Thank you, fire evacuation for everyone who doesn't know straight out through those double doors
in the back or down through these on your right, downstairs out to the back door and please as far away from the building is possible.
Secretary, please call the roll.
Louis Fiori, Virginia Higgler, one of the gray, John Petronol is here, Francis Olimov,
is absent, John Muley, Kenneth Olensky, Vinigurolo, is absent, Christian D. Antonio, and
Nicholas Lefakis is absent.
Thank you.
Let the record show there's five regular members that will be seeding alternate member,
The Antonio tonight, in place of one of the regular members, probably Commissioner Lambo, who is not here for the act for protection agency.
And a Tanner motion for approval of minutes of November 16th, 2023.
Motion by Vice Chairman Higley, seconded by Vice Chairman DeGray, any discussion on the minutes.
Seeing none of those in favor of a set in the minutes.
Hi.
A record show that it was pretty much an answer.
John, do you want to vote on the member you won't hear here?
I started to go to the entire meeting.
Okay, so let the record show your unanimous six nothing to approve the minutes public communications or anyone to speak
about the act for protection that's something that's not in our agenda going once going twice
That's close any correspondence about act for protection
Seeing none new business
New business is application
X-A-R-A number 2740-moody road application for an aquifer registration renewal over the
A45 and A50 aquifer town of Enfield, applicant owner, Matt 75, a lot 103, I1 zone.
Thank you.
Is the applicant representative here?
Bill 24, D-P-W.
Thank you, Bill.
Can you just give us that?
You know?
With Georgia, give us a quick overview of the this aquifer application.
So what we're doing is we're looking to, obviously, as you guys know, you have a PNC approved the application, the fuel station renewal and update,
What we're looking to do is renew our aquifer protection and registration.
It actually, I believe, it expired in January of this year.
It was found out during the process of getting the planning and zoning application together.
So I put the application together and
we created a best management practices, put that on there,
and we renewed all of the information on the previous application submitted with the help of Georgie.
Thank you, Georgie anything you want to add to this?
Sure.
So I expected the site and it was very clean.
Well organized.
There were a couple of recommendations I made about the location of trash vehicles and just some dumpster notes to keep an eye on.
And then, so their original registration include
activities, ADV and X, however, because they're pending,
the planning and zoning for ASAP and modification
to move underground storage tanks and to put in
a background storage tanks.
It's a lot better for the environment.
And I recommend a condition that activity A,
B is suspended after the completion of project
under Excess U23-01.
Just to keep them as a safe backup, just in case something
goes wrong during the application process, they could always go back to activity A if they need to.
The goal is to hopefully never have to do USTs again.
Everything else was in compliance with the regulations and there were no violations.
Thank you.
I just have an order of business to do.
Commissioner Lamal.
I did seek Mr. and the Antonio for this.
Would you?
Would you like to come in?
You want to sit this one up?
Just want to make sure.
So, Commissioner Lamal is going to sit this one out since he came in a little late.
put.
Now, are there any questions for the applicants or staff on this?
Nope.
Everyone in the stands were, you know, the pool for this would be with the one condition.
Okay.
Thank you very much.
Seeing none.
I'll entertain a motion to.
Is this a public hearing?
No.
I'll entertain a motion to approve.
Motion to.
Motion.
That's okay.
Yeah.
I'd like to make a motion to approve.
ARA number 27 dashed 40 moody road application for an aquifer renewal registration over the A45 and A50 aquifer's town of Enfield,
applicant owner map 75, lap 103, I one zone with the one condition listed.
The condition is activity A is to be suspended after the completion of the project under XSU number 23-01.
buchadneadasund, thank you.
Secondary I civilians.
The mongeon made by the Secretary of
IIlovex Christianudene to prove this into discussion.
Seeing them will we ready Mr. Secretary?
On the point of death, we can book a webinar that was
over a moment at the credit fee.
Action.
Of rogue.
Uh, Kenneth Owensky.
KorchidianScript, John Petronola,
is for the record shows unanimous to approve this
accurate protection, you're all sitting there.
I think you're all sitting out with the project.
I think that was probably it, thank you for coming tonight.
Thank you.
Excuse me, Mr. Chair, I don't want to clarify.
Is it six voting members or seven?
Because you also have Commissioner Mule.
One, two, three, four, if there's seven voting members.
OK, so you also have so many votes.
Commissioner Mule, yes.
OK, because you also stated six votes for the minutes as well.
So just to correct it.
That should be right.
Yeah, it was seven.
Yes, thank you very much.
Thank you.
So that's what I just want to thank again staff,
especially Georgie, for all the work she's done
in the last couple years on Act for Protection,
getting us back up to snuff and up to the on target.
Really nice job for an old staff.
Yeah.
So we're all right, thank you.
We're all right.
Let's something like this pops up.
That's, you know, you don't know about it last minute,
but again, thank you so much for all your work.
Thank you.
And I'll entertain a motion to adjourn this meeting.
No, no.
me by Vice Chairman DeGrey, second by Vice Chairman Higley, to adjourn the Act for Protection
Agency.
We will be back at 7 o'clock for the Planings One meeting.
The call is meeting of the InfoPlanings Zoning Commission to Order of Thursday, December 21st at 7pm. Please rise for pledge of allegiance.
Thank you, everybody. Fire, evacuation, right behind you out through the double doors, or to your right down these
set of doors down the stairs and out towards the back and of course many things going on. Please walk away as far as you can from the building.
Mr. Secretary, roll call, whatever you're ready.
Yes, Mr. Chair, I'll lose for you.
Here, Virginia Higley.
Here.
One to the gray.
Here.
John Petron, I was here.
Francis Alimo.
Joseph Muway.
Here.
Kenneth Holensky.
Here.
Vinnie Grillo.
Here.
Hi, what was that?
Christian DeAntonio.
And Nicholas LaFancus is absent.
Thank you.
Let the record show that all the regular members are here.
in attendance, so for Mr. Lefakis who couldn't make it tonight, in our
chain of motion to prove the minutes of December 7th of regular meeting, motion made by
Vice Chairman Higley, is there a second? Seconded by Commissioner Halinsky, discussion
on the minutes. I had one question. I have one. Did you do roll call? Oh, you did, okay.
Okay, so John was it here on time? John just did roll call. No, I'm not meeting. Oh, that
Okay, I don't remember. All right. That's why yeah, it's okay. Commissioner Lambo. Yes
There's a section of the agenda that I was left off the minutes. Commissioner's correspondence whole section of that
Is not on the minutes and there's stuff that's act their commission's correspondence that are on the minutes
I know we have somebody else take the minutes ethnic or somebody do it out of a recording. They're
So Lord, so Lord through the chair and Lori
Yeah, unfortunately Rebecca was ill, and so that was kind of a last minute thing, so how
are other risk-wording secretary did do them over the weekend?
So we'll have her check it.
So she's our temporary.
So she's in the office, so.
I don't know.
This was stamped into the town clerk.
So it needs to be amended.
So the amendment occurs on to these next on tonight's minutes.
Well, I don't know what it was for Bataum.
Well, the minutes are not for Bataum and never.
Not for Bataum.
Well, it's not even on there.
Okay.
Section is not on there.
We'll put something in.
We can go back to the video.
It's still there.
Okay.
Thank you.
Would you accept an amendment tonight, Mr.
Commissioner Alaymo, stating that there was a...
Can we be second here?
Correspondence.
It concerns correspondence of that commissioner.
Alaymo questioned the resignation letter of Chairman Fiori.
Would that satisfy you if we made that amendment tonight?
No, I'd like it for you.
We don't do for Betham.
We do not do for Betham minutes.
Well, maybe not for Betham, but I'd like to have you go back to the video
and at least get some contents out of it.
Not that I just simply questioned it.
The amount of time of motion to table the minutes.
So unfortunately, I won't be here for the next minute.
I needed to approve those minutes since you're on one of the compromise.
When the amount of time of motion to table the minutes won't be forgotten either.
Anybody who made the first please?
Well, the chair made it, but I don't know if the chair can make a motion.
Does it have any questions?
I don't know.
I mean, the motion to ask if a motion to secondative minutes of commissioner line will
meet a motion the second in minutes is there a second?
I mean, table the minutes, is there a second?
Second, is there a second?
Second, by commissioner to gray.
All those that favor will in a table, the minutes signify by saying aye.
There's only two.
So the minutes are not tables.
So again, we're going to go back to the discussion on the minutes.
I made a recommendation at the, we could amend the minutes tonight stating that
I'm going to show him a limo question.
Some of the things that Chairman Fiori said in his resignation letter, and that would be amended
to this minutes.
I'll make that motion as a chairman if that's acceptable to the group, because we don't
do verbatim minutes.
Is there a second to that amendment?
Seconded by Commissioner Hoelensky.
All those of favor of amending the minutes has question?
Questions?
Yeah.
So I think there was more than just a question that was a back and forth.
So I question you answered, so it should be the
content of the discussion. We don't do that. People want to see the contents
Frank, they go to the video. That's what we do now. The minister's supposed to be
just the actions of the commission. I'm trying to work a compromise with you
because people go to the video. People are really interested about that back and
forth you and I had to go watch the YouTube video. That's what we've done. That's
what we started to do two years ago. That's what the council does. That's what the
Board of Ed does. Nobody does for a bit of minutes any longer.
Well, it just ran a call that was left out and it was stuff put in that was okay
I mean, I'm working with you to try to make sure to something in here that's agreeable so that people want to see if they can go back and watch you to video.
I'll go with that for now, but I'm not saying I will not take it more forward to.
Well, once we prove the minister approve Frank.
I will vote for it.
Okay, that's fine.
I made a motion as a chairman to amend the minister state.
In a correspondence, that Commissioner or LIMO questioned Chairman Fiori's
things in Chairman Fiori's resignation letter.
I made that motion is there a second.
I think Commissioner Felensky's second and that.
All those are favor of accepting the minutes as amended signify by saying I like the
record show is no.
Yep.
Is it the one?
Yeah.
Are you a standing sentence you weren't here or are you going to vote?
One abstention.
The minutes are accepted as such.
Account attorneys report. I know what date still same when is November 27th.
There is no executive session. No enforcement officers report tonight. Public communications.
At this point in the meeting, the planning is only commission welcome's comments, concerns,
and opinions related to planning, zoning and infield.
For anyone who is present, provide the no one may discuss any matter of business at this time.
That is already elsewhere in your agenda.
Any matter as part of an open public hearing of this commission.
Or any matter where a decision is commissioned may be pending and that includes any legal pending business.
So anyone like to come in front of the council to speak?
Go ahead.
Lots is not on agenda.
Okay.
Can you hear me?
No.
You can.
It was it's red.
Can you hear?
Four.
You have a closer.
Okay.
Angela Boss, 16 Crescent Beach Drive.
I don't know if I can talk about this.
I want to ask you about this.
At that last meeting, impact residential had some very unkind words to say about us and we
couldn't reach that.
That's up in the next part of the business.
Thank you.
Anybody else?
For the third time?
Seeing public communications closed.
Moving on to the bond release.
Mr. Secretary.
Yes.
Okay.
Yes.
The Ethel Planning and Zone of Commission here by approves a release of a landscaping
bond in the amount of $5,950 dollars to Eric Forge, Forge Construction Company submitted
for the Project Public Hearing 2,925 family Ford 65 Hazard Avenue site improvements.
Thank you.
Sir, second, second by Commissioner Lensky, discussion on this.
The only question out to me if I'm, please, you know, correct me if I'm incorrect here.
It looks to me like this is kind of like a swap, it looks like they're, we're releasing
the construction companies bond, but then if your family forward is going to turn right
around and take back out the bond for the same amount because of work as I've been done yet.
Am I correct with that analysis?
I do believe that is.
Thank you.
So I just want to make up.
It's about $5,950.
$50?
So I just want to make that point to everyone.
It works still isn't done.
They're just switching who's holding a bond.
So, there's been any other discussion?
What I understand also is that the new bond is currently in place.
So, the reason that thereby is the release of this one.
Thank you, John.
Commissioner Petronoff.
Thank you for the information.
Seeing no discussion, there's a motion was made in a second.
We'll call whenever you're ready.
Mr. Secretary?
Yes.
Lou Fiori.
Four.
Linda the Grey.
Four.
Virginia Higway.
For instance, O'I'm O'Fore, Joseph Mueway.
For Kenneth Zelensky.
For John Petronol is for.
With the record shows you an analyst to release this bond.
Moving on to continued public hearings.
We don't need to read the whole thing, so I just very quickly we're going to be reopening
hearing pH 378.
Application of impact residential development for mixed development.
What do you applicant in a public hearing is still open?
Applicant and representative please go ahead.
We do want to mention for the record.
Please do not be repetitious tonight. We have a heard. Many comments. If you have something new to add to this public caring tonight
Please come forward, but if you're going to come up and repeat some of the same things that you've said the last two days
We have where the public here is open. Please don't please don't do that. So we're looking from new information
So having said that
We'll never the applicant is ready. I presume you have some new information that you want to pass on to us tonight
Thank you.
Good evening, Mr. Chairman.
There you are.
Good for us.
Good to see you.
Governor Chris Smith on behalf of well Chris Smith of Alter and Pearson.
I'm a land use attorney with Alter and Pearson at the outset.
I would like to extend my appreciation and thank you to your land use staff as well as Mr.
Gainer for arranging for me to participate this evening.
I remotely do to prior commitments that I have that require me to be out of town and
to apologize to the commission for not being able to attend this evening.
But I do appear before you on behalf of the applicant,
Impact Residential Development LLC,
concerning a proposed mixed use TOD proposal for a 70-unit community,
where 56 of the 70-units will be income restricted
to provide housing opportunities to the residents of the town.
At the outset, Mr. Chairman, I'd like to introduce the members of the team
we're here this evening. We're attending remotely. On behalf of Impact Residential, we have
Logan Kiwig, Development Manager, who is attending remotely. We have Peter Wood, Development
Consultant with Collaborative Development LLC, who is here in person. We also have Frank
Faka, our License Professional Engineer and Project Manager with the BSC Group. Unfortunately,
Susan O'Dell, our License Professional Architect with Paul B. Bailey Architect LLC, is not well
things so she's not able to attend, but we do have from our office as well.
Meg Hope was laying you's attorney with Ulpturm Pearson, Legal Counsel for Impact Residential.
Just a quick summary, as you may recall, we convinced the public hearing and the
November 16th, where we made a formal presentation to the Commission in public.
The hearing was continued to allow impact residential, the opportunity to address
comments that were received at the hearing, and we returned to the Commission at your last meeting on December 7 for a continuation of the public hearing to address a number of comments, including an alternate architectural design for the buildings, a detailed summary regarding traffic and parking, and a detailed explanation of the stormwater quality and management system.
The Commission requested that the hearing be continued to this evening to allow members the opportunity to review the supplemental information that was provided and presented on December 7 and also to confirm that the town engineer had signed off on the proposal in particular relative to the strong water management system which has occurred.
The Town Engineer had suggested the elimination of any runoff from the site sheet flow of prior
to entering an adjacent property to the two adjacent properties located on Pleasant Street
that a but the subject property, Mr. Vaka, the BSC group incorporated the Town Engineer's
suggestions into the plan. As the commission is aware, the subject properties currently do not
We have any stormwater collection or treatment system, any comprehensive system.
My client's proposal does provide for a comprehensive stormwater management system where, first,
the all stormwater will be collected and treated, be, all stormwater will be discharged after
treatment into the adjacent municipal stormwater system, where by no stormwater will sheet
flow onto adjacent properties and see there will be no increase in peak flows concerning
the discharge of this treated stormwater into the municipal system.
What we'd like to do with this point with permission of the chair is to have Mr.
Vaca, our licensed professional engineer, the BSC group,
provide the commission with a brief summary of how he incorporated the Town Engineer's
suggestion into the site plan and stormwater management design,
whereby we now have a final sign-off from the Town Engineer or the proposal,
which your Frank of Mr. Baca will be addressing is that that small strip of land between the two properties on pleasant street and the fact that with the modifications to the plan they're now going to be in pervious surface to allow for all the stormwater that does hit that portion of the property to be collected and not allowed to sheet flow off onto the two adjacent properties on either side of that strip.
but again, with the permission of the chair,
I'll turn the presentation over in the Mr. Vaca.
Thank you.
Yep, please do.
Very good, can you all hear me?
Yes.
For the record, my name is Francis Vaca.
I'm a professional engineer with the BEC group
and class very Connecticut.
I'm going to go through very quickly the changes.
So I spoke directly with Mr. Kavevo,
with regard to the concerns that had been raised
at previous meetings.
One in particular relates to the small section
of property owned by impact development.
adjacent to 22 Puzz and Street. It was originally, it was previously indicated at previous meetings that this was to be converted to grass to infiltrate any additional water.
After further coordination with the town engineer, it was determined and it is, I should clarify, it is existing pavement, right now, it will remain pavement as a result of my coordination with Mr. Gabibou.
Therefore, there will not be any infiltration directly adjacent to any of the properties basements or anything associated with this area. It will continue to discharge as it currently discharges down the slope onto Pleasant Street,
which it has been doing for the duration.
The other change that was made is there was concern
with regard to one of the focal point,
one of the focal point water quality systems
located in the direction in the location I am identifying
with the computer.
This has been removed and replaced by a double catch basin
and standard water quality treatment unit
where it will discharge directly to the travel street.
The water quality unit is essentially a structure that will scroll the water around to collect all of the sediments and oils separate and it does not use any planted material.
It is essentially just going through hydrodynamic means, treat the water and discharge it to travel street to clarify this modification to the design ensures that there will be no infiltration
associated with any of this norm water associated with this portion of the property in direct
adjacency to 20,000 street. Those were the two main changes that had that came as a result of
my coordination with the Hound Engineer and we'll clarify all changes that have been
accordance with the conduct drainage manual, the 2004 water quality manual, the state of
I will turn the presentation back over to Mr. Smith.
Thank you.
I have one file.
Okay.
If I may ask one question, so if we go back to your slide.
So it's not the unfortunate part about this is we've not decreasing the previous coverage.
We're going back.
Which was a nice about the original design.
Even I do see why you made the change.
I would up to the exact calculation.
And we have increased a large amount of pervious grass throughout the majority of this.
But yes, there is a small section here as identified that will remain as impervious.
Yes, that's too bad.
Okay, but excuse me, I'd be the best solution.
Thank you.
Just for you.
And again, Mr.
I'm sorry.
Oh, no.
I just wanted to second that.
Yeah, I feel like this is a missed opportunity as well to decrease in pervious coverage.
And from your past presentations from your analysis, there was to be no runoff to adjacent properties, that's correct.
Is that correct?
There was to be no runoff adjacent, but I cannot guarantee that there would not be infiltration.
Right, right.
That's the difference.
Right.
And that was the concern that was the, we had comments from the adjacent property owners concerning not only the sheet flow, but also possible infiltration into their basements level.
So I think the town engineer working with Mr. Bakker, Mr. Bakker working with the town engineer came up with this solution.
It's not what was proposed, but I suppose if you wanted to use a look at it, it's an alternative, but the sole purpose of what to address that comment from the Jason's property on his own pleasant.
Yeah, that told you that it's so, thank you.
Who's your animal?
So that change was made after the last meeting and before this meeting.
That is correct. It was in the as a result of there being concerned with the town engineer not having fully
For lack of a better term clicked off his button. I confirmed that with him and I made sure that all of all comments that he may have had have been addressed
One of the comments that we discussed was his concern with regard to
the potential for infiltration as a result of this which is why we have
elected to maintain the existing payment as is.
Well, I'm glad we waited because I think there was a lot of discussion and we were
talking about red buttons and blue buttons in the town in Geneva had reviewed it.
So now he made these changes.
So if we went move forward last meeting, these changes wouldn't have been made.
So I'm glad we waited.
Thank you for the change.
Very good.
Mr. Chairman, just for the record perspective, those were our comments,
I know that hearing was continued to allow the commission on the opportunity to review the supplemental information from the last meeting, as well as to address the items with 10 engineers.
So we don't know if the commission or anyone else may have any questions for the team and before we wrap up with our conclusions.
Yes, but what we're going to do is turn to Smith is we're going to be you guys going to continue what you're going to need to do them the public do get a chance to speak again
Then you do get a chance to come back and answer any other concerns they have but I think I'm looking around to be quite frank
If you I think it's our we need to close this public here tonight
So we're going to keep on moving so go ahead if you want to you done or you have somewhere you need to go. I am also now
And let's Mr. Vakka has something further. I think we that that's all we have we just wanted to explain this to my
Thank you. Thank you very much. We're going to have an opportunity to ask questions.
Yes, absolutely. Thank you.
We're open up for the public now since there seem to be unfold now until the public speaks.
So give them a second to clear and we'll open for the public to come back up.
Yeah, you'll be coming back. Yeah.
I'm sure I'm sure to be something you want to respond to.
There might be more questions from the commission.
So now is the public trying going to remind everyone again, please don't be repetitious.
What you've already done, we've already had two public hearings already.
So if you have something new to offer, or comments, we'll definitely take that in the consideration.
This commission is very good at reading the minutes and going back and watching the videos.
So we've heard all your comments already.
So I think I would have half here.
Looks like Jonathan Robertson, come on forward, Jonathan, and you have five minutes for your first
time, please.
And in three minutes for a second time,
Jonathan, I have to identify yourself at a record
of your name and your address, please.
Make sure to mic sign and speak clearly right into it.
Can you hear me, okay?
Perfect.
Beautiful for Jonathan Robinson 14 Pleasant Street. The only question I had was it looks like
There's a right away currently there
between
where the Monastery Center was
deconstructed and the
the old
movie theater and I was wondering where does that fit into this?
Okay, we don't we don't do a given take it. It's for question. Oh, yeah, yeah
that's the only question so a right away near what building A I'm not sure it doesn't
look to be marked here but I see I notice a right away in between I'm not going to do
give it a take but I notice a right away between building A and the corner of the
parking lot yes they the applicant has mentioned at numerous times there is a right
okay there what's happening to that right away what we can ask them to come back and
Okay, so hang around. Okay, that's it. Okay. Thank you.
Hope you to my friend is helping him a little bit.
I think it's Patricia Burns.
Patricia, you've been in front of us twice before.
Do you have something new you want to add?
Yes. Okay. Please.
Like my grandmother taught me there are three different ways to go in life.
Yeah, I mean, I just want to thank you.
She burned 16 A.1 to 3.
The way that I was going was if he.
I don't want to stem anybody in the back, you know, we're all here for a reason.
I'm glad that they're willing to work on the certain things that Mr. Frost needed to be done.
Okay, my back's off to you.
And the other, I'd rather if we can, like I said with them, we can all work together.
Please, we're good.
Patricia, you have to address us, not the crowd, please.
If we could all work together or this not only for people who may know, that could have the same thing that
me and my children are looking for for their future so that everybody can have it.
You know, I was going to do the step-toes, but that doesn't pay off in the end.
But if we can all work together and come to an agreement for the benefit of the future.
Thank you. Thank you very much.
And I think that must be your daughter. I want to speak next.
Yeah, please come on up.
You're naming that just for the record, please.
Gabrielle Burns, 168 Winters Street.
I was thinking maybe they can add floors to one building, doing six floors and 16 units,
so they can contract to other building for parking.
That's all I have.
Thank you.
Jeff,
boss, 16, Chris and Beach Drive, don't please the staff will pass that out.
Yeah, I'll let them pass that out.
We're going to need that.
I would like to talk again about the parking in Thompsonville as it relates to the Union Square
Project.
My issue is parking.
Do not approve this project as it does not benefit the area as presented.
Again, I'm not against the new apartment's going in.
I said this earlier.
I own what I call Marvin Gardens on the Game of Board walk and they are building park
place, which is great. But these are two different price points. This is not my competition
at all. Their per price unit price is $471,000 given their $33 million project statement.
Can you imagine living in a half million dollar house with insufficient parking? Okay, so now
I want to bring up something that has never been brought up and I missed it myself. Something
that is completely overlooked is that the parking in the parking numbers, as presented, is that
the existing public parking lot, which is on Pleasant Street, beside my building at 20 Pleasant
Street, is behind and is behind the town pool, has been given to impact residential project.
Why was this never disclosed to the surrounding impact residents?
This creates another shortage of 23 additional parking spots, yes, I counted them.
and more issues with parking when the snow comes.
People that are currently using this municipal parking lot
during the winter storms will no longer have a place
to park to get off the roads.
Everyone on that street has been using it for more than 20 years that I'm aware of
and now what?
The town already knows we have a major parking issue in Thompsonville so why
is the town just giving away our public parking for this project
to go private and create a greater parking problem on the streets?
It's not 41 spots they're looking for.
Now they need 64 spots because they're taking 23 of our municipal parking lot from us for this
private use.
Where will everyone who has been using this lot park their vehicles in the winter?
Was this overlooked?
They are taking our current municipal parking area and making it into a private parking area, requiring
these 23 parking spots to be added to their numbers.
And what about parking spaces needed for their community center?
As the planning and zoning commission you can stop this, as presented, this project does not meet the requirement zoning regulations for parking.
I'd like to go over the numbers on a handout. Did everybody get the handout?
Yeah. Okay, so the parking line I'm talking about is rated the top of their project on the left side there, that dark area.
it's in yellow here.
That parking lot is currently the town's parking lot and it's for people to park in.
So, the left side of the handout that gave you, they're looking for 111 parking spots,
plus six for the office and they claim they have 76 on the grounds, which means they need 41 on the street.
And if you go further down, you'll see where they took the municipal parking lot.
Spot can actually, this is the different municipal parking lot, this is
Cross from Corona is that they're counting as as parking, but the problem with that is 12 of the spots
Across from Corona is
Is already consumed by the six family at the end of Corona?
It was given the town gave the the six family at the end of that parking lot
12 places for them the park so you have to subtract that out of their original number
That brings them down to 43 and they're only allowed half of that which brings it to 21. So now they're there's six parking
spots short of what they had estimated they would have. The other thing is, let's see, the other
thing is, oh, the fact that they're taking these 23 spots from us means that we need 23 additional
spots on the street, or they need 23 more additional spots. So we'll give them credit for only 25
spots on the street divided by two means they are now only have 12. If you add 21 from coronavirus
parking lot and 12 on the street, they really only have 33 parking spots and they tell us
they have 51. It doesn't, the math doesn't work. They need 41 parking spots for this
to qualify. I just don't get how the math is working here. We don't have the correct math.
That's all I have to say. Thank you very much. Thank you.
Here's your little fuss.
Angela Foss, 16 present beach drive. I want to thank you all for your hard work.
I know it's not easy being you. I can't imagine what we're like being up there and being you guys and you're doing a great
Job. The decision tonight though is going to be something that's going to be the beginning decisions for everything that happens with this Thompson Bill project. I know we're looking forward to a train station. We all want a train station. I know we've been waiting for many, many years for a train station hasn't happened yet. So we're kind of putting the cart if we're a horse. We're planning on something that's going to be two years down the road.
Maybe more. And do we know the train station will
be here for this. They're calling it. You're calling it a, calling it a transit transit station
or multi-purpose buildings and all of those things don't fit the rugs that I have
read on multi-purpose.
I
wanted to respond to the landing and zoning meeting last time
where these people had spoken. Mr. Wood spoke about us on kindly. Mr. Mr. Wood.
Mr. Wood, our genuine desire is to do what is best for our tenants and the residents of
Thompsonville. As you know, we are not distance landlords, we live here in town. We have
never spoken to Mr. Wood, so we're quite surprised when he made false statements about
us. We actually spoke often with Jessica Mullins, and we have only kind words to say about
Jessica Mullins. I will simply say that, in fact, residential did try to buy our buildings.
They kept wanting to extend the due diligence period for the POS without putting down any
typical down payment.
They instead put money into an escrow account that they can pull at any time.
And if you who are realtors know that's not how business is done.
Our attorney insisted on an escalation clause for the price went up the longer it took
for them to close on our buildings.
The town and the do sets, they don't have an escalation clause in their contracts.
So the price for the town land and the parking lot today remains the same in two years,
in three years, for however long it takes for them to purchase the building and they will
continue to extend their contracts just so you know.
When we learned that instead of fixing up our apartments as they claimed they were going
to do. They were going to fix up our apartments, which would not impact our tenants. They
instead, we saw them with the plans up here that they wanted to demolish our buildings and
add another building instead. We refused another extension and ended the deal with them. It's
that simple. They had to withdraw their contract or they would have to release money from the
escrow account to us and they claimed that they didn't have it, but we were very content.
Because we were concerned for our tenants and they were concerned because they were facing housing difficulties or instability.
So I want to also say I know that there's something with the setbacks minimum rear yard on their paperwork says it's required 20 feet and they only have two on the front of their document.
And I did ask about the step-backs last time, and I was told that the step-backs were met, and the other concern I have, and I'm thrilled with the pay that the town engineer worked this out for us, is that the snow is again being piled up against the buildings.
It's pushed up against, in that parking lot, and it'll be piled up there if they want to have, you know, if they need to deal with snow, push it up against their buildings.
find another location if they if you're going to go with this that's no either has to be removed
like it always doesn't any other municipality taken out where it needs to go or push it against
their own buildings don't push it against ours that's a last no again I'm going to miss you I'm
going to miss you a lot thank you for all that you have done for our town we appreciate you very
Thank you.
Chris, I think it's Christina Lang,
and you were here before, Christina, do you have something
new to offer?
You were here?
Yes.
Okay.
Thank you.
Yes.
I heard you a couple of times.
Thank you.
I'm monitoring all of us about being original.
Thank you.
So yes.
I'm original.
I'm Chris Lang, and I am at 90 South Road.
That's not original.
Okay.
I'm here just to say that, like we all know, this is the last time you will all be meeting together in this particular commission.
And I wish you all well.
This is a legacy moment is what I wanted to say.
should you make and fill in the TOD and Thompsonville go without another investment for another few decades or should you have us go without the new housing until somebody comes up with a better bus system or until a parking garage miraculously appears or until the cows come home.
That isn't a ton of constant of voice at all this on you, that's not your job.
Finding parking for everything and fixing the other tenants' problems with parking and
everything else is not tonight's job, it's not the job of this developer either.
What we have here is a pretty golden opportunity for tons of people to start having a magnet that
make when the train station comes something worth having.
And finally, from the J.I. on Friday the 15th of December, my goodness, bringing us back
the way it was, Windsor's Founders Square Housing Retail Project, and I advise you to
take a look, everything they're doing and getting is what we could have had.
They got 3.2 million in community investment funding.
No, T.C. did not let you have that.
But they're going to have a transit-oriented district that works and that's people-friendly
and gives housing to workforce housing of 20% of it is.
And it's even energy-efficient.
It's energy-star certified.
It's so much like what we could be having if we don't say no.
That's what I'm looking at now. Windsor is getting it and we're not. Don't let that be your legacy. Thanks.
Thank you very much.
Petibutu.
Thank you. It's all in though. I just a couple. A couple of
thenums, the what I said earlier. I mean Patrick's a bit of a 20-course street and field.
In the discussion that you had, I sense attention on the issue of whether you go with commercial
or housing first or a combination thereof and in the distant life I was a city hall reporter
an economic development reporter in New Britain Connecticut. I saw a history book of the city
which was published and but they haven't experienced down there and they haven't added
to down there which might inform our thinking here.
They lost everything when we were growing.
They lost their downtown, they lost their industrial area, and when West Farm's mall was built in 74,
so that vacuumed out whatever remaining retail they had. So they were pretty much destroyed and most
of their downtown, a lot of that was just vacant. And so they went on basically a 50-year period
to try to rebuild it. And they were helped. And they threw everything they could on it.
new highways, new parking garages, they went in the public private partnerships like
least a third of the new office building but the school department in there. They did everything
you can think of. They moved the police department downtown and put retail on the first floor.
None of these things had what I would consider a transformative effect on their downtown area. It was
largely abandoned and some private investors who built restaurants and thought that they
have a go at it. They didn't get business. But what changed? What changed is there's been
another thing. There's a big social change about an attitude about living in downtown areas.
People are trying to make better use of mass transit, doing more walking and things like that.
But the brain was also helped by fast track, the bus system. If you ever seen it, the platforms
are pretty much like a train, you have a lot of reliability to them. And so there's a takeaway from that
us. But anyways, they elected a mayor. She was only in her 20s. Erwin Stewart, a Republican.
And her attitude was one of the kind of things she wanted to kind of build a city that
young people wanted to live in, so that was her thinking. But she was able to also learn from
the history of what went on in that city and what worked in what then. And the story began
the story, I just want to read one quote from her, but the quote is introduced this way and
reporter writes, some argue a city should create retail opportunities that inspire people
to move to town. Others say starting with building housing will encourage retail. And this
is how she answered that particular problem. She said, quote, we learn you build housing
first. It was a risk we took. It's a big risk because we were debating where do you put
resources. Do you put your resources into retail or are we putting it into housing?
I am so glad we put it into housing because feed on the street is going to drive the economy.
Thank you very much. Thank you.
Nicky Price.
Good evening. Good evening, Nicky Price 1320.
1320 for Imperial Street. I'm going to read something that I wrote to Dr. Poland back in
August 21st, 2022, then is going to leave into my comments.
What I find disturbing in the 2021 Plan of Conservation and Development is a focus only
on revising Thomsonville.
High-rising buildings to accommodate more low income housing is not the answer when we, as
a town, are above the state of the pandemic goal of 10%.
We are currently at 12.5, I think it's a little bit higher now.
Before a plan is approved, the fundamental problem of Thomsonville must be addressed and fixed before any plan is put in place if not then it will be a waste of money and time.
Now I want to fast forward to the Thomson meeting of this past Monday.
President Jack Sharon and came up and reminded all of us that Shapiro was commissioned
four or five decades ago, and it addressed parking.
And since then we've had many more commission reports.
And what's the bottom line to Thompsonville's fundamental problem?
It's parking.
How can a town do 40 to 50 years of commission reports and not fix the parking first before
or any developer comes in and makes a proposal.
That's my point.
Second, at the last PNZ meeting,
our steam professionals said,
this project meets the town's PLCD goals.
I would like to point out, the PLCD is a guideline
as this commission stated,
at the time of adopting the PLCD.
Lastly, how does this project move forward
When the town council did not accept the grant funds, thank you, I appreciate your time.
Thank you.
I don't want to speak about this spoken.
Is there anyone who hasn't didn't sign up that would like to speak about this issue?
Please come forward.
Good evening, everyone.
A little out of breath, I ran from the parking lot up on.
I'm not getting any younger.
My name is Patrick Tolerita.
I live at 11 Pearl Street.
I live in what used to be the old Thompsonville Firehouse, so I am directly in vicinity of this proposed development.
I have certainly been around town long enough to have heard the tales of progress in Thompsonville,
and the efforts that have been made each time they seem to be stymied, where the economy gets in the way,
But something I always jeopardizes it and I see living in Thompsonville now that we're taking
Small but steady progress, and I think that we need to continue to do that. I have paid attention
Watching this on on video to this progress of of what you're deliberating here this evening and I understand
It's not perfect. I understand that there are concerns within the community. I think some of them are legitimate
I think some of them aren't legitimate, but there's concerns.
And I think there's a couple of deficiencies that are here,
specifically parking.
But I think parking is always going to be a deficiency in Thompsonville,
with every proposed development or any proposed improvement.
And I think that's the case in many downtown locations.
And sometimes the progress needs to come before the solutions do.
And I think there's opportunity in Thompsonville to improve the parking, but we need development, I think, to spur that on.
I think sometimes we sacrifice progress for perfection.
And I don't think we're going to get perfection the first initial steps that we take in Thompsonville.
I'm here to speak in favor of this and I know that this will have an effect on me personally because I live there.
I've proposed before this committee and was accepted to do a business in Thompsonville and the parking that is there that I'm counting on
May be jeopardized because of it. But I also am sick of seeing open lots in Thompsonville. I'm also sick of seeing things not progress. We need to take small steps in order to get where we want to be. I think this commission has an opportunity to night to do that.
It's not everything that we'd want. I would have liked to see some retail involved. I certainly would have liked to see it as a pure market condition establishment.
But I don't think those are possible under the current economic situations in this community and in
Thompsonville itself and my last comment is I'm not speaking in favor of this just for Thompsonville
I'm a resident born and raised in Thompsonville I continue to support it and we'll fight very hard for it
For a long time to come as long as I have breath even though I've lost some breaths running along
But I think that this helps end field in general because if Thompsonville is lifted up,
what all the things that are happening, the things that have been that are moving forward,
that this helps the rest of end field up, because the less attention Thompsonville takes
from either social services, or from our emergency services, educational services,
the better it is for the community as a whole, that the resource is going to be pushed out
throughout the community. So I'm hoping that you'll move this forward and accept this and move the
ball forward for the the residents of Thompsonville and the residents of Enfield. Thank you very
much and thank you all for your service here. I know you're all volunteers. I appreciate it.
Thank you.
So anyway, I'd like to speak for a second time. Oh, no, no, you haven't. Please.
Hi, Sheila Monroe, three Stacey Lee. This is a source object. Let's think back to her
renewal. It wiped out Tomson though. Any plans of making it a little community village.
Residents as well as businesses. The direction changed. And what do we have from it? Housing.
That's it. Now we're all backtracking trying to figure out how to revitalize Tom's
bill. It's a tough situation. You can't build something on something that hasn't has a
foundation. Many foundations, the parking of course. And to get to the parking, you know
that a one bedroom is going to have two people in it. Today's day and age, they're going
to have two cars. So you have to just multiply two, four, six, whatever. There's single
Family homes that have a whole family everybody move every day all move in there's four or five cars
with that house so you can't you're it's under the parking is under
Valuated for sure
So getting back to our renewal
It wiped us out in times and they'll
Taking the bridge down over the self-field bridge that was that couldn't that see the thing is and the reason why I'm bringing this up is we need a plan
We need a vision. We can't just do this and hope for that. We can't do this and hope for that.
Take away this and then expect it to be a beautiful place.
I think, honestly, that if this didn't get changed and it had residential as well as retail underneath,
like most of us all remember, Tom's of the was, I don't think there'd be an issue today.
Because if you have the retail underneath, they're only open certain amount hours a day, so that parking situation is gone.
So I honestly don't support this at all, and I don't think it's worth taking the strand, it's worth doing, you know, taking down a lot of the things that we've got that we don't have anymore.
So this is just going to add more housing that's it and more problems for the people
already have housing there.
That's all I have to say.
Thank you.
So we're going to let you come up a second time.
Go ahead and this burns.
Name an address again.
The 16A Windsor Street in MPL in the time terminal section.
I'm not going to repeat what I have said before.
I'm going to say, I'm a single parent that has raised three now, young adults, in terms of real.
And I would be willing to keep walking to have a place that I can call home for me and my children.
And when I go, they have it.
Like the gentleman before said, we may never have a parking.
Um, my son lives in Windsor-lox, there's a station, there isn't much parking there, but
it's a beautiful place and people walk everywhere.
My daughter lives in New Jersey.
She's older-card.
She works for a kind of come-on-all of the business and corporate-op, and they're watching
in DC.
She doesn't need a card, there's a lot of time she walks, she's only like three miles away
from her job.
I'd be willing to do that, and I'm sure a lot of people like Mr. Frost said a lot of these buildings are so old and they're falling apart.
Building a living is over a hundred years old. How much longer are they going to stay? What happens when they're gone?
I mean, they're burning down like there's no tomorrow.
How much longer are we going to wait?
To there's no buildings until
we look at like the porous
country. We're not
You still have I I work in a day care and I won't tell you how many starting from the very little to elder
These people drop their children off and they have a future looking for and some of them live in Thompsonville
But they're afraid to step on toes. I'm not if it's good for me and my family and everybody else
I'm not looking at just me.
And that's why I said we need to all work together.
Even us work with Mr. Frosting.
Keep going.
We need to be united front.
Thank you.
For the sake of the future.
Thank you.
Anyone else for a second time?
Seeing them and the applicant like to come forward,
I think there's a couple of questions we have
probably for you at this point, based on public's comments.
You know, my name is.
I'll wait for everybody to sit down on Mr. Chairman, so it's not a distraction or I'm not a distraction to that, but
I just want to remind the Commission to this is probably the last time if you have questions for the applicant, okay?
So if I guess I'll start first I guess Mr. Robertson mentioned and I know you guys already talked about before the right away
So if you could explain that again about that right away, please with the map Mr. Robertson can you see the map?
Okay, go ahead.
Can you all hear me?
Yep.
Again, for the record, Francis Vaca, professional engineer, Mr. Robertson, there is this
orientation of the drive aisle right here, as I identify with my cursor, is the existing
location of a right to access.
So in other words, there will be the access to 14 pleasant street maintained throughout the
duration of the project, the proposed plans that were submitted to the Planning and Zoning Commission
show, in addition to what is shown here, all of the stages of the project will require
that a portion of this maintain open for access throughout the duration of the project,
and will, and once the project is completed, this again, because this is a right to access,
this will be maintained throughout the duration of following the construction of the project.
Okay, thank you. Thank you for the explanation. I know you went that,
did I must before? I'm glad we got the honor record again.
Any other questions of the applicant?
ComcentralIME.
Thank you Mr. Chairman.
Last meeting we had a discussion about the previous the original design relative to
retail.
And I believe you sir, you said you did a study on the retail and that's what changed the
plan.
I think it was you, sir, on the left there.
On my left, you're right.
My name is Peter Wood.
I'm Peter Development Consultant to impact residential.
I did not cite a study.
I said the developer upon selection looked much more carefully
at the neighborhood and the retail opportunities.
I believe it was in the first hearing
where Susan O'Dell, from Paul Bailey Associates, presented information and slides showing
how much commercial vacancy there is within a couple of blocks of this development site.
It was learning of the extensive vacancy rates which exceed 50% within the immediate area,
which discourage impact from proceeding with any kind of extensive ground floor retail.
There would be financial obligations to maintain that retail space and in this current climate it did not appear to be financially feasible to do.
So just in the vicinity you said right the vicinity of that building in the immediate area surrounding this site within probably a two and a half to three block radius
Okay, and when it did that what was the rate of vacant office space or what the available office space
Frank you can you look at that slide so we can
Again cover this.
Okay, so I can't see what you're seeing
is an identification,
yeah, so the cursor that Mr. Vaka is moving and scrolling on the orange
parcel is the development parcel that we're discussing for Union Square. So that would
be the development site and what's cited is all of the commercial along, I believe that's
street to the south, identifying where commercial properties are and all of the vacancies in
that area. I don't believe that information actually even includes the shopping center behind
Pearl Street, which is approximately 50% vacant as well. That was spoken to by the public in a
prior, in a prior hearing as well. I think it was the second hearing. So yes, we did attempt to
document for you here what it was that we discovered and our own research that
discouraged the developer from moving forward with an extensive mixed use
development what we did instead was to provide office space that the
developer themselves can maintain on the site on the ground floor facing
North Main Street, as required by the regulations, beyond the commercial or, well, the commercial
activity that the regulations require facing North Main Street on the ground floor,
the developer further offered to provide a community room and a fitness room in the second
building what we described as building B that faces on to church 3. So those are additional
uses that are not residential and character that we're bringing to the site.
So there's no numbers or percentages of office space to that area that's where the
way it's vacant or occupied relative to office space. You did it look at that.
I don't think we actually did this for footage.
I think there's a delay.
I'm sorry, Peter.
I don't think that the analysis included square footage analysis for each one of those buildings.
But as you can see from that depiction and this Ovelar architect walked through those various
I mean, there was to there, but we did not provide a, I don't believe me now, this has included a square picture analysis.
I'm sorry.
Right.
So what I was, what I'm getting at was there is a look at vacant or need for office space.
And specifically what we looked at was the available commercial space in the community.
Okay.
That's going unused.
you think so you said that the owner can support the offices that means he'll they'll have
offices in it or when you say so these will be offices you look forward to the property
manager for that's not to at least to somebody correct there's no
okay so you're not so I see I'm glad we talked about this because I thought you were
going to be renting out office space to somebody who needed to rent an office so
that's not the case will be provided to the onsite property manager
or leasing agent and supportive service providers.
These are third-party providers.
This is not the developer themselves,
but these are uses that will be required
by the existing development.
And then you had said that it was financial, that it would be.
Financial impact or burdened to maintain a, would you say, would it begin to maintain a commercial?
Yes. Again, I think this is in the record from prior hearings. I spoke previously about, in doing a mixed use development, you have to separate the commercial development from the residential development when you're using public subsidies that come from sources such as CHFA and the department.
of housing. Those uses cannot be combined or used towards any commercial activity per se.
So there would have to be a completely separate, condoized structure for any extensive
retail use on the site. In this current market, there are a few opportunities to create new
detail until there's a more robust demand that's created, which is the point of the town
taking these steps to provide housing. This is what will generate, you know, feet on the street
and foot traffic, which will support the existing retail that's in the community and help generate
new retail. It's premature at this moment in time for the town to expect a lot of new retail
in Thompsonville. So, just to be clear, the office space will be occupied for the facilitating
of the building, the property, the manager, for use is related directly to property, correct?
Okay. And the other retail would have been a financial burden to do. It would be a risk
that the developer did not feel was a legitimate risk to take it this time. Correct. Thank
you for clearing that up. One more thing, you and I talked about, I think, what do you
that little strip of land that's now going to be paved. It's currently paved.
It's currently paved. I talked about that and I think I asked you if you had
control that property and you said there is a purchase sale agreement. Correct.
Okay. What about the other parcels? You have control of the other parcels?
The other parcels are all town owned and they're under another as separate agreement
agreement with the town correct so at this point either party couldn't walk away
it would be a courting to the agreement itself there's certain you know protections
and requirements within that purchase and sale agreement that we're negotiated
between the town and the developer okay my questions are answered thank you very good
thank
was turned. I know this whole parking thing is been beat to death, but it is the concern
and being relatively due to this. I took three trips in the area over the course of the last
few weeks at night when people would be home and parked and my question is how did
you come up with the number of available parking spaces on these streets that are
involved? Because I gotta tell you, I've go down there at 8 o'clock, 9 o'clock, and 10 o'clock.
And I couldn't find a parking space to save my life. So I'm just curious how you come up with
available parking when the streets are full at night, I'm going to refer that to our
engine here again for the record, Francis Vaka, professional engineer, the way the regulations
are stipulated it is available parking spaces as in spaces that are able to be utilized
on the street not specifically ones that are full or not full, so it is basically in the
So if I may, if I may, it's not guaranteed parking, it's available parking.
That is correct. Is not guaranteed parking? It is available spaces within 500 feet and to be
specifically clear with regard to the regulation. It is available 50% of the available spaces within
500 feet. And that is the specific reason to point about the guaranteed, the specific 50% number
is specified to ensure that we're not taking all of the spaces.
And if I can't, Joe, if I can't, if you don't mind me helping here, that also come pretty
much comes back to our regulation, is the why it's a TOD district, am I not correct?
Because it's a transit oriented district, whether we like it or not, whatever plan is only
pushing created that zone, it was to deemphasize autos, that's what a TOD is all about, to deemphasize
autos.
You know, again, it's the chicken or the egg, but I just want to make that point so that you grasp.
Oh, our dilemma.
I appreciate it.
Thank you.
I mean, I understand it.
You're working on the regulations, stuff.
But I just had to go and look for myself.
I just find a hard to believe that there's going to be.
Even if people have one car, I don't know.
I'm just, you answered my question.
And if I may Mr. Chairman, please, please,
a Christmas for the record with the Commissioner
Mioing, is that it?
Thank you.
Hopefully.
And in response to your question, and I know that the Chair
made reference to it.
I think it's important just to remind everybody to say,
I know this is the third night of public hearing,
that not only does the proposal meet your,
all your regulations for the T.D.
for this particular development, but it also meets your parking regulations, which you recently adopted
for at this type of development, a TOD development, in the TD5 zone district, which is where the property is located.
In addition to utilizing your regulations and demonstrating compliance with it, and actually we're only utilizing
little over 35% of the parking for off-site, which you can use up to 50% of the total
necessary parking. But we actually went so far. The BSC group did a study, a parking study,
as we presented that at the last meeting, and that was prepared by a licensed professional
civil engineer expert in traffic. And the ITE is something that you do reference in
in your regulations to be utilized when evaluating parking issues.
So we did utilize that, which is standard in the industry, and also the various parking
that's available in the area was utilized in that neighborhood data, but more importantly,
the ITE study, which is based on similar communities throughout the entire country, confirm
that your regulations complies with your regulations will work.
And I know that you're looking at on-street parking at this point in time and you see parking
spaces taken, but there is, and Mr. Baca did perform, B.S. Secret did perform a parking
analysis and had that breakdown as to where all the spaces were available. And most of those
spaces, I believe, were to the south of the property. And that was done deliberately, not taking
credit for spaces that were in the north of the property in the more residential area,
But I just wanted to point out that the plan as prepared is not only does comply with your
parking requirements and your zoning regulations.
And I think that that was reviewed by your staff.
And I believe that they agree that we have complied with it, contrary to what anybody may
be saying in opposition.
And in addition to that there was a neighborhood analysis done based on the ITE study
back up those numbers. So we do meet your parking requirements and your regulations relative to
this development that you just recently adopted to accommodate this type of development as the
chair indicated at TOD development. I would like to also just comment just very briefly that
we've heard a number of comments both ways as far as do you do retail first and then have
people move in or is it the other way around and I think it's fairly accepted planning
practices throughout our country that you really need boots on the ground first.
You need residents there and the residents will bring in hopefully the businesses and
revive the businesses in those current locations where you have all those vacancies in
the immediate neighborhood.
So again, in that Mr. Wood did address that a little more specifically but I was hoping
to touch upon those two items and relative to any parking that may that people in the neighborhood
maybe utilizing existing properties for parking, all of that again was taken into consideration
when the ITE study was done in this development does comply finding it with your regulations.
So thank you Mr. Chairman and members of the Commission for being able to comment on those items.
I do have some questions for Mr. Baca before we in our conclusion. I know Mr. Wood would like to address
the commission, but I understand at this point we're trying to address all of your questions
before we do that, but I just wanted to indicate that to the chair.
Thank you.
Can we finish up as to what the questions for someone to make sure the commissioners are
all set with the questions.
I know you guys have some closing comments you probably want to make.
I'm looking around as if any other questions.
I had a couple of questions for staff since again this kind of wraps that up too.
One of the residents did ask about adding for them.
I'm not mistaken.
They're at the max in our regulations with how many floors or could they go higher?
I think they are at the max plate.
I don't have the right.
I'm pretty sure it's a max.
I just wanted to get that for Rick's one of the residents that asked them.
They could go higher and create more parking space.
But I think you guys are already at the max from a four height.
Yeah.
That's five floors.
Is it five floors?
The vowel height is 55 feet.
Okay.
So it is five floors and you guys only went up how many?
Four.
So you can't go right about 44 feet.
So you couldn't want to have one more story on you
should condense the building which could have created
possibly some more parking.
Hypothetical.
Well, going up another story obviously adds additional cost.
Density in units.
Generates more parking.
That's not my thing.
It's the units.
I'm saying you could have went up.
Now we're building creating more parking.
I guess.
And that's the other concern, frankly,
with adding retail to the site.
Is you're adding a lot more parking when you add retail.
Well, I mean, for the 1500 or so square feet that we're providing in terms of commercial
space on the ground floor and building a six parking spaces, we're required.
And, you know, the more you add, the more parking is going to be generated, so at any
way.
I don't know the question for staff.
Well, another resident mentioned a public parking lot on Pleasant Street, as far as
I can sound, I'm going to look at Commissioner Alainmo, because tonight I know it's very
pretty well.
I don't know if the town ever officially adopted that as a town, parking a lot of
whether that's just the last that people have been using in right, you know, for years.
I don't know of that being an official parking lot.
To the best of my knowledge, I believe it was utilized for the strand and the Lamania
Center.
It was okay.
So the town did adopt that.
So I mean, it was public parking for those cases.
Mr.
Chair, I think I think they would have a, you would have at least our purchase agreement
on that piece parking lot, if it was controlled by the town.
That parking lot in question, who controls it?
It's part of the overall site that is owned by the town that was part of this RFP.
Yeah, yeah.
It's already included.
Yeah.
This will ensure for the parking lot.
There's something that was common to you.
I think it might have been, I forget.
I'm not going to tell you what it used to be, but.
All right.
Thank you.
Any other questions for the applicant?
Or do you want them to wrap up here?
Cursor Grill?
Please.
So I just had a quick question.
How many apartments, again, can you break it down for me on this building?
How, how you have it broken down into percentages?
I know I saw on the paperwork that you had it broken down into apartments where like 20%
and park or housing or whatever you had it broken down in percentages.
I can, I can cite that for you verbally. Do you want to pull up the slide that gives you the breakdown?
Yeah. There's two studios.
It's a total of 70 units. Two or studios.
27 or one bedrooms.
And 41 or two bedroom units.
Okay, so that's all apartments right there. This whole building is basically all apartments
and down at the bottom is for the people who take care of the apartments.
There are some apartments on the ground floor of both buildings, but both buildings also have, you know,
quote unquote commercial or community space on the ground floor.
Quick question, you're right.
We are, we are trying to build up down there.
Okay.
We are.
Here is my concern.
When the housing.
There's like we're proposing there's two types, okay.
I'm going to throw South Windsor out real quick.
They just did something very familiar to this building.
But what they did at the tapers,
they put luxury apartments,
and what luxury apartments does,
springs and money.
When you bring in money,
you help the town.
You supply the businesses that are already there,
the mom and pop and you bring in the business. If the money's not there to the spend, sir,
it's not going to grow. This is my issue. We have a lot of, we are over and, um, unhousing.
We need luxury housing now to bring in and feel, because infill is gorgeous. We have everything
here okay except all the money can bring in the money and everybody will be happy
that's that's where I'm going with this
I, I, I hear you, I, I appreciate your comments. And for me personally, you got a floor. You can go up. The people downstairs can rent. Put your parking if we configure this out. I don't know if this is allowed under the building. In the building, there's the rent is parking. But in the building, you walk out of your car. You hit in elevator. You go up to your houses to actually apartments. Thank you. Thank you.
So give me a second here.
So seeing, I don't think there's any questions.
Why don't you?
I know you had something you wanted to finalize here.
So let's finalize it, please.
Yes, just in response, Mr. Carlos comments,
20% of these units are market rate.
So there is no cap on rents or rather incomes.
I should say on those buildings,
no, they are taxed.
So yeah, 20% of the units are at standard taxes.
And let me just say that
there are various arguments towards what housing does for downtown
and retail areas.
I worked in Stanford for 15 years back in the 90s and just before and after.
Stanford had a real problem.
It's, you know, retail was fleeing the downtown back in the, I think, 70s and 80s.
always damped, saw that problem was to generate housing in the downtown area and the commercial
and retail bloomed following that.
Once you bring the density of residents into a downtown area, you create demand that generate
sales.
And just one other note, the higher-income populations aren't necessarily those that spend the
in local retail areas. In fact, those people who have less resources tend to spend more
of their money on local businesses for their needs than people who have plenty of money
and can go wherever. So I would just offer those two things up to the commission and considering
Cricut Stanford's Greenwich area.
That's Stanford's South downtown.
Right, but that's Stanford itself.
That's Greenwich area, right?
Well, Stanford is...
Greenwich and Daryan.
Lower Fairfax, John.
Yeah, do you sure I'm going with this serve?
I do, all right.
Okay, thank you.
I appreciate that.
No seconds for rule?
Yes.
You're welcome.
No problem.
I'm going to refer this back to our council.
Sure.
However, you guys want to go ahead.
Just put the record again.
Chris Smith, the Vulture and Pearson.
I just had a couple of questions for Mr. Baca.
And then I'd like to turn the conclusion over to Mr. Wooddoge has some summary comments or
some closing comments for the commission.
And Mr. Baca, in your professional opinion, does the proposal comply with and meet the
requirements of the regulatory site-playing criteria provided in Section 9.10.4, the special
permit criteria provided in Section 9.20.2, in the provisions provided in the TD-5 zone
district in related provisions as is commissioned on regulations.
Yes, it does.
And final question in your professional opinion, Mr. Vaca, and this includes your firm's
traffic engineering traffic and parking study that was done. Will the proposal result in an adverse impact to the public health safety and welfare?
No, it will not.
Thank you very much.
Thank you Mr. Chairman for indulging me with that.
I would like to turn it over to Mr. Wood who does have some comments that he would like to provide to the commission and then I'll just wrap up with a very very very short conclusion.
Thank you very much, Mr. Jeremy.
Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, I'll provide this to the staff.
Please, sir.
She's doing that.
I have to get up and stretch.
My knee.
Thank you.
Most of them will go ahead.
For the record, my name is Peter Wood Development consultant
to impact residential development.
The acronym is IRD.
I'd like to take a few moments to summarize the measures.
My client is taken to respond to various concerns and comments.
Express in regards to the Union Square Development
over the past 18 months. In our effort to be a responsible developer and partner with the
town, we've revised our development plans numerous times in various ways based on comments
received in meetings with members of the Connecticut State Historic Preservation Office,
the Enfield Town Council, the Town Administrative Review Team, the ART, and the Planning
and Zoning Commission members, and the public. The developer negotiated purchase and sale
agreements to acquire three adjacent private properties to expand the development footprint,
providing for the addition of a third building facing Pleasant Street.
This allowed for an increase in density to 123 units, while also triggering a review
by the Connecticut State Historic Preservation Office as two of the private buildings to be acquired
and subsequently demolished were within the Bigelow Hartford Mills Historic District.
The design team researched the historic district and incorporated some of the housing
typologies near the site into the new building facades is requested by Shippo, leading
this state agency to approve the plans and conclude that this was one of the most responsive
design collaborations with a private developer in their experience.
In subsequent town council meetings this past year during which the council approved resolutions
two separate times, allowing for the submission of funding requests on behalf of the town
and the project to the Connecticut Department of Economic and Community Development. Certain
town council members in those meetings expressed concerns about the amount of off-site parking
required. The developer subsequently voluntarily reduced the scale of the development by 43 percent,
reducing the unit count from 123 studios, one in two bedroom units to a total of 70 units
in two buildings, removing the proposed third and largest building which would have faced
pleasant street. This reduced the overall parking requirement by 105 spaces and reduce the off-site
parking demand by 62 spaces. It's important to recognize that the parking associated with the current
site plan meets and actually exceeds the zone districts parking requirements that were recently
adopted by the PZC for this transit-oriented district area.
During the first PZC hearing on November 16, one of the public members referenced the
Enfield River Gateway study and encouraged the commission to take these guidelines into account
and encourage the best pops possible design solutions for Thompsonville.
Having already met or exceeded the recommendations contained in the infield plan of conservation and development,
and the infield housing and housing needs assessment,
our team reviewed the findings of the River Gateway study,
and found that our development meets and is consistent with those recommendations as well.
Moreover, IRD, the developer, directed our design team to create a new building designed for the exterior facades,
creating more curb appeal with additional dormers in our ticklish and articulation of the street facing facades.
While adding costs to the project, the developer agreed to offer this alternative design for the commission's consideration.
As further evidence of the strength of the Union Square Development Plan,
on December 8, the Federal Home Loan Bank of Boston approved impact residential developments,
proposal and conjunction with citizen's bank,
awarding $1.2 million in grants and interest rate subsidies to the development.
Impact residential development has made a substantial commitment and investment over the past 18 months,
and reliance on the town's decision to work with IRD and develop this property as a transit-oriented district for the benefit of the town's citizens.
impact residential development will be a long-term owner and partner with the
town of Enfield and its efforts to revitalize the Thompsonville community.
We look forward to that partnership.
Thank you very much.
Final time any questions of the applicant or staff?
Staff any comments, Lori?
We did receive an email from Ronnie Salas this evening and he owns the corner lot over at
in North Main Street?
You'll call Teeville Pharmacy.
Yeah.
So that's the little corner that's been redeveloped
and renovated, it's beautiful.
He's had some drainage issues.
He just wants to just make sure that during construction
that there will be a consistency of having a soil
there's no sheet flow.
So I just want to put that on the record.
He had a couple comments about some people walking over,
but that's, you know, we do work on that.
Okay, thank you. Thank you for getting that in the record. Any other questions for staff?
Ready applicant?
And now we close public care is just discussion among ourselves and we understand.
So I'll entertain a motion to close.
And again, I'll be half of the entire team Mr. Chairman and we thank you.
The commission and your professional staff.
And we look forward to working with the commission in partnership with the town.
I bring this TOD to end field and again, on behalf of our entire team, we wish you everyone
in the commission, your families, a happy and healthy holiday and new year.
And thank you again for your time and process in this application.
Thank you very much.
Thank you all for your professionalism.
Thank you very much.
I'll entertain a motion to close the public hearing.
Motion made by Commissioner Hullinski, second of Vice Chairman to grade a close public
hearing.
All those in favor signify by saying aye, but the record shows unanimous to close the public
now entertain a motion to approve.
Take your time, Secretary of State, whenever you're ready.
Yeah.
Mr. Chair, first of all, there is conditions 27 conditions and I understand that there's a new condition to be added. I can read that in right now.
If you don't, if it's okay with you, if you're comfortable with that, please.
There's an added condition which would make it 28 conditions total.
And the 28th condition would be actually, it's added to the site specific conditions,
which would read as follows when the WPC, WPC permit approval is sought additional research may be required to analyze capacity during weather events.
And with that, I'd like to make a motion.
If I can, I would be conditioned 28-foot at the National Out of the other day,
it'd be conditioned 11 of the site-specific.
That's correct.
Thank you very much.
And with that, I'd like to make a motion to approve public hearing
number 3078 application for a mixed use
development at 20 and a half pleasant,
Street, 16 Pleasant Street, 2 Chapel Street, 1 in 5 and 19 and 21 Church Street, 17 North
Main Street, inclusive of the front parcel with 0.1 acres, impact residential development
applicant, town event field owner, map 24 with lots, 51, 60, 60, 62 and 85, map 27 with
That's 135 162 165 35 and field owner or T5 zone.
Thank you.
There is second.
Seconded by Commissioner Holinski.
discussion on emotion.
Please, even the office, everyone's opinions and comments count.
Commissioner de Grey started first.
Well, it's been a long time with us.
And I've written down everybody's comments,
gone through them, reviewed the meetings.
And I realized I had to put my emotions aside.
I lived in this town.
I have lived in Thompsonville.
Some of the places I lived down town were not great.
And if I had a helping hand when I first got married,
we probably wouldn't have had to live in some of the places
that we did. But this is a way to give a hand up.
I have to think about the future and I appreciate
Christian because Commissioner D. Antonio first some of his insight because this is going to be
your town and your children's town and their children's town. And so that's what I have to think
And then I thought about, well, the train stations coming and it should be coming online about the same time as this housing comes to fruition.
So there will be more parking spaces when the train station gets developed.
So a lot of these parking issues will actually go away.
and also
I've had to park on the street and I've gotten tickets when I've lived down in town, downtown. So, yeah, I understand
the parking issues, but I also understand we have to move forward. We have to look to the future and
not everybody's going to have cars and there's a lot of people I know that don't have cars anymore. They do
They do busses and they do different types of transportation, they have the e-bikes, they do scooters, so I think this is really a fit for the future, and I think we have to consider that, and I think they've addressed all of my concerns, and I think they've addressed all of the towns concerns, so this isn't going to happen tomorrow, it's going to happen two, three years.
So I am in favor of it.
Thank you. Thank you for your comments.
Commissioner, you know, Christian Dintoni was first no offense. He was he is up.
I appreciate the sentiment. I can assure the degree.
I will just carry on that sentiment and say those are all great points.
And Thompsonville is, you know, the center of town.
It is our transit oriented district.
And we should continue to enhance it as that, and you're absolutely right, is that the past
has not always been transit oriented, unfortunately, you know, sad, you know, there is a
lot of car dependency, which is why we have all these parking concerns, because there's
the assumption everybody is going to have their own car, every person, every resident, which
is not, it's not the case, it's not a definitive,
and it's not necessarily the future we
want to build for Enfield. We don't want, we don't actually want in abundance of parking,
that's just going to sit foul. We want the right amount of parking. This developer is building
what they've proven to be the right amount of parking for their development. And then I think we've
a lot of information here to go forward into the future as a town, as a planning and zoning
commission, and then working with our staff and town council, of course, to develop
the appropriate parking regulations for Tomsonville for the rest of the town to address
these in the future. We're all used to free parking. That is certainly something we've
used to for a while. It's not a God-given right. We have a limited amount of space, especially
in Thompsonville. And I mentioned this before. There's other strategies we can take to
parking besides just building excess parking just in case. So going forward, we have a lot
things at our disposal. We have a great staff, well trained, and they've proven themselves
well. They will work with us in improving the way we handle parking. We're not unique
across the country. There's lots of lots of places, much, much bigger cities and ours that
have no parking minimums. It's not even radical anymore.
So, but anyway, I digress.
I do think this project is good. They see the requirements. I just want to add one thing
regarding the motion, which is the architectural style. We don't have that as a condition,
But I know we kind of have the option between the two so I don't know how we're going to address that
We may want to put that as a deployment. Thank you for reminding us of that. Yes, so
thank you, Christopher
So I guess as we go. I know everyone is probably going to have a comment. So I guess I'll go around and pull Christopher to do have a preference to the architectural design
I had no issue with the first one, but then they did present the second one and I have to say the second one is a nicer fit
Okay, so I'll ask that question of each person who comments, so we'll take a poll.
We can always go back and make that a condition.
Actually, Jimmy was before you can.
Okay.
Are
you doing the survey?
Or the?
No, give me a comment, or you can do whatever you want to give me.
Yeah, whatever you want.
Reflexible.
We've heard a lot about parking.
And I understand that on paper it meets the criteria.
I still have a problem with it.
I've lived in town my entire life.
And every time you get on a Thompsonville,
I'm sorry, but you can't find a place to park.
The other thing I had a problem with was when this was first presented,
it had mixed use.
And we've been pushing Thompsonville for mixed use.
And I understand that there's the empty retail
in the vicinity, but they're old.
They haven't been kept up.
the owners are not putting back into the building.
This would all be new, clean, safe, retail.
And that's what I would like to see.
Also, too.
Thank you.
Commissioner Hoonsky.
Yeah, I'm very familiar with the top civil area.
When we were first married, we lived on Wallnut Street,
which is right near a lot of the vacant areas
vacant commercial areas that as of today. But back then it was kind of teaming place.
I was very impressed by the presentations and the professionalism of IRD.
I have to give you my highest compliment. It's one of the best presentations I've heard
in this type of line of work, so I have confidence in you as a developer and I think
you're, you've already proven you would do the right thing and you made the changes
requested and went above and beyond I think so I'd just like to say that I think that's
a real strong reason to be in favor of this and I am in favor of this development I think
it's going to really help the Thompsonville area and I agree with the promise that you need
boots on the ground before you're going to start developing commercial type businesses.
So I'd just like to make that comment and I am in favor of the newer facade.
Thank you, Kim.
Anybody else have any comments?
Christian one. Thank you guys for coming to Thomsavill and give it a good look. So the first
plan that was presented with the mixed use and retail on a lower levels really really got
the community excited and especially the people like some of us up here that were born and brought up in Thomsavill.
And, you know, we call it the gateway and you mentioned one of the studies, but there's other
studies that were done.
I think Russell Gibson, Van Dolan, was the name of one of the studies.
One of the companies that did a study 20 years ago or 25 years ago.
And again, they referred that maybe didn't call it the gateway, but that's going to be the
like it was. So I think that that first presentation gave a lot of people a lot of hope
and to see it come back.
I have very mixed feelings because I want to see times of the
guilt. They'll get redeveloped. We'll talk about our emotions.
But you know tonight when I asked
question I wanted to make sure I had a straight about office versus retail.
You said the
office, I imagine you were renting the offices out to whatever small company, small little
startup company or a printer or whatever, a cigar shop or whatever, not a cigar shop,
sorry,
a small startup. That's what I envisioned. To me, that still makes use. But now tonight,
it told me the offices are for the company itself for the facilitate the daily operations.
That's not an excuse,
so I kind of changed my mind tonight. I'm sorry, but I'm not going to
want to say it was misleading or bait and switch or I don't want to use those kind of words,
but it changed. And now for me tonight, and then you mentioned finances, monetary
reasons, monetary reasons aren't acceptable. I mean, that's not our problem.
That's
monitorial support, monitorial resources to support retail.
I mean, that's to me, that blows it out the window for me, too.
So again, I appreciate you wanting to do this.
And I think if it's stuck to the same initial proposal,
now you don't have any mixed use, none.
So I'm not going to support this tonight.
maybe you can come back.
I wish you do and come back with something else, but it got
to have the component of the mixed use in there and I think people will come. You know,
the mixed use, the people that live upstairs support the downstairs. I mean, that's kind
how it always worked, and then other people would come to the stores.
So I think the mixed use piece for me, now that it's not mixed to me, it's not mixed
to me, it's not mixed to me, it's not mixed to all.
Whereas parking too is somewhat of an issue for me, but I'm looking at more what you're
presenting and to what it used to be to the many studies that have been done over the
30 years that targeted that entrance, that main entrance to be a mixed use area where people
could come in, shop, live, and then the outer areas would be the residential areas.
So you mentioned before Pearl Street, North Main Street, that's how both of those streets
were. They were mixed use, and then the residential were kind of spider-web-dough. There was
some mixed use scattered within as well. But, um, so again, I really appreciate you looking
at Enfield coming to Thompsonville. We've been waiting a long time, but I'm not going
to support this and its current situation for the reasons I've given. Thank you.
If it does get approved, that's sort of still want to have your opinion on what architectural design you might have liked.
Number two.
Okay. Thank you.
Anything else?
John.
Number two.
John, do you have a second off?
No comments.
If you have no comments, I guess I have.
Of course everybody knows I always have comments, right?
So, first thing I want to add is, to me, you know,
Why did we create a TOD district at all if we're going to be going this far with this project and why did the past planning is only
Commissioned create the TOD TOD zone at all we were going to consider in a positive manner of development such as this
That's the question I have so my personal opinion is if this goes down tonight
I think you guys in a future route go look back go back and get rid of the TOD what you have it for it's meaningless
Why have it but even though you might be not quite happy with this particular project
That wasn't my concern at the top of my head.
And I like what was brought up tonight.
Parking will always be a problem in time.
So Parking will always be a problem in a quasi-urban development.
And regardless of what the town is,
you could talk about a parking garage all you want.
And maybe we do need another empty lot,
found somewhere where the town could create another little municipal park
and I certainly would be an advocate of that.
But Parking will always be a problem.
And you can't, if we're going to keep using Parking
as an excuse to not go forward, we're
I never going to go forward with anything in this town, and believe me, I was born and raised there, too, my parents were born and raised there.
I grew up there, I'm affect the first two years in my life, I live on Windsor Street.
I remember family members in cold water, flats, boiling water on the stove, so I know all about Thompsonville.
Matter of fact, that was the aid to a council and during redevelopment, and I came down here every day and did my inventory for him,
tough, all things were progressing.
And yeah, there was some bill that's got torn down to shouldn't have been absolutely there's also buildings that should have been torn down that never were so it's a nicks bag on that one
Irving it over ruined times of ill
Castle was already ruined before Irving it will I lived here was born here always was
You know, we didn't count on the browns building burning down that hurt. We didn't count on that. Did we it maybe
Toss a bit a lot different at the brown building never burned down
You remember the brown building but Western Idaho stuff in it, all right?
We didn't count on the bakery moving out of the old teen center slash grants and that would have been viable to those things happen and tons of ill has changed and we
We need to change with it. We need to go forward. And I really like what was brought up tonight about Mayor Storton, who brought in here, I'm going to give a Republican some coup d'hose. And I don't mind, because basically she's right. What comes first, a chicken or the egg, right? You build the housing first, and then the economic development occurs. We have a train station coming, right? At this point, I trust that people in the state, what they're saying and money's been somewhat there. They're going to be going for that. This project, based on our timeline, is going to be happening concurrently with
that, or maybe just a little bit before that, like I think you brought up, so again, we need
to have the boots on the ground, you have the boots on the ground with this many people now
economic development starts occurring. And yeah, you know, parking needs to be addressed at
this level, maybe the council level, economic development commission, I'm not sure, but they need
to be looking at another lot or something, even regardless whether this project comes forward or not,
winter parking is an issue, no doubt about it. But like we were saying before, our regulations don't
guarantee parking. They say available parking. If you want to make a guarantee parking, change
a regulation to say guarantee parking. I guess that's my point. We have to go by the regulations
here. So having said that, I probably said enough. I am for this development and I'm for option
number two. I did like, even though I did like option number one, didn't bother me. Option number
one, minding me of that facility just as built and harford and a corner of Maine and park,
kind of, but option two is a little bit nicer. So I do like the architecture option two.
So, having said it after my comments,
seeing none, I guess Mr.
Oh, thank you.
So, I would like to, again, I usually don't do this, but I would like to add as a condition.
If someone would make condition 29, the architectural design be a number of proposal number
2, I think that would cover it, Laurie, you think that would cover it?
Would someone please make that motion?
So moved.
How did that?
I'm a lot of the laugh right, everybody a little bit.
Commissioner Halinsky made the motion that the architectural design, the second one
and proposal BD accepted one, seconded by Vice Chairman Higley, all those in favor of that
condition.
I know you know, however you vote, so that was condition 29, that was unanimous
to that
What did the gray for Virginia Higley against Francis Olibon against Joseph Meway for
Kenneth Olensky for and John Petrano is for let the records show to this application has passed and has been accepted
And we will be moving forward this project
I notice it's contentious a lot of people, but please
I know this is a contentious with a lot of people and a lot of the vision and the talent over this project, but just playing his own and a five to two vote has a firm this project in this case is closed.
Thank you very much everybody.
Give us a second to get collected and we'll move on to the next.
I will entertain a quick five-minute recess by the room clears motion motion-based by Vice-Chairman DeGrease,
Second of Vice-Chairman Higley for a five-minute recess all those of favor.
Alex, we're taking a five-minute recess.
I call this meeting back to order everybody please.
Mr. Secretary, could you please open the hearing on pH 308MA please?
Yeah, Mr. Chair, I think this was right in the legal notice of running last meeting.
I couldn't really do that again.
No, it's okay.
Maybe we should, because we didn't actually hear it.
If you don't mind, we'd table.
Thank you, if you don't mind.
Yeah, with that right on our agenda, whatever.
Okay, just so the public kind of knows what it is.
Sure.
Public hearing.
Number pH 3080MA 1721 L Street map 26 lot 18 application for a Zoing map amendment from
our 33 zone to be El Zone Triano properties LLC applicant owner map 26 lots 28 29 and
one 18.
Thank you, the applicant to represent this here.
Good evening, Mr. Chairman. Yes, for the record. My name is Attorney Paul Smith, 27 self-maist treatments or locks.
I represent the applicant owner, which is Triano Properties LLC, to my right as the ZIAC.
The engineer with Hesketh Associates who did the maps for the zone change and to my left is Frank Triano, who is a member and representative of Triano Properties LLC.
What you see, Mr. Chairman, and members of the Commission on the screen is the zone change map.
As you can see, this property, which has been in the triano family for about 20 years, I believe,
is two pieces that are on Elm Street,
And then a rear parcel,
which is to the rear of Elm Street, in terms of location, this area, basically is on the north, I guess you would call a north side of Elm Street.
It's bordered on the east and north by residential and on the west and the south by
properties owned BL or BG.
So this property has been in the Triano family for some time.
They're looking to initially develop the frontage parcels on Elm Street, and from that
carve out a rear access driveway to the property which is located in the rear.
The total parcel that we're looking to rezone is 7.5 acres.
I would suggest, as you look at this map, that this is really, and I'm sure you're all familiar
with the area. It's a transitional zone. Again, where you have a business BL and BG business
general, a budding the property, and then on the other side you have a large vacant R-33
zone. So, the goal is initially, as I said, to develop the front parcels for commercial
purposes, and then to extend that commercial use into the rear a lot, I would know top
of graphically, the rear a lot is fairly challenging because there's extensive wetlands
on that lot. So when you say it's going to be developed, it's a limited, the development
is going to be limited back there based on the wetlands, which is a fairly substantial portion.
We proposed BL because that's obviously a little bit more of a limiting zone in terms of what's allowed for business uses.
I think Frank could speak maybe to a long-term vision, but I would think it would be a couple of buildings, single story,
medical use or some light retail use, something like that, nothing with any significant impact.
And so it's, they think, now is the opportunity, they own obviously other parcels on that street that they've successfully, successfully developed for business uses.
And they think there's an opportunity here and now move forward with these parcels.
I don't know, Frank, if there's anything else you want to add.
David, did you want to go to the point of your day?
I'm glad you're here.
Good evening, Mr. Chairman.
Members of the Commission, my name's Dave Zayak.
I'm a professional engineer with F.A. Haskell.
And just to maybe expand just a little bit more with Paul was saying,
in particular, the idea would be to demolish the two homes
that are on the two lots along Elm Street.
And integrate that development with the bank and the medical center.
So it would all be tied together.
We have to have limited driveway cuts out
into Elm Street, it's a state road.
And the idea would be to integrate the parking there
and the whole look of the facility as one from the corner
all the way down.
And then the idea was, well, what do we do with the back parcel?
It's a fairly large parcel, certainly, for the neighborhood.
But as Paul indicated, it's chopped up with a major wetland.
and then of course there will be buffer requirements to the surrounding residential uses just by zoning.
So the thought was to, it's essentially a strange parcel, it's landlocked and no one really knows how it got that way, but it is.
It has no frontage on any public street.
So logically, the best shot to do anything back there will be to get a driveway through the wetland area
going to be a difficult application with the wetlands commission and then bring any traffic
and access to that back piece through the front piece out to Elm Street. There will be
no other access points to the surrounding neighborhood. And that's about it. It's been a
piece that we've looked at with the Toronto's now for a number of years. And this seems like
we've talked the thrill we think this is the most logical thing is to expand some business
use down to the location and then do our best to integrate that back larger piece through the front
piece back to Elm Street. It certainly has no practical use as like an R33 live. It would remain
undeveloped.
Right, so maybe if I may have had to have a question to not come kind of confused if Commissioner
of the mind. So are you saying that there's going to be no curb cut onto Elm Street or you
No, they'll probably be one more curb cut onto Almstree.
We're the two lots are. Right, so that would remain and to be at least one clerk that you're going for to host the four.
Yeah, and that would go through up into the back. Yeah, okay. And then another access through to the other medical building and the bank and the back.
The idea is to tie that all together nicely.
Okay, I just confused about the clerk. I know, okay. Thank you.
All right.
Sorry to interrupt.
Good evening.
Thank you very much and first of all, happy holidays to everyone.
We've had this piece for quite a while and we looked at it for options and we finally
came to a conclusion and said that there's actually a limited amount of first floor access
commercial and residential and everything else to do right now we're working on commercial
and medical uses here.
We don't want to pursue the homes that are still there.
We find this actually as an opportunity to do commercial work, medical work, because we
have some interest.
People that actually solicit us for our advertisements, there's very few walk-in, first
floor, single floor, access, four medical.
And we're getting a lot of that inquiry right now.
It's very difficult to find a spot and end field for the cost, for the access, for the parking,
and like David said, a lot of the setback issues are a problem.
We've actually had some interest.
We wanted to see if we can see if we can develop something, but this is a little bit of a challenge
site.
We have interest for the front.
We would like to find out if this interest for the back.
And to do that, as Paul and David Ball said, it's a really challenged area because most
of the site in the back on that larger parcel is very wet.
So the buffer on that side is probably going to end off being 50, 100 feet on those parcels
that actually about Elm Street.
The drier or the more raised area is actually on the far side and actually do that delineation and do all that research
It's going to be a challenge. So we talked with staff
We tried to find out the easiest way and we also wanted to be not disingenuous to the commission
We have no intention to do in multi-story
We want to actually have a blend into the community
We have two homes that we've owned for a while. They're both two story
This would be a one-story medical single-floor on-slab, walk-in, handicapped, accessible building.
There's very few left and end-fielders very few now.
And it's hard to actually justify the expense that actually takes for something like that.
But we see this as an opportunity because when we develop the M&T building, which is to be end-field federal savings,
I'm like the previous application, I'm from end-field to I'm a lifer.
So I wrote an I bike downtown for a big hello and I feel for everything that you said at the previous application,
but there still needs to be more investment.
And I still need to have people come down that have to spend some money, want to go and
solicit all the restaurants and all the other activities that are part of this.
And we see this type of development as a blend that has to bridge the residential that's
actually to the east and the commercial or the medical professional that's actually to the west.
And integrating this right into that type of development, we see as an opportunity and
that's why we wanted to bring it for you.
The challenge that we had in working with staff is you have very few zoning opportunities
is because B&L does allow more activity.
And we wanted to make sure that we presented this to the commission, but also to the public
in the sense that we have no intention in the back to build another Hartford hospital building
in the back with multistory, the parking requirements, the setbacks, and probably the density
is going to be very challenged back there.
But we really want to come forward with a zone change application for the purpose that we
want to make sure that you're interested.
We really can't go forward if we know we're not interested.
we feel very comfortable in the front that we can integrate a pitched roof, a very shingle
style building in the front area, but the idea of actually doing that, we have our setback
requirement that everything designs out for a nice little building that would actually integrate
next to and be lower than most of the house sets in the area. In the back, the challenge is how much
can we actually get for density and actually make a view worthwhile. As Mr. Zayak said, has been our
engineer on the site since we actually built that first building in 2005, that it's a tough area.
It's a lot of wetness.
There's going to be a lot of setback requirements, and we're going to actually abide by all
of it.
But to do all of that integration, it's going to be extremely expensive.
But we also want to make sure that you're interested in doing that.
We want to make sure you're interested in doing the front.
We think the front's a very great opportunity to bridge that gap between the residential
and where the beginning and the end might be.
And we think we have the buffer behind it that actually can be integrated into the neighborhood.
And still actually be something that Thompson will gain from.
But we also want to make sure that you knew why we came through with this to tell you that
We're only doing first story, single story, walk in, and we're planning to do the same in
the back.
Even though we're applying for BL at our ART meeting, we actually talked openly about
that has to be clear, that has to be something there.
I thank you again also for not, I guess you can say, my illness, I was actually sick to
weeks ago.
I appreciate the opportunity to come this time because you didn't want to have me there.
It would have been bad for everybody if I'm going to show up to weeks ago.
But the idea is, I wanted to say it myself to let you know, our intention is to actually do a very simple-style
access where fire code, health access,
handy-cap access is all part of the development, but that's also what our intention is to the rear-parsal before people are worried about having a BL district
where we actually have that need. So openly knowing I'm a, I'm a repeat applicant
I think that hopefully would say should some light on what our intentions are not only for such a
I think an access to the front, but also to the rear area that may be given you a concern as well.
And that's why I wanted to make sure it was clear as to what our intentions are for the future.
Thank you.
Thank you very much for that overview.
Questions for the applicant?
Good afternoon.
Mr. Trion, could you elaborate on some of the commercial uses that might come out there?
I know you spoke medical and I'm happy with medical.
Sure.
The first development has worked out very well.
I think on the corner there.
Thank you.
And, but can you just say, Library, I'll maybe, what would the types of commercial businesses
would you be considering there?
You know, it's funny you said that we've had no inquiries for commercial.
We've only had inquiries for professional.
We've had a lawyer, lawyer actually at us, so we had the PT groups, we've had medical.
I know it would allow it, but you know, in the front we already have some interest, which
would take up a good portion of the building and it is not met.
it is medical, it is not commercial.
We understand that the BL allows that.
And I also don't tell that to the back.
The BL is going to allow commercial in the back.
But it's got to be a very low, low traffic, very hidden
with the tree line, as you see, with the wetlands
on the southern side of that larger parcel.
It's going to be hidden.
There's nothing there.
There's no access on Park Avenue just because it's fully developed.
There's with Mr. Rome on that side, on the west side.
there's nothing available for for anybody seeing that opportunity so we're never going
to get any high retail which is another reason why we know we're not going to be doing
some large development back there it'll be single story but we haven't received any
we do have some open space and we can always solicit but at the same time that's not the
intention that's not the expectation so it's going to be something like like you said medical
offices perhaps maybe an optician potentially professional office maybe an account in type
or appropriate.
Something that simple.
Just that kind of thing.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Any other questions?
Have you talked or notified the people on Park Avenue of your 10th, all those of
butters?
We do not.
We don't have to.
We did not.
We also want to make sure that, you know, we don't have a curb cut there either.
So no traffic is going to go on that side.
And we'll make sure that we actually, but as far back with that setback requirement
35 feet. We would probably also want to infill and leave all that vegetation that's up there
now for all those people that are in the same thing on the south side but the south side
we're not going to be able to touch it. It's too wet. I know you'd be reputable and I know
you're word is your word, but I guess I'm concerned even though you don't have to. We don't have to.
Nobody has to. Notify all those butters. There's 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13
butters back there. Summoner multi-family. You know what? We know the street very well.
I'm sure we do. I know we don't have to notify them and here they are. This might be, if any of
them are even interested, you only tend to notice this application is even coming front of us,
if they're happening to be watching this or if the J.I. puts it in the paper or someone puts it in
patch. So that's one of my concerns. I know you didn't have to notify them.
No, and to answer that question, I think the idea is having that delay in having that opportunity
with the signs. We left the signs up for the entire time for the public hearing.
Yeah, you did. You know, we wanted to make sure and I'm not here to mislead me, but we're also
not here to develop any kind of large, high-rise and large traffic.
I'm not planning to do this, but I appreciate what you said because I think it should
be said to the microphone and said to the openness, we're not there to have it be a large
invasive type of activity.
We don't foresee that just like when I mentioned to Mr. Flintsky, that's not what we expect
to happen in the first place anyways.
I just wanted to mention that.
We did receive quite a lot of colors about the property who live across the street behind
on ParkF. You did. Yes. So they were kind of aware we were having a serious night. And none of
them had any objections or concerns. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
Thank you. Thanks for passing on. I appreciate
that. I don't think anyone in public here
but I have to do it from the public. Is there anyone in public that like to speak for
against this application? Anyone in public for the third time? Seeing none. That's done.
There's no questions and no real self questions. Staff have any more questions or concerns?
Nothing beyond what was written in the memo.
So.
But I did see in a memo that I did not.
You didn't allude to anything in our house affordable housing plan.
It's we're supposed to be encouraging affordable housing and not decreasing affordable housing.
And this application would be eliminating some affordable housing.
That is correct.
Thank you.
Just want to get that for the record.
Seeing that.
questions just among ourselves. Most are made by Vice Chairman, Vice Chairman, the
great second by Vice Chairman, Hickley, to close the public hearing. All those in favor
signify by saying aye. To record show the public hearing is closed, entertain a motion
to approve.
Yes, Mr. Chair, I would like to make a motion to approve public hearing. Number 3, 0, 8, 0,
M, A, 17, 21, L, street and map 26, lock 18, zoning map amendment from R33 to B, L.
of Toronto properties LLC applicant owner, map 26, lots 28, 29 and 1, 1, 8.
Thank you.
There are seconds.
Second, I'd like to mention how this can be motion made by Secretary Petramell, the second
of I can mention, it's too approve.
Discussion.
Well, I guess I'm the only one who has a little bit of budget about this.
And I know you're being an honorable business, an honorable family, and your words, you
are, and I know you always do what you set to do.
Please don't take my condos, is anything detrimental towards your operation at all.
which is this area bothers me to be quite frank with you.
And I know you know I know it well.
I'm concerned about another commercial curb cut on
the Elm Street.
Elm Street is turning it to a disaster from all the way up
from past Walgreens all the way down to this light here.
And to me, I'm not looking to create any more commercial areas.
Taring down any more woodlands or certainly Taring down any more homes
for commercial expansion in this town period.
One of the reasons why I'm getting off because I know that's going to happen and I don't see
there's a need and I've been hearing in my travels for a while time.
Most people are saying, my god, another medical facility, how many more chicken places
we're going to get?
How many more gas station?
How many don't can do it?
It's another medical building?
So based on all that, you know, I probably, I know I'm in the minority here, but please don't
take it to this in a fence, it's not.
I'm going to be voting against this zone change because of all the reasons I just stated.
And that's my only comment, so have me said, that's just no one else, because I shouldn't be great.
Just a question.
I know that you're trying to do here.
And since there is a curb cut already for the medical building and for the bank,
I guess I just don't see the necessity for a third one.
You know, because the bank and the medical building was all connected,
And if this is all merged, I'm using the wrong word,
but merge it together, why wouldn't you be able to use that?
And then again, you're not in front of us with a site plan
or anything, this is just a zone, but just a thought,
just to put it in the back here, OK?
And somebody who we know, it's a noodle on it.
So noodle on that.
Thank you.
So being at there's two homes there that have driveways that are curb cuts, so they're there
exist.
So if you combine those two, that makes one no question with the, yeah, we're really close
public here.
Lots ourselves.
So it's already, yeah.
Well, it's different than that in the commercial one.
But I mean, there already is, there are curb cuts, there are curb cuts.
And not commercial.
Yeah.
point yeah anybody else because we just want to make a comment you know we talked about how we all kind
of grew up in Thompsonville and all that and one of the houses we looked at looking for our
first house was on middle road and it backed up to a medical facility at the time it was the small
Johnson wasn't even there and so it was a small medical dental type facility and the owner of that
said best neighbors you could ever have. So they're quiet. There's no parties. You know, so, you know, I kind of think of that, you know, and I'm saying, it's really, I think an ideal use for that land.
Thank you.
Yeah.
As far as the attention went out, they're not here before it's for development.
No, they talked about the extensive wetlands there.
Yeah.
I went and looked again yesterday. I'm so impressed by the noble gas station and what they did over there with that wetland.
They've actually moved it and created a public.
Area where you can go lock around ponds and they have benches and so there are so many different things they can do. I mean, I don't know if they're going to do that. But I don't think that we're thinking about wetlands as wetlands like the Redwood Forest and we got to protect the certain species and stuff like that. But there's that mobile and not mobile, noble gas station, everybody should go back there and look amazing what they did. And that lot that plot back there, that parcel that they've built on. Everybody tried to build on it over the years. No, it's wet. No, it's wet. No, it's wet. No, it's wet. No, it's wet. No, it's wet.
did something amazing. Hopefully, we can see more of that in this community. Because it takes
what lens that aren't used to being used. Again, that'd be careful if I can. This is not
about be careful for what you wish for, because we might end up being just a one big,
impervious coverage, where I just see this happening every day. The thing is, people can actually
go and enjoy that wetland now and walk around there or traffic some more dangerous intersection on
my friend. We're deviating. We have a vote. Let's have a vote. We're deviating. Let's have a vote.
We have Mr. Secretary.
We are.
Four.
John Pachford, I was four.
Approved.
Sixty-one.
Yep. Good luck with the project.
I think you're lucky.
Yep.
Good luck.
Happy holidays.
All you save one.
Sixth one.
Approval.
Could you just place the effective date?
It's in the motion on your paper.
Effective date.
Shadow.
Effective January 1.
Thank you very much.
You're welcome.
So, pH 381-27 pro-Street was withdrawn.
It was applicant withdrew this application.
Due to the fact that it was with 100 feet of a park,
Delale Park, and thus RT, our tons of regulations
for any type of cannabis facility required to be more
than 100 feet.
This was not going to be retail.
It was strictly a manufacturing that was going to bring
some economic development to the town,
but it does not fall within the application in the applicant.
I think at this point decided it didn't want to go forward and come to front of the next
planes only because we tried to get that change.
They just withdrawn.
They're probably looking at a time.
Mr. Chair, was that going to be the Diana's voice?
Yes, please.
So they've moved on.
We've drawn.
If I look in some other opportunities.
Okay.
Going out of pH 383, these young ladies, waiting 383, Z. A. Mr. Secretary.
The Edphil planning and zone commissioner will hold a public care and get their regular meeting
on Thursday, December 21, 2023 at 7 p.m.
the Town Hall Council chambers at 820 Infiltre and Phil Connecticut concerning the following
application, pH number 3083 ZA application of a zoning regulation amendment to allow
the use of veterinarian offices as a separate category in the B.L. B.L. H and B. G. H zones
in table 5.2 0, possum vet care, PLLC applicant, Sarah DuPree, Roe, representative.
Good evening, I guess you're probably all here, so maybe you all identify yourself
in a record if you don't mind, or at least the person who's going to be doing a speaking.
Yeah, hi, I'm Sarah DuPree, Roe, one of the owners of the practice here.
Courtney Snyder?
Yeah, I'm so sorry.
Yeah, nine people in Coronado arrive in Newington.
Courtney Snyder, 64 Kensington, Street, Manchester
Connecticut, one of the owners.
Alexa, suitor, 27, St. Mark, circle in Wilington,
Connecticut, Murray Bates, 83 Brookview Drive
in Vernon, Connecticut.
Okay, thank you.
Thank you for coming.
Please state, you know, why are you here?
So we are looking to be able
to provide additional very badly-needed veterinary care
for the town of Enfield.
The 42 roughly 1,000 person city with only two veterinarians
at the moment, both of whom are part-time,
which means that the majority of residents
are forced to travel well outside of the city
to obtain veterinary care for their pets.
We all work at various clinics around in the area
that we see people from and field seeking care in Manchester, in Bolton, in Stafford, in farming
tin, in Bloomfield. I saw one in North Windom a few weeks ago, and that's a really far distance
of people to have to drive to provide even basic care for their pets.
So the veterinary profession
is being overrun by corporations and we are a local, we've all, we're all Connecticut residents
that are looking to develop a private solution for the city of Enfield and even the surrounding
towns that are also underserved for vet care to be able to get quality personalized care for
their pets. Unfortunately, currently only being available in the, what is it the business general
own. There's not a lot of those locations that are available that are a size appropriate for a
small and well veterinary clinic and so are a veterinary office and so that's what we're
hoping to we're not looking to be providing overnight care or looking to provide you know basically
day outpatient care for patients and that's what we're looking to create a separate category for veterinary
offices that are essentially doing just that.
One of the clinics that is still currently open
and end field, fresh water is actually
technically in the BL zone.
So it would also be bringing them into compliance.
They just need, and field needs more care for their dogs
and cats.
So.
OK, thank you.
Anything else you want to add?
I want to add it all.
to a very good job, to a very good job.
The questions for the commission from the commission.
Good question, Higley.
I noticed that in the separate category,
you list BL historic and BG historic,
you have planned to open up in the historic district.
We, that was actually a commissioner.
Higley, the H stands for Hazardville, not historic.
Oh, Hazardville.
Yeah.
That's interesting.
I take back my question, and I'm glad
that you're not running a kennel.
No, we don't need wonderful this in this town, but not the kennel.
No, and that is specifically what we are not trying to serve.
We are truly just looking to provide medical care.
Thank you.
Do you have any other questions?
We should do it.
Sorry.
It's your hand.
Through the chair.
To staff.
The hazard bill, BL and BG, the setbacks are very, very close 10-foot setbacks in that.
And in hazard bill, where there's availability to where these zones would bake are, lots of houses.
And now I'm a dog, I've had dogs, I had a dog that the vet called me and said, please come get your dog.
He was that loud. He never barked, never. He was a husky, but he had to go there.
He had to stay for a couple hours and when he came to, his hauling was so loud that the neighbors were complaining.
That's what I have a concern about, and hazard vell.
And you're saying there's no overnight, I heard that.
But there will be times when people will have to leave their animal for a couple of hours.
And I have currently have a neighbor who lets their dog out and bark.
And it's annoying.
So that is a concern, especially in the hazard vell district.
is the closeness of the houses in that area.
Any, dear.
And some canals are veterinarian offices.
I haven't really been the one where they keep the dogs outside,
so when the dogs, because she's absolutely right,
I have four dogs, by the way.
And they do bark when they're out there.
But so people are just pulling in.
Basically getting out of the car with the dogs going in your office.
You're going to treat them like a regular, and then they're gone.
That's correct.
This one done.
I wish inside.
And that's how bad he was.
I can sympathize.
I've worked with plenty of Husky's.
But what I will say is that actually veterinary architecture has come a very long way.
And over the years in trying to control sound and odor.
And we are working with a veterinary specific architectural firm to basically soundproof and maximize
odor control and ventilation so that we will be less disruptive to surrounding businesses or homes
specifically for that reason that is actually one of the modern goals of design in veterinary clinics,
Especially because we will probably be looking at building out and existing building.
You know, we want to make sure that that is top priority.
And the two that are not.
The two veterinary hospitals you have in Enfield are in strip malls.
Enfields not.
Enfields not. Sorry. One is fresh water is.
Directly, directly in a location where we, where they share walls.
So, well, fresh water is the one that would be brought into compliance with this.
Excuse me, I understand where that that is.
I have had animals go to that that, but the housing that I'm talking about because
hazard will.
These houses are very close together, especially in the areas that you're talking about.
That one area is strictly strip mall with a lot of medical buildings around
There's not a lot of houses close by, but I don't know if that would be the area that you're specifically talking about
Because that one's already grandfathered in excuse me. I'm sure integrations. I may I think I can probably shed some light on that
Almost like
70 to 80 percent of our retail uses are surrounded by subdivisions
So in the map amendment that you just approve,
completely surrounded by residential.
The other thing is, has your bill might be small,
but it also depends on what they would be building
if anything.
Right now you're just looking at text amendment for use.
That separates a less intensive use
than a much more intense use, like the clinics than whatnot.
So if you're not comfortable with the has a bill,
sections being a site plan review,
perhaps may be considering them as special permit instead. You can listen to the
publics and put about the hazard locations. I think I would be more comfortable with that
because of the proximity of the houses and the density of just because I've looked at the maps.
I don't know if the rest of the commissioners have those maps, but I have them and I see how close
the houses would be in those areas.
So, absolutely.
So, yeah.
So, of course.
Of course.
So, what you could do instead then is just take out those proposed BLHs, BGHs and instead
of an SPR, you could just make it a SP, that would make the commission more comfortable.
And I'm sure the public would appreciate that too in regards to location.
I also find the veterinary and architect specifics to be very fascinating because I'm sure
I'm not too familiar with the veterinarian field, but I'm sure I'm moving forward
to follow this new technology development that any proposed building that a vet, utilizing
this architecture, takes over when you utilize those sound odor, proving measures, but just
something to note.
And we certainly respect your concerns.
They are valid and we are definitely appreciate, we do not notice familiar with the hazard
bill specifics and we certainly appreciate those considerations.
So if I make a shot at this motion to approve, so it's my own mind here and maybe help
some of the commissioners.
So what you're recommending, George, is something like this?
I'm excuse me.
Okay.
So what you're recommending is something like this.
If we were to approve, the application of zoning regulation amendment to allow the use
veterinarian is a separate category in a BL zone in table 5 to 20. In addition, it would
be allowed in the BLH and BH zone, but by special use permit only. Correct. And it would
remain the way it is for business professional and by special permit. So the only site primary
view would be the BL zone. BLH and BGH and BGH and BGH and BGH and BGH and BL. Not regular
BL. No. Regular BL would be site primary view. That's correct. Yes. Okay. You got that, John?
BLH and BGA should be by special use permit only or not by on the FCA to work only.
Yeah and the BP which is currently allowed in is already a special permit.
You don't see too much vets going into the business professional zones but throughout and field and our plaza is we have a lot of split zone to locations more than we realize sometimes and one of the
malls is BG and BL so why not just make it both plus the benefits the public event field
for traveling distances and so you have an emergency during the day.
MPGH, MPL. Oh, you want to make all three of them? No, no, MPLH, MPLH, MPG, MPG, just the hazard bill. Just the
hazard bill stuff. Yes. Keep some happy.
Any other questions? So what kind of do let me not think for
all you people in the audience, is there anyone out there speak for against this? One, two, three times
done, done and on. That's actually the last time I have to do that, but I don't know. Any other
questions? Any questions here right now? We still have the one in residential area right in all of
the roads that like the only one we have. That's one of the two. Right. That's still functioning,
right? It is functioning in residential area. That's around one part time doctor. Not sure if
it's farmland. Yeah, I'm not sure if it's farmland there or the zone farm or zone. It's
owned industrial when I look at it. That's old industrial. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think I'm back. Most
most of our vet places are not conforming but at least with this text amendment one of them gets close
Yeah, they'd be too, so they're just like a part-time now.
Yeah, they used to have three doctors.
They're down to one part-time doctor over there.
No wonder why my phone doesn't ring as much
because my phone number's very close to theirs.
My dog's second.
How you a wrong number?
All right, staff, have any more questions?
Thank you, sirs?
Nope.
It's pretty straight away.
I'm getting motion to close this public hearing.
It's good.
Motion made by Commissioner Vice Chairman Higley, seconded by Commissioner
Felensky to close this public hearing, all those in favor.
Seeing the five by saying I, it was unanimous to close the public hearing.
Mr. Secretary, whenever you're ready to make a motion to approve.
Mr. Chair, I'd like to make a motion to approve public hearing number 3083 ZA application of a zoning regulation amendment to allow the use of veterinary and offices as a separate category.
and BL zone, and by special use permit, and the BLH and BGH zones in table 5.2.0,
possum vet care, PLLC, applicant, serodupri, row representative, subject to the certain
criteria limitations and application procedures.
Is there a second?
Seconded by Vice Chairman Heagley. Any discussion?
Seeing none, Mr. Secretary, whenever you're ready for a roll?
Yeah, a little Fiori.
Approved. Yes.
Linda the Gray.
For Jenny Higley.
For Francis Alimov.
For Joseph Mueley.
For Kenneth Alensky.
For.
And John Petrono was for.
The record show is unanimous approval for this use change.
And we're all set.
Thank you.
I would say effective January 1 it says okay all right January 1 no because they need to move I would say effective January 20 December 23rd
I heard, twenty twenty-four.
Twenty twenty twenty three two three.
All those are favour that.
Safety status tomorrow.
I need you guys to carry on so I can check the
carpet.
Make A Mr.
And tomorrowdays 22nd.
Okay so it's a next day.
Is it a gift staff chance to do all the
people?
pussy.
Happy, baby.
Okay, but not bing.
So, where are you going?
I don't plan.
Oh, you'll be right.
I think you're going to be a couple of blocks.
Yeah.
I was going to deal with Christ.
That's a good location.
Very close to Summers as well.
It's a great location.
I've been working with this applicant for about six months now.
Please, we all sit on Saturday.
If staff's okay.
Yeah. I put there's only a permanent hole. You're lucky ladies.
Yeah, that's a really good luck. Very close. Very close.
They're lucky.
Come on condition. You've got to serve me.
Well, it is very well.
All right. There's no old bit lately for staff here.
There's no old business, there's no new business, other business is staying on, just as
a filler for staff to get back with a new commission, is there any correspondence,
any
commissioners' correspondence?
Coach, are you late?
I just want to wish everybody happy holiday Merry Christmas and I'm very sad to see you
go, sir.
Thank you.
Appreciate anybody else?
I just want to acknowledge the fact that we're going to be losing three commissioners at the end of the year, including our Chairman, Mr. Commissioner Fiori.
Commissioner Fiori, thank you for your service here as Chairman of this August body.
I think you've done an excellent job over the last couple of years.
I'd also like to acknowledge Jenny Higley, who I've known for many years.
she's done a great job and we're going to miss her experience on this planning and zoning
commission. So thank you very much. And it also like the acknowledge Nicola Fakus. I didn't
know Mr. the Fakus before becoming a commissioner, but I appreciated his insight. It was professionalism.
And I thank him as well if he's listening. I wish him a lot of good luck as well. Thank you.
So I'd like to go next. I'd like to go next. I'd like to go next and Alex, I'd like to
Followed a camera to each person I call out instead of me could take the camera off of me if you don't mind
So I know Commissioner Lefakis is not here tonight, and I want to thank him. I know he's probably going to watch
Two years ago when our party one majority I contacted Mr. Lefakis about whether he wanted to climb a plane zoning
Mr. Lefakis 20 years experience is sitting on this board articulate and intelligent professional a lot of experience
He sat on here as a full-time member and after I talked with him he said he would come on as an alternate to help us
And I want to thank him very much.
I wish he was here tonight.
I enjoyed serving with him.
I really doubted that I was on a council.
I know Kenny too.
He was part of Plains, only back then.
So we're well aware.
And thank you, Nick, wherever you are.
Commissioner of the Antonio, I didn't know you from a holding wall.
Until you sat here, you have shown us an aptitude for these regulations.
You bring a whole different generation to this commission that we didn't have before.
And I know you're going to have a fine future as a commissioner.
It's not even going to a different board and I want to thank I got to know you well during the last two is done a great job
and I know you're going to continue to grow and do a great job with the next commission.
So I want to thank you.
Commissioner Hulinski, you and I go way back and people might not know this, but Ken was on the board of Edwin.
I was on the council and then Ken became chairman of the board of Edwin.
I was deputy mayor.
We were 10 in hand.
And then when I had to resign from the council for health reasons.
The first person I reached to would be interested in taking my place was Mr. Hulinski.
He went on to be Deputy Mayor, kind of I go way back and when Tony unfortunately passed away,
kind of I met at Tony's wake, and I indicated him in the willingness to come on this board,
and kind of I want to thank him as wonderful working with you again, and your professionalism, again,
your knowledge has been well overseed, and I couldn't have done it without you thank you.
Mr. Petronella, thank you. I didn't know you. I knew your family, but I didn't really know you.
We got to know each other well. I think work well together. I want to thank you again for
You know, volunteer and to be the secretary of Tony Pass, you've done a tremendous job.
The last two years doing that, and I'm just working with you, I know you're going to
do fine with the next commission too, and it's been wonderful working with you.
Jenny, when I do a lot of things outside of this too, I want to thank you.
Your support as Vice Chair has been tremendous to me.
People don't know, I do the only person I talk to as Jenny, we go through the agenda.
Before the meeting, just in case something happens to me, so she can fill in.
her support and her knowledge has been trance and I thank you for working with the last two years and I'm sorry you didn't get
reappointing.
Thank you.
I know our paths across before and not in this level, but you've been wonderful to work with.
I know what kinds of our views are different because we've come from two different political parties
and I know this is not supposed to be political commission, but you know that's why you're
in parties.
But you've been great to work with, you're knowledge and having to use the other vice chair
filling in a secretary has been very thankful, I really enjoyed working with you.
So thank you very much, and I know you're going to do well.
Frank, people play not know this, and I don't mind sharing us our family's go back
probably over a thousand years.
Right?
Probably longer.
That's right.
My uncle was one of your brothers, Godfather's, and I'm old in a new, but I remember you and
you were a little of a guy, a group of brothers, more than a new Frank, but I enjoyed
we sparred.
And that's fine.
Good spars, good thing.
But it is.
It's a good thing.
As long as you can be respectful and friendship after shake hands.
Shake hands.
That's the problem with the world today.
And if we say something wrongly to apologize afterwards, that's the way it should be.
What I want to add is no one probably watched your back more than I did.
I want you to know that.
Thank you.
And I know you didn't do well going forward.
Thank you.
Joe was really nice sitting in the last two, three months or two.
We're not going to get a chance to sit more right?
No, you're going to do well.
You've show me some stuff.
I know you're going to do well in the next commission.
You seem to have an attitude for it in an understanding.
And you know, good luck going forward.
And thank you for the last couple of months.
It's been a long time. I've actually learned quite a bit and I've watched over here. It's been an honor.
Yeah, it's going to even learn more. You're going to learn a lot more. It's a lot more to learn.
If any, you know, I do have something to say, you know, basically I wish you had stopped coming.
I did reach out to you numerous times. I do want to mention this is not personally against you, but I have to mention something
because Councilman Nelson brought up the council meeting, which is totally from my standpoint,
the Ronus has nothing to do with you personally.
So I know why you need to take this as a personal counter towards you.
But Councilman Nelson indicated an council on TV that you stopped coming because I stopped you from hitting
sitting on the Felician Sisters application, and that is a Ronus.
You did the right thing by recusing yourself from that application.
That was also the advice from our local staff, our town attorney, and from staff.
And the applicant themselves asked you to recuse.
It wasn't this chairman.
I did agree with them.
I thought it was in the best interest in this commission for the integrity of all of us
because I'm really important about the integrity of each one of our commissioners.
You did do the right thing.
You did recuse yourself and I want to thank you for that.
And I want to thank staff.
You know, I don't know if you know how, not I'm not going to.
I never cry.
We do work closely together.
I do want, I think some of you guys really know that.
We have worked closely together last two years because I'm in here.
So you've had that advantage of having your chairman in the building where we've been able to
and I've been able to dissect some things and with the agenda and things coming up.
It's been wonderful. I hope I've been a help. I know you've been a help to me and I'm
miss working with you, but I want to thank you all. So having said that, I'd like to entertain.
Do you have anything else you want to add? I just want to say I really appreciate you taking the time
to discuss things with staff and just being there as like a chair should and just being supportive
and just conducting great meetings overall.
So thank you for your service.
Thank you.
And I did know that all of that, it's been an honor and a great learning experience because
you've brought great insight to me and staff as to the history of and field that certainly
plays into how we plan.
Yeah, sure.
Thank you.
I would like to add, and I'm looking this way, because I know how it works.
Whoever is going to be the next chair from your contingent, please continue, like, I
met with them weekly.
You don't have to do that, but at least on a monthly basis, I think that it was so beneficial.
And we're not talking about conducting business behind closed doors, just informative talking
about the agenda instead of just getting it in email and just keeping staff abreast of things.
Whoever's going to be the chair, I highly recommend you continue and I think it was
very beneficial with that continuing. It has been very nice to have a chair and person
go over the agenda. Yeah, thank you. Absolutely. So if you guys have anything else you want to
add tonight for me to go home? Yeah, for. Um, does this receipt of applications? Okay. Let's go.
So public hearing, 384, Gary World, Nissan, expansion of outdoor display at six park and 809,
field street and 385 grades at Flood of Club 98-106 Pro Street. And again, thank you all.
It's a great second to the race club on Pro Street.
I thought they were going to tour on Mondays.
Thanks have changed.
They're going to tour with you.
You know I used to live there.
They're going to be hungry.
That brings back 45, 50, 60 years of memories.
All right.
I'll entertain a motion to adjourn.
So moved.
Motion made by Vice Chairman Higley, Second Life Vice Chairman of Greater would adjourn
this playing his own commission.
I can't, is it nine, 45, nine, 45.
Thank you very much, everybody.
Merry Christmas and happy new year to everybody in that field.
Goodnight now.