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Good evening everyone. I'd like to call the Durham City Council

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meeting to order on the fourth day of May, 2026 at 7 p.m..

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Thank you so much for being here. If I could invite

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everyone to please join me in a moment of silent meditation.

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Thank you. Council Member Rist. If you'd like to lead us in the

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Pledge of Allegiance. Thank you, Mayor Pro Tem. If it

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is your practice, I invite you to rise with me and recite the

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Pledge of Allegiance. For. Okay.

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I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America.

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And to the republic for which it stands. One nation under

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God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

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Thank you. Madam clerk, could you please call the roll?

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Yes, indeed. Mayor Williams has an excused absence, but I

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believe is delayed and will be here shortly.

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Mayor Pro Tem Caballero here. Council Member Baker here.

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Council Member Burris here. Council Member Cook has

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received an excuse absence for this evening. Council Member

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Kopac here. Council Member Rist here. Thank you.

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Thank you. We have several ceremonial items this evening,

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so I'm going to invite Council Member Kopac to kick us off

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with the Drinking Water Week proclamation. Can you hear me

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now? Thank you. Raindrop or not, tonight? I

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don't know. Can you come to my left here?

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All right. Good evening. This evening. Good evening everyone.

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It's my pleasure this evening to read a proclamation on

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behalf of Drinking Water Week. And I'm glad to have Mr. Ralph

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Horn up here with me today with our Williams water treatment,

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one of our Williams water treatment plant operator with

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the City of Durham. So thank you for your service and thanks

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for being here this evening. Thank you sir.

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Yeah. So proclamation. Whereas water is a fundamental and

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essential need of all living things. And whereas tap water

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consistently provides public health protection, fire

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protection and economic support for the quality of life we

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enjoy. And whereas the city delivers a dependable supply of

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high quality, award winning drinking water. And whereas as

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stewards, we must continue to support investment in water

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infrastructure to meet the needs of future generations.

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And whereas the city stands as a leader in source water

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protection and recognizes the potential impacts of climate

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change on this vital resource. And whereas dedicated

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individuals and organizations have made significant

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contributions to developing, operating and maintaining our

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water systems and educating the public about their value. Now,

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therefore, I. Leonardo Williams mayor of the City of Durham,

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North Carolina, do hereby proclaim May 3rd to the fifth,

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2026 as Drinking Water Week in the City of Durham and

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encourage all residents to recognize and celebrate the

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staff who produce, manage and maintain the city water

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resources and support a more sustainable community by

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practicing water wise habits. Signed on this day, May 4th,

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Leonardo Williams Mayor. Thank you, thank you, thank

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you, thank you that thank. Good evening. My name is Ralph

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Horn. I'm an operator at the Williams Water Treatment

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facility. I thank you guys for taking the time tonight to

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recognize the vital role safe water drinking plays in all of

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our lives. Just like our police, fire, emergency

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responders and operators, water professionals work around the

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clock to keep public health and the community safe. It is an

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honor for me to accept this proclamation on behalf of my

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fellow operators in the water management, supply and drinking

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division and all it all employees of the City of

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Durham's Department of Water Management. Our team of more

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than 380 professionals works 24 hours a day, 365 days a year to

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ensure that all customers have access to one of the most basic

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human needs clean and safe drinking water. We've had a

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very dry spring. Durham's water supply has been on everyone's

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mind, and it will continue to be so until we have a good

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storm that fills reservoirs back up and eventually the

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public will, it fade from the public mind. Still, I would

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like to inform the mayor, the city council and the public to

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know that water management will still be working on your water

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supply around the clock diligently to maintain it. As

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Durham continues to grow, so does the number of customers

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who rely on us every day for their drinking water. For this

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reason, it is important that we plan today to provide for

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Durham's future tomorrow. I said that right, right. Our

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department is in the planning phase for building a water

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intake at Jordan Lake and a new water treatment plant in South

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Durham. This is part of a multiyear project to meet

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Durham's needs, known as the Jordan Light Water Supply

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Program. And you can hear. Adequate

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supply. We also to educate the next generation about the

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importance of drinking water each year. I wonder if it's the

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same spot as a poster contest that highlights the value of

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more choosing are starting to drop, and we can to 300 entries

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making judgments. It's quite a challenge. We are not fine with

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the artwork, but our. And we're very proud of our. Our fans and.

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To live and work. Thank you. That.

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To. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you sir.

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Good evening everyone. It's my honor to read the Taiwanese

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American Heritage Week proclamation. Is Chris Daly

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here? Thank you for joining me. Whereas since 1999, elected

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officials across the United States have observed the week

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following Mother's Day at Mother's Day as Taiwanese

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American Heritage Week. And Whereas the City of Durham

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values its diverse community and recognizes the important

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cultural, economic and civic contributions of Taiwanese

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Americans. And Whereas, in the face of ongoing challenges, it

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is important to recognize and celebrate the heritage and

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contributions of the Taiwanese American community. And

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Whereas, the United States and Taiwan share a strong

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partnership rooted in democracy, freedom, and human

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rights, supported by the Taiwan Relations Act of 1979 and the

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Six Assurances of 1982. And Whereas, Taiwanese American

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Heritage Week provides an opportunity to celebrate these

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contributions and the diversity that strengthens our community.

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Now there are four I. Leonardo Williams, mayor of the City of

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Durham, North Carolina, do hereby proclaim May 10th

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through 17th, 2026 as Taiwanese American Heritage Week in the

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City of Durham and encourage all residents to recognize and

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celebrate the contributions and heritage of Taiwanese

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Americans. Witness my hand in the Corporate seal of the City

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of Durham, North Carolina. This fourth day of May, 2026.

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Mayor Williams. And members of the City

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Council, thank you for taking the time and effort to approve

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and sign this proclamation celebrating Taiwanese American

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Heritage Week. Durham has a rich history of welcoming

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people from all over the world, and this proclamation

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beautifully demonstrates that spirit of acceptance. While I

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am not myself a Taiwanese American, my wife who is with

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us tonight, is a first generation Taiwanese American.

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Just last month, she celebrated three years as a US citizen. In

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nearly six years as a proud Durham resident. I am also the

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father of two young boys, Taiwanese Americans, who were

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both born right here at Duke Regional Hospital. The

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proclamation referenced Taiwan's resilience and

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perseverance in the face of ever growing geopolitical

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challenges. And I just want to say, for my family, those

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challenges are deeply personal. And now, more than ever, I

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worry about my son's future. Taiwan faces constant,

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unprovoked posturing from its much larger neighbor to the

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west. On a recent family trip to visit my wife's family, we

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stopped at Hualien, on Taiwan's east coast. The peaceful

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serenity was interrupted every few hours by F-16 fighter jets

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roaring into the skies. We learned that these jets are

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constantly scrambling to intercept military aircraft

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from the People's Liberation Army. Entering Taiwan's air

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defense identification zone without permission. This hits

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close to home for me, because if my sons choose to maintain

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their dual citizenship into adulthood, they will be

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required to serve in the Taiwanese military and possibly

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defend Taiwan from an invading force. Because of this reality,

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this proclamation is not mere platitudes. It is a declaration

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of solidarity. Tonight you have told my wife, my children and

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all Taiwanese Americans living in Durham, across North

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Carolina, and even the United States. We see you. We value

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your heritage, and we stand with you in your quest for

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freedom and democracy. Durham has a rich history of

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supporting the oppressed, whether supporting refugees

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fleeing the threat of war or standing up against systemic

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racial injustices that were taking place here at home.

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Durham is a city for good. And tonight, once again, you have

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chosen to stand up for the marginalized in our community.

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Thank you. Good evening. I will be

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presenting the Firefighters Day Proclamation. So if chiefs.

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Could please come up and Durham Fire and Rescue.

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Whereas firefighters serve the City of Durham with courage,

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dedication and professionalism, responding to emergencies at

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all hours to protect lives and property and the safety of our

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community. And whereas firefighters placed themselves

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in harm's way to safeguard residents and visitors,

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demonstrating extraordinary commitment to public service

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and the well-being of others. And Whereas International

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Firefighters Day is observed annually on May 4th to

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recognize and honor firefighters around the world

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for their bravery, sacrifice and unwavering service, their

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communities. And Whereas this day also provides an

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opportunity to remember and honor firefighters who have

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been injured or who have made the ultimate sacrifice in the

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line of duty. And whereas the Durham Fire Department proudly

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serves the whole city through emergency response, fire

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prevention efforts, public safety, education and community

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outreach initiatives that help keep residents safe. And

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whereas recognizing International Firefighters Day

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highlights the essential role of firefighters play in

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protecting our community and provides an opportunity for

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residents to express their appreciation for their service

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and sacrifice. Now, therefore, I. Leonardo Williams, mayor of

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the City of Durham, North Carolina, do hereby proclaim

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May 4th, 2026 as International Firefighters Day in the City of

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Durham and encourage all residents to recognize the

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dedication, bravery and service of firefighters and to aim to

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express their gratitude for the work they do to protect our

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community. Witness my hand the corporate seal of the City of

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Durham, North Carolina. This fourth day of May, 2026. May

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4th be with you. All.

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Thank you very much. Madam Mayor Pro Tem, members of

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the City Council. Good evening. My name is Bob. I have the

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pleasure of serving as the fire chief of this great city. With

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me tonight are two members. They did come up. I was afraid

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that they would hide in the back of the Durham Fire

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Department, who have great significance. I have one of our

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most senior and one of our most junior members with me tonight.

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Our department senior members, Captain Travis Melvin, who

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graduated in August of 1994 from Academy eight. Travis is

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our longest serving member in operations, saving and saving

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lives and property in the city for over 32 years. Cap melvin's

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other duties include serving as the liaison to 911 and as a

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response plan specialist, where he designs and implements

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response strategies for the city. Travis also serves as the

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president of Bull City Firefighters, one of our three

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employee groups. Capt Melvin is assigned to Engine Company one,

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quartered right across the street at 139 East Morgan

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Street, and he's a native Durham Light, our department's

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junior members, firefighter Davon Blackwell, who graduated

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on April 17th, 2026, on from Academy 45 year. Blackwell

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graduated with 26 other new firefighter just 17 days ago.

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And while they're all equally junior, if you will, I asked

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Davon specifically to represent our newest members tonight

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because he was picked by his peers to represent them at

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their academy class. Graduation. Fifer Blackwell is also

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assigned in company one. He's originally from San Bernardino,

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California, and I'd love to say our recruitment is just that

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good that we grabbed him in California. He came to the area

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to finish college, and then later he took his son to visit

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a firehouse. And, well, the rest is history Council. Thank

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you so much for recognizing the great work of your firefighters

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tonight. The officers and members of the Durham Fire

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Department protect the lives, property and environment of the

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city. 24 over 365 your fire department does that by

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responding to fires, medical emergencies, auto accidents,

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hazardous materials incidents, technical rescue, entrapment,

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and all manner of other events that require life saving and

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caring skill. We were called to help. Three I'm sorry. 35,805

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times in 2025, and we always answer that call so that, you

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know, to answer that many. Number one calls for service.

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The DFD had to respond 52,000 times. And to provide our high

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level of service to the community, we trained over

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108,000 hours during the year. Your fire department also works

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very hard to prevent the 911 call from happening in the

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first place. Through fire code enforcement and strong public

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safety education efforts, including three summer youth

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camps. Today is International Firefighters Day, a day set

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aside to recognize firefighters from all across our world who

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put their lives on the line to save others. In the United

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States, there are over a million firefighters. Here in

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Durham, there's 449 men and women keeping our communities

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safe. On behalf of all of them, thank you very much for the

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kind and thoughtful recognition of their strong work. Thank you.

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Thank you very much. All right. Good evening,

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everyone. I'd like to call forward Gregory Williams and

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David Braddock from Bike Durham. It is bike month. I'm

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going to don my bike helmet since I biked in for bike

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month, as did Council Member Kopac, who's also going to join

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me here. So whereas Mayor's National Bike Month, a

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celebration of biking as transportation, recreation and

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community connection that benefits public health,

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environmental sustainability and quality of life. And

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whereas the City of Durham continues to invest in its

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bicycle and pedestrian network, including $75 million for new

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and repaired sidewalks via the successful 2024 connector and

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bond issue. And Whereas, the City of City and County of

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Durham continue to plan for strategic expansion of biking

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and walking networks via the Durham Bike and Walk Plan,

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charting a course toward a safer, more connected and more

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equitable transportation system. And whereas May 6th is

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bike walk and roll to school day, when students, parents and

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educators across Durham are encouraged to travel to school

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by foot, by bicycle or other active means throughout the

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month of May. And whereas May 9th is the Bull City Bike

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Stampede, a ride organized by Bike Durham. Thank you all.

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When cyclists of all ages take to Durham streets together to

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celebrate and advocate for safer infrastructure for all,

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and whereas May 11th through 17th is Bike to Work Week, when

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commuters across Durham are encouraged to swap car trips

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for bike trips, reducing emissions and promoting health

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and economic benefits of cycling as transportation and

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bike. Durham will host the annual Ride of Silence on May

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20th. A memorial ride through downtown Durham to honor those

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killed or injured while biking, affirming that every traffic

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death is preventable. Now, therefore, I Leonardo Williams,

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mayor of the City of Durham, North Carolina, do hereby

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proclaim May 2026 as National Bike Month in the City of

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Durham and encourage all residents to ride, walk and

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roll this month in the Bull City. Witness my hand and the

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corporate seal of the City of Durham, North Carolina. This

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fourth day of May, 2026. Leonardo Williams mayor.

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Thank you, Mayor Williams, Mayor Pro Tem and members of

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City Council for this proclamation. Recognizing May

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as National Bike Month in Durham. My name is David

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Bradwell. I volunteer with Bike Durham as the advocacy

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co-chair. I for the past five years have been biking my kid

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to Echo Elementary in Old West Durham, and I've been biking to

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work for much longer. On behalf of Bike Durham, I'm grateful

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for the city's partnership and its commitment to making Durham

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streets safer and more welcoming for everyone who

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walks, bikes and rolls. This proclamation reflects not just

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a celebration, but a shared commitment to the work ahead.

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This month, we invite all Durham residents to join us for

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the Bike Month events announced in the proclamation and found

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at Bike Durham. Next. I'd like to hand it off to Gregory

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Williams, advocacy campaign organizer at Bike Durham.

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Good evening, Mayor Williams. Council members, we invite you

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to attend our 10th our Events this month to send a powerful

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message to our community that Durham's leaders are committed

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to safe streets for everyone. Bike month is a celebration,

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but it's also a time to reflect and honor those who we have

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lost on our streets. Most recently, Jack O'Shea, who was

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killed by a driver on Coal Mill Road. With tragedies like this

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underscoring the importance we recognize the work, the City of

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Durham staff has done on the recent bike walk plan update.

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We call on council to identify the resources necessary to

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fully implement its recommendations. Durham is

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making progress on biking and transportation in general, with

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new sidewalks and bike lanes, improved crosswalks and bus

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service, and a community that shows up to ride, to remember,

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to advocate and to imagine a city where everyone can get

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around safely. We have more work to do, but we're glad to

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do it alongside this city. Thank you.

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Thank you. Thank you colleagues. Now I

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have announcements by council. Does anyone have any

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00:21:53,812 --> 00:21:56,548
announcements? And, Madam Clerk, we're keeping our

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announcements to two minutes each. Colleagues. Anyone? Go

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00:22:06,692 --> 00:22:09,428
ahead. Council Member Baker. Good evening everyone. Thank

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you all for being in the building. I'll be quick. I do

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00:22:12,164 --> 00:22:17,635
just want to say thank you for your patience in signing up. It

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is not every meeting that we have such a large number of

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people attending, but it also doesn't never happen. And so I

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00:22:25,643 --> 00:22:29,848
do. I do think that we need to develop some some protocols for

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00:22:29,848 --> 00:22:33,452
larger groups so that people don't have to wait for extended

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periods of time to, to sign up to speak. So I hope that we can

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00:22:38,590 --> 00:22:42,928
do that. Just want to say thank you to all of our city workers

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00:22:42,928 --> 00:22:46,665
every day for all that you do. And thanks to it,

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00:22:46,665 --> 00:22:50,669
communications, all the city staff who help keep our

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meetings running smoothly. That's it. Thank you.

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00:22:55,273 --> 00:22:58,770
Thank you. Any other council members? Good. Council Member

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Kopac. Thank you, Madam Mayor Pro Tem.

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So a few announcements. First of all, I just want to give

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appreciation to your ministries of Durham and Durham Center for

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Senior Life for the recent annual galas and celebrations.

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Council Member Burris and I got to see the Durham Center for

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00:23:14,826 --> 00:23:20,165
Senior Life House band perform and see the the residents take

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00:23:20,165 --> 00:23:22,367
over the dance floor. So that was a really joyous

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celebration. Appreciate and thank Haiti Reborn for the

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00:23:26,972 --> 00:23:31,176
recent forum. I was invited to. Congratulations to Cornwallis

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youth and their nCCU mentors with Grace to Inc. for

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completion of a podcast series everyone should check out, and

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00:23:37,783 --> 00:23:40,652
the courage and leadership they showed in the face of recent

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violence, which they should not have to show as people so

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young. The second annual Solar festival was a big hit at Lyons

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Farm Elementary with students, solar builds and a puppet show

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in partnership with the NC Climate Justice Collective and

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Paper hand puppets, showing us the possibility of a future

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with clean, abundant energy built with collective power on

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00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:06,100
our agenda. Tonight you won't hear about Keep Durham

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00:24:06,100 --> 00:24:07,946
Beautiful and their annual report, but I want to

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00:24:07,946 --> 00:24:10,882
acknowledge and commend their ongoing work to expand our tree

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canopy and clear invasive plants. Happy Jewish American

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Heritage Month! And finally, as a reminder, the City manager

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will be releasing his budget on May 18th. The best times to

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00:24:22,761 --> 00:24:26,164
give input at this stage are our work sessions on May 18th

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and May 21st, and at the June 1st budget hearing. Thank you.

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Thank you. Council Member Burris do you have any

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comments? Thank you, Mayor Pro Tem again.

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00:24:35,774 --> 00:24:38,844
Happy. May everyone. In addition to Bike Month, it is

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also was also May day on Friday. And I want to thank all the

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Durham residents who went over to Raleigh to celebrate or to

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join in the thousands of people, literally tens of

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thousands of people at the May day protest in Raleigh last

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Friday, part of the May Day Strong campaign nationwide, I

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want to thank you for helping to organize that rally, and I

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want to thank everyone that came out to express their deep

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concern with the with the direction our state's going in

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and how we need to fund our schools and our people in much

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more substantial ways and avoid tax cuts. So thanks for all

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that came out. Also last Saturday, May 2nd was the

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Garmin Marathon. I want to thank the Durham Sports

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Commission for sponsoring that and helping to organize that in

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Durham. As you all know, the Garmin Marathon is only in a

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couple cities a year. It's a great honor for that to have

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been in Durham again. Literally thousands of runners who

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participated in that marathon. Big runner myself, as you know.

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Yeah, but I wasn't able to get out. But it's great to wake up

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Saturday morning and see literally a wall of runners

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coming down my street participating in that. Is it

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great for the runners? They're also great for Durham to

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attract so many folks to our city to participate in the

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Garmin Marathon. Finally, I want to say going back to the

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month of last of April, I want to thank the Haiti Heritage

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Center for hosting a screening of the new documentary by

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00:25:46,251 --> 00:25:49,851
Durham documentarian Kenny Alzheimer called Moonchild.

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Moonchild. It screened on April 30th, which I think is also

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International Jazz Day. If I'm not mistaken. If you if you've

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not seen it, don't miss a chance to see moonsault

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Moonchild. It's the untold story of a Durham legend who's

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00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:06,605
a jazz pianist, but also an amazing connector. His name is

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00:26:06,605 --> 00:26:11,760
brother Yusef Saleem. Yusef Saleem it's 100% Durham Jazz

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00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:14,346
Durham story about the power of music, the power of jazz,

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00:26:14,346 --> 00:26:16,815
connections to the nCCU jazz program, which is one of the

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00:26:16,815 --> 00:26:19,551
strongest in the country, and also connections to the Muslim

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community in Durham that centered around West Chapel

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Hill Street, where the mosque still is. So if you have a

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00:26:24,890 --> 00:26:27,426
chance, look out for Moonchild, an amazing story of Durham.

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00:26:27,426 --> 00:26:29,428
Again, thanks to Kenny Dulcimer, the filmmaker, for

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00:26:29,428 --> 00:26:32,297
bringing that story to all of us. It's a fascinating story.

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You got to see it. So thank you. Mayor Pro Tem.

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00:26:35,567 --> 00:26:38,771
Thank you. I have just a few announcements. I want to first

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00:26:38,771 --> 00:26:42,775
acknowledge Scout troop that is here. Scout troop 400. I think

400
00:26:42,775 --> 00:26:44,709
there are towards the back of the chamber.

401
00:26:44,709 --> 00:26:47,312
So thank you so much for being here and participating. If

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00:26:47,312 --> 00:26:50,312
y'all want to stand. Up.

403
00:26:55,721 --> 00:26:59,258
It's always a pleasure to have scouts here with us. Secondly,

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00:26:59,258 --> 00:27:02,260
and I will leave it with the clerk. Somebody left their

405
00:27:02,260 --> 00:27:06,732
phone. It's just like a black. So I'll leave it with the with

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00:27:06,732 --> 00:27:09,601
the clerk. So if you're missing your phone, look through your

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00:27:09,601 --> 00:27:13,472
belongings. And finally, I will be reordering the agenda quite

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00:27:13,472 --> 00:27:15,340
a lot tonight. There are certain things that are going

409
00:27:15,340 --> 00:27:19,770
to have to get switched around, so please bear with me. When

410
00:27:19,770 --> 00:27:21,413
the mayor is here, he has a second. I don't have a second.

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00:27:21,413 --> 00:27:24,216
So I ask for patience this evening. Hopefully he will get

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00:27:24,216 --> 00:27:27,753
here around eight between 830. So those are all. Oh, and then

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00:27:27,753 --> 00:27:30,689
finally I do want to extend a huge shout out to everyone who

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00:27:30,689 --> 00:27:33,691
did was able to go out to Raleigh. It was an incredible

415
00:27:33,691 --> 00:27:36,962
afternoon. I was very happy to be able to participate and just

416
00:27:36,962 --> 00:27:39,498
delighted that that many folks showed up. I will say it was

417
00:27:39,498 --> 00:27:42,434
also distressing and disappointing because the last

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00:27:42,434 --> 00:27:45,970
time I marched in Raleigh for a large red for an event, my kids

419
00:27:45,970 --> 00:27:48,240
were in elementary school and my third kid is about to

420
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:51,376
graduate from Riverside in June, and we still don't have

421
00:27:51,376 --> 00:27:53,579
adequate funding for a public schools. So we have a lot of

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00:27:53,579 --> 00:27:56,480
work to do in the state of North Carolina, and I encourage

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00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:58,650
every single one of you who's here tonight to keep doing your

424
00:27:58,650 --> 00:28:04,856
civic duty and showing up for our public schools. Thank you.

425
00:28:04,856 --> 00:28:09,461
Madam manager, priority items. I'll go with madam. So sorry.

426
00:28:09,461 --> 00:28:13,999
I'll go with manager madam. All right? Yeah. Thank you, madam

427
00:28:13,999 --> 00:28:16,735
mayor. Pro tem, members of council. The city manager's

428
00:28:16,735 --> 00:28:19,338
office has one priority item this evening. That is agenda

429
00:28:19,338 --> 00:28:22,741
item number 27. That's been added to your agenda. It's a

430
00:28:22,741 --> 00:28:26,100
revision to the 2026 City Council meeting schedule. This

431
00:28:26,100 --> 00:28:29,140
has been added to move the work session that was originally

432
00:28:29,140 --> 00:28:32,751
scheduled for May 7th, to now take place on May 18th. That

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00:28:32,751 --> 00:28:35,420
item is on your agenda. And those are all our priority

434
00:28:35,420 --> 00:28:36,555
items from the manager's office.

435
00:28:36,555 --> 00:28:40,920
Thank you. Thank you, Madam Attorney.

436
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:42,827
Thank you, Madam Mayor Pro Tem, the city Attorney's office has

437
00:28:42,827 --> 00:28:46,164
no priority items. Although I think I will speak on behalf of

438
00:28:46,164 --> 00:28:48,500
Council Member Baker. Perhaps to point out that there's

439
00:28:48,500 --> 00:28:51,360
another supplemental item that's been added to the

440
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:55,236
agenda. Item number 28. Thank you, Madam Attorney.

441
00:28:56,410 --> 00:28:59,778
Madam clerk. Thank you, Madam Mayor Pro Tem,

442
00:28:59,778 --> 00:29:03,182
the city clerk's office has no priority items tonight.

443
00:29:03,182 --> 00:29:09,388
Thank you. So the next order of business for us is to read out

444
00:29:09,388 --> 00:29:12,858
the agenda. We will be taking up our consent agenda. Consent

445
00:29:12,858 --> 00:29:15,660
agenda is everything that we discussed at our work session.

446
00:29:15,660 --> 00:29:18,730
And it's all together. It's why it's on consent. Item number

447
00:29:18,730 --> 00:29:22,330
one developmental Review Performance Audit March 2026.

448
00:29:23,100 --> 00:29:26,337
Item number five opioid Settlement Update and Spending

449
00:29:26,337 --> 00:29:30,800
authorization. Item number eight Durham Armory HVAC

450
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,946
upgrades, design build contract with Brady Train Service, Inc..

451
00:29:33,946 --> 00:29:37,415
Item number nine Keep Durham Beautiful 2025 Annual Report.

452
00:29:37,415 --> 00:29:39,484
Item number ten Second Amendment to contract with

453
00:29:39,484 --> 00:29:42,154
International Business Machines Corporation for next generation

454
00:29:42,154 --> 00:29:45,754
ERP implementation. Item number 11 supplemental Agreement

455
00:29:45,891 --> 00:29:50,691
Number two two Governing agreement number 21551 with P

456
00:29:50,895 --> 00:29:54,566
USA, Inc. for cultural for Central Durham Bus Rapid

457
00:29:54,566 --> 00:29:58,303
Transit design 30% and National Environmental Policy Act, Nepa

458
00:29:58,303 --> 00:30:01,840
study item number 12. Extension of street impact fee credits to

459
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:05,577
Creek Wood highway 70, Alexander, LLC, item number 13.

460
00:30:05,577 --> 00:30:08,313
Construction contract for signalized pedestrian upgrades

461
00:30:08,313 --> 00:30:12,251
at 13 locations with Traffic Control Devices, LLC. Item

462
00:30:12,251 --> 00:30:16,540
number 14 Go Durham FY 25 Annual Report. Item number 15

463
00:30:16,540 --> 00:30:18,990
FY 26 Water and Sewer Funds Budget Ordinance Amendment,

464
00:30:18,990 --> 00:30:21,259
item number 16, amendment number five to Professional

465
00:30:21,259 --> 00:30:24,863
Engineering Services. Contract number 14605 with Hazen and

466
00:30:24,863 --> 00:30:28,667
Sawyer, PC for the Lake McKee and little River Raw water pump

467
00:30:28,667 --> 00:30:31,667
Station improvements. Item number 17. Professional

468
00:30:32,204 --> 00:30:34,740
services contract with the Wooten Company for the Duke

469
00:30:34,740 --> 00:30:37,476
Golf Course. Aerial rehabilitation, rehabilitation

470
00:30:37,476 --> 00:30:40,679
and Lick Basin Sewer assessments Project. Item

471
00:30:40,679 --> 00:30:44,279
number 18. Professional services contract award to

472
00:30:44,349 --> 00:30:46,885
McKim and Creed, Inc. for the Southeast Pressure Zone pump

473
00:30:46,885 --> 00:30:50,825
Station upgrade, item number 26. Approval of the draft FY

474
00:30:50,825 --> 00:30:55,625
2627 Actual Action Plan, ARP and Recommended Funding Plan.

475
00:30:55,763 --> 00:30:58,320
That is everything that I have under consent and I have no

476
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:01,302
pulled agenda items. So if I could go ahead and get a

477
00:31:01,302 --> 00:31:03,236
motion. So moved.

478
00:31:03,236 --> 00:31:06,574
I have a motion a second. All in favor, madam clerk, could

479
00:31:06,574 --> 00:31:13,774
you please open the vote? Pull. Madam Mayor Pro Tem, you need

480
00:31:27,661 --> 00:31:30,730
to vote yes. Could you please open it? It's

481
00:31:30,730 --> 00:31:34,735
open. Mine is not. Oh, there it is. Sorry, sorry. Y'all okay?

482
00:31:34,735 --> 00:31:37,735
Could you please close. It?

483
00:31:39,500 --> 00:31:42,877
The motion passes unanimously. Thank you, Madam clerk. Under

484
00:31:42,877 --> 00:31:46,814
general business agenda, I have items number two, children's

485
00:31:46,814 --> 00:31:49,216
wealth building resolution and number three, endangered

486
00:31:49,216 --> 00:31:51,819
species day resolution. We have a few speakers on that. And

487
00:31:51,819 --> 00:31:54,221
then we have several other items under general business

488
00:31:54,221 --> 00:31:57,891
agenda. Madam attorney, I know that we have to take up item

489
00:31:57,891 --> 00:32:03,891
number 28 before item number four. But those are all under

490
00:32:04,498 --> 00:32:08,698
general business public hearings. And or. Sorry.

491
00:32:09,169 --> 00:32:11,772
I'm sorry, Madam Mayor. Pro Tem number 28 is not a public

492
00:32:11,772 --> 00:32:15,410
hearing item. It's a resolution that's required in order to

493
00:32:15,410 --> 00:32:18,379
hold the public hearing at item number four. So what I would

494
00:32:18,379 --> 00:32:20,581
suggest is maybe you work through the agenda. Go ahead

495
00:32:20,581 --> 00:32:22,850
and tackle the supplemental items and leave all of the

496
00:32:22,850 --> 00:32:26,320
public hearings at the end. Okay. So we're going to do item

497
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:30,123
number 28, which is the supplemental item resolution to

498
00:32:30,123 --> 00:32:32,993
set a public hearing to impose a temporary moratorium on

499
00:32:32,993 --> 00:32:35,930
developmental approvals for data centers, cryptocurrency

500
00:32:35,930 --> 00:32:38,399
mining operations, and any use associated with data center

501
00:32:38,399 --> 00:32:41,680
processing facilities within the city of Durham. Pursuant to

502
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:47,675
NC. I don't have the statute, but that's what we have to do

503
00:32:47,675 --> 00:32:52,680
first. And Council, this is your item. So I'm going to pass

504
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:55,282
it to you if you have any comments.

505
00:32:55,282 --> 00:32:57,418
Since this is just the resolution, I'll go ahead and

506
00:32:57,418 --> 00:33:00,221
save my comments for the actual ordinance.

507
00:33:00,221 --> 00:33:02,957
Perfect. Thank you. Could I please get a motion to adopt a

508
00:33:02,957 --> 00:33:05,292
resolution to set a public hearing to impose a temporary

509
00:33:05,292 --> 00:33:07,494
moratorium on developmental approvals for data centers,

510
00:33:07,494 --> 00:33:10,970
cryptocurrency mining operations, and any use

511
00:33:10,970 --> 00:33:12,366
associated with data center processing facilities within

512
00:33:12,366 --> 00:33:16,837
the City of Durham. Pursuant to NC General Statute 160 Dash 107

513
00:33:16,837 --> 00:33:19,837
and Udo section 3.99.6. So moved..

514
00:33:21,842 --> 00:33:23,577
Madam Mayor Pro Tem, second. Madam.

515
00:33:23,577 --> 00:33:27,647
I'm sorry to interrupt. We signed up to speed on.

516
00:33:27,647 --> 00:33:32,853
I will not be allowing folks to shout at us from to the dais.

517
00:33:32,853 --> 00:33:35,923
That is okay. It's going to get handled. This is just the

518
00:33:35,923 --> 00:33:39,460
resolution. Your opportunity to speak is coming. We can't let

519
00:33:39,460 --> 00:33:42,329
you speak until we accept the resolution to hold a public

520
00:33:42,329 --> 00:33:45,132
hearing. If we do not pass item number four, there is no item

521
00:33:45,132 --> 00:33:49,269
number 28. That is the order that we have to follow or we

522
00:33:49,269 --> 00:33:51,939
can't do the thing that folks have signed up to do. So we are

523
00:33:51,939 --> 00:33:56,277
going to accept the resolution. There is a motion and a second,

524
00:33:56,277 --> 00:33:59,613
and we are going to hold the vote. And that will allow item

525
00:33:59,613 --> 00:34:02,816
number four to pursue. Otherwise, item number four

526
00:34:02,816 --> 00:34:09,623
cannot pursue. Thank you, Madam Clerk. Is it is the. Could you

527
00:34:09,623 --> 00:34:15,963
please open the vote? Thank you. Could you please close the

528
00:34:15,963 --> 00:34:18,363
vote? Motion passes unanimously.

529
00:34:19,966 --> 00:34:24,438
Thank you, Madam Clerk. Now I'll be going back up under our

530
00:34:24,438 --> 00:34:29,838
general business items, we have. Under our general business

531
00:34:32,846 --> 00:34:35,516
agenda, we have item number two. Children's wealth building

532
00:34:35,516 --> 00:34:37,985
resolution. And item number three, endangered species day

533
00:34:37,985 --> 00:34:41,188
resolution for both items. Folks who signed up, I would

534
00:34:41,188 --> 00:34:44,257
like you to keep your minutes to two minutes. Excuse me, your

535
00:34:44,257 --> 00:34:47,600
comments to two minutes each, because we have a lot of public

536
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:51,198
hearings this evening. I'm going to start with our

537
00:34:51,198 --> 00:34:57,798
registrants online first. Madam clerk. Yeah. So I have okay. So

538
00:35:01,408 --> 00:35:05,780
I have Miss Amelia O'Rourke own, but I think she is here in

539
00:35:05,780 --> 00:35:10,283
person. Is that correct? Is she here in person? Okay. Thank you

540
00:35:10,283 --> 00:35:14,488
for standing up. So we're going to come to you in just a

541
00:35:14,488 --> 00:35:21,880
second. I also have Kate Irish online. Is Kate okay? Okay.

542
00:35:21,628 --> 00:35:23,898
Irish. You are also here in person okay. So those are the

543
00:35:23,898 --> 00:35:29,770
two online speakers I have for item number two. Madam clerk, I

544
00:35:29,770 --> 00:35:32,973
don't unless you sent it via email. I don't have in-person

545
00:35:32,973 --> 00:35:35,642
registrants yet. It's not here yet. It's in

546
00:35:35,642 --> 00:35:39,842
process. Okay. Because I know that miss

547
00:35:40,581 --> 00:35:43,784
O'Rourke Owen is here in person and Miss Irish is here in

548
00:35:43,784 --> 00:35:46,453
person. I'm going to go ahead and let you all come on up and

549
00:35:46,453 --> 00:35:50,857
line up to speak. As soon as I have my in-person registrants.

550
00:35:50,857 --> 00:35:53,461
I'll keep inviting you. I just don't have the names yet, so

551
00:35:53,461 --> 00:35:57,731
please bear with us so folks can go ahead and line up here.

552
00:35:57,731 --> 00:36:01,931
Yes, and remember, you have two minutes.

553
00:36:02,335 --> 00:36:08,542
I'll I love it. I don't. And as soon as I have the rest

554
00:36:08,542 --> 00:36:13,146
of the speakers, I will call you up. Thank you.

555
00:36:13,146 --> 00:36:16,146
Samantha Roth. Okay. Good evening.

556
00:36:21,210 --> 00:36:22,622
Good evening. Thank you.

557
00:36:22,622 --> 00:36:24,958
I'm Kate. Irish, executive director with

558
00:36:24,958 --> 00:36:27,761
Durham's Partnership for children. At the partnership,

559
00:36:27,761 --> 00:36:31,231
we're focused on ensuring every child in Durham enters school

560
00:36:31,231 --> 00:36:34,968
healthy and ready to succeed. We lead strategies for all

561
00:36:34,968 --> 00:36:38,906
23,000 children age, birth to five and their families to

562
00:36:38,906 --> 00:36:41,975
promote healthy development, learning and enhance high

563
00:36:41,975 --> 00:36:43,777
quality child. Care.

564
00:36:43,777 --> 00:36:47,314
Investing in the early years means lifelong outcomes for

565
00:36:47,314 --> 00:36:51,500
that child and family and education, health and economic

566
00:36:51,500 --> 00:36:54,387
security, early childhood investments are also critical

567
00:36:54,387 --> 00:36:57,391
to our community's well-being, as child care and early

568
00:36:57,391 --> 00:37:00,862
education. Our work supports and critical infrastructure for

569
00:37:00,862 --> 00:37:04,999
our economy. We know the power of a strong foundation for

570
00:37:04,999 --> 00:37:08,690
young children, and that includes a financially stable

571
00:37:08,690 --> 00:37:11,406
one. This resolution on children's savings accounts

572
00:37:11,406 --> 00:37:15,342
recognizes the importance of launching children and families

573
00:37:15,342 --> 00:37:19,130
into a brighter futures by planting the seeds of economic

574
00:37:19,130 --> 00:37:23,618
security. Many families with young children in Durham are

575
00:37:23,618 --> 00:37:27,210
struggling right now to make ends meet, with the cost of

576
00:37:27,210 --> 00:37:30,424
living rising and the trouble of being able to afford the

577
00:37:30,424 --> 00:37:34,562
cost of housing, food, childcare, this means that

578
00:37:34,562 --> 00:37:38,232
families are stretched too thin to be able to start saving and

579
00:37:38,232 --> 00:37:42,237
planning for their children's future. A savings account for a

580
00:37:42,237 --> 00:37:46,374
child unlocks something beyond economic security. It unlocks

581
00:37:46,374 --> 00:37:50,378
hope and trust in the future. It highlights for families the

582
00:37:50,378 --> 00:37:54,480
possibilities of what can be and what may be on the horizon

583
00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:57,785
for their child as they grow up, college or starting a

584
00:37:57,785 --> 00:38:01,322
business. A path to buying a home. The possibilities will be

585
00:38:01,322 --> 00:38:04,993
endless. We want young children and families, of course, to

586
00:38:04,993 --> 00:38:09,397
have financial security, but also to feel empowered to dream

587
00:38:09,397 --> 00:38:12,667
about their future. These children savings accounts with

588
00:38:12,667 --> 00:38:16,337
federal contributions will help put young children on a path to

589
00:38:16,337 --> 00:38:19,741
a stronger and more supported future. Durham's partnership

590
00:38:19,741 --> 00:38:22,610
for children is excited to partner with the city on

591
00:38:22,610 --> 00:38:24,745
outreach efforts for this campaign.

592
00:38:24,745 --> 00:38:27,145
Thank you. Thank you.

593
00:38:29,684 --> 00:38:33,284
Miss O'Rourke, I. Want good evening.

594
00:38:34,489 --> 00:38:35,956
My name is Amelia O'Rourke Owens.

595
00:38:35,956 --> 00:38:38,359
I'm a lawyer who focuses on consumer protection and

596
00:38:38,359 --> 00:38:41,829
community economic development. Before I was DOJ's twice in

597
00:38:41,829 --> 00:38:45,633
2025, I worked for the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau,

598
00:38:45,633 --> 00:38:48,436
where I focused on public benefits payments, fair lending

599
00:38:48,436 --> 00:38:51,839
technologies, and abusive private student loans. Since

600
00:38:51,839 --> 00:38:54,376
Elon Musk raised a chainsaw above his head and federal

601
00:38:54,376 --> 00:38:57,312
consumer protections were on the chopping block. I've been

602
00:38:57,312 --> 00:38:59,914
advising nonprofits and academic institutions on

603
00:38:59,914 --> 00:39:03,251
various policy matters. One of those roles has been as a

604
00:39:03,251 --> 00:39:05,720
research fellow for the center for Taxpayer Rights, where

605
00:39:05,720 --> 00:39:09,524
we've read every statute notice and implementing regulation for

606
00:39:09,524 --> 00:39:13,610
these new Trump accounts, also referred to as section 538

607
00:39:13,610 --> 00:39:17,132
accounts. This is a long way to say that I am a nerd and also

608
00:39:17,132 --> 00:39:20,401
very in the weeds. I'm thankful for Council Member Rice

609
00:39:20,401 --> 00:39:23,605
Resolution and I hope that y'all will support it today. To

610
00:39:23,605 --> 00:39:26,607
this end, I want to highlight the robust scholarship on

611
00:39:26,607 --> 00:39:29,811
children's savings accounts and the reality of Trump accounts

612
00:39:29,811 --> 00:39:33,347
as they're already being deployed first. Since Michael

613
00:39:33,347 --> 00:39:36,217
Sheridan started researching child assets as poverty

614
00:39:36,217 --> 00:39:40,417
alleviation strategies in 1991, there's incredible research on

615
00:39:40,488 --> 00:39:43,224
the positive impacts of children's savings accounts,

616
00:39:43,224 --> 00:39:46,560
even in small amounts. Doctor Willie Elliott from the

617
00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:49,497
University of Michigan, articulates so beautifully that

618
00:39:49,497 --> 00:39:52,330
one of the most impactful pieces of children's savings

619
00:39:52,330 --> 00:39:55,837
accounts is one of the hardest to quantify, which is the hope

620
00:39:55,837 --> 00:40:00,108
that it gives to the young children who are beneficiaries.

621
00:40:00,108 --> 00:40:03,511
Now, turning to Durham's role and Trump accounts, these

622
00:40:03,511 --> 00:40:08,911
accounts are here. They were already deployed on form 4547

623
00:40:09,517 --> 00:40:14,188
on our tax filing, and the only way that children born since

624
00:40:14,188 --> 00:40:17,788
January 1st, 2025 can receive their $1,000 pilot

625
00:40:17,859 --> 00:40:22,864
contributions is by opening these accounts. So they also

626
00:40:22,864 --> 00:40:26,670
these accounts implement almost none of the best practices for

627
00:40:26,670 --> 00:40:29,270
children's savings accounts, such as automatic enrollment or

628
00:40:29,270 --> 00:40:32,941
a public trustee. Given this, without the thoughtful outreach

629
00:40:32,941 --> 00:40:36,100
and the city's efforts to those who would benefit most from

630
00:40:36,100 --> 00:40:39,214
these accounts, we risk entrenching wealth inequality

631
00:40:39,214 --> 00:40:42,214
further. Thank you. Thank you.

632
00:40:44,819 --> 00:40:50,892
Next up, I think I have Ryan Hurley. And, Tabitha, hold.

633
00:40:50,892 --> 00:40:52,892
On. Blackwell.

634
00:41:01,369 --> 00:41:04,969
Good evening. Good evening. City Council

635
00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:09,710
members. city manager and city staff. My name is Ryan Hurley.

636
00:41:09,710 --> 00:41:13,581
I'm a Durham resident, parent and a local business owner here

637
00:41:13,581 --> 00:41:18,520
since 2008. I am so supportive of the children's wealth

638
00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:22,257
building resolution because it advances a simple but

639
00:41:22,257 --> 00:41:27,570
transformative idea. Every child, every child should have

640
00:41:27,595 --> 00:41:31,733
a chance to build assets, understand ownership, and see a

641
00:41:31,733 --> 00:41:35,804
financial future for themselves. Many of us in this

642
00:41:35,804 --> 00:41:39,407
room benefited because our parents or grandparents owned

643
00:41:39,407 --> 00:41:42,810
assets through a home, a retirement account, or

644
00:41:42,810 --> 00:41:46,481
investments in the stock market. They also passed down

645
00:41:46,481 --> 00:41:51,850
to us a habit of saving, investing and owning something

646
00:41:51,850 --> 00:41:56,557
whose value compounds over time. Far too many children in

647
00:41:56,557 --> 00:42:00,940
the US have not had these advantages at the start of

648
00:42:00,940 --> 00:42:03,765
their lives. Roughly half of American families don't own

649
00:42:03,765 --> 00:42:08,102
equities in the stock market. That means millions of children

650
00:42:08,102 --> 00:42:12,706
grow up outside one of the core systems that helps build long

651
00:42:12,706 --> 00:42:17,111
term financial security. The new Invest America federal

652
00:42:17,111 --> 00:42:21,182
program gives us a chance to help close that gap by allowing

653
00:42:21,182 --> 00:42:25,119
eligible children to have a long term investment account in

654
00:42:25,119 --> 00:42:29,919
their own name, beginning with the initial $1,000 federal

655
00:42:30,458 --> 00:42:35,463
contribution. Imagine a child in Durham not just hearing

656
00:42:35,463 --> 00:42:41,680
about saving and investing, but seeing it in their own name,

657
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:44,939
watching it grow over time, learning how it works, and

658
00:42:44,939 --> 00:42:48,809
beginning to believe this is something I can do to imagine

659
00:42:48,809 --> 00:42:51,679
that same child reaching adulthood with something of

660
00:42:51,679 --> 00:42:55,416
their own money they've seen grow and compound, and the

661
00:42:55,416 --> 00:42:59,820
confidence to use it toward education. A trade, starting a

662
00:42:59,820 --> 00:43:05,426
business, or even buying a first home. That's my time. But

663
00:43:05,426 --> 00:43:07,895
we've got an incredible opportunity in Durham, and I

664
00:43:07,895 --> 00:43:09,852
hope everybody supports you. Thank you.

665
00:43:09,852 --> 00:43:12,252
Thank you. Good evening.

666
00:43:19,795 --> 00:43:22,464
Good evening. Good evening. Mayor Pro.

667
00:43:22,464 --> 00:43:26,000
Tem and members of city council. My name is Tabitha

668
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:29,471
Blackwell and I serve as executive director of Book

669
00:43:29,471 --> 00:43:34,143
Harvest. Durham. Our mission is simple. Every child deserves to

670
00:43:34,143 --> 00:43:38,346
grow up surrounded by books, by stories, and by adults who

671
00:43:38,346 --> 00:43:42,150
believe in their potential through programs like Book

672
00:43:42,150 --> 00:43:46,200
Babies. We work with families from the very beginning,

673
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:49,224
putting books in their hands and planting the seeds of their

674
00:43:49,224 --> 00:43:54,229
child's future is full of possibility. That belief is

675
00:43:54,229 --> 00:43:58,320
exactly why we launched Bright Futures and partnerships with

676
00:43:58,320 --> 00:44:03,432
Latino Community Credit Union. We currently manage and support

677
00:44:03,505 --> 00:44:08,177
child savings accounts for 248 babies right here in Durham.

678
00:44:08,177 --> 00:44:12,314
May. You know, because we know that raising a reader and

679
00:44:12,314 --> 00:44:17,385
building a future go hand in hand when a family opens a

680
00:44:17,385 --> 00:44:21,189
child savings account, when they see their baby's name

681
00:44:21,189 --> 00:44:24,460
attached to something that's growing, as mentioned, it

682
00:44:24,460 --> 00:44:28,530
changes how they think about their child's future. Just like

683
00:44:28,530 --> 00:44:33,668
handing a parent a bag of books, we know that this does

684
00:44:33,668 --> 00:44:38,730
the same thing. It says someone believes in your child's

685
00:44:38,730 --> 00:44:42,343
future. Right now, there's real federal money on the table for

686
00:44:42,343 --> 00:44:46,482
Durham families. Thousands of dollars available to eligible

687
00:44:46,482 --> 00:44:51,553
children that too many families don't know exist. This

688
00:44:51,553 --> 00:44:55,557
resolution asks the city to be a trusted messenger and make

689
00:44:55,557 --> 00:45:00,763
sure no family misses out. That costs nothing but outreach and

690
00:45:00,763 --> 00:45:05,300
will book. Harvest is ready to carry the message that we

691
00:45:05,300 --> 00:45:08,771
believe in our children's future. I urge you to vote yes

692
00:45:08,771 --> 00:45:12,371
to the resolution tonight. Thank you.

693
00:45:13,410 --> 00:45:14,843
Thank you. Those are all the speakers I

694
00:45:14,843 --> 00:45:18,514
have this evening. I don't know if council has any comments

695
00:45:18,514 --> 00:45:20,515
that they'd like to provide. Council Member Rist this is

696
00:45:20,515 --> 00:45:22,785
your item. I'm not sure if you wanted to say anything.

697
00:45:22,785 --> 00:45:24,787
Yeah, I'll just say briefly. Yeah. This is so this is, as

698
00:45:24,787 --> 00:45:27,656
you heard the speaker say, this is all about addressing wealth

699
00:45:27,656 --> 00:45:29,925
inequality in this country. We know from the Federal Reserve

700
00:45:29,925 --> 00:45:34,262
that 37% of families lack $400. If they were to have an

701
00:45:34,262 --> 00:45:37,199
emergency with their car or a boiler. So, so many families

702
00:45:37,199 --> 00:45:40,869
lack any tangible wealth. No one here expect. I'm certainly

703
00:45:40,869 --> 00:45:42,804
I don't think anyone in this room expected this would come

704
00:45:42,804 --> 00:45:45,740
from the Trump administration. But the reality is there's

705
00:45:45,740 --> 00:45:48,544
$1,000 on the table for every child born after January 1st,

706
00:45:48,544 --> 00:45:55,150
2025. For four years. And and so so we can either say, oh, we

707
00:45:55,150 --> 00:45:57,180
don't want this, we don't like the name, or we can say, this

708
00:45:57,180 --> 00:45:59,755
is a this is an amazing wealth infusion to every kid in our

709
00:45:59,755 --> 00:46:03,225
community. It's between 2500 and 3000 kids per year that

710
00:46:03,225 --> 00:46:06,428
would qualify for this accounts. It's also for kids

711
00:46:06,428 --> 00:46:11,228
born before January 1st, 2025. There's also a $250 deposit

712
00:46:11,433 --> 00:46:13,568
made possible. As you may have read in the papers by Michael

713
00:46:13,568 --> 00:46:17,772
and Susan Dell. So anywhere from 35 to 36,000 kids in

714
00:46:17,772 --> 00:46:22,310
Durham would qualify for a $250 deposit in a 538 account and

715
00:46:22,310 --> 00:46:26,581
220 500 to 3000 kids per year would qualify for the $1,000

716
00:46:26,581 --> 00:46:29,985
deposit in a 530 a account. All they have to do is claim the

717
00:46:29,985 --> 00:46:33,188
accounts and sign up. So what we're what this resolution

718
00:46:33,188 --> 00:46:35,323
committed to doing is making sure everyone in Durham knows

719
00:46:35,323 --> 00:46:37,926
about this opportunity. As miss Iris said from the partnership

720
00:46:37,926 --> 00:46:40,329
for children, we want all kids in Durham as they grow up with

721
00:46:40,329 --> 00:46:43,198
healthy childhood education and parks to walk in and places to

722
00:46:43,198 --> 00:46:45,467
play, that they also are building their financial

723
00:46:45,467 --> 00:46:48,603
futures. So the resolutions before the council, I will say

724
00:46:48,603 --> 00:46:51,206
there was one request from Council Member Cook to change

725
00:46:51,206 --> 00:46:53,208
the title in here from Trump accounts, which is the

726
00:46:53,208 --> 00:46:56,278
statutory name for these accounts, to 530 a accounts,

727
00:46:56,278 --> 00:46:58,213
which is the name the Treasury calls accounts. And that's

728
00:46:58,213 --> 00:47:01,616
fine, as Shakespeare said, a rose by any other name smells

729
00:47:01,616 --> 00:47:03,752
just sweets out. I don't really care what the name is. I want

730
00:47:03,752 --> 00:47:06,154
to make sure every child in Durham has access claims these

731
00:47:06,154 --> 00:47:08,223
accounts to build wealth for the future, sir.

732
00:47:08,223 --> 00:47:10,892
Thank you. Other than that change.

733
00:47:10,892 --> 00:47:14,492
Colleagues. Go ahead. Council Member Burris

734
00:47:14,963 --> 00:47:19,234
and Council Member Baker. Just to clarify, can we, for

735
00:47:19,234 --> 00:47:21,636
the end of the resolution, can you provide a little bit more,

736
00:47:21,636 --> 00:47:24,373
just a little bit more insight in terms like what exactly the

737
00:47:24,373 --> 00:47:27,976
role of the city staff is? In this resolution? I think

738
00:47:27,976 --> 00:47:30,312
particularly in the city manager's direct city staff to

739
00:47:30,312 --> 00:47:32,780
support efforts on the part of community partners and sure

740
00:47:32,780 --> 00:47:34,649
mentioned clear, frequent that all families are able to open

741
00:47:34,649 --> 00:47:36,317
an account. So I want to know if you could unpack that a

742
00:47:36,317 --> 00:47:41,790
little more for me or whomever. I'm sorry. The question. So the

743
00:47:41,790 --> 00:47:44,258
impact on staff, is that the question?

744
00:47:44,258 --> 00:47:46,661
Yes. But like the role, like what does that look like.

745
00:47:46,661 --> 00:47:50,866
In that? So, so primarily what this does is with the approval

746
00:47:50,866 --> 00:47:53,935
of the council, allows staff whether there's a press

747
00:47:53,935 --> 00:47:56,204
conference or some other event that's happening, allows staff

748
00:47:56,204 --> 00:47:58,406
to participate in that and share information about that.

749
00:47:58,406 --> 00:48:00,608
This is not committing staff to any particular sort of

750
00:48:00,608 --> 00:48:03,344
activities. The Office of Economic and Workforce

751
00:48:03,344 --> 00:48:06,615
Development is 100% behind this resolution wants to be able to

752
00:48:06,615 --> 00:48:09,170
support families not only with workforce training and jobs,

753
00:48:09,170 --> 00:48:11,753
but also wealth building, and so this allows them to continue

754
00:48:11,753 --> 00:48:14,890
working on this, spreading the word about this to our

755
00:48:14,890 --> 00:48:16,891
community through the work they do.

756
00:48:16,891 --> 00:48:19,294
And then for the record, because I am one of those and I

757
00:48:19,294 --> 00:48:22,297
do appreciate your beautiful poet poetry, poetry, whatever

758
00:48:22,297 --> 00:48:26,330
you had going on down there, if we can like remove the

759
00:48:26,330 --> 00:48:28,970
reference to Trump and do as councilmember suggested, I

760
00:48:28,970 --> 00:48:30,972
would be comfortable moving forward in those circumstances

761
00:48:30,972 --> 00:48:33,107
with the commitment for that. Yeah, it's quite all right.

762
00:48:33,107 --> 00:48:37,307
Thank you. Go ahead. Council Member Baker.

763
00:48:38,180 --> 00:48:41,316
I had the exact same question about what exactly we were

764
00:48:41,316 --> 00:48:44,585
directing staff to to do. I had asked Council Member Rist a

765
00:48:44,585 --> 00:48:49,570
little bit about it before and was comforted that it's more

766
00:48:49,570 --> 00:48:53,929
passive if the opportunity arises. Staff can make it

767
00:48:53,929 --> 00:48:58,600
known. So our folks, sign up for your $1,000. Don't lose

768
00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:00,600
your password. Thanks.

769
00:49:02,603 --> 00:49:04,939
I also will say, you know, I actually talked to the state

770
00:49:04,939 --> 00:49:07,742
treasurer at the event over the weekend. This is a brand new.

771
00:49:07,742 --> 00:49:10,344
Not many communities, in fact, nobody else North Carolina is

772
00:49:10,344 --> 00:49:13,215
even thinking about this. So we are way ahead on this, making

773
00:49:13,215 --> 00:49:14,882
sure that our kids are accessing these federal

774
00:49:14,882 --> 00:49:17,850
dollars, significant federal dollars. So this is one more

775
00:49:17,850 --> 00:49:19,374
way, not only for our individual kids who can benefit

776
00:49:19,374 --> 00:49:22,110
from this wealth infusion, but also we are a leader in the

777
00:49:22,110 --> 00:49:24,245
state and folks will look to us. And I think there's gonna

778
00:49:24,245 --> 00:49:26,448
be a lot of cities that will follow us because the dollars.

779
00:49:26,448 --> 00:49:28,717
Are there. Any financial advisor would tell you if

780
00:49:28,717 --> 00:49:30,385
there's free money in the table, you should take the free

781
00:49:30,385 --> 00:49:34,456
money. Thank you. So what I have heard

782
00:49:34,456 --> 00:49:36,324
on the language, was there anything that was referenced

783
00:49:36,324 --> 00:49:38,392
around a Trump account? It would be changed to Children's

784
00:49:38,392 --> 00:49:41,796
Savings Account. Is that changed to 530 a 538?

785
00:49:41,796 --> 00:49:45,600
That's in the resolution. And colleagues were good. Okay. So

786
00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:51,600
other than that change I think our motion for us this evening

787
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:54,209
is to adopt the children's wealth building resolution.

788
00:49:54,209 --> 00:49:56,745
Could I please get a motion? So move.

789
00:49:56,745 --> 00:49:58,880
Can I get. A second? Second.

790
00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:01,683
Thank you. I have a motion, a second. Madam clerk, could you

791
00:50:01,683 --> 00:50:04,830
please open the. Vote?

792
00:50:05,754 --> 00:50:07,622
Could you please close the vote?

793
00:50:07,622 --> 00:50:10,558
Motion passes unanimously. Thank you so much.

794
00:50:10,558 --> 00:50:14,563
Thank you. Colleagues. The next item I have before us

795
00:50:14,563 --> 00:50:17,366
is the Endangered Species Day resolution. I have a few

796
00:50:17,366 --> 00:50:20,435
speakers signed up for that. Again, you will be given two

797
00:50:20,435 --> 00:50:24,372
minutes. I will start with our online speakers first. I have

798
00:50:24,372 --> 00:50:29,378
Miss Pamela Andrews signed up for item number three online.

799
00:50:29,378 --> 00:50:34,778
Madam clerk, I don't know if she's here yet.

800
00:50:37,986 --> 00:50:41,560
Good evening. Can you hear me? Yes, Miss Andrews, good

801
00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:44,325
evening. You have two minutes. Thank you. Thank you to the

802
00:50:44,325 --> 00:50:47,595
Environmental Affairs Board and member Astrid Cook for this

803
00:50:47,595 --> 00:50:50,731
resolution submitted by Council. Nate Baker for helping

804
00:50:50,731 --> 00:50:52,934
coordinate this important resolution. Adoption.

805
00:50:52,934 --> 00:50:55,536
Recognizing the endangered salamander of the North River

806
00:50:55,536 --> 00:50:58,600
is important as it is one of the rare salamanders in the

807
00:50:58,600 --> 00:51:00,608
southeastern United States, which is why it is fairly

808
00:51:00,608 --> 00:51:04,412
protected. The news River water dog needs protection. Yet this

809
00:51:04,412 --> 00:51:07,416
is the this is the area polluted with sediment

810
00:51:07,416 --> 00:51:10,886
pollution week after week, establishing a day dedicated to

811
00:51:10,886 --> 00:51:13,555
endangered species is important. However, there needs

812
00:51:13,555 --> 00:51:16,157
to be a clear protection for all inventoried endangered

813
00:51:16,157 --> 00:51:19,494
species. Durham should require that the natural heritage lands

814
00:51:19,494 --> 00:51:22,364
be protected as open space and should follow the National

815
00:51:22,364 --> 00:51:25,634
Heritage Registry guidelines. When it comes to the 300 foot

816
00:51:25,634 --> 00:51:28,703
riparian buffer for aquatic species like the Carolina

817
00:51:28,703 --> 00:51:31,706
darter fish, no practical alternative applications should

818
00:51:31,706 --> 00:51:34,776
not be allowed in these aquatic buffers. There must be even

819
00:51:34,776 --> 00:51:37,379
more efforts to protect endangered plants and animals

820
00:51:37,379 --> 00:51:41,249
in Durham, the Natural Heritage Land and the TCC. The Triangle

821
00:51:41,249 --> 00:51:44,185
Connectivity Collaborative should both be recognized in

822
00:51:44,185 --> 00:51:47,723
the new UT oh to guarantee the protection on Howards Place,

823
00:51:47,723 --> 00:51:51,259
parcel had two endangered species of concern the Carolina

824
00:51:51,259 --> 00:51:54,596
darter fish is a fish species of special concern, as well as

825
00:51:54,596 --> 00:51:57,666
the dissected tooth wort, which is a protected species of

826
00:51:57,666 --> 00:52:01,690
special concern, a vulnerable plant. Both are within the

827
00:52:01,690 --> 00:52:04,405
natural heritage land, yet it was not recognized. More time a

828
00:52:04,405 --> 00:52:06,608
commitment needs to be spent studying these potentially

829
00:52:06,608 --> 00:52:09,344
endangered species before development is allowed to clear

830
00:52:09,344 --> 00:52:12,146
cut the land. The natural heritage land is important, as

831
00:52:12,146 --> 00:52:14,949
well as the TCC, which helps identify the wildlife

832
00:52:14,949 --> 00:52:18,553
corridors. It is imperative that an environmental stand

833
00:52:18,553 --> 00:52:21,823
needs to be taken in this new Udo. Thank you so much for your

834
00:52:21,823 --> 00:52:24,826
time again. Thank you, Commissioner Imy Council Member

835
00:52:24,826 --> 00:52:27,963
Baker and the Environmental Affairs Board. Thank you so

836
00:52:27,963 --> 00:52:33,234
much for this. Thank you. I have one in

837
00:52:33,234 --> 00:52:38,340
in-person speaker Samantha Kropp for item number three.

838
00:52:45,981 --> 00:52:48,183
Hi, council members, good evening. Thank you for the

839
00:52:48,183 --> 00:52:51,385
opportunity to speak. My name is Samantha Kropp. I work as

840
00:52:51,385 --> 00:52:54,656
the News Riverkeeper with a nonprofit named Sound Rivers.

841
00:52:54,656 --> 00:52:57,458
And I just wanted to say, echoing some of the comments in

842
00:52:57,458 --> 00:53:00,729
the speaker before me, that I do appreciate this resolution

843
00:53:00,729 --> 00:53:03,398
for the Endangered Species Act. It's one of the most important

844
00:53:03,398 --> 00:53:05,933
environmental laws in our nation's history. As a

845
00:53:05,933 --> 00:53:10,400
riverkeeper, my work to protect waterways depends on strong,

846
00:53:10,400 --> 00:53:13,140
enforceable protections for the species and habitats that

847
00:53:13,140 --> 00:53:16,411
sustain them. And here in the news River basin, we are home

848
00:53:16,411 --> 00:53:19,413
to at least ten rare and endangered species. And that

849
00:53:19,413 --> 00:53:22,217
includes, of course, the news River Water Dog, as well as

850
00:53:22,217 --> 00:53:25,686
federally listed species like the Carolina madtom, the dwarf

851
00:53:25,686 --> 00:53:28,622
wedge mussel, the tar River spiny mussel, and the yellow

852
00:53:28,622 --> 00:53:31,959
lance. Some of these species are found nowhere else in the

853
00:53:31,959 --> 00:53:35,897
world, so if we lose them here, we lose them forever. These

854
00:53:35,897 --> 00:53:39,234
species aren't just rare, but they are essential. They help

855
00:53:39,234 --> 00:53:42,170
maintain water quality, support habitat, and sustain the

856
00:53:42,170 --> 00:53:45,907
ecosystems our communities rely on. But today, these species

857
00:53:45,907 --> 00:53:49,110
face growing threats from drought, rapid development, and

858
00:53:49,110 --> 00:53:52,980
polluted stormwater runoff. This resolution is a meaningful

859
00:53:52,980 --> 00:53:56,451
step, but Durham's current development code still fails to

860
00:53:56,451 --> 00:54:00,188
require protections for endangered species. Habitat. In

861
00:54:00,188 --> 00:54:04,580
practice, that gap has allowed the city to continue approving

862
00:54:04,580 --> 00:54:08,396
projects that directly impact sensitive areas, despite clear

863
00:54:08,396 --> 00:54:11,666
evidence of ecological risk in places like the Lick Creek

864
00:54:11,666 --> 00:54:15,136
bottomlands, a designated natural heritage area, the city

865
00:54:15,136 --> 00:54:18,873
has permitted extensive development projects, such as

866
00:54:18,873 --> 00:54:22,877
the 86 acre Howard's Place development, have been approved

867
00:54:22,877 --> 00:54:25,212
in known endangered species habitat, and even now,

868
00:54:25,212 --> 00:54:28,416
proposals are under review that would impact over 100,000ft of

869
00:54:28,416 --> 00:54:31,285
stream habitat in that development area. These

870
00:54:31,285 --> 00:54:34,688
decisions point to a troubling disconnect between Durham's

871
00:54:34,688 --> 00:54:37,559
stated environmental values and its actual development

872
00:54:37,559 --> 00:54:40,762
practices. So if Durham is serious about protecting

873
00:54:40,762 --> 00:54:43,498
endangered species, it must move beyond symbolic

874
00:54:43,498 --> 00:54:46,701
recognition. The city should require that mapped natural

875
00:54:46,701 --> 00:54:50,380
heritage areas are preserved. This is a good first step.

876
00:54:50,380 --> 00:54:51,840
Please align policy with practice.

877
00:54:51,840 --> 00:54:54,240
Thank you. Thank you.

878
00:55:06,187 --> 00:55:12,326
Those are all the speakers I have signed up for. That item.

879
00:55:12,326 --> 00:55:15,397
Council Member Baker, this is your item. Did you want to say

880
00:55:15,397 --> 00:55:20,797
anything on it? Sure. Was there a third speaker?

881
00:55:22,737 --> 00:55:25,139
I don't. Send a know.

882
00:55:25,139 --> 00:55:27,208
She signed up for number four. Is what we've been. number

883
00:55:27,208 --> 00:55:30,808
four. Okay. Colleagues, this is a

884
00:55:30,897 --> 00:55:33,834
resolution. I'm not going to read it all out. I encourage

885
00:55:33,834 --> 00:55:38,839
folks to to check it out. The wording is is great. It's a

886
00:55:38,839 --> 00:55:43,176
resolution spearheaded actually by the mayor of Boone, Dalton

887
00:55:43,176 --> 00:55:47,447
George, who also does lobbying in Washington. The good, the

888
00:55:47,447 --> 00:55:53,186
good lobbying, the rare good lobbying. This is to designate

889
00:55:53,186 --> 00:55:57,590
May, May 15th, 2026 as Endangered Species Day. Part of

890
00:55:57,590 --> 00:56:00,600
the reason behind this we are not the only municipality and

891
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:02,863
local government in North Carolina to do this is that

892
00:56:02,863 --> 00:56:06,660
lobbyists actually use the communities that are doing

893
00:56:06,660 --> 00:56:10,700
this. We they add us to a number of communities that have

894
00:56:10,700 --> 00:56:13,720
passed something like this, and they take that to Washington.

895
00:56:13,720 --> 00:56:18,345
So we are we are feeding into a larger advocacy system to

896
00:56:18,345 --> 00:56:21,881
support the Endangered Species Act. And it was actually the

897
00:56:21,881 --> 00:56:27,281
members of the Environmental Affairs Board who drafted this

898
00:56:27,888 --> 00:56:33,288
specific language. You will also find in attachments an

899
00:56:33,894 --> 00:56:36,830
official letter of support from the Land Use and Planning

900
00:56:36,830 --> 00:56:39,699
Subcommittee of the Environmental Affairs Board,

901
00:56:39,699 --> 00:56:44,837
who also commonly weigh in on development review cases,

902
00:56:44,837 --> 00:56:49,309
rezoning cases and annexation cases in Durham. So many thanks

903
00:56:49,309 --> 00:56:54,848
to them. To Astrid, to David and the folks on EAB who put

904
00:56:54,848 --> 00:56:59,648
this together. Thank you. Anyone else have any

905
00:57:00,987 --> 00:57:03,924
comments? Okay. And so the motion before us is to adopt

906
00:57:03,924 --> 00:57:06,259
the Endangered Species Day resolution. Could I please get

907
00:57:06,259 --> 00:57:07,994
a motion. To move?

908
00:57:07,994 --> 00:57:13,994
Second motion a second. Madam clerk, please open the vote.

909
00:57:17,604 --> 00:57:21,804
Please close the vote. Motion passes unanimously.

910
00:57:23,676 --> 00:57:30,876
Thank you. The next items. I wonder. Do I have anyone? I'm

911
00:57:53,974 --> 00:57:56,843
going to move the order around a little bit. I want to take up

912
00:57:56,843 --> 00:58:00,714
item. We have a lot of speakers for item number four. Number 19

913
00:58:00,714 --> 00:58:02,915
is pretty straightforward and we don't have a lot of speaker

914
00:58:02,915 --> 00:58:05,852
actually, any speakers signed up for that. So I'm going to do

915
00:58:05,852 --> 00:58:09,452
a agenda item number 19. First up.

916
00:58:10,523 --> 00:58:12,523
19. Thank you.

917
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:23,600
I don't see them. Do you.

918
00:58:26,720 --> 00:58:28,808
Sir, have you signed up with the clerk to speak?

919
00:58:28,808 --> 00:58:31,208
Yes. Okay. Thank you.

920
00:58:48,940 --> 00:58:50,296
Sir, when it's your time, I'm going to call you up in just a

921
00:58:50,296 --> 00:58:53,299
second. I'm going to let staff do their part first. Thank you.

922
00:58:53,299 --> 00:58:55,340
Good evening. Good evening.

923
00:58:55,340 --> 00:58:58,504
Mayor Pro Tem, members of council manager Ferguson. Madam

924
00:58:58,504 --> 00:59:01,307
attorney, my name is Ryan Smith. I'm director of the City

925
00:59:01,307 --> 00:59:04,443
of Durham's community safety department. The purpose of this

926
00:59:04,443 --> 00:59:07,460
public hearing is to receive resident comments regarding the

927
00:59:07,460 --> 00:59:10,249
draft proposed home ARP amendment to the fiscal year

928
00:59:10,249 --> 00:59:15,188
2021 Annual Action Plan and home ARP Allocation Plan. The

929
00:59:15,188 --> 00:59:17,791
initial home ARP allocation plan that the City of Durham

930
00:59:17,791 --> 00:59:19,859
submitted to the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban

931
00:59:19,859 --> 00:59:22,859
Development in 2023, committed $4,352,661 toward the

932
00:59:26,666 --> 00:59:30,336
development of approximately 25 affordable rental housing units

933
00:59:30,336 --> 00:59:33,740
intended to serve qualifying populations. The City of

934
00:59:33,740 --> 00:59:36,609
Durham, substantial amendment to the home Allocation Plan

935
00:59:36,609 --> 00:59:40,212
revises the previously approved use of home ARP funds by

936
00:59:40,212 --> 00:59:42,615
reallocating funding from the development of affordable

937
00:59:42,615 --> 00:59:45,885
rental housing to the provision of supportive services designed

938
00:59:45,885 --> 00:59:48,822
to assist people experiencing homelessness, and accessing and

939
00:59:48,822 --> 00:59:51,557
maintaining housing. Specifically, when I say

940
00:59:51,557 --> 00:59:55,228
supportive services, I mean providing financial assistance

941
00:59:55,228 --> 00:59:57,964
in the form of rent assistance, paying for arrears and other

942
00:59:57,964 --> 01:00:01,300
things that compare clear pathways so that people who are

943
01:00:01,300 --> 01:00:05,304
experiencing homelessness today can access units as well as

944
01:00:05,304 --> 01:00:07,841
case management, so that when people enter, units were able

945
01:00:07,841 --> 01:00:11,111
to provide the support they need to remain in units. This

946
01:00:11,111 --> 01:00:13,513
public hearing is a requirement to submit a substantial

947
01:00:13,513 --> 01:00:16,490
amendment to HUD. The proposed substantial amendment to the

948
01:00:16,490 --> 01:00:18,585
home ARP allocation plan has been available for public

949
01:00:18,585 --> 01:00:23,123
review since April 7th, 2026, and will close on May 6th.

950
01:00:23,123 --> 01:00:25,125
Notice of this meeting was properly advertised in the

951
01:00:25,125 --> 01:00:28,194
Herald Sun and Carson newspapers, as well as via the

952
01:00:28,194 --> 01:00:32,131
City of Durham's website. The Community Safety Department,

953
01:00:32,131 --> 01:00:34,400
which serves as the lead agency for the Durham Continuum of

954
01:00:34,400 --> 01:00:36,736
Care, led a strategic planning process. As you all are aware,

955
01:00:36,736 --> 01:00:40,406
from July through January of this year that focused on

956
01:00:40,406 --> 01:00:43,276
developing a unified coalition and a credible path toward

957
01:00:43,276 --> 01:00:46,413
making homelessness rare and brief in Durham, their

958
01:00:46,413 --> 01:00:48,748
strategic framework was developed in collaboration with

959
01:00:48,748 --> 01:00:51,150
homeless service providers, health system partners,

960
01:00:51,150 --> 01:00:53,753
government agencies and people with current lived experience

961
01:00:53,753 --> 01:00:56,690
of homelessness in Durham and many others. These stakeholders

962
01:00:56,690 --> 01:00:59,826
met together to assess our needs, our current system's

963
01:00:59,826 --> 01:01:03,362
capacity and what it would take to reduce homelessness in

964
01:01:03,362 --> 01:01:06,565
Durham so that it's truly rare and brief. After completion of

965
01:01:06,565 --> 01:01:09,350
this process, the Community Safety Department, in

966
01:01:09,350 --> 01:01:11,438
partnership with Housing and Neighborhood Services,

967
01:01:11,438 --> 01:01:13,973
determined that reallocating the funds to supportive

968
01:01:13,973 --> 01:01:16,709
services will have a significantly greater and more

969
01:01:16,709 --> 01:01:20,113
immediate impact on households who are currently experiencing,

970
01:01:20,113 --> 01:01:23,316
or at imminent risk of experiencing homelessness.

971
01:01:23,316 --> 01:01:25,718
Reallocating these funds will enable the City of Durham to

972
01:01:25,718 --> 01:01:28,388
serve hundreds of households experiencing or at risk of

973
01:01:28,388 --> 01:01:31,257
homelessness starting next year, provide immediate and

974
01:01:31,257 --> 01:01:33,793
critical assistance, including housing stabilization, case

975
01:01:33,793 --> 01:01:36,262
management and crisis intervention. Strengthen the

976
01:01:36,262 --> 01:01:39,883
community's capacity to address homelessness and rapidly return

977
01:01:39,883 --> 01:01:42,353
individuals and families to stable housing, including

978
01:01:42,353 --> 01:01:45,756
through the provision of rental assistance. Increased system

979
01:01:45,756 --> 01:01:48,492
wide flexibility to respond effectively to evolving needs,

980
01:01:48,492 --> 01:01:51,896
and, importantly, advance our year one goals to reduce the

981
01:01:51,896 --> 01:01:54,832
number of people who are experiencing unsheltered

982
01:01:54,832 --> 01:01:58,169
homelessness by 30%. Youth who are experiencing homelessness

983
01:01:58,169 --> 01:02:01,571
by 50%, and veterans who are experiencing homelessness by

984
01:02:01,571 --> 01:02:05,509
30%. By next summer. The strategic reallocation aligns

985
01:02:05,509 --> 01:02:07,645
with the identified service gaps and priorities within the

986
01:02:07,645 --> 01:02:10,647
local homeless response system, and ensures that home ARP funds

987
01:02:10,647 --> 01:02:13,317
are deployed in a manner that maximizes impact and

988
01:02:13,317 --> 01:02:16,520
timeliness. The City Council is being asked to approve the

989
01:02:16,520 --> 01:02:18,922
draft proposed home HRP amendment for submission to

990
01:02:18,922 --> 01:02:21,792
HUD, and to authorize the City Manager to execute all

991
01:02:21,792 --> 01:02:24,995
administrative requirements and contractual documents for the

992
01:02:24,995 --> 01:02:29,133
implementation of the amended FY 2021 Annual Action Plan and

993
01:02:29,133 --> 01:02:32,336
Home ARP Allocation Plan to reallocate funding to support

994
01:02:32,336 --> 01:02:35,272
our services. Comments made during this public hearing and

995
01:02:35,272 --> 01:02:38,142
written comments received from residents will be included with

996
01:02:38,142 --> 01:02:41,780
the submission of the home ARP Allocation Plan. Substantial

997
01:02:41,780 --> 01:02:43,614
amendment to the US Department of Housing and Urban

998
01:02:43,614 --> 01:02:48,414
Development. Thank you. Thank you. You've heard the

999
01:02:49,820 --> 01:02:52,823
staff report. I'll now declare this public hearing open first

1000
01:02:52,823 --> 01:02:58,429
to council colleagues. Have any questions or comments? Okay. If

1001
01:02:58,429 --> 01:03:03,501
you have signed up to speak, could you over here, sir, on

1002
01:03:03,501 --> 01:03:08,390
this side. Thank you. And then just state your name and you

1003
01:03:08,390 --> 01:03:12,976
will have two minutes. We have two people speaking. We

1004
01:03:12,976 --> 01:03:16,113
have Karen Miles. Okay. And if you have not

1005
01:03:16,113 --> 01:03:18,916
registered to speak during. Okay. Thank you. Just make sure

1006
01:03:18,916 --> 01:03:20,718
you fill out a card if you haven't.

1007
01:03:20,718 --> 01:03:24,455
Okay? Okay. Okay. Good evening, city Council.

1008
01:03:24,455 --> 01:03:28,458
Good evening. Durham. I am the Reverend Chris Rivers. I'm here

1009
01:03:28,458 --> 01:03:33,530
advocating against the approval of this reallocation of funds.

1010
01:03:33,530 --> 01:03:37,601
As I understand the context is, is that when the RFP was

1011
01:03:37,601 --> 01:03:41,472
issued, there were really no solutions at that time. I'm not

1012
01:03:41,472 --> 01:03:44,475
here just to advocate that we don't approve. But also I'm

1013
01:03:44,475 --> 01:03:48,545
here proposing a solution. We can, in fact, satisfy this need

1014
01:03:48,545 --> 01:03:52,483
to provide 25 affordable houses to the City of Durham at the

1015
01:03:52,483 --> 01:03:57,888
cost allocated to those in the proposal. Moving away from

1016
01:03:57,888 --> 01:04:02,492
allocated. Reallocating these funds puts us out of alignment

1017
01:04:02,492 --> 01:04:05,280
with housing, urban development. They've already

1018
01:04:05,280 --> 01:04:08,310
set their priorities, and their priorities are to put actual

1019
01:04:08,310 --> 01:04:11,701
buildings on the ground. Our proposal does that.

1020
01:04:11,701 --> 01:04:16,507
Reallocating these funds also does not offer the city a

1021
01:04:16,507 --> 01:04:19,309
return on the investment. With the program that we're going to

1022
01:04:19,309 --> 01:04:22,179
put forth and that we're putting forth, it allows for

1023
01:04:22,179 --> 01:04:24,781
the city council to actually get a return on this in

1024
01:04:24,781 --> 01:04:28,985
investments, leaving the city in a surplus of about $1.2

1025
01:04:28,985 --> 01:04:33,123
million based on what our current situation is right now,

1026
01:04:33,123 --> 01:04:36,260
we are in the state of homelessness and hopelessness.

1027
01:04:36,260 --> 01:04:40,664
People can't see a way to afford housing here in Durham.

1028
01:04:40,664 --> 01:04:45,200
We have solved that problem. We can fulfill this order. We have

1029
01:04:45,200 --> 01:04:48,739
the proposed order and we have the proposal here for us. So

1030
01:04:48,739 --> 01:04:54,812
today we're just simply here to ask the council to vote no and

1031
01:04:54,812 --> 01:05:00,283
reassigning those funds and and asking that the council do all

1032
01:05:00,283 --> 01:05:03,821
the administrative processes to actually administer us doing

1033
01:05:03,821 --> 01:05:08,210
the 25 affordable housing units in this community.

1034
01:05:08,959 --> 01:05:13,630
Thank you. Good evening. My name is Karen Mangum and I am a

1035
01:05:13,630 --> 01:05:16,233
licensed real estate broker. And I've worked in the Durham

1036
01:05:16,233 --> 01:05:20,437
community for about the last three decades. I have a very

1037
01:05:20,437 --> 01:05:27,370
strong desire to see affordable housing as well as a strong

1038
01:05:27,177 --> 01:05:30,380
stand to help reduce homelessness, because we deeply

1039
01:05:30,380 --> 01:05:34,851
believe the solution to homelessness is is obviously

1040
01:05:34,851 --> 01:05:38,922
housing. And then building all those resources and support

1041
01:05:38,922 --> 01:05:42,526
around that to be sure that they are able to sustain. And

1042
01:05:42,526 --> 01:05:46,730
the longevity is there for these families. It is been a

1043
01:05:46,730 --> 01:05:51,000
very critical situation for a very long time. So we really

1044
01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:54,271
are committed to bringing those solutions. As Chris mentioned,

1045
01:05:54,271 --> 01:05:59,143
to help solve this very serious epidemic. And it is a national

1046
01:05:59,143 --> 01:06:01,879
problem. Of course, we know it's not just local to Durham.

1047
01:06:01,879 --> 01:06:04,815
When we talk about solutions for homelessness as well as

1048
01:06:04,815 --> 01:06:09,819
affordability. Durham is a city of innovation. We all know that

1049
01:06:09,819 --> 01:06:13,490
in Durham we need to use that ingenuity. We have to come up

1050
01:06:13,490 --> 01:06:16,760
with very individual, unique solutions for Durham residents.

1051
01:06:16,760 --> 01:06:19,896
Durham is a very unique city, although it's great to look at

1052
01:06:19,896 --> 01:06:22,499
things that other places have done, it's very important to

1053
01:06:22,499 --> 01:06:25,769
look at what's going on here locally and what the needs are

1054
01:06:25,769 --> 01:06:30,373
of Durham residents. So as we gather some information to

1055
01:06:30,373 --> 01:06:33,377
support some of the things that we want you to understand, 17

1056
01:06:33,377 --> 01:06:39,377
to 44% more, these homes that TBG can offer are 17 to 44%

1057
01:06:39,516 --> 01:06:44,321
more affordable than other median sales prices. And with

1058
01:06:44,321 --> 01:06:47,323
the with the the city partnering with us, we would

1059
01:06:47,323 --> 01:06:50,994
create 100 jobs. There would be land improvement estimate at

1060
01:06:50,994 --> 01:06:54,331
1.2 million to local vendors and suppliers. So there will be

1061
01:06:54,331 --> 01:06:57,735
tremendous benefit, not just to the homeowners but also to the

1062
01:06:57,735 --> 01:07:03,674
local economy here in Durham. So we really we appreciate the

1063
01:07:03,674 --> 01:07:06,743
opportunity to address the council and all those today

1064
01:07:06,743 --> 01:07:09,746
present. Just to point out again, this,

1065
01:07:09,746 --> 01:07:12,416
this, this program has a significant economic impact.

1066
01:07:12,416 --> 01:07:15,416
Over 100 jobs. created land improvement.

1067
01:07:15,419 --> 01:07:17,821
Your time. Thank you so much. Thank you. Good evening.

1068
01:07:17,821 --> 01:07:23,221
Thank you. Thank you. Are there any other folks

1069
01:07:24,940 --> 01:07:26,697
registered? Sir, can you just pass that to the city clerk,

1070
01:07:26,697 --> 01:07:28,697
please? Thank you.

1071
01:07:29,990 --> 01:07:32,703
Thank you so much. Is there anyone else who has not already

1072
01:07:32,703 --> 01:07:34,838
registered who would like to speak on this public hearing

1073
01:07:34,838 --> 01:07:39,176
item? You can go ahead and come up and then sign up after you

1074
01:07:39,176 --> 01:07:42,579
speak. Anyone else? Okay, since there's no one else who wishes

1075
01:07:42,579 --> 01:07:46,983
to speak on this item, let the record. Let the record reflect

1076
01:07:46,983 --> 01:07:49,132
that no one else has signed up and the public hearing is

1077
01:07:49,132 --> 01:07:52,669
closed. And back before the council Council members, does

1078
01:07:52,669 --> 01:07:58,690
anyone have any questions, comments? On this item? No.

1079
01:08:01,345 --> 01:08:06,750
Okay, so at this point I just need a motion. First motion is

1080
01:08:06,750 --> 01:08:11,622
to adopt an ordinance annex. Excuse me. Wrong one. To we to

1081
01:08:11,622 --> 01:08:15,492
approve the draft proposed home ARP amendment for submission to

1082
01:08:15,492 --> 01:08:18,829
the US Department of Housing and Urban Development, HUD.

1083
01:08:18,829 --> 01:08:20,829
So moved. Second.

1084
01:08:21,632 --> 01:08:28,232
Madam Clerk, could you please open the vote? Could you please

1085
01:08:34,845 --> 01:08:39,450
close the vote? I don't know. Not.

1086
01:08:47,991 --> 01:08:50,994
There it is. Motion passes unanimously.

1087
01:08:50,994 --> 01:08:54,531
Thank you. The next motion is to authorize

1088
01:08:54,531 --> 01:08:57,670
the city manager to execute all administrative requirements and

1089
01:08:57,670 --> 01:08:59,603
contractual documents for the implementation of the amended

1090
01:08:59,603 --> 01:09:04,808
FY 2021 Annual Action Plan and home ARP Allocation Plan to

1091
01:09:04,808 --> 01:09:06,677
reallocate funding to supportive services to

1092
01:09:06,677 --> 01:09:10,147
qualified populations to include populations defined in

1093
01:09:10,147 --> 01:09:12,147
24 CFR 91.5. So moved.

1094
01:09:14,351 --> 01:09:17,687
Can I get a second? Second? Thank you, madam Clerk, could

1095
01:09:17,687 --> 01:09:20,687
you please open the. Vote?

1096
01:09:23,827 --> 01:09:27,427
Could you please close. The vote?

1097
01:09:28,765 --> 01:09:31,765
Motion passes unanimously. Thank you.

1098
01:09:36,305 --> 01:09:39,108
Mr. mayor, good to see you. Would you like me to pass the

1099
01:09:39,108 --> 01:09:43,113
gavel back? Not yet. Okay. I'll see you

1100
01:09:43,113 --> 01:09:47,913
guys to. I was following on YouTube, but

1101
01:09:48,185 --> 01:09:49,719
I need to. Catch up. Okay? Okay.

1102
01:09:49,719 --> 01:09:53,523
Thank you. The next item that we'll do is our item number

1103
01:09:53,523 --> 01:09:59,196
four, which is the we. we the agenda item number 28 allowed

1104
01:09:59,196 --> 01:10:03,934
us to be able to hold to take up item number four. Several

1105
01:10:03,934 --> 01:10:08,710
folks signed up for item 28 to speak. I'm going to move you to

1106
01:10:08,710 --> 01:10:13,100
item four to speak. So you're going to get your time. We have

1107
01:10:13,100 --> 01:10:18,614
lots of speakers. I am going to limit everyone to one minute.

1108
01:10:18,614 --> 01:10:23,414
This. And I do want to Council member.

1109
01:10:24,887 --> 01:10:29,426
One minute. What's up? I am going to limit everyone to

1110
01:10:29,426 --> 01:10:33,497
one minute. We have, I think 40 speakers. So that's 40 minutes.

1111
01:10:33,497 --> 01:10:35,632
If I've counted correctly. I think we have 40 speakers

1112
01:10:35,632 --> 01:10:38,568
between online and in person. We have several public

1113
01:10:38,568 --> 01:10:41,638
hearings. This public hearing items this evening. I said that

1114
01:10:41,638 --> 01:10:45,709
at the beginning of the meeting, I do want to allow

1115
01:10:45,709 --> 01:10:48,712
Madam Attorney or Council Member Baker before we start

1116
01:10:48,712 --> 01:10:51,314
calling up speakers to speak on this item a little bit, if

1117
01:10:51,314 --> 01:10:54,250
that's possible. And I don't know which one of you is going

1118
01:10:54,250 --> 01:11:01,450
to start Council Member Baker, I'm going to pass it to you.

1119
01:11:03,526 --> 01:11:09,526
I, I'm going to speak on this following public comment.

1120
01:11:10,400 --> 01:11:13,670
Okay. And so folks, just. so folks are understanding that

1121
01:11:13,670 --> 01:11:19,670
the, the. Ordinance before us is for a temporary moratorium.

1122
01:11:20,811 --> 01:11:23,814
Some of the parameters have changed.

1123
01:11:23,814 --> 01:11:25,215
Sure. Yeah. I'll explain. What I explain.

1124
01:11:25,215 --> 01:11:27,751
Yeah I can I can explain that. Okay. Thank you.

1125
01:11:27,751 --> 01:11:31,754
A lot of folks came here tonight to speak on a 24 month

1126
01:11:31,754 --> 01:11:35,425
moratorium. That was the draft that had been presented, had

1127
01:11:35,425 --> 01:11:40,497
been reviewed by legal and the planning department, and was

1128
01:11:40,497 --> 01:11:47,970
moving forward for the vote. As of Friday. There are provisions

1129
01:11:47,304 --> 01:11:51,641
in the Unified Development Ordinance that these our own

1130
01:11:51,641 --> 01:11:55,511
regulations that have never been used because we've never

1131
01:11:55,511 --> 01:12:01,511
done a development moratorium that limits the length of the

1132
01:12:01,985 --> 01:12:07,924
maximum length of a development moratorium in our city to be 60

1133
01:12:07,924 --> 01:12:12,195
days without a planning Commission review. So what is

1134
01:12:12,195 --> 01:12:18,680
before us tonight is a 60 day moratorium, which is the first

1135
01:12:18,680 --> 01:12:22,806
step. And there can be there can be more to come from that.

1136
01:12:22,806 --> 01:12:29,479
And that's all I'll say now. I'll have more to say later.

1137
01:12:29,479 --> 01:12:31,748
Thank you. Are you comfortable if I

1138
01:12:31,748 --> 01:12:34,170
continue to share part of that? So folks understand that, that

1139
01:12:34,170 --> 01:12:36,153
their minute tonight is not their only opportunity to

1140
01:12:36,153 --> 01:12:37,954
comment on this because of what's going to happen

1141
01:12:37,954 --> 01:12:42,425
subsequently. Okay. So first there will be a planning. We do

1142
01:12:42,425 --> 01:12:46,296
not take questions or comments from the crowd. To us, it would

1143
01:12:46,296 --> 01:12:52,350
create chaos. Thank you. This will be your first opportunity

1144
01:12:52,350 --> 01:12:55,238
to speak. We are in process of working with the county. We

1145
01:12:55,238 --> 01:12:57,974
have a unified planning department. So city and county,

1146
01:12:57,974 --> 01:13:00,844
it is important that we move in alignment with our county

1147
01:13:00,844 --> 01:13:05,648
colleagues because it can cause issues for us. Since we have a

1148
01:13:05,648 --> 01:13:09,520
merged planning department. Additionally, this will have to

1149
01:13:09,520 --> 01:13:11,454
come before Planning Commission. Planning Commission

1150
01:13:11,454 --> 01:13:16,726
also allows you to speak on an item. This will also have to

1151
01:13:16,726 --> 01:13:20,263
come back to council down the road, so you will have another

1152
01:13:20,263 --> 01:13:23,266
opportunity to speak. So if you choose and you will have an

1153
01:13:23,266 --> 01:13:26,202
opportunity to speak in front of your county commissioners.

1154
01:13:26,202 --> 01:13:30,473
So with as many people as a registered, we appreciate your

1155
01:13:30,473 --> 01:13:32,475
all of us are very concerned about this item. This is

1156
01:13:32,475 --> 01:13:35,110
getting national attention. Please know that your one

1157
01:13:35,110 --> 01:13:38,150
minute tonight is not going to be your only opportunity to

1158
01:13:38,150 --> 01:13:41,350
speak. If you choose, there will be at least three other

1159
01:13:41,350 --> 01:13:44,354
public hearings that you will be able to register and speak

1160
01:13:44,354 --> 01:13:47,490
at. I'm just sharing that because I heard some folks in

1161
01:13:47,490 --> 01:13:49,559
the crowd being upset, and I wanted folks to really

1162
01:13:49,559 --> 01:13:52,896
understand the process that is before us this evening. So we

1163
01:13:52,896 --> 01:13:56,166
are going to stick to the one minute. Please don't jeer at

1164
01:13:56,166 --> 01:14:00,649
us. I'm going to call folks. I'm going to start with online

1165
01:14:00,649 --> 01:14:04,786
speakers, and I will let the folks who signed up for 28. I'm

1166
01:14:04,786 --> 01:14:07,656
just going to shift you to four automatically. You do not need

1167
01:14:07,656 --> 01:14:11,326
to reregister or any thing. Thank you so much for your

1168
01:14:11,326 --> 01:14:14,129
patience, Madam Clerk. I'm going to start with online

1169
01:14:14,129 --> 01:14:19,529
speakers. As soon as I can find my piece.

1170
01:14:19,801 --> 01:14:24,601
Of paper. The first person I have under

1171
01:14:25,140 --> 01:14:29,278
online speakers is Cassandra row or row.

1172
01:14:29,278 --> 01:14:31,813
Oh, Cassandra row. Hi. Can you hear me?

1173
01:14:31,813 --> 01:14:34,150
Thank you. One more quick. I need to open the public

1174
01:14:34,150 --> 01:14:36,885
hearing. Thank you, Madam Attorney. Let me declare this

1175
01:14:36,885 --> 01:14:40,422
public hearing. Open. First speaker, that we have is

1176
01:14:40,422 --> 01:14:43,625
Cassandra. Romero. Thank you. Good evening. You have one

1177
01:14:43,625 --> 01:14:46,628
minute. Hi. Thank you. Yes, I am a

1178
01:14:46,628 --> 01:14:50,565
Durham resident. I work at a domestic violence organization.

1179
01:14:50,565 --> 01:14:54,703
I organized with mothers for Cease, and I'm also an artist

1180
01:14:54,703 --> 01:14:59,410
and a mother. And as a mom to a young child, I'm constantly

1181
01:14:59,410 --> 01:15:02,577
thinking about who I'm raising him to be. And one of the

1182
01:15:02,577 --> 01:15:05,380
things that I hope to impart to him is that he has the

1183
01:15:05,380 --> 01:15:08,650
autonomy, the power, and the responsibility to think before

1184
01:15:08,650 --> 01:15:12,854
he takes action, especially when those actions risk harm to

1185
01:15:12,854 --> 01:15:15,724
himself and other people and his community and the

1186
01:15:15,724 --> 01:15:19,261
environment. And this is a lesson he'll have to learn over

1187
01:15:19,261 --> 01:15:22,264
and over again, because it's popular, it's tempting to do

1188
01:15:22,264 --> 01:15:25,734
it's popular or convenient, and there are billionaires and

1189
01:15:25,734 --> 01:15:29,404
politicians crafting propaganda that would lead them to believe

1190
01:15:29,404 --> 01:15:32,474
that certain things are inevitable, and that his only

1191
01:15:32,474 --> 01:15:36,611
choice is to get on board or be left behind. And I'm not the

1192
01:15:36,611 --> 01:15:40,348
only one who is responsible for teaching my son these lessons.

1193
01:15:40,348 --> 01:15:45,420
And our children these lessons. And and I think that we have a

1194
01:15:45,420 --> 01:15:49,490
unique opportunity here. And there is plenty of propaganda

1195
01:15:49,490 --> 01:15:50,759
that would have us believe that.

1196
01:15:50,759 --> 01:15:56,759
AI thank you. Next up, I have Zack Orton or

1197
01:15:56,965 --> 01:16:02,365
Orton online. Madam clerk, see you there. Good evening.

1198
01:16:05,307 --> 01:16:08,109
Can you hear me? Yes we can. Good evening. You

1199
01:16:08,109 --> 01:16:11,446
have one minute. Okay, thanks. I had a amazing

1200
01:16:11,446 --> 01:16:13,915
speech planned, but I'm gonna have to wing it a little bit.

1201
01:16:13,915 --> 01:16:16,717
Basically, I just wanted to speak in support of, like, the

1202
01:16:16,717 --> 01:16:20,922
strongest possible data center moratorium. Ideally, at least

1203
01:16:20,922 --> 01:16:24,926
24 months. These data centers have a ton of drawbacks for the

1204
01:16:24,926 --> 01:16:27,395
communities that they're built in. They use an enormous amount

1205
01:16:27,395 --> 01:16:32,334
of energy. They're bad for the environment. They raise like

1206
01:16:32,334 --> 01:16:35,804
utility costs at a time when folks are struggling to afford

1207
01:16:35,804 --> 01:16:42,544
rent and groceries. And this is all so that AI companies can

1208
01:16:42,544 --> 01:16:45,546
replace our jobs with AI, so that investors and billionaires

1209
01:16:45,546 --> 01:16:49,684
can become even wealthier. And I also just want to say that if

1210
01:16:49,684 --> 01:16:53,888
this is like an issue that you care about, you should try to

1211
01:16:53,888 --> 01:16:56,558
get organized in your community and like talk to your friends

1212
01:16:56,558 --> 01:17:00,829
and family, reach out to organizations like triangle

1213
01:17:00,829 --> 01:17:06,829
DSA. That's a group I'm with labor unions. Day 150. Tenant

1214
01:17:07,436 --> 01:17:11,636
unions like tribal tenant union. Yeah. Thanks.

1215
01:17:11,839 --> 01:17:15,309
Thank you so much. So now those are the only speakers I have

1216
01:17:15,309 --> 01:17:19,915
online. I'm going to call folks up in groups of five. So when

1217
01:17:19,915 --> 01:17:23,500
you hear your name, please line up over here. And then you'll

1218
01:17:23,500 --> 01:17:28,990
have one minute. I have Miss Mimi Kessler. Sean Caple,

1219
01:17:28,990 --> 01:17:34,390
Leslie. Sandra, Latasha or Letitia Gibson. And then Damien

1220
01:17:35,196 --> 01:17:40,596
GU. Those were the first five speakers I have.

1221
01:17:45,407 --> 01:17:49,770
Andrew said that she's. I've never cheated on my.

1222
01:17:49,770 --> 01:17:53,877
She signed up in person. And Andrew's. Oh.

1223
01:17:54,482 --> 01:17:56,818
I just have her for. Number three.

1224
01:17:56,818 --> 01:18:04,180
Okay. Good evening. Thank you for being with us. You have one

1225
01:18:05,960 --> 01:18:08,960
minute. Good evening. My name is Mimi

1226
01:18:08,960 --> 01:18:14,569
Kessler. I am for a moratorium, but 60 days is window dressing.

1227
01:18:14,569 --> 01:18:19,640
In reality, Durham does not need this to be a home of a

1228
01:18:19,640 --> 01:18:23,311
data center. With all of its impacts on environment and

1229
01:18:23,311 --> 01:18:27,716
excessive water usage. We don't need the economic stimulus as

1230
01:18:27,716 --> 01:18:31,720
it is. We are struggling to fill the vacant jobs in Durham

1231
01:18:31,720 --> 01:18:36,124
and housing for people moving here. The moratorium should be

1232
01:18:36,124 --> 01:18:41,930
for a much longer period of time. In fact, forever.

1233
01:18:41,930 --> 01:18:49,130
Thank you. And we're going to the faster the it will go.

1234
01:18:52,541 --> 01:18:56,611
Better if folks just let us call folks up. Good evening. I

1235
01:18:56,611 --> 01:18:59,280
don't think I think you're Lesley Sandra or did I? Did I

1236
01:18:59,280 --> 01:19:03,840
flip? The order I have is Sean. Oh, sorry. Sorry about that.

1237
01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:06,554
Yes, we are. All right. Howdy, howdy. Good evening.

1238
01:19:06,554 --> 01:19:08,156
Council. Good evening.

1239
01:19:08,156 --> 01:19:09,758
My name. Is Sean Cable, and I'm here

1240
01:19:09,758 --> 01:19:11,560
tonight as a member of Democratic Socialists of

1241
01:19:11,560 --> 01:19:14,830
America. I fully support council member Nate Baker's two

1242
01:19:14,830 --> 01:19:17,566
month moratorium, but it is only a first step in protecting

1243
01:19:17,566 --> 01:19:20,435
the city permanently. I would strongly urge the rest of

1244
01:19:20,435 --> 01:19:22,704
council to push for restrictions in the upcoming

1245
01:19:22,704 --> 01:19:26,374
Uto on what types of data centers are allowed for the

1246
01:19:26,374 --> 01:19:29,845
data centers that are socially necessary. We need to look at

1247
01:19:29,845 --> 01:19:31,780
how to regulate them effectively. We should be

1248
01:19:31,780 --> 01:19:35,116
looking at items like water usage limitations. We should

1249
01:19:35,116 --> 01:19:37,252
have limitations on zoning approval based on their

1250
01:19:37,252 --> 01:19:40,388
proximity to schools, places of worship, recreational centers

1251
01:19:40,388 --> 01:19:43,391
and residential areas. They shouldn't be allowed to use

1252
01:19:43,391 --> 01:19:46,610
diesel generators as backup. I know that there are

1253
01:19:46,610 --> 01:19:47,996
commissioners at the county level that are currently

1254
01:19:47,996 --> 01:19:50,932
working on a 12 month moratorium, and I would suggest

1255
01:19:50,932 --> 01:19:53,602
that the council continue to collaborate with them on the

1256
01:19:53,602 --> 01:19:59,700
new Udo to not just prevent this type of harmful zoning,

1257
01:19:59,700 --> 01:20:01,676
but to prevent other forms of harmful zoning in the future.

1258
01:20:01,676 --> 01:20:05,876
Thank you. Thank you. Go ahead. Leslie.

1259
01:20:08,483 --> 01:20:12,683
Sandra. Hello. I am Leslie Saint Dre.

1260
01:20:13,966 --> 01:20:18,437
I'm here with community, land and power as part of the stop

1261
01:20:18,437 --> 01:20:22,174
data centers in Durham. Coalition. We're invested in

1262
01:20:22,174 --> 01:20:26,579
protecting all residents from the harms of Big tech AI data

1263
01:20:26,579 --> 01:20:30,316
centers, dirty energy and dirty real estate, all of whom are

1264
01:20:30,316 --> 01:20:35,788
putting our lives, ecosystems and futures at risk. For profit

1265
01:20:35,788 --> 01:20:38,791
Durham residents and every living being deserved the

1266
01:20:38,791 --> 01:20:43,329
longest, strongest moratorium, which will give us time for the

1267
01:20:43,329 --> 01:20:47,529
best, loophole free, permanent protections against these

1268
01:20:48,133 --> 01:20:52,805
behemoths. Unless y'all are ready to implement a complete

1269
01:20:52,805 --> 01:20:55,674
and total ban, there's simply no way this planning department

1270
01:20:55,674 --> 01:20:58,944
is equipped to understand the water usage, energy use,

1271
01:20:58,944 --> 01:21:02,681
climate, and ecosystem impacts, displacement impacts, and how

1272
01:21:02,681 --> 01:21:06,180
to make legislation. With all that in mind, to protect Durham

1273
01:21:06,180 --> 01:21:09,889
residents in under 24 months, given that they have little to

1274
01:21:09,889 --> 01:21:12,758
no experience with moratoriums or legislation to protect

1275
01:21:12,758 --> 01:21:17,558
people and our ecosystems. Thank you. Good evening.

1276
01:21:21,233 --> 01:21:23,233
Good evening. Okay.

1277
01:21:24,637 --> 01:21:29,975
Yes. So I am for the moratorium as environmental justice

1278
01:21:29,975 --> 01:21:33,245
advocate with a background in energy research. I want to be

1279
01:21:33,245 --> 01:21:36,915
clear. What we are witnessing is not coincidental. There's a

1280
01:21:36,915 --> 01:21:39,985
certain alignment between utility companies such as Duke

1281
01:21:39,985 --> 01:21:43,122
Energy and the rapid proliferation of data centers.

1282
01:21:43,122 --> 01:21:47,193
Duke energy is justifying significant rate increases

1283
01:21:47,193 --> 01:21:49,728
based on projected energy demand. That is, at best

1284
01:21:49,728 --> 01:21:52,464
speculative and at worst inflated to accommodate large

1285
01:21:52,464 --> 01:21:56,869
scale industrial users. At the same time, there's a troubling

1286
01:21:56,869 --> 01:21:59,805
lack of transparency surrounding these data center

1287
01:21:59,805 --> 01:22:04,209
developments. We we often do not know who the end users are

1288
01:22:04,209 --> 01:22:07,479
or what technologies are being deployed. If these facilities

1289
01:22:07,479 --> 01:22:11,550
incorporate generated AI, the energy demand increases

1290
01:22:11,550 --> 01:22:15,200
exponentially, placing additional strain on the grid

1291
01:22:15,200 --> 01:22:19,692
and ultimately driving up costs for every residents. So for us

1292
01:22:19,692 --> 01:22:22,628
who study this issue closely, the need for moratorium is

1293
01:22:22,628 --> 01:22:25,697
clear. As public servants, do you have a responsibility to

1294
01:22:25,697 --> 01:22:30,436
act in the best interests of the community?

1295
01:22:30,436 --> 01:22:34,636
Thank you. Mr. GU, before you start

1296
01:22:34,840 --> 01:22:38,377
speaking, can I please have Stephanie Gans, Brian MacInnis,

1297
01:22:38,377 --> 01:22:43,777
Mustafa El Almeida. Jordan Grapple and John Hargett line

1298
01:22:47,119 --> 01:22:52,519
up. Good evening. Good evening. Hi, my name is

1299
01:23:00,866 --> 01:23:06,472
Damian GU. I haven't been here a while, so congratulations to

1300
01:23:06,472 --> 01:23:11,272
Councilor Matt and Councilors Fernando. I'm disappointed that

1301
01:23:12,811 --> 01:23:16,949
speaking times are southern. Cut down to one minute each.

1302
01:23:16,949 --> 01:23:22,949
And that's exactly why I don't prepare my speeches beforehand.

1303
01:23:23,823 --> 01:23:28,940
I know most of you on council, but I'm not sure if I have a

1304
01:23:28,940 --> 01:23:33,565
share that I am supposed to be a software engineer. So data

1305
01:23:33,565 --> 01:23:38,965
centers or dangerous AI is dangerous. Well, actually, data

1306
01:23:39,438 --> 01:23:43,642
centers are just bad. But it's something that we definitely

1307
01:23:43,642 --> 01:23:47,979
need a moratorium on until we figure out how we're going to

1308
01:23:47,979 --> 01:23:52,852
deal with it. 60 days is not the two years I was looking

1309
01:23:52,852 --> 01:23:57,790
forward, but I will take that. Thank you for consideration.

1310
01:23:57,790 --> 01:24:01,390
Thank you. Thank you and good.

1311
01:24:02,995 --> 01:24:05,264
Thank you. And folks could just state your name before you

1312
01:24:05,264 --> 01:24:08,133
start. Thank you. Good evening. Okay. Hi. My name is Stephanie

1313
01:24:08,133 --> 01:24:10,202
Gans. I'm a Durham City resident and I work for an

1314
01:24:10,202 --> 01:24:12,738
environmental justice nonprofit called Clean Water for North

1315
01:24:12,738 --> 01:24:15,808
Carolina. A moratorium provides an opportunity to pause and

1316
01:24:15,808 --> 01:24:18,100
make sure that data centers do not worsen the environmental

1317
01:24:18,100 --> 01:24:22,614
injustices, like toxic dumping and wastewater issues that we

1318
01:24:22,614 --> 01:24:25,951
already experience here in Durham. According to NC

1319
01:24:25,951 --> 01:24:28,487
statute, a moratorium duration must be reasonable and may not

1320
01:24:28,487 --> 01:24:30,555
exceed the time necessary to resolve the conditions that

1321
01:24:30,555 --> 01:24:32,624
warrant imposing the moratorium. It is very

1322
01:24:32,624 --> 01:24:34,894
reasonable to put in place a moratorium that uses the

1323
01:24:34,894 --> 01:24:37,296
maximum time that has been upheld by the Supreme Court of

1324
01:24:37,296 --> 01:24:41,166
32 months for our county and for our city. We need to take

1325
01:24:41,166 --> 01:24:44,103
the time to study this very carefully. We are in a drought

1326
01:24:44,103 --> 01:24:47,573
right now. North Carolina state climatologist just said climate

1327
01:24:47,573 --> 01:24:49,708
change is really removing the safety net from our water

1328
01:24:49,708 --> 01:24:51,977
supplies over the last 100 years. North Carolina's

1329
01:24:51,977 --> 01:24:53,846
population is more than quadrupled. And when you add

1330
01:24:53,846 --> 01:24:56,314
things like data centers that are not people, but machines

1331
01:24:56,314 --> 01:24:59,118
that are consuming water, that certainly adds to the stress

1332
01:24:59,118 --> 01:25:02,530
that the water systems face. Data centers are also not

1333
01:25:02,530 --> 01:25:04,123
paying their fair share in taxes right now. And there's

1334
01:25:04,123 --> 01:25:06,926
bipartisan legislation to change that. The data centers

1335
01:25:06,926 --> 01:25:10,996
are causing huge increases in our electric bills. Don't

1336
01:25:10,996 --> 01:25:13,996
contribute to that. Thank you.

1337
01:25:18,603 --> 01:25:21,540
Hi. My name is Brian McGinnis, and I just wanted to say in

1338
01:25:21,540 --> 01:25:23,742
Marine boot camp, my drill instructor told me the pen is

1339
01:25:23,742 --> 01:25:26,478
mightier than the sword. So you guys are a real defenders

1340
01:25:26,478 --> 01:25:28,680
against these threats that we have, which has been explained

1341
01:25:28,680 --> 01:25:31,617
as far as the tangible pollution that could come from

1342
01:25:31,617 --> 01:25:34,820
data centers. Also, there's the enigmatic factor that, you

1343
01:25:34,820 --> 01:25:38,757
know, AI is really stealing the journey part. The the work

1344
01:25:38,757 --> 01:25:42,895
aspect of us trying to create our thoughts through writing

1345
01:25:42,895 --> 01:25:45,631
essays. You know, a lot of people just, you know, AI it

1346
01:25:45,631 --> 01:25:49,301
and there's a lot of, you know, dealing with computers, with

1347
01:25:49,301 --> 01:25:52,972
call centers and things that are degrading our humanity. And

1348
01:25:52,972 --> 01:25:55,841
I think this is a trajectory that's really bad for us and as

1349
01:25:55,841 --> 01:25:59,440
a humanity. So I really implore you guys to stick up for us

1350
01:25:59,440 --> 01:26:02,470
against these data centers, which not only hurt our our

1351
01:26:02,470 --> 01:26:05,251
environment, but also I will, I think, degrade our humanity.

1352
01:26:05,251 --> 01:26:08,851
Thank you. Thank you. Good evening.

1353
01:26:11,924 --> 01:26:15,927
Good evening. My name is Mustafa Almeida. I am a Durham

1354
01:26:15,927 --> 01:26:19,738
resident and I am a worker, just like everybody else in

1355
01:26:19,738 --> 01:26:24,476
this room. And I am here today to say, not only do I support

1356
01:26:24,476 --> 01:26:28,120
the moratorium, but I believe that this moratorium should be

1357
01:26:28,120 --> 01:26:32,217
extended as long as humanly possible because these data

1358
01:26:32,217 --> 01:26:36,822
centers will affect every aspect of our lives. I've heard

1359
01:26:36,822 --> 01:26:39,240
things about drinking water tonight. It will negatively

1360
01:26:39,240 --> 01:26:41,893
impact that. I've heard things about homelessness. It will

1361
01:26:41,893 --> 01:26:45,364
negatively impact that. We are seeing the impacts on education

1362
01:26:45,364 --> 01:26:50,235
and the way it's impacting children. There are just a

1363
01:26:50,235 --> 01:26:53,905
plethora of things that I could bring up, and you will hear

1364
01:26:53,905 --> 01:26:56,307
probably every one of those things tonight from the other

1365
01:26:56,307 --> 01:27:00,578
speakers. But I just want to drive home the importance of

1366
01:27:00,578 --> 01:27:06,719
the fact that there is no one issue that this moratorium will

1367
01:27:06,719 --> 01:27:11,323
fix. It will assist in all of them. Thank you guys.

1368
01:27:11,323 --> 01:27:17,323
Thank you. Hey there. So yeah, I definitely am in

1369
01:27:20,666 --> 01:27:23,680
favor of a moratorium. I don't think two months is enough. I

1370
01:27:23,680 --> 01:27:26,400
don't think two years is enough. I think you guys have

1371
01:27:26,400 --> 01:27:28,674
said some really great things tonight. But to be blunt, if

1372
01:27:28,674 --> 01:27:30,943
you mend any of them, then you will fight to expand this

1373
01:27:30,943 --> 01:27:33,478
moratorium. If you believe in fighting growing wealth

1374
01:27:33,478 --> 01:27:36,215
inequality, then you will fight against these AI power centers,

1375
01:27:36,215 --> 01:27:39,551
which will only give money to the already wealthy while

1376
01:27:39,551 --> 01:27:42,421
taking away many of our jobs and increasing prices on many

1377
01:27:42,421 --> 01:27:45,690
other things such as our water and our electricity. If you

1378
01:27:45,690 --> 01:27:48,293
care about keeping our children healthy, both physically and

1379
01:27:48,293 --> 01:27:51,964
economically, you will prevent these AI centers from polluting

1380
01:27:51,964 --> 01:27:54,833
our air and water. You will prevent them from stealing our

1381
01:27:54,833 --> 01:27:59,704
jobs and, you know, damaging the minds of our children. And

1382
01:27:59,704 --> 01:28:02,775
if you care about keeping Durham beautiful, then you have

1383
01:28:02,775 --> 01:28:04,710
to oppose these plans because they're going to destroy our

1384
01:28:04,710 --> 01:28:07,979
air. They're going to give us disgusting, smoggy skylines,

1385
01:28:07,979 --> 01:28:10,115
disgusting drinking water, and they're going to leave our

1386
01:28:10,115 --> 01:28:14,119
economies destroyed, leave our people dirty and poor. You have

1387
01:28:14,119 --> 01:28:20,119
to fight it. Please. Thank you. Thank you. And then.

1388
01:28:20,325 --> 01:28:23,261
Before John Hargett, is that you? Thank you. Good evening.

1389
01:28:23,261 --> 01:28:25,597
Before you start speaking in, your time is not going to

1390
01:28:25,597 --> 01:28:27,399
start. I'm going to call the next five folks. And please

1391
01:28:27,399 --> 01:28:29,467
remember to state your name so I can make sure I'm tracking

1392
01:28:29,467 --> 01:28:33,500
where we are on the list. Rachel Perry, Andrea Casals,

1393
01:28:33,500 --> 01:28:39,344
Tia Hunt, Shaheed Mustafa, F2, Jagan, Jesse I don't know those

1394
01:28:39,344 --> 01:28:43,748
folks. Thank you. Good evening. Good evening. My name is John

1395
01:28:43,748 --> 01:28:46,685
Hargett. I live in North Durham. I'm here to advocate in

1396
01:28:46,685 --> 01:28:49,487
support of the moratorium on building new data centers in

1397
01:28:49,487 --> 01:28:52,357
Durham. The most obvious concern with these data centers

1398
01:28:52,357 --> 01:28:55,930
is the exorbitant water usage, with industry estimates showing

1399
01:28:55,930 --> 01:28:58,960
a single large data center can use up to a billion gallons of

1400
01:28:58,960 --> 01:29:01,900
water per year, or 2.7 million gallons of water a day during

1401
01:29:01,900 --> 01:29:04,503
peak summer heat. And we all know Durham summers are getting

1402
01:29:04,503 --> 01:29:07,239
hotter and hotter, with the consequences of the climate

1403
01:29:07,239 --> 01:29:11,376
crisis that we did not ask for. The second concern I have is on

1404
01:29:11,376 --> 01:29:14,246
the economics of these data centers. According to studies

1405
01:29:14,246 --> 01:29:16,981
at Harvard Law School and a Bloomberg analysis, after

1406
01:29:16,981 --> 01:29:19,384
aggregating wholesale electricity prices around the

1407
01:29:19,384 --> 01:29:24,189
country, electricity now costs as much as 267% more for a

1408
01:29:24,189 --> 01:29:27,726
single month than it did five years ago. In close location to

1409
01:29:27,726 --> 01:29:31,196
these data centers. Lastly, on a more personal point, I am a

1410
01:29:31,196 --> 01:29:34,600
local musician. Just today, we learned that 44% of music

1411
01:29:34,600 --> 01:29:39,804
uploaded to Spotify as AI ai generated now was 75,000 AI

1412
01:29:39,804 --> 01:29:43,208
generated songs uploaded a day. The AI industry is sucking the

1413
01:29:43,208 --> 01:29:49,208
lifeblood out of the arts. Thank you for your time.

1414
01:29:50,749 --> 01:29:54,219
Thank thank you. And then there was one name that I missed Tia

1415
01:29:54,219 --> 01:29:57,622
Hunt. So if you're Tia Hunt, go ahead and come on up to. Oh, I

1416
01:29:57,622 --> 01:30:00,892
didn't miss you. Okay. Good evening.

1417
01:30:00,892 --> 01:30:06,431
Good evening, Council members. My name is Rachel Perry. Data

1418
01:30:06,431 --> 01:30:11,770
centers do not provide a service to the people of Durham.

1419
01:30:11,770 --> 01:30:15,708
They will be a means to extract wealth from the people of

1420
01:30:15,708 --> 01:30:19,978
Durham and the nation as a whole. And then

1421
01:30:19,978 --> 01:30:23,915
disproportionately put the cost on whoever was unlucky enough

1422
01:30:23,915 --> 01:30:27,920
to actually build these data centers. I support a moratorium

1423
01:30:27,920 --> 01:30:33,320
not only for the two months, but extended indefinitely.

1424
01:30:33,324 --> 01:30:36,595
Right now, the AI companies that are going to be using

1425
01:30:36,595 --> 01:30:41,600
these don't even have a plan to make these profitable. Sam

1426
01:30:41,600 --> 01:30:46,271
Altman said himself that he was going to wait till AI

1427
01:30:46,271 --> 01:30:49,808
actualized to ask it how to make it profitable. So right

1428
01:30:49,808 --> 01:30:53,679
now we'd be expected to take on cost with no plan of any

1429
01:30:53,679 --> 01:30:59,617
return. This is not in our best interest and we need to put a

1430
01:30:59,617 --> 01:31:04,289
hold on this until there's some plan to make this useful. If

1431
01:31:04,289 --> 01:31:07,889
that was. Possible. Thank you. Good

1432
01:31:16,301 --> 01:31:18,103
evening. Good evening. My name is Andrea

1433
01:31:18,103 --> 01:31:21,390
Casals. I've been a Durham nurse since 2019, and in the

1434
01:31:21,390 --> 01:31:23,509
past year I got my doctorate, which means I know a lot about

1435
01:31:23,509 --> 01:31:27,713
research or a good bit. I'm very concerned because I don't

1436
01:31:27,713 --> 01:31:30,181
know if you all know, but Nurse's Week is starting on

1437
01:31:30,181 --> 01:31:33,519
Wednesday and I really don't care for a pizza party. I don't

1438
01:31:33,519 --> 01:31:35,920
care for the freebies out of restaurants. I don't even care

1439
01:31:35,920 --> 01:31:39,257
for a thank you. What I care for is a ban on data centers

1440
01:31:39,257 --> 01:31:42,861
here in Durham, and honestly, everywhere across the country I

1441
01:31:42,861 --> 01:31:46,998
have seen the impacts that it does on people's finances. I've

1442
01:31:46,998 --> 01:31:49,534
seen the impact it does on their environments and in turn,

1443
01:31:49,534 --> 01:31:52,404
their health. We are called the City of Medicine and if we're

1444
01:31:52,404 --> 01:31:54,539
called the City of medicine, we have to act. And being

1445
01:31:54,539 --> 01:31:57,942
preventative instead of reactionary. Once harm is done.

1446
01:31:57,942 --> 01:32:02,800
Yes, saying no to data centers is actually the bare minimum.

1447
01:32:02,800 --> 01:32:04,149
And if you're going to be protecting its constituents,

1448
01:32:04,149 --> 01:32:07,285
especially being health care workers, the largest sector in

1449
01:32:07,285 --> 01:32:09,754
Durham workers, and we have to make sure that we protect our

1450
01:32:09,754 --> 01:32:12,690
communities and this way and so many other ways. So I really

1451
01:32:12,690 --> 01:32:15,493
urge you to consider the impact it's going to have on the

1452
01:32:15,493 --> 01:32:18,764
health sector, the environment sector, and also our pockets,

1453
01:32:18,764 --> 01:32:22,567
which are our livelihoods trust nurses, not AI, not developers,

1454
01:32:22,567 --> 01:32:26,167
and no data centers. Thank you.

1455
01:32:29,579 --> 01:32:31,381
Good evening. Good evening.

1456
01:32:31,381 --> 01:32:34,383
Hi, my name is Tia Han and I'm a citizen of the Lumbee Tribe

1457
01:32:34,383 --> 01:32:36,787
of North Carolina and an organizer with seven directions

1458
01:32:36,787 --> 01:32:39,189
of service and indigenous led environmental justice

1459
01:32:39,189 --> 01:32:42,325
organization here in North Carolina. I'm here to express

1460
01:32:42,325 --> 01:32:44,794
my support and this current resolution, as well as a full

1461
01:32:44,794 --> 01:32:48,799
32 month resolution. Their moratorium for both the City of

1462
01:32:48,799 --> 01:32:51,935
Durham and for Durham County. There's very, very little

1463
01:32:51,935 --> 01:32:54,700
certainty that these developments would bring any

1464
01:32:54,700 --> 01:32:56,272
good to the working class people of Durham, but we know

1465
01:32:56,272 --> 01:33:00,143
for a fact it will line the pockets of big tech. These data

1466
01:33:00,143 --> 01:33:02,812
centers will pollute our land and water and aid in increasing

1467
01:33:02,812 --> 01:33:04,814
state surveillance on our residents. During already

1468
01:33:04,814 --> 01:33:07,817
concerning times. A moratorium will allow residents and

1469
01:33:07,817 --> 01:33:10,220
decision makers in Durham to learn more about these centers

1470
01:33:10,220 --> 01:33:13,890
and how they can affect us and the language of the land. Money

1471
01:33:13,890 --> 01:33:15,425
and ice. Water is alive, and it's all of our duties to

1472
01:33:15,425 --> 01:33:20,825
protect it as much as we can. Thank you.

1473
01:33:22,632 --> 01:33:23,967
Thank you. Good evening.

1474
01:33:23,967 --> 01:33:26,836
Good evening. My name is Shah Mustafa and I

1475
01:33:26,836 --> 01:33:29,706
1,000% support a data center moratorium, which will

1476
01:33:29,706 --> 01:33:32,709
hopefully become indefinite. Data centers are being sold to

1477
01:33:32,709 --> 01:33:35,111
us as signs of progress. Keys to the futures of our

1478
01:33:35,111 --> 01:33:37,647
communities. The reality, though, is that data centers

1479
01:33:37,647 --> 01:33:40,650
secure the exact opposite and signal further destruction to

1480
01:33:40,650 --> 01:33:44,187
our communities. I ask you, council members, what do we as

1481
01:33:44,187 --> 01:33:47,570
a community stand to benefit from data centers? The idea

1482
01:33:47,570 --> 01:33:49,726
that their existence would bolster jobs is a myth. They

1483
01:33:49,726 --> 01:33:53,596
increase property values that people allege will come about,

1484
01:33:53,596 --> 01:33:57,670
have helped nobody but the wealthy, and more tech related

1485
01:33:57,670 --> 01:34:00,690
to business is not worth the lives of your constituents.

1486
01:34:00,690 --> 01:34:02,672
Please vote with your community. There are other,

1487
01:34:02,672 --> 01:34:04,875
more urgent matters to be considered that take precedent

1488
01:34:04,875 --> 01:34:07,410
to any data center. We have not adequately addressed the

1489
01:34:07,410 --> 01:34:10,613
affordable housing crisis here. Gun violence, food insecurity

1490
01:34:10,613 --> 01:34:13,830
and other issues that play a role in how Durham might lead

1491
01:34:13,830 --> 01:34:16,219
their lives. Our futures and livelihoods depend on it. And

1492
01:34:16,219 --> 01:34:19,219
you. Thank you. Thank you.

1493
01:34:22,158 --> 01:34:23,427
Good evening. Hello. My name.

1494
01:34:23,427 --> 01:34:25,161
Is. Feherty Jackson.

1495
01:34:25,161 --> 01:34:27,897
I am calling. On the city, the county and the

1496
01:34:27,897 --> 01:34:32,102
joint city. County planning. Commission to vote yes on a 24

1497
01:34:32,102 --> 01:34:34,971
month moratorium. I won't belabor the point on what other

1498
01:34:34,971 --> 01:34:37,708
people said, but I do find it extremely disrespectful that we

1499
01:34:37,708 --> 01:34:40,577
all came here and we only get one minute to talk. And we talk

1500
01:34:40,577 --> 01:34:43,380
a lot about accountable and responsive government. And this

1501
01:34:43,380 --> 01:34:46,983
is not what was demonstrated tonight. And so, like everyone

1502
01:34:46,983 --> 01:34:49,452
has already said, data centers will increase our cost of

1503
01:34:49,452 --> 01:34:52,989
living. Duke energy is proposing another rate increase

1504
01:34:52,989 --> 01:34:56,793
due to anticipated demand from data centers, which need

1505
01:34:56,793 --> 01:34:58,995
improvements to our infrastructure, to our power

1506
01:34:58,995 --> 01:35:02,265
grid, and we will end up paying for that. Duke energy made $5

1507
01:35:02,265 --> 01:35:05,668
billion last year, but we will have to pay for the data

1508
01:35:05,668 --> 01:35:08,205
centers that will further increase their profits. Thank

1509
01:35:08,205 --> 01:35:11,674
you very much. And yes, I'll vote yes on moratorium.

1510
01:35:11,674 --> 01:35:15,874
Thank you. Good evening. And before you

1511
01:35:17,947 --> 01:35:19,816
start your comments, I'm going to call the next five speakers

1512
01:35:19,816 --> 01:35:24,554
up. Thank you so much. Wiley Kornbluth, Angela Bell,

1513
01:35:24,554 --> 01:35:29,354
Victoria Peterson, Samantha Krupp, and Annie Doran. Go

1514
01:35:30,760 --> 01:35:31,961
ahead. Thank you. Good evening.

1515
01:35:31,961 --> 01:35:33,830
All right. Good evening y'all. I'm Jesse.

1516
01:35:33,830 --> 01:35:34,898
I'm. Giving you the cliff notes.

1517
01:35:34,898 --> 01:35:35,632
Don't worry. I emailed.

1518
01:35:35,632 --> 01:35:37,434
You the full thing. Whether you.

1519
01:35:37,434 --> 01:35:40,637
Adopt our 32 month original moratorium, start and stop with

1520
01:35:40,637 --> 01:35:42,238
shorter ones, or pretend. Wattage limits.

1521
01:35:42,238 --> 01:35:44,908
Could dissuade these companies, they will use any time we give.

1522
01:35:44,908 --> 01:35:47,910
them to pivot to smaller scale centers, transfer ownership of

1523
01:35:47,910 --> 01:35:50,713
existing buildings rather than seek rezoning, and straight up

1524
01:35:50,713 --> 01:35:52,649
lie about the impacts of powering and cooling the

1525
01:35:52,649 --> 01:35:55,185
servers to get these projects through. Without public input,

1526
01:35:55,185 --> 01:35:57,721
it will always be in their best interest to say whatever it

1527
01:35:57,721 --> 01:36:00,657
gets to get you to buy in, and it will always be us who pays

1528
01:36:00,657 --> 01:36:03,527
the price. We don't have more time or more water to be guinea

1529
01:36:03,527 --> 01:36:06,329
pigs for their cash grab. It's infuriating to see how many

1530
01:36:06,329 --> 01:36:08,932
people with power are actively gambling with our future, to

1531
01:36:08,932 --> 01:36:11,100
chase the dreams of private companies that want a full time

1532
01:36:11,100 --> 01:36:13,603
surveillance state. If any of us is going to make it through

1533
01:36:13,603 --> 01:36:15,805
the next decade, we must end the narrative that this is

1534
01:36:15,805 --> 01:36:19,276
inevitable and stop the churn of tech to tech supremacy. Look

1535
01:36:19,276 --> 01:36:21,678
to places like Tennessee, Georgia and Utah. People are

1536
01:36:21,678 --> 01:36:23,547
already paying the price for data centers through

1537
01:36:23,547 --> 01:36:26,349
displacement, illness decimated environments, not to mention

1538
01:36:26,349 --> 01:36:29,286
literally through power bills. We must consider bans, robust

1539
01:36:29,286 --> 01:36:32,890
land and water conservancy, heavy penalties, regulations

1540
01:36:32,890 --> 01:36:35,910
and restrictions for existing infrastructure in our state, as

1541
01:36:35,910 --> 01:36:36,960
well as reparations for people already impacted.

1542
01:36:36,960 --> 01:36:40,560
Thank you. Thank you. Good evening.

1543
01:36:45,102 --> 01:36:47,904
Good evening. My name is. Angela Beale.

1544
01:36:47,904 --> 01:36:51,241
I'm on. It's it's okay. I have Wiley

1545
01:36:51,241 --> 01:36:54,378
next, but they can go after you up okay. Here.

1546
01:36:54,378 --> 01:36:56,460
It's okay. To go. Go ahead.

1547
01:36:56,460 --> 01:36:56,980
Okay. Good evening.

1548
01:36:56,980 --> 01:37:03,186
My name is Angela Bell. I am born and raised in Durham. I'm

1549
01:37:03,186 --> 01:37:09,786
appalled at this. That is even a discussion tonight. I am

1550
01:37:09,793 --> 01:37:15,193
definitely in support of the moratorium. I'm also a

1551
01:37:15,465 --> 01:37:19,535
registered nurse in North Carolina. As the other lady,

1552
01:37:19,535 --> 01:37:24,273
the amount of health issues that data centers bring into

1553
01:37:24,273 --> 01:37:29,345
communities people are unable to go outside of their houses

1554
01:37:29,345 --> 01:37:34,484
without coughing. Children aren't able to go outside and

1555
01:37:34,484 --> 01:37:40,156
play. I don't think this should even be a discussion. It takes

1556
01:37:40,156 --> 01:37:45,628
5 million gallons of water a day to keep the service cool,

1557
01:37:45,628 --> 01:37:51,100
because they produce so much heat. This isn't something that

1558
01:37:51,100 --> 01:37:55,972
Durham needs. I think it's time for each one of you all to

1559
01:37:55,972 --> 01:37:59,976
search your hearts and ask, are you in support of yourself?

1560
01:37:59,976 --> 01:38:04,176
Your pockets, corporate America or Durham residents?

1561
01:38:14,657 --> 01:38:20,530
Wiley corn blue. Is that person here this evening? No. Okay.

1562
01:38:20,530 --> 01:38:27,130
Thank you for that. Peterson. I'm Mrs. Peterson. I think if

1563
01:38:30,607 --> 01:38:33,943
the city council can stay here until 2:00 in the morning, they

1564
01:38:33,943 --> 01:38:36,880
could have given us more than one minute. And they have done

1565
01:38:36,880 --> 01:38:40,150
that in the past. They've been here 2:00 in the morning. I

1566
01:38:40,150 --> 01:38:43,954
have several concerns. First thing, Council Member Baker,

1567
01:38:43,954 --> 01:38:47,230
when you speak, can you please tell us where you folks are

1568
01:38:47,230 --> 01:38:51,361
looking at putting this facility? Also, can you make

1569
01:38:51,361 --> 01:38:56,330
sure when you have a meeting that the company will have a

1570
01:38:56,330 --> 01:38:59,569
representative? Is this something, Mr. Mayor, that you

1571
01:38:59,569 --> 01:39:02,906
folks are just trying to do on your own to put a data center

1572
01:39:02,906 --> 01:39:06,977
here, or do you already have a location that that you already

1573
01:39:06,977 --> 01:39:09,979
have something in mind where you would like to put the data

1574
01:39:09,979 --> 01:39:13,650
center, please, Mr. Baker? Councilman Baker, I want you to

1575
01:39:13,650 --> 01:39:16,453
speak on that. When you share some information with us,

1576
01:39:16,453 --> 01:39:19,656
because it is not in the information that you folks have

1577
01:39:19,656 --> 01:39:23,460
given us. Also, I'm concerned we have seniors in this

1578
01:39:23,460 --> 01:39:27,397
community. I'm a senior. My understanding these data

1579
01:39:27,397 --> 01:39:32,202
centers put out a whole lot of noise, put out a whole lot of

1580
01:39:32,202 --> 01:39:33,871
noise. I will. Be back.

1581
01:39:33,871 --> 01:39:39,871
To some of the other meetings. Thank you. City Council.

1582
01:39:45,348 --> 01:39:48,418
Thank you again for the opportunity to speak. Can I go

1583
01:39:48,418 --> 01:39:49,553
ahead? Okay.

1584
01:39:49,553 --> 01:39:53,623
Just just for the record, you you are going to find very

1585
01:39:53,623 --> 01:39:56,760
little daylight between what's been said and on this council.

1586
01:39:56,760 --> 01:40:00,430
I can confidently say that we are not putting data centers

1587
01:40:00,430 --> 01:40:02,900
anywhere. This is just part of the process. We do have to

1588
01:40:02,900 --> 01:40:06,836
bring this to the council. It's a resolution. It was presented

1589
01:40:06,836 --> 01:40:09,640
and we're taking it up, but we don't have a plan to do that.

1590
01:40:09,640 --> 01:40:12,710
So before we have the other 100 people speak, I don't want

1591
01:40:12,710 --> 01:40:15,379
folks to come up here yelling at council members, thinking

1592
01:40:15,379 --> 01:40:18,448
that we are putting a data center somewhere. Trust me when

1593
01:40:18,448 --> 01:40:21,185
you hear our comments. So that makes sense. But we're allowing

1594
01:40:21,185 --> 01:40:25,456
public comment first before you hear ours. All right. I hope no

1595
01:40:25,456 --> 01:40:27,724
one told you all that. That's what we're considering because

1596
01:40:27,724 --> 01:40:31,610
it's not all right. I miss Peterson. No, we're not we're

1597
01:40:31,610 --> 01:40:33,630
not going to do that. Thank you.

1598
01:40:33,630 --> 01:40:33,930
Go ahead. Let's go.

1599
01:40:33,930 --> 01:40:38,680
Ahead. Hi. My name is Samantha Cropp.

1600
01:40:38,680 --> 01:40:40,470
Thank you for the opportunity to speak. I support a data

1601
01:40:40,470 --> 01:40:43,700
center moratorium, and I echo the message of many here that

1602
01:40:43,700 --> 01:40:45,342
we need more time to do it, right. When it comes to data

1603
01:40:45,342 --> 01:40:47,945
centers, there are many dangerous unknowns. For

1604
01:40:47,945 --> 01:40:50,130
instance, we don't actually know how much water these

1605
01:40:50,130 --> 01:40:52,883
facilities truly use. We don't know where this water will come

1606
01:40:52,883 --> 01:40:55,352
from, which is especially troubling given the ongoing

1607
01:40:55,352 --> 01:40:57,488
drought conditions and increasing demand for water

1608
01:40:57,488 --> 01:41:00,223
across the triangle. We also don't know the quality of the

1609
01:41:00,223 --> 01:41:03,160
water that is used and discharged back to our rivers.

1610
01:41:03,160 --> 01:41:05,829
Data center discharge may contain biocides, heavy metals,

1611
01:41:05,829 --> 01:41:08,832
potentially PFAS, which are forever chemicals, and this is

1612
01:41:08,832 --> 01:41:11,301
not a trivial risk to communities who rely on our

1613
01:41:11,301 --> 01:41:14,637
rivers for drinking water. With so many unknowns, Durham does

1614
01:41:14,637 --> 01:41:16,973
need the time to do it right. We need the time to establish

1615
01:41:16,973 --> 01:41:20,177
clear, enforceable safeguards. It needs a permitting process

1616
01:41:20,177 --> 01:41:22,779
for high volume water users and meaningful enforcement

1617
01:41:22,779 --> 01:41:25,715
mechanisms. And finally, Durham needs to put long term

1618
01:41:25,715 --> 01:41:28,185
protections in place to ensure water resources are not

1619
01:41:28,185 --> 01:41:31,855
degraded. This work cannot be rushed. A 24 month moratorium

1620
01:41:31,855 --> 01:41:34,791
is the bare minimum needed to get the answers to build the

1621
01:41:34,791 --> 01:41:37,460
safeguards and protect Durham's waterways. As a soon to be

1622
01:41:37,460 --> 01:41:39,796
mother, I'm concerned about our future and I hope that you do

1623
01:41:39,796 --> 01:41:46,396
what's right for our community. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

1624
01:41:47,710 --> 01:41:49,873
I'm going to call the next five folks up. Thank you. And then

1625
01:41:49,873 --> 01:41:55,412
let you speak. I have Gabriella Lott, Jade Brooks, Pablo

1626
01:41:55,412 --> 01:42:00,212
Friedman. Ashley Daniels and Isa Kessel Robinson. 2828 but

1627
01:42:08,558 --> 01:42:10,427
that's what. We. I'm sorry.

1628
01:42:10,427 --> 01:42:12,827
Thank you. Thank you.

1629
01:42:13,496 --> 01:42:16,966
And for the folks who signed up as under 28, I'm just calling

1630
01:42:16,966 --> 01:42:22,239
you up. As for item number four, automatically. Good

1631
01:42:22,239 --> 01:42:23,974
evening. Thank you, thank you, and thank

1632
01:42:23,974 --> 01:42:25,420
you for the opportunity to speak.

1633
01:42:25,420 --> 01:42:27,644
My name. Is Annie Doran. I'm sure that

1634
01:42:27,644 --> 01:42:29,179
many people have. spoken on. All.

1635
01:42:29,179 --> 01:42:31,114
These topics more. Eloquently than I can.

1636
01:42:31,114 --> 01:42:32,249
But I. Do.

1637
01:42:32,249 --> 01:42:35,853
Want to point out that one of my passions is clean drinking

1638
01:42:35,853 --> 01:42:40,791
water and wetlands and waterways, and one of my great

1639
01:42:40,791 --> 01:42:43,927
concerns is the presence of chemicals and PFAS in our

1640
01:42:43,927 --> 01:42:48,650
drinking water. North Carolina infamously does not have great

1641
01:42:48,650 --> 01:42:50,934
drinking water in many areas. There are some areas where the

1642
01:42:50,934 --> 01:42:53,737
water is not particularly safe to drink. I would really hate

1643
01:42:53,737 --> 01:42:57,541
to see that happen in Durham County. Furthermore, something

1644
01:42:57,541 --> 01:43:00,209
I don't think I've seen pointed out tonight is the

1645
01:43:00,209 --> 01:43:03,346
infrastructure that it takes for these AI data centers to

1646
01:43:03,346 --> 01:43:09,180
exist. What we saw up in Person County was a natural gas plant

1647
01:43:09,180 --> 01:43:11,621
created. And then, lo and behold, we hear that a data

1648
01:43:11,621 --> 01:43:14,757
center was being announced shortly afterward. So I think

1649
01:43:14,757 --> 01:43:18,940
we have to take into account some of these other possible

1650
01:43:18,940 --> 01:43:21,431
polluting factors, such as natural gas plants, that it

1651
01:43:21,431 --> 01:43:24,768
would take for these AI data centers to exist. Thank you so

1652
01:43:24,768 --> 01:43:28,368
much. Thank you. Good evening. Good

1653
01:43:30,507 --> 01:43:31,307
evening. My name.

1654
01:43:31,307 --> 01:43:32,709
Is Gabriela Lott. I'm a.

1655
01:43:32,709 --> 01:43:34,644
Durham resident. And I'm here to join the calls

1656
01:43:34,644 --> 01:43:38,248
for. multiyear moratorium. on data centers. I want to talk a

1657
01:43:38,248 --> 01:43:41,918
bit about what's at stake if we don't pass a moratorium. So

1658
01:43:41,918 --> 01:43:44,588
what's at stake for y'all as a council is simple. It's going

1659
01:43:44,588 --> 01:43:47,590
to shoot yourself in the foot. Data centers will undermine the

1660
01:43:47,590 --> 01:43:50,260
work you do on things like affordable housing, because it

1661
01:43:50,260 --> 01:43:53,730
will increase competition for land to build homes. And even

1662
01:43:53,730 --> 01:43:56,400
if you can get people into homes, there's a data center

1663
01:43:56,400 --> 01:43:59,200
raising their electric bills. Now they have to choose between

1664
01:43:59,200 --> 01:44:02,271
paying rent and paying for things like AC. It'll cancel

1665
01:44:02,271 --> 01:44:04,608
out the work you're doing on economic development, because

1666
01:44:04,608 --> 01:44:07,477
these centers offer next to no permanent jobs, and they're

1667
01:44:07,477 --> 01:44:11,140
contributing to widespread layoffs. Finally, it'll

1668
01:44:11,140 --> 01:44:14,484
squander the city's financial and environmental resources,

1669
01:44:14,484 --> 01:44:17,954
because data centers will rob us of tax revenue and our water

1670
01:44:17,954 --> 01:44:21,491
supply. What's at stake for me is personal. I'm from York

1671
01:44:21,491 --> 01:44:24,494
County, South Carolina, and every time I go home, I see how

1672
01:44:24,494 --> 01:44:27,430
a 400 acre data center is impacting my mom's

1673
01:44:27,430 --> 01:44:30,233
neighborhood. People talked about the noise, waking people

1674
01:44:30,233 --> 01:44:33,236
up out their sleep, and we know about the health costs that

1675
01:44:33,236 --> 01:44:36,840
come over time. So I'm asking today, pass a long and strong

1676
01:44:36,840 --> 01:44:39,309
moratorium and learn from places that didn't.

1677
01:44:39,309 --> 01:44:44,109
Thank you. Jade Brooks is next. And Pablo

1678
01:44:47,872 --> 01:44:51,750
Friedman, then Ashley Daniels, and then Isaac or Isaac Hessel

1679
01:44:51,750 --> 01:44:55,679
Robinson. That's the order I have. Thank you. Good evening.

1680
01:44:55,679 --> 01:44:57,681
Good evening. I'm Jade. I want.

1681
01:44:57,681 --> 01:44:58,883
To. Thank you all for hearing us

1682
01:44:58,883 --> 01:45:01,618
all out. And I. know that you. All support.

1683
01:45:01,618 --> 01:45:04,889
What we're talking about and that ultimately you all, I

1684
01:45:04,889 --> 01:45:07,240
believe, want more than the two months we're going to get

1685
01:45:07,240 --> 01:45:10,270
tonight. So what? I'm asking you all to keep fighting with

1686
01:45:10,270 --> 01:45:13,563
us behind the scenes, get into the meetings that only you are

1687
01:45:13,563 --> 01:45:16,633
able to sit in. Fight for the county to make us much longer

1688
01:45:16,633 --> 01:45:19,570
than we want. We know we need multiple years because we with

1689
01:45:19,570 --> 01:45:22,840
the staff to. We want you all to have the time you need to do

1690
01:45:22,840 --> 01:45:26,110
all that's going to be necessary to fight back in our

1691
01:45:26,110 --> 01:45:28,979
community against these. And I know that you all are probably

1692
01:45:28,979 --> 01:45:33,650
feeling that we're part of a growing resistance, not only to

1693
01:45:33,650 --> 01:45:36,720
data centers, of course, but also to Big tech's role over

1694
01:45:36,720 --> 01:45:40,123
our lives, to big oil and gases roll over our lives, and this

1695
01:45:40,123 --> 01:45:43,127
is part of what we do to fight back against authoritarianism,

1696
01:45:43,127 --> 01:45:47,327
which I know you all care about.

1697
01:45:51,268 --> 01:45:54,268
Thank you. Good evening. Right.

1698
01:45:58,542 --> 01:46:01,746
Good evening everyone. We got one minute. Maybe we

1699
01:46:01,746 --> 01:46:04,147
should have all been developers tonight to get 10 or 15

1700
01:46:04,147 --> 01:46:07,885
minutes. But we'll do with one minute. It is what it is. All

1701
01:46:07,885 --> 01:46:12,356
right, so I first want to begin by talking about the process to

1702
01:46:12,356 --> 01:46:15,159
get to this podium tonight. So some of us were waiting for 10

1703
01:46:15,159 --> 01:46:19,230
or 15 minutes to sign up. I think when we talk about the

1704
01:46:19,230 --> 01:46:21,565
processes that we're using, if we have to wait 10 or 15

1705
01:46:21,565 --> 01:46:24,340
minutes to sign up to speak for public comment, I think that

1706
01:46:24,340 --> 01:46:26,503
might be a time to move to the more analog system of the

1707
01:46:26,503 --> 01:46:29,173
yellow card, so we don't have to wait for 15 minutes. Thank

1708
01:46:29,173 --> 01:46:31,642
you, Councilmember Baker, for your supportive comments during

1709
01:46:31,642 --> 01:46:34,645
public comments, but we need to revisit that process. I also

1710
01:46:34,645 --> 01:46:37,715
want to talk tonight about how we got to this point. So my

1711
01:46:37,715 --> 01:46:40,518
understanding is that county staff sent over some

1712
01:46:40,518 --> 01:46:43,721
information to you, and that's now why it's watered down. I do

1713
01:46:43,721 --> 01:46:46,523
think it is interesting when the rules get enforced when it

1714
01:46:46,523 --> 01:46:49,994
comes to these types of issues. So for example, Lee village,

1715
01:46:49,994 --> 01:46:53,464
that redevelopment proposal, you don't have to do a TPO. You

1716
01:46:53,464 --> 01:46:55,999
know, you have to do a TPO and you still pass it up and now

1717
01:46:55,999 --> 01:46:58,735
you're getting sued for it. Right? When we talk about the

1718
01:46:58,735 --> 01:47:01,938
Udo redevelopment, right, you're threatening get sued and

1719
01:47:01,938 --> 01:47:04,942
then you pause it. No. When you choose to enforce the law and

1720
01:47:04,942 --> 01:47:07,544
when you choose to leverage the law, thank.

1721
01:47:07,544 --> 01:47:12,944
You. Good evening. Good evening. My name is Ashley

1722
01:47:19,623 --> 01:47:20,357
Daniels. I work.

1723
01:47:20,357 --> 01:47:23,427
At Toxic Free NC. Durham houses, five.

1724
01:47:23,427 --> 01:47:25,696
Contaminated public parks. And is still learning the

1725
01:47:25,696 --> 01:47:27,964
extent of. Contamination in Burton Creek.

1726
01:47:27,964 --> 01:47:29,366
We do. Not need to create another.

1727
01:47:29,366 --> 01:47:31,568
Mess that a future generations will be obligated to.

1728
01:47:31,568 --> 01:47:35,372
Clean up later. Data centers rely on the use of

1729
01:47:35,372 --> 01:47:38,976
PFAS substances and other toxicants to power their

1730
01:47:38,976 --> 01:47:42,179
servers and keep their machines cool. We do not need to add

1731
01:47:42,179 --> 01:47:44,181
another source of PFAS contamination to our

1732
01:47:44,181 --> 01:47:48,520
communities, as Duke Energy appeals to the North Carolina

1733
01:47:48,520 --> 01:47:51,789
Utilities Commission to extract an additional 18% in cost from

1734
01:47:51,789 --> 01:47:54,458
the people of North Carolina, the people in the state do not

1735
01:47:54,458 --> 01:47:58,929
need to give profit for another industry. We support a 32 month

1736
01:47:58,929 --> 01:48:03,129
moratorium. Yeah. Thank you for your time.

1737
01:48:06,737 --> 01:48:09,940
Thank you. And I'm going to call the next

1738
01:48:09,940 --> 01:48:15,879
five. I think I have five more. Sarah, Janek, Nicole, drape.

1739
01:48:15,879 --> 01:48:20,790
Luke. Edgar. Alex. Rico. Eva, Paige, Banach.

1740
01:48:22,190 --> 01:48:24,888
Thank you. Good evening. My name is Isaac Castle

1741
01:48:24,888 --> 01:48:27,958
Robinson. I voted in the recent Durham primary election,

1742
01:48:27,958 --> 01:48:30,961
partially based on my opposition to AI. I recently

1743
01:48:30,961 --> 01:48:34,498
graduated from a tech oriented college with a degree in

1744
01:48:34,498 --> 01:48:37,968
computer science, and I work. I was brought to the triangle to

1745
01:48:37,968 --> 01:48:41,171
work at a major tech employer. I do not know any tech oriented

1746
01:48:41,171 --> 01:48:46,176
people who do not virulently dislike AI, has minimal to no

1747
01:48:46,176 --> 01:48:49,847
positive benefits on society, and numerous negative ones,

1748
01:48:49,847 --> 01:48:54,470
including replacing critical thinking, mastered skills, and

1749
01:48:55,786 --> 01:49:01,786
skill. And yeah, those three with dependence on AI enables

1750
01:49:02,992 --> 01:49:05,328
mass surveillance by governments and corporations,

1751
01:49:05,328 --> 01:49:08,198
opens new fronts for sexual assault and harassment, and

1752
01:49:08,198 --> 01:49:11,135
contributes to the widening wage gap by eliminating jobs at

1753
01:49:11,135 --> 01:49:15,138
all skill levels. I believe that we should not in any way

1754
01:49:15,138 --> 01:49:17,207
subsidize or enable this incredibly dangerous

1755
01:49:17,207 --> 01:49:19,743
technology, because these are problems that can never be

1756
01:49:19,743 --> 01:49:23,343
engineered around. Thank you. Thank you.

1757
01:49:26,950 --> 01:49:30,621
Good evening. Good evening. My name is Sarah Yannick.

1758
01:49:30,621 --> 01:49:32,222
I grew up. Here and I'm also an

1759
01:49:32,222 --> 01:49:35,822
environmental educator. I support this moratorium.

1760
01:49:35,892 --> 01:49:39,290
I learned. early in. My career that we live not far

1761
01:49:39,290 --> 01:49:41,965
from the place that many people credit. As the birthplace of

1762
01:49:41,965 --> 01:49:45,635
the environmental justice movement, Warren County, where

1763
01:49:45,635 --> 01:49:48,371
concerned citizens protested a landfill that would bring

1764
01:49:48,371 --> 01:49:51,909
thousands of truckloads of carcinogenic waste into a

1765
01:49:51,909 --> 01:49:56,179
community that was 60% black. That protest and others after

1766
01:49:56,179 --> 01:49:59,116
it taught me that environmental protection and social justice

1767
01:49:59,116 --> 01:50:03,530
are not separate fights. Our care for the land and water are

1768
01:50:03,530 --> 01:50:07,391
a core part of how we care for each other. As humans. Durham's

1769
01:50:07,391 --> 01:50:09,793
well-being depends on the well-being of the water and

1770
01:50:09,793 --> 01:50:13,329
land in and around Durham. We need to be stewarding our

1771
01:50:13,329 --> 01:50:16,266
waterways so that we will have the water we need in coming

1772
01:50:16,266 --> 01:50:20,270
decades. That water is not guaranteed. It depends on our

1773
01:50:20,270 --> 01:50:23,674
protection, on the protection that this council must exercise

1774
01:50:23,674 --> 01:50:26,674
tonight. Thank you. Thank you.

1775
01:50:30,948 --> 01:50:35,850
Good evening. Good evening. My name is Nicole. I'm a volunteer

1776
01:50:35,850 --> 01:50:37,955
with Mestre Barrio volunteer run community center on Driver

1777
01:50:37,955 --> 01:50:40,491
Street and a resident of East Durham. I'm here to urge the

1778
01:50:40,491 --> 01:50:43,761
City Council to pass and extend the proposed moratorium and put

1779
01:50:43,761 --> 01:50:46,696
the people of Durham above tech billionaires. There are a few

1780
01:50:46,696 --> 01:50:49,966
issues that must be considered for future regulations. Data

1781
01:50:49,966 --> 01:50:52,969
centers of our electricity and our water supply. In Wisconsin

1782
01:50:52,969 --> 01:50:55,439
alone, two hyperscale facilities are expected to use

1783
01:50:55,439 --> 01:50:57,259
more energy than every household in the state

1784
01:50:57,259 --> 01:51:00,196
combined. More electricity means more carbon emissions,

1785
01:51:00,196 --> 01:51:03,733
more climate catastrophe. We cannot ignore who gets hurt

1786
01:51:03,733 --> 01:51:06,536
first. Developers target low income communities and black

1787
01:51:06,536 --> 01:51:09,500
neighborhoods, both for data centers and the fossil fuel

1788
01:51:09,500 --> 01:51:11,340
plants needed to power them. Long term exposure to these

1789
01:51:11,340 --> 01:51:14,210
fumes cause asthma, cancer, heart disease. That's not

1790
01:51:14,210 --> 01:51:16,679
innovation. That's environmental racism. Bloomberg

1791
01:51:16,679 --> 01:51:19,548
recently reported that half of all data centers for 2026 are

1792
01:51:19,548 --> 01:51:21,151
going to be delayed or canceled. There's clearly

1793
01:51:21,151 --> 01:51:23,552
community pushback across the country, and Durham will be no

1794
01:51:23,552 --> 01:51:26,422
different. We should have the political power in our hands.

1795
01:51:26,422 --> 01:51:28,691
The communities directly impacted, not the communities

1796
01:51:28,691 --> 01:51:31,427
of tech, not the hands of tech billionaires or corporate

1797
01:51:31,427 --> 01:51:34,164
politicians who will sacrifice workers, poison our communities

1798
01:51:34,164 --> 01:51:36,966
or destroy our future just to line their pockets, pass and

1799
01:51:36,966 --> 01:51:39,966
extend the moratorium. Thank you.

1800
01:51:46,242 --> 01:51:48,711
Good evening. Good evening, Council and

1801
01:51:48,711 --> 01:51:51,648
everyone else. My name is Edgar Arrieta. I'm a proud member

1802
01:51:51,648 --> 01:51:53,450
with the triangle branch for the party for socialism,

1803
01:51:53,450 --> 01:51:57,654
Liberation, and I grew up for 17 years of my life in Warren

1804
01:51:57,654 --> 01:52:01,391
County. So I grew up hearing these stories of the protests

1805
01:52:01,391 --> 01:52:04,600
and, you know, this small town in North Carolina being the

1806
01:52:04,600 --> 01:52:07,864
birthplace for environmental justice in our country. And,

1807
01:52:07,864 --> 01:52:12,134
you know, seeing in just these past few years, we have seen we

1808
01:52:12,134 --> 01:52:16,272
know we have data, we have real people who have suffered and

1809
01:52:16,272 --> 01:52:18,675
have been exploited from these data centers, from these

1810
01:52:18,675 --> 01:52:22,479
corporations, from these AI booms that are just eventually

1811
01:52:22,479 --> 01:52:25,682
going to fall because they're not turning a profit. It's all

1812
01:52:25,682 --> 01:52:31,820
speculative. And I've seen very recently, in fact, the

1813
01:52:32,622 --> 01:52:35,891
consequences of what not planning for our future can

1814
01:52:35,891 --> 01:52:39,280
lead to. I'm Sure that y'all.

1815
01:52:39,280 --> 01:52:43,990
Will do the right thing. Pastors moratorium continue to

1816
01:52:43,990 --> 01:52:46,970
work with the community with for the 32 month maximum that

1817
01:52:46,970 --> 01:52:50,439
we have. I'll wait and see it. Thank you.

1818
01:52:50,439 --> 01:52:52,839
Thank you. Good evening.

1819
01:52:55,440 --> 01:52:56,579
Hi. Good evening. My name.

1820
01:52:56,579 --> 01:52:58,114
Is Alex Trejo. I'm an organizer.

1821
01:52:58,114 --> 01:53:00,717
With Rostro Barrio in East Durham. And I'm asking the city

1822
01:53:00,717 --> 01:53:03,652
of Durham to vote in favor of a two year minimum data center

1823
01:53:03,652 --> 01:53:07,560
moratorium. When we make decisions that will drastically

1824
01:53:07,560 --> 01:53:08,858
change the layout of our neighborhoods and our entire

1825
01:53:08,858 --> 01:53:11,527
city, the people who live here deserve enough time to have a

1826
01:53:11,527 --> 01:53:14,664
real say in what those changes look like. Data centers consume

1827
01:53:14,664 --> 01:53:17,734
massive amounts of energy and carry serious, ever minor

1828
01:53:17,734 --> 01:53:21,204
environmental impacts, and that consumption has been shown to

1829
01:53:21,204 --> 01:53:23,740
raise electricity costs for residents across the country.

1830
01:53:23,740 --> 01:53:26,343
With the cost of living already climbing every year. Durham

1831
01:53:26,343 --> 01:53:29,110
families simply cannot afford another increase to our utility

1832
01:53:29,110 --> 01:53:31,614
bills. We've already watched Durham transform the interest

1833
01:53:31,614 --> 01:53:34,684
of a few and influx of private capital developers and luxury

1834
01:53:34,684 --> 01:53:37,153
apartments has reshaped this city. While many of the people

1835
01:53:37,153 --> 01:53:39,823
who built it and still work here every day are being pushed

1836
01:53:39,823 --> 01:53:42,692
out by the rising cost of living. This large part of the

1837
01:53:42,692 --> 01:53:45,628
result of hyper development that prioritizes outside

1838
01:53:45,628 --> 01:53:48,231
investors over the residents who call Durham home. Bringing

1839
01:53:48,231 --> 01:53:51,340
in data centers without a clear, community informed plan

1840
01:53:51,340 --> 01:53:54,370
would not only deepen that pattern, luck locking us into

1841
01:53:54,370 --> 01:53:56,439
long term commitments with corporations that we cannot

1842
01:53:56,439 --> 01:54:01,239
easily undo. Thank you. Thank you. Good evening.

1843
01:54:04,180 --> 01:54:05,714
Hi. My name is.

1844
01:54:05,714 --> 01:54:08,384
Eva and I live in Durham County. I filled out my form

1845
01:54:08,384 --> 01:54:11,587
incorrectly, but I hope my remarks make my position clear.

1846
01:54:11,587 --> 01:54:14,724
I am in favor of the longest possible moratorium on new data

1847
01:54:14,724 --> 01:54:17,460
centers to allow time for the development of regulations that

1848
01:54:17,460 --> 01:54:20,996
protect our people, our land, and our water. AI focused

1849
01:54:20,996 --> 01:54:23,666
hyperscale data centers can use as much power as hundreds of

1850
01:54:23,666 --> 01:54:26,668
thousands to millions of households. These data centers

1851
01:54:26,668 --> 01:54:29,471
emit huge amounts of greenhouse gases and expose nearby

1852
01:54:29,471 --> 01:54:32,542
communities to toxins that can cause asthma and exacerbate

1853
01:54:32,542 --> 01:54:35,544
heart disease. Of course, in line with the long history of

1854
01:54:35,544 --> 01:54:38,800
environmental racism in this country, this

1855
01:54:38,800 --> 01:54:40,616
disproportionately affects communities of color. In all

1856
01:54:40,616 --> 01:54:43,486
the places we've seen this happen so far. Some of the

1857
01:54:43,486 --> 01:54:46,210
largest data centers being built now cover hundreds of

1858
01:54:46,210 --> 01:54:49,158
acres with steel and concrete, endangering our ecosystems and

1859
01:54:49,158 --> 01:54:52,228
environment. And they use water with little to no transparency

1860
01:54:52,228 --> 01:54:54,764
about the amount taken from local water sources, typically

1861
01:54:54,764 --> 01:54:58,567
drawing from a single source to satisfy AI inquiries across the

1862
01:54:58,567 --> 01:55:01,904
world. We are currently in a drought. I hope that you will

1863
01:55:01,904 --> 01:55:04,507
support the moratorium for the longest amount possible, and

1864
01:55:04,507 --> 01:55:07,176
use that time to implement regulations to place strong

1865
01:55:07,176 --> 01:55:10,776
limitations and transparency requirements. Thank you.

1866
01:55:10,913 --> 01:55:15,713
Thank you. Those are all the speakers I

1867
01:55:16,852 --> 01:55:20,523
have signed up. So I'm going to declare this public hearing

1868
01:55:20,523 --> 01:55:23,526
closed and back before the council and back before US

1869
01:55:23,526 --> 01:55:26,595
colleagues for comments or questions that we may have.

1870
01:55:26,595 --> 01:55:28,798
Mayor Williams, do you want me to finish this out before we

1871
01:55:28,798 --> 01:55:31,801
take a break? Okay. Thank you. We're going to finish this

1872
01:55:31,801 --> 01:55:33,936
discussion item, colleagues, and then take a ten minute

1873
01:55:33,936 --> 01:55:37,674
break. But I'd rather finish and vote and then take a break

1874
01:55:37,674 --> 01:55:43,674
versus cut us off in five minutes. Anyone have Council

1875
01:55:43,812 --> 01:55:47,750
Member Baker? Go ahead. Thank you all for being here.

1876
01:55:47,750 --> 01:55:51,200
Thank you to all of the speakers who spoke so

1877
01:55:51,200 --> 01:55:55,158
eloquently to the dangers of hyperscale data centers. We are

1878
01:55:55,158 --> 01:56:01,758
here tonight because of you, because you wrote to us, you

1879
01:56:01,898 --> 01:56:05,567
called us for meetings. You gave us text messages and phone

1880
01:56:05,567 --> 01:56:11,107
calls. You made this. You put this on our agenda. You made

1881
01:56:11,107 --> 01:56:16,450
this as important as it as it could possibly be. And there

1882
01:56:16,450 --> 01:56:19,581
were a few of you who are the tip of the spear, who put pen

1883
01:56:19,581 --> 01:56:23,920
to paper and reached out and worked to make this happen. And

1884
01:56:23,920 --> 01:56:26,322
that is why we were sitting here tonight. And I want to

1885
01:56:26,322 --> 01:56:31,260
name a few of those groups who who have done this work,

1886
01:56:31,260 --> 01:56:35,998
community, land and power, I think has done incredible work,

1887
01:56:35,998 --> 01:56:39,202
clean water and C North Carolina Environmental Justice

1888
01:56:39,202 --> 01:56:42,202
Network, Merrick Moore Community Development

1889
01:56:42,672 --> 01:56:46,876
Corporation, and so, so many others. I can't name them all,

1890
01:56:46,876 --> 01:56:50,546
but shout out to to all of you, to the DSA, to PSL, everyone

1891
01:56:50,546 --> 01:56:55,685
who's raised your voice to this issue and how important it is.

1892
01:56:55,685 --> 01:56:58,687
Again, many of you expected to see a 24 month moratorium when

1893
01:56:58,687 --> 01:57:03,559
you came here this evening and for reasons that I, I think you

1894
01:57:03,559 --> 01:57:10,510
now see, we are at this point temporarily stuck with 60 day

1895
01:57:10,510 --> 01:57:14,851
moratorium with with more options moving forward tonight,

1896
01:57:16,190 --> 01:57:20,728
in keeping with the Ido, we are going to be voting on the 60

1897
01:57:20,728 --> 01:57:25,933
day moratorium that buys us time to bring forward more

1898
01:57:25,933 --> 01:57:30,739
robust language for a more robust moratorium. I will say

1899
01:57:30,739 --> 01:57:35,410
this. I think that it is vital that we have no less than a 24

1900
01:57:35,410 --> 01:57:39,280
month moratorium on hyperscale data centers in the city of

1901
01:57:39,280 --> 01:57:44,800
Durham. Why the enabling legislation? In chapter 162 of

1902
01:57:44,886 --> 01:57:49,224
the state statutes is is pretty clear about moratorium, and we

1903
01:57:49,224 --> 01:57:52,693
need to have a reason. Why would it be six months? Why

1904
01:57:52,693 --> 01:57:55,763
would it be 12 months? Why would it be 24 months or more?

1905
01:57:55,763 --> 01:58:00,101
We need to be able to explain why the longest moratorium in

1906
01:58:00,101 --> 01:58:02,837
the state of North Carolina right now is 12 months. That's

1907
01:58:02,837 --> 01:58:06,708
what we've typically been seeing. However, the evidence

1908
01:58:06,708 --> 01:58:12,708
is piling up. We see the hyperscale data centers are

1909
01:58:12,847 --> 01:58:15,449
having detrimental impacts in communities across the state,

1910
01:58:15,449 --> 01:58:19,453
but also across the United States, across the South, many

1911
01:58:19,453 --> 01:58:22,323
people who came here this evening have spoken to those

1912
01:58:22,323 --> 01:58:25,660
very eloquently. They're impacting water. They're

1913
01:58:25,660 --> 01:58:29,530
impacting electricity, they're impacting fiscal outcomes. They

1914
01:58:29,530 --> 01:58:32,734
have negative impacts on social justice issues. They are

1915
01:58:32,734 --> 01:58:36,471
locating themselves in places where the poorest live. They

1916
01:58:36,471 --> 01:58:40,608
are raising temperatures sometimes extremely close to

1917
01:58:40,608 --> 01:58:44,679
where they are, and they have so many other potential impacts

1918
01:58:44,679 --> 01:58:49,551
that we might not even know about. We do not want these

1919
01:58:49,551 --> 01:58:53,688
impacts in Durham. I am concerned that other

1920
01:58:53,688 --> 01:58:56,157
communities have not given themselves enough time to

1921
01:58:56,157 --> 01:59:00,161
thoroughly understand this complex issue. Yes, they can

1922
01:59:00,161 --> 01:59:02,430
extend their moratorium, and I do think that we're probably

1923
01:59:02,430 --> 01:59:07,350
going to see that. But the safe route is just to adopt

1924
01:59:07,350 --> 01:59:11,906
something longer that meets the moment and the need. This is a

1925
01:59:11,906 --> 01:59:15,576
fast evolving issue that requires time. The best

1926
01:59:15,576 --> 01:59:19,647
practices on this issue are constantly changing and being

1927
01:59:19,647 --> 01:59:24,919
updated. Durham is the first of North Carolina's major cities

1928
01:59:24,919 --> 01:59:29,391
to not the only one. The first one to be looking at a

1929
01:59:29,391 --> 01:59:33,528
moratorium and developing more robust regulations. Durham is

1930
01:59:33,528 --> 01:59:37,398
in the middle of a stalled Udo process, and that adds

1931
01:59:37,398 --> 01:59:41,602
additional complications for us in particular. And then

1932
01:59:41,602 --> 01:59:46,140
finally, I have spoken with experts across the state. I've

1933
01:59:46,140 --> 01:59:48,943
spoken with our counterparts in other communities in North

1934
01:59:48,943 --> 01:59:53,414
Carolina who have passed a moratorium. And because of all

1935
01:59:53,414 --> 01:59:56,417
those conversations that that I have had, because of all of

1936
01:59:56,417 --> 02:00:01,688
these reasons, I do believe that we are justified in a

1937
02:00:01,688 --> 02:00:06,488
minimum 24 month moratorium. So I'm disappointed, like many

1938
02:00:07,561 --> 02:00:11,310
folks, that that we are not approving a clean 24 months

1939
02:00:11,310 --> 02:00:16,637
this evening. But I see this as a first step. This is Durham's

1940
02:00:16,637 --> 02:00:21,410
first development moratorium. Durham is the first, not the

1941
02:00:21,410 --> 02:00:25,446
only but the first of of North Carolina's major communities to

1942
02:00:25,446 --> 02:00:30,317
do this. And when the moratorium goes into effect, I

1943
02:00:30,317 --> 02:00:34,122
am counting on a highly engaging and collaborative

1944
02:00:34,122 --> 02:00:38,325
process with the community, especially those experts who

1945
02:00:38,325 --> 02:00:40,861
have played a key role in putting this moratorium

1946
02:00:40,861 --> 02:00:45,266
forward. The technical experts to do the research, to study

1947
02:00:45,266 --> 02:00:49,136
the issues, to study the best practices, and ultimately to

1948
02:00:49,136 --> 02:00:53,741
put in place the best high quality regulations that we

1949
02:00:53,741 --> 02:00:59,213
possibly can. And my hope is that Durham sets the standard,

1950
02:00:59,213 --> 02:01:02,350
at least for North Carolina, for hyperscale data center

1951
02:01:02,350 --> 02:01:04,752
regulations and what they should look like.

1952
02:01:04,752 --> 02:01:07,822
Thank you, Council member Council Member Burris did you

1953
02:01:07,822 --> 02:01:09,822
have. Anything?

1954
02:01:10,224 --> 02:01:13,270
Good evening and thank you all so much for your advocacy and

1955
02:01:13,270 --> 02:01:15,563
your organizing work. As we I share the same sentence with

1956
02:01:15,563 --> 02:01:18,499
many of you in regards to not want a data center in our

1957
02:01:18,499 --> 02:01:21,836
community. Also to your point, Miss Peterson, I had the same

1958
02:01:21,836 --> 02:01:24,238
question initially like where's proposed data center? So I do

1959
02:01:24,238 --> 02:01:26,974
agree that we can message a little bit better. I recognize

1960
02:01:26,974 --> 02:01:29,977
that our staff has moved very swiftly to try to address these

1961
02:01:29,977 --> 02:01:31,646
issues. It came before us in the work session a couple of

1962
02:01:31,646 --> 02:01:35,182
weeks ago. So I think that moving forward, it will be

1963
02:01:35,182 --> 02:01:37,384
while support this, we just need to make sure we figure out

1964
02:01:37,384 --> 02:01:40,388
all of the legalities that we still can move forward. And if

1965
02:01:40,388 --> 02:01:44,392
we may provide it a little more time, possibly could have got

1966
02:01:44,392 --> 02:01:49,130
that clear. So while 60 days is a start, I feel it just feels

1967
02:01:49,130 --> 02:01:53,000
like 60s to me. And so I look forward in the immediate future

1968
02:01:53,000 --> 02:01:55,402
as to learning more and making sure we work closely with our

1969
02:01:55,402 --> 02:01:58,272
staff to learn more about what our options are, as well as

1970
02:01:58,272 --> 02:02:02,209
using our voices to compel our colleagues to maybe explore a

1971
02:02:02,209 --> 02:02:06,130
longer moratorium as well. So thank you all again for your

1972
02:02:06,130 --> 02:02:08,683
advocacy, and I look forward to hearing from you on additional

1973
02:02:08,683 --> 02:02:11,218
occasions. But I just want to also compliment our staff for

1974
02:02:11,218 --> 02:02:14,155
being a minimum of flexible, as you all have had to pull this

1975
02:02:14,155 --> 02:02:19,555
together on very short notice. Thank you. Council Member

1976
02:02:19,760 --> 02:02:22,629
Burris Council Member Kopac and then Council Member Rist. Oh

1977
02:02:22,629 --> 02:02:23,965
no. Okay. Thank you.

1978
02:02:23,965 --> 02:02:27,568
Yeah. Thank you, Madam Mayor Pro Tem. So first of all, happy

1979
02:02:27,568 --> 02:02:30,438
Nurses Week starting on Wednesday. I appreciate that my

1980
02:02:30,438 --> 02:02:34,908
wife is also a nurse. I want to say that I am firmly in support

1981
02:02:34,908 --> 02:02:38,780
of the hyperscale data center moratorium, which I believe is

1982
02:02:38,780 --> 02:02:41,516
an important statement of our values as a community. The

1983
02:02:41,516 --> 02:02:44,510
environmental impacts, the impact on our water supply, the

1984
02:02:44,510 --> 02:02:47,521
impact on utility rates and the lack of jobs and real community

1985
02:02:47,521 --> 02:02:51,325
benefits are clear. I appreciate the most important

1986
02:02:51,325 --> 02:02:54,862
source of renewable energy here this evening, which is all of

1987
02:02:54,862 --> 02:02:58,132
you who showed up to advocate, and I want to thank you all as

1988
02:02:58,132 --> 02:03:02,690
individuals as well as organizations such as song,

1989
02:03:02,690 --> 02:03:04,806
community, Land and Power, North Carolina Environmental

1990
02:03:04,806 --> 02:03:07,408
Justice Network, and many others that came together in

1991
02:03:07,408 --> 02:03:10,677
coalition to advocate this evening. This has moved very

1992
02:03:10,677 --> 02:03:16,350
quickly, and that's because of the urgency and interest most

1993
02:03:16,350 --> 02:03:18,636
much quicker than most agenda items that come before this

1994
02:03:18,636 --> 02:03:22,240
council. And so I certainly understand the reasons for

1995
02:03:22,240 --> 02:03:26,244
shifting to the 60 day pause at this time while we work with

1996
02:03:26,244 --> 02:03:29,781
the county and stay in compliance with our Udo to make

1997
02:03:29,781 --> 02:03:33,317
sure that we put in place effective regulations, which I

1998
02:03:33,317 --> 02:03:37,789
intend on supporting the 24 month moratorium. When it comes

1999
02:03:37,789 --> 02:03:42,260
back before us, I'll just note that as the mayor pro tem said,

2000
02:03:42,260 --> 02:03:44,996
there are other opportunities for advocacy. And economically

2001
02:03:44,996 --> 02:03:47,865
speaking, the county is where we would likely see a

2002
02:03:47,865 --> 02:03:51,690
hyperscale data center attempt to locate. So I encourage you

2003
02:03:51,690 --> 02:03:53,204
to bring the energy to the county during the public

2004
02:03:53,204 --> 02:03:56,741
hearing, just as you have here. And I look forward to a joint

2005
02:03:56,741 --> 02:04:00,545
unified approach to addressing this issue for our great city.

2006
02:04:00,545 --> 02:04:02,945
Thank you. Thank you.

2007
02:04:04,682 --> 02:04:06,618
Councilmember present. Yeah, I just want I know it's a long

2008
02:04:06,618 --> 02:04:08,419
meeting. I just want to echo the comments of my colleagues,

2009
02:04:08,419 --> 02:04:10,688
want to appreciate all the folks here who've spoken and

2010
02:04:10,688 --> 02:04:13,357
the organizers. I will support this enthusiastically. So thank

2011
02:04:13,357 --> 02:04:17,429
you for being here. Thank you. Mayor Williams.

2012
02:04:17,429 --> 02:04:22,330
Yeah, thank you. Just briefly, I like I said earlier, I think

2013
02:04:22,330 --> 02:04:27,439
everyone on on this council is is in support of this. I am

2014
02:04:27,439 --> 02:04:32,376
probably on one of the very few occasions, I don't know, I

2015
02:04:32,376 --> 02:04:34,512
might be a bit more aggressive on this than you. Council

2016
02:04:34,512 --> 02:04:39,517
Member Baker. I think that, you know, Durham just needs to

2017
02:04:39,517 --> 02:04:43,654
indefinitely have a moratorium on megawatt data centers. I

2018
02:04:43,654 --> 02:04:46,658
will say that there is some language that's being worked on

2019
02:04:46,658 --> 02:04:50,328
at the county level, as well as the state level, and I want to

2020
02:04:50,328 --> 02:04:53,531
talk a little bit just because I saw some familiar faces in

2021
02:04:53,531 --> 02:04:56,334
here tonight. And and I just want to appreciate their

2022
02:04:56,334 --> 02:05:02,540
concern. On a recent incident, something that a mayor does is

2023
02:05:02,540 --> 02:05:05,410
we listen to our community, and then we go and speak on behalf

2024
02:05:05,410 --> 02:05:08,879
of our community. And one thing you're going to find me doing

2025
02:05:08,879 --> 02:05:13,351
is you're going to find me trying to find the best options

2026
02:05:13,351 --> 02:05:17,621
forward. I understand that people use data centers. I

2027
02:05:17,621 --> 02:05:20,425
understand when you pick up your phone. This phone is tied

2028
02:05:20,425 --> 02:05:23,961
to a data center somewhere. I understand I'm not going to not

2029
02:05:23,961 --> 02:05:28,299
be in reality, but I also want to be very vocal, which in

2030
02:05:28,299 --> 02:05:31,302
regards to land that we have here in Durham, we don't have

2031
02:05:31,302 --> 02:05:34,705
the space for it, nor do we want that in here. We have a

2032
02:05:34,705 --> 02:05:37,575
housing crunch as it is already, and if these data

2033
02:05:37,575 --> 02:05:40,177
centers and the people who own them are wealthy enough to have

2034
02:05:40,177 --> 02:05:42,846
them, then they're wealthy enough to build infrastructure

2035
02:05:42,846 --> 02:05:46,517
in areas where it's needed. But Durham is not the place for it.

2036
02:05:46,517 --> 02:05:48,519
I've been very clear about that, but you're going to hear

2037
02:05:48,519 --> 02:05:50,721
me talk to them. You're going to hear me try and figure out

2038
02:05:50,721 --> 02:05:53,324
what solutions they can bring. And right now, there is no

2039
02:05:53,324 --> 02:05:58,262
federal guidance nor state guidance. And so we're kind of

2040
02:05:58,262 --> 02:06:02,466
left out here on our own right now. And and I have spoken to

2041
02:06:02,466 --> 02:06:05,135
Duke Energy and others. And, you know, I'm going to try and

2042
02:06:05,135 --> 02:06:08,338
seek solutions with them. That's what we do. We we speak

2043
02:06:08,338 --> 02:06:10,408
to people. We try to find solutions that we speak on

2044
02:06:10,408 --> 02:06:13,611
behalf of the interests of our community. If you haven't paid

2045
02:06:13,611 --> 02:06:16,547
attention, pay attention to Northern Virginia, northern

2046
02:06:16,547 --> 02:06:20,170
Virginia wanted data centers. They invited a man and they

2047
02:06:20,170 --> 02:06:24,422
enjoyed the revenue that they brought in. And now they are

2048
02:06:24,422 --> 02:06:28,692
humming machines behind their homes. It is very uncomfortable

2049
02:06:28,692 --> 02:06:33,564
living condition. And it's a high populous area. So I know

2050
02:06:33,564 --> 02:06:36,233
the data centers are going to go up somewhere. I know that

2051
02:06:36,233 --> 02:06:38,350
they're going to go, they're going to they're going to

2052
02:06:38,350 --> 02:06:41,572
build. I know that, but I think that until we get some clear

2053
02:06:41,572 --> 02:06:45,420
guidance around where it's most appropriate and therefore we

2054
02:06:45,420 --> 02:06:47,245
have to make sure that we are getting ahead of it. While

2055
02:06:47,245 --> 02:06:50,515
there is no guidance, we can put our own guidance. There.

2056
02:06:50,515 --> 02:06:54,510
I've been very clear this poor use of land is low number of

2057
02:06:54,510 --> 02:06:55,853
jobs, and there are other creative ways that we can

2058
02:06:55,853 --> 02:06:59,657
generate sales tax revenue. I invite you to support our small

2059
02:06:59,657 --> 02:07:02,659
businesses. I invite you, Durham, a still majority

2060
02:07:02,659 --> 02:07:06,396
locally owned. So therefore a higher return on the dollar

2061
02:07:06,396 --> 02:07:10,000
stays local when you shop local we can generate sales taxes

2062
02:07:10,000 --> 02:07:13,671
that way rather than being bringing a large establishments

2063
02:07:13,671 --> 02:07:19,610
like this into the area. Again, the federal and state levels

2064
02:07:19,610 --> 02:07:21,746
just don't have the guidance for us. But I will say I want

2065
02:07:21,746 --> 02:07:25,750
to shout out State Representative Renata Austin.

2066
02:07:25,750 --> 02:07:29,553
She actually has a bill that she's sponsoring that puts some

2067
02:07:29,553 --> 02:07:34,559
some type of language and some some guidance and structure

2068
02:07:34,559 --> 02:07:38,496
around the use of data centers across the entire state. So I

2069
02:07:38,496 --> 02:07:41,632
would appreciate having a little more time to work with

2070
02:07:41,632 --> 02:07:45,502
our county colleagues and our state colleagues. I actually

2071
02:07:45,502 --> 02:07:49,240
would like to send this back and, and work on the indefinite

2072
02:07:49,240 --> 02:07:53,845
one and have more of a tiered approach that that addresses us

2073
02:07:53,845 --> 02:07:58,582
here locally. If not, we'll do this for 60 days. But I will

2074
02:07:58,582 --> 02:08:02,530
say that I, I also may entertain the idea of a, of a

2075
02:08:02,530 --> 02:08:04,522
task force where we can work with our county and state

2076
02:08:04,522 --> 02:08:08,192
colleagues. So, colleagues, I may reach out to you all about

2077
02:08:08,192 --> 02:08:11,662
that as well. Just be on the lookout that that way we can

2078
02:08:11,662 --> 02:08:14,665
potentially have some vertical alignment and we pass it all at

2079
02:08:14,665 --> 02:08:19,700
the same time. If you all would be interested in that. Okay,

2080
02:08:19,700 --> 02:08:21,939
that'll be all my comments. Mayor Pro Tem.

2081
02:08:21,939 --> 02:08:24,809
Miss Benjamin will comment. This is for staff. I don't know

2082
02:08:24,809 --> 02:08:26,944
if the city manager others can address this. We've been

2083
02:08:26,944 --> 02:08:28,946
getting some comments from residents that that there's I

2084
02:08:28,946 --> 02:08:31,215
know this has been a fast moving topic and that there are

2085
02:08:31,215 --> 02:08:32,683
different, potentially different versions of the

2086
02:08:32,683 --> 02:08:35,286
resolution online on the agenda, whatever. So we'll make

2087
02:08:35,286 --> 02:08:37,621
clear that the agenda that we're or the resolution we're

2088
02:08:37,621 --> 02:08:39,957
voting on is the one that's in our packet tonight, regardless

2089
02:08:39,957 --> 02:08:42,693
of what else may be on different sort of online

2090
02:08:42,693 --> 02:08:44,950
agendas. It did change.

2091
02:08:44,950 --> 02:08:46,630
Yeah. Respectfully, I'm going to defer to the city attorney

2092
02:08:46,630 --> 02:08:49,100
because the attorney's office manager had them for us. Thank

2093
02:08:49,100 --> 02:08:51,969
you. Thank you, Mr. Manager. Thank

2094
02:08:51,969 --> 02:08:54,505
you. Councilmember. What you're voting on now is actually an

2095
02:08:54,505 --> 02:08:56,974
ordinance, not the resolution. You've already passed and

2096
02:08:56,974 --> 02:09:01,979
adopted. The resolution, which was to set this public hearing.

2097
02:09:01,979 --> 02:09:06,184
The ordinance that's before you right now has been modified. It

2098
02:09:06,184 --> 02:09:11,584
originally was in the agenda process for 24 months. And

2099
02:09:12,723 --> 02:09:15,593
again, as we discovered, there's actually a limitation

2100
02:09:15,593 --> 02:09:18,529
in the audio that if we were going to adopt a 24 month

2101
02:09:18,529 --> 02:09:23,334
resolution, it had to first 24 month moratorium. I'm sorry, it

2102
02:09:23,334 --> 02:09:28,285
had to first have gone through the Planning Commission, and we

2103
02:09:28,285 --> 02:09:31,955
didn't have time to do that before this evening. The other

2104
02:09:31,955 --> 02:09:36,493
issue is that we had gotten word we do have a joint studio

2105
02:09:36,493 --> 02:09:38,896
and a joint planning and development department that we

2106
02:09:38,896 --> 02:09:42,232
share with Durham County, and we had gotten word that the

2107
02:09:42,232 --> 02:09:45,102
county is also looking at this issue. And it's really, really

2108
02:09:45,102 --> 02:09:47,838
important that the two jurisdictions be aligned

2109
02:09:47,838 --> 02:09:53,238
because of that joint structure. It would be really

2110
02:09:55,245 --> 02:09:57,848
problematic for the planning and Development department to

2111
02:09:57,848 --> 02:10:01,785
administer something. If the city were to adopt one standard

2112
02:10:01,785 --> 02:10:04,121
and the county adopt a completely different standard.

2113
02:10:04,121 --> 02:10:07,258
So I think it's really important to see if the county

2114
02:10:07,258 --> 02:10:10,394
wants to act in this space. I don't know that we've

2115
02:10:10,394 --> 02:10:15,466
definitively heard as yet, but also, if they do want to act in

2116
02:10:15,466 --> 02:10:17,334
that space, it's pretty important that the two

2117
02:10:17,334 --> 02:10:20,804
jurisdictions try to align their their approach.

2118
02:10:20,804 --> 02:10:23,700
I appreciate that additional information. And again, I'm

2119
02:10:23,700 --> 02:10:25,276
sorry that ordinance right. Not not resolution, but just want

2120
02:10:25,276 --> 02:10:27,144
to make sure that the ordinance we're voting on is the one

2121
02:10:27,144 --> 02:10:29,880
that's in our packet. Correct. Regardless of what else. Yeah.

2122
02:10:29,880 --> 02:10:31,682
That's what everyone. Yeah. Correct.

2123
02:10:31,682 --> 02:10:34,351
Yes. And I do also want to clarify, there have been lots

2124
02:10:34,351 --> 02:10:38,221
of statements about wanting a 24 month. There have been some

2125
02:10:38,221 --> 02:10:41,292
statements made this evening about 32 months. It's also

2126
02:10:41,292 --> 02:10:43,760
important to recognize that the Durham Unified Development

2127
02:10:43,760 --> 02:10:47,964
Ordinance limits moratorium for development purposes to one

2128
02:10:47,964 --> 02:10:52,164
year. That's our own locally adopted legislation.

2129
02:10:56,773 --> 02:10:59,176
Thank you. Colleagues, is there anyone else, any comment or

2130
02:10:59,176 --> 02:11:01,979
questions? Yeah, just real quick. I just

2131
02:11:01,979 --> 02:11:08,652
want to reiterate we we don't even have to land for this. So

2132
02:11:08,652 --> 02:11:12,922
but the importance of the importance of make mass

2133
02:11:12,922 --> 02:11:18,922
megawatt data centers, we don't want any particular land that

2134
02:11:19,863 --> 02:11:23,600
does or structures that do exist to be converted. That's

2135
02:11:23,600 --> 02:11:28,400
really important as well. But I will say I spoke with some

2136
02:11:28,400 --> 02:11:30,340
colleagues at the county and they are moving on this as

2137
02:11:30,340 --> 02:11:34,678
well. I will say I also would like us to be as consistent as

2138
02:11:34,678 --> 02:11:38,810
possible on this, working with the county and our state

2139
02:11:38,810 --> 02:11:41,284
colleagues. So we're if we're passing the ordinance tonight,

2140
02:11:41,284 --> 02:11:45,489
do know that modifications will come so that we can be on the

2141
02:11:45,489 --> 02:11:51,489
same page with them. Thank you. I just want to

2142
02:11:53,970 --> 02:11:56,699
appreciate everyone who spoke. I want to also lift up Council

2143
02:11:56,699 --> 02:11:59,436
Member Baker. I appreciate you listing some of the the groups,

2144
02:11:59,436 --> 02:12:02,380
some of the folks that had reached out to us or

2145
02:12:02,380 --> 02:12:04,241
Southerners on new ground, community, land and power,

2146
02:12:04,241 --> 02:12:07,911
clean water and see more CDC sound rivers, mother's first

2147
02:12:07,911 --> 02:12:09,913
ceasefire, the Durham Art Guild, Carolina Jews for

2148
02:12:09,913 --> 02:12:14,184
justice, Durham, Orange County Juice for Jewish Voices for

2149
02:12:14,184 --> 02:12:20,784
peace, triangle, NC moms, Clean Moms, Clean Air Force, NC, and

2150
02:12:20,924 --> 02:12:23,994
the environmental NC Environmental Justice Network.

2151
02:12:23,994 --> 02:12:27,263
So I know that there's been a lot of folks working on this in

2152
02:12:27,263 --> 02:12:29,399
this space, including some other groups that were named

2153
02:12:29,399 --> 02:12:33,670
this evening when they spoke. I just want to share with folks

2154
02:12:33,670 --> 02:12:37,408
here. We don't always agree on development, on the status, but

2155
02:12:37,408 --> 02:12:41,745
a data center is not housing a data center at the scale that

2156
02:12:41,745 --> 02:12:44,881
we're talking about. This is not to support local hospitals

2157
02:12:44,881 --> 02:12:46,950
health care. We know that in some cases, we have to have

2158
02:12:46,950 --> 02:12:50,153
those that we are. Quite frankly, we already have some

2159
02:12:50,153 --> 02:12:52,756
of those there in the park. Do hospital has some of these

2160
02:12:52,756 --> 02:12:55,558
things. They've been here. That's not what we're talking

2161
02:12:55,558 --> 02:12:58,161
about this evening. And I know that's what many of you said,

2162
02:12:58,161 --> 02:13:00,630
and that's what your comments referenced. I just really want

2163
02:13:00,630 --> 02:13:03,567
to lift up that housing and data centers and AI and big

2164
02:13:03,567 --> 02:13:07,170
tech and defense companies, it's not the same. And we

2165
02:13:07,170 --> 02:13:10,307
really do need to have nuanced conversations on what some of

2166
02:13:10,307 --> 02:13:12,976
these things are and what the threats are to our communities,

2167
02:13:12,976 --> 02:13:15,440
because they are real threats and they are legitimate

2168
02:13:15,440 --> 02:13:19,983
threats. And so there was never a question. I know I've had

2169
02:13:19,983 --> 02:13:22,519
some meetings with some community groups. I've had some

2170
02:13:22,519 --> 02:13:26,523
email exchanges. It was never a doubt in my mind that there

2171
02:13:26,523 --> 02:13:29,590
wasn't going to be unanimous support for something like this

2172
02:13:29,590 --> 02:13:31,795
on this council. It's the same way that there's never a doubt

2173
02:13:31,795 --> 02:13:33,930
in my mind on any single council I've ever served on.

2174
02:13:33,930 --> 02:13:37,801
This is my third mayor, this is my ninth budget. You don't

2175
02:13:37,801 --> 02:13:40,537
fight about LGBTQ rights in Durham when you're an elected

2176
02:13:40,537 --> 02:13:42,873
official. You don't fight. If whether you're pro-life or

2177
02:13:42,873 --> 02:13:45,476
pro-choice, you're pro-choice. In this community, you do not

2178
02:13:45,476 --> 02:13:50,140
fight around immigration and standing up for our neighbors.

2179
02:13:50,140 --> 02:13:53,283
That's who you have to be to serve in any capacity. In

2180
02:13:53,283 --> 02:13:56,286
Durham County. That's the expectation of almost every

2181
02:13:56,286 --> 02:13:59,689
single resident I've ever encountered. And that means

2182
02:13:59,689 --> 02:14:04,427
it's a blessing that we live in that type of community. But

2183
02:14:04,427 --> 02:14:08,699
this isn't a fight. This is an acknowledgement and affirmation

2184
02:14:08,699 --> 02:14:11,568
of what community's already asked for. We have a lot of

2185
02:14:11,568 --> 02:14:14,438
work to do before us around what the county is going to do,

2186
02:14:14,438 --> 02:14:17,708
what we can do, what the opportunities are, and the LDC,

2187
02:14:17,708 --> 02:14:20,911
the upcoming Udo around a moratorium. There's right, we

2188
02:14:20,911 --> 02:14:24,915
have a lot of questions, but I believe in our legal staff.

2189
02:14:24,915 --> 02:14:29,987
Several years ago, I think when HB 153 sunset, madam attorney,

2190
02:14:29,987 --> 02:14:32,560
we had to work around non-discrimination ordinance

2191
02:14:32,560 --> 02:14:36,393
language for housing and jobs for our queer community, and we

2192
02:14:36,393 --> 02:14:39,662
had to work with the county because we wanted unified

2193
02:14:39,662 --> 02:14:42,532
language that the county and the city adopted at the same

2194
02:14:42,532 --> 02:14:46,202
time. And we passed that language. And it was unanimous

2195
02:14:46,202 --> 02:14:48,405
on both both boards, and it was a different county

2196
02:14:48,405 --> 02:14:50,473
commissioners and different city council members that are

2197
02:14:50,473 --> 02:14:53,143
before you. So I just am sharing that as an example of

2198
02:14:53,143 --> 02:14:56,947
the community you live in, the elected officials that you have

2199
02:14:56,947 --> 02:15:00,884
and the neighbors that you have, and in this moment when

2200
02:15:00,884 --> 02:15:03,553
we are fighting on so many fronts, this is hopefully not

2201
02:15:03,553 --> 02:15:06,890
one that we're going to have to fight with. Residents and

2202
02:15:06,890 --> 02:15:08,559
electeds. We're not always going to see eye to eye on some

2203
02:15:08,559 --> 02:15:10,561
other things. We're going to fight here in a couple of cases

2204
02:15:10,561 --> 02:15:13,697
and that's fine. But this is not one of those moments. This

2205
02:15:13,697 --> 02:15:17,330
is where this is where I can feel deep pride. I know that we

2206
02:15:17,330 --> 02:15:21,638
are unified and know that the billionaires, and thankfully we

2207
02:15:21,638 --> 02:15:26,242
don't really have any live here, aren't going to keep stealing

2208
02:15:26,242 --> 02:15:29,179
our future from us. So I look forward to working with

2209
02:15:29,179 --> 02:15:30,781
colleagues. Thank you, Councilmember Baker, for

2210
02:15:30,781 --> 02:15:33,116
introducing this and for community groups for bringing

2211
02:15:33,116 --> 02:15:35,919
it forward. And I will look forward to working with our

2212
02:15:35,919 --> 02:15:40,468
county commissioners and making sure that we get this right.

2213
02:15:40,468 --> 02:15:44,500
Mayor Pro Tem. Yes, just I do have a favor to ask of, since

2214
02:15:44,500 --> 02:15:46,274
there was such an organizing tonight, I'm going to ask you

2215
02:15:46,274 --> 02:15:49,210
all for a favor. Please pay attention to what's happening

2216
02:15:49,210 --> 02:15:52,347
at the state level as well. I think many of you know I'm from

2217
02:15:52,347 --> 02:15:57,180
Halifax County, and I had to step in and help out from a

2218
02:15:57,180 --> 02:16:01,355
distance, but there was literally language at the state

2219
02:16:01,355 --> 02:16:05,427
potentially authorizing a single county to infringe on

2220
02:16:05,427 --> 02:16:07,295
three other counties. I think someone said they were from

2221
02:16:07,295 --> 02:16:11,566
Warren County and someone from the another tribe or whatever,

2222
02:16:11,566 --> 02:16:16,704
but literally Franklin County was going to be able to take

2223
02:16:16,704 --> 02:16:21,843
land with or without consent from Warren Vance and Halifax

2224
02:16:21,843 --> 02:16:25,313
to allow them to utilize their water, utilize their land and

2225
02:16:25,313 --> 02:16:30,452
their grid for this. So please, Durham, is your low hanging

2226
02:16:30,452 --> 02:16:32,921
fruit. As a matter of fact, in many cases, and like this one

2227
02:16:32,921 --> 02:16:35,923
where the fruit has already fallen off the tree, we're

2228
02:16:35,923 --> 02:16:38,727
going to have to have we have to climb higher up the tree

2229
02:16:38,727 --> 02:16:40,929
because there are some things going across going on across

2230
02:16:40,929 --> 02:16:43,598
the state. But you're organizing powers can really be

2231
02:16:43,598 --> 02:16:47,869
useful. It's this is easy in Durham, but there are some

2232
02:16:47,869 --> 02:16:50,604
folks across the state that really need our support. And

2233
02:16:50,604 --> 02:16:54,341
and personally, I'm asking for my family. We could use some of

2234
02:16:54,341 --> 02:16:59,130
this organizing power and some other parts. Thank you.

2235
02:16:59,130 --> 02:17:01,816
Thank you. And with that, the motion in front of us is to

2236
02:17:01,816 --> 02:17:04,218
adopt a resolution to set a public hearing, to impose a

2237
02:17:04,218 --> 02:17:06,488
temporary moratorium on development approvals for data

2238
02:17:06,488 --> 02:17:09,957
centers, cryptocurrency mining operations, and any use. Madam

2239
02:17:09,957 --> 02:17:13,561
Mayor Pro tem. Yes, ma'am. I'm sorry. We're on item four.

2240
02:17:13,561 --> 02:17:15,830
Oh. Good Lord, thank you. That's

2241
02:17:15,830 --> 02:17:22,504
what we did earlier. Excuse me. To adopt. So the motion before

2242
02:17:22,504 --> 02:17:25,106
us is to adopt an ordinance imposing a temporary 60 day

2243
02:17:25,106 --> 02:17:27,175
moratorium on development approvals for data centers,

2244
02:17:27,175 --> 02:17:29,177
cryptocurrency mining operations, and any use

2245
02:17:29,177 --> 02:17:31,579
associated with data center processing facilities within

2246
02:17:31,579 --> 02:17:37,185
the city of Durham. Pursuant to 160-107. Could I please get a

2247
02:17:37,185 --> 02:17:40,321
motion. so moved? Second, I have a motion and a second.

2248
02:17:40,321 --> 02:17:46,861
Madam clerk, could you please open the vote? Could you please

2249
02:17:46,861 --> 02:17:49,464
close the vote? Motion passes.

2250
02:17:49,464 --> 02:17:53,640
Unanimously. Thank you. Colleagues, we are

2251
02:18:02,744 --> 02:18:06,944
on break for the next ten minutes.

2252
02:18:07,415 --> 02:18:10,415
Okay. I came to the.

2253
02:20:28,689 --> 02:20:30,558
City to develop. Leadership and.

2254
02:20:30,558 --> 02:20:33,558
Supervisory skills. I stayed because.

2255
02:20:33,561 --> 02:20:36,163
Of the city's culture. And dedication to serving

2256
02:20:36,163 --> 02:20:41,502
residents. The city of Durham, where careers make community to

2257
02:20:41,502 --> 02:20:44,639
connect with a career that serves the whole city. Visit

2258
02:20:44,639 --> 02:20:50,390
Durham, NC gov careers. Everyone in Durham should be

2259
02:21:00,121 --> 02:21:03,992
able to find a home they can afford. That's why Forever Home

2260
02:21:03,992 --> 02:21:07,928
Durham is creating affordable, livable and inclusive

2261
02:21:07,928 --> 02:21:12,133
communities for low to middle income residents from renting

2262
02:21:12,133 --> 02:21:15,737
to owning. Find out how the city is helping more people

2263
02:21:15,737 --> 02:21:22,337
find homes right here in Durham. Learn more at Forever Home

2264
02:21:23,944 --> 02:21:28,144
Durham. Com. Owning a home. provides a.

2265
02:21:29,350 --> 02:21:31,952
Sense of. Financial stability. Family,

2266
02:21:31,952 --> 02:21:34,356
community and. Pride. With housing.

2267
02:21:34,356 --> 02:21:36,958
Prices are now higher. Than ever, making it hard for.

2268
02:21:36,958 --> 02:21:40,361
Many Durham residents to afford their first home. That's why

2269
02:21:40,361 --> 02:21:43,564
the City of Durham is offering the down Payment Assistance

2270
02:21:43,564 --> 02:21:48,313
Program to support eligible individuals with up to $80,000

2271
02:21:48,313 --> 02:21:52,517
in 0% interest forgivable loans to purchase a house within the

2272
02:21:52,517 --> 02:21:56,588
city limits. Visit the site or call to find out if you qualify

2273
02:21:56,588 --> 02:22:01,988
for the program. See a pothole? There's an app

2274
02:22:03,261 --> 02:22:07,265
for that missed pickup. There's an app for that need to set up

2275
02:22:07,265 --> 02:22:10,602
water service. There's an app for that too. Introducing the

2276
02:22:10,602 --> 02:22:14,539
one Call app. Report your service request online on your

2277
02:22:14,539 --> 02:22:18,677
schedule. Just download for free from the App Store or

2278
02:22:18,677 --> 02:22:23,148
Google Play Store. Then sign up and start using it to report

2279
02:22:23,148 --> 02:22:26,618
problems. Check the status of your service request or just

2280
02:22:26,618 --> 02:22:33,218
find out more information. Try the Durham One Call app today.

2281
02:22:33,825 --> 02:22:37,829
Here's some tips to ensure that your garbage and recycling gets

2282
02:22:37,829 --> 02:22:41,299
picked up. One. Your cart should be put out for

2283
02:22:41,299 --> 02:22:45,704
collection before 6 a.m. on your collection. Day two. Your

2284
02:22:45,704 --> 02:22:48,973
cart should be at least three feet from all other objects,

2285
02:22:48,973 --> 02:22:53,578
such as mailboxes, telephone poles, fire hydrants, trees,

2286
02:22:53,578 --> 02:22:58,517
and other carts. Three. Your cart should be no more than

2287
02:22:58,517 --> 02:23:03,188
three feet from the curb, for. No vehicles should be blocking

2288
02:23:03,188 --> 02:23:07,258
your cards. The mechanical arms on our trucks need direct

2289
02:23:07,258 --> 02:23:11,730
access to your carts and cannot reach around vehicles. To find

2290
02:23:11,730 --> 02:23:15,333
more information about garbage and recycling pickups, go to

2291
02:23:15,333 --> 02:23:21,333
this web address. I think we're going to. I think

2292
02:30:09,753 --> 02:30:15,753
we're going to get started. You're going to keep running.

2293
02:30:35,178 --> 02:30:39,783
The game right? I think so. Ladies and gentlemen.

2294
02:30:39,783 --> 02:30:46,383
Colleagues, I need colleagues back on the dais. Let's go. And

2295
02:30:56,800 --> 02:30:59,336
I'm going to go ahead and get us started because we are

2296
02:30:59,336 --> 02:31:01,939
already at quorum. I do want to announce that the canes game is

2297
02:31:01,939 --> 02:31:06,343
tied up for those who are paying attention. Third period

2298
02:31:06,343 --> 02:31:12,343
were tied up two, two. Count. Council Member Burris is

2299
02:31:14,551 --> 02:31:17,154
picking on me. I also never watched a hockey game until my

2300
02:31:17,154 --> 02:31:23,754
kid started playing hockey. So. I think the next item. Sorry,

2301
02:31:30,367 --> 02:31:33,104
y'all give me a second. I'm going to keep us going and

2302
02:31:33,104 --> 02:31:38,642
we'll wait. Okay, the next item I have is a public hearing and

2303
02:31:38,642 --> 02:31:42,379
economic development incentive agreement with AMEC Properties,

2304
02:31:42,379 --> 02:31:47,251
Inc.. We have a public hearing, so I'm going to go ahead and

2305
02:31:47,251 --> 02:31:50,254
do. Oh, we have staff here. I'm going to hear the staff report

2306
02:31:50,254 --> 02:31:54,454
and then declare the public hearing open.

2307
02:31:56,660 --> 02:31:59,600
Good evening. Madam Pro.

2308
02:31:59,630 --> 02:32:01,932
Tem and members of council. My name is Chris Dickey with the

2309
02:32:01,932 --> 02:32:04,935
Office of Economic and Workforce Development. Before

2310
02:32:04,935 --> 02:32:07,400
you as an item to consider approval of a proposed

2311
02:32:07,400 --> 02:32:10,274
agreement between the City of Durham and Massey Properties

2312
02:32:10,274 --> 02:32:13,544
Incorporated. When a family opened, Rosellas Professional

2313
02:32:13,544 --> 02:32:16,947
Complex in the late 1980s, one of the first tenants was a

2314
02:32:16,947 --> 02:32:19,349
daycare center, reflecting their deep commitment to care

2315
02:32:19,349 --> 02:32:22,953
and community. Over the years, the complex expanded to include

2316
02:32:22,953 --> 02:32:25,822
a diverse mix of businesses, including a salon, barber shop,

2317
02:32:25,822 --> 02:32:28,826
insurance agency, and a communication store offering

2318
02:32:28,826 --> 02:32:32,496
phones, Wi-Fi products, and early access to technology.

2319
02:32:32,496 --> 02:32:36,330
Well before such resources, well before such resources were

2320
02:32:36,330 --> 02:32:39,103
widely available in the neighborhood. Now, under second

2321
02:32:39,103 --> 02:32:41,906
generation leadership, the Agency Properties Incorporated

2322
02:32:41,906 --> 02:32:45,709
plans to renovate a 5800 square foot building to enhance curb

2323
02:32:45,709 --> 02:32:49,447
appeal and accessibility and upgrade building security. This

2324
02:32:49,447 --> 02:32:51,782
renovation and redevelopment project will promote the

2325
02:32:51,782 --> 02:32:54,318
continued revitalization and economic development and

2326
02:32:54,318 --> 02:32:57,588
economic vitality of the targeted community development

2327
02:32:57,588 --> 02:33:00,524
area along the Fayetteville Street corridor. Upon the

2328
02:33:00,524 --> 02:33:02,726
completion of a project expected to stimulate new

2329
02:33:02,726 --> 02:33:05,195
business development and stabilize existing businesses

2330
02:33:05,195 --> 02:33:08,465
within the building, the. The proposed project will attract

2331
02:33:08,465 --> 02:33:12,650
$849,000 in private investment, with 150,000 city funding

2332
02:33:13,604 --> 02:33:18,742
producing approximately a 5.6 ratio to one of private to

2333
02:33:18,742 --> 02:33:22,346
public funding. Staff endorses this project, which would be an

2334
02:33:22,346 --> 02:33:25,215
asset in promoting the vitality of traditionally underutilized

2335
02:33:25,215 --> 02:33:28,218
businesses, including minority and women owned businesses

2336
02:33:28,218 --> 02:33:30,954
along the Fayetteville Street Commercial Court. The project.

2337
02:33:30,954 --> 02:33:35,910
The project directly addresses a major goal of the cities of

2338
02:33:35,910 --> 02:33:37,761
Durham's strategic plan and advancing shared economic

2339
02:33:37,761 --> 02:33:40,630
prosperity, and it furthers the objective of the Office of

2340
02:33:40,630 --> 02:33:43,967
Economic Development, shared Economic Development Seed

2341
02:33:43,967 --> 02:33:47,304
Initiative, which supports an ecosystem of strategies,

2342
02:33:47,304 --> 02:33:50,304
business stabilization, business succession planning,

2343
02:33:50,908 --> 02:33:53,110
and supports the growth and expansion of Durham's legacy

2344
02:33:53,110 --> 02:33:56,780
business. The Office of Economic Development is both a

2345
02:33:56,780 --> 02:33:58,848
collaborator and funding partner, and building key

2346
02:33:58,848 --> 02:34:01,585
partnerships that increase technical assistance capacity

2347
02:34:01,585 --> 02:34:04,521
in Durham small business ecosystem and help to preserve

2348
02:34:04,521 --> 02:34:07,729
wealth among minority owned legacy business as well as

2349
02:34:07,729 --> 02:34:10,640
historically underserved residents working at local

2350
02:34:10,640 --> 02:34:13,664
businesses. Thank you. You've heard the

2351
02:34:17,539 --> 02:34:21,760
report from staff. The public hearing is now open. First,

2352
02:34:21,760 --> 02:34:26,347
council colleagues, do we have any questions or comments?

2353
02:34:26,347 --> 02:34:30,618
Okay. So I'm going to go ahead and invite, I guess, the

2354
02:34:30,618 --> 02:34:35,223
applicant. Madam clerk, would that be approved? No. Okay.

2355
02:34:35,223 --> 02:34:37,623
Just any speakers. It's.

2356
02:34:40,628 --> 02:34:43,165
Madam mayor pro tem, it's not a rezoning. Public hearing. So

2357
02:34:43,165 --> 02:34:46,435
the staff report was presenting the project, I believe. Unless.

2358
02:34:46,435 --> 02:34:50,350
Oh, well, the property owners here.

2359
02:34:52,507 --> 02:34:54,843
Good evening. Good evening.

2360
02:34:54,843 --> 02:34:56,445
How much time do you think you need?

2361
02:34:56,445 --> 02:34:57,379
Just two. Minutes left.

2362
02:34:57,379 --> 02:34:59,379
Perfect. Thank you.

2363
02:34:59,848 --> 02:35:00,382
Hi. My name.

2364
02:35:00,382 --> 02:35:04,253
Is Merrick Roma Steele. I'm here to speak about the

2365
02:35:04,253 --> 02:35:06,855
location. For over four. Decades.

2366
02:35:06,855 --> 02:35:09,591
My mother, Marcella professional. My mother started

2367
02:35:09,591 --> 02:35:13,610
Marcel's professional complex. The business located at 2919

2368
02:35:13,610 --> 02:35:16,640
Fayetteville Street. It has been more than just a location.

2369
02:35:16,640 --> 02:35:19,734
It's been a steady presence in the Durham community since

2370
02:35:19,734 --> 02:35:23,934
1984. Through the changing times, economic shifts and

2371
02:35:24,206 --> 02:35:27,806
neighborhood transitions transitioning, we have remained

2372
02:35:28,343 --> 02:35:30,813
committed to serving our community and customers and

2373
02:35:30,813 --> 02:35:34,820
supporting the local family, families and contributing to

2374
02:35:34,820 --> 02:35:38,620
the vitality of this historical corridor. This grant is just

2375
02:35:38,620 --> 02:35:41,690
not an investment in a building. It is an investment

2376
02:35:41,690 --> 02:35:45,260
in the legacy, stability and future. A growth of our

2377
02:35:45,260 --> 02:35:48,626
community. Our business has demonstrated resilience,

2378
02:35:48,764 --> 02:35:53,101
dedication for over 40 years. We've created jobs, provided

2379
02:35:53,101 --> 02:35:57,172
consistency and services and other business growth, build

2380
02:35:57,172 --> 02:36:00,776
relationships with spans of generations. Many of your

2381
02:36:00,776 --> 02:36:04,913
customers are not just clients, they're neighbors who trust us.

2382
02:36:04,913 --> 02:36:09,318
For decades. With this funding, we were strengthen our ability

2383
02:36:09,318 --> 02:36:12,521
to continue the services in the community by improving our

2384
02:36:12,521 --> 02:36:15,924
space, expanding our offering, and ensuring that we will

2385
02:36:15,924 --> 02:36:20,796
remain reliable and welcoming place for years to come. The

2386
02:36:20,796 --> 02:36:24,733
support will allow us to adopt a modern, challenging, modern,

2387
02:36:24,733 --> 02:36:28,604
challenging challenges while preserving the history and the

2388
02:36:28,604 --> 02:36:34,400
character that makes our business unique. We are not

2389
02:36:35,477 --> 02:36:39,548
starting from scratch. We are building on a foundation, a

2390
02:36:39,548 --> 02:36:42,548
foundation rooted in commitment, preservation,

2391
02:36:43,418 --> 02:36:48,356
community impact. This grant will help us ensure that what

2392
02:36:48,356 --> 02:36:53,228
what was began in 1984 continues and thrive well into

2393
02:36:53,228 --> 02:36:56,899
the future and benefit not just only our businesses, but the

2394
02:36:56,899 --> 02:36:59,634
entire Durham community. Thank you for considering our

2395
02:36:59,634 --> 02:37:03,834
application. Thank you so much, Madam Clerk.

2396
02:37:04,906 --> 02:37:11,447
I have one online speaker. Oh, and you're here. Go ahead.

2397
02:37:11,447 --> 02:37:12,781
Could you just please state your name for the.

2398
02:37:12,781 --> 02:37:14,781
Record? Good afternoon.

2399
02:37:16,585 --> 02:37:18,985
Council mayor. City manager.

2400
02:37:18,987 --> 02:37:22,391
My name is Tanya Taylor Dingell. My consulting team is

2401
02:37:22,391 --> 02:37:24,993
MQ Nicole Global. And we've been working with the Office of

2402
02:37:24,993 --> 02:37:28,530
Economic and Workforce Development on various small

2403
02:37:28,530 --> 02:37:32,734
business community projects. And so I'm here to support

2404
02:37:32,734 --> 02:37:37,873
Mariko Steele and her projects. In 2020, the Office of Economic

2405
02:37:37,873 --> 02:37:41,900
and Workforce Development worked with started working

2406
02:37:41,900 --> 02:37:45,809
with legacy businesses in Durham. In 2024. They continued

2407
02:37:46,748 --> 02:37:51,153
on with small business, helping the small business ecosystem by

2408
02:37:51,153 --> 02:37:53,221
working with businesses that are along the Fayetteville

2409
02:37:53,221 --> 02:37:58,210
Street corridor. Mariko still fits into almost every

2410
02:37:59,270 --> 02:38:02,631
demographic of all those programs and iterations. She

2411
02:38:02,631 --> 02:38:05,701
represents legacy businesses. She represents Fayetteville

2412
02:38:05,701 --> 02:38:08,771
Street, she represents small business. She represents legacy

2413
02:38:08,771 --> 02:38:12,307
commercial property ownership. And I'm sure I could find a few

2414
02:38:12,307 --> 02:38:15,577
more pockets of that she would represent as well. She is a

2415
02:38:15,577 --> 02:38:19,380
shining example of what the technical support that this

2416
02:38:19,380 --> 02:38:22,451
city is offering to businesses and property owners, and what

2417
02:38:22,451 --> 02:38:26,321
it can do for the city. Her property, as you've read in her

2418
02:38:26,321 --> 02:38:29,191
application, has been in business supporting

2419
02:38:29,191 --> 02:38:32,860
Fayetteville Street community for over five decades. When you

2420
02:38:32,860 --> 02:38:37,600
visit Mariko or sorry, Marcellus Professional Suites,

2421
02:38:37,199 --> 02:38:40,202
which is a property that her mother, Marcella Steele,

2422
02:38:40,202 --> 02:38:43,939
started, you're also going to be meeting multiple other

2423
02:38:43,939 --> 02:38:47,342
business owners who have been given a chance, and that's

2424
02:38:47,342 --> 02:38:50,110
really what they are given. They're just given a chance.

2425
02:38:50,110 --> 02:38:53,481
How did they how are they receiving a chance? Her rents

2426
02:38:53,481 --> 02:38:57,285
are not exactly market rate. Now that would make any

2427
02:38:57,285 --> 02:39:01,356
economist or consultant cringe. But what it does is that it has

2428
02:39:01,356 --> 02:39:05,560
created loyal tenancies. It's created almost a business

2429
02:39:05,560 --> 02:39:09,631
incubator. Even if she's not officially one, a business hub

2430
02:39:09,631 --> 02:39:12,967
and even a microeconomic center along the Fayetteville Street

2431
02:39:12,967 --> 02:39:16,438
corridor. When my team interviewed her to assist her

2432
02:39:16,438 --> 02:39:19,374
with her application, all she could think about was the

2433
02:39:19,374 --> 02:39:22,711
possibilities. And those are the reasons why you should

2434
02:39:22,711 --> 02:39:24,912
assist her in trying to modernize her space.

2435
02:39:24,912 --> 02:39:27,782
Thank you. Thank you so much, Madam Clerk.

2436
02:39:27,782 --> 02:39:30,852
I don't have any other speakers signed up. Is there anyone here

2437
02:39:30,852 --> 02:39:36,257
who would like to speak on item number 20? Okay. Seeing no one

2438
02:39:36,257 --> 02:39:38,727
signed up, this public hearing is now closed. And before the

2439
02:39:38,727 --> 02:39:41,996
council. Council members, do we have any comments or questions

2440
02:39:41,996 --> 02:39:47,996
for staff or the applicant? Go ahead. Council Member Rist.

2441
02:39:49,671 --> 02:39:52,540
Thanks. Mayor Pro Tem. Yeah, I think this is now appreciate

2442
02:39:52,540 --> 02:39:55,410
Mr. Dickey's presentation. I think the second incentive

2443
02:39:55,410 --> 02:39:57,412
grant has come before the council since I've been on the

2444
02:39:57,412 --> 02:40:02,160
council, I have been on record both here in the council, but

2445
02:40:02,160 --> 02:40:04,219
also in previous my professional life, being very

2446
02:40:04,219 --> 02:40:07,289
cautious about the use of public dollars to incentivize

2447
02:40:07,289 --> 02:40:09,557
private businesses. So I think there's for me, there's a high

2448
02:40:09,557 --> 02:40:12,961
bar. I love the story of the business owners here. I love

2449
02:40:12,961 --> 02:40:15,970
the story of legacy businesses. I love the Fable Street

2450
02:40:15,970 --> 02:40:17,365
corridor. We're clearly, as a city investing in the

2451
02:40:17,365 --> 02:40:20,235
Fayetteville Street corridor. So I just want to for staff, I

2452
02:40:20,235 --> 02:40:23,380
just want to get a better sense of we could invest in a lot of

2453
02:40:23,380 --> 02:40:24,840
businesses on the Fayetteville Street corridor, I imagine.

2454
02:40:24,840 --> 02:40:27,776
Right. So can you give me a sense, Mr. Dickey, of like,

2455
02:40:27,776 --> 02:40:31,180
what's our budget like? Like why why this business? Why not

2456
02:40:31,180 --> 02:40:33,915
others? What's our what's the larger plan here? What's the

2457
02:40:33,915 --> 02:40:37,719
strategic sort of, sort of orientation of the city

2458
02:40:37,719 --> 02:40:39,788
towards? Certainly the Fayetteville Street quarter and

2459
02:40:39,788 --> 02:40:42,724
these kind of incentive grants. Well.

2460
02:40:42,724 --> 02:40:48,664
I think as it says, since 2020, council has graciously given

2461
02:40:48,664 --> 02:40:50,799
the office of Economic Workforce the dollars to

2462
02:40:50,799 --> 02:40:54,202
support legacy business through technical assistance. And

2463
02:40:54,202 --> 02:40:56,872
throughout the years, we have a neighborhood revitalization

2464
02:40:56,872 --> 02:41:01,100
grant as well. Fayetteville Street is a major commercial

2465
02:41:01,100 --> 02:41:04,813
corridor that City Council supports. This business sits

2466
02:41:04,813 --> 02:41:08,160
along Fayetteville Street corridor. Matter of fact, it's

2467
02:41:08,160 --> 02:41:12,353
in the very trying area. Difficult to for business

2468
02:41:12,353 --> 02:41:15,423
development along that particular area. And a lot of

2469
02:41:15,423 --> 02:41:18,427
businesses that are currently operating in what what we can

2470
02:41:18,427 --> 02:41:21,830
consider to her a business incubator are paying under

2471
02:41:21,830 --> 02:41:25,234
market share at that particular point. She wants to spruce up

2472
02:41:25,234 --> 02:41:28,237
the place along with some of the other city activities that

2473
02:41:28,237 --> 02:41:31,173
are going to go on to spruce up the activities so that she

2474
02:41:31,173 --> 02:41:33,375
still could be a stabilizing force in that particular

2475
02:41:33,375 --> 02:41:36,178
community. This particular project meets the tenets of the

2476
02:41:36,178 --> 02:41:38,646
neighborhood revitalization, meaning what it's doing is

2477
02:41:38,646 --> 02:41:41,249
aesthetically approving the parents along that particular

2478
02:41:41,249 --> 02:41:44,319
corridor. And not only that, we're still supporting a legacy

2479
02:41:44,319 --> 02:41:47,923
businesses. What in reference to what the strategic plan is

2480
02:41:47,923 --> 02:41:51,660
asking us to do? You know, again, I appreciate

2481
02:41:51,660 --> 02:41:53,996
all that. I think that is true. I guess what I'm trying to get

2482
02:41:53,996 --> 02:41:58,200
a sense of is so what is what's the annual budget at WD for

2483
02:41:58,200 --> 02:42:01,803
supporting these kind of grants for in this case this is for.

2484
02:42:01,803 --> 02:42:05,740
So in this particular case here we could get anywhere between

2485
02:42:05,740 --> 02:42:07,474
300,300, 300, $350,000 out of neighborhood revitalization

2486
02:42:09,811 --> 02:42:14,283
program to support a project such as this..

2487
02:42:14,283 --> 02:42:16,283
Annually, $350,000 annually. Yeah.

2488
02:42:16,819 --> 02:42:21,423
23 and again 350. So I I've been careful I'm

2489
02:42:21,423 --> 02:42:23,558
cautious about whether it's a large incentive grant for big

2490
02:42:23,558 --> 02:42:27,162
corporate employees or jobs or corporate employees or small

2491
02:42:27,162 --> 02:42:30,899
ones. I do want to and I appreciate Mister Gundy here as

2492
02:42:30,899 --> 02:42:34,102
well. I know that our policy also says that we that there's

2493
02:42:34,102 --> 02:42:37,305
an evaluation criteria that includes a kind of but for

2494
02:42:37,305 --> 02:42:40,442
financial analysis. So can you give me a sense of like but for

2495
02:42:40,442 --> 02:42:43,712
this grant, what would not have happened that I want to make

2496
02:42:43,712 --> 02:42:46,181
again, clear, because we have limited public dollars. Right.

2497
02:42:46,181 --> 02:42:50,919
So what's the why the win here. What's what's the because

2498
02:42:50,919 --> 02:42:53,188
there's you know, there's also an old adage that, you know,

2499
02:42:53,188 --> 02:42:56,124
you've heard the old Lay's potato chips. It's hard to eat

2500
02:42:56,124 --> 02:42:59,862
just one. Right. And there's also the reverse adages like

2501
02:42:59,862 --> 02:43:02,597
for incentives, there's the old it's hard to give away just

2502
02:43:02,597 --> 02:43:05,333
one. Right. So once we give away 1 to 1 business, like how

2503
02:43:05,333 --> 02:43:08,737
do we again, what's the strategic sort of orientation.

2504
02:43:08,737 --> 02:43:11,873
How do we what is the but for analysis we've done here that

2505
02:43:11,873 --> 02:43:14,943
indicates for this business but for our incentive this

2506
02:43:14,943 --> 02:43:17,413
investment wouldn't happen. Yeah I appreciate the question.

2507
02:43:17,413 --> 02:43:19,748
And good evening, Joshua Gunn Office of Economic and

2508
02:43:19,748 --> 02:43:25,148
Workforce Development. This is another example of a property

2509
02:43:25,154 --> 02:43:28,891
owner who has assembled their own resources right to the

2510
02:43:28,891 --> 02:43:32,627
maximum amount of the resources that they can assemble. And

2511
02:43:32,627 --> 02:43:36,765
then that but for is it's going to take just a little bit more

2512
02:43:36,765 --> 02:43:39,300
to get to the finish line in terms of this project. Right.

2513
02:43:39,300 --> 02:43:43,304
It's complex. It's an older property. There's been a lot of

2514
02:43:43,304 --> 02:43:46,508
technical assistance with our department and NMCB working

2515
02:43:46,508 --> 02:43:50,378
with them to get them to this point and that, but for is the

2516
02:43:50,378 --> 02:43:53,849
the incentive amount before you today to get the property up to

2517
02:43:53,849 --> 02:43:55,984
the modernization that they're looking to get to.

2518
02:43:55,984 --> 02:43:58,320
And is that I mean does that but for was that like sort of

2519
02:43:58,320 --> 02:44:00,255
spreadsheet or is that sort of more of like a feel like what

2520
02:44:00,255 --> 02:44:03,458
is that what does that analysis look like?

2521
02:44:03,458 --> 02:44:07,195
The analysis. So one of the things that in Chris, please

2522
02:44:07,195 --> 02:44:09,598
feel free to jump in here, but I'll do my best here. One of

2523
02:44:09,598 --> 02:44:14,469
the things that we have taken Miss Steele through is the

2524
02:44:14,469 --> 02:44:18,940
process of the planning process. The design process.

2525
02:44:18,940 --> 02:44:21,409
What is what is the actual project going to look like?

2526
02:44:21,409 --> 02:44:25,614
What are you going to need for this thing to solve for what is

2527
02:44:25,614 --> 02:44:28,349
a significant challenge in the corridor? Right. So I don't

2528
02:44:28,349 --> 02:44:31,860
know if you know exactly where this is, but this is at the

2529
02:44:31,860 --> 02:44:34,890
intersection of the American Tobacco Trail and the

2530
02:44:34,890 --> 02:44:37,920
Fayetteville Street corridor. This is a part of that

2531
02:44:37,920 --> 02:44:40,829
particularly challenged part of that corridor. And so prior to

2532
02:44:40,829 --> 02:44:45,367
bringing this incentive before the council, we helped do a

2533
02:44:45,367 --> 02:44:48,503
deep analysis of what was possible with the property,

2534
02:44:48,503 --> 02:44:51,573
what it would look like, and then what it would cost. Miss

2535
02:44:51,573 --> 02:44:54,910
Steele assembled the capital stack that she could. And the

2536
02:44:54,910 --> 02:44:57,712
gap that we found is what we put before council today for

2537
02:44:57,712 --> 02:45:01,183
public support. In partnership with her significant private

2538
02:45:01,183 --> 02:45:03,652
investment. Gotcha. Thanks. Yeah. No, I

2539
02:45:03,652 --> 02:45:05,987
think, you know, reading the literature on incentives,

2540
02:45:05,987 --> 02:45:07,922
right. Some of the best folks in the country to look at this

2541
02:45:07,922 --> 02:45:11,593
like, it's not often it's hard to make the case, but but where

2542
02:45:11,593 --> 02:45:14,396
you can make the case is when an incentive does bring

2543
02:45:14,396 --> 02:45:17,650
economic activity to an area that might not receive that. So

2544
02:45:17,650 --> 02:45:18,934
I appreciate that. I mean, I think this is a really

2545
02:45:18,934 --> 02:45:21,269
compelling one. But again, I just want to make sure we're

2546
02:45:21,269 --> 02:45:24,740
clear as a city with a with a tight budget, if we're giving

2547
02:45:24,740 --> 02:45:27,750
away public dollars to private businesses, I want to make sure

2548
02:45:27,750 --> 02:45:29,477
that we're very strategic about how we invest those dollars.

2549
02:45:29,477 --> 02:45:31,813
But again, I think in this case with the neighborhood that

2550
02:45:31,813 --> 02:45:34,883
needs that kind of investment, I can I think it does pass my

2551
02:45:34,883 --> 02:45:37,218
threshold. So thank you. Thank you.

2552
02:45:37,218 --> 02:45:40,218
Thank you, Councilmember. Mayor Williams.

2553
02:45:43,240 --> 02:45:45,930
Council Member Burris I'll be brief in my remarks. I'm not

2554
02:45:45,930 --> 02:45:48,290
going to come short. Rapid fire. I'm excited to support a

2555
02:45:48,290 --> 02:45:50,565
legacy business considering what's happened in that quarter

2556
02:45:50,565 --> 02:45:52,900
right now and what these businesses have to endure. As

2557
02:45:52,900 --> 02:45:54,703
you said, this is right there, I believe the intersection,

2558
02:45:54,703 --> 02:45:57,773
Fayetteville Road and pilot. And so if you drive down at any

2559
02:45:57,773 --> 02:46:01,420
point in a day, you will see what happens on that trail. And

2560
02:46:01,420 --> 02:46:03,244
so I can only imagine that at some point that may be a

2561
02:46:03,244 --> 02:46:05,713
deterrent from any business owners in that community

2562
02:46:05,713 --> 02:46:08,917
because of what it looks like. So I appreciate and I

2563
02:46:08,917 --> 02:46:12,530
appreciate the packet in terms of how we look for support.

2564
02:46:12,530 --> 02:46:15,390
This private business. But however they are, they will

2565
02:46:15,390 --> 02:46:17,659
generate tax revenue and commercial dollars. It's going

2566
02:46:17,659 --> 02:46:20,729
to help essentially benefit our entire community. So I look

2567
02:46:20,729 --> 02:46:23,131
forward to seeing projects of this nature will make sure that

2568
02:46:23,131 --> 02:46:26,287
the legacy owners, as that corridor is changing, they

2569
02:46:26,287 --> 02:46:28,490
still have some skin in the game. If they are able to

2570
02:46:28,490 --> 02:46:30,159
provide for their families for generations. Thank you all so

2571
02:46:30,159 --> 02:46:33,161
much for your work. Thank you.

2572
02:46:33,161 --> 02:46:35,960
Thank you. Council Member Burris mayor Williams.

2573
02:46:35,960 --> 02:46:39,501
I should have gone before her. Basically, I was going to say

2574
02:46:39,501 --> 02:46:43,372
the same thing for a community like Durham who believe so much

2575
02:46:43,372 --> 02:46:46,241
inequity. First, I want to appreciate Council Member

2576
02:46:46,241 --> 02:46:50,912
Burris, you know, really focus on this. You've been very

2577
02:46:50,912 --> 02:46:54,717
consistent on it, and I appreciate you. You know,

2578
02:46:54,717 --> 02:46:58,187
leaning in and and but also, you know, making way when, when

2579
02:46:58,187 --> 02:47:01,990
you say it's compelling enough. But Durham believes in equity.

2580
02:47:01,990 --> 02:47:05,594
And this has been one of the most divested communities in

2581
02:47:05,594 --> 02:47:09,665
our city's history. The houses along this corridor were built

2582
02:47:09,665 --> 02:47:13,535
by carpentry students at Hillside High School and nCCU

2583
02:47:13,535 --> 02:47:17,806
way before I was born. This has always been a community that's

2584
02:47:17,806 --> 02:47:21,900
been invested within itself, and I look at it this way two

2585
02:47:21,900 --> 02:47:25,213
things can happen. Investment can happen from within the

2586
02:47:25,213 --> 02:47:27,549
community, or investment can happen to the community.

2587
02:47:27,549 --> 02:47:30,885
Usually when investment happens to the community, the people in

2588
02:47:30,885 --> 02:47:35,824
it are placed out. And this is an opportunity for us to not

2589
02:47:35,824 --> 02:47:40,229
necessarily gentrify, but revitalize and and based on

2590
02:47:40,229 --> 02:47:45,434
Durham's rich history and what's happening in the past,

2591
02:47:45,434 --> 02:47:49,571
there are some parts of the city where we owe some form of

2592
02:47:49,571 --> 02:47:54,777
repair. And I think this is an opportunity to do that. So I

2593
02:47:54,777 --> 02:48:00,777
look forward to supporting it. Any other comments or questions?

2594
02:48:03,520 --> 02:48:04,853
Oh, sorry. Council Member Kopac.

2595
02:48:04,853 --> 02:48:08,457
Yes. Thank you. Just say very briefly that I'm glad we have

2596
02:48:08,457 --> 02:48:11,126
this neighborhood revitalization program. I

2597
02:48:11,126 --> 02:48:15,640
appreciate council member. Careful. I toward use of public

2598
02:48:15,640 --> 02:48:20,680
dollars and use of incentives. I'll just echo my colleagues

2599
02:48:20,680 --> 02:48:23,405
Council Member Burris and the mayor saying that I, I do

2600
02:48:23,405 --> 02:48:27,943
believe that investment in this quarter is so critical and so

2601
02:48:27,943 --> 02:48:30,278
necessary and so appropriate. And so I appreciate your due

2602
02:48:30,278 --> 02:48:33,882
diligence in evaluating this. The applicant's long term

2603
02:48:33,882 --> 02:48:37,686
investment in our community in this quarter. And there

2604
02:48:37,686 --> 02:48:42,624
willingness to to to reinvest in this really important part

2605
02:48:42,624 --> 02:48:45,694
of, of of, of our city. And so I look forward to supporting

2606
02:48:45,694 --> 02:48:49,894
it. Thank you. Thank you. Council Member

2607
02:48:50,165 --> 02:48:53,368
Kopac. Unless I have any other questions or comments, the

2608
02:48:53,368 --> 02:48:56,171
motion before us is to authorize the city manager to

2609
02:48:56,171 --> 02:48:59,975
execute an economic development agreement with AMEC properties,

2610
02:48:59,975 --> 02:49:04,112
or Amoc properties, Inc., in an amount not to exceed $150,000

2611
02:49:04,112 --> 02:49:07,582
for building renovation project at 2919 Fayetteville Street,

2612
02:49:07,582 --> 02:49:09,582
Durham, NC. So.

2613
02:49:11,520 --> 02:49:15,657
So move. Thank you. Second, thank you.

2614
02:49:15,657 --> 02:49:17,926
I have a motion and a second. Madam clerk, could you please

2615
02:49:17,926 --> 02:49:23,326
open the vote? Could you please close the vote?

2616
02:49:25,467 --> 02:49:28,467
Motion passes unanimously. Thank you.

2617
02:49:29,537 --> 02:49:31,537
Congratulations. Congratulations.

2618
02:49:40,281 --> 02:49:44,219
I like when we get to do happy things like that. Our next.

2619
02:49:44,219 --> 02:49:46,487
The rest of the evening is going to be just like that.

2620
02:49:46,487 --> 02:49:51,287
It's going to be. Amazing. The next item.

2621
02:49:51,959 --> 02:49:54,563
Mayor Williams, do you want me to keep going?

2622
02:49:54,563 --> 02:49:56,963
Yeah. Keep going. Okay.

2623
02:49:57,299 --> 02:50:00,969
Item number 21. Next agenda item is a public hearing and

2624
02:50:00,969 --> 02:50:05,769
economic development incentive agreement with cocoa Fro, LLC.

2625
02:50:06,241 --> 02:50:10,778
Could l, Mr. Dickey? Good to see you. I'll take our staff

2626
02:50:10,778 --> 02:50:13,480
report. Madam Pro Tem members of

2627
02:50:13,480 --> 02:50:17,252
council. My name is Chris Dickey with the Office of

2628
02:50:17,252 --> 02:50:19,387
Economic and Workforce Development. Before you as an

2629
02:50:19,387 --> 02:50:21,722
item and consider approval of proposed economic development

2630
02:50:21,722 --> 02:50:26,527
agreement between the City of Durham and Cocoa Pro LLC. Cocoa

2631
02:50:26,527 --> 02:50:29,264
Pro LLC is now preparing for his next phase, establishing a

2632
02:50:29,264 --> 02:50:33,602
permanent home at 104 1004 Morning Glory Avenue in Durham,

2633
02:50:33,602 --> 02:50:37,500
North Carolina. This 1300 square foot space will serve as

2634
02:50:37,500 --> 02:50:40,142
a production facility and public facing tasting room,

2635
02:50:40,142 --> 02:50:43,411
bringing in manufacturing, retail and community engagement

2636
02:50:43,411 --> 02:50:46,281
under one roof. To make this possible, the building requires

2637
02:50:46,281 --> 02:50:49,217
comprehensive rehabilitation plan. Improvements include

2638
02:50:49,217 --> 02:50:53,880
structural repairs, upgraded plumbing and electrical systems

2639
02:50:53,880 --> 02:50:56,157
to support commercial commercial equipment, fire

2640
02:50:56,157 --> 02:50:58,360
safety enhancements, and the installation of a fully

2641
02:50:58,360 --> 02:51:01,496
compliant commercial kitchen. Exterior improvements will

2642
02:51:01,496 --> 02:51:03,565
restore the building's presence, creating a clean,

2643
02:51:03,565 --> 02:51:07,102
well lit and welcoming environment. This project

2644
02:51:07,102 --> 02:51:09,838
represents a tangible investment in a local economic

2645
02:51:09,838 --> 02:51:12,774
growth and neighborhood revitalization. By activating a

2646
02:51:12,774 --> 02:51:15,510
currently underused property, it will create stable

2647
02:51:15,510 --> 02:51:18,579
employment opportunities, contribute to local tax base,

2648
02:51:18,579 --> 02:51:22,117
and help shift the trajectory of the surrounding corridor. A.

2649
02:51:22,117 --> 02:51:24,786
Thriving storefronts signal possibilities. They attract

2650
02:51:24,786 --> 02:51:27,255
foot traffic, reduce vacancies and encourage additional

2651
02:51:27,255 --> 02:51:30,125
business development by transforming this site into a

2652
02:51:30,125 --> 02:51:33,662
vibrant, professionally operated facility. Cocoa LLC

2653
02:51:33,662 --> 02:51:36,798
aims to demonstrate what is possible, helping to catalyze

2654
02:51:36,798 --> 02:51:39,668
further investment in long term community stability. The

2655
02:51:39,668 --> 02:51:43,868
proposed project will attract $593,000 in private investment,

2656
02:51:44,339 --> 02:51:47,339
with 150,000 $115,000 in city funding, producing

2657
02:51:49,410 --> 02:51:53,100
approximately 5.16 to 1% private to public funding

2658
02:51:53,815 --> 02:51:57,886
ratio. A major priority of the City of Durham is increasing

2659
02:51:57,886 --> 02:52:01,230
and strengthen the economic stability of the city. The

2660
02:52:01,230 --> 02:52:03,425
proposed project, when completed, will be a key step

2661
02:52:03,425 --> 02:52:05,293
in implementing the Neighborhood Assessment plan

2662
02:52:05,293 --> 02:52:08,430
that was approved by the City Council. This assessment plan

2663
02:52:08,430 --> 02:52:11,499
calls for the renovation of blighted and underutilized

2664
02:52:11,499 --> 02:52:14,302
buildings as a means of attracting private capital

2665
02:52:14,302 --> 02:52:17,172
investments to promote business development and stabilization

2666
02:52:17,172 --> 02:52:19,975
in the City of Durham. Designated Community

2667
02:52:19,975 --> 02:52:22,510
Development Area. The opportunity to attract this

2668
02:52:22,510 --> 02:52:26,470
type of capital investment is somewhat challenging, since

2669
02:52:26,470 --> 02:52:28,784
it's considered high risk for successful economic

2670
02:52:28,784 --> 02:52:31,786
development. The project will serve as a catalyst to attract

2671
02:52:31,786 --> 02:52:33,922
additional business and development projects to this

2672
02:52:33,922 --> 02:52:37,211
area. Staff endorses this project, which align with the

2673
02:52:37,211 --> 02:52:39,948
goals and objectives of the Neighborhood Ization Grant,

2674
02:52:39,948 --> 02:52:44,748
incentive program. Thank you. I'm going to declare

2675
02:52:47,221 --> 02:52:49,758
this public hearing open. Now that we've heard the staff's

2676
02:52:49,758 --> 02:52:53,361
report. Colleagues, before, I invite any speakers. Do you

2677
02:52:53,361 --> 02:52:58,990
have any questions or comments for staff? Okay. Go ahead.

2678
02:52:58,990 --> 02:53:01,235
Council Member Rist. Mr. Dickey, I just have a

2679
02:53:01,235 --> 02:53:03,571
question about the location here. And this just came up in

2680
02:53:03,571 --> 02:53:05,639
a conversation with the applicant. So this is in the

2681
02:53:05,639 --> 02:53:08,776
Goose Creek outfall area, right? Correct. And you've

2682
02:53:08,776 --> 02:53:11,246
mentioned sort of plumbing improvements, commercial

2683
02:53:11,246 --> 02:53:14,716
kitchen. So is is is this project in any way? I know

2684
02:53:14,716 --> 02:53:16,785
we've sort of like we're now trying to deal with the

2685
02:53:16,785 --> 02:53:21,456
capacity of the Goose Creek area. Is this is this a y'all

2686
02:53:21,456 --> 02:53:24,192
looked with planning to make sure that this is compliant

2687
02:53:24,192 --> 02:53:28,530
with given our new sort of how we're proceeding with the sort

2688
02:53:28,530 --> 02:53:31,532
of development approvals in the Goose Creek outflow area. If

2689
02:53:31,532 --> 02:53:33,934
the manager knows as well. But I just want to make sure we're

2690
02:53:33,934 --> 02:53:36,271
there. We're not sort of running afoul of those

2691
02:53:36,271 --> 02:53:38,720
restrictions that are in place right now, is we address a

2692
02:53:38,720 --> 02:53:39,673
sewer capacity. Can you hold hold on one

2693
02:53:39,673 --> 02:53:43,873
second, please? Yeah. We haven't discussed that

2694
02:53:53,287 --> 02:53:56,691
with planning. We can do that and report back as it relates

2695
02:53:56,691 --> 02:54:00,280
to the plan. So yeah, we don't we don't we don't have an

2696
02:54:00,280 --> 02:54:02,428
answer for that. Okay.

2697
02:54:04,165 --> 02:54:07,165
Excuse me. What? I'm sorry.

2698
02:54:07,435 --> 02:54:11,705
Excuse me. What? I do have an answer for is what our office

2699
02:54:11,705 --> 02:54:15,430
has been asked to do here. And that is a blighted building

2700
02:54:15,430 --> 02:54:17,978
that has been blighted for about 3 or 4, about 3 or 4

2701
02:54:17,978 --> 02:54:21,382
years. It was a church at one time, a coffee shop at one

2702
02:54:21,382 --> 02:54:24,118
time. And if you go behind Morning Glory, the morning

2703
02:54:24,118 --> 02:54:26,654
glory Avenue in that particular area, it's right behind Golden

2704
02:54:26,654 --> 02:54:29,657
Belt. If you look in that particular area, there's half

2705
02:54:29,657 --> 02:54:32,326
$1 million houses that are lined up there. But what you

2706
02:54:32,326 --> 02:54:34,929
see on the corner, there is a house that's currently on for

2707
02:54:34,929 --> 02:54:39,000
sale that's blighted. The next piece of property over is this

2708
02:54:39,000 --> 02:54:41,603
particular property which has been sitting there. And then

2709
02:54:41,603 --> 02:54:44,739
there's a new property that's currently going through zoning

2710
02:54:44,739 --> 02:54:48,476
right now. And then the next property is a property that was

2711
02:54:48,476 --> 02:54:53,347
just recently redeveloped by Cor, which is a, a lounge that

2712
02:54:53,347 --> 02:54:56,284
has opened in the past year. So there's been some strategic

2713
02:54:56,284 --> 02:54:59,870
things happening along that corridor. And, and we just

2714
02:54:59,870 --> 02:55:01,222
believe in reference to anything that's in our

2715
02:55:01,222 --> 02:55:03,357
community development area that's going to bring

2716
02:55:03,357 --> 02:55:06,761
production. We have an individual who lives in Durham

2717
02:55:06,761 --> 02:55:09,430
who's moving his business from Hillsboro, who's going to

2718
02:55:09,430 --> 02:55:12,100
upgrade that building. And I believe and we believe over the

2719
02:55:12,100 --> 02:55:14,902
years will create jobs. Although this is not a job

2720
02:55:14,902 --> 02:55:17,905
creator initially, but what we are doing is bringing some

2721
02:55:17,905 --> 02:55:20,508
stabilization to this neighborhood and getting ready,

2722
02:55:20,508 --> 02:55:23,444
getting rid of an eyesore that currently exists there. And

2723
02:55:23,444 --> 02:55:25,113
that's the purpose of the neighborhood violation.

2724
02:55:25,113 --> 02:55:27,314
Yes. So again, again, understand all that, appreciate

2725
02:55:27,314 --> 02:55:29,917
that sort of the business itself and just appreciate the,

2726
02:55:29,917 --> 02:55:32,986
the the neighborhood and efforts to sort of revitalize

2727
02:55:32,986 --> 02:55:36,124
the neighborhood. I just I want to make sure that if we're

2728
02:55:36,124 --> 02:55:38,793
making an investment again, that this is something that can

2729
02:55:38,793 --> 02:55:41,329
take place in the next couple of years as we're dealing with

2730
02:55:41,329 --> 02:55:43,130
sewer and we do have planning staff here, I would like to

2731
02:55:43,130 --> 02:55:47,602
know, get some sense of like, what's the impact of this

2732
02:55:47,602 --> 02:55:50,671
potential business or how it impacts the sort of the the

2733
02:55:50,671 --> 02:55:56,710
Goose Creek outfall issue we have with sewer capacity.

2734
02:56:00,481 --> 02:56:03,951
Good evening. So as. Director Gunn mentioned, we

2735
02:56:03,951 --> 02:56:06,754
haven't had a chance. To look at this together. As

2736
02:56:06,754 --> 02:56:08,756
you know, water. Management is.

2737
02:56:08,756 --> 02:56:10,825
Looking closely. At these and finding.

2738
02:56:10,825 --> 02:56:14,425
Ways to permit projects. As long.

2739
02:56:15,960 --> 02:56:18,696
As there. Is some nominal increase.

2740
02:56:18,833 --> 02:56:20,435
They the. You've been.

2741
02:56:20,435 --> 02:56:22,170
Seeing utility. Extension agreements come

2742
02:56:22,170 --> 02:56:24,438
through. Fairly quickly now. So there

2743
02:56:24,438 --> 02:56:28,776
are other ways that improvements can be made in

2744
02:56:28,776 --> 02:56:32,914
terms of tying into adjacent areas, etc.. So I can't speak

2745
02:56:32,914 --> 02:56:35,249
for water management and the specifics of this site, but I

2746
02:56:35,249 --> 02:56:37,510
can tell you that it is something that we will look at

2747
02:56:37,510 --> 02:56:41,851
with them. If I may. Council Member Rist

2748
02:56:41,989 --> 02:56:45,993
thanks staff for providing the context, but my read of the

2749
02:56:45,993 --> 02:56:48,796
process. So first of all, we don't have a clear answer for

2750
02:56:48,796 --> 02:56:52,660
you tonight. We'll get one. My read of the project is a as a

2751
02:56:52,660 --> 02:56:55,690
rehabilitation, as it is likely under the threshold of anything

2752
02:56:55,690 --> 02:56:58,272
that would trigger any concerns in the Goose Creek basin. But

2753
02:56:58,272 --> 02:57:01,208
we will get information for Council and clarify that going

2754
02:57:01,208 --> 02:57:04,412
forward. My recommendation would be for council to go

2755
02:57:04,412 --> 02:57:06,948
ahead and consider the item tonight and give us your

2756
02:57:06,948 --> 02:57:10,618
direction. Should we find that there's anything that that

2757
02:57:10,618 --> 02:57:12,553
prevents this project from moving forward, be happy to

2758
02:57:12,553 --> 02:57:15,957
notify that Council and make this contingent on that. But

2759
02:57:15,957 --> 02:57:18,959
that'd be my recommendation this evening.

2760
02:57:18,959 --> 02:57:22,162
Thank you. Okay. I think Mayor Williams Council Member Burris

2761
02:57:22,162 --> 02:57:25,232
Council Member Baker. Yeah, that was going to be my

2762
02:57:25,232 --> 02:57:31,232
comment. To my understanding, based on prior matters. If this

2763
02:57:32,507 --> 02:57:37,907
was adding additional needs or needing more capacity than

2764
02:57:38,780 --> 02:57:43,317
what's already allotted, and it would not, but I is this the

2765
02:57:43,317 --> 02:57:46,854
the little white church looking thing where a coffee shop was

2766
02:57:46,854 --> 02:57:51,592
once so so it was so it had functioning plumbing and that

2767
02:57:51,592 --> 02:57:56,530
was that was just a few years ago. And I mean, are you

2768
02:57:56,530 --> 02:57:58,999
expanding to the port was going to be like some big business,

2769
02:57:58,999 --> 02:58:03,805
more capacity. It's still going to be it's still the it's still

2770
02:58:03,805 --> 02:58:08,676
going to be the same. I guess what I'm asking is.

2771
02:58:08,676 --> 02:58:12,276
Is similar, similar usage thresholds. Yes.

2772
02:58:12,346 --> 02:58:14,481
Yeah. So I guess that's the information we'll need to get

2773
02:58:14,481 --> 02:58:18,190
back to my understanding, there's been I don't want to

2774
02:58:18,190 --> 02:58:23,958
say a one for one, but the nominal usage or or increases

2775
02:58:23,958 --> 02:58:29,830
or just. Yeah, the nominal increases if needed that then I

2776
02:58:29,830 --> 02:58:32,767
think it would be fine. But that's what I just wanted.

2777
02:58:32,767 --> 02:58:34,835
Clarity on that. Thank you. Thank you. Council

2778
02:58:34,835 --> 02:58:37,838
Member Burris. Okay, I just have a quick

2779
02:58:37,838 --> 02:58:40,410
question in the packet we received. Is there any

2780
02:58:40,410 --> 02:58:42,776
particular reason why the grant application is empty? It's like

2781
02:58:42,776 --> 02:58:46,465
nothing in there at all. Well, it's just blank. It's just

2782
02:58:46,465 --> 02:58:52,738
eight pages of like nothing.. That should not be. That was in

2783
02:58:52,738 --> 02:58:56,475
an oversight. That was. No, this one is great.

2784
02:58:56,475 --> 02:59:00,479
You see, it's nothing in here. It's empty.

2785
02:59:00,479 --> 02:59:07,790
And there's only a narrative. Yeah. The text didn't copy over.

2786
02:59:08,888 --> 02:59:10,890
Yeah. This is the application here. I don't know.

2787
02:59:10,890 --> 02:59:15,962
What the application is. Okay. Yeah, the form didn't

2788
02:59:15,962 --> 02:59:20,162
copy over. Council Member Burris. Did you

2789
02:59:23,635 --> 02:59:26,973
have any other questions? No. Well, I guess, like, just

2790
02:59:26,973 --> 02:59:31,310
to be, as we've gone through before, you know, about

2791
02:59:31,310 --> 02:59:33,312
applications and everything being there, I want to make

2792
02:59:33,312 --> 02:59:35,247
sure, because I did have a chance to meet the applicant

2793
02:59:35,247 --> 02:59:39,510
earlier, and I expressed my concerns in regards to the time

2794
02:59:39,510 --> 02:59:42,388
it would take for you to actually hire folks. We know

2795
02:59:42,388 --> 02:59:44,657
this community is definitely undergoing changes. There's

2796
02:59:44,657 --> 02:59:46,590
some commercial businesses there, but if you go on to

2797
02:59:46,590 --> 02:59:48,461
other side of the street, there's a lot of activity as

2798
02:59:48,461 --> 02:59:51,130
well. And so I believe you said that you guys will be hiring

2799
02:59:51,130 --> 02:59:53,799
like 6 to 8 people within the next two years or so. And so

2800
02:59:53,799 --> 02:59:55,935
I'm just trying to make sure that the city is getting there.

2801
02:59:55,935 --> 02:59:58,804
The same to my colleague Council Member Rist. If we are

2802
02:59:58,804 --> 03:00:01,274
preparing our staff for a tough budget year, we want to make

2803
03:00:01,274 --> 03:00:03,542
sure we're allocating dollars in a way that gives us the

2804
03:00:03,542 --> 03:00:06,946
biggest bang for our buck. And so having a critical piece of

2805
03:00:06,946 --> 03:00:10,215
information that is missing gives me a little bit of pause

2806
03:00:10,215 --> 03:00:13,686
in terms of like, I do see the, the the business project

2807
03:00:13,686 --> 03:00:17,890
narrative, but I don't have that other information. So that

2808
03:00:17,890 --> 03:00:19,250
is where I'm looking at right now.

2809
03:00:19,250 --> 03:00:22,829
Thank you. Council Member Burris Council Member Baker.

2810
03:00:22,829 --> 03:00:25,898
Yeah, I appreciate all the comments of my, my colleagues

2811
03:00:25,898 --> 03:00:28,701
and Council Member Burris. Thank you for your questions on

2812
03:00:28,701 --> 03:00:32,705
both of these items. Definitely have some some heartburn

2813
03:00:32,705 --> 03:00:38,644
myself. I guess I would just say that moving forward I would

2814
03:00:38,644 --> 03:00:42,381
be, you know, comfortable, more comfortable with tightening up

2815
03:00:42,381 --> 03:00:45,184
the vision and the policies that are that are supporting

2816
03:00:45,184 --> 03:00:48,320
these. And then also just making sure that departments

2817
03:00:48,320 --> 03:00:53,525
are talking to each other and notifying one another, one

2818
03:00:53,525 --> 03:00:57,329
another so that they can identify any of these kind of

2819
03:00:57,329 --> 03:01:03,535
big, bigger issues. Thank you. Thank you. This is a public

2820
03:01:03,535 --> 03:01:06,338
hearing. I don't have anyone signed up to speak, but I don't

2821
03:01:06,338 --> 03:01:12,611
know if the property owner of anyone else wanted to speak.

2822
03:01:12,611 --> 03:01:17,411
Thank you. Go ahead. Good evening, Mr. Freeland.

2823
03:01:18,170 --> 03:01:21,287
Good evening. Mayor Pro Tem and mayor.

2824
03:01:21,287 --> 03:01:22,687
City council. Members.

2825
03:01:22,687 --> 03:01:24,623
Your name is up. There's a.

2826
03:01:24,623 --> 03:01:28,560
Button. Like, kind of know the to the right.

2827
03:01:28,560 --> 03:01:32,765
Of to the right of the. Oh, here he comes.

2828
03:01:32,765 --> 03:01:36,101
Okay. Just your right hand under it up there. There she

2829
03:01:36,101 --> 03:01:39,839
is. I have to press the button. Let

2830
03:01:39,839 --> 03:01:43,309
me help you out here. We did. look at that. Except I set my

2831
03:01:43,309 --> 03:01:44,443
own time limit. Okay.

2832
03:01:44,443 --> 03:01:47,460
No, I was about to ask. You make the podium taller.

2833
03:01:47,460 --> 03:01:49,982
Thank you. Awesome. Mr.. Mr. Freeland, how much

2834
03:01:49,982 --> 03:01:51,249
time do you believe you need? Oh.

2835
03:01:51,249 --> 03:01:53,786
Just 90s will be plenty. Perfect. Thank you.

2836
03:01:53,786 --> 03:01:56,188
Can you please put two minutes on the clock?

2837
03:01:56,188 --> 03:02:00,125
I mean. Madam Clerk. Greetings. My name is Pierce

2838
03:02:00,125 --> 03:02:03,529
Freeland. My wife and I started a freeze dried ice cream

2839
03:02:03,529 --> 03:02:05,864
company called Cocoa Fro last year, based out of

2840
03:02:05,864 --> 03:02:08,801
Hillsborough, North Carolina, and quickly outgrew the

2841
03:02:08,801 --> 03:02:11,470
commercial kitchen, the Piedmont food processing center

2842
03:02:11,470 --> 03:02:14,673
where we were renting and started looking for a place to

2843
03:02:14,673 --> 03:02:18,770
expand. And we want to serve ice cream. We want to create

2844
03:02:18,770 --> 03:02:21,414
living wage jobs and build manufacturing infrastructure in

2845
03:02:21,414 --> 03:02:25,751
a historically underinvested area of East Durham. And we

2846
03:02:25,751 --> 03:02:28,754
can't do that without support from the city. We don't want to

2847
03:02:28,754 --> 03:02:32,758
move to Oxford or Morrisville or Raleigh. We want to plant

2848
03:02:32,758 --> 03:02:35,940
seeds right here in Durham, where I was born, where our

2849
03:02:35,940 --> 03:02:37,830
family is raised and where our first client is at the Museum

2850
03:02:37,830 --> 03:02:41,299
of Life and Science. So I'd like to thank Mr. Dickie and

2851
03:02:41,299 --> 03:02:44,369
Mr. Gunn and the wonderful folks at the Office of Economic

2852
03:02:44,369 --> 03:02:46,372
and Workforce Development for seeing the vision and

2853
03:02:46,372 --> 03:02:49,241
partnering with us to put this on today's agenda. And we hope

2854
03:02:49,241 --> 03:02:53,913
to have your support. And I do want to say one thing about Mr.

2855
03:02:53,913 --> 03:02:59,652
Question. We met earlier this week. I did look into the Goose

2856
03:02:59,652 --> 03:03:06,252
Creek sewer Capacity website and saw there that on the FAQ

2857
03:03:06,325 --> 03:03:08,794
page it says, does this affect current residents or

2858
03:03:08,794 --> 03:03:12,264
businesses? And no, the only issue affects new development

2859
03:03:12,264 --> 03:03:15,468
projects in the impacted area. Existing homes and businesses

2860
03:03:15,468 --> 03:03:19,138
are not at risk. So I appreciate you bringing that

2861
03:03:19,138 --> 03:03:22,140
question to me and try to do a little digging myself. And

2862
03:03:22,140 --> 03:03:25,610
according to the website, this is not a new development. It is

2863
03:03:25,610 --> 03:03:29,348
a it's an existing space and the capacity will be similar to

2864
03:03:29,348 --> 03:03:32,840
what the previous capacity was. We just need to build it up to

2865
03:03:32,840 --> 03:03:35,887
be a commercial kitchen so we can make our product. So thank

2866
03:03:35,887 --> 03:03:39,825
you for your time and appreciate your consideration.

2867
03:03:39,825 --> 03:03:44,296
Thank you. That is the only speaker that we have. So the

2868
03:03:44,296 --> 03:03:46,966
public hearing is now closed and this item is now before the

2869
03:03:46,966 --> 03:03:50,302
council. Does anyone else have any other questions or comments

2870
03:03:50,302 --> 03:03:53,105
to make before I ask for a motion? Mayor Williams.

2871
03:03:53,105 --> 03:03:57,976
Yeah, I'll I'll say I'm going to support this even though the

2872
03:03:57,976 --> 03:04:01,980
application itself is not in the packet. I do have enough

2873
03:04:01,980 --> 03:04:06,852
information, I need it. I want to be very clear. I support our

2874
03:04:06,852 --> 03:04:11,190
small businesses, support our small business community. We

2875
03:04:11,190 --> 03:04:15,594
just landed the biggest investment in Durham's history.

2876
03:04:15,594 --> 03:04:19,999
AbbVie. They're investing $1.4 billion in our community, and

2877
03:04:19,999 --> 03:04:25,471
we put up a huge incentive for millions and they are coming

2878
03:04:25,471 --> 03:04:28,874
out of Illinois, coming out of Illinois to hear this is a

2879
03:04:28,874 --> 03:04:32,945
Durham based business that I look forward to supporting.

2880
03:04:32,945 --> 03:04:36,148
It's not millions, but it's it's a business that we can

2881
03:04:36,148 --> 03:04:39,752
invest in here locally. And again, I think that, you know,

2882
03:04:39,752 --> 03:04:42,287
considering the history of Durham, we have a lot of pain

2883
03:04:42,287 --> 03:04:46,625
back to do. And I think that even in a in a tight budget

2884
03:04:46,625 --> 03:04:49,495
year, I don't want to let technicalities hold up an

2885
03:04:49,495 --> 03:04:52,497
opportunity to support another small business in this

2886
03:04:52,497 --> 03:04:55,434
community. And I can tell you firsthand, as a small business

2887
03:04:55,434 --> 03:04:59,634
owner, there are vulture commercial tenants, commercial

2888
03:05:00,790 --> 03:05:04,860
landlords out there, and it is a very, very aggressive world

2889
03:05:04,860 --> 03:05:08,664
to try and do small business. And so if you have the

2890
03:05:08,664 --> 03:05:11,667
commercial space, commercial real estate space, where it's

2891
03:05:11,667 --> 03:05:15,271
extremely aggressive and you have a history of divestment

2892
03:05:15,271 --> 03:05:18,140
and small locally owned businesses, especially black

2893
03:05:18,140 --> 03:05:21,477
owned businesses, and you have a just the ability to do

2894
03:05:21,477 --> 03:05:25,214
business in this industry and this market right now, as it is

2895
03:05:25,214 --> 03:05:28,685
the only place sometimes you can go is to your city. And I

2896
03:05:28,685 --> 03:05:31,354
think Durham is a community where we're willing to invest

2897
03:05:31,354 --> 03:05:36,754
in our in our own. So I'll support it.

2898
03:05:37,426 --> 03:05:41,897
Council Member Kopac just to assuage the concerns, perhaps,

2899
03:05:41,897 --> 03:05:45,435
of staff like it may be issue of laptop versus iPad, but I'm

2900
03:05:45,435 --> 03:05:48,371
on my laptop and I have access to the completed application.

2901
03:05:48,371 --> 03:05:49,906
Okay. So it sounds like there's a

2902
03:05:49,906 --> 03:05:52,108
technical issue. There's a glitch in there, but the

2903
03:05:52,108 --> 03:05:55,111
completed application was included and I can see it.

2904
03:05:55,111 --> 03:05:58,247
Well, thank you. And I apologize. I'd like

2905
03:05:58,247 --> 03:06:00,450
council members to let me know which of you had trouble. I

2906
03:06:00,450 --> 03:06:04,454
know we verified it. It is on the website and it is in my

2907
03:06:04,454 --> 03:06:07,323
packet. It sounds like it's not in some of yours, so definitely

2908
03:06:07,323 --> 03:06:09,792
want to get to the bottom of that, but do want to verify

2909
03:06:09,792 --> 03:06:12,128
that it was made available to the public. Anyone who had

2910
03:06:12,128 --> 03:06:14,196
reviewed this beforehand should have gotten that attachment,

2911
03:06:14,196 --> 03:06:16,865
and we apologize for the problem.

2912
03:06:16,865 --> 03:06:19,802
Thank you. Manager Ferguson Council Member Rist. Did you

2913
03:06:19,802 --> 03:06:21,937
have a question? Yeah. No, I just just to say I

2914
03:06:21,937 --> 03:06:23,806
have deep appreciation for the applicant, one of our former

2915
03:06:23,806 --> 03:06:26,875
colleagues here on the on the dais. So thanks for being here.

2916
03:06:26,875 --> 03:06:29,745
I do love the investment in East Durham. As the mayor said,

2917
03:06:29,745 --> 03:06:34,149
I but I, I do feel like I'm not quite ready to support this

2918
03:06:34,149 --> 03:06:36,418
with given the questions we have about the sewer capacity.

2919
03:06:36,418 --> 03:06:39,955
We're talking about increasing sort of manufacturing capacity.

2920
03:06:39,955 --> 03:06:42,558
I don't have the application here. I don't I feel like when

2921
03:06:42,558 --> 03:06:45,961
we're again, utilizing scarce public resources, I think

2922
03:06:45,961 --> 03:06:47,763
voters want us to make sure we know what we're doing when

2923
03:06:47,763 --> 03:06:50,320
we're casting a vote. I don't have the information here. I

2924
03:06:50,320 --> 03:06:53,301
don't know if that's an error on the part of the city or. But

2925
03:06:53,301 --> 03:06:56,906
I'm just not without that information. Not comfortable

2926
03:06:56,906 --> 03:07:01,106
right now with this. So thank you.

2927
03:07:02,511 --> 03:07:06,515
Mayor Williams. Would we be interested in maybe

2928
03:07:06,515 --> 03:07:10,653
by continuing it or sending it back, or until we get the

2929
03:07:10,653 --> 03:07:14,389
technical? I just don't want to blame a an applicant on

2930
03:07:14,389 --> 03:07:16,325
something. That's a technicality on our part,

2931
03:07:16,325 --> 03:07:18,928
because I think it's fair. You can't see the application. I

2932
03:07:18,928 --> 03:07:22,640
can't see the application. And we feel differently. You can't

2933
03:07:22,640 --> 03:07:24,133
see the application. But, you know, we feel differently about

2934
03:07:24,133 --> 03:07:26,668
it. I don't think we should vote up or down on something.

2935
03:07:26,668 --> 03:07:30,606
That's a technicality on our part. And it doesn't mean

2936
03:07:30,606 --> 03:07:32,474
you're a former council member, but it has nothing to do with

2937
03:07:32,474 --> 03:07:35,877
it. It's for anyone that would be in this situation.

2938
03:07:35,877 --> 03:07:39,148
Thank thank you, Council colleagues. Does anyone have a

2939
03:07:39,148 --> 03:07:41,160
comment or question around that? Council Member Burris I

2940
03:07:41,160 --> 03:07:42,751
know you were one of the did you want to address that?

2941
03:07:42,751 --> 03:07:44,954
Yeah, and I just want to clarify that there will also

2942
03:07:44,954 --> 03:07:47,756
like provide space for Council Member Rist questions to be

2943
03:07:47,756 --> 03:07:51,359
addressed as well before we come back. Right? Yeah. Okay. I

2944
03:07:51,359 --> 03:07:52,962
think. We would leave the public.

2945
03:07:52,962 --> 03:07:55,164
Well, I close the public hearing, so I don't think we

2946
03:07:55,164 --> 03:07:57,299
can leave it open, but we can I don't know, how.

2947
03:07:57,299 --> 03:08:01,499
Did you. Close, Madam Attorney? Get to

2948
03:08:02,170 --> 03:08:03,639
reopen it. I think you could reopen it.

2949
03:08:03,639 --> 03:08:06,108
Okay. And then continuing. What we could do is just reopen

2950
03:08:06,108 --> 03:08:10,246
the public hearing. And that would give staff an opportunity

2951
03:08:10,246 --> 03:08:14,446
to upload the appropriate documents. Council colleagues,

2952
03:08:15,784 --> 03:08:18,520
do we want to do it to the next one? To the subsequent one? I

2953
03:08:18,520 --> 03:08:22,591
guess that's the question I have for you all. I feel like

2954
03:08:22,591 --> 03:08:24,593
we do need to deal with this before we go on our break in

2955
03:08:24,593 --> 03:08:30,198
June. So one cycle or two. I mean, however long it takes.

2956
03:08:30,198 --> 03:08:34,937
It's a question for staff around public hearings at the

2957
03:08:34,937 --> 03:08:39,341
at the next, I guess the okay, let me synthesize the question.

2958
03:08:39,341 --> 03:08:42,545
So one is making sure the application is in our packet so

2959
03:08:42,545 --> 03:08:45,481
that council can see it all to was to make sure that the water

2960
03:08:45,481 --> 03:08:48,350
department has done the necessary analysis on the goose

2961
03:08:48,350 --> 03:08:55,550
fall out creek thing. Sorry. And I think those are the two

2962
03:08:55,891 --> 03:08:58,627
kind of outstanding questions that council member or council

2963
03:08:58,627 --> 03:09:03,165
colleagues had. And so I would I'm going to look at Director

2964
03:09:03,165 --> 03:09:05,968
Young because you probably know how many zoning cases we have

2965
03:09:05,968 --> 03:09:08,770
next round. And I think that does influence if we go to 1 or

2966
03:09:08,770 --> 03:09:12,970
2 cycles out. So you're asking about whether

2967
03:09:31,993 --> 03:09:35,597
to go 1 or 2 cycles out. And the Madam Attorney just

2968
03:09:35,597 --> 03:09:37,999
reminded me that the May 18th, when we have a long work

2969
03:09:37,999 --> 03:09:40,336
session, a council meeting, and it's public hearings, so maybe

2970
03:09:40,336 --> 03:09:42,537
we want to go to the subsequent one in the first one in June,

2971
03:09:42,537 --> 03:09:46,876
but that's a public hearing for the budget. Yes. So either way,

2972
03:09:46,876 --> 03:09:50,346
we're kind of going to be here a long time. Maybe the second

2973
03:09:50,346 --> 03:09:52,615
one, the one in June would be better, because that way we're

2974
03:09:52,615 --> 03:09:55,417
not doing a work session and a council meeting and. Okay. And

2975
03:09:55,417 --> 03:09:58,954
you're nodding your head. Yes. Is that's a better option? Mr.

2976
03:09:58,954 --> 03:10:01,690
Freeland, are you comfortable with that? It would be two

2977
03:10:01,690 --> 03:10:05,227
cycles. So the first whatever. I think June, June 1st, it

2978
03:10:05,227 --> 03:10:09,365
would be Monday, June 1st. Okay. Okay. So I'm going to

2979
03:10:09,365 --> 03:10:13,636
reopen declaring the public hearing. Nope, I closed it. I

2980
03:10:13,636 --> 03:10:17,373
need to reopen it. I'm going to reopen the the public hearing

2981
03:10:17,373 --> 03:10:22,978
is now open again. We are going to continue this case until

2982
03:10:22,978 --> 03:10:27,115
June 1st at our council meeting. Thank you so much.

2983
03:10:27,115 --> 03:10:31,915
Thank you. And then we're going to reorder

2984
03:10:36,659 --> 03:10:42,531
the next agenda items. Because the way that it's listed it's I

2985
03:10:42,531 --> 03:10:49,131
my belief is that items 23, 24 and 25 are going to be pretty

2986
03:10:49,471 --> 03:10:52,475
straightforward. We don't have a ton of speakers on those. So

2987
03:10:52,475 --> 03:10:57,346
we will be taking up item number 22. Last colleagues, are

2988
03:10:57,346 --> 03:11:03,552
we good with that. So it lets folks who don't need to be here

2989
03:11:03,552 --> 03:11:11,305
go. So it is helpful for folks I know it's hard. So the first

2990
03:11:11,305 --> 03:11:16,440
item that I have then is item number 23, Consolidated

2991
03:11:16,440 --> 03:11:18,444
Annexation, 1735 Fletcher Chapel Road.

2992
03:11:32,594 --> 03:11:34,796
Mayor Williams Mayor Pro Tem Caballero.

2993
03:11:34,796 --> 03:11:36,865
And honorable Council members. Good evening.

2994
03:11:36,865 --> 03:11:38,266
I am Peyton Burgess. With the Planning.

2995
03:11:38,266 --> 03:11:39,934
And Development Department, and I am happy.

2996
03:11:39,934 --> 03:11:42,203
To be here with you tonight. A request.

2997
03:11:42,203 --> 03:11:44,739
For a utility. Extension agreement. Voluntary

2998
03:11:44,739 --> 03:11:47,875
annexation and initial zoning map. change has been received

2999
03:11:47,875 --> 03:11:50,411
from Gray Madden. With Madden Construction.

3000
03:11:50,411 --> 03:11:53,881
For one parcel of land zoned residential rural, totaling

3001
03:11:53,881 --> 03:11:58,681
0.83 acres and located at 1735 Fletcher's Chapel Road. This

3002
03:11:58,953 --> 03:12:01,756
annexation petition is not contiguous to the primary

3003
03:12:01,756 --> 03:12:04,692
corporate limits and would create a new satellite. This

3004
03:12:04,692 --> 03:12:06,827
request would allow the applicant to connect to city

3005
03:12:06,827 --> 03:12:10,431
water and sewer for one single family home. This is a direct

3006
03:12:10,431 --> 03:12:13,568
translational zoning. A direct translational zoning is one in

3007
03:12:13,568 --> 03:12:16,170
which the existing Durham County zoning is translated to

3008
03:12:16,170 --> 03:12:18,907
the identical Durham City zoning district. Upon the

3009
03:12:18,907 --> 03:12:22,430
annexation of the property into the city limits. Since there is

3010
03:12:22,430 --> 03:12:24,779
no request for a change to the existing zoning attached to

3011
03:12:24,779 --> 03:12:27,582
this annexation petition, there is not a development plan under

3012
03:12:27,582 --> 03:12:30,985
consideration and therefore no proffered commitments. Any

3013
03:12:30,985 --> 03:12:33,254
future development may proceed according to what the zoning

3014
03:12:33,254 --> 03:12:36,391
would allow. The properties are currently designated mixed use

3015
03:12:36,391 --> 03:12:39,127
neighborhood on the place type map. The existing residential

3016
03:12:39,127 --> 03:12:41,596
rural zoning is generally consistent with the designated

3017
03:12:41,596 --> 03:12:44,265
place type. If the proposed zoning is approved, there will

3018
03:12:44,265 --> 03:12:47,535
be no change to the place type designation. Thank you. Staff

3019
03:12:47,535 --> 03:12:50,138
and the applicant are available for any questions, and I

3020
03:12:50,138 --> 03:12:53,738
believe the applicant is available online.

3021
03:12:54,142 --> 03:13:00,142
Thank you. And we've heard the staff report. now declare.

3022
03:13:00,681 --> 03:13:03,418
This public hearing open. Colleagues does anyone have

3023
03:13:03,418 --> 03:13:09,418
questions for staff at this time? Okay. The applicant is

3024
03:13:10,624 --> 03:13:15,496
online and then I have one proponent and one opponent

3025
03:13:15,496 --> 03:13:17,765
signed up. Those are all the speakers I have, madam clerk,

3026
03:13:17,765 --> 03:13:21,360
is that correct? Okay. Thank you. Can we make the applicant

3027
03:13:21,360 --> 03:13:23,360
here? Hey, can.

3028
03:13:27,975 --> 03:13:29,377
You. Hear me?

3029
03:13:29,377 --> 03:13:32,460
Yes, we can, Mr. Madden. Good evening. How much time do you

3030
03:13:32,460 --> 03:13:34,982
think you'll need? Just a minute.

3031
03:13:34,982 --> 03:13:37,520
Okay. Madam clerk, could you please put two minutes on the

3032
03:13:37,520 --> 03:13:40,520
clock? I'm a local builder.

3033
03:13:42,457 --> 03:13:44,726
I actually. Live right around.

3034
03:13:44,726 --> 03:13:47,729
The corner from. This property. It's just a

3035
03:13:47,729 --> 03:13:52,867
single lot we're looking to get annexed into the city so that

3036
03:13:52,867 --> 03:13:56,871
we're able to tie in to the utilities, water and sewer that

3037
03:13:56,871 --> 03:14:02,477
pass right in front of the lot. Currently, just one single

3038
03:14:02,477 --> 03:14:07,281
family home. The owner of the property was actually there at

3039
03:14:07,281 --> 03:14:11,886
the meeting, and I think he had to leave. But he's a local

3040
03:14:11,886 --> 03:14:15,230
business owner as well. If there's any questions or

3041
03:14:15,230 --> 03:14:18,827
concerns, I'm I'm happy to address them.

3042
03:14:18,827 --> 03:14:25,427
Thank you. That's the only. Okay. And then I have Pablo

3043
03:14:26,901 --> 03:14:33,774
Friedman signed up. Okay I have you down is 23. So I'll call

3044
03:14:33,774 --> 03:14:39,914
you for 22. Sorry for 23. The opposite of what I just said.

3045
03:14:39,914 --> 03:14:46,514
Okay. I don't have any other speakers this evening. So this

3046
03:14:46,720 --> 03:14:49,991
public hearing is now closed and back before the council.

3047
03:14:49,991 --> 03:14:55,262
Council members, any questions or comments before I call the

3048
03:14:55,262 --> 03:14:58,862
motion? Go ahead. Council Member Baker.

3049
03:14:59,567 --> 03:15:03,671
Yeah. This this feels kind of small and inconsequential.

3050
03:15:03,671 --> 03:15:09,143
There's water and sewer that run right in front, but this is

3051
03:15:09,143 --> 03:15:13,748
mixed residential on the place type map. It is not contiguous

3052
03:15:13,748 --> 03:15:20,948
and you know, if we make a practice of of annexing small

3053
03:15:22,623 --> 03:15:26,961
lots that are satellite lots over and over and over, that

3054
03:15:26,961 --> 03:15:31,232
does add up over time. I'm kind of wrestling with that question

3055
03:15:31,232 --> 03:15:34,569
a little bit. I wonder if I wonder if staff can provide any

3056
03:15:34,569 --> 03:15:39,400
commentary on the fact that this is mixed residential on

3057
03:15:39,400 --> 03:15:44,111
the place type map, that it's not contiguous? What kind of

3058
03:15:44,111 --> 03:15:48,583
impacts do you think that will have? What happens if this were

3059
03:15:48,583 --> 03:15:52,454
approved to the Future Place site map?

3060
03:15:52,454 --> 03:15:56,657
Absolutely. So this site right now, although it would create a

3061
03:15:56,657 --> 03:16:01,196
satellite for the purpose of the annexation, there is water

3062
03:16:01,196 --> 03:16:03,732
and sewer right across the street. So those houses along

3063
03:16:03,732 --> 03:16:06,935
that road have it. Additionally, the majority of

3064
03:16:06,935 --> 03:16:11,206
the mixed residential place type that you're talking about

3065
03:16:11,206 --> 03:16:15,276
that this site is in, is really primarily undeveloped right

3066
03:16:15,276 --> 03:16:20,548
now. And so although this site is a single family home, there

3067
03:16:20,548 --> 03:16:24,850
is the potential that there will be future development and

3068
03:16:24,850 --> 03:16:28,356
future annexation that actually fills that area in and does

3069
03:16:28,356 --> 03:16:32,627
actually add to a mix of housing types and meets the

3070
03:16:32,627 --> 03:16:36,827
goal of that place type. All right.

3071
03:16:37,499 --> 03:16:40,499
Thank you. Thank you, Councilmember.

3072
03:16:42,704 --> 03:16:46,107
Miss Burgess. Sorry, we can come back there. I did note in

3073
03:16:46,107 --> 03:16:48,443
the packet, so I had the same question Council Member Baker

3074
03:16:48,443 --> 03:16:51,379
had I know this this does score revenue positive, which helped

3075
03:16:51,379 --> 03:16:54,382
me a little bit on this. But also as I understand the

3076
03:16:54,382 --> 03:16:57,510
packet. So the comp plan does allow for consideration of

3077
03:16:57,510 --> 03:17:00,521
annexation of a single family residence, even though it's a

3078
03:17:00,521 --> 03:17:02,323
even though it is not contiguous. Can you say more

3079
03:17:02,323 --> 03:17:04,859
about that in our comp plan? How we like? What's the

3080
03:17:04,859 --> 03:17:08,262
particular provisions there? Yeah, absolutely. So I believe

3081
03:17:08,262 --> 03:17:12,534
that's policy. 165 that addresses that. But it does

3082
03:17:12,534 --> 03:17:17,830
give sort of a opportunity for council to consideration.

3083
03:17:17,830 --> 03:17:22,483
Consider situations like this when it becomes necessary for

3084
03:17:23,155 --> 03:17:27,626
single family lots to connect to water and sewer to create

3085
03:17:27,626 --> 03:17:32,631
those satellites. And so policy 165 really gives council the

3086
03:17:32,631 --> 03:17:36,368
opportunity to consider those, even though they might create a

3087
03:17:36,368 --> 03:17:38,771
satellite. I appreciate that. Yeah. I

3088
03:17:38,771 --> 03:17:40,639
think bringing folks on the water and sewer is always

3089
03:17:40,639 --> 03:17:42,641
better. So yeah, I think that makes sense. I appreciate that.

3090
03:17:42,641 --> 03:17:47,460
Thanks for explaining. Thank you. Anyone else? Okay, I

3091
03:17:47,460 --> 03:17:52,117
appreciate those comments. Colleagues and I think it is

3092
03:17:52,117 --> 03:17:58,117
tricky. I guess this is a question for staff. Sorry.

3093
03:17:59,580 --> 03:18:01,794
Obviously we have water and sewer. They're taking advantage

3094
03:18:01,794 --> 03:18:05,798
of a thing. I would want city water and sewer to I think

3095
03:18:05,798 --> 03:18:08,600
sometimes becomes an equity issue, especially as people's

3096
03:18:08,600 --> 03:18:14,340
wells age or it becomes more expensive when we lay water and

3097
03:18:14,340 --> 03:18:17,409
sewer in that type of circumstance that's in there.

3098
03:18:17,409 --> 03:18:20,746
What is the outreach we are doing to residents that they

3099
03:18:20,746 --> 03:18:23,415
are aware. That there? What was.

3100
03:18:23,415 --> 03:18:27,352
That that they can't like? One side of the street is hooked up

3101
03:18:27,352 --> 03:18:29,622
and the other side isn't. What are the opportunities for

3102
03:18:29,622 --> 03:18:33,822
residents to know that that those possibilities.?

3103
03:18:33,893 --> 03:18:37,763
So I would think that if if somebody who is wanting to

3104
03:18:37,763 --> 03:18:41,366
develop their property, that's kind of where it starts, okay.

3105
03:18:41,366 --> 03:18:45,504
Whether that's through a metal meeting, signing up or starting

3106
03:18:45,504 --> 03:18:49,241
to submit applications and realizing that you need

3107
03:18:49,241 --> 03:18:53,712
annexation for water and sewer, I feel like that is where I see

3108
03:18:53,712 --> 03:18:55,981
the majority of applicants, kind of especially these

3109
03:18:55,981 --> 03:18:59,510
smaller single family lots. That's that's when I see the

3110
03:18:59,510 --> 03:19:03,851
majority of applicants getting. Thank you. Okay, colleagues,

3111
03:19:07,993 --> 03:19:15,793
the motion before us is. Hold on. First motion is to adopt an

3112
03:19:20,605 --> 03:19:25,277
ordinance annexing 1735 of Fletcher's Chapel Road into the

3113
03:19:25,277 --> 03:19:27,679
city of Durham, and to authorize the city manager to

3114
03:19:27,679 --> 03:19:30,216
enter into a utility extension agreement with Cecil Gray.

3115
03:19:30,216 --> 03:19:32,818
Madden, the third. So moved.

3116
03:19:32,818 --> 03:19:34,820
Second. Have a motion a second. Madam

3117
03:19:34,820 --> 03:19:40,820
clerk, could you please open the vote? Could you please

3118
03:19:44,963 --> 03:19:49,763
close the vote? The motion passes 5 to 1 with

3119
03:19:50,350 --> 03:19:55,440
Council Member Baker voting no. Thank you. The second motion is

3120
03:19:55,440 --> 03:19:57,643
to adopt an ordinance amending the Unified Development

3121
03:19:57,643 --> 03:20:00,112
Ordinance by taking property out of the residential rule.

3122
03:20:00,112 --> 03:20:04,312
Falls Jordan District B watershed protection overlay

3123
03:20:04,450 --> 03:20:06,251
county jurisdiction and establishing the same as

3124
03:20:06,251 --> 03:20:08,921
residential rural falls. Jordan District B Watershed Protection

3125
03:20:08,921 --> 03:20:11,921
Overlay city jurisdiction. So moved.

3126
03:20:12,191 --> 03:20:13,859
Second. Have a motion a second. Madam

3127
03:20:13,859 --> 03:20:18,330
clerk, could you please open the vote? Could you please

3128
03:20:18,330 --> 03:20:21,930
close the vote? Motion passes unanimously.

3129
03:20:23,201 --> 03:20:26,405
Thank you. And the last motion? Motion is to adopt a

3130
03:20:26,405 --> 03:20:30,605
consistency statement as required by section 160 de 605.

3131
03:20:33,145 --> 03:20:35,800
So moved. Second.

3132
03:20:35,800 --> 03:20:37,150
A motion. And second. Madam Clerk, could you please open

3133
03:20:37,150 --> 03:20:41,815
the vote? Could you please close the vote?

3134
03:20:43,889 --> 03:20:49,161
Motion passes unanimously. Thank you. Next item in front

3135
03:20:49,161 --> 03:20:51,697
of us this evening is item number 24, consolidated

3136
03:20:51,697 --> 03:20:54,697
annexation experience. Reality. Glenn West.

3137
03:21:01,574 --> 03:21:04,977
Mayor Williams, mayor pro Tem Caballero and honorable council

3138
03:21:04,977 --> 03:21:07,847
members. Good evening. I am Peyton Burgess with the

3139
03:21:07,847 --> 03:21:09,782
Planning and Development Department, and I am happy to

3140
03:21:09,782 --> 03:21:12,918
be here with you tonight. A request for utility extension

3141
03:21:12,918 --> 03:21:16,321
agreement, voluntary annexation and initial zoning map change

3142
03:21:16,321 --> 03:21:18,724
has been received from Jeff McSwain with Experience

3143
03:21:18,724 --> 03:21:22,661
Reality, Inc. for seven parcels and a portion of an eighth of

3144
03:21:22,661 --> 03:21:27,461
land totaling 25.949 acres and located at 4007 409, A, 49 B 40

3145
03:21:31,136 --> 03:21:34,136
1140, 1340 15 A, 4015, B 49 1940, 21, 4023, and a portion

3146
03:21:38,544 --> 03:21:41,947
of 4026 Glenn Road. This annexation petition is not

3147
03:21:41,947 --> 03:21:44,216
contiguous to the primary corporate limits, but is

3148
03:21:44,216 --> 03:21:47,285
contiguous to an existing satellite. This request would

3149
03:21:47,285 --> 03:21:50,220
allow the applicant to connect to city water and sewer, while

3150
03:21:50,220 --> 03:21:52,891
the current residential rural zoning would allow for up to 36

3151
03:21:52,891 --> 03:21:55,695
single family homes. The Utility Extension agreement

3152
03:21:55,695 --> 03:21:58,764
only allows for a maximum of eight. This is a direct

3153
03:21:58,764 --> 03:22:01,566
translational zoning. A direct transactional zoning is one in

3154
03:22:01,566 --> 03:22:04,169
which the existing Durham County zoning is translated to

3155
03:22:04,169 --> 03:22:06,505
the identical Durham City zoning district. Upon the

3156
03:22:06,505 --> 03:22:09,575
annexation of the property into the city limits. Since there is

3157
03:22:09,575 --> 03:22:12,445
no request for a change to the existing zoning attached to

3158
03:22:12,445 --> 03:22:15,247
this annexation petition, there is not a development plan under

3159
03:22:15,247 --> 03:22:18,584
consideration and therefore no proffered commitments. Any

3160
03:22:18,584 --> 03:22:20,653
future development may proceed according to what the zoning

3161
03:22:20,653 --> 03:22:23,923
would allow. The properties are currently designated mixed

3162
03:22:23,923 --> 03:22:26,258
residential neighborhood and established residential on the

3163
03:22:26,258 --> 03:22:29,261
place type map. The proposed residential rural zoning is

3164
03:22:29,261 --> 03:22:32,198
generally consistent with the designated place type. If the

3165
03:22:32,198 --> 03:22:34,467
proposed zoning is approved, there will be no change to the

3166
03:22:34,467 --> 03:22:37,269
place type designations. Thank you. Staff and the applicant

3167
03:22:37,269 --> 03:22:40,269
are available for any questions.

3168
03:22:40,673 --> 03:22:43,209
Thank you. You've heard the report from staff. I'm going to

3169
03:22:43,209 --> 03:22:46,479
declare this public hearing open. Colleagues, are there any

3170
03:22:46,479 --> 03:22:52,684
questions for staff before we take any speakers? Okay. Can I

3171
03:22:52,684 --> 03:22:58,684
go ahead and invite the applicant up for this item?

3172
03:23:00,492 --> 03:23:02,494
Good evening, Mr. Jewell. How much time do you think you'll

3173
03:23:02,494 --> 03:23:03,628
need? 4 or.

3174
03:23:03,628 --> 03:23:05,497
5 minutes. If you can put five up, I'll be.

3175
03:23:05,497 --> 03:23:07,499
Faster than that. Okay. Thank you. Madam clerk,

3176
03:23:07,499 --> 03:23:10,436
could you please put five minutes? Thank you.

3177
03:23:10,436 --> 03:23:13,839
Great. Appreciate it. Good evening, mayor Pro tem. Mayor,

3178
03:23:13,839 --> 03:23:16,839
Council members. Attorney and manager.

3179
03:23:17,176 --> 03:23:21,112
I'm Dan Jewell, reside at 1025 Gloria Avenue. I'm here at the

3180
03:23:21,112 --> 03:23:25,912
request of Jeff McSwain with Reality Ministries. We've

3181
03:23:26,620 --> 03:23:28,640
helped him prepare this application. He's asked me to

3182
03:23:28,640 --> 03:23:30,599
make a few remarks to clarify some things in the staff

3183
03:23:30,599 --> 03:23:34,137
report. First, this is by no stretch of the imagination a

3184
03:23:34,137 --> 03:23:37,273
development. These are eight existing lots that are already

3185
03:23:37,273 --> 03:23:41,410
adjacent to city water and sewer. And we simply want to

3186
03:23:41,410 --> 03:23:45,147
connect, which is why we made the request for annexation.

3187
03:23:45,147 --> 03:23:49,947
Utility extension. Secondly, clarify. Even though the staff

3188
03:23:49,952 --> 03:23:53,222
report calls us rightly, a satellite annexation, it is

3189
03:23:53,222 --> 03:23:56,692
anything but remote. The existing neighborhood to the

3190
03:23:56,692 --> 03:24:02,970
south is served by city water and sewer, and the only reason

3191
03:24:02,970 --> 03:24:05,234
it is not in the city limits is that it was developed years

3192
03:24:05,234 --> 03:24:08,504
ago, before the policy was in place, that if you wanted city

3193
03:24:08,504 --> 03:24:12,508
water or sewer, you must apply for annexation, otherwise it

3194
03:24:12,508 --> 03:24:15,440
would be within the city limits. And those lots are

3195
03:24:15,440 --> 03:24:18,247
actually a little bit smaller than the existing lots on this

3196
03:24:18,247 --> 03:24:22,510
site. And additionally, there is a neighborhood directly to

3197
03:24:22,510 --> 03:24:24,987
the north across the land that's controlled by Aqua

3198
03:24:24,987 --> 03:24:28,991
called Glenstone. That's a denser project, city water and

3199
03:24:28,991 --> 03:24:32,662
sewer. And in the city limits, finally, and we think most

3200
03:24:32,662 --> 03:24:36,532
importantly, these new homes will serve a very special

3201
03:24:36,532 --> 03:24:40,803
community. I hope some of you are familiar with the North

3202
03:24:40,803 --> 03:24:45,141
Street neighborhood just a few blocks up that way between Geer

3203
03:24:45,141 --> 03:24:50,412
and Club and Gear and North and Madison, Jeff and his team with

3204
03:24:50,412 --> 03:24:54,149
Reality Ministries were able to turn a dozen derelict, empty

3205
03:24:54,149 --> 03:24:57,954
old apartment buildings into an intentional community of

3206
03:24:57,954 --> 03:25:02,825
families with adult children who have special needs. What

3207
03:25:02,825 --> 03:25:06,295
they were able to do was to allow families to buy those

3208
03:25:06,295 --> 03:25:10,299
units and have actually a separate unit within them,

3209
03:25:10,299 --> 03:25:14,704
totally independent that their adult kids could live in. So

3210
03:25:14,704 --> 03:25:17,506
they would get not only the support of their families as

3211
03:25:17,506 --> 03:25:21,977
they aged, but the support of the rest of the neighborhood.

3212
03:25:21,977 --> 03:25:25,715
This community is now going on 15 successful years. We help

3213
03:25:25,715 --> 03:25:28,384
Jeff design it and get it approved, and it's become a

3214
03:25:28,384 --> 03:25:31,454
vibrant and very important part of the Durham fabric. But

3215
03:25:31,454 --> 03:25:36,526
there's more need than can be met over there. And when Jeff,

3216
03:25:36,526 --> 03:25:39,995
who's now has experienced reality and affiliated

3217
03:25:39,995 --> 03:25:43,933
organization, came across this property, he saw an opportunity

3218
03:25:43,933 --> 03:25:49,472
create a similar, although less dense community. And the homes

3219
03:25:49,472 --> 03:25:52,408
that will be built in this new neighborhood. They will all

3220
03:25:52,408 --> 03:25:57,280
have ADUs. Those homes will be offered to again residents who

3221
03:25:57,280 --> 03:26:01,617
have adult children, who have special needs of some kind or

3222
03:26:01,617 --> 03:26:04,620
another so they can live in the accessory dwellings as part of

3223
03:26:04,620 --> 03:26:08,757
that community and be nurtured as part of that whole

3224
03:26:08,757 --> 03:26:12,762
neighborhood. I hope you noted the unanimous recommendation

3225
03:26:12,762 --> 03:26:15,697
for approval received from the Planning Commission, and will

3226
03:26:15,697 --> 03:26:19,235
follow in suit, and we appreciate your time. I'm here

3227
03:26:19,235 --> 03:26:21,437
to answer any questions that you might have. That's the end

3228
03:26:21,437 --> 03:26:27,376
of our presentation. Thank you. Thank you so much. Those are

3229
03:26:27,376 --> 03:26:29,378
all the speakers that I have. So I'm going to go ahead and

3230
03:26:29,378 --> 03:26:31,380
declare this public hearing closed and back before the

3231
03:26:31,380 --> 03:26:33,582
council. Council colleagues, do we have any questions or

3232
03:26:33,582 --> 03:26:37,182
comments. Go ahead. Council Member Baker.

3233
03:26:41,124 --> 03:26:47,124
I appreciate all the commentary. And you know, there's of

3234
03:26:47,196 --> 03:26:50,799
course, the the story behind annexations and rezoning. And

3235
03:26:50,799 --> 03:26:56,538
then there's just the cold, hard of law that applies to to

3236
03:26:56,538 --> 03:27:01,343
these cases. I one question to to staff. Again, similar to my

3237
03:27:01,343 --> 03:27:06,743
last question, this is a direct translational rezoning. Direct,

3238
03:27:09,952 --> 03:27:15,352
translational. And annexation. I'm sorry. And from a rural

3239
03:27:16,959 --> 03:27:19,762
residential to rural residential and it's in the

3240
03:27:19,762 --> 03:27:21,697
mixed residential neighborhoods. Are we saying

3241
03:27:21,697 --> 03:27:25,367
that rural residential under the Udo is consistent with

3242
03:27:25,367 --> 03:27:28,237
mixed residential neighborhood place type?

3243
03:27:28,237 --> 03:27:34,176
It can be because it offers a type of housing. So especially

3244
03:27:34,176 --> 03:27:38,460
when it's combined with other zoning things that allow

3245
03:27:38,460 --> 03:27:43,252
additional housing types, it is possible for it to be

3246
03:27:43,252 --> 03:27:45,652
consistent. Okay. Thank you.

3247
03:27:50,993 --> 03:27:53,620
Thank you. Anyone else have any questions? Go ahead. Council

3248
03:27:53,620 --> 03:27:56,199
Member Rist. Thank you. Mayor Pro tem. Yeah,

3249
03:27:56,199 --> 03:27:59,669
this is this case is an easy yes for me. And it's not

3250
03:27:59,669 --> 03:28:03,720
because Mr. McSwain is actually a lifelong friend, one of my

3251
03:28:03,720 --> 03:28:09,144
dearest friends in the world. It's because, as Mr. is a jewel

3252
03:28:09,144 --> 03:28:12,615
said, this is not your ordinary development. Not at all. I

3253
03:28:12,615 --> 03:28:16,619
actually had the privilege of touring with Mr. McSwain 1520

3254
03:28:16,619 --> 03:28:18,287
years ago, North Street Community, when it was

3255
03:28:18,287 --> 03:28:22,224
literally, as Mr. Jewel said, dilapidated buildings right

3256
03:28:22,224 --> 03:28:26,361
near full steam Brewery. Now it's a marvelous community.

3257
03:28:26,361 --> 03:28:29,980
It's absolutely an example of God's beloved community on this

3258
03:28:29,980 --> 03:28:31,967
world with folks with disabilities living with able

3259
03:28:31,967 --> 03:28:34,837
bodied families. It's amazing model. We usually see

3260
03:28:34,837 --> 03:28:37,706
developments where developers want to maximize number of

3261
03:28:37,706 --> 03:28:40,375
units on the lot on their parcel. This is not the case

3262
03:28:40,375 --> 03:28:43,713
here. Mr. McSwain is not trying to maximize profit. He's trying

3263
03:28:43,713 --> 03:28:47,649
to maximize joy and love in the world. This is an amazing

3264
03:28:47,649 --> 03:28:51,586
project. I'm so proud to support this. I love the idea

3265
03:28:51,586 --> 03:28:53,989
of both. And this is not only housing, it's also below market

3266
03:28:53,989 --> 03:28:56,992
rate housing with AA to use to support more units. So this is

3267
03:28:56,992 --> 03:29:00,262
a beautiful project. We don't see stuff like this much. So I

3268
03:29:00,262 --> 03:29:03,640
just want to thank the the Mr.. Mr. Jewel and the applicant,

3269
03:29:03,640 --> 03:29:05,601
Mr. McSwain, my good friend, for an amazing project that

3270
03:29:05,601 --> 03:29:10,139
will make this a more beloved community. So thank you.

3271
03:29:10,139 --> 03:29:13,542
Thank you council colleagues. Anyone else?

3272
03:29:13,542 --> 03:29:16,345
Everything Council Member Rist just said thank you.

3273
03:29:16,345 --> 03:29:20,816
Perfect. So with that, I'm going to go ahead and move us

3274
03:29:20,816 --> 03:29:24,860
forward. My first motion this our first motion this evening

3275
03:29:24,860 --> 03:29:27,156
is to adopt an ordinance annexing experience reality.

3276
03:29:27,156 --> 03:29:29,224
Glenn West in the city of Durham, and to authorize the

3277
03:29:29,224 --> 03:29:31,493
city manager to enter into a utility extension agreement

3278
03:29:31,493 --> 03:29:34,435
with Experience Reality, Inc.. So moved.

3279
03:29:34,435 --> 03:29:36,371
Second. Have a motion and a second.

3280
03:29:36,371 --> 03:29:41,643
Madam clerk, could you please open the vote? Could you please

3281
03:29:41,643 --> 03:29:45,243
close the vote? Motion passes unanimously.

3282
03:29:46,247 --> 03:29:50,985
Thank you. And our second motion is to adopt an ordinance

3283
03:29:50,985 --> 03:29:52,920
amending the Unified Development Ordinance by taking

3284
03:29:52,920 --> 03:29:56,458
property out of the residential rule falls Jordan, district B

3285
03:29:56,458 --> 03:30:00,395
and falls, Jordan Falls, Jordan District. A watershed

3286
03:30:00,395 --> 03:30:03,197
protection overlays county jurisdiction and establishing

3287
03:30:03,197 --> 03:30:07,202
the same as residential rural falls. Jordan District B and

3288
03:30:07,202 --> 03:30:10,471
Falls Jordan District. A watershed protection overlays

3289
03:30:10,471 --> 03:30:12,607
cities jurisdiction. So second.

3290
03:30:12,607 --> 03:30:14,342
A motion. And second, Madam Clerk, could you please open

3291
03:30:14,342 --> 03:30:19,142
the vote? Could you please close the vote?

3292
03:30:20,215 --> 03:30:24,285
Motion passes unanimously. Thank you. And our last motion

3293
03:30:24,285 --> 03:30:27,622
is to adopt a consistency statement as required by NC

3294
03:30:27,622 --> 03:30:31,222
section 160 D-605. Move to adopt consistency.

3295
03:30:33,428 --> 03:30:36,970
Got a motion a second. Madam Clerk, could you please open

3296
03:30:36,970 --> 03:30:39,697
the vote? Please close the vote.

3297
03:30:43,304 --> 03:30:47,909
Motion passes unanimously. Thank you. thank you. Have a

3298
03:30:47,909 --> 03:30:52,709
good night. Next up is item number 25, consolidated

3299
03:30:53,248 --> 03:30:56,248
annexation 1418 South Miami. Good evening.

3300
03:30:56,718 --> 03:30:59,987
Thank you. Mayor Williams. Mayor Pro Tem caballero, an.

3301
03:30:59,987 --> 03:31:02,524
Honorable council members. Good evening. I'm Andy Lester with

3302
03:31:02,524 --> 03:31:04,459
the planning and development department. It's good to be

3303
03:31:04,459 --> 03:31:07,462
with you all. Before I begin, staff, I'd like to state for

3304
03:31:07,462 --> 03:31:09,530
the record that all planning department hearing items have

3305
03:31:09,530 --> 03:31:11,866
been advertised and notice, in accordance with state and local

3306
03:31:11,866 --> 03:31:15,200
law and affidavits of all notices are on file with the

3307
03:31:15,200 --> 03:31:18,273
Department. A request for Utility extension agreement,

3308
03:31:18,273 --> 03:31:21,876
voluntary annexation and initial zoning map change has

3309
03:31:21,876 --> 03:31:25,279
been received from ten stivers of community for two parcels of

3310
03:31:25,279 --> 03:31:30,790
land totaling 3.44 acres and located at 1404 and 1418 South

3311
03:31:30,818 --> 03:31:34,622
Miami Boulevard. Annexation petition is for a contiguous

3312
03:31:34,622 --> 03:31:37,425
expansion of the primary corporate limits, with the

3313
03:31:37,425 --> 03:31:41,290
intent to connect to city water and sewer. As part of this

3314
03:31:41,290 --> 03:31:43,431
annexation petition, the applicant is not seeking a

3315
03:31:43,431 --> 03:31:46,967
change in the underlying zoning districts of commercial,

3316
03:31:46,967 --> 03:31:49,704
general and residential suburban 20, a direct

3317
03:31:49,704 --> 03:31:52,507
transitional zoning is the general zoning map change, in

3318
03:31:52,507 --> 03:31:54,776
which the existing county zoning is translated to the

3319
03:31:54,776 --> 03:31:59,113
identical city zoning district. Upon the annexation of the

3320
03:31:59,113 --> 03:32:02,517
property into the city limits. Since there is no request for a

3321
03:32:02,517 --> 03:32:06,254
change to the existing zoning attached to this annexation

3322
03:32:06,254 --> 03:32:09,924
petition, there's no there is not a development plan under

3323
03:32:09,924 --> 03:32:13,128
consideration and therefore no proffered commitments. Any

3324
03:32:13,128 --> 03:32:16,131
future development may proceed according to what the zoning

3325
03:32:16,131 --> 03:32:20,680
would allow. The properties are designated highway commercial

3326
03:32:20,680 --> 03:32:24,872
on the place type map. The proposed Commercial General is

3327
03:32:24,872 --> 03:32:28,750
generally consistent with the designated place type, while

3328
03:32:28,750 --> 03:32:30,545
the proposed residential suburban 20 is not generally

3329
03:32:30,545 --> 03:32:33,810
consistent with the designated place type, staff does not

3330
03:32:33,810 --> 03:32:35,750
recommend a change in the place type because the proposed

3331
03:32:35,750 --> 03:32:39,200
zoning in the LDC will be consistent with the place type.

3332
03:32:39,200 --> 03:32:41,890
Thank you. Staff and the applicant are available for any

3333
03:32:41,890 --> 03:32:45,289
questions. Thank you for the report from

3334
03:32:46,227 --> 03:32:49,497
staff. I'm now to declare this public hearing open. First.

3335
03:32:49,497 --> 03:32:52,990
Colleagues, do we have any anyone have any questions or

3336
03:32:52,990 --> 03:32:59,899
for staff? Okay. And I think I just have. One speaker yeah, I

3337
03:33:03,978 --> 03:33:07,382
have one speaker right now. Just the applicant, Tim Sivers,

3338
03:33:07,382 --> 03:33:13,788
is that right? Here you are. Where'd you go? Good evening,

3339
03:33:13,788 --> 03:33:15,589
Mr. Cyrus. How much time do you think you need?

3340
03:33:15,589 --> 03:33:18,590
One minute, two minutes. Perfect. Thank you, Madam

3341
03:33:18,590 --> 03:33:20,595
Clerk. Could you just do it? Thank you.

3342
03:33:20,595 --> 03:33:22,129
Good evening, Council members Tim Sivers.

3343
03:33:22,129 --> 03:33:24,465
With community 16. Consultant Place. So, yes, the

3344
03:33:24,465 --> 03:33:25,734
project in front of you. Is for two.

3345
03:33:25,734 --> 03:33:29,870
Parcels. To be clear, this is owned by Admiral Properties who

3346
03:33:29,870 --> 03:33:33,208
I'm here representing tonight. That same property owner owns

3347
03:33:33,208 --> 03:33:36,410
the two parcels between these two that are being annexed. His

3348
03:33:36,410 --> 03:33:39,213
intent is to sell all four properties which are currently

3349
03:33:39,213 --> 03:33:42,817
on the market. We did hold two neighborhood meetings. Both

3350
03:33:42,817 --> 03:33:46,821
meetings had one neighbor in attendance. The first meeting,

3351
03:33:46,821 --> 03:33:49,357
actually, that neighbor asked to be part of the application.

3352
03:33:49,357 --> 03:33:52,693
The second meeting, that neighbor was signed up for the

3353
03:33:52,693 --> 03:33:55,697
wrong meeting. So technically he that person jumped out of

3354
03:33:55,697 --> 03:33:57,298
the meeting. So we had no attendees at the second

3355
03:33:57,298 --> 03:33:59,701
neighborhood meeting. Planning Commission did recommend

3356
03:33:59,701 --> 03:34:02,503
unanimous approval of this, and I request that you follow their

3357
03:34:02,503 --> 03:34:07,303
recommendation. I'm available for any questions. Thank you.

3358
03:34:08,376 --> 03:34:12,313
Thank you. Those are all the speakers I have signed up for

3359
03:34:12,313 --> 03:34:20,113
this item. Let me just make sure. Okay. And so at this time

3360
03:34:20,388 --> 03:34:23,190
I'm going to close the public hearing. The back before

3361
03:34:23,190 --> 03:34:26,260
council. Anyone have any questions colleagues questions

3362
03:34:26,260 --> 03:34:33,201
or comments. Okay I'm going to keep us moving then. So the

3363
03:34:33,201 --> 03:34:35,936
motion in front of us right now is to adopt an ordinance

3364
03:34:35,936 --> 03:34:40,340
annexing 1418 South Miami and to the city of Durham, and to

3365
03:34:40,340 --> 03:34:42,810
authorize the city manager to enter into a utility extension

3366
03:34:42,810 --> 03:34:44,946
agreement with Admiral Properties, LLC.

3367
03:34:44,946 --> 03:34:47,215
So move. I have a motion. A second.

3368
03:34:47,215 --> 03:34:53,815
Madam Clerk, could you please open the vote, please? Close it.

3369
03:34:55,623 --> 03:34:58,826
Motion passes unanimously. Thank you. Our second motion is

3370
03:34:58,826 --> 03:35:01,228
to adopt an ordinance amending the Unified Development

3371
03:35:01,228 --> 03:35:03,297
Ordinance by taking property out of the commercial, general

3372
03:35:03,297 --> 03:35:06,767
residential suburban Dash 20 falls Jordan Watershed Overlay

3373
03:35:06,767 --> 03:35:10,705
district B, Dash district Dash b overlay County jurisdiction

3374
03:35:10,705 --> 03:35:14,175
and establishing the same as commercial general residential

3375
03:35:14,175 --> 03:35:17,245
suburban Dash 20 falls slash Jordan Watershed overlay

3376
03:35:17,245 --> 03:35:19,914
district B overlay city jurisdiction.

3377
03:35:19,914 --> 03:35:22,583
So moved. Second have a motion a second.

3378
03:35:22,583 --> 03:35:27,588
Madam clerk, could you please open the vote? Please close the

3379
03:35:27,588 --> 03:35:29,988
vote. Motion passes unanimously.

3380
03:35:31,392 --> 03:35:34,661
Thank you. And last motion is to adopt a consistency

3381
03:35:34,661 --> 03:35:37,731
statement as required by NC General Statute, section one

3382
03:35:37,731 --> 03:35:39,731
6605. So moved.

3383
03:35:41,100 --> 03:35:45,801
Second. I have a motion and a second.

3384
03:35:46,211 --> 03:35:48,947
Madam clerk, could you please close the vote? Open the vote.

3385
03:35:48,947 --> 03:35:52,751
Close it. Thank you. Motion passes unanimously.

3386
03:35:52,751 --> 03:35:59,351
Thank you. Our last item, if I'm not mistaken, before us

3387
03:35:59,424 --> 03:36:04,224
this evening is item number 23, consolidated Consult. Excuse

3388
03:36:06,898 --> 03:36:10,102
me. Thank you. Consolidated annexation enclave at Little

3389
03:36:10,102 --> 03:36:13,702
Creek. For. annual action plan CDBG,

3390
03:36:29,855 --> 03:36:34,655
the homes. Hold on. Yes, sir. Sorry. That

3391
03:36:42,267 --> 03:36:46,271
was under consent. So unless that item got pulled, if I'm

3392
03:36:46,271 --> 03:36:48,873
not mistaken, the item is under consent. So unless it was

3393
03:36:48,873 --> 03:36:55,140
pulled, we passed that earlier in the evening. So our. Sir,

3394
03:36:55,140 --> 03:36:57,483
I'm not going to speak to you back and forth. Maybe somebody

3395
03:36:57,483 --> 03:37:01,286
from staff could. Am I wrong on that, madam? Which item? He

3396
03:37:01,286 --> 03:37:03,686
said. We're talking about.

3397
03:37:06,692 --> 03:37:10,292
Item number 26. Correct. Is that right?

3398
03:37:10,628 --> 03:37:14,228
26. If staff could speak with the

3399
03:37:15,901 --> 03:37:21,301
resident around that, that would be helpful. Thank you.

3400
03:37:27,379 --> 03:37:29,379
What's going. On?

3401
03:37:33,118 --> 03:37:36,321
Good evening, Mr. Lester. We're ready for the staff report.

3402
03:37:36,321 --> 03:37:40,592
Appreciate your patience. No worries. Thank you. A

3403
03:37:40,592 --> 03:37:44,620
request for utility extension agreement. Voluntary annexation

3404
03:37:44,620 --> 03:37:47,399
and initial zoning map. Change has been received from no.

3405
03:37:47,399 --> 03:37:51,670
Ghost of Morningstar law Group for one parcel and a portion of

3406
03:37:51,670 --> 03:37:55,870
another, totaling 47.85 acres and located at 55, 24, and 5515

3407
03:37:58,544 --> 03:38:02,130
George King Road. This annexation petition is

3408
03:38:02,130 --> 03:38:04,416
contiguous to the primary corporate limits. Due to a

3409
03:38:04,416 --> 03:38:07,552
recent annexation by state law. The request is considered

3410
03:38:07,552 --> 03:38:10,756
non-contiguous because it was at the time of submittal, the

3411
03:38:10,756 --> 03:38:14,293
applicant proposes to change this designation of one part of

3412
03:38:14,293 --> 03:38:19,930
one partial parcel read 232242, totaling 45.95 acres to plan

3413
03:38:21,232 --> 03:38:25,432
development residential 5.006 to allow up to 230 townhouses,

3414
03:38:26,704 --> 03:38:30,909
multiplexes and or apartments. The applicant is also seeking

3415
03:38:30,909 --> 03:38:36,848
an initial zoning map change of Rs 20 county jurisdiction to Rs

3416
03:38:36,848 --> 03:38:41,648
20 city jurisdiction for the other parcel, read 140495. Any

3417
03:38:43,788 --> 03:38:47,459
use within the Rs 20 district will be allowed. The properties

3418
03:38:47,459 --> 03:38:49,595
are currently designated Mixed Residential Neighborhood,

3419
03:38:49,595 --> 03:38:52,664
Transit Opportunity Area and Recreation and open space on

3420
03:38:52,664 --> 03:38:57,469
the place type map. The proposed PDR 5.006 is generally

3421
03:38:57,469 --> 03:38:59,271
consistent with the mixed residential neighborhood and

3422
03:38:59,271 --> 03:39:03,275
recreation and open space, place types, and the Rs 20

3423
03:39:03,275 --> 03:39:08,280
zoning is generally consistent with the designated place type,

3424
03:39:08,280 --> 03:39:10,883
as the district allows residential with limited

3425
03:39:10,883 --> 03:39:13,485
non-residential uses. Individual higher density and

3426
03:39:13,485 --> 03:39:17,822
intensity uses are still desired in the Toe area. Thank

3427
03:39:17,822 --> 03:39:23,222
you staff. The applicant are available for any questions.

3428
03:39:23,695 --> 03:39:27,900
Thank you. Having heard the staff report, I'm declaring

3429
03:39:27,900 --> 03:39:32,704
this public hearing open before we take speakers. Colleagues.

3430
03:39:32,704 --> 03:39:38,911
Does anyone have any questions for staff? Okay, based on my

3431
03:39:38,911 --> 03:39:41,713
count and I'm just going to take a second to count how many

3432
03:39:41,713 --> 03:39:47,713
speakers I have that are not the applicant. I have 21

3433
03:39:59,630 --> 03:40:05,690
speakers on this item, so. I'm going to allow one minute per

3434
03:40:05,690 --> 03:40:09,474
speaker. Please do not yell at me. It's not going to. It's

3435
03:40:09,474 --> 03:40:14,274
10:40 p.m. with 21 speakers. It's 21 minutes. I understand

3436
03:40:15,947 --> 03:40:19,284
that y'all are displeased, but as presiding chair, I get to

3437
03:40:19,284 --> 03:40:25,284
make that decision. Mr. Ghosh, you are the applicant. Thank

3438
03:40:29,627 --> 03:40:34,365
you, Mr. Ghosh. How much time? And please don't say too many

3439
03:40:34,365 --> 03:40:36,765
minutes. Less than. 21 minutes.

3440
03:40:37,502 --> 03:40:41,702
I was going to say. Maybe 12 minutes.

3441
03:40:43,107 --> 03:40:48,380
Okay. Madam clerk, could you put 12 minutes? And the way

3442
03:40:48,380 --> 03:40:54,586
this works, please do not yell from the chambers. I taught

3443
03:40:54,586 --> 03:40:57,322
middle, I taught preschool through middle school. Do not

3444
03:40:57,322 --> 03:41:04,996
yell. Thank you. If the. We have to allow equal time. So if

3445
03:41:04,996 --> 03:41:08,866
for whatever reason, the applicant goes longer, more

3446
03:41:08,866 --> 03:41:11,870
time gets added to the other side. That's how this works. It

3447
03:41:11,870 --> 03:41:14,739
has to be fair. And in fact, we are already not following our

3448
03:41:14,739 --> 03:41:17,542
own rules because we are only allowed by our own procedures.

3449
03:41:17,542 --> 03:41:22,147
It's 15 minutes per side. That is actually what our procedures

3450
03:41:22,147 --> 03:41:26,551
say. And we adopted those procedures, re-adopted them in

3451
03:41:26,551 --> 03:41:31,756
June of 2025. So by our own procedures, by letting everyone

3452
03:41:31,756 --> 03:41:37,829
speak, we are already forgiving and adding more. So I'm just

3453
03:41:37,829 --> 03:41:41,233
sharing because I know some of you all are not. You don't come

3454
03:41:41,233 --> 03:41:43,902
here as much and so you don't know what all the rules are. So

3455
03:41:43,902 --> 03:41:46,705
I'm explaining our procedures. Our procedures allows 15

3456
03:41:46,705 --> 03:41:49,908
minutes per side. Opponents and proponents. That's our

3457
03:41:49,908 --> 03:41:53,444
procedures. Go ahead. Mr.. Gosh. Thank you.

3458
03:41:53,444 --> 03:41:54,115
First of all. Thank you.

3459
03:41:54,115 --> 03:41:55,316
Mr. Lester, for your presentation.

3460
03:41:55,316 --> 03:41:56,451
And good evening. Mayor Williams.

3461
03:41:56,451 --> 03:41:58,653
Mayor Pro Tem. Caballero .. And members of the

3462
03:41:58,653 --> 03:42:01,323
city Council. I'm Neil Ghosh with the Morningstar Law Group

3463
03:42:01,323 --> 03:42:04,326
at 700 West Main Street in Durham. I'm here tonight

3464
03:42:04,326 --> 03:42:06,862
representing the application for this rezoning and

3465
03:42:06,862 --> 03:42:10,650
annexation request. Our team includes Tim Sivers with

3466
03:42:10,650 --> 03:42:13,201
community, who you heard from earlier, and the developers, Ty

3467
03:42:13,201 --> 03:42:17,673
Armstrong with Abode and Ted Heilbrunn with Kelly on the

3468
03:42:17,673 --> 03:42:21,543
affordable component. There is a lot to talk about here, so

3469
03:42:21,543 --> 03:42:24,790
I'm going to jump right in rather than repeating what Mr.

3470
03:42:24,790 --> 03:42:27,348
Lester has already told you. This is a challenging site, but

3471
03:42:27,348 --> 03:42:30,819
I believe our team has risen to that challenge. When Ty

3472
03:42:30,819 --> 03:42:34,223
contacted me, he told me his goal was to put a high tech

3473
03:42:34,223 --> 03:42:38,560
deal on this site. Married with a market rate component. When

3474
03:42:38,560 --> 03:42:41,430
we looked at how that might work, we had to make some tough

3475
03:42:41,430 --> 03:42:44,900
decisions. Just like you will need to do tonight. But I want

3476
03:42:44,900 --> 03:42:50,439
to walk you through that process. Here's the site and

3477
03:42:50,439 --> 03:42:53,308
just for orientation purposes, the right hand side of the page

3478
03:42:53,308 --> 03:42:56,912
is south at the top of the page where George King Road is is

3479
03:42:56,912 --> 03:42:59,848
the east. You can see the Chapel Hill community is on the

3480
03:42:59,848 --> 03:43:02,317
bottom of the page, which directionally represents the

3481
03:43:02,317 --> 03:43:06,550
West. This is one of the few areas where the homes are

3482
03:43:06,550 --> 03:43:09,191
within Durham County, but also are within the town of Chapel

3483
03:43:09,191 --> 03:43:12,327
Hill rather than the City of Durham. And anyway, you can see

3484
03:43:12,327 --> 03:43:15,197
on this page that there are some streams on this property,

3485
03:43:15,197 --> 03:43:19,401
and there is some natural heritage designation on the

3486
03:43:19,401 --> 03:43:25,607
site. I thought it would be useful to start there. The

3487
03:43:25,607 --> 03:43:28,900
brown area on this slide represents the natural Heritage

3488
03:43:28,900 --> 03:43:31,480
Area designation on the site, so you can see it's basically

3489
03:43:31,480 --> 03:43:34,483
all in the southern portion of the site. You can also see that

3490
03:43:34,483 --> 03:43:38,287
there already are impacts in that area with this existing

3491
03:43:38,287 --> 03:43:43,892
gas line right here. That's already there, right. And but

3492
03:43:43,892 --> 03:43:47,963
what really is this natural heritage area. And if you zoom

3493
03:43:47,963 --> 03:43:52,634
out, I think you can get a better picture. The natural

3494
03:43:52,634 --> 03:43:56,171
heritage area that exists on our site is the very periphery

3495
03:43:56,171 --> 03:43:58,840
of a much larger natural heritage area. In fact, the

3496
03:43:58,840 --> 03:44:02,440
area to our south all the way out to highway 54 is all

3497
03:44:02,440 --> 03:44:05,380
natural Heritage area. And that portion south of us is

3498
03:44:05,380 --> 03:44:09,584
federally managed. In other words, there's a huge chunk of

3499
03:44:09,584 --> 03:44:13,721
natural heritage area that is already being preserved on our

3500
03:44:13,721 --> 03:44:17,926
site. We have two categories R5, which is a general category

3501
03:44:17,926 --> 03:44:22,998
as opposed to a top or high priority area, and C4, which

3502
03:44:22,998 --> 03:44:26,735
signifies limited or lower priority if it were a high

3503
03:44:26,735 --> 03:44:29,605
priority, one would imagine the federal government would have

3504
03:44:29,605 --> 03:44:35,343
taken it for preservation. Like the area to the south. Now,

3505
03:44:35,343 --> 03:44:39,614
this image is from an item in your agenda packet. The UEA or

3506
03:44:39,614 --> 03:44:43,418
Utility Extension Agreement. This is a document prepared by

3507
03:44:43,418 --> 03:44:48,691
the city staff to tell us what we need to do on our dime to

3508
03:44:48,691 --> 03:44:53,362
bring water and sewer to this site. If we are annexed. As you

3509
03:44:53,362 --> 03:44:55,897
can see, the site has been identified for a public lift

3510
03:44:55,897 --> 03:44:59,501
station. The ideal location for a lift station, just generally

3511
03:44:59,501 --> 03:45:02,504
speaking, is at the very bottom of a drainage basin which

3512
03:45:02,504 --> 03:45:05,907
happens to be on the site, and this infrastructure will be

3513
03:45:05,907 --> 03:45:12,507
built by the developer at a cost of around $1.5 million. So

3514
03:45:13,982 --> 03:45:16,785
that's where the lift station is, right in the natural

3515
03:45:16,785 --> 03:45:19,988
heritage area. And don't forget, we would have to build

3516
03:45:19,988 --> 03:45:25,927
a road to it for access and extend utilities to and from it.

3517
03:45:25,927 --> 03:45:30,265
Now, this is a figure from the adopted collector street plan

3518
03:45:30,265 --> 03:45:33,267
for this area. You can see all the roads have been planned

3519
03:45:33,267 --> 03:45:36,738
through this parcel, which is a fixed feature of the site that

3520
03:45:36,738 --> 03:45:39,608
we have to take into consideration for development.

3521
03:45:39,608 --> 03:45:42,477
The developer will build portions of these roads and off

3522
03:45:42,477 --> 03:45:46,214
site improvements, including extensions of utilities that

3523
03:45:46,214 --> 03:45:50,218
have costs of around $2.5 million in public

3524
03:45:50,218 --> 03:45:53,755
infrastructure. Now, here are those roads again in that

3525
03:45:53,755 --> 03:45:57,692
roundabout and again, right through the natural heritage

3526
03:45:57,692 --> 03:46:00,896
areas. Honestly, I don't really understand this. This transit

3527
03:46:00,896 --> 03:46:04,299
plant or collector street plan. You kind of could not draw

3528
03:46:04,299 --> 03:46:08,636
these roads in a worse way with more impacts. But luckily there

3529
03:46:08,636 --> 03:46:11,506
is some flexibility for property owners on how the road

3530
03:46:11,506 --> 03:46:14,376
goes through the property. The end points are more or less

3531
03:46:14,376 --> 03:46:20,376
fixed. The road on the southern side, our southern boundary

3532
03:46:21,983 --> 03:46:24,385
actually is not entirely on our property, so we will not be

3533
03:46:24,385 --> 03:46:28,189
building it. Or I don't think any portion of it actually,

3534
03:46:28,189 --> 03:46:30,859
which I think is a good thing given its significant impacts

3535
03:46:30,859 --> 03:46:33,795
to the natural heritage area. And we intend to design the

3536
03:46:33,795 --> 03:46:36,465
other road, the one that goes to the middle of the property,

3537
03:46:36,465 --> 03:46:39,867
so as to avoid the first little stream finger, right, right

3538
03:46:39,867 --> 03:46:42,938
here we want to turn that road. So we miss that. We want to

3539
03:46:42,938 --> 03:46:47,800
straighten out the crossing of the stream and hopefully get

3540
03:46:47,800 --> 03:46:52,814
all of that road out of the natural heritage area. And

3541
03:46:52,814 --> 03:46:55,483
significantly, as I mentioned at the beginning, my client was

3542
03:46:55,483 --> 03:46:59,488
dead set on finding a way to include a light tech component

3543
03:46:59,488 --> 03:47:03,240
in this project. We found a great partner on the on the

3544
03:47:03,240 --> 03:47:06,361
affordable side and Ted, Halbrand Kelly development. And

3545
03:47:06,361 --> 03:47:10,765
you all might be aware that light tech deals have a scoring

3546
03:47:10,765 --> 03:47:15,360
rubric, which includes many facets. And among those are

3547
03:47:15,360 --> 03:47:17,706
proximity to and drive time to amenities

3548
03:47:17,706 --> 03:47:19,574
Like grocery stores or. Pharmacies.

3549
03:47:19,574 --> 03:47:22,511
And also access. Our valuation.

3550
03:47:22,511 --> 03:47:24,446
Of the site basically indicates there are only.

3551
03:47:24,446 --> 03:47:26,180
Two locations. On the parcel.

3552
03:47:26,180 --> 03:47:30,852
Which will score adequately to be awarded tax credit. And you

3553
03:47:30,852 --> 03:47:34,722
guessed it, both are within the Natural Heritage area. I said I

3554
03:47:34,722 --> 03:47:37,658
wanted to walk you through the decision making process here.

3555
03:47:37,658 --> 03:47:41,463
In a nutshell. We found that we really cannot avoid impacts to

3556
03:47:41,463 --> 03:47:44,866
the natural heritage area based purely on the infrastructure

3557
03:47:44,866 --> 03:47:49,700
requirements. The lift station, the roads, the stream crossing.

3558
03:47:49,700 --> 03:47:51,873
No matter how this site is developed. The natural heritage

3559
03:47:51,873 --> 03:47:55,760
area will be impacted. Secondly, we took into

3560
03:47:55,760 --> 03:47:59,414
consideration the state's own value of this particular

3561
03:47:59,414 --> 03:48:03,685
natural heritage area. Not all are created equal. These fell

3562
03:48:03,685 --> 03:48:08,292
into the lower categories. And finally, we ultimately decided

3563
03:48:08,292 --> 03:48:11,828
that if impacts to the natural heritage area are inevitable

3564
03:48:11,828 --> 03:48:15,699
and these areas are not of particular significance, that

3565
03:48:15,699 --> 03:48:20,370
it makes sense to include the light component despite it

3566
03:48:20,370 --> 03:48:23,840
impacting the natural heritage area. The city has already

3567
03:48:23,840 --> 03:48:28,450
decided to pick infrastructure over natural heritage. We are

3568
03:48:28,450 --> 03:48:31,114
hoping you will pick affordable housing over natural heritage

3569
03:48:31,114 --> 03:48:36,120
as well. To wrap up, I have two more slides. Tonight there are

3570
03:48:36,120 --> 03:48:40,123
a few more commitments we would like to add. We want to

3571
03:48:40,123 --> 03:48:44,794
increase our school commitment from 11,000 to 25,000. We also

3572
03:48:44,794 --> 03:48:48,465
want to commit to handling the 100 year storm. And then these

3573
03:48:48,465 --> 03:48:51,335
last two are meant to provide specific commitments for

3574
03:48:51,335 --> 03:48:55,720
greater protections to the natural heritage area. We are

3575
03:48:55,720 --> 03:48:58,342
committing to having a 30 foot natural buffer along our

3576
03:48:58,342 --> 03:49:01,945
southern property line, and we are prohibited prohibiting land

3577
03:49:01,945 --> 03:49:04,748
disturbance south of that gas easement that I pointed out

3578
03:49:04,748 --> 03:49:08,170
earlier. These are great commitments on top of the

3579
03:49:08,170 --> 03:49:11,355
already great commitments the project has, including several

3580
03:49:11,355 --> 03:49:14,958
of which were negotiated with our Chapel Hill neighbors for

3581
03:49:14,958 --> 03:49:19,290
buffers, additional plantings, and height limitations. We also

3582
03:49:19,290 --> 03:49:22,832
already have decreased the allowable impervious from 70%

3583
03:49:22,832 --> 03:49:28,238
to 60%. We have three times the amount of UDL required, tree

3584
03:49:28,238 --> 03:49:31,508
coverage, and of course the affordable housing commitment,

3585
03:49:31,508 --> 03:49:37,514
which requires a minimum of 20% of the units to be affordable.

3586
03:49:37,514 --> 03:49:40,384
My client is deep into this project and at this point is

3587
03:49:40,384 --> 03:49:42,919
therefore in a position where they intend to develop the

3588
03:49:42,919 --> 03:49:46,189
site. This last slide, I just wanted to point out the various

3589
03:49:46,189 --> 03:49:49,993
outcomes here. Tonight. We are asking for your approval of

3590
03:49:49,993 --> 03:49:53,396
both the annexation and rezoning. This will result in

3591
03:49:53,396 --> 03:49:56,996
about 230 units, roughly $4 million in public

3592
03:49:57,100 --> 03:50:00,601
infrastructure, and 20% affordable units. If instead

3593
03:50:01,938 --> 03:50:04,541
you approve only the annexation, the project would

3594
03:50:04,541 --> 03:50:08,212
shrink to about 91 single family detached units. The

3595
03:50:08,212 --> 03:50:11,748
public infrastructure would still be there, but we would

3596
03:50:11,748 --> 03:50:14,884
not be able to do any of the affordable housing. And if

3597
03:50:14,884 --> 03:50:17,955
neither the annexation nor the rezoning are approved, my

3598
03:50:17,955 --> 03:50:20,891
client would intend to build this site on well and septic in

3599
03:50:20,891 --> 03:50:26,430
the county for about 25 estate lots. Again, I recognize this

3600
03:50:26,430 --> 03:50:30,330
will be a hard decision for you. It was for us. We

3601
03:50:30,330 --> 03:50:32,236
understand that we already went through the mental math on

3602
03:50:32,236 --> 03:50:35,973
this, and obviously we decided to move forward. This is a good

3603
03:50:35,973 --> 03:50:39,576
project. Despite the challenges that the property presents, and

3604
03:50:39,576 --> 03:50:42,378
we hope you see it the same way. Our team is here to answer

3605
03:50:42,378 --> 03:50:47,784
any questions you may have, and thank you for your time tonight.

3606
03:50:47,784 --> 03:50:55,392
Thank you. I have been given a list of residents in the order

3607
03:50:55,392 --> 03:50:57,994
that they would like to speak, so I'm going to call that list,

3608
03:50:57,994 --> 03:51:00,330
and then I'm going to have to cross-reference it to the list

3609
03:51:00,330 --> 03:51:02,532
that signed up with the clerk. So just to make sure I don't

3610
03:51:02,532 --> 03:51:07,137
skip anybody. I think what I'm going to do, and actually I'm

3611
03:51:07,137 --> 03:51:09,539
going to take the online speaker. I think we have one

3612
03:51:09,539 --> 03:51:12,539
online speaker, Mr.. Jonathan Langston.

3613
03:51:19,949 --> 03:51:22,819
Can you hear me? Can you speak up just a little

3614
03:51:22,819 --> 03:51:24,754
bit? Yes.

3615
03:51:24,754 --> 03:51:25,889
Can you hear. Me now?

3616
03:51:25,889 --> 03:51:29,692
Yes. We can. Thank you. Good evening. You have one minute.

3617
03:51:29,692 --> 03:51:31,360
All right. I'm Jonathan Langston, and my

3618
03:51:31,360 --> 03:51:34,564
home is located at 5508 George King Road, adjacent to the

3619
03:51:34,564 --> 03:51:37,233
proposed site. I think the stormwater issue is one of my

3620
03:51:37,233 --> 03:51:40,303
biggest concerns for roadway and sewer infrastructure, and

3621
03:51:40,303 --> 03:51:43,106
the legality of the water utility extension agreement.

3622
03:51:43,106 --> 03:51:45,241
Currently, there are several developments around the area

3623
03:51:45,241 --> 03:51:47,110
which have been approved, and I don't believe the city is

3624
03:51:47,110 --> 03:51:49,780
taking into consideration the exorbitant amount of runoff

3625
03:51:49,780 --> 03:51:52,315
that we're cleared with this development. The connector road

3626
03:51:52,315 --> 03:51:54,851
from George King Road to Lancaster connects directly

3627
03:51:54,851 --> 03:51:57,387
above a creek that crosses George King Road and onward to

3628
03:51:57,387 --> 03:52:00,190
Lee village center. And I have all ideas that the City of

3629
03:52:00,190 --> 03:52:02,392
Durham will have future problems and costs of this

3630
03:52:02,392 --> 03:52:04,928
road. With the roadway connector for George King

3631
03:52:04,928 --> 03:52:07,998
washing out the location to the creek due to stormwater from

3632
03:52:07,998 --> 03:52:11,667
surrounding development and most importantly, affecting the

3633
03:52:11,667 --> 03:52:14,338
sewer pumping station outlined in exhibit B of the Utility

3634
03:52:14,338 --> 03:52:17,808
Extension Agreement. Another big concern I have is the

3635
03:52:17,808 --> 03:52:21,110
legality of the drinking water infrastructure outlined in

3636
03:52:21,110 --> 03:52:24,140
exhibit A of the utility agreement downward, North and

3637
03:52:24,140 --> 03:52:28,814
South. My 2022 plat registered with the county memorializes

3638
03:52:29,850 --> 03:52:34,490
the width of the road and my neighbor to the west of me.

3639
03:52:34,490 --> 03:52:37,761
There have a conservation easement to the center of

3640
03:52:37,761 --> 03:52:44,361
George King Road. So thank you. I hope y'all vote no.

3641
03:52:44,434 --> 03:52:48,839
Those are all the online speakers I have. First, sign

3642
03:52:48,839 --> 03:52:51,707
up. This is the order that folks said that they wanted to

3643
03:52:51,707 --> 03:52:55,578
speak in. So I'm going to call you up the first five Melissa

3644
03:52:55,578 --> 03:53:00,378
Cain, Ruth Ross, Linda Shiflett, Brian Sugg and

3645
03:53:00,516 --> 03:53:04,716
Michael Wilder. Good evening. My name is

3646
03:53:18,534 --> 03:53:21,871
Melissa Kane. I live in the Oaks Villas in Chapel Hill and

3647
03:53:21,871 --> 03:53:26,760
in Durham County. Thank you for taking my emails. As the

3648
03:53:26,760 --> 03:53:28,476
president of the. HOA.

3649
03:53:28,879 --> 03:53:33,679
The Oaks Villas Owners Association, I felt obligated

3650
03:53:34,160 --> 03:53:41,240
to explain to you the value of this particular land and why it

3651
03:53:41,240 --> 03:53:45,428
is vastly inappropriate for development. First of all, Oaks

3652
03:53:45,428 --> 03:53:49,232
Villas is adjacent to Little Creek. It is adjacent to the US

3653
03:53:49,232 --> 03:53:52,769
Army Corps of Engineers. Land. North Carolina Game Lands and

3654
03:53:52,769 --> 03:53:59,309
and 5524 George King Road. The proposed site for enclave is a

3655
03:53:59,309 --> 03:54:04,714
site that stands out as the northernmost boundary of the

3656
03:54:04,714 --> 03:54:10,114
Army Corps Watershed Protection Agent Area. It is the

3657
03:54:10,253 --> 03:54:16,253
headwaters of the Jordan Lake watershed. No other property in

3658
03:54:16,527 --> 03:54:23,127
Durham County is like this property. It is unique. Is that

3659
03:54:24,669 --> 03:54:25,803
it? Yes, ma'am.

3660
03:54:25,803 --> 03:54:32,403
Thank you. That is it? Yep. Thank you, Miss Ruth Ross.

3661
03:54:35,480 --> 03:54:39,617
My name is Ruth Ross on. Helmsdale Drive and I've lived

3662
03:54:39,617 --> 03:54:45,220
in Durham and Durham County since 1970. I have watched this

3663
03:54:45,220 --> 03:54:48,559
community grow, change and prosper over many decades, and

3664
03:54:48,559 --> 03:54:51,629
I care deeply about the decisions that shape its

3665
03:54:51,629 --> 03:54:56,340
future. The question tonight is whether the enclave project

3666
03:54:56,340 --> 03:54:59,971
will be the right kind of growth in the right place.

3667
03:54:59,971 --> 03:55:05,309
Durham adopted clear goals in the 2023 Comprehensive Plan for

3668
03:55:05,309 --> 03:55:08,309
Complete Neighborhoods, transportation, access and

3669
03:55:09,470 --> 03:55:13,247
Environmental Stewardship. Enclave may add housing units,

3670
03:55:13,785 --> 03:55:18,322
but it falls short of these larger responsibilities. I'm

3671
03:55:18,322 --> 03:55:21,592
especially troubled by what this proposal means for the

3672
03:55:21,592 --> 03:55:26,464
land itself. Once mature, trees are removed, streams disturbed,

3673
03:55:26,464 --> 03:55:30,535
and large areas covered with pavement and rooftops. Those

3674
03:55:30,535 --> 03:55:34,873
natural protections are lost for generations. When the city

3675
03:55:34,873 --> 03:55:38,410
approves annexations and rezoning, I believe those

3676
03:55:38,410 --> 03:55:42,613
decisions should fairly clear the long term public good.

3677
03:55:42,613 --> 03:55:46,160
Thank you. And then just real quick, some of the folks who I

3678
03:55:46,160 --> 03:55:49,554
have in the order that they want weren't I don't I'm not

3679
03:55:49,554 --> 03:55:52,356
matching them. So I may I may read your name out afterwards

3680
03:55:52,356 --> 03:55:54,893
and just make sure that you register with the city clerk.

3681
03:55:54,893 --> 03:55:58,562
Okay. Thank you. Good evening, Miss Shiflett.

3682
03:55:58,562 --> 03:56:00,899
Yes. Good evening. My name is Linda

3683
03:56:00,899 --> 03:56:03,568
Shiflett, and I'm here to speak about enclaves, affordable

3684
03:56:03,568 --> 03:56:07,505
housing model. At first glance, at 20% affordable housing

3685
03:56:07,505 --> 03:56:10,909
commitment sounds meaningful. And I want to acknowledge that

3686
03:56:10,909 --> 03:56:13,511
Durham does need more affordable housing. We've heard

3687
03:56:13,511 --> 03:56:16,781
it a lot tonight, but tonight's question is not whether

3688
03:56:16,781 --> 03:56:20,652
affordability matters. It's whether this model delivers it

3689
03:56:20,652 --> 03:56:24,322
in a way that is equitable, reliable and aligned with your

3690
03:56:24,322 --> 03:56:28,659
comprehensive plan. Based on the details on the staff report

3691
03:56:28,659 --> 03:56:32,130
and the Planning Commission report, it does not. First, the

3692
03:56:32,130 --> 03:56:36,200
20% commitment is misleading. The proposal allows a portion

3693
03:56:36,200 --> 03:56:40,404
of that obligation to be met by conveying a separate three acre

3694
03:56:40,404 --> 03:56:44,341
parcel to another developer. That means the affordable

3695
03:56:44,341 --> 03:56:47,878
housing is not concurrently built, not guaranteed in

3696
03:56:47,878 --> 03:56:51,149
timing, and not controlled by this project. It is deferred

3697
03:56:51,149 --> 03:56:55,152
and has uncertainty. This model creates separation, not

3698
03:56:55,152 --> 03:56:58,890
inclusion. Market rate units are clustered in one area,

3699
03:56:58,890 --> 03:57:02,293
while income restricted units are placed in another. This is

3700
03:57:02,293 --> 03:57:06,630
not a mixed income community, its economic segregation.

3701
03:57:06,630 --> 03:57:10,301
Durham's policy calls for integration where affordability

3702
03:57:10,301 --> 03:57:12,570
is woven into the fabric of a neighborhood.

3703
03:57:12,570 --> 03:57:17,370
Thank you. Thank you so much, Brian Sugg.

3704
03:57:27,317 --> 03:57:29,720
Good evening. Good evening Brian.

3705
03:57:29,720 --> 03:57:32,390
I live in Durham. County and the community that borders the

3706
03:57:32,390 --> 03:57:35,193
western boundary of this project. There's a lot

3707
03:57:35,193 --> 03:57:37,528
happening in the near vicinity of our neighborhood, and I

3708
03:57:37,528 --> 03:57:40,531
wanted to call that out here tonight to quantify the impact

3709
03:57:40,531 --> 03:57:42,867
that not only this development, but the other developments are

3710
03:57:42,867 --> 03:57:45,470
having on our neighborhood. I provided this map to all of you

3711
03:57:45,470 --> 03:57:48,539
in email yesterday, and I bring it here tonight to show that

3712
03:57:48,539 --> 03:57:55,213
there are 12 projects in total on this one square mile of map

3713
03:57:55,213 --> 03:57:58,616
that you see here on the screen tonight. Six of these projects

3714
03:57:58,616 --> 03:58:00,751
have already been built primarily along Farrington

3715
03:58:00,751 --> 03:58:04,955
Road. Five of them are active cases. That is listed on page

3716
03:58:04,955 --> 03:58:07,758
seven of the zoning Map report in your packet. And then you

3717
03:58:07,758 --> 03:58:10,962
have the enclave. I bring this to your attention one, because

3718
03:58:10,962 --> 03:58:14,165
there are 4800 units that have been planned for this one

3719
03:58:14,165 --> 03:58:18,169
square mile of development, and at 2.2 people per unit, that's

3720
03:58:18,169 --> 03:58:21,380
over 10,000 people being squeezed into this amount of

3721
03:58:21,380 --> 03:58:24,308
area that is constrained by wetlands to both the east and

3722
03:58:24,308 --> 03:58:27,845
the west. And this enclave proposal is only one of two

3723
03:58:27,845 --> 03:58:31,716
remaining in rezoning and application rezoning phase. And

3724
03:58:31,716 --> 03:58:33,718
you have an opportunity to preserve some of what's left.

3725
03:58:33,718 --> 03:58:37,918
Thank you. Thank you. Good evening, good.

3726
03:58:55,740 --> 03:59:00,611
Evening, good morning. I so my name is Michael. Wilder and I'm

3727
03:59:00,611 --> 03:59:04,748
here tonight to oppose the annexation. Rezoning. I'm going

3728
03:59:04,748 --> 03:59:09,860
to deviate from my prepared text to talk about an exchange

3729
03:59:09,860 --> 03:59:14,292
of emails I've had with Andy Lester and Eric Kane over the

3730
03:59:14,292 --> 03:59:18,228
last few months. First of all, and your documents tonight for

3731
03:59:18,228 --> 03:59:22,166
the annexation petition in the first paragraph, state pretty

3732
03:59:22,166 --> 03:59:25,102
clearly the state law requires this application to be

3733
03:59:25,102 --> 03:59:29,390
considered as a non-contiguous, because when it was submitted

3734
03:59:29,390 --> 03:59:32,776
to the city planning, the city county planning, it was not

3735
03:59:32,776 --> 03:59:35,580
contiguous could not be considered contiguous. So it's

3736
03:59:35,580 --> 03:59:39,250
not a it's a non-contiguous annexation. Secondly, I've

3737
03:59:39,250 --> 03:59:43,187
exchanged email once again with Andy, and here is the place

3738
03:59:43,187 --> 03:59:47,324
type map for the properties along George King Road. And you

3739
03:59:47,324 --> 03:59:51,395
can plainly see, as Andy has confirmed with me, that the

3740
03:59:51,395 --> 03:59:56,795
acreage set aside for 5524 George King Road, the enclave

3741
03:59:57,869 --> 04:00:03,674
development, is not a Toa. It's not designed as a toa unlikely

3742
04:00:03,674 --> 04:00:06,770
village, which is on the east side. Thank you.

3743
04:00:06,770 --> 04:00:09,747
Thank you so much. The next few. And then just very

3744
04:00:09,747 --> 04:00:13,551
clearly, Miss Melissa and Miss Ruth Ross and Miss Linda

3745
04:00:13,551 --> 04:00:17,354
Shiflett, I don't have you on our registered list with the

3746
04:00:17,354 --> 04:00:21,225
clerk. So before you leave, just make sure you register.

3747
04:00:21,225 --> 04:00:26,716
Thank you. The next few folks I have are Gordon Gardner, Abbey

3748
04:00:26,716 --> 04:00:32,716
palms, Crag Palms and Patrice, Captain or Captain. Oh, and

3749
04:00:34,790 --> 04:00:37,790
then Tyler Bennett. Sign up.

3750
04:01:11,930 --> 04:01:12,894
I'm sorry. Go ahead. Good evening.

3751
04:01:12,894 --> 04:01:15,898
Thanks for having us. My name is Gordon Gardner, and I'm

3752
04:01:15,898 --> 04:01:18,567
opposed to the approval of the enclave development and the

3753
04:01:18,567 --> 04:01:21,437
proposed connection of Lancaster Drive through the

3754
04:01:21,437 --> 04:01:24,973
development. Our streets, like sidewalks and bike lanes,

3755
04:01:24,973 --> 04:01:28,430
pedestrians, including children and elderly residents, are

3756
04:01:28,430 --> 04:01:31,179
forced to share the road with vehicles. And the road does not

3757
04:01:31,179 --> 04:01:35,918
meet connector street guidelines. I'd also like to

3758
04:01:35,918 --> 04:01:39,721
piggyback on the views on the affordable housing. The

3759
04:01:39,721 --> 04:01:42,725
proposal does not guarantee any affordable housing will ever be

3760
04:01:42,725 --> 04:01:46,928
built, and if it is, it's not an inclusionary way. I'm a

3761
04:01:46,928 --> 04:01:49,532
retired teacher of Durham Public Schools, having served

3762
04:01:49,532 --> 04:01:52,735
29 years at the very schools. This proposal in my own

3763
04:01:52,735 --> 04:01:55,337
neighborhood send their children Geffen's middle and

3764
04:01:55,337 --> 04:01:59,408
Jordan. I. Research shows an inclusion of affordable housing

3765
04:01:59,408 --> 04:02:03,800
significantly narrows the academic achievement gap,

3766
04:02:03,545 --> 04:02:06,148
leading to higher test scores and improved reading and math

3767
04:02:06,148 --> 04:02:10,685
proficiency. Beyond academics, living in a stable mixed income

3768
04:02:10,685 --> 04:02:14,230
communities reduces the toxic stress associated with housing

3769
04:02:14,230 --> 04:02:20,230
insecurity and neighborhood violence. I urge you to vote no.

3770
04:02:28,703 --> 04:02:30,105
Yes. Good evening.

3771
04:02:30,105 --> 04:02:32,505
Thank you. Good evening.

3772
04:02:32,774 --> 04:02:36,178
Unfortunately. my presentation. Didn't get uploaded. So you

3773
04:02:36,178 --> 04:02:39,848
have received this. There's I'm not going to go through it, but

3774
04:02:39,848 --> 04:02:42,500
there's a great deal of pictures in there just

3775
04:02:42,500 --> 04:02:43,985
depicting our neighborhood. Just to let you know what it

3776
04:02:43,985 --> 04:02:47,723
looks like. We have a lot of seniors, probably 90% seniors.

3777
04:02:47,723 --> 04:02:50,859
They use assistive walking devices to get to mailboxes. We

3778
04:02:50,859 --> 04:02:54,195
don't have sidewalks and we don't have bike lanes. We

3779
04:02:54,195 --> 04:02:56,865
simply have to walk on the road to get everywhere. I also

3780
04:02:56,865 --> 04:03:02,671
wanted to mention there's a map in your in your documents that

3781
04:03:02,671 --> 04:03:05,673
Mr. Ghosh didn't recommend. Didn't mention one area.

3782
04:03:05,673 --> 04:03:09,678
There's a brown area in that map above the Natural heritage

3783
04:03:09,678 --> 04:03:13,615
lands, and that is the North Carolina Natural Heritage

3784
04:03:13,615 --> 04:03:17,419
Program. Biodiversity and Wildlife Assessment Area. It's

3785
04:03:17,419 --> 04:03:22,358
a birding area that was authorized by the the Audubon

3786
04:03:22,358 --> 04:03:25,761
Society. So that's also another area to consider when you make

3787
04:03:25,761 --> 04:03:30,165
this decision. The other thing is this is immediately adjacent

3788
04:03:30,165 --> 04:03:33,969
to hunting grounds. And I want to just stress that these

3789
04:03:33,969 --> 04:03:36,638
places are going to have children playing in yards,

3790
04:03:36,638 --> 04:03:40,238
right at hunting grounds. Thank you.

3791
04:03:47,480 --> 04:03:50,386
Good evening. Are you Craig? Craig. Perfect.

3792
04:03:50,386 --> 04:03:52,654
Good evening. Thank you, thank you Craig

3793
04:03:52,654 --> 04:03:53,321
palms. I live.

3794
04:03:53,321 --> 04:03:56,525
On Lancaster. I appreciate your time tonight.

3795
04:03:56,525 --> 04:03:59,261
So my comments and I think this got.

3796
04:03:59,261 --> 04:04:01,263
Uploaded to you also. So I'm not.

3797
04:04:01,263 --> 04:04:02,598
Going to go through. The whole thing.

3798
04:04:02,598 --> 04:04:05,934
This relates to the southwest Durham southeast Chapel Hill

3799
04:04:05,934 --> 04:04:07,936
collector street plan. And as.

3800
04:04:07,936 --> 04:04:12,140
You probably aware, the document was adopted as a

3801
04:04:12,140 --> 04:04:16,611
policy planning guidance document. Okay. And I don't

3802
04:04:16,611 --> 04:04:19,681
have time to go through the whole thing. But this current

3803
04:04:19,681 --> 04:04:25,154
development that what they are proposing as far as connecting

3804
04:04:25,154 --> 04:04:30,920
to Lancaster as a connector street, doesn't comply with the

3805
04:04:30,920 --> 04:04:33,562
document. The document talks about collector street plans

3806
04:04:33,562 --> 04:04:38,434
having adequate space for cars and bikes and sidewalks to talk.

3807
04:04:38,434 --> 04:04:42,104
The document even goes on. There are some pictures in in

3808
04:04:42,104 --> 04:04:45,908
this document that talks about trees, and I, you know, the

3809
04:04:45,908 --> 04:04:50,645
last page of the document talks about the why the proposed

3810
04:04:50,645 --> 04:04:55,383
extension into Lancaster isn't in compliance with with that

3811
04:04:55,383 --> 04:04:58,853
planning and that guidance for you all. So we urge no, thank

3812
04:04:58,853 --> 04:05:00,853
you. Thank you.

3813
04:05:04,860 --> 04:05:06,395
Good evening. Hi.

3814
04:05:06,395 --> 04:05:07,329
My name is. Patrice.

3815
04:05:07,329 --> 04:05:09,865
Given the county is already. Moving forward with the county

3816
04:05:09,865 --> 04:05:10,933
wide open. Space plan.

3817
04:05:10,933 --> 04:05:15,133
In spring 2026, supported by the 2023 Comprehensive Plan,

3818
04:05:15,136 --> 04:05:17,939
which calls for identifying and permanently protecting lands

3819
04:05:17,939 --> 04:05:21,676
designated as recreation and open space. This parcel already

3820
04:05:21,676 --> 04:05:24,546
carries that designation. It connects to Little Creek Trail,

3821
04:05:24,546 --> 04:05:27,415
lies near conserved land by the North Carolina Botanical

3822
04:05:27,415 --> 04:05:29,885
Garden, and supports a perennial stream and important

3823
04:05:29,885 --> 04:05:32,287
habitats like that of affiliated woodpeckers. There

3824
04:05:32,287 --> 04:05:34,490
are several pileated woodpecker that live in the woods, where

3825
04:05:34,490 --> 04:05:37,920
the proposed enclave will be built. They are legally

3826
04:05:37,920 --> 04:05:40,295
protected by the Migratory Bird Treaty Act. That means it's

3827
04:05:40,295 --> 04:05:42,698
illegal to harm, capture, or kill them or disturb their

3828
04:05:42,698 --> 04:05:45,500
nests without a permit. They are a keystone species because

3829
04:05:45,500 --> 04:05:48,504
they create cavities and mature forests with large dead or

3830
04:05:48,504 --> 04:05:52,373
decaying trees. Please protect this Jordan Creek watershed.

3831
04:05:52,373 --> 04:05:55,377
The. The southern portion of the site, adjacent to the Army

3832
04:05:55,377 --> 04:05:59,314
Corps land, is designated as Natural Heritage land. It is

3833
04:05:59,314 --> 04:06:02,383
named Little Creek. Bottomlands and Slopes. The conservation

3834
04:06:02,383 --> 04:06:06,455
value is C4 and the rarity value was R5. It scored within

3835
04:06:06,455 --> 04:06:11,192
both categories of conservation and rarity. Approving rezoning

3836
04:06:11,192 --> 04:06:13,662
now would be premature. Respectfully ask that you wait

3837
04:06:13,662 --> 04:06:16,531
until this parcel is reviewed through Open Space plan

3838
04:06:16,531 --> 04:06:18,531
process. Thank you.

3839
04:06:25,540 --> 04:06:30,340
Tyler. There we go. Come on. One second.

3840
04:06:31,800 --> 04:06:34,800
There we go. Good evening.

3841
04:06:37,303 --> 04:06:40,305
My name is Tyler Bennett, and I'm would like to speak.

3842
04:06:40,305 --> 04:06:43,442
To the. Natural Heritage area and the

3843
04:06:43,442 --> 04:06:45,911
recreational and open space areas on.

3844
04:06:45,911 --> 04:06:48,781
This property. As Neal pointed out, this is a

3845
04:06:48,781 --> 04:06:51,117
fairly complex piece of property. And what I show in

3846
04:06:51,117 --> 04:06:56,988
this map, and I'm north is the top is north. We have the

3847
04:06:56,988 --> 04:07:01,600
little Creek water fowl impoundment below the property.

3848
04:07:01,600 --> 04:07:05,131
We have a flood zone. We have game lands below the property.

3849
04:07:05,131 --> 04:07:08,867
And in the property we have two creeks that provide all the

3850
04:07:08,867 --> 04:07:12,538
drainage for a series of seven ponds that are outside the

3851
04:07:12,538 --> 04:07:16,475
property. And as Neal pointed out, it's very difficult to

3852
04:07:16,475 --> 04:07:19,344
develop this land because of all these environmental

3853
04:07:19,344 --> 04:07:22,748
concerns. And I think there's a very easy solution to this.

3854
04:07:22,748 --> 04:07:24,550
Turn down. The request.

3855
04:07:24,550 --> 04:07:28,750
Thank you. Thank you. Laura Elgin, Charlie

3856
04:07:37,162 --> 04:07:40,762
Mondeo and TC MorphOS. Thank you.

3857
04:07:43,635 --> 04:07:48,106
Thank you. Good evening. I'm Laura Elgin and I oppose this

3858
04:07:48,106 --> 04:07:51,510
action. There are a number of reasons we oppose it, but.

3859
04:07:51,510 --> 04:07:53,111
specifically I wanted to address my.

3860
04:07:53,111 --> 04:07:56,114
Concern about stormwater. Runoff and its implication for

3861
04:07:56,114 --> 04:07:59,384
most of the 14 homes on the east side of Helmsdale, my

3862
04:07:59,384 --> 04:08:02,984
street, the proposed 60% impervious surface will

3863
04:08:03,321 --> 04:08:06,458
significantly increase. stormwater runoff over the past

3864
04:08:06,458 --> 04:08:10,329
10 to 15 years. Residents of Helmsdale have experienced

3865
04:08:10,329 --> 04:08:12,664
increasing incidents of flooding and drainage issues.

3866
04:08:12,664 --> 04:08:15,868
Here are a few comments from many I received, but I've

3867
04:08:15,868 --> 04:08:21,600
paired it down. My neighbor on 103 reports. Heavy rains bring

3868
04:08:21,600 --> 04:08:24,542
water down from Lancaster, through my backyard and on down

3869
04:08:24,542 --> 04:08:28,800
the hill, through the backyards of my neighbors at 105 and 107.

3870
04:08:28,800 --> 04:08:30,949
Even with an elaborate French drain system, after heavy

3871
04:08:30,949 --> 04:08:35,754
rains, it is still emptying water out onto the curb.

3872
04:08:35,754 --> 04:08:39,291
Another, my other neighbor at 202 Helmsdale. There have been

3873
04:08:39,291 --> 04:08:44,691
two flooding episodes, the worst being in 2013. Do well

3874
04:08:46,765 --> 04:08:49,340
anyway, thank you very much for your consideration.

3875
04:08:49,340 --> 04:08:51,434
Thank you. Hello Charles.

3876
04:09:00,578 --> 04:09:02,114
Mondello. I'm an American.

3877
04:09:02,114 --> 04:09:03,715
Society of. Photogrammetry and remote

3878
04:09:03,715 --> 04:09:07,118
sensing imaging scientist, by the way, and I also happen to

3879
04:09:07,118 --> 04:09:12,560
live on Helmsdale. You've seen many of these comments before,

3880
04:09:12,560 --> 04:09:12,924
so I'm going to. Just flag.

3881
04:09:12,924 --> 04:09:16,594
Your own data. for you. If you look at this slide, you will

3882
04:09:16,594 --> 04:09:22,467
see where we have impacts from flat areas. That is where water

3883
04:09:22,467 --> 04:09:26,938
flows. It's plain as day. It's visually right in front of you.

3884
04:09:26,938 --> 04:09:32,144
It's a lean and Chantal, any addition of impermeable will

3885
04:09:32,144 --> 04:09:36,881
cause that to expand. You have additionally a bunch of other

3886
04:09:36,881 --> 04:09:39,818
slides I've given you. Without enough time to present. I've

3887
04:09:39,818 --> 04:09:43,489
given you a Duke study from February of this year, which

3888
04:09:43,489 --> 04:09:47,425
highlights here and in other cases where these kinds of

3889
04:09:47,425 --> 04:09:51,430
things are a challenge. When you have wetlands like we do in

3890
04:09:51,430 --> 04:09:56,301
this area. So please just read through this material and use

3891
04:09:56,301 --> 04:10:01,373
this insight as you move on across many programs. Hopefully

3892
04:10:01,373 --> 04:10:06,440
I've also given you the USGS and North Carolina State

3893
04:10:06,440 --> 04:10:10,315
commentary on Risk, so I hope it helps you here and

3894
04:10:10,315 --> 04:10:13,718
elsewhere. But please don't approve. Disaster do occur.

3895
04:10:13,718 --> 04:10:20,318
Thank you. Thank you. Good evening. My name is T.C.

3896
04:10:26,932 --> 04:10:28,801
MorphOS. I'm a partner with a law firm

3897
04:10:28,801 --> 04:10:31,270
in Chapel Hill, and I'm here on behalf of the Oakville

3898
04:10:31,270 --> 04:10:34,339
Homeowners Association. I'm going to condense down my

3899
04:10:34,339 --> 04:10:37,876
presentation to just make two points. One, I remind council

3900
04:10:37,876 --> 04:10:40,278
that the Planning Commission voted 8 to 3 against

3901
04:10:40,278 --> 04:10:42,947
recommending approval of this project, largely due to

3902
04:10:42,947 --> 04:10:45,550
environmental concerns. Secondly, I would point out

3903
04:10:45,550 --> 04:10:50,489
that the applicant has promised to expand George King Road to

3904
04:10:50,489 --> 04:10:54,250
NCDOT standards and to provide water and sewer along much of

3905
04:10:54,250 --> 04:10:56,428
the George King Road right of way. And I would say, with all

3906
04:10:56,428 --> 04:11:01,567
respect to the Council and to the applicant, they cannot make

3907
04:11:01,567 --> 04:11:04,836
those improvements. As you heard from me in December, in

3908
04:11:04,836 --> 04:11:07,772
connection to the Village Center project, George King

3909
04:11:07,772 --> 04:11:10,642
Road exists as a prescriptive easement, which means that they

3910
04:11:10,642 --> 04:11:13,846
would need to get easements from private property owners,

3911
04:11:13,846 --> 04:11:15,981
which I believe was the point Mr. Langston was going to make

3912
04:11:15,981 --> 04:11:18,983
earlier. In order to be able to do those infrastructure

3913
04:11:18,983 --> 04:11:22,454
improvements, should they seek to rely on the village center

3914
04:11:22,454 --> 04:11:27,590
project, which, as council is aware, proposes to realign the

3915
04:11:27,590 --> 04:11:29,995
George King Road project? I would say that that has been

3916
04:11:29,995 --> 04:11:33,650
challenged in court and should not be used as a basis for

3917
04:11:33,650 --> 04:11:37,265
approving this project. Thank you. Thank you.

3918
04:11:43,475 --> 04:11:46,478
Thank you. That was the order of the folks who wanted and

3919
04:11:46,478 --> 04:11:49,814
everybody else who came after had registered. And so thank

3920
04:11:49,814 --> 04:11:51,950
you for that. And so now I'm going to keep moving on the

3921
04:11:51,950 --> 04:11:57,890
list. That was the order that y'all wanted. I have Jennifer

3922
04:11:57,890 --> 04:12:02,489
Mayer, Mimi Kessler. Pablo Friedman, Steven Cohn and David

3923
04:12:06,565 --> 04:12:10,165
Barron. Yes. Thank you. Good. Good

3924
04:12:23,581 --> 04:12:25,917
evening, Jennifer Maher. My address is on record.

3925
04:12:25,917 --> 04:12:28,653
I'm co-chair. Of the new Hope Road. Alliance

3926
04:12:28,653 --> 04:12:30,188
Conservation Committee. I'm not a.

3927
04:12:30,188 --> 04:12:33,525
Neighbor of this property, so I'm speaking as a person

3928
04:12:33,525 --> 04:12:37,396
concerned about the community of Durham and its future. This

3929
04:12:37,396 --> 04:12:42,670
is a very attractive in on paper offer of affordable

3930
04:12:42,670 --> 04:12:45,352
housing, but it needs to be balanced against possible

3931
04:12:45,352 --> 04:12:50,758
damage of an long term damage of water that we've just heard

3932
04:12:50,758 --> 04:12:53,761
tonight. We're going to be drinking from Jordan Lake, the

3933
04:12:53,761 --> 04:12:58,365
Natural Heritage Area is not a small deal. It is a deal that

3934
04:12:58,365 --> 04:13:02,569
protects birds, which we have found in new Hope. Audubon

3935
04:13:02,569 --> 04:13:05,772
Research has found are in a steep decline, and that

3936
04:13:05,772 --> 04:13:09,430
reflects what's going on with our environment for people. So

3937
04:13:09,430 --> 04:13:14,248
how affordable is it when your heat bills cause the heat cause

3938
04:13:14,248 --> 04:13:17,651
high bills? How affordable is it when your water is polluted

3939
04:13:17,651 --> 04:13:21,455
and when this city has to remediate? So for all these

3940
04:13:21,455 --> 04:13:25,192
reasons, I ask you to think a very difficult decision. We

3941
04:13:25,192 --> 04:13:28,792
acknowledge that, but please vote no.

3942
04:13:34,802 --> 04:13:39,806
Hi, I'm Mimi Kessler. I just want to amplify proximity to

3943
04:13:39,806 --> 04:13:42,806
hunting, environmental sensitivity, including rare

3944
04:13:43,877 --> 04:13:49,483
birds. To many people into small space. And the Planning

3945
04:13:49,483 --> 04:13:54,283
Commission voted 8 to 3 against it. Please vote no.

3946
04:13:54,288 --> 04:13:56,688
Thank you. Good evening.

3947
04:14:02,563 --> 04:14:06,567
All right. Good evening. An apology and

3948
04:14:06,567 --> 04:14:09,570
two points to my fellow premium tax paying brothers and

3949
04:14:09,570 --> 04:14:12,373
sisters. I'm sorry you all have to sit and only get one minute

3950
04:14:12,373 --> 04:14:15,175
of public comment. The presiding officer can make the

3951
04:14:15,175 --> 04:14:17,244
rule, and they can change the rule. And elections have

3952
04:14:17,244 --> 04:14:20,981
consequences. Two points I want to make. Point number one, I

3953
04:14:20,981 --> 04:14:23,117
actually want to thank the applicant for increasing their

3954
04:14:23,117 --> 04:14:26,520
proffer on education. It's funny how when council members

3955
04:14:26,520 --> 04:14:30,570
lean in a certain things and the lawyers that represent

3956
04:14:30,570 --> 04:14:33,127
these applicants listen and they improve their proffers,

3957
04:14:33,127 --> 04:14:35,796
this is a substantially better proffer on education. And I

3958
04:14:35,796 --> 04:14:38,532
want to congratulate the applicant on that point. Number

3959
04:14:38,532 --> 04:14:42,803
two, that I want to make is specifically around emergency

3960
04:14:42,803 --> 04:14:45,672
first responders. And I made this at the last meeting that

3961
04:14:45,672 --> 04:14:48,750
you all had. I think it's really important that you all

3962
04:14:48,750 --> 04:14:50,945
figure out as council members the the number of times that

3963
04:14:50,945 --> 04:14:54,682
they've gone into stat mode for this part of Durham County. And

3964
04:14:54,682 --> 04:14:57,618
how is this applicant going to adjust it? Because right now in

3965
04:14:57,618 --> 04:15:00,220
Durham, there are times when you call 911 and you can't get

3966
04:15:00,220 --> 04:15:03,290
an ambulance delivered to you. So if they're going to if we're

3967
04:15:03,290 --> 04:15:05,625
going to give them this, which we don't have to, how are they

3968
04:15:05,625 --> 04:15:12,225
going to improve public goods in Durham? Thank you very much.

3969
04:15:14,902 --> 04:15:18,239
Steve Cohn, chair of the Open Space committee of the Durham

3970
04:15:18,239 --> 04:15:21,108
Open Space and Trails Commission, as the citizen

3971
04:15:21,108 --> 04:15:23,511
group that advises Durham's governments on all matters

3972
04:15:23,511 --> 04:15:26,847
connected to open space, we've sent you our Open Space report

3973
04:15:26,847 --> 04:15:30,117
card on the enclave at Little Creek with grades of 1D and

3974
04:15:30,117 --> 04:15:33,920
three FS. As you've heard, there's a Natural Heritage Area

3975
04:15:33,920 --> 04:15:38,525
involved with direct proximity to NC Game Lands and with a

3976
04:15:38,525 --> 04:15:43,130
hunting safety buffer around it, and the developer is choosing

3977
04:15:43,130 --> 04:15:46,934
to build over them with no commitment to protect the

3978
04:15:46,934 --> 04:15:50,700
natural heritage area and to create an adequate buffer from

3979
04:15:50,700 --> 04:15:53,273
the active game lands to the south, the developers can do

3980
04:15:53,273 --> 04:15:57,611
whatever they want in this area and that is not acceptable as

3981
04:15:57,611 --> 04:16:00,614
the planning staff's consistency review shows, this

3982
04:16:00,614 --> 04:16:05,753
rezoning case fails to meet policy 79, policy 81 and policy

3983
04:16:05,753 --> 04:16:08,753
83 on protecting environmentally open space

3984
04:16:08,956 --> 04:16:14,280
sensitive areas. It also fails to meet policy 80 on protecting

3985
04:16:14,280 --> 04:16:17,431
the integrity of nearby parklands and nature preserves.

3986
04:16:17,431 --> 04:16:20,701
We strongly recommend that the enclave at Little Creek should

3987
04:16:20,701 --> 04:16:23,701
not be rezoned. Thank you.

3988
04:16:29,109 --> 04:16:31,979
Good evening. Good evening. My name is David

3989
04:16:31,979 --> 04:16:34,848
Barron. I'm speaking on behalf of the Environmental Affairs

3990
04:16:34,848 --> 04:16:36,984
Board, Land Use and Planning subcommittee, where I serve as

3991
04:16:36,984 --> 04:16:39,720
chair. The site sits in a very sensitive area within the

3992
04:16:39,720 --> 04:16:41,922
Jordan Lake watershed, with streams feeding directly into

3993
04:16:41,922 --> 04:16:45,259
Little Creek. Little Creek is already identified as impaired.

3994
04:16:45,259 --> 04:16:47,928
Given that, as per other comment, we're concerned about

3995
04:16:47,928 --> 04:16:49,729
the amount of impervious surface leading to stormwater

3996
04:16:49,729 --> 04:16:52,199
runoff, sediment, and nutrient loading into an already

3997
04:16:52,199 --> 04:16:54,669
stressed system. We're also concerned about the lack of

3998
04:16:54,669 --> 04:16:57,471
attention to a designated natural area, identified by the

3999
04:16:57,471 --> 04:16:59,807
National Carolina Natural Heritage Program on the

4000
04:16:59,807 --> 04:17:02,476
southern portion of the site. These areas are identified by

4001
04:17:02,476 --> 04:17:04,945
state experts because they contain high value habitat and

4002
04:17:04,945 --> 04:17:07,681
biodiversity. For a little more clarity here. I do believe they

4003
04:17:07,681 --> 04:17:10,283
send actual people out to these sites to make the determination

4004
04:17:10,283 --> 04:17:13,154
of what is a natural area and what is not. We should not

4005
04:17:13,154 --> 04:17:16,690
diminish that categorization there. When you need to put a

4006
04:17:16,690 --> 04:17:19,160
lift station and do development in that area, it's kind of a

4007
04:17:19,160 --> 04:17:21,495
clear indication that you do not have the right development

4008
04:17:21,495 --> 04:17:24,965
for the parcel at hand. So AaBb Land Use and Planning strongly

4009
04:17:24,965 --> 04:17:27,340
urges council not to allow development of this natural

4010
04:17:27,340 --> 04:17:29,503
area and a minimum. We need to have a better understanding of

4011
04:17:29,503 --> 04:17:31,371
the engineering stormwater management plan and sediment

4012
04:17:31,371 --> 04:17:34,241
transport analysis. These plans would result in commitments to

4013
04:17:34,241 --> 04:17:37,440
minimize impervious surfaces. Thank you.

4014
04:17:37,440 --> 04:17:41,844
Thank you. Thank you. I have Sarah Morgan,

4015
04:17:45,319 --> 04:17:50,719
Helen Westerman, Paul Casey, Drew Dorey. And Elizabeth Faber.

4016
04:17:59,867 --> 04:18:02,403
Good evening. Good evening. My name is Sarah Morgan, and I

4017
04:18:02,403 --> 04:18:05,940
live on Tweed Place. We support thoughtful development and the

4018
04:18:05,940 --> 04:18:08,609
need for more housing. But growth must be aligned with

4019
04:18:08,609 --> 04:18:12,679
safety. And this proposal is not. Durham is committed

4020
04:18:12,679 --> 04:18:16,283
through its Vision Zero Action plan to eliminating traffic

4021
04:18:16,283 --> 04:18:19,420
deaths and serious injuries. That commitment is grounded in

4022
04:18:19,420 --> 04:18:24,158
a simple idea safe mobility is a right, not a trade off. And

4023
04:18:24,158 --> 04:18:26,627
the data shows why this matters. In Durham, there are

4024
04:18:26,627 --> 04:18:30,164
32 crashes every day and a pedestrian is involved in a

4025
04:18:30,164 --> 04:18:34,367
crash every three days at Farrington Road and NC 54.

4026
04:18:34,367 --> 04:18:36,703
Adjacent to this development, there have been more than 40

4027
04:18:36,703 --> 04:18:40,641
crashes and over 40,000 cars moved through this corridor

4028
04:18:40,641 --> 04:18:45,446
daily. As of 2024. Now consider what the enclave would do. The

4029
04:18:45,446 --> 04:18:49,249
enclave would connect to Lancaster, Hebrides and Dundalk

4030
04:18:49,249 --> 04:18:52,786
roads, creating a cut through route that diverts traffic into

4031
04:18:52,786 --> 04:18:55,671
residential neighborhoods that were never designed to carry

4032
04:18:55,671 --> 04:18:59,341
this load. This increases exposure without ensuring

4033
04:18:59,341 --> 04:19:04,141
safety infrastructure. Exactly what Vision Zero warns against.

4034
04:19:04,213 --> 04:19:07,213
Please vote no. Thank you.

4035
04:19:12,221 --> 04:19:13,822
Good evening. Good evening.

4036
04:19:13,822 --> 04:19:16,892
I am. Helen Westerman. I support.

4037
04:19:16,892 --> 04:19:20,950
affordable housing and I support strong communities.

4038
04:19:20,950 --> 04:19:22,697
This plan does neither. It separates.

4039
04:19:22,697 --> 04:19:26,902
Residents by income. Two storey townhouses with garages for

4040
04:19:26,902 --> 04:19:30,372
some, and a four story affordable housing building

4041
04:19:30,372 --> 04:19:34,109
built by a different developer for others. The result is a

4042
04:19:34,109 --> 04:19:37,713
visually different and likely inferior structure set apart

4043
04:19:37,713 --> 04:19:42,184
from the rest. That is not community, that is segregation,

4044
04:19:42,184 --> 04:19:45,520
affordable housing should provide stability and dignity,

4045
04:19:45,520 --> 04:19:49,191
not label people as less than in their own neighborhood.

4046
04:19:49,191 --> 04:19:52,528
There is also no guarantee these units will ever be built.

4047
04:19:52,528 --> 04:19:55,731
Low tech funding is highly competitive and this site does

4048
04:19:55,731 --> 04:19:58,734
not appear to meet key criteria. Yet. The promise of

4049
04:19:58,734 --> 04:20:02,538
20% affordable housing is being used to justify a zoning

4050
04:20:02,538 --> 04:20:06,800
change. While responsibility for these units is handed off

4051
04:20:06,800 --> 04:20:10,120
to a third party. Once zoning is approved, accountability

4052
04:20:10,120 --> 04:20:12,615
disappears, both for whether these units are built and the

4053
04:20:12,615 --> 04:20:16,180
quality of what it is built. I urge you to reject this

4054
04:20:16,180 --> 04:20:21,418
proposal. As it stands. My name is Paul. Sorry.

4055
04:20:27,763 --> 04:20:30,699
Okay. My name is Paul Casey. I wanted to highlight quickly why

4056
04:20:30,699 --> 04:20:33,769
we believe Lancaster is unsafe to serve as a through street

4057
04:20:33,769 --> 04:20:36,839
for heavy traffic. Lancaster Drive is a residential street

4058
04:20:36,839 --> 04:20:39,575
defined by private driveways, curb cuts and high pedestrian

4059
04:20:39,575 --> 04:20:42,511
activity. Because we do not have individual mailboxes at

4060
04:20:42,511 --> 04:20:45,514
our homes. Or and our residents, including many

4061
04:20:45,514 --> 04:20:48,451
elderly neighbors, must cross the street daily to access

4062
04:20:48,451 --> 04:20:51,787
shared mailbox stations. This is a walking neighborhood where

4063
04:20:51,787 --> 04:20:54,590
families, children and pet owners are constantly active,

4064
04:20:54,590 --> 04:20:56,859
introducing through traffic into this environment creates

4065
04:20:56,859 --> 04:20:59,728
an immediate and preventable safety hazard. Second,

4066
04:20:59,728 --> 04:21:02,531
Lancaster Drive functions as a central traffic hub for a great

4067
04:21:02,531 --> 04:21:04,933
deal of activities in the Oaks neighborhood, including golf

4068
04:21:04,933 --> 04:21:07,403
course, tennis and pickleball courts, and a pool. These

4069
04:21:07,403 --> 04:21:10,406
activities generate a flow of vehicles, along with pedestrian

4070
04:21:10,406 --> 04:21:12,741
crossings that are often obscured to drivers unfamiliar

4071
04:21:12,741 --> 04:21:16,412
with this area. Adding high volume through traffic to a

4072
04:21:16,412 --> 04:21:18,547
street where children are biking and visibility is

4073
04:21:18,547 --> 04:21:21,550
highly, is already restricted is an unacceptable risk to

4074
04:21:21,550 --> 04:21:25,750
public safety. You should turn this down.

4075
04:21:29,358 --> 04:21:31,626
Good evening. I'm Elizabeth Faber. I'll speak

4076
04:21:31,626 --> 04:21:32,561
before Jerry. Dory.

4077
04:21:32,561 --> 04:21:35,697
Thank you. Thank you. Council members. I live on Nottingham

4078
04:21:35,697 --> 04:21:39,835
Road in Durham and you have my photos and pack in your

4079
04:21:39,835 --> 04:21:43,773
materials. So I'll just speak to my slides that the data

4080
04:21:43,773 --> 04:21:47,909
shows that this proposal does not advance or even align with

4081
04:21:47,909 --> 04:21:51,313
Durham's community goals and objectives speak about

4082
04:21:51,313 --> 04:21:54,917
transportation first, the closest existing transit stop

4083
04:21:54,917 --> 04:21:59,121
is 1.3 miles away at the intersection of highway 54 and

4084
04:21:59,121 --> 04:22:02,725
Falconbridge Road. This is a 28 minute walk on a very busy

4085
04:22:02,725 --> 04:22:06,929
multi-lane highway without sidewalks or bike lanes to

4086
04:22:06,929 --> 04:22:10,732
reach a singular bus stop, you have to cross a very busy

4087
04:22:10,732 --> 04:22:14,270
highway 54 without a traffic light or crosswalk, and I would

4088
04:22:14,270 --> 04:22:17,720
add it respectfully that it contradicts today's

4089
04:22:17,720 --> 04:22:21,100
proclamation of May as Durham's National Bike Month.

4090
04:22:21,100 --> 04:22:23,813
Additionally, one of Durham's goals for health and well-being

4091
04:22:23,813 --> 04:22:26,615
is for new developments to stay within a quarter mile of the

4092
04:22:26,615 --> 04:22:29,684
pharmacy. This proposal does not meet this goal either. The

4093
04:22:29,684 --> 04:22:33,355
closest pharmacy is two miles away. The closest health clinic

4094
04:22:33,355 --> 04:22:38,493
is 1.6 miles away, or 35 minutes by foot. By foot. I

4095
04:22:38,493 --> 04:22:40,896
respectfully ask you to oppose. Thank you.

4096
04:22:40,896 --> 04:22:43,296
Thank you. Good evening.

4097
04:22:47,436 --> 04:22:49,105
Let me get the right. Sorry. Let me.

4098
04:22:49,105 --> 04:22:52,410
Get the right PowerPoint here and I'm going to zip through

4099
04:22:52,410 --> 04:22:56,241
it. Part two. There we go. There

4100
04:23:00,515 --> 04:23:03,252
you go. Yeah. Thank you. Good evening.

4101
04:23:03,252 --> 04:23:06,388
I'm Andrea Doria. I live at 407 Lancaster Road in Durham

4102
04:23:06,388 --> 04:23:10,726
County. I want to talk again about how this aligns with the

4103
04:23:10,726 --> 04:23:15,731
objectives. Let's see. There we go. The 2025 CEO from Durham.

4104
04:23:15,731 --> 04:23:19,601
How does it align with daily needs. So it should be a

4105
04:23:19,601 --> 04:23:25,100
walking community. And this graph shows that 4840 or being

4106
04:23:25,407 --> 04:23:28,210
within a mile of a grocery store is the goal. Our closest

4107
04:23:28,210 --> 04:23:30,812
grocery store from this property is two miles 45

4108
04:23:30,812 --> 04:23:34,883
minutes by foot. Similarly, for banking, they recommend a

4109
04:23:34,883 --> 04:23:38,487
quarter mile from a bank and basically the closest bank is

4110
04:23:38,487 --> 04:23:42,491
2.4 miles away. So it's not a walkable community. In fact,

4111
04:23:42,491 --> 04:23:47,163
there's a 1.2 mile walk to the closest elementary school. And

4112
04:23:47,163 --> 04:23:51,167
as you guys know from family responsibility zones in 2025,

4113
04:23:51,167 --> 04:23:54,350
walk zones that extend up to one and a half miles, where

4114
04:23:54,350 --> 04:23:58,306
school bus transportation is not offered, that Brown. That's

4115
04:23:58,306 --> 04:24:01,777
the Creekside Elementary school. There's an enclave.

4116
04:24:01,777 --> 04:24:04,312
This is the road that people will have to walk down. No

4117
04:24:04,312 --> 04:24:08,117
sidewalks, no lights, and poor visibility for dust. We

4118
04:24:08,117 --> 04:24:14,117
recommend a no vote. Thank you. Those are all the

4119
04:24:19,728 --> 04:24:26,328
speakers that I have signed up this evening. Has anyone? Oh.

4120
04:24:26,735 --> 04:24:32,135
You have okay. I apologize. Go ahead. Good evening.

4121
04:24:37,946 --> 04:24:41,282
Good evening. Sorry, I. Thought I signed up properly.

4122
04:24:41,282 --> 04:24:43,352
It's okay. When you're done speaking, just

4123
04:24:43,352 --> 04:24:45,754
make sure to register with the clerk. Thank you so much.

4124
04:24:45,754 --> 04:24:49,358
Thank you. My name is Chris Bass and I am the owner of an

4125
04:24:49,358 --> 04:24:51,358
ecological. Engineering company.

4126
04:24:51,693 --> 04:24:55,897
I spend all day, every day trying to protect streams and

4127
04:24:55,897 --> 04:24:59,568
build projects to restore them, protect wetlands. I build

4128
04:24:59,568 --> 04:25:03,172
stormwater projects and I work on flooding resilience for

4129
04:25:03,172 --> 04:25:08,190
communities. And both of those. That is the reason I'm here to

4130
04:25:08,190 --> 04:25:13,610
oppose this development. It is located right downstream of the

4131
04:25:13,610 --> 04:25:17,466
confluence of two of the very most flood prone streams in the

4132
04:25:17,466 --> 04:25:22,866
entire triangle, Booker Creek and Bowling Creek. That entire

4133
04:25:23,672 --> 04:25:26,609
corridor was damaged tremendously with hurricane,

4134
04:25:26,609 --> 04:25:30,612
with hurricanes and Tropical Storm Chantal. And this

4135
04:25:30,612 --> 04:25:34,283
development is right downstream of that. I also bring your

4136
04:25:34,283 --> 04:25:36,686
attention to the natural Heritage area. This has been

4137
04:25:36,686 --> 04:25:40,222
mentioned several times, but the impact of a 50 acre

4138
04:25:40,222 --> 04:25:45,220
development directly adjacent to this will do almost

4139
04:25:45,494 --> 04:25:49,898
irreparable damage. I see this is your opportunity to do

4140
04:25:49,898 --> 04:25:53,169
something really positive for species and water.

4141
04:25:53,169 --> 04:25:57,969
Thank you. Thank you. And Mister Bass, you

4142
04:26:03,245 --> 04:26:06,248
had registered. I just had you as an online speaker, so you're

4143
04:26:06,248 --> 04:26:11,320
fine. Thank you so much. Okay, now, I think I have gotten

4144
04:26:11,320 --> 04:26:14,657
everyone who signed up to speak. This is a public

4145
04:26:14,657 --> 04:26:17,660
hearing. I'm about to declare the public hearing closed. So

4146
04:26:17,660 --> 04:26:21,530
if you did not speak or you signed up and weren't given

4147
04:26:21,530 --> 04:26:25,667
your opportunity, this is your chance. Okay. On that, I'm

4148
04:26:25,667 --> 04:26:29,538
closing the public hearing. And this item is before the council.

4149
04:26:29,538 --> 04:26:32,608
Colleagues, questions? Comments? Go ahead. Council

4150
04:26:32,608 --> 04:26:34,276
Member Burris. I have a question for the

4151
04:26:34,276 --> 04:26:37,876
applicant. Somebody left their glasses up

4152
04:26:41,817 --> 04:26:46,170
here. They're not mine. Oh. Did you?

4153
04:26:46,756 --> 04:26:52,270
And sorry, Mr. Gauche, you do have time. But I'm going to let

4154
04:26:52,270 --> 04:26:54,296
Council Member Burris ask her a question first. Thank you.

4155
04:26:54,296 --> 04:26:57,165
Oh, no. You may. You may answer it in your response, so I'll

4156
04:26:57,165 --> 04:26:59,501
let you I'll provide deference to you to go ahead and respond.

4157
04:26:59,501 --> 04:27:01,904
And I can ask the question if it hasn't been answered.

4158
04:27:01,904 --> 04:27:05,440
Sure. So just a couple things I wanted to respond to and I will

4159
04:27:05,440 --> 04:27:09,245
ask Ted Halloran to hobble up here. In the meantime, there

4160
04:27:09,245 --> 04:27:13,582
you are. All right. So that he can help respond. You know,

4161
04:27:13,582 --> 04:27:17,185
some of the comments that you heard, I will say we had

4162
04:27:17,185 --> 04:27:20,550
extensive communications with the with representatives of the

4163
04:27:20,550 --> 04:27:24,660
HOA in the neighborhood to our west in Chapel Hill. We had

4164
04:27:24,660 --> 04:27:30,132
come to add some zoning conditions to our to our

4165
04:27:30,132 --> 04:27:32,801
project. As a result, we had extensive communications with

4166
04:27:32,801 --> 04:27:35,201
them. After Planning commission.

4167
04:27:36,138 --> 04:27:39,408
All you did. Ladies and gentlemen, what we

4168
04:27:39,408 --> 04:27:40,675
would. Not tolerate.

4169
04:27:40,675 --> 04:27:43,679
Is that. All right, let's be respectful. We're going to make

4170
04:27:43,679 --> 04:27:47,416
sure that we're respectful mutually. This will not be one

4171
04:27:47,416 --> 04:27:51,486
of those councils where we go viral on YouTube. Let's be

4172
04:27:51,486 --> 04:27:55,860
respectful. Please. After planning Commission, the

4173
04:27:57,159 --> 04:28:00,962
neighbors did hire an attorney, T.C. MorphOS, who I've. I've

4174
04:28:00,962 --> 04:28:03,966
had a few conversations with about this project, none of

4175
04:28:03,966 --> 04:28:08,170
which where where's it indicated that the neighbors

4176
04:28:08,170 --> 04:28:11,707
were asking for any additional, you know, commitments or things

4177
04:28:11,707 --> 04:28:14,709
like that to work on. So, you know, just just to give you an

4178
04:28:14,709 --> 04:28:20,582
idea of where we were at on all that with the I want to speak

4179
04:28:20,582 --> 04:28:25,982
on the the topic of affordability. This project has

4180
04:28:26,550 --> 04:28:28,723
an affordable component. I think some there was some

4181
04:28:28,723 --> 04:28:31,600
indication here that it's not actually affordable. I'm not

4182
04:28:31,600 --> 04:28:33,862
really sure what that means. Ted.

4183
04:28:33,862 --> 04:28:35,464
Child. Sorry, Kelly development.

4184
04:28:35,464 --> 04:28:42,738
Do we have a timer on Mister? Gosh, right now no, I you had

4185
04:28:42,738 --> 04:28:47,476
12 minutes initially, correct? Yes. Make sure that I'm keeping

4186
04:28:47,476 --> 04:28:51,347
track of time. Sorry. I'm not trying to be long

4187
04:28:51,347 --> 04:28:53,683
winded. Let me just have Ted come up and talk a little bit

4188
04:28:53,683 --> 04:28:56,485
about the affordable piece. Madam clerk, could you put

4189
04:28:56,485 --> 04:28:59,888
three minutes on the clock. Please?

4190
04:28:59,888 --> 04:29:03,426
Thank you everyone, I'll be brief. Just a sense.

4191
04:29:03,426 --> 04:29:04,359
Of the. Plan that.

4192
04:29:04,359 --> 04:29:05,961
We have. To build the affordable housing

4193
04:29:05,961 --> 04:29:07,829
out here. There's been a lot of questions raised about whether

4194
04:29:07,829 --> 04:29:12,635
it's viable or possible, or what timeline. So the market

4195
04:29:12,635 --> 04:29:16,705
rate developer will be dealing the real estate to us for free.

4196
04:29:16,705 --> 04:29:18,774
The infrastructure that's necessary for the affordable

4197
04:29:18,774 --> 04:29:23,112
housing will be provided for free. The site planning and

4198
04:29:23,112 --> 04:29:27,182
permitting, and some of the grading work for our pad will

4199
04:29:27,182 --> 04:29:30,719
be done at no cost for us. So we're already ahead of any

4200
04:29:30,719 --> 04:29:32,988
other fordable project that we would otherwise contemplate in

4201
04:29:32,988 --> 04:29:35,657
the city. Because these improvements are being done for

4202
04:29:35,657 --> 04:29:40,396
us by the developer. From there, the plan is to seek a 4%

4203
04:29:40,396 --> 04:29:42,331
low income housing tax credit award, which here in North

4204
04:29:42,331 --> 04:29:47,200
Carolina is not competitive. So the concerns about availability

4205
04:29:47,200 --> 04:29:51,339
of credit aren't matched with the reality, which is 4% low

4206
04:29:51,339 --> 04:29:53,542
income housing tax credit projects are not competitive

4207
04:29:53,542 --> 04:29:58,800
here in North Carolina. We further intend to secure a

4208
04:29:58,800 --> 04:30:00,616
nonprofit partner and secure real estate tax abatement,

4209
04:30:00,616 --> 04:30:03,885
which enables us to size up more firm debt. We intend to

4210
04:30:03,885 --> 04:30:06,880
work with Durham Housing Authority to process a rad

4211
04:30:06,880 --> 04:30:09,291
conversion to move folks out of projects like Cornwallis and

4212
04:30:09,291 --> 04:30:12,894
others, where there are folks living in conditions that no

4213
04:30:12,894 --> 04:30:17,699
one in this room has, you know, spent a night in a bed. So

4214
04:30:17,699 --> 04:30:20,769
these concerns about this neighborhood not being the

4215
04:30:20,769 --> 04:30:23,371
right neighbor, we consistently hear concerns from residents

4216
04:30:23,371 --> 04:30:25,574
who don't want to see projects next to them. That project

4217
04:30:25,574 --> 04:30:28,577
isn't affordable enough or it's not integrated enough, or it's

4218
04:30:28,577 --> 04:30:31,580
too hard to develop. And the reality is the alternative is

4219
04:30:31,580 --> 04:30:33,715
we've residents across the city living in housing that's not

4220
04:30:33,715 --> 04:30:37,719
livable. So the path ahead is going to take a few minutes to

4221
04:30:37,719 --> 04:30:43,580
add conversions, take time with HUD, but there is a plan and we

4222
04:30:43,580 --> 04:30:45,527
will be proud of the affordable project that gets built out

4223
04:30:45,527 --> 04:30:48,530
here at this culmination. Thank you.

4224
04:30:48,530 --> 04:30:50,331
Thank you Councilmember. Thank you.

4225
04:30:50,331 --> 04:30:53,602
Oh, Mr.. Oh, yes. Yes. Right.

4226
04:30:53,602 --> 04:30:56,605
So that didn't really get to the crux of what I was going to

4227
04:30:56,605 --> 04:30:58,940
ask, but thank you. Clay will provide some insight around the

4228
04:30:58,940 --> 04:31:04,940
4% live tech. My question is around segregation. So is it

4229
04:31:05,948 --> 04:31:09,685
can you clarify if the people who will have market rate will

4230
04:31:09,685 --> 04:31:13,880
be separated from those who are in the affordable units? Like

4231
04:31:13,880 --> 04:31:16,170
how does that look? Well, it's an integrated

4232
04:31:16,170 --> 04:31:20,308
community. I mean, to be clear, there is a market rate

4233
04:31:20,308 --> 04:31:23,177
developer and there is a separate affordable developer.

4234
04:31:23,177 --> 04:31:25,513
So are they going to be are the units going to be in the same

4235
04:31:25,513 --> 04:31:27,982
building? No. Are they going to be on the same road?

4236
04:31:27,982 --> 04:31:31,452
Yes okay. Okay. Because I'm thinking about what we did to

4237
04:31:31,452 --> 04:31:34,188
Rad conversion as was just referenced. Right. The idea was

4238
04:31:34,188 --> 04:31:37,391
that you didn't want a community of people all with

4239
04:31:37,391 --> 04:31:39,660
the same subject of background. You wanted to integrate them,

4240
04:31:39,660 --> 04:31:42,730
but you want to make it look like, you know, everyone has

4241
04:31:42,730 --> 04:31:46,401
equity around that. So I'm just trying to figure out in 2026,

4242
04:31:46,401 --> 04:31:49,804
I'll hold that. So will the conditions, will the materials

4243
04:31:49,804 --> 04:31:53,740
or the structure be different for the affordable component

4244
04:31:53,740 --> 04:31:55,409
than for the market rate? Yeah, absolutely. We're

4245
04:31:55,409 --> 04:31:58,790
building apartments as a part of the affordable housing

4246
04:31:58,790 --> 04:32:03,484
project. But I'll also tell you is that it is not simple and

4247
04:32:03,484 --> 04:32:06,154
often not possible to combine the financing for a low income

4248
04:32:06,154 --> 04:32:08,422
housing tax credit project with a market rate development, two

4249
04:32:08,422 --> 04:32:11,625
separate capital stacks. So in North Carolina, with almost

4250
04:32:11,625 --> 04:32:14,561
near certainty, projects are not integrated where you have

4251
04:32:14,561 --> 04:32:17,899
true market rate, unrestricted units and then low tech income

4252
04:32:17,899 --> 04:32:20,635
and rent restricted units, it would would make this project

4253
04:32:20,635 --> 04:32:23,637
unfeasible to accomplish it in the way you're describing. I'd

4254
04:32:23,637 --> 04:32:27,374
also say when we talk about the demographics of the

4255
04:32:27,374 --> 04:32:31,112
neighborhood, you know, we're saying that we're segregating

4256
04:32:31,112 --> 04:32:33,714
housing by building affordable housing on a small parcel.

4257
04:32:33,714 --> 04:32:36,117
We're integrating into the neighborhood as a whole,

4258
04:32:36,117 --> 04:32:37,919
because not many folks have an opportunity to live in a

4259
04:32:37,919 --> 04:32:41,389
neighborhood like this. So I think the lens through which we

4260
04:32:41,389 --> 04:32:44,458
view mixed income neighborhoods is critical here. If we look at

4261
04:32:44,458 --> 04:32:47,862
an acre, sure, we look at five acres. It's a very, very

4262
04:32:47,862 --> 04:32:52,662
different picture. Okay. Well, I just okay. Thank

4263
04:32:55,300 --> 04:32:57,872
you for that. Thank you for your additional proffers around

4264
04:32:57,872 --> 04:33:01,609
the school. And also, I did see some A.D.A. compliance in

4265
04:33:01,609 --> 04:33:05,813
there. These are humans and not props. As we think about the

4266
04:33:05,813 --> 04:33:09,160
people who stay in our housing across the city, more so. So I

4267
04:33:09,160 --> 04:33:11,819
want to be cognizant of that and that these are actual human

4268
04:33:11,819 --> 04:33:15,155
beings. And so when you think about the environment, you want

4269
04:33:15,155 --> 04:33:18,893
to ensure that people have a decent quality of life as you

4270
04:33:18,893 --> 04:33:22,296
if they are transitioning. So I would just want to like, lend

4271
04:33:22,296 --> 04:33:28,302
that to equity. I also have not heard enough addressing of the

4272
04:33:28,302 --> 04:33:30,772
environmental concerns, but I'm really just stuck on the

4273
04:33:30,772 --> 04:33:34,776
affordable housing piece. But I'll just yield my comments so.

4274
04:33:34,776 --> 04:33:39,576
Okay, thank you. Other council members, Council members,

4275
04:33:42,382 --> 04:33:46,587
mayor, anyone? I have a couple. Oh go ahead. Councillor. Oh

4276
04:33:46,587 --> 04:33:48,656
Council Member Kopac. Go ahead.

4277
04:33:48,656 --> 04:33:51,592
Yeah. Thank you, madam Mayor Pro Tem so I appreciate

4278
04:33:51,592 --> 04:33:54,328
everyone who's weighed in on this case. Want to acknowledge

4279
04:33:54,328 --> 04:33:56,731
the neighborhood and environmental concerns raised

4280
04:33:56,731 --> 04:34:00,100
and appreciate the proffers that have been brought to make

4281
04:34:00,100 --> 04:34:04,806
this a case worth considering. It's important to acknowledge

4282
04:34:04,806 --> 04:34:07,275
there are some real trade offs here that we have to to wrestle

4283
04:34:07,275 --> 04:34:10,745
with. Before I get into that, I just want to start with a

4284
04:34:10,745 --> 04:34:13,614
couple other questions of some discussions that have been had

4285
04:34:13,614 --> 04:34:17,284
around additional proffers. Has the applicant considered

4286
04:34:17,284 --> 04:34:19,687
construction of a of a greenway?

4287
04:34:19,687 --> 04:34:22,956
We have considered construction on the greenway. We actually

4288
04:34:22,956 --> 04:34:26,494
floated some language to staff on that. We will be building

4289
04:34:26,494 --> 04:34:29,229
portions of the Greenway, but the portions that we know we're

4290
04:34:29,229 --> 04:34:32,300
going to build, therefore, the ones that we would be able to

4291
04:34:32,300 --> 04:34:36,303
commit to in a zoning condition are ones that staff has

4292
04:34:36,303 --> 04:34:40,410
determined would be required by the code based on other

4293
04:34:40,410 --> 04:34:42,176
infrastructure that would need to be. So basically, the

4294
04:34:42,176 --> 04:34:46,460
portions that go along George King Road right of way in the

4295
04:34:46,460 --> 04:34:48,783
Lancaster extension, those are the portions that we know we

4296
04:34:48,783 --> 04:34:53,121
would build. And I think the staff analysis was that

4297
04:34:53,121 --> 04:34:55,656
actually those portions would be required to be built as part

4298
04:34:55,656 --> 04:35:01,462
of those road networks. Anyway. It is it is Ty's goal to build

4299
04:35:01,462 --> 04:35:03,597
as much of the Greenway as possible. However, that

4300
04:35:03,597 --> 04:35:09,300
Greenway, not all of it can be accommodated within right of

4301
04:35:09,300 --> 04:35:11,539
way. There are portions of it that go through the natural

4302
04:35:11,539 --> 04:35:14,275
heritage area. So that's something we're you know, we're

4303
04:35:14,275 --> 04:35:16,544
not comfortable making a commitment on for those

4304
04:35:16,544 --> 04:35:18,746
portions because we haven't actually studied it in that

4305
04:35:18,746 --> 04:35:21,815
much depth to say we know how to do it in a way that's going

4306
04:35:21,815 --> 04:35:24,952
to be respectful of those areas. So we have not made that

4307
04:35:24,952 --> 04:35:27,821
commitment. But we did we did consider it. In fact, we did

4308
04:35:27,821 --> 04:35:32,626
float that language to staff related to the Greenway.

4309
04:35:32,626 --> 04:35:34,828
Are there additional parts of the natural heritage area you

4310
04:35:34,828 --> 04:35:38,565
can commit to protecting? So we added some commitments

4311
04:35:38,565 --> 04:35:43,370
tonight, which include a 30 foot wide buffer along our

4312
04:35:43,370 --> 04:35:46,307
southern property line. Our southern property line is, of

4313
04:35:46,307 --> 04:35:48,642
course, where the natural heritage area is. So that

4314
04:35:48,642 --> 04:35:53,114
buffer is an X and natural buffer, meaning as it is that

4315
04:35:53,114 --> 04:35:58,452
that. I'm sorry. That would. So that's in the natural heritage

4316
04:35:58,452 --> 04:36:01,721
area. We also made a commitment tonight to prohibit land

4317
04:36:01,721 --> 04:36:04,925
disturbance south of the existing gas easement, which

4318
04:36:04,925 --> 04:36:09,263
all of that area south of the existing gas easement is also

4319
04:36:09,263 --> 04:36:14,663
Natural Heritage area. I think conservatively, we think that

4320
04:36:15,536 --> 04:36:18,472
of the amount of natural heritage area that's on the

4321
04:36:18,472 --> 04:36:22,343
property, you know, I think we're we're probably preserving

4322
04:36:22,343 --> 04:36:26,814
around 25% of it as a result. And keep in mind some of the

4323
04:36:26,814 --> 04:36:29,950
impacts of the natural heritage area are already required by

4324
04:36:29,950 --> 04:36:33,153
that road network that's been adopted in the collector street

4325
04:36:33,153 --> 04:36:40,353
plan. And for the lift station, which is part of our UEA.

4326
04:36:40,427 --> 04:36:43,764
There was a statement about all street trees native. Can you

4327
04:36:43,764 --> 04:36:47,634
make a commitment to all trees? Yes. Yeah. You did point that

4328
04:36:47,634 --> 04:36:51,638
out and I had forgot to mention that. Yes, our our current

4329
04:36:51,638 --> 04:36:54,709
condition says that all the street trees would be native

4330
04:36:54,709 --> 04:36:57,778
and we would remove the word, you know, street. So it would

4331
04:36:57,778 --> 04:36:59,847
be all other required trees would be native on this

4332
04:36:59,847 --> 04:37:02,182
property. Thank you. I'm going to pause

4333
04:37:02,182 --> 04:37:05,185
there for now, but I'd like to come back.

4334
04:37:05,185 --> 04:37:08,321
Thank you. Council members. Anybody else? Go ahead. Council

4335
04:37:08,321 --> 04:37:10,190
Member Rist. Thank you. Mayor Pro Tem, I

4336
04:37:10,190 --> 04:37:12,526
have a question about the road. Piece here. So I.

4337
04:37:12,526 --> 04:37:16,263
Know there I don't know whether staff or the applicant. So

4338
04:37:16,263 --> 04:37:19,333
there there is a concern. We heard about the previous

4339
04:37:19,333 --> 04:37:23,700
development, about the right of way acquisition. So so can you

4340
04:37:23,700 --> 04:37:27,619
help explain the right of way piece. Because your plan is to

4341
04:37:27,619 --> 04:37:30,622
is to complete George King Road, correct.

4342
04:37:30,622 --> 04:37:36,622
Well, no, our plan. Well, for purposes of this conversation,

4343
04:37:46,380 --> 04:37:48,907
oops, this might be the best slide. Although this isn't

4344
04:37:48,907 --> 04:37:54,179
quite if you go on GIS today, you'll actually see that George

4345
04:37:54,179 --> 04:37:57,182
King road realignment has been dedicated across the village

4346
04:37:57,182 --> 04:38:00,385
center. So the way that works. So this is our frontage on

4347
04:38:00,385 --> 04:38:05,324
George King Road, right. And then as it goes down, I mean,

4348
04:38:05,324 --> 04:38:09,610
all of this is a gravel road today. But since Lee Village

4349
04:38:09,610 --> 04:38:11,730
Center was approved, it's not necessarily related to the

4350
04:38:11,730 --> 04:38:14,799
approval, but the owner here has gone ahead and dedicated

4351
04:38:14,799 --> 04:38:17,336
the right of way for realign George King Road. So it

4352
04:38:17,336 --> 04:38:22,273
actually goes like this now. So the gravel road exists, but

4353
04:38:22,273 --> 04:38:25,100
there's a there's a new right of way that's a realigned

4354
04:38:25,100 --> 04:38:31,820
George King Road. So what we believe would happen here is

4355
04:38:31,820 --> 04:38:34,820
that we would improve George King Road along our frontage.

4356
04:38:34,820 --> 04:38:37,689
And then after it leaves our site, it actually will go

4357
04:38:37,689 --> 04:38:42,489
through the Lee Village Center property like that.

4358
04:38:43,762 --> 04:38:46,165
So you can you can do that. You've got this sort of on your

4359
04:38:46,165 --> 04:38:47,899
on site. You can do your part of it.

4360
04:38:47,899 --> 04:38:51,837
So the good thing about the portion that's on our side is

4361
04:38:51,837 --> 04:38:55,400
that we can actually dedicate the right of way that we need

4362
04:38:55,400 --> 04:38:59,445
on our site. So if we need 60ft, if we need 30ft, we can

4363
04:38:59,445 --> 04:39:01,847
just dedicate our site. The idea would be to shift that

4364
04:39:01,847 --> 04:39:05,250
road onto our site and then as it leaves the property, it goes

4365
04:39:05,250 --> 04:39:06,918
through the Lee village center, where the right of way is

4366
04:39:06,918 --> 04:39:09,654
already been dedicated. Okay, thanks for that. So and

4367
04:39:09,654 --> 04:39:11,723
how about Lancaster Road? So I know there's I drove through

4368
04:39:11,723 --> 04:39:14,793
the neighborhood today. There's a lot of signs. It's a traffic

4369
04:39:14,793 --> 04:39:17,996
calming community. Right. There's there's I think speed

4370
04:39:17,996 --> 04:39:20,599
bumps or speed humps or whatever. So so I know there's

4371
04:39:20,599 --> 04:39:23,135
concern about Lancaster being sort of like a sort of like a

4372
04:39:23,135 --> 04:39:26,710
pass through. Right. So can you talk more about the how you

4373
04:39:26,710 --> 04:39:29,475
plan to realign Lancaster and is that partly it's a traffic

4374
04:39:29,475 --> 04:39:33,120
calming piece or what's the what's the intent behind that

4375
04:39:33,120 --> 04:39:36,215
sort of realigning Lancaster. Oh so. Well, our intent behind

4376
04:39:36,215 --> 04:39:40,850
the realignment of Lancaster, which is in this deck. Right.

4377
04:39:40,850 --> 04:39:43,688
But and I should say, by the way, yeah. So if I can say

4378
04:39:43,688 --> 04:39:46,624
also, by the way, I did talk to some chapel town Council

4379
04:39:46,624 --> 04:39:48,961
members today who had also heard from constituents on

4380
04:39:48,961 --> 04:39:51,363
their side. And so there is concern about these wider

4381
04:39:51,363 --> 04:39:53,565
streets in the in the development around the country

4382
04:39:53,565 --> 04:39:56,502
club that are fairly calm. The people walking the street.

4383
04:39:56,502 --> 04:39:59,571
Right. So can you say more also what the street network would

4384
04:39:59,571 --> 04:40:04,420
look like on the on the enclave side, will there be sidewalks?

4385
04:40:04,420 --> 04:40:06,778
What's the. Will be ten foot wide sidewalks

4386
04:40:06,778 --> 04:40:09,114
on both sides of this road? It's part of the greenway

4387
04:40:09,114 --> 04:40:14,586
system that I was referring to earlier, this road. So our

4388
04:40:14,586 --> 04:40:19,580
intent in realigning it was to avoid as much as we can impacts

4389
04:40:19,580 --> 04:40:23,328
to this stream. And in particular, this little finger

4390
04:40:23,328 --> 04:40:27,666
that comes out of the stream. And also to try to avoid any

4391
04:40:27,666 --> 04:40:30,535
further impacts in the natural heritage area. So we're trying

4392
04:40:30,535 --> 04:40:34,873
to align this road through our property. So the endpoints are

4393
04:40:34,873 --> 04:40:37,810
fixed. Right. So we have to connect the Lancaster here. And

4394
04:40:37,810 --> 04:40:40,345
we're supposed to exit the property somewhere here. We're

4395
04:40:40,345 --> 04:40:47,850
trying to align this road in a way that crosses this stream in

4396
04:40:47,850 --> 04:40:50,688
perpendicular which is the requirement anyway for from a

4397
04:40:50,688 --> 04:40:55,488
permitting standpoint. And which avoids this, this finger.

4398
04:40:56,561 --> 04:40:59,697
And as much as we can impacts to the natural heritage area

4399
04:40:59,697 --> 04:41:03,101
won't be real clear. This is conceptual. But this I think,

4400
04:41:03,101 --> 04:41:07,380
illustrates this is not by any means an engineered. But I drew

4401
04:41:07,380 --> 04:41:10,642
this. So this is by no means an engineer road design. But the

4402
04:41:10,642 --> 04:41:15,380
idea is to avoid those those components on the site. What

4403
04:41:15,380 --> 04:41:19,517
the road will look like is dictated by the city's street

4404
04:41:19,517 --> 04:41:22,530
design standards. Right? So there will be ten foot wide

4405
04:41:22,530 --> 04:41:25,257
sidewalks on both sides of this road. That's just what the

4406
04:41:25,257 --> 04:41:27,526
standard is. And how wide will the streets

4407
04:41:27,526 --> 04:41:31,196
be? What of the lane widths? I'm gonna I'm gonna ask Tim,

4408
04:41:31,196 --> 04:41:34,599
who probably knows more about this specific road design

4409
04:41:34,599 --> 04:41:38,199
standards than than I do. Typically.

4410
04:41:39,670 --> 04:41:42,540
Tim Sivers community, those are. typically the.

4411
04:41:42,540 --> 04:41:45,143
Right of way is about. 72 foot minimum.

4412
04:41:45,143 --> 04:41:46,477
With those. Ten foot lanes.

4413
04:41:46,477 --> 04:41:47,479
Or ten foot. Sidewalks on.

4414
04:41:47,479 --> 04:41:49,614
Both sides. The lanes themselves are about 12 foot.

4415
04:41:49,614 --> 04:41:51,950
Wide, 12 foot lanes. It has that compared to what's

4416
04:41:51,950 --> 04:41:55,353
currently on the Lancaster on the on the other side, those

4417
04:41:55,353 --> 04:41:56,421
are. Pretty within the Chapel.

4418
04:41:56,421 --> 04:42:01,221
Hill area. Yeah. There's I believe Chapel Hill

4419
04:42:02,561 --> 04:42:06,980
doesn't have any of the sidewalks in that area. So I

4420
04:42:06,980 --> 04:42:10,569
believe that road I'm guessing is probably three lanes wide,

4421
04:42:10,569 --> 04:42:12,637
but that's an estimate. I have driven down it myself, so I've

4422
04:42:12,637 --> 04:42:15,240
driven those same speed humps that you're discussing. So I'm

4423
04:42:15,240 --> 04:42:18,443
guessing that's about maybe 36 to 40 foot wide.

4424
04:42:18,443 --> 04:42:20,312
So you're so you're guessing the street will actually be,

4425
04:42:20,312 --> 04:42:22,781
like, narrower on the within enclave?

4426
04:42:22,781 --> 04:42:24,916
Yeah. Potentially a little bit. And you have staff is

4427
04:42:24,916 --> 04:42:28,252
available. They may be able to identify the exact widths of

4428
04:42:28,252 --> 04:42:31,989
the collector requirements. But I believe I believe it's two

4429
04:42:31,989 --> 04:42:35,193
lanes at 12 foot. Okay. Yeah. If staff could comment on

4430
04:42:35,193 --> 04:42:39,993
that I appreciate that. Earlene Thomas. planning and

4431
04:42:45,403 --> 04:42:47,873
development. So yes, the standard.

4432
04:42:47,873 --> 04:42:51,610
Would be 212. Foot wide lanes with turn lanes

4433
04:42:51,610 --> 04:42:55,810
at, you know, major intersections as needed.

4434
04:42:55,881 --> 04:43:01,281
Probably the Chapel Hill side was constructed with three

4435
04:43:01,419 --> 04:43:02,688
lane. As a.

4436
04:43:02,688 --> 04:43:07,250
Three lane cross section, which would be typical, but we

4437
04:43:07,250 --> 04:43:11,763
usually only require that center turn lane at, you know,

4438
04:43:11,763 --> 04:43:15,963
an intersecting street when it's needed, necessary.

4439
04:43:16,234 --> 04:43:20,238
So then so a driver driving from on the current Lancaster,

4440
04:43:20,238 --> 04:43:23,174
the road would be would kind of narrow going into enclave.

4441
04:43:23,174 --> 04:43:27,312
Right. Based on our our Durham City cross-section guidelines.

4442
04:43:27,312 --> 04:43:32,500
It would narrow or neck down as you come into this development.

4443
04:43:32,500 --> 04:43:35,253
Okay. Thank you. That's my question for I'll save my

4444
04:43:35,253 --> 04:43:38,534
comments for later. Thank you. Anyone else have any

4445
04:43:38,534 --> 04:43:45,134
comments or questions? Okay, I have a question for staff. I

4446
04:43:45,540 --> 04:43:49,144
don't have a question for the applicant. And it might

4447
04:43:49,144 --> 04:43:54,544
actually be a question for Director Young because sorry.

4448
04:44:04,759 --> 04:44:09,898
Good evening. Can you remind me with the NC heritage

4449
04:44:09,898 --> 04:44:13,350
designation, there was something that happened at JC

4450
04:44:13,350 --> 04:44:16,171
peak where we were trying. It's not regulatory meaning it's not

4451
04:44:16,171 --> 04:44:21,577
it's not rules. It's it's a program. But it's pretty like

4452
04:44:21,577 --> 04:44:25,514
if it was regulatory, we'd have to follow it. Right. And a few

4453
04:44:25,514 --> 04:44:29,118
months ago, I feel like we had some information presented to

4454
04:44:29,118 --> 04:44:31,986
us because planning staff was interested in making it maybe a

4455
04:44:31,986 --> 04:44:36,580
little bit more than what it is now. Can you just remind me

4456
04:44:36,580 --> 04:44:39,327
kind of what the state's response was on that? Sure.

4457
04:44:39,327 --> 04:44:41,463
This was actually. I think maybe.

4458
04:44:41,463 --> 04:44:43,265
A couple. Of years ago now.

4459
04:44:43,265 --> 04:44:44,800
Staff had. Looked at.

4460
04:44:44,800 --> 04:44:47,202
Increasing some. Of. our environmental.

4461
04:44:47,202 --> 04:44:48,404
Regulations in the. Unified.

4462
04:44:48,404 --> 04:44:50,472
Development Ordinance. And one of the things we

4463
04:44:50,472 --> 04:44:53,208
explored was whether. We could. use we could.

4464
04:44:53,208 --> 04:44:55,811
Require that natural heritage areas.

4465
04:44:55,811 --> 04:44:58,800
Be protected. And we met.

4466
04:44:58,800 --> 04:45:02,283
With the state. I believe the state sent representatives.

4467
04:45:02,283 --> 04:45:04,420
To that joint. City county. planning committee

4468
04:45:04,420 --> 04:45:07,220
meeting. And the word that we got.

4469
04:45:07,220 --> 04:45:08,757
From the state was that their program.

4470
04:45:08,757 --> 04:45:10,825
Was never. Intended to be regulatory.

4471
04:45:10,825 --> 04:45:13,295
And they did not want us to turn it into a.

4472
04:45:13,295 --> 04:45:16,231
Regulatory program. So we backed off.

4473
04:45:16,231 --> 04:45:20,635
On those changes. Thank you. That was my.

4474
04:45:20,635 --> 04:45:22,635
Question. Mayor Williams.

4475
04:45:28,510 --> 04:45:31,847
Yeah, just. could you just for the sake of clarification, I

4476
04:45:31,847 --> 04:45:38,654
was listening to some of the comments and I just once again

4477
04:45:38,654 --> 04:45:44,540
talk about. The financing structure for why the the

4478
04:45:46,928 --> 04:45:51,728
affordability, the affordable housing units are separate and

4479
04:45:53,680 --> 04:45:55,671
we talk about materials. You know, what what what

4480
04:45:55,671 --> 04:45:58,207
differentiates that. Well Ted is coming up. Let me

4481
04:45:58,207 --> 04:46:01,743
just also point out, just just to be clear, the first

4482
04:46:01,743 --> 04:46:05,947
development agreement that the city entered into was for

4483
04:46:05,947 --> 04:46:09,417
affordable housing project that was in conjunction with the

4484
04:46:09,417 --> 04:46:12,620
with the market rate project actually off right in this

4485
04:46:12,620 --> 04:46:17,893
area, off Crescent. Wendell, with the same kind of setup

4486
04:46:17,893 --> 04:46:23,298
where the affordable units were not included in an integrated

4487
04:46:23,298 --> 04:46:25,367
building with market rate units. Instead, what it was was

4488
04:46:25,367 --> 04:46:31,306
very similar to this. It was a it was a standalone, low tech,

4489
04:46:31,306 --> 04:46:36,444
affordable housing deal with a market rate component in the

4490
04:46:36,444 --> 04:46:41,116
same vicinity. That's what it was. And the city approved a

4491
04:46:41,116 --> 04:46:43,118
development agreement for that. They actually changed the code

4492
04:46:43,118 --> 04:46:45,387
to allow development agreement for that approved development

4493
04:46:45,387 --> 04:46:48,990
agreement for that and Gap Finance that this project is,

4494
04:46:48,990 --> 04:46:51,659
is different in a few important ways. It doesn't need a

4495
04:46:51,659 --> 04:46:54,463
developer agreement. It doesn't need any city subsidy other

4496
04:46:54,463 --> 04:46:59,863
than that same thing that. Affordable housing deals are

4497
04:47:01,136 --> 04:47:04,272
financed with tax credits that get sold to banks, and the

4498
04:47:04,272 --> 04:47:07,142
compliance requirements that run with that last for 30

4499
04:47:07,142 --> 04:47:11,346
years. So these projects are structured as long term holds

4500
04:47:11,346 --> 04:47:14,482
by the developers. So and then to build in Durham I'm going to

4501
04:47:14,482 --> 04:47:18,553
own for 30 years at a minimum. The market rate development

4502
04:47:18,553 --> 04:47:23,558
model is different. Folks buy a site, rezone it, raise capital,

4503
04:47:23,558 --> 04:47:26,828
build a project, stabilize it, and then it gets sold. And so

4504
04:47:26,828 --> 04:47:29,564
you've got a capital stack that has to sit in place for 30

4505
04:47:29,564 --> 04:47:32,367
years, with one that is not going to that has to generate

4506
04:47:32,367 --> 04:47:36,371
returns to warrant the investment. And so in North

4507
04:47:36,371 --> 04:47:38,907
Carolina, with the rare exception of, I think Charlotte

4508
04:47:38,907 --> 04:47:41,242
Housing Authority did a true mixed income deal where they

4509
04:47:41,242 --> 04:47:43,445
wrote the equity check for the market rate units in downtown

4510
04:47:43,445 --> 04:47:47,315
Charlotte. That one exception, what you see are standalone

4511
04:47:47,315 --> 04:47:50,919
high tech projects built on parcels that are specific to

4512
04:47:50,919 --> 04:47:54,322
the high tech itself. And and that's been the case in Durham

4513
04:47:54,322 --> 04:47:55,991
when we think about the projects at the city's gap

4514
04:47:55,991 --> 04:47:58,259
funded over the years, it is standalone affordable housing

4515
04:47:58,259 --> 04:48:01,730
projects, the opportunity to build them in what I would

4516
04:48:01,730 --> 04:48:04,799
define as an higher income neighborhood is unique. A lot

4517
04:48:04,799 --> 04:48:06,868
of the affordable housing that gets built in Durham gets built

4518
04:48:06,868 --> 04:48:09,937
in qualified census tracks in lower income parts of the city.

4519
04:48:09,937 --> 04:48:14,409
So to hear that this project is viewed as not sufficiently

4520
04:48:14,409 --> 04:48:17,612
mixed income, I struggled to understand a little bit. And

4521
04:48:17,612 --> 04:48:21,820
then on the the mixing of units, we don't ask the

4522
04:48:21,820 --> 04:48:25,153
affordable housing community to build mixed income projects

4523
04:48:25,153 --> 04:48:27,756
themselves, right? They build 100% affordable. They come for

4524
04:48:27,756 --> 04:48:29,957
gap funding. Those get built. But we're asking the market

4525
04:48:29,957 --> 04:48:32,427
rate community to do something that the affordable housing

4526
04:48:32,427 --> 04:48:35,563
community themselves can't do. And to me, there's a disconnect

4527
04:48:35,563 --> 04:48:40,363
there. Thank you. I. I just wanted to

4528
04:48:42,437 --> 04:48:47,837
hear that again. I was fortunate enough to get

4529
04:48:48,443 --> 04:48:55,517
selected to be one of the 100 mayors in the US, or no. 100

4530
04:48:55,517 --> 04:49:01,723
mayors period in the world to be taken to Madrid last week.

4531
04:49:01,723 --> 04:49:07,195
And and I walked the city a lot. The city's over a thousand

4532
04:49:07,195 --> 04:49:13,401
years old, and I was just admiring how dense it was. I

4533
04:49:13,401 --> 04:49:18,473
walked because I could walk. Yes, there was still a lot of

4534
04:49:18,473 --> 04:49:23,110
cars, but the lifestyle was, was was different simply

4535
04:49:23,110 --> 04:49:28,411
because of the density. And things were accessible. It

4536
04:49:28,750 --> 04:49:32,220
wasn't always that way. They had to build today to get to

4537
04:49:32,220 --> 04:49:39,961
get to that point. And. I, I, I always struggle when I think

4538
04:49:39,961 --> 04:49:43,565
about, you know, the living conditions that we have here in

4539
04:49:43,565 --> 04:49:48,646
Durham. For some people and how we're trying to have a very

4540
04:49:48,646 --> 04:49:51,248
balanced approach. I think some of the concerns we had tonight,

4541
04:49:51,248 --> 04:49:54,785
what's what's really sitting tough with me right now is, you

4542
04:49:54,785 --> 04:50:00,191
know, the trade offs that we have to make in order to even

4543
04:50:00,191 --> 04:50:04,128
have this case approved environmentally. But I also

4544
04:50:04,128 --> 04:50:08,465
think about, you know, I think about some of our some of the

4545
04:50:08,465 --> 04:50:11,134
conditions in which some of our community members are living in

4546
04:50:11,134 --> 04:50:15,205
and how the ideal amount of emails that I get, you know,

4547
04:50:15,205 --> 04:50:18,742
mayor, can you please call Da and have them relocate me

4548
04:50:18,742 --> 04:50:22,480
somewhere and we don't have anywhere for them to go? That

4549
04:50:22,480 --> 04:50:24,748
that does bother me. And these are some issues that we deal

4550
04:50:24,748 --> 04:50:28,152
with in Durham that not a lot of people have to deal with

4551
04:50:28,152 --> 04:50:34,425
across the triangle. And, and so I, I don't want to discount

4552
04:50:34,425 --> 04:50:40,425
anything that anyone you know bought here tonight. But these

4553
04:50:40,564 --> 04:50:42,433
are some of the these are some of the tough things we have to

4554
04:50:42,433 --> 04:50:50,233
deal with. You know, could you tell me. One more one more part

4555
04:50:52,642 --> 04:50:56,781
about the actually, no, I'm just I'm going to leave my

4556
04:50:56,781 --> 04:51:02,385
comments there. Just I hear comments about, you know, based

4557
04:51:02,385 --> 04:51:06,389
on paper this should be XYZ. We should be this distance from

4558
04:51:06,389 --> 04:51:10,327
that, this distance from that. And you know, if it's not that

4559
04:51:10,327 --> 04:51:15,650
and we're not going, we don't need to approve it. And I don't

4560
04:51:15,650 --> 04:51:18,668
know any other way to get to where we are on paper. If we

4561
04:51:18,668 --> 04:51:23,140
don't density, you know, and I'm, I don't want to just put a

4562
04:51:23,140 --> 04:51:27,344
bunch of, you know, one type of housing up on the backs of

4563
04:51:27,344 --> 04:51:32,160
someone else and just totally tear the character apart. But

4564
04:51:32,160 --> 04:51:36,220
we do need to have multiple types of housing. This is

4565
04:51:36,220 --> 04:51:40,420
minimum 20% affordable, and we're having an affordability

4566
04:51:40,690 --> 04:51:44,962
crisis right now. That's compelling to me. One last

4567
04:51:44,962 --> 04:51:48,632
question. Could you tell me what if this isn't approved

4568
04:51:48,632 --> 04:51:52,569
tonight? Then what's the plan? Yes. So I had a slide about

4569
04:51:52,569 --> 04:51:57,969
that as well. Was that the the two 230 versus

4570
04:51:58,642 --> 04:52:01,642
91 versus 25. Yeah. Basically the annexation

4571
04:52:03,180 --> 04:52:07,384
rezoning would allow for the project as is 230 units, lots

4572
04:52:07,384 --> 04:52:10,521
of public infrastructure. And as you know, we've committed

4573
04:52:10,521 --> 04:52:14,458
20% affordable if if the annexation rezoning are not

4574
04:52:14,458 --> 04:52:19,620
approved, you know, we're looking at building this site

4575
04:52:19,620 --> 04:52:22,466
in the county, unincorporated Durham County on well and

4576
04:52:22,466 --> 04:52:25,869
septic, which ultimately is going to reduce the yield

4577
04:52:25,869 --> 04:52:29,139
significantly. There will be probably something like 25 lots

4578
04:52:29,139 --> 04:52:33,277
on well and septic. It wouldn't the lift station wouldn't be,

4579
04:52:33,277 --> 04:52:37,147
you know, necessary. Obviously on one septic and obviously the

4580
04:52:37,147 --> 04:52:39,816
affordable housing. I mean these lots themselves would

4581
04:52:39,816 --> 04:52:44,821
probably be just a lot would probably be, you know, in the

4582
04:52:44,821 --> 04:52:50,821
half to $1 million range. The homes would be probably 3 to $5

4583
04:52:50,961 --> 04:52:54,300
million in that scenario. Right. And that's that's

4584
04:52:54,300 --> 04:52:58,350
actually a lot closer, you know, when you look at, at some

4585
04:52:58,350 --> 04:53:00,904
of the houses that are listed in the Oaks, you know, you've

4586
04:53:00,904 --> 04:53:04,842
got a house listed on Helmsdale right now for 850,000. You've

4587
04:53:04,842 --> 04:53:08,579
got one listed on I can't remember the name Notting

4588
04:53:08,579 --> 04:53:12,515
Notting Hill for 2.1 million right now. That's you know,

4589
04:53:12,515 --> 04:53:16,920
that's the I think we could get those kind of prices here. But

4590
04:53:16,920 --> 04:53:19,722
that's not what, what we're actually asking for on the.

4591
04:53:19,722 --> 04:53:21,191
Thank you. Thank you. And I and I

4592
04:53:21,191 --> 04:53:24,461
understand that I don't shame anyone for the value of their

4593
04:53:24,461 --> 04:53:27,664
home. I know we need housing. We're going to we're going to

4594
04:53:27,664 --> 04:53:30,801
need housing at every income level, in every type of

4595
04:53:30,801 --> 04:53:34,671
housing. So I don't demonize that. I do have a question for

4596
04:53:34,671 --> 04:53:41,871
staff. If, if, if it's a if they built by right. The 25

4597
04:53:44,810 --> 04:53:48,881
lots, are they required to still preserve the

4598
04:53:49,553 --> 04:53:53,753
environmental nominee. The National Heritage Heritage area

4599
04:53:54,625 --> 04:53:59,290
or are they what is that still required? I guess what I'm

4600
04:53:59,290 --> 04:54:03,300
trying to say is or ask is if the if this is not approved,

4601
04:54:03,300 --> 04:54:08,380
then they go, they're playing by right. Are they required to

4602
04:54:08,380 --> 04:54:10,774
still protect the environmental the national heritage.

4603
04:54:10,774 --> 04:54:11,842
No. They could they could develop.

4604
04:54:11,842 --> 04:54:15,645
Single family lots. Within that that area. You have

4605
04:54:15,645 --> 04:54:16,460
to. Vote by.

4606
04:54:16,460 --> 04:54:20,517
Right. Okay. Thank you. So when I when

4607
04:54:20,517 --> 04:54:23,520
I think about these trade offs, when I think about, you know,

4608
04:54:23,520 --> 04:54:28,592
what our needs are in Durham, I understand that we're our MSA

4609
04:54:28,592 --> 04:54:33,997
is triangle is Chapel Hill and Durham. But what I do think

4610
04:54:33,997 --> 04:54:36,400
about, you know, the trade offs that we have here, the

4611
04:54:36,400 --> 04:54:40,300
affordability crisis that we have, the pain points that we

4612
04:54:40,300 --> 04:54:43,139
have here are, you know, their their preferences and then

4613
04:54:43,139 --> 04:54:48,412
their needs. And that's what usually drives my decision

4614
04:54:48,412 --> 04:54:52,612
making. So I'll be supporting the case.

4615
04:54:52,615 --> 04:54:54,485
Thank you. Council Member Burris.

4616
04:54:54,485 --> 04:54:57,210
And I just want to clarify. So like a couple of things could

4617
04:54:57,210 --> 04:54:59,756
be true that we do need affordable housing and a

4618
04:54:59,756 --> 04:55:01,625
variety and make sure affordable housing. But when

4619
04:55:01,625 --> 04:55:05,950
you talk about specialized populations and thinking about

4620
04:55:05,950 --> 04:55:07,831
you specifically mentioned Cornwallis in your statement,

4621
04:55:07,831 --> 04:55:09,900
and if you think about the current infrastructure, there's

4622
04:55:09,900 --> 04:55:12,503
there are bus stops right outside of that. And looking at

4623
04:55:12,503 --> 04:55:15,639
this, the closest proximity to a bus stop is 1.3 miles. So if

4624
04:55:15,639 --> 04:55:18,175
you don't have a car, then you're going to have to

4625
04:55:18,175 --> 04:55:21,111
basically handle that by foot. Thinking about if your children

4626
04:55:21,111 --> 04:55:24,181
go to school, you have a high school with 3.1 miles of Jordan

4627
04:55:24,181 --> 04:55:27,117
High. So I'm just saying, like and then 2.6 miles to the

4628
04:55:27,117 --> 04:55:30,530
nearest grocery store. And that's if you don't have access

4629
04:55:30,530 --> 04:55:33,657
to a car in transit. So I do agree that we do need a variety

4630
04:55:33,657 --> 04:55:37,194
of make sure housing. However, our neighbors should not be an

4631
04:55:37,194 --> 04:55:40,263
afterthought. And that's my point right there. So I would

4632
04:55:40,263 --> 04:55:42,599
have I do think that I appreciate some of your

4633
04:55:42,599 --> 04:55:46,799
properties offered. However, the environmental effects as

4634
04:55:46,870 --> 04:55:50,207
well as just, yeah, this affordable housing component

4635
04:55:50,207 --> 04:55:52,743
and what I've heard thus far does not compel me to vote for

4636
04:55:52,743 --> 04:55:57,543
this case. I'm raising my own hand here.

4637
04:55:59,290 --> 04:56:05,290
Sorry it's late. I have a question. I have an

4638
04:56:06,431 --> 04:56:09,340
understanding that there was conversations back and forth

4639
04:56:09,340 --> 04:56:13,372
with the homes in both Oak. I want to say yes, but villas.

4640
04:56:13,372 --> 04:56:19,110
Sorry. And maybe Oaks three HOA. Can you share with me

4641
04:56:19,110 --> 04:56:26,910
where did what the. When? Hold on. I'm trying to find the. I'm

4642
04:56:30,856 --> 04:56:35,593
going to find it, I apologize, it is late. Okay. What does it

4643
04:56:35,593 --> 04:56:42,134
mean to be in the boot and. Oh., six affordable units in the

4644
04:56:42,134 --> 04:56:45,737
boot of the 46 acre enclave track. What does that mean on.

4645
04:56:45,737 --> 04:56:48,473
The site? All right, so I'm just using

4646
04:56:48,473 --> 04:56:53,344
this slide as a proxy. If you look at the parcel, it kind of

4647
04:56:53,344 --> 04:56:57,349
looks like a boot. And this is the toe and this is the heel.

4648
04:56:57,349 --> 04:57:00,485
So the boot I mean generally refers to this section right

4649
04:57:00,485 --> 04:57:07,685
here. You know that's that's so at some point a memorandum of

4650
04:57:08,560 --> 04:57:11,897
understanding was pinned. I will say I don't believe we

4651
04:57:11,897 --> 04:57:15,901
ever entered into it formally, but one was Pin and it was

4652
04:57:15,901 --> 04:57:21,506
related to some of the things that the HOA representatives

4653
04:57:21,506 --> 04:57:26,778
were. Their constituents were concerned about and wanted us

4654
04:57:26,778 --> 04:57:31,249
to work together on to resolve. So one of them was, there's

4655
04:57:31,249 --> 04:57:36,587
these two roads right here, Dundalk and Hebrides, that

4656
04:57:36,587 --> 04:57:39,524
technically development of this site, regardless of what it is,

4657
04:57:39,524 --> 04:57:42,600
what would be required under the Durham code to connect to

4658
04:57:42,600 --> 04:57:45,596
these. I talked to planning staff about those connections

4659
04:57:45,596 --> 04:57:50,201
to Dundalk and Hebrides and planning staff here said those

4660
04:57:50,201 --> 04:57:55,473
are completely unimportant and they wouldn't mind if if those,

4661
04:57:55,473 --> 04:57:58,142
those streets or portion of the streets were closed such that

4662
04:57:58,142 --> 04:58:00,679
we wouldn't have to make a connection. We also spoke with

4663
04:58:00,679 --> 04:58:03,748
Town of Chapel Hill staff about that. They indicated the same

4664
04:58:03,748 --> 04:58:06,283
thing. They, you know, so this was something we thought we

4665
04:58:06,283 --> 04:58:09,287
would work on together with the HOA.

4666
04:58:09,287 --> 04:58:12,356
Another thing. That is still true.

4667
04:58:12,356 --> 04:58:15,760
Well, my my understanding is that neighbors are have are

4668
04:58:15,760 --> 04:58:18,696
pursuing these closures themselves right now. Okay.

4669
04:58:18,696 --> 04:58:23,368
That's my understanding. Another thing that the HOA

4670
04:58:23,368 --> 04:58:26,571
wanted to work on was what I will call a circuitous route

4671
04:58:26,571 --> 04:58:30,308
for the extension of Lancaster through the site, and that was

4672
04:58:30,308 --> 04:58:33,311
so as not to develop like a speedway through there, which I

4673
04:58:33,311 --> 04:58:35,980
mean, frankly, we don't want our residents to be dealing

4674
04:58:35,980 --> 04:58:39,584
with that either. So, you know, I think our motivations are

4675
04:58:39,584 --> 04:58:43,588
aligned, however, that road design is, is number one

4676
04:58:43,588 --> 04:58:46,391
happens at site plan, not zoning. And number two, a lot

4677
04:58:46,391 --> 04:58:49,127
of that is driven by the MPO. So we recognize that that's

4678
04:58:49,127 --> 04:58:50,928
something that we're gonna have to work on outside of the

4679
04:58:50,928 --> 04:58:54,640
context of the zoning. And the last one was the placement of

4680
04:58:54,640 --> 04:58:58,864
the affordable housing component. As I mentioned on.

4681
04:58:59,871 --> 04:59:01,539
So where does. That fall?

4682
04:59:01,539 --> 04:59:05,210
Different slide. Yeah. In that, in that the next picture, the

4683
04:59:05,210 --> 04:59:07,345
one you just had, where would that fall.

4684
04:59:07,345 --> 04:59:11,949
Yeah, I think this one shows these are the locations that

4685
04:59:11,949 --> 04:59:15,954
that we evaluated on the site would score under the current

4686
04:59:15,954 --> 04:59:20,154
light tag rubric for a 4% deal. And.

4687
04:59:20,758 --> 04:59:23,628
The. The HOS preferred this

4688
04:59:23,628 --> 04:59:26,970
location, which is something that we want. And frankly, I

4689
04:59:26,970 --> 04:59:28,232
think we probably prefer this location as well.

4690
04:59:28,232 --> 04:59:30,702
Preferred they prefer that one right there on the the lower

4691
04:59:30,702 --> 04:59:34,639
part of the screen. I'm sorry. The HOA preferred the on the

4692
04:59:34,639 --> 04:59:37,174
lower part of the screen. They preferred this one over

4693
04:59:37,174 --> 04:59:39,644
here by George King Road. It's been hidden by your

4694
04:59:39,644 --> 04:59:41,446
picture. Okay.

4695
04:59:41,446 --> 04:59:44,783
Oh I'm sorry. Yeah I okay my. Yeah but.

4696
04:59:44,783 --> 04:59:48,787
That's I know you all can't determine where like that's an

4697
04:59:48,787 --> 04:59:52,924
open question mark, but was there an awareness from the

4698
04:59:52,924 --> 04:59:56,260
neighbors part that that is in the heritage area?

4699
04:59:56,260 --> 04:59:58,129
Well, they're both in the natural heritage area. Yeah.

4700
04:59:58,129 --> 04:59:59,530
That is something that we discussed.

4701
04:59:59,530 --> 05:00:01,332
Yes. Okay. So that was made aware to

4702
05:00:01,332 --> 05:00:03,134
those neighbors that where would they wanted the

4703
05:00:03,134 --> 05:00:05,700
affordable housing was actually in the most environmentally

4704
05:00:05,700 --> 05:00:07,872
sensitive area. Well, out of two locations that

4705
05:00:07,872 --> 05:00:10,274
are both environmentally sensitive. I mean, we're

4706
05:00:10,274 --> 05:00:12,277
talking yes, I mean, they were aware of that, but that.

4707
05:00:12,277 --> 05:00:13,945
I don't. Lose the HOA. Maybe not all the

4708
05:00:13,945 --> 05:00:15,945
neighbors. I'm sorry.

4709
05:00:16,481 --> 05:00:19,684
I said, maybe not all the neighbors, just the hos.

4710
05:00:19,684 --> 05:00:22,220
The HOA representatives we received. Yeah. That's correct.

4711
05:00:22,220 --> 05:00:27,892
Okay. Thank you. I appreciate that. And then as far as the

4712
05:00:27,892 --> 05:00:31,429
road, I mean, we've had to see, obviously when things come to

4713
05:00:31,429 --> 05:00:35,330
the TPO, which council member wrist and myself are both the

4714
05:00:35,330 --> 05:00:39,170
voting members, there have been adjustments on road alignments

4715
05:00:39,170 --> 05:00:40,505
and things like that. Right.

4716
05:00:40,505 --> 05:00:47,245
So it is not unheard of. It is not. An issue, at least in my

4717
05:00:47,245 --> 05:00:49,714
opinion, when things have had to move forward, we've been

4718
05:00:49,714 --> 05:00:52,983
able to do some things that are necessary around alignment. As

4719
05:00:52,983 --> 05:00:58,983
TPO members and as, yeah, that's where I'll leave that.

4720
05:01:00,258 --> 05:01:03,128
Does anyone else have any and colleagues or folks comfortable

4721
05:01:03,128 --> 05:01:05,663
with us wrapping up questions and comments in the next couple

4722
05:01:05,663 --> 05:01:11,663
of minutes? Okay. Thank you. Council Member Kopac. And then

4723
05:01:12,203 --> 05:01:16,541
Council Member Baker. And then I'm just going to kind of go

4724
05:01:16,541 --> 05:01:19,770
down and let folks do their last. Any last comments or

4725
05:01:19,770 --> 05:01:23,348
questions that folks have? We're just going to start and

4726
05:01:23,348 --> 05:01:26,684
then kind of come down if folks are comfortable with that.

4727
05:01:26,684 --> 05:01:29,154
And do we get our time from the first time or just the second

4728
05:01:29,154 --> 05:01:32,223
time? This is now your second time?

4729
05:01:32,223 --> 05:01:34,692
Yeah, I'll use like 30s the first time.

4730
05:01:34,692 --> 05:01:37,495
Oh, I see, I'm yeah. I mean as long as you're not going in six

4731
05:01:37,495 --> 05:01:39,895
minutes and we're. Good.

4732
05:01:40,310 --> 05:01:43,768
I mean, at a high level, our community decided in our comp

4733
05:01:43,768 --> 05:01:46,504
plan that this is an area where we're going to see more growth

4734
05:01:46,504 --> 05:01:49,974
in this corridor, more housing, more commercial, more transit.

4735
05:01:49,974 --> 05:01:53,644
And the updates to George King Road will bring infrastructure.

4736
05:01:53,644 --> 05:01:56,514
The proximity to Lee village will add bike in and walk

4737
05:01:56,514 --> 05:02:00,184
mobility, along with transit. And I always sympathize with

4738
05:02:00,184 --> 05:02:03,254
anyone who has concerns about what's being changed where they

4739
05:02:03,254 --> 05:02:06,458
live. But if we're going to achieve our goal of of a

4740
05:02:06,458 --> 05:02:08,799
polycentric city, the development in this area

4741
05:02:08,799 --> 05:02:13,400
alongside a Toa with the step downs nearby is kind of the

4742
05:02:13,400 --> 05:02:15,740
goal and the point of the comprehensive plan for this

4743
05:02:15,740 --> 05:02:19,940
area. It's significant that we're seeing 20% affordable

4744
05:02:20,145 --> 05:02:23,281
housing income restricted for people making $60,000 or less a

4745
05:02:23,281 --> 05:02:28,810
year, with proximity to employment and future transit.

4746
05:02:28,860 --> 05:02:31,823
And some people who make $60,000 a year or less do have

4747
05:02:31,823 --> 05:02:36,427
a car, and there will be other ways to access the future

4748
05:02:36,427 --> 05:02:39,430
mobility options. This area is going to bring in the questions

4749
05:02:39,430 --> 05:02:41,899
of the benefits, and the cost of growth is always a tough

4750
05:02:41,899 --> 05:02:44,302
one, but I think just considering ourselves a

4751
05:02:44,302 --> 05:02:46,905
progressive community in Durham, I think I mean, The

4752
05:02:46,905 --> 05:02:49,174
Oaks is a beautiful community. The ones nearby, it are

4753
05:02:49,174 --> 05:02:53,440
beautiful and I think that it's an equitable choice to have

4754
05:02:53,440 --> 05:02:56,981
this area welcoming new neighbors, just like we ask,

4755
05:02:56,981 --> 05:03:00,500
and often put the burdens on historically black and

4756
05:03:00,500 --> 05:03:03,788
gentrifying neighborhoods to accept more housing. I used to

4757
05:03:03,788 --> 05:03:06,457
be an advocate for low income housing tax credits for my

4758
05:03:06,457 --> 05:03:10,328
profession, and this is not low quality, segregated housing.

4759
05:03:10,328 --> 05:03:12,930
It's the same housing we're advocating for. And 505 Chapel

4760
05:03:12,930 --> 05:03:15,533
Hill Street. It's the same that we're supportive of in Bragg

4761
05:03:15,533 --> 05:03:18,803
Town neighborhood. And so, you know, it's okay for those

4762
05:03:18,803 --> 05:03:21,673
areas. I think it should be okay for, for for wealthier

4763
05:03:21,673 --> 05:03:26,144
areas that are developing as well. The environmental impacts

4764
05:03:26,144 --> 05:03:29,800
are what give me the biggest concern in this area. And I

4765
05:03:29,800 --> 05:03:31,548
think this is where the trade offs come in. And, and, you

4766
05:03:31,548 --> 05:03:34,752
know, kept me up last night. I don't think I've ever supported

4767
05:03:34,752 --> 05:03:37,221
a case. I'm planning commission or council that didn't align

4768
05:03:37,221 --> 05:03:39,757
with policy 79 around environmentally sensitive

4769
05:03:39,757 --> 05:03:44,162
areas. And professionally. I used to bring philanthropic

4770
05:03:44,162 --> 05:03:47,899
money to help support studies that did wildlife corridor

4771
05:03:47,899 --> 05:03:51,435
assessments. So this area is already stressed. I get it.

4772
05:03:51,435 --> 05:03:54,572
Like the Oaks development put stress on the forest and on the

4773
05:03:54,572 --> 05:03:58,108
natural heritage area, you know, and putting more growth

4774
05:03:58,108 --> 05:04:00,845
in this area will put additional stress. And I want

4775
05:04:00,845 --> 05:04:03,714
to be able to go along with the recommendations of TCC Wildlife

4776
05:04:03,714 --> 05:04:07,651
Resources Commission, EAP dost for how to improve the

4777
05:04:07,651 --> 05:04:11,655
proposal. Like that's what I want, but ultimately we can't

4778
05:04:11,655 --> 05:04:15,660
dictate that the development is done in a certain way. And so

4779
05:04:15,660 --> 05:04:18,329
we also have to understand the practicalities of what could

4780
05:04:18,329 --> 05:04:23,267
happen, even with even with a no. And, you know, the

4781
05:04:23,267 --> 05:04:26,204
Lancaster Street that's under adopted plans, that's going to

4782
05:04:26,204 --> 05:04:28,806
happen anyway. It's like you're going to see some development

4783
05:04:28,806 --> 05:04:32,810
happen in this in the natural heritage area. Regardless, it

4784
05:04:32,810 --> 05:04:35,613
does give me some comfort to know this is it, the periphery

4785
05:04:35,613 --> 05:04:41,285
that it does not rate highly for biodiverse qualities. It

4786
05:04:41,285 --> 05:04:44,355
does not disrupt the area. Wildlife corridors. We do get

4787
05:04:44,355 --> 05:04:48,159
more trees, but I want all the things for environmental

4788
05:04:48,159 --> 05:04:51,229
protection. And so that's why I'm struggling here. But I'm

4789
05:04:51,229 --> 05:04:54,832
struggling to if we adopt maximalist positions here, that

4790
05:04:54,832 --> 05:04:56,834
we have to be really clear eyed about the trade offs we're

4791
05:04:56,834 --> 05:04:59,637
accepting, including a loss of significant affordable housing

4792
05:04:59,637 --> 05:05:04,375
and housing overall, which, while it does have a harm for,

4793
05:05:04,375 --> 05:05:06,710
you know, the species that may have been identified, there's

4794
05:05:06,710 --> 05:05:10,448
also the endangerment of our people, of our residents. So we

4795
05:05:10,448 --> 05:05:13,718
talk a lot about species, but we also have to think about our

4796
05:05:13,718 --> 05:05:16,454
people and those who are most endangered at being displaced.

4797
05:05:16,454 --> 05:05:18,656
And that's where a development like this can be most

4798
05:05:18,656 --> 05:05:24,662
beneficial for neighbors who are in need of that housing. So

4799
05:05:24,662 --> 05:05:27,532
this is a tough one to weigh. I think there's definite pros

4800
05:05:27,532 --> 05:05:30,000
that align with our comp plan. There's definitely drawbacks

4801
05:05:30,000 --> 05:05:32,937
and the environmental side, and this is one that I'm going to

4802
05:05:32,937 --> 05:05:36,537
continue to weigh. So thank you.

4803
05:05:37,800 --> 05:05:41,208
Council Member Baker. I appreciate those comments.

4804
05:05:43,881 --> 05:05:47,351
Council Member Kopac I appreciate the deliberation of

4805
05:05:47,351 --> 05:05:51,155
my colleagues up here. You know, since.

4806
05:05:51,155 --> 05:05:55,826
My colleagues here hear me say this a lot, but since 2017,

4807
05:05:55,826 --> 05:06:00,898
we've sprawled by half the year of Manhattan. The vast majority

4808
05:06:00,898 --> 05:06:05,369
of approved cases in that time period don't have anywhere near

4809
05:06:05,369 --> 05:06:11,969
the quality of commitments that this case presents to us today.

4810
05:06:13,911 --> 05:06:16,380
That get us closer to the comprehensive plan. I think

4811
05:06:16,380 --> 05:06:18,516
that that each one of these commitments, it's not just

4812
05:06:18,516 --> 05:06:22,186
about giving us something or giving us that, giving us

4813
05:06:22,186 --> 05:06:26,591
something else, but moving us toward the comprehensive plan,

4814
05:06:26,591 --> 05:06:30,127
the community vision, the goals, the policies that were

4815
05:06:30,127 --> 05:06:34,732
laid out by the community. I voted for Lee village, right

4816
05:06:34,732 --> 05:06:38,202
next door. We had a lot of people show up, speak against

4817
05:06:38,202 --> 05:06:44,141
it, and I felt that that case crossed the threshold.

4818
05:06:44,141 --> 05:06:48,279
Threshold. It was a departure for me because I'm so used to

4819
05:06:48,279 --> 05:06:54,152
voting against cases that are large scale and on large

4820
05:06:54,152 --> 05:06:59,890
forested properties. But to me, it had the right combination of

4821
05:06:59,890 --> 05:07:03,694
the things that I am consistent on, which is about walkability

4822
05:07:03,694 --> 05:07:07,431
and walkability. You know, Mayor Williams, you talked

4823
05:07:07,431 --> 05:07:10,702
about Madrid density, diversity and design. That's what that's

4824
05:07:10,702 --> 05:07:15,706
what places like Madrid and other much very walkable cities

4825
05:07:15,706 --> 05:07:19,977
have. That is the there's the the ingredients of walkability.

4826
05:07:19,977 --> 05:07:26,784
And so this case provides public goods. And to me we need

4827
05:07:26,784 --> 05:07:31,655
cases that provide public goods that also have the combination

4828
05:07:31,655 --> 05:07:35,255
of walkability. Because walkability is sustainability

4829
05:07:36,590 --> 05:07:40,665
is equity. And I think that those are all critical

4830
05:07:40,665 --> 05:07:46,871
elements. So for me, until we adopt the LDC, which builds

4831
05:07:46,871 --> 05:07:52,900
much more walkable urban design into the fabric and into our

4832
05:07:52,900 --> 05:07:56,748
standards, we really have no guarantee of walkability unless

4833
05:07:56,748 --> 05:08:02,687
those are spelled out explicitly to me. We we need a

4834
05:08:02,687 --> 05:08:06,157
a paradigm shift in the way that we do things. In Durham.

4835
05:08:06,157 --> 05:08:10,161
Only 4% of our residents can can walk anywhere. There are

4836
05:08:10,161 --> 05:08:16,500
decent elements in this case that I, I had to sit back and

4837
05:08:16,500 --> 05:08:22,500
and listen to to the presentation and think a lot

4838
05:08:22,846 --> 05:08:26,316
about what my colleagues were saying up here. But for me, I'm

4839
05:08:26,316 --> 05:08:29,319
not going to budge from my position. I'm consistent. I

4840
05:08:29,319 --> 05:08:33,723
will remain consistent on what I believe is, is the dramatic

4841
05:08:33,723 --> 05:08:37,594
change that is that is needed in in the way that we plan and

4842
05:08:37,594 --> 05:08:44,194
build our city. You know, as far as approving an application

4843
05:08:44,267 --> 05:08:49,539
and it becomes what the presentation shows versus if

4844
05:08:49,539 --> 05:08:51,541
you don't approve the application, we will build

4845
05:08:51,541 --> 05:08:55,612
under the UN annexed land in the county. And the very low

4846
05:08:55,612 --> 05:09:00,417
density that that's not how I review these cases. I really

4847
05:09:00,417 --> 05:09:05,755
look at what they are truly proposing. And for this one, we

4848
05:09:05,755 --> 05:09:08,558
there's a lot of good in here, but for me, it hasn't quite

4849
05:09:08,558 --> 05:09:11,828
persuaded me and it hasn't crossed that threshold. Thank

4850
05:09:11,828 --> 05:09:15,832
you. I'll be brief. My final word.

4851
05:09:15,832 --> 05:09:19,502
So as a new elected official, I've learned over the past like

4852
05:09:19,502 --> 05:09:23,372
four months that sometimes we don't have someone's lived

4853
05:09:23,372 --> 05:09:25,509
experience. You may not want to make comments about what

4854
05:09:25,509 --> 05:09:28,645
someone has endured. And so I think about that in terms of

4855
05:09:28,645 --> 05:09:30,914
like for some of our people in our community who I've always

4856
05:09:30,914 --> 05:09:33,916
advocated for in terms of how they're treated in community.

4857
05:09:33,916 --> 05:09:37,654
So I'll just leave with that. We are currently in a drought,

4858
05:09:37,654 --> 05:09:41,570
as we all know right now, and as a result of growth, like we

4859
05:09:41,570 --> 05:09:45,328
have realized that, you know, trees have a purpose. We have,

4860
05:09:45,328 --> 05:09:48,198
I think, our environment for a reason. And so I really just

4861
05:09:48,198 --> 05:09:50,867
want to ensure that we are not setting ourselves up for future

4862
05:09:50,867 --> 05:09:53,870
harm and thinking about proximity to a major water

4863
05:09:53,870 --> 05:09:57,607
source and just about how. And then also the 100 year storm.

4864
05:09:57,607 --> 05:09:59,743
Like if you think about it right now for the drought, talk

4865
05:09:59,743 --> 05:10:01,944
to my dad are days like, we're going to need a hurricane to

4866
05:10:01,944 --> 05:10:04,748
get out of this drought pretty soon, and if you're a North

4867
05:10:04,748 --> 05:10:08,284
Carolina, you understand how that works. So again, I, I've

4868
05:10:08,284 --> 05:10:10,420
already stated my position on that, but I just want to make

4869
05:10:10,420 --> 05:10:13,823
sure that we are giving grace to each other and just yeah, in

4870
05:10:13,823 --> 05:10:15,625
honoring each other's lived experience and sometimes

4871
05:10:15,625 --> 05:10:18,829
knowing that is listening before you speak about other

4872
05:10:18,829 --> 05:10:22,429
people that you don't relate to.

4873
05:10:22,432 --> 05:10:27,570
Thank you, Council Member Rist and then Mayor Williams.

4874
05:10:27,570 --> 05:10:30,374
Thanks, mayor Pro tem. Yeah, I'm with the mayor in this. I

4875
05:10:30,374 --> 05:10:32,642
think, you know, we've seen the data, right? We're growing

4876
05:10:32,642 --> 05:10:36,646
rapidly. We the MTP shows we're going to grow or the the our

4877
05:10:36,646 --> 05:10:39,649
transportation plan shows we're going to grow by 50% in the

4878
05:10:39,649 --> 05:10:44,187
next 30 years, right? 90% jobs. The data shows during Durham

4879
05:10:44,187 --> 05:10:47,724
County, median housing prices have gone up 58% since 2019.

4880
05:10:47,724 --> 05:10:51,328
Prices are going up. People need places to live affordably.

4881
05:10:51,328 --> 05:10:53,530
I think our housing gap, estimated by city staff, is

4882
05:10:53,530 --> 05:10:57,334
like 25,000 rental units. We need for families. They qualify

4883
05:10:57,334 --> 05:11:01,338
for income, so we need housing. I think I also want to zoom

4884
05:11:01,338 --> 05:11:04,274
out. You know, we we get so focused on individual cases.

4885
05:11:04,274 --> 05:11:08,144
Right. But the truth is like, you know, it's and we gotta, we

4886
05:11:08,144 --> 05:11:10,680
gotta we gotta judge it based on the confines of this case.

4887
05:11:10,680 --> 05:11:13,160
But I've been around long enough. I'm the old guy on the

4888
05:11:13,160 --> 05:11:16,180
council, and I've been around long enough to know that back

4889
05:11:16,180 --> 05:11:19,289
in the 70s, when The Oaks was built, 70 or 80s people in Glen

4890
05:11:19,289 --> 05:11:21,291
Lennox were upset about that. Right? They didn't like the

4891
05:11:21,291 --> 05:11:23,260
fact that there was tearing down trees like in their

4892
05:11:23,260 --> 05:11:27,363
neighborhood. Right. So Chapel Hill has moved west, you know,

4893
05:11:27,363 --> 05:11:30,100
The Oaks was built. The first phase was built. And then

4894
05:11:30,100 --> 05:11:32,835
there's Meadow Mont, right. Meadow monster. And the folks

4895
05:11:32,835 --> 05:11:34,570
in the Oaks were mad about betterment because it was

4896
05:11:34,570 --> 05:11:38,108
taking down trees. Right. So we're growing. Ideally, we grow

4897
05:11:38,108 --> 05:11:40,430
within our urban growth boundaries. So we preserve open

4898
05:11:40,430 --> 05:11:43,780
space that we need. But who's to say who gets to pull up the

4899
05:11:43,780 --> 05:11:45,582
ladder and say, we got to stop here, right? I don't think

4900
05:11:45,582 --> 05:11:48,185
that's fair. We've got a comprehensive plan as as

4901
05:11:48,185 --> 05:11:50,853
Council Member Kopac referenced, that looks for this

4902
05:11:50,853 --> 05:11:53,190
to be a mixed residential neighborhood near a transit

4903
05:11:53,190 --> 05:11:56,393
opportunity area, I see actually abundance here. I do

4904
05:11:56,393 --> 05:11:59,462
see we talked about this before. I see a 20% of mobile

4905
05:11:59,462 --> 05:12:01,640
housing that's, you know, we talk about the need for

4906
05:12:01,640 --> 05:12:04,267
affordable housing. I think our plan requires Director Young,

4907
05:12:04,267 --> 05:12:07,737
what is the plan and vision? Maybe 15% affordable is our

4908
05:12:07,737 --> 05:12:12,209
goal right. This is a and we often proffer with developers

4909
05:12:12,209 --> 05:12:15,545
to get six, seven, 8% affordable. There's a developer

4910
05:12:15,545 --> 05:12:18,415
that's coming to us that's giving us 20% affordable.

4911
05:12:18,415 --> 05:12:22,180
That's above the goal we set from the get go. We need that

4912
05:12:22,180 --> 05:12:24,554
affordable housing. We also need partners who are willing

4913
05:12:24,554 --> 05:12:26,957
to like, I'm on the Housing Authority board. We need

4914
05:12:26,957 --> 05:12:29,626
partners that are willing to allow folks to transfer from

4915
05:12:29,626 --> 05:12:32,280
existing public housing communities as we're renovating

4916
05:12:32,280 --> 05:12:34,431
them. So that transfer of assistance we've offered is a

4917
05:12:34,431 --> 05:12:36,833
key thing. We need to be able to transfer folks as we're

4918
05:12:36,833 --> 05:12:40,971
renovating our key public housing assets, the the proper

4919
05:12:40,971 --> 05:12:43,106
stormwater hundred year stolen. That's a key proffer there.

4920
05:12:43,106 --> 05:12:45,842
That's we've got to protect our stormwater tree coverage is

4921
05:12:45,842 --> 05:12:48,912
great. It's also worth noting that we are building a

4922
05:12:48,912 --> 05:12:51,781
community here, right? We don't have all the infrastructure

4923
05:12:51,781 --> 05:12:54,918
that we need for the future. We're building towards that

4924
05:12:54,918 --> 05:12:58,254
highway 54. A bunch of us in a focus group just of the day.

4925
05:12:58,254 --> 05:13:01,457
It's one of the corridors we're looking at for bus rapid

4926
05:13:01,457 --> 05:13:04,327
transit. Right. That could be dedicated lanes. It could be

4927
05:13:04,327 --> 05:13:06,796
signal priorities, it could be enhanced stations. But that's a

4928
05:13:06,796 --> 05:13:10,666
corridor that will have bus rapid transit in the future. So

4929
05:13:10,666 --> 05:13:13,202
it's going to be more accessible by transit. I do

4930
05:13:13,202 --> 05:13:16,473
have heartburn about the natural heritage area. This is

4931
05:13:16,473 --> 05:13:18,208
something that Council Member Kopac referred to. Again,

4932
05:13:18,208 --> 05:13:21,211
that's something that I'm aware of. I am given comfort by the

4933
05:13:21,211 --> 05:13:23,547
fact that this area is surrounded by this large core

4934
05:13:23,547 --> 05:13:27,484
lands, which is also a natural heritage area. So there are

4935
05:13:27,484 --> 05:13:30,220
always tradeoffs we face. Part of our job here at the council

4936
05:13:30,220 --> 05:13:33,222
is to evaluate those. On balance. I think this case to

4937
05:13:33,222 --> 05:13:34,958
me passes the threshold. I'll be supporting it.

4938
05:13:34,958 --> 05:13:35,959
Thank you. Thank you.

4939
05:13:35,959 --> 05:13:40,960
Mayor Williams. Yeah, I'll just be quick

4940
05:13:40,960 --> 05:13:43,232
because it got really cold up here. My sinuses are just

4941
05:13:43,232 --> 05:13:49,372
draining really bad. I, you know, I think about why I, why

4942
05:13:49,372 --> 05:13:56,179
I'm here, why I'm sitting on this council. I'm here to be in

4943
05:13:56,179 --> 05:14:01,251
the, in the affirmative. Like I'm here to do something. I,

4944
05:14:01,251 --> 05:14:05,122
I'm not here. And and I want to be very clear. Each of us are

4945
05:14:05,122 --> 05:14:09,326
elected separately. We're up here to be a representative

4946
05:14:09,326 --> 05:14:13,196
body. And the mixed bag of opinions that you hear up here

4947
05:14:13,196 --> 05:14:16,599
are what the voters have chosen. So this is what you

4948
05:14:16,599 --> 05:14:18,468
get. So that means you're going to get a diverse school of

4949
05:14:18,468 --> 05:14:25,800
thought. For me, my perspective is my, my, my I understand some

4950
05:14:25,800 --> 05:14:28,683
things I can't control, right? I understand I have no idea

4951
05:14:28,683 --> 05:14:31,152
who's moving here, but when I look at the data, it's a lot of

4952
05:14:31,152 --> 05:14:34,755
people. And at some point in time, some of you all moved

4953
05:14:34,755 --> 05:14:38,159
here. Most of you all moved to Chapel Hill or. But you're in

4954
05:14:38,159 --> 05:14:42,630
the area. We're all in the same MSA. But what I can control is

4955
05:14:42,630 --> 05:14:46,634
the decisions I make. And in the middle of, you know, this

4956
05:14:46,634 --> 05:14:49,103
housing situation, we have this housing crisis of

4957
05:14:49,103 --> 05:14:53,108
affordability. The decision I make, am I going to make a

4958
05:14:53,108 --> 05:14:59,108
decision to be okay with 25 units or 230 units or 91 units?

4959
05:15:01,582 --> 05:15:08,590
Am I going to be okay with the the preference of keeping it as

4960
05:15:08,590 --> 05:15:13,795
is versus building on it? I try to I try to simplify it down to

4961
05:15:13,795 --> 05:15:17,665
this in my mind, and I and I try to do that in the most

4962
05:15:17,665 --> 05:15:20,468
sensitive way as well, because I know that you all have you

4963
05:15:20,468 --> 05:15:23,271
live where you live. The folks that showed up to talk, you

4964
05:15:23,271 --> 05:15:25,673
live where you live, and you are used to what you see and

4965
05:15:25,673 --> 05:15:28,542
what you have. And then when there are changes that are

4966
05:15:28,542 --> 05:15:33,882
coming, that's that's a big adjustment, you know? But I

4967
05:15:33,882 --> 05:15:38,553
also realize that, you know, we as a community are evolving,

4968
05:15:38,553 --> 05:15:41,489
you know, and and that and that matters. It matters to the

4969
05:15:41,489 --> 05:15:44,759
people who are looking for someone to live. It matters to

4970
05:15:44,759 --> 05:15:47,695
the people who are already living there. And so, yes, for

4971
05:15:47,695 --> 05:15:51,432
me, I do break it down to those trade offs of what issues do we

4972
05:15:51,432 --> 05:15:56,360
have and how do I address those issues and compare it to the

4973
05:15:56,360 --> 05:16:00,975
preferences that we already have? You know, so you're here

4974
05:16:00,975 --> 05:16:03,978
to diversity the thought up here. And and that's perfectly

4975
05:16:03,978 --> 05:16:09,117
fine. And I respect everyone's opinion. And and we fall where

4976
05:16:09,117 --> 05:16:12,387
we fall on it. And I respect yours as well. And I appreciate

4977
05:16:12,387 --> 05:16:16,457
everyone coming coming here tonight. But I, I you know we

4978
05:16:16,457 --> 05:16:19,594
have too many people that are looking for a home. We have we

4979
05:16:19,594 --> 05:16:21,663
have too many people that are, that are we have too many

4980
05:16:21,663 --> 05:16:24,532
college students that want to stay here but have no idea how

4981
05:16:24,532 --> 05:16:28,200
to get in the market. We have too many folks that are trying

4982
05:16:28,200 --> 05:16:31,205
to upskill and get out on their own and be independent, and

4983
05:16:31,205 --> 05:16:34,209
there's just too competitive. The market is too competitive,

4984
05:16:34,209 --> 05:16:38,213
so 20% affordable housing. I think we're I think the trade

4985
05:16:38,213 --> 05:16:43,130
offs are worth affirming this one. Thank you.

4986
05:16:43,151 --> 05:16:46,154
Thank you. I'm going to be brief. I really appreciate

4987
05:16:46,154 --> 05:16:48,289
these are we all know that these are hard cases. And

4988
05:16:48,289 --> 05:16:52,260
you're always you're always doing trade offs. I will be

4989
05:16:52,260 --> 05:16:54,962
supporting this case in large part because it does have such

4990
05:16:54,962 --> 05:16:58,299
a large affordability component, and also because it

4991
05:16:58,299 --> 05:17:02,170
doesn't involve city subsidy. I understand that disappoints

4992
05:17:02,170 --> 05:17:04,439
neighbors. I understand it disappoints the folks who have

4993
05:17:04,439 --> 05:17:08,909
to live there. We're all dealing with change in our

4994
05:17:08,909 --> 05:17:14,382
communities. And I do want to say very quickly that a lot of

4995
05:17:14,382 --> 05:17:17,585
the decisions that you all lifted up, Vision Zero, the

4996
05:17:17,585 --> 05:17:19,654
comp plan, a lot of the decisions we've made as a

4997
05:17:19,654 --> 05:17:22,657
council, I have been one of the yes votes on those decisions.

4998
05:17:22,657 --> 05:17:26,127
I'm the council member who got us the Vision Zero coordinator.

4999
05:17:26,127 --> 05:17:30,398
I'm the one who's been on the TPO denying MnDOT money for

5000
05:17:30,398 --> 05:17:33,735
road widening. There's lots of ways to be an environmentalist.

5001
05:17:33,735 --> 05:17:37,672
It's not just conservation. I appreciate all of the work that

5002
05:17:37,672 --> 05:17:40,141
staff did, especially in exploring how we can get this

5003
05:17:40,141 --> 05:17:42,477
NC heritage program, how it could actually be more

5004
05:17:42,477 --> 05:17:47,148
enforceable, more regulatory. And that was that was the state

5005
05:17:47,148 --> 05:17:49,684
at the very beginning of this night, I asked every single one

5006
05:17:49,684 --> 05:17:52,687
of you to please continue to participate, especially at the

5007
05:17:52,687 --> 05:17:59,427
state level. And so that is my urging tonight. We have a

5008
05:17:59,427 --> 05:18:03,497
motion in front of us. Motion number one, to adopt an

5009
05:18:03,497 --> 05:18:05,833
ordinance annexing Enclave at Little Creek in the city of

5010
05:18:05,833 --> 05:18:08,169
Durham and to authorize the city manager to enter in a

5011
05:18:08,169 --> 05:18:11,505
utility extension agreement with a Adobe Communities

5012
05:18:11,505 --> 05:18:13,905
Acquisitions, LLC. So move..

5013
05:18:14,843 --> 05:18:16,430
Second. I have a motion.

5014
05:18:16,430 --> 05:18:17,511
Second, Madam Clerk, could you please open the.

5015
05:18:17,511 --> 05:18:20,511
Vote? Could you please close.

5016
05:18:25,120 --> 05:18:27,520
The vote? The motion.

5017
05:18:29,257 --> 05:18:30,792
Passes 4 to. 2.

5018
05:18:30,792 --> 05:18:33,461
With council. Members Baker and Burris voting

5019
05:18:33,461 --> 05:18:36,464
no. Thank you. Next motion is to

5020
05:18:36,464 --> 05:18:39,670
adopt an ordinance amending the Unified Development Ordinance

5021
05:18:39,670 --> 05:18:41,870
by taking property out of residential suburban Dash 20

5022
05:18:41,870 --> 05:18:45,272
fall. Jordan Watershed watershed overlay be county

5023
05:18:45,272 --> 05:18:47,809
jurisdiction and establishing the same as planned development

5024
05:18:47,809 --> 05:18:52,609
residential 5.006 falls Jordan watershed overlay B to city

5025
05:18:53,415 --> 05:18:56,830
jurisdiction. Can I please get a motion.

5026
05:18:56,830 --> 05:18:58,486
So moved. Second. I have a motion a second. Madam

5027
05:18:58,486 --> 05:19:03,958
Clerk, could you please open the vote? Could you please

5028
05:19:03,958 --> 05:19:06,958
close the vote? The motion.

5029
05:19:08,162 --> 05:19:10,832
Passes 4 to 2. With Council Member Baker.

5030
05:19:10,832 --> 05:19:13,834
And Burris voting no. Motion number three to adopt an

5031
05:19:13,834 --> 05:19:16,370
ordinance amending the Unified Development Ordinance by taking

5032
05:19:16,370 --> 05:19:18,973
property out of residential suburban 20 fall Jordan

5033
05:19:18,973 --> 05:19:23,173
Watershed overlay. Be county's jurisdiction and establishing

5034
05:19:24,111 --> 05:19:27,248
the same as residential suburban 24 Jordan watershed

5035
05:19:27,248 --> 05:19:30,251
overlay be city jurisdiction. So moved.

5036
05:19:30,251 --> 05:19:32,520
Second have a motion and a second. Madam clerk, could you

5037
05:19:32,520 --> 05:19:38,520
please open the vote? Could you please close the vote?

5038
05:19:41,796 --> 05:19:44,398
Motion passes forwarded to with council members Baker and

5039
05:19:44,398 --> 05:19:46,734
Burris voting. No on motion number four is to

5040
05:19:46,734 --> 05:19:51,534
adopt a consistency statement as required by section 16605.

5041
05:19:52,206 --> 05:19:54,206
So moved. Second.

5042
05:19:54,342 --> 05:19:56,344
I have a motion and a second. Madam clerk, could you please

5043
05:19:56,344 --> 05:20:01,744
open the vote? Please close it. Motion passes unanimously.

5044
05:20:04,886 --> 05:20:06,821
Thank you. Colleagues, we have one last

5045
05:20:06,821 --> 05:20:11,358
item that we need to pass, which is our under supplemental

5046
05:20:11,358 --> 05:20:14,950
items. I did not add it to the consent agenda. So it's the

5047
05:20:14,950 --> 05:20:18,365
revision of to the 2026 City Council meeting schedule. Could

5048
05:20:18,365 --> 05:20:22,503
I please get a motion to. Move?

5049
05:20:22,503 --> 05:20:24,503
Second? Three.

5050
05:20:26,841 --> 05:20:29,911
I'm just gonna do it to approve a revision of the 2026 City

5051
05:20:29,911 --> 05:20:32,780
Council meeting schedule that rescheduled the Thursday, May

5052
05:20:32,780 --> 05:20:37,785
7th work session to May to Monday, May 18th at 1 p.m..

5053
05:20:37,785 --> 05:20:39,785
So moved. Second.

5054
05:20:41,322 --> 05:20:44,992
I guess to adopt an ordinance rescheduling the May 7th. Is it

5055
05:20:44,992 --> 05:20:48,530
two different ones? Okay. Thank you. Okay.

5056
05:20:48,530 --> 05:20:50,799
Let me. Yeah. We're just voting on the

5057
05:20:50,799 --> 05:20:52,934
first one. Madam clerk, could you you opened it. Could you

5058
05:20:52,934 --> 05:20:56,534
please close it? Motion passes unanimously.

5059
05:20:58,540 --> 05:21:02,344
Thank you. And then the last one is to. a adopt an ordinance

5060
05:21:02,344 --> 05:21:06,147
rescheduling the May 7th, 2026 work session to May 18th, 2026

5061
05:21:06,147 --> 05:21:09,617
at 1 p.m.. So moved. Second.

5062
05:21:09,617 --> 05:21:15,156
Could you please open the vote, madam clerk? Could you please

5063
05:21:15,156 --> 05:21:17,156
close the. Vote?

5064
05:21:17,892 --> 05:21:21,362
Thank you. Passes unanimously. I'll finish the meeting out.

5065
05:21:21,362 --> 05:21:23,698
You can pass it back to me now. Okay. All right. Meeting

5066
05:21:23,698 --> 05:21:25,698
adjourned. All right.