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Good evening, welcome to the July 16th, 2026 City of Napa Regular Meeting for the Planning

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Commission.

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I would like to call this meeting to order and ask my RIT to please conduct a roll call.

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Commissioner Yibok?

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Present.

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Commissioner Massaro.

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Present.

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Commissioner Shotwell.

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Present.

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Chair Owen here, and I have Vice Chair Myers noted as absent.

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And we will now rise for the Pledge of Allegiance.

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I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic

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for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

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The Planning Commission conducts all meetings in accordance with the Ralph Brown Act

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and pursuant to the City's Rules of Order for Planning Commission meetings policy resolution

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10.

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Staff are there any changes to the evening's agenda or any supplemental reports?

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Yes, so there have been three supplemental memos that have been conveyed to the Planning

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Commission and are available for physical copies in the back.

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One, two, agenda item seven B, and then two, four, the study session item later tonight.

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And then we staff is recommending to continue item seven A just generally to not to a date

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uncertain, not to a day certain.

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Okay, can I get a motion to continue item seven A, so moved.

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Second, all those in favor, I motion passes.

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Public comment, public comment provides an opportunity for members of the public to directly address

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the Planning Commission on items of interest, not otherwise noted on the agenda.

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Each speaker's comments will be limited to three minutes and will comply with the Rules of Order

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for Planning Commission meetings.

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Do we have any members of the public who wish to provide public comments on non-agenda items?

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Yes, sir, please can board.

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I'll be very brief on customary for a lawyer and I had discussions with staff before I have a pending

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application for Division of my 62 point four acre parcel on leaning oak drive in Napa,

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off of a human avenue, and I've held things in the Bayons, there's an application to divide

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into three parcels, which was allowed under the existing zoning, and I held in the Bayonsville

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all this general plan, and other conforming work was an order.

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The, that is still pending and if not, I will resuscitate it.

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But my comments are directed to the lack of consideration of the fact that there are only two significant

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parcels that David Don, parcel on Old Sonoma Road, Porter Biles on Old Sonoma Road, and my

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parcel, and both of those were large, and David Don had three or four parcels already in their

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40 plus acre parcel, and I had 62 point seven and one parcel and a pending application.

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Like comments repeatedly to staff and other planning people involved, I have been that one,

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it is unwise to have a large parcel of property in the city that is zoned for now under the

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proposal of a go to one unit of housing on 62 point four acres, not even the three that I applied for.

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And that isn't logical if the city attempts to do any annexations,

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it is wise to have a better proposition to pose to those parcels to be a next.

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Mine's already in, but I've made the comment repeatedly that if you had a five acre zone,

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you could probably encourage people to annex without having to force any issues.

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And five acres is a very reasonable buffer zone that would help avoid problems with the public who

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does do not wish to have annexations, and with the public that do wish to have annexations,

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it would just be a wise policy, so that's what I recommend.

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Thank you. Thank you.

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Does anybody else wish to speak on something not on tonight's agenda?

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Can I get a motion to close public comment?

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So moved. Second, all those in favor?

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Hi.

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Consent calendar, these routine items may be approved by a single vote, however, any member of the public or a

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commissioner may remove an item for discussion during the public hearing portion of the agenda.

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This evening we are reviewing the planning commission regular meeting minutes for July 2nd,

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2020-26. Is there a motion to approve the meeting minutes for July 2nd, 2020-26?

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So moved.

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Second, all those in favor? Hi. Motion passes.

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We have no consent hearings, so moving on to public hearings. These are items that are formally presented

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to the planning commission and provide an opportunity for members of the public to comment.

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Applicants or Appellants are allowed 10 minutes to present testimony at the beginning of the public hearing,

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and if needed, five minutes to present rebuttal at the end of the public hearing,

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all other speakers will be limited to three minutes. Tonight we have the following item,

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item 7b, 585 First Street Skating Rink Use Permit.

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Can we start with commissioner disclosures?

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No disclosures? No disclosures? No disclosures? No disclosures.

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I'm familiar with the site but I went on Sunday to check it out a little bit more.

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All right. And we'll now hear a report from staff.

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Good evening everybody. I'll be presenting on the proposed skating ring at 585 First Street on the

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project applicant Rick Gajel is also here and we'll be speaking later.

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The applicant requires a use permit and a design review permit to construct an

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operate in approximately 6,400 square foot rollers getting ring at the site.

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To start, just regarding the late communication, following publication of the meeting agenda,

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some inconsistencies were identified between the project square footages across the plan

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submitted and the staff report and noticed materials. As included in the memo,

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the proposed skating ring would be up to 6,400 square feet and the proposed roof cover would be up to 7,200 square feet.

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The project site is located on the south side of First Street between Bernanstreet and the Napa River.

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The applicant proposes the addition and operation of an approximately 6,400 square foot rollers

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getting ring under a pre-manufactured metal roof cover. The ring would operate in conjunction with Napa

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Yard and existing outdoor restaurant and entertainment venue. But it is worth noting that the project

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applicant is separate from the operators of Napa Yard they would operate in conjunction at the site.

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The proposed roller skating ring would fall within the site's existing hours of operation.

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10 a.m. to 9 p.m. Monday through Thursday 10 a.m. to 10 p.m. on Friday and Saturday and 10 a.m.

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to 8 p.m. on Sundays. I'm just a note on Napa Yard. It's an existing outdoor restaurant and entertainment

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venue. It's a temporary use. The use permit for the project will expire on December 21,

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29. The use permit for this proposed project if approved would also expire on December 21, 29.

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This is the proposed site plan in blue would be the location of the proposed skating ring.

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And green is the existing mini golf course that was recently approved by the planning commission.

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This is to the north of the dining area of the site into the west of Napa River. The proposed

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ring would be buffered from first street by the mini golf course and the site's existing gardens.

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This is a rendering of the proposed roof cover. It's a fairly simple building

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constructed of cruciform beams and would be open on three sides on all sides excuse me.

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These are the proposed details. The applicant wouldn't install clear acrylic railing.

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String lights would be hung above the ring.

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Skate rentals would occur from one of the site's existing shipping containers that were previously approved

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through prior entitlements. Parking bathroom and other facilities would be shared with Napa Yard.

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To approve the project, the commission must make the findings for our use permit,

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a design review permit, specific findings for the South School Quarter overlay district

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and the findings required by the interim zoning ordinance.

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Staff has also determined that the project would be exempt from sequa pursuant to section 15303,

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which exempts the construction and location of new small facilities and structures. This includes

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up to four commercial structures not exceeding 10,000 square feet.

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And with that staff recommends that the commission adopt a resolution of proving a use permit

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and a designer view permit for the proposed skating ring and are determined that the actions

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authorized by the resolution are exempt from sequa. Thank you.

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Thank you Paul. Do any commissioners have any questions for staff at this time?

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No. Will the applicant be providing a presentation?

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Yes.

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Please come forward.

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Hi. My name is Rick Gajola. This is my part during Logan Mayn.

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So thank you for your time considering our proposal. My name is Rick Gajola and with me is my

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business partner in Logan Mayn. Together we are here asking for your support in bringing

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will like Napa to our community. At its heart, it isn't simply a roller skating ring.

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It's about creating a place where families can spend time together. We're children have

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somewhere safe to go after school or on weekends. We're on our community has another positive

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gathering place. Today's young people face more challenges than ever before. Many spend more time

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behind the screens and have fewer places where they can safely gather with friends.

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We have an opportunity to change that. A skating ring provides a safe, supervised environment where

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children and teenagers can be active, build confidence, develop friendships, and simply enjoy being kids.

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Even every evening a child chooses to spend at our skating ring is an evening there in a safe,

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supervised environment surrounded by friends, families, and positive role models. Research has shown

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the participation in recreational activities can reduce youth and involvement in risky behaviors

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by up to 30%. While a skating ring isn't the solution to every challenge, it can absolutely

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be a part of the solution by giving young people a positive place where they feel welcome, valued, and connected.

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And if that, we build, if what we build helps even one child choose a better path,

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then every bit of our effort we put into this project will have been worth it.

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Roller skating is also one of the few recreational activities that truly brings generations together.

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In a world where it's becoming harder to disconnect from technology and reconnect with one another.

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We want to create a place where those moments happen naturally. We also hope to partner with local

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schools, youth organizations, nonprofits, and community groups. Even envision hosting school nights,

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fundraisers, educational programs, birthday parties, and community events that strengthen the connections

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throughout Napa. This project will also support our local economy by creating jobs, attracting visitors,

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and encouraging families to spend more time supporting the businesses at Napa Yard and throughout our city.

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But above all else, this project is about investing in the quality of life for the people who call Napa home.

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These are remembered not only by the restaurants and businesses, but for the places where childhood memories are made.

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We want, we'll like, not that to become one of those places.

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A place where a child laces up skates for the very first time, where teenagers have a safe place to spend,

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Friday nights, where parents and grandparents laugh alongside their children,

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where birthdays are celebrated, friendships are formed, and families create memories that last a lifetime.

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We aren't simply asking for approval to build a business.

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We are asking for the opportunity to invest in Napa families.

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It's children and its future.

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We believe Napa deserves more opportunities for health recreation, community connection, and family entertainment.

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And we're committed to building something the city of Napa can be proud of for years to come.

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If we'll life Napa helps hundreds of families make memories, we'll be grateful.

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But if it helps even one child find a safe place to be long, make better choices or simply know they have somewhere they are welcome.

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Then that alone will make all of this worthwhile.

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Thank you for your time, your consideration and your service to our community.

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We appreciate the opportunity to share our vision with you, and we'd be happy to answer your questions.

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Thank you.

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Very well said.

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Do any commissioners have any questions for the applicant at this time?

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I just have one question.

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Will roller blades be allowed?

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Yes.

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Excellent.

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Personal roller blades and roller skates will be allowed.

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We already have purchased quad skates, but we are planning on purchasing roller blades also for rent.

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Commissioner Rosario, did you have a question?

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Just a staff question, really.

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For the staff, how long can we keep renewing a temporary use permit?

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Generally, there's not like a set limit to the amount of time.

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Being that there's an application currently under review for the further development of that site that's kind of the intention behind the temporary use permit for this site specifically.

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When there's a consideration, generally across the city, for a use that seeks to be more permanent, then we would push for a standard use permit.

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Where if they act upon their rights based on the conditions and satisfy the conditions, then it's invested right in perpetuity.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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All right, you guys can have a seat.

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Thank you.

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I'm going to open public comment.

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Myra, do we have any public comment cards for this item?

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I did not receive any cards for this item.

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Does there any members of the public that would like to speak on this item?

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Please just state your name when you speak.

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Chris Ben's Napa.

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I'd like to say, I think this is a brilliant idea.

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It brings a brand new type of attraction to Napa.

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The nearest roller rink is in Bruner Park.

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And it's a healthy activity, so I do hope you approve it.

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Thank you.

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Thank you, Chris.

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Hello.

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I'm Jennifer Huffman.

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I've lived in Napa for about 28 years.

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And I was really happy to see on the agenda that it looks like you're recommending that the planning commission adopt the resolution,

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approving use permit and design review permit for rick skating rink in Napa at Napa yard.

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I'm here to show my strong support for this project for three main reasons.

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My husband and I raised three kids here in Napa.

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And of course, Napa has been hugely successful with drawing in visitors for wine-related adult kind of activities.

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We are less successful when it comes to offering things for kids and younger families to do.

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I think we can change that if we commit to new things like the roller skating rink.

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Number two, Rick is a small business owner and we need to support and nurture these entrepreneurs in our city.

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The people who are willing to put themselves out there, especially financially.

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And three, I'm a quad skater.

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And skating is fun.

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Almost any age can do it.

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It's not very expensive.

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You don't need to live equipment.

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So I want to say let's support Rick and his rink.

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And as the shirt says, don't hate roller skate.

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Thank you.

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Good afternoon.

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Commission members and city staff.

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My name is Terrence Mulligan.

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I'm a resident and I'm also the president and CEO of Napa Valley Community Foundation.

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And I'm here in support of the roller rink for two reasons.

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The first is professional and the second is personal.

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Let me start with the second first.

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I am the father of two kids.

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Both, well, teens and young adults.

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And my daughter Claire.

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She played Rex soccer.

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Thank you city of Napa.

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But then she moved to a club soccer.

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And then a academy soccer.

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And the difference between those last two is that it's like imported British coaches and it never ends.

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And it's much more expensive.

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So lucky us were mildly affluent enough to have been able to afford for a decade.

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The frankly, like car payment number that comes attend with getting your kid into enriching activities.

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And I wish that when my kids were small, we had something like this in this community because it's super cool.

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00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:11,000
On the professional side.

225
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:16,000
Lucky me, we get to distribute about ten million dollars a year to local charitable organizations.

226
00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:21,000
And a big part of our mission is to try to build a stronger, more cohesive, more connected community.

227
00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:25,000
A big part of our work is about half a million dollars in scholarships every year.

228
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:28,000
To the most promising kids who come out of our high schools.

229
00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:33,000
And at risk of telling you what you already know, there's just not enough for those young people to do.

230
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:35,000
There's not enough places for us to gather.

231
00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:37,000
So I thank you for your consideration.

232
00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:40,000
And I thank Rick and a partner for what they're trying to do.

233
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:41,000
Thank you, Terence.

234
00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:44,000
Thank you.

235
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:51,000
Good afternoon.

236
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:52,000
I'm Maria Macias.

237
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:54,000
And I'm an upper resident.

238
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:56,000
And in the port of the skating rink.

239
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,000
And why I just came.

240
00:21:58,000 --> 00:21:59,000
I saw that in the neighborhood app.

241
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:01,000
And I just wanted to support.

242
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,000
And when I walked through the door.

243
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,000
I didn't know.

244
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:06,000
And we just, I saw our escape.

245
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,000
And we just picked up a conversation.

246
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:11,000
And I just want to say it's where adults too.

247
00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:13,000
I mean, I skated my whole life.

248
00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:14,000
The quads.

249
00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:16,000
And it was a big part of my childhood.

250
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:17,000
But I saw adults.

251
00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:19,000
And it was just like community.

252
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:22,000
Like I said, I just met Jennifer outside there.

253
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:23,000
And what a wonderful thing.

254
00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:26,000
Right for our community to bring skating to it.

255
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:27,000
Not just for children.

256
00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:29,000
But like Rick said, it's like a community thing.

257
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:33,000
And you have the great memories growing up where you skated.

258
00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:36,000
And when you could go by yourself for the first time.

259
00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:38,000
Your parents could drop you off at the rink.

260
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:39,000
And you could skate.

261
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:40,000
And then they would pick you up.

262
00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,000
And what a wonderful thing for our community.

263
00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:45,000
So I just wanted to say that's why it came.

264
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:47,000
And I just wanted to give my support.

265
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:48,000
And thank you for your time.

266
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:49,000
Thank you.

267
00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:51,000
Seeing that there are no more requests to speak.

268
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:54,000
Is there a motion to close public comment?

269
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:56,000
So moved.

270
00:22:56,000 --> 00:23:05,000
Second, all those in favor?

271
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:06,000
Hi.

272
00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:11,000
I'm just going to echo a lot of what we've already heard.

273
00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:21,000
I appreciate applicants who are willing to invest in experiences that strengthen our community.

274
00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:24,000
The mini golf course has been amazing.

275
00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:26,000
I'm excited to see this come.

276
00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:32,000
And I am in support of this project.

277
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:38,000
Isn't it nice to see some of the things from our youth coming back to know that?

278
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:41,000
I would say I grew up here in town.

279
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:45,000
And years ago, we had mini golf.

280
00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:49,000
And a couple of skating rinks actually in a couple different places.

281
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,000
So it's nice to see it come back.

282
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:54,000
I'm going to sort of support of the project.

283
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:56,000
My only.

284
00:23:56,000 --> 00:24:00,000
I think my only concern really is.

285
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:02,000
It's a shame that this building is open.

286
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:08,000
At this point and is not really a year-round facility.

287
00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:09,000
Yeah.

288
00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:10,000
Someday.

289
00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:11,000
I hope.

290
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:12,000
Anyway.

291
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:14,000
Thank you.

292
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:16,000
I wish I shot well.

293
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:17,000
Do you have any comments?

294
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:20,000
Oh, you bet I do.

295
00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:23,000
This is so bitter sweet.

296
00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:28,000
My husband and I, we moved here almost 24 years ago.

297
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:31,000
And we moved here from Los Angeles.

298
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,000
And we.

299
00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:38,000
We didn't understand why there weren't any roller rinks anywhere near by.

300
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:41,000
I didn't even know about the runner park.

301
00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:42,000
One.

302
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:47,000
We thought that the former Montgomery Ward building that is now a target.

303
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:49,000
We thought that would be perfect.

304
00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:53,000
And then when safely closed, we're like, there's, there it is.

305
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:58,000
Let's do this and we looked into actually what it would take.

306
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:00,000
And we just didn't have the funds.

307
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:03,000
We couldn't deal with the liability issues.

308
00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:05,000
It was a dream that never happened.

309
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:08,000
We wanted the downstairs to be a roller rink.

310
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:12,000
And then to have a plexiglass upper level.

311
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,000
That would be.

312
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:24,000
For another, like it would, I'm sorry, in ice skating rink on the bottom floor and then a plexiglass roller skating rink on the upper floor.

313
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:29,000
With lots of other fun activities for kids.

314
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:31,000
We don't even have children.

315
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:35,000
We just didn't understand why this, these things weren't available here.

316
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:38,000
So cut to.

317
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:41,000
We brought our roller blades here.

318
00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:43,000
My husband still roller blades.

319
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:46,000
You might see him with dogs pulling him from time to time.

320
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:51,000
I've tried rollerblading and quad skating at Kennedy Park.

321
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:54,000
And not a river trail around my neighborhood.

322
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,000
Oxbow commons.

323
00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:00,000
Sadly two years ago.

324
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:03,000
I decided that I was too old for it.

325
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:07,000
So I gave away my roller blades and my roller skates.

326
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:10,000
I had already sold my skateboard many years ago.

327
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:13,000
And now we're getting my dream.

328
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,000
So I am thrilled.

329
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,000
I will support it.

330
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:20,000
But it's better sweet.

331
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,000
Thank you.

332
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:23,000
You buck.

333
00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:27,000
I said this before when you came forward with the Mitting Golf project.

334
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:32,000
But any creative way to utilize the space during the interim.

335
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:33,000
I think it's great.

336
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:37,000
I applaud you for continuing to look for opportunities to utilize it.

337
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:41,000
Well, the other application is pending and I support the project.

338
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,000
Thank you.

339
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:49,000
Can I get somebody who wants to make the recommendation?

340
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:52,000
I move that the Planning Commission adopted a resolution.

341
00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:56,000
Approving a use permit and designer be permit allowing the construction.

342
00:26:56,000 --> 00:27:00,000
An operation of a new approximately 6,400 square foot roller skating rink.

343
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:05,000
And determined that the actions authorized by this resolution are exempt from sequel.

344
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,000
Second.

345
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:08,000
All those in favor?

346
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:09,000
Hi.

347
00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:10,000
Motion passes.

348
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:11,000
Congratulations.

349
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,000
All right.

350
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,000
Administrative reports.

351
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:28,000
Administrative report items include reports and recommendations from city staff that do not require a public hearing prior to action by the Commission.

352
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:31,000
The Commission may take action if the agenda description provides for it.

353
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:36,000
Only the Planning Commission may authorize public input for these items.

354
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:44,000
And seeing that this is a very big item that involves our community that the city has been working on for many years.

355
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:50,000
We will take some public comment after the applicant and the Commission has deliberated.

356
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:55,000
Tonight we have item 8A zoning ordinance update study session.

357
00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:02,000
We will now hear the report from Lisa Wise consulting and staff.

358
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:04,000
Thank you very much chair.

359
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:05,000
Thank you commissioners.

360
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:08,000
We are happy to be back here in beautiful Napa.

361
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:12,000
We were here as you may recall last year for a couple of city sessions.

362
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:16,000
So this is our third study session here before you today.

363
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,000
So happy to be back.

364
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,000
I will say commissioner shot well.

365
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:24,000
Please bear with me because this presentation is similar to the one that you heard.

366
00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:34,000
A couple nights ago there's a little more detail in this one for the for the Planning Commissioners.

367
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,000
To the computer.

368
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:38,000
Is it this computer.

369
00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:48,000
Excuse this for one moment please.

370
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:36,000
Okay.

371
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:37,000
We're back.

372
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:38,000
Thank you.

373
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:46,000
So of course you all know city city staff, but just for the public to point out who the key players are on on this project.

374
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:51,000
I'm right right or daily playing managers also the project manager for this project.

375
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:56,000
I'm over the last couple years we have worked with closely with Mike Walker and Mike Allen as well.

376
00:29:56,000 --> 00:30:01,000
On the Lisa Wise consulting side we have Katherine Slump.

377
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:05,040
who's in the audience here, who's the director and project manager for this project. My name is

378
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:11,200
Stephanie Rikiki. And then we also have Cal Courts here today next to Katherine. She is our residential

379
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:17,680
objective design standards expert. So she will be providing support as needed there. Tonight we're

380
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:22,080
going to go through a little bit of the background of the project, what we've been up to these last

381
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:28,240
couple years and in the year since we last spoke, then we'll talk about what's actually in the public

382
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:34,400
review draft zoning ordinance and the math and some key changes there and then talk about next steps.

383
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:41,600
In terms of objectives for this project, it should be the same as what you saw last time

384
00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:46,880
about a year ago. The thrust of this of course is implementing the general plan and the housing

385
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:52,320
element, the ICO, in terms of zoning ordinances being implemented through this to the various

386
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:57,760
mixed use zones that the city had already developed. We will be talking about the residential

387
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:04,480
objective design standards today as well as other modernization, legal consistency and

388
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:12,160
not only the zoning ordinance for the code but the map as well. So in terms of past overview

389
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:20,640
this project kicked off about two years ago, July 2024. Since that time we've had the community feedback

390
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:27,600
survey that many people participated in that was early 2025. We did speak with stakeholders and various

391
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:35,600
city departments on their thoughts for potential improvements for the code. As I mentioned we had those two

392
00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:42,400
steady sessions last last spring here with the Planning Commission. Our second workshop as you heard was

393
00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:50,960
was Tuesday this this week and then we did talk to the residential objective design standards advisory group

394
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:55,680
in developing those design standards. So there's been a lot about reach for this project thus far

395
00:31:56,480 --> 00:32:03,040
and then we are getting to the latter stages of the project but we are in the public review period now.

396
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:11,280
So prior to this meeting common themes that we've heard about and discussed with others have to do with

397
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:19,200
reducing parking requirements. An issue that came up through various means and media had to do with

398
00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:25,520
stakeholders pointed out difficulties achieving maximum densities that are set forth in the general

399
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:31,920
plan and so we did look at various development standards and how to modify those to accommodate those

400
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:38,720
those densities set forth in the general plan. In fill was it was a big focus wanting to to avoid

401
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:45,760
sprawl so where are you know those strategic locations that can densify here in Napa. Well also wanted to protect

402
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:51,120
the small town feel. I'm running out toward dining as well in terms of uses we heard that

403
00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:59,120
Napa needs more housing. Economic development and others were specifically interested in maker uses.

404
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:07,840
Also a theme that came up was looking at ways to regulate fossil fuel stations in a more stringent manner

405
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:13,760
and then balancing the needs of tourists and residences in residence. He's me. Another

406
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:19,600
comment that came up several times was that the design review process through the city could use a

407
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:26,080
little bit of extra attention and then what were ways to empower staff to make decisions at

408
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:33,200
the staff level as well when appropriate and then otherwise more general comments about making the code

409
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:41,280
more user friendly updating graphics there were some really old graphics in the code and then simplifying

410
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:47,280
and consolidating definitions. As I mentioned this project kicked off about two years ago

411
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:54,640
we have moved from identifying issues and opportunities to recommendations which is

412
00:33:54,640 --> 00:34:00,000
over here last since that time over the last year we've been drafting the code so we have prepared the

413
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:06,720
administrative draft that we work with staff to make appropriate edits to now prepare the public review

414
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:14,240
draft zoning ordinance that's before you today and then yes now and I apologize that that we are here

415
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:19,680
actually should be one lower that was for the workshop but now we're in the public review and

416
00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:26,480
getting close to adoption for this project so we are in the public review phase so we are looking for

417
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:31,040
forward to potential hearings over the next few months for adoption of this project.

418
00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:40,320
In terms of deliverables that got us to where we are today with the public review draft zoning

419
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:47,760
ordinance was the two-part technical consistency memo it looked at the general plan state law,

420
00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:55,520
federal law and compared the code to those for identifying inconsistencies and inconsistencies but also

421
00:34:55,520 --> 00:35:03,440
we had a portion of the memo had to do with residential objective design standards as well and the

422
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:09,440
findings you can see there we found that yes several of the zones needed work there opportunities for

423
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:18,800
new zones things to align the zones with the general plan we heard about the city's design guidelines

424
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:26,240
that were subjective right and then that there was some work to be done in regard to uses and and permitting

425
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:35,680
also another deliverable that informed this zoning ordinance was the development standard testing

426
00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:40,880
approach memo so we looked at various residential zones the development standards within them and again

427
00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:48,240
excuse me and then also looked at average parcel sizes residential parcel sizes within the city

428
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:55,840
to see whether these maximum densities of the general plan puts forth could be attained and we found

429
00:35:55,840 --> 00:36:01,360
that there did need to be a little bit of tweaking to the development standard so things such as high

430
00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:08,960
light coverage and setbacks were proposed to be or are proposed to be modified to allow for

431
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:17,680
for those maximum densities to be reached consistent with the general plan so that was a lot of the

432
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:24,560
background that led up to where we are today in terms of the this is the table of contents for the code

433
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:30,240
the structure now is organized into parts and I think we talked about this last year we're making our

434
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:37,040
recommendations but this is to try to promote user-friendlyness we find this works well for codes so we have five

435
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:46,160
parts 17 ABCDE that there's the general part that has introductory language for the code part B is definitions and we did

436
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:52,320
break up definitions into various categories it's not just a running list of definitions but again trying to

437
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:58,560
promote that user-friendlyness and intuitiveness of the code so we do break the definitions up into uses terms

438
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:05,520
measurements and sign terms as well the meat of the code really starts in part 17C which are those

439
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:12,560
zoning district regulations similar to what you have today in terms of organization where the zoning

440
00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:19,920
districts are grouped so we'll talk about that but then part 17D these are city-wide standards are not

441
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:25,360
zones specific standards but standards that apply throughout the whole city and then admin procedures

442
00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:33,360
is all the all the permitting and legislative actions within the code just getting a little more

443
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:40,320
fine grain in terms of this the structure and the the numbering syntax of the code

444
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:48,160
again we introduced parts as organizing principle but then instead of increments of two for the chapter we

445
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:54,160
included increments of 10 this allows more space within the code for future amendments so you don't get

446
00:37:55,680 --> 00:38:01,760
other situations where you have to go chapter 1725-06 you know kind of the thing we wanted to

447
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:07,360
allow more room there for amendments and otherwise it's very similar to what you have now so you can

448
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:13,360
see at the bottom of the table that the comparisons but the sections are so increments of 10 we swapped

449
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:19,360
in a room in numeral for an error-bake numeral there just to differentiate a little bit more

450
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:26,160
so that had to do more with structure in terms of the overall approach we were trying to

451
00:38:26,720 --> 00:38:31,120
hit all the objectives I mentioned on the prior slide right implementing the general plan

452
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:37,440
legal consistency as well as incorporating best practices and being responsive to all the all the

453
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:42,880
feedback that we've received to this point otherwise just wanting to modernize the code

454
00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:52,640
and and streamline things as as possible or where it made sense so getting into a little bit more

455
00:38:52,640 --> 00:39:01,120
of the the meat of the code here part 17c zone just at regulations as you can see we have the zones grouped

456
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:11,520
by by zone type this these this table on on the next slide show what the various land use

457
00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:17,200
designations are or land use categories are in the general plan and what the relationship is

458
00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:24,640
of those land use categories to both existing zones and and proposed zoning districts as well

459
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:33,360
and and the second column is some of these are like a kind of a best fit right what's the closest

460
00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:39,840
existing zone that would implement the land use designation but we did find room for for modifications

461
00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:47,200
of course so what I guess a notable zone there is the multi-family residential medium that is a

462
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:53,520
a new zone implementing the medium density residential land use category otherwise we generally

463
00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:58,400
tried to keep a one to one relationship between the implementing zone and the general plan land use

464
00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:04,160
category that wasn't that wasn't possible I didn't make sense in all cases but that's kind of a general

465
00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:10,480
general theme here for commercial we did keep both the local commercial and community

466
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:15,840
commercial zones that that general commercial land use category did have room and it we thought it

467
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:21,440
did make sense to keep two zones there otherwise we did look for opportunities for consolidation

468
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:27,600
such as the residential office and commercial office being consolidated into this new commercial

469
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:33,280
business park zone hospitality commercial was renamed or excuse me tourists commercial was

470
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:40,960
renamed hospitality commercial so that was relatively minor there otherwise in terms of the mixed

471
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:47,600
use zones again we part of this right was taking the in terms of any ordinance and incorporating it into

472
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:56,320
the comprehensive zoning ordinance so we pulled those ICO mixed use zones through here for industrial

473
00:40:56,320 --> 00:41:01,760
zones the flex industrial zone is is new consistent with that general plan land use category

474
00:41:02,720 --> 00:41:10,000
and then otherwise we did consolidate some of the public serving zones into one zone and then

475
00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:16,320
other note where they changes the green belt land use category we did not see an implementing zone in

476
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:22,640
the current zoning ordinance and so have created the conservation open space zone for that as well

477
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:28,800
the downtown districts we didn't really touch the downtown districts those those carry forward

478
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:38,400
so getting a little bit more into the details of of what the zones are it's a gradation of course so

479
00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:43,600
the single family residential very low these are larger lots with single family residences

480
00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:50,320
similarly single family residential low is also lower density single family neighborhoods

481
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:57,360
traditional residential you start to get more missing mental housing so single family but

482
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:03,920
then also the various plexus court yard apartments those kinds of things and as the densities and

483
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:09,120
height continued increase we get to the multifamily residential medium zone which also has

484
00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:15,680
suggests right the name multifamily housing in addition to single family and then multifamily residential

485
00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:26,880
high gets up to four stories does allow commercial uses as well in terms of the

486
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:31,680
the actual commercial uses again we carried forward the local commercial and community

487
00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:39,360
commercial zoning districts hospitality commercial as well continues to allow tourist oriented uses

488
00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:45,440
and then around the hospital medical office was maintained and as I mentioned the new

489
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:52,000
consolidated commercial business parks zone was was included these are office-related uses but also

490
00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:57,360
allow residential and I will say another change we did medical office also allows

491
00:42:58,240 --> 00:43:04,160
health-related residential as well things like assisted living and nursing homes things like that

492
00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:11,680
and then mixed use zones again carry those forward from the in terms of zoning ordinance the

493
00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:22,960
tannery bend mixed use zone also does does carry forward here in terms of industrial that flex

494
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:33,840
industrial zone is new so that is more of the makers zone so smaller scale industrial producers but

495
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:39,760
also some some residential component there in the flex industrial zone otherwise the light industrial

496
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:47,760
and industrial park zoning districts carry forward and then as I mentioned we did consolidate zones into

497
00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:54,240
the public zone parks and open space does carry forward as the agricultural resource but then this

498
00:43:54,240 --> 00:44:02,080
conservation open space zone is is a new zone that implements that green belt land use category and then

499
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:07,120
in terms of the overlays the active frontage overlay which is from the in terms of zoning

500
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:12,960
ordinance does carry forward into the zoning ordinance here as well as all the other

501
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:22,560
overlays that exist in the municipal code today so that was zones in terms of land uses there are

502
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:28,960
some new land uses that we added we also consolidated land uses I know about a year ago we had talked

503
00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:35,920
about food trucks right so that's the mobile food bending park use that was included otherwise several

504
00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:41,360
types of housing called for by state law and housing element and then that makers use the artisan

505
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:48,480
in small scale manufacturing uses is a new use and then you can see we just have a few examples of where

506
00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:55,120
we consolidated land uses as I'm sure you're familiar zoning codes have a tendency to get very long

507
00:44:55,120 --> 00:45:00,160
and so anywhere we can be more succinct and

508
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:06,400
consolidate things we take that opportunity. So we did so with the land uses as well.

509
00:45:10,080 --> 00:45:16,800
Here we have just additional new or updated definitions for various types of uses.

510
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:25,200
And then we did modify where certain types of commercial uses, excuse me that are allowed in

511
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:36,320
both the residential high district, as well as commercial uses such as small grocery stores in the

512
00:45:37,600 --> 00:45:44,080
hospitality commercial district as well. And then regarding residential, I to

513
00:45:44,080 --> 00:45:50,320
look to this a little bit beforehand, but we did add residential uses as allowed uses in the OEM district

514
00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:55,120
if they're health or medical related and that's consistent with the underlying land use category.

515
00:45:55,840 --> 00:46:03,760
And then the commercial zones, the general plan sees those more as as strictly commercial zones. And so we

516
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:09,600
removed residential use allowances there in in CL and CC local commercial and we need to

517
00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:17,760
commercial. Last time we were here, we spent a good amount of time or our state sessions were

518
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,440
focused on the special uses that we wanted to talk about with you today as well.

519
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:33,360
So drive throughs. The purpose here was to look to find ways to add regulations on drive throughs to

520
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:41,680
promote alternative typologies. And there is that policy in the general plan that calls for the

521
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:47,600
discouraging of drive throughs in the city. So taking that into account, the planning commission

522
00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:54,160
was interested in all kinds of regulations that we had talked about last time. And so we've included those

523
00:46:54,160 --> 00:47:01,440
in the code. So some of the regulations have to do with the location and not wanting to have an overconcentration

524
00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:09,680
of drive throughs. So you see that 500 foot separation distance, also location standard wanting to have

525
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:14,560
drive throughs more limited in terms of where they're allowed. So they need to be near on six

526
00:47:14,560 --> 00:47:19,360
hundred within six hundred feet of an off ramp there. We also have standards for drive through windows where

527
00:47:19,360 --> 00:47:26,480
those should be located. And then took, excuse me, to screening seriously as an important

528
00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:35,120
measure to prevent headlight glare from drive throughs as well. In terms of food tracks, we understand that

529
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:43,040
the city did want to allow food trucks on private property, but also regulate, regulate them. And so

530
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:50,960
as proposed in the draft code, mobile food vendors can operate in the various zones. You see there with

531
00:47:50,960 --> 00:47:56,960
a commercial use permit. We have standards requiring them to be parked on a paved surface.

532
00:47:57,680 --> 00:48:03,760
And then we do have a minimum separation from existing restaurants that I believe we talked about

533
00:48:03,840 --> 00:48:08,320
on last time we were here as something that was important to the community. Otherwise,

534
00:48:08,320 --> 00:48:15,040
they do need to have their own access to a restroom and they have hours of operations set forth as well.

535
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:24,400
Another topic that we discussed at our our city sessions last time around had to do with

536
00:48:24,400 --> 00:48:30,960
emphightsound and live entertainment. And so again, it's it's a balancing act here in terms of

537
00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:38,160
promoting live entertainment, but also thinking about potential impacts on others in terms of

538
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:48,000
amplified sound. And so there is an addition to a noise ordinance and we did draw from the noise

539
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:54,880
element in terms of hours of operations, decibel levels, et cetera. So in addition to the more general

540
00:48:54,880 --> 00:49:03,760
noise ordinance, we included standards for live entertainment uses. So cannot be within 125 feet of

541
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:12,000
a residence outside of 8 a.m. to 8 a.m. to 8 a.m. to 10 p.m. on weekends, unless the planning commission

542
00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:18,960
authorizes a use permit. So that's that's the standard that's applied to live entertainment there.

543
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:25,440
And then lastly, fossil fuel service stations. There was interest. We know there was the more

544
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:31,840
tournament that the city had on fossil fuel service stations. And there was interest in regulating these

545
00:49:31,840 --> 00:49:38,640
more stringently as well. So similarly, drive throughs we do have the separation distance required for fossil

546
00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:46,880
fuel stations. It's a thousand feet is what we proposed. And then otherwise have setbacks and curb cut distance

547
00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:54,320
setbacks that you have to have landscaping standards and a screening wall when a button residential

548
00:49:54,320 --> 00:50:02,080
I'm as well for fossil fuel service stations. And so that that was a lot that had to do with with uses

549
00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:08,880
now we're getting into the city wide standards. So a lot of this has carried forward in terms of

550
00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:17,680
additional site regulations, standards for environmental sensitive areas. We did we did make

551
00:50:18,720 --> 00:50:25,040
moderate reductions to parking requirements, signs largely carried forward, but there are standards for

552
00:50:25,680 --> 00:50:31,600
the specific uses that we talked about. And really the focus here is on the residential objective

553
00:50:31,600 --> 00:50:40,720
design standards. So as as you've heard state law does not allow jurisdictions to

554
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:47,040
deny residential projects based on on subjective design standards. So previously the city had

555
00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:55,760
all the various guidelines on the screen. And so we took those and turned the turn guidelines and when

556
00:50:55,760 --> 00:51:02,160
we turned sheds into shells where it made sense. So I was working with city staff and the residential

557
00:51:02,160 --> 00:51:09,920
ODS advisory group through several meetings. And we also did look at existing projects in the city

558
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:18,240
informulating the design standards. This is the table of contents for the residential objective design

559
00:51:18,240 --> 00:51:24,240
standards. We have standards that apply an all residential cases to all residential projects. And then we

560
00:51:24,240 --> 00:51:31,040
have standards that apply to single-family residences due places or to unit projects. And then

561
00:51:31,040 --> 00:51:35,760
another section with standards for multi-family residential projects as well.

562
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:46,720
I'm in terms of the general standards. One of the themes that we wanted to address here was privacy.

563
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:56,000
And so we have standards for windows. We have if you're near your neighbor's side property line,

564
00:51:56,720 --> 00:52:04,720
the window has to be set at a certain angle or be frosted glazing. Similarly, second stories that are near

565
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:12,080
the side property line. There are privacy fences that are required. And then we do have standards

566
00:52:12,080 --> 00:52:23,760
for materials as well. For single-family and two-unit projects, and for multi-family

567
00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:29,760
projects as well. But we wanted to be cognizant of the massing of buildings and how that could

568
00:52:30,720 --> 00:52:38,800
impact surrounding properties. And so there are step-backs required in certain cases. So step-backs to the

569
00:52:38,880 --> 00:52:47,360
upper story. And then in terms of visual interest, we wanted to promote visual interest and high-quality

570
00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:54,160
design. There are various articulation features that are required when the building elevations

571
00:52:54,160 --> 00:53:02,160
start to get longer. So we don't want long-blank kind of plain buildings. We want visual interest.

572
00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:08,800
And so drawing from the guidelines, these are some of the standards that have been developed

573
00:53:08,800 --> 00:53:16,400
requiring articulation as well. And then we want, and the standards, the design guidelines used

574
00:53:16,400 --> 00:53:24,400
me called for garages to be clearly subordinate to the homes on properties. And so that is included in

575
00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:32,080
the standards as well. Similarly, for multi-family projects, there are different

576
00:53:32,080 --> 00:53:40,320
standards, but the considerations were similar in terms of massing step-backs are required when

577
00:53:40,320 --> 00:53:48,240
near single-family residential or traditional residential zones for the beyond four stories. And then

578
00:53:49,120 --> 00:53:57,840
again, wanting high-quality design and requiring articulation standards for multi-family

579
00:53:57,840 --> 00:54:07,040
residences as well. So those are things like balconies, bay windows, projections, recesses, etc.

580
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:15,840
I'm to add more detail to buildings. And then roofs as well, if they start getting very long,

581
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:23,440
you to include articulation. And then lastly, parking similar to garages, again, should be clearly

582
00:54:23,520 --> 00:54:30,240
subordinate to the building and so needs to be located in the rear or side of the property.

583
00:54:32,240 --> 00:54:38,080
And then of course, private and common open spaces required. And structured parking needs,

584
00:54:38,880 --> 00:54:46,000
some ground floor residential uses as well. So that's an overview of the objective design

585
00:54:46,000 --> 00:54:51,920
standards and the issues and considerations you wanted to take into account as we're developing them.

586
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:57,280
And the last part of the zoning ordinance is the administration of procedures. Of course,

587
00:54:57,280 --> 00:55:03,120
all the various permit types. And we've modified those. And I'm adding new ones as appropriate.

588
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:13,200
And the legislative actions are included here as well. So in this table, you can see the zoning

589
00:55:13,200 --> 00:55:19,280
clearance. That was not necessarily a new approval type for the city, but we really

590
00:55:21,280 --> 00:55:28,240
strengthened and added more detail to the zoning clearance in large bar because of the objective

591
00:55:28,240 --> 00:55:34,160
design standards and the requirement that residential projects that comply with the ODS with the

592
00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:42,080
objective design standards be processed in a streamlined manner. So we added quite a bit there to the zoning

593
00:55:42,160 --> 00:55:48,160
clearance. Otherwise, there's an administrative design review that we've clearly called out to

594
00:55:48,160 --> 00:55:52,800
distinguish from design review. So design review, as opposed to administrative design review,

595
00:55:52,800 --> 00:55:58,400
would still go to a planning commission. Hotels would still go to a council.

596
00:55:59,840 --> 00:56:06,640
For the use permits, we you had an administrative permit. We've broken that up into into various

597
00:56:06,640 --> 00:56:11,600
permits. One of them being the administrative use permit as well as the conditional use permit.

598
00:56:12,240 --> 00:56:16,320
These administrative permits, again, can be approved at the staff level.

599
00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:23,040
And then also, as you can see on the screen, we added a temporary use permit as well.

600
00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:28,640
I think right now the city goes to a use permit process, like we just saw for temporary uses.

601
00:56:29,760 --> 00:56:38,080
We took a lot of the standards that the city already had. And for temporary use projects, those are

602
00:56:38,080 --> 00:56:43,520
now subject to a temporary use permit, which is a little bit different from the conditional use permit

603
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:54,080
as proposed in the other review draft. We did also have additional things that an administrative

604
00:56:54,640 --> 00:57:02,720
exception would apply to. So we'll talk about those. And then again, the legislative actions and decisions

605
00:57:02,720 --> 00:57:13,920
are all codified there as well. So as I mentioned, the administrative permit was separated into various

606
00:57:13,920 --> 00:57:17,440
types of permits. So the administrative use permit, of course, having to do with uses,

607
00:57:17,440 --> 00:57:22,800
administrative exceptions with development standards and that temporary use permit. And we talked

608
00:57:22,800 --> 00:57:28,480
about the streamline minister review process, especially for projects that comply with the residential

609
00:57:28,480 --> 00:57:35,840
objective design standards. And then otherwise, clarify applicability and review thresholds.

610
00:57:36,480 --> 00:57:43,120
So that's clear and removed overlap between the various permit types. And when they would apply,

611
00:57:43,120 --> 00:57:48,400
so we won't really clear discrete thresholds for when various permits apply.

612
00:57:54,160 --> 00:57:56,000
And now the text is starting to get small.

613
00:57:59,040 --> 00:58:04,960
So we did clarify the, again, the administrative design review that that's a

614
00:58:04,960 --> 00:58:12,240
director-level clarifying thresholds there. So smaller buildings, non-residential buildings,

615
00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:19,040
between 500 to 5000 square feet, as proposed. Now those would be subject to an administrative

616
00:58:19,040 --> 00:58:26,320
design review permit, whereas the design review permit now would apply to, as proposed,

617
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:33,760
would apply to non-residential structures, 5000 square feet or larger. So those are the thresholds

618
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:41,200
that that we've included here. And then otherwise there are other things that the administrative

619
00:58:41,200 --> 00:58:47,360
design review can kind of prove, including reductions in setbacks for mixed use projects.

620
00:58:48,320 --> 00:58:53,200
Otherwise, the design review, which would still go to planning commission,

621
00:58:55,120 --> 00:58:59,680
that would apply to projects that don't comply with the residential objective design standards.

622
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:08,400
And then for the administrative exceptions, we did add many things, many situations that that could

623
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:15,680
apply to. So additional deviations at that administrative exception level versus having to get a

624
00:59:15,680 --> 00:59:22,640
variance for things like limited deviations to parking requirements, setbacks, and the like there.

625
00:59:25,920 --> 00:59:29,520
Okay, so we're getting close to the end. So other presentations I appreciate everyone

626
00:59:29,520 --> 00:59:36,480
bearing with me. The map on the left is the city's current zoning map today. As you can see,

627
00:59:36,480 --> 00:59:41,600
it's, you know, not the easiest thing to read. So the public review draft we've color coded everything

628
00:59:41,600 --> 00:59:48,080
and includes the new zones, the modified zones. I mean, there are two maps. There's the

629
00:59:48,080 --> 00:59:52,720
base zone map. It's color coded and we have a color coded. It's not shown on the screen, but a color

630
00:59:52,720 --> 00:59:59,920
coded map for the overlays as well. So again, just basic modernization user friendly.

631
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:11,000
So, again, we are in the public review period, comments have been coming in, city staff has been sharing those with us.

632
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:15,000
Of course, we're looking forward to planning commissioner comments as well.

633
01:00:15,000 --> 01:00:19,000
The public review period does close end of next week.

634
01:00:19,000 --> 01:00:22,000
So, a Friday, July 24th.

635
01:00:22,000 --> 01:00:29,000
Of course, as required by state law, we are working with our subconsultant on secret compliance

636
01:00:29,000 --> 01:00:32,000
for the comprehensive zoning ordinance and zoning map.

637
01:00:32,000 --> 01:00:37,000
But largely, drawing from the environment I reviewed that was done for the general plan.

638
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:42,000
And then, otherwise, in terms of next steps, we're looking for public hearings here over the next few months,

639
01:00:42,000 --> 01:00:48,000
public hearings for adoption of this project.

640
01:00:48,000 --> 01:00:50,000
The contact for this.

641
01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:52,000
You can submit comments or questions at zoning.

642
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:55,000
Update at cityofnapa.org.

643
01:00:55,000 --> 01:00:58,000
And then, for those that are interested in signing out for emails,

644
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:04,000
you can sign up for emails at the city website for this project as well.

645
01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:05,000
And that is it.

646
01:01:05,000 --> 01:01:08,000
I'm, you know, of course, obviously I'm here and my colleagues are here as well.

647
01:01:08,000 --> 01:01:11,000
So, we're available to answer any questions that you may have.

648
01:01:11,000 --> 01:01:12,000
Thank you very much.

649
01:01:12,000 --> 01:01:13,000
Thank you.

650
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:20,000
To staff have anything in addition, they want to report?

651
01:01:20,000 --> 01:01:26,000
Yeah, maybe just a primer for that kind of expectations for the intent behind the zoning ordinance.

652
01:01:26,000 --> 01:01:34,000
This is obviously the general plan and the monumental effort that it was in the community input and the decisions ultimately made by council.

653
01:01:34,000 --> 01:01:36,000
That cast a pretty wide net.

654
01:01:36,000 --> 01:01:44,000
The intent behind this adoption of a comprehensive zoning ordinance update is going to accomplish a lot of what the general plan asked for.

655
01:01:44,000 --> 01:01:46,000
But it won't accomplish everything, right?

656
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:48,000
There will be some targeted efforts.

657
01:01:48,000 --> 01:01:51,000
There's some county wide efforts.

658
01:01:51,000 --> 01:02:01,000
Regional climate action and adaptation plan that will focus on more climate initiatives that then will look towards local adoption of that.

659
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:07,000
Local active transportation plan, which will fill in some of the holes related to transportation.

660
01:02:07,000 --> 01:02:15,000
Among other programs including housing element programs that will take a little bit more of a focus review towards housing programs.

661
01:02:15,000 --> 01:02:25,000
Also, the intent even with the new zone districts and appointed clarity because I know the conversation has come up in the supplemental comments.

662
01:02:25,000 --> 01:02:28,000
The zone districts propose that they're new and they have a different name.

663
01:02:28,000 --> 01:02:34,000
It's still the intention is to conform to that general plan designation.

664
01:02:34,000 --> 01:02:44,000
So, if a property is designated for a specific use, then the intent under this is to conform to the designation.

665
01:02:44,000 --> 01:02:48,000
That was approved with that general plan.

666
01:02:48,000 --> 01:02:51,000
So, it may come by a different name.

667
01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:59,000
But the intent with the development standards, the land use is generally art to conform to what that designation calls for.

668
01:02:59,000 --> 01:03:05,000
So, the notable one is like, the green belt designation isn't going under a green belt zoning district.

669
01:03:05,000 --> 01:03:08,000
It's going under a conservation open space zone district.

670
01:03:08,000 --> 01:03:14,000
But the intent is to still conform to the green belt designation.

671
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:28,000
So, generally approach that with an open mind if you look is a lot of the decisions in the way that the draft was structured was to really feed into the general plan and not conflict with the general plan.

672
01:03:28,000 --> 01:03:36,000
So, looking at the policies, looking at the standards, looking at the types of land uses feed into each individual designation.

673
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:49,000
That's kind of the intent of the why the land use table and the selective, the selective decision between the individual land uses, how the land uses were defined generally.

674
01:03:49,000 --> 01:03:51,000
There's a lot of effort that went into that.

675
01:03:51,000 --> 01:04:01,000
There's a lot of discussion back and forth even with one land use in one zone district that may have been a very long conversation.

676
01:04:01,000 --> 01:04:04,000
So, that's just a good primer.

677
01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:11,000
I do want to just thank the crowd here tonight in appreciative of everyone that attended the workshop on Tuesday.

678
01:04:11,000 --> 01:04:19,000
Everyone that's been conveying comments and would continue to recommend conveyance of public comment at that email address listed on the PowerPoint.

679
01:04:19,000 --> 01:04:23,000
So, zoning update at cityofnapa.org.

680
01:04:23,000 --> 01:04:29,000
Other than that, just appreciate your time here today and open for any questions you have.

681
01:04:29,000 --> 01:04:36,000
Thank you, writer and thank you for clarifying the green belt and open space.

682
01:04:36,000 --> 01:04:39,000
All right, who wants to start?

683
01:04:39,000 --> 01:04:42,000
Questions or comments for staff or the consulting team?

684
01:04:42,000 --> 01:04:44,000
Commissioner Ibac?

685
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:58,000
I guess before we get started, what is most helpful in terms of providing questions and comments is it easier if we kind of chunk it out and say we're going to talk about residential design standards and address all of those comments at once.

686
01:04:58,000 --> 01:05:06,000
Or what works best for staff and consulting team?

687
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:09,000
I don't have a preference. I'm happy to take them.

688
01:05:09,000 --> 01:05:15,000
If you just have things at the front of your mind that you want to talk about, we can do that or we can structure it.

689
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:19,000
You know, in a more focused manner, either way is okay with would be.

690
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:23,000
I mean, I have a list. I just don't know if I should have a page number.

691
01:05:23,000 --> 01:05:26,000
It's helpful to have the page number.

692
01:05:26,000 --> 01:05:32,000
Maybe as you go and if we have comments on that topic, then we can add on to it.

693
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:34,000
Okay.

694
01:05:38,000 --> 01:05:48,000
So starting off on page 57, the definition for sorry you have to give a 17 dot pages.

695
01:05:48,000 --> 01:05:50,000
It's on the bottom of the bottom.

696
01:05:50,000 --> 01:05:53,000
The bottom writer left of the page will tell you.

697
01:05:53,000 --> 01:05:55,000
Page 17 B33.

698
01:05:55,000 --> 01:05:59,000
The definition for two unit dwelling.

699
01:05:59,000 --> 01:06:05,000
In all of the other definitions that rely on a California government code, they say such.

700
01:06:05,000 --> 01:06:11,000
I imagine that this is pulling from the definition from SB 9, but it says as defined by state law and the structure.

701
01:06:11,000 --> 01:06:19,000
Just for staff's purposes, it would be helpful to have the government code there for them in the future if they're asked.

702
01:06:20,000 --> 01:06:23,000
Yes, that is SB 9, but we can make sure that's clear.

703
01:06:27,000 --> 01:06:29,000
Okay, next I've got a few questions.

704
01:06:29,000 --> 01:06:31,000
Oh, it's a signage.

705
01:06:33,000 --> 01:06:37,000
Sorry, let me get to that section here.

706
01:06:37,000 --> 01:06:55,000
I have a second turn with the call out of treating garage sales signs differently than other non-commercial message signs and how potentially that could.

707
01:06:55,000 --> 01:06:59,000
Create a non-content neutral sign.

708
01:06:59,000 --> 01:07:06,000
Regulation, not necessarily something that we need to dive into too much right now, but would encourage attorneys to weigh in on that piece.

709
01:07:06,000 --> 01:07:14,000
The commercial definitions for the commercial content versus non-commercial are great.

710
01:07:14,000 --> 01:07:18,000
Those look really good, but this one specifically.

711
01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:20,000
Maybe a little nervous.

712
01:07:20,000 --> 01:07:22,000
What section is that that you refer on?

713
01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:26,000
That's in the sign code and that is on page 17 D48.

714
01:07:26,000 --> 01:07:28,000
Thank you.

715
01:07:28,000 --> 01:07:35,000
And I think you rightly point out that, you know, read versus Gilbert right, applies.

716
01:07:35,000 --> 01:07:52,000
In this case, we did work with the city attorney on on the sign ordinance on our the conversations that we had is that was to not make substantial content edits to the sign ordinance.

717
01:07:52,000 --> 01:08:00,000
So that's just a little bit of the background there, but I agree that read versus Gilbert is what apply in this case.

718
01:08:00,000 --> 01:08:02,000
And I think like for political science, those are treated differently.

719
01:08:02,000 --> 01:08:11,000
And I think that there's an argument that those are okay under like the strict scrutiny doctrine, but garage sales signs don't necessarily have that same level of importance in terms of speech.

720
01:08:11,000 --> 01:08:13,000
So that's why I read that.

721
01:08:13,000 --> 01:08:14,000
Thank you.

722
01:08:14,000 --> 01:08:21,000
Okay, and then residential district development standards, page 17 C5.

723
01:08:21,000 --> 01:08:36,000
The residential load density district has a higher minimum number of dwelling units per acre than the residential traditional.

724
01:08:36,000 --> 01:08:44,000
So the three to eight DUA for residential low versus 2 to 12 for traditional residential.

725
01:08:44,000 --> 01:08:52,000
Can you explain maybe the intent of, because in my mind, the residential low should be a lower density district.

726
01:08:52,000 --> 01:08:57,000
I think it'd be great if most of them had a minimum of three dwelling units per acre density.

727
01:08:57,000 --> 01:08:59,000
Yeah, and you're thinking.

728
01:08:59,000 --> 01:09:02,000
Yeah, intuitively what you're saying definitely makes sense.

729
01:09:02,000 --> 01:09:10,000
I think we can look at the general plan thresholds for those underlying land use categories, but generally that's what we're relying upon.

730
01:09:10,000 --> 01:09:16,000
So I believe that's what it says in the general plan, but we'll confirm that.

731
01:09:16,000 --> 01:09:17,000
I understand it.

732
01:09:17,000 --> 01:09:21,000
It seems a little odd because it's not just a clean gradation the whole way through, right?

733
01:09:21,000 --> 01:09:27,000
So we can look at that, but I believe that's how it's reflected in the general plan.

734
01:09:27,000 --> 01:09:35,000
Yeah, I can confirm that. So it is two to 12 units per acre in traditional residential designation.

735
01:09:35,000 --> 01:09:41,000
Happy to give clarity to the intent of whether general plan was that.

736
01:09:41,000 --> 01:09:43,000
Great. Thank you.

737
01:09:43,000 --> 01:09:59,000
Okay, and then I don't know if anyone else had anything on that section, but if not, I'm going to talk about the use regulation table.

738
01:09:59,000 --> 01:10:00,000
Is that okay?

739
01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:01,000
Sure.

740
01:10:01,000 --> 01:10:04,000
That is on page 17C8.

741
01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:29,000
This is just a comment, less of a question, I guess, but I think it would be nice now that we have the breakout between the grocery store small and large and seeing that there's pretty substantial portion of the city covered in the RSL district.

742
01:10:29,000 --> 01:10:45,000
I'm sorry, the residential districts, I would recommend that we look at adding conditional uses for small grocery stores in residential traditional and then the RMM district.

743
01:10:45,000 --> 01:11:01,000
And in order to support the general plan goals of walkability, complete communities and seeing that in most cases, these small grocery stores are really not going to have substantial negative impacts on adjacent residential uses.

744
01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:04,000
We can certainly look at that. Yes.

745
01:11:04,000 --> 01:11:09,000
And then I'd still more question on the community garden land use.

746
01:11:09,000 --> 01:11:21,000
So it looks like that is listed, sorry, on page 17C11 and it's a lot as a conditional use only in the RMH.

747
01:11:21,000 --> 01:11:29,000
I feel that the potential negative impacts on adjacent properties for community garden are very low.

748
01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:36,000
So would recommend that that be a conditional use in all the residential districts.

749
01:11:36,000 --> 01:11:42,000
Community gardens can be great if you have an empty site and you need temporary info before it's developed.

750
01:11:42,000 --> 01:11:51,000
Great use and we're going to have that flexibility there I think.

751
01:11:51,000 --> 01:12:04,000
One, one thing there and we'll look into seeing if we can strike the right balance but sometimes that the balancing act is also making sure that there's the preservation of meeting minimum density requirement.

752
01:12:05,000 --> 01:12:22,000
Priority is still residential if it's the sake of meeting number numbers and so generally so that I will say that that was kind of the intent in a lot of the residential zones but something we can look into.

753
01:12:22,000 --> 01:12:29,000
And I do have a question on that well get to in terms of replacement units later.

754
01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:35,000
Just a comment on the setbacks on page 17C18 at the top.

755
01:12:35,000 --> 01:12:44,000
I'm really excited to see those I think those are great in terms of promoting pedestrian friendly street standards and.

756
01:12:44,000 --> 01:12:50,000
Keeping the garage is back from the sidewalk to a lot for parking.

757
01:12:50,000 --> 01:12:57,000
And having the garage door set back again great standards.

758
01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:06,000
I comment on the parking standards on page 70d 37.

759
01:13:06,000 --> 01:13:09,000
So the.

760
01:13:09,000 --> 01:13:17,000
Well backing up I was pleased to see that a lot of the parking requirements were decreased by this draft.

761
01:13:17,000 --> 01:13:24,000
Great job everyone on that I do have a concern for single family dwellings and two unit dwellings.

762
01:13:25,000 --> 01:13:34,000
The breakout for you know only we're having two units required for dwellings that are less than 900 square feet.

763
01:13:34,000 --> 01:13:36,000
I'm sorry I'm sorry could you repeat the page number here.

764
01:13:36,000 --> 01:13:38,000
Yes we got 17.

765
01:13:38,000 --> 01:13:39,000
The 37.

766
01:13:39,000 --> 01:13:40,000
Thank you.

767
01:13:43,000 --> 01:13:53,000
So the differentiation between dwelling units that are less than 900 square feet or over 900 square feet the requirement for an additional.

768
01:13:53,000 --> 01:14:01,000
Parking stall for those dwellings over 900 square feet.

769
01:14:01,000 --> 01:14:04,000
Three dwelling units for one.

770
01:14:04,000 --> 01:14:11,000
Like one one 1000 square foot single family home is high or then.

771
01:14:11,000 --> 01:14:19,000
What I personally would like to see and be interested to hear what other commissioners think but.

772
01:14:19,000 --> 01:14:25,000
I would love to see the two per unit standard applied across the board to all dwell units.

773
01:14:25,000 --> 01:14:27,000
I'm sorry all.

774
01:14:27,000 --> 01:14:34,000
Single family and two unit dwellings.

775
01:14:34,000 --> 01:14:36,000
Yeah.

776
01:14:36,000 --> 01:14:42,000
Sorry so for dwelling units that are less than 900 square feet and this applies.

777
01:14:42,000 --> 01:14:50,000
Excuse me to single family and doplexes or have three bedrooms or fewer they're required to provide two parking stalls per unit.

778
01:14:50,000 --> 01:15:00,000
But for those that jump up when you go from 900 under 900 square foot or three bedrooms or less to above 900 square foot and.

779
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:05,000
and greater, they're then required to provide three parking stalls for unit.

780
01:15:05,000 --> 01:15:09,000
So, yeah, that threshold might want to be a little higher.

781
01:15:09,000 --> 01:15:16,000
Yeah, I don't know that that's, that's where footage necessitates an additional parking

782
01:15:16,000 --> 01:15:17,000
soul.

783
01:15:17,000 --> 01:15:21,000
And your thought is to just have it be two spaces.

784
01:15:21,000 --> 01:15:26,000
Excuse me, per unit across the board for single family dwellings and two unit dwellings.

785
01:15:26,000 --> 01:15:28,000
That would be my recommendation.

786
01:15:28,000 --> 01:15:34,000
But if this body wants to have a larger discussion about having a larger,

787
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:38,000
square footage threshold or something, I'm open to discussing that as well.

788
01:15:38,000 --> 01:15:41,000
That's my two cents on that piece.

789
01:15:56,000 --> 01:16:11,000
For the citywide design standards, page 17D 140, under consistency number two,

790
01:16:11,000 --> 01:16:20,000
A, it says on quarter buildings materials must be consistent on both frontages facing the right of way.

791
01:16:20,000 --> 01:16:35,000
So, I can never mind scratch that one.

792
01:16:35,000 --> 01:16:37,000
I answered my own question.

793
01:16:37,000 --> 01:16:39,000
She was on D 140.

794
01:16:39,000 --> 01:16:44,000
Okay, she was on today.

795
01:16:44,000 --> 01:16:45,000
Okay.

796
01:16:45,000 --> 01:17:02,000
So on 17D 142 at the bottom under building articulation.

797
01:17:02,000 --> 01:17:14,000
The language talks about the maximum width of a front elevation.

798
01:17:14,000 --> 01:17:22,000
And then also talks about the street facing elevation.

799
01:17:22,000 --> 01:17:32,000
There could be a scenario in which the structure takes up like a corner and they have multiple street facing elevations.

800
01:17:32,000 --> 01:17:41,000
So I noticed that in a few areas where it refers to structures only having the option to have one street facing elevation.

801
01:17:41,000 --> 01:17:56,000
I think it'd be helpful if the intent is to have articulation on all elevations of face a street to just add an SLP in there.

802
01:17:56,000 --> 01:18:10,000
And then similarly in the residential design standards page 17D 145.

803
01:18:10,000 --> 01:18:16,000
Under D building orientation and entry design.

804
01:18:16,000 --> 01:18:17,000
I'm sorry.

805
01:18:17,000 --> 01:18:27,000
What was that when I get 17D 145?

806
01:18:27,000 --> 01:18:33,000
So under D building orientation and entry design.

807
01:18:33,000 --> 01:18:39,000
Number one says that the primary building entrance must face the primary street.

808
01:18:39,000 --> 01:18:45,000
I think that's a great standard, but primary street is not defined in the definitions.

809
01:18:45,000 --> 01:18:53,000
So in order to ensure the intent of that regulation is met, you'd want to define that term.

810
01:18:53,000 --> 01:19:03,000
And then the same page number two building entrances must have a roofed projection including but not limited to a porch.

811
01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:05,000
And so on and so forth.

812
01:19:05,000 --> 01:19:15,000
I would recommend talking to legal counsel about that as well typically for to be truly objective and airtight.

813
01:19:15,000 --> 01:19:20,000
It's best not to have other options that are not stated.

814
01:19:20,000 --> 01:19:27,000
There is the desire to allow a roofed projection that is not a porch and is something else.

815
01:19:27,000 --> 01:19:30,000
I think in order to be for the roofed covers.

816
01:19:30,000 --> 01:19:32,000
Yeah, to be truly objective.

817
01:19:32,000 --> 01:19:36,000
I'd recommend spelling those out.

818
01:19:36,000 --> 01:19:39,000
Or simply leaving it as porch if that was the intent.

819
01:19:39,000 --> 01:19:48,000
But either way, not leaving any gray area there.

820
01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:56,000
I will say that the including been not limited to you'll see that dozens of times or more throughout the code.

821
01:19:56,000 --> 01:20:02,000
And some of that was a stylistic choice to allow for greater flexibility.

822
01:20:02,000 --> 01:20:12,000
But I hear what you're saying in terms of giving kind of outlining this specific type types of projections that would conform.

823
01:20:12,000 --> 01:20:22,000
And I realize it is a greater exercise but in listing all of those out but just in a scenario where you do get strong push back on those standards.

824
01:20:22,000 --> 01:20:25,000
But yeah, I think that's always helpful.

825
01:20:25,000 --> 01:20:34,000
I just want to write a little bit of clarity on that because in the objective just Catherine slum as director at least way as consulting.

826
01:20:34,000 --> 01:20:40,000
Just a couple notes that as we're going through the objective design centered specifically.

827
01:20:40,000 --> 01:20:45,000
In some cases, there's the objective standard, which is required.

828
01:20:45,000 --> 01:20:48,000
And then there's examples of how to meet that objective standard.

829
01:20:48,000 --> 01:20:55,000
So that is where it's not not objective because the objectivity lies within the five feet in the three square feet.

830
01:20:55,000 --> 01:20:58,000
So how you meet that it doesn't matter.

831
01:20:58,000 --> 01:21:04,000
So we almost could strike that, including when I'm not limited to a porch because it's almost an example.

832
01:21:05,000 --> 01:21:10,000
While maintaining that objectivity is really just the numeric measurement.

833
01:21:10,000 --> 01:21:12,000
That makes sense.

834
01:21:12,000 --> 01:21:24,000
So yeah, if it's appearing too flexible or subjective, we could almost just strike the parentheses part because they're in lies the kind of the root of the standard is everything else.

835
01:21:24,000 --> 01:21:29,000
Just to help with kind of the examples versus where the requirements kind of come in.

836
01:21:29,000 --> 01:21:41,000
And maybe that's something I simple as calling out examples exactly or ways to meet the standard include exactly yes yes yes.

837
01:21:41,000 --> 01:21:48,000
And then page 17d155.

838
01:21:48,000 --> 01:22:00,000
In terms of screening and visibility standard for surface parking lots.

839
01:22:00,000 --> 01:22:04,000
There is a section that says screen and visibility.

840
01:22:04,000 --> 01:22:10,000
And it states that there's a minimum five foot landscaping buffer that must be provided along the parking area in the adjacent property.

841
01:22:10,000 --> 01:22:16,000
And the adjacent property line does the city have a standard in terms of how.

842
01:22:16,000 --> 01:22:23,000
Translucent or like how uppercentage in which the buffering or screening needs to cover the parking.

843
01:22:23,000 --> 01:22:30,000
That may be written out somewhere else and I'm just not seeing it.

844
01:22:30,000 --> 01:22:38,000
I have to double check I think in some other zone districts where there are standards that apply there are a little bit more prescriptive to what that screening is.

845
01:22:38,000 --> 01:22:40,000
I can double check on that.

846
01:22:40,000 --> 01:22:51,000
I don't maybe the intent there was to not be overly prescriptive but just you have a general landscape buffer but we can look into it.

847
01:22:52,000 --> 01:22:57,000
There there are additional landscaping standards.

848
01:22:57,000 --> 01:23:06,000
Within the city wide section on supplemental site regulations as well as.

849
01:23:06,000 --> 01:23:08,000
Okay.

850
01:23:08,000 --> 01:23:09,000
Detain.

851
01:23:09,000 --> 01:23:10,000
Detain.

852
01:23:10,000 --> 01:23:11,000
Detain.

853
01:23:11,000 --> 01:23:12,000
Detain.

854
01:23:12,000 --> 01:23:13,000
Detain.

855
01:23:13,000 --> 01:23:14,000
Okay.

856
01:23:14,000 --> 01:23:15,000
Awesome.

857
01:23:15,000 --> 01:23:16,000
Thank you.

858
01:23:16,000 --> 01:23:18,000
And then also 17d206.

859
01:23:18,000 --> 01:23:28,000
So so those were all kind of working in concert with one another but yes we can look into specifics for that particular one.

860
01:23:28,000 --> 01:23:31,000
And that's the page number thank you 17d10.

861
01:23:31,000 --> 01:23:32,000
I'm looking at.

862
01:23:32,000 --> 01:23:38,000
We're trying to look at sections and we're talking page number so yes thank you it's both let me know if you need more clarity on that one.

863
01:23:38,000 --> 01:23:43,000
No that is that's very helpful.

864
01:23:43,000 --> 01:23:44,000
Okay.

865
01:23:44,000 --> 01:23:54,000
And then still under the design standard page 17d156.

866
01:23:54,000 --> 01:23:57,000
Sections that talk about.

867
01:23:57,000 --> 01:24:05,000
Direct and convenient access must be provided from residential areas to adjacent commercial and mixed use.

868
01:24:05,000 --> 01:24:08,000
And then safe and convenient pedestrian connections again.

869
01:24:08,000 --> 01:24:12,000
I think all every reasonable person knows what safe and direct and convenient mean.

870
01:24:12,000 --> 01:24:15,000
Does it sound as objective as it could.

871
01:24:15,000 --> 01:24:16,000
Yeah.

872
01:24:16,000 --> 01:24:19,000
Just just for your consideration.

873
01:24:19,000 --> 01:24:37,000
To again prevent staff from getting in a bind later and fighting about what safe or convenient really means.

874
01:24:37,000 --> 01:24:38,000
Okay.

875
01:24:38,000 --> 01:24:40,000
And then last one here.

876
01:24:40,000 --> 01:24:44,000
On page 17d169.

877
01:24:44,000 --> 01:24:51,000
The section regarding residential conversions.

878
01:24:51,000 --> 01:25:01,000
So conversion or loss of residential uses two non residential uses.

879
01:25:01,000 --> 01:25:09,000
So hoping to get some clarification here so under d where it says housing impact fees says the city shall impose housing impact fees.

880
01:25:09,000 --> 01:25:16,000
That's it for all all conversions of residential uses to non residential uses.

881
01:25:16,000 --> 01:25:19,000
In the case that.

882
01:25:19,000 --> 01:25:22,000
A conversion was approved.

883
01:25:22,000 --> 01:25:35,000
Would they for commercial use with a commercial use be required to pay the impact fees related to both the housing units that were lost as well as any additional impact fee.

884
01:25:35,000 --> 01:25:39,000
I think if it was a land use that already would typically require impact fee.

885
01:25:39,000 --> 01:25:42,000
We repeat the question because we were still finding the section.

886
01:25:42,000 --> 01:25:43,000
Sorry.

887
01:25:43,000 --> 01:25:44,000
Yeah.

888
01:25:44,000 --> 01:25:45,000
I'm sorry.

889
01:25:45,000 --> 01:25:47,000
So.

890
01:25:47,000 --> 01:25:49,000
For the.

891
01:25:49,000 --> 01:25:54,000
And where it says multifamily residential conversions.

892
01:25:54,000 --> 01:25:59,000
Number D housing impact fees.

893
01:25:59,000 --> 01:26:03,000
So it says that the city shall impose housing impact fees.

894
01:26:03,000 --> 01:26:14,000
Um, pursuant to code that the stuff for all conversions of residential uses to non residential uses.

895
01:26:14,000 --> 01:26:16,000
So with that require.

896
01:26:16,000 --> 01:26:28,000
The commercial use to pay an impact fee that the typical impact fee that that would be assessed and then the additional impact fee to cover the loss of units.

897
01:26:29,000 --> 01:26:33,000
Well, good question of the double the main.

898
01:26:33,000 --> 01:26:39,000
But yes, so like for the new use generally that if there's a.

899
01:26:39,000 --> 01:26:43,000
An impact fee more appropriate for that commercial use generally.

900
01:26:43,000 --> 01:26:47,000
Yes, is there's nexus and proportionality to that new use.

901
01:26:47,000 --> 01:26:55,000
Now your question is also if they'd be required to pay for the loss of the unit.

902
01:26:56,000 --> 01:27:10,000
So in some case, like some jurisdictions will have a policy where if you lose X number of units because you're transferring to a different use, you can acquire a placement is so this is just stating that they would be required to pay an affordable housing impact fee.

903
01:27:10,000 --> 01:27:23,000
It's not related to the number of lost units correct paid the affordable housing impact fee on the whatever the square footage value is assuming that's still the calculation for whatever the new use is and it's entirety.

904
01:27:23,000 --> 01:27:33,000
Wouldn't the way I read this is they wouldn't receive credits so like if a commercial building adds on or tears down and then replaces they get credit for what was there before in this case there would be no credit.

905
01:27:33,000 --> 01:27:38,000
But they would be paying solely based on the new use got it.

906
01:27:38,000 --> 01:27:42,000
Okay, thank you.

907
01:27:42,000 --> 01:27:44,000
Okay, that's all I've got. Thank you so much.

908
01:27:44,000 --> 01:27:46,000
Thank you.

909
01:27:46,000 --> 01:27:49,000
Thank you commissioner a buck.

910
01:27:49,000 --> 01:27:52,000
Do you want to go next commissioner on the sorrow?

911
01:27:52,000 --> 01:27:53,000
Sure.

912
01:27:57,000 --> 01:27:59,000
Where do I want to start?

913
01:28:04,000 --> 01:28:10,000
So I did I did spend a lot of time with staff because I was actually concerned I wasn't going to make this meeting.

914
01:28:10,000 --> 01:28:16,000
So we spent a little bit of time together, but I'll go over some of the highlights.

915
01:28:16,000 --> 01:28:26,000
I'm sorry get your feedback from them and just for the record we do have all of your comments and we shared we've provided our books to them to date but we'll continue to do so.

916
01:28:26,000 --> 01:28:28,000
Thank you.

917
01:28:34,000 --> 01:28:37,000
To the right section.

918
01:28:37,000 --> 01:28:45,000
One thing that I saw in your presentation.

919
01:28:45,000 --> 01:28:51,000
You've shown a slide you talked about the parking.

920
01:28:51,000 --> 01:28:54,000
Would be behind.

921
01:28:54,000 --> 01:29:01,000
I think this we're looking at it as in multifamily behind or at the side.

922
01:29:01,000 --> 01:29:06,000
And do you can you think you can go back in your little presentation?

923
01:29:06,000 --> 01:29:07,000
Yes.

924
01:29:07,000 --> 01:29:11,000
Are you a big presentation or whatever presentation that is.

925
01:29:11,000 --> 01:29:14,000
For the record is there a page number.

926
01:29:14,000 --> 01:29:26,000
There wasn't because it was up here and I know that there was a picture and I know there's a picture that matches it in here.

927
01:29:32,000 --> 01:29:33,000
Yeah.

928
01:29:33,000 --> 01:29:37,000
So maybe you guys can find that picture for me.

929
01:29:37,000 --> 01:29:42,000
Are you talking about the one on the bottom right portion of the screen?

930
01:29:42,000 --> 01:29:45,000
That one is a structure.

931
01:29:45,000 --> 01:29:46,000
So yeah.

932
01:29:46,000 --> 01:29:47,000
So yeah.

933
01:29:47,000 --> 01:29:51,000
So it's as parking lots must be in the rear or side of the parcel.

934
01:29:51,000 --> 01:29:53,000
Do you know where that?

935
01:29:53,000 --> 01:29:55,000
Yeah.

936
01:29:55,000 --> 01:29:56,000
One by four.

937
01:29:56,000 --> 01:29:58,000
Thank you.

938
01:29:58,000 --> 01:30:00,000
And the service parking lot.

939
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:03,000
is 17D 153, just a page before it.

940
01:30:04,000 --> 01:30:05,000
Thanks.

941
01:30:22,000 --> 01:30:23,000
There we go.

942
01:30:23,000 --> 01:30:26,000
I do have that worked up again.

943
01:30:27,000 --> 01:30:32,000
So when we're talking about the parking in the rear or the side,

944
01:30:32,000 --> 01:30:37,000
there are instances where we've seen multifamily parking

945
01:30:37,000 --> 01:30:41,000
where they have used the,

946
01:30:41,000 --> 01:30:43,000
I would say,

947
01:30:43,000 --> 01:30:47,000
some parking on the primary street

948
01:30:47,000 --> 01:30:50,000
to use it as a buffer from that primary street.

949
01:30:50,000 --> 01:30:53,000
So, for instance, if you go down

950
01:30:53,000 --> 01:30:56,000
in the front of the street,

951
01:30:56,000 --> 01:30:58,000
you can see the front of the street

952
01:30:58,000 --> 01:31:01,000
or the front of the street.

953
01:31:01,000 --> 01:31:02,000
And even as we think about,

954
01:31:02,000 --> 01:31:05,000
we're developing saucechool and those types of things.

955
01:31:05,000 --> 01:31:08,000
Do we really want to have residential units

956
01:31:08,000 --> 01:31:10,000
on those streets,

957
01:31:10,000 --> 01:31:12,000
sitting near traffic

958
01:31:12,000 --> 01:31:14,000
so they're hearing noise?

959
01:31:14,000 --> 01:31:16,000
And the reason I say that

960
01:31:16,000 --> 01:31:18,000
is I just spent four nights camping

961
01:31:18,000 --> 01:31:20,000
right next to I5

962
01:31:20,000 --> 01:31:22,000
and it was really loud.

963
01:31:22,000 --> 01:31:26,000
So I just know that when we have constant traffic

964
01:31:26,000 --> 01:31:28,000
like we can on those streets,

965
01:31:28,000 --> 01:31:30,000
I mean, not obviously 20 hours a day,

966
01:31:30,000 --> 01:31:31,000
but we can.

967
01:31:31,000 --> 01:31:32,000
They just,

968
01:31:32,000 --> 01:31:34,000
I just wondering if we don't want to create

969
01:31:34,000 --> 01:31:36,000
more of a buffer,

970
01:31:36,000 --> 01:31:39,000
the possibility of having a buffer.

971
01:31:39,000 --> 01:31:41,000
That's something that we can look at.

972
01:31:41,000 --> 01:31:43,000
Yeah, I lived on a major thoroughfare

973
01:31:43,000 --> 01:31:46,000
myself and the house was right up against the road.

974
01:31:46,000 --> 01:31:47,000
I know what you're talking.

975
01:31:47,000 --> 01:31:49,000
I knew when it was rush hour every day

976
01:31:49,000 --> 01:31:51,000
because you could hear it very loudly.

977
01:31:51,000 --> 01:31:52,000
Yeah, sorry.

978
01:31:52,000 --> 01:31:53,000
I hear what you're saying there.

979
01:31:53,000 --> 01:31:54,000
And I don't know.

980
01:31:54,000 --> 01:31:56,000
And maybe some of my team knows

981
01:31:56,000 --> 01:31:59,000
but a lot of this was drawn

982
01:31:59,000 --> 01:32:01,000
from the design guidelines.

983
01:32:01,000 --> 01:32:03,000
And then we repurposed them into standards.

984
01:32:03,000 --> 01:32:04,000
And you know,

985
01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:06,000
some standards could use a little more objectivity

986
01:32:06,000 --> 01:32:08,000
as I can assure you about pointed out.

987
01:32:08,000 --> 01:32:10,000
But this may be,

988
01:32:10,000 --> 01:32:11,000
you know,

989
01:32:11,000 --> 01:32:12,000
one of the,

990
01:32:12,000 --> 01:32:14,000
this may have been from one of the design guidelines

991
01:32:14,000 --> 01:32:15,000
document.

992
01:32:15,000 --> 01:32:16,000
So we can look at that.

993
01:32:16,000 --> 01:32:19,000
And not that we're wedded to what the guidelines

994
01:32:19,000 --> 01:32:21,000
have been necessarily.

995
01:32:21,000 --> 01:32:23,000
But that may be where this comes from.

996
01:32:23,000 --> 01:32:24,000
Yeah.

997
01:32:24,000 --> 01:32:25,000
But we can take a look.

998
01:32:25,000 --> 01:32:26,000
We know that a lot of the communities

999
01:32:26,000 --> 01:32:28,000
have been at time on those guidelines.

1000
01:32:28,000 --> 01:32:29,000
28 years.

1001
01:32:29,000 --> 01:32:30,000
So we'll go.

1002
01:32:30,000 --> 01:32:31,000
I think.

1003
01:32:31,000 --> 01:32:33,000
But they do need to be updated.

1004
01:32:33,000 --> 01:32:34,000
And.

1005
01:32:34,000 --> 01:32:38,000
And I'm appreciative that we're here doing this.

1006
01:32:38,000 --> 01:32:41,000
Before we get too far in that.

1007
01:32:41,000 --> 01:32:43,000
This won't answer your full question.

1008
01:32:43,000 --> 01:32:45,000
But it's important to note that the general plan

1009
01:32:45,000 --> 01:32:48,000
does define certain noise contours

1010
01:32:48,000 --> 01:32:50,000
specific street frontages.

1011
01:32:50,000 --> 01:32:52,000
It's also important to take this up further

1012
01:32:52,000 --> 01:32:54,000
until when diving into building code requirements.

1013
01:32:54,000 --> 01:32:57,000
They're maximum right noise thresholds for

1014
01:32:57,000 --> 01:33:00,000
interior interior levels.

1015
01:33:00,000 --> 01:33:04,000
So when we have enough evidence to conclude that a certain

1016
01:33:04,000 --> 01:33:06,000
street frontage.

1017
01:33:06,000 --> 01:33:10,000
On average generates a specific amount of noise,

1018
01:33:10,000 --> 01:33:13,000
even through the build out of the general plan.

1019
01:33:13,000 --> 01:33:17,000
There's enough evidence there to give direction to staff.

1020
01:33:18,000 --> 01:33:23,000
When analyzing noise to give direction to our building

1021
01:33:23,000 --> 01:33:27,000
division team in making sure that the actual facilities.

1022
01:33:27,000 --> 01:33:31,000
If it is residential, there's enough insulation there to where

1023
01:33:31,000 --> 01:33:34,000
if you're sitting on the interior of it.

1024
01:33:34,000 --> 01:33:37,000
There's not an impact to your general.

1025
01:33:37,000 --> 01:33:39,000
Enjoyment of your unit.

1026
01:33:39,000 --> 01:33:40,000
Right.

1027
01:33:40,000 --> 01:33:41,000
One thing.

1028
01:33:41,000 --> 01:33:44,000
So I'll just add to that as well is just context.

1029
01:33:45,000 --> 01:33:48,000
The objective design standards that we've prepared in the

1030
01:33:48,000 --> 01:33:51,000
draft zoning ordinance here.

1031
01:33:51,000 --> 01:33:53,000
If an applicant meets those,

1032
01:33:53,000 --> 01:33:56,000
then they qualify for that zoning clearance process

1033
01:33:56,000 --> 01:33:57,000
through county staff.

1034
01:33:57,000 --> 01:34:00,000
But if someone, if an application does

1035
01:34:00,000 --> 01:34:01,000
deviate from these things,

1036
01:34:01,000 --> 01:34:03,000
it's not that it's a no-go completely right.

1037
01:34:03,000 --> 01:34:05,000
It's able to go to planning commission or,

1038
01:34:05,000 --> 01:34:07,000
you know, require discretionary approval.

1039
01:34:07,000 --> 01:34:08,000
So.

1040
01:34:08,000 --> 01:34:09,000
I think that's great.

1041
01:34:09,000 --> 01:34:12,000
You said that because actually I was going to say that next.

1042
01:34:12,000 --> 01:34:13,000
We're on the same page.

1043
01:34:13,000 --> 01:34:14,000
Yeah, we are on the same page.

1044
01:34:14,000 --> 01:34:15,000
So.

1045
01:34:15,000 --> 01:34:20,000
So given that and knowing that what we want to do is.

1046
01:34:20,000 --> 01:34:22,000
Trying to provide.

1047
01:34:22,000 --> 01:34:27,000
Our developers out there with a good little road map where they can get.

1048
01:34:27,000 --> 01:34:28,000
They can.

1049
01:34:28,000 --> 01:34:32,000
Take the easiest path forward or they can design something amazing

1050
01:34:32,000 --> 01:34:35,000
and then bring it to planning commission.

1051
01:34:35,000 --> 01:34:36,000
Right.

1052
01:34:36,000 --> 01:34:37,000
Okay.

1053
01:34:37,000 --> 01:34:38,000
So.

1054
01:34:38,000 --> 01:34:41,000
On page.

1055
01:34:41,000 --> 01:34:43,000
Well, I would say in general.

1056
01:34:43,000 --> 01:34:46,000
So I'm starting with the chapter 17D 70,

1057
01:34:46,000 --> 01:34:49,000
which is a residential objective design standards.

1058
01:34:49,000 --> 01:34:51,000
That's where my focus is going to be.

1059
01:34:51,000 --> 01:34:52,000
Primarily.

1060
01:34:52,000 --> 01:34:56,000
That's where I spend a lot of my time on this first iteration of it.

1061
01:34:56,000 --> 01:34:58,000
Um.

1062
01:34:58,000 --> 01:35:00,000
In general.

1063
01:35:00,000 --> 01:35:03,000
I didn't see onings.

1064
01:35:03,000 --> 01:35:06,000
Farncutters or downspouts.

1065
01:35:06,000 --> 01:35:08,000
Really discussed in our.

1066
01:35:09,000 --> 01:35:11,000
In these objective design standards.

1067
01:35:11,000 --> 01:35:13,000
And I think that those are important.

1068
01:35:13,000 --> 01:35:14,000
If we're going to.

1069
01:35:14,000 --> 01:35:18,000
I mean, I know some in some many cases stormwater will dictate where those.

1070
01:35:18,000 --> 01:35:20,000
Downspouts and things are.

1071
01:35:20,000 --> 01:35:23,000
But we want to make sure that we're giving some design standards around.

1072
01:35:23,000 --> 01:35:26,000
What types of materials may be that we want to see.

1073
01:35:26,000 --> 01:35:27,000
Or.

1074
01:35:27,000 --> 01:35:28,000
Um.

1075
01:35:28,000 --> 01:35:29,000
Locations.

1076
01:35:29,000 --> 01:35:32,000
Potentially aware those things should be.

1077
01:35:32,000 --> 01:35:36,000
And that onings could be listed as an architectural feature.

1078
01:35:36,000 --> 01:35:39,000
So that was one of those.

1079
01:35:39,000 --> 01:35:43,000
I went over windows with the staff pretty well,

1080
01:35:43,000 --> 01:35:48,000
but I think we could use some better graphics on 17D 70 30

1081
01:35:48,000 --> 01:35:50,000
dash one.

1082
01:35:50,000 --> 01:35:53,000
Which is your window trim and recess.

1083
01:35:53,000 --> 01:35:57,000
It is on page D 17 D 138.

1084
01:35:57,000 --> 01:36:05,000
In our description and that we call for the sill that we don't really.

1085
01:36:05,000 --> 01:36:09,000
Call for aprons and we have aprons in the.

1086
01:36:09,000 --> 01:36:11,000
In the picture.

1087
01:36:11,000 --> 01:36:14,000
But I also think the pictures could be.

1088
01:36:14,000 --> 01:36:16,000
Simpler.

1089
01:36:16,000 --> 01:36:20,000
Then what you have here to to know what these types of windows could look like.

1090
01:36:20,000 --> 01:36:23,000
And then we know we're that with the.

1091
01:36:23,000 --> 01:36:24,000
Anyway.

1092
01:36:24,000 --> 01:36:26,000
So we'll make sure to get your.

1093
01:36:26,000 --> 01:36:27,000
Your comments.

1094
01:36:27,000 --> 01:36:28,000
Yeah.

1095
01:36:28,000 --> 01:36:29,000
Really through staff then.

1096
01:36:29,000 --> 01:36:32,000
I have some comments on that specific section as well.

1097
01:36:32,000 --> 01:36:34,000
Do you want to pick up and go on that before.

1098
01:36:34,000 --> 01:36:35,000
Go on that before I move on.

1099
01:36:35,000 --> 01:36:36,000
Yeah.

1100
01:36:36,000 --> 01:36:37,000
Okay.

1101
01:36:37,000 --> 01:36:38,000
Kind of close this window area.

1102
01:36:38,000 --> 01:36:40,000
Close the windows.

1103
01:36:40,000 --> 01:36:41,000
Um.

1104
01:36:41,000 --> 01:36:46,000
One thing I have is requiring the overhang of the header, the lintel.

1105
01:36:46,000 --> 01:36:48,000
And the apron.

1106
01:36:48,000 --> 01:36:52,000
So a lot of our historical homes and one that I'm working on right now.

1107
01:36:52,000 --> 01:36:53,000
There is not an apron.

1108
01:36:53,000 --> 01:36:55,000
There's definitely a sill.

1109
01:36:55,000 --> 01:36:57,000
And a lot of times it's a picture frame around that window.

1110
01:36:57,000 --> 01:36:58,000
So there's not an overhang.

1111
01:36:58,000 --> 01:36:59,000
So I just get a little.

1112
01:36:59,000 --> 01:37:03,000
I'm cautious about requiring that design element because sometimes it's.

1113
01:37:03,000 --> 01:37:07,000
It's specific to a certain architectural style.

1114
01:37:07,000 --> 01:37:13,000
The apron and then the overhang of the lintel on the on the jam trim.

1115
01:37:13,000 --> 01:37:15,000
Right.

1116
01:37:15,000 --> 01:37:20,000
Um.

1117
01:37:20,000 --> 01:37:22,000
And then I also think of the buildability.

1118
01:37:22,000 --> 01:37:24,000
So on C.

1119
01:37:24,000 --> 01:37:25,000
Double eye.

1120
01:37:25,000 --> 01:37:30,000
The minimum projection from wall surface of as a half inch.

1121
01:37:30,000 --> 01:37:34,000
Sometimes it's only a quarter inch based on the three quarter inch wall surface material.

1122
01:37:34,000 --> 01:37:38,000
Your nominal one inch framing trim whatever use for your trim.

1123
01:37:38,000 --> 01:37:39,000
And so again there.

1124
01:37:39,000 --> 01:37:43,000
It's like I like to have it sit proud of the wall surface.

1125
01:37:43,000 --> 01:37:49,000
Point two five is just a construction industry increment that you buy materials in.

1126
01:37:49,000 --> 01:37:53,000
So I would say a minimum of a quarter inch projection.

1127
01:37:53,000 --> 01:37:54,000
Um.

1128
01:37:54,000 --> 01:37:56,000
On C to on C to.

1129
01:37:56,000 --> 01:37:59,000
And.

1130
01:37:59,000 --> 01:38:01,000
This one doesn't talk about the recess.

1131
01:38:01,000 --> 01:38:02,000
Okay. So yeah.

1132
01:38:02,000 --> 01:38:04,000
That's what I had on.

1133
01:38:04,000 --> 01:38:05,000
That figure.

1134
01:38:05,000 --> 01:38:07,000
Great.

1135
01:38:12,000 --> 01:38:15,000
We're forgetting to standards.

1136
01:38:15,000 --> 01:38:18,000
On the CI.

1137
01:38:18,000 --> 01:38:20,000
You're talking about it.

1138
01:38:20,000 --> 01:38:23,000
Minimum height of the header is four inches.

1139
01:38:23,000 --> 01:38:27,000
But we never really buy a four inch board.

1140
01:38:28,000 --> 01:38:31,000
So it's kind of a.

1141
01:38:31,000 --> 01:38:32,000
You know, it's in.

1142
01:38:32,000 --> 01:38:33,000
I don't know.

1143
01:38:33,000 --> 01:38:35,000
It's kind of an interesting thing to put in there.

1144
01:38:35,000 --> 01:38:36,000
It's a little specific.

1145
01:38:36,000 --> 01:38:39,000
I guess maybe what I'm saying is it's a little specific.

1146
01:38:39,000 --> 01:38:41,000
If we're trying to.

1147
01:38:41,000 --> 01:38:44,000
Um.

1148
01:38:44,000 --> 01:38:45,000
I.

1149
01:38:45,000 --> 01:38:48,000
It's just it's just a little specific to specific.

1150
01:38:48,000 --> 01:38:50,000
Maybe.

1151
01:38:50,000 --> 01:38:53,000
I understand where they don't want to just frame.

1152
01:38:53,000 --> 01:38:54,000
You know.

1153
01:38:54,000 --> 01:38:55,000
Right.

1154
01:38:55,000 --> 01:38:56,000
Yeah.

1155
01:38:57,000 --> 01:38:59,000
Okay.

1156
01:38:59,000 --> 01:39:00,000
Um.

1157
01:39:00,000 --> 01:39:01,000
I think we had.

1158
01:39:01,000 --> 01:39:04,000
You merged to come on that moving very slowly.

1159
01:39:04,000 --> 01:39:05,000
But I'm.

1160
01:39:05,000 --> 01:39:11,000
We've we've we've we started to look at some of the comments that you provided staff.

1161
01:39:11,000 --> 01:39:12,000
So somebody's more specific ones.

1162
01:39:12,000 --> 01:39:13,000
We definitely appreciate.

1163
01:39:13,000 --> 01:39:14,000
We'll look into all of those.

1164
01:39:14,000 --> 01:39:15,000
But I.

1165
01:39:15,000 --> 01:39:16,000
I want to just.

1166
01:39:16,000 --> 01:39:25,000
I think this might continue to come up and we will answer every single question that you have.

1167
01:39:25,000 --> 01:39:26,000
The.

1168
01:39:26,000 --> 01:39:27,000
The.

1169
01:39:27,000 --> 01:39:28,000
This is the.

1170
01:39:28,000 --> 01:39:29,000
This is the.

1171
01:39:29,000 --> 01:39:31,000
The challenge that this is presented.

1172
01:39:31,000 --> 01:39:33,000
It's presented to the.

1173
01:39:33,000 --> 01:39:34,000
Community is across the state.

1174
01:39:34,000 --> 01:39:35,000
It's been definitely been a.

1175
01:39:35,000 --> 01:39:37,000
You know, presented a.

1176
01:39:37,000 --> 01:39:39,000
Interesting conversation that they can.

1177
01:39:39,000 --> 01:39:44,000
So team has had with stakeholders and staff and the commission and the advisory group.

1178
01:39:44,000 --> 01:39:46,000
Throughout this process of.

1179
01:39:46,000 --> 01:39:49,000
The necessity of being specific.

1180
01:39:49,000 --> 01:39:52,000
Otherwise, you can't regulate it.

1181
01:39:52,000 --> 01:39:55,000
And I think that's where we're happy to continue.

1182
01:39:55,000 --> 01:39:59,000
I think one of the things that you'll see is that some of these lists get very long.

1183
01:39:59,000 --> 01:40:03,000
Because we want to provide the objective flexibility.

1184
01:40:03,000 --> 01:40:05,000
So the more options that you give.

1185
01:40:05,000 --> 01:40:08,000
You can remain objective because you have them all listed.

1186
01:40:08,000 --> 01:40:11,000
And I think that goes to your comment earlier commissioner.

1187
01:40:11,000 --> 01:40:15,000
You're about like wanting to specifically list the things that are allowed.

1188
01:40:15,000 --> 01:40:17,000
Because the more that we can list.

1189
01:40:17,000 --> 01:40:19,000
The more you're allowed to say, yep, you're objective.

1190
01:40:19,000 --> 01:40:20,000
Yes, you met this.

1191
01:40:21,000 --> 01:40:23,000
So if it for inches that is not the right number.

1192
01:40:23,000 --> 01:40:26,000
That's of course completely movable.

1193
01:40:26,000 --> 01:40:28,000
But I think if we say.

1194
01:40:28,000 --> 01:40:31,000
If we don't have any height measurement then it's.

1195
01:40:31,000 --> 01:40:35,000
You know, you kind of lose your ability to to say yes or no.

1196
01:40:35,000 --> 01:40:42,000
So I just wanted to process that because I think further down we start to see some longer lists of examples and longer lists of things that are allowed.

1197
01:40:42,000 --> 01:40:48,000
Because the the kind of the flip side of not allowing a lot of different options is that you don't have any.

1198
01:40:48,000 --> 01:40:55,000
And then you really are opening yourself to maybe some unintended consequences of not being able to then.

1199
01:40:55,000 --> 01:40:58,000
Work with staff, which you've done so successfully.

1200
01:40:58,000 --> 01:41:03,000
I think that's the problem in a community that has has really great examples and really great structures.

1201
01:41:03,000 --> 01:41:13,000
And a really great development community is that you've worked so well together over the over the course of several years of producing great outcomes.

1202
01:41:13,000 --> 01:41:21,000
And knowingly so through a negotiated process so it's just wanting to kind of document those great outcomes in.

1203
01:41:21,000 --> 01:41:23,000
Objective standards.

1204
01:41:23,000 --> 01:41:29,000
So one of the things that just as I read through this objective design standard and then.

1205
01:41:29,000 --> 01:41:34,000
I've looked at other cities ejected design standards and I think that.

1206
01:41:34,000 --> 01:41:42,000
There are other cities who have really dialed it in and they've said here's an example of a craftsman here's an example of.

1207
01:41:42,000 --> 01:41:47,000
A modern architecture here's contemporary design.

1208
01:41:47,000 --> 01:41:53,000
And we're not doing that right this is not that so.

1209
01:41:53,000 --> 01:42:02,000
This document then we need to talk about some of the specific specifics that are in here because they're starting to lean into.

1210
01:42:02,000 --> 01:42:11,000
Architectural styles that we really don't want to define in the first place so that I think is the hard part of this document.

1211
01:42:11,000 --> 01:42:24,000
Because as I read through here I was like you know this section and I know you've seen my comments so the sections when we're talking about architectural elements it's like it's way too many.

1212
01:42:24,000 --> 01:42:29,000
Of different architectural styles so we're just kind of like saying hey.

1213
01:42:29,000 --> 01:42:35,000
We're not telling you to build this way but here's the style that goes with that sure.

1214
01:42:35,000 --> 01:42:39,000
So that's kind of how it and put a lot of my comments for me.

1215
01:42:39,000 --> 01:42:40,000
Absolutely.

1216
01:42:40,000 --> 01:42:48,000
No I understand that I just wanted to give a little bit of context of some of the nature of some of the lists.

1217
01:42:48,000 --> 01:42:57,000
Wanting to you know either add more but you know maybe the answer is more detail or you know to to further.

1218
01:42:58,000 --> 01:43:09,000
The fine what we want to see if that you know if I think if we're if we're maybe buff bordering the line of we're specific and not specific enough you know we can we can add more.

1219
01:43:09,000 --> 01:43:10,000
Absolutely.

1220
01:43:10,000 --> 01:43:11,000
Okay.

1221
01:43:11,000 --> 01:43:12,000
Thank you.

1222
01:43:12,000 --> 01:43:13,000
Really quick.

1223
01:43:13,000 --> 01:43:22,000
Commissioner Massara to close the loop on that minimum height is four inches because if they want to use wood it would be three and a half so would you be more comfortable with three and a half inches.

1224
01:43:22,000 --> 01:43:25,000
Oh I think we're not going to be okay.

1225
01:43:25,000 --> 01:43:26,000
Yeah.

1226
01:43:26,000 --> 01:43:27,000
Yeah.

1227
01:43:27,000 --> 01:43:28,000
Yeah.

1228
01:43:28,000 --> 01:43:29,000
Yeah.

1229
01:43:29,000 --> 01:43:30,000
Yeah.

1230
01:43:30,000 --> 01:43:31,000
Okay.

1231
01:43:31,000 --> 01:43:38,000
So then I'm just going to hit some of my other pieces here.

1232
01:43:38,000 --> 01:43:54,000
In the material section which is B section subsection B on page 17 d 139 we talk about pallets and what I would like to see.

1233
01:43:54,000 --> 01:44:09,000
In the roof pallet it says here it says roofs may not use glazed ceramic tiles or reflected metal materials and maybe we changed the wording on reflective medical metal materials because there's oftentimes we have cool roofs.

1234
01:44:09,000 --> 01:44:23,000
We have corrugated roofs we have standing sea metal that are in all intensive purposes reflected but they're not glaring so maybe we change that section to glaring if we're worried about.

1235
01:44:24,000 --> 01:44:35,000
Glare if that's why if that's why we don't have ceramic tiles I know glaze ceramic tiles so and just to clarify that one then.

1236
01:44:35,000 --> 01:44:39,000
Is is the intent of what you're talking about.

1237
01:44:39,000 --> 01:44:44,000
Being more stringent and not allowing these other types of metal roofs as well or is it.

1238
01:44:44,000 --> 01:44:49,000
No it's it by having that wording you're telling people they.

1239
01:44:49,000 --> 01:44:51,000
If you're designing with.

1240
01:44:51,000 --> 01:44:58,000
Stant in my opinion should be designing me standing sea metal roofs or cool roofs or anything like that anything that we reflect.

1241
01:44:58,000 --> 01:45:00,000
There's the note that we have.

1242
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:10,000
From earlier was to remove, this is B1A correct page, which to just say reflective materials, regardless of what the material type was.

1243
01:45:10,000 --> 01:45:11,000
So take out the word metal.

1244
01:45:11,000 --> 01:45:17,000
Take out that's the note that I have to take out the word metal.

1245
01:45:17,000 --> 01:45:29,000
And see, same palette, I would add to that header material, metal and fiber cement.

1246
01:45:29,000 --> 01:45:37,000
And then indeed, when we call it a loud materials, it looks like we're talking about siding.

1247
01:45:37,000 --> 01:45:41,000
So I'd add that word to it.

1248
01:45:41,000 --> 01:45:54,000
And in the siding section I would add metal panel to be allowed.

1249
01:45:54,000 --> 01:46:01,000
And we talked a little bit about that metal panel.

1250
01:46:01,000 --> 01:46:09,000
I didn't know if we would want to 100% metal paneled house, but if we're designing some multifamily, for instance, which we've seen come in the past,

1251
01:46:09,000 --> 01:46:16,000
they've had metal panel coordinated to match, you know, farm housing, you know, those types of things.

1252
01:46:16,000 --> 01:46:28,000
So maybe looking at that in a way where we could have some metal allowed in the siding so that can go through rather than having it come through design review, so to speak.

1253
01:46:28,000 --> 01:46:36,000
So are you proposing to, like, because what we've done in the past is like a certain percentage or anything, we have that for the stecco, right?

1254
01:46:36,000 --> 01:46:37,000
Right.

1255
01:46:37,000 --> 01:46:40,000
Are you open to that kind of approach then?

1256
01:46:40,000 --> 01:46:41,000
Yes.

1257
01:46:41,000 --> 01:46:42,000
Yeah.

1258
01:46:42,000 --> 01:46:46,000
I would also be sensitive that it works great in Louisiana.

1259
01:46:46,000 --> 01:46:49,000
So I guess none of the city of Nevada really is.

1260
01:46:49,000 --> 01:46:50,000
Well, I'm somewhere.

1261
01:46:50,000 --> 01:46:53,000
Yeah, because the siding around is great.

1262
01:46:53,000 --> 01:46:57,000
I would love to just make a comment about corrugated metal.

1263
01:46:57,000 --> 01:47:15,000
The house next door to us, my husband and I, we, they put a metal roof on their out building and we have the tank house and my office is on that second level.

1264
01:47:15,000 --> 01:47:18,000
And it was absolutely blinding.

1265
01:47:19,000 --> 01:47:26,000
And people, we have corrugated metal fencing that we painted and it looks rusted and it's beautiful.

1266
01:47:26,000 --> 01:47:28,000
Lisa, you've, you've seen it.

1267
01:47:28,000 --> 01:47:41,000
I feel that there, I have, I'm very hesitant to go for, you know, the corrugated metal on buildings because it is very reflective and it's blinding.

1268
01:47:41,000 --> 01:47:42,000
It's eats things up.

1269
01:47:42,000 --> 01:47:49,000
It's not really, doesn't seem, um, energy efficient to me.

1270
01:47:49,000 --> 01:47:50,000
That's just my comment.

1271
01:47:50,000 --> 01:47:53,000
I'm not a designer by trade.

1272
01:47:53,000 --> 01:47:55,000
That's okay.

1273
01:47:55,000 --> 01:48:02,000
I think declaring, if we keep that word wording in our materials, then that's important.

1274
01:48:02,000 --> 01:48:21,000
There's a lot of different ways that metal can be treated so that it is actually cool and reflecting the heat more so and not bothering people, but anyway, that's just a design thing.

1275
01:48:21,000 --> 01:48:25,000
Let's see.

1276
01:48:25,000 --> 01:48:34,000
My question is on figure 17d7040-1.

1277
01:48:34,000 --> 01:48:40,000
It's on page d142.

1278
01:48:40,000 --> 01:48:43,000
17d142.

1279
01:48:43,000 --> 01:48:53,000
It's his upper story front step, and I, I just kind of had a question about why we chose those architectural styles to be used if we're cleaning up graphics.

1280
01:48:53,000 --> 01:49:09,000
When we want to use this generic, you know, as possible of looking things since we don't want to be specific that we, I don't know, just, it is a suggestion.

1281
01:49:09,000 --> 01:49:10,000
That sounds good.

1282
01:49:10,000 --> 01:49:14,000
Yeah, I'm not sure if we have anything to add on on that one.

1283
01:49:14,000 --> 01:49:15,000
No, just a minor comment.

1284
01:49:15,000 --> 01:49:18,000
Yeah, we can, we can look at the graphics.

1285
01:49:18,000 --> 01:49:26,000
Is there something, I guess my question, is there something specific that you're not liking about them?

1286
01:49:26,000 --> 01:49:39,000
I think one of the reasons we do add detail is because a, a massing diagram, like a massing model that's really just blank 3d with no design gives it gives a poor impression.

1287
01:49:39,000 --> 01:49:41,000
So we do want to add a little bit of detail.

1288
01:49:41,000 --> 01:49:49,000
So to make the look like the standards would actually make a better product rather than, you know, just a 3d3 box.

1289
01:49:49,000 --> 01:49:56,000
Other other styles that you think would be more appropriate to use that could give us, give our team a little bit more guidance.

1290
01:49:56,000 --> 01:49:58,000
I think about that one.

1291
01:49:58,000 --> 01:50:05,000
I just, I just feel like these are poor examples of what I'd want to see built.

1292
01:50:05,000 --> 01:50:14,000
And, um, and I know that there's simple graphics and I know that that's, you know, kind of what you want to want to show in the massing and all of that.

1293
01:50:14,000 --> 01:50:18,000
I do that, but yeah, just could be, I think it could be better.

1294
01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:19,000
Thank you.

1295
01:50:19,000 --> 01:50:30,000
Um, getting into page 17d143.

1296
01:50:30,000 --> 01:50:43,000
And this may be carry over from the last residential design guidelines, but I just feel like, um, should we be talking about.

1297
01:50:43,000 --> 01:50:52,000
Should we be using the word must include on these items a through d.

1298
01:50:52,000 --> 01:50:56,000
And having us talk about chimneys.

1299
01:50:56,000 --> 01:51:00,000
Do you guys have any other questions, any other comments about that?

1300
01:51:00,000 --> 01:51:06,000
I agree with the talk of chimneys since they are so.

1301
01:51:06,000 --> 01:51:07,000
Yeah.

1302
01:51:07,000 --> 01:51:15,000
So maybe figuring out a different design guidelines we should be putting in there.

1303
01:51:15,000 --> 01:51:21,000
I think the intent, um, as Katherine had alluded to before, is to outline those options.

1304
01:51:21,000 --> 01:51:24,000
But is that one that maybe should be, should be removed?

1305
01:51:24,000 --> 01:51:25,000
Yes, correct.

1306
01:51:25,000 --> 01:51:26,000
I would remember that.

1307
01:51:26,000 --> 01:51:29,000
I don't think we need to have.

1308
01:51:29,000 --> 01:51:30,000
I love it.

1309
01:51:30,000 --> 01:51:35,000
So a chimney can be.

1310
01:51:35,000 --> 01:51:38,000
Maybe outside of a build out the side of a wall.

1311
01:51:38,000 --> 01:51:39,000
Maybe one point of clarity.

1312
01:51:39,000 --> 01:51:43,000
I mean, there are, there are times within certain zone districts.

1313
01:51:43,000 --> 01:51:45,000
Well, one corner lots.

1314
01:51:45,000 --> 01:51:47,000
This would generally be applicable.

1315
01:51:47,000 --> 01:51:48,000
So it gives options that.

1316
01:51:48,000 --> 01:51:53,000
So it's also the traditional building form where chimneys were prominent of, like, giving options for people.

1317
01:51:53,000 --> 01:51:58,000
To resemble more traditional building form where they may have that.

1318
01:51:58,000 --> 01:52:04,000
But also, in instances, I think, where you increase maybe the number of units.

1319
01:52:04,000 --> 01:52:08,000
And it's not an ADU generally aware.

1320
01:52:08,000 --> 01:52:14,000
You could have to focus on both the addition and the existing context of the structure.

1321
01:52:14,000 --> 01:52:18,000
So I.

1322
01:52:18,000 --> 01:52:22,000
I think we'receptive of, receptive of the feedback, but maybe that's perspective.

1323
01:52:22,000 --> 01:52:24,000
But, um, I don't think.

1324
01:52:24,000 --> 01:52:25,000
Okay.

1325
01:52:25,000 --> 01:52:30,000
But if they wanted to have a chimney, they would just go through a design review process, right?

1326
01:52:30,000 --> 01:52:34,000
Or we're just saying that a chimney can be one of the articulations.

1327
01:52:34,000 --> 01:52:36,000
That's what all we're saying, right?

1328
01:52:36,000 --> 01:52:39,000
Okay.

1329
01:52:39,000 --> 01:52:41,000
Well, I don't know.

1330
01:52:41,000 --> 01:52:44,000
I don't know that I ever want to.

1331
01:52:44,000 --> 01:52:45,000
Yeah.

1332
01:52:45,000 --> 01:52:46,000
Hi.

1333
01:52:46,000 --> 01:52:47,000
I'm Cal Courts.

1334
01:52:47,000 --> 01:52:48,000
I lead us as it would be.

1335
01:52:48,000 --> 01:52:49,000
Oh, thank you.

1336
01:52:49,000 --> 01:52:51,000
Just to address some of that.

1337
01:52:51,000 --> 01:52:53,000
Um, just.

1338
01:52:53,000 --> 01:53:00,000
Um, so completely okay with, um, removing chimneys if that's not inappropriate standard.

1339
01:53:00,000 --> 01:53:06,000
Um, really the goal of the overall list of standards here is to break up, of course,

1340
01:53:06,000 --> 01:53:09,000
um, a wall that exceeds 35 feet and width.

1341
01:53:09,000 --> 01:53:16,000
So I just wanted to ask if there are any other design elements that you think would be more appropriate.

1342
01:53:16,000 --> 01:53:20,000
Um, so if we removed chimney as an option, there would only be three.

1343
01:53:20,000 --> 01:53:27,000
And really we like to provide a whole number of options that we feel are appropriate for the city of Napa.

1344
01:53:27,000 --> 01:53:30,000
So if you have any other suggestions, that would be very helpful.

1345
01:53:30,000 --> 01:53:32,000
Maybe it's a recess.

1346
01:53:32,000 --> 01:53:34,000
I don't, you know, just.

1347
01:53:35,000 --> 01:53:49,000
What about, I mean, I love like belly bands and in between like a stem wall and underneath window trim and things that that literally run the length of the wall.

1348
01:53:49,000 --> 01:53:55,000
Um, I think they're, they're, they are very craftsmen or farmhouse fish.

1349
01:53:55,000 --> 01:54:02,000
But, um, that is something that I like to see.

1350
01:54:03,000 --> 01:54:05,000
So belly band is an option.

1351
01:54:05,000 --> 01:54:11,000
I think to break up some of the maybe the vertical monotony and I think it is a standard in one of the sections as an option.

1352
01:54:11,000 --> 01:54:17,000
I think this generally would be to break up the large expanse of wall horizontally.

1353
01:54:17,000 --> 01:54:24,000
Um, but I do think that the belly band is a standard and option for that.

1354
01:54:24,000 --> 01:54:30,000
Yes, for the upper story elevation, actually that the next number right after number two, it's an option.

1355
01:54:30,000 --> 01:54:34,000
It's called horizontal band, but.

1356
01:54:34,000 --> 01:54:38,000
Commissioner Missara, I also have on here my notes from you.

1357
01:54:38,000 --> 01:54:45,000
That you had suggested that windows that necessarily have to be patruding and picture windows would be an option there as well.

1358
01:54:45,000 --> 01:54:46,000
Yeah.

1359
01:54:46,000 --> 01:54:49,000
I'm looking at other window types rather than just.

1360
01:54:49,000 --> 01:54:50,000
It is to pay window.

1361
01:54:50,000 --> 01:54:51,000
Pretty petruding window.

1362
01:54:51,000 --> 01:54:52,000
Right.

1363
01:54:52,000 --> 01:54:53,000
Thank you.

1364
01:54:54,000 --> 01:54:59,000
Um.

1365
01:54:59,000 --> 01:55:04,000
I don't want to take up all the time because I know my.

1366
01:55:04,000 --> 01:55:07,000
No, it's have been communicated.

1367
01:55:07,000 --> 01:55:10,000
So, um, but I do want to just hit on.

1368
01:55:10,000 --> 01:55:22,000
And I think I talked a little bit about this in the beginning when I started talking on the next page where we had 17 D 144.

1369
01:55:22,000 --> 01:55:23,000
Yeah.

1370
01:55:23,000 --> 01:55:24,000
Yeah.

1371
01:55:24,000 --> 01:55:28,000
Five articular art architectural articulations for stucco buildings.

1372
01:55:28,000 --> 01:55:33,000
And then it's repeated in here for other buildings with these, with these same.

1373
01:55:33,000 --> 01:55:34,000
A through F's.

1374
01:55:34,000 --> 01:55:38,000
Descriptions where we have Iron window grill.

1375
01:55:38,000 --> 01:55:39,000
Julia balcony.

1376
01:55:39,000 --> 01:55:43,000
Decorative tile arch window.

1377
01:55:43,000 --> 01:55:45,000
Classical and tablature.

1378
01:55:45,000 --> 01:55:48,000
Cornous arch door, etc.

1379
01:55:48,000 --> 01:55:51,000
That's what I was referring to as.

1380
01:55:51,000 --> 01:55:54,000
Being very specific.

1381
01:55:54,000 --> 01:55:56,000
Architectural styles.

1382
01:55:56,000 --> 01:55:58,000
But we're not telling.

1383
01:55:58,000 --> 01:56:02,000
We're not giving architectural styles as a full definition.

1384
01:56:02,000 --> 01:56:07,000
So, it's either it's kind of like either take that away or.

1385
01:56:07,000 --> 01:56:09,000
Go deeper.

1386
01:56:09,000 --> 01:56:14,000
It's sort of how I feel.

1387
01:56:14,000 --> 01:56:20,000
So, as you're concerned, you don't like this list or you'd like to add additional options to this list.

1388
01:56:20,000 --> 01:56:28,000
Um, I guess what what I'm trying to say is maybe I don't.

1389
01:56:28,000 --> 01:56:33,000
I don't like the list because.

1390
01:56:33,000 --> 01:56:34,000
It.

1391
01:56:34,000 --> 01:56:35,000
If we're trying.

1392
01:56:35,000 --> 01:56:38,000
If we're trying not to dictate style.

1393
01:56:38,000 --> 01:56:41,000
But we're but now we're dictating style.

1394
01:56:41,000 --> 01:56:42,000
Sure.

1395
01:56:42,000 --> 01:56:43,000
I think that is just where I'm at.

1396
01:56:43,000 --> 01:56:44,000
What do you think?

1397
01:56:44,000 --> 01:56:45,000
What do you guys think up here?

1398
01:56:45,000 --> 01:56:46,000
What am I?

1399
01:56:46,000 --> 01:56:49,000
Commissioner's think.

1400
01:56:50,000 --> 01:56:53,000
I think some input and it because I think context is important.

1401
01:56:53,000 --> 01:56:54,000
Like generally.

1402
01:56:54,000 --> 01:56:57,000
Staff had received the draft.

1403
01:56:57,000 --> 01:56:59,000
Um.

1404
01:56:59,000 --> 01:57:03,000
Limiting the amount of stucco was generally the theme.

1405
01:57:03,000 --> 01:57:04,000
And then.

1406
01:57:04,000 --> 01:57:08,000
Staff had conveyed comments that will well.

1407
01:57:08,000 --> 01:57:14,000
There's a traditional style that utilized primary primarily stucco.

1408
01:57:14,000 --> 01:57:17,000
So, how is there an option to.

1409
01:57:18,000 --> 01:57:21,000
Give that option to people, but also still break up.

1410
01:57:21,000 --> 01:57:25,000
What could be large expanses of wall that provides stucco.

1411
01:57:25,000 --> 01:57:29,000
So I think the initial take of that is.

1412
01:57:29,000 --> 01:57:33,000
To give certain relief options that are generally typical for.

1413
01:57:33,000 --> 01:57:36,000
Maybe architectural styles that utilize stucco.

1414
01:57:36,000 --> 01:57:40,000
So it's not to dictate it, but I think it's generally to.

1415
01:57:40,000 --> 01:57:46,000
So it's not to acknowledge where there are certain architectural styles within the community to give options to.

1416
01:57:46,000 --> 01:57:51,000
Still receptive of feedback if they're alternative.

1417
01:57:51,000 --> 01:57:54,000
Ways to to give more relief to.

1418
01:57:54,000 --> 01:57:56,000
To stucco.

1419
01:57:56,000 --> 01:57:57,000
Yeah, I agree.

1420
01:57:57,000 --> 01:58:00,000
That just gives some perspective of.

1421
01:58:00,000 --> 01:58:01,000
Of.

1422
01:58:01,000 --> 01:58:04,000
Why I think this section is out on.

1423
01:58:04,000 --> 01:58:08,000
The section does also say must provide a minimum of one.

1424
01:58:08,000 --> 01:58:11,000
And like commissioner masaro says said.

1425
01:58:11,000 --> 01:58:16,000
You know stucco is now used more often because of its fire resistivity.

1426
01:58:16,000 --> 01:58:20,000
So it's and there's modern homes that have none of those on the home.

1427
01:58:20,000 --> 01:58:24,000
It's not you know not Spanish at all.

1428
01:58:24,000 --> 01:58:28,000
So I agree they don't have to have one of those.

1429
01:58:28,000 --> 01:58:30,000
Maybe the wording is.

1430
01:58:30,000 --> 01:58:34,000
Something how you discuss the relief or breaking up the massing.

1431
01:58:34,000 --> 01:58:37,000
But I don't think it's it has to have one of those ABCD.

1432
01:58:37,000 --> 01:58:43,000
And maybe that's the the request is to maybe identify more options to that.

1433
01:58:43,000 --> 01:58:51,000
It's generally do want to acknowledge where the commission has.

1434
01:58:51,000 --> 01:58:56,000
Provided feedback in past projects where it has just been a stucco box.

1435
01:58:56,000 --> 01:58:58,000
So it's trying to strike the right balance.

1436
01:58:58,000 --> 01:58:59,000
Sure.

1437
01:58:59,000 --> 01:59:00,000
Sure.

1438
01:59:00,000 --> 01:59:06,000
Okay, so then maybe we should think about adding.

1439
01:59:06,000 --> 01:59:11,000
Something to this list that meets the.

1440
01:59:11,000 --> 01:59:14,000
Design standard of a.

1441
01:59:14,000 --> 01:59:17,000
Contemporary or modern because the only.

1442
01:59:17,000 --> 01:59:21,000
Must in here if you already do a modern would be a Julia balcony.

1443
01:59:21,000 --> 01:59:25,000
And why that may just work fine because I think it works fine on the.

1444
01:59:25,000 --> 01:59:27,000
That modern.

1445
01:59:27,000 --> 01:59:32,000
Looking apartment complex on first tree.

1446
01:59:33,000 --> 01:59:35,000
Maybe that's it. Maybe that's fine.

1447
01:59:35,000 --> 01:59:40,000
But maybe add an onion in here.

1448
01:59:40,000 --> 01:59:42,000
Because that would break up the.

1449
01:59:42,000 --> 01:59:50,000
Menate of a stucco something.

1450
01:59:50,000 --> 01:59:53,000
That's very helpful. Thank you.

1451
02:00:00,000 --> 02:00:24,720
And then same thing repeated on page 17D150. It's the same architecture articulation for

1452
02:00:24,720 --> 02:00:28,720
stack of buildings having to do with multi-family. So, just the same note.

1453
02:00:40,720 --> 02:00:51,720
There was one note I had in here and I don't know if you can find it for me easier over there, Molly.

1454
02:00:51,720 --> 02:00:53,720
It was the one having to do with dormers.

1455
02:00:53,720 --> 02:00:56,720
So, yeah, you were on that page 144.

1456
02:00:56,720 --> 02:01:04,720
Yes, I have looking at options that would allow for the placement of solar panels.

1457
02:01:04,720 --> 02:01:08,720
Yes, yes. I love a long, big beautiful roof plane.

1458
02:01:08,720 --> 02:01:13,720
Yes, not just dormers, but look at options for incentivizing or allowing for solar panels.

1459
02:01:13,720 --> 02:01:16,720
I do have that. It's on page 17D144.

1460
02:01:16,720 --> 02:01:28,720
If I could just ask, so we've certainly had discussions about dormers, about the solar access.

1461
02:01:28,720 --> 02:01:37,720
So, if you could just clarify, do you think it would be best to remove the standard that requires dormers when a roof plane exceeds 40 feet?

1462
02:01:37,720 --> 02:01:39,720
Yes, that's what I would recommend.

1463
02:01:46,720 --> 02:02:04,720
And I think that was it with my specifics and questions.

1464
02:02:04,720 --> 02:02:11,720
Did you, right? Because I have all of your notes, everything is kind of running together.

1465
02:02:11,720 --> 02:02:13,720
I should have cut it a little bit better.

1466
02:02:13,720 --> 02:02:17,720
But, so I do anything we spoke about when you came to meet with us.

1467
02:02:17,720 --> 02:02:23,720
And I think they will make sure the consultants get.

1468
02:02:23,720 --> 02:02:26,720
We had the opportunity to look through your comments.

1469
02:02:26,720 --> 02:02:29,720
There might be other questions that we have.

1470
02:02:29,720 --> 02:02:33,720
So, hopefully, we were able to ask staff to get any clarity.

1471
02:02:33,720 --> 02:02:35,720
But, one thing does come to mind.

1472
02:02:35,720 --> 02:02:39,720
I believe, and if it wasn't your comment, Commissioner, I apologize.

1473
02:02:39,720 --> 02:02:41,720
A question about roof fencing. Do you recall that?

1474
02:02:41,720 --> 02:02:42,720
Oh, yeah.

1475
02:02:42,720 --> 02:02:47,720
Could you provide a little more clarity about what you're looking for there? Is it screening of roof fencing?

1476
02:02:47,720 --> 02:02:51,720
Or is it the regulation of venting methods?

1477
02:02:51,720 --> 02:02:55,720
Well, I think it was the, well, it had more to do with is there.

1478
02:02:55,720 --> 02:03:07,720
As we're planning to, as we're getting into providing more and more solar on our commercial buildings and then our multifamily buildings and our residential buildings.

1479
02:03:07,720 --> 02:03:19,720
There's an advantage to grouping your venting in a location that would then keep it away from where the solar panels would normally be.

1480
02:03:19,720 --> 02:03:22,720
And it's a little bit more expensive to do it that way.

1481
02:03:22,720 --> 02:03:28,720
But, it gives whoever the homework is, the opportunity to have the most space available.

1482
02:03:28,720 --> 02:03:35,720
Typically, when you build construction, you're where your bathroom is, your roof fencing comes out right from the bathroom.

1483
02:03:35,720 --> 02:03:41,720
And then your bathroom might, you might have three bathrooms. And so you have three different bathrooms, and then you have the washing machine vent.

1484
02:03:41,720 --> 02:03:45,720
You got the water heater vent and kitchen, kitchen, and all those things. Yeah.

1485
02:03:45,720 --> 02:03:51,720
So that was it. But I don't know that that would be feasible.

1486
02:03:51,720 --> 02:04:01,720
I have a quick question because you are so knowledgeable about energy, like clean building, healthy buildings, all of it, very, very impressive.

1487
02:04:01,720 --> 02:04:17,720
When will solar panels be smaller and less intrusive and why aren't there more building roof materials that are that have the solar capacity embedded in them?

1488
02:04:17,720 --> 02:04:30,720
Why are there not more building materials that can, that can do the job of solar panels, so that you don't see solar panels, it's embedded in the building materials.

1489
02:04:30,720 --> 02:04:42,720
It's a longer conversation, but it has to do with building code and testing and getting your, and getting the items tested to be approved in the standards.

1490
02:04:42,720 --> 02:04:43,720
That's a bigger question.

1491
02:04:43,720 --> 02:04:58,720
If I may ask chair Owen, since we do have public in the audience tonight, and we are starting to lose members of the public, ask whether the chair might consider allowing the public to comment.

1492
02:04:58,720 --> 02:05:00,720
And then coming back to the audience.

1493
02:05:00,720 --> 02:05:02,720
How many comment cards am I doing?

1494
02:05:02,720 --> 02:05:06,720
I received six.

1495
02:05:06,720 --> 02:05:17,720
Okay. Before we open public comment, could I have an opportunity to actually, because my, my comments are very, very concise.

1496
02:05:17,720 --> 02:05:18,720
Okay.

1497
02:05:18,720 --> 02:05:24,720
Because I met with staff and I covered everything and only have a couple of items.

1498
02:05:24,720 --> 02:05:25,720
Sure.

1499
02:05:25,720 --> 02:05:26,720
Is that okay?

1500
02:05:27,720 --> 02:05:37,720
I just want to say that I've been very impressed with.

1501
02:05:37,720 --> 02:05:46,720
When I signed up for to receive the email correspondence and getting the updates, it has been so incredibly helpful, so thank you.

1502
02:05:46,720 --> 02:05:55,720
And I also wanted to say that I appreciate the reduced parking standards to help increase density.

1503
02:05:55,720 --> 02:06:11,720
I thought that I believe that this updated draft, even though we're still working on it and I will have will submit more thoughts through the, either through staff or through that amazing vehicle that we have with the portal.

1504
02:06:11,720 --> 02:06:23,720
But the updated draft I just wanted to compliment you guys because it is much more user friendly than the previous draft the zoning map is so much easier to navigate.

1505
02:06:23,720 --> 02:06:32,720
The course wants to throughout this project with those emails and updates have been really helpful, especially the executive summary.

1506
02:06:32,720 --> 02:06:38,720
If you just have time to read the executive summary, you learn so much right.

1507
02:06:38,720 --> 02:06:51,720
I just wanted to mention that I had a question and this is something that you can just think of how to staff me be able to get back to me on it two things number one.

1508
02:06:51,720 --> 02:07:00,720
Artificial turf is mentioned in two areas and I did meet with staff and I explained this, but I just thought it's worth repeating here.

1509
02:07:00,720 --> 02:07:12,720
17D 11, we have a required landscape area visible from the public right of way, it must not utilize non vegetative ground.

1510
02:07:12,720 --> 02:07:24,720
And then we have a net it's also mentioned back here and then on page 17D 157 and open space design.

1511
02:07:24,720 --> 02:07:30,720
We have where you're designing an open space that artificial turf is prohibited.

1512
02:07:30,720 --> 02:07:49,720
This just made me explore extraordinarily happy because I feel that it would be great if we could somehow ban artificial turf unless it's perhaps many golf courses or perhaps an area of a playground or.

1513
02:07:49,720 --> 02:08:02,720
Something of that sort I know other cities have done it and I just had a question for the consultant team have you worked with any cities that have banned artificial turf.

1514
02:08:02,720 --> 02:08:11,720
And Catherine maybe Catherine can wait and in my experience it's it's all over the gamut right coming so we've we've had.

1515
02:08:11,720 --> 02:08:23,720
We've had clients that kind of want the opposite and and right now they're starting to allow artificial turf I know there are always water you know concerns and things like that.

1516
02:08:23,720 --> 02:08:28,720
I don't recall it the client that's ban turf but maybe you will do.

1517
02:08:28,720 --> 02:08:36,720
I would just add that this actually came up in a meeting I was in today with our parks and recreation director and as we're looking at harvest.

1518
02:08:36,720 --> 02:08:45,720
You know sometimes there is a benefit in terms from the sport field perspective from artificial turf and so I think that that's a conversation that's going to be coming up as part of the harvest.

1519
02:08:46,720 --> 02:08:57,720
Projects discussion and you know what what and she also said that the technology is changing a little bit so I'm not going to get it right but some sort of off gassing that that comes from it.

1520
02:08:57,720 --> 02:09:02,720
Many of the products are changing however the downside being artificial turf isn't last as long so you.

1521
02:09:02,720 --> 02:09:08,720
So many problems with it but I won't get into that that's my water loop and then the last thing.

1522
02:09:08,720 --> 02:09:20,720
I just have this other question that I couldn't really and perhaps I've read 90% of this I just have a few more pages to go back on but.

1523
02:09:21,720 --> 02:09:26,720
Is there a way to put more restrictions on.

1524
02:09:26,720 --> 02:09:37,720
Extending entitlements or that the extensions of entitlements is there is there anything in a zoning code that we can restrict.

1525
02:09:37,720 --> 02:09:39,720
Like.

1526
02:09:39,720 --> 02:09:47,720
The extensions of permits and entitlements that have already been approved.

1527
02:09:47,720 --> 02:09:57,720
I would I would recommend as you just saw we did that for the first time you this commission included a recommendation that goes to council next week on that in the zoning.

1528
02:09:57,720 --> 02:10:02,720
I think each project is going to be a little bit different and actually one of the.

1529
02:10:02,720 --> 02:10:14,720
One of the points in a grand jury report that was written about the planning division was suggesting that we look at that so I would I would maybe pull that one out separately from from this but look at maybe a citywide policy and administrative regulation.

1530
02:10:14,720 --> 02:10:24,720
I think he's that he was it thank you and I would I would actually say to commissioner on since you're the only one that hasn't gone it's probably makes sense for you to go now and and sorry to the public if you can hang on with us for just a few more minutes.

1531
02:10:24,720 --> 02:10:29,720
I looked through mine they're very designed specific so I can just email to you and you can communicate them.

1532
02:10:29,720 --> 02:10:34,720
Okay up to you I just wanted to give you that option just said that you don't like to more so.

1533
02:10:34,720 --> 02:10:35,720
Okay.

1534
02:10:35,720 --> 02:10:37,720
All right.

1535
02:10:37,720 --> 02:10:40,720
Do you want to sort of public on we can go to public comment.

1536
02:10:44,720 --> 02:10:58,720
So I received seven I don't know if everyone is still here but I can just call them up in no particular order Linda Brown Chris Benz.

1537
02:10:58,720 --> 02:11:02,720
Maryland at night men's in Bruce.

1538
02:11:02,720 --> 02:11:04,720
Bruce Bosch.

1539
02:11:04,720 --> 02:11:10,720
Joseph Keibler and Carlotta Sinato and Bayard Fox.

1540
02:11:10,720 --> 02:11:17,720
And Catherine Kelly in my register to clarify will stick with the typical three minutes. Thank you.

1541
02:11:17,720 --> 02:11:23,720
Before I'm going to read.

1542
02:11:23,720 --> 02:11:29,720
Before my three minutes start I just want to say that Carol, barge and Bruce barge I think of left.

1543
02:11:29,720 --> 02:11:30,720
Okay.

1544
02:11:30,720 --> 02:11:33,720
So they were on your list but I don't see them now.

1545
02:11:33,720 --> 02:11:34,720
Thank you.

1546
02:11:34,720 --> 02:11:35,720
Thank you.

1547
02:11:36,720 --> 02:11:39,720
First of all, commissioner shot well.

1548
02:11:39,720 --> 02:11:42,720
Thank you for your comments on artificial turf.

1549
02:11:42,720 --> 02:11:44,720
I couldn't be in more agreement.

1550
02:11:44,720 --> 02:11:45,720
It's not sustainable.

1551
02:11:45,720 --> 02:11:50,720
It breaks down into microplastic pollution no matter what they say.

1552
02:11:50,720 --> 02:12:01,720
It disturbs the agroecology which kills off soil and also disturbs the microbiome in the organic material that sequester's carbon.

1553
02:12:01,720 --> 02:12:12,720
And it heats up greatly and it's a completely inappropriate for athletic fields where in a time when the world is heating up when we're having super heat days.

1554
02:12:12,720 --> 02:12:18,720
The last thing we need are athletic fields that are even hotter than they would be if they were grass.

1555
02:12:18,720 --> 02:12:20,720
Now here are my prepared comments.

1556
02:12:20,720 --> 02:12:23,720
Remember seeing Claire gas stations.

1557
02:12:23,720 --> 02:12:24,720
Maybe you don't.

1558
02:12:24,720 --> 02:12:29,720
But if you do, you'll remember that they had a dinosaur that was their big emblem.

1559
02:12:29,720 --> 02:12:32,720
And that's how we should be looking at gas stations right now.

1560
02:12:32,720 --> 02:12:34,720
They're dinosaurs.

1561
02:12:34,720 --> 02:12:41,720
They perpetuate fossil fuel dependency culture that is in parallel to our climate and our lives.

1562
02:12:41,720 --> 02:12:44,720
Not to mention future generations.

1563
02:12:44,720 --> 02:12:46,720
This is not Jurassic Park.

1564
02:12:46,720 --> 02:12:49,720
We do not want to encourage gas stations.

1565
02:12:49,720 --> 02:12:52,720
I have so much to say about it.

1566
02:12:52,720 --> 02:12:54,720
I know others will be commenting on it.

1567
02:12:54,720 --> 02:12:56,720
But I will say a few words.

1568
02:12:56,720 --> 02:13:07,720
Our general plan and our RCAP as well as our sister cities throughout the county have established permanent bands on new and expanded fossil fuel pumps.

1569
02:13:07,720 --> 02:13:12,720
And the RCAP envisions facing down our gas dependency over time.

1570
02:13:12,720 --> 02:13:15,720
We need alternative transportation.

1571
02:13:15,720 --> 02:13:17,720
That's where our efforts should go.

1572
02:13:17,720 --> 02:13:19,720
We do not need new gas stations.

1573
02:13:19,720 --> 02:13:25,720
Please modify the draft zoning language to be in sync with these intentions.

1574
02:13:25,720 --> 02:13:29,720
Now to say a word about drive throughs.

1575
02:13:29,720 --> 02:13:33,720
These are primarily all about convenience.

1576
02:13:33,720 --> 02:13:36,720
When I grew up, we didn't have drive throughs.

1577
02:13:36,720 --> 02:13:40,720
It was not something anyone ever felt we needed to do.

1578
02:13:40,720 --> 02:13:43,720
We could get out of the car and go walk into wherever.

1579
02:13:43,720 --> 02:13:45,720
It's not about community benefit.

1580
02:13:45,720 --> 02:13:47,720
It's all about convenience.

1581
02:13:47,720 --> 02:13:51,720
And as we've learned the hard way from fast food, fast fashion.

1582
02:13:51,720 --> 02:13:54,720
Convenience is bad for our health.

1583
02:13:54,720 --> 02:14:04,720
It is well-established at vehicle idling emissions or dangerous to breathe hurting nearby residents, especially in simultaneously contributing to climate change.

1584
02:14:04,720 --> 02:14:09,720
Our kids in Napa already have asthma rates that are higher than the California average.

1585
02:14:09,720 --> 02:14:17,720
And there are numerous pulmonary and other diseases associated with the emissions of idling vehicles.

1586
02:14:17,720 --> 02:14:23,720
Our traffic circles thankfully reduce these emissions at high density intersections but we need to do a lot more.

1587
02:14:23,720 --> 02:14:29,720
Just take a look on Jefferson Avenue at Dutch Brothers or at McDonald's or at In and Out Burger.

1588
02:14:29,720 --> 02:14:31,720
The lines are obscene.

1589
02:14:31,720 --> 02:14:35,720
We have to do something that's not about convenience.

1590
02:14:35,720 --> 02:14:40,720
So I urge you to change the language in the zoning ordinance to phase it out.

1591
02:14:40,720 --> 02:14:41,720
Thank you.

1592
02:14:41,720 --> 02:14:51,720
Good evening.

1593
02:14:51,720 --> 02:14:56,720
Maryland Night Mendelssohn, Napa resident, member of Napa climate now.

1594
02:14:56,720 --> 02:14:59,720
I'm also going to speak to the issue.

1595
02:15:00,000 --> 02:15:21,000
Of new and existing gas stations. The draft zoning regulations that permit new and expended fossil fuel gas stations do not seem to align with key parts of the 2040 general plan.

1596
02:15:21,000 --> 02:15:30,000
Getting principal number 7 states to achieve a healthy and safe community for all.

1597
02:15:30,000 --> 02:15:42,000
The public health and equity element addresses how this is to be achieved. It contains two goals that are relevant to the gas station issue.

1598
02:15:42,000 --> 02:16:06,000
First one, goal P-H-E-1 states incorporate a health in all policies framework to send a health considerations in policies, programs and practices that affect all aspects of the civic decision-making process.

1599
02:16:06,000 --> 02:16:30,000
That's the first one. The second one, goal P-H-E-3 states promote clean air and water, healthy natural environment and pollution-free neighborhoods to reduce disparate health impacts resulting from environmental pollutants in vulnerable communities.

1600
02:16:30,000 --> 02:16:45,000
The public health and equity element of the general plan contains a map of pollution sources, including what are referred to as permitted water discharges.

1601
02:16:45,000 --> 02:17:07,000
And include the Brownfield sites at former gas stations. The general plan describes this pollution as follows. Ground water threats happen when hazardous chemicals are stored in containers on land or in underground storage tanks.

1602
02:17:07,000 --> 02:17:23,000
Leaks from tanks that can contaminate soil and groundwater. Common soil and groundwater pollutants include gasoline and diesel fuels at gas stations.

1603
02:17:23,000 --> 02:17:36,000
Do you believe that permitting new gas stations will promote clean air and water and natural healthy environment and pollution-free neighborhoods?

1604
02:17:36,000 --> 02:17:51,000
No. Abband on new and expanded fossil fuels stations aligns the zoning regulations with the goals and guiding principles of the city's general plan.

1605
02:17:51,000 --> 02:18:00,000
We ask you to direct staff to amend the draft regulations to include a ban. Thank you.

1606
02:18:06,000 --> 02:18:24,000
Good evening. My name is Byard Fox. I am ten gently involved in the agricultural industry, which is very much impacted by the climate crisis today.

1607
02:18:24,000 --> 02:18:36,000
So let me also allow me to thank you for your service to the community. I'm well aware of considerable reading and workload involved in your responsibilities.

1608
02:18:37,000 --> 02:18:57,000
Your job is to implement land use policies specifically applied by parameters of the general plan. The general plan has clear sustainability objectives as well as climate pollutant targets related to CO2 and other gases.

1609
02:18:57,000 --> 02:19:02,000
I've not seen convenience as a priority in the general plan.

1610
02:19:02,000 --> 02:19:16,000
Vehicle miles traveled are our largest single climate pollutant and as such all aspects related to VMT must be addressed in all aspects of land use.

1611
02:19:16,000 --> 02:19:26,000
Public review provided strong direction on a permanent moratorium of drive throughs as well as fossil fuel stations.

1612
02:19:26,000 --> 02:19:38,000
Your direction to staff and the consulting group behind me are critical to implementing the overall lens of our climate initiatives.

1613
02:19:38,000 --> 02:19:55,000
The current suggested verbiage appears vague and equivocates on the importance of the climate agenda and general plan especially in regards to drive throughs and gas stations.

1614
02:19:55,000 --> 02:20:05,000
Other napavalley towns have a permanent moratorium on gas stations and we should follow that precedent likewise.

1615
02:20:05,000 --> 02:20:13,000
Drive throughs should be completely abolished idling accounts for 5% of our vehicle emissions.

1616
02:20:13,000 --> 02:20:18,000
Why are we continuing to contribute with that? Thank you.

1617
02:20:18,000 --> 02:20:30,000
Hi, Carlota Sinato program manager with the Napa County Bicycle Coalition.

1618
02:20:30,000 --> 02:20:35,000
Thank you for the opportunity to provide and put on the draft zoning ordinance update.

1619
02:20:35,000 --> 02:20:46,000
We submitted a written letter earlier in the public comment period with our detailed comments but I wanted to come and highlights some of our main points for the planning commission.

1620
02:20:46,000 --> 02:20:59,000
First we want to thank the city and the consultant for exceeding state requirements for location of non-residential bike parking requiring that the bike parking be within 50 feet of a building entrance.

1621
02:20:59,000 --> 02:21:10,000
This is a standard that's set by the association of pedestrian and bicycle professionals and recognized by the league of American bicyclists bicycle friendly communities program.

1622
02:21:10,000 --> 02:21:19,000
However, it's our understanding that the draft non-residential bike parking code is otherwise not in compliance with the mandatory 2025 Calgreen codes.

1623
02:21:19,000 --> 02:21:26,000
We outline the Calgreen codes regarding non-residential short term and long term bike parking in our written letter.

1624
02:21:26,000 --> 02:21:34,000
I know one of our team members has brought this up earlier and began this conversation so we hope to see that this is corrected prior to adoption.

1625
02:21:34,000 --> 02:21:50,000
Assuming that the codes are updated this way we ask that Napa's local ordinance also requires that short term bike parking be compliant with the association for pedestrian and bicycle professional guidelines around bike rack styles and placement.

1626
02:21:50,000 --> 02:21:57,000
As well as include language around accommodating cargo and child carrier bikes and coverage by building security cameras.

1627
02:21:57,000 --> 02:22:10,000
Doing so will help ensure that bike parking is secure useful and makes efficient use of space as well as help the city of Napa in maintaining and advancing its status as a bicycle friendly community.

1628
02:22:10,000 --> 02:22:21,000
Additionally, in our written letter we outlined recommendations for a May include section for residential bike parking requirements to supplement the Calgreen requirements.

1629
02:22:21,000 --> 02:22:29,000
As AB 130 has placed a moratorium on the adoption of new or more restrictive residential building standards.

1630
02:22:29,000 --> 02:22:33,000
I put the state and local levels for the next five years.

1631
02:22:33,000 --> 02:22:39,000
The only way these features can be included in Napa zoning code is as May include recommendations.

1632
02:22:39,000 --> 02:22:53,000
Including these recommendations will encourage builders to consider features that will support city of Napa's mode shift goals and that may not otherwise occur to builders who are unfamiliar with bike parking specific best practices.

1633
02:22:53,000 --> 02:23:08,000
Having safe and secure bike parking is one of the first things that people consider when they are weighing the decision to invest in things like e-bikes or e-cargo bikes that can really help shift that mode.

1634
02:23:08,000 --> 02:23:16,000
So having really strong bike parking guidelines is essential to helping people get out of their cars and get on bikes.

1635
02:23:16,000 --> 02:23:22,000
We are happy to answer any questions or provide further insight on our request with the team and thank you for your time.

1636
02:23:22,000 --> 02:23:31,000
Thank you.

1637
02:23:31,000 --> 02:23:37,000
Good evening commissioners, Jim Wilson, city of Napa resident.

1638
02:23:37,000 --> 02:23:41,000
Member Napa climate now and grandfather.

1639
02:23:42,000 --> 02:23:45,000
I'm reading from a letter to the editor from our mayor.

1640
02:23:45,000 --> 02:23:53,000
Scott Sajli published February 16th, 2022 protect our local watershed.

1641
02:23:53,000 --> 02:23:56,000
In it, he says, quote,

1642
02:23:56,000 --> 02:24:02,000
We need to find short and long-term solutions to housing, transportation and climate change.

1643
02:24:02,000 --> 02:24:06,000
Climate change is brought us many uncertainties.

1644
02:24:06,000 --> 02:24:11,000
And we'll require monumental change to the way we conduct business and quote.

1645
02:24:11,000 --> 02:24:15,000
This is an inspiration to me and many of the folks that I work with.

1646
02:24:15,000 --> 02:24:18,000
I teach climate responsibility in the schools.

1647
02:24:18,000 --> 02:24:22,000
I teach this letter to the community by our mayor.

1648
02:24:22,000 --> 02:24:33,000
I'm looking at a letter written in May of 2022 by planner Paul Aniel.

1649
02:24:34,000 --> 02:24:37,000
And he's writing it to a gas station applicant on sosco Avenue.

1650
02:24:37,000 --> 02:24:39,000
It's about a pre-application.

1651
02:24:39,000 --> 02:24:42,000
It's in his preliminary review summary.

1652
02:24:42,000 --> 02:24:44,000
This application has some problems.

1653
02:24:44,000 --> 02:24:50,000
But Mr. Neil took pains to say the following and this makes my heart race.

1654
02:24:50,000 --> 02:24:54,000
Since the use permit requires approval by the Planning Commission.

1655
02:24:54,000 --> 02:25:02,000
An applicant should consider the previous meeting and discussions of the commission and their opinions on drive through uses and other uses.

1656
02:25:02,000 --> 02:25:06,000
That are thought to increase greenhouse gas emissions.

1657
02:25:06,000 --> 02:25:18,000
If the project is appealed, it will be reviewed by the city council who are even more critical of greenhouse gas generating uses.

1658
02:25:18,000 --> 02:25:27,000
The council recently adopted a resolution declaring a climate emergency last month, April 5, 2022.

1659
02:25:27,000 --> 02:25:33,000
And granted an appeal denying a drive through facility on November 22, 2021.

1660
02:25:33,000 --> 02:25:40,000
A more TORM on new gas stations is also likely to be approved by the city council in the near future.

1661
02:25:40,000 --> 02:25:46,000
Similar to the more TORM's past by the city of Petaluma and other Sonoma County cities.

1662
02:25:46,000 --> 02:25:48,000
And quote.

1663
02:25:48,000 --> 02:25:51,000
Thank you, Paul.

1664
02:25:51,000 --> 02:26:00,000
That more TORM went into effect in April of the following year and expired a year later in 2024.

1665
02:26:00,000 --> 02:26:08,000
Ultimately, the resolution Paul referred to led to the general plan, which was updated later in the year.

1666
02:26:08,000 --> 02:26:13,000
And I want to quote from the goal CCS1 further.

1667
02:26:13,000 --> 02:26:24,000
The city's sustainability initiative is to reduce the community's greenhouse gas emissions and foster green development patterns, including buildings, sites and landscapes.

1668
02:26:24,000 --> 02:26:39,000
And the first policy around climate change is from the resolution, implement immediate and sustained actions and support of achieving that zero climate pollutants from public and private operations within the city by 2030.

1669
02:26:39,000 --> 02:26:40,000
Thank you.

1670
02:26:40,000 --> 02:26:41,000
Thank you.

1671
02:26:43,000 --> 02:26:50,000
Good evening.

1672
02:26:50,000 --> 02:27:04,000
My name is Sophie Wassif and I'm a recent graduate of justancy in a high school in coming freshman at MIT and co-president of the student led environmental advocacy organization, NAPA Schools for Climate Action.

1673
02:27:04,000 --> 02:27:16,000
Today, I speak behalf on behalf of my team to urge you to take the climate emergency seriously and uphold your commitment to addressing climate pollution in our beautiful valley.

1674
02:27:16,000 --> 02:27:33,000
It has come to our attention that the city of NAPA's moratorium on new fossil fuel stations has expired and a recently published zoning public review draft indicates that construction of new gas stations is indeed permitted.

1675
02:27:33,000 --> 02:27:44,000
This represents a big step back for NAPA, a city that has committed to prioritizing urgent climate action to lay the groundwork for a safe future for its inhabitants.

1676
02:27:44,000 --> 02:27:55,000
Gas stations not only contribute to environmental harm through greenhouse gas emissions and the transportation sector, the sites themselves pose risks to human health.

1677
02:27:55,000 --> 02:28:06,000
To specify, gas stations release volatile organic compounds into the surrounding air, which are associated with respiratory issues as well as increased cancer risk.

1678
02:28:06,000 --> 02:28:11,000
Below grounds leaks contaminate nearby soil and water sources.

1679
02:28:11,000 --> 02:28:16,000
Once their time is over, gas stations become brownfields that are costly to remediate.

1680
02:28:16,000 --> 02:28:28,000
I urge you to question whether continuing to build infrastructure that poses a threat to human and environmental health is what is right for our community.

1681
02:28:29,000 --> 02:28:50,000
As a city whose livelihood relies on the stable climate, we have to understand that building a sustainable NAPA means prohibiting additional outdated and harmful fossil fuel infrastructure and immediately shifting efforts to expand clean energy and its accessibility.

1682
02:28:50,000 --> 02:29:06,000
As the neighboring Yantville, St. Helena, American Canyon and Calistoga have all worked to create permanent bands on new and expanded gas stations consistent with their climate emergency resolutions and 2030 net zero greenhouse gas emission commitments.

1683
02:29:06,000 --> 02:29:09,000
We hope the city of NAPA will do the same.

1684
02:29:09,000 --> 02:29:19,000
During the May 15th and November 6th planning commission meetings last year, we made similar formal requests for action, as I'm sure you might remember.

1685
02:29:19,000 --> 02:29:30,000
We understand taking these actions are neither simple nor easy. They require continuous attention, collaboration and leadership centered on climate forward values.

1686
02:29:31,000 --> 02:29:36,000
At the same time, we see them as necessary to ensure a safe and livable future.

1687
02:29:36,000 --> 02:29:39,000
Thank you very much for your time and attention.

1688
02:29:39,000 --> 02:29:42,000
Thank you and congrats on MIT.

1689
02:29:47,000 --> 02:29:53,000
So, he's also a winner of the NAPA Schools for Climate Action Scholarship this year.

1690
02:29:53,000 --> 02:30:00,000
I don't mind waiting because it has to make the comments because it was fascinating to see you all.

1691
02:30:00,000 --> 02:30:09,000
We use your expertise and go deep into the woods on these regulations. Thank you for that. I was very appreciative of all your comments.

1692
02:30:09,000 --> 02:30:22,000
I also wanted to say thank you to writer and the staff and the consultants for the public workshop on Tuesday night. That was very informative and it was great to see commissioner shot well there.

1693
02:30:22,000 --> 02:30:35,000
Learn from staff that this graph does not contain a ban on new and expanded fossil fuel stations because staff did not receive formal direction from the planning commission.

1694
02:30:35,000 --> 02:30:45,000
The city council has given clear direction when they established a more atrium on new stations, pending the update of the zoning regulations.

1695
02:30:45,000 --> 02:31:05,000
The city council members and our vios and painter who served on the Napa County Climate Action Committee were clear when they approved the regional climate action and adaptation plan, which list a ban on the development of new fossil fuel pumps as one of its near-term actions.

1696
02:31:05,000 --> 02:31:33,000
If you think as we do that Napa is adequately served by the 21 gas stations we have now, including 32 pumps at Costco, then we ask you to please give clear direction to the staff to have the zoning regulations include a ban on new and expanded fossil fuel stations as has been done by the other jurisdictions in the county.

1697
02:31:33,000 --> 02:31:43,000
Thank you. Thanks Chris.

1698
02:31:43,000 --> 02:31:52,000
Hi my name is Katherine Kelly. I'm a newcomer to this because we recently purchased a piece of property in the industrial park.

1699
02:31:52,000 --> 02:32:02,000
I have some concerns about it. For one, the map isn't right, so I'd like the map to be updated for the industrial park, the map that showed the things.

1700
02:32:02,000 --> 02:32:09,000
So it's not right. There's river sound way goes through it now and it's not it's not indicated on that, so maybe that could be updated.

1701
02:32:09,000 --> 02:32:15,000
Napa Valley Commons is a name of that industrial park and Napa Valley Commons.

1702
02:32:15,000 --> 02:32:28,000
I think, I think, but I'm not sure about this, that there is a commercial hospitality or commercial tourism zoning designation on top of the industrial park.

1703
02:32:28,000 --> 02:32:34,000
So you might want to look at that because I don't think the industrial park CC and ours allow it.

1704
02:32:34,000 --> 02:32:41,000
So I think on the map that I saw, but I can't really tell because I'm not really sure of the colors.

1705
02:32:41,000 --> 02:32:52,000
But I think on the map that I saw the industrial park A has been painted like orange colored and that's actually supposed to be industrial park colored so that was another thing.

1706
02:32:52,000 --> 02:33:03,000
And one of my concerns about that is that a lot of the industrial park uses got eliminated or proposed to be eliminated that were acceptable before.

1707
02:33:03,000 --> 02:33:16,000
And I think this might be an issue because if we're trying, I know that most of the focus of this is on residential and design and things like that, but my dog and the fight is industrial park because that's where I have these property.

1708
02:33:16,000 --> 02:33:26,000
So I'm interested in trying to find out if those industrial uses that were there before in the industrial park could remain there and why they were taken out.

1709
02:33:26,000 --> 02:33:30,000
So I don't know why the uses that were allowed before were taken out.

1710
02:33:30,000 --> 02:33:45,000
A lot of them seem to have been grouped into flex industrial and I'm not really sure, but I think from my experience whenever you sit in industrial use next to residential or mix with the residential you're going to get a lot of complaints.

1711
02:33:45,000 --> 02:33:54,000
Because somebody who's a little glass blower and has a little glass blowing furnace or has a kiln or something like that is trying to be an artisan and they got their little.

1712
02:33:54,000 --> 02:34:00,000
Thousands degree kilns sitting in their backyard in the neighborhood doesn't like it because they're trying to live there.

1713
02:34:00,000 --> 02:34:04,000
I think that's a possible mix that might cause problems down the road.

1714
02:34:04,000 --> 02:34:11,000
The industrial park doesn't have any added residential uses in this draft that I see.

1715
02:34:11,000 --> 02:34:20,000
I would say that maybe some of those smaller arson things should be included in the industrial park, which doesn't have that kind of issue.

1716
02:34:20,000 --> 02:34:27,000
Another thing that consider I'm pushing my pushing my agenda here, but another thing to consider is that a lot of the uses that were.

1717
02:34:27,000 --> 02:34:33,000
Now that this proposed draft allows in the industrial park our uses.

1718
02:34:33,000 --> 02:34:37,000
That this draft this allows our uses that are allowed in the county.

1719
02:34:37,000 --> 02:34:42,000
So what's happening is you're taking stuff that the county can the county will take the businesses.

1720
02:34:42,000 --> 02:34:46,000
The county will take those business uses.

1721
02:34:46,000 --> 02:34:47,000
Okay.

1722
02:34:47,000 --> 02:34:49,000
You can finish your sentence.

1723
02:34:49,000 --> 02:34:56,000
The county will take the business uses and that's revenue for the city because the county allows those uses right outside.

1724
02:34:56,000 --> 02:34:59,000
You know where airport the airport business park is.

1725
02:34:59,000 --> 02:35:03,000
They will allow those uses and this draft this allows them within the city.

1726
02:35:03,000 --> 02:35:07,000
So I think that that might be a conflict there. So I kind of like.

1727
02:35:07,000 --> 02:35:10,000
Those perhaps consider a review of what's the wording.

1728
02:35:10,000 --> 02:35:15,000
Perhaps the review of the draft uses land uses in the industrial park.

1729
02:35:15,000 --> 02:35:16,000
Thank you.

1730
02:35:16,000 --> 02:35:17,000
Thank you.

1731
02:35:19,000 --> 02:35:22,000
Is that all of the public comments for tonight?

1732
02:35:22,000 --> 02:35:32,000
I just want to make sure it be Joseph Keibler and Bruce Spock.

1733
02:35:32,000 --> 02:35:39,000
Writer shall I get a motion to close public comments since we did have a public comment.

1734
02:35:39,000 --> 02:35:40,000
Yeah.

1735
02:35:40,000 --> 02:35:41,000
It's safe to.

1736
02:35:41,000 --> 02:35:43,000
Okay. Okay. Get a motion to close public comment.

1737
02:35:43,000 --> 02:35:45,000
Motion to close public comment.

1738
02:35:45,000 --> 02:35:47,000
Second. All in favor.

1739
02:35:47,000 --> 02:35:48,000
I. Thank you.

1740
02:35:53,000 --> 02:35:55,000
Well, that was very interesting.

1741
02:35:55,000 --> 02:35:58,000
Great to hear from you guys.

1742
02:35:58,000 --> 02:36:04,000
I didn't realize we are the reason that gas stations are still in there.

1743
02:36:04,000 --> 02:36:06,000
I won't be able to sleep tonight.

1744
02:36:06,000 --> 02:36:07,000
Honestly.

1745
02:36:07,000 --> 02:36:08,000
I'm fine.

1746
02:36:08,000 --> 02:36:12,000
Not being the reason that they are in there.

1747
02:36:12,000 --> 02:36:13,000
I.

1748
02:36:13,000 --> 02:36:19,000
Sir, let's talk about fossil fuel stations for a second.

1749
02:36:19,000 --> 02:36:22,000
Public comment was actually excellent in that.

1750
02:36:22,000 --> 02:36:23,000
And I.

1751
02:36:23,000 --> 02:36:27,000
And I feel a little remiss to about missing the fact that when we talked about the last time.

1752
02:36:27,000 --> 02:36:30,000
We didn't really make a clarification in that.

1753
02:36:30,000 --> 02:36:32,000
So I would.

1754
02:36:32,000 --> 02:36:34,000
Be very happy to.

1755
02:36:34,000 --> 02:36:40,000
Include a moratorium on new fossil fuel stations and new expanded stations.

1756
02:36:40,000 --> 02:36:44,000
Or expanded stations.

1757
02:36:44,000 --> 02:36:46,000
And put that moratorium back.

1758
02:36:46,000 --> 02:36:47,000
It's a moratorium back.

1759
02:36:47,000 --> 02:36:49,000
It's a moratorium is temporary.

1760
02:36:49,000 --> 02:36:50,000
Right.

1761
02:36:50,000 --> 02:36:51,000
That's okay.

1762
02:36:51,000 --> 02:36:52,000
That's important to us tonight.

1763
02:36:52,000 --> 02:36:54,000
Abolish.

1764
02:36:54,000 --> 02:36:55,000
Yeah.

1765
02:36:55,000 --> 02:36:56,000
So a ban.

1766
02:36:56,000 --> 02:36:58,000
That's what I mean.

1767
02:36:58,000 --> 02:36:59,000
I mean.

1768
02:36:59,000 --> 02:37:01,000
Let's. Let's ban it.

1769
02:37:01,000 --> 02:37:02,000
That would be.

1770
02:37:02,000 --> 02:37:04,000
The.

1771
02:37:04,000 --> 02:37:13,000
But we can say the planning commission would recommend that.

1772
02:37:13,000 --> 02:37:14,000
Along that line.

1773
02:37:15,000 --> 02:37:16,000
I.

1774
02:37:16,000 --> 02:37:17,000
At the last meeting.

1775
02:37:17,000 --> 02:37:18,000
We talked about this.

1776
02:37:18,000 --> 02:37:21,000
I'm in strong support of similarly banning drive through.

1777
02:37:21,000 --> 02:37:22,000
Where are thoughts on that?

1778
02:37:22,000 --> 02:37:23,000
Yeah.

1779
02:37:23,000 --> 02:37:24,000
Replay.

1780
02:37:24,000 --> 02:37:25,000
Yeah.

1781
02:37:25,000 --> 02:37:26,000
You have to replace.

1782
02:37:26,000 --> 02:37:27,000
Or do we not.

1783
02:37:27,000 --> 02:37:28,000
We discuss that.

1784
02:37:28,000 --> 02:37:31,000
There are some drive throughs like pharmacies have drive.

1785
02:37:31,000 --> 02:37:32,000
Remember we.

1786
02:37:32,000 --> 02:37:33,000
It goes.

1787
02:37:33,000 --> 02:37:35,000
You have to really consider.

1788
02:37:35,000 --> 02:37:38,000
What drive throughs we would want to ban.

1789
02:37:38,000 --> 02:37:40,000
To clarify the code does break them out.

1790
02:37:40,000 --> 02:37:42,000
So it does have retail drive through.

1791
02:37:42,000 --> 02:37:46,000
I would be speaking specifically about the restaurant category of drive through.

1792
02:37:46,000 --> 02:37:47,000
So like a pharmacy.

1793
02:37:47,000 --> 02:37:50,000
Or something of that nature would still be okay.

1794
02:37:50,000 --> 02:37:51,000
Right.

1795
02:37:51,000 --> 02:37:53,000
Just talking about the restaurant use.

1796
02:37:53,000 --> 02:37:55,000
So restaurants coffee shops.

1797
02:37:55,000 --> 02:37:57,000
Look at the Dutch bros.

1798
02:37:57,000 --> 02:37:58,000
Yeah.

1799
02:37:58,000 --> 02:37:59,000
Everything that falls under that.

1800
02:37:59,000 --> 02:38:00,000
It's service.

1801
02:38:00,000 --> 02:38:01,000
It's service.

1802
02:38:01,000 --> 02:38:02,000
It's in batch.

1803
02:38:02,000 --> 02:38:03,000
Whatever.

1804
02:38:03,000 --> 02:38:04,000
Yeah.

1805
02:38:04,000 --> 02:38:05,000
Food and beverage.

1806
02:38:05,000 --> 02:38:06,000
Okay.

1807
02:38:06,000 --> 02:38:08,000
I mean, I think that's part of the problem with Americans.

1808
02:38:08,000 --> 02:38:11,000
People just don't want to get out of their car wash.

1809
02:38:11,000 --> 02:38:12,000
Okay.

1810
02:38:12,000 --> 02:38:14,000
Let's talk about that for a second.

1811
02:38:14,000 --> 02:38:15,000
So yeah.

1812
02:38:15,000 --> 02:38:17,000
Anything that we talk about stackable.

1813
02:38:17,000 --> 02:38:19,000
Car stacking.

1814
02:38:19,000 --> 02:38:20,000
Right.

1815
02:38:20,000 --> 02:38:21,000
I think we.

1816
02:38:21,000 --> 02:38:22,000
I remember back.

1817
02:38:22,000 --> 02:38:23,000
And.

1818
02:38:23,000 --> 02:38:24,000
And.

1819
02:38:24,000 --> 02:38:25,000
So we were talking about.

1820
02:38:25,000 --> 02:38:28,000
How do we avoid the car stacking or the emissions.

1821
02:38:28,000 --> 02:38:30,000
And I think we have.

1822
02:38:30,000 --> 02:38:32,000
I do think we have enough.

1823
02:38:32,000 --> 02:38:34,000
Car washes in town.

1824
02:38:34,000 --> 02:38:35,000
Already.

1825
02:38:35,000 --> 02:38:38,000
And what's going to stand is that if a car wash is there.

1826
02:38:38,000 --> 02:38:39,000
It's used as there.

1827
02:38:39,000 --> 02:38:42,000
Then it's permanent until they stop operating for.

1828
02:38:42,000 --> 02:38:43,000
What a year.

1829
02:38:43,000 --> 02:38:45,000
Is that what we said earlier.

1830
02:38:45,000 --> 02:38:46,000
Right.

1831
02:38:46,000 --> 02:38:47,000
He said that earlier.

1832
02:38:47,000 --> 02:38:51,000
But I didn't know if it applies to everything.

1833
02:38:51,000 --> 02:38:53,000
If if a business stops operating.

1834
02:38:53,000 --> 02:38:55,000
If a car wash stops operating.

1835
02:38:55,000 --> 02:38:56,000
For a year.

1836
02:38:56,000 --> 02:38:59,000
There's no new owner thing coming there and buy it.

1837
02:38:59,000 --> 02:39:01,000
You're in a half later and started.

1838
02:39:01,000 --> 02:39:03,000
So it technically depends.

1839
02:39:03,000 --> 02:39:05,000
And Dan should still be online.

1840
02:39:05,000 --> 02:39:07,000
But technically depends on how that.

1841
02:39:07,000 --> 02:39:10,000
That that use was authorized.

1842
02:39:10,000 --> 02:39:11,000
Okay.

1843
02:39:11,000 --> 02:39:15,000
Use permits generally if they vest those rights.

1844
02:39:15,000 --> 02:39:18,000
There's usually a formal action needed to revoke it.

1845
02:39:18,000 --> 02:39:22,000
So there's there's the section for legal non-conforming uses otherwise.

1846
02:39:22,000 --> 02:39:29,000
And if they act upon those rights not granted under use permit, but like generally allowed.

1847
02:39:29,000 --> 02:39:32,000
That.

1848
02:39:32,000 --> 02:39:33,000
Absence of that.

1849
02:39:33,000 --> 02:39:38,000
And if the zone district does not allow for that use to continue.

1850
02:39:38,000 --> 02:39:44,000
They cannot continue it unless through like a non-conforming use permit.

1851
02:39:44,000 --> 02:39:45,000
Okay.

1852
02:39:45,000 --> 02:39:46,000
So.

1853
02:39:46,000 --> 02:39:48,000
So there's nuance to that.

1854
02:39:48,000 --> 02:39:50,000
There's not a straight answer.

1855
02:39:50,000 --> 02:39:51,000
Unfortunately.

1856
02:39:51,000 --> 02:39:54,000
Because there are the vested rights.

1857
02:39:54,000 --> 02:39:57,000
And technically it's like like the use permit example is.

1858
02:39:57,000 --> 02:40:01,000
You need a formal action to revoke it unless.

1859
02:40:01,000 --> 02:40:05,000
It was prescriptive of a certain sunset date.

1860
02:40:05,000 --> 02:40:06,000
Okay.

1861
02:40:06,000 --> 02:40:11,000
So but basically what we're talking about right now is not allowing any new.

1862
02:40:11,000 --> 02:40:14,000
Drives through.

1863
02:40:14,000 --> 02:40:20,000
So is the direction to not allow new to not.

1864
02:40:20,000 --> 02:40:23,000
I'd like to hear from the other commissioners.

1865
02:40:23,000 --> 02:40:25,000
Expansion.

1866
02:40:25,000 --> 02:40:29,000
I would say new and more expansion of existing.

1867
02:40:30,000 --> 02:40:31,000
Yeah.

1868
02:40:31,000 --> 02:40:32,000
Yeah.

1869
02:40:32,000 --> 02:40:33,000
New A and expansion.

1870
02:40:33,000 --> 02:40:34,000
Exactly.

1871
02:40:34,000 --> 02:40:40,000
That's what was also provided to us from the MIT student.

1872
02:40:40,000 --> 02:40:43,000
New experience.

1873
02:40:43,000 --> 02:40:44,000
Yeah.

1874
02:40:44,000 --> 02:40:47,000
I mean, we are happy to take that direction.

1875
02:40:47,000 --> 02:40:52,000
And I think the most straightforward to do that would be to just prohibit it in the districts.

1876
02:40:52,000 --> 02:40:56,000
And which case rather than allowing it with any sort of conditions.

1877
02:40:56,000 --> 02:41:00,000
That that would open up as writers noting the.

1878
02:41:00,000 --> 02:41:03,000
The applicability and the duration of that use permit.

1879
02:41:03,000 --> 02:41:07,000
And perpetuity but if it's simply not allowed.

1880
02:41:07,000 --> 02:41:12,000
It would be allowed any any existing use it would offer under its existing use permit.

1881
02:41:12,000 --> 02:41:17,000
It would operate under its existing allowances until at one point it becomes obsolete.

1882
02:41:17,000 --> 02:41:19,000
And then business were to close.

1883
02:41:19,000 --> 02:41:22,000
In which case commissioner it would then fall under.

1884
02:41:22,000 --> 02:41:26,000
The non conforming provisions at which point yes after a certain period of time.

1885
02:41:26,000 --> 02:41:32,000
You've you've known not you've lost your ability to be illegal non conforming use and you wouldn't be able to resume that up.

1886
02:41:32,000 --> 02:41:36,000
You know temporary temporary short term you know ceases of operation.

1887
02:41:36,000 --> 02:41:41,000
You can usually continue and pick those back up but after a certain period of time.

1888
02:41:41,000 --> 02:41:42,000
They would be gone.

1889
02:41:42,000 --> 02:41:48,000
So and that would be any existing and then the expansion of those would also fall under that prohibition.

1890
02:41:48,000 --> 02:41:53,000
Because if it's a prohibited use you can't enlarge your non conforming use.

1891
02:41:53,000 --> 02:42:00,000
So you don't even you would be able to remain more silent on that because if it's not allowed you can expand and use a silent.

1892
02:42:00,000 --> 02:42:06,000
Could they could the business owner or building owner who let's say has the.

1893
02:42:06,000 --> 02:42:13,000
Current drives through and they aren't expanding the footprint but they need to remodel it they can still do that correct.

1894
02:42:13,000 --> 02:42:18,000
We we we we would need to look at your non conforming and maybe writer and really could speak to that.

1895
02:42:18,000 --> 02:42:26,000
But typically there's some ongoing maintenance that's allowed so you don't fall into complete disrepair during that operation of that non conforming.

1896
02:42:26,000 --> 02:42:35,000
Usually it's the argument of expansion of or intensification of that use of generally a remodel in itself that does not expand that area is not that.

1897
02:42:35,000 --> 02:42:41,000
And if they're continuing that use effectively you can come in for remodel it won't.

1898
02:42:41,000 --> 02:42:55,000
But argument of like intensification is generally tied to the the floor area or the usable area so and some other uses it could also be outdoor area if it's like active.

1899
02:42:55,000 --> 02:43:04,000
But the maintenance you should be able to maintain the exterior make minor facade and you know improvements that don't expand the those graphics.

1900
02:43:05,000 --> 02:43:15,000
I guess an example that is where there have been other tenants that have come in generally that extends to like signage as well.

1901
02:43:15,000 --> 02:43:27,000
But looking at the the current configuration of the site most of the time in the way it's been applied generally is that that configuration remains the same even if inefficient.

1902
02:43:27,000 --> 02:43:30,000
You know that's interesting because.

1903
02:43:30,000 --> 02:43:49,000
The reason I met my husband was in 2010 or around that time period maybe it was yeah 2010 McDonald's was up for improving their facility on Jefferson Street to what we have now and they had the most ridiculous.

1904
02:43:50,000 --> 02:43:56,000
Stacking for cars at that place and so I think it's kind of funny that.

1905
02:43:56,000 --> 02:44:01,000
One of the reasons I got together with Bob was over a drive through.

1906
02:44:01,000 --> 02:44:04,000
You would be very proud.

1907
02:44:04,000 --> 02:44:15,000
Can I just clarify the ban on new and expansion we said food service we said car wash I think we want to carve out for pharmacy.

1908
02:44:15,000 --> 02:44:21,000
I'm just thinking like we have a drive through dry cleaner and take other services so I just.

1909
02:44:21,000 --> 02:44:30,000
Or we look services are okay or just pharmacies are okay and everything else I just and who knows what else someone will try to make into a drive through and day so.

1910
02:44:30,000 --> 02:44:35,000
What other land use is specifically have in the use chart.

1911
02:44:35,000 --> 02:44:37,000
A section for.

1912
02:44:37,000 --> 02:44:44,000
So there are three types of drive through currently.

1913
02:44:44,000 --> 02:44:46,000
Currently proposed in the code.

1914
02:44:46,000 --> 02:44:50,000
So it's retail with drive through facility.

1915
02:44:50,000 --> 02:44:51,000
So that's.

1916
02:44:51,000 --> 02:44:59,000
Pharmacy relatively broad yeah so so that would include pharmacies as as currently as proposed to be defined.

1917
02:44:59,000 --> 02:45:00,000
Then there's.

1918
02:45:00,000 --> 02:45:12,000
Restorant with Drive3, which is the fast food, and then bank or credit union with Drive3. So right now, as proposed, there are the three types of retail restaurant and bank or credit union.

1919
02:45:12,000 --> 02:45:26,000
So my interpretation of that, then would be that, like, a personal service drive through would currently going forward, be able to go along to work and use, right? Unless we'd just say fair food.

1920
02:45:26,000 --> 02:45:34,000
Well, like, as it's even written now that personal services are not permitted to have drive throughs under this new version, what's the definition of retail?

1921
02:45:34,000 --> 02:45:51,000
Yes, so the definition of retail with the drive through facility is on page 17B34, and it's a general retail use with the motor vehicle drive through, which is designed and are used to provide purchase items including prescriptions.

1922
02:45:51,000 --> 02:46:01,000
But I think the question here is, right, if drive cleaners would fall under retail or if that's under service, in which case that might be.

1923
02:46:01,000 --> 02:46:09,000
I don't, I don't think under the broad definition of retail, it includes those personal services, like a drive cleaner.

1924
02:46:09,000 --> 02:46:11,000
In my mind, it would already be not comfortable.

1925
02:46:11,000 --> 02:46:21,000
It would be not for me, but it's correct for you if I'm, it's different, but I will pay with not allowing new drive through drive clears.

1926
02:46:21,000 --> 02:46:23,000
I agree completely.

1927
02:46:23,000 --> 02:46:28,000
I was thinking about driving, I would, I would love to ban future drive cleaners.

1928
02:46:28,000 --> 02:46:33,000
But that's because again, I think that they're toxic.

1929
02:46:33,000 --> 02:46:38,000
The other thing that I just, that just occurred to me when we're thinking about this is that now with so many,

1930
02:46:38,000 --> 02:46:45,000
so many stores and whether they're retail establishments, cafes, what have you.

1931
02:46:45,000 --> 02:46:53,000
You have the option to order online and then have the curbside pick up and people literally come to your car.

1932
02:46:53,000 --> 02:47:00,000
So I think because we're replacing drive throughs with that type of convenience and it's human interaction.

1933
02:47:00,000 --> 02:47:02,000
Someone's literally greeting you.

1934
02:47:02,000 --> 02:47:13,000
If you can't get out of your car, if you've got four kids, you know, just got finished with soccer, you still can stay in the car and get your groceries and things of that sort.

1935
02:47:13,000 --> 02:47:20,000
So I think that that hopefully this will help encourage people to just, you know,

1936
02:47:20,000 --> 02:47:30,000
socialize more too because drive through you're just like waiting and you're dealing with an inner calm and there's not a lot of human reaction.

1937
02:47:31,000 --> 02:47:38,000
I agree. I actually, I think one of the public speakers used this term, mode shift goals.

1938
02:47:38,000 --> 02:47:56,000
And I think that's really where we're moving towards this where, you know, I think about my mom is 83 and she now orders her groceries and she drives and she parks in one of the stalls and the person comes out and they'll even deliver her pharmacy to her.

1939
02:47:56,000 --> 02:48:11,000
And then there's also delivery service too. So I think we're just shifting the way that we use retail now in actually much more much better more sustainable way.

1940
02:48:11,000 --> 02:48:24,000
Yes, and it's more one stop shopping as well. So you can pick up your food and your medicine and a t-shirt or pajamas at the same time.

1941
02:48:25,000 --> 02:48:45,000
And I would note to the commission that from similar conversations that we had with the commission previously the code does include some provisions for encouraging those types of pickup spaces to think about how parking has shifted because there are more of those types of uses.

1942
02:48:45,000 --> 02:49:01,000
The parking part of the draft code does talk about those reserved and dedicated spaces for just online order pickup because of your direction previously something he for that.

1943
02:49:01,000 --> 02:49:04,000
Do you need anything else from us on this topic?

1944
02:49:05,000 --> 02:49:15,000
Can we clarify fossil fuel stations if that's also within the commission's recommendation or maybe you're moving there right or I think we maybe close the book on the drive through.

1945
02:49:16,000 --> 02:49:35,000
Yes, I had heard that you wanted a ban for new or expanded facilities generally so that that would assume the same provisions apply and so for the existing fossil fuel stations generally that equipment has a limited lifespan.

1946
02:49:35,000 --> 02:49:41,000
So you have to see every so often tanks being replaced.

1947
02:49:41,000 --> 02:49:48,000
And then generally the safety limit of the valves and then the pumps generally.

1948
02:49:48,000 --> 02:50:04,000
Well, I think that I think that right, I think that applies actually for both uses right so for fossil fuel you want to make sure that you are able to keep those fossil fuel that we do have who do want to stay in business and as I go through

1949
02:50:04,000 --> 02:50:12,000
I'm not expanding their tank but they got to fix it right or maybe and I think at some point they may have to expand their tank.

1950
02:50:12,000 --> 02:50:17,000
So in generally the the size of the tank.

1951
02:50:17,000 --> 02:50:20,000
Not that it doesn't matter as much as the number of.

1952
02:50:20,000 --> 02:50:28,000
So generally the way it's been enforced is the number of existing pumps okay and if it's being replaced.

1953
02:50:28,000 --> 02:50:32,000
Matching the same number okay okay and then the types of fuel.

1954
02:50:34,000 --> 02:50:39,000
Sometimes the equipment does drastically change.

1955
02:50:39,000 --> 02:50:44,000
Most of the time it's in in in a very efficient footprint.

1956
02:50:44,000 --> 02:50:49,000
But I'm not that expert on fossil fuel stations generally and the equipment used.

1957
02:50:49,000 --> 02:50:56,000
So there's wiggle room there and the equipment itself may fluctuate in size if.

1958
02:50:56,000 --> 02:51:02,000
It needs to be replaced but generally the way it's enforces number of pumps.

1959
02:51:02,000 --> 02:51:08,000
So how would we deal just trying to future think.

1960
02:51:08,000 --> 02:51:13,000
How would we deal with this type of thing if.

1961
02:51:13,000 --> 02:51:18,000
Pumps decreased and electrical.

1962
02:51:18,000 --> 02:51:23,000
Charging increased and that caused an expansion of the fossil fuel station.

1963
02:51:23,000 --> 02:51:25,000
Well not fossil fuel.

1964
02:51:25,000 --> 02:51:27,000
That's a good deal.

1965
02:51:27,000 --> 02:51:29,000
Generally EVs are different topic.

1966
02:51:29,000 --> 02:51:30,000
Right.

1967
02:51:30,000 --> 02:51:35,000
Type maybe a topic for another point in time and obviously there are considerations.

1968
02:51:35,000 --> 02:51:38,000
Industry wide of like hydrogen and.

1969
02:51:38,000 --> 02:51:40,000
Yeah so that's what I mean is like what how.

1970
02:51:40,000 --> 02:51:44,000
Did we then look at this zoning again in the future when that happens?

1971
02:51:44,000 --> 02:51:47,000
You can replace like I think it's a fossil fuel.

1972
02:51:47,000 --> 02:51:50,000
Tank pumps the packs number of pumps so if you remove.

1973
02:51:50,000 --> 02:51:54,000
If you have 10 fossil fuel pumps and you remove to replace them with electric.

1974
02:51:54,000 --> 02:51:57,000
You can never put those to back is what I'm hearing.

1975
02:51:57,000 --> 02:51:58,000
That's what I meant.

1976
02:51:58,000 --> 02:52:02,000
But you can replace them with something different.

1977
02:52:02,000 --> 02:52:04,000
Like bio diesel.

1978
02:52:04,000 --> 02:52:05,000
You could add five.

1979
02:52:05,000 --> 02:52:06,000
Yes.

1980
02:52:06,000 --> 02:52:07,000
Yeah.

1981
02:52:07,000 --> 02:52:08,000
Okay.

1982
02:52:08,000 --> 02:52:10,000
So we're specifically talking about fossil fuel.

1983
02:52:10,000 --> 02:52:11,000
Okay.

1984
02:52:11,000 --> 02:52:12,000
Perfect.

1985
02:52:12,000 --> 02:52:15,000
My gallon in the back.

1986
02:52:15,000 --> 02:52:16,000
Yeah.

1987
02:52:16,000 --> 02:52:17,000
Okay.

1988
02:52:17,000 --> 02:52:18,000
I think yeah.

1989
02:52:18,000 --> 02:52:19,000
No new.

1990
02:52:19,000 --> 02:52:20,000
Car washes.

1991
02:52:20,000 --> 02:52:21,000
Okay.

1992
02:52:21,000 --> 02:52:30,000
Does any commissioners have any other further comments?

1993
02:52:30,000 --> 02:52:33,000
I do have one more comment.

1994
02:52:33,000 --> 02:52:35,000
Sorry.

1995
02:52:35,000 --> 02:52:38,000
The hospitality commercial land use.

1996
02:52:38,000 --> 02:52:42,000
Did the name change for that on the map?

1997
02:52:42,000 --> 02:52:46,000
Yes.

1998
02:52:46,000 --> 02:52:47,000
Yes.

1999
02:52:47,000 --> 02:52:50,000
So I went from tourist commercial to hospitality commercial.

2000
02:52:50,000 --> 02:52:51,000
Thank you.

2001
02:52:51,000 --> 02:52:53,000
Which actually matches the designation.

2002
02:52:53,000 --> 02:52:54,000
I believe.

2003
02:52:54,000 --> 02:52:55,000
Yeah.

2004
02:52:55,000 --> 02:52:57,000
The only question I have.

2005
02:52:57,000 --> 02:52:59,000
Oh, did you have anything else commissioner?

2006
02:52:59,000 --> 02:53:05,000
Well, the public comments from this evening.

2007
02:53:05,000 --> 02:53:07,000
Because it was in the workshop.

2008
02:53:07,000 --> 02:53:08,000
I got to ask the question.

2009
02:53:08,000 --> 02:53:10,000
I recognize the address 90% of them.

2010
02:53:10,000 --> 02:53:13,000
And if people left them, I know that you would follow up.

2011
02:53:13,000 --> 02:53:20,000
So how will you respond to the members of the public who spoke tonight, who are no longer here?

2012
02:53:20,000 --> 02:53:26,000
How will they know that their comments were taken into account and addressed?

2013
02:53:26,000 --> 02:53:27,000
Yes.

2014
02:53:27,000 --> 02:53:29,000
So I'll refer to staff on that one.

2015
02:53:29,000 --> 02:53:32,000
So is the question about a comment that wasn't conveyed?

2016
02:53:32,000 --> 02:53:35,000
Well, industrial flecks versus.

2017
02:53:35,000 --> 02:53:36,600
But first is, we'll look into that.

2018
02:53:36,600 --> 02:53:40,000
And then that week, you'll get back to that week.

2019
02:53:40,000 --> 02:53:46,400
Topics that are conveyed will, so if they're emailing the zoning update at city

2020
02:53:46,400 --> 02:53:53,000
of Napa.org or otherwise conveying information to a body, and sometimes it's been planning

2021
02:53:53,000 --> 02:53:55,280
community city council.

2022
02:53:55,280 --> 02:54:00,680
Staff has generally been responding also to those individuals that have reached out, but

2023
02:54:00,680 --> 02:54:06,680
generally for the workshop, for comments received through the email, through the comments

2024
02:54:06,680 --> 02:54:07,680
received here tonight.

2025
02:54:07,680 --> 02:54:10,680
We're creating a log of comments received.

2026
02:54:10,680 --> 02:54:17,680
Now we'll, in future efforts, outline each individual comment, probably not, but we'll

2027
02:54:17,680 --> 02:54:21,680
probably combine and you'll do, I get it.

2028
02:54:21,680 --> 02:54:23,680
Yeah, dividing conquer a little bit.

2029
02:54:23,680 --> 02:54:25,680
Yes, that's what I was going to say.

2030
02:54:25,680 --> 02:54:26,680
Awesome.

2031
02:54:26,680 --> 02:54:27,680
Okay.

2032
02:54:27,680 --> 02:54:28,680
Thank you.

2033
02:54:28,680 --> 02:54:31,680
I'm going to go to the next slide of things to our next deliverable as any rota.

2034
02:54:31,680 --> 02:54:37,680
So similar to the list that staff's putting together of comments received from various

2035
02:54:37,680 --> 02:54:38,680
members of the public.

2036
02:54:38,680 --> 02:54:48,680
We'll take by any commissions direction here tonight and identify edits future edits to the draft in any rota

2037
02:54:48,680 --> 02:54:49,680
sheet.

2038
02:54:49,680 --> 02:54:50,680
So it'll be a separate document.

2039
02:54:50,680 --> 02:54:52,680
It won't be a revised code.

2040
02:54:52,680 --> 02:54:55,680
That'll come before you next time for public hearings.

2041
02:54:55,680 --> 02:55:01,680
It'll be in a rota document that clearly identifies proposed edits to the code.

2042
02:55:01,680 --> 02:55:02,680
As a next step.

2043
02:55:02,680 --> 02:55:03,680
Okay.

2044
02:55:03,680 --> 02:55:07,680
Commissioner Missara, did you have anything else to add?

2045
02:55:07,680 --> 02:55:08,680
No.

2046
02:55:08,680 --> 02:55:12,680
Well, a big thank you to staff and the consultants at Lisa Wise.

2047
02:55:12,680 --> 02:55:16,680
This was quite the undertaking in the last two years in a big heavy lift.

2048
02:55:16,680 --> 02:55:18,680
So we thank you for all of your hard work.

2049
02:55:18,680 --> 02:55:21,680
And thanks to staff for printing these for us.

2050
02:55:21,680 --> 02:55:23,680
It will hold something down at my house in the future.

2051
02:55:23,680 --> 02:55:25,680
I'm not sure what yet.

2052
02:55:25,680 --> 02:55:30,680
But and thank you for being open and transparent with the public throughout this process.

2053
02:55:30,680 --> 02:55:34,680
It has been a very thoughtful and transparent process to work with you guys.

2054
02:55:34,680 --> 02:55:35,680
Also, thank you.

2055
02:55:35,680 --> 02:55:37,680
No formal action is required.

2056
02:55:37,680 --> 02:55:40,680
So that is that.

2057
02:55:40,680 --> 02:55:48,680
I guess we we end with any other comments for competitors or staff after the last three hours.

2058
02:55:48,680 --> 02:55:50,680
None.

2059
02:55:51,680 --> 02:55:55,680
We do have an associate planner starting on Monday.

2060
02:55:55,680 --> 02:56:02,680
So the way the the forecast is tracking we won't have a planning commission hearing.

2061
02:56:02,680 --> 02:56:08,680
And maybe that's maybe that's a relief to some or you're looking forward to a planning commission hearing beginning of August.

2062
02:56:08,680 --> 02:56:12,680
So we're tracking for the second hearing in August.

2063
02:56:12,680 --> 02:56:17,680
So we'll look to introduce you to her as she comes on board.

2064
02:56:17,680 --> 02:56:28,680
So excited about that again appreciative of of the public for tonight and through the process appreciative of each and every one of the staff members that is contributed to that document.

2065
02:56:28,680 --> 02:56:30,680
It's taken a lot of time.

2066
02:56:30,680 --> 02:56:37,680
All the planners have had input multiple divisions department of that input multiple meetings with the consultants.

2067
02:56:37,680 --> 02:56:42,680
Just to reiterate public comment period ends on the 24th.

2068
02:56:42,680 --> 02:56:51,680
Not to say that that is the ending of public comment generally because we will have hearings hearings generally.

2069
02:56:51,680 --> 02:57:02,680
But it does put certain significance into the comments conveyed of the public draft gives staff and our consultant direction to where that that dropped is generally headed.

2070
02:57:02,680 --> 02:57:05,680
So appreciative of the time and attention there.

2071
02:57:05,680 --> 02:57:06,680
Thank you.

2072
02:57:06,680 --> 02:57:16,680
All right and with that the next regularly scheduled meeting of the planning commission of the city of Napa is on August 20th, 2026 meeting is adjourned.