[0:02] Okay.
[0:02] Good evening ladies and gentlemen.
[0:03] Welcome to zoning Board of Adjustment
[0:05] for two thou July 16th, 2026.
[0:08] Please rise to the pledge.
[0:11] Alright. Pledge allegiance to the flyback
[0:14] of the United States of America.
[0:16] Due the republic for which it stands
[0:18] by one nation under God, indivisible Justice.
[0:25] Alright. Okay, let's start off
[0:28] by introducing the board all the way to my far left, please.
[0:32] Anthony Henry, Michael Donlin, Richard
[0:35] Trip, Crystal Morin. Secretary
[0:37] Lynn Perkins. Chair
[0:39] Jim Dietzel.
[0:40] Jason Ney.
[0:42] And to our far right,
[0:43] we have a code enforcement officer, Carrie Owen.
[0:47] And the clerk is Eileen Boudreaux.
[0:52] And these proceedings are scheduled to terminate at 10:00 PM
[0:56] And audio, our audio video recorded,
[0:58] please shut off all cell phones, iPhones, anything
[1:01] that could create a distraction
[1:02] to the proceedings in the event of an emergency, just stay
[1:05] to the staircase and we'll help you out.
[1:07] Don't use the, the electrical box
[1:09] that takes you to the lower floors.
[1:12] With that being said, we'll get moving along here.
[1:16] Our first case for consideration is a motion
[1:21] for rehearing and it is case number 26 dash 1 0 7.
[1:25] It is for submitted by James Foley, the against the owner,
[1:30] Byrd Enterprises, LLC.
[1:34] The submission has been entered on time
[1:37] and the board has had this for a few weeks.
[1:43] The applicant is requesting a rehearing
[1:47] to basically towards improprieties of the board's operation.
[1:53] And therefore, for consideration, we will open
[1:56] that up for discussion.
[1:59] Mr. Diesel, anything you'd like to say on this? No.
[2:02] Thank you Mr. Chair. Okay. Mr. Trip,
[2:05] I, I believe the, his reasoning
[2:10] in his request was just as colluded as
[2:15] his testimony when we heard the hearing, heard the case.
[2:20] I I do not find it anymore relevant now.
[2:24] All right, Mr. Don, Mr. Chair.
[2:26] I don't find any justification for a rehearing.
[2:30] Very good. Mrs. Moore
[2:32] Chair.
[2:33] I also don't find any new evidence for a rehearing,
[2:37] And the chair myself will say that I, I don't see anything
[2:42] that the board did not cover in for hearings and the, the,
[2:47] and no new information here to reconsider
[2:50] that the board did not address to begin with.
[2:55] So in that case, we have, do we have a motion on this?
[2:59] No, but I can wing it. I can You think you can? Yeah,
[3:02] I have.
[3:04] All right, well I'll let you wing it then. Go ahead.
[3:07] I make a motion on case number 26 dash
[3:11] 1 0 7 to grant a re-hearing
[3:17] for James L. Foley.
[3:22] And I believe that's it, right?
[3:24] Regarding the property itself?
[3:27] Oh, regarding 1 78 Hamstead Road,
[3:31] dairy New Hampshire 0 3 0 3 8
[3:34] by enterprises LLC
[3:37] and I take, I correct that.
[3:39] That's 180 7 Stead Road. Dairy New Hampshire.
[3:43] Mr. Foley is 1 78.
[3:45] Alright. And that concludes the reading of the motion.
[3:49] I need a second,
[3:52] I'll second it All.
[3:55] Should we include the case number in
[3:57] the hearing? In the motion?
[3:58] Yeah, I make a motion on case number 26 dash 1 0 7 is
[4:03] Okay. Thank you.
[4:04] Good. Mr. Trip, you've seconded that? Yes. Okay.
[4:09] Motion's been seconded. And any conversation on that Mr.
[4:12] Dietzel? You all set? All set. All set to my left Mr.
[4:16] Donlin, Mr. Trip?
[4:17] I'm good Mr. Chair. Alright, very good.
[4:20] All in favor moving that for vote? Say aye. Aye. Opposed?
[4:24] Mr. Trip? What? Say you No. Mr. Donlin? No. Mr. Dietzel? No.
[4:29] Mr. Mor No.
[4:30] And the chair will make that five nos as well
[4:34] as I'm sure the a butter is aware.
[4:39] His next recourse would be
[4:41] to the land use court, unfortunately.
[4:45] And we'll see where that goes from there. Alright.
[4:49] All right. Next case.
[4:53] 26 dash 107.
[4:55] This is continued from June 18th, 2026.
[5:00] And it is Michael and Frannie Greenberg.
[5:11] Hi folks. Hello. How you doing? Okay, good.
[5:14] Alright, so you gave us quite a submittal here.
[5:18] You gave us time. Are you retired?
[5:23] Pardon Me? What? Are you retired? He's
[5:27] Not from rehab, but yes.
[5:29] Yeah, I I understood that the, the, the bunnies
[5:32] and stuff kept you busy.
[5:34] They do. It does. We also have three children,
[5:37] our youngest of whom is in marketing.
[5:39] So at times we reach out to our kids
[5:41] for help in one way or another.
[5:43] And we had a daughter help us put together this,
[5:46] which hopefully answers whatever questions we left you
[5:49] with at our last meeting.
[5:53] Well, this isn't something that we normally hear now,
[5:57] so we, we like to err on the site
[5:59] of caution. Is that all right?
[6:02] Yes, absolutely. Alright, so folks,
[6:06] you gave us a submittal and we've heard from the abutters
[6:10] and we've heard from others.
[6:12] Then the abutters, you know, let that slide through.
[6:16] A lot of them were favorable to you.
[6:19] And as is the case, you have an opportunity to rebut any
[6:23] of the testimony that was, that was spoken.
[6:27] So if you'd like, you can narrate with your pamphlet
[6:30] that you gave the board
[6:31] and anything else that you may want to share
[6:36] with us in your rebuttal, you have the floor,
[6:41] We can offer just a brief summary, which is the last page.
[6:45] If you have other questions about the packet, we're happy
[6:48] to go back over any or all of that
[6:50] and we can do the entire packet if you are
[6:53] happy to go through that.
[6:55] But we try to address those questions that you had for us.
[7:00] The sum would you like to do?
[7:02] Well, I was gonna say, what I would do is focus on
[7:06] if you can recall the, particularly the,
[7:11] the commentary that was in opposition of yourself
[7:14] because it is the, the applicant to prove their case.
[7:19] And so you have some, some
[7:23] objections there and I would try to cover that
[7:25] and see what you can do.
[7:27] You may develop questions from us back.
[7:29] Okay, very good. Well, first we wanted to make sure
[7:34] that you were comfortable knowing
[7:36] what a home-based wildlife rehabilitation center really is.
[7:40] There was some concerns that the animals would come
[7:43] and be on site for long periods of time.
[7:46] The animals that come to us, in fact come
[7:49] for temporary medical care.
[7:51] The animals we see are not all
[7:55] onsite at one particular time.
[7:57] We did include for you pictures
[8:00] of the current property that we live on.
[8:02] It's our home. And
[8:04] after 11 years, we wanted you to see what it looks like.
[8:08] We fully expect that a, a dairy property,
[8:12] everything would primarily be with indoors.
[8:17] Anything that would happen would not be in front
[8:19] of the property close to the house.
[8:21] But we wanted to include that there was some concerns
[8:26] and we wanted to address the licensing.
[8:29] We are licensed by both New Hampshire Fish
[8:32] and Game, also the USDA.
[8:35] And so we've included those specifically
[8:38] how does one become licensed and what that means.
[8:42] We can, I'll give you specifics if you'd like to know.
[8:46] Yes, please. Okay.
[8:47] Thank you. For fish
[8:50] and game, if you are interested in becoming a wildlife
[8:53] rehabilitator under current Law
[8:55] and regs, you do 200 hours of work
[9:00] with a current class two rehabilitator.
[9:03] That would be myself or any of the others around the state.
[9:07] After 200 hours you find a veterinarian willing
[9:10] to sponsor you
[9:12] and you submit something that proves
[9:16] that you have done that work.
[9:18] Typically, your class two sponsor is willing
[9:22] to work with you beyond that.
[9:24] So that is the first means of having a license.
[9:27] We also hold a license to exhibit.
[9:30] That means if we do as be as we mentioned last time,
[9:34] if we want or have the time to go to
[9:38] a Girl Scout program
[9:39] or a rotary meeting, we have the license
[9:43] to take a non releasable animal offsite.
[9:47] When you do that, you also need to be licensed
[9:50] by the USDA, which we have.
[9:52] The regulations are that we are 100%
[9:58] Animal Welfare Act compliant.
[10:01] We have a formal veterinary care on file.
[10:06] We get unannounced inspections
[10:08] and we need to provide precise record keeping.
[10:12] So we hold three licenses to do what we're doing.
[10:17] I know there was some question about noise.
[10:21] Probably if, if you live near anyone
[10:25] or maybe you even yourself own a dog, you know,
[10:28] they can sometimes be quite loud.
[10:31] Wildlife patients typically are less than 20 decibels
[10:35] where a barking dog is 80 to a hundred.
[10:38] Your lawnmower 85 to 90,
[10:41] your rooster 90 plus your horse, 80 to 100.
[10:46] By nature, an injured
[10:49] wild animal is gonna be quiet.
[10:51] They don't want you to know they're there.
[10:54] Even if they're in pain, they are not making a lot of noise.
[10:59] So, as I mentioned, our most common patient
[11:03] is an eastern cottontail rabbit.
[11:06] Their volume is approximately 20 decibels.
[11:11] We wanted to mention release of animals as
[11:13] that was a concern.
[11:15] We are not allowed to release wherever we would like.
[11:19] We need permission from either a homeowner,
[11:21] if someone would like an A possum in their yard,
[11:24] we can check out the site, which we do.
[11:27] We have to make sure it's safe for the animal.
[11:31] But we do not just drive around
[11:33] and randomly pick sites where we work
[11:36] with New Hampshire Fish
[11:37] and Game to have pre-approved locations for these animals
[11:42] and make sure that they're safe when we do so.
[11:45] 76 Shani Road is not considered a release site for
[11:50] for animals staffing.
[11:54] I know there was some concern,
[11:55] what if someone wasn't on site
[11:57] and an animal might need care?
[12:00] We wanna let you know that home-based
[12:04] wildlife rehabilitators are
[12:07] what happens in the state of New Hampshire.
[12:10] There is not a mandate
[12:12] requiring 24 7 in your home.
[12:15] People work full time, they have animals, they work
[12:19] with fish and game to make sure that those animals are safe
[12:24] and if they need to leave the property, it's
[12:28] done in a fashion that those animals are cared for
[12:32] or left during a time they do not need to be fed.
[12:38] Our nonprofit status is something that
[12:43] it, it operates exclusively for exempt purposes
[12:47] and we are a 5 0 1 C3.
[12:51] So the concern about being a commercial property,
[12:55] our nonprofit status would automatically
[13:01] prove that this is not for a commercial use.
[13:05] We are not a business, we're not selling animals, we are not
[13:09] selling any other product
[13:15] as far as the rental goes
[13:18] because this property is owned by the Greenberg
[13:23] family as and not the nonprofit.
[13:26] Just as if you would like to rent your own home,
[13:29] that doesn't change the zoning of it.
[13:32] So the plan would be, as we had mentioned
[13:34] before, to have somebody on site to have to have renters
[13:38] and it is, it would be residential in nature of that home.
[13:43] And the rental agreement would serve strictly as,
[13:48] as a standard residential occupancy
[13:52] and would not violate zoning provisions
[13:55] regarding non-commercial districts.
[13:58] We were asked about vehicle traffic,
[14:03] both minimal and seasonal.
[14:05] What we did was we took a year's worth of intakes
[14:09] to determine how many cars on any given day might
[14:13] appear on our doorstep.
[14:15] If we get 13 possums brought to us,
[14:18] they don't come in 13 cars necessarily.
[14:22] They come, someone finds a mom that's passed with 13 babies.
[14:27] So close to 1500 animals are brought
[14:31] to us in far fewer vehicles with an average
[14:34] of being about three vehicles a day
[14:38] for the general public dropping off an animal.
[14:41] Out of curiosity, what we did
[14:43] after we left here, we also looked to see
[14:46] how long does it take someone to say,
[14:49] here I'm here in the yard.
[14:51] We get a text to being helped.
[14:54] And for them to turn around
[14:55] and leave that time may be four minutes.
[14:58] If they're chatty and they have a couple questions,
[15:01] it may be a little longer, maybe a seven or eight minutes.
[15:04] So if you think about the last time you went
[15:06] to Dunkin Donuts
[15:07] and tried to get your coffee, you know it's,
[15:10] it's not a long period of time.
[15:12] We're not inviting people to come in to sit down.
[15:16] We are not doing tours, people are not allowed
[15:19] to see the animals.
[15:20] It's a quick service. We need to get those animals care.
[15:24] So vehicle traffic was addressed here in our bar graph
[15:29] as well as vehicle capacity of the yard.
[15:33] Now we, with an engineer's help of measuring
[15:37] and considering
[15:40] how big your average vehicle was.
[15:42] This was measured to the vehicle.
[15:44] The vehicle we drive, which is a Jeep Cherokee,
[15:49] nine vehicles fit in this driveway comfortably.
[15:53] Could you fit more probably if you got
[15:56] them squeezing in there.
[15:57] But the diagram will show you the buildings
[16:00] and how nine cars would fit.
[16:03] Although we don't have nine cars, 40 volunteers
[16:08] come throughout the day, the week, the year.
[16:12] We do not have 40 people on site off season.
[16:16] We have one volunteer in the morning, one in the afternoon
[16:19] during our busy season.
[16:21] We might have four there during a shift,
[16:25] but that's four cars.
[16:27] We do have some husband and wife teams they drive together.
[16:31] So nine would be ample.
[16:34] We have of course included a few photos for you of some
[16:38] of our, our animals, which was just for the fun
[16:43] of doing it and end in a summary
[16:47] and we're happy to answer further questions
[16:50] that we didn't address
[16:51] but from our last meeting wanted to assure you
[16:56] that these things have been thought through
[17:00] that we are already doing this.
[17:02] Maybe some of you drove by our current property to see
[17:05] where we are in in Wyndham
[17:08] and we are happy now to take your questions. Mr.
[17:12] Trip, I was interested when you said do
[17:17] you, you do some exhibitions
[17:19] and then you said that you only do this
[17:23] with non releasable animals.
[17:26] Could you explain what a non releasable animal is?
[17:30] A non releasable animal is one
[17:32] that would not survive on its own in the wild,
[17:35] but one that could remain in captivity
[17:38] for educational purposes without it being
[17:41] stressful for that animal.
[17:43] Typically that would be an A possum.
[17:46] Possums are short-lived, but they're calm animals.
[17:50] We, when we use them,
[17:52] the general public is not allowed to touch them.
[17:55] We can use them for educational purposes.
[17:58] Talk about the natural history of an A possum, the benefit
[18:01] of having possums and coexisting with possums,
[18:05] but it means it's an animal
[18:06] that would not survive on its own
[18:10] and it's with us not suffering.
[18:12] And that's determined through veterinary care and clearing.
[18:16] And then that's where the USDA becomes involved.
[18:20] They too check their caging and their overall wellbeing.
[18:26] So, so the releasable animals are the animals that came,
[18:31] come in for treatment and then like you said, release.
[18:36] Yes, exactly. The non releasable are animals
[18:38] that I imagine came in for treatment
[18:41] and you determined that they were non releasable
[18:45] so you keep them.
[18:47] Yes. So I guess the question now is how many
[18:51] non releasable animals do you typically have?
[18:56] There's, I don't know if there's a typical
[18:59] right now we have four.
[19:04] Four. Alright, so the, I have another question if I might.
[19:08] The, I was
[19:12] interested in you, you being able to operate two sites
[19:18] and so I contacted Colonel Jordan,
[19:23] you know, and ask him specifically, you know, would,
[19:26] would you be able to have two sites?
[19:28] And he says absolutely, you know, he was,
[19:32] he think he spoke very highly of you
[19:35] and you know,
[19:38] but like I said, it was, it was a, a thing
[19:40] that I was interested in.
[19:42] You know, could you actually hold two licenses
[19:47] or actually you had actually you only have one license
[19:50] but you have two sites, you know,
[19:52] because your name is on is the only person correct license.
[19:57] Correct. Well I,
[20:01] I wish I would've done a little more research
[20:04] before you showed up last time, you know,
[20:07] but I think it was suitable that, that we
[20:11] asked you to come back because you know, we weren't
[20:15] that educated on what you do,
[20:21] you know, and what, what the rules are.
[20:23] So thank you for coming back. You're
[20:26] Very welcome.
[20:28] Ms. Moore. Mine are more clerical.
[20:32] Are you comfortable with having the stipulation on
[20:37] the variance that you keep 76 Genito Road
[20:40] as not a release site?
[20:43] We are. And then also,
[20:45] I don't know if it would be put on it,
[20:47] it depends on the other four.
[20:50] But would you be comfortable
[20:51] with keeping your nonprofit status current
[20:56] and stay in compliance with USDA and fish and game?
[21:00] We would, yes. Thank you.
[21:03] Anything else? No, Mr. Donlin?
[21:06] Yeah, just kind of jumping onto what Mr.
[21:08] Tripp was asking, is there, just outta curiosity,
[21:11] is there some sort of a limit by one of your licenses, USDA
[21:15] or otherwise that regulates the amount
[21:17] of non-lease animals you are permitted
[21:20] to have at once? Yes.
[21:22] USDA says that the license I have would allow us
[21:26] to have up to 50 non releaseable animals.
[21:30] One five or 5 0 5 0. Five
[21:32] Zero.
[21:33] Okay. And then just to reiterate, I believe this was said,
[21:37] but just 'cause it's in keeping what this conversation,
[21:39] those animals you're only allowed to take out, right?
[21:43] Nobody's allowed to come in,
[21:45] No one comes to us. That's correct.
[21:47] Thank you. Now, Mr. Diesel.
[21:54] Thank you Mr. Chair. Regarding
[21:58] the fifth criter in the hardship criterion, what are some
[22:03] of the special conditions of this piece of property
[22:07] that distinguish it from the other properties in the area
[22:11] and how does that affect your ability
[22:13] to do business one way or the other?
[22:16] Positive, negative. Well,
[22:17] The key, one of the key aspects
[22:19] of the property is the outbuildings.
[22:21] There are several outbuildings.
[22:24] Home base rehab, 90% plus is indoors.
[22:28] So having space that is not in the residential area,
[22:31] that allows for free movement of volunteers
[22:35] to go to those buildings.
[22:37] As you've seen on the property,
[22:38] there are three substantial outbuildings providing
[22:41] for storage of materials.
[22:43] The animals come in, many are very tiny,
[22:46] they're in incubators, they go to cages,
[22:48] varying stages of cages.
[22:50] So there's a lot of material involved in the process.
[22:54] The outbuildings here provide ability
[22:57] to store things on site
[22:59] and address the animals that are close by.
[23:01] So the outbuildings were the primary asset of the property.
[23:06] That and the fact that it is, you know,
[23:08] although it's frontages on the main road,
[23:11] the property extends all the way back to a very quiet area.
[23:14] So I think, you know, the property itself,
[23:18] the residential area is a bonus.
[23:21] The primary outbuildings were
[23:23] really the significant driver in, you know, how would this
[23:27] be utilized by a homebased rehab.
[23:29] It allows for, you know, very ease of access, ease
[23:34] of ability to handle all the requirements
[23:37] of a home-based rehab center
[23:39] all in one site rather than in my garage.
[23:43] Okay. Thank you. So you're, you're, you believe
[23:47] that this particular property,
[23:49] because of its special conditions, actually makes it
[23:53] conducive to doing what you want to do, is to pose
[23:58] as opposed to your neighbor, which might be less desirable
[24:03] location because of the building?
[24:05] Correct? Yeah. Okay. Thank you Mr. Chair.
[24:08] Anything else? No, thank you. You re you in indicated
[24:11] three licenses that you have the USDA
[24:14] and the through fish and game. What was the third
[24:17] Two are?
[24:18] Through New Hampshire Fish and Game. Oh, I see.
[24:20] There's the REHABILITATOR license.
[24:22] I hold an exhibitor license through Fish
[24:25] and Game and the USDA.
[24:26] So two, two categories with fish and game, correct.
[24:28] And one through the USDA? Correct. Okay. Correct. Got it.
[24:33] All right. I think someone addressed concerns
[24:36] and I think more so because of
[24:38] facility down the road from you about any contamination
[24:43] of water that could occur outside of your,
[24:47] do the domicile.
[24:49] And I do see that you have a photo here with a stream in it.
[24:52] But I I'm thinking
[24:53] that's from the millstone address? Yeah. Or is it from
[24:57] This The pictures are millstone, yes.
[24:59] Although we don't have a stream on the property,
[25:01] it may just look that way from the black and white image.
[25:05] Oh no, now I see what you're looking at. Yeah.
[25:08] So that's an semi-aquatic enclosure that
[25:12] houses currently three mink that are in our care.
[25:16] Okay, so that's not a, not a stream.
[25:19] It's contained, it's filtered,
[25:22] it flows within that enclosure.
[25:25] Okay. So there's no risk of public contamination
[25:29] or water runoff that, you know,
[25:31] contaminated water runoff, anything like that? Correct.
[25:33] There is not. Okay.
[25:34] Alright. I have no further questions.
[25:36] We've heard from the public
[25:38] and we heard from the public in the hearing prior
[25:43] and we extended the courtesy to people
[25:46] who are not direct abutters to this parcel
[25:50] that typically do not have standing to this,
[25:53] to this location.
[25:56] Ms. Owen, we did get staff report from you. Am I correct?
[26:00] We did correct. Okay. Anything else that you think we need
[26:02] to know that may have occurred in the last few weeks?
[26:05] No new information. I just wanted
[26:06] to mention a reminder when structuring the motion
[26:09] that a planning board site plan
[26:11] determination is recommended.
[26:13] Okay. All right.
[26:20] Got it. Alright. Okay. Anybody else have any questions?
[26:24] Mr. Henry? You all set? I'm all set.
[26:27] And Mr. Dani, anything from you?
[26:29] No, sir. All right.
[26:31] Well that being said, we can take a motion
[26:34] to go into deliberation if you folks are all set.
[26:37] Yes. So move second. Alright, Mr. Tripp makes a motion.
[26:42] And Mr. Donlin seconds all in favor
[26:44] of deliberation, say aye.
[26:46] Aye. Aye. And the opposed. All right.
[26:48] Anybody wish to lead off Mr. Dietzel?
[26:54] Well,
[26:59] I listened to what the, the Abutter had to say
[27:02] and she read an emotional letter from,
[27:06] from the former owner's daughter, I believe.
[27:09] And it was moving and,
[27:14] but I think many of her concerns were
[27:20] addressed by the applicants in their written response.
[27:25] And, and here tonight,
[27:28] and I'm, I'm hoping that, that,
[27:32] that she'll feel satisfied that the, the historic nature
[27:35] of this property will be continued.
[27:40] My, my problem, of course, as always is the,
[27:44] the hardship criterion.
[27:46] And I reread the statute
[27:49] and I re-read the, the notes.
[27:52] And here
[27:56] and under five
[28:01] A it says, for purposes
[28:04] of this subparagraph unnecessary hardship means
[28:08] that owing to special conditions of the property
[28:12] that distinguish it from the other properties in this,
[28:16] in the area, no fair and substantial relationship exists.
[28:23] It doesn't say whether those conditions are
[28:26] positive conditions, which make it more,
[28:29] as they stated earlier, conducive
[28:34] to use versus less.
[28:36] It just says whether it's distinguished
[28:39] from other properties.
[28:41] And I, I think for me, that's what that is,
[28:46] what makes this pass the hardship test
[28:50] because I think the other four criteria are met.
[28:54] I don't see any relationship to
[28:59] values and, and all the other ones.
[29:01] And so I don't think there's a, a,
[29:05] a substantial relationship between, between the purpose
[29:09] of the ordinance in this.
[29:11] And the second part is, is it reasonable?
[29:14] And I, I think the applicants have demonstrated
[29:16] to my satisfaction that this is
[29:18] a reasonable use of the property. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
[29:21] You're welcome. Anything else?
[29:23] No, thank you Mr. Don.
[29:26] Yeah, I, I believe that, just jumping on to the,
[29:30] the taking care of the home and the character.
[29:32] I, I, I would say that it's in their best interest
[29:36] to keep the house in functioning order.
[29:38] So I don't see that as a, as a problem.
[29:41] And certainly the, the pride they're taking in a,
[29:47] in a voluntary role, I'll say shows
[29:51] that they have a lot of respect for
[29:56] life and property as without overstating it.
[30:00] And I believe one of the other concerns I, going back
[30:04] to the animals only being able to be taken out as far as
[30:10] exhibits and stuff are concerned.
[30:11] I believe one of the other things one
[30:13] of the neighbors brought up with, they didn't want it
[30:14] to turn into a petting zoo.
[30:15] So I believe that's been resolved as well.
[30:19] Okay. Mr. Trip,
[30:25] As Mr.
[30:26] Donlin said, you know, the, and,
[30:28] and as you had mentioned, you know, there, there is a
[30:32] animal sanctuary on this same street that is,
[30:39] is being operated kind
[30:44] of sketchy, sketchy, you know, I believe what the,
[30:50] the applicant is asking to do is well thought out,
[30:54] well planned meets the
[31:00] requirement that it's not a,
[31:07] a detriment to the, you know, public.
[31:13] I, I think that the,
[31:18] the two weeks we had to research the, the legal side
[31:22] of everything were well spent, you know,
[31:25] and the applicant also
[31:28] provided a bunch of information that, you know,
[31:29] was not presented at the previous hearing.
[31:35] So I think it, it's
[31:41] something that dairy can be proud of.
[31:47] Okay. Ms. Moore?
[31:50] I agree with Mr. Dietzel.
[31:53] I had researched the listing so I could get a better idea
[31:58] of the house and the property and it's beautiful.
[32:01] There's no question asked whatsoever.
[32:05] And I agree that those buildings are gonna be used
[32:08] for something they need to be,
[32:10] and as a mom of five adult kids, it just screamed a DU
[32:15] and compounded
[32:16] and it just,
[32:18] I think the direction they're going in is better suited than
[32:22] what it could go in.
[32:25] Okay. Is that it? Yeah. I think Mr.
[32:29] Dietzel narrates through one of the key points
[32:32] of the five criteria and what I all,
[32:36] but what I find is that often as we are an evolving
[32:41] society, and there's often things that when planning
[32:46] and legislation
[32:48] and executive approval
[32:52] construct things like in the case of all government,
[32:55] sometimes things get lost through the cracks.
[32:57] And I think the fact that this is a licensure
[33:04] use and it's probably not one
[33:07] that when we were working on the legislative
[33:10] and executive process was even thought of.
[33:13] I think that that brings us back to is,
[33:17] is the use unreasonable?
[33:20] And to me this is because it protects the public,
[33:23] because it protects the, the critters.
[33:27] It is one that is a contact address and
[33:30] therefore needs, needs this approval,
[33:34] but does not stipulate that that there is
[33:39] in reflection of a use that's not really recognized,
[33:44] but does not impact the public negatively, I think is a use
[33:49] that is reasonable for the property when you are looking at
[33:54] that fifth leg of the, of the criteria.
[33:59] And so I think that this is overall a reasonable use
[34:03] that does not impact the public in a negative way.
[34:06] And I think it benefits the public by preserving
[34:11] what we often see and enjoy and,
[34:15] and not not seeing some mutilation on the side of the road.
[34:19] So anyway, that's my position on that.
[34:22] And, and so I'd like to move forward
[34:25] and construct the motion as code enforcement has requested,
[34:31] site plan determination should be added to this
[34:35] above and beyond the subject to obtaining all state
[34:39] and town permits and inspections.
[34:41] Are there any other conditions
[34:42] that the board voting members would like to
[34:47] apply to this motion?
[34:50] I think just the one, the not become a release site,
[34:55] just 'cause that was their biggest,
[34:57] what I felt was the biggest concern would be animals going
[35:02] there and then them releasing 'em there as well.
[35:06] We are aware that the supervisory aspects
[35:08] of this under this license, we,
[35:11] we didn't ask if there was inventory actually written
[35:15] for the animals that are brought in,
[35:17] but in in the idea of your concern,
[35:20] this being a release site, I think the licensure aspect
[35:24] of it ensures that it's not, not the case.
[35:27] Right. It's not a, it's just a debate. It's not a
[35:32] No.
[35:33] I didn't even think of if someone was to call
[35:35] and say they had, you know, five pets one day
[35:38] and now there's only four that it could, I just, I could see
[35:42] where it would go for Ms. Owens.
[35:44] So I think having it on the record
[35:46] that it can't be is enough.
[35:48] Are you, that's what you would like? Yes. Okay.
[35:51] Anybody have any opposition to that? No. Ms. Tr Ms. Doman.
[35:55] Okay. Address not to be.
[35:58] No, I was agreeing
[35:59] with you saying it didn't have to be there.
[36:01] Oh, okay. Very good. What'd You, what'd you say?
[36:05] She said it does not have to be on the,
[36:07] as a condition of the motion.
[36:10] All right. The last thing I I would want to point out is
[36:14] that the licensing goes with the individual on this and
[36:19] therefore as sunsetting can apply to the individual
[36:23] and not the property, I would ask that we sunset this
[36:28] and that when the greenbergs vacate
[36:30] or sell the home, that they're also that license
[36:35] to operate there expires
[36:37] and that someone else buying the home cannot just take
[36:40] that on under any needs.
[36:44] Anybody object to that?
[36:46] I think we should add a condition
[36:47] that should the greenbergs cease
[36:53] operating the rehabilitation center,
[36:56] that the variance would sunset also.
[36:59] Okay. Approval to operate
[37:07] Requires licensing
[37:10] Sunsets
[37:15] with the vacation of the vacating of the greenbergs.
[37:20] Correct?
[37:23] Well the thing is the greenbergs, could
[37:26] you stop doing this?
[37:28] Yes. You know, and when, when they no longer have a license,
[37:34] then I think the variance should lapse.
[37:36] Correct. Mr.
[37:38] Dietzel, did you follow along with my comment?
[37:42] I followed along, I think
[37:44] Written to your satisfac my satisfaction.
[37:46] Yep. Yep. Mr. Donlin,
[37:50] Strictly as, I suppose more devil's advocate than
[37:53] anything, I could see a world where one of their volunteers,
[37:58] specifically the person that might be renting it,
[38:00] would probably want to move forward
[38:02] and its stead when they are no longer trying to,
[38:06] and I could see that as being somewhat of a hurdle.
[38:11] Right. So the, the last condition of the motion says,
[38:14] approval to operate sunsets with the vacating
[38:17] of the greenbergs.
[38:19] Is that acceptable to you?
[38:23] Meaning when they sell it
[38:24] and they vacate it, their license goes,
[38:27] somebody else can't just come in and take a license over it.
[38:29] They'd have, somebody else would essentially have
[38:31] to come back here to do this all over again.
[38:33] Fair enough. Alright. Mrs. O Mor, you good with that?
[38:36] Yeah. Mr. Tripp as well? Yep. Alright, very good.
[38:39] That's third condition. Fourth and all. We all good? Yep.
[38:42] All right. Very good. Anything else? All right.
[38:45] The motion is structured.
[38:47] So with that, let's make a motion come out
[38:50] of deliberative Mr.
[38:51] De second. All right. Mr. Dietzel has a second off of Mr.
[38:56] Trip's motion. All in favor
[38:57] of coming outta deliberation, say aye.
[38:59] Aye. Aye. Aye. Any opposed? Very good.
[39:03] Mrs. Moore, you have a motion to read?
[39:06] I do. Thank you. I make a motion on case number
[39:10] 2 6 7 to grant a variance
[39:15] to the terms of Article six, section
[39:19] 1 65 dash four six A of the town
[39:23] of dairy zoning ordinance
[39:26] to allow a wildlife rehabilitation center use at the
[39:31] property parcel ID
[39:33] 0 8 0 4 1 0 0 1 zoned
[39:39] MDR as presented with the following conditions.
[39:42] We have three. One subject to obtaining Allstate
[39:46] and town permits and inspections.
[39:49] Two site plan by planning board site
[39:54] three approval to op.
[39:57] The approval is to operate
[39:59] sunsets when the greenbergs vacate the property.
[40:03] And that concludes the reading of the motion.
[40:05] I need a second,
[40:06] Mr.
[40:07] Donlin. Second. Thank you.
[40:11] Any comments there all?
[40:13] Let's get in finding of fact. I'm sorry,
[40:15] Sorry to interrupt if I could make a comment.
[40:17] It's called a site plan
[40:18] determination required by the planning board. Maybe
[40:21] You, did we get that?
[40:22] No, I said I didn't do determination. Okay.
[40:25] So I'd like to correct it for number two is site plan
[40:28] determination by planning board.
[40:30] You good there? Thank you. Very good. Thank you.
[40:34] I knew I was missing a word. Did you hear the pause?
[40:39] Alright, that motion's on the floor has been second.
[40:42] Let's work into the finding of fact.
[40:44] I know that the facts, some initial facts here, the,
[40:48] and I'll ask the board to contribute on this,
[40:51] but currently the applicant desires
[40:53] to create a wildlife rehabilitation center on the parcel.
[40:56] The applicants are licensed by the State of New Hampshire
[40:59] and the USDA,
[41:01] the parcel is in the Medium density residential district.
[41:04] And the license for is for rehabilitation
[41:08] and release as guideline by the state regulations.
[41:11] The activities of the center would remain unseen
[41:14] to the public and primarily operate indoors.
[41:19] Are there any other facts
[41:20] that you have heard in this case, Mr.
[41:23] Dietzel, that you'd like to have noted as a, as a heading?
[41:26] No. Thank you. Okay. Mr. Born? No, thank you. Mr. Trip.
[41:30] Did you mention that there's, they also have a license for
[41:36] exhibiting animals,
[41:37] but the animals had to be non releasable?
[41:40] I think I've indicated that the license has,
[41:43] that they have three licenses.
[41:45] Okay. Tooth fish and game one. The USDA. Is that good? Fine.
[41:50] Mr. Donlin, anything you'd like to add?
[41:52] No, sir. Alright, Very good.
[41:53] Well then let's get into the work through the findings
[41:56] of fact and how the board
[41:59] sees the depictions of the applicant.
[42:01] The first is the public interest. Mr.
[42:03] Dietzel, do you see anything there you'd like
[42:05] to mention on the public interest?
[42:09] I don't think it'll be contrary to the public interest.
[42:12] It, it's a, a, certainly a worthwhile endeavor.
[42:16] It is in the public interest
[42:18] and I don't, I think
[42:25] the first criterion is met.
[42:26] Okay. Mr. Mr.
[42:28] Donlin on the public interest, what do you say?
[42:33] I believe the variances will not be contrary
[42:35] to public interest for reasons stated.
[42:38] All right. Mrs. Moron
[42:40] Chair, I also agree that it will not be contrary
[42:43] to the public interest for reasons stated.
[42:46] All right, Mr. Tripp? Ditto.
[42:49] Alright. In my world, I find
[42:53] that this would be in the public interest as it's
[42:58] preserving our wildlife and,
[43:01] and making a benefit to our,
[43:05] to the public overall regarding the spirit of ordinance.
[43:10] Mr. Dietzel, what do you think?
[43:13] The main concern, I think was the fact
[43:17] that it wasn't gonna be an owner,
[43:19] opper owner occupied property.
[43:22] The applicant's asserted
[43:25] that it's really no different from any other property
[43:27] that's rented out.
[43:30] And I, I found that argument convincing.
[43:33] I don't, I don't think that it's contrary to the spirit
[43:36] of the ordinance, which is to keep rural neighborhoods rural
[43:41] and non-commercial
[43:44] and
[43:48] not, not crowded.
[43:49] So I, I believe that the spirit
[43:51] of the ordinance is maintained if we grant it.
[43:54] Very good. Mr. Donlin,
[43:56] how do you feel about the spirit of the ordinance?
[43:58] Feel the spirit of the ordinance is observed for a reason?
[44:02] Stated, and I will add on that no,
[44:07] really no structural changes
[44:09] or nothing elaborate
[44:11] to the residence itself is happening. This is all internal.
[44:14] Very good. I like that. Okay.
[44:16] No change to the property, Mrs. Mrs. Mor?
[44:21] I agree. The spirit of the ordinance is observed
[44:24] because it's not changing the character of the neighborhood
[44:27] and having the planning board.
[44:29] If they do, having them do the site work, they'll be able
[44:33] to put down anything.
[44:35] So to confirm, there'll be no changes.
[44:38] Very good. Mr. Tripp?
[44:40] Well, I believe that
[44:42] unless someone that is looking to bring a animal that's
[44:48] injured goes to the Fish and Game website and,
[44:51] and looks up where the rehabilitative sites are,
[44:56] they would never know that the Greenbergs were operating
[44:59] in a rehab center. Yeah,
[45:01] I, and I would say also the spear of the ordinances there
[45:04] of, everyone's touched on this, there's no change
[45:06] to the parcel at all.
[45:08] And, and as Mr.
[45:09] Tripp has just indicated, the use would be concealed.
[45:13] I think I recognize this is nothing more than a location
[45:17] for the, for the state to have the license registered
[45:21] and a second opportunity to keep the, the critters alive.
[45:27] I will say this, I was a, i I hunt
[45:30] and one time I found a moose in the last weekend
[45:33] of the season struggling in the, in the forest.
[45:36] And we, we were there in the woods till eight 30 at night
[45:40] trying to save it and fish and game came out the next day.
[45:43] So you can't save it. So they shot it
[45:45] and then I dragged it out and we ate it.
[45:46] So we
[45:48] Try to make The best students
[45:49] of everything though ways.
[45:52] Fish and game shot it, by the way. I did not, so anyway,
[45:56] You're not gonna be invited.
[45:59] When you said we drug it out, did fish
[46:01] and game help drag it out?
[46:03] Well, actually to get it outta the woods,
[46:05] they got an a TV up, hooked a cable to it, dragged it,
[46:08] and I had to ride on the handlebars of the,
[46:10] of the four wheeler to keep it from flipping.
[46:12] 'cause the moose was 700
[46:14] pounds substantial Justice.
[46:20] Mr. Dietzel, you wanna lead?
[46:23] Well, I, I I think that any potential harm
[46:26] to the public would be minimal or hypothetical only.
[46:29] I think the, the applicants did a pretty good job
[46:32] of addressing, addressing their concerns.
[46:36] And so I think the benefit to the applicants outweighs any
[46:39] potential harm to the public.
[46:41] I think substantial justice would be done if we were
[46:44] to allow this variant.
[46:46] All right, Mr. Don?
[46:49] I believe substantial justice is done as well.
[46:52] They're making good use of a property, somewhat
[46:56] of a busy road setback.
[46:57] Fairly unique property for CTO for sure.
[47:00] And I think this is a, a very unique
[47:04] and reasonable use of, of what's existing there.
[47:07] All right, very good. Mrs. Moore,
[47:09] I also agree for already thinks what Mr.
[47:13] Donlin had said, that I agree with him
[47:15] that substantial justice is done.
[47:18] Okay, Mr. Trip?
[47:20] Well, I, I don't believe that any harm is done
[47:23] to the public, but there is, you know,
[47:27] substantial, you know, good being done
[47:31] by keeping our little critters alive.
[47:35] All right. And I think that the substantial justice
[47:38] of the gain to the public outweighs
[47:43] is outweighed by the approval of this
[47:47] valuation values of surrounding properties.
[47:50] Are they diminished Mr. Dietzel?
[47:53] No. Okay. Mr. Donlin,
[47:56] I do not believe the values
[47:57] of the surrounding properties will be diminished.
[47:59] Very good. Mrs. Moore Chair, I agree as well.
[48:02] All right, Mr. Trip. I don't believe
[48:05] that there'll be any impact on the property values
[48:08] And Mr. Perkins would concur that I see no negative impact
[48:12] to the property or,
[48:13] or the surrounding properties as this is a contained use,
[48:17] primarily within the building or the structure,
[48:19] or in an unseen situation,
[48:22] literal enforcement creates unnecessary hardship.
[48:27] Mr. Dietzel, you wanna speak to that?
[48:28] And we can keep this category a if you'd like.
[48:35] The, the, the little paragraph one kind of says it all,
[48:39] the substantial relationship between literal enforcement
[48:44] and the, and the, the goals of the town that I take that
[48:48] to mean that we shouldn't be disallowing something
[48:51] for the sole purpose of disallowing it.
[48:54] We shouldn't, we should take into consideration the other
[48:57] four criteria and it should be based on the,
[49:02] the unique characteristics of the property.
[49:05] And that could be for the better or for the worse.
[49:08] And I, I just don't see how disapprove, how,
[49:16] how I see
[49:18] how a hardship would be created if we were
[49:21] to just simply say no.
[49:24] Alright. Very good, Mr. Donlin.
[49:27] Yeah, I agree. And I, I'll also say that if the,
[49:31] to your point or during the deliberative session
[49:33] of this might just be something that wasn't thought
[49:35] of when they were making zoning rules.
[49:36] And I would be willing to bet that's true.
[49:39] The state allows this, this is something
[49:41] that's clearly been thought of on, on, on some level fish
[49:44] and game wise, that's why there's a license.
[49:47] So it would, in my opinion, be a hardship to deny something
[49:50] that's allowed through the state just
[49:52] because our town doesn't have the, the means and the books
[49:56] Very good.
[49:57] Nicely said. Ms. Moore,
[49:59] I agree with both of them. I can't word it better.
[50:02] Okay, Mr. Tripp,
[50:07] Basically all we're doing by it
[50:12] saying that there's a
[50:17] hardship is creating a new use.
[50:22] And as several people said, you know, when we're
[50:26] in the process of developing our zoning ordinance, you know,
[50:31] who would've thought that we would need a, an
[50:36] animal rehabilitation center?
[50:38] Right? But I'm happy to create one.
[50:43] Well, little enforcement I find creates a nec unnecessary
[50:47] high hardship is this is a blind use and,
[50:50] and it's designed that way to help these, the critters that
[50:55] has brought this case forward to help rehabilitate them.
[50:58] And I see this as a peaceful transition.
[51:00] So therefore I, I support this on
[51:04] that fi f fifth leg as well.
[51:07] That being said, does not require us to go into section B
[51:10] of, of, of the fifth leg.
[51:12] Brings us back to the motion sheet
[51:17] if no one has anything else on the five on the finding
[51:20] of fact, all those in favor
[51:23] of moving this for a vote, say aye.
[51:24] Aye. Aye. Any, any opposed? Mr. Donlin? Yes. Mr. Tripp? Yes.
[51:29] Mr. Dietzel? Yes. Ms. Morn? Yes. And the chair votes Yes.
[51:33] Makes that a unanimous.
[51:35] So congratulations folks, you've passed
[51:37] by a vote of five to zero.
[51:41] Thank you. We appreciate very much. Thank you.
[51:45] Kind of brings a tear to your eye.
[51:47] But anyway, anybody agreed by this has 30 days
[51:50] to ask this board for reconsideration.
[51:52] After that recourse will be to superior court.
[51:54] Okay? Good luck.
[51:56] And if you get a raccoon that you can't release,
[52:00] you can bring 'em for the next experience.
[52:02] Anybody wants a bat? Are they playing possum?
[52:11] There's lot of people leaving,
[52:18] My goodness.
[52:20] Alright, Let's get, keep moving.
[52:22] Case number 26 dash 1 1 8.
[52:25] This would be Kozo Enterprises,
[52:28] LLCA.
[52:46] Good evening gentlemen, you'd like
[52:47] care to introduce yourselves?
[52:49] Good evening. My name is Rob Degan with SNH Land Services.
[52:53] With me tonight is Mike Kuzo.
[52:56] How you doing? Michael Kuzo.
[52:58] Okay, very good. And you are representing Mr. Kuzo?
[53:02] That is correct. Alright, Well
[53:04] Cool.
[53:05] So what we ask for is our protocol is
[53:07] that we have five criteria.
[53:09] Read first for the record
[53:10] and then we will move on from there
[53:12] and bar you with questions. Sound
[53:16] Good?
[53:17] Absolutely. Alright. All right.
[53:21] My favorite part of this. Okay.
[53:23] Variance will not be contrary to public interest.
[53:26] The applicant's use of the property has had a
[53:28] negligible impact on the public.
[53:31] To deny the variance would be a disruption to his business.
[53:35] Thus any benefit to the public would be outweighed
[53:37] by the impact on the applicant.
[53:41] Spirit of the ordinance,
[53:42] the applicant's use uses the property,
[53:45] does not threaten the health, safety,
[53:46] and welfare of the community, thus is not contrary
[53:49] to the spirit and intent of the ordinance.
[53:52] Substantial justice, multiple properties in the surrounding
[53:56] neighborhood are multi-unit dwellings with mixed use
[53:58] and dwellings on the ground floor.
[54:01] Denying the variance would be a
[54:03] disruption to the applicant's business.
[54:05] Any benefit to the public would be outweighed
[54:07] by the impact on the applicant value
[54:11] of surrounding properties.
[54:13] The applicant seeks to maintain a nonconforming situation
[54:16] while correcting some encroachments
[54:17] and providing additional screening.
[54:19] There have been no complaints from the surrounding property
[54:22] owners regarding the use of this property,
[54:24] thus granting the variance would not increase impact on the
[54:27] applicant's property has on its neighbors.
[54:30] The nonconforming residential use is compatible
[54:32] with the surrounding neighborhood,
[54:33] which contains multiple similar use uses
[54:37] and literal enforcement.
[54:39] The property is the best place for the applicant
[54:41] to store his excess materials.
[54:43] If the materials were
[54:44] to be moved onto the property at 27 Franklin,
[54:47] they would represent a greater public nuisance
[54:49] as the only practical location
[54:51] to store them would be in the front yard
[54:52] of the house of 27 Franklin.
[54:54] On the backside of the property at six Pearl Street,
[54:57] the materials are screened from Pearl Street
[54:59] and the by the building and topography
[55:01] and additional private sea fencing is proposed
[55:04] to further screen the site from neighboring properties.
[55:10] Anything else you wish to add off script?
[55:12] Yeah, so I, I just wanted to give a brief history of this.
[55:17] So Mr. Kuzo bought six Pearl Street first.
[55:21] He, you can see from the, the maps
[55:23] provided he owns six Pearl and 27 Franklin.
[55:28] And then when the property at 27 Franklin became vacant
[55:32] and available, he, he acquired that as well
[55:34] and he began operating his business out of it,
[55:37] which is a contracting company.
[55:40] They install like patios and stuff.
[55:42] Yeah, like patios, masonary, masonry work.
[55:46] And he was blissfully unaware
[55:48] that he needed site plan approval for this.
[55:50] And the, the town came to him last year
[55:55] and said, Hey, you need to have a site plan for this.
[55:59] So our company got involved, we prepared a
[56:03] proposed site plan for him
[56:05] and then we, we went to the technical review committee
[56:09] and you know, got input from all the departments
[56:12] and everything was moving along.
[56:13] And then it was determined that, oh wait, the materials
[56:17] at six Pearl constitute a contractor yard,
[56:21] which is not an allowed use in
[56:23] the central business district.
[56:24] Whereas the contractor use is.
[56:28] So what we're here to do is get a variance
[56:32] to continue his use of the back of the property.
[56:36] So what he's doing on the back of the property, it's not
[56:41] what you would necessarily think
[56:43] of when you hear the phrase contractor yard.
[56:46] You might be thinking of like a lumber yard where
[56:49] customers come in and pick out product
[56:51] and bring in a truck and take it away.
[56:53] That's not what's happening there.
[56:55] What's happening there is storage of excess materials
[56:58] and like, you know,
[57:00] parking a trailer there overnight and stuff like that.
[57:04] So it's not, there's no customer activity there. Okay.
[57:09] Or public activity. It's just things are being stored.
[57:15] So that's where we are now.
[57:16] And as a kind of an addendum to that,
[57:21] the reason we we brought up the residential use is that,
[57:25] you know, because now we're changing the property,
[57:29] we're asking for change of use.
[57:32] The what would be a grandfathered use really needs to be
[57:36] like, okay, so the front of the property at Six Pearl
[57:40] is a three three unit residential building.
[57:45] And as the board is aware, in the central business district,
[57:49] multifamily is allowed as an accessory to
[57:53] and like above the first floor.
[57:56] So it's supposed to be like commercial use on the ground
[57:59] floor with residences above is what's permitted.
[58:04] And that's not what's there.
[58:05] It's just a house which is in keeping
[58:10] with all the surrounding properties.
[58:12] You know, next door there's a four unit building.
[58:14] The other side, there's a, I believe two unit building
[58:18] and then none of them have businesses in them.
[58:21] So we're just looking to maintain the status quo
[58:25] of what's going on there.
[58:28] Do you have anything you wanna add, Mike?
[58:32] Mainly this is just like a storage shed
[58:36] to put all the equipment
[58:37] and anything that, that they brought up
[58:40] that wouldn't be allowed in this district.
[58:42] So it would just kind of house that it's, it, I'm not
[58:47] looking to ruffle any feathers, I just want to continue
[58:50] to move forward
[58:51] and operate the business out of that location.
[58:56] So you purchased Pearl Street first
[58:59] and the second Franklin was the Bruno residence.
[59:02] Am I correct? Yes. And when did you purchase
[59:05] the Pearl Street property?
[59:07] Geez, I think it's been eight years ago now. Okay.
[59:10] I wanna say
[59:12] When did you purchase the Bruno property?
[59:16] Probably two years after that, so six years ago.
[59:18] Six years ago. Okay. And that's
[59:20] how long the business has been going out of there since I
[59:23] bought the first property.
[59:24] Alright. So my understanding is that you have been,
[59:27] that you purchased the Pearl Street
[59:30] property as a multifamily?
[59:31] Yes sir. And you reside there as well?
[59:35] No, I did and then we purchased Franklin Street
[59:37] and you redid that.
[59:39] And then we moved
[59:40] to Marlborough Street actually now, so. Okay.
[59:42] So how long were you operating your business
[59:46] out of Pearl Street?
[59:48] Right from day one
[59:50] Pr pretty much it was like a side business.
[59:51] At first I worked for a local company
[59:53] and I had my first daughter, multifamily
[59:55] and next thing you know, here we are.
[59:58] Okay. Ms. Owen, do we have images of, of
[1:00:02] what we're dealing with in these files by chance or not?
[1:00:06] We do, yes. I I can look, that's not a problem,
[1:00:08] but I want to see if, if we had that.
[1:00:13] What was the, this file here? Hang on just a second, Mr.
[1:00:17] Chair. Point of order. Yes sir. Who is the fifth member?
[1:00:22] Good question. Who'd like to be the fifth member? Mr.
[1:00:25] Dani would like to be, he raised his hand. Mr.
[1:00:29] Dani, would you sit on this case please? Thank you Mr. Don.
[1:00:32] Yes. For bringing up my attention.
[1:00:33] We'll swing back around to you afterwards.
[1:00:36] Let me distribute these photos here
[1:00:40] and so I get a good feel and idea on this.
[1:00:46] So now you're a full-time kind of contractor?
[1:00:49] Yes Sir. And I don't know that I, that I
[1:00:54] necessarily agree with the description
[1:00:57] of contractor yard being one that looks like a lumber yard,
[1:01:01] but I think we understand.
[1:01:03] So what, what each other is saying here.
[1:01:10] So do you have a,
[1:01:15] a structure that's being built here or a shed
[1:01:18] or something or garage?
[1:01:19] So I don't, currently, I have like a storage container
[1:01:22] and another like tent apparatus
[1:01:24] should say on like bin block.
[1:01:26] Okay. But we, this main area is
[1:01:28] where I park different trucks
[1:01:30] and just store hand tools
[1:01:35] where the guys load up in the morning.
[1:01:37] It won't be a ton of activity during the day.
[1:01:39] It's pretty much when they come in at seven
[1:01:41] and when they get back at four 30.
[1:01:44] And part of the proposed plan,
[1:01:45] which is obviously gonna have to go back
[1:01:47] through the planning board, is to put a
[1:01:49] three bay garage up in, in there
[1:01:53] and erect some like privacy fence like vinyl fencing
[1:01:57] around the area
[1:02:01] To shield Screen.
[1:02:02] Yeah. Just to make a, a nice visual screen.
[1:02:05] I'm gonna distribute the pictures here to everybody.
[1:02:07] What I'm seeing on this is storage containers,
[1:02:12] metal storage containers.
[1:02:14] Are those on the Franklin Street property or the,
[1:02:16] Those are actually on Pearl Street.
[1:02:19] On Pearl Street. Okay. Yeah.
[1:02:23] Let me, let me hand these out.
[1:02:25] I'm gonna go to the left with the photos and then Mr.
[1:02:27] Dani, Mr. Dietzel, you guys can take
[1:02:29] a look at it afterwards.
[1:02:31] And in the meantime let's get a narrative from Code
[1:02:35] Enforcement and see what was going on
[1:02:37] and how this one came about.
[1:02:39] Sure. Thank you. As the applicant stated,
[1:02:42] so they're requesting a variance
[1:02:43] to utilize the existing rear portion of the property of
[1:02:47] the subject property six Pearl Street
[1:02:49] to allow the construction of a three bay contractor garage
[1:02:52] for the use by the business at the abutting property at
[1:02:55] 27 Franklin Street.
[1:02:57] As the applicant stated,
[1:02:58] he owns the adjacent property at 27 Franklin
[1:03:01] and operates a masonry contracting business out
[1:03:04] of the existing detached garage on the property,
[1:03:07] which also contains a separate multifamily.
[1:03:10] The current application is intended to be used by
[1:03:13] and support the existing business operations at
[1:03:16] 27 Franklin Street.
[1:03:18] Do you have a little history, background and timeline?
[1:03:22] This originally came to us
[1:03:24] as a compliance issue involving the ABUT
[1:03:26] and property at 27 Franklin Street for a business operating
[1:03:29] beyond the limits of a change of use.
[1:03:32] The owner at that time was instructed
[1:03:34] to capture the expanded business through a new change
[1:03:37] of use application.
[1:03:39] In November of 2024.
[1:03:42] The change of use application notice of decision was issued
[1:03:47] and it was at that time determined
[1:03:48] that site plan determination would be required
[1:03:50] by the planning board.
[1:03:53] August, 2025 is when the official TRC meeting happened
[1:03:59] and that application was our representing the business
[1:04:01] operations at 27 Franklin Street at that time only,
[1:04:05] not the sixth Pearl Street property.
[1:04:08] During that follow following the TRC meeting
[1:04:12] revisions were requested to the plan based on the operations
[1:04:15] that were visible that we could, we could see
[1:04:19] and a survey of six Pearl Street was requested
[1:04:22] for the onsite material storage.
[1:04:25] And then January, 2026 is when we received the revised TRC
[1:04:29] plans and that's
[1:04:30] where we saw the reflection on six Pearl Street
[1:04:33] and determined at that time
[1:04:34] that the variance would be required
[1:04:35] for the contractor yard use.
[1:04:39] So as, as kind of previously stated, this prop, both
[1:04:43] of these properties, but this property,
[1:04:44] subject property is located in the CBD
[1:04:47] Central Business District.
[1:04:48] It does meet the definition of what we would describe
[1:04:51] as a contractor yard
[1:04:52] as outlined in our town ordinance definition.
[1:04:57] So therefore the, the variance is being requested,
[1:04:59] this would add a commercial use
[1:05:02] to the preexisting non-conforming multifamily
[1:05:06] residential property.
[1:05:08] That existing structure
[1:05:10] based on our records was built in 1895.
[1:05:13] So that came long, you know, well before zoning.
[1:05:17] So if approved at tonight's meeting, completion
[1:05:21] of the site plan, approval is required by planning board
[1:05:24] and appropriate permits and inspections are required.
[1:05:28] And as the board you can elect
[1:05:30] to perform a site walk if you choose as well.
[1:05:34] Okay. And that's it, That's it.
[1:05:37] Did did you get a registered complaint on this?
[1:05:39] Is that how this came about?
[1:05:41] So this honestly started before I came on board.
[1:05:45] From my understanding it was between complaint
[1:05:49] and just visual of the operations being close
[1:05:53] to the town hall.
[1:05:56] Okay. I'm noticing on the site plan that
[1:06:02] there's some materials that seem to be on a boundary
[1:06:05] and they're over the boundary.
[1:06:06] Am I correct? That is correct.
[1:06:08] And have those been cleaned up at this point
[1:06:10] or is it just left? Have they left yet?
[1:06:12] Yeah, they were moved.
[1:06:14] I didn't look today 'cause
[1:06:16] but my guys do tend to put things
[1:06:18] you're talking about on the hillside
[1:06:19] leading up to Pearl. Right?
[1:06:21] I don't know. I have, I have on your, on your plan
[1:06:24] where just above where it says notes, I can see
[1:06:26] that there's materials to be relocated.
[1:06:28] Yeah. Hashed out. Right.
[1:06:30] So that, what was there we call it, it's just a bunch
[1:06:33] of like extra pallets of brick and stuff like that.
[1:06:35] We've started going through
[1:06:36] 'em, I started moving everything.
[1:06:37] So it's definitely about 10, 10, 15 feet back.
[1:06:41] I haven't gotten rid of all the brick yet,
[1:06:42] but I definitely moved them off the border of the property.
[1:06:45] I think what we're looking at and,
[1:06:47] and what's being addressed is the concern about when,
[1:06:51] when a when there's something of this impact
[1:06:54] that happens in a close proximity, it it,
[1:06:58] it almost on its own doesn't become
[1:07:02] something that's a good thing.
[1:07:03] Right? When you see it spilling over onto other properties
[1:07:06] and, and not being properly contained.
[1:07:10] That would be a concern, especially in a,
[1:07:12] in a very high impacted area
[1:07:14] of residences in this, in this regard.
[1:07:17] Right. And so one
[1:07:19] of the hurdles I think the board may face is
[1:07:22] how do we give this approval
[1:07:23] and make sure that it's, that it's clean
[1:07:26] and it's not an issue going forward
[1:07:29] because it's with, with sand
[1:07:31] and landscape materials, those can tend to spill over
[1:07:34] and get out of control versus if it was a stack of lumber,
[1:07:38] you can co cover with a tarp
[1:07:40] and it's easier to move around. Right.
[1:07:41] No, absolutely. So just going off of your point, I mean
[1:07:46] the yard's pretty tidy.
[1:07:48] There's not many areas of like clutter.
[1:07:52] I don't have like fill piles there.
[1:07:55] I I don't really have any sand.
[1:07:56] It's more or less like brick mortar and,
[1:07:59] and that stuff stays pretty organized.
[1:08:01] I but I, I do understand what you're saying
[1:08:05] and I know that you talked about a complaint,
[1:08:07] but I, I haven't heard ev any complaints.
[1:08:09] It was just the fact that we were so close to the town hall
[1:08:13] and then the business was growing
[1:08:14] and then more trucks, more guys
[1:08:15] and then they were just like, Hey, you know,
[1:08:17] did you know you can't, you know, I
[1:08:19] and I had no idea You're spilling over.
[1:08:20] Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
[1:08:21] Okay. If I, if I may, I believe it mainly got noticed just
[1:08:25] 'cause Liz, Roberto drove, drove by it every day.
[1:08:28] 'cause it's literally right around the corner.
[1:08:29] So every time she came to work she's
[1:08:30] like, it's going on here.
[1:08:33] Okay. And it was actually stated to us explicitly at the TRC
[1:08:37] that no complaints had been filed by them.
[1:08:41] Just people noticed it by the people around us.
[1:08:43] Got it. Okay. How are we doing
[1:08:45] with those photos down there, Mr. Henry?
[1:08:46] We pass 'em down. When you, when you get done with them,
[1:08:50] would you take those all the way back down to Mr.
[1:08:53] Ani for me? Thank you.
[1:08:54] Yeah. If I may also, sure.
[1:08:57] To your point about the ongoing encroachment situations,
[1:09:01] there's no way we're getting
[1:09:02] through the planning board without addressing that.
[1:09:05] So the, the planning board will make sure that, you know,
[1:09:09] when, when this gets approved, it is above board.
[1:09:13] Yep. I understand.
[1:09:15] And we've already, but then that takes us back
[1:09:17] to the criteria of the variance itself.
[1:09:18] Right. The zone requires if it's going to be a commercial
[1:09:24] property that some kind of,
[1:09:26] that typically a business would take the first floor
[1:09:30] and then the residences could be above.
[1:09:32] And I understand when that ordinance shifted
[1:09:35] and its, its in intentions at the time
[1:09:39] that were thought the, to be in good shape.
[1:09:43] I think that we have a new structure on the corner here
[1:09:46] that was one of those that face hurdles to comply with the,
[1:09:51] with that, with that same ordinance.
[1:09:57] Any, any reason. So where's this new
[1:09:59] garage that you're going to build?
[1:10:00] Is it on Pearl Street or Franklin? It's
[1:10:02] On the Pearl Street.
[1:10:03] It's on the, the site plan there.
[1:10:06] You have it on your screen in front of you.
[1:10:09] It's the blue rectangle near the north
[1:10:12] or I guess that would be the easterly side of six Pearl?
[1:10:15] Yeah, just above where the hand is
[1:10:16] there. I see. There you go.
[1:10:18] That's gonna be the garage. That's correct. Okay.
[1:10:21] Now is that an open bay garage just a roof over
[1:10:24] or is it a enclosed garage?
[1:10:27] I believe metal roof
[1:10:28] Yeah, so I was planning on metal and enc.
[1:10:31] Yeah. Enclosed. I would like to, I'm kind
[1:10:33] of here just hoping you'll tell me I can do something.
[1:10:36] Garage, garage, garage. So whatever you guys
[1:10:37] garage, whatever you guys say I could do.
[1:10:39] I'll do, you know, garage
[1:10:40] Doors?
[1:10:41] I would like to, yes. Yeah. Okay.
[1:10:42] Alright. Alright, well let me rest. I've gabbed enough.
[1:10:46] Anybody have any questions Mr. Trip?
[1:10:52] Not at this time. Okay, Ms. Moore?
[1:10:55] No, but our
[1:10:57] Variance is 27 Franklin Street
[1:11:00] and I You just said the garage is going on sixth Pearl?
[1:11:04] Yes. Alright. I just wanna make sure it's correct.
[1:11:08] Is is the address on this,
[1:11:10] because the applicant li resides at 27 Franklin,
[1:11:14] but it's the property that we have to give the relief to
[1:11:18] or not is on Pearl.
[1:11:22] The, the prop property for relief is on Pearl. Correct.
[1:11:25] But, but to be utilized by 27. Got
[1:11:27] It.
[1:11:28] Okay.
[1:11:29] Could you say that again please?
[1:11:31] Business, could you say that again
[1:11:33] Please?
[1:11:34] So the relief is requested for six Pearl Street for use
[1:11:39] at the adjacent 27 Franklin Street.
[1:11:44] So are you thinking a driveway connecting the two?
[1:11:46] Well that's what I was just gonna point out.
[1:11:48] So I mean, when we first started clearing all the clutter
[1:11:52] and stuff out of Pearl, when we purchased it,
[1:11:54] it was just cut down wood piles of wood
[1:11:57] and you know, that 27 Franklin was an
[1:11:59] eyesore for quite some time.
[1:12:01] We did a ton of work there.
[1:12:03] I think it was vac nobody was there for 10 years.
[1:12:06] So we ended up doing everything.
[1:12:09] I've, we keep keep up with the, the property pretty well,
[1:12:13] but if you look right
[1:12:15] after those parking spots there, there's a little, like,
[1:12:17] there's a, there's a gravel entryway
[1:12:20] into the gravel lot right now.
[1:12:23] And that's just kind of how I get in and out.
[1:12:25] And so I guess you could say that's a proposed driveway.
[1:12:30] I, I could pave it, but I,
[1:12:31] I was thinking I I would just leave it gravel if that was,
[1:12:34] but whatever you guys want me to do, I'll do.
[1:12:36] I just didn't want to add more pavement,
[1:12:38] square footage than worry about runoff
[1:12:39] and, and all the other stuff.
[1:12:42] Okay, Mr. Dani?
[1:12:44] Yeah, I actually, I do have a question.
[1:12:46] So with the
[1:12:49] Franklin Street being a large lot in more locations
[1:12:53] and you're gonna be putting a building in already,
[1:12:55] why do we need to do a mixed use on the other property?
[1:12:59] So the building is on the
[1:13:00] other property, if you look, it's connected.
[1:13:02] So I just tried to, I don't, everything
[1:13:06] is just like tucked away over here.
[1:13:07] So if you really drive by, I I, my hope is
[1:13:10] that it doesn't affect the other residents
[1:13:12] or you don't really see it if everything's put away.
[1:13:15] Well I guess what I was looking at is when I'm looking at
[1:13:17] the pictures, you have a lot of stuff all over the place.
[1:13:19] It looks very cramped
[1:13:21] and tight where the other lot is wide open.
[1:13:24] And if you were putting a store, if you were putting
[1:13:27] a metal unit to store all that stuff
[1:13:31] and that other unit's more commercial than residential.
[1:13:35] It just makes to me more sense where
[1:13:37] you're stuffing everything in a very small envelope.
[1:13:41] I think some of the open space shows that it's
[1:13:45] for work vehicles and employee parking and
[1:13:49] Stuff.
[1:13:50] No, I understand that, but there's that large patch
[1:13:51] of grass on the left hand side that there's nothing there
[1:13:56] on Franklin Street.
[1:13:59] Right. And we'd be turning that into a bit
[1:14:02] of an eyesore if we moved all, all the stuff down there.
[1:14:06] I was thinking about putting an apartment complex right
[1:14:08] There unmatch everything else in dairy.
[1:14:11] Great. Yeah, exactly. No, no,
[1:14:12] I meant if you're putting a building, you're saying
[1:14:14] that you're gonna be doing a structure on Pearl Street.
[1:14:17] If you do the same structure, then it's not gonna be an eyeo
[1:14:20] 'cause it would be tucked away and
[1:14:21] hit it inside your structure.
[1:14:24] No, a hundred percent. I mean, if you want to propose,
[1:14:27] propose me to put it on the lawn and that, that's fine.
[1:14:30] I just thought it would be tucked away in the back there
[1:14:32] where everything's been for years and nobody's complained.
[1:14:36] I don't know if it's like the noise
[1:14:37] or whatever that nobody hears 'cause all the trees there,
[1:14:40] but I, I feel as if it would disrupt the, the,
[1:14:43] the neighbor neighbors more.
[1:14:45] If it was on that, that grass area.
[1:14:48] It would also possibly be an issue with the existing water
[1:14:51] and sewer lines for the house on 27.
[1:14:53] 'cause you'd be putting a concrete
[1:14:56] slab building on top of them.
[1:15:02] I'm not sure where the plumbing goes.
[1:15:03] I'm not gonna comment.
[1:15:05] Well, it's shown on the plan, but
[1:15:12] I'm all set.
[1:15:13] Okay. Mr. Dietzel.
[1:15:15] Yeah, I i I think my question is from Ms. Owen,
[1:15:19] did you say that currently as things are right now,
[1:15:26] the property is not in compliance?
[1:15:28] Or is it just what he's proposing tonight
[1:15:31] that's not in compliance?
[1:15:33] The way that it is operating today
[1:15:36] and has been is not in compliance.
[1:15:37] It's not in compliance And we're trying
[1:15:39] to bring it into compliance with this variance.
[1:15:42] And so, and so if we grant the variance,
[1:15:46] he still won't be in compliance,
[1:15:49] but he'll be less in compliance but have the variance.
[1:15:52] So he'd be okay
[1:15:55] And still Would need to complete.
[1:15:56] So in effect he's still not in compliance,
[1:15:59] but it's better than it was before
[1:16:00] or less non-compliant than before.
[1:16:06] O okay. Okay. Thank you.
[1:16:11] I think that's all for the moment, Mr. Chair.
[1:16:14] I think Mr. Dani's question was why not
[1:16:18] consolidate everything into onto one parcel
[1:16:22] where there's not a controversy
[1:16:24] and where there's a history of that type of operation.
[1:16:28] Salt Sanders, you know, trucks onto,
[1:16:32] what I'm gesturing towards is the Franklin Street parcel.
[1:16:36] I, I don't want to necessarily say
[1:16:38] that you would park it over the water sewer lines,
[1:16:41] but I guess that's my inquiry is why, why not do that
[1:16:46] and keep that historical aspect the way it was
[1:16:50] and the way it was recognized
[1:16:55] At this point.
[1:16:56] It's already existing where it is now, so seemed easier
[1:17:00] to ask for the variance
[1:17:04] and not relocate at all.
[1:17:06] And like I said, it would be a bit
[1:17:10] of an eyesore down there on the road, but,
[1:17:13] Well, it's hard.
[1:17:14] I was, I was just trying to solve the problem by the,
[1:17:16] the biggest problem was the storage of the materials.
[1:17:19] Right. That's why the various, that's why they
[1:17:20] said you have to come here.
[1:17:21] So I said, okay, no problem. So what I'll do is I'll,
[1:17:23] I'll just bring, build the shed right.
[1:17:25] And I'll put everything inside so it doesn't bother anybody.
[1:17:27] And then I I I am in, I'm, I'm in compliance with
[1:17:31] that. Yeah. You
[1:17:32] Know, the, the, the question is not necessarily whether
[1:17:35] you're doing the right or wrong.
[1:17:36] Yes. But it's, it's that you have this issue going on
[1:17:40] and the question is, you know, why not remedy it this way
[1:17:44] as opposed to trying to get the graces of this board
[1:17:47] to give you that relief.
[1:17:49] You know? And, and, and that in itself,
[1:17:51] that movement in itself needs vetting
[1:17:55] to see where that goes.
[1:17:56] It just, to me it made more sense.
[1:17:59] And it goes back to, you know, the idea
[1:18:02] that when I see materials that are apparently
[1:18:04] over somebody else's property line that, you know,
[1:18:09] how do you, how do you address this
[1:18:11] and, you know, make it simpler.
[1:18:13] That's all. So there's no necessarily right
[1:18:15] or wrong answer, it's just what's the answer?
[1:18:18] The, the path of least resistance for you
[1:18:22] or for the, the, the board, the community?
[1:18:25] No, absolutely. That the house is currently now I'm, I'm,
[1:18:28] I don't reside at 27th Franklin anymore,
[1:18:30] so I actually have it rented.
[1:18:32] I See. You know, so I, I didn't want to really, I try
[1:18:35] to keep it the business to certain hours
[1:18:37] and I I wasn't planning on taking
[1:18:38] that whole front lawn away.
[1:18:41] But I do understand what you're saying.
[1:18:43] And if that, that is,
[1:18:45] that is definitely an option. A hundred percent.
[1:18:47] Well, and it's not to direct you, it's to ask why
[1:18:50] that wasn't considered.
[1:18:51] You're answering that question whether
[1:18:53] or not that sways the board
[1:18:54] or not, I don't know. But yeah, no, being
[1:18:56] Honest, You know, it's just always best to come in
[1:18:58] with solutions in soft
[1:18:59] and we try to find what that, what the compromise is
[1:19:03] and weed out, you know, to the five criteria.
[1:19:07] So anyway. Anybody else have any other questions?
[1:19:12] Mr. Henry?
[1:19:15] So I see there's a proposed fence on the right here.
[1:19:20] Yep. As part of Pearl Street.
[1:19:23] And I saw in the pictures that a lot
[1:19:25] of the materials are visible from Franklin Street.
[1:19:28] Is there a reason there's not part
[1:19:30] of a proposed fence there?
[1:19:31] So some of that might be hidden.
[1:19:35] Oh, the,
[1:19:43] You got the hillside and the trees
[1:19:46] and the neighbors shed there.
[1:19:48] Okay. So the materials you're talking about
[1:19:50] that you can see from down here would be this pile
[1:19:55] and like the, the container that's there
[1:19:58] and the, this little sand she thing.
[1:20:01] And that's where the garage would go.
[1:20:04] But this side of the property,
[1:20:07] there's much more view from the neighboring land
[1:20:09] because it's a lot flatter there.
[1:20:12] So the fence around that would shield that.
[1:20:17] And you're not gonna see anything from Pearl Street
[1:20:19] because the building and the hillside kind
[1:20:21] of comes up and goes back down.
[1:20:25] Okay, thank you. I think one of the concerns
[1:20:29] that I have going forward, and Mr.
[1:20:32] Dietzel addressed it in the prior case was, you know, the,
[1:20:35] the hardship aspect, right?
[1:20:37] And because this becomes a voluntary thing that starts
[1:20:40] to grow and, and expand almost
[1:20:44] accidentally without someone knowing
[1:20:46] that they're not in compliance.
[1:20:47] Right. You few rocks, few bricks here
[1:20:50] and there doing it on the weekend
[1:20:52] and the next thing you know, you've got this, this,
[1:20:55] you know, accumulation of stuff.
[1:20:58] And to be honest with you, some of the pictures aren't
[1:21:01] so flattering in my eyes either, right.
[1:21:04] Especially with the storage containers there and whatnot.
[1:21:07] So it's not a good fit for, for the, that area in,
[1:21:12] in my personal view at this point.
[1:21:15] And so the introduction of questions
[1:21:17] and why not this, why not that is where that leads
[1:21:20] to you folks.
[1:21:23] You guys have anything else right now? No,
[1:21:27] I do not.
[1:21:28] I have a question. Mr. Trip, how do you access the
[1:21:36] construction material from Pearl Street?
[1:21:40] You you don't, You don't,
[1:21:42] You don't.
[1:21:43] So the elevation, if you're looking at Pearl Street,
[1:21:45] when you, when you described like a hill, it's gotta be,
[1:21:48] I mean from the top of the driveway it's
[1:21:50] gotta be 15 feet down to
[1:21:51] The street.
[1:21:52] So when you bring material in, you always,
[1:21:53] you always bring it in from on the Franklin Street side,
[1:21:56] Everything.
[1:21:57] Yeah. So if you look at that, that access right next to the,
[1:21:59] the current garage Yep.
[1:22:01] And the shop in the office. Yep.
[1:22:02] You, you have to come in right there
[1:22:05] and then go, go over there.
[1:22:07] So it's mainly like, you know,
[1:22:08] those materials do get offloaded and it's excess material.
[1:22:11] Yep. But like I, it's mainly we park a lot of trucks there
[1:22:15] and, and, and if I've been getting rid of materials
[1:22:18] as we go, but I figured this proposed shed would literally
[1:22:22] solve everybody's problem and it would look nice tight.
[1:22:25] Now where do you park the trucks?
[1:22:27] Right there Where the,
[1:22:29] where it says grab a yes, grab a lot. Yes sir.
[1:22:31] Yes sir. Yep. So that's where like they,
[1:22:34] the guys will load up from the container if they need a tool
[1:22:36] or something like that and then they pull out and they go,
[1:22:39] So what do you use 44 40,
[1:22:43] whatever Franklin Street is for.
[1:22:45] So that's right in the front there. That's the shop.
[1:22:48] If you come outta here and you take a left, you'll see it.
[1:22:50] That's the shop? Yep.
[1:22:51] That's got a garage bay,
[1:22:53] it's got a lift on the other side, some storage.
[1:22:56] We just ran the, the sewer line and the water line in there.
[1:22:59] And then I have an office upstairs.
[1:23:01] Alright. Is where, where is the office?
[1:23:07] I I see in the, in the garage there on Franklin
[1:23:09] Street?
[1:23:10] Yes sir. So if you Yes, it's right above the right side.
[1:23:13] It's like, not huge, but it's like 800 square.
[1:23:17] I don't know, it may be six, 700
[1:23:18] square feet. I'm not exactly sure.
[1:23:20] Okay. So is a business a permitted
[1:23:25] use at Franklin Street?
[1:23:28] It is. It came through originally as a change of use
[1:23:31] because there was a prior business operating out of there.
[1:23:35] And then the, it was a similar use
[1:23:37] and so that's how it was looked at internally.
[1:23:42] Why, why not expand off of building B
[1:23:49] Off of building?
[1:23:50] Well, building B On 27th.
[1:23:52] I mean, the biggest, we, we were kind
[1:23:55] of worried about the parking for the employees.
[1:23:56] So right now I have about like 12 or 13 working employees.
[1:24:02] Some of 'em walk to work, they live locally,
[1:24:03] but you know, with the spots.
[1:24:06] So we, we didn't want to, you know,
[1:24:11] put a building there
[1:24:12] and then I just wouldn't have a location for them to park.
[1:24:14] Then they'd be parking all over the streets and stuff. So
[1:24:16] They can, I don't know if parking
[1:24:21] closer to Pearl Street would still be allowed
[1:24:25] or not for employees if that.
[1:24:30] Well, no, I, they don't, nobody,
[1:24:31] they all park in these spaces right here.
[1:24:33] So if I made building B bigger, I,
[1:24:36] I don't know if I'd have the parking spot.
[1:24:37] So no matter what, I'd have to get rid
[1:24:39] of the grass on that left side I guess. Well,
[1:24:41] No.
[1:24:42] Oh, I was saying for them to park back where the material
[1:24:44] and stuff is instead. Oh,
[1:24:46] Okay.
[1:24:47] Oh, okay, okay. Yeah, yeah.
[1:24:47] I I guess yeah, that's an option.
[1:24:50] But regardless we're putting,
[1:24:51] then it would be the asphalt thing.
[1:24:53] Right. And we're just putting,
[1:24:58] Hmm.
[1:24:59] So,
[1:25:00] So, so what are we, what's being asked for?
[1:25:05] I'm confused.
[1:25:08] Me too. So they are essentially
[1:25:12] asking for, to use the rear portion of six Pearl Street
[1:25:18] to add a contractor yard use to the existing residential lot
[1:25:23] in addition to the residential lot.
[1:25:26] And then that contractor yard would be utilized
[1:25:29] by the adjacent 27 Franklin Street business operation.
[1:25:34] And is the business operation permitted?
[1:25:37] The business operation is
[1:25:38] permitted through a change of use? Correct.
[1:25:41] Okay, thank you.
[1:25:45] Actually, can I ask a question quickly to you again,
[1:25:49] but is a construction law
[1:25:51] and a commercial multifamily combined, is that a,
[1:25:56] is that something we've combined before?
[1:26:00] It's not a four unit.
[1:26:01] It is combining. Yeah,
[1:26:03] it's essentially combining commercial. I
[1:26:04] Know, but can we, I mean is that something
[1:26:05] that has been combined?
[1:26:09] I'd have to look at what we have looked at done in the
[1:26:12] past history, but top of my head I can't think of anything.
[1:26:18] I have a question too, Ms. Owens, if they did expand off
[1:26:22] of that lower building, would they have to,
[1:26:24] would they even be here if it was all kept on 27
[1:26:33] For the use?
[1:26:35] No, anything changing.
[1:26:38] So if they're changing utilities, drainage, the par,
[1:26:41] if they use parking elsewhere, those are things
[1:26:44] that would potentially need approval elsewhere.
[1:26:48] But simply the answer would be no,
[1:26:51] they wouldn't need a variance to increase their
[1:26:53] use at 27 Franklin.
[1:26:55] Okay.
[1:26:59] I have a question too, and forgive me
[1:27:04] because it might've been asked and answered, but,
[1:27:07] but I want to answer it or I want to ask it.
[1:27:12] Just to be clear for me, they're requesting
[1:27:19] that the property be used for a contractor yard
[1:27:24] and a garage.
[1:27:26] Those sound like two different things.
[1:27:28] So the contractor yard in and of itself is an approved use?
[1:27:33] It is not, no, it is not. Right.
[1:27:35] So what kind of a business use, you said
[1:27:37] that there is a business use that's permitted,
[1:27:41] The business use is permitted at 27 Franklin
[1:27:44] to operate out of the existing garage building B based on
[1:27:48] the previous owner business
[1:27:51] that had operated out there historically.
[1:27:53] I see it was a similar business when the new owner purchased
[1:27:56] the property or the applicant purchased the property
[1:27:58] and at that time it was looked at as a similar business,
[1:28:00] so it could be achieved as a change of use.
[1:28:06] Okay. He essentially wants to expand it
[1:28:09] to six Pearl Street and he owns both.
[1:28:15] Right. Okay. All right. Thank you.
[1:28:19] I I think an area that I need clarity of is
[1:28:22] that the contractor garage really is a moot point to this
[1:28:26] because if we, if we approve the use
[1:28:29] and Pearl Street, essentially the contractor garage goes
[1:28:33] back to regular permitting
[1:28:35] and all you're going to do is observe setbacks
[1:28:38] and so on and so forth.
[1:28:40] My sense is he could probably build the contractor garage
[1:28:43] there if he wants what he uses it
[1:28:48] for, if the board doesn't approve it is up to him.
[1:28:52] If the, if we don't approve the use as a contractor yard,
[1:28:58] He would be permitted to construct a garage on the
[1:29:01] property for residential use or, or for his use.
[1:29:03] Correct. Whatever he wants.
[1:29:04] But how it's currently operating now wouldn't be
[1:29:08] permitted to continue. Got
[1:29:10] It.
[1:29:11] Without the variance. Yeah. Makes sense. Yep. Okay.
[1:29:15] So realistically we just wanna look at the impact of the,
[1:29:21] of the u the current usage of it and determine whether
[1:29:25] or not it's something we feel is, is justified
[1:29:29] to remain there or not.
[1:29:35] That's kinda why I like keep leaning on.
[1:29:37] We haven't had any complaints.
[1:29:38] So it's like, and, and I'm open
[1:29:39] to suggestions if there's something I can do to, you know,
[1:29:42] screen the building, screen the materials
[1:29:44] or you know, anything you guys suggest.
[1:29:51] I'm just thinking out loud here, being that you,
[1:29:56] what's screaming in my head right now is
[1:29:58] that if you were ever to try
[1:30:00] to divide these properties again,
[1:30:02] you got yourself a situation.
[1:30:05] So it seems like if you did a lot line adjustment
[1:30:09] and came for a variance
[1:30:10] for the rear setbacks on Pearl Street
[1:30:12] and made that part of Franklin Street,
[1:30:13] the whole thing would go away.
[1:30:15] We, we actually discussed that,
[1:30:17] but we thought it would be a little bit more in detail,
[1:30:20] whereas if it's literally just for storage.
[1:30:23] So I mean at this point, if I ever did do that,
[1:30:26] which it would probably be my kids who sell it, not me,
[1:30:28] but I would, I mean I, you know, it's, it's,
[1:30:33] it's connected by, you can plant the tree there, you know?
[1:30:37] Right. But then like how would you, I guess, I mean you,
[1:30:42] 'cause you, if we were to speculate
[1:30:45] that you could access the garage from Pearl Street,
[1:30:47] then the question's gonna be why don't you just
[1:30:49] access it from Pearl Street now? Yeah,
[1:30:50] So I mean by right, you could,
[1:30:53] I mean if you see the paved driveway
[1:30:54] that is like a hill that goes down.
[1:30:56] I see it. Yeah. So I mean you, you really, you could,
[1:30:59] you could, if, if that was I going up, I didn't want
[1:31:02] to disrupt the, the tenants who all park in
[1:31:04] that driveway to make it like a roadway.
[1:31:07] It would actually be perfect for trailers.
[1:31:08] I could like go up, go around and come down.
[1:31:10] I thought about it but I, I just,
[1:31:12] I just felt like it would disrupt like the, the tenants
[1:31:14] and the flow of traffic right off of that.
[1:31:16] 'cause it gets pretty busy right there at that intersection.
[1:31:20] So I just felt like it wouldn't work.
[1:31:23] 'cause you got like the dunkins, the,
[1:31:24] the dentist right there and then that,
[1:31:25] that stop sign coming outta Cubies.
[1:31:28] It's really busy over there.
[1:31:32] Ms. Owen, you had indicated that this initiated prior
[1:31:36] to your, your coming to this position,
[1:31:39] but it was it that the Franklin Street
[1:31:44] pro property had the change of use
[1:31:47] and that's what kind of initiates this
[1:31:52] 27 Franklin had the change of use
[1:31:54] to operate the contractor business out of the property.
[1:31:58] And from my understanding, it's just the evolution of time
[1:32:03] or through time
[1:32:04] and since then that things have kind of spilled over
[1:32:08] to Six Pearl and that's
[1:32:09] where the compliance concerns came into play.
[1:32:12] Got it. So the, the change of use notice
[1:32:14] of decision was November, 2024.
[1:32:18] And again, this was all kind
[1:32:19] of looking at 27 Franklin Street.
[1:32:21] So when we went through TRC originally it was 27 Franklin.
[1:32:24] And then when we received revised plans,
[1:32:27] 'cause we had requested a survey of six Pearl,
[1:32:29] that's when this came in front of us
[1:32:32] and that's why we're here this evening.
[1:32:35] Gentlemen, you almost can solve your own problem
[1:32:38] or you take the risk of the board making
[1:32:40] the decision for you.
[1:32:42] We'll what I'm thinking is, we'll, let's make a call
[1:32:45] to public see what feedback we get after that.
[1:32:48] If you'd like to consider tabling this
[1:32:50] and rethinking your position
[1:32:52] and coming back next month for this, you
[1:32:55] might be a good strategy if you,
[1:32:57] and now that you're hearing the dialogue going back
[1:33:00] and forth, I,
[1:33:02] I myself find the Pearl Street thing kind of a headache.
[1:33:06] And I've already de described, dis described that I, I find
[1:33:09] that it's not a good look,
[1:33:14] but we're not there yet.
[1:33:17] So why don't we make that call to public,
[1:33:19] see if anybody comes forward
[1:33:21] and then if you wanna rethink this
[1:33:24] before we make a decision, you could do that.
[1:33:28] Alright, thank you.
[1:33:30] Keep in mind anybody that says anything,
[1:33:32] I don't know if anyone's gonna come up,
[1:33:33] but you, they'll, you'll have an opportunity
[1:33:35] to rebut that as well.
[1:33:37] Okay. So at this point, let's make a call to public.
[1:33:40] Anybody wishes to speak in favor of this application,
[1:33:43] this would be your opportunity to come forward and do so.
[1:33:46] Seeing no one rise,
[1:33:48] likewise anybody who wishes to speak in opposition of this
[1:33:53] application, this would be your opportunity to come forward.
[1:33:59] All right folks, gentlemen,
[1:34:01] we don't have anybody to speak here.
[1:34:13] We're just kind of discussing the options.
[1:34:14] That's all right. Well you can come
[1:34:16] up 'cause no one's come forward.
[1:34:19] And if you wish to have us table this
[1:34:22] and have that discussion
[1:34:24] after this outside of this room, you're welcome to do that.
[1:34:28] I, I guess my one question is
[1:34:32] how much can we change the proposal without needing
[1:34:38] like a whole new application?
[1:34:40] 'cause we did bounce a lot of ideas off of Carrie,
[1:34:43] like, well what if we did this?
[1:34:44] What if we did that? And every time it was, well
[1:34:47] that needs a variance because of X, Y, and Z.
[1:34:50] So no matter what we did was we were basically told it's
[1:34:54] gonna need a variance every
[1:34:55] Time she told me we Had to get, get a variance.
[1:34:57] So I just,
[1:35:00] Are you speaking to the microphone? Yes.
[1:35:01] Well you're here. Right?
[1:35:04] So I guess like if like someone had mentioned, well
[1:35:08] what if you did a lot line adjustment, if we did that,
[1:35:11] that would be a completely different variance.
[1:35:14] 'cause the variance would be for lot size and setbacks.
[1:35:19] So would we be able to just table it
[1:35:21] and come back with a lot line adjustment
[1:35:23] or would we need to go
[1:35:24] through the whole application process again?
[1:35:27] Well your, your application is active, it's live
[1:35:30] and you can come back to a date certain,
[1:35:33] I'm not hearing any abutters speak on this.
[1:35:36] So you don't have that threat of,
[1:35:40] to have to deal with with that.
[1:35:41] Is there a latitude for them to work in the direction
[1:35:45] of some of the board's questions, Mrs. Owen?
[1:35:47] Or is that like already been touched on? I think
[1:35:50] The, the question becomes how far
[1:35:54] materially different it becomes Yeah.
[1:35:56] From the application. Right? But
[1:36:00] That, that is my, the nature of my question is like,
[1:36:02] can we do what is being suggested?
[1:36:05] Right. Or or are we just kind
[1:36:07] of up the creek without a paddle on that?
[1:36:09] Right.
[1:36:10] Well the board hasn't made a decision.
[1:36:12] We can proceed with this if you'd like,
[1:36:14] if the decision is rendered not favorable to you,
[1:36:17] you'd be into trying to work a different idea anyway.
[1:36:21] And I'm, you know, the board's not, you know,
[1:36:23] we're pretty open to the the testimony Right.
[1:36:27] What you're saying. So I can't speak for everybody.
[1:36:31] I just have a feel for this that the way it's described and,
[1:36:35] and the look of it doesn't feel good right now.
[1:36:38] And if we did con table it would we be in August?
[1:36:42] Like August early August or late August 3rd,
[1:36:45] Third week is our next meeting.
[1:36:47] August 20th. We just on some of the schedule
[1:36:48] August 20th.
[1:36:49] So it would be another month. I guess the other x
[1:36:54] factor is will the planning
[1:36:55] department let us wait that long?
[1:36:58] I dunno. You're you're in action currently.
[1:37:01] So this is under the board's purview and I Right,
[1:37:06] Right.
[1:37:07] Basically so we can let them vote.
[1:37:09] No, I understand that, but I don't understand where the,
[1:37:11] What the pro What's the issue.
[1:37:14] Isn't Pearl Street also in the business district?
[1:37:18] Yes, it is.
[1:37:24] So we can
[1:37:26] look at a couple alternative ideas and come back
[1:37:30] and see if that flies or we can Yeah,
[1:37:33] Whatever you suggest.
[1:37:34] I mean
[1:37:35] Okay.
[1:37:36] Do do you guys have any suggestions for, for Pearl Street
[1:37:39] or just completely 86?
[1:37:41] That whole lot. That's where I started the business out of
[1:37:44] just get rid of, just get rid of that lot
[1:37:46] and just move everything to Franklin.
[1:37:47] I mean I could put it on the front lawn if
[1:37:49] that makes more sense for the town.
[1:37:52] Well I think Mr. Donlin raised a good question, right?
[1:37:55] Which, and I don't know what your conversations
[1:37:57] with code enforcement have been,
[1:37:58] but you know, if you found this that it was necessary to,
[1:38:04] to function with another garage, you know, to me, I, Mr.
[1:38:09] Donlin says, well, why don't you do a lot line adjustment?
[1:38:12] I don't know whether you can do that
[1:38:13] or not off the, off the cuff.
[1:38:17] And I'm not a surveyor. Right.
[1:38:19] It looks like you have a lot of room there and,
[1:38:23] and I, I get this ooey feeling about,
[1:38:27] about Pearl Street and the way it looks right now that it's,
[1:38:31] it's not in a favorable light.
[1:38:34] No, I agree with you. So wouldn't this proposed garage
[1:38:37] eliminate that not favorable light?
[1:38:44] You know, wouldn't that solve all, wouldn't I be able,
[1:38:46] nobody would see the materials there would be
[1:38:47] inside the, the storage shed.
[1:38:49] Well, so because of the square footage of the property,
[1:38:54] I think you still need a variance.
[1:38:56] 'cause the quick guide says you need 30,000 square feet,
[1:39:02] that's the regulation.
[1:39:03] And you have almost 20,
[1:39:06] What does he need that for
[1:39:08] If he, where they were safe to keep it on sixth Pearl?
[1:39:12] The garage. Yeah.
[1:39:15] Are those, are those proper setback lines on that on that
[1:39:18] Those should be correct. Yes.
[1:39:20] Sorry. No, they, they were trying
[1:39:23] to figure out why they should move it,
[1:39:25] why we would want them to move it to 27.
[1:39:27] Like why not just keep it in six if they're
[1:39:30] Zoned?
[1:39:31] Well, I don't necessarily want them to move it to 27.
[1:39:32] The question is whether
[1:39:33] or not we grant them the use on Pearl Street to, for,
[1:39:37] to continue this operation
[1:39:39] and in the look so far is not favorable in my eyes.
[1:39:44] I'm not speaking for the whole board.
[1:39:47] So what are the options? Well, Mr.
[1:39:49] Donlin says, well, why don't you do a lot line adjustment,
[1:39:51] reposition the shed and keep the business
[1:39:54] off of Pearl Street.
[1:39:55] You know, I you had, you had a business
[1:39:58] and that's part of the problem too, is that you have
[1:40:01] a business that,
[1:40:07] that has grown
[1:40:10] and it's grown so much you're spilling into other properties
[1:40:13] in an, in an area that may not be a good fit for it at all.
[1:40:18] I don't know what your solution is.
[1:40:20] I'm just describing to you options that you preserve your,
[1:40:24] your opportunity to continue to function in some way.
[1:40:31] Okay. Ms. Owen, I, I mean,
[1:40:33] I'm looking at the setback lines on Pearl Street.
[1:40:36] Is there anything to say that the construction
[1:40:40] shed doesn't fit there?
[1:40:42] I'm not sure what Mrs. Warren was,
[1:40:45] what you were pointing out there.
[1:40:46] Yeah, I mean, if that, it's a lot line adjustment
[1:40:48] that's given to 27 Franklin.
[1:40:50] It's, it's hard to say where that lot line would fall,
[1:40:52] but at first glance, I, I don't see it being a
[1:40:57] setback challenge, but it could all, you know, it depends on
[1:40:59] how they configure it or if they wanna
[1:41:01] reposition the garage as well.
[1:41:03] Right.
[1:41:07] Mr. Tripp, you have some thoughts there?
[1:41:12] Don't like it. Okay, Mr. Dani?
[1:41:17] I'm with Trip. I'd rather keep it into one lot than having
[1:41:22] something spread off over to two.
[1:41:23] And it's just my opinion,
[1:41:25] Mr.
[1:41:26] Dietzel,
[1:41:28] This isn't a criticism of the applicant,
[1:41:30] but I, I just don't think that the application has been,
[1:41:33] is fully fleshed out yet.
[1:41:35] And I didn't know that until we had this discussion.
[1:41:39] I don't have enough information, in my opinion
[1:41:41] to make a a a, a judgment in this case
[1:41:44] because the burden is on the applicant to sh
[1:41:49] to show that he needs a variance.
[1:41:55] And he hasn't shown me why
[1:41:58] he can't get a lot line adjustment
[1:42:01] and fix the problem like others have said.
[1:42:07] I don't know if he can, I don't know if he can't,
[1:42:10] but he, the burn's on him
[1:42:11] and he hasn't demonstrated to me that he's even tried.
[1:42:18] So if we, if we act on it tonight,
[1:42:22] I'm gonna vote no, but I don't think that's fair
[1:42:26] because he might be able to solve the problem
[1:42:30] and come into compliance.
[1:42:32] So I would just assume table it, give him enough chance to
[1:42:36] look over his options, come back to us
[1:42:39] with either this proposal
[1:42:40] because he can make a case that it's okay or revise
[1:42:44] or revise his application.
[1:42:46] That would make it perhaps even in con
[1:42:50] conformance with the ordinance.
[1:42:52] But either way a little more palatable.
[1:42:56] So I'm not prepared to,
[1:42:58] to make a vote without additional information.
[1:43:01] So I I I'm for tabling it.
[1:43:04] May I ask a question? Sure.
[1:43:07] If we did a lot line adjustment
[1:43:10] that would also require a variance
[1:43:12] Perhaps.
[1:43:13] No, it definitely does because six Pearl Street is already
[1:43:16] below the minimum size for a lot in the CBD zone
[1:43:19] and we would be making it smaller.
[1:43:21] So that's definitely a variance.
[1:43:24] So I guess would you feel more comfortable giving us a
[1:43:28] variance for that than
[1:43:29] For what's being proposed?
[1:43:30] I'd have see the proposal, I'm not gonna,
[1:43:32] I'm not gonna make a judgment right now.
[1:43:34] That's fair. I I just, I'm trying
[1:43:39] to be fair to you because based on your application right
[1:43:43] now, my, I'm moving in the direction of a no vote.
[1:43:50] But I think that there,
[1:43:52] I I believe the applicant is acting in good faith.
[1:43:55] I believe he's trying to do what's right for the community
[1:43:58] and I think, I think he's willing to work toward
[1:44:02] making this work for everybody.
[1:44:05] And I think he should be able to have that opportunity
[1:44:08] because if we say no,
[1:44:09] he's not gonna get another bite of the apple.
[1:44:11] Right. Unless he comes up
[1:44:13] with something radically different.
[1:44:16] And I don't wanna close off that, that possibility.
[1:44:19] So I don't want to say what, you might come back
[1:44:22] with another proposal and I'll still say no, I don't know.
[1:44:25] But I, I just, if I, if I voted tonight,
[1:44:29] I would probably say no and I'm,
[1:44:31] You'd be back here in August
[1:44:33] anyway. I'd rather, or September.
[1:44:34] I'd rather A question for Ms. Owen.
[1:44:37] It might be, I know we've touched on it already.
[1:44:41] So contractor is allowed so he could park vehicles there,
[1:44:46] have his garage.
[1:44:47] It's the materials itself that can't be there. Correct.
[1:44:50] Those would have to be moved, correct?
[1:44:53] Yep. Or or stored Internally. Yeah, elsewhere. So
[1:44:59] Tell me what you wanna do.
[1:45:03] I guess we'll have to table this and
[1:45:07] I'm back.
[1:45:08] Wagons. Okay.
[1:45:10] That's your request to go ahead and table? Yes sir.
[1:45:13] Alright, very good. Applicant has asked for a table.
[1:45:18] Mr. Beatle, you want a motion?
[1:45:20] I make a motion to table this case until
[1:45:25] August 20th.
[1:45:29] 20th, correct. 2026.
[1:45:32] That's a date certain. I have a second, please.
[1:45:34] I'll second. Okay. All in favor say aye. Aye.
[1:45:38] Aye. Any opposed?
[1:45:39] Hearing none, gentlemen will regroup and,
[1:45:44] and see what you can do later. All right? Yes
[1:45:47] Sir.
[1:45:56] Do I,
[1:45:58] I'm going to start to reorganize our meeting.
[1:46:03] Our, our last case, Mr. Benson, I don't know
[1:46:07] that we're gonna get to you this evening.
[1:46:10] You're welcome to ride it out and see, but we've got an hour
[1:46:14] and 15 minutes of a scheduled meeting
[1:46:16] and we've got 1, 2, 3, 4 cases.
[1:46:20] Yours is the fourth of the, of those.
[1:46:23] Would you like us to postpone you
[1:46:25] to the next meeting instead of having you sit here?
[1:46:31] That's August 20th,
[1:46:34] I think I wait out.
[1:46:35] Oh, okay, good. That's, that's fine.
[1:46:39] We, we try, are trying to streamline what we can do,
[1:46:43] but legislatively our hands are getting tied,
[1:46:47] so, all right.
[1:46:49] Right. Let's go on to the next one.
[1:46:51] Tabled from the former meeting, Pinkerton Academy
[1:46:56] and case number 26 dash nine.
[1:47:01] Alright, thank you.
[1:47:08] All right, so we have,
[1:47:09] you have gentlemen have somebody remote as well from Maine.
[1:47:14] They're just there to assist you in the event.
[1:47:16] There's some questions from the board, correct? Correct.
[1:47:19] Correct. Okay. Who's presenting?
[1:47:23] Ed Kenny will be presenting.
[1:47:25] I will be. My name is Ed Kenny, I'm with Watch Fire Signs.
[1:47:28] You're Who? Ed Kenny? I'm with Watch Fire Signs.
[1:47:32] Watch Fire. Okay.
[1:47:34] And we do have the letter
[1:47:37] and Mr. Henry, would you like to sit on this one?
[1:47:43] Is the board okay with me sitting on this case since I'm
[1:47:46] such a recent graduate of the school that is applying?
[1:47:50] I think you'd have more. Do you want to sit on it
[1:47:53] or do you not want to sit on It
[1:47:56] Might be better if I sat on a different case since I have
[1:47:59] so recently graduated from the institution in question.
[1:48:02] Okay. Pull your diploma
[1:48:07] Dust mine off.
[1:48:09] I would just add there that I'm in a butter,
[1:48:11] so I can't be a part of this.
[1:48:13] So did you, did you pay them for your diploma?
[1:48:18] No, the school board does.
[1:48:19] School district did. Just personally,
[1:48:22] Mr.
[1:48:23] Dani, are you telling me you can't sit on this? Well,
[1:48:25] I own a property that abuts this.
[1:48:27] I'm, I'm listed on the as an abutter.
[1:48:31] Okay. Is That a conflict?
[1:48:34] Mr. Dome? You gotta sit on this.
[1:48:36] I could probably come up with the reason why not.
[1:48:40] I'm not trying to, I'm not a huge fantasize.
[1:48:42] Why don't we just do four people?
[1:48:46] Okay, gentlemen, please proceed.
[1:48:53] By the way, we ask that you read the five criteria first on
[1:48:56] your application as is presented
[1:48:59] goes on the record for the board. Okay.
[1:49:01] Okay. So again, my name is Ed Kenny.
[1:49:05] I'm with watchfire Signs we're the manufacturer
[1:49:07] of the digital display that Pinken is looking
[1:49:11] to have installed on campus.
[1:49:14] I am kind of filling in, so bear with me
[1:49:18] as I, as I go along.
[1:49:22] Excuse me. So, 0.1, the variance will not be in contrary
[1:49:27] to the public interest
[1:49:28] because the proposed sign is replacing an existing
[1:49:31] freestanding sign that's substantially in the same location
[1:49:35] and serves the same identification
[1:49:37] and communication purpose currently
[1:49:39] presented on the property.
[1:49:41] The upgraded sign design will improve visibility,
[1:49:44] readability, and overall aesthetics while maintaining a
[1:49:48] professional appearance appropriate
[1:49:50] for an educational campus environment.
[1:49:54] The electronic message center will be used
[1:49:56] for school related communication, including events,
[1:50:00] schedules, announcements, athletics,
[1:50:02] and community information.
[1:50:04] The proposed sign will enhance communication with students,
[1:50:07] parents, visitors in the community without negatively
[1:50:10] impacting surrounded prop surrounding
[1:50:13] properties or traffic safety.
[1:50:16] The spirit of the ordinance is observed
[1:50:18] because the intent of the ordinance is to promote safe,
[1:50:21] effective, and aesthetically appropriate signage.
[1:50:25] The proposed sign accomplishes these goals
[1:50:28] by replacing an older sign structure
[1:50:30] with a modern professionally designed monument sign
[1:50:33] that improves legibility organization and appearance.
[1:50:36] The electronic message center component is integrated into
[1:50:39] the overall design
[1:50:40] and it tasteful manner consistent
[1:50:42] with other signage already existing on the
[1:50:44] Pinkerton Academy campus.
[1:50:48] Substantial justice is done
[1:50:50] because granting the variance allows Pinkerton Academy
[1:50:53] to modernize and improve an existing campus sign while
[1:50:57] continuing to effectively communicate important school
[1:51:01] and community information.
[1:51:03] Denial of the variance would unnecessarily restrict the
[1:51:07] school's ability to utilize modern communication methods
[1:51:11] already commonly used by educational institutions
[1:51:14] and community facilities throughout the region.
[1:51:17] The benefit to the school and the community outweighs any
[1:51:20] potential impact, particularly since the sign replaces an
[1:51:24] existing structure and remains compatible
[1:51:27] with the surrounding area.
[1:51:30] The values of surrounding properties are not diminished
[1:51:32] because the proposed sign is a significant aesthetic
[1:51:35] improvement over the existing sign
[1:51:38] and incorporates high quality materials,
[1:51:40] professional design elements and landscape features.
[1:51:44] The updated monument style design is intended
[1:51:46] to compliment the character
[1:51:47] of the campus and surrounding area.
[1:51:49] The electronic message center is integrated into this
[1:51:52] structure in a cohesive manner
[1:51:53] and will be used primarily for school related messaging.
[1:51:57] The overall appearance of the property
[1:51:59] and surrounding corridor will be improved
[1:52:01] by replacing the existing sign existing aging sign.
[1:52:04] With a modern well-maintained structure,
[1:52:08] Little enforcement of the provisions
[1:52:10] of the audience result in a unnecessary hardship
[1:52:13] because for purpose of this paragraph, blah, blah, blah,
[1:52:17] no fair and substantial relationship exists
[1:52:19] between the general public purpose
[1:52:21] of the ordinance provision
[1:52:23] and the specific application of
[1:52:24] that provision to the property.
[1:52:26] Because the proposed sign is replacing existing free
[1:52:29] standing sign already served
[1:52:30] as against the location on campus.
[1:52:33] The request is not for a new commercial sign location,
[1:52:35] but rather a modernization
[1:52:37] of an existing school identification sign that is used
[1:52:40] for campus communication and public information.
[1:52:44] Pinton Academy is a large educational campus
[1:52:47] with significant daily vehicle traffic,
[1:52:49] multiple access points, and frequent
[1:52:51] school and community events.
[1:52:53] The electronic message center component is intended
[1:52:56] to provide timely communication related to school functions,
[1:52:59] athletics, scheduling, emergency messaging,
[1:53:02] and commer community notices.
[1:53:05] The proposed sign will remain consistent with the character
[1:53:07] of the property and the surrounding area
[1:53:09] and will improve the overall appearance
[1:53:10] of the existing sign location.
[1:53:12] Strict application of the ordinance in this case would
[1:53:15] prevent the school from utilizing modern communication
[1:53:17] methods and reasonably that reasonably serve the needs
[1:53:20] of the campus and community.
[1:53:23] The proposed use is a reasonable one
[1:53:25] because the proposed sign, the proposed sign is educational
[1:53:29] and informational in nature
[1:53:31] and directly related
[1:53:32] to the ongoing operations of Pinkerton Academy.
[1:53:35] The electronic message center is appropriately integrated
[1:53:38] into the professional design monument sign
[1:53:40] that replaces an older
[1:53:42] existing structure in substantially the same location.
[1:53:46] The scale design and function of the sign are appropriate
[1:53:49] for the size and nature of the campus.
[1:53:51] And similar signage already exists,
[1:53:53] uhwhere elsewhere on the property.
[1:53:55] The sign will continue to serve students, parents, staff,
[1:53:58] visitors in the community while improving visibility,
[1:54:01] safety, communication at a and aesthetics at the site.
[1:54:06] If the criter and paragraph A are not established,
[1:54:08] an unnecessary hardship will be deemed to exist.
[1:54:11] If and only if owing to special conditions
[1:54:13] of the property dis distinguish it from other properties in
[1:54:16] the area, the property cannot be reasonably used in a strict
[1:54:19] conformance with the ordinance.
[1:54:21] And a variance is therefore necessary
[1:54:23] to enable reasonable use of it.
[1:54:25] Because pick
[1:54:27] and Earn Academy functions as a large educational campus
[1:54:29] that requires effective communication with students,
[1:54:32] families, staff, visitors, and the surrounding community.
[1:54:35] Due to the scale of the campus, the volume of traffic
[1:54:37] and the frequency of school and community events.
[1:54:39] A modern communication sign
[1:54:41] with electronic message center capability is reasonable
[1:54:44] and necessary component of the property's operation.
[1:54:48] Without the request of re variance,
[1:54:49] the school would be limited in stability
[1:54:51] of communicate timely
[1:54:53] and important information in an effective manner consistent
[1:54:56] with current educational and community standards.
[1:54:59] The proposed sign replaces an existing sign in a similar
[1:55:02] location and is designed to enhance the appearance
[1:55:04] of the property while maintaining compatibility
[1:55:06] with the surrounding area.
[1:55:10] Okay. In your own words, What's that? I'm sorry.
[1:55:15] In your own words, anything further?
[1:55:19] Excuse me. I'm sorry. Anything further?
[1:55:22] Not at the moment, no. Okay. Questions from the board.
[1:55:28] How big is the existing sign?
[1:55:30] The existing sign is, hold on.
[1:55:36] It's basically identical to what's there now.
[1:55:40] It's a little over eight foot tall in height,
[1:55:43] a little over eight foot wide.
[1:55:46] The existing signage is exactly the same in terms
[1:55:49] of height and width.
[1:55:53] Thank you.
[1:55:55] The, how far from the road is it?
[1:55:59] It's gonna be setback,
[1:56:02] I think it's a little feet over 10 feet.
[1:56:03] Feet. 20 feet. 20 feet,
[1:56:04] 20 feet from the road edge? Yep.
[1:56:06] So it does conform to the code as far as setback
[1:56:10] for signs in the, in the MD
[1:56:15] medium high density residential.
[1:56:18] Sorry about that.
[1:56:24] The, the intent of the ordinance is to promote safe,
[1:56:28] effective, and aesthetically appropriate signage.
[1:56:31] The proposed sign accomplishes these goals
[1:56:33] by replacing an older sign structure
[1:56:35] of the modern professionally designed monument sign.
[1:56:40] The electronic messaging center component is integrated into
[1:56:43] the overall design, a tasteful manner.
[1:56:47] You understand the criteria for frequency of the changing
[1:56:52] of the, of the letters.
[1:56:54] Is there a brightness stipulation there as well, Ms. Owen?
[1:56:57] Correct. Yep. And I think one of the things that,
[1:57:01] that often is looked at as electronic messaging centers are
[1:57:07] becoming more predominant
[1:57:08] and frequent, you know, the requests,
[1:57:11] it's the changing time, energy savings
[1:57:14] and so on and so forth.
[1:57:16] But you know, as a distra is a safety distraction of images
[1:57:20] that could draw someone's eye off of traffic
[1:57:23] and run over a student.
[1:57:27] So you understand that?
[1:57:29] Yeah. So there's, you know, a, the couple of points as far
[1:57:34] as the message hold time, it's completely
[1:57:39] programmable to comply with whatever the ordinance is
[1:57:42] as far as they message hold time.
[1:57:44] I didn't see anything
[1:57:46] or I don't recall anything in the ordinances to
[1:57:49] what the actual hold time is,
[1:57:52] but it's programmable to comply with the code.
[1:57:56] The brightness levels comply with the code as far as the,
[1:57:59] you know, total brightness,
[1:58:01] automatic dimming throughout the day
[1:58:03] into twilight and nighttime.
[1:58:05] It meets the, excuse me, the,
[1:58:08] it actually excuses the 0.3 candles
[1:58:12] measured at a hundred feet, I believe it was.
[1:58:14] Okay. So Wafi sign, we are the premier manufacturer
[1:58:19] of digital signage in the industry.
[1:58:22] We actually help set the standards for outdoor advertising.
[1:58:28] Outdoor advertising guidelines.
[1:58:32] So we've met with billboard operators,
[1:58:38] the International Sign Association.
[1:58:40] We've met with different dark sky groups
[1:58:43] and everyone's in agreement, you know, with the, the,
[1:58:48] the specifications we put forth meet
[1:58:50] or exceed any, any ordinance within the country.
[1:58:55] All right, so permitted uses of such signs
[1:58:58] that are in the two commercial zones, an industrial zone,
[1:59:02] this is in a medium density residential zone.
[1:59:07] How do you justify that, that aspect, that hardship,
[1:59:11] that spear of the ordinance?
[1:59:13] I think it boils down to the uniqueness of the property.
[1:59:16] You know, pinking Pinkerton is a
[1:59:18] 120 acre campus in the middle of a residential zone.
[1:59:22] They have 22 buildings on site, multiple entrances.
[1:59:27] They serve 3,100 students over 500 faculty.
[1:59:32] So it's, it's very unique to the, the district itself.
[1:59:38] You know, I understand digital signage not being allowed in
[1:59:43] a residential area.
[1:59:44] Part of the ordinances, you, you know, for residential area,
[1:59:47] you don't wanna sign this distracting is too bright at night
[1:59:51] or shining any neighbor's window and so forth.
[1:59:55] The location of the proposed signage, with the exception
[1:59:59] of one property, it's completely enveloped by the campus.
[2:00:05] There's the buildings on one side,
[2:00:06] the athletic fields on the other.
[2:00:08] There's not another resident within several hundred yards.
[2:00:13] The only resident on the property.
[2:00:17] I took a picture, which I can share with the group.
[2:00:20] I have handouts. The only resident within
[2:00:25] that would have any viewable, you know,
[2:00:30] capacity of the digital sign.
[2:00:32] They're at an angle well over 40 degrees to one side.
[2:00:37] And the, the view from the resonance
[2:00:41] to the sign is completely blocked by evergreen trees.
[2:00:44] So pine trees, they don't lose their,
[2:00:48] their leaves or anything in the winter.
[2:00:49] So there's no worry about, you know, shining in the,
[2:00:53] a residence in the middle
[2:00:54] of the winter or anything like that.
[2:00:55] So I think it's,
[2:00:57] So, so could you say that the,
[2:00:59] because of the size of the campus
[2:01:01] that this sign is serving primarily to the campus
[2:01:06] and the campus becomes an island of its own,
[2:01:09] excluding it from
[2:01:11] or meeting the spirit of the ordinance,
[2:01:12] excluding it from the rest of the criteria in that zone?
[2:01:16] I, I think the uniqueness
[2:01:17] of the property definitely does, yes.
[2:01:19] Okay. Alright. Anybody else have any questions, Mr.
[2:01:22] Dietzel?
[2:01:26] No, I, I had questions,
[2:01:27] but I, I think they were addressed
[2:01:31] just name mainly on the, the hardship.
[2:01:34] He, when he was going over a, he went the,
[2:01:39] the pur for the purpose of this,
[2:01:40] this paragraph, da da da da.
[2:01:42] Well, he kind of da da da da over the most important part.
[2:01:45] And that was the nature and the,
[2:01:47] the special conditions of the property.
[2:01:49] But he went on to explain that.
[2:01:52] And so I think
[2:01:56] that question has been answered. So thank you,
[2:01:58] Mr.
[2:01:59] Chair. Ms. Mor, I have none at Mr. Trip.
[2:02:03] All set
[2:02:05] At, at present.
[2:02:06] Okay. Mr. Donlin, I'm gonna hold off for now.
[2:02:10] Mr. Okay, Ms. Owen, you wanna
[2:02:11] help us with the staff report? Sure.
[2:02:13] I don't have a lot of new information to add, but, okay.
[2:02:16] We can move on. I'll just kind of reiterate the facts.
[2:02:20] So the applicant's seeking approval
[2:02:23] to allow the installation of a 48 square foot
[2:02:26] freestanding sign that it will be illuminated,
[2:02:29] that includes a 16 square foot electronic
[2:02:31] message center sign.
[2:02:33] So as we are aware that the, they're looking
[2:02:37] to replace the existing deteriorating sign,
[2:02:39] it's in a little bit of a different location,
[2:02:41] but they did provide the vicinity map
[2:02:42] that meets the setbacks Property is located in the medium
[2:02:45] high density residential district, which does not permit
[2:02:49] or doesn't even address non-residential signs
[2:02:52] in the neighborhood.
[2:02:53] And as we're aware, electronic message center signs are
[2:02:57] currently only permitted in the general commercial,
[2:02:59] general commercial four and industrial four districts.
[2:03:03] So that's why they're here this evening for the variance.
[2:03:06] So if appro, so for the, they're seeking the variance
[2:03:09] for the sign and for the EMC if approved,
[2:03:13] the condition for the electronic message center is required
[2:03:16] to operate in accordance with section 1 65 0.101 point 11.
[2:03:21] And so appropriate sign permits will be required.
[2:03:28] Is the visibility the reason
[2:03:30] that you're relocating the sign to closer to the road edge?
[2:03:35] I think it has more to do with
[2:03:38] that existing structure isn't just such disrepair.
[2:03:43] I you had a picture of it previously.
[2:03:46] The stone base is deteriorating, crumbling.
[2:03:49] There's, there's footings below that brick base
[2:03:55] that are not adequate, you know, for the,
[2:03:58] for the new signage, what, you know, you would consider,
[2:04:01] you know, what's required today.
[2:04:04] So to put it in the exact same location would
[2:04:09] be more difficult than moving it, you know,
[2:04:12] several feet away from where it is now.
[2:04:15] And it will be easier to see from the roadway where
[2:04:19] that one is kind of set back into the driveway a little bit
[2:04:22] more, you know,
[2:04:26] keeping in conformance with the code
[2:04:28] and a 20 foot setback, you know, there the,
[2:04:31] the new location will just have better
[2:04:33] visibility from the road.
[2:04:37] The, the sign as it's,
[2:04:40] the new sign proposal is not on piers, it's on a,
[2:04:44] a solid base similar to the one that's there.
[2:04:46] Correct. And the one that's there is not worthy of
[2:04:51] tearing off of the footings
[2:04:53] and then setting this back on top of it,
[2:04:56] If you look at that, excuse me, that previous picture,
[2:05:03] that brick base, the,
[2:05:07] the sign shop, Bailey sign had done a site survey
[2:05:12] and you know, beneath that brick base,
[2:05:16] you know, there's a a, a concrete footing that all of
[2:05:21] that sits on and the steel poles sit on the steel poles
[2:05:24] themselves are in disrepair.
[2:05:26] So they're not reusable.
[2:05:28] The concrete footing that's there, it's been there for,
[2:05:33] for a very, very long time.
[2:05:36] And there's concern that, you know,
[2:05:38] what they could see was not in great shape
[2:05:40] and there's concern that there would just be
[2:05:42] so much disrepair that they would have
[2:05:45] to completely dig out, you know, that
[2:05:47] entire concrete footing and,
[2:05:50] and start over from scratch where, you know, having
[2:05:53] that sign move just a little bit further away
[2:05:58] to give it better visibility from the road
[2:06:01] still conform to the ordinance.
[2:06:03] As far as a setback, it's a more cost effects of option
[2:06:07] and in the end it gives better visibility
[2:06:11] to people traveling down North Main Street.
[2:06:14] You can see that existing sign, you know, it's probably 30
[2:06:19] to, I'll call it 30 feet into the driveway.
[2:06:24] So, and there's, you know, if you look on the north side of
[2:06:27] that street, there are trees that block the visibility.
[2:06:31] I believe that's a tree blocking visibility.
[2:06:35] So the, the new location, it's, you know,
[2:06:38] it serves the same purpose.
[2:06:39] It just increases, you know, the visibility.
[2:06:43] We will be better
[2:06:45] and it's a more cost effective option than digging down,
[2:06:49] you know, six feet to find dilapidated concrete,
[2:06:53] remove it all, re excavate that area
[2:06:56] and pour a new base.
[2:06:58] Okay. Alright. Anybody else? So Mr. Trip, go ahead.
[2:07:04] I assume you're going to, when you install the new sign,
[2:07:09] you're gonna remove the old one, right?
[2:07:11] Correct. Yes. Alright, so if you remove the old one,
[2:07:17] why couldn't you put the new one
[2:07:20] where the old one used to be?
[2:07:22] So when you look at that old sign, what you can see
[2:07:25] above ground is not the entire structure. So, so
[2:07:28] You're not gonna remove the entirety of the old sign.
[2:07:32] The, so the, the concrete footing
[2:07:35] that would be below that?
[2:07:37] Yes. Brick veneer I, that can most likely stay
[2:07:42] some landscaping over
[2:07:43] that you'll never even know it's there.
[2:07:45] Okay. So you answered my question. Yeah,
[2:07:49] I'll set, you'll set Mr. Trip or no?
[2:07:54] Currently. Okay.
[2:07:56] If you're not, that's fine.
[2:07:58] What, do you have another question?
[2:08:00] No, it was just, you know,
[2:08:02] if you're taking the oat sign out, you know,
[2:08:06] but you're not taking the oat sign out,
[2:08:08] you're removing the visible portion.
[2:08:11] Yeah. I mean that, that concrete footing, if I were
[2:08:15] to guess is probably goes down maybe two feet.
[2:08:19] So it's, you know, it's probably 36 inches
[2:08:22] by two feet by eight feet.
[2:08:24] This is significant, significant weight to it. Yeah.
[2:08:27] To remove it is not an easy task.
[2:08:30] Are you're gonna put a, a similar base
[2:08:32] in the new sign, right?
[2:08:34] Yes. Much easier to break ground on virgin ground than
[2:08:37] digging through or removing any existing concrete.
[2:08:39] Yeah. Tell you, find some
[2:08:42] And that's, that's just the labor portion.
[2:08:44] Just the, the fact that you have better visibility from the
[2:08:47] road at the new location is probably the,
[2:08:51] the more important reason.
[2:08:53] Well, better visibility
[2:08:54] with an electronic messaging sign is one
[2:08:56] of the bigger impacts or pushbacks that we get.
[2:09:00] And why? It's, why it's sometimes objectable Yeah.
[2:09:04] That and people don't like signs in residential areas.
[2:09:09] Right? Right. And you know, again, just the,
[2:09:13] the uniqueness of the property, you know, there's,
[2:09:18] I I don't have the full zoning map in front of me,
[2:09:21] but there's not a resident that will be able to see
[2:09:24] that sign while they're home or in their yard
[2:09:27] or anything else.
[2:09:29] It's, it's serving the community.
[2:09:31] It's, I mean, you, it's a, it's a residential district
[2:09:35] with no residents that live within several
[2:09:38] hundred yards of the display.
[2:09:40] So the house that's next to the,
[2:09:41] That's the only one.
[2:09:43] And I, you know, I, I,
[2:09:45] Well then that's, there's, it's wrong for you
[2:09:47] to say there's no resident in the area.
[2:09:50] I misspoke. There's one. Well, thank you
[2:09:55] Mr.
[2:09:56] Donald. You all set
[2:09:57] For now? Mr.
[2:09:58] Chair? Ms. Moore? I'm all set. Mr. Dietzel. All set, Mr.
[2:10:01] Chair. All right, very good. Let's take a
[2:10:02] call to public then.
[2:10:04] Anybody who wishes to support this application,
[2:10:06] this should be your opportunity to come forward.
[2:10:09] I'm not seeing anybody rise for that one.
[2:10:12] Anybody in opposition to this application?
[2:10:14] This would be your opportunity to come forward and be heard.
[2:10:18] All right, gentlemen, I guess you're safe there.
[2:10:21] Any last questions? I do, yes. Mr. Donlin,
[2:10:24] In the digital era that we live in nowadays,
[2:10:30] could you expand on the need for the digital aspect
[2:10:34] of this sign for messaging when emails
[2:10:37] and text messages are so easy
[2:10:39] to send out to either the school?
[2:10:42] Yeah, so if you look at all the studies as far as
[2:10:47] what sort of, you know, lack of better term marketing
[2:10:51] or messaging or communication, which forms
[2:10:56] are the most effective?
[2:10:58] Digital fi digital signage exceeds
[2:11:00] every other form out there.
[2:11:02] Whether it's news, radio, email, text,
[2:11:07] you know, I'm a resident of Manchester, New Hampshire.
[2:11:10] My daughter just graduated from high school.
[2:11:15] I don't, I I got over a dozen texts a week
[2:11:19] from the school district.
[2:11:20] I never read any of 'em.
[2:11:22] It just, you know, I didn't care if school bus five
[2:11:24] was going to be late today.
[2:11:26] My daughter wasn't on the bus.
[2:11:29] You know, the students come from,
[2:11:33] they're not all localized.
[2:11:34] They come from all over.
[2:11:38] Pretty much every student, every parent, including the staff
[2:11:43] will go by the sign every day.
[2:11:47] So, you know, the ability to reach
[2:11:51] that broad of a public base is, you know,
[2:11:56] there, there's no other form
[2:11:58] of communication that's more effective.
[2:12:00] Not to mention, you know, Pinkerton is, you know,
[2:12:04] a a member of the community.
[2:12:07] So, you know, putting messages up for
[2:12:11] community events that normally wouldn't
[2:12:16] receive an email or a text message.
[2:12:18] Emergency alerts, you know, emergencies on campus,
[2:12:22] things along those lines.
[2:12:24] There's no way to reach the public with that outside of,
[2:12:28] you know, the digital messaging.
[2:12:33] That's kind of where I was going with it.
[2:12:34] So it would be fair to say that utilizing the gym
[2:12:38] for voting say, or shows
[2:12:40] that Stockbridge might be advertised on that sign
[2:12:42] where you might not get a text if you're not a student?
[2:12:45] That's correct. And if the building,
[2:12:51] the gym is also the town's shelter.
[2:12:53] So say the shelter was open, we'd have the ability
[2:12:56] to put it up on the sign that shelter is open here
[2:12:59] for the town pending.
[2:13:00] We had power, If we had power,
[2:13:05] but it can be gener,
[2:13:06] generator can probably run that as well.
[2:13:09] Thank you. All set. Mr. Doman? Yes, sir. Okay.
[2:13:12] Mr. Trip, back to you.
[2:13:13] So do you,
[2:13:16] do you anticipate the sign usage
[2:13:21] to include something like
[2:13:23] what you've shown home of the Astros?
[2:13:28] I mean, it's, it's a pretty good rendering, you know,
[2:13:34] athletic events, things like that would obviously be part
[2:13:38] of the message that's, that's put out there, you know,
[2:13:42] but it's, you know, key dates,
[2:13:45] important dates coming, events.
[2:13:47] So mostly textual. What's
[2:13:49] That?
[2:13:50] Mostly textual messages. Yes. Yeah.
[2:13:52] With the t with the what?
[2:13:55] Nothing. I mean,
[2:13:57] we have a great example right here in town.
[2:13:59] If you've driven by the dairy public library,
[2:14:02] that's a watchfire digital sign.
[2:14:04] It's actually a little bit larger than
[2:14:05] what they're proposing here, which is appropriate
[2:14:09] because it's stepped back
[2:14:10] a little bit further from the road.
[2:14:13] But I think if you were to look at dairy,
[2:14:15] the public library, every message they have on there is done
[2:14:19] in a, a tasteful manner.
[2:14:21] It's actually the screen saver on my computer.
[2:14:23] So it's, it's my, the, my favorite picture
[2:14:26] of a sign I've taken in, in my entire territory.
[2:14:31] And I've never noticed it.
[2:14:35] I actually probably have, but it
[2:14:36] doesn't stand out in my head.
[2:14:38] Well that's, that's, that's mostly used
[2:14:40] for events, you know?
[2:14:41] 'cause I go to the library quite a bit
[2:14:43] and I, I do look at it, you know, when they talk about
[2:14:47] events that they're holding in the, in the library
[2:14:51] and sometimes even the events
[2:14:53] that are held in McGregor Park. So,
[2:14:57] You know, so I mean, you know,
[2:14:59] the school would be utilizing it basically the same
[2:15:02] manner that the library does.
[2:15:03] Yeah. All set. Mr. Tripp?
[2:15:08] I am all set for now.
[2:15:10] Okay. Did I call the public already?
[2:15:13] You did? Yeah. Okay. Good enough. Ms.
[2:15:16] Dietzel? You all set? All
[2:15:18] Set, Mr. Chair?
[2:15:18] Well that being said, we can take a motion
[2:15:20] to go into deliberation.
[2:15:22] I'll make a motion to go into deliberative session.
[2:15:26] Mr. Donlin, who wants
[2:15:27] to second, can we hear from the court?
[2:15:28] Yes. He just told me. I asked, I called. I didn't hear her.
[2:15:33] You wanna second his motion?
[2:15:35] I'll second the motion to go into deliberation.
[2:15:37] A all in favor of deliberation, say aye. Aye. He opposed.
[2:15:42] Okay. Who wants
[2:15:45] to start off Mr. Donlin?
[2:15:48] Sure. As we know, the digital signs,
[2:15:53] especially in the residential areas, tend
[2:15:56] to be a hot topic throughout the community at times.
[2:16:00] I, I feel like the uniqueness of this property
[2:16:07] in the residential area not being very residentially,
[2:16:11] for lack of a better term,
[2:16:12] and the, the use for the community and such, like the voting
[2:16:15] and other things around the, that might be
[2:16:20] appropriate for the community, not just the students
[2:16:23] or at lodge or the staff.
[2:16:26] That it, it goes
[2:16:31] beyond a reasonable, like it in a good way.
[2:16:35] That it, that it's, they've proven the need in my opinion.
[2:16:42] Okay. Mr. Zel?
[2:16:46] Yeah, I, I agree with Mr. Donlin.
[2:16:50] I, I think clearly the first four criteria are met.
[2:16:55] It goes back to the, the, the hardship
[2:16:58] and the uniqueness of the property
[2:17:00] and the special conditions surrounding the property.
[2:17:02] And I am concerned that there is one ofbut
[2:17:07] who might be affected.
[2:17:08] But when you look at that stretch of North Main Street,
[2:17:13] all the activities that's going on with the, the,
[2:17:16] the crosswalks and the children crossing
[2:17:18] and the sporting events.
[2:17:19] And the voting. And it, I just don't see that it's
[2:17:23] unreasonable to add this one
[2:17:28] small sign to such a big busy area.
[2:17:32] And so that's the,
[2:17:34] and so disallowing a variance
[2:17:38] for it would cause an unreasonable hardship.
[2:17:42] Okay. Mrs. Moore.
[2:17:45] So I agree.
[2:17:46] I like the new sign
[2:17:48] because if you're from around here,
[2:17:50] you'll tell people it's at the Hackler.
[2:17:54] But to what? The Hackler 'cause it's the name of the gym.
[2:17:57] It, the old side doesn't have the address.
[2:18:00] It doesn't say Fields House or any of that.
[2:18:03] So we'll use a craft fair for ex, you know, example.
[2:18:08] 'cause I know that's a lot of foot traffic
[2:18:11] to say it's at five Rein Street.
[2:18:14] Having the address on that will be helpful.
[2:18:18] The only thing I really wish is that they could put, like,
[2:18:21] parking lot is full.
[2:18:22] So we all know the parking lot, which parking lot is full,
[2:18:27] which parking lot does have open spots,
[2:18:30] but maybe in the next sign.
[2:18:33] Well that's, that's true. They
[2:18:35] Can put that message on the sign.
[2:18:37] It's digital. Yeah.
[2:18:38] Crystal, the Careful
[2:18:40] deliberation. Mr. Trip.
[2:18:45] Well the, looking at section 1 65 dash
[2:18:50] 1 0 1 1, the only things that I see
[2:18:55] that this sign is not compliant with would be that it's
[2:19:01] over 24 square feet and that it's an m
[2:19:05] and it's in a residential district now.
[2:19:09] So having fought this battle
[2:19:13] before, I believe that we've determined that
[2:19:19] businesses, and I believe Pinkerton is a business
[2:19:24] Longest standing.
[2:19:25] I said it's the longest standing business in town.
[2:19:28] No, it's a, it's a, a business is, is permitted to
[2:19:36] advertise where they are in the town with a sign
[2:19:42] and advertise what their products are.
[2:19:47] It being a electronic, electronic sign, you know, that's a,
[2:19:52] that's even better because, you know, as we know,
[2:19:55] Pinkerton has a lot of products.
[2:19:58] You know, the, so
[2:20:03] I, I believe that's a,
[2:20:07] a plus on this.
[2:20:09] And as for the electronic sign, as, as the applicant said,
[2:20:13] you know, the old sign was, well, you had to go out
[2:20:17] and put letters on.
[2:20:19] You know, the, the ability to
[2:20:25] change the messages electronically, you know,
[2:20:29] is a, is a great benefit.
[2:20:31] You know, especially when we're having football games
[2:20:35] or baseball games or basketball games
[2:20:40] or elections, you know, so
[2:20:46] I, I see that, I believe that the new sign
[2:20:53] is, is, is a benefit to the community.
[2:20:57] Okay. Anything else? You good?
[2:21:03] I'm good. Alright, great. Alright.
[2:21:07] I think weighing out the balance
[2:21:09] of five criteria is something that was established
[2:21:12] a long time ago before the criteria became so stringent.
[2:21:18] Understandably, we can see the deterioration
[2:21:20] of the former sign and its need for replacement.
[2:21:24] The question is, you know, how the, how the future
[2:21:30] continues to evolve and affects that.
[2:21:33] I don't find that the ask on this as,
[2:21:37] as reg egregious as it seems
[2:21:41] that electronic messaging signs are not being
[2:21:46] more appropriately addressed in our ordinances.
[2:21:50] So I'm going to, I feel fairly supportive of this
[2:21:55] understanding that the criteria is easily upheld
[2:22:01] as far as its luminance and its ability to change
[2:22:05] and become a distraction to traffic.
[2:22:08] I was a little taken back by the fact
[2:22:12] that it's not in the same place
[2:22:13] because that had stood out to me
[2:22:17] and I didn't know that to be contrary
[2:22:20] before we sat down tonight.
[2:22:22] Other than that, I, I think overall this is a reasonable fit
[2:22:27] and a reasonable request
[2:22:29] as Pinkerton is a 10 acre island upon itself.
[2:22:33] And this can become service to the community
[2:22:37] and certainly serves the student body there
[2:22:39] of 3,400 students.
[2:22:42] Anyway, let's structure the, the motion.
[2:22:46] I think we have just the,
[2:22:52] I lost my track of what I was
[2:22:54] looking at the motion.
[2:23:01] Can I borrow your motion sheet for a second?
[2:23:04] I think I might have figured out
[2:23:05] where my missing motions went.
[2:23:11] Subject to obtaining all State Town permits and inspections
[2:23:15] and the electronic message center signed shall operate in
[2:23:19] accordance with section described in within the ordinance.
[2:23:25] Does anybody have any other conditions they
[2:23:27] wish to add to that?
[2:23:30] Does the signed permit in included in the
[2:23:35] subject to obtaining all state
[2:23:37] and town permits and inspections?
[2:23:41] Yes. You got that Mr. Trip?
[2:23:45] I, I I heard
[2:23:46] That.
[2:23:47] Yes. Nod. You saw them. You heard the nod? Yes.
[2:23:49] I understand. Okay. Good enough.
[2:23:51] Alright, we've structured the motion.
[2:23:54] Take a motion to come on deliberate de deliberation, please.
[2:23:59] I'll make that motion to come outta deliberation. Thank
[2:24:01] You.
[2:24:02] Second. Seconded by Mr. Donlin.
[2:24:04] All in favor of coming outta deliberation, say aye. A aye.
[2:24:07] Aye. Any opposed? Mrs. Moore, you have a motion to read?
[2:24:10] I do. Thank you. I make a motion on case number two six
[2:24:14] dash 1 1 9 to grant a variance to the terms
[2:24:19] of Article 12, section
[2:24:22] 1 65 dash 1 0 1 1
[2:24:27] and article 12, section 1 65 dash
[2:24:32] 0 1 1 of the town
[2:24:35] of Derry zoning ordinance to allow the insulation
[2:24:39] of a 48 square foot freestanding sign
[2:24:43] containing a 16 square foot electronic message
[2:24:48] center sign replacing
[2:24:50] and existing free standing sign parcel ID
[2:24:55] 4 3 0 0 1 zoned MHDR as presented
[2:25:00] with the following conditions.
[2:25:01] We have two, one subject to obtaining l State
[2:25:05] and town permits and inspections.
[2:25:08] Two. Electronic message center sign shall operate in
[2:25:12] accordance with section
[2:25:14] 1 65 0.1011
[2:25:19] of the Town of Dairy zoning ordinance.
[2:25:21] And that completes the reading
[2:25:23] of the motion. I need a second,
[2:25:25] Second Seconded by Mr.
[2:25:27] Tripp that puts that on the floor.
[2:25:30] This, this case was not contested by any
[2:25:34] abutters either for or opposed to this application.
[2:25:39] Therefore, I would accept ask for acceptance
[2:25:43] to abbreviate the finding of fact.
[2:25:46] Thank you. Second. All right. Thank you.
[2:25:48] Finding of fact for case number 26 dash one 19.
[2:25:51] The applicant desires to replace a deteriorated sign.
[2:25:54] The application is in medium high density
[2:25:56] residential District central.
[2:25:58] The application is a request
[2:26:00] for an electronic messaging center
[2:26:02] where a backlit reader board was
[2:26:04] before electronic messages centers are permitted in two
[2:26:07] commercial zones and the industrial zone only.
[2:26:10] The board also includes all facts found in the meeting
[2:26:13] minutes for this application
[2:26:14] and incorporates all meeting minutes into its finding
[2:26:17] of facts and decisions.
[2:26:19] Anybody wish to add any addendums to that? No sir.
[2:26:22] Seeing no gestures.
[2:26:23] All in favor of moving this vote for this motion for a vote.
[2:26:27] Say aye. Aye. Aye. Any opposed Mr.
[2:26:33] Dietzel? Yes. Mark their votes please. Mr. Trip?
[2:26:38] Yes. Mr. Donlin? Yes. Mr. I. Sorry, Ms. Mor.
[2:26:43] Yes. And the chair will make that unanimous
[2:26:46] by a vote of five to zero.
[2:26:47] So congratulations gentlemen. Anybody agree by this?
[2:26:50] Of course, has 30 days to ask this board for rehearing,
[2:26:53] otherwise reports superior court.
[2:26:55] Okay. Thank you very much. Thank you very much.
[2:26:58] Have a good evening.
[2:27:03] This next case up is case number 26 dash one 20,
[2:27:07] Ackerman family revocable trust.
[2:27:25] Gentlemen, how are you? Good. How are introduce yourselves?
[2:27:28] My name is Peter Rockerman. Okay.
[2:27:30] And I'm Brian Jones with Allen Major Associates.
[2:27:33] We are the civil engineer on the project.
[2:27:35] And, and we ask that you read the five criteria
[2:27:38] for the record first and then we'll get into
[2:27:40] the barrage of questions. Okay?
[2:27:41] Certainly. Mr. Chair, if I may before you get started.
[2:27:44] Yes sir. I'll be restarting the,
[2:27:47] it looks like the PC was accidentally hit the computer,
[2:27:49] so I'll be just starting that.
[2:27:50] Well, don't do that guys.
[2:27:52] And would point a, would you like
[2:27:56] to appoint someone to the case?
[2:27:58] I would. The computer's down.
[2:28:00] Mr. Dani, can you sit on this one please?
[2:28:03] Yes I can. Alright,
[2:28:04] Very good.
[2:28:05] Mr Dial, did you catch that? He can sit on this one.
[2:28:09] He can. Oh good. John, you all
[2:28:12] Set?
[2:28:13] Thank you. Yes. I think that only
[2:28:13] Makes for though, Mr.
[2:28:14] Chair. All right. The chatter
[2:28:16] and the blueberries make it worthwhile.
[2:28:17] Go ahead.
[2:28:19] This is for a front yard setback
[2:28:21] for a billing addition in low density residential zone.
[2:28:24] And criteria number one, the variance will not be contrary
[2:28:29] to the public interest
[2:28:30] because it'll not alter the essential character
[2:28:33] of the neighborhood or threaten the public's health,
[2:28:36] safety, or welfare.
[2:28:38] The proposed development includes an existing residential
[2:28:41] duplex building that's approximately 45 feet from the right
[2:28:44] of way and parking for four cars along the front.
[2:28:48] Inside of the structure. The size
[2:28:50] and style of the proposed building addition are consistent
[2:28:53] with others in the neighborhood.
[2:28:56] Two, the spirit of the ordinance is observed
[2:28:58] because residential duplex structures are allowed in the
[2:29:02] current use and the massing of the proposed garage
[2:29:06] and structure are similar in size for the neighborhood
[2:29:09] while maintaining the current alignment
[2:29:11] of the existing parking area.
[2:29:13] The orientation of the garage allows for flow vehicles,
[2:29:16] which residents have been accustomed to since the mid 1980s
[2:29:20] when the structure was constructed.
[2:29:22] Number three, substantial justice is done
[2:29:25] because the site plan as designed is consistent
[2:29:28] with surrounding uses.
[2:29:30] Denial of the variance would require the entire development
[2:29:32] to be extended to the north resulting in an impact
[2:29:36] to the existing septic field for the the entire project.
[2:29:41] This would create an unnecessary visual discontinuity
[2:29:44] and alter the existing character of the neighborhood.
[2:29:47] The general public does not stand the benefit from
[2:29:49] de denying the request.
[2:29:51] The lot sizes conforming the proposed use is per permitted
[2:29:55] and the site plan has been designed to a high standard
[2:29:58] to protect the interests of the surrounding properties.
[2:30:01] Number four, as stated above, the use is allowed
[2:30:05] and consistent with the neighborhood.
[2:30:07] The project maintains the existing streets, scape
[2:30:10] and neighborhood character while providing a residential use
[2:30:13] compatible with surrounding properties.
[2:30:17] And number five liter literal enforcement of the provisions
[2:30:20] of the ordinance would result in an unnecessary hardship.
[2:30:25] A i and I'll read our response.
[2:30:29] Enforcement of the ordinance provision would require the
[2:30:32] development to be designed in a way
[2:30:33] that would make it inconsistent
[2:30:35] with the surrounding neighborhood, which is counter
[2:30:37] to the spirit and intent of the ordinance.
[2:30:40] And I'd add that special conditions of this property,
[2:30:44] that's not the property.
[2:30:49] Mr. Prevention, we have the wrong video up there.
[2:30:54] It's 300 island. That's for The next case. Yeah.
[2:30:57] Case one 20. My apologies. My apologies.
[2:31:00] No, it's fine. No problem.
[2:31:02] Probably when the applicant bumped the table right.
[2:31:05] Pull up the wrong one. When the, when this reset,
[2:31:08] I, I was just gonna state that
[2:31:10] there are special conditions for this property.
[2:31:11] It's wedge shaped. It's a lot
[2:31:13] with existing non-conforming frontage,
[2:31:16] which prevents placing the garage to the side without impact
[2:31:19] to the existing septic system.
[2:31:22] Turn it back to the chair.
[2:31:25] Do you, you don't have anything else you want to add?
[2:31:29] Oh, we can talk about the uniqueness
[2:31:31] of the, the building addition.
[2:31:33] Mr. Ackerman is laid it out. It has very specific uses.
[2:31:38] Mr. Ackman, can you enlighten the board as to the purpose
[2:31:41] of the, the addition?
[2:31:42] Well, so I think the garage itself certainly
[2:31:45] speaks for itself.
[2:31:46] We'd like to have a garage, but over that we'll have a room
[2:31:50] that we're gonna build for my son who has special needs.
[2:31:55] He does a lot of home care and a lot of therapy at home.
[2:32:00] He just reacts a lot better when we do do it at home.
[2:32:03] So over time we're trying to do more and more of that.
[2:32:05] And this will create a space for him as opposed
[2:32:08] to being jammed into a very small corner of the basement
[2:32:11] for a two to four hour session with a therapist.
[2:32:19] This is a two family townhouse, correct?
[2:32:22] It's Duplex. It's duplex, yeah. Plex.
[2:32:24] Yeah. And
[2:32:28] what is the actual size of this structure?
[2:32:32] Because you have about three
[2:32:34] or four different size descriptions
[2:32:38] throughout your whole packet.
[2:32:41] Do you know the square footage of the building edition
[2:32:43] Of the entire, the entire edition or just the garage?
[2:32:47] Well, you have on your propo on your drawing plan,
[2:32:51] you have a proposed 30 by 30 foot garage
[2:32:55] on another document you have another size designated.
[2:33:00] It is 30 by 34.
[2:33:05] And then on, I think another plan, you have it
[2:33:09] as a 32 by 34.
[2:33:12] So this is gonna go back to the hardship aspect for me.
[2:33:17] Not because there's different sizes, but
[2:33:19] because of the overall size of your, of the structure.
[2:33:22] But I'd like to know what the actual proposed
[2:33:25] size of the structure is.
[2:33:26] Sounds like you may have two different,
[2:33:28] maybe there was an old one and a new one.
[2:33:33] I do not have the plans in front of me.
[2:33:35] I just have that's not
[2:33:39] so 34 by 32.
[2:33:43] Yeah. So this plan here says
[2:33:47] 30 by 30.
[2:33:50] That's, that's the size that we would live
[2:33:52] with if a variance was granted.
[2:33:54] The 30 by 30 is correct. Is your application size.
[2:33:59] Yes. So with this structure being the way it is,
[2:34:08] How does putting this size of a garage,
[2:34:13] you know, really make, make sense in this indication?
[2:34:18] You're, you know, you're coming into the,
[2:34:20] and it kind of refutes your testimony, right?
[2:34:24] Similar structures along the way,
[2:34:27] but you're coming into this a 35 foot setback, you know,
[2:34:32] you're asking for relief at 17 feet.
[2:34:35] The size of the garage would be a concern, right?
[2:34:38] If somebody wants to build a hundred by a hundred foot house
[2:34:42] and you know, on a quarter acre lot
[2:34:44] and then they tell you they need relief, you say,
[2:34:46] well you need to build a smaller house.
[2:34:48] Right? It's that kind of philosophy.
[2:34:50] So I I, for me, I really need to understand why a 30
[2:34:55] by 30 foot garage is appropriate on a townhouse
[2:34:59] and how it fits to the structure that's there.
[2:35:04] So I I think the garage space is obviously of a of use
[2:35:09] to the resident, but it's the, the upper story
[2:35:11] that is really critical for them that, that activity area,
[2:35:17] and again, I just speak to the,
[2:35:20] the uniqueness of this property.
[2:35:22] It does get pinched in the front.
[2:35:23] It has non-conforming frontage, which,
[2:35:26] which automatically makes it difficult to
[2:35:28] which build in either direction.
[2:35:31] But Mr. Ackman again can enlighten on the actual purpose
[2:35:37] of the second floor why it's needed,
[2:35:40] why it's laid out the way it is.
[2:35:42] I think, and correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just,
[2:35:44] when we laid it out, the 32 feet
[2:35:47] or 30 feet from the
[2:35:49] existing structure towards the road towards Island Pond
[2:35:52] Road, in order to get two cars side by side
[2:35:56] and the stairs to go up
[2:35:57] and down, that kind of brought me to it backed into the size
[2:36:02] of the left or the right
[2:36:03] or the, the size of the space towards Island Pond.
[2:36:07] As far as going deep towards the back of the property.
[2:36:10] I believe we have enough space anyway, whether it was 30
[2:36:13] or 32 or 34, I think that was, I don't think it's the,
[2:36:18] you're you're referring to more of the, the 32 feet
[2:36:22] or the 30 feet from the existing home
[2:36:25] towards the island pond road. Am I right?
[2:36:28] I I think that's how it's orientated. Yep. Yep.
[2:36:33] And I did see in the plans
[2:36:34] that looks like you have the staircase built into the back
[2:36:37] of the garage that would take you up
[2:36:40] to the top floor, correct?
[2:36:41] Yeah, there's a doorway, you know, a doorway.
[2:36:42] So the two co, two garage doors and a doorway to get in
[2:36:47] and out and then that doorway would have a
[2:36:50] stairway to go up to the top.
[2:36:51] Yep, I understand.
[2:36:53] So that ended up kind of backing into a little bit wider
[2:36:55] of a space as opposed to just two cars
[2:36:59] or two garage doors, which are roughly eight feet wide.
[2:37:03] And then the sides that would go with that
[2:37:07] Is, is the, are you adding onto your,
[2:37:12] your live on the left side unit?
[2:37:14] Correct? Yes. And are you adding onto that habitable space?
[2:37:17] Yes. As well as the garage? Yes.
[2:37:20] And so, and I, so the,
[2:37:23] who lives in the right hand side?
[2:37:25] You? My sister. Your Sister,
[2:37:26] Okay.
[2:37:27] I bought the home in 1999.
[2:37:28] She's lived there beside me since then.
[2:37:31] Okay. And so
[2:37:36] why does the whole structure can't, can't slide backwards?
[2:37:40] 'cause this is a pretty big encroachment
[2:37:42] on a very busy road.
[2:37:45] When you say slide backwards, can you
[2:37:48] Well, I, the the third towards
[2:37:50] The back of the property you mean?
[2:37:51] Yes. I guess it could slide backwards a little bit more.
[2:37:57] Trying to line up the addition with the existing home so
[2:38:01] that when we open up the walls it all flows together.
[2:38:04] If it did slide back, then it creates a little bit
[2:38:07] of an awkward space as to where that would cross through.
[2:38:10] Yep.
[2:38:12] Okay. Let me yield, anybody wishes to
[2:38:17] ask any questions Mr. Dietzel?
[2:38:20] No, thank you Mr. Chair. Mr. Dani,
[2:38:23] I think you asked the questions.
[2:38:25] I was curious why I wouldn't be able to slide back myself.
[2:38:28] It looks more of a inconvenience than a hardship.
[2:38:33] So in their application they mention
[2:38:37] it would result in impact to the existing septic field
[2:38:40] for the entire project?
[2:38:43] No, that's to go to the north.
[2:38:45] Go left, I mean,
[2:38:48] or off to the side.
[2:38:52] You're essentially adding another bedroom here. Yes.
[2:38:55] And have you had a test for the septic
[2:39:00] to evaluate?
[2:39:02] Yes. Future expansion.
[2:39:04] We put a new septic in.
[2:39:06] You have put in a new septic? Yep.
[2:39:08] And we relocated a little further out.
[2:39:10] Okay. The, the term development,
[2:39:13] when I was reviewing these documents through me,
[2:39:16] because it, my first impression without seeing any images
[2:39:19] was that this was a multi house, which I guess it is,
[2:39:24] but I was thinking that it was an alignment
[2:39:26] of a few different homes or something in this regard.
[2:39:31] And, and that's just an addition, not the case. Yeah.
[2:39:36] When did you put the, the septic in?
[2:39:39] It's just recently finished Like six months ago. Mm.
[2:39:43] It's been done for about a month and a half.
[2:39:45] I see. Okay. Mr.
[2:39:49] Trip, any questions?
[2:39:55] Not at this time. Anybody else down on the left there?
[2:39:57] Mr. Donlin? Mr. Henry? No, thank you. Okay.
[2:40:05] I, I find that, you know, for me this is getting a little
[2:40:09] close to the road for, for my comfort.
[2:40:12] I think that what's been cited is that this is more of a,
[2:40:16] a convenience versus a, a need.
[2:40:19] And it's not to shade over the empathy of what you're trying
[2:40:24] to achieve here, but that's pretty close to the road.
[2:40:28] It's not like a five foot request, you know,
[2:40:33] and it has a not feel good side to it
[2:40:36] for me at this right now.
[2:40:38] Is there anything else you wish to speak to on this or
[2:40:42] Address?
[2:40:43] Well, You know, I, other than the fact that we,
[2:40:48] you know, I, I plan on myself
[2:40:50] and my family's plan on spending the rest of our lives here.
[2:40:53] You know, we of course, I get it from your point of view,
[2:40:57] it's a little close to the road.
[2:40:59] We did try to configure it
[2:41:00] by stretching it out back further,
[2:41:03] but then there's not enough room
[2:41:04] to come out if we came out on the side as a,
[2:41:07] with a two car garage, if that makes sense.
[2:41:10] Why I'm trying to describe it.
[2:41:13] Of course we'd love to have the space upstairs
[2:41:15] for obvious reasons, but that I explained
[2:41:21] we'd love to be able to have a two car garage there
[2:41:23] and have the ability to use the stairs to go upstairs.
[2:41:27] Most, you know, I think, you know, a foot
[2:41:30] or two feet in either direction I
[2:41:32] think could be figured out.
[2:41:34] But I understand. I get it.
[2:41:37] The most two car garages I see are 24 by 24.
[2:41:42] I see. 22 by 20 fours and the narrow
[2:41:46] and just don't, yeah, they don't work,
[2:41:47] but they, 24 by 20 fours I certainly don't like
[2:41:51] to, I think are adequate.
[2:41:53] Yeah. And more so if it's a stick built versus trap
[2:41:57] between two foundation walls.
[2:41:58] Correct? Sure. And so this seemed
[2:42:03] to be a little large for me,
[2:42:06] but I saw the drawings of the stairs in the back.
[2:42:09] Yeah. I don't know exactly what,
[2:42:13] what fits for me that's comfortable on, you know,
[2:42:16] for a setback for this.
[2:42:18] But again, this is, this is a little uncomfortable
[2:42:21] for myself, but other board members may
[2:42:24] have a say in it as well.
[2:42:25] So Mr. Deel,
[2:42:31] I drove by the property a number of times.
[2:42:37] I really don't feel uncomfortable with the setback.
[2:42:40] That particular stretch of the road is,
[2:42:43] is fairly visible.
[2:42:46] I I don't, I don't think
[2:42:48] what they're requesting is unreasonable.
[2:42:51] It it, but is it excessive?
[2:42:54] It's not excessive, but is it, I think given the fact
[2:42:59] that there, there really aren't any very close abutters
[2:43:05] and given the fact that there still is a safe distance
[2:43:09] between with the setback, I, I think
[2:43:13] what they're proposing is, is reasonable
[2:43:16] and especially in light of the, the,
[2:43:21] the son, he's gonna need special needs or not.
[2:43:25] He has needs, he's gonna need his own space is is he grows.
[2:43:29] And, and I think
[2:43:34] to the nature of the, the property itself, I think going
[2:43:38] back and he explained why some
[2:43:41] of those other configurations aren't as desirable.
[2:43:44] And so I think denying it would cause a hardship.
[2:43:47] And so I, I believe that
[2:43:51] the five criteria are met. Alright.
[2:43:53] Mr. Dani, anything, any questions?
[2:43:56] I mean, I just disagree with Mr. Dietzel.
[2:43:59] I feel like the garage is not the living space
[2:44:01] that we're concerned with.
[2:44:03] It's a garage and it's encroaching
[2:44:06] and we don't know what's the future for
[2:44:08] that road in the future if they're gonna widen it or not.
[2:44:12] And you're already encroaching on a 35 foot. I think it's
[2:44:17] Okay.
[2:44:18] Mrs. Moore, any questions?
[2:44:20] Yeah, so now that I understand it better,
[2:44:26] if you're, are you gonna be utilizing the garage?
[2:44:29] Will the garage doors be on the island pond side or
[2:44:33] No?
[2:44:34] Okay. Where are they gonna be?
[2:44:35] Because my concern would be backing out into the road for
[2:44:39] Public safety.
[2:44:40] No backing out into the driveway. Plant south.
[2:44:43] Okay. Thank you. Anything else?
[2:44:47] No. That I just, my concern was.
[2:44:49] Okay. Any other, any other information you wanna share
[2:44:53] with us or make a call the public or?
[2:44:57] No. Okay. All right, Mrs. Owen,
[2:45:00] you wanna help us out on your, on your end and
[2:45:03] Sure.
[2:45:04] Yeah. I don't have, again, a lot to add for this one,
[2:45:06] but the applicant's requesting a variance
[2:45:08] to allow the construction of a residential addition
[2:45:10] with attached garage within 17.7 feet
[2:45:14] of the front property line where 35 feet is required
[2:45:18] and that's at its closest point.
[2:45:19] This is located in the low density residential district,
[2:45:23] which requires a 35 foot minimum front yard setback,
[2:45:27] which is therefore we're here for the variance this evening.
[2:45:30] As we're aware, the property contains a preexisting
[2:45:33] non-conforming two family residence,
[2:45:35] each unit consisting of two bedrooms.
[2:45:38] The proposed addition would be for one unit, the left side,
[2:45:43] the existing lot of record is 6.01 acres
[2:45:46] with approximately 145 feet of frontage if approved,
[2:45:50] appropriate permits and inspections will be required.
[2:45:54] Okay. Anybody have any questions for coen enforcement?
[2:45:58] Nothing there. Okay. All right. Let's make a call to public.
[2:46:01] Just go through the protocols, statute.
[2:46:05] Anybody here wish to speak in favor of this application?
[2:46:07] This would be your time to come forward.
[2:46:10] Seeing no gestures there, anybody who wishes
[2:46:13] to speak in opposition to this,
[2:46:15] this would be your opportunity to come forward.
[2:46:18] Alright. I seeing nobody on that end. Okay.
[2:46:23] So if there's nothing left to address to the board
[2:46:26] or anything to say, we can we'll move into deliberation.
[2:46:29] You guys all set?
[2:46:32] Yes. Alright, take a motion.
[2:46:34] Go into deliberation please.
[2:46:35] So, vote. All right, Richard, Mr. Trip has that motion.
[2:46:39] Could have second please. I'll second it. Thank you Mr. Ani.
[2:46:42] All in favor of deliberation, say aye. Aye. Any opposed?
[2:46:47] Hearing none. All right. Let's think this one out.
[2:46:51] We have the motion structured,
[2:46:55] we have one condition with it subject
[2:46:58] to all towns permits and inspections.
[2:47:01] And does anybody want to make any further comments about,
[2:47:05] I think we touched into deliberation a little bit, but Mr.
[2:47:08] Dietzel, you wanna go any further with that? No.
[2:47:11] Thank you Mr. Chair. Okay, Mr. Dani? No, thank you sir. Mr.
[2:47:16] Tripp, you want to help explain us through this?
[2:47:19] Well, the, since the
[2:47:25] garage entrance
[2:47:28] and exit is on the side, which
[2:47:35] eliminates part of the,
[2:47:40] my hesitance to approve a,
[2:47:42] a shortened setback.
[2:47:47] The,
[2:47:52] it it, it makes it a a little more appealing.
[2:47:55] The,
[2:48:00] and that's the only ask in this variance request
[2:48:05] is to give them a, a reduced setback.
[2:48:11] You know, the, it appears that
[2:48:16] the property,
[2:48:22] what, what do you
[2:48:25] is set back significantly from the road itself?
[2:48:30] No, because there's the landscaping.
[2:48:34] That must be, do we
[2:48:36] have No, I
[2:48:40] Don't think so.
[2:48:44] I'd estimate probably 15 feet from the pavement to the,
[2:48:46] the front yard, the lot line
[2:48:49] 15 feet from speak of the louder
[2:48:50] Pavement to the property line. It's
[2:48:52] A little bit angle, but it's a, yeah,
[2:48:53] It's 18 deliberation.
[2:48:54] That's, so we do try to, if we wanna break the protocol
[2:48:57] and go back, we can do that.
[2:48:59] I apologize. Mr.
[2:49:00] Trip, did you want to go work out of deliberation? No. Okay.
[2:49:09] Any further questions Mr. Trip?
[2:49:11] No, thank you. Okay.
[2:49:16] Any other comments at all? You are all set,
[2:49:24] But the only comment I have is, you know,
[2:49:25] preexisting conditions are, are limiting, you know,
[2:49:30] what you can do to put another building in
[2:49:36] if, if you're interested in being able
[2:49:38] to provide a walkthrough, you know, from the
[2:49:41] new building to the old building.
[2:49:43] So,
[2:49:45] You know, Ms. Morin asked a question
[2:49:46] that was the orientation of the garage doors
[2:49:50] to the structure and the garage doors are coming in on the
[2:49:55] side where the 35 foot front setback is designated.
[2:49:59] And that's understandable.
[2:50:01] And I point out the fact that a 24 by 24 garage
[2:50:07] is, or 24 foot width garage is probably the nearest,
[2:50:10] I would like to see a two car garage.
[2:50:13] And As you address
[2:50:18] and the idea of sliding this backwards, you start
[2:50:22] to eliminate a passage that would be between
[2:50:27] the garage door that's closest to the structure
[2:50:32] and clear passage for a car, a vehicle to back out.
[2:50:37] I think you're, you were starting to touch on that, Mr.
[2:50:40] Tripp and or go in that direction. Yep.
[2:50:42] This is Morin's point is that if you have a, a vehicle
[2:50:46] that's at least 17 feet long today,
[2:50:49] that 17 foot long car vehicle backs out into the next,
[2:50:54] if they go any further, they're out on the road.
[2:50:56] And we try to discourage that
[2:50:58] and the construction of homes with sight line
[2:51:04] clearances that this town
[2:51:07] stipulates would certainly
[2:51:11] render this addition not appropriate.
[2:51:16] But the garage doors come out on the side
[2:51:18] and they back, they would back up across the front
[2:51:21] of the right hand unit.
[2:51:23] And you can see that there's a hammerhead for them
[2:51:25] to proceed safely out of the driveway onto the road.
[2:51:31] But, you know, my my thoughts on this are still
[2:51:36] that were at 17 feet for
[2:51:40] clearance and you know, we don't like to see that in a,
[2:51:45] in a tight neighborhood, let alone on a busy road.
[2:51:50] That's my position on it, not yours.
[2:51:52] But I was trying to add clarity to
[2:51:54] what you were getting at Mr.
[2:51:55] Trip by yield.
[2:51:57] And I would just bring up that, you know,
[2:51:59] we're talking about the garage portion
[2:52:01] and the hardship of having
[2:52:05] or needing a two car garage.
[2:52:08] Is, is, is that more of a hardship or just a want
[2:52:14] and you know, yes.
[2:52:15] We don't have the opportunity to move off to the right,
[2:52:18] I mean, sorry, the left of the, the structure
[2:52:20] because they, everybody did the septic,
[2:52:24] but if they knew this was a project they wanted to do,
[2:52:26] they may have waited
[2:52:29] and figured out the appropriate spot for the septic.
[2:52:32] I don't know if it could have been moved
[2:52:33] or not. I'm just saying
[2:52:35] I did ask that with the septic company
[2:52:37] and that's, that's where it needed to be.
[2:52:38] Excuse me. We're
[2:52:39] Deliberation.
[2:52:40] Deliberation. Sorry. Oh, I'm
[2:52:41] Sorry guys.
[2:52:42] No, I'm sorry. You were led down the bad road.
[2:52:50] Yeah. Your, the test pit date
[2:52:53] or whatever may have said, well this is,
[2:52:55] this needs to remain there.
[2:52:57] I just can't, I don't know enough to say, well there's a,
[2:53:01] a different configuration that could occur and I think Mr.
[2:53:04] Dani's starting to touch on that
[2:53:07] to bring us back into more compliance.
[2:53:11] You know, we've had a similar case, I think last year
[2:53:15] where someone, a couple needed to build a garage
[2:53:19] and they were similarly on as,
[2:53:24] as close or a little closer to a less busy road
[2:53:27] and we asked them to go back and reconfigure it
[2:53:30] and bring it back to us
[2:53:31] and the, the board was able to find a happy
[2:53:36] medium with that.
[2:53:39] I'm inclined to want to go in that direction here,
[2:53:42] but I'm not saying that everybody else has to either.
[2:53:47] Mr. Trip, did you have anything else?
[2:53:49] I think we jumped off of your point. I'm done. Okay.
[2:53:54] Mrs. Moore, you all set?
[2:53:55] No, I have just a couple thoughts 'cause Mr.
[2:53:58] Dietzel brought up a great point about the sun
[2:54:02] and then I'm unsure if for therapy, like
[2:54:06] what equipment they're bringing in are the
[2:54:10] 'cause where we wanna shorten it.
[2:54:11] The doors coming out.
[2:54:13] I, I don't know, I just have concerns with shortening it too
[2:54:17] because their purpose of having that extra room
[2:54:22] for their son, I don't wanna take that away.
[2:54:30] I don't, do they need the extra room
[2:54:32] to help him in a car? I guess
[2:54:35] Yeah, but that's reconfiguring a stairwell
[2:54:37] that could be direction in any other direction.
[2:54:41] No, but also too, like, I don't know what they bring in
[2:54:45] and out for therapy and just
[2:54:53] in, and I couldn't imagine asking them
[2:54:56] to move it to detached.
[2:54:58] Especially if they wanna use it for a special needs sun.
[2:55:03] I know I would as a parent would wanna be able to hear,
[2:55:09] So.
[2:55:10] Okay. Are you all set? I am.
[2:55:19] Alright,
[2:55:22] Let's see.
[2:55:25] Do we wanna come outta deliberation at this point?
[2:55:31] Is everybody ready to come outta deliberation?
[2:55:33] I'll make a motion to come outta deliberation.
[2:55:36] Mr. Trip, are you all set to come out? Sure.
[2:55:41] You wanna give that? Second?
[2:55:43] Second It. Okay.
[2:55:44] All in favor of coming outta deliberation. Say aye. Aye.
[2:55:47] Aye. And you opposed?
[2:55:50] All right, Ms. Zamore, you have a motion to read. I,
[2:55:56] Sorry.
[2:55:59] I make a motion on case number 26 dash 20
[2:56:04] to grant a variance to the terms of article six, section
[2:56:10] 1 65 dash 48 B four of the town
[2:56:15] of der zoning ordinance to allow the construction
[2:56:19] of a residential addition with attached garage with within
[2:56:24] 17.7 feet of the front property line where
[2:56:28] 35 feet is required.
[2:56:30] Parcel ID 0 7 0 4 9
[2:56:35] zoned LDR as presented with the following conditions.
[2:56:39] We have one, one subject to obtaining Allstate
[2:56:43] and town permits and inspections.
[2:56:45] And that concludes the reading of the motion.
[2:56:47] I need a second.
[2:56:49] I'll second Mr. Dug.
[2:56:51] Any seconds the motion puts that on the floor.
[2:57:01] Let's get into finding a fact.
[2:57:07] Did you wanna address a question or we
[2:57:09] No, I was, I was thinking That's
[2:57:12] Okay.
[2:57:15] Finding a fact.
[2:57:17] The applicant desires to build into the front setbacks
[2:57:22] required setbacks are 35 feet in front.
[2:57:25] The application is in the low density residential district
[2:57:29] parcel is six plus acres.
[2:57:32] The current structure is a non-conforming two family
[2:57:35] townhouse style home.
[2:57:38] Are there any other points in the finding of fact
[2:57:40] that anybody would like to add to it?
[2:57:45] No. Okay. To the depictions of the application.
[2:57:51] First is the public interest. The board finds Mr.
[2:57:57] Dietzel you wanna
[2:57:58] start public interest?
[2:58:03] I I think it's in the public interest
[2:58:05] because it, it, it,
[2:58:08] well it isn't contrary to the public interest.
[2:58:10] I think it, it it's remote enough that it really,
[2:58:13] it doesn't have an effect on
[2:58:15] the, the area.
[2:58:21] Okay. Mr. Dug,
[2:58:26] I don't have a problem with the public interest.
[2:58:28] Okay. You see it favorable in that way? Yes.
[2:58:33] Or not, it's not repeating. Correct? Correct. Okay.
[2:58:38] Ms. Moore,
[2:58:39] That was my original concern.
[2:58:41] But knowing that the doors are gonna be
[2:58:44] on the other side, that
[2:58:47] Fixes that safety concern?
[2:58:49] Yes. Okay. Mr. Tripp?
[2:58:52] I don't find it negative to the public interest.
[2:58:56] Okay,
[2:59:00] Mr. Chair?
[2:59:02] Yes sir. Would you like me to make a motion
[2:59:04] to extend for 15 minutes?
[2:59:06] Yes, I would. Thank you. So move.
[2:59:09] Okay, second. All in favor of extension, say aye.
[2:59:14] Aye. Opposed? Okay.
[2:59:22] The chair
[2:59:27] could slide on the public interest for the same reasons
[2:59:31] that have been described,
[2:59:36] not contrary to the public interest.
[2:59:40] So under the spirit of the ordinance, Mr. Dietzel,
[2:59:43] The spirit of the ordinance is observed.
[2:59:45] The ordinance is to keep the, the rural nature
[2:59:50] and this, this is with that conducive, it's a,
[2:59:56] Okay, Mr.
[2:59:58] Dani. Tired.
[3:00:01] I would concur with Mr. Dietzel.
[3:00:03] I'm sorry. Again, I Would concur with Mr. Dietzel.
[3:00:06] Okay. Okay. Mr. Mrs. Moore,
[3:00:11] Can you come back to me in a second?
[3:00:13] Okay. Mr. Tripp spear of the ordinance,
[3:00:17] you feel it's met here or contained or not?
[3:00:25] Yeah.
[3:00:31] Yes, I believe the spear of the ordinance is met.
[3:00:34] Okay. The, the chair would not agree with that.
[3:00:38] I am not in agreement on the spear of the ordinance
[3:00:45] as it is the, the consistency along the road,
[3:00:50] I think and holding all the other
[3:00:55] parcels to that.
[3:00:56] I think this drastically drifts away from it
[3:01:01] for reasons I'm not confident.
[3:01:05] Are the, are the best submissions
[3:01:08] or approaches for this parcel, Mrs. Morin?
[3:01:12] So that's what I was trying to look up
[3:01:16] for frontage.
[3:01:17] The spirit of the ordinance says that it's basically
[3:01:22] to ensure there's room for a safe driveway placement,
[3:01:25] emergency vehicles,
[3:01:27] and if the lot was big enough to subdivide
[3:01:30] to ensure there's more placement for a driveway.
[3:01:34] And I feel they have the adequate space
[3:01:38] between it being a duplex for the emergency vehicles
[3:01:42] and being able to be a driveway as well,
[3:01:44] seeing he owns both properties
[3:01:47] and he just makes it so he can't subdivide. So,
[3:01:51] Okay.
[3:01:52] So you're a yes on the spear of the ordinance? Yes. Okay.
[3:01:56] Substantial justice. Mr. Dietzel,
[3:01:59] I see minimum negative impact to the public,
[3:02:03] but a benefit to the applicant
[3:02:06] that would outweigh any, any negatives.
[3:02:08] Okay. So yes.
[3:02:11] All right, Mr. Dani.
[3:02:16] Gimme another second. Sorry. Okay. Ms. Ms. Moore,
[3:02:22] I do think substantial justice is being done due
[3:02:25] to their special condition that they have as a family unit.
[3:02:29] Okay, Mr. Dani, you ready?
[3:02:33] Yeah, I would say I would not agree with
[3:02:37] some justice being done due to the fact that it's
[3:02:44] encroaching onto the, the,
[3:02:49] the front line there, the 35 feet.
[3:02:52] Okay. Mr.
[3:02:55] Miss, who did I miss me? Oh, myself.
[3:02:59] No, I, I didn't ask you. No, you didn't. Oh. Alright.
[3:03:03] Go ahead Mr. Tripp.
[3:03:05] I would say substantial justice is being done.
[3:03:09] The, I said the, the,
[3:03:13] the whole situation here is
[3:03:18] the preexisting conditions limit.
[3:03:23] What you can do with the addition, admittedly the,
[3:03:30] is probably a little wide,
[3:03:31] but by having the entrance
[3:03:36] and exit on the side, that eliminates the
[3:03:43] somewhat the requirement for the 35 foot setback.
[3:03:47] Okay. Mr. Moore, did you answer this already?
[3:03:51] I did, I said because of their unique family situation,
[3:03:55] I feel that substantial justice is done.
[3:03:58] Okay. And I, I would say
[3:04:01] that substantial justice is fair here
[3:04:06] in their, in their request.
[3:04:09] The next one is, values
[3:04:14] of surrounding properties are not diminished. Mr. Dietzel,
[3:04:18] I I don't see that there would be any effect whatsoever.
[3:04:20] It's neutral.
[3:04:22] Okay. Mr. Dani? I would agree with that.
[3:04:25] Okay. Mrs. Warren?
[3:04:29] I agree with that, but also I,
[3:04:31] I looked up the square footage
[3:04:33] and there half
[3:04:35] of the duplex would be a thousand square feet,
[3:04:37] which is sub a lot lower than most
[3:04:40] houses on Island Pond Road.
[3:04:42] So I feel it could help.
[3:04:44] Okay. You feel it would elevate property values?
[3:04:47] It wouldn't diminish. Okay.
[3:04:49] All right. I don't see this
[3:04:53] as being a Dimi Dimi diminuation of property values myself.
[3:05:00] Now the hardship, literal enforcement creates an
[3:05:03] unnecessary hardship.
[3:05:06] That's section A. Mr. Dietzel.
[3:05:11] The applicant's explained
[3:05:13] to my satisfaction the special conditions
[3:05:15] of the property which make literal in literal enforcement
[3:05:18] of the ordinance causing a, a,
[3:05:23] a unnecessary hardship due to their inability
[3:05:28] to expand to accommodate their special needs child.
[3:05:32] Okay, Mr. Dietzel? That was
[3:05:36] Me, Mr. Dani.
[3:05:37] I'm sorry Mr. Dani. It's getting late.
[3:05:39] Gotcha. I'm tired too.
[3:05:42] I would say that it does not support
[3:05:47] on my opinion due to the fact that it's the garage portion
[3:05:50] and not the living spaces that we're dealing with.
[3:05:54] Okay. Mrs. Moore?
[3:05:57] I do feel that it meets the hardship
[3:05:59] because of the upstairs living space.
[3:06:03] It doesn't, if it's one
[3:06:04] or two levels isn't gonna change anything.
[3:06:07] I feel because of also it being a duplex,
[3:06:10] they're really stuck to that one location.
[3:06:13] Okay. Mr. Tripp? I agree with Ms. Ms. Lauren.
[3:06:17] Okay. The chair will
[3:06:21] defer on the, or on the unnecessary hardship.
[3:06:30] I believe there's not unnecessary hardship on this
[3:06:33] as I think the structure could be reconfigured
[3:06:37] and taken back from the road edge.
[3:06:41] I think that we do not need to go into section B
[3:06:46] of the hardship, so
[3:06:48] therefore we can mo come back out of finding a fact
[3:06:51] unless there's somebody that has an objection to that
[3:06:55] seeing no gestures there.
[3:06:58] All in favor of moving this for a vote? Say aye. Aye. Aye.
[3:07:01] Aye. Any opposed? Mrs. Mor? What? Say you.
[3:07:06] Aye vote Yes. Mr. Dietzel? Yes. Mr. Trip? Yes.
[3:07:11] Mr. Dani? No.
[3:07:14] And the chair will vote no
[3:07:15] for reasons described in the findings of fact.
[3:07:19] Gentlemen, congratulations.
[3:07:21] You have been approved by a vote of three to two.
[3:07:23] Anybody agree by this decision as 30 days to ask this board
[3:07:26] for reconsideration afterwards?
[3:07:29] Recourse to be superior court. Okay. Thank you.
[3:07:31] Thank you for your time. Goodnight. You're welcome.
[3:07:33] Current's license. Alright, we,
[3:07:38] we are going to have to conclude our meeting.
[3:07:41] Prime storage. And Mr. Benson, I am sorry
[3:07:45] that we're, we would not, even if we tried
[3:07:48] to bite into this, we wouldn't do them justice.
[3:07:52] So we will see you back at the next meeting in August.
[3:07:56] Who is the 20? Who is Prime Storage? Is that you? Okay.
[3:08:00] Do we have any other cases? We have one new application.
[3:08:03] One application. Correct.
[3:08:06] Mean we, we can reasonably
[3:08:09] we'll discuss this agenda I guess,
[3:08:11] but I have no problem with continuing where we're at
[3:08:14] and letting the other individuals fall in
[3:08:16] afterwards that we've tabled.
[3:08:18] Sure. I think that works for me.
[3:08:20] They, they may not have resolution by then,
[3:08:22] but hopefully they do and we can continue
[3:08:25] to clear the docket.
[3:08:26] So we'll table all in favor
[3:08:30] of tabling case number 26 dash 1 21
[3:08:33] and case number 26 dash 1 22 to the next scheduled meeting.
[3:08:37] Say aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Any opposed? Very good. Thank you.
[3:08:41] Sorry gentlemen. And I
[3:08:42] Seconded it.
[3:08:43] Who seconded me. You did Very good. Ms. Mor seconded it.
[3:08:47] I saw you nod your head. I think I made the motion. So
[3:08:50] Eight 20.
[3:08:53] All right. This possibly happen again.
[3:08:59] I think we just cleared that up. Okay. Okay.
[3:09:03] We have a back load of minutes. We have an email from Mr.
[3:09:08] Corbett who's absent that he's has no objection
[3:09:12] to us approving these minutes.
[3:09:16] Mr. Donlin, would you sit
[3:09:19] for the approval of minutes please?
[3:09:21] Yes, sir. All right. So I need a motion
[3:09:23] to approve the minutes for fi.
[3:09:26] May 7th, 2026 as amended. So moved. Thank you.
[3:09:31] A second Mr. Donlin. Second. Thank you.
[3:09:34] All in favor of that say aye. Aye. Aye. We have motion.
[3:09:39] I need a motion to approve the minutes
[3:09:42] for May 21st, 2026 as amended.
[3:09:45] So moved. Mr. Dietzel, is that you? Yes. Yeah. Mr.
[3:09:49] Dani, you wanna help out? I'll second it. Thank you.
[3:09:53] All in favor of that say aye. Aye. Aye. Any opposed?
[3:09:56] I abstain. You. Abstain. Okay.
[3:10:00] Was it you were out six, four or five? Four.
[3:10:02] That's my birthday. Oh, six four was no May 21st.
[3:10:07] That was his grandson's graduation. That's right. Right.
[3:10:12] Approval of the minutes as amended for six four. 26.
[3:10:18] So moved. Mr. Donlin second. All in favor say aye.
[3:10:23] Aye. A. Any, any opposed Mr. Des?
[3:10:32] Approval of minutes as amended.
[3:10:34] Do you have any amendments on six 18? No.
[3:10:39] So moved. What's that? So moved. So moved.
[3:10:43] Well as presented I guess six 18 as presented. So moved.
[3:10:47] Thank you Mr. Dietzel. Mrs. Morin.
[3:10:50] I'll second it. Thank you. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Aye.
[3:10:54] Any opposed? A aye.
[3:10:57] Can I make a motion to adjourn?
[3:11:00] Is there any other business? There is not.
[3:11:04] Yes, you may Mrs. Mor make that motion.
[3:11:06] I make a motion to adjourn. Second.
[3:11:08] Second Before we go.
[3:11:11] It's blueberry season so all of you should get out
[3:11:14] and pick your blueberries. I already have.
[3:11:17] I transplanted my plant so I got none this year.
[3:11:20] No blueberries, textures, groups.
[3:11:22] All in favor of adjournment, say aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.
[3:11:25] Any your post. Have a good night everybody.