Okay, it's 9:00 a.m. I'm going to call to order the uh August 11th study
sessions of the custom family districts and do a roll call for us.
» Thank you. Dr. Cheyenne Wright >> here,
» director Nicole Welshshire, Secretary Arthur Perry, Vice President Robert Uten
» here, >> President Michael Schaefer
» here. >> Thank you.
» U public comments. This is the time for
those of you in the audience who like uh items that are subject matter
jurisdiction and are not listed on the agenda. We have no one we have any
virtual public comments. >> No, sir.
» Okay. Items of study. Uh Scott, could I please add our committee record?
» Yes. Thank you, Mr. President. Marissa for writing the given report.
» Good morning, president and board. The district's agreement with CRNR includes
liquidated damages provisions. Um, and this is a penalty that may be assessed
for failure to meet certain administrative or operational standards.
The solid waste ad hoc committee met twice to review and discuss the
liquidity damages provisions. The proposed revisions are outlined in the
staff report and the attached redline exhibit provides details um of the
proposed changes. Overall, the revisions are intended to improve accountability,
clarify expectations, and better align the provisions with customer service
priorities. The committee generally supported the overall direction of the
revisions and did provide clarification on a few specific items. The committee
also emphasized that penalties should not be issued for circumstances outside
of CRR's control. Staff and CRR are continuing to finalize the performance
thresholds for roll out and valet service large item OHW and Christmas
tree collection. So you'll see on the red line there's a few um kind of lying
areas. Those numbers will be filled in once we finalize those.
Today staff is looking for more direction and feedback and direction. Um
following that direction, the final revisions will be incorporated into the
bond exhibit. Um, it will be reviewed by district council and then it will come
back to the board for consideration and approval. This concludes my presentation
and I'm available to provide more detail if the board has any questions.
» Yes.
» I thought we had good discussion on it. Yeah, I kind of incorporated some of the
discussion points that we have with the committee into the in the staff report.
some things that the committee asked us to kind of clarify um or make sure that
we were addressing certain things in a way that was fair to both our customers
and DC on our >> the uh one of the things that I've
always been concerned about is the collection reliability and I think
they've done some really good things about getting the large item um
take large item is the one I hear about most from my neighbors and I think CR is
going to really good job of narrowing that down. It's funny. All these shares
are big on this board and with the large item. I' I've used it. My neighbors have
used it. Um trucks come around usually earlier than
the than the regular pickup. But when the trucks come around, there's rarely
anything left, you know, from from the resin. I'm sure you guys.
But overall, I think we have a pretty good
meeting with with with that. I guess we I'd like to hear from Julie
on what she has to say. This is the time for your vote.
» Well, me I g to you.
» I have questions too if after it's totally fine. Do you want to
say >> us up here first? Okay. I guess I
shouldn't have further my senior colleague.
» I I think what he means is the older old older more mature person.
» No. No doubt. No doubt. >> Um I thought the meeting was good. you
know, I had from the meeting I learned um how the
process came about for so-called liquidated damages, which as a matter of
fact, we changed the name of that in the discussion.
» We we did discuss change it. We haven't officially yet. We just want to check
with legal counsel just to make sure there's no implications with changing it
from liquidated damages to something else. But that that is one of the
discussion points. And then then there were a number of items and I think staff
highlighted most of them in in the staff report that
since since the um since that policy was developed for
performance objectives or duplicated damages or whatever you want to call it.
Um it came from various places and there
were probably six or seven items that needed clarification. A lot of them
around President Schaffer said um you know delivery of services. Um there were
also some emphasis on needing um more more um
um there were many many items in that so-called performance process and
um I think we only hit on probably seven or eight items that needed to be
clarified or changed. Um, it was informative informative to me be on that
committee. Um, I appreciate staff and CR's input. Um,
that's all.
» Um, okay. So, I just have a couple questions or like feedback on this, but
in general, I'm glad we have this sort of clause in our contract. So um I see
that we're adding some performance categories for collection reliability.
How do we measure just standard um pickups?
So just like a missed part, somebody gets missed and then uh they get a call
they still complain to us that it didn't get picked up on time and that's how
we're drafting. >> So right now for just like a standard
miss service just missing your card. Um CR&R needs a list of anything that's
reported to them as a missed and so we're looking at that in combination
with things that are reported directly to us. A lot of times there is overlap.
So we'll account for anything that's in our records if it's already in CR and
our system account for that. But it's through our our logs of what's been
reported to us or NCR magic. >> Is there a time frame to uh correct that
mistake before that fee is incurred or it's just immediately upon
» for this particular one? If it's a miss then it's big ones. Yeah.
» Okay. Well, I'm glad we're going to be tracking all the other ones. um
especially since tree collections um quality
uh clarifying that debris spills and requirements must be completed on the
same day. That's great. I definitely support including that
um responsiveness to our residents.
Yes. Timeliness of submission. Yes. Accuracy of billing. So, can we talk
about the uh additional card cost billing error and like can you play
out for me how that would not only be affected in you know rebating our
customers directly but then how does how does that manifest in liquidated
damages? >> Sure. For something like this so if it's
a billing error um if they were bill it's not in accordance with our you know
our actual prices then it would be 250 accounts. So in this case, I think there
was 12 or,400 um accounts that were misfilled. So
there would be an assessment of $250 for each of those.
» So just a onetime fee, >> no matter when we discovered how long
ago that bill was. Okay. >> Um
yeah, I mean I think with any contract it makes sense to have some sort of uh
incentive for not making six, you know, especially because we are so
contractually and long-term bound with this relationship. So,
um, increasing delayed responses
to us, not to our customers. So, just like
to respond to CNS with that one business.
Uh can you uh educate me on what is the outdated role significant deployment
provisions for so a cleanup?
» Yeah, I'm just looking at the move out do roll out specific deployment
permissions. Is that just a uh >> so for that would you like? So, it was a
it was basically saying that they needed to have trucks in place necessary for
the three-part system, but because we've already passed that point, three-part
system, three-part program has been rolled out, all the trucks were provided
at that point. It's just not something that we would assess any further because
it was specific to that date. Great.
Is there anything proactive? I know we were talking uh a while ago about
ensuring you know CRNR helps us ensure that customers have all three of their
cards or can can even be our eyes on the ground if one is missing or damaged. Um
I wouldn't how how like accountable are they to that? Because I I worry that
people are falling through the cracks uh of just they're not proactively
reaching out but they maybe are missing a car but they have a damaged car etc. I
don't know that I would assume CR if they're out doing route audits and they
know that a cart is um significantly damaged and they never very soon they
would put in a replacement request for that and that is one of the provisions
here is to sort of replace damaged carts within a tiny tiny dam
» and our code force can also report that as well if if he or she sees a damaged
card that person can report it as well. >> Okay.
or a neighbor
» neighbor might report my neighbors not paying attention to their
» Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm just speaking from personal experience that I didn't
even It's just one of those like things that get set on the back burner, you
know. Um I just had to try it which like I'll survive and then they took care of
it. You guys were in the meeting. Uh, but it just made me realize like, oh, I
think normal people maybe don't realize how awesome we are. Not awesome CRM,
right? That they'll get it done really quick and it's not a big deal. Um,
but uh, okay. And then obviously I'm excited about public education and
outreach and I'll kind of just allow that to be part of the later
conversation in our ad hoc committee. Um,
and
In general, I mean, this looks good to me. I I'm a little bit curious about the
history. I see we only have 2023, 2024. Do we have a 2025
um estimate? >> We're in that window right now. Okay.
» And that's common that like about one year later, we're evaluating for last.
» We actually adjusted the um revision period. So this current period runs
through the end of June of 2026. So it's going to be a year and a half instead of
a year to get us on the fiscal year schedule. So this year we'll have um an
additional six months which takes additional time to
» Awesome. Um I guess my only other question would be like how these
terms compare to other cities, other clients. uh if there's anything you know
are we below market on or do they do any type of CPI adjustment to educate these
as time goes on etc. Yeah. for you. Can I have a question?
» Sure. >> How did we come up with 250
for this bill? Who came up with that figure?
» 250 for >> number D.
See, it's pretty excessive
» for uh Oh, for accuracy of billing. >> Yes.
» 250 per account. That was the amount that
were initially put into the contract. I believe this was modeled after city of
Newport Beach. So I would imagine that that amount came from from that model
when they were put into the contract. >> Are there any other students that have
passed like this? >> Um I have no I'm not sure on other
agencies that have eliminated in their homes.
» Good morning President. Um, just to start off, this is very common that we
have limited damages or performance standard metrics in almost all of our
contracts and it's something we support. Um, we're doing our job correctly and
we're picking everybody up and we should be, I have no problem with having any
type of performance measures and penalties that go along with it. I think
it's the right thing. Um, I'll start the last one. So yes, this um and for um
Cheyenne so it's very common as we mentioned the equipment damages in many
contracts. Some of the penalties vary Newport was probably one of the highest
one that was the most newest templated in 2021 where you made that contract and
then we carried those over um into CMS. I will tell you, yeah, when you hear
that number 250 and we had that villain error and on the extra cards, um it's
usually intended to maybe be oneoffs here and there. So, yeah, that was going
to be really big for a a change that the first processes are uh increases missed.
Um I presented originally two options, the board of the one she didn't see the
changed file and what was the original one that I submitted to staff. Then we
came back and said she didn't see it. So, um, all the credits already issued
their post on the accounts. We did that. Um, the district has to file and show
every customer impacted and credit that they receive. Um, it just the
inconvenience that they're getting that bill and the phone calls that generated.
So, yeah, it is meant to be like oneoffs here and there. I don't think I thought
about it to be quite honest that $250 and what that implication is. This one's
going to be worth it's a crazy one. Um, with that being said, we we agreed to it
and um put it in his spot to accept it. Um, I did want to talk a little bit
because I wasn't sure um for director Wright your question if I felt like it's
too hard and it was something that I've been noticing and I just had a meeting
actually I'm writing my notes on my same page. I just had a meeting with the city
of Costa Mesa last Friday. This is for our non-exclusive commercial franchise.
So they brought all the haulers in. We were talking about um SP 1383. Does
every customer have their three container system? Whether they use cards
or they use bins and it made you think about here and
for director Wilchshire at her facility and it was the same night that our day
we talked about you not have your prop lid. She didn't have organic problem.
Um, so the question is, um, I don't think we put together a method or a
requirement. Just does a strong letter go out that says you are required if
it's something that's build by CNSD. And I think that's maybe my question that I
had is do I bring a couple accounts because I'm noticing that folks aren't
using their own using an organic center. Maybe they have one and keeping it
behind, but I was going to have you check, are you billing this? Are they
being build by us? I was going to check the lapes, but I know that when we
rolled out Newport Beach for two years, we had 70 residential customers that
just we deliver their part and they go illegally dump it in the park because we
were able to trace the serial numbers and we had an issue and then the city
got involved and they were sending letters directed to these residents
saying, "We are required by law. You have to have your container. This is
what you should put in it." and we finally got it. Takes two years to get
out of but I don't know that we have a process internally for our residential
customers or the multifamily duplexes that are using
wanting to be built and we had a lot of you switch as costs are going up. A lot
of some of the duplexes are saying hey I I'd rather use carts and they want to be
build through the district. I don't know that we have a process in place is that
requires them to have those services and what that would be.
since it's kind of brought up because I think I felt like your question was
twofold. That was the note I wrote because that just came to my mind last
week. So maybe that's something we had for a future agenda with staff. Um I can
get new reports and what they did with those strike ones. But I think couple
things we have when we're doing the route reviews the state the lift flips
when our team goes out there if they notice there's not three containers out
then we come back we looked on their car. Does it look like we delivered it?
They had it at one time. have to call for anything or we ask the driver. We
get full video to see do they ever put out a part. Maybe that one day they just
didn't put it out. But I think then we determine what's the what's the process
or what's what's the board's desire to require them to have the service because
they're paying for it, right? It's a bundled service. They're paying for it.
They're just not using it. >> Do your drivers
pay attention or do they have like a a sense of their their routes? Which ones
are not using the cart heat? >> I think it's twofold. They do. I mean,
we could probably ask them, hey, could you identify the customers on their
route? Our green waste or organics cards. Our percentage is very heavy. So,
you know, we have a lot of people that use their organics cards. Even if
they're not using it for food, they're definitely using it for their their
greenery, you know, for still their yard trimmings and stuff like that. But, um,
and then the recycling, that's the other part is I would like to
do maybe participation. When we have drivers that maybe go on um life duty,
let's say they get injured or something and they can't drive the truck, but they
can be a rider in the truck, that's when we usually use them to do audits for us.
Um that might be something that I do is to have them look at see my other
concern is um I'm not sure if you're all aware with recycle from home um or us
having OC opening back up. My concern was we implemented the three-part
system, right? When the recycled buyback center opened up again. And I hear from
a lot of people if they don't recycle, they say, "Oh, why I don't use my blue
card anymore because I take my stuff to the buyback center or they have recycled
from home." Well, that's only CRV rebate material. There's so much other stuff
that people should be recycling. And I've heard that from people. Oh, well, I
just go to OC, so I take my cardboard and my logs and cans. What about all the
other stuff that you should be putting in there? So, I'd be interested to see
how many people are not possibly participating in the recycling program,
but we're seeing this in other cities. And I actually just had the city of
Tustin reach out to me and say, you know what? How do you feel about this
program? They said, I feel like it it hurts recycling because of what I just
mentioned.
Well, and also I don't think they know that we pay $17 a ton for blue cart and
we pay 80 plus dollars for landfill organics.
So, you know, and there's a huge savings using the
blueprint um which indirectly relates to what we
have Detroit. >> It does. All those materials when we
process and we sell them for, you know, beneficial use and recycle material that
helps offset our cost and keeps our cost down.
» You're you're seeing folks not putting it in the blue cart, they're
putting it in the landfill card because they don't want
» because I don't need to use it. >> They're not going to haul out a third
cart, right? um when when we do the source separations,
have we seen that? This might see that there's a lot more in the landfill carts
when when they do thatation with I'm curious if we're seeing more recycles
add up, but then Mike wouldn't know. They'd have to go back to that, excuse
me, have to go back to that audit I mentioned kind of seeing what's our set
out participation rate on recycle cart and see if the two correlate,
» right? >> Because he wouldn't know that. So you
would you wouldn't actually know if that was tied to what I was just
» excuse my ignorance, but does Orange Coast pay for cardboard?
» Yeah, they do. >> They do?
» Yeah. >> I think Well, no. I don't think they
What do you do with your cardboard? I take my cardboard when I have excessive
cardboard because I have only a 35 pound car
» and you know, I still cut my cut the cardboard up that little blue card.
old machine. So, >> in good times, cardboard. So, there's
not many things. Plastics, there was very little cost per ton. It's a wash,
but it's not a it's not a disposal cost. But still, um, aside from the CRV
materials, paper,
mixed paper, um, and cardboard still can go for sell for about $200 a ton. That's
when times are good. So that's why these facilities will still also accept
cardboard because there's some money to the the person that takes it and sells
it after they pay it in large quantities. Obviously you're not getting
a whole lot for it but you're going to get
trial and you didn't get much they didn't tell
you. No, they just have one. It's a great program for them because in in
Huntington Beach they have three guys working the cart system, you know, that
put the cans in each separate bucket. You take it in, you got three guys
sorting and they're going through pulling out stuff. It shouldn't be in
there. But OCC, you only have one guy that takes the weight and that's it. He
just looks in. So, they're probably saving money by having one guy work.
It's three or four. Sure. >> Yeah. We have at our facility um in
Stanton CRT, we have a buyback center and I mean the amount of trucks coming
in I think they collect a lot of hard work from businesses or others while
they borrowing out their containers and they
bring it in and so no it roughly about $200. So they've been weighing paid down
accordingly based off material. >> Well, I I walk a lot in the morning and
I see pickup trucks going to various facilities to pick up the car.
» Um so our latest audit report was going to be effective. was saying that was
successfully recycling almost our goal and that number has been moving
positively which was great and I think that makes sense because I do think like
what we're all talking about takes up a lot of space so it's kind of it's nice
to have that separation um and then where we're struggling is organic waste
um so food and green waste and having them actually sort I think at the moment
that they are throwing their trash in their home is like the biggest behavior
change we're going to have to work on. Uh, and that's where we're I think we're
declining at that point. So, I think for me, I'm always trying to think about
like the regular person like the normal busy renter, busy income or whatever, a
homeowner who likely isn't doesn't have the time to drive stuff to OC. But I
think it's like it's almost like you have really good like radicals that are
really on on top of it and they're really, you know, intelligent about it
and then you just have normal busy people that like we're still just trying
to cut through the noise um without before we have to resort to
like punitive measures, you know. So, uh but I think I don't know if you've been
reading and I I see it on social media. I've read a few um in the paper. I know
Huntington Beach just went to penalties. What's going to happen is the states
have required us to do it. They're not merely the city and on they have the
jurisdiction or the district. So I saw some friends that I go to high school
and used to live in Huntington Beach, moved to Texas and she sort of follows
her local stuff and she's like good old California and that's where I read the
article but she was still in Huntington Beach starting charging for people
putting it on thing's been doing it for quite a while. I just saw another post
the other day that they said you kidding me I had one box I had no more room on
my recycle cart and they put it in the trash cart and they they don't they
don't do uh physical route reviews like we do. We have the human that's still
going lifting lids and then that way hopefully they can talk to the resident
if if they come out and say hey what are you doing? Oh we're required to do this
by for the state we just want to make sure we help you you know have properly
properly sourced separate but waste management uses cameras in the hopper
the truck. So once the material goes in um that's the whole process it's very
extensive and then it goes to India and India has to start drawing pictures and
they charge you back to the account but she posted it yesterday on her page that
um you saw this one big box that was not broken down but just the solid box that
she put in her trash can and she she posted her picture and her invoice and
they charged her $35 for putting that box in her trash can. the state the
legislation says that the cities need to be doing this but they have push been
pushing the jurisdictions or the districts yet but it is not
» I got a question we talked about we used to get percentage of Steve for recycling
did did you talk to them we're going to get still
» we don't have any interaction with them at all and now that they sold they're
being brought by the company I mentioned that I'm just thinking about it that
besides from home I I have no idea that that recycle our mom's running the
facility. >> Are they required to know what's like if
I go in they required to know which city we're coming from?
» Yes. Anywhere you go they they're supposed to ask where where is your
material coming from so that the city gets the actual at least diversion
credit for that material. that we get that first credit back from LCC because
they're much busier now than they ever >> I don't think it necessarily works in
that way where they can give us the credit. They're reporting their data to
cal and then I assume cycle is putting that into their punish numbers but it's
not something that we would actually take.
» We used to get OC. We used to get it. Why couldn't we get
it again? It might carry again. >> Well, I think it's a private company now
that's running it. it would work the same way.
» Who would get the credit for that? >> The city overall.
» Yeah, I think so. Just the city as a whole
» and the district as far as I understand even though you operate the residential
program still everything rolls up under the city. If you don't hold the belt
separate, they directly become >> like
» um >> but then the whole the whole city with
residential commercial is meeting the state target.
» We sort of got off track, see if we could reel this back towards
the the topic. Um anything else from you guys? I mean,
» no, just looking to see if the board has anything they want us to change, look
at. If not, we'll take um what we have here. We're still working with CR on
kind of finalizing the two things and then we would run that through their
legal council, our legal council and then bring that back to the board as a
track. >> We asked
have we reduced any of the liquidated damages? I think we did.
» I think we did. Um, >> are you asking on the red line if
anything was reduced or >> anything that they anything that's been
reduced this last year under the public outreach fund? We went from $100 a day
to $100 in in >> right.
» Yeah. On that particular one, there wasn't really a way to you couldn't
really look at it as how many days behind it's either if you did it or if
you didn't. And so I just made that adjustment.
» Okay. So, that's one. I I I kind of agree with that directive area. The 250
seems ownorous to me, but um it's not my business. I mean, you guys have done
your due diligence on it, agreed to it. So, let me ask you one more question.
What's the lowest of the liquidated damages in that case?
You have some >> most of them around 100. That's
100. I don't care about I would like to see you guys
» and I can supply that information with the different cities and tables to staff
» that would be too busy. So I my opinion on it is I would be
comfortable reducing and lowering it for future instances but what I don't like
is that we committed to a number in the contract then when contract
» no I think we have retro and I supported retro
» okay cool but I would come about
» so anything we're reviewing currently for a year and a half will be based on
the living as they stand in the contract.
» I don't know if we're position to do that. I think we're I think it's just a
recommendation >> you can make all of this.
» Well, I think the second part of this performance requirements toended
is that we not
uh pick her with them over they have cola so their cola comes irrespective of
the problems. >> Yeah.
» Yeah. Absolutely. >> Yeah. I'm kind of I'm kind of struggling
with that too of like we we are always giving increases like we just did with
our increases with the county and we're doing CPI increases
pretty much on an automated schedule. However, liquidate damages does not
receive the same treatment. >> It it will. So, previously it was done
on a calendar year basis and it was very hard to take half of the year at the
current rate and then the other half of the year at the CPI adjusted rate, but
because we're transitioning to this fiscal year schedule for the next fiscal
year, we'll be able to actually make that CPI adjustment and then
I like that. And those fees, you get adjusted by CPI.
» Perfect. Are they capped? >> No.
» Okay. Um I think for me just speaking out loud with you guys, I'm kind of torn
of like what is our responsibility here? Is it to the customers
and recollecting those like literally the liquid value of
a damage to a customer, right? Like our staff was yelled at over a $5 net
spilling. I think that's kind of a dramatic reaction, but I'm glad that we
have something out there for that. So, I'm kind of torn of like our
responsibility is to be good partners and they are the boots on the ground in
so many ways, right? So, we want to be fair, but also
in a way I view this as like this protective measure to rebuild that trust
with customers when something went arry. And I don't know where that
is. You know, >> that word would go in the right
direction. Yeah. So, you know,
» I have a question. Um maybe because um I'm still this but these liquidated
damages like the per like for instance per home, they feel really arbitrary to
me because I don't know I don't know what like an annual number of instances
is. So, for example, >> um
» see one that you might be kind of like, okay, so for each filler to clean up
solid waste, recycling material for the waste or be any waste. Um, it's $150 for
each half of five. So, but like how many how many because $150
that's not if these are liquidated damages and in a way it's kind of meant
to be punitive because we want them to a certain standard. What's $150? Is it
$150 times 2,000 occurrences or is it five?
» I think that data was presented as a solid
Marissa I think Marissa Marissa presented those kinds of
numbers. So I think you could bring that.
» So as far as like the items under section
» it's not it's it's not a specific section. But the whole thing has her
classes, >> right? So, but just for an example, the
items under section A that we're looking at, that's what we're working with CRM
to develop like what should the standard be? Because you're right, we don't want
to just choose arbitrary numbers. And so, we're evaluating those saying what
is the average, what are other agencies doing, what could we actually hold them
accountable for? And so if you want us to look at the number reference for the
other items, we can certainly work with CRM and evaluate do we have the right
metric here or do we need to make it a fast
» and what information would we be getting from CR to really? They'd be looking at
kind of like what do you like, for example, how many spills are we seeing
per month or per year? um and kind of what is a standard there's certain
standards for a certain percentage you know is considered acceptable for
example and so >> you get outside data on standards and so
yeah me numbers it's just that's one of the
factors that we're considering >> sure I'd like to get that from CNR and
from some sort of wider industry standard so we're not
all I would ask that is is that so every phone call that comes in I'll tell you
the numbers are always higher than you the district task. So every phone call
that comes in, customer service rep is required to enter an order of the system
and everything's coded. So we have a spill, we have a spill code. If it's a
mis pickup, it's called MIPU. So everything is coded and they're
required. Then that's tracked for training in coaching. So every phone
call requires some sort of a a note on the customer's account. So whether it's
a mis pickup, they report a spill, um it could be a driver complaint that they
maybe thought the driver was driving too fast, everything is coded system and we
extract report and data and then we submit that data to the um to the
district on monthly basis. So that is stuff that comes directly from the
customer and like I said all say it's always higher because majority of the
customer that service they call us directly some go through the go side but
most of those call us directly and that can never be erased or
» I'm sorry I'm not understanding what you mean. Are you saying that there needs to
be a reconciliation between Urbana and Africa?
» No, not at all. You have to use both because some people um the districts
just haven't our other cities don't. No one calls the city. They all call us
directly for everything. But for the district, they have this gov system for
a while. So some customers use the the district gov system. They can call or
they can go online and say you have a mispickup or they can request a card
exchange or they can go through the districts the website or people can come
to us and we do live chat no AI live chat um email form customer service
phone call so we the district and mentioned she has to both a lot of their
duplication because sometimes they'll call the district and they'll call us
thinking well maybe I should call their voice
» I'm not quite understanding are you saying that they're are you saying that
the numbers are going to look deflated because there's duplicates. I'm
» no we so we get a count for example just looking at miss pickups we get a count
from CR& their miss pickup count includes anything that's been reported
through goa so we can eliminate eliminate those duplicates but if we get
a complaint that we're not putting through goup if it's like um an
escalated complaint we're just reaching out directly to for example the
operations manager and it's not putting a buildup we have to make sure we're
adding those to their account but we are eliminating any duplicates so don't
expect the numbers They should be reconciled and you said
» they're reconciled on our end. CRN just provides their data and then we look at
their data in combination with how you're tracking like escalated
complaints and things like that. >> So you're saying that at the end of the
day uh the district has correct numbers on all of these incidents,
» right? Pretty well pretty
committee. that final message. I think once we have the opinion back with Allen
and we where CR to get that final iteration
maybe we could have a meeting just to finalize it I don't
» Scott >> I'd love to keep this conversation going
» yeah understand more about that the greater confidence I agree I I I
out of this study, a couple things that hit me that I I want more information.
The valet service, do we I I'd like to see the number that
» we actually just got them. We have only one customer signed up for valet service
currently and I think 34 or 35 signed up for the roll out which is the no fee
service. >> Okay. So maybe I'm thinking the roll out
that's the one really designed for >> for seniors right that's the one that we
are recently promoted in our new email last but we haven't seen any any
» okay valet we charge >> valet is $40 per month
» okay >> what's the difference between valet and
roll out >> valet is a paid service so if you don't
qualify for the no fee you can pay $40 and then the roll out is if you can
provide a doctor's note that you can have that service for free.
» You have 30 calls for that. >> We have 35 currently signed up for it,
but we haven't had any new um signups since we sent out.
» That's interesting. >> Yeah, I was surprised you.
» So, I could use my driver's license. It shows how old I am and qualified for
rule. >> You need a doctor.
» All right. Good discussion. Thanks. Thanks for your input.
um solid waste fund reserves. >> So I'll take that one again. So as of
July 31st, the solid waste fund has a balance of approximately 5.8 million. Of
that 2.9 million is unreserve unrestricted and available for board
allocation. So that 2.9 million represents reserves above our 30%
operating reserve target. Um so staff has identified four general areas where
the board could consider um to choose to direct some or all of those reserves. So
number one, customer education, which includes things like expanded outreach,
school assemblies and composting workshops. Um number two, contamination
monitoring and compliance. Number three, service enhancements, which includes
things like lockable carts and compostable bags. um or number four,
solid rate stabilization, which would minimize future rate increases. So, the
board could choose to prioritize one category, a combination of categories.
Um if you don't like any of the categories, you can come back with more.
Um you're welcome to um suggest additional priorities. So, today staff
is seeking the board's reactions on the priorities overall and then any specific
programs you'd like us to move forward with. So to assist with that discussion,
there are some questions that we're asking. Um, which of these four
categories should receive highest priority? Should available reserves be
allocated to any of the specific programs in the staff report?
Approximately how much of reserves should be retained for future rate
stabilization or other um solids? And are there any other priorities or
initiatives that you'd like us to explore? Um so following your direction
today we will evaluate costs and implementation approaches for agent
items and then we'll come back for additional recommendation and
consideration. So
» that would be the great advice part of that money would be great advice.
This is this is for solid waste. Oh solid waste.
Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. Um I'm gonna hit on this. Um,
I wish we' had this before we did the rate the 218. I wish we had these
numbers. May maybe I missed. >> So, this is being presented during the
rate study um based on the rates that were presented, the options that were
presented. There was going to be a kind of abundance of reserve funds. And so,
part of that discussion was that we would come back once the rate was set um
and get kind of an action plan from the board on how we want to send out.
» Yeah. And and I'm not loving any criticism or any judgment here. Um I I I
firmly believe that if we have this kind of money and based on landfill increases
and all that, I would like short of this to go to rate stabilization. That's my
opinion. I'm only 105. But um the other component and looking through this
talking about school assemblies and and I've always I've always championed I
think the fact that I think kids are where we get the biggest bang for our
buck for the future. So I'm I'm a big proponent that we use funds school
assemblies outreach at that level as well as with with older people. Um those
would be my two biggest priorities would be as much as we can towards rate
getting rates stabilized or I'm not calling for a reduction u I don't I
don't think we can but I think we need to use make sure we don't have any big
increases >> so clarification majority I I think we
need more clarification majority you say 70% 55% what is majority to you
» majority 30 is anything over 16%. >> Okay.
» So I would say 16% >> towards rate stabilization would be my
uh the question about school. Is there a cost for that? Do we put those on
somebody else? >> No. So we would go through a contractor.
I did include some information for one of the options um that we'd like to
explore. That's something the board wishes for us to do the eagle hero show.
So there is some kind of per assembly per presentation additional cost
included but it would really be at your discretion and you would say we want to
spend x amount of dollars. We would give that amount to the contractor and then
they would perform assemblies up to that point. So it's really you have the
flexibility to decide how much you want to spend on something like that. Wait,
» do we have a good relationship with the the school district for having
incentives because that's the biggest pay challenge just to make sure we're
getting a hold of the right people. But the good thing about these programs
similar to um discovery cube is we give them the list. We do kind of some
initial outreach to let them know that it's coming and then that contract
really takes the lead on reaching out to the schools and getting everything
scheduled. >> We still are we still working with them
or is that >> that contract has concluded? So we uh
are looking at maybe exploring an alternative option and then if if you
elect to do that we can explore an alternative option and then maybe
compare the two and see that program that they present
» which one ecohero or discovery >> yeah on an online basis they would
provide us with u data on the presentations performed and the um
feedback that they were getting from the classrooms.
» Do you know how many people or how many schools they represent? I want to say
that it was like a little over 3,000 students that were um
» Did she say like >> impacted? But I need to go back and
look. >> Did you say like 30 schools or
something? >> I honestly
34 schools that were like schools. It might
have been 34 classrooms, but it might have been like multiple done schools.
» Yeah. >> Yeah.
Inherently the problem would be this discovery cube is they do have a
relationship with the guys that drive the green and yellow trucks and I don't
know if that conflicts with any
they're promoting general education organics and recycling specific
» no and we actually did ask them to include our carts so our carts were
actually part of the presentation. >> Okay. So, so that wasn't an issue as far
as
» my question is what do we spend now on um
the 2.9 million broken down cube reach code
what do we budget now for >> so a lot of these items are not anything
that we budgeted like the school assembly that was a 110 grant funded
program. I think we've allocated about 30,000
um composting workshops, walkable carts, um providing compostable bags for
customers in excess of what we're doing now. Those are things that haven't been
budgeted before. So those would be kind of new programs that we
» So we budget. >> So that's what we're asking. How much do
you want us to allocate to? What are your priorities and how much do you want
us to allocate to those priorities? You don't allocate anything more of what
we're granted the grant funds >> for school assemblies. We only did that
one time grant funding program. So we don't have school assemblies currently
in our budget. >> So we we we get grant funding 150,000 or
whatever it is. of the 2.9 million um
has does our budget contain any of that 2.9 million in wage to be expended or is
it? >> So these are unrestricted funds. So
they're to my understanding they're not being allocated towards anything.
They're unrestricted. The rest of that 5.8 is allocated towards expenses but
this 2.9 is not is unrestricted. Well, I think director right brought
this to our attention um needing more potentially more in customer education
and I think I think staff is doing quite a lot. I see many more things on the
Facebook page or Instagram page or lots of
all over the place. Um, and I'd be interested in
Well, I think I have to go back. The citizen survey gave us a lot of
information about um what what the citizens preferences were and is is that
what staff is now using to, you know, dedicate
um the grant funds or other funds? Um, I don't know that that's being used
to dedicate the budget. I think that's probably informing our education and
outreach. So, we're looking at that and incorporating that into our plans. Um,
but our budget is currently set. The grant term is ending in a few months and
that has will be fully expended. So, we're just looking at things we want to
do kind of above and beyond what is currently budgeted if you want us to
allocate any of these funds towards programs that are not currently
budgeted. So, so the grant fund is like 150,000 or depending on the year.
» So, that that is to my knowledge that is the last SB 1383 grant. Um, I haven't
heard of any plans for any new grants. So, right now once that's suspended, I'm
not anticipating any additional. >> So, so the 150,000 or whatever it is is
not going to be available to us in the future.
» Okay. So that's the starting point. Out of the 2.9 million, we're looking at if
we duplicate those programs, 150,000
» if that's your guess. It's totally up to you how you want to allocate. And and
for example, we spent 30,000 on the school assembly program with grant
funds. You don't have to allocate that specific amount. It could be more, it
could be less. It's just whatever your priorities are. Oh, what
what I'm thinking um we're getting substantially more
um citizen awareness, you know, by by using
$150,000 PL or whatever it is. Um
I I I think that this should be a topic that's discussed in the uh the new ADOC
committee because I believe
and Georgia right have substantially more
ideas about uh how we can uh approach the community to systematically get our
goals achieved. And so I think we need to go back and decide
um and maybe the committee can decide this how
what our goals are. Is it is it the uh landfill part recyclables in that? Is it
the organics in the recycle part? That's 1383 question. So, and and the organics
cart is not and the recycle cart is not um
I think that should be at the top of the list. Um I mean what's regulated and
regulations require us to work on but if we have a 75% total uh for the landfill
part I I think the money should be a lot of money should be spent in figuring out
how to get those contamination
materials out of that cart. And it doesn't sound like it's going to be a
lot. Um we're just starting out of the shoot. There's no way there's no way in
hell we could spend $2.9 million. Um so I think it'll substantially go to rate
stabilization because it's going to take a year to ramp up. Um
the spending the spending plan um I mean it's not overnight you think
we're going to spend $100,000 on figuring out how to get the uh
contamination out of the land cart. It's going to take
years to figure out and implement the processes that we want them citizens to
do. So, we've got a lot of money left over
for RA stabilization. >> So, we went from substantial staff,
» but it sounds like you're asking us to dedicate at least some of the funds
towards outreach and education. Well, obviously I'll vote in the half. Not
sure how, but >> So, let me I'm trying to help cover. So,
I'm looking at our budget 2627 budget. We budget $105,000 in community outreach
in the solid waste fund for this year. Doesn't $105,000. Okay. And from what I
understand, from what I got from the board, you want us to go over that based
on this unrestricted fund of $2.9 million. You want to spend that much
over $100,000. What that how much more over? We don't know. We're seeking
clarification. Now, what I'm hearing from the board is that you want to go
make probably 6040 60% of that $2.9 million we pay for race stabilization.
That 40% we'd come back with you with some numbers of how much that would be
for outreach efforts. And as as Marissa identified in the staff board, that
could be lockable containers, that could be the um um home composting program,
that could be additional um um bags for for um uh residents, that could be um
more advertising, whatever it is, we can bring that number back to you. But
that's where we're trying to get some clarification from the board.
» Yeah. And and I'm looking to you guys tell me 60%'s
just my shot in the dark. That's not I'm not locked to that number. If it's 50 or
40, I mean, whatever we can realistically use,
» I'll tell you right now, lockable carts doesn't make sense to me.
» It doesn't work. Giving people compostable bags, I'm not I won't I'm
not favor of that. they can go to bonds for stater brothers to get them
and said I don't think we should be giving out recyclable bags. Um some of
the others I'm still mulling but those are two that just I mean $245
for a walkable cart that >> nonsense in the survey said people do
not want lock. >> No, they said they want to walk if they
haven't paid for it. If they got for free I bet they change their money.
» Yeah, that's right. They wanted it for free.
» I'm not sure how the survey said that. >> We said they said, "Will you be willing
for it?" They said, "Yeah." And then we said, "Would we be filling it?" Then
they said, "No." So if we said, "No, it's free." I bet they're they changed.
» People won't pay for it. >> And I don't think the amount of recycles
we lose, it's Yeah. I mean, we get five We get
five We catch five recyclers, scavengers a month. And I and and they're on
bicycles and carts and dragging bags. >> Yeah.
» It's nothing. So we we spend way too much money
looking for five scavengers a month.
» Whatever we're spending so that I can see Bob on ESPN
every night. Do we pay for those ads?
» The spectrum that's I think it's funny. It's
Uh and and what I'm getting to is you guys have always had really good
judgment as far as I'm concerned about what we spend on those those programs.
So a continuation of those over that's not over and above what you're already
talking about with the 100,000 I assume.
» Grant those >> for what? dinosaur
» for the commercials on ESA. >> Yeah.
» Okay. >> Sh.
» Okay, I'm ready. Um, first >> jump in.
» I'm off of it. Okay, first I just want to say fantastic step.
» So, this is really good. This is, you know, I think a really good start and we
do off and everything we talked about. I want to bring your guys's attention to
the financial review section and staff report. So
» uh >> which shows us where the reserves are
going to be at the end of our current increase because we did look into uh
supplementing via reserves and we did do that. We just
went conservative with it because right now we're going to lose money on our
increases every year for the next five years. So really,
if we want to do and we know we're going to have to do an increase in the next in
five years again, we just and you and it was Bob actually who said it's way
easier to take it all out than to put it back in because then we're looking at
what profiting off of increases, which we don't want to do. So the way I
realistically look at this is if we want to have money left to supplement our
increases in five years, we actually have less than 1.6 million to play with
right now. So right now if we want to leave so let's say over the next five
years we're going to be supplementing uh what total is this 150 260 3 410 5
5 560 we're pulling about 560 grand or more from reserves over the next five
years. >> You're saying cumulative ones from the
staff report? Yeah, I roughly just >> put the shortfall number.
» So planned use of the reserve shortfall is over the next five years we're
supplementing over $500,000. Let's say we even want to be more aggressive with
that and the next time we do a rate increase. We want to supplement 750,000.
Okay. Well, that means we have about 900,000 to spend over the next five
years. We can either start with a big jump and then taper that off because
then maybe city or the city the state is going to force us to find people
whatever. But to me that's the number is okay at the end of this if the most we
spent was x amount we want to make sure we have a million dollar right let's
give ourselves cushion. We want to make sure we have a million dollars to
supplement increases via reserves. And even then,
guys, I'm hesitant to say every 5 years we're just pulling from the reserves
because eventually there will be nothing left. That's concerning to me. So,
so no, I don't want to spend $2.9 million. We've already agreed we're
going to spend $560 on rate stabilization for the next five.
So, that's already out the door in my head because it's not going to get
replenished because we're losing money. And then I
want to leave at least 750 to a million for rate stabilization by 203031.
So then that gives us our number. Okay, over the next 5 years we maybe have
200,000 a year to play with.
I don't know if it maybe high level as a board member it's wise to just stick to
something like that rather than super going into the granular of like how it
would split because the way I see it is our needs are
evolving. It's really great that we do these
audits because we're learning that people are listening
and they are changing their behavior and then we're also going to figure out
where they're unwilling to change their behavior and where we need to push a
little more. >> I know Sarah, you said 200 a year for
education and out that's what you're saying
» for any of these programs that go towards the goal of of our diversion
rate goals. To me, that seems like the imperative goal. Uh,
I'm not I I'm similarly not as concerned about uh recyclables getting stolen, for
example. I'm more concerned about before we start charging people for not sorting
their parts. I want to know that we tried everything we could and we threw
everything at the wall to change and motivate them. Um, and you know, it's
funny like because we are I'm just going to use this example with organic waste
because we are struggling there and behaviorally it's going to be such a big
change for people. Funny enough, I'm almost more
comfortable with putting our money into trying to get them to have kitchen pales
and maybe the kitchen pale comes with the compostable bags one time rather
than, hey, for the next five years, you get $3 off your bill. Like to me, I at
least want to try to change their behavior as much as possible before I
give them like a small incremental discount over time. Um, and then if it
doesn't work, it doesn't work, you know, then we we we move on to the next great
idea. Um, so, so yeah, I feel like the big thing
to to really talk about is like the rate stabilization. That's how I'm thinking
about it. I'm not looking at the money we have now because we already committed
to putting over 500,000 into the rate stabilization. I'm looking at the real
number we have is the number that's left at the end of five years from now
and maybe we go we go conservative which would be about you know
150 to $200,000 a year and then so I'll just pause there then I'll get
into like the ideas in the actual staff report but what do you guys think about
that that does that kind of clarify how I'm thinking about the balance
» there's say keep a higher rate stabilization. Is that what you're
saying? >> I'm saying I we kind of know how much we
want to have left in 5 years. At least a million.
» You would know if you kept a percent of the race compensation money, not spent
out of anything else. That's basically what you're saying.
» Uh yeah, we know we will have 1.6 million left.
» I know it could be greater if we don't spend that extra money.
» Yeah, at most it will be 1.6. At a minimum, I'm saying I think a
million 750 to a million is fine. >> Um, and and that's actually it could end
up being more if certain costs aren't incurred, right? Or CPI,
» right? >> Uh, liquidated damages.
» Are you suggesting to wait until the end of the fiveyear term, look at that 1.6
and then see how we can use that to stabilize for the next fiveyear rate
study? Is that your suggestion? just buy anything.
» Yeah. Because what what we're saying what we're saying look you already have
a fiveyear plan right to increase the rates. I think next year is nine years.
What we're saying that maybe look at some of this money that's in that's
unrestricted. Maybe instead of a 9% increase we can do a 5% increase. You
see what I'm saying? By using offsetting that cost through this stabilization.
» I mean I'm happy with the results of our most recent study and our current
fiveyear plan. >> So you're you're open with a 999. You
don't want to lower that at all? >> No. I'm happy with what where we're at.
I don't want to deplete our reserves anymore as of now.
» What I want to make sure is that when we get to the end of five years with
additional investment into education, outreach, schools, um trying to change
our customers behavior. I want to make sure we have at least a million dollars
left. So when we look at the plan that they gave us with several different
ideas, I'm saying over the next five years, let's spend 600k,
leaving us a million dollars in reserves that would go towards
uh rate stabilization.
What is the percentage increase of a million over 1.6? Let me try. I'm
guessing if that's a Look at that. It's 62%. So, it's about
it's about an alignment with with your back as well.
» Or could you high 60?
» Yeah. For the sake of like for the sake of compromise, we could start small. We
even start with 100 grand a year. Then that's only 500 pay over five years.
I think it's better than that.
» Um, and then as far as the actual like substance of the of where the spend
would go, um, obviously I'm I'm a big supporter of
outreach and education, I think it's way more nuanced than even like a broad
category, which is why we're doing this at Penny. Um, and I think we'll be able
to come back to you guys with some real like data backed ideas that have souls
associated with them. Um, a section on here that isn't included I think is the
actual like physical representation on the bins themselves, like the stickers
on the trash cans. I think they're provided by you guys with QR codes like
just the actual physical interaction they're having with their trash cans.
Um I think it's a big one. Obviously I I love investing in the schools even that
I want to think a little bit outside the box though. Um
and then yeah if organic waste continues to be like
our leading indicator if that's where people are struggling then uh diving
more into the kitchen tales composting education there. But to me that also
basically overlaps with public outreach. Uh and then
contamination inspection.
Uh that seems to me that it's already going to be built into like our existing
compliance. It's already going to be mandatory and
then unfortunately it's going to be required that we find people. So I'm not
really thinking we need to send more there.
agree with you guys on lockable recycling carts. I'm not really worried
about people's recyclables getting stolen. Um,
no. [laughter]
So, yeah, that that's kind of that's how I'm thinking about one. The leading
indicator here is like we are currently uh stabilizing the rates for the next 5
years. How much money do we want to make sure we have left for the next time? And
then what's what's at least a minimum amount we're comfortable investing more
into for for our diversion goals over the next five years to make sure we
still end with that million dollars in five years.
So what you're saying is keep our reserves rather than give people $3 off
their bill. My understanding is I'm saying right now we're already well
right now we are already giving people discounts by putting some of our
reserves into the cost of our services and we're actually going to be losing
money over the next 5 years. That was intentional. We planned it because we
have $3 million. So what we have to do is keep in mind
the number we'll have left in five years which is 1.6.
But we don't want to spend. It's kind of like working backwards like how much do
we want to make sure we have in five years because we're gonna have to raise
the rates again, right? >> We want to keep trying to give them a
discount without depleting our reserves all the way because then we have to
start rebuilding them back up or then we stop buying left for nothing. So your
goal is to have a million in reserves, use that 600 for
» Yeah. But if they even want to have a little
bit more of a commission, maybe I was saying 500 because then that's kind of a
clean 100 each year for five years. And at this point, I think it's also
more about like the quality of the work, which you and I can make sure it's good
quality versus quantity, right? Exactly. Consultants
consultants will spend 100k real quick, but right we can get something good done
for however much you guys comfortable with. And also I think that given the
recent uh study results saying that we are getting much much closer to
recyclables, our goal for recyclables. I think that it's I think that we should
probably establish just to like uh establish expectation for the rest of
the board that probably a lot of the stuff that we're going to be talking
about in the committee is going to be related to organics
because that's number that we want to raise. I mean so things like and I don't
mean to beat a dead horse but like recycling cards we probably wouldn't put
a lot of discussion into something like that because it's not as much of an
issue as it was before. Well, I think I would like to leave room
for uh what's the word a v the variability
of our results informs our outreach and our spend and what we're talking what
we're talking to people about what we're planning into. So, and we see that
seasonally even with you know Christmas time and Christmas trees and people are
moving all that stuff. So, um
But that is even more the staff responsibility. It's our
responsibility high level be like this is the money we want left for this
purpose at the end of the five years. This is what can be worked on also. I
mean we're not even thinking about what if everything goes right. If everything
goes right and people do successfully change their behavior for years, then we
can all say, "All right, we we're willing to pull back on public outreach
and spend because it's clicking or they're getting fined by the state now
or required by the state for to find them." So I think eventually we may even
see an inflection point where >> behavior will be forced to change and
then we we could preserve that we can just put that final 200 the last two
years aside that it'll just not get allocated you know
» well and I well what I think ought to be done is um
in preference in in preparation for the ad committee to meet and I'd like to
know when their first meeting is and I think it's this my opinion it's as soon
as possible is to go over the citizen survey. Um and I believe CHC should that
should be one of the priority items for their 9 their 9926
meeting. My suspicion is there well there's a lot
of new me CHC members and they don't have
the work that we've done and facilitate you know and and that's
the emphasis on the top items that would make recycling easier in the survey were
magnets recycle coach social media tips and recognition And I think you know in
the report here somewhere recognitions um for people that are doing well or
areas are doing well is mentioned um they they want collection containers or
their batteries. 69% of the people want collection containers. I don't know how
far we've reached with that. And my my problem with the collection containers,
it only says take take them to the take them to Huntington Beach. Um,
take it should also take take them to the schools. giving your paper to the
back and >> yeah and those other schools benefit
from those battery processes and and the mail and email are the first ways that
citizens want to get their input. Text is way down the list. Websites way down
the list. Social media posts are way down the list. Public events and mediums
are way down on the list. And I also have a uh as they looked at the citizen
survey, 95% of the people want the information that we provided to
them in English. 5% want it in Spanish. So, we're spending
50% of our media coverage on Spanish and English penetration.
and that's way out of whack with what the demographics show or uh the citizens
that we that we serve. So I would say that we need to rethink that policy uh
to where so we can recover some of the space that uh goes out in the in the in
the quarterly newsletter. It shouldn't be half Spanish and half English. It
should have a a marker on top that said elabor
and and then we then we recoup 50% of the space
that we are talking in the newsletter to people for what we want them to do or to
educate them or whatever. Um and
thank you for letting me talk. >> You're always welcome to talk. Now you
guys join the committee as soon as possible.
» I think we're waiting on this the September space meeting. So they'll
people and then yes, we'll try to get it done ASAP.
» So maybe like late September or something depending on everyone's
availability. Um,
and I guess I wanted to clarify like we really just need to make we really just
need to show we have a working plan, right, for the reserves. That that's the
that's the true or that's like the uh administrative purpose and goal of this.
I want to say this this is not going to be written in stone. like if things
change, if things get better, if the state is harsher on our customers, this
can absolutely uh evolve, we can pull back. Um
but I think roughly maybe like 100k for this year and next year would be a
good place to start. And then we can at least have in writing, hey, this is our
plan. We want a million dollars left for rate stabilization in the five years and
then we're planning on spending about5 to 600 over the next five years into uh
SB1 1383 efforts and uh investing into educating customers to try to get their
behavior change through a myriad of ideas. But if that's kind of enough to
keep to to give ourselves that strong answer of why we have these reserves yet
also then internally staff can sort of start working on some ideas based off of
the ad hoc committee. I think that relatively meets all the criteria we're
trying to hit. Uh what do you guys think about that?
» Yeah. Yeah. Do you have what you need?
» I guess my question is is there a consensus um that we do not want to do
anything with the reserve towards rate stabilization for 5 years? Is that
consensus among the board or do you want us to come back and show you what it
would look like if we were to not raise the rate as much as we're anticipating
for next year? Do you want that information or
» I don't know what sense this is, but I still firmly believe that we need to
have some great stabilization with that money. I I understand the numbers and u
if if we increase our public outreach by another 100,000, it still allows us
historically this board since I've been on it has looked for ways to lower
rates, excuse me, to keep rates affordable. We we've always been
committed to being better than the average in account.
Um $3 doesn't sound like a lot, but I guarantee you there's rateayers out
there that $3 means a hell of a lot. So, I still believe that we need some
component like you said, Scott
years with rates. um this reserve once it's gone. I mean, we have money coming
into this reserve account every year, don't we, Caitlin? Do we have some
component that in that comes into this res that accounts for these reserves?
It's not like we're we're deleting it over the next five years completely.
No, over like um director right says if you look at the the matching review over
the next five based on the rate study that we just approved
for fiscal year 26 27 the end of the year we're projecting $100,000
in defensive and um we reserve above the 30% the target 30%
above this 3.1 million. So over the next five years, let's say if you want to
break out the um 500,000 for the next five years addition to what's already
» in the rate study, then it will be negative 200,000
for the plan used for the short ball will be 200 in this year 6* 7 and then
56 in fiscal year 27 28. So, so by the end of the five years study, you'll end
up with 1.1 or 1 million. So, it's not like we're depleting reserve completely
and now we're getting more money in is from the rate study from the rate that
um res are paying. >> Yeah. So if we don't prop it right, how
how do the reserves get built up without is that when you do okay so when you do
the prop 218 you have to justify why you're profiting and that would be to
say we want to reach our reserve goal or is it only from unexpected revenue
incomes like liquidated damages? Typically
» it it could be from investment earnings. It could be savings from unspent money
like you you plan in your budget to um for 100,000 in outreach and but you only
spend um a 100 um half of that. So then you
that's where the savings come from. I guess like the consultant did show us a
range of of three. It was four scenarios. three were more aggressive
into this and because we already went through that whole process and decided
on this one. That's my hesitancy to not want to do it all over again. But then
also my question would be like what would be a good goal you think to be
able to uh to be able to stabilize future rates,
right? like what is a good amount to chip away at over time to leave some in
the future versus going more aggressive. Now,
» I think I think that's really hard um to to narrow that down that based on the s
based on the surprises we got. I mean, it was totally out of character to get
the landfill increase. I mean that that was so far off the off the rails that if
we have another >> situation like that going into the next
five years uh it's going to be challenging. I mean it's going to be
really challenging. So I I think trying to look that far ahead as much as I'd
like to uh is going to really really hard.
» Scott, you know what do you anticipate the rate will be from this county? Well,
the land the landfills are going to continue to go away and until they come
up with an alternative to the landfill where it's going to go, that's to me
that's the unknown factor that that we can't plan.
» Well, before before we were negotiating with the county, they were projecting
typically over $100 a ton. >> Yeah.
» You know, and so because we got involved with the city managers and um negotiate
with them, we were able to stabilize off a little bit. I mean, it's still going
to be up to $81 here in about 5 years, but it, trust me, it'll be over $100
eventually. Um, so >> yeah,
» I mean, maybe that's why the efforts for diversion are becoming basically
heavy-handed is they see the writing on the walls because landfill spaces
» on that diver on when we start doing penalties,
do we get to keep that money? >> We should. I want to say 80% similar to
um additional cart revenue. We retain 80% of that revenue. So if CR isue um I
think I want to say more than 80%. >> So CR needs 20
nothing goes nothing goes >> for managing the program but none none
of that money goes to the state. No, >> even though
» that's great. That's gonna be great for hopefully stabilizing costs.
» So I guess >> even though people will hate us.
» So I guess I guess the point is we don't do any education. We let people continue
and we make a lot of money and I do that completely physicious. I'm not right.
Um, >> no, I think that's a valid dope even of
like, do we just let people let it blow up in their own faces or do do we have a
responsibility to try to help them before they get their hands slashed?
» 100% have a responsibility. >> And just so that everyone is clear, we
100% have a responsibility to avoid finding residents for government
services. >> I will say that process isn't like a one
time examination in your mind. do get education multiple times before
» they have no one to blame with themselves once they they really don't
» oh they fact of the matter is and I've seen this many times and played out in
many different ways these citizens have in the programs that
we um try to train or educate people they
have to see it three times yeah >> before it registers
» I was driving through neighbor to pick up my wife when she was professor at
Sana College and I had to see the signs about ch, you know, be go slow through
these neighborhoods because there's children here and when I saw that the
third time then I then I paid attention to
» Yeah. >> As an insurance agent I paid attention.
» Oh. Uh you >> voters have to see your name seven times
on average to know >> to vote for you. So you're you're
definitely right to game numbers. Um cool. I mean I I love I love it.
Exploring these sort of philosophical debates would be nice.
» Well, we I we need uh some some direction from the board. First off, I
think um what uh director Wright mentioned is I I I want to
kud kudos to what she said because what you just demonstrated is, you know, it
was good governance. You you're having a a dialogue about discussion, asking
questions, and it's a it's a great model for other districts to see how good
governance works. So, I commend you for for doing that. Thank you. Um but I have
one board member who says that um no, keep the rates increases as we approved.
And I have another board member says, "No, let's use some of the uh reserves
to lesser those rates, whether fibs or whatever." I What does the board want us
to do? I need some directions. I I've got some conflicts on the on this board.
So, I need we need some direction. >> You want to vote?
» I don't listen to vote because it's, you know, I don't but just give me, you
know, >> what's
» Well, I think you guys should follow that question in the end. come
back recommending or should >> so that would be a kind of a separate
item. So we're looking at in addition to education and outreach which I'm
sounding like the consensus is we do want to dedicate money to ed and
outreach but we need to know how much or do we want to dedicate any rate
stabilization at the same time and then we can look at the how and what's of the
outreach and the committee. there there's going to be more money left over
for both these processes. Right stabilization, you know what? Because
staff is has to be and is conservative in their budget.
» So, you know, I don't know if it's 5% more or what from the fines.
» Yeah. Well, I for me it's like if we think that the rates are for sure going
to go up in five years, then I want to know what you guys are comfortable with
reserving for those like how aggressive do we want to plan to those
I think answers that question. >> At least 60%
» that's about a million. But once we find out there's
a a hu another huge increase let the county put on us you know we got time to
change the rate. Yeah, we'll have to
» course five years with six year plan
seems >> and also we we're going to do another
solid waist grade um survey citizen survey I think we do them every two
years. So once the ADOP committee and the board decide on where we're going
with this processes um that those question should be
within the citizen survey. >> Yeah.
» In in a meaningful way. So we we get some
» and this time it'll include our renter. So at least try and [snorts] reach out
to them too. So maybe we'll get some more accurate
languages too. Uh
» answer your question. >> Yeah, I think I think I' I've uh have
some direction what we can do. We we'll um we'll present uh so is is the solways
ad hoc comm is going to be meeting again too, right? So we have the solways ad
hoc committee and the public outreach committee, right? So okay um I think
what we'll do is we'll um present to the committees um if we're going to let's
say for next fiscal year we're going to consider lower lowering the rates
instead or increasing the rate instead of 9% we can look at 5% and how much
money would that come out of reserves can we share that with you and then
whatever's left over we can spend I think you want to spend $500,000
additional on outreach efforts is that right there
» for five years >> for five years 1.1 million for rate
futures rate stabilization. >> Okay. So, we can and we'll we'll come
back with some some um programs with the numbers too. I think it's good for you
to see the numbers too. You need to see the numbers and um see where that
» Yeah. Okay. >> You know, I I think to draw you're
drawing for a consensus. I think there's really two factors that out of all of
this. This was a good report. I this was really good. But I think out of all of
it, education and rate stabilization are the two areas that we're asking you to
overall. No matter what numbers we use, those those are the areas we're asking
you to focus on. >> By the way, Echo Hero, you click on it.
Did you notice that it's almost completely yellow and green?
» Oh, there. Yeah, they have a lot of yellow, white, yellow, and green.
» So, that changed the colors. >> Yeah. So you guys,
» yes, we [clears throat] we're clear. >> Okay. Thank thanks for thanks for the
discussion. It's really thank you for your work. So
» thank you. >> And and I'm sure the numbers lady had a
lot to do with this because >> I think Jenn
[laughter]
all right. Uh any oral communications and any director comments?
Okay. So we are uh board meeting make sure
» 31st >> knows that it's the week
» board meetings was postponed to the annual
» the 31st. >> Oh wait 31st.
» Yeah it's the week after the conference. >> Okay
» the 24th meeting is now on. >> Yes.
» Okay. So we'll uh we'll adjourn to move August 31.
» Thank you.