>> my apologies. I would like to
call this meeting concerning
the new notice for the new tax law
to order and
you will make a presentation first?
>> yes or we wanted to
open up the public hearing that we
will have this afternoon, the first
one will
be on house bill 581
and will have a description in that
in a presentation first with any
questions that come after that. Once
we finish that we would go
on to the homestead
exemptions and annexation and talk
about the one acre law versus an
unlimited amount and go ahead
and describe
the for the public and take any comments
on that one also. Mayor, if
you would not mind we can go ahead
and and off
to our finance director who
would like to make a presentation
on hb 581.
>>
good afternoon.
>> good
afternoon.
>> so,
hb 581 is a bill that was
signed into law on april 18, 2024.
but it was contingent upon a referendum
that was recently passed
in november of in november 2024. It
incorporates three new
tax provisions.
so the first one is a revision of
the property tax procedures. The
second one is the lost or local option
sales
tax which limits,
their limits
and the
last one is the implementation of
the statewide floating homestead exemption.
this is the one most directly impacting
the taxpayer and the
one we're going to focus on today.
why is this important? So,
in response
to the substantial increase in property
taxes,
lawmakers decided that they wanted
to provide more certainty
for the taxpayers who were concerned
about the taxable value of
their homes. Under this bill the homeowner
will have a better idea of
the value of their home and
they will know
that it will not increase any more
than the cpi or
the inflation rate for the previous
year. This prevents
having large jumps in
property tax value and
thus, stabilizes the taxpayer's
annual bill.
so with the
558, 581 floating homestead exemption,
is going to apply starting
in 2025,
so this year. It will conclude
an adjustment factor
and the adjustment factor allows the
assessment of
homestead properties to rise annually
by the rate of inflation,
this exemption will be in addition
to the
other homestead exemptions, except other
base year value exemptions
such as the freezes or floats.
when a local jurisdiction has a base
value exemption already in place,
by law, the taxpayer must receive
the exemption
that is most beneficial. So that brings
us to why
we are here today. So, marietta currently
has a
floating homestead
exemption.
and as you can see, based on
these slides, they are very similar.
with two very distinct
, very important distinctions.
as
one of the pioneers in the state,
marietta
governing officials have been providing
this benefit
since 2002 and
this is one that allows for
a freeze. Again, setting itself apart
from other jurisdictions and agencies.
the
second more
important distinction is the homestead
exemption that was established
23
years ago does not include an adjustment factor.
this is what I mean
about freeze, the inflation rate,
unlike hb 581 is not
included in the marietta floating
homestead.
the exclusion of the adjustment factor
allows
the base year or the taxable
value amount to remain
the same, regardless of inflation
as long as the home is
still owned at the same property owner.
so let's look at a calculation
comparison.
example shows marietta homestead residence
with a net taxable value
of $350,000.
at the time the homestead
was implemented. So there
are questions we have received in
regards to whether or not
it is the value
that you purchased the property. It's
actually the value in which
the homestead exemption was implemented.
so in most cases when people purchase
a home,
they are purchasing a home that they
live in
and they apply the
homestead exemption. There are cases
where people may purchase a home that
may not be their
primary residence and later on the
transfer and that is their primary
residence. At
that point and time the freeze is
implemented. Okay? Taking the growth
tax value at 40%
which is
less and 40% less the fair market value
, the exemptions, leslie exemptions
and then less,
multiply that times the
millage rate and you will get your
net taxable value
for the amount you owe.
so let's walk through this one.
you have a fair market value, you
take that
and multiply
by 40% and that is going to give you
the taxable
home value.
in this instance on the first year
you purchased the home that's $350,000.
and then that is
in this particular assumption we
have already excluded any
additional exemptions.
typically there is a $4000 or $6000
state exemption with a disability,
it would be $6000.
so in this particular instance we
have taken
that out. You will multiply that
by the millage rate and it will give
you a tax bill
of $657. Now as we
fast forward five years, he
will look at a home that has no exemption.
the taxable value
is $425,427. Multiplied by the city
millage rate and you have a
taxable liability of $798.
for the same home if you are applying
hb 581,
your taxable value is
$386,335
. Apply the city millage rate and
you have taxable amount that is due
of 725. With the city
of marietta current floating
homestead exemption,
at a value of 250,000
, notice the amount does
not change. And that is in regards
to the freeze. With the state exemption
it does have an inflation rate so
you'll see the increase in taxable
value of
your home. Again, apply the
millage rate to the city's
taxable value and you will have
$657 of liability,
which is the same amount you paid
in
year one. Okay?
so, the opt out provision.
so, the
state requires local jurisdictions
to provide the most
beneficial option to the taxpayer.
the city of
marietta has already been doing that.
why are we
opting out? Opting
out allows the city to continue to provide
the best
options without having the additional
administrative costs. So,
by us opting out, we are
not changing our methodology, we are
not changing our
taxes that
are billed to the taxpayer, our
millage rate has remained
the same for quite some time.
as well as our exemption.
so what the city is currently
doing provides the best benefit to
the taxpayer
and that is why we are
choosing to opt out.
>> will you take
questions as we go?
>> certainly.
>> when you say we will do it,
you know now we have to advertise
and see there is a tax increase. We
will still
have to do what
is the law we came under. Make the disclosures.
>> that's required
under either option, yes sir.
>> yes,
so during the billing cycle we have
to go through and advertise and indicate
if we roll
back whether or not there is a tax
increase which would have been assumed
for the taxpayer, if we did not take
the new millage rate.
>> folks that have not seen that in
the past, basically it is saying
is the city taking in more dollars
overall, in
texas that year than they took in
the previous year without changing
the taxes. Because
we have development and things going
on in
the city we are taking in more money
on annual basis
then we did the prior year so the
state makes us go say it
is a tax increase when it really isn't,
the taxes do not change.
it is a revenue increase, that we
are getting
more revenue off the taxes
, but there are no individual taxes
being changed by the
city. And in fact
three years we reduced the taxes but
we were charging everybody as
far as the tax bill because we reduced
the bond millage on that.
it is something the state put
in place that is really kind of confusing.
when you have to state it
is so we usually put another ad that
goes
in the paper that lets everyone knows,
the city has not
changed the tax rate
and is not
increasing taxes and if you have a
homestead property, you will see zero
impact. You're
not going to have any tax increase
at all, if you
have commercial piece of property
you do,
the homestead property you could own
20 years
with us and not change taxes but they
will pay nothing different than they
paid 20 years ago.
>> if you don't, if you
interpret it. By the
city opting out, the non-homestead people
are the same either way.
>> yes sir.
>> we are not adding much
other than tax purposes
giving to homestead.
>> that's a good point, if you have
a commercial
piece of property with another residential
piece of property
are renting ports not primary residence
and you will see
no change.
>> so it would keep
, what we have been doing in the past
we
will continue to do. What we are seeing
is simply
what we have been doing is still better
than what the state is opting to do
currently for this bill.
so, if
you are a homestead, you have
a homestead property, that was
recently purchased or you sold the property,
once you sold the property,
the new homeowner would assume
the taxable value at that
point and time.
>>
yes, the overarching point
is the city in its infinite wisdom
20 some
years ago put
this in place and protected the homestead
property owners from the
increases and hardly anybody else
in the state
did.
so the other law is to do with everybody
else in the state that is
not have that protection and our protection
is better
than with the state has imposed.
>>
four counties out of 159.
I don't know if there is more. I don't
know, chatham
or, it was done local
.
to me we're not often
opting out,
they are opting in. 155 counties.
>> have a question. We don't know
what the county is doing at this point?
>>
we do not, that is a good point.
we have heard different things both
ways and I
cannot say for sure.
>> because that
affects the
total bill
.
>> well, it would not really
affect city bills.
>> not the city
bill but the homeowner pays.
>> the
county
is exempted, too like we are so
as far as the homestead properties.
the difference is, if you're in the
county, you have to pay
the fire fee so the fire fee would
not be regulated, if they opt
in sorry if they opt out then the
fire fee would
not have regulation on its. It would
continue to
do as it does now
and go up with appraisals. If they
opt in it would be subject to 3%
or whatever inflationary amount each
year
but the city residents will not feel
any impact either way.
>> I guess the point I was making,
the county still every two
years or three years whatever it is
come around. And evaluate.
>> yesterday. >> I have
38% increase this year.
>> hi 20s
and 30s.
>> not just me, whatever
I was in,
we were behind. And if
I may, this is, but the
county has, most
of the cities will probably opt out
from what I have
seen in the paper. The county has
things like the fire to consider.
they
have a lot more conservatory
property. You know,
to see how that's going to balance,
but boy I think they will say, the cities
don't tend to have large
aggregates under conservation.
>> they do
have until march 1 to file with
the state and declare one way or another
opting in or out. So I
am sure, as many have seen
the news, where so many different agencies
are starting to advertise and doing
exactly what we are doing, holding hearings
if they
are choosing to opt out.
>> so, mayor, however you want to
do this, if you want
to hand it over to [ name ] to do
the public portion or
if you would like to do it, however
you would prefer. On that, but the
presentation is finished.
>>
I think this is important enough of
an issue
to have a public hearing.
so everybody can have their say on
the record.
conduct a public hearing.
>> yes sir, this will be
a public hearing on hospital 581.
regarding the floating
homestead exemption. It appears that marietta may opt out,
anyone here who would like to speak on that
please come forward.
state your name and address and make any comment. Anyone?
mayor tumlin no one
would like to speak on this matter,
public hearing is closed.
>>
down here please. Nobody is
coming down.
what we just presented, is that on
our webpage?
>> yes we have
had it on the page.
we have a flyer that's on the page
that describes everything we went
through and it has the chart on it
with
those issues.
>> I apologize, state your name and
address please.
>> [ name
] 667 hampton place
marietta 30064.
thank you for the opportunity to
address you guys tonight. Just wanted
to make a few comments and make sure
we
have clarification, for the homeowners
in the city. With a few comments
made by, with the
calculation I think is what we are
trying
to understand.
the calculation will change but property
taxes may increase year-over-year
even though
the assessed value
also changes? So if I
look at my property tax, I'm sure
if you look at
mr. Goldstein's property taxes in
the last several years he has seen
increases and changes
in the homestead value as the assessed
value
goes up, but not everybody is afforded
the same opportunity. What I am trying
to
find clarification for is why does
my neighbor get a different
homestead floating exemption than
I do from one
year to the other and his taxes stay
the same and mine go up?
>> yeah, while there shouldn't
be any change because what should happen,
I was
able should happen if you're both
inside the city. Okay so
if you brought your property five years ago,
he bought his two years ago or three years ago whatever
the sales price value was at that time
that the county used, it would freeze at that point.
if you're getting a city tax bill
it's comp located because you have
city taxes
and you also have school taxes. The
school
taxes are not
, so if you look at just the
city portion, it should stay the same
if it's frozen at 300,000 or whatever
it should stay that way for your house
for 20 years. Unless the city goes
in and
changes the millage which the city
has not done since
around 2003.
so, that, although we have gone down
three times.
but yes it should stay the same the
entire time now
on the school portion that would've
gone up because when
the county goes to reappraise the
property as the mayor was talking about,
then it's going to make property tax
go up on that
site. Since the city bills for both
of those you get
one bill with school and city tax
on it
and that's why we have frequently
folks will come
to us
at meetings and
so you said my taxes did not go up
but they did, I was paying this,
now I'm paying this. And that is true
you are
paying more on that tax bill but the
portion going to the city did not
change.
>> I don't know that I would
agree with that and
I think mr. Tumlin mentioned something about
county taxes, my county taxes for cobb county homestead
exempt has remained the same for the last five years
since I owned my home since 2020.
so while I see that the line item remains the same,
because they make a floating adjustment
on homestead
exemption number, as my value increases
on my assessed value
, that number goes up
to remain
my tax bill the same.
however the city line item continues
to remain stagnant at 4000
or when you're going up to 40,000
and next year back
to 4000, my value continues
to increase some actual cost has risen
almost 40% in the last five years
since I have on my home.
>> that does not make sense at all.
>> it does not. Understand
city schools is going to have a hearing
tomorrow to discuss the
same thing. I do again see my
homestead exemption staying the same
at $4000,
but neighbors owning their home since
2016 with kids,
not of age 62 or older and
0they have adjusted homestead exemption
going up and down during the
same period.
so I'm trying to
get clarification for the homeowners
in the city to make sure everybody
is on the
same page because once everything
you stated
is not reality if you look at everybody's
tax bill.
>> since you are talking about the
4000, I think
we are talking about two different
things. And I will let
, come up, the 4000 is
not what we are talking about here.
we are talking about the actual valuation
of the property. And then you do have
other valuations that are changing
on the homestead
with state also that comes in and
has given relief at times
so that has changed a little bit too
>> real quick
the comments are seeing the city is
years advanced in terms of adopting
the floating
homestead exemption was the flotation
goes as your assessed value goes up you
it floats up
so your taxes remain the same. That's
the constant, I
understand that and I think that is
a better opportunity
than what the state may have provided
but I do see the
assessed value
, the homestead floating exemption
not rising at the same value as the
assessed value so you pay more taxes going above and beyond
the consumer price index inflation value year-over-year.
>> go ahead, that should not be happening.
>> what you should see on the tax bill is come
okay. This is cobb county.
>> the city is right here.
>> so, it is showing,
your millage rate, for marietta
. This is from the board of assessors, this
is not
your bill. Okay I see what it is now.
so you
are not paying this.
>> that is the estimate.
>> let me swing, so every year
the tax assessors around this time
will ask
, they will go release what the new
assessments are.
if you notice on that piece of paper
it will tell you this is not a bill.
so they
give an estimate, not always is that
inclusive of all the exemptions
that you have. In the
last couple years
we have worked closely
with the tax assessor office to get
that as close as we can
in providing the tax assessor office
with those exemptions in advance
of this notice going out. So you should see
, you will see increase in your
assessment, but he will also see increase
in the number of exemptions that you have.
homestead exemptions.
so that will increase,
to equal out to the base rate
or the value of the home when you
purchased it.
>> understand, and understand the
calculation process. However, I know
this is
just the notice I printed off online,
but
the bill like it in the mail
and the one that
I process right outside this building,
right outside this office,
is the exact same thing that is printed
on here.
unless I go through the process to
.
>> it
should not be exact because we found
a lot of inaccuracies in that over
the last couple years.
>> maybe
I have overpaid my taxes.
>> we are talking about inaccuracies
of the
tax assessor because it tells you
it is
an estimate.
>>
they have to do it way before any
taxes are set and so they
are guessing
at that point.
>> everybody else experiencing
the same thing
up here?
>>
in the prior years.
>>
get confused with
that notice.
>> understand it's a notice
and I'm not using this as hard facts,
but what
I paid in 2024 for property taxes
is what the notice stated, what I
paid 23 is what
the bill stated for city
school taxes.
>> what we
can do for you in the next 15 minutes
as I can have one of my staff members
sit and go through the computer
and pull up your true bill and show what you
paid and might see if there's a problem,
if there is we need to deal
with it.
>> again if
you look at the notices available
to the public will see it and
when asking people on my street or the neighborhood they
pay what they receive as the notice so
I see this consistently across the area that I live in.
>> I don't know, I can see the notice I get
each year is different from what I
am paying because when I get the actual
bill, it's different because we don't
put the notice out. We put
the bill out but let's look and see because
you should not have any change on that,
it should exactly be the same. I mean
I have been here 20 some years and mine has always been the same.
>> first two years it stayed the same and then the
value really started to increase in 22 and 23
and that's why the the floating homestead exemption
did not float at the same rate to
make sure my city taxes
remain flat. And
again, school
may be separate
and that's tomorrow.
>> that's the
question, you did the homestead application,
you applied with
the county office and you went to
the city office and applied?
>> it's
line itemed here so I assumed I did
both of them. Maybe that's where
the issue is but I don't know why
it would
be there if
I didn't apply for both.
>> we'll
figure that out for you. We'll go
ahead
and do that. We can do that probably
today.
>> appreciate your time. >>
thank
you.
>> the other two components of
the bill were
the 2010 bond issue. We haven't had
one
since then .
>> that's a good
point to mention.
>> if it goes up
30,000 then your exemption goes up
30. Is
there a
mechanical problem?
>> we definitely
look and see there. There would've
been two, depending
on what years we are talking about,
there would've been two times. I don't
know
when you bought property initially
but there would've been an additional
tax that would've been
added on because there were two different
bonds that voters approved. There
was a
parts bond that approved and added
tax and there was also redevelopment
bond that
was approved and added tax so that
would've been two years where it would've
gone
up even though your appraisal, from
our standpoint, would not have changed.
so we
can show that also.
>> I will also
like to bring up the
fact that the state issued
an additional exemption last
year up
to $18,000 that was not renewed
this year. So there will be a
differential there in the
taxes that you paid for
the $18,000 that's not exempted
from the state this year.
>> what
they did with that is they basically
took
our general tax that we would normally
charge and then they said we are
going to reduce it, everybody, everybody
in the state, and they said we are
going
to take our excess reserves that we
have and we are going to pump it
into the state and allow everybody's
tax
to go down a little bit this year.
so they did that and then
they didn't do it to the same amount
next year so it went up.
>> that was the year the rebates during
covid for
income tax.
they were flush with money so they
shared it with the homestead
people.
>> a real good thing.
>> public hearing is closed unless
there are
further comments. The public hearing
is closed.
>> mayor, we had the second
item we have on their which
is talking about annexation
and also the exemption that we have
right now on
school tax for 62 andover, which is
one acre at the current
time and the
discussion was whether we should possibly
extend
that and make that unlimited
if it's to a parcel that is owned
and
lived in by someone who can be under
the homestead
at 62 point currently the way it works
is if you have
10
acres or let's make it smaller. Let's
have five acres. You can only have
one acre of
that land
exempted if you're over 62. The rest
of
that property is taxed for school
tax. If you're in the county that
is not
the case. If you're in the city it
is. And so the discussion was
whether council should consider extending
that exemption over the entire piece
of property that
is the
one parcel, with multiple parcels
I guess you could combine
if you wanted to. But it
would be whatever is owned by that
homesteader and used by the homesteader,
not rental property or whatever else
that
we have. Anything else
you want to add to that?
>> does the
county have an acreage limits
at all?
>> they got a 10 acre. >>
they have a
10 acre. In another issue
when we were annexing, there were
some properties that say they had
six acres. The
city got them to put their residence
within one
acre and
--
>> the rest was
separated.
>> the rest were separated.
I think the way we mostly do it
is people --we would take a pro rata.
>>
that's what would happen if they didn't
put them on
separate parcels. And so
I know part of the discussion was
we have large blocks
of land that are adjacent to the city,
the annexing
the city
, but
we've heard that in the past where
they didn't want to do that because
of
the difference between what we had
in the county had on that. Because
they
would all of a sudden have to be paying
school taxes that they were not
currently.
>> I'd like to ask a question
for doug. We are an independent school
system.
we approved
there millage. It doesn't say
we have to rubberstamp it. According
both
to georgia law
and hours, but they had to make
the decision and would this be considered
a recommendation?
>> that's a real
good
question. We've got it actually in
our city code at this point as far
as
if you look at marietta city code
part five,
miscellaneous special laws, article
two, special tax exemptions, section
5.202. Homestead exemption for elderly
from ad
valorem taxation purposes. And it
talks about the
one acre, as used in this paragraph,
the term term homestand should have
the specified meaning
by law for state, county and civil
purposes
except that the term should
not include more than one acre of
land immediately surrounding
the residence of
the applicant.
>>
that's something we don't think
about much but the independent school
system, 21 of them, and we are
blessed to
have one, the recovery first, the
school system, they
are referring to the 159 county
school systems. Not private schools.
not independent
school system.
>> are you ready for
a
public hearing?
>> are there any facts?
there is a $400,000 difference that
would make this if we did it.
>> it
wouldn't make any difference
to us.
>> to the school system? >>
we looked at that in the
city. It's a guess.
>> based on those
residences that have applied thus
far and qualify for the
excess acreage, or greater than
one acre, with
the homestead properties, it's approximately
$150,000 when we
last checked.
there are additional properties that
may qualify
later on but we
don't know, due to the fact that they
have to meet the
age requirement and we don't know
what
the owner's age of older properties
may be
for those particular
properties that qualify from an acreage
standpoint.
>> as somebody
who was annexed into the city, they
would pay
more tax.
>> as
far as --
>> school tax. >> if they
were annexed to the city and they
were 10 acres
less, we did 10 acres, they would
pay whatever the difference is
between the county school tax but
they wouldn't pay anything. If they
were 62 andover
they wouldn't pay anything on the
school so they would come in to be
exempt from
the whole thing. If it was 15 they'd
have five would get but if
they are in the county they'd have
to pay. If we
did five than it just depends on the
size of
their parcel.
>> if it's limited to
one acre, they weren't [
inaudible ]
>> currently, I was thinking
if we did that change. Currently
that's the problem, yes
or.
>> they've got up to nine acres
extra that they've got to
pay for, that they would not pay for
in
the county. That is to discourage
people from annexing.
>>
18 mills, that's a lot of money.
>>
yes sir.
>> we did have that
problem somewhat with the large annexation
that we got on the east side of
town that we just did with beazer
homes now, that are
going on. That property was
a family property, as we are all aware,
and we talked
to them years ago
about annexing them and made them
want to do with that
particular time
because of the extra tax cuts once
they have. So they basically said
we'll just
wait until at some point, if some
revise it from us, wants to
develop it, then they can talk to
you. Thankfully
they did.
>> will you conduct the
public
hearing?
>> mayor tumlin and the city
council have authorized
a public hearing on item
20250027, on whether or not to increase
the
one acre
exemption to unlimited. If you would
like to comment on this, please
come forward and state your name and
address, and address the
city council.
>> it's good to
be here. I'm on this side.
my name is scott cochran and I'm a
new marietta resident at 546
saint john's court over
in
oakton. And this directly affect me.
it affects
a lot of my neighbors who are here.
our neighborhood is filled with lots.
they
are platted lots. They are numbered
as a single residential lot they are
over
and acre and
our people
, including myself, are getting older,
and we are to the point where we would
qualify for this, due to age. I told
somebody the other day, one of
the on the good things that I found
out so far about getting older is
maybe I'll get a homestead exemption.
I can't think of anything else that
happened.
mr. Mayor, I think you hit the nail
on the head. This
to me seems a
lot like the first issue you guys
had. I was dealing with this, too.
a lot of the cities are. One of the
benefits, the best benefit I've seen
that I think one of the best benefits
of being in cobb county is
living in the city. The cities just
provide more services. They have more
grassroots government.
it's just
better. And
I think one of the reasons you guys
have on the agenda,
the other issue to opt out of the
statewide thing is because what you
already
do is better. Right? It's just that
are. It's that way for the other
cities that had to float an exemption
but what you guys agreed to do
years and years ago was better than
what the state now has agreed to do.
so you opt out of that but
this is a similar thing. But it's
a little bit different because times
have changed
so you guys have your own school board,
you're
the only city in the county that's
got its own school
system, right? But now there's a tax
benefit for residents
as far as school taxes
are concerned for residents living
in the county over
residents living in the city of marietta.
and when you said about somebody being
annexed so if someone lives
on a five
acre site in cobb
county and they
get annexed in marietta,
right now the way your law is set
up, that's a
huge disadvantage because they go
from being exempt from cobb school
taxes
to having to pay marietta school taxes.
that's a disincentive for people to
live in
the city. And I know that the cities
--I think all of them,
I learned a lot in the discussions
about what cities
offer over and above what the county
offers,
and this is the only thing that I've
seen out there that's just
a disconnect. This is one of the
few things
where county residents have an advantage
over city residents. As a practical
matter, I don't
think it's going
to cost
the school system any money. I don't.
I heard the $100,000 or
so estimate but the problem with that
I think is that people can come in
and carve out
some of
that. They can carve out, somebody
lives on a
five acre tract, they can come in
and carve out for acres and one
acre, and get it replanted, and usually
what's remaining is going to be a
lot less valuable than where the house
is built. Where we are, there's creeks
and things running through, so our
excess property is on buildable. It's
nice to
have but it's on buildable. It's not
worth the same as the property where
the
houses are. So somebody did a deep
study, I don't
think it's going to cost any money
to the
school system. You
know what you guys have known here
is fantastic.
the way the squares operate now, and
thriving. The way
the neighborhoods, your oversight
zoning and annexations is great. This
is just
something that I think needs to be
fixed,
and I don't see
really
any downside
and I think is consistent with other
things
that you are doing. That's my two
cents. I didn't ever expect to be
here on this side of
the podium but I
am. I'll tell you guys, I'm very happy
to be a marietta resident now. I
appreciate all of you.
>> thank you.
the closed session,
what was the date on that?
>>
it's old. Things have
changed.
>>
you give 10% off the top to the school
system. This thing
we chiseled out other things.
>> 1980. >> 1980? >> yes sir. >>
one year out of
high
school.
>> bill
w was around 12 mills and when the
state around 1980 raises it 20, we
must have been --I just think
I'm real curious, not
many things we let
the county leave to someone
as far as taking care of taxing.
>>
I'll say I'm not exactly sure it's
1980, but the way it phrases it, it
says the exemption provided for all
years
beginning after december 31st, 1980.
that's referring
to 1980. When it was
passed.
>> so that was done in 1979.
>>
mr. Mayor?
>>
yes sir.
>> it looked like it was
an amendment to the constitution that
allowed it to happen back in
1980 because it refers back to a georgia
law, 1980,
page 2123.
>> two
jurisdictions side-by-side. Mr. Wills,
your next.
>> larry wills,
60 oakmont drive, marietta, georgia.
I'm going to read a statement
and then turn it in as
part of the record for this
public hearing. I'm reading it because
this is kind
of complicated. I
have long relayed to the marietta
city council the importance
of maintaining
a low density residential buffer around
kennesaw mountain national park. Numerous
studies over the
years reveal such buffers provide
a vital transitional zone between
development
areas and national parkland. So
far my diss suggestions have
fallen on deaf ears. At the
december 19 committee meeting, the
city
council released
ledger
star 20241136. This document revealed
another threat to
kennesaw mountain I had not
previously considered. Waitlisted
150 properties greater than
one acre currently receiving school
tax exemptions.
a school tax exemption is available
to any
owner-occupied property owner 62 years
of age or
older, but the school tax exemption
is granted for no more than
one acre of
a multi-acre parcel. Apparently
the
150 parcels were receiving exemptions
for
their
entire acreage, for how long, I don't
know. The
exemption amounts range
from $36-$7000. 28
range between $1000 and $5000. The
remainder
range between $36 and $998. Most of
the large parcels
have developed as a type of defective
density buffer
adjacent to and
in close proximity to
kennesaw mountain. If
you look at the street addresses,
they are most around,
right up against the mountain. It
is
assumed that these parcels will be
reappraised to correct
this mistake and will motivate some
property owners to subdivide
and develop
their property
to relieve their new tax burden. Instead
of suddenly hitting these property
owners
with higher taxes, the city council
and/or the
impacted residents have several
possible actions
. They
could establish a low-density zoning
buffer around the park and offer a
property tax exemption
to all property owners who agree to
manage their property
in accordance to buffer standards.
the other option
for residencies the formation of a
special
taxing district.
state statutes authorize special
taxing districts
and specify their powers and
duties, governance, structure, and
other things that regulate
their
land-use and they could also
enforce building codes among other
items.
special assessment programs include
landmark historic
property, may qualify for
preferential assessments where the
property has been certified by local
government as
landmark heritage property
and where local
ordinance extend the
preferential assessment. Special
taxing districts. There are other
special assessment programs
available to
property owners whereby property can
be reassessed at its current
use value rather than the fair
market value.
qualifying properties must be maintained
and that the current use for a period
of
10 years. These special
programs include environmental sensitive
property,
forest land
property, and
something
else. Residential transitional
properties. These properties can be
assessed
at its current use value rather than
fair market value, when it is used
for
residential purposes but located in
an area that
is changing to or
being developed for a use
other than residential. It's my
belief that
some of these actions
are not taken to create a low-density
buffer around
kennesaw mountain national battlefield
park. I fear that in 20 years or so
the roofs
of townhomes will replace the tree
canopy
in marietta and extend right up to
the
park's boundaries
. Two things are already foreshadowing
the looming degradation of
the parkland. Traffic is backing up
all the way from barrick parkway
to the park's
trailhead and trail crossing on bert
hickory, and a little
over a month ago a deer struck my
daughter's car
at the
intersection of polk street and burnt
hickory,
causing $6000 in
damages. These situations and other
negative
impacts to open space
enjoyment will only increase if action
is not taken.
thank you.
>> next speaker, anyone
else that would like to address this
matter? Please come forward, raise
your hand. City council, the public
hearing
is closed.
>> we
would have two more public hearings.
we'd have one at our next meeting,
our regular
meeting, which will be coming up in
two
weeks
and then we would have one in our
community meetings in february. And
then at
that committee meeting in february
that would be a special called meeting
by the
mayor if the mayor so chose and could
be voted on at that particular time,
since we would have two handy in our
decision before march 1st.
>>
and the next 20s --
the next public hearing is when?
>> it's our committee, the 12th. The
regular
council meeting
.
>> [ inaudible ] work session? >>
it's actually going to
be at 6:30 before the 7:00 council
meeting on wednesday.
>>
well then I'd like
to adjourn
the
meeting and turned the ball
over. Which one are you?
>> at this
time I'd
like to call the finance committee
meeting
to order. The first item is to
approve the
minutes from december 19th.
>> I'll
make a motion
to approve the revised minutes that
we have a copy of on our desk.
>> second. >> all those in favor say
by
raising your hand.
>> all
right. So moved.
>>
all right. The next item on the
agenda is --are the
hotel motel
tax and --did we
take all four of those?
>> yes or.
I can take all
four of those together. The
first one is
the hotel/motel. The december collections
are the highest they have been
in the last four year
period, with the collections of
december at 274,000. The year to date
collections are comparable to
the 2023 --sorry, the 2024
numbers. So your debate, so we are
still in line as we have been
for the prior year. For the auto
rental, the total for the month
is $170,877. If you
remove the payments from the november
that I reported on
last month's presentation, stating
that there were some payments that
came
in late, so they were reported in
december. If
you remove those and reassign them
back to november
you'll have 128,000 for the month
of
december. So the year to date collections
are about $30,000 less than
last year. And we
continue to exceed the budgeted collections
by almost 31%. The
current year to date collections,
and this is total collections between
the two, are not
as great but they are still higher,
24%
higher than
fy '23, year to date. So although
we are not exceeding
the '24 numbers, we are exceeding
'23. And the consumer reports indicate
that we were
kind of looking at some of the aspects
of the auto
rental and rideshare has had an impact
on that as well as
the
overall economy
is slowing so we are trying to take
a
look at that and see how that is trending, and
how that will go forward,
and how we will implement that into
the '26 budget. Then we'll have the
finance report, I'll take the finance
update and a quarterly report all
at once. The quarterly report, if
you look
on
page 4, for the revenue, total revenue
is 61%
to budget, primarily to the property
tax deadline that was back in october.
so we've received about 94% of
property tax collections.
why oldie
personal property taxes is lagging
behind, so that's only a
52% collection. So we will work on
that
as we get closer to the end of the
fiscal year. There
is a positive uptick in the commercial
and residential
building permits over prior
year and that's a good sign for construction
as we go into the spring and
summer months, all the way into fall.
business
license revenue will increase as
we are currently in
the renewal
season. So the next couple of months
will be the heaviest portion
of renewal season for business license
and that revenue will show for the
end
of q3. And
then
lastly, all all
other revenue areas such as charges
for services, fines, and other transfers,
are all in
line as we look at through period
six, where
approximately 50% through
the budget. And then same with the
expenditures.
there is no big markers for
the expenditures.
we are able --it seems most of the
departments
are able to utilize their capital
funds. Previously we've had a delay
in that,
being able to receive products. We
haven't seemed to have that issue
this year so we've
been able to move through those funds
and
encumber those fairly quickly, so
we are in line
with that, as well. And that concludes
my report.
>>
so do
we need
a motion?
>> you need a motion to
receive
and file, which I
so make.
>> are
we adjourned?
>> nothing else on the
finance report?
>> call to order
the personnel insurance committee.
on our
agenda
is the
amendments from the december 19th
meeting. Do I hear a motion?
>>
I'll make a motion to approve the
meeting minutes.
>> second. >> revised
copy.
>> the minutes have
been revised.
at the top I changed
it.
>>
over
here.
>> the revised agenda.
meeting minutes.
>> second. >> all
in favor. Thank
you, joseph.
appointed officials compensation
and contracts?
>> hr direct
are coming
down.
>> good evening. I'd like
to request that we move this to a
brief executive session, if that's
okay?
>> that would be the end
of tonight, I guess do that as part
of
the general council
session.
>> anybody
got a problem with
that?
okay. So we are moving on to the ethics
committee council
report .
>> yes or. You've got, as
you can see down there, you've got
two different ones .1 is
the mayor
's appointment, which would be
next, this one is the council appointment.
we currently do have individuals serving
in both
of those seats at the current time.
from what we can tell, both of them
would be willing to continue on that.
but they both run out in the
next two months so the first one,
like I said, is the one kelly is
serving in currently and that's a
two year term go until 2027.
>> and
I make a motion to approve michelle
cooper kelly
to another two year term?
>> second. >> all in favor? The next
one, the mayor's
of point.
>> I've got a question on
this one. Are these once supposed
to be voting
on this or is this
the mayor's power on this one?
>>
that's a good point.
this one probably is the delineation
that he wants to put this person on
their and we will just be put on directly
onto the
agenda so if he decides that he wants
to move forward
with this, probably stick it under
mayor's appointment.
>> okay. How
about
civil-service board?
>> sir,
that one is a
little bit different in that you've
got the actual civil-service board
recommending
that you
reappoint philip hynninen to the civil-service
board to. That is a one
year term which will expire in 2026.
as y'all remember, because of state
law
changes, any time a
board has someone that they have the
ability to
appoint to their board, they
have to get concurrence by the
council.
>> okay. Could I make a motion
to
reappoint philip hynninen?
>> second.
>> all in
favor? That's unanimous.
>> question, for the
council ethics and for
this one is consent okay?
>> you.
that's good.
and then we are adjourned subject
to the --
>> recess probably, right? >> or recess
subject to
the
--
>> prior report as well, it's up
to you.
>>
the mayor's. We can't
do [
inaudible ].
>> we'll
--
>> recess, I
guess, until after the
meeting.
>> thank you. >> so
I'm going to call the parks,
recreation, and tourism committee
meeting.
first up is to approve the
minutes from december 19.
>> I'll
make
a
motion.
>> as amended. >> as
amended.
>>
I second.
>> all
in favor?
>> all right. So next up
is going to be our 2009 parks bond
report.
mr. Chairman, good evening,
everyone. Report
starts with the financial, as usual.
we earned $522 of interest
last month, which is considerably
less than
we had been
but that's because we spent almost
all the money now. We paid out a good
bit on wildwood park so we still have
some money at
this time but that's why you see a
reduction from that high
thousands to 2000 a month that leaves
us over $101,000 in
available balance we can allocate
comedies on other projects once we
finish
that wildwood project up
entirely point all
we are lacking now is the restroom.
we've done all the other work
out there that we have scheduled,
that you all are signed up and all
the other
work
is complete. As I pointed out in a
prior
meeting, I think it's been very popular
out there and we actually had the
december data that we got off the
place for a I and in the month
of december last year we had about
833, if I
recall correctly, at wildwood park
this year we had a little over
2400. So you can attribute most of
that to
the disk golf players that are
out there . It was pretty decent,
obviously
this month not as good but I was out
there on a 30, 40 degree
day. There were people out playing
so they're enjoying it.
let's see . We do get the fully executed
project
unit from the state of georgia for
the land and water conservation fund
rent
so we are allowed now to proceed with
all activities with the west
dixie park project.
with that and permission we've gone
ahead and begun ordering
the restroom, which takes some time
to get in
production, so it will be here
for us so we can get all the other
construction work complete. We
are also looking at getting a bid
out for the playground equipment ahead
of schedule so we can get that done
and then we are still working
over our stormwater issues with them
so we don't have a
full set of construction documents
ready to go
to read
that we should have that within the
next two or three weeks, I would imagine,
and then we can get those bid documents
prepared.
>> questions? I
think councilwoman richards has
a
question.
>> you
talked one time about doing a ribbon-cutting
at
wildwood.
>>
yes ma'am.
>> are we going to plan
that for
june?
>> I was thinking maybe
late march, if that works with
everyone. I was going to look into
your schedules to see if you were
involved
in any national meetings, and I haven't
done
that yet. Or it is still a little
cold, we can do
it a little bit later. We are still
online to have the restroom shipped
in mid-february, so that could take
five meetings, it could take
two weeks. So I'm thinking only a
three day installation,
probably early
march. We are getting ready to order
a clack so that's why we are wondering,
what do we put on the plaque
for the dedication date and today
I'm saying we could just put spring
rather
than a month but if, you know, we
want to push
it back a little bit into april or
something or whatever you want to
do, we can do that.
>>
if you want to talk about it and let
us know what you think
I'm a that would
be great. But I wouldn't do it before
the end of march because I just
don't feel secure about the restroom
building to that last
couple weeks. That's really what we
were kind of waiting on.
>>
anymore questions?
>> okay, thank you. That concludes
my parks bond report.
>> if there are no questions, so we
are going to
move on
to the recreation facilities quarterly
report
>> I'm going to turn
that over to aaron.
>>
thank you.
>> how are you doing, man?
>>
I'm good. How are you doing? Good
evening everyone. Just before I
start my report I want to take a moment
to recognize one of our staff
members. So we found out last week,
hunter
keyser, who is one of our recreation
specialist,
custer park
sports
and fitness center, is being recognized
as one of the top 30 young parks and
recreation of nationals under the
age of 30 in the nation. That's the
30
under 30. That's a cool recognition
for him.
several
applicants across 27 states so it's
a big accomplishment for him. So hunter
does a
great job for him and of course we
are very appreciative to the national
recreation and park association for
recognizing hunter. So if you see
him, congratulate him for
that. As far as the reports, so this
is the report for the second
quarter and this is for custer park
sports and fitness center, parks program
and the
franklin gateway sports complex. So
for the quarter you have your reports.
custer park
sports and fitness center had a total
of 3800 attendees for all of our activities
throughout the quarter. Gross revenue
was almost $142,000 for
the quarter. Versus a little
over $120,000, versus the second
quarter, last
fiscal year. The parks program is
currently closed for the season and
then
we will open on friday, may 2nd. We'll
open for the year
for that. The sports complex
had 45,286 participants this last
quarter so we stay busy
out there and the majority of those
were
soccer rentals. The total
gross revenue at the sports complex
per
quarter
was $16,656 and of course that
was down a little bit for the quarter.
so a
lot of that had to do with organizations
last
year that
didn't [ inaudible ] for various
reasons. Some of those had events
during the first quarter, the second
quarter. So some
of that was timing. And then as previously
mentioned in other reports,
last year we changed our billing model
to pay
in advance of that, as well. If you
remember back
in the first quarter
report for franklin, we were up
about $46,000 in the first quarter
so some of it is just
timing, just
looking forward, starting in february,
we don't
have a day without a rental giveaway
until june 15th
and we'll continue to fill those up.
also, this course,
this is the third quarter in january.
this january versus last january was
almost double
so we are continuing to
do well there. Program-wise with our
youth basketball league and custer
park sports and fitness
center, we are wrapping up over the
next few weekends. We'll have our
season end
tournament. This year we had 259 players
versus 231 players last year, so
we had a good increase there. And
then special event-wise,
of course we had fourth in the park
this
year, harvestfest and our christmas
tree lighting. The next large event
for the city
will be marietta the gathering. That
will be saturday, march 21st. That
includes our report.
>> thank
you so much. Do we have any questions
for eric?
>> I'd add
two things that
are not messerli at the rec center
but a couple projects you may
be interested in. We have
that pipe
project at city club, we had our funds
for. That's 80% complete.
there out there working. They hope
to be done by friday but
the rain
the last week or
so and impending rain on friday, I
think that will be next week before
they get it all buttoned up but that
is going on very well. It came
at a good time when it was cold. We
had the greens covered. No
one could play golf so no interruption
to the players during that period.
than the
second thing you notice that glover
park on the that barricade for some
time.
we had the drainage project that you
did at the playground, back in the
playground area. We did eventually
get to a pipe that was completely
jammed up with roots.
that has all been removed. The pipe
has been replaced and then we got
a new --a couple new spots at the
end of that pipe, and new
cleanouts that we put in,
a tap box
actually that we put in so that we
can get it in the future, should
that arise again. Pike electric is
up there, still doing their electrical
work
and rewiring all the light
poles, a little bit of collateral
damage, irrigation lines, so we expect
that to be done
and we may expect that to push off
once
we energize. I don't think
we have anything that anyone can handle,
just a couple things that
were unexpected.
>> so I guess next
up is going to be the
street closures.
>> a disclosure for
us,
disclosure
first.
>> members of
my family, I myself
and members of my family owned properties
in the downtown area. On a member
of the
cobb naacp and that I serve on the
port of the marietta visitors bureau
serving the city
of marietta. And that polish a, my
aunt, is on the [
inaudible ].
>> thank you. Appreciated. This is
the
annual street closure request, before
I give you any details on either of
them you
might see two that you think are missing.
one is marietta the gathering. Of
course we just dealt with that last
month because of the timing of the
event
coming up in march and needing to
be done, and rather than putting it
on
now for 2026, we'll just wait until
later in the calendar year, again,
like
we just did this last time as
a one-off. And the other one you might
be wondering
about is the cherokee heights arts
festival. This particular request
here are only the
ones that come through special event
applications and actually use glover
park in the downtown
square. That was done separately off
of what we call a
parade permit. It's come through a
different mechanism so
they will be coming back for that
street closure for you at a
later date, sometime probably early
summer if not late spring. So those
two are
on our radar. They just
aren't on this particular report so
I just wanted to bring that
up. So all the other events on here
are repeat events. Everything that
we've
had in the past, and
there are only two changes,
street closures that have all been
previously approved. One of them is
from juneteenth and
they requested the northpark square
be closed this year. In
the past, I point out on
friday night, on friday nights they've
always
had a concert and they have had
the concert in east park square
and its
gotten very popular. And by closing
northpark
square we get more opportunity for
patrons to come and sit and enjoy
the music.
that was their request. We are extending
that because of the location of
the restrooms that are along the courthouse
on lawrence
street with patrons imbibing and all
the back-and-forth traffic that
goes
across their. And I think I just got
that wrong. They did not have east
park four
point they were asking for north and
we are recommending east
as well because of that traffic
that goes back and forth in that crosswalk,
and lack of management there. And
also with moore park closed down,
we
would expect it from lawrence street
down to waddell, like
we do with other events, because that's
where the police put the security
barricades,
to keep
people
from running up lawrence street and
then on to the northpark square that's
closed. So
we actually added onto their request
and we are recommending that we do
north
and east
.
>> what event was that? >> that's
for juneteenth and it's
the friday night. You know they do
a friday, saturday and sunday event.
friday is
when they have a big concert. Folks
come up and it's similar to our
friday night concerts that we do and
they're just kind of trying to get
to that point and the parks are jammed
up full so this gives
them an opportunity and we are recommending
the additional street for safety.
the other request
was from the organizers of art in
the park and they have historically
closed 5:30 on
friday on
north park east and south
and asked to
close that at 4:00, and there is a
letter attached from carolyn, why
she thinks that needs to be done.
I
can tell you we've had some additional
conversations since then. We don't
necessarily agree 100% the logic that
was there but we
do understand she has some interesting
closing earlier and
some needs and we think it would be
more appropriate
than to close
all those streets at 4:00, as she
has requested, or even at 5:30, to
do northpark
at 4:00, south park at 5:00, and east
park at 6:00. What that does
is add a one hour block to each of
the sections and this is how
it works with chalktoberfest. Having
done that the last couple years has
proven to
be a much better method for us to
close the streets down that
way . One of the things we don't want
to do
is tell anybody, so we close it down
and there is an additional half an
hour then on that particular street
to get the cars out of there. The
cars aren't even, the
police can check the license antagonist,
get a name, maybe a phone number to
call.
we can go to a restaurant on that
street, try to find those people
and get them out of there. To try
to do that on all three of
those streets at one time while people
are trying to manhandle barricades
for the
traffic department and our staff trying
to get out cones doesn't work well
so it's
really better off for us, we found,
if we did one block
at a time. Know
carolyn would love to put that up
at 2:00, 3:00 and 4:00. We are
recommending 4:00, 5:00 and 6:00 from
a staff perspective and she is amenable
to that.
carolyn is here if you have to ask
her any
questions. That would be the recommended
change if you
are amenable to doing it earlier than
5:30. It makes it flow and then it
keeps the northbound traffic on atlanta
street
open until 6:00 against that
northbound rush-hour extra time, even
over the 5:30, which
they've had the past 30 some years,
so
it actually helps out on that side.
>> okay,
so do we need to vote on that?
so first
item that we'll entertain a motion
for would be the northpark square
to be closed and also the east park
square to be closed for juneteenth
could do we
have a motion?
>> I'll make
a motion. To make
the closure of those streets.
>> okay.
>> following the staff's recommendation.
>>
from a point of order I guess on this,
rather
than individual motion, should we
do that way or try to
do one motion, incorporate all the
changes and
move on?
>> okay, good
enough.
>> all right, and then approve
everything.
sounds good.
>> I was going to ask
on
that because the way the motions were,
one item at the end
of this, should there be a
base motion
to approve, deny, or something like
that, and have motions to do the other
changes, something like that?
>> you
can do it either way. I think with
the chairman wants to do is do
these one at a time and have a global
motion at the end.
>> so
it's been moved and properly seconded
on the juneteenth recommendation.
we'll move
on to --all
in favor?
>> started
at 6:00.
>> 6:00,
yes
or.
>>
one of these we had different times?
>> all of the events
have some different times. This particular
case here with juneteenth is different
than the
park, yes. So all the other events
have their individual listings in
the memo.
all of them are the same as what we've
always done in the past few
years. Only juneteenth and our department
are different.
>>
we put the bus down all the way at
oak
street or [
inaudible ]?
>> I don't know. >> we've
got five
very viable businesses on
church street that we haven't had
in
the equation.
>> for juneteenth
we wouldn't be touching that.
no.
>>
talking about the ones come after
6:00 I think it's fair game.
>> the juneteenth wouldn't be touched
at all.
>> open it for somebody, or
it's detrimental to somebody. The
same 24/7.
>> true,
it
does.
>> this would
take it.
>> I don't have --probably
juneteenth --
>> that's what we are voting on
is the juneteenth.
we voted okay on that.
>> that was
north
and east.
>> I did
failed to point out one other thing
in our park and that was the
closure on
west park. Excuse me
a second.
that was just to move that up a little
bit, a half
an hour, actually the street closed
at 10:00. Before the street would
close
at 9:00 but the people in the parking
spaces would
not have to leave until 9:30. So it's
a half an hour earlier than what
it was but it would allow those folks
having dinner to have until 9:30 to
get out of that west parkside. Just
a one half hour
change their. We will stop the traffic
just because the people don't come
in
and dive into spots as they open up
some better management for the police
and
traffic. Okay.
>> so that motion then
would be for the art in
the park to close at 4:00, 5:00
and 6:00.
>> northpark at 4:00, south
park at 5:00, east park at 6:00 and
then westpark would
be closed
, the street at 9:00, parking spaces
at 9:30.
>> okay. Are we good with that? All
in
favor?
>> 4:00 on
northpark.
>>
[ inaudible ] but the city does a
good job
of keeping [ inaudible ]. Before,
we were
trapped in. Especially to go down,
for them to
sell products to do harm to other
businesses, it's like being against
santa claus
or the
easter bunny.
why can't the northside be last?
>>
northside
be last? You know I
guess because
--
>>
[ inaudible ]
>> it's just not seen
as a through route,
like south park, where you are trying
to get over to dallas
highway and down roswell, where you
can go around
the park on northpark. If people are
coming, they can go west,
they can go south, they can go east
and get deck around. It's a little
bit easier detour than what people
would encounter if we did south park
before northpark.
>> just
want
it later?
>> keep in mind this is
a request
so it can be dealt with the way you
deem appropriate.
>> [
inaudible ]
>> what do you want us to do? >> and
also
when you close
that, we are going to have [ inaudible
] restaurants, if we
[ inaudible ]. If you can't get the
trucks in there and stuff,
I've seen delivery trucks
and
trash when they had one of
them open. And I think every one of
them will be
very successful.
you know
they're not [ inaudible
] anymore. We hadn't cut a
deal with the baptist church, we got
that place, but hansen street is basically
closed.
>> we are having some
ongoing discussions. They do have
something that we are going to need
to bring back
to discuss. Hopefully we are going
to solve that in
the future. We won't be immediate,
that's for
sure.
>> I'm
talking about we have problems,
that's better than a
deserted square. But I think the change
is coming.
>> do
you think moving the times a little
bit
would help?
>> I really
can't offer --you are either going
to do it or not so I
guess --I'd like
to encourage or keep some of the traffic
flowing well on reed street
and hensel. Because it
does bottleneck
. Could be closed
around 4:00, too.
>> cherokee would
not close until 6:00.
>> 6:00. You
can take
it uninhibited on the cherokee street.
>> it closes up to
hensel. Yeah.
>> and you would still be
able to flow through our --
>> you
can still flow-through hensel and
get
back on cherokee and you would be
able to go on westpark until
9:00 p.m.
>> just with all
this smaller streets open as we
close them.
>> one section of route
will
be closed.
>> between northpark
square and hansen would be closed
at 4:00.
>> it wouldn't
affect --
>> [ inaudible ]. >> it wouldn't affect
you leaving.
you just wouldn't be able to get into
northpark to turn on from wood
street. You
can leave from
the parking spaces back behind the
wall from your place.
>> I'm just
talking about
going home.
>> we have carolyn here
if she wants to answer anything in
particular.
>> folks have had to get
them before.
>> definitely would
want to keep that
portion open. Wouldn't be able to
enter from
the square.
>> on talking about
15 cars
>> really we would just lock
it at
the square and he wouldn't have any
other blockage,
right?
>> root street would be
blocked at sugar cakes.
>> and that's it? >> that's it. Nothing
beyond their.
>> that's what I'd like
to clear
up. Apologize .
>> I
wonder what the problem is.
>> two
thirds of our parking lot our uninvited
guests.
>> you. >> I don't want to be sued
by somebody
that's trespassing.
>> we wouldn't
be putting like
until 9:00 there wouldn't be anything
blocking church
so that everybody would be able to
go
around.
>> they wouldn't even be blocking
at 9:00. The traffic would still be
able to get down to middle street
right there. It would just be that
block from
mill street forward on that friday
evening.
>> blocking those restaurants
and all them.
>> they will still be open. >>
every business has a [
inaudible ]. We are committed
to the baptist church parking
there, too.
>> we'll provide that
access
as we
have been.
>> so do me a favor. Let's
restate
or art in the park, what we're doing
so it will be on record and
then we'll get a total group on both.
>> the friday
night closures would be northpark
square at 4:00, south
park square at 5:00, east park square
at 6:00 and westpark square at
9:00 p.m... Then the
saturday
and sunday
--saturday,
sunday, monday stay the same as they
have been in the past. Nothing has
changed so what's in the memo would
be correct and I can provide a
revised memo for the council meeting
that details what we
just discussed.
>> okay. So I guess
what we'll do now, all in
favor of approving what is brought
before us for the
juneteenth and also art in the
park. Do we have a motion? All
in favor?
>> were you going to
use his motion?
>> we'll just
use
--
>> [ inaudible ] motion on
his wording.
>> moved and seconded.
all in
favor?
passes 3-0.
>> point of inquiry
on this. Now a full thing,
although closures.
>>
those are the
two changes. Are they full
closure lists now?
>> we'll now make a
motion to approve
all
of the closures that we discussed
for juneteenth and also art
in the park. Do we have a motion?
all of them. A
whole list.
>> I'll add there are
those
three events on there that also request
the permission for
alcohol sales, oktoberfest,
art in the park and taste of marietta.
that would be in
the motion as well.
>> we'll use that
motion that rich just
talk about for all of the events that
are scheduled. Do
we have a motion for that?
>> I'll
make a motion
for approval for all of the items
that we just
discussed, including juneteenth
and art in the park.
>> it's been
moved
and seconded that we are
going to approve everything. All
in favor?
passes
3-0. Everybody good
with consent?
>> would you like to vote the
consent or weight and have the revised
memo? How would you like to handle
that?
>>
I provide one anyway, whether you
move it or not.
>> let's
check just
to see so we can get out
of here.
>> five, four,
three, two, one.
>>
no comment.
>> so we
are good.
>> okay. And I'll revise all that.
>> just revise
it, bring it back. Perfect.
thank you. Any other
things that need to come before parks,
creation,
and tourism? We
are adjourned.
>> okay. I call to
order the judicial legislative
community. First item
of business will be the revised
minutes.
>> a motion to
approve?
>> got a motion and a second.
any questions, comments, or concerns?
hearing none, all
in favor? All right. We've
got three plus one person who doesn't
know what he's doing.
the next item
of
business --I
lost
it. The next item of business is zoning
code amendments.
>> I'm
going to turn that over to mr. White
and
ms. Little.
>> the legendary
ray stevens saying it's me here, margaret.
I'm here I'm back on the
zoning amendment. We discussed this
in december after we discussed it
a
couple months before december and
this time I
tried
to summarize just a reminder
of the purpose of the changes for
the zoning
amend vent.
the amendment to the zoning ordinance
in the first place, that's the first
three items,
is just to remind you of what this
is about, why this got started
in the first place. And then items
1
through 6 are the changes I made based
on
feedback I got last month and these
were sort of
also sent to shelby
and rusty and I think
shelby had to mention a couple things
that I also incorporated
that were consistent with what was
brought up in the
last meeting. I can go through those
individually if you want but hopefully
you've had
a chance to look at them and I did
want to point out at the end there
was a request
made that alternative language be
proposed for those two
sections. So let me just address maybe
it is helpful to go back and
remind you
but the three main categories that
we are addressing in this
amendment are to adopt a
distinction between the zoning decisions
and because I judicial
decisions that's enacted in the cpl.
we
are also updating and enacting the
procedures and
policies for council bza and planning
commission that were required by the
cbl and
then updating the appeal portions,
the judicial review portions
so that's the main purpose. Then you will
see each one of these things,
in
section 1
, this is what rusty had pointed out
to me right before the
last meeting so I added it to this
one that their language and
704 06 probably needed to be updated.
it was old language that
really was talking about variances
but calling them special exceptions.
so I just updated that
section
to reflect the language that we are
adopting
now about zoning decisions and
quasijudicial decisions
. I'll just go through these all quickly
and you
can come back and ask me questions
about them. But number two, the second
change
we made after the last one was to
update the language about temporary
buildings,
to incorporate the language. There
is one correction noted last time
and then also we
noted there was a recommendation that
we could clear the temporary buildings
while there
is an act of
construction permit.
we talked back and forth about vacancies,
automatic
vacancies on the planning
commission at the bza. I lined those
up to reflect the things you agreed
on, which I think we watched
the meeting, what we
could tell, there is general agreement
it could be three meetings within
a year, a
calendar year, that would trigger
an absence. There never seemed to
be any consensus
about whether that's automatic or
who decides what just cause is or
anything
like that. I left that language in
there about without just cause in,
because there wasn't a consensus.
but there is a proposed alternative
language on the
second page that would make a referral
to council
and you can --basically what
the alternative language
says actually amounts to a resignation
but that resignation
is forwarded to you so you can
decide whether to accept it or find
there was just cause were not. So that's
kind of the in between or compromise
language I
offered their for that suggestion.
and then in
section nine,
there is a category of decisions that
were able to be appealed to
the bza. That
change was made based on recommendation
from
ms. Little. And then
both 720
07 and 720 04f were updated to remove
the language about the conflict of
interest rules and 720.05
and 720.04 were
just removed it as the restriction
on numbers appearing before their
boards, that
was removed. Then there was a suggestion
made that I didn't add
it to it but we are welcome
to use it. That's the bottom of this
page saying members are subject to
the code
of ethics and I just referenced
the article and then the last thing
to
note is the language in 722.11
regarding appeals of zoning decisions.
the cbl now
uses
the term for when
it's talking about appeals of zoning
decision. It talks about
challenging them so instead of saying
appeal or judicial review, it
talks about challenging the constitutionality.
this legislature adopted that based
on the
case law that's basically built up
over the years. I changed
hours, instead of
making them both petitions for review.
the first one talks about bringing
an
appeal as
a challenge . It's a
very arcane legal distinction but
you bring a challenge to a zoning
decision under equity --basically
under
the declaratory judgment action. That's
what the zbl says so I
changed
that draft to say that and then the
bza appeals and the appeals of
variances, basically quasijudicial
decisions are now under the petition
for review. So that's another
change that was made since the
last meeting that I don't think was
discussed at all,
so I make sure you understood what
I was doing your. Those are the
changes I made. There is the reasons.
happy to answer any more questions
but just as far as next steps, this
is like any other zoning code amendment.
it would need to be advertised and
go before the planning commission
and back
before
you so even if you still want to talk
some more I would suggest
let's get it on the cycle for getting
it before the planning
commission and then it would have
to be advertised for 15 days before
that or
just before
your meetings.
>> so I have
a question. Yes. I'm sorry, go
ahead.
the zoning --it's on here as a request
to update zoning
procedures, not as
a direct the staff
to advertise.
>> if you want to go
forward,
that should
be added. For the city to advertise
and conduct the requirements.
>> okay. >> for the people that were
on the committee, do I have
a motion?
>> [ inaudible ]. >> okay, first let
me ask, are there questions or
concerns? What is your concern, sir?
>> right now there
are three. The
first two are dealing with those alternate
language choices.
[ inaudible ] to make that choice
whenever emotion is made
as to which language you want to use,
whether it's the --for the
vacancy language, whether it's an
automatic vacancy or whether
it's --whether it comes back before
us for
our decision. The conflict of interest
languages to reference back to our
ethics code and the final one
just a question about the state last
month
over on page
16. How would you like me to
handle that? How would you like to
make
the motions? One at a time?
>> yes, [ inaudible ]. >> good with
the vacancy
language first. Right now again it
says it's automatic
vacancy with an exception for just
cause, but
again, doesn't specify who determines
what just cause is. Because of the
importance of making sure we have
a functioning board and have had members
attending,
I think that is important that once
you hit
that three that it's basically an
automatic-they
are basically
shall be considered for resignation
from
the board and then that resignation
gets forwarded along to us to make
that
final decision whether to accept or
find that there is just cause to allow
them
to continue. That will be my personal
preference on that one as opposed
to automatic, they removed but we
don't
determine how just cause is determined
and that's
current language. I think the council
action
is important in this one since we
are
the ones to [ inaudible ], we should
be the ones to
remove it, if that's the
case.
>> you are saying the language
on page two is what you're
comfortable with.
>> it shall
be considered for resignation from
the
board rather than just
saying resignation from the board.
that is the one change I'd
add just language-wise, just for flow
of the sentence. But the rest of
that gets
my concern.
and it forces us to have to consider
an action
on
that once they hit that three.
>>
okay, so taking these individuals
at three, do I
have a motion on the alternative board
vacancy
language? So what mr. Goldstein is
saying is the language
on page two, which
says the failure of a board member
to attend three regular meetings within
a calendar
year shall be considered for resignation
from
the board. Such resignation shall
be
forwarded to city council, who may
accept the resignation or
may decline to accept it if it finds
just cause exists for the absence.
and then it continues on. So do I
have a motion for that
language or to leave it as it
is, which --is it in here?
>>
it is. It's
in section --
>> 723. >> it's in 723
and 722-04.
>> thank you. The current
language
is page
six I.
so I now says failure of a board member
to
attend three regular meetings within
a calendar year without just
cause shall be considered resignation
from the board to. Upon
such
automatic resignation, resignation
by other means, or other
vacancies occurring, the chairman
shall inform the city council. So
this
one is an automatic. You missed three,
you're out unless you have
just cause. The other question I guess
that mr. Goldstein is raising his
what's just
cause. Should that be determined by
the board or should
that come up here to
be determined?
>> that's policy decision. This is
adopted from the bylaws so I
guess at some point the boards adopted
these
bylaws and said, I guess they originated
as
the board determining, the border
of the planning commission,
whichever one it was, determining
just cause
so that they policy preference. I
think that it is
appropriate to have
somebody make
the decision
and the council needs to say, if you
are fine with it
being the board, we can put language
in there saying the bza were the planning
commission makes the decision about
what just cause is but I think it
would
be wise to say [ inaudible ].
>> I'm
going to step out and
say that I make a motion for the alternative
board vacancy language where
just cause is determined at city
council, not at
the board.
any discussion before we
go
forward?
>> they missed three
regular meetings with a
calendar year.
>> right. >> if they
have
a surgery or a heart attack or something,
they have a letter from
their doctor.
>> then it comes up here and we decide
whether or not that's just
cause.
>> it still comes up here.
>> at least under
this alternative
language.
>> under the motion I am
making it would come up here
for us to determine whether or not
that's just cause. Even with a
heart attack, you know they've got
you up and
moving around. Never had a heart attack.
I
don't know. Pretty quickly. This is
90
days. This is 90 days you couldn't
make
it back. My motion
is that you go with the language that
says just cause is
determined up here at council. And
I've
got a second. Anybody else? I'm looking
at
the
mayor.
>> I have a question. >>
oh, please.
>> everyday language,
does that mean it would
automatically go to
[ inaudible ]?
>> yes, they are automatically
--they
have resigned. They submitted
for resignation and then it comes
up
here and we say thank
you, it's been really nice having
you. Know, we really want you to stay,
you
had cause. Or --
>> this would happen
automatically? At
the
following meeting? At the following
meeting of
city council, upon this condition
be met?
>> yes. >> it's my question
for doug. When it comes to the council,
will it be voted
on?
>> yes sir, it will be in public.
they supply whatever
just cause.
>> I guess appealed it, not appealed
it --
>>
could it be an executive session issue?
>> I would not
think so.
>> it's
not considered a personnel?
the vote would have to be --
>> the vote would have to be public
but
the reason --
>> I guess it would depend
on the reason, and if it's
confidential medical information it
could be
executive session.
>> [ inaudible
].
>> so that
would be an ad hoc decision.
>>
yes or.
>> okay, again we've got
a motion and
a second. The discussion. All in
favor? It's 3-0. So that's just that,
okay? What's next?
>> the second one is with the conflict
of interest language. The code of
ethics already covers what they can
and can't vote
on so it would be better just to have
a reference back to
that to make it clear who is trying
to interpret
something else when they already have
something they have
to follow. And just make reference
to it so
they'll work [ inaudible ].
>>
so the two conditions
are what's written
here, which says the board members
are subject to the code
of ethics as set forth in chapter
14, article one of the city's code
of ordinances, abuse of office and
conflict of interest. This language
says
that so the alternative language --
>> that's
the alternative language.
>> okay.
the current language
says --
>> the strikethrough language
right now.
>> okay, b 2, that does
not say what I needed to say.
>> that's
the
current language. The alternative
language reference to
the code of ethics.
>> I think
it was supposed to be three.
did
I?
>> okay. I'm reading b 2 and I'm
going, that [
inaudible ].
>> I'm talking about
b 3.
>> page 8, down at the bottom,
in red and
it says b3. New board member shall
here or vote
upon any appellate which he or she
is directly or indirectly interested
in a personal or financial way.
so that kind of states what's in the
ethics,
kind of. But the other language says
turn
to the ethics ordinance for your guidance.
>> just
for context, this was probably adopted
before the ethics code
so it had the
more general language. Ethics code
was adopted that has more detail
on it. I don't think it's a
bad idea to say it
gives you more clear parameters than
the ethics code if you want to reference
it but it's fine either way. Either
one covers
the rule. Short and sweet like the
old way or
you can reference it.
>> the short
and
sweet, what do
you miss?
>> there's a specific --
there is
some more things in the abuse
of office,
whatever section. The reality is whether
you change
it or not, the ethics code says they
are subject to it. Whether it's referenced
in this part or not, this applies
to --we are missing repeating
the details in the
ethics code at the ethics code itself
says
if you are a councilmember or a member
of an appointed board, these are the
rules that apply to you so they are
still subject to them. We are just
not repeating them here in as much
detail.
>> okay. Do I have a
motion for the board members?
>> so -->> councilmembers? >> yeah,
I would say my
recommendation would be
to go with
the revised language.
>> that's on
page 2.
>> that's on
page 2.
>> did you hear
that?
so what andre just
said was he wants to
go with the language that's on
page 2, which directs them basically
to the ethics
ordinance.
>> seconded. >> I'm looking
for a
second. Seconding?
>> would you like
to
second?
>> I can second it.
okay. Somebody got a motion and
seconded, any discussion? Hearing
on, all
in favor. You
can do
either hand
. Okay. So
that's a 3-0. Okay. So we've got those
two. What's your third one?
>> last
one just questioning over on --
it's page
16, actually. They were getting
closer
to what the
ocg a
3666 5.1 dealing with the appeal up
to the thing. I think
I'd asked last month about
the state
,
what happens if it's only parts, like
one of variance versus the risk, while
the
rest of the development might be able
to get done outside of maybe one house
or something like that, for example.
would this stay the entire thing or
just the
one house being developed, or something
like that? Would that be an issue
or
is that something that's also the
state law mandates to do based off
of that
procedure?
>> if it's an appeal of
the decision,
you know,
if it's a zoning decision with a variance
tied in, that's
the zoning decision and that's going
to be an appeal under title ix, really,
or under the declared judgment action.
that's its own
thing. So if we're
talking about just appealing the variance
or the zoning decision,
it's all the same thing for a
variance. If there
is multiple variances
created by the bza or you guys acting
as far as your judicial capacity,
the
whole thing, it's not just one. You
know I guess you could look and
see if the petition
for review, like if the motion is
broken down and they're only
challenging one portion of it, arguably
you could try to take a position
that only everything else can continue
but
my default position would be that
the whole
thing would stay.
I literally as close as I could, cut
and pasted the language
from that statute into something for
city council
and those things because that's what's
in
the deal now so even if we didn't
have it in there
it's going to apply anyways.
>> if
it's
in state law that overrides us, that's
the end of my line of questioning
because we don't have --we can't override
state law. If that's what state law
says, is
that
correct?
>> does anyone else have
any questions, concerns? Okay. Do
we have a
motion
regarding this
, with the changes we've already
voted on?
>> I would like to make
a motion.
>> if you could
state the motion that would be great.
>> yes ma'am. The motion would be
to
authorize the advertisement in the
conducting of the necessary public
hearings to adopt the
amendments to the zoning ordinances
as set forth in ledger star 20240993.
>> that's
the motion. Is there a
second?
>> second.
okay.
>> got the second. Any
discussion, concerns? And again, this
is advertising where we are at
right now. Hearing no questions or
concern, all
in favor?
it's 3-0. Does that go on consent
or
is it --
>> it's
advertising.
>> consent to advertise.
all
right. Consent, please. All right.
that wasn't too painful. So the
next item --this
is going to be [ inaudible ] --the
next item is the campus realty
advisors. Hello miss little.
>> hello,
good evening. I'm here to present
to you
the request for detailed
plan for 950 hudson
road. This is
a nine acre apartment complex that
was
zoned in
1983 for 1296
students over a 15
acre tract. Campus realty advisors
is proposing to
demolish the nine acres
and
build three five story
apartment buildings. So this will
amount to a
total of
240
units with
665 beds.
two of the main issues that
are still outstanding, it's gone through
staff
review twice. The first
is this many
units would require two access
points and
right now there is only one
vehicular access proposed off
hudson. They --
they're showing there is a pedestrian
path that runs
from the apartments across
to sbs you, or
sorry, asu. They're amenable to
using that as a sort of
a secondary
emergency access. They are working
on getting
easements from ksu
but being that it
would still only result in
one access point for daily users,
that's something that
would require a variance. The second
issue
--and when we've gotten some updated
information from the applicant
today on the
unit composition, that they will be
based
on those
parking requirements and the zoning
ordinance. They'll be short 61 parking
spaces so that would also
require
a variance.
considering that it's primarily supposed
to
be students, there is a pedestrian
path. There is also a bus stop
right on the loop. But
you have to walk up hudson and
over. Those are some
considerations for the reduced
parking requirements. There
are
also some stipulations that were included
in the 1983
zoning regarding it only
being used
by students that would need to be
revised and
kevin moore was going to be here.
he could probably
speak to the legality of those
restrictions and the fair housing
act but do you have randy
herring here? From campus
realty advisors? If you have any
questions.
>> by approving this,
would this
make this a [ inaudible ] plan?
>>
yes.
>> [ inaudible ]? >> I'm
sorry.
>> what was referred to in
1983 was 1200 [ inaudible ]
so this in essence
is basically a [ inaudible
] for
the 1200.
they said [ inaudible ] is long enough
to
use
it but I'd like to make it clear that
the 1200 [ inaudible
] we change is the 665.
>>
yes, okay. [ inaudible ], is that
all right?
>> this would supersede the prior
zoning,
prior approval.
>> a formal
action to
override it.
>> you probably shouldn't
included in the
motion, if you do approve it, that
it supersedes
all prior [ inaudible ], the units
and the [
inaudible ].
>> they are
cutting in half the number
of beds.
>> in 1983 they
were approved for that many. They
never
built
that many. I think they only
built 120 of the 468 that
were approved
so only a small portion of the units
were
ever built. What's out there
now is 120
units and
205 beds so this would
still be an increase.
>> this is triple
the number of beds.
>> yes,
but it's still what was approved originally
back
in
1983.
>> and in 1983, what was the
density? I see that it would be
right now like 33.
>> so
in 1983
the zoning included the adjacent site,
so it was a total of
15 acres. With the 468
units over
in 15 acres, the density would've
been about 31 units
per acre.
>> this would not only increase
the
triple the beds, but increase the
density.
>> yes. >> yes sir.
>> how do
you overcome
the 61, not enough parking spaces?
is this because a lot of
these students don't have cars? Is
this something
that's doable?
>> today they also
let us
know that
they are trying to get an agreement
from ks you that
it would allow some overflow on the
campus. I think it's still in the
works. We haven't gotten
anything formal but if
you go to probably like the
fifth page, yeah,
right there.
there's a
path down on
the south. I think it was built
almost up to road standards but it's
used as a
pedestrian linkage from an apartment
complex, over to
ksu.
>> [ inaudible
]?
>> [ inaudible ], if you
don't mind. We've got another question.
talk
about 240 apartments but you are saying
there's
more beds
than 1200?
>> no. >> what am
I missing mathematically? 240 is below
1200. Those would
be one to two units.
>>
they didn't build to what they were
given permission
to build and it would've also included
the part
that was across the street, which
would go from 10 acres
to 50.
>> how
many on already
built,
this 240?
>> how
many of the 240?
>> talking about the
original zoning,
this is not just
a little amendment. This ought to
go through the planning commission.
>>
I agree.
what do we do about that, doug? Do
we have that ability?
>> you absolutely
do.
adopt a motion to refer this to the
planning commission and then back
to
the city itself. That's what you want
to do.
>> do you have any
other questions from anyone? I make
a
motion that this goes
to the planning committee, the
planning commission, not
directly appear.
>> second.
>> any
comments, concerns? All
in favor?
you're going to the
planning commission. Consent on the
agenda consent?
consent, please.
thank you. The next
item of business
we have is polling location change.
we are looking at
three a, 4 b
and 6a.
>> these changes were made by
the county. Probably should have come
here first to
ask before that was done but this
is
a cleanup.
>> can I ask a question? >> please.
>> we've
already talked to the
board of elections, who say get it
to us before making a change for
future work changes. Thank
you.
>>
so are we just ratifying? Because
we are not really approving.
>> basically
you
do have to approve for your elections
so even though they made
the move, it's really not valid unless
you approve.
>> okay. Sabean devils
advocate, which I love, what if we
say no?
>> that would be a problem. >> hold
your
own election.
>> you couldn't do
that.
>> we did that last time more
than
one moved. They worked
with us.
>> you were
part of this?
>> I looked at a couple
of these. I saw it on
the agenda, I said, oh. Some of these
were --they
are not
--these places told the board of elections,
we are not going to hold elections
here anymore. So
these may be polling places that serve
as polling places in non-city elections,
so they come to the board of elections
and said, we are not going to
hold elections anymore and so I will
make a special note. There has been
a
sort of --not a big but at least a
significant turnover in
the department of site location and
site
planning, and all that, so this is
probably one of those --one
of the things that led to
that change, this is not getting ahead
of these changes like that. I'm
also sort of surprised the board is
going
to be
trying to get out of most of the schools
over the
next few years because the parents
want them out, which is unfortunate
because it really
limits the places. Right now the high
school is still on there because cobb
is
not object but these really should've
come here first.
but honestly
these were changed, I
think most of these that I looked
at had already changed for prior elections were
these
were just polling places that either don't
want to hold it or have had
to move for other reasons. Now is
just kind of applying to the context
of
municipal election so that's why your
bill is [ inaudible ].
>> now are
some
of these moving outside of their ward?
I mean ward 3 letter a is
coming over to sweitzer.
>> do you
know
the reason for pleasant grove? Did
they not want to do
it anymore.
>> I hear these every month so I did
not --if I had
seen somebody I would've gone and
pulled each one and said why did they
end
up changing but I'm in meetings in
here there is two or three
of these in every meeting.'s over
the last two or three election cycles,
since
our last noticeable election, days
have changed so I have to
go back and I'm happy to do that if
you
want email from between now and the
council meeting.
>>
I would
think ward 3 a, I think it should
be at marietta
miller school middle
school instead of all the way --everybody
else is pretty
close
by but
if we don't have any say so in it
at this point.
>> you certainly, that requires talking
to the board of elections but also
our
site
survey team. Are they available and
can they
make
it work?
have a look at
next year's calendar. They are doing
the general cycles, the municipal
cycle this
year but if that's something you want
to
run by. Very accommodating
for all the cities and how they want
to work
where they want to have their
polling places.
>> or how do you
feel about [
inaudible
]?
>> is that center
still open?
>> [ inaudible ].
>>
okay.
>> all right,
and 6a?
I hope it's that close.
>> it's by the va. >> okay. >> it's
right up the hill
on 41.
>> 6a, your thoughts?
>> that one, I can say that's
where my
mom votes [ inaudible ] so that's
been there for at least two
cycles
now so getting to just wherever it
was before has already changed in
the last
two cycles. We are trying to match
up the closest we could get. The problem
is the precincts for countywide elections
don't always directly map onto
the ward so they did what they
thought was the best but we've got
plenty of
time between now and november to change
it.
but the earlier, the better, so we
can get notices
out.
>> you are talking about
6a?
>> any of them that you look at
this list and
you go, I was specifically talking
about liberty church.
>>
your mom is in 4 b.
>> now she's in
the county.
>> I would like for you
to check
in to
ward 3.
that's quite
a difference.
>> what they've got
to
think about is if they want to make
it just for the municipal's, what
they've probably done is put it in
a
place for the larger general
cycles that it's big enough but these
municipal's you are talking about
are smaller turnouts
and they maybe need to look at doing
something [ inaudible ] but
they probably need to move forward.
the
other thing, there is an a.d.a. Compliance
that we had to enter into to move
some of these locations to places
that are
a.d.a. Compliant. A lot of these churches
just don't have to comply on their
own and we can't force them as the
board of elections to
comply so there are some places that
are just too out of compliance
that we have to make changes. Schools
and public
buildings generally are in pretty
good shape but some of the churches
just
don't have --
they have elevation problems in terms
of where the
parking is and the
grades and some other things like
that. I don't know if that's specifically
for this
one but if you want me to ask them
about ward 3 I can
do that for sure.
>> okay. Sean, while I'm on a roll
I'm going to make a motion that
we move this forward to the monday
agenda work
session to give you some time to figure
out
what they were
up to. Give
the ward members time to go look at
these, see if they are acceptable
to you.
and
if not, where would be acceptable?
again,
they wanted to move me to the water
department. It
made zero sense because it was too
far off of line from the buses.
and most people in my ward, more than
generally, are bus people, so I said
no to
that because you are just getting
people
not to vote in a ward that only has
4% people voting already. So look
at these --again, my motion is to
move it to
the agenda work session.
>> I second
that.
>> we got a second. My
motion gives you time to look at them.
any other
discussion? Hearing none, all in
favor? 3-0. We'll
see you
back at agenda work session because
we love
seeing you.
>> the location, I think
they ought to pay
the cost. A big
build up.
>> the next item
is actually a discussion and a question
that
ronnie barrett is going
to be asking as far as the
ward boundaries deals with the
election and how we display the ward
boundaries.
>> so back in 2020 for you all approved
the new ward boundaries for the upcoming
election. We posted the new
words, new ward boundaries, and we
left the
old wards up on the website. But as
we are rolling
into
this election year, we didn't know
when you guys wanted us to officially
switch from
the old wards to the
new wards. We didn't want to confuse
voters. We didn't want to confuse
council
people
by getting inundated with questions
from people they didn't think were
in their ward,
but that were in there ward. So we
have not made the official switch.
there
is no easy way and some of the tools
that we have to list kind
of the new and old without confusion.
so operationally, it would be better
if we
just made a decision of when to make
that switch and we are
just looking for guidance from you
on when to officially change everything,
in all the
systems, so that they reflect the
new wards.
>>
yes or.
>> I thought we've already
made the switch. Back when
you did the
charter change
to
change the boundaries.
>> so we did
not change anything in the system,
so
that would've been an oversight on
our part. But we were clear.
>> we
kept
them both in there because we had
people that were saying, wait a minute,
I voted for so and so and that's the
word I'm in. Until the next
election and you are not anymore.
but now what we are worried
about is with the election coming
up, obviously we want
to understand [ inaudible ], they
knew who they
are going to be voting for, they need
to know the right ward they
are in.
>> I
know that affects where there voting
is going to be, as well, in case this
hasn't already been transmitted up
to
the state for their voter registration,
too.
is going to be important, especially
with the special elections
going on.
>> [ inaudible ]? >> anything that's
going to be annexed.
>>
that's next year.
>> right. That's not going to be decided
by us until
the next redistricting.
>> thank
you.
>> nobody from the
city council or
--the subsequent data has been adversely
affected.
>> they
have not.
>>
a horrible situation for all of us.
she moved and then
they changed
the mapmakers.
>> as long as no
one moves, we've already voted
it in .
>> okay, so go ahead
and pull the old ward information.
>> do I have any comments on whether
or not
to pull now or pull later?
>> I think
it's probably best [
inaudible
]
>> really should've already been
done and made sure we transmitted
the word,
made sure everyone knew.
>>
your thoughts on whether or not we
should change
boundaries now
or later?
>> change what we
all discussed.
>> I'll say, just to reiterate, we
do have
on-site, these are the maps that are
in place for the next election.
we just also had the old ones in there
so
that you both, we are just going
to wipe out, just keep the new one
in there.
>> it's the last detailed
question is do you want me to go ahead
and do it now or
do you want me to wait until you take
the official vote on february 12th?
>> actually you don't even have to
take that vote if you all just
instruct us to do it.
>> we voted
in '23, I thought to go
>>
for purposes of the sidewalk
fund for zoning and all that, I
think we operate the way we
were
elected. Unless somebody wants [
inaudible ]
>> we can
maintain that data so if there's a
question, we
can work through that.
>> our ideas
among ourselves
stays the same until [ inaudible ].
>> yes or.
>> I think
that's right. I'm
still spending my street money on
my
streets but they are going to be different
people who will be voting for me.
that's okay.
>> all right. Thank you
all.
>> weird on.
all right. Proposed amendment to
ordinance 10-4-030.
>>
yes ma'am. This
first request is to amend
that ordinance, while we are reviewing
that ordinance, looking at some
other ordinances we
have. It didn't include all public
places as
an example
, if someone wanted to camp or light
a fire out
here on the green between police and
fire department, it's not covered
in this ordinance.
so basically it's a slight change
to add the words, upon any
other public property, which would
be other city property. That's
really it.
>> that's easy. >> it shortens
it and it deletes some extraneous
language by
providing that
firsthand. That doesn't otherwise
change
the meaning outside of that additional
language.
>> no, not at all. Camp
or
build a fire.
>> do I have a motion?
actually first, any
comments? Comments,
concerns, issues? This is the shortest
thing we are looking
at all day.
>> this was on the middle
six acres, can we enforce this on
private property?
>> this
is the public one. The
first one. That's the next one.
>> this [ inaudible ] in washington,
oregon.
>> it's any --
as it's
worded.
>>
it's on private property.
>> the next
one we are going
to talk about his private property.
this one is public property.
>> 225073. >> I
went ahead of you, thank you.
>>
anyone else, do I have a motion?
>> yes, a motion to approve
10-4-030 with
the changes
that you have brought before
us.
>> do I have a second? Got a second.
got a motion and a
second. Any other discussion?
>> county
property
including transit,
is that our jurisdiction?
>> we would contact the county, let
them deal with it. For instance, if
they
started camping in the civic center
parking lot, you're going to call
cobb county and
enforce their ordinances.
>> thank
you.
>>
all right go hearing any other
questions? Having a motion and a second?
all
in favor, it passes 3-0. Is
this good for consent?
on consent, please. So the last thing
we have, which is something I'm
passing around --
>> it was
not in the package.
>> one thing is
you are passing it around, I
think for first meeting, this is
an ordinance.
>> that's right.
thank you.
>> that's the same thing as polling
places technically, too.
>>
okay. This goes around, talking about
prohibited use
of private
property. Chief, I'll let you take
it.
>>
yes ma'am . This ordinance, if
adopted, would allow us to charge
individuals who are camping on private
property without
the property owner's permission. We've
done some research. There
are multiple local jurisdictions in
georgia that already have
this ordinance
work for
including glynn county, cleveland,
georgia, and woodstock, georgia. They've
all had it
in place everywhere from 2011, 2013
to 2023. We reached out to
those three jurisdictions to find
out if they were
having any trouble prosecuting
a charge and they are not. We spoke
to the prosecutors of all
three jurisdictions.
to do a little further research today,
just to see
if there were any other local jurisdictions
in georgia and we haven't made phone
calls
to
these two but and perry also
have the same ordinance in place.
in some cases it's an ordinance by
itself. In other
cases it's a bullet within a camping
ordinance but it's the same verbiage.
spoke
to van smith and solicitor ben smith,
he felt like he had no issue whatsoever
prosecuting them.
we ran the ordinance by rich
bus from a parks perspective, which
doesn't have a lot to do with parks
but
still thought he should look at it.
he's on the real issues and ron brewster,
a code enforcement perspective for
the city, of course mr. Haney's office
is also [
inaudible ].
>> what does this do
with
the cta? Do you still have to have
that?
>> the what? >> the trespass
[
inaudible ]
>> I see it as two different things.
>> okay. >> I
believe you could be charged with
both actually, as an example, if we
have
a trespassing situation where we have
somebody who
has been warned not to be on the property
before, that's a charge by itself.
and if they were there camping on
top of that, it would be a
second charge. That being said, from
an enforcement standpoint, I would
prefer that my officers enforce it
similarly. We're giving people a chance
to leave the
grounds and not
just coming in and start charging
people
without first having them the opportunity,
probably 2
to 3 days opportunity to get off the
property with
there camping materials,
et cetera, before we write the citation.
and we would also verify that the
owner of the property has not given
permission for people to
camp there.
that's the plan for the enforcement
side. I will say that the other
jurisdictions, the three we've spoken
to, they don't do that.
they assume --they cite and then they
leave it up to the
defendant
in court to prove that they had permission
to do
so, unless they prove it to the officer.
I would prefer not to do
that. I would prefer to do it on the
front end before we prosecute, verify
that they do not have [ inaudible
].
>> okay. >> I have one
question.
>> please. >> chief, so
in that instance
let's say you --what's the timeline
if you can't really
find an owner?
>> will the options there are going
to be that we
don't prosecute or that we prosecute
like the other jurisdictions I
just mentioned .
we do have some situations where we
have a company that owns land and
we can't get a person on the telephone.
>> is kind of what I was
leading to. Yeah.
>> if you want to
go at it
purely from an enforcement standpoint,
I believe we could still charge based
on what these other jurisdictions
have done and had no issues with,
and
based on
what our city solicitor said, that
he feels he could prosecute the case.
that being
said, if we did it and it failed,
we would have to stop prosecuting
and those people would be allowed
to camp there until we could find
the owner
and verify.
>> you have corporations
with
different names and that might be
a
little difficult.
>> great. Any
other --[ inaudible ].
>> motion is called
the probably
[ inaudible ].
y'all not just walking through the
woods trying to find them. Neighbors
complain about noise.
>> on almost a daily basis. I receive
one a day, again, of complaint about
people camping and just generally
in the area, causing issues. So it's
usually neighbors. It's
sometimes the property owners but
it's
usually neighbors
, they
see the campfires, they see the people
go in the woods. They see the
tents when the leaves fall off the
trees. They call us about the situation.
but
sometimes it's property owners, as
well. We've had people laying down
and sleeping in yards,
not that as much as the camping that
we have that on occasion
as well.
>>
first thing, we know other cities
are
doing it, just I want
to ask the same question I did with
disorderly conduct is making sure
we
have the authority going back. The
squatter law doesn't have
that exception, so that would be a
question on
that one
[ inaudible ].
>> the city, if it
would so
choose, would have the authority under
the police power of the constitution.
>> than the
other thing that worries me on this
is kind
of the thing you brought up already,
the fact that
it's a --the law almost assumes that
there is
no permission --that no permission
was given by the owner to
do it and then you have to put into
the thing of proving it otherwise,
which is
a rare thing. The thing is, though,
you get someone
who says, it becomes
impossible, he said/she said or you
try to look around, [ inaudible ].
it
makes it hard to prove. The proof
of
the thing is something I'd be worried
about especially, and also if
there is
an officer, say someone in the future
came up and they just saw
this language, would they assume they
have right to go on to someone's property
to take a look for someone not
doing it, not
camping out, and possibly then have
a fourth
amendment violation.
that's kind of --those
were some of my concerns about the
current language as proposed.
>> I
don't disagree. I
think it's very important with an
ordinance like this that we do a lot
of
back end planning before we actually
enforce it. Once it's adopted we will
need
to make sure our officers are trained
properly and what you said is exactly
true. We can't just go tromping
onto private property. We need a minimum
of a complaint where there is an issue
of fire or something that could be
dangerous. The property owner that
has already
told us
there shouldn't be
anyone on the property but if I see
one tent on five acres of land
in the middle, from a drone or something
that's flying over, that doesn't give
me permission to go onto that property
and check that tent out. Could be
the
property owner's tent so there's a
lot of back and training on it.
>>
as presented, if the authority thing,
which I know this
would be some of
the concerns, wordsmithing or something
like this would go into effect on
that. That would be my concern
on
that one.
>> just to integrate what
you just said into
the language so that we have some
--I know you will do. I don't know
what the next one will do,
if that makes sense. I know how you
enforce it, basically what you
just told is making sure
that it's very clear going forward
so we don't have incidents going forward
in
case there is a break in the chain
or something like that. Okay?
>> okay.
>> I guess I have -->> [
inaudible ]
>> the other question
would be --
>> [ inaudible ]. >>
I'm good with the language, too.
>>
do you think that the people will
that we would be
addressing and dealing with, will
they actually come to
court?
>>
I couldn't really answer that.
if I had to give you my best guess
I would say it's a 50/50.
I think some have the capability to come
to court and some don't. As an example,
we made an arrest today in that area
for a failure to
appear case out of
cherokee county,
a misdemeanor public drunk jaywalking
case that had
been made in cherokee county, and
the person did not go to court. And
they were
on how standing that area today, and
we made contact, had an outstanding
warrant, maybe arrest, turn them over
to cherokee county.
that's probably an
example of how they ended up where
they ended up. I couldn't tell you.
I don't know. They did not go back
to
court in cherokee county.
>> got it.
>> some may make that attempt to
go. It's not actually that far. Look
at the city
of marietta. Assuming they stay
in the marietta area, they at least
have the opportunity to go to court
if they choose to do so.
>> so they
will be served and the whole
nine yards. Is that kind of how
that worked ?
>> if they are cited,
the citation will have a court date,
location, everything on it. If they
are arrested
they would have a copy of that when
they left the facility.
>>
all right. Do I have a motion?
>>
I make a motion to approve.
>>
second.
>> got a motion and a second.
all
in favor.
>> move forward. >> move
forward.
>> you. >> that's all
in favor. It
is
an ordinance so I can
consent the first one,
all right?
>> with
the recommendation of the second,
to be waived or not?
>> [
inaudible ]
>> no sir. >> consent, no consent?
>> if you
want to have consent please show me
your hands.
>> four point >> we've
got
consent. Just hands, please. All right.
I keep losing my minutes now.
all right. Seen nothing further before
jail, we
stand adjourned.
>> [ inaudible ] >>
nope,
nope. Economic and community development
is first.
>> they
never have anything.
>> okay.
I call the economic community development
committee to order. The first item
of business is the regular meeting
minutes from september
24th, 2024, and that's because it
was that far back, that's one without
revisions. So is there a motion on
the minutes?
>>
motion to approve.
>> second. >> a
motion to approve is properly made
and seconded.
is there further discussion on the
minutes? Hearing them, call the question.
all in
favor please raise your right hand.
the motion passes 3-0. Before the
next item
I make a disclosure that I am on the
board of directors for
visit marietta
, representing the marietta city council.
next item of business is the
extension of the pole banners installations
for visit marietta.
>> thank you mr.
chairman. Back
in september you approved a request
for a visit marietta to hang some
pole banners
up in downtown business
district. That is set to expire on
january 31st
. Brittany gray, the executive director,
has requested that be extended for
an
additional nine months, which would
take you up to the end of october,
as I
recall. And she has a letter of request
that I attached, email of request,
to the back of it. I did discuss with
britney the fact that there are
other eligible nonprofit groups who
might wanting to put up a
banner and
there is a provision for that to take
place. So if such a group did make
an application to you, and you wanted
to approve that, she's 100% amenable
to
her banners coming down for that two
week or less period and then hers
could
be put back up when the others come
down. So by giving that nine-month
extension, you would not eliminate
others from using the banners if they
were qualified applicant.
>> is there any discussion for
a motion? Before we go for a motion,
I know you made that recommendation
there. Right now the motion on the
agenda
is a straight approval.
in the recommendation they also included
the
language about
a
provision for other groups to use
the polls for an allotted period with
the
visit marietta banners to be replaced
at the conclusion of the allotted
timeframe.
and without cover of the
language or need to add anything else
before the city council meeting, make
sure its
approval by city council for that.
>> that would be good.
the language in the recommendation,
yes sir.
>> so a possible motion
would be
, a motion to approve a nine-month
extension for the visit marietta pole
banners
in the downtown area, retroactive to
february 1st, 2025, with the provision
for other groups to
use the polls for an allotted period
with the visit marietta banners to
be
replaced at the conclusion of the
allotted timeframe. Is there a motion?
>> motion. >>
is there a motion to that effect?
>> I thought you made the motion.
>> I just looked at the numbers first.
I can make it if you'd
like. I
make that --I so make that
motion I just stated.
>> second. >>
any further discussion?
>> yes.
>> I'm for
it but it's starting to smell like
this
is permanent and I like them. I
like the banners on it. I thought
we ought
to maybe look at it just
be a staff decision. Maybe not
tonight. Just --
>>
direct staff,
before the next extension, if visit
marietta plan to continue these
banners to have that come up at the
appropriate time in a committee meeting,
please?
>> are you thinking that just
whatever banners go up in the future
will
be staff decision or just these particular
items?
>> we went from no banners
to approval for
9 months, very happily extended
another nine, with other people being
able to
use it. And I think it's going to
be
routine.
to me
it's appropriate.
>> we can still
draw it that way.
>>
not tonight but I'm just [ inaudible
] to
see
because feel the [ inaudible ], we
don't even know who these other
people are and we've [ inaudible ].
>> okay. And for these other people,
though, we do
have --at this point it would be approval
by council for them to put it
up and take it back down within that
two week period.
>> that's what
I'm suggesting. I'd hate for us to
have
26 meetings.
[ inaudible ] it is almost.
>> there
are some requirements in there currently
on what type of organizations can
use
the banners
and so
forth. We can go in and refine that
even more.
>> it would be a
nonprofit, so someone who is receiving
tourism funds from the city. There
is a
two week maximum, or less, as were
approved by the council. And the council
would
improve approve the artwork, so that's
in the existing one point
>> council
would or the hpr?
>> it does not go
to the hpr now, no.
>>
do you think that can be brought up
at the appropriate time, to the appropriate
committee? Because I'm not sure if
that would be ji l or economic
development.
>> I'm not suggesting
the [ inaudible ] but I think one
of
these days somebody's going to come
with can we have it for two weeks
and
I think it's appropriate.
>> we have
had that in the
past, definitely.
>> we've had some
bozo some people
have talked to me if they are interested,
perhaps, in a couple of our
established events which we are approving
street closures for earlier. They
may
come and make that requesting some
upcoming months.
>> we should
have standards about taste
and everything.
>> yes sir. >> okay, and
a motion is currently
before us, properly made and seconded.
is there any
further discussion? I can
see you. Are you good?
>> I'm good.
>> hearing no more
discussion, call
the question. All in favor please
raise your right hand.
the motion carries 3-0. Is this appropriate
for consent?
>> [
inaudible ].
>> hearing no objections,
this is recommended for consent. Is
there any further
business to come before the economic
and community development committee?
hearing none, this meeting is
adjourned.
>> sorry, I messed up. Looked like
it was shorter.
>> make a motion to approve
the revised minutes.
>>
second.
>> second. >>
all
in favor.
>>
mr. Chairman, all I have on the 2016
is the rotten wood creek trail project
and we are preparing that project
to go back out to
bead at this time and hopefully we'll
get some better
numbers. Hopefully.
>> fingers crossed.
>>
that's all I have on the
2016. I will see if anyone has any
questions.
>> [
inaudible ]
>>
a few updates. We're going to talk
about a couple of the projects here,
thinking
we can go over the concept
for brent hickory and polk roundabout,
that intersection that will
be coming up as well
as woodlock drive intersection
improvements. We will show that one
as well. A
couple others. Tower and
james intersection improvement, that
project is well underway. The upright
polls
have been up, put a.
they've been working on concrete,
started concrete work
this week. They are hoping to get
the master installed
this week if the weather continues
to hold, which
it looks like it's going to. So they'll
move toward completion
very rapidly
now at this point. Mountain view ridge,
I told you that I would
continue to a date you on that so
we
are still --we finalized the plan
modifications of this and we are still
proceeding to bid this spring with
estimated construction in
late summer, late spring, early summer
for that project, as
well point mayberry avenue is a sidewalk
project that was
using mr. Goldstein --somebody's arpa
money there so that project now has
moved to --I said it's underway in
the up dates there and we moved almost
2 punchlist items at
this point.
>> mr. Chair,
may I? Budget is
doing okay
he'll all arpa funds were used
at this point?
>> we've spent every
last dollar of your arpa money for
that
project, you sort.
>> and the rest
of it is going out of the council
sidewalk safety funds?
>> correct.
>> thank you. >>
and east exit trail has been a project
that's been on my books
for a while. We've been stating we've
been waiting on marietta water
to start their project.
they have started that
project now. According to mr. Dewoody,
that project will run through sometime
in may. We are looking to try to use
their contractor
to potentially --since they're
already being mobilized, to go ahead
and move forward with our trail
project. But we've got to work the
details out with them to make sure
that
they can do that project, so
we don't lose any momentum there,
while they're
already there. Mayor langfield, that
contractor is
mobilizing this week. He will
obviously start construction, if you
will, but he's mobilizing, getting
everything ready to go now.
he will start work, moving dirt next
week out there on that project. That's
all I have on the 2022 unless anyone
has any specific questions.
>> next item is [ inaudible
].
>> before going to that, mr. Chairman,
mr. Goldstein had sent us some
information on the governor wanting
to release some money for
transportation projects. So we have
reached
out, seen some of those qualifications
for those
and we are in the process of applying
for some
of that money. The include sidewalk
projects as well
as streetscape projects and of course
we have several of those so we are
in the process of applying
for some of that. I hate to call it
freestate money
but we are in the process of going
after that money, as well. I just
wanted to up date mayor and council
on that, that we are going through
that process,
as well
, for that, as far as going
to the departmental things. So we
are pursuing that. The departmental
activities, you see the
numbers there. Bettina has already
kind of talked about the inspection
numbers, permitting numbers.
so those are still holding steady.
all the other activities, even through
the cold spell
in the winter weather event we had,
we still maintained our activities
for the month
so we are looking good and I'll be
happy to answer any questions anyone
has.
>> next
item is the [ inaudible ].
>> this
is an item we've had on the agenda
for the last couple of
committee meetings as we've been working
through talking to congressman loudermilk's
office about possibly
reallocating that money as well as
having conversations
with g.about their timeline requirement
for
bridge replacement
. We have had conversations or feedback
from congressman loudermilk's office
now. They will
not allow us to reallocate that money
toward any other project so it has
to
be spent
that if we are going
to spend it, it has to be spent on
this particular project. I had a
conversation yesterday with g.'s chief
engineer about the timeline because
there was
a little bit of miscommunication between
the congressman's
office and
gdot. Somewhere along the line the
congressman's office was under the
impression that gdot was amenable
to allowing us to work
under our original schedule. A year
and a half to two years construction
time.
that is not true. Gdot is going to
hold us to that five-year-plus
scheduled to do this project in order
for us to get
this money. So we're back to the original
item
before you. You have two options here
for this project. You can
accept the money from congressman
loudermilk's office, with
the understanding that we are under
gdot's timeline for construction.
which means five to seven
year construction window, which means
money that we will receive from the
congressman's
office, we will spend at least that
much money by the time we actually
get
to construction, just due to inflation.
or we do not have
to accept the money from the congressman's
office, and we will move forward with
our
own construction timeline
and reallocate
money. We already have bridge replacement
money in
the current spl ost. We'll have to
move some other money around to get
the
current, cover everything. We'll be
a little short but
not everything and
then we'll be able to get this project
completed right after the world cup,
which
is about 18 months
timeframe. So --and save us a considerable
amount
of money. So those are the options
before this committee and mayor and
council at this point.
>> they say
that
we can't do it, finish early.
>> no
sir.
if
we take the money --
>> they distribute
the
$750,000 over five years and if we
finish it in two years you get
that prorated?
>> if we do this and
we take the money,
we
are under
gdot's control at that point for this
project. Gdot will distribute the
money. Gdot will manage the project.
gdot will assign a contractor. It's
basically
gdot's project. We have no control
over it at that point.
>> [ inaudible
].
>>
and sorry, mr. Chair, may I? With
regard to some of the gdot
stuff, they are also being hamstrung,
I think, by the federal
highway authority's regulations. And
that's I think what they said
is the main cause for
the five-year [ inaudible ].
>> that
is what gdot
says . Some of
that mystification, I think, going
back and forth. I don't know that
I totally believe
that total requirements on that but
that's what gdot is telling us. Yes,
that's
where they're getting that requirement.
so anyways, it doesn't matter where
they are getting it. They're going
to
hold us to it. If we take that money
we are under their control at
that point for this project. It's
a
minimum of five years and we will
--whatever that end up
construction cost is, based on
our estimates right now with construction
dollars,
my estimate, we will spend
at least $4 million by the time we
actually get to construction, based
on
inflation and where construction
costs are.
>> we are so much better
to
do it right now.
>> that is my opinion,
yes sir.
>> I asked
for one more moonshot on this one.
is there anyway --at this
point it's hard to justify taking
the funds if we have
that five-year is that basically adds
$4 million, the exact
same amount
we had
been getting for it so it still cost
us the same amount and just
take longer. Costs us essentially
the same amount in just take longer.
I want to ask
if there is any way between now and
the work session, we can get
someone from congressman loudermilk's
office, someone from gdot, on the
same call with you,
and just see if we can talk and figure
out where this
miscommunication is, why are we getting
two different
messages on this, and see if we can
get this
hashed out hopefully in a
favorable position for the city on
that.
>> I'd like to keep them on
the same page.
>> I'm happy to put
them on the same call but I've
gotten the same email from the two
individuals, one from the congressman's
office, one from
gdot, that says everything I just
told you.
>> okay, so they are
now on the same page.
>> yes. >> so
let's think.
>> [
inaudible ] ?
>> the appropriation
from the
congressman's office is $4 million.
>> yeah. >> we are estimating this
project
to be about $6 million total. We
have almost $4 million allocated in
the
current law so we
have to come up with another couple
million dollars to do the project,
which again, save that amount of money
being able to do
it on our time schedule, that's a
savings in the end run versus trying
to
wait because it will
cost us
. It will cost us every
bit of that $4 million by the time
we get to get, in at
least five years.
>> and I get an
idea [
inaudible ]?
>> is there more
to it [
inaudible ]?
>> it's
all on the money.
>> it's hard for
me to justify taking an additional
five years and
it costing us more, yeah.
>> the $4
million we
would save, we could put in
another project that the same day
would happen.
whatever of the
4 million projects out there, if you
wait five years it's going to cost
you $6.5 million anyway.
>> that's
correct.
>> so you mitigate it by
spending
the money, just on a different project.
>> that's correct. That's a very good
point,
mr. Maher. If we save that money now
and do the project now then
that
would be money,
that instead of spending it later
on, we'd be able to focus that money
somewhere
else, on another project, and
spend it.
>> that's why I'm saying
I agree on that. It's hard
to justify taking this with
the amount of time it would take in
the amount of cost it would
be.
>> it's the
same principle that
[ inaudible ]
>> correct. >> what's
the bridge rated at right now?
>>
the bridge --excuse me, the bridge
is safe.
gdot --when gdot came out and did
their
assessment, it did not meet their
requirements.
since that time, we have made improvements
and it is safe that
this point.
but we still want to go
ahead and replace it, to make sure
that it fully
meets their requirements and everything
is done.
plus, it would allow us
to improve some other safety improvements.
we've had some other accidents and
other things in
that area plus with the trail coming
in, it would allow us to go ahead
and finish off a lot of things that
we need to do.
>>
the one other thing I would suggest,
then, is we know the
reason why
this doesn't work in this case. We
need to express that
to the congressman's office as best
we can and hopefully we take a look
to see if we can get them to take
a look at doing changes by
that federal level or whatever the
appropriate level is so that if we
try
and do a different project going forward,
or some other
city does, they don't have the same
issue we just ran into. That
does need to be discussed at some
point.
>> discussing
with ashley
from the congressman's office, I think
she is fully aware and understanding
now that this
is an issue that's going to have to
be addressed and corrected at the
federal level to make sure these issues
don't happen
again but going forward, if the council
chooses to go this direction then
we'll make sure that she understands,
or if the congressman's office understands
why we are
having to go this route.
>> would
we have any luck with the newer
administration and their wanting to
do away with some of
the regulations? That's just pie in
the sky?
>> that's a difficult question
to
answer at
this point.
I guess if we had --
>> one week in
office.
>> I guess we
had enough time to wait it out, then
that's a possibility. The problem
is g.wants an answer
now on
this so
the buddha
>> it would be our lobbyists
to
do that, gma?
>> this would be
a combination of gma and lc at this
point.
I could bring it up to
britney colder with and lc. She's
the transportation
policy person. It's and lc to talk
about these issues .4 gma it would
be claire chan. She's the federal
person. I'm also on the federal policy
committee
so I'll make sure to
get that to her.
>> more on their plate right now they
us.
>> I think my opinion is
definitely worth
pursuing and
if this
is a way the council wants to go,
and allow us to go ahead and
move forward with it, if it does change
later on, then if we do get
additional money, if it changes, then
we could always go back and apply
it
toward the project at whatever stage
we are in and it will definitely help
free
up wherever we are at.
>> one month
to score this would be prudent?
>> if that's the council's wishes,
we can. If that's council's wishes.
>>
at
these dry
.
>> they could actually move it
to the work session to at least keep
it on a thing, keep it
on an agenda to talk about, and if
it doesn't get worked out by then,
we can always then
shift it back to the committee schedule
or move it forward to council to take
the appropriate action.
>> if they
say no way --
>> I say make a motion
to move this towards
the agenda work session so we can
get that progressive update.
>> second? >>
next item.
>> I'm sorry. We received
a request for traffic calming on ayers
avenue from
warren street to tyler street so we want
to do a
speed study in this area just to determine
if traffic calming devices are needed.
aires
avenue from lawrence to tolliver is
approximately 173 feet in length.
does
have a variable right-of-way between
30 feet and
40 feet. This section does have
a
current posted speed limit of 30 miles
an hour. It is considered a residential
street
and is located in ward one a. We would
recommend proceeding with a proper
setting of the speed limit at 25 miles
an hour
once the speed study has been completed.
we would recommend moving forward
with the
speed study.
>> didn't we just do a speed study
on ayers?
>> not on ayers. We've done
several of those surrounding streets
but
we've not done ayers.
>> I thought
we did ayers when we put in that
three way stop sign because of the
buses.
>> no ma'am. >> I make a
motion to approve the ayers speed
study.
>> I'm with that setting of
the
speed limit.
>> that's our normal
thing.
>>
our second.
>> seconded. >> yeah, second. >> all
in favor?
>> is that okay for consent? >> no
objection to consent.
>> no objection. >> consent.
>> consent.
>> our building inspections vision
and planning and zoning department
have discovered
some discrepancies between code sections
and personal response abilities when
it
comes to
some duplication of efforts between
the departments for condemnation of
unsafe structures and systems. It
is stated in section 718.01 that the
director of development services shall
order the discontinuance
of any illegal work being done without
defining the extent of this illegal
work.
I have spoken to the director of development
services, the fire chief, and it
is our recommendation that all determinations
of unsafe structures and systems be
performed by the
chief voting official or his
or her
designee. This is due to the stringent
certification and training
requirements for the building inspectors
who can make these determinations
based upon the applicable
construction codes. So in order to
clear up these discrepancies, the
following amendment is
being proposed, section 7-4-2-0 40,
section e, entitled powers and
duties of the building official, by
adding this paragraph to
this
section stating all such unsafe building
structures or service systems are
hereby declared
illegal, shelby properly placarded
and shall be aided by
repair and rehabilitation or
by demolition
in accordance with the provisions
of
the applicable construction code as
determined by the chief building official.
if this is
approved this will require two public
readings as approved and adopted.
>> may I? >>
yes.
>> for
the determination
--when you talk about the termination
you're talking
about the termination of where it
is supposed to be repaired and rehabilitated
or
demolished, or are you talking determination
of whether it's unsafe?
>> it's unsafe.
>> right
now the way the thing reads, it looks
like that determination is not about
the unsafe part. It's about whether
it should be abated and repaired or
demolished. It
seems that's where that discretion
looks to be, otherwise it looks like
the chief building
inspector has any discretion in this
ordinance on that.
>> in the first graph
in
this section come of this will be
the
second paragraph
, it states because
it's titled section e is unsafe buildings
or systems. It says all building structures,
electrical,
gas, chemical or plumbing systems
which are unsafe, unsanitary, or do
not provide adequate egress
or which constitutes a fire hazard
or otherwise dangerous to human life,
or which
in relation to existing use constitutes
a hazard to safety or health, are
considered unsafe
building and service systems so this
is just moving,
trying to move this forward a little
bit more.
>> I know. That's what
you are trying to get the chief building
inspector to determine that part
of it. As it's written it doesn't
look like that's what he
is determining.
>> I don't agree.
I think with both paragraphs --
>> all such buildings
are declared illegal and shall be
placarded. It doesn't say the determination
goes back to that first sentence.
that's
one thing I'm worried
about. It looks like it doesn't have
much discretion on what can or can't
be done. It's a lot of shalls in this
case and also a different question
is what if the system is just a small
system
that can be
theoretically done by turning it
off, if the rest of the building
is safe, do
you have to placarded and close down
the entire building when you have
just one
system that could be easily turned
off? That's what
I'm worried about with this language.
>> that goes back to the training
and certifications
and experience of these inspectors.
they
understand that if they can go in
and not have to condemn or close
down an entire building, and they
can just isolate a system and make
that
area or that system safe and keep
the entire building open,
than they have that knowledge and
expertise to do that.
>> I'm just
worried
the language doesn't allow them to
use their
proper
discretion, that's the thing that
was a little bit worried about with
the current
language. It feels almost like it's
trying to use a sledgehammer but too
much
when that's not the tool that should
be used on
the language.
>> [ inaudible ] as
written?
>>
second.
>> all
in favor?
>> all opposed? >> I oppose.
>> this will require two public readings
unless you want to
wave it.
>> whitlock drive
first.
>>
whitlock drive.
>> excuse me. >> these
last two
items are named projects on
the 2022
splost, so this first
one, after numerous meetings with
the neighborhood and
public input,
this is the design that has been acceptable
by
the neighborhood as well as our
engineering staff. This design
would maintain the current islands
that are in place,
the tree islands there that you see,
create
pedestrian crosswalks, create additional
green space by the removal of existing
pavement, create stock conditions
for traffic at all points of street
intersections, install rapid flashing
beacons at all the crosswalks, and
create two points of
raised speed tables or crosswalks.
you see those
in red there, one right there and
one up
right there. The original budget approved
the 2022
splost for this project was $750,000.
the
revised construction estimate for
this project is now $125,000 for what
you see
there. This project is located in
ward 3 a.
>> saving the city a lot of money
on
this now. Speaking of
the money,
do you have something earmarked for
the remainder of
this money and when do you think this
project might be
able to get started now?
>>
this project, because the scope has
been reduced and is very simple
right now, if council approves
this concept, we are ready to go to
construction here probably in
30-45 days. It's a very simple project.
we can get out the door
and get started on. It will be very,
very quick.
>>
I make a motion to approve this as
designed.
>> second. >> [
inaudible
]
>>
[ inaudible ] sign rather than
a yield sign at whitlock
drive in hillcrest.
>> part of the
point
there was, when I was looking at this
initially, was to
help slow traffic down there
and improve some of the safety coming
around both
turns. So
our original design,
of course, as some of you saw in several
of the emails that was
flying around during the years past,
was put some roundabouts there. And
of course that
did not go over well. So we came back
with a design. We had
a couple different options, one of
which was some yield signs, one of
which
was stop signs, and this was the one
that the neighborhood agreed-upon
that
they liked the most. We actually had
everybody
vote on it and we had a meeting in
here. This is the one
they chose. We have no problems
with this.
>> I'd love for us to consider
at a
stop sign rather than the
yield sign their.
>> does it
say yield? It supposed to all be
stop signs. If it says yield --
those are stop signs.
>> those
are stops.
>> yeah, those are stops.
>> if it says yield that's
a mistype. There
all supposed to be stop signs.
>>
thank you, thank you.
>> they are
currently
yield and we are taking them out.
>> running yields or
running stops.
>> I would ask for
this item, if it's okay, not
to be on
consent and for you to take a vote,
just
due to --
>> nonconsent, please. >> the items.
>> let people show up if they want
to
for this one.
>> that is correct.
>> so it's not on
consent. Okay. Next item?
>> next
item
is our first big
project
of 2022 splost, intersection improvement
at hickory and
polk. So
this proposed design would replace
the current
traffic signal that is in place with
the roundabout that
you see their. The roundabout
would allow for the best flow of traffic
at this intersection, without the
backups
of traffic during morning and
evening rush
.'s. It would create pedestrian crosswalks,
create additional green space in the
middle of
the roundabout, allow for traffic
to move at all times toward whitlock,
down burnt
hickory, and install rapid flashing
beacons at the crosswalk. The
original budget amount approved in
the 2022 splost for this
project is $1.5 million. We do not
have an estimated construction at
this point.
we wanted council to look at this
concept before we move any further
forward with this. This project is
split between three wards. Actually
two, but
three a,
4 letter a and 4 c. The size of
that roundabout, just to kind of give
you some reference, is approximately
120 foot
radius through their. As you are moving
down burnt hickory coming there from
the northwest to the southeast there,
coming down toward
whitlock, you see there is what
I call a slip lane that will allow
traffic to continually move and not
get caught up in the
roundabout traffic coming down burnt
hickory, to move on
toward whitlock, to
keep traffic
constantly moving through there. And
you
would still be able, if you need to
get into the roundabout, to move on
toward polk, you'll get in that left-hand
lane if you're coming down burnt hickory.
you're getting that inside lane, move
around and get on to pole, and move
your way around. Everything would
be beautified
streetscape as far as brick islands,
and like I
said, the crosswalks. The center spot
there you see, we just indicated that
right now
with green. We are proposing to bring
that back to our design, internal
design
group, to come back with some sort
of gateway structure. We just don't
know what that's going to look
like at this point, but it will be
some sort of
gateway monument
type item at this point. We just don't
know what that's going to look
like. I don't want you to think that's
just all going to be green.
it's not. It's going to be some sort
of gateway structure.
>> [ inaudible
]?
>> I'm sorry. So that's the concept.
I'm happy to
answer
any questions
. If it's acceptable then we'll continue
moving on, finalizing design, and
getting this
project on out to bid. I
do not --this will be
a project that will have to be a summer
construction project, just because
of school traffic,
so we don't impact
school traffic, and then we get a
little closer to that, which
I anticipate
to be summer of '26 before we actually
are
ready to do construction, at a minimum.
once we get to that point, a
little closer, then I would be happy
to have a conversation with mayor
and council
as to more specifics, as to the construction
timeline. A couple of options I've
got
in mind on doing this, just the up
to council
to tell me how quick you want to pull
the band-aid off, make this
thing work
, whether or not we want to work
24 hours a day, seven days a week,
in order to get traffic least impacted,
or we want to stretch this out for
a number of weeks and have traffic
impacted. But we'll come back and
have that discussion
a little later when we get closer
to actual construction time.
>> I
make the
motion to move
this forward.
>> [ inaudible ]. >> I
am well aware of that x city employee.
>> [ inaudible ]. >> I
have not. She knows we're going to
do a project there but she has not
seen this. I have not shown this plan
to anyone, until mayor and council
see
it tonight.
>> I make the motion moving
forward.
>> I'll second it. >> all
in favor, raise your hand.
>> you
guys get stopped by another one person
on the roundabout, that
ain't right.
>> they're a natural
born target,
aren't they?
>> stop sign [ inaudible
] at
that shopping center [ inaudible ]. Anyway.
>> I will
say this about this. We only have
to have a little bit of additional
right-of-way from the southeast and
the southwest, two parties, that bank
and
then that assisted living facility.
the other two properties to the northeast,
northwest, are
city-owned. Now one of those parks,
part of the parks
and rec grounds and we'll have to
work
that out with
rich buss and his folks. But other
than that, we already owned those
two
right of ways.
>> just for an update,
with
your counterpart, basically when they
tore
up your roads, but
you
know, I think bill w did a good job
of 2020 weather, today
we
lost two, I guess the park sign
and one just off of [ inaudible ].
the water main break
>> on lawrence. >> 3:00
in the
morning. But who goes --you fix the
street
back later?
>> we
do.
>>
just [ inaudible ]?
>> it depends
on the size of the patch.
so if it's a small enough patch then
my streets crews will go fix
it but those are too
large so for having our paving crew,
we've already given that over to our
paving contractor as part of our resurfacing
price
for this year and they are going to
hit those first and get
those repaired because
they are too big for our guys to handling
house so they are going to
fix those first, as soon as they get
in town and get that fixed.
>>
you guys did outstanding work. I
saw some stuff on
the ring system
for like,
what's going on. But I tell you what,
for the ones that affected my
ward, there are two
of them
, [ inaudible ].
>> we
will, streets will, keep them maintained
in the meantime until we get the permanent
patch on
them. We'll make sure that they're
all
safe.
>> why do water pipes burst at 3:00
in the morning? Why don't they ever
--
[ laughter ].
>> same reason my storm
water pipes --
>> anything else
for public works?
>> just because
we own the [ inaudible
], most of those pipes were probably
put in 80 years ago. So I think
we've gotten good life. They
were built
by '39 or '40 point
>> they had had
multiple days of
extremely cold weather, and they were
dealing with the settling and everything
else in the
roof, and everything else going on.
that's the time that you would have
something like
that happen.
>> and we are doing a
job the last few years of
working with marietta water on any
time now we have a project, streetscape
project or
anything else, we are looking at doing
a drainage improvement project over on
maxwell
right now and we've identified some
of their old clay sewer pipes, and
we've
been in conversations with
marietta water
and said even though we are not touching
those pipes, but we are going to be
close enough, you might want to
go take a look at those, since we
are going to have the road
opened. Now would be a good time for
you to go in and if you want
to do something, now would be a good
time when we've got
the road open so you are not having
to
pay double early on, so we are constantly
in communication with them to try
to
help both parties get things done
like this.
>>
thanks for putting that in motion.
>> thank you.
>> thank
you all.
>> I want to call
the special council meeting work session
to order. First item of business is
addressing the
december 19th 2024
meeting minutes
. Motion?
>> make a motion to approve.
>> second. >> all those
in favor please raise your right hand.
motion carries. Do
we have a personnel executive session?
>> yes sir,
would you like to have that for that
item that was on the other agenda?
>>
I see two of them, wasn't it?
>> one
was voting for
--
>> one was just a question. >> however
reanalyzed.
>> there was a question
during the personnel meeting about
your appointment to the ethics board.
>> we couldn't
do it [ inaudible ].
>> that's just your appointment
but we put it on there as a reminder
so we would just give it
to you before the
next agenda.
>>
if I had unsuccessful
phone calls I might be
able to put it off for another month,
but the sooner I try, the better,
because the committee is doing a lot
of
work and
I'm sure they'd like to know their
future.
>> it appeared both of the
individuals wanted to still be on
it. Like I say, they are in the middle
of work at this point.
>> for that committee more
than once, there is never been a wrong
line. It takes a good
citizen. So yeah,
I want notice it
this time.
>> and we do -->> make
a motion to go in executive session
for personal matters. >> I make a motion
to go into executive session for personnel matters.
>> is there a second? >> second.