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was like
>> in the day

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» 1968
>> and I came home

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but not

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» it's hard but it's doable like I've been
working

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avoid
>> not a bad thing but it was a lot of

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money
And the great thing about the way um

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trade does it is they definitely don't
put any scores up.

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» There are no scores.
>> So you can navigate through

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counselors,

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» it's time.
Well, I'm just waiting for two of them

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to come and sit down.

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Okay, welcome everybody. Welcome the
people in the gallery and welcome to the

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regular meeting of Tuesday, July the
7th. I'd like to call the meeting to

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order and uh sorry for the couple
minutes we had to get uh caught up on

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world world cup for a few minutes. So
we're two minutes late

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» um starting. We would like to
acknowledge the land on which we gather

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is a traditional territory of the Taha,
the Silks and the Snyags people and is

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home to the Matei and many diverse
Aboriginal persons. We honor their

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00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:52,880
connection to the land and rivers and
respect the importance of the

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environment to our strength as a
community. I have one late item here for

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um introduction and that is regarding um
development

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cost
>> cost charges. So we see here it is

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connection fees and development cost
charges. um the RFP has been circulated

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to all of you and if um if it's that's
acceptable then um kind of a mover to

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accept the late item move by councelor
Paige seconded by councelor Woodward all

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those in favor and that carries so that
will be discussed at the end of the

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evening and so then could I have an
adoption of the agenda as amended

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moved by councelor Tate second by
councelor Lockenberg all those in favor

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00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:43,200
and that carries if we could have an
adoption of minutes of the previous

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meeting of June the 9th. Is there a move
or moved by councelor Payne? Seconded by

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councelor Woodward. Any errors or
omissions? Councelor Payne.

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» No.
>> Oh, I was ready.

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» You were already jumping on to the next
one.

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» Jumping on.
>> I've never seen hands up so fast in this

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room. This is
>> it happened today.

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» This is great. Okay. So, all those in
favor of the meetings then and thank

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you. Item number six, requests. So, we
have some requests of some proposed

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resolutions to go forward to the
Federation of Canadian uh municipalities

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to make sure that they get it on their
docket for their upcoming meeting in

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July. So, council's being asked to
consider endorsing two resolutions for

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it for a submission to the um FCM,
Federation of Canadian Municipalities

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00:14:26,399 --> 00:14:32,000
before the July 13th submission
deadline. The proposed resolutions

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00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:36,639
request that FCM undertake research and
development recommendations on federal

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policy matters related to one innovative
financial twos and speculative

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00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:45,680
residential estate real estate
investment and two systemic algorithmic

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00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:48,720
risks associated with online platforms.
Endorsement by council would authorize

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00:14:47,120 --> 00:14:54,000
the city to submit the resolutions for
consideration through FCM's national

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resolution process.
>> Moved by councelor Woodward.

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Seconded by councelor Paige
and um I think we can do both these

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together. Is everybody happy with that
if we do them together? Okay. Any need

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for any conversation counselors?

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Seeing none that's been moved and
second. All those in favor

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00:15:20,399 --> 00:15:27,920
and that carries. There we go. So, those
will be off and we'll be

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sure that councelor Paige will no doubt
be knowing letting them know that those

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are coming to make sure it gets on their
their docket for July or at the latest

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their September um meeting.
Thank you for your work on that

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counselor um page. So, item number
seven, building bylaw amendment. So, uh,

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staff are proposing amendments to the
city of Nelson building bylaw 3456 2019

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to adopt higher performance requirements
for part 9 buildings, generally low-rise

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residential and small buildings under
the BC energy step code and the BC zero

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carbon step code um, ZCSC.
Recommended phased approach for part 9

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is effective December 31st, 2026, energy
step code 4 and zerocarbon EL3,

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effective December 31st, 2028, zero
carbon EL4.

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Step four remains in place.
So the request is for council to give

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first three readings. bylaw amend um
building bylaw amendment energy step

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code 4 and zerocarbon EL3 bylaw 3654
2026 and building bylaw amendment

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zerocarbon EL4 step four remaining bylaw
number 3664

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2026
councilors there's been a we had a last

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last meeting was it just last meeting
two weeks ago

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» June 9th
>> June 9th so a month ago so we had a

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presentation regarding um step code uh
from the planning department and they're

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here if we need a summary of that or if
people feel that they want to move ahead

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with something else. I see councelor
Lock and

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are you moving something?
>> No, I can ask a question.

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» Yeah. So, um do we have any further um
questions or do we feel that we need a

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quick review or is everybody okay with
us questions?

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Uh just question I guess.
>> Okay. So we're gonna start with uh

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councelor logberg then we'll move to
councelor panero.

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» Um thank you mayor. So I guess my
question will give you the opportunity

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to go into a bit of detail for the
public to explain what these things are.

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So um I'm going to frame it this way. Um
why should we not go to EL4? So

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emissions level four given that 2030
it's mandatory and why are we going to

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EL3? So I'll I'm setting it up so you
can give the rationale.

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» Sure. When we first went out to talk to
the building community, that was kind of

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our idea to look at can the building
community support um just kind of

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holding it step four um because in just
a few short months probably in six

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months um I could expect that the uh BC
building code will change and that part

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buildings which are small simple or
simple buildings like single family are

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going to move to step four. So that will
be the provincial minimum. Um and we

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were considering going to a mission
level four when we went out to the

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building community and while they were
supportive, we did hear from that

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community that they didn't fully
understand it in some cases. So that is

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why we are recommending a staggered
approach to the um zero carbon. So we're

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going to do emission level three and
give folks a couple years to transition

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to a mission level four. I think that
gives industry time to prepare and

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transition and get more experience.
people can still always go beyond the

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minimums. That would just be the minimum
from the city. So that was kind of our

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thinking once we understood that not
every builder in the city had a full

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understanding of those requirements. We
went out to them.

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» And can I have a followup to his
question? So when when do you foresee so

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you see you see um the step code within
the next six months. When do you see

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EL4?
When is that going to be the build when

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will that do you foresee be a building
code requirement provinially?

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» Yeah. So I don't they don't they haven't
put out a timeline for when you would

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have to move along the zerocarbon step
code. Right now it's minimum is emission

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level one which is just reporting and
then we know by 2030 that is going to be

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the provincial standard which is
emission level four.

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» Okay. So, and I think it's up to
communities to decide how they want to

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get there. That's kind of my
interpretation.

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» Uh, councelor Panero, then councelor P.
So, I just got this email the other day

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and I think we all did from the chamber
and they brought up a bunch of points

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and basically I don't want to misquote
or anything but paraphrasing

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one of the points uh was that they feel
that moving this forward out of step

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with the provincial guidelines would
somehow put the building community under

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pressure and we wouldn't be able to
adapt and therefore we would for any

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sort of construction construction or
development, we would have to go outside

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of the community for those jobs. And
what I see in the report is that you

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have actually consulted with the
building community. And I'm wondering

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uh where the disconnect there is and and
if and if we have consulted with the

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building community which apparently we
have are you confident that that we have

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the capacity here to absorb any of those
changes and and move forward so that we

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are you know maximizing
uh productivity in our community and and

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people the opportunity to to work uh in
field and not have to bring people in.

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Is that something that having spoken to
those people that you're confident that

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we have that breadth of knowledge here?
>> Yeah. No, unfortunately I did not get

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that email from the chamber, but I am
happy to follow up with Tom and just get

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some more details on that after the
meeting. I do actually feel for part

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nine buildings, which is what the
amendments are for today, um the data is

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showing us that these that our builders
can achieve these quite easily. that is

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the minimum is step four in our
community. We've been kind of achieving

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it now for quite a few years. And um in
terms of emission level, I think it was

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12 out of 13 projects. Um we're hitting
emission level three or higher. So I do

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think that we have the skill set here
locally. Um I wonder if maybe they're

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referring to part three buildings, which
are the bigger, more complex buildings,

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and maybe they're not clear on the
amendments today. I think those ones

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would need special consideration and and
I can reach out to the chamber to see if

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maybe that's where the misunderstanding
is.

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» It's quite a long letter and there's a
few things but generally I I think I'm

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not exaggerating. I think most of them
are sort of like that like there things

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that are addressed. I just don't know to
what depth or to what you know level

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they're seem to be unhappy something but
not sure.

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seen them on that. It would be good to
know.

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00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:51,600
» It would be good to know. I you know
based on the engagement that we did with

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our local building community and we did
talk both about part three and about

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part 9. There wasn't hesitation in
either of those from our building

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community. But part three buildings are
a little bit different in that um the

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bigger buildings often have consultants
and builders from outside of Nelson um

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because we don't always have the
capacity. they don't always like because

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people bid on those projects from all
over the place. Uh but for part nine for

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single family duplex that sort of thing
I really do believe we have the capacity

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here in the city of Nelson. So
>> councelor Payne and then councelor.

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» So I just want to um say out loud what
I've heard and read in the report. So we

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have around 10 to 12 contractors who are
building at that level. um approximately

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10 to 15
homes per year and many already are

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meeting or exceeding
uh step four and I'm sure also EL4.

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So, I'm I'm really concerned that we're
holding that I know we're not holding

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that community back, but how do we
incentivize

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the other contractors to take advantage
of the education that's been widely

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available for free and free much of it
is free and widely available for um well

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for step code since 2017 when it was
introduced.

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because I I think there's significant
advantages in in going to EL4

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and I I personally find um would say
that that education piece of saying okay

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everybody we'd like to you to learn EL3
and then two years from now we'd like

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you to learn something do new to add on
to it wouldn't it just be less painful

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to just go to four learn what you need
for four and obvious Obviously three is

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going to be included in that. But I
don't think these are hugely

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significant. I'm not a builder. Did
build had a good experience inter okay

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not good experience. Let's just say
building your own house is not ever a

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good experience. If it is, tell me. Um
but yeah, I think we're and in addition

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to that, so are we serving our
contractor community by not setting the

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bar high, which is what we've always
done in a leadership role, especially

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around climate. And as we look around us
today, we see what James Hansen, the

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NASA scientist, called the storms of our
grandchildren. They're here now. So,

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we're doing a disservice to homeowners
building their homes if we're not going

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to the the highest possible level
because those homes

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will need to be standing and
withstanding

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climate that we don't really understand
right now. So, I strongly encourage us

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in addition to step four to go to um
EL4. the it's been I know it wasn't

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clearly demonstrated because there just
hasn't been enough data yet but I have

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been on a number of webinars through the
community energy association that talked

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about the the cost increases are not
significant

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but the investment now leads to a huge
payback over the life of those homes

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when we insulate and do all the other um
energy efficiency plus zerocarbon

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um
methods that we we can take advantage

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of. So that would be my recommendation.
I I don't know in any job that I've been

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at if they said we want you to learn
this new process here knowing that in

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two years you're going to be learning
something new like here's the accounting

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system. could you learn this one now and
then two years from now we're going to

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00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:07,679
give you more? Why don't we just go to
the new accounting system, figure that

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one out and keep going, especially if it
offers benefits greater than what we're

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working with now.

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00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:20,240
» Not a question. Sorry. I just wanted to
make sure that I had summarized what I

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what I had heard. Is there anything in
what I said that wasn't um included in

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in your report other than you know Gian
Hansen in terms of our grandchild?

195
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:37,200
» No, I think that does summarize
summarize the report. Um

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we just wanted to make sure that all the
builders were coming along. So that is

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why we recommended a gradual step. Um, I
think we have a really great building

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00:27:44,799 --> 00:27:51,840
community here and if we move to the
regulations up to EL4, I'm sure that

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00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:55,440
they could achieve it. But I did and
there is lots of opportunities for

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education and I think they're very
dialed on the building science aspect.

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Um, the zero carbon is really working
with your energy advisor on the

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mechanical systems and I don't know if
Mike wants to speak to that too, but

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it's just a different sort of investment
in your education. Um, and that's why we

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thought a staggered approach would even
be better for our community based on the

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engagement that we did. But of course,
council could go beyond that. Um, so,

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» but are we asking them to do that
education twice as a small business

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owner? Do I want to invest in my
employees to spend whatever number of

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hours it is now and then to do the whole
thing all over again? Because those

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hours are out of productivity when I do
that. um from a business perspective I

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would want them to get the highest level
of information. Now in

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» the step code and the zero carbon I
think are intentionally stepped so that

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you learn that um energy efficiency or
you learn that zerocarbon step and then

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you move on to the next and lots of
communities have jumped. They have

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skipped a bunch of steps and gone
forward but it really was designed so

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that people could get that experience
learn that system and then move on. it

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is intentionally designed that way but
many communities have skipped also. So I

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think both approaches um have worked in
other communities and could potentially

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work here. It was just our
recommendation based on our engagement.

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» Council Edward, I would um just to speak
to the chambers's letter and and build

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on what councelor P is saying that it's
important to separate the step code

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versus the zero carbon step code. I
think the chamber's letter was really

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about the step code, not the zero carbon
step code. Like when you I they do

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mention electrification at one point,
but then you can but it's kind of

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conflated with electrification in
general that it would require more

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infrastructure, that kind of thing. A
lot of houses and I think you even said

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this are built full electrified. That's
we do it all the time. So many houses

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are built probably every developer or
every contractor has built in effect for

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house. So they know how to do it. It's
not that complicated. The letter does

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speak to step code being more
complicated because you're talking about

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the building envelope and that kind of
thing for sure. I get that. And so in

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terms of the energy step code, I
definitely appreciate the stepped

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approach. With the zerocarbon step code,
it doesn't make as much sense. I think

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it does add complexity to counselor
Payne's point. Like for example, a mixed

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fuel heat pump is more complicated than
just a regular electric heat pump. Um,

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as a fully electric home, we have a heat
pump and we have baseboard heating too.

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We'd never use the baseboard heating
like the the heat pump is totally

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sufficient for creating a lowcost and
really effective um home heating

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solution. The one where I can imagine an
argument for not going directly to EL4,

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but it's it is a bit of a stretch. It's
more of a culture shift around maybe

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cooking like people like gas stoves for
cooking.

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But the I think the health impacts that
are now known, especially over the last

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year or two with indoor gas stoves, is
pretty significant. The amount of indoor

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pollution and the health impacts of that
those it's it's being phased out, I

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00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:30,159
think, pretty quickly. We just didn't
know before. It was nice to have that

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00:31:27,919 --> 00:31:36,159
quick instant heat. It's a nice cooking
environment. Totally. But nobody knew

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00:31:32,799 --> 00:31:42,799
about the health effects of indoor fuel
or indoor gas stoves. Now we do. So now

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induction stoves are are amazing
alternatives and are super efficient and

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instant heat too. So I understand the
chamber's point on the step code taking

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it a little bit more stepped on the
zerocarbon step code. I think I think it

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just makes sense to go to Y4. It's just
for everybody ease better for the

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contractors and just they got to get
there anyways.

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» Forward

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» ran out of electric

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again.
>> So, I just wanted to ask you both. Um,

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» it's okay. if council decided to go EL4
um

256
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other than maybe some worries that
you've mentioned about the ability for

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contractors to match the moment
um would there be do you do you think

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there could be some kind of like
situation where a developer might be

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00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:47,360
like you know what I'm not going to
develop this building Nelson because

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00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:52,080
they have EL4
or is that a a false

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00:32:52,240 --> 00:33:01,679
Um I would say that's a false worry. Um
yeah, it's important to note uh earlier

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that you can still meet EL4 with gas
cooking. You can still meet EL4 with

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dual fuel gas systems. So it all comes
down to how that building's being

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modeled by your energy advisor. So I
don't see it as a big

265
00:33:13,679 --> 00:33:18,399
» just a supplemental bar.
>> Yeah.

266
00:33:15,039 --> 00:33:23,200
» Thank you. So, so what I how I
understand this is that you actually get

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your building when you're in the design
phase and you're doing you're doing this

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00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:31,440
work in the design phase, you're not
actually adding some kind of massive

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00:33:28,799 --> 00:33:37,120
cost because you design it in. You're
you're you're building from the start

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00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:40,720
out with that in mind. That's right.
There's not all of a sudden at the end

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00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:45,039
of the build there's some 10 or 20%
increase. You've actually planned it all

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out and you've had your energy advisor
and your plans to start with. Is that

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00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:50,720
correct?
>> We don't accept a building permit

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without a pre-construction compliance
report that's produced by an energy

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advisor. So, it's all laid out from the
start. The cost should be well aware

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from this time.
>> Thank you.

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00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:05,519
» And mid construction lowered,
>> right?

278
00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:09,599
» Yeah. The energy adviser is involved
normally at three points the project. Uh

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00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:15,359
it's the pre-construction compliance
report. Uh they it's it's optional. they

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00:34:13,200 --> 00:34:19,440
can come and do a mid construction. It's
called a blower door test where they

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00:34:16,879 --> 00:34:24,240
test for an air leakage in the home. Uh
that that's a requirement that must be

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00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:27,839
met met to meet levels of step code. And
then they're uh brought in at the end of

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00:34:26,079 --> 00:34:33,599
the project to do another blower door
test. And they ensure that the building

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00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:40,320
is built in the exact way that it was
modeled. So insulation, mechanical

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00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:46,159
systems, air tightness, um they're all
as it was modeled. windows, you know,

286
00:34:42,879 --> 00:34:50,240
everything's involved. Um, and us as
building officials, we're also

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00:34:48,159 --> 00:34:55,520
cross-referencing that um,
pre-construction compliance report as

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the project is is progressing.
>> Thank you for

289
00:34:58,240 --> 00:35:03,520
question, and this is a little bit of a
thought experiment. There are some

290
00:35:01,599 --> 00:35:08,400
municipalities that are talking about
like Vancouver, right, about stepping

291
00:35:05,599 --> 00:35:14,640
back on stepping back. um what what is
the like risk proincially in terms of

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00:35:11,839 --> 00:35:19,599
some kind of uh oversight or
overregulation or is it possible for

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00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:25,240
them to undo what we have done in our
own bylaws? I'm just curious.

294
00:35:22,240 --> 00:35:25,240
» Um

295
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:34,079
I think that we can always go beyond the
provincial minimums. Um we can't go

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below them if the province for some
reason pauses step code or

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00:35:37,119 --> 00:35:43,680
um the government shifts and they get
rid of it, then then council could

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00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:49,839
always amend our bylaws at that time. I
think I mentioned this at the last

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00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:53,200
meeting, too. The step code um is being
um looked at across the province, and

300
00:35:51,599 --> 00:35:57,359
they're actually going to be um
implementing it into a harmonized

301
00:35:55,119 --> 00:36:03,359
building code across the country. And
so, it's going to be adopted, a version

302
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:06,640
of it anyway, um nationally. So I think
yeah I mean I guess I can't say for sure

303
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:10,960
what will happen at the provincial level
but they could change it in theory but I

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00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:13,680
think it is kind of becoming a standard
that everybody is accepting at the same

305
00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:17,440
time.
>> Yeah. Thanks. It's interesting um

306
00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:20,480
because I've had lots of conversations
about this. I'm sure you guys have all

307
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:25,040
had lots of conversations about this and
I just keep coming back to thinking like

308
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:28,079
it is quite incremental. It's not like
every single house is going to have a

309
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:33,200
heat pump,
>> right? That's not how this works. and it

310
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:37,280
just feels like the next right thing to
do, you know, when you we're just like

311
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:41,359
this one little city council and like
what can we just do that's the next most

312
00:36:39,359 --> 00:36:44,480
right thing and it I I really keep
landing there just in terms of those

313
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:49,280
little pieces that we can do to make
that little difference and just show a

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00:36:47,119 --> 00:36:55,760
bit of leadership as well which we don't
ever want to be the most high and the

315
00:36:51,839 --> 00:37:02,079
best of everything but because we have
um really competent building community

316
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:07,760
and um you know, not a lot of building
in a year. It does feel like a really

317
00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:10,480
clever way to to make an impact. I like
it.

318
00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:15,400
» Yeah. And and I'd be in support of going
to the EL4 for the new builds as well.

319
00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:22,720
» Okay. So, council, anybody else got any
questions for staff while they're here?

320
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:28,880
Can I just ask
to me the the risk is more on the home

321
00:37:25,359 --> 00:37:30,720
owner because we don't have fixed price
builders.

322
00:37:29,839 --> 00:37:37,200
» Yeah.
>> Um you get build what the uh how many

323
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:44,240
hours the person puts into the thing and
if the you know they didn't do the you

324
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:47,839
know the the uh they didn't build it
exactly to the modeling. I haven't seen

325
00:37:46,240 --> 00:37:53,599
a builder that says, "Oh, okay. Well,
sorry. We'll fix that for nothing." So,

326
00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:58,400
how do we educate
homeowner? Because they're the ones

327
00:37:55,440 --> 00:38:03,359
footing the bill if the thing doesn't
get quite built to meet the standards,

328
00:38:01,839 --> 00:38:07,599
etc.,
you know, to me, that's where more the

329
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:12,800
work has to be done is with those
homeowners because they're mostly

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00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:17,599
customuilt. they're um you know, you're
on the you know, most people don't have

331
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:23,599
a fixed price contract. They they pay
for whatever the cost it is of those

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00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:29,280
builders building this thing. So to me,
that's where the bigger risk is. The

333
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:36,079
homeowner is educated enough to ensure
that um whatever their contract ensures

334
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:40,240
that you know that if the builder didn't
get it right the first time, they're not

335
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:41,920
now on the hook of rework and all that
stuff.

336
00:38:40,560 --> 00:38:45,280
» You having to pull out the drywall to
put in a new

337
00:38:43,359 --> 00:38:47,599
» vapor barrier or whatever. That's why
you have the mid lower door before

338
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:52,000
drywall.
>> Before and after. Yep. Anyway, that

339
00:38:49,839 --> 00:38:56,640
that's my experience is that, you know,
because that's just the nature of our

340
00:38:55,119 --> 00:39:01,839
custombuilt
um individual unsophisticated homeowners

341
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:05,680
that are kind of hoping everything goes
well.

342
00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:10,320
Any home builder out there that can say,
"Oh, Gez, yeah, I just came in right on

343
00:39:08,240 --> 00:39:14,720
budget and under budget by I'm not sure,
Lesly, if yours yours did, but yeah,

344
00:39:13,359 --> 00:39:18,560
» I stopped adding it up."
>> Right? So, that to me is the biggest

345
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:25,440
risk. So I think that's where the work
needs to be done is is how do we educate

346
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:31,440
and and maybe support the homeowner kind
of contract. How do they make sure that

347
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:39,040
you know these you know these additional
every time you make it more complicated

348
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:43,800
more um difficult to meet things the
risk is on the homeowner not builder.

349
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:50,960
I would say step code is pretty well
understood. Um I know people can make

350
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:54,320
mistakes for sure. I think it's I think
our building community though has been

351
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:57,040
doing it now for quite a few years like
over six years and I think they're

352
00:39:55,520 --> 00:40:00,960
getting better at it. I think yeah
there's always a risk to that. So I

353
00:39:58,720 --> 00:40:05,119
think um I don't know if the city but
maybe there's some guides the step code

354
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:08,480
has put out related to that and so maybe
we can look that up and put that on our

355
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:13,359
website because we do have a let's talk
page about that. Um, as far as admission

356
00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:17,040
level um, requirements, I think you
really just have to follow what's in

357
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:19,760
those plans. Whatever your energy
advisor has kind of laid out for

358
00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:22,079
mechanical systems, I think you need to
meet those all those step code is a

359
00:40:21,839 --> 00:40:25,839
different
>> but again you need to understand which

360
00:40:24,079 --> 00:40:30,160
one you know what is the right
mechanical system because there's a

361
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:34,960
variety right
>> just it's it's just challenging as

362
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:39,599
» any of us that have built have
recognized the challenge of these things

363
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:45,920
» but the design team is the important
component. It's not just a contractor

364
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:53,119
and a homeowner. gets the design team.
>> Yep. And if those two don't make it get

365
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:58,400
it right, then it's a homeowner pay.
>> So I guess that's listening to that. My

366
00:40:56,720 --> 00:41:07,040
question is,
so I hire the contractor, I have the the

367
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:12,800
energy efficiency person, and it gets
all said and done, and my house isn't

368
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:18,560
step code 4 or EL4, do I not get an
occupancy permit?

369
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:26,319
» Uh, no. You Well, we haven't had that
happen. Um, but you do need to meet the

370
00:41:22,319 --> 00:41:29,119
minimums. So, what whatever we decide as
as our minimums, they need to be met.

371
00:41:28,720 --> 00:41:33,440
Um,
>> okay. So, so basically, if I if at the

372
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:37,119
end of the day and I thought everybody's
worked together and done everything

373
00:41:35,119 --> 00:41:41,760
right
and

374
00:41:38,720 --> 00:41:47,119
the proverbial fly in the ointment and
my last blower door test comes back and

375
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:50,000
there's something wrong and I have not
met the standard, I do not get an

376
00:41:48,720 --> 00:41:53,200
occupancy permit. I just need to get
that clear in my head. So, that would be

377
00:41:51,599 --> 00:41:57,040
great. Okay. Thanks.
>> That because that uh well one it will be

378
00:41:55,520 --> 00:42:00,800
in our bylaw
>> but very soon it'll be part of the BC

379
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:03,200
building code
>> right

380
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:06,960
» so anything that doesn't meet the BC
building code

381
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:13,359
wouldn't be able to kind of close your
permit so with all building code related

382
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:18,160
» and so those deficiencies isn't the
contractor responsible for them

383
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:21,560
» yeah
but they charge

384
00:42:24,240 --> 00:42:27,920
Depends on your contract. Yes.
>> Okay. I'm gonna go.

385
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:32,319
» Depends on your contract.
>> I think I've heard from him. I think I

386
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:37,359
Okay, I've heard from everybody. So, I'm
going to go Woodward Panero page.

387
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:42,480
» Thank you, Mayor. I just I was just
looking at our Nelson Max document and

388
00:42:40,720 --> 00:42:47,520
looking at aspiration to infrastructure
and buildings in Nelson are zero carbon

389
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:52,640
and resilient. Um, you know, this was a
two-year, we took two years to build

390
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:57,680
this document two years ago with deep
input by the community and um, as

391
00:42:55,359 --> 00:43:02,960
councelor Tate said, I think, you know,
this is one of those moments where we

392
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:06,960
could be guided by our guiding
documents. So, I feel like and the

393
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:10,960
number one strategy here is new
buildings are net zero ready and have

394
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:16,319
lower embodied carbon and are resilient
against climate change.

395
00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:20,880
like this has been you know this is a
very important piece of documentation

396
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:23,520
for the city so
that

397
00:43:21,359 --> 00:43:31,599
» okay council
>> I don't have any issue with what staff

398
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:38,079
has put forward as a phased approach
it's only it's two years and

399
00:43:35,359 --> 00:43:43,440
I think the point of consulting with the
community

400
00:43:39,599 --> 00:43:48,480
there really isn't a point especially
the community that actually builds

401
00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:52,880
houses. And I would say to Kevin's
point, like homeowners are, you know,

402
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:57,359
they need to be educated and what have
you. A lot of I'm assuming a lot of

403
00:43:54,800 --> 00:44:00,720
education from a from the homeowner
perspective comes from the building

404
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:05,119
community. When you hire somebody to
build your house, they're going to tell

405
00:44:02,079 --> 00:44:09,920
you what you need to do. And if that
community needs

406
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:16,319
I I don't know what they said, but if
they need a couple years to to get on

407
00:44:12,720 --> 00:44:19,440
the pace, we're already like this is
we're we're still going ahead. We're

408
00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:22,880
still ahead of the way ahead of the
curve. We're already ahead of the curve

409
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:28,560
and this is a little bit more ahead of
the curve, but it's still, I think,

410
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:33,200
respects the feedback and the wishes of
a very important sector of the community

411
00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:38,880
that actually builds these houses. And
we don't I I I think we don't want to

412
00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:46,160
leave those people behind. I'm sure they
will scramble and they'll figure it out.

413
00:44:42,720 --> 00:44:51,680
That's true. Also,
at what you know, like I don't I don't

414
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:57,839
quite understand the point of of
ignoring them if we're going to consult

415
00:44:53,359 --> 00:45:03,440
them. And so I would just I'm happy with
what you guys have put forward. Um, I

416
00:45:00,160 --> 00:45:08,480
feel like we're we are um ahead of the
game like demonstratively and and I

417
00:45:06,160 --> 00:45:13,119
don't see why we need to tip people over
and and cause any sort of discomfort for

418
00:45:11,119 --> 00:45:17,280
our building community if they're
already on board. And I seem to be like

419
00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:20,560
we have a great knowledgeable building
community. They're on board with all of

420
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:27,240
this. We're going to get to the target
by 2028. And why is that?

421
00:45:27,599 --> 00:45:35,119
I I think we have to I I personally feel
like the point of consulting with

422
00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:39,440
experts is that we listen to have to
say.

423
00:45:36,560 --> 00:45:43,680
» Councelor Paige,
>> thanks. Yeah, we've been working on this

424
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:49,359
continuum and making some adjust
adjustments. Based on what I'm hearing,

425
00:45:46,079 --> 00:45:52,880
uh what I'm thinking about is going to
E4

426
00:45:51,359 --> 00:45:59,119
mostly seems to cut out cooking
appliances. That's majority of what I've

427
00:45:55,760 --> 00:46:03,280
understood is between your water heater
and your furnace and building heat that

428
00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:09,440
like you're going to reach those targets
for E4 for zero carbon for cutting up

429
00:46:07,119 --> 00:46:13,599
cooking appliances. And so does that
does that mean as a builder you can't

430
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:18,079
necessarily plum it in for gas and put
electric? Like how does that does the

431
00:46:15,359 --> 00:46:22,880
homeowner lose all opportunity
in an L4 home to have a gas hook up or

432
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:26,960
could they just put a gas hook up and
installed?

433
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:30,880
» Um in in for part nine, yeah,
>> it's a bit different for part three. For

434
00:46:28,480 --> 00:46:36,240
part nine, you can still have gas
cooking. It can still be modeled in and

435
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:42,720
you can even still have a dual fuel heat
pump where there is natural gas paired

436
00:46:39,359 --> 00:46:47,920
uh with an electric um cooling system,
commercial heating system. So you can

437
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:52,480
still have natural gas to emission level
for homes. It's just a a further

438
00:46:50,319 --> 00:46:56,640
restriction on the greenhouse gas
emissions associated with that building.

439
00:46:54,640 --> 00:46:59,760
Uh the mechanical systems have to be
more efficient.

440
00:46:58,240 --> 00:47:02,160
» Yeah. So you can still have those things
and people can still have natural gas to

441
00:47:01,359 --> 00:47:05,920
the property
>> and likely still will. Yeah.

442
00:47:03,599 --> 00:47:12,800
» Yeah. Okay. So there's that flexibility
and then the supplemental.

443
00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:17,760
» How many homes have been giving EL4?
Where are we landing on? And I I'll just

444
00:47:15,599 --> 00:47:22,480
say I'm sympathetic to the idea that we
kind of train once versus like every two

445
00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:27,440
years. It's not the change that that
that amount of shift and change is also

446
00:47:25,599 --> 00:47:33,760
adds to this regulatory fatigue that
people feel and then the building code

447
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:37,839
captures it all anyway.
But I am curious how many people how

448
00:47:35,359 --> 00:47:40,800
many of our new builds are close to G4
already.

449
00:47:38,240 --> 00:47:49,200
» We we have that data. We have that.
>> Yeah. And it's a law.

450
00:47:45,599 --> 00:47:54,000
» Yeah. It's a better system.
system

451
00:47:52,079 --> 00:47:59,680
» and we're finding you know people are
modeling

452
00:47:55,520 --> 00:48:06,720
EL1 EL2 and at the end of the project
they're coming out at EL3 and E4

453
00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:11,440
quite often
>> have you had any feedback from Maple

454
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:16,480
regions done this already
gone to EL4 is that true

455
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:19,520
» or there
most coastal regions have gone there

456
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:24,720
already.
>> Uh yeah.

457
00:48:22,079 --> 00:48:29,839
Uh Whistler have gone there already and
they're in a colder climate zone. Um

458
00:48:28,240 --> 00:48:32,960
Nelson would be the first of the
interior areas.

459
00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:37,359
» I was thinking there were words kind of
slightly separate but not really.

460
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:42,079
» Interestingly enough, Nelson is in
climate zone five

461
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:46,800
» and a lot of climate zone 5 has actually
gone to emission level four. A lot of

462
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:51,359
that actually also includes the island.
So we do know that it is possible here.

463
00:48:49,839 --> 00:48:56,880
Um and I looked at the stats. I couldn't
find the completed projects. I can send

464
00:48:52,960 --> 00:49:02,720
that afterwards. But um we had uh 11
project projects or 40% of our projects

465
00:48:59,839 --> 00:49:08,839
were hitting emission level four um in
their proposed um reports. So

466
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:18,960
» I would almost my last comment is I'd
almost just if there was any hesitation

467
00:49:14,559 --> 00:49:24,079
about talking I just the whole thing 200
seven I probably also want to get a

468
00:49:21,119 --> 00:49:29,880
little more
but I think there's some sense around

469
00:49:25,920 --> 00:49:29,880
the table maybe going further.

470
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:38,559
» Yeah I would go further. I would just go
straight to E4. Um, now and to councelor

471
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:44,240
Pierro's point again, I think that
there's some con except between the step

472
00:49:41,040 --> 00:49:48,400
code and zerocarbon step code.
I think the building community's concern

473
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:54,000
isn't the zerocarbon step code so much
because they do largely build for at

474
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:58,880
least 40% said already do it. 40% of
buildings I bet you 100% of contractors

475
00:49:55,680 --> 00:50:04,640
do it because it's really it's not that
complicated. It's just a house that's

476
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:10,960
generally electric. Heating water that's
electric. A lot of our houses going back

477
00:50:07,119 --> 00:50:14,960
to the 2010s are like that. So, it's
it's not complicated. I don't think the

478
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:20,160
building community is what we're is
concerned about that. It's the step code

479
00:50:17,599 --> 00:50:22,880
part that's that they would be. So, the
feedback I'm sure if you did separate

480
00:50:21,680 --> 00:50:28,319
them out, they wouldn't have problems
with EL4.

481
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:33,599
the and again even the chambers letter
if you parsed it didn't sound like the

482
00:50:30,559 --> 00:50:40,720
issue was EL4 was referencing the step
code in terms of their concern um I

483
00:50:37,599 --> 00:50:45,280
think E4 in general again I think
counselor Payne's original point is kind

484
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:50,559
of bang on it's just simpler like let's
let's let's just go straight to it let's

485
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:57,839
not complicate the process too much by
stepping through EL3

486
00:50:54,160 --> 00:51:04,559
Um and and I think in general too the
reason why we should keep the pace up is

487
00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:10,480
because we've set those targets like and
those targets were way behind on

488
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:15,760
» already all of us all of society. It's
so even just trying to find parody with

489
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:20,880
other interior municipalities is not
something we should be achieving or

490
00:51:17,760 --> 00:51:28,079
aiming for. We've we've got to got to
keep the momentum up. And so in this

491
00:51:24,240 --> 00:51:31,359
case, I I think it's one, it's simpler.
Two, I don't think the build the the

492
00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:35,599
contractors, the building community
would have an issue particularly with

493
00:51:33,119 --> 00:51:40,640
this one. I think there's some on the
margins around,

494
00:51:37,599 --> 00:51:45,520
you know, an attachment to
gas. And and to your point, I guess I

495
00:51:42,960 --> 00:51:48,880
had thought that gas was only for like,
you know, your gas fireplace or your

496
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:53,200
exterior gas, but you're right, it's the
stove as well, so even that isn't an

497
00:51:52,160 --> 00:51:55,599
issue.
Um, so

498
00:51:54,960 --> 00:51:59,839
» yeah,
>> not a not a lot of reason to not just go

499
00:51:58,079 --> 00:52:04,559
to raise the eel.
>> Okay, council, I'm gonna I'm going to be

500
00:52:02,240 --> 00:52:08,240
very um generous here this evening on
this discussion because I'm hearing lots

501
00:52:06,720 --> 00:52:12,559
of things and I know I know where this
discussion is going, but uh I'm going to

502
00:52:10,319 --> 00:52:16,400
be letting somebody else uh lead lead
this one. I've been quite busy already

503
00:52:14,319 --> 00:52:20,800
today. So, councelor Woodward and then
councelor Panero for last and then we

504
00:52:18,640 --> 00:52:24,880
are going to make some decisions. Okay,
>> my my just my quick question is it's

505
00:52:22,480 --> 00:52:30,000
never going to be cheaper to do this
work now. It's only going to get more

506
00:52:27,440 --> 00:52:35,680
expensive to do the work. So, if we just
set the set the precedent now and people

507
00:52:32,559 --> 00:52:42,319
who are building now and in the next few
years, it's like it'll be far more

508
00:52:37,520 --> 00:52:47,440
expensive in 10 years or five years. So,
>> entrepreneurial.

509
00:52:43,520 --> 00:52:53,200
» Okay, super quick. If that's true, then
I have no problem with that at all.

510
00:52:50,240 --> 00:53:00,079
the thing like everything you said makes
sense to me. I'm just a bit hung up on

511
00:52:56,960 --> 00:53:05,440
when we consulted with people
like council doctor can say that he

512
00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:09,599
doesn't think that the building
community has an issue with that but

513
00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:12,720
what did the building community have an
issue with because they had an issue

514
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:17,520
with something that made them want to
phase this in slower and and I'm just

515
00:53:15,680 --> 00:53:22,960
curious what that was because if it
isn't if it isn't that like you said

516
00:53:19,920 --> 00:53:27,359
then let's go like I'm completely into
it. It's just that one like these people

517
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:31,359
do this for a living and I think that
needs to be respected. So what did they

518
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:35,280
have a problem with specifically and if
it wasn't Yel for then then we're good.

519
00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:39,920
I think
>> I think um actually it was kind of a bit

520
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:43,680
different than what the chambers letter
and again I have not seen the chamber

521
00:53:41,280 --> 00:53:49,040
but just from what I gleaned here um our
building community from the builders

522
00:53:45,119 --> 00:53:51,920
that we spoke with were uh both um okay
with moving forward with the step code

523
00:53:50,559 --> 00:53:57,119
and I think they really understand the
step code. They were also okay with

524
00:53:54,079 --> 00:54:00,640
moving forward u with zerocarbon.
However, when we were talking to them,

525
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:05,440
it was pretty clear that some of them
had less understanding of the zerocarbon

526
00:54:03,680 --> 00:54:09,760
step code and there was some questions
around it and they didn't understand.

527
00:54:07,440 --> 00:54:14,559
I've gone all electric, I'm still not
hitting EL4 or I put in a dual fuel

528
00:54:12,720 --> 00:54:18,160
system, I am hitting EL4. Like there
were some questions and I can't use

529
00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:23,839
certain mechanical equipment anymore. So
then we brought in um a part three and a

530
00:54:21,599 --> 00:54:27,760
part nine energy advisor and they did a
presentation and people were able to

531
00:54:25,359 --> 00:54:31,920
answer their question. So the reason we
um implemented a phased approach wasn't

532
00:54:29,599 --> 00:54:35,440
because the builders were concerned. It
was more just we could see that not

533
00:54:33,680 --> 00:54:40,480
everybody had the same level of
understanding on zero carbon they all

534
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:43,839
you know generally supported it. So I
don't know that that helps clarify but I

535
00:54:42,640 --> 00:54:49,359
just wanted to give a phased approach
just to give them time to catch up.

536
00:54:47,200 --> 00:54:57,319
Okay, counselors,
there are five resolutions before us

537
00:54:54,319 --> 00:54:57,319
and

538
00:55:02,319 --> 00:55:13,880
are we then proposing that we only pass
three in for bylaw 3664 and amend it to

539
00:55:10,240 --> 00:55:13,880
say December 2026.

540
00:55:15,119 --> 00:55:22,960
That would be the privilege of the
table. I think that um do we have to do

541
00:55:20,319 --> 00:55:25,119
we have to can we just eliminate some of
these or can we just I'm just looking at

542
00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:28,960
it
>> or just make a new one.

543
00:55:26,880 --> 00:55:34,960
» One of them is to do that we're doing
but in 2028.

544
00:55:30,400 --> 00:55:40,400
» Yes. But there's a big change to the um
16.3 to 16.5. There's

545
00:55:38,559 --> 00:55:47,000
it repeals.
So, building bylaw amendment number

546
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:47,000
34564

547
00:55:47,760 --> 00:55:56,720
» or whatever. Yeah. 3654.
Um,

548
00:55:53,680 --> 00:56:00,400
» deletes the section 16.2 to 16.5 and
then replaces it.

549
00:55:59,520 --> 00:56:04,640
So,
>> why don't we just do first two readings?

550
00:56:02,559 --> 00:56:10,720
» We could do that.
And then um third reading is given as

551
00:56:09,359 --> 00:56:13,839
amended.
>> Yeah.

552
00:56:11,599 --> 00:56:17,520
» Or we can just
>> Yeah.

553
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:22,720
» The only change is to 16.2 where you
change emission level

554
00:56:19,599 --> 00:56:27,040
» three to emission level four in 16.2 or
you could do first two ratings.

555
00:56:25,200 --> 00:56:29,119
» Isn't it just easiest to do if that's
the

556
00:56:27,280 --> 00:56:35,040
» I've got no recommendations on the table
yet. So I am curious as to why I'm

557
00:56:32,160 --> 00:56:45,599
hearing this that that there is a
thought around the table to go to step

558
00:56:38,559 --> 00:56:52,240
code step code step 4 and zerocarbon E4
in 2026. Can that not can that not just

559
00:56:49,760 --> 00:56:56,000
be the resolution that's passed
>> 16.2 just needs to change that we have

560
00:56:55,280 --> 00:56:58,880
the bylaw.
>> It's a bylaw.

561
00:56:56,880 --> 00:57:03,280
» It's a bylaw. We have to change the
bylaw.

562
00:57:01,119 --> 00:57:06,720
» Wasn't this changing the bylaw?
>> Are these resolutions changing?

563
00:57:04,640 --> 00:57:13,440
» I get what you're saying. So, adopt one
just as is and adopt

564
00:57:09,839 --> 00:57:17,119
resolution two as amended.
It's you.

565
00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:21,520
» Why don't Well, we could you could just
um

566
00:57:19,359 --> 00:57:25,359
adopt Well, it's amended as
>> this is a description of bylaws, not the

567
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:28,480
actual
>> No. Well, the bylaw is on the back. You

568
00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:33,119
just attach to this.
>> So it's the bylaw that needs to change

569
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:36,119
in resolution.
>> Yeah.

570
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:43,200
» One and two is E4.
>> Why don't we we just do one and two. We

571
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:48,160
can bring it back on the 21st and do
third reading and I think we'll be

572
00:57:45,280 --> 00:57:52,160
basically on the same timeline.
>> This is this isn't happening.

573
00:57:50,240 --> 00:57:54,480
» Yeah. For another six. It doesn't we
have time. It's happening in five

574
00:57:53,520 --> 00:57:57,920
months. So
>> So why don't we just do one and two?

575
00:57:56,160 --> 00:58:05,359
they can change the bylaw, bring it back
as as the actual bylaw that you want to

576
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:11,119
pass and there's no urgency to change
that on the fly to me.

577
00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:15,440
» I'm I'm I'm still really confused. So,
you have to tell me again this because

578
00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:17,520
» because number two is reading it for a
third time and usually when we read a

579
00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:20,480
third time,
>> we're just doing we're just doing one

580
00:58:19,680 --> 00:58:22,799
and two and then
>> What's one and two?

581
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:25,440
» No, one and three. We're going to do
anything

582
00:58:23,119 --> 00:58:31,040
» first and second time by title only,
>> right?

583
00:58:26,160 --> 00:58:35,680
» For for for the first resolution
>> and then we're not doing anymore.

584
00:58:33,599 --> 00:58:39,440
And then we're going to bring it back to
another the next regular meeting in

585
00:58:37,520 --> 00:58:45,680
August
for third reading as amended to change

586
00:58:42,640 --> 00:58:49,359
it from uh step
>> E

587
00:58:46,240 --> 00:58:53,839
» E3 to E4
and then it'll be adopted in September.

588
00:58:52,319 --> 00:58:59,960
» And I think we can still do five tonight
if we want to.

589
00:58:55,359 --> 00:58:59,960
» Oh, and we can do five. Yes. Sorry. Yes.

590
00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:06,559
» Okay. So, as long as everybody's got
that, I guess somebody can uh move

591
00:59:03,760 --> 00:59:10,160
recommendation number one.
>> So, should we move to strike two, three,

592
00:59:08,720 --> 00:59:13,720
and four, or do we just vote them down
or do you just not?

593
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:22,799
» Okay. Moved by councelor Lochenberg,
seconded by councelor Woodward.

594
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:27,400
So, councelor Lockenberg, do you have
that up there so you can read it out to

595
00:59:24,240 --> 00:59:27,400
the public?

596
00:59:27,760 --> 00:59:37,280
that the Corporation of the City of
Nelson building amendment um energy step

597
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:43,920
code step 4 plus zerocarbon EL3 bylaw
number 3654 2026 be introduced and read

598
00:59:40,880 --> 00:59:50,559
a first and second time by title.
>> Okay, counselors that's been moved and

599
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:55,520
seconded. All those in favor
and that carries. Anybody Anybody

600
00:59:52,640 --> 00:59:59,119
opposed?
I just wanted to hear EL4. It makes me

601
00:59:57,839 --> 01:00:01,280
nervous.
>> Well, that's why I don't understand. I'm

602
01:00:00,240 --> 01:00:05,839
still trying to figure out why I can't
say E4. You guys can't change that.

603
01:00:03,680 --> 01:00:09,839
» Why are you saying E4? If we're changing
the Bible, it feels like

604
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:14,400
» Commission 4 E4.
>> My understanding is because in that

605
01:00:11,920 --> 01:00:18,559
resolutions, it's referencing the bylaw
as written. Yeah.

606
01:00:15,599 --> 01:00:22,720
» And so, we have to speak to the bylaws
written. They'll bring it back amended.

607
01:00:20,720 --> 01:00:25,760
So when they bring it back, it'll be EL4
>> and it'll be third reading.

608
01:00:23,839 --> 01:00:32,079
» And if you want to pass a resolution
that says, you know, um, please bring

609
01:00:28,880 --> 01:00:35,480
back, you know, the bylaw amended to
adopt E4.

610
01:00:38,640 --> 01:00:45,920
» Okay, before we get
>> the date we want EL4 is

611
01:00:42,480 --> 01:00:50,720
» okay. Um, so this is number one's been
moved and seconded. We have to do this.

612
01:00:48,640 --> 01:00:53,599
» Can I have the vote? So I we voted. You
didn't want to go down as recorded the

613
01:00:52,160 --> 01:00:59,200
post. You're okay.
>> Not opposed. I just

614
01:00:54,960 --> 01:01:04,960
» So that's all in favor. So that carries.
>> So you passed this two readings of the

615
01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:12,680
bylaw as current. Now you can pass the
resolution to say please amend this

616
01:01:07,599 --> 01:01:12,680
bylaw to have EL4

617
01:01:12,720 --> 01:01:22,880
supposed to come in December 2026.
December

618
01:01:19,520 --> 01:01:27,520
31st, 2026.
>> You want to pass that resolution that

619
01:01:25,200 --> 01:01:30,160
directs us to bring this back that way.
>> Okay, I'll I'll move that.

620
01:01:29,040 --> 01:01:33,599
» Can I move that?
>> Okay, I'll move that.

621
01:01:31,599 --> 01:01:36,079
» You okay with that? You've got what we
need, sir?

622
01:01:34,319 --> 01:01:39,079
» Yeah.
>> I'll

623
01:01:39,280 --> 01:01:50,000
» Okay. So, recommendation to bring back
amended version that says EL4 December

624
01:01:44,319 --> 01:01:53,960
31, 2026. So five months. Okay. By
Woodward, seconded by Payne.

625
01:01:56,079 --> 01:01:59,400
Any discussion?

626
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:07,119
Now we're all quiet. Let's see if we all
raise up our hands again.

627
01:02:06,079 --> 01:02:11,200
» Okay.
>> All All those in favor

628
01:02:10,079 --> 01:02:13,440
that carries.
>> And I'll move five.

629
01:02:12,160 --> 01:02:19,760
» And you're going to move number five.
Okay. Number five. Tate seconder

630
01:02:18,000 --> 01:02:24,880
Woodward Tate, please.
>> Council direct staff to return in 2027

631
01:02:23,119 --> 01:02:28,559
with recommendations regarding future
energy step code and zero requirement

632
01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:31,440
step code requirements for part three
buildings.

633
01:02:29,599 --> 01:02:35,680
» Okay, that's moved and seconded. Anybody
need uh further on that? So part three

634
01:02:33,920 --> 01:02:41,440
buildings are the big buildings versus
the small buildings.

635
01:02:38,400 --> 01:02:46,559
Okay, all those in favor
and that carries.

636
01:02:44,319 --> 01:02:50,960
Okay, thank you very much counselors.
Thank you staff

637
01:02:48,480 --> 01:02:56,760
for bringing that forward and moving us
along.

638
01:02:53,599 --> 01:02:56,760
Thank you.

639
01:02:57,359 --> 01:03:05,359
Next up,
we have some further recommendations

640
01:03:01,119 --> 01:03:09,200
from staff. We have 8A the cube 2.0
lease terms. Staff are seeking council's

641
01:03:07,680 --> 01:03:15,119
approval to amend its previous direction
regarding the lease term for the cube

642
01:03:11,599 --> 01:03:19,039
2.0 zero project at 82010 street. While
council has already approved the site

643
01:03:16,799 --> 01:03:23,280
location, directed staff to finalize the
land agreement, approve a 10-year

644
01:03:20,799 --> 01:03:27,119
nominal rent period in principal, and
agree to providing letters of support

645
01:03:24,720 --> 01:03:32,240
for grant applications. Staff now
recommend authorizing a 25-year initial

646
01:03:29,680 --> 01:03:36,400
ground lease with one 25-year renewal
option. The longer lease term better

647
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:41,039
reflects the construction of a permanent
facility on city-owned land, supports

648
01:03:38,960 --> 01:03:44,720
funding and financial requirements, and
provides long-term certainty certainty

649
01:03:42,799 --> 01:03:50,079
while preserving council's previous
direction that the first 10 years of the

650
01:03:46,559 --> 01:03:55,839
lease be provided at nominal rent. So,
there's quite a lot of information there

651
01:03:52,880 --> 01:03:59,760
and there is a recommendation
moved by councelor Paige. Is there a

652
01:03:57,760 --> 01:04:05,359
second? Council Woodward. Councelor
Page. Council amended its previous

653
01:04:01,839 --> 01:04:08,319
direction regarding Q 2.0 project at 820
10th Street by authorizing the city to

654
01:04:07,039 --> 01:04:12,559
enter into a ground lease with the
complete climate association for an

655
01:04:09,760 --> 01:04:16,880
initial term of 25 years with one option
to renew for further 25 years with the

656
01:04:14,960 --> 01:04:21,599
first 10 years of the initial term to
remain at a nominal rent as previously

657
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:25,599
approved by council and further that all
the resolution previously adopted by

658
01:04:23,440 --> 01:04:29,520
council respecting Q 2.0 project,
including the approval of site location,

659
01:04:27,680 --> 01:04:33,680
staff's authority to finalize the site
details and document them in a land

660
01:04:31,920 --> 01:04:38,960
agreement, and the city's commitment to
provide letters of support for grant

661
01:04:35,200 --> 01:04:45,520
applications remain unchanged.
>> Okay, that's been counc um I just have a

662
01:04:42,559 --> 01:04:51,960
question about
uh communication. Public notice will be

663
01:04:47,200 --> 01:04:51,960
provided for property disposition.

664
01:04:53,440 --> 01:05:00,319
Um when I looked up property like
property disposition

665
01:04:58,240 --> 01:05:03,920
is that different because when I looked
that up it said legal financial and tax

666
01:05:02,079 --> 01:05:08,640
processes of selling transferring or
disposing. So disposition and disposal

667
01:05:06,799 --> 01:05:14,720
are they
>> help me understand that

668
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:20,880
» any time we lease land for longer than a
five years is considered a disposition.

669
01:05:17,599 --> 01:05:25,280
So the municipality does not have um
rights to that land for a long period of

670
01:05:23,119 --> 01:05:29,039
time. We have to let the community know
that we're going to do that.

671
01:05:26,559 --> 01:05:32,000
» Okay. So we still own it.
>> No,

672
01:05:29,760 --> 01:05:36,799
» but we just Yeah. That's what
>> we sort of giving up our rights to use

673
01:05:33,839 --> 01:05:39,839
it as long. That's what I want to clar.
Thank you. Figured it was something like

674
01:05:38,720 --> 01:05:45,599
that.
>> Okay. Any other comments, questions, or

675
01:05:42,480 --> 01:05:49,680
concerns? Seeing none, all those in
favor?

676
01:05:47,119 --> 01:05:54,799
And that carries.
Okay. Moving on to 8B.

677
01:05:53,440 --> 01:05:59,119
Um, development variance permit
application for 820 Victoria Street to

678
01:05:57,280 --> 01:06:05,839
bury requirements for interior lot line
setpack and sading exemptions. And staff

679
01:06:02,799 --> 01:06:10,799
is back at the table. So, development
services has received an application to

680
01:06:07,280 --> 01:06:17,119
bury zoning bylaw number 3652 2026 as
follows. Section 10.12R3

681
01:06:14,480 --> 01:06:22,640
interior side lot line setback to reduce
the minimum required setback from the

682
01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:32,240
interior side property line from 1.0 m
to 0.52 m and section two section five

683
01:06:29,200 --> 01:06:35,680
and number two section 5.10
sighting exemptions to reduce the

684
01:06:33,760 --> 01:06:41,839
allowable distance between roof eaves
and a property line from 0.9 m to 0.7 m.

685
01:06:40,319 --> 01:06:45,880
council is being requested to consider
and approve the proposed variances.

686
01:06:46,640 --> 01:06:53,359
» Um yeah, so I can just provide a little
bit of context on this property. Uh so

687
01:06:51,680 --> 01:06:57,520
the property is located in the lower
Uhill neighborhood. Uh the existing home

688
01:06:55,680 --> 01:07:01,920
is estimated to have been built around
1905 during an earlier period of

689
01:07:00,240 --> 01:07:07,680
development in the neighborhood and this
was before modern zoning and subdivision

690
01:07:04,319 --> 01:07:11,599
standards were established. Uh many uh
blocks in lower Uphill and Nelson

691
01:07:09,760 --> 01:07:16,160
reflect the development patterns of this
period where buildings were typically

692
01:07:13,599 --> 01:07:20,319
located closer together and closer to
property lines than what would be

693
01:07:18,319 --> 01:07:24,640
typically permitted under today's zoning
regulations. Uh these historic

694
01:07:22,640 --> 01:07:28,559
conditions contribute to the established
character of the neighborhood, but they

695
01:07:26,079 --> 01:07:33,200
can also create challenges for older
homes when they're renovated or expanded

696
01:07:30,480 --> 01:07:38,079
due to our current regulations. uh in
this house, in this case, the existing

697
01:07:35,359 --> 01:07:42,799
house was built uh close to the interior
property line and at a slight angle. So,

698
01:07:40,880 --> 01:07:47,680
it results in a building setback that
does not comply with our current zoning.

699
01:07:45,200 --> 01:07:52,240
Um our staff have reviewed the
application and it complies with all the

700
01:07:49,680 --> 01:07:55,599
other zoning regulations. Um the
building footprint will also not be

701
01:07:54,000 --> 01:08:00,960
increased. They're using the existing
footprint to build upward on the home.

702
01:07:58,160 --> 01:08:06,400
Uh the variances are needed because we
approved our new variance criteria and

703
01:08:03,599 --> 01:08:11,200
it exceeds that 20% threshold at which a
variance can still be considered minor.

704
01:08:08,880 --> 01:08:14,799
Um and also the local government act
dictates that you can't increase a

705
01:08:13,280 --> 01:08:20,960
nonconformity. So the variance would
help to bring it into uh conformity.

706
01:08:18,000 --> 01:08:25,920
And um their variances would also help
retain an existing home in the uphill

707
01:08:23,199 --> 01:08:29,839
neighborhood. Um and staff have concerns
that uh requiring the applicant to

708
01:08:28,159 --> 01:08:34,960
adhere to the setback could create
undesirable outcomes for the streetscape

709
01:08:32,400 --> 01:08:40,400
by creating an asymmetrical
uh facade um or resulting in an

710
01:08:37,839 --> 01:08:46,159
unfavorable demolition on the block. Uh
we circulated uh notice to the neighbors

711
01:08:43,359 --> 01:08:50,560
and we received uh four comments in
favor and one comment in concern as well

712
01:08:48,880 --> 01:08:55,359
as our other city staff and departments
and no concerns were noted. So I'll take

713
01:08:52,719 --> 01:09:00,480
any questions. Council Tate,
>> I have a question about when the houses

714
01:08:58,799 --> 01:09:04,799
um get approved to be closer together
than would be our typical setbacks. Do

715
01:09:02,159 --> 01:09:08,319
they have to have different or higher
standard of fire separation on the

716
01:09:07,279 --> 01:09:12,560
outside?
>> Uh yeah, so they do have to meet the um

717
01:09:10,960 --> 01:09:16,880
BC building code. So the main
requirement that they have to adhere to

718
01:09:14,799 --> 01:09:20,159
is related to the fenestrations or
openings on the side of the building

719
01:09:18,400 --> 01:09:24,080
wall. So typically they have very
limited uh windows to prevent fire

720
01:09:22,319 --> 01:09:28,239
spread or no windows to prevent fire
spread. And then in addition um there

721
01:09:26,799 --> 01:09:36,080
are certain standards in the building
code that pertain to the roof eaves. Um

722
01:09:32,719 --> 01:09:40,799
and uh building staff and fire staff
looked at the proposal and they're

723
01:09:38,319 --> 01:09:43,600
satisfied with the requirements as
presented.

724
01:09:41,520 --> 01:09:46,159
» So it's not higher than a regular the
regular building code. It's just like

725
01:09:44,719 --> 01:09:50,080
the building code is good. It's solid.
We're okay. the closer you get to the

726
01:09:48,480 --> 01:09:53,520
property line, the more restrictions you
have.

727
01:09:51,920 --> 01:09:56,560
» Sometimes, I'm not sure in this case,
but sometimes they'll have to put

728
01:09:55,120 --> 01:09:59,360
non-combustible siding,
>> right?

729
01:09:57,120 --> 01:10:02,080
» So, the building code kind of addresses
those concerns when they get close to

730
01:10:00,719 --> 01:10:05,120
the property line.
>> Thank you,

731
01:10:03,920 --> 01:10:09,520
» Card.
>> Thank you, Mayor.

732
01:10:06,640 --> 01:10:13,120
» Um, I know there are I'm just looking at
this. I flew up this picture here and

733
01:10:11,280 --> 01:10:16,480
the
>> the closeness of the buildings. I know

734
01:10:14,640 --> 01:10:20,480
there's a there's quite a few an uphill
like this and I guess number one as

735
01:10:18,960 --> 01:10:25,199
councelor Tate said I was I'm always
concerned about fire how would you do

736
01:10:22,640 --> 01:10:30,800
this but I was also wondering about
repair and if it's so tight like how do

737
01:10:28,560 --> 01:10:35,440
you get in there to repair? What does
the building code say about these kind

738
01:10:33,360 --> 01:10:40,480
of situations? because it would almost
seem like you'd have to go in from the

739
01:10:37,920 --> 01:10:44,400
inside out to repair because you
couldn't actually you might be able to

740
01:10:41,920 --> 01:10:49,199
just fit in here but there are some that
are like three or four inches away from

741
01:10:47,440 --> 01:10:55,120
the next movement.
>> Yeah. Um that is a fair complaint.

742
01:10:51,840 --> 01:11:00,560
Typically um when a building sits in a
really close threshold to the property

743
01:10:57,120 --> 01:11:04,239
line um there isn't any requirement to
establish like an easement. So, an

744
01:11:02,719 --> 01:11:10,640
easement is a legal agreement that
allows people to maintain their property

745
01:11:06,159 --> 01:11:14,800
by accessing by another property. Um, in
this case, because the building is fully

746
01:11:12,800 --> 01:11:19,040
located on that, even though it's really
close to the property line, there is no

747
01:11:16,560 --> 01:11:22,640
easement registered. Um, but the
neighbors do have quite a good

748
01:11:20,640 --> 01:11:26,400
relationship with their their neighbor
and they've uh been very collaborative

749
01:11:25,040 --> 01:11:30,320
and sort of communicating the
construction in a way that works with

750
01:11:27,760 --> 01:11:36,000
everybody. So typically we kind of rely
on just goodwill and good neighbor civil

751
01:11:33,679 --> 01:11:39,600
partnership for things like that. But in
certain situations there are legal

752
01:11:37,440 --> 01:11:40,880
agreements that maintain legal access to
that part of the building.

753
01:11:40,560 --> 01:11:43,520
» Okay.
>> Yeah.

754
01:11:41,199 --> 01:11:47,600
» Thank you.
>> I just have a question um as sort of a

755
01:11:46,000 --> 01:11:52,800
followup to what um councelor Pete was
asking around um fire and such and and

756
01:11:50,880 --> 01:11:56,159
building code.
When they do this extension, the

757
01:11:54,560 --> 01:12:01,360
extension has to comply with the
building code. They don't have to bring

758
01:11:57,840 --> 01:12:05,280
the house up to code cuz that would
never happen. I I mean I I own one of

759
01:12:03,440 --> 01:12:07,920
these. Like that would be
>> Yeah, that's

760
01:12:06,000 --> 01:12:12,960
» they just tear it down instead of
>> Yeah. No, that that's correct. So, we

761
01:12:09,760 --> 01:12:19,120
don't retroactively apply building code
um or uh zoning bylaw. Um it would be

762
01:12:16,800 --> 01:12:22,000
unreasonable to kind of retroactively
apply those requirements. So, just the

763
01:12:21,360 --> 01:12:24,640
new construction.
>> Just the new construction. I just want

764
01:12:23,120 --> 01:12:27,679
to be really clear about that because
when she was asking about its proximity

765
01:12:26,080 --> 01:12:31,840
and stuff and like it has to meet the
building code, it's like no, the the new

766
01:12:29,760 --> 01:12:35,920
has to meet the building code,
>> not not the not the old. I just

767
01:12:33,520 --> 01:12:40,400
» if you went to put new siding where the
existing sighting is, the new sighting

768
01:12:37,920 --> 01:12:44,400
would have to meet the building code of
the reduced setback.

769
01:12:42,239 --> 01:12:48,880
» I don't know. You are always allowed
under local act repair and maintain.

770
01:12:47,040 --> 01:12:52,239
Okay. I would have to check with the
building official too far into the

771
01:12:51,199 --> 01:12:54,480
building code.
>> Actually not allowed to.

772
01:12:53,520 --> 01:12:58,400
» Yeah.
>> But um but I could ask them and I could

773
01:12:56,480 --> 01:13:02,320
follow up an email just if you wanted to
know. But I think there might be a

774
01:12:59,760 --> 01:13:06,400
repair and maintain that you can do
>> new have to be the building.

775
01:13:04,080 --> 01:13:10,880
» So So in that example like
>> if the proposal had a new window and

776
01:13:08,960 --> 01:13:13,760
you'd be like we need to make sure it's
the

777
01:13:11,840 --> 01:13:14,880
» depending you may or may not be allowed
window.

778
01:13:14,320 --> 01:13:18,640
» That's right.
>> Yeah. Exactly. Like typically um when

779
01:13:17,040 --> 01:13:23,440
you're that close to the property line,
you either have to have a very reduced

780
01:13:21,360 --> 01:13:26,400
size or only a certain percentage of
windows can cover that side of the

781
01:13:24,880 --> 01:13:30,000
property or you have to have fire
shutters or something like that. So

782
01:13:28,400 --> 01:13:35,679
yeah,
>> I just wanted clarity on that cuz I was

783
01:13:31,600 --> 01:13:40,960
sort of thinking, okay, that's uh yeah,
the new the new will be up building

784
01:13:37,280 --> 01:13:44,480
code. Anyways, so uh councelor Paige has
a question.

785
01:13:42,560 --> 01:13:49,199
I'm curious about the the one concern
that we did get around the blocking and

786
01:13:46,960 --> 01:13:54,000
I have been hearing as we've been seeing
more of these buildings show up and take

787
01:13:51,280 --> 01:13:57,679
form that very tall blocking. There were
some good examples provided. I think

788
01:13:55,760 --> 01:14:03,040
other residents have pointed them out to
me as well and there's some stuff going

789
01:13:58,960 --> 01:14:09,040
on in Uphill. uh how can we start to
address the massing of those those third

790
01:14:06,480 --> 01:14:15,679
and second stories uh the way those
roofs are being peaked because this is

791
01:14:11,280 --> 01:14:22,239
all this will also be quite well as but
address that concern specifically and is

792
01:14:18,960 --> 01:14:27,920
there need for change in our approach.
Um so typically our zoning bylaws are

793
01:14:25,840 --> 01:14:33,120
what would help to regulate um the
massing uh in this particular instance

794
01:14:30,719 --> 01:14:37,440
the historic sighting of the house
typically it would be set back kind of

795
01:14:35,199 --> 01:14:42,880
in that invisible box that the zoning
creates um in a way that it doesn't

796
01:14:41,360 --> 01:14:48,000
impact sort of the neighboring
properties. But in this instance it's

797
01:14:44,880 --> 01:14:53,280
just too close to the property line. Um
if we were concerned with um sort of

798
01:14:51,120 --> 01:14:58,480
massing and shadow casting and things
like that, we could certainly uh look at

799
01:14:55,600 --> 01:15:01,840
our OCP design guidelines and zoning to
evaluate if any changes need to be made

800
01:15:00,480 --> 01:15:06,000
there. But those are typically the
avenues through which those things are

801
01:15:03,520 --> 01:15:09,199
addressed. So and single family homes
like this one, there's no design

802
01:15:07,520 --> 01:15:15,840
guidelines. You kind of just need the
rules in the zoning bylaw. um only big

803
01:15:12,640 --> 01:15:20,640
buildings um that you see downtown. Um
we like look more closely at the design

804
01:15:18,159 --> 01:15:25,520
of them. Um and sometimes we do also
like Sarah was mentioning for variances.

805
01:15:23,199 --> 01:15:29,600
Um
>> what are you guys hearing about that

806
01:15:27,920 --> 01:15:36,320
concern? Like that can't be the first
time you heard of the public say that

807
01:15:33,360 --> 01:15:40,960
buildings too tall and too blocky small
neighborhoods. I have heard that in the

808
01:15:38,560 --> 01:15:47,120
past and we have ever since we've had a
zoning bylaw. Um it has been 10 meters

809
01:15:44,080 --> 01:15:51,679
in height was allowed in the R1 overall
density which and now we've changed it

810
01:15:48,640 --> 01:15:55,840
to smallcale residential. I think uh now
our land is becoming more valuable and

811
01:15:54,239 --> 01:15:59,679
so people are kind of building up and so
I think you are seeing those taller

812
01:15:57,440 --> 01:16:03,679
homes. I think Nelson benefits from a
very eclectic building stock. So right

813
01:16:02,080 --> 01:16:08,000
next to it is a house that is going to
be the exact same height as this one.

814
01:16:06,320 --> 01:16:12,480
So, I think it's kind of a mix and I
think you'll see like a tall house um in

815
01:16:10,880 --> 01:16:16,080
an area where there's shorter houses and
I think those ones stand out a little

816
01:16:13,920 --> 01:16:20,159
bit more, but I think housing stock is
always kind of evolving and over time

817
01:16:18,159 --> 01:16:25,199
you'll see some of that older housing
stock be replaced or modifications made.

818
01:16:22,480 --> 01:16:28,719
But I do I do occasionally hear that
point and and I kind of mentioned that

819
01:16:27,040 --> 01:16:33,840
the rules have been substantially
similar for many many years. Um the

820
01:16:31,679 --> 01:16:37,840
other thing to note um in our most
recent iteration of the zoning bylaw, so

821
01:16:36,159 --> 01:16:41,840
we actually modified the way that we
calculate building height um as you may

822
01:16:40,400 --> 01:16:47,199
remember because we were finding that
the way we're calculating building

823
01:16:43,600 --> 01:16:52,000
height actually um was more beneficial
to sort of those flat more modern style

824
01:16:49,920 --> 01:16:56,400
roofs. So now the way we calculate um
makes it easier for people to have that

825
01:16:54,159 --> 01:16:59,600
pitched roof which can be more
consistent with the character especially

826
01:16:57,920 --> 01:17:04,400
that we see in lower uphill where
there's quite a lot of those open cable

827
01:17:01,520 --> 01:17:07,719
form roofs as well. So yeah.
>> Okay. Thanks.

828
01:17:10,080 --> 01:17:16,880
» Any other questions?
>> Okay.

829
01:17:14,239 --> 01:17:20,320
So
I I'll move one mayor.

830
01:17:19,199 --> 01:17:21,840
» Okay.
two.

831
01:17:20,800 --> 01:17:24,320
» Uh, yes, please.
>> Okay, I'll move one.

832
01:17:23,040 --> 01:17:28,480
» Is there a seconder?
>> Second.

833
01:17:24,960 --> 01:17:33,199
» Seconded by councelor Tate.
>> Uh, so this is uh section 10.

834
01:17:31,840 --> 01:17:37,679
» Oh, I think it starts above that and
there is only one. If you go back only

835
01:17:35,120 --> 01:17:41,840
one, sorry, that's one. Sorry.
Um that the application for the

836
01:17:39,760 --> 01:17:49,199
development variance permit be approved
to vary the requirements of zoning bylaw

837
01:17:44,239 --> 01:17:54,880
3652 2026 allowing for a new roof and
rear second story edition on following

838
01:17:52,480 --> 01:18:01,679
properties collectively known as 820
Victoria Street. Uh can we read all that

839
01:17:58,719 --> 01:18:04,560
for the record? The lot nine.
>> Oh no, we can probably pass those

840
01:18:03,600 --> 01:18:09,120
things. Okay,
>> that's all the pin the P ID numbers and

841
01:18:06,719 --> 01:18:14,640
such. And as follow, do you want me to
read this as follows then? Zoning B

842
01:18:11,600 --> 01:18:21,440
» number 3652 2026. This is number one
section 10

843
01:18:17,360 --> 01:18:28,239
12 R3 interior side lot line setback to
reduce the minimum required setback from

844
01:18:23,520 --> 01:18:34,800
the interior side property line from 1
uh meter to 0.52

845
01:18:31,440 --> 01:18:38,880
m. And this is number two section 51
section.10

846
01:18:36,960 --> 01:18:47,440
uh sitting exemptions to reduce the
allowable distance between roof eaves

847
01:18:41,040 --> 01:18:52,719
and property lines from 0.9 m to 0.7 m.
>> Okay. So that's been moved and seconded.

848
01:18:50,480 --> 01:18:58,880
All seeing no further questions. All
those in favor and that carries. Thank

849
01:18:55,920 --> 01:19:05,360
you counselors.
Moving on. Thank you staff.

850
01:19:02,800 --> 01:19:08,800
Moving on to the thing I usually make
the breakfast of information items

851
01:19:07,360 --> 01:19:15,679
including correspondence and meetings of
committees and commissions. And the

852
01:19:10,560 --> 01:19:19,120
first one I have up in my pile is the um
information items from council's

853
01:19:17,120 --> 01:19:23,199
committees and commissions. There are
seven of them. We have minutes from the

854
01:19:21,280 --> 01:19:27,920
cultural development committee, Nelson
Public Library, Nelson, two from Nelson

855
01:19:25,760 --> 01:19:32,560
Public Library, three from the Greater
Nelson Economic Development um group,

856
01:19:30,560 --> 01:19:38,080
two coordinating meetings, and an
advisory meeting, and we have the Nelson

857
01:19:34,960 --> 01:19:41,920
Housing Committee. Um they're all for to
be received for information. Is there

858
01:19:40,239 --> 01:19:45,239
anyone that wishes to draw one out for
further discussion?

859
01:19:45,360 --> 01:19:53,159
Seeing no hands shooting up. Is there a
mover of items 1 through 7 for

860
01:19:50,159 --> 01:19:53,159
information

861
01:19:53,280 --> 01:19:58,320
by councelor Woodward. Is there a
seconder?

862
01:19:55,440 --> 01:20:02,960
» Seconded by councelor Tate. So items 1
through 7 have been moved for um receipt

863
01:20:00,880 --> 01:20:10,239
for information.
Uh all those in favor

864
01:20:06,560 --> 01:20:14,880
post and that carries.
Thank you.

865
01:20:12,000 --> 01:20:20,000
Next up, we have information items um
proposed by staff and we have three of

866
01:20:17,440 --> 01:20:25,520
them here. We have development services,
we have finance, and we have um

867
01:20:23,199 --> 01:20:29,040
corporate services. Is there anything
that anybody wishes to pull out?

868
01:20:27,520 --> 01:20:32,880
Councelor Payne?
>> Um I think we need to pull out the

869
01:20:30,719 --> 01:20:36,640
development services
monthly

870
01:20:34,400 --> 01:20:40,480
build report.
>> Okay.

871
01:20:38,159 --> 01:20:44,159
So, we will pull that out. And is there
someone that would like to move item two

872
01:20:43,040 --> 01:20:47,280
and three?
>> We can move two and three.

873
01:20:45,600 --> 01:20:51,360
» Okay. Moved by councelor Tate, seconded
by councelor Woodward. All those in

874
01:20:49,440 --> 01:20:57,760
favor of receiving for information two
and three. And that carries. So here we

875
01:20:54,080 --> 01:21:02,239
are back at number one. Councelor Payne,
you have a question.

876
01:20:59,520 --> 01:21:07,520
» Yeah, I I actually emailed earlier today
to uh director of development services.

877
01:21:04,640 --> 01:21:13,520
Did I get that title right?
um about the numbers and she

878
01:21:10,800 --> 01:21:18,880
acknowledged that there was a a typo on
there. Um an email did go out to all of

879
01:21:16,480 --> 01:21:24,880
council, but I don't know what the
procedure is. Do we withdraw that report

880
01:21:21,760 --> 01:21:30,080
until we have the correct report or
>> we can just we'll amend the or just note

881
01:21:27,920 --> 01:21:33,920
that it will be amended with the
>> correct.

882
01:21:30,800 --> 01:21:36,159
» Okay, that was basically building.
>> Did I get that? That's

883
01:21:35,120 --> 01:21:40,239
» right.
an extra zero. So, where'd you put the

884
01:21:38,880 --> 01:21:41,840
extra?
>> Oh,

885
01:21:40,800 --> 01:21:45,600
» on the millions.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was like,

886
01:21:43,679 --> 01:21:50,199
» that got my attention.
>> Yeah.

887
01:21:46,719 --> 01:21:50,199
» I'm like, woohoo.

888
01:21:50,560 --> 01:21:55,280
» So, you want to just give the update so
>> Yeah.

889
01:21:53,679 --> 01:21:58,239
» We get it on record.
>> Uh the update. Yes.

890
01:21:56,719 --> 01:22:02,320
» So, the correct numbers and then that
everybody will hear it.

891
01:21:59,520 --> 01:22:07,840
» The update. Just one second here. Um but
basically an extra zero got added to the

892
01:22:05,760 --> 01:22:15,199
multi-unit residential building permit
numbers and so it said 75 million

893
01:22:09,840 --> 01:22:20,639
instead of seven um 7.5 million. Um and
then so I made so I did send council an

894
01:22:18,239 --> 01:22:25,199
email to that effect letting them know.
Then I've noticed so we draw that rep

895
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:29,360
report from a third party and their
numbers aren't kind of adding up

896
01:22:26,880 --> 01:22:34,000
necessarily. So, I need to work with um
city reporter to get that sorted out.

897
01:22:32,239 --> 01:22:37,920
So, some of the building permit numbers
are kind of not accurate. So, I'll be

898
01:22:36,400 --> 01:22:46,360
working with them on that. And then I
did provide council. The unit count

899
01:22:40,159 --> 01:22:46,360
though um is actually correct. Um

900
01:22:48,159 --> 01:22:53,679
» total for this period is got too many
zeros as well.

901
01:22:52,400 --> 01:22:58,080
» Yeah. So, we'll be reviewing that
report. We'll take it off maybe and then

902
01:22:55,679 --> 01:23:03,800
have it amended or we might have to make
our own report if that one's not working

903
01:23:00,239 --> 01:23:03,800
from the city report.

904
01:23:03,840 --> 01:23:10,600
» So just to make the correction there. So
that line that says total for this

905
01:23:06,400 --> 01:23:10,600
period is actually 8 million.

906
01:23:10,639 --> 01:23:14,400
» Yes.
>> It's just it's just for people that

907
01:23:12,880 --> 01:23:17,120
might be looking and listening.
>> What are you building?

908
01:23:15,440 --> 01:23:19,920
» And then and then
>> where are you putting it

909
01:23:18,320 --> 01:23:25,199
» your year today I imagine has a
significant change.

910
01:23:23,199 --> 01:23:29,920
I I have a question that riffs off of
that really nicely from our um from some

911
01:23:27,600 --> 01:23:35,600
other curiosities I've had. So I notice
on the BC provincial government website,

912
01:23:33,600 --> 01:23:41,679
you can Google like list of
municipalities in BC by revenue, list of

913
01:23:38,560 --> 01:23:47,040
municipalities in BC by VCC's and
building permit information. And so I

914
01:23:43,360 --> 01:23:51,199
was like, woo. Um and sometimes our cool
little municipality has zeros. And is

915
01:23:49,040 --> 01:23:55,440
that a reporting thing? Is it because we
might not like align with that? I maybe

916
01:23:53,920 --> 01:23:58,719
I'll send it out and you guys could talk
about it at another report. I'm like,

917
01:23:57,280 --> 01:24:02,080
how come we're zeros here? I don't think
we're zero. I think we're rad.

918
01:24:01,280 --> 01:24:05,920
» Okay, I'll pass it around.
>> I'll send you the link and I'll look

919
01:24:03,280 --> 01:24:08,880
into it. Um, it might I'm not sure if it
might be voluntary to provide that

920
01:24:07,920 --> 01:24:11,520
information.
>> There could be a threshold and because

921
01:24:10,239 --> 01:24:13,520
we're small, we don't meet the
threshold.

922
01:24:12,000 --> 01:24:15,520
» This is my question.
>> I think it's a th I think it's a

923
01:24:14,719 --> 01:24:19,280
threshold thing.
>> From your I don't think we're zero.

924
01:24:17,760 --> 01:24:22,800
Looking at government reports, I would
say we're not meeting the threshold.

925
01:24:20,719 --> 01:24:27,920
» Our planned acquisition
>> open.

926
01:24:25,199 --> 01:24:34,239
» Okay. Noting that those corrections um
will be made if somebody would like to

927
01:24:31,199 --> 01:24:39,760
move the development services report as
amended. Councelor Payne, is there a

928
01:24:36,880 --> 01:24:43,920
seconder? Councelor Lochenberg. All
those in favor of the report as that

929
01:24:42,159 --> 01:24:49,199
carries. Thank you for that.
>> Can I just ask one question out of the

930
01:24:45,920 --> 01:24:53,679
payables? Um, I think it was 179,000.
Does that mean the elevator's finished

931
01:24:51,600 --> 01:24:57,040
or is there a No, because it didn't seem
to be fully operational. I wanted to try

932
01:24:55,679 --> 01:24:59,120
it today. I thought, "Oh, we spent a lot
of money on the elevator. Let's check it

933
01:24:58,560 --> 01:25:00,719
out."
>> So, one is done.

934
01:25:00,159 --> 01:25:03,600
» Yeah.
>> Okay. The one is actually completed.

935
01:25:02,239 --> 01:25:05,920
» And they're working on the other one
now.

936
01:25:04,239 --> 01:25:09,199
» So, that would be a draw.
>> Yeah.

937
01:25:07,120 --> 01:25:13,600
» Yeah. No, I I thought it was higher in
the um budgeting and I went, "Whoa, did

938
01:25:12,000 --> 01:25:16,800
we save some money there?" But then I
saw only multiples. So,

939
01:25:15,600 --> 01:25:19,440
» all good. We'll get there.
>> Yes.

940
01:25:17,840 --> 01:25:22,719
» Um,
>> um, just now that they're fixed, um,

941
01:25:22,159 --> 01:25:24,960
» one's fixed,
>> one fixed,

942
01:25:23,280 --> 01:25:29,840
» one's fixed, and then the other one will
be fixed. Uh, what's the lifespan now on

943
01:25:27,679 --> 01:25:33,679
those fixed elevators? I
>> think those ones have been in there

944
01:25:31,280 --> 01:25:37,040
since the building was built. So, 50
years ago or whatever.

945
01:25:35,280 --> 01:25:41,920
» So, we get another 50 years.
>> No, maybe they aren't 30.

946
01:25:40,239 --> 01:25:44,800
» Maybe we don't use them that much. start
walking more

947
01:25:43,920 --> 01:25:47,280
» just just as a
>> they are a nice ride. Has anybody been

948
01:25:46,480 --> 01:25:51,440
in the new one now?
>> Yeah, that's why I went today. I went I

949
01:25:49,440 --> 01:25:56,960
want to see what I feel like.
>> I don't I don't get in and feel like

950
01:25:53,360 --> 01:25:59,520
this could be my last elevator ride.
>> Okay,

951
01:25:57,520 --> 01:26:03,840
» I'm holding my phone. No, I don't know.
>> Yeah, that's what I always think. I'm in

952
01:26:00,800 --> 01:26:05,520
here. Do I have a phone?
>> Okay,

953
01:26:04,159 --> 01:26:09,120
» that sensation anymore.
>> That was my question.

954
01:26:06,159 --> 01:26:13,679
» Um so, uh we have one more. We have the
um late item. And so the late item is

955
01:26:12,480 --> 01:26:16,960
connection fees and development.
>> So I have correspondence. I know it's it

956
01:26:15,679 --> 01:26:20,080
doesn't have its own little thing. So I
never know when to jump in with that.

957
01:26:18,320 --> 01:26:23,679
» Oh, I I had correspondence like she
passed that as number two. Like she

958
01:26:21,440 --> 01:26:28,239
passed two and three together.
>> Two and three.

959
01:26:26,000 --> 01:26:32,719
Oh, sorry. Under reports.
>> Yeah, under reports. We passed them.

960
01:26:30,560 --> 01:26:37,679
» Just a just a quick thing. I saw the
response to the lakeside washrooms,

961
01:26:35,520 --> 01:26:43,600
but my question was I thought we had
allocated some money in the budget to do

962
01:26:40,320 --> 01:26:47,840
an upgrade on those. Not this year.
>> We had um

963
01:26:45,840 --> 01:26:51,040
» it was a request then that we didn't
actually

964
01:26:48,320 --> 01:26:55,760
» we went to the regional district and
asked them if they would help fund that

965
01:26:52,880 --> 01:27:01,520
and they didn't put that in their
budget. That's the bad news. The good

966
01:26:57,920 --> 01:27:08,480
news is uh CBT has come out with a some
new grants. One's called uh the shore

967
01:27:04,800 --> 01:27:14,400
grant um which seems to be a good fit
for this. Uh there's planning money

968
01:27:11,120 --> 01:27:16,800
available. So we're going to do some to
understand um

969
01:27:15,360 --> 01:27:18,320
» I think I I did read that in the
response letter.

970
01:27:17,600 --> 01:27:21,760
» Right. So
>> I it was mainly the budget question that

971
01:27:20,000 --> 01:27:25,679
I was because I did see that we were
going for some CBT money but so some

972
01:27:24,000 --> 01:27:29,120
there is some action.
>> Yeah. So, we'll do the uh we'll apply

973
01:27:27,840 --> 01:27:32,159
for that grant. Hopefully do the
planning. We have to understand, make

974
01:27:30,480 --> 01:27:36,000
sure the structure and everything is
fine before we put a bunch of money into

975
01:27:34,159 --> 01:27:39,679
it. So, that's where we're at.
>> And then the other one was about the

976
01:27:37,520 --> 01:27:43,440
escooter letter. I didn't see a response
to that, but it didn't make sense to me

977
01:27:41,679 --> 01:27:48,000
that
a safety officer told him that he needed

978
01:27:45,520 --> 01:27:54,320
a license for his escooter because those
things are driving all over the place.

979
01:27:51,440 --> 01:28:00,880
You have pilot. You have to be approved
as a pilot community to legally have

980
01:27:58,400 --> 01:28:05,920
scooters in your town.
>> And we are not scooters.

981
01:28:02,639 --> 01:28:07,920
» Individuals can't own e scooters.
>> Well, they can

982
01:28:06,880 --> 01:28:10,159
» you just can't
>> they just can't ride them.

983
01:28:09,199 --> 01:28:13,040
» What's wrong?
>> Probably on a public road, right?

984
01:28:12,719 --> 01:28:16,480
» So,
>> you can ride in your driveway.

985
01:28:14,400 --> 01:28:19,440
» Are we driveway
>> and you can't ride them?

986
01:28:17,440 --> 01:28:24,239
» Are we ticketing those individuals? Some
of whom I know. Some are getting tickets

987
01:28:21,920 --> 01:28:28,639
like the individual was told.
>> Okay. So that is that's what I wanted to

988
01:28:26,639 --> 01:28:32,159
verify that is correct information.
>> That's correct. Yeah.

989
01:28:29,440 --> 01:28:36,880
» So do we want to become a pilot
community? Is that anything we should

990
01:28:34,239 --> 01:28:43,360
look at because it is a
>> conveyance and especially for like the

991
01:28:39,840 --> 01:28:48,400
individuals I know that own them are
down like they're going um what am I

992
01:28:46,560 --> 01:28:52,320
trying to say horizontally. They're not
necessarily going uphill on those

993
01:28:50,000 --> 01:28:57,360
things. Can you imagine coming down on
one? I'm scared on my ebike and I got my

994
01:28:54,800 --> 01:29:02,320
hands on the brakes the whole time. Um,
yeah, it's interesting. So, which

995
01:28:59,920 --> 01:29:06,920
department do we feed that into when we
have the next opportunity to do so?

996
01:29:07,360 --> 01:29:13,840
» Sarah, some info, some
>> So, it would come, you pull it out.

997
01:29:12,320 --> 01:29:17,679
» You can pull it out. I'm just thinking
no. And then we'll bring it back to

998
01:29:15,520 --> 01:29:22,960
council at the next regular meeting. So
in August for you can make a decision.

999
01:29:20,639 --> 01:29:25,679
You can read it. We haven't responded to
them, but you can make a decision about

1000
01:29:24,560 --> 01:29:30,719
whether or not
>> you'd like staff to move forward

1001
01:29:28,320 --> 01:29:35,280
to become a pilot community.
>> Yeah. I mean, it'd be interesting to get

1002
01:29:32,639 --> 01:29:38,480
the um opinion of development services
as far as active transportation if

1003
01:29:36,880 --> 01:29:43,600
that's anything that has been considered
in the past. But I just wanted to while

1004
01:29:41,280 --> 01:29:47,360
it was there in front of me understand a
little better because yeah, I'm not

1005
01:29:45,120 --> 01:29:52,159
riding one. I've tried that in at the
active transportation conference and

1006
01:29:50,480 --> 01:29:55,920
that was pretty flat and I wasn't
totally comfortable with it myself.

1007
01:29:53,760 --> 01:29:59,840
» Councelor Paige,
>> uh, I don't want to convolute anything,

1008
01:29:58,480 --> 01:30:04,320
but I'm just going to go back to
something to talk about the bathrooms

1009
01:30:02,080 --> 01:30:09,920
and then I'm going to come back to that.
So, currently parks has referred off the

1010
01:30:08,080 --> 01:30:16,480
conversation about capital investments
to develop a set of principles. uh

1011
01:30:13,199 --> 01:30:20,560
workshop is on the 22nd uh of July. It
got moved around a few times, but we

1012
01:30:17,840 --> 01:30:24,080
finally locked in a time. Uh and
specifically around that contribution,

1013
01:30:22,719 --> 01:30:27,360
it's it's great that there's other
funding opportunities, but it's also a

1014
01:30:26,000 --> 01:30:33,440
leverage point. So, I just don't want to
lose that

1015
01:30:29,520 --> 01:30:37,840
moment to ask that question and get that
expectation nailed down from rural

1016
01:30:35,520 --> 01:30:40,800
directors about what a regionally
significant park is and why those

1017
01:30:39,280 --> 01:30:46,960
contributions should be part of our
principles. uh and that project is you

1018
01:30:43,840 --> 01:30:51,520
know the the catalyst for that. Uh and
then

1019
01:30:48,400 --> 01:30:55,679
» CBT grant isn't 100% either. So
>> yeah so we'll keep hammering away at

1020
01:30:53,679 --> 01:31:00,880
that and it'll be good to know that you
know on this year principles aside the

1021
01:30:58,800 --> 01:31:06,320
the the ask will be smaller but we'll
try and get to the principles.

1022
01:31:02,880 --> 01:31:11,600
Uh and then on the other piece, I don't
like I I think right now I think on our

1023
01:31:09,280 --> 01:31:17,360
mobility side of things, I really want
to see us really manifest well good

1024
01:31:14,960 --> 01:31:22,560
training, good uh compliance around
safety. I'm am very concerned about the

1025
01:31:20,800 --> 01:31:27,280
number of severe injuries that we're
seeing in other communities and and I

1026
01:31:25,199 --> 01:31:30,239
don't want to necessarily embrace
another product out there

1027
01:31:29,120 --> 01:31:35,600
» on scooters.
>> The escooters Yeah. like and I was using

1028
01:31:33,040 --> 01:31:39,920
them at SCM too and I'm all fine. I just
like it's just one other kind of

1029
01:31:37,199 --> 01:31:44,159
distinctly different product out on the
streets out on the sidewalks. Sarah

1030
01:31:42,800 --> 01:31:46,880
seems to have a question.
>> Not a question, just a comment.

1031
01:31:45,760 --> 01:31:50,400
» Yeah,
>> let's discuss it. I think it can be

1032
01:31:49,760 --> 01:31:51,920
debated.
>> Let's bring it up when it's brought

1033
01:31:51,440 --> 01:31:55,159
forward.
>> Okay, great.

1034
01:31:55,920 --> 01:32:02,880
Okay. So, um
there's been a

1035
01:32:02,080 --> 01:32:10,159
» late item now,
>> a recommendation from councelor Payne to

1036
01:32:07,840 --> 01:32:15,920
remove
um item number two from the

1037
01:32:12,639 --> 01:32:20,679
correspondence list.
>> How would you like that done? So,

1038
01:32:21,360 --> 01:32:29,440
um, when a letter is included in the
correspondence package, you as council

1039
01:32:26,719 --> 01:32:33,280
have can pull it out and then we will
place it on the next regular meeting

1040
01:32:31,199 --> 01:32:38,480
agenda at which time we will vote on
whether or not you approve of it or want

1041
01:32:36,000 --> 01:32:42,480
us to how you want us to respond or in
this case whether you want us to apply

1042
01:32:39,920 --> 01:32:48,480
to the province as a pilot community.
you will direct us and then you'll see

1043
01:32:45,360 --> 01:32:50,960
it in the next correspondence package.
So, we don't need

1044
01:32:49,120 --> 01:32:53,679
» No, you want the direction I'm confused
now. Do you want the direction now?

1045
01:32:52,719 --> 01:32:56,080
» No,
>> I don't.

1046
01:32:54,719 --> 01:32:58,960
» I want I I don't
>> Would you like What? What would you like

1047
01:32:57,280 --> 01:33:03,120
the motion to be?
>> I wouldn't like anybody to motion

1048
01:33:01,120 --> 01:33:07,920
» at this point. Just that we're pulling
it out because council has the right to

1049
01:33:06,000 --> 01:33:12,080
pull out anything in correspondence that
they try to.

1050
01:33:10,400 --> 01:33:14,400
» Excellent. It's just that, you know,
we've been trying to go back and forth

1051
01:33:13,199 --> 01:33:16,719
to make sure that while we're directing
staff to do something that we have a

1052
01:33:15,679 --> 01:33:20,000
resolution.
>> This is a little bit different to me

1053
01:33:17,840 --> 01:33:23,520
that this is pulling something out
>> and we're going to get a resolution, but

1054
01:33:21,679 --> 01:33:28,239
we're not making we're not voting on it.
Okay.

1055
01:33:24,639 --> 01:33:31,679
» Okay. Perfect. I'm good. I'm golden.
Anything else in correspondence, which

1056
01:33:29,600 --> 01:33:33,760
we already passed once, but perhaps we
need to pass the correspondence package

1057
01:33:33,040 --> 01:33:38,080
again. Are we good?
>> I hope we miss it. Maybe the next one.

1058
01:33:36,639 --> 01:33:42,400
» I'm I'm fine with it.
>> Okay, that's fine. I'm good, too, cuz we

1059
01:33:40,000 --> 01:33:49,840
didn't pass it. So okay all golden
there. So moving on to the last item

1060
01:33:45,679 --> 01:33:53,440
which is a laid item and regarding
connection fees and development cost

1061
01:33:51,199 --> 01:33:57,280
charges. So staff have identified an
opportunity to review and modernize the

1062
01:33:55,040 --> 01:34:00,239
city's current connection fee framework.
Existing fees were established more than

1063
01:33:58,880 --> 01:34:03,760
20 years ago and have not been
comprehensively reviewed during that

1064
01:34:01,760 --> 01:34:08,239
time. Given changes to the principal
legislation, development practices, and

1065
01:34:06,080 --> 01:34:12,080
municipal infrastructure planning, staff
believes that it's timely to assess the

1066
01:34:10,080 --> 01:34:15,760
city's current approach and ensure it
remains aligned with current standards

1067
01:34:13,600 --> 01:34:20,320
and best practices. As part of this
review, staff are proposing to evaluate

1068
01:34:17,760 --> 01:34:24,000
development cost charges, a framework
commonly used by local governments

1069
01:34:21,760 --> 01:34:27,120
throughout British Columbia. The review
will help inform future council

1070
01:34:25,520 --> 01:34:31,520
decisions regarding the city's long-term
approach to development related

1071
01:34:28,960 --> 01:34:35,360
infrastructure funding. Council is being
asked to rep prioritize the development

1072
01:34:33,360 --> 01:34:39,600
services work plan to undertake this
review in 2026 and defer the planned

1073
01:34:38,159 --> 01:34:44,400
update to the subdivision and
development services bylaw.

1074
01:34:42,800 --> 01:34:49,600
So
um we have a recommendation in front of

1075
01:34:46,239 --> 01:34:54,159
us is a mover councelor Payne seconded
by councelor Woodward. Council pay uh

1076
01:34:52,480 --> 01:34:59,360
that council direct staff to undertake a
review and modernization of the city's

1077
01:34:56,560 --> 01:35:05,600
connection fee framework including
evaluation of a development cost charge

1078
01:35:02,320 --> 01:35:11,840
known as a DCC framework and rep
prioritize the 2026 development services

1079
01:35:08,960 --> 01:35:17,840
work plan by deferring the subdivision
and development services bylaw update

1080
01:35:15,199 --> 01:35:24,960
and further that staff be authorized to
reallocate existing budgeted funds as

1081
01:35:21,600 --> 01:35:28,800
necessary to complete the review and the
council with findings and

1082
01:35:27,040 --> 01:35:31,800
recommendations for future
consideration.

1083
01:35:32,480 --> 01:35:42,520
» Perfect. Any um questions or concerns to
staff while we have them here with us?

1084
01:35:42,800 --> 01:35:48,320
Oh boy, we're all quiet. We're getting
Are we setting a new record? 8:25. Uh

1085
01:35:47,840 --> 01:35:53,840
yeah,
>> not quite a new record. Anyhow, um

1086
01:35:50,880 --> 01:35:57,679
seeing no further um discussion or
concerns, I think this is a excellent

1087
01:35:55,440 --> 01:36:03,199
plan to move forward with this at this
time given the fact that the federal

1088
01:36:00,000 --> 01:36:07,679
government is looking at um funding and
resource allocation that may involve

1089
01:36:05,440 --> 01:36:10,880
some offsets for um development cost
charges or other things. We're hoping

1090
01:36:09,520 --> 01:36:16,080
that they're going to be flexible with
their with their money and not just be

1091
01:36:14,239 --> 01:36:20,800
locked into one particular aspect. But I
think that uh getting this work done

1092
01:36:18,000 --> 01:36:23,120
will be excellent then um moving
forward.

1093
01:36:21,760 --> 01:36:26,320
» I do actually have a question.
>> Okay.

1094
01:36:24,080 --> 01:36:32,000
» Can I can I just get a little example of
this? Like I'm thinking of the Trevor

1095
01:36:28,480 --> 01:36:38,960
Street extension. So that developer paid
for the whole thing,

1096
01:36:33,840 --> 01:36:46,320
» but they will pay connection fees
because it's prior to this new change.

1097
01:36:43,600 --> 01:36:51,600
Um, and
they won't pay

1098
01:36:49,040 --> 01:36:56,320
development cost charges obviously that
contribute to the rest of the community

1099
01:36:54,719 --> 01:36:59,840
the way this does. I'm not saying that
currently, but do you know what I mean?

1100
01:36:57,600 --> 01:37:03,679
They're they're they're similar. So, for
the Trevor Street development, they had

1101
01:37:01,679 --> 01:37:07,600
to both install the road, the
infrastructure.

1102
01:37:05,119 --> 01:37:13,199
» They also had to pay connection fees.
Those fees uh go into our reserves for

1103
01:37:10,560 --> 01:37:17,840
our utilities. DCC's are going to be
similar to that. Yeah, just

1104
01:37:15,440 --> 01:37:19,679
» that's just one example of how that
works.

1105
01:37:18,719 --> 01:37:24,719
» All right. Yeah,
>> I I was pretty sure, but I just wanted

1106
01:37:21,600 --> 01:37:30,400
to clarify. Thank you.
>> Okay, seeing no further questions or

1107
01:37:27,360 --> 01:37:33,760
concerns. All those in favor and that
carries. Thank you, council. Thank you,

1108
01:37:32,400 --> 01:37:37,679
staff, for staying. Thank you for
bringing forward this late item so that

1109
01:37:35,760 --> 01:37:40,400
we can get that work plan adjusted
because this this plan will take

1110
01:37:39,040 --> 01:37:46,719
actually a little bit of time. So, this
isn't going to be done in 2026. This

1111
01:37:42,960 --> 01:37:50,480
will be going forward. Um, and the next
council will be making additional

1112
01:37:48,239 --> 01:37:52,560
decisions around DCC's, but at least
that work will be there for them to look

1113
01:37:52,159 --> 01:37:55,760
at.
>> That's right. And it'll be started this

1114
01:37:53,920 --> 01:38:00,800
year, uh, but it probably won't really
be kicked off until the end of the year,

1115
01:37:57,360 --> 01:38:05,199
early 2027. And I would anticipate about
a year.

1116
01:38:01,679 --> 01:38:08,639
» Yeah, exactly. So, just for anybody that
might be wondering how fast this kicks

1117
01:38:07,440 --> 01:38:12,400
in. So, there's going to be projects
that are in the mix that aren't going to

1118
01:38:10,000 --> 01:38:15,440
be affected by this at this time. I
think that's always a key thing. People

1119
01:38:14,080 --> 01:38:18,719
think, "Oh my god, they're adding more
charges and like I'm in the middle of

1120
01:38:16,719 --> 01:38:20,800
something." But stay in the middle of
something, you're not going to be

1121
01:38:19,840 --> 01:38:24,800
affected.
>> That's right. And there will also be

1122
01:38:22,239 --> 01:38:28,159
community engagement as well as builder
developer engagement. So, there'll be

1123
01:38:26,159 --> 01:38:31,119
lots of opportunities for people to come
and chat with us.

1124
01:38:29,199 --> 01:38:35,199
» Yeah, exactly. Thank you for that
additional information. Okay, council,

1125
01:38:33,679 --> 01:38:40,159
we've uh made it to the end of the
night. It was a very busy day and we

1126
01:38:38,480 --> 01:38:46,320
worked through dinner and uh I think we
got a lot done um this evening. So I'm

1127
01:38:43,679 --> 01:38:51,600
uh in favor of a resolution to adjourn.
>> Can I have a question before that?

1128
01:38:48,080 --> 01:38:57,280
» Sure. So I know we've gone alternate um
meetings for council reports but we

1129
01:38:54,159 --> 01:39:03,719
normally have a CIO report at each
meeting. So we don't have one today.

1130
01:38:59,600 --> 01:39:03,719
» No agenda. Okay.

1131
01:39:03,920 --> 01:39:09,920
» Okay. But that is our normal. We do
normally get a report every meeting.

1132
01:39:07,840 --> 01:39:13,760
Okay. So, this is an anomaly. Look
forward to hearing more from you in two

1133
01:39:11,840 --> 01:39:18,000
weeks.
>> Okay. So, if I could have a motion to

1134
01:39:15,920 --> 01:39:22,159
adjourn and council, second by councelor
Panero, all those in favor and that

1135
01:39:21,440 --> 01:39:25,600
carries.
>> Shoot. I did want to ask for like what

1136
01:39:23,920 --> 01:39:29,520
was the final numbers at the FIFA event
that like the staff was just

1137
01:39:27,280 --> 01:39:33,920
unbelievable. There was the whole day.
It was so cool.

1138
01:39:30,880 --> 01:39:36,719
» Yeah. We estimated test number three.
>> Yeah,

1139
01:39:34,560 --> 01:39:38,960
» that garbage was just being picked up.
>> Yeah, definitely was great.

1140
01:39:37,679 --> 01:39:42,960
» It was so cool.
>> Did such a good job.

1141
01:39:40,560 --> 01:39:46,800
» Did such a good job. like that.
>> I think probably some of the people were