[0:04] tonight. Stand and join us in the
pledge.
[0:09] » I pledge algiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the
[0:14] republic for which it stands. One nation
[clears throat] under God, indivisible,
[0:20] with liberty and justice for all.
[0:34] All right, Madame Mayor, I make a motion
to approve the agenda. I'll sign.
[0:39] » It's been moved by Council Member
Renard, second by Council Member Allen
[0:42] to approve tonight's agenda as
presented. Any discussion? All right.
[0:47] Hearing none, all those in favor say I.
I.
[0:49] » All those opposed, none. Motion pass.
Okay. Consent agenda.
[0:56] Didn't
[0:59] see anything.
>> Madame Mayor, I move to approve the
[1:03] consent agenda.
>> I'll second.
[1:06] » So moved by Council Member Renard,
second by Council Member Allen to
[1:08] approve tonight's consent agenda. Any
discussion?
[1:12] Hearing none. All those in favor say I.
>> I.
[1:14] » All those opposed, same sign. Motion
pass. All right. So, next is public
[1:19] comment. We're making a little change to
that. So, when you come up, you will be
[1:22] given five minutes. Please state your
full name and your address. Uh, council
[1:27] members have been instructed to not
respond to anyone speaking during public
[1:31] comment and this will be the only time
during the meeting that the public are
[1:35] asked or given the opportunity to speak.
So, Michael, we've got you first.
[1:41] » Thank you.
>> All right. Yeah.
[1:46] final 101 street
[1:52] or 16
[1:57] but um lately has been the first
time I ever been I believe the street is
[2:05] even um
I've always that city was responsible um
[2:12] for in the streets um
friend of mine told me, "Hey, you know,
[2:18] when some of the ordinances said,
"How
[2:23] responsible for deleting the street
area?"
[2:30] And I thought, well, that seems kind of
a gun. Um, city takes care of everything
[2:35] else. The snow um they have streets
um maintenance paws, whatever on the
[2:43] streets, but um I haven't looked at the
u
[2:49] the ratio of age groups in El, but I I
would assume that there are at least 60%
[2:58] elderly people. I mean what I call
elderly 55 and above maybe 60. I would
[3:04] assume that. Okay. Um, but do we really
want people who are on disability or
[3:12] retired due to health issues with
limited hearing,
[3:17] limited sights, um, limited mobility,
going out into the city streets to risk
[3:24] their safety
in the streets, managing to reach in the
[3:29] streets. Um I I mean it just seems to me
like it would be beneficial for citizens
[3:37] of the community if the city could could
uh change the ordinance there and uh in
[3:44] consideration for owners generations and
um and and handle the situation. We do
[3:51] have city crew from the facility that I
do take care of some places around parks
[3:58] and stuff. They mo weedy stuff like
that. Why can't we use that same city
[4:03] crew to handle this the weeds in the
streets? I mean it's I mean to me it's
[4:10] the cheap labor from the facility. I
thought
[4:14] um but
to to
[4:20] require residents to be on the streets
and I've seen some people driving down
[4:25] streets. They don't pay attention.
um somebody's going to get hurt and and
[4:30] and and trying to be done around and
that's that's not going to be a very
[4:37] good publicity at all for the city or
something like that came up and I just
[4:41] wanted to bring it up and leave it for
discussion and um you can do what you
[4:47] want to do with it but um that's just
mainly what I want to bring up and uh
[4:54] you know concern for our needs
presidents who really can't get that
[4:59] done like that. So on their own maybe
they can't afford to pay somebody
[5:07] limited incomes
and just get by
[5:13] that's
all I have to discuss.
[5:18] » Thank you Michaels.
[5:25] Yeah, I guess this gives us the
opportunity if we want to put that on
[5:28] next month's meeting's agenda.
[clears throat]
[5:31] » Comes in the me side.
>> Uh let's move on to unfinished business
[5:38] discussion of creating a special sales
tax to finance city facility
[5:42] improvements.
Madame Mayor, council members, of
[5:45] course, you brought this up a month or
so ago and um and had a charge of
[5:51] different neighboring communities and
everything else. And you know, just
[5:54] rehash locally, you know, we have the 6
and 12% state sales tax. The city has a
[5:59] 1%
general fund sales tax. The county has a
[6:04] 1% fund general sales tax. However, as
I've told you before, the county's
[6:10] general's fund sale general sales tax is
split between the entities in the five
[6:16] cities in the county based on the
population. There's a ratio statewide
[6:21] ratio half for population and half for
the amount of taxes levied. Um, we
[6:27] receive I believe it's 30 some% of the
county sales tax. Um, and everybody says
[6:32] why would the city get county sales tax?
Well, last I looked, pizza is in the
[6:37] city and in the county both or pick any
business. Um, and you know, and the old
[6:43] rational statewise was is that, you
know, even though county tax dollars are
[6:48] used this year for different things, it
is the cities that provide streets and
[6:54] maintenance and all the other things
that you have. So, that's that's the
[6:58] same way. It hasn't changed. Um and then
and then you know a few years ago the
[7:03] city has a 1/4% sales tax that was
renewed two years ago or came in last
[7:08] year u for debt service and of course
you have the one county of the county
[7:13] still floating out there that was
approved last year. Now, since that's
[7:17] not a general sales tax, it'd have to be
approved by the state legislature. And
[7:21] you I told you that story how um certain
person wanted to give the three and not
[7:28] the three in western Kansas and then the
state the house said no, we're not going
[7:32] to finally and usually that's been a
slam dunk. I don't think anybody knew of
[7:36] one that ever got turned down until this
year and there was three of them. So,
[7:40] all six got turned down. So, I don't
know what the status is. I have had
[7:43] different discussions with different
people. So we'll see what happens there.
[7:46] So be another quarter%. You know what
initially I put out there with T is is
[7:51] staff too is is we talk about some of
the projects we have to do and you
[7:56] either pay them with property taxes or
you pay them with sales taxes. And of
[7:59] course you know we are going to our
stability the revenue rate this year
[8:03] again. Um I think we need to for a lot
of reasons. you know, um sure rates went
[8:07] up. We have to tiff the gap and
everything else, but you know, we know
[8:10] we have a $350, $400,000
um bill staring us at the baseball parks
[8:16] with the power holes out there. Ron has
talked about those with you and of
[8:20] course, you know, back at this building
and um our city clerk's been trying to
[8:25] get grants to replace the windows. I
mean, they're 60 years old. You know,
[8:29] there's always talk about since this
this town is short of gymnasiums, he's
[8:34] putting AC out there and which means
we're preparing everything else and you
[8:39] probably could do better. We talked
about some police department, but but I
[8:42] would think we struggled on facilities.
So to put a sales tax in place and Cra
[8:48] and I have talked u we would do a
resolution at the next meeting. Uh the
[8:52] council says yes, we want to put it on
the ballot and then it would go from
[8:57] before September 1, it would go to the
county clerk and it would appear on the
[9:01] November I believe November 3rd ballot.
I think that's the dated. Uh so that's
[9:07] the process. Um, I think it's a good
process, you know, and I think the
[9:13] cities are going to have to start
looking, especially with all the talk
[9:16] and all you have to do is watch every
political ad on TV right now. It's about
[9:20] property taxes and one they're going to
change revenue sources. One would be
[9:25] sales tax and two would be um use fees
and that's another story for them taxes
[9:32] and and we've looked at those. you know,
a year ago the s the city um council um
[9:38] changed the way we charge at the pool
and everybody [clears throat] thought,
[9:41] "Oh my god, it's going to be the end of
the world." It hasn't been. And you
[9:46] know, another thing we throw in there
was this platform. I mean, I think we
[9:48] could be kind of focused on those kind
of things there. Is quarter% enough?
[9:53] Probably. You know, right now quarter%
takes in about 15 110 to 120,000 a year.
[10:01] Um, I don't know if want to push up to a
half. That might be a little high. I
[10:06] think you try it and get a taste to the
public. I mean, that's that's kind of my
[10:09] recommendation. So, um, if you'll move
forward, let me know. We'll we'll have
[10:15] our city attorney do a resolution for
the next meeting, but you know, or you
[10:19] want you think we ought to do do a sales
tax or for whole different ideas have
[10:24] that discussion.
>> So, so Mr. ridicul
[10:28] if we do a sales tax that will not
affect property taxes. Correct. Because
[10:33] it's sales tax everything you buy. The
good part about it is is that you know
[10:40] again I draw about the old C district
that just came off last January one. So
[10:47] and I know I believe Coastal Market was
a C district if I remember right. sales
[10:52] tax there went down 1% or was pay 1% tax
it went down now we go back up a quarter
[11:02] » um you know and there's arguments of
course you know when you go to another
[11:06] town and buy something um you're
probably paying a sales tax and you're
[11:11] financing something in that community
um though it's not been done here and I
[11:17] don't advocate by any stretch of
imagination but there is communities in
[11:20] western Kansas that are now using
working with the school district because
[11:25] school district can't let any sales tax
is the city is lev sales tax to get a
[11:29] school improvement done. Um I know Ray
HBC administrator they did that last
[11:34] year they did a bond issue and says you
know bond issue and then also sales tax
[11:40] on the side and you know and it was a
combination again I think we look at
[11:45] property taxes and other income tax
sources you know and everyone says let's
[11:49] cut taxes well why do you want to cut
services we can take the ball likes down
[11:53] and play afternoon baseball the rest
forever not sure if this committee wants
[11:57] to do that or you know any other items
Well, I know as a citizen I think I'd
[12:04] rather pay a sales tax than to find out
my property taxes when well the nice
[12:10] thing about sales tax is if you buy
local you know you are and and sales tax
[12:14] have grown in communities because of the
uh we're catching more internet sales.
[12:21] So when you buy something off of Amazon
it's delivered here. Well, if you go to
[12:28] the Nebraska For Racetrack in Kansas
City and you buy a couch and it's
[12:33] delivered to Ellsworth, Kansas, Kansas
gets the local sales tax.
[12:39] Now, if you throw the back of your
pickup, you may have one there because
[12:43] we don't have any major car dealerships
here anymore like we did years ago. So,
[12:48] you have those those communities and the
car sales tax is another issue itself.
[12:54] So bottom line, you're just going to ask
us to approve to put it on the ballot so
[12:58] that the citizens
>> Yeah. You can't you can't make a tax
[13:01] happen. The only power you as everybody
has is citizens, we want you to look at
[13:06] it. Every sales tax, every local sales
tax, you do not state sales tax. local
[13:12] sales tax has to be approved by voters
>> because when people do this our sales
[13:16] tax too I says but if your friends you
and your friends voted for well they you
[13:22] know in sales tax the biggest sales tax
I saw passed in the August election was
[13:27] actually a one% in Engles camp because
Engles is not very big but that's how
[13:32] they're going to be funding some water
they're all doable but I think with just
[13:37] the needs we have you know the ballpark
lights are staring at us And and I think
[13:41] we all know that it's not a matter of
if they're going to fall down, it's when
[13:48] and with the liability we have out
there, you know, then and having good
[13:52] strong programs. we do um that became
the need at least a need and then we
[13:57] start other things in here and of course
um you know issue in this building or
[14:03] could be energy cost also but then if
you go to this building
[14:08] need to look at that Tim you know
because it is a a cornerstone of the
[14:11] community and once in a while it's good
to do things for your community I mean
[14:16] yeah you got to do streets and you got
to do curb got those things
[14:21] but also quality programs are important
to your community as well.
[14:26] » So, do we need to have this more like
what it's going to go for or can we use
[14:32] so people might want to vote for we
don't how we
[14:35] » No, we have to be pretty narrow. We
would call community and park right now.
[14:40] I think the word um city buildings and
park facilities
[14:46] and and people have next and Paul and I
can sit and I can narrow it down a
[14:51] little bit. But um and that money can be
used for that only.
[14:55] » Okay.
>> Just like right now the you know we
[14:58] cannot use the sales tax right now to
um
[15:03] buy a mower for the department. We can
use it to pay debt on some things but
[15:09] that's it. So yeah. Yeah. Sales taxes
general sales tax all goes to the
[15:15] general funds and general fund us is
wide open there.
[15:20] » So worth a shot.
>> Yeah.
[15:23] » Yeah.
>> We'll have a resolution next meeting
[15:27] then.
>> Great.
[15:29] » Thanks.
>> Okay. Next new business discussion of
[15:34] the 2027 budget.
>> Oh, it'll be a discussion. We talk about
[15:38] via RNR. I'm working on it. We'll have
the hearing on the 14th of September.
[15:44] Um, you know, and I think we can fit
everything in. Um, there's a lot of give
[15:49] and takes because you got to realize
budget is not guaranteed spending.
[15:56] Budget is budget authority. revenue
still has to come in. If sales tax
[16:02] doesn't come in, if if um if our water,
you know, utility transfer from, you
[16:08] know, water to, you know, we have to
franchise fees we have from all of our
[16:13] utilities plus for natural gas and
everything else. If that lowers, you
[16:16] have less money, you can't spend it, but
you create the authority. Of course, we
[16:20] know we have the discussion on the
contracts right now. We're talking
[16:24] about, you know, how that happens. to
put that in there and then how will we
[16:28] spend the money but we'll leave the
authority how you spend it will become
[16:31] the process next year but you have to
have the authority because you don't
[16:34] have authority you can't spend and I
hate to amend budgets I mean that's an
[16:40] allville ism because you know have
enough money in there spend now grant if
[16:44] we ever have something n a good natural
disaster will break your budget big time
[16:50] [clears throat] and there's ways to get
around that of course but um let's not
[16:53] play on that so let's say anything real
big there. Um, you know, I think we got
[16:58] the fifth issue that that coming off is
going to put basically another $110,000
[17:03] at the city conference, which right now
my goal again as we transition to new
[17:09] administrator, my recommendation is is
use that to help finance
[17:15] um the third street project.
>> Yeah. So, I'm going to ask you how how
[17:20] is that? There's still things, you know,
and we're not going to go to get funding
[17:24] yet because I don't want to borrow money
I don't need yet. Yeah.
[17:27] » Because no sense paying interest when
you don't need the money. But yeah,
[17:30] we'll get out of place. I think that's
timing is great on that one there. You
[17:35] know, um that was one reason why I want
to push to get rid of TIF because one
[17:38] time it was good. Secondly, current
legislation allows TIFF to, you know,
[17:45] the city people have been paying these
taxes, they can keep them. some of the
[17:49] stuff on the property tax last spring
would have thrown that away. That'd be
[17:54] just like we've been paying this for
years. We got the tiff done, but the
[17:57] city you can't use 110,000 you didn't
get it. It goes away. Well, I understand
[18:02] the total property taxes, but really,
you know, you still got still got to
[18:07] maintain your communities.
So,
[18:11] there's a process [clears throat] there
is some method behind some of this
[18:13] matters once in a while. Once in a
while. So, we'll keep moving forward and
[18:18] keep you updated and we'll have it
published at the end of August and then
[18:24] hearing on the 14th and again we look at
RNR so we know it's going to be 70
[18:29] 77 mill whatever it is um of course you
got up there with my RNRs I got a second
[18:37] statement my families did today
after tax far and county their taxes are
[18:43] all going down but since some of the
agencies have that are in our hearings,
[18:48] they have to send the state send out
notice. So, you know, on that quarter
[18:53] ground where I have my all right in
Brooks County, they probably the state
[18:56] of Kansas and the counties probably
spend in excess of a couple hundred
[19:01] dollars set up our our notice to tell us
our taxes are going down.
[19:05] I did send that to way master
[19:09] because they want us to spending money
they need as well.
[19:13] » Yeah.
So our budget hearing is the 14th at
[19:19] 5:30 or different time
>> during the meeting. I I've also moved
[19:23] and again this you know I think it's a
good process moved to hearings in in the
[19:27] meeting because the problem in the past
you've had hearings ahead of the meeting
[19:31] there's no minutes and they were kept
the same and I just like during the
[19:36] meeting now I have been criticized in
the past let's say where we said the
[19:40] hearing starts at 5:30 and it was 5:36
when we got to the hearing and somebody
[19:45] complained we're going to win that
battle so don't worry about it. Yeah.
[19:50] All
right. Anything else for new business?
[19:54] All right. Let's move on to department
heads
[19:57] that
[20:01] Murphy.
[20:09] You want me to move closer?
>> Good evening.
[20:13] » So,
got a couple issues. So, I want to
[20:17] address you guys with uh we had since
I've been here, we got our first call of
[20:23] uh public urination
never responded to. Then we found out
[20:28] that we don't have a city ordinance
for public urination
[20:34] or defecation. So, I'm here to ask
your feelings on
[20:40] having our city attorney
ordinance. K is that they didn't have
[20:44] anything?
>> No.
[20:47] » No, we looked uh I talked to our city
attorney and he thought we had one of
[20:53] course he looked
so
[20:57] before it becomes a problem.
I'd like some input from from you all
[21:03] get a consensus from you guys do that.
Just you know city did not have nor till
[21:10] 2017 again found the same
>> everybody probably thought they did
[21:15] » this time courtesy don't do that
>> I just still walk out the street naked
[21:20] can't they
[21:23] » right I mean
>> give me a call when you do that
[21:31] » nobody wants to see that
you're really
[21:36] The second topic I have this is uh yeah
so I have fielded several complaints
[21:44] plus our office fielded several
complaints on the ebikes.
[21:52] So, I didn't know
I've seen them around town
[21:59] and state statute has
they treat them as like a bicycle.
[22:05] So, there's really no legal way of
taking care of this. As long as they got
[22:09] pedals, it is a considered bicycle.
There's three different classifications
[22:15] of the ebikes.
Class three, they run 40 mph.
[22:20] State statute says that at class three
you have to be 16 years of age.
[22:30] Oh
[22:35] yeah 16 years of age
class three
[22:40] ebike.
[22:43] One way you can distinguish this class
three is by stopping
[22:48] determining class rates.
So again, I'd like to get a consensus
[22:54] with the council
that we can start drafting ordinance for
[23:00] the need by ext.
[23:05] I mean, I've already witnessed one child
that crossed first in Kansas that almost
[23:11] didn't make it.
Um just a quick question. I would assume
[23:17] that to ebikes also have to follow
posted speed limits or or do they not?
[23:23] Do they fall under posted speed limits?
>> They are considered a bicycles.
[23:27] » So So even if I have a regular bicycle,
if I can get over 30, I'm okay. And
[23:32] they're considered bicycles, so they are
not. Okay. I just
[23:35] » And these and these kids again, I mean,
a lot of these kids, they're supposed to
[23:39] stay off the sidewalks, but like a
regular kid on a bicycle, a lot of times
[23:44] they don't. I mean, [clears throat]
they're on and off sidewalks and really
[23:47] nobody paid attention to them. But with
these ebikes, ebikes, they're more on
[23:51] the on the sidewalks now than they ever
have, especially down downtown.
[23:58] Um,
so
[24:02] I mean some of the options we have on we
can ban them in town which is really
[24:07] harsh.
>> Yeah.
[24:09] » Or we just put some regulations out
there.
[24:12] » Yeah, we can put regulations.
>> Sorry,
[24:14] » we can't have regulations.
>> I think you can enforce it.
[24:19] » Just like uh I mean Okay. So with a
child under the age of 16 and it's a
[24:24] parent falls back on the parents. That's
where you go with that's where you go
[24:27] with forcing regulations.
>> But it's just the class three ones
[24:32] for all of them.
>> Well,
[24:34] the class 3 is the ones I'm worried
about. That's the 40 mph ones cuz that's
[24:37] the one 16
>> and then but you got these other
[24:43] do we regulate for these ebikes for the
class 2.
[24:48] » Um
I mean these these ebikes are getting to
[24:53] where you don't even have to hit the
pedals. Yeah,
[24:55] » you just push off and you're going.
>> If I may add, Chief, can you let me talk
[25:02] for Chief raising his hand?
>> Yeah. Um, so the other side of that age
[25:07] issue is I've served some much older
people, almost bikes,
[25:14] » and they're using them because they're
unable to use other forms of
[25:20] transportation.
>> I was going with that, too. And uh and I
[25:23] I was coming up and I saw one coming
down 8th Street one day uh and cut
[25:30] through the American Family Law to avoid
the intersection and then blew the light
[25:36] down Third Street and they were using
these because they don't have the mode
[25:40] of transportation
or they don't want to get caught with
[25:47] the possibility of maybe having one too
many when they go run flickers,
[25:52] » right?
>> So, I don't know if we classify them.
[25:57] Can we reclassify what they [snorts]
have they are?
[26:00] » I don't think you can reclassify them
the actual ebike itself. I don't I don't
[26:04] believe you can reclassify the ebike
itself,
[26:08] but on a class 3 you can make it to
where you have to have a valid driver's
[26:12] license.
[26:15] » Vehicle can.
>> Yeah,
[26:17] » I'm trying to follow the stat. Yeah,
that's I do believe I read one one city
[26:22] did classify you had to have a class a
valid class be 16 and a valid driver's
[26:27] license for a class 3.
>> That's not a motor vehicle,
[26:30] » right?
>> I think wouldn't that be a little
[26:32] » It's like a core
>> because a moped uh
[26:35] » under 50 cc
>> under Yeah. 49 cc.
[26:39] » Do you have to have a What do you got to
have for that? I'm pretty sure the state
[26:43] statute says that on even on class
threes uh cannot require a driver's
[26:49] license title or insurance. Is that
Yeah, I I know they've went back and
[26:54] forth on that's what
they are not considered motor vehicles.
[27:00] uh insurance license and title cannot be
required on those but it does you do
[27:08] have to be 16 but it gets into how do
you prove your how old you are have an
[27:13] ID your license so that kind of gets
messy there but uh we can as a city
[27:22] override the state uh requirements on
that but we can put additional
[27:26] regulations now as far as you were
saying with the
[27:30] um traffic enforcements, bicycles, even
though it's not a motor vehicle, it's
[27:33] operated on the road. Still has standard
traffic laws. You can't blow through
[27:36] stop signs. You can't blow through the
stop light. You have to stop. You have
[27:40] to do just like you would if you were in
a vehicle because you're operating on
[27:44] the property. So, or on the city
property on the street. So, uh, as far
[27:49] as traffic enforcement goes, and I would
even you'd have to say, well, if they're
[27:54] running 40 mph in a 20 mph zone on an
ebike,
[28:00] that's still a standard traffic offense.
So, um you could be the officers could
[28:06] address that as well, but um it it is an
area that uh obviously we need to look
[28:13] into more to make sure that we don't run
a foul with these state statutes when
[28:17] we're drafted. We've had some initial
communications about it. I think that uh
[28:21] there are some good regulations that
could be put in place. A lot of them
[28:25] focus more on the safety standard. Not
saying that we don't want ebikes. You
[28:29] don't want people to utilize ebikes for
any reason. You just if they're going to
[28:33] make sure they're using the problem
related using them safe safely for
[28:36] themselves and for other vehicles on the
way.
[28:39] » Could that be something we look into is
maybe putting out something on hey you
[28:44] know these are like a bikes you can't
ride on the sidewalks or can they ride
[28:48] » the educational part of it? Yeah.
helmet.
[28:53] » That's where there's no there's no state
requirement on helmets on bicycles. So
[28:57] that's where we'd have to come back into
local regulations on whether we want to
[29:02] require as part of our ordinance or part
of the local regulations that everyone
[29:06] wears a helmet that anyone under a
certain age wears a you know you get it
[29:10] to to those types of things. Um, and
that's why I think the local regulations
[29:15] are more emphasizing the the safety of
it as opposed to the actual use of it.
[29:22] » Dan, did you still have some comments?
>> Yes, I did. Just a clarification about
[29:26] Thank you. for the helmets and the
safety gear. Uh, what did you just say
[29:33] about that? Did you
>> uh to my knowledge and again this is
[29:36] these are relatively new. So, I I'm
going once I get an idea of what uh the
[29:41] council's um how you're wanting to
proceed on this, I'll be able to dive
[29:46] deeper into it and get you a more
informed opinion. As this kind of became
[29:49] an issue in about the last week, so I'm
playing a little bit of catchup, but uh
[29:54] to my knowledge, there's not a state
requirement for wearing a helmet uh on a
[30:00] bicycle. And because these ebikes aren't
considered bicycles, that helmet or
[30:05] safety requirement would have to come
through a local regulation as opposed to
[30:10] relying on a state statute where uh law
enforcement could uh enforce that
[30:15] without council action. And and it's
interesting uh chief that this has came
[30:21] up uh because I did write a letter to
the editor about some observations that
[30:27] I made uh with I mean I'm seeing kids
they can't be over 12 years old and and
[30:35] they're on those moped scooters and they
have skill these folks are riding.
[30:43] » Oh yeah. and they're cutting across
parking lots and I don't think they're
[30:48] on the side of the street. I think
they're more in the street, right? And
[30:55] the clients we're getting to, they're
jumping from the sidewalks to the
[30:58] streets. People are standing on their
brakes to avoid hitting them or the fear
[31:03] of hitting, I shouldn't say, but the
fear of hitting them. Um,
[31:10] like I said, the one kid I saw, I mean,
he didn't even look when he jumped
[31:13] across Kansas. He just rode right across
Kansas.
[31:16] » I got there's some same kids go through
the intersection intersection
[31:23] » and they don't even look. They just buzz
through there. What about licensing the
[31:28] bikes? No time requirements either
because they're not vehicle but I mean
[31:33] do I know there
are
[31:38] » you can do you're talking about
>> yes
[31:42] if you did that at least you'd have some
handle on who's got what
[31:48] » does it have a serial number on it or
you'd have be able to track it
[31:54] » I [clears throat] think you could uh do
by her heads
[31:59] You can't separate out ebikines from any
you'd have to say everyone in town has
[32:04] to come in and
>> ferment their bike.
[32:06] » Well, I know it's not a good idea.
>> We had those
[32:09] » We had those back in the 60s.
>> Yeah,
[32:13] » you had
>> I agreed that I don't think we should do
[32:16] that. I could see if if we had
like bike parking or something and you
[32:22] had areas where there were large bike
racks that people were using, you want
[32:26] to make sure that the bikes were
permitted for use in the city, something
[32:29] like that. I could see a permitting
system being used. U but again, this
[32:34] that is something that would be up to
council to decide u if if that's the
[32:38] route you want to go. I think the
biggest issue that that's going to come
[32:41] is going to be, you know, obviously some
of these kids look way under 16. Uh but
[32:46] it's Not only being under 16, it's also
knowing what classification of bike
[32:50] they're using, which is difficult to
know without actually stopping the bike
[32:56] and saying, "Hey, what kind of bike are
you want?"
[32:57] » Well, it's only a matter of time here
before somebody gets hurt,
[33:01] unfortunately. But and that's what we're
trying to fix.
[33:04] » Yeah.
>> And I'm just trying to figure out a way
[33:06] that we can do that and still try to
maintain our state.
[33:12] » And in uh quite a few other city, this
is nothing. It's new for Kansas, but as
[33:17] far as municipalities regulating ebikes,
it's this is not the first city to
[33:22] attempt to do it. There is a lot of
information out there. Everyone's doing
[33:25] a little separate little bit different
with separate ways just because what
[33:29] works for Kansas City might not work for
Wall, which might not work for
[33:33] elsewhere, you know. uh do do what works
for your locality, but uh there is quite
[33:40] a bit of information out there and uh
wider provided me with some as well. Um
[33:46] just regarding um different
city ordinances that have already been
[33:52] put into place. So, we're not
reinventing the wheel here. It's just
[33:55] you have to make sure what it's what we
put together is what council wants and
[34:01] you know what you guys feel work for us.
scooters. Would this encompass scooters
[34:07] also?
>> It could um not the ebike ordinance
[34:14] itself refers specifically to electronic
bicycles which a scooter is not an
[34:19] electronic bicycle
but it could be the ordinance could be
[34:24] drafted to include those. Just you got
to make you got to make sure it's clear
[34:29] for law enforcement. They they've got to
know. And for individuals operating it,
[34:34] they want to know when they're out
there, if their kids are out there, what
[34:37] they need for their kids uh to be legal,
how to do it properly. Because the idea
[34:41] is you don't want to be don't want to be
writing a bunch of kids tickets. You
[34:44] don't want to be writing a bunch of
parents tickets because of what kids
[34:47] have done. That that that's not I don't
think that's the purpose of it.
[34:51] » You just don't you don't want kids hurt.
You don't want them killed. You want to
[34:54] make sure that everyone's on the same
page with that. Let's start off with
[34:58] education first and go to schools,
educating kids first. Okay? I mean,
[35:02] that's that's not my priority. But if we
had something to go by, something we
[35:07] drafted up to go by, hey, look, this is
this is new. Understand it's new. This
[35:13] is why
>> and I'm glad you brought that. Uh we've
[35:17] had, like I said, we've had
communication.
[35:20] My position is really on anything uh
that we bring before council. I'd like
[35:24] council to give an opinion on it before
uh you know we spend a bunch of time
[35:28] putting together uh regulations or
proposed ordinance that you come back
[35:32] and say well no we're not interested in
doing that. It just kind of wasted
[35:35] everybody's time. So um I think if
that's something that the council's
[35:39] interested in uh we can get her together
and we'll work with uh city
[35:43] administrator uh Dinkl as well to uh get
that on a future agenda and uh allow you
[35:50] guys opportunity to review it.
I
[35:55] » like I heard you.
>> I mean, I don't think we need to make
[35:58] more law and we don't we already have
enough. Just talk to your kids and say
[36:02] if they're jumping the curb, say quit it
and I'll take the bike away. That's the
[36:06] only easy your school does probably.
>> Yeah.
[36:09] » Yeah. We have more parents like that.
>> Yeah. Well,
[36:13] » I don't know what you're going to What
are you going to do? Ban them? I mean,
[36:16] that's not I don't want to see that.
>> I don't want to ask Don't do that. It
[36:22] isn't, damn. I think it's if the city
wants to add additional restrictions
[36:26] regarding their operation is really what
it comes down to. And it's not saying
[36:30] don't use them. It's if you're going to
use them, you need helmets. You need to
[36:35] use this or um just to put some more
safety precautions in there. But also,
[36:43] this is why we talk to council first. If
council's opinion is no, it's just an
[36:47] education issue. you want to try going
the education route, that's up to you
[36:52] guys if you want to do that or not. Um,
but what we're saying is the way it
[36:56] currently is stated there really the
only restriction that the uh city police
[37:02] can enforce is if they see a 16 under 16
year old on a class 3 ebike. If they
[37:09] show that then that is violation of
state statute then that can be
[37:13] addressed. outside of that regarding
ebikes other than standard traffic
[37:17] enforcement
is kind of technical.
[37:25] Is the city liable?
What I mean is if someone had an
[37:29] accident, we didn't have an ordinance
and we didn't do the awareness stuff.
[37:34] Could a complaint be filed at the city a
complaint can always be filed? I mean,
[37:40] it's not a complaint being filed. And
again, that's a very general question.
[37:44] Every liability issue is going to be
very fact specific. Generally speaking,
[37:52] if a someone were to operate an ebike in
violation of state statute or operate an
[37:58] ebike where an accident occurred,
>> it's going to be very difficult to say
[38:04] that's the city's fault unless the city
had some involvement on it just because
[38:08] the city didn't say, "Well, you have to
wear a helmet." Uh
[38:12] but I don't particularly want that on my
conscience that you know something could
[38:18] have been done and we didn't then
I mean some accidents are unavoidable.
[38:24] Yes. But uh I agree with with Tyler if
parents would say yes you need you know
[38:30] if you're going to operate a 30 m per
hour bike as a you know 16 year old you
[38:34] may want to throw one.
>> Yeah.
[38:37] » I agree.
So that awareness and
[38:41] » I mean some education would probably
help because I know probably who you're
[38:45] talking about
an idea but and I I'm going to do some
[38:50] talking myself too.
I might don't
[38:57] if you guys are all right with it. Uh we
can throw together as long if you want
[39:01] to at least review it. We can throw
together what uh some other
[39:05] municipalities have done. Let's take a
look at it. You guys say no, we don't
[39:10] need more laws. Fine. That's what you
guys decides.
[39:14] » Think it'd be worth our time and theirs
to
[39:17] » Absolutely.
>> Absolutely. But again, it's fine. I'm
[39:20] with you. I don't want to m take a loss,
but I am I am concerned. I was almost
[39:24] part of a first accident. I had a young
man on a bike on a sidewalk. It was
[39:28] ebikes of direction. Um, he got behind a
parked car where I couldn't swim
[39:33] immediately after the parked car was a
driveway and he decided to transition
[39:37] from the sidewalk to the road at that
point and came out from behind that park
[39:41] and I'm missing my
>> and I don't want to be that guy. So
[39:44] » yeah, nobody hopefully education works.
>> I don't want to but it is conserving.
[39:50] I'm going to do some educ
[39:54] [laughter]
[40:01] time to catch them when they're in a
confined area. It's all
[40:04] » and I think if could we make some social
media posts on our Facebook like on city
[40:09] Facebook page that we could all share
that way
[40:11] » gets in front of lots of people.
>> Yeah. all about the education part first
[40:14] before we
just want to bring it to your attention
[40:19] let you know that this is we are filming
fielding phone call on this and um
[40:26] just have to tell that you know state
statute that's all we have to go by
[40:28] right now and then we are going trying
to work on something so I just want to
[40:32] bring it to your attention
[40:36] » sounds like you and Mr. Casper will be
busy.
[40:41] » Thank you.
>> Thanks. Thank you.
[40:44] » Okay, Mr. Boltz.
[41:02] » We have
>> I didn't get on.
[41:05] » Yeah. Uh we have contract that need to
be looked at and uh asked before the
[41:12] 20th of this month on some equipment.
Um I didn't know
[41:23] I didn't realize I have a lot of
questions because it's new equipment and
[41:27] I'm trying to find out there got to be
some warranty. I have to pay $5,000 for
[41:32] we bought for 19,000.
So I that's
[41:38] you know it's just the you know
I'm pretty sure they have like a warning
[41:44] on any any parts
but this is this is for them to come out
[41:49] and do our u
[41:54] you know make sure that they're uh
[42:01] how do I put um in compliance
is what that that
[42:08] contracts for is to make sure each each
individual
[42:13] improvement is in compant
with
[42:19] and there isn't that they'll fix it for
nothing.
[42:25] So is this one critical?
Yeah, because it's a brand new
[42:44] » flight was all a little bit is paying if
I'm paying for a fourth the price now
[42:50] again and I want to check other cities.
So if it's due by the 20th, well then
[42:59] that'll be fine.
>> Okay.
[43:00] » Just making sure.
>> Well, I just, you know,
[43:04] » I didn't see it. So I think I'll bring
it up. Other than that, we got parts
[43:09] again for Zodia. I should have run again
on tomorrow.
[43:17] So, um,
[43:21] it just seems like
the sound houses breaking down. So,
[43:29] trying to keep on top of it.
>> Well, we appreciate you all your hard
[43:32] work. Your department does.
>> Thank you.
[43:36] » Okay, Mr. Gford.
>> Madam Mayor, outside of discussion to
[43:41] that, I don't have anything fertil
questions for me regarding ordinances or
[43:47] anything.
>> So, thanks
[43:51] » Mrs. Ranker. No,
>> Mr.
[43:56] Yes. Right here at the K14
open house [snorts] at the rec center
[44:01] from 2:30 to 3:30 on Thursday. Again,
there's no there's no good renovation.
[44:08] There's like your boards out there. And
again, if the community wants to know
[44:12] what Konies talk about for K14, show up
there. And
[44:16] » the public is at a different time.
>> I got a postcard about it and I thought
[44:22] the public open houses in the evening.
>> I didn't know that. Okay. Well, look at
[44:27] your papers. You probably Okay.
>> Yeah.
[44:29] » Thank you.
>> Yeah. And um but yeah, and it's just a
[44:33] good way to know what's happening
community and and I don't think there's
[44:36] anybody in this community that thinks
improvement on K14 is a bad idea and uh
[44:41] you know has shoulders there and
everything else. So be good thing there.
[44:46] um comment on the you know last council
made you talked about the moving to the
[44:49] streets of course as we identified even
though it was discussion two years ago
[44:55] it's always been that the property owner
main center the rightway you know the
[45:00] front and back um which is probably 90%
of the cities in the city of Kansas um
[45:06] can we still go out there and spray a
time if we need to y we can we can um
[45:13] you know if you drive in that part of
this community you see most of them are
[45:17] getting on brick streets I get all that
new streets for the most part you see it
[45:23] um schedule um a city clerk and and
coach director are putting some
[45:29] education together talk about that a
little bit we get that out there that
[45:32] way getting a ticket or anything but
it's the process I think this is a good
[45:37] point everybody's always wants to
complain about property taxes
[45:41] that means this you have to cooperate
with the city too. So I, as I said, we
[45:48] don't have budgets. I can make a budget
as big as you want to,
[45:53] but can you have to guess and give 150
200 mill taxes? Hopefully not. I mean,
[45:59] that's what it boils down to. It's that
whole community thing being part of the
[46:02] community. And again, I I was surprised
when I got here when we didn't do it
[46:06] because every city 35 years, that's a
responsibility. And trust me as a
[46:11] neighbor when I took care of mine I
probably took care the block you know
[46:16] and when the city sprayed the past I'm
find out we probably did some not smart
[46:21] things told the local extension um
crop guy and he did what? Yeah, we did
[46:28] it, you know, and uh and so, you know,
when the city stopped doing they did it
[46:33] for the right reason. It's just educated
to go and work for public. Again, as we
[46:38] as a community want to watch our
property taxes, it takes teamwork and
[46:42] that's what it's going to take. I think
this is a good place to start there. Um,
[46:46] funny, we talked about golf carts the
office today and we had an employee that
[46:50] took a golf cart. Just so you know, you
cannot take a golf cart down Douglas.
[46:55] You can cross Douglas but you can't take
it down because golf carts are banned on
[46:58] state highways. Joker and this person we
kind of have to break the law but that's
[47:04] okay. I got still the point is is we
have golf carts and we have we have
[47:09] orings for that but stay those nonate
golf cart down the state highway. So
[47:14] crawl she can't go down. So one of those
weird things that's all I have to
[47:18] session. Thank you.
>> All right. Uh, city council, council
[47:23] member Allen, council member Moon.
>> Uh, yes, Madame Mayor. Uh, Mr. Dinko,
[47:29] just two things. I I know you're busy. I
I probably don't know how busy you are.
[47:34] Uh, but I know in one of our meetings,
you talk about you identify a lot of
[47:39] ordinances that needed to be either
looked at or rewritten.
[47:46] That is task one.
That's what I mean. again
[47:52] role I always like my job just to hold
cover.
[47:55] » Okay.
>> But to carry it through, you know, you
[47:57] know. Okay.
>> Okay. Second thing is this the the issue
[48:03] about the rebuilding
uh it was going to go to the city
[48:07] planner. Uh someone's house burned down
and the issue that came up with should
[48:14] he rebuild?
>> We haven't had a meeting December 21st
[48:17] just due to schedules and everything
else. just so delic
[48:25] Bishop
>> council member
[48:27] » no
>> right and I don't have anything either
[48:30] » good
>> we're moving into executive
[48:32] » s
[48:36] and then add more
[48:43] » and is not able to join us tonight so it
will just be
[48:49] Okay.
>> Yeah.
[48:52] » Madam Mayor, I move that the council
recess from executive session to include
[48:56] the mayor, council, city attorney, and
interim city administrator for 20
[49:00] minutes beginning at uh we'll say 18:20
to discuss matters regarding non-elected
[49:05] personnel to review and discuss
applications for the city administrator
[49:09] position. The justification is to
protect the privacy of the applicants
[49:12] for this nonvited position is provided
by KSA754319.
[49:18] The open meeting is resumed in this room
at uh 6:40.
[49:24] Second that. It's
>> been moved by council member Allen,
[49:27] second by council member Bernard to move
uh into executive session and to to
[49:33] include the mayor, council, city
attorney, and interim city administrator
[49:36] for 20 minutes starting at 6:20 to
discuss matters regarding non-elected
[49:41] personnel.
Any discussion?
[49:44] » Great. All those in favor say I. I.
>> Those opposed, same sign. Same pass.
[49:49] » Yes, they do.
>> Yes. I just wanted to clarify that
[50:03] » upon returning from executive session. I
suggest the following motion. I move the
[50:07] city council return from executive
session where no decision were made and
[50:12] no action was taken. I second. Been
moved by council member Bishop, second
[50:17] by council member Moon to come back from
executive session where no action was
[50:21] taken and no decisions were made. All
those in favor say I. I. Sign pass.
[50:28] » All right, Ros, I think you have
something to say.
[50:30] » Madam Mayor, I move that this council
recess for an executive session to
[50:34] include the mayor, council, and interim
city administrator administrator and
[50:38] applic.
[50:43] Okay, let me start over. I move the city
council recess. Um, no, I can't see
[50:48] that. Somebody else did. I put mine
away.
[50:51] » Hang on. At least you got your
>> And I have Lori here looking at
[50:55] » I move that the council recess for an
executive session to include the mayor,
[51:00] council, city attorney, and the interim
city administrator for 10 minutes
[51:07] uh at
[51:11] 18:44.
[51:15] to discuss matters regarding non-elected
personnel to review and discuss
[51:18] applicants for the city administer
position. The justification is to
[51:22] protect the privacy of the applicants
for this non-elected position and is
[51:27] provided by KSA 75431B
subsection B subsection 1. The open
[51:34] meeting is to resume in this room at
1854.
[51:40] » I second. Been moved by council member
Bishop, second by council member Moon to
[51:45] recess for an executive session to
include the mayor, city council, city
[51:49] attorney, and interim city administrator
for 10 minutes starting at 6:44 to
[51:53] discuss matters regarding non-elective
personnel to review and discuss
[51:57] applicants for the city administrator
position. Any discussion? Hearing none,
[52:01] all those in favor say I.
>> I signed
[52:14] Skip that first part. Upon returning,
just go straight to the motion.
[52:17] » Upon returning from executive session, I
suggest the following motion. I move the
[52:21] city council return from executive
session where no decisions were made or
[52:26] no action was taken.
>> Second.
[52:28] » Been moved by council member Bishop,
second by council member Moon to return
[52:32] from executive session where no
decisions were made and no action was
[52:36] taken. All those in favor say I. I. Say
motion pass.
[52:41] Okay. Anything else?
Anybody want to adjurnn?
[52:46] Mayor make a motion we
second.
[52:51] » It's been moved by council member Ellen,
second by council member Moon to adjourn
[52:55] tonight's meeting. All those in favor
say I.
[52:57] » I. Those opposed, same signed. Motion
passed. to full coffee