>>> good evening.
this is the march
19th meeting of the planning and zoning
commission. The time is 6:00. Our
first order of business is to
recess into work session while we
review
the cases and then we'll come out
before you as a reconveneience of
the general session at 6:30. So
with that, I'll adjourn into the work session.
>>> the
time is
04, and we are convening into the
work session. We'll
start with chairman edmund
haas and vice chair sue
blankenship.
>> present. >> ed maurer
will
be away today.
john dobmeier, and
kent hafemann.
did I get it right?
>> present. ?
samit patel is not here. I understand
he's on the way, but
he's not here yet and cindy bishop.
is she on the line?
>> she'll be joining
us virtually. Okay, mary, if you would
introduce staff and then we'll
read the
cases? ? Sure. Senior
planner, matt
steer services administrator. [ inaudible ]
she's a
full engineer. He's graduated. Yeah.
city attorney
bob hager and miss katie mcgee, our secretary.
>> all right.
>> what do we have tonight?
>> sure. So I'll
let matt start.
>> okay.
yeah. Item number 6 is
the benge legacy addition. They're
basically demoing residents on southwestern
slated for light industrial, zoned
for light industrial. They're coming
in with a light
industrial style building. It's an
office warehouse. 4900 square feet and
they're meeting all of the requirements
and it's straight site plan approval.
so not much to.
>> wow. >> okay. >> that's weird.
>> is this one of those that used to
be residential and it's just been
hanging out there
for a long time?
>> correct. And the next case is the minor
plat for that property, and in order
to
get a building permit they need to
know
it's platted. [ inaudible ]
>> that
was a very --
no.
>> just checking. >>
and then mary's got the next.
>> saving
that
for me. So
item number 8 is --
takes place at 145 west town center.
it
used to be a children's
courtyard. So it's one lot, two buildings
and two
children's courtyards. One is there still.
the one on the west end is proposed
to convert to a doggie
daycare center essentially and we'll
convert it to play grounds and convert
the inside to play areas,
grooming areas as well as kennelling
for
overnight stays. So
we'll have up
to 71.
>>
any comparison
with what camp bow wow had? No?
>> I don't know. I'm sorry. >>
that's all right. So we are
asking them to --there are chain
link fences right now like on the
north and
south sides. So we're asking them
to --
because they were just going to keep
it and then replace,
like, the vinyl or the fabric mesh
stuff that goes on there. We told
them
we want to see more fence. So I think
they'll keep the chain link, but put
a board on
board fence on the south side, and on
the west end there is
an existing break wall. So that will
remain and
the building will act as the other
screen on the east.
so they share a parking lot. They share
a
parking. There are about 57 --
55 parking spaces. They're
going to share a dumpster,
the proposal assigned which complies.
landscaping, no real changes other than
we ask
them to go through and show them the
original landscape plan just to go
through and see if,
you know, over time stuff dies to
go
back in other places and
that is the condition. This one is
one of the itemsitems where we did get
a petition from neighbors
who are in opposition of it.
>> do
you
want me to pass these down?
>> yeah.
so
I've made, like, a summary of the names
and
their concerns.
essentially it's noise, traffic,
odor, sanitation, quality of life,
decrease in
property values, and I have the actual
ones here if you guys want to take
a look
at that.
>> so traffic --their concern
is more traffic over a day care?
>> yeah.
>> that's yours.
[ inaudible ]
>> these
addressesaddresses within the
200 beats. So there should
be a checklist there that show you
between the 200
feet or the 800 feet. So the orange,
if they sign
a petition and then the red
is if they're within
200 feet. Sorry.
but a 200-foot column
and they signed the petition and sent
him a letter and I tried toto check of
the boxes there. There
were some additional petitions, but
they just sent me, like, you
know when
they send someone an email and it's
expand it and it's pixelated
and that's what I got. I got a hold
of someone who will send me the
actual papers because
I couldn't read.
>> someone copy/pasted
something. That's usually what happens when
it gets pixelated like
that.
>> yeah. >> between platforms.
>> so in terms
of
conditions, the only condition was
landscaping
on our side.
one thing you may want to ask is
in terms
of time --
operation time and time when you have
the dogs outside
so they don't go --you know, up
to midnight. And how they deal with waste.
so there is a dumpster and they plan
to
empty it.
>> double bag it. If double
bag it.
>> just like
diapers, right? I know camp bow wow,
I
think they're open until 7:00 and
then
dogtopia is open until 10:00.
>> I
said I --[ inaudible ]
>>
there's another one right up here.
>> they close
at 7:00. That might be this. Dog day out.
dog's day out? Something like that.
it's
right up here by all
the liquor stores. [ laughter ]
>>
right next
door to the liquor store? You know
that area well.
>> I do, indeed. >> he's got a dog
in there.
>> they're the only ones
that can cut my
dog's nails. I won't do it.
>> what's
going
on behind? There's a
residential neighborhood. Right
behind it, what is that in is that
an
oversized garage? Is that part of
that same lot?
>> the montessori academy? >> no,
no, no. Behind it. To the west.
>>
oh, to
that tied to that one
residential lot? I couldn't tell if it
was or not
when I
drove it. It would be right over
here. It would be right this structure
right
there because this is the house. At
first I thought it
was some
kind of lift station or something.
>>
think it's just a big wall for
a house because on the --
>> I'll pull it up. You guys move
on or
go on.
>> it's just a house.
a big lot.
>> yeah. There's a house
and an oversized garage there or something.
okay.
>> okay. So I'm going to keep
trucking along here.
next item is item 9,
samaritan's purse.
>> on the last
one, did you guys want to
do that one first or no?
>> okay.
>> gotcha. >> so item 9
is samaritan's purse, back in 2018,
if you recall, they bought
a piece of
land from fellowship church and
constructed an office warehouse building.
so essentially
they use that their main --like
in november when they have people
come in and they
do the boxes that they hand out and distribute.
so since then, they've
been looking for an
areaarea build for their I.t.
people. So we've been working
withwith and what they're proposing
is they're going to
take out a piece of the parking lot
that's to the
north, build a three-story building
and
then they're buying a portion of
land to the south that's just in front of
the
gas wall and make up for the parking
that
they're taking out. So it will
be a
three-story, first floor
for, like,
for staff. The large break room, staff
devotions, guest training and second
floor for their
I.t. People and the third floor is
for
future growth. So the building will
be
mainly brick. Two different
types with some stucco.
they're showing a sign on the building,
but that's
for illustrative purposes.
>> stucco --
20%?
>> that's
an old --[ inaudible ] [ laughter ]
>> we used
to do that. Efis?
we're not doing efis here.
>> like I said they're taking trees
out for the south
and they are asking for a waiver of
the
tree fees and that will be going to
city council
as
part of their
dus correction. Discussion.
>> based
on what?
>> because they're
good samaritans. Because they're
nonprofit. I've done the christmas boxes.
we've
been doing it for the last five years.
it is an
incredible event. It really is.
>> there
are people from all
over the country.
>> it
doesn't mean they can't comply with
our
requirements.
>> that's something council can
look at. Council
did not approve the permit the last
time when they
built the
building.
>> how much are their fees?
we are
still working on that and somewhere in the
range of
200,000. Somewhere
around there. We're still finalizing
numbers. So the
building --they're building the new
building and they'll have a
little outdoor area with a pergola and that's
what they're planning on doing.
there were no letters
in opposition. So it's pretty standard
comments, additional
comments
for review.
these
the project plant --we are
requesting for staff to administratively
approve any change in landscaping,
because there is
a big 30-foot gas easement that
runs along the creek view, just if
we need
to maneuver and get the trees on the
outside
of that easement. One other thing is
they did turn in some information for
the
downstream drainage.
so they're still working with coal
on finalizing those documents.
>> is there a concern? [ inaudible ]
>> okay.
>> the outside is related
to how the calculations were
for --not related to this project
and it's related to another
one. There is a
required percentage of site for
green space, but then the required
number of trees they've
calculated based on what
is required of the site not of what
they've actually provided and I've
always
understood that it's
10% --or 1x% of
whatever is provided and not necessarily what
is
originally required of this site if
that
makes sense? So the site required,
and
I'm just pulling numbers, 400 square
feet of green space.
>> is that non-
vehicular landscaping?
>> non-vehicular landscaping. >> okay.
and only
two trees were required
based on that 4 00, but
they've actually provided
2400 square feet, falling
back to only two were
required because that's
what's required of the 4 00, but I
forget what the percentage is and it's
not calculated from
the 24.
>> what case are you
referring to?
>>
the
samaritan's purse --
>> sorry.
>> sorry I'm late, but a procedural
question, and again,
I don't know if I should ask it in here
or out there
how it's calculated. I've
always done it that if I'm
provided 2400 --
>> we can double-
check any just make sure,
you know? I'll pull up the
landscape summary table and they were
willing to
add some additional landscaping right next to
the building
which qualifies non-vehicular
landscaping, and they were still working
through whether or not to pave that
area where the generator was going to
be
located.
>> yeah. >> so I think that's
where they can provide that.
>> yeah. We'll take another look.
>> yeah. No worries.
so
item 10 is essentially the plat for
that
where they're
taking that bit to the south adding to
the existing lot and
then platting the rest of it as a separate lot.
and then
item 11?
>> okay. So that's the
767 west main. That's the mixed use
development down
in old town right across the
street from the old town plaza, the
open
space down there.
so
in august 2022 we approved
the mixed-use project that had residential on the
second floor and then retail on the
first floor. They came
back in 2023. You guys remember the
dumpster case where it was too close?
>> yeah. >> well, so they
added restaurant uses to be allowed on
the
first floor. So what they're doing
this time is they're coming
back and they haven't been
successful marketing to a restaurant
or retail users
and they're proposing professional
office or medical office
uses, and
so in order to
create an active, old town
main street area down there we
need retail or restaurant uses that
are
open in the evenings and on the weekends,
and
this, if they do medical office
or professional office probably wouldn't
be, and so --you know,
our recommendation is
for denial. So --
that's what it is.
>> is there a requirement around the
retail to
be open? Like the farmers market is
open
saturday
morning
and --
we've not stipulated hours
of operation for those businesses.
>> it seems like
a missed opportunity.
>> here's the letter requesting the rezoning.
so,
anyway, that's what it is. You don't have
to
approve it. So --
>>
question, though. If a professional
office or medical
office were allowed to
go in, the parking requirement is stricter.
>>
no, it's not stricter because
it's already platted for
restaurant.
>> one to one for medical
office.
>> okay. >> so, yeah, we did
look
through that. It's just the argument's
going to be is
the other
uses around this property are changing,
right?
so we've had summer which changed
to dodi's which was restaurant use
which then changed to tangerine salon which
is a
personal service or kind of
a retail type --but
then the property to the south of
her is just a professional
office that is probably only open on
the
weekdays from 8:00 to 5:00 and it's
an investment --money
matters, I think, is the name of it.
then there's
another business on that same size
are side.
>> a cupcake place -->> cupcake
is in her --
>> space.
>> the arts and
cakery and
then shine directly in the building
north and that's
a mixed-use development so that's
retail and them north of that
is another financial place which is
a professional office. So I think
the argument's going
to be these other people are changing,
why
won't you let me? And so, specifically,
when we wrote this mixed use development
we wanted
to activate the area. So we
wrote retail on the first floor. So
that's why we can't support. We as in staff.
that concludes my
remarks. [ laughter ] is it a
zoning request change. So it's just
to add those
two additional uses. She would still
market it
as retail or restaurant, but she would
also be available to market it as to those other
folks.
item number 12 is the shops
at sandy lake. So this is the piece
that
is on sandy
lake just
north upon
manor and express. So this was part
of an original 29-
acre development where everything kind
of along sandy lake
was some kind of
commercial owe retail and then in
from
that was arbor
manor's 73-year --whatever,
residential lot. So this is essentially
the last
commercial piece to be
developed. So originally,
the plan showed
two buildings on sandy lake with
parking in the back backing up
to the residential. What they're proposing
is
the building towards the back with
the
majority of the parking out front.
so trying to take that parking lot to the
front towards the
street versus back where the residential
stuff is.
in addition, kind of the differences
I'm going
to point out on screen is that
the original p.d. Showed not only
an entrance off of sandy lake, but
also a
drive out to the
hoa lot. Arbor manor has
an entrance or exit out there. So
what they're proposing
is they're going
to share the drive that exists like on
the
verizon building next door, and then
have another entrance/exit out
front on sandy lake with no connection to
the hoa lot. So those are
kind of, like, the bigger differences.
and
there's an
existing brick wall that arbor manor
has for
those houses in that area. One of the other
things
when we
talked to them because originally they
had their trash
cans at the back, right? So we're
told no,
you need to move them off
further into the parking lot
or something, but like, off of the
residential because we know that will
be an issue. So this one is one
building with a patio. They're looking
at retail, medical and restaurant uses.
one of
the conditions is like the patio
is only 555 square feet, but that
we
include that as part of their
parking as we've done with other restaurants.
so
we're hoping to change that in an
ordinance where we
don't have to ask it as a condition
anymore, but anything over 500
you have to park.
one of the other things that we're
looking at with
this one is we
ask them
to put
additional screening or vegetation in
the
back.
so they're planting trees, shrubs,
whatever they may be, really closer
to where the parking lot
hit the --the
back end of the lot to act
as an additional screening device
and along with the
screening while it's there. They're trying
to
save trees along
the eastern side where it kind of
lines with
the entryway,
but essentially, you know, they'll
be planting other
trees within the site and
the majority of trees that are
there will be gone.
this one also had a
lot of people
sending notices. So we sent out
26 within 200 feet and we got ten
back
in opposition and another
120 courtesy notices and we got five
back
in
opposition. Essentially,
here's the other one.
the concernsconcerns traffic and
they're saying that it's hard to turn in and
out of
sandy lake. Loss of green space.
quality of life, noise.
>>
one more?
>> sorry.
lots of paper tonight, and if you
want to
see the actual notices, I've got
them here. We can hand
them out. Essentially the conditions
that we're looking for
is for the 500
square feet patio area that they'll have to update the
drainage analysis toto
staff comments. Any signage that they're
proposing, they just have a monument
sign, but any
wall sign would have to do with
city requirements and
they have to
make a --[ inaudible ]
>> so
it's already going in the p.d. As a
commercial lot.
>> right. Originally, they had two
buildings and they're going
with one building and kind of doing
a flip-flop of
what's there and it's the restaurant --
>> the
argument, the loss of green space, they
can build it in green space anyway.
>>
they're already entitled.
>>
they're already entitled.
>> yes.
how long will it affect the
quality of life?
it's zoned or any nuances
to their request.
>> right. So --you understand that.
I understand understand that, but
when you
see green space that's there and you
move in,
and you've been living there and now
all of
a suddensudden sign goes up --
>>
and the hoa is proposing to buy
it so they can keep the green space?
>> not
to my knowledge.
[ laughter ]
>> this is fairly common,
so --
>> I'm just verifying. >> yeah.
if you read some of the
stuff it's spot zoning. It's not
spot zoning. It's already been planned
for
that. [ inaudible ]
>> so they're
just coming in
with a detailed plan to show you what
they want to do.
>> right.
>> and they're adding restaurant use,
what they want to do. So --
>> when 151 came in --
>> no drive through. >> there were
the
same arguments about the removal of
the trees. Earn seems to
forget that the removal of the trees for
the
development itself.
>> right. >> the
whole
thing was --
>> green space. >> it was heavily wooded.
yeah.
>> allall right. I do have a concern
about
increased traffic. We want to avoid
cars making left turns.
>> there's a
left-turn bay.
>> I'm around there
all of the time
because sprouts is on the other side.
I
appreciate them coming over to the
verizon
bank because that's where the curb
cut is, and you'll
be able to make a left turn.
>> yeah.
>> I know it
can be a lot --
>> increased. >> there
will be a lot of people trying to go
all of the
way across into the turn lane to make a u-turn.
>> yeah. Yeah. >>
so
that's goinggoing fall within the
purview of
the potential signal.
>> everyone will go
right out here to hit the
turn lane right away and make the
u-turn.
>>
or they will come out here.
>> that's what
the smart
people would do. [ laughter ]
>> I
mean,
it happens in every direction.
>> yeah.
>>
because we're so close to the
intersection to
come around that way.
>> once they
go out the wrong way the
first time then the next time they'll get
it figured out, right?
>> yeah.
>> you know --
typically, you know, I would think
if you're having restaurants or office
or
retail,
whatever, later in the not later in
the
day, but 9:00 or whatever, I think
most people if you're going to work
you leave
at 7:00, 8:00?
>> you're talking if
it conflicts with our manor?
>> I'm just saying, you know -->>
are they going to wall that on arbor manor?
>> it's already walled. >> oh,
it's already walled.
>> on the south
side of this property.
>> no. I'm talking about on the east
side.
>> there's kind of, like,
something there. It's commercial.
it's zoned commercial.
>> trees, because's no
actual correction to that drive.
>> correct.
>> I
wonder if it would be better for
sani lake if they don't come out of
the other end
of the property and you won't have
to
worry about
this traffic thing.
>> this is arbor
manor's
ho allot. So they don't own that.
>> oh! >> it's on the other side.
>> on
the east side of the property is arbor
manor's ho allot.
>> okay. Okay.
it's not their lot.
>> we don't want
a connection to their --
>> yeah. Because they don't want
people driving through
their neighborhood.
>> what? >> driving
28 feet.
>> item number 12 or --
I'm sorry, number 13 is essentially
the plat
for it basically showing the water
easement, drainage easement and fire lane.
and let's
see, very quickly, I'll tell you about cases --
>> really --are they actually
requesting a zoning change or amending
the plan of record? ? Just a site
plan approval.
>> no, it is a
zoning --
>>
it was --[ inaudible ]
>> pd
to pd.
>> conceptual pd to detailed
pd
and they're adding the restaurant use.
okay.
>> yeah. City
council, march 10th, we had the
multi-family,
55+ coppell was denied
by city council
3-4 or 4-3. It was close.
>> one vote.
>> what was the main reason there?
>> they didn't think it
was a good use for that area.
>> too
tall?
>> wow. >> too tall was part of it.
density.
>> natera, the
detailed pd was approved. The true
hotel was approved and
the str removal at k
street was approved and the batch
plat was continued to april
28th.
>> chris collins' deal was
approved, too.
>> oh, sorry. >> which
one was that one?
>> the work.
the home-based business.
>> the
concrete plat, did the applicant request
a
continuation or did council want that?
>>
council, they said go back and work on
your plans
and get something that is --is acceptable
for
staff for review and then bring it
back to us and
so I think it was april 24th --
28th.
>> I was
just wondering if they pulled the
december application, and then they
reapplied.
>> they got
a lecture.
>>
was
there any --[ inaudible ]
>> I think
I'll let --[ inaudible ]
>>
december, january --[ inaudible ]
>> all right. Hey. >> so what
was your answer? Did you have a question?
>> I
asked cole if there was traffic analysis for
the
site, and he said no, there wasn't
because
it didn't meet thresholds for an analysis,
and then
I commented that it was huge that
verizon allowed to process the easement
to connect on the back
end of that site, but I did have a
question back
on the old town. So that was previously
a pd, and it will stay as a pd.
>>
are you talking the town --
>>
no, the
professional.
>> yeah. >> so you're --
you're
looking at it the from the big picture
plan.
could there be a challengechallenge
a basis for
a taking
if it's not allowed?
>> no. Not at
all. They have two
apartments rented upstairs
and 750.
>> if
it were to go south,
and they still have their existing
ability.
>> that type of question, I think
needs to be in
executive session.
>> okay.
>>
consultation --
>> we have to say no reasonable use
of property and there
are restaurants
in the area. And they would
have a very tough time
convincing the judge that they don't
have reasonable use.
>> okay. Okay. >> all of
the units in that line
capable of a restaurant?
>>
I think --
>> yeah. Dodi
is still capable --
>> they have three
new buildings.
south of
dodi is where the financial --
>> right. >> they have not been planned
for a restaurant so they have to come
back through
the process. The pad
site is next to twisted route is also
slated
for a restaurant with
the city-owned property.
>> and any restaurant coming in. >>
is that the tamale place?
>> no.
that's the vacant pad site next to that.
>> there are some synergies for those kind
of
uses out there now.
>> yeah.
>> so they may have a hard time
convincing the council and
they're just sitting there watching.
>> yeah.
and I know
it's our vision to create an active
old town. So we can't take away the
evening and weekend traffic.
>> it's come a long way since
the
carter track. [ laughter ]
>> and it
was a very
bad feel.
>> it was. I remember being
out there
with soccer and baseball. Any other
questions
of staff on cases? Okay. With that,
I'll
adjourn the work session at 6:30.
a five-minute break before we start?
>> yes.
>>> okay.
good evening. The time is 6:47
and the planning and zoning commission
is now
reconvening into general session.
prayer to coming out before you
we were in work session reviewing
the cases, and we
had some audio technical and we are
all
squared away and ready to go. So with
that,
item 4 on the agenda is the
citizens appearance. Is there anybody
here that wants
to speak on an item that's not on
the
agenda? Okay. Seeing none.
for the record, we have all of the
commission members
present and we have cindy bishop virtually tonight.
so --
[ inaudible ]
>> oh,
you're right.
ed maurer. All right.
item 5 on the agenda is for approval of
the february
19th meeting. Any comments by the
commission
or is there a motion by the commission?
>> I'll make a motion to approve the --
what was
the date?
>> february 19th?
>> february 19th meeting minutes.
>> I'll second. >> we
have a motion by commissioner
dobmeier and a second by
commissioner patel. Tammy, would you call
the
roll, please?
>> commissioner dobmeier.
>> aye. >> commissioner haas. >> aye.
>> commissioner bishop?
her
audio is not working. I apologize.
all approved, none opposed, motion
carries.
>> before we move on,
cindy, can you hear us? Okay. I
see you're nodding. Okay. We don't
hear you unless you're muted.
okay. Yeah.
if you give us a thumb's up when we
call the roll for
the vote then we'll know, but hopefully
we'll get things
fixed before then, okay?
all right.
>> item 6 is to
consider approval of
the benge
legacy addition lot 1 block a site
plan
to allow for the development
of a 4,900 square foot
office/warehouse located at 428 southwestern
blood at the request
of jason benge being represented by
greg frnka of
gpf architects. We have a
presentation by chairman matt steer.
>> it currently has a single-
family house on itit has plans to
be demolished. The property
is proposed to be cleared and redeveloped
with a 4900 square foot
office warehouse and this is acceptable
within the
light industrial district. They are
planning to have 2100 square
feet of office space, 2800 square
feet
of warehouse space. They are proposing
ten parking spaces where nine parking
spaces
are required.
there's five pecan trees which are
proposed to be
removed and replaced with
15 over story trees.
there are pour
pen oaks andand texas red oaks. The
tree
removal permit will be required prior to
the removal of any trees and as designed
the landscape plan is compliant with
the
landscape ordinance and given that
this property is less than
two acres in size, the
required landscaping is --
is 30% and they are providing
41%. The building is 28-
foot in height and they have a combination
of
white austin stone and the
fiberboard and
dark bronze, metal panels
and the dark bronze
canopies. The staff is recommending
approval for
the benge legacy
site plan, subject to the following
condition and
the detailed engineering and building
permit review
and prior to
the removal of any trees and it shall
comply with the sign
ordinance and the formation of the type of
the lighting
facilities and security lighting,
screening and
glare shades will be required at the
time of building permit
to ensure compliance with the
lighting ordinance. That concludes
my presentation.
the applicant's in the audience as
well, and I'd
be happy to answer any questions.
>> okay. Matt, any concern? >> looks
like a residential property on the
outside?
>> no, sir, that's zone light industrial.
>> okay. Any questions of the applicant?
I'm sorry --
of the staff? Of the commission? Okay.
is the applicant here to present the case?
>> greg, if you
can hold on a second. Can we combine
the two?
we'll com bin bine these two just
to
save a little time. If you can load up item
7.
>>
item 7 is the minor plat.
>> okay.
so
item 7 is considering
approval of the minor plat to
allow for the office
warehouse and jason benge being
represented by greg frnka
of
gpf architects.
>> this plot has never
been
platted. The property must be legally
defined as a lot
and block. The
only easement required is for the water connection
and
the proposed 10' water easement is
acceptable and staff
is recommending approval subject to
the
following conditions there will
be a dditional comments and the
tree removal permit is required prior to
the removal of
any trees and three, the detector
check is
not required and the 10 by 10
easement at the the property line
is
redundant.
>> any questions of staff by
the
commission? Okay. You get the applicant
to present the case.
>> good evening. Mr. Haas,
commissioners, mr. Steer, greg
frnka gpf architect,
coppell, texas. We agree with all of the
staff
recommendations and I would be glad to answer
any questions.
>> any questions of the
applicant.
>> -- back here, too. >> any questions of the
applicant?
I see cindy nodding no.
okay.
>> thank you very much. >> any
final discussion by the commission?
>> is there a motion by the commission?
I'll make a motion for
benge legacy addition lot one
block 1428 southwestern
both minor site plan
approval subject to staff terms and conditions.
>> we have a
motion by commissioner
is there a second in.
>>
second by vice chair blankenship.
tammy, would you
call the roll
please? Please respond aye or nay.
>> chairman haas?
>> aye. >> commissioner hafemann.
>> aye. >>
commissioner patel.
>> aye. >> and
commissioner bishop?
>> I see commissioner bishop,
thumbs up.
>> all approve.
>> thank you very much. Item 8 on
the agenda is a public hearing.
this is to consider approval of
pd-178r2r-c 145 west town
center drive a zoning change request request
for commercial to plan development
178 revision
2 revised commission to revise
the detail site plan for building
b, that
being 145 west town center. A former --
a former child day care facility converting
it to a day care for dogs on 2.
56 acres of property located on the
south
side of town center drive --
I'm sorry,
located on the north of the road at
the
request of
realtex
ventures being represented pie
terwisscha construction. We have representative
mary
paron-boswell.
>> good evening, commissioners.
this site was
formerly used as a children's courtyard day
care
center. The building is approximately
11,000
square feet. There are two buildings
on this lot and they
do share parking.
145 town center, shown there in the
gray, is
proposed to be converted to a dog
day care center and also offering
overnight accommodations. The site will remain
cell
relatively the same and it will be
divided into
play yard as you can see to the north for
small, medium and large dogs as well
as an area for dogs
to relief themselves and there is
an existing black,
chain link fence that will remain.
they'll be
placing a new 8' board on board fence along
the southern property line. The western
property line has
an existing 6' brick wall that
will remain. They will
also be sharing a trash
enclosure that is down in the lower left of the screen.
so
the building itself, like I said,
is about
11,000 square feet and the interior
will be renovated
to include various dog
play areas. Food, prep and storage
areas, a grooming area and
suites for up to 71 dogs and there will
be a waiting area
up front with a reception area, office and staff
area.
they are proposing a
you new wall sign that meets sign
requirements.
in terms of
landscaping, there are no plans to
change the landscaping
on site. Staff is working with the
applicant to identify
any landscaping that may have died
over time
and needs to be replaced. Staff
is proposing a condition that they
replace any
landscaping that is currently missing
or dead.
>>>
the general concerns were noise, traffic,
odor,
sanitation, a decrease in
the
quality of life and a
decrease in property values.
I did hand you a
sign in sheet. There was a
petition signed and handed to us. There
was additional signatures on the petition
but I reached out to
that
person who was collecting them. Because
they sent me,
some j. Pegs and I wasn't able
to read them. I reached out to ask them
for the paper copies so
we can add them to the
records. Staff
is recommending approval to the request
subject to conditions. Two that
the
applicant
replace any missing landscaping and allow
staff
to update any landscaping. That is
the end of
my report.
>> with regard to some
of the previous similar type land uses
in other parts of town. When they
came through the process, have there
have been any
complaints, any formal complaints
with regard to those
uses for noise, nuisance, any of
those kinds of things?
>> not to my
knowledge.
>> I'm sorry. >>
no, sir not to
my knowledge.
>> okay. But you checked
if there
was any
complaints?
>> right because we've done like
the doggy day
care, which is not there anymore. But
I haven't
had anyone else --I think people
earlier that lived like further
away had come in during the zoning process. But after
they did not, no
one came in. I haven't heard any complaints.
>> okay. Any questions of staff?
by the
commission?
>>
mary.
>> yeah. >> what kind
of fencing is -- sampson
drive. Residences from all
of
the activity
to south of sampson drive?
>> I'm
not
sure honestly.
>>
sir, we'll get
to
you shortly.
>> okay. >> I don't know. And
remember,
so thank you.
>> any other questions
of staff by the commission?
>> is
the,
so did I understand that the prior
zoning landscaping plan
has been incorporated into what we
see in this
plan, or it will be part
of terms and conditions?
>> so,
when we were reviewing the plans,
they basically
told us that they weren't planning
on changing anything. So our response
was well,
we need to go, we need you to make
sure that,
everything that was supposed to be
there is
still there. And if not, go back and replace
it. Because we
have had the freeze over the last
couple
of years and, things just die naturally. So
we like them
to replace anything that, has died
off or is missing and in response
to your question. Does look
like there's a, a brick wall. That
has been pulled up.
>> on the north side of town.
>> mayor,
--mary, can you pull up the map that has
the location
of the feed back we received from
the public. Okay,
so we have the 200
on the top left and the 800 on the
top
right. Our screens
are blanking out here.
>> yeah, sorry. So
the one on
the bottom
right is the 800. It doesn't include
all
the 200s.
>> okay. >> okay,
very
good. Is the applicant here to present
the case?
>> good afternoon. >> name
and address for the record
please.
>> my name
is nada javon
I'm the
owner of excellent pet club. I'm
an infectious disease by profession. Actually I
respect the neighbor's concerns. I
understand that. Buff if
I can briefly address all those concerns. I'll
be happy. It's going to be
very well managed and
all time supervised by
our well trained and certified staff. So
the dogs at the
beginning are going to be evaluated. And
based on their temperament, their age,
their size and
even their type of the play they would
like, they will
be grouped and they will be supervised. So
most of the time, they
will be kept inside. We have the two
play
group indoor play group and we also have
the enrichment room. So it's
going to be, they're going to be involved
with the enrichment activity all the time. And
about the noise,
they will be in
a smaller group, all the time. Supervised
by
staff. And not all the time
outside. It's going
to be from 10:00
a.m. To 5:00 p.m. Rotation. Some part
outside,
some part inside and sometime resting. For
the cleanliness, as
I said I'm a scientist. So cleanliness
is my first priority. The
trash will be picked up immediately. We
will have a contract
with a commercial. So they will pick
up
the trash three times a week. So there's no
issue with the cleanliness and
with the odor, we have the protocols
to
clean the play area
outside and all with
the doggy safe, you know the
material and take liquid to clean
them. And
about the traffic,
one of the concerns actually it's because
the --it used to
be a doggy day care we're going to follow
the same pattern. Drop off and
pick up the dogs during the
day. But we also will offer
the kind of, the valet drop off. So
one of the staff is going to bring
the
dog to the car and one of
the staff
in the morning they will get
them inside. And
sorry I forgot what
was the other concern.
>>
I actually have
a question. Tell me what your
plan is specifically with waste.
>> the
waste will be
picked up immediately by a staff. They
will seal a bag
and we will put it in the trash with a
secure lid. And
they
will collect them, we will store them
in the drums are outside and
they will collect them three times
a week.
>> at any point will there
be open
waste.
>> no not at
all.
>> okay, thank you. >> -->> is your mic on. >>
it's going to be
group play. And like I said, it's
going to be enrichment type play. We
will have
enrichment outside. They will take
with their handler, you know
our staff outside. They will play
like
the one on one play
or they will have enrichment and they
will bring them
inside. It's not going to
be the whole day without supervision. If
any parking access happens they
will redirect, they
will try to redirect their attention
and
if some of the --thaeup --they will
put them in a
time out and they will bring them
inside.
>> you mentioned
they're not going to
be outside for long?
>> no, no. Unsupervised
actually. Each play session is going
to be
20 minutes for a small group. Like,
five to 10 dogs with one handler
it's going to be 20 minutes outside
with as I said it's
not like the frilly play. It's going
to be enrichment play with
going to
the farm and then
coming back
inside. To engage them mentally and physically
all the time. Dogs
bark when they're bored. So they're
not
going to bark.
>> so you say small,
medium large and it's an hour. So
they're only outside one hour of the day.
>>
two
times outside. And the rest is going to
be inside
with exercise that we will have. And
with the play
area inside. And also they will
rest
most of the time you know. Doggy needs 16
hours of sleep.
>>
I have some
questions. I'm not familiar. I don't
have
dogs but what's involved with enrichment?
>>
enrichment,
the means of enrichment, make
them physically and
mentally engaged with some play
like the sniffing, and play or exercise
like
doggy
treadmill or something like that.
>>
and then with
regards to the valet or any type of
drop off. How is that typically done? Are
the dogs on
leash from?
>> yes,
of course.
>> that's like a mandatory? >>
yes, it's
mandatory.
>> if there is valet
service offered they're coming out, they're
leashed. So there's no time where they're
not leashed.
>> no, not
at all. Otherwise in the play
area which is enclosed.
>> at
the out outset of your presentation. Did
I
hear you say this particular building.
>>
a kids day care.
>> it
was a kids day care. I thought I heard
you say it was
a dog's day care.
>> no it was a kid's
day care.
>> and then we
have the
waste removal. Okay most of the time. And
then, you
said outside, no that's the removal
three times a week of
waste.
>> three times per
week.
>>
three times per
week. Okay.
>> thank you. >> ma'am,
where
exactly outside will the dogs be playing?
>>
those
two big rooms and the north
side is enrichment room. Outside you mean.
>>
yes, yes.
>>
no, it's the
next one. Those two blue
one. And we will
have the, the farm enrichment farm. And
it's going to
be there, you know sorry relieving
area.
>> will any
of those areas be fenced?
>> all of
them are fenced.
>> solid fencing,
what kind
of fencing.
>>
inside it's going
to
be wire fence.
>> excuse me. >> wire
fence. But outside it's
going to be wood.
>>
that's where you said board on
board.
>> yes. >> okay, okay thank you. So I saw the first. >>
I just had a quick question. You had
mentioned
that the dogs would only be outside between
the hours
of 10:00 a.m. And 5:00 p.m.
>> yes. >> so after 5:00 p.m., dog -- >> they
will be inside and our operation times is
going to be 7:00 a.m. To 7:00 p.m. So
we don't have
any day care. So they will go to
their resting area
to the --
>> so they won't be
playing outside before 10:00 a.m.
or after 4:00 p.m.
>>
no, we don't have to.
>> before I
make
assumptions of the words being used. The
two
areas off to the it'll be on the north
side and
south side of the building
that we refer to as
relief areas.
>> yes. >> are those,
are they relieving themselves in those areas
or is it --
>>
you know for the boarding dogs, we
will
have the --in the morning time. We will immediately
after they wake up at
the 7:00 a.m. We will take them to
the relief area. So of course they
will relieving in the
other area too. But that's just for
morning and for the boarding dogs.
>>
is it fair to ask to
only have relief area on
one
side of that property and
preferably on the south side.
>> we
have the area on
the right for the smaller dog and on
the
left side, yes that one and this one.
>>
my
question is can that one on the
north side be consolidated to
the south side so that it
is further
away from the
north property and the adjacent community.
>>
yeah, it can
change.
>> that just allows
greater distance.
>>
yeah, I will share this with our
contract.
>> any other
questions of the applicant? Okay. I
wish we could
let cindy in. But, sorry, our screens are cutting
out. Maybe you can text or something
if you have questionless. But what
was
the right to ask you to
come back after the public hearing. Okay. Very
good. All right, so we
have several folks that have
signed up for this case. So, we appreciate you
coming out. You will have
three minutes to speak. No more than three
minutes. Cami if you can raise your hand. Maybe
they have 30
seconds to start wrapping it
up. But we want to
try to get to everybody. So I will
call names
first person then followed by so that
the next person can
get ready and we can move
through this fairly quickly. We
will
start out with pete sup erack
and to be followed by sarah sanders and
brandon gros.
>> apologize for the
fence comment. This is my first one. So
good evening and
thanks for the opportunity,
my name is pete superack. The property
is under construction,
the property under construction
for rezoning is located right behind
the border fence of
my house. I want to make it very clear, we
love dogs, I have two rescues. My
wife has
fostered dogs. We support small
business. This property
sits
behind a row of residential
homes 11 behind fence
and is close
to two montessori schools. Many of
us use our
pools, backyard spaces to relax, spend
time
with our families especially during
the weekends. So
persistent
barking will definitely impact the
quality of our life. Second, even responsible management.
facilities that
manage -- especially
in texas odor becomes
a big problem for precedents. It's
important to note that town center is
the
primary rout used by the high schoolers
and the students that walk, use bikes
and scooters to
travel to and from schools. And then
finally, property value
for many of
us our homes is the single
biggest financial asset we own. One
backing up to a
doggy day care
and
one that does
not. So even under ideal management. There
are no perfect fences that
are going to stop dogs from barking. There
are no trash bins
no matter how you
seal it that is going to eliminate
hot odor especially on a hot texas
day. On the evening that's
when
I use the backyard
the most. There were no
--all the comments were about the
weekday, what are you
going to do on
the weekend. This is simply not the appropriate
location
for a doggy day care. For
this reason, I respectfully ask the
committee to consider the impact this will
have on
our schools. We have already submitted
a petition that has
52 signatures with gratitude I thank
you for your time and consideration.
>>
okay,
thank you very much. Quick question
for you.
>> yes, sir. >> so you mentioned
increased traffic. How
would this be
increased traffic over a child care?
that was
previously there.
>> statistically
we would have to
measure that. 71 dogs, I don't think
71 children are in that
day care next to it. You would have
to measure that.
>> thank
you. Thank you. Sarah sanders followed
by landon gause. And so mrs.
sanders you live on beachwood. Where's beachwood.
>>
across from the
library in town
center. I see it
now. Got you. Thank
you.
>> sarah sanders, my child attends coppell
montessori and my family frequently
commute on foot. Town center drive
to
the high school on weekends and weekdays
and it's only
the only
paved side of that
street which
is butting up
against this facility. I've volunteered
at
multiple dog shelters. And I've seen
dogs escape their leash even
by trained handlers. In an area with
children, it is not just
an inconvenience it is a danger. Big
fan
of dogs, big fan of kids but those
two
don't blend well in close quarters. The
noise pollution with the significant
outdoor
presence like the proposed
facility is objectively loud, consistent and
uncontrollable. Even with redirection
and engagement. I am surprised
actually the city would consider putting such
a facility with a 71
dog capacity so centrally in a high
trafficked
area by people of all ages. Using
the other two doggy
day cares in coppell is
an example. One doesn't have a designated outdoor
area. So they do relief
for dogs in the surrounding
runs. The other
has runs but
they're fully
surrounded by parking lots. Barking
acts
as a stressor
on children's brain and reducing cognitive
functions such as focus. Leading to
the height fear or alertness. I'm
not
a scientist but I
do have children that walk by this
facility
every day. Town
center drive is the proposed facility becomes
a booming
nonstop thoroughfare five days of
the week. From school
start. After school program and
last week 1400 students signed on
for honor roll run. And many
of them are
in that same area. The
buses, cars, high schoolers and constant
noise. I
oppose, with kids, school staff and
commuters as their close
proximity will raise stress levels
and negatively impact the
day fall. Thank
you.
>> thank you very much. Landongaus. While
brandon is coming
down. How many kids are enrolled at the
day care center. Do we
have
a number of capacity of
what was previously there? Thank you.
mr. Gause.
>> just to quickly
address ed haas question. Was there
any complaints with other doggy
day care. I think the reason why there was
no
complaints is
because the day
cares that were surrounded by industrial areas. That's
probably why
there isn't that many complaints. My
property is actually directly across the
fence that the dogs
will be playing in. And so I have
a
direct connection to this. We actually
walk
--walked it yesterday with the kids. I
basically second everything that was
said by the previous two speakers. I'm
not a
scientist, I don't have a lot
of stats. Say, but
I think just from a selfish
perspective that I don't really see
a doggy day care being
near a residential area
as something that is conducive to
daily life. There's also a
direct child day care right next to
it. Right
next door called the children's courtyard. So
there's going to
be drop off and pick up from there
as well. To me
that seems that would be a safety
and liability
issue as well. If a dog were
to get off leash, kids five and under
are statistically
even as I said I don't have any statistic,
kids five
and under are more
likely to get
bit by a dog. Sanitation was covered. I
don't really have much else. I think
they covered really everything that's
involved. But,
I just hope that we use common sense
here. And that there are
other properties that could
be used for this. So, I thank
you for your
time.
>> thank you. >> vicki rice
followed by darla mann.
>>
chairman haas.
>> yes. >> so between
the two buildings, which
are basically about the
same time. 334 kids between
both buildings.
>> 334,
so 150, 180 kids. Okay. Okay. Yes,
ma'am.
>> hi
my name is
vicki rice. I'm the director of coppell montessori. Our
playground backs up
to that area with just
a small creek separating the properties. Toddlers
play
out there all day. Learning
and playing. Dog day cares typically include
dogs playing
together which can result in frequent barking
and noise
throughout the school hours. She said
between 10:00 and 5:00 those
are the times we're outside. For very
young children,
that level of noise
can be disruptive to outdoor play. Learning
activities and
rest times. Many children at this
age are also frightened
by loud barking or groups of unfamiliar
dogs. There's
also practical concerns as everyone
has mentioned. The sanitation, odors
and waste management
so close to an area where children
play. As others have mentioned, town center
drive
becomes very busy throughout the week. There's
buses, cars, the
high schoolers
that go through that area. It's crazy. My
intention is
not to
impose the business
but for the city to
consider if placing
a
doggy tkeu
-- day care is
the best choice.
>>
hi thank you very
much. My name is darla mann. I reside
on shady lane. So our
residents first off
I came really just to show support. I
did sign the petition and my mother
as
well. We're the neighbor we're
on the west side of this location. But
as I've
been sitting here listening to the
meeting,
the city's point of view and
any kind of information that they've
gathered. So
I want to provide some
perspective on
our side. Originally this was
a day care buildings a and
b were both populated for
children. As
a resident of coppell since 1969 at
this residence
since 1980, we've seen a lot of growth. The
high
school has been built. The
day care has been put
in. Mr. More homes around us. Even
the church
which is just south of this
property,
over the years
we have been inundated by noise. The
day care with screaming, playing kids. All
hours,
all ages. We get noise from the high school
which you know
the field is a little further
away but we still get it. Also the
church which
is just, a
stone's throw south of this facility. You
think a church is
going in there but they play rock
& roll kind of music
that really imnates out
of there on wednesday and thursday
evenings and on sunday mornings. They've
tried to do some improvement
from sound barrier but
we still
hear it. So
we
are bombarded
with
noise by these entities
that have grown
up around our homes. The brick fence runs
across that entire line. There's two actual
brick fences. There's the church brick
fence that
runs all the way out to sandy lake
and
then there's the day care brick fence that's
only brick on
the west side. Everything else
is chain link. So
there is a gap there. Probably 10
to 12-inches
where those
fences do not meet and you know critters
go in and out
of there so dogs can certainly go
in between
and enter our property. So
a few things that I
wrote down today, proximity. I'm an
animal lover, not against the
business but
again there's probably been
no complaints because the doggy day
care within coppell.
>>
thank you. We'll give you another
minute to
wrap up.
>> are in an
industrial
area more so. We, this is a very dense neighborhood,
I just, we
feel and my mother feels this is just
not the
appropriate location for this
facility. Also regarding the landscaping,
trees were planted in
that original day care as it was. I
believe their oak elms. They have
the little
tiny leaves all along that fence. They're
on their side of the property
but as they've grown over the last
decade or so. They
have branched out and they
are over into our property. We, had
many conversations trying to
get them to do their tree management,
cut them down. You know trim them
down. It's been futile
because it's always, well we have
to deal with corporate. It's
been like a brick wall. So there's
a lot of landscaping. That needs
to be done on that property regarding
treeing, regarding grasses. Especially
in those areas where
they're going to have relief urine constantly
going through
there. That's going
to erode the grass. It's going
to emanate the odor. Again
another thing regarding the
noise. Talking about 10:00 a.m.
to 4:00 p.m. 70 dogs all of that play
time is going to
be our on side. For years. We would
hear
the kids outside screaming and playing. My
mother actually worked nights. It
was
very
hard for her to sleep. It's just, we've
been inundated
by noise. You would not think there would
be
that much noise but there is. Now
to have barking dogs,
I just. I can't even. I don't even
want to go there. I have
also have a child who is
on the autism spectrum. And he is
afraid of dogs
so a constant barking of dogs. I
just, we don't want to
have to tolerate it. And the weekend
issue --that was
another.
>> we'll follow up,
question on the applicant
there. Thank you
very much. So we have vishi.
>> yeah,
that's
me.
>>
followed by shanti.
>>
we are here for actually items 12
and 13.
>> oh you signed up on
the wrong one.
>> sorry about that. >>
you want to say anything while you're
here?
>> yes. >> okay we'll get you
on
that one. So y'all are on
12. All right.
>> all
right, sir,
so, it would be
rama rara, probably and rama
sana
rosani. So these are all
12. Okay. Oh my gosh and ron you're
on for item 12. For
this one. The
other
one,
okay. How about robert? Robert dolman. You
on --
I'm sorry. I
didn't plan on saying anything.
>>
okay, okay. There's,
mr.
doman.
>> was that on item eight or 12. >> we
agreed on
everything.
>> I just want to make
sure I get
everybody
here. This is on eight,
this is on 12. Then
I'm
just going to say mr.
and mrs. Woo. She's brave. By hands
those coming down are there others
that would like to speak on the item.
>>
I crossed my name out. I thought --
>>
I see that.
>>
we'll get
others that haven't
signed up. But,
mrs. Woo.
>> hi. >> I'm the resident
at
127 clover lane
in the neighborhood. So I opposed
the working the former
into a dog day care center because
this location is
in the middle of residential neighborhood
with many families
with kids. Myself has two kids. And.
>>
could I ask you to
speak closer to the mic so
we can hear you.
>> sure. So I oppose
converting the former
facility into a dog day care center
because this location is
in the middle of a residential neighborhood
with many families
and kids and myself have
two kids. I
think this, dog day
care center will, like
bring noise, odor and sanitation
concerns. So it will impact, naturally impact
the
quality of life for the
neighborhood. So I respectfully ask
the authorities to
take this concern. And takes up
community concerns
seriously. And we can consider this
proposal.
>> in
opposition.
>> is there anything else. >> thank
you very much.
>> are
there
others that would like
to
speak on the item? Come
on
down, over here.
>> hey there. Closer. >> you
can
pull
it down.
>> is that better. Hi I'm
shafini, 411, or 144 woodhurst
drive. I have lived in coppell since 1995
and
moved back here about four years
ago. Actually lived in the neighborhood
that's adjacent to the
neighborhood that this would be at. That
backs up to the high school fields. So
I
do, understand the people that live
behind the
noise pollution that's already there. I
would also, urge the in opposition. Sorry
if I didn't say that. Would
urge you guys to really consider
flipping the sanitation to that backside that
is
where
my
child goes to school
at coppell montessori and we're very
concerned with the sound. And
there's a creek that goes there and
it could make
the situation much worse for the run
off. I
heard her address the concern for
removal. But also
coppell has pick up twice a
week. I'm interested
if they will have pry --
private pick up and how that
will work.
>> can
I get your name.
>> shae finney. Woodhurst drive. By
the duck pond.
>> okay, got
you. All righty. Thank you very much. Is
there anybody else
who would like to speak
for
or against the proposed application.
>>
may I add one comment.
>>
he used his three minutes. You still
have three minutes. I
will need
your
name and address for the record.
>>
dawn superack. I
was just looking at the sign and it
says that they are maximum dogs could
be 71 dogs total
at a time. I know a lot of facilities allow
dogs
that come from the same household
to stay in
the same suites or the
same kennels. So essentially that
71 dogs could be 144 dogs. I don't
know if their facility is going to allow
that but
I know most of them do. So that is
just another, concern
that I have that
is not just 71 dogs that, it could
potentially
be 144. Thanks.
>> thank you very
much. Is there anyone else who
would like to speak
for or against the proposed application. Seeing
none. I will
close the public hearing. If
we could have the
applicant come back
please. There were a couple of concerns
raised through the period. One of
the concerns is what are the operations on
the weekend.
>> the operation on the weekend
for the day care is going to
be shorter. It's going to be 8:00
to just 5:00 p.m.
>>
8:00 to
5:00. Both saturday and sunday.
>>
yes, yes.
>> then there was
a follow up question with regard to sanitation. The
pick
up, the
operations of who's providing.
>>
that's going to
be commercial, private they pick up
the trash. If it's needed we can add
it more time. But for now we have
a
contract for three times
a week. We can add it for, you know, like
the summertime
we can add it to four
times a week.
>>
is there special disposal required?
>>
yeah, they are a
private company.
>> so
they're versed in those type of operations.
>>
yes.
>>
I'm sorry. There's a
side bar going on over
there. Then there's
one last one. 71 times two, 144.
>>
for a
smaller, the kennel we're not allowing
two dogs
at a time. Just for suites that we
will have
eight suites for them we can for two dogs
not for the rest.
>> so the total
is 71
dogs.
>> the total is 71, yes. >>
total.
>> total. >> okay, all right. While
the applicant is here.
>> it's
not usually 71 for day care. It's
for boarding
kennel 71 as I mentioned in a,
you know it's not very clear here. But
we are for indoor play, we just have
a 15
as a big dog and 15 as
a small dog. For a day care.
>> so
thank you.
>> the small. >> thank
you for that clarification. So what
is the total potential number
of dogs
on-site?
>> 71. >> total. >> total. >> boarding
or
nonboarding.
>> yeah. >>
including suites.
>> including suites. Yes.
eight suites is just like.
>>
okay, what does
the staffing look
like. Because you mentioned there will be
1v1.
>>
we will have
seven to nine. Around seven for each
shift.
>> seven for each shift. Is
there,
I'm not clear with this operation.
>>
like each
10 dog, seven to 10 dogs per handler.
>>
per person. Okay, okay. And they will
never
leave the site.
>> no. >> they're
only, okay.
>> they're
going through the, you know the training
program. So
they will know the dog behavior. They
will have
a course and a dog behavior how to
handle
the emergencies. How to handle the
barking. How to you know the manage the emergency
time. So, they will have
the training time and they will certify
before.
>> is that a requirement
for this type of operation.
>> no
for our
operation it's going to be
--
>> for your operational. >>
--operations.
>> so you have
another location.
>> no this will
be
the first location.
>> out of curiosity
why this business.
>> actually I
was looking for my dog. I have
two dogs so I was looking for their
boarding. So I was thinking, okay,
when I
saw
couple, I thought I can do
better.
>> okay. Any final
questions of the applicant. Samit.
>> just
to
clarify from an operational standpoint. You
are going to allow boarding overnight.
>> yes. We
will
have staff overnight.
>> but no dogs
will
be taken outside overnight.
>> no,
no. They will have a
relief area inside too.
>> similar
on the
weekends. So somebody could check
their dog in for a
vacation.
>> oh no we have a time
for accepting and for you know, drop
off and pick up. We
don't load them any time.
>> spring
break this week, somebody can check
their
dog in on a saturday and pick
them up a week later following sunday?
>>
yeah,
they can do it, yes, of course.
>>
okay, okay.
>> I
have a question, a couple of
things came up for staff while she's
still
here. Is there any, is staff aware of
any
creeks or run off area adjacent to
this property? And is there any
part of
this property that's directly adjacent
to the montessori school?
>>
so I'll have to defer
to engineering about the creeks. I'll
let, I think he's going to
look that up. I'm sorry what was the
second question.
>> we had a couple
of comments that this
was directly adjacent to the
montessori school. Is there any piece
that abuts next to that.
>> it
looks like it's
the church or a
church parking lot. Yeah.
>>
so looks like
the montessori backs up to the other day
care.
>> okay no more questions
for me, thank you.
>> on the other
side.
>> fire away. >> I
don't know who this is toward. But
the eight foot board fence is it continuous
around there regardless of the existing walls
and whatever. Or is it
meant to bridge, is it only intended
to bridge the gaps where
the walls are not?
>> so, our intent
is there's a wall to
the west which is
a brick wall. Which is going to stay. Then
on the
north facing
the street and on the south at
the rear, there's currently a chain
link fence where I think there's fabric
and
we didn't want
just that. So it should be in front
of I think
they're going to keep the chain link
fence but it should be on the
rear. Because we don't want
kids sticking their hands in there.
>>
right, right. But in lieu of the comment, because
knowing that there's drainage and
what not below brick walls,
we want to
make sure that that's closed off too. Maybe
not a solid 8-foot fence,
but they want to make sure
no dog goes boroughing underneath
the wall or
the fence.
>>
board on board outside.
>> okay.
okay.
>> fire away kent. >>
why are we agreeing to a board on
board. Wouldn't
it be better to recommend a stone
or
brick fence or something of that nature.
something that's
solid?
>> if that's
something
that you want to recommend.
staff was
just thinking of leaving the
chain link
fence. We thought the board on board was better
for blocking access.
>> thank
you.
>>
any other comments. Okay discussion
by the commission.
>> so
I have mixed feelings about
this application. Because
it
is a, a lot of dogs. But with the
proper mitigation I was
concerned about,
this gentleman over here who was thinking
that,
the location of this
operation would impact his property
values and I'm wondering how, the
rest
of the commission feels about
that. Because I'm thinking
that this, operation is far enough away
from that land to not impact it. But,
maybe I'm wrong. I would
like to
see
what others on the commission feel about that. ,
I think I can support
this project if all of the fencing was
brick or some kind of stone fence
of some
sort. Something that's attractive
to the area
and build it up. I'm not
really excited about the chain link
fence and or, any of that. Plus it
would mitigate
any potential run off
so called if there would be
any. You know fluids and
what not that would not
be you wouldn't want to see go elsewhere
from dog urine or
whatever. I think that's my initial thought.
>>
thank you. You can have
a seat. Other thoughts by the commission. Sue.
>>
you
know, initially I thought this was
probably a good
conversion use of a day care
into a doggy day care. Burr listening
to some of
the residents and what they really had
to
say about it, I'm not sure in this
particular location that it's really
good based
on the foot traffic and the proximity to
the montessori and to the other day
care and to the high schoolers walking
by. You
know those high
schoolers are going to atphroeu --
to annoy
those dogs as they walk by. Any way,
I don't know
if this is the best spot in this. There's another
day
care for sale on the other side of
the creek
with no residents. But any way. I
don't
know
that I can support the approval of
this.
>>
okay. I wanted to understand what this
land
use potentially could be like. I visited
other locations in coppell just driving
around. Just
listening for sounds, things like
that. So there's one
there, more or less on the north quadrant of mcarthur
and belt line. And I detected no
smells. There was operations when
the door opened. I could hear dogs barking. There
was
a brick fence on one end. Some dogs
were
out playing. I could hear them. But,
then I decided
to check with
some of the
folks that lived
in that adjacent neighborhood. And
kudos
to coppell residents for not opening the
doors for strangers. But I
found some folks walking. So I asked
them questions. And
they were you know,
they were at 500 feet plus and
from the alley of
I believe it was crestview
or, I lost it
here. Yeah crestview.
>> for clarification
you're talking about camp bowwow.
>>
yes.
>>
from the alley,
I could hear the dogs. So
that's over 400 plus feet. And but
the residents, that
I spoke with they didn't have any problem. They
said
they could hear them, you know. They
were fine with it. But no
big deal. The second location I
went to was
the one just on
the southeast
corner of denton tap and sandy
lake
there by, by victor's. I'm looking
for the
name here. It's right
there by
the rock & roll.
>> dogtopia. >> dogtopia
yes thank you
for that. So I spoke with residents behind
there
on glenview. Because they're a lot
closer. The residents I spoke with there,
actually one guy
over here answered his door. He said
that he's
never had a problem. The noise,
not a problem. Smell, not a problem. Then
I decided, let me check with some
of the
adjacent commercial businesses if there's
any issues. And
so I went to
the zalot's and the
rock & roll, rock of school rock
of ages whatever it is. The restaurant
couldn't really hear anything
other than when the dogs were going
in and out. Rock &
roll place there, they could hear
them
through the wall. But they have drones and guitars
going
so it kind
of blended in. I didn't hear really
anything negative. But
as I consider this site and I consider
the comments we've received here regarding just
the proximity
of
other children's
abg tiffties -- activity, and the
proximity
of residents. Especially the resident
that's been here
since 1969. She looks
awful young for being here since 1969. I'm
not against
the use but I think
this may
not be the location. Are there any
other
thoughts or final comments by the commission?
>>
I think the convenience of it being
within
the community, no different than when
we do look
for a day care. I like it near by
my home
so that I can
pick up and drop off kids. Dogs. It
would be an interesting study, 71
dogs versus
180 kids which one
is louder in the day. This happens
to
be a larger commercial property and
this property just
happens to be
on one side of
it. But the over all residential area
was built adjacent to
a large commercial property. So
the church noise,
the other noise. I'm mixed, I am mixed
because of its --but I think
there's a value
and
a convenience of it as well being
so close.
>> with
that said is there a
motion by
the commission?
>>
okay I move to
approve pd178r2r-cu at 145
west
town center
drive. A zoning
change request from pd178r2r-planned
develop to-78 commercial
two pd178r2rc planned development. 178
revision to
commercial to revise the detailed
site plan for building b at 145
west town center. Which was a former child
day care center subject to
staff conditions.
>> okay we have
a
motion by commissioner hafemann is
there a second.
>> I
will second.
>> I'm sorry. There was
a
second okay so we have a
motion
by commissioners hafemann
and a
essential
by commissioner dobmeier.
>> commissioner
dobmeier.
>>
aye.
>> blankeship. >>
nae.
>> commissioner patel. >> aye. >>
and commissioner bishop.
>> nae.
can you hear me?
>> yeah, we got
you now. So
that, motion is a tie. That motion
is
a tie. That motion fails. So we
need
another
motion
by the commission. Sue.
>> I motion
to deny consideration of
pd-178r2r-c.
>> we have a denial by commissioner
blankenship. I will second that
motion. Cammy
would you call the roll
please.
>> commissioner dobmeier. >> nae. >>
vice chair blankenship.
>>
aye.
>> commissioner haas. >>
commissioner
bishop.
>> aye. >> so
that motion fails. We're landlocked.
>>
as a matter of law,
it requires a majority to
be approved. That means 50% plus one. You
did not
receive 50% plus one so it's
denied.
>> so it's denied. >>
yes, sir.
>> okay. So the application
as presented
is denied. You have the ability to
appeal to
council for your application. But
thank you to those
who came
tonight
and the
input
for that. Okay, moving
on. Item nine. Considering approval
of pd-296r-li, samaritans purse addition
lot 1r block
a, a zoning change request from pd-296-li. I'm
sorry. Let
me
back up
here. A zoning change request from planned development
to 96 light development and revised light
industrial. To add parking lot
to add a parking lot to
the south of the existing planned development
for parking
and update the
existing site plan for
a new additional 37,699 square
foot three story professional building office building
located
on approximately 13 acres of land on the
west side of creek view drive approximately
525
feet north of
bethel road at the request
of samaritan's purse and fellowship
purse. And
being represented by kelsey
campbell. We have a staff presentation by mrs.
mary prune boswell.
>>
mr. Chairman if you choose to you
can also, do the replat of
the two lots that would result. If
you will just
read that first sentence that will
get us to that issue.
>> is anybody
opposed on the commission on that? Okay. So
we're
going to
combine nine and 10. Item
10 is a
public hearing to consider approval
of samaritan's purse
addition lot 1r and two block
a replat. A plat request to create
two lots
extending lot 1r south of the existing
planned development to be used for additional parking
and the existing gas well
site on lot 2 on approximately 27.6
acres of land located
on the west side of creekview
drive approximately 525 feet north of
bethel road at
the request of fellowship
church
fka fellowship in hras colinas being
represented by kelsey campbell, kimley-horn
& associates.
>> all the
property was
once owned by fellowship church. A
portion was sold
to samaritan's purse and developed
as warehouse space. This is
an expanse of the samaritan
purse site. So there's two main changes. One
is
to remove parking for the addition
of a
new three story building. The
location of the new building
necessitated the parking and the fire
lane. The new buildings large floor will
include staff
devotion for 70 and guest training. The
second floor will house 30 of their
information technology staff and the
third floor is for future
growth. In order to accommodate
the new building and the parking associated
with it,
and the parking that was lost to the new
building footprint
a new parking
lot will be constructed
south of the existing lot. The new
parking is the second main change. So
they are
plotting some land to the
south to -- the required parking. They're
removing 60
spaces and adding back
176 for a grand total of 399 spaces
on-site. So the elevation shows that the
majority of the
building will be brick with a
small portion to be stucco. There
are three
brick
colors proposed. The stucco will be a
pepper corn color. Here we're looking at
the elevations
of the new three story building. It's
just under 200
feet of height. It will have
a canopy on the front. In terms of
building signage I know there's one
shown
on the diagram here on
the illustration but it's just for
illustrative purposes. In terms of landscaping,
so that
they meet the site requirement staff
will
be working with the applicant for tree
placement along
creek view drive. Since there is a major
gas easement
that runs parallel to the street. Staff
is requesting a condition that would allow us to
administratively approve any
landscaping to the easement. They
are proposing 40 trees, 19 trees
in the parking and outdoor patio
area. The new parking area will require
existing
trees to be removed, so the
applicant will be requesting that
the
fees for tree mitigation
be waived. This can only
be done by council. So
let's see here. In addition there's
a larger tree that requires city council
approval as well. So
now we're looking at the northern
portion
of the site. So the blue represents
the new building. And then
just to the
left of that
you will
see
the new patio area with pergola that they're
planning. Again
this was a zone
change request. We did send out
notifications within 200
feet. Additional courtesy within 800
feet and received no responses. And
we do have conditions,
so staff is recommending approval of
the request
subject to the following conditions. One
that
there may be additional
comments during the building, comment. Two
that a replat will
be required and recorded prior
to building permit. Three that if
tree mitigation fees
are not waived that
the mitigation fees be
paid prior to plat recordation. Three,
to allow staff to administratively
approve my changes related to the landscaping
in the 30-foot gas easement. Five that
a
signage must comply with the
city ordnances. And six, a downstream
drainage analysis will be
required in order to
determine whether storm water detention
is needed. I'm
going to go through item 10. Item
10
is essentially the companion piece. So
it's
a plat, the plat
to create two lots which includes extending
plot one
to be used for the additional parking
and lot two
will consistent of the existing gas
well
and the remainder of the existing tract. So
the one
in yellow is
the new lot
for the samaritan's first
expansion.
and
again, this is the companion piece. So
in
terms
of recommendation, staff recommends
approval of the samaritan's purse fellowship
addition replat. That additional comments
may be
generated upon detail engineering
permit reviews. That's the end of
my presentation and the applicant is
here in the audience as well if
you have any questions.
>> okay. Thank
you mary. Two
questions, you think
you can go back to the
conditions. One tree mitigation fees
are if they're not
waived the mitigation
--so the applicant is requesting waving
of the mitigation.
>> yes. >>
what's the reason for that?
>> I guess
you can ask
them.
>> did they express any concern
to staff.
>> no they just
said that they were asking for
waiver of the fees.
>> and then with
regards to administratively
approve the changes on landscaping,
if we were
to remove that. What would be required? They
would have to come through the
planning zoning commission again?
>>
yeah, we're just
asking because, with
the easement there, we may need to
kind
of jockey where the trees are located. Maybe
not
necessarily have them spaced accordingly. We may
have
to group them in other areas. It just
allows us some flexibility
so we don't have to come back to say
hey
this isn't working, now we
have to do this.
>> understood there. The
elevations, the proposed three
story building, how does the height
of that,
does it align
with the height of the current building?
>>
I think the
current building might be a little bit shorter
but
everything around there
is light industrial. And it
backs
up to like citigroup
vine.
>> --city grapevine. >> so there's nothing
that.
>> right, right. >>
the waving of the tree mitigation
that's not part of this for planning
and
zoning to approve. It's not part of
this application.
>> any fee
is not part of
your purview so that will go straight
to city council.
>>
so mary, if it's not part of our purview
why is it brought
up before
us.
>> it's
just part of the conditions.
>> okay. Any other
questions of staff? In
the cross-examination. Okay. Thank
you. Is the applicant
here? Mrs. Campbell to present the
case. Mr. Campbell.
>> yes
I'm craig yancy. 1201 creek view
drive for samaritan's first coppell. Good
to see some
familiar faces.
>> it's been a while. >>
yeah. It's been
about 15 I
think. I'm glad to answer any questions.
>>
okay. It's not within our purview but
why are
we requesting waving of the tree mitigation.
>>
sure we asked for them last time
as well. And it was denied. I think
it was a split vote. But samaritan
first
is a global ministry and if you, obviously
the intent
of the preordnance is for
a developer to
preserve trees wherever possible. And
to, supplement the parks department
to replace those trees
and where they
can be planted.
I
totally understand that. It would
be,
it is a global ministry and
it is a faith based organization. If
this was
a regular develop. We would not ask
to waive
it.
>> is samaritans purse were ever
to leave
this location, those trees would be
brought down
and another development came in and
if it were waived, then we would,
lose the trees. I guess, it's not within
my purview.
>> I don't mind telling
you. I think if
their 40 years of existence
they never sold real estate any where. And
you
know, the flip side as well
that it's owned by fellowship church. At
any time fellowship church could have
developed it for church
use and there would
not be any mitigation fees
because churches are
completely excluded. I'm sure you
would correct
me if I'm wrong.
>> this is just more
of
a curiosity question. So would putting
the new building
there and you're removing I think mary
said 71 parking spaces but you're adding
in 130
something. I don't remember the number. Why
the additional spaces?
>>
when we first looked at this,
this was all driven by needing a place
to put cloud support, it people. So
and we're totally out of office space
in the building. And so that wasn't
an option to keep building out space
in the building. They even discussed
doing two floors in the building and
I told them
you would have to be out of
here
for a year while we remodeled it
and it would be
cry --crazy money. We went
to --the last manhole for sanitary
sewer is
right at that bend creek view. So I
had
to run 200
feet
when we built the first building. The
private sewer
line was put so they
could develop on bethel road. Dbt
has been acquired by proledges. Prolodges
is very nice to us. They've
been a temporary landlord and we love
prolodges but we have
been unable to get permission from
them to use their
sanitary sewer line. I don't blame
them. If ever they would
ask me, I would say no. I don't want
a tenant
calling me with a problem
and I have this
other guy calling me about it. We're
given up on
that. And we're not
upset about it. But
this lot
is undeveloppable without sewer. The
most logical thing
to do is put parking there. We located
the building so
it would make all the existing driveways
align and so everything just worked
out. That's how I ended up with 35
feet between the truck
work fence and the wall of this building. Since
that becomes kind of an ugly space
looking at
the front court. That's how we
got down the road of
let's do some
really nice landscaping, a pergola and
try to make
it an amenity. So that's how
we got here.
>> why the
additional spaces.
>>
yeah, sure. During shoe box collection season,
sorry,
samaritan collects about 1,200 shoe boxes
with a gift for children. I
don't know if you're familiar with
that. Coppell does about 10% of those
it's
a great distribution center. Those volunteers
that come. Some
of them come by bus. Some come
car pooling. But in
some cases we do shuttle people from
a
remote parking lot
to shuttle
them in during volunteer season. It's
just
mayhem really from thanksgiving to
christmas. Then it's down
to, the 50 people on staff. Half of
them are disaster people and they're
gone. I mean you can walk in there and
those
25 people aren't even
in the building. So this lot will be
largely unused for most of the year. There
are three
occasions during the year when there's like
ministry training that happens,
that will happen at this new building. And
so,
part of this goal too is to not have
to go rent hotel space. This could
be done here on-site. Then every morning, every employee
is
required to go to devotion between
8:00
and 8:30. So there's a quick
prayer study. Then a missionary reports
from something overseas and they watch
a
video. So that goes on every morning at
the building. That's another
reason they wanted the building here. They
like all our people together so everyone
has a sense of community there. So
that the folks that work
in the building now they're going to
walk every morning at 8:00 a.m., come
to this new building and be on the
first floor. Do
the
half hour devotion
and then go back to work.
>> okay. I
missed
it.
>> sure, they're going to stay at this
building.
>> the
it people will work in this
building. The people that I've got working
here now there's about 40 people I
guess on staff in the building now. Every
morning they're
going to walk to
the new building. 100 yards, whatever
it is
for devotion.
>> any other questions
of the applicant? Okay, we may
call you back for follow up questions. Is
there anybody that
would like to speak
for or against the proposed application? Okay. Seeing
none
I will
close the public
hearing. Any discussion by the commission? Samit.
>>
if
this parking lot is going to be
predominantly unused do we need to
create that much concrete area for, is
there
any alternative surfacing that
won't
create so much
heat?
>> not by our current ordnances. >>
that is
a great question. No
surfaces that
would
allow for, permeation of water. Yeah. No,
okay. So I
have been to this site for several
years preparing boxes. And I
know exactly what you're talking about
parking. And it, but
because it's a great effort, and I'm surprised
that, we couldn't park in
this building across the street because
they
may tow us for a volunteer event. But
any way, yeah. So I
get it. It's a great operation. And
I'm not
going to speak about the tree mitigation
but I just
don't feel --it's not within our
purview but we must come ply --comply
with all
of our ordnances. With
that is there a
motion by the commission? Nine
and 10.
yeah.
>> I move
to approve
items 1 and 10, consider approval. Samaritans
purse addition
lot 1r block
a
zoning change request
from pd26-li
planned development 2-6 planned industrial. And
light industrial
revised light industrial to add a parking
lot
for parking
and updates the existing site
plan for new, additional 37,699 square
foot three story professional
office building. Do I
need to
read the whole thing. No, okay. With
the conditions.
>> as
presented.
>> as presented. >> okay
we
have
a motion.
>> clarification,
and also in item 10.
>>
and also item
10, approval of the replat for
lot 1r and two. With conditions.
>>
so we have a
motion for items
9 and 10
with conditions as presented. By
commissioner patel
is
there second?
>> second. >>
by vice chair blankenship.
>>
commissioner dobmeier.
>> aye. >>
blankenship.
>> aye. >>
haas.
>> aye. >>
commissioner
patel.
>> aye. >> and commissioner
bishop.
>> aye. >>
all
approve.
>>> item 11,
consider approval of pd-250r26r2-h
old town addition
lot
4r block d
a zoning
change request from pd-250r26r-h planned development. To
allow for
a professional or medical
office
in addition to the
retail
already permitted on the property. At
the request of diana ahmad being represented by
bill
peck of william peck &
associates and
we
have a presentation
by matthew steer.
>> commissioners,
the initial zoning change for the
live work units was approved in august
2022. That was for
a two story mixed use building with
retail on the
first floor. And then we
would
allow for two
residential units on the second floor. Council
approved a plan
for a 775 square
foot ice cream shop,
on the first floor and then, 2,359
feet of speck
of restaurant uses on the
first floor. That
could also contain some retail. So
the cakery has occupied the 759
feet. So the site is approximately .25
acres in
size. Gross square foot gross floor area
is, 10,200 square
feet. That
includes
the two apartment
units on
the second floor. The existing
is the restaurant and this was 225
square feet of restaurant
or retail space. So what they're proposing
is to allow for this 2,300
square feet to
be
medical or professional office. In
addition to, restaurant
or retail use. We sent
out 19 notices within 200 feet. And
a 133 within 800 feet received
no
responses either in
favor or opposition. And
unfortunately, staff is recommending
denial. Of the requested addition
of professional
and medical offices to allowable uses
on the first
floor. So sites in the old
town main street project, that were intended
to be
retail, have been
converted over
the years to medical
and professional office uses. This
property
was conceptually planned for retail/restaurant uses
initially. And the current mixed use
plan development for this property was
intentionally allowed in this
instance with two apartments on the
second floor to maximize the
use of the property so that we
could have retail and restaurant uses
on the
first floor. And that
would generate activity in the area. And
by allowing
a medical office, or a professional office
even in this
2,300 square foot
area, that would take a
way from a potential
in this general area of old town. That
concludes
my presentation. I'll be happy to
answer
any questions and the
applicant is in the audience. I've
given a statement of
the reasoning behind her
request.
>> okay. Very good. Any questions
of staff? Sue.
>>
so matt, if this commission were to
approve this, are there
any
staff conditions that
would go along with that approval?
>>
no.
>>
thank you.
>> because you're simply adding
other
land uses.
>> correct, correct. We're
just adding this professional
medical office to the acceptable
use.
>> okay. As bob said all the
former would apply.
>>
I heard live-work in there. Is this truly
mixed
use.
>> this is truly mixed use. Did
I say live work.
>> I heard
live work in there some where.
>> oh,
I
apologize.
>> is
the applicant here to present the case.
>>
my name is diana ahmad. I'm the
property
owner at 67 main street.
I also reside
in coppel. I'm requesting to amend the allowed
usage for
750 square feet of my property. The
total size
is 10,250 square feet. I'm only referring to
less than
25% of the total square footage. This
space that I'm
referring to has been
vacant for over two years now. During
these two years and currently ongoing I
have marketed the space
for retail use. Spending thousands
on-sites such as lukenet and co star. I
have adjusting
the price, have worked with
brokers
but until now have
not been successful in securing a tenant. At
the time it's not a lack
of effort coming from my side it's
really that
the current allowed uses are
not matching the market demand. I
will continue my
efforts to obtain a retail restaurant user
but
I have had to
turn away numerous businesses that would
be classified
as professional offices or medical
from
insurance agencies, chiropractors,
law firms, wellness
clinics, and other low intensity tenants. I'm
use. I'm open
to conditions such as maintaining
the glass door front
design limiting
some of the medical uses. And ensuring
the space remains visually consistent
with retail. Filling the
vacant space will not only be
beneficial to achieving the city's
goals
of having an active vibrant downtown
area, it
will help support the current bakery, and
neighboring businesses. It will help
prevent long term vacancy and
reduce financial burden and align with
all of our goals for old
town. Thank you
and I appreciate your time and consideration.
>>
thank you
very much. Out of curiosity you mentioned that
you have
been courting other retail or restaurants. What
was their
reason
for not signing on the dotted line?
>>
yes, so, there's a few reasons. For
one, for example franchises
I reached out to so many of them
and their main concern is there's
not enough car traffic that goes through old
town
coppell. When
they say what is
the average per hour,
to the two closest cross streets. They
have an app
that will tell them. Even if I tell
them we're crazy busy on
saturday. I tell them there's a lot
of opportunity because there's not
too many options in the evening in
that
area or on the weekends. So that they
can bring the life to the area. It's
kind of in the center of old town. It
can be a
family hang out. You know all these
things. So you know for
a
bigger franchises, it's not busy enough.
and actually
I everyone asked starbucks. I told
them,
you have the location at
tom thumb that doesn't count. There's
been a couple of
first generation restaurants. So there's
been a couple of people that
have come and said okay I'm
ready to sign the lease. And as you
know, a responsible, you know property owner,
when I start
talking to them. You need to
start thinking of your design. And
you know, all
these different things. When they
start to actually go into the process,
they have a concept, they're excited. You
know the area
looks like it would match
their concept but when they start to
go saying I need
to pay for drawings. I need to get
permits. I need to
have license, people doing the work. You
know things like
that, they sometimes will shy away, you
know. But I
would say, you know and I live in
coppell. I
would love for there to be a really
nice retail and restaurant place. I
have friends that
live right across the street. If I
go to a nice restaurant I will
ask for the owner. I will
say hey why don't you come here. I've
given so
many tours to restaurant groups. And
then even one guy he's like, well,
I'll put a
crumble cookie there, I said we have
a bakery next door. Give
me something else to
work with. I really am trying and
I'm still trying
for that. I think because there are professional
offices
and kind of medical already in old town,
that's
what's driving those businesses to
approach me. Because they
see that it's already in the area. I
think that's maybe why I'm you know
getting
more approached on that side than on retail
or
restaurant. And unfortunately I would
say majority of the retail
that have come are businesses that I don't
feel are right for old town coppell. You
know from even I think I've mentioned
a
previous, there's been cbd shops. There's
been
a lady,
she actually makes it's
bakery out of medical phaeurpb. --
marijuana. She works with kids. There's
been two tattoo artists. One massage
parlor. Some of these businesses
that just want to find a place
any where that could be in
a town. Even they'll market
as high end. Even the cbd shop
that has vapes at 200, $300. And
I said there's high
school kids I don't need
them to hang out just doing cbd. They
said,
no, these are for the adults. I have
a cigar shop that wanted
to be in the building. We have residents
upstairs. Some of these things are
kind of the barrier. But
still, I am still working with a couple of
restaurants and
retail and trying to see if
they can come. Most of the brokers
that
do specialize in retail and restaurant,
they'll tell
me if they're going
to come to coppell they would rather
be on denton because of that traffic. In
old town, people
who aren't familiar with old town. They
don't even
know it's there, in a way. Unless
you're from coppell
in a way. I don't know if maybe there should
be more marketing
for the farmers market outside of coppell. Because
I don't know anybody that lives outside
of coppell that
really knows about it. On my side, I'm
really trying. I don't
know what to do. When we first had
the building zoned for retail and
then I thought, we
originally had it zoned I thought
it was already zoned for
restaurant. And so I had signed
a lease with an ice cream shop. Then
they came to
the city and the city said no and
said it's actually only retail. That
was
at the end of october. I
signed that lease. I paid
the commission. They spent tons of
money on the design and
so forth. But they didn't
have everything they needed design for
like november. December you
guys, there was not a
meeting for the
holiday. I had signed in october. And
via the agreement, by the end of january, they
were everything was supposed to be set
up for them to
break ground. Like you know do their construction. And
because we didn't get that january
meeting, we didn't get the full
approval. We had to postpone it
all the way to march because there
was a variance
of where's the dumpster going to be
for
the restaurant. That delayed it another
two months. So
I had to cancel because I was you
know
kind of, outside of you know the scope
of the lease. So I lost thousands
just for that
tenant. And then, they
ended up opening a beautiful location in
burleson. I stayed in
touch. I said open your
second location. You know. But it's
now
too far. They're doing well and coppell is
really far. So
I'm just giving
examples
of things that have happened, right. You
know, on there. But yeah.
>> so you've
had several almost
signed and in the
end it became
a hardship working through the process.
>>
yes.
>> interesting. >> for that
one example. But not in
general, I mean. In general the city
is always helpful and
cooperative. I'm not complaining or anything
like that. But I'm just
pointing
out
kind of some
of the things that happened.
>> okay
so, for potentially opening to include professional
or
medical offices, you
say you're going to restrict high traffic,
high intensity medical use such as urgent
facilities. What
other types of uses would you restrict?
>>
I mean
if there was something you
felt didn't align with coppell. You
know
with old town,
you know I wouldn't have a problem. If
there
was opposition for medical, is it
because there's certain medical
practices you don't like what they
do or what entails. I didn't know
if there was something specific
that you don't like about professional offices
or medical that
you would be concerned
about. But that's why I
said I wouldn't mind like having conditions. Still
make
it look like retail. Friendly for
people to
pass by and so forth. Even having
these allowed uses doesn't mean I'm
not going
to have a restaurant or retail. I
mean
we do have a grease trap
in place and so forth. But you know, and
actually like
to address like saying you want
to have more
abg activity in
the evenings and weekends. There have
been
a few breakfast places that have come. Even if
they were there. They
wouldn't
increase the traffic in the evening. But
keeping it,
it's
not
fair for our neighbors that are professional
restaurant and retail. Even for
our baker, they would like to have
someone next
door to bake for.
>> so being an
owner there, you're
familiar with what works. What doesn't
work. And there was
a restaurant behind the twisted root.
I don't know
if that ever took off or whatever. But
you've seen
things come and go. So
you're looking for a little flexibility. And
if there
was an office or medical office,
you're still trying to recruit a retail
or restaurant.
>> yes. >>
what kind of leases would you be
signing. A year lease or something. So
that you're
still bringing in the opportunity
for a restaurant or retail?
>> so
the nice part is
with office space and so forth. It's
easily, you can easily convert office
space into retail or
restaurant. If they wanted to do a
short term
lease. There's no problem with that. You
know
because it can easily be converted
exactly if a
good restaurant comes or something. But
if I'm
signing for a restaurant. Obviously
we're going to look for
five, 10 yearlong term leases would
be favorable. Because you're
going to be, it's new construction. So the
walls, the
bathroom, the kitchen, it's going
to be stuff if there's
a restaurant. And that's also one thing
too. You want a restaurant
that's going to do well. Because they're
going to
be spending a lot. The building will
be
altered so you want something that's going
to make sense for the building
and for the area. But I'm very flexible. I
mean,
if any of you guys have a side business
as
a restaurant you want to come. We'll
take care of
you. It's a great location.
>> maybe
an ice cream shop. But
I might be
nervous taking it through the
process.
>> no. No. Okay. Thank you for
your presentation. Are
there any
questions of
the applicant? Okay. Kent.
>>
is the, does the artsy cakery. Does
that
generate foot traffic or is it
just uber eats.
>> they're
not a bakery. They custom cakes. But
they do have cup cakes. Everything
she makes is delicious. A little bit
of
traffic comes and so forth. But unfortunately,
it's not that they're
going to be there too long or something.
>>
how long have they
been there at that facility?
>> it's
almost
going to
be, since
they started construction almost two years.
>>
can I comment on that.
>>
yeah.
>> yeah. Sure. >> I love that
place. Artsy cakery
when we walk our dog through old town,
we'll stop there
and get a couple of cookies and eat them
outside. They
have
a couple of outside tables. I
just think their food is really
good.
>> okay. >> and actually the
owner
for artsy
cakery
she had mentioned some cup cake shortening. It's
always great. Any
business that will be
in my building. I will help promote
it. Any food, restaurant. Any sort
of business. My daughter is
in high school, she's in varsity tennis. Any
time there's
an event and they
say we need
desserts I do say use artsy cakery. They
do
have some areas that they use. But
I tell that to businesses all
the time. You know,
that I will be pushing it. And I'm
on three tennis teams in coppell. So
all the ladies
on my team and
so forth. They've all bought from
artsy cakery. If there's
a restaurant there. They will all
support
it. They will be
there. That's the nice thing about coppell. We
like to have
the services and food in town. That's
the sad part of not finding
the right restaurant yet, you know.
>>
I have questions.
>>
sure.
>> besides the bakery and then there's
the residential
on top and two different units. Are those
both leased.
>> yes
the two apartments are both leased
for two
years and the bakery.
>>
75% of the building is already leased.
>>
yes. And those apartments both of them
leased out
within five days of being listed with
an agent.
>>
so you won't have any problem leasing
those out.
>> yeah, yeah. There's
a few people that have told me that
the
leases end, they
would love to go. They're
really
beautiful. Very
high end. Tall ceilings. There's a
vacancy if you're interested
let me know.
>> this is a public hearing
is there
anyone who would like to speak for
or against the proposed application? Okay. I'm
not going
to close
the public hearing just yet. As authorized
by
section 551.071 of the texas
local government code, I'm requesting
that we recess into executive
session. I have some questions
of our city attorney to
address. So, the time is, 8:35. And
we'll try to make it quick.
>>> the time
is 8:54 and we are now back
into general session. I left the
public hearing open on purpose. Is
there anybody who would like to
speak from the
public for or against the proposed application? Okay,
I
will close the
public hearing. Does the commission
request the applicant for any
final questions? Okay. Is there any
discussion
by the commission? Is there a
motion by the
commission? Okay.
>>
I motion denial of
the requested addition of the professional
medical offices to
be
allowable uses on the first floor. Not
subject to staff.
>>
that's correct. So we have
a motion to deny the
proposed application. Commissioner
blankenship is there a second.
>>
I
will second.
>>
we have a second by commissioner
patel.
>> commissioner dobmeier. >>
aye.
>> blankenship. >> aye. >>
commissioner haas.
>> aye. >> you
can appeal,
it would require supermajority but
we do recommend that.
>>> item
12 this evening
is
a public hearing to consider approval
of
pd-214r10-c. The
shops
at sandy lake. Zoning change request from pd-214r2
--
c to r10
--
c to allow for the detailed
planned development for 14,418 commercial
center and a
patio area on 2.03 acres of property located
at the
south side of sandy lake road. Approximately
560 feet
west of denton
tap
road
at the
request of pete coppell. Being represented by
d.r. Rankin
pllc.
>>
can we include the replat
of that.
>> commissioner hafmann
beat you to that. To consider approval
of
the shops at sandy lake addition lot one
block a
replat. The shops at sandy
lake. A replat to revise
the current plat and associated
easements and fire lane configuration
on 2.03
acres of property located at the south
side of sandy lake road approximately
56 to feet
west
of
denton tap road at
the request of
peak coppell llc being represented
by spooner and associates.
>> this
property was
part of a larger development that included
the development of arbor manors and
tap and sandy lake
road. The additional zoning was approved
in 2007, with subsequent
rezonings
occurring with each detailed
site plan for the commercial
sites. This represents the final commercial
piece to
be developed. So what we're
looking at on the left
is the
original pd. Concept versus the current
proposal on
the right. So the original pd shows
two buildings out front adjacent to
sandy lake with
parking at the rear of the
property. The current proposal has
one building with a parking
with one building toward the
rear of the property
and parking with
the majority out front. The original
pd shows,
a driveway entrance on the west end
side. The
new proposal will also have a driveway
on
the west side but this will
be
in contingent with the
verizon property. So they'll share
one
driveway. The original proposal showed
a driveway entrance off
of on the
east side that goes
into the hoa property for arbor manors. This
current
proposal does not share any type of
driveway with
the arbor manors and has there's no access
to that drive or street
approach. It will have a
separate entrance
off of sandy
lake. So there we
go. So the site is
currently vacant. And the site plan
shows
14,480 square foot proposed building will
contain a mix
of uses including retail, restaurant
and medical. An outdoor patio is
proposed on the western
side of the building. There's a
pd condition to allow the 500 square
foot patio area without additional parking
requirements. This
has been approved in other developments. Any
square footage over 500 square
feet will require additional
parking. There will be a driveway entrance
from
sandy lake road and a secondary
shared access point from
the neighboring verizon
building to
the west. There are two trash receptacles
situated away from the residences. So
during the initial proposal they actually
had the trash cans on
the rear of the property and we asked
them
to move it away from the residential. There's
an
existing 6-foot masonry screening
wall between this and the residential
property to
the south. So here, we're
looking at the building elevations. It's
just around 19 feet
with a wall at the front
varying in height from
20 to 25 feet. Creating some
articulation. The trash enclosures
will match the building material
as well. Building
will be a combination of
brick, aluminum store front. As
I mentioned in terms
of restaurant there is no drive-thru
proposed. And they
do have a monument signed proposed
along
sandy lake road. Which
will share the
same building materials as the building
itself. So
there's no signage presented for the
buildings. Any proposed signage will
need to comply with city requirements. Here
we're looking at the landscaping. There'll
be a 20-foot landscaping
strip along sandy lake road and 15
to 20
feet along the southern perimeter. The
eastern
perimeter will see a large number
of trees being preserved. Additional
trees along the southern
perimeter wall will also be preserved. In
total
39 existing trees will be
saved on-site. An
additional 30
trees will be planted on-site. And
we also ask
them to, create some more buffer screening
where we have
the parking at
the rear of
the site. So 36
will be planted to provide
additional screening along the perimeter. Now
this
is a zone change request. We
did mail out notices. 26 within
200 feet. Additional 120 courtesy notices
within 800
feet. We did receive 10
notices within
the 200 feet
in opposition. Additional five within
the 800 feet. As
a, general
summary. I did hand you guys
a table of their concerns. But
basically it was increased traffic. Loss
of the green
space, decrease in
the quality of life. And noise
were the primary concerns. So staff is
recommending approval of
pd-214r10-c. Detailed engineering
review will
occur at the
time of if you feel engineering submittal. To
allow 500 square feet patio area
per lot within
the existing
parking count. Additional pad
owe
space will require parking
at 11:00 square feet. The downstream
drainage analysis will need to be updated to
address. I'm
going to
go through the plat. The plat is a
companion item to plat 1a. The
case that I just went over. The plat
will
take the existing lot, replat
it to include the mutual access. Fire
lanes and necessary utility
easements for
the development of the
14,480 square foot commercial. Staff
is recommending approval of the shops at
sandy
lake addition lot 1 block
a replat. Subject to the
following conditions. That is the
end of my application. The applicant is
here
as well if you have any questions.
>>
thank you mary. A couple of quick
questions. So, the site
originally came through. When was
that?
>> I believe some where around 2007. >>
it's about the
time when I first
came on. A few days ago. And was
the, was that all part of the
entire arbor manors development. It's
just that the residential went
first or was this carved out?
>> so
when we look
at, at this drawing up
here. Can you
see
my arrow. My curser.
>>
yeah.
>> everything that's
outlined here, to here down
here. Around here. And this, and I
think yes some down here. This
is all part of the initial
development.
>> okay. >> so,
this was like
I think a1, they had different letters. You
zoom in and you can actually
see it. So essentially it was always proposed
that there would
be some commercial here, here, and here. And
this is retail. It's just a different
color. Although these pieces
were not part of that
original development. But, you know,
what's standard or typical
along a thoroughfare like this is commercial
development that acts
as a buffer.
>> okay. >> so when this
came in, it was part, this
was part of it as well. And this,
and this. And
this is just the
last piece to get developed.
>> okay. Thank
you. So
just, you confirmed for
me that this is already entitled from
the initial application.
>>
so this was the original concept
plan. They're just comeing
in with detailed plan.
>> okay. With
regards
to parking can you remind me. Is parking
equal to
what's needed on-site or they're not overparked
in any way are they?
>> so
according to what they're proposing,
they have the
amount of parking they need.
>> the
required amount.
>> yes. >>
they're not providing more?
>> no,
they might have one extra parking
maybe a couple.
>>
okay.
>> any other
questions of staff by the commission? John.
>>
yes, so,
we're not, we're just changing the
site plan here not the permanent
use.
>> so there is, the restaurant portion
of it. Does require a pd or a
special use permit because
it's a pd, it's you know,
it's just additional use. But
the, other commercial components are
allowed by right.
>> and the current
plan square footage versus the
plan the revised do you know what
that was?
>> I'm
not sure if there was an exact number
for the --
>> so they're going from
two buildings.
>>
right.
>> two buildings at street side
to
one building offset from street side.
>>
right. So
the main thing is
going from two buildings to
one. Basically flipping the site, so
that the
parking you know and traffic
would be along sandy lake versus
driving along the residential to the rear. And
the current plan
it appears contains some sort of an
excess easement?
>> correct. >> on
the east side.
>> so
there's a verizon building over here. So
they would come
in. Instead of having a
driveway here and one here, they're just
sharing one
driveway here.
>> so there's no longer
an easement
requirement on the east
side.
>> so this is the west side. >>
no I'm
talking about the east side. In the
current plan it
seems there's
an easement to
the east going down to arbor manor.
>> there
is
no proposal to go this way. There's
no easement there.
>> I'm
just saying that's --
>> the original. >>
the prior plan
was that, they've taken that away.
>> right. >> okay, okay thank you. >>
so that
way they don't have, they don't
have people driving through
the neighborhood either.
>> sure,
yeah.
>>
and there's no, with this configuration
there's no drive-thru like they won't have
a drive-thru restaurant.
>>
yeah, okay. Very good. Any other
questions of staff by the
commission. Okay,
is the applicant here
to present the case.
>>
hello
everyone. Thanks for having us tonight.
I'm tyler abbey. We build retail centers
like this all across
texas. It's pretty common for us because
of the
way communities are built in texas
now where there's
residential communities and they have
a commercial component along. So we
have experience
with these things and one of the things
we typically
tend to do is once we find a site,
let's see, we're trying to you know align
a bunch
of different interests within our
tenants and we
want to make sure they can survive. And
near
by residents we're trying to align
all
these different interests. So when
we got this site, our first, what
we were trying to do is
we want to make sure our product is successful
but we wanted
to minimize as much as we
can the impact on the residents. Moving
the building away
in our experience is just the cars
is what actually cause a lot of the
disruption. And if
you have in the front of the building
when
you open the front door
you have the noise coming from there. So
by flipping the building
we have the cars and noise blocked
as much as
we can. The trees are above code. They're
not
required by code but we thought they
were
a nice addition as a buffer for the residential homes. The
access easement going to the west
I think is a nice improvement. For
the original plan, in that it gets
I think
most people will travel that way to
the median and they will come in through the
median I think that will keep people. I
think that
will be the more commonly used
opening. And, yeah, ultimately this
is, I think maybe the
biggest thing is we specifically
chose not to use
a drive-thru. We don't
do drive-thrus when there's residential neighborhoods
like this. Honestly
never again. That's what we find cause
the most disruption. These
are never going to be perfect solutions
for everyone. Back
in 2007 when this was zoned, you know
was chosen to be a commercial site, you know,
it made
a lot of sense. I think it makes all the sense now
given the traffic on sandy lake. This
is
a commercial area. But we do understand that there's
residential near by and there's things
we need to do. So we're
going to do our best to accommodate
their concerns as much as we
can. Some of that is in the design. Some
of that
is in the field we'll have the, you
know those emergency lights
in the back of the building we'll
have the, the city or
the fire department come out and we'll say. What
is
the lowest we can put these and still
meet code. So we can be
cognizant of light, cognizant of sound. We
took the
city's advice on the dumpsters and
we moved those away as
far as possible. And
so, happy to take any questions on
this. There's not perfect solutions when
it comes to these but
we tried
our best. And we'll be sure to
have our the residents near by
when we're able to start construction. They
will have my contact information and they'll
be able to
reach out to me if they have
any concerns. That's all we have.
>>
thank you
for that. I see the
reversal of the site to limit the
noise. The
cross easement I think is huge. Kudos
for being able to
help navigate that to secure
that. Were there any specimen trees lost
on this?
>> so
there were, I don't
know if dawn knows this
more specifically. Dawn is our civil
engineer that helped designed this.
>>
I know you're replacing
and I know it's heavily wooded and I
know it's going to create some comment. But
we recognize that this has been approved
and entitled we're basically modifying
the site
to make it better.
>>
that's our view as well. And we, you know,
partly because
don has spent so much time in the
woods over
there tracking the trees. We try
to find any way we could to save trees
because of the
evolution of the
site. Some things just couldn't make it. But
particularly on the
area is that border. The southeast corner
is a good example. Like, we tried
to
save as much as we could. Because
that's the entrance
to the neighborhood and yeah, so we
did the best we
can given the --
>> on the east side
of the site. There's the parking and
then there's the some of
the landscaping. Are there any other
treatments to try to help maybe
block some of the view, low walls
or anything like that?
>> the
good news is there's a sliver on
the east side that's not our property. That's
kind of between
the property and the road and there's trees
all within there that
aren't on our property. And
that we obviously
never touch. So there is, there's
some buffer
and yeah.
>> so that's what the original plan
called for you
guys to cut through that.
>> the original
plan, did
cut. When they had this in 2007, we reached
out to the board and association. We
always try to speak
to them as quickly as we can. They,
it seemed like it was important for
them that
the, that our traffic stays our traffic
and their traffic stays their
traffic. So we tried to accommodate. Once
we got that feed
back. Okay we didn't even, we asked but
it was denied so we just moved on, yeah. And
I
think this makes more sense too. That
way the residents don't ever
have to deal with our traffic. But
if they wanted to walk over to the
retail, we'll always
be open to if they wanted a little
path way there. We're happy
to do that. They didn't seem interested
at the
time but we're open to allowing that
if
we had like
a coffee shop that's a nice walkable
location.
>> speaking of, any tenants lined
up or potential
tenants.
>> potential tenant
is coffee shop that we would, like
I, in my ideal world which I can't force
anybody to lease. But in
my ideal world, the east side would
be
the coffee shop. Because I think it
makes sense for residents who wanted
to walk
over there if they wanted to. But
coffee
shop and sandwich shop
is what the restaurants look like. Currently. Those
are
subject to change. And then the, the
interior I expect to
be medical. You know other retail services. Maybe
like a, a
pilates studio something like that
reach out. So things
like that. But this is a, this
is new construction. So it's higher rent. So
it
tends to be higher end tenants. That's
all who can afford to --
>> what
kind of fencing do you have
on the south side of the site?
>>
there's already a fence. There's that,
I know
you described in your presentation. The
masonry
wall. And it was actually like a 2-foot
concrete
foundation piece underneath it. I think
it's six feet but ends up
being 8 feet because
of that. So we'll be a little lower than
the residents. That helps
when you think about the door and
emergency light on top of that. I
think
that will help with the screening. We
put those trees,
the trees that we put those trees
in the back
that weren't required by code in the
hopes
of helping to screen an vet that as
much as
possible.
>> and the height of
your building, sir?
>> in the
front it's like 18 feet slit down
some. There's some really tall retail
buildings now
that you see. Ours is
I think, I
would say --
>> it's 19. Then
goes from, 20 to 25. That's on the
front.
>> on
the
front.
>> then it slopes down toward the
back.
>> and I
think there was mention in the report
about lighting
cut off. Lighting will be cut off
to prevent.
>> yeah, so we will be. For
us that's, I
mean we don't want to get called for
that right. So we
will be, if we do shield, we
do shields. We have to follow the
fire department's
rules and things like that. So we'll basically
work with them to
figure out what is. But right
now we
have a photo me
-- metric plan. And the photometric
plan is the ruleless. We'll also
find
that in the field so we
can get it as -- as possible.
>>
in regards to hours of operation. What
are the anticipated hours of operation.
>>
I would expect the busiest time to
be during the day. Because
I think there's, we're limited on,
we have
very little restaurant use here. This
is primarily going to be, like, I
would
be shocked if we don't have a dentist
in here. I would be shocked
if we don't have a couple of medical uses in
here. So
I think those will just be 9:00
to 5:00. Then you'll have some uses that
go till like 7:00. But we don't have
the tenants yet so we don't know. But
we'll be, say coppell has their
own rules right on hours of
operation. So we'll be you
know, we're trying, we'll try to balance between
like making
sure tenants have enough parking throughout
the day. So there's not one time
when everybody is there and now the parking
is
overly congested. We'll try to have
uses that kind of spread out a little bit
so we
can keep the traffic spread
out as much as possible. But given
this area I would expect that the
day will
be most busy because that's when all
the tenants will
be open. At night and in the morning there
might be
one or two open. Like
a dentist closes at 5:00, right so.
>>
thank you
for considering about the over lap
and
parking and trying to
maximize that. But you've met
the requirement. That the coppell
requirement for
parking. So. And
you've, I guess a question for staff,
are they, the applicant mentioned
9:00 to 5:00 maybe
some of the retail use
to 7:00. There's other restrictions
on how late operations could go?
>>
we
haven't placed any. We
don't know what the tenants is. Tenants
will be. That's something, if you
want to
consider that.
>> yeah, I would expect
like thinking about the
sandwich shop that's probably the
one that goes the latest. And I'm
trying to think of like, I think there's
a jersey mikes over there. That's
open till like 9:00. 9:00 10:00. I
don't know exactly
when those are open to. But that is,
I
think that's probably where we, where
most of these tenants cut
off. But we
don't have a line up
of tenants yet.
>>
I'm sorry,
I'm having a side bar
here. Okay. So no operations late
in the morning, midnight, beyond 6:00
a.m. 7:00 a.m.
>>
we don't expect that, no.
>> okay
any other
questions?
>> coffee shop might be,
if there's a sit down coffee shop. They
may open early. But
I'm hoping that would be welcomed
by the community.
>>
there's no
drive-thru. So.
>> exactly. Yeah. Just
for the sit down folks.
>> I
appreciate your attempts at trying
to preserve as many trees as
you can. But I think you kind of answered
the question,
I just want to make sure. You've done
the general grading to sort
of make sure that
what you're
thinking you're going to preserve
will be preserved based on
the over all grading plan of the property.
>>
our
plan is set on the trees. We, and
that was, we tagged them
all and we know exactly what we're
doing. We try
to plan around
as best we can. But the site plan
if approved is,
is this is what we'll be following
and the tree plan we have won't be
changing.
>>
so the one concern I have from
a site plan standpoint
is your direct entry on to sandy lake,
I just feel
like it's close. Really close to
your, to the arbor meadows drive. And
I can see people driving across to
go to
the immediate turn lane. Have you
considered moving that a little bit
further to the
west to a
maintain a little bit of separation. More
separation. But also, you know, knowing that
people are going to cut across just
make it,
give a little more run up to that curve
cup. To
be able to make a u turn or turn
into the parking lot across the street.
>>
I think there were fire department reasons
for it having to be there.
>>
it
has to be
there.
>> but that's my understanding. I'm
open to, discussing that with
the planning team. But
that was, that was my understanding.
>>
I appreciate the
attempt to go over to the west because that
shared drive does have a left
turn curve
cut. So that will significantly help
once people discover it.
>> yeah,
I think it, yeah, I agree. I
think that is a, that was
a, you know and we, and in doing so
with the, what we're doing for them
is
putting gates up on the road. So making
sure that people who go to our
center don't go to their
parking lot. So we had, so we
worked
it out with them and they're
very good neighbors.
>> sue. >> just
a quick question for you. So
the green space on
the western portion surrounded
by parking lot. What is the purpose
of, that particular space.
>> so when
I first did that, I was hoping that
we could
put like a picnic table or something like
that there. Just
to have some additional seating. Truthfully,
that's where probably
like the transformer is going to go. But
we'll put it as
close to the dumpster as
possible so they're kind of together. But
there
will probably
need to be an electrical transformer on-site.
>>
but
there's no future -- snow cone or
--
>> no
this is all building you're going
to
get. We're at full capacity. I thought
you meant that little
green island. That little green island
in the middle
that's where the transformer will
go.
>> there's an easement there.
>> yeah,
the drainage easements. So drainage
from the residential
neighborhood goes there and it'll
come underneath our grading.
>> thank
you.
>>
I have one more question.
>> fire
away.
>>
so to
the south of the building, between
the
wall, the fence
and the building itself
you've got some, landscaped areas
there. I
presume that, each suite will have
access from
the rear. Is that correct.
>> yeah
they'll have to. For code reasons.
>>
what kind of activity do you
envision
going on in the back of the building?
>>
I think, given where, given like
the location of everything. I don't
imagine, I don't imagine
much. I think but for fire
purposes, we have to have it. So I
understand your question. We'll
have a small sidewalk there at
the back. But, I think, I would
expect like you can't, give, given the way
the side is. All the deliveries are
going to be in the front, right. They
just functionally have to be right. Given
where the dumpsters are, I
don't think anyone, I think going
out the front
actually makes more
sense for most of these
tenants. But there's not going to
be any like customer access there. There
might be some employee access there. All
the parking is on the side. Most employees
will
come to the front.
>> will there be
roll
up doors in the back.
>> roll up doors? >>
yeah.
>>
no.
>> to facilitation trash or something
of
that nature.
>> no, no, no. It'll
just be a normal
back door with a push bar on it for fire
purposes. But no roll up doors.
>>
so there's
no traffic access behind the
building either.
>> no. Like from a
vehicle perspective? Oh
yeah, that was the intention. Is that
we
were trying, the building
is meant to block the cars. So again,
it's not
a perfect solution for the residents
of the neighborhood
but this is what we have found to
be
the, at a minimum I think this is much better
than
the original plan that was already approved. So,
you know, we're
coming here in the hopes of
improving what was already approved
is our view on the
situation.
>> I would conquer
that this is better than originally planned. I
would definitely --
and you're really. This is
a retail, maybe some professional
services. Which
is almost, it's not quite right in
right out
but you have maybe some potential u
turn
traffic up there by the verizon
or the median to the west. But
you some
what limited with access. So
I mean,
yeah. Hopefully it'll be
successful. So. Okay. Any other questions
of the applicant? Samit.
>> just,
I just noticed. It's
saying 36 on the
southern border but I'm assuming those are
not shown in this graphic.
>> I feel
when you press the button it
was like they were not shown then
--
>>
there they
are. All right. All right.
>> this
is very schematic.
>> I get it. It's
just
the way I look at it. Can
we beef up along the backside? I mean,
I know it's behind the buildings. But
again to help buffer and screen
and the lighting and the whatever.
>>
we're open
to spreading them out. And they'll
all grow. I think in
our original plan we had them more
spread out. I don't remember.
>> there's
two groupings.
>> I think at
one point we had them spread out. And
it's
like, okay let's concentrate them to
parking. We're open to either.
>>
it's
blocking more of the parking right
now on
the backside of the building but they
might be appreciated
to block the backside of the building
as well.
>> I think just
the opposite. You want to shield the parking.
>>
that's what I'm
saying right now
they're grouped to block the parking
but, again to visibility for the backyards
to not see
the backside of the
building or the lighting that
required safe safety lighting back
there that is
required won't hurt.
>> to block the
security lights.
>>
light.
>> I think the
homes that are back there, most are
two stories.
>>
yes.
>> so they'll be looking down at
this property absent trees that mitigate
the view.
>> the ones behind
the building are
the ones that exist. Or, does that make
sense. There'll still be
some that remain there. At one
point we spread them out. And then,
I don't know if it was
based on feed back. Then we concentrated
them
to parking. We're open to how you,
how to best
lay them out back there. We can
be strategic about it.
>> I have one
more landscape related question, I'm
sorry. On
the front trees
are required every 50
feet. And I know you're
preserving trees in the, eastern edge. The
northeast corner
but,
that leaves the entirety of the sandy
lake
frontage untreed. You know, again
there's supposed to be one
every 50
feet. Is there
an easement or something
that's preventing? Or
are we counting the parking island
trees as
trees.
>> my understanding is we've designed
this to code on other than
the additional ones that on
the back. That's obviously well above code. But
I'm sure that
can be verified.
>> we'll take another
look at it and see
if we need to add any
trees.
>> okay. >> one last question. >>
sure.
>>
the roofing
material on the backside of this
building, so the building has the
roofs then it comes down
like this and comes down. So you have your
--in front. Is that
going to be like one of those
white covered types of --
>> yeah
it'll be a tpo
roof.
>> which is white generally. >>
right. Yes.
>> again being two storied. Is
it kind of pushing for some mitigation for
the glare
and whatever that might come off of
that roof.
>> yeah I don't know
if tpo is known for that. But I understand
what you're saying
because it's white. I'm happy to consider. I
don't have a
solution off the top of my head for
that.
>>
are there other
colors beside white. Is there a
tan color.
>>
no, white
is, yeah. It's like an
energy preservation. Yeah. But yeah. No
it's a fair question. I
don't have a solution to that. But
understood. Appreciate
the feed back.
>> thank you very much
for answering the
questions there. We may bring you
back at the end.
>> I
figured, yeah. Thank you.
>> so this
is a public hearing. We
have several folks
that are signed up
to
speak. I'll call in
order, we'll go with
vishi
subramanyan. Followed by shanti subramanyan. Then
followed
by uma alagapan.
>> yeah, hi. Thank
you. Thank you folks for taking listening
to us.
>> name
and address for
the record.
>>
my name is vishi subramanyan. I
live at
126 wild plum. Our property
is exactly behind the building
that is being proposed currently.
so, if you look at
this place has a lot of, a
lot of, its very wooded currently. And
when
we bought this house, we bought it
in
what 2015, 2016 time frame. We were
told by
our realtor, which I obviously I'm
hearing that it
is, it was not true. But
we bought it primarily because we
had a, green zone and we
were told it's a green zone. That's why
we bought it.
>>
there was not going to be building
on it.
>> so, any
way. So that's
what it is. That's fine. Primarily
our main concern is there's going
to be a lot of noise. There's going
to be smell, especially
we didn't know there was a restaurant
that's going to come in. That's being
proposed currently. So
we really don't like that idea of
a
restaurant coming in behind our property. So
we object
to it. Second thing, the other
idea is the traffic on sandy
lake. Currently, coming out of arbor manors
and
making a left, going to the
airport is really hard. If you come
around 4:00 on sandy
lake the traffic
is just, horrendous. Especially you're
very
close to, close to denton tap. So
that traffic, sandy
lake traffic, people coming out of sprouts
making
a left
on to sandy lake. A --there is no
traffic light there.
>>
there's a lot of conflict points.
>>
it's just a matter
of time before somebody hits someone. The
city also made another change
recently
in the last couple of years. They
allowed sorry,
I'm not used to
these things. But any way, they allowed, they stopped
prevented
a u turn
from taking place there. Right. Outside
sandy
lake. Right outside sprouts, so
what happens is people come into the
neighborhood. And they're
speeding. They just make a
u turn at the end of the cul-de-sac
and make a right
or left. There's no traffic light there. It
is just hard
for us to
even come out. It's not normal.
>>
and
despite the u turn signs, maybe I
--but despite the u turn sign, people
keep making
u turns. I try to make
a right turn and I think, okay, somebody with the
indicator
they're turning left. And I'm safe
to go. And before I
know it, they're u turning
and I'm trying
to turn and we're in conflict. It
happens all the time. So that's
one request. But the traffic is
one thing. Go ahead, you finish.
>>
the other thing
is we sit in the backyard, we
are able to enjoy. Once this building
comes up, we are done. The other thing that is annoying
is also he says, it's okay. I
think they can hear me. I
think I'm
loud enough. If you
folks aren't able to hear me. So,
the other
thing is, we
sit in the backyard and we
enjoy the
nature. And we're going
lose all that stuff now. I do not
know the legal thing but based on
my research, is it smart zoning? Is
that
even a valid statement anymore. Because
you're already commercialized it before
now. This
is just requesting a change in the zoning
allowing them to do
other things, I guess. But I'm
not a lawyer, but I do plan to
protest. Thank
you. I think I'm done with
my three minutes. I
think I'm done. Thank you.
>> shanti
has three minutes.
>> yeah. So the
main points I want to make is,
I realize now that our realtor gave
us false information. And there's
nothing we can do about that. It is
zoned commercial. I like the fact
that they are making
an effort
to move the traffic up to the
front. So given the situation;
main concern
is, if we have restaurants, that
they're restricted types of restaurant. We
don't want anything
that's deep frying, or smells
or rodents to be encourage encouraged because
it will come to the residential area
and
also it increases noise. So if the
restrictions could be placed that
we have
more quiet type of restaurants if you're
going
to have. Coffee shops are fine. But
not the kind where it's much more
noisy, dinner restaurants and things
that you
know, would go on till late at
night. And that
doesn't, is not consistent with
the residential life. The other thing
is, the wall is you know we're
asking that if it can be
increased in height
to give
more privacy, more protection from
the noise. The, you know, and lighting. Because
even as it is right now we go
upstairs, the sprouts lighting the
night lighting comes
straight up into the,
into our home at the back. So
those other requests that
I can make given the situation that
we have.
>> yeah and, one of
the
things that I would like to point
out is,
how can they
say that there is not going to
be people coming to the back? If I
have a restaurant, I'm not
going to allow people to come
through the front to deliver
stuff. The delivery has
to happen in the back.
>> no. >> it cannot. How
can they
do that?
>> that's not reflected in
the current plan.
>> the deliveries
are going to be from the
front. I'm not defending the application
but I'm saying the deliveries
are
going to be from the front. It's only
emergency
access, a door for the site. That's
all. We're not
going go back and forth. I
will let you finish your statement.
>>
okay. You already --
>>
and so again, we would
like to minimize noise, minimize rodents,
minimize smell and
be able to still enjoy our backyard
without having you know, still have
that privacy to
some extent and not have it feel like commercial.
>>
if
I could ask you one question, you
have a
fence in your back? Is it a 6-foot,
8-foot fence. Is
it an open fence, rot
iron.
>> no it's masonry, white color. >>
okay
so it's a solid wall.
>> solid wall. >>
but, again, just if that could be increased
in
height mainly for the light at night. That's
the concern. Because some of the parking,
I mean, and
I don't know if there's emergency
lighting, whatever
there is at
the light. If that comes into the yard it'll
impact
us.
>> okay, thank you very much. >>
thank you.
>> can
I ask one question
real quick. Mary can you bring
up the two plans. So the plan on the
left is already approved. The plan
on the right is what they're proposing. If
you
had a choice, which of those
two plans would you prefer?
>> the
new one.
>> okay. >>
the only thing that has changed that
wasn't
there that I thought was the restaurant addition
of restaurants. So
again if we could restrict the
types of restaurants. You know, many, I
mean if they're full
food restaurants that want to be open
until 10:00
at night but that's what I'm saying.
>>
understood.
>> yeah. >> thank you. >>
but you won't
have a problem with a coffee shop
for example.
>>
correct.
>>
different kind
of smell. Okay. Okay. Thank you.
>>
okay
mrs. Uma alagapan.
>>
yes.
>>
and
then to be
followed
by ramar. Okay.
>> my name is
uma alagapan. I live on wild
plum road. I'm a neighbor of shanti. I
agree with all
they've said. But I have this point. We
are already surrounded by so many
coffee
shops and sandwich shops in
every direction. Every kind of grocery
shop too. So,
we're like surrounded with so much
retail,
so many doctors, so many
gyms. So I would strongly ask the city
to
reconsider. To cutting down all these trees. Because
that's
the only thing we
don't have. Thank you.
>>
thank you. Okay
rama r then followed
by rama sani. Okay.
>> hi,
thank you for hearing me out. I'm rama,
I live in
129 wild plum drive. So the
traffic is a huge concern. This community has
over 730 homes, children
are going to schools. School buses
have to come
in and go out and that's a hazard as
is. When
she talked about the left turn on
sandy lake he was right on point. It
makes
it difficult to even drive to sprouts. We
live here
across the street, and we have to,
it's just easier to walk and get what you
want. And
this is not just peak hour. Peak
hour is a nightmare but even
the regular times. Even
at 10:00 in the morning. We
are the connection. Sandy lake is
the connection of
denton and carlton. People are
driving through
us and there's no highway or anything
yet. And businesses, traffic is
a concern. People are using
us as a shortcut. They do enter through
the sandy lake entrance and
exit out of our denton tap entrance. So
this is
already a thoroughfare for other traffic and now,
this will
just probably make our matters worse. City
would have to
do something to protect, the kids who
are walking
to school to wilson or high school. And
the buses the
school buses and the general population
to safely exit and enter the community. Not
just, you know this. It's
also trader joe on the other side. So
we kind of need something better on
both
streets. And that is my point. And
thank
you all.
>> so
just
to make sure you understand. There's,
there's
traffic observed traffic coming
in, arbor manors
off of sandy lake. Traversing through
the neighborhood and then
exiting brae wood denton tap.
>>s
that correct.
>> and
you've observed this.
>> yes. These
are people who are evading
that light. And they don't
have to wait in line forever. So we
are conveniently a way out
where you don't have to waste two
or three minutes or more where you
have to wait for
turns to just
hit the light. We're already a thoroughfare. You
know for all
those peak hours. And that's
why it takes a while even for the
buses to come in and
leave the community.
>> got you. Thank
you.
>> all right,
anything else?
>>
got
a question for
her? Anyone?
>> thanks
again.
>> rama sani. >> hi, I'm jea pria
ramasami. 180
plum. Thank you for hearing us out. I'm
also
in for the current proposal. I see
how they have accommodated
a lot of things. But one thing
if I wanted to ask is, can we
try to avoid restaurants even the
coffee shops and have
other retail options. Because of currently after andy's
opened, we are at
just right behind the building that is
proposed. With
andy open, I have to close out with
heavy
curtains even to avoid this light. This
business
which is proposing for retail I'm
okay because it's already, it's zoned
for
retail. So there's no argument about that. But
can we avoid restaurants, which will
be opening even
at 10:00 or in the weekends that's
the time we have coffee shops are
going to open early in the
morning. Though I like the coffee smell,
but you know.
>>
only so much, right.
>> I don't want
to do that. And I wanted to, add
--
>> may I ask, a clarifying question
please.
>>
sure.
>> so there are
ample trees separating you
from andy's, correct. Are you
refering to -- referring the light
tonight second floor.
>> yes. In the second
floor. And in between when
it's the fall season when the trees
are not full. At that
time, we also get on the
ground floor too.
>> thank you.
>> and I wanted
to add what commissioner patel was
saying about this entrance, that
was proposed in the new plan also. Just
like our neighbors were talking about
how that u
turn is avoided. And people trying
to come and trying to turn
back to sandy lake. That is going
to cause
a lot of commotion there too. Because
it's immediately they try to
go to the left most lane
to take the u turn. So do
please concern that
part which will cause accidents there,
definitely. And one of our neighborhood person
got into that
accident for a
u turn. So.
>> question to staff,
is
the, eastbound u
turn
legal at that left turn?
>> both ways
it's prevented.
>>
we'll bring down our traffic.
>> and
then, the trees that, because we're
just
going to be back behind
the building based on our location,
can
we ask for a higher thing which like what
they did on the
other side. Where it's mcdonalds and where
they build the high fence
so that it'll try to give us some
privacy in addition to the trees. So for
that,
especially those four houses I think
those will be the
main thing which is backing in
building. So if you can help, elevate and
add extra fencing
there to help us with some
privacy. That
will,
that's something that I wanted to
ask
for.
>> okay. >> but please do that entrance,
that's
definitely going to call for. If he
can move. But
he's told about
a fire or something. But if definitely
think about that
especially when our kids are driving
there. The high schoolers they
walk and they come into our community
and the next
community.
>> so we have kids shortcutting
through the neighborhood too. Walking
through the neighborhood too.
>> yes,
they
walk near the andy's and the next
signal they come around and that's how
they enter into our community and
to the
next community. That's how the
high schoolers they go on walking
by themselves or something.
>> okay
I do have
a follow up question for you. With
the conflict as on
the imagine to the right there's the
driveway. That's a little modified but it's
eliminating
the driveway off of arbor manor drive. To
reduce the number of conflict points
it would be better to go
to arbor
drive.
>> no, I
I have visitors that are coming always.
>>
okay.
>>
they just drive to plum. They don't
realize
they're inside a community. Especially
on our
road. They just speed in.
>> so
the new design separates that traffic. So
it's actually better.
>> yeah, it's
better but think of all the cars that
are trying to go to the left lane. That's all
I'm
trying to
point out.
>> got you. Thank you. >> you
must be.
>>
rahm.
>> yes. >> we're
a couple. So thanks for
your time. Listening to us. I'm just
going to
piggy back whatever
they talked about. I know this is
going to be a property already approved
for the business. But
I definitely would
like to oppose for any restaurants.
>>
say
that again.
>> restaurants. >> oh
yeah, restaurants.
>>
so definitely, you know. It's going
to be a problem. And
I believe they have a back, you know
on the side. Even though they
have a small door, but I'm
sure they have dumpsters on the side. I
know
I have seen some
other restaurants they keep the garbage
can outside. So I
don't know how we
can prevent that. Definitely keeping
the garbage outside. Sometimes
they keep
the garbage, back of the building near
to the door.
>> it
sounds like it's in
a better situation. We'll ask the
applicant. It
so --
sounds like it's in
a better location away from the residential.
but we'll ask them.
>> if you have
any restaurants and it's
going to impact the privacy and also
we
have seen, you know some flies and
bugs and that's
going to cause a problem. That's going
to and the other thing is
the property value is going to go
down. Definitely we
know because we had a green, you know
greener, so definitely it's going
to impact it and the property value
is going do go down. The other thing
is I
want
to raise a concern about the fence. Definitely
we need to
have some kind of solution so we can
have
some privacy. 6 feet is not going
to
be enough. Because there's definitely going
to be a lot of traffic.
>> okay. >>
thank you.
>> thank you very much. I
don't have
any other names signed up
but is there anyone else who
would like
to speak.
>> yes
>> my name is aten culcurney. I live
in
122 wild plum drive. The property
that's right behind this proposed
building. First I want
to thank you for allowing me to speak. I
came a little bit late and
I didn't get to
sign up for the speaking here. So,
I think my neighbors have spoken
about a few points so I won't
elaborate on those. What I would
like to talk about is slightly different. To
connect this with
our city's proposed master plan. You
know, I know that
the, property is this is zoned for commercial
use but having the right to build
doesn't necessarily mean they can build
the
way that it is planned because we would
like to see
being connected with the soul of the city's
master plan. See, I think you all
know this. Coppell our city
is more than 90% built out. So
our standards for building now must
be higher than what they used
to be 20 years
ago. We're no longer a growing suburb. We're
a mature community. The burden should
be on
the developers to prove that
the project enhances rather
than just build another genetic, commercial
building. Our tree preservation ordnance which
you folks know well, exists
precisely for
lots like this. It's not so
much about sort of, being fees
into the city's coffers
but it is about, critical zones and
ecological goals
that are in our 2040 plan. So I urge
this
commission to exercise its authority
to make a low impact development. We
should require the site plan that
preserves
most of the old grow trees
as a
key feature
rather than just clear cut and then
subsequently plant
smaller trees here and there. This
lost canopy
cannot be restored. This is the only
green space, this is the only
kind of something looks green in the entire
concrete jungle
that is around
us
and it's what is preserving
for the city's future plan. A high
intensity
restaurant, even if
it is a coffee
shop. And as my neighbor said, there's
coffee in every corner. Thankfully
it's not a fast food restaurant but
that's just one point. I think it's
just
creating this concrete island is a challenge. If the
commission approves this plan as it
is, then
I think we are signaling that the commercial
zoning rights are value that are in
our 2040 plan. So I
ask to send
this plan back to
the drawing
board. And keep trees as historic assets. So
in closing, retoring versus --
that you had opportunity to see around. And
there's plenty of
other retail spaces available that could
be used for
this purpose. And with this, I urge
you to deny this approval until a conservation
focus plan
is presented to you, thank you.
>>
thank you very much. Is there anybody
else
who would
like to speak on the application pro or
against. Seeing none, I'll
close the public
hearing. I would like
our
traffic engineer, mr. Baker, we
have some traffic questions.
>> based on
hearing
the comments this evening and the concerns. Do
you have any
concerns that need
to be evaluated with the proposed
application?
>> so they're
proposed driveway locations meeting
the ordnance requirement for the driveway
spacing. If they
wanted to look at moving it further
to
the west.
>> you're okay with that. >>
as long as
we can talk with the fire department
and see
if they're okay. I know they have
specific access requirements.
>>
what about some
measures to eliminate accessing that
left turn
lane. A raised, small raised
median or
something to eliminate the ability
to make
that maneuver?
>> not something we
have done much.
>> true, true. Are
there any with regards
to current traffic right now at that
intersection. Are there any concerns?
>>
I'm not aware of current concerns
there. We periodically look at different
intersections throughout the city
to see if any improvements or
anything would be warranted. I'm not
aware of looking
at this intersection currently.
>>
so as part of the site review we didn't
get a chance to see what operations
are to see, I know
for a fact and they're exactly
right. During the peak hour, there's heavy
westbound traffic
no question. There's
traffic coming
out of commercial so there's conflict. The
site, didn't meet
the triggers for an evaluation.
>>
correct.
>> correct. Okay. There might
be something we can look at the
intersection.
>> we can look at it
with our team.
>> it
sounds like there's already no u turn if
you're headed westbound. I think if
you made
no u turn eastbound also at that same friction point, people wouldn't
be
as eager to get out there and make
a u
turn. They
would go to the
other driveway. Just a thought.
>> yeah I
can see
all kinds of maneuvers for
that though. Yeah. Okay. Any questions of
our
traffic engineer, by the commission.
>>
yes. So
would a stoplight there be appropriate
in
your
mind's eye given all of the input
we received.
>> there's specific procedures for
that that would have
to be done. That hasn't been done
up
to this point.
>> in
your opinion, the amount of traffic that's
there would not
most likely require a stoplight, is
that what you're thinking.
>> no,
it
would have to be studied
to determine that. And
it hasn't currently been studied.
>>
yeah.
>>
if, and I agree. That this site may
not generate
the enough trips to trigger a traffic
evaluation. Especially since the
site is basically already been entitled
for
our previous zoning in 2007. But,
if there were a signal required who would
pay
for that? Would
this
site bare a portion of that? Probably
not, okay.
>> maybe let the cool
off the hook a little bit. But that's
such a major intersection. You can
make an
argument for multiple
lights on denton
tap, at trader joe's. On
tom thumb's side of
denton tap. It's, that's a much bigger.
>>
it's a bigger question. And I'm
sorry to put you on the spot.
>> not
at
all.
>> you have to learn sometime. So
it's
a learning experience for you
tonight. So. But yeah, it's a bigger question. And
to me
it seems like it would result in,
that's why
I was asking the applicant you know
they're basically right in, right
out and so
they're taking risk with the site there. But,
I'm not in favor of
more signals because signals are not
cheap. They're 400,000
plus and tying all those together
just makes it even more expensive. But
at the same time there are some conflict points that
I think we might be looking
at on this one. Okay, thank you cole.
>> yeah. >>
okay so the public hearing is closed. Discussion,
but before we get to the discussion
I had some questions for staff
if I can try to
remember
those. Is the
footprint the same, mary. Size wise. The previous
single, the previous two versus
this current single. Is it smaller
now than it was before.
>> I
don't think there was a size proposed
that I was able.
>> if
you can
visually put up that map.
it
just looks visually like it's smaller. Yeah. Maybe
it's even.
okay. And so it might be
a wash. Maybe it's
a wash. But, it's
still
entitled. Number two, the tree
ordnance. Three mitigation --I
know it's
not within
our purview. So keep that
in mind. And,
then I asked about
the traffic. Yes, restaurant. What
about scrubbers
for restaurant users. Is that a requirement.
>>
no.
>> I
know we've made some put some in off
of 121.
>>
we analyzed it so we
never did.
>>
okay, okay. Okay. If the applicant
could come up please. So I wanted to
capture
your thoughts on a couple of things. I
guess first of all. I do want to
commend, the plan you have done on
this site is a lot
better than what it was. So
y'all have done significant work on
this. If restaurant use is
on containening --containing smell. What
is
your thoughts on that.
>> I
don't, I think I have asked, there's
restaurants we're fine saying no. I
don't know if we
can document that. I don't know how
you do that within the, but
like, we understand that's
an important item. And we will certainly
be factoring that in. Because we would
rather get fewer calls than not. I
also would like to say that I've done
these
enough where I feel I always hear
about
how realtors lie to the residents. Next
to the people mixed commercial on. I
don't
know what
to do to that. I know this was
approved in 2007. But I've been to
a million meetings
where that comes up. It's unfortunate. I
hope
that the residents see that there's
a lot
of developers that could get this land
and do something
with. It's not something they
will ever be happy but it's the less
of undesirable outcomes. If there
was
a way within y'all's code we could
do that, I would be open
it. On
the sizing, I don't know
if it was two 100,000 square foot building
or two. I know we have
a max we have to stay below. I remember
us
pulling it smaller to meet that. But
I can't remember exactly. It's some
where in the plans.
>>
but you met the requirement.
>>
we're smaller is my point. But it's
15,000 or 16,000 I can't remember
exactly.
>> and then, thoughts on
some of
the fencing in the back. Is there
a
way that y'all could help.
>> so we
chose the trees because they're evergreen. And
this was, and matt was helpful with
this. We were trying to choose a tree
that would
grow from 20 to 30 feet. We were trying to
choose a tree that's
green throughout the year. I'm hoping
that will help not just with our
property but with the
sprouts and the andy's that won't
have,
like we're going
to be --to have shielding. We will
look at can
we throw on a few more trees in the back
too since
that seems to be the primary concern. The
fence isn't on our property. So I
don't know what we
can do with the fence.
>> that seg
ways into a similar question that
I have. I'm trying to envision here. And I
believe the front of the building
was 18 feet.
>> correct. >> so
there's a par pit on the front of
the building. I
heard some of the residents saying
they're already getting light from
across the street all the way from
andy's coming over
into their yard. I'm wondering what
the lighting on
the backside of the building
and the backside of that wall
because, by building an 18-foot parapit you're
essentially
building an 18-foot wall between them unless
you're radically lighting
the back of the building.
>> no
yeah. If you're saying that, our building,
so
what's interesting about the houses behind
us. They're
build on like, there's fill, they're built
a
little higher than they probably should
have. I don't know
if our building, you're asking
if our building will block the sprouts
sign from shining. I
don't know to be honest. My
hope is that, it won't be immediate
but we
chose specific trees that
will grow and then
eventually be taller than our building
and.
>> what
would be anticipated lights in the
back.
>> it'll be energy
building. The wall packs will be shielded
they will point
down so those won't be an issue. But
above the energy door you will see
the
emergency lighting. But we'll make
sure to use shields and like
I said, we'll meet the fire marshals
out there and say,
what is the lowest we can put
this to abide by code. Because you have
two
feet, foundation plus the six foot wall. So
that's eight feet. So my
hope is you can keep the emergency
lighting try to keep it, you
know like lower than the fence. I
don't know if we
can quite --if they will
let us we will. Like, yeah. So we
can, we
can keep all of our like the wall
packs
those we can keep it where the lights
point
down. Those won't
impact at all and they'll be shielded. It's
the
emergency lighting required by fire. That's
the only thing. But I
think compared to like sprouts or
andy
signs that's a much smaller.
>> and
it there wouldn't
be anything lighting the roof or the back
of the paraput
wall.
>> signage will be in
the front of the building only. That's
another
reason why flipping the building is helpful. Because
the building was flipped you would
have signage on both
sides and you
would have signage pointing at the resident
neighbors. We tried our
best to make
this within the box that we could.
>>
I was
thinking about some of the noise. You're
going to have hvac
on top. Is there any shielder to prevent
any of that
noise, since that
is there any way to do that?
>>
that so the tenants typically
handle that. I'm not sure if that's something when
the
tenants come in if that's something that
would be required of them. I don't know,
because we,
we don't put in the hvc. We don't
know
the tenant
or where
to put them. But
the tenants will
have their own issues.
>>
I would like for you to do something
for noise. Any ways you can help.
>>
hopefully you
have seen our plans and see that we're already
trying to do
that.
>> any other thoughts or comments
of the applicant.
>> based on
a couple of questions I think what will
be very
helpful is a scaled cross section. So
we can
see your description of the houses,
are a little bit higher. The wall
that exists is
on a 2-foot wall. If we had a cross
section that goes from sandy
lake on back, I think that would help
to visualize a lot better. I
think I can follow what you're describing. But
visually it's
hard to see. Are those houses elevated. Are
they lower. How is the wall? And I
know you can't
worry about across the street. But
then how do
the trees, you know, and any kind
of beef
up of the buffering in the back visually
screening will, I think will be
appreciated. But a cross section will really
help to
communicate that better so it's better understood.
>>
understood. It's good advice.
>>
I would just make the comment. It
seems like
you have a fairly
good representation of the neighborhood
here. I'm sure they have a homeowners
association that meet periodically. It
would be productive to make that connection
some where.
>> we've spoken to
their board. The association we reached
out to very
early
on that. We had met with
them once here.
>> thank you very
much.
>> thank
you.
>> so I would
like to adjust a few comments. Just
regarding this. All the
items you brought up that's all part
of the process. But the
one thing we have to remember,
this site was basically already
approved for commercial back in 07. So
they have
entitlements. We have to be very careful that
there's not
a taking. You know, I asked for
y'all to reflect a little bit. When
arbor manor
was approved for the residential dwelling units
there were a lot
of trees that
were taken out. A lot for those homes. So
to restrict
the ability for the site that's already
been approved
to develop because that's
a taking, and so
that would not be, not be well received. So,
and you guys have some great comments. I
totally
agree. There's going to be some conflictpoints. I
would
agree that through the development
process here. If it
gets past the pnz if there's the ability
to
perhaps move that driveway further
to the west a
little bit maybe to try to
limit or eliminate further conflict through
that meeting opening there. There could
be
an issue. I do agree with cole. Sorry I
put you on the spot there cole. That
you know, we may
take a look at that to see if there's any
ways to improve safety
if possible. But it hasn't been evaluated formally. I
was not aware of cut
through traffic but if
there's any ways for the hoa to under
take some measures to
try to reduce some things I would
be
all for that. But sorry that's really occurring. That's
the first time I've ever
heard of that one there. And, but
then I've got to
also reflect to the applicant, that they've
done a lot, a lot
on the site to really try to make it
better. And I
feel like they've done a lot of things
to actually make it better than what
was initially approved. So
those are just my
thoughts. Any other thoughts by
the commission? Okay is there a
motion by the commission? I
will
make a motion to approve
sandy lake
plot 1-a to lot 1 block a.
>> you
also
have the plat, if you
would include that.
>> and the replat. >> that
was
item 13 on
the agenda there. So we have a motion by commissioner
dobmeier is there a second.
>> I'll
second it.
>> we have
a second by commissioner
hafemann.
>> please respond by
saying aye or nae.
>>
commissioner dobmeier.
>> aye. >>
commissioner
blankenship.
>> aye. >> commissioner
the
haas.
>> aye. >> commissioner bishop. >>
aye.
>> all approve, none opposed. >>
thank you to the al
cant. -- applicant. Thank you for
the residents who
have provided input. This
must
still go through
the council. So --we did
meet in presession to
review those. I'm
going to pass that. Item
15 is adjournment. Unless there's
any other comments