All right, we've got six o'clock PM. It's Thursday, August 20th, 2026. I'm
here to call to order this meeting of the utility commission for this evening.
Could we have a roll call, please? >> Tom
» here. >> Curtis
» here. >> Hammer is absent. Fininkler
» here. >> Anner
» here. >> Sanderson
» here. Fry >> here.
» All right. This meeting this meeting has been noticed in accordance with state
statutes and local ordinances. The next item is to approve the agenda for the
evening. >> Move to approve.
» I will second. >> We have a motion, a second to approve
the agenda. Any discussion on the motion? If none, all in favor, please
say I. >> I.
» Any opposed? The agenda is approved. On to public comment. Do we have anyone
present this evening for public comment? Seeing none, we'll move on to the
consent agenda. We have three items which is the approval of the July 16th
minutes. Uh approve utility department's cash dispersements report and accounts
payable report and the outage report. Are there any questions on the consent
agenda items? If not, I'll take a motion to approve.
» Move to approve. >> Second.
» We have a motion and a second to approve the consent agenda. Any discussion on
the motion? If not, we'll need a roll call for that
then. >> Curtis,
» I. >> Thinkler,
» I. >> Anler,
» I. >> Sanderson,
» I. >> Fry.
» Hi, >> Tom.
» I. >> All right, we'll move on to new
business. Item number four, uh, is the 2025 utility audit presentation by Baker
Tilly. Uh, for our annual, um, financial review. We have director uh Dan Lehei
with us this evening. >> Hi.
» Thanks for having me here today.
» There you go. You're good. >> Am I good?
» All right. Well, thanks for having me. I'll just
give a quick introduction of myself. I've been involved with the utilities
audit for quite a while, but I haven't presented in in a couple years. But my
name is uh Dan Lee. I'm a director with Baker Tilly. been with Baker Tilly out
of our Madison, Wisconsin office for 15 years now. Uh like I said, I've been
involved with the Columbus Utilities Audit in some form or fashion since I
first started with the firm. Uh this year took on more of a supervisory role,
director role, uh overseeing the work of our staff. So here tonight to talk about
the results of the 2025 audit. So we have a couple graphs and charts to kind
of go through here real quick uh to summarize the results of the year. But
uh before I get into that, I just want to talk a little bit about our work and
our deliverables that we've issued uh and finalized as part of the audit
process. So in addition to these graphs, we've also issued um the financial
statements themselves uh which includes our auditor's opinion. Uh I'm pleased to
report that the utilities received an unmodified or clean audit opinion this
year. Uh which is the highest form of assurance that can be received. So what
that tells you is that the financial statements that are presented to the
outside world are presented fairly and accurately uh based off of the
accounting rules uh in the United States.
We also issued a document uh called it's called the reporting and insights from
the 2025 audit. Uh it includes a couple different deliverables. Uh the first
being our required communications under auditing standards. I call this sort of
a no news is good news type document. uh we have standard communications that we
must issue every year and if there were any sort of problems to report that's
where you'd find that items reported there but kind of have the standard
communications no difficulties with management the audit went uh as planned
and and as scheduled we also have a section of that report on
internal controls uh so as part of the audit process we do assess the internal
controls of the utility uh we don't issue an opinion on those controls but
we do uh report any items uh to you folks here that were are worthy of your
attention. We did have one reportable item uh it's it was called the material
weakness over financial reporting and essentially what that means is uh the
utility has outsourced the responsibility of preparing the
financial statements to the auditors. Uh and I'd say 95% of your peer
organizations or other electric and water utilities around you have the same
issue. It's really a matter of staffing and you know the cost benefit of hiring
additional staff to prepare an annual report that's done once a year versus
outsourcing it to the auditors. So same finding as in previous years. Uh but
nothing unusual and like I said majority of utilities your size have that same
same recommendation. So with that I'll get into the graphs here. Uh the first
graph here just summarizes the electric utilities results. Uh so we have a a
trend analysis on the bottom that shows revenues as compared to operating
expenses. The top uh lighter blue line represents operating revenues. So you
can see uh operating revenues did increase this year. Uh that was due to a
a full the implementation of a full rate increase uh that was effective in
February 2024. So essentially we had a a full year impact of that of that rate
increase. Uh you can also see that the uh at the
top there we've summarized the uh utility's rate of return. What that
represents is the net operating results uh of the utility uh based off of the
rate of return that's authorized by the public service commission of Wisconsin.
The public service commission governs your rates. So they they use this number
to to design your rates and charges for services. So, the utility did fall a
little bit short of its authorized rate of return this year. Uh, it's authorized
for a 6.5% rate. It came in at 1.3. So, it was an improvement uh from the prior
year, but this could indicate that it could potentially be time to take a look
at your electric rates and consider a rate increase uh in the near future. I
know the utility has some uh larger capital projects planned in the near
future. So that's another good time to kind of assess those rates and see where
they stand. Um so that would kind of coincide uh well with that.
Moving on to the next slide for the water results. Uh similar sort of graph
trend analysis here. You can see uh revenues u exceeded expenses in the
current year. Um revenues did increase due to another rate uh rate change that
was effective in August 2025. Um so our rate of return fell a little bit short
on the water side as well. But hopefully next year um with that the impact of
that full year uh of that rate increase that was effective towards the batter
later half of the year uh we can get that a little bit closer to your uh
authorized rate of return. Again I do know the water utility has some capital
projects coming up too. So just something to something to monitor and
keep an eye on in the future. Moving on to the next uh graph here. The
water and electric utilities present a combined financial statement. So here
are some of the combined metrics that uh we take a look at. The first one being
the unrestricted cash on hand. Uh you can see the utility has about $1.1
million of unrestricted reserves. Uh that represents about one a little over
one month's worth of operations. Um the government uh government government
finance officers association has a minimum recommendation of about 3 months
there. So uh we'll want to kind of continue to see that unrestricted
reserve uh fund to continue to build. It's sort of dip dip down in 2023 and
you can see that it's sort of bouncing up and starting to uh kind of build up
again. Uh the next uh ratio to cover is oop
sorry can you go up back up one more? We have the debt coverage calculation. Um
what this represents is the utilities ability to make uh payments on your
revenue bonds and also cover uh your operating expenses. Uh so you're
required to have a coverage factor of 1.25 and you can see that the utilities
uh healthfully exceeded that. So that's a good metric to see and what we like to
see uh from that perspective. The last metric on this slide before we move to
sewer results uh is the debt to equity or the investment in capital ratio. What
this measures is how much of the utilities infrastructure is financed by
debt versus how much is financed through customer rates. Uh so the blue graph
represents how much is f funded by rates. Uh you can see it's about 89%. Uh
we generally uh sort of expect to see kind of a 50/50 split there. 50% debt,
50% equity depends a little bit about on the community and the the nature of the
system. Uh so what this indicates is that the utilities have capability for
borrowing uh in the future for any sort of significant capital projects uh that
could come up. Uh moving on to the next slide to talk about the sewer results.
So there's a little bit more on this graph uh or on this page, but similarly
we're presenting sort of a five-year trend analysis. Uh you can see this year
expenses did increase uh a little bit up to 2.3 million and did exceed uh
operating revenue uh numbers. What was driving that was there was a
large maintenance expense this year for some slip lining. Um you know, it's a
it's a non-recurring expense that you don't expect to have year-over-year. Um
» slip lining. >> Yeah. for like Yep. Yep. Um so I I think
that makes up the majority of that increase. Fortunately, revenues did also
increase though. Uh that was due to the u impacts of a rate increase that was
effective in April of 2025. Uh I know the utility also did increase rates in
June of this year. So hopefully sort of the combination of those two uh rate
increases uh coupled with you know a reduction in expenses from that one off
in 2025 will sort of uh flip that number a little bit so that the revenues uh
will exceed expenses in future years. Uh continuing on talking about the
unrestricted reserve figures, uh you can see that the sewer utility had about uh
a little less than 700,000 in reserves that represent uh little less than four
months of operating uh statistic or operating expenses. Um so it's again
it's above that 3month minimum threshold that uh you you'd want to be at. Um it
has it has dipped down because there has been larger capital projects that that
maintenance expense. So something to keep an eye on and something to monitor
potentially uh for a future uh sewer rate increase.
Then moving on to the debt coverage calculation. Uh you're required to meet
a coverage factor of 1.25. Uh the utility did fall a little bit short the
last two years. So again, hopefully a combination of the uh two rate increases
that were just just implemented will help uh mitigate that in the future. If
not, uh might want to look into potentially uh future rate increases for
the sewer. I also know there's some capital projects planned there. So, uh
something to keep an eye on and something to consider.
Then lastly, the same ratio of the debt to equity or the investment in capital.
Again, this shows that uh the utility has some uh borrowing capabilities. 59
of the 59% of the assets are being funded by rates. Uh so it's closer to
that 50/50 ratio that we usually see with capital intensive utilities. Um but
again it's a positive number to report and uh you're on the right side of it.
You'd want to generally have more uh equity than debt as it relates to that
figure. Any questions on the results of the
audit or the financial numbers?
» You asking about the entire audit presentation
» presentation or the audit itself.
Page 13. >> Can you turn your mic on, Jack?
» Thank you. >> Page 13 of the
utility audit liabilities, deferred inflows.
Top of the page,
liabilities due to municipality
$682,00025 and now $459,000
this year. What does due to municipality mean?
» So that would be like inner fund balances and I think it's note three
within that document spells out what all that's what makes that figure up. What
what utility was that for? Or was that for
» electric? >> Water and electric.
» Water and electric. >> No. Three. No. Three. Okay.
» Um I do know there was an item that was shown as an advance uh from the
municipality this year for some some debt proceeds on a borrowing that didn't
quite close uh yet at the end of 2025. All right.
» Receivable payable. That would be it. >> Yep. So that has some detail as to what
makes up that balance.
But I mean it's generally you know operating costs. Um you said was it for
water and light or water? >> No it talks about the sewer but this is
the water and light.
» Yeah. And I think a lot of that is also the uh pilot payment as well. The
approval of the payment in L tax. Well >> I understand pilot.
» Yeah. >> But pilot payment's not $65,000 a month.
That's what got my attention. This is a big number. Far above payment of Luan
taxes. >> Yeah.
» The tax obligation of the utility is not $65,000 a month.
» Right. Right. >> So
I mean what what's the obligation >> here? Can I actually
So, yeah, looks like there are some insurance uh charges, um some shared
wages, um costs for capital additions. Could be
a timing issue, too, of when funds were paid over to the municipality, but you
know, if you need me to get more detail, I can dig into this and and get back to
you.
» All right. Well, your number's in there, huh?
» Yeah.
» In light of a later discussion tonight um related to the sur utility,
how how does the audit look at our billing
and verify that billing is being done correctly?
Um so what we typically do uh when there's new rates implemented is we'll
take a sample of customer bills and recalculate um the actual charges based
off of the new newly approved rates and then we also independently look at
revenues as a whole. Uh we take a look at the prior year audited revenues
factor in any changes in consumption uh you know any increases in sales to your
customers. factor in that overall increase in rates and we kind of develop
an independent expectation of what we think the revenue totals will be and we
compare that to the actual actual figures themselves.
» Are you aware that the utility was incorrectly charging one of our large
customers going back to January 1 of 2023?
» Was is that a wholesale customer? >> The village of Fall River.
» Okay. Yeah, management did bring that to our attention uh this year and we did
acrewue the revenue related to that and the related receivable.
» Um so yeah, we were aware of that. >> Did you look at that what that impact
had on the the sewer operating? Obviously we've been running at a
deficit the last two years. Was there any analysis if that would have been
built correctly that we would have been closer to break even point?
Yeah, I mean it certainly would have helped uh you know narrow that that loss
or reduce that loss. Uh but the revenues for the entire back billing are
reflected in the current year's results. So that revenue total of $2 million
there does include that total back billing. Um the it was a big number or
you know over two years but the split you you know the difference of what was
related to 2024 versus 2025 it was a it was a number that was small enough where
we were able to just record it all in the current year rather than restating
prior period results.
» Thank you. >> Any other questions?
» One more followup. One more followup. Is there a professional recommendation
on how to resolve the difference between Fall River and what we'd like to do?
They owe us some back money, right? And is there a
approved procedure resolution that you know of?
» Yeah, it's probably more >> I think the last hire they're they're
talking about hiring an attorney, right? We're going to discuss that.
» I don't say those words specifically. Neither did we. So,
» I think it'd probably be a question for an attorney as to how far of a, you
know, period you can go back to bill based off of the Wisconsin statutes.
It's not really something that's covered by the audit. It'd be a question for an
attorney, not not to say that you need an attorney to resolve it, but hey,
what's what's what are we allowed to actually back bill?
» It's not in your toolbox.
It's more of a laws and regulations thing, you know, like what in and what
your attorney would be comfortable, you know, defending essentially.
» So, just to be clear, our deficit
includes the money that we're owed, >> right? Yeah. Those revenues are recorded
in the in 2025,
» I guess. How does that work if we don't have it? We well you also have a
receivable an accounts receivable balance for it. And actually you'll
notice this year there's a a long-term portion of that because last we talked
with the management team it was uh determined it was going to be paid back
over a couple year period. So it's acred in your revenues but you don't have the
cash in the door. So it has a we have an accounts receivable balance recorded for
that. >> Yeah.
» Thanks for clarifying. >> Yeah. Thanks. Any other questions for
Dan while he's up? I see none. Thanks for the presentation.
» Thanks. Yeah, just one more thing. I do want to thank uh Ry's team for all their
help during the audit. They were uh very very efficient and helpful with us. Gave
us all the answers we needed um and and were very knowledgeable what was going
on. So, appreciate your time uh team's time, Randy, and thanks for your help,
too. >> Thank you. Thanks.
All right, that was just a presentation, so there's no action required. We'll
move on to new business item number five then, which is consider and take action
on the funding of the storm water utility.
» I I'll just give a little bit of a background on this. The this same
presentation was provided to the city council um ear couple months ago. This
was referred by the council to the utility commission um with the I think
most are aware that the storm water utility has been created. The challenge
is is is we have not identified how to fund the storm water utility and that'll
be the basis of Jason's discussion and presentation this evening.
All right. Thank you, Matt. Uh, yeah, I'm just here tonight to kind of go over
this presentation. You can see we presented in May to the council. It's
not the exact same presentation because Sam's not here and Sam did a amazing job
when we were at council, but uh I'm pinching for tonight because she's out
watching paving um on School Street. So, uh the agenda tonight on the
presentation uh up there is uh we want to talk a little bit about stormwater
management in general. Uh why it's important. We want to review the city's
current storm water uh system. What do we have? What are the challenges? Uh
we're going to talk about some options. Um what's the status of the stormwater
utility? Um obviously it's been quite a few years since the last time that we've
considered this and talk about some implementation options. And obviously at
the end there's some answers and hopefully I got those for or questions.
I hopefully I got some answers for you. Um and we'll go from there.
So moving on just a little bit about why storm water matters. Uh I think these
are all pretty intuitive but uh just kind of talking a little bit about uh
how it protects the public safety by reducing flooding. Uh as we manage storm
water as our storm sewers have capacity uh they're not clogged uh you know
sediment-free waterways. Uh there's just a lot of things that will help reduce
flooding. As we know flooding is uh more reoccurring now than it has been in the
past. uh we see more intense rainfalls uh when we do get those generally which
uh result more in runoff and so um you know the propensity for more flooding uh
has been growing. Um you know storm water if we manage it correctly presu uh
prevents uh pollution in our waterways. Uh you know it could be fertilizer
runoff. It could be uh sand and gravel. Uh it could be chemicals that people put
on lawns. uh just kind of ao host a variety of things that storm water
management can help with our waterways uh to keep them clean and healthy. Uh
and then uh compliance with federal regulations. Uh you know we do have uh
requirements at the municipal level of things that we have to do and follow uh
on the state and federal regulations. Uh, one of the things that we do not
have in Columbus is what they call an MS4 permit, which is a permit that EPA
and uh, the state of Wisconsin does regulate for larger communities,
generally 10,000 people and above. Uh, they are over time working towards
smaller communities like ours. There are communities throughout the state that do
have these MS4 permit requirements. If you are an MS4 permitted community, you
will be required. Unfortunately, a lot of that's unfunded mandates, but
required to do a lot of storm water management. Uh that was probably not
occurring today in Columbus. So, those are on the horizon. Uh no promise to
when those will be here, but uh it's just something to be aware of. Uh
preserve infrastructure. Uh there's a lot of other utilities in the city that
are affected by storm water. It's not just storm water. So you think about
when we get a heavy rain uh you know we get storm water that affects our sewer
utility. We get more water at the plant to treat. Um you know we also have uh
erosion things that occur uh you know in waterways that can expose other
utilities as well that are in near those uh infrastructure components. And so uh
you know managing storm water is important to to other things not just
storm water. And then uh reducing the long-term costs. If we start thinking
about, you know, those things of, you know, what flood damage costs and we
start thinking about, you know, what it costs to treat infiltration at the
wastewater treatment plant, you know, when we get significant rain events, our
our flows at our plant will almost double. Uh, so we're treating twice as
much waste water during those rain events. Uh, and that's just INI, they
call it inflow info infiltration into the uh, sanitary system. So you start
looking at what that cost to treat all of that. You start compounding
uh those costs um long term for storm water.
Uh so uh the next slide uh talks a little bit about our existing
infrastructure. So just a little bit about Columbus. Uh I listed here that we
have miles of pipes. Um so to put that in perspective, we have 27 miles of
roadways in the city. Um, not every road has a storm sewer or a storm manhole
underneath it, but we also have storm pipes that aren't in roads. We have them
uh that are out in easement areas. We have storm water retention ponds, things
like that. Uh, we have we have channels and creeks. Um, so we have a lot of uh
roadways when you think about uh throughout the city um that don't have
curbon gutter on and the water runs into some type of a a ditch that's channeled
away from yards into you know eventually discharges into a waterway. So it's not
just maintaining the pipes and inlets, it's maintaining those other uh
conveyance methods um throughout the city.
We've identified 16 storm water basins uh in our comprehensive stormwater study
around the city. Uh in those basins, those are the ones that the city
maintains. There's obviously private basins out there that treat storm water,
but there's 16 of them. Four are dry, 12 are wet, which means 12 of them are
permanent pools or ponds uh that are meant for both volume and rate control
and for water quality. So, total dissolved solids reduction or suspended
solids reduction in those 12. Uh, I put in here hundreds of inlets. I couldn't
even begin to guess how many here. Uh, but we have a lot of them and I don't
even think we have them all accounted for in our maps and systems. Uh, so
there's a lot of infrastructure that's that's out there. Uh, and then uh
multiple waterways. When we start thinking about uh the crawfish river,
it's not just the crawfish river. We have second ward creek, Robins Creek. Um
we have the discharge or drainage way north um that drains into the crawfish
and we also have the the unnamed tributary to the second war creek. So
there's five total uh major waterways that drain the city. Uh so again those
all have uh culverts that water flows through. They all have flooding
potential throughout the city. So again, uh when you just start thinking about
the inf infrastructure in the city, there really is a lot there to uh to
manage and and maintain. Uh as far as the maintenance
responsibilities, we we kind of threw this in here. A little bit of that is
just sediment control. Uh when we start talking about routine cleaning
inspection, that that involves things like street sweeping, right? So it's not
just cleaning out inlets. not just making sure that you know the discharge
end walls are are free and and have capacity to flow freely. Uh but it's
also uh prevention, it's also you know sweeping streets, it's keeping things
clean and so there's um a lot of maintenance responsibilities to keep the
system functioning that uh is up above there.
So talk a little bit about next uh projects. Uh so you know the question is
you know and this kind of started with the original discussion with stormwater
utility back in the day uh was you know kind of what are the projects how many
are there uh we have kind of a comprehensive plan that we developed and
we'll talk about that here in a little bit uh but you know we named a lot of
projects here and you can kind of see the numbers highlighted here um just to
show you how many projects there are. There's more than that but uh we started
since 2021 working off a priority list of projects. Um, so the city has been
actively working on this. It's not like we're just sitting around doing nothing.
Uh, the cities have been targeting these. And so you can kind of go down
through here and see uh quite a few projects that have been completed uh
over the years. Um, and that that total since 2021 has totaled about 1 1.378
million. And so you can see that there's been some active um prioritization in
these needs and uh projects have been successfully completed which is great to
see the city uh moving forward and and making sure that they're maintaining
this system. So the next slide we're going to talk a
little bit about uh the current challenges. So um you know this is
obviously the probably the biggest question I get when we talk about storm
water is okay if we have this need why don't we go get grants? Um, and so
grants are in high demand. Uh, timing doesn't always work. Some grants are uh
every other year type grants. So you can apply one year, but you can't get it the
next year. Uh, they're highly dependent on funding, the state budgets, what kind
of money get put into those grants. And they're highly competitive. I mean, uh,
you can probably imagine that every community in Columbus is got a demand or
a need for storm water. Uh, so, you know, highly underfunded, highly
competitive type things. So it is a funding source but you know again uh we
do our best to identify those and apply to those but aren't always successful
getting grant money. Um so how how is it funded? So current currently or in you
know the past uh the storm water projects have been funded through
capital borrowing and obviously capital borrowing has uh you know a direct
effect on what you're able to borrow and it has to compete with all the other
things that you borrow for uh throughout the city. could be buildings and
equipment and whatever else. And so it it has a it has a place and has been uh
used in that um capacity to to generate the funds to do the work.
So that's the funding piece. Uh so prioritization, well, how does the city
decide what to improve? And so the way that it's kind of historically worked is
uh it's it's reactive. we have a collapsed pipe or we have uh an issue
with flooding in a particular area or we have a damaged box culvert or whatever
that might be and so those are the things that that have come to light
right so Jason help us you know what are your recommendations how do we get this
how critical is it uh so we make those identifications and we react to that um
but I think what what you know the recommendation obviously with any good
um you know infrastructure program is to be proactive and and not reactive. So,
we want to be identifying those culverts that have the bottom rusted out of them
before they're collapsing and we want to replace those before they cause more
damage type thing. And so, as we're moving towards
developing this comprehensive plan that we did and then moving forward, we're
you see this list and there's a priority list that we've been working off of for
a few years now that we're trying to get ahead of that. We know these projects
have a need. We're trying to identify them and then provide that attention to
those projects that we need and not be that reactive type that we've been in
the past. And a lot of that comes with maintenance.
Um there's a lot that kind of goes into maintenance. Uh it's employee wages,
it's infrastructure, it's it's it's crew time, it's time spent, it's resources
available. That resources could be equipment. Uh could could be a lot of
things. And um you know, we talk about maintenance and capitalization of
projects and roads. And what we always say there is, you know, you can spend a
dime to maintain a road and make it last 10 years longer, but if you allow it to
go to failure, it's going to cost you a dollar, right? And so it's a 10 times
factor usually in roads. And, you know, storm water is going to be the same type
of thing. If we can maintain these pipes and infrastructure, uh, and do some, you
know, needed maintenance on those things, you know, the infrastructure
will last longer and you can push those larger costs out. So maintenance is
important to the storm water system as well as it is to the roadways.
So the next slide we'll talk a little bit about solutions. Um you know a
little bit about you know h how do we deal with this? And so there's obviously
I always say there's the do nothing option. So the city continues to treat
storm water management like it has in the past. Uh you know the funding comes
through the general fund through capital borrowing. Um projects are completed on
what funds are available or the city is willing to approve in that cycle. And
it's reactive versus proactive right. So, it's really, you know, help help us
find a project when we have a list of a hundred uh that we can put in next year
capital plan. We're going to hope we pick the right one and if something else
happens, we're just going to have to react to it and there's going to be a
demand on the system. Um the other way that we've talked about, and this has
been talked about for several years now, is to create a separate fee or funding
source through the stormwater utility. Um that is obviously something that is
done uh to many places around the state now. Uh continues to grow on communities
adding storm water utilities. Uh it's funded by residents uh as a utility much
like water, sewer, electric. Uh also uh we're able to complete more projects uh
because we have a sustainable funding source. Um we can still borrow uh and
supplement that but we also have its own source. that we have that commitment to
projects annually. Uh that feels like that becomes much more proactive than
reactive because we have a dedicated funding source. Uh we can identify the
projects in the list. We can continue to complete those projects knowing that we
have funds to do that on a regular basis. Uh and we're able to keep on top
of maintenance. Um those things that you know right now uh the general fund has a
very small storm water uh cost in there for maintenance. And um you know, I'm
sure Randy can attest, you know, I don't know what the number is in the budget,
but generally it's not very big and it doesn't go very far. Um so again, I
think there's some benefits to the fee that can help versus the current option.
So on the next slide here, um we just want to talk about the utility. Uh so u
the city has adopted a storm water utility. Uh that was done in 2021. Uh I
don't know that everybody truly understands the city has a stormwater
utility. The difference is it's not funded. Uh in in uh 2021 there was a
referendum that failed to implement a user or a charge fee to raise those
funds. Um so what's changed since 21? So why are we back here talking about it?
Um it was determined that um at the time of the referendum that it was believed
that that was a requirement uh because the funds that were expended when the
regulations on utilities went into place that that was the amount that I believe
it was 2013 we had to go back find out how much the city had spent on uh
utility storm related expenses and then that was what the levy would have to be
reduced by. Uh the city at that time had believed that it was the total cost
capital and general fund costs towards the utility spend. Uh in reality it was
only the the general fund cost and not the capital cost which lowered that
number significantly. So it had a much less impact on the levy than the city
had thought. Um and so uh going to referendum obviously was the decision at
the time. But you know it was decided that you know uh the impact was
relatively small to the overall levy to make this decision to adopt the user fee
going forward. And so uh that has changed. Uh so we knew have new kind of
a new um I guess approach to uh what that really meant and where the city
currently sits. Uh the other thing that's changed is in 2022
as a result of the failed referendum, a lot of the general feedback from the
public was uh the fee is okay, but we have to understand how you're going to
spend it, right? There's this unknown of, you know, the city just or the
utility just collecting this fee and not knowing what it's going to be used for.
And you know, I think the the city at the time and the council had looked at
this and said, uh, we recognize that we know there's projects out there, but
let's do a comprehensive study and identify what they really are and, you
know, put some validity behind the ask. And so in 2022, uh, I had worked with
the city on developing a comprehensive plan which kind of looks at all facets
of storm water management across the entire city, not just certain areas. Um
the council in 2023 had asked for a priority list of those top projects um
that we created uh in that comprehensive plan. And what we did when we created
that uh is we we gave every project that we identified a priority score based on
impact uh there was there were several categories. there was impact um cost,
you know, water quality, all kinds of things. And that's what generated the
projects that prioritized on the list were the ones that scored the highest uh
for need. So that was the 2023 memo. And uh so then since we've been working on
that, so going back to what was completed, so from 2023 to 2025, uh the
city has continued to complete a number of storm water projects uh moving
forward off of that list. So, we're still working off that list uh to
complete those projects. So, that's kind of the progression of of the ordinance
adoption, the referendum, and then kind of the progress that we've made since
that. So, the next couple slides again are
just quick examples of um just projects that have been completed. Uh there was a
very large diameter, I don't remember the size of it, 60-in uh pipe that was
replaced under Fuller Street uh in the tributary to the Second Ward creek that
goes through Washington Park. Uh that was a significant project cost. I
believe it was um over $500,000 worth of uh repair. This pipe had to be replaced
because this was one where it was a large diameter corrugated metal pipe
where the bottom had rusted out of completely. So, it had no support
underneath the pipe. The water was just basically running across bare ground. Um
so that was kind of a a example of a project where you know we need
significant funds to make those improvements.
Um the next slide uh shows a project where um we just completed. So those of
you who are familiar with Fireman's Park uh know that there is a culvert that no
longer exists that is a small dam cvert that was removed throughout the park. Uh
and hopefully people see that as an enhancement to the park as much as it is
an improvement to storm water quality. And so that project was completed as
well. Um again, you know, you know, several hundred,000 project there that
was completed, but again, we're making progress towards uh improving that. And
I understand that I've heard reports that that has helped with some of the
flooding or at least uh the impacts of some of the heavy rains. Uh so we're
happy that that that project's completed.
Uh so kind of moving on here, stormwater utility. So what is it? Uh again, we
talked about that it's going to be the mechanism that allows us to operate. Uh
it's going to be a dedicated uh funding source. So once these uh funds are
collected, they're managed and financed and controlled through that specifically
used for storm water projects. Uh much like sewer and water utilities. Uh what
are the benefits with the fees? We talked a lot about that. Um how is it
funded? Again, I think there are two components of this. There's a base fee
that would be part of that that's uh kind of charged uh and then there's a
fee based on an equivalent runoff unit. So, the base fee is essentially an
administrative fee to execute um you know the utility um needs and
then the the ERU will generate the fees for the uh for the actual storm owner
piece itself. >> Er, what's that?
» Equivalent runoff unit. >> Okay.
So, as we look at funding scenarios, we we've revisited this and said, "Okay, um
the way that I think the utility had previously uh looked at and the city had
asked me to kind of develop a plan was to pick a pick a dollar amount and say
we're going to raise x amount of dollars without knowing what the need was. Now
that we have the need, uh I think the we've gone back and looked at this a
little bit differently and said, "Okay, what knowing the need, what is it that
we need to do to meet some of the needs that we have listed in the report to
have a meaningful impact?" So we looked at some funding scenarios. So the first
one here is just a maintenance focused funding scenario. So rotational ditch
cleaning maintenance, storm water inlet cleaning maintenance. Again, you see a
lot of maintenance heavy stuff here. Uh a medium-sized project every few years.
So we're going to take one of these big projects you just saw off the list.
we're going to get it completed every every couple years. Um we're also going
to you know do projects that the city has been completing um you know and and
continue to work on those but you know some of those may remain deferred uh if
we're going to do this every few years. So the ERU and we'll talk about
equivalent running unit equivalent runoff unit here in a minute for
definition but you know that would be between 90 and $120 annually. So
essentially $10 or less a month for uh the average residential property.
Uh funding scenario number two, we looked at what we call what we uh it's
called a balance program. So we're going to do the annual maintenance as we
talked about. Uh but now we're going to look to fund one capital project every
other year. So we're going to kind of ramp that up a little bit. Uh but again
that you know that takes more expense and so therefore you know you see your
erus here uh bumping up a little bit. So now it's going to start at the $10 and
it's going to work its way up a little higher. Um you we're kind of
recommending this as kind of the heavy medium if you will. Um you know it's not
that much more expensive than the maintenance but it gives us this ability
to raise funds uh to create um you know more of these major projects. These are
the bigger ones that are going to have more meaningful impact. Uh so that's
just the funding scenario number two. And then on three
uh I think we looked at what we'd call the aggressive capital program. So,
we're going to pick off one of these large projects every year. We're going
to continue to do full annual maintenance. Um, you building out
projects, addressing them systematically. Uh, this is going to be
your fastest impact, but you start seeing the dollars getting up into, you
know, 150 to 175 annually. Uh all of these values are not out of line with
some of the competitor or u comparable organizations that we see uh from
municipalities around the area, but um it it is something that we're just going
to have to take a look at from Columbus's standpoint to make sure that
what is right or what fits for you guys um is what you need.
Uh the next slide uh we look at here was just the eru. So Jack uh equivalent
runoff unit is a average horizontal impervious surface area for single
family residential lot within the city of Columbus. So how we calculate that is
we take samples throughout different zoning districts and densities for uh
single family uh residential. We figure out how much impervious area they have
square footage wise. We average that out across all of them. And we take the
average and we say that's it. That's going to be what we're going to base our
fee off of. So, everybody across the city pays one eru if you have a
residential unit, single family home. Uh, we determined that in 2021 to be
3600 square ft of impervious on a lot. So, you might have slightly less or
slightly more, but you'll still base pay off of that 3600 as an average. Um, so
again, somebody with a slightly larger lot may have the $150 a year because
they have one ERU. somebody with a slightly bigger lot or smaller lot will
still pay the same amount. Uh and that that type of equivalent runoff uh
calculation is also supported legally within the state. So it's been
challenged and the way that's calculated is is really kind of supported by uh
kind of the history of of the challenge. So uh for two units mult multi or if you
start getting into multif family uh the erus are calculated off of a number of
times factor. So if it's twice the 3600 or 7200, you'll be at two erus, two unit
residentials, each pay6. So total 1.2. So again, just some very standard uh
calculations that have been used and and again tried and true throughout the
stormwater uh units is how you apply to multifamily and and uh two single family
residentials. Uh so once we calculate it, um then what
do we do with it? So we got to talk about how we bill it. Uh there's a
couple options here. Um I there's pros and cons to both. Uh it can be done
monthly like your typical bill. Uh right now I get in my community I get a sewer,
water and storm water utility bill every month and there's a utility charge for
storm water on that. That's pretty typical. There are some communities here
that do it on a annual tax basis. So it's a special charge on a tax bill to
collect it. Um and then there's obviously some that do quarterlys. Uh
there's some examples up there. Sarah Fitchburg does quarterly, Middleton does
quarterly. Uh again, some prairie is an example of somebody who does it monthly.
So again, just it it can all be done that way. I think the difference is if
it's done on a tax bill, it goes to the property owner. If it's done on a
utility bill, it goes to the user. So if there's a renter or somebody in a home
uh that the utility bill is under, that the, you know, storm water utility bill
would go to them. So again, there's some nuances to the different options in here
of how we want that uh sent out. But again, I I think there's examples of how
communities do that regardless of which way you guys would decide to go if you
implement a storm water utility fee. Um, next slide.
» I think my presenter there is skipping over a couple. He's trying to speed me
up. Um,
» it's working, isn't it? >> Well, I was I was on track until we got
lost here. Um so implementation so establish new
project priorities we talked about that uh the rate study credit policy
development so if we choose to move this forward uh we'd have to implement the
actually the rate study piece of it so there's a lot of properties out there
that are commercial where we'd have to calculate how many erus they have and
we'd have to put that into a uh a rate for them. Uh there's a credit policy.
We've talked about this in the past. What happens if somebody mitigates their
own storm water on site through their own means or methods? Maybe a property
or a community puts in some kind of uh storm water implementation measures on
their own. What kind of credit do we give back to them? We develop that
because that's not in place currently. Certainly public public engagement uh
will be part of that. There will be an ordinance update. There's some things on
the original ordinance that were adopted that would need to be adjusted uh today
because things have changed since 2021 when the ordinance was adopted. Like any
ordinance, there's things that uh we know now that we didn't know then. uh
council review and adoption and a utility launch. So, there's a bunch of
pieces that would have to kind of fall into place here. So, um those are kind
of the the pieces of where Columbus is at and kind of what it would take to
kind of uh implement this. So, so what would we expect? Um we'd have a better
idea of projects, which we have now. Uh we'd know what funding we would have
available. We could project that and and plan better as to what we could get
accomplished. uh that would show your proactive uh continuous improvements. Uh
you would have a funding balance. So reoccurring money coming into the system
as we would spend it out. Uh and you know your CIP would get a little bit of
relief from that. So at the city level there would be uh less impact to the
general borrowing uh for storm water u because it you know obviously is funded
through this. So I think that's it. Is that the last one?
Oh, there's a summary there, but I think we're ready for questions if
anybody's got any for me. >> Oh, sure.
» Page six, we bought projects
and the numbers on the projects I indicate are they're priority projects,
right? Like number 19, number 69, 25. >> So, it kind of looks like we're funding
projects of low priority. Am I reading that right?
» No. you're reading that wrong. Uh the trick to that is that we numbered every
project we identified on just a number. We gave it a number one through I think
97 is the the total project. We think we had 97 priority.
» It's not a priority. We went back and assigned priority to them after we
numbered them and then those were the projects that rose.
» Let's cut to the next question that is is there a list in here? I didn't see
it. >> Not in the presentation. No, but the
comprehensive storm management plan has the entire list and there's the priority
list from 2023 that's available. >> All right, two more questions. Um 2008
we had like 14 inches of rain caused a big problem and we we fixed some things.
You were here and um trying to figure out
where are we? If we got 14 inches of rain again over a two-day period, you
know, just um how big of a headache are we a step up or two from where we were?
I know we fixed some lift station issues and got rid of some lift stations that
flooded out and did some other improvements.
» Are we are we better prepared today than 2008? What would happen?
» That's a trick question. >> I'd like to say, Jack, if we do get a
big rainstorm, I'm going to blame you. >> What? So, if we do get a flooding
rainstorm, I'm going to blame you for that question.
» It's a trick question. And why I say that is because um every situation is
different. So, um I was very familiar with 2008 cuz I had a flooded basement
just like everybody else and I was sandbagging.
Um what happened in 2008 is we had a very wet winter or a very snow covered
winter between 2007 2008. Fall of 20ou 2007 was also there was a lot of rain in
late summer fall of 2007. So we're very saturated, very high groundwater. Uh we
went into a very heavy snow year. It melted in spring. We had actually a lot
of uh in March of that year we had a lot of damage uh and high flooding because
of all the ice jams. Everything broke up really quick. We had a lot of water. So
again, I I this is burned in my brain so I know the answers to this. And so what
happened is when we got to May, when that storm hit, it came over about a
3-day period and there was there was 14 in of rain, but it was already so
saturated that it had kind of a compound effect.
» Soaked in. >> So So it's hard to say like if we got 14
in of rain today and it had been dry out for 30 days, there's a complete
different result. Now what I can say is that have we made improvements
throughout the system? Absolutely. Would that help? 100%. But again, to the
degree of what that would help would really depend on all those situations
that kind of build up around that storm event.
» Too many variables. >> There's a lot of variables. So, last
question. >> Um, do the comprehensive approach.
How about if we did that for a couple years and then sunseted it? It might be
the idea is it might be easier to sell if we sold a two or threeyear
improvement storm water improvement program. We knew exactly what projects
we wanted to do. We got a good idea how much it's going to cost. And when we get
the work done, it's going to sunset.
» Maybe you don't have to have an answer to this one here, but uh
» that's your prerogative. That might be an easier cell because
» it definitely would take two years. >> Continuous storm water
» funding. >> There's way too many projects to get it
done in a couple of years. >> All right. Three, four years.
» Well, and and I just add that >> it's just an idea. I don't know if it's
a good idea or not. >> Right. And but I also think communities
that have created a storm water utility, I haven't seen any that have then all of
a sudden disbanded their storm water utility.
many have increased the amount that they're charging because
what we've seen is costs increase. And when you develop this
infrastructure, you have to have a way to maintain it.
And so when you've created the maintenance through the storm water
utility and now you say you're going to take the storm water utility away, now
you've still got to maintain that infrastructure and now you're putting
that on your general fund that is already stressed.
And and so I understand, I agree, it would be a much more sellable
proposition to say we're going to whether it's a fiveyear or 10-year, but
I also think that puts you in a really tough spot at the end of that time
period of how how you continue because it's not just
it's not just the infrastructure and building new infrastructure.
We are currently struggling to maintain and upkeep the infrastructure that we
have.
» Never mind. >> I think a good example too is we bought
a street sweeper a couple years ago that wasn't bought through a storm water
utility. It was bought by the DPW through the city general fund. But
there's always going to be needs for those maintenance things even after you
check the projects off. I think one >> a lot of communities to add to that will
run their leaf collection program through the storm water utility and if
we wanted to potentially upgrade to a leaf vacuum or a different
way of collecting leaves that I know has been bantered around and talked about
that could be a potential project of the stormwater utility or a partial funded
project of the stormwater utility. >> Yeah.
» I'm not out of line there am I Jason? Like that I'm guessing most communities
are doing that. Yeah, leaves in the street are not generally good for storm
water. Um,
» I'm assuming the comprehensive plan is probably available on the website.
» It is on the website. >> I think getting a look at that entire
list and I'm assuming there's estimated costs that go with all the projects that
would probably help Jack too if you saw the whole list.
» Sorry. >> I think it's 400 pages long. So,
» oh, quick read. >> It'll it'll it'll keep Jack busy.
» That's why it was included in your packet. And and just to add to that, and
Jason can clarify, I think a lot of those projects are things that I've
heard people talking about in terms of dredging some of the creeks and and
cleaning up. Those are projects in that listing, right?
» Yeah. Cal capacities in there. Other things we put in there are uh just I
mean, I'll give an example. I looked it up today, so I knew this answer tonight,
but I thought this is a great example that it might come up is we do these uh
re street reconstruction projects generally annually based on the city
capital plans. Everybody wants their streets repaired. Well, I just look the
the school street project. Everybody's familiar with the seven blocks we're
reconstructing. There's $325,000 worth of storm sewer improvements on that job.
So again, just an example of a cost that's being borrowed for that's not
being funded out of a utility that could partially or fully be funded out of a
utility. So again, those annual projects are occurring. So when you think about
projects and we think about culverts and and creeks and dredging and, you know,
big large diameter culverts and stuff like that, that doesn't preclude these
street reconstruction projects from having significant storm costs, too. And
obviously, we're doing those to repair our roads, but we're upgrading the storm
sewers and replacing those in those projects as well. So again, just another
example of a reoccurring need that we have now. Um, and that's list that'll be
listed in comprehensive plan as a as a line item, but it just says annual
stormwater reconstruction projects. So, but yeah, those are all incorporated
into that report. My question would be or comment. Um,
I don't know if we're going about it a little bit backwards.
Um I know in that year um my backyard was
water almost up to the house which is quite deep and I think the deer were in
our backyard to give them relief from the deer pen that was flooded. But I
know when now with the two parts of the park being opened up, I know now the
bottleneck moved downstream like Joe could probably attest now. I think he
gets more flooding at his place. Should we start at the end and work our
way to the beginning? You know what I mean?
» Yeah. Well, if you that that's perfect setup, Brooke. So, for example, if you
look at that 2023 memo of priority projects, two of the priority projects
are just that. We knew that, right? Like, if we do these projects, we're
going to we're going to have to be very cognizant of the downstream flooding in
Second Work Creek. One of the priority projects is increasing the culvert
capacity under James Street. That is a bottleneck. Uh is and it it's a big
culvert, but when we get those significant waters, that has no chance
of carrying that water under the street. So, that backs it up before it actually
breaches the street. I think it was just a few years ago. We had a very quick
flash flood one night and there was water over top of James Street. I drove
through there. I turn around, I come back and I couldn't get back. There was
like a foot and a half of water like in 10 minutes that came over that street.
So again, just an example of that's downstream. That's a priority project.
That's actually number one. That's priority. I think number one on my
entire list. Uh and then we had a project where we had looked at dredging
that whole section from the mill pond all the way up through uh Quantis Park
as a priority project. So, the idea was to open that up, make more capacity in
there, uh, from a flood standpoint, but also conveyance standpoint, right? We
need to be able to get that water down to the dam and and we've done a good job
of monitoring the dam and knowing if rain is coming, we can draw that down.
We can get the water in the mill pond lower to take that capacity. The problem
is we can't get it through the system unless we make these improvements. So,
yes, absolutely right. Those are on the priority list. So,
» that James Street choke point though is a state responsibility, isn't it?
Highway 16, Highway 16. >> Uh, yes. And what we would do is we'd
work with the state to try and figure out how much we could get them to fund.
That would be 100% correct. So, I don't know that's a boring 100% of our cost,
but you know, uh, there is a project there that's a priority project that
needs to be addressed. My other question would be on the Fuller
Street. Now, I can't remember how far that went
in, but eventually we're probably going to have
to replace all the way past Senate. Correct.
» You're just throwing darts at me tonight, aren't you? Um
» I'm sorry. >> That is also on the priority project
list. Yeah. So, we did replace it through Washington Park up to 73 and
stopped. But two of the issues there is it's going to be very expensive to cross
the state highway and once we get into the gas station property we're going to
probably end up with contamination and mitigation and things over there too. Is
that covered in great shape from where we connected down to where it discharges
in Kuanas? No. >> It's on our priority list for sure.
» You know I only ask because familiar you know growing up in that area.
Um what are you had an implementation slide what would your timeline for that
implementation be if we decided on something?
Yeah, I mean obviously there's some pieces to that, right? So, um, so if
there's a recommendation from here to council, council has to take action on
it. I don't know how long that will take. You know, I don't know if that's a
a cow or a public hearing or some other things they want to do there. That's
really their prerogative. Uh, but assuming that everything can move
forward, the actual rate structure we have from 2021, we built that the first
time. So, for me to go in and change the erus and run some new numbers, we'd have
to verify the the 3600 for erus, which I don't imagine's changed. Well, there's
some businesses that have been built and changed. So, we'll have to update that.
That's not going to take too long. Uh, but it's then just figuring out how to
incorporate it into the billing process. However, the again, the community wants
to do that. The ordinance update is going to take a little time. Uh, I don't
know if it's realistic to assume it'll take a few months or more to get it
through the process and get some changes made, assuming that it's got some
priority in those other utilities or other
communities. Sorry. You said that some of them do it monthly, quarterly, yearly
on the tax bill. Um, Middleton does it quarterly. City of S Prairie does it
monthly. How do they get it to their customer? Is it a separate bill? Is it
on their utility bill with their other utilities? How are they getting
» most people that are not putting on tax bill will build bill through the
utility? >> Yeah.
» Places I've lived >> other places I've lived, it's come on
the monthly utility bill. >> Yeah,
» I have a few questions. Uh, as far as the erus, I mean, you're talking mostly
here about residential, but is there something in the ordinance already that
addresses other zoning like commercial, industrial, things like that already, or
does that need to be created? >> No. ERUS are for those non-residential
properties are based off of uh the 3600 ft. So, again, we're the same principle.
So, if we have somebody who's got 7,200, it's two eru. So, it's commercial. It's
just based off of. So what we have to do is go in and actually calculate project
or parcel by parcel on the commercials what their total impervious is and then
we just divide that into the 3600 to give us an eru number. So it could be
2.4 erus or it could be 4.6. Um so we again we have that calculated for most
of the commercial properties in the city right now. So it's just applying what
the eru size is and just updating that in the rate study.
» Imperous factor. >> Impervious factor. Yep.
» Like roof versus lawn. >> Yep. Gravel. gravel, roofs, concrete,
you know, those are the type of things that factor into it.
» Um, the other two questions I have is, uh, what mechanism has changed that
would allow this to happen now without a referendum or was it just knowledge at
the time that the city >> Yeah, maybe Matt can speak more to that.
I I might have botched that a little bit earlier, but no. Um,
so when this was being discussed for the first time when I was here, I asked
Ellers how all these communities are enacting storm water utilities without
going to referendum. And what they shared was you have to
take a negative levy le levy adjustment in the year you enact your storm water
utility for whatever you spent from an operating standpoint in your operating
budget in 2012 or 2013 whenever the law changed about having to go to
referendum. Um and so I think that the difference is in 2020 2021 when that was
discussed the the understanding was you had to take the negative levy adjustment
for both your operating and capital and the correct information is you only have
to take for what you spent in operating and so I think with capital it would
have been in excess of $200,000 as a negative levy adjustment which we can't
afford to do the operating expense is is roughly $14,000 and some change. That's
a negative levy adjustment that I think we're willing to take as a one-time hit
to be able to create this funding source for storm water.
» And that doesn't limit your future ability for the amount that you're
correct >> going to raise. Okay.
» Yeah. >> Yep.
» Um >> it's a one-time negative levy
adjustment. >> All right. Um, the other question I
guess is how did the council respond to this presentation when you got it in
May? >> Oh gosh, that was back in May.
» I mean, we're probably just making a recommendation to the council at this
point. I'm I'm assuming, >> right?
» I mean, Matt, you're going to have to help me here because my memory back to
May is not well, but I don't remember it being contentious at all. It was more
like we we want to send this to the utility commission. want to send it to
utility commission for their input because obviously there are things that
could impact the utility operation, right? The billing structure could
potentially be an impact utility, but there's also um you know depending on
where this goes, there's some advantages to creating it as well, right? Um so I I
think there are some impacts here to the utility clearly that the council wanted
input from the utility commission. As I've talked to council members, nobody
wants to add another fee, but I I think the council is very in tune with some of
our levy limit issues and concerns both at the operating budget level as well as
borrowing. And the biggest thing that I'm talking to people that have
questions about budget and what what challenges we're facing is the street
project that used to cost 34 of a million now costs $3 million, right? And
so people may not like this answer, but if we can take the 320,000
out of the general fund borrowing and assign it to a storm water utility with
a separate funding source, we can do more streets.
And I think the number one thing the council heard last year during the
budget is, "Please fix my street." And so we aggressively put a 10-year street
plan together that is very different than past street plans. And Jason can
talk about this. Our street program used to be we would do a major project and
then we'd do like a mill and overlay or something smaller. And then we'd do a
major project and then we'd do a smaller maintenance mill and overlay. We've now
got 10 years stacked of we're going to do a major street project 10 years in a
row. and and that we've got to stretch dollars as far as
we can to be able to do that and be able to deliver the residents expectations of
having their streets repaired. >> Yeah. And I think also to add to that,
um, the council is is trying to stop kicking cans down the road, um, and
trying to take care of needs. And the fact that storm water has been such a
problem for so long and we just haven't been able to make a lot of progress up
until like recently to show our commitment to it from a city perspective
before we felt comfortable with being able to put in a utility. It's like
we're showing we have a plan now and Jason um talked about that a little bit
and we're doing some of these projects ourselves like see we find it important
but we want to continue but we can't do it continue doing it that way long term
» and and to answer one of Jack's earlier points I don't know that any community
can handle a 14inch rainfall no matter how much storm water infrastructure you
plan and manage for Um, I would say Middleton, where I worked, has done a
great job of of implementing storm water infrastructure, and we got a 14-inch
rainfall over a 12-h hour period of time, and it it was a war zone.
» So, my thought is, how does this affect the utilities? I mean, it almost seems
like it it's more of a DPW issue than
um water um electric sewer type. >> Originally, when when this commission
was created, there there was the intent of having a storm water utility under
it, which has been created, but there's no funding for it. So,
» your your ordinance clear currently states that you manage the storm water
utility that is an unfunded utility. So the funding is just coming from
somewhere else.
» Yep. >> So
» the the streets issue is not going to go away. When I ran for city council in
2013, that was a hot button item and it's 2026.
» Um so I'm all for it. My main concern is that
I I'd be happy to make a recommendation to the council, but when the word gets
out that there's going to be a fee, um I remember doing that once when I was
mayor and there were people from all over the state emailing me, how dare you
do this. So, there's got to be some bravery on the council when it gets that
far. That's the only reason I'm asking what the mechanism is at this point. So,
» well, and I think we've already been seeing that, you know, but I think a lot
of the problem is is it's misinformation or lack of information that's being
shared with the community. And that's something else we've also been trying to
um increase within council and with, you know, awareness to the community, kind
of like what we're doing with the public safety building and stuff like that. But
the problem is is getting people to show up. you know, you can build it, but it
depends if they come or not. So, the opportunities to learn and understand
um don't outweigh people just wanting to complain.
» I think the projects in Fireman's Park are a great example, though. I mean, I
think you guys were out there potholeing 10 or 12 years ago because we knew there
was an issue and it takes a long time to get those done. But I think anybody that
goes to the parks or to the school sees that project and the people that live in
that area know that the flooding has been mitigated somewhat um that maybe
they'd be on more on board now as well. But you know that project all got paid
from somewhere and you had to take something else out of the budget or the
borrowing to do that. >> And that project was a lot more visual
and in your face. It's the projects that >> the storm water that gets put underneath
every street that you're >> pretty things that you know that it's
hard to see benefits from. The other thing is is like everybody that's had
flooding problems >> wants it to be fixed, but everybody that
doesn't have flooding problems don't want to pay for the people that have
flooding problems to have it fixed. So, um you have that and I think you're
going to have that no matter what. >> Yeah. was my question about the er. I
mean, obviously, if you live on a hill, flooding is not an issue. If you live at
the bottom of the hill, it's more of an issue, but you're both paying the same
amount if you have the same size home because eventually you're going to have
to drive down the hill to go to the grocery store. You know, the
infrastructure is affected. All that stuff is affected.
» Exactly. My house is is pretty high up. My sump pump has never ran once since
I've lived here. Um, and just like a block down the road, if it's just spring
and there isn't even rain and I'm walking around, I hear people some pumps
running nonstop and spitting water out. So, um, I think I think just people have
to be better better neighbors and, you know, and be concerned about everybody.
» I ran into this problem a lot when I was working. I founded a lot of storm sewer
projects. We squeezed it down to a real easy
concept. We all live in this drainage basin
together. >> And so when they complain about, I live
in the hill, oh, I don't have to pay. You tell them, no, you're part of the
drainage basin, too. >> You the water's running off of your roof
just as much as running off everybody else's roof.
» Yeah, Sandy, >> everything goes downhill.
First of all, I I fully support funding a a storm water utility. One of the
things that you said tonight that I hadn't considered was that utility bills
would go to the renter versus if it was on the tax bill, it would go to the
owner. And I think that having it go to the owner seems more appropriate because
they have more control over what the what the impervious surface is on that
property. But it kind of goes against what is
intuitive to have it be a utility on a utility bill.
» Yeah. Certainly that's a drawback of the utility bills, right? Because utility
bills can vary. I mean, some landlords pay them and work it into the rent.
Others are go directly to the renter and stuff. And so that's that's always the
decision of well then how do you how do you decide
how to get that to the right person, which is the owner? And a lot of cases,
you're you're right. I mean, we have a lot of owners that don't even live in
the city. Um, but yet it's their property that's contributing. So, is
there is there a way to to to mitigate that? I don't I don't know. I guess that
would be something we'd have to look into. And I don't know if you have any
thoughts on that, Matt, but I mean I mean I have my unsolicited two cents
on it. Um, I would say even if the owner is out of the city, they're not the one
utilizing the infrastructure within the city and the renter is. The other thing
is is I selfishly as a council member do not want to raise the taxes again
because we get beat up nonstop for that and we have the public safety building
come up that is inevitably going to raise the taxes. So I selfishly want it
on the utility because it's easier to explain as a utility than people getting
a one-time lump sum once a year. I can see that. Um, but it's the owner's
equity that's being protected by the storm water utility.
Yes and no. Because like for me, the storm water utility isn't raising my
equity at all. But if I was renting to somebody and I didn't live in the city,
I would say, well, they're using the infrastructure, they're using the parks,
they're using the roads, and the storm water utility protects all of that, and
they're using it, not me. I see what you're saying. I don't agree,
but I see what you're saying. >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I feel like it could
go either way. I mean, you can put an argument on either side. I just think
that it would be
easily consumable on a utility bill versus taxes.
» Point made. I think that regardless implementation on a utility bill will
cause questions and frustrations because they've had an electric rate increase, a
water rate increase. We're talking about a sewer rate increase, and now you're
going to add the weight, sorry, storm sewer utility fee on there. Um, and then
you have a small group of people that are fielding those questions as well and
are going to get beat up constantly. I'm not disagreeing with the storm water
utility because I do agree that managing the storm water is a huge huge need in
this city but try not to discount that the people that are going to be
implementing it are also going to get beat up pretty badly once they implement
it and that will be a challenge on how they're going to implement it. That's
not going to be easy either. >> And I totally understand that. I also
think that our utilities are very reasonably priced still even after rate
increases that we might want to do some education on that too. I think no matter
which way you implement it, you're going to have to do education on it. But um
you know just >> just considering that
» I just add like I think part of our strategy with the utility rates have
been we want to do small incremental frequent increases as opposed to large
step increases that you're seeing in the news in other utility operations
throughout the state where they haven't raised and now they're making big jumps.
And um I think the reality is is is the cost for everyone is increasing and
nobody wants to see increases. But I I I'm not aware of any community out there
that's magically not increasing their costs of operating whether it's their
utilities that you know or other facets of the city.
» Is there a way to split it like 50% on the tax bill, 50% on a monthly basis?
that way. They're kind of both. It covers both. It hits the homeowner.
Well, if you are a homeowner, it hits you get it 100% no matter what. But if
you're renting, you only pay for your portion and it as a property owner,
you're only paying for your portion. And my second comment would be everybody
that's running for election right now, you hear them, they're trying to limit
these how much we can raise our rates. What is going to happen then? You know
what I mean? You want my response to that question?
They're great electable issues that people always talk about and the
implementation of them is not realistic. >> Right.
» I understand that. I would it be like an oversight
nightmare of the storm water utility to bill it 50/50 and take more staff
resources than just to have it on one or the other?
» It's an interesting concept that I don't think that I've contemplated and I think
there's some legal questions and some un unanswered questions that I think we
would need to get answers on. I actually had the same thought for this reason is
that if you split the cost, the cost that's on your utility bill is minimal
and also on your tax bill. When you look at how much you pay for garbage and
recycling, that's not my taxes going up. There's a fixed cost that goes with that
and that can vary based upon contracts. >> But if you had that small charge,
» I really like that you just said that because I've not heard it from anybody
else. They view it as their taxes going up, not the cost of
» You can't include that as your total taxes when you file. I'm just saying.
Yep, I know. But I recognize that. But anyway, I think if you saw a storm water
bill for $60 a year next to garbage and recycling for $200 and some dollars, I
think I don't think you'd get a whole lot of people angry about that. So, if
we could do a hybrid, but that would be up to the council ultimately.
That's my assumption. Well, I mean, I think the council would want
recommendation though from from you all and and they would
then agree or disagree or you know >> um but we could always I mean you could
always and I don't know Matt how you feel about this. I mean if everybody
feels strongly about you could give an option like we would prefer to do it
50/50. Let's say everybody's okay with that, but if that's not legally possible
or not just doesn't make sense, you know, fiscally, then we would prefer XYZ
and then like give at least a second option. I don't know.
» Sure. >> I mean, my assumption is the the garbage
and recycling fee that comes in on the tax bill, that's in a segregated
account. It's not mixed in with the general fund. It's it can't go anywhere
else. So, it would have to go to the to the new utility. It's its own special
revenue fund is how the garbage recycling is set up.
» Okay. >> Uh what specifically are you looking
from us tonight? Like a yes or a no overall or like which version of this to
give a recommendation? Um I think I think what council would be
looking for is you know Jason had a low a medium and a high example a
recommendation there and then if there is a recommendation on the billing
structure as Molly talked about I think those are are two um valuable things for
the council to consider. Do you know what mechanism would be involved if we
do move forward with this to adjust those rates after it's created? After
the fund is created,
» this has been bantered by the council and these discussions too and um
I don't know that there's been any concrete discussion on on how that is
dealt with. I I think what you're referencing is um some kind of built-in
escalator or some kind of builtin um control mechanism that doesn't allow
the rate to to increase significantly or >> not really uh just I think since it's
new yeah >> is that if you implement kind of at the
base level which is way more than we have right now it's a separate funding
source and then you incrementally bring it up a little bit the first couple
years to take the sting out of it. >> Yeah.
» I'd rather do that personally. >> Yeah.
» Than say, let's go for the gusto and do the the gold package. That's just me.
» Yeah. I >> Others may feel differently.
» And my my whole thing on this is the the past approach was let's let's create
this to have it, but we don't know what it's going to do, right? And I I think
to for me to be able to sell this to the public is here's the projects it's going
to accomplish. here's the schedule that we're going to accomplish them and that
the rate makes sense based on what we want to accomplish for the utility.
» Yeah, I think the council had more concerns with the rate changing
frequently than a rate that has been confirmed is the rate we need to pick
the projects to be charged from the beginning. So, um I think that there is
definitely a desire to have that number figured out and solid from the
beginning.
Lori, >> how I mean I I guess I struggle with
that because like we talked about a road this year costs this much, a road next
year cost this much. Storm water is going to be the same. In your ordinance,
can you write in there every 3 years you're increasing it this percentage due
to inflation or what have you, but have it
set ahead of time and that you're not doing it every year per inflation, but
every couple of years for inflation. I you can set it, but it'd be unrealistic
to think that you're going to be able to keep it at the same level.
» Oh, for sure. I meant just it not increasing for like three or four years
in a row, ramping up. We wouldn't want that. But we council does want in the
ordinance that clarified like how do you how do you justify an increase because
of inflation in the future and stuff like that?
» And who would be responsible for the rate increases? Is it this commission or
is it the city council because we have to adjust the utility rates here?
» Well, I think it would be utilities making a recommendation to council
» just like it is now. >> Okay.
» Um my opinion on the matter is the funding scenario too. Um I think that
you might as well start out right in the middle. Get the money going. Get it
taken care of. Um, I'm split on whether it should go on a utility bill or a tax
bill. I really am. I don't know. I mean, I understand the implic implementation
imple, you know what I'm trying to say, implications of both. I was like, you
know what I'm trying to say, of both. So, I I don't know how I feel one way or
another on that. So, I'm not going to provide that. But I do think that this
is absolutely necessary within the city just like roads and everything else. So,
I'm recommending funding scenario two.
I'm also good with funding scenario too, but you all know my opinion on where it
comes from.
» Getting the opinions down here on which version?
» Two is fine. I I still think we should do a 5050.
» I think that >> is the preference if that's um frowned
upon. >> I don't Why would it be frowned upon?
We haven't talked to lawyers or the impact on city staff. I mean, if it's
going to cost us >> x amount of dollars to even implement a
50/50, the juice might not be worth the squeeze, you know?
» I mean, wouldn't it all go to the same fund anyways? I mean, so it's just a
matter of how it's collected. >> I mean, maybe, but support and questions
are going to come to more city staff than just one area.
I would opt for simplicity, accountability,
transparency. If you start splitting it up, we're
getting 25% from there and 10% from there. And then then it gets confusing
like, well, whose obligation is it? Now, $10 a month for storm sewer
function, it's people can swallow that on their utility
bill. Okay, we got we had this utility bill
for six years now. We're finally going to run around, put some money in there
so we can do some more things and fix the streets in two. And um
yeah, they're going to cry. I mean, I don't blame them. I don't like my tax
bill and but uh I don't know how you can get
around it. How about if we don't build a brand new public safety building? Let's
take that one off. You know how much time I put into uh
selling the historic preservation district? Now they're going to like get
rid of city hall. You know how much time I put in trying to
» That's a topic. >> Well, I'm trying to get
» it creates a whole lot of room if you >> We can go round and round and round
another day on that, but not today. >> Sandy, do you have a preference?
» I also would prefer scenario two. Um, and I
I understand the simplicity of putting it on the utility bill. I also
understand the simplicity of putting on the tax bill. There's um, but I I get
the 50/50, too. I I do think that if we do the 5050, people will see it as
double dipping. And I wonder
» I understand what you're saying and that was kind of a thought,
but if it's explained properly, you know,
it would be to a user fee and basically an owner portion, I guess, more or less.
» Okay, >> that's the way I I would look at it.
» And that makes perfect sense. >> Yeah.
I I like scenario number two as well. And I'm still leaning on the hybrid. And
here's another reason. If you put it on the tax bill, it has to get paid. If you
don't pay for your trash and recycling and you just short your tax bill by
$272, you haven't paid your taxes. So, it's always collectible. Utility bills
are different. Um, if you decide you don't want to pay
that $10 and you short your bill every month $10, who's not getting the $10?
You're paying one bill. So, I think having the hybrid, if it's a
possibility, I think it looks better. Like, if if the
the property owner is getting the tax bill and the renters's not, then they
have to pay their portion and it makes those both of those numbers a little bit
smaller. But, I'm not going to get hung up on that. I just think that might be a
good way to approach it and let council kind of talk to staff and find out what
is possible and what's not possible. And if it's a logistical nightmare to do it,
then let the council decide.
So is the recommendation then if it's a logistical because it seems like the
majority want the 50/50 split or not a preference, but if it's a logistical
nightmare, you don't want to give a second preference. You just you want to
leave it up to council. >> The council Yeah. I mean, ultimately you
guys decide that stuff. I mean, there's so many other things to consider. I
mean, this is a benefit to the utilities, but it's also a benefit to
the city by freeing up more general funds.
» Yeah. I guess I would like everybody to agree that they would leave it then for
council to decide versus a recommendation because I think that's
risky um in doing that because you may not like what council chooses.
» Oh, if we make a recommendation, you don't have to follow it. I mean, that's
what a recommendation is, right? Yeah. >> Right. But right, I'm I guess I would
just be hoping as council to have if the recommendation is 5050 and it turns out
to be a logistical nightmare, I would worry that council may send it back to
utility asking what is a better what's the second option. I'm not saying it
will happen, but it could happen because the new structure that we have is that
if something can be handled in a committee or commission, we would like
that to happen and then a recommendation to council because the committee and the
commission is the quote unquote experts of the area. So, I'm just
» sure.
» Well, shoot. I'll go ahead and make a motion funding
recommend
» and then that's it. >> You don't want to
» Well, and then Well, I would then like to see a recommendation to council that
they pick the way that they fund it then if you're not going to offer a
recommendation on how it's funded because otherwise council will be like,
"Okay, well, how are we supposed to fund it?" And again, I worry it's going to
get kicked back. >> I'll move funding scenario number two,
putting$120 to $150 per EU on the utility.
» Second. >> All right, we've got a motion, a second
to make a recommendation to city council for scenario number two with no
recommendation as far as the billing. He said on the utility bill.
» Utility bill. >> Oh, utility bill. Sorry, I didn't hear
that. With the recommendation that it's on the utility bill.
» Do we have a roll call on this one? >> Is there any other discussion on the
motion? >> No.
» What uh I guess Matt, what
what's easiest to collect? Is it easier to collect taxes or is it easy to
collect billing?
my opinion is billing. It's uh straightforward. We have a system down
for it and and we have steps to take when it's not being paid or collected.
So, fair enough. >> Any other discussion? If none, let's
take a roll call then. >> Andler.
I Sanderson. >> Hi.
» F. I >> Tol.
» Hi, >> Curtis. I
» I >> unanimous got through that.
» Amen.
» They weren't intended to be >> appcate all.
» Thank you, Jason. >> Take care, Jason. Good to see you.
» Bye.
All right, we're going to move on to item number six then next, which is
consider and take action on the substation 2 water street transformer
purchase. There is information in our packets about that with the bits that
were received. So,
substation 2 upgrade. This project was approved by the council in 2024
and it is I believe and it is starting to come together. Uh materials are being
procured. You'll see in the packet that uh we had
put out to bid for transformers. Transformers are extremely expensive
now, especially the size we need for substations.
Um, we received five bids, I believe, and
the consulting engineer that we use a great deal, Forester, has recommended
that of the two lowest bids, we actually go award the contract to the second
lowest bidder because we find we feel that the greater value is with that
product that they supply. Um,
» sure. >> I got to ask a question on were these
solicited as quotes or through a formal bidding process?
» Through the formal bidding process. >> So my understanding is when you do a
formal bidding process in the state of Wisconsin, you're required to take the
low bid unless you've prevetted your vendors.
» Unless what? >> If it's an RFB, yes, you have to take
the lowest bid. If it's an RF >> Q
» Q, then you can take the person that's most qualified and doesn't necessarily
have to be the lowest bid. So if it was an RFB, you have to take lowest.
» Well, I'll have to find out then. It was my understanding. I mean, I don't think
» and and and I'm going to clarify this as there may be different rules for
utilities than for the city. I I I will state that, but it as the city, we're
not allowed to um not take the low bid on a bidded project.
Okay. I wasn't prepared for that question, I'm afraid. Um
I have at other times, well, many many times in my career in utilities, we do
not necessarily always take the lowest bidder because it is not the greatest
value. Um, many projects can be very under bid.
So, I'll have to get that answer. Um,
» can I say something real quick? >> Yes.
» I'm sorry. You made Jason stay, but we've had Rukard and Milky
» review bids for us in the past for other projects
» and then they do this similar thing that Forester did for us here. Has Rrooker
and Milky ever suggested that we don't take the lowest bidder for any sort of
cause? I don't trying to be as general to not like you know you know what I'm
trying to ask. >> Yeah.
» Have we done this before in a different situation with utilities? The way that
I've always approached it in my 20s some years with municipalities is it has to
be the lowest respons lowest responsible bidder and responsible bidder is clearly
defined as somebody who meets all the qualifications. So if they meet all the
qualifications then you have to basically take the low bid. If it's
nonresponsible means maybe you've had experience with
them where they've defaulted on something in the past where they had a
contract with you or done something. There are grounds or exceptions to that
in in my understanding that can be made, but that's only if you have again those
pre-qualifications identified up front for the biders when they submit. So
again, there there is some I think ways that we've done it. Um but again, I know
there's some risk in it and there's always some debate of whether you can
accept something that's not low and on based on what grounds. So, I've ran
across it a few times, but I can't say that I've ever made a recommendation
that isn't lowest. >> Sorry, I didn't mean to put you on the
spot on your topic. >> One way to avoid this in the future is
if you have a particular brand that you want used, call that out in your RFB
because then you can just get bids from people that use a certain brand.
Well, just for a little further explanation, it it was more of we had to
make a decision for the products that were submitted
um on what is going to provide the city in a greater capacity if we
grow. If we felt that
um our load requirements would stay the same for the next 20 years as they are
in 2026, then we would be very comfortable going with the lowest bid.
The second lowest bidder though is offering a product that allows for
greater capacity growth. And so Dalton and I made the decision
that we feel Columbus is on the brink of growing and this is going to serve us
better long after my career is over.
So that was the background of it. I'm thinking now that
I should pull this and uh if it doesn't come back to commission it's because
this was indeed a bid. So >> well and if I can add something as far
as the lowest responsible bidder goes uh the reason that we're going with Walka
as well is different capabilities of the transformer as opposed uh to the
Virginia. Now while they do have and make kind of what we're looking for it's
better supported through Waka. What we're going to is right now in our
substation we have voltage regulators. Essentially, it's a unit after the
transformer regulates the voltage tap changes um as needs arise for lower
higher voltages. What we're going to now with this larger transformer is what's
called an LTC, a load tap changer, which is in my opinion and forers as well
better supported through WacaWaw as far as service, sales, dependability, things
of that nature. So, I get the lowest responsible bidder
thing, but I don't think this is a fight that Virginia would be willing to get
into. I mean, these transformers are bought and sold all over the United
States all the time. I don't think that one transformer here is much to pay
attention to. I don't know my opinion on that.
» It's law though, unfortunately. >> Responsible bidder. Like, how do you
define that? Is there labor involved in this project?
» Yes, >> by the vendor.
» Um, labor by the vendor? No. Now, they will have somebody on site to review
» and like ensure it's being installed, but the labor itself is not by the
vendor. No. >> So, if it's a materials purchase, you
are not required to go low bit. If labor is involved, you and the labor exceeds
now $50,000 because of the change in state law that went from 25 to 50. If
labor exceeds 50, then you're required to go low bit.
» I'm a little surprised that Forester didn't catch this.
» Yes, sir. So am I. >> Well, my other question is, are all of
these transformers apples to apples? Are they all within the specs of the bid
that you put out? You said that the walk shaw one will be able to allow the city
to grow, but what were the specs of the bid that was put out?
» That's the sticking point. If you guys weren't specific to that in the bid, you
can't choose it later. >> What do you mean?
» We're hiring we're hiring a forester to figure all that out for us. We can get
really deep into the weeds on an electrical transformer. This can get
complicated. Do you want to debate that? Now, I've whenever I've gone out in the
field and audit projects, the most problematic ones were always at the
lowest bid. You know, we got a professional telling
us, you know, buy the walkie shaw one. It's a better deal.
» I'm good with that. It's getting late. >> We're not arguing that, Jack. We're
stating state law. >> Well, they're going to figure that out.
» We have to comply with >> I know. Yeah, but Ry's going to go check
that out and figure it out. And if they require us to take a low bid, you know,
well, I guess our hands are tied. But, >> you know, we don't have to figure that
out. Revise your >> So, the these are all comparables. These
are apples to apples across the board. All the specifications are the same
throughout. This is the way the bid came in. And with Matt saying it's the
material and this is strictly a material purchase. Does that apply?
I feel like what we should be doing is moving this recommendation forward from
Forester and if Forester did something inappropriate, they're going to notify
staff and then we have to figure it out from there. We're not doing anything
wrong by taking this recommendation from Forester.
» Is Forester liable if if it breaks um >> they went through the bidding
procurement process. >> They should know the bidding process.
» How >> I mean if they're accountable, sure,
that's a valid thing. But my experience is it's not the vendor that's
accountable. It's the it's the city or the state that's accountable.
» I don't know directly that answer. How would we hold them accountable?
» That's why I'm saying they can't be accountable. It's it's were the
accountable one. >> But if it's purely material, maybe it's
not an argument that is even there. I'm I'm going to throw out a recommendation
that maybe helps this move along is make make your motion to approve Waka Shaw
pending city attorney review. >> Perfect.
» May I can't make the motion. >> I can't make a motion.
» That's probably illegal. >> I'll move to approve MC Sales Walka. um
after verification with city attorney that we can choose them versus the
lowest bid. >> I'll still second.
» All right. There's a motion and a second to approve MC sales of Wakaaw the amount
of 1.868,226
for the purchase of a transformer with approval of the city attorney.
Any discussion on the motion?
We'll need a roll call on that, but we are missing one member right now.
» You take the vote and if they're back, does that work?
» Yep. >> Fry
» I. >> Tom,
» I >> Curtis
» I >> Fininkler
» I >> Handler I
» Sanderson will say
Yes or no? >> We're waiting on you for your vote.
» We took a vote. >> What do we have another?
» We took a vote to to award it to Walka with the approval of the city attorney.
Basic contingent. >> I'll vote for Walkaw.
» Okay. >> Got a yes.
» Y Sanderson. >> I I guess I
» motion's approved.
All right, let's move on to number seven. Consider and take action on
electric lead lineman proposed updated wage scale. So, as everyone knows, we
have hired Mr. Highley here as our assistant director. This has left a
vacancy for our uh department lead, electric department lead. Um, and we are
about to post this position, but the market out there right now in our
area for the lead in some cities, they call it Foreman still, is considerably
higher. They've had some cola adjustments since Columbus had set their
wage scale. So in order to stay competitive uh in this very competitive
market which I've discussed with the commission before um I am proposing or
asking your permission to uh increase our wage range now from initially it was
58.95 I believe was a ceiling and now we are
requesting that the ceiling be 6095. Uh that does not mean we that's what we
would start the new lead at but that would be their salary range that they
could expect.
Yes. Yes.
» I make a motion to accept the wage range for the electric lead lineman proposed
updated wage scale. >> I will second.
» All right. We got a motion, a second to approve the uh wage range adjustment
um as given by Randy. Any discussion on the motion?
If none let's take a roll call on this please.
» Tom >> I
» Curtis >> I
» Finler >> I
» Handler >> I
» Sanderson >> I
» Fry >> I
» could I just ask one question about the position description. We don't mention
anywhere at all the the assistant utility director as being part of the
hierarchy and the and seeing that was that's a newly created position and you
might want them to be >> yes
» somewhere in that hierarchy >> they answer to this yes that's a very
good point >> so just an idea
» we'll we'll make that change
» I'm going to take the screen Yep.
» All right. On to the fun one. Consider, discuss, and take possible
action on email sent from Fall River Village President on July 30th, 2026
regarding the outstanding Arers O2 Columbus utilities.
We've had this conversation a couple meetings ago.
Yes, we have. I'm sorry. And let me open up
just some data that I want to share with commission. I wanted to bring this to
commission because the president of Fall River did reach out specifically to the
commissioners and he did mention my name. Um so I want to make some u
clarifications here. Uh this was the last email sent by the president of Fall
River. um the areas I've highlighted um he has completely misrepresented the
actual circumstances and I want to go through those four and just explain to
um the commission why this is not realistic what he has been saying um
so this is a timeline of when this whole thing started when I started here at
Columbus one of the first tasks we took on was doing a rate case for sanitary
sewer uh because of we found some problems with our financial situation in
sanitary and so we did a rate case and during that rate case we discovered that
Fall River had not been built properly for the last four years. Um we then on
March 1st of this year u myself Matt Jason uh our business manager Michelle
and Mayor Hammer all met with Mr. Slottton and his staff and uh presented
to them our rate case and then during that conversation we explained to him
that there was an error in um the billing. Um we apologized for the
air but we explained how this was an error service was provided
um and you understand the story that um we felt not felt it was necessary that
we collect this outstanding balance. Uh at that time Mr. Slottton did not
respond. He said he wanted some time and then they did s send a response on May
2nd. Um in his letter um he said that the city has indicated a
village has been under charged approximately 117,000.5
um dating back to 2022 and then he states that the village does not believe
a back payment is justified. They went on with another reason um
saying that uh in the sewer utility invested funds that they're they believe
we could have been collecting interest off of this. It is my from my office our
position is this has nothing to do with our billing process. Uh if they wanted
to dispute that they can uh approach Matt the city or that but that has
nothing to do with me. I'm I'm It's my job uh as director to collect revenue
and to uh cover our costs. So I did not um I do not recognize this. Um if I'm
instructed to recognize this uh to factor this into what they owe us, I
will do so. But this is something I cannot consider. I do not consider this
for other customers we have and other businesses.
Um but what I want to point out here is Mr. Slottton is just dead wrong when he
said that he has not had a chance to talk about this. He's had eight months.
Um there have been many exchanges. Um
prior to this first invoice we sent Fall River uh in the beginning of June, Mr.
Slottton contacted our administrator, Mr. And admmonson, sorry, Matt. Um, and
he stated to Matt, um, I'm speaking on Matt's behalf, but he stated to Matt
that they do not intend to pay this. Um, he never reached out to me. Um, but then
we send the invoice. It was pretty clear in that invoice there. I'm sorry that,
um, they have this particular bill as
instructed by the commission has been spread out in 60 payments. There's no
interest attached to this. We could have attached interest. Uh the numbers there
when we were pulling them were uh if they were to pay this in lump sum the
interest which we have every right to claim would have been 5500 to 6,000. If
we spread this payment over 60 years and collected interest that would be 17,000.
I think that we are being gracious in this matter. But we are not asking for
interest. We're just asking for the payments. And we have given them you
know the 60-month spread as I was instructed and I'm glad to do it.
But then Mr. Slottton sends this email saying that um they do not intend to pay
it. They do not think this is justified. Um I sent a response.
I laid it out very clearly what the balance was. I uh explained that um you
know made it gave a further explanation that you have 60 months. There is no
interest here. Um I'm more than willing to talk about this and uh contrary to
Mr. Slottton's claim. I did not threaten legal action. I just laid out what the
procedures were if invoices are not paid. This is the same uh boilerplate
procedure we use for everybody that we apply a very minimal 1% per month
penalty. In their case, it would be I think $19 a month. Um and if that
doesn't happen, then I'm going to go to a collection agency. If that doesn't uh
produce the balance then we will pursue legal proceedings. This is nothing new
in the industry. So I I don't know
I cannot speak for Mr. Slottton. I know if I behave this way I would be
embarrassed at my professional immaturity
um using this aggressive language and uh calling me out in front of the
commission. But I just wanted to explain to commission and if you have any more
instructions for me, I'm going to follow them. But I am fully prepared to just
continue sending them the invoices and you know if I'm more than willing to
talk to Mr. Slaugh, but I don't know what more there is to talk about. Um, we
believe the debt well, we know the debt is owed and I just don't think any court
in Wisconsin would every court in Wisconsin would recognize our claim as
legitimate. So, there's plenty of hypotheticals you could put out there.
If we had overbuild them, would we be entitled to pay that back to them? You
know, um how do they treat their clients when there's billing errors? You know,
do they forgive that so quickly or so? >> The when I saw the email um
sent out to the commissioners, I was very disappointed. And I would also
remind commissioners that it's not advisable for any of us to meet
independently to have casual conversation in this sort of situation.
So for him to put that invitation out there was alarming to say the least.
» Yes, sir. >> Here. What? That's a monthly bill. What
is this one up here? >> That is a monthly invoice. Yes, monthly
bill. >> So, okay. It talked about several years
here. What is this then? So we have spread out their bill the balance being
16,000 some hundred and we've spread that out
in 60-month payments. >> So
» 60 payments >> yes
» would get them caught up. >> Yes.
» So what and what's their typical monthly bill to us?
» I don't have that number off the top of my head. It's more than that but
» Well, yeah. I'm I'm trying to put it in perspective.
» Yes. >> So they're paying maybe $30,000 a month.
Oh, no. >> Sir,
» no, not 40. Yes. Uh, less than that, but >> I don't have that number.
» Bill, monthly bills 15 to $20,000 a month, and they're griping about this a
rear, which is generously spread over five years.
» Yes, sir. >> Trying to get it.
» I 100% have your back, Randy. And I think we should just keep invoicing them
and take the the steps that we take with anybody else that doesn't pay their
bill. It's I mean, in my opinion, that's the most
equitable way to handle this situation. You know, we're not going to give
preferential treatment like you know, it is what it is. Like it's an
unfortunate situation, but it is what it is. You know,
» my question is what is my answer? >> I unfortunately work with two members of
the Fall River Village. I was approached by one of them about
this and I forwarded you the email that you already had received. Um, am I
supposed to no comment? My advice would be is to
direct them to direct their questions to the utility director, Andy Myum.
» I think he's asking how he's supposed to speak right now.
» No. >> No. Okay.
» Okay. I heard I was wondering if you needed to abstain or not.
» I'm not really worried about that, but I know
» I'm gonna get feedback at work.
they're welcome to contact me. >> Yeah. And I think, you know, I did share
the email with them that I I said that we should invite him to come and
meet with us in person. Obviously, if we extend that and he doesn't come, that's
on him. >> I mean, we don't even have to extend it.
We have a public comment section on every agenda,
» right? >> He could just come.
And we did address the interest on the amount that we're holding from them. And
we >> decided as a group that that's not part
of the repayment because that's interest that was owed to us.
» That's correct. >> How about if we all go over to a Fall
River board meeting and we each like >> give them five minutes of our mind under
public comments. How about how about we do that?
» Zeny. >> Um first of all, Randy, I I don't have
any problem at all with how you handled this. Um I I do think though that fall
we we need to be good neighbors as far as working with Fall River. So if they
want to come back with a counter other than what they've already suggested, you
know, as maybe it was extending it to I don't know whatever it might be.
If if meeting with them again preserves a relationship, maybe we don't change,
maybe we do. Um I think it would be worth a discussion if you think it would
be productive. >> Yeah, I absolutely want to get along
with them. Um there's no productive reason not to. Um they did actually they
have not offered any counter. They just said they don't want to pay it.
» Mhm. >> So but
I think my hands are tied now on I mean all I can do is maybe I can offer him
you know the 60 months and the no interest. Mhm.
» So, but >> which I'm comfortable with.
» Yeah. But I'm going to refrain from making
comments that I would like to make and wish that we had a close session to
discuss options at this point. Uh maybe next month. Uh we could consider that
based upon what activity might happen between now and then.
» Okay. I I think we need to be able to have a
comfortable conversation about what options are and doing it in public. I
think we've already had this conversation once and we haven't gained
an inch of ground. >> Um is that something that even can be
taken to close session?
» I can confer with city attorney. I I I'm confident that it's a negotiation and
negotiations can be in close session, but we'll make sure that we have
conversation and have the discussion um framed correctly.
» Is it a negotiation when they're just refusing and they're not asking for
something different? That's what I would want to know from from the attorney is
are we even negotiating?
» And I'll have that conversation with Paul.
What do you need from us tonight, Randy? >> Um,
well, I if there was a change in direction, that's what I needed to know.
If the commission sought that, I'd take another
another step here, another direction. But
» I think you're handling the situation the best you can based upon the
communications I've seen from you. >> All right. Thank you.
Well, then I'll move forward uh in the same direction. Then
» I would please ask that staff considers having, you know, this on next month's
agenda with a possible close session if that's feasible so we can discuss
further so we can get some updates on what's happened between now and then.
» Okay. >> Thank you.
Jason. >> Good night, Jason.
» Good night. >> Take care.
» All right, let's move on to something a little bit more fun.
» My favorite part, >> director's report outline.
So, we have been very busy in the latter part of July and uh August. I'll try and
zip through this quickly. Um the last part of it though is actually not
you'll see it is a little depressing. Uh one of our sister communities has gone
through a very devastating storm that we responded to. But uh in the water
department we've been doing plant water meter replacements and plant repairs. Um
in both uh plants, this is an influent effluent water meter that we've replaced
in both. Uh this went from disc meters to the new updated disc meters. Um this
leads to more accurate readings on our water production
and the crew was busy with this. Some other activities we've been doing
in water is um we are we have purchased and I brought this up at previous uh
commission meetings a new correlator. This helps us pinpoint a water main
break uh underground which can just save valuable amount of time and effort. Um
often times we end up trying to guess where the water is come where the break
is and so we'll do an exploratory trench and hope we're close. Sun Prairie had a
significant water break and they requested our uh help. Um so our crew
went out there with our correlator and um what ended up happening was uh they
were searching Sun Prairie for five hours. Our crew showed up and in about
58 seconds he says they pinpointed the leak. Um it was 22 feet away from where
they were digging. So where that measuring wheel is is where the actual
leak ended up being. >> Um but we are glad to help Sun Prairie.
They too are part of our co-op. Um, and this is just um an example though of uh
good investments we're making, I feel, and uh trying to save time with our
staff. Um, the water department also has been
cleaning out and exercising distribution valves on our main lines. Uh, here Craig
is doing just that. Um, this valve vault has some standing water in it and
debris. So, we suck that out, clean up the valves, grease them, make sure
everything's operational. Um and then finally they've been uh
cleaning aation stones at the water plants. This is just one of the many
filter systems we have for water production. Uh this allows for better
flow of air into the stone which helps in our iron removal process.
It's not such a pleasant picture there, but you see what we're cleaning out
there. Um unfortunately I I miss getting some
pictures of wastewater. I'm going to owe them a really big presentation one of
these days. Um, they sort of just been in the background doing their jobs, uh,
cleaning lines and doing maintenance. Um, but I will
pay them just dues and all the efforts they make in electric. Uh, we've been
doing a good deal of new construction. This is out at Cardinal Heights where
we're energizing some new homes um, and running the services up to the
meter sockets. Uh and here um the crew is doing some
exploratory pits to find where our what do you call that?
» Feeders. >> Our feeders are um this is an
anticipation of some new work we're going to be doing at this substation as
well. And the transmission company ATC is going to be doing a good deal of work
in this same substation. We'll be sharing it with them. So we needed to
find out just where our grounds are. And that's what was happening here.
» Yes. uh in public works. They've been very
busy the last four weeks. Uh we had a sinkhole form on Dick Street. Um
because there was a storm sewer lined right up there. Uh we had a pretty good
idea where it was and we were right. Uh there was a gap in that storm pipe. You
can see just the top of it there. And uh so material bedding road material was
going into the pipe and washing out. Once we identified it, we're able to
successfully plug it and back fill it. Um, this is not paved yet. We're going
to pave this very soon as we when we have little projects like this, it's
hard to get a contractor to come out individually. It's hard for our we don't
have all the equipment for patching something like that correctly. So, we
try to fold it into an existing project and that's what we're doing here. So,
this will get repaved soon. But the crew uh we back fill it with stone and it's
actually doing us a service right now by leaving it in stone and traffic going
over it. Just making sure that there's no gaps or no more uh settlement.
Uh the DPW crew also was still doing some corrections or remediation from the
last big storm we had. Um they were fixing and uprighting the scoreboard at
the football field. this had become twisted in the wind and so they were
able to straighten that up. They're also doing work at the community center. Um
we tore down some old cabinets and we're doing repainting. We're doing this right
now. Um and we're uh replaced a slide and got a jungle gym system up and
running again. It took a while to get the right parts. We got the slide a
while ago, but we didn't have the right brackets. Um we do have more mulch now.
It just arrived today. Uh we'll be completing this tomorrow.
And then we're really excited about this new attachment we got. You're going to
see this a lot now in the next four or five weeks. Uh knocking down the brush
and all the cicks and streams. Um we really did not have the right equipment
to do this other than doing it by hand, which we just didn't have the labor for.
So this was something we were waiting for all summer. It has arrived and
you're going to see a lot of this going on now. This will really mulches up the
weeds into little bits. Um, so it won't clog our drainage systems here. And
we're excited to use this. >> Can we get a video in the future?
» Sure. Absolutely. >> Might bump my back truck wanting to use
that up. >> Yeah. Okay.
» Fun. >> Uh, finally, DPW also did some community
projects. Uh, we were at the library and we read to a group of children and we
brought the goat and that was a big hit. Um, there are great a lot of kids were
there. We read three books about road construction and they all themed with
animals doing the construction. And >> that's great unless you're the group
following it. Yes. You didn't bring a goat or truck.
» Yeah, we had staff I had staff queued up in in different various pieces of
equipment and uh then I would radio them to come forward and there the piece of
equipment to show the kids what all we use to keep the city going.
So, and he was very happy. He got lots of treats to be there.
projects.
We have the School Street project. We are now completely done with utilities
um up to from Letington to Main Street. Um we're now working north of that from
Maine to what is it? Hamilton >> Hibbert.
» Hibert, sorry. Um however, the good news there is we started paving today. um in
my line of work, this is always a good time when um all the efforts are coming
to a conclusion and you can start paving.
And so you'll see here, this is just some sidewalk work that also got done.
Uh the pavers are on site. These trucks are delivering a hot mix asphalt
material around 300 degrees Fahrenheit. Um and then they place it in the hopper
of the the paver. I don't know how these people do this
job in the summer, but they do. Um, but this is today they're putting down what
we call binder. This is normally the aggregate or the as asphalt mix that has
larger stone in it and it's meant to be the base. And then tomorrow they're
going to be putting on two coats of surface. This is uh has finer aggregates
and more of the um petroleum based adhesive that you call asphalt. And the
primary purpose for that is to keep water from getting into the base. So
when that's doing its job, everything else should hold up fine.
But uh that's what's happening right now. This is the hot roller. Normally we
call it the hot roller because you get about 90% of your compaction with the
hot roller. And then the cold roller comes in when the temperature is down to
about 150 degrees or so to get out all the lines and creases you see there.
So, some other work we've had going on is uh
we did remediation on the pavilion roof. There was storm damage there that was
waiting to be fixed. The crew was out there. Um I will admit, I don't want to
look at Matt's face right now. It didn't go entirely well. There were some
hiccups. Um there was a conflict with a renting venue, but unfortunately for
Brooke, it didn't cancel the venue. Um but it is done now. It does look good.
Uh we're going to we're addressing some issues with the contractor. Um and we're
going to have an inspection performed on the roof to make sure everything was
well. >> Previous
it >> important to note this was all
» this was a claim as a result of storm damage from the April um not quite
tornado. So this was all done um as work under our insurance provider. Uh they
reshingled the roof and um repaired the chimney that had been damaged in the
storm.
» Didn't quite >> No, they did not. They No, they did not.
Uh this is the pickle ball courts going in. Um they're making great progress
here. This should be done in a few weeks.
» Check that. >> Okay.
I was told today the asphalt needs to cure cure period before um the color
surface coat and lines get put on. So, they want to make sure that the proper
cure time occurs on the asphalt. So, um you'll see fencing going up next week.
Uh I know they're going to do some work tomorrow on um finalizing restoration
and the ponds. Um but yeah, it's progressing and um getting exciting.
Okay. I actually just assumed that they were going to be done soon from that. Um
» wishful thinking. >> Yes. Well, the asphalt was in for in my
line of work. That's the end of the project.
» Now you got to pay the bills. Um last topic. So on the 27th of July, a sister
community of ours um experienced a devastating tornado.
Um, as I've explained to the commission and you all know very well, our system
exists only when we were able to rely on aid from our other communities. Uh, we
do not have the resources to respond to emergencies like a wei energies and
that. So, it's important when one of our other cities needs help that they get a
big response and they did here. Um, I got the call on the 27th
of just how bad it was and then the news article started coming up. Um on that
day the director in Juno um Nick Gman uh and I drove up there ahead of our crews
uh we were on the phone with the director of Waterlue as we are
assembling our crews. Dalton got busy contacting the other linemen um and they
all convened. It was um Columbus, Juno, um Lake Mills, and Wapon. And I believe
there was another one there that joined us all in uh Juno. And we headed up from
there. But Nick and I drove up ahead of them to just start uh assessing the
situation and giving them directions of where to go. When we got there, it was
I'm going to go through some photos. Uh it was I had never seen anything like
it. Um their engineers were having a hard time
cope hard time coping with how we do where do we even begin? A lot of roads
were just in inaccessible. Um trees houses completely obliterated and in the
roads. But um we got there and we start seeing finding scenes like this. Um,
but then as we're looking at all these, you know,
you know, truck, some trucks were sitting in a house. Uh, some homes were,
like I said, completely devastated. There was people walking just in shock
in their yard because they no longer had a place to live.
Um the first task we had to do was start
trying to get access to some of these down lines because this was very
dangerous. There were a lot of people just roaming. A lot of gawkers were
creating problems too. So we needed to get access to a lot of these lines and
kill them and open. Um
yeah, and it's just this next one just gives you a greater idea of and the
background there is what we call the island or they call the island and that
was hit even harder. Their water production facilities were leveled. They
had no way of producing fresh water at the time. Um they were able to back feed
into a neighbor's water system and deliver that into their circuit too. Um
but getting it to these houses was just impossible there. You know, we were
smelling um gas in the area. This was another big concern because we're
dealing with electricity and I was very nervous for Dalton and his crew. Dalton
got his harness back on and he was up in the bucket for days. But you can just
see some of these pictures here. Um one of our linemen, Jeff, uh he's been
he's responded to a lot of hurricanes in Florida, a lot of tornadoes. He said
this was the worst he'd ever seen it. Um,
» if you know the area, Dodie Island is one of the more affluent areas in the
greater Appleton area as well. That's not a
there's some really historic and old homes on that island.
» Dodie Island then is in the background there. This house in the front is
completely slid off as foundation. You can see
um >> but yes, I'm sorry. Imagine being in
that basement. >> Oh,
» is there any post post um support for the folks that respond to this as far as
PTSD or >> um I mean the Red Cross was on site then
and they provide services like that. Is that what you mean? Just
» Well, the people that are responding, not so much the home for us. Yes.
» Oh. Um
» what was the width of the tornado? Mile and a half. My only wide correct.
» Yeah. >> Oh my god.
» I don't know, Sandy. Um >> I would hope if if anybody needs it that
we can find a way to get them. >> Yeah.
» For them.
» That is a very good point. Um >> employee assistant programs would be
available. >> Okay.
» I'm actually a little embarrassed now. I hadn't thought about that. I just I'm so
used to grunting at these guys and you know um and getting the right response
» and that gets work for you sometimes. >> Yeah. That you're very right. They
witnessed a lot of a lot of this. I mean you see Dalton and Jake there. Um
and this is one of the first areas we tackled when we got on site and it was
just trying to get these power lines off the homes
that and then we were just trying to secure the area. We had people walking
in underneath the lines and I don't know and then you had some
others like I said uh that were just in shock. They wouldn't understand you when
you were talking to them because they just couldn't believe what had happened.
Um but day too
» yeah I started I always do I get a little
emotional about now you know these next pictures because it was awesome just
seeing the effort out there. Um, how many crews, Dalton, do you think showed
up? How many municipalities? >> There was 25 overall.
» Yes. >> Um,
yes. Three of our four went up there, the linemen, and then we sent the fourth
up. Um, you know, we replaced someone else just to give them some rest. Dton
went up on the weekends as well. Um, you know, they stayed in a hotel nearby
and, um, they just got to work. We started at the very base trying to get
some of the most dangerous poles off the homes, trying to get accessibility in
the roads. Another piece of equipment we sent up was our shop or our vac truck.
This is extremely useful at this time because, you know, we can't call
Digger's hotline now and wait 3 days for them to come out and identify. We need
to start working. So, it was imperative we and another municipality sent their
vac truck and our two operators uh in the sanitary department worked non-stop
for two days, two or three days. >> How
» Yeah. What does the back do? C >> can you expand on how like you can't
wait for digger's hotline? So, what you use the vac truck in case the vac truck
can't electrocute itself. Is that the point? So the vac truck can excavate
without rupturing existing utilities underground.
» Okay, perfect. >> Thanks.
» Yep. It helps us also, we call it potholeing where we're identifying if we
think I mean you get an idea here in the industry long enough there's typical
areas where you're running your sanitary, your sewer, your gas lines,
your communications if they're underground. Um so we then start
potholeing and looking for them. So, if we know what that's there, the gas
line's the one we're looking for the most, um, then we can safely dig in
another area nearby. But, it's just absolutely essential. So,
this big hero is Jeff. Uh, he's a mascot kind of now with us, but he's been in
the industry a long time and, um, he absolutely is passionate about
responding to these and he spent a good deal of time up there with Dalton, too.
And the rest of the pictures are just all the crews. You look at all those
bucket trucks. They just go all to the very end of the picture there. Probably
15 of them. And they're all working in conjunction with each other.
» Wow.
» And I know that you guys aren't looking for fanfare, but I think that getting
them on social media a little bit around the initial
when it happened so that people understand that our guys were there
helping out. I saw a lot of questions pop up and again I know the last thing
you guys want to stand on fair and the last thing you guys are doing is taking
pictures. You're doing these just to get the point across but I think that our
community needs to understand how much we help others when needed.
» I agree. Um we can still do that. I refrain from doing that right away
because this you know this is still raw and the for the people of Manasha.
So, and yeah, at the time, you know, I'm the
one taking a lot of these pictures, not this one or not the ones from the bucket
all the time, but all the way up to 41. >> Yeah.
» So, let's run through the rest of these. >> But I can say and these guys were
working well into the night every night for about three weeks.
» Three weeks. >> Yes, sir. Now, Manasha has they are
fully restored. Not all services are restored because there are no homes in
some of these places, but all the primary and secondary has been restored.
Um, I just think it's a great testament to our community, our electric co-op
community. So, that concludes my report. >> Thank you to your team for that
response. >> Well, they did most of the work. I I
worked the phone, >> so Yeah.
» So, >> before we do, uh, Sandy pointed out that
we may need to change our meeting date for next month.
» Yes, she's very correct. Um, there is a WPPI meeting that, um, three or four of
us now will be attending. I can send out an email to everyone for suggestions.
Um, maybe I'll have some target dates on there.
» Okay. >> A lot of times in the past, they've just
pushed to the fourth. >> Okay.
» I'll propose that. And if that's successful, we'll schedule that then.
» Sounds good. >> Okay.
» Thank you. >> Thank you, Commission.
» Jack made a motion to adjurnn. Is there a second?
» Second.
» Motion and a second to adjurnn. All in favor, please say I. I.
» Any opposed? We are 8:21.