[clears throat]
Is is that on the close session comment?
Okay.
>> Feel like we got to get a better table
for Brian. No, that's perfect for him.
It's like the little kids table at
Thanksgiving.
[laughter]
[snorts]
Okay. Call the special meeting of the
San Clemeni City Council for August 18th
order, noting that all five council
members are present.
>> Okay. And you're ready to recess to
close. Is there a motion to recess to
close session?
>> Move.
>> I'll second.
>> We have a motion by Council Member
Cabral, second by Council Member Amire.
All in favor? I.
» [snorts]
>> You got one of your
[snorts]
» [clears throat and snorts]
» Okay, mayor, it is 5:30. Would you like
to start the business meeting?
>> Absolutely. We'll call the San Clemen
City Council meeting for August 18th to
order.
>> And we will start with the invocation
given by Pastor Jim Wilkey with Calvary
South OC.
» Thank you for this uh honor and
privilege. Heavenly Father, we uh we are
reminded in your word in first uh first
Timothy and second Timothy that uh we
are to pray for those who are in
authority. So today we lift up our
mayor, our city council members, our
staff, our police officers,
firefighters, and all those who will
being entrusted in serving this great
community. Lord, give our leaders wisdom
beyond their own understanding. Help
them to make decisions with integrity
and courage and humility and a genuine
concern for the people they serve.
Lord, we also just ask that you would
give them the courage u to make
decisions that uh there might be
disagreement. Lord, give them civility
in their dis in the way they discuss and
um among them and among the citizens
that bring their questions and concerns.
Lord, may our city be a place where
families can flourish, where people can
worship freely, where businesses can
prosper, where our streets are safe, and
where our neighbors look out for one
another. Lord, we thank you in all these
things and give you praise and glory.
Amen.
>> Amen. Thank you, Jim.
>> Thank you.
>> Is Sophia de Rocher from the high school
here someplace? Want to come up and lead
us in the pledge? Uh, Sophia.
>> Okay. Up there.
>> Oh, okay.
>> So people can see you better.
>> Okay. Hello.
>> Place your right hand over your heart.
Ready? Begin. I pledge allegiance to the
flag of the United States of America and
to the republic for which it stands, one
nation under God, indivisible, with
liberty and justice for all.
Okay, real quick, Madame Clerk, before
we go to the special uh presentations, I
want to remind everybody this is the
second meeting we have where we do uh
accept uh oral communications from
either Zoom or telephone.
And what we're going to do is the same
way we did the last meeting is we take
all the people that are here in person.
We take your cards first and then we're
when we're done with those then we
accept the oral communications for
people who are not present. So if that's
clear to everybody then we can continue.
» Okay. Um next item on the just roll call
and we will note that everyone is
present. All council members are
present. Next item on the agenda is
special presentations and the first
presentation is recogn rec recognition
of humanitarian award recipients Sophia
D Roshi and Ryan Quinca and I have
plaques for both of them. Mayor,
[applause]
Sophia, congratulations. This one's for
you. Um so uh this is uh because of all
your humanitarian work that you've been
doing throughout the city. Uh these
applicants apply for this through the
city and then our our uh committee on
human resources or uh human affairs uh
then goes through this and and uh looks
at all their applications, looks at all
of what they've done. They've nominate
these through the city for our youth. So
whereas the community safety and welfare
committee of s of the s city of San
clemeni recognizes the outstanding
student leaders who have furthered
mutual respect among fellow students and
fostered multicultural understanding.
And whereas Sophia de roucher has
demonstrated a desire to make a
difference through involvement with
numerous organizations and volunteer
efforts in the sami uh community. Now
therefore, Mayor Rick Leler of the city
of San Clemeni, acting on behalf of the
city council and the citizens of San
Clemeni, do hereby recognize Sophia Dur.
Congratulations. [applause]
» Sophia, why don't you hang on for a
second? We'll get Ryan up here, too.
Then we'll take a picture.
>> Oh, well, there you are. Okay.
>> Uh Ryan, uh my name is Steve Nobel. I'm
the mayor pro town. I'm honored to read
this. It says, "Whereas the community
safety and welfare committee of the city
of San Clementi recognizes the
outstanding student leaders who have
furthered mutual respect among fellow
students and fostered multicultural
understanding. And whereas and whereas
uh Ryan Quinca has demonstrated a desire
to make a difference through involvement
in numerous organizations and volunteer
efforts in the city of San Clemente and
our community. Now, Rick Leler, on
behalf of the entire city council, and
as the mayor prom, I uh uh will honor
you with this uh acting on behalf of the
city of San Clemeni and the citizens of
uh of San Clemitty recognize you, Ryan,
for the work that you've done and the
participation that you've done in our
community. So, thank you very much and
God bless you.
>> [applause]
» Sorry, I'll get out of the way.
» Congratulations.
>> Thank you.
>> Congratulations, Sophia.
Congratulations. Congratulations.
>> Thank you.
Thank you.
>> So, we're doing the other re want to
stick here for a second here.
>> We got the outgoing.
>> Okay. Next item on the agenda is
presentation of commendations to
outgoing commission and committee
members in recognition of their service
and commitment to the city of S.
Clemeni. From the arts and culture
committee, we have Nicholas Craze, Kathy
Kohler, and Joshua Pascowitz. Beaches
Parks and Recreation Commission, Sherry
Grace, Teddy Khan, Alyssa McCann,
Matthew Schmidt, and Dee Van Nort.
Community Safety and Welfare Committees,
Stuart Anderson, and Tom Hazelton. Golf
Course Committee, Mandy Hamilton.
Planning Commission, Gary McConn, and uh
that is it. If you you've received your
files,
>> if you're here, why don't you step up
here? We'd like to acknowledge you. Get
a get a great photo here. [applause]
How's it going?
Just want to say real quick, all these
members of our committees and
commissions put in a lot of volunteer
time to to do really great work for the
city. They meet, they come up with great
ideas to help the city, reduce staff
time, and anyway, it takes a lot. And
these people that are going out, we're
going to we're going to miss them all.
And hopefully we put in their their
people, the replacements, are going to
do the same kind of job. But anyway,
these are the people that really really
are unbelievable the the in the the city
who put in just so much time. So, let's
give them another big round of applause.
[applause]
This is going to be my Christmas card.
So, everybody everybody smile now.
Yeah, we're gonna take a selfie.
» Okay, let's take a selfie. Just real
quick.
>> Oh, Josh got the selfie. [laughter]
» I expect to see that on Facebook, Josh.
>> Oh, [laughter]
hey. Well, thank you guys so much.
>> Thank you so much. [applause]
» Thank you. Excuse me.
» Next item on the agenda is presentation
by S. Clemen Police Services Chief
Shioalier uh presenting the Orange
County Sheriff's Department annual
report.
>> All right.
» Good evening, Mayor Laughler, members of
the city council and city staff. My name
is Justin Shabbay. I'm the captain and
chief of police services for the city of
San Clemeni. We do have a presentation
that uh my amazing staff put together.
It'll be right up on your guys' screen.
So, first off, I want to say that what
you guys are going to see in this report
is a reflection of the collective
efforts not only from police services,
but everyone involved in the city.
Specifically, uh Andy Hall, the city
manager, the entire city staff, and I
want to shout out to Troy and Carly. At
the end of the presentation, I will be
giving uh some details on the um the
amount of work that they have been
contributing to regarding homelessness
in the city of San Clemeni. So uh with
that we can move on through the
presentation and this is going to be for
calendar year 2025. So January 1 through
December 31st. In total we had around
25,000 calls for service and out of that
25,000 10,000 were of proactive. And
just so we can kind of put it in
layman's terms. That's just about a
little less than half um the deputies
that work here in the city. They're
going out and they're looking for stuff.
Um the other amount of that which is
around 14,000 or 15,000 those are calls
for service that the city gets. Um, and
we are the busiest city in the entire
county as far as calls for services is
concerned. So, your guys' dollars are
going to good work here. Let me go to
the next slide.
And again, one of the things that I
wanted to institute when I got here uh
early last year in February of 2025 is I
wanted to make sure that the deputies
were not at the station and they were
out in the streets being productive and
proactive in the patrol and they have
absolutely accomplished that in the the
calendar year of 2025. Next slide,
please.
These are just some of the the photos
that are appropriate um that we can
share here, but this doesn't really show
the amount of work that the deputies put
in. I think overall in uh calendar year
2025, we seized hundreds of pounds of
illegal narcotics, but again, we wanted
to make sure this was appropriate for
all the kids viewing uh the presentation
tonight, but our guys do and gals do a
really, really good job. Next slide,
please.
Okay, as you guys can see going back to
the year 2022, crime has steadily
decreased in the city of San Clemeni.
And again, that is obviously we are the
public safety uh uh leaders, if you
will, when it comes to policing here in
the city, but it's a collective effort
with all the city leadership and
everyone that's involved in public
safety in the city. So, we're hoping to
have an additional decrease in 2026 and
so far it is looking like that, but as
you can see, that's record lows over the
last decade. Next slide, please.
One of the things that's near and dear
to my heart is community outreach. We
have an amazing community outreach team
that includes our crime prevention
specialist, staff specialists, and
office specialists, including a lot of
deputies, our ad administrative deputy,
and school resource officers. Um, we now
have two um that go out and are
routinely in the community conducting uh
positive uh interactions with community
and law enforcement. Our national night
out has been a success year-over-year.
It's coming up again October 16th, and I
hope to see all you guys out there. will
have a really really good showing of
resources that the Orange County
Sheriff's Department brings to you guys'
city. Next slide, please.
So, looking ahead, we're going to
continue to reduce crime. Um, one of the
things I wanted to do was increase our
business uh watch program. It's just
like neighborhood watch, but for
businesses because they're just as
valuable as the residents here in the
city. So, we want to make sure that we
continue to strengthen that uh
relationship that we have with him.
Obviously, crime, uh, we want to
continue to reduce that and emergency
response to things. I believe community
development director Adam Tamian has put
together a really good team when it
comes to emergency preparedness and
emergency management and we're going to
continue to work well with them so that
way when something bad does happen in
the uh in in the emergency management
realm we're working together and it's
not going to be the first time that we do it. We do practice regularly. We
have a meeting actually coming up for
fires. Um and that is something that we
have been doing monthly uh to make sure
that we're completely prepared for any
emergency incident that does occur. Next
slide please.
Uh just a couple plugs. We do have an
option for you guys to register the
locations of some of your private
cameras that you guys do have. Um it's
residential and commercial and it does
not mean that Big Brother is going to be
watching uh by any means, but if there
is a crime that does occur, it's going
to provide our team the ability to see
where a camera location is. My
department would then reach out to you
and ask if you could personally provide
the video to us. So, we wouldn't be
installing any sort of devices or
anything like that. It's merely just a
location uh for a camera if a crime is
to occur in an area where that camera
is. And that's our uh real-time
operation center uh up in Tustin. That
would would be kind of the forefront of
that. Next slide, please.
Our ebike uh rider program has been
extremely successful in the city. Um,
we're going to continue to push that
with education as well as aggressive
enforcement. Uh, because the last thing
that we want is anyone to get hurt or
anyone to continue to think that it is
okay to violate the rules of the road.
Um, so with the public safety, the
education, awareness, and enforcement
that we have done this past year, in
2025, it's going to continue in 2026,
and we're going to hope that we never
have any major incidents regarding
ebikes, uh, collisions or illegal riding
in the city that that become a problem.
Next slide, please.
follow us on social. And then there's a
couple stats that aren't going to be on
here that I wanted to share with you
guys. Um, back when I first got here in
February of 2025, we had over 50 uh
people experiencing homelessness in the
city. With the efforts of Troy and
Carly, the city, and obviously in
partnership with the sheriff's
department, we've been able to reduce
that number to 10 and that is as of this
month. Um, and again, that's through
outreach efforts getting finding them
housing and of course enforcement of the
uh many municipal codes and laws that we
have here available to us in the city.
Uh an additional number and stat that is
available um readily available if you
guys ask is our priority one response
time. Last year uh our priority one
response time was 4 minutes and 41
seconds. Uh in 2025 we got that down to
4 minutes and 35 seconds. So every
second counts and yes that's only 6
seconds. But again 6 seconds could be
the difference between life and death.
And because of the proactiveness and the
partnership that we have with the city
and our deputies doing an excellent job
being out there in the streets, we've
been able to get that time down to a
pretty good amount. I I think we are
leading in that category for the entire
county as well. So with that, appreciate
you guys. It is a pleasure to serve the
city of St. Clemenia as Elizabeth
Mitchell would say, but I'm here for any
questions if you guys have them.
>> Thank you, Chief, to start with.
[applause] Outstanding.
Have any questions or comments for the
chief? Yeah,
>> you know this issue, you know very well
because people have been writing to you
this past week about uh Los Ramblas and
uh and can you just give the community a
little bit of an update on on what's
happening there and and how you intend
to address that?
>> Sure. Now, in partnership with the city,
uh the resident uh that the residents in
the street that is affecting off of La
Rambla and the four beach patrol
deputies that we have instituted over
the last year, I think we're going to be
able to conduct a education uh uh I
don't want to call it a task force, but
it's going to be heavily enforced in
that area to make sure that that problem
does not continue because obviously it's
a beautiful view, but the resident uh
the residents of that street pay for
that beautiful view and they're entitled
to that. I
>> I I'm aware you're on top of it. Our
staff's on top of it, but I just want to
make sure the community knows that. Yes,
sir.
>> Things are being done.
>> Yes, sir.
>> Anything else?
>> Thanks, Chief.
>> Thank you.
[clears throat]
>> Next item on the agenda is council
member reports.
>> Anybody want to volunteer to kick it
off?
>> I I would actually u make a motion just
to say to ask that we move this to right
before um our uh consent calendar. uh
over the past few times we have gone
into 15 20 minutes of talking and and I
know that we have discussed before hey
keeping this to two minutes but we
cannot hold ourselves to that uh amount
so I would make a motion to move this to
right before consent
» Mark are you talking about this meeting
only or as a policy and going forward
>> just for this meeting meeting only and
then we can discuss this for a policy
going forward later if we if we so
desire
There's no
>> I'm good on it. I I I was second of
that.
>> You'll second it. Okay.
>> Okay. So, that's just for clarification.
So, you're saying for this meeting
>> just for this meeting to move it to
right before consent.
>> Okay. My my my feeling is if you if we
want to move it, we should have
discussion on it future agenda. That's
>> policy change.
>> That's fine. I was just put on itself,
but if we want to move it and discuss as
a future agenda item, we can.
>> But is it is it proper without
agendaizing the item that we that we
>> as I understand the motion? Um, council
meer just wants to move it for this
meeting, which is moving things around
on the agenda. That's proper.
>> Okay. So, we've had a uh a motion by
council member, a second by council
member Woo. All in favor?
>> I opposed. No.
>> Loses or fails three to two. Okay.
>> Okay. So, do you want to give your
council member report now or you want to
>> I I can go later.
>> You can wait. [laughter]
>> You just go for it.
>> No, no. I said you could wait till the
end if you want.
>> Let's go. Hey, Victor, you want to kick
it off?
>> I'll kick it off. Uh we had a meeting
with Love San Clemeni. We have a event
scheduled for
>> [snorts]
>> uh 912 of this year as you you'll all
know the the 25th anniversary of 911.
It's a it's a work uh uh volunteer day.
We're we're going to have uh [snorts]
the Love San Clemeni event beginning uh
on the 912 that Saturday. There's a [snorts] whole slate of of
volunteer opportunities. Take a look at
the Love San Clemeni website uh for the
Love San Clemeni school projects. We had
almost a thousand volunteers. We hope to
have at least that many for projects to
clean up our city. Uh we had a city
investment advisory meeting and I'll
leave it at that. We had a golf course
uh committee uh review of interviews for
the the the pro shop. Attended the
Fiesta Music Festival. We had last week
the OCTA study review session. Most of
you know what happened in that meeting.
Uh we had the arts and crafts fair this
past weekend.
We had the community engagement panel.
uh uh present draft presentation review
this week or meetings next week uh where
we're going to talk about the options
that are going forward for moving the
nuclear fuel out of San Clemente. I had
meetings with residents in SH Cypress
Shores about uh what's happening with
the parking down in South San Clementi.
Residents have been very concerned about
that. You got got together with
residents down there. A lot of it's been
cleaned up, but uh there's still ongoing
efforts to to clean that up. Had a
meeting with state parks down there,
Scott Kirby, about some projects that
we're working on to clean up the the
state parks. Also, that's it.
>> Great, Zen.
>> Thank you, Mayor. [snorts] Um on August
the 10th, attended OCTA Coastal Rail
Resiliency Study public listening
session. on August the 12th attended a
Skag gener connect so-called 2025
subcommittees meeting. It's the first
meeting to kick off the preparation for
the long-term planning document.
Um, also
I' I'd like to give a shout out to our
city manager Andy Hall and worked
diligently on the homelessness issue at
the south south end of El Camino Ria.
Um, I think we're getting close to a
some
we've made some temporary improvement.
It's not completely solved yet, but um
we're still working on a solution, but
um at certain time Annie may have
something to to share with the public.
Um lastly, Laura, do you have my
presentation? You can put Okay. Um, I'd
like to um report on the I'd like to
talk about the August 10th
the press conference experience in front
of the city hall. Uh, may I respect
request a brief extension beyond a
two-minut advisory time limit. Uh, on
Monday the 10th at 4:30, a press
conference was held in front of the city
hall. Um,
a few days earlier, the city manager's
office posted a notice on the city
website stating, as you can see on the
screen, city officials will be available
for comment beginning at 4:30 p.m. just
ahead of the 5:00 public listening
session on OCTA's coastal rail
resiliency study. This official news
release also promoted a letter written
by council member Cabra acting sortly in
his individual capacity.
Despite the promise of city officials
being available, I was never notified. I
attended anyway because I found it out.
Uh I want to make myself to you know
make myself available to the public as
expected
only to be told on the spot by council
member Cabra it's not your press
conference
even though other council members were
present.
Council member Cabra is entirely free to
hold personal press events in public
spaces whenever he chooses. My concern
is the borrowed legitimacy.
By using the city manager's office to
advance a personal message, he blured
the line between individual opinion and
official city policy.
We can hold a personal press conferences
or we can hold a city sanctioned event
where the entire council is properly
notified and consulted.
What we cannot do is to disguise a
personal media event as official city
function. This council never authorized
it.
Using public resources to present a
personal opinion of the city's official
stance damages public trust. This is a
failure of institutional propriety
and this council must have zero
tolerance for it.
Later in this mo in this meeting, I will
move to agenda as a policy change to
clarify our communications procedures
and I hope the rest of the council will
join me in this necessary review. If I
do not receive a second, I will issue my
findings as my own news release and I
would ask the city manager office to
accommodate his publication with the
exact same courtesy as council member
Woo's personal statement, not the
city's. Thank you. Thank you, Zen Mark.
Uh,
>> all I like to say is that it is a it is
uh back to school today. Uh, students
are back there and I want to just give a quick um uh
[clears throat] I want to say warning,
but to the parents who have ebikers
going out there, just a heads up that
our law enforcement are going to be out
there this week and next week uh really
looking for to make sure our kids are following the laws on those roads.
So, just be aware of that. Please talk
to your kids um about safe uh bike safe
biking and ebiking to schools.
>> All right, that's all.
>> Thank you, Mark.
>> Steve, yes, I attended the uh as one of
my colleagues has the several of our
colleagues have the Orange County uh
sand uh coastal resiliency meeting last
week. I also attended a Chamber of
Commerce ribbon cutting event for the uh
Severson event. And um I also had an
opportunity to drive once again in the
Orange County Fair Circ uh
demolition derby figure 8 race uh for
the second time and the second time I
actually came in first place which was
enjoyable. Wow.
>> Although the mayor had some problems
with his car. Uh
>> I saw I have a [laughter] Mr. Mayor
Proam I have it on good information that
they saw you tampering with my car
before the race even started. I want to
make a point of order on that right now.
>> I'm innocent. I'm innocent. It was a it
was a fun derby. We raised about $50,000
for Chalk Hospital. It was a lot of fun.
Um, uh, Stevenson also I attended for,
uh, Shelley, uh, Kindred the her, uh,
gathering for her at the OC Tavern. And
it's a good thing the the fire marshall
wasn't there because I'm sure we were
way way over the, uh, the, uh,
population limitation, but, uh, was a
wonderful event for Shelley who's having
some health issues, and it was nice for
the community to to acknowledge her. So,
>> awesome. My part.
>> Thank you. Well, Laura can put up my
slide of, you know, you've heard about
most of the things that happened in the
city, so I'll just put slide, but I want
to say that August 18th is an incredible
day in music history. In 1956, Elvis's
Hound Dog rose to the number one status
and was on number one for six months. In
1960, the Beatles made their first
public appearance in Hamburg, Germany.
And in 1969, as some of us remember, was
the last day of the Woodstock Music
Festival. Incredible day in music
history. And I thought maybe we would do
something. It's getting towards the end
of the summer here. And uh I wanted to,
you know, acknowledge just how
important, you know, music is in our in
our city. And I I was trying to think of
what to do. And then our city manager
said he was really a fran a fan of uh
brother is that's Israel Kamaka we o you
know as you all know one you know uh the
rainbow song you know yeah well brother
is so anyway I I'd like to come up and
maybe do a little homage to him and I'd
like I I could use some backups I'd like
anybody my fellow city council members I know the city attorney has you know a
great interest in music and maybe we
could do this real quick if you if you
wouldn't mind if you were indulging.
» By the way, my CD, it's a little old.
Don Ho sings the island hits with Rick
Leler. Is available on Apple Music.
Anybody wants to pick it up, I'm just
saying. So,
Happy birthday
to you. [music and singing]
» Happy birthday
[music] to you.
Happy [singing]
birthday [chanting]
dear Laura.
Happy birthday
to [singing]
you. [music]
ALL RIGHT
[applause]
TODAY.
I really know how to throw a party. All
right, Lois, first first order first
person on oral communications. Are you
singing?
>> My birthday song last.
>> Thank you, mayor. I appreciate that.
[laughter]
>> What about the backup group?
>> No songs from me.
>> Just some more hard facts about that 1%
sales tax increase on the ballot. The
sand replenishment and fire prevention
measure known as the San Clemeni natural
hazard protection and resilience act of
2026 will distribute the monies in the
following manner of the funds deposited
into the beach fund at least 70% must be
used for sand replenishment nourishment
beach erosion but what happens to the
other 30%. Why isn't all of it being
used for that? The fire protection and
wildfire preparedness fund is even more
mysterious. 50% is only deposited into
that legally restricted fund dedicated
exclusively to fire prevention,
emergency response support, and wildfire
risk reduction. It would include support
for OPA and other fire protection
services provided or contracted by the
city of San Clemeni. What other agency
besides OVA provides fire protection
services or are contracted by this city?
Resources to enhance wildfire readiness,
emergency response, firefighters. But
excuse me, don't we pay for this
already? Just ask our city manager or
the budget personnel about what
constitutes the largest expense in this
budget.
city administered long-term wildfire
prevention programs that include
planning, risk assessments, and
partnerships, vague terminology, to
reduce hazards.
The city without any expertise in this
area will carry out these programs on
both public and private lands. What are
they going to be doing on private lands?
citywide community outreach, education
and management and engagement programs
focused on wildfire prevention and
vegetation management across both again
public and private lands.
Would this include providing homeowners
that live on bluffs information about
how to prevent slides as is already
performed in other beach cities without
any increase in taxes?
And what happens to the other 50%.
Here is a breakdown of their taxes. If
we raise $10 million, $5 million will go
to the sand fund. 70% or 3.5 sand
replenishment. Dredging costs are about
$10,000 for a cubic yard. So we get 350
cubic yard of beach for that. But what
happens to the other one the other one
a.5 million and the $5 million placed in
the firerevention restricted fund? 50%
or 2.5 million is spent on fire
prevention. Specific programs are hinted
at, but there are no cost estimates.
Neither the city council nor its staff
have any expertise in this area.
>> Thank you.
>> What happens to the other two and a half
million?
>> Thank you. Like your shirt.
>> Okay, I'll call up the next uh few
speakers, Amanda Kinttonia, followed by
Susie Lance and Rick Rodriguez.
And um we'll start with those and then
we have a group of individuals.
>> Great. Good afternoon.
Um next slide please. So um last city
council meeting uh there was concerns
regarding how the process how certain
projects are pushed through. Um the
Victoria sidewalk widening was a concept
that has changed. It's undergone several
changes and um at the uh beaches parks
and recreation commission the staff
report um said of June the 23rd that the
fiscal impact the action had no cost
implications. Well, that's not true. Um
next slide please. Oh, also there was no
arborist report in that staff report. Um
according to the director of beaches
parks and recreation commission, she had
mentioned I do not have an arborist
report for the tree. Next slide please.
Um so um one of the concerns was this
was a capital improvement um program
project and it was from funding was from
the gas tax RMR fund which was approved
at the June 2nd um city council meeting
under SB1. However, uh in the beaches
parks and recreation commission agenda
staff agenda report it said no fiscal
impact. So there is a fiscal impact.
There is money coming from somewhere
which could have been used for some
other places like T Street Bridge. Next
slide please. So um one of the concerns
was that you wanted to expand the
Evanita Victoria to have more access on
um the sidewalk. However, here's two
areas. Um here's an area where two
parking spaces can be um placed for a
trolley line. So there's more space
there. There's benches over there. Uh
there's a bench there and you can put
move the other bench on the other side.
So you can you can have more room. The
meter parking can be restored on the
opposite side of the street which um we
had mentioned to Andy Hall at on the
June 3rd 20 June 23rd meeting that we
had uh down at the pier. Next slide
please. And so one of the things that
the San Pier Conservancy said is that
they mentioned a report an arburous
report uh that its canopy had already
been trimmed to improve um safety in the
stairwell but there was no arburous
report done and that I received
confirmation from the city manager
regarding that. Next slide please. So
also there was also a concern regarding
um on their web page it said um that
they wanted to minimize traffic
congestion but according to our city
engineers there is no traffic congestion
on a meeting of Victoria so there is no
data to support that. Next slide please.
So, um, one of the things that they
wanted to do is to restore the majestic
corridor, but if you could see here, the
little circles are those are the view
corridors, and it's not in front. Next
slide. And then I think I'm out of time.
Thank you,
» Susie Lance and Rick Rodriguez.
» Good afternoon, everyone. and I'm Susie
Lance with the San Clemente Chamber of
Commerce and I'm here with Rick from our
board of directors. Um, I wanted to just
take a moment to thank the council, the
city staff, and all the city partners
for supporting the 71st
Fiesta Music Festival last Saturday. It
was an incredibly safe and fun and
successful event. It was also a very
profitable event. We were really proud
to share that our beverage booth
gratuitities alone produced $10,000 in
tips and those will go back to our local
charities. In fact, we cut those checks
today and um those include some
charities such as Pet Project
Foundation, Fish for Life, uh Knights of
Columbus, and others. So, it's really
exciting to be able to give that money
out just a week later. Um the economic
impact was also really significant. and
a couple of restaurants shared that it
was their best day on record ever. So,
that was really exciting to hear. Most
importantly, people stayed downtown
after the event. They shopped, they
enjoyed the restaurants. Um, we had
really good behavior, which was
wonderful. Um, even the Myiramar um
shared that they had a really um
successful evening. People even went
down that way and enjoyed the food there
after the event. So, thank you, Rick.
Yeah, just want to say thank you to uh
city manager and council members who
were in attendance of the fiesta and
experienced it firsthand. It was awesome
to see you guys there. I know where came
up and gave some words about how San is
so great and why the fiesta is so
important to the community here. Um huge
thank you to the city staff that did
help with the planning and the setup and
everything like that. I mean without you
guys it would be really hard to do. And
thank you for the sheriff department for
having their presence there, for RSVPs,
for C. I mean, all these all these great
organizations that did help us help put
it on there. Um, and we are very proud
of what the fiesta delivered to St.
Clinton this year to our businesses and
nonprofits and our community. And we
hope that, you know, next year with the
72nd Fiesta that we can have the city
support again to put on a great
community event for the community. So,
thank you guys. Well, Susie and Rick,
let's thank the chamber for all the hard
work to put on [applause] an incredible
event. Thank you so much.
>> Yeah. Thank you guys.
>> Thank you.
>> I did have a question though about the Raiders booth.
>> Uh the Raiders booth. Yeah,
>> there there will always be a Raiders
booth. [laughter]
>> Always. Raider Nation. Go Mendoza.
Is that the last?
>> No. Um the next card has several
speakers on it, so I'll call you all up
at once. Lucy Inis, Juke Johnston, Lucas
Mora, Nate Noel, and I think it's Nathan
Wondreies. I can't quite get the last
name.
>> Are they here?
>> Are
>> Oh, okay. We're all going to come up
together. This is great. Okay,
Chief, look out for the They look like
they might be organized here. There's
something going on. Keep an eye out
here.
» Good afternoon. I'm uh Jake Johnson
representing San Clemeni Marine Safety
Department and we want to bring
attention to one important issue um that
will be lifeguard pay. Our message is
simple. San clemeny lifeguards should be
getting paid more. When we compare our
wages with other Southern California
beach cities, San Clemen has fallen
behind. San Clemeni lifeguards start at
approximately 2070 an hour. Meanwhile,
Huntington Beach pays roughly 2250 an
hour starting. Laguna Beach pays about
2372 and Newport Beach starts about
approximately 25 an hour with
experienced guards earning even more.
These are neighboring coastal
communities asking lifeguards to perform
many of the same critical
responsibilities we perform here in
Skeleman. [snorts] We understand that
not every department structure we
understand that every department
structures paid differently but the
overall trend is clear. Other
departments have increased wages and S.
Clemeny needs to catch up. And this
isn't just about comparing numbers.
Being a San Clemeni lifeguard means
being responsible for the safety of
thousands of residents and visitors. We
perform ocean rescues, respond to
medical emergencies, search for missing
children, manage dangerous surf
conditions, and make decisions in
seconds that can have life or death
consequences. Our compensation should
reflect that level of responsibility.
Competitive pay also helps San Clemeni
retain experienced lifeguards. Every
year guard returns, they gain more
knowledge of our coastline, currents,
surf conditions, hazards, and emergency
response systems. Those experienced
guards become leaders and train the next
generation. But when a lifeguard can
drive a short distance up the coast and
earn significantly more comp uh
comparable work, we risk losing
experienced people that this city has
invested years in training. We take
tremendous pride in working for San
Clemeni. Many of us, many of us grew up
on these beaches. We know this coastline
and we care about this community and
we're proud to protect it. But pride in
our department shouldn't mean accepting
below market pay. We're asking the city
to bring sleguard wages in line with
comparable departments. If Sany expects
professionalism, commitment, and a high
standard from its lifeguards, our pay
should reflect that standard. We're not
asking for special treatment. We're
asking to be paid competitively for the
work that we already do.
Additionally, we have a form signed with
26 current employees in favor of change
if you guys are willing to accept. Um,
we just wanted to shed some light on our
current situation. Thanks for listening.
Appreciate your time. And we got 30
seconds left. I'll hand off the mic to
lifeguard Mora.
>> Thank you.
>> Yeah, as you said, my name is uh Mora
Lucas Mora. Um, I'm not going to be able
to finish everything I have here, but I
just wanted to say how grateful I am
that I'm able to serve this community as
a lifeguard. Um, but I wanted to shed
light on how we're kind of losing
experience in our department. Usually
our senior towers, including tower five
at T Street and tower six at Linda Lane,
are staffed by much older guards, such
as fifth year lifeguards and above, and
they have second year or third year
lifeguards working as their secondary.
However, in recent years, especially
this past summer,
>> wait, he he can have three minutes also,
we've reset that to about 230 or
something like that. Go ahead.
Wonderful. Continue. I'm sorry. Yeah,
we've had um especially in these recent
years, we've had second year lifeguards
working these more advanced towers.
We've also had second years working as
junior lifeguard instructors and rookies
working towers that usually be staffed
by second and third year guards. And
while our younger lifeguards are being
held to a higher standard with far more
responsibility, we are not being
compensated for it. This year, as I'm
still in high school, I was honored with
the opportunity to work as a junior
lifeguard instructor and work in these
senior towers. And I'm a secondyear
lifeguard. While I'm grateful for these
opportunities, they also show that our
department is beginning to lose
experience. We have declining retention
of lifeguards, meaning that our
workforce is getting younger and less
experienced. Beyond that, we are simply
understaffed, causing us to be able to
be unable to open some towers on busy
days.
Furthermore, many of our older and more
experienced lifeguards have been leaving
the department for what they often call
big boy jobs because continuing to work
for our department simply is enough to
pay the bills. and then I'd like to pass
it off to Garnell.
>> And you can start the clock again.
>> Hi, my name is Nate Newell. I'm a
secondy year lifeguard. I'm super
honored to serve this community. I love
uh doing what I do, working at the beach
every day. I grew up here. Uh my family
has lived here for a really long time.
Um, this summer as a second year
lifeguard, I was tasked with working
tower five at T Street, one of the most
senior towers as the senior guard, and
tower six at Linda Lane as the senior
guard. And getting put in that situation
as a second year lifeguard is a super
stressful situation. And it just shows
that as a second year lifeguard, we're
losing a lot of experience because we
simply just don't have the money to keep
lifeguards working here. Like uh guard
Morris said, as guards get older, they
need to make more money. They need to
provide for themselves. And working as a
lifeguard here can't properly compensate
uh the cost of living. And I just wish
that we could be properly compensated
for the work that we do. And all the
lifeguards here know firsthand that if
we weren't on the beach, there would be
drownings. Every single summer, we make
multiple rescues and save multiple lives
like every day. And I just wish that we
were properly compensated for the work
that we do. Thank you guys.
>> Thank you.
>> Govern you guys hang for just one
second. M Mr. City Manager, I know we
had a conversation last week and while
you I don't know we have the ability
today to to bring them up where they
need to be, we certainly need to address
it. And was there some movement made in
that direction? Uh
>> yeah, we have some we have a meeting
actually coming up with the lifeguard
captain. I believe it might be as early
as tomorrow. I can't I'm not sure of the
date, but it's coming right up. we're
going to be discussing this issue.
>> Okay. And and yeah, especially in the
light of both the Congress and the state
legislature looking to certify
lifeguards as first responders, we we we
need to address that. We we have made
some steps recently. We used to be like
right at the top and then we went to the
bottom and now we're sliding down the
scale again and and we need to address
that. I I'm speaking for myself and I
know the city manager is is working on
this problem. It's a problem we have to
address.
>> Mr. Mayor, I just I just want to let
everyone know that this is public uh
comment and so we're not allowed to do
anything other than have a brief
response and so the mayor has had a
brief response and so we can't really do
more than that.
>> Well, I I would like to make even a
briefer response. This morning, Newsmax
uh did a report on President Trump uh uh
talking about the significance of
lifeguards and being the first
responders. You really are first
responders in a critical life-saving
environment. And uh the the article was
on the uh the two lifeguards in New
Jersey that lost their life, but
President Trump was saying we need to to
recognize the uh significance of the
first responders. I was honored to be on
that with one of our our lifeguard
personnel here in San Clementi. Uh and u
we just appreciate what you guys are
doing. Thank you for what you're doing.
God bless you and uh keep up the good
work and we'll be addressing the
concerns that you just hang on just a
little while longer. [laughter]
at at the end of the meeting there's
something called uh future agenda items
there's some and if if you don't have to
stay till the end of the meeting but if
you want to watch something uh watch it
at home and you can see if if uh we
bring something up in regards to this.
>> Awesome. Well, I just want to thank you
guys again for your support and
everything that you guys do. Thank you.
>> Thanks guys.
>> Okay. [applause]
» Final speaker is Donna Dream.
And do do we have any zoom in or column?
No one. Okay. As of now,
» good evening, mayor and members of city
council. I'd like to speak briefly
tonight about the importance of
thoughtful, well-planned housing in San
Clemente, particularly housing that is
attainable for working people, young
families, seniors, and others who are
increasingly priced out of the
communities where they live and serve
and work. I want to give a shout out to
our neighbors in San Juan Capistrano and
their city council led by John Taylor
for moving forward with the proposed 50
unit affordable apartment development.
The city is contributing dedicated
affordable housing funds towards the
project which is intended to provide
housing opportunities for people earning
less than $50,000 a year.
What I what I particularly appreciate is
that affordable housing does not have to
mean ignoring legitimate community
concerns. Parking, traffic, appropriate
scale, design, and compatibility with
surrounding neighborhoods all matter.
Those concerns should be addressed early
and thoughtfully as part of good
planning. We should be looking forward.
We should be looking for opportunities
to create housing that our workforce and
families can afford while preserving the
character and quality of life that make
San Clemente special. San Clemente needs
additional housing. But where we build,
what we build, and how it fits into our
community matter. That requires
listening to residents, good planning,
fiscal responsibility, and collaboration
among the city, developers, community
members, and our regional partners.
Affordable housing and neighborhood
compatibility should not be competing
goals. With thoughtful planning, we can
work towards both. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Donna.
» That is it for oral communications.
Next item on the agenda is motion waving
reading and full of all resolutions and
ordinances.
>> I'll move that have the motion by Mayor
Prom Nobel.
>> Second by council member Ammy. All in
favor?
>> Pass 5-0.
>> Consideration of agendaizing items
requiring immediate action.
>> Hearing none.
>> Close session report. City attorney.
>> Thank you. The council met in close
session [clears throat] on items A1 and
two. There's no reportable action. Thank
you.
>> Staff communication. City manager Hall
has an update.
>> Thank you, mayor and council. Just real
quickly, I know that I placed in front
of you tonight a map that indicates the
jurisdictional boundaries at the south
end of the community. It's very complex.
We have everything from the Marine Corps
to San Diego County Public Works, San
Diego County Sheriff, Orange County
Sheriff, City of San Clemeni, state
parks, all in a very, very small
geographic area. And so when residents
identify an issue in that area, they're
not always sure who to call. And so
without disscent from the city council,
um what I'd like to do is take the map
that's been distributed to the city
council, put it up on the web page so
that people will have some contact
numbers for that area of the community.
Um, so I just wanted to pass that along.
If there's no concerns of the city
council, I think it'd be beneficial for members of the community to be able
to have this contact and a map because
it's very
>> Yeah. Just for clarification since
there's no slide that we're talking
about the area like south of Carl's Jr.
down there in that area where we we
share a street with state parks and the
Marines and Calrans and there's been
some who who really has enforcement
ability. So you've clarified it. And
also on this map there's phone numbers
for the residents to call if they have
whatever issues they have. They have a
actually a contact number to come to
address that. So that's going to go up
on the city website is what you're
planning.
>> That's correct. And there's some copies
of the map in the back. So
>> any dissension done?
>> No, not at all. I just have a question.
Oh, sure.
>> Uh has there been any talk with San
Diego County at all of of a possibility
of just moving that yellow line to the
other side of the road? Yeah, I think I
think the complex part of that is that
everything on the
south side, if you will, of the red line
is actually part of Camp Pendleton. Some
of it is leased to the state parks and or San Diego County Public Works has
agreed to maintain some of the roadways,
but it's all federal land. And so moving
the boundaries on federal land is very
complicated. So what we're trying to do
is make sure that that we understand
everybody's jurisdictional
responsibility so that we know the right
people to respond that have the
authority to to take care of the issues
that might arise in that area.
>> Okay.
>> Thank you Andy. um very mining comment
and first of all the you listed
California CL trains um when we actually
published it I I think we need to let
the the let the public understand that
not all encampment needs to be reported
to Cal trains.
>> That's correct.
>> Uh if it's only if only for those within
the CAL trains.
>> Thank you. Great suggestion. We'll we'll
further we'll further clarify what is
Calrans property that's not clearly
identified like some of the rest.
>> And I also want to take this uh
opportunity to let the public know that
the county of San Diego has been very
responsive to our request. They've sent
a public works uh staff here to re uh to
reinstall
parking permits and clean up the their
properties and do their maintenance
work. And they also suggested that their
county San Diego County sheriff will
have some night patrol in this area. So
that's that's in the intergovernmental
cooper cooperation
by large part depends on their
cooperation and sometime goodwill. So um
if there's any chance our our residents
can appreciate their effort that will
help the situation. Great. Thank you.
>> Yeah. May Mr. Mayor. Yeah. We created
these maps a couple of years ago and
they've changed in in in in the period
of two years. Uh they've changed
significantly at at one point in time. A
lot of this land that is now uh uh
now no longer state parks is now the
Marine Corps uh land. and the Marine
Corps will do a much better job than uh
the than the county of San Diego in
enforcing they as I understand uh you
know they they they're less tolerant
than the San Diego uh uh sheriff. So a
lot of this is has changed. We we went
out there u with Lori Davies a couple of
years ago and and many other of the
principles and drew up these these
original maps that have now been
modified. But a lot's getting done out
there. I, as I mentioned in my earlier
report, I went out there with many of
the residents that are complaining about
this. Walked the area, identified the
areas where residents were parking and
well actually mostly uh tourists were
parking and uh it's uh it it's it will
be addressed uh over the next few weeks.
>> Is anyone opposed to the city manager
taking action of putting this on the
website? Seeing nobody opposed.
» Okay, we ready for the next item? Um,
next item on the agenda is public
hearing. The public hearing process
includes a staff presentation. A
presentation by the applicant not to
exceed 10 minutes and public testimony
not to exceed 3 minutes per person.
Following closure of the public hearing,
the city council will respond to
questions raised during the hearing,
discuss the issues, and act upon the
matter by motion. And the first public
hearing we have is appeal of the denial
of an administrative encroachment permit
for a wall in the right ofway located at
1202 Avanita de la Estustrala and
findings under the California
Environmental Equality Act. And we have
staff here to present. Okay.
>> We'll open the public hearing and I'll
ask any of my fellow council members if
they have any exparte disclosures to
make. I'll make one. The attorney for
the uh for the appellet is uh I have
I've known him socially for a while.
Spencer Snider note him through the
Chamber of Commerce and and had numerous
contacts with him through the chamber.
Uh would not make me any way not to be
fair and impartial on this matter.
>> But we we've had this matter before and
he's come and presented to us. So
>> yeah, I was I was fair and impartial
that time, too.
>> You were too. You were. He asked for a
continuence and we gave him one. So
>> absolutely. So [snorts] also there any
communications that have come in after
this item was agendaized?
We did receive a communication from the
attorney and I um it's in the back of
the council chambers. It's on the city
website and it was sent to city council.
>> Okay. And uh with with that I guess
staff, are you you prepared, Zach, to go
right ahead with this?
>> Yes, sir. Uh Zach Ponson, assistant city
engineer. Um tonight in front of you, we
have the continuation of an item that
was um brought to you u the second
meeting of June. Uh just for a real
quick um background, this was a uh the
property owner's deni um appeal of a
denial to keep a wall in the public
rideway. Um my presentation is basically
the same, but there's a couple things I
did want to bring up that we didn't
bring up before. This property owner did
not do the recent construction
modifications to this wall. Uh that was
a previous property owner that was um a
short owner of the property, did some
remodel and and sold it to this property
owner. This property owner was aware of
the code case violation prior to
purchasing it. We were in contact with
them and and discussing some of the
issues with the law. But with that, I
had one slide that we didn't get to last
time that just discusses the um the line
of sight standard at the Orange County
uh standard 1117. So, if Dave can, it's
kind of at the end of our slide, so he's
going to kind of zip through a few.
>> Can you help us get to the last slide?
>> Yes.
» Oh, that was it.
>> Yeah. So, what this slide showing is
actual a cut and paste of the the county
standards. So, the the dark area is
what's shown as a limited light sight
line of sight triangles. So, when you're
coming out of a side street, you stand
back 10 ft. you look down a certain
distance down these streets. And so
we've done this analysis uh during our
initial investigation. Um the for a
street like this, ideally you want to
see about 280 ft down that street when
you're seeing cars come out um at a
height of about 3 and 1/2 ft from the viewer's eyes on a normal car. Uh
right now with the wall out there, we
believe the line of sight's close to
about 150 linear feet. Uh removing the
wall gets us actually close back to that
280 ft. Uh parking is allowed on
streets, but we and the county does not
take parking into consideration. There
is a recent state law modification that
now prohibits parking close to
intersections that would actually kind
of negate any of those issues if there's
a car on there. Uh with that, staff's
available for questions.
>> Any any questions to staff?
>> I have one quick question. The uh you
mentioned the [snorts] removal of the
wall gets you back to the line of sight
about 260. Is that the complete removal
of the wall or just reducing it to the
3ft level where it was before?
>> In our staff report, we had a lot of
discussion. Removing the wall down to
about 30 36 in should give us back to
that 280 ft.
>> Thank you.
>> The 180 you say, not the two.
>> We would actually get back to the 280.
>> Okay. Thank
>> y
I have a quick question. I I notic on
the in the photos that going out looking
at Oh, I'm sorry. going out looking at
the property. Uh the stop sign actually
seems to be in an orordinate distance
back from the actual limit line. Uh is there a reason for that which makes
cars stop where they can't definitely
can't see back and and then they have to
pull up into the limit line to actually
look. Is there any reason why that stop
sign because the street sign is about
where it looks like the stop sign should
be. Is there any reason why that stop
sign couldn't be pushed farther towards
the street?
>> We we can definitely look into it. We
might actually have a picture of it in
one of the slides if you wanted to see
it. But um ultimately what we have on a
lot of cross streets in town, especially
on El Camino Rale, the stop sign itself
and the stop bar is often further back
in anticipation for pedestrian crossings
and the access ramps. So, what we tell
people all the time is you often can't
see from the stop sign itself, but your
design is to stop at the stop sign, look
for pedestrians first, and then inch out
into intersections. So, we have this
conversation quite a bit regarding all
the streets along El Camino Rail.
>> Okay. Thank you. Any other questions of
staff?
>> Okay, I guess it's time for the
appelllet to step on up.
>> Spencer Schneider.
>> Thank you. My name is Spencer Schneider.
I'm here on behalf of Mr. Dan Roberts.
He is the homeowner of 1202 Avenue de la
Estraa.
What we are asking for today is the
reversal of that denial of the
administrative encroachment permit. But
really what that entails is confirmation
that the wall can remain in its current
place at its current height that it has
been in since the 1960s.
The wall's height, the position, and the
footprint haven't been changed. The
updates which were done by the prior
owner were entirely cosmetic where the
bars in between the posts were just
turned into a solid base there.
And sorry, can we go to the next slide?
I think we're on slide three now.
Um, one more.
So, a significant part of the city's
denial focuses on the reduced sight
distance and the increased risk caused
by this reduced sight distance, but
there's no evidence of the reduced sight
distance or increased risk. Today was
the first time we've seen this
engineering or sight distance study. um
it wasn't in the denial record, but the
city has also said that the original
wall before the modification
was also blocking the site distance.
It's been up for over 60 years, and
there's only been one complaint about
this wall. It was fairly recent. The
city also hasn't identified any
accidents, either auto or pedestrian, at
this intersection, besides one DUI that
occurred a number of years ago at this
intersection. So claiming that there's a
reduced sight line that in increases
risk is simply unsupported by the
traffic and accident data at this
intersection. And just the assertion
that safety is reduced isn't doesn't
support the removal of a 60-year-old
structure.
Can we go to the next slide, please? As
a council can see, parked cars do reduce
the sight line here. And the blockage is
from the cars. It's not the wall. Even
with the removal of the wall, vehicles
parked there, even far back from the
intersection, are blocking the line of
sight. Can we please go to the next
slide?
If the city has remaining concerns, a
convex mirror can be installed on this
intersection, and Mr. Roberts is willing
to install that mirror to actually
address some of the sighteline concerns.
Can we go to the next slide, please?
There's also similar walls at this
intersection and throughout the
neighborhood of equal or greater height,
and enforcement against this property
alone would just be inequitable. Can we
go to the next slide, please?
Addressing. I know the council had some
concerns last time we spoke about
compliant sidewalks along the rest of
the block. Um it was represented that
the existing sidewalk on the rest of the
block is largely compliant. But as the
council can see all along the block,
this walkway stops, it starts, it's
blocked. Um it's non-existent in some
places as landscaping or walls come all
the way to the street. It also has
mailboxes, trees planted in the
sidewalk. So changing this one property
and this one wall is not going to create
a compliant path of travel for the
block. Can we go to the next slide
please?
Addressing the drainage and lights
raised by those concerns that were
raised by the city. The drain holes on
the wall face have now been closed so
nothing discharges onto the walkway any
longer. And the lights can also be
removed. Mr. Roberts is willing to take
those down if that's what the city
wishes. Can we go to the next slide,
please? One of the city's proposed
solutions was complete removal of the
wall and grading into a slope. As the
council can see from this rendering,
that's completely untenable. This would
be a steep drop off to the sidewalk.
It'd be about 45°
and this would create runoff and
drainage problems, which the city has
also already expressed concerns about.
And as the city can see from this
rendering, cars parked along this street
would still be blocking the line of
sight.
Can we go to the next slide, please?
Finally, the wall's a safety feature for
Mr. Roberts and his family. It's the
only barrier between an elevated yard
and a drop to the public street corner.
Mr. Roberts has a 7-year-old child that
uses the yard daily, and removal or even
reduction of the wall creates a new
hazard. It's also a privacy barrier,
preventing direct line of sight from the
street or the sidewalk into Mr. Robert's
yard or house. There is an individual
living in his vehicle in front of Mr.
Robert's property, which makes this
privacy um point especially salient. Can
we go to the next slide, please? Mr.
Roberts has gathered over 124 signatures
supporting that the wall remain in its
place. These are his neighbors. These
are constituents that have signed the
petition stating that they support the
wall in its current location, at its
current height, that they don't believe
it creates a safety hazard, and that
they don't want the city coming to
homeowners based on a single complaint
and forcing them to undergo costly and
expensive and extensive construction
projects, especially to long-standing
structures, and especially when there
has been no proven safety risk. I just
want to reiterate what we're asking for
here, just that Mr. Robert's wall is um
able to remain where it is at its
current height and the height that it's
been in since the Eisenhower
administration. Thank you for your time.
>> Thank you, sir. We have any public
comments?
>> We do. I'll call the first few speakers.
Lynn Bronco, followed by Diana Lansen,
followed by John Lanston.
Lynn.
Uh good afternoon, council. My name is
Len Brango. Um, [clears throat]
I'm a home owner there on La Placentia
and I've been here the last time and
explained to you guys that I've lived
there for 40 years.
There's never [clears throat] been a
problem with that wall until it got
modified.
And since that wall's been modified,
there's been situations that we've had
with me personally in my own car. So, a
lot of these things that these guys are
saying, the wall's been there for 50
years. That's correct. But when they
modified it, that's when we had the
issues. We didn't have any issues prior
to the wall being modified because you
could see the line of sight just like
the engineer stated. There wasn't a
problem. But once you modify the wall,
you cannot see. You have to pull out
past almost into the oncoming traffic to
actually [clears throat] excuse me to
see any traffic coming at you. And in
the morning, you know, sometimes when
it's kind of like dusk, it's hard to
see. There's a little dip there to the
left. And sometimes you what what I'm
what I do is I come out, I'm looking
right because I got to sneak out and I
don't see anybody in the dip. Next thing
you know, I got a car, you know, right next to me. So the wall
modification has created a a line of
sight issue. So it is dangerous the in its current state. It wasn't when the
wall was in the normal state prior to
his ownership, but when the wall was
modified, it has created an issue for
line of sight. We and I personally have
had some issues, not any accidents, so
that you know, like the attorney said,
there's nothing reported, but I'm
telling you, it's going to it's just a
matter of time before it happens. The
homeowner's only been there for a year,
so I don't know that he's experienced
any real [clears throat] real
situations. Number one. Number two, the
signatures that he's got on the on on
the petition. I mean, I don't even know
if anybody all these people are are, you
know, have licenses to drive or if they
even live there. I live there. I've been
there for a long time. So, I I'm
experiencing this every day. So, the
wall is a is a problem [clears throat]
in its current state. I don't think you
have to take the whole wall down, but I
think if it was back to where it
initially was, it would be it would be
fine. Thank you.
>> Thank you, sir.
» Diana Lansen, followed by John Lansen,
followed by Dylan Odbert.
Got my clock going. Hi, I'm Diana
Lansen. I actually live next door to the
wall. Um, I enjoy and respect all of my
neighbors, so I appreciate their point
of view as well. Um, I just think that
we are addressing a symptom of the
problem at the intersection and not the
actual root cause. The wall
does not create a line of sight issue
for me. I'd like to say that traffic
cars have two other exit points out of
our neighborhood. So, there are multiple
options. If you are not comfortable with
the line of sight, there are two other
entry and exit points. There are no
crosswalks. There are no usable
sidewalks. I am a mom. My kids go to Los
Palmus and also the Boys and Girls Club.
They cannot walk home. They cannot from
either location because the whole street
has no safe crossing point for children
or our community. The wall is not
causing a problem there. The wall is
actually providing some protection for
our children when they stand on the
curb. At least there is a significant
barrier there for them. The real issue
is the line of sight issue created by
other cars, which I guess the city
doesn't have a solution for quite yet. I
don't see any red curb. No matter how
far you pull up, you saw where the stop
sign is, you've seen the visuals. No
matter how far you pull up, you cannot
see if anyone is coming when there is
any car parked in front of Dan's house.
So, if we are not going to address the
actual root cause of the problem, I
don't think we penalize our neighbor who
did not construct the wall. And yes, he
does need the wall for safety because
I'm pretty sure the 10 um vagrants or
unhoused that the sheriff was referring
to live in their cars in front of our
houses. So, I also can't allow my kids
to walk because we've allowed someone to
live. There is literally an SUV that
lives full-time in front of Dan's house
and he has a 7-year-old daughter and I
have children. And so, we've allowed
this person, there are multiple, it's
not just one car, there are multiple
cars on our street. The reason the
original homeowners that built the wall
put the wall there who also we talked to
because they were my neighbors is
because they felt unsafe. They also had
small children and the city has allowed
numerous people to live in their
vehicles right in front of our
neighborhood. And so we should afford
our neighbor some protection and until
we address that we shouldn't ask him to
take down the wall. So I would just say
if we're going to ask our neighbor to
remove a wall at great expense I
understand the need for permits. I think
there is a good solution in the interim
until we address all of the root causes
that being getting rid of the the people
that are allowed to live in their homes.
I'm using drugs, going to the restroom
out all hours of the night right in
front of his front door. We're doing
nothing as a city to address that. We
have begged the city for any kind of
traffic control. Our children cannot
cross the road there. There is nowhere
safe for them. The cars can go to two
different entry and exit points in our
neighborhood if they need clear
visibility to leave the street. But so
far, we haven't addressed any of the
concerns for the pedestrian traffic and
our children. So, I would ask that we go
with a temporary solution of a mirror
that provides visibility both around
cars and the wall.
>> Thank you, Diana.
[applause]
>> John Lansen,
followed by Dylan Odvert.
>> Uh, thank you, Council. Um, and I'll
probably reiterate a few things that
Diana, uh, my beautiful wife just, uh,
said. Um, but the main thing is we've
lived there for about 7 years, and that
wall has not changed height or anything.
Um, even during Halloween there was
times, everybody says we can see through
the gate. Well, during Halloween, they
would put up little ghost things that
would keep you from seeing through that.
And it was also, we talked to those
neighbors and they wanted that wall.
They love that wall because they had
young kids.
um to protect them. It was the only
barrier uh for people not just walking
right in their homes. And honestly, as
you can see with all the uh pictures and
everything, you have to pull up past
that stop sign at least 10 ft. And if
you stop your car at the front of the
line, there is nothing that you can see.
And if there's one car right there, should be a red line that's going
down for at least two cars. Everybody
has to pull all the way out. The sign is
here, back here, and there's a car here.
You can't see anything. And we have
kids. We've asked the city multiple
times to put a crosswalk in because we
go to Bonita Canyon Park, which is right
across the street. Beautiful park that
the city maintains. That's where we're
at 5 days a week. Okay. So, we have our
kids crossing this 20 times at least a
week, I would say. We have dogs that
we're walking in the park and
everything. And literally, if there's a
car there, we have to have them cross
the street, which is also a blind curve,
to uh the other side of the street to
get max viewing of coming down here. And
Lynn is correct. There's a dip on the on
the if you're looking to the left,
there's a dip. I tell my kids, wait.
You're going to look both sides, you're
going to look past the cars, and you're
going to wait because there's always a
car in that dip. If it's a low riding
car, for some reason, we always wait.
And then here comes a car at 40 45 miles
an hour. And we have seven year old like
four to 10 year old kids that don't have
fully formed brains and everything. So
we are telling them you have to wait for
this. Okay. But the main thing is if
you're out all the way to the stop sign
there, the wall has nothing to do with
it. Uh you can't see because you're
already too far back. Uh you have to go
out. I would say the back of your car
has to be on that on the on the white
line to see. And that has no And now
we're 10 feet past the wall. Okay. It's
if there's a if there's a car parked 20
feet down the way, we still can't see uh
anything that's coming from that way.
[snorts] So, um and I don't think that
he needs to be penalized because it will
cost six figures for him to fix this
wall at least. Uh I put in a small
retention wall few years ago with the
city. It went through the whole
ordinance thing and every and it was $50
$60,000 for a wall that would be a tenth
of what he's going to have to do cuz he
would have to tear it down. And for his
family's protection, he's going to have
to put up another smaller wall, a
retaining wall to keep uh everything
from running down. Um so I don't think
that we need to change the wall. It's
always been that way. So,
>> thank you, John.
>> Thank you,
>> Dylan Odd.
Thank you, council. I'm a long-standing
resident in the neighborhood of the
retaining wall that is under discussion
this evening, and I support improving
safety in our street, but the corner
wall is not the source of danger. It has
been a place, it has been in place for
decades without creating a safety a
safety problem. The real safety concern
is speeding and unsafe driving on
Australia near the crossing used by
children walking to our park. Our
neighborhood has many children under the
age of 10, making traffic calming
especially important. The city surveyed
this street 3 years ago in uh 2023 and
somehow decided against stop signs or
speed bumps. Neighbors were told there
weren't enough incidents to warrant
action. Removing a long-standing wall
will not address speeding or protect our
children crossing the street.
Please leave the wall in place which has
been there for decades and instead
considered measures that will directly
address the danger to our neighborhood
such as speed bumps, stop signs or
marked or marked crosswalks. Please
focus city resources on actual safety
the actual safety threat. unsafe unsafe
driving on Australia. Protecting
children who cross the street should
take priority over removing a wall that
has existed for over for a decade. Thank
you.
>> Thank you, Dylan.
» That's it for speakers.
>> Okay. So, I I guess the uh appellet has
five minutes. He can rebut whatever
issues they've heard.
I don't need the full five minutes. Just
we'll briefly reiterate it. I think the
neighborhood spoken. The petition speaks
for itself. There's addresses on the
petition as well. But the neighborhood
doesn't feel like this is a safety
concern. The data doesn't support this
being a safety concern, and the city
doesn't have to do anything except let
Mr. Roberts keep the wall where it's
been for decades. Thank you. Yeah. Thank
you, sir. Do we have any questions of
staff before the public hearing's
closed?
>> Can we take a break?
>> Oh, okay. What? So, the council, can we
take a fivem minute break?
>> Sure.
>> You don't want to do questions of staff
first?
>> Well, I I think we want to take a fivem
minute break first before we break those
up. So, we'll we'll recess for five
minutes. And I can't see the clock.
We'll come back at like 8.
At what time?
>> 6:45.
>> It's so at 6:50. Okay.
Well,
we're going to go back in session.
So, I I I know Mark will be here in a
second, I'm sure, and he had a question.
Are there any other questions of staff
while we're while we're waiting?
I I I'll I'll ask one to kill some time.
So, you know, we talked about a
crosswalk, you know, or that was
mentioned about a a crosswalk, and I
went out there and was and was looking
crosswalks would be it it might be
interesting. I I don't know, but isn't
there since there's no sidewalks there,
is that problematic to do a crosswalk to
up to where there's no sidewalk. Isn't
that an engineering issue?
>> So, uh, good question. Yes, a crosswalk
at an uncontrolled intersection that
doesn't have a three-way stop or a
signal is always a little bit scary
because you're given a false sense of
security, but also having a crosswalk
that leads to nowhere um would be a
probably a very large ADA uh violation.
And my other quick question, I know the
vehicle code changed and now you know
blocking or parking on corner radiuses
is an issue. uh
that there wouldn't be an an issue of
going out there and painting that radius
red, would there?
>> We can do 20 ft per state law right now
without going to planning commission and
council. Beyond the 20 ft, typically we
would go to planning commission and come
back to council to codify that.
>> Okay. So, we could do immediately we
could paint the curb and then if it was
something that we they wanted we wanted
to address further, we just go to
planning commission.
>> Correct. And looking to the east on that
intersection, it is already red curbed.
>> Okay.
>> And so the right side is not red curbed.
Okay. Yeah. Mark, you I think you had
questions of staff or
>> um you address uh several of them. When
was the last time we we've done a and
may have missed the first part of it. Uh
>> when was the last time we we did a a
comprehensive view of of that entire
area
>> for like traffic calming and speeding?
Um I believe he he mentioned 2023 which
sounds correct.
>> Um I do know the results of that. Uh, it
was focused also on the the S-curves
kind of by the tennis court where the
speed was actually very slow in that
stretch. I don't remember the results
off the top of my head on the
straightaway. If anywhere is going to
qualify for traffic calming on this
street, it's going to be the
straightaway. The the curves further to
the west, if I remember correctly, the
speeds were 10, 15 miles an hour on
average, not for 30 and 35 that you're
looking for to qualify.
>> There might be something there to this.
And I I know this is mainly just on on the uh blocks itself, but for staff
to look at a at a more comprehensive uh
study specifically on that area because
it sounds like we're having a lot of
issues
on top of the wall itself.
>> Right. So we can definitely relook at
that straightaway. I don't need a
petition from the city. We if you guys
give us that direction, we can we can do
that. And that's something that um
really the trafficcoming policy, we have
a whole policy on that. We would come
back to appropriate if it was additional
red curb beyond the 20 ft or other
measures in our toolbox including speed
bumps and stuff like that that are we
have a lot of measures in our toolbox.
Usually it's speed feedback signs are
the next option after red curbs that we
try to get people to slow down first
before we start going with physical
barriers like uh speed cushions.
>> Okay, great. Any questions?
>> Yeah. Um uh a few neighbors talking
about the the parked the car blocking
the sight line. Uh what what is your
assessment on that? And if we were to
pre prevent people from parking there,
then does this wall still present a
sight plan issue?
>> Uh yes. per the state law that we were
just talking about, we can we can go out
and red curb that, you know, as soon as
we get a work order into the maintenance
department, we can red curb 20 feet from
where the straight part hits the curve
of the the radius. So, by state law, I
forget the assembly bill number, I think
it's 418, but that one, the daylighting
law, it's referred to, uh, we can
actually go out and do 20 ft of red curb
without changing our code. Anything
beyond that, I need I usually do an
investigation. I would look at this line
of sight and say what's needed to get us
closer to that line of sight of what
we're looking for in this code. My guess
is it'll go from 20 ft is one car. My
guess is you would end up coming back
with potentially three cars worth of red
curb.
>> Okay. My question is if we were to take
out three parking spaces in that
segment, will this
because right now the parked car blocks
sight line. If we were to prevent them
from parking there, taking out three by
taking out three parked cars, will that
wall becomes a obstacle to the line of
sight?
>> The wall per the city, per the county
standard, it it's still technically a
line of sight standard because it's
higher than that 42 in that the standard
looks at from a driver's eye. And they look at a specific distance back
from the flow line of the curb, 10 ft. a
driver's eye being 42 in, how far can
you see? And that standard wants you to
be able to see 280 feet. And so the wall
is technically still a violation of
that, but part removing parked cars
would help the situation for sure.
>> What is what's a ramification or
consequence of not abiding by the county
standard?
>> Um, I mean, ultimately, these streets
were built prior to the county standard.
Obviously, we're 1920s, right? This
county standard didn't wasn't created in
the 1920s. So, not all streets are going
to meet this standard, but as an
engineer, we we like to have some sort
of guideline of what's the standard of
care and what's the standard of practice
in our industry of what we're trying to
follow. So, most cities look at the the
county standard of 117 to to try to
implement what we can on that standard
where we can to the best of our
abilities.
>> Okay. Thank you,
>> Victor.
>> Yeah, I I'm just trying to get a better
sense of uh I'm a little bit confused. I
think I understand about the height of
the wall. There's some some a little bit
of confusion though that the wall was uh
has been there, you know, for forever,
for 20 years. But but help
[clears throat] me understand what part
of the wall was was there and what part
was not there and uh and at what height.
» So, uh
>> we have a couple photos that might show
the pre-existing. So, um, while she's
looking for those here, so here's the
existing case where you're looking at
>> the actual solid wall on the lower half
that has been there probably since the
1950s. Okay.
>> Um, that's looking at I'm guessing since
it's not there today, I'm I'm guessing
it's 30 to 36 in high
>> and then those columns went up to 6 feet
in height.
>> And so, in my staff report, I talk about
how those columns themselves kind of
posed a line of sight issue. Even though
they're not there today, you can
actually see it in this photo. When you
see columns in a line, they start acting
as a wall at a certain angle.
>> Mhm.
>> And so, was it better back then than it
is now? I believe so.
>> Because there was this as you're
approaching the wall, you can see
through it, and there's only a couple
feet where you're actually getting those
columns start acting like a wall. Um,
once they filled it in, they filled in
to the tops of those columns
effectively. So all that fence material
you see there, the the previous owner
filled it in with solid wall. And that's
where it it it kind of it basically
creates a sixoot wall instead of that 3.
>> So when
I'll clarify this maybe a little bit
later, but when we're talking about that
6ft wall being there, it wasn't always a
6ft wall. It was this wall with the rod
iron in in place.
>> Correct. Uh
there was an issue of lights on on the
wall currently. Can you help me
understand that?
>> Um right
>> gates
>> I think it's the next one or right
there.
>> So the the the the owner before or this
one somebody added those two light
sconces when you [clears throat] are
walking on that 2 and 1/2t wide walkway
right there. It's pretty much right at
like eye level for me at least
>> with pretty sharp corners. And
>> so I I had some concerns of that myself
just kind of being at if you weren't
paying attention that's not the
especially on a 2 and 1/2t walkway.
>> You're kind of forced into something
right at your eye level.
>> And the the other thing I I'm trying to
get a better sense of is uh uh I think
that these owners bought this house with
the wall there. Was there knowledge
though of the [laughter]
as far as you under understand that
there was issues with the wall when when
it was purchased or was there there an
ongoing uh action at that time? Can you
help me understand that? So, from what
we can I can look back, one of my staff
members, Alex Lowki, he was in
communications with the current owners
as they were in escrow to purchase the
house, and they were made aware of the
code case on this prior to their closing
of the purchase. But some of the their
real estate agent was involved, I
believe, and there were several emails
back and forth of um what's out there
now, what was before the fact that the
whole wall was unpermitted and
potentially a zoning violation and
potentially a line of sight violation.
>> Okay. Uh is there is there any uh
obligate or consequences to the city or
liability to the city uh as a result? I
mean, if we if we kept the Well, this
incre Well, maybe [laughter]
you're not the right person to answer,
but but it is it a it's a violation of
the code the code the county code.
>> Well, I will say though, the county is
it's not exactly a code. It's a standard.
>> And so standards are guidelines that you try to abide by. We have engineering
standards that aren't codified. Mhm.
>> We we have wiggle room in there and not
it doesn't always fit especially in a
historic building or a historic parking
lot. We can't always get our proper
backup distance for example. We we wave
these standards all the time to try to
help development happen in town. Um so
standards aren't codified. My my my my
last question would be
if hypothetically we we were going to
try and address the line of sight, would
the entire wall have to be modified to
its original or could you just modify a smaller portion of the wall uh to
address the line of sight?
>> That is a good question and I don't
believe I have an aerial view of this.
Um,
that is an excellent question. It is
something we can look into if that was
council's direction cuz the further to
the west, you know, maybe it's not an
issue as you're that far down to their
western property line.
>> Um, somewhere between that gate and that
western property line, there might be a
point where that wall technically could
stay.
>> Well, what would what would be the the
option? Could someone for could could
there be glass or something that you
could see through as opposed to putting
rod restoring rod iron?
>> Um, and that's where it kind of gets
into some of our zoning standards, too.
Talk about guard rails being somewhat
see-through or slotted rails or or or
rod iron or some of these
[clears throat] things that are a little
bit more see-through. So, there's
different options that are usually used.
When somebody were to come in today and
let's say propose this,
>> our zoning code usually says do your
42-in high wall and anything above that
is basically see-through with rod iron
or slotted uh glass like you said or
glass and stuff.
>> But theoretically, you know, right there
in that picture, you could create uh
some kind of line of sight there on the
top part and keep a good portion of the
wall. Otherwise,
>> there's a certain point around this
fence somewhere between this fence and
to the west where maybe that wall could
stay that height and then from I think
what you're getting at is from that
point
>> east towards the intersection maybe it
has glass or a rod iron or something
like that.
>> All right, those are my that's all the
questions that
>> I know Mark has another question but
real quick is is this the photo is this
what it looks like right now?
>> This is today.
>> Okay, Megan, did you leave this photo up
for people to retrieve it quickly? Okay.
Go ahead, Mark.
>> Sorry, there I had one more question. Uh
actually to our chief, uh there was a
[snorts]
mention there of of a lot of people uh
parking overnight there and uh just
wondering if there's uh any patrol in
that area uh to to monitor that for
safety or other reasons.
>> Yes.
>> Okay. And and you are actively in that
area and working in that area?
>> Yes, sir.
>> Okay, great. Thank you.
>> Okay. Uh quick question for
clarification of the appellet. So uh you
talked about a putting up a cat's eye
mirror and the appelllet is willing to
do that to to put one up and to maintain
it. Is that my understanding? Okay, I'm
getting a yes, Spencer. And the last
thing is uh would the appelllet be
willing to remove those lights on either
side of the gate? And I get an
affirmative on that also. Any other
questions of staff?
I I if we could ask them questions, too.
I I I had a few comments. I just want to
know uh your your your reaction uh to
any of that or uh to to my comments
about, you know, at a certain point
lowering the wall if it could help
impact the line of sight.
>> Yes. So, I Mr. Robert's ideal situation
here is that the wall can remain as it
is. the alternative is having to
demolish it and move it. Um, it's a
retaining wall. It's going to be an
expensive and serious project.
>> He's willing to [clears throat] make
some adjustments um that will help the
line of sight, but his what he's really
asking for is that the wall can stay as
it is right now.
>> No, I understand that. I don't I don't
want to throw something out there
irrational or unreasonable, but Okay.
Thank you. And
>> yeah, really quick quick question about
the wall height for the staff. Um, the
zoning code has a
front front yard and side yard if it's next to the public street a wall
height limit of 42 in as you just
mentioned. Uh, so if we were to leave
the war earlier, apparently there's a
lot of zoning code issue here. Have you
worked with the planning department on
this? Uh we have had some conversations
with them on this. Um ultimately the the
what you're referring to the front yard
setback uh zoning code does say uh 42 in
is the maximum height of a wall on
there. Normally when they go through a
minor exception permit any guard rails
on top of that are of see-through
material. Um on the sideyard because
this is a a corner lot. the sideyard uh
10 feet back from the ride of way is
where anything within that front 10 feet
on the sideyard is supposed to be 42
inches according to their zoning code.
>> Okay. Thank you.
>> Any other questions before we close the
public hearing? Hearing none. Public
hearing is closed. So, who wants to kick
it off for discussion?
>> I'll kick it off, Mr. Mayor, if I could.
Uh I I uh depending on the the desire of
the council, I think the line of sight
issue is important. I think the
reflecting mirror u kind of addresses
that issue and the red curbing would
address that issue. So I can support uh
this wall has been there for 50 plus
years. I can support the wall remaining
with the removal of the lights, the
pinning of the red curb and the
reflector reflecting mechanism
maintained by the applicant. Uh I can
support that. Uh but uh the reduction is
the second second step back from that.
But I I can support the applicant with
those two conditions.
>> Yeah, Mr. Woo. Yeah. uh my my position
or my opinion is that uh uh
I'm going to follow much of the staff's
recommendation. I think the six foot
wall cannot stay there because it's a
liability issue and also public safety
issue. Um in dishing the it violates the
zoning code of the wall height with the
wall is never a legal non-conforming
use. It's it didn't have a permit to
exist there. So, it's illegal
construction from the beginning. And I I
think at the minimum, we need to lower
the wall down to 42 in and allow the the
owner to add a see-through rod iron
design on top of that if that's still
what he wants to make wall taller. Uh,
regarding the privacy in the front yard,
um, there's no expectation for privacy
in the front yard. U the front yard is
expected to be visible from uh from from
an open street. Um the other things
the the lack of accident is um
it does not mean that there's no risk.
It just hasn't happened because such a
uh it's a it's a small
location and any any risk will take time
to materialize and eventually giving
enough time something will happen. So by
that time city will be on hook for a
liability issue. So if we were to allow
this to h to to stay and I need I need
the the owner to indemnify the city for
any future liability if something
happens. But I think the solution today
is to have them to lower it to 42 in.
Thank you.
>> I concur with uh Mr. Woo. Uh this is the
issue for me here is is
uh compliance and that we we have these
uh design review committees in place for
a reason and I understand that you
bought this house from someone else but
you also understood when you bought it
that it was out of compliance. Um, and
that's unfortunate that it wasn't done
properly, but we can't be making
exceptions on this and then expect
others to not want to have exceptions as
well and sort of uh, you know, build
first or or uh, yeah, build first and
ask for permission later. Um, we we need
to to do this correctly. Uh I am
amenable to the idea of of going back to
some design that was close to what it
was before of having some some gated
slots in there or gate um some iron uh
slats in there uh or some sort, you
know, working with our design uh
committee to to find a a good compromise
in there to get it close to what it was
before. I think that that can uh be
amendable to to all parties there. Um
but yeah, we it
This is why we have these these codes in
place. So,
>> Victor,
yeah. Uh
I I'm not sure if it's the 32 or the 42
in that that is re is required by code,
but or or or 30 in is where is where it
was. The lower part was before.
Well,
do we have to open the
>> Well, yeah. I'll reopen the public
hearing and the question of staff is is
42 what what you're looking for.
>> 42 is the zoning code actually. So that
is in our code. The the line of sight
happens to also be 42. What staff was
looking at was from a driver's eye and
the street. So we actually put it down
at 30, but I I mean we're okay with the
42 is that way it's in compliance with
planning and it's a somewhat
compromised.
>> Yeah. All right.
>> As long as we're reopen. This photo here
I keep on hearing this number six feet.
Are are you saying that that that wall
right there is 6 feet correct?
>> Just about. It kind of varies with with
height because it used to have some
steps in it, but I me I measured it
right around in this area and I believe
I was um at six feet here.
>> Okay. I'm going to close the public
hearing again. Okay. So is that
>> my my my inclination is to uh create
some line of sight uh op opportunity and
I I would hope uh that you we'd be able
to find a way that would uh lower it in
the me in the least amount of uh space
to create that line of sight either
through the rod iron that was there or
through some other acceptable glass or
that meets the city standard to address
the uh the issue of line of sight but I
also think you know the lights and the drainage which has been removed and
uh uh need to be addressed also.
>> Okay. Uh my feeling is is that the the
main issue I I drove it and made turns
from both sides of the street and tried
to tried to look at it and I I think a a
mirror across the street there would
definitely be beneficial. I also think
that the the main my main problem for
site was the fact that there's cars
parked all the way around the radius and I think if a red curb was painted
around the radius at 20 ft and more if needed that it would it would
mitigate that. Uh I also like the idea
of going out looking at all all traffic
calming. I just don't know that lowering if we
say lower lower it to 42 in and then put
something rod iron whatever that the the
line of sight's going to still be
blocked to whatever it is. Now, I I just
think that the main issue is, like I
say, the cars the the cars that are
parked there, and there's a lot of other
things that were brought up, and I think
that those are mitigated. And as far as
a standard, uh, we we we don't go by the standards in a lot of places in a
100-year-old city that they're are
constantly coming up and we're coming to
a mitigation. We're not saying this has
to be done now to code. I I mean, if it
can be done, when you scrape out a lot,
I think that's great. Otherwise, if you
look at the neighborhood, there's a lot
more, you know, there's a lot of what
you would say egregious, you know, code
variations than than this. So, for me, I I I would be fine with the with doing
the traffic mitigation, the red curbs,
the the the mirror uh with that. But
again, it's whatever the whatever the
majority of the council thinks is
appropriate.
>> Mayor, we can do both, right? the city
can initiate some improvement at the
location. We can we can make that happen
as additional direction to the staff at
the same time we address this code
violation issue.
Oh yeah, absolutely we can or we can do
a mitigation of it and and and not hold
them accountable to the code. It's done
all the time. I mean, we we get we give
variances, we give, you know, so it's
not like we're set in stone that we have
to make them take that wall down. That's
just not a fact.
>> My concern though is that it sets a
precedent that uh throughout the city
people are going to say, well, ask for forgiveness, not permission. And
that that's my concern here.
>> Yeah, I'm I'm certainly not in favor of
not g getting a building permit and
building something without getting a
permit. that wasn't done by this
applicant. That was done and I I think
the prior owner should have should have
done something. They didn't. Uh again,
it's done all over the city all the
time. Uh where you go out and you look
at a project and you try to mitigate it.
And I every project is different.
There's no well he did this now I can do
that because that just isn't reality.
That's not how it really happens in the
everyday world here in the city. So
that's may
>> Mayor if you go on Zen
>> if you allow me if you can uh reopen the
public I'd like to ask the the council.
>> Sure. Okay. Okay.
>> Few questions. Um,
so if the city were to uh adopt the
resolution 26109
to partially grant your appeal, uh, if
you I believe you have read the
conditions on section three, there are
four items. A the encroach encroaching
wall improvement shall not exceed a
maximum height of 30 inches. We will
raise it to 42 inches. B the drain shall
be removed or modified to property drain
to the street and not onto the sidewalk.
We're going to keep that. C. The
property owners shall execute a
administrative encroachment permit and
agreement containing covenants affecting
real property informed substantially
similar to those presented to the city
council. Um in other words you the
property owner will have to indemnify
the city and then D is just generic
cash. Um with those modification is that
acceptable by you by you? So that's not
our preferred outcome here. We're
willing to work with the city attorneys
and we want to reach a resolution with
this. Some of the in the proposed
resolution, it really is a catchall
placing a lot of um liability that's
not regulated onto Mr. Roberts. So we'd
want to make sure that's spelled out
what Mr. Roberts is responsible for
indemnifying the city for. And then it
also gives the city a anytime anywhere
we can revoke this. So we'd want to
understand that if we are undergoing a
costly height reduction that next week
the city doesn't decide that they don't
like this and um reverse that um
encroachment permit so we'd like some
ability to come in front of the council
again if that ever became a case. Um can
I just briefly address um Mr. Mark's um
concern about exceptions to the code and
this becoming a snowball effect. This
while the modifications were done a few
years ago, the wall has been in this
footprint um location and height at
least the columns since the 60s. So the
snowball effect I think is kind of an
unfound fear where
nobody else can go out today and build
something without a code and ask for
forgiveness tomorrow. This has been here
for over 60 years. So, while those
homeowners that have
um improvements on their property that
are 60 years old may see this and say,
"Okay, well, I guess I'm fine with
that." It's not going to lead to more
residents coming out trying to get
around the building permits.
>> Okay. I have question for the city
attorney. So I just I just propose some
compromise and it doesn't look like the
applicant is willing to accept that. So
if the council doesn't get any motion
approved then what what is that what's
the outcome?
>> Uh so first of all the applicants
agreement is not required. This is a
quasi judicial hearing in which the city
council is deciding an appeal. So you
don't need to reach an agreement. Um
if the council takes no action um that
would
it doesn't get staff's you know staff's
recommendation stands which is the last
thing that happened.
>> Yeah. I I think Mr. Woo uh your concern
I think is being addressed in in the uh
license agreement paragraph 6 provides
uh that the homeowner provide insurance
liability insurance. uh it's maybe a
little weak on the indemnification
provision that that section could be
boosted a little bit to make sure
there's a specific indemnity provision
if that's acceptable to the to the
client for any damage caused by this uh
this this uh structure. Um so I think I
think your address is your your concerns
pretty much been addressed in the most
part.
>> Uh no not to my knowledge and
>> read paragraph six it's pretty pretty
clear. Well, that's indemnification is
just a one and also uh I think we have
if I read it correctly we have uh three
council members wants the height limit
to address the site landing issues and
uh the applicant has not expressed their
uh support to accept that
we have a closed public hearing.
>> So are you done with your questions? I'm
sorry is closed.
>> Let's move forward. I'd like to make a
motion that u uh we address this matter
by granting the uh the applicant a uh uh
an encroachment permit with the
condition that the lights be removed.
that uh that the uh reflector mechanism
be installed at the cost and maintenance
of the homeowner and that the curb at
least the 20 foot uh section that we can
do without additional authorization be
installed on the curb uh to the right of
that parking parking lot. That's my
motion. I make a a friendly amendment
that we also direct staff to to take any
whatever study they want to do to for
traffic calming in that location in
general and then also once the red curb
is painted if it's deemed that that's
not sufficient that we go to the
planning commission to extend that red
curb.
>> Absolutely.
>> I'll I'll second that.
>> Okay. I make a substit substitute motion
to um to adopt resolution
26-109
with a modification to section 3 a that
we change the height of 30 in to 42 in
>> with everything else in the original
motion. Uh that's uh well the the motion
in 26 to 109
>> the one that grant the the one that
grants there appeal but with those
conditions
>> with the added conditions of the mirror
and the red curb and the traffic calming
or you leaving those out
>> those are the additional
direction to the to the staff but it
doesn't have to be this resolution.
Okay,
>> just to be just for clarity on this, would be proposing that you that
the wall goes to 42 in. Uh is it also
putting uh recommending that putting in
slats in there or or uh see-through?
>> That's that's up to the applicant. If
they want to add seeth through guard
rails on top of the 42 in solid wall,
they they may do so with the planning department with a separate permit.
>> I'll second.
>> Okay. So, we have a substitute motion.
We'll vote on that first. All in favor
of substitute motion say I.
>> I.
>> All oppose. No.
>> Now we go to the original.
>> What was the result of that? Oh, three to two. Uh the eyes were did not
carry. Uh eyes by uh council member, Woo. Those were uh
myself, mayor prom Nobel, and council
member uh Cabraw. So now we go to the
original motion. And are we clear on
>> I do have a clarification on the
original motion. Um Mayor Prom, was that
um your conditions that you delineated?
Were that were those um changes to
resolution 26
109.
>> Yes.
>> Thank you.
>> Okay. With that, we'll vote. All in
favor of the motion?
>> I opposed.
>> No. No.
>> Okay. It passes 3 to two with council
members Endm and Woo dissenting.
>> Thank you.
» Next item on the agenda is continuation,
excuse me, let me just get there.
Continuation of a scheduled public
hearing to introduce um the first
reading of an ordinance amending chapter
13.04 of the city of Sanini Municipal
Code creating a uniform process for
setting fees and adoption of a
resolution adjusting water department
fee schedule for miscellaneous water
fees. And if the city council concurs
with the information provided within the
staff report, the recommendation is to
continue the public hearing to a date
uncertain.
Okay, we have to open the public hearing
to do that though, correct? So, I'm
going to open the public hearing. Uh,
are there any public comments on this?
>> Not.
>> And so, the staff's recommendation is to
continue to a date uncertain. Okay. So,
I'm going to close the public hearing.
Does anybody have a motion?
>> I'll call the question.
>> Okay. Uh, motion by council member
Cabal. I have a second.
>> Second
>> by council member Woo. All in favor?
>> I. So done.
>> Okay.
Next item on the agenda is consideration
of a resolution adopting the real estate
asset management program approving the
associated program policies and
procedures, establishing the city
council declared surplus property list,
authorizing the city manager to approve
future administrative modifications
consistent consistent with the program
and finding the action not subject to
the California Environmental Quality
Act.
>> Are there any public comments on this?
>> Yes. Okay. Uh, does anybody need a staff
report from the council? You're pulling.
Okay. So, let's go ahead and hear the
public comments.
>> Amanda Kinttonia.
» Okay. I think I have a presentation, but
um
hopefully it's queuing up.
So, um I'm just kind of wondering is the
city of SM up for sale? Because that's
what it seems like to me. Uh next slide
please.
When going through this uh reamp um and
um what comes out uh comes up is it's
that the entities can purchase or lease
city- owned property. And so this is
what I'm I'm concerned about. Um they
want to you want to maximize revenue
potential, but this is not what we are.
We're we're about running the city,
right? Not you know taking care of our constituents. um looking at public
safety which thank you Mark Endm and Zen
Woo did um I really appreciate that as
an RN I think that public safety is
number one. Next slide please. Um so
when I looked at the surplus property
list um it does say it does not approve
the sale or lease or change uh exchange
of any disposition of the listed
property. However, it just I'm concerned
of what is going to be used for this.
What is this going to be the start of?
Next slide please. So basically um in
the staff report it says mentions public
state public benefit but one of the
things that should be really put in
there that we should have a focus of
number one having open space
preservation should be our primary
focus. Number two conversate
conservation of our lands and natural
resources uh to last for a long time
because this is it. this is all we have
right our our open land um our surplus
land um land assembly I think that's
really important for open space
preservation and conservation to
maintain it to join these properties uh
support this is to support tree city USA
um it's important for any surplus land
to u establish parks um also municipal
operation infrastructure for municipal
operations as well next slide and then
public safety have coarse fire
mitigation following the California Fish
and Wildlife standards. Um public access
where it doesn't disturb conservation
easements, threatened or endangered
species or affects the ecosystem. And
then um next slide please. So we are the
Spanish village by the sea and I think
we should uphold that. Um we should you
know we have fought very hard to
preserve our open spaces. That's why we
have measure of v and all the surface
land. I think that should go into the
into our open space um measure V and I
don't know why that isn't and maybe we
could um find out if that would be
considered as open space but [snorts]
um I know that I fought for 5 years
against the toll roads because they
wanted to go into our open spaces. So I
think it's very important to protect uh
who we are. Um we have when the TCA land
uh was under negotiation
uh it was going to Tleg Maintenance
Corporation Ted Associates but you know
there was a cost of someone said $30
million $40 million but that that's not
true because it was open space. Thank
you.
>> Impressive PowerPoint.
[laughter]
>> Y any other public comments?
>> No.
>> We have a motion. I
>> I'll make a motion. I just want to point
out this is a this is a report we're
required to produce by by law. Is that
correct, Andy?
>> At least a portion of it. One of this
one of the things that this does address
is our responsibility to look at each
one of the city's properties on an
annual basis for whether or not it could
include some affordable housing. That's
part of the of the state law. This
allows us to do that.
>> All right. I'd move the item.
>> I'll second the introduce the ordinance
1812
>> is
resolution
>> there. You want to read that?
>> Uh, we don't need to read. Okay. I I'm
happy to read it, but it's
>> No, not if we don't have to.
>> We have a a motion by Council Member
Cabal. Second.
>> And just to clarify, this is the
introduction, the first reading of the
ordinance. Correct.
>> Correct.
>> I'll second that.
>> Well, this is a wrong This is item 10 A.
There's this is a resolution
>> 26135.
>> Moving the item is a motion to adopt
resolution 26135.
>> And the motions are made by council
member Cabal, second by council member
Mire. And I think council member who
wants to make a comment. I
>> I have a question for for the staff. Uh
on the uh attach attachment five
proposed the policy 901-2
property acquisition policies
5.4 appraisal and evaluation.
Um
you divide the potential transactions or
land acquisition into two categories.
The first one is acquisition involving
compensation
and the second one is a donation and a
dedications
and you propose that the if if the city
is buying a piece of land we're going to
do some appraisal but if we are
accepting some land we don't do not do
some
appraisal
um we all I I think it's well understood
that uh
the the the free land is not really
free. A lot of time it comes with
obligations for example conservation
easement has a habitat management
program which has a long-term financial
liability. So the city is going to take
over those piece of land we to take over
the liabilities and and I think they
have a value which is a negative value.
It's worthwhile to have appraisal no
matter what. So, is there a reason that
you are not proposing a appraisal for
donations and dedications?
>> Well, the uh that's a great question,
Council Member Woo. Um the appraisal is
u necessary when the city is looking to
expend funds to purchase a property uh
to ensure that the amount of uh
compensation for that property is
commensurate with the property's value.
on a donation of land, the value of that
property is not really the issue.
However, the maintenance cost, the life
cycle cost, all of those types of
obligations that the city may incur
would be evaluated through the other
aspects of this policy.
So if we receive a piece of land with
conservation easement
uh I suppose that appraiser will do a
valuation of that easement.
So without that appraisal, how does the city come up with the a
number
>> through the other requirements in this
policy which require us to look at
long-term u maintenance costs uh life
cycle costs the the the amount of uh
funds that would be required to simply
own and maintain this property.
essentially then an appraisal. An
appraisal is looking at the value of a
property for purchase. Since there's
since the property would be donated,
we could take it at face value that the
value of the property is is $0. Whether
there are long-term obligation costs,
that's that's something that the rest of
this policy will address.
>> So essentially staff will do the
appraisal work.
>> Yes. There's there's additional work
that would identify those particular
costs. The appraisal is really just
looking at what the value of the
property is. And for donated property,
it's it's not really necessary since the
city's not paying for the property.
>> Okay. Thank you.
>> Question.
>> Yep. We have a motion and a second. All
in favor? I.
>> Passes 5-0.
Next item on the agenda is consideration
of an ordinance amending section
1.12.010
of the Sony Municipal Code to authorize
the park rangers to enforce provisions
of the California Fish and Game Code and
finding this action is exempt from the
California Environmental Quality Act SQA
pursuant to SQA guidelines sections
153075308
and 15321.
>> Are there any oral comments on this?
>> No. Does anybody need to hear a staff
report?
>> I'll make a motion to move the item.
>> Motion by council member, second by
Mayor Prom Nobel. All in favor? I
>> pass 5-0.
» Lobster cops.
>> Okay.
>> The new reality show.
Next item on the agenda is consideration
of resolution number 26-136
approving the arts and culture committee
fiscal year 20 26 27 work plan.
>> Okay. Um
do we need a a staff report on this
item?
>> Okay. With with that uh are there any
public comment?
>> Yes, there are.
>> Okay. Let's go ahead and hear the public
comment.
>> Okay. Michael Wesburg followed by
Sherman Fowler.
Good evening. Uh I'm Michael Wexburg,
recently appointed to the Arts and
Culture Committee. I helped work on the
uh the work plan that you're
considering. However, today I'm just
speaking for myself and not for the
committee. And I encourage you to um I
guess accept the um the resolution.
uh so that the work on the amphitheater
remains part of our job jar uh on the
committee because there's specific
expertise that committee members have
that aren't elsewhere available and uh
believe we can help uh steer that effort
and make it happen more quickly. Uh next
slide.
I started working on this a little bit
after I was appointed to the committee.
I wanted to come up with a process for
how we'd select between sites and figure
out what it needed to do. I wanted to
come up with something solid to hand
over to uh the city manager and staff to
uh go forward with. Next slide. So I I
visited a bunch of sites in the city
uh uh and did an evaluation. I used some
AI tools to help me and uh one of the
places I didn't visit was Forester Ranch
because I initially thought it was too
small. But after the council meeting on
the 4th uh and I saw what you did there,
I did visit Forester Ranch
um and did some of the same thing I did
for the other sites. Uh these are some
of the advantages and disadvantages.
uh mainly their limitations in size and
time of uh uh available to do things.
Next slide.
Uh but I did go through it looks like it
is suitable for around a 300 uh seat
amphitheater.
Um uh this is a con an AI image of a
concept. Uh so you should be aware of
that and it's not complete but it gives
you an idea of what might be done there.
Um there are issues mainly with uh ADA
requirements and parking that need to be
considered. Next slide. Uh I also came
up with uh some ideas for an execution
strategy in a couple of phases. Next
slide.
And uh I also
uh queried about potential funding
sources
uh for this sort of a project and it
came up with a list and there's some
other searches that I did. These are
beyond just the the city funds.
So next slide.
Uh so I'm encouraging you to retain this
task within the arts and culture
committee. Uh we have things and I'm not
just speaking about myself but other
members on the committee have expertise
to help guide this. We can support the
effort that you've already assigned.
>> Thanks Mike.
[clears throat]
>> Next speaker is Sherman Fowler.
» Mayor city council. Uh, I just want to
say I'm here um as the chairman for the
arts and culture committee. I would like
for you to take in consideration that
when it comes to art, in order to be
proficient at art, you have to be
committed. And that means putting in the
time. And so, uh, as you can see in in
Michael's u presentation, um, it's on
his dime. He put in the time. So I ask
that you um let the arts and culture
committee to continue its task because
we were tasked to actually be a brain
trust for you when it comes to
creativity for the city. So to task us
with a um to go out and bring
information to you so you can reevaluate
would would be a slap in the face to
take that off of our workbook because we
brought it to the workbook. We voted on
it. We moved on it. We committed to it
and we act on it. And tonight, I'd like
to ask you to act on our workbook and
continue to allow your arts and culture
committee to be involved in this uh
amphitheater project because I would
also like to ask you to see us, the arts
and culture committee, because we are
your brain trust when it comes to
creativity and the arts for San
Clemente. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Sherman.
Is that all the comments?
>> That is all the comments.
>> Okay. You have any discussion?
>> Uh yeah, mayor. Um I'd like to make a u
well it's it's rare to see well um to
see some newly uh appointed committee
member just put in the time and start
working immediately. And so that's the effort I appreciate. I think
the the committee is an advisor to the
security council. So I don't think it
will it would hurt just to keep that
item on their work plan and so keep
[snorts] them engaged because they can
be helping hands to the to the council
while the council is taking the control
of the direction they can assist the
council. So with that, I'd I'd like to
uh make a motion to adopt the resolution
number 26136
without without a removal of the
uh amphitheater component.
» comment. Sure.
>> Yeah. Um
I I I appreciate the members coming
here. I appreciate the work that that
you've done on this matter. Uh it's uh
it is uh it looks like you're it's
something you really want to do and and
are engaged in and we appreciate that.
Uh and I I would uh believe I I believe
that you know your your your commitment
to to pursuing this is something uh I I
could support. Uh because I I I think
whenever we get someone that actually
sees the project now that's been
identified, they can develop a vision.
Uh we're put the effort and time into
it. I think uh you're we're at the right
point. So I I think uh uh I I support
you guys uh continuing with that that effort.
>> Any other comments?
So, I I do appreciate all the work you
have done on this and it it is it is
incredibly apparent how much passion you have in it and it is incredibly
appreciated. Um, I do believe at this
point because the council voted on this
two weeks ago uh to give this to staff
that as as well as the job that you are
doing on it, I believe that the staff
can expedite this and I would love to
see staff still reaching out to you and getting your opinion on on certain
uh
aspects of it. But as a whole for the
project, uh I believe to get this done
quickly and efficiently, we need to hand
it over to staff. That was the direction
of the council.
>> Yeah. Uh I I agree real quick. The thing
is there's obviously an appetite for an
amphitheater and we came to some kind of
proposal that we could actually bring to
fruition. Uh I I I love Mike's drawings
and I I'd like to have more of
conversation with him. Uh let me ask a
quick question before we go on. uh our
director of beaches and parks. Um as we
move forward with this and I I'd like to
move forward with it. Could you still
accept some an ad hoc from your arts and
culture committee? I I I mean Mike's
drawings are great, you know, and I
think it might actually enhance our as
we as we go forward. Uh is that
something that's possible to do still
even if it's not on their work plan per
se? Okay. Uh well, I think that that
gives us an opportunity. The thing is,
well, we've how how long have the 24
pickle ball courts been on our our our
plan, our general plan? How how many
years has that been?
>> 2023.
Okay. So, six years. And And we're
no closer to having that than than we
were then. The issue with going in and
having a grandiose plan is if we know we
can't fund it, then then we have
nothing. And I think this gives us an
opportunity to build something because
there is an appetite. I think it still
gives the uh arts and culture committee
a chance to to weigh in on probably what
it should look like. And also once it's
built, it gives the uh arts and culture
committee a chance to say what can we
perform there? And so and I don't think
that needs to be necessarily on on their
work plan to do that could be part of
the cultural experience in San Clemeni.
What can what can we do? What kind of
performances we can we do? So with that,
I I just don't I think we can move
forward this quickly and actually have
something. I mean, look, if this becomes
really really popular and we see a need,
then I think we would all have an
appetite to say, well, do we need
something bigger? Do we need a groundup
uh construction? And and at that time,
we could put it back on their work plan.
And I think uh I just think that the way
I think we're moving from the work plan
now so we can move forward on this so we
don't have to go back to the committee
and then where next to the arts and or
the design and review committee and the
so we're going to be two years before we
ever see this and and I'd just like to
see us go forward on it now because I
think there is a need for this uh for
this facility that's
>> man while we're working on the design
and the the awesome cultural committee
can help us to to develop a program of
uh
on the site.
>> I I Yeah,
>> maybe we can have them to work.
>> Yes, we can. I think I made that that
comment. And I think how many people are
on the arts and culture committee?
>> Seven.
So, they can come up with uh with
three of them, right? They could be on a
subcommittee that could work with you
directly for that. I think I think that
they should, but that still keeps our
keeps the progress going on this so we
can actually see it sometime. So, I'd
like to see a Christmas carol done at
the uh, you know, amphitheater there
sometime in December, maybe. You never
can tell. We might be able to make it
happen. So, that's my feeling. I I don't
think having on on the uh work plan or
off the work plan keeps them from
participating while still having the
program go forward. That's my feeling.
>> Yeah, I agree. I I think they will be an
integral part of everything we do going
forward. They're the they're the
experts. I I think the the council's
again, as you said, recognized a need
and appetite for an amphitheater. we've identified a location and and
moving forward and I like the work that the pres the work that was
presented uh Michael
>> but I'm not sure I I like the idea of a
development fee to pay for it but uh I
there are the resources but uh but uh
clearly they'll be partnering as we move
forward
>> absolutely so I think we're on the same
page but h how do we go about
>> well I think what we do I think somebody
needs to make a motion that we that we
uh that we pass this resolution with the
uh the work plan implement from the arts
and culture are coming off but with
direction to the staff that they will uh
have a ad hoc committee from the arts
and culture participate in this project.
>> That's a motion. I second it.
>> Okay. That that was my motion.
>> Second it. [laughter]
>> Okay.
Just to be clear, you are making the
motion to adopt resolution number 26136
with the with the uh attachment of
having an ad hoc committee from the arts
and culture to support
>> removing it from the arts and cultural
committee work plan but with the
implementation of a hadoc ad hoc
committee to work with our director of
beaches and parks.
>> So that was my motion. Is that a second
by council member Cabraw? All in favor?
I passes 5-0.
Thank you.
>> Okay. Next item on the agenda is the
city position on a resolution being
considered by the League of California
Cities at the 2026 annual conference.
And um at at your last meeting, council
voted to appoint Council Member Inmmyer
to serve as the city's voting delegate
at the 2026 annual general assembly
meeting at the League of California
Cities annual conference. And subsequent
to that decision, the league has sent
out what will be considered at that
general assembly. And it's a resolution
of the general assembly of the League of
California Cities calling for a working
group to consider a state constitutional
amendment or other form of initiative to
ensure final local authority over
housing and land use decisions.
>> Do we have Oh, are we done? I'm sorry.
>> That's it. And it just council needs to
decide whether or not to support uh this
resolution.
>> Okay. Do you have any public comments?
>> We do not.
>> Okay. Can we do this with consensus if
on on this if if we're in consensus that
we should support this? Is that enough?
>> I'm in I'm consent.
>> Are we supportive of this?
>> As long as it does not contradict your
own
the consensus that we are that
supporting the resolution.
>> Yes. I I agree. As long as the
discussion about a constitutional
amendment doesn't drift beyond the issue
in front. Well, I think it's I think
it's the resol [laughter] it's just a
resolution that the Cal Cities will come
up with a committee to discuss a
constit. It's like do we want to be in
support of having a committee being
formed under Cal Cities to look at a
possible constitutional amendment?
>> Yeah, that's the resolution.
>> And you you'll be there the three days
for to
>> I will be there three days.
>> Yeah.
>> Okay.
We have a consensus. Is that a
consensus?
>> Is that enough? We support it. Okay,
thank you. Moving on.
>> Get a lot of votes. [laughter]
>> I'm going to make you wear a sandwich
sign and walk around. Support this.
>> Moving on to uh Sorry, my
>> Are we in
>> consent calendar? Yes.
>> Okay. Has the public asked to pull any
items?
>> 11D.
is in David public. Any council
members wish to pull an item?
>> I'd like to pull 11 H. 11H from council
member Cabraw
» else
move the balance unless there are any
other
>> okay motion by mayor prom no second by
councilmire in favor I okay now we'll
hear the comment on 11D
>> 11D
uh first speaker is Amanda Kinttonia
followed by Barbara Miller
Um hello. I was reminded by a wonderful
San Clemeni resident, a longtime Skele
resident that when this was first
presented um before the city council
that uh there was a condition that cars
would be removed or hauled away if there
were complaints. And so I wanted to
remind you of that because there was
conversations or discussion among the
city council that uh you know moving 100
ft would only have to be uh if there was
any complaints um because I I I think
what it came down to is that um certain
residents could complain, oh this car
has been here for for 72 hours when it
hasn't. So there I would have to be a
complaint to our deputies regarding that
this has been this car has been here for
72 hours. So that's where I'm I'm
concerned about. Um so I don't know in
this resolution if it does say regarding
complaints or if it addresses it. So I
just wanted to make sure of that. Um
because I know sometimes uh residents
could say oh yeah that car has been
parked but that person's been move you
know has gone and moved and you know if
that space is there you know there's proof or um that they have
moved. Um sorry I'm not really speaking
that clearly. There have been situations
on our street where a car has been moved
and other residents have said, "Oh, no,
that car hasn't been moved." But there
is documentation to prove yes, that it
was moved. So, I don't want this to be a
retaliatory
um uh uh ordinance to where it does
become retaliatory.
um you know someone reporting it to the
deputies they would come out here come
out to the residents mark the car and
then 72 hours then if it wasn't moved
then they would get hauled away. So I
just wanted to make sure if there was a
complaint system in place and uh that it
would follow that.
>> Thank you madam. I think that's it.
>> And and chief, just for clarification,
not the distance has changed 100 ft, but
the they still come out and mark it and
make note exactly where the car was
parked, right? I I mean, so
isn't that how it still works?
>> Yes, sir. That is accurate.
>> Okay. So, it would they would know
whether it was moved 100 ft or not in 72
hours or not.
>> Correct. The only issue is if they moved
100 ft and came right back to the same
spot,
>> parked in the exact same spot. Yes, sir.
All right. Thank you. But that would be
the same and moving it six inches
though, right?
>> Yes, sir.
>> Okay. All right. Thank you. And was
there another speaker on this?
>> Barbara Miller.
>> Barbara.
» Hello. And I agree with Amanda. Nothing
is meant to be retaliatory. We just
thank you so much for recognizing that
this ordinance is very important and we
really appreciate you passing it and it
keeps us in line with the other
neighborhoods and the other communities
and cities around us that have passed
this too.
We want clean, safe streets, so we
appreciate you doing this and nothing to
be retaliatory. We love our neighbors.
We just want clean, safe streets. Thank
you.
>> Thank you, Barbara.
Okay,
>> I'll make a motion to adopt ordinance
number 1811.
>> Motion by council member Mire.
>> I'll second it. All in favor?
>> I passes 5 0 one or 11H from Victor
Pulvic.
>> Yeah, this is an item I would like to
table at this time. And let me let me
explain why we don't have any staff
here, but so I'll explain. We're
currently reviewing proposals.
>> Oh, wait. We we do have a staff here if
you need some I think Samantha's still
here.
>> I'll explain it.
>> Oh. Oh. So you you blame it on staff
being here, but you don't not being
here, but you don't really want to talk
to them. Is that it?
>> I don't. [laughter]
We talked all day.
>> Okay. No. So So we are currently
reviewing proposals uh uh uh for for the
golf course implementation. There's
several parts to to to what we're
looking at, what we're we're we're
asking the companies to bid on. Yeah.
The operation of the golf course, the store. One of the elements is the range. Uh and we've asked them to
put together a bid on the range to say
how would you change it? Uh what would
you do to modify it? Uh how would you
make it more profitable? How would you
improve the grass, the balls,
everything? But uh included in that
would be their proposal to say okay we
will do A b C and D and we want this
percentage of the profits and the city
could take another percentage but here
we're spending $300,000
in advance of of them even committing to
do anything. And so I would rather see
if there's a company out there that and they may they're they're evaluating
they may look and say we will do it but
we want the profits or bigger portion of
the profits. So rather than us commit
let us finish a process of reviewing uh
all the proposals out there because
that's this is part of the discussion of
what whether they they want to run the
range and what what percentage of the
profits they want of it. I don't want to
commit. And I think our our Samantha
said, you know, we're not going to do
this this month or next month.
>> Why don't you start working your way up?
Samantha might have
>> start correcting me,
>> but but uh so so we're going to get done
with the process of reviewing the bids
in in the next uh few months. and you
know and then at that point we could if
we tabled this we could bring this back
and have make it part of uh whatever
agreement we come to and see if someone
wants to pay for it. Samantha, I have a
question. If this project the baseline
of all the proposals, they already know
that the city is going to do that or
they don't.
>> Um
the contract, well, we did the bid
process. So, this would be the city
originally was going to be doing the
work. Even under the scenario that a
potential new operator would be willing
to contribute to this, the city would
still manage the project and and be
overseeing it given the nature of it. I
think the expectation could be that an
operator is going to help fund it just
by it um this has happened before. So
they've cut like a check essentially to
>> Well, my question is when we send out
the request for proposal,
>> do they understand that the city is
going going to do this project?
>> Yes. Yes. Originally the contract that
you're looking at tonight was it's a
city it's a city project.
>> No, the request for proposal of the
operators.
>> Oh, this was not part of the RFP for
this the pro shop. No.
>> So they don't know that the city is
going to do this project. It's not
pricing their proposal.
>> No, this was not a piece of the RFP for
this pro shop services.
>> Okay.
>> Is there any are any of the results
coming back from that saying that they
would want to be involved in creating
netting?
>> So, a a large element of the RFP was to
allow um proposers the opportunity to
say how they could contribute to the
future master plan. Um we we tried to
keep it very broad in that sense cuz
really the longerterm vision is a master
plan for the golf course. Substantial
portion of that is a is a redevelopment
and reimagining of the driving range
facility which would include an
increased netting. It wasn't
specifically spelled out but for our pro
shop operators who or proposers who
submitted that was part of the the the
conversation piece. Now the task force
as the council's assigned it is going to
have interviews with the um
organizations who submit a proposals and
through that interview process this can
be a conversation piece that's
incorporated into it to get more
details.
>> So then there's no hurry right now in in
awarding this contract?
>> No. Um our public works director said
that there's about 120 days typically
within um a bid process that a
contractor is going to hold their price
for about 120 days. And I feel pretty
confident that we'll be able to get
through interviews in the next couple of
weeks here makes a decision part of that
interviewing process and understanding
can can be a piece of this as well.
>> Okay. I' as a scratch golfer at Salty
Turf, I have [laughter] I've got a
question. So, what's the difference in
what you're saying and what Victor's
saying? I I mean, what's what's the
thing here? What's our what's our
>> Where's it meet?
>> Yeah. I don't I don't I think the the
element um that council member Capell is suggesting is to continue this item
tonight allow the task force as you've
appointed the pro shop operations task
force to finish their job in
interviewing um the folks who have have
submitted proposals. Part of that can be
a conversation of how will you
contribute to the future funding um and
improvements at the golf course and then
bring it back.
>> Okay. Instead of tableabling, it would
be better to bring it back to a date
certain.
>> Is that right?
>> Continue.
>> We can continue it to certainly.
>> Oh, go ahead, Steve.
>> I have a question to the city attorney.
Just just curious uh with any contract
to manage the course, does that do
anything for the prevailing wage require
responsibilities we have in bidding this
project out in the future? If a third
party were to come in and contract,
» the prevailing wage requirement depends
on exactly what they're doing. So like
pro shop does is not
>> let's say let's say we're talking about
driving raising the net. Yeah,
>> the net.
>> Um
>> would that theoretically
>> that's theoretically
>> exclude from prevailing wage or would be
stuck in prevailing wage? Do you know?
>> I don't know off the top of my head. It
might be either one.
>> Okay, that well that's a important
consideration for holding off. We may we
may get an answer on that that could
save us some money as well.
>> Just a question.
>> Well, there's there's not a way to avoid
it by waiting. We if it's a prevailing
wage project, it's a prevailing wage
project, then it wouldn't matter.
>> Well, that's the question. If we had a
third party manager,
>> yeah, that's not going to matter in the
analysis.
>> Won't matter in your opinion. Would
still be stuck with prevailing wage?
>> If it's a prevailing wage project, yes,
>> that's the question.
>> It is a prevailing wage project.
>> Project.
>> It is. It is. They it's been bid as a
public works project which includes
prevailing wage.
>> Okay. So in that
>> okay I know we bid it but if a third
party came in and said I'm now managing
this store I want to build the project
on my own nickel and I expect a a higher
percentage. Would that keep it in?
That's my question.
>> You can't avoid prevailing wage
>> issues by having another party.
>> Okay. It sounds like that's
>> it's still prevailing wage. Yes. No if
they do it or we do it. It's still
prevailing wage. I like that idea
though.
>> Every nickel, [laughter] every nickel is
important. Thank you, sis.
>> Samantha, if we want to continue it,
what what's the timing that works for
you?
>> Um, I think we'd like to get this back
to you no later than your first meeting
in October. Could come sooner than that,
but I wouldn't just based on the timing
of the contractor's kind of price
holding. I'd like to get it to you that
first meeting in October.
>> Okay. Andy, you want to weigh in?
>> Yeah, I wanted to answer your question a
little bit. I I think where you're what
you're asking is as part of the proposal
process what we can ask and we can
assess the different people that we
interview is um are you willing to
contribute what maybe that is a higher
percentage of the um the higher
percentage of the revenues generated by
the driving range for whatever period of
time to pay the city back for the cost
that's going to be associated with this.
So that'll be part of that negotiation.
I think that was your question was the
monetary side of it. It's very possible
that we could talk to them and say,
"Hey, we're going to be making this
contribution and this improvement in the
course. Are you willing to consider a
higher percentage to the city until we
are able to repay ourselves for this
investment?"
>> But this is also this also comes out of
the the enterprise fund which is a
separate fund from the general plan from
our general fund.
>> That's right.
>> So you just want to postpone the
contract until we have
>> Do you want to make a motion to continue
this first meeting in October?
If not sooner if the staff not if not
sooner has already yes that's
>> okay second by mayor prom no block all
in favor I ask 5
>> thank you
>> okay oral communications part two I have
one speaker card Tony Rubilino
hey council so when Mark ran for council
he originally claimed that these were
supposed to be nonpartisan seats. I
would like you to listen to a clip that
he made recently.
>> See, congratulations on a 10-year
anniversary. You are making a
difference. You are helping to change
policy up and down from the federal
government to the state to the county to
the local to school boards everywhere.
You are making a change. Well done. Keep
it up.
>> That was well-wishing the Democratic
women of South Orange County on their
anniversary. Mark, please share with us
what is it that they were doing that was
so great. Was it the one of the founding
members making a slit throat gesture at
me while I waited to speak at a council
meeting? Was it one of their more
prominent members standing up and
interrupting the meeting to such an
egregious offense that you had to stop
and recess until order could be called
in council chambers? Was it that they
were very prominent in supporting Eric
Swallwell for California governor who
then was later be found a sexual fiend
and even this week we have found that
the FBI may have been involved in
covering up his affair with a Chinese
spy. Uh so please Mark share with us
what is it that is so great [snorts] and
Mark I really think it's pretty
hypocritical hypocritical of you to
claim that these are nonpartisan seats
and then to go ahead and publish a uh
video like that. I would love to hear
your retort.
Um let's go ahead and shift gears
though. I would also like to discuss
Oceanfest. That was a huge huge success.
It was very widely attended and a lot of
the the praise that I heard was for the
jet ski event. And the jet ski event was
also something that as many of you
recall that that was an event that the
um beaches parks and reccks uh director
said that that was an event that could
not happen. So it turns out that that
was wrong. The event was widely praised
and I think that the event coordinator
had originally asked for a standalone
event. I would suggest highly that there
would be communication if there isn't
already to try and embrace a standalone
event. I think that um he proved that he
could pull it off. It could be safe. It
could be well attended. I mean, there
were people up on the pier that were
getting uh jet ski spray um from the
ocean and people were just loving the
flips and everything like that. It was
really incredible. So, thanks for that.
And then the last thing is this is the
last uh meeting before we head into
September and October in an election
year. That's usually what we call silly
season. Um it sounds like that uh I have
to confirm, but if Miss Kathy Ward is
going to be running, there's definitely
going to be have to uh some
presentations because I think the public
would like a refreshing on what went
down over the past decade. And uh we'll
see see y'all there. Thank you. Thank
you.
>> And we have one more speaker card. Mike
K.
>> Mike. Hello, council. I'll keep this
short. Uh at the very beginning, we were
talking about lifeguards and the
potential for increasing their salary
and the potential for them uh becoming
first responders, and this got me to
thinking of some conversations I've had
with park rangers who have expressed a
similar uh desire, and we've uh fleshed
out some of those ideas. So, I'm just
asking council as you go forward those
discussions with lifeguards visav um
expanding their powers and and their uh
certification for first responder
different types of first responder
status um that you potentially include
or consider the park rangers to expand
their um uh abilities um in a similar
manner. And both um both groups
potentially could play important roles
should we have a natural disaster here
in San Clementi. Even things as mundane
but extremely important as uh people
leaving the scene of a of a fire for
example coming in going doortodoor for
example helping with elderly uh folks
and and the rest to get them out of
harm's way. um even things like that
could be areas where both forces uh
could come together. Lifeguard doesn't
have to just work at a beach. In some
instances, uh there could be roles uh
for both to play. I personally have seen
all of this happen in real time. I know
exactly what the consequences are. I
know that most towns are not prepared
for these types of major disasters. Uh
but these two under potentially
underutilized uh groups could be
included into some of these areas.
There's many other areas where they
could be certified for um as well and
potentially measure M funds I think
could go towards both of those uh both
one for the beach and uh if it's fire
protection uh for the uh park rangers.
Anyway, I just wanted to share some of
those ideas. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Mike.
>> Yes. Go. You want to make a comment?
>> Oh, no. I was Are we done? I I was going
to
>> done. Yeah. No, I I was going to make
>> We're getting there. Future [laughter]
agenda. Future agenda items.
>> Usually we let the city clerk announce
it and then we go and [laughter]
>> future agenda items.
>> Yeah. I I think it's been discussed.
[laughter] I thought we were there
already. [clears throat]
Uh uh I think the idea of of uh at least
evaluating the our lifeguards and the
role they play in our city uh and at the
very least the the the the salary and
equity you know with other communities.
Uh I don't know anything beyond that but
we would leave it up to staff to
determine uh whether uh uh what the next
steps are and what the best approach is
and I think that's uh the place to
start. So I'd like to agendaize that
>> second agendaizing that.
>> Yeah, we have first a second and I'm
sure Mark wants to make a third but I
also want to make sure that agendaizing
this doesn't prohibit our city manager
from doing something now that he's
already got in
>> action. I don't I don't know. I
you
>> yeah
I don't want I don't want this to come
across wrong. This isn't the right
process for what for for evaluating
salaries and you know if this is the
process then we're just going to have
every employee group come up here and do this and we'll just this is the
way we'll do our our salaries in the
future. Um what we'd like to do is take
a look at this. It's a it's it's a me
it's a multi-layered thing as you said.
there's already another employee group
that's been brought up by another
resident and so this isn't the way we
typically address salary scales and
salaries um through this process. So
we'd like to follow the correct process.
We have meetings to have with our
employee association. I mean they they
have rights to meet and confer and talk
about these things. There's there's a process that's set up in our
memorandum of understanding that needs
to be followed. So
>> that's all I'm asking for to to help us
understand that better. I mean, whatever
that might be. We're not asking you to
come up with you go out and negotiate
something. We're just asking you cuz I
don't understand the process completely.
>> Perfect.
>> Well, then that can be a staff report
because I don't think the city council
wants to step on the toe of a city
manager to establish the salary scale.
>> City manager has heard heard this loud
and clear and I have confidence that
he's addressing the issue. That that's
all. So, if you want a staff report to
come back at some point, if there is
something that's gleaned, that's fine.
>> Is this something that we instead of
doing a an agenda future agenda items,
is this something we could individually
talk with our city manager about and go
through that process uh or would you
guys like to hear this this process uh
in in front of uh the public? So maybe
what I could do is jump to the end and I know it's not on the agenda, so
I'm I'm just going to give you a real
quick answer. If this is something we
can accommodate within the existing
budget, it's something that we would
move forward. We we make salary
adjustments on a pretty regular basis
based on different things that are
happening in the organization. And as
long as we're within the adopted budget,
we can do that. If it takes an an
additional allocation to make this work,
we bring it back to the council and we'd
say, "Okay, we need some additional
allocation in the budget to make this
happen." But lots of times there could
be vacancies. There could be some other
equipment that you don't purchase or
something to address it a different way.
I just we haven't taken that deep dive
yet to to know how we're going to
address this issue. It's loud and clear
to us you want us to address it. We
would we'd like to address it and then let you know what the results
are.
>> Any council member wants to contact Andy
and learn about the process is wide
open.
>> I'm satisfied with that. We all have a
consensus on on this now.
>> Okay. Thank you.
Next item.
May
>> I have another item? Hold on. I'd like
the council to review and revise council
policy on media communication.
>> A second.
>> Okay. Just let me ask a a question. What
does that mean? I'm just asking to
clarify what that means. Because our
current council uh council procedure and
policy is very vague on how the council
approach media accept media interview
and uh uh calling for press conference
for example who is responsible who it it
only identifies that the mayor as a
council as a spokesperson for the city
but other than that is very vague and I
think the council would benefit if we
have a little more established policy
and procedure.
>> Are you talking about because don't we
have a PIO in the city also? Don't we
have Andy? Do we have a PIO? Okay. So,
>> this is not about the staff. This is
about a council's act.
>> Yeah. No, I know. I'm just trying I'm
trying to get this
>> correct. Yes, we have a a public
information officer. um if it would help
the council, if what you're asking for
is to bring back the existing policy so
you can take a look at that and see if
there need to be any changes, we could we could put that on the next
agenda.
>> Is that what you want to agendaize that
we bring?
>> Yeah, I for discussion bring the the
existing policy back and look and see if
we need to amend it or change it.
>> I may assist to write some policy and see and for the council's
discussion.
>> Okay. And you need a staff report for
that? I assume that
>> well we have two council members. If I
get a third one then I can use
>> that's fine because I I'd like to look
at the policy too. I'll give you a third
and we can look at it and we can discuss
it.
>> Okay. Thank you. So So I have your
authorization to work with the staff to
come up with some more established
policy and procedures
>> for our discussion. I think
>> well that well that I I I would be fine
to have them come back with the existing
policy because I don't know it that well
and then we can have a discussion and
see if there's any alterations we need
to make to that at that time at the next
meeting.
>> Bring your ideas on that council next
meeting.
>> Sure. Okay.
>> Is that fair?
>> Yeah, of course. Existing policy is
almost
>> perfect. Okay. Any any other agenda
items? I have uh two items, Mr. Mayor.
The first is that uh uh regarding the
amphitheater at the Forester Ranch
Community Park, I I think with the end
of the summer, uh we look at that
facility and we we look about its
capabil we're wondering about its
capabilities and and and so forth. Uh
and what I'd like to do is is perhaps
have a uh a uh how do you call it? a dry
run kickoff session where we where we
have a uh a a m musical band that that
plays there where the arts and and
culture subcommittee can can monitor and
look at uh look at what's needed in
terms of uh preliminary view in terms of
electricity staging lighting access
through the school district additional
parking sort of a sort of a dry run if
you will of uh kind of what we need in
the future as we go forward and I'd like
maybe to have the parks and recreation
department to schedule an an a impromptu
uh ad hoc, if you will, pre uh
presentation and maybe select a
interesting local band that could play.
>> Maybe we have a natural event that
movies there.
>> I know they do movies, but I'm talking
about But that's
>> You're talking about a concert.
>> I'm talking about more of a concert,
more of a more of a a theatrical or
musical production that requires some
additional uh equipment and so forth
just to sort of observe. What is the
next natural event that we can just move
it to there and see how it works?
[snorts]
>> The only condition I was going to ask is
it not be the musical group that
performed earlier tonight. But
[laughter] um
>> there you go again.
Everybody is right.
>> No, but the I I think you know perhaps
something associated with the holidays
or something is going to probably be the
next natural time and maybe we could do
something like that. maybe have even,
you know, contact maybe some of the
schools and see if they're doing a
Christmas concert and if they would want
to do something where, you know, might
get the parents involved and we can kind
of see how it would work and even maybe
that school we can talk to them.
>> Again, Christmas is still four or five
months away and I'm thinking maybe
something short
>> closer to more more end of the summer.
Uh
>> okay.
>> Uh view sort of a
>> Sure.
>> Yeah, that's the end of the summer.
>> I know that's what I mean. That's what I
mean. I mean
>> I mean I'll certainly second that and
that's something you can just do through
Samantha, right? We don't need Okay, it
was something else.
>> Uh yeah, second the second thing is I'd
like to agendaize
a a a council resolution supporting uh
Prop 39. Um
Proposition 39 is a election ID uh issue
which uh which impacts the entire nation
and impacts the state. It impacts the
city of San Clementi particularly. Uh
there's been a lot of uh concern about
uh um accurate voting and uh this item
was approved by the the citizens to go
on the agenda. The attorney general
turned it from a voter ID integrity rule
to to a title which basically says
prevent citizens from from voting unless
they prevent ID. So I'd like a
resolution. I I I'll present I'd like to
present a resolution for the council's
consideration at our next meeting.
Attorney, are there any rules getting
this close to election season about
propositions and what the council can
and cannot do in terms of supporting
different propositions or not?
>> The city council can take a position.
>> That's my my request.
» Okay. Have a second to to bring to bring
it back for discussion at the next next
council meeting.
>> Next council meeting. Yes. Is somebody
want to second that?
>> I'll second it. Okay, I have a second.
We don't need a staff report. It's going
to be for dis discussion only.
>> Correct.
>> Okay.
Thank you.
>> Any other agenda items? Yeah, that
brings
>> that brings a a important um point
because
I I'm think um
maybe we can uh also have the council to
express our position on proposition
41, 42, 43, and 40. They're all about
the tax. This is a big issue statewide.
the state the statewide
>> the state well the I believe 40 is the
mansion tax but um I'm more interested
in 43
which is essentially ACA 22 that is
asking
>> okay what could you list those again I'm
sorry
>> yeah never mind I think about next time
[laughter]
>> I I was going to do my own homework on
them but uh yeah okay I I mean I think
we're good now all All right, next item
>> report. City attorney.
>> Thank you. I just wanted to clarify what
I said earlier. The council can
agendaize taking a pos official position
on something, but it cannot advocate for
or against a measure. So, that's a it's
a nuance
that I just wanted to clarify. Other
than that, I have nothing to report
except it's a pleasure to serve.
>> A little more clarification on that. the
council can.
>> So if I I assume you'll be putting
forward a resolution saying that the
city
>> council the city of San Clemeni
supports
slash opposes whatever proposition, but
you can't say everybody should vote for
or against it. That would be advocacy.
So, there's a difference between once
stating a position
versus advocating for or against
something on the ballot.
>> Okay. Okay. Thank you. Perfect.
>> All right. So, is that your entire
report?
>> That is my entire and longest report to
date.
>> So, you're you're it's you're not
honored or whatever to work for this
subject.
>> I already said that after that musical
[laughter]
edition. I said it was a pleasure to
serve.
>> I asked the clerk. clerk. Did she say
that? [laughter] I don't think she did
say that. I can confirm for the
>> record. Somebody's covering for
somebody. Okay.
>> City manager.
>> No, I just I want to thank everybody
that everybody from the council to the
residents to the staff for it's been a
really fun summer. There's been a lot of
really cool events and we it's been
pretty uneventful for some of the big
events that we've had and I think we've
all had a good time and I think it's a
good kind of dress rehearsal for some of
the things we're leading up to in the
next couple of years with the Olympics
and the 100th birthday and that kind of
stuff. and we're learning about the the
some of the fun things that are
happening and it's been a fun summer.
So, I just wanted to a shout out to
everybody involved. I think the
residents have been very patient with a
lot of visitors in town and and it's
been a fun summer without a lot of I
think a lot of drama. So, it's been a
lot of fun. So,
>> you're here
>> and our first responders have uh made us
safe and done a phenomenal job.
>> Just a just a huge Yeah, everybody. It's
been great.
>> Well, you got a parking ticket you need
fixed. What's What's the deal? Anybody
want to make a motion to the next
council meeting?
>> I'll make a motion to [snorts] adjourn.
The next regular city council meeting,
let me turn on the mic. Is scheduled to
take place on September 1st, 2026.
Closed session will begin at 4:30 p.m.
and the regular business meeting will
begin at 5:30 p.m. The meeting will take
place in the council chambers located in
910 Gaia Negotio second floor San
Clemeni.
>> I'll second. All in favor? I. We are
adjourned.
I hope my phone's up in your office.