[0:00] We are now streaming.
[0:05] » Call the September 8th meeting of the
board of supervisors. Would you please
[0:08] rise and pledge the flag with us?
>> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
[0:15] United States of America and to the
republic for which it stands, one nation
[0:20] under God, indivisible, with liberty and
justice for all.
[0:28] » Thank you. The board did meet prior to
tonight's meeting to discuss personnel
[0:32] and litigation matters.
Um,
[0:39] is there a motion to approve or amend
the agenda?
[0:43] » Make a motion to approve the agenda.
>> Second.
[0:48] All in favor signifi I. I.
[0:58] The board did meet also met for an
advertised public intermunicipal meeting
[1:03] with the sewer authority in August 24th,
2026. Draft minutes were taken by the
[1:07] sewer authority and will be presented
before their board for approval on
[1:11] September 28th and will be posted after
the October Board of Supervisors
[1:15] meeting.
[1:21] Okay. Is there a motion to approve or
amend the minutes of the August 11th,
[1:27] 2026 meeting?
>> Make a motion to approve those minutes.
[1:32] I have it
and under special requests
[1:38] word should be polls.
>> Uh where's that at Dean?
[1:43] » Under special requests
sentencing I believe in parentheses it
[1:48] says to drive. Oh, good catch.
>> Okay.
[1:56] » So, it's your motion to
include that correction.
[2:03] » I second that.
>> Okay. You have a motion and second to
[2:06] amend the minutes of the August 11th
meeting. All those in favor of the
[2:10] amendment say no. I I
>> public comments at this time. Are there
[2:16] any?
>> Yes, sir.
[2:23] 12:15
[2:27] » the other one
[2:35] being shut down right now the amount of
traffic on extended is
[2:43] that's not a problem but the problem is
is the speed allows you to be over the
[2:49] come around the corner down below there
and they just hammer up the hill. I
[2:54] don't know how it is down
real fast but what they fly
[3:08] doesn't really have to watch anymore.
[3:14] It's it's ridiculous.
>> Yeah. when they get to the bottom corner
[3:18] slide out.
>> We will bring it up closely.
[3:23] » Thank you.
>> Any other comments?
[3:27] » Yes, sir.
>> Question.
[3:29] » Yes.
[3:39] real
[3:52] as well, but I'm just going to bring
a copy of this orbit for the
[4:03] feel of
that's important.
[4:09] That is correct.
[4:22] » Uh that would be my fault, but it was at
the front counter and the the law uh
[4:27] basically says that we have to have it
at the front counter. That was an
[4:30] oversight on my part to put it on the
website which is just a something that
[4:35] we do as a friendly community thing.
Yes. Very. Yes.
[4:45] » Um we put in the past we we've put big
ticket things uh on there like uh the
[4:52] data center stuff the overlay.
>> Um but prior to that no we have not.
[4:59] Well, that's
[5:03] » Well, but I we wanted to do that going
forward and since I wasn't used to doing
[5:08] it, I missed it. So, that is my fault. I
should have put it up there.
[5:12] » So, there's one out there.
>> Here, I'll give up mine right now.
[5:16] » I have one.
>> Thank you.
[5:19] » No, it's a cop. It's It's a copy sitting
and [clears throat] then we make a copy
[5:22] for people.
>> Okay.
[5:23] » Yeah.
>> Would you like one right now, sir?
[5:27] a copy of the
[5:34] » Thank you for your comment. Any other
comments?
[5:37] » Okay, we'll move on with the agenda.
Special request
[5:42] 5.1, the tax collector requests for an
exoneration for 190 Manchester Street in
[5:49] the amount of $58.54
for the reason of the property split per
[5:54] your county tax assessment.
I'd like to make a motion that we honor
[5:58] that exoneration for $58.54.
>> I'll second that.
[6:03] » Okay, we have a motion and a second. Is
there any discussion? And as for 190
[6:07] Manchester Street, Manchester, PA for
the vote. All in favor of the motion
[6:12] signify by saying I. I.
>> Motion carries. Westshore Wildlife C
[6:17] Center is requesting the township to
become a 27 municipal wildlife services
[6:21] partner through annual allocation of
$1,741.
[6:26] Is there anyone here from the Westshore
Wildlife Center?
[6:31] » It does say and I don't think there is,
but it says in their letter that if we
[6:34] want somebody to come, they will. So, if
you'd like to have someone come to a
[6:40] future meeting, I can reach out. Um,
that's up to you. I did. This got
[6:45] brought up at the last manager meeting
and it appears that only one
[6:51] municipality
actually donated or you know did what
[6:55] they requested. Um everybody else was
like uh we don't know what we're going
[7:00] to do yet. You know it seemed very up in
the air. I am going to let you know that
[7:05] in 2024
we did donate to them because they're
[7:09] local. Well, they're not in our
township, but they're the local uh
[7:14] wildlife uh center. They're in do. But
you guys donated pretty much $350.
[7:23] Um and then you didn't do it in 25.
Uh and I'm not sure why that was.
[7:30] » The the burning question I have is what
can they do for us that we don't already
[7:34] provide with our animal control officer
SPCA? Well, it appears this is for
[7:38] wildlife, whereas [clears throat] the
animal control officer is for dogs and
[7:42] then the shelter in contract with the
SPCI is also for dogs.
[7:47] » So then this would entail a skunk in
your window well or a raccoon that's
[7:52] rabbit or something,
>> right?
[7:55] » What's the board's wishes?
[8:02] » [clears throat]
>> I'd be willing to contribute because it
[8:04] could help some of our residents given
the rural nature part of the township. I
[8:09] don't have a problem with doing 350 like
we did in 2024.
[8:15] Then we put in some line items for
donations and contributions. I'm
[8:21] wondering if uh 350 would do it because
they're asking for 1741.
[8:26] » Okay. and uh that's uh to be a partner
through the annual allocation. So um
[8:34] » correct in that
>> in so in that line item for
[8:38] contributions
you have you all lot $6,500 for 2026.
[8:45] You usually give the Lions Club for the
Halloween parade $5,000. You already
[8:51] distribute it uh 500 for the viron. So
that'll leave you uh with just a
[8:58] thousand on what you want to do. And the
only other things that's on that list is
[9:02] your county rail trail authority which
you already said you weren't going to
[9:06] donate to this year. So um it's up to
you guys. So you'll have $1,000 in that
[9:11] line item.
understand what they ask for, but you
[9:17] know there is no obligation that
some of our residents
[9:23] might need their service.
[9:28] If you wish to make a motion,
>> I'll make a motion that we
[9:33] $350 towards the west.
[9:42] » So,
my question would be how do they differ
[9:48] from the Pennsylvania game commission
other than it's hard to get commission
[9:51] to come out and do some of these things?
[9:56] » That's really described in the
letter start and uh have we have we
[10:02] needed those services in [clears throat]
the past? I don't remember.
[10:06] » When someone calls us for things like
this, um we give them like Mike Ellis's
[10:12] number. Um whatever we find on Google.
Yeah. The state game commission
[10:16] sometimes. Um and and we really don't
otherwise we don't get very many calls
[10:23] » for this. No.
>> Okay.
[10:25] » More dead.
>> Yeah. have more dead animals if
[10:28] anything.
>> Okay,
[10:32] we'll move on. That takes us down to the
emergency services report chief.
[10:42] [clears throat]
[10:47] » I don't think so.
[10:52] » And then you have to talk directly into
it. Just so you know, you might have to
[10:56] rotate it if you want to face this one.
>> There you go.
[10:59] » There you go, buddy.
[11:03] [laughter]
[11:06] » She was playing with [laughter]
[11:11] » Good evening. Uh, you should have the
fire chief report in there for the month
[11:17] of July
total. So, 42 calls
[11:23] total. 42 calls, 96.
Um,
[11:29] we did one later
[11:33] from the ladder had a fire
[11:39] to the hospital.
Uh, I don't have anything else to add
[11:44] other than the fire department into
their fall season, which means we're
[11:50] busy fire prevention.
our whole community.
[12:02] I'd be glad to answer any questions you
might have.
[12:05] » No, your report I don't have any
questions. Your report was very
[12:08] thorough. Uh just one you got a report
from Eagle Fire Company.
[12:13] » I did. Well, uh it was sent out late
last
[12:20] year.
[12:24] I have my reported
usually around
[12:32] I know
state that's kind of close for her. So
[12:38] » thank you.
>> I do have one question. How do you like
[12:40] the new format of the system you're
using?
[12:43] » Uh we're still getting used to a couple
things. Still tweaking a couple things,
[12:47] but it's a lot.
>> Yeah, pretty decent. very
[12:50] » I think the data that it's
gonna be better.
[12:54] » Yeah.
>> Um I just I just want to add um that I
[12:59] did write Eagle um today that I did
forward their email um and report to you
[13:07] guys. I did that first thing this
morning. I emailed it to you, but I did
[13:12] remind them when that due uh date and
and time frame is um and to get it to
[13:18] Chief Stevens sooner because he combines
all the emergency service reports. And
[13:23] then additionally, I reminded them that
we never got their June report for
[13:28] August because they're what, two months,
we give the fire departments two months
[13:33] leeway. Yeah. Um, so, uh, just so you're
aware, we don't have June's reports
[13:40] still.
>> Is there anyone here for you?
[13:43] Okay.
>> I just wanted to highlight that, uh,
[13:47] beyond uh, in addition to fighting fires
within the township and the burrows. Uh,
[13:53] his July report for adjusted meetings
and inspections that he goes to is
[13:57] pretty impressive. Uh, the Knox box of
checkers was inspected. reinspection of
[14:03] the automation department drive review
plans for motor tech
[14:08] uh came to our meeting county fire
chiefs associated meeting the photo
[14:11] conference for the gates at 1035 Memphis
Point Road the joint fire board meeting
[14:17] safety inspection of leg up farms
meeting the DHL safety committee walkth
[14:20] through for 84 signs road so chief thank
you for your your service to our
[14:25] township it's you have a busy busy
months
[14:29] » I I wouldn't be able to do it without
the
[14:32] Yeah. Well, don't say it too loud
because his head will get
[14:35] » I know.
[14:38] » Won't be able to fit the helmet.
>> Thank you.
[14:42] » Thank you.
>> Um, Deputy Chief Risha, I see you're
[14:48] here. Do you have any report for your
county regional?
[14:52] I think you took a note about Canal
Road.
[14:54] » I did. Write that down. Um, that report
actually
[15:01] vacation.
[15:07] » Any questions from anyone in the
audience?
[15:11] » They made a note of the speeding.
>> I did.
[15:14] » Thank you.
[15:23] » Wasn't me, was it?
>> Oh my gosh.
[15:28] » Wasn't me.
You're not stopping. I came out and put
[15:34] it away so I could be here. And I come
around the corner, I see a car coming.
[15:38] So I go out the street because he's
going to stop. He didn't stop. So he
[15:43] does one of these around
[15:55] point. I mean the times I go through
most of the folks seem to be stopping.
[16:02] » But then
[16:10] you're sitting there and watching and
you can't do
[16:18] » Can you do anything with cameras? I mean
they have stoplight cameras but I guess
[16:21] not stop sign cameras.
>> Not allowed to do that. put a flock.
[16:26] » So you have to physically
flocks for traffic. Um but I mean you
[16:32] physically have to see someone blow
through the stop sign. You can't use
[16:37] » until someone changes the legislation.
>> But you took them.
[16:41] » Yes.
>> Okay. Thank you. Chief
[16:44] » and they're coming just as fast. I'm on
the other side. They're coming just as
[16:47] fast down that way, too.
>> There's a nice corn field that you can
[16:51] park.
[17:02] on right there.
>> It's a big barn there on the corner.
[17:15] » I seen you tonight standing there when I
came over at 4:30, so I made sure I
[17:20] stopped.
>> Okay. Uh Christie, anything in your
[17:23] county emergency management agency?
[clears throat]
[17:26] » I did not get a report. Um but uh I know
that Mike is working very hard um
[17:33] because he'll be here sometimes uh you
know into the night and things working
[17:38] on our plans just to be ready for the
tmi reopening. Um and he'll fill me in
[17:45] every once in a while. Uh but otherwise,
yep, he's just working on that. um so
[17:49] that he can start doing tabletops and
getting people together to start
[17:54] practicing.
>> Okay,
[17:58] » any questions on the services?
>> Okay, that moves us down to a reszoning
[18:07] request has been filed by Kinley
Properties regarding 4390 board,
[18:12] Manchester Muscle Farm and uh
representatives for those It's all
[18:19] yours.
[18:23] » Good evening. Stage here on Enterprises
[18:31] Enterprises as well as representatives
from the
[18:36] family. Um, last time we saw you was
probably [snorts] May.
[18:42] We've been formally submitted since that
time. had the request reviewed by
[18:49] commission as well as the township
planning commission and we're here this
[18:54] evening to ask the board to consider
scheding public hearing on the request.
[19:00] So um what we have done obviously when
we were meeting with the board I believe
[19:06] in April and May we discussed um looking
at studying here that would retain a
[19:12] portion of the track for R1 res
[19:20] and a portion of the track for AO. So so
that is what we've done with this
[19:25] submission. Um so generally what we have
is we genally from that drainage ditch
[19:31] that enters through the property for
that industrial zoning district
[19:36] boundary.
There is a small portion of industrial
[19:42] zone that goes out to some view road
that is not intended for any sort of
[19:47] access. As we've discussed all along,
any industrial access would be internal
[19:52] through Bartlett Drive, not up to Z
road. It's solely for purposes of being
[19:58] able to subdivide along future zoning
district boundaries and to be able to
[20:04] have the required lot width and road age
for that um future parcel of land. Then
[20:12] um the R1 zoning would um again match up
with the R1 zoning that is on the north
[20:20] side of Science View Road as well as
kind of being adjacent to the existing
[20:26] R2 lot. So you may recall that the
monster farm property includes with a
[20:32] small 4 and a half acre lot of land that
is zone R2. Um that is yeah right in
[20:40] that area there that is kind of uh
adjacent to existing um single family
[20:47] detach along road that the zoning of
that parcel is not changing and it would
[20:55] proposed um continued R1 zoning district
and then we would take the um A1 zone
[21:05] that is exist sorry AO zone that is the
church property extend that existing AO
[21:13] um zone into um church property. So I
say church property enterprises has
[21:20] actually acquired that parcel of land.
It is an L-shaped parcel of land that is
[21:27] um that purple
extends up along this where you see the
[21:33] cursor there. So the piece that extends
kind of
[21:37] East West is zone R1. The portion of it
that extends north south is zone AO
[21:43] currently. So we would take the AO kind
of into the site to mirror that existing
[21:50] AO and usually run along also the back
of the church, but we would not run the
[21:55] AO behind where you had existing single
family detached homes. So we repeat that
[22:01] R1 to match up the um proposed single
family detached homes with those single
[22:08] family detach homes. And ultimately um
what this results with is approximately
[22:16] 35 and a half acres industrial a little
over 31 acres of AO and 22 acres of R1
[22:25] as well as um of course retaining the 4
and 12 acres of R2 that is already
[22:32] existing. Um, we felt this was an
appropriate combination that gives you
[22:38] the make sure that we talked about the
transition zone of AO up next to the
[22:44] industrial as well as that north water
property which is directly to the south.
[22:49] Um, and the church property which is of
course to the east continues the R1 zone
[22:55] to the south side road which is
something we heard from the board if you
[22:59] would desire to succeed but also puts
that industrial district up in the
[23:04] corner where you really are right in
between those two existing industrial
[23:09] facilities.
>> Um so I'll pause there I guess to see if
[23:14] there are comments um there from board
or the board um has specific questions.
[23:21] » Did you solidify right away for to go
into the industrial department?
[23:29] So the my understanding would actually
be onto the south side there.
[23:36] » So that would be your only
entrance egress into that.
[23:43] [clears throat]
>> It would be like a shared access drive
[23:47] and Kinsley owns this property here.
Okay.
[23:50] » Yep.
>> So the main question is there will be
[23:52] zero trucks coming into Ford Road or to
Mount S.
[23:58] That's correct. And um the um kind of
the schematics, the sketches that I know
[24:06] Mike and his team have been playing
with, there is absolutely no connection
[24:11] between the industrial development and
the residential development,
[24:16] » right? But those trucks will still come
up signs road once gets connected out
[24:21] the signs.
>> Yeah, they'll come up and turn right
[24:25] into the industrial complex.
And they still have the right to go
[24:29] straight forward and go to George
Street, too.
[24:31] » Yeah. They'll be able to go out George
because that's a truck route. They just
[24:36] can't use road.
Okay.
[24:42] That will impact
truck traffic on George Street somewhat.
[24:51] And is there any concern of the share
access that industrial property
[25:01] » the share of the access
[25:05] to the south?
>> Yes. Understand that it's properties on
[25:09] both sides. It's not a problem to
>> we don't concern that. It would just be
[25:14] a waiver uh in the land development
stage to you guys.
[25:19] » And from an emergency standpoint, Chief,
any issues?
[25:23] » Honestly, Bo, go ahead, Chief. But I was
thinking the
[25:31] this would be the emergency access.
>> No, I understand. I mean,
[25:36] it's the only way in, but that's usually
you only have one way into a place. The
[25:39] issue is whether you can get around the
building, right?
[25:43] at least two access points
and
[25:49] » but you can't get that because the only
place you would have road treatment
[25:53] zones for emergency
right because you can't that other
[25:58] property that goes up to Bart belongs to
some other individual who would not give
[26:04] you
>> that's the current you know that's the
[26:07] current situation obviously we're we're
not the main development yet so that's
[26:12] whole process where we can continue to
explore what might be needed from an
[26:17] emergency services standpoint.
>> So you haven't approached the owner of
[26:21] that property.
>> There has been a prior approach to the
[26:24] owner of that property, but you know
that's a prior approach.
[26:29] » Okay.
[26:39] » Any staff questions?
I don't have any questions
[26:46] » members
[26:49] commission approved this request.
>> Our planning commission of York County
[26:57] [clears throat]
that's one that I have trouble signing.
[27:01] » So if I if I can I can kind of maybe you
through um the three points from your
[27:08] county planning commission that they had
in their
[27:11] you obviously saw it, but um and then we
did discuss those points. Obviously,
[27:17] please use the township planning
commission when we were in front of them
[27:20] as well. Um so, county really had three
points that they made in their letter.
[27:26] Um one is that this isn't fully
consistent with your future land use
[27:30] map. I think we all know that. Um we did
have discussions of that with the
[27:35] township planning commission. I think it
was just an acknowledgement that um we
[27:40] has changed since that map was adopted
and that this would be generally
[27:46] consistent with other um objectives in
your comprehensive plan. Um they
[27:53] mentioned the fact that it's an security
area. I mean I know that this board
[27:57] knows that doesn't stop a resial or
development of the property. In fact the
[28:02] gross farm on the north side is design
is also an area. So that was just
[28:08] something I think that your county
mentioned just as a factor or something
[28:13] for awareness. And then your county
planning commission was concerned that
[28:19] the reszoning follow identifiable parcel
boundaries. And we talked with your
[28:25] planning commission about that as well
that should the property be resoneed,
[28:30] the intention is to then subdivide along
these partial boundaries so that you do
[28:36] end up with
um so many districts that do paralle
[28:49] road is to provide um your zone or is
necessary
[28:54] so that that can be subdivided into a
separate parcel and now you have a
[28:59] parcel that's own industrial and that
addresses that county planning
[29:04] commission comment. We can likewise
subdivide
[29:09] excuse me so that you have you know
basically your zoning district following
[29:14] separate parcels and that would happen
and you know if the board were to
[29:18] approve the reszoning um that's
something that then immediately would
[29:23] follow on that and that was one of I
think the one of the conditions that
[29:29] recommendation for approval is that
subdivision [clears throat]
[29:33] then would follow
[29:40] So with the industrial
make sure I understand is you extended
[29:46] that one because it follows the natural
boundary must come right
[29:51] » and then two it gives you enough road
frontage where you could off that
[29:58] particular piece of property and access
it from side to
[30:01] » no not access only your zoning ordinance
requires for a parcel to be a standalone
[30:07] parcel, then you need to have lot and
lot is defined as heavy.
[30:14] » So then it would be so [snorts] if you
put two buildings in there, you have
[30:18] more shared drive down.
>> Yeah, it's not large enough for I don't
[30:23] believe for two buildings, but yeah, the
idea is just that
[30:28] » Oh, sorry. Now I get it. My apologies.
You don't have to explain anymore. You
[30:33] can actually
Sorry.
[30:42] » Is there any estimated numbers for how
many apartments or how many individual
[30:48] homes would be put on that R1?
>> I mean, I know it could be three, but
[30:53] could it be up to 50 or 100?
>> The R1
[31:00] we're [clears throat] looking
Um I don't know about how many like 40
[31:06] » 34 homes in the R1. The um AO is really
limited. You have a 25% lot coverage in
[31:15] the AO. So we have it might build
[31:26] too many more because
[31:34] So the your hop zone has a number of
factors that while it may seem like a
[31:40] lot of acreage because of the factors in
your air will limit the density that you
[31:46] can have in that zoning district. So the
buildings themselves of course are
[31:50] limited in resource and height and 125
ft in length. So you can't do any of
[31:56] those really super big long apartment
buildings thing we talked about maybe
[32:01] planning commission talking about that
with that for example that large engine
[32:06] co multifamily building that I think is
a whole burrow you couldn't do something
[32:12] like that in your zoning district um the
other factor the really big limiting
[32:18] factor is your coverage which is 25%
so 25% coverage till you put buildings
[32:27] and parking and access drives um you're
limiting what is available for actual
[32:35] vertical construction
[32:38] » and would the R1 tie in design view and
board rate?
[32:43] » Yes. So the the R1 and the A1 would be
um our expectation it would be
[32:48] interconnected. So there would be an
access to size view and an access out to
[32:53] B road so that you could for the
residential component you would have two
[32:58] points of interest and address for the
residential um for the residents of the
[33:03] community for fire and emergency
services.
[33:06] » Thank you.
>> Sure.
[33:11] » Any other questions?
[33:15] » I do have a question. Um Stacey, did you
investigate the impact on the school
[33:20] district taxes with the apartment office
and R1?
[33:26] » So, um I would say we investigate the
impact on taxes. I will say that um and
[33:31] I think I mentioned this in the
application, we did take a look at just
[33:35] generally historical enrollment which
has um seen some growth in your school
[33:40] district but not nearly as much as some
of the other um school districts in the
[33:44] area. But additionally, um Kinsley has
some similar apartment projects as to
[33:51] what they would be doing here and really
looking at the apartment component of
[33:54] it. um similar projects with one to two
bedrooms. They have about 8% of those
[33:59] units actually have school age children.
So we we recognize that um yes we are
[34:06] looking at maybe about 35 single family
homes. That's really where school age
[34:11] children are primar primarily going to
reside very limited percentage of the
[34:16] apartments are anticipated they actually
have school age children. Does the
[34:20] school district count those though in
whatever equation they come up with? So
[34:25] regardless of that Okay.
>> Yeah. So the school district does
[34:28] comprehensive planning every few years
and they look at your um zoning and they
[34:35] have anticipated growth for the area
that they um you know look into and
[34:41] consider in their longrange.
[34:47] I'm going
>> the other thing and reading through you
[34:50] also mentioned about the amendment to
the comprehensive plan and also about
[34:56] housing needs in York County from York
County Planning Commission and I looked
[35:01] through that information and basically
they're saying we need more affordable
[35:06] housing
[35:09] not necessarily we need more investments
>> and and I would be I will say
[35:15] affordable. I I'm always cautious about
using that term because right um I I
[35:22] would say attainable housing a lot of
times. So attainable housing meaning
[35:27] housing that um young professionals or
young people can afford or that
[35:34] sometimes older people can afford or
maybe people who aren't living on um you
[35:41] know a a salary that can afford a 450
000,
[35:46] » right? Because the living wage in New
York is close to 20 bucks an hour,
[35:51] » right? And then when you read about
those things,
[35:55] it talks about like apartments being
within walking distance of a lot of
[35:59] services. And while I could see how you
probably tie that in to somewhat, you
[36:05] still got to cross George Street to get
to things and get down the giant if you
[36:09] want to like that walking community type
of deal. So I struggle with that a
[36:14] little bit too.
Again, where I struggle with the most is
[36:21] really industrial space.
[36:29] » Well, definitely on the um walkability.
I mean certainly um it puts any workers
[36:37] there in close proximity to a lot of
jobs. Um but I I do understand, you
[36:43] know, trying to get there. Maybe that's
something during the land development
[36:46] process we can look at um walking
corridors,
[36:50] » walking corridors, bus routes and and
things of that nature because I can
[36:55] certainly understand, you know, if you
go back to what
[36:58] county needs, not that this township
needs to solve that problem, you know,
[37:03] but you do point out that that's
something to be factored in and that's
[37:06] what really jumped out through that, I
guess. you know there spend a lot of my
[37:14] time used to anyway he's working up in
New York City you know the one guy lived
[37:18] on Staten Island so for him when I say
like oh in the car I got to go hear him
[37:23] yeah I do all that within walk distance
of my house
[37:28] » obvious
[37:30] Well, again [clears throat]
the best of all these different worlds
[37:38] here. It provides some of that
affordable housing. It keeps some of
[37:42] your R1 across the street from the R1,
but it also does bring in a small amount
[37:49] of additional industrial will offset any
um maybe burden um taxes that might come
[37:57] about. from the resoning to um
residential
[38:03] know that the invest will certainly
shoot out some some bas
[38:14] it's that kind of balloon mentality push
[38:20] so we know that if you build a bunch of
houses you know the factors were like
[38:24] 2.58 people in a household
planning information. So that suggests
[38:30] at least one child. So the school when
you look at that it said the school's
[38:35] enrollment over the past couple years is
slightly declined. But you build you
[38:39] know that out one half acre lots. I
think you said 40 homes and 30 acres if
[38:46] I got it right. So that would suggest,
you know, probably maybe over 100 homes,
[38:52] which could mean the school might have
to expand, but it depends on when they
[38:56] all show up. And then that additional
infrastructure certainly on solar
[39:02] authority going off of memory, for some
reason, I thought it had like 2500 EU
[39:08] left in it based on the report I was
looking at. And so one EDU is a
[39:12] household, 250 gallons. So ultimately
that puts some strain on the solar
[39:19] authority understanding of course the
developer would be developing all that
[39:23] but tying into that system ultimately
probably use up the majority use I think
[39:30] that's certainly a significant portion
and so that plays into it
[39:37] just kind of thinking through all the
issues
[39:43] I don't think I have
[39:48] Okay. Okay. I'm I'm I feel obligated to
ask. I think I know the answer, but is
[39:54] the Musers okay with this type of plan?
>> Sorry.
[39:58] » Um, are you guys okay with this type of
plan?
[40:02] » Are we okay with this plan? Absolutely.
>> Okay. I I knew that answer, but I I have
[40:07] to ask.
It's what we believe meets the
[40:11] township's needs and the families the
property will be sold.
[40:16] » So it's a matter of what can be done and
we respect the Kinsey family enough to
[40:24] make those decisions as well.
>> Okay. Thank you.
[40:29] I'd like to make a motion that we
authorize NPL Law Firm to advertise for
[40:33] a hearing to adopt the reszoning request
for the properties on 4390 Board Road,
[40:42] Manchester, PA. I'm going to read off
the partial numbers for you.
[40:47] » You got them. Okay,
>> the following partial numbers there uh
[40:51] for a hearing for the board of
supervisors meeting on October 13th.
[40:56] » I'll second that motion. We have a
motion and a second. Is there any
[41:00] further discussion?
All those in favor signify by saying I.
[41:06] » Motion carries. Thank you.
>> Thank you.
[41:14] » Andy, that takes us to your report.
[41:20] The first item on my report this evening
is ordinance 2026-5.
[41:26] Uh this is an ordinance that will repeal
the per capita tax in the township.
[41:32] This has been advertised for adoption
and
[41:40] I said
[41:46] action.
>> Okay. And that will go in effect on
[41:50] January.
>> Yes, that's that's correct.
[41:53] » For the year.7 would be effective
January 1.
[41:58] » Okay.
I make a motion that we approved
[42:01] ordinance 2026-5.
I'll second that. We have a motion to
[42:07] second discussion.
All in favor signify saying I. I. Motion
[42:12] carries.
[42:16] Yes.
>> Yes.
[42:19] I know you guys have decided to do this,
but
[42:23] I don't understand why.
>> I mean, it's nice to get a tax break,
[42:28] but this money coming in
you tax.
[42:36] » I'll let our managers explain
[clears throat] the reason.
[42:40] » Sure. Hold on. I'm just grabbing my
notes here. I don't have to speak
[42:44] anything.
Okay. So, I'm just going to recap some
[42:49] items. Um, and this was discussed in
several meetings.
[42:55] » No, it's it's okay. Um, but uh pretty
much in a nutshell, we had uh our tax
[43:02] collector Kathy
uh put together statistics for us to
[43:08] assess uh the facts uh surrounding this
per capita tax. And uh we also asked our
[43:17] attorney several questions. He gave us a
lot of information. There's uh the local
[43:22] tax enabling act puts caps on several
taxes including the income per capita
[43:29] and local services tax. And the statute
then has a provision that says if two
[43:34] tax authorities levy the same tax, in
this case it's the school district and
[43:39] the township, each levy $10 per capita,
but you only you half it. So that's why
[43:46] we would get $5 and school district gets
$5 per person. Um and and that's for as
[43:55] so long as both collect it. Uh Kathy did
some research for us. It turns out of
[44:02] all the municipalities
um that that are a part of Northeastern
[44:07] School District, only East Manchester
Township until now uh and Manchester
[44:14] Burough were the only two left still
assessing that tax uh on residents
[44:21] » uh the per capita tax. school districts
were the ones that were only ones that
[44:26] were doing it, but it was this couple
school districts.
[44:30] » Uh so what we found out was that um the
northeastern school district did not
[44:37] take over. So according to that law, if
one gets rid of their half, the school
[44:42] district in this case could say, "Well,
we want the township's half from those
[44:47] residents now." And technically you
wouldn't be getting a tax break. But we
[44:51] learned that if they do that, the board
can reinstate that per capita tax so
[44:56] that we get the funds instead of the
school district. But history shows that
[45:01] they actually have not taken other
municipalities
[45:05] half uh the other municipalities that
got rid of it. Um, so that would be
[45:10] Goldsboro Burough, York Haven Burough,
Mount Wolf Burough, Konowago Township,
[45:14] and Newberry Township all eliminated
their per capita tax and the school
[45:19] district did not take the half.
>> So we're still going to get a $5 per
[45:23] capita tax for school
>> for the school district. Yep.
[45:27] » Correct. Um, and so
>> I don't see why you guys don't
[45:31] » Well, and that Well, it's not very much
money. Um, so we actually were only
[45:36] collecting
after, you know, delinquents and all the
[45:42] mailing and the chasing and all of that
stuff. We were only getting about uh
[45:47] $25,000
uh from it when it's set said and done
[45:51] for something that's a very laborous
collection between our tax collector and
[45:56] the delinquent tax company.
>> And the difference there, right, is the
[45:59] school district includes with her other
school taxes. So, it's not a separate
[46:03] bill that goes out.
>> That very good point. That is correct.
[46:06] Um, ours is a separate bill and so it's
harder to get people they assume that
[46:15] what they're already paying Kathy for
the taxes is already roping in that per
[46:20] capita and it's not. It's separate. So,
it gets ignored very often. So, our
[46:24] percentage rate for who doesn't pay it
is high, pretty high. Um and
[46:30] » the economics made sense,
>> right?
[46:32] » To to move forward,
>> but but uh that that's why we could
[46:36] always we could always, you know,
collect it again.
[46:46] » That's true.
>> The other piece of [laughter]
[46:49] as you know, we did increase our taxes
last year, which took effect this year.
[46:56] So that factored that small amount into
the overall equation of it and so again
[47:01] the economics were really the driving
decision. So
[47:06] » thank you.
>> Yep.
[47:10] » And 8.2 resolution.
[47:17] Next then is uh resolution 2026-10
[47:25] which is the employee handbook updates
and those were distributed to and that
[47:32] resolution is ready for
[47:38] any questions from the board or any
concerns about the employee handbook
[47:44] revision.
Okay.
[47:49] And I'll make a motion that we adopt
resolution 2026-10.
[47:55] » I'll second that.
>> We have a motion to second discussion.
[47:59] All in favor call by saying I.
>> I.
[48:02] » Motion carries.
Uh the the only thing I will add is that
[48:09] one there's one item in that handbook
amendment as you already know um because
[48:15] it was uh employee matter uh discussion
with our solicitor. Uh so I can't say
[48:22] very much but um that we received a
anonymous letter um about an employee
[48:30] and after investigation it was found
that that employee is in fact not in
[48:35] violation of any of our handbook uh
policies nor are they in violation of uh
[48:42] the amendments to the policy which
actually got stronger. Um but I just
[48:47] wanted to mention that
>> I appreciate that.
[48:51] » Yep.
[48:55] » Okay. Uh moving on then. Uh next is
approval of the way temporary
[49:03] construction easements. Uh these have
been uh executed. So this is a
[49:10] ratification by the board. Uh that is
necessary.
[49:16] perissor
[49:28] construction.
>> Correct. To ratify. Yep.
[49:32] » I'll make a motion that we authorize the
chairman sign temporary construction.
[49:41] » I'll second.
Motion second. to discussion.
[49:46] All those vote in favor signify by
saying I.
[49:48] » I.
[49:52] » And then
along with that Christian, you had on
[49:57] the agenda the floor plan.
>> Oh yes. Yes. Um
[50:04] that
let me just get that up here for you
[50:08] guys. that came today uh for Shane to
look at. Uh but basically it's espresso
[50:18] ways you as we all know we were the
permitting
[50:23] uh municipality for with pendot to
obtain uh uh work a work permit for
[50:31] improving espresso way but handover
company is going to do the work and they
[50:37] also came up with the detour plan
um and they gave us two plans And so for
[50:47] obvious reasons, you're going to see
that we don't recommend one of them and
[50:52] it was an oversight from handover
company. And then the other side is what
[50:58] we recommend you approving. Um, as soon
as I get it here. Hold on one second.
[51:07] I have so many emails, guys.
And then and Shane Shane if you could
[51:13] please take over that
discussion.
[51:16] » Can you give it up?
>> Yeah. Yeah.
[51:23] » Start the next one.
>> Oh, okay. Sure.
[51:27] Yeah. This is the one for obvious
reasons that
[51:30] » Yes. This one here. I know it's hard to
see. Um, so they're going to be closing
[51:36] espresso away from the last driveway at
Canal.
[51:40] That detour plan there includes Ford
grade as a detour route and we can't do
[51:46] that. It's already going to be a no
truck route right start
[51:50] » right [clears throat]
>> and it can't be shorter and simpler
[51:54] which they did for the second.
>> So we would reject that proposal
[52:00] » as soon as I get it here. There we go.
>> Yeah, this one's very simple. It's just
[52:06] Willow Springs at Canal is
>> pretty much your next best shot and
[52:12] that's what they do there. So Willow
Springs department and
[52:18] » or or back out down Willow Springs to
connect one way either way. So
[52:23] » they're not going to they're not going
to take them up through Canal extended.
[52:30] No, it shouldn't need that at all to get
just because they closed that one area.
[52:35] » Yeah. Yeah.
The only thing we're detouring there is
[52:42] that little piece of closure.
>> When did this construction take place?
[52:49] » This year from what we understand,
>> uh, it appears so. Byron, do you know?
[52:56] My understanding is this year's
hand.
[53:03] » Yeah.
>> Resources.
[53:06] » I mean, we had our deadline hard to get.
>> Yeah. He also explained to me today um
[53:15] had not they're not pushing for the the
complete closure of it, but they would
[53:20] like that because let them work with
unencumbered, right? And they should
[53:24] they should pass down in six weeks if
they can.
[53:28] » And then on the heels of that
>> I'm the six weeks.
[53:33] » Yeah. [laughter]
Five count.
[53:37] » Um so on the heels of that then will
will those springs become the culdeac we
[53:41] designed?
>> I'm going to say not this year. We're
[53:44] beyond paving season by then.
>> Plus now I miss not being on vacation.
[53:50] Um
>> okay. I I want to speak with them about
[53:53] that to see when they do the canal road
project
[53:57] if I can also tie our closure into that
at the same time of the extension the
[54:03] betterment process the whole way out to
the trail.
[54:06] » Yeah. So hopefully while they're working
down there makes it easier on us to
[54:10] close out in the road while they're down
there already working anyway. So
[54:13] » yeah because give them a place to park
their equipment too close.
[54:17] » There you go. Yeah. Yep. Yep. to keep
them out that bare road could be used
[54:22] for
>> parking their stuff for a while.
[54:25] » Okay.
>> Yeah. So, I'm hoping spring or
[54:29] » but bottom line is is expressway should
get done this year
[54:34] » and then Willow Springs the following.
Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Uh if I could
[54:41] have a motion uh to reject the board
road proposal and to accept the Willow
[54:48] Springs proposal.
>> Make a motion to reject the
[54:53] detour that
uses board road and to accept the detour
[54:59] that uses Florida and Willow Springs.
[55:06] I'll second a motion. Motion second.
Further discussion.
[55:13] All in favor signif.
>> I
[55:20] man.
Next on my agenda is the deeds of
[55:25] dedication for manor. Uh and this is to
complete some road in front of the set
[55:33] of town houses. their deeds of
dedication uh in your materials for
[55:39] board for 4247
[55:49] George 4247
[55:53] road
[55:58] » and so is this to make more
>> yeah this is I believe this is just for
[56:04] widening the supposed to be done as part
of this house development in the first
[56:08] place
over a decade ago.
[56:14] » Is that
been there what 10 years?
[56:22] Is that the is that the
[56:26] pile of dirt still in front of us?
>> That's that's actually what pressured
[56:30] them just to this. Yeah. Go ahead, Kate.
Let them know what you what you did
[56:35] there. That's your
>> received complaints about animals, I
[56:40] guess, hiding in this weed pile. Where's
the dirt pile? So, I had to send them a
[56:45] uh violation letter for high grass and
weeds. And that's kind of where it all
[56:49] started. It was just
going after that. So I started fighting
[56:54] him and then
>> he was asking what he needed to do and
[56:58] uh he trimmed it down and she explained
to me why the dirt piles there
[57:04] » for future building of the top soil.
>> Yeah,
[57:08] » but it's been there for 10 years,
>> right? Um so we were giving him an
[57:13] ultimatum of either remove the top soil
pile or start making progress on this
[57:21] » and that's what he's doing. Okay. So,
all right. Somebody motion motion to
[57:27] approve the deeds of dedication.
[57:38] I'll make a motion that we authorize the
chairman signed of dedication for
[57:43] department along.
[57:49] » I'll second that. Okay. Commission
second. Any
[57:54] further discussion?
Seeing none, all in favor of the motion
[57:57] sign say I.
>> I.
[58:03] » And then Christy, when you when you have
this signed, would you be able to
[58:08] circulate the PDFs of them back to you
at
[58:16] » Who is it?
>> Chris Schwab.
[58:19] » Oh, is he the one who took over the
project from John? Yes,
[58:22] » Chris Schwab.
>> Yes,
[58:27] » even if you just
>> If I see an email from him, I'll put him
[58:32] in on it. But if not, then yeah, I'll
have you do it.
[58:37] » Oh, okay. No problem.
>> Sold these. I got to be notorious.
[58:41] [laughter]
>> Correct.
[58:44] I have a lot of signatures that I need.
The next item on my agenda then moving
[58:49] on is the sewer authority
intergovernmental agreement.
[58:55] This is an agreement that
has been hanging out there for several
[59:01] years
for Manchester Bur
[59:06] Township uh to agree on some of the
specific terms for the operation
[59:12] authority
[59:15] including districts
and
[59:21] some other
uh
[59:24] The sewer authority is asking for
comments from each of municipalities
[59:30] agreement circulated
2120s
[59:35] that did not get executed but had most
of the comments in to that point.
[59:44] So
what I would ask for
[59:49] from the board at this time and from the
comments that received back from the
[59:54] board, I believe the comments that the
township would
[1:00:03] like to forward
authority in addition to the changes
[1:00:08] that were in there before. uh would be
to increase the board membership to
[1:00:15] membership potential four members in the
board.
[1:00:20] And then
also on the
[1:00:28] potential termination and dissolution of
the authority that that be by a majority
[1:00:35] vote of the authority board as well as
an affirmative
[1:00:40] vote of municipalities. So two of the
municipalities.
[1:00:45] I think the next step would be to
prepare those comments
[1:00:52] and agreement.
[1:01:05] The one other comment I do have is when
I look back at this
[1:01:12] board membership byation
of the authority so
[1:01:19] that
agreement
[1:01:23] agreement
[1:01:27] change
agreement
[1:01:32] the remain
revisions from 2021
[1:01:40] back at that time. I proposed
[1:01:49] » I think what we would
ask for we would prefer that Andy work
[1:01:55] through
the solicitor of super to
[1:02:02] work between them getting our
recommendation for
[1:02:07] » I would agree.
Do you need a motion?
[1:02:11] » If you want me to if you want me to make
the changes and bring them back to the
[1:02:16] board first, I can do that. If you want
me to go ahead and send them now, I can
[1:02:20] do that.
[1:02:24] » Yeah. Now, I think this bottom line is
if there's something else that comes up,
[1:02:29] this is a process, right? That's not
what's
[1:02:32] » Yeah, there there will be another
>> So you need a motion in order to trigger
[1:02:38] the release of
>> Yeah.
[1:02:41] motion forward.
[1:02:45] » Um I make a motion that we authorize
attorney Miller to release our comments
[1:02:51] to the inter municipal agreement to the
store authority council.
[1:02:57] » I'll second that. Okay, we have a motion
in a second for discussion. I'd like to
[1:03:03] let the audience know that we're basing
this basically on edu.
[1:03:08] Um we feel that the township has a lot
more customers than the two bureaus and
[1:03:14] uh
we want to reflect that in the voting
[1:03:19] edus andor the actual revenue
>> actual revenue
[1:03:24] » because commercial and industrial are
charged different rates than what
[1:03:29] individuals.
>> Yes.
[1:03:33] So we will have to if the two burers
reject this to go back to the drawing
[1:03:39] board.
>> Again it's a process.
[1:03:42] » Okay.
>> So I'll call for the vote. All in favor
[1:03:45] of the motion signify say I
>> motion carries.
[1:03:53] Next then is the fire company use
ordinance. This will be an ordinance
[1:03:59] that would authorize and allow
fire company to
[1:04:07] collect fees or calls that go in calls
or false alarm calls.
[1:04:17] allow for a fee structure for that.
I'm bringing this back. I believe
[1:04:24] Christy is working and chief is working
on
[1:04:30] some of these fees
yet putting that schedule together.
[1:04:35] » We do have it, Andy. I just forgot to
send it to you. Um but the board did uh
[1:04:39] see it in their books.
>> Okay.
[1:04:42] » Um I can forward that to you though.
It's not in a It's not in our format.
[1:04:48] Um, it's raw. I just didn't have a
chance. It still looks good though.
[1:04:52] Thank you. I love the colors. It makes
it easier to read.
[1:04:57] » So, this is about getting
>> the reinforcement.
[1:05:03] » Oh, yeah.
>> Yeah. The ordinance is Yeah, the
[1:05:08] ordinance has not been uh advertised
yet. So, that would the next step. Uh we
[1:05:16] did also I believe
uh last month we had the question of
[1:05:22] whether we wanted to authorize emergency
services to collect fees in excess of
[1:05:29] available insurance proceeds uh when
there is a a claim that can be made. Uh
[1:05:35] and my understanding was the board
did not want to do that but wanted the
[1:05:42] collections limited to available
insurance proceed. So you did make that
[1:05:46] change at the top of page seven in
section
[1:05:55] it does
[1:05:58] limit those
[1:06:04] questions.
[1:06:13] Yes. That was just
[1:06:19] information.
>> Yes. And the fee schedule will be
[1:06:24] established by resolution. So we will
put together a separate fee resolution
[1:06:29] for that to adopt that fee schedule.
>> And I want to just add that um what
[1:06:37] chief came up with um for uh what did we
call it like a re it's re I hate to call
[1:06:43] it a fee schedule. It's more like a
reimbursement of service or
[1:06:47] » recovery
>> recovery. That's it. Um but this is
[1:06:52] what other uh fire department or
municipalities have adopted for their
[1:06:57] fire departments. Um so the the fee
structure follows that closely. Uh
[1:07:03] correct?
>> Yep.
[1:07:08] » Yeah. Yeah. He didn't pull these out of
thin air, I think, is what I'm trying to
[1:07:11] say here. It came from
>> correct we looked at
[1:07:23] » correct
[1:07:37] [clears throat]
[1:07:41] » Okay. different.
>> So you need to advertise.
[1:07:47] » Yeah. If you want to move forward with a
motion to advertise the ordinance and
[1:07:52] then a separate motion to authorize it.
[1:07:57] » I like I make a motion that
[1:08:05] » I'll second a motion. We have another.
>> So we have a motion, a second. Is there
[1:08:12] any discussion?
>> All in favor signify by saying I.
[1:08:16] » I. And then the next part is he needs a
motion. I'll make this motion to draft
[1:08:23] the resolution with the fee schedule
for the ordinance.
[1:08:32] » Yes.
>> Okay. We have a motion to second
[1:08:34] discussion. You had to use red and
green.
[1:08:38] All right.
On your chart.
[1:08:42] » Couldn't you see it?
>> No.
[1:08:43] » Hold [clears throat] Steve.
>> On my computer. I can't say. Did you
[1:08:48] call it?
>> No. All in favor signify by saying I
[1:08:52] » I couldn't leave because it's
>> Are you color block?
[1:08:57] » Well, maybe.
>> Okay. [laughter]
[1:09:00] » You should tell me. Then I won't use
that color.
[1:09:04] What color would you like?
>> Yeah. [clears throat] What would you
[1:09:06] like to see?
>> Well, that's actually a good cue. If you
[1:09:09] wanted to sign something, do it in red
and green.
[1:09:12] » My my predecessor could not see I think
red and green.
[1:09:16] » He thought the green the grass looked
like red, like it was on fire. He said
[1:09:21] » as long as they don't change the uh
traffic lights.
[1:09:26] » Turn them upside down.
>> The uh the last thing on my agenda then
[1:09:31] is just uh
fire company and proposed fire
[1:09:38] to establish
authority and responsibility for fire
[1:09:44] chief. My understanding is that previous
[1:10:04] Okay.
>> I mean, that's me, but I'm one of three.
[1:10:07] So,
I didn't go back and repeat again.
[1:10:14] » All right. Motion to table until that
meeting.
[1:10:18] » I second
favor.
[1:10:24] » And that's that's all I have.
>> Any questions for Andy?
[1:10:31] » No.
Okay, Byron.
[1:10:34] » Uh, first item on my list is Mo Street
pipe work.
[1:10:38] Again, we haven't started pipe work in
our area. I did talk with one of the
[1:10:44] contractors. U he is going to be
starting hopefully next week the water
[1:10:50] man relocate. They have to water to
relocate portion of the water man in
[1:10:55] that area. So, he's doing that and I
actually at York excavated.
[1:11:01] So I worked I kind of worked with him
just gave him some information regarding
[1:11:05] our sue that he never heard salt from
pandot so that he's more comfortable
[1:11:10] where the he didn't know the gas and and
the sewer line on top of one another and
[1:11:16] it's kind of how it's actually but um he
didn't know they were touching so I just
[1:11:22] kind of shaping my head courtesy heads
up
[1:11:25] » so they're supposed to start that
portion
[1:11:28] » as far as the kind of red storms
[1:11:32] I think Chrissy was called a few times,
but
[1:11:36] they're waiting for I guess the water
first.
[1:11:40] Um,
Will Springs called the sack. Shane gave
[1:11:45] me all his information.
Uh I have the draft ready to go back
[1:11:52] change information.
[1:12:01] » Uh do we
did we decide what kind of gate we want
[1:12:05] here? Senator
[1:12:13] come down late.
Well, I think I think we wanted to go
[1:12:20] all our future gates beside activated
and we can do an extended uh solar panel
[1:12:28] get it out of the shade and
underground wire to the
[1:12:34] Yeah, we could probably pull I was
thinking electric and that's where I
[1:12:37] knew you wanted. You know what I mean?
But let me check on that.
[1:12:42] » Right.
>> Yeah.
[1:12:46] just calls out.
>> Yes.
[1:12:49] » So
>> that's why
[1:12:51] » so we we have a little more flexibility.
>> I just want to come back to the focus
[1:12:56] that we have or I guess the goal we have
is if we're putting data center in one
[1:13:01] remote control.
>> Yeah.
[1:13:05] » Right.
>> Right.
[1:13:06] » And so if we can power them up with a
solar panel that's going to provide
[1:13:11] enough power, great. If not, then
they're going to be paying electric
[1:13:16] » and paying to install electric, too,
right? But in the grand scheme of
[1:13:19] things, that's a small price to pay to
get that kind of access, right?
[1:13:25] » Yeah. Yeah. Usually solar does not um
unless you were having problem.
[1:13:31] » Okay. Down behind the willow there,
unless we eliminate all trees, you know,
[1:13:35] I mean, right. That's the problem.
>> Yeah. But would we remove any trees and
[1:13:41] whatnot to you? You could it would take
a lot to get sun on it all day long,
[1:13:46] » but do you need sun all day? How many
hours of sun do you need? And I guess
[1:13:50] those are questions just to
>> kind of come back and they determine
[1:13:53] whether we need something else.
>> We could we could put it on or something
[1:13:58] like that too.
>> Yeah.
[1:13:59] » Yeah.
>> Okay. Um, next item is the staff has
[1:14:07] been asking us to get together two grant
applications which is the local share
[1:14:13] for grant which is due here again in
September. Uh, first one steambo
[1:14:19] uh is to work machine
mill 2 in off which gets rid of the old
[1:14:27] uh micro surfacing that we're having
problems with. uh mil that put two
[1:14:32] inches back of 12.5 million pavement. Uh
I did the estimate. I reached out to a
[1:14:39] couple contractors and find out what
what the current rate is and came up
[1:14:43] with an estimate that worked grand
amount was $400,400
[1:14:48] to do all that. That's almost what 3,000
3200 ft of road call.
[1:14:59] So what I'm looking for on that one, I
have given a resolution.
[1:15:05] Uh that's part of the requirement. Uh so
I'm looking for approval of the
[1:15:09] resolution
>> and authorizing me to sign it as the
[1:15:14] secretary.
>> Right.
[1:15:15] » Uh and it would be resolution 2026-11.
[1:15:22] » I'll make a motion that we authorize the
manager to sign resolution 2026-11.
[1:15:28] I'll second that
>> discussion.
[1:15:32] All in favor say I.
>> And if I [cough]
[1:15:39] just need Christie to give me a letter
that says that the township's going to
[1:15:43] it's basically one sentence the township
own
[1:15:50] finish the application to speak.
>> Yep. And that that is key in that grant
[1:15:57] um because the next one there I
contacted them. I have a contact with
[1:16:03] the LSA grant and I was picking her
brain about this Dolbertton storm sewer
[1:16:10] situation and what this chalks up to is
that we do not own that Dolbertton storm
[1:16:17] sewer pipe. So we would not be awarded
that grant.
[1:16:22] Um so
[1:16:26] and unless you guys want to own it then
we can go through with the resolution
[1:16:30] but um that is not something that I
believe attorney Miller and he can say
[1:16:35] it for himself but he does not advise us
to do such a thing.
[1:16:39] » So if you do not advise us to take over
that we have to when we do maintenance
[1:16:45] on them plates where do we send the
bill?
[1:16:49] I think that's what that's the difficult
decision for the board to make. Um,
[1:16:56] we sent
the the burrow and the township sent
[1:17:02] letter
to the HOA in 2015 or 2016 when they
[1:17:10] were there were rumors that it was going
to try to disband.
[1:17:16] Both municipalities specifically others
saying you can't do that and they did it
[1:17:22] anyway without the municipalities
knowing [clears throat] and ordered the
[1:17:28] termination without coming to any of the
municipalities for consent.
[1:17:33] So this was never supposed to be like
this. The township was never supposed to
[1:17:40] be in this position.
Uh but I think the difficult decision
[1:17:45] for the board is
do you held those
[1:17:50] residents accountable. I don't even know
if any of them knew that the HOA was
[1:17:54] doing that either or participated in it
in any way, but likely a lot of the
[1:18:00] residents there have no inclination or
understanding of what transpired.
[1:18:09] I [clears throat] think the, you know,
the board has to make a decision. Do you
[1:18:14] do you try to to
assess those property owners or or not?
[1:18:19] I think legally we can do that because
even though the HLA was standing
[1:18:27] liability
asked this question um would it be
[1:18:32] possible to send letters to all the
folks in
[1:18:37] tell them that there's going to be a
meeting specifically addressing them
[1:18:41] bring
I know it's here now but I mean to
[1:18:46] really notify the folks and tell them
here's your choices. You know, here's
[1:18:51] the history and here's the choice. You
know, my my view is
[1:18:56] I don't want,
you know, yes, I I get that you're
[1:19:01] probably right. Most of the folks have
no clue. Some folks that bought a house,
[1:19:05] say, a month ago have no clue even a
year ago, right? And and so it's going
[1:19:09] to be news to them. So I'd much rather
have and encourage some open dialogue
[1:19:14] with those folks who impacted from a
township standpoint.
[1:19:20] We shouldn't take on that problem,
[1:19:24] right? I and we could I think that's up
to the board if you want to have that
[1:19:30] kind of meeting with them
and see I I think it's going to be very
[1:19:38] difficult for them to
come together and actually uh do
[1:19:44] anything. I think they're in a whoever
did this from the prior HOA boards has
[1:19:51] left them in a very in a no-win
situation because legally I'm not I'm
[1:19:57] not even sure how they reformulate an
HOA at this. In other words, there's
[1:20:04] HOAs are formed when there's a single
owner of the property. forming an HA
[1:20:10] when it's no longer in civil ownership
is is very very difficult
[1:20:16] but at the same time that leaves all
members with
[1:20:22] with assessments individual assessments
and that's kind of they just want to be
[1:20:28] able to have that dialogue to say you
know in my view it's this is where it's
[1:20:34] headed this is what's coming your way
and this is the estimated cost and you
[1:20:38] know, whether your property sits right
over top that plate or you're in that
[1:20:44] community, you benefit from it.
Do I
[1:20:50] think what would be critical in having
that meeting is number one, you know,
[1:20:55] some of that history of what happened
with it, but then also the information
[1:21:00] about the pipes and the work that's
going to need to be done, grant
[1:21:05] applications, etc.
the lack of being able to apply for a
[1:21:09] grant.
>> Well, for that one in particular, um I
[1:21:13] honestly in my opinion, um the original
plan was to just try to look for grant
[1:21:19] money to offset those costs. I think
that we should continue to do that so we
[1:21:25] have all of our ducks in a row and maybe
some good news.
[1:21:29] » Sure.
>> To offset some of that heartburn.
[1:21:33] » I mean, sorry to interrupt you, but I
mean, while the the contact said it
[1:21:38] won't be approved. You can still at
least submit it and get the formal
[1:21:41] rejection,
right? You can still look for other
[1:21:45] grants, too. Doesn't cost us to submit
anything.
[1:21:48] » It does cost a little bit, but not very
much.
[1:21:50] » Yeah.
>> So, that's $100 we would spend.
[1:21:53] » Yeah. So, I could also offer this is the
local grant which is due here in
[1:21:59] September 30th. There's another grant
the exact basically the exact same grant
[1:22:04] statewide is due on October 30. So that
gives us another 30 days.
[1:22:09] » I would apply for for both just to try
and kick those doors.
[1:22:13] » So what we would have is not have a
letter saying that township owns and
[1:22:17] maintains.
>> I would give him the history to say look
[1:22:20] there was an HOA the HOA disbanded and
so the township can't provide a letter
[1:22:24] but we're submitting you know for this
community's behalf to see if there's a
[1:22:28] chance.
[1:22:31] I think that would kill it.
>> Maybe, but but at least then you get the
[1:22:35] formal, you know, you went through the
process. It wasn't just, you know,
[1:22:39] Christy talking to some contact. Again,
I appreciate you doing that, but at
[1:22:42] least this way does a formal submission
and they formally have to reject it.
[1:22:48] » I think you probably could say that the
township has the authority without
[1:22:53] saying
[1:23:00] that be great just at least try versus
not being 100 bucks
[1:23:07] it's a reasonable cost to at least try
>> um if you guys so move that resolution
[1:23:14] then um uh Andy can you just send me the
language for what I should write is all
[1:23:20] thank you
>> I just have one other question if I may
[1:23:22] and Shane it's for you regarding that
how long can that continue to go in its
[1:23:28] current condition.
>> Um, most of it's on the engine pipes,
[1:23:31] but we do have lawns that are sinking
between sidewalks.
[1:23:35] » I mean, guest obviously depends on
weather and whether you get a 100year
[1:23:39] flood, but
>> that's the I'm hoping another year or
[1:23:43] two, you know.
>> Okay. So,
[1:23:45] » yeah.
>> So, so looking at the picture I to help
[1:23:48] keep the calls down, Shane did a lot. I
told Shane what I he did the photos. We
[1:23:52] met on site. He did all the photos and
just look from my opinion looking at the
[1:23:57] photos is the a lot of places the bottom
of the pipe is completely gone. It is
[1:24:02] » okay. However, there's enough cinders
and sediment in the bottom that it's
[1:24:06] kind of acting as the bottom of the pipe
temporarily. So, so I think you're okay
[1:24:12] like Shane said for a year or two, but
it's something you don't want to have
[1:24:17] since and understand this pipe run that
we were looking for for the grant is
[1:24:21] only one run in the development that
will take the worst
[1:24:27] » because it'll it means the other pipes
eventually will come around.
[1:24:31] » I'm going to say we did inspect them um
uh
[1:24:37] five years you may get more than that
out of it. You know, I mean, there was
[1:24:41] set the stage of what happened.
>> This one was past the point. Yeah.
[1:24:45] » Yeah. The other ones,
>> uh, if I remember correctly, all the
[1:24:50] bombs are still intact. But the bottom
line is is we haven't run into a
[1:24:54] situation like this before anyway.
>> No, we have metal pipes like that. Just
[1:24:59] not No, but I mean without the HOA
disbanding and correct things of that to
[1:25:03] where we have a single door to knock on
versus all the rest of it.
[1:25:08] » Yes. Yeah.
Okay.
[1:25:11] » So, we have time, but yeah, you know, we
should get moving.
[1:25:14] » So, again, I'm looking for approval of
the resolution so I can continue to
[1:25:19] » I'll make a a motion to approve the
necessary resolution uh so that Byron
[1:25:26] can submit the LSA grant for Dolbertton
>> authorizing me resolution 2026-12.
[1:25:34] » Yeah, very please.
>> Thank you. [laughter]
[1:25:40] I'll second
[1:25:43] » you got motion.
[1:25:50] » So sorry
[1:25:56] that last
>> uh authorizing
[1:26:01] Mr. contract to move forward with the
res sorry move forward with the LSA
[1:26:07] grant
for Dolbertton man
[1:26:14] storm soil
>> and then this resolution 2026-
[1:26:20] » 12
>> 12
[1:26:23] » and then authorizing me to sign it
>> and authorizing township manager.
[1:26:28] » Yep.
>> Okay. Okay, I have a motion and second
[1:26:32] discussion
second.
[1:26:39] » I'll call for vote. All in favor of the
motion signify by saying I
[1:26:43] » motion carry.
[1:26:47] » Um the last thing I just want to mention
in my report is that Shane and I had our
[1:26:52] BC MS4 audit um two weeks ago, two
Thursdays ago. Um, as far as I'm
[1:27:00] concerned, it went well. The the staff
did a wonderful job and Shane's guys did
[1:27:05] a wonderful job cleaning everything.
Everything looked really good. Um,
[1:27:10] really didn't have
we we were we were supposed to get a
[1:27:15] written report within two weeks, two to
three weeks and said, uh, I I got
[1:27:21] nothing out of him that said that we
have any violation.
[1:27:25] So, we took him out on the site. We
looked at old buildings. We took him
[1:27:29] down on five sites and looked at out
falls. We looked at some BM current
[1:27:36] BMPs. We didn't we don't have any
current construction projects. I
[1:27:40] couldn't take him to a current
construction project which is but we
[1:27:43] took him to the five locations that he
wanted to go see. A young guy and a
[1:27:48] girl. Um, and again,
the only thing the only thing I'd say
[1:27:56] that they kind of really pushed was
public outreach, which is one of the
[1:28:01] requirements, which is how can we reach
out to businesses and the residents to
[1:28:06] make them aware of NS4
and we let's wait till we hear back. I
[1:28:12] mean, we've had public meetings and
nobody showed up. We've had, you know,
[1:28:17] we've labeled stuff. I mean, we do
mailers. We do um we do when people pick
[1:28:23] up the permit, they they get referred to
when it rains a dream brochure. I mean,
[1:28:28] I think we're doing a lot already, but
that was, you know, I think one of the
[1:28:34] things we mentioned is we talked about
the Halloween parade and the staff is in
[1:28:38] the Halloween parade. Is we put a sign
on the side of the trucks about leak,
[1:28:42] the dates of the leaf pickup, put a
second sign on one of the trucks that
[1:28:46] says, [clears throat] "Hey, ask us about
MS4" or something like that.
[1:28:50] » And I think that's all good. Maybe
another thing is, you know, next year as
[1:28:54] we put the budget together, you know,
the website improvements maybe
[1:28:58] » MS4 is only website.
>> No, no, but it's it might be easier to
[1:29:02] find with a reconstructed and and to be
honest, you know, MS4 had no clue what
[1:29:09] that is, you know. So, part of that
education of what does it mean things of
[1:29:14] that nature?
>> So, okay. I just wanted to bring that up
[1:29:17] and mention that.
>> No, I think it's that's good. They're
[1:29:20] going to give us some feedback then.
>> They're going to give us some feedback.
[1:29:23] Yes.
[1:29:26] If I would say I would say yes
and it's I mean it's possible. I'm not I
[1:29:33] I think Shane you agree with me. I'm not
real worried about it. It just we g we
[1:29:38] we were perfectly honest. We had nothing
to hide.
[1:29:41] » So here here it is. So they looked at
our our annual they actually had us send
[1:29:46] them the annual reports in the past few
years. I did all that. our storm water
[1:29:51] ordinance. They listed like 15 items
that they gave. So again, I have nothing
[1:29:57] to hide.
>> Thank you.
[1:30:00] » That's all I had.
>> Any questions for Byron?
[1:30:04] » No.
>> Thank you, Byron.
[1:30:07] Christie, manager report. Oh, I'm sorry.
Public works department work.
[1:30:13] » Any questions on our report?
[1:30:17] » No. Still liking the deer.
>> Still liking the deer. The giant deer
[1:30:23] tractor.
>> Oh, it's still getting fixed. So, yeah.
[1:30:26] Yeah, it's a Yeah, it's a great piece of
equipment.
[1:30:31] » Um,
uh, if there's no questions and I'd just
[1:30:34] like to have a discussion and
I'm assuming you guys see the signs on
[1:30:40] here for the
for the snow for no parking. Um,
[1:30:46] Andy, can you explain a little bit what
it would take to possibly do this? But
[1:30:52] before you do, can I mention something
that,
[1:30:58] and I'm pretty sure all of these I could
be wrong without looking at the plans,
[1:31:02] but most of these developments that
we're having issues with started out
[1:31:07] originally as no parking developments.
[1:31:13] So, can this just take that place, Andy,
but for only certain times of the year?
[1:31:20] Did that make sense? Or I mean,
technically, if they started out that
[1:31:24] way, I can go back and post them all
again as no parking
[1:31:28] forever.
>> I think you guys I think you would have
[1:31:31] to change the ordinance to do that.
Wouldn't you have to add them as no
[1:31:34] parking roads? Right now, it's not
listed. They're not listed.
[1:31:40] That's that's correct. To be able to
>> say,
[1:31:46] » they'd have to amend the ordinance to
address whatever roads are considered no
[1:31:51] parking. And so,
>> wouldn't we already have that on for
[1:31:54] Lake Sherman?
>> It would have got changed back when they
[1:31:57] allowed they would have been those roads
would have been removed when they
[1:32:01] allowed parking on the streets.
>> I don't believe we did. I believe one
[1:32:06] day I was just told you sign. Well, we
can we can look we can win
[1:32:11] » if there's an ordinance in place that
hasn't been repealed that allows for the
[1:32:16] parking
and I don't you know what year that was
[1:32:21] I check did it 15 years ago
but if if there's if if the ordinance is
[1:32:31] still in place for no parking then yes
you can reestablish the signs
[1:32:38] put them back in.
>> Could I reestablish it as the snow signs
[1:32:46] and not worry the other six, eight
months of the year?
[1:32:50] » Well, exactly. I mean, that isn't going
to be
[1:32:57] that isn't going to be supported by the
study that's in it. And I don't know
[1:33:04] that that uh
I don't know that that's
[1:33:11] that's necessarily
required [clears throat] to do it.
[1:33:18] I think and what I'm just going back to
the the emails we exchanged about it.
[1:33:29] » They're not listed just so you know.
There there's a section that says that
[1:33:34] » type of use. Well, it's a it's
prohibited parking at any time at
[1:33:39] certain locations
and and the developments that I know
[1:33:44] he's talking about like Sherman Oaks for
instance there. It's not on here.
[1:33:51] » Um traffic study establish
[1:33:58] it be simple because it's a one lane
race which is technically all equal. You
[1:34:03] can't fence two carts in these streets
without one waiting a quarter mile down
[1:34:07] the road while the other one
>> if I recall that cart you were 26 or 28
[1:34:12] » it's 20 26
>> 26 so that's with parking that
[1:34:16] » yeah park two cars you just took 16 ft
away
[1:34:20] » would would you be proposing this in
every development that has a 50 foot
[1:34:26] rightway?
>> Yes. only for the 26 foot rental. Yeah.
[1:34:29] Not the 60,
>> right?
[1:34:31] » Yeah.
>> So then it would be up to you guys. I
[1:34:34] think in the past
uh the previous board um didn't want to
[1:34:42] do that because there were a lot of
people who park on the road because they
[1:34:47] have grown kids now and things like
that. And I think I and maybe Dave you
[1:34:52] can recall but I think that's why I
think it was because so many people park
[1:34:55] on the road and use it. It but from
Shane's standpoint it's a huge issue
[1:35:00] when it comes to weather or storm
removal uh snow and ice.
[1:35:05] » It's also a huge issue for Chief
>> and and emers very big point emergency
[1:35:10] services truck down through Apple. has
tremendous amount of problems.
[1:35:22] Yeah.
>> Yeah. The whole back street.
[1:35:27] » Yeah. And that's where one of my file
operators who thought he could fit,
[1:35:31] » right?
>> He made it like three, four cars in and
[1:35:34] realized I ain't going to fit. Well,
when he backed out, he realized, you
[1:35:37] know, we hit the first two cars and he
met trying to get through that. But
[1:35:40] yeah, that one's really bad. So,
problems.
[1:35:46] » Yeah.
>> So, I have Sherman Oaks, Orchard View,
[1:35:50] Greenfield, Greenwood, Asbury.
It isn't bad because they're not all
[1:35:56] together in Ashbury, but it's still a
narrow street. Um, Smith Gardens and
[1:36:00] Dton is is our vision.
>> One thing to consider would be park no
[1:36:06] parking on one side
and beyond the narrow streets of the
[1:36:13] Yeah.
>> straight in nowadays. Yeah,
[1:36:18] [clears throat]
[1:36:21] » he did uh he did many years discuss no
parking on one side of the street going
[1:36:26] down through do uh Oaks and we can't we
can't get together with the with the
[1:36:32] mail
US mail
[1:36:37] because they allow mailboxes on either
side both sides.
[1:36:42] So, we were trying to get the mailboxes
on one side of the street that you can't
[1:36:46] park on.
>> Yeah. I don't even see how when that was
[1:36:49] delivered.
[1:36:53] » It It was a poor It was a poor design of
that development right from the get-go.
[1:36:57] » Correct. In our streets.
>> Yeah.
[1:37:01] » So, you're suggesting no parking when
snow removal conditions exist.
[1:37:07] » Correct.
>> And
[1:37:09] » that that can mean just a salt job. It's
still a snow removal condition. Correct
[1:37:14] me if I'm wrong here,
>> you know.
[1:37:19] » Yeah.
>> Okay. And the the snow storage areas
[1:37:22] down in cesacs. Yeah. Is very important.
Yeah.
[1:37:25] » Yeah. Chief way like that sign snow
storage area. So where we don't have the
[1:37:30] driveways, it's where parks is only
five. Um has two hours has a date
[1:37:36] November 15th, April sometime. You know
what I mean?
[1:37:39] So, how do we enforce it?
[1:37:43] » Does it take an ordinance? Who's going
to enforce it? And I want it enforced.
[1:37:48] » So, so
>> just so we're aware because I I did read
[1:37:53] the sample ordinance that uh Andy
supplied us from T uh Hopewell Township.
[1:38:00] Um,
we do not, the township does not enforce
[1:38:05] anything on the road that the police
department does that. The reason for
[1:38:09] that is because my staff is not legally
allowed to have I don't know what the
[1:38:17] system's called, but it's the system
where you can run the VINs and stuff.
[1:38:20] We're not legally allowed to have that.
>> Yeah. And because I tried when I was the
[1:38:26] zoning officer, they wouldn't give it to
me. [laughter] So anyways, um, uh, so
[1:38:32] and and you know, you never know who
actually owns that vehicle. Just because
[1:38:36] they're parked in front of a house
doesn't mean that it belongs to that
[1:38:40] house. Okay? So it is very difficult for
township staff to enforce it per a
[1:38:47] ticketing system. Um, so it it would
rely heavily on the police department to
[1:38:54] do that task.
Um,
[1:38:58] I don't I don't know what else to say
about that.
[1:39:01] » And and that was one of the reasons we
took the signs down originally was
[1:39:05] because
at least I was told we don't have enough
[1:39:10] of them to enforce it.
>> So, I mean, it's a never ending battle.
[1:39:15] » It's a catch 22, right?
>> Yes. So the signs would, you know,
[1:39:20] certainly tell folks remind you to
please move your vehicle when it's this.
[1:39:25] Okay.
>> And I'm hoping to deter some people.
[1:39:31] » I don't need them all to deter
some. So
[1:39:34] » 50% right.
>> Yes. Give give me 50%. Because years ago
[1:39:37] we only had certain little sections.
>> Now it's all roads. So So I think the
[1:39:43] one thing I keep coming back to is
there's no one tool that solves it all.
[1:39:47] I think it's a couple of different
things. So, I think putting signage out
[1:39:50] there would help.
>> Two would be, you know, if that
[1:39:54] particular development or developments
that are problematic, do they have a
[1:39:58] Facebook page where you could go on and
be like, "Guys, I'll rate your project
[1:40:03] for sure."
>> No, understand.
[1:40:05] » Y and but again, the people that post it
are very angry because they do move
[1:40:11] their cars.
>> Sure. I've had neighbors yell at me
[1:40:13] because their neighbors are parked in
front of their house during the snow.
[1:40:17] They're not even the ones parked there.
I understand.
[1:40:19] » But yeah,
>> so that's why I'm saying no one's full
[1:40:22] solves at all. These signs aren't going
to solve it all. Correct. And when you
[1:40:25] get to enforcement, there's not enough
officers to go doing that. And the point
[1:40:29] is is okay, they could ticket every car.
It's not going to move them out of the
[1:40:33] way.
>> Right. Our ordinance does allow, Kate
[1:40:36] just pointed it out to me, so good
looking out there, but it basically
[1:40:40] gives the road master and the police
department the authority to tow the
[1:40:44] vehicles during a weather event.
>> Good luck finding a tow truck.
[1:40:48] » Yes.
>> Again, they did it last year.
[1:40:52] » Was it Officer George?
>> No. What township towed 380 something in
[1:40:57] the middle of the night?
>> But didn't you say they knew? You have
[1:41:01] to have a plan if you're gonna 380 some
cars.
[1:41:04] » But yes, they do. These cars were never
>> You could do that, but before you do
[1:41:08] that, it'd be a function of We told you,
we told you, we told you, and we told
[1:41:11] you again. Okay.
>> Um, and that's why I say, you know, our
[1:41:16] website, all the things you've already
done to to to do that.
[1:41:21] um and certainly putting the signs out
but at the end of the day unfortunately
[1:41:26] I'm just hoping the signs like you said
will get through
[1:41:29] » some portion 40% you know what I mean
like
[1:41:32] » and what the other thing I was thinking
about given you know solar powered signs
[1:41:37] you know is there because that sign's
out there rain snow right
[1:41:44] um sunshine but if there was a solar
powered sign that you could trip a
[1:41:50] message like we're coming. You know,
this is a snow condition, please. You
[1:41:55] know,
>> I could try using the the reader boards
[1:41:58] for the police officers.
>> We we do that every year
[1:42:01] » during the winter. You know what I mean?
>> Or do it out here,
[1:42:05] » but I might actually put it at the
entrance to death.
[1:42:08] » And and maybe maybe that's another thing
too to consider. You know, those small
[1:42:12] reader boards that we have, what do they
cost? Would it make sense for us to have
[1:42:16] a couple to put at those developments as
well? Well, they have a few. I think now
[1:42:20] we're all together.
>> No, but even renting some or whatnot.
[1:42:24] I'm saying the township rents them and
you know, they're calling for snow. It's
[1:42:27] like go to those couple developments
that are problematic at their entry and
[1:42:32] put them up and fire them up and
hopefully you get a few more to your
[1:42:36] corn chain.
>> Yeah.
[1:42:37] » Again, I don't think one thing solves it
all, but
[1:42:39] » yeah, but can I post a sign is the
question.
[1:42:44] the the no parking signs in certain
conditions in the first place.
[1:42:49] » Yeah.
>> I mean, you you can post the signs
[1:42:54] whether or not they're enforceable. I
mean, we could put
[1:42:58] Well,
first of all, you almost have to declare
[1:43:02] that a snow emergency route to to
require them to move. Uh, and you can do
[1:43:08] that. We I mean we could put into the
ordinance, you know, certain I think
[1:43:14] this is a discussion we had. If you put
in two inches,
[1:43:18] » you know, you may have two inches on one
street, you may have an inch on the next
[1:43:23] street. So, it's that's really hard to
measure. Yeah.
[1:43:26] » But we can put that in the ordinance.
>> Um, you know, how enforceable they
[1:43:32] ultimately are. If you if you have to go
enforce them, you know, I think the
[1:43:38] board just Uh and you just have to
expect maybe difficult right to
[1:43:45] » but we're looking for deterrent
>> right
[1:43:47] » and that wouldn't even bother me as much
but
[1:43:51] just trying to
>> but in terms of putting the signs up I
[1:43:56] mean it's not you know where you putting
up a speed control sign or something
[1:44:01] like that
certainly more concerns correct but
[1:44:06] putting up a sign like that I think I
think it's okay if you just understand,
[1:44:14] » right? Okay. So, maybe we're just give
it a try and
[1:44:19] you know, pick one development. See see
what it does for
[1:44:23] y. So, all right. Thanks.
[1:44:28] What's weather event takes us to Christy
Norththeast New York County Stewart?
[1:44:37] Um I I read through their minutes. It
there's nothing spectacular happening.
[1:44:42] Um it they are constantly, you know,
finessing their internal repair systems
[1:44:51] and uh uh just trying to make sure
everything is working properly, it
[1:44:56] appears. And then I have one here. It
looks like I did a repeat um because
[1:45:01] Andy addressed it already under his
report [clears throat] for the
[1:45:04] intermunicipal agreement. So we can
breeze over that.
[1:45:07] » Okay. So that takes us to Kate zoning
officers reports.
[1:45:12] » So we don't have no meeting for
September's uh zoning hearing board.
[1:45:18] I should know tomorrow we have a
planning commission meeting. Um that
[1:45:23] would be for trade center 83
for their final
[1:45:27] uh plan. Um waiting on Chris Pencil to
get back to me on that one. Um other
[1:45:33] than that, do you have any questions on
my report or
[1:45:37] » just plot
your planning commission?
[1:45:41] » So that you're saying it hinges on
Chris?
[1:45:44] » Yeah. Okay. FBI game until tomorrow,
[1:45:48] » but they don't go to it then be nothing
on the agenda commission.
[1:45:53] » Any question with the code enforcements
requirements?
[1:45:57] » Yeah.
Recreation board Christie.
[1:46:01] » Uh they did meet recently
uh last week and uh they made a
[1:46:08] brochure.
Um, they're going to get that, print it,
[1:46:12] and they would like to hand it out. I
They uh plan to go to Touch a Truck.
[1:46:18] They did go to National Night Out, which
I already reported to you. They just
[1:46:23] want to appear a bit more professional
and try to recruit people and also show
[1:46:28] people uh or the the residents, you
know, what they do and what our township
[1:46:34] has to offer for recreation.
Um
[1:46:39] and and they they continue to talk about
future events.
[1:46:43] » Oh, it looks like I'm so sorry I I
misspoke. It looks like they're not
[1:46:46] available to come to Touch a Truck, but
they will still have the flyers to give
[1:46:52] to Shane for the event. That's what it
is. Sorry about that.
[1:46:58] » Yeah, the flyer does look
>> Yeah.
[1:47:00] » I'm sorry. I was I I planned on make
making that meeting death in the family.
[1:47:05] So, I couldn't attend. But I want to go
to one of their meetings because there
[1:47:10] is interest if any of the residents
remember what they used to call
[1:47:15] stay-at-home celebration way back when
when the JC's put it on and stuff that
[1:47:21] uh uh the school district, the police
department
[1:47:26] all are are are
Lions Club
[1:47:32] are showing interest in renewing that
and bringing that back. So, between the
[1:47:38] school district and all those
departments and our recreation board, I
[1:47:41] think we it's it's an initiative to
bring back the stay-at-h home
[1:47:45] celebration, whether it's multi-days or
it's a carnival or whatever. We need
[1:47:50] more of those community involvements in
our in our community. So, I will get
[1:47:55] with the rec board and float that by
them.
[1:48:00] Uh
[1:48:03] 11.4 4 2027 minimum municipal
obligations Manchester Towns.
[1:48:11] So that obligation is $48,132.
>> Correct.
[1:48:16] » In those sense,
>> you need a motion for that.
[1:48:19] » We we do. And just to reiterate, like I
do every year, we uh have uh gotten more
[1:48:28] state aid than what we had to pay in uh
for the previous year. So, um,
[1:48:36] technically we end up getting it back.
Um, and that it's been like that for a
[1:48:40] very long time. So, let's knock on some
wood. Um, but just so you're aware.
[1:48:46] » So, yeah, I'll entertain a motion for an
obligation.
[1:48:52] » Yeah, I'll make a motion that we heard
the 2027 MMO for East Manchester
[1:48:57] County's pension plan. the amount of the
obligation amount of $48,132.
[1:49:04] Second that
>> we have a motion to second discussion.
[1:49:09] » All in favor signify by saying I. I.
>> I. Motion carries.
[1:49:13] » Takes us down to docar.
>> Uh okay. So
[1:49:19] our license well first let me just say
we have a program called Docstar. It's
[1:49:24] our electronic scanning system. Um, it
was in existence before I ever worked
[1:49:30] here and I started here in 2014.
Um, it was being actively worked on. Uh,
[1:49:38] the township was paying at that time.
Stratex uh is what the company's name is
[1:49:44] now. They used to be called Block. Block
uh was actually taking our documents and
[1:49:50] scanning them and keywording them for
us. Okay. And that was the back scan
[1:49:57] project until we were day forward with
our scanning.
[1:50:02] And we did that for some time until
about two years ago when we stopped
[1:50:08] putting documents into Docstar. Um
because we have uh a cloud permit
[1:50:15] manager that houses all of the property
files and it used to be on local server
[1:50:22] but now now we have cloud storage for it
at no additional cost with uh for permit
[1:50:26] manager and um uh that that's working
very well for us very well and no point
[1:50:35] to have documents in multiple different
areas that we then have to check for
[1:50:42] permits and projects and right to knows
and whatever else we would need to do
[1:50:46] that for. Um, and also it's very hard to
find documents in it because uh many
[1:50:56] different people through the times
including like I said block systems
[1:51:00] keyworded our stuff and nobody did it
the same or they did it improperly. So
[1:51:04] there are some documents that we just
can't find uh because of that reason and
[1:51:11] uh
Stratex and I we were and Jason our IT
[1:51:15] guy we were working on
uh coming up with a solution so that we
[1:51:21] could just get our documents
uh and and be done with Docstar. Okay.
[1:51:28] They lost our license or dropped our
license out of nowhere with no notice.
[1:51:34] um while we were getting pretty close to
our options and um SR Business Systems
[1:51:40] took it over and now we have uh only
this meeting to make this decision, but
[1:51:46] staff and Jason and SR Business Systems
uh worked very diligently to try to uh
[1:51:53] get us to make the best decision
possible in a short amount of time
[1:51:57] before we lose our licensing. We we need
to make this decision tonight. Um, so
[1:52:03] we're currently paying uh a little over
$7,100 a year. Uh, that's option one.
[1:52:10] Option one is to not change anything, go
back into a three-year contract with
[1:52:15] them, and we wouldn't lose any of our
user licenses, and uh we could have not
[1:52:22] to exceed 5% of an increase for years
two and three.
[1:52:26] And then option two would be to decrease
the number of users and a three-year
[1:52:32] contract at a little over $3,800.
Same thing, the not to exceed 5%
[1:52:38] increase in years two and three. And
then option three is to export documents
[1:52:43] out completely
uh for a onetime fee of $9,600.
[1:52:49] And uh then lastly, if we did options
one or two, uh we would need to pay for
[1:52:57] blocks of time because they would need
to teach us how to adequately use the
[1:53:02] system since apparently Stratex was not
a very good uh I don't know what it's
[1:53:09] called. They they basically sold the
product, didn't know how to work it very
[1:53:13] well. Let's put it that way. Okay. And
SR Business Group, that's what they
[1:53:17] specialize in. After
picking lots of brains and and
[1:53:22] thoroughly discussing this, staff
recommends highly recommends to go with
[1:53:27] option three and export export all the
documents out. They will be named how
[1:53:34] they were named in the system. So if
it's named wrong in the in uh docstar,
[1:53:40] it will also be named wrong in the
export. But at least we have an
[1:53:45] opportunity to change it. I mean, we
would have an opportunity either way.
[1:53:49] The reason for the export is to just
eliminate steps if we decrease the user
[1:53:54] licenses to the three-year contract for
the $3,800.
[1:53:58] Um, we would pretty much be, in my
opinion, prolonging uh a contract with
[1:54:04] somebody, paying an additional blocks of
hours for help, and then we'd be
[1:54:08] creating more steps to even get our
documents out because ultimately that's
[1:54:12] the goal. The goal is to get out all the
property files and put them into permit
[1:54:17] manager cloud and then the rest of the
documents we already have housed on our
[1:54:22] share file uh which is very well
organized. Um so uh that's what we
[1:54:29] recommend and I talked to each of you a
little bit about this uh individually to
[1:54:35] give you some background on it. Do you
have any questions for me right now?
[1:54:40] No, you said your staff and we recommend
option three.
[1:54:45] » Correct.
>> I make a motion that uh we
[1:54:51] approve option three to export documents
out at one time fee of $9,600.
[1:54:58] » I'll second a motion.
>> I ask a question.
[1:55:00] » Yeah. Discussion.
>> Sorry. Um,
[1:55:04] so I want to make sure when these things
get exported, they're in PDF, which then
[1:55:11] the PDF depending on how it's exported
is searchable. That's the first question
[1:55:16] that needs to be.
>> He told me that it when it exports, it
[1:55:21] will export out its native,
>> right? Whatever
[1:55:24] » you put in Word, it's coming out Word.
If it's PDF,
[1:55:26] » but I'm going to tell you everything was
scan. None of it should be Word. And
[1:55:30] there in lies maybe the issue because if
it was scanned with technology back then
[1:55:36] it's probably an image and it's not OCR.
So you can't search for words in the
[1:55:42] document,
>> right? No, it'll be whatever it was
[1:55:45] keyworded. It'll
>> I understand
[1:55:47] » the name and the title. Yeah.
>> So that's number one. And number two is
[1:55:53] » say you want everything in permanent
manager. But something caused me some
[1:55:57] confusion when you said, "Well, we've
got a shared folder," which suggests
[1:56:00] that's on the SharePoint site. So, is
that where the document resides on our
[1:56:06] SharePoint site?
>> No. No. Um, you're right. There is some
[1:56:10] confusion. What I'm talking about is all
of our other stuff. Like, for instance,
[1:56:14] your minutes, that's not property
related. So we have a lot of documents
[1:56:19] that were was scanned into
uh Docstar that didn't have to be uh a
[1:56:26] property related document. I think
that's what I was trying to explain.
[1:56:29] Yep. So the end result if you get all
these things exported regardless of
[1:56:33] whether it's property related or minutes
or some other document permit manager is
[1:56:39] for all the properties that reside
within the township and all the
[1:56:42] information my house you know house that
type of deal
[1:56:47] » correct
>> the industrial buildings
[1:56:49] » right
>> and so when you get all these extracts
[1:56:52] you're going to go in and pull up file
number one oh this is the XYZ property
[1:56:56] let me go into permit manager and I'm
now going going to load whether that's a
[1:57:00] PDF or a word file or whatever I'm going
to load that in the permit manager. So
[1:57:05] when I go in the permit manager and ask
about XYZ address everything
[1:57:09] » is there.
>> Correct. That's correct.
[1:57:11] » So the worst thing that happens is you
export all this stuff out and it's going
[1:57:16] to take
>> staff time to ultimately push it in
[1:57:20] which could take a couple of months to
go through
[1:57:23] » it. It'll take years to get through all
that. It's over 27,000 documents.
[1:57:29] » Yeah.
>> Unless you want to come in part time
[1:57:32] » or if you allow us to
>> hire figure out.
[1:57:39] » Um, all right. That answers my question.
>> Yep.
[1:57:44] Um,
okay.
[1:57:46] » Do you have any other questions?
>> Any further discussion?
[1:57:50] » I don't have any.
>> I'll call for the vote. All in favor of
[1:57:53] the motion signify by saying I. I
[snorts]
[1:57:59] » Okay. Correspondence. Do you have any?
>> Uh, no correspondence.
[1:58:04] » Is there any public comments at this
time?
[1:58:08] » Somewhere.
[1:58:20] » Yeah, that was done.
>> We talked about it and it was go
[1:58:25] We knew it was not going to be good.
>> Yeah,
[1:58:29] » it was develop
>> I I remember that that it was I'm sure
[1:58:35] it was the oaks down there. Um
>> and I think the the mailboxes came into
[1:58:42] play on that. But uh
>> I I guess we could always always you
[1:58:48] know decide that hey the uh the north
side of the street road parking or west
[1:58:54] side or whatever we could do that but u
again it comes back to enforcement.
[1:59:02] So uh I I got to ask chief what do you
do when you have a fire truck going down
[1:59:07] through there and you got to get to the
fire. You just take off mirrors.
[1:59:11] » Push.
>> Push. Yeah. Okay.
[1:59:21] » Okay.
[1:59:32] » Any other comments?
I'll move on. I'll make a motion that we
[1:59:36] bill pay all bills.
>> Second.
[1:59:40] » All in favor?
>> I. Supervisor speak
[1:59:47] I was remiss at last month's meeting to
thank all the hard work staff does when
[1:59:52] it comes to zoning enforcement and
things of that nature.
[1:59:58] So I appreciate what you do every every
day.
[2:00:04] And then just a reminder that budget
season's coming up budget meeting O S O
[2:00:09] S O S O S O S O S O S O S O S O S O S O
S O S O S O S O S O S O S O S O S 20
[2:00:14] » Okay,
uh Pendot just came out with recently
[2:00:18] with our new 12year plan. I went through
everything in your county. I didn't see
[2:00:23] anything. I don't think I missed it. I'm
saying about Route 83, whether that
[2:00:26] would be under the 12ear plan or not.
But there are two things that will
[2:00:31] affect East Manchester Township.
One is the Cadoras Farnest Road over
[2:00:37] Cadoras Creek and East Manchester and
Helen Township. Uh consist of bridge
[2:00:42] improvement, replacement, rehabilitation
or preservation on Kador's Furnish Road,
[2:00:49] excuse [clears throat] me.
>> [cough]
[2:00:51] » The second one is uh resurfacing
of North George Street. It will be from
[2:00:59] Woodland View Road in Manchester
Township to Sunset Drive in East
[2:01:05] Manchester Township, which is right near
McDonald's there.
[2:01:09] These are under their 12-year plan.
Who knows? And secondly, I was reviewing
[2:01:16] the uh the minutes of the burrows and
saw in Burough their July
[2:01:24] 14th meeting, they received their report
from fire company. That's fire company.
[2:01:34] » So in that 102 plan, what about the
bridge that's going in?
[2:01:40] Shouldn't that be on? Oh, I think that's
already
[2:01:43] » already.
>> Yeah. Yeah. These are the future
[2:01:45] projects.
>> Okay.
[2:01:46] » Yeah.
>> So, no exit 26.
[2:01:50] » Nope. And then, yeah, I didn't see any.
I mean, the only thing they're talking
[2:01:53] about on Church Road is the right hand
turn lane when you get up the
[2:01:59] South Pl.
But the whole crux of the problem is
[2:02:03] they only have two lanes crossing over
83.
[2:02:07] So, it's not going to help much when you
get up there and still have to sit on
[2:02:11] the bridge until you can get up to the
light to turn right or left.
[2:02:19] » The only comment I have a question for
Shane. Uh, you're going through a lot of
[2:02:23] CDL training right now. Driving nuts.
>> Yeah, it is. They uh they passed their I
[2:02:33] guess training course if you want to
call it that and now we're just waiting
[2:02:36] to hear from the instructor when they
fit in. So
[2:02:38] » Okay. So we will have plow operators for
winter.
[2:02:42] » I hope so. They still got to pass. So
>> Shane, you want to put a plug in for
[2:02:46] Touch a Truck this weekend?
>> Yeah.
[2:02:48] » Uh yeah, this weekend uh Touch Truck the
Minon is at the middle school up here.
[2:02:55] Um it's for childhood cancer. Um it's
five $5 I believe for a child. Yeah. And
[2:03:02] adults are free. Uh if you have
children, bring them up. It's all kinds
[2:03:05] of equipment. Send the chief's going to
be there. We're have to back the kids
[2:03:10] playing on and skip over and all kinds
of things. There's all kinds of stuff
[2:03:13] there. So 2 to 6 this Saturday the 12th.
>> And I see you're accumulating a lot of
[2:03:20] giveaways for the kiddies.
>> I did this year. Yep. Thanks to our
[2:03:24] rangers for that. So yeah, we have kids
hats and everything like that building.
[2:03:28] So y
>> do you want to maybe mention something
[2:03:30] about the night work on Willow Springs?
>> Uh starting this Sunday, Willow Springs
[2:03:39] will be getting paid
from Board Road down Willow Springs.
[2:03:44] It's going to be night work from 6:00 p.
p.m. to 6:00 a.m. The road will not be
[2:03:50] closed. it will still be flagged for
allowing traffic through. Um, but we
[2:03:56] might want to real
[2:04:07] » I put it on the website
>> a truck on the website.
[2:04:11] » I did not get that on the website. As
soon as he was saying about it,
[2:04:16] » forgot about that. I don't know. I think
we need to start tracking.
[2:04:20] » Wow. I think I think someone needs an
assistant. How about that?
[2:04:25] » So, Shane, uh the detour. If you're
coming if you're coming north on Science
[2:04:30] View and you turn at the new light, go
back towards my house, Canal Road. Okay.
[2:04:36] You're coming up there and it says
detour
[2:04:39] route. And then there's a sign up on
Canal Road. No detour. But the detour
[2:04:44] route send people up that cross the
bridge up through here.
[2:04:50] » The detour route we just showed.
>> No.
[2:04:53] » Oh,
>> Locust Point up there
[2:04:59] and it
>> Yeah. So, you're saying it's sending
[2:05:04] them back like past Unifi and down
across the bridge is what you're saying.
[2:05:09] » Yeah. that that is a detour route
because there are businesses there. So
[2:05:14] that is where that detour they would
loop the whole way around. I know it
[2:05:19] seems weird because you're like why are
they sending traffic that way? The roads
[2:05:22] [clears throat] closed.
>> They're sending them the whole way
[2:05:24] around to get them to that business.
>> Okay.
[2:05:26] » So it has to be posted that way. Am I
correct in saying that, Byron?
[2:05:30] » Yeah.
>> Yeah. Yep. Yep.
[2:05:33] » Okay. That clears that up.
>> Uh Andy, do we need executive? All
[2:05:38] right. I don't need it for anything
else.
[2:05:40] » Okay.
>> I will make a motion we adjourn the
[2:05:43] meeting.
>> Second.
[2:05:45] » All in favor?
>> I.