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Roll call.
>> Parker

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» here.
>> Miss Lich

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» here.
>> Bergen

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» here.
>> Zitra

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» here.
>> Chisel

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» here.
>> Whittle

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» here.
>> Neil

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» here.
>> Item three, public comment. Uh, I have

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Leon Felkey signed up to address the
council.

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» You have three minutes, sir.
>> Hi.

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» Hi. Uh, my name's Leon Faly. I don't
know most of you. Talk to you Brent and

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nice to see you here. Um, did I get like
three minutes or four minutes? I got it

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pretty short. I I rewrote everything
here. I'm going to go through it very

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quickly. Uh, I am going to hand out some
things. Don't take my three minutes for

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that though. Okay.

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» I believe
about

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about two weeks ago that I got this
in the dark.

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» I do have another one that compares what
they want to

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Okay. My name is Leon Fal and uh I
purchased my property from Sunflower 26

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years ago, built my new home on it and
because of nice space and privacy and uh

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but things have changed a lot in the
last three years up there. In the last

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three years, we've got traffic just
booming on on Highway 9 and we have only

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one driveway out of our spot. And keep
that in mind by the way. And uh that has

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disappeared because uh they moved the
school and more traffic because they

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moved the school buses out to Freeport
from up by Luther College. So all the

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school buses come up Highway 9 and uh
just to get them get them there. And

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then the city of Ball Diamond is out in
Freeport now, too. and that I'm told and

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I I don't this is just coffee talk but
I've heard that they they would expect

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maybe three to four 400 vehicles there
if they had um uh big games because

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there's four four uh fields there and I
don't know if that's correct but it's it

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would be close I think. Um anyway,
uh I I received

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my first
thought on this whole thing right here.

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This was uh August 12th of this year.
And people asked me, "What's going on up

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there?" And I I don't know. I haven't
heard a thing. I'm going to read

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something here that really bothers me.
It says um over 60% of of of this uh um

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housing survey and I never got one of
these. I I got this in this envelope. It

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says respondents prefer to live on the
edge of town. Good. It's a nice spot. I

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like it. Uh and near a park. There's no
park there. And a trail. There's no

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trail there. Playground. No playground
there. Or a community garden. there none

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of those things there. So, I have to
wonder why they're even thinking about

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putting those those homes up there. And
the other thing is we'll go on down the

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list here real quick. And uh excuse me u
get halfway done here. Uh the thing that

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uh that kind of bothered me about the
whole thing uh is that those people that

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live there, they can't walk to a store.
They can't walk any place. They all have

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to have cars. If you got husband and
wife there, that's two cars. And kids,

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maybe an extra car there. And right now
there, that plat that I gave you is

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showing 30 homes. That means 60 cars.
And that's if they're all full. And uh

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more than And then if they got kids,
it's more than that. And then they

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they're going to have uh 30 people with
uh visitors coming in uh 24 hours a day,

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seven days a week. Sunflower was very
good because it was only five days a

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week, weekends, no traffic. And so
anyway, it's it keeps building because

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of that. And uh uh the city will not be
plowing those streets, I understand,

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because they're too narrow. I think 60
feet is and I don't know that those

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things but this
>> Could you wrap it up?

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» They said that the city will not plow
it. Is that correct?

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» I'm sorry. What was that?
>> The the on that plat there the because

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it's very very narrow. It's a one-way
street. So, I'm assuming they won't plow

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it for snow. So, they'll anybody that
lives there, they'll have to find their

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own. And uh in case of a storm, uh
there's a real problem there, I think.

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And I did talk to Mike Ashbacker to see
about how our fire would be uh taken

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care of up there. And he said, "Well, we
don't do much until everything gets

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settled and like that." But anyway, if
we had a fire in one of those row houses

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that you live there, uh it's right next
to the cemetery and say, we got a little

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wind with it. It knocked a house down or
something and a fire started.

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» Lean, I'm going to have to cut you off.
We have more people who'd like to speak.

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We're going to schedule a meeting with
you as well.

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» I'm sorry. We're going to schedule a
meeting with the residents up there.

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» Okay. So, it is up.
>> Uh yeah, we can talk about it uh after

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the meeting.
>> I'm sorry I can't hear you.

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» Can we talk after the meeting?
>> I still didn't understand.

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» Could we talk after the meeting?
>> I'm sorry. What?

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» Could we talk after the meeting?
>> Oh, yes. I sure can. Yeah. And that

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would be fine. All right. Thank you.
Appreciate your time.

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» I have Herb Hegman next.
>> I thought I could talk faster, but I'm

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not a fast.
>> That's all right. We got a lot on the

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agenda tonight. So, appreciate you
bringing that.

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» Anyway, thank you. And yeah, I would
like to visit after the meeting because

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I didn't get to the the problem that
>> that I think really very deeply engraved

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up there. So,
>> good evening. I'm Herb Heamman and I

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live at 300 Pleasant Hill Drive. You
could say Pleasant Hill

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» Road because one side of the sign says
drive and the other side says roads.

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sort of unique in Dora. Uh I've lived in
Dora for over 40 years at different

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times.
I'm a member of the Phelps Cemetery

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board neighbors to the site we're
talking about for de for the high

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density development.
In fact, um we boardroom on two sides

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and um some of the we want to be good
neighbors and I certainly am in favor of

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additional housing in Decora,
but

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looking at the plan,
my main concern is

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that the current drawn plans show a lack
or a complete lack of playground and

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playground equipment and green spaces
for children to play. Now, I understand

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this is not housing for the elderly
targeted, right? Probably. Anyway, so

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they're probably going to have children
and um

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we don't want to become the playground
for this development.

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Cemeteries are sacred and should be
revered. My wife is buried there. My

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in-laws are buried. Many, many of my
friends. But any cemetery deserves to be

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protected and to be a quiet, nice
environment.

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And so we, the board members are
concerned about that. We just don't want

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to become the playground for the
development.

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And I speak here. You're saying, "Well,
why are you speaking to this group,

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Herb?" Well, the mayor,
city manager,

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couple council people are part of the uh
Decora jobs group that supposedly owns

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the land. Sometimes they hear they do,
sometimes I hear they don't. But I did

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talk to Stephanie from and she agreed on
some points on the plat. One was where

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they showed remove the fence on our
property line. The next was put in a

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concrete segmented retaining wall right
at the property line. Now, if you're

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going to put a retaining wall that's
possibly six foot tall and you remove

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our fence,
you're going to have people tumbling

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over. A real hazard.
And there's other things about it that

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just aren't aren't as right as they
could be. They first of all, they talk

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about a three and a half acre lot. Well,
there's a good half acre that is not

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usable for building. That is the
driveway that goes to the private homes

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and that area south
>> be between

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» Herb. Can I cut you off? Sorry, time's
up.

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» Okay, I apologize.
>> Well, my concern is

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mayor, city manager, council members, is
this going to become a matter of

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conflict of interest? Think about it.
Thank you. Is there anyone else who'd

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like to address the council this evening
have three minutes?

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I do think Andy, you were saying that
we're going to try to have a meeting

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with homeowners. So, there will be a
meeting with homeowners in the air by in

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the nearby vicinity that I think we're
working on. Um

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» Yep. Absolutely. So, so there'll be an
opportunity to talk among

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» I anyone who want I I mean I think we'll
be open to

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» repeat
>> there there is planned a planned we

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haven't scheduled it yet but we have
planned to talk to homeowners and

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interested parties about the development
in the near future. So we won't respond

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to all the comments right now. I'm just
letting you know that we have heard what

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you have to say like an opportunity.
>> Typically we don't we don't do back and

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forth during the public comment section.
>> Okay. But I wanted you to be aware.

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» Thank you. Appreciate that. Item four,
introduction of Jeff Bun, new uh code

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official.
>> Yes. So, as much fun as I had playing

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building official and code enforcement
official this summer, uh we have filled

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the vacancy formerly held by Greg
Swanson with Jeff Bun who joins us from

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uh prior to was the building official
for the city of Wine. So, a number a

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number of contractors that work in the
city of Dora have worked with Jeff in

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the past and very positive things to say
about their experiences when he worked

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down there. as well as uh my counterpart
in Wine had very positive things to say

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uh about Jeff, not so positive things
about me for taking him, but um so did

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want to introduce Jeff tonight and
anything Jeff you want to add?

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» Jeff, have you relocated to Decor?
>> Okay.

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» Well, we're happy to have you and
welcome you to Dora. Thank you.

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» All right.
>> And he doesn't live in Wine, so he's a

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lot closer than that.
>> Okay.

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» Yeah.
>> Good deal.

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» All right. Item five, city manager
department head and council reports.

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» All right. The only thing I'll just
remind everyone about airport ribbon

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cutting. Uh that'd be next week,
Wednesday, at 4 o'clock p.m. if you want

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to be up there in attendance for that.
The airport commission has a meeting

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that'll follow at 5:00 after that. But
4:00 p.m. next Wednesday if you want to

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do uh want to be there for the ribbon
cutting. And uh with that, I'm going to

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go to John first. John, can you hear me?
All right.

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We'll go to Carrie first. All right,
there's John.

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» John.
>> All right.

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» Yep, we can hear you, John. John's busy
working in his office offsite in the

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second floor of the street shop, uh,
trying to get stuff done. But, uh, John,

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you want to give some report and I'll do
a screen share here soon.

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All right. Thank you, John.
>> I have a couple quick follow-ups for

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John, but I'm not sure if his audio
allows it. Is that okay, Mayor?

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» Go for it.
>> Um, John, if you can hear me and if

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we're able to hear your response. I I uh
I saw someone asserting on Facebook, and

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I know that's always a great start to
something, um that that the blasting

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itself cost $1 million and that it was
solely for the purpose of creating a

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bike path pedestrian trail. Uh and and
that that was asserted to say something

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about the priorities of some of the
people sitting at this very dis. Um and

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I'm curious, could you could you correct
anything that's wrong about those

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assertions so that uh we have good
information? And then if you want to

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feel free to comment on the character of
people who would just make stuff up and

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put it on the internet like that.

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John, are you talking about the entire
scope of the DOT project? The entire

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» project, correct? I don't want anyone to
get confused.

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» I think I think what Steve is getting at
is that the blast wasn't just because of

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the bike trail, right? that it was
multiple needs of the highway

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infrastructure that caused the blasting
and we happened to get a bike trail as

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part of that. It's hard to hear your
audio, but

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Thank you.

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» Any other questions for John?
>> All right. Next, we'll move on to we'll

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go out to Chopper first.

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Okay. Hey, just going to give a quick
update on uh Decor Fiber. Um

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this week we're wrapping up some of the
CO headend uh things to get ready to uh

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start up some customers down in the zone
2, which is the flats. Uh we're hoping

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that uh by next week we'll have a couple
test customers going and then we'll

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about a week or two after that we will
be ready to kind of turn the spot and

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let the installers go for the flats. So
there's like 338

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homes I think in that zone which is
called zone 2 in our in our world. Um

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so then within a month uh of today's
date zone three will be completed and

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ready to go to. So we'll we'll have
quite a few customers to in a sense go

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after to potentially get as decor fiber
uh installs here coming up. But so the

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next two to three weeks um we'll be kind
of moving along with some things

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happening down in the flat. So, that's
really exciting to get some customers

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going and live here.
>> Absolutely.

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» I have a couple questions for you,
Chopper. Yep. That I've just gotten uh

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related to the trenching and and such.
One is um and I'm pretty sure this is

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correct. What customers have said is
that they go in with the they get their

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orange tubes out and then they're
putting sand down, but not necessarily

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dirt. And then some people say they suck
out the sand and then put back in the

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dirt.
>> Correct. The sand is a temporary

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solution. Okay. So, Fridays are
typically the days that they do most of

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their cleanup, the hydro seating and the
areas that they messed up during the

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week. Okay.
>> So, that's usually Fridays, but in the

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meantime, they don't want to leave trip
hazards, things like that. So, whether

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it's where the um equipment was or where
they had to in a sense what they call

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pothole, which means that every time
they c cross gas or electric, they have

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to see their the head of the drill.
>> Um go uh above or below that. So, so

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that means any time you cross Alliant or
Black Hills, they have to see that and

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they have to pothole that section. So,
that's usually the sections that get

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00:22:09,679 --> 00:22:15,840
filled with sand in the interim, then
they'll suck that back out and then put

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00:22:13,520 --> 00:22:19,840
the dirt back in or if it's cement in
some cases, we've had a couple where we

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00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:22,799
had to do that in a sidewalk or in a
sense, we had one recently we had to put

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00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:26,720
one in someone's driveway just because
the way the gas was. Um, but that's

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00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:30,799
usually what the steps that take. So,
Fridays are typically the cleanup day.

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Okay? and they try to explain that to
the homeowners when they're in their

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area working and a lot of them come up
with questions and they're curious of

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how that's done and what's put in and
things like that. So, yes.

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» Okay. And I have a lot of neighbors
asking how soon they can get signed up

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00:22:42,159 --> 00:22:46,000
and I think that's zone three. So, I
should tell them a month.

215
00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:48,880
» I would say within a month we'll be
starting zone three. Yes.

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00:22:47,039 --> 00:22:51,880
» And people are really excited. So, thank
you.

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00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:58,720
» Thanks, Robert.
>> All right. Next up, Carrie.

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00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:03,520
» Okay. Uh just continuing to work on our
messaging to the residents regarding the

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00:23:00,559 --> 00:23:06,640
water and sewer billing. Um we've heard
some positive comments after the last

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00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:11,440
statements that we sent out with the
email notification, but we are really

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00:23:09,360 --> 00:23:16,320
pushing um residents. We have about half
of the residents of the city that are

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00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:19,919
now paying through a online payments.
And we really really are pushing them to

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00:23:17,919 --> 00:23:23,520
go to a because there's no fees with
that. That's directly through us or

224
00:23:21,919 --> 00:23:27,679
their bank if there's no fees with their
bank. But um there was some confusion

225
00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:33,200
there, but it seems to be getting
better. The calls are less calls, but

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00:23:30,799 --> 00:23:38,240
we're still helping people through that.
So again, if you hear anything, please

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00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:41,400
send them our way.
>> Thank you.

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00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:47,520
» Anybody want to add anything else? I
think we got

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00:23:45,120 --> 00:23:50,480
» any other department heads?
>> No. Council members,

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00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:56,000
» nothing.
>> I've got two quick ones. Um uh the first

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00:23:53,840 --> 00:24:01,360
is I I know that in several different
ways the city's expressed gratitude for

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00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:05,360
what patience the public has shown and
had for all the various

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00:24:03,919 --> 00:24:11,279
construction projects happening around
the city uh this summer and last summer.

234
00:24:08,159 --> 00:24:14,880
Um and uh and I I certainly, you know, I
I think that's very true. I'm excited

235
00:24:13,039 --> 00:24:17,520
about all the improvements and and uh
and I'm looking forward to seeing some

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00:24:16,159 --> 00:24:24,320
of the orange barricades that have been
haunting my dreams uh go away. Um I I uh

237
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:28,080
in particular though I I just have you
know been been thinking about a few like

238
00:24:26,559 --> 00:24:32,960
heavily affected businesses especially
from the highly construction projects.

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00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:37,279
Um businesses like uh the bowling alley
and the uh the movie theater and and you

240
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:41,600
know services like the post office that
we've effectively put at the end of uh

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00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:47,279
hard to get to dead-end places for the
last couple construction seasons. And uh

242
00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:52,000
and and that's the cost of progress in
in some ways. And you know, that's how

243
00:24:49,679 --> 00:24:55,679
things sometimes are. But, uh, I just
think I just wanted to to I was at the

244
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:59,120
bowling alley the other night and I was
happy to see it was busy. And I I just

245
00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:02,559
want to say a special word of
appreciation to those businesses and

246
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:06,400
residents who've been most affected by
this construction season. And and I hope

247
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:13,200
everyone's equally excited that it's
coming uh closer to a close. Um, and the

248
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:18,720
other comment I wanted to make tonight
has to do with uh, so some of us up here

249
00:25:15,919 --> 00:25:22,320
review receipts where we we sign off on
uh, expenditures the city's made. This

250
00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:25,760
is a requirement of Iowa law for elected
officials that we actually sort of know

251
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:31,279
where the money is going and and agree
with it. Um and uh and so last week I

252
00:25:29,120 --> 00:25:35,120
was signing a receipt and I noticed uh
that that the city was now participating

253
00:25:33,279 --> 00:25:39,840
in what seemed like a really good thing,
which is uh participating in a cost

254
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:44,799
share with the sheriff's office on on a
program that's used for an investigative

255
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:47,760
tool related to uh downloading cell
phone data when when there's an

256
00:25:46,159 --> 00:25:50,720
investigation happening related to a
phone. That's just something that

257
00:25:49,120 --> 00:25:55,120
happens these days and it's an important
tool for for police work. Um, and I was

258
00:25:53,279 --> 00:25:58,720
glad to see that instead of there being
two copies, one for our police station

259
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:05,039
and one for our sheriff's office, that
that uh the the chief and and and the

260
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:11,600
sheriff uh worked out a way to to to
share some of those costs. And I I want

261
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:16,320
to commend um both both uh both the
department and the office for that

262
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:19,840
cooperation. And and I I see it as as a
kind of cooperation that there should be

263
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:24,159
more of in this city and not less of.
And I say this all by way of saying that

264
00:26:21,919 --> 00:26:28,799
uh I I don't like the way that the costs
are shared in this particular case. And

265
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:33,360
and this is not new to my colleagues at
here up here at the dis that sometimes I

266
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:37,520
think that when we are determining cost
sharing arrangements between the city

267
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:42,159
and the county we forget that city
residents are also county residents and

268
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:45,520
often end up paying for things twice
because of that. Um that was a little

269
00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:51,360
bit true with this particular
subscription. Um but but I want to make

270
00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:55,440
it really clear that in raising
questions about these kinds of cost

271
00:26:53,120 --> 00:26:58,960
shares, it is not saying that we should
not be cooperating with our close

272
00:26:57,360 --> 00:27:02,960
partners in the county law enforcement
community as a city police department.

273
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:08,159
It is saying that we should make sure
that uh that that that to the extent

274
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:12,240
that various people are benefiting, they
are paying their fair share and and that

275
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:16,400
that that is a way to make sure that our
law enforcement community both in town

276
00:27:14,159 --> 00:27:20,960
and in the county are as well supported
as possible. So, u I hope we continue to

277
00:27:19,279 --> 00:27:25,440
work towards increased cooperation. I
thank uh I thank Chief Tine and and and

278
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:29,520
Sheriff Marks for their collaboration
and and hammering out this new

279
00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:33,120
agreement. And I encourage all of us,
uh, surely I see you here. Thanks for

280
00:27:31,039 --> 00:27:38,840
being here. Our two bodies, I encourage
us to continue to find ways to to save

281
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:38,840
the people we represent money.

282
00:27:39,279 --> 00:27:46,000
» Um, and I just wanted to give an update.
Um, Decor Jobs was just announced in the

283
00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:50,480
Iowa Workforce Housing Development. They
just put out publicly um that uh our

284
00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:55,919
economic development team at Decor Jobs
did um get awarded the workforce housing

285
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:59,600
tax credit for the housing project. Um,
and the number is escaping me, but

286
00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,640
Travis, he might know it. Is it a
million?

287
00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:02,960
» I think it's a million.
>> I think it's a million, too. So, we got

288
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:10,200
a million dollars worth of housing tax
credits um for the housing project um

289
00:28:06,399 --> 00:28:10,200
that just came out today.

290
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:18,240
» Anyone else to share? Council
>> and congratulations to Christopher for

291
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:20,240
being inducted into the NICC Hall of
Fame.

292
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:24,480
» Oh, yeah. Congrats.
>> Thank you.

293
00:28:22,799 --> 00:28:28,399
» Oh, yeah. Congratulations to Zach
current, too, for adding hopefully a

294
00:28:26,799 --> 00:28:31,360
future volunteer firefighter or
full-time firefighter for that matter.

295
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:33,600
» Oh, did he have a baby?
>> Yeah, last Friday.

296
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:38,320
» I had no idea. Yay.
>> I'll congratulate Lauren.

297
00:28:36,399 --> 00:28:40,720
» Yeah, Zach didn't have the baby. Let's
be clear.

298
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:45,279
» That's awesome. I did not know that.
>> Um, what I've been up to, uh, I did was

299
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:49,919
invited to Luther to speak to the
incoming freshman class, uh, class of

300
00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:53,919
432 if I remember correctly. Um, so I
appreciated that. uh talk about the

301
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:58,320
relationship between Decor and Luther.
Um also met with the library and they're

302
00:28:56,320 --> 00:29:01,600
willing to do some help um with regards
to our bond referendum and helping with

303
00:29:00,159 --> 00:29:06,960
some of the social media planning and
things of that nature. So appreciative

304
00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:10,320
of them. Um yeah, it's been kind of a
slow couple of weeks. Do I dare say

305
00:29:09,039 --> 00:29:13,919
that? No,
>> you can say that.

306
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:19,840
» No, it hasn't been. Anyways, uh moving
on. Item six, consent agenda.

307
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:27,120
» Item A, minutes of August 17, 2026.
council meeting and August 24th, 2026

308
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:30,399
work session minutes. B claims C.
Issuance of addendum one for

309
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:34,559
comprehensive park plan request for
proposals.

310
00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:40,159
D. Construction administration proposal
with ISG for Raleigh Sports Complex

311
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:45,440
final phase. E. Class E retail alcohol
license ownership amendment for Casey's

312
00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:50,159
on Old Stage Road and College Drive. F.
Class C retail alcohol license with

313
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:56,240
outdoor service service renewal Skyline
Lanes LLC. G retail tobacco ownership

314
00:29:54,240 --> 00:30:01,919
amendment for cases on Old Stage Road
and College Drive. H. Carlson Park

315
00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:05,679
Gateway Trail Project application number
11.

316
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:11,520
I Dora Wastewater Treatment Plant
Improvement Project pay application

317
00:30:07,279 --> 00:30:16,080
number 10. J. Dora 2026 Hiveley Street
intersection improvements project pay

318
00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:22,960
application number five.
K Dor Athletic Complex pay application

319
00:30:18,799 --> 00:30:27,200
number five and L Phelps Park Holiday
Lighting Agreement.

320
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:32,559
» Can I get a motion for the approval of
the consent agenda?

321
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:36,399
» Move for approval as presented.
>> I'll second.

322
00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:40,399
» Okay. I have a question about
>> um in the Phelps Park holiday lighting

323
00:30:38,799 --> 00:30:45,640
agreement uh in the park board's
discussion um was holiday defined

324
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:52,720
» as far as like the timing that they
would be up

325
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:58,000
» no I understand that the timing is what
I was wondering what constitutes a

326
00:30:54,399 --> 00:31:03,200
holiday display
>> colors words content imagery

327
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:12,080
Yeah, more of a time frame. So, uh
40-day period.

328
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:17,039
» So, it's but no content or anything
discussed. Uh as I understand it, it's

329
00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:20,399
to put lights in the trees. It's not
ground mount stuff. Correct.

330
00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:25,120
» Yep. And then the pavilion as well,
right? So, is the is the agreement

331
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:31,919
documented in your conversations to be
like string or individual lights like

332
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:36,799
not light up Santa and Frosty?
>> That is correct. Uh along the trails and

333
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:39,600
then on the gazebo as well.
>> Okay, great. I just wanted to make sure

334
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:44,000
that that conversation had been
discussed and noted.

335
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:51,559
» Also like to thank the Thornton family
for donating that.

336
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:51,559
» Uh any other questions, comments?

337
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:55,519
All right. Motion by Chisel, seconded by
Miss Linich. Roll call.

338
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:56,640
» Chisel.
>> I.

339
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:57,600
» Miss Limich.
>> I.

340
00:31:57,120 --> 00:31:58,720
» Parker.
>> Hi.

341
00:31:58,159 --> 00:31:59,679
» Bergen.
>> I.

342
00:31:59,039 --> 00:32:00,640
» Zitigrin.
>> Hi.

343
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:01,600
» Whittle.
>> I.

344
00:32:01,039 --> 00:32:05,200
» Neil.
>> I.

345
00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:08,720
» Consent agenda is approved. Moving on to
item seven. Consider resolution

346
00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:12,399
approving voluntary annexation of Eric
Teal real estate in the vicinity of

347
00:32:10,399 --> 00:32:15,760
northeast of intersection of Locust Road
and Laurel Drive. Travis, you want to

348
00:32:14,559 --> 00:32:20,000
get background there?
>> Yes. So this is um to refresh your

349
00:32:18,559 --> 00:32:25,760
memories in case you forgot from the
first time we approved this the I'm not

350
00:32:23,519 --> 00:32:33,679
bitter but the state said we didn't
follow their process uh of 14 days

351
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:40,080
publication advance uh in advance of the
action taken. Well we were 14 days but

352
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:44,880
they said no we mean 14 business days.
So uh we did have to republish. The

353
00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:49,519
county supervisors already provided
plenty of notice because we tried this

354
00:32:47,519 --> 00:32:55,840
three months ago at this point. So
anyway, here we are. Uh background for

355
00:32:52,640 --> 00:33:01,679
this is the same as item 7. The Eric
Teal property is the most adjacent. The

356
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:06,720
home is already within the city limits.
There's additional land owned just to

357
00:33:04,159 --> 00:33:13,679
the north that sits outside in the
county. So this annexation as well as

358
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:18,960
item eight uh for the Mossman property
for those to be annexed in is a

359
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:23,519
requirement for well uh as part of their
development. We've got a preliminary

360
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:30,399
plat that's approved contingent upon
their annexation. So that first phase is

361
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:35,360
the background for item 8 as well. Um
that's the area that'll be annexed in as

362
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:40,480
part of item 8. notes sent to the
supervisors June 24th, republished

363
00:33:37,919 --> 00:33:47,640
August 6th. So, we've met uh all the
requirements by Iowa code.

364
00:33:44,159 --> 00:33:47,640
» Again, for approval,

365
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:56,120
» I'll second.
>> Motion by Chisel, second by Missich. Any

366
00:33:52,799 --> 00:33:56,120
further discussion?

367
00:33:57,039 --> 00:33:58,880
Roll call.
>> Chisel.

368
00:33:58,559 --> 00:34:00,000
» I.
>> Miss Lynch.

369
00:33:59,519 --> 00:34:00,880
» Hi.
>> Bergen.

370
00:34:00,559 --> 00:34:01,919
» I.
>> Zitrin.

371
00:34:01,519 --> 00:34:04,159
» Hi.
>> Whittle.

372
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:05,120
» Hi. Neil
>> I

373
00:34:04,559 --> 00:34:08,240
» Parker
>> I

374
00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:11,599
» motion passes unanimously. Item eight
consider resolution approving voluntary

375
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:15,119
annexation of Tom Mossman Construction
Inc. Real estate in the vicinity

376
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:19,000
southeast of intersection of Locust
Road, Middle Hesper Road

377
00:34:20,879 --> 00:34:25,760
» Travis. Okay. I was going to say we
don't really need to go over again for

378
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:30,639
the resolution.
>> I'll second. Okay.

379
00:34:28,639 --> 00:34:34,480
» Motion by Chisel, second by Missinich.
Any further discussion?

380
00:34:33,679 --> 00:34:35,359
Roll call.
>> Chisel.

381
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:36,720
» Hi.
>> Miss Limich.

382
00:34:36,079 --> 00:34:37,839
» Hi.
>> Bergen.

383
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:38,879
» Hi.
>> Zitigrin.

384
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:39,839
» Hi.
>> Whittle.

385
00:34:39,359 --> 00:34:40,800
» Hi.
>> Neil.

386
00:34:40,399 --> 00:34:42,800
» Hi.
>> Parker.

387
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:45,599
» Hi.
>> Item nine. Consider resolution

388
00:34:44,240 --> 00:34:50,240
authorizing execution of lease
agreements with uh Enterprise Fleet

389
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:53,200
Management.
>> All right. So, we do have

390
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:56,240
representatives of enterprise fleet
management here. I'll give kind of a

391
00:34:54,720 --> 00:35:02,320
high level and then turn it over to
Ethan to uh fully present. So, the

392
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:10,160
proposed resolution would allow staff to
replace, and I use the term replace, but

393
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:14,400
uh only three would uh we would sell
off, but five current vehicles with a

394
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:19,119
lease option previously presented to
council as part of a an umbrella master

395
00:35:17,119 --> 00:35:24,079
lease agreement. Again, three would be
sold. One we would rotate to the airport

396
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:30,160
and sell a different vehicle that's
currently there and one we would keep

397
00:35:27,119 --> 00:35:36,560
and actually utilize um as kind of a
travel but the primary vehicle for the

398
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:40,400
building official at this point. U there
are instances where we got to take stuff

399
00:35:38,240 --> 00:35:45,040
from the street department or something
uh to be able to use for travel

400
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:52,720
vehicles, but that one is still
sufficient. Um, it's a decent vehicle,

401
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:56,960
but not well equipped for plowing. We've
had issues with it. So, it'd be a good

402
00:35:54,720 --> 00:36:00,560
backup for the building official or good
primary vehicle knowing that we've got

403
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:05,760
other travel vehicles that can be the
backup.

404
00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:08,560
So, that's what we would do um if moved
forward with five.

405
00:36:08,079 --> 00:36:13,119
Bless you.
>> Excuse me. So further analysis of

406
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:19,359
individual vehicle replacements are
included in Dropbox as file 9B. And this

407
00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:22,800
resolution would also authorize, we
talked about this briefly during the

408
00:36:20,720 --> 00:36:27,040
master lease agreement. Uh would
actually also allow us to enter into a m

409
00:36:25,599 --> 00:36:32,400
maintenance agreement for the duration
of the lease. Both of which are expected

410
00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:38,880
to save the city operational costs assoc
over fiveyear term.

411
00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:42,240
Travis, do we usually is five years the
life of a city vehicle or do we usually

412
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:45,599
have them much longer than five years?
>> No, we usually have them much much

413
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:50,000
longer.
>> Um,

414
00:36:46,240 --> 00:36:54,560
» so so why then a calculation of saying
five years saves us money when we own a

415
00:36:53,119 --> 00:37:01,440
vehicle much longer than that?
>> Yeah. So

416
00:36:56,800 --> 00:37:07,760
the way this lease is is structured is
that it has the acquisition price from

417
00:37:03,359 --> 00:37:14,560
enterprise fleet management and the
estimated resale value after five years

418
00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:20,320
and those two the difference between
those two are used to calculate the

419
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:24,560
monthly payments for the lease the lease
period.

420
00:37:22,079 --> 00:37:30,560
Right now, we do
extend that vehicle life out 15, 20

421
00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:38,400
years, but there is no resale value. We
typically sell it at auction for for

422
00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:44,079
$1,000 or so. Um,
our maintenance costs also ex, you know,

423
00:37:42,079 --> 00:37:50,000
obviously the longer you own a vehicle,
you have higher maintenance costs. By

424
00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:55,119
pairing the two together,
we're able to lower both our

425
00:37:53,359 --> 00:38:04,000
maintenance costs associated with our
entire fleet as well as the um

426
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:08,160
if we take our acquisition costs and
amvertise it over the life of the

427
00:38:06,240 --> 00:38:15,040
vehicle
and then cut it down to fiveyear period.

428
00:38:11,359 --> 00:38:20,480
We're still looking at a savings with
the lease as opposed to holding it and

429
00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:25,440
then just moving it through the system
every five years. And I know I I just

430
00:38:23,599 --> 00:38:29,800
realized I did not explain that very
well. Give me a second here.

431
00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:36,880
Like I feel like we're I feel like what
I have right now is apples and oranges

432
00:38:34,240 --> 00:38:42,160
because I don't know what the the cost
of buying a vehicle and owning it for 15

433
00:38:39,599 --> 00:38:47,920
years compared to
leasing a vehicle and then trading it in

434
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:50,480
in five years or would we buy the
vehicle in five years?

435
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:56,599
» The option.
>> We'd have the option but then how do I

436
00:38:52,240 --> 00:38:56,599
compare the total cost?

437
00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:02,720
Well, there's trade-offs on both sides,
right? One is you're probably not gonna

438
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:05,440
have to deal with a ton of maintenance
issues if you get rid of it after five

439
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:08,560
years,
>> right?

440
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:11,920
» Well, I get that. I mean, I but I I I
have a hard time thinking we say I I

441
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:15,599
think I said this last time. I have a
hard time thinking we save money leasing

442
00:39:13,359 --> 00:39:19,440
a vehicle because
>> and I I was willing to accept the fact

443
00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:23,040
that okay, maybe a corporate lease is
different than just a personal lease,

444
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:27,440
» but I still want to understand that and
then what happens? Yeah. So,

445
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:30,079
» could you come to the podium so we can
have some questions.

446
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:35,359
» Thank you.
>> So, Emily, if you look at it'd be on

447
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:41,119
page looks like 64 of the council
packet. It's an Excel spreadsheet that

448
00:39:39,119 --> 00:39:45,040
unfortunately it's really long. So, it
is multiple pages so that you can

449
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:48,640
actually still read it. We're on page
64. It's got the state acquisition or

450
00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:54,079
internal quote. So, those are the
pricings that we've received for an

451
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:59,599
outright purchase of a vehicle. So if we
were to take that and say this is we're

452
00:39:56,560 --> 00:40:05,359
going to structure this over 15 or 20
years of a vehicle life, you depreciate

453
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:11,839
it over that time
as opposed to

454
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:18,359
the next page which has EFM, their
acquisition cost, their monthly lease

455
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:18,359
rate, full maintenance.

456
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:26,640
Next page has their annual cost to us.
>> Is this also in document B? That's what

457
00:40:25,839 --> 00:40:30,480
I was looking up.
>> Correct. So yeah, it's all within

458
00:40:28,240 --> 00:40:32,880
document B, but it's multiple pages
because

459
00:40:31,520 --> 00:40:37,680
» like I said, unfortunately, it's a
really long spreadsheet because there's

460
00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:43,680
only just a few lines to it, but I have
to chop it up into a couple pages to

461
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:51,040
make it actually legible.
But the on page 67, the last column on

462
00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:58,000
there shows the anticipated resale price
at term. So they take that, which for us

463
00:40:55,680 --> 00:41:03,599
is under our current method is like
$1,000.

464
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:08,160
They take that anticipated resale price
at term and subtract that from their

465
00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:12,000
acquisition costs to come up with the
lease rate over five years.

466
00:41:10,319 --> 00:41:17,520
» Am I explaining that correct, Ethan?
Yeah, I think I understand that.

467
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:22,000
What I don't understand is if we hang on
to the vehicle.

468
00:41:20,720 --> 00:41:26,359
» Well, I'll let other people ask
questions because I have more.

469
00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:35,359
» I Oh, I I got a question. I think the
last time you're here, I mean, you had

470
00:41:33,040 --> 00:41:42,960
like a list of agencies or uh
individuals that use Enterprise. Um, and

471
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:47,680
I think I I asked if there's like a
like a close government entity that has

472
00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:51,760
used Enterprise that it maybe hasn't
penciled out that kind of backed away.

473
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:54,880
Um, and you didn't know the answer at
that time. I'm just curious if you're

474
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:58,960
able to look at that or uh if there's
like some place close that have had it

475
00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:03,599
for a while and stopped using
Enterprise.

476
00:42:00,319 --> 00:42:08,079
» Um, yeah. So um to to my knowledge uh
still es in my tenure and and in the

477
00:42:06,079 --> 00:42:11,040
recent history um not that I know of
have we worked with an agency that has

478
00:42:09,839 --> 00:42:15,280
has worked with us for an extended
period and then ultimately decided to

479
00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:19,440
leave uh from a government end. Um on
the commercial side of our business um

480
00:42:17,040 --> 00:42:23,760
that that has happened in the past. Um
but to maybe kind of speak to your your

481
00:42:21,599 --> 00:42:27,440
question or maybe I should just ask you
u if there are some concerns about what

482
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:31,839
it would look like to to walk away from
a program like this. Um, I'll just add

483
00:42:29,839 --> 00:42:36,079
that what we do is is always as
conservative as possible in our client's

484
00:42:33,839 --> 00:42:40,240
best interest and Travis and I have
discussed this u multiple different

485
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:44,400
occasions, but as far as what it would
look like to walk away is a really

486
00:42:41,599 --> 00:42:48,160
seamless process. Um, if we started with
these five vehicles today and a year

487
00:42:46,319 --> 00:42:50,880
from now, uh, you guys determined that
that was no longer something you could

488
00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:55,440
our partnership was something you wanted
to pursue, it's as simple as either, um,

489
00:42:53,839 --> 00:42:59,040
continuing to pay for the vehicles that
we have on on lease. um we'll service

490
00:42:57,599 --> 00:43:02,800
them throughout their lifetime at the
end of that fiveyear period can shake

491
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:06,480
hands and split up or alternatively
you're welcome to to purchase out the

492
00:43:04,079 --> 00:43:10,079
vehicles themselves or we can resell
those for you and ultimately uh

493
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:14,800
liquidate and remove from the program as
well. Um so again our goal is is at the

494
00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:18,640
end of the day to be a service provider
to you all and to make that as seamless

495
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:20,480
as possible. Is that maybe kind of what
you were getting at?

496
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:25,119
» Yeah. No, I was just curious if there
was anybody that, you know, because it

497
00:43:22,079 --> 00:43:29,440
it it kind of um just curious if
anybody's gone with enterprise lease

498
00:43:27,119 --> 00:43:35,200
vehicles and then have gone away from
that. So, if there has, you know, that

499
00:43:32,319 --> 00:43:38,720
that I'd just be curious on why they
decided to go away from enterprise

500
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:42,480
leasing vehicles if they've,
>> you know, but to your knowledge that

501
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:45,760
everybody that's gone with you, you're
saying, has stayed with you?

502
00:43:43,839 --> 00:43:50,720
» Yes, my knowledge and actually uh
invited a colleague with me today. Um uh

503
00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:54,560
Raven's with our with our team for quite
a while longer than I have been. So she

504
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:57,440
may have an experience to speak to
there.

505
00:43:55,040 --> 00:44:02,880
» Yeah. So what I would say is um at the
end of the day we are here again to to

506
00:44:00,319 --> 00:44:07,040
Ethan's point to make it as easy as
possible for the municipalities that we

507
00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:11,520
work with. I actually come from the uh
client man client strategy manager side

508
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:15,599
of the house where I manage onboarded
clients and at the end of the day if

509
00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:19,119
there is a situation where it's not
penciling out I'm going to be the first

510
00:44:17,200 --> 00:44:24,960
one to tell you that like our our team
will be the first one to tell you that.

511
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:29,040
Um, what I will say is the where I have
seen it not work out the way that we

512
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:34,400
have, which I think that our our
projection is um $140,000

513
00:44:32,160 --> 00:44:40,000
of savings over the course of 10 years,
is where we come up with a plan and then

514
00:44:36,319 --> 00:44:44,079
the plan isn't isn't executed on because
um the whole idea of our program and the

515
00:44:42,319 --> 00:44:50,319
what reason that the scent per mile and
the total cost of ownership um view of

516
00:44:47,680 --> 00:44:55,920
owning and operating a vehicle works is
because we're able on the government

517
00:44:52,640 --> 00:45:01,440
side to purchase low because you qualify
for really high incentives um from the

518
00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:06,800
manufacturers and then sell on the
wholesale market at the end of the term.

519
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:12,640
So um at the end of the day that that
scent per mile actually um that gap

520
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:17,839
closes and then the vehicle program ends
up paying for itself almost like an

521
00:45:14,640 --> 00:45:21,280
internal service fund.
>> I got one more question. Yeah.

522
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:27,119
» So, obviously, you know, entities go
into the cost savings. Where do you make

523
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:28,800
your money off of us leasing vehicles?
>> Yeah. Really?

524
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:31,280
» Yeah. I mean, because obviously it's a
business. You wouldn't be here if it's

525
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:34,160
there's not something for you, right?
>> Absolutely.

526
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:37,680
» Yeah. Absolutely. Um Yeah. It's a simple
for lease structure. There is an

527
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:42,800
interest rate. Um we do of course uh
profit from there. Um and then uh kind

528
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:47,680
of additionally, there are some there's
some management fees uh as well built in

529
00:45:45,839 --> 00:45:52,880
uh based on the acquisition price of the
vehicle. Um those are really the two

530
00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:57,760
largest uh opportunity for us. Um I know
Travis mentioned our uh maintenance

531
00:45:55,119 --> 00:46:01,760
program. Um isn't really a necessarily
as much of a profit center for us. Um

532
00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:06,240
essentially what we do is we look at
historically the cost of operating a

533
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:09,839
vehicle of its type um across you know
our fleet of rental vehicles on that on

534
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:14,240
the rental side of our business but also
from the remainder of our clients out in

535
00:46:11,200 --> 00:46:17,520
the field. And from that uh using that
data to predict what the cost is going

536
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:20,640
to be like with a little bit of padding
kind of no different from an insurance

537
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:23,839
agency would just to ensure that we're
we're in a right position at the end of

538
00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:28,240
term but also ensuring you guys are
paying the lowest amount possible over

539
00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:33,440
it lifetime. Um and then lastly would be
at the end of end of term of a vehicle.

540
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:37,280
Um this is is again not really a profit
center for us but it is a cost that you

541
00:46:34,800 --> 00:46:41,760
would see on a statement. We do charge a
$500 fee associated with reselling the

542
00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:44,800
vehicle at the end of its term. Um,
again, that's built into the complete

543
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:47,680
leases that Travis has had a chance to
see and hopefully you guys have had a

544
00:46:46,160 --> 00:46:52,520
chance to see. Um, but those would be
the big big areas that are coming to

545
00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:52,520
mind for me.

546
00:46:53,200 --> 00:46:57,920
» And what exactly does the full
maintenance program cover?

547
00:46:56,000 --> 00:47:01,680
» Yeah, absolutely. So, that covers uh any
any routine maintenance on the vehicle

548
00:46:59,920 --> 00:47:06,400
over the course of its lifetime or up to
100,000 miles. Um, the only things that

549
00:47:04,720 --> 00:47:09,760
wouldn't be included that are commonly
asked would be things like brakes and

550
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:13,920
tires. Um, so outside of that, any oil
changes, tire rotations, everything like

551
00:47:11,520 --> 00:47:16,960
that fully included in that cost. Um, so
outside of those brakes and tires, and

552
00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:21,200
of course any like collision or body
damage, um, we we assume the risk on on

553
00:47:19,359 --> 00:47:25,599
the cost of the vehicle. Okay.
>> Are there requirements or limitations

554
00:47:22,720 --> 00:47:28,640
about where maintenance can occur?
>> Uh, yes, we do ask that you work through

555
00:47:27,119 --> 00:47:32,240
our vendor network. Uh, it's the same
network we built rental side of our

556
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:36,240
business. It's quite expansive. I think
here in Dora at a 10 mile radius there's

557
00:47:34,400 --> 00:47:40,240
five locations and I think if you
stretch that out to 25 miles or a

558
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:44,240
handful more um so plenty of
availability timeliness is a huge factor

559
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:48,079
in how we determine our vendors. Um so I
wouldn't anticipate any issues there.

560
00:47:46,319 --> 00:47:52,480
» Travis, do you know if that would change
where we currently

561
00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:55,440
have our vehicles sent for maintenance?
>> We've got a pretty good spread of where

562
00:47:53,839 --> 00:48:04,280
we take all our different types of
vehicles. So it might change where we

563
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:04,280
take grab that list here again.

564
00:48:20,560 --> 00:48:27,920
So, actually, this wouldn't change. Uh,
PD takes their vehicles to a place

565
00:48:24,319 --> 00:48:31,119
that's not listed on here, but the rest
the rest should be good. We wouldn't

566
00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:34,400
have to change them.
>> I mean, I'll take that list because I

567
00:48:32,559 --> 00:48:40,960
can get my can't get my car in anywhere.
So, um uh great. And then just uh make

568
00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:47,280
sure I understand the terms correctly.
So, it's five years um and 10,000 miles

569
00:48:45,119 --> 00:48:52,240
per year per vehicle.
>> Yes. So that 10,000 miles is based on

570
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:55,359
the a average application
of the typical of the vehicles you guys

571
00:48:53,839 --> 00:48:58,960
are operating today. So that is subject
to change if you guys have any any

572
00:48:56,800 --> 00:49:01,520
change in the vehicles. Um but yeah,
we're looking at that 5year 50,000 mi

573
00:49:01,119 --> 00:49:04,880
period.
>> So something changed around the use of

574
00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:08,640
one of the vehicles and mileage was
going to go up. That is something that

575
00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:12,800
we could address or negotiate with you
without waiting for that 5year term.

576
00:49:10,720 --> 00:49:16,720
» Yeah, absolutely. And part of our
account team's process and I've spoke to

577
00:49:14,480 --> 00:49:22,160
Travis about this is to review all the
ongoings in the fleet um in some in

578
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:25,200
really deep detail at least twice a year
one of the primary targets of those

579
00:49:23,520 --> 00:49:29,280
meetings is ensuring that everything is
where it needs to be at from a term and

580
00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:34,000
depreciation standpoint. Um, so if we
notice that a vehicle is going 50% more

581
00:49:31,839 --> 00:49:37,119
miles uh between years two and three,
it's absolutely a conversation that we'd

582
00:49:35,599 --> 00:49:40,240
have with Travis and and likely the
department has operating the vehicle and

583
00:49:39,040 --> 00:49:44,160
ensuring that if anything needs to
change that it does well before there's

584
00:49:42,160 --> 00:49:48,640
any sort of potential
u you know significant issue.

585
00:49:46,079 --> 00:49:54,400
» Um and then I do want to add just to um
Miss Neil's point earlier, the the lease

586
00:49:52,079 --> 00:49:58,960
that we have um the open-ended lease is
very different from like a traditional

587
00:49:56,079 --> 00:50:04,079
dealer lease. So while The terms are
written at 10,000 miles per year for

588
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:09,119
five years. If you do end up going over
that, there aren't any penalties

589
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:13,680
for going over that. The only thing that
would be impacted is the resale value

590
00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:17,040
that we expect at the end, which um you
know, higher mileage, older vehicle,

591
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:22,559
whatever the case may be that gets
changed. Um that would that would impact

592
00:50:19,839 --> 00:50:25,599
the equity that comes back to the city
um to either roll into the next

593
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:28,800
generation of vehicles or back into the
city's budget.

594
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:31,280
What about if there are ding scratches?
I mean, these are vehicles that will be

595
00:50:30,079 --> 00:50:36,000
heavy used.
>> We don't have wear and tear charges.

596
00:50:34,240 --> 00:50:41,520
Again, the only thing that's impacted
from dense dings, higher mileage is the

597
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:46,480
resale value that we get,
>> right? And so, we should expect sort of

598
00:50:44,559 --> 00:50:50,160
the prime resale value. We should expect
a lower resale value that

599
00:50:48,559 --> 00:50:54,240
» and at the end of the day, we do
anticipate um we we're very conservative

600
00:50:52,480 --> 00:50:59,280
with our resale values. So even what
we're projecting today is based on what

601
00:50:56,480 --> 00:51:04,000
we would expect for a typical city
vehicle. Um you know using being used

602
00:51:02,640 --> 00:51:08,319
the same way that any other city
vehicle. to to clarify, are you saying

603
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:14,640
that that when you were guessing resale
values for the proposed five vehicles in

604
00:51:10,319 --> 00:51:20,000
the packet, uh you were using uh
municipal use vehicles for plowing and

605
00:51:17,359 --> 00:51:23,839
and street maintenance vehicle resale
values after 50,000 miles of wear and

606
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:26,640
tear and hard breaking and things.
>> Yes. So, our fleet strategy team put

607
00:51:25,599 --> 00:51:30,720
those values together.
>> Is that written down anywhere?

608
00:51:28,880 --> 00:51:34,160
uh the the the resale value for
>> I'd like to I'd like to understand how

609
00:51:32,640 --> 00:51:38,559
you came up with the resale values
because you know as as you've all noted

610
00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:42,160
um your assumptions lead to this
incredibly rosy projection of how all

611
00:51:40,720 --> 00:51:45,040
this money is just going to come out of
thin air that we're currently

612
00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:48,640
squandering and and uh and that's how
you're going to make your end and the

613
00:51:46,319 --> 00:51:53,920
city's going to come out ahead. Um but
but I don't I I don't quite see the

614
00:51:51,760 --> 00:51:57,200
comparisons documented and so I'd like
to understand where they come from.

615
00:51:55,599 --> 00:52:00,640
» Yeah, absolutely. I can I can definitely
get Travis and the council as well the

616
00:51:59,119 --> 00:52:05,760
full kind of rundown of of what we
anticipate values to look like. Um but

617
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:12,000
everything we do is assuming um you know
fair or less than condition uh in in the

618
00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:15,520
state of government um you know
essentially treating them as as

619
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:20,559
commercial vehicles, right? So non um
and non- retail use um and we're

620
00:52:17,760 --> 00:52:24,480
assuming a level of wear and tear uh is
to be expected. So everything we're

621
00:52:22,160 --> 00:52:29,280
showing is is a conservative projection
with 80% of that um is what we're taking

622
00:52:27,440 --> 00:52:33,760
to to to Travis and building into our
analysis. Um I I haven't I haven't yet

623
00:52:32,240 --> 00:52:38,319
to see a time where we're not exceeding
on those expectations. I know we've seen

624
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:42,319
some some really big wins just recent
rec recently in our partnership with

625
00:52:39,520 --> 00:52:47,359
Mason City. Um but to answer your
question again, we're assuming mid-level

626
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:50,559
or worst condition uh commercially rated
vehicle as opposed to retail rated

627
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:53,920
vehicle. And with that comes the
assumption of some wear and tear, door

628
00:52:52,160 --> 00:52:55,839
dings, bed scratches, things of that
nature.

629
00:52:54,800 --> 00:52:58,640
» How long have you been working with
Mason City?

630
00:52:56,720 --> 00:53:02,800
» Um, I believe our partnerships, it's
either just coming up on six years or

631
00:53:00,559 --> 00:53:07,520
seven years.
>> And what what area do you cover? Like,

632
00:53:05,280 --> 00:53:14,800
uh, what what's your region as far as
the people you serve or lease vehicles?

633
00:53:11,359 --> 00:53:19,280
» Um, our local team is Iowa and Nebraska.
Um, however, we span across all 50

634
00:53:17,839 --> 00:53:22,240
states.
And we have municipalities.

635
00:53:20,640 --> 00:53:26,640
» Yeah. I was just curious like you two
like you're Iowa Nebraska.

636
00:53:24,240 --> 00:53:30,640
» Yes. Iowa Nebraska.
>> Mike, quick question. How's the street

637
00:53:28,640 --> 00:53:35,040
department? Would they are they have any
opposition? Are they all right with

638
00:53:32,079 --> 00:53:38,559
this? Do you think the 10,000 miles is a
fair projection for what we normally

639
00:53:36,720 --> 00:53:40,720
would put on? Probably. I would assume
less than that, but obviously we don't

640
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:42,319
know what the word brings.
>> Close to 10,000.

641
00:53:41,680 --> 00:53:46,559
» Not even close.
>> I' I've talked with Kevin about it and

642
00:53:44,400 --> 00:53:51,680
I've talked with Travis about it.
>> Okay.

643
00:53:48,240 --> 00:53:53,680
questions have been answered and um I
don't have any reservations right now.

644
00:53:53,119 --> 00:53:54,960
» Okay.
>> So,

645
00:53:54,000 --> 00:53:58,559
» good to know.
>> I do, but I I want to have that

646
00:53:56,319 --> 00:54:01,119
conversation as a council and so I want
to make sure that we've had a chance to

647
00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:05,680
ask the enterprise reps all the
questions that we need if others have

648
00:54:03,599 --> 00:54:10,400
questions for them.
>> Anyone else?

649
00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:12,640
» All right.
>> I have questions for Travis.

650
00:54:12,319 --> 00:54:16,880
» All right.
>> That maybe that might be helpful to the

651
00:54:14,559 --> 00:54:22,079
conversation. Um, Travis, can you talk
about where uh where in our budget lines

652
00:54:20,480 --> 00:54:25,280
lease payments would come from in
relation to it was different when we

653
00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:29,760
were looking at it in budget season and
purchasing.

654
00:54:26,079 --> 00:54:34,079
» Right. So, of the five listed here,
three of which were planned capital

655
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:42,400
replacements.
>> The two parks, right, both parks and one

656
00:54:38,640 --> 00:54:46,960
water, the street ones were not planned
replacements.

657
00:54:43,920 --> 00:54:52,880
Uh but we've already actually found a if
council if we move forward with this uh

658
00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:59,040
Mike actually just today uh it was
discovered our one plow that we're

659
00:54:55,440 --> 00:55:04,160
actually proposing to replace the the
unit cracked in half and so we have to

660
00:55:01,599 --> 00:55:11,440
replace the plow not the truck the plow
unit itself but that's 10,000

661
00:55:08,319 --> 00:55:16,559
$10,000. So that's where the funding
would come from one of these because

662
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:23,520
that's the full annual lease payment on
one of these. Uh the 3/4 ton ram.

663
00:55:21,920 --> 00:55:28,559
» I'm confused. The truck is fine. The
plow is broken. Like the front of it,

664
00:55:25,839 --> 00:55:33,680
» correct? So the plow mount itself just
to replace the plow unit is $10,000.

665
00:55:32,240 --> 00:55:36,800
» But this would replace the whole truck
and the plow

666
00:55:35,280 --> 00:55:41,680
» for the lease payment
>> for one year of the five. for one year

667
00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:46,240
of the five. So what what I was saying
is that we have a $10,000

668
00:55:44,720 --> 00:55:55,920
expense
with the plow that we would forego

669
00:55:51,200 --> 00:56:04,160
in lie of this for this fiscal season
and uh the other 10,000 we would call it

670
00:56:01,599 --> 00:56:10,079
uh would actually offset our maintenance
budget for was it the maintenance budget

671
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:17,359
Mike that we were talking about within
road use tax for the street one.

672
00:56:15,359 --> 00:56:22,319
» So that
the three that were budgeted as outright

673
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:28,640
capital purchases
were water and two out of parks.

674
00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:32,720
Water is a service. It's paid out of its
own enterprise fund. The two out of

675
00:56:30,079 --> 00:56:37,359
parks are general fund instead. So those
would be

676
00:56:35,440 --> 00:56:42,319
already covered within the general fund
budget. And did we um we paid that we

677
00:56:40,799 --> 00:56:46,559
allocated dollars for that in the budget
out of the general fund separate and

678
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:52,160
distinct from the park and wreck sort of
quote unquote standard budget.

679
00:56:49,760 --> 00:56:55,760
» They have to identify within their
budget as a whole that they that the

680
00:56:54,720 --> 00:56:58,640
council approves.
>> Yep.

681
00:56:56,400 --> 00:57:02,480
» They have to identify which account code
that's associated with.

682
00:57:00,079 --> 00:57:07,079
» So it is it would be associated. Yeah.
>> Correct. It's associated with an

683
00:57:04,079 --> 00:57:07,079
accountant.

684
00:57:08,400 --> 00:57:17,200
Um, I I don't think I'll be supporting
this path forward and I want to be

685
00:57:13,520 --> 00:57:21,680
really clear and and I'll only I'll try
to just say the one thing. It'll take a

686
00:57:19,119 --> 00:57:26,480
while though, so just bear with me. Um,
I think we're trying to solve a problem

687
00:57:23,119 --> 00:57:30,480
that's a real problem and uh and and I I
admire uh that that that we've

688
00:57:28,960 --> 00:57:36,480
identified, you know, one possible way
to address uh the age of our vehicles

689
00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:39,440
fleet. Um the the fact that our the
pressures on our budget have put us in a

690
00:57:38,079 --> 00:57:42,880
position where we kind of keep things
limping along as long as we possibly can

691
00:57:41,520 --> 00:57:46,319
to the point where there's holes in the
floor of some of our trucks and and

692
00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:51,280
things are breaking all the time and we
spend a lot of valuable staff time and

693
00:57:48,240 --> 00:57:56,400
city resources uh on constantly chasing
repairs. Uh my concern though is is

694
00:57:54,160 --> 00:58:01,040
largely with what I think is pretty
clearly an asymmetric information

695
00:57:59,119 --> 00:58:05,760
environment. And by that I mean that
that uh these wonderful people uh are

696
00:58:03,599 --> 00:58:09,440
very good at their jobs, I'm sure. Um
and and they they spend a lot of their

697
00:58:07,599 --> 00:58:13,040
time going in front of people like us
who don't enter into these kinds of

698
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:18,319
agreements except for once every five or
15 years to sell us on something. You

699
00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:22,480
know, that's that's how this works. Um
and and I don't know what the

700
00:58:20,240 --> 00:58:27,520
counterarguments are. I read I read this
language and I see what I know are not

701
00:58:25,040 --> 00:58:32,720
applesto apples comparisons between uh
the city's financial options. We're

702
00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:36,880
comparing um a uh you know a program
where where we buy cars through this

703
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:42,559
lease program. We we make the payments
of about $10,000 per car per year for

704
00:58:40,400 --> 00:58:45,839
five years. Like that's a half of a
full-timer that we could we could hire

705
00:58:44,079 --> 00:58:49,520
instead with that money. And then at the
end there the cars will have or the

706
00:58:47,440 --> 00:58:53,200
vehicles will have resale value, right?
Um and we just have to make a guess as

707
00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:57,440
to what that resale value is. And
enterprise has made some projections

708
00:58:54,799 --> 00:59:02,480
that do end up making things look rosy.
But again, we are very hard on our

709
00:58:59,839 --> 00:59:06,880
trucks. And it may be that we don't want
to sell or to to have a new vehicle

710
00:59:04,640 --> 00:59:11,440
every 5 years. So what will we do? We'll
we'll buy them from them right when the

711
00:59:09,599 --> 00:59:15,839
maintenance costs start ramping up
probably. Uh and and and then we'll be

712
00:59:14,319 --> 00:59:19,760
responsible for the maintenance. In the
meantime, the maintenance plan, which

713
00:59:18,079 --> 00:59:23,760
sounds like a big selling fee, right? we
don't have to take care of things for

714
00:59:20,880 --> 00:59:27,119
the first 5 years are covering uh
vehicles that probably won't have a

715
00:59:25,119 --> 00:59:30,400
whole lot of things come up because or
if they do come up, we would have them

716
00:59:28,799 --> 00:59:33,760
covered under warranty under any other
purchase agreement. And furthermore,

717
00:59:32,400 --> 00:59:38,559
this maintenance agreement doesn't cover
the two major recurring costs, tires and

718
00:59:36,799 --> 00:59:42,480
brakes. That's especially a major
recurring cost in the kinds of vehicles

719
00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:47,760
that we use for street work and for
plowing. And so personally, I'm not

720
00:59:45,599 --> 00:59:52,319
comfortable with the quality of the
comparison we're getting between uh the

721
00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:58,240
status quo, which we should not
continue. It costs us too much money,

722
00:59:54,799 --> 01:00:03,760
but then this possible alternative where
I don't I got to say I just don't trust

723
01:00:01,359 --> 01:00:08,160
it. Um and and and that's not anything
to do with YouTube or Enterprise.

724
01:00:06,559 --> 01:00:12,319
Believe me, if you were Herz here, I
would say it was something to do with

725
01:00:09,599 --> 01:00:15,839
you because Hertz completely jobbed me
uh the last time I rented a car. But uh

726
01:00:14,480 --> 01:00:19,119
so far, Enterprise has been pretty
decent to work with personally and uh

727
01:00:17,599 --> 01:00:24,079
and I have no reason to think we as a
city shouldn't consider a good deal for

728
01:00:21,920 --> 01:00:28,559
us. I also don't have enough reason to
know that this is a good deal. And in

729
01:00:26,240 --> 01:00:32,160
particular, uh, the kinds of things that
that would help me understand better if

730
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:36,640
this was a good deal would be a true
applesto apples comparison showing the

731
01:00:34,480 --> 01:00:40,400
city, uh, seeking his own financing,
purchasing these same vehicles, if we

732
01:00:38,960 --> 01:00:44,000
really would purchase these five
vehicles if it was, you know, upfront

733
01:00:42,400 --> 01:00:48,160
payments with cash dollars. I don't
think we probably would buy all five at

734
01:00:46,160 --> 01:00:51,280
this this fit and trim level. I think
this is more vehicle than probably we

735
01:00:49,680 --> 01:00:54,799
need if we really ask those hard
questions. Uh, so but but let's just say

736
01:00:53,200 --> 01:00:58,400
we bought all five of these vehicles.
what kind of interest rates would we get

737
01:00:56,400 --> 01:01:01,680
on those? Um, Enterprise has already
done some work for us, so we know after

738
01:01:00,000 --> 01:01:05,760
five years what they think they'll be
worth after five years of nominal city

739
01:01:03,440 --> 01:01:09,520
use. Uh, we we can we can do the math
and figure out if that's a better

740
01:01:07,359 --> 01:01:14,160
comparison. And I'd like to see us do
it. Now, the downside of that is our

741
01:01:11,839 --> 01:01:18,480
staff are busy. They work hard. And this
is a clean solution where we sign paper,

742
01:01:16,720 --> 01:01:21,680
we pay money, they find savings.
Presumably, they're better at finding

743
01:01:19,920 --> 01:01:26,240
vehicles and probably they're better at
selling vehicles than we as a city are.

744
01:01:23,839 --> 01:01:30,000
Um, I don't know how much of that you're
being better at selling vehicles goes

745
01:01:27,680 --> 01:01:35,680
away in charging us $500 to sell our
vehicle though. Um, especially do you

746
01:01:32,880 --> 01:01:40,240
charge us 500 to sell it to us?
>> Like if if we bought it from you? No.

747
01:01:37,839 --> 01:01:41,920
» The $500 wouldn't or if we bought it if
we bought out the lease at the end of

748
01:01:41,359 --> 01:01:46,559
five years?
>> Uh, no. That uh that fee typically is is

749
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:51,119
just enough to cover like auction or
>> That's that's helpful. So, I I I get

750
01:01:49,440 --> 01:01:54,000
that they bring some efficiencies to
this and I get that it may be that

751
01:01:52,559 --> 01:01:57,280
something like this is the best path
forward to the city, but I don't think

752
01:01:55,680 --> 01:02:01,680
it'd be smart of us as a council to
proceed without at least pricing out

753
01:02:00,000 --> 01:02:04,880
what kind of competitive interest rates
we can get on these new vehicles. Maybe

754
01:02:03,440 --> 01:02:08,559
we need to start making payments on
cars. Um, and that's that's kind of my

755
01:02:07,440 --> 01:02:14,480
speech about why I don't think we should
move forward tonight. And I want to say

756
01:02:10,319 --> 01:02:21,760
a second thing, much shorter. Um,
I'm not comfortable with a city of

757
01:02:18,000 --> 01:02:28,160
Decor's size needing to make payments to
afford vehicles. I don't think that

758
01:02:24,319 --> 01:02:32,640
reflects uh the kind of future planning
that we as a as a community are capable

759
01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:37,599
of and it doesn't reflect uh the
financial resources that that a a city

760
01:02:35,359 --> 01:02:43,280
with a $13 million or whatever annual
budget should be able to to to leverage

761
01:02:40,480 --> 01:02:49,119
for purchases that are between 25 and 60
or $75,000.

762
01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:52,240
Um, I I understand that budget pressures
make it so that we end up just keeping

763
01:02:50,480 --> 01:02:57,200
things limping along and along and along
and we can't afford to to do it. And so

764
01:02:54,400 --> 01:03:03,200
this this seems like a way out, but I'd
rather take a really hard look at where

765
01:03:00,559 --> 01:03:06,480
we do spend our money and find ways to I
I I know we've all tried to look for

766
01:03:04,799 --> 01:03:11,040
ways to cut, you know, this mythical
waste that we're all searching for all

767
01:03:07,839 --> 01:03:17,039
the time. Um, but
if we can't afford $50,000 for a broken

768
01:03:14,160 --> 01:03:21,920
park truck, what are we doing?
And so I personally would like to see us

769
01:03:19,359 --> 01:03:25,440
proceed another way. Um, and my last
question, and this truly isn't a gotcha,

770
01:03:23,680 --> 01:03:30,400
okay? I I hope I hope you understand
that these are good faith questions. I'm

771
01:03:27,039 --> 01:03:34,400
doing my very best to represent um
people who whose cost of housing is

772
01:03:32,880 --> 01:03:40,559
partially affected by these kinds of
decisions. Um,

773
01:03:38,000 --> 01:03:45,760
what interest rates are assumed in your
payment models?

774
01:03:43,839 --> 01:03:49,200
And it's and and I guess here's why I'm
asking you, just so you don't think it's

775
01:03:46,799 --> 01:03:53,039
a gotcha question. I did the math and I
think it's like 10%. And I feel like we

776
01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:57,200
could do better as a city, but maybe I'm
I'm not a banker. So, could you could

777
01:03:54,960 --> 01:04:00,960
you explain to me how you all came up
with with the interest rate?

778
01:03:59,280 --> 01:04:06,799
» Yeah. So, the interest rate is based on
the three-year T bill plus 200 or 300

779
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:11,200
basis points. Um, but I do want to also
make sure that you're aware that the the

780
01:04:09,200 --> 01:04:17,280
um the lease payment is what it's
labeled as. Um, that also includes the

781
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:20,000
uh management fee for the resources and
everything behind enterprise,

782
01:04:18,799 --> 01:04:22,880
» right? And the maintenance the
maintenance is a separate charge on top

783
01:04:21,680 --> 01:04:27,520
of that though. Is that I'm
understanding that right. So, so

784
01:04:25,200 --> 01:04:31,520
fiveyear T-Bo plus three
>> three year

785
01:04:28,000 --> 01:04:36,319
» three year plus three great and T bills
have been getting worse and worse like

786
01:04:33,920 --> 01:04:40,280
they've been going up. So I I'm I'm a no
on this and I think I've said enough.

787
01:04:41,039 --> 01:04:46,240
» I try to want I kind of want to
understand some things and I want to see

788
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:50,799
if I have pieced together.
>> So when we purchase let's say that we

789
01:04:49,119 --> 01:04:54,319
want to purchase a vehicle after five
years do we get credit for our payments

790
01:04:52,400 --> 01:04:59,440
or not? Reason I asked that is because I
was confused about the

791
01:04:57,599 --> 01:05:07,240
chart that says sum of payment minus
resale. What is that column telling me?

792
01:05:03,520 --> 01:05:07,240
It's on page

793
01:05:09,119 --> 01:05:15,440
I don't know
>> page 68.

794
01:05:11,119 --> 01:05:20,400
» Well, I'm looking at the the B
uh 9b

795
01:05:17,680 --> 01:05:25,839
the individual.
So it says anticipated equity at the end

796
01:05:22,079 --> 01:05:30,520
of term, sum of payments minus resale,
cash purchase minus resale.

797
01:05:31,520 --> 01:05:35,599
» I can feel that one.
>> Yeah, I thought you were. Sorry.

798
01:05:34,079 --> 01:05:40,559
» I'm sorry. You were looking over there.
Um yeah, again, that's just comparing um

799
01:05:37,760 --> 01:05:45,359
if you went out today, paid cash for uh
you know, for a $50,000 truck, uh ran

800
01:05:43,680 --> 01:05:48,319
it, ran it for its lifetime, and then
resold it, what is your what is really

801
01:05:47,039 --> 01:05:51,359
your sum of payments look like at the
end of its lifetime? Ah, so that really

802
01:05:49,920 --> 01:05:54,559
has nothing to do with what we're paying
for the vehicle.

803
01:05:52,880 --> 01:05:58,240
» Yeah, that that would be at the end of
at the end of its life uh what the

804
01:05:56,559 --> 01:06:03,200
investment would be essentially.
>> Got it. Okay.

805
01:06:01,280 --> 01:06:06,000
» If we were to let's take one of the
vehicles, right? Because it's nice just

806
01:06:04,640 --> 01:06:09,839
to have a case scenario. Absolutely.
Okay. So, let's start with the one that

807
01:06:07,680 --> 01:06:14,000
is essentially closest to 10,000 because
I like round numbers, which is the half

808
01:06:11,520 --> 01:06:18,400
ton pickup truck. No, I lied. Sorry.
Yeah, it is. Right. So, 9500, but let's

809
01:06:16,240 --> 01:06:23,280
just round it to 10. Okay. So, let's say
that we make five years, $50,000 worth

810
01:06:21,200 --> 01:06:25,520
of payments for that vehicle. What would
it cost us to buy that vehicle at the

811
01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:28,799
end of that?
>> Absolutely. There should be a column

812
01:06:26,720 --> 01:06:32,160
there uh that shows the residual value
and that's essentially the value that

813
01:06:30,240 --> 01:06:35,839
we've written down the lease term for.
So, at the end of five years, um I'm not

814
01:06:34,400 --> 01:06:40,480
sure which what it is off the top of my
head. Um say it's written down to a

815
01:06:37,839 --> 01:06:43,680
$6,000 residual. At the end of that
fiveyear period, the city determined

816
01:06:42,079 --> 01:06:47,680
that it wanted to purchase that vehicle
and hold on to it for a longer period.

817
01:06:45,599 --> 01:06:52,319
That's all that's remaining. um on the
vehicle. So, be that $5,000 purchase,

818
01:06:49,839 --> 01:06:56,400
whether that's one time or spread evenly
across another 12-month period. Uh

819
01:06:54,960 --> 01:07:00,319
regardless, that's all that's owed on
the vehicle. Alternatively, we would of

820
01:06:58,400 --> 01:07:03,440
course recommend that we resell that
vehicle at the end of its lifetime. Um

821
01:07:02,240 --> 01:07:06,640
that difference would come out of its
resale value and the remaining cash

822
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:11,359
would go back into the city.
>> Okay. So, what you're saying essentially

823
01:07:08,720 --> 01:07:15,680
if we bought a
we'd be buying a $60,000 vehicle at the

824
01:07:13,520 --> 01:07:19,440
end of five years. We paid 50. We have
10 left to pay. We'd pay $60,000 for a

825
01:07:18,319 --> 01:07:20,880
truck.
>> That's how the math would work out.

826
01:07:20,559 --> 01:07:24,480
Yeah.
>> Right. So then what would it cost us to

827
01:07:22,559 --> 01:07:28,480
just buy that cut truck out outright on
day one?

828
01:07:25,839 --> 01:07:32,839
» That one was
>> 43, right?

829
01:07:29,839 --> 01:07:32,839
» 43,370.

830
01:07:33,119 --> 01:07:39,200
» Yes.
>> Okay. So it's a $15,000 difference

831
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:42,960
between leasing it or buying it, but
that doesn't account for any maintenance

832
01:07:40,640 --> 01:07:49,880
on it. So the question I would have in
my mind is in five years do we spend

833
01:07:45,200 --> 01:07:49,880
$15,000 on maintenance of a vehicle?

834
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:54,839
» First five probably not

835
01:07:55,200 --> 01:08:01,960
» and then in the second five
we spent 15

836
01:08:04,160 --> 01:08:11,920
» near the end of it gets closer to that.
I mean that's I mean I have to I have to

837
01:08:08,079 --> 01:08:16,560
think in simple terms for my residential
you know small budget brain because it

838
01:08:14,079 --> 01:08:21,600
to me it's like what's the that's how I
make every economic decision like what

839
01:08:18,480 --> 01:08:26,000
it what is my long-term gain and what
does it really do to my budget? Am I

840
01:08:23,120 --> 01:08:31,279
actually making an investment? So when I
look at the $15,000 difference if we

841
01:08:28,400 --> 01:08:35,359
bought it outright now or we bought it
in five years which is 15,000 I guess I

842
01:08:34,159 --> 01:08:41,359
need to be a little bit convinced why
that $1,000 is worth it because multiply

843
01:08:38,159 --> 01:08:46,759
that by five right now we're looking at
a lot more than I want to do math.

844
01:08:46,799 --> 01:08:50,319
» Can I
>> Anybody can explain.

845
01:08:48,799 --> 01:08:55,120
» Yeah. So, one one thing I'll add as well
is that that the resale factor is is a

846
01:08:52,319 --> 01:08:58,400
big piece. What's um what's calculating
ultimately like what we call total cost

847
01:08:57,199 --> 01:09:01,839
of ownership. It's all over our
documents. is everything we do is just

848
01:09:00,239 --> 01:09:06,719
looking at the vehicle, determining what
it's costing the city to operate to to

849
01:09:04,319 --> 01:09:10,000
fulfill its needs over its lifetime. Um,
and to your point, would it have cost

850
01:09:08,319 --> 01:09:14,319
$15,000
um to maintain a vehicle in the first

851
01:09:11,600 --> 01:09:17,359
five years? Almost certainly not right
at the end of a 10-year period, we are

852
01:09:16,159 --> 01:09:20,000
getting closer there. And especially
when you factor in things like brakes

853
01:09:18,799 --> 01:09:24,719
and tires, which we have, of course,
admitted from our analysis, um, very

854
01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:28,880
close. And and to I think your point
earlier, really what the city's doing is

855
01:09:26,560 --> 01:09:33,440
operating them for 15 or closer to 15 in
some cases. And so what what we've done

856
01:09:31,359 --> 01:09:37,440
and what we've built and uh hopefully
you guys have that kind of 10-year

857
01:09:35,040 --> 01:09:41,920
analysis available to you is really just
saying if we make a few small changes or

858
01:09:40,400 --> 01:09:46,400
the city makes a few small changes and
how it manages it manages its vehicles

859
01:09:43,920 --> 01:09:49,759
today, what you'll see is not only some
cost reduction on the front end for the

860
01:09:47,839 --> 01:09:53,440
types of vehicles that we purchase. Um
Stephen, you made a great point about

861
01:09:51,040 --> 01:09:58,320
the trim levels. Um everything built has
been in conjunction with Travis. Um, but

862
01:09:56,080 --> 01:10:01,520
you often are saving from ordering from
a manufacturer like we'd recommend

863
01:09:59,920 --> 01:10:05,760
versus buying what's available on the
lot. So, there's cost savings on the

864
01:10:03,199 --> 01:10:09,199
front end. By operating a newer vehicle,
we're paying significantly less in

865
01:10:07,360 --> 01:10:12,719
maintenance over its lifetime to the
point where our organization is willing

866
01:10:10,719 --> 01:10:18,000
to to roll the dice and take the risk on
your behalf. And and to Stephen's point

867
01:10:15,280 --> 01:10:21,360
again, like we're avoiding significant
uh repair costs that would be covered by

868
01:10:19,760 --> 01:10:25,440
warranty because we're operating more
vehicles. And then as we get throughout

869
01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:29,920
its lifetime and eventually resell the
vehicle, ideally we're reselling a

870
01:10:27,360 --> 01:10:35,920
5-year-old pickup truck with 25 to
30,000 miles on it and able to take that

871
01:10:33,199 --> 01:10:39,520
15 to $20,000 worth of equity to put it
down on what we'd call like the second

872
01:10:37,600 --> 01:10:44,159
generation vehicle. So instead of
starting with the $50,000 pickup truck

873
01:10:42,159 --> 01:10:48,560
that we're riding down to a $10,000
residual or 5,000 whatever we agreed on

874
01:10:46,400 --> 01:10:52,800
$5,000 residual, we're rolling that
extra 15 or $20,000 into it. So we're

875
01:10:50,880 --> 01:10:55,760
financing even less of the vehicle,
right? So the program really gets to be

876
01:10:54,480 --> 01:11:00,000
that like kind of self-funding,
self-sustainable model. So you're paying

877
01:10:58,080 --> 01:11:04,239
less out the door every month and then
reciprocating it over its lifetime. And

878
01:11:02,400 --> 01:11:07,600
what you'll see in that 10-year analysis
is just saying, "Hey, if we take the

879
01:11:05,600 --> 01:11:11,199
equity that's in the fleet today, right?
We sell those trucks. Some may maybe

880
01:11:09,600 --> 01:11:14,719
only worth a couple thousand dollars,
but replace the ones that probably

881
01:11:12,800 --> 01:11:18,239
aren't on your guys' radar for the next
three or four years sooner, we can

882
01:11:16,640 --> 01:11:21,199
capture that equity and get closer to
that second generation vehicle to begin

883
01:11:20,560 --> 01:11:24,080
with.
>> Even if the second generational vehicles

884
01:11:22,800 --> 01:11:28,159
are already going to cost more than
first generation first place, so if we

885
01:11:26,159 --> 01:11:32,400
have $15,000 extra that we're putting in
a second gen vehicle, we probably buy a

886
01:11:30,320 --> 01:11:35,679
vehicle that costs more than first gen.
>> Yeah.

887
01:11:32,800 --> 01:11:40,320
» Yes. But the the almost certainly over a
fiveyear period, it's not going to

888
01:11:37,520 --> 01:11:44,880
increase by $15,000. So you would be
spending less in the second generation,

889
01:11:42,560 --> 01:11:48,640
which is why many of our municipalities
and our nonprofits who get to take

890
01:11:46,480 --> 01:11:52,800
advantage of really high upfront
incentives are actually spending less

891
01:11:51,120 --> 01:11:56,880
and sometimes getting paid on the back
end of the for the vehicle when they

892
01:11:54,719 --> 01:12:01,280
resell it because it can be sold for
more than what we ended up paying for

893
01:11:58,880 --> 01:12:07,600
it. Um, additionally, I do want to back
to um I mean you brought up interest as

894
01:12:04,560 --> 01:12:12,560
well. Um we have very very flexible
terms. So if it is the preference of the

895
01:12:10,080 --> 01:12:17,840
city to purchase the like to pay the
vehicle down to a dollar at the at the

896
01:12:14,480 --> 01:12:22,719
onset of that's 100% an option that we
can offer you and that offsets the cost

897
01:12:20,320 --> 01:12:26,480
of of the interest. But at the end of
the day when we look at it from a total

898
01:12:24,239 --> 01:12:30,640
cost of ownership from like the resale
or from the purchase like the

899
01:12:27,920 --> 01:12:34,880
acquisition cost to the resale side the
cost of ownership. The interest is a

900
01:12:32,719 --> 01:12:39,120
very very small factor and I I don't
want that to be something that's being

901
01:12:36,239 --> 01:12:43,679
skipped is that the the shortened life
cycle is really in the reselling of the

902
01:12:41,199 --> 01:12:48,960
vehicle at the right time and that um
cost avoidance of the higher fuel and

903
01:12:45,600 --> 01:12:54,040
the higher maintenance is really the the
value proposition that Enterprise brings

904
01:12:50,719 --> 01:12:54,040
to our municipalities.

905
01:12:54,159 --> 01:12:59,520
» John, can I put you on the spot for a
second? Did you have a chance to look

906
01:12:56,960 --> 01:13:02,159
over the master lease agreement? And
>> if so, were there anything maybe that

907
01:13:01,120 --> 01:13:05,280
did you see anything that raised your
eyebrow or anything that

908
01:13:03,679 --> 01:13:08,480
» Let me I was just looking back. I
reviewed it months ago. Sure.

909
01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:11,360
» Um
>> just wondering if there was anything

910
01:13:09,760 --> 01:13:19,040
that maybe
>> you didn't like or questioned.

911
01:13:15,520 --> 01:13:25,520
There were some comments, but I think
either all or most were added into

912
01:13:24,159 --> 01:13:30,000
the new lease.
>> Yeah. And I don't I I I don't know if I

913
01:13:27,760 --> 01:13:34,560
saw the most updated one. My initial
review, uh I wanted to make sure the

914
01:13:32,000 --> 01:13:39,360
language was clear that the city had the
option to purchase the vehicles because

915
01:13:36,960 --> 01:13:46,000
the original agreement I saw, uh the
language was clearly only a lease. uh

916
01:13:43,520 --> 01:13:50,080
and to make sure there was a a schedule
for what those um purchases would be.

917
01:13:48,560 --> 01:13:54,360
And I think that those questions have
been answered. Um

918
01:14:02,000 --> 01:14:05,920
» Travis, what what do you believe the
cost savings to the city is over five

919
01:14:05,360 --> 01:14:08,320
years?
>> Sorry, can John finish?

920
01:14:07,360 --> 01:14:12,560
» Oh, sorry. I thought he was
>> Yeah, sorry. Sorry, I was going through

921
01:14:09,280 --> 01:14:16,960
my notes because I from before um I had
a question on there's a term in the

922
01:14:14,800 --> 01:14:23,280
lease about you can't uh transport
hazardous vehicles and I think uh my

923
01:14:19,920 --> 01:14:27,040
concern was well street department or
police department would there be any

924
01:14:25,040 --> 01:14:32,800
issue? I I don't the police department
isn't involved with this lease so that's

925
01:14:29,840 --> 01:14:36,480
a non-issue. Uh I'm not sure about the
street department for the vehicles that

926
01:14:34,960 --> 01:14:42,159
are being purchased. It looks like
they're smaller trucks, so you wouldn't

927
01:14:38,880 --> 01:14:45,159
be transporting any hazardous material.
Um,

928
01:14:47,760 --> 01:14:57,120
» water can be dangerous, John.
>> Well, depending on where you get it. Uh,

929
01:14:55,520 --> 01:15:02,640
and then I had questions about the
maintenance and I think costs of

930
01:14:59,440 --> 01:15:07,520
maintenance and what
maintenance the city is responsible for.

931
01:15:05,679 --> 01:15:10,640
And again, I'm going off of my prior
review. I think there's some

932
01:15:08,880 --> 01:15:15,199
maintenance, routine maintenance, like
oil changes that the city pays for. No,

933
01:15:14,000 --> 01:15:17,600
that's all included.
>> Those are uh included in the program.

934
01:15:17,280 --> 01:15:19,600
» Okay.
>> Tires and brakes are the two things that

935
01:15:19,120 --> 01:15:21,679
Steve brought.
>> Tires and brakes are not included. Not

936
01:15:21,360 --> 01:15:26,000
included,
>> just to be clear. Yeah,

937
01:15:22,719 --> 01:15:32,159
» not included. Um and then I had a
question on uh the warranty. Uh again,

938
01:15:29,679 --> 01:15:36,800
I'm going off of the agreement I saw. Uh
it said Lesor makes no representation or

939
01:15:34,640 --> 01:15:43,199
warranty of any kind express or implied
with respect to any vehicle um uh in

940
01:15:40,880 --> 01:15:48,800
regards to condition, merchantability or
fitness for any uh particular purpose.

941
01:15:45,760 --> 01:15:55,120
vehicles are leased as is and that's I
wanted to make sure that in fact they

942
01:15:52,080 --> 01:16:00,239
are warranted and if the uh that the
vehicles will if there is a problem and

943
01:15:58,400 --> 01:16:06,080
are pro who pays for it you know just to
make sure that's clear and it looks like

944
01:16:02,000 --> 01:16:09,600
that's has been cleared up.
>> So you're saying some concessions have

945
01:16:07,760 --> 01:16:12,000
been made and they've met us kind of in
the middle or at least

946
01:16:10,640 --> 01:16:16,640
» concessions and it might have been in a
in a a schedule or an addendum. I didn't

947
01:16:14,640 --> 01:16:20,560
actually see
>> they they actually edited the lease

948
01:16:18,880 --> 01:16:23,440
agreement and sent us a new lease
agreement with those comments.

949
01:16:21,920 --> 01:16:28,159
» Yeah. And I I know there was another one
that I saw where they address some of

950
01:16:25,120 --> 01:16:31,040
the uh like where you return the vehicle
when you're done with it.

951
01:16:29,600 --> 01:16:34,560
» Yes.
>> Remind me again who the cities are Mason

952
01:16:33,520 --> 01:16:38,480
City in our area
>> that we currently work with. Um yeah, so

953
01:16:36,320 --> 01:16:45,520
the cities of Mason City and the first
two line here in Iowa. Um I know just in

954
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:49,199
the last last month's council meeting
Dodge also just approved our program so

955
01:16:47,840 --> 01:16:53,600
we working really closely with Ryan mail
over there

956
01:16:51,280 --> 01:16:58,800
» and then um I know we work with city of
Austin as well in

957
01:16:56,640 --> 01:17:07,120
» while not a city Luther College has
added them a few months ago as well

958
01:17:03,920 --> 01:17:11,040
» it seems to summarize I mean I feel like
it's really I I'm not sure if we all

959
01:17:09,440 --> 01:17:14,719
still understand this I think this is
important for us to understand before we

960
01:17:12,640 --> 01:17:19,199
commit to it So, I'm going to say what I
think this agreement gets us and and I'd

961
01:17:17,280 --> 01:17:23,920
like to be corrected if I'm wrong or if
people think I'm wrong. I think in ex

962
01:17:22,000 --> 01:17:28,800
like we're kind of the benefits to us
are uh are administrative convenience.

963
01:17:27,120 --> 01:17:32,960
Um that's that's a big one that right
now uh buying a vehicle takes hours of

964
01:17:31,520 --> 01:17:36,960
staff time and so so we sort of
outsource the administrative functions.

965
01:17:35,120 --> 01:17:40,320
So in terms of council goals, we've
established as a council goal

966
01:17:38,640 --> 01:17:43,360
identifying ways that we can outsource
functions from our overworked

967
01:17:41,600 --> 01:17:49,199
administration. And to me that seems
like a valuable thing and and worth

968
01:17:45,440 --> 01:17:53,199
pursuing. Um and in addition we get uh
the conversion of occasional really big

969
01:17:51,360 --> 01:17:58,560
hits to the city budget which are harder
and harder to manage. Uh instead of that

970
01:17:55,760 --> 01:18:03,040
we get kind of a steady commitment to a
monthly payment pretty much in

971
01:18:00,239 --> 01:18:08,159
perpetuity. Um that's I bet how this
ends up working. Um, and we get access

972
01:18:06,239 --> 01:18:11,840
to enterprises expertise that we don't
have in house in terms of procuring

973
01:18:10,239 --> 01:18:16,640
vehicles that we maybe couldn't buy on
the open market at lower trim levels.

974
01:18:14,320 --> 01:18:19,280
Uh, and and we get not having to deal
with maintenance stuff except for tires

975
01:18:18,159 --> 01:18:23,280
and brakes, although those are pretty
big deals. Uh, and maybe some of that

976
01:18:21,840 --> 01:18:28,000
maintenance stuff would be under covered
under warranty. And we get um a partner

977
01:18:26,239 --> 01:18:32,080
in making a decision about what to do
after 5 years or seven or 10, just kind

978
01:18:30,239 --> 01:18:38,480
of whatever we identify as a service
life. Um, and what we're giving up is is

979
01:18:35,679 --> 01:18:43,679
uh is and I think this is the big one, a
number of dollars. Um, some of which is

980
01:18:41,520 --> 01:18:48,480
gathered from those efficiencies, but
quite a bit of it is gathered from that

981
01:18:45,280 --> 01:18:54,560
interest rate. And, uh, and for me, um,
I don't, you know, I'm sorry, that's my

982
01:18:51,040 --> 01:18:56,880
summary. Um, am I missing something,
>> Travis? Does that seem like Okay.

983
01:18:56,560 --> 01:18:59,679
» No,
>> thank you.

984
01:18:58,239 --> 01:19:03,520
» I think you're pretty right. It was
pretty complicated and and I

985
01:19:01,679 --> 01:19:08,000
» see them write that down. But
>> my my grandpa told me never to make a

986
01:19:05,840 --> 01:19:11,520
deal I didn't understand. I I've not
followed his advice always, but I want

987
01:19:09,920 --> 01:19:14,960
to do better. And there's a lot of deals
that come to us that I don't understand.

988
01:19:13,280 --> 01:19:19,440
So,
>> um what happens if Okay, so we generally

989
01:19:17,679 --> 01:19:24,239
have a maintenance vehicle replacement
schedule.

990
01:19:20,880 --> 01:19:27,280
» So, we did not have five years vehicles.
We did not have five vehicles on our

991
01:19:25,520 --> 01:19:30,800
schedule this year. Next year, we
probably have two or three.

992
01:19:29,440 --> 01:19:37,840
So,
>> the the one vehicle on there that

993
01:19:34,560 --> 01:19:42,719
probably raised a few eyebrows is the
2007.

994
01:19:40,159 --> 01:19:47,120
It's a 17, right, Mike? Yeah, there's a
2017.

995
01:19:44,400 --> 01:19:53,440
And the reason for
uh pushing or excuse me, not pushing,

996
01:19:50,159 --> 01:19:58,800
but there would be one street vehicle
replaced next year, the 2012

997
01:19:56,400 --> 01:20:05,600
uh as part of our replacement, but the
17 listed here has given us nothing but

998
01:20:02,560 --> 01:20:10,560
issues. That is not one that's one we
would look to sell. Um it's been a

999
01:20:08,000 --> 01:20:15,360
maintenance nightmare and so that's one
of the reasons that's that's on the

1000
01:20:13,360 --> 01:20:20,880
list. But yes, next year would have had
at least one street truck uh replaced

1001
01:20:17,760 --> 01:20:27,360
for it. Um but what it typically ends up
happening, less so on the street side,

1002
01:20:24,000 --> 01:20:30,880
more park wreck. Um anything general
fund related, we've gone through this

1003
01:20:28,880 --> 01:20:35,600
process enough times where many of you
have partaken this. You get the list of

1004
01:20:33,520 --> 01:20:38,560
capital improvements that are submitted
by department heads and you get a lot of

1005
01:20:37,120 --> 01:20:44,159
them that have red lines crossed through
them, right? And so to Stephen's comment

1006
01:20:41,440 --> 01:20:50,000
earlier about when these higherend
oneoff purchases come up, if we're

1007
01:20:46,719 --> 01:20:57,440
trying to budget in the general fund
to to have a black positive number

1008
01:20:55,199 --> 01:21:01,440
operationally,
those tend to be what's cut off the

1009
01:20:59,440 --> 01:21:05,120
list. If it's something that still
works,

1010
01:21:03,440 --> 01:21:11,040
but we're trying to be proactive in the
replacement, we typically don't do that

1011
01:21:08,480 --> 01:21:15,040
because we have to cut other things to
make that happen, especially within the

1012
01:21:13,679 --> 01:21:19,679
general fund.
>> So, I think Oh,

1013
01:21:16,800 --> 01:21:23,199
» no. I I just wanted to ask on that
because how do we how do we cash flow

1014
01:21:21,280 --> 01:21:27,280
that, right? So, this is going to be 70
$72,000 out of the general fund to pay

1015
01:21:25,120 --> 01:21:32,960
for five vehicles. But now, what if we
need another vehicle? we either add it

1016
01:21:29,440 --> 01:21:35,840
to the lease or we buy it outright. So
at some point are we going to be

1017
01:21:34,000 --> 01:21:40,159
spending $120,000 out of the general
fund on vehicles and that's a lot more

1018
01:21:37,760 --> 01:21:45,280
than the one vehicle that we buy every
year or the two vehicles.

1019
01:21:41,760 --> 01:21:53,760
» Yeah. So one of the reasons of with this
being um again five vehicles proposed

1020
01:21:51,040 --> 01:22:00,080
the two parks ones are the general fund
need we need to get these two replaced.

1021
01:21:57,760 --> 01:22:07,440
Those are the hardest ones for us to us
to budget every year. Water side, it's

1022
01:22:04,000 --> 01:22:12,480
an enterprise fund. It's uh we can
incorporate that into our water rate

1023
01:22:09,920 --> 01:22:18,480
analysis.
It's a lot easier to offset or to be

1024
01:22:15,440 --> 01:22:24,159
able to afford those water purchases,
sewer purchases,

1025
01:22:21,520 --> 01:22:29,199
street less. So that's road use tax.
Those are dollars that come from the

1026
01:22:25,760 --> 01:22:37,199
state on a per capita basis,
but most of those go towards wages for

1027
01:22:33,199 --> 01:22:42,000
the street department. So, we have um a
lot of that already kind of earmarked as

1028
01:22:39,760 --> 01:22:47,280
well.
We would still use road use tax dollars

1029
01:22:44,159 --> 01:22:53,040
to pay for the street portion that we
need to, but it's a much smaller. Again,

1030
01:22:50,239 --> 01:22:58,480
it's the same with the general fund.
Instead of one large capital project

1031
01:22:55,440 --> 01:23:05,080
cost, you're spreading it out and easier
to incorporate into your operational

1032
01:23:00,239 --> 01:23:05,080
expense if it's only 10,000 a year.

1033
01:23:05,360 --> 01:23:10,159
» Um,
this is not meant to be a tangent and I

1034
01:23:08,800 --> 01:23:14,320
so I'm going to like try to put it in a
box and then come back here. Um, I do

1035
01:23:12,400 --> 01:23:20,639
think that there's an opportunity for us
to uh look at improving our vehicle

1036
01:23:17,760 --> 01:23:25,040
purchase maintenance process. And what
you're just describing, Travis, is the

1037
01:23:23,360 --> 01:23:31,600
pain point that I'd like to see
different. That the purchasing a vehicle

1038
01:23:27,920 --> 01:23:36,800
right now is a, oh, we have a big dollar
amount and we need to budget this year.

1039
01:23:34,159 --> 01:23:42,080
And I'd love to be in a position where
when we purchase a vehicle, we are every

1040
01:23:39,760 --> 01:23:45,120
year allocating not only the payment of
that vehicle, however that was

1041
01:23:43,120 --> 01:23:50,000
organized, but the the department is
also putting money in the maintenance

1042
01:23:47,760 --> 01:23:55,040
fund, putting money in the replacement
fund. Like this is a one-time purchase

1043
01:23:52,960 --> 01:24:00,800
over these years, and we know it will
have to be replaced. And how can we

1044
01:23:56,560 --> 01:24:06,880
become mindful of that earlier on? Um,
and I

1045
01:24:03,120 --> 01:24:11,840
I know that's complicated and I think I
and I and I believe it's important,

1046
01:24:08,639 --> 01:24:17,440
right? So, how does managing vehicles
across the city become regular and

1047
01:24:14,400 --> 01:24:21,360
routine, which may mean we restrict cash
going out for other projects and

1048
01:24:18,960 --> 01:24:27,760
prioritize maintaining or being ready to
purchase again.

1049
01:24:24,480 --> 01:24:33,440
I see the argument here that we could
just lease the vehicles and then we

1050
01:24:29,679 --> 01:24:41,679
don't have to do that. And I am worried
that a five-year lease is just avoiding

1051
01:24:37,760 --> 01:24:46,639
this this practical budget pro problem
that every city has. How do we maintain

1052
01:24:43,840 --> 01:24:50,719
what we have with rising costs? We're
just kicking it down five years and then

1053
01:24:49,280 --> 01:24:55,120
probably many of us won't be sitting
here and this a different group of

1054
01:24:52,639 --> 01:25:01,199
people will be pitched the same idea and
and then you are leasing and paying

1055
01:24:58,320 --> 01:25:06,960
money for other people to service things
that we we have been for decades doing

1056
01:25:03,600 --> 01:25:11,920
in house. And so it's this
are we avoiding a true maintenance

1057
01:25:09,760 --> 01:25:18,800
investment that we need to be making and
are we entering a slipp slippery slope

1058
01:25:14,719 --> 01:25:24,239
of lease forever? And I and and like the
five vehicles is a lot,

1059
01:25:20,560 --> 01:25:28,960
» right? Like we we haven't until
Enterprise M the June meeting when we

1060
01:25:27,360 --> 01:25:35,679
had that like we weren't talking about
five vehicles. So the ease of the lease

1061
01:25:32,400 --> 01:25:38,960
is potentially already working and that
is a I'd like more friction. The lease

1062
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:42,840
feels like there's not enough friction
in the decision-m process.

1063
01:25:43,280 --> 01:25:49,040
» And I know I was looking at you Travis
and I wasn't necessarily like please

1064
01:25:46,639 --> 01:25:53,360
answer all of the questions
>> because I was trying to follow along but

1065
01:25:51,040 --> 01:25:58,320
» it's just yeah
>> it's a lot to take in.

1066
01:25:56,080 --> 01:26:02,520
Any other comments, questions by
council? Few of you haven't spoken.

1067
01:26:04,880 --> 01:26:11,920
» Is it compromise trying it with a couple
vehicles as opposed to five? Maybe most

1068
01:26:09,920 --> 01:26:17,280
needed. I mean, I know they're all
needed, but heist. So,

1069
01:26:14,880 --> 01:26:23,199
» we had to prioritize.
One of one of the thoughts being that if

1070
01:26:19,760 --> 01:26:25,760
five is a path is what selected. I'm
sorry, I can't remember your name.

1071
01:26:25,120 --> 01:26:33,440
» Raven.
>> Raven. her comment earlier was where

1072
01:26:29,679 --> 01:26:38,880
they have seen those projections get off
is if there isn't um I don't want to

1073
01:26:37,040 --> 01:26:45,360
call it adherence to the 10-year plan,
but just if you don't stick through it,

1074
01:26:42,719 --> 01:26:50,719
you don't see the results of it. That is
part of our thought process as well as

1075
01:26:47,679 --> 01:26:58,080
if I already talking about two trucks
that we would budget to replace next

1076
01:26:53,120 --> 01:27:05,199
year. So that instead of doing three
this year and then two next year, our

1077
01:27:02,000 --> 01:27:11,199
thought is if we do five
and we get two, three years down the

1078
01:27:08,400 --> 01:27:17,280
road and we realize this isn't working
and we want out. Also to Ethan's

1079
01:27:14,480 --> 01:27:21,600
comments earlier, we can either buy them
outright, continue through the rest of

1080
01:27:20,000 --> 01:27:27,199
the five-year lease, and just be done
with it. But this way, we're not strung

1081
01:27:24,400 --> 01:27:33,040
out in a series of one-year lease or
excuse me, a a series of five-year

1082
01:27:29,679 --> 01:27:38,400
leases with one year in between them. So
our thought was if we started a little

1083
01:27:35,120 --> 01:27:44,400
more that we could
analyze those results,

1084
01:27:41,280 --> 01:27:52,000
not do anything next year, but we'd
still be on the plan or on track for the

1085
01:27:48,560 --> 01:27:56,800
plan that at the end of year two if we
say, "Hey, this is clearly isn't

1086
01:27:53,840 --> 01:28:02,639
working." Like we are overpaying,
obviously we're we're done. And then we

1087
01:27:59,280 --> 01:28:08,080
look to either buy out uh the vehicles
or we continue for the remainder of the

1088
01:28:05,280 --> 01:28:12,320
three years but don't lock in anymore.
>> Travis, how do you see us saving money

1089
01:28:09,600 --> 01:28:15,880
on this? Like in your own words, what do
you see as the advantage?

1090
01:28:18,560 --> 01:28:28,280
» So
one is going to be the

1091
01:28:23,600 --> 01:28:28,280
focusing on the resale price.

1092
01:28:28,800 --> 01:28:36,480
We don't see much. Like I said, we see
like a thousand dollars at the end of

1093
01:28:33,600 --> 01:28:41,679
any vehicle we sell. Now, I will say
part of that is we we are rough on

1094
01:28:39,360 --> 01:28:46,159
vehicles.
I was looking out back to see if it's

1095
01:28:43,360 --> 01:28:51,440
the parks truck that's got a white half
white bed on it because we've got paint

1096
01:28:48,800 --> 01:28:54,400
that just spilled everywhere. But I'll
be honest with you, there was really no

1097
01:28:52,960 --> 01:29:00,080
reason to clean it up because it was an
improvement on the truck. That's the

1098
01:28:56,639 --> 01:29:06,880
other flip side of it is that we run our
vehicles into the ground. We do have

1099
01:29:02,960 --> 01:29:12,199
staff also spending um
um a lot of downtime with vehicles.

1100
01:29:12,880 --> 01:29:23,440
I think our savings is on the less on
there is some financial savings that I

1101
01:29:20,000 --> 01:29:28,239
think's here based on trying to sell at
the end of five years.

1102
01:29:26,080 --> 01:29:33,440
use Enterprise Fleet Management and
their access to markets that we don't.

1103
01:29:30,480 --> 01:29:38,000
We hold an auction back here that Joe
Gavely comes and I think he volunteers

1104
01:29:35,520 --> 01:29:41,920
to sell to 10 people that are standing
out back. Um,

1105
01:29:40,159 --> 01:29:46,880
» but how often do we sell a car in five
years? Don't we just keep them?

1106
01:29:43,840 --> 01:29:50,320
» No, we sell one or two usually one or
two a year.

1107
01:29:47,920 --> 01:29:52,080
» Emily's question Emily's question was
how often do we sell them after five

1108
01:29:51,760 --> 01:29:57,679
years?
>> Oh, sorry. Sorry. Gotcha. Yeah, they're

1109
01:29:55,360 --> 01:30:05,120
all a after five years. You know,
usually they're 15 20 years and so

1110
01:30:03,360 --> 01:30:08,600
they're all after that, but they're
pulling about $1,000.

1111
01:30:08,960 --> 01:30:15,840
» So I
uh Andy, you say compromise. Um okay,

1112
01:30:14,239 --> 01:30:20,560
just before I use this number, I'm on
page 66 and the far right column is

1113
01:30:17,760 --> 01:30:24,000
anticipated resale price at term. Is
that the that's like the number that

1114
01:30:22,480 --> 01:30:27,120
we're talking about that if we wanted to
buy it in year six, we'd be paying that

1115
01:30:26,400 --> 01:30:33,679
amount.
>> That's what's expected at the end of

1116
01:30:29,920 --> 01:30:39,280
five years. What Enterprise would be
able to resell it out on the market.

1117
01:30:36,719 --> 01:30:43,440
» Correct. The the residual value column
would represent what is what is the

1118
01:30:41,120 --> 01:30:46,639
remaining cost of the vehicle to buy out
at your

1119
01:30:44,719 --> 01:30:48,800
» and we would pay you that amount to
purchase the vehicle.

1120
01:30:47,600 --> 01:30:51,199
» Yes. if that was what you'd like to do,
purchase out the vehicle. That would be

1121
01:30:49,840 --> 01:30:56,400
the the cost and that could be spread
over another 12 months or or upront.

1122
01:30:53,600 --> 01:30:59,280
» Sure. So, I mean, I think uh this is
probably not where you are going with

1123
01:30:57,840 --> 01:31:04,480
Andy and has nothing to do with this
lease. Like, what I would what I'm not

1124
01:31:02,480 --> 01:31:08,440
excited about leasing this many vehicles
for this many years without

1125
01:31:08,639 --> 01:31:23,199
without information that feels firmer
and I'm Yeah. So, uh, I would see I have

1126
01:31:18,480 --> 01:31:29,679
appetite for if we took that $19,851
anticipated real resale price for the 34

1127
01:31:26,159 --> 01:31:35,600
ton pickup 3/4 ton pickup truck and
divided that by 60 months and I saw the

1128
01:31:33,280 --> 01:31:40,480
that in the budget of every department
saving that the whatever department line

1129
01:31:37,520 --> 01:31:46,960
that is saving that money. So when the
year lease ends, we have $19,851

1130
01:31:44,080 --> 01:31:52,639
to buy that truck.
>> So if we buy it, it would be the column

1131
01:31:49,199 --> 01:31:55,040
in front of that. It would be $9,270.
That's our purchase price.

1132
01:31:54,159 --> 01:31:57,600
» I heard. Okay.
>> The 19,000 is their estimate that they

1133
01:31:57,040 --> 01:32:03,360
give.
>> Cool. So divide $9,270

1134
01:32:00,880 --> 01:32:10,000
by six months.
So, we have a plan to buy these vehicles

1135
01:32:05,760 --> 01:32:16,560
and not a plan to lease forever.
>> So, what I might offer is what's great

1136
01:32:13,520 --> 01:32:19,120
about if they're 10,000 a year lease
payments.

1137
01:32:17,280 --> 01:32:24,239
» You get to sign the check.
>> No, no, no. I don't sign any checks to

1138
01:32:22,560 --> 01:32:28,080
be clear.
>> Um, not on any accounts.

1139
01:32:26,880 --> 01:32:34,719
» Travis gets to approve it.
>> Yeah. No, what I was getting at is

1140
01:32:31,840 --> 01:32:41,520
the 10,000 a year payments for fiveyear
lease and the residuals are all 10,000

1141
01:32:37,520 --> 01:32:45,400
or less. That's year six. You make that
payment now we own it.

1142
01:32:45,520 --> 01:32:52,159
» Okay. So, no cost savings. Do you see
cost uh do you see it being a financial

1143
01:32:50,080 --> 01:32:59,199
hit?
>> I I don't know a good way to calculate

1144
01:32:55,040 --> 01:33:03,760
this. I'll be honest with you. It's too
We can't get as granular as I'd like to

1145
01:33:01,920 --> 01:33:08,880
get. I mean, you guys have seen me mess
with numbers uh without going through

1146
01:33:06,639 --> 01:33:12,560
all our records and pulling all the
maintenance receipts for specific

1147
01:33:11,679 --> 01:33:15,040
vehicles.
>> And how do you value staff time? I mean,

1148
01:33:14,320 --> 01:33:15,920
that's tough,
>> right?

1149
01:33:15,360 --> 01:33:19,600
» Yeah.
>> So, that that's fine. I mean, I'm

1150
01:33:18,320 --> 01:33:23,280
inclined to try it because of staff
time, right? If you're if you can't tell

1151
01:33:21,120 --> 01:33:27,840
me that we can get a huge if we're not
going to get a huge hit, but it is this

1152
01:33:25,600 --> 01:33:32,639
is just and I I I think that's what I'm
trying to this is really hard to make a

1153
01:33:29,840 --> 01:33:38,000
judgment on when we're not really able
to make an acute comparison financially.

1154
01:33:35,199 --> 01:33:43,040
Well, I wanted I wanted to be clear that
without me without myself or Carrie

1155
01:33:41,120 --> 01:33:48,320
going and by myself or Carrie I mean
Carrie and her staff pulling this

1156
01:33:45,120 --> 01:33:52,239
information for me all of those
maintenance records for individual

1157
01:33:50,080 --> 01:33:58,320
vehicles to see what those expenses are
amounting to all we can go off of really

1158
01:33:55,280 --> 01:34:03,840
our average costs to maintain. And so
these are estimates.

1159
01:34:01,120 --> 01:34:07,520
That is why, you know, obviously not
proposing to change over an entire

1160
01:34:05,440 --> 01:34:12,880
fleet, but I would not recommend we do
another year of this right off the bat,

1161
01:34:09,760 --> 01:34:18,480
but be able to actually look at what we
had been historically

1162
01:34:15,120 --> 01:34:23,360
spending as a whole
and what a lease payment for a year

1163
01:34:22,320 --> 01:34:24,639
year plus
>> Yeah.

1164
01:34:23,760 --> 01:34:28,400
» would look like.
>> Yeah. And that's a really good like

1165
01:34:26,320 --> 01:34:32,639
pilot quality improvement pro project
process that I really respect. And we're

1166
01:34:30,800 --> 01:34:37,440
going to be offloading the worst
vehicles and unloading onboarding five

1167
01:34:35,679 --> 01:34:41,679
new. So like yes, there should be
significant maintenance reduction.

1168
01:34:39,600 --> 01:34:47,120
Correct. Right. By nature of vehicle
replacement and I think the question is

1169
01:34:44,239 --> 01:34:51,040
is the vehicle replacement via lease the
thing that is saving money. Mhm.

1170
01:34:49,600 --> 01:34:54,560
» And I think that is going to be like I'm
with you that's gonna be really hard to

1171
01:34:52,719 --> 01:34:57,440
measure even if that's something we want
to look for in the data.

1172
01:34:56,080 --> 01:35:00,159
» Yeah. Because even if we didn't use a
lease and we just went out and bought

1173
01:34:58,480 --> 01:35:04,080
five new vehicles, which obviously we
can't do, but we went out and bought

1174
01:35:01,679 --> 01:35:08,719
five new vehicles, our maintenance costs
should dramatically decrease. It's

1175
01:35:05,840 --> 01:35:12,960
really and it really is like what what I
feel like we're trading off is

1176
01:35:11,840 --> 01:35:17,199
no one's going to pay a lot of
maintenance on the five-year vehicles.

1177
01:35:15,440 --> 01:35:20,880
So, if we own these vehicles in five
years, we're back to owing we're back to

1178
01:35:19,280 --> 01:35:25,440
having maintenance costs on them again
like we do now. So, we're not really

1179
01:35:23,199 --> 01:35:28,560
saving on maintenance costs unless we
just wind up in a perpetual lease

1180
01:35:26,960 --> 01:35:32,719
situation, right? We lease these, we
give them back, we lease new ones. So,

1181
01:35:30,400 --> 01:35:35,920
we're always leasing new because if we
buy these, we're really not saving money

1182
01:35:35,040 --> 01:35:39,440
on maintenance.
>> And what actually might be an option?

1183
01:35:37,679 --> 01:35:43,679
You know, we're talking a lot about the
maintenance costs and the maintenance

1184
01:35:40,880 --> 01:35:46,960
savings. The maintenance is a separate
contract. Correct.

1185
01:35:44,880 --> 01:35:52,320
» Correct.
>> We could look at moving forward without

1186
01:35:48,719 --> 01:35:57,440
the maintenance as part of the contract.
And it's easy for me to say it because

1187
01:35:55,360 --> 01:36:02,320
I'm volunteering other staff time as
part of this, but maybe we can monitor

1188
01:36:00,480 --> 01:36:08,320
as we're bringing in these individual
vehicles. Let's start keeping tabs on

1189
01:36:06,080 --> 01:36:13,679
what these individual vehicles are in
mind to for maintenance costs that when

1190
01:36:11,040 --> 01:36:17,920
we revisit we look at whether it's worth
adding it or not.

1191
01:36:16,400 --> 01:36:20,480
» And does those does the maintenance
contract include things like regular oil

1192
01:36:19,520 --> 01:36:23,120
changes and all of that?
>> Yeah, it's all that just not brakes and

1193
01:36:22,560 --> 01:36:25,679
tires.
>> Okay.

1194
01:36:23,520 --> 01:36:28,960
» To clarify on the brakes and tires, we
can still facilitate that with the shops

1195
01:36:27,520 --> 01:36:33,920
that we work with. It's just something
that would be build back through the

1196
01:36:31,520 --> 01:36:38,880
monthly statement with the enterprise at
our cost. So I want that to be clear

1197
01:36:36,480 --> 01:36:43,440
too. It's not like you know and and you
also have a client strategy manager that

1198
01:36:40,880 --> 01:36:47,600
would be you know able to analyze and
like make recommendations based on that

1199
01:36:45,119 --> 01:36:53,000
and that's what's included with the the
um the service chart or the service.

1200
01:36:53,199 --> 01:36:59,520
Um, I've never bought a new car in my
life and so, you know, also that might

1201
01:36:56,960 --> 01:37:04,239
be a part of this. Um, and my dad always
told me never to buy for the extras. So,

1202
01:37:02,239 --> 01:37:09,119
that's appealing to me. Travis, uh, I
just like we know we know the people who

1203
01:37:07,040 --> 01:37:12,880
fix our cars and we know how much the
tires are going to be and like we're a

1204
01:37:10,800 --> 01:37:16,000
tiny town. Everybody know like I don't
know that we need a client service

1205
01:37:14,080 --> 01:37:21,920
manager to help us figure out who's
going to change our tires in Decora.

1206
01:37:18,719 --> 01:37:25,440
Um, do you have electric vehicles in
your fleet or service specifically

1207
01:37:23,679 --> 01:37:28,960
electric vehicles for any of your
government entities?

1208
01:37:26,719 --> 01:37:33,520
» Uh, not in the Iowa Nebraska area. We
did just um have the first contract

1209
01:37:31,440 --> 01:37:37,280
signed with a nonprofit that's going to
be onboarding some electric vehicles,

1210
01:37:35,360 --> 01:37:41,199
but we do have them throughout the
country. Yes,

1211
01:37:38,960 --> 01:37:46,800
» this is just like a general to the room
conversation. Um this is uh this is yet

1212
01:37:44,880 --> 01:37:51,920
again another vehicle investment
conversation without conversation about

1213
01:37:49,199 --> 01:37:56,639
when we electrify our fleet and
resources. And so even when the answer

1214
01:37:54,800 --> 01:38:01,280
is that's not feasible or doesn't make
sense right now. Um it's always

1215
01:37:58,719 --> 01:38:09,440
disconcerting to me that the requests to
spend money uh come without background

1216
01:38:04,239 --> 01:38:12,440
for us if uh electric was explored.
Any

1217
01:38:15,520 --> 01:38:21,600
other? No, go ahead, Cody.
>> Um,

1218
01:38:19,360 --> 01:38:28,080
» because we can get out of it when we
want when we fe when we find if we find

1219
01:38:26,000 --> 01:38:33,199
that it's not working for us. I'm not
super opposed to it. But I am

1220
01:38:30,159 --> 01:38:37,199
apprehensive and a big picture level.
For one, personally, I have moral issues

1221
01:38:35,440 --> 01:38:43,520
with the enterprise. not you two
specifically, but corporation as a

1222
01:38:39,119 --> 01:38:49,440
whole. Um, for another thing, I
hate seeing

1223
01:38:45,840 --> 01:38:56,000
us hand more and more over to privatized
corporations to fix problems that I see

1224
01:38:52,800 --> 01:39:01,760
as being created by privatized
organizations. In the big picture, it's

1225
01:38:57,840 --> 01:39:08,000
like the U Amazon Prime conversation we
just had.

1226
01:39:04,080 --> 01:39:15,840
small businesses needing assistance from
Amazon now after decades of Amazon

1227
01:39:12,639 --> 01:39:20,800
hurting small businesses and I see a lot
of the power of what happens in our

1228
01:39:18,159 --> 01:39:25,679
country right now being in the hands of
corporations and so I I don't like

1229
01:39:23,600 --> 01:39:30,400
handing over
control over the property that we have

1230
01:39:28,719 --> 01:39:36,000
even though it's a lot of maintenance
and they're old trucks that we're

1231
01:39:33,119 --> 01:39:41,679
dealing with right right now. I
don't like that we don't have complete

1232
01:39:38,159 --> 01:39:46,880
control over what we own. Um, the
nonprofit that I work at, we got a email

1233
01:39:44,480 --> 01:39:50,639
the other day that uh warned people not
to print

1234
01:39:48,880 --> 01:39:56,080
more than they need because we got
charged for the extra printing. Even

1235
01:39:53,679 --> 01:40:02,719
though we have the printers and the
paper and the ink, because we went

1236
01:39:59,280 --> 01:40:09,840
through this outside privatized
entity, we have to ask permission and

1237
01:40:06,639 --> 01:40:16,400
pay more and jump through all of these
hoops that I don't think that we need to

1238
01:40:12,960 --> 01:40:22,560
that we need to do. So
obviously you guys are much more in

1239
01:40:18,560 --> 01:40:27,360
touch with the direct needs and um the
everyday of it all. Um so I trust in you

1240
01:40:26,000 --> 01:40:33,920
that you've been going through all of
this. But just big picture, I I don't

1241
01:40:29,920 --> 01:40:40,320
want to see more things handed over to
privatized entities that have their own

1242
01:40:36,239 --> 01:40:49,040
interest um in mind and less control for
us over the things that we pay for. Um,

1243
01:40:43,920 --> 01:40:56,520
and big big picture, it's just
it's extra incentive to the rigors of

1244
01:40:52,880 --> 01:40:56,520
the system to

1245
01:40:56,800 --> 01:41:06,239
it's a reward for for that behind the
scenes stuff. And I um that's why I'm

1246
01:41:04,400 --> 01:41:13,280
apprehensive. It's going to help us out
right now, but we can but we can get out

1247
01:41:09,679 --> 01:41:16,880
of it. We're not locked in. um
something that we can't get out of, then

1248
01:41:14,880 --> 01:41:21,840
I'm I'm okay with moving forward with
it. But I just

1249
01:41:19,040 --> 01:41:29,360
I hate seeing
more and more privatized or uh entities

1250
01:41:26,400 --> 01:41:33,840
involved in the system. That's all I
have to say.

1251
01:41:32,239 --> 01:41:38,800
» I think two things I'm hearing that help
me make the decision are that

1252
01:41:36,639 --> 01:41:45,520
thinking about this as a pilot, thinking
about it as a trial. Um, also the

1253
01:41:42,560 --> 01:41:49,199
respect for city staff that they think
that this is a good way to go for right

1254
01:41:47,119 --> 01:41:54,159
now. Um, or they wouldn't have brought
it to us. So, I mean, there's a certain

1255
01:41:51,119 --> 01:41:57,920
amount of I feel comfortable with that.
Um,

1256
01:41:55,840 --> 01:42:01,360
I I I I hope that we don't rush into
then leasing more vehicles. Like, I'd

1257
01:41:59,280 --> 01:42:05,520
like to know that we're gonna going to
try this. Um, and we wouldn't be doing

1258
01:42:03,840 --> 01:42:10,239
this with police vehicles.
>> Not at this point.

1259
01:42:06,480 --> 01:42:16,320
» Okay. So to me, like I hear all all your
points, Cody, and even you saying like,

1260
01:42:13,199 --> 01:42:19,520
but um I think logistically when I think
about the alternative, we don't really

1261
01:42:17,840 --> 01:42:23,280
have an alternative to buy five vehicles
right now. And we don't No. And I get we

1262
01:42:22,080 --> 01:42:29,360
don't need to, but it does sound like
we're about to have to turn around and

1263
01:42:24,560 --> 01:42:33,280
buy two or a plow or this. Um and we
have to get a little creative, I think,

1264
01:42:30,880 --> 01:42:39,520
in terms of how we flow our money, which
this might be as we think about budget

1265
01:42:35,600 --> 01:42:43,520
cuts. So, I have lots of reservations. I
feel like the information we have make

1266
01:42:41,199 --> 01:42:47,040
it makes it a difficult decision. So,
once again, I think I I go with the idea

1267
01:42:45,040 --> 01:42:51,760
of trust and pilot and we have to think
innovatively and this might be it until

1268
01:42:49,040 --> 01:42:55,600
we're presented with something else. Um,
so that's kind of where I'm sitting

1269
01:42:53,119 --> 01:43:01,199
right now.
>> Um, I'm I I don't know where people are

1270
01:42:58,719 --> 01:43:05,600
going to go with this. Um, if if council
members are willing, I' I'd like a week

1271
01:43:03,520 --> 01:43:08,719
to try to figure out an applesto apples
comparison, which I don't think we've

1272
01:43:06,800 --> 01:43:14,480
seen yet. I' I'd like to take one of
these vehicles, and I'd like to really

1273
01:43:11,199 --> 01:43:18,560
rigorously dig into uh, you know, what
cities sell a 3/4 ton truck for after 8

1274
01:43:17,040 --> 01:43:24,000
years and and what we could get
financing for if we had to finance it.

1275
01:43:20,800 --> 01:43:27,280
Um, I I I personally would like a week
to look into that for my own needs, but

1276
01:43:25,840 --> 01:43:29,920
I understand if council has heard enough
that they want to move forward. Uh, and

1277
01:43:28,880 --> 01:43:33,199
and I've said my piece.
>> Are you making a motion to table?

1278
01:43:31,679 --> 01:43:36,480
» I I don't want to do that if it's going
to fail six to one because then I look

1279
01:43:34,639 --> 01:43:39,040
bad in the newspapers.
>> Just make the motion you want and we'll

1280
01:43:38,000 --> 01:43:43,040
figure it out.
>> I assume this would be a morale boost

1281
01:43:40,639 --> 01:43:47,040
too for our departments. Is that fair to
say, do you think?

1282
01:43:45,280 --> 01:43:52,239
» No.
>> No. I don't know about five.

1283
01:43:51,040 --> 01:43:54,000
» That's what I'm saying. I think it would
be a little bit of morale boost,

1284
01:43:53,360 --> 01:43:59,440
wouldn't it?
>> She's a clean used one owner.

1285
01:43:57,440 --> 01:44:03,040
» I don't know about two of the three of
those.

1286
01:44:00,480 --> 01:44:08,639
» Travis, tableabling this hurt anything.
>> It It doesn't in reality. Uh if that's

1287
01:44:07,280 --> 01:44:13,600
something the council wants to choose to
do, that's there's no real no harm, no

1288
01:44:10,960 --> 01:44:16,159
foul except for um maybe just join us
via Zoom next time.

1289
01:44:15,199 --> 01:44:23,600
» 100%.
But um to the question of morale, I

1290
01:44:21,040 --> 01:44:30,719
don't know it's as much morale. Maybe
there's a little benefit there, but

1291
01:44:28,080 --> 01:44:35,760
there, you know, I've actually heard
with I've had some people say public

1292
01:44:33,360 --> 01:44:43,520
works needs to wear uniforms.
Like the presentation among the public

1293
01:44:39,600 --> 01:44:51,199
needs to be a certain level. And so I do
think there's some value there that when

1294
01:44:47,119 --> 01:44:56,880
our parks department pulls up to uh Will
Baker in a pickup truck that you're not

1295
01:44:55,040 --> 01:45:01,600
Fred Flintstoning through the flood
floorboards.

1296
01:44:58,560 --> 01:45:08,080
That's that's a better image of our park
system than than what we currently have.

1297
01:45:06,800 --> 01:45:10,800
I'm not saying that's the only reason
that we should do it, but I do think

1298
01:45:09,360 --> 01:45:14,639
that's an added benefit that we're not
taking into consideration.

1299
01:45:12,400 --> 01:45:18,080
» I I agree that the current situation
with our vehicles needs to change and I

1300
01:45:16,880 --> 01:45:21,360
don't think that tonight's vote should
reflect whether you agree with that or

1301
01:45:19,520 --> 01:45:26,960
disagree with it.
>> Um I I will move to table until our next

1302
01:45:23,840 --> 01:45:30,159
council meeting. Uh and uh and maybe it
will give all of us a chance to seek

1303
01:45:28,800 --> 01:45:33,600
alternative perspectives and learn
something.

1304
01:45:30,880 --> 01:45:38,080
» I'll second that.
>> Okay. Motion by Zitiguan,

1305
01:45:36,000 --> 01:45:41,920
seconded. Sorry, motion to table by
Zitiguin, seconded by Parker.

1306
01:45:40,880 --> 01:45:44,719
» Any further discussion?
>> I just want to say that at the next

1307
01:45:43,280 --> 01:45:46,800
meeting, let's all remember that we've
already said a lot of this tonight.

1308
01:45:46,239 --> 01:45:50,159
» Thank you.
>> And and we should bring new information

1309
01:45:48,320 --> 01:45:52,719
and make a decision and move on.
>> Agreed.

1310
01:45:51,440 --> 01:45:54,080
» Roll call.
>> Zitiguin.

1311
01:45:53,600 --> 01:45:55,360
» I
>> Parker.

1312
01:45:54,560 --> 01:45:57,040
» Hi.
>> Chisel.

1313
01:45:56,400 --> 01:45:58,080
» Hi.
>> Whittle.

1314
01:45:57,600 --> 01:45:58,960
» Hi.
>> Neil.

1315
01:45:58,560 --> 01:46:00,000
» Hi.
>> Miss Lynch.

1316
01:45:59,679 --> 01:46:01,280
» Hi.
>> Bergen.

1317
01:46:00,639 --> 01:46:04,400
» I.
>> Motion passes unanimously to table.

1318
01:46:03,199 --> 01:46:07,119
Thank you for joining us tonight.
Pleasure.

1319
01:46:04,719 --> 01:46:11,520
» Thank you. Appreciate your time.
>> Item 10, consider resolution setting

1320
01:46:08,960 --> 01:46:15,199
speed limit for Pleasant Avenue.
>> Okay. So, the county engineers been

1321
01:46:13,360 --> 01:46:19,600
evaluating the surrounding rural speed
limits with the state law change that 60

1322
01:46:17,360 --> 01:46:23,280
is now the new standard unless posted
otherwise. And the city's been asked to

1323
01:46:21,840 --> 01:46:29,600
consider changing the speed limit of
Pleasant Avenue for southbound traffic

1324
01:46:25,760 --> 01:46:34,960
as it um changing that down to 35 miles
per hour because once it gets outside

1325
01:46:32,719 --> 01:46:39,040
the city limits, there's a vertical
curve that the county is going to have

1326
01:46:36,480 --> 01:46:45,520
to post for 35 with the restriction
there. So they uh what we're being asked

1327
01:46:42,639 --> 01:46:50,639
to keep that consistent instead of going
from 35 up to 45 then the county going

1328
01:46:48,239 --> 01:46:54,040
back down to 35 for that corner. So
that's the ask.

1329
01:46:54,960 --> 01:47:02,960
» So because I didn't have time to drive
by Emily's house today. Um you're saying

1330
01:47:00,000 --> 01:47:04,159
that the we're being asked to lower the
speed limit.

1331
01:47:03,840 --> 01:47:06,800
» Correct.
>> I didn't know what the speed limit was

1332
01:47:05,679 --> 01:47:10,400
on this.
>> Yeah. It's currently 45 through this

1333
01:47:08,639 --> 01:47:13,119
stretch. Okay, great. Thank you.
>> And uh right

1334
01:47:12,560 --> 01:47:16,320
» Yeah.
>> 25 up to there.

1335
01:47:14,480 --> 01:47:20,080
» So go 25 to 35.
>> Correct. Be consistent through that.

1336
01:47:17,840 --> 01:47:26,199
» And then south or excuse me, northbound
traffic is actually already at 25

1337
01:47:22,800 --> 01:47:26,199
through this stretch.

1338
01:47:27,280 --> 01:47:33,679
» Uh I'm totally in favor of it. Thank
you. And uh let's get some feed

1339
01:47:32,239 --> 01:47:37,440
» monitoring people up there because
people go way more than 45. So,

1340
01:47:35,920 --> 01:47:41,520
» as somebody that crosses that road
almost daily with my dogs, I don't think

1341
01:47:39,440 --> 01:47:45,760
you could I don't care what you post on
that. They're not going to follow it.

1342
01:47:43,199 --> 01:47:49,600
So, just throw that out there. That's
that's the lu coming into town at 65.

1343
01:47:48,800 --> 01:47:52,880
It's not a lot.
>> It's a beautiful flat

1344
01:47:50,880 --> 01:47:54,560
» lot smooth road, but
>> we lowered that down.

1345
01:47:54,159 --> 01:47:56,639
» What's that?
>> Oh, yeah.

1346
01:47:54,800 --> 01:47:59,840
» We lowered Locust Road. I mean, I
remember when it used to be 50 miles an

1347
01:47:58,239 --> 01:48:03,199
hour through there before any
improvements.

1348
01:48:01,600 --> 01:48:08,159
And and of course this should be yet
another reminder that people will drive

1349
01:48:05,520 --> 01:48:11,920
the speed that we design the roads for
and not what we put on them in terms of

1350
01:48:10,000 --> 01:48:16,560
a speed limit. And so we should keep
that in mind if we want people to drive

1351
01:48:13,679 --> 01:48:20,800
calmly uh in in residential areas. We
need to divine design roads that that

1352
01:48:18,719 --> 01:48:24,639
encourage drivers to drive calmly. And I
think that we need to do better than we

1353
01:48:22,239 --> 01:48:27,440
have been doing.
>> Motion by Chisel. Is there a second?

1354
01:48:26,880 --> 01:48:32,560
» Second.
>> Thank you, Christopher.

1355
01:48:30,639 --> 01:48:36,080
Motion by Chisel, seconded by Missinich.
Any further discussion?

1356
01:48:35,199 --> 01:48:36,880
Roll call.
>> Chisel.

1357
01:48:36,560 --> 01:48:38,000
» Hi.
>> Miss Linich.

1358
01:48:37,600 --> 01:48:39,119
» Hi.
>> Whittle.

1359
01:48:38,639 --> 01:48:40,159
» I.
>> Neil.

1360
01:48:39,760 --> 01:48:41,199
» I.
>> Parker.

1361
01:48:40,880 --> 01:48:42,080
» I.
>> Bergen.

1362
01:48:41,760 --> 01:48:43,520
» I.
>> Sudig.

1363
01:48:42,719 --> 01:48:47,119
» Hi.
>> Motion passes unanimously. Item 11.

1364
01:48:45,679 --> 01:48:51,440
Consider resolution authorizing
professional services agreement with

1365
01:48:48,880 --> 01:48:57,119
WHKS for water distribution system
hydraulic modeling.

1366
01:48:53,520 --> 01:49:01,280
» Okay. So this is based on the request
for qualifications that the council

1367
01:48:59,600 --> 01:49:06,320
approved the scoring at the last
meeting. The way RFQS work, each

1368
01:49:04,320 --> 01:49:11,440
respondents evaluated based on their
qualifications that ranks established

1369
01:49:08,880 --> 01:49:16,960
and then scope of services agreements
are negotiated with that top scoring

1370
01:49:13,679 --> 01:49:22,639
scoring uh organization and if we can't
enter then you can move on to number two

1371
01:49:19,360 --> 01:49:28,639
so on so forth. So anyway, staff uh
discussed we met with WHKS talked about

1372
01:49:25,679 --> 01:49:34,320
the full scope uh as expected for the
distribution system modeling. Again,

1373
01:49:31,440 --> 01:49:40,000
this will help identify deficiencies,
areas of improvement within the existing

1374
01:49:36,960 --> 01:49:45,280
structure. Um help develop that into a
capital improvement plan. also used uh

1375
01:49:43,040 --> 01:49:49,600
for modeling future planning efforts on
system capacity or planned upgrades

1376
01:49:47,760 --> 01:49:53,199
needed to be placed for community
growth.

1377
01:49:51,280 --> 01:49:58,320
Agreement also establishes hourly rates
for training and hosting within that

1378
01:49:54,960 --> 01:50:03,600
first year at $1,350 with subsequent
years at 9,000 or excuse me $950 a year

1379
01:50:01,119 --> 01:50:07,360
for the hosting and that EZRI license
that's needed to look at the model. Uh

1380
01:50:05,600 --> 01:50:12,880
the model service agreement is for the
lump sum of 75,500 to create the model.

1381
01:50:19,760 --> 01:50:23,159
Thank you, Travis.

1382
01:50:25,119 --> 01:50:30,080
» Any discussion?
>> Do you want someone to move it first or

1383
01:50:28,880 --> 01:50:36,320
» Sure.
>> Whatever you want.

1384
01:50:30,880 --> 01:50:38,960
» I I have questions again. U but um uh I
don't know if people would rather talk

1385
01:50:37,360 --> 01:50:47,199
about the motion after it's been made.
Uh I I am I'm concerned that this uh

1386
01:50:44,719 --> 01:50:51,360
sets us I so so I I want to do better
capital planning than we've done. I want

1387
01:50:49,360 --> 01:50:55,040
to do better forward thinking planning
than we've done. And I especially want

1388
01:50:52,719 --> 01:50:58,560
that forward planning to be informed by
the commitments that that we've made

1389
01:50:56,719 --> 01:51:03,760
about the values of of our city with
regard to long-term fiscal

1390
01:51:00,239 --> 01:51:08,239
sustainability. um uh growing in a way
that that doesn't inflate property taxes

1391
01:51:06,400 --> 01:51:11,840
for everyone over the years because we
spread ourselves too thin that we need

1392
01:51:09,760 --> 01:51:16,159
to raise taxes to pay for the additional
miles of curb and gutter and pipe and

1393
01:51:13,600 --> 01:51:20,880
road and sewer. Um and and this is the
kind of project that would help us

1394
01:51:18,239 --> 01:51:27,199
understand where we're at today. uh and
maybe put us in a better position to um

1395
01:51:24,480 --> 01:51:31,679
to to to think thoughtfully about how
this information can steer us as a city

1396
01:51:29,119 --> 01:51:36,800
towards uh a stronger, more resilient,
fiscally more responsible future. Um to

1397
01:51:34,719 --> 01:51:41,920
that extent, I think that's great. What
I'm concerned about is that um uh I

1398
01:51:40,400 --> 01:51:45,599
don't think that that makes the
engineers from Cedar Rapids enough money

1399
01:51:43,679 --> 01:51:48,880
if we do it that way. And and so like
this is just another reprise of the the

1400
01:51:47,520 --> 01:51:53,599
argument that I just made about
enterprise and I won't rehash it all. Um

1401
01:51:50,960 --> 01:51:56,800
but but but um I feel like they're going
to identify a lot of deferred

1402
01:51:55,280 --> 01:51:59,199
maintenance needs in our water system.
And I think they're going to say, hey,

1403
01:51:57,920 --> 01:52:02,800
you know, like we're projecting growth
here and here and here and probably

1404
01:52:00,719 --> 01:52:06,560
here, too. And if you're like every
other community that's been growing in

1405
01:52:04,719 --> 01:52:10,159
America in the past 40 years, you're
going to want lots of really spread out

1406
01:52:08,239 --> 01:52:15,280
properties served by lots of uh
expensive water systems. And uh and

1407
01:52:13,679 --> 01:52:20,159
aren't you lucky? we happen to know the
perfect engineering firm to help you uh

1408
01:52:17,440 --> 01:52:24,000
take out a bunch of debt to to build out
this new system and make all these

1409
01:52:21,520 --> 01:52:28,320
repairs and and I get the attraction of
kind of an all at once let's fix

1410
01:52:25,679 --> 01:52:34,719
everything fix and just kind of tuck the
payments into water rates going forward.

1411
01:52:30,800 --> 01:52:38,719
Um but but uh I think that that that's a
dangerous road to go down as a council.

1412
01:52:36,719 --> 01:52:45,199
Uh, and I do think there's also wisdom
in what has gotten us to this point as a

1413
01:52:41,040 --> 01:52:50,639
city, which is um has been incremental
and has been responsive to to needs as

1414
01:52:48,320 --> 01:52:54,400
they've arisen. Uh, and it hasn't always
been perfect. Maybe there's been areas

1415
01:52:52,159 --> 01:52:57,360
of of low pressure or or systems that
could have been better maintained along

1416
01:52:56,080 --> 01:53:00,800
the way. And I think we need to do
better at those things. Um, but I'm

1417
01:52:59,360 --> 01:53:06,400
scared that going down this path takes
us down the path of of uh, well, now we

1418
01:53:04,480 --> 01:53:11,599
need to spend $20 million fixing our
water systems and planning for the

1419
01:53:08,239 --> 01:53:17,280
future and and the assumptions that are
brought into what that future looks like

1420
01:53:14,239 --> 01:53:23,599
make us weaker and make taxes higher and
make utility rates higher. And so, uh, I

1421
01:53:20,400 --> 01:53:27,840
don't know how, uh, how to avoid going
down that path because I think that

1422
01:53:25,679 --> 01:53:33,679
WHKS, am I getting that right or is that
a radio station? I think that the

1423
01:53:30,320 --> 01:53:38,239
engineering firm is really good at
convincing us to spend a lot of money.

1424
01:53:35,840 --> 01:53:42,639
And uh, and and sometimes we need to,
like that's just part of running a big

1425
01:53:39,760 --> 01:53:48,320
city. Um, I'm just not always convinced
that it's the best thing for us to to to

1426
01:53:46,000 --> 01:53:53,520
go down that path without really uh
clear leadership from people who do

1427
01:53:50,159 --> 01:53:57,360
understand this. And so, you know, I I I
I don't know, you know, like trusting

1428
01:53:55,840 --> 01:54:01,040
staff who knows these things, trusting
Todd, trusting Travis. That's a big part

1429
01:53:59,119 --> 01:54:05,599
of our job is hiring good people and
then trusting their recommendations.

1430
01:54:03,280 --> 01:54:09,199
But I really hope that our staff
remembers that when they're giving us

1431
01:54:06,960 --> 01:54:13,679
recommendations, we need to hear things
that align with what we have expressed

1432
01:54:11,440 --> 01:54:18,400
as this community's values with regard
to the long-term need for any new

1433
01:54:16,320 --> 01:54:22,320
investments in our city, not to create
additional property tax burdens on the

1434
01:54:20,800 --> 01:54:25,920
taxpayers because we can't afford
anymore and the state government won't

1435
01:54:23,760 --> 01:54:30,239
let us even if we could.
>> So that's that's what I'm worried about.

1436
01:54:27,840 --> 01:54:34,960
I think we have expressed
the need to do this type of work though.

1437
01:54:33,360 --> 01:54:38,960
I mean I don't know that this is the
type and scope of work that we can do

1438
01:54:36,560 --> 01:54:44,719
in-house right um given the job scope
that people have and what needs to be

1439
01:54:40,800 --> 01:54:49,840
done and we do need an analysis like we
have you know old water towers we have a

1440
01:54:47,520 --> 01:54:54,639
whole new segment of growth coming out
like we do need a water analysis so I

1441
01:54:52,080 --> 01:54:58,239
guess in my mind I'm thinking like we
would hire any engineer before we're

1442
01:54:56,159 --> 01:55:01,920
going to undertake a major project or to
write a comp plan for Dora this is the

1443
01:55:00,639 --> 01:55:04,800
planning that we need in order to make
the informed decision so that he can do

1444
01:55:03,440 --> 01:55:09,280
incremental growth as opposed to doing
it all at once.

1445
01:55:06,159 --> 01:55:13,440
» Yeah, I I agree that that that that we
do not have the capability to do this

1446
01:55:11,840 --> 01:55:21,840
thoughtful, forward-looking work in
house. My concern is that um

1447
01:55:18,239 --> 01:55:28,320
every North American city is broke. And
they're broke because of decisions that

1448
01:55:24,719 --> 01:55:32,560
councils make like this 50 years ago, 40
years ago, 30 years ago, 20 years ago,

1449
01:55:29,920 --> 01:55:38,159
10 years ago now. and and and I worry
that um that the wrong kinds of uh

1450
01:55:36,639 --> 01:55:44,400
influences
and and incentives uh animate

1451
01:55:41,920 --> 01:55:49,599
projects like this to the point where we
end up with reports that we can't afford

1452
01:55:47,199 --> 01:55:54,480
to do much about. I do know that we have
two tanks up by Phelps Park that are 100

1453
01:55:52,080 --> 01:55:57,040
years old and uh and I've looked we've
done some repair work on them, right,

1454
01:55:55,679 --> 01:56:00,000
Todd? I think we've we've done some
maintenance here and there. We don't

1455
01:55:58,480 --> 01:56:03,920
know how much longer they'll last. it'll
be a big deal when they break. Um, and

1456
01:56:02,080 --> 01:56:07,520
and I know that having reports about
their lifespan and what it costs to

1457
01:56:05,840 --> 01:56:12,639
maintain and maybe one day replace them
is important. Um, but like what if you

1458
01:56:11,119 --> 01:56:17,840
know like I I just want to know how this
is so much obviously better than fix

1459
01:56:14,400 --> 01:56:24,239
things when they break. Mhm. So, one of
the things though I do want to point out

1460
01:56:20,960 --> 01:56:28,639
or agree with there's this is not
something we can perform in house. Like

1461
01:56:26,080 --> 01:56:34,239
this is far and exceeds and I'm not
speaking down about our staff's ability

1462
01:56:30,400 --> 01:56:41,840
here. like this is a highly specialized
area to be able to model out what's what

1463
01:56:39,520 --> 01:56:46,159
would potentially happen when you have
the proposed Mossman subdivision on the

1464
01:56:44,000 --> 01:56:52,080
north end of town. What's that going to
do for your water pressure within the

1465
01:56:48,000 --> 01:56:59,040
system and what improvements can you do
to the system? Especially given our

1466
01:56:55,199 --> 01:57:03,760
topography. Now, that's where Dora is a
key outlier in the rest of, you know,

1467
01:57:01,440 --> 01:57:06,560
I'll say the rest of the state of Iowa.
You know, if you're in Independence,

1468
01:57:05,199 --> 01:57:11,199
you're doing a water model where your
elevation from one side of town to the

1469
01:57:08,320 --> 01:57:16,800
other is maybe 20 feet difference,
that's a lot easier to figure out, oh,

1470
01:57:13,520 --> 01:57:21,840
we just add more water tower capacity or
and and we're good to go because it's

1471
01:57:18,480 --> 01:57:26,320
all gravity based. But here, how many
different pressure zones do we have,

1472
01:57:23,760 --> 01:57:32,719
Todd?
five different pressure zones. So it's

1473
01:57:29,199 --> 01:57:39,040
like five separate systems within each
other. Uh they do they do work with each

1474
01:57:35,520 --> 01:57:46,840
other but they are
different in their capacity as well. So

1475
01:57:42,880 --> 01:57:46,840
this is something that

1476
01:57:46,880 --> 01:57:54,080
to the comment of yes this will help us
capital improvement plan for

1477
01:57:52,400 --> 01:58:00,080
infrastructure that needs replaced but
it'll also help us identify if hey don't

1478
01:57:56,800 --> 01:58:05,679
put 6 in pipe back in the ground here
because if you put 6 inch pipe back in

1479
01:58:02,239 --> 01:58:10,320
the ground here instead of eight you're
going to shut off your ability to keep

1480
01:58:07,360 --> 01:58:15,599
going north or south or whatever that
direction is that's also part of this

1481
01:58:12,800 --> 01:58:24,320
modeling is to identify what
improvements the that's the deficiencies

1482
01:58:19,440 --> 01:58:28,639
or areas of improvement is hey 6 in main
well 4 inch main used to be standard I

1483
01:58:26,960 --> 01:58:33,239
mean two we don't have any twoinch
sections left do we D thank god

1484
01:58:36,400 --> 01:58:42,320
» got under
>> yeah but

1485
01:58:40,560 --> 01:58:48,239
Anyway,
that's when your older parts of town

1486
01:58:44,800 --> 01:58:52,639
were built out and maybe had a 4 inch
maid and you grow out in a circular

1487
01:58:50,719 --> 01:58:56,800
fashion. Well, now your constriction
points are all in the middle of the town

1488
01:58:54,239 --> 01:59:02,320
right where your smaller main sizes are.
So, it'll also help identify which of

1489
01:58:59,280 --> 01:59:07,760
those mains when we go to replace them
by upsizing the pipe. it'll increase the

1490
01:59:05,840 --> 01:59:13,199
volume, not necessarily the pressure,
but the volume that's able to get on

1491
01:59:10,560 --> 01:59:19,119
either end.
So, that's one of the reasons I do want

1492
01:59:14,800 --> 01:59:23,440
to point out this um this is really
important when it comes to communities

1493
01:59:21,920 --> 01:59:26,800
like us where we've got a lot of
elevation change throughout the

1494
01:59:24,800 --> 01:59:30,000
community.
>> I guess my question for Todd or Mike

1495
01:59:28,800 --> 01:59:33,040
would be what's what would be the
biggest benefit if you could choose one

1496
01:59:31,440 --> 01:59:36,800
thing or one or two things out of here.
What would be the one or two things you

1497
01:59:34,800 --> 01:59:41,560
would choose that you would really want
to know or be able to utilize?

1498
01:59:47,040 --> 01:59:53,280
» It have been funnier if you gave it to
Todd after you did that.

1499
01:59:50,960 --> 01:59:57,679
» Talk first talks last because usually
everyone remembers who talks last.

1500
01:59:55,760 --> 02:00:00,320
» The big thing is is the different
pressure zones.

1501
01:59:58,639 --> 02:00:05,280
» Okay. And if there's development, like
Travis just said, I mean, that's if

1502
02:00:02,719 --> 02:00:09,520
you're talking 20 PSI and everyone's out
washing their vehicle and it drops down

1503
02:00:06,880 --> 02:00:13,840
to 15 and there's a fire. I mean, you
got to be prepared. And if there's more

1504
02:00:11,760 --> 02:00:17,280
development happening in the near future
up there, I mean, obviously, you got to

1505
02:00:15,440 --> 02:00:20,800
know what's going on and plan for. You
don't want to have someone come in and

1506
02:00:19,119 --> 02:00:24,719
want to put 50 more lots up there and
say, you know, we got to do a study.

1507
02:00:23,280 --> 02:00:29,040
Maybe in four, five, six years, we can
do that, but not now. I mean, you want

1508
02:00:27,040 --> 02:00:33,040
to be prepared of of what might might
happen in the near future.

1509
02:00:30,159 --> 02:00:37,440
» And to at least know what that needs. We
don't need to be built out and ready,

1510
02:00:34,880 --> 02:00:40,960
but to at least know would be a key part
of that.

1511
02:00:39,040 --> 02:00:44,239
» Yeah. It's it's just what we can and
can't do with what we already have for

1512
02:00:42,560 --> 02:00:47,679
infrastructure.
>> You know, even building to the south as

1513
02:00:46,000 --> 02:00:51,119
far as the Minnow Heights area with this
new development that wants to go in or

1514
02:00:49,840 --> 02:00:56,159
with that pressure zone. Those are
pressure zones in themselves. the

1515
02:00:53,280 --> 02:01:00,000
Bruning Edition and and well, Minimal
Heights is actually fed from our ground

1516
02:00:58,000 --> 02:01:05,119
storage tanks, but the industrial park
and Locust Road area that those are two

1517
02:01:02,480 --> 02:01:09,360
completely separate. They have storage.
The rest of them don't. All we're

1518
02:01:07,440 --> 02:01:13,360
getting them when we when we supply
water to those other zones, it's just

1519
02:01:11,199 --> 02:01:17,520
coming from a pressure tank.
>> There's no water storage there. So, if

1520
02:01:15,440 --> 02:01:22,639
they have issues, it has to come from
our ground reservoirs.

1521
02:01:20,880 --> 02:01:27,119
So, if we're going to keep adequate fire
protection and whatever else in some of

1522
02:01:24,480 --> 02:01:32,159
these small pressure tank zones, that's
what we need to know. I can't design it

1523
02:01:30,000 --> 02:01:38,480
» with the two ground storage tanks that
we have up by Phelps Park. Like I said,

1524
02:01:35,199 --> 02:01:42,880
the one is 130 years old.
>> And you put those two tanks together,

1525
02:01:40,000 --> 02:01:48,560
that's half of Decor's
gravity water supply. If one of those

1526
02:01:45,679 --> 02:01:52,800
fails, do you replace that one? Do you
replace them both? And if so, where do

1527
02:01:50,639 --> 02:01:57,280
you put them? And that's not going to
happen overnight. That's going to be

1528
02:01:54,159 --> 02:02:03,360
years of of construction. So there
you've eliminated half of Decor's water

1529
02:01:59,440 --> 02:02:07,040
supply for the main part of Decora,
which is the gravity fed. So those are

1530
02:02:05,199 --> 02:02:10,159
the things that I would like to see come
out of this.

1531
02:02:08,560 --> 02:02:13,440
» The reason I asked was I wondered if we
could maybe do a lesser scope of this

1532
02:02:11,679 --> 02:02:18,159
project for less money, but it sounds
like that it's kind of the big the big

1533
02:02:16,320 --> 02:02:21,360
thing here that we need is the
>> I feel like we this project when we've

1534
02:02:20,400 --> 02:02:24,320
talked about it
>> for future development obviously too.

1535
02:02:23,119 --> 02:02:27,920
» Yeah. I mean for future development
where we are in terms of our replacement

1536
02:02:25,679 --> 02:02:30,639
costs like I think this is going to be
extremely informative to our water

1537
02:02:29,679 --> 02:02:35,199
supply
>> and to the point since it is for the

1538
02:02:33,040 --> 02:02:37,599
water system this isn't coming out of
the general fund.

1539
02:02:36,639 --> 02:02:42,560
» Correct. This is
>> water so it wouldn't be a tax

1540
02:02:40,400 --> 02:02:47,639
base per se. It's user fee. So
>> correct

1541
02:02:43,119 --> 02:02:47,639
» I would move for the agreement. second

1542
02:02:48,480 --> 02:02:56,639
» just u a comment in agreement that we
need this and I feel like I've been

1543
02:02:53,840 --> 02:03:02,400
someone who's been asking for it. Um I
wonder if uh Stephen some of some maybe

1544
02:03:00,480 --> 02:03:09,119
one part of the reservations you were
sharing is the assumption of growth

1545
02:03:05,360 --> 02:03:15,040
language that is baked into this. So, in
the in the scope um I'm sorry, I was

1546
02:03:13,199 --> 02:03:19,280
trying to pull these numbers and I'm not
going to be able to. But, uh in the

1547
02:03:17,119 --> 02:03:24,239
scope of services provided, there are
things like um review land use

1548
02:03:22,480 --> 02:03:29,199
development trends, comp plans,
historical population trends, develop

1549
02:03:26,800 --> 02:03:33,840
population and growth projections for a
number of years out to 2046, coordinate

1550
02:03:32,000 --> 02:03:38,880
assumptions about future growth pro
projections. I mean, I do think I think

1551
02:03:36,080 --> 02:03:44,400
our entire country has seen
plans everywhere based on we're going to

1552
02:03:41,760 --> 02:03:50,080
grow our population and so one thing
might be like could we check the the

1553
02:03:48,480 --> 02:03:54,880
definition of growth?
>> So, we did actually we were very clear

1554
02:03:51,920 --> 02:03:59,760
in our meeting uh with them that we
recognize population wise it's fairly

1555
02:03:57,599 --> 02:04:05,119
static like we're not seeing a
substantial growth. don't come out with

1556
02:04:01,679 --> 02:04:10,560
like a two or 4% growth, you know,
compounded annually, but we are seeing

1557
02:04:08,159 --> 02:04:15,360
number of housing units. We are seeing
growth there. And that's um when you're

1558
02:04:13,840 --> 02:04:17,280
building out the infrastructure, that's
almost the more important part.

1559
02:04:16,960 --> 02:04:22,040
» Yeah.
>> Is the number of units.

1560
02:04:19,040 --> 02:04:22,040
» Yeah.

1561
02:04:50,960 --> 02:04:58,320
extremely helpful, John. Thank you.
>> Yeah, thank you. Um, and I I guess uh I

1562
02:04:56,719 --> 02:05:02,639
also will take the mic anytime I can say
we should get a new comp plan. There are

1563
02:05:00,400 --> 02:05:06,320
growth estimations and projections in
our comp plan that I that I don't think

1564
02:05:04,560 --> 02:05:10,800
I mean I'd like them to be even lower.
And so if the reference is WHKS, use our

1565
02:05:09,360 --> 02:05:14,960
comp plan, I'm going to be like,
actually, no, could you please be more

1566
02:05:12,560 --> 02:05:23,360
conservative of that? And one of the
things that we do need out of this is um

1567
02:05:19,199 --> 02:05:27,199
where can we grow with uh where it's
phys fiscally responsible to put

1568
02:05:26,000 --> 02:05:33,199
infrastructure
>> and I think our comp plan is like grow

1569
02:05:30,239 --> 02:05:38,560
everywhere there might be land. So if we
could have this study and then say

1570
02:05:35,760 --> 02:05:43,679
because water infrastructure will be
less expensive or easier to maintain

1571
02:05:41,360 --> 02:05:46,960
grow in this way that would be a far
more helpful document when we're

1572
02:05:45,360 --> 02:05:49,760
thinking about what housing are we
incentivizing what developments do we

1573
02:05:48,800 --> 02:05:54,800
want to support.
>> Yeah. And I I'll I'll support this plan.

1574
02:05:52,000 --> 02:05:57,520
Uh but but I think when we receive it,
we should remember that there are going

1575
02:05:55,840 --> 02:06:03,040
to be engineering recommendations which
come from a place of expertise and there

1576
02:06:00,159 --> 02:06:07,280
may also be value assumptions which may
not line up with what we want for our

1577
02:06:05,199 --> 02:06:11,280
community uh and maybe the kinds of
values that have led to lots of other

1578
02:06:08,639 --> 02:06:15,199
communities uh being in in receiverhip.
So let's not you know necessarily go

1579
02:06:13,280 --> 02:06:17,679
down every road recommended but but I
don't mind taking the temperature of our

1580
02:06:16,400 --> 02:06:20,880
water system and understanding it
better.

1581
02:06:19,040 --> 02:06:24,880
» Motion by Chisel, seconded by Neil. Any
further discussion?

1582
02:06:22,480 --> 02:06:28,320
» I just think that it's a it's a good way
to look at the infrastructure that we

1583
02:06:26,320 --> 02:06:32,000
have and plan for the future. I want to
push back on one comment that was made

1584
02:06:30,400 --> 02:06:37,119
about
all

1585
02:06:34,079 --> 02:06:39,440
all cities in North America are broke.
True.

1586
02:06:37,920 --> 02:06:42,239
» It's hyperbole, but yeah, it's probably
not exactly

1587
02:06:40,079 --> 02:06:46,639
» I know. But I want to also tie it into
what I was saying before and it's not an

1588
02:06:44,239 --> 02:06:52,560
attack on you. It's just a o overarching
thing. It's not

1589
02:06:49,920 --> 02:06:57,040
it is true that all communities are are
hurting right now, but it's not at the

1590
02:06:54,800 --> 02:07:01,920
as a result of the decisions that
council is making specifically. It goes

1591
02:07:00,239 --> 02:07:07,040
back to the big picture thing I'm
talking about with uh uh corporations.

1592
02:07:05,040 --> 02:07:13,920
It is the
the wealth being funneled to the top and

1593
02:07:10,560 --> 02:07:19,760
leaving us all in survival mode on
shoestring budgets and

1594
02:07:17,040 --> 02:07:23,679
having to cut things, having to fix
things when they arise.

1595
02:07:21,920 --> 02:07:28,480
There is a lot of responsibility that
goes into the decisions that we make as

1596
02:07:25,520 --> 02:07:33,280
council. But I also I wanted to I want
to take every opportunity that I have to

1597
02:07:31,119 --> 02:07:39,599
speak out against
why we are all struggling

1598
02:07:36,560 --> 02:07:45,040
and it is a big picture
wealth distribution

1599
02:07:42,000 --> 02:07:51,520
priorities of funding wars over
infrastructure education things like

1600
02:07:47,679 --> 02:07:56,639
that. Um, so
again, not an attack on the comment,

1601
02:07:53,440 --> 02:08:02,320
just uh I want to take the opportunity
to point out big picture issues and um

1602
02:08:01,599 --> 02:08:04,880
the real
>> I should have said given that we're

1603
02:08:03,440 --> 02:08:09,199
being screwed. Sorry.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Just uh just that was

1604
02:08:07,360 --> 02:08:12,800
all I just want to take the opportunity
to point out big picture stuff whenever

1605
02:08:10,880 --> 02:08:19,119
I can. I think this is a good thing for
our city. Um I'm in agreement or u I

1606
02:08:17,360 --> 02:08:22,639
support it.
That's all.

1607
02:08:20,400 --> 02:08:24,159
» Any further comments?
Roll call.

1608
02:08:23,679 --> 02:08:25,280
» Chisel.
>> Hi.

1609
02:08:24,719 --> 02:08:27,280
» Neil.
>> Hi.

1610
02:08:26,719 --> 02:08:28,320
» Whittle.
>> Hi.

1611
02:08:27,840 --> 02:08:29,360
» Parker.
>> Hi.

1612
02:08:28,639 --> 02:08:30,239
» Miss Lynch.
>> I.

1613
02:08:29,679 --> 02:08:31,360
» Bergen.
>> I.

1614
02:08:30,639 --> 02:08:34,239
» Zitro.
>> Hi.

1615
02:08:32,239 --> 02:08:37,920
» Motion passes unanimously. Item 12.
Consider resolution approving contract

1616
02:08:36,320 --> 02:08:42,000
with Upper Explorer Land for sidewalk
inspection program.

1617
02:08:40,480 --> 02:08:45,760
» Okay. Okay. So, the proposed resolution
would authorize a three-year agreement

1618
02:08:44,000 --> 02:08:52,000
with Upper Explorer Land to perform
sidewalk inspections for ADA compliance

1619
02:08:48,960 --> 02:08:56,400
uh at $15,000 per year and assist with
property owner notification compliance

1620
02:08:53,840 --> 02:09:00,639
for an additional $3,000 per year. The
sustainability commission did include in

1621
02:08:58,079 --> 02:09:08,480
their budget 26,000 for this current
fiscal year for um transportation 1.1.3

1622
02:09:06,719 --> 02:09:11,840
move toward increase city oversight
enforcement for sidewalk construction

1623
02:09:10,079 --> 02:09:16,480
improvement and implement policies to
ensure citywide accessibility of

1624
02:09:14,159 --> 02:09:20,320
sidewalks, curb ramps, and crosswalks.
So staff would propose the use of

1625
02:09:18,239 --> 02:09:26,320
sustainability funds as part of the
prepared budget from the commission.

1626
02:09:24,079 --> 02:09:30,320
» So don't we
Don't we have a sidewalk assessment

1627
02:09:27,840 --> 02:09:33,920
already? We have I know I sat down with
Jeremy might have been two years ago,

1628
02:09:32,239 --> 02:09:39,040
three years ago now. Time flies. Maybe
it's been five. Anyhow, we have like the

1629
02:09:36,000 --> 02:09:42,239
whole city of Dora and red yellow. We
have an assessment of our

1630
02:09:40,159 --> 02:09:46,000
» we have where it exists, where it
doesn't exist, and where it's not in

1631
02:09:44,880 --> 02:09:52,560
great shape.
>> Right? So what this would do is actually

1632
02:09:49,040 --> 02:09:59,199
go through over three years the entire
city of do decor and identify this

1633
02:09:56,560 --> 02:10:06,400
sidewalk has a cross slope of greater
than 2%. This sidewalk has a uh more

1634
02:10:04,560 --> 02:10:11,520
than half inch deviation which is
considered a trip hazard by ADA. It

1635
02:10:09,440 --> 02:10:17,520
would go through
all of the city of Dora and identify all

1636
02:10:15,119 --> 02:10:22,800
of those
and then follow them up with letters to

1637
02:10:20,239 --> 02:10:26,480
the property owners of the deficiencies
of the sidewalk.

1638
02:10:24,239 --> 02:10:32,239
» And do we not ourselves have capacity to
give notices to the public of

1639
02:10:28,400 --> 02:10:40,079
deficiencies in sidewalks currently?
we could if we didn't have the current

1640
02:10:35,520 --> 02:10:47,119
level of construction going on and um
you know maybe if we have a little

1641
02:10:41,840 --> 02:10:54,719
slower year next year but we part of
this cost is upper explorer land would

1642
02:10:51,679 --> 02:11:00,320
purchase a software that the
sustainability commission had actually

1643
02:10:56,960 --> 02:11:07,760
included as part of this budget was for
the city to buy this software for 23,000

1644
02:11:04,960 --> 02:11:14,560
or so was I believe the budgeted cost
for this software.

1645
02:11:09,920 --> 02:11:21,119
So in lie of the city purchasing it for
23,000 for the year

1646
02:11:17,599 --> 02:11:24,119
and not knowing the staff capacity to
execute

1647
02:11:25,119 --> 02:11:34,800
consulted with upper explorer land about
taking a regional approach to it of how

1648
02:11:31,920 --> 02:11:40,159
about you buy this software
and we contract you and you can go to

1649
02:11:38,560 --> 02:11:44,000
other communities.
and say, "Hey, we can do this for your

1650
02:11:42,320 --> 02:11:46,719
community, too. We can go to WCON. We
can go to Postville. You can go

1651
02:11:45,119 --> 02:11:54,639
wherever.
You buy one software.

1652
02:11:50,159 --> 02:11:58,960
We'll contract with you to do the work
plus the

1653
02:11:56,719 --> 02:12:05,119
compliance letters."
Now, this in itself will generate plenty

1654
02:12:01,920 --> 02:12:11,360
of staff u
staff response time. Uh, as John has

1655
02:12:08,880 --> 02:12:16,960
pointed out to me, every sidewalk letter
we send is three phone calls to the

1656
02:12:14,079 --> 02:12:21,199
engineering office. The first one is the
property owner saying, "I got this

1657
02:12:18,560 --> 02:12:25,040
letter. What do I need to do?" So, they
have a convers.

1658
02:12:23,280 --> 02:12:29,520
They show them what they need to do.
Second phone call is the contractor that

1659
02:12:28,000 --> 02:12:35,040
says, "Hey, the homeowner called me.
What do I need to do?" So, they go, they

1660
02:12:32,719 --> 02:12:38,719
point out what needs to be done. And the
third one is the contractor again says,

1661
02:12:36,880 --> 02:12:41,679
"Okay, I have this formed up. Can you
come out and make sure I'm doing this

1662
02:12:40,159 --> 02:12:46,400
right?"
So, the thought is we could at least

1663
02:12:44,239 --> 02:12:52,079
remove one component of those phone
calls by the homeowner calling Upper

1664
02:12:49,760 --> 02:12:58,000
Explorer Land and saying, "Hey, what do
I got to do?"

1665
02:12:54,400 --> 02:13:02,079
So, that's that's part of that $3,000
contribution is they're mailings out and

1666
02:13:00,320 --> 02:13:04,880
they're fielding that first one from the
homeowner that says, "Hey, what do I

1667
02:13:04,000 --> 02:13:07,840
need to fix here?"
>> And are they then determining the

1668
02:13:06,320 --> 02:13:10,239
priority of who needs to fix what when?
Are they just going to blanket the whole

1669
02:13:08,960 --> 02:13:12,960
city with letters of you need to fix
your sideb?

1670
02:13:10,800 --> 02:13:16,480
» It's over three years. So, it'd be a
third of the community

1671
02:13:15,440 --> 02:13:21,360
each year.
>> And is that just for magnitude of their

1672
02:13:19,119 --> 02:13:27,520
ability to handle that? less their
ability and more our financial ability.

1673
02:13:24,880 --> 02:13:32,239
So the city of Dora pays for the
additional foot for anything wider than

1674
02:13:30,400 --> 02:13:36,239
four feet wide of a sidewalk.
>> Yeah.

1675
02:13:33,119 --> 02:13:39,920
» And and we can handle that financially
if we do all of this.

1676
02:13:37,760 --> 02:13:44,320
» Oh, a third is is still going to stretch
what we currently allocate. Now, if

1677
02:13:41,679 --> 02:13:50,880
council wants to to allocate more
towards this, it you know, we can do it

1678
02:13:47,440 --> 02:13:58,480
then, but it would be substantially more
than what we current allocate towards

1679
02:13:53,119 --> 02:14:02,159
sidewalks as well as so that's one foot,
excuse me, I I didn't phrase that the

1680
02:14:00,159 --> 02:14:06,079
best way. It's anything beyond four
feet. So, if it's a section that's an

1681
02:14:04,400 --> 02:14:10,159
eight foot sidewalk, we're paying for
half of that sidewalk.

1682
02:14:08,320 --> 02:14:17,599
Um,
in addition, the city pays for any

1683
02:14:14,320 --> 02:14:20,880
corner that has the truncated domes.
>> Mhm.

1684
02:14:18,159 --> 02:14:24,880
» We pay for those. So, that's another
substantial cost.

1685
02:14:23,119 --> 02:14:30,000
Um,
anything that is a result of a boulevard

1686
02:14:27,360 --> 02:14:34,320
tree that may have created the trip
hazard, the city has a policy pays for

1687
02:14:32,560 --> 02:14:40,400
those panels.
So,

1688
02:14:36,159 --> 02:14:44,000
if we don't segment this into couple of
years,

1689
02:14:42,880 --> 02:14:49,199
the council, we're going to have to
allocate a lot more funding than we do

1690
02:14:46,480 --> 02:14:52,480
annually for sidewalk improvements.
>> And I I guess I that's one of the

1691
02:14:50,880 --> 02:14:55,920
concerns I have with this is one, we
have not had a discussion about how much

1692
02:14:54,079 --> 02:14:58,800
we want to allocate towards sidewalks.
And given that, I feel like we're going

1693
02:14:57,280 --> 02:15:03,840
to send out a lot of notices and then we
can't uphold our end of the bargain. Um,

1694
02:15:02,000 --> 02:15:07,599
I would much rather we spent that money
focused on our own sidewalks like for

1695
02:15:05,599 --> 02:15:11,679
the city and working on so I guess I
feel like in terms of pri priorities

1696
02:15:09,119 --> 02:15:15,360
first the city and our sidewalks. I feel
like we would be letting up explorer

1697
02:15:13,199 --> 02:15:19,840
land drive that bus instead of the city
and I feel like the city needs to drive

1698
02:15:17,040 --> 02:15:23,119
the bus on what is the priority and then
we can say to upper explorer land this

1699
02:15:21,760 --> 02:15:26,320
is what we want you to focus on as
opposed to just dividing our city into

1700
02:15:24,560 --> 02:15:29,599
thirds. The reason I say that is I feel
like we tried this with Bruning. Oh,

1701
02:15:27,679 --> 02:15:34,320
we'll just do this area. That clearly
backfired on us. um we still have not

1702
02:15:32,719 --> 02:15:37,679
fulfilled our like these are the
sidewalks we need to take care of of our

1703
02:15:36,000 --> 02:15:42,880
own. Like we haven't finished that work
yet. And so I guess I

1704
02:15:40,960 --> 02:15:48,159
um
we also I think need to to be able to

1705
02:15:46,000 --> 02:15:51,679
coordinate the streets we're going to be
working on in the next three years with

1706
02:15:49,840 --> 02:15:54,400
the sidewalks because I'd hate to have
someone put in a sidewalk and then all

1707
02:15:52,960 --> 02:15:58,719
of a sudden we do the streets and now
something needs to be different. Um, so

1708
02:15:57,280 --> 02:16:01,360
I guess I'm a little I feel like I don't
have enough information on this one

1709
02:15:59,760 --> 02:16:03,599
either to be like, "Yeah, upper explorer
land do this." I feel like what's going

1710
02:16:02,560 --> 02:16:08,400
to happen is they're going to want us to
do a bunch of things that we aren't

1711
02:16:05,119 --> 02:16:13,719
prepared to do at this point.
>> Question on software. Is that only good

1712
02:16:10,239 --> 02:16:13,719
for one year

1713
02:16:14,560 --> 02:16:19,760
» the
>> No, it's deep. I mean, if you It's a one

1714
02:16:17,760 --> 02:16:23,199
year, you purchase it, but you can keep
using it, right,

1715
02:16:21,520 --> 02:16:27,800
» Mike? Do you remember this when we
looked at it? If we were to acquire it,

1716
02:16:36,960 --> 02:16:42,200
» here, give me a second. I can
>> Can I talk for a moment?

1717
02:16:42,240 --> 02:16:48,559
» You run the meeting.
>> I I spent about three hours researching

1718
02:16:45,359 --> 02:16:51,519
this on Sunday, I think it was. Um,
>> sorry. So, one, I'm going to throw the

1719
02:16:50,160 --> 02:16:55,599
kudos out where they belong, and that is
this is in the sustainability plan,

1720
02:16:53,200 --> 02:16:59,679
right? Is in T1.1.3
and T2.2.1.

1721
02:16:57,760 --> 02:17:03,439
And I also commend the use of
sustainability funds for something like

1722
02:17:01,120 --> 02:17:07,280
this. What I don't like is the fact that
where we ran into issues last time is it

1723
02:17:05,280 --> 02:17:11,120
was we just picked and choose and that's
why everyone was upset was why are you

1724
02:17:08,880 --> 02:17:15,439
choosing this now? So, I I think
spreading this out over three years is a

1725
02:17:12,800 --> 02:17:21,200
mistake. I think I think we should do an
RFP. There's many reputable companies

1726
02:17:17,920 --> 02:17:26,399
that do this. Civil, Street Scan, City
Logix, Path View, DAX Spot. I talked to

1727
02:17:24,160 --> 02:17:31,200
the founder of Civil through email on
Sunday. Um, and we can do this a lot

1728
02:17:28,479 --> 02:17:38,080
cheaper. Uh, Daxbot, for example, did
Parisburg, Ohio for about $225 per mile.

1729
02:17:35,120 --> 02:17:44,160
Banger, Maine, 627. That's kind of the
middle. We'd be looking at about $1,125

1730
02:17:41,599 --> 02:17:47,519
per mile. So, we could, I think, save
considerable amount of money just at

1731
02:17:45,679 --> 02:17:49,840
least opening this up, looking at other
>> 40 miles of sidewalks.

1732
02:17:48,639 --> 02:17:53,359
» 40 miles of sidewalks.
>> Is that both sides of the street or is

1733
02:17:51,439 --> 02:17:57,280
it 40 miles total? Like I said, be both
sides, I believe. Thanks,

1734
02:17:54,559 --> 02:18:01,319
» man. Um,
I think that

1735
02:18:02,240 --> 02:18:09,120
the idea of us just not looking into
some of these and just saying, "Okay,

1736
02:18:07,920 --> 02:18:15,359
we're going to go deep. I can do this
over three years." uh a town of where

1737
02:18:12,160 --> 02:18:20,160
was it? Genanoa, Illinois had 28 miles
of sidewalk. They did it in four days

1738
02:18:16,960 --> 02:18:24,000
using internal staff. So, I feel like
we're capable. And I know I talked to

1739
02:18:22,000 --> 02:18:25,840
Jeremy and he said they used interns.
>> Yep.

1740
02:18:24,319 --> 02:18:31,120
» You know, in the summer to do it last
time. Daxbot is just a little robot that

1741
02:18:29,200 --> 02:18:35,519
just goes up and down the sidewalks and
does all these calculations. So, we may

1742
02:18:33,679 --> 02:18:38,160
not even need, you know, interns or
summer help. And I don't know how staff

1743
02:18:36,960 --> 02:18:43,599
would feel about, you know,
participating. But I feel like you do it

1744
02:18:40,479 --> 02:18:46,960
in one swoop, right? Um that way there's
no, you know, calling out the council

1745
02:18:45,519 --> 02:18:52,559
and saying, "Why did you choose this
zone first?" or and that's the same

1746
02:18:49,439 --> 02:18:57,840
issue we ran into last time. So I'm
sorry to throw a grenade or, you know,

1747
02:18:54,160 --> 02:19:02,479
gas on the fire here, but um I just I
can't I I don't have an issue though

1748
02:19:00,160 --> 02:19:05,920
with
using upper explorer land to do the

1749
02:19:04,160 --> 02:19:11,120
compliance letters and stuff like that.
do the, you know, the follow-up work if

1750
02:19:08,960 --> 02:19:15,599
Travis thinks that they're, you know,
too busy, which you guys usually are.

1751
02:19:13,760 --> 02:19:21,599
So, I wouldn't mind hiring them out to
do some of the paperwork. Well, and I

1752
02:19:18,800 --> 02:19:26,240
talked about the engineering office, the
on-site inspections that come out of

1753
02:19:22,960 --> 02:19:31,439
that, but the uh letters and stuff come
out of Car's office, and as we're going

1754
02:19:28,639 --> 02:19:35,439
through, not currently the the utility
bill, hopefully that we've got that

1755
02:19:33,679 --> 02:19:42,559
running seamlessly by the time these
letters would go out, but these letters

1756
02:19:39,359 --> 02:19:48,880
also when we do them in house come out
of the city clerk's office as well as

1757
02:19:46,399 --> 02:19:53,920
the followup of, hey, we haven't heard
from these property owners. Here's a

1758
02:19:50,880 --> 02:20:01,600
second notice and then the third three
notices. So,

1759
02:19:56,720 --> 02:20:06,960
those also come out of Car's office. Um,
I was able to pull up deep when it was

1760
02:20:04,800 --> 02:20:18,399
quoted if the city of Dora were to
purchase it. That was in February of 25

1761
02:20:14,319 --> 02:20:26,800
was the pricing I have. It was
just shy of 20,000 for the scanning of

1762
02:20:21,600 --> 02:20:34,240
the sidewalk. 39 miles at five $512 per
mile. And then the web platform. So the

1763
02:20:30,880 --> 02:20:40,520
scanning is the most costly side. And
then the web platform subscription is

1764
02:20:36,880 --> 02:20:40,520
2,000 annually.

1765
02:20:42,800 --> 02:20:48,399
» Um where's the other money for this?
Where would the other money outside of

1766
02:20:46,720 --> 02:20:51,439
the sustainability funds come from for
this?

1767
02:20:49,520 --> 02:20:56,160
» Just sustainability funds. Just sustain.
>> Oh, it's not bigger than that amount.

1768
02:20:53,200 --> 02:21:01,960
» No, over three years.
>> Over three years. Thank you.

1769
02:20:58,960 --> 02:21:01,960
» Um

1770
02:21:04,479 --> 02:21:11,439
and what is our sidewalk repair cost
share budget annually?

1771
02:21:09,040 --> 02:21:15,120
» About 30,000.
>> 34,000. We use that with franchise fee

1772
02:21:13,520 --> 02:21:17,200
money. Correct.
>> Correct.

1773
02:21:15,359 --> 02:21:20,200
» From from gas mostly
>> fee.

1774
02:21:22,160 --> 02:21:29,520
» Um I'm hugely in favor of walkability
and connectivity. Uh and I think uh a

1775
02:21:27,520 --> 02:21:33,280
huge top- down systematic approach that
will cause a lot of chaos and probably

1776
02:21:32,080 --> 02:21:37,040
not result in a lot of improved
walkability isn't the best way forward

1777
02:21:34,880 --> 02:21:39,920
for us as a city. Uh I do think getting
good information is a good first step

1778
02:21:38,399 --> 02:21:44,640
and it sounds like there's pretty cheap
ways to get good information. Um I think

1779
02:21:42,080 --> 02:21:48,880
a place where uh the expertise of a
local company like uh Upper Explorer

1780
02:21:46,960 --> 02:21:54,560
Land or someone else uh would be really
handy is and once that information is

1781
02:21:50,800 --> 02:21:59,040
developed um I I would like to see as a
city us and this be a later conversation

1782
02:21:56,479 --> 02:22:03,359
but like identify what of those
identified issues uh are should be high

1783
02:22:01,439 --> 02:22:07,040
priority in terms of creating additional
safety or better connectivity or

1784
02:22:04,720 --> 02:22:10,640
accomplishing city goals better. Um, I
think that we should not treat a

1785
02:22:08,880 --> 02:22:14,880
sidewalk out in a suburb with like two
cars an hour. Uh, that that needs to be

1786
02:22:13,120 --> 02:22:20,319
repaired with the same urgency that we
treat uh a huge gap in in in in a

1787
02:22:17,920 --> 02:22:23,680
sidewalk between a school and and a
playground, for instance. I'm not

1788
02:22:22,080 --> 02:22:27,520
identifying one in my head. I'm just
saying let's get the information and

1789
02:22:25,280 --> 02:22:30,160
then let's prioritize and uh and I think
we've got a good way forward. So, thanks

1790
02:22:28,880 --> 02:22:34,399
to the mayor for all the research he
did.

1791
02:22:31,680 --> 02:22:39,040
So I would move to table this proposal
and look at other options.

1792
02:22:36,720 --> 02:22:44,080
» Second.
>> So just to clarify, table typically

1793
02:22:41,520 --> 02:22:48,479
means next meeting. Are you wanting it
immediately on the next meeting or

1794
02:22:45,439 --> 02:22:53,359
unless requested by
>> unless requested by I would like to

1795
02:22:51,280 --> 02:22:56,080
» until requested by other council. Yes.
>> There's still companies couple companies

1796
02:22:55,520 --> 02:22:59,200
haven't heard back.
>> I mean we won't be doing anything till

1797
02:22:57,040 --> 02:23:03,520
the spring. So to me we can kick this
down the road.

1798
02:23:01,120 --> 02:23:06,000
You'll have to use the road.
>> And I I mean I think if we're going to

1799
02:23:04,880 --> 02:23:10,479
do something with sidewalks, we better
look at our sidewalk budget. $30,000 to

1800
02:23:08,720 --> 02:23:14,120
Yeah. fix a third of the town. Sidewalks
won't cut it. So

1801
02:23:14,479 --> 02:23:20,080
» all right. Motion to table by Chisel,
seconded by Neil. Any further

1802
02:23:17,439 --> 02:23:23,040
discussion?
>> Roll call.

1803
02:23:21,920 --> 02:23:25,040
» Chisel. I
>> Neil. I

1804
02:23:24,160 --> 02:23:27,120
» Parker. Hi.
>> Miss Lynch. Hi.

1805
02:23:26,160 --> 02:23:29,600
» Bergen. Hi.
>> Zitiguin. Hi.

1806
02:23:28,080 --> 02:23:32,720
» Whittle. Hi.
>> All right.

1807
02:23:30,640 --> 02:23:36,960
Motion to the table passes unanimously.
Item 13, discussion, possible action

1808
02:23:34,640 --> 02:23:40,200
regarding water and sewer service repair
cost sharing.

1809
02:23:41,680 --> 02:23:50,000
Okay, so this has come up in the past
and been discussed by uh by council.

1810
02:23:48,160 --> 02:23:53,359
Staff has identified a possible avenue
to try and balance costs associated with

1811
02:23:51,840 --> 02:23:58,000
the individual property and the system
as a whole. staff's proposing that the

1812
02:23:56,160 --> 02:24:03,280
ownership and responsibility to maintain
the service stay with the property owner

1813
02:24:00,240 --> 02:24:10,000
but repaving costs. So I know council
members were actually just emailed a

1814
02:24:06,880 --> 02:24:17,359
estimate for business downtown where
paving was a over a fifth of the costs

1815
02:24:12,880 --> 02:24:23,840
associated with it. So, um, staff's
thought is a way we can make sure that

1816
02:24:19,840 --> 02:24:29,439
the the to balance again that system
stability or excuse me the let me get

1817
02:24:27,200 --> 02:24:33,200
back to my notes
to maintain that the service stay with

1818
02:24:31,040 --> 02:24:43,160
the property owner. We cover the
repavement the pavement cost that

1819
02:24:37,200 --> 02:24:43,160
doesn't attribute the uh

1820
02:24:44,240 --> 02:24:52,720
deficiencies of the existing service to
be born by the system right away.

1821
02:24:50,399 --> 02:24:56,240
One of the items that was pointed out in
previous discussions was if the main is

1822
02:24:54,640 --> 02:25:00,399
on one side of the street versus the
other that it's not fair that this side

1823
02:24:59,120 --> 02:25:05,280
of the street doesn't have to pay to
replace an entire street. This side

1824
02:25:02,560 --> 02:25:10,960
does. So, we thought it that balances
that. But also, we do have a couple, for

1825
02:25:09,200 --> 02:25:14,880
example, we've got a couple service
repairs that have been done this year

1826
02:25:12,960 --> 02:25:20,399
that the street still isn't fixed. The
ste street still isn't repaired. So, it

1827
02:25:17,200 --> 02:25:24,560
would put the city in control of making
sure the street actually gets repaired

1828
02:25:22,960 --> 02:25:30,479
timely.
And we could actually have um some

1829
02:25:27,680 --> 02:25:37,280
efficiencies to be gained if the city is
reaching out to replace four or five

1830
02:25:33,520 --> 02:25:43,120
service u service cuts as opposed to
each individual property owner paying to

1831
02:25:40,160 --> 02:25:46,560
have theirs repaved.
So that's what we've come up from a

1832
02:25:44,640 --> 02:25:52,160
staff perspective. And you're proposing
that that would come out of that would

1833
02:25:49,120 --> 02:25:57,359
be out of the water enterprise fund
>> or sewer if it's associated with the

1834
02:25:54,000 --> 02:26:05,600
sewer service repair alternatively not
alternatively but and also um that staff

1835
02:26:02,000 --> 02:26:11,520
discussed there's a Todd remind me was a
division for example there's like a temp

1836
02:26:08,960 --> 02:26:16,880
where asphalt was put back in and and
yeah so um if it's a street that's

1837
02:26:14,560 --> 02:26:23,200
identified for
um for significant repair in our street

1838
02:26:20,319 --> 02:26:26,800
plan, then it's one that we wouldn't
necessarily attribute to water or sewer,

1839
02:26:25,439 --> 02:26:31,520
but we would actually just make it part
of a bigger street project if it's a

1840
02:26:29,760 --> 02:26:34,640
specially already planned one
>> and not then allocate, but we would just

1841
02:26:33,520 --> 02:26:38,399
pay for the infrastructure under the
seat under it.

1842
02:26:36,800 --> 02:26:43,200
» Well, that's if the repair has already
been made. So let's say the street city

1843
02:26:41,600 --> 02:26:52,080
has
um you know we have we're gonna next

1844
02:26:47,200 --> 02:26:56,640
month with our work session
is that next two months John and Mike

1845
02:26:55,280 --> 02:27:02,319
» in October we have
>> October is the one big one for fiscal 28

1846
02:27:00,479 --> 02:27:07,040
where we're going to come and have a
conversation with a street capital

1847
02:27:03,920 --> 02:27:11,120
improvement plan. So, if the city's
identified it as a street capital

1848
02:27:08,880 --> 02:27:16,560
improvement, but the homeowner had to
have a service replacement done, we

1849
02:27:14,319 --> 02:27:19,520
wouldn't attribute that repaving cost to
the water of the sewer side because

1850
02:27:18,000 --> 02:27:22,000
we're planning to redo the street
already.

1851
02:27:21,040 --> 02:27:25,439
Follow,
>> but we wouldn't give it to the homeowner

1852
02:27:23,600 --> 02:27:28,800
either. We would take it on as part of
our capital improvement.

1853
02:27:26,399 --> 02:27:32,399
» Correct. Yeah. So, when you asked if the
breakdown if it's paid out of the water

1854
02:27:30,240 --> 02:27:38,640
fund, Yes. water if it's a water
service, sewer if it's a sewer sewer

1855
02:27:35,200 --> 02:27:43,680
service uh repair, unless it's part of a
street capital plan project anyway.

1856
02:27:41,200 --> 02:27:48,000
» So under this model though, if there was
a a break within the system under the

1857
02:27:46,479 --> 02:27:51,280
street,
essentially the business would still

1858
02:27:49,840 --> 02:27:56,880
have to pay for the repair under the
street. We would just help we would just

1859
02:27:54,000 --> 02:28:01,680
cost share 5050 the pavement. No, we
would cover the like they wouldn't even

1860
02:27:59,040 --> 02:28:06,960
have to facilitate repaving.
>> So all they would have to pay for is

1861
02:28:03,520 --> 02:28:12,399
pipes and
>> excavation and pipe work.

1862
02:28:09,040 --> 02:28:16,160
» I mean I still have trouble with with
quite honestly anyone paying for

1863
02:28:14,640 --> 02:28:22,880
infrastructure under a city street. To
me that is public property and the

1864
02:28:18,479 --> 02:28:26,640
public should pay for. Um so I am still
uh someone who believes that public

1865
02:28:25,280 --> 02:28:32,439
infrastructure under public street
should be paid for by a public entity

1866
02:28:29,439 --> 02:28:32,439
collective.

1867
02:28:34,399 --> 02:28:37,399
Sure.

1868
02:29:17,439 --> 02:29:26,960
So to summarize, John said the main
that's public, the service, those are

1869
02:29:24,479 --> 02:29:31,840
all treated as private,
>> but those ser those private entities

1870
02:29:29,040 --> 02:29:36,240
extend into the public infrastructure,
right? I mean that so essentially we

1871
02:29:34,160 --> 02:29:39,120
have some some service lines that run
all the way through the street to the

1872
02:29:37,359 --> 02:29:42,479
other side
and and that's where I mean ideally yes

1873
02:29:41,439 --> 02:29:46,800
ideally we would have built
infrastructure such that it ends at the

1874
02:29:45,120 --> 02:29:52,560
property line and then you hit the the
city's main

1875
02:29:49,120 --> 02:29:58,080
» here's I'm not I am playing devil's
advocate I guess but I'm drawing a a

1876
02:29:54,960 --> 02:30:03,280
comparison to my driveway also extends
into the public right away the city

1877
02:30:00,479 --> 02:30:05,600
doesn't pay to replace my driveway,
>> but it doesn't extend into the middle of

1878
02:30:04,880 --> 02:30:10,960
the street,
>> but extends into the public rightway

1879
02:30:08,479 --> 02:30:16,720
» and you're required to have it.
>> So my point being is that we treat that

1880
02:30:14,880 --> 02:30:22,000
portion of the public rightway as
private because it serves one property.

1881
02:30:20,240 --> 02:30:26,240
The street, to John's comment, the
street is public because anybody can use

1882
02:30:24,160 --> 02:30:31,520
it.
Same, you know, same with the water

1883
02:30:29,200 --> 02:30:36,399
side. The main is public because it runs
through the rightway and it's for the

1884
02:30:33,200 --> 02:30:40,319
entire systems benefit. The service that
goes off of it, even though it's going

1885
02:30:38,240 --> 02:30:44,479
through the private rightaway, only
benefits the one property.

1886
02:30:42,399 --> 02:30:51,200
» Yeah. Yeah. Thank you, John and Travis.
That was really helpful for me. Um I uh

1887
02:30:48,880 --> 02:30:55,120
I'm not interested in taking action on
this right now. And I stand exactly

1888
02:30:53,439 --> 02:31:00,000
where I stand the last three times we've
talked about this, that without a rate

1889
02:30:56,960 --> 02:31:04,479
study, which needs to come after the
water study we just talked about, I'm

1890
02:31:02,399 --> 02:31:10,479
uninterested in committing us to any
more uh maintenance or financial

1891
02:31:08,000 --> 02:31:14,560
responsibility to water, sewer
infrastructure. Um, not saying that this

1892
02:31:12,479 --> 02:31:19,520
isn't creative and thank you and thank
you for hearing the discussion and the

1893
02:31:16,479 --> 02:31:25,040
the public comment we've had. Uh, but I
don't have appetite for this. we without

1894
02:31:21,840 --> 02:31:29,920
we don't know it is not clear what
financial uh expectation we would be

1895
02:31:27,680 --> 02:31:35,040
putting into our water and sewer
enterprise functions and what that would

1896
02:31:31,920 --> 02:31:40,240
do to the rateayer who is who would
cover this cost

1897
02:31:37,760 --> 02:31:46,319
» I think with that I'm not willing to
give it up so I mean I think that we

1898
02:31:42,399 --> 02:31:51,280
need to do some type of relief for
businesses quite honestly who are

1899
02:31:48,479 --> 02:31:54,960
dealing with old infrastructure
um and absorbing costs that to me the

1900
02:31:53,840 --> 02:31:59,040
public should bear some of the
responsibility for and if it is the only

1901
02:31:57,280 --> 02:32:04,399
thing that works is that okay then let's
cost share the streets I think that's

1902
02:32:01,120 --> 02:32:09,359
something we should look at um but I
forget our last conversation how many

1903
02:32:06,399 --> 02:32:12,720
mains we've had breakdown um for every
business now we've got businesses who

1904
02:32:11,120 --> 02:32:18,319
want to be proactive which I think is
awesome um and so if the only thing that

1905
02:32:16,560 --> 02:32:22,399
council has appetite for is cost sharing
pavement then I think we should move

1906
02:32:20,080 --> 02:32:27,200
forward with that and we can uh talk
about something else later. Um and I can

1907
02:32:25,280 --> 02:32:32,560
buy the argument that everyone benefits
from the public street so therefore if

1908
02:32:31,040 --> 02:32:36,960
we need to then remove the street in
order for a business to be able to fix

1909
02:32:34,399 --> 02:32:40,080
the pipe then we should then cost share
it back.

1910
02:32:37,760 --> 02:32:43,439
» Do you think homeowners should also get
the same sort of treatment? I do

1911
02:32:41,680 --> 02:32:48,240
actually and was one thing Randy and I
agreed when we redid Maine that we

1912
02:32:46,479 --> 02:32:51,840
should redo the infrastructure and not
the cost to the homeowner. But I also

1913
02:32:49,840 --> 02:32:55,120
think homeowners have insurance. So
homeowners can get insurance for this

1914
02:32:53,120 --> 02:32:57,200
type of thing. Businesses cannot.
>> When I

1915
02:32:55,680 --> 02:33:01,760
» and I don't understand why that is the
case

1916
02:32:58,720 --> 02:33:05,920
um but they can't
>> because because an insurance company

1917
02:33:03,520 --> 02:33:11,200
would be foolish to to write paper on a
40-year-old water pipe service line. I

1918
02:33:08,399 --> 02:33:14,240
mean, it it's it's not insurable because
we know what's going to happen to them

1919
02:33:12,880 --> 02:33:19,439
over time. And that's why some
businesses in town have invested in

1920
02:33:16,720 --> 02:33:23,200
replacing the end of life uh lines
running to their business. And that's to

1921
02:33:21,040 --> 02:33:26,880
me an ordinary cost of doing business.
Now, I don't say and I I I think

1922
02:33:25,760 --> 02:33:31,760
everyone knows that I'm one of the
biggest advocates on this count council

1923
02:33:29,040 --> 02:33:36,399
for finding ways to incentivize and
encourage downtown economic activity,

1924
02:33:33,920 --> 02:33:40,560
which has an outsized return for the
whole town, not just our downtown. If

1925
02:33:38,640 --> 02:33:44,399
you look at a map of where we generate
property taxes versus where we spend

1926
02:33:42,399 --> 02:33:48,160
city dollars, downtown is one of the
engines that makes the rest of the city

1927
02:33:46,240 --> 02:33:52,960
possible. And so, we should absolutely
be supporting downtown businesses. I'm

1928
02:33:50,560 --> 02:33:57,120
just uncomfortable with removing the
very important feedback that potential

1929
02:33:55,200 --> 02:34:02,479
investors have when they're considering
a building's state of repair. Um, when I

1930
02:34:00,399 --> 02:34:06,000
have toured a building, uh, you know, I
know that important questions to ask are

1931
02:34:04,640 --> 02:34:09,840
what's the roof like? What are the
windows like? What's the HVAC like? And

1932
02:34:08,000 --> 02:34:14,319
what's the water service like? And
presumably no one here, uh, no one who

1933
02:34:12,880 --> 02:34:18,240
owns a building downtown has owned it
since that street was laid. Um, so so

1934
02:34:16,640 --> 02:34:22,000
everyone has had an opportunity to do
their due diligence. I do kind of like,

1935
02:34:20,640 --> 02:34:26,399
and this is where Johan and I maybe
don't see eye to eye. I think there's

1936
02:34:23,920 --> 02:34:30,000
maybe an argument, especially downtown,
because

1937
02:34:27,920 --> 02:34:33,280
the style of the street, it's sort of
important that it be more expensive than

1938
02:34:31,760 --> 02:34:37,600
than the street in front of my house,
for instance, for for lots of reasons.

1939
02:34:35,359 --> 02:34:42,479
Um, and that that's an economic activity
and benefit that occurs not just to the

1940
02:34:40,560 --> 02:34:46,960
business whose street is being repaired,
but to the whole community in a way that

1941
02:34:45,120 --> 02:34:50,960
my street being repaired pretty much
benefits me and my neighbors. Um, so

1942
02:34:49,040 --> 02:34:55,200
like I can see paying for the concrete
to to be put back really nicely. I think

1943
02:34:52,960 --> 02:34:58,720
there's I I like this as a compromise
and I I wouldn't hate moving forward

1944
02:34:56,640 --> 02:35:03,920
with it. Um, although I think Johanna
makes some good points about why why

1945
02:35:01,040 --> 02:35:10,960
push this ahead of a rate study.
I think I'm also in the camp that feels

1946
02:35:07,359 --> 02:35:17,359
like we should financially support or
help um help these businesses deal with

1947
02:35:14,720 --> 02:35:23,280
uh with issues that pop up old
infrastructure. I had a conversation

1948
02:35:20,479 --> 02:35:29,600
with um
you know Michael Bachmann Tabox and uh

1949
02:35:26,080 --> 02:35:35,680
the just an issue that ended up costing
a ton of money and I think of how much

1950
02:35:32,160 --> 02:35:41,760
we as a community benefit from Tabox and
how grateful

1951
02:35:37,520 --> 02:35:47,200
we are to have places like that like
impact like uh like these institutions

1952
02:35:44,800 --> 02:35:50,960
downtown that we all benefit from. I
think that um

1953
02:35:48,720 --> 02:35:55,200
I think that it's important that they
don't have to pay for all of the cost.

1954
02:35:53,359 --> 02:36:03,200
And I think that this is a good creative
solution in taking some of that off of

1955
02:35:58,240 --> 02:36:08,319
their plate and um in a way that we can
we can do it and we can also factor it

1956
02:36:05,439 --> 02:36:11,840
into um street projects going forward.
So I like this. I think it's a good

1957
02:36:10,240 --> 02:36:19,840
solution. I think it's a good middle
ground. Um, would that be

1958
02:36:16,240 --> 02:36:25,120
applicable to people who are making um
proactive

1959
02:36:21,760 --> 02:36:29,359
um like say the email that we just got
about the business that wants to take

1960
02:36:26,720 --> 02:36:34,160
proactive steps and fixing it now as
opposed to dealing with a busted main

1961
02:36:31,920 --> 02:36:36,720
down the road? Would it also apply to
them?

1962
02:36:34,960 --> 02:36:42,160
» Yeah, it would apply to any service
whether it's a repair for a break or

1963
02:36:39,920 --> 02:36:46,319
» a planned service replacement. because
we do have we do have a few of those

1964
02:36:44,800 --> 02:36:50,319
from time to time.
>> Usually those are the service or sewer

1965
02:36:49,200 --> 02:36:53,520
where
>> they fix an immediate issue and then

1966
02:36:52,080 --> 02:36:56,160
they plan to replace that.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

1967
02:36:54,399 --> 02:37:00,000
» I mean I
Go ahead. Sorry.

1968
02:36:57,520 --> 02:37:04,479
» I uh agree that uh it would be
beneficial to have the uh the rate

1969
02:37:02,560 --> 02:37:10,240
analysis.
So that would be great to get

1970
02:37:06,399 --> 02:37:15,280
beforehand, but everything else I'm
fully supportive of and I think this

1971
02:37:12,000 --> 02:37:22,960
this is a great forward
progress, great first steps, good way to

1972
02:37:18,880 --> 02:37:27,680
deal with it um now and if more problems
should arise down the road then we could

1973
02:37:25,439 --> 02:37:31,040
uh address it then and talk open the
discussion up more.

1974
02:37:29,680 --> 02:37:34,880
» Did you want to make a motion to adopt
Cody? I

1975
02:37:33,040 --> 02:37:40,160
» we don't have any writing like what are
we adopting? Um

1976
02:37:37,680 --> 02:37:44,000
I want to push I I have questions.
>> I was just asking him. He said he

1977
02:37:42,240 --> 02:37:46,000
supported it for a minute. So I wondered
if it was a motion.

1978
02:37:45,280 --> 02:37:49,840
» Sure.
>> Yeah, he can make a motion.

1979
02:37:48,160 --> 02:37:54,960
» Do we need language? I mean I think that
I would I would ask staff to draft if if

1980
02:37:52,800 --> 02:37:58,640
needed or if we can just say that we
because I I am interested in making a

1981
02:37:56,560 --> 02:38:01,760
motion. Um I do think that this is
something we should do. Um, I think we

1982
02:38:00,640 --> 02:38:07,680
don't need a rate study because I think
it's the right thing to do. Um, I think

1983
02:38:04,640 --> 02:38:11,680
Steve made a really good point about and
and when I look at this, I really do

1984
02:38:09,120 --> 02:38:17,040
look at our small businesses downtown um
and the risks that they assume for the

1985
02:38:13,439 --> 02:38:24,000
benefit of all of us um and the ways in
which um small business makes Dora and

1986
02:38:21,359 --> 02:38:29,040
small business is a giant risk in Dora.
And one of those risks is that you want

1987
02:38:26,640 --> 02:38:32,720
to go to this historic downtown. And
yeah, the infrastructure under it is 40

1988
02:38:30,960 --> 02:38:35,280
years old. And if we could, I would say
as a city, we should replace all the

1989
02:38:34,000 --> 02:38:40,319
infrastructure. We can't. We don't have
the financial resources to do it. Um, so

1990
02:38:38,000 --> 02:38:43,840
this is that happy medium of all right,
either you can be proactive and fix it

1991
02:38:42,000 --> 02:38:46,399
and we'll help you with the pavement. In
the same way that if you redo your

1992
02:38:45,439 --> 02:38:50,720
building, we'll help you with the
windows and the facade and the roof. To

1993
02:38:48,399 --> 02:38:57,960
me, this is just one more investment in
that nature. Um, as I said, I just think

1994
02:38:54,960 --> 02:38:57,960
um

1995
02:38:59,120 --> 02:39:04,479
it's it's the right thing to do, I
guess. And and I appreciate Steve

1996
02:39:02,080 --> 02:39:08,080
bringing that comment about helping out
the downtown businesses and how much

1997
02:39:05,840 --> 02:39:13,680
they help our local economy.
>> Cody said, too.

1998
02:39:09,600 --> 02:39:19,920
» Yeah. Uh I I want to Well, I I want to
be clear. I am not saying that this is a

1999
02:39:16,479 --> 02:39:24,319
bad idea. It might be a great idea. We I
don't know how much this might cost. I

2000
02:39:22,160 --> 02:39:30,479
don't understand like I don't have any
data to know what we're how many uh are

2001
02:39:28,800 --> 02:39:33,760
we going to be proactive? Because that's
not if we're moving the language in our

2002
02:39:32,240 --> 02:39:38,000
background notes that doesn't clarify
things about if it's proactive. What if

2003
02:39:35,359 --> 02:39:43,920
you repaired your your main in the last
12 months? Do we recoup that? Do we what

2004
02:39:42,080 --> 02:39:48,880
is the district that this is? Is this
just C3? Is it the overlay we haven't

2005
02:39:45,920 --> 02:39:54,080
talked about in the C3? So I I'm here to
say that two things. One is I don't have

2006
02:39:52,000 --> 02:39:58,399
enough information and I don't think I
will until we have a rate study to

2007
02:39:56,160 --> 02:40:04,399
understand what this impact this
decision would impact. And two, I don't

2008
02:40:01,280 --> 02:40:10,319
see in this language enough detail about
what I'm approving. So like it's even if

2009
02:40:07,280 --> 02:40:13,439
if if Yeah.
>> I can give the language on terms of what

2010
02:40:11,840 --> 02:40:17,760
I think we should approve because I'm
about to make a motion on it.

2011
02:40:14,640 --> 02:40:23,920
» Okay. And I thank you. I have to say
that I am not super excited about our uh

2012
02:40:21,520 --> 02:40:29,840
verbal editing the motion three or four
times and then turning into practice

2013
02:40:27,359 --> 02:40:35,439
and I don't watch Matlock but if I did I
would have left 22 minutes ago. Um I'm

2014
02:40:32,560 --> 02:40:38,479
I'm just I'm tired. It's hard to hold
these concepts in mind. The other thing

2015
02:40:36,880 --> 02:40:43,359
is I just want to push back Cody and
Emily both on you proposing a

2016
02:40:40,240 --> 02:40:48,080
compromise. A compromise with whom
and middle ground. How do you know it's

2017
02:40:46,240 --> 02:40:50,240
the middle ground if we don't have any
numbers?

2018
02:40:48,800 --> 02:40:53,920
» Okay, so I guess what I'm not thinking
of it as a compromise. I'm thinking it

2019
02:40:51,760 --> 02:40:59,520
about a public benefit. So as I said, I
don't need numbers when I believe,

2020
02:40:56,720 --> 02:41:03,920
right, the value of that infrastructure
to the community, right, is something

2021
02:41:02,160 --> 02:41:07,200
that the city should be investing in and
that the street is public

2022
02:41:05,120 --> 02:41:10,319
infrastructure. So if something happens
below the street and public

2023
02:41:08,640 --> 02:41:13,760
infrastructure needs to be fixed, we
should be responsible to put it in. I

2024
02:41:12,319 --> 02:41:17,040
believe the whole thing is public infra
infrastructure. So for me, I don't need

2025
02:41:15,359 --> 02:41:21,600
the number because of my value system
that this is public infrastructure that

2026
02:41:18,800 --> 02:41:26,080
benefits the entire decor community. I
have a question for John before I make

2027
02:41:23,359 --> 02:41:30,000
the motion. We had discussed we couldn't
that it's probably not best that we just

2028
02:41:27,760 --> 02:41:34,760
do this for the C3 and that we should
just say

2029
02:41:31,040 --> 02:41:34,760
» or can we say C3

2030
02:41:36,240 --> 02:41:43,359
or can we pilot in the C3?
>> It's really I I think there is a

2031
02:41:41,520 --> 02:41:49,359
question. Are you discriminating against
the rest of the city by doing that? At

2032
02:41:45,439 --> 02:41:52,000
the same time, we do have uh downtown
facade improvement programs.

2033
02:41:51,359 --> 02:41:57,359
» Exactly.
>> Uh and this is a little bit different

2034
02:41:54,640 --> 02:42:02,560
because this involves utilities that are
throughout the town and you have

2035
02:41:59,439 --> 02:42:09,920
businesses that are not in the C3
district. So to me, it's a it it looks

2036
02:42:07,040 --> 02:42:14,399
different than the downtown betterment
program. So, I do have some concerns

2037
02:42:12,640 --> 02:42:18,160
about that. I don't have an answer for
you, but it does feel like it's not the

2038
02:42:17,439 --> 02:42:20,640
same.
>> Travis, when you made this

2039
02:42:19,280 --> 02:42:22,880
recommendation, were you thinking just
citywide?

2040
02:42:21,840 --> 02:42:28,720
» Yeah, just citywide.
>> Yeah. So, I think my motion is that

2041
02:42:24,479 --> 02:42:34,640
citywide um we we will cost share the
pavement. No, we pay for the pavement um

2042
02:42:32,720 --> 02:42:37,840
underwater main breaks or if people are
proactive about changing.

2043
02:42:36,000 --> 02:42:43,359
» I do sometimes stall just for the sake
of stalling. I I know I do. Uh tonight,

2044
02:42:40,319 --> 02:42:47,120
tonight though, I think it might help us
govern as effectively as possible if

2045
02:42:45,120 --> 02:42:51,280
instead of considering a motion at the
meeting, uh we directed staff to prepare

2046
02:42:49,680 --> 02:42:52,399
a motion at our next meeting for our
consideration.

2047
02:42:52,080 --> 02:42:57,200
» Sure.
>> And then we would have language that

2048
02:42:54,000 --> 02:43:00,720
that did their
presented that argument as well as as

2049
02:42:58,800 --> 02:43:05,200
staff can make it and and we'll have a
more enlightened conversation.

2050
02:43:02,000 --> 02:43:08,479
» And I I do want to remind uh council at
least that we spent $5 million putting

2051
02:43:07,280 --> 02:43:13,920
water infrastructure to other
businesses, right? So, it's not as if we

2052
02:43:10,560 --> 02:43:17,359
haven't made huge concessions to other
businesses across our community in order

2053
02:43:15,520 --> 02:43:22,000
to incentivize business for happening.
We recognize economic growth is

2054
02:43:19,520 --> 02:43:28,800
essential to our town. Um, and I guess
this is one way that I think will really

2055
02:43:24,160 --> 02:43:32,960
bolster local de local small business um
when these types of costs are

2056
02:43:30,560 --> 02:43:36,560
detrimental quite honestly to them. And
as for homeowners, like I said,

2057
02:43:34,800 --> 02:43:41,680
homeowners can get insurance in a way
that businesses can't. But I do based on

2058
02:43:39,600 --> 02:43:45,439
that premise that the street is public
infrastructure believe we should be on

2059
02:43:43,840 --> 02:43:48,080
the hook for the cost of the street at
the very least.

2060
02:43:46,399 --> 02:43:51,120
» Todd or Mike, how many of these
situations do you think we run into per

2061
02:43:50,000 --> 02:43:54,080
year?
>> As far as water,

2062
02:43:53,040 --> 02:43:59,439
» yeah,
>> service lines that we'd be looking at

2063
02:43:57,520 --> 02:44:04,640
dealing with
>> 30. Okay. With the aging infrastructure

2064
02:44:02,560 --> 02:44:08,479
we have, which is mostly 80 plus years
old, correct?

2065
02:44:06,560 --> 02:44:14,479
A lot of it
>> depends on the neighborhood, I suppose.

2066
02:44:10,640 --> 02:44:17,600
» I think I remember when I was on,
>> right?

2067
02:44:16,000 --> 02:44:22,720
So, we do have a lot of aging
infrastructure, correct?

2068
02:44:20,640 --> 02:44:28,760
» Yeah. Is that fair to say? Could this
potentially balloon into way more than

2069
02:44:25,279 --> 02:44:28,760
30 per year?

2070
02:44:30,080 --> 02:44:35,920
» Sure.
>> If you make it for voluntary If you make

2071
02:44:34,080 --> 02:44:39,760
it for voluntary upgrades, Yeah. But we
could get hit pretty hard, right?

2072
02:44:38,399 --> 02:44:41,600
» So, I also don't know if we're opening a
can of worms here,

2073
02:44:40,800 --> 02:44:44,319
» right?
>> These are good conversations when we

2074
02:44:42,800 --> 02:44:47,680
have a motion in front of us next next
meeting.

2075
02:44:44,720 --> 02:44:51,520
» I think I think staff can create a a
good motion that accomplishes the goal

2076
02:44:49,760 --> 02:44:55,279
and protects the city from everyone
deciding that they want to redo their

2077
02:44:52,880 --> 02:44:59,279
water their service lines.
I'm also thinking more specifically,

2078
02:44:57,600 --> 02:45:06,640
like I don't want to cut out the rest of
the town, but the the downtown Water

2079
02:45:02,160 --> 02:45:12,560
Street business district area is the the
biggest thing in my mind because I want

2080
02:45:09,359 --> 02:45:20,000
to see a thriving downtown. I want all
the storefronts to be filled with

2081
02:45:15,600 --> 02:45:23,359
businesses. Um, but buying a buying a
building is already expensive enough if

2082
02:45:21,760 --> 02:45:32,080
you're starting a business and then
having uh 30, 40, 50 grand expense pop

2083
02:45:28,399 --> 02:45:37,600
up out of nowhere is um
detrimental to a thriving downtown. And

2084
02:45:34,720 --> 02:45:42,560
um as somebody who's had a business
downtown but never owned a building, uh

2085
02:45:40,000 --> 02:45:47,520
I wouldn't have been able to deal with
anything like that. And um I want to see

2086
02:45:45,840 --> 02:45:52,319
entrepreneurial
I want to see ideas take shape and

2087
02:45:50,240 --> 02:45:56,880
become businesses. And uh it's always
kind of blown my mind too that our

2088
02:45:54,319 --> 02:46:04,560
downtown buildings
um which kind of represent the the

2089
02:46:01,439 --> 02:46:12,160
the iconic nature of what Dora is as a
town is left kind of in the hands of

2090
02:46:09,600 --> 02:46:16,240
people who may or may not take care of
of the businesses. So that that's a

2091
02:46:14,319 --> 02:46:24,240
separate thing. But I think that like
the downtown historic brick building

2092
02:46:20,479 --> 02:46:28,720
infrastructure that's there is is
part of the community. It's part of the

2093
02:46:26,319 --> 02:46:33,840
town. And so I just I want to do what we
can to alleviate some of that pressure

2094
02:46:30,560 --> 02:46:38,640
from entrepreneurial business building.
So when I think about it, I think of it

2095
02:46:35,680 --> 02:46:42,720
kind of specifically to that area. It
could be a can of worms if we're opening

2096
02:46:40,479 --> 02:46:49,920
it up to the whole community. But I do
want to be supportive of business owners

2097
02:46:46,720 --> 02:46:52,240
in town here. So hopefully that wasn't a
circular

2098
02:46:51,439 --> 02:46:56,160
ramble.
>> Do we have a motion to for any action or

2099
02:46:54,720 --> 02:47:02,720
are we going to table it or
>> No, I think we I I will resend my motion

2100
02:46:58,800 --> 02:47:09,200
with Steve's ask of city staff to come
with come with a motion drafted for us

2101
02:47:05,200 --> 02:47:12,720
to vote on to the next meeting. Um,
>> even if you plan to vote no, I do I

2102
02:47:11,600 --> 02:47:16,399
personally think it'd be an okay thing
to talk about. So, tra let Travis know

2103
02:47:14,960 --> 02:47:18,960
if you're okay with that. It helps him
to see us nod when someone says

2104
02:47:17,760 --> 02:47:22,600
something like this so he knows it's not
just Emily's opinion

2105
02:47:24,160 --> 02:47:28,640
» and if this is going to be a motion and
we would come back with a resolution.

2106
02:47:28,000 --> 02:47:29,680
» Sure.
>> Yeah.

2107
02:47:29,120 --> 02:47:35,439
» Oh, got it.
>> Is it is it going to be citywide C3

2108
02:47:33,040 --> 02:47:38,479
district? What's the geograph know what
citywide means? That means all

2109
02:47:36,560 --> 02:47:42,319
residential, all industrial, like
everything.

2110
02:47:40,240 --> 02:47:46,560
» Yeah. I mean, if you're okay with C3, I
guess I would start with C3 and let's

2111
02:47:43,760 --> 02:47:49,439
see how it goes. Personally, um, if you
and Travis feel like it has to be

2112
02:47:48,080 --> 02:47:52,960
different, then you will tell us that
next meeting. But I guess for right now,

2113
02:47:51,359 --> 02:47:58,319
I'm interested in looking at the C3
district primarily.

2114
02:47:55,920 --> 02:48:03,439
» Infrastructure on the west side of Decor
is 50 years old under that business

2115
02:48:00,880 --> 02:48:05,920
district.
So, you're thinking we should include

2116
02:48:04,720 --> 02:48:09,520
all business districts?
>> I think you should do if you're going to

2117
02:48:07,200 --> 02:48:13,520
do it fair for one, fair for all.
>> Okay.

2118
02:48:11,439 --> 02:48:18,720
» And am I hearing commercial and
residential, industrial, or just

2119
02:48:15,920 --> 02:48:22,640
commercial?
>> I mean, now,

2120
02:48:19,760 --> 02:48:29,439
» Travis, you you proposed the whole all
of it because you think that's feasible?

2121
02:48:26,319 --> 02:48:33,399
» It would raise rates. It's feasible. It
would um

2122
02:48:33,439 --> 02:48:40,960
but I
I don't think we'll see a mass influx of

2123
02:48:38,160 --> 02:48:44,479
people running out for preemptive water
and sewer main replacement. I mean, if

2124
02:48:42,880 --> 02:48:47,760
you've priced one of these out to have
your water sewer line, you you're

2125
02:48:46,160 --> 02:48:52,240
talking 10,000 plus,
>> right?

2126
02:48:48,080 --> 02:48:56,960
» Well, if it's if it's voluntarily done,
that's not on us. If it's an emergency,

2127
02:48:54,399 --> 02:49:02,240
that's different. if they're repairing a
sewer or water service, if they're

2128
02:49:00,240 --> 02:49:07,040
repairing their repair or replacement of
their service, I don't know how we would

2129
02:49:05,200 --> 02:49:13,840
differentiate, especially on the sewer
side, whether it's preventative or not.

2130
02:49:11,760 --> 02:49:17,680
So, I don't think the sewer side you can
really differentiate between the two.

2131
02:49:16,080 --> 02:49:22,399
» And that's that's why I think I mean I
think that that is honestly what we're

2132
02:49:20,080 --> 02:49:26,160
saying is that it's already going to be
an expensive cost to businesses and

2133
02:49:24,399 --> 02:49:29,439
homeowners. they already have to pay for
the underground. We're just now going to

2134
02:49:27,760 --> 02:49:34,240
pay for the pavement, right, to get the
street returned. So,

2135
02:49:32,319 --> 02:49:37,920
to me, I don't see that there's going to
be a rush of like, "Yes, let me please

2136
02:49:35,760 --> 02:49:41,600
go spend $10,000 and have my service
line redone." For businesses, the only

2137
02:49:40,479 --> 02:49:45,439
reason a business would want to be
preemptive is because, as the letter

2138
02:49:43,600 --> 02:49:49,680
pointed out to us today, right, you're
going to lose more business if your line

2139
02:49:47,040 --> 02:49:55,279
fails you than it's going to cost in the
$20,000 of repairs. So, I mean, and

2140
02:49:54,080 --> 02:49:58,560
bless them for doing that on Water
Street because it doesn't just affect

2141
02:49:56,720 --> 02:50:04,960
their business when that line breaks, it
affects a a whole block of downtown. And

2142
02:50:02,160 --> 02:50:11,120
so, by not doing this, we're really
hurting our economic development

2143
02:50:07,439 --> 02:50:16,240
downtown. And so, I guess I am okay with
a motion that is or with a resolution

2144
02:50:13,680 --> 02:50:20,479
that is citywide. Um, I also know of
homeowners who had to do it twice,

2145
02:50:18,720 --> 02:50:24,720
right? Okay. They had to pay for this
twice. I don't remember what it was, but

2146
02:50:22,960 --> 02:50:28,399
it was over on the west side. They had
to redo their water line twice. This was

2147
02:50:26,560 --> 02:50:32,319
a couple years ago.
>> They live in the house for 40 years.

2148
02:50:30,399 --> 02:50:36,319
» No, it it literally wasn't at I think
their pipes froze once and then

2149
02:50:33,600 --> 02:50:38,000
something else happened to the line.
>> That's true.

2150
02:50:37,200 --> 02:50:43,600
» What?
>> Anyhow, their service line was on the

2151
02:50:39,439 --> 02:50:47,279
other side of the street. Um but um so I
I am okay with a resolution that is

2152
02:50:45,439 --> 02:50:51,520
citywide.
>> Yeah. And after having

2153
02:50:49,600 --> 02:50:55,840
after Ry's comment, I'm thinking about
the last comment that I made about just

2154
02:50:53,279 --> 02:51:01,840
being all downtown. And then in that
moment, uh residential people have

2155
02:50:58,960 --> 02:51:09,920
popped up that had to deal with a
massive Yeah. Anyway, I'm I'm I agree.

2156
02:51:06,160 --> 02:51:14,880
» So citywide in any all types of property
Y

2157
02:51:12,800 --> 02:51:19,279
» and we'll have another discussion at the
next meeting to

2158
02:51:17,760 --> 02:51:24,479
fill
fill in the blanks, scratch things out.

2159
02:51:22,560 --> 02:51:26,000
» Well, this gives I mean it's a good
>> Yeah.

2160
02:51:24,800 --> 02:51:29,760
» Does that give a start?
>> Yeah. I I mean I I don't think you guys

2161
02:51:27,600 --> 02:51:33,359
need to come up with like a a you know
publishable resolution. We don't need to

2162
02:51:31,439 --> 02:51:37,680
but but come with something in writing a
policy and and if you can develop a

2163
02:51:35,359 --> 02:51:40,240
policy for us to consider that that I
think saves us some staff time in terms

2164
02:51:39,040 --> 02:51:43,520
of preparing a resolution.
>> And you I mean you wrote this with

2165
02:51:41,600 --> 02:51:47,359
something in mind that was that you said
was sort of this compromise. I say go

2166
02:51:45,439 --> 02:51:51,680
with it, put it down on paper and we can
vote on

2167
02:51:49,760 --> 02:51:56,000
» and I I really appreciate the work
that's gone into it so far. Travis

2168
02:51:54,960 --> 02:51:58,960
» and you guys
>> or them.

2169
02:51:56,720 --> 02:52:02,240
» Yes.
>> All right. Okay. Is there any further

2170
02:52:00,080 --> 02:52:06,960
discussion needed on item 14 or 13,
excuse me?

2171
02:52:04,720 --> 02:52:10,800
Seeing none, moving on to item 14, board
and commission vacancies. We still have

2172
02:52:08,479 --> 02:52:14,399
a tree board, historic preservation,
human rights, and library board

2173
02:52:12,080 --> 02:52:19,279
openings. Any other matters on the
agenda for this evening?

2174
02:52:17,120 --> 02:52:25,200
» Wow, that was a long one.
>> Oh, yeah. We do have a work session um

2175
02:52:22,560 --> 02:52:30,560
on the for tomorrow night at 6 with for
talking about our fire department.

2176
02:52:28,800 --> 02:52:37,399
All right. Bon referendum issue. All
right. Seeing none, hearing none.

2177
02:52:34,000 --> 02:52:37,399
» Move to ajourn.