1
00:00:05,072 --> 00:00:32,499
So the connection to this one
really? Gotcha. Okay. Thank you.
Sorry. That I. Saw you at Saint

2
00:00:32,499 --> 00:00:36,637
John's this morning. You go to
church there? Okay. You live
close by. I live next door to

3
00:00:36,637 --> 00:00:42,576
the church. Every Tuesday
morning, I have a 730 group. Oh,
you're welcome to join. Okay.

4
00:00:42,576 --> 00:00:48,682
Good to know. Yeah. It's coffee.
I saw you fixing up the yard. I
think about 7 a.m. this morning.

5
00:00:48,682 --> 00:01:54,448
Yeah. Yeah. What you doing
there? Right now? That's. Right.
Good morning everybody. This

6
00:01:54,448 --> 00:02:00,420
meeting of the Escambia County
Planning Board for September
1st is hereby called to order

7
00:02:00,420 --> 00:02:05,826
with six members present. We do
have a quorum. Just a reminder
to turn off all electronic

8
00:02:05,826 --> 00:02:12,366
devices or set your phones to
silent. If you would, please
stand and join me for the

9
00:02:12,366 --> 00:02:20,107
pledge. Pledge allegiance,
pledge allegiance to the United
States of America and to the

10
00:02:20,107 --> 00:02:27,681
Republic for which it stands.
One nation under God,
indivisible, with liberty and

11
00:02:27,681 --> 00:02:35,355
justice for all. Alrighty. Do
we have proof of publication?
Yes, sir. The publication meet

12
00:02:35,355 --> 00:02:39,226
all legal requirements. Yes,
sir. I'll entertain a motion to
waive the reading of the legal

13
00:02:39,226 --> 00:02:45,198
advertisement. A motion. Motion.
Second. Second. All those in
favor, please signify by. Raise

14
00:02:45,198 --> 00:02:49,670
your right hand. All those
opposed? Motion carries. The
rezoning meeting minutes for

15
00:02:49,670 --> 00:02:54,641
the previous meeting, dated
August the 4th, has been
provided to the board. Are

16
00:02:54,641 --> 00:03:00,781
there any additions, deletions
or corrections? If not, I'll
entertain a motion to approve.

17
00:03:00,781 --> 00:03:06,219
Motion to approve. Second. All
those in favor, please signify
by raising your right hand.

18
00:03:06,219 --> 00:03:14,027
Motion carries. The rezoning
hearing package for September,
the first with findings of fact,

19
00:03:14,027 --> 00:03:18,098
has been provided to the board.
I'll entertain a motion to
accept the rezoning hearing

20
00:03:18,098 --> 00:03:22,369
package with findings of fact
and legal advertisement into
evidence. Do we have a motion?

21
00:03:22,369 --> 00:03:26,373
Motion to accept second. Second.
All those in favor, please
signify by raising your right

22
00:03:26,373 --> 00:03:32,479
hand. Right motion carries.
Will the court reporter please
swear in members of staff?

23
00:03:32,479 --> 00:03:37,084
Raise your right hand. Do you
solemnly swear or affirm the
testimony to be testimony that

24
00:03:37,084 --> 00:03:41,922
you give in this case will be
the whole truth and nothing but
the truth. All right. And the

25
00:03:41,922 --> 00:03:46,560
board has previously qualified
staff to offer expert testimony
in the area of land use and

26
00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:50,864
planning. Does anyone have any
questions regarding their
qualifications or ability to

27
00:03:50,864 --> 00:03:57,370
offer that expert testimony?
All right. At this hearing, the
Planning Board is acting under

28
00:03:57,370 --> 00:04:03,477
its authority to hear and make
recommendations to the Board of
County Commissioners. BCC on

29
00:04:03,477 --> 00:04:09,883
rezoning applications. These
hearings are quasi judicial in
nature. These hearings are like

30
00:04:09,883 --> 00:04:15,021
evidentiary hearings in a court
of law. However less formal,
all testimony will be given

31
00:04:15,021 --> 00:04:20,026
under oath, and anyone
testifying before the Planning
Board may be subject to

32
00:04:20,026 --> 00:04:23,964
cross-examination. All
documents and exhibits that the
Planning Board considers will

33
00:04:23,964 --> 00:04:29,069
be entered into evidence and
made part of the record.
Opinion testimony will be

34
00:04:29,069 --> 00:04:35,208
limited to experts. The closing
arguments will be limited to
the evidence in the record.

35
00:04:35,208 --> 00:04:40,247
Before making a decision, the
Planning Board will consider
the relevant testimony, the

36
00:04:40,247 --> 00:04:44,851
exhibits entered into evidence
and the law. Each each
individual who wishes to

37
00:04:44,851 --> 00:04:49,890
address the Planning Board must
complete a speaker request form
and submit it to the Planning

38
00:04:49,890 --> 00:04:56,830
Board. Clerk. These forms are
on the table in the back of the
room, and you won't be allowed

39
00:04:56,830 --> 00:05:02,369
to speak until we have a
completed form. Please note
that the only. Only those

40
00:05:02,369 --> 00:05:07,774
individuals who speak at
today's meeting in the rezoning
meeting will be allowed to

41
00:05:07,774 --> 00:05:12,913
speak at the subsequent hearing
before the BCC. At that time,
no new evidence can be

42
00:05:12,913 --> 00:05:19,452
presented at the BCC. Therefore,
all testimony and evidence must
be presented today. The

43
00:05:19,452 --> 00:05:23,824
Planning Board will provide a
recommendation for each
rezoning request to the BCC,

44
00:05:23,824 --> 00:05:28,061
which will review testimony,
documents and exhibits,
consider the closing arguments

45
00:05:28,061 --> 00:05:36,002
and make a final decision. All
decisions by the BCC are final.
Anyone who wishes to seek

46
00:05:36,002 --> 00:05:41,741
judicial review of the decision
of the BCC must do so in a
court of competent jurisdiction

47
00:05:41,741 --> 00:05:46,780
within 30 days of the date. The
BCC approves or rejects the
recommended order of the

48
00:05:46,780 --> 00:05:52,719
Planning Board. All written or
oral communications. Outside of
this hearing with the members

49
00:05:52,719 --> 00:05:58,325
of the Planning Board regarding
matters under considered under
consideration today are

50
00:05:58,325 --> 00:06:03,363
considered ex parte
communications. Ex parte
communications are presumed

51
00:06:03,363 --> 00:06:09,069
prejudicial under Florida law
and must be disclosed as
provided in BCC resolution

52
00:06:09,069 --> 00:06:16,076
number 96-13. As each case is
heard, I'll ask that any board
member who has been involved in

53
00:06:16,076 --> 00:06:22,449
ex parte communication please
identify themselves and
describe the communication as

54
00:06:22,449 --> 00:06:27,420
required by section 2-7.2 of
the Escambia County Land
Development Code. The Planning

55
00:06:27,420 --> 00:06:33,593
Board's recommendation to the
BCC shall include consideration
of the following approval

56
00:06:33,593 --> 00:06:39,132
conditions. The applicant has
the burden of presenting
competent, substantial evidence

57
00:06:39,132 --> 00:06:43,670
to reviewing board,
establishing that the requested
Zoning district would

58
00:06:43,670 --> 00:06:50,110
contribute to or result in a
logical and orderly development
pattern. The appropriate

59
00:06:50,110 --> 00:06:55,982
surrounding area within which
uses and conditions must be
considered, may vary with those

60
00:06:55,982 --> 00:07:00,654
uses and conditions, and is not
necessarily the same area
required for mailed

61
00:07:00,654 --> 00:07:06,026
notification. A logical and
orderly pattern shall require
demonstration of each of the

62
00:07:06,026 --> 00:07:12,465
following conditions. A
consistent with comprehensive
plan. The proposed zoning is

63
00:07:12,465 --> 00:07:17,504
consistent with the future land
use or flu category as
prescribed in LDC. Chapter

64
00:07:17,504 --> 00:07:24,311
three and with all other goals,
objectives, and policies of the
Comprehensive Plan. If the

65
00:07:24,311 --> 00:07:29,416
rezoning is required. If
rezoning is required to
properly enact a proposed flu

66
00:07:29,416 --> 00:07:34,788
map. Amendment transmitted for
state agency review. The
proposed zoning is consistent

67
00:07:34,788 --> 00:07:41,661
with the proposed flu and
conditional to its adoption. Be
consistent with zoning district

68
00:07:41,661 --> 00:07:47,067
provisions. The proposed zoning
is consistent with the purpose
and intent and with any other

69
00:07:47,067 --> 00:07:53,173
zoning establishment provisions
prescribed by the proposed
district and chapter three C

70
00:07:53,173 --> 00:07:58,211
compatible with surroundings.
All of the permitted uses of
the proposed zoning, not just

71
00:07:58,211 --> 00:08:02,749
those anticipated by the
rezoning applicant, are
compatible as defined in

72
00:08:02,749 --> 00:08:08,121
chapter six, with the
surrounding uses, the uses of
any surrounding undeveloped

73
00:08:08,121 --> 00:08:13,159
land shall be considered the
permitted uses of the
applicable district.

74
00:08:13,159 --> 00:08:18,098
Compatibility is not considered
with potential conditional uses
or any nonconforming or

75
00:08:18,098 --> 00:08:23,636
unapproved uses. Also, in
establishing the compatibility
of a residential use, there is

76
00:08:23,636 --> 00:08:28,008
no additional burden to
demonstrate the compatibility
of specific residence or

77
00:08:28,008 --> 00:08:34,547
activities protected by fair
housing law. D Appropriative
spot zoning where the proposed

78
00:08:34,547 --> 00:08:39,219
zoning would establish or
reinforce a condition of spot
zoning as defined in chapter

79
00:08:39,219 --> 00:08:43,623
six, the isolated district
would nevertheless be
transitional in character

80
00:08:43,623 --> 00:08:48,628
between the adjoining districts,
or the differences with those
districts would be minor or

81
00:08:48,628 --> 00:08:54,034
sufficiently limited. The
extent of these mitigating
characteristics or conditions

82
00:08:54,034 --> 00:08:58,371
demonstrates an appropriate
site specific balancing of
interests between the isolated

83
00:08:58,371 --> 00:09:05,912
district and the adjoining
lands. E appropriate with
changed or changing conditions

84
00:09:05,912 --> 00:09:10,250
if the land uses or development
conditions within the
surrounding area of the

85
00:09:10,250 --> 00:09:16,089
property have changed, the
changes are just such a degree
in character that it is in the

86
00:09:16,089 --> 00:09:20,693
public interest to allow new
uses, densities or intensities
in the area through rezoning

87
00:09:20,693 --> 00:09:25,198
and the permitted uses of the
proposed district are
appropriate and not premature

88
00:09:25,198 --> 00:09:31,604
for the area, or likely to
create or contribute to sprawl
at the beginning of each case.

89
00:09:31,604 --> 00:09:36,142
As long as there's no
objections from the applicant,
we will allow staff to briefly

90
00:09:36,142 --> 00:09:41,614
present the location and zoning
maps and photos for the
property. We will then hear

91
00:09:41,614 --> 00:09:46,653
from the applicant and any
witnesses that they may wish to
call, and then we will hear

92
00:09:46,653 --> 00:09:50,623
from staff and any witnesses
that they may wish to call. And
finally, we'll hear from

93
00:09:50,623 --> 00:09:56,296
members of the public who have
filled out a speaker request
form today in the rezoning

94
00:09:56,296 --> 00:10:02,502
meeting, there is one case to
be heard. The rezoning
application for consideration

95
00:10:02,502 --> 00:10:12,145
is case number Z-2026-16, which
request rezoning of 114 Linux
Parkway from TMU. High density

96
00:10:12,145 --> 00:10:18,685
mixed use district 25 dwelling
units per acre to commercial 25
dwelling units per acre, as

97
00:10:18,685 --> 00:10:24,791
requested by Meredith Bush,
agent for Tami Bohanon, trustee
of the Tami Bohanon Revocable

98
00:10:24,791 --> 00:10:31,998
Trust, dated November 8th, 2018.
The owner members of the board.
Has there been any ex parte

99
00:10:31,998 --> 00:10:35,568
communication between you and
the applicant of the
applicant's agents, attorneys

100
00:10:35,568 --> 00:10:40,173
or witnesses with fellow
Planning Board members or
anyone from the general public

101
00:10:40,173 --> 00:10:45,645
prior to this hearing? Have you
visited the subject property
and also disclose if you are a

102
00:10:45,645 --> 00:10:51,050
relative or business associate
of the applicant or the
applicant's agent? No to all.

103
00:10:51,050 --> 00:10:57,157
Not at all. No to all. No to
all. No to all. But I'd like to
seek some clarification. Ex

104
00:10:57,157 --> 00:11:02,562
parte communication. This is a
question for the attorney, Mr.
Chairman. Ex parte

105
00:11:02,562 --> 00:11:06,866
communication only starts from
the time that the application
has been submitted. So if

106
00:11:06,866 --> 00:11:12,605
someone had if I was previously
communicated about a property,
not particularly this one that

107
00:11:12,605 --> 00:11:17,677
wouldn't be considered ex parte
communication prior to the
actual application. Correct. So

108
00:11:17,677 --> 00:11:21,981
clarification on that. It's
matters that foreseeably may
come come before the board. So

109
00:11:21,981 --> 00:11:29,556
that would include when it's
already scheduled. Matters
Foreseeably before the board.

110
00:11:29,556 --> 00:11:38,865
You'd have to dig into that.
And it's fact specific
generally. No. Okay. Thank you.

111
00:11:38,865 --> 00:11:50,243
No tall. All right. Very good.
All right. And. Staff was
notified of the hearing sent to

112
00:11:50,243 --> 00:11:53,880
all interested parties. Yes,
sir. Was notice of the hearing
posted on the subject property?

113
00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:59,619
Yes, sir. Meredith, are you
okay with the photographs? And
before we get you up here. All

114
00:11:59,619 --> 00:12:08,394
right. Good morning. Board
Caleb McCarty, ACP certified
planner on behalf of the county.

115
00:12:08,394 --> 00:12:16,102
This is the location map
showing the subject property
along Lennox Parkway. The 500

116
00:12:16,102 --> 00:12:24,978
foot radius map. The majority
of the property is high density,
mixed use. The future land use

117
00:12:24,978 --> 00:12:32,185
designation of the subject
property is mixed use. Urban.
This is in the Palafox

118
00:12:32,185 --> 00:12:40,326
Community Redevelopment area.
This is an aerial showing the
existing building on the

119
00:12:40,326 --> 00:12:52,672
subject property. The existing
building was was recently
occupied by a place of worship.

120
00:12:52,672 --> 00:12:59,612
And next. This is our notice of
Public hearing sign we placed
in front of the property. This

121
00:12:59,612 --> 00:13:08,588
is looking onto the site at
that building. This is looking
east along Lennox Parkway. This

122
00:13:08,588 --> 00:13:15,828
is looking across Lennox
Parkway and this is looking
west along Lennox. That

123
00:13:15,828 --> 00:13:21,701
completes our maps and photos
for this case. All right. Thank
you so much. And Meredith, if

124
00:13:21,701 --> 00:13:27,373
you would go ahead and come on
up, and then we'll just get you
to state your name and address

125
00:13:27,373 --> 00:13:32,278
for the record. Meredith Bush,
Aicp certified planner, board
certified city, county and

126
00:13:32,278 --> 00:13:37,717
local government lawyer, 314
South Bailen Street, suite 108,
Pensacola, Florida. All right.

127
00:13:37,717 --> 00:13:42,388
And did you receive a copy of
the rezoning hearing package
with the findings of fact? I

128
00:13:42,388 --> 00:13:46,526
did, and I understand that you
have the burden of providing
substantial, competent evidence

129
00:13:46,526 --> 00:13:50,430
that the proposed rezoning is
consistent with the
comprehensive plan, furthers

130
00:13:50,430 --> 00:13:54,367
the goals, objectives and
policies of the Comprehensive
Plan, and is not in conflict

131
00:13:54,367 --> 00:13:58,905
with any portion of the
county's Land Development Code
I do. All right. Go ahead.

132
00:13:58,905 --> 00:14:05,445
Thank you, members of the board.
And Mr. Chair, this is a case
where we are seeking commercial

133
00:14:05,445 --> 00:14:10,883
from DMU. I've reviewed and
received staff's findings. We
are in agreement with their

134
00:14:10,883 --> 00:14:17,757
findings, and I will walk
through each of the criteria.
So criterion A consistent with

135
00:14:17,757 --> 00:14:23,763
the Comprehensive Plan
requested. Commercial zoning is
consistent with mixed use urban.

136
00:14:23,763 --> 00:14:29,202
That's outlined specifically in
the code that. There is
consistency. This property is

137
00:14:29,202 --> 00:14:35,341
also located within the Palafox
Community Redevelopment area,
the CRA, and I'll get to this

138
00:14:35,341 --> 00:14:41,047
in more detail later, has noted
they have no concerns. The
requested rezoning advances,

139
00:14:41,047 --> 00:14:49,021
the objectives of that CRA by
allowing a productive reuse of
the existing nonresidential

140
00:14:49,021 --> 00:14:55,828
building. So we've met
criterion A as to criterion B,
consistent with zoning district

141
00:14:55,828 --> 00:15:00,133
provisions, the commercial
district is intended to
accommodate general retail

142
00:15:00,133 --> 00:15:06,305
service, professional, civic,
recreational and limited other
activities. Future use of the

143
00:15:06,305 --> 00:15:13,112
property will remain subject to
all district standards. Notable.
Any specific new nonresidential

144
00:15:13,112 --> 00:15:21,521
use must also be compatible and
undergo the locational criteria
analysis. Here we. Our position

145
00:15:21,521 --> 00:15:26,092
is that the request is
consistent with the purpose and
zoning establishment provisions

146
00:15:26,092 --> 00:15:32,932
of the district. Notably, there
are already commercial uses in
the area. There's clear

147
00:15:32,932 --> 00:15:39,705
directly across the street, and
I believe it's like a quarter
of a mile from Palafox. As far

148
00:15:39,705 --> 00:15:47,313
as criterion C, compatible with
surroundings, the property lies
within an established urbanized

149
00:15:47,313 --> 00:15:55,955
area near mixed use development
and in proximity to commercial
and clear zoning. The urban

150
00:15:55,955 --> 00:16:02,762
setting existing development
again, proximity to established
commercial activity does

151
00:16:02,762 --> 00:16:10,369
further establish that this
rezoning is compatible. Again.
The Palafox Overlay District

152
00:16:10,369 --> 00:16:15,074
regulates structure, height,
materials and detailing, facade
setbacks, natural features,

153
00:16:15,074 --> 00:16:20,446
landscaping signs, lighting,
parking, placement and
screening. More intensive uses

154
00:16:20,446 --> 00:16:25,818
would be restricted by use
specific standards and again,
that development review process.

155
00:16:25,818 --> 00:16:30,089
There are also, you know,
physical constraints, given
that it's, you know, a little

156
00:16:30,089 --> 00:16:36,262
over an acre site. So the
proposed zoning district is
compatible with surrounding

157
00:16:36,262 --> 00:16:43,069
uses as two criterion D spot
zoning. As you all know, spot
zoning is not in and of itself

158
00:16:43,069 --> 00:16:49,942
prohibited. It must be shown,
however, that it meets a higher
review of either being

159
00:16:49,942 --> 00:16:54,580
transitional in character or
the differences between the
districts being minor. GMU

160
00:16:54,580 --> 00:17:01,487
already allows many of the same
uses as commercial. So the, you
know, retail services,

161
00:17:01,487 --> 00:17:06,526
professional, civic things of
those nature. The differences
are in perhaps square footage

162
00:17:06,526 --> 00:17:14,467
of the uses. Buildings such as
that here. Those differences
are both minor. And this is

163
00:17:14,467 --> 00:17:20,973
specifically more appropriately
transitional in character.
Again, you've got DMU nearby.

164
00:17:20,973 --> 00:17:25,211
You've also got Hcli, the heavy
commercial light industrial
across the street. This is

165
00:17:25,211 --> 00:17:31,751
directly in between those. The
rezoning does not constitute
arbitrary or impermissible spot

166
00:17:31,751 --> 00:17:36,689
zoning. It's located within an
established urban area. It's
already developed with

167
00:17:36,689 --> 00:17:41,694
substantial form of former
institutional building, which
was used as a church or a place

168
00:17:41,694 --> 00:17:48,334
of worship. It's historically
accommodated nonresidential
uses, again, clear zoning and

169
00:17:48,334 --> 00:17:52,705
nonresidential development are
located directly across the
street or a quarter of a mile,

170
00:17:52,705 --> 00:17:56,709
a little bit less than a
quarter of a mile from the
North Palafox Commercial

171
00:17:56,709 --> 00:18:02,882
Corridor. The district would
serve a genuine transitional
function, and commercial is

172
00:18:02,882 --> 00:18:08,421
less intensive than the CLR
across the street, and
commercial is also expressly

173
00:18:08,421 --> 00:18:14,860
and explicitly identified by
the Land Development Code as an
appropriate transitional zoning.

174
00:18:14,860 --> 00:18:21,033
The request facilitates
adaptive reuse of the property
and is directly related to the

175
00:18:21,033 --> 00:18:26,072
surrounding existing land use
pattern as two criterion E
appropriate with changed or

176
00:18:26,072 --> 00:18:31,811
changing conditions. The
relevant conditions include the
cessation of the property's

177
00:18:31,811 --> 00:18:36,882
institutional use, the
availability resulting
availability of an existing

178
00:18:36,882 --> 00:18:44,457
developed site for adaptive
reuse. The changing conditions
make this a commercially

179
00:18:44,457 --> 00:18:50,229
focused reuse and advance the
Palafox redevelopment plans
written objectives of

180
00:18:50,229 --> 00:18:55,267
encouraging reinvestment in
vacant or underutilized
buildings and supporting

181
00:18:55,267 --> 00:19:01,407
compatible commercial
reinvestment. It is not a
premature rezoning request, and

182
00:19:01,407 --> 00:19:08,214
nor is it characteristic of
sprawl on this parcel. We also
have to meet the locational

183
00:19:08,214 --> 00:19:15,021
criteria. This meets the
criteria in two different ways.
It is appropriate as infill

184
00:19:15,021 --> 00:19:22,094
development and there is
documented compatibility. So as
far as the infill development,

185
00:19:22,094 --> 00:19:29,068
again it's surrounded by some
commercial and mixed use with
some residential development.

186
00:19:29,068 --> 00:19:34,807
It is currently unutilized an
empty it's got a building on it,
but it's not currently being

187
00:19:34,807 --> 00:19:39,912
used. And filling in those
holes and development is
exactly what infill development

188
00:19:39,912 --> 00:19:44,950
means. As far as documented
compatibility. Again, the
property's already developed

189
00:19:44,950 --> 00:19:50,690
with a former institutional
building. It's a quarter of a
mile from North Palafox Street,

190
00:19:50,690 --> 00:19:55,394
closely connected with an
established commercial and
employment corridor, commercial

191
00:19:55,394 --> 00:20:00,800
and zoning, as well as non
residential development, are
located nearby toward North

192
00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:06,138
Palafox and Massachusetts
Avenue. Commercial is less
intensive than the CLI. The

193
00:20:06,138 --> 00:20:10,810
permitted uses within Com
consists consists principally
of retail, service, office,

194
00:20:10,810 --> 00:20:16,215
civic and recreational. Future
development will remain subject
to review of access,

195
00:20:16,215 --> 00:20:20,519
circulation, parking, loading.
Buffering, landscaping,
lighting, drainage, solid waste

196
00:20:20,519 --> 00:20:25,591
screening and outdoor activity
and the requested rezoning
promotes that private

197
00:20:25,591 --> 00:20:32,031
reinvestment within the CRA
Land Development Code 3-2 ten E
specifically requires that

198
00:20:32,031 --> 00:20:38,604
future nonresidential use
itself must also establish
locational criteria at the time

199
00:20:38,604 --> 00:20:45,444
of the development submittal.
So, you know, we feel we've met
the criteria. We've submitted

200
00:20:45,444 --> 00:20:50,850
our report and supporting
backup county staff's findings,
supports our request. Happy to

201
00:20:50,850 --> 00:20:54,720
take any questions or address
any concerns, but we would ask
that you approve this or

202
00:20:54,720 --> 00:21:00,926
recommend approval of the
rezoning. Mr. chair, just real
quick, Meredith, can I ask if

203
00:21:00,926 --> 00:21:07,800
the is this being done for
marketability or for a specific
use? A little bit of both. So

204
00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:14,640
it is overall marketability,
but there is a specific use. I
believe the property is under

205
00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:20,346
contract. The what's outlined
in our submittal and what we've
talked to the county about.

206
00:21:20,346 --> 00:21:28,254
It's a window and door business
that would like to use the
property. Thank you. Meredith.

207
00:21:28,254 --> 00:21:33,626
Since a portion of this is
marketability, if this was not
approved, would this affect the

208
00:21:33,626 --> 00:21:38,731
contract going forward?
Possibly, or the marketability.
So it would this is a material

209
00:21:38,731 --> 00:21:42,935
change in the value of the
property based on based on this
zoning classification. Correct.

210
00:21:42,935 --> 00:21:48,340
My understanding is yes. Again,
I'm not a certified property
appraiser, but the commercial

211
00:21:48,340 --> 00:21:53,746
is a higher you know, there
there's a greater ability to do
more things in commercial.

212
00:21:53,746 --> 00:21:58,317
Again, must remain compatible
with the surrounding. You can't
just, you know, throw something

213
00:21:58,317 --> 00:22:02,688
in there that even if it's a
permitted and commercial, if it
doesn't meet its own individual

214
00:22:02,688 --> 00:22:07,426
locational criteria as part of
development review process, it
wouldn't necessarily be allowed.

215
00:22:07,426 --> 00:22:13,499
But yes, I mean, part of many
times when I'm here for what is
considered by some to be an up

216
00:22:13,499 --> 00:22:19,004
zoning, it's because it's a
greater value and broader range
of uses. Thank you. And in this

217
00:22:19,004 --> 00:22:25,744
case, the density doesn't
change. And you could already
do 25 per per acre. So thank

218
00:22:25,744 --> 00:22:36,722
you. Anyone else have questions
for the applicant? Okay. If we
if we got some more questions

219
00:22:36,722 --> 00:22:43,429
we'll get you back up here. All
right. Okay. All right staff,
we'll go ahead and turn it over

220
00:22:43,429 --> 00:22:48,767
to you. Certainly. Thank you
again, Caleb, with Escambia
County. Just a reminder that

221
00:22:48,767 --> 00:22:54,907
this is a high density, mixed
use zoned property. And the
request is to the commercial

222
00:22:54,907 --> 00:23:02,414
district concerning criterion A,
consistent with the
comprehensive plan, we found

223
00:23:02,414 --> 00:23:07,119
that the proposed amendment to
commercial is consistent with
the future land use category.

224
00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:12,191
Mixed use urban mixed use.
Urban future land use allows
for an intense mix of

225
00:23:12,191 --> 00:23:17,296
residential and nonresidential
uses, while promoting
compatible infill and

226
00:23:17,296 --> 00:23:24,370
separation of urban and
suburban land uses within the
category. Per the Comprehensive

227
00:23:24,370 --> 00:23:28,774
plan, redevelopment of
underutilized properties is
encouraged to maximize

228
00:23:28,774 --> 00:23:35,281
densities and intensities in
the mixed use urban future.
Land use the Escambia County

229
00:23:35,281 --> 00:23:39,551
Comprehensive Plan and its
implementing document, the Land
Development Code. The county

230
00:23:39,551 --> 00:23:43,789
must consider the issue of
compatibility with adjacent
uses and determining the

231
00:23:43,789 --> 00:23:49,261
suitability of development
projects. The Commercial
district is an allowed zoning

232
00:23:49,261 --> 00:23:54,333
category for uses in densities
within the mixed use urban
future land use. However, the

233
00:23:54,333 --> 00:24:01,874
Comprehensive Plan prohibits
incompatible development in
section 3.04 incompatible

234
00:24:01,874 --> 00:24:06,879
incompatible development as
defined as incompatible
development as new development

235
00:24:06,879 --> 00:24:11,216
proposed to be constructed next
to existing development,
wherein the proximity of the

236
00:24:11,216 --> 00:24:17,022
two kinds of development would
each diminish the usefulness of
the other or would be

237
00:24:17,022 --> 00:24:22,061
detrimental to existing
operations. The incompatibility
can arise from either land use

238
00:24:22,061 --> 00:24:28,100
or structure, size and design.
Compatible development is new
development proposed to be

239
00:24:28,100 --> 00:24:32,471
constructed next to existing
development, in which the
proximity of the two kinds of

240
00:24:32,471 --> 00:24:37,443
development would each
complement or enhance the
usefulness of the other.

241
00:24:37,443 --> 00:24:41,780
Additionally, the intensity of
the proposed rezoning request
must be considered in relation

242
00:24:41,780 --> 00:24:46,151
to the low impact, low
intensity residential
development and the surrounding

243
00:24:46,151 --> 00:24:50,456
neighborhood, as well as the
historic uses and commercially
zoned property on the south

244
00:24:50,456 --> 00:24:55,861
side of Lenox Parkway. Infill
development is defined as
development of new housing or

245
00:24:55,861 --> 00:25:02,301
other land uses on vacant or
underutilized land in existing
developed areas, which focuses

246
00:25:02,301 --> 00:25:09,908
on the reuse and repositioning
of obsolete or underutilized
buildings and sites. Per the

247
00:25:09,908 --> 00:25:13,846
definitions of the
comprehensive Plan, staff found
that the rezoning request to

248
00:25:13,846 --> 00:25:17,683
commercial is consistent with
the Comprehensive Plan through
the site specific requirements

249
00:25:17,683 --> 00:25:22,521
of the Land Development Code.
The intensity of the proposed
rezoning request can be

250
00:25:22,521 --> 00:25:28,293
compatible with the surrounding
residential uses. Land uses the
implementation of buffering and

251
00:25:28,293 --> 00:25:32,898
screening of any commercial
uses will be required by Land
Development Code provisions to

252
00:25:32,898 --> 00:25:40,139
be integrated into site design,
and will assist in offsetting
in any unforeseen

253
00:25:40,139 --> 00:25:45,210
incompatibilities. Note that
nonresidential uses in the
vicinity are separated from the

254
00:25:45,210 --> 00:25:50,249
subject property by the right
of way of Lenox Parkway, and we
provided that in the zoning map

255
00:25:50,249 --> 00:25:59,158
criterion. Be consistent with
the Land Development Code. We
found that. The requested

256
00:25:59,158 --> 00:26:03,595
rezoning to commercial is
consistent with the purpose and
intent of the Commercial Zoning

257
00:26:03,595 --> 00:26:09,334
district. The commercial
district establishes
appropriate uses, appropriate

258
00:26:09,334 --> 00:26:13,572
areas, and land use regulations
for general commercial
activities, especially the

259
00:26:13,572 --> 00:26:18,710
retelling of commodities and
services. The primary intent of
the commercial district is to

260
00:26:18,710 --> 00:26:23,382
allow more diverse and intense
commercial uses than the
neighborhood commercial allowed

261
00:26:23,382 --> 00:26:27,619
in the mixed use districts.
Additionally, to maintain
compatibility with surrounding

262
00:26:27,619 --> 00:26:32,524
uses, all commercial operations
are limited to the confines of
buildings and are not allowed

263
00:26:32,524 --> 00:26:38,163
to produce undesirable effects
on the surrounding properties.
To retain adequate area for

264
00:26:38,163 --> 00:26:42,835
commercial activities. New and
expanded residential
development within that

265
00:26:42,835 --> 00:26:48,607
district is limited and
consistent with the commercial
future land use category and

266
00:26:48,607 --> 00:26:53,512
the Commercial Zoning District.
The location criteria is
established to promote

267
00:26:53,512 --> 00:26:58,283
compatibility among the uses,
especially new nonresidential
uses, in relation to existing

268
00:26:58,283 --> 00:27:04,189
residential uses. The criteria
are designed to create smooth
transitions of use intensity

269
00:27:04,189 --> 00:27:09,428
from large scale concentrations
of general commercial uses near
major street intersections to

270
00:27:09,428 --> 00:27:14,066
small scale, dispersed
neighborhood commercial uses,
and approximate proximity to

271
00:27:14,066 --> 00:27:19,138
residential areas. Those
transitions prevent the adverse
impacts of continuous strip

272
00:27:19,138 --> 00:27:23,075
commercial development along
major streets, and avoid
negative and blighting

273
00:27:23,075 --> 00:27:28,113
influences of some commercial
uses on adjacent residential
neighborhoods. The subject

274
00:27:28,113 --> 00:27:34,186
property does allow along a
local road, Lenox Parkway, and
therefore cannot achieve the

275
00:27:34,186 --> 00:27:39,658
location criteria of the
Commercial Zoning District as
we referenced there, because it

276
00:27:39,658 --> 00:27:44,830
doesn't front an arterial or
collector street. Therefore, to
achieve the location criteria

277
00:27:44,830 --> 00:27:50,135
of the Commercial Zoning
District, the applicant has
provided competent, substantial

278
00:27:50,135 --> 00:27:54,373
evidence of unique
circumstances regarding the
potential uses of the property

279
00:27:54,373 --> 00:28:00,212
that were not anticipated by
the alternative criteria of the
requested zoning district. We

280
00:28:00,212 --> 00:28:05,217
provided a summary that was
provided by the applicant
that's needed to achieve the

281
00:28:05,217 --> 00:28:11,657
necessary criteria related to
the documented compatibility.
The summary documents that the

282
00:28:11,657 --> 00:28:16,361
property has already developed
with a substantial former
institutional building and

283
00:28:16,361 --> 00:28:25,003
associated site improvements.
The site is approximately 0.14
mile from North Palafox Street

284
00:28:25,003 --> 00:28:30,776
and closely connected to an
established commercial and
employment corridor, commercial

285
00:28:30,776 --> 00:28:34,813
and heavy commercial light,
industrial zoning and
nonresidential development are

286
00:28:34,813 --> 00:28:40,185
located nearby towards North
Palafox and Massachusetts
Avenue. While the high density,

287
00:28:40,185 --> 00:28:46,625
mixed use and residential uses
are located to the northwest
southwest, giving the parcel a

288
00:28:46,625 --> 00:28:52,531
transitional function, the
commercial is less intensive
than the heavy commercial light

289
00:28:52,531 --> 00:28:56,735
industrial and is expressively
identified as an appropriate
transition between the high

290
00:28:56,735 --> 00:29:01,473
density mixed use development
and the heavy commercial and
industrial development. The

291
00:29:01,473 --> 00:29:07,846
permanent uses within the
Commercial Zoning District
consists of principally of

292
00:29:07,846 --> 00:29:14,019
retail, service, office, civic,
recreational and limited
industrial related activities.

293
00:29:14,019 --> 00:29:20,158
Future development will remain
subject to the review of access,
circulation, parking, loading,

294
00:29:20,158 --> 00:29:25,564
buffering, landscaping,
lighting, drainage, solid waste
screening and outdoor activity.

295
00:29:25,564 --> 00:29:30,535
One note on that the applicant
has submitted to the county's
development review process and

296
00:29:30,535 --> 00:29:37,009
has met for a pre-application
for this proposal as well. The
requested rezoning promotes

297
00:29:37,009 --> 00:29:42,714
private reinvestment within the
Palafox Community Redevelopment
Area and supports adaptive

298
00:29:42,714 --> 00:29:51,823
reuse of the site. We also
provided the. In accordance
with the Commercial Zoning

299
00:29:51,823 --> 00:29:56,161
District, this may be
established only within the
mixed use suburban mixed use

300
00:29:56,161 --> 00:30:01,900
urban or commercial future land
use categories. The district is
appropriate to provide.

301
00:30:01,900 --> 00:30:06,471
Transitions between. Areas
zoned are used for high density.
Mixed use in areas. Zoning are

302
00:30:06,471 --> 00:30:10,876
used for heavy commercial or
industrial. Rezoning to
commercial is subject to the

303
00:30:10,876 --> 00:30:15,947
same location criteria as any
new non residential use
proposed within the commercial

304
00:30:15,947 --> 00:30:23,922
district. Our County Community
Redevelopment Area Agency did
provide us with a summary and a

305
00:30:23,922 --> 00:30:33,131
memo, and basically they stated
they have no concerns regarding
the rezoning request. Also, our

306
00:30:33,131 --> 00:30:40,038
Traffic and transportation
office reviewed this and they
had no concerns as well.

307
00:30:40,038 --> 00:30:45,077
Criterion C, compatible with
surrounding land uses. Staff
found that through the site

308
00:30:45,077 --> 00:30:48,980
specific requirements of the
Land Development Code, such as
screening and buffering, the

309
00:30:48,980 --> 00:30:52,284
proposed amendment to
commercial can be compatible
with the surrounding properties

310
00:30:52,284 --> 00:30:56,521
in the area. The subject
property has an existing
building that, according to

311
00:30:56,521 --> 00:31:01,326
county property appraiser data,
was built in 1955 and the
building was used as a church.

312
00:31:01,326 --> 00:31:07,065
Until recently. The area
surrounding the subject
property is generally mixed use,

313
00:31:07,065 --> 00:31:11,036
consisting of historic
commercial uses. When the.
Within the heavy commercial

314
00:31:11,036 --> 00:31:16,842
light industrial zoning. South
side of Lenox Parkway and
single family residential uses

315
00:31:16,842 --> 00:31:22,147
to the northeast and west into
the residential neighborhood
and our zone. High density

316
00:31:22,147 --> 00:31:28,253
mixed use. An assessment of the
surrounding land uses show that
the property across Lenox at

317
00:31:28,253 --> 00:31:32,624
117 Lenox Parkway is zoned
Heavy Commercial, Light
industrial and is currently

318
00:31:32,624 --> 00:31:37,629
vacant. That property appears
to have been occupied by a
salvage and towing yard as

319
00:31:37,629 --> 00:31:43,835
recently as 2022, and the
building was recently
demolished. Additionally, the

320
00:31:43,835 --> 00:31:50,242
property at 201 Lenox is on
heavy commercial light,
industrial nonalcoholic and

321
00:31:50,242 --> 00:31:55,680
contains an existing warehouse
facility. Most uses in the
surrounding area appear to be

322
00:31:55,680 --> 00:32:00,285
residential in nature, with
commercial and industrial type
uses. Located near the

323
00:32:00,285 --> 00:32:06,758
intersection of North Palafox
and Lenox Parkway along the
North Palafox Corridor.

324
00:32:06,758 --> 00:32:11,830
Concerning criteria D
appropriate a spot zoning. By
definition, the proposed

325
00:32:11,830 --> 00:32:16,501
commercial zoning would create
or reinforce a condition of
spot zoning, as there's no

326
00:32:16,501 --> 00:32:20,872
commercial zoning on the
adjacent property. The proposed
commercial zoning district

327
00:32:20,872 --> 00:32:26,645
would be isolated and higher in
intensity of commercial uses
than adjoining DMU. High

328
00:32:26,645 --> 00:32:32,417
density mixed use. The
allowable density of the
current DMU and the proposed

329
00:32:32,417 --> 00:32:38,890
zoning to commercial is both 25
dwelling units per acre. Now,
spot zoning is not by itself

330
00:32:38,890 --> 00:32:44,196
prohibited, but due to
potential adverse impacts on
adjoining zoning, it carries a

331
00:32:44,196 --> 00:32:49,334
higher burden of demonstration
that, if authorized, will
contribute to or result in

332
00:32:49,334 --> 00:32:55,040
logical and orderly development.
Finally, criterion E
appropriate with changed or

333
00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:58,376
changing conditions. We found
that the land use and
development conditions adjacent

334
00:32:58,376 --> 00:33:03,748
to or near the subject property
are changing. A rezoning case
was approved by the BCC Board

335
00:33:03,748 --> 00:33:11,990
of County Commissioners under
case Z2015-07 for the property
at 201 Lenox Parkway. That

336
00:33:11,990 --> 00:33:18,897
property was rezoned from DMU
to CLINA. The proposed
amendment would not create or

337
00:33:18,897 --> 00:33:23,935
contribute to urban sprawl and
would assign an appropriate
zoning district to the property

338
00:33:23,935 --> 00:33:28,173
based on the established
historic use requiring
buffering and fencing of the

339
00:33:28,173 --> 00:33:33,645
adjacent residential uses that
is otherwise not currently in
place. That concludes our

340
00:33:33,645 --> 00:33:42,387
findings for this case board.
Are there any questions for
staff at this time? All right.

341
00:33:42,387 --> 00:33:49,494
If we got questions, we'll come
back to you guys. All right.
Now we'll hear from members of

342
00:33:49,494 --> 00:33:55,233
the public, those members who
wish to speak. Please make sure
that you filled out a speaker

343
00:33:55,233 --> 00:34:01,740
request form in the back of the
room and bring it up front. Our
the Planning Board bases its

344
00:34:01,740 --> 00:34:07,279
decisions on the approval
conditions and exceptions
described in section 2-6.8 of

345
00:34:07,279 --> 00:34:12,884
the Escambia County Land
Development Code. During our
deliberations, the board will

346
00:34:12,884 --> 00:34:18,623
not consider general statements
of support or opposition, but
accordingly, just to limit your

347
00:34:18,623 --> 00:34:24,763
testimony to the approval
conditions that we went over
earlier described in section

348
00:34:24,763 --> 00:34:30,101
2-6.8. Please also note that
only those individuals who are
present and give testimony on

349
00:34:30,101 --> 00:34:36,241
this rezoning case will be able
to speak before the Board of
County Commissioners for their

350
00:34:36,241 --> 00:34:47,819
final decision. So first up, I
have Nancy Accardo. And if you
want to come forward and state

351
00:34:47,819 --> 00:34:53,124
your name and address for the
record and be sworn in, I will
get your time started. Okay.

352
00:34:53,124 --> 00:35:01,499
Good morning. Good morning
everyone. My name is Nancy
Liccardo. My address is 112

353
00:35:01,499 --> 00:35:09,808
Baileys Court, and I'm here in
regards to the rezoning. I've
lived in this neighborhood for

354
00:35:09,808 --> 00:35:17,682
over 40 years. I've seen a lot
of things come and go. I'm very
concerned over what will be put

355
00:35:17,682 --> 00:35:26,491
on this property. She wasn't
sworn. Oh, I'm sorry, I was
just sworn in. Raise your right

356
00:35:26,491 --> 00:35:30,695
hand. Do solemnly swear or
affirm the testimony about to
give in this case will be the

357
00:35:30,695 --> 00:35:35,500
truth, the whole truth, and
nothing but the truth. So help
you God, I do thank you. Thank

358
00:35:35,500 --> 00:35:41,072
you. Yeah. Thank you. Anyway,
we'd like to know. And I guess
I'm speaking for the two

359
00:35:41,072 --> 00:35:49,114
streets. A lot of people
couldn't get off to come this
time of day, but we. It's true

360
00:35:49,114 --> 00:35:54,052
that there is a lot of
commercial. But it's on the
outskirts. We're surrounded by

361
00:35:54,052 --> 00:36:01,326
four highways. As you all know.
Debbie Street to Palafox Brant
Lane are Beverly Parkway to

362
00:36:01,326 --> 00:36:09,868
Massachusetts, which was messed
up, but we are so. And I speak
for the group that couldn't be

363
00:36:09,868 --> 00:36:17,108
here today. We are so concerned
about what is going into that
property. Is it going to bring

364
00:36:17,108 --> 00:36:25,050
our our value of our property
down? Is it going to build it
up? Is it going to be a

365
00:36:25,050 --> 00:36:32,957
business? There's a lot of
rumors going around as far as
apartments, low income housing,

366
00:36:32,957 --> 00:36:39,731
some type of business. Of
course, you hear all kind of
things, but yet when it's built,

367
00:36:39,731 --> 00:36:47,706
it's built. We are trying and
we would love to have our
little residential area to stay

368
00:36:47,706 --> 00:36:56,748
that way. We've had a couple of
businesses in and out, but we
have one. I think that's might

369
00:36:56,748 --> 00:37:08,760
be it closed. And I think, if
I'm not mistaken, someone is
rented it. I have no idea. Just

370
00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:15,734
appreciate you letting me speak.
And I really think that if we
could get something in there,

371
00:37:15,734 --> 00:37:20,138
say brick homes or something,
we've got about five new homes
that's been built that has been

372
00:37:20,138 --> 00:37:25,844
built in our neighborhood. Four
of them right down the street
from me, about two houses down

373
00:37:25,844 --> 00:37:33,818
the residential area is growing.
We're trying to build it. We
would love to have it built to

374
00:37:33,818 --> 00:37:40,825
where we can have a nice
neighborhood again. But when
you start bringing businesses

375
00:37:40,825 --> 00:37:45,697
in, it's going to be more
traffic. It's going to be riff
raff come in, it's going to be

376
00:37:45,697 --> 00:37:54,606
whatever. And I would really
like for you to really consider
what you're bringing into our

377
00:37:54,606 --> 00:38:06,117
neighborhood. If you don't mind,
please. Thank you, thank you.
Any questions for the speaker?

378
00:38:06,117 --> 00:38:11,289
Thank you. All right, I
appreciate it. Thank you very
much. All right. Our next

379
00:38:11,289 --> 00:38:16,461
speaker is Larry Downs Jr. Yeah,
please come on up, be sworn in.
State your name and address for

380
00:38:16,461 --> 00:38:31,743
the record and we'll get your
time started. Larry. Hello.
Larry Daniels jr I'm ready. Oh,

381
00:38:31,743 --> 00:38:43,655
address. Address. What is this?
Is this violating my to not. To
have to have protection at my

382
00:38:43,655 --> 00:38:49,794
house like government officials
do? Isn't that weird? You can
decline to give your address.

383
00:38:49,794 --> 00:38:57,836
12156 Hamburg Drive. I don't
need any help. Half Burg Drive,
Pensacola, Florida 32506. Raise

384
00:38:57,836 --> 00:39:02,307
your right hand. Sir. Do you
solemnly swear or affirm the
testimony about to give, in

385
00:39:02,307 --> 00:39:08,479
this case the whole truth and
nothing but the truth, so help
you God? I do. Mr. Alrighty. Of

386
00:39:08,479 --> 00:39:18,189
course I, I support this and
and I support it based on
approval conditions. Meredith

387
00:39:18,189 --> 00:39:27,232
laid it out pretty well. I
think staff did staff agree. Is
that right? Horse? Did y'all.

388
00:39:27,232 --> 00:39:32,203
Yes. Yeah. Okay. Good deal.
Staff agreed. So there we go.
And y'all have done it before.

389
00:39:32,203 --> 00:39:37,809
So it's a 14th amendment thing.
You've already done it before.
So you can't you know, it's

390
00:39:37,809 --> 00:39:44,549
kind of wrong to approve
someone else and then deny one.
And this is not just for this

391
00:39:44,549 --> 00:39:50,355
case. This is for every case.
Y'all should consider that. You
should say, what makes you know,

392
00:39:50,355 --> 00:39:56,761
Mr. Smith, any more valuable
than Mr. Thomas? You know, in
theory or his property, you

393
00:39:56,761 --> 00:40:02,100
know, or his property rights?
The lady said that she
represents a group of people

394
00:40:02,100 --> 00:40:08,573
who live near there. Well, I
represent a group of people in
this country who still love

395
00:40:08,573 --> 00:40:15,813
freedom and property rights. So
I'm speaking on their behalf.
And riff raff. We always hear

396
00:40:15,813 --> 00:40:22,987
that riff raff, don't we? Gotta
keep the riff raff out. That's
not that's not y'all's job or

397
00:40:22,987 --> 00:40:29,093
the, or the staff's job, you
know, or the presenter's job,
you know, that's that's, that's

398
00:40:29,093 --> 00:40:35,633
the problem with freedom. With
freedom. You get some riff raff,
some sometimes it's not all

399
00:40:35,633 --> 00:40:41,539
neat and perfect, but you can,
you can try to legislate it,
but it doesn't help. Anyways,

400
00:40:41,539 --> 00:40:50,782
I'm for this, so please, please
move along with some freedom.
Thank you Larry. Next up is

401
00:40:50,782 --> 00:40:55,286
Pepper Weimer. Y'all please
come forward, be sworn in and
state your name and address for

402
00:40:55,286 --> 00:41:06,898
the record. Hi, Pepper Weimer
and 8079 Heirloom Drive. And I
solemnly swear that I'm telling

403
00:41:06,898 --> 00:41:12,337
the truth. And raise your right
hand. Your right hand. Thank
you. You saw me swear or affirm

404
00:41:12,337 --> 00:41:16,407
the testimony about. To give in
this case would be the truth,
the whole truth, and nothing

405
00:41:16,407 --> 00:41:21,546
but the truth. So help you? Yes,
sir. Now you can. Thank you.
Hey, guys. So finally learned

406
00:41:21,546 --> 00:41:29,287
about the quasi or the zoning.
So you have to speak to speak.
So I'm going to talk a little

407
00:41:29,287 --> 00:41:35,827
bit about transparency and
clarity and notice to the
public, which are all

408
00:41:35,827 --> 00:41:42,533
accessibility issues and
accessibility issues are
transparency issues. Because

409
00:41:42,533 --> 00:41:47,939
when things aren't accessible
to the public and it's hard for
them to show up. Sounds like

410
00:41:47,939 --> 00:41:53,044
Miss Nancy has a lot of
neighbors that couldn't make it.
They're probably working. So

411
00:41:53,044 --> 00:42:00,852
those are those are all issues
for the public to interact with
these issues that directly

412
00:42:00,852 --> 00:42:09,227
affect their communities and
their neighbors and their homes.
So I learned from Mr. Keith

413
00:42:09,227 --> 00:42:15,099
that I can just say I adopt the
position of all speakers for
further consideration. I don't

414
00:42:15,099 --> 00:42:21,939
know if I agree with Nancy or
Larry because, again, the
transparency issue, Miss Nancy

415
00:42:21,939 --> 00:42:30,481
didn't know what what the plans
are. And that is just a serious
issue in the community in

416
00:42:30,481 --> 00:42:37,355
general, not just for this,
just all these things that
y'all are trying to sneak in.

417
00:42:37,355 --> 00:42:41,993
We're, we're, we're connecting
with y'all. And, and we would
just like a little bit of

418
00:42:41,993 --> 00:42:45,596
transparency back. And I know
y'all are just the planning
board members, members. I'm

419
00:42:45,596 --> 00:42:50,268
just putting it up on the
record. Maybe somebody's
actually listening, you know,

420
00:42:50,268 --> 00:42:59,977
and I appreciate what y'all do.
So I'm just going to say that
we really the public is begging,

421
00:42:59,977 --> 00:43:05,416
begging and screaming and
crying for transparency and
clarity. That's all we want.

422
00:43:05,416 --> 00:43:14,392
And this isn't a left or right
or any anything like these
issues. We all agree on it. We

423
00:43:14,392 --> 00:43:23,301
all agree on it. So I think
that times are changing right
now. We're the public

424
00:43:23,301 --> 00:43:30,108
interacting with their local
governance. So yeah, the the
governance needs to change with

425
00:43:30,108 --> 00:43:37,081
us and actually stop obscuring
what's going on. You know,
there's, there's actually a law

426
00:43:37,081 --> 00:43:45,656
called the plain language law.
And it's a law where when
there's things that have to do

427
00:43:45,656 --> 00:43:50,728
with the public and the
government and they're supposed
to work together, it's supposed

428
00:43:50,728 --> 00:43:59,203
to be made to put in layman's
terms. So like on your agendas
online, they're explained, but

429
00:43:59,203 --> 00:44:04,876
they're not explained on those
papers. And I know that a paper
might be an issue. Like y'all

430
00:44:04,876 --> 00:44:09,981
are worried about a paper bill.
But at the last board of County
commissioners meeting, there

431
00:44:09,981 --> 00:44:17,321
was a huge stack of papers that
were being wasted. So I think
that maybe this place might be

432
00:44:17,321 --> 00:44:27,365
a place to pay for some paper
so that people can understand.
Thank you, thank you. All right.

433
00:44:27,365 --> 00:44:35,306
And then we did have the owner
of the property, Tammy Bohanon,
sign up. But I don't know if

434
00:44:35,306 --> 00:44:41,712
you wanted to speak or not, but
if you don't have to, but if
you would just state your name

435
00:44:41,712 --> 00:44:47,451
and address. Tammy Bohanon 228
Starboard Drive, Pensacola
Beach, Florida 32561. Right.

436
00:44:47,451 --> 00:44:52,557
And you saw miss. Where are you
an attorney? No. Do you
solemnly swear or affirm the

437
00:44:52,557 --> 00:44:56,894
testimony about to give in this
case will be the truth, the
whole truth, and nothing but

438
00:44:56,894 --> 00:45:01,065
the truth, so help you God?
Thank you. Yes, sir. I'm just
here in case you have any

439
00:45:01,065 --> 00:45:08,439
questions. Any questions for
the property owner? None. None.
Okay. All right. Thank you very

440
00:45:08,439 --> 00:45:16,247
much. All right. Are there
after hearing both from the
applicant and staff, do we have

441
00:45:16,247 --> 00:45:29,594
any questions for them? No.
Okay. If there's no questions,
I'll entertain a motion on Mr.

442
00:45:29,594 --> 00:45:41,205
Walker. Yes, sir. I want to try
to provide some education with
I. I did speak with Miss Nancy.

443
00:45:41,205 --> 00:45:47,245
I I've been known a long time.
Amen. She at William High
School. She's my cafeteria lady.

444
00:45:47,245 --> 00:45:57,054
That's been a long time ago.
Wait a minute, Caleb. I don't
need that. But but just for the

445
00:45:57,054 --> 00:46:02,393
purpose of educating her and I.
And I'd be glad to talk to her
more. Whatever the. Whatever

446
00:46:02,393 --> 00:46:09,667
decision of the Planning Board
is this zoning category
currently right now is high

447
00:46:09,667 --> 00:46:19,777
density, mixed use. Currently
without any people giving them
permission. They could put some

448
00:46:19,777 --> 00:46:27,918
neighborhood commercial type
uses on this property right now.
Right now it's zone. It is

449
00:46:27,918 --> 00:46:34,792
zoned for it. So I want to
clarify, it's not this zoning
category. If someone came in,

450
00:46:34,792 --> 00:46:39,063
they can come to me and say,
hey, I want to put this
commercial, will look at it.

451
00:46:39,063 --> 00:46:45,202
They go through a proper
process, but commercial uses
can already go in this area.

452
00:46:45,202 --> 00:46:49,540
Now, there are some other
stipulations that miss that
that have they have to go

453
00:46:49,540 --> 00:46:56,347
through, as Miss Bush stated,
but this zoning category is
high density. It currently

454
00:46:56,347 --> 00:47:07,158
allows for minimum neighborhood,
high density, mixed use
commercial can go in this area

455
00:47:07,158 --> 00:47:14,799
right now without any special
provisions by any type of board
or Boa or anything like that.

456
00:47:14,799 --> 00:47:20,805
So give me an example then of
what kind of commercial uses
could go on right now with you

457
00:47:20,805 --> 00:47:28,112
and what in moving to
commercial is currently zoning.
The current zoning category is

458
00:47:28,112 --> 00:47:36,487
high density, mixed use. Just a
few of the residential uses
that people have concerns with,

459
00:47:36,487 --> 00:47:47,098
for example, apartments. There
are allowable use in this area
right now. Townhouses, group

460
00:47:47,098 --> 00:47:53,003
living right now without any
type of special provision.
Again, apartments. And those

461
00:47:53,003 --> 00:47:59,076
are those are approved uses not
conditional correct. These are
permitted allowable uses not

462
00:47:59,076 --> 00:48:08,686
conditional uses. A group that
would need site plan review
process. Of course retail sales.

463
00:48:08,686 --> 00:48:17,928
Right now you can have retail
sales such as. Now the square
footage is a factor 6000 square

464
00:48:17,928 --> 00:48:24,201
foot. No more. You can have bed,
breakfast and boarding rooming
houses. Some of the retail

465
00:48:24,201 --> 00:48:29,407
sales professional services
including realtors, bankers,
accountants, repair services

466
00:48:29,407 --> 00:48:34,211
such as appliance repair,
furniture that just to name
just a few. But it does. It

467
00:48:34,211 --> 00:48:40,418
does not allow for motor
vehicles. Okay, so go into
commercial. What intense uses

468
00:48:40,418 --> 00:48:47,124
would then now be allowed that
are not. Yes. So that one more
time the commercial district

469
00:48:47,124 --> 00:48:53,030
does allow for more intense
uses such as, you know, hotels,
motels, the as far as

470
00:48:53,030 --> 00:48:58,769
residential uses, they're
essentially the same right as
DMU. The density allocations

471
00:48:58,769 --> 00:49:04,842
and the intensity. As far as
apartments, they're both
allowed in the DMU and the

472
00:49:04,842 --> 00:49:11,081
commercial. The difference is
there's no restriction on the
size of the retail sales in the

473
00:49:11,081 --> 00:49:22,960
DMU, and the current zoning
district is limited to 6000
square foot. Think neighborhood

474
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:25,930
type of retail sales and
service. Barbershop. A
conditional use is available in

475
00:49:25,930 --> 00:49:33,437
this existing zoning district
to build up to 35,000ft² of
retail, sales, service, those

476
00:49:33,437 --> 00:49:39,443
type of things. The commercial
district. There's no limitation
on the size. There are

477
00:49:39,443 --> 00:49:48,152
provisions such as car washes.
More greater personal services,
repair service restaurants. So

478
00:49:48,152 --> 00:49:54,225
that kind of gives you a little
bit more idea. H DMU it's
really restricted on the size

479
00:49:54,225 --> 00:49:59,997
of the buildings without
conditional use. And also to
thank you, Caleb also too, if

480
00:49:59,997 --> 00:50:06,103
someone if someone had what the
current zoning of of if you
decide to keep it the same, if

481
00:50:06,103 --> 00:50:10,441
someone wanted to come in with
one of those, use a greater.
That's right. Greater than

482
00:50:10,441 --> 00:50:16,247
signs. The use would have to be
specified and maybe that's can
help with the neighborhood. It

483
00:50:16,247 --> 00:50:20,150
would have to be a public
meeting, but they have to get
approval from the Board of

484
00:50:20,150 --> 00:50:23,721
adjustments. But it's
conditional. And the
neighborhood, they can show up

485
00:50:23,721 --> 00:50:31,328
and they could they could see
what is going on with that
particular use going on in the

486
00:50:31,328 --> 00:50:38,869
neighborhood. So so there will
be a, a, another public meeting.
If, if someone want to come in

487
00:50:38,869 --> 00:50:43,274
with those higher uses that are
allowable and conditional use,
and with that, and they want to

488
00:50:43,274 --> 00:50:48,178
go more than 6000 square foot.
So there will be a public BOA
and neighborhood impact. The

489
00:50:48,178 --> 00:50:55,786
uses clearly got to be
identified then. So, Mr.
Speaker, and in light of one of

490
00:50:55,786 --> 00:51:01,325
the speakers, miss Pepper, I
believe the plain speak. I'm a
big fan of it. They've got to

491
00:51:01,325 --> 00:51:06,830
dumb this down for me a lot.
One of the one of the reasons
what we do up here, we have to

492
00:51:06,830 --> 00:51:11,302
look at the macro. We can't
look at the specific. Hence the
question I asked is it for

493
00:51:11,302 --> 00:51:15,072
marketability or for a specific
use? She was kind enough to
mention the specific use. I

494
00:51:15,072 --> 00:51:21,145
think a windows door type of
property. But again, for the
homeowner nearby, there's

495
00:51:21,145 --> 00:51:25,683
another level where he just
mentioned the board of
adjustments where you have.

496
00:51:25,683 --> 00:51:31,088
Don't wash your hands if this.
You have still a voice in this
whole process as you go forward

497
00:51:31,088 --> 00:51:37,595
and how they allow things to be
built there or not. But up here,
we look at the macro and then

498
00:51:37,595 --> 00:51:44,401
we we ask for detail, but we
cannot basically judge it on
what specific use. Because if

499
00:51:44,401 --> 00:51:49,540
today it's a if it's commercial,
that could mean a whole list of
things. We have to think about

500
00:51:49,540 --> 00:51:54,411
everything that's possible for
them. It's not to obscure what
is, you know, planned to be

501
00:51:54,411 --> 00:51:59,149
there because quite frankly,
none of us know. We have no
idea ten years from now. Yeah.

502
00:51:59,149 --> 00:52:04,121
And Mr. Collins, and let me let
me clarify something. I want to
make sure I said it correctly.

503
00:52:04,121 --> 00:52:11,028
If it remains high density,
mixed use, if it remains what
it currently is, and if there's

504
00:52:11,028 --> 00:52:18,969
any of those uses that exceed
the square footage, then they
will have to have Boa approval.

505
00:52:18,969 --> 00:52:24,708
With the conditional use
approval got to be specified.
That's if someone come and

506
00:52:24,708 --> 00:52:31,515
y'all make a decision to keep
it there. Those higher uses,
there's another option for them,

507
00:52:31,515 --> 00:52:37,287
which is through the board of
adjustments at a public meeting.
I want to be clear, for the

508
00:52:37,287 --> 00:52:44,862
record, that's if it remains
high density, mixed use, right.
You're saying if we denied the

509
00:52:44,862 --> 00:52:50,134
request today, that the other
option would be to go to the
board of adjustments for one of

510
00:52:50,134 --> 00:52:57,608
those uses, or conditional use
or variance. So for the owner,
if it does get approved, what

511
00:52:57,608 --> 00:53:02,012
what voice do they have? What
what part of the process can
they if somebody comes through

512
00:53:02,012 --> 00:53:09,319
with a permit request and they
have a pre-application meeting,
are they allowed to join in

513
00:53:09,319 --> 00:53:17,828
that process or hear what's
going to be presented? You
speak to me without their staff.

514
00:53:17,828 --> 00:53:25,703
Well, of course there is known
if it is approved, if someone
if they do want to come, they

515
00:53:25,703 --> 00:53:32,309
come to the site plan review
process. There is no type of
quote unquote public meetings

516
00:53:32,309 --> 00:53:37,047
or anything where they can come,
but they can. The meetings will
be posted, they can show up the

517
00:53:37,047 --> 00:53:44,188
pre app, but if that use is
allowed, it will be rather
challenging for someone to say

518
00:53:44,188 --> 00:53:53,330
that basically, because I don't
like it. That's not that's not
according to the law. Meredith,

519
00:53:53,330 --> 00:53:57,701
do you want to add something? I
would like to yes. Just briefly
respond to some of the

520
00:53:57,701 --> 00:54:02,039
statements being made. We
appreciate Miss Liccardo coming
out, as we always do with

521
00:54:02,039 --> 00:54:07,578
citizens expressing their
concerns. As she stated stated
herself, there is a lot of

522
00:54:07,578 --> 00:54:12,282
commercial. It's a direct quote.
There's. This is already
happening around her. Any idea

523
00:54:12,282 --> 00:54:17,454
that apartments or low housing
or anything like that may occur?
As Mr. Jones stated, as we've

524
00:54:17,454 --> 00:54:21,525
stated, the density, the number
of houses, none of that's
changing. So if this owner

525
00:54:21,525 --> 00:54:26,830
wanted to put that in today, We
could file a pre app for that
today. The major difference is

526
00:54:26,830 --> 00:54:30,834
the square footage and not the
need to come in for a
conditional use. Because again

527
00:54:30,834 --> 00:54:36,006
if it's marketability, if it's,
you know, a broad range of
potential uses, then, you know,

528
00:54:36,006 --> 00:54:40,477
having to narrow one down and
say, this is exactly what we're
going to do and do at this

529
00:54:40,477 --> 00:54:45,415
stage in the development really
is not the best path for us,
which is why we're here for the

530
00:54:45,415 --> 00:54:50,020
rezoning. Florida law actually
prohibits contract zoning. So
for us to come say we're

531
00:54:50,020 --> 00:54:54,825
absolutely we promise we're
going to do a window store. So
therefore give us this 100. You

532
00:54:54,825 --> 00:54:58,762
know, that's a contract that's
saying we'll give you something,
you give us something and

533
00:54:58,762 --> 00:55:03,801
that's not allowed. So we can't
say even though, you know,
everyone has good intentions.

534
00:55:03,801 --> 00:55:07,871
Obviously, you all understand.
And for the public to
understand, you are looking at

535
00:55:07,871 --> 00:55:17,181
the broad picture and all
permitted uses in these cases,
your, you know, purview is very

536
00:55:17,181 --> 00:55:20,450
narrow. You have to look only
at the criteria and determine
whether by competent and

537
00:55:20,450 --> 00:55:24,288
substantial evidence, we've met
those criteria. We, you know,
have submitted our evidence,

538
00:55:24,288 --> 00:55:27,424
our supporting materials and
our report meeting that
criteria. The county has

539
00:55:27,424 --> 00:55:32,296
adopted and agreed with that.
They even say in their findings
that it is transitional between

540
00:55:32,296 --> 00:55:40,470
the CLI and the DMU. Concerns
about traffic or riff raff. The
Redevelopment Agency has no

541
00:55:40,470 --> 00:55:45,642
concerns, and they're charged
with redeveloping a blighted,
not necessarily blighted, but

542
00:55:45,642 --> 00:55:49,546
an area that needs some
attention. So I'm not saying
the area is blighted. However

543
00:55:49,546 --> 00:55:53,150
that's what they're charged
with. They say, you know, we're
good with this traffic

544
00:55:53,150 --> 00:55:58,522
department. TT o has issued a
memorandum. They're good with
it. Again, staff says we've met

545
00:55:58,522 --> 00:56:04,261
the criteria. And just for, you
know, a little bit of
reassurance for the neighbors,

546
00:56:04,261 --> 00:56:10,767
any use, any of the permitted
uses has to come back through
the county. It goes through

547
00:56:10,767 --> 00:56:16,807
development review committee.
They can come and participate.
Those are, you know, agenda

548
00:56:16,807 --> 00:56:22,946
meetings they can get with Mr.
Jones and ask to be notified
when that process starts. And

549
00:56:22,946 --> 00:56:29,620
be aware, because the county
must look to see whether that
particular use actually also is

550
00:56:29,620 --> 00:56:33,757
compatible and consistent. So
if we, you know, somebody
wanted to come in with

551
00:56:33,757 --> 00:56:38,395
something that was going to be,
you know, incredibly noisy or
generate a lot of traffic or

552
00:56:38,395 --> 00:56:42,966
somehow adverse to the
neighborhood. The county still
has the ability at review

553
00:56:42,966 --> 00:56:46,837
committee level to deny it. So
having met the criteria, again,
we appreciate everyone's

554
00:56:46,837 --> 00:56:51,775
concerns. But we would ask for
approval today. Meredith. I
have a chairman. I have a

555
00:56:51,775 --> 00:56:55,145
question for Meredith. The
current property has obviously
a church structure on it that

556
00:56:55,145 --> 00:57:00,250
was built in 1980. So from a I
mean, this is prior to us even
having zoning here in Escambia

557
00:57:00,250 --> 00:57:04,421
County that didn't start until
Windhorse 96, that we really
had a real zoning

558
00:57:04,421 --> 00:57:09,326
classifications here. And from
a stormwater standpoint, which
I saw, I think I saw Chris Curb

559
00:57:09,326 --> 00:57:14,798
back there. He'll appreciate
this. Any changes in this
property footprint would have

560
00:57:14,798 --> 00:57:19,836
to meet today's current
standards. And this is only an
acre. One acre just over an

561
00:57:19,836 --> 00:57:24,241
acre property. So any any
changes to this footprint
parking wise and things would

562
00:57:24,241 --> 00:57:29,579
have to have new stormwater
meet today's current standards.
So if that gives if if that

563
00:57:29,579 --> 00:57:35,953
gives the citizens some some,
you know, and not only is that
true, but a change of use that

564
00:57:35,953 --> 00:57:41,024
increases the parking
requirements also has to come
up. So let's say, you know, to

565
00:57:41,024 --> 00:57:44,227
your question, if the building
gets raised, hurricane,
whatever takes it out, they're

566
00:57:44,227 --> 00:57:50,567
going to rebuild. Absolutely.
To today's standards, if we if
somebody comes in and wants to

567
00:57:50,567 --> 00:57:55,472
do something, you know, a
change of use that that the use
itself is going to impact or,

568
00:57:55,472 --> 00:58:02,679
you know, create that higher
demand. Today's standards,
while the building itself may

569
00:58:02,679 --> 00:58:07,050
be, I hate to use grandfathered,
but non-conforming in some way.
And I don't know that it is

570
00:58:07,050 --> 00:58:11,621
actually non-conforming, but
but to the extent it may be,
you know, more intense

571
00:58:11,621 --> 00:58:15,292
development, anything like that
is going to trigger those
protections for the

572
00:58:15,292 --> 00:58:20,630
neighborhood. And again,
anytime you have a commercial
use adjacent to or buffering a

573
00:58:20,630 --> 00:58:23,867
residence, there are those
heightened buffering standards,
higher, you know, heightened

574
00:58:23,867 --> 00:58:29,306
protections between the two
uses and lots of steps to get
to a change in from what it

575
00:58:29,306 --> 00:58:33,610
currently is today as far as
use goes, as well as parking
and so forth. So yes,

576
00:58:33,610 --> 00:58:39,416
absolutely. Thank you. All
right. Any further questions?
If there aren't any I'll

577
00:58:39,416 --> 00:58:46,289
entertain a motion on case
Z2026-16. Well, as much as I
don't like spot zoning, but I

578
00:58:46,289 --> 00:58:51,962
feel with the urban infill
component of all this and with
the CRA there, I think this

579
00:58:51,962 --> 00:58:58,869
merits this. So I'm you know,
recommend approval for this
case. Second. Okay. Any

580
00:58:58,869 --> 00:59:04,174
discussion on the motion? All
those in favor, please signify
by raising your right hand

581
00:59:04,174 --> 00:59:10,280
motion carries. All right. That
was the only case that we had
in the rezoning meeting. So we

582
00:59:10,280 --> 00:59:17,888
will adjourn that meeting. And
we will now call to order the
regular Planning Board meeting.

583
00:59:17,888 --> 00:59:23,260
So the Escambia County Planning
Board for September 1st is
hereby called to order with six

584
00:59:23,260 --> 00:59:29,733
members present. We do have a
quorum. Do we have proof of
publication? Yes, sir. The

585
00:59:29,733 --> 00:59:34,104
publication meet all legal
requirements. Yes, sir. I'll
entertain a motion to waive the

586
00:59:34,104 --> 00:59:37,707
reading of the legal
advertisement. Do I have a
motion? So moved. Second.

587
00:59:37,707 --> 00:59:42,746
Second. All those in favor,
please signify by raising your
right hand. Motion carries.

588
00:59:42,746 --> 00:59:48,852
Planning board meeting minutes
for July 7th, 2026 have been
provided to the board. I'll

589
00:59:48,852 --> 00:59:53,123
entertain a motion to accept
the meeting minutes into
evidence. Do we have a motion?

590
00:59:53,123 --> 00:59:57,360
Motion? We have a second.
Second. All those in favor,
please signify by raising your

591
00:59:57,360 --> 01:00:02,365
right hand. All right. Motion
carries. Planning board hearing
package for September 1st has

592
01:00:02,365 --> 01:00:05,802
been provided to the board.
I'll entertain a motion to
accept the hearing package and

593
01:00:05,802 --> 01:00:10,073
legal advertisement into
evidence to have a motion.
Motion to accept. Second.

594
01:00:10,073 --> 01:00:13,643
Second. All right. All those in
favor, please signify by
raising your right hand. All

595
01:00:13,643 --> 01:00:22,152
right. Great. All right. So
there is one item to be heard
today that we will vote on.

596
01:00:22,152 --> 01:00:32,362
That is the small scale map
amendment application for
consideration case SSA202601

597
01:00:32,362 --> 01:00:44,241
request change the future Land
Use category for parcel number
26-1-31- 3200 dash 000-001 off

598
01:00:44,241 --> 01:00:51,314
Mill View Road from mixed use
suburban MUS to AR agricultural
residential flew as requested

599
01:00:51,314 --> 01:00:57,554
by Meredith Bush, the agent for
Chavers construction. The owner
staff was. Notice of the

600
01:00:57,554 --> 01:01:03,527
hearing sent to all interested
parties. Yes, sir. Was notice
of the hearing posted on the

601
01:01:03,527 --> 01:01:08,365
subject property? Yes, sir. All
right. Meredith, are you good
with staff presenting maps and

602
01:01:08,365 --> 01:01:15,272
photographs? Yes, sir. All
right. Good morning, planning
Board. My name is Melissa

603
01:01:15,272 --> 01:01:21,678
Shirley. I am an urban planner
two with the Development
Services Department. This is

604
01:01:21,678 --> 01:01:33,957
the location map. This is the
500 radius zoning map for the
subject parcel. This is the

605
01:01:33,957 --> 01:01:47,103
existing future land use. This
is the proposed future land use.
This is the NWI wetlands map.

606
01:01:47,103 --> 01:01:54,277
This is an aerial photograph.
This is the notice of the
public hearing sign on the

607
01:01:54,277 --> 01:02:03,086
subject parcel. This is looking
east along Bankhead Drive. This
is looking across Bankhead

608
01:02:03,086 --> 01:02:13,563
Drive. This is looking west
along Bankhead Drive. This is
looking south onto the site.

609
01:02:13,563 --> 01:02:23,707
This is also looking south onto
the site. This is actually on
some of the site right here, as

610
01:02:23,707 --> 01:02:38,054
well as more of the site right
here. The conditions currently
at the site. That's all of the

611
01:02:38,054 --> 01:02:43,860
staff findings of the. All
right. Thank you very much,
Meredith. Please just go ahead

612
01:02:43,860 --> 01:02:50,367
and come forward. And we've
already had you state your name
and address. So we'll skip that

613
01:02:50,367 --> 01:02:56,039
part. And did you read that
part? Yeah. Okay. Did you
receive a hearing or the

614
01:02:56,039 --> 01:03:02,112
package for. With staff's
analysis for today's case? Yes,
sir. All right. I'll go ahead.

615
01:03:02,112 --> 01:03:07,450
So this is a small scale map
amendment. We're actually
seeking to go from the mixed

616
01:03:07,450 --> 01:03:13,590
use suburban down to an
agricultural residential. Part
of this is implementation of

617
01:03:13,590 --> 01:03:19,029
the savings clause. As you're
aware, in 2015, the county
adopted a new Land Development

618
01:03:19,029 --> 01:03:26,970
code rezone. The entire county.
Part of that and an unintended
consequence, was that certain

619
01:03:26,970 --> 01:03:32,776
rights and permitted uses were
lost. To avoid any issues with
that, legally, the county

620
01:03:32,776 --> 01:03:38,148
adopted the savings clause,
which allows an owner to ask to
be reverted back or allow those

621
01:03:38,148 --> 01:03:44,988
prior uses. However, in order
to do so, the county, at no
cost to the applicant, has to

622
01:03:44,988 --> 01:03:51,828
process a future land use map
amendment when that action
would create an incompatibility

623
01:03:51,828 --> 01:03:59,436
with one of the uses being
requested. So, you know, we had
discussions back and forth with

624
01:03:59,436 --> 01:04:04,040
the county whether or not for
the intended use. This is an
already excavated borrow pit

625
01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:09,779
for the intended use. Whether
or not we should, you know,
bump up to an industrial or go

626
01:04:09,779 --> 01:04:16,252
back to a agricultural
residential. The prior zoning
is rural residential that's

627
01:04:16,252 --> 01:04:21,291
been implemented and out of,
you know, for every reason, we
have determined that going back

628
01:04:21,291 --> 01:04:25,929
down to the agricultural
residential is the most
appropriate. It's going from 25,

629
01:04:25,929 --> 01:04:32,602
you know, potential dwelling
units to one per four acres in
a much more limited scope. We

630
01:04:32,602 --> 01:04:38,975
have met the criteria, I
believe counties report
outlines that. However, I will

631
01:04:38,975 --> 01:04:58,561
walk through those requirements.
So there are quite a few for
these. So the property as far

632
01:04:58,561 --> 01:05:05,335
as environmental criteria, the
property is in an area of
minimal flood hazard zone X

633
01:05:05,335 --> 01:05:11,341
soils of the area, primarily
Bonifay loamy sand and big B
garcon complex soils. We've

634
01:05:11,341 --> 01:05:19,616
submitted a contour map. We are
not within any protected
wellhead area outside of both

635
01:05:19,616 --> 01:05:28,158
the seven year and 20 year
contour. Sanitary, sewer and
water to the extent necessary.

636
01:05:28,158 --> 01:05:34,063
Emerald Coast Utilities
Authority will provide water
and sanitation services if

637
01:05:34,063 --> 01:05:38,802
needed. Traffic. The subject
property is located to the
south of Bankhead Drive and

638
01:05:38,802 --> 01:05:44,874
west of blue Angel Parkway,
near the intersection of blue
Angel and Mobile Highway. FDOT

639
01:05:44,874 --> 01:05:50,213
provides an annual traffic
daily count at that. At that
location of 15000 trips on blue

640
01:05:50,213 --> 01:05:57,320
Angel Parkway. Wetlands and
drainage to the site contains a
shallow, man made water body

641
01:05:57,320 --> 01:06:02,358
created by the prior excavation.
So when the pit was dug out,
there is, you know, some water

642
01:06:02,358 --> 01:06:07,464
there, but the artificial
borrow pit pond does not
constitute jurisdictional

643
01:06:07,464 --> 01:06:14,637
wetlands. Any necessary
assessments or any, you know,
review of the stormwater or

644
01:06:14,637 --> 01:06:20,109
drainage would occur at the
development review stage.
Stormwater system, if needed,

645
01:06:20,109 --> 01:06:25,815
would be designed for 100 year
storm event. It's not within a
stormwater problem area. It is

646
01:06:25,815 --> 01:06:31,588
located within the eight Mile
Creek drainage basin. Solid
waste to the extent necessary,

647
01:06:31,588 --> 01:06:38,428
will be collected by Ecua for
disposal in the county landfill,
which has adequate existing and

648
01:06:38,428 --> 01:06:43,032
projected capacity. Level of
standard. Level of service
standard for solid waste

649
01:06:43,032 --> 01:06:51,007
disposal is 6 pounds per capita
per day. Parks, recreation and
open space. Proposed amendments

650
01:06:51,007 --> 01:06:57,146
would not adversely affect
parks, recreation or open space.
All code requirements will be

651
01:06:57,146 --> 01:07:01,518
adhered to throughout
development review process. The
current school assignments for

652
01:07:01,518 --> 01:07:07,223
the area are Beulah Elementary,
Beulah Middle School, and Pine
Forest High School. The

653
01:07:07,223 --> 01:07:11,928
amendment to AR is not
anticipated to create any
capacity issue, and again, it

654
01:07:11,928 --> 01:07:17,967
actually reduces any conflict
with school capacity as we're
going from 25 units per acre

655
01:07:17,967 --> 01:07:24,474
down to one one unit per four
acres. State of Florida
Division of Historical

656
01:07:24,474 --> 01:07:30,213
Resources. We did request that
analysis. The historic and
archeological investigation

657
01:07:30,213 --> 01:07:34,551
revealed there were no
protected historical or
cultural references on the

658
01:07:34,551 --> 01:07:40,323
property, and as part of our
packet, we have submitted those
findings with a comprehensive

659
01:07:40,323 --> 01:07:45,728
plan request. We have to show a
need and benefit. The
identified land use need is

660
01:07:45,728 --> 01:07:50,400
consistent with the scope and
function of the comprehensive
plan, for which the amendment

661
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:55,405
to AR is clearly warranted. In
this case, the County Savings
Clause provides the specific

662
01:07:55,405 --> 01:08:01,945
policy basis for the amendment
to restore the property's prior
rural residential zoning rights

663
01:08:01,945 --> 01:08:06,950
rights that cannot be
meaningfully implemented under
the current Muhs designation.

664
01:08:06,950 --> 01:08:13,089
So again, in order to
accommodate that restoration of
rights, we have to have the flu

665
01:08:13,089 --> 01:08:18,661
change. We also have to show
professional practices. The
amendment applies contemporary

666
01:08:18,661 --> 01:08:23,099
planning principles,
engineering standards, and
professional best practices.

667
01:08:23,099 --> 01:08:29,272
The implementation of the
savings clause to restore the
RR zoning entitlements reflect

668
01:08:29,272 --> 01:08:34,844
sound planning methodology by
ensuring the comprehensive plan,
zoning map and long standing

669
01:08:34,844 --> 01:08:41,351
use and history of the property
operate cohesively. As far as
the specific small scale

670
01:08:41,351 --> 01:08:48,458
amendment conditions out of
Florida statutes 16331871.
We're less than 50 acres. It's

671
01:08:48,458 --> 01:08:53,763
about a 20 acre parcel. This
does not involve a text change.
The comprehensive plan. It's

672
01:08:53,763 --> 01:09:00,670
only a land use change to the
map. And we are not in an area
designated of critical state

673
01:09:00,670 --> 01:09:07,410
concern. Section D of our
report. We go through about 40
comprehensive plan principles

674
01:09:07,410 --> 01:09:12,849
which we meet. I won't take the
time to read all those to you,
but they are submitted as

675
01:09:12,849 --> 01:09:19,288
evidence in the background of
this hearing. And I believe
that concludes the specific

676
01:09:19,288 --> 01:09:25,328
findings. Again, staff supports
our request. This may be one
that you've heard a little

677
01:09:25,328 --> 01:09:29,699
about, because we were recently
at the Board of Adjustment and
were granted a conditional use

678
01:09:29,699 --> 01:09:34,871
approval for land clearing
debris. As an amended
reclamation plan on the pit. So

679
01:09:34,871 --> 01:09:39,208
there has been some concern. I
would just remind everyone, if
there are speakers, that today

680
01:09:39,208 --> 01:09:45,648
is only about the savings
clause and the change in the
land, the future land use

681
01:09:45,648 --> 01:09:49,185
conditional use hearing that
was already determined by the
Board of Adjustment, we will

682
01:09:49,185 --> 01:09:53,389
have after this, the whole
development review process to
get a development order, which

683
01:09:53,389 --> 01:09:57,827
will be contingent on a full
public hearing before the Board
of County Commissioners for an

684
01:09:57,827 --> 01:10:03,266
operational permit. So all
we're asking today is that you
give us a consistent flew for

685
01:10:03,266 --> 01:10:10,006
our entitlement to the RR
zoning. And again, it reduces
the density from 25 to 1 per

686
01:10:10,006 --> 01:10:16,512
four. Happy to take any
questions or address speakers
concerns. Any questions for

687
01:10:16,512 --> 01:10:21,984
Meredith at this time? Just
just for clarification, the
savings clause allows it to

688
01:10:21,984 --> 01:10:31,627
roll back will will to a
previous zoning that doesn't
exist anymore. Right. Will that

689
01:10:31,627 --> 01:10:35,665
affect will they have to come
here? We'll have to have a
quasi judicial meeting. Or is

690
01:10:35,665 --> 01:10:42,105
it just. No, no. It's automatic.
So when someone has lost a use,
there's an application form to

691
01:10:42,105 --> 01:10:48,945
the county just seeking to have
them restore that, reinstate
that prior use. That does not

692
01:10:48,945 --> 01:10:52,882
go to anyone but county
reviewers who look at. Yes,
this is the prior zoning. Yes,

693
01:10:52,882 --> 01:10:57,653
this was a prior use. We're
giving it to them because we
shouldn't have taken it per law.

694
01:10:57,653 --> 01:11:01,824
It's only when you look at that
and you see, oh, you know,
there's this use or there's

695
01:11:01,824 --> 01:11:06,963
this, this zoning category that
is no longer consistent under
the code with the future land

696
01:11:06,963 --> 01:11:11,634
use. So the county at its cost
must I mean, the applicant has
to apply. The county didn't

697
01:11:11,634 --> 01:11:16,305
apply for us. But as part of
that restoration of the
entitlement, we have to do the

698
01:11:16,305 --> 01:11:21,511
future land use. So that's
where the hearing comes in. And
then once we get the approval,

699
01:11:21,511 --> 01:11:25,915
you know, you recommend or
recommend approval or denial.
But once that final decision is

700
01:11:25,915 --> 01:11:31,387
made by the county commission,
the savings clause is then
signed and recorded. But the

701
01:11:31,387 --> 01:11:36,492
actual reversion to that prior
zoning is not a question for
anyone other than staff looking

702
01:11:36,492 --> 01:11:40,730
to say, yeah, we took this, we
got to give it back, right?
We're not in instituting any

703
01:11:40,730 --> 01:11:46,202
new things. It's just taking it
back to where the previous uses
were. Correct. And again, here

704
01:11:46,202 --> 01:11:51,941
we're going back to rural
residential, which is a much
less intense, much less dense.

705
01:11:51,941 --> 01:11:57,013
So, you know, future use of the
property is much more protected
for and lower intensity for the

706
01:11:57,013 --> 01:12:04,387
surrounding neighborhoods.
Thank you. And board just there
are a lot of moving parts with

707
01:12:04,387 --> 01:12:13,529
this issue. Sorry. Andrew
Holmer Development services. As
Miss Busch mentioned, you're

708
01:12:13,529 --> 01:12:24,507
strictly here looking at a
small scale future land use map
amendment strictly to bring the

709
01:12:24,507 --> 01:12:30,980
savings clause uses into
conformance with the future
land use. The savings clause is

710
01:12:30,980 --> 01:12:35,518
for uses, but it's also for
density. In either case, when
someone enacts it, we, the

711
01:12:35,518 --> 01:12:40,156
staff, are obligated to make
sure they have a compatible
future land use. And that's all

712
01:12:40,156 --> 01:12:45,294
this is today. Last month at
the Board of Adjustment, we
handled the conditional use

713
01:12:45,294 --> 01:12:52,468
because in the previous zoning,
RR, borrow pits and reclamation
activities were a conditional

714
01:12:52,468 --> 01:12:58,941
use. So this change to the
reclamation was reviewed by the
Board of Adjustment and

715
01:12:58,941 --> 01:13:06,315
approved by the Board of
Adjustment. So today is the
next to last step of cleaning

716
01:13:06,315 --> 01:13:16,959
this up. In the future land use
change. All right. All right.
Now we'll have staff make their

717
01:13:16,959 --> 01:13:27,703
presentation. Okay. Again this
is a summary of the proposed
amendment for transition from

718
01:13:27,703 --> 01:13:35,645
mixed use suburban to
agricultural residential. So
the small scale amendment to

719
01:13:35,645 --> 01:13:43,152
the future land use map of
Escambia County proposes the
change to change. Excuse me,

720
01:13:43,152 --> 01:13:52,561
the flu category of one parcel
totaling 21.4 acres from mixed
use suburban to agricultural

721
01:13:52,561 --> 01:13:58,668
residential. The current zoning
designation of the subject
parcel is low density

722
01:13:58,668 --> 01:14:03,739
residential with a savings
clause. Zoning of rural
residential district. Low

723
01:14:03,739 --> 01:14:10,913
density. The subject parcel was
historically permitted as the
bank had. Borrow pit. The RR

724
01:14:10,913 --> 01:14:19,221
zoning designation by the use
of the saving savings clause
reestablishes the ability to

725
01:14:19,221 --> 01:14:26,429
apply for a conditional use of
borrow pits and reclamation
activities subject to the local

726
01:14:26,429 --> 01:14:33,102
permit and development review
requirements. The application.
Excuse me, the applicant has an

727
01:14:33,102 --> 01:14:42,745
approved conditional use
request CU202601 to allow a
borrow pit within 1000ft of a

728
01:14:42,745 --> 01:14:50,653
residential. Use the RR zoning
designation in lieu of the low
Density Zoning designation,

729
01:14:50,653 --> 01:14:56,092
requires a future land use
change. This future land use
change from mixed use suburban

730
01:14:56,092 --> 01:15:02,832
to agricultural residential
will allow for the most
compatible and consistent flu

731
01:15:02,832 --> 01:15:09,105
category to support continued
commercial activities
consistent with the approved

732
01:15:09,105 --> 01:15:15,411
conditional use. And then below
is just some information about
those two designations. Mixed

733
01:15:15,411 --> 01:15:21,484
use suburban. The intended use
is a mix of residential and
nonresidential uses, while

734
01:15:21,484 --> 01:15:27,556
promoting compatible infill
development and the separation
of urban and suburban land uses.

735
01:15:27,556 --> 01:15:33,295
And then the proposed future
land use is agricultural
residential, which is intended

736
01:15:33,295 --> 01:15:41,237
for routine agricultural and
silvicultural related
activities and low density

737
01:15:41,237 --> 01:15:47,777
residential uses. It also
allows for commercial activity
limited to those endeavors,

738
01:15:47,777 --> 01:15:53,849
ancillary to agricultural and
silvicultural pursuits, and in
support of agricultural

739
01:15:53,849 --> 01:16:00,689
activities such as seed feed
and food outlets, farm
equipment and repair and

740
01:16:00,689 --> 01:16:09,365
veterinary services so as to
the land development, flu
amendment requirements. There

741
01:16:09,365 --> 01:16:16,205
are general amendment
conditions, the need and
benefits, a conversion from

742
01:16:16,205 --> 01:16:22,278
mixed use suburban flu to
agricultural. Excuse me,
agricultural residential flu

743
01:16:22,278 --> 01:16:28,050
would allow for reinstated
conditional use. Commercial
activity on the savings clause

744
01:16:28,050 --> 01:16:35,658
has already been applied for
and vested. The continued use
of the bank head pit as to

745
01:16:35,658 --> 01:16:41,464
professional practices, the
requested change to
agricultural residential would

746
01:16:41,464 --> 01:16:47,002
be compatible with the existing
site. This is also compatible
with the approved conditional

747
01:16:47,002 --> 01:16:54,777
use operation of the borrow pit
at this location. As to the flu
amendment conditions subject to

748
01:16:54,777 --> 01:17:10,960
Florida statutes. 163.31871 as
to one, the subject parcel is
21.48 acres, which is less than

749
01:17:10,960 --> 01:17:17,032
those 50 acre requirement or
fewer. The proposed amendment
does not involve a text change

750
01:17:17,032 --> 01:17:26,842
to the Comprehensive Plan, and
only a site specific small
scale development activity, and

751
01:17:26,842 --> 01:17:33,582
the properties are subject to
the proposed amendment, not
within a critical state concern

752
01:17:33,582 --> 01:17:43,025
area. As to other comp plan
objectives and policies for
housing. The approved

753
01:17:43,025 --> 01:17:49,798
historical borrow pit would not
be suitable for residential
uses. The reclamation plan for

754
01:17:49,798 --> 01:17:56,238
the land Clearing Debris
Facility would be challenging
for future redevelopment. If

755
01:17:56,238 --> 01:18:01,377
the flu change is approved, the
commercial activity would be
consistent with the savings

756
01:18:01,377 --> 01:18:07,116
clause zoning, and it would
allow for the most productive
use of the existing site. As

757
01:18:07,116 --> 01:18:14,657
for the future land use, the
future land use categories
adjacent and surrounding the

758
01:18:14,657 --> 01:18:22,998
subject parcel are mixed use
suburban and industrial. This
change to AR would not change

759
01:18:22,998 --> 01:18:28,671
the area's characteristics
while preventing sprawl and
higher densities, as well as

760
01:18:28,671 --> 01:18:34,476
preserving the protection of
rural areas. As to
infrastructure, the parcel is

761
01:18:34,476 --> 01:18:40,249
currently undeveloped for any
kind of residential activities.
The scope of the proposed

762
01:18:40,249 --> 01:18:45,554
continued conditional use of
the pit operations will be
reviewed at a future date to

763
01:18:45,554 --> 01:18:53,162
determine provisions for any
required infrastructure changes,
and then as to the concurrency

764
01:18:53,162 --> 01:19:01,837
management system in relation
to potable water, sanitary
sewer and solid waste disposal.

765
01:19:01,837 --> 01:19:08,811
According to the application,
Ecua provides the potable water,
sanitary sewer and solid waste

766
01:19:08,811 --> 01:19:15,417
collection and disposal of the
subject parcel. The continued
use of the proposed conditional

767
01:19:15,417 --> 01:19:22,725
use commercial activity would
require future review. If any
capacity changes at this

768
01:19:22,725 --> 01:19:36,205
location. As to the stormwater
management and the the current
installation will be reviewed

769
01:19:36,205 --> 01:19:43,979
if any new development will be
made here and be the
responsibility of the developer

770
01:19:43,979 --> 01:19:54,290
as to transportation and
mobility, the t o staff has
submitted information there.

771
01:19:54,290 --> 01:20:04,967
I'm not going to go through all
of that, but they did note that
they were in approval of the

772
01:20:04,967 --> 01:20:12,174
small scale change as to
protected resources. The
subject parcel is outside of

773
01:20:12,174 --> 01:20:21,116
any kind of wellhead protection
areas. As to the historically
significant sites, there was

774
01:20:21,116 --> 01:20:27,756
none that were identified as to
wetlands and habitats. The.
There are indications there

775
01:20:27,756 --> 01:20:32,695
that there are hydric soils,
which may indicate the presence
of wetlands. However, a review

776
01:20:32,695 --> 01:20:36,899
of the available National
Wetlands Inventory data showed
that only the southernmost

777
01:20:36,899 --> 01:20:41,203
portion of the property had
been identified as having
wetlands attributes. A site

778
01:20:41,203 --> 01:20:46,542
specific survey will be
required before any future
development authorizations,

779
01:20:46,542 --> 01:20:53,449
regardless of the proposed flu
change. Requirements for state
and federal wetlands impacts or

780
01:20:53,449 --> 01:20:59,154
responsibility of the developer,
and a requirement for any new
development of the existing

781
01:20:59,154 --> 01:21:07,096
location. And as to the final
urban forest, any existing
vegetation will remain as

782
01:21:07,096 --> 01:21:13,168
buffering to the site. Any
future development may require
a tree inventory and subject

783
01:21:13,168 --> 01:21:20,376
parcel for any expansion of the
future use of the site, and
that concludes the staff's

784
01:21:20,376 --> 01:21:29,818
findings. All right. Any
questions for staff? All right.
Seeing none, we do have two

785
01:21:29,818 --> 01:21:34,423
members of the public that have
signed up to speak. So Larry
Downes Jr, if you'll please

786
01:21:34,423 --> 01:21:43,399
come forward, state your name
and address for us and we'll
get your time started. Address

787
01:21:43,399 --> 01:21:50,973
again? Oh, yeah. You've already
said yours, Larry. Larry Downes
junior here. I happen to have a

788
01:21:50,973 --> 01:21:57,146
little bit of experience with
this. It's probably ten years
ago or so that I had to utilize

789
01:21:57,146 --> 01:22:03,085
the savings clause. Didn't know
anything about it. And of
course, I'm in favor of this

790
01:22:03,085 --> 01:22:11,160
because it's the right thing to
do. But they rezoned Half Bird
Drive where I live. The whole

791
01:22:11,160 --> 01:22:20,102
one mile long road rezoned it
to LDR low density residential
from RR. Nothing is conforming

792
01:22:20,102 --> 01:22:24,973
out there. 90% of the
properties on that road are
non-conforming cows, horses,

793
01:22:24,973 --> 01:22:31,713
all types of stuff. So I don't
know why they did this. I was
in the middle of battling the

794
01:22:31,713 --> 01:22:37,453
city natural gas department, so
I was busy and whoever put up
the sign, y'all know that I

795
01:22:37,453 --> 01:22:45,360
would I would have been here.
So they put the sign up and
then it must have disappeared

796
01:22:45,360 --> 01:22:50,132
really quickly because I didn't
see it coming in or out. And
y'all know me. Y'all know I

797
01:22:50,132 --> 01:22:54,369
would have got out, took a
picture with this sign and came
here. But I was busy fighting

798
01:22:54,369 --> 01:23:01,210
another leg of government. So
anyways, I'm for this
restoration of rights, you know,

799
01:23:01,210 --> 01:23:09,117
I mean, that's isn't that weird
that we had rights once upon a
time and now y'all have to

800
01:23:09,117 --> 01:23:15,290
suggest to the county
commissioners to restore them
rights. So I'm for that. And

801
01:23:15,290 --> 01:23:20,762
also, you know, the 14th
amendment supports this, right?
You know, because we're

802
01:23:20,762 --> 01:23:26,401
supposed to have property
rights. And if we if we give it
to anybody else, which it was

803
01:23:26,401 --> 01:23:34,309
given to me, I have a paper in
my safe to make sure it never
goes away because of because of

804
01:23:34,309 --> 01:23:40,682
my farm, which I have chickens
and cows and goats and turkeys
and all this kind of stuff. But

805
01:23:40,682 --> 01:23:48,690
all the uses that are allowed
with this, you know, it's, it's
it's kind of a, it's kind of

806
01:23:48,690 --> 01:23:54,129
represents the basic principles
of liberty and our founding
principles of this country. So

807
01:23:54,129 --> 01:24:02,704
anyways, recommend to the
county that they accept the
savings clause. Thank you to

808
01:24:02,704 --> 01:24:12,381
the commissioners. All right.
Thank you Larry. Next up is
Deborah Fall. If you'll state

809
01:24:12,381 --> 01:24:18,620
your name and address for the
record and be well, you don't
have to be sworn in in this

810
01:24:18,620 --> 01:24:32,367
meeting, so we'll get your time
started. My name is Deborah
Fall. I have I own 5115

811
01:24:32,367 --> 01:24:40,542
Bankhead Drive. I am the L
right ahead of the pit. I'm. I
like chambers, I'm all in

812
01:24:40,542 --> 01:24:46,949
favors what he wants to do. My
concern and my question is that
that access road belongs to me.

813
01:24:46,949 --> 01:24:51,019
I they he has irrevocable use
of it. There's also two other
pits right there beside it.

814
01:24:51,019 --> 01:24:55,090
They all have irrevocable use
of that access road, but it
belongs to me on my legal

815
01:24:55,090 --> 01:24:59,094
description. So my question is,
if they are going to develop
something back there, how does

816
01:24:59,094 --> 01:25:03,131
that work with it being an
access road? And that's really
all. Otherwise I'm in favor. I

817
01:25:03,131 --> 01:25:07,169
like rural residential and I
hope they do put large acreage
back there eventually, but

818
01:25:07,169 --> 01:25:11,206
they've got to go across my
road to get there. So if
somebody can explain how that

819
01:25:11,206 --> 01:25:15,944
works out, that would be great.
Thank you. All right. I would
refer you over to Developmental

820
01:25:15,944 --> 01:25:19,181
Services for a better answer
with that. And probably, yeah,
yeah, yeah. Yes, ma'am. He

821
01:25:19,181 --> 01:25:24,987
knows me. Very good. All right.
We have no further speakers.
Any further questions for staff

822
01:25:24,987 --> 01:25:32,060
or the applicant. If not, I'll
entertain a motion. Motion to
accept move to state. Okay.

823
01:25:32,060 --> 01:25:35,998
Second. Second. Any discussion
on the motion? All those in
favor, please signify by

824
01:25:35,998 --> 01:25:44,272
raising your right hand. All
right. Motion carries. All
right. We do have one action

825
01:25:44,272 --> 01:25:51,113
item for discussion today or
one discussion item. I'm sorry.
That's out lying fields a

826
01:25:51,113 --> 01:25:59,721
discussion. So am I turning
this on over to you guys. And
okay. And we do have several

827
01:25:59,721 --> 01:26:10,165
speakers on this as well. All
right. There's a lot of moving
parts with this issue as well.

828
01:26:10,165 --> 01:26:15,937
Okay. Ol f eight. So as you
will recall, we were here
before with the future land use

829
01:26:15,937 --> 01:26:24,513
change that was recommended by
the BCC to be transmitted to
Tallahassee. It has been sent

830
01:26:24,513 --> 01:26:36,825
to Tallahassee. We're waiting
on their answer. Along with
that is the master plan. The

831
01:26:36,825 --> 01:26:44,800
changes to the the master plan
that's on there. Now, in
addition to that, and from that

832
01:26:44,800 --> 01:26:50,939
master plan, there's going to
be some proposed rezoning
involved with that. Can. Can I

833
01:26:50,939 --> 01:26:56,978
pause this just a second, chair?
Yeah. How did this item get on
the agenda? So requested to put

834
01:26:56,978 --> 01:27:05,153
this item on the agenda? It
came from our direction that we
were given. Now, this is is the

835
01:27:05,153 --> 01:27:09,925
county did the county, county
administration. Yes. County. So
West Marino was requested to

836
01:27:09,925 --> 01:27:17,399
this be put on the agenda? I
don't recall exactly what
person said who what, but

837
01:27:17,399 --> 01:27:20,469
because this hasn't been
discussed at the Board of
County Commissioners, for it to

838
01:27:20,469 --> 01:27:25,340
come to us for discussion. So
correct. Everything that goes
to them from this board comes

839
01:27:25,340 --> 01:27:31,880
here first. So this is a
discussion item. Okay. As
you'll recall, when the future

840
01:27:31,880 --> 01:27:39,354
land use items came through,
there were questions from from
this board about not having

841
01:27:39,354 --> 01:27:49,097
enough time to review. So as an
action item, the master plan
will be showing up at a later

842
01:27:49,097 --> 01:27:55,337
date. We're looking at October,
but before doing that, we're
bringing it to this board and

843
01:27:55,337 --> 01:28:02,744
the public as a discussion item
for it to have the whole month
of discussion prior to

844
01:28:02,744 --> 01:28:09,251
requesting an action on the
item. So that's, that's how we
got here. So I, I need some

845
01:28:09,251 --> 01:28:13,355
legal clarification. So
considering this is an item
that's going to come as a

846
01:28:13,355 --> 01:28:22,197
future rezoning, will, will,
will not. Ex-parte
communication there. So there's

847
01:28:22,197 --> 01:28:27,269
multiple items coming in the
upcoming planning board.
There's a rezoning component.

848
01:28:27,269 --> 01:28:31,306
And then there's a master plan
design plan component. The
master plan design plan

849
01:28:31,306 --> 01:28:40,248
component is not quasi judicial.
That means it's not subject to
the same proceeding. Okay. This

850
01:28:40,248 --> 01:28:46,321
is in order for the board to
evaluate in general the design
plan and have some time to

851
01:28:46,321 --> 01:28:52,127
process things before the
actual planning board hearing,
where there will be a vote

852
01:28:52,127 --> 01:28:58,633
taken to recommend it, or to
deny or to approve or deny the
recommended recommendation to

853
01:28:58,633 --> 01:29:06,474
the BCC. So this today is just
discussion item on that before
it comes before for a vote. So

854
01:29:06,474 --> 01:29:12,581
a rezoning is coming based on
what Mr. Homer just said. And
you so what ex parte

855
01:29:12,581 --> 01:29:17,586
communication be considered. So
anybody that we talk to and the
board members that the

856
01:29:17,586 --> 01:29:21,623
applicant citizens any any of
that is going to be ex parte
communications when those

857
01:29:21,623 --> 01:29:26,995
rezoning come to us. Correct.
As far as the rezoning part of
this, that part is subject to

858
01:29:26,995 --> 01:29:37,105
the quasi judicial procedures.
Yes. Okay. Just looking for
clarification. Thank you. So I

859
01:29:37,105 --> 01:29:44,980
guess to Jonathan's point, what
we're discussing today, are we
potentially introducing

860
01:29:44,980 --> 01:29:53,021
evidence into what could be a
potential future rezoning case
and hearing evidence that may

861
01:29:53,021 --> 01:29:58,693
be presented to us before we
should be getting that? Sure. I
can provide clarification to

862
01:29:58,693 --> 01:30:06,568
that as well. So this public
hearing, legislative amendments
like this, they're about

863
01:30:06,568 --> 01:30:11,673
setting and creating policy,
quasi judicial, are about
applying policies. So having

864
01:30:11,673 --> 01:30:17,045
that separation there is
helpful to your understanding
of how these proceedings should

865
01:30:17,045 --> 01:30:21,016
work. So quasi judicial means
you're applying something,
you're doing rezoning, you're

866
01:30:21,016 --> 01:30:30,759
doing a variance, something
like that. This is about policy
setting. This is the text, the

867
01:30:30,759 --> 01:30:39,367
design standards more generally
of this development or this
parcel. Excuse me. So it's

868
01:30:39,367 --> 01:30:45,573
setting policy. That's why it's
not quasi judicial and why it
can be discussed today. And if

869
01:30:45,573 --> 01:30:53,415
I may, and if I may basically,
as stated, basically, we're
just going to be looking at a

870
01:30:53,415 --> 01:31:02,090
plan, the overall concept of
the master plan, drawings,
diagrams, layouts for we've

871
01:31:02,090 --> 01:31:06,261
this is, is this the same
version that we've seen before,
or is this has some revisions

872
01:31:06,261 --> 01:31:10,899
to it? This what this what
they're going to present just
like we did for the, the other

873
01:31:10,899 --> 01:31:15,203
one that we adopted, we looked
at the pictures and graphics
and drawings. Master plan for

874
01:31:15,203 --> 01:31:22,344
discussion. It will. This
drawing concept will come back
at this stage for a public

875
01:31:22,344 --> 01:31:28,883
meeting. But this is the first
step right now that just
writing, writing this really.

876
01:31:28,883 --> 01:31:34,122
There's no. You can have
discussion on it. It's not even
a horse. Is this the same

877
01:31:34,122 --> 01:31:40,562
presentation we received back
in July? It's not, it's not. No,
it's not okay. It's updated. So

878
01:31:40,562 --> 01:31:50,138
it's there's been changes made
to it as far as whatever zoning
class, zoning, classification

879
01:31:50,138 --> 01:31:56,478
changes previous to what we've
seen before, let them present.
And if you can let them go

880
01:31:56,478 --> 01:32:02,951
through it and they they going
to show you. Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
Yes, sir. Pretty slippery slope

881
01:32:02,951 --> 01:32:07,555
we're getting on here, fellas.
It's it's it's not we got legal.
Yeah. Yeah. We're not I mean

882
01:32:07,555 --> 01:32:11,559
horse legal is legal. And
everybody's got opinions just
like I do. So but this is a

883
01:32:11,559 --> 01:32:15,597
slippery slope. We're going
down here. I do kind of agree
with them because we are

884
01:32:15,597 --> 01:32:18,633
entering something that is
technically privy to our
discussion beforehand, which we

885
01:32:18,633 --> 01:32:22,604
do come and state. We didn't,
you know, kind of have
discussions about that parcel.

886
01:32:22,604 --> 01:32:27,475
I get that it's supposed to be
to that underlying zoning. So I
do get kind of with everyone

887
01:32:27,475 --> 01:32:34,582
here. I guess my question would
be, what is our goal for us
today for this? Just to listen

888
01:32:34,582 --> 01:32:39,454
more information. Yeah, that's
a great question. Do you
clarify do we vote on this

889
01:32:39,454 --> 01:32:50,465
action item today? No, there's
no vote. It's a discussion item.
Yes. And the direction from

890
01:32:50,465 --> 01:32:55,437
county administration for
having this set for today was
to kind of workshop this design

891
01:32:55,437 --> 01:33:02,277
plan and give the opportunity
of the public to speak as well
as the team to speak to this

892
01:33:02,277 --> 01:33:06,915
project. So that was the intent
of today from administration is
to gather more public input,

893
01:33:06,915 --> 01:33:13,088
because these are significant
legislative changes to our LDC.
So if you look at the design

894
01:33:13,088 --> 01:33:18,493
code, we're not doing a
rezoning today. There's not
maps related to rezoning,

895
01:33:18,493 --> 01:33:23,898
putting things into different
zoning categories. That's not
what's happening. It's a

896
01:33:23,898 --> 01:33:29,971
discussion on the design plan
and whether those standards and
whatnot and kind of workshop

897
01:33:29,971 --> 01:33:34,943
those things a bit so that when
it comes next time, there'll be
more of a better understanding

898
01:33:34,943 --> 01:33:42,550
of the process and the, the
current status of the, of the
design plan. So this is

899
01:33:42,550 --> 01:33:47,922
basically an awareness effort,
and it's perfectly appropriate
for this board to absorb with

900
01:33:47,922 --> 01:33:54,028
zero response, all discussion
discussion. You're welcome to
discuss it and recommend

901
01:33:54,028 --> 01:34:00,135
changes to the developer. So
it's kind of just a workshop
because this is such a

902
01:34:00,135 --> 01:34:04,506
substantial project for the
county and its impact is
substantial. Putting all those

903
01:34:04,506 --> 01:34:11,679
things in one day, the rezoning
and workshopping, this is a lot.
So it kind of separates those

904
01:34:11,679 --> 01:34:16,751
processes out a bit to the
extent that they're able to be.
It was a long way for the

905
01:34:16,751 --> 01:34:22,457
citizens of district one and
Bula residents to get to where
we are today. With outlying

906
01:34:22,457 --> 01:34:30,465
field eight or outlying fields.
The future name of it, lots of
workshops, Navy, federal paid

907
01:34:30,465 --> 01:34:37,972
for a design company to do
charrettes lots of civic
engagement. So for us to take

908
01:34:37,972 --> 01:34:43,077
information about a future
rezoning for a future owner.
Because right now, the citizens

909
01:34:43,077 --> 01:34:54,689
of Escambia County still own
outlying field. Would you agree?
Yes, yes. So. So, chairman,

910
01:34:54,689 --> 01:35:09,337
it's up to you. I get the sense
that whereas a few of us up
here, maybe most of us up here,

911
01:35:09,337 --> 01:35:17,212
are a little uneasy about this
and don't want to get ourselves,
you know, ahead of this or into

912
01:35:17,212 --> 01:35:22,951
an issue, potential issue that
maybe some of us sea view,
maybe not what the attorneys

913
01:35:22,951 --> 01:35:33,795
see. Are, I don't know. You
know, if this is something we
want to continue with, we

914
01:35:33,795 --> 01:35:41,336
certainly can. If it's an item
that we want to drop, we could
do that too. And I would hate

915
01:35:41,336 --> 01:35:47,775
to have wasted people's time to
come down here for that. But.
Well, being that it's just a

916
01:35:47,775 --> 01:35:54,282
discussion, theoretically, I,
I'm kind of curious about what
the applicant, how similar it

917
01:35:54,282 --> 01:36:00,154
is to the charrette program, to
DP's, because in my opinion,
from everything that they spoke

918
01:36:00,154 --> 01:36:05,827
to before, it seemed to mirror
to some degree the DPP's
process, the charrette process,

919
01:36:05,827 --> 01:36:13,201
and my inclination last time we
were accused of not listening
to the people that were against

920
01:36:13,201 --> 01:36:19,040
it. And I adamantly opposed
that because and I'm strongly
in favor of how I voted last

921
01:36:19,040 --> 01:36:24,112
time, because it mirrored what
the charrette program, exactly
what they asked for, what they

922
01:36:24,112 --> 01:36:30,685
wanted. And so to that point,
and I felt like saying, look,
if the opposition would like it

923
01:36:30,685 --> 01:36:35,690
to remain a green field, then
be honest about it and present
that to the county

924
01:36:35,690 --> 01:36:40,762
commissioners and figure out a
way to pay for it to be
maintained. I mean, we're never

925
01:36:40,762 --> 01:36:47,435
going to create the perfect
animal for the people,
apparently, because like I said,

926
01:36:47,435 --> 01:36:52,607
it seemed like it was DP's
exact charrette. What came out
of the whole charrette program.

927
01:36:52,607 --> 01:36:57,645
I feel like this is probably
more of a covering someone's
backside to have this put out

928
01:36:57,645 --> 01:37:04,886
there for us. But hey, I'd like
to suss that out. Is this like
DPP's charrette process or is

929
01:37:04,886 --> 01:37:18,166
this not? Yeah. That is I mean,
we are it is a workshop right
now, but I. We're going to have

930
01:37:18,166 --> 01:37:25,039
to wait till we figure out what
we're doing. Exactly. May I
address that point or not yet.

931
01:37:25,039 --> 01:37:35,583
Not yet. I'm sorry. Okay. So
where do we want to continue on
and and hear the presentation

932
01:37:35,583 --> 01:37:46,728
or. We'll be here. We'll be
here next. Well, that's that's
true. Yeah, it at some point it

933
01:37:46,728 --> 01:37:52,533
will come before you as an
action item. That's why it's
here as a discussion so that

934
01:37:52,533 --> 01:38:00,108
you can have this time to go
through it, discuss it, listen
to the presentation prior to

935
01:38:00,108 --> 01:38:04,879
things being brought to you
requesting action. There's no
action required, just simply a

936
01:38:04,879 --> 01:38:09,951
discussion. Okay. I lean
towards at least giving this a
go since we've got so many

937
01:38:09,951 --> 01:38:14,822
people that have signed up to
speak and came down here and
have spent some time with us

938
01:38:14,822 --> 01:38:22,263
this morning. So if we'll
proceed, unless, you know a
majority of you tell me we

939
01:38:22,263 --> 01:38:34,876
should not. Anyways, we'll go
ahead and move forward. So who
is presenting? No. She's got

940
01:38:34,876 --> 01:38:39,147
the slide. She's got the slides.
Okay. Good deal. Appreciate it.
Thank you all. Good morning,

941
01:38:39,147 --> 01:38:42,984
Mr. Chairman. Members. My name
is Truett Brewer. I'm an
attorney at Phelps Dunbar here

942
01:38:42,984 --> 01:38:47,488
in Pensacola. My firm and I
represent the purchaser under
the contract with the county.

943
01:38:47,488 --> 01:38:53,494
The developer group, Tri-w and
Chad Henderson. As you've been
briefed just now, what we have

944
01:38:53,494 --> 01:38:57,498
today is something that we were
presenting in the nature of
good faith and transparency.

945
01:38:57,498 --> 01:39:02,603
Again, informational purposes,
only to present to this body
what we intend to bring

946
01:39:02,603 --> 01:39:07,675
formally in the next hearing in
October. Just our presentation
on the changes to the master

947
01:39:07,675 --> 01:39:11,913
plan and the design codes. I
have a question for you. You
bringing this as the

948
01:39:11,913 --> 01:39:15,950
representative of the buyer, or
are you bringing this as a
representative of the citizens

949
01:39:15,950 --> 01:39:19,086
of Escambia County, the buyer,
the purchaser under the
contract with the county? Yes,

950
01:39:19,086 --> 01:39:24,892
sir. Gotcha. We've got our
primary consultant, design
consultant, planning consultant,

951
01:39:24,892 --> 01:39:28,629
Melissa Headley, who will be up
here to present the substance
of the presentation. We've got

952
01:39:28,629 --> 01:39:32,467
Mr. Henderson here as well to
provide some comments. In
closing, answer any questions.

953
01:39:32,467 --> 01:39:38,606
If there may be some, my my
comments will be will be brief.
And just to set the stage as to

954
01:39:38,606 --> 01:39:42,176
the question of why we're here
today, presently in this in
this procedure. Next slide

955
01:39:42,176 --> 01:39:48,349
please. And one more. This is a
segment from the original
purchase contract between my

956
01:39:48,349 --> 01:39:53,321
client and the county back in
June of 2025. I draw your
attention to section seven two

957
01:39:53,321 --> 01:39:59,460
A, which recognizes expressly
that the parties agree that the
existing design code must be

958
01:39:59,460 --> 01:40:03,764
modified to accommodate for
certain market economic
engineering conditions

959
01:40:03,764 --> 01:40:07,401
regarding the property. So
again, this was something that
was contemplated. Our presence

960
01:40:07,401 --> 01:40:13,841
here before this body and our
application to change the the
plan and the design code was

961
01:40:13,841 --> 01:40:17,144
contemplated at contract
formation and in the
negotiations with the county

962
01:40:17,144 --> 01:40:19,647
beforehand. This isn't
something that we've gone
through the due diligence

963
01:40:19,647 --> 01:40:24,185
process and realized, hey,
we've got to change some things
and are trying to go back to

964
01:40:24,185 --> 01:40:28,289
the drawing board on that. This
was Contemplated at the time.
We got under contract in 2025,

965
01:40:28,289 --> 01:40:32,860
and so much so, it was made an
express condition precedent or
of our obligation to purchase

966
01:40:32,860 --> 01:40:37,965
the property. We've got to go
through this process, make the
changes to the master plan and

967
01:40:37,965 --> 01:40:41,569
the design code to accommodate
for these market economic and
engineering conditions that

968
01:40:41,569 --> 01:40:45,706
were recognized by all parties
before. We are obligated to
proceed with the purchase of

969
01:40:45,706 --> 01:40:49,544
the property. We're here
because the contract requires
it, and that's and that's the

970
01:40:49,544 --> 01:40:53,247
the purpose of this proceeding
before you in October when we
formally submit that

971
01:40:53,247 --> 01:40:59,020
application. Next slide please.
The contract was amended in
March of this year. As many

972
01:40:59,020 --> 01:41:03,591
recall, the primary purpose of
that amendment was to take out
the E t district, what we've

973
01:41:03,591 --> 01:41:08,029
called the E t district, which
again is the job creation
technology employment hub of

974
01:41:08,029 --> 01:41:12,266
the proposed development and
have that retained by the
county. It's an asset for the

975
01:41:12,266 --> 01:41:17,238
county now and forever into the
future. The amendment also
reiterated and recognized the

976
01:41:17,238 --> 01:41:21,976
need to go through this process,
the need to amend the master
plan and the design codes to

977
01:41:21,976 --> 01:41:26,013
accommodate for certain things
that Melissa and a few others
will come up here and speak to

978
01:41:26,013 --> 01:41:30,051
you in more detail about. But
again, this is not something
that popped up in this

979
01:41:30,051 --> 01:41:34,121
amendment. As you recall the
previous slide, it was in the
contract back in 2025 that we

980
01:41:34,121 --> 01:41:38,259
were to go through this process
as part of our due diligence.
And that's that's why we're

981
01:41:38,259 --> 01:41:43,130
here engaging with with you and
your staff. I will say that in
the past year or more, my

982
01:41:43,130 --> 01:41:47,034
client has expended six sincere
amount of funds, time and
effort and due diligence and

983
01:41:47,034 --> 01:41:50,271
looking into what these exact
market and economic, economic
and engineering conditions are,

984
01:41:50,271 --> 01:41:54,976
how they can be remedied by our
proposed changes to the master
plan and to the design code.

985
01:41:54,976 --> 01:42:00,414
And I think what you'll see is
a very comprehensive and not
out of the spirit of the

986
01:42:00,414 --> 01:42:04,385
original plan, but a. But a
proposed master plan, a
proposed changes to the design

987
01:42:04,385 --> 01:42:08,522
code that are beneficial for us
as the buyer, for us as the
county, and most importantly

988
01:42:08,522 --> 01:42:12,393
for the constituents who will
live, work and play here in
this development. And so with

989
01:42:12,393 --> 01:42:22,503
that next slide, I'll turn it
over to Miss Hadley. Thank you,
and good morning, Planning

990
01:42:22,503 --> 01:42:26,941
Board Chair and members. It's
my pleasure to be here this
morning. Melissa Hadley with

991
01:42:26,941 --> 01:42:32,246
the firm Goodwyn Mills and
Cawood. And we're going to go
through the master plan and

992
01:42:32,246 --> 01:42:36,884
talk about that in particular.
We did mention that there are
other items that will come

993
01:42:36,884 --> 01:42:43,024
later, but we're focusing
strictly on the master plan
this morning. So currently the

994
01:42:43,024 --> 01:42:49,230
property is zoned with multiple
zones. And this is according to
the D, P, z regulating plan

995
01:42:49,230 --> 01:42:56,337
that was adopted into the
county's ordinances in 2021. So
we have Z one through Z five

996
01:42:56,337 --> 01:43:01,008
that is currently under the
zoning. And you can see these
are represented by the

997
01:43:01,008 --> 01:43:07,948
different colors. The when the
PDF converted it some of the
things got misaligned. But you

998
01:43:07,948 --> 01:43:16,857
can see where the different
zones lie. And then with the
master plan, we have

999
01:43:16,857 --> 01:43:21,896
represented those same
districts. We have the light
industrial, the residential,

1000
01:43:21,896 --> 01:43:30,171
the civic, open space, town
center, commerce and
residential. So as we mentioned,

1001
01:43:30,171 --> 01:43:37,378
this plan follows regulating
plan one. And this came up out
of a process that was long.

1002
01:43:37,378 --> 01:43:42,783
There was stakeholder
interviews, there were website
surveys, there were charrettes,

1003
01:43:42,783 --> 01:43:47,922
and there were specific goals
that were set forth. And those
goals were to have a mixed use

1004
01:43:47,922 --> 01:43:59,166
area, to have a town center, to
be pedestrian oriented and to
create jobs. So we been talking

1005
01:43:59,166 --> 01:44:05,172
about, well, why are we here
today? So the reason that we're
here is we are presenting a new

1006
01:44:05,172 --> 01:44:10,478
master plan. And the reason
that we have a new master plan
is that the current plan

1007
01:44:10,478 --> 01:44:15,916
doesn't work. And so we're
going to talk about why those
why it's been problematic.

1008
01:44:15,916 --> 01:44:22,389
Number one, it's overly
complicated. It has multiple
multiple regulating plans that

1009
01:44:22,389 --> 01:44:27,561
change every five years. So
every five years the property
gets automatically rezoned. And

1010
01:44:27,561 --> 01:44:33,601
it starts off one way. And what
we saw, and by the time we get
to the final regulating plan,

1011
01:44:33,601 --> 01:44:40,007
it's more than 50% residential.
There are inconsistencies
between the master plan, the

1012
01:44:40,007 --> 01:44:45,446
design code and the regulating
plan. And we'll talk about just
a couple. The roads and the

1013
01:44:45,446 --> 01:44:52,286
parking don't meet county and
industry standards. A desired
uses are prohibited by the

1014
01:44:52,286 --> 01:44:57,625
design code, and there's a two
story maximum building height
on nearly all of the property,

1015
01:44:57,625 --> 01:45:04,832
with variances prohibited by
the design code. So what we are
proposing is a much simpler

1016
01:45:04,832 --> 01:45:09,937
plan. We're simplifying our
codes and our policies to make
it easier for the county to

1017
01:45:09,937 --> 01:45:16,677
follow and enforce. We're going
to just one regulating plan. So
it's very unusual to have this

1018
01:45:16,677 --> 01:45:23,117
multiple regulating plan with
this role rolling rezoning.
It's a very unusual condition.

1019
01:45:23,117 --> 01:45:28,656
So we're going to have just one
regulating plan, create
cohesiveness across all of the

1020
01:45:28,656 --> 01:45:36,597
documents. And we want to meet
county standards and best
industry practices. So the

1021
01:45:36,597 --> 01:45:42,970
adopted master plan and design
code, some of the things that
are not quite as obvious

1022
01:45:42,970 --> 01:45:47,374
sometimes when you look at
things on paper is how they
might ultimately happen. So

1023
01:45:47,374 --> 01:45:55,216
here are some examples of
desired uses. We have a a
technology center. We have Navy

1024
01:45:55,216 --> 01:46:00,354
federal, and we have an office
complex. And none of these
things are allowed in the

1025
01:46:00,354 --> 01:46:07,161
current OLF8, including the
blue areas that don't have the
X's on them. But the only

1026
01:46:07,161 --> 01:46:12,566
places where something more
than two stories would be
allowed is in the purple down

1027
01:46:12,566 --> 01:46:18,672
at the very bottom. So these
are highly desirable uses. So
even Navy federal, which has a

1028
01:46:18,672 --> 01:46:24,778
has four story buildings would
not be allowed in O L, F eight.
And we all know how wonderful

1029
01:46:24,778 --> 01:46:32,052
and successful the Navy federal
credit has been. These aren't
monstrosities. These are jobs.

1030
01:46:32,052 --> 01:46:36,257
These are things that are
beneficial to the to the
residents and the citizens of

1031
01:46:36,257 --> 01:46:44,265
Escambia County. So. Well then
what is allowed? So again, with
the light industrial that are

1032
01:46:44,265 --> 01:46:50,804
marked with the X's, the things
that we can do are things like
car washes, light industrial.

1033
01:46:50,804 --> 01:46:56,577
Obviously commercial
entertainment, farm equipment
and outdoor sales. But again,

1034
01:46:56,577 --> 01:47:02,917
over, you know, half of the
site or, or close to two thirds,
the things that we want to do

1035
01:47:02,917 --> 01:47:07,421
can't be done. And I think the
things that Escambia County
wants and sort of maybe thought

1036
01:47:07,421 --> 01:47:13,394
that they were going to be able
to get is not in actuality what
can be achieved through the

1037
01:47:13,394 --> 01:47:21,302
current plans. So to talk a
little bit about some of the
inconsistencies and some of the

1038
01:47:21,302 --> 01:47:26,707
places where there's a lack of
agreement between the master
plan and the regulating plan,

1039
01:47:26,707 --> 01:47:32,079
we're all look at just two
specific, but there are many.
So we'll talk about open space.

1040
01:47:32,079 --> 01:47:36,784
So on the left we have the
regulating plan. And you can
see the green squares

1041
01:47:36,784 --> 01:47:42,222
indicating where regulate where
green spaces are supposed to be
located. And then we have also

1042
01:47:42,222 --> 01:47:47,962
a trail location that is around
the perimeter of the site. So
the DPP's design code states

1043
01:47:47,962 --> 01:47:54,368
that open space shown on the
regulating plan has to be
within 100ft of that location.

1044
01:47:54,368 --> 01:48:00,874
So if you then take those red
circles where all of the open
spaces are shown, and then put

1045
01:48:00,874 --> 01:48:06,246
them on the actual master plan,
you can see that they don't
fall. They fall in the middle

1046
01:48:06,246 --> 01:48:12,052
of parking lots. They they
don't follow the regulating
plan. So this is an example of

1047
01:48:12,052 --> 01:48:20,461
the inconsistencies and the
things that are not able to be
properly developed or properly

1048
01:48:20,461 --> 01:48:32,606
enforced. Did we miss one? No,
because we did. The land uses
first. Excuse me. So what we

1049
01:48:32,606 --> 01:48:38,012
are talking about is our plan.
So our planning approach is
that we wanted to have

1050
01:48:38,012 --> 01:48:44,418
something that was feasible. We
wanted to make sure that we we
honored the community

1051
01:48:44,418 --> 01:48:49,790
engagement that had gone before.
We followed the same goals and
objectives that had been set

1052
01:48:49,790 --> 01:48:58,399
forth in the original documents.
And we identified three major
stakeholder groups. So those

1053
01:48:58,399 --> 01:49:03,470
stakeholder groups are the
people of Beulah. This is in
the Beulah community. It's also

1054
01:49:03,470 --> 01:49:07,474
the economic development
community. So the number one
goal that had been stated from

1055
01:49:07,474 --> 01:49:14,648
the very beginning was the
creation of at least a thousand
good paying jobs. So the

1056
01:49:14,648 --> 01:49:19,653
economic development community
is another stakeholder. And
then the citizens at large of

1057
01:49:19,653 --> 01:49:25,025
Escambia County. So the
property is not owned by any
one community group. It's owned

1058
01:49:25,025 --> 01:49:31,865
by the entire citizens of
Escambia County. So we have
these three major stakeholder

1059
01:49:31,865 --> 01:49:38,639
groups. And as Chad has said
before, it's not that one group
wins out over another. All

1060
01:49:38,639 --> 01:49:44,878
three are stakeholders, and all
three have a say. And it
shouldn't be that one group

1061
01:49:44,878 --> 01:49:52,019
wins out and the other two
groups lose. So the stakeholder
goals that were identified, I

1062
01:49:52,019 --> 01:49:58,559
organized them into fiscal
goals and land use goals. And
so the very top goal and from

1063
01:49:58,559 --> 01:50:04,331
the very beginning, this was
envisioned as a job creation
place. So early iterations of

1064
01:50:04,331 --> 01:50:09,269
the site showed it to be a
completely as an industrial
park. And so there's always

1065
01:50:09,269 --> 01:50:16,210
been the goal that there would
be this massive job creation
here, so that with at least a

1066
01:50:16,210 --> 01:50:21,582
thousand high paying jobs on
the site, economic viability of
the plan, that the county would

1067
01:50:21,582 --> 01:50:26,153
have a solid return on its
investment, that it would
benefit the residents across

1068
01:50:26,153 --> 01:50:31,925
Escambia County, and not just
the Beulah community, and the
need for planned transportation

1069
01:50:31,925 --> 01:50:37,364
improvements. We've got the
interchange at I-10 coming in,
the widening of roads and a lot

1070
01:50:37,364 --> 01:50:45,272
of road improvements, and then
land use goals were to create a
more compact residential,

1071
01:50:45,272 --> 01:50:51,879
commercial and high tech mixed
use environment. Provide
walkable uses, include a mixed

1072
01:50:51,879 --> 01:50:58,318
use town center, protect the
quality of life, and. To make
sure that stormwater management

1073
01:50:58,318 --> 01:51:02,990
was handled in a in a
responsible way and that we
could incorporate low impact

1074
01:51:02,990 --> 01:51:11,131
development standards. So what
we did was we when we were
contemplating how the site

1075
01:51:11,131 --> 01:51:17,004
could be developed, we wanted
to honor the original plan and
the and the original

1076
01:51:17,004 --> 01:51:23,110
stakeholder input and the goals
that had been set forth. So we
started with the basic

1077
01:51:23,110 --> 01:51:28,582
framework of the plan. So the
roads and the block network are
left intact, as you can see

1078
01:51:28,582 --> 01:51:34,721
here. So on the left is the
Df's master plan that was
adopted in 2021 with the major

1079
01:51:34,721 --> 01:51:39,726
roads shown. And then on the
right is our master plan that
we're proposing, where we left

1080
01:51:39,726 --> 01:51:46,533
the major road network intact
with the same block network. So
again, we're using the same

1081
01:51:46,533 --> 01:51:52,539
goals where we want to have a
mixed use center. We want to
have a town center, we want to

1082
01:51:52,539 --> 01:51:59,813
have job creation, and we want
to have pedestrian oriented
streets. So this is our master

1083
01:51:59,813 --> 01:52:05,252
plan that we ultimately
designed. So the road network
in the block network, block

1084
01:52:05,252 --> 01:52:12,426
network are all in place. And
we have developed with some
major districts that include

1085
01:52:12,426 --> 01:52:17,931
residential that include
commerce, our employment
technology and innovation

1086
01:52:17,931 --> 01:52:24,304
districts, health and wellness
areas. So we have a lot of
different uses, and we've come

1087
01:52:24,304 --> 01:52:30,043
up with a really great plan
that brings these things
together and then improves on

1088
01:52:30,043 --> 01:52:38,352
the plan that we already that
already exists. So those
districts are in accordance

1089
01:52:38,352 --> 01:52:43,757
with the future land use
application that has gone
before. And these are the

1090
01:52:43,757 --> 01:52:50,897
required mixes of uses and
maximum percentages that can be
dedicated of the land to each

1091
01:52:50,897 --> 01:52:59,873
one. And they do correspond to
what will be our regulating
plan. So our plan is built

1092
01:52:59,873 --> 01:53:05,345
solidly on new urbanism
principles. So the key
principles in New Urbanism

1093
01:53:05,345 --> 01:53:11,418
design are to maintain
walkability for mix of uses on
the development. So commercial

1094
01:53:11,418 --> 01:53:17,557
uses and housing uses and
things are all located within
close proximity of each other.

1095
01:53:17,557 --> 01:53:24,097
That the site provides
connectivity so that it's not
isolated or cut off from its

1096
01:53:24,097 --> 01:53:29,036
context, that the design is
kept to be human scale, and
that there are sustainable

1097
01:53:29,036 --> 01:53:36,677
principles folded into the
design. So here we have a side
by side comparison of the two

1098
01:53:36,677 --> 01:53:42,015
plans. And I think this is
going to be very helpful in
helping to understand how we're

1099
01:53:42,015 --> 01:53:49,656
changing. So there are eight
specific site elements that are
common to both plans. So we'll

1100
01:53:49,656 --> 01:53:55,796
start with number one the
walkable town center. So on the
Dfe's plan, the town center is

1101
01:53:55,796 --> 01:54:02,602
located in the south part of
the site near West Nine Mile
Road. And for us, our number

1102
01:54:02,602 --> 01:54:10,844
one town center is right in the
middle of the site. So we that
is the the town center has been

1103
01:54:10,844 --> 01:54:16,316
relocated. And so there's a
very specific reason for that.
So if you look over at the item

1104
01:54:16,316 --> 01:54:20,987
that's labeled number nine on
our plan, you can see that
we've added a connection to

1105
01:54:20,987 --> 01:54:28,595
Beulah Road. So if you are on
that at that connection point
and traveled east along a new

1106
01:54:28,595 --> 01:54:34,634
boulevard that we're creating,
you'll come into the middle of
the site if you start from the

1107
01:54:34,634 --> 01:54:40,407
area where we connect at West
Nine Mile Road on our main
boulevard and travel north,

1108
01:54:40,407 --> 01:54:46,146
those two boulevards intersect
right in the middle of the site,
and that's the heart of the

1109
01:54:46,146 --> 01:54:50,984
site. And so that's where we
located our town center. So
when we talk about walkability

1110
01:54:50,984 --> 01:54:57,357
and we talk about accessibility,
the current location of the
town center along West Nine

1111
01:54:57,357 --> 01:55:02,662
Mile Road, this site is one
mile square. So that means it's
a mile away from anything on

1112
01:55:02,662 --> 01:55:07,701
the northern part of the site
where we have ours. We're
within a half a mile of any

1113
01:55:07,701 --> 01:55:14,207
point on the site. Our town
center is centrally located and
within easy walking distance of

1114
01:55:14,207 --> 01:55:19,212
the residential neighborhood,
which is our item number two.
As you can see, we've relocated

1115
01:55:19,212 --> 01:55:25,752
to the northwest portion of the
site so that it's compatible
with existing residential uses.

1116
01:55:25,752 --> 01:55:33,260
On the Dpz plan, residential
uses are over in the center to
the north of the town center.

1117
01:55:33,260 --> 01:55:40,467
Our civic uses. They're on both
plans. Number four is
integrated low impact

1118
01:55:40,467 --> 01:55:46,540
development. So that means that
we're locating stormwater
within parking lots within

1119
01:55:46,540 --> 01:55:52,779
roadways so that there's a
cumulative storing and
treatment of water. And then it

1120
01:55:52,779 --> 01:56:00,287
will ultimately discharge into
our ten acre lake that we're
creating. Item number five

1121
01:56:00,287 --> 01:56:05,358
parking in the rear of
buildings. So both plans
incorporate rear loaded parking

1122
01:56:05,358 --> 01:56:11,064
areas, preserving open space.
Number six, with our large
wetlands areas that's being

1123
01:56:11,064 --> 01:56:18,004
preserved. Light industrial
uses number seven in both plans.
And then commercial uses number

1124
01:56:18,004 --> 01:56:25,212
eight. So for us commercial
uses are located primarily in
the southeast quadrant of the

1125
01:56:25,212 --> 01:56:31,551
site on the Dfe's plan. They're
located along West Nine Mile
Road and then also along Frank

1126
01:56:31,551 --> 01:56:38,158
Reeder Road. So the other
things that we've added, number
ten, and we'll talk about this

1127
01:56:38,158 --> 01:56:44,564
in a little bit of detail, but
multiple open spaces throughout.
So in the Dpz plan and in the

1128
01:56:44,564 --> 01:56:52,172
Dpz code, parks are not allowed
in any of the zoning districts
except for the CC, and the CC

1129
01:56:52,172 --> 01:56:57,577
is the large quadrant in the
southwest that contains the
wetlands. Why can't you put a

1130
01:56:57,577 --> 01:57:04,751
park in a residential area?
It's not allowed in the Dpz
design code. So no it's not.

1131
01:57:04,751 --> 01:57:14,261
That's the design code. Excuse
me. Sorry. The park. So we have
parks located in every district

1132
01:57:14,261 --> 01:57:19,533
and in every part of the site.
There are parks in the
residential areas. There are

1133
01:57:19,533 --> 01:57:26,039
parks in the commercial areas.
There are parks in the town
center. We have a large central

1134
01:57:26,039 --> 01:57:32,913
green. So we felt like that was
important. We have preserved
historic elements on site that

1135
01:57:32,913 --> 01:57:39,686
are not part of the plan. So
the historic landing mound
where the helicopters took off

1136
01:57:39,686 --> 01:57:45,091
and landed, that's number 11.
That is called Pinnacle Landing.
And then we have number 12,

1137
01:57:45,091 --> 01:57:51,865
multiple housing options. So we
have single family. We have
multi-family, we have 55 plus.

1138
01:57:51,865 --> 01:58:01,174
We have a range of of housing
options that are affordable for
multiple points of living in

1139
01:58:01,174 --> 01:58:06,513
your, in your lifespan. So I
think that there's a lot of
really important improvements

1140
01:58:06,513 --> 01:58:13,987
that we've made on our plan. So
if we look at the plan in a
little bit more detail, you can

1141
01:58:13,987 --> 01:58:21,394
see that our, our, the light
industrial on the Dpz plan, we
are now with the e t, which is

1142
01:58:21,394 --> 01:58:26,099
employment, technology and
innovation, and that is
primarily in the northeast

1143
01:58:26,099 --> 01:58:32,238
corner or quadrant. And this is
the area that the county
maintains ownership of. So that

1144
01:58:32,238 --> 01:58:39,613
will be able to be flexible,
uses light industrial
commercial uses office space. I

1145
01:58:39,613 --> 01:58:48,021
want to back up one slide to
the previous. There's there's
some movement around in what

1146
01:58:48,021 --> 01:58:53,026
the previous plan in the E t
district four, five and seven.
So you really haven't made any

1147
01:58:53,026 --> 01:59:00,200
made any changes to the e t
district, the lighting. So the
light industrial the light

1148
01:59:00,200 --> 01:59:09,576
industrial on the Dfe's plan is
basically the the let me come
over here. You can you go to

1149
01:59:09,576 --> 01:59:29,562
the one that shows the zoning.
That's. So you can see our our
e t district is that purple in

1150
01:59:29,562 --> 01:59:34,167
the northeast quadrant, which
is not being purchased. Correct.
That's that's that's the

1151
01:59:34,167 --> 01:59:45,679
county's maintained. Right. And
then the light industrial zone,
which is the Z four. On the

1152
01:59:45,679 --> 02:00:08,401
current plan. Just shows the
existing zoning, the existing
asset. That's it right there.

1153
02:00:08,401 --> 02:00:16,042
So all of the areas in gray are
the the Z four that's zoned
light industrial. Okay. And

1154
02:00:16,042 --> 02:00:23,483
then the areas that are blue is
the commerce for commercial.
And that's your current zoning,

1155
02:00:23,483 --> 02:00:32,892
right? Right. So with the, with
our plan, what we've done is,
and it's easy to see here. So

1156
02:00:32,892 --> 02:00:39,032
everything in the blue and in
the red, those are the blue is
the ETI employment technology

1157
02:00:39,032 --> 02:00:45,805
and innovation. And then the
red is the commerce and service.
So it's still basically in that

1158
02:00:45,805 --> 02:00:59,586
same area. So as as we
mentioned earlier, our town
center is very mixed use, lots

1159
02:00:59,586 --> 02:01:05,358
of retail. It includes
residential options as well.
Very pedestrian oriented, a lot

1160
02:01:05,358 --> 02:01:10,530
of different commercial uses
and residential uses. And we
have a main street that runs

1161
02:01:10,530 --> 02:01:17,137
through it with a town square.
And then on the west side, we
are anchored by Pinnacle

1162
02:01:17,137 --> 02:01:22,275
Landing and the large open
space. And on the east side we
are anchored by a six acre

1163
02:01:22,275 --> 02:01:28,548
seasonal park. So the the
seasonal park is envisioned as
a place that will change with

1164
02:01:28,548 --> 02:01:33,653
the seasons. So in the. In the
spring it might be a flower
market. In the fall it's a

1165
02:01:33,653 --> 02:01:39,159
pumpkin patch, and in the
winter it's more of a winter
wonderland. So it's a it's a

1166
02:01:39,159 --> 02:01:44,197
beautiful place for the
community. We have the, the
commercial residential or

1167
02:01:44,197 --> 02:01:49,469
excuse me, CMR district, which
is Commerce and service. It's
mixed use with the. Featuring a

1168
02:01:49,469 --> 02:01:56,376
health and wellness district
where we'll have clinics and
all types of health care

1169
02:01:56,376 --> 02:02:02,549
available. We have multiple
kinds of commercial uses retail,
restaurants, hotels, all sorts

1170
02:02:02,549 --> 02:02:09,689
of commerce and service uses.
We have the same main entrance
and main boulevard running

1171
02:02:09,689 --> 02:02:14,394
through the site. We've
preserved all of the open space,
and then we have a ten acre

1172
02:02:14,394 --> 02:02:19,732
lake that we're proposing
called, we're calling it Angel
Lake that will filter all of

1173
02:02:19,732 --> 02:02:24,771
our stormwater ultimately, and
also be a buffer to the
existing wetlands. We have our

1174
02:02:24,771 --> 02:02:31,711
new connection point at Beulah
Road, which will bring will
take a lot of the traffic off

1175
02:02:31,711 --> 02:02:36,716
of just coming in off of either
Frank Reeder or off of West
Nile Mall Road. So it gives a

1176
02:02:36,716 --> 02:02:43,556
way for traffic traffic to be
more distributed throughout the
site. And we have the

1177
02:02:43,556 --> 02:02:55,401
preservation of the pinnacle
landing and also the three main
clearings as well. So the town

1178
02:02:55,401 --> 02:03:03,710
centers moved right through.
You can get it either way. So
you can get an access for, for

1179
02:03:03,710 --> 02:03:07,814
folks for the rest of the
county, right? Because this is
not just for people, it's for

1180
02:03:07,814 --> 02:03:11,718
everybody, right? It's coming
off of Bula Road, correct.
That's, that's one of the main

1181
02:03:11,718 --> 02:03:15,355
entrance. The main entrance is
still the main boulevard. That
property is not currently owned

1182
02:03:15,355 --> 02:03:20,526
by the by the buyer. Correct.
Well, that's what we're under
contract for. Okay. So you got

1183
02:03:20,526 --> 02:03:24,764
to purchase it. Yes. Or the
buyer is purchasing this
property as well. That's right.

1184
02:03:24,764 --> 02:03:30,770
So we have the main entrance
coming in off of West Nine Mile
Road. And that road runs to the

1185
02:03:30,770 --> 02:03:37,543
north and and curves a little
bit to the west and connects to
Frank Reeder Road. So at the

1186
02:03:37,543 --> 02:03:42,548
intersection of that main north
South Boulevard and the new
east west Boulevard, that will

1187
02:03:42,548 --> 02:03:49,422
connect all the way on over to
Navy Federal's ultimate
property. Right at the

1188
02:03:49,422 --> 02:03:56,829
intersection there is where we
have located our town center.
So we have, like I mentioned,

1189
02:03:56,829 --> 02:04:03,102
we have placed a priority on
green space. So we've created
multiple green space

1190
02:04:03,102 --> 02:04:09,309
opportunities of different
sizes of different types. We
have an 83 acre community open

1191
02:04:09,309 --> 02:04:15,715
space with a ten acre lake
preserving all of the wetlands
intact. We have a six acre

1192
02:04:15,715 --> 02:04:22,889
seasonal park, a two acre town
center, central green, a 1.2
acre park in green space

1193
02:04:22,889 --> 02:04:30,196
located along Frank Reeder Road.
So if we just talk about that
northwest quadrant for a minute,

1194
02:04:30,196 --> 02:04:35,902
having those green spaces and
the residential uses adjacent
to existing neighborhoods is a

1195
02:04:35,902 --> 02:04:40,940
very different feel from the
Dfe's plan, where those
neighborhoods that are on the

1196
02:04:40,940 --> 02:04:45,979
north side of Frank Reeder
would have been looking into
the backs of, of industrial

1197
02:04:45,979 --> 02:04:50,984
buildings and large parking
lots. And so now those
neighborhoods and Frank Reeder

1198
02:04:50,984 --> 02:04:59,993
Road will be looking onto other
residential neighborhoods and a
green 1.2 acre green space. We

1199
02:04:59,993 --> 02:05:05,064
are providing 100 foot buffer
along the westerly boundary
line to buffer between those

1200
02:05:05,064 --> 02:05:11,170
existing residential uses and
our site. We have, as I
mentioned, preserved the

1201
02:05:11,170 --> 02:05:15,775
wetlands in the in the
southwest quadrant, but also
there's a wetland in the

1202
02:05:15,775 --> 02:05:21,614
northeast corner, and then one
right kind of in the middle
along Frank Reeder Road. All of

1203
02:05:21,614 --> 02:05:26,352
our streets are tree lined
streets, and we're using
Landscape Island throughout all

1204
02:05:26,352 --> 02:05:34,160
of our parking areas. So we'll
have more than 100 acres of the
total, 540 acres of the site,

1205
02:05:34,160 --> 02:05:40,400
preserved in some sort of park
or open space. So we have
really placed a priority on

1206
02:05:40,400 --> 02:05:47,874
creating a beautiful green
environment for all of these
different uses to flourish. And

1207
02:05:47,874 --> 02:05:52,879
one other thing I would like to
point out while we're looking
at this plan, is you see the

1208
02:05:52,879 --> 02:05:59,752
connection road that we're that
we're planning in from Beulah
Road. We negotiated with the

1209
02:05:59,752 --> 02:06:04,424
diocese property to do that
connection. It wasn't part of
the plan. So that's a major

1210
02:06:04,424 --> 02:06:09,796
improvement. But their desire
was that road be located at the
northernmost part of their

1211
02:06:09,796 --> 02:06:16,669
property. But we did purchase
enough land to provide a buffer
to that neighborhood to the

1212
02:06:16,669 --> 02:06:21,774
north. But then you'll see that
the road makes a kind of a big
dip and a curve back around.

1213
02:06:21,774 --> 02:06:26,846
And so this is a way for
traffic calming. So instead of
just a straight shot running

1214
02:06:26,846 --> 02:06:31,851
right on in, there's a lot of
different ways and different
techniques that you can use for

1215
02:06:31,851 --> 02:06:37,590
traffic calming. So wide open
streets that are straight are
those that people tend to pick

1216
02:06:37,590 --> 02:06:44,030
up speed. So in our plan, we're
using curves in a lot of places
and multiple intersection

1217
02:06:44,030 --> 02:06:50,503
points, different pavement,
pavement patterns. So brick, we
have brick circles in some

1218
02:06:50,503 --> 02:06:57,677
places, brick crosswalks or
areas just to those are all the
different ways that we're using

1219
02:06:57,677 --> 02:07:03,282
for traffic calming. I have a
question since this is the main
hart to get to, I'm sorry. So

1220
02:07:03,282 --> 02:07:10,289
this is the main access to get
to the town center. What's the
travel lane widths on this road?

1221
02:07:10,289 --> 02:07:16,629
Proposed roadway coming in. So
the travel lane widths are 12ft
which is the county standard.

1222
02:07:16,629 --> 02:07:22,168
So all of our roads ultimately
these roads will become public
and they're going to be

1223
02:07:22,168 --> 02:07:26,873
maintained by the county. So
we're proposing that our roads
meet county standards. So

1224
02:07:26,873 --> 02:07:32,712
that's what the 12 foot wide.
Yes. That's different from the
master plan, correct. That is

1225
02:07:32,712 --> 02:07:36,582
correct. So what was the
previous for Dpw's master plan?
Road widths. Their roads were

1226
02:07:36,582 --> 02:07:41,387
ten feet wide so they do not
meet. I mean would you agree
with narrow narrower roads

1227
02:07:41,387 --> 02:07:46,325
would would essentially affect
traffic calming as well. They
can in some places. It depends

1228
02:07:46,325 --> 02:07:52,131
on the context. So there are so
many ways that you can achieve
traffic calming. But I want to

1229
02:07:52,131 --> 02:07:57,904
point out that the, the way
that that road width is, or the
lane width is measured includes

1230
02:07:57,904 --> 02:08:04,143
18in of, of gutter. So the, the
lane width is actually measured
to the face of the curb. So the

1231
02:08:04,143 --> 02:08:09,081
way that a curb is built, you
have a six inch vertical
element and then you have an 18

1232
02:08:09,081 --> 02:08:14,320
inch gutter. So that's all part
of a two foot wide curb. So the
12ft is measured from the face

1233
02:08:14,320 --> 02:08:20,826
of the curb to the center line.
So it's 10.5ft of asphalt. So
we're talking about a very

1234
02:08:20,826 --> 02:08:31,637
small change in the width.
Thank you. So our road network
we have in addition to the main

1235
02:08:31,637 --> 02:08:36,008
roads, we have a lot of
internal roads. So you can see
that our blocks are broken down

1236
02:08:36,008 --> 02:08:42,448
more and more. And as we just
went through our, our goal was
so that our roads would meet

1237
02:08:42,448 --> 02:08:49,255
county standards. What are
those residential roads also
12ft. Yes. So there's no there

1238
02:08:49,255 --> 02:08:54,393
are some roads that are smaller,
like rear entry roads for like
rear loaded lots and things

1239
02:08:54,393 --> 02:09:03,336
like that, alleys, that type of
road. Thank you. So here's an
example of one of our roadway

1240
02:09:03,336 --> 02:09:08,140
sections. So you can, and I, I
put the county's standards over
here on the right so that you

1241
02:09:08,140 --> 02:09:13,079
can see what the county
standards are. And we're
meeting those. And we're

1242
02:09:13,079 --> 02:09:17,617
creating a very walkable
environment because we have
wide sidewalks. Our sidewalks

1243
02:09:17,617 --> 02:09:24,323
are a little wider. We have
wider medians than what are
actually required. We have on

1244
02:09:24,323 --> 02:09:30,329
street parking in almost every
part of the site, other than in
areas where there it wouldn't

1245
02:09:30,329 --> 02:09:37,970
be serving a use. So this is
just one example. This is the
town center road number one. So

1246
02:09:37,970 --> 02:09:45,845
we have multiple different
types of road typologies. So
here are a couple of other our

1247
02:09:45,845 --> 02:09:51,951
roads. So in different road
conditions, some with some
without medians. We have our

1248
02:09:51,951 --> 02:09:56,622
sidewalks everywhere. We have
street trees everywhere. So
street trees are another

1249
02:09:56,622 --> 02:10:03,095
traffic calming technique, as
well as just having sidewalks
and having more people in the

1250
02:10:03,095 --> 02:10:12,471
area. So excuse me, can we go
back one? So the design
elements that we're including,

1251
02:10:12,471 --> 02:10:19,011
we have right sized our our
lane widths and things like
that. We have connectivity to

1252
02:10:19,011 --> 02:10:25,418
the other adjoining parcels. We
have a few connections on the
east side to the Navy federal

1253
02:10:25,418 --> 02:10:31,290
property. We have street trees
everywhere on street parking
options where they're needed.

1254
02:10:31,290 --> 02:10:38,097
And we are integrating low
impact development standards
just in in a way that works

1255
02:10:38,097 --> 02:10:41,834
where it's, as I mentioned
earlier, it's sort of
accumulative where we collected

1256
02:10:41,834 --> 02:10:51,744
as close as we can, and then
the areas get treated on site.
So we're going to talk a little

1257
02:10:51,744 --> 02:10:55,748
bit about each one of the
districts. So we're going to
start with the town center

1258
02:10:55,748 --> 02:11:01,253
district. So it is, as we said,
right in the heart of the
district or in the heart of the

1259
02:11:01,253 --> 02:11:08,494
site. So I've highlighted a few
of our main elements. So we
have a two acre town green

1260
02:11:08,494 --> 02:11:13,966
where shops and restaurants and
things like that will be able
to face and have an outdoor

1261
02:11:13,966 --> 02:11:18,637
concert. Or you can play
Frisbee, have a picnic or
whatever you want to do. We

1262
02:11:18,637 --> 02:11:24,710
have a beautiful boulevards
that go down our main street.
It's very walkable. We have our

1263
02:11:24,710 --> 02:11:30,149
seasonal park on the east side,
and then we're connecting to a
really important part of our

1264
02:11:30,149 --> 02:11:35,087
open space, where we have
Pinnacle Landing, our community
center, and we'll talk about

1265
02:11:35,087 --> 02:11:42,395
those when we get to the
community district. So here's a
rendering of what we're

1266
02:11:42,395 --> 02:11:48,134
thinking. And this is based on
our plan of how the buildings
would be laid out. So we have

1267
02:11:48,134 --> 02:11:54,974
beautiful pedestrian oriented
environment. So it's, you know,
there's a lot of talk about

1268
02:11:54,974 --> 02:11:58,911
we're taking away the
pedestrian oriented
neighborhood. That's not what

1269
02:11:58,911 --> 02:12:05,785
we're doing at all. It's right
here in the town center where
it's always been. And so this

1270
02:12:05,785 --> 02:12:09,855
is our rendering of what it
might look like looking down
our main street to the west.

1271
02:12:09,855 --> 02:12:14,760
And you can see sort of in the
background where Pinnacle
Landing might be. And we have

1272
02:12:14,760 --> 02:12:21,200
ideas. Maybe we'll enhance that
with a tower or different
things. So our community

1273
02:12:21,200 --> 02:12:26,605
district, so this would be
community oriented uses,
including open space and civic

1274
02:12:26,605 --> 02:12:31,310
uses. So we'll preserve our
natural landscapes and things
that celebrate Escambia

1275
02:12:31,310 --> 02:12:38,117
County's unique woodlands and
wetlands. So this is located
primarily in the southwest

1276
02:12:38,117 --> 02:12:44,190
quadrant. We have our ten acre,
ten acre Angel Lake that we'll
be creating to handle all of

1277
02:12:44,190 --> 02:12:49,261
our storm water, but we're also
going to use it as amenity. So
they'll be walking trails,

1278
02:12:49,261 --> 02:12:55,401
fishing pier, the ability to do
kayak, launch kayaks and things
like that. We're hoping to

1279
02:12:55,401 --> 02:13:00,406
maybe get a post office. We're
proposing a community center
and a post office with an

1280
02:13:00,406 --> 02:13:07,813
outdoor food court in the
northeast portion of that main
open space. We're preserving

1281
02:13:07,813 --> 02:13:17,723
the wetlands and creating just
a beautiful space to anchor the
site. So these are images of

1282
02:13:17,723 --> 02:13:23,496
the existing conditions there.
So there's three clearings that
are located on that site that

1283
02:13:23,496 --> 02:13:29,201
have been there historically.
And we're proposing to keep
those. So you can, as you go

1284
02:13:29,201 --> 02:13:34,306
through the different walking
trails in that main large open
space, you'll go from different

1285
02:13:34,306 --> 02:13:40,012
conditions where you have
wooded areas and the cleared
areas, the wetland areas. There

1286
02:13:40,012 --> 02:13:45,084
may be some interpretive
signage that gets put up with
along those trails so that

1287
02:13:45,084 --> 02:13:51,190
people understand the
ecosystems and all that they're
walking through. And then

1288
02:13:51,190 --> 02:13:59,465
here's a rendering of one of
our the outdoor dining area and
what that might look like. So

1289
02:13:59,465 --> 02:14:05,638
with our residential district,
again, located in the northwest
corner of the site, so very

1290
02:14:05,638 --> 02:14:11,410
accessible to the town center,
accessible to the job center,
and then easily accessed off of

1291
02:14:11,410 --> 02:14:17,483
either Frank Reeder Road or our
new road that will be coming in
to the site. So we have we're

1292
02:14:17,483 --> 02:14:23,255
showing here townhomes, but we
could also have single family
detached if needed, active

1293
02:14:23,255 --> 02:14:28,727
adult multifamily. So the idea
is that there'll be a range of
housing options. So with a

1294
02:14:28,727 --> 02:14:34,433
range of options, there comes a
range of price points that
those housing choices would be

1295
02:14:34,433 --> 02:14:41,273
would be offered at. And here
you can see the context that
we're located adjacent. We've

1296
02:14:41,273 --> 02:14:47,713
moved that so that it's more
compatible with the existing
surrounding neighborhoods to

1297
02:14:47,713 --> 02:14:55,287
the west and to the north. So
here's a rendering of how our
townhomes, we have a lot of

1298
02:14:55,287 --> 02:15:00,893
town greens located within the
townhome district. So they will
break up the roads a little bit

1299
02:15:00,893 --> 02:15:07,933
and give the townhomes a focus
on a central green spaces,
creating little neighborhoods

1300
02:15:07,933 --> 02:15:15,174
within the larger neighborhood
overall. So the Commerce and
Services District is the

1301
02:15:15,174 --> 02:15:22,348
southeast quadrant of the site.
And this will be shops,
businesses, all sorts of retail,

1302
02:15:22,348 --> 02:15:31,624
lots of opportunity also for
jobs. So these the area that's
outlined in red. So we'll have

1303
02:15:31,624 --> 02:15:38,897
lodging various types of
commercial and retail uses
restaurants, hotels. The

1304
02:15:38,897 --> 02:15:43,569
primary boulevard goes right
through the middle of this. So
that primary boulevard that

1305
02:15:43,569 --> 02:15:48,841
connects from West Nine Mile
Road through the north and
makes a little bit of a

1306
02:15:48,841 --> 02:15:55,047
westerly jog back up to Frank
Reeder, will bring people
really to pretty much every

1307
02:15:55,047 --> 02:16:01,620
part of the site. So a
rendering of what our health
and wellness district might

1308
02:16:01,620 --> 02:16:08,093
look like here. And so this is
going to be really special area,
another really prime employment

1309
02:16:08,093 --> 02:16:15,300
center for people in the health
care industry. Pensacola area
is a very well known regional

1310
02:16:15,300 --> 02:16:21,407
hub for health care. It's one
of our largest employment
sectors in the county. So we

1311
02:16:21,407 --> 02:16:28,947
plan to have health and
wellness as a big part of our
commerce district. And then the

1312
02:16:28,947 --> 02:16:33,352
district. So this is the
portion that the county will
maintain ownership of. And this

1313
02:16:33,352 --> 02:16:41,794
is a real a real gem for job
creation, a workforce
development. So you can see

1314
02:16:41,794 --> 02:16:46,165
that sitting there in the
northeast quadrant of the site.
So again, we have some

1315
02:16:46,165 --> 02:16:52,137
preserved wetlands, but here we
want to think flexible. We want
to think of different different

1316
02:16:52,137 --> 02:16:57,276
things that could be put there.
We might have office uses. We
might have office towers, we

1317
02:16:57,276 --> 02:17:05,651
might have light industrial, we
might have things that support
our military force here. And so

1318
02:17:05,651 --> 02:17:12,091
there's a lot of opportunity in
the district for all these job
opportunities. It's a very

1319
02:17:12,091 --> 02:17:16,795
strategic location. It's easily
accessed either off of Frank
Reeder, off of the new

1320
02:17:16,795 --> 02:17:21,100
boulevard, coming in off of
Beulah, and then off of the
main boulevard, coming in off

1321
02:17:21,100 --> 02:17:29,074
of West Nine Mile Road. And it
is also has a lot of proximity
to the existing housing that or

1322
02:17:29,074 --> 02:17:35,614
the new housing that we are
proposing here. So, for example,
if let's say we have Boeing

1323
02:17:35,614 --> 02:17:40,953
that wants to come and locate
in the ETI, so they might they
would have in the area that

1324
02:17:40,953 --> 02:17:47,960
we've got labeled here, office
towers. So when we think about
how with all of our technology

1325
02:17:47,960 --> 02:17:52,397
and the way that things have
advanced simulation labs and
things like that, it's all it's

1326
02:17:52,397 --> 02:17:59,972
all done in computers now. And
so the, the big warehouses
aren't always as used. They're,

1327
02:17:59,972 --> 02:18:05,043
they're much more likely to
look like office towers. And so
we have these office towers

1328
02:18:05,043 --> 02:18:09,681
located here very close to
where there could be lodging,
where there's close to

1329
02:18:09,681 --> 02:18:15,821
restaurants and shopping. So
there's a very thoughtful mix
of being able to put people and

1330
02:18:15,821 --> 02:18:21,894
attract people to come to good
paying jobs that have in a
location that has tons of

1331
02:18:21,894 --> 02:18:30,202
opportunity, tons of enrichment
for their life during the day.
So if you work in a secure

1332
02:18:30,202 --> 02:18:35,808
building, like something, say
that's doing R&D, maybe you
don't have as much freedom or

1333
02:18:35,808 --> 02:18:42,181
as much ability to go on or off
a site. And so here we're very
proximal to restaurants and

1334
02:18:42,181 --> 02:18:49,988
things like that for lunch
breaks or after after work
gatherings. So this is a

1335
02:18:49,988 --> 02:18:55,394
rendering of what the e t might
look like. So here we'll
integrate our low impact

1336
02:18:55,394 --> 02:19:00,132
development stormwater
techniques as to be used as
amenities to enhance our our

1337
02:19:00,132 --> 02:19:06,305
building scapes. They'll be
walkable. They'll be connected
so people can ride bikes or

1338
02:19:06,305 --> 02:19:15,180
walk to work if they live on
site or nearby. And so that's
pretty much the whole plan.

1339
02:19:15,180 --> 02:19:19,518
We've walked all the way
through it. I appreciate your
time and your attention. So if

1340
02:19:19,518 --> 02:19:29,228
you have any specific questions
or would like to ask anything
or go back over anything.

1341
02:19:29,228 --> 02:19:35,934
Anything, anyone. Thank you
very much. And now I'm going to
introduce Chad Henderson to

1342
02:19:35,934 --> 02:19:45,911
come and speak. Thanks, Melissa.
Chairman and members, thank you
so much for for having me. My

1343
02:19:45,911 --> 02:19:51,583
name is Chad Henderson. I am a
principal and tri-w and
developer. Proposed developer

1344
02:19:51,583 --> 02:19:57,022
of of outlying fields. I just
wanted to quickly state, thank
you for letting us walk you

1345
02:19:57,022 --> 02:20:00,826
through this. This is
completely informational. I
mean, we were just trying to be

1346
02:20:00,826 --> 02:20:06,798
as transparent and as
intentional as possible and
being and bringing such a large

1347
02:20:06,798 --> 02:20:13,605
and impactful project to try
and move forward. I mean, I
just want to say that the

1348
02:20:13,605 --> 02:20:20,345
design code in the master plan
is, is reflects the same
discipline that we've applied

1349
02:20:20,345 --> 02:20:25,384
from, from the onset in
approaching this project, we
keep on harping on these three

1350
02:20:25,384 --> 02:20:33,158
major stakeholders. If I could
even be more blunt. I mean, Jim
Cronley, a great man, noticed a

1351
02:20:33,158 --> 02:20:37,396
long time ago that maybe in
Ellis Industrial Field was
filling up and that we need

1352
02:20:37,396 --> 02:20:44,436
more places for commerce. And
30 years ago brought about this
idea for a job creation. And I

1353
02:20:44,436 --> 02:20:50,275
think if that move forward,
this would have been a a large,
you know, very single use

1354
02:20:50,275 --> 02:20:56,448
commerce, light industrial park.
We then had the community of,
of Beulah come together and

1355
02:20:56,448 --> 02:21:03,221
think about looking with, with,
with Andres Duany, about how to
create a beating heart of

1356
02:21:03,221 --> 02:21:11,496
Beulah that wanted to really
focus on, on, on creating
experiences and green space and

1357
02:21:11,496 --> 02:21:15,934
gathering places. And then we
have some folks in Escambia
County that say, you know what,

1358
02:21:15,934 --> 02:21:20,706
let's just sell this property
for the highest that we can
sell it for. I don't really

1359
02:21:20,706 --> 02:21:25,477
didn't really maybe as matter
as much of what goes there. But
if you see these stakeholders,

1360
02:21:25,477 --> 02:21:31,616
they want to create jobs, you
know, they want to have a
meaningful place to gather and

1361
02:21:31,616 --> 02:21:36,455
to create a beating heart of
Beulah. Hey, and we need to, we
need to sell this and have an

1362
02:21:36,455 --> 02:21:42,094
ROI not only immediately, but
ongoing, because this is just
not for this district, but for

1363
02:21:42,094 --> 02:21:47,566
all of Escambia County. So
that's how we're framing these
stakeholders. And we don't want

1364
02:21:47,566 --> 02:21:53,972
to move the plan forward at the
expense of any one of those
stakeholders. We keep saying

1365
02:21:53,972 --> 02:21:58,276
that we're hoping one plus one
equal three, four, and five.
And that's what we believe this

1366
02:21:58,276 --> 02:22:03,315
plan does is that we're working
with every stakeholder. Again,
not at the expense of what

1367
02:22:03,315 --> 02:22:07,486
they're trying to do and not to
give them one third of what
they want. But every move

1368
02:22:07,486 --> 02:22:12,557
within the plan, hopefully, is
accretive to what the other
stakeholder would like to enjoy.

1369
02:22:12,557 --> 02:22:18,430
And that's what this plan, the
spirit of this plan grounded in
the DP's, has come from. There

1370
02:22:18,430 --> 02:22:23,068
has been a ton of
intentionality, and there's
been a ton of effort, and

1371
02:22:23,068 --> 02:22:29,775
there's been a ton of resources
spent on gathering data and
create evidence based decisions

1372
02:22:29,775 --> 02:22:35,680
to get to this point, to move
this plan forward. So again,
appreciate your attention. You

1373
02:22:35,680 --> 02:22:41,420
know, our entire intent was to
be transparent and to create
awareness around our thought

1374
02:22:41,420 --> 02:22:51,196
process and our approach. Thank
you. Thank you, Chad. All right.
I'm sorry. Oh, no. You're good.

1375
02:22:51,196 --> 02:22:59,438
Sorry. Appreciate that
presentation. And at this point,
we do have some public speakers

1376
02:22:59,438 --> 02:23:08,580
that have signed up to speak on
this item. All right. We have
John Moore, if you'll please

1377
02:23:08,580 --> 02:23:14,619
come forward, state your name
and address and we'll get your
time started after John, we've

1378
02:23:14,619 --> 02:23:30,969
got Jacqueline Wild. Sorry.
Before I start, before you
start my time, I just want to

1379
02:23:30,969 --> 02:23:38,443
acknowledge Mr. Horace Socks
today, Mr. Moore, your on point.
That's bold. Okay, I'll kick

1380
02:23:38,443 --> 02:23:43,515
off thousands of hours of
citizen participation and input
over $1 million, built off a

1381
02:23:43,515 --> 02:23:48,487
design code. And the only
defect in that thing is the
phasing. That's a simple fix.

1382
02:23:48,487 --> 02:23:52,124
Once again, warehouse
distribution language has been
inserted into the code. The

1383
02:23:52,124 --> 02:23:57,496
community fought this to a draw
and now it's back. Why? The
proposed definition of a

1384
02:23:57,496 --> 02:24:01,466
permitted use of that reads a
warehouse or distribution
facility used primarily for the

1385
02:24:01,466 --> 02:24:05,770
storage, sale, distribution of
goods, materials and
merchandise. That means

1386
02:24:05,770 --> 02:24:09,374
unnecessary heavy trucks and
associated commercial vehicle
traffic, and real safety

1387
02:24:09,374 --> 02:24:14,079
concerns for every surrounding
community. Six story warehouses
doubled today's height limit,

1388
02:24:14,079 --> 02:24:20,218
with a 60% increase in floor
area ratio across the entire
field relating to housing. The

1389
02:24:20,218 --> 02:24:25,223
developer's plan assumes 1300
units. The entitlement allows
several times that actually as

1390
02:24:25,223 --> 02:24:30,629
many as 32,000 if it were to
actually cap out. There's no
county analysis, sewer, water,

1391
02:24:30,629 --> 02:24:36,334
traffic or schools at the at
the maximums here. There's no
analysis that's close. The

1392
02:24:36,334 --> 02:24:40,672
Purchase and sale agreement
defines this project as mixed
use residential and commercial

1393
02:24:40,672 --> 02:24:45,644
retail. It says nothing about
industrial. Nothing here is
remotely consistent with the

1394
02:24:45,644 --> 02:24:50,916
current design code, which that
same agreement requires. That
is direct conflict. How does

1395
02:24:50,916 --> 02:24:56,154
this board honestly forward any
of this to the BCC with a
positive recommendation, I will

1396
02:24:56,154 --> 02:25:00,792
get around to what was already
asked. I think. Who owns this
field? Didn't the citizens buy

1397
02:25:00,792 --> 02:25:07,999
this with their lost dollars?
Who are the signatories on this
contract? Who placed the item

1398
02:25:07,999 --> 02:25:11,303
on today's agenda? I think we
already addressed that. I'd
like to know, actually, the

1399
02:25:11,303 --> 02:25:15,540
person that did this and why
everybody's here today. The
developers already established

1400
02:25:15,540 --> 02:25:20,979
some of that. We don't know who
represents the people. The
developer was given agency to

1401
02:25:20,979 --> 02:25:24,616
represent the county, but they
come in here and they say they
represent themselves. The

1402
02:25:24,616 --> 02:25:28,920
planning department pays the
developers own proposals. The
record calls them developer

1403
02:25:28,920 --> 02:25:33,992
drafted into the applications
that this board sees. The
contract gives our BCC zero

1404
02:25:33,992 --> 02:25:38,797
incentive to challenge anything
the developer demands. It reads
like a rubber stamp. On May 7th,

1405
02:25:38,797 --> 02:25:43,735
no one at the BCC could say who
actually represents the county.
Florida West demurred.

1406
02:25:43,735 --> 02:25:47,606
Administrator Moreno said he
and council had been project
managing. Then the board

1407
02:25:47,606 --> 02:25:51,977
ratified Marino's three week
old notarized signatures,
giving the developer agency to

1408
02:25:51,977 --> 02:25:56,281
represent me. I didn't get to
vote on that, and no other
citizen got to vote on that. In

1409
02:25:56,281 --> 02:26:01,786
my opinion, ratifying backdated
signatures does not cure an
ultra serious process. So it

1410
02:26:01,786 --> 02:26:06,658
comes down to this who's going
to represent me and the
citizens of Escambia County, if

1411
02:26:06,658 --> 02:26:12,497
not the BCC, not the developer
and not the state who I know
it's only listed as a

1412
02:26:12,497 --> 02:26:18,003
discussion item today. I'm
asking, please pause this long
enough for the citizens and

1413
02:26:18,003 --> 02:26:22,874
their elected officials to
actually discuss these changes,
and for review by independent,

1414
02:26:22,874 --> 02:26:27,979
qualified counsel, since we're
just here for discussion. Right.
And I've got a little bit of

1415
02:26:27,979 --> 02:26:34,052
time, I read that kind of fast.
The developer was given agency
on May 7th to represent the

1416
02:26:34,052 --> 02:26:38,757
county. They come in here and
say they represent themselves
and it's not a knock. I'm just

1417
02:26:38,757 --> 02:26:45,664
confused. The business the
business impact statement from
the last meeting, that was part

1418
02:26:45,664 --> 02:26:52,804
of the documentation here in
the package, all the blocks on
that was marked n a. So I don't

1419
02:26:52,804 --> 02:26:58,476
understand if it's a private
entity or can those be n a or a
public entity making the

1420
02:26:58,476 --> 02:27:05,016
application. Why was that left
in a. Thank you so much. Our
next speaker is Jacqueline Wild.

1421
02:27:05,016 --> 02:27:12,223
After Jacqueline, I've got
Melissa Hadley slash Godwin
Mills, so I'm not sure if

1422
02:27:12,223 --> 02:27:26,237
that's a. So sorry. After
Jacqueline it'll be Keith Pope.
Jacqueline still here. Not not

1423
02:27:26,237 --> 02:27:32,310
you. You're later on. Well
we'll come back and Keith, if
you want to go ahead and come

1424
02:27:32,310 --> 02:27:47,859
forward after Keith has Pepper.
Keith. Bow. Oh yes. Now it's
your turn, Keith. Wake up here.

1425
02:27:47,859 --> 02:27:59,003
Don't start the clock yet. Okay?
All right. Your weak spot in
this. Let let me get up here.

1426
02:27:59,003 --> 02:28:06,177
Need my name and all that? Yes,
sir. Keith Bow, 1213 Paulding
Avenue, Pensacola, Warrington

1427
02:28:06,177 --> 02:28:17,088
Beach Haven. And I didn't walk
here, so it's not walkability.
Anyway, the weak spot in this

1428
02:28:17,088 --> 02:28:24,896
rezoning and the master plan
and all this is to comply with
the compatibility and zoning

1429
02:28:24,896 --> 02:28:35,073
generality. So on that point.
Let's take what the Olef eight.
You know, the ten years of

1430
02:28:35,073 --> 02:28:40,445
putting together the the
walkability and stuff, it had
the town center that had retail

1431
02:28:40,445 --> 02:28:46,918
business with residential up on
top of it close to the the
parkways and such as that. That

1432
02:28:46,918 --> 02:28:54,893
was the concept. It, it got
here through this process. Now
what you're wanting to do is or

1433
02:28:54,893 --> 02:29:01,633
eventually rezone the whole
thing. Well, you're, you're,
you're rezoning it, but you

1434
02:29:01,633 --> 02:29:07,105
don't know what specifically
you're rezoning it for. So what
I'm saying is you don't know

1435
02:29:07,105 --> 02:29:11,810
what's compatible if you don't
know what's there. And so to
change the whole strip the

1436
02:29:11,810 --> 02:29:16,781
sheets off the bed, you don't
know what you're going to make
the bed with when you get done.

1437
02:29:16,781 --> 02:29:23,922
That's the whole point. So
whether or not you can get past
that competitive compatibility

1438
02:29:23,922 --> 02:29:33,965
issue is going to be paramount
to your decision here. Nobody.
Chad can design and you know

1439
02:29:33,965 --> 02:29:39,170
nobody wants to take that away
from him. All we want is the
time to instead of rushing into

1440
02:29:39,170 --> 02:29:45,477
this because we've rushed into
this through two contracts one
year, get it done and we don't

1441
02:29:45,477 --> 02:29:51,282
know what we're going to get
done. We don't know the
compatibility. So I think Chad

1442
02:29:51,282 --> 02:29:57,455
can do it. I know he can do it,
and he's got the support of
everybody to do it. But at this

1443
02:29:57,455 --> 02:30:02,894
point, all we're trying to say
is, let's give it a little bit
more time. If you need an

1444
02:30:02,894 --> 02:30:07,465
extension, we can waive, you
know, the Dyess can waive
whatever the fees are, the

1445
02:30:07,465 --> 02:30:13,638
costs. Is there a reason why
this has to be done right now,
right away on this timeline, or

1446
02:30:13,638 --> 02:30:20,478
can we assess whether or not
the walkability means the
integration of the retail

1447
02:30:20,478 --> 02:30:26,985
spaces with the living spaces,
with the recreational spaces?
The plan looks good, but it

1448
02:30:26,985 --> 02:30:33,858
doesn't have the congruency
that we were expecting with the
Ola fate. So I want this to go

1449
02:30:33,858 --> 02:30:38,930
on, but I want it to go on,
right? And I don't want to see
it fall apart because of the

1450
02:30:38,930 --> 02:30:43,902
way we got here. Thank you.
Thank you so much. Pepper. You
are up after Pepper is Larry

1451
02:30:43,902 --> 02:30:49,741
Downs junior. Before she starts,
can I ask a quick question of
whoever can answer this. So I'm

1452
02:30:49,741 --> 02:30:55,380
on the same page. What exactly
is getting dedicated back to
the county? Besides, I'm not

1453
02:30:55,380 --> 02:31:01,185
talking the e t district, but
what infrastructure? I know we
just talked about the roads

1454
02:31:01,185 --> 02:31:06,958
coming back to the county. What
else is coming back to the
county. So I'm on the same page

1455
02:31:06,958 --> 02:31:15,133
here because I'm staring at
this picture and I'm kind of
having some head scratching.

1456
02:31:15,133 --> 02:31:22,073
Can someone from what is it,
GMC or whatever come up or, or
someone who's part of the plan?

1457
02:31:22,073 --> 02:31:26,411
Yes, sir. True. Brewer again
with Phelps Dunbar legal
counsel. It's going to be part

1458
02:31:26,411 --> 02:31:29,681
of the development of the
property to fully determine
what that infrastructure will

1459
02:31:29,681 --> 02:31:33,952
be. Preliminarily, right now,
we're thinking roadways and
drainage infrastructure,

1460
02:31:33,952 --> 02:31:40,058
stormwater drainage. So what
about the parks? And what about
any of the other infrastructure

1461
02:31:40,058 --> 02:31:47,966
that would be associated with
like, I don't want to say
livability, like who's

1462
02:31:47,966 --> 02:31:53,404
maintaining all this after the
fact? Is any of this coming
back to Escambia County or like

1463
02:31:53,404 --> 02:31:56,708
this seasonal park that was
brought up several times of
this landing area? Who's

1464
02:31:56,708 --> 02:32:01,546
maintaining this all after for
the parks? I would assume it's
the fee owner, the dirt owner

1465
02:32:01,546 --> 02:32:07,085
of those parks. So it's not
getting back to Escambia County
if it's in the E t district, I

1466
02:32:07,085 --> 02:32:12,357
believe so, but not everything
that's non e t. Yeah. I would
presume it's the owner of the

1467
02:32:12,357 --> 02:32:16,461
property. But yeah. Is it
addressed in this any of this
right now or any of that.

1468
02:32:16,461 --> 02:32:20,565
Because I didn't see anything.
I'm kind of curious actually.
Who's I don't think we're there

1469
02:32:20,565 --> 02:32:26,104
yet. Yeah. I know we're
building it to it. But who's
taking after the fact. Who's

1470
02:32:26,104 --> 02:32:30,675
controlling this I guess is
kind of like we're talking
about these roads coming back

1471
02:32:30,675 --> 02:32:34,846
to us as a fact. But then what
about everything that attaches
to the roads, this Angel Lake

1472
02:32:34,846 --> 02:32:39,150
who's maintaining this? And I
think that kind of helps me
understand, I think the public

1473
02:32:39,150 --> 02:32:44,455
as well coming up, as long as
if it comes back to them,
ultimately, I think they should

1474
02:32:44,455 --> 02:32:49,427
have a say in what gets done
here. Sure, I understand and
I'll confirm that on the green

1475
02:32:49,427 --> 02:32:53,765
spaces, but I would presume,
just as the boundaries of the
districts lie, the E t district,

1476
02:32:53,765 --> 02:32:56,668
which the county will retain,
of course, will retain
ownership and the

1477
02:32:56,668 --> 02:33:00,805
responsibility, I understand
that it's going to be retained
by it, and that makes sense.

1478
02:33:00,805 --> 02:33:05,309
It's public then, but
everywhere else, if we're
getting the roads back to us,

1479
02:33:05,309 --> 02:33:11,849
or for instance, are we getting
the parks back to us or any
other infrastructure or

1480
02:33:11,849 --> 02:33:16,954
anything that would be coming
back on that's coming back to
what's coming back to Escambia

1481
02:33:16,954 --> 02:33:21,359
County, that the taxpayer would
ultimately be born after the
development. Understood. And

1482
02:33:21,359 --> 02:33:27,932
then we'll work to get a full
answer to that question. Much
appreciated. I was just going

1483
02:33:27,932 --> 02:33:32,303
to say that those things also
will come up when the site
plans are done on a site plan

1484
02:33:32,303 --> 02:33:38,042
by site plan basis. So there
will be a master development
association that will be

1485
02:33:38,042 --> 02:33:43,681
ultimately responsible for the
development of the site. And
there may be a mix where some

1486
02:33:43,681 --> 02:33:48,486
things are public, some things
are private. For example, in
the residential area, it's

1487
02:33:48,486 --> 02:33:53,191
typical for the homeowner's
association to be responsible
for their common areas and

1488
02:33:53,191 --> 02:33:59,530
their parks and things like
that. Oh, and I and I get that
too with this, I guess before

1489
02:33:59,530 --> 02:34:03,568
we get to the sale and
everything, I guess it should
have been one of the things

1490
02:34:03,568 --> 02:34:08,406
that the county should have had
the discussion of what we are
ultimately boring at the end of

1491
02:34:08,406 --> 02:34:12,610
the day. And that's where if
we're coming to this design, if
all of a sudden we sell this

1492
02:34:12,610 --> 02:34:17,381
property for X amount of
dollars, but all of a sudden it
becomes an X amount of

1493
02:34:17,381 --> 02:34:20,585
liability every year in
perpetuity. I think that is
something where we come up and

1494
02:34:20,585 --> 02:34:24,522
say, hey, this design needs to
be reflective where it's
ultimately not what we're

1495
02:34:24,522 --> 02:34:28,426
taking, you know, the dollars
now, and we're spending X
amount over the lifetime of

1496
02:34:28,426 --> 02:34:31,596
this project. You know, we're
maintaining that's my $0.10.
Now, if there's an HOA or

1497
02:34:31,596 --> 02:34:35,233
anything that's established
beforehand or some other taxing
authority over this specific

1498
02:34:35,233 --> 02:34:41,606
area or something like that, I
have no idea. And those are
there's probably a hundred

1499
02:34:41,606 --> 02:34:45,176
different answers nationally
where we could come up with
this. But having these right

1500
02:34:45,176 --> 02:34:49,180
here in this master plan in
front of me, those are
questions I'd like before even

1501
02:34:49,180 --> 02:34:56,187
giving any type of real, you
know, criticisms. Or we can get
more detail back to that. But

1502
02:34:56,187 --> 02:35:01,592
obviously the things like the
major public infrastructure,
roads or water tower, whatever,

1503
02:35:01,592 --> 02:35:06,764
those are public. Yeah. But
that needs to be spelled out
beforehand. If especially if

1504
02:35:06,764 --> 02:35:11,669
all of a sudden, like I said,
we sell this property and we
have stuff coming back to us

1505
02:35:11,669 --> 02:35:15,907
and it's not said in this
document beforehand. And that's
where I kind of, you know, I

1506
02:35:15,907 --> 02:35:20,745
run into that issue is, is like,
what are we assuming after the
fact that's going to be chucked

1507
02:35:20,745 --> 02:35:25,783
at us? All of a sudden, you can
come out in these parks are
ours. And, you know, we do have

1508
02:35:25,783 --> 02:35:30,388
a standard in Escambia County
for funding mechanisms and
everything like that. But

1509
02:35:30,388 --> 02:35:35,059
typically, you know, with
commercial developments, the
open spaces and things are are

1510
02:35:35,059 --> 02:35:40,097
maintained by those entities
that that own those properties
or are leasing them and things

1511
02:35:40,097 --> 02:35:45,169
like that, because it's in
their interest for those to be
maintained to certain standards.

1512
02:35:45,169 --> 02:35:50,208
And I get that for a smaller
project, but we're talking
hundreds of acres here. And

1513
02:35:50,208 --> 02:35:56,347
that's where unless there was a
retainage specifically where
it's sold off in large blocks

1514
02:35:56,347 --> 02:36:00,284
or the town centers all under
one ownership, I see that
perfectly making sense. But if

1515
02:36:00,284 --> 02:36:06,424
you sell off every single block
or, you know, lot, that's where
I raise these questions now,

1516
02:36:06,424 --> 02:36:11,495
because eventually it will end
up being more by the taxpayers
and the Escambia County. So

1517
02:36:11,495 --> 02:36:17,235
having that question of what is
ultimately coming back to us, I
think is a good thing in this

1518
02:36:17,235 --> 02:36:22,240
master plan that should have
been discussed. We'll
definitely look into that and

1519
02:36:22,240 --> 02:36:28,880
have some info for that. Thank
you. Just one real quick point
and follow up for the roads,

1520
02:36:28,880 --> 02:36:32,783
for example. There's a process
for that dedication to occur.
We're not going to throw

1521
02:36:32,783 --> 02:36:36,354
anything at the county without
the county's approval,
obviously, and anything we

1522
02:36:36,354 --> 02:36:40,124
propose the county to accept
ownership of outside of the
district, which is under

1523
02:36:40,124 --> 02:36:44,996
contract already, that would be
subject to full approval and
the requisite process to to

1524
02:36:44,996 --> 02:36:49,800
make that transfer. And once
again, I get that it's pretty
much everything else that's the

1525
02:36:49,800 --> 02:36:57,241
outlier of the unknown. Sure.
Walker. Yes, sir. This is
probably a question for staff

1526
02:36:57,241 --> 02:37:00,311
planning and zoning or
engineering. I don't know if we
have anybody from engineering

1527
02:37:00,311 --> 02:37:04,015
in here that can answer this,
but any commercial development,
it's my understanding. Correct

1528
02:37:04,015 --> 02:37:08,052
me if I'm wrong, that that
stormwater retention needs to
go back to what would end up

1529
02:37:08,052 --> 02:37:12,590
going to the county regardless.
I mean, there's there's the
private pond issue here in

1530
02:37:12,590 --> 02:37:19,463
Escambia County. Can anyone
from staff address that? So the
way it works, each site has to

1531
02:37:19,463 --> 02:37:25,937
accommodate its own impervious
cover, right along with
whatever water was running off

1532
02:37:25,937 --> 02:37:34,211
previous to that. Fortunately,
this is a greenfield, so yeah,
well, it still runs off. So

1533
02:37:34,211 --> 02:37:39,283
you've got a site that's
happening. You're going to have
to accommodate for yours on

1534
02:37:39,283 --> 02:37:52,663
your site. Now, if. We have an
overall plan, it's going to be
designed to accommodate your

1535
02:37:52,663 --> 02:37:58,402
overflow from that because
you're going to have. Right. In
a lot of cases, it goes

1536
02:37:58,402 --> 02:38:07,511
straight to DOT right of way.
We don't have any site plans
approved on this site. Nothing

1537
02:38:07,511 --> 02:38:16,120
was approved under the DP's
plan. No site plans at all. So
we can we can address

1538
02:38:16,120 --> 02:38:22,626
generalities, but those
specifics, until we get a site
plan, we don't know here.

1539
02:38:22,626 --> 02:38:27,932
Here's some guidelines on how
to design it. We don't have
that exact design until

1540
02:38:27,932 --> 02:38:35,072
somebody buys right and and
submits a plan. But in general,
it's at some point when the

1541
02:38:35,072 --> 02:38:40,845
water comes off the site,
there's it's going to involve
some sort of conveyance from

1542
02:38:40,845 --> 02:38:48,119
the public, public ownership of
some form of. So somewhere on
OLF outlying fields. Still.

1543
02:38:48,119 --> 02:38:53,124
Sorry, it's been a long time of
calling it all f eight. The
public infrastructure that's

1544
02:38:53,124 --> 02:38:59,263
going to be put in the roadways
right of ways. That's going to
shed water to a common pond

1545
02:38:59,263 --> 02:39:06,070
somewhere. Correct. At some
point, when we get all those
designs that the county will

1546
02:39:06,070 --> 02:39:11,809
maintain, yes, there there will
be county ownership of
infrastructure. That way we can

1547
02:39:11,809 --> 02:39:18,282
keep an eye on it and make sure
it's maintained what those what
exactly that's going to be and

1548
02:39:18,282 --> 02:39:24,789
how it's going to work out. We
don't have that. Okay. Thank
you. And kind of to follow that

1549
02:39:24,789 --> 02:39:29,860
up, I mean, I think that's kind
of important, having that
understanding when we're making

1550
02:39:29,860 --> 02:39:36,367
a full design plan. And this is
why, like I go to the Perdido
Key master plan, or if DP Z had

1551
02:39:36,367 --> 02:39:41,338
a representative here, I mean,
they know I'm critical of them
always. But you know, when you

1552
02:39:41,338 --> 02:39:45,976
have private properties already
over, you know, an overlay, you
don't have this issue as much

1553
02:39:45,976 --> 02:39:50,681
as what's being tossed around
after the fact. So I don't know.
To me, there's a lot of

1554
02:39:50,681 --> 02:39:57,688
unknowns after the fact. The
only difference is the lost key
plan will is irrelevant because

1555
02:39:57,688 --> 02:40:03,327
there's no hand in hand action
with the developer where it's
going to happen. So you can

1556
02:40:03,327 --> 02:40:07,665
make a pretty picture, but it
won't happen without the
economic handholding of

1557
02:40:07,665 --> 02:40:13,370
somebody who's got a stake in
it like they do. This is why,
to me, debate whether you want

1558
02:40:13,370 --> 02:40:21,412
it or you don't and work with
the people during this next
time frame to make it closest

1559
02:40:21,412 --> 02:40:27,184
to what you want or say, forget
it, just be honest and say, I.
We want a 500 acre green space

1560
02:40:27,184 --> 02:40:33,591
and we want to figure out how
to maintain it. I just think
this is the closest even shot

1561
02:40:33,591 --> 02:40:37,094
of making something happen.
When you've got the person
who's putting the most at stake,

1562
02:40:37,094 --> 02:40:43,767
the developer I that I can see
so far. Yeah, of course, the
county wants the waterways back

1563
02:40:43,767 --> 02:40:50,541
because I don't want like for
my subdivision, I don't want my
HOA trying to maintain our, our

1564
02:40:50,541 --> 02:40:55,146
ponds because we don't know
what we're doing. And if we're
going to vacate the roads back

1565
02:40:55,146 --> 02:40:59,850
or keep the roads with county,
I want them under county
control. I think there's enough

1566
02:40:59,850 --> 02:41:03,754
return on this. We could go
round and round, but certainly
there's enough return here

1567
02:41:03,754 --> 02:41:11,328
shown for the tax implications
that far make up a lot more.
And like you said hoa's

1568
02:41:11,328 --> 02:41:14,665
leaseholders, they're the ones
that are going to have to have
it written into their

1569
02:41:14,665 --> 02:41:18,569
stipulations as ownership takes
transaction or as it transfers
ownership, they're going to be

1570
02:41:18,569 --> 02:41:24,708
the ones to maintain it. But
anyway, I think we're kind of
getting caught in the horse.

1571
02:41:24,708 --> 02:41:31,115
And don't forget, when you're
talking about anything being a
plan like this, if somebody

1572
02:41:31,115 --> 02:41:35,119
purchased some property and
they're saying, well, I'm going
to build all of this and turn

1573
02:41:35,119 --> 02:41:42,259
it over to the county, County
has to accept it. Okay, that,
that that's the end of the day.

1574
02:41:42,259 --> 02:41:47,264
People forget that part. You
can't just turn your problem
over. The county has to accept

1575
02:41:47,264 --> 02:41:54,138
it. So there will be discussion
on that. Yeah. Thank you. Thank
you for that. And there will be,

1576
02:41:54,138 --> 02:41:59,243
of course, those technicalities,
the details they're going to
have to come into play as it if

1577
02:41:59,243 --> 02:42:04,081
it is approved going forward.
So right now we're just looking
at the general concept of of

1578
02:42:04,081 --> 02:42:13,624
the plan like we do for any
proposals. And and they work
those issues out going forward.

1579
02:42:13,624 --> 02:42:21,198
Okay. All right. Let's get back
to public speakers here. Pepper
Weimer, you're up next. After

1580
02:42:21,198 --> 02:42:29,473
Peppers Larry Downs. So we
started the this meeting
specifically about ol F eight

1581
02:42:29,473 --> 02:42:37,748
with some confusion. And then
there was a long presentation
from the developers. And then

1582
02:42:37,748 --> 02:42:42,753
Mr. Van Horn brought up a
really good question. And I
really appreciate that, because

1583
02:42:42,753 --> 02:42:48,592
when the beginning of this
meeting started, we were people
were confused about like what

1584
02:42:48,592 --> 02:42:56,100
the discussion was. So what I
saw was no discussion, a
presentation from the

1585
02:42:56,100 --> 02:43:00,471
developers. And then the public
gets to speak. And we all know
that when the public speaks at

1586
02:43:00,471 --> 02:43:08,479
these meetings, nobody's really
listening. So thank you, Mr.
Van Horn. And I don't remember

1587
02:43:08,479 --> 02:43:13,384
who brought up the water
retention, but both of those
are great issues. And I think

1588
02:43:13,384 --> 02:43:18,222
that we're talking about
discussing. And then there was
no discussion. It was literally

1589
02:43:18,222 --> 02:43:24,928
just a presentation. And then
we're going to come up and
speak and not be listened to is

1590
02:43:24,928 --> 02:43:31,402
how it appears to me. So I'm
just learning this process. But
I just found that to be very

1591
02:43:31,402 --> 02:43:40,210
interesting. And then Back to
Mr. Van Horn's point. So it
just appears that the plan was

1592
02:43:40,210 --> 02:43:48,919
not planned very well. When we
can't even figure out what's
going to be state roads or or

1593
02:43:48,919 --> 02:43:56,360
whatever county, whatever. So I
don't know what's going on. And
then I wanted to talk about

1594
02:43:56,360 --> 02:44:05,502
what Mr. Moore said. Again,
it's it just appears to be like
a rubber stamp because a long

1595
02:44:05,502 --> 02:44:10,507
presentation from the
developers, you hear from the
public, but there's no

1596
02:44:10,507 --> 02:44:16,313
discussion until in the middle
of the public speaking. But I
do really, truly appreciate

1597
02:44:16,313 --> 02:44:21,752
bringing these issues up
because this is what it appears
to the public. Like. I'm, I'm

1598
02:44:21,752 --> 02:44:26,357
just one of the people that
actually shows up and talks
like we're all really

1599
02:44:26,357 --> 02:44:32,096
suspicious of everything these
days. So, you know, I wanted to
shout out the, the developers,

1600
02:44:32,096 --> 02:44:37,534
you know, for they said that
they wanted to bring this
forward for transparency, you

1601
02:44:37,534 --> 02:44:44,375
know, and that that's my thing.
I still think that there's a
transparency issue. And I

1602
02:44:44,375 --> 02:44:53,450
appreciate the, the effort. So
I just more transparency, more
discussion, more advocating for

1603
02:44:53,450 --> 02:44:59,857
the public, like Mr. Van Horn
did. Thank you. Pepper. Just
pepper, just to be clear, you

1604
02:44:59,857 --> 02:45:04,895
always come. And I appreciate
you coming to speak. And it's
great you said we rubber stamp

1605
02:45:04,895 --> 02:45:09,900
today, but we're not rubber
stamping anything. We're just
here listening. So in full

1606
02:45:09,900 --> 02:45:14,605
transparency, I'm missing work
right now. We're just here
having discussion. We're not

1607
02:45:14,605 --> 02:45:20,110
stamping anything. So we're
listening to everything you say
and is falling in my ears. And

1608
02:45:20,110 --> 02:45:24,581
I'm I'm listening to it for
next time when we do have to
stamp something. So thank you.

1609
02:45:24,581 --> 02:45:37,261
Well, thank you, Mr. Nelson.
Thank you. Pepper. Hilarious.
Theresa. Get ready. Theresa.

1610
02:45:37,261 --> 02:45:44,201
All right. Larry Downs Junior
Plumbing, LLC. Because fecal
matters. All right. I don't

1611
02:45:44,201 --> 02:45:51,275
know why these people are
suspicious. Have no clue why
they be suspicious of of our

1612
02:45:51,275 --> 02:45:56,680
property. You know, our
property being purchased by the
county in the first place. And

1613
02:45:56,680 --> 02:46:01,785
then and then the, the deals
that come along, you know, the
triumph money and all that. I

1614
02:46:01,785 --> 02:46:06,557
mean, it's, it's, it's a, it's
a little thing, you know, it's
a little thing that's, that's

1615
02:46:06,557 --> 02:46:13,931
done. And I'm sure everything
will work out just fine. But,
you know, I agree with, with

1616
02:46:13,931 --> 02:46:18,902
Horace whenever he, he said
earlier and it's, it's recorded.
He said really no reason to

1617
02:46:18,902 --> 02:46:28,111
have this discussion at this
discussion. I agree with you.
It's all, it's all it's

1618
02:46:28,111 --> 02:46:34,818
recorded. I made sure I went
back and looked at it. I mean,
it may have been just a mistake.

1619
02:46:34,818 --> 02:46:42,893
The problem I have with this,
you know, with this parcel and
what we're doing here is they

1620
02:46:42,893 --> 02:46:50,734
don't own it. They've
contracted to buy a part of it.
But and it's not a, another

1621
02:46:50,734 --> 02:46:56,540
owner or a group of owners.
It's we the people who own it.
So that's, that's totally

1622
02:46:56,540 --> 02:47:02,980
different. Otherwise I'd be up
here advocating for, you know,
to make it happen for them. But

1623
02:47:02,980 --> 02:47:08,719
it's not, it's, it's the people
own it. So there's, you know,
they're, they're representing

1624
02:47:08,719 --> 02:47:14,525
themselves when they come up
here. And then they're the, the
developers are representing

1625
02:47:14,525 --> 02:47:18,962
themselves and kind of seem
like they're representing the
commissioners also because

1626
02:47:18,962 --> 02:47:25,502
they're going to make the final,
final say. But we you know,
that's the thing. Why don't why

1627
02:47:25,502 --> 02:47:34,311
don't. And I know this ain't
for y'all, but this property
should be just be sold and then

1628
02:47:34,311 --> 02:47:38,549
have private owners. Because
when it's the government, you
see how. And they're going to

1629
02:47:38,549 --> 02:47:44,321
be partnerships, private public
partnerships. All throughout. I,
I told them it was going to be

1630
02:47:44,321 --> 02:47:51,962
a debacle years ago, just like
the, the soccer complex, just
like, you know, Willie Junior

1631
02:47:51,962 --> 02:47:58,001
didn't found under under a
crawl space, you know, drinking
antifreeze. I mean, come on,

1632
02:47:58,001 --> 02:48:05,208
we've got a history of this
stuff. Why is the government
involved in real estate deals?

1633
02:48:05,208 --> 02:48:10,681
It's unlimited. We shouldn't be
doing this. And I know y'all
are in a conundrum, but at

1634
02:48:10,681 --> 02:48:14,718
least y'all don't have the
final say the commissioners do.
All y'all got to do is just

1635
02:48:14,718 --> 02:48:21,158
recommend it to them and then
they'll do. You know what?
Whatever it is they do like,

1636
02:48:21,158 --> 02:48:27,965
like every government agency
who has the power to, to create
problems, they'll do it and

1637
02:48:27,965 --> 02:48:34,071
then we'll end up paying for
that debacle, just like with
the Covid shots, just like with

1638
02:48:34,071 --> 02:48:39,376
the it's just a mask. It's just
six foot social distance. It's
just two weeks to flatten the

1639
02:48:39,376 --> 02:48:47,050
curve. It's the same principle.
It's repeats, it's silly cycle
over and over again. And

1640
02:48:47,050 --> 02:48:52,756
anyways, mission obvious.com.
If y'all go there, y'all can
see some real obviousness. All

1641
02:48:52,756 --> 02:49:09,640
right, Teresa, then we have
Jacqueline Rogers. Good morning,
Teresa Blackwell. I live in

1642
02:49:09,640 --> 02:49:16,513
Beulah. I don't know what the
confusion is about. This was a
discussion item with the design

1643
02:49:16,513 --> 02:49:22,586
code attached. When you think
we're going to discuss the
design code, of course, we got

1644
02:49:22,586 --> 02:49:28,725
no guidance from our planners
on what how this is different
than the DPC code? None

1645
02:49:28,725 --> 02:49:36,667
whatsoever. So I'm just amazed
that once again, the process
has been confused and distorted.

1646
02:49:36,667 --> 02:49:41,104
For nearly ten years. The
people of Beulah have worked
toward one clear goal for all

1647
02:49:41,104 --> 02:49:46,777
of fate a place designed for
people with a scale and
intensity that fits our

1648
02:49:46,777 --> 02:49:53,350
community. That promise is
embedded in the DPC Master Plan
Design Code, a document created

1649
02:49:53,350 --> 02:50:00,457
with extensive public input and
built around a careful balance
of walkability, building height

1650
02:50:00,457 --> 02:50:07,330
and development intensity. The
design code is the mechanism
that ensures the development

1651
02:50:07,330 --> 02:50:13,770
becomes what the community was
promised. Any changes must be
listed out and clearly

1652
02:50:13,770 --> 02:50:19,910
justified. Not with. Times have
changed. The most significant
change in Tri-w is proposed.

1653
02:50:19,910 --> 02:50:26,116
Replacement code is basically a
massive up zoning. No, it's not
quasi judicial. They're doing

1654
02:50:26,116 --> 02:50:32,889
it a different way. They
achieve it by making buildings
taller and more massive, with

1655
02:50:32,889 --> 02:50:39,730
higher floor area ratios and
higher height limits. That
alone would undermine undermine

1656
02:50:39,730 --> 02:50:47,237
the development plan DPS has
created for us. DP Z designed a
graduated ladder of intensity,

1657
02:50:47,237 --> 02:50:53,810
using far to step down from the
walkable core to the rest of
the development. That ladder

1658
02:50:53,810 --> 02:50:59,916
creates human scaled streets
and predictable transitions
between districts. It is a

1659
02:50:59,916 --> 02:51:08,391
fundamental part of the DP Z
code. Tri-w replacement code
removes that ladder entirely.

1660
02:51:08,391 --> 02:51:18,201
It up zones nearly the. The
entire 540 acres to 4.0 far,
including areas DP Z capped at

1661
02:51:18,201 --> 02:51:24,541
at 2.5. Combined with increased
building heights, this
dramatically changes the scale

1662
02:51:24,541 --> 02:51:32,716
of the development. A blanket
4.05 is not a minor adjustment.
It is an urban level intensity.

1663
02:51:32,716 --> 02:51:39,489
It allows much larger buildings
and far more total square
footage than DP's ever intended.

1664
02:51:39,489 --> 02:51:45,629
And little old Bula. It pushes
all effort toward a high
intensity, car dependent

1665
02:51:45,629 --> 02:51:51,101
pattern that is completely
different from the plan. The
community supported. A second

1666
02:51:51,101 --> 02:51:56,439
change that would alter the
site is the removal of Dps's
requirement for continuous

1667
02:51:56,439 --> 02:52:01,878
sidewalks and bike lanes, along
with wider road widths that
make streets less safe.

1668
02:52:01,878 --> 02:52:07,117
Walkability is a core part of
the adopted plan, and weakening
those standards undermines the

1669
02:52:07,117 --> 02:52:14,724
entire mixed use framework. I
have visited Tri-w development
in East Montgomery, as well as

1670
02:52:14,724 --> 02:52:20,564
catalysts, nice buildings and
landscape. But they are not
what we want. We want a people

1671
02:52:20,564 --> 02:52:27,404
centered, walkable place that
have the character those places
lack. AI misled me. That was

1672
02:52:27,404 --> 02:52:31,541
four minutes at least, I guess.
But thank you. Thank you Tracy.
We'll see you in a few in

1673
02:52:31,541 --> 02:52:43,053
public. All right. Jacqueline
then Jacob Rockwell. Just a
note. We are the owners and we

1674
02:52:43,053 --> 02:52:48,358
should get as much time as the
developers. That's my opinion.
And the other ones, you give it

1675
02:52:48,358 --> 02:52:53,230
to the owner. But my name is
Jacqueline Rogers. I came here
to talk about the design code,

1676
02:52:53,230 --> 02:52:58,301
but I have whiplash because
your agenda had the design code
attached and design code on the

1677
02:52:58,301 --> 02:53:03,073
agenda. But now we're talking
about the master plan. So I'm
sitting in the back with my

1678
02:53:03,073 --> 02:53:07,110
geriatric eyes. I'm supposed to
read all that because they
didn't want to attach it. And

1679
02:53:07,110 --> 02:53:12,816
when I asked for all this to be
put on a website in OLF website,
the design code, any changes to

1680
02:53:12,816 --> 02:53:17,854
the master plan, I see a we
didn't get it on the website
and I see a complaint by

1681
02:53:17,854 --> 02:53:22,592
Development Services staff
saying, you know, it'll come up
seven days before. That's when

1682
02:53:22,592 --> 02:53:27,264
you'll get it. So this is not a
workshop, not at 830 in the
morning, Mr. Moreno. It's not a

1683
02:53:27,264 --> 02:53:32,202
workshop. And especially when
you change the agenda and don't
attach it, it's a shell game. I

1684
02:53:32,202 --> 02:53:37,941
will speak to the design code
because that's what I prepared
for. The lane widths are 12

1685
02:53:37,941 --> 02:53:44,180
foot okay, she said. That's
what the county does. The the
urban and walkable design.

1686
02:53:44,180 --> 02:53:48,952
You're not going to have 12
foot. Look what we have the
problems with Cervantes already.

1687
02:53:48,952 --> 02:53:53,757
We don't need to go back to
that where they made them so
wide that then we had to put up

1688
02:53:53,757 --> 02:53:59,963
barriers in the middle. If you
look at the design code for the
transfer Florida Department of

1689
02:53:59,963 --> 02:54:04,567
Transportation, I don't know
what they do in Alabama, but
the Florida Transportation said

1690
02:54:04,567 --> 02:54:11,441
in in conventional in suburban
areas, it's not it's ten foot
on state roads, it's 11ft. And

1691
02:54:11,441 --> 02:54:16,713
then on the highways, it's 12ft,
interstates and freeways, it
said. So this that's ridiculous.

1692
02:54:16,713 --> 02:54:21,851
That change. Do we have any
type of analysis from the staff
or a third party analysis? No

1693
02:54:21,851 --> 02:54:26,456
we don't. The block structure
size. If you make the blocks
too big like they're proposing,

1694
02:54:26,456 --> 02:54:31,127
people won't want to walk down
there. They don't want to
commit to walking down a large

1695
02:54:31,127 --> 02:54:35,298
block. They want to be able to
have side roads where they
could go down, stop and sit.

1696
02:54:35,298 --> 02:54:39,336
Same thing for the parking
standards. Now that allows some
of the front loaded parking,

1697
02:54:39,336 --> 02:54:44,407
and that's uninteresting and
it's unsafe. I'm a woman. I
don't want to walk through

1698
02:54:44,407 --> 02:54:49,312
creepy parking lot at night in
front of one. I want to walk
along a store aisle. And then

1699
02:54:49,312 --> 02:54:55,618
if I'm going to drive there and
I don't live in Beulah, I am
another. What do you call it? A

1700
02:54:55,618 --> 02:55:00,090
person who has an interest in
OLFA. I will probably drive
there, but I do want to walk

1701
02:55:00,090 --> 02:55:07,030
when I get there, and not just
in the town center. So I think
that this is a lack of

1702
02:55:07,030 --> 02:55:12,469
transparency. I think you're
trying to they're trying to
socialize the idea, but not get

1703
02:55:12,469 --> 02:55:17,173
the information out to the
people where we could truly,
outside of a three minute time,

1704
02:55:17,173 --> 02:55:23,446
really ask questions of them.
And so I'm going to go back a
little bit. I did tell you this

1705
02:55:23,446 --> 02:55:30,086
was not attached to the agenda.
Oh, the private infrastructure.
You say that the private

1706
02:55:30,086 --> 02:55:34,457
infrastructure, there is no
private infrastructure. But
look at what we've already

1707
02:55:34,457 --> 02:55:40,363
experienced. If if it's not
clearly defined, like you said,
Mr. Van Horn, neighborhoods are

1708
02:55:40,363 --> 02:55:44,134
not just going to take it over.
Neighborhoods will fight it.
They will take the county to

1709
02:55:44,134 --> 02:55:49,205
court and stuff like that. It
needs to be defined. You know,
drew said, well, if the county

1710
02:55:49,205 --> 02:55:54,110
doesn't want to take it over,
we won't. So then what will we
do with it? Because we're not

1711
02:55:54,110 --> 02:55:57,280
allowed to have private
infrastructure. We already have
things about that. So it should

1712
02:55:57,280 --> 02:56:01,785
be clearly spelled out. And
thank you for asking those
questions. Thank you Jacob.

1713
02:56:01,785 --> 02:56:19,836
Well, you're up next. And then
Chris Curb. Hello hello. Howdy,
folks. I'm reckon I reckon I'm

1714
02:56:19,836 --> 02:56:24,774
here to rant about ol F eight
again. I've gone back and
watched a lot that had to do

1715
02:56:24,774 --> 02:56:29,546
with this process, especially
the commissioners bickering for
hours on end, causing the high

1716
02:56:29,546 --> 02:56:36,920
bidder to RUNNOFT. It was
painful to watch. Luckily,
YouTube has a 1.5 time setting

1717
02:56:36,920 --> 02:56:41,724
to get through that slog a
little quicker. All the stops
were pulled out for the low bid,

1718
02:56:41,724 --> 02:56:46,596
though I guess they forgot we
were bidding a land sale and
not a retention wall job. Now

1719
02:56:46,596 --> 02:56:50,767
we're getting about half as
much as work as it's worth
looking at campaign

1720
02:56:50,767 --> 02:56:53,870
contributions for. Various
folks answered all the
questions I needed to know,

1721
02:56:53,870 --> 02:56:59,476
though. To me all this stinks
like a pig sty in July. But
here we are regardless. So

1722
02:56:59,476 --> 02:57:03,680
there's this distribution
center language I saw while I
was looking for back door data

1723
02:57:03,680 --> 02:57:08,451
center implementation. I wonder
who that's for. I have an idea,
but I'll ask anyway. Are these

1724
02:57:08,451 --> 02:57:12,722
like Amazon distribution
warehouses, but not quite.
Amazon warehouses, nuclear

1725
02:57:12,722 --> 02:57:17,627
waste storage? Are we talking
future government warehouses
where they keep the Ark of the

1726
02:57:17,627 --> 02:57:23,166
Covenant and Epstein files? I
don't know, it's very ambiguous.
So then I look at the plan,

1727
02:57:23,166 --> 02:57:27,504
employment avenues. What kind
of jobs are we talking here?
Domino's minimum wage clothing

1728
02:57:27,504 --> 02:57:31,841
retail hostess at a chain
restaurant. Alcohol
establishments. When fentanyl

1729
02:57:31,841 --> 02:57:36,946
federal came in, their entire
campus was decent jobs. There
was no garbage, minimum wage,

1730
02:57:36,946 --> 02:57:40,917
retail jobs or apartment
complexes built there. I've
been around long enough to be

1731
02:57:40,917 --> 02:57:45,622
very wary when lizard people
start saying loaded words like
high paying and local jobs.

1732
02:57:45,622 --> 02:57:49,993
That's why I keep hearing the
words maybe and might when it
comes to these high paying jobs.

1733
02:57:49,993 --> 02:57:55,265
While the dog water jobs are
near guarantees so far outside
a Navy federal high paying jobs

1734
02:57:55,265 --> 02:57:59,903
meant foreigners and
transplants, while as Gambians
are cooking pizzas for them,

1735
02:57:59,903 --> 02:58:04,007
everything so far proposed
outside of a town center is
also available at the corner of

1736
02:58:04,007 --> 02:58:08,111
Pine Forest and Nine Mile. Hell,
you could just rename it the
Publix Town Center and you got

1737
02:58:08,111 --> 02:58:13,216
one. All the benefits to the
community that were told to us
are vague promises with no

1738
02:58:13,216 --> 02:58:16,786
guarantees. The only guarantees
we've gotten so far is
urbanization with low paying

1739
02:58:16,786 --> 02:58:23,259
retail crap jobs, a bunch of
housing, $100 million, private
public, private infrastructure

1740
02:58:23,259 --> 02:58:28,498
cost, infrastructure impacts I
know will be passed on to me.
I'll believe Tri-w pays for

1741
02:58:28,498 --> 02:58:32,635
those infrastructure impacts
when pigs fly and leprechauns
put pots of gold at the end of

1742
02:58:32,635 --> 02:58:37,407
rainbows. Hell, they don't even
know how much that's going to
be. Who's going to pay for the

1743
02:58:37,407 --> 02:58:40,743
new school that gets ultimately
built from all these new
housing and urbanizations the

1744
02:58:40,743 --> 02:58:46,683
new firefighters, deputies,
school teachers, road widenings,
crosswalks, traffic lights,

1745
02:58:46,683 --> 02:58:53,923
utility infrastructure, etc.
etc. etc. and that's all I got
to say. Thank you, thank you.

1746
02:58:53,923 --> 02:59:11,975
All right, Chris curb and then
John Martin. Flooding matters
just asked Noah. I'm Chris Kerr

1747
02:59:11,975 --> 02:59:21,584
with Flood Defenders Panhandle.
I worked here for 25 years.
There's a couple of handouts. I

1748
02:59:21,584 --> 02:59:32,762
emailed that to you by the way,
horse earlier I heard. Design
standards. Whose design

1749
02:59:32,762 --> 02:59:38,968
standards? Well I'm not going
to get into all this other
stuff. I'm going to stay in my

1750
02:59:38,968 --> 02:59:52,181
lane, which is stormwater. FDOT
has a design standard that they
came up with at a 2022, excuse

1751
02:59:52,181 --> 03:00:06,262
me, 2022 legislation. 339.157
Florida statutes. That's where
fDOT archived and abandoned and

1752
03:00:06,262 --> 03:00:13,036
actually put on their
stormwater precipitation,
intensity, duration, frequency

1753
03:00:13,036 --> 03:00:20,610
curves they put on there that
do not use for stormwater
design. Well, the nice thing

1754
03:00:20,610 --> 03:00:28,184
about this site is most of it
drains to Nine Mile Road, which
means you're going to have to

1755
03:00:28,184 --> 03:00:38,728
meet dot design standards.
There is a little ponds right
up here in the top right corner

1756
03:00:38,728 --> 03:00:44,033
there. I don't know if that'll
go over onto the Navy, Federal
Credit Union drainage way or

1757
03:00:44,033 --> 03:00:51,974
your little wetlands at the top
end that maybe that might go up
in that area. But. Your county

1758
03:00:51,974 --> 03:00:57,347
codes, even your state
environmental resource
regulations, environmental

1759
03:00:57,347 --> 03:01:07,790
resource permitting regulations
under chapter 623 30, they used
archive and old rainfall data.

1760
03:01:07,790 --> 03:01:14,697
For the record, I, I hope these
guys hear a lot of your bigger
engineering firms and

1761
03:01:14,697 --> 03:01:21,437
consultants are actually
understand the liability behind
using data that has been

1762
03:01:21,437 --> 03:01:29,145
archived. Scare me. County
Board of County commissioners
don't seem to get that. They

1763
03:01:29,145 --> 03:01:37,019
don't understand their
liability behind approving
stuff that does not meet an

1764
03:01:37,019 --> 03:01:45,261
acceptable science of hydrology,
which is the most accurate
available rainfall data. And

1765
03:01:45,261 --> 03:01:50,233
it's costing us lots of money.
By the way, this drains into 11
Mile Creek Basin, one of your

1766
03:01:50,233 --> 03:01:57,039
worst basins in the county as
far as completely overloaded,
it's completely overloaded.

1767
03:01:57,039 --> 03:02:01,944
Your floodplains are way bigger
than what they used to be. You
got houses flooding in areas

1768
03:02:01,944 --> 03:02:10,153
that did not flood when they
were built. 160 homes flooded
in Bristol Park subdivision in

1769
03:02:10,153 --> 03:02:18,728
April 2014. 100 of them flooded
in hurricane Sally. They're not
even listed on your flood

1770
03:02:18,728 --> 03:02:27,637
insurance rate map as a high
hazard flood zone. What are we
doing, guys? This is the issue

1771
03:02:27,637 --> 03:02:33,176
for your Board of County
commissioners. Please tell them
to get on board with modern

1772
03:02:33,176 --> 03:02:47,590
technology. Thank you. Chris.
Darren. Martin. Boomer. And
then Deborah fall after. Hey

1773
03:02:47,590 --> 03:02:54,030
good morning John. Go. Hi, Jack.
I want to be here as a resident
of Beulah, and I'm a local

1774
03:02:54,030 --> 03:02:59,836
realtor and just I've been
looking forward to. I drive by
this field every day and I

1775
03:02:59,836 --> 03:03:05,708
can't wait to see something
special happen. I know what
it's like to be in Escambia

1776
03:03:05,708 --> 03:03:10,313
County. I grew up here, lived
here my whole life, and it's
easy to live here and then be

1777
03:03:10,313 --> 03:03:17,119
skeptical of something new
happening and happening towards
the end as a positive. So I'm

1778
03:03:17,119 --> 03:03:21,624
excited to see I want to say
thank you guys for your
presentation. It was it was

1779
03:03:21,624 --> 03:03:26,529
very well done. Lots of great
things there. I think the, the,
the biggest concern would be

1780
03:03:26,529 --> 03:03:32,602
when you have something that's
going on this long, any kind of
change can feel sudden, can

1781
03:03:32,602 --> 03:03:38,674
feel. They talk about whiplash.
I think that's why a lot of the
residents are so, so worried. I

1782
03:03:38,674 --> 03:03:43,579
live off of Beulah Road. So the,
the there's, there's a lot of
interest in to make sure that

1783
03:03:43,579 --> 03:03:47,817
this is done right and done
well. So again, taking the time
to, to have this discussion, I

1784
03:03:47,817 --> 03:03:52,688
think was, was great. I'm glad
you guys did that. To me, the,
the biggest concern I have when

1785
03:03:52,688 --> 03:03:56,459
seeing any kind of changes to
these, these things, here's
distribution centers. That's I

1786
03:03:56,459 --> 03:04:01,063
think when we talk about jobs,
we talk about walkability. We
talk about life in this area.

1787
03:04:01,063 --> 03:04:08,538
Distribution center to me is
the exact opposite of all three
things. Distribution does not

1788
03:04:08,538 --> 03:04:14,277
provide jobs, is a is to
maximize profit. The next great
product will not be built there.

1789
03:04:14,277 --> 03:04:18,147
There will not be anything
bought or sold there. They will
do whatever they can to limit

1790
03:04:18,147 --> 03:04:22,151
the amount of jobs there,
because that's what brings down
your labor cost. But you will

1791
03:04:22,151 --> 03:04:26,222
still have big trucks, so you
have big trucks and big
warehouses and no jobs. And

1792
03:04:26,222 --> 03:04:33,095
again, that area right now will
only mean we we talk about
traffic like we live in Atlanta.

1793
03:04:33,095 --> 03:04:38,801
We obviously don't, but traffic
would not get better if we have
big, large trucks in that area.

1794
03:04:38,801 --> 03:04:43,005
So again, distribution centers
is the main concern that I have
seeing this plan because this

1795
03:04:43,005 --> 03:04:47,443
this looks great seeing this.
There's lots of great things
about that. I love the idea of

1796
03:04:47,443 --> 03:04:51,747
narrow streets. I'd like to get
clarification on the questions
you're asking on the 12 foot

1797
03:04:51,747 --> 03:05:01,791
versus ten foot and the they
it's just like 18in of, of the,
the curb. Does that mean it's

1798
03:05:01,791 --> 03:05:07,163
really just a short distance?
It's not actually a ten versus
12. It's actually ten and a

1799
03:05:07,163 --> 03:05:13,302
half versus ten. Or is that
correct? Okay. So it wouldn't
be okay. To talk about

1800
03:05:13,302 --> 03:05:20,343
walkability, but obviously the,
the thing that I will tell you
as a realtor, whether you're

1801
03:05:20,343 --> 03:05:24,547
buying or selling, one of the
things we personally do is we
run our PR report. And one of

1802
03:05:24,547 --> 03:05:29,352
the first things your home gets
scored on is walkability or
access to walkable areas. And

1803
03:05:29,352 --> 03:05:34,156
again, I can't tell you the
difference between my house
versus not. I don't compare it

1804
03:05:34,156 --> 03:05:38,294
to Aragon because of the
neighborhood, but the
walkability aspect is a huge is

1805
03:05:38,294 --> 03:05:44,734
from 1 to 5. I think making
this area walkable continue to
make the entire area sidewalks

1806
03:05:44,734 --> 03:05:49,872
is a huge focus that should
stay there. I think that would
be a big in sidewalk. So thank

1807
03:05:49,872 --> 03:06:03,386
you guys. Thank you thank you
thank you Deborah fall. Then we
have Josh Roberson. Hi, I am

1808
03:06:03,386 --> 03:06:10,226
Deborah Fall. I also live in
Beulah. I'm exactly like what
he said. I love the idea of

1809
03:06:10,226 --> 03:06:15,398
having a town center. I think
it's improving. Like they said,
the heartbeat of Beulah. I am

1810
03:06:15,398 --> 03:06:19,669
concerned about the
distribution centers. We've
already we're doing our own

1811
03:06:19,669 --> 03:06:23,406
research, guys. It is not
rocket science to get out there
and find the profitability of

1812
03:06:23,406 --> 03:06:28,711
the distribution centers are
all up and down I-75. Just go
down to South Florida. You'll

1813
03:06:28,711 --> 03:06:33,315
see them everywhere. And we
have places like in Ellison
Industrial. We have places out

1814
03:06:33,315 --> 03:06:39,021
there in Nine Mile Road that is,
I mean, up highway 29, that's
an industrial park. So we have

1815
03:06:39,021 --> 03:06:43,826
other areas they can put
distribution centers. We want
that to be a town center, like

1816
03:06:43,826 --> 03:06:48,831
what they're describing, where
you can walk the neighborhoods,
walk to commerce, be in the

1817
03:06:48,831 --> 03:06:53,135
greens. I think every bit of
that is perfect for what Beulah
has because we have nothing

1818
03:06:53,135 --> 03:06:57,673
there. However, we don't want
distribution centers. We don't
want the big trucks coming in

1819
03:06:57,673 --> 03:07:03,612
there. Every one of us has come
up here for years saying in the
master plan, we don't want them.

1820
03:07:03,612 --> 03:07:07,817
We don't want them on our
streets. We don't want them on
Nine Mile Road, and we

1821
03:07:07,817 --> 03:07:12,321
definitely don't want them
coming off of Frank road. That
route is too small. We have

1822
03:07:12,321 --> 03:07:16,592
been through this many times at
these meetings. Then you've got
the interstate access coming in

1823
03:07:16,592 --> 03:07:21,030
there now and it's going to be
highly congested. We have
busses coming in there around

1824
03:07:21,030 --> 03:07:26,802
those kids. We do not want
those trucks coming in and out
of Frank Reeder Road, and I

1825
03:07:26,802 --> 03:07:31,807
don't really want them on Nine
mile, but if they had to come,
that would be the only way that

1826
03:07:31,807 --> 03:07:35,878
we would be supportive of
having trucks coming in out of
there. Frank Road is just too

1827
03:07:35,878 --> 03:07:40,116
small, guys. And we have
discussed this until we're blue
in the face, we are supportive

1828
03:07:40,116 --> 03:07:45,287
of these guys. It was a great
presentation, lovely area. We
do not want distribution

1829
03:07:45,287 --> 03:07:50,626
centers at all. So find another
place for those. And then I
think we would all come

1830
03:07:50,626 --> 03:07:54,663
together and agree on these
things. But that is our big
thorn. We don't want those

1831
03:07:54,663 --> 03:08:02,538
trucks coming in. Thank you.
Thank you Josh Roberson. And
then we'll finish with public

1832
03:08:02,538 --> 03:08:26,061
forum. Well hello. Good evening.
I don't like it. All right. Hey
good morning. I'm Joshua

1833
03:08:26,061 --> 03:08:29,999
Robertson. I wasn't going to
say anything today. I'm just
going to listen because it was

1834
03:08:29,999 --> 03:08:34,670
information purposes. Then you
said discussion. And it
reminded me of two shows I

1835
03:08:34,670 --> 03:08:39,008
watched last night on 48 hours.
I watched the opening, I
watched the meet, and then I

1836
03:08:39,008 --> 03:08:46,348
watched the closing. It's kind
of weird. Anyway. Mr. Owens, I
listened to your concerns when

1837
03:08:46,348 --> 03:08:52,221
you brought it up about having
this, and it was pretty
interesting. It'll be kicked

1838
03:08:52,221 --> 03:08:57,326
back to you. Anyway, I listened
to your concerns, and that's
what discussions are about. Not

1839
03:08:57,326 --> 03:09:05,201
about 35 minutes of laying out
this trial with lawyers. I
don't even know what they do,

1840
03:09:05,201 --> 03:09:11,707
what law they practice. No
answers on this side. However,
I do listen. I listen very

1841
03:09:11,707 --> 03:09:16,979
carefully. Let me set the stage.
Lawyer number one. Let me set
the stage and explain why we're

1842
03:09:16,979 --> 03:09:26,822
here. There's your answer.
Followed that lawyer number two.
Let's see why as to why we are

1843
03:09:26,822 --> 03:09:35,197
here. Then it says, as per the
contract in 2025, then that was
also stated. Lawyer number one

1844
03:09:35,197 --> 03:09:41,237
2025 contract. Well, none of
that was adhered to anyway. So
then we go back and let's see,

1845
03:09:41,237 --> 03:09:51,714
original plan mentioned 11
times the entire. I don't know,
whatever presentation, but it

1846
03:09:51,714 --> 03:09:58,187
was also stated as per the
contract in 2025. But it's too
complicated. We got to change

1847
03:09:58,187 --> 03:10:05,327
that contract. I listened to
certain words again, raise the
limits as a blanket. There's no

1848
03:10:05,327 --> 03:10:09,999
definition of what is actually
wanting to be done to raise the
limits of the height. Yeah,

1849
03:10:09,999 --> 03:10:14,169
you're right Nate. Tallest
buildings at Navy federal was
done in phase two. It was

1850
03:10:14,169 --> 03:10:17,640
building seven and eight.
What's the tallest height on
that? Was this a discussion? So

1851
03:10:17,640 --> 03:10:23,078
what's the tallest height? Six
stories. I actually built those
so I can tell you they're eight

1852
03:10:23,078 --> 03:10:27,650
stories. They're eight. Yeah.
Including the roof with a
penthouse. There you go with a

1853
03:10:27,650 --> 03:10:33,422
penthouse. Were they designed
six stories? Phase one I
believe was six stories. Phase

1854
03:10:33,422 --> 03:10:37,726
two was seven plus the
penthouse plus the penthouse.
Yeah. So eight stories,

1855
03:10:37,726 --> 03:10:42,798
including the the deal, right?
Yeah. I'm not sure what the
design criteria was back then,

1856
03:10:42,798 --> 03:10:48,137
but that's that's what they are.
But that love this discussion.
No, no, no, I love the

1857
03:10:48,137 --> 03:10:54,310
discussion. So but on top of
that they were laid out in
front though right. It wasn't

1858
03:10:54,310 --> 03:10:59,949
an NDA that building seven and
eight were going to be this.
We'll let you know. I was just

1859
03:10:59,949 --> 03:11:04,486
blown. Oh okay. Well you said
you built them. You said. But
anyway, they were going to be

1860
03:11:04,486 --> 03:11:10,225
part of the banking institution.
And not saying that we can put
this in. And then later on,

1861
03:11:10,225 --> 03:11:14,997
when you do blanket policies,
how does that work? I'm just
going off. I wasn't going to

1862
03:11:14,997 --> 03:11:25,240
speak until I heard the
discussion. These are all notes.
I don't know the three

1863
03:11:25,240 --> 03:11:31,647
stakeholders. Yeah, we are
Escambia County citizens. It is
Bula citizens. It wasn't the

1864
03:11:31,647 --> 03:11:38,620
economic development until it
was given back to the county.
With the economic development

1865
03:11:38,620 --> 03:11:43,826
grants. It wasn't that. So I
don't know, $100 million. We're
going to get all the

1866
03:11:43,826 --> 03:11:48,130
infrastructure HOAs. They're
not going to sign off on the
actual parks that aren't inside

1867
03:11:48,130 --> 03:11:52,301
those neighborhoods. I don't
know, food for thought, but
thanks for asking those

1868
03:11:52,301 --> 03:11:57,573
questions in the beginning. I
do appreciate it. Mr. Tim
Powell I how you doing? It's

1869
03:11:57,573 --> 03:12:03,112
hard for us when when we come
down from, you know, where we
live out in the sticks. But

1870
03:12:03,112 --> 03:12:09,218
thanks for having us again, I
appreciate it. Thanks for
having us. Yeah. Thanks, Mr.

1871
03:12:09,218 --> 03:12:18,127
Rosen. I guess since this is.
This is a discussion item. So I
think that finalizes our

1872
03:12:18,127 --> 03:12:26,802
discussion. Unless there's
anything else for this board
here. Or. I mean, we can't have

1873
03:12:26,802 --> 03:12:31,507
discussing, I guess. I mean I
just a discussion. Anything
else? I'll say this. I think we

1874
03:12:31,507 --> 03:12:37,546
had more discussion today than
the last time. So we can say it
was productive. Yeah. And I

1875
03:12:37,546 --> 03:12:42,684
hope that that was I don't know
what else to say there. Yeah.
Still for the for the sake of

1876
03:12:42,684 --> 03:12:52,428
the public, can you sequence
the next 60 days or so on where
this goes from here? You can

1877
03:12:52,428 --> 03:13:00,669
tell them. Yeah, of course
we're we're waiting on the
results from Tallahassee. We're

1878
03:13:00,669 --> 03:13:05,707
waiting. We're definitely
waiting on the results from
Tallahassee, whether they are

1879
03:13:05,707 --> 03:13:11,814
men or Tallahassee. Then it
goes back to the board for
approval. If there are no

1880
03:13:11,814 --> 03:13:16,885
recommendations for a public
meeting. In the meantime, while
we're still waiting on that,

1881
03:13:16,885 --> 03:13:22,624
we're going to with the
direction of staff and with the
with them, come back in October

1882
03:13:22,624 --> 03:13:32,367
for the public hearing on the
master plan, on the master plan,
how many public hearings are

1883
03:13:32,367 --> 03:13:38,040
required? How many? It's I
believe it's just one
legislative. Correct. So

1884
03:13:38,040 --> 03:13:43,812
because because see, the reason
why? Because as you see. And
board. Sometimes doing

1885
03:13:43,812 --> 03:13:50,986
everything together, it causes
a little concern because you
got the legislative and

1886
03:13:50,986 --> 03:13:55,791
judiciary. And our legal
counsel said sometimes it's
best to keep it separated. If

1887
03:13:55,791 --> 03:14:01,130
we're trying to give the public
the opportunity to come for you
all without just bringing

1888
03:14:01,130 --> 03:14:09,371
everything at once, step by
step, the master plan that goes
before, then the next thing we

1889
03:14:09,371 --> 03:14:15,878
will come. Quasi judicial
portion. These are general
steps, and that's when the.

1890
03:14:15,878 --> 03:14:20,182
We'll address the Land
Development Code, the zoning
districts, all of those things.

1891
03:14:20,182 --> 03:14:26,688
We. Because sometimes this is
such a big. Doing all at once
may cause more confusion. We're

1892
03:14:26,688 --> 03:14:31,393
trying to minimize the
confusion and trying to give
everybody the opportunity for

1893
03:14:31,393 --> 03:14:37,833
the board to understand, to be
transparent step by step,
without trying to throw

1894
03:14:37,833 --> 03:14:43,972
everything all at once. Mr.
Jones, why did you attach the
design code to the agenda? It

1895
03:14:43,972 --> 03:14:53,815
was not the master plan. That's
what I answer my question.
You're confused. So did that

1896
03:14:53,815 --> 03:14:58,487
answer your question in the
what's what the timeline is for
the next six? Yes. I asked it

1897
03:14:58,487 --> 03:15:02,524
for the benefit of the public,
who came today with several
comments. Knowing that I think

1898
03:15:02,524 --> 03:15:09,198
it's very important that you
all track the sequencing and
progression of this so that you

1899
03:15:09,198 --> 03:15:17,139
have the same opportunity every
chance you get to be heard.
Today, just the beginning

1900
03:15:17,139 --> 03:15:21,009
discussion item. There's an
action item later. We're
waiting on a response from

1901
03:15:21,009 --> 03:15:27,182
Tallahassee to see where that
goes. You have the BCC as well.
These are all opportunities for

1902
03:15:27,182 --> 03:15:37,392
you to be heard. This is just
the beginning. Get more than
seven days notice in the public

1903
03:15:37,392 --> 03:15:43,465
eye. More than seven days
notice. We don't get that much.
Jamie, I couldn't hear what you

1904
03:15:43,465 --> 03:15:49,671
asked. What was that? You have
more than seven days. Seven
days notice for what? The

1905
03:15:49,671 --> 03:15:54,676
planning board agenda. That's
all we get. Sometimes it's six,
sometimes it's five. That's not

1906
03:15:54,676 --> 03:16:00,482
enough for us to study and be
prepared to speak to the issue.
And then if you change the

1907
03:16:00,482 --> 03:16:08,257
issue, of course, that's fine.
Okay. Did board did you hear
that? Yeah. And I would defer

1908
03:16:08,257 --> 03:16:13,762
to staff on how their
regulatory you know, for timing
for that. That's the best I can

1909
03:16:13,762 --> 03:16:22,871
say. So timing of public
notices that's all set out by
the state. It's all codified in

1910
03:16:22,871 --> 03:16:31,813
our code. And you can attest
that this was compliant with
those statutes. Yes it is.

1911
03:16:31,813 --> 03:16:39,321
Thank you. All right. I guess
we're moving off of that. So if
there's any other discussion

1912
03:16:39,321 --> 03:16:54,903
we're good to go. Not at this
time. So. Okay. But before you
jump into the next. No. So

1913
03:16:54,903 --> 03:16:59,941
while we're going through
discussion, the Board of
Adjustment made a rather unique

1914
03:16:59,941 --> 03:17:11,853
request of staff that. They are
asking for a change, a code
change in the sign section. So

1915
03:17:11,853 --> 03:17:17,292
I'm going to explain it to you
now. What's going to you're
going to be seeing coming up

1916
03:17:17,292 --> 03:17:23,332
our current land development
code. When somebody wants to
build a drive through, it only

1917
03:17:23,332 --> 03:17:30,172
allows for signage for one
drive through. I'll. Since
Covid, the standard now when

1918
03:17:30,172 --> 03:17:36,311
folks bring in drive thrus is
two aisles. The board of
adjustment doesn't want to have

1919
03:17:36,311 --> 03:17:40,982
to go through a variance every
single time one of them comes
in. So they're asking us to

1920
03:17:40,982 --> 03:17:47,122
bring a proposal for changing
that to you guys. So we will
get that scheduled. I mean,

1921
03:17:47,122 --> 03:17:52,527
there's a lot going on towards
the end of the year, but we are
going to be bringing that to

1922
03:17:52,527 --> 03:17:58,734
you because they have requested
that we don't know when. We
just want to let you know it's

1923
03:17:58,734 --> 03:18:02,938
just forthcoming. We don't want
to say we're just trying to let
you know. Things that we got on

1924
03:18:02,938 --> 03:18:07,609
the calendar along with this
item, which is definitely
primary. And I and our other

1925
03:18:07,609 --> 03:18:13,048
rezoning cases that are yet
coming. So we still got three
public speakers, Teresa

1926
03:18:13,048 --> 03:18:27,763
Blackwell and then Larry Downs
and Jacqueline Rogers. So.
Who's first? Teresa? You're

1927
03:18:27,763 --> 03:18:35,036
first. She's a little older and
takes her just a minute.
Wherever whoever's second go,

1928
03:18:35,036 --> 03:18:41,009
go now so I can find my speech.
All right, Larry, you're up
first. Oh, I've got my speech

1929
03:18:41,009 --> 03:18:50,886
ready. It's all in my head. All
right. Since since since staff
brought up Larry Downs Junior

1930
03:18:50,886 --> 03:18:55,257
Plumbing, LLC. Because fecal
matters and mission obvious dot
coms where you can go get all

1931
03:18:55,257 --> 03:19:07,369
your information. Since staff
brought up since Covid, since
Covid, we got new stuff. Are

1932
03:19:07,369 --> 03:19:15,677
y'all are y'all up to date on
y'all's corporate chemical
vaccine injections? Staff up to

1933
03:19:15,677 --> 03:19:20,782
date? I just want to make sure
everybody's protected in here.
Now, for all you that are 50

1934
03:19:20,782 --> 03:19:28,089
and older, they got a new flu
mRNA shot by Moderna. Oh, it's
going to be great. It's going

1935
03:19:28,089 --> 03:19:35,764
to be great. Y'all can go get
that and join the the cardiac
arrest and cancers and all that.

1936
03:19:35,764 --> 03:19:45,907
All right. One of the things I
wanted to say. Hold on. I wrote
it down right here. Oh yeah.

1937
03:19:45,907 --> 03:19:52,481
Whenever you are moving forward
in the future and I know we're
always moving forward, I would

1938
03:19:52,481 --> 03:19:58,153
like for y'all to do I would
like to see if I could get a
discussion item put on here,

1939
03:19:58,153 --> 03:20:05,694
just like they did a discussion
item for property rights. So we
can kind of have a public

1940
03:20:05,694 --> 03:20:10,966
discussion for property rights
and, and maybe we can discuss
it back and forth. What would

1941
03:20:10,966 --> 03:20:20,008
be the best way to go back to
the savings clause for all
properties to, you know, to

1942
03:20:20,008 --> 03:20:26,248
have that traditional use, that
this founding, you know, that
our country was founded upon

1943
03:20:26,248 --> 03:20:32,754
the basic principles of liberty.
If we, you know, imagine that
if we went back to that now, it

1944
03:20:32,754 --> 03:20:36,992
would make a lot of people
upset. It'd make a lot of
people upset. They would be

1945
03:20:36,992 --> 03:20:46,735
they'd be like, we can't have
people having grass this tall.
It's just too much. It must be

1946
03:20:46,735 --> 03:20:56,177
six inches. Do y'all know what
the grass code is? Do y'all
know? No freedom there? Yeah,

1947
03:20:56,177 --> 03:21:02,851
maybe I need to put in a
Freedom of Information Act so I
can find that out. We thought

1948
03:21:02,851 --> 03:21:10,959
you were going to tell us. Yeah,
but. Well, I used to know it,
but since I live a place where

1949
03:21:10,959 --> 03:21:19,200
I got my savings calls back. I
don't have to go buy it. But
anyhow, how do you how how

1950
03:21:19,200 --> 03:21:25,974
could we rezone if we if we had
that discussion, how could we
get have Burke drive one mile

1951
03:21:25,974 --> 03:21:32,881
long road that was zoned RR and
somehow, you know, went through
the whole process without the

1952
03:21:32,881 --> 03:21:39,387
signs up, how could we get it
rezoned back to RR from what?
They changed it from LDR

1953
03:21:39,387 --> 03:21:43,625
because that's it's
non-conforming. 90% of the
people on there are

1954
03:21:43,625 --> 03:21:51,032
non-conforming. So we should
not have that. And all we have
to do to go back to that is I'm

1955
03:21:51,032 --> 03:21:56,304
guessing we could have that
discussion first, like, like
they have, and we could get our

1956
03:21:56,304 --> 03:22:01,276
rights back because there's a
lot of a lot of people don't
have Burke Drive that are

1957
03:22:01,276 --> 03:22:08,850
violating LDR rules. So anyways,
maybe we could move towards
that. All right. Teresa, then

1958
03:22:08,850 --> 03:22:19,294
Jacqueline Rogers, mission
obvious.com. Don't forget your
shots. Did you? Okay, first I'm

1959
03:22:19,294 --> 03:22:30,038
gonna just get in my last few
points. As far as the design
code. First, restore Dps's

1960
03:22:30,038 --> 03:22:34,776
requirement for continuous
sidewalks and bike lanes and
restore the narrower, safer

1961
03:22:34,776 --> 03:22:41,683
street widths in the DP's
design code. Second, restore
Dps's far intensity ladder. Do

1962
03:22:41,683 --> 03:22:49,858
not approve a blanket 4.0 far
across the entire site. Third,
restore Dps's height limits to

1963
03:22:49,858 --> 03:22:56,364
maintain human scale streets
and predictable transitions.
Fourth, remove distribution

1964
03:22:56,364 --> 03:23:04,239
uses that distribute directly
directly to consumers, whether
labeled as warehouses,

1965
03:23:04,239 --> 03:23:14,783
facilities, or logistics. Fifth,
prohibit standalone data
centers. Okay. Please ensure

1966
03:23:14,783 --> 03:23:19,788
that the design code for oh
eight reflects the scale,
intensity, and land use pattern

1967
03:23:19,788 --> 03:23:25,860
the community supported, and
that the Board of County
Commissioners agreed to. Thank

1968
03:23:25,860 --> 03:23:31,633
you. Now I'm going to talk
about transparency, and I think
today was pretty much of a

1969
03:23:31,633 --> 03:23:38,473
farce. It was advertised as a
discussion with the design code
attached. The developer

1970
03:23:38,473 --> 03:23:44,245
presented about the master plan.
And then we talked about the
master plan. So as far as the

1971
03:23:44,245 --> 03:23:50,685
first meeting being a
discussion meeting, we did not
discuss the design code. And

1972
03:23:50,685 --> 03:23:59,661
that's what the subject was
advertised to be. So there's
that. No wonder we get confused.

1973
03:23:59,661 --> 03:24:04,799
So, you know, it's nice to get
an after the fact explanation
on what we're doing, but you

1974
03:24:04,799 --> 03:24:13,007
know, put that in what goes in
the agenda. Thank you. And I
want to address a transparency

1975
03:24:13,007 --> 03:24:19,147
concern related to the outlying
field design code, one that
affects public confidence in

1976
03:24:19,147 --> 03:24:24,986
how decisions are made.
Recently, an email from the
Director of Development

1977
03:24:24,986 --> 03:24:30,325
Services included wording that
raised questions about the
independence of the review

1978
03:24:30,325 --> 03:24:35,697
process. Of course, we didn't
see any review here today, but
in that message he asked his

1979
03:24:35,697 --> 03:24:41,770
team, which actually includes
county staff as well as the
developers planner. He this was

1980
03:24:41,770 --> 03:24:50,478
an email to that group asking
about changes between the two
plans so that he'd be able to

1981
03:24:50,478 --> 03:25:01,256
explain them. So he said. He
wanted to know about what he
called our. And then he changed

1982
03:25:01,256 --> 03:25:08,797
that word to the proposed code.
So when staff refer to an
applicant's document as our

1983
03:25:08,797 --> 03:25:15,303
code, it suggests a level of
collaboration that goes beyond
the neutral arm's length review.

1984
03:25:15,303 --> 03:25:21,376
The public expects the
community relies on staff to
evaluate proposals and

1985
03:25:21,376 --> 03:25:29,384
independently, independently
and protect adopted plans. So
as my as John Moore asked, who

1986
03:25:29,384 --> 03:25:35,490
is representing us, even
advising us? Not happening over
here. Thank you. Thank you

1987
03:25:35,490 --> 03:25:47,702
Teresa. All right. Jacqueline
Rogers pepper Weimer. Okay, I
have five unrelated things. One

1988
03:25:47,702 --> 03:25:55,610
of them you used to put out
there on that sheet that you
gave, what the criteria were.

1989
03:25:55,610 --> 03:26:00,381
You have the five criteria. And
then at the end you had board
action. And I even came and

1990
03:26:00,381 --> 03:26:04,619
said, hey, that's so great that
you're finally including that
last thing, board action. And

1991
03:26:04,619 --> 03:26:09,524
the attorney even agreed with
me or not agreed with me, but
said, yes, that's appropriate.

1992
03:26:09,524 --> 03:26:15,096
The board, even if a rezoning
meets all the criteria, the
board can see if keeping it the

1993
03:26:15,096 --> 03:26:19,868
same would be better. And now
you guys took it off. So I
don't know why you did that.

1994
03:26:19,868 --> 03:26:24,505
I'm just give you staff or
whoever took it off. That's
that's not good because you did

1995
03:26:24,505 --> 03:26:32,847
it right the first time. Number
two that he said they met the
statutory minimum for notice.

1996
03:26:32,847 --> 03:26:38,119
But just like the Boa can say,
look, I don't want to see two
lanes of a drive through. You

1997
03:26:38,119 --> 03:26:43,458
can direct the staff to put it
out more than a week ahead of
time. That's I mean, I

1998
03:26:43,458 --> 03:26:48,930
understand that developers are
working on this, working on
this, but it has to be a timely

1999
03:26:48,930 --> 03:26:54,969
time for us to review it. Five
days sometimes is all and then
it's incorrect. And then and

2000
03:26:54,969 --> 03:27:00,408
then we have to do it all over
again. This was incorrect. What
was what was attached. So it's

2001
03:27:00,408 --> 03:27:05,480
up to you. You guys are our
planning board. I understand
that I can't vote on everything

2002
03:27:05,480 --> 03:27:11,552
you guys can, but you are our
only board that is standing in
for the people you're standing

2003
03:27:11,552 --> 03:27:15,290
for. Developers to developers
are people. I understand that
to make it fair. So please

2004
03:27:15,290 --> 03:27:21,996
think about directing them to
put it on more than 5 to 7 days
before. When they say they

2005
03:27:21,996 --> 03:27:28,403
don't pass off evaluation on
rezonings and comp plans to the
DRC process. Because if you

2006
03:27:28,403 --> 03:27:33,541
look up the DRC process, there
is no initial application
meeting. It says right on there.

2007
03:27:33,541 --> 03:27:38,546
There's no application meeting
for the public. So what is
required to find out when he

2008
03:27:38,546 --> 03:27:43,117
says, well, you can go to a pre
app meeting. Pre apps are not
required. Somebody could just

2009
03:27:43,117 --> 03:27:47,221
go straight to the initial. So
you're not going to know that
somebody's doing a pre app or

2010
03:27:47,221 --> 03:27:52,093
not. And pre op sometimes are
like crazy off the wall and
they find out it's not feasible.

2011
03:27:52,093 --> 03:27:56,631
Initial application is where we
could get involved. It's
published for the final

2012
03:27:56,631 --> 03:28:02,670
application but not for the
initial. I mean it's public.
There's a public meeting for it.

2013
03:28:02,670 --> 03:28:07,709
So we would have to dig in to
go to each reviewer, find out
what all they're saying, and we

2014
03:28:07,709 --> 03:28:12,013
might not even know it's on on
there. If you look on August,
there's nothing for initial.

2015
03:28:12,013 --> 03:28:16,985
Did we get no initial
applications in August? There's
nothing for the one this week

2016
03:28:16,985 --> 03:28:21,022
in September. There's nothing
listed. Do we get in the last
five weeks no initial

2017
03:28:21,022 --> 03:28:26,094
applications or are they just
not putting them on the agenda
anymore? So the last thing I

2018
03:28:26,094 --> 03:28:32,600
wanted to say, well, no,
there's two things. Okay.
Sector plan versus the DP's

2019
03:28:32,600 --> 03:28:36,938
master plan. You guys told me,
oh, the sector plan was thrown
up on all these people that

2020
03:28:36,938 --> 03:28:41,642
didn't already own this
property. And it wasn't fair.
But even Commissioner Bergus,

2021
03:28:41,642 --> 03:28:46,614
former Commissioner bergus
acknowledged that DPS was
different. This was our chance

2022
03:28:46,614 --> 03:28:52,086
because the public owned this.
We could put whatever we wanted.
So what do we do? We got the DC

2023
03:28:52,086 --> 03:28:58,092
DPS master plan ahead of time.
Then we put it out there and
people bid on it and said, yes,

2024
03:28:58,092 --> 03:29:04,165
I want to do this master plan
and now we're totally changing
it. Why did we do it ahead of

2025
03:29:04,165 --> 03:29:09,137
time? If if it's a blank check
to the developer to just change
it because he's putting all his

2026
03:29:09,137 --> 03:29:14,409
investment and he's putting all
his money out there, then why
did we do the million dollar

2027
03:29:14,409 --> 03:29:20,448
investment and the time of ten
years of a lot of our time? Why
did we do that? Thank you. All

2028
03:29:20,448 --> 03:29:33,761
right, Pepper, and we're done
with public forum. I still want
to talk about the confusion. I

2029
03:29:33,761 --> 03:29:39,067
it's really confusing. And we
should be able to interact with
you guys and and I do

2030
03:29:39,067 --> 03:29:48,643
appreciate the attitude here.
You guys are really open and
helpful over here. But the fact

2031
03:29:48,643 --> 03:29:57,151
that the agenda did not reflect
what's what's going on here is,
is crazy. I'm lucky enough to

2032
03:29:57,151 --> 03:30:04,025
be able to just show up a lot
at a lot of these meetings, but
most people are not. So again,

2033
03:30:04,025 --> 03:30:09,097
it's this is accessibility
because people aren't being
told what's going on. And so,

2034
03:30:09,097 --> 03:30:13,801
you know what Miss Rogers was
talking about with the agendas
that that is a serious problem.

2035
03:30:13,801 --> 03:30:18,806
And it's not even just a
problem here. It's a problem
with the city and the county

2036
03:30:18,806 --> 03:30:23,845
commissioners and councils as
well. The public deserves to
know what's going on. And it

2037
03:30:23,845 --> 03:30:31,085
just feels, as a member of the
public, like every single step
of the way that there is to

2038
03:30:31,085 --> 03:30:40,328
interact with any kind of
process, is just shrouded in
confusion. And it's just

2039
03:30:40,328 --> 03:30:48,369
absolutely unacceptable. It's
undemocratic. We should be able
to understand, and I understand

2040
03:30:48,369 --> 03:30:54,075
that, you know, maybe 50 years
ago, people were showing up in
a way that they weren't 15

2041
03:30:54,075 --> 03:31:00,515
years ago. But the pendulum
swings and we're back. We're
back. The public's back. So

2042
03:31:00,515 --> 03:31:07,388
we're begging. The public is
begging for transparency. And
transparency means

2043
03:31:07,388 --> 03:31:13,594
understanding what's going on.
So I don't, you know, we really
need this. You know, it would

2044
03:31:13,594 --> 03:31:18,499
help everybody because you've
got people showing up confused
about what they want to talk

2045
03:31:18,499 --> 03:31:24,672
about. And, you know, so that
would really subvert the issue.
But I think that, and I'm not

2046
03:31:24,672 --> 03:31:28,643
talking about the planning
Board meeting again, planning
board members, I appreciate you

2047
03:31:28,643 --> 03:31:35,416
guys. But somewhere along the
line, it just feels intentional
and strategic like that. You

2048
03:31:35,416 --> 03:31:44,058
guys are strategically making
it confusing, putting things in
legalese. You why? How can you

2049
03:31:44,058 --> 03:31:50,231
expect the public to not be
frustrated? And when when the
Planning board members are

2050
03:31:50,231 --> 03:31:55,703
confused too? If the Planning
Board members are confused, how
could you look down on the

2051
03:31:55,703 --> 03:32:00,841
public for not understanding?
Because it feels like a lot of
people think that we're dumb

2052
03:32:00,841 --> 03:32:08,649
for not understanding, and we
just want to interact, and it
just feels like a brick wall.

2053
03:32:08,649 --> 03:32:14,989
Seriously, it's it's it's it's
ridiculous. And I really hope
somebody other than you guys

2054
03:32:14,989 --> 03:32:20,127
hear this because I know y'all,
you know, y'all aren't doing it.
But but that's what this is

2055
03:32:20,127 --> 03:32:23,998
supposed to be for. I just
don't know if anybody really
pays attention. You know, I, I

2056
03:32:23,998 --> 03:32:28,402
heard what you said, Mr. Nelson.
I understand y'all are
listening, but I don't under I

2057
03:32:28,402 --> 03:32:32,873
don't know if the commissioners
go back and listen to this. I
do because I'm a reporter, but

2058
03:32:32,873 --> 03:32:40,014
I don't think they do. I don't
think they care. Thank you so
much. We are. You have to fill

2059
03:32:40,014 --> 03:32:44,952
out a form. I signed up for the
old. I mean, what what is this
specific? This is public forum.

2060
03:32:44,952 --> 03:32:49,991
Just public forum for the
planning board. Separate.
Separate. Yes. All right. Thank

2061
03:32:49,991 --> 03:32:56,864
for me. Next time. Unless you
really want to. Several more
times. Yes. All right.

2062
03:32:56,864 --> 03:33:00,768
Directors review anything we
got besides that we haven't
already talked about Drew or

2063
03:33:00,768 --> 03:33:07,842
Horse. No, I think that's
covering everything. And we've
got a code enforcement hearing

2064
03:33:07,842 --> 03:33:11,912
on the way for this room, so.
Okay. All right. And then
county attorney. Anything. All

2065
03:33:11,912 --> 03:33:17,385
right then we're done. Thank
you so much. Hold on. Y'all
don't leave yet. I gotta get a

2066
03:33:17,385 --> 03:33:28,629
photo op with the shot. The
shot? Come on. You love these
thoughts, man. Submit to my

2067
03:33:28,629 --> 03:33:46,499
work. Well, I mean, how much
time do you.