[0:44] Is that right?
[1:05] Yeah, nice thing about
[1:19] » I don't see Any
[1:22] interest?
[1:47] I guess she emailed me.
[2:38] You were the brave stood.
[2:46] My wife
[2:50] absolutely
[3:15] I think it's important.
[3:28] Okay,
[3:30] we'll call to order.
[3:32] See if I'm
[3:36] We'll call to order
[3:39] this August 20th meeting of the Woodland
[3:42] Planning Commission. And we will start
[3:45] with the pledge of allegiance.
[4:11] All right.
[4:14] Take roll call.
[4:17] >> Commissioner Matson
[4:19] >> Commissioner Watt
[4:21] >> Commissioner Lewis
[4:23] >> Commissioner Simpson
[4:25] >> here.
[4:28] Commissioner Red has not arrived yet.
[4:32] >> Um
[4:34] I don't know if this is like cancelled.
[4:36] Do we need a vote to excuse her?
[4:39] So let's go ahead and um somebody make a
[4:43] motion.
[4:48] » All right. Motion's been made and
[4:49] seconded.
[4:52] All those in favor? Hi. All right.
[4:56] This time,
[4:59] one of the most important
[5:02] things of our meeting is um citizen for
[5:06] communication for items not on the
[5:09] agenda.
[5:11] You have anything.
[5:22] I as well
[5:26] » I move that
[5:28] [laughter]
[5:30] >> second.
[5:33] » All right. All right.
[5:38] » So, um,
[5:40] next thing would be agenda approval.
[5:43] >> I move that we approve the agenda as
[5:46] presented.
[5:48] >> Discussion.
[5:51] I have some you know, on this agenda is
[5:54] an action item for our
[5:57] um
[6:00] code enforcement stuff and if we're not
[6:03] ready to take action, we can table it at
[6:06] that time. Okay, just so everybody's
[6:09] aware.
[6:11] All right, so
[6:13] we don't have to roll call that vote.
[6:17] >> I am not. I'm just I want everybody to
[6:20] be satisfied.
[6:23] Do we need to call that vote out?
[6:36] » Are there any objections?
[6:37] >> Anybody object?
[6:39] >> No.
[6:40] >> All those in favor of the agenda as
[6:42] presented?
[6:44] >> All right,
[6:46] enough of the books. All right, we are
[6:50] on to workshopping
[6:52] the retooling our code which is going to
[6:55] result in ordinance 1606
[6:59] and
[7:01] >> actually
[7:03] >> oh shoot I'm sorry thank you
[7:07] always love being corrected um so
[7:11] September meeting
[7:15] we uh Travis is going to be out of town
[7:20] on the 17th and 18th. And
[7:25] we
[7:29] can either move it
[7:32] or
[7:36] cancel it
[7:38] which at this time
[7:40] we don't have any really any heavy duty
[7:43] projects once we finish the retooling
[7:46] our code.
[7:48] Um
[7:50] I think everything would be like
[7:52] formative stuff and we are in compliance
[7:55] with the state so far on how many
[7:57] meetings we have. So
[8:01] um
[8:03] we're workshopping.
[8:05] I think we should move it to
[8:15] I mean unless you have any driving
[8:17] concerns.
[8:26] » Yeah. No long pants next month.
[8:30] >> Okay. So, um
[8:34] That seems to be a good consensus.
[8:38] We need to take action on that or just
[8:41] that's what we've agreed to do and that
[8:44] workshop is over. See how easy this is?
[8:48] >> So you have an unrealistic idea how the
[8:51] rest of this goes to work.
[8:55] >> So move to cancel the meeting on the
[8:57] 17th.
[9:00] So, as a workshop, you don't have to
[9:03] take action. It's your opportunity to
[9:05] direct staff to do stuff.
[9:10] » Okay,
[9:13] we're all in agreement. We're not having
[9:15] a September meeting.
[9:17] Change your calendar, Dave.
[9:22] [laughter]
[9:26] Okay.
[9:29] So, um,
[9:32] that means we're moving into our
[9:34] workshop on ordinance6006, retooling our
[9:37] code that I brought up earlier. And, um,
[9:41] we've got,
[9:44] do you want to do staff report here,
[9:45] Travis? Is that the best thing to do or
[9:48] Sure.
[9:50] >> Um, so for the record, my name is Travis
[9:52] Goddard, community development director
[9:54] for the city of Woodland. And um we have
[9:57] had a couple workshops on these um code
[10:01] changes over the last several months.
[10:03] And there was one change that was
[10:06] requested at the last meeting. And um it
[10:10] is outlined here on the um cover letter.
[10:15] And I will quickly scroll down to the
[10:17] code sections. And specifically the
[10:20] issues that have been brought up is um
[10:23] the issue of
[10:26] uh including in our nuisance language
[10:29] basketball hoops in the streets and
[10:31] blocking sidewalks and the issue
[10:34] associated with odors and making it
[10:37] clear that that odors um will be
[10:41] something that's pursued by code
[10:42] enforcement. And the issue that was
[10:45] brought up was the desire to make sure
[10:47] that the language does not include food
[10:52] preparation. So like whether it's
[10:55] Daddy's De's barbecue or a food truck or
[10:58] a restaurant that just because you can
[11:00] smell it next door, it doesn't
[11:02] necessarily means it's
[11:04] >> that means the neighbor's trigger.
[11:06] >> Yeah.
[11:07] >> Right.
[11:08] >> So So there are two sections where we
[11:11] added that in there and in this case um
[11:14] as identified here we just added a
[11:17] sentence that says, "This shall not
[11:18] apply to odors caused by the preparation
[11:21] of food in a residential or commercial
[11:24] circumstance." So, unless you have some
[11:27] language changes for that, it's pretty
[11:30] straightforward. I think
[11:31] >> I'll take this I'll take this moment,
[11:34] Mike, to answer your question about is
[11:37] there anyone
[11:39] background? So, the background on this
[11:41] is um there is a company in town that
[11:46] makes um
[11:48] fertilizer for the grow industry. And
[11:52] they had a um centriuge evaporator,
[11:57] centrifical evaporator that basically
[12:00] was supposed to cook the water out of
[12:03] the other wash down chemicals. It was it
[12:07] was everything they were washing down.
[12:08] So it wasn't just the fertilizer. It was
[12:10] wash down chemicals with the fertilizer.
[12:13] And it um
[12:16] had quite the odor. I'm sure you've
[12:18] smelled it. And it was um really
[12:22] important to me because I was losing
[12:23] business at my business because of it as
[12:27] well. And so and we don't know about the
[12:31] health implications from it. Our old
[12:35] code said that
[12:40] Southwest Washington Clean Air
[12:43] uh was was responsible for
[12:46] and
[12:49] whatever code
[12:51] Washington deemed was the one that would
[12:53] be enforced. So even though we had a
[12:56] code that said you keep your smell on
[12:58] your property,
[13:01] Southwest Washington, it was arbitrary,
[13:02] they could come out and say, "Well, it's
[13:04] bad, but it's not bad enough to and that
[13:07] was what was happening." And they
[13:08] blatantly said they don't enforce
[13:10] anybody else's code. So yes, I'm 150
[13:13] yards away and I s it, but we don't
[13:17] So that's the background to the need for the
[13:23] change in the first place. And so it has
[13:26] been removed from one of the basically
[13:29] three pieces of code
[13:32] that still refer to clean air for us to
[13:36] have them help us with. But odors is not
[13:42] and it was true and I think reasonably
[13:44] brought up but
[13:45] We don't want somebody putting, you
[13:48] know, restaurants been here for 20 years
[13:50] out of business because they don't like
[13:51] the smell or the
[13:54] vegans complaining about the neighbor
[13:56] cooking st. So that's where
[13:59] um that idea for doesn't apply to food
[14:02] preparation comes into play. And
[14:07] hopefully that takes care of that.
[14:21] after
[14:23] Brea came on board and Brea
[14:27] really
[14:28] stayed on them and they figured out that
[14:30] they're not going to be able to they
[14:34] were just not honest about oh we're
[14:36] doing this and we're doing that. After
[14:38] Brea came on board they figured out that
[14:39] this is going to start getting serious
[14:41] and uh they replace the machine with a
[14:44] different process. So the machine's
[14:47] gone, the odor's gone. And
[14:50] unfortunately, the people from Clean Air
[14:52] told me that they didn't have any way to
[14:56] tell
[14:57] what kind of emissions were in that
[15:00] plume.
[15:01] They just knew it was a plume. And the
[15:04] permit actually was um originated
[15:08] because they needed to burn so much
[15:10] natural gas to run that machine. It was
[15:12] for the carbon dioxide. The permit was
[15:15] for carbon dioxide and steam which are
[15:18] both odorless. So
[15:21] anyway, that's the whole and I mean and
[15:24] that's from back in
[15:27] 2022
[15:29] probably that got started. So it was a
[15:32] long
[15:33] road. I wasn't on the planning
[15:35] commission back then. Um,
[15:38] so now that's the background and here we
[15:40] are.
[16:20] Whatever. Somebody's complain about
[16:26] whatever if because it's complaint
[16:28] driven. So it'll just depend on if I
[16:31] receive a complaint about something else
[16:35] like I did get a complaint about a
[16:38] septic smell and I got the joy of
[16:43] smelling it and sure enough
[16:47] had like cracked. So
[17:05] » we're workshopping. Go ahead.
[17:10] [laughter]
[17:15] That's Yeah, that's good.
[17:22] Mhm.
[17:37] » Yeah.
[18:19] I've been smelling the dog food plant a
[18:21] little bit more. I think that's what it
[18:23] is.
[18:24] >> You think the dog food plant kind of
[18:25] depends on the weather. And so they got kind of a free pass for the
[18:30] longest time because so PDM I was buying
[18:32] steel at PDM next door and it was
[18:35] horrible and I said, "Doesn't that smell
[18:38] bug you?" And they said, "Oh, it's just
[18:40] a dog food plant. They've always been
[18:42] there. I'm like, look at the look at the
[18:44] wind. Look at the steam. The wind is
[18:47] going away from the dog food plant.
[18:48] That's not the dog food plant. You have
[18:50] any idea what you're breathing? You
[18:53] know, and I was about to to the point of
[18:56] contacting the the safety directors for
[18:59] Lifeport and the other businesses and
[19:01] saying, "Hey, you know, this is what
[19:03] this is and you're responsible for your
[19:06] employees health and what they're
[19:08] breathing, even if it's from the
[19:10] neighbors. you know it's it's up but
[19:12] fortunately
[19:15] it one day the machine just got removed.
[19:18] So,
[19:20] um
[19:22] any comments there, questions?
[19:27] So, um
[19:30] at the last meeting
[19:33] I talked about when we got down into
[19:36] like 19, right? enforcements in 19
[19:39] chapter 19
[19:43] and uh
[19:50] go ahead and go on down there. Stop.
[19:56] Um
[20:02] I guess so
[20:05] I had asked about uh turning some of the
[20:08] maze into shs
[20:11] on, you know, where especially when it
[20:14] comes to uh development code stuff.
[20:23] Um it's not what is in there? But I'd
[20:26] asked about it and it kind of got
[20:27] sidelined
[20:32] where it says that the um
[20:44] shall be
[20:51] I like the idea.
[20:54] discussion.
[20:55] >> So, I I like the idea of giving staff a
[20:57] little discretion, too. But what about
[20:59] when it comes to um the environmental
[21:02] code?
[21:04] >> That's where
[21:09] I just
[21:17] find
[21:24] Okay.
[21:28] » I Right.
[21:30] So,
[21:33] >> I don't think
[21:34] >> that's not what I'm thinking of at all.
[21:35] And that's not um
[21:38] even covered in our environmental code.
[21:41] That's covered in our nuisance code.
[21:43] Okay.
[21:44] >> I'll just say this really quick. I mean,
[21:47] currently, how it is written, I've had
[21:50] no problem
[21:52] getting the job done and enforcing when
[21:55] needed. And I don't know if it really is
[21:59] that
[22:01] important to go through and change that
[22:04] one little word. I I know I'm going to
[22:06] enforce it.
[22:07] >> Okay. So,
[22:08] >> but I do like the flexibility of working
[22:11] with
[22:11] >> if you if you go so far with something
[22:14] and then you you hit a wall,
[22:17] then it goes on to the director, right?
[22:20] the responsible official
[22:22] >> they start
[22:23] >> 1990 12
[22:24] >> they start getting penalties and fines
[22:27] and then you take a lean out that's
[22:33] » correct
[22:34] >> so we had Mike Laboki in here for his
[22:39] reaver zone request he wasn't here the
[22:42] first time but he was out of compliance
[22:44] on those properties with parking trucks
[22:48] selling truck parking and not
[22:52] um having any of the storm water
[22:55] permitted, no separators, no nothing.
[22:58] So, he wasn't at the first meeting. So,
[23:01] at the second meeting, I sat here and
[23:03] told him, "You got to have the storm
[23:06] water done. You got to have permits
[23:08] before you open a business there. Before
[23:10] you start parking trucks, you can't let
[23:12] that stuff end up in the storm water."
[23:16] and he's advertising. Are you aware of
[23:19] this?
[23:20] >> Yes.
[23:20] >> He's advertising storage on Craigslist
[23:25] and there's trucks there and signs and
[23:28] everything. So,
[23:32] » yes.
[23:35] So, there's no there's
[23:37] >> there's no there's no occupancy pyramid.
[23:39] Correct.
[23:39] >> And that's correct. And it's final
[23:42] engineering. I'm expecting that. So,
[23:45] >> don't we the engineering and the work
[23:48] and then open for business.
[23:50] >> Yes, that's supposed to occur.
[23:54] >> How are we to get
[23:56] things to occur how they're supposed to
[23:58] occur? But we change
[24:02] 199120.
[24:08] » Well, we need to
[24:22] So, and so this is not this is not
[24:25] somebody's nuisance. This is not
[24:27] somebody's yard. This is not some this
[24:29] is a a blatant
[24:32] u ignor ignoring our development code.
[24:36] Just blatantly ignoring the code and and
[24:39] figuring that apologies cheaper than
[24:42] asking.
[24:44] So, I did start a code enforcement case
[24:48] and I reached out to him and his
[24:50] engineer and his sister and I sent an
[24:54] email saying, "Hello, we're still
[24:56] waiting for payment on your fence permit
[24:58] that you've already built." And I'm
[25:02] curious what's going on with the storing
[25:04] of trucks in that parking area as that
[25:09] has not even been approved yet. And I
[25:14] immediately got a bunch of invoices paid
[25:18] for from him, which is a start, but he
[25:22] did not touch on that other he was out
[25:25] of town. So I was kind of waiting for
[25:27] him to get back to go. I didn't know.
[25:30] Did you agreement with Mike that I was
[25:32] unaware of. I don't want to just start
[25:34] doing stuff before I have all the
[25:35] details. And so that's where we're at
[25:38] right now.
[25:52] » A month.
[25:54] >> Yeah.
[25:56] So um
[26:07] it's not
[26:10] that
[26:17] » I when I don't know when you live
[26:21] downstream from it you're more aware of
[26:25] And then you wonder where it's h where
[26:27] else is it happening, you know, but the fact of the matter is if they park
[26:33] something in there that's loaded with a
[26:35] liquid and it leaks, it's going to end
[26:39] up in the waterway that goes to
[26:40] neighbors properties.
[26:44] >> No.
[26:49] » Yeah. And anyway, that's where um if we
[26:53] don't change this May to a shall what
[26:58] can we do for for these things for them
[27:00] to be you know
[27:05] and and and just in my you know I know a
[27:07] lot of people have complained about
[27:09] things that have gone on on the sand
[27:11] pile and you know just the neglect for
[27:15] our code there and you know I don't see
[27:19] everything I know what I see in my
[27:21] neighborhoods and what I see in my
[27:23] neighborhood neighborhoods is Jeffrey's,
[27:26] you know, running them up and doing
[27:28] things that they're not permitted for a long time. And so what do we do to
[27:32] shake their boots?
[27:34] So
[27:37] I don't know that we need any additional
[27:39] code changes for that. Part of it is our
[27:42] philosophy has always been if they're
[27:45] taking steps to get into compliance,
[27:48] typically we don't. But there are some
[27:51] cases where If we have a repeat
[27:54] offender, we should just go right to the
[27:56] notice and order. And that's an internal
[28:00] decision that we have code that would
[28:03] allow us to make that decision.
[28:06] So
[28:15] » yeah, this language has shall
[28:20] » I don't feel like I need it changed to
[28:22] do my job.
[28:24] >> So you guys are looking at 210 and I'm
[28:27] looking at 120.
[28:29] >> So that's where
[28:32] whenever the reasonable official has
[28:34] believe that a violation of land use
[28:36] ordinance, rule or regulation will most
[28:38] be promptly and adequately terminated by
[28:41] distributes.
[28:46] I can't fake this administrative notice.
[28:50] A written notice and order shall be
[28:52] directed to the person
[28:55] and
[28:56] it says what it has to say. And then at
[28:59] some point here it says
[29:03] the responsible official may at any time
[29:06] add to resend in part or otherwise
[29:07] modify that notice
[29:10] and um
[29:21] » so I had it at the last meeting. Um I'll
[29:26] find it here in a minute.
[29:31] to the order.
[29:42] » I Yeah,
[29:44] >> I did.
[29:53] » Okay.
[29:56] May initiate enforcement action.
[29:58] You're looking at
[30:00] >> 199100A.
[30:02] That's what you're looking at.
[30:02] >> Okay. 199230
[30:06] suspend may suspend any permits. Um
[30:09] there's
[30:11] and that's for for um
[30:18] there's a few in there, but this is
[30:20] mostly land use. So it permits
[30:23] >> and it's not um
[30:29] » my understanding of the context you're
[30:31] talking
[30:47] » um I had it last month and
[30:51] didn't have my stuff with me.
[30:58] » Do you feel that
[31:01] if there's a person that is that is
[31:03] facilitating
[31:13] performing mitigation or whatnot because
[31:15] it says
[31:21] No,
[31:22] >> you start
[31:25] >> I I
[31:31] » I think if you go to a construction site
[31:33] and they're doing something that they
[31:35] haven't gotten permits for, you can put
[31:37] a stop work order on it, right?
[31:38] >> Yep.
[31:39] >> So, if we have a business opened up
[31:42] without any permits to do the business,
[31:44] we can put a stop work order on that,
[31:46] too. Right. We have that ability to do
[31:49] right now.
[31:50] >> Y
[31:50] >> and so
[31:52] what don't you think people would be
[31:55] more inclined to come get things done if
[31:58] they had to stop what they're doing?
[32:01] >> If we were more liberal. Yeah.
[32:04] >> If we were more liberal.
[32:05] with the stop
[32:07] use orders.
[32:08] >> Okay.
[32:12] So, um, they're in the same thing. You
[32:16] know, we had we had another issue where
[32:19] a piece of property was just being used
[32:21] as a a material waste construction waste
[32:25] storage yard and and they brought a rock
[32:28] crusher in without any permits and they
[32:29] did all this stuff and
[32:33] um no matter how many calls I made to
[32:36] the city, it didn't get stopped till
[32:38] finally Travis said to the to the
[32:41] contractor, "You better call this guy
[32:43] because he's pretty down on what you're
[32:46] And when the guy called me, I laid it
[32:48] out for him and he's out of compliance.
[32:51] And he stopped
[32:53] because he's out of compliance. And it's
[32:55] like, you know, we can do this the hard
[32:58] way or we can do it the easy way. The
[33:00] easy way is you stop. The hard way is
[33:03] you stop after it cost you a bunch of
[33:04] money, you know, and if you want me to
[33:07] see that through, I'll see that through.
[33:08] But I don't have to be the bird dog on
[33:10] everything. But I guarantee you if
[33:12] somebody comes to me and says, "Hey,
[33:15] this production companies dusting me out
[33:18] or doing whatever they're doing. I'm I'm
[33:20] going to bird dog it for them just like
[33:21] I would bird dog it for myself. But I
[33:24] just don't understand why it takes so
[33:27] long. And if we can make some code go in
[33:30] there that makes that better.
[33:34] >> Just so you know, um when I drive
[33:36] around, I'll just drive around looking
[33:39] down, see what's going on. I have
[33:42] uh 17 people like doing stuff without
[33:46] permits that I just pulled up and been
[33:48] like, "Hey, stop. Come down to city hall
[33:52] that I have."
[33:53] >> That's awesome.
[33:54] >> Yeah. But I didn't have to go pound. I
[33:57] just was like, "Hey,
[33:59] people are pretty
[34:08] easy."
[34:11] >> You know, you're surprised that you got
[34:13] compliance. You know, I told him, I
[34:16] says, "Hey, I get it. I've built stuff,
[34:19] right? When you're building, you're
[34:20] building and you're throwing money on it
[34:22] and it's got to it's got to make stuff
[34:24] happen. So, a little dust is fine. If
[34:27] you got a piece of property over there
[34:28] that's high density residential and
[34:31] you're treating it like a construction
[34:32] yard and you're you're doing all the
[34:35] construction things over there and
[34:37] you're dusting me out, I'm this is going
[34:39] to be the fourth year if you don't stop
[34:42] of dust and they haven't built anything,
[34:45] you know, and
[34:50] » well they they were behind they were off the road but they were
[34:56] dump trucks in and out, emptying vector
[35:00] trucks just out on the ground, you know,
[35:03] stockpiling asphalt concrete to grind
[35:05] later, you know, just and then grinding
[35:08] it later. And, you know, they have to
[35:10] have a swak up permit to do that. They
[35:12] didn't have any swaka permit, you know.
[35:14] And I emailed Travis and said, "Hey,
[35:18] they're stockpiling stuff that they're
[35:20] going to want to grind later." and they
[35:23] told him, "Oh, we're just storing that
[35:25] grinder."
[35:28] » And then a year later, they did the
[35:31] grinding, you know. So, and they
[35:37] lied their way through that. So, that's
[35:39] where I just just knowing what I know
[35:42] from my neighborhood want to know, is
[35:44] there something we can do in the code
[35:46] that makes it a little better for
[35:48] everybody?
[35:51] So,
[35:54] but I'm just I'm just one person.
[35:58] I think well I know how
[36:02] it's all complaint
[36:10] also.
[36:26] So, I'm just like,
[36:29] um,
[36:30] >> yeah. Well,
[36:33] um,
[36:36] we I'm glad we have bread in there. I
[36:38] really am, but maybe I've just been the
[36:41] unlucky guy to get the sticky ones. So,
[36:43] the smelly guy, by the way,
[36:47] just so you know, um, I don't think
[36:50] Travis was there yet, but I complained
[36:52] about it under the previous mayor.
[36:54] That's how long it's been. and then
[36:56] nothing happened. And then I noticed
[36:58] that the owner of the building was the
[37:01] largest donor at the time I looked to
[37:05] the mayor's re-election campaign. And so
[37:09] that's where you think that's code code
[37:12] helps that, right?
[37:15] >> But
[37:18] and that's the and the question I've
[37:20] always asked when we're writing code. We
[37:22] have to write code that the next person
[37:24] is going to be able to understand and enforce. So,
[37:30] um, if you're telling me we don't need
[37:33] to change the maze to the shs
[37:36] and uh,
[37:39] we won't change the maze to the shs.
[37:41] >> Well, and I think the biggest impact is
[37:44] going to be from the fact that we've
[37:46] gone from $25
[37:48] to 50 75 and 15. So the longer you
[37:52] ignore us, the more painful it gets.
[37:55] Whereas that was never anything to worry
[37:59] about before. It was small enough that
[38:04] people would blow me off.
[38:05] >> Especially if you're renting a space for
[38:07] more than that a day and you're renting
[38:08] a couple hundred. Dave has something to
[38:10] say.
[38:23] I um
[38:29] » yeah so you'll see you'll see in in we
[38:33] have to pay attention to the shoods and
[38:35] the shallows and that's the may shoulds
[38:38] and shall and that's where that's why I
[38:39] was like I want to change this from a
[38:41] may to a shall you know so Um
[38:46] I think we can uh leave it alone. I will
[38:52] be paying attention to see what kind of
[38:54] u
[38:57] things happen there, right? Because this
[39:00] city is not going to get smaller
[39:03] and uh
[39:06] we've got a lot of industrial land. So I
[39:08] hear to build on and you know more
[39:12] problems we can have. So
[39:15] That being said, let's go back to the
[39:17] red lines and discuss them all and um
[39:26] get Mike up to speed.
[39:33] So, um that one
[39:37] kind of clarified basketball hoops. So,
[39:40] if somebody in the city wants to go look
[39:42] and see Yes. Basketball hoops are
[39:44] illegal and it also made so odors were
[39:47] only covered in development code before.
[39:50] This puts them over there in in our
[39:53] nuisance code
[39:57] » out in the streets. Yeah.
[40:02] And then the the next frame
[40:05] changes things from being a misdemeanor
[40:08] to a civil offense.
[40:11] And Then the next frame outline out
[40:15] outlines those civil offenses
[40:19] um
[40:21] which are graduating. So that and then
[40:25] quite honestly on a lot of things when
[40:28] it's um
[40:30] uh somebody that
[40:33] can't m can't maintain their yard u has
[40:38] some leeway before these go into effect
[40:40] with our code but somebody that um
[40:43] blatantly doesn't maintain their yard.
[40:46] What part of town you live in?
[40:49] Offensive. Okay.
[40:58] Oh yeah,
[41:04] » because um
[41:07] the misdemeanors are police and courts
[41:11] and civil we can find
[41:14] nutshell. Good enough.
[41:18] Trying to get good at this.
[41:24] Okay. So, that's where it goes up.
[41:28] The more obstinate you are, the more
[41:30] expensive it's going to be. And uh
[41:34] then if you have two violations,
[41:36] let's say you have two broken down cars
[41:38] in your yard,
[41:40] it's 50 bucks a day each
[41:44] according to that. That's the Reader's
[41:45] Digest version of that. You go ahead and
[41:49] scroll.
[41:52] Um,
[41:55] that's the stuff we talked about
[41:58] in uh referring to 1990
[42:04] uh
[42:06] for development code
[42:10] » because the 1.12 is the CI is the
[42:14] misdemeanor section under for police.
[42:19] Yeah, we we got rid of that. Yeah. Okay.
[42:30] That's a new addition that talks about
[42:32] like if somebody's out doing a re- roof
[42:34] without a permit, they pay double. And
[42:37] that's in our that's in our fee
[42:42] schedule, but it's now clear in the code
[42:45] that we
[42:48] >> So, um well, no, in this case, no. In
[42:51] this case, it does say uh it will be
[42:54] assessed. So, it is a sh. So, no second
[42:58] choices. If you're a roofer, you know,
[43:00] you need a roofing permit.
[43:02] >> What about if you're a homeowner?
[43:08] Yeah.
[43:14] » Well, so it used to be also you if you
[43:18] did a complete tear off, you needed a
[43:21] permit, but if you were adding that
[43:25] second layer,
[43:27] you know, and you weren't doing any
[43:29] structural repairs to your roof or
[43:30] anything, um, that didn't need a permit.
[43:34] And I think that have been an
[43:36] international building code thing. Do
[43:38] you guys know
[43:46] » what was that? I didn't
[43:47] >> That's in the new international building
[43:50] code and we have not adopted that one
[43:52] yet. We're still under 2024.
[43:55] >> So in
[43:56] >> or 21
[43:57] >> in 21 are we needing a permit to add
[44:01] shingles?
[44:02] >> Yeah. All the required.
[44:04] >> Okay.
[44:06] which by the way is good if somebody
[44:08] doesn't know they already have three
[44:10] layers and they can't put a force on
[44:12] there.
[44:12] >> You know, there's there's
[44:15] some of this stuff, you know, you think
[44:17] about if you ever had to have an
[44:19] insurance claim and they find out you
[44:21] didn't pull a permit for something
[44:22] that's you know, a lot of this is for
[44:24] the homeowner's own protection,
[44:27] you know,
[44:29] not just the wiring stuff.
[44:34] used to be.
[44:37] >> I think it's two.
[44:41] >> You can't go over two.
[44:44] >> It adds more. I'm sure
[44:51] the roofing lobby
[45:04] » got to wait for the new IBC to come out
[45:07] before you add a layer.
[45:17] Um,
[45:19] so the next section, Mike, is where we
[45:22] took the smell part out of that standard
[45:27] sighted for
[45:28] >> Southwest Clean Air. Swapa,
[45:33] they call themselves. I don't know.
[45:34] Maybe I just my hearing I always thought
[45:36] they were
[45:36] >> Swaka.
[45:42] Yeah,
[45:49] » for the smells.
[45:50] >> I don't know.
[45:53] >> Yes, I I'll look them up here. Um,
[46:03] miss
[46:14] Southwest Clean Air Agency, SWCA.
[46:20] Do we want to add that correction to
[46:23] that while we're here?
[46:30] And so, actually, there's still
[46:34] cover pollutants. what what the other
[46:37] two things that we left
[46:41] um
[46:44] still covers pollutants and dust and
[46:47] everything. So even it might smell but
[46:50] also be a pollutant, right? We're going
[46:51] to
[46:53] have their involvement there
[47:00] and
[47:08] I missed that one. Oh. Oh, yeah.
[47:12] >> That's um I think isn't most of that
[47:17] already in
[47:20] >> it's a clarification.
[47:21] >> Yeah, that's a clarification. So,
[47:26] um, so what is the code
[47:29] on like in the county
[47:33] and
[47:34] when you get a permit from the county,
[47:36] they give you a thing you have to staple
[47:37] up, put on a post at the street that
[47:39] says I have a permit. Do we have that?
[47:42] And it says we have to post up
[47:44] >> that I did talk to Mike Williams, the
[47:48] county um
[47:52] county building official and he said
[47:54] that is still in the code.
[47:56] >> But what about Woodley?
[47:58] >> And we should be doing that because it
[48:00] is in the building code.
[48:01] >> Okay.
[48:03] >> Because that would really help even
[48:06] better, right? When she drives by
[48:08] something and there's an orange.
[48:10] >> I already know that doesn't have a
[48:12] permit.
[48:14] I know.
[48:16] >> I guess you do, but I don't know why I
[48:19] feel like it takes a village. And even
[48:21] the city guys that are out taking care
[48:23] of the mowing and everything, they see
[48:24] something and you know, they should at
[48:26] least tell you or something, right? You
[48:30] know, don't get me started on my rocks
[48:32] in the road stuff, but
[48:35] um anyway, we're going to start trying
[48:39] to do that somehow. Cool. All right.
[48:44] Maybe if they get a Saturday permit,
[48:46] they get a blue paper to put up or
[48:48] something.
[48:49] >> Well, then so is there a fine they don't
[48:51] have it up.
[48:55] » It's funny because there's so many
[48:57] places,
[48:58] >> you know, you have you get this paper
[49:00] and it says post this. But do you even
[49:03] get your permits because you do
[49:05] everything online now, right? You get
[49:07] your permits online.
[49:09] >> You don't get anything back from the
[49:11] city.
[49:12] >> Not anymore.
[49:15] >> But they have to keep the plans on site
[49:18] as well.
[49:23] >> yeah, that's that's hard to
[49:29] » I don't care if they take a sheet of
[49:30] plywood and write permit number 26-045
[49:35] on there and put that out there quite
[49:37] honestly. It shows they have a permit
[49:40] and where the inspector needs to go,
[49:41] right?
[49:43] >> So, anyway, that's not on here though,
[49:46] Mike. Okay. So, we can keep scrolling.
[49:52] » That's the odor shall not apply to the
[49:54] food. We're going to try that
[49:58] >> and
[50:01] says residential and commercial. So,
[50:03] should we add zones to that as well?
[50:08] >> Uh, no. I put circumstances because
[50:13] um it might be a res
[50:20] Correct.
[50:23] » It could be a commercial food truck in
[50:26] an industrial zone in which case it's a
[50:29] commercial circumstance.
[50:31] >> Yeah.
[50:32] >> Industrial zone res.
[50:34] >> Okay. All right.
[50:38] » And I specifically put the word
[50:40] preparation
[50:42] as opposed to
[50:44] >> processing or something.
[50:49] Okay.
[51:02] » Yeah. Just
[51:04] Yeah.
[51:06] Gives it some direction.
[51:09] >> And then down below there's a section on
[51:12] defines what the development codes that
[51:14] are subject enforcement. This is that
[51:17] reference because we no longer use land
[51:19] use codes. We use development codes
[51:22] because it includes zoning, building,
[51:24] environmental.
[51:32] This is just a different version of the
[51:35] ones that we talked about. So this is
[51:36] just
[51:40] and then here's the definition for land
[51:43] use and development code specifically
[51:46] titles 8 which is 8 and 12 which are the
[51:49] nuisance and um 13 is uh streets or
[51:54] sorry 12 is streets water sewer 14 is
[51:58] building 15 title 15 is environmental
[52:02] title 16 is subdivision title 17 is the
[52:08] zoning code and title 19 is the
[52:10] administrative code.
[52:13] So this makes it clear that what code
[52:17] enforcement is responsible for versus
[52:19] what the police are responsible for.
[52:23] So
[52:25] Mike, have you done any city code
[52:28] scrolling gone into where it's at a
[52:31] little bit? Okay. So you know how to
[52:32] find it?
[52:34] >> Yeah. Um,
[52:37] good. Very good. All right. What else we
[52:40] got? Penalties.
[52:43] >> This is in the enforcement section.
[52:46] >> Yeah.
[52:50] » All right.
[52:56] Anybody have anything to ask about or
[53:00] add?
[53:20] And what's funny is it was redone in
[53:24] some things were redone in 22
[53:28] and a lot of things were not. So anyway,
[53:32] all right.
[53:33] Everybody happy? Can we conclude the
[53:36] workshop portion? Do we have any public
[53:39] comment about our workshop?
[53:43] Sounds good. Pass the
[53:46] Donna test.
[53:51] All right, then we'll um close up that
[53:53] workshop
[53:55] and we'll go on to
[53:59] action items.
[54:01] And first Approving the minutes of our
[54:05] July 16th
[54:07] meeting.
[54:09] >> We approve the minutes.
[54:13] » You need to call those out. Motion's
[54:15] been made. Second. Any discussion?
[54:18] Mike's probably going to stayain.
[54:21] Um,
[54:23] all those in favor? I There we go. I got
[54:28] when I go to my union meetings once a
[54:30] month, they read the complete minutes to
[54:34] us
[54:39] and the AC don't work. All right,
[54:44] get it rolling here, boys. Okay. So, the
[54:48] next action item is ordinance number
[54:51] 16006 retooling our code to ship it up
[54:56] to city council.
[55:01] I move that we recommend approval of the
[55:21] Nice.
[55:24] » All right, we're going to call this vote
[55:26] up. Motion's been made and seconded. Any
[55:28] more discussion?
[55:31] >> All right, the vote.
[55:37] » Commissioner what?
[55:39] >> Commissioner C. Hi,
[55:41] >> Commissioner Matson.
[55:42] >> Hi,
[55:42] >> Commissioner Le.
[55:44] >> All right. Wow.
[55:48] We got that done by August.
[55:56] » We did spend well um it was not without
[56:00] um some hiccups here and there. There
[56:02] was some presentation stuff that wasn't
[56:03] available once and we actually had some
[56:06] other
[56:08] stuff that took up a bunch of time. So
[56:10] we were like trying to
[56:12] short version it at the end. But um
[56:15] anyway,
[56:16] >> was there any?
[56:20] » No. Um
[56:23] one one thing we did though that is not
[56:26] in the code that when we had a meeting
[56:28] with we have state says we have to have
[56:31] a joint meeting with city council once a
[56:33] year. And in that joint meeting with
[56:36] city council I brought up that
[56:39] you know, somehow we are u complaint
[56:43] driven
[56:45] and
[56:46] we shouldn't be. If staff sees
[56:49] something, they shouldn't have to wait
[56:51] for a complaint to do something about
[56:52] it. And so, uh, the city council all
[56:55] right, then agreed to it. And actually,
[56:57] the only thing that why they change the
[56:59] website,
[57:00] right? Because their website said code
[57:02] enforcement was complaint driven. So,
[57:05] you know, that um I think that really
[57:07] helped give a little more um free free
[57:12] reign and she's not out to um
[57:16] you know be
[57:19] mean person. She's just protecting Oh
[57:22] yeah, look at you.
[57:24] Protecting the city's interest and um
[57:29] anyway
[57:30] um that took care of that and then u
[57:35] we kind of tossed amount of the fee
[57:38] change to them then and they actually
[57:40] got workshops at city council last week
[57:43] because it was a slow news week. They um
[57:47] covered our stuff too and so they kind
[57:49] of know what to expect and when they see
[57:52] this
[57:54] um hopefully I'll be able to be there to
[57:57] maybe sell it a little, you know. Um
[58:02] I don't think any of the city council
[58:03] people are going to have any problem
[58:05] because the city council people kind of
[58:07] bringing up the same issues that we're
[58:10] trying to fix already. So hopefully it
[58:12] helps. But anyway, thank you guys for
[58:16] let's all getting through that. So, um,
[58:21] we've got a, um,
[58:24] permit activity update.
[58:46] » Oh, yeah.
[58:48] So, I went through and crunched some
[58:52] numbers, calculated um building going on in Alder Ash. It's
[58:58] 148 lots total in there. So far, we have
[59:03] 94 lots that are either occupied or
[59:07] actively being built.
[59:10] And then we have 54 lots in there that
[59:13] there's no permit. They're available.
[59:15] Building has not started. So that's
[59:17] Alder Nash. Riverwalk is 48 lots total
[59:22] um with only 11 lots so far being
[59:25] occupied and they are fully built and 37
[59:29] lots available. No permits have been
[59:31] pulled yet
[59:33] for Riverwalk.
[59:35] >> So is that whether So COO loop
[59:42] which one's that? So that's the sandbox.
[59:47] >> Okay.
[59:48] >> So the sandbox
[59:50] has 85 lots total with 44 of them being
[59:54] occupied or currently being built and 41
[59:58] lots that novailable.
[1:00:05] give you an idea of what's available and
[1:00:06] what's
[1:00:08] >> so um
[1:00:15] you're going to have to help me. So
[1:00:17] Alder and Ash,
[1:00:19] that's the one on the Lewis River side
[1:00:22] of the
[1:00:24] >> funny shaped houses.
[1:00:28] Lewis River side of
[1:00:29] >> it's the one next to the elementary
[1:00:31] school, North Fork Elementary
[1:00:33] >> behind it.
[1:00:34] >> Yep.
[1:00:34] >> Okay. So, that's actually PD.
[1:00:38] >> Yeah. Okay. That's Alder and Nash. Okay.
[1:00:40] >> The highlighted ones are the ones that
[1:00:42] are either occupied or currently being
[1:00:45] built.
[1:00:48] » I sold all the ones that don't look at
[1:00:50] another house
[1:00:53] >> quite a bit first.
[1:00:56] >> Same thing with Coh
[1:01:00] » are the what
[1:01:01] >> are they
[1:01:03] all
[1:01:05] >> the roads are? Yes.
[1:01:10] » Those are
[1:01:13] this phase has not been recorded yet.
[1:01:15] >> Oh, okay. That explains that I just
[1:01:18] typically I want that backyard
[1:01:28] river.
[1:01:29] >> Okay.
[1:01:30] >> So that's the one that's on the east
[1:01:32] river side
[1:01:33] >> and that's probably the same thing that
[1:01:34] they have some that haven't been
[1:01:36] recorded yet as you get closer to the
[1:01:37] river.
[1:01:38] >> Yes. So that's these ones here.
[1:01:40] >> Yeah.
[1:01:43] I can't
[1:01:52] » detach.
[1:01:53] >> Yes.
[1:02:03] » I I
[1:02:05] >> bet you better.
[1:02:10] So these kind of came in when CO was
[1:02:14] going and these are um they specifically
[1:02:18] got a increased lot coverage if it is a
[1:02:22] singlestory
[1:02:25] um ranch style because they were looking
[1:02:28] in the one to $1.2 million range and for
[1:02:32] seniors that would have um no ADA
[1:02:36] issues.
[1:02:38] this subdivision,
[1:02:40] their price point when they were
[1:02:42] originally designing was in the neighbor
[1:02:44] of 400 to 450,000.
[1:02:47] So it is
[1:02:48] >> that's a starter house today.
[1:02:51] >> So that is a starter house. Y
[1:02:53] >> and those also that was also zoned
[1:02:57] >> medium density
[1:02:58] >> MDR.
[1:02:58] >> Yep.
[1:02:59] >> So uh the other one was seven
[1:03:03] >> LDR 75, right?
[1:03:05] >> Yes. Their average lot size, I wanted to
[1:03:09] say, was closer to 9 to 12.
[1:03:12] >> Yeah. Well, yeah. If you're going to
[1:03:13] sell something for that much money, it's
[1:03:15] got to have some yard.
[1:03:16] >> Yeah. And then this subdivision with 150
[1:03:21] behind the school, their target was 550
[1:03:24] to 650. And
[1:03:26] >> I I talked to somebody that bought one
[1:03:28] in there for 530.
[1:03:30] So, but they have uh some CCNRs and HOA
[1:03:36] fees and stuff that I
[1:03:39] don't get, you know. So, like you can
[1:03:43] only have park dust in your backyard.
[1:03:57] And is that because they have to have
[1:03:58] sprinklers because they're so close
[1:03:59] together and the roads are so skinny.
[1:04:02] >> Irrigation.
[1:04:04] >> Yeah, they do not all need um
[1:04:07] sprinklers, but they are have the water
[1:04:11] connections for it.
[1:04:16] So, so according to Riley, the houses
[1:04:24] that have to have fire sprinklers
[1:04:27] get a one inch connection, but we only
[1:04:29] charge them for a 3/4 or something
[1:04:31] crazy. But uh but we have to
[1:04:35] >> that's for the fire sprinklers should
[1:04:37] and and I think because it's a PURD and
[1:04:41] everything's so close together and the
[1:04:42] streets are so small.
[1:04:45] Um it would be reasonable that I know
[1:04:48] how our fire department loves sprinklers
[1:04:52] that they would require sprinklers
[1:04:54] there. So that's probably why that one
[1:04:56] inch connection.
[1:04:57] >> Those don't have sprinklers.
[1:05:02] But they don't have lines.
[1:05:07] » Yeah. So they I think you are correct.
[1:05:10] They have the one in connections but
[1:05:12] we're only charging them for 3/4 in
[1:05:15] because um they are not using the full 1
[1:05:19] in connection capacity. So it's a quirk
[1:05:23] in our code where since they are not
[1:05:26] producing that much sewer and they are
[1:05:29] using a reduced amount of water
[1:05:31] theoretically the extra capacity for the
[1:05:34] 1 in is normally required for sprinklers
[1:05:38] and so if they were to put in sprinklers
[1:05:40] that's what the systems are designed for
[1:05:43] but they can opt not to put sprinklers
[1:05:45] in there
[1:05:50] » you have a water meter for a
[1:05:59] Yes. So that all has to do with
[1:06:01] >> Yeah. with water meter. When you
[1:06:04] >> you when you buy a $260 water meter from
[1:06:07] the city, it's
[1:06:10] $5,000 because the city has to take
[1:06:13] money to set aside for future needs and
[1:06:16] development growth. So um that charge is
[1:06:21] based on the size of meter. So, this is
[1:06:24] where they're getting they're getting a
[1:06:26] one inch meter and I I always from from
[1:06:30] Riley it was because
[1:06:33] um it has to be that big for fire
[1:06:35] sprinklers in the house but it doesn't
[1:06:38] mean that they don't use that in a
[1:06:39] normal house. So, that's where that
[1:06:41] caveat is. So, that's why I would say if
[1:06:43] they have one in meters they probably
[1:06:45] have to have fire sprinkers.
[1:06:46] >> Well, so that was the original in the
[1:06:51] original design called for 1 in meters
[1:06:55] even though they didn't need them. So
[1:06:58] Riley made them install what the
[1:07:00] engineer designed. Well, I was surprised
[1:07:03] the fire department did not require
[1:07:06] sprinklers in those houses
[1:07:08] >> because
[1:07:24] » they can make you get sprinklers if if
[1:07:27] you're on a flag lot. They will make you
[1:07:29] get sprinklers.
[1:07:29] >> Yes.
[1:07:30] >> If it's if If you're more than 150 feet
[1:07:34] on a remote lot from a hydrant,
[1:07:38] >> you have to have sprinklers. So
[1:07:41] >> So like those
[1:07:44] >> So those infill projects like on
[1:07:46] Washington and CC Street, the houses out
[1:07:49] front don't have sprinklers, but the
[1:07:52] houses in the back do have sprinklers.
[1:07:55] So the the houses in the back, the flag
[1:07:58] lots have 1 in meters, whereas ones out
[1:08:02] front of 3/4 in
[1:08:06] » things.
[1:08:08] Okay. All right. So, we are we're done
[1:08:11] interrupting. Was that everything there?
[1:08:13] >> Yep.
[1:08:15] >> So, you think it slowed down some? The
[1:08:18] >> Yeah, the permits coming in have slowed
[1:08:20] down a lot. I did want to just mention
[1:08:22] really quick and I put this in front of
[1:08:25] you guys. It's just a year toate um code
[1:08:28] enforcement update of you can see how
[1:08:31] many have been closed and then I also
[1:08:34] highlighted the ones that are in the
[1:08:37] notice of order phase. Um but I did want
[1:08:41] to just share some good news and that is
[1:08:44] um on 1507 I believe
[1:08:48] the half burnt down apartment
[1:08:51] you know with the
[1:08:53] I
[1:08:57] gentle
[1:08:59] to the land
[1:09:02] >> just a little bit
[1:09:04] and they are they came in and they're
[1:09:06] going to be demolishing
[1:09:09] So that's kind of awesome. I I actually
[1:09:11] talked to Chief Gibbs about those. I
[1:09:15] said, you know, you guys get calls there
[1:09:17] and he said, we get called. I said, what
[1:09:19] are the calls that you're that are
[1:09:22] generated for that? And he said, it's
[1:09:24] usually vandalism,
[1:09:26] and trans. And so I told him, well,
[1:09:29] those are getting demolished. And he was
[1:09:32] very happy to hear that.
[1:09:34] >> Yes, I'm very happy. There's an easy way
[1:09:36] we could do this
[1:09:37] >> or the hard way.
[1:09:39] >> You know what? It works every time.
[1:09:43] >> So, uh,
[1:09:45] >> are you getting any response from 503
[1:09:48] Washington Street?
[1:09:49] >> So, he is one of those.
[1:09:53] >> Yeah.
[1:09:54] >> I'm just waiting for the clock to
[1:09:56] finish.
[1:09:57] But, um, I've gotten excellent response
[1:10:00] from
[1:10:04] also got excellent response from about
[1:10:07] two other houses on CC
[1:10:09] and it's crazy the
[1:10:14] >> better I'm sure the neighbors
[1:10:17] >> they better they better
[1:10:19] P's and Q's on CC street
[1:10:22] >> what's that
[1:10:22] >> they better mind their P's and Q's on CC
[1:10:24] street
[1:10:27] >> I
[1:10:28] >> but I'm in the middle Washington also
[1:10:33] the
[1:10:34] just across from the corner store. You
[1:10:36] know those apartments right there?
[1:10:38] >> Yeah.
[1:10:39] >> I don't know if you guys have noticed
[1:10:41] just the insane amounts of trash,
[1:10:44] garbage, used furniture, mattresses.
[1:10:48] >> Um they are repeatedly
[1:10:53] repeat offenders and I am about to do a
[1:10:57] notice in order. I sent them their
[1:10:59] second notice but I actually wrote them
[1:11:00] a letter certified mail to the
[1:11:04] He said, "Y'all, this isn't okay."
[1:11:12] » Riverside
[1:11:14] has all those town home.
[1:11:17] >> No, there's an apartment thing there.
[1:11:20] >> Just look for mattress.
[1:11:30] » No, it's not.
[1:11:36] How do we know what's designated local?
[1:11:38] >> Oh, okay. Yeah.
[1:11:41] >> Only only, you know, the property
[1:11:43] management company. So, you know, it's
[1:11:44] not the housing authority in Vancouver
[1:11:46] somewhere.
[1:11:47] >> Yeah.
[1:11:47] >> And I have never got a response from
[1:11:49] them and so I just sent them their final
[1:11:52] letter saying
[1:11:56] for littering.
[1:12:00] I listed all of it. So, and I sent it
[1:12:02] certified.
[1:12:05] >> Terrible. I have a stack of photos of
[1:12:08] just garbage and on the sidewalk.
[1:12:12] >> I
[1:12:20] sent it to the property management. It's
[1:12:22] still a city code.
[1:12:25] >> I think um
[1:12:26] >> the owner
[1:12:30] Absolutely.
[1:12:32] The occupants won't get penalized. It'll
[1:12:35] be the property management,
[1:12:37] >> I think. And if it was um um the housing
[1:12:40] authority long, they would have a crew
[1:12:42] come out and
[1:12:43] >> get it picked up. So,
[1:12:46] >> we had to have the same conversation
[1:12:47] with the meadow park or whatever.
[1:12:53] Same thing. piles of garbage and
[1:12:55] mattresses and it took two weeks to
[1:12:58] track down the property management and
[1:12:59] they were up in Seattle and I found out
[1:13:02] they did not have maintenance guy coming
[1:13:04] in and it was just a hot mess and
[1:13:08] they're on
[1:13:10] >> fantastic. That's that's
[1:13:13] wonderful workers.
[1:13:17] Okay. V vacant build buildable land
[1:13:20] update
[1:13:22] notice. This meeting will be recorded.
[1:13:28] So, um,
[1:13:31] this had been asked about at the last
[1:13:32] couple meetings for an update and I
[1:13:37] downloaded a bunch of information and
[1:13:39] sorted through the data. And then I came
[1:13:41] to realize kind of after I was done is
[1:13:44] there was a bunch of properties missing
[1:13:48] because I kept expecting as I kind of
[1:13:51] looked through the data and updated it
[1:13:54] that there was stuff missing. And so I
[1:13:58] didn't realize that until Monday when I
[1:14:01] thought I was finished when I
[1:14:02] discovered. So what I did is I pulled
[1:14:05] the 2023 numbers that were prepared as
[1:14:08] part of the comprehensive update. So,
[1:14:11] I'm going to show you real quick some data just to give you an idea of
[1:14:15] where we are. Um, and that is so we're
[1:14:19] going to look at residential,
[1:14:21] commercial, and industrial just some
[1:14:23] generic numbers here. So, our total
[1:14:25] acreage of residential land, so single
[1:14:28] family and multifamily is 681.8.8
[1:14:34] acres. So 682 acres of residential land
[1:14:38] in the city and um
[1:14:41] in 2023 when we did the vacant land
[1:14:45] analysis there was 97.11
[1:14:48] acres that was vacant or vacant with
[1:14:52] approved plans on it. And so you see
[1:14:56] that was broken out here 30 35.3 acres
[1:15:00] of vacant undeveloped and then there
[1:15:03] were proposals that were in for
[1:15:06] approval. Now, since that time, 47.3
[1:15:10] acres has been developed or 48% of that
[1:15:14] vacant land um has been um
[1:15:20] uh subdivided and um is in work. So, of
[1:15:25] that, 45 acres is vacant because we had
[1:15:29] a couple projects that were approved and
[1:15:32] then ended up not built or got smaller
[1:15:36] than so the sandbox went from apartments
[1:15:39] to part of it is homes, part of it is
[1:15:42] still vacant. So that's part of the
[1:15:44] reason why the vacant land is more
[1:15:46] available now than it was in 2023
[1:15:49] um because we were dealing with COVID
[1:15:52] 2021 2022 approvals and um when I did
[1:15:57] that analysis in 23 um and then we have
[1:16:01] a lot less that is development approved
[1:16:05] but not constructed. And so in addition
[1:16:09] to this 49 acres of vacant and available
[1:16:15] land, there's also the 105 lots that are
[1:16:21] occupied and constructed or in
[1:16:24] construction. And then as Brea was
[1:16:26] mentioning those three subdivisions,
[1:16:28] there's still a lot of lots. Basically
[1:16:31] 50% of those lots are still available.
[1:16:34] So although it looks like we've used 48%
[1:16:37] of the vacant land, there's still a lot
[1:16:40] of vacant lots within those lots that
[1:16:44] have been developed.
[1:16:46] So that's kind of a moving number.
[1:16:50] And then the other side of the
[1:16:52] residential equation is the multifamily
[1:16:54] supply and that was 47.53
[1:16:57] acres in 2023 and 12 of that was vacant.
[1:17:01] And then there were several projects
[1:17:03] that were um proposed for development.
[1:17:07] And since then 19 of those 35 acres have
[1:17:11] been developed and the units are out
[1:17:14] there on the ground. And so um that was
[1:17:18] the smaller subdivision known as the
[1:17:21] Sandbox is is specifically the one of
[1:17:25] the lots or one of the projects that was
[1:17:28] developed and there are still 41 vacant
[1:17:31] lots in that subdivision that haven't
[1:17:34] been used but basically we still have
[1:17:37] about 70% of the multifamily land is
[1:17:40] available and there's a couple projects
[1:17:42] on the board so one by um on Fifth
[1:17:46] Street by North Elementary and then
[1:17:50] another sorry Woodland Elementary and
[1:17:53] then there's also 30 units behind the um
[1:18:00] Woodland Corner Store kind of in that
[1:18:03] area there between Gordon and the seaw
[1:18:05] wall and
[1:18:09] >> get legs.
[1:18:09] >> That one's still Yep. They're waiting.
[1:18:13] They have their final engineering now. I
[1:18:15] don't know what they're waiting on. I
[1:18:18] think they're trying to time it so that
[1:18:21] they get their permits before the school
[1:18:23] impact fees go up, even though they're
[1:18:26] not necessarily planning on building it
[1:18:28] right away. So when you start seeing
[1:18:31] them do site preparation, you'll know
[1:18:33] that those building permits are ready to
[1:18:35] go because they've got all their
[1:18:37] engineering.
[1:18:40] >> So um
[1:18:43] I have a question that you know we It
[1:18:47] was talked about at the city council
[1:18:49] meeting and everything that the the
[1:18:50] county is planning for 10,000
[1:18:54] extra homes over the next 20 years
[1:18:57] >> and they're going to all lot 2,000 of
[1:19:00] that to Woodland.
[1:19:04] So they say and is that 2,000 more based
[1:19:08] on do they have their own inventories or
[1:19:11] based on our inventories from our comp
[1:19:14] plan or
[1:19:17] um where are they where are they getting
[1:19:20] their basis for those numbers.
[1:19:23] >> So that is a question that is still
[1:19:26] hanging out there. At the start of the
[1:19:28] process that was one of their first
[1:19:30] major discussion points and then they've
[1:19:33] kind of
[1:19:34] um put that on the back burner. They are
[1:19:37] updating their critical area ordinance
[1:19:39] right now and when they have finished
[1:19:42] with their critical area ordinance
[1:19:44] update, they will be turning back to the
[1:19:47] comprehensive plan and kind of
[1:19:49] addressing that. We
[1:19:53] did not get a clear answer when we asked
[1:19:56] how they arrived at that number.
[1:20:00] What's that random? Yes. So
[1:20:04] >> because we were last like oh we still
[1:20:06] need
[1:20:08] >> the leftover amount. Yeah. So um they
[1:20:13] have not fully discussed that and part
[1:20:16] of that is because they haven't really
[1:20:18] made that final decision. So I think
[1:20:23] that is
[1:20:26] still in the back of their heads but
[1:20:27] they haven't quite put that to paper
[1:20:29] yet.
[1:20:40] So, so under the growth management act,
[1:20:44] our plans have to be consistent.
[1:20:47] However, our plan has to be a lot more
[1:20:51] comprehensive than theirs and we are not
[1:20:55] quite sure how commerce is going to
[1:20:58] treat that because we did ours last year
[1:21:02] and they're doing theirs this year and I
[1:21:06] been asking this question for five years
[1:21:09] and they've kind of said
[1:21:12] we're going to muddle through this the
[1:21:14] best that we can and It is about time to
[1:21:17] pay the piper and by the end of this
[1:21:20] year we will have muddled to the finish
[1:21:23] line and it's either going to be total
[1:21:26] bedum or
[1:21:28] everybody's going to roll their eyes and
[1:21:30] snicker and we'll just be inconsistent.
[1:21:34] Yeah.
[1:21:44] » Can I
[1:21:47] editorialize on that a minute?
[1:21:49] um
[1:21:53] we have to plan for a certain amount but
[1:21:59] we don't have to plan the easy stuff
[1:22:02] to be developed as part of our plan. So
[1:22:08] the easy stuff being expand our
[1:22:11] urban growth boundary and annex a bunch
[1:22:13] of we we have a lot more capacity than
[1:22:16] people realize inside our city
[1:22:20] boundaries now that already have
[1:22:24] pipes in the street and everything. And
[1:22:26] if we ever expect to complete the
[1:22:28] sidewalks in Oldtown and all of these
[1:22:32] things, you drive through Oldtown and
[1:22:34] look look in people's yards, it's it
[1:22:36] freaks them out. And um just look at the
[1:22:39] lots and sometimes you can go by four or
[1:22:42] five lots in a row and say this can
[1:22:45] accommodate a mother-in-law. set up an
[1:22:48] ADU, some sort of unit of housing. It
[1:22:51] doesn't have to be a track home in a
[1:22:53] neighborhood. And so we
[1:22:57] hopefully will be able to answer to most
[1:23:00] of this assignment, whatever it be,
[1:23:04] with space we already have. Now, the
[1:23:07] tough thing is it's hard to get those
[1:23:09] lots into the inventory,
[1:23:12] you know, and it's and it's nothing you
[1:23:14] can count on because you can't count on
[1:23:17] somebody's deciding, oh, I'm going to
[1:23:21] put an ADU on my property because it's
[1:23:23] the best thing for the city. But in the
[1:23:25] same token, some of these people are
[1:23:28] going to
[1:23:31] retire and move to Hawaii or something
[1:23:33] like that or leave the house to the kids
[1:23:35] and the kids are going to go, "Let's
[1:23:36] knock that old thing down and build a
[1:23:38] forplex," you know, because it can
[1:23:40] happen there. So,
[1:23:42] I'm not saying it's easy,
[1:23:45] but it's also not going to happen if you
[1:23:51] make the easy stuff available, you know?
[1:23:53] And that's what we're seeing now. with the available land that we have,
[1:23:58] it's all the tougher stuff to develop.
[1:24:01] You know, even that even that one with
[1:24:04] the by the intermediate school, you
[1:24:06] know, that property was
[1:24:10] what 30% wetlands. And so they had to
[1:24:14] change some design standards to get
[1:24:15] their their count up to make that pencil
[1:24:18] out. And so we really need and my my
[1:24:22] feelings are on this is we really need
[1:24:24] to to push the infill and recognize that
[1:24:28] there is space to hit that number, but
[1:24:32] it's not,
[1:24:34] you know, we don't have to,
[1:24:36] you know, we we just passed a bunch of
[1:24:39] uh code for ADUs and things that the
[1:24:42] state told us we had to do. Well, the
[1:24:44] states made that easier and told cities
[1:24:47] they can't zone that stuff out and
[1:24:50] things. And so there's there's really a
[1:24:53] lot more lots out there that could
[1:24:55] afford a unit that don't have a unit.
[1:24:58] And and I think we can, you know, and
[1:25:02] even I don't care what Clark K says, we
[1:25:06] can we can count the acreage that's in
[1:25:10] Clark County that's really hard to
[1:25:14] But we can count it, you know, and it's
[1:25:17] just kind of the psychological of it and
[1:25:19] we don't um
[1:25:21] >> so it's a goal they're setting
[1:25:23] >> they're
[1:25:24] >> Yeah. So you got to remember if you
[1:25:26] Google search 98674 growth rate it's
[1:25:30] like 2.4%.
[1:25:32] But how much of that a lotment that the
[1:25:35] county is the county going to say, okay,
[1:25:37] you know, a bunch of that is going to be
[1:25:40] homes in the Woodland area but not in
[1:25:43] the Woodland city limits. It's not like,
[1:25:44] you know, so the county is going to
[1:25:47] absorb. They're assigning so much to
[1:25:48] Castle Rock and so much to Calama and
[1:25:53] so much to us and so much to the county.
[1:25:56] And so,
[1:25:58] >> you know, it's a goal. It's not
[1:25:59] necessarily a
[1:26:01] >> and the whole commerce thing is is you kind of want to try to be compliant
[1:26:06] with commerce when it comes to getting
[1:26:08] grant money and stuff like that. You
[1:26:10] know, it's some of the boxes they check,
[1:26:13] you know, puts you in front of somebody
[1:26:14] else sometimes. But, um, there's a lot
[1:26:17] of communities out there that are not in
[1:26:19] compliance with Congress,
[1:26:21] >> probably Clark County
[1:26:24] >> and they're still getting their stuff.
[1:26:26] Yeah. So anyway, yeah, that's the
[1:26:35] Yeah, population growth. Yeah.
[1:26:42] In the zip code. Did you search the zip
[1:26:44] code?
[1:26:46] >> That's our zip code.
[1:26:48] >> Yeah.
[1:26:53] which is where we came from. It's over.
[1:27:12] Um, thank you for that, Travis. And
[1:27:15] then, um,
[1:27:18] you don't have that where you can throw
[1:27:20] it up either. with the dates.
[1:27:22] >> I did not bring that map and I ticked
[1:27:25] myself for that. Oh, but I emailed it to
[1:27:27] you. So, I can
[1:27:29] >> you look in your email?
[1:27:30] >> I can look in my email. So, I asked
[1:27:32] Travis to do this one. Um, which he I
[1:27:37] mean I'm sure it was some work and I
[1:27:38] really appreciate that he did it because
[1:27:41] um
[1:27:48] there's
[1:27:49] when we're planning I think people get
[1:27:52] scared when they hear numbers and
[1:28:03] This is kind of some fun facts. There's
[1:28:06] got to be one with an attachment.
[1:28:12] » No, it's next one up. That one.
[1:28:17] » Yeah.
[1:28:25] » Oh, no. That's the That's the raw maps
[1:28:28] that I used to create.
[1:28:47] Probably put it on some other
[1:28:50] conversation and it's going to be harder
[1:28:52] to find.
[1:29:13] There we go.
[1:29:16] Rotate that.
[1:29:21] So that's the annexations
[1:29:25] and the last annexations in the city.
[1:29:28] Um just kind of to give you an idea. So
[1:29:33] um
[1:29:35] Travis, you want to you want to kind of
[1:29:37] give detail on
[1:29:40] so in 2000 so in 2005 that yellow one
[1:29:43] was um
[1:29:46] over there between the freeway and Green
[1:29:48] Mountain Road. What is the um
[1:29:52] >> well no Belmont lives on the cross the
[1:29:54] road l that stuff was that stuff was
[1:29:57] annexed and zoned in the 1900s
[1:30:00] >> yeah builder supplies there
[1:30:02] >> 2007
[1:30:04] >> was um
[1:30:06] >> church
[1:30:06] >> was that just the church the high school
[1:30:08] was already zone
[1:30:09] >> just the church so this is the high
[1:30:11] school
[1:30:11] >> they have the high school and a wetlands
[1:30:13] there
[1:30:15] and
[1:30:16] Walmart was before that right
[1:30:19] >> uh Yes. So,
[1:30:21] >> so then in 2006 we did some industrial
[1:30:24] on the back side of the Sherman way kind
[1:30:27] of stuff. Same thing as in 2004. In
[1:30:30] 2009,
[1:30:32] Aony's asked to bring all that in as as
[1:30:37] like light industrial and heavy
[1:30:38] industrial. It's a mix.
[1:30:40] >> And then in 2009,
[1:30:44] um the stuff over by the sewer plant was
[1:30:47] brought in.
[1:30:49] And uh so we haven't had you know and so
[1:30:52] if you think about that sewer plant
[1:30:53] property is one of our multifamily
[1:30:56] pieces that is still not developed. Part
[1:30:59] of the um up there by builder first
[1:31:02] source is high density residential that
[1:31:06] has not been developed. There's
[1:31:10] 21 years on the books and they haven't
[1:31:12] been developed you know. So uh in fact
[1:31:16] the school half of the school where the
[1:31:18] church property is supposed to be for
[1:31:19] school has never been developed. And
[1:31:24] you know, I just think the takeaway
[1:31:26] there that's developing now
[1:31:28] and the other blue one in 2004 is
[1:31:32] developing now.
[1:31:34] It's been 22 years and now they're
[1:31:36] selling houses there, you know. So
[1:31:40] when these requests come in,
[1:31:44] some of this stuff should be what are we
[1:31:47] thinking? in 20 years because we can't
[1:31:48] do all this infill for 20 years. We have
[1:31:51] to at some point bring some in. But
[1:31:52] that's kind of an idea of what what has
[1:31:56] been done.
[1:31:58] And then of course the market tanked in
[1:32:01] 2008.
[1:32:03] And so that's why a lot of those never
[1:32:05] got, you know, people had ambitions and
[1:32:07] they never got started. We can't we
[1:32:10] can't tell what the market's going to
[1:32:11] do.
[1:32:12] Um
[1:32:19] some of it was within the urban growth
[1:32:21] boundary and we annexed it's different
[1:32:24] things for different ones. Some of it
[1:32:25] was annexed and never zoned
[1:32:28] you know.
[1:32:30] So um
[1:32:33] some of it
[1:32:39] » right
[1:32:41] >> well some of it
[1:32:43] >> oh because
[1:32:47] we have unzed
[1:32:50] everything
[1:32:51] transformed into a city
[1:32:54] >> matters
[1:32:57] talking
[1:32:59] >> so Um, and by the way, Merryweather
[1:33:03] is in there in 2005
[1:33:06] and Merryweather went bankrupt and a big
[1:33:10] chunk of that. Phase three is now a
[1:33:13] park, you know, so things change. And
[1:33:16] uh, then there's that piece above
[1:33:18] Merryweather that's in the urban growth
[1:33:21] boundary that's not been
[1:33:25] brought into the city, but it's in the
[1:33:27] urban growth boundary right there. So
[1:33:28] that's was that in the inventories,
[1:33:31] things that are in our in urban growth
[1:33:33] boundary.
[1:33:33] >> That's one of the pieces that I was
[1:33:35] looking for and
[1:33:37] >> and you couldn't find. And then on
[1:33:38] Horseshoe Lake, we have some stuff
[1:33:40] inside our urban growth boundary. Right.
[1:33:44] So that big chunk down there is in our
[1:33:48] urban growth boundary, but not in our
[1:33:49] city limits. And uh you talk about a a
[1:33:53] pressure relief valve for if you just
[1:33:55] want quantity to say we're for it. Um,
[1:34:01] you see it it can be a tool,
[1:34:04] right?
[1:34:06] And so those things are there too. So
[1:34:08] Travis Travis had to go back to a bunch
[1:34:12] of applications and approvals and get
[1:34:13] all of those dates and everything for us
[1:34:15] and then put them together on a map. And
[1:34:23] Was
[1:34:31] all of that west of the railroad tracks
[1:34:34] >> or east of the railroad track?
[1:34:36] >> Yes.
[1:34:41] » Sorry.
[1:34:45] » Not
[1:34:55] out here beyond the church. Yeah, beyond
[1:34:58] the church is all county
[1:35:00] >> and even on the south side across from
[1:35:02] the high school is in the county
[1:35:05] >> and that's not even in the UV
[1:35:16] » that is
[1:35:25] across Freeway from there.
[1:35:44] I've walked my dog down there.
[1:35:59] I don't know of anything. So, is it back
[1:36:03] here towards
[1:36:06] >> where the fields are? There's a there's
[1:36:08] like a little path that runs all along
[1:36:10] the perimeter
[1:36:25] » that's um mitigation.
[1:36:30] So they can maint maint
[1:36:54] is that leg right there. All that leg
[1:36:56] that's north of the school, north of the
[1:36:59] substation
[1:37:00] >> and it's all
[1:37:02] owned by the port wetland mitigation.
[1:37:05] It's a joint
[1:37:07] part of when they dret the river. So
[1:37:11] they can maintain that,
[1:37:15] you know, binding to dredge. So
[1:37:22] I saw a dozer out there, but that's not
[1:37:36] I'm just trying to get
[1:37:47] » Yeah, I can't buy a piece of property
[1:37:49] and do RV parking,
[1:37:51] but um
[1:37:55] Right.
[1:37:58] Just I'm not bitter. I'm just saying.
[1:38:01] Yeah.
[1:38:04] Thank you, Travis. That's um educational
[1:38:08] piece, I think.
[1:38:10] >> Okay. And then on the on the industrial
[1:38:14] and commercial, we'll get to these real
[1:38:16] quick. The commercial property total
[1:38:19] acreage was 296 acres and 2013 there was
[1:38:24] 119.4
[1:38:26] that was vacant although we did have a
[1:38:30] significant chunk of that was approved
[1:38:32] for development. Um and by 2026
[1:38:37] there is still uh 92.66
[1:38:41] acres vacant and there is actually more
[1:38:45] in development,
[1:38:47] but it's expiring so quick I figured I
[1:38:50] would just I mean within a couple months
[1:38:53] it will expire. And this is Logan's
[1:38:55] Landing over there off of Belmont Loop,
[1:38:58] south of Belmont Loop. There's that big
[1:39:00] field there. It's set to expire within a
[1:39:03] month or two, so it's unlikely to
[1:39:06] proceed. So I just dropped it off. But
[1:39:13] » did that include multifamily?
[1:39:16] >> It did. Yep. And that's about to expire.
[1:39:20] Um so we've had 24
[1:39:24] acres of commercial development and that
[1:39:26] includes like the builder for source,
[1:39:29] some other smaller ones here and there,
[1:39:31] but that one is a pretty big chunk of
[1:39:35] our commercial land.
[1:39:37] How are they doing with the rest of that
[1:39:39] with their army engineer per
[1:39:44] they got their stuff back from the
[1:39:46] >> Yes. So like for the critical area
[1:39:50] permit to move that dirt pile that's
[1:39:54] been stacking up forever. They finally
[1:39:57] got it at least sealed off.
[1:40:00] >> Now they're going to
[1:40:03] get widened.
[1:40:05] Eventually the rest of that will be
[1:40:08] widened. You can see that
[1:40:09] >> is there going to be turn lanes here?
[1:40:11] >> That new access point will I think
[1:40:13] eventually have an extra center turn
[1:40:16] lane.
[1:40:17] >> And will we get a turn lane for the
[1:40:19] Chevron into Belmont L? That's getting
[1:40:22] dangerous.
[1:40:24] >> Yeah, I don't know that off the top of my head
[1:40:28] right now.
[1:40:31] I I think we need to have some kind of
[1:40:33] registry for near misses there because,
[1:40:36] you know, people have to shoot out there
[1:40:37] because they can't
[1:40:39] see, especially from the roundabout
[1:40:42] side, anything coming and so they jump
[1:40:44] out in front of people and and I know
[1:40:46] I've had three near misses and I mean
[1:40:50] cram my brakes in the last two months on
[1:40:52] I know I drive that piece a bunch, but
[1:40:56] >> I go the speed limit. You will go around
[1:40:59] me if you saw me. Okay. Oh, here's the
[1:41:02] old man in that Toyota.
[1:41:05] >> You don't know.
[1:41:07] It's blue.
[1:41:10] Are they
[1:41:13] >> okay?
[1:41:13] >> Oh, yeah.
[1:41:16] I'm not the one they complain about
[1:41:17] racing down pay route. Let me tell you
[1:41:19] that.
[1:41:21] >> And then the last one we have here is
[1:41:23] industrial. We have a thousand a little
[1:41:26] over a thousand acres in the city and
[1:41:29] the vacant in 2023 was 9 691 or
[1:41:34] basically 700 acres and a lot of that is
[1:41:38] still in agricultural use. Then there's
[1:41:40] a bunch of open ground that would be
[1:41:42] developable or is developable and um a
[1:41:47] bunch of it was in development in 2023.
[1:41:51] So 218 of those
[1:41:54] have moved into development and that's a
[1:41:58] little deceptive because for example
[1:42:00] Columbia River carbonates is now on the
[1:42:02] other side of peacin huge property and
[1:42:05] it's marked as developed but it's you
[1:42:08] know 60% of the property is still vacant
[1:42:11] but it dropped off for tax coding it is
[1:42:14] considered developed so these are not
[1:42:17] pure numbers but um we still have a
[1:42:21] significant amount of property that is
[1:42:23] development like for example the Traml
[1:42:25] Pro properties with those warehouses
[1:42:28] those are technically not finished and
[1:42:31] so they are still in the inventory as
[1:42:35] develop
[1:42:37] but not vacant so I'm kind of juggling
[1:42:41] these numbers here but it gives you an
[1:42:43] idea basically about 30% of it the
[1:42:47] problem is is that from Treml Crow south
[1:42:51] so I'll switch to the map real Quick
[1:43:08] map. Um
[1:43:12] the So the Traml Crow is in this
[1:43:15] property right here.
[1:43:18] And
[1:43:22] Yep. This is property and
[1:43:27] all the way to here and then we're
[1:43:29] starting to get some development here.
[1:43:32] But the sewer is can only go to this
[1:43:36] point here.
[1:43:39] All of this portion of the city down
[1:43:41] here has no sewer service to it because
[1:43:47] um of elevation issues and the in the
[1:43:51] storm the sewer system. Sorry.
[1:43:55] All of this property here drains north
[1:43:59] through a series of lift stations that
[1:44:02] takes it up to exit 22, comes down 22,
[1:44:05] and then comes down water treatment
[1:44:08] plant which is right here. So, um we are
[1:44:13] at the capacity for this piping system
[1:44:17] and we are going to have to develop this
[1:44:19] land and there's about I want to say 350
[1:44:23] acres south of this point that we're
[1:44:28] going to have to find a new route for
[1:44:29] the sewer for it to ever be developed.
[1:44:33] You're looking at four or five lift
[1:44:35] stations to relay daisy chain to get
[1:44:40] that part of the city online.
[1:44:42] >> Y
[1:44:43] >> but um
[1:44:45] industrial customers can have their own
[1:44:48] wastewater treatment plants.
[1:44:50] You know, there is there is other
[1:44:52] things, but for us to handle it and uh
[1:44:57] whatnot, it's
[1:45:03] until something is done there. It's kind
[1:45:04] of locked up
[1:45:13] as
[1:45:18] I mean where does sewer improvements
[1:45:20] come from?
[1:45:32] We can and we are
[1:45:38] » we're kind of wrestling that with it
[1:45:40] right now because
[1:45:43] we are trying to get Roseway to come
[1:45:45] down to Capes.
[1:45:47] Um so we will have adequate cross
[1:45:50] circulation and the water man comes
[1:45:53] along to this point. So
[1:45:57] the water main would be easily looped on
[1:46:01] this location and this would come down
[1:46:04] that road would come down to capable but
[1:46:06] there's no sewer for it to go into and
[1:46:11] the problem that we have at this north
[1:46:13] end of town is capacity issue through
[1:46:16] the daisy chain of lift stations that we
[1:46:19] have and the wastewater treatment plant.
[1:46:22] We have plenty of capacity
[1:46:25] We just have total suspended solids and
[1:46:28] BOD. So the actual stuff that goes in
[1:46:31] there, we would have to do something
[1:46:34] about getting pre-treatment at the
[1:46:36] industrial users. So for example, Walts
[1:46:39] meets, they have a lot of gunk in their
[1:46:42] discharge. It's not that the discharge
[1:46:44] is too much.
[1:46:47] It is too much for the pipes. But if we
[1:46:50] fix the pipes, it won't make a
[1:46:52] difference because at that point we get
[1:46:55] too much dirty water to the wastewater
[1:46:57] treatment plant. It can take capacity,
[1:46:59] just not the total suspended solids and
[1:47:04] it. So we're trying to figure out, okay,
[1:47:07] how are we going to do that? Right now
[1:47:08] the limiting factor is the lift stations
[1:47:12] and the pipe sizes, how much liquid we
[1:47:14] could get through there.
[1:47:16] Once we get this southbound path to the
[1:47:20] wastewater treatment plant, that will
[1:47:22] free up a ton of liquid capacity in the
[1:47:26] system, which means as we get more
[1:47:28] infill and more development at the north
[1:47:30] end of town. We don't need to make
[1:47:32] improvements because now there's plenty
[1:47:34] of room.
[1:47:36] We have we've created breathing space
[1:47:39] for
[1:47:42] >> what zoning allows data centers.
[1:47:46] Well, we don't have to worry about that
[1:47:48] because we don't have the water capacity
[1:47:50] or the water rights for that. So, we
[1:47:52] won't deal with that.
[1:47:53] >> So, um
[1:47:57] all of that area
[1:48:00] um
[1:48:02] I think it's going to be
[1:48:06] interesting to see how with the Traml
[1:48:08] Crow and some of the big producers we've
[1:48:11] had over there, um how the surface water
[1:48:14] changes and storm surface water because
[1:48:20] um that water that ground doesn't take
[1:48:22] water and you know there's wet bottom
[1:48:25] ponds and things and and there's um
[1:48:30] confusion over who's responsible for our
[1:48:33] storm water and I think we've got some
[1:48:34] things we've got to settle out with that
[1:48:37] as well before my in my opinion is
[1:48:39] before we annex anything
[1:48:43] the city. We've got we've got to know
[1:48:46] how all that's getting handled. And
[1:48:47] that's it seems like our dying district
[1:48:50] doesn't want to be a dying and drainage
[1:48:52] district, but we pay
[1:48:55] for that all the way
[1:48:58] up to
[1:49:00] um
[1:49:02] Belmont Loop and those properties. All I
[1:49:05] know I'm across the street. I don't pay
[1:49:07] into the dining district, but
[1:49:10] you know, we have all seen that flood,
[1:49:11] right? We've all
[1:49:13] some of that you got to go, boy, what's
[1:49:15] going to happen? Well, we're gonna have
[1:49:16] to find out what's going to happen and
[1:49:18] find out how it's going to be handled
[1:49:21] because the best available science
[1:49:24] um doesn't seem like it's perfect. So,
[1:49:30] anyway,
[1:49:31] those are the things we will be looking
[1:49:34] forward to.
[1:49:38] Mr. Bson, anybody else have any
[1:49:40] questions?
[1:49:45] school. No school next
[1:49:52] time.
[1:49:52] >> Ra is over there going. Motion to
[1:49:54] adjourn.
[1:49:56] >> I move to adjourn the planning
[1:49:58] commission.
[1:50:00] All those in favor.
[1:50:02] >> All right. Thank you everybody.
[1:50:05] Shut this off. I don't know if it was
[1:50:07] ever really on.
[1:50:15] Are you let's get personal. Oh, we can't
[1:50:17] talk too much. We um still career man or
[1:50:22] retired or
[1:50:29] school.
[1:50:47] I taught truck driving at heavy at West
[1:50:49] Coast training