:47:53,830 --> 00:47:59,370
on fairgrounds property as you know at this time we have two locations on fairgrounds

564
00:47:59,370 --> 00:48:05,470
property and we've revised the language in the ordinance to prohibit those uses during

565
00:48:05,470 --> 00:48:11,670
the times of events that have special event permits granted by the city and that's really

566
00:48:11,670 --> 00:48:18,510
I believe the extent of the changes that we've done to this ordinance since you last saw it and I'm available for questions.

567
00:48:18,630 --> 00:48:22,470
It sounds like a lot of fine tuning is going on on this one.

568
00:48:22,830 --> 00:48:23,110
Correct.

569
00:48:24,130 --> 00:48:26,070
Council members, are there questions for clarification?

570
00:48:26,690 --> 00:48:30,990
Just for clarification, not our opinion on this yet, and then we'll open it up to the public.

571
00:48:30,990 --> 00:48:46,710
During a public event, let's say the tractor parade, so there will be no vendors available around, you know, during the event.

572
00:48:47,870 --> 00:48:50,470
I don't believe it prohibits anybody from vending.

573
00:48:51,230 --> 00:49:01,950
The specific prohibit prohibitions that we placed on it were when mobile food trucks can operate in the two locations that the council's already identified on.

574
00:49:01,950 --> 00:49:04,010
on fairgrounds property.

575
00:49:04,570 --> 00:49:10,910
Okay, I'm a little confused here because I'm thinking about, you know, those street vendors

576
00:49:10,910 --> 00:49:15,490
that are pushing little cars walking during an event.

577
00:49:16,050 --> 00:49:21,430
So they will have to get the appropriate permits or be associated with the event themselves,

578
00:49:21,850 --> 00:49:23,770
but there's no prohibition on that.

579
00:49:24,170 --> 00:49:24,470
Okay.

580
00:49:24,650 --> 00:49:25,670
If that makes sense.

581
00:49:25,790 --> 00:49:25,910
Yeah.

582
00:49:26,170 --> 00:49:26,310
Yeah.

583
00:49:26,670 --> 00:49:27,070
Thank you.

584
00:49:28,270 --> 00:49:36,830
And this allows all the food vendors to be responsible for all the ordinances in Calistoga,

585
00:49:37,510 --> 00:49:42,270
including all the foodware ordinances, and that can be enforced.

586
00:49:43,210 --> 00:49:53,130
Yes, so the process is just to reiterate, the folks who would like to use this, you know,

587
00:49:53,130 --> 00:49:59,850
And then, then, globally, they will have to sign up for a use permit, they'll have to get a city business license.

588
00:50:00,830 --> 00:50:05,890
They will have to get a permit from EpiValley Environmental Health.

589
00:50:06,710 --> 00:50:12,870
And the NapiValley Environmental Health Permit is kind of, there's an annual permit.

590
00:50:13,090 --> 00:50:20,810
And then there's a one time permit where the Health Department inspects the actual facility or

591
00:50:20,810 --> 00:50:27,110
a car or vehicle that the vendor is utilizing for in the case of their vending food.

592
00:50:28,150 --> 00:50:34,570
So those fees, the local fees are going to be around $200 for the business license and

593
00:50:34,570 --> 00:50:35,170
the use permit.

594
00:50:36,810 --> 00:50:44,490
And then from the county, depending on what they're vending, the annual permit is between

595
00:50:44,490 --> 00:50:52,770
between $2 and $300 and the facilities inspection permit is between $6 and $1,200 and

596
00:50:52,770 --> 00:51:01,390
that is per facility or cart or vehicle that can be used anywhere in Napa County for

597
00:51:01,390 --> 00:51:03,470
the calendar year, or for year.

598
00:51:05,110 --> 00:51:06,110
Okay, thank you.

599
00:51:06,750 --> 00:51:13,610
I had a question back to the mobile food strikes on the fair ground if the event's applicants

600
00:51:13,610 --> 00:51:18,470
Since chooses to contract directly with the food drunk, this wouldn't prevent that from happening.

601
00:51:18,550 --> 00:51:18,930
That's correct.

602
00:51:19,610 --> 00:51:19,610
Okay,

603
00:51:22,050 --> 00:51:23,650
let's open two public comment.

604
00:51:24,630 --> 00:51:32,170
Is there anybody either online or here in the community center who'd like to comment on the ordinance pending before us?

605
00:51:36,150 --> 00:51:37,730
Okay, and somebody online?

606
00:51:38,150 --> 00:51:38,270
Yes,

607
00:51:41,990 --> 00:51:43,110
Marlin, do you hear us?

608
00:51:43,890 --> 00:51:44,890
Yeah, can you hear me?

609
00:51:45,050 --> 00:51:46,130
Yes, go ahead, do you have three minutes?

610
00:51:46,130 --> 00:51:52,570
Oh, thank you very much. Honorable Mayor and Council members, my name is Marlon Lara.

611
00:51:52,970 --> 00:51:58,790
I'm a legislative director for the California Restaurant Association. Thank you for giving me

612
00:51:58,790 --> 00:52:06,590
some time to be able to address you today. I sent over a letter providing some input on this ordinance.

613
00:52:07,290 --> 00:52:13,870
First of all, I want to say that the Restaurant Association appreciates all of staff's work and

614
00:52:13,870 --> 00:52:22,050
of the council's work to establish clear guidelines around sidewalk vendors and ultimately food safety.

615
00:52:22,730 --> 00:52:29,690
I think as brick and mortar restaurants were held to a really high standard on food safety and

616
00:52:29,690 --> 00:52:38,050
we want to see a lot of those same things applied throughout any food business. We believe that food

617
00:52:38,050 --> 00:52:48,430
safety should apply the same if you're in a brick-and-mortar restaurant or getting food from a sidewalk

618
00:52:48,430 --> 00:52:55,630
vendor or even sidewalk-bending on private property which we have seen that has become a problem.

619
00:52:57,090 --> 00:53:05,430
I guess the bulk of my comments today is wanting to ask and see if the council can consider

620
00:53:07,270 --> 00:53:16,210
understanding the same sort of buffer zones between brick and mortar restaurants and sidewalk

621
00:53:16,210 --> 00:53:25,210
vendors on private property and brick and mortar restaurants such as such as the same ones that

622
00:53:25,210 --> 00:53:33,030
are extended to distance requirements for for special events and farmer's markets.

623
00:53:33,030 --> 00:53:38,570
It's at the moment there's a 15 foot distance requirement

624
00:53:38,570 --> 00:53:42,790
from no vending from the entrance of any business

625
00:53:42,790 --> 00:53:45,850
in a similar 50 foot distance requirement

626
00:53:45,850 --> 00:53:48,970
between other food businesses such as restaurants

627
00:53:49,610 --> 00:53:51,310
and vendors on private property.

628
00:53:51,770 --> 00:53:56,650
I outlined some of the ordinances and sections

629
00:53:56,650 --> 00:53:58,170
that we're looking at.

630
00:53:58,410 --> 00:54:01,090
We're looking for the council to reflect

631
00:54:01,090 --> 00:54:03,670
like the same 200 foot distance requirement

632
00:54:03,670 --> 00:54:07,190
that are applied to special events and farmer's markets.

633
00:54:08,190 --> 00:54:14,190
Again, state law SB946 past in 2018

634
00:54:14,190 --> 00:54:17,650
allows the council to establish guidelines,

635
00:54:18,070 --> 00:54:21,070
objective guidelines that protect the health, safety

636
00:54:21,070 --> 00:54:24,470
and welfare of the community and businesses.

637
00:54:24,730 --> 00:54:30,020
We think that this is sort of modification

638
00:54:30,020 --> 00:54:39,960
that we think make sense that falls under those guidelines that protects the health safety and welfare of the community and just really appreciate your consideration. Thank you.

639
00:54:40,480 --> 00:54:41,880
Thanks, Mr. Lara, for your comments.

640
00:54:44,570 --> 00:54:46,710
Anybody else? Yes, the public. Yes, please.

641
00:54:50,410 --> 00:54:53,290
Hi, Mary Hastings. I'm coming to you too.

642
00:54:53,290 --> 00:54:54,690
That doesn't apply to you.

643
00:54:57,150 --> 00:55:09,450
I'm coming to you with a background in teaching and I just wanted to put out there that I have concerns about mobile carts being in such close proximity to schools, which I see happening in our town.

644
00:55:10,170 --> 00:55:22,130
Oftentimes parents would rather not have their children buying from carts that perhaps don't have the healthiest of food items, but it's very difficult to monitor when their kids are walking home from school on their own.

645
00:55:22,130 --> 00:55:24,750
and there's the cart like right next to them.

646
00:55:25,270 --> 00:55:28,050
So I wanted to just ask for some consideration

647
00:55:28,510 --> 00:55:30,510
on the council's part for thinking about that,

648
00:55:30,630 --> 00:55:34,470
as well as how many mobile carts there would be,

649
00:55:35,250 --> 00:55:39,270
and as much as we've discovered that three is like the max

650
00:55:39,270 --> 00:55:41,130
that the town seems to be able to handle

651
00:55:41,130 --> 00:55:42,930
with the larger trucks,

652
00:55:43,450 --> 00:55:47,590
I don't know how many smaller carts you might be thinking of,

653
00:55:47,710 --> 00:55:50,510
so I thought I'd just plant that seed to think about it.

654
00:55:50,830 --> 00:55:51,230
Thank you.

655
00:55:51,230 --> 00:55:57,140
Okay. Thank you. Are there any other public comments?

656
00:56:00,900 --> 00:56:02,320
And we'll check once more online.

657
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:03,160
No, no, no, no.

658
00:56:03,160 --> 00:56:04,360
Okay. Nobody else online?

659
00:56:05,140 --> 00:56:06,880
And no other comments here?

660
00:56:07,380 --> 00:56:10,380
Let's close public comment and back to council members.

661
00:56:10,940 --> 00:56:16,380
Any questions or comments or a motion on this one?

662
00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:24,540
Regarding the comment and the letter that we just received from Mr. Lara.

663
00:56:25,680 --> 00:56:35,760
I mean, some sections here will be possible to do it right now or we need to come back to.

664
00:56:37,160 --> 00:56:42,800
My recommendation would be not to accept that recommendation.

665
00:56:43,480 --> 00:56:52,440
So I think, you know, my staff and myself put this ordinance together looking at other similarly size and

666
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:58,320
and similar types of commercial zoning districts

667
00:56:58,740 --> 00:57:01,760
and came up with this number based on what other folks

668
00:57:01,760 --> 00:57:02,480
have adopted.

669
00:57:03,240 --> 00:57:05,280
I think the 200 foot buffer

670
00:57:05,280 --> 00:57:07,560
would given the scale of this community

671
00:57:07,560 --> 00:57:08,380
would be

672
00:57:10,160 --> 00:57:11,360
honoris to folks.

673
00:57:12,100 --> 00:57:13,180
So that's my recommendation.

674
00:57:13,740 --> 00:57:15,040
You guys can make a change now

675
00:57:15,040 --> 00:57:16,880
and we can bring it back.

676
00:57:16,960 --> 00:57:18,120
That's up to you guys,

677
00:57:18,120 --> 00:57:21,340
but we did put some thought

678
00:57:21,340 --> 00:57:24,040
into the metrics that are in the ordinance today.

679
00:57:25,360 --> 00:57:26,680
Okay, all right.

680
00:57:26,860 --> 00:57:28,440
So we have that, Councilman Cooper?

681
00:57:29,860 --> 00:57:33,080
Personally, I've always had reservations about this ordinance.

682
00:57:33,340 --> 00:57:38,280
I think that mobile food vendors are a service to a certain demographic in our town

683
00:57:38,280 --> 00:57:43,460
that really deserves to have the opportunity to culturally enjoy.

684
00:57:43,880 --> 00:57:48,040
That if we put a 200 foot regulation from restaurants,

685
00:57:48,040 --> 00:58:11,900
that's going to potentially drive them out of town, but concerned that, you know, $1,500 of health inspections and permits and fees, there's not a lot of margins, it's just, you know, so I understand that concerns and the reason behind it, but I still have reservations about there's really nothing I can do about it, but I think we do need to be sensitive that there's a population that really enjoys these specific food mobile vendors.

686
00:58:11,900 --> 00:58:23,690
I think this ordinance is really important because this is how we make sure that all the

687
00:58:23,690 --> 00:58:30,290
food vendors and all the restaurants at every entity in Calistoga is following the law

688
00:58:30,630 --> 00:58:36,090
and does not put people who purchase at risk of foodborne diseases.

689
00:58:36,610 --> 00:58:38,710
This means there will be safety inspections.

690
00:58:38,710 --> 00:58:49,750
It means that our foodware ordinance can be enforced and that we don't have this one group of vendors that is using Styrofoam

691
00:58:49,750 --> 00:59:00,730
while every restaurant food truck in town has got to use compostable takeout.

692
00:59:00,730 --> 00:59:04,810
It's a matter of fairness and I'm

693
00:59:07,110 --> 00:59:32,910
actually also was just listening to one of our comments from the public and I don't think we should change the ordinance right now, but I do think it may be worthwhile to inquire from the school district if they would like to have them if they're interested in proposing some sort of distance.

694
00:59:32,910 --> 00:59:40,970
that we might enforce at a future date and I

695
00:59:43,180 --> 00:59:46,520
actually don't think the kinds of

696
00:59:46,520 --> 00:59:52,020
food carts that are currently in Kalastoga are in too much competition with

697
00:59:52,020 --> 00:59:58,780
our restaurants. It looks like the primary product or the primary products are

698
00:59:58,780 --> 00:59:59,880
and

699
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:02,480
And ready to eat. Candy.

700
01:00:05,340 --> 01:00:27,840
That's another reason to look at what the school district might be interested in. But I do support entrepreneurship. I do believe having jobs where people can honestly earn a living following the laws of Kalastoga is a really good thing. I did have one thought.

701
01:00:30,280 --> 01:00:50,520
I don't know for sure, but what I have heard is that many of the food carts that are currently in use in Calistoga are from one operator and would each would all the fees be by cart or by ownership.

702
01:00:51,180 --> 01:00:57,660
So that's a good question, and so that's a good question.

703
01:00:58,020 --> 01:01:01,760
And I think you're right, I think, but I don't, we didn't do any analysis of that.

704
01:01:02,020 --> 01:01:08,760
But the way that NAPA County permits these from their perspective is by cart or truck

705
01:01:09,540 --> 01:01:11,620
or facility as they call it.

706
01:01:11,620 --> 01:01:14,040
So that permit is,

707
01:01:16,140 --> 01:01:37,060
and you can use that facility anywhere in Napa County, but I think what we're looking for is somebody to get the local permit for each user here locally, independent of what the county is doing, what their actual car or truck or so forth.

708
01:01:37,060 --> 01:01:38,600
So, what does user mean?

709
01:01:39,920 --> 01:01:46,740
User is the person who is pushing the cart and selling the item.

710
01:01:51,150 --> 01:01:51,790
Thank you.

711
01:01:51,810 --> 01:01:52,550
Is that answer your question?

712
01:01:52,690 --> 01:01:58,410
I'm going to, yeah, I mean, it answered the last question, but the earlier ones have already

713
01:01:58,410 --> 01:02:00,010
forgotten, so you get away with that.

714
01:02:00,890 --> 01:02:08,250
So, if I can try to understand, if there's one owner who has five carts, does he need five permits?

715
01:02:08,590 --> 01:02:08,750
Yes.

716
01:02:08,750 --> 01:02:09,470
He does.

717
01:02:09,790 --> 01:02:10,110
Yes.

718
01:02:10,350 --> 01:02:11,150
By this ordinance.

719
01:02:11,570 --> 01:02:11,710
Okay.

720
01:02:13,130 --> 01:02:20,470
And if I may, I remember a recall now that one of the issues about Girl Scout cookies came

721
01:02:20,470 --> 01:02:26,650
up in December and we did insert a provision in there that exempts charitable organizations

722
01:02:27,500 --> 01:02:28,210
from this.

723
01:02:28,870 --> 01:02:29,230
Thank you.

724
01:02:29,650 --> 01:02:32,590
And council member, if you had a separate question.

725
01:02:32,590 --> 01:02:43,390
So this 1,500 or so fees annually, this would apply to the guy that walks around the pool with his ice cream thing on the hot day.

726
01:02:43,990 --> 01:03:00,550
Well, so it's a scaled, it's $600 to $1,200, where it's a county fee and they inspect the actual whatever it is, the card or the truck or whatever he's using to sell or vend his.

727
01:03:01,070 --> 01:03:03,910
And that's only for foods that are prepared.

728
01:03:04,350 --> 01:03:08,470
So if he's got just snacks, or just like wrap prepared things.

729
01:03:09,430 --> 01:03:16,410
But if it's prepared food, there's the fee goes up higher.

730
01:03:17,130 --> 01:03:19,590
But again, the local fees, and that's no matter what.

731
01:03:19,830 --> 01:03:24,130
So it's the $2 to $300 Napa County Environmental Health

732
01:03:24,130 --> 01:03:27,670
fee plus the inspection fee, which is anywhere from $6 to $1,200.

733
01:03:27,670 --> 01:03:33,450
depending on the scale and the type of ending that the individual is involved with.

734
01:03:34,290 --> 01:03:35,050
Thank you.

735
01:03:36,010 --> 01:03:41,410
So, you know, the fees are one thing, it's not just the fees, this is more of another

736
01:03:41,410 --> 01:03:46,170
example of imposing a green tariff on the population.

737
01:03:46,450 --> 01:03:51,450
Now we have to factor in the increase in cost of styrofoam and all of the food ordinances,

738
01:03:51,490 --> 01:03:54,450
which I understand, of course, are important for the environment.

739
01:03:54,450 --> 01:03:59,750
But at the same time, you sometimes have to look past that and, you know, there's a certain

740
01:03:59,750 --> 01:04:06,350
cost factor that they're bringing food to the community that really is about as inexpensive

741
01:04:07,210 --> 01:04:08,130
as you can get.

742
01:04:08,710 --> 01:04:11,550
And when you start adding these and stacking these at some point, they're going to have

743
01:04:11,550 --> 01:04:13,570
to translate, transfer that into the population.

744
01:04:13,930 --> 01:04:17,010
So I'm just going on record saying, you know, that's something we don't need to be aware of,

745
01:04:17,030 --> 01:04:17,110
too.

746
01:04:19,710 --> 01:04:28,430
Just when let's come in about enforcement, just to be sure, you know, that when somebody

747
01:04:28,430 --> 01:04:42,870
gets penalties for no doing what they're supposed to do, to be sure that, because what

748
01:04:42,870 --> 01:04:48,750
What happened is that most of these vendors, they don't have, it's not their own business.

749
01:04:49,570 --> 01:04:59,150
The owner of those little cars is a big corporation, which is out of Ara Calistoga, even

750
01:04:59,150 --> 01:05:00,230
out of the county.

751
01:05:01,700 --> 01:05:09,850
One of the fruit vendors that is in Calistoga, we know, is coming from either Modesto or

752
01:05:09,850 --> 01:05:17,390
where else is talked on and so it's a big corporation that just put people all over you know all

753
01:05:17,390 --> 01:05:23,470
over the Napa Valley so we need to be sure that the enforcement or the penalties they don't go

754
01:05:23,470 --> 01:05:30,690
to this the actual the people who's you know that's a great comment I totally understand we're

755
01:05:30,690 --> 01:05:35,650
going with this and so he goes to the corporation. The permit holder would be the corporation in the example

756
01:05:35,650 --> 01:05:42,650
you're giving and the, you know, the other, the person doing the vending is an employee of that corporation.

757
01:05:43,310 --> 01:05:44,810
So that's how we will.

758
01:05:44,910 --> 01:05:45,730
Yes, to be sure.

759
01:05:46,150 --> 01:05:47,010
Thank you.

760
01:05:48,290 --> 01:05:49,830
Other questions or comments?

761
01:05:50,650 --> 01:05:51,530
Council, thank you.

762
01:05:51,670 --> 01:05:52,250
Good comments.

763
01:05:52,450 --> 01:05:52,990
Good questions.

764
01:05:53,850 --> 01:06:03,470
I'm satisfied with this ordinance the way it's presented to us knowing that it can be modified if experience suggested would be better off in the direction.

765
01:06:04,150 --> 01:06:08,870
But for now, I'll make a motion that will be approved as it's presented to us.

766
01:06:09,770 --> 01:06:11,030
Is there a second on that?

767
01:06:11,450 --> 01:06:11,810
Second.

768
01:06:12,470 --> 01:06:12,830
Thank you.

769
01:06:12,890 --> 01:06:14,390
There's a motion in the second.

770
01:06:14,830 --> 01:06:16,450
Let's take a roll call, please, City Clerk.

771
01:06:18,860 --> 01:06:20,180
Council Member Eisenberg?

772
01:06:20,420 --> 01:06:20,580
Aye.

773
01:06:21,280 --> 01:06:22,540
Council Member Cooper?

774
01:06:22,940 --> 01:06:23,120
Nay.

775
01:06:24,260 --> 01:06:25,300
Council Member Gift?

776
01:06:25,960 --> 01:06:26,220
No.

777
01:06:27,200 --> 01:06:28,400
Vice Mayor Lopez Rotega?

778
01:06:28,700 --> 01:06:28,840
Aye.

779
01:06:29,800 --> 01:06:30,300
And Mayor Williams?

780
01:06:30,820 --> 01:06:31,000
Aye.

781
01:06:31,000 --> 01:06:38,260
Okay. Thank you, Council of the passes, three to two, council members gift, and Cooper dissenting.

782
01:06:39,890 --> 01:06:44,080
Let's go back to item 6.1.

783
01:06:47,740 --> 01:06:50,240
And, Director Desmond, are we okay to proceed with this?

784
01:06:50,240 --> 01:06:51,360
We are okay to proceed.

785
01:06:51,940 --> 01:06:52,000
Okay.

786
01:06:52,620 --> 01:07:00,320
So this item addresses the topic of development impact fee study.

787
01:07:00,320 --> 01:07:01,380
Yes,

788
01:07:06,610 --> 01:07:34,730
and this is another item that you got has been before you I think I believe is actually back in December also and we are here tonight to prepare up to go over the final version of the development infact fee study and I've got consultants here that are going to run the show for you and they as well as myself and director Rainer are here to answer any questions.

789
01:07:34,730 --> 01:07:35,710
you may have of staff.

790
01:07:37,750 --> 01:07:40,950
So with that, I will turn it over to Typhian from EPS.

791
01:07:42,410 --> 01:07:43,110
You ready to go?

792
01:07:43,830 --> 01:07:43,990
Great.

793
01:07:45,710 --> 01:07:47,150
OK, and welcome, sir.

794
01:07:47,910 --> 01:07:49,170
Good evening, Typhian.

795
01:07:50,650 --> 01:07:53,650
My name is Typhian Rice Evans with Economic and Planning

796
01:07:53,650 --> 01:07:54,110
Systems.

797
01:07:55,670 --> 01:07:56,810
And I think we were here.

798
01:07:57,090 --> 01:07:59,530
My colleague, Megan Gregory, was here a couple of months ago,

799
01:08:00,050 --> 01:08:02,210
giving you an initial presentation on the fees.

800
01:08:03,030 --> 01:08:04,290
I'm pleased to be back here.

801
01:08:04,290 --> 01:08:10,890
I believe we have our co-consultant from W trans daily and with lockers on the zoom connection.

802
01:08:10,890 --> 01:08:15,810
It was a little tricky getting in here tonight to Kater Stoker that is.

803
01:08:17,190 --> 01:08:24,170
So I'm going to kick this off and I think daily and I will do a combined presentation hopefully.

804
01:08:25,370 --> 01:08:25,910
Let me see.

805
01:08:26,330 --> 01:08:28,390
And if you could speak into the mic as much as possible.

806
01:08:28,470 --> 01:08:29,010
Yes, all right.

807
01:08:29,110 --> 01:08:29,450
Thank you.

808
01:08:30,810 --> 01:08:31,330
Let's see.

809
01:08:31,330 --> 01:08:48,390
So, yeah, so we're going to start off with daily and last time we presented to you the background analysis on several fees, the public safety, the cultural parks and recreation, the civic and city administrative facilities.

810
01:08:49,170 --> 01:08:57,830
We had it at that time, completed the transportation component. So, daily and with luck with WTrans, we'll present that to you in a little bit of detail.

811
01:08:57,830 --> 01:09:04,170
So then we'll bring it back together and kind of show you all the fees together what it looks like for your consideration.

812
01:09:07,190 --> 01:09:10,310
So, I don't, do we, do we have Dalyne on the line?

813
01:09:12,330 --> 01:09:13,330
I am here.

814
01:09:13,870 --> 01:09:17,550
All right, Dalyne, did you want to, did you want to start with this one or the next one?

815
01:09:21,110 --> 01:09:21,730
Let's see.

816
01:09:21,970 --> 01:09:23,230
I can start wherever you want.

817
01:09:23,230 --> 01:09:29,670
Okay, well, just, just, contextually, I think one thing we wanted to, to note for you all before daily

818
01:09:29,670 --> 01:09:35,210
and explains the transportation side is just the, with impact fees, there's a, you know, a question about

819
01:09:35,210 --> 01:09:40,330
how much new development do we expect to occur in the city? That is the development they book.

820
01:09:40,850 --> 01:09:47,270
We're asking to contribute towards a capital facility improvements. And so it's, it's nobody knows

821
01:09:47,270 --> 01:09:51,890
for certain, of course, exactly how much development is going to occur over the next 20 or so years.

822
01:09:51,890 --> 01:09:59,490
but this is the estimated amount of development based on the city's general plan and other

823
01:10:00,150 --> 01:10:05,130
kind of review of available documents. So we just wanted to note that, and what that

824
01:10:05,830 --> 01:10:10,590
means ultimately in the city is that we're estimating that you would have about, if all this

825
01:10:10,590 --> 01:10:17,590
development comes to pass, you'd end up with about 1,000 new residents, about 1,850 new employees,

826
01:10:18,070 --> 01:10:20,710
and about 450 new visitors.

827
01:10:21,670 --> 01:10:23,210
This is over a 20-year span?

828
01:10:23,490 --> 01:10:24,690
This is over a 20-year span.

829
01:10:25,830 --> 01:10:27,970
So we just want to kind of remind you of that

830
01:10:27,970 --> 01:10:30,350
because that's just a kind of framing piece.

831
01:10:30,810 --> 01:10:33,690
And now let me see if I think the next slide

832
01:10:33,690 --> 01:10:36,850
is getting into your work daily and you can ask me

833
01:10:36,850 --> 01:10:40,570
if you want me to move a slide forward, just let me know.

834
01:10:41,290 --> 01:10:42,050
All right, thank you.

835
01:10:42,630 --> 01:10:43,070
Well, good evening.

836
01:10:43,250 --> 01:10:44,250
My name is Dalyne Whitlock.

837
01:10:44,450 --> 01:10:46,670
I'm a senior principal with W. Trans and Santa Rosa.

838
01:10:46,670 --> 01:10:52,050
that we prepared the study. And I apologize for not being there like Tapeon. I got as far

839
01:10:52,050 --> 01:10:56,670
as Calistoga Road turned and went back across Santa Rosa and tried to come through down

840
01:10:56,670 --> 01:11:03,490
Mark West. And that was closed. Alexander Valley Road is closed. So I was I spent about an hour

841
01:11:03,490 --> 01:11:07,610
driving around Santa Rosa and never got any further than the east side. So I finally gave up and

842
01:11:07,610 --> 01:11:12,190
came home and figured I could I could remodiate in and and I but I do apologize for not being there.

843
01:11:12,190 --> 01:11:19,910
but I did give it a, a valiant try. So in, in order to determine the trip gender, in order to

844
01:11:19,910 --> 01:11:27,010
determine the fee per trip for your development impact fees, we start with how much development

845
01:11:27,010 --> 01:11:32,210
there is, which, which Davey on was just going through there. So we then take that development and

846
01:11:32,210 --> 01:11:38,230
use that to figure out how many new trips are those developments going to generate. So we have rates

847
01:11:38,230 --> 01:11:44,250
that are standard rates they're used nationally for single-family, residential, multi-family,

848
01:11:44,490 --> 01:11:49,770
a hotel, commercial, general, light industrial. So we took all of those various uses that are

849
01:11:49,770 --> 01:11:56,510
anticipated and multiplied by their applicable rates to come up with how many trips they would

850
01:11:57,410 --> 01:12:04,130
generate, both on a daily basis as well as during the kind of critical P&P care which seems to be

851
01:12:04,130 --> 01:12:09,610
the, you know, most important time or the time there's the most congestion in the city of Calistoga.

852
01:12:10,390 --> 01:12:15,710
So next year's slide. Next slide, please. So once we had the trips established,

853
01:12:16,110 --> 01:12:20,430
we started looking at what the project costs would be. So what are you trying to pay for with this

854
01:12:20,430 --> 01:12:28,710
impact fee? And we started out with a list that was about 100 lines long. So we picked up everything

855
01:12:28,710 --> 01:12:33,430
that was in your CIP, in your Active Transportation Plan,

856
01:12:34,210 --> 01:12:38,570
in your pedestrian plan, anywhere we could find projects,

857
01:12:38,970 --> 01:12:41,450
we pulled all of those into a single list.

858
01:12:42,750 --> 01:12:45,210
And then we started going through those with your staff.

859
01:12:45,990 --> 01:12:50,030
And some of them make sense to have in as part of this fee

860
01:12:50,030 --> 01:12:52,310
because they are, some were truly transportation.

861
01:12:52,890 --> 01:12:55,170
But there were things in the CIP that had to do with

862
01:12:56,730 --> 01:13:03,830
water, wastewater, parking, other other things that weren't strictly transportation or

863
01:13:03,830 --> 01:13:04,710
at least circulation.

864
01:13:05,750 --> 01:13:11,830
So we ultimately paired it down to this list of 12 line items.

865
01:13:12,270 --> 01:13:16,890
And some of those are our compilation of enumerous projects, for instance, the various

866
01:13:16,890 --> 01:13:19,210
pathways, sidewalks, and bikeways.

867
01:13:22,830 --> 01:13:35,550
We've left those rather vague so that the city has a lot of flexibility in terms of what order you do things and which which ones you choose to construct with the funds that are made available.

868
01:13:36,410 --> 01:13:48,230
So at the end of the day, we came up with about $33 million plus worth of projects that we're wanted to put into the traffic impact fee and one way or another.

869
01:13:49,150 --> 01:13:58,130
We then looked at how much of that cost is associated with new development versus how much of it is associated with existing residences.

870
01:13:58,990 --> 01:14:12,910
And so a lot of these things like a multi-use pathway and a pedestrian bridge, some of the a lot of those things there are benefit to existing residents as much as they are to future residents and businesses.

871
01:14:12,910 --> 01:14:25,570
and EPA calculated the amount of the ratio of new residents to existing residents and

872
01:14:25,570 --> 01:14:33,330
that was 20.44%. So we put 20.44% of the cost of all those future facilities into this

873
01:14:33,330 --> 01:14:38,790
fee. And so at the end of the day after we had taken out the things that had either,

874
01:14:41,890 --> 01:14:42,710
you

875
01:14:42,710 --> 01:14:59,470
for by something by this project versus by something else or if there was outside funding available and sometimes for some of these projects we know that there will be state funding or grants and other sources of funding. So after taking out the outside funding.

876
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:29,580
And allocating a proportion of the fee to or the cost to the fee versus to existing residents. We ended up with over six and a half million dollars with the projects that would go into the transportation fee when it's set up. So next slide, please. The next step was then to figure out how to allocate those fees. We have a certain amount of number of trips. You saw that on the first slide I talked about. We have

877
01:15:31,300 --> 01:15:41,020
1241 daily trips and 701 p-cara trips or we had 1241 p-cara trips, I'm sorry, but some

878
01:15:41,020 --> 01:15:46,160
of these items have a lot more benefit to residents than they do to commercial establishments

879
01:15:46,160 --> 01:15:53,180
for instance. So we ended up using some factors and this is consistent with how your current

880
01:15:53,180 --> 01:16:02,880
fee was done. We worked on that with EPS some years ago, and so we're doing the same basic

881
01:16:02,880 --> 01:16:10,440
approaches we did then in terms of assigning a residential uses, got a higher surcharge,

882
01:16:10,840 --> 01:16:15,300
and then like commercial uses where a lot of the people that would go to, for instance,

883
01:16:15,300 --> 01:16:21,440
a new store would either be drawn from existing traffic. So those trips, those aren't new trips,

884
01:16:21,440 --> 01:16:26,440
those are those are those are already existing trips but they're just drawing them in.

885
01:16:27,520 --> 01:16:32,380
So for all of the commercial uses we used factors to bring those down

886
01:16:33,120 --> 01:16:38,920
and then pro-rated their trips based on that and used the after we had done the discounts

887
01:16:38,920 --> 01:16:45,940
in the surcharges we ended up with 701 trips and that was the number we used to divide for the land use.

888
01:16:47,420 --> 01:17:00,720
one thing I do want to note is that for the trip generation rates, the housing is per dwelling unit. So we took an average size of both a single family and multi family dwelling unit.

889
01:17:01,620 --> 01:17:05,700
And use that to come up with square footage for dwelling units.

890
01:17:05,700 --> 01:17:15,720
to come up with the cost per square foot because that that's something new that the state is requiring that this be based on the size of it.

891
01:17:16,080 --> 01:17:23,440
The same thing was done with industrial where before we had just a winery and we could have been a 3000 square foot winery, it could have been a 30,000 square foot winery.

892
01:17:23,960 --> 01:17:34,660
So in this particular instance, we assumed a certain size and I believe was 10,000 square feet for the wineries so that we could relate that to the feed per square foot.

893
01:17:34,660 --> 01:17:45,740
So that it's consistent for all for the residential commercial industrial uses and then hotel and motel those are on per room, which is a pretty pretty standard measure.

894
01:17:47,080 --> 01:17:49,220
So let's see last slide, please.

895
01:17:50,560 --> 01:17:55,260
So this is just a comparison of what the costs were.

896
01:17:56,300 --> 01:18:03,400
the fees were from the 2014 study versus the current study and as you can see the residential

897
01:18:03,400 --> 01:18:13,440
has gone up 16% commercial went down 5%, which is 25 cents. Hotel Motel went up by 24%

898
01:18:13,440 --> 01:18:17,780
and then industrial went down quite a bit. I think the biggest reason the industrial went down

899
01:18:17,780 --> 01:18:22,960
is because we're now doing it per square foot, so we're not. It's not exactly apples to apples

900
01:18:22,960 --> 01:18:28,840
because we didn't do either residential or industrial weren't evaluated per square foot

901
01:18:28,840 --> 01:18:35,900
in 2014. So these were translated from the current fees which are per trip as opposed to per square

902
01:18:35,900 --> 01:18:45,680
foot. But now they're all put into square foot basis. So we did, the industrial land use was

903
01:18:45,680 --> 01:18:51,040
previously a winery and now we've made it just a generic industrial land use. So that you have

904
01:18:51,040 --> 01:19:02,540
We have a little more flexibility again in terms of what projects are assigned and where they go and with that, I think that's the last slide that I have, but I'm more than happy to answer questions.

905
01:19:03,960 --> 01:19:10,260
Thank you for that presentation. Council members, before we go to public comment, are there any clarification?

906
01:19:11,240 --> 01:19:12,800
Mayor, I believe we have a lot more presentation.

907
01:19:14,300 --> 01:19:16,460
Not too much more, but we have a little bit more.

908
01:19:16,460 --> 01:19:19,960
All right, if that's okay, sure, please proceed.

909
01:19:20,200 --> 01:19:24,340
Yeah, so what, so the thing we wanted to do is bring together what Dalyne just presented

910
01:19:24,340 --> 01:19:30,180
to you, along with the work we showed you last time, and just give you a kind of an overall

911
01:19:30,180 --> 01:19:33,000
synopsis of what the whole fee program looked like.

912
01:19:33,100 --> 01:19:41,120
So what you'll see up here is, on the residential side of things, you can see here a kind of

913
01:19:41,120 --> 01:19:48,760
compilation of the overall potential new maximum fee that we could place in residential development.

914
01:19:49,200 --> 01:19:53,400
And what you'll notice is that on the left hand side, we show the per unit, and on the right hand side,

915
01:19:53,500 --> 01:20:01,880
we show the per square foot. And as Dilly was saying, the way we typically develop those fees is on a per unit basis.

916
01:20:01,920 --> 01:20:05,960
But the state now asks us to translate that into a per square foot basis.

917
01:20:05,960 --> 01:20:13,380
So we do the per unit and we translate it dividing by 2,500 square feet into per square

918
01:20:13,380 --> 01:20:21,420
foot basis. So there you can see on the right hand side, the maximum fee we could now charge

919
01:20:21,420 --> 01:20:28,720
would be about $13.64 per square foot of residential development. And you can see the components

920
01:20:28,720 --> 01:20:34,680
of that. You can see the 429 transportation fee that Delina was talking about. And then you

921
01:20:34,680 --> 01:20:40,500
You can see the other components that we looked at last time in that kind of relative scale between fire,

922
01:20:40,680 --> 01:20:45,580
police, recreational city administration, and transportation fees.

923
01:20:46,040 --> 01:20:58,580
So, a man ripped in, if someone walks in and says you want to build a residence, and is it a fixed fee of $34,112, or does it depend on the dimensions of the structure?

924
01:20:58,580 --> 01:21:07,960
Exactly. It depends on the size. That was the state wanted it to be determined by size so the smaller units will now pay less and the larger units will pay more.

925
01:21:08,900 --> 01:21:13,780
Okay. And the maximum is going to be 34,112.

926
01:21:14,340 --> 01:21:22,040
No, that's just, that's for 2,500 square foot homes. So if you were to build a 5,000 square foot home, it would be more.

927
01:21:23,640 --> 01:21:30,260
So that's kind of in some ways those two technical studies coming together to show you the maximum amount.

928
01:21:30,920 --> 01:21:39,080
Here on the non-residential side you can see the kind of equivalent outcomes where you can see from industrial,

929
01:21:41,240 --> 01:21:43,380
industrial per square foot fee.

930
01:21:43,960 --> 01:21:47,300
I guess I'm starting one column over would be 825.

931
01:21:47,300 --> 01:21:52,100
and you can see the break down there between transportation and the other components.

932
01:21:52,740 --> 01:21:58,920
A retail would be $13.22, and an office would be $16.83.

933
01:22:00,080 --> 01:22:08,120
And then the hotel motel, we have it on our per room basis, that would be $11,800 per room.

934
01:22:08,400 --> 01:22:14,300
So those are the, you know, again, this is the technical analysis where we've done what,

935
01:22:14,300 --> 01:22:19,300
kind of the equivalent of what Danny was describing, put together capital improvement program

936
01:22:19,300 --> 01:22:24,500
plans, the development forecasts, recognize we can't charge new development for the existing

937
01:22:24,500 --> 01:22:33,680
development share. I think one of the last slides we have here is just to show you the overall change

938
01:22:34,300 --> 01:22:38,940
between if you would, if we adopt these fees the overall change between the existing

939
01:22:39,680 --> 01:22:46,340
and they're proposed and so you can see there are some, all the fees would increase,

940
01:22:46,540 --> 01:22:53,800
they would increase by different amounts based on this analysis we just conducted.

941
01:22:55,520 --> 01:23:04,340
And I think with that we now maybe move into discussion and yeah, questions all right.

942
01:23:04,340 --> 01:23:10,500
Okay. Council members, any questions, clarification questions, then we'll go to public comment.

943
01:23:13,050 --> 01:23:15,050
Okay, let's open for public comment, then.

944
01:23:16,690 --> 01:23:19,930
Anybody here in the community center tonight, like to?

945
01:23:20,370 --> 01:23:22,990
I mean, I'm happy to go comment. I do have several questions, but.

946
01:23:23,090 --> 01:23:24,410
Okay, well, okay.

947
01:23:25,010 --> 01:23:26,590
Sure. Council member gift.

948
01:23:28,050 --> 01:23:30,010
So, you're clarifying questions?

949
01:23:30,490 --> 01:23:31,830
Yeah, these are clarifying questions.

950
01:23:31,830 --> 01:23:38,450
So I'm looking at the agenda here, and on that first chart, it is kind of confusing.

951
01:23:39,550 --> 01:23:45,110
This isn't totally match up with the presentation, but under the summary of maximum capital facility,

952
01:23:45,690 --> 01:23:52,430
it outlines both per unit and per square foot, which while I understand that you're saying the state is starting per square foot,

953
01:23:52,770 --> 01:23:55,710
shouldn't that chart be updated?

954
01:23:59,350 --> 01:24:01,730
it's table one on my agenda.

955
01:24:04,710 --> 01:24:11,450
Let me see. You had it up at some point. Sorry to just dial

956
01:24:11,450 --> 01:24:15,210
down on something so specific for you but if you want to take a look at it. It's one of

957
01:24:15,210 --> 01:24:20,870
the very first table, table one. But it was not on there. It was on our agenda. Oh absolutely

958
01:24:27,450 --> 01:24:32,350
So, it's listing per unit and per square foot, but you're saying that the state is requiring

959
01:24:32,350 --> 01:24:33,110
per square foot.

960
01:24:36,830 --> 01:24:37,670
Yeah, exactly.

961
01:24:38,030 --> 01:24:43,850
So, in reality, the impact fee that scheduled you would adopt would be the right hand column

962
01:24:43,850 --> 01:24:45,050
with the per square foot.

963
01:24:45,510 --> 01:24:45,730
Okay.

964
01:24:46,150 --> 01:24:52,950
I was showing the per unit because that's in some ways it's where we do the analysis and come

965
01:24:52,950 --> 01:24:53,910
up with a per unit.

966
01:24:53,910 --> 01:24:58,270
And you are just basing that unit off the 2500 square foot.

967
01:24:58,770 --> 01:25:04,870
Yeah, well, so a lot of different, for example, a lot of the different demand factors are

968
01:25:04,870 --> 01:25:09,550
based on how many people per unit or how many trips per unit.

969
01:25:09,730 --> 01:25:14,570
So they kind of, you more naturally calculate a fee on a per unit basis because those are

970
01:25:14,570 --> 01:25:15,590
the kind of metrics you demand.

971
01:25:16,230 --> 01:25:23,230
But then, and so before the state passed AB 602 a couple of years ago, we would have just

972
01:25:23,230 --> 01:25:28,270
been presenting to you the left hand side of the per unit fee but now we have

973
01:25:28,270 --> 01:25:35,010
that on a per square foot basis so we dividing all of those by the 2500 so I was

974
01:25:35,010 --> 01:25:37,710
showing both of them but really what manages the one on the right.

975
01:25:37,890 --> 01:25:41,070
Great and that will be totally clear and what we're adopting here I'm sure.

976
01:25:42,710 --> 01:25:48,330
My next question then is specific to the applicability so if somebody is

977
01:25:48,330 --> 01:25:52,870
building a 2500 square foot home and then they're adding a 500 square foot

978
01:25:52,870 --> 01:25:59,690
garage, would it be based on 3,000 square foot, square feet, I mean, or would it just be

979
01:25:59,690 --> 01:26:02,950
the living space that this would be applied to?

980
01:26:03,250 --> 01:26:12,270
Yeah, so these fees apply to the living space, not garage spaces, so if you're building

981
01:26:12,270 --> 01:26:19,130
a brand new house, like your example, maybe a 3,000 square foot structure, but 2,500 is living

982
01:26:19,130 --> 01:26:21,630
that would be the, what the fees apply to.

983
01:26:21,930 --> 01:26:26,430
Okay, and then like something like a small expansion,

984
01:26:26,610 --> 01:26:29,570
like let's say a sunroom or just a small expansion

985
01:26:29,570 --> 01:26:32,750
on the home, would these fees be applicable to that as well?

986
01:26:33,870 --> 01:26:37,150
I mean, I think that is a policy question.

987
01:26:37,250 --> 01:26:37,430
Okay.

988
01:26:40,170 --> 01:26:43,590
And I've seen different cities do it different ways.

989
01:26:43,850 --> 01:26:44,970
Okay, I'll go back to staff on that.

990
01:26:45,050 --> 01:26:45,670
There's no problem.

991
01:26:45,670 --> 01:27:15,150
And then this might also be a policy question, but I'm not noticing, and it's really just for more public clarity and general information, because not, you know, people aren't paying attention into AB 68, for instance, we don't have the language that ADUs would only be paying this fee beyond the 750 square foot so that would that be more of a policy thing that we would need to adopt.

992
01:27:15,150 --> 01:27:19,090
I mean, that is, that is kind of state law.

993
01:27:19,370 --> 01:27:19,810
And so-

994
01:27:19,810 --> 01:27:21,130
Well, I mean, I understand that.

995
01:27:21,190 --> 01:27:22,370
I just mean that clarifying language.

996
01:27:22,710 --> 01:27:24,490
Yeah, we would need that, we would want to put that

997
01:27:24,490 --> 01:27:26,530
in your ordinance to make it clear.

998
01:27:27,950 --> 01:27:31,830
And if it isn't in our primary technical document,

999
01:27:31,990 --> 01:27:34,010
we can add that in there to make it clear.

1000
01:27:34,630 --> 01:27:35,610
Great, thank you so much.

1001
01:27:36,350 --> 01:27:36,530
Great.

1002
01:27:37,050 --> 01:27:38,170
Thank you, Council Member Giff.

1003
01:27:38,310 --> 01:27:38,810
Good questions.

1004
01:27:39,830 --> 01:27:40,730
Other council members?

1005
01:27:41,630 --> 01:27:43,210
Okay, let's go to public comment.

1006
01:27:43,890 --> 01:27:47,470
then? Yes, Mr. Wilkes.

1007
01:27:58,530 --> 01:28:02,050
Thank you. I would, Tim Wilkes, Cedar Street.

1008
01:28:03,040 --> 01:28:09,010
I would like to first say that I'm not here to speak on behalf of the planning commission.

1009
01:28:09,230 --> 01:28:12,330
I'm here just generally to ask a question.

1010
01:28:16,080 --> 01:28:22,000
Callostoga, in terms of infrastructure, we all know is just terribly broken.

1011
01:28:22,000 --> 01:28:30,020
And a lot of it from the fact of its age and a lot of it from decades of not paying attention.

1012
01:28:30,940 --> 01:28:37,020
And the question I would like to ask then is, are these new fees,

1013
01:28:37,020 --> 01:28:48,240
if you look at them and try to establish a nexus to what I will call a more not unusual city,

1014
01:28:48,240 --> 01:29:12,580
You know, a newer town and the establishment of these fees is then the builder of a new home here paying substantially more because he's building in a broken city or an injured city as opposed to if he's building somewhere else.

1015
01:29:12,580 --> 01:29:20,360
And if that is the case, then I think that we all know why middle income people can't afford to live in Calistoga.

1016
01:29:21,120 --> 01:29:36,440
But if that, if there is no nexus there, then it begs the question of, are we going to penalize future homes because the cities so broken?

1017
01:29:37,020 --> 01:29:37,800
That's my question.

1018
01:29:40,060 --> 01:29:40,780
Thank you, Mr. Wilkes.

1019
01:29:41,000 --> 01:29:41,660
Yeah, good question.

1020
01:29:41,660 --> 01:29:46,480
Anybody else like to offer public comment and

1021
01:29:50,350 --> 01:29:53,790
looks like, let's see, nobody online,

1022
01:29:55,210 --> 01:29:58,710
and anyone else on public comment on this issue.

1023
01:30:01,620 --> 01:30:02,260
Yes, sir.

1024
01:30:05,080 --> 01:30:33,140
Why first? I'm 31 years old, and I am fortunate to have something here, but a lot of my friends that went to school with Mr. Eisenberg, being a principal, are trying to have something here. And as we know, we already have a shortage of homes. Some people have the ability to try to build something, but just very quickly looking at that number on the residential side from a number going from

1025
01:30:33,140 --> 01:30:49,500
24 or $22,000 to $34,000, the $12,000 tax increase is substantial on residential and we're trying to make it easier to have home to your being people that are from here so only thing is just the cost increase.

1026
01:30:50,060 --> 01:30:50,580
Thank you.

1027
01:30:57,140 --> 01:30:58,580
Public comments still open?

1028
01:31:01,800 --> 01:31:04,880
Okay, let's close public comment and bring it back to council.

1029
01:31:04,880 --> 01:31:08,580
Council member gift, you have some further follow-up questions?

1030
01:31:08,860 --> 01:31:14,980
I do, but these are more for staff, so I don't know Laura if, or Greg, if you could maybe

1031
01:31:14,980 --> 01:31:18,040
help me with my additional questions here.

1032
01:31:18,180 --> 01:31:19,980
I'm pretty sure they're for staff.

1033
01:31:23,760 --> 01:31:29,860
So one thing I would like to suggest and maybe now is not the appropriate time or place,

1034
01:31:29,860 --> 01:31:34,480
it would probably be an amendment to the housing element in our general plan, but to

1035
01:31:34,480 --> 01:31:41,440
address some of the concerns in the room tonight. If you guys will remember I helped to implement

1036
01:31:41,440 --> 01:31:47,640
the affordable housing threshold to 160% of the AMI, but we don't really have a lot of

1037
01:31:47,640 --> 01:31:56,160
policy in place to utilize that threshold. One of my suggestions would be as with other

1038
01:31:56,160 --> 01:32:05,340
affordable housing that we make any projects exempt up to that 160% threshold so they wouldn't

1039
01:32:05,340 --> 01:32:09,300
be paying this fee which would again help encourage some of that missing middle.

1040
01:32:09,520 --> 01:32:15,860
So is now an appropriate time to address that or would I need to come back to yes?

1041
01:32:18,820 --> 01:32:24,240
Yes, so your question then would be how does this apply to affordable housing development projects?

1042
01:32:24,240 --> 01:32:29,760
I would like to because we already, because affordable housing is already exempt from

1043
01:32:29,760 --> 01:32:38,520
these fees as it stands, I would like to increase that threshold to projects up to 160% of

1044
01:32:38,520 --> 01:32:44,120
the AMI, which is currently in the housing element, but we don't really have a lot of language

1045
01:32:44,120 --> 01:32:47,620
to speak to how we're utilizing that.

1046
01:32:47,960 --> 01:32:52,360
So I think, so it would be appropriate tonight if the council wanted to give that direction,

1047
01:32:52,360 --> 01:32:57,320
that could be done tonight, that fits in with the Brown Act component of this item.

1048
01:32:57,580 --> 01:33:01,740
I think in terms of actually effectuating that in the language and not we would need

1049
01:33:01,740 --> 01:33:05,720
to go study it, and then bring that suggested change back.

1050
01:33:06,340 --> 01:33:06,480
Great.

1051
01:33:07,060 --> 01:33:09,500
So do I have support in increasing the-

1052
01:33:09,500 --> 01:33:09,860
Complete.

1053
01:33:10,180 --> 01:33:10,380
Yes.

1054
01:33:10,720 --> 01:33:12,280
I share why it's concerned-

1055
01:33:12,280 --> 01:33:12,700
Absolutely.

1056
01:33:13,040 --> 01:33:13,580
I'm not callous.

1057
01:33:13,660 --> 01:33:19,400
And this would help address hopefully down the road and building policy around that missing

1058
01:33:19,400 --> 01:33:20,980
middle which were all fighting so hard.

1059
01:33:20,980 --> 01:33:22,420
So that's what that's one item.

1060
01:33:22,580 --> 01:33:23,280
Thank you guys for this.

1061
01:33:23,480 --> 01:33:37,280
I clarify for me, so you're proposing that these fees be not applied to any affordable housing structure that is

1062
01:33:37,280 --> 01:33:41,820
that people up to under 60% of the-

1063
01:33:41,820 --> 01:33:43,140
Area median income.

1064
01:33:43,340 --> 01:33:43,860
The AMI.

1065
01:33:46,160 --> 01:33:49,460
So anybody applying for an affordable housing structure

1066
01:33:49,460 --> 01:33:55,040
and who has qualifies up to that under 60%

1067
01:33:55,740 --> 01:33:57,780
would be exempt from paying these fees.

1068
01:33:58,200 --> 01:33:58,400
Correct.

1069
01:33:59,140 --> 01:34:02,100
And it would be for all of the fees.

1070
01:34:03,780 --> 01:34:06,660
And we would be the equivalent

1071
01:34:06,660 --> 01:34:14,340
of the same exemptions that the rest of our affordable housing portfolio are receiving would be my suggestion.

1072
01:34:14,980 --> 01:34:17,540
And we would look at things like deed restrictions and stuff.

1073
01:34:17,640 --> 01:34:19,340
That's where we would need to go back and think about.

1074
01:34:19,540 --> 01:34:30,420
And absolutely. And as we know, just for conversations sake, most of the projects that are coming to us are receiving those tax credits and receiving that federal funding,

1075
01:34:30,420 --> 01:34:42,880
And up to like 80% may be 120% of the AMI, so what we didn't expanding it from 160 was create our own local threshold.

1076
01:34:43,160 --> 01:34:48,920
But now these are different ways that we can help incentivize those builds down the road, hopefully.

1077
01:34:49,660 --> 01:34:55,060
So it looks, however, like these fees or these costs will have to be incurred and carried by somebody.

1078
01:34:55,060 --> 01:35:00,820
So can those costs be taken from the Affordable Housing Fund?

1079
01:35:01,180 --> 01:35:10,200
Can the money be taken from there to subsidize, to replace the amount that's exempted as suggested?

1080
01:35:12,500 --> 01:35:24,800
The way mentioned, it seems like it could, but it also could be that these fees are all based on the capital improvement projects that staff have presented to the consultants.

1081
01:35:24,800 --> 01:35:29,740
that we anticipate needing in this city over the span of 20 years.

1082
01:35:29,940 --> 01:35:35,240
So it may be also that we revisit what some of those improvement projects are.

1083
01:35:35,420 --> 01:35:38,360
And when I talk about capital, it's not capital improvement projects.

1084
01:35:38,820 --> 01:35:43,600
It's facilities that this city is going to need to provide.

1085
01:35:44,020 --> 01:35:50,940
And when I mention facilities, it's not specific to structures, but it's also vehicles and so forth.

1086
01:35:50,940 --> 01:36:04,540
So it may be a combo of utilizing measured defense and also looking at ways are revisiting that list of wish list items that the city is looking for that we can.

1087
01:36:05,020 --> 01:36:10,780
So you're suggesting that maybe all those items on the capital improvement list may not be need to be undertaken?

1088
01:36:11,940 --> 01:36:16,180
It's a, you know, it's something that we need to bring back to you and have you guys confirm.

1089
01:36:16,180 --> 01:36:23,500
Or that not necessarily they wouldn't need to be because we've already reduced the list of them, but that we just might not be able to potentially.

1090
01:36:24,580 --> 01:36:35,540
I would say, you know, what is the most important concern is it to provide housing for the missing middle, or is it to extend some of the capital improvement projects down the road a little ways to that end?

1091
01:36:35,540 --> 01:36:40,640
You know what is our priorities in town and I agree with Councilwoman Giff that you know

1092
01:36:40,640 --> 01:36:46,720
We need to really focus on providing the means for the the middle income people here in town to build homes

1093
01:36:46,720 --> 01:36:51,460
I think that this worth compromising potentially and just to clarify this kept to this council

1094
01:36:51,460 --> 01:36:54,380
We don't have people running to our gates to build

1095
01:36:55,420 --> 01:36:56,880
Housing to that 160

1096
01:36:57,500 --> 01:37:03,080
Present AMI this is a really unique position that we're in and I'm looking to our neighbors like Hildsburg for instance

1097
01:37:03,080 --> 01:37:05,700
since that has adopted a similar threshold,

1098
01:37:05,800 --> 01:37:08,220
but is struggling with getting that development.

1099
01:37:08,680 --> 01:37:11,200
And so we wouldn't be building 100 houses overnight.

1100
01:37:11,420 --> 01:37:15,480
And these fees for this mystical person

1101
01:37:15,480 --> 01:37:18,620
who's building a 2,500 square foot house,

1102
01:37:19,160 --> 01:37:24,040
which very few of us live in, they're

1103
01:37:24,040 --> 01:37:27,800
not going to be paying that huge amount.

1104
01:37:28,400 --> 01:37:30,800
And in relation to what they're doing,

1105
01:37:30,880 --> 01:37:32,560
if you come in here to Calistoga,

1106
01:37:32,560 --> 01:37:34,680
You're building a $2 million house.

1107
01:37:35,220 --> 01:37:40,080
The addition in fees is not a significant part of your building costs.

1108
01:37:41,280 --> 01:37:50,260
So I think Councilmember Giff's idea is a wonderful way to target where the need is and

1109
01:37:50,260 --> 01:37:59,140
allow the fees to proceed where they are for the people who come to build very expensive

1110
01:37:59,140 --> 01:37:59,700
homes.

1111
01:37:59,700 --> 01:38:06,520
those aren't the homes that are going to fit into people at 160%.

1112
01:38:06,980 --> 01:38:14,180
They're going to be 1,200 square foot houses at the best.

1113
01:38:16,700 --> 01:38:20,300
So I concur with your suggestion, and

1114
01:38:20,300 --> 01:38:26,760
I don't think we should worry so much about the increase in fees for

1115
01:38:26,760 --> 01:38:37,420
or the larger, much larger homes that the 2500 square foot sample that the calculation was taken from.

1116
01:38:37,960 --> 01:38:46,400
I do have a question about our fees in relation to similar communities.

1117
01:38:46,600 --> 01:38:49,460
This is a bit in reference to Mr. Wilkes' concern.

1118
01:38:50,450 --> 01:38:54,880
I understand that you're building the fees out of what we need to do.

1119
01:38:54,880 --> 01:39:00,780
which does is a factor in our infrastructure needs.

1120
01:39:01,480 --> 01:39:06,500
But after you do that, where are we with similar cities?

1121
01:39:07,160 --> 01:39:16,800
Where are we in the big picture in the North Bay on the fees?

1122
01:39:20,960 --> 01:39:28,040
So, let's see, so we did, we did compare and perhaps Typhians a better person to answer

1123
01:39:28,040 --> 01:39:33,460
this, but we did look at, you know, what St. Lena is doing and our fees are higher than

1124
01:39:33,460 --> 01:39:34,820
what St. Lena's are doing.

1125
01:39:35,480 --> 01:39:45,880
The one thing that's important to note is that we haven't done this study for 10 years.

1126
01:39:45,880 --> 01:39:54,050
So, it's out of date by a couple of years and going back to the relationship between what

1127
01:39:54,050 --> 01:39:59,610
Kalastoga's fees are and what's insanely nice are, you know, the fees are higher, but

1128
01:39:59,610 --> 01:40:04,890
you know, we didn't do an analysis on what their wish list was for the next 20 years.

1129
01:40:05,190 --> 01:40:09,750
So it's going to be different because what their wish list is very much, probably very much

1130
01:40:09,750 --> 01:40:10,650
different than what we are.

1131
01:40:10,650 --> 01:40:16,750
But I don't know if that's enough, but I wanted to elaborate on that, be helpful.

1132
01:40:17,070 --> 01:40:23,470
Yeah, I just wanted to add, so there is a, like you're suggesting, there's kind of a variation.

1133
01:40:23,750 --> 01:40:26,570
Every city develops its own capital improvement list, right?

1134
01:40:26,690 --> 01:40:31,010
They end up with different, they have different bases of new development that are occurring.

1135
01:40:31,790 --> 01:40:36,190
I did look into more detail into St. Helena's fees, which we're interesting.

1136
01:40:36,190 --> 01:40:41,590
up until two years ago, they had fees that were considered higher than yours.

1137
01:40:42,130 --> 01:40:50,130
They did a refresh, and they determined that what they needed was not a lot less than

1138
01:40:50,130 --> 01:40:52,170
what they had previously envisioned.

1139
01:40:52,410 --> 01:40:54,930
So they brought their fees a fairways down.

1140
01:40:56,190 --> 01:41:01,150
So there, for a long time, they've had fees well above your existing fees.

1141
01:41:01,790 --> 01:41:03,210
Now their fees are below.

1142
01:41:03,850 --> 01:41:22,310
And so I think that obviously is I wasn't in the room when they were discussing that, but they clearly determined that either they've built much of what they want to build or they specifically chose not to fund projects with impact fees.

1143
01:41:22,310 --> 01:41:36,490
So anyway, so that's that's the that's a central even story there are I think we I think we can look at different fees some fees some communities would have fees above yours or parks but below yours for please and fire they kind of very

1144
01:41:37,510 --> 01:41:38,430
Fair amount

1145
01:41:39,350 --> 01:41:42,850
Yeah, that was just a couple of additional notes.

1146
01:41:43,850 --> 01:41:52,790
Would it be, Director Desmond, would it be onerous to project approximate costs of a change

1147
01:41:52,790 --> 01:41:54,470
that the council is interested in?

1148
01:41:56,230 --> 01:42:03,630
There would be, how much more we would collect, the city would collect if the fees were in

1149
01:42:03,630 --> 01:42:19,710
in place as proposed here, compared to how much revenue would be accumulated if those units were exempted.

1150
01:42:21,390 --> 01:42:23,350
Is that difficult to compute or?

1151
01:42:23,430 --> 01:42:32,730
I couldn't compute that at this time and I doubt Typhion could either or I don't know if we'd have to make a,

1152
01:42:32,730 --> 01:42:34,090
You could run scenarios, right?

1153
01:42:34,350 --> 01:42:41,950
So you were projecting about 450 new units in Callis Doga over the next 20 years, and so

1154
01:42:42,550 --> 01:42:47,530
we would have to make a guess of, this Councilman was mentioning, it's a little hard to know

1155
01:42:47,530 --> 01:42:51,950
exactly how much it's going to be billed, but so you could say, what if 50 of those were

1156
01:42:52,590 --> 01:42:56,470
fell in that bucket, what would we lose, but not with certainty?

1157
01:42:57,230 --> 01:42:57,450
Okay.

1158
01:42:57,930 --> 01:43:01,450
Sound like the Council is interested in this change that Councilmember would give to suggest

1159
01:43:01,450 --> 01:43:01,750
it?

1160
01:43:03,830 --> 01:43:15,470
I think these might be more staff specific, though, but I'm just curious for staff, is there a cost center for the admin fees associated with this?

1161
01:43:15,570 --> 01:43:16,910
Like, where are they showing up in the budget?

1162
01:43:18,750 --> 01:43:19,270
Yeah.

1163
01:43:23,120 --> 01:43:24,840
I'm not sure I understand the question.

1164
01:43:24,940 --> 01:43:25,260
I'm sorry.

1165
01:43:27,160 --> 01:43:30,660
So, the administrative fee that is on, let me...

1166
01:43:32,930 --> 01:43:39,570
Yeah, so what we charging are we put in a 2% percent yeah, and that's I think the questions when that goes right yeah

1167
01:43:39,570 --> 01:43:44,610
Where does it go so is there a cost center for it? I mean does this need to be codified like all of our other fees

1168
01:43:44,610 --> 01:43:48,110
Like is it going to fall under our development impact fees?

1169
01:43:48,690 --> 01:43:51,530
Where are we going to thank you? Thank you so much

1170
01:43:51,530 --> 01:43:55,910
And that is reported in the AB 1600 report that was adopted in December

1171
01:43:55,910 --> 01:43:59,130
Okay, every year you will see a balance of the

1172
01:43:59,130 --> 01:44:02,210
to develop an impact fees and what they're going to be used for.

1173
01:44:02,430 --> 01:44:04,410
But in the admin fee specifically.

1174
01:44:04,690 --> 01:44:04,830
Yes.

1175
01:44:05,110 --> 01:44:05,270
Okay.

1176
01:44:05,510 --> 01:44:05,650
Great.

1177
01:44:05,770 --> 01:44:06,450
Thank you so much.

1178
01:44:06,910 --> 01:44:08,030
And those are all my questions.

1179
01:44:08,230 --> 01:44:08,490
Thank you.

1180
01:44:08,550 --> 01:44:08,730
That's it.

1181
01:44:08,930 --> 01:44:09,110
Okay.

1182
01:44:09,890 --> 01:44:11,030
And then follow up questions.

1183
01:44:11,370 --> 01:44:19,210
So if this, supposing we adopt this schedule as it's proposed, how long, you know, are

1184
01:44:19,210 --> 01:44:22,470
these numbers applicable, you know, cost change in a year from now?

1185
01:44:22,470 --> 01:44:23,930
They're going to be different in two years.

1186
01:44:23,930 --> 01:44:35,850
and so it's been 10 years and are they fixed, you know, these numbers fixed and then, or can the CPI, the cost of living be applied to them?

1187
01:44:36,350 --> 01:44:40,170
How often do we have to call you back to justify these fees?

1188
01:44:41,350 --> 01:44:48,130
So yeah, so I think you I guess two points one is you do have the option of having an annual CPI index

1189
01:44:48,130 --> 01:44:52,850
Which is what a lot of cities do and is generally seen as advisable right just to keep up with inflation

1190
01:44:53,850 --> 01:44:59,970
And then you know the last time we did this was about 10 years ago there used to be some flexibility but

1191
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:28,560
Now the new AB 602 says you need to take a more detailed look, at least every eight years. So you don't have to see me or anybody else like me for eight years if you don't want to, but at that point you, you would need someone else to come back in and look at your next study in more detail just to see how it's all panning out. And if you add to that answer, you couldn't beyond what in ordinance adopts it with this next study, providing the basis for it, you couldn't ever go above that.

1192
01:45:29,180 --> 01:45:32,460
You could, without doing another nexus study.

1193
01:45:32,720 --> 01:45:35,540
But could the CPI be applied to it?

1194
01:45:35,540 --> 01:45:35,700
Yeah.

1195
01:45:36,420 --> 01:45:37,420
Above the...

1196
01:45:37,420 --> 01:45:39,000
Yeah, but it doesn't, I was just looking at it.

1197
01:45:39,100 --> 01:45:40,720
It doesn't look to me like we have,

1198
01:45:41,320 --> 01:45:43,960
it doesn't look to me like we have incorporated the CPI

1199
01:45:43,960 --> 01:45:46,280
just in our, in our resolution.

1200
01:45:48,300 --> 01:45:51,400
So could that option be incorporated into this

1201
01:45:51,400 --> 01:45:53,560
and the council could exercise it or not?

1202
01:45:55,340 --> 01:45:56,500
As the years go by?

1203
01:45:57,460 --> 01:45:58,720
Yeah, I think I've seen so.

1204
01:45:58,720 --> 01:45:59,480
Oh wait, here we go.

1205
01:45:59,620 --> 01:45:59,960
I'm sorry.

1206
01:46:00,320 --> 01:46:00,860
So adjustments.

1207
01:46:01,160 --> 01:46:02,540
Are you reading this and you're not reading something?

1208
01:46:02,740 --> 01:46:02,880
Okay.

1209
01:46:03,940 --> 01:46:04,820
Any fee,

1210
01:46:08,950 --> 01:46:10,650
I take that back.

1211
01:46:11,170 --> 01:46:13,150
We can adjust them.

1212
01:46:14,170 --> 01:46:15,170
It is in the ordinance.

1213
01:46:15,170 --> 01:46:16,050
We can adjust them.

1214
01:46:16,570 --> 01:46:16,850
Okay.

1215
01:46:17,030 --> 01:46:18,830
So it's not exactly by the CPI.

1216
01:46:18,990 --> 01:46:20,410
It's much more complicated than that.

1217
01:46:20,630 --> 01:46:22,670
But there could be an annual adjustment, yes.

1218
01:46:23,310 --> 01:46:23,730
Okay.

1219
01:46:25,250 --> 01:46:28,850
And so that's filled into this proposal that we're contemplating.

1220
01:46:28,850 --> 01:46:39,730
Yes, it's going to refer to the engineering news record, US 20, city's average construction cost index for June, proceeding the increase one year prior there too.

1221
01:46:40,090 --> 01:46:49,970
And do I understand supposing the council wants to exempt affordable housing at this time, but three years from now it doesn't want to exempt them.

1222
01:46:50,070 --> 01:46:53,150
Can that be changed, being made as well, that a council decision at the time?

1223
01:46:53,150 --> 01:46:58,350
I mean, I think it depends on how you write the ordinance.

1224
01:46:58,350 --> 01:47:00,350
I think we would need legal advice on that.

1225
01:47:01,210 --> 01:47:01,310
That's it.

1226
01:47:01,630 --> 01:47:01,830
All right.

1227
01:47:02,330 --> 01:47:04,730
So that's an internal to Calistoga then.

1228
01:47:06,800 --> 01:47:07,220
Yes.

1229
01:47:08,060 --> 01:47:08,220
Yes.

1230
01:47:08,500 --> 01:47:09,060
Quick question.

1231
01:47:09,760 --> 01:47:18,360
Implementing these new fees, it will affect the current projects that they are on the

1232
01:47:18,360 --> 01:47:24,420
works like, for example, the yellow rose of projects that we just talk, it depends.

1233
01:47:26,040 --> 01:47:26,480
Okay.

1234
01:47:27,860 --> 01:47:32,500
I'm not aware that if they have a development agreement or not, if they do, then their

1235
01:47:32,500 --> 01:47:36,240
fees are locked into the time at which that development agreement was approved.

1236
01:47:36,720 --> 01:47:37,060
Okay.

1237
01:47:37,480 --> 01:47:47,960
So it's for future, it's not like if a project already has an agreement, it will not affect

1238
01:47:51,020 --> 01:47:54,280
So this would be for projects moving forward.

1239
01:47:54,660 --> 01:48:00,840
But anything already entitled would be under the previous, pretty much.

1240
01:48:01,000 --> 01:48:04,940
It's complicated, but absolutely sort of, yes, yes.

1241
01:48:05,300 --> 01:48:06,120
Councillor McCoofer.

1242
01:48:06,300 --> 01:48:07,140
Yeah, one last question.

1243
01:48:07,320 --> 01:48:11,880
If we do end up running the calculations on the last revenue of exempting the 160 AMI,

1244
01:48:12,040 --> 01:48:17,440
can we also project forward with the potential to recover that last revenue on increasing the

1245
01:48:17,440 --> 01:48:22,260
fees to some degree for the others, that makes sense.

1246
01:48:22,720 --> 01:48:24,620
If we're going to run that assumption of calculation,

1247
01:48:25,420 --> 01:48:28,480
we figure out what that loss revenue figure is by making that exemption.

1248
01:48:28,980 --> 01:48:33,680
Can we then calculate how much we need to increase the fees to recover that across the board?

1249
01:48:34,540 --> 01:48:41,500
So we wouldn't, I guess the equivalent, right, the loss revenue we would need to recover from somewhere.

1250
01:48:42,300 --> 01:48:47,100
But when you're not allowed to recover it from like increasing the fees, right?

1251
01:48:47,100 --> 01:48:48,520
We've already established a maximum.

1252
01:48:50,890 --> 01:48:51,220
Okay.

1253
01:48:51,840 --> 01:48:58,200
So do I understand council that we want to ask staff to bring this back to us with the rewritten

1254
01:48:59,600 --> 01:49:05,900
provision that has projects up to 160% of the AMI be exempt?

1255
01:49:06,120 --> 01:49:10,500
I would highly recommend that you go ahead and introduce this, move this forward

1256
01:49:10,500 --> 01:49:17,460
and incorporate into a motion and direct us to look into how we can do this and to bring

1257
01:49:17,460 --> 01:49:25,680
it back as soon as possible with that modification. I just get more and more nervous that a decade

1258
01:49:25,680 --> 01:49:32,740
has already gone by and we may have some larger projects that we would like to capture.

1259
01:49:32,740 --> 01:49:41,600
So let's see. I'll take a stab at this. Council correct me if I'm going straight. I'll

1260
01:49:41,600 --> 01:49:48,840
make a motion that we approve this with the condition that staff modifies it to exempt

1261
01:49:49,900 --> 01:49:57,960
units, affordable units, which are up to the 160% AMI threshold.

1262
01:49:57,960 --> 01:50:04,190
Can I make a suggestion based on what I think I'm hearing the Council intent is?

1263
01:50:04,730 --> 01:50:09,870
I think what I'm hearing is to adopt the resolution as presented.

1264
01:50:10,270 --> 01:50:17,030
In addition, look at how we can incorporate exemptions up to 160 per cent for affordable

1265
01:50:17,030 --> 01:50:21,890
health, for middle income housing units, and bring that back.

1266
01:50:23,910 --> 01:50:31,570
Okay, so that way we are sure that if there is a new project that is coming in the future

1267
01:50:32,570 --> 01:50:37,210
They will be we will cut these fancy cures. I mean this

1268
01:50:37,210 --> 01:50:43,110
Feast secure. I'm comfortable with that and knowing how I operate. I won't forget it. So

1269
01:50:44,550 --> 01:50:50,010
Okay, all right, so there's a motion second. Well, second. Thank you

1270
01:50:51,930 --> 01:50:52,890
Councillor Cidiclurk.

1271
01:50:55,430 --> 01:50:56,390
Councilmember Eisenberg.

1272
01:50:56,710 --> 01:50:56,850
Aye.

1273
01:50:58,050 --> 01:50:58,850
Councilmember Cooper.

1274
01:50:59,110 --> 01:50:59,290
Aye.

1275
01:50:59,930 --> 01:51:00,550
Councilmember Gift.

1276
01:51:00,830 --> 01:51:00,970
Aye.

1277
01:51:01,450 --> 01:51:02,570
Vice Mayor Lopez Roteca.

1278
01:51:02,810 --> 01:51:02,950
Aye.

1279
01:51:03,570 --> 01:51:04,110
And Mayor Williams.

1280
01:51:04,510 --> 01:51:04,610
Aye.

1281
01:51:05,290 --> 01:51:05,610
Thank you.

1282
01:51:05,890 --> 01:51:09,210
Thank you for coming and visiting and working with us tonight.

1283
01:51:09,430 --> 01:51:11,650
And thank you, Dalyne, for your help.

1284
01:51:12,150 --> 01:51:17,210
And just to kind of set some expectations, I'll need to work with Director Desmond on what

1285
01:51:17,210 --> 01:51:19,290
you're asking for is fairly complicated.

1286
01:51:19,290 --> 01:51:23,650
I know it sounds simple, but it's actually fairly complicated in terms of the language

1287
01:51:23,650 --> 01:51:26,670
and the things that need to get considered to fold into the whole package.

1288
01:51:28,010 --> 01:51:32,630
And so I want to, we're going to need some time to let you know when we could come back

1289
01:51:32,630 --> 01:51:33,470
with any changes.

1290
01:51:34,110 --> 01:51:34,570
That's okay.

1291
01:51:34,730 --> 01:51:38,150
I'll follow up in an email with all the things you talked about.

1292
01:51:38,150 --> 01:51:38,390
Okay.

1293
01:51:39,010 --> 01:51:39,550
Thank you.

1294
01:51:39,890 --> 01:51:41,610
Thank you, Director Desmond, for your help on this.

1295
01:51:43,850 --> 01:51:44,150
Let's see.

1296
01:51:44,330 --> 01:51:47,070
We're on to the category of general government.

1297
01:51:48,890 --> 01:51:52,850
So here, I'm sorry, I'm asking for indulgence one more time.

1298
01:51:53,830 --> 01:51:58,930
If we could try and quickly address, at least while we have a representative here from

1299
01:51:58,930 --> 01:52:07,170
NVTA to address item 7.3 about renewal of the shuttle agreement, we are about to lose

1300
01:52:07,710 --> 01:52:12,310
a representative who might be able to answer some pertinent questions since she's going

1301
01:52:12,310 --> 01:52:12,930
to take the bus.

1302
01:52:12,930 --> 01:52:15,290
Okay. All right, very good.

1303
01:52:16,490 --> 01:52:20,170
So let's see, so we're going to item 7.3.

1304
01:52:20,950 --> 01:52:29,070
The subject here is the Napa Valley Transportation Authority Shuttle Services and Assistant City Manager.

1305
01:52:29,650 --> 01:52:30,110
Welcome.

1306
01:52:31,070 --> 01:52:34,930
Thank you very much and I'm going to move this quickly along because we do have a tight time for him.

1307
01:52:34,970 --> 01:52:38,230
She needs to catch her bus and leave here by 810.

1308
01:52:39,050 --> 01:52:46,290
So we thought by eight, so I thought we had seven minutes, but a couple more than that, so that's why I'm going to keep my porch short.

1309
01:52:47,170 --> 01:52:51,370
And this was brought in front of you on January 14th.

1310
01:52:51,830 --> 01:52:54,050
Unfortunately, I was sick and not here to shop at this along.

1311
01:52:55,890 --> 01:52:59,970
During that being brought forward, there were two issues or concerns that got brought up.

1312
01:53:00,270 --> 01:53:03,510
One was about some stops at NVTA.

1313
01:53:03,510 --> 01:53:08,610
There was a belief that it wasn't making at the Highlands Church area.

1314
01:53:09,670 --> 01:53:18,690
Part of the current agreement and the proposed agreement, it allows upon mutually agreed upon between NVTA and the city to make changes in the routes and things like that.

1315
01:53:18,850 --> 01:53:19,550
And that has been done.

1316
01:53:19,950 --> 01:53:23,550
So the issue regarding being able to drop off at Highlands Church has been resolved.

1317
01:53:24,010 --> 01:53:26,830
That is now a viable stop to be able to drop people off.

1318
01:53:27,330 --> 01:53:27,850
Thank you.

1319
01:53:27,850 --> 01:53:38,850
The second issue that came up had to do with a came up from council regarding electric shuttle buses and where we are with that and so I'm not going to give a summary I'm going to allow

1320
01:53:39,790 --> 01:53:49,690
Rebecca Shank she is the NVTA program manager for transit and ADA compliance to come up and answer any questions the question that you had regarding that.

1321
01:53:50,030 --> 01:53:50,590
Thank you.

1322
01:53:52,260 --> 01:53:55,340
Miss Shank thank you for joining us nice to see you at Valley here.

1323
01:53:55,340 --> 01:54:03,800
So, yes, on the electric vehicle front, so there was, there is some history to this in

1324
01:54:03,800 --> 01:54:08,980
that NVTA did acquire, if you're familiar with St. Helena or with Yantville, on a 30-foot

1325
01:54:08,980 --> 01:54:16,540
electric vehicle with a grant that we had in the 2022 time frame, and we deployed those.

1326
01:54:16,840 --> 01:54:21,020
At that time, when we had gone for that grant in 2017, we asked kind of the question to

1327
01:54:21,020 --> 01:54:26,280
Calistoga Council at that time if they would also like to be included in that particular

1328
01:54:26,280 --> 01:54:30,580
grant application that the time and the thinking was and I think it makes some sense was

1329
01:54:30,580 --> 01:54:36,220
that that vehicle was too large to serve as Calistoga and the mobile homes the way that you

1330
01:54:36,220 --> 01:54:42,560
wanted to. So since that time, right, there's been some evolution in the electric vehicle market

1331
01:54:42,560 --> 01:54:48,220
and there is one vehicle now that's approved by the Federal Transit Administration that's closer

1332
01:54:48,220 --> 01:54:52,160
sort of 23 feet long that could be used in your jurisdiction.

1333
01:54:52,920 --> 01:54:57,800
So what we're looking at doing is you'll get a replacement diesel vehicle because we had

1334
01:54:57,800 --> 01:55:01,700
made an application for that in the 2022 timeframe.

1335
01:55:02,280 --> 01:55:03,300
That will be the replacement.

1336
01:55:03,520 --> 01:55:10,120
At the same time, whenever this particular grant called 5310 opens up in July, we would apply

1337
01:55:10,120 --> 01:55:14,320
for that to get to or one or two, I guess you could make that decision.

1338
01:55:16,000 --> 01:55:19,000
Calistoga vehicles that would be 23 foot would be electric.

1339
01:55:19,240 --> 01:55:25,340
At the same time, we've been working with your public works department to identify a place to charge, because we need a location here.

1340
01:55:25,640 --> 01:55:31,520
We can't be going back down to Napa to charge, and we've worked with in Yantville and

1341
01:55:31,520 --> 01:55:37,000
St. Helena, they have charging locations so we would maybe work in your public works yard to install a charger.

1342
01:55:37,300 --> 01:55:42,580
So that also has a relatively long time frame, and we would work on that at the same time as the grant.

1343
01:55:42,580 --> 01:55:46,760
So it would be one of these things we'd apply for the grant and basically in a three-year

1344
01:55:46,760 --> 01:55:50,220
period, if we received the grant, you would have the vehicle because they built them

1345
01:55:50,220 --> 01:55:51,640
to scratch and the charger.

1346
01:55:52,200 --> 01:55:57,100
But nothing in this agreement, I guess, yeah, precludes electric vehicle, non-electric vehicle,

1347
01:55:57,200 --> 01:55:57,600
et cetera.

1348
01:55:57,640 --> 01:55:59,020
It's all about kind of operations.

1349
01:56:00,160 --> 01:56:05,520
So it sounds so will the calisogal be eligible to receive or would we replace the diesel vehicle

1350
01:56:05,520 --> 01:56:06,680
with the electric one?

1351
01:56:07,140 --> 01:56:10,680
So what we would end up doing, it will be branded for calisogas.

1352
01:56:10,680 --> 01:56:16,300
So what would happen is we would say, hey, we have these other vehicles in our fleet that need to be replaced, right?

1353
01:56:16,460 --> 01:56:18,960
And so we'd put those ones up in our grant agreement.

1354
01:56:19,260 --> 01:56:22,940
We'd replace them with the electric vehicle, but we'd just do a swap, right?

1355
01:56:23,100 --> 01:56:30,000
We'd take the Callistoga diesel vehicle, we'd rebrand it as our vine-go vehicle, and no one's worth for wear.

1356
01:56:30,300 --> 01:56:34,640
So considerably on this outline within three years,

1357
01:56:35,240 --> 01:56:38,300
Callistoga may have an electric shuttle available.

1358
01:56:38,300 --> 01:56:45,720
Yeah, and we would let you know when we apply and then we'll let you know the results of that we've had some success in the past with this particular program

1359
01:56:45,720 --> 01:56:50,460
So we will see if we luck out again great council members questions

1360
01:56:52,480 --> 01:56:58,730
This is a public any public comment here or online

1361
01:57:00,410 --> 01:57:08,410
Okay, let's close public comment and no further questions. Let's bring it back to council and the other comments here

1362
01:57:09,010 --> 01:57:17,350
All right, then let's make a motion, let's have a motion to approve this to adopt the resolution is what we're looking at here

1363
01:57:17,350 --> 01:57:25,430
Is there a motion for that? I move to adopt the resolution. Thank you councillor Eisenberg. We have a second by Councilman the Councilwoman gift and all in favor

1364
01:57:25,890 --> 01:57:34,090
Aye. Opposed? It passes unanimously. Thank you for coming up here and thank you for awaiting on this item.

1365
01:57:35,410 --> 01:57:45,330
Thank you for that indulgence, and thank you to the county staff who are here for the next item for waiting through those changes.

1366
01:57:46,070 --> 01:57:48,010
So we're on 7.1.

1367
01:57:52,740 --> 01:57:53,560
Good evening, Council.

1368
01:57:53,900 --> 01:58:04,160
We will be having a couple of presentations from County of Napa, from Tracy Schultz about money in and it's regarding the property taxes and the VLF swap.

1369
01:58:07,110 --> 01:58:07,830
Okay, welcome.

1370
01:58:07,830 --> 01:58:12,910
Good evening. Thank you. My name is Tracy Shulzi. I'm your Napa County

1371
01:58:12,910 --> 01:58:16,930
Otter Controller and with me is Bob Minahan, our Treasurer Tax Collector. We're

1372
01:58:16,930 --> 01:58:22,170
here to talk about our riveting property tax. So we're just going to make this

1373
01:58:22,170 --> 01:58:26,930
exciting for everybody in the audience here. So we've been doing this together

1374
01:58:26,930 --> 01:58:34,210
for about 17 years. He was the assistant in my office for about 13 years before we

1375
01:58:34,210 --> 01:58:36,470
can't property tax or treasure tax collector.

1376
01:58:37,070 --> 01:58:38,530
And so he's very familiar with this.

1377
01:58:38,730 --> 01:58:40,470
So when it gets complicated, I give it to him.

1378
01:58:41,270 --> 01:58:43,790
So I'm just going to go over a high level overview

1379
01:58:43,790 --> 01:58:47,730
of property tax and unraveling the puzzle

1380
01:58:47,730 --> 01:58:49,330
of what property tax is.

1381
01:58:49,830 --> 01:58:52,050
We'll talk about your budget, just an overview.

1382
01:58:52,270 --> 01:58:53,910
You know your budget much better than I do.

1383
01:58:54,690 --> 01:58:58,530
How we get to where we're at with property tax, what our estimates

1384
01:58:58,530 --> 01:59:00,870
are for property tax for $24.25.

1385
01:59:01,450 --> 01:59:03,030
And then we get into the fun stuff.

1386
01:59:03,030 --> 01:59:09,490
ERAF, Education Revenue Augmentation Fund, VLF, which is vehicle license fees and then

1387
01:59:09,490 --> 01:59:10,390
we'll do some review.

1388
01:59:11,830 --> 01:59:13,370
So just a high-level overview.

1389
01:59:13,770 --> 01:59:17,470
This is your major revenue categories for your general fund.

1390
01:59:18,050 --> 01:59:22,110
So this is your discretionary, mostly discretionary dollars that you have.

1391
01:59:22,590 --> 01:59:25,930
So this came from your Adapt to 2425 budget.

1392
01:59:26,350 --> 01:59:31,210
You have approximately 20 million dollars and you can see the majority of your budget or

1393
01:59:31,210 --> 01:59:36,370
you revenues discretionary dollars which can be used for general services is about $12 million

1394
01:59:36,370 --> 01:59:41,970
from your transient occupancy tax. Congratulations because that's a great number. You'll be young

1395
01:59:41,970 --> 01:59:49,870
film. And then we go into the next highest which is property taxes, about 3 million. And then

1396
01:59:49,870 --> 01:59:58,370
your other discretionary is your sales tax and your charge for services offset the fees for services

1397
01:59:58,370 --> 01:59:59,970
is that you already, um...

1398
02:00:00,000 --> 02:00:29,880
I have the expenses for. You get state and federal and other government revenues there for probably program, grant revenues that you do. And then there's other, which is like miscellaneous, like interest earnings and rental fees and things like that. Your major expenditures of what these funds all are spent on is a pretty, pretty well balanced graph here. And you can see that the majority of your discretionary revenue and

1399
02:00:29,880 --> 02:00:34,440
And again, this is discretionary, meaning it's your monies that you decide how to use

1400
02:00:34,440 --> 02:00:39,080
for general community service that you provide in the city.

1401
02:00:39,720 --> 02:00:44,540
You can see the biggest pieces of police and fire, so public safety, which is very common.

1402
02:00:44,760 --> 02:00:45,680
It's what we do.

1403
02:00:46,680 --> 02:00:51,540
Public works, parks and recreation, administrative and general government, community development,

1404
02:00:51,740 --> 02:00:56,080
and then those transfers are things in between different funds based on governmental accounting

1405
02:00:56,080 --> 02:00:56,380
rules.

1406
02:00:57,100 --> 02:00:57,960
Any questions?

1407
02:00:58,240 --> 02:00:58,820
Is this familiar?

1408
02:00:58,820 --> 02:01:14,740
Okay. So starting into property tax, how did we get here? Well, we had pre in 1978, we were under a pre-proctor 13 tax levy way of creating property taxes.

1409
02:01:15,000 --> 02:01:24,880
So everybody would submit their budgets and we would determine at that time how much we had a levy on everybody's property in order to make our budget revenues whole.

1410
02:01:24,880 --> 02:01:32,740
In 1978, we had prop 13, which limited the property tax to 1% of your assessed value.

1411
02:01:33,600 --> 02:01:39,860
So the components of prop 13, again passing in 1978, and instead of that levy, we restricted

1412
02:01:39,860 --> 02:01:47,000
the property tax to 1% of assessed valuation as of the 1975 lean date.

1413
02:01:47,200 --> 02:01:51,400
So this went back to 1975, what the assessed values were at that time.

1414
02:01:51,400 --> 02:01:58,740
It limited annual assess valuation to the lesser of 2% or your consumer price index of CPI.

1415
02:01:59,820 --> 02:02:02,380
We have what's called a portion of factors.

1416
02:02:02,880 --> 02:02:06,740
That's how we, a portion of the property tax revenue that comes in,

1417
02:02:07,260 --> 02:02:11,400
based on the tax levy from 1977 to 1978,

1418
02:02:12,120 --> 02:02:14,820
and the geographical boundaries of each jurisdiction.

1419
02:02:15,360 --> 02:02:19,380
So you have the cities, the town, the school districts, those are jurisdictional boundaries.

1420
02:02:19,380 --> 02:02:21,460
And those are called AB 8 factors.

1421
02:02:22,740 --> 02:02:29,160
In Napa County, schools receive about 60% of all property taxes at that time.

1422
02:02:29,700 --> 02:02:32,680
Local agencies received the other 40%.

1423
02:02:33,000 --> 02:02:38,460
For this Prop 13, it reduced property taxes throughout the state by $7 billion in the

1424
02:02:38,460 --> 02:02:40,880
first year, and that was the whole purpose of it.

1425
02:02:41,000 --> 02:02:46,780
That was the goal of the Prop 13 was to reduce the amount of property taxes.

1426
02:02:47,380 --> 02:02:53,160
Of course, there's complications that include annexations, as boundaries change, redevelopment

1427
02:02:53,160 --> 02:02:58,440
agencies that came into play any time that you have changes of ownership, you have supplemental

1428
02:02:58,440 --> 02:02:59,100
tax bills.

1429
02:02:59,740 --> 02:03:02,460
So we estimate your revenues, but of course it changes.

1430
02:03:04,060 --> 02:03:06,260
So let's look at what we have in NEPA County.

1431
02:03:08,040 --> 02:03:12,400
So this is really hard to see, but each one of these is a taxing jurisdiction.

1432
02:03:12,400 --> 02:03:16,240
So on the top you have a breakdown of the county.

1433
02:03:16,860 --> 02:03:21,560
Again, this is based on the levies that were established back in 1975.

1434
02:03:23,300 --> 02:03:29,240
So Napa County, we have fire, the library gets a piece of the property tax and then fire protection.

1435
02:03:29,500 --> 02:03:31,440
There's non-structural fire and fire protection.

1436
02:03:31,800 --> 02:03:32,940
So that goes to the county.

1437
02:03:33,480 --> 02:03:34,960
Then you have the cities in the town.

1438
02:03:35,520 --> 02:03:36,840
And then you have special districts.

1439
02:03:36,840 --> 02:03:46,480
like Barriessa, Monticello's cemetery district, mosquito abatement, all the special districts that we have at the time of this Prop 13.

1440
02:03:46,980 --> 02:03:48,740
And then you have all the school districts.

1441
02:03:51,500 --> 02:03:55,180
So looking at the pie, how does the property tax get divided?

1442
02:03:57,060 --> 02:04:00,040
Schools, after all the shifts, and this is as of today.

1443
02:04:00,340 --> 02:04:02,920
So this is as growth and changes and boundary changes.

1444
02:04:02,920 --> 02:04:09,380
schools are getting approximately 66% are estimated revenue for 2425.

1445
02:04:10,040 --> 02:04:18,400
You see there is 556 million, so schools are getting approximately 366 of that million of that.

1446
02:04:18,900 --> 02:04:26,020
The county is the next with the 127 million, the cities in town share the 57 million and

1447
02:04:26,020 --> 02:04:28,340
then the special districts get about 10 million.

1448
02:04:28,340 --> 02:04:34,860
So, honing in on that city's in town pie, this is how that is broken down.

1449
02:04:35,440 --> 02:04:37,820
So, there's the 55 million for the city's in town.

1450
02:04:38,340 --> 02:04:41,120
City of Napa has the biggest portion.

1451
02:04:42,500 --> 02:04:46,880
And then you can see their American Canyon, St. Helena, Calestoga, and Town of Gapville.

1452
02:04:48,140 --> 02:04:56,340
So, I know this is fast and there's a lot here, but hopefully it's just kind of

1453
02:04:56,340 --> 02:04:59,860
your toes in to see what the property tax process is.

1454
02:05:00,480 --> 02:05:02,180
Then we get into the complex things.

1455
02:05:02,420 --> 02:05:05,260
What are this ERAF and VLF swap that we've been hearing about?

1456
02:05:07,120 --> 02:05:12,300
So ERAF stands for Educational Revenue Augmentation Fund.

1457
02:05:13,220 --> 02:05:17,760
This really is a mechanism by the state to bail them out

1458
02:05:17,760 --> 02:05:18,600
from their deficits.

1459
02:05:19,420 --> 02:05:22,300
The state says we need to fund schools.

1460
02:05:22,300 --> 02:05:25,720
It's a state's obligation to make sure that the schools are funded.

1461
02:05:25,720 --> 02:05:27,880
We don't have the money as a state.

1462
02:05:28,500 --> 02:05:32,320
We can't take local property taxes away from the county

1463
02:05:32,320 --> 02:05:34,860
of the cities that the special districts who can't take them.

1464
02:05:35,400 --> 02:05:37,320
So what we're going to do is we're going to create one

1465
02:05:37,320 --> 02:05:39,840
of those taxing entities that I showed you that long list

1466
02:05:39,840 --> 02:05:41,180
and call it ERAF.

1467
02:05:41,500 --> 02:05:44,820
And we're going to tell you how to shift money

1468
02:05:44,820 --> 02:05:47,960
from all the taxing jurisdictions into this bucket.

1469
02:05:48,500 --> 02:05:50,140
So they did that three times.

1470
02:05:50,780 --> 02:05:59,320
In 1992 and 1993, they shifted $3.6 billion statewide into this bucket so that the local

1471
02:05:59,320 --> 02:06:04,060
property tax entities were really paying for the school obligations that the state was

1472
02:06:04,060 --> 02:06:04,900
supposed to pay for.

1473
02:06:05,860 --> 02:06:10,660
In 1993 and 1994, they did another shift, and then in 0.4 and 0.5, they did a third.

1474
02:06:11,180 --> 02:06:15,740
The 0.405, they shifted, it was just a two-year shift, so that no longer exists.

1475
02:06:15,740 --> 02:06:20,480
But the first two shifts still exist today and they're in perpetuity, there's nothing

1476
02:06:20,480 --> 02:06:21,980
that says that they're going to stop that.

1477
02:06:22,840 --> 02:06:28,820
So again, it's taking local taxpayer dollars, putting them into a new tax ingestiction called

1478
02:06:28,820 --> 02:06:35,160
ERAF, and that is really being used to pay for the state's obligation to fund schools.

1479
02:06:37,860 --> 02:06:45,640
So some terms, and when Bob comes up and talk about, you're going to see some redundant

1480
02:06:45,640 --> 02:06:54,160
because this is very complicated and we want to make sure that it sticks, so we might, you might hear things a couple times, but I think it'll be worth your while.

1481
02:06:54,700 --> 02:07:08,140
So there's some terms here that you will hear, as we talk about this, one is the state revenue limit. That is the guaranteed minimum amount that the state will fund per pupil for the schools.

1482
02:07:08,960 --> 02:07:15,800
basic aid school districts. That's if property tax allocated originally, remember my list

1483
02:07:15,800 --> 02:07:24,260
of all the tax interstiction, if that property tax amount that was allocated exceeds or is equal

1484
02:07:24,260 --> 02:07:31,760
to what that school was guaranteed to get by the state, then they're basic aid. They don't need

1485
02:07:31,760 --> 02:07:37,000
any more money. Property tax filled the state's obligation, they don't need to get any more money.

1486
02:07:37,000 --> 02:07:44,380
If it's non-basic aid, that means that the school district has less than that per-pupil

1487
02:07:44,380 --> 02:07:47,800
revenue limit and then the state needs to fill that bucket.

1488
02:07:48,420 --> 02:07:49,760
How does the state fill that bucket?

1489
02:07:50,180 --> 02:07:52,980
They take it out of our e-Raff and fill that bucket, okay?

1490
02:07:54,040 --> 02:08:00,840
So that's e-Raff is a new taxing entity that shifted the local taxes and we have to use

1491
02:08:00,840 --> 02:08:06,000
that e-Raff to fill if a school is lower than the revenue limit that the state sets.

1492
02:08:06,000 --> 02:08:07,920
Does that make sense?

1493
02:08:08,640 --> 02:08:08,720
Okay.

1494
02:08:10,220 --> 02:08:14,020
If we have excess ERAF, meaning we shifted everything

1495
02:08:14,020 --> 02:08:16,140
from the state or everything from the tax

1496
02:08:16,140 --> 02:08:18,620
and jurisdictions down to this ERAF bucket,

1497
02:08:21,800 --> 02:08:26,140
if when we fill up the obligation, the gap that

1498
02:08:26,140 --> 02:08:29,960
the schools need, if we have extra, we give it back

1499
02:08:29,960 --> 02:08:32,700
to the tax and jurisdictions. So that's where we get

1500
02:08:32,700 --> 02:08:40,060
Excess ERAF and NAPA County is one of five counties out of the 58 that are in the situation.

1501
02:08:40,740 --> 02:08:48,060
So every year I shift property taxes from all the local jurisdictions, put them in this ERAF bucket based on all these state calculations.

1502
02:08:49,200 --> 02:08:58,200
We do the whole state, our school reporting, get their average daily tenants, know the revenue limit, fill up whatever bucket is left.

1503
02:08:58,200 --> 02:09:08,160
And then there's money left over, so I'm able to then return those taxes to all the jurisdictions that gave them based on that same thing and that same allocation.

1504
02:09:11,850 --> 02:09:12,450
Question.

1505
02:09:13,350 --> 02:09:27,470
So even if a school district during the city in which the school district is, is if the school district's basic aid, they're still getting charged e-raft to subsidize the non-basic aid districts in the county.

1506
02:09:30,970 --> 02:09:37,630
So you bring up a very good point back to that chart with the list with all the numbers which I won't bring because you can't see it anyway.

1507
02:09:39,290 --> 02:09:46,910
All the money that's collected is put into one pot, the 1% up and down the whole county is put into a pot.

1508
02:09:46,910 --> 02:09:53,910
I have to take those allocations, those AB 8 factors, based on that tax base that happened in 1970s,

1509
02:09:55,010 --> 02:09:59,910
late 70s, and allocated based on evaluation, assess evaluation growth.

1510
02:10:00,550 --> 02:10:04,930
And again, districts changes and all this stuff, so it's a complicated formula.

1511
02:10:05,570 --> 02:10:10,630
But those percentages, they're tweaked every year, but they're pretty consistent each year,

1512
02:10:10,830 --> 02:10:13,950
you know, when you talk about the amount of money we're talking about.

1513
02:10:13,950 --> 02:10:20,810
So the money all gets collected, regardless of where you live, and it gets spread out through those AB8 factors.

1514
02:10:21,090 --> 02:10:23,710
That's the way the state property tax system works.

1515
02:10:24,930 --> 02:10:27,830
So it's not my fault, it's the state.

1516
02:10:29,010 --> 02:10:35,030
So with that, this next slide is what you probably don't want to see.

1517
02:10:35,570 --> 02:10:42,890
So Napa Valley Unified is really the only school district that doesn't get enough property taxes

1518
02:10:42,890 --> 02:10:45,110
to fully fund all of its students.

1519
02:10:46,290 --> 02:10:49,990
But think about the number of students they have,

1520
02:10:50,210 --> 02:10:52,710
think about the range of different areas

1521
02:10:52,710 --> 02:10:56,710
and the property tax of values of the district.

1522
02:10:57,210 --> 02:11:00,970
So NAPA Valley Unified School District is the only school district

1523
02:11:00,970 --> 02:11:03,010
that when we shift money to ERAF,

1524
02:11:03,190 --> 02:11:05,310
we give to NAPA Valley Unified School District

1525
02:11:05,310 --> 02:11:07,510
and then we fill up the state's obligation,

1526
02:11:07,690 --> 02:11:09,810
not our obligation, the state's obligation

1527
02:11:09,810 --> 02:11:11,010
of what they should have paid.

1528
02:11:12,070 --> 02:11:17,870
And then we give, I'm able to give you back your excess e-ref that we've taken away from you.

1529
02:11:18,590 --> 02:11:24,690
Now there's two key components to that is the average daily attendance.

1530
02:11:25,010 --> 02:11:29,330
Also you'll hear ADA, average daily attendance, and the assess valuation.

1531
02:11:30,030 --> 02:11:36,930
So if the, and remember the state provides its limit by ADA.

1532
02:11:36,930 --> 02:11:52,030
So if the school population goes down, that means that they won't need as much money and their property taxes may offset everything that is, you know, the revenue limit of the state set.

1533
02:11:52,650 --> 02:12:02,170
Same with the SES valuation. The SES valuation goes down. We're generating more property taxes. So their property taxes may result in not needing any more money from the shift.

1534
02:12:02,170 --> 02:12:13,270
Okay? So that's ERAF. It gets better because now we get into vehicle license fees. Long story,

1535
02:12:13,730 --> 02:12:24,590
back in the 80s, early 80s, but basically Prop 1A was passed on November of 2004 and it changed how

1536
02:12:24,590 --> 02:12:29,390
counties, cities and towns were the only entities, no school districts, no special districts, the

1537
02:12:29,390 --> 02:12:35,630
counties, cities, and towns, were to receive portion of vehicle license fees and in the

1538
02:12:35,630 --> 02:12:42,270
state's wisdom they assigned it to assessed valuation growth. Vehicle license fees assessed

1539
02:12:42,270 --> 02:12:49,290
values. There's really no connection, but that's what they did. So what it did is the constitutionally

1540
02:12:49,290 --> 02:12:56,490
set limitations on the state's legislative authority to change local revenues and it generally prohibits

1541
02:12:56,490 --> 02:13:01,170
more e-reff shifts from occurring. So, you know, we got a couple of wins out of that

1542
02:13:01,170 --> 02:13:07,070
because they weren't able to do any shifts, but now it's tied to assess valuation growth

1543
02:13:07,070 --> 02:13:09,290
not anything to do with vehicle license fees.

1544
02:13:12,530 --> 02:13:15,010
So what's the problem? Well,

1545
02:13:17,420 --> 02:13:18,220
you thought

1546
02:13:18,220 --> 02:13:24,920
e-reff was a little complicated and how we're moving around things. Well, payment to a VLF

1547
02:13:24,920 --> 02:13:30,580
to us, the county, the cities and the town, are to be taken back from any school district

1548
02:13:30,580 --> 02:13:35,300
that we gave ERAF2. That's how it's written in legislation.

1549
02:13:36,220 --> 02:13:39,460
So, if we want our vehicle license fees, which the state has,

1550
02:13:40,080 --> 02:13:44,260
we have to get them from the school district that we give ERAF2.

1551
02:13:44,880 --> 02:13:48,240
So, let's say I'm going to use really simple numbers here.

1552
02:13:48,800 --> 02:13:53,200
Let's say Napa Valley Unified School District needed a million dollars

1553
02:13:53,200 --> 02:13:57,240
to finish their bucket, for their state, for their obligation.

1554
02:13:57,240 --> 02:14:00,420
We gave them a million dollars in eRaff.

1555
02:14:01,540 --> 02:14:04,300
VLF Countywide is about 30 million dollars.

1556
02:14:04,680 --> 02:14:06,340
35, 50?

1557
02:14:06,660 --> 02:14:07,620
Oh, I'm thinking Countywide.

1558
02:14:07,720 --> 02:14:09,180
Sorry. 50 million dollars.

1559
02:14:10,460 --> 02:14:14,360
So we then are able to take a million dollars back

1560
02:14:14,360 --> 02:14:16,600
out of eRaff to pay our VLF.

1561
02:14:17,200 --> 02:14:18,640
The next thing that it says,

1562
02:14:19,140 --> 02:14:22,460
and bullet two, is if we took all of our eRaff back,

1563
02:14:22,560 --> 02:14:23,420
which is million dollars,

1564
02:14:24,120 --> 02:14:26,940
we then get to take 49 million dollars

1565
02:14:26,940 --> 02:14:34,240
from NAPA Valley unifies property tax that I just gave them and say okay now we took 50 million

1566
02:14:34,240 --> 02:14:40,880
dollars back and we get to then pay the county the cities in the town for our vehicle license fees

1567
02:14:41,600 --> 02:14:47,080
so now we took their e-reff and their property tax so what does that mean the state has an

1568
02:14:47,080 --> 02:14:55,800
obligation to backfill the 50 million dollars that we just took away from the schools so that's

1569
02:14:55,800 --> 02:14:59,860
twice called VLF swap. We're swapping all this money around.

1570
02:15:00,240 --> 02:15:31,200
And then the state gets to say, look what we did. We gave NAPA Valley Unified School District $50 million. Not really. They gave us our VLF, right? It's a swap. And so it's kind of crazy. The worst part of it, if that wasn't even bad enough, are you guys all following this? Okay. Totally was going to be exciting. The worst part of this is if NAPA Valley Unified School District

1571
02:15:31,200 --> 02:15:35,160
goes basic aid, meaning their property taxes,

1572
02:15:35,400 --> 02:15:35,940
fill their bucket.

1573
02:15:36,880 --> 02:15:40,760
Nothing in legislation allows us to get paid

1574
02:15:40,760 --> 02:15:42,280
for vehicle license fees.

1575
02:15:43,140 --> 02:15:48,240
So if the ADA is down or the assess values up

1576
02:15:48,600 --> 02:15:51,440
and NAPA value unified, does it need ERAF?

1577
02:15:51,940 --> 02:15:54,680
We have no mechanism to get $50 million

1578
02:15:54,680 --> 02:15:57,100
from the state for our vehicle license fees.

1579
02:15:59,450 --> 02:16:00,370
Let that sink in.

1580
02:16:02,730 --> 02:16:10,950
But one of the key points that I want to tell everybody and again Bob is going to repeat all this so if it's not syncing in it will

1581
02:16:11,830 --> 02:16:20,110
Schools are made whole schools are not harmed in any way, and I want to make that point clear because that's a that's a very

1582
02:16:20,670 --> 02:16:23,010
Miss information common

1583
02:16:23,670 --> 02:16:30,770
Thing out there that we are taking schools money away. We're not schools are made 100% whole the state has an obligation

1584
02:16:30,770 --> 02:16:36,610
they have to fill that bucket. So they are getting their revenue. The state gets

1585
02:16:36,610 --> 02:16:41,770
to say that they paid all this money to schools and let's you know put more

1586
02:16:41,770 --> 02:16:45,730
legislation to get more school funding okay because they're spending no it's

1587
02:16:45,730 --> 02:16:50,250
VLF. The only thing that really is hurting is the local governments that are

1588
02:16:50,250 --> 02:16:51,230
losing this funding.

1589
02:16:55,730 --> 02:17:01,050
So here's our estimated county revenues for VLF so this is

1590
02:17:01,050 --> 02:17:06,070
estimated for $24.25. So you can see the county there, that's where I got my $30 million,

1591
02:17:06,230 --> 02:17:13,390
it's almost $30 million. So let's just hone in on you guys, it's a million bucks. So a million

1592
02:17:13,390 --> 02:17:19,250
dollars out of your budget that could just be gone, just like that. And that includes a ton of

1593
02:17:19,250 --> 02:17:23,070
y'all fills a million, so you say the lien is a million, so you have NAPA, it's almost 12 million,

1594
02:17:23,270 --> 02:17:25,050
American Canyon 2.3 million.

1595
02:17:31,670 --> 02:17:36,030
I'll just leave that up there for a minute. Okay. Okay. So

1596
02:17:36,030 --> 02:17:40,770
The simplified piece of the puzzle, just to make sure everybody understands how this works.

1597
02:17:41,410 --> 02:17:45,810
Property taxes are collected by the treasure tax collector, he's the bad guy, he collects

1598
02:17:45,810 --> 02:17:46,630
your property taxes.

1599
02:17:48,530 --> 02:17:54,030
I allocate the revenues based on those AB8 factors.

1600
02:17:54,430 --> 02:17:57,210
I shift monies to ERAF.

1601
02:17:57,550 --> 02:18:01,130
I distribute those monies to the non-basic aid school districts.

1602
02:18:01,550 --> 02:18:05,230
If excess exists, I give it back to the taxing entities.

1603
02:18:06,610 --> 02:18:26,990
VLF is taken from the non-basic aid school districts, if from their ERAF first, if the ERAF is not enough, I take it from their property taxes, the state back fills the schools, and then I remit all the property taxes in VLF to the cities and the town and the special districts and the schools.

1604
02:18:28,010 --> 02:18:33,190
The complicated piece of the puzzle, the state can change their revenue limit at any time.

1605
02:18:33,330 --> 02:18:36,590
They can increase it or decrease it, which is another moving piece of the puzzle.

1606
02:18:37,530 --> 02:18:42,150
They can even go back and say, two years ago, we want to give the schools more,

1607
02:18:42,370 --> 02:18:46,470
which means that I'd have to take more money from you guys because we already gave the money back.

1608
02:18:47,310 --> 02:18:51,630
There's no mechanism once again to get our VLF if it goes basic aid.

1609
02:18:51,630 --> 02:19:00,210
And the state is not, they are, this is where Bob has been working with the state for many years now on this whole issue.

1610
02:19:00,650 --> 02:19:10,130
The state is saying we don't have really any thought that we have to guarantee this for you, even though it's our revenue.

1611
02:19:11,250 --> 02:19:16,910
And but think about it, we're five counties in the state of California, 58.

1612
02:19:16,910 --> 02:19:21,250
think of how much money is going to offset their school obligation.

1613
02:19:22,250 --> 02:19:25,250
So they're not going to want to change legislation for that.

1614
02:19:26,330 --> 02:19:31,370
And one thing is, they're trying now that five counties have this excess

1615
02:19:31,370 --> 02:19:35,730
e-reff, they're trying to see how they can legislatively take more of that away,

1616
02:19:36,250 --> 02:19:37,550
to use for other things.

1617
02:19:38,470 --> 02:19:43,610
So the key takeaways for me, we all need to understand property tax and

1618
02:19:43,610 --> 02:19:45,710
what our local property tax funding goes to.

1619
02:19:45,710 --> 02:19:49,450
We need to be aware that schools are not harmed in any way.

1620
02:19:49,770 --> 02:19:50,570
Neither is the state.

1621
02:19:50,790 --> 02:19:52,470
Only us local governments are.

1622
02:19:53,490 --> 02:19:55,690
And back to the little graphs.

1623
02:19:56,290 --> 02:19:57,510
Those are your discretionary dollars.

1624
02:19:57,910 --> 02:19:59,970
Your VLF is a discretionary piece of that.

1625
02:20:00,410 --> 02:20:03,930
So we need to make sure that the discretionary dollars are safe

1626
02:20:03,930 --> 02:20:09,730
and that they're flexible to be able to use for the services that you provide.

1627
02:20:10,910 --> 02:20:11,290
Okay.

1628
02:20:12,150 --> 02:20:12,270
So.

1629
02:20:12,670 --> 02:20:13,350
Thank you.

1630
02:20:13,350 --> 02:20:15,770
Bob, someone please call 1-800-Dodge.

1631
02:20:17,330 --> 02:20:21,870
Bob is next, he's going to go a little deep dive, so do you have any general questions

1632
02:20:21,870 --> 02:20:23,110
or do you want to wait for him?

1633
02:20:23,770 --> 02:20:24,190
Okay.

1634
02:20:25,030 --> 02:20:29,710
And as he comes up, the primary point of this evening to try and help educate people about

1635
02:20:29,710 --> 02:20:38,690
is it's very complicated, the city of Calistoga overnight could lose a million dollars instantaneously,

1636
02:20:39,210 --> 02:20:40,970
which is about 5% of our general phone budget.

1637
02:20:40,970 --> 02:20:48,410
And so where's the good news, like how do we, well, yes, welcome, Mr. Minnan.

1638
02:20:48,790 --> 02:20:49,670
Thank you very much.

1639
02:20:50,110 --> 02:20:54,830
If we can pull up the next slide deck, I'll walk you through it, and I have two

1640
02:20:54,830 --> 02:20:59,090
confessions to make right up the bat, as both Tracy and

1641
02:20:59,090 --> 02:21:03,650
Supervisor Manfrey, who's in the back, know I can get in the weeds on this stuff pretty

1642
02:21:03,650 --> 02:21:07,670
quickly. And the second confession is Tracy had the

1643
02:21:07,670 --> 02:21:09,930
easy part. So, here we go.

1644
02:21:09,930 --> 02:21:14,970
So I'm just going to deal with the VLF swap issue and I think it is the most prevalent

1645
02:21:15,570 --> 02:21:20,490
and right in your face kind of issue that we're going to deal with now and I've been dealing

1646
02:21:20,490 --> 02:21:27,050
with this for solidly five years now dealing with the state of California trying to get this

1647
02:21:27,050 --> 02:21:32,950
resolved for all of the taxing agencies within the county and so let's just jump in.

1648
02:21:34,270 --> 02:21:37,270
So, these are the people that we're going to be dealing with.

1649
02:21:37,650 --> 02:21:45,630
State of California, ERAF, as Tracy explained, the BLF swap, we're going to talk a lot about Napa Valley and if I had school district,

1650
02:21:45,630 --> 02:21:51,490
even though it's in the southern part of the county, it's the one that we have to pay attention to, and then local governments.

1651
02:21:52,790 --> 02:21:58,390
And the terms are, the local control funding formula is the new school funding formula.

1652
02:21:58,390 --> 02:22:03,090
It's the ADA-based revenue limit calculation.

1653
02:22:03,570 --> 02:22:04,910
It's very complex calculation.

1654
02:22:05,410 --> 02:22:08,970
Came in during the last administration

1655
02:22:08,970 --> 02:22:11,250
was a great change for schools,

1656
02:22:11,490 --> 02:22:12,610
but it's really complicated.

1657
02:22:13,210 --> 02:22:14,890
School property taxes is the amount

1658
02:22:14,890 --> 02:22:18,470
that Tracy allocates or apportions to each school.

1659
02:22:19,330 --> 02:22:23,290
And then we have basic aid, which is when number two,

1660
02:22:23,710 --> 02:22:25,530
school property taxes is greater

1661
02:22:25,530 --> 02:22:32,610
later than their guaranteed minimum funding and ERAF entitlement is the other way around.

1662
02:22:33,090 --> 02:22:38,950
So if the LCFF minimum guarantee is greater than local property taxes for a school, the

1663
02:22:39,450 --> 02:22:42,170
difference between those two becomes their ERAF entitlement.

1664
02:22:42,990 --> 02:22:51,170
And then excess ERAF has trace stated when all schools within the county are funded to their

1665
02:22:51,170 --> 02:22:59,850
LCFF limit and there is excess funds remaining in ERAF, then a portion of that gets returned

1666
02:22:59,850 --> 02:23:01,630
back to contributing agencies.

1667
02:23:03,470 --> 02:23:15,090
VLF swap history back in the great Davis era, local agencies benefited from a 2% vehicle

1668
02:23:15,090 --> 02:23:22,150
license fee. During the Davis administration, he reduced it to 0.65, which did significant

1669
02:23:22,150 --> 02:23:28,370
harm to local agencies, but developed a backfill agreement with local agencies for a couple

1670
02:23:28,370 --> 02:23:35,450
of years to help them out. Fast forward to the Schwarzenegger administration through the

1671
02:23:35,450 --> 02:23:52,790
The ERAF free shift, which shifted at $1.3 billion per year, again, to save the state money, they made the VLF swap a permanent funding source for local governments, and they tied it to assess valuation.

1672
02:23:53,990 --> 02:24:00,230
The current law problem is for VLF, first funding source is ERAF.

1673
02:24:00,230 --> 02:24:06,170
If there isn't sufficient funds in ERAF to fully fund the VLLF swap, the next funding

1674
02:24:06,170 --> 02:24:12,470
source is any real property taxes for all non-basic-gauge school districts.

1675
02:24:13,730 --> 02:24:20,470
The problem is if all of our schools are basic-gauge, code is silent on where you get your

1676
02:24:20,470 --> 02:24:24,690
reimbursement from, and right now the state says we don't technically have to give you

1677
02:24:24,690 --> 02:24:25,290
any money back.

1678
02:24:25,290 --> 02:24:29,310
So the swap isn't really a swap in that area.

1679
02:24:30,470 --> 02:24:34,090
Napa County's issues, we have one basic aid school district.

1680
02:24:35,190 --> 02:24:38,830
It's Napa Valley Unified School District, our largest school district.

1681
02:24:39,490 --> 02:24:41,990
It is trending towards basic aid.

1682
02:24:42,550 --> 02:24:48,430
It has been suffering a significant loss of ADA over the past probably five years.

1683
02:24:50,090 --> 02:24:55,230
And once Napa Valley Unified School District turns basic aid, we lose our

1684
02:24:55,230 --> 02:25:02,610
funding source, the minimum loss that we would look at currently is, it's a two-year cycle

1685
02:25:02,610 --> 02:25:09,510
to get any kind of funding from the state. So, local governments in Napa County would

1686
02:25:09,510 --> 02:25:15,830
suffer $100 million loss revenue just when Napa Valley Unified School District turns

1687
02:25:15,830 --> 02:25:16,430
basic aid.

1688
02:25:18,770 --> 02:25:24,550
Factors leading to basic aid, prop 13 AB 8 factors that came into play, it's

1689
02:25:24,550 --> 02:25:31,810
key because the leading factor towards this is in Napa County, schools get two out of

1690
02:25:31,810 --> 02:25:33,450
every $3 of property taxes.

1691
02:25:34,230 --> 02:25:37,690
It's a significantly higher ratio than in other counties.

1692
02:25:38,490 --> 02:25:44,790
We would be in a better position if we had Solano County's apportionment factors and

1693
02:25:44,790 --> 02:25:47,590
we weren't a basic or an excess UF County.

1694
02:25:48,230 --> 02:25:53,670
Solano County shifts one out of every $2 to school with the state backfilling the rest

1695
02:25:53,670 --> 02:25:56,530
in NAPI County, we shift to out of every three.

1696
02:25:58,070 --> 02:26:01,230
RSS valuation is increasing constantly.

1697
02:26:01,970 --> 02:26:04,950
Last year, I think the county wide, we were at 4.5%.

1698
02:26:06,130 --> 02:26:09,570
NAPI value-unified school district is suffering declining enrollment.

1699
02:26:10,490 --> 02:26:13,690
And the state general fund over the last couple of years,

1700
02:26:14,210 --> 02:26:18,970
the deficit has resulted in a significant reduction in the Prop 98 guarantee.

1701
02:26:18,970 --> 02:26:24,790
And the Prop 98 guarantee is good, and I appreciate having a principal here because we're going

1702
02:26:24,790 --> 02:26:26,510
to talk a little bit about the Prop 98 guarantee.

1703
02:26:28,690 --> 02:26:33,170
So these are the calculations, and this is how the money flows.

1704
02:26:33,990 --> 02:26:41,490
So Tracy shifts $75 million from local taxing agencies into ERAF.

1705
02:26:43,210 --> 02:26:48,310
We then calculate what the Napa Valley Unified School District's ERAF entitlement is, and

1706
02:26:48,310 --> 02:26:51,470
Again, that's the distance between their minimum state

1707
02:26:51,470 --> 02:26:54,250
guarantee and local property taxes.

1708
02:26:54,550 --> 02:26:58,470
So we have to shift $28 million to the Napa Valley Unified

1709
02:26:58,470 --> 02:27:01,410
School District to get them to their LCFF minimum

1710
02:27:01,410 --> 02:27:02,270
guarantee number.

1711
02:27:03,970 --> 02:27:06,450
But we then have to give that money back

1712
02:27:06,990 --> 02:27:10,210
because that's the first funding source for the VLF swap.

1713
02:27:10,770 --> 02:27:14,670
That funding goes back into ERA and then comes down.

1714
02:27:14,910 --> 02:27:16,910
And it's in the pot that we're going to use

1715
02:27:16,910 --> 02:27:21,950
used to fund the cities and the county for the state's VLF swap obligation.

1716
02:27:24,770 --> 02:27:28,350
Okay, then we in excess ERAF mode.

1717
02:27:28,930 --> 02:27:34,730
And so since NAPA Valley Unified School District has technically been filled to their revenue

1718
02:27:34,730 --> 02:27:41,810
limit using the $28 million, we then shift all of the rest the remainder in ERAF back to

1719
02:27:41,810 --> 02:27:48,670
the contributing agencies after we make NAPA counties office of education hold for their special

1720
02:27:48,670 --> 02:27:50,550
education, local plan area.

1721
02:27:50,770 --> 02:27:54,730
So there's about a $10 million savings to the state that we have to fulfill first.

1722
02:27:55,290 --> 02:28:00,750
All the rest of it goes back to our cities and special districts that contribute into ERAF.

1723
02:28:03,400 --> 02:28:16,900
Then, in order to make our VLF swap full, we then take $22 million from Napa Valley Unified School District to make the full VLF payment.

1724
02:28:17,780 --> 02:28:25,620
And ultimately, the state then backfills the $50 million back to Napa Valley Unified School District, so they're made whole.

1725
02:28:25,820 --> 02:28:45,700
The key to this, and it's a nuance that 99 out of 100, maybe 999 out of 1,000 people don't realize this, when the state backfills Napa Valley Unified School District, to effectively pay VLF, they count that under the Prop 98 guarantee.

1726
02:28:45,700 --> 02:28:58,900
And so, when the state talks about the Prop 98 guarantee and how much they're funding schools included in that number is the amount of dollars that they're funding every single county and city for their VLF swap.

1727
02:28:59,640 --> 02:29:10,320
So, we've been working tirelessly with the state for a number of years and we've come up with this incredibly complicated, incredibly complicated change.

1728
02:29:11,180 --> 02:29:21,950
And our plan is to do this, that this is way it should work if we don't have a funding source.

1729
02:29:21,950 --> 02:29:25,230
The state should simply shift the $50 million to the VLF and be done.

1730
02:29:25,530 --> 02:29:34,690
They do this effectively in 56 out of the 58 counties in the state of California without even thinking about it.

1731
02:29:34,790 --> 02:29:36,350
But they just do it through schools.

1732
02:29:36,350 --> 02:29:46,860
The impact of basic aid and APA value, if I had school district again, we lose our two funding sources for VLF.

1733
02:29:48,720 --> 02:29:55,820
We then become at the mercy of the legislature to be able to add our loss into the state budget.

1734
02:29:55,820 --> 02:29:59,900
it. San Mateo County is in a similar position.

1735
02:30:00,000 --> 02:30:08,040
And then we are, they are currently out about $116 million, that they're trying to get added into the state budget for next year.

1736
02:30:11,860 --> 02:30:32,960
So here's an Apple Value Unified School District's trekked towards basic aid using updated estimates as we go along. The lighter green, the 22, 23, 23, 24 actuals, 24, 25 is the school funding is correct in the percentage of growth that it is

1737
02:30:32,960 --> 02:30:39,560
everything else for the most part is estimated. And then as we move out to 2526 and 2627 there are

1738
02:30:39,560 --> 02:30:45,080
three key factors that are going to make this Bob look really good or make Bob look really bad.

1739
02:30:45,700 --> 02:30:55,700
But as you see in 2223 ERAF entitlements 21 million it goes up in 2324. In that year there was an

1740
02:30:55,700 --> 02:31:04,720
And 8% growth in school funding, there was also a statutory 7.5% growth, so the ultimate growth in school funding was double digits.

1741
02:31:05,580 --> 02:31:10,820
So ERAF entitlement goes up, 24-25 after the budget crisis at the state.

1742
02:31:11,400 --> 02:31:15,800
Governor reduces the growth in school down to 0.76%.

1743
02:31:15,800 --> 02:31:20,500
You start to see Napa Valley Unified School District's ERAF entitlement shrink.

1744
02:31:21,340 --> 02:31:24,700
And in the following year in 25-26, further shrinks.

1745
02:31:24,700 --> 02:31:31,580
And I'm projecting, at this point in time, 2627 is about the time that we need to really pay attention

1746
02:31:32,180 --> 02:31:34,720
because we may be in a position where we're losing revenues.

1747
02:31:35,000 --> 02:31:42,080
So the takeaway is that we're projected to have revenue about a million dollars less in a couple of years.

1748
02:31:43,700 --> 02:31:50,640
And I've been ripped just for a second and so do we build ERAF into our budget?

1749
02:31:50,640 --> 02:31:55,120
Did we set it aside because we're unsure of how much we're going to get?

1750
02:31:58,960 --> 02:32:04,920
We have been building an entire budget and we'll be building it into next year's budget that we're working on currently.

1751
02:32:05,420 --> 02:32:09,920
And this meeting is to address the future 2627 budget cycle.

1752
02:32:10,380 --> 02:32:11,120
So possible.

1753
02:32:11,200 --> 02:32:15,380
So the budget pie that we saw up there included ERAF and was-

1754
02:32:15,380 --> 02:32:15,840
Yeah, left.

1755
02:32:16,440 --> 02:32:19,200
Was there an ERAF category, maybe I just overlooked it.

1756
02:32:19,280 --> 02:32:20,940
It's under vehicle license fee.

1757
02:32:23,620 --> 02:32:24,780
There's two components.

1758
02:32:25,360 --> 02:32:27,640
So there's excess E-Raff absolutely.

1759
02:32:28,120 --> 02:32:31,380
It's included in your property tax side of the thing that I'm not sure.

1760
02:32:31,940 --> 02:32:33,760
VLF is included in that same pot.

1761
02:32:34,580 --> 02:32:37,040
Excess E-Raff, you showed it separately?

1762
02:32:37,920 --> 02:32:38,960
No, in the pipe.

1763
02:32:39,460 --> 02:32:39,580
Yeah.

1764
02:32:40,420 --> 02:32:42,460
So excess E-Raff will continue.

1765
02:32:43,340 --> 02:32:47,940
It's not going to change unless the state does something statutorily to remove it.

1766
02:32:47,940 --> 02:32:52,520
The only piece that is in jeopardy is the VLF side of things.

1767
02:32:52,720 --> 02:32:57,340
So is there anything that we can do about, except respond to what you're telling us?

1768
02:32:57,960 --> 02:33:04,000
Yeah, we've been kind of, we've battled this directly twice so far.

1769
02:33:04,300 --> 02:33:10,220
In 2019, when the pandemic hit, the governor came out with his first pandemic budget.

1770
02:33:10,700 --> 02:33:12,460
He included reduction in school funding.

1771
02:33:12,460 --> 02:33:20,120
We would have been sitting facing that, the VLF swap issue in 2020, as soon as he came out with his budget cuts.

1772
02:33:20,480 --> 02:33:30,320
Luckily, the legislature kind of pushed back on it, school funding stayed exactly the way it was going to, and so, we've kind of progressed along with it.

1773
02:33:30,860 --> 02:33:41,840
We battled it again, I think in 2023, and I'm sure, I'm not sure who from the city signed the letters,

1774
02:33:41,840 --> 02:33:47,800
But we've we've been battling it with our legislature Senator Dodd has carried a lot of water on this one

1775
02:33:47,800 --> 02:33:55,560
We're really lucky because Senator Kabaldon is a school funding expert and so I've met with him already

1776
02:33:56,260 --> 02:34:01,760
Understands the issue and he's hit the ground running and so we don't have to go through kind of the re-education

1777
02:34:02,620 --> 02:34:07,840
We're trying to find the right time to do this and to bring it back to the legislature

1778
02:34:09,820 --> 02:34:13,120
with them in budget crisis is probably not the right time,

1779
02:34:13,820 --> 02:34:17,120
and so we're kind of just biting until we come back in it.

1780
02:34:17,480 --> 02:34:25,580
So for the time being, this is information for us to understand that beginning 26, 27 were likely to be a million dollars less.

1781
02:34:26,800 --> 02:34:30,840
You receive a million dollars less than we would otherwise have received.

1782
02:34:31,120 --> 02:34:34,660
That is correct. And when I go through and I do the estimates for these,

1783
02:34:35,300 --> 02:34:44,460
I will always estimate, I want to say this correctly, in a manner that's going to tell you potentially a year too early, as opposed to a year too late.

1784
02:34:45,000 --> 02:34:52,240
And so any estimate I'm going to do is going to be pushed forward a little bit so we have plenty of time to adjust and react to what's coming.

1785
02:34:52,620 --> 02:34:58,800
In addition, by the time we get there, it might be more than a million dollars. It's already a little bit over now.

1786
02:35:00,900 --> 02:35:05,800
Okay, is there is there more for the presentation or can we ask a question, sir?

1787
02:35:06,280 --> 02:35:06,540
Yes.

1788
02:35:06,660 --> 02:35:07,240
This is your show.

1789
02:35:07,420 --> 02:35:08,320
You can ask whatever you want.

1790
02:35:09,120 --> 02:35:13,900
Council members, do you like to offer any comment or questions?

1791
02:35:14,320 --> 02:35:17,780
How can you reverse the trend towards basic aid?

1792
02:35:17,780 --> 02:35:18,860
Is that even possible?

1793
02:35:21,140 --> 02:35:22,500
Well, good timing.

1794
02:35:22,800 --> 02:35:26,140
There are three key variables in the trend towards basic aid.

1795
02:35:26,140 --> 02:35:33,160
there's average daily attendance and Napa Valley Unified School District had been

1796
02:35:33,920 --> 02:35:39,960
hemorrhaging students for a few years. Now part of that is offset and you haven't

1797
02:35:39,960 --> 02:35:45,160
recognized or felt it yet in these calculations because the state during the pandemic did a

1798
02:35:45,160 --> 02:35:54,800
couple of things. One, they froze ADA at the lesser or the greater of whatever it was pre-pandemic

1799
02:35:54,800 --> 02:35:56,880
and what it was actually.

1800
02:35:57,220 --> 02:35:59,420
So while you were hemorrhaging students

1801
02:35:59,800 --> 02:36:03,660
for your state funding, they kept the old number,

1802
02:36:03,700 --> 02:36:05,460
the artificial number up.

1803
02:36:06,000 --> 02:36:08,180
They then took a second stab that said, okay,

1804
02:36:08,500 --> 02:36:11,280
moving forward, when a school district is

1805
02:36:11,280 --> 02:36:13,300
in a declining enrollment state.

1806
02:36:13,540 --> 02:36:14,840
So they're losing students.

1807
02:36:15,720 --> 02:36:19,140
They then decided to make the calculations based

1808
02:36:19,140 --> 02:36:22,280
on an average of the prior three years.

1809
02:36:22,280 --> 02:36:33,240
and so it gave schools more time to kind of change their ways to affect, to deal with the loss of funding that was going to come.

1810
02:36:33,420 --> 02:36:42,220
So if one year you lost 2,000 students, you didn't have to suffer the full consequences of that funding loss like that.

1811
02:36:42,840 --> 02:36:50,960
It gave you a time to gradually right size your school in order to meet the declining funding that was coming your way.

1812
02:36:50,960 --> 02:36:56,060
Okay, so this is probably partially a result of the decrease in childbirth.

1813
02:36:57,480 --> 02:37:01,420
A lot of it has to do, it was in the planning enrollment state already.

1814
02:37:02,100 --> 02:37:07,200
But when the pandemic had, we saw a significant number of people leave the public school systems

1815
02:37:07,200 --> 02:37:13,960
and they started doing other things, but that's where you really see the decline in enrollment.

1816
02:37:14,680 --> 02:37:22,140
Can we not market the county as a sanctuary county and embrace millions of kids into our community and turn the vote?

1817
02:37:23,620 --> 02:37:24,300
Right.

1818
02:37:24,700 --> 02:37:26,560
I'll leave that to smarter people.

1819
02:37:27,280 --> 02:37:30,260
But I just like to volunteer.

1820
02:37:31,320 --> 02:37:39,520
School districts, while no one wants to lose students when your property tax is put you into basic aid, the school district is celebrating.

1821
02:37:39,520 --> 02:37:46,880
school districts go into basic aid, one win the lottery, so they're not interested.

1822
02:37:47,100 --> 02:37:52,740
Oh no, let's hold those tax property taxes down, that's, we're lucky.

1823
02:37:53,320 --> 02:37:59,160
School districts, Cal State Unified School District is about one and a half times basic aid.

1824
02:37:59,280 --> 02:38:01,940
They're clearly past basic aid status.

1825
02:38:02,400 --> 02:38:08,260
And so in Cal State Unified School District, I think the average funding

1826
02:38:08,260 --> 02:38:14,340
or the LCFF funding for an app-felling unified school district is $13,000 per student.

1827
02:38:15,280 --> 02:38:19,540
Calisogus is at $20,000 per student, just from local property taxes.

1828
02:38:19,920 --> 02:38:36,040
So you're right, there's a, there's a, there is a, a, a folkroom at that, at that point, because what non-basic age school districts do when they're approaching basic age status is,

1829
02:38:36,040 --> 02:38:40,000
is they will increase their inter-district transfers

1830
02:38:41,020 --> 02:38:45,180
to raise their student counts, to raise their LCFF

1831
02:38:45,180 --> 02:38:49,080
limit up once they pass that threshold and they become

1832
02:38:49,080 --> 02:38:53,300
basic A, then effectively you're educating those

1833
02:38:53,300 --> 02:38:54,020
students for free.

1834
02:38:54,880 --> 02:38:57,940
And so then you'll see a purge of all the inter-district kids,

1835
02:38:58,620 --> 02:39:00,860
all the inter-district students, back to their home

1836
02:39:01,360 --> 02:39:01,700
districts.

1837
02:39:01,700 --> 02:39:05,800
And so, then you become basic by quite a ways.

1838
02:39:07,140 --> 02:39:09,520
Other questions, council members, comments?

1839
02:39:10,460 --> 02:39:15,520
It's a public comment is time.

1840
02:39:15,820 --> 02:39:23,040
Is there anybody in the chambers here who would like to address the council or our guests on this issue?

1841
02:39:23,860 --> 02:39:25,740
Or City Clerk, anybody online?

1842
02:39:26,800 --> 02:39:27,040
Okay.

1843
02:39:27,560 --> 02:39:29,440
Last call for public comment.

1844
02:39:31,500 --> 02:39:35,880
Okay, let's close public comment then and council members back to us.

1845
02:39:36,160 --> 02:39:39,960
Any further questions, comments, for our guests?

1846
02:39:41,580 --> 02:39:42,660
Then-

1847
02:39:42,660 --> 02:39:47,700
Can we get these slides just, or these decks that would be awesome?

1848
02:39:48,080 --> 02:39:54,720
Thanks, I can even absorb like one, Iota of this sitting here, this is the Blake complex.

1849
02:39:55,060 --> 02:39:58,220
I think the key takeaway is, we both work for you.

1850
02:39:58,220 --> 02:40:02,540
And so if you have questions, you know, feel free to contact us at your leisure.

1851
02:40:03,060 --> 02:40:03,180
Great.

1852
02:40:03,480 --> 02:40:03,900
Thank you.

1853
02:40:03,960 --> 02:40:06,160
Just one quick question.

1854
02:40:06,400 --> 02:40:09,120
You mentioned Senator Cavaldon.

1855
02:40:09,420 --> 02:40:13,400
Is there any way that we can do some kind of advocacy?

1856
02:40:14,140 --> 02:40:22,060
We have an event that leaders submit in Sacramento coming in April.

1857
02:40:22,500 --> 02:40:25,360
So this will be a good topic to talk to them.

1858
02:40:26,860 --> 02:40:27,420
Absolutely.

1859
02:40:28,360 --> 02:40:33,140
He's aware of the issue, like I said, he's a prop 98 specialist.

1860
02:40:34,360 --> 02:40:40,900
And so anytime we have the ability to raise the issue, before it's an emergency, just

1861
02:40:40,900 --> 02:40:43,600
for education and keeping it in the forefront of his thoughts.

1862
02:40:44,080 --> 02:40:44,380
Okay.

1863
02:40:44,680 --> 02:40:45,160
Thank you.

1864
02:40:45,480 --> 02:40:49,640
And I tried to corner him at the swearing in for the New County Supervisors and he stopped

1865
02:40:49,640 --> 02:40:51,100
me before I even finished.

1866
02:40:51,400 --> 02:40:52,720
I know all about it.

1867
02:40:52,980 --> 02:40:53,440
Okay.

1868
02:40:53,880 --> 02:40:55,720
But it would not hurt again to raise it.

1869
02:40:55,920 --> 02:40:56,280
Okay.

1870
02:40:56,280 --> 02:41:03,660
Yeah, but you know, we had to cut fine topics to talk to them when we see them there, so I think this is a good one

1871
02:41:04,540 --> 02:41:07,640
Thank you. Okay, good other questions comments

1872
02:41:08,360 --> 02:41:12,220
Thank you for coming up appreciate it all the way up Valley nice to see you up here

1873
02:41:12,220 --> 02:41:14,440
Thank you, and it was important for I

1874
02:41:15,160 --> 02:41:18,460
Think everyone to start understanding this as we're entering budget season

1875
02:41:18,460 --> 02:41:25,060
So because we're going to be referring to this in our projections and and wanting to make sure that there's some understanding of why it's

1876
02:41:25,060 --> 02:41:33,560
complicated. Great. Thank you for that. We're almost three hours into the meeting. I'm going to suggest a brief recess and mayor.

1877
02:41:34,180 --> 02:41:45,840
Yes, mayor. As we approach 9pm, I just have to advise you for the operating agreements. If you want to go to 930, we'll need a majority vote.

1878
02:41:46,360 --> 02:41:50,900
And if you want to go pass that to a set time, we'll need a unanimous vote.

1879
02:41:51,720 --> 02:41:55,240
In addition, there's another choice to be made when you come back.

1880
02:41:56,340 --> 02:42:01,540
The actual consultant who would do the survey is only available until 9.30.

1881
02:42:02,560 --> 02:42:07,300
If you would like to hear from that person, we'd need to hear that earlier, but we can

1882
02:42:07,300 --> 02:42:09,520
also continue with the order and the agenda.

1883
02:42:11,580 --> 02:42:19,180
Another suggestion, the mid-year budget amendments, can we do that one last?

1884
02:42:19,920 --> 02:42:25,600
And it's keep all the things that it has to do with the programs first, do you know?

1885
02:42:28,760 --> 02:42:34,140
Let's take a brief recess and then reconvene in just a few minutes.

1886
02:50:50,930 --> 02:50:51,450
I like it.

1887
02:50:58,730 --> 02:50:59,930
Mid-year budget adjustments.

1888
02:51:05,360 --> 02:51:12,560
Inept to file that on our 700 form I guess, right? I mean, maybe we can take the budget adjustments off if we have to. Yeah.

1889
02:51:22,120 --> 02:51:23,540
I would be important that we do one.

1890
02:51:37,800 --> 02:51:41,080
I like your style. I like your dreamer.

1891
02:51:44,260 --> 02:51:49,120
Okay. I will do everything to support that. If I not be alone, wind it.

1892
02:51:51,820 --> 02:51:52,280
Okay.

1893
02:51:54,880 --> 02:51:59,980
Okay, let's reconvene council members and members of the public.

1894
02:52:01,500 --> 02:52:12,020
And our next item is the mid-year budget amendments for this fiscal year that we're in presently.

1895
02:52:12,520 --> 02:52:17,840
Let's see, we're approaching the time when we have two fairgrounds.

1896
02:52:18,740 --> 02:52:20,440
We want to go to fairgrounds, really do that.

1897
02:52:20,440 --> 02:52:25,580
I think, and let's leave the budget at the end, so we'll skip it.

1898
02:52:25,680 --> 02:52:26,720
Okay, I'm going to skip it.

1899
02:52:27,700 --> 02:52:30,020
Okay, with that cast, no, that's what I was going to do.

1900
02:52:30,160 --> 02:52:38,400
I was going to move to, and we all move 7.2 to the end, and to extend the meeting to 9.30 if needed.

1901
02:52:39,120 --> 02:52:40,860
We need a majority vote on that.

1902
02:52:41,840 --> 02:52:44,080
Let's see, let's go roll call, make sure we're okay.

1903
02:52:44,080 --> 02:52:52,640
If we, Council members, we're being asked for approval for authorization to continue to 930.

1904
02:52:54,400 --> 02:52:55,720
Council member Eisenberg?

1905
02:52:55,960 --> 02:52:56,100
Aye.

1906
02:52:56,400 --> 02:52:57,140
Council member Cooper?

1907
02:52:57,380 --> 02:52:57,600
Aye.

1908
02:52:58,000 --> 02:52:58,720
Council member gift?

1909
02:52:59,140 --> 02:52:59,340
Aye.

1910
02:52:59,940 --> 02:53:01,140
Vice Mayor Lopez Roteca?

1911
02:53:01,460 --> 02:53:01,660
Aye.

1912
02:53:02,260 --> 02:53:02,680
Mayor Williams.

1913
02:53:03,040 --> 02:53:03,140
Aye.

1914
02:53:03,780 --> 02:53:04,140
Thank you.

1915
02:53:04,520 --> 02:53:06,080
So we'll continue till that time.

1916
02:53:06,300 --> 02:53:10,980
And at that time I understand if we want to continue longer, we need a unanimous vote to do that.

1917
02:53:12,360 --> 02:53:21,860
Let's go to, let's see, we're going to skip over for the moment, the mid-year budget amendments.

1918
02:53:23,180 --> 02:53:33,360
And let's see, we have the director write the survey consultant, and we have a limited

1919
02:53:33,360 --> 02:53:33,700
time.

1920
02:53:33,780 --> 02:53:35,180
So shall we bring that person on?

1921
02:53:35,180 --> 02:53:41,140
I do not want to put the survey ahead of the conversation for a subcommittee.

1922
02:53:41,640 --> 02:53:44,260
I personally don't think I don't want to do that.

1923
02:53:44,800 --> 02:53:48,900
I'm not prepared to vote on that if we aren't having the conversation at the subcommittee first.

1924
02:53:49,880 --> 02:53:51,600
Actually, I like that, I like that too.

1925
02:53:51,760 --> 02:53:52,160
So let's see,

1926
02:53:56,470 --> 02:54:06,190
yeah, I'm going to suggest, let's see, we go to 7-4, I think that's when you're referring to?

1927
02:54:08,090 --> 02:54:24,090
Okay, I'm going to suggest this order that we go to 7-4, and then 7-6, then 7-6, and 7-5 is fine.

1928
02:54:27,770 --> 02:54:31,030
Let's see, 7-4 is the advisory rule.

1929
02:54:39,000 --> 02:54:44,080
Let's see, my notes suggest that going, what about doing the feasibility plan first?

1930
02:54:44,780 --> 02:54:50,260
would we be okay with that, and going from there to the advisory role, and then last to the survey.

1931
02:54:53,810 --> 02:54:56,170
So I'm suggesting going right to 7.5,

1932
02:55:00,340 --> 02:55:00,560
okay.

1933
02:55:03,060 --> 02:55:05,220
Does it matter, Councilmember Giebt?

1934
02:55:05,820 --> 02:55:12,440
I mean, we have them in order at 7.4, the advisory committee, 7.5 is the facility, and then, yeah.

1935
02:55:13,520 --> 02:55:20,520
All right, let's go with 7.4, is the first one that's listed here related to fairgrounds.

1936
02:55:20,520 --> 02:55:29,640
All right, let's go to 7.4, options for fairground advisory role, fairground advisory body.

1937
02:55:30,480 --> 02:55:31,240
Okay, Director Wright.

1938
02:55:32,040 --> 02:55:38,680
Thank you for organizing these items for us, and would you like to start it off?

1939
02:55:39,500 --> 02:55:40,900
No problem, thank you Mayor.

1940
02:55:41,220 --> 02:55:49,880
Mayor and City Council members, the staff report before you is in regards to options for an advisory role.

1941
02:55:50,520 --> 02:55:58,320
for the fairgrounds. The two options that were given include a ad hoc committee, which

1942
02:55:58,320 --> 02:56:07,280
is devised for specific task purposes and a short duration, dissolving upon a certain

1943
02:56:07,280 --> 02:56:17,100
date or a committee task completion. The example given is a five-member community committee, but

1944
02:56:17,100 --> 02:56:23,920
But could also include a free community members and up to two council members.

1945
02:56:24,840 --> 02:56:33,560
The importance is that the ad hoc committee needs a specific task focus, and we should

1946
02:56:33,560 --> 02:56:39,380
make sure that we note that it does require Brown Act noticing and Brown Act components.

1947
02:56:39,380 --> 02:56:47,720
The second option given to you today is the Council subcommittee option.

1948
02:56:48,340 --> 02:56:57,540
In this option, the mayor appoints two council members to serve on the subcommittee with

1949
02:56:57,540 --> 02:57:04,800
concurrence of the full board, full council, excuse me, and it's also a temporary committee

1950
02:57:04,800 --> 02:57:18,860
but it has no set schedule for dissolving and this committee would work on Fairgrounds Council priorities, and it does not have Brown Act compliance.

1951
02:57:19,680 --> 02:57:27,880
There was an example in the staff report of the comparison of the two types of committees that I present to you today.

1952
02:57:28,760 --> 02:57:33,980
Great. Thank you for that. Any clarifying questions before we go for public comment?

1953
02:57:35,760 --> 02:57:37,880
Okay, let's open for public comment then.

1954
02:57:39,860 --> 02:57:49,960
Is there anybody here tonight who would like to address the council on this topic of advisory body and some suggestions that are in the staff report?

1955
02:57:53,290 --> 02:58:04,410
Carrie Abrue, 1720 Renard Lane, out of the two that Shelley just talked about in the

1956
02:58:04,410 --> 02:58:12,750
face of transparency with this community, I think it would be best to include a few

1957
02:58:12,750 --> 02:58:14,610
people's citizens of Calistoga.

1958
02:58:15,770 --> 02:58:25,050
It's and it to be where as long as the council and there were some parameters to it to exactly

1959
02:58:25,050 --> 02:58:31,850
what the focus is I mean I think that is imperative there's there's many people that

1960
02:58:31,850 --> 02:58:42,730
have worked hard to to bring the fairgrounds to to Calistoga there's there's people that

1961
02:58:42,730 --> 02:58:46,970
that have valued information that they could also share.

1962
02:58:47,170 --> 02:58:48,950
So I think that's something that should be considered.

1963
02:58:49,390 --> 02:58:49,730
Thank you.

1964
02:58:50,190 --> 02:58:50,590
Thank you.

1965
02:58:58,130 --> 02:58:59,370
Doug Allen, high street.

1966
02:59:00,450 --> 02:59:05,890
I think the discussion that the few of you had about the order

1967
02:59:05,890 --> 02:59:10,550
of the items on the agenda tonight is a great illustration

1968
02:59:10,550 --> 02:59:16,070
to me about how interwoven these topics are to one another,

1969
02:59:16,070 --> 02:59:23,670
and how complex this project is and it should be complex because it's a once-in-a-lifetime

1970
02:59:23,670 --> 02:59:25,910
opportunity to impact this property.

1971
02:59:27,510 --> 02:59:32,890
And so I actually wasn't planning to hear that, that was just kind of how you discussed

1972
02:59:32,890 --> 02:59:39,470
these items and how they unfolded, but I think at pinpoints the need not only for a committee,

1973
02:59:40,010 --> 02:59:44,610
but a committee to be part of a comprehensive plan.

1974
02:59:44,610 --> 02:59:57,170
And I don't know if you guys read my public comment earlier today, but the plan that we should be enacting includes that component, but many other components.

1975
02:59:57,170 --> 02:59:59,790
So we have an overarching idea and plan.

1976
03:00:00,000 --> 03:00:29,300
Vision for what the planning process is going to look like because it's hard, at least for me, is this human to make decisions on individual items as they pop up without a larger vision for the plan and the project. And so as you make this decision tonight on this particular item and the other two items, please consider the complexity and comprehensiveness that I believe this

1977
03:00:29,300 --> 03:00:32,560
This process needs to undertake to get to the right solution.

1978
03:00:33,900 --> 03:00:41,440
Part of that solution in my mind is having a community-based committee that within the confines of the law,

1979
03:00:42,020 --> 03:00:50,640
as broad as we can make it so that this committee can attack more than just a survey that may or may not happen.

1980
03:00:50,920 --> 03:00:53,100
So we can have a larger committee.

1981
03:00:53,580 --> 03:00:54,360
Thank you very much.

1982
03:00:54,480 --> 03:00:54,760
Thank you.

1983
03:01:09,790 --> 03:01:28,490
I would like to, first of all, endorse what Doug has put together and concur with the concept of an ongoing community effort of people in town as part of that process.

1984
03:01:28,490 --> 03:01:37,050
and by way of saying then I concur also with that it needs people from the community involved.

1985
03:01:38,410 --> 03:01:47,430
One of the things certainly that I've learned I've 50 years did not only designing buildings

1986
03:01:47,430 --> 03:01:57,310
but doing urban design throughout the Western United States and the Pacific Rim and there are projects

1987
03:01:57,310 --> 03:02:04,010
projects that we had worked on for 10 and 15 years.

1988
03:02:05,230 --> 03:02:14,630
This is a project that will outlive probably all of us and will be hopefully completed by the next generation.

1989
03:02:15,190 --> 03:02:24,170
And that needs continuity in the process that is just folks in town who are reporting.

1990
03:02:24,170 --> 03:02:29,830
part of the mission that needs to be incorporated with this group of

1991
03:02:29,830 --> 03:02:34,750
individuals that you might hopefully select and maybe it's a combination of

1992
03:02:34,750 --> 03:02:40,530
council people and citizens is that it's a conduit for communication and it's a

1993
03:02:40,530 --> 03:02:51,010
two-way conduit but the conduit to the council is very important and it's got to

1994
03:02:51,010 --> 03:02:58,330
be an ongoing dialogue. So that says don't give it a specific task and then end of

1995
03:02:58,330 --> 03:03:05,590
story, nor does it say give them a specific time. You can be renewable as it goes along,

1996
03:03:05,850 --> 03:03:13,310
it will by necessity morph and change through its lifetime. That's what I would hope it

1997
03:03:13,310 --> 03:03:21,410
would do because that's what's going to happen and it needs that ongoing input, that avenue

1998
03:03:22,310 --> 03:03:30,970
so that people know this is a place where I can go and let people know what is going

1999
03:03:30,970 --> 03:03:36,690
on and that will be reported to the council and hopefully maybe be reflected in the city's

2000
03:03:36,690 --> 03:03:39,790
website so that people can stay in tune.

2001
03:03:40,290 --> 03:03:45,810
So to that end, endorse the general principle here and

2002
03:03:45,810 --> 03:03:49,170
encourage you to make it more open ended and

2003
03:03:49,170 --> 03:03:54,650
invite the people in town in a structured way to be part of that process.

2004
03:03:56,110 --> 03:03:56,690
Thank you.

2005
03:04:05,830 --> 03:04:09,170
Evening, council mayor, Stephen Penske on High Street.

2006
03:04:09,670 --> 03:04:14,530
And I concur with everything that all three of

2007
03:04:14,530 --> 03:04:20,930
of the previous speakers have said, but I would like to just re-emphasize that it needs

2008
03:04:20,930 --> 03:04:29,290
to be not necessarily permanent, but it needs to be a committee that sees the entire

2009
03:04:29,290 --> 03:04:36,310
visioning and revisioning of the fairgrounds, including developing the business plan, and

2010
03:04:36,310 --> 03:04:45,670
And I think that a combination of community members from all sides of the argument and

2011
03:04:47,190 --> 03:04:50,730
some of the council members be included.

2012
03:04:51,170 --> 03:04:55,690
And that this, it may take two years, it may take ten years.

2013
03:04:56,290 --> 03:04:58,610
It, who knows, it may go on forever.

2014
03:04:59,070 --> 03:05:04,150
But it's an important, that the community has, it's saying.

2015
03:05:04,570 --> 03:05:04,870
Thank you.

2016
03:05:04,870 --> 03:05:05,870
Thank you.

2017
03:05:17,160 --> 03:05:23,220
My name is Tim Riley, I'm a permanent resident of Callistoga, and I've submitted a pretty detailed

2018
03:05:23,220 --> 03:05:24,120
list of comments.

2019
03:05:24,720 --> 03:05:29,040
I just wanted to emphasize a couple of key points here that we heard about earlier.

2020
03:05:29,500 --> 03:05:33,400
By the way, I agree with everything we've heard about this issue tonight.

2021
03:05:37,370 --> 03:05:41,510
You know, I think it's essential that we have continuity and that we engage right now,

2022
03:05:41,510 --> 03:05:51,830
starting now with the very well-structured articulated committed program for public participation.

2023
03:05:56,170 --> 03:06:05,150
That we think will end with if not developing a consensus around whatever decision related to the master plan is,

2024
03:06:05,150 --> 03:06:12,050
because there will be a consensus that the process for arriving at that plan was even

2025
03:06:12,050 --> 03:06:16,430
handed inclusive, objective, unbiased, all of those things.

2026
03:06:17,070 --> 03:06:26,570
If we want that to happen, we need to be focused on continuity and we need to be careful

2027
03:06:26,570 --> 03:06:31,390
when we select the members on the committee because their role is going to be not one of

2028
03:06:31,390 --> 03:06:56,050
the advocacy for a given alternative, but it's going to be a commitment to ensure that the process is welcoming and at the end of it, it's credible because at the end of this process, our community is going to be called again to make a really difficult decision about public resources and trade-offs.

2029
03:06:57,390 --> 03:07:15,410
And regardless of their own individual preferences, if the time comes for that decision, and they feel that they've been informed, they've been respected, they've been listened to, and they understand all the small incremental decisions that are now leading to their big decision.

2030
03:07:17,190 --> 03:07:21,430
That's going to be a much better outcome, regardless of what alternative is selected.

2031
03:07:21,430 --> 03:07:31,430
So, I think that it would be good for the council to approve the ad hoc committee, not

2032
03:07:31,430 --> 03:07:37,570
the instant, you know, not the episodic one, but the more longer alternative and start

2033
03:07:37,570 --> 03:07:44,330
working towards a mission statement for that committee, and at that point, charge the

2034
03:07:44,330 --> 03:07:50,410
committee to evaluate the selection process for the survey consultant, you know, and consider

2035
03:07:50,410 --> 03:07:57,050
that input when you make the decision on whether or not to award the contract to that provider.

2036
03:07:57,570 --> 03:07:58,490
Thank you.

2037
03:07:58,990 --> 03:07:59,450
Thank you.

2038
03:07:59,770 --> 03:08:00,170
Thank

2039
03:08:04,460 --> 03:08:04,460
you.

2040
03:08:04,540 --> 03:08:06,680
City clerk, is there anyone online?

2041
03:08:07,300 --> 03:08:07,800
No, no, no.

2042
03:08:08,000 --> 03:08:08,320
Okay.

2043
03:08:09,140 --> 03:08:09,780
Public comment?

2044
03:08:12,790 --> 03:08:13,570
Charlotte Williams.

2045
03:08:16,690 --> 03:08:25,310
Given the two proposals, I would select a smaller and simpler and more streamlined committee

2046
03:08:25,310 --> 03:08:34,590
of Council subcommittee, however, my other idea was to put it on a ballot and have the

2047
03:08:34,590 --> 03:08:44,550
citizens vote, the voters vote on whether they want to have a committee creating a vision

2048
03:08:44,880 --> 03:08:50,050
or whatever for the fairgrounds, that it's not a matter of an appointment, appointment by

2049
03:08:50,050 --> 03:08:55,550
city council that the voters in town who, of course, are not all the residents.

2050
03:08:55,910 --> 03:08:57,090
The children can't vote.

2051
03:08:57,910 --> 03:09:00,730
Anyone younger than 18 can't vote.

2052
03:09:01,310 --> 03:09:06,110
And there are many residents who probably aren't voters, but have lived here a long time.

2053
03:09:08,070 --> 03:09:12,290
So I don't like the idea of another layer of government.

2054
03:09:13,070 --> 03:09:16,690
Director Wright is being paid $180,000 a year.

2055
03:09:16,690 --> 03:09:41,370
She has experience, I think we need to be moving this fairgrounds along in a prompt manner to make sure there's income and then a plan, a larger plan, a greater plan can be developed later, but as was pointed out, many of us will not be here before very long.

2056
03:09:41,370 --> 03:09:47,290
And ideally, the fairgrounds exist for the public in perpetuity.

2057
03:09:48,090 --> 03:09:54,030
And so that means a lot of younger people who are not going to be on committees.

2058
03:09:56,190 --> 03:09:59,970
They're potentially going to be the ones living with whatever decisions are made.

2059
03:10:00,650 --> 03:10:09,370
So I would suggest a smaller subcommittee to account with a council subcommittee to just get this moving along.

2060
03:10:09,370 --> 03:10:25,970
and then if there is a lot of outcry for a citizens committee, then put it on the ballot and let the voters decide who is going to represent them as far as what happens at the fairground.

2061
03:10:26,530 --> 03:10:37,110
But my understanding right now is that Director Wright is very open to comments from everyone, local residents, citizens and others.

2062
03:10:38,210 --> 03:10:41,070
So I prefer a streamlined, thank you.

2063
03:10:41,270 --> 03:10:41,730
Thank you.

2064
03:10:47,190 --> 03:10:48,710
Why Ferris 1820 Grant?

2065
03:10:49,530 --> 03:10:51,090
I just want to reiterate what was just said.

2066
03:10:52,230 --> 03:10:54,910
From the start of this, you know, when it comes to transparency

2067
03:10:54,910 --> 03:10:57,690
and communication and information about all of this,

2068
03:10:57,970 --> 03:11:02,030
the five of you have always answered any, you know, concern question,

2069
03:11:02,290 --> 03:11:03,750
idea that I've had personally.

2070
03:11:04,270 --> 03:11:06,290
And since Shelley's come on board, she's done the same.

2071
03:11:07,810 --> 03:11:10,910
Is it perfect? No, but is anything perfect? No.

2072
03:11:10,910 --> 03:11:16,330
I think from the moment that we started this and actually got the keys there's been a lot that's been done

2073
03:11:16,330 --> 03:11:22,810
And we're definitely moving in a forward process and again from the start the idea was to just get this thing going

2074
03:11:22,810 --> 03:11:31,770
And so now at some point I think it's great to bring all of this on and and I'm going to kind of reiterate the same thing for the next two topics, but

2075
03:11:32,610 --> 03:11:34,550
we're moving in the right direction and

2076
03:11:34,550 --> 03:11:42,010
And anybody and everybody is welcome to come to these meetings and talk to you guys and it seems to be the same ten of us that are here so

2077
03:11:42,590 --> 03:11:47,550
Are we gonna over complicate something that doesn't need to be you know more complicated than it is?

2078
03:11:49,810 --> 03:11:50,890
Thank you

2079
03:11:54,310 --> 03:11:57,230
Any other public comments from the

2080
03:11:58,190 --> 03:12:01,490
Chambers here or online city clerk

2081
03:12:03,710 --> 03:12:09,430
Okay, okay, let's close public comment and bring it back to us council members

2082
03:12:10,110 --> 03:12:11,250
I would like to start off.

2083
03:12:11,250 --> 03:12:12,630
I would like to start.

2084
03:12:13,130 --> 03:12:15,230
I'm not really a fan of either of these.

2085
03:12:15,870 --> 03:12:18,150
I think that a blend would be more appropriate.

2086
03:12:18,150 --> 03:12:26,310
My vision would be to quickly establish a community based committee with probably two council

2087
03:12:26,310 --> 03:12:32,850
members and one at large and really implement this very quickly.

2088
03:12:32,990 --> 03:12:37,570
I'd like to see it in a permanent basis maybe have term limits so that other people could

2089
03:12:37,570 --> 03:12:38,470
also contribute.

2090
03:12:39,110 --> 03:12:44,590
And I think it's important to not just have the City Councils, members on the subcommittee,

2091
03:12:44,790 --> 03:12:51,870
but again have a great blend of a good sized group of concerned citizens I would consider

2092
03:12:51,870 --> 03:12:55,490
maybe eight or higher would be a good idea.

2093
03:12:55,810 --> 03:12:58,790
But again, you know, I don't think it's something that should end quickly.

2094
03:12:58,790 --> 03:13:02,050
I think it needs to be ongoing and I think it will definitely outlive us.

2095
03:13:02,050 --> 03:13:06,470
I don't think it needs to be at the level of a fair board at this juncture.

2096
03:13:06,470 --> 03:13:11,250
But I just think it's really important to involve the community members.

2097
03:13:11,530 --> 03:13:23,870
And I would suggest potentially that the mayor could appoint out of the vast group of talent that you have worked with in the past, and then we could potentially review that.

2098
03:13:24,290 --> 03:13:29,150
Just my particular perspective on everything, and I look forward to hearing from everyone else.

2099
03:13:29,150 --> 03:13:33,010
Okay, sure, Councilman Eisenberg.

2100
03:13:33,770 --> 03:13:43,610
Okay, I've really thought about this for a very long time and continue to think and continue to evolve, I hope, may make it to humans soon.

2101
03:13:46,480 --> 03:13:54,060
We absolutely need public input, and I think the

2102
03:13:56,970 --> 03:14:02,390
real issues we have to deal is how, what is the real purpose of the committee?

2103
03:14:02,390 --> 03:14:04,270
I think that's really important.

2104
03:14:05,850 --> 03:14:06,970
Members are easy.

2105
03:14:07,470 --> 03:14:09,750
I agree with Councilman Cooper.

2106
03:14:10,570 --> 03:14:11,990
Let's have two Council people.

2107
03:14:12,790 --> 03:14:17,230
Staff person and four, you know, whatever the mix is.

2108
03:14:17,410 --> 03:14:19,530
Four community members.

2109
03:14:20,490 --> 03:14:22,870
That would be a really nice mix.

2110
03:14:24,010 --> 03:14:26,610
But what are we going to do with this committee?

2111
03:14:27,650 --> 03:14:30,610
Well, my first job that I thought of would be,

2112
03:14:30,610 --> 03:14:42,030
When we, of course, have a survey that this committee be charged with being the conduit.

2113
03:14:42,110 --> 03:14:44,590
Conduit is my new word that I like.

2114
03:14:44,770 --> 03:14:47,750
Thank you, Mr. Wilkes, I'm thinking conduit.

2115
03:14:48,170 --> 03:14:55,290
The conduit from all the community input that we've already received to the survey designers,

2116
03:14:55,290 --> 03:14:58,850
and make sure that it includes

2117
03:15:00,000 --> 03:15:05,780
Everything we've talked about, and then, of course, we rely on the survey designers, then to

2118
03:15:05,780 --> 03:15:16,180
turn all that input into objective questions that aren't influenced by, well, I'm getting

2119
03:15:16,180 --> 03:15:30,420
into the survey debate. But as a conduit, and after that, the committee then could continue,

2120
03:15:30,420 --> 03:15:38,400
continue with conduit activities, how to gather more information from the

2121
03:15:38,400 --> 03:15:44,440
community, how to make sure the community sees the survey results, what it

2122
03:15:44,440 --> 03:15:54,480
means and understand it, continued to bring in input and not but the

2123
03:15:54,480 --> 03:16:04,540
The council cannot delegate its responsibility as your elected officials to make decisions.

2124
03:16:04,780 --> 03:16:12,300
We are the only ones that are totally responsible to the community, to the voters.

2125
03:16:13,120 --> 03:16:24,260
This committee could serve an incredibly useful purpose of bringing information, distilling

2126
03:16:24,260 --> 03:16:38,820
it in being part of the discussion with the council, but I cannot see saying committee

2127
03:16:39,520 --> 03:16:51,740
come up with a master plan that it eventually has to come to the to our public meetings here.

2128
03:16:53,280 --> 03:17:21,010
and it's not going to be a fast process, and the committee would could bring all sorts of expertise as they bring in information, as they dispense information out to the community, as they share information with the council as a whole, and you can have experts in all different aspects. I hope that if we do set this up, that we have four or five,

2129
03:17:21,010 --> 03:17:29,950
five community members with a variety of expertise, not there to advance how they think

2130
03:17:30,290 --> 03:17:31,990
the fairground should be.

2131
03:17:33,350 --> 03:17:41,110
But to look at, to bring in all the input, look at it critically, help distill it and

2132
03:17:41,110 --> 03:17:48,470
bring it where it will eventually have to be decided by elected officials.

2133
03:17:50,550 --> 03:17:56,970
with plenty of discussion from the community and the people who come to our meetings and send us letters.

2134
03:17:57,830 --> 03:17:59,970
So I absolutely do think we need a committee.

2135
03:18:01,070 --> 03:18:04,950
I think we need to be clear on what its purpose is.

2136
03:18:07,170 --> 03:18:07,870
Thank you.

2137
03:18:11,720 --> 03:18:12,140
Talk or?

2138
03:18:12,480 --> 03:18:12,720
Okay.

2139
03:18:13,020 --> 03:18:13,180
No matter.

2140
03:18:14,520 --> 03:18:15,780
Do you want to go?

2141
03:18:15,900 --> 03:18:16,420
I can go next.

2142
03:18:16,940 --> 03:18:17,280
Okay.

2143
03:18:17,540 --> 03:18:18,680
I think for the vice mayor was there.

2144
03:18:18,680 --> 03:18:18,960
Vice mayor.

2145
03:18:19,200 --> 03:18:19,680
Okay.

2146
03:18:19,680 --> 03:18:31,650
I agree that also is important to have a committee, but we need to be sure that we get

2147
03:18:31,650 --> 03:18:37,690
representation from all the different groups that they are hearing in Calistoga.

2148
03:18:38,510 --> 03:18:48,430
We had to form a committee similar to the Green Committee of the Housing Committee.

2149
03:18:48,430 --> 03:18:56,330
I believe that we should have a process that they will, whoever wants to be in the committee,

2150
03:18:56,870 --> 03:19:02,990
they should submit an application, explain why they want to be in this committee,

2151
03:19:03,710 --> 03:19:10,450
explaining their qualifications, how they've been involved in other affairs of the community,

2152
03:19:11,110 --> 03:19:15,170
their experience as an active volunteers, etc.

2153
03:19:16,010 --> 03:19:27,050
Also, you know, we need to, as I say before, we need to have a representation for everybody here.

2154
03:19:27,470 --> 03:19:34,190
It doesn't have to be a huge, you know, a large, a bunch of members,

2155
03:19:34,550 --> 03:19:40,150
but one member representing specific groups, you know, like, for example,

2156
03:19:40,150 --> 03:19:44,130
for somebody who represents the people who wants the races,

2157
03:19:44,790 --> 03:19:48,730
somebody who wants the people who wants other things that

2158
03:19:48,730 --> 03:19:49,250
happening.

2159
03:19:50,530 --> 03:19:54,890
So that way, everybody gets represented

2160
03:19:54,890 --> 03:20:01,310
and it will be clear and it will be open to, you know,

2161
03:20:01,570 --> 03:20:06,050
for so it will be no internal decisions that it will be made.

2162
03:20:06,050 --> 03:20:17,010
It will very clear, and also we need to create the rules, and we need to create the mission of the committee.

2163
03:20:17,250 --> 03:20:19,870
I think it's important to have all the-

2164
03:20:21,910 --> 03:20:27,130
Okay, so without being too repetitive and trying to get it along here,

2165
03:20:27,970 --> 03:20:33,750
I think that it is imperative that along with you, that we have this committee,

2166
03:20:34,130 --> 03:20:37,390
there were comments made earlier that maybe the next generations wouldn't

2167
03:20:37,390 --> 03:20:44,450
serve on these committees, I beg to differ when we see some of the younger generation stepping to serve on the existing committees that are in place.

2168
03:20:45,410 --> 03:20:52,510
I think it is also imperative that we are a methodical in this process when we are looking back at other projects, for

2169
03:20:52,510 --> 03:20:55,650
instance, Logby Park in the pool. We're still completing that project.

2170
03:20:55,790 --> 03:21:00,210
This is now 18 years in the works that was done through really thoughtful planning it.

2171
03:21:00,210 --> 03:21:02,270
It did take a really, really long time.

2172
03:21:03,330 --> 03:21:10,390
And since we're just really talking specific to this item, and

2173
03:21:10,390 --> 03:21:17,310
what I envision this as, I do envision the council making those really big decisions.

2174
03:21:17,310 --> 03:21:23,450
However, similar to our other committees and commissions, they bring us a work plan that is approved.

2175
03:21:23,630 --> 03:21:25,810
Or we assign work for them.

2176
03:21:26,090 --> 03:21:28,970
So it would have to be after all of these other things take place.

2177
03:21:28,970 --> 03:21:41,730
So if we're talking about what we envision, I envision, I like the idea of combining two council members in a combination with four to five members of the community and a staff member.

2178
03:21:42,050 --> 03:21:48,510
I think that just like all of our other committees and commissions, these people need to apply for these appointments.

2179
03:21:48,510 --> 03:21:53,970
I think that they're similarly they may be can come with a recommendation from the mayor

2180
03:21:53,970 --> 03:22:00,790
but each of those appointments needs to be agreed upon by the entire council to ensure just good representation.

2181
03:22:02,030 --> 03:22:07,610
I also think that it's really a great starting point would be to oversee the aspects of this survey

2182
03:22:07,610 --> 03:22:13,910
followed by the feasibility plan and then from there we start some of the heavy lifting.

2183
03:22:14,170 --> 03:22:18,410
But I think that could be a very very good starting point and I don't envision this as a short

2184
03:22:18,410 --> 03:22:24,270
term thing. I envision this as an ongoing long term thing and maybe this committee or commission

2185
03:22:24,270 --> 03:22:29,170
changes with time and we decide okay maybe it doesn't need council members anymore. It's just

2186
03:22:29,170 --> 03:22:34,190
members of the committee but with that said I think that we're all in agreement but we just need

2187
03:22:34,190 --> 03:22:43,610
to dial it down to what that committee or commission looks like. So thank you. So I'm fine. I actually

2188
03:22:43,610 --> 03:22:59,890
partial towards option one, which assuming that we approve a survey, I'm going on that assumption that the public be invited to participate in organizing the question, the survey questions and so on.

2189
03:23:00,910 --> 03:23:13,250
I'm fine, I endorse and I approve and I encourage folks to organize and give comments and participate and we welcome that and we welcome that all the way along here.

2190
03:23:14,370 --> 03:23:19,950
We already have at least three groups here in town working on the fairgrounds.

2191
03:23:21,310 --> 03:23:27,690
We have the friends in Napa County fairgrounds, who have done lots of work before we ever got this far.

2192
03:23:28,330 --> 03:23:32,570
And they've organized the help to organize with the clean update, for example,

2193
03:23:32,750 --> 03:23:37,270
and the accompanying encouragement and enthusiasm building before we got to this point.

2194
03:23:37,270 --> 03:23:48,870
We also have a group of unnamed volunteers who have been working weekends and days and nights out there at note charts, anybody.

2195
03:23:49,430 --> 03:24:00,510
And there's a group of people who, you know, they're not named and organized as a committee, but they've been working out there for months now and they're participating heavily.

2196
03:24:00,510 --> 03:24:09,850
We've gotten hundreds and hundreds of comments and letters, we're not ignoring those, we have lots of, lots of comments over the years.

2197
03:24:10,750 --> 03:24:20,130
And we also have a third group which is us, we're the ones who are appointed or elected by the public to make the kind of decision.

2198
03:24:20,290 --> 03:24:27,850
So there's at least three groups, if not more, in town who are working on the fairgrounds.

2199
03:24:27,850 --> 03:24:47,230
If other groups, other groups of people want to organize, I encourage that, I approve it, I endorse it, but they don't need our blessing, they don't need us to appoint them, they can appoint, they can organize themselves, and they can bring ideas to us, and they don't need our permission to do that.

2200
03:24:47,230 --> 03:24:59,830
But if we establish a formal committee, it basically amounts to an alter council, and we can say it's advisory.

2201
03:25:00,630 --> 03:25:12,010
But if there are recommendations emerging from that committee and they've done work on it and they had their point of view, it's going to be hard for this council to say thanks but no thanks.

2202
03:25:12,010 --> 03:25:21,870
It's going to amount to an alternative council, and we're basically delegating the authority which is invested in us by the voters.

2203
03:25:22,230 --> 03:25:30,850
We're the ones who ran the campaigns, put ourselves out there, and we're the ones who are chosen by the public to make these kinds of decisions.

2204
03:25:31,670 --> 03:25:38,870
Now it doesn't mean we don't listen, we do want to hear what the public says, but if another committee is appointed by this council,

2205
03:25:38,870 --> 03:25:46,670
So it will face the same questions, why would it not face the same questions that are being talked about here?

2206
03:25:47,010 --> 03:25:57,060
There are terms, there are expressions of informed and respected bodies, okay?

2207
03:25:57,580 --> 03:26:01,860
Why would they be any more informed and respected than this body is already?

2208
03:26:04,160 --> 03:26:08,440
If we want a committee that encourages participation and is welcoming,

2209
03:26:08,440 --> 03:26:15,720
Why would that committee be any more encouraging a participation or welcoming than we are already are?

2210
03:26:17,440 --> 03:26:22,520
Let's see, keeping the focus, including the public, having a place for input.

2211
03:26:23,100 --> 03:26:24,860
Those things are available right now.

2212
03:26:25,020 --> 03:26:32,700
If another committee is established, those same concerns could be brought to that committee as well.

2213
03:26:33,420 --> 03:26:44,140
If another committee is appointed, why would we be assigning to those five or seven, however many people?

2214
03:26:44,700 --> 03:26:52,480
Why would we be assigning to them any authority or any privilege that's not available to everybody else in the public?

2215
03:26:53,160 --> 03:26:58,820
Why is that committee special in some way just because by virtue of their appointment?

2216
03:26:58,820 --> 03:27:04,280
You know, that doesn't really, that doesn't really, you know, why should they be empowered?

2217
03:27:04,380 --> 03:27:05,160
I don't see that at all.

2218
03:27:05,540 --> 03:27:08,820
Well, so what I have seen is a constant drum beat.

2219
03:27:09,420 --> 03:27:09,580
Right.

2220
03:27:09,700 --> 03:27:20,440
The phone calls, the conversations, the emails, the text that it's very important to the community that we do establish, semi-formal.

2221
03:27:20,720 --> 03:27:28,700
So what can, here's my, as a practical question, what can an appointed committee do that an independent committee cannot do?

2222
03:27:29,580 --> 03:27:34,980
But an independent committee can do everything that we're talking about.

2223
03:27:35,600 --> 03:27:40,120
They can receive public, they can look for public comment, they can bring comments to us,

2224
03:27:40,660 --> 03:27:46,700
they can generate ideas, they can employ, or they consult with experts, all of those things can happen.

2225
03:27:47,240 --> 03:27:53,420
But if independent committee, but if the City Council members are not involved directly with one of those committees,

2226
03:27:53,420 --> 03:28:04,180
then there's no conduit to staff, part of the involvement of the city council members with a semi-formal ad hoc or subcommittee, whatever you want.

2227
03:28:04,580 --> 03:28:16,880
I'm just saying that in the scope of what I've heard from the public, there is a very important desire for this type of committee that we're interviewing.

2228
03:28:17,020 --> 03:28:19,880
Now there may be three or four others, right? I don't know of them.

2229
03:28:20,380 --> 03:28:21,860
I'm sure they're doing great work.

2230
03:28:21,960 --> 03:28:26,020
I'd love to hear from them, but I just think there needs to be some degree of formalized,

2231
03:28:26,980 --> 03:28:34,660
accepted committee that interacts in engages specifically with city council members who,

2232
03:28:34,760 --> 03:28:38,700
again, can relate the discussions to staff.

2233
03:28:38,900 --> 03:28:40,580
We don't want to involve staff.

2234
03:28:40,940 --> 03:28:42,920
They've got everything enough on their place.

2235
03:28:43,280 --> 03:28:46,560
And how could an independent committee not be in contact with us?

2236
03:28:46,560 --> 03:28:56,300
I mean, the independent committee comes to us and says we'd like research on this or on that or help us with this or that and we have access to staff.

2237
03:28:57,280 --> 03:29:02,400
Okay, so I'm wondering how are we coming out of head with independent committee?

2238
03:29:02,960 --> 03:29:03,680
Yes, Councilman Eisenberg.

2239
03:29:03,880 --> 03:29:03,960
Okay.

2240
03:29:03,960 --> 03:29:12,300
As soon as Councilperson Giff tonight decide who's going to speak next, the

2241
03:29:14,760 --> 03:29:35,720
advantage of having the committee is as a central conduit, a place for all these disparate groups to come and know that here is a place where they can immediately get their feelings known,

2242
03:29:35,720 --> 03:29:42,720
give opinions. I don't picture, like I said before, I don't picture any formal

2243
03:29:42,720 --> 03:29:52,260
committee we have as being in charge of the fairgrounds. But I do see them as this

2244
03:29:52,260 --> 03:29:59,640
as a conduit for all the separate groups to be able to provide input and to

2245
03:29:59,640 --> 03:29:59,900
you can

2246
03:30:00,000 --> 03:30:29,780
Distill things who can bring it back to us and I do believe that there should be a council person or two on the committee because it's one can help guide where both it can work two ways. The council people can help guide the citizen group where the council is how the council feels or bring things very directly being part of the discussion and understand.

2247
03:30:29,780 --> 03:30:37,480
understanding better why the discussion went a certain way, why there were certain elements that they felt was important that go to council.

2248
03:30:41,020 --> 03:30:59,460
I've become less and less worried about where people stand on this committee and really just want people who are open, want to listen, don't have a set point of view.

2249
03:30:59,460 --> 03:31:04,380
We're going to, if they do have a set point of view, know that their obligation to the

2250
03:31:04,380 --> 03:31:10,740
committee is stronger than their own personal views as we are on council.

2251
03:31:12,980 --> 03:31:23,240
So as I said initially, the council cannot delegate its authority.

2252
03:31:24,060 --> 03:31:26,760
And that's why the purpose has to be clear.

2253
03:31:27,820 --> 03:31:36,570
It's not, maybe it's to look at how different things might work on the, on the fairgrounds,

2254
03:31:36,610 --> 03:31:42,550
the committee could look at that, but it's not to make decisions on the way it's going

2255
03:31:42,550 --> 03:31:43,070
to be.

2256
03:31:43,530 --> 03:31:51,710
It's to provide the information, the knowledge, the thoughtfulness that will help us as a

2257
03:31:51,710 --> 03:31:53,470
council make the decisions.

2258
03:31:53,470 --> 03:31:58,590
In Councilmember Eisenberg, were you going to make a motion about extending the meeting?

2259
03:32:02,420 --> 03:32:07,140
Yes, because we're going to vote on the survey whether you want to or not.

2260
03:32:07,320 --> 03:32:14,660
I move that we extend the meeting to 9.50.

2261
03:32:15,640 --> 03:32:16,160
Second.

2262
03:32:16,840 --> 03:32:18,840
Okay, we have a motion and second.

2263
03:32:19,080 --> 03:32:20,180
It takes unanimous vote.

2264
03:32:21,900 --> 03:32:22,900
Councilmember Eisenberg?

2265
03:32:23,300 --> 03:32:23,520
Aye.

2266
03:32:24,120 --> 03:32:24,900
Councilmember Cooper?

2267
03:32:25,220 --> 03:32:25,440
Aye.

2268
03:32:25,440 --> 03:32:27,200
May I come to my brief gift?

2269
03:32:27,760 --> 03:32:27,840
Aye.

2270
03:32:28,380 --> 03:32:30,040
Vice Mayor Lopez Ortega.

2271
03:32:30,340 --> 03:32:30,460
Aye.

2272
03:32:31,380 --> 03:32:32,140
And Mayor Williams.

2273
03:32:33,950 --> 03:32:35,950
Thank you for that reminder.

2274
03:32:36,430 --> 03:32:36,570
Yes.

2275
03:32:36,950 --> 03:32:38,010
And it also...

2276
03:32:38,690 --> 03:32:40,470
Unfortunately, it also quieted me down.

2277
03:32:43,130 --> 03:32:43,410
Okay.

2278
03:32:43,950 --> 03:32:46,650
So just a few things to unpack here.

2279
03:32:47,430 --> 03:32:48,250
Number one.

2280
03:32:48,930 --> 03:32:56,630
As elected, our job really is to do what our constituents are asking of us.

2281
03:32:56,630 --> 03:33:06,670
And even before the acquisition of the Fairgrounds, I was getting requests for a subcommittee of members of our community.

2282
03:33:07,410 --> 03:33:26,230
And just like members of our other committees, many people are professionals or experts in their field that bring to us experience and information that we don't otherwise have to be able to disseminate this incredibly complex topic.

2283
03:33:26,230 --> 03:33:28,190
and information for us.

2284
03:33:28,690 --> 03:33:32,590
One prime example of this would be our Housing Advisory Committee.

2285
03:33:32,930 --> 03:33:39,350
And we gave them the incredible daunting task of updating our housing element.

2286
03:33:40,030 --> 03:33:46,050
And we put full trust and confidence into them to do that, which goes back to the state,

2287
03:33:46,050 --> 03:33:52,110
and is that huge, convoluted process, all based on the experience of the people that we

2288
03:33:52,110 --> 03:33:53,790
appointed to that board.

2289
03:33:53,790 --> 03:34:02,370
So, in that, I would have the same trust in a board that we would appoint to work on the

2290
03:34:02,370 --> 03:34:07,350
fairgrounds and whether that is in projects that we direct, such as the Housing Advisory

2291
03:34:07,350 --> 03:34:17,650
Committee on that piece, or the Green Committee on idling, or the foodware ordinances, whatever

2292
03:34:17,650 --> 03:34:22,070
way we choose to operate that committee is something that we would have to decide, but

2293
03:34:22,070 --> 03:34:38,830
But to have that committee and to be able to not only answer to our constituents, make our public happy and have that community involvement, we would also have experts in their respective fields helping us on this really incredible project.

2294
03:34:38,830 --> 03:34:58,470
And I can be supportive if a committee residents has a specific task and a, you know, a limited, you know, has a specific purpose, a specific task, for example, the work on the survey, assuming, assuming we approve that.

2295
03:34:58,470 --> 03:35:10,990
If it's an ongoing and broad open-ended kind of committee, that's an alter council, an alternative council, and that I would not support.

2296
03:35:11,330 --> 03:35:20,230
But if it's limited scope, specific scope, and they're doing work that somebody has to do, it would be much appreciated and I could support that.

2297
03:35:20,230 --> 03:35:40,130
That's why I mentioned that whoever wants to be part of this committee, they have to submit an application that the entire council will review and then we will decide, you know, according to their qualifications and what they have to offer to this committee.

2298
03:35:40,730 --> 03:35:43,630
So without discriminating anybody.

2299
03:35:43,630 --> 03:35:51,910
Yeah, exactly, and I don't, not to get into semantics too much, but yeah, just those

2300
03:35:51,910 --> 03:35:59,530
kind of examples of, let's say, as a council, we say, we need to find a partnership with

2301
03:36:00,150 --> 03:36:06,530
somebody who will host events, community events, and you go maybe find a nonprofit public

2302
03:36:06,530 --> 03:36:10,890
partner in the community and work on a contract with them, and then they could bring that back

2303
03:36:10,890 --> 03:36:15,250
to us for us to decide on for example I think we're close to a consensus

2304
03:36:16,390 --> 03:36:21,110
I'm sure Michelle could provide guidance and specific tasks as well exactly and they would

2305
03:36:21,110 --> 03:36:25,610
work closely with Shelley on she would be yeah I'm fine with how he would liaison with

2306
03:36:25,610 --> 03:36:33,370
with Shelley as well and he's not taking away her job or her authority you know she's the director

2307
03:36:33,370 --> 03:36:40,430
and she's the one the expert who's gonna tell us what to ask to the committee so you know

2308
03:36:40,430 --> 03:36:43,370
is going to be a win-win situation for everybody.

2309
03:36:44,050 --> 03:36:47,090
We get the input from the members of the community,

2310
03:36:47,350 --> 03:36:53,410
their ideas, working with the policies that they are in place

2311
03:36:53,410 --> 03:36:55,070
for their programs already.

2312
03:36:55,270 --> 03:36:58,270
And just like other staff, their recommendations come to us.

2313
03:36:58,370 --> 03:36:58,510
Right.

2314
03:36:59,730 --> 03:37:05,210
Yeah, just to clarify though, we don't need a committee to receive public input.

2315
03:37:05,490 --> 03:37:05,630
No.

2316
03:37:06,490 --> 03:37:09,290
We have lots of public input coming and we receive lots.

2317
03:37:09,290 --> 03:37:15,310
So it's not because we're establishing a committee that we're going to have public input.

2318
03:37:15,310 --> 03:37:23,910
It's already available to us and that's already welcome and if anybody thinks it isn't, you know, an extended welcome again.

2319
03:37:23,930 --> 03:37:34,530
We are always available to public input, absolutely, but to help distill it, that's a much harder job.

2320
03:37:35,590 --> 03:37:49,780
How many emails did we all get about the committee just having a committee and, sure, I could go through it and count up.

2321
03:37:49,920 --> 03:37:54,420
Okay, seven are in favor of a committee of four people and three are in favor.

2322
03:37:55,480 --> 03:38:05,200
I think it's a valuable, it would be valuable to have a committee that can take things in.

2323
03:38:05,200 --> 03:38:10,920
and organize it and think about the implications of it.

2324
03:38:11,340 --> 03:38:17,880
It's not just organization, but what does it mean to do that?

2325
03:38:18,340 --> 03:38:24,880
And perhaps even research on what some ideas are on cost or feasibility.

2326
03:38:27,290 --> 03:38:31,030
That's helping us out in our decision making.

2327
03:38:31,370 --> 03:38:35,990
Distilling conduit, I love that word conduit.

2328
03:38:35,990 --> 03:38:39,870
But I'm going to be stuck with condo and go home and start working on my wiring.

2329
03:38:41,850 --> 03:38:43,650
I'm distilling condo it.

2330
03:38:44,750 --> 03:38:53,870
It's late, I'm a little okay, but yeah, there's really, there can be a good use.

2331
03:38:54,830 --> 03:39:04,570
As long as we understand where the limits are and as long as we do our jobs as council

2332
03:39:04,570 --> 03:39:11,210
of people. I think we're okay. And as far as, like I said, I'm not as concerned now

2333
03:39:11,210 --> 03:39:16,630
about what's side everyone's on and I'm going to try to think outside of side just good

2334
03:39:16,630 --> 03:39:24,050
people that represent our community and represent different aspects of our community and represent

2335
03:39:24,050 --> 03:39:29,030
different skills. And I hope that comes out in whatever applications we do.

2336
03:39:29,030 --> 03:39:38,190
So would this be the time to make a suggestion on the structure of which of what we want to adopt because it seems like kind of like a hybrid of both?

2337
03:39:38,470 --> 03:39:54,350
It does seem like a hybrid and in fact the ad hoc committee and the subcommittee are both types of committee that the brown out deals with and I don't pretend to be a legal expert or legal with regard to the city.

2338
03:39:54,350 --> 03:40:01,470
But I can tell you that an ad hoc committee is a temporary advisory body.

2339
03:40:02,090 --> 03:40:09,410
It means to have a specific defined purpose, something that they can support and do.

2340
03:40:09,950 --> 03:40:17,110
It has a limited scope of duration, which basically means that you either give it a time frame

2341
03:40:17,110 --> 03:40:18,670
or a task completion.

2342
03:40:18,670 --> 03:40:27,150
So if you're wanting to end that ad hoc committee, certainly could have some council members

2343
03:40:27,150 --> 03:40:35,310
and some community members on it, but that is a specific committee for a specific purpose.

2344
03:40:36,210 --> 03:40:40,850
So if that is something that you're wanting, that's how an ad hoc committee works.

2345
03:40:40,850 --> 03:40:50,910
It also is one of the types of committees that must have notice and fall all the other

2346
03:40:50,910 --> 03:40:52,150
brown act rules.

2347
03:40:53,050 --> 03:40:57,570
The second type of committee that I gave to you was the one that was only of two council

2348
03:40:57,570 --> 03:41:04,250
members and so that does not follow the brown act with regard to meeting.

2349
03:41:04,990 --> 03:41:11,570
When I wrote down what it was that each of you were kind of talking about, to talk about

2350
03:41:11,570 --> 03:41:19,670
committees and correct me if I'm wrong, it sounded like Scott wanted a bit of a blend.

2351
03:41:19,830 --> 03:41:24,430
He would like two council members and potentially three community members.

2352
03:41:25,330 --> 03:41:32,310
An ad hoc committee is appointed by the mayor in our procedures. Scott did mention that.

2353
03:41:32,310 --> 03:41:37,810
And that sounds more like an ad hoc committee with a specific purpose.

2354
03:41:38,490 --> 03:41:45,830
Sounded like Kevin wanted, he just acknowledged that we really wanted a committee.

2355
03:41:46,490 --> 03:41:53,410
He stated that he wanted to make sure that we have a true purpose for that committee.

2356
03:41:56,630 --> 03:42:00,090
IRIS wants applications for the committee.

2357
03:42:01,010 --> 03:42:06,370
She had talked about it being a large advisory committee, a little bit longer term,

2358
03:42:06,790 --> 03:42:14,510
and wants to make sure that it follows the rules and procedures that regular committees have.

2359
03:42:14,510 --> 03:42:21,210
That's more like a regular advisory committee.

2360
03:42:21,670 --> 03:42:29,930
That was not an option on the agenda today, but could potentially be something that staff could bring back to you, maybe in March.

2361
03:42:31,130 --> 03:42:43,970
Lisa asked for something more on the lines like Iris wanted, something with a work plan that's traditional for a regular advisory body committee.

2362
03:42:43,970 --> 03:42:50,210
Something ongoing long-term, those are all long-term committees, not an ad hoc committee

2363
03:42:50,210 --> 03:42:57,230
with a specific purpose, and also a blend of community and council.

2364
03:42:58,430 --> 03:43:07,410
And the mayor talked about some of the really natural committees that have already formed.

2365
03:43:07,410 --> 03:43:18,810
We have a large presence of both business owners from the surrounding area and individuals who have been working on the grounds.

2366
03:43:19,570 --> 03:43:26,670
They talk all the time together, they give ideas to me all the time that they have talked about.

2367
03:43:27,270 --> 03:43:32,050
And essentially, they are very much like a committee, many of them come here.

2368
03:43:32,910 --> 03:43:37,990
and then there was the Napa County Fair friends.

2369
03:43:38,330 --> 03:43:40,610
They did help organize the cleanup day.

2370
03:43:40,830 --> 03:43:42,470
They're wanting to do another one.

2371
03:43:44,330 --> 03:43:49,070
And there actually has been a fraction off of that group trying

2372
03:43:49,070 --> 03:43:53,290
to start a non-profit, but not all of the group members.

2373
03:43:54,490 --> 03:44:00,750
And it does sound like the mayor was reticent.

2374
03:44:00,750 --> 03:44:05,450
But, but okay about forming a committee for a specific purpose.

2375
03:44:06,090 --> 03:44:06,430
Yes.

2376
03:44:08,540 --> 03:44:09,140
Yes.

2377
03:44:09,540 --> 03:44:19,300
I am prepared to amend this and make a motion for a committee if a, sorry, you may have had something to say.

2378
03:44:19,560 --> 03:44:20,260
Just what you said.

2379
03:44:20,660 --> 03:44:23,940
Okay. You probably will say it more eloquently than me, principal.

2380
03:44:24,280 --> 03:44:24,540
Okay.

2381
03:44:25,300 --> 03:44:28,180
I'm not, I think we are capable.

2382
03:44:28,800 --> 03:44:32,020
I think I'm going to have to redo that motion on what time we leave.

2383
03:44:33,920 --> 03:44:41,440
I think we're perfectly capable of coming to a consensus amongst the five of us and come

2384
03:44:41,440 --> 03:44:42,900
up with a motion tonight.

2385
03:44:44,660 --> 03:44:50,450
And I don't think we have to send it back to staff.

2386
03:44:50,450 --> 03:44:59,970
So I'm going to, this is a motion but you're allowed to alter it.

2387
03:45:00,020 --> 03:45:28,800
Any way you want, and I'm not married to any of the piece, but I want to get this done. But before I do that motion, I'm going to suggest that we extend our time and 1015. I'm willing to get through at least a survey. Yeah. Yeah. 1015 and we do the survey right after this.

2388
03:45:28,800 --> 03:45:29,000
Yes.

2389
03:45:29,880 --> 03:45:30,460
That's fine.

2390
03:45:31,040 --> 03:45:31,280
Okay.

2391
03:45:32,660 --> 03:45:33,100
Mayor.

2392
03:45:33,440 --> 03:45:34,860
You want to call us?

2393
03:45:34,880 --> 03:45:35,020
I'll call.

2394
03:45:36,180 --> 03:45:36,620
Yes.

2395
03:45:37,160 --> 03:45:37,760
City Clerk.

2396
03:45:40,220 --> 03:45:41,360
Council Member Eisenberg.

2397
03:45:41,640 --> 03:45:41,820
Aye.

2398
03:45:42,200 --> 03:45:42,900
Council Member Cooper.

2399
03:45:43,120 --> 03:45:43,280
Aye.

2400
03:45:44,000 --> 03:45:44,920
Council Member Gift.

2401
03:45:45,260 --> 03:45:45,420
Aye.

2402
03:45:45,840 --> 03:45:46,900
Vice Mayor Lopez Rotega.

2403
03:45:47,120 --> 03:45:47,280
Aye.

2404
03:45:47,780 --> 03:45:48,320
And Mayor Williams.

2405
03:45:48,620 --> 03:45:48,700
Aye.

2406
03:45:49,240 --> 03:45:49,460
Okay.

2407
03:45:49,620 --> 03:45:54,660
So now I'll go back to the sorted democracies and not coming over.

2408
03:45:54,860 --> 03:45:55,080
Okay.

2409
03:45:55,080 --> 03:46:04,020
Okay, I think we all agree that we're going to have citizens on this committee.

2410
03:46:06,460 --> 03:46:11,340
My personal feeling is we should still have two council members.

2411
03:46:12,740 --> 03:46:21,360
And if staff wants to appoint a member, you may, but if you don't want to, we can handle

2412
03:46:21,360 --> 03:46:21,620
it.

2413
03:46:21,620 --> 03:46:25,040
Now you're referring to the committee addressing the survey?

2414
03:46:25,820 --> 03:46:29,880
I'm starting with the easy stuff.

2415
03:46:30,180 --> 03:46:33,160
The easy stuff would be composition.

2416
03:46:34,360 --> 03:46:43,260
Two council members, four community members, that's a six-person committee, they can talk.

2417
03:46:45,050 --> 03:46:55,930
Then, purpose, serve as for specific tasks specifically,

2418
03:46:58,230 --> 03:47:00,190
work with the survey company

2419
03:47:00,850 --> 03:47:10,430
to make sure that all the different issues within the fairgrounds are communicated to

2420
03:47:10,430 --> 03:47:17,350
the survey company, provide a conduit for information between the whole community and

2421
03:47:17,350 --> 03:47:27,410
the council, and from the council out to the community, and provide, using their expertise,

2422
03:47:28,650 --> 03:47:39,870
provide specific tasks about the feasibility, the benefits, and problems

2423
03:47:39,870 --> 03:47:51,210
with the various ideas that come through the committee and advise the council as a whole on those issues.

2424
03:47:56,620 --> 03:48:10,020
So I support that, but I think that if I think having a staff liaison would be great, but as with most committees it should be an uneven number, so if it's two members of council.

2425
03:48:10,020 --> 03:48:12,120
five community members.

2426
03:48:12,520 --> 03:48:13,260
That's the one.

2427
03:48:14,500 --> 03:48:17,700
But I don't picture this committee voting.

2428
03:48:18,320 --> 03:48:21,300
I picture talking.

2429
03:48:22,540 --> 03:48:28,860
So really on a standing advisory committee they would provide ongoing advice, research

2430
03:48:28,860 --> 03:48:32,020
and recommendations and specific areas.

2431
03:48:32,540 --> 03:48:34,600
So that's different from an ad hoc committee.

2432
03:48:34,880 --> 03:48:37,400
Yes, I don't want an I want a standing committee.

2433
03:48:37,400 --> 03:48:39,140
And you're talking about ad hoc committee?

2434
03:48:40,440 --> 03:48:44,840
My initial thought was ad hoc.

2435
03:48:44,940 --> 03:48:52,000
I've been thinking ad hoc from the beginning, but now, based on other council members,

2436
03:48:55,080 --> 03:48:58,180
it's going to have a series of ad hoc duties,

2437
03:49:01,120 --> 03:49:03,280
but we can't, I don't want to reconstitute

2438
03:49:03,280 --> 03:49:10,620
the tarot part and reconstitute the committee every time there's a new duty added or a different duty

2439
03:49:10,620 --> 03:49:14,000
or there comes up with some other way to deal with things.

2440
03:49:14,200 --> 03:49:22,760
Which begs the question, why have the committee at all, when we can ask advice from the public,

2441
03:49:22,760 --> 03:49:24,680
those members of the public who are knowledgeable?

2442
03:49:26,480 --> 03:49:30,140
As a, well, I understand.

2443
03:49:30,980 --> 03:49:36,680
And you're right, we could do everything all by ourselves, but we can also get help in doing some things.

2444
03:49:36,680 --> 03:49:41,780
I would totally appreciate the help and so the survey is a perfect example.

2445
03:49:42,860 --> 03:49:49,720
The input that the members of the public can offer on the questions on the topics will be valuable.

2446
03:49:52,580 --> 03:49:55,520
But that's a limited, that's a limited purpose.

2447
03:49:56,360 --> 03:50:02,400
You complete that and then we're going to have to reconstitute and start over with the next task.

2448
03:50:02,400 --> 03:50:12,020
I would like to lift up the fair ground committee to the same level as our green committee,

2449
03:50:12,320 --> 03:50:14,080
as our housing advisory committee.

2450
03:50:14,680 --> 03:50:17,740
The same respect, the same amount of intention.

2451
03:50:18,180 --> 03:50:23,500
We could be on part of it, but it needs to be the same degree of importance as these other committees.

2452
03:50:23,800 --> 03:50:30,000
I mean, the green committee is very important, but so was the fair ground committee as is the transportation.

2453
03:50:30,000 --> 03:50:33,920
I mean, I just think it needs to be elevated to be that same level.

2454
03:50:34,380 --> 03:50:40,800
That's an incredibly important decision that we have to make here, and I think we need to give that respect personally.

2455
03:50:42,720 --> 03:50:43,720
I want to make a motion.

2456
03:50:46,130 --> 03:50:47,030
Not sure how to.

2457
03:50:47,270 --> 03:50:48,430
Okay, I will make a motion.

2458
03:50:48,430 --> 03:50:49,670
I think, yeah, you've got the notes.

2459
03:50:49,870 --> 03:50:50,770
I will make a motion.

2460
03:50:51,230 --> 03:50:53,890
By the way, my motion died for lack of a second.

2461
03:50:54,070 --> 03:50:55,850
I'm sorry, I was trying to amend.

2462
03:50:56,550 --> 03:51:00,710
Okay, I supported 99.9% of your motion.

2463
03:51:00,710 --> 03:51:07,270
So I'm making a motion for a standing advisory committee,

2464
03:51:10,100 --> 03:51:13,320
a committee that provides ongoing advice,

2465
03:51:14,180 --> 03:51:17,320
research, and recommendations made

2466
03:51:19,490 --> 03:51:27,430
up of five community members and two council members with the staff liaison,

2467
03:51:27,430 --> 03:51:30,110
on, preferably Shelley for obvious reasons,

2468
03:51:33,340 --> 03:51:39,340
and we can direct them on specific tasks as

2469
03:51:39,340 --> 03:51:45,900
we move forward, such as the survey, which will be very soon.

2470
03:51:46,140 --> 03:51:46,400
I see.

2471
03:51:46,420 --> 03:51:47,220
And that's my motion.

2472
03:51:47,540 --> 03:51:47,660
Sorry.

2473
03:51:47,860 --> 03:51:48,420
I second it.

2474
03:51:48,480 --> 03:51:59,060
I'd like to amend it to include a sunset and ending and ending and it can be renewed, but

2475
03:51:59,060 --> 03:52:02,840
But I'd like it to have a fixed timeframe if the committee is approved.

2476
03:52:03,800 --> 03:52:07,540
Otherwise, committees take on a life of their own and that's not necessarily a good thing.

2477
03:52:07,980 --> 03:52:09,660
What term would you say here?

2478
03:52:11,180 --> 03:52:13,580
So we have a second, so that means we can still vote.

2479
03:52:14,440 --> 03:52:17,840
So my emotion is seconded, so we can still vote if we want.

2480
03:52:17,840 --> 03:52:19,600
Well, we have to vote on the amendment.

2481
03:52:19,940 --> 03:52:20,160
Okay.

2482
03:52:20,860 --> 03:52:28,720
I mean, or unless you just want to say, I think the public will give us very loud advice at the end of that year.

2483
03:52:28,720 --> 03:52:32,820
We're convincing us to go ahead and extend it as needed, pretty much indefinitely.

2484
03:52:33,020 --> 03:52:41,380
If we listened to the public, which is our duty, and they expect us to extend it again for another year, we can't say no.

2485
03:52:41,580 --> 03:52:48,780
So I would be in favor of that sunset, knowing that we can extend it, and we will, if there is demand.

2486
03:52:50,260 --> 03:52:55,900
So as we have a motion to that effect, are we clear on the motion council members?

2487
03:52:56,300 --> 03:53:00,500
I think so, and the amendment is accepted by the council.

2488
03:53:00,500 --> 03:53:02,500
Yeah, the original motion maker needs to accept.

2489
03:53:02,680 --> 03:53:02,820
Great.

2490
03:53:03,000 --> 03:53:12,700
I will accept this, but I will hold this council to task by having this conversation in advance

2491
03:53:12,700 --> 03:53:21,420
of that year mark so we can reach out for applications and renew this because I'm certain that's what our community blocks for so I am

2492
03:53:22,140 --> 03:53:23,380
amendable to the amendment

2493
03:53:24,700 --> 03:53:28,260
So that again, please. I'm amendable. Yes, I accept that I accept

2494
03:53:30,200 --> 03:53:31,320
All right

2495
03:53:33,500 --> 03:53:35,880
I'm not feeling supportive of this

2496
03:53:35,880 --> 03:53:49,300
That's because I think it's redundant and I think that it can encounter the same problems and the same concerns that are expressed towards us, can be expressed towards that committee.

2497
03:53:50,400 --> 03:53:57,060
And they're going to have to be subject to the Brown Act and open and so they can't be talking among themselves whoever they are.

2498
03:53:57,640 --> 03:54:04,180
They're going to be good people, no question and the input will be valuable and I'm going to appreciate whatever input comes from the public.

2499
03:54:04,180 --> 03:54:17,500
I think the committee's structure of formal, standing committee structure at this time is premature and maybe a dereliction of our own responsibility, even though nominally we're going to be still in charge.

2500
03:54:19,040 --> 03:54:21,060
So I'm not going to be supportive of that.

2501
03:54:21,160 --> 03:54:31,940
If it's merely an ad hoc committee with a specific task for a specific time, that's not before us, but in that case I could be supportive of a standing ongoing committee, I can't be supportive.

2502
03:54:31,940 --> 03:54:36,620
So we have a motion, and a second, let's take a roll call, please.

2503
03:54:38,520 --> 03:54:39,800
Council Member Eisenberg.

2504
03:54:40,140 --> 03:54:40,340
Aye.

2505
03:54:41,740 --> 03:54:42,820
Council Member Cooper.

2506
03:54:43,300 --> 03:54:43,480
Aye.

2507
03:54:44,180 --> 03:54:45,140
Council Member Gift.

2508
03:54:45,620 --> 03:54:45,780
Aye.

2509
03:54:46,960 --> 03:54:48,300
Vice Mayor Lopez Ortega.

2510
03:54:48,560 --> 03:54:48,760
Aye.

2511
03:54:49,540 --> 03:54:49,960
Mayor Williams.

2512
03:54:50,320 --> 03:54:50,440
Aye.

2513
03:54:51,660 --> 03:54:51,820
Okay.

2514
03:54:52,000 --> 03:54:53,300
Council Member's good discussion.

2515
03:54:53,580 --> 03:54:54,460
Thank you for the input.

2516
03:54:55,480 --> 03:55:00,160
Let's go to, so it passes 4 to 1 with me in the center.

2517
03:55:00,160 --> 03:55:01,180
So,

2518
03:55:04,010 --> 03:55:04,850
let's see, it

2519
03:55:07,730 --> 03:55:09,130
was 7

2520
03:55:11,400 --> 03:55:12,060
.4,

2521
03:55:16,290 --> 03:55:19,890
and we wanted to go to the survey next, I think council members, let's do that.

2522
03:55:22,020 --> 03:55:25,460
That is 7.6.

2523
03:55:32,010 --> 03:55:47,690
And this week, last meeting, it's a discussion about a consultant agreement with FM3 research for a statistically valid survey of the community needs and desires

2524
03:55:47,690 --> 03:55:49,810
for the fairgrounds proper to use.

2525
03:55:50,430 --> 03:55:53,490
Is there anything fairgrounds director

2526
03:55:53,490 --> 03:55:57,010
that you would like to add to this before we bring it

2527
03:55:57,010 --> 03:55:58,090
to the public again?

2528
03:55:58,790 --> 03:56:03,730
So, Council, this is the same agreement that we brought to you

2529
03:56:03,730 --> 03:56:07,570
in January on January 14th.

2530
03:56:07,610 --> 03:56:12,530
And the consultant was on the phone to be able to speak with you

2531
03:56:12,530 --> 03:56:17,350
but she may have had to have left already due to time.

2532
03:56:18,170 --> 03:56:19,310
She's gone, yeah.

2533
03:56:20,430 --> 03:56:27,270
So, you know, this firm is an excellent firm out of the Bay Area.

2534
03:56:27,490 --> 03:56:30,730
All three firms that we contacted were from the Bay Area.

2535
03:56:30,890 --> 03:56:33,670
They have knowledge of our small town and community.

2536
03:56:34,350 --> 03:56:40,670
And I've talked extensively with the consultant who presented to us last time.

2537
03:56:41,130 --> 03:56:46,770
And I feel very comfortable with their desires

2538
03:56:46,770 --> 03:56:50,790
to help us with regard to a survey to our community.

2539
03:56:51,990 --> 03:56:52,790
Great, thank you.

2540
03:56:53,370 --> 03:56:54,110
Public comment.

2541
03:56:54,710 --> 03:56:57,030
Anybody like to comment on this?

2542
03:57:01,320 --> 03:57:02,800
Yes sir, yes, Mr. Riley.

2543
03:57:06,680 --> 03:57:12,480
Once again, Tim Riley, and I'll just reference briefly the comment letter I submitted for this meeting.

2544
03:57:13,160 --> 03:57:22,800
But at a previous meeting, I submitted comments about questions I had about the procurement process for the consultant.

2545
03:57:22,800 --> 03:57:24,580
that the preferred alternative consulted.

2546
03:57:26,410 --> 03:57:30,760
And now going back to the issue of continuity and the importance of continuity to start

2547
03:57:30,760 --> 03:57:35,120
developing this credibility in what we're doing here.

2548
03:57:37,810 --> 03:57:43,500
I think the survey, this initial survey that's being done under the auspices of the city is

2549
03:57:43,500 --> 03:57:51,380
going to be kind of a very important milestone in that path of just staying unbiased and

2550
03:57:51,380 --> 03:57:54,900
inclusive and open to a lot of ideas.

2551
03:57:57,220 --> 03:58:04,180
So to me, it makes sense to continue to consider this consultant to be a strong contender.

2552
03:58:05,120 --> 03:58:12,520
But if I was in the council's position, I would charge the committee with just reviewing

2553
03:58:12,520 --> 03:58:20,480
the solicitation, reviewing the RFP, making sure the scope of work is consistent and contributory

2554
03:58:20,480 --> 03:58:32,760
to an ongoing process that would begin with the survey and would end with the creation of two or three or four alternative master plans.

2555
03:58:32,980 --> 03:58:36,900
That's what I see the continuity, the whole process to be.

2556
03:58:37,880 --> 03:58:44,780
And this would be, in my view, an initial assignment for the committee to put their eyes on that process and

2557
03:58:44,780 --> 03:58:50,340
evaluate it objectively, again, in the context of what's likely to be needed analytically

2558
03:58:50,340 --> 03:58:59,000
down the road, and just give their opinion to the council if it's the best alternative

2559
03:58:59,000 --> 03:58:59,940
that we have out there.

2560
03:59:00,120 --> 03:59:07,780
I think that to blow by that path, that step without pausing to just illuminate that element

2561
03:59:07,780 --> 03:59:12,780
of the process is a missed opportunity, and I don't see that it brings any benefit to the

2562
03:59:12,780 --> 03:59:13,800
process to do that.

2563
03:59:13,800 --> 03:59:21,200
But I see a lot of benefit to take the time to go through that review and get that advice.

2564
03:59:21,700 --> 03:59:24,800
So you're thinking that a survey at this time is premature?

2565
03:59:25,740 --> 03:59:34,320
Not necessarily, but it depends on the survey and it depends on the vision that the council has for

2566
03:59:34,320 --> 03:59:37,300
how the information in the survey is going to be applied.

2567
03:59:38,160 --> 03:59:41,920
And so to launch on a survey without having those understandings in place,

2568
03:59:42,420 --> 03:59:48,120
I think the values, the survey, you could end up having to do it again.

2569
03:59:50,350 --> 03:59:52,270
Mr. Riley, I have a question for you.

2570
03:59:52,790 --> 03:59:56,610
Just for this council and for the public, would you please let us know your background and

2571
03:59:56,610 --> 03:59:59,970
what your professional experience is because I think it's pertinent to what you're saying.

2572
04:00:00,000 --> 04:00:29,580
I'll do it as quickly as I can. That's okay. You know, I have a degree in soil science from the University of California. I spent about 10 years as a field soil scientist. And then I got tired of being in the field. So I migrated to developing an expertise and regulatory compliance for private and public clients. And I built a consulting firm that numbered about 60 employees when I finally left and the staff was composed of archaeologists and geologists.

2573
04:00:29,580 --> 04:00:31,520
and engineers and those kind of guys.

2574
04:00:32,200 --> 04:00:36,320
And we represented private clients and federal agencies and state agencies

2575
04:00:36,760 --> 04:00:43,420
as they sought their environmental permits to do things like build dams and build bridges and things like that.

2576
04:00:43,840 --> 04:00:53,600
Part of that, body of work involved implementing public participation plans for public benefit projects.

2577
04:00:54,600 --> 04:00:55,980
Thank you very much for sharing.

2578
04:00:55,980 --> 04:00:57,940
Thank you.

2579
04:01:03,140 --> 04:01:04,100
Thank you.

2580
04:01:04,140 --> 04:01:05,460
Any other public comment?

2581
04:01:05,900 --> 04:01:06,220
Thank you.

2582
04:01:06,900 --> 04:01:07,180
Mr. Rowley.

2583
04:01:07,580 --> 04:01:08,680
Other public comment.

2584
04:01:12,110 --> 04:01:13,190
Carrie Eibou.

2585
04:01:14,350 --> 04:01:21,590
Listening to all of this is this city is so famous for doing thousands of surveys that

2586
04:01:21,590 --> 04:01:22,730
they never do anything with.

2587
04:01:23,710 --> 04:01:30,430
I mean, really, it's like can't at this stage of the game, like you guys took possession

2588
04:01:30,430 --> 04:01:41,310
in July 22nd, it is now February 4th and you're still running around like thinking can't

2589
04:01:41,310 --> 04:01:48,830
you just simplify everything and think about, I mean a master plan, we spend 100,000 at

2590
04:01:48,830 --> 04:01:53,190
the fairgrounds for the last master plan, that where is it, probably in a round file somewhere.

2591
04:01:53,190 --> 04:02:00,330
I mean, it's so I understand that you have to have vision, but a survey, you've had so

2592
04:02:00,330 --> 04:02:05,350
many meetings, you've had, you've had so many people that gathered at those meetings

2593
04:02:05,350 --> 04:02:11,350
took four hours, five hours, to write down all their expertise, and here you are saying

2594
04:02:11,350 --> 04:02:21,610
that the public can come to you, which I know a lot of people have, but just the time

2595
04:02:21,610 --> 04:02:26,570
that you keep taking away from the simplicity of what can start happening.

2596
04:02:26,670 --> 04:02:28,730
You have somebody here who hired to do the job.

2597
04:02:29,810 --> 04:02:34,630
I mean, it just seems like it's so arduous to have to listen to bureaucracy

2598
04:02:34,630 --> 04:02:38,150
where I get you have to do it, but, oh my gosh, it's so frustrating.

2599
04:02:38,830 --> 04:02:40,610
It's so frustrating. I don't know if I'm the only one.

2600
04:02:40,730 --> 04:02:42,010
I don't know why I'm still here, actually.

2601
04:02:42,170 --> 04:02:45,710
But, I mean, I love Kalastoga. I love the fairgrounds.

2602
04:02:45,730 --> 04:02:47,170
I fought like heck for it. Believe me.

2603
04:02:47,170 --> 04:02:51,590
I just hope that you can think about the simplicity of what can happen.

2604
04:02:52,190 --> 04:02:52,810
Thank you.

2605
04:02:52,930 --> 04:02:53,510
Thank you, Kerry.

2606
04:02:55,460 --> 04:02:56,540
Other public comment?

2607
04:03:03,060 --> 04:03:04,000
Who's phone is that?

2608
04:03:08,820 --> 04:03:25,820
As I said earlier, this is a very complex process and complex problem that if we don't take the right time and due diligence to get the entire community bought in to what we're doing, it's not going to succeed.

2609
04:03:25,820 --> 04:03:35,960
And I think Mr. Riley has said a lot of intelligent things about this process, but I think one of the most intelligent is

2610
04:03:36,980 --> 04:03:41,980
do the right thing to get the entire community to buy into what we're going to do.

2611
04:03:42,760 --> 04:03:49,140
Because if you don't have that, we will never have civil conversations about this topic.

2612
04:03:49,840 --> 04:03:56,640
And it will always be something that we wonder what could have been or what might be.

2613
04:03:57,980 --> 04:04:05,280
And so taking the time to do this, I know it's painful to do that, but this is the

2614
04:04:05,280 --> 04:04:11,640
way that real progress gets made, is by listening to everybody in this process.

2615
04:04:15,010 --> 04:04:21,050
And by limiting the opportunity for us to participate, is limiting the buy-in that the community

2616
04:04:21,050 --> 04:04:27,750
needs to believe in the vision that we all think we have for the space, but that's part

2617
04:04:27,750 --> 04:04:32,530
of the problem is we all think we have a vision for it and we need to clarify what that

2618
04:04:32,530 --> 04:04:33,310
vision is.

2619
04:04:34,870 --> 04:04:42,290
And I have submitted numerous times a six step process to do that in conjunction with professionals

2620
04:04:42,870 --> 04:04:49,550
who have consulted with that and not one of you has returned that request to talk about

2621
04:04:49,550 --> 04:04:56,750
this, or even discuss it. And so, you get in a tough position. And I'm frustrated about

2622
04:04:56,750 --> 04:05:05,490
that point. My overall point is when this ends, when we get to an endpoint, whether that's

2623
04:05:05,490 --> 04:05:09,990
in three months or three years or 30 years, you need to ensure that the entire community

2624
04:05:10,580 --> 04:05:17,410
knows that they were heard, and the entire community knows that we get what the entire

2625
04:05:17,410 --> 04:05:22,470
community wants. And that to me, I think, is the most important part in this critical juncture.

2626
04:05:23,310 --> 04:05:25,250
Thank you for listening. Thank you.

2627
04:05:32,540 --> 04:05:38,220
Charlotte Williams. I'm looking at this room right now,

2628
04:05:38,560 --> 04:05:45,700
and I don't see this community represented in this room. Not truly, I don't. And I'm not sure how

2629
04:05:45,700 --> 04:05:51,660
many people who represent the whole community can show up at meetings like this in the evening

2630
04:05:51,660 --> 04:05:56,340
and go on and on and on like this because many of them are at home with their children

2631
04:05:56,920 --> 04:06:01,780
or their family celebrations or they're flat out working six days a week.

2632
04:06:02,580 --> 04:06:12,440
So if I don't know exactly what a statistically accurate valid survey is,

2633
04:06:13,100 --> 04:06:19,140
but as soon as I hear that I just think lies, damn lies, and statistics marked

2634
04:06:19,140 --> 04:06:28,340
way. And if it's not just plain old accurate, never mind statistically accurate, then I don't

2635
04:06:28,340 --> 04:06:35,080
think it's going to be worth the money or time that's spent on it. So when you show me a room

2636
04:06:35,840 --> 04:06:42,900
full, that represents the people who live in this town, then I will believe that there's going

2637
04:06:42,900 --> 04:06:47,460
to be a statistically or any sort of accurate survey.

2638
04:06:48,740 --> 04:06:54,360
I don't know how many people in this room have gone door to door to every single voter

2639
04:06:54,360 --> 04:06:55,100
in this town.

2640
04:06:55,300 --> 04:07:01,300
I don't know how many of you have, but I have in the only street that I didn't go to

2641
04:07:01,300 --> 04:07:02,180
was High Street.

2642
04:07:02,800 --> 04:07:08,000
I have knocked on the door of every single voter in this town and I've done it twice.

2643
04:07:08,000 --> 04:07:15,000
I've done it two and a half times and lots of people just aren't home you just you know unless

2644
04:07:15,000 --> 04:07:20,500
you're going to be there after dinner time during dinner time first thing in the morning you miss

2645
04:07:20,500 --> 04:07:30,360
people so I'm not sure how everybody's really going to be contacted but unless you hear of a

2646
04:07:30,360 --> 04:07:37,600
A very accurate way of achieving that, then I think it would be a waste of money.

2647
04:07:40,810 --> 04:07:41,350
Thank you.

2648
04:07:47,780 --> 04:07:48,160
All right.

2649
04:07:48,640 --> 04:07:49,020
Background.

2650
04:07:51,540 --> 04:07:55,860
Like I said at the last meeting, like I said, kind of from the start, the surveys come

2651
04:07:55,860 --> 04:07:56,060
up.

2652
04:07:56,260 --> 04:08:01,280
I just think right now the cost associated to do it is my biggest drawback, right?

2653
04:08:01,440 --> 04:08:06,320
We're trying to find money to fund everything and it comes with the price.

2654
04:08:06,760 --> 04:08:11,080
the way I kind of think of it is we bought a boat and were in the water and our

2655
04:08:11,080 --> 04:08:14,600
boat had holes in it to start with and we've been bailing water and we're doing a

2656
04:08:14,600 --> 04:08:19,060
good job and it wasn't gonna happen overnight but I've got a gun in one hand

2657
04:08:19,060 --> 04:08:22,980
and spending more money like shooting another hole in the bottom of the boat. We're

2658
04:08:22,980 --> 04:08:26,860
gonna get there and we're gonna get this thing patched but from the start from day

2659
04:08:26,860 --> 04:08:32,900
one when we all sat down and talked about purchasing this you guys we all

2660
04:08:32,900 --> 04:08:37,620
broadcasted it to all of us, the public, that we are going to purchase this and we're

2661
04:08:37,620 --> 04:08:42,740
going to get it afloat. And that's with the first goal of getting the historical uses

2662
04:08:42,740 --> 04:08:48,400
up and running and create funding to make us flush. And that doesn't happen overnight,

2663
04:08:48,700 --> 04:08:54,100
that doesn't happen in two months, that doesn't happen in what now six months. But we are still

2664
04:08:54,560 --> 04:09:00,040
getting water out of the boat. So before we go and spend more money and again, complicate

2665
04:09:00,040 --> 04:09:03,800
things more we need to get to a level playing field and kind of find some

2666
04:09:03,800 --> 04:09:09,900
balance in this and it might just be my opinion but again talking to all of you

2667
04:09:09,900 --> 04:09:14,220
and talking to the community and seeing the 200 plus people that showed up I

2668
04:09:14,220 --> 04:09:19,320
mean if that's not a sign that we do have public interest and support I don't

2669
04:09:19,320 --> 04:09:23,680
really know what is but I see a lot of progress and yes it might not be perfect

2670
04:09:23,680 --> 04:09:27,920
and it might not be planned out to the T but progress is progress we just have

2671
04:09:27,920 --> 04:09:29,360
that open our eyes and look at it.

2672
04:09:29,960 --> 04:09:30,560
Thank you.

2673
04:09:35,910 --> 04:09:37,090
City Clerk, is there anybody?

2674
04:09:38,030 --> 04:09:38,750
Still online?

2675
04:09:39,350 --> 04:09:39,790
No, I'm not.

2676
04:09:39,910 --> 04:09:40,810
Okay, nobody online.

2677
04:09:41,390 --> 04:09:43,930
And anyone else in the chamber's night?

2678
04:09:44,170 --> 04:09:45,430
Would like to address the council?

2679
04:09:46,550 --> 04:09:48,350
Okay, let's close public comment.

2680
04:09:48,970 --> 04:09:50,430
Bring it back to council.

2681
04:09:52,150 --> 04:09:52,970
Okay, first.

2682
04:09:53,490 --> 04:09:54,790
Yes, councilman Eisenberg.

2683
04:09:55,130 --> 04:09:55,490
Thank you.

2684
04:09:55,770 --> 04:09:56,950
You did recognize me, didn't you?

2685
04:09:57,630 --> 04:09:58,530
I thought you did.

2686
04:09:58,950 --> 04:09:59,770
Okay, thank you.

2687
04:09:59,930 --> 04:10:00,990
I tried to be quick with the hand.

2688
04:10:04,150 --> 04:10:27,430
First, part of the reason for a survey really is as was mentioned by a couple of people that it will be inclusive, people will feel they have a stake, no matter whether they made it to a meeting or not, and that will make the final decision even more powerful or are all of our final decisions more powerful because everybody felt heard.

2689
04:10:27,430 --> 04:10:35,690
There were suggestions that we abandoned the work that was done by staff to choose a survey

2690
04:10:35,690 --> 04:10:42,270
company and assign it to the committee. I don't see that at all. I think choosing a survey

2691
04:10:42,270 --> 04:10:51,470
company is a lot more. It's a staff activity. It was approved by council. All of the applicants

2692
04:10:51,470 --> 04:10:56,710
looked good. The one that was chosen looks very good. They worked on a fair

2693
04:10:56,710 --> 04:11:03,090
grounds and they worked on Petaluma. They had references. I really don't think

2694
04:11:03,090 --> 04:11:11,830
that that is worth throwing away that work, which is not fundamental to the

2695
04:11:11,830 --> 04:11:19,770
survey results. These are good companies with good references. So on that note,

2696
04:11:19,770 --> 04:11:22,690
I move to approve the survey.

2697
04:11:24,110 --> 04:11:26,710
I'd like to address the cost question.

2698
04:11:27,210 --> 04:11:30,390
I pay insurance for my car, for my health, for my house.

2699
04:11:30,570 --> 04:11:34,290
And in this case, this would be an insurance policy that we get it right.

2700
04:11:34,850 --> 04:11:36,550
And I think that's money well spent.

2701
04:11:36,750 --> 04:11:42,770
It's again, engaging part of the community like Charlotte said that just doesn't have access to it, doesn't have the time to go here.

2702
04:11:42,910 --> 04:11:44,930
So the price to me is money well spent.

2703
04:11:44,930 --> 04:12:09,370
And I believe after working on the subcommittee for since the beginning of my term, with the mayor, interviewing hundreds of not thousands of people, reading scores of emails that we can condense or distill all maybe the 20 to 30 questions that are really important in the community that we need to go down into the survey.

2704
04:12:09,370 --> 04:12:15,390
into the survey. So if we had a subcommittee poking at all of this data, who knows how long it

2705
04:12:15,390 --> 04:12:20,110
would take. And I can almost guarantee you that it would end up in maybe a 2% minutia.

2706
04:12:20,290 --> 04:12:27,430
It would be distilled down to certain core questions that would go on the survey, maybe 20, 30, 40.

2707
04:12:27,570 --> 04:12:34,030
I'm not sure what number that would be, but we have way more data than we need to go ahead and

2708
04:12:34,030 --> 04:12:38,130
and create an extremely valid survey immediately.

2709
04:12:39,050 --> 04:12:41,410
In my opinion, I think that needs to be done quickly,

2710
04:12:41,950 --> 04:12:44,070
and we have everything we need to make it

2711
04:12:44,070 --> 04:12:46,850
as concrete and successful as possible.

2712
04:12:47,810 --> 04:12:47,930
OK?

2713
04:12:48,490 --> 04:12:49,170
Yes.

2714
04:12:49,470 --> 04:12:54,550
The only question I have regarding the financial impact

2715
04:12:54,970 --> 04:13:00,350
is that the money will come for the infrastructure

2716
04:13:04,910 --> 04:13:10,270
It makes me a little worried because we're going to take money from things that they need

2717
04:13:10,270 --> 04:13:16,790
to be done in the city. Is there any way that we can get the money from another fund?

2718
04:13:19,960 --> 04:13:26,680
We could take it from the General Fund Reserve. The fund that you're speaking about that

2719
04:13:26,680 --> 04:13:33,460
we're recommending it come from was created by the council in recently, specifically

2720
04:13:33,460 --> 04:13:36,420
for sort of things that come up.

2721
04:13:37,320 --> 04:13:37,620
Okay.

2722
04:13:38,120 --> 04:13:41,520
So from a staff perspective, we're comfortable with it.

2723
04:13:41,600 --> 04:13:44,860
It's not going to affect any other projects that we have.

2724
04:13:45,040 --> 04:13:45,280
Correct.

2725
04:13:45,460 --> 04:13:49,240
It is not going to take away money from any other project.

2726
04:13:49,380 --> 04:13:49,660
Okay.

2727
04:13:49,840 --> 04:13:52,060
As long as that's happening, I'm fine with it.

2728
04:13:52,620 --> 04:13:53,900
So we have one minute.

2729
04:13:53,900 --> 04:13:56,200
So I will second your motion.

2730
04:13:58,760 --> 04:13:59,940
I call the question.

2731
04:14:02,000 --> 04:14:05,840
Then I'm not going to be supportive of a survey at this time.

2732
04:14:06,660 --> 04:14:09,100
I am supportive of wanting to know what the folks think.

2733
04:14:09,220 --> 04:14:10,500
I don't think we need to do a survey.

2734
04:14:10,580 --> 04:14:15,320
They cost this much money to know what the population town is interested in.

2735
04:14:15,740 --> 04:14:19,800
I could be supportive of a survey down the road as we get farther along.

2736
04:14:20,240 --> 04:14:24,180
And I like Mr. Rodley's idea of having a couple of different options, two or three or four

2737
04:14:24,180 --> 04:14:24,960
different options.

2738
04:14:24,960 --> 04:14:29,080
and then finding out in a valid survey, then.

2739
04:14:29,460 --> 04:14:41,240
I think it's too early at this point, and I think it's too much money to spend at this point when we really have to, as Mr. Ferris said, plug the holes in the boat at this time.

2740
04:14:41,540 --> 04:14:44,140
So I'm not going to be supportive of it at this time.

2741
04:14:44,420 --> 04:14:48,820
We have a motion and a second, let's take a roll call, please.

2742
04:14:48,820 --> 04:14:48,980
Please.

2743
04:14:50,340 --> 04:14:51,560
Council Member Esenberg.

2744
04:14:51,860 --> 04:14:52,020
Aye.

2745
04:14:52,980 --> 04:14:54,120
Council Member Cooper.

2746
04:14:54,520 --> 04:14:54,680
Aye.

2747
04:14:55,380 --> 04:14:56,440
Council Member Gift.

2748
04:14:56,760 --> 04:14:56,900
Aye.

2749
04:14:58,100 --> 04:14:59,420
Vice Mayor Lopez Ortega.

2750
04:14:59,680 --> 04:14:59,820
Aye.

2751
04:15:00,020 --> 04:15:01,360
Mayor Williams. Okay,

2752
04:15:03,500 --> 04:15:11,600
we are 15. Right, at 1015. Exactly. At the time you are next.

2753
04:15:15,380 --> 04:15:16,060
Let's see.

2754
04:15:18,380 --> 04:15:30,100
Come this far. Yeah, let's go for it. I'm going to move that we continue till 1045. I can't do 1045.

2755
04:15:30,100 --> 04:15:32,100
How are you going to withdraw that motion?

2756
04:15:33,240 --> 04:15:34,740
I mean, I can go back.

2757
04:15:34,740 --> 04:15:35,740
What do we do back?

2758
04:15:36,680 --> 04:15:38,820
We can finish this point in five minutes.

2759
04:15:39,320 --> 04:15:40,000
Which one?

2760
04:15:41,200 --> 04:15:43,200
This is the feasibility plan.

2761
04:15:43,300 --> 04:15:43,500
Yeah.

2762
04:15:45,060 --> 04:15:45,200
Okay.

2763
04:15:45,540 --> 04:15:45,640
Yeah.

2764
04:15:45,960 --> 04:15:46,280
That's good.

2765
04:15:46,500 --> 04:15:46,680
All right.

2766
04:15:48,060 --> 04:15:48,820
And then what?

2767
04:15:48,960 --> 04:15:49,320
10.30?

2768
04:15:49,380 --> 04:15:50,500
We still need a motion.

2769
04:15:51,200 --> 04:15:51,980
And a vote.

2770
04:15:52,760 --> 04:15:53,360
10.30?

2771
04:15:53,860 --> 04:15:56,720
Motion to continue this meeting till 10.30.

2772
04:15:58,220 --> 04:15:58,700
Second.

2773
04:16:05,120 --> 04:16:10,120
And we're all, and I also, so we're all, we're all in agreement.

2774
04:16:10,440 --> 04:16:10,580
Okay.

2775
04:16:11,180 --> 04:16:13,580
We're on 7.5,

2776
04:16:16,060 --> 04:16:16,840
okay.

2777
04:16:18,160 --> 04:16:21,540
See members of the public, let's see, we're continuing with the meeting.

2778
04:16:22,620 --> 04:16:28,760
This one is the consideration of a fairgrounds, business, visibility plan.

2779
04:16:30,200 --> 04:16:32,780
And any initial comments for us.

2780
04:16:32,960 --> 04:16:34,280
Thank you, Mayor, council members.

2781
04:16:34,700 --> 04:16:41,000
As the last item today, I bring to you the consideration of a fairgrounds business feasibility plan.

2782
04:16:41,500 --> 04:16:44,460
During prior city council meetings, there's been-

2783
04:16:44,460 --> 04:16:45,060
Should the meeting, Mr. Ring.

2784
04:16:46,000 --> 04:16:47,880
Folks, we have the meeting going on.

2785
04:16:49,720 --> 04:16:50,440
I'm sorry.

2786
04:16:50,760 --> 04:16:51,020
No problem.

2787
04:16:51,760 --> 04:16:58,740
So during prior city council meetings, there's been discussion regarding the interests of some type of larger plan.

2788
04:16:58,740 --> 04:17:06,480
plan for the Callistoga Fairgrounds and in this discussion we recommend soliciting proposals

2789
04:17:06,480 --> 04:17:16,280
from external companies to use both past and current information and potentially from

2790
04:17:16,280 --> 04:17:23,060
the Statistically Valid Survey to devise several phased plans that have identified sustainable

2791
04:17:23,060 --> 04:17:26,960
impacts for both historic and new potential uses.

2792
04:17:26,960 --> 04:17:34,240
These proposals should at a minimum establish a baseline from community input and new ideas

2793
04:17:34,240 --> 04:17:39,700
and must incorporate the development of a fiscal plan as part of the process in order

2794
04:17:39,700 --> 04:17:42,780
to ensure sustainability for the grounds.

2795
04:17:43,500 --> 04:17:49,060
The phases of the project should include an initial feasibility study, a proposal for cost management

2796
04:17:49,060 --> 04:17:55,720
on the components of each phase, a proposal for construction management on the components

2797
04:17:55,720 --> 04:18:02,620
of each project and a phased recommendation for any other consultants we may need such as architects,

2798
04:18:03,000 --> 04:18:09,080
structural engineers, or design teams to complete the overall project.

2799
04:18:09,880 --> 04:18:16,080
This plan must ensure that any new uses align with a financially sustainable model

2800
04:18:16,080 --> 04:18:19,780
while preserving the city's unique character in small town.

2801
04:18:20,260 --> 04:18:25,060
The efforts with regard to the proposed plans and the design should guide future choices

2802
04:18:25,060 --> 04:18:34,600
on financial investments and address the historically revenue negative activities of the grounds and improve overall operations.

2803
04:18:35,460 --> 04:18:39,780
All of this should be done with an understanding of the purchase contract for the property.

2804
04:18:40,740 --> 04:18:44,020
Staff is seeking council input with regard to this report.

2805
04:18:44,740 --> 04:18:45,540
Great, thank you.

2806
04:18:45,920 --> 04:18:49,220
Let's open for public comment on this item.

2807
04:18:50,300 --> 04:18:51,340
Yes, Mr. Al.

2808
04:18:52,840 --> 04:19:18,700
Well, given the two prior votes that we now have a committee formed, or going to form a committee, and we have a survey, I think it's, I'm glad you're bringing these things up, but I think it's a little bit too early to look at a feasibility plan at this point in time, certainly should happen at some point if it's in the six point plan that we've presented, but I think it's too early for this exact item in my opinion. Thank you.

2809
04:19:18,700 --> 04:19:19,740
Thank you.

2810
04:19:28,980 --> 04:19:38,960
I'd just like to offer for consideration that I want to really clarify that we've not been advocating for a business facility feasibility plan.

2811
04:19:39,820 --> 04:19:55,600
We've been advocating for a public participation plan that includes conceptual drawings and rough approximation of financial performance and alternative revenue streams

2812
04:19:55,600 --> 04:20:02,240
that could be assembled and then presented to the community so they can weigh in on their preferences.

2813
04:20:03,360 --> 04:20:08,940
This level of analysis would be relatively coarse-grained and

2814
04:20:08,940 --> 04:20:13,640
would be adequate to support reason public input.

2815
04:20:14,320 --> 04:20:21,320
But wouldn't go as far in terms of the details of constructability and

2816
04:20:21,320 --> 04:20:27,900
other, you know, other elements that seem to be the focus of this business feasibility plan.

2817
04:20:30,040 --> 04:20:35,180
Instead, what we think is needed now is a plan for public participation that clearly focuses

2818
04:20:35,180 --> 04:20:43,020
on cultivating wide public input and delivers a range of master plan alternatives. So in lieu of

2819
04:20:43,020 --> 04:20:50,580
approving a business feasibility plan, I would request that the council consider

2820
04:20:50,580 --> 04:21:08,020
clearly articulating and endorsing a plan for public participation and developing a public participation plan that roughly follows the six-step process that we've offered for consideration in, you know, previous comments.

2821
04:21:10,820 --> 04:21:11,640
Thank you.

2822
04:21:11,900 --> 04:21:12,640
Thank you.

2823
04:21:12,640 --> 04:21:13,600
Good

2824
04:21:23,160 --> 04:21:23,720
evening, Council.

2825
04:21:24,340 --> 04:21:27,640
Aaron Harkin, 1542 Centennial Circle.

2826
04:21:29,160 --> 04:21:32,320
I'm taking off my daily job hat as a developer.

2827
04:21:32,820 --> 04:21:34,480
I'm managing a little project in town here,

2828
04:21:34,840 --> 04:21:36,240
and I'm just coming to you as a citizen

2829
04:21:36,240 --> 04:21:39,000
who lives across the street from the fairgrounds

2830
04:21:39,000 --> 04:21:40,220
and cares daily where we're going.

2831
04:21:41,000 --> 04:21:42,680
Bottom line, this is, in my view,

2832
04:21:42,740 --> 04:21:46,240
the most important issue in addition to the community input

2833
04:21:46,240 --> 04:21:49,840
is gathering this data as it relates to cost

2834
04:21:49,840 --> 04:21:53,560
to drive where you're going with all this stuff.

2835
04:21:53,940 --> 04:21:55,420
You're getting into the development game.

2836
04:21:55,880 --> 04:21:57,200
You're going to have to develop a pro forma.

2837
04:21:57,540 --> 04:22:01,340
The pro forma is going to have to take on both hard costs, soft costs,

2838
04:22:01,740 --> 04:22:07,200
current fees that are associated with just the ongoing work of the fairgrounds.

2839
04:22:07,360 --> 04:22:11,240
You have a lot of buildings on this property currently.

2840
04:22:11,500 --> 04:22:15,300
You need to understand what is the feasibility of all those buildings

2841
04:22:15,300 --> 04:22:17,160
and what you're going to do with them at the onset.

2842
04:22:17,160 --> 04:22:19,660
that this is all about cost data.

2843
04:22:20,360 --> 04:22:23,840
All these feelings, opinions, great things

2844
04:22:23,840 --> 04:22:26,580
that people are going to suggest don't go anywhere

2845
04:22:26,580 --> 04:22:27,580
without cost data.

2846
04:22:28,380 --> 04:22:31,520
So this is imperative to being able to get these ideas

2847
04:22:31,520 --> 04:22:33,500
that all the community is going to put together

2848
04:22:33,500 --> 04:22:35,380
in a fishbowl that you can say, hey,

2849
04:22:35,420 --> 04:22:36,920
I've got the greatest idea in the world.

2850
04:22:37,360 --> 04:22:40,620
But if it doesn't cost out with any semblance of reality,

2851
04:22:41,100 --> 04:22:43,700
it's not worth the time that idea is.

2852
04:22:43,700 --> 04:22:47,840
Moreover, you're going to need to likely get financing at some point.

2853
04:22:48,200 --> 04:22:57,920
Well, this information collected, this data, this feasibility information will give you that tool that you will need in order to embark on those financing efforts.

2854
04:22:58,220 --> 04:23:05,600
So, again, I very much so in my professional opinion and as a citizen, I encourage you to embark on this effort.

2855
04:23:05,880 --> 04:23:06,140
Thank you.

2856
04:23:06,660 --> 04:23:07,380
Thank you.

2857
04:23:12,340 --> 04:23:13,380
Yes, Mr. Ferris.

2858
04:23:13,380 --> 04:23:19,320
I'm going to just reiterate what was just said as we take in all this information and try

2859
04:23:19,320 --> 04:23:25,220
to plan and change and potentially turn things left, right, upside down, keep it the

2860
04:23:25,220 --> 04:23:25,500
same.

2861
04:23:26,040 --> 04:23:29,340
Now we're going to need to understand what costs are associated to all of that.

2862
04:23:30,740 --> 04:23:36,960
We can spend a much of time planning an upside down racetrack, but if we don't know the cost

2863
04:23:36,960 --> 04:23:39,120
associated to that, we're kind of just spending our wheels.

2864
04:23:39,120 --> 04:23:49,280
So, I think, moving forward, if we want to start looking at truly seeing what this place could be or see the same, what not, we need to have a cost associated to it.

2865
04:23:50,420 --> 04:23:51,140
Thank you.

2866
04:23:54,060 --> 04:23:56,580
Did anybody else like to comment on this item?

2867
04:23:57,480 --> 04:23:58,980
Or let's check online, City Clerk.

2868
04:23:59,660 --> 04:24:00,140
Okay.

2869
04:24:01,400 --> 04:24:04,560
Let's close the public comment and bring it back to us.

2870
04:24:05,860 --> 04:24:07,340
Council members, would you like to start on this?

2871
04:24:09,280 --> 04:24:16,960
I think that a feasibility study will certainly be prudent for us at some point.

2872
04:24:17,580 --> 04:24:28,580
I don't think that right now is that time to take that step, especially with just forming this committee of community members and enacting the survey.

2873
04:24:29,000 --> 04:24:33,660
I think this could be a possible next step, so I vote that we table this.

2874
04:24:33,660 --> 04:24:37,320
Okay. Other comments? Yes.

2875
04:24:37,620 --> 04:24:44,660
I agree with Council Member Gift. It should be tabled. Great idea. It's just...

2876
04:24:44,660 --> 04:24:51,460
Let's get the survey done. Let's get the committee in starting to work.

2877
04:24:53,280 --> 04:24:59,260
And so that right now, as soon as you start doing this, you're cutting off the ideas.

2878
04:25:00,780 --> 04:25:17,620
Let's get all the ideas in, and then more direction and more direction from council over the things that we think are even feasible from our point of view, and then we could get the feasibility plan.

2879
04:25:17,980 --> 04:25:20,100
Or the wants and then let's see if they're even feasible.

2880
04:25:20,100 --> 04:25:29,520
I mean, I think that Mr. Harkin established the importance in a very clear and concise way.

2881
04:25:29,940 --> 04:25:41,160
And I think this needs to be implemented very quickly, but at the same time I think this is a perfect example of discussion or action item that the committee could mull over.

2882
04:25:41,460 --> 04:25:45,180
I think this would be one of the most important tasks that we could assign them.

2883
04:25:45,180 --> 04:25:51,860
So, that would give us time to put the committee in place, and one of the most immediate questions

2884
04:25:51,860 --> 04:25:58,260
and tasks would be to review this very carefully and come back to us with some advice.

2885
04:25:59,620 --> 04:26:04,920
So, I agree that maybe postponing it temporarily, but it needs to happen as quickly as possible.

2886
04:26:04,920 --> 04:26:16,860
Yeah, I agree that this item needs to happen sooner better than later, but we need to get

2887
04:26:16,860 --> 04:26:24,760
all the information first and then, you know, so we can take the right decision about

2888
04:26:24,760 --> 04:26:33,160
this, but for sure, it has to be done, not necessary today, but, you know, we can table

2889
04:26:33,160 --> 04:26:37,980
All these for the next meeting and continue the discussion.

2890
04:26:38,720 --> 04:26:40,120
And I'm okay with tabling it.

2891
04:26:41,320 --> 04:26:42,600
I make a motion to be tabled.

2892
04:26:43,260 --> 04:26:43,440
Done.

2893
04:26:44,000 --> 04:26:44,880
What you already made.

2894
04:26:47,540 --> 04:26:48,300
So that's done.

2895
04:26:48,860 --> 04:26:49,720
All right, thank you, Council.

2896
04:26:49,900 --> 04:26:51,500
Thank you for bringing this to us.

2897
04:26:52,100 --> 04:26:54,980
I think we're going to get back here at some point, but not quite yet.

2898
04:26:55,460 --> 04:26:55,860
Thank you.

2899
04:26:56,880 --> 04:26:58,980
Thank you, everyone, for sticking out with us.

2900
04:26:59,120 --> 04:26:59,280
Yes.

2901
04:26:59,620 --> 04:27:00,140
Appreciate it.

2902
04:27:00,200 --> 04:27:01,460
We were at, yeah.

2903
04:27:01,780 --> 04:27:02,800
No, we're at the end.

2904
04:27:02,800 --> 04:27:11,220
And let's continue, we have to continue with the mid your budget, let's do that next

2905
04:27:11,220 --> 04:27:11,440
time.

2906
04:27:11,640 --> 04:27:12,580
Yeah, next time.

2907
04:27:12,820 --> 04:27:13,540
And I can't do this.

2908
04:27:13,680 --> 04:27:14,540
I want to report.

2909
04:27:15,180 --> 04:27:16,780
And be before that.

2910
04:27:16,920 --> 04:27:17,620
I don't have a report.

2911
04:27:18,840 --> 04:27:19,620
Anything else?

2912
04:27:20,020 --> 04:27:30,740
The budget report, I think, is important that we get into that, not today, but the mid your

2913
04:27:30,740 --> 04:27:31,560
budget.

2914
04:27:31,560 --> 04:27:42,080
But will be possible to have a special meeting maybe next week, or you know, because we need to discuss this.

2915
04:27:42,360 --> 04:27:47,140
So I think it's important that we bring it back, so is that okay?

2916
04:27:47,300 --> 04:27:51,820
Would you like us to pull you out on a potential special meeting next week?

2917
04:27:52,840 --> 04:27:54,640
Sure, can we possibly do it remotely?

2918
04:27:56,040 --> 04:27:56,720
Or no?

2919
04:27:57,000 --> 04:27:59,800
Do we need, is it so important that we need a special meeting?

2920
04:27:59,800 --> 04:28:01,880
Is there a heavy agenda next time?

2921
04:28:01,920 --> 04:28:03,240
Yeah, because it's the budget.

2922
04:28:04,140 --> 04:28:04,160
Yeah.

2923
04:28:04,300 --> 04:28:05,260
I understand.

2924
04:28:06,820 --> 04:28:07,200
Does it?

2925
04:28:09,770 --> 04:28:11,090
It's very important.

2926
04:28:11,310 --> 04:28:12,450
We do have to go over it.

2927
04:28:12,610 --> 04:28:19,970
But if we put it off three weeks, is it in any way going to impede the city's progress?

2928
04:28:23,840 --> 04:28:23,940
Yeah.

2929
04:28:23,940 --> 04:28:28,220
Because we are getting close to the new budget.

2930
04:28:28,220 --> 04:28:38,320
I mean, the conversations are new budgets, so I think that's important that we get to this and

2931
04:28:40,220 --> 04:28:42,200
be ready for the next one.

2932
04:28:43,200 --> 04:28:49,500
This is a mid-year update and so it wouldn't really necessarily affect next year's budget

2933
04:28:49,500 --> 04:28:50,180
and the process.

2934
04:28:51,240 --> 04:28:52,660
We can do them simultaneously.

2935
04:28:56,900 --> 04:28:58,180
All right.

2936
04:28:58,180 --> 04:28:59,380
until the next regular meeting?

2937
04:28:59,800 --> 04:29:00,140
Yes?

2938
04:29:00,520 --> 04:29:00,680
Okay.

2939
04:29:01,140 --> 04:29:02,180
All right, that's to that then.

2940
04:29:03,280 --> 04:29:06,060
I think that concludes our meeting.

2941
04:29:06,860 --> 04:29:07,520
Thank you, Council.

2942
04:29:08,520 --> 04:29:08,960
Thank you.

2943
04:29:09,220 --> 04:29:10,560
Members of the public and staff.