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Welcome everyone. Very happy to see you here this evening as we,

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again, stick to council's direction and leadership in relationship to their want

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for transparency.

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We began this journey about five and a half, six months ago, as you're aware,

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and we had an incredibly challenging situation.

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And not to say that it's still not challenging, obviously it still is,

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but a lot of work has been done

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over the last number of months, and we wanted to share that with you this evening

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and let you know where we stand today.

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The other thing, as I mentioned in past open houses,

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is we are here to hear from you. So

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questions, and any question, is on side.

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If there's anything you want to ask, there's no questions that we won't try to

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answer. The other thing, again, and the last

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couple of town halls we've had have been, quite frankly, fantastic from a

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public engagement perspective. We've really appreciated the

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openness, the patience with us. There's frustration, we

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understand that, but it's been very respectful.

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And again, the big word for tonight is respect.

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And

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again, we'll show the crowd respect, and hopefully you'll show council and

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administration respect.

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We have information to share with you tonight, and we're going to basically

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let you know a little bit about all the work that's been done over the last number

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of months. Before we get going,

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I'm going to have each of the councilors introduce themselves to you this evening,

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maybe give you a couple of comments before we begin on what their thoughts about

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tonight are, and we'll move on from there. Okay.

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Which end am I going to start on? I'm going to start on this end because you

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deserve it. So go ahead, Travis, you're number one.

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You just introduced me.

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I'm Travis Curry, first-time councilor, same with everyone else here.

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Long time listener, first time councilor.

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I'm from Gibbons,

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and I know several of you here.

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And

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I think that's

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about it for now, I suppose.

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Darryl Burak, first time councilor.

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Glad to see you guys showed up tonight.

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Tonight, we're going to be going over the

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budget and where we're sitting. We encourage everyone to ask as many

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questions as possible. Put us on the spot, we don't mind.

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That's kind of what we're here for, and we want to make everyone as

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comfortable as possible with what the future of Gibbons is.

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Darren Longstaff.

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Been a resident here since 2001,

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so

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this means just as much to me as it does to the rest of you, and the rest of

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the council, I'm sure.

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Good evening, and thanks everybody for coming out.

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Not a very pleasant evening to be out and about with the strong winds.

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You'll see tonight by the presentation, this is just the start of a long road

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ahead.

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We have an important engagement at the end of June,

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two dates for a viability review, June 24th and

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25th. So write those dates down on your calendar.

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Very important for our town.

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Good evening. My name is Robert Zmarlic,

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first time councilor.

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Been living in town since 1979. And

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welcome everybody for coming tonight, and please ask questions.

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The other thing is you'll hear information on our budget, and I'm also excited

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to hear about some cost-sharing proposals that

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we have in the works. So, thank you very much.

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Again, welcome all. Ashley Morrison, first-time councilor.

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I

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recognize most faces here, so I think you already know that.

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We're really happy that you come out to these forums.

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Please, this is your opportunity to ask questions and hold us

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accountable if we're not doing what you are expecting us to do.

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Thanks.

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Is this on?

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Sharla St. Germain, first time councilor.

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I've lived in Gibbons since 2012.

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We're glad you all came out. Thank you.

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Yeah, we just want to hear from you. We want your voices heard. Thank you.

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Okay.

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So with that, I have some information to share with you tonight.

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I'm going to go through it as quickly and painlessly as I can, but admittedly,

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there's a lot of financial kind of information I'm going to share

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with you that

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may not be

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overly easy to understand, but I'll do my best to explain it in the best

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way and easiest way that I can.

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One of the things, again, I'm using a mouse tonight.

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Again, I don't have my clicker, this will be difficult, is one of the key things

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when it comes to municipal finance that we want to make sure is very clear to you

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as our residents

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is that

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municipalities are in the business of one very simple thing, and that's to provide

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quality of life for people. It's not as complicated as we make it.

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But we clear snow, we cut grass, we provide fire and emergency services,

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fill potholes,

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have family community services to help support people, have recreation

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assets, those types of things. And every day it really adds to people's quality of

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life. And that's really the business that we're in.

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And there is a... Do you mind doing this for me right here? Okay, thanks.

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There is a very simple

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equation to that, and that is that to be able to manage

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to deliver the quality of life and the services that we provide, we have to charge

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taxes, utility rates, and fees and charges.

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And one of the key things about the municipal business that sometimes is

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misunderstood is we don't take a profit

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home. It's basically a break-even business.

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So we do our best, and basically the budget process is pretty simple, is we do a

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lot of work to basically determine exactly what the costs

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areAnd then we turn that into a tax rate, and from a water

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perspective and sewer and refuse, we turn that into a utility rate, and that's

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it. So there's not a lot of mystery behind that.

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We just do our best to really, in a sense, flow the cost through

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taxes and utility rates.

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This is a slide. I know probably many of you can't see that.

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These are slides I created back in the early 2000s, by the way, when I was

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presenting budgets for Strathcona County.

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And there's a very simple concept that we have to follow in municipal government,

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and that is balancing budgets. It's

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not legal through the Municipal Government Act for us to

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basically have what we call deficit budgeting, so we have to balance

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budgets. And admittedly, that was a big problem for the town of

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Gibbons for years, is that essentially, you were running

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on unbalanced budgets for many years, and that was

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essentially being balanced with transfers from basically debt,

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operating debt, which I'm going to share some information with you tonight.

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When you do that, eventually you run out of debt, run out of cash reserves, and

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you hit a wall, which happened last year, which essentially was running out of

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those reserves. And so you have to balance your services costs

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to the revenue coming in, and if you don't do that, you'll eventually run out of

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money, which is what happened here.

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There's eventually three key things that we look at when we're budgeting.

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We have capital. So one of the key things municipalities take care of is hard

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assets, roads,

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vehicles, buildings, ice plants, recreation

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assets, family community services buildings.

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Basically, the assets that we own or are helping

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deliver services each and every day.

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So the grass doesn't get cut by itself if we need a mower.

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Your fire doesn't get responded to by just a bunch of firefighters running with

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buckets of water. We need a fire truck.

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The list goes on and on and on. So capital assets are absolutely key and

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critical to delivering services each and every day, and so we must take care of our

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assets. And we do this through asset management, we do this

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through transfers and reserves, and in some cases, we do this through taking out

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debt to sometimes maintain or replenish the assets we have.

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So a very important thought is capital.

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The second component of good municipal budgeting is essentially taking care of

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operations. So every day we have people working.

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Every day we have electricity and heat that's

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warming our buildings. Every day we're using things like fuel.

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So we have significant costs that go out the door every

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day to basically serve you. So again, snow

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clearing means labor, it means fuel.

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Using this asset site means electricity, it means heat.

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So we have general operating costs that we have to budget for and take care

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of. So a very important thing to consider. I just want to share this with you.

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The number one challenge for municipal government, bar

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none,

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is inflation. It's the most challenging thing municipalities deal with from a

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financial perspective each and every year. I've been doing this for a long time.

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What's the biggest challenge we have right now?

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Municipalities across Canada, well, quite frankly, across the world, we're

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significantly challenged because of the cost of fuel.

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One of our main commodities to help support you each and every day

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has literally doubled in the last three or four months, and so that's become very

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challenging for us from a budget perspective.

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The final thing is

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we have what's called restricted, unrestricted surplus, essentially reserves.

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So we put money in the bank just like you do in your household.

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So you're going to put money away for rainy days, you're going to put money away

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to take care of your car if it breaks down.

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You're going to put money away maybe for applying for a holiday.

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Municipalities, in a sense, aren't all that different.

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We put money away, though, for things like replacing our

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vehicles. We put money away for fixing up buildings occasionally,

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maybe the ice plant. We put money away for rainy days and possible

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disaster mitigation, and so having money in reserve is key and

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critical to sustainable municipalities. And again, sometimes this is misunderstood.

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People go, "Well, you're putting all this money away and it's sitting in the bank.

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Well, you're overtaxing me." That's not the case.

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That said, there

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is work that we do to ensure that the reserves are basically at the right balance.

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So this is called optimal balance, basically methodologies.

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But at the same time, we want to ensure that we have money in the bank.

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Again, as you know, this was another critical thing that we had to discuss

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early in basically our time with you.

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We didn't have any money in the bank.

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It basically went out the door to basically pay for

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capital assets that went into the ground for development and for other things over

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the years, and so we're looking at replenishing that now.

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Now, moving along, the specific of our operating budget.

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So we are looking at our tax revenue increase of

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8.2%. This results in

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basically 5%, 5.2%

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for

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basically our general base budget.

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And as I mentioned before, this is to cover off the services that I just talked

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about. It also includes things like inflation, changes to

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service levels, and whatnot. The one thing we were here about five

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months ago, that number was over

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120%, is what we started with when we looked at this budget as we

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began.

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So a lot of work has been done to basically get it down to what we consider was

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manageable. Now, some will say, "Well, 8.2% is

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very high and that's a lot." And I don't disagree that that may be challenging,

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but I also want to state that this is basically the average in

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Alberta right now. In fact, there's a lot of municipalities that are higher than

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this right now. So 8.2%, we believe, is not

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an unreasonable amount considering the challenges we've

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had. About 5% is going into

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basically covering off our base, and 3% is going to

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replenishing those reserves I just talked about.

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So this is basically part of our long-term financial plan, where we're going to

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start putting money away so we can start taking care of tomorrow.

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And again, something that we do have to do to make sure the

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municipality survives.

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This is a balanced budget.It reduces the

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long-term risk because we are going to be preparing for future financial

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needs. And again, it's a multi-layered strategy, which I'm going to talk about here

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in a few moments. Moving on. One of the things that's very important to note is as

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we look at the challenges that we face as a town,

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we are literally between, say, for example, our comparatives Bon Accord and

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Redwater, still close to 15% to 20%

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less than they pay for the same house for taxes.

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So that's an important thing to note, is that we're actually a little bit lower

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than our comparables. We're a bit higher than

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Thorhild County and Sturgeon County, but when we compare to the towns, we're

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actually lower than the others. So to say that we're maybe

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in a tax position that was unfair or unreasonable, we're not.

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So I think that's important for us to realize as we move forward.

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One thing I would say is important to note, though, is that when we look at our

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comparables like the county,

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a person who lives in the county pays less than half

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of the property taxes for the same home.

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And so I think that's an important consideration as we start talking about

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collaboration and working together. Okay? Moving on.

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So how did we do this?

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One of the things that we looked at was basically understanding that we're going to

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have a leaner, basically, organization.

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This meant making some tough decisions.

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One of the key things about municipal government, and a lot of

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00:13:32,068 --> 00:13:35,848
people have a hard time understanding this when they start first looking at the

242
00:13:35,868 --> 00:13:39,548
municipal business, is that we are a people-driven business, which

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means the grass doesn't get cut without a person on the mower.

244
00:13:43,188 --> 00:13:46,318
The fire truck can't show up to a fire call without a firefighter.

245
00:13:47,348 --> 00:13:51,088
The recreation complex doesn't get opened without a person working there.

246
00:13:51,148 --> 00:13:54,128
That also means from a cost-cutting perspective,

247
00:13:55,148 --> 00:13:58,988
we actually don't have a lot of areas that are really basically easy to

248
00:13:59,028 --> 00:14:01,808
find a lot of money in other than staffing in a lot of cases.

249
00:14:02,408 --> 00:14:03,568
So in the case of

250
00:14:06,508 --> 00:14:10,318
the town, we really did a lot of work looking at the organization and

251
00:14:10,408 --> 00:14:14,028
trying to determine what were the right service levels for a town of this size.

252
00:14:14,928 --> 00:14:18,908
So we actually eliminated approximately what would be the equivalent to 14

253
00:14:18,928 --> 00:14:22,308
positions within the town. Now, one of the things I want to

254
00:14:23,268 --> 00:14:27,217
maybe make clear right now, just again, maybe create some, I guess,

255
00:14:28,008 --> 00:14:31,388
calm in basically the decisions we made, is that of those 14

256
00:14:31,398 --> 00:14:32,048
positions,

257
00:14:33,228 --> 00:14:33,908
all but two

258
00:14:35,848 --> 00:14:37,348
were with the town for less than two years.

259
00:14:38,748 --> 00:14:42,198
Many of those positions, around seven to eight, had been hired within the last two

260
00:14:42,228 --> 00:14:43,898
years for new work to be done.

261
00:14:44,838 --> 00:14:48,808
That means we had a significant increase in service levels and basically this

262
00:14:48,888 --> 00:14:52,428
idea that we're going to be doing a lot more work over the last years because of

263
00:14:52,468 --> 00:14:55,268
the thought that a lot of development is going to come in because of the investment

264
00:14:55,288 --> 00:14:57,148
that we put in. It didn't materialize.

265
00:14:57,868 --> 00:14:58,928
So in my mind,

266
00:14:59,848 --> 00:15:02,908
we feel we're not actually significantly cutting out service levels.

267
00:15:02,968 --> 00:15:06,868
And again, there are things that have changed, but is it a monumental change

268
00:15:06,908 --> 00:15:10,118
where we're not going to be filling potholes or clearing snow or cutting grass?

269
00:15:10,428 --> 00:15:13,568
No, that's not going to happen. There are some changes I'm going to share with you

270
00:15:13,608 --> 00:15:16,308
tonight, but on the most part, we feel it's manageable.

271
00:15:16,968 --> 00:15:17,748
But it's manageable

272
00:15:18,608 --> 00:15:21,308
because we're going to change the way that we look at performance and the way that

273
00:15:21,348 --> 00:15:24,088
we train people as well, and I'll share that with you in a few moments.

274
00:15:25,248 --> 00:15:29,168
The staffing changes supported about $1.2 million in savings,

275
00:15:30,028 --> 00:15:31,268
and then we looked at other things.

276
00:15:31,308 --> 00:15:34,928
And we did an extensive review of your actual results over the last five years.

277
00:15:35,388 --> 00:15:38,888
We also made some hard decisions in terms of maybe some things that we can't do

278
00:15:38,928 --> 00:15:42,498
right now. And so we found about $400,000 in savings

279
00:15:43,148 --> 00:15:46,788
in goods and services, about $300,000 savings in contracted and

280
00:15:46,828 --> 00:15:50,538
professional services, and $200,000 in savings in repairs and

281
00:15:50,608 --> 00:15:54,368
maintenance. So when we look at things, that's over $2 million in savings

282
00:15:54,428 --> 00:15:57,728
altogether, and a 1% increase for the town is, what, Ryan?

283
00:15:57,768 --> 00:15:58,778
About 35%.

284
00:16:00,628 --> 00:16:03,928
37,000. So 37,000 is a 1% increase.

285
00:16:03,988 --> 00:16:07,968
So quick math. Ryan will figure it out for me, but $2 million is a

286
00:16:08,068 --> 00:16:08,848
savings of

287
00:16:10,368 --> 00:16:12,888
a lot. So I'll get Ryan to figure that out, and we'll go from there.

288
00:16:13,128 --> 00:16:14,328
Next slide, Ryan. Sorry.

289
00:16:17,268 --> 00:16:20,038
The next thing that we did, again, as we were talking about reserves,

290
00:16:21,108 --> 00:16:24,308
that $2 million reduction in costs

291
00:16:25,088 --> 00:16:29,028
was also complemented with us looking at revenues that we

292
00:16:29,067 --> 00:16:31,528
determined or thought were not realistic.

293
00:16:32,088 --> 00:16:35,478
And you had about almost $3 million of revenues that were not

294
00:16:35,508 --> 00:16:38,908
realized in your actuals when that was budgeted,

295
00:16:39,488 --> 00:16:41,308
and we fixed that. That said,

296
00:16:42,508 --> 00:16:46,008
we have done a bunch of work on looking at the developments.

297
00:16:46,018 --> 00:16:49,848
The infrastructure was put in the ground, and we worked very hard and

298
00:16:49,868 --> 00:16:53,788
diligently to develop frameworks on what's called a local

299
00:16:53,828 --> 00:16:56,688
improvement bylaw, and we're looking at your offsite levy bylaws.

300
00:16:57,068 --> 00:16:58,668
And the changes that we're going to make in those

301
00:16:59,508 --> 00:17:02,728
will result in development agreements that are enforceable.

302
00:17:03,748 --> 00:17:05,388
And we've received legal opinions on that.

303
00:17:05,449 --> 00:17:09,348
That does mean that we're now going to be in a position to recover the money

304
00:17:09,368 --> 00:17:10,148
we put in the ground.

305
00:17:11,088 --> 00:17:14,748
So we have put that money in the budget, but have also

306
00:17:14,828 --> 00:17:16,729
offset that with transfer to reserves.

307
00:17:17,008 --> 00:17:17,778
So if it doesn't work,

308
00:17:18,689 --> 00:17:22,679
and we end up with challenges from a legal perspective with the people that

309
00:17:22,689 --> 00:17:25,318
we're going to be looking to recover the money from, we just don't transfer the

310
00:17:25,348 --> 00:17:27,608
money to reserves. So our base budget is no longer at risk.

311
00:17:28,568 --> 00:17:32,488
We have no risk in terms of our ability to basically run services or have

312
00:17:32,528 --> 00:17:36,228
to increase taxes or put ourselves in a situation where we have to take out

313
00:17:36,268 --> 00:17:38,768
significant loans to cover our budget. That is no longer the case.

314
00:17:39,068 --> 00:17:42,908
We have balanced the budget with money we know that is assured, basically tax

315
00:17:42,928 --> 00:17:46,398
dollars. So that's a very important consideration that we've made a change on.

316
00:17:48,368 --> 00:17:51,798
We believe right now, base transfers, by the end of this year, we'll be able to

317
00:17:51,828 --> 00:17:55,748
transfer $1 million into reserves, and possibly up to three

318
00:17:55,828 --> 00:17:56,148
million.

319
00:17:57,008 --> 00:18:00,808
And if things work out, and things look like they're starting to work out, we

320
00:18:00,868 --> 00:18:04,768
could see a balanced budget and a replenishment of our reserves of up to

321
00:18:04,808 --> 00:18:07,608
$3 million by the end of this year, which is a significant

322
00:18:08,428 --> 00:18:08,748
change.

323
00:18:09,848 --> 00:18:12,168
It's still just the beginning, but it is a significant

324
00:18:12,228 --> 00:18:15,424
change.Again,

325
00:18:16,564 --> 00:18:20,344
this is critical to building our long-term financial sustainability, and I

326
00:18:20,384 --> 00:18:24,204
can't stress this enough, we can no longer budget just basically

327
00:18:24,224 --> 00:18:27,084
based on a balanced budget without putting money in the bank.

328
00:18:27,124 --> 00:18:28,604
We have to just stay sustainable.

329
00:18:29,524 --> 00:18:33,424
This means having the ability to handle a water line break,

330
00:18:33,504 --> 00:18:37,464
or if we had a roof failure or something significant, we need to be able to

331
00:18:37,504 --> 00:18:40,424
take care of those things. That means that we do need to replenish our reserves.

332
00:18:40,444 --> 00:18:41,924
And so we're going to work very hard on that.

333
00:18:43,084 --> 00:18:45,564
Next move. Okay. Capital projects.

334
00:18:45,604 --> 00:18:47,684
And so this is an area, admittedly,

335
00:18:48,784 --> 00:18:51,184
we've had to really tighten our belts on.

336
00:18:52,884 --> 00:18:56,764
Our debt capacity is very stretched, so I'm going to share exactly what our

337
00:18:56,804 --> 00:19:00,084
debt is tonight. But we decided we didn't want to take out any additional debt.

338
00:19:01,584 --> 00:19:02,864
We have to be very careful with our grants.

339
00:19:02,904 --> 00:19:06,714
We've received permission to use some of our capital grants and turn it into

340
00:19:06,784 --> 00:19:10,064
operating funds, which again, is a really positive thing from a cash flow

341
00:19:10,084 --> 00:19:14,034
perspective to get us on track. But that also means that we had to tighten our

342
00:19:14,044 --> 00:19:17,904
belts and deal with having to use maybe some of the capital assets

343
00:19:17,944 --> 00:19:21,764
we have and not change over things very quickly. And so we've really cut this back.

344
00:19:22,244 --> 00:19:22,784
That said,

345
00:19:23,604 --> 00:19:27,004
we have our SCID Survive Bet program, so this is positive for us.

346
00:19:27,064 --> 00:19:30,774
We have to upgrade our reservoir, so we're going to do

347
00:19:30,844 --> 00:19:31,984
that. And

348
00:19:32,984 --> 00:19:36,384
we're buying a vac truck. So I think this is something that was a

349
00:19:36,504 --> 00:19:39,984
real sore point for everybody, and I think we went from

350
00:19:40,324 --> 00:19:44,164
monthly pay of about $15,000 a month, which is what it costs,

351
00:19:44,204 --> 00:19:44,664
down to-

352
00:19:45,624 --> 00:19:47,964
I was going to say it was 11,5 for a while.

353
00:19:48,044 --> 00:19:48,324
Okay.

354
00:19:50,284 --> 00:19:50,744
But it's gone to 5 now.

355
00:19:50,824 --> 00:19:54,814
Okay. So we're down to about 5,500 a month, and we own it now, so that's a

356
00:19:54,844 --> 00:19:56,044
big difference as well. Okay?

357
00:19:58,964 --> 00:20:00,854
So again, debt funding,

358
00:20:02,964 --> 00:20:06,834
which is really important, is capital does tie to debt, and sometimes

359
00:20:06,844 --> 00:20:08,904
there is good debt. I'm going to explain that here in a few moments.

360
00:20:09,364 --> 00:20:12,784
But I can guarantee you this budget now is not taking out any new debt, and we're

361
00:20:12,844 --> 00:20:16,684
certainly not covering operations with operating loans any longer, which is a very

362
00:20:16,704 --> 00:20:18,994
important consideration. Okay? Moving on.

363
00:20:20,024 --> 00:20:22,564
So we are working on a long-term financial plan.

364
00:20:22,724 --> 00:20:24,544
Elements of this are a long-term financial plan.

365
00:20:25,284 --> 00:20:29,164
But if you saw the budget presentation, and maybe some of you have,

366
00:20:29,213 --> 00:20:30,104
we are looking at

367
00:20:31,264 --> 00:20:34,724
tax increases that are similar to what we've had this year in future years.

368
00:20:35,164 --> 00:20:38,844
And again, if you look around Alberta, most municipalities from a

369
00:20:38,914 --> 00:20:42,873
long-term financial planning perspective are forecasting between 5% to

370
00:20:43,144 --> 00:20:45,713
9% every year for the next three to four years because

371
00:20:46,544 --> 00:20:48,024
they're having to combat with inflation.

372
00:20:48,064 --> 00:20:50,014
So we're not all that different than other municipalities right now.

373
00:20:50,144 --> 00:20:54,104
So we feel our plan is reasonable, challenging, but

374
00:20:54,124 --> 00:20:57,044
reasonable, but it is a plan to get us back on track.

375
00:20:57,124 --> 00:21:00,804
And simple math, this includes significant buy-down of

376
00:21:00,884 --> 00:21:04,634
debt in future years, replenishment of reserves in future years,

377
00:21:04,984 --> 00:21:08,864
and a balanced budget. And like I said, I give this council all the credit.

378
00:21:09,464 --> 00:21:12,684
They were able to achieve this in five and a half months, which has people honestly

379
00:21:12,694 --> 00:21:14,924
around the province calling and going, "How the heck did that work?

380
00:21:15,444 --> 00:21:17,224
How did they do that?" Hard decisions.

381
00:21:17,464 --> 00:21:17,584
The

382
00:21:18,724 --> 00:21:21,104
council is willing to make some tough decisions, which we appreciated.

383
00:21:21,124 --> 00:21:22,844
It allowed us to do the work that we needed to do.

384
00:21:23,964 --> 00:21:27,684
So, this does include future debt buy-downs.

385
00:21:27,724 --> 00:21:30,144
There's been some thought that we're not buying down debt, that's not accurate.

386
00:21:30,224 --> 00:21:31,284
We are buying down debt.

387
00:21:32,564 --> 00:21:36,334
We have renegotiated, though, with the province on a bunch of debentures,

388
00:21:36,404 --> 00:21:40,304
about five or six of them, I believe, we've turned into one debenture, and

389
00:21:40,344 --> 00:21:44,204
we renegotiated to get our principal payments down for basically three

390
00:21:44,224 --> 00:21:46,544
years, so we don't have to make the principal payments.

391
00:21:46,624 --> 00:21:50,464
That is providing us with the runway to start putting money in the bank and plan

392
00:21:50,524 --> 00:21:52,984
for our debt buy-down plan in three years.

393
00:21:53,544 --> 00:21:56,024
So there is concern and everybody says, "Well, what happens in three years?

394
00:21:56,064 --> 00:21:57,124
You don't have money to pay off the debt.

395
00:21:57,164 --> 00:21:58,844
What happens when the principal payments come back?"

396
00:21:59,764 --> 00:22:03,224
We then switch over to the reserve plan that we're going to have in place to start

397
00:22:03,284 --> 00:22:05,864
paying down the debt. So we're smoothing it out by putting a bunch of money in the

398
00:22:05,884 --> 00:22:09,224
bank. We should have considerable money in the bank after three years with the plan

399
00:22:09,264 --> 00:22:10,304
that we've developed. Okay?

400
00:22:11,344 --> 00:22:15,064
So the three-year financial outlook, again, is consistent.

401
00:22:15,144 --> 00:22:17,374
It does have measured and consistent tax increases.

402
00:22:17,694 --> 00:22:21,024
The last thing we wanted to do was have a spike like this.

403
00:22:21,884 --> 00:22:25,104
When we first looked at it, we're looking at 120%, and then we did a bunch of work,

404
00:22:25,144 --> 00:22:29,094
we got down to 60%, and now we've got it down to 8.2,

405
00:22:29,944 --> 00:22:33,764
and then looking at seven and seven and seven is our forecast, but it's like this.

406
00:22:33,814 --> 00:22:35,903
And so we know what we're going to be looking at, right?

407
00:22:36,004 --> 00:22:38,604
Rather than this and this and this and this.

408
00:22:38,634 --> 00:22:42,134
And so we feel it's consistent and we feel it's reasonable, and it

409
00:22:42,184 --> 00:22:44,744
solves a lot of the issues that we had when we first started.

410
00:22:44,784 --> 00:22:48,304
So I think that's a good thing. Okay? Okay, moving along.

411
00:22:49,264 --> 00:22:49,464
So

412
00:22:50,484 --> 00:22:53,483
did we have to make service level adjustments? Yes, we did.

413
00:22:54,104 --> 00:22:57,834
Now, one of the things that I will say, I've been doing this for a long time.

414
00:22:58,314 --> 00:23:01,384
I've worked in very big municipalities. I've also worked in small ones.

415
00:23:01,544 --> 00:23:05,424
My favorite job of all time was CAO of Bruderheim, where it was my first

416
00:23:05,524 --> 00:23:07,924
small town CAO job, and I loved that place.

417
00:23:07,944 --> 00:23:09,944
It was a lot of fun, but I learned a lot there.

418
00:23:10,584 --> 00:23:14,324
But I'll also say this, is that the service levels that were basically funded

419
00:23:14,364 --> 00:23:18,344
here were way beyond what a municipality this size would normally have.

420
00:23:19,004 --> 00:23:22,724
And I'll just say it, when we started working, there was a

421
00:23:22,784 --> 00:23:26,644
lot of time staff had basically

422
00:23:26,724 --> 00:23:28,564
to plan, I guess, let's put it that way.

423
00:23:28,984 --> 00:23:32,704
And we kind of right-sized that down to where we feel the resources are now

424
00:23:33,744 --> 00:23:36,944
at the right levels for the services that we want to provide.

425
00:23:37,564 --> 00:23:37,984
And

426
00:23:39,004 --> 00:23:41,544
we feel it's manageable, and we do believe that we'll be able to deliver good

427
00:23:41,624 --> 00:23:44,904
services. That said, there are going to be service level changes that are

428
00:23:44,944 --> 00:23:46,684
unavoidable. We'll talk about those tonight.

429
00:23:47,524 --> 00:23:51,124
But we will say, we believe we'll be able to overcome this with strong

430
00:23:51,184 --> 00:23:52,184
performance management.

431
00:23:53,644 --> 00:23:56,144
The municipality before we came didn't have performance appraisals.

432
00:23:57,244 --> 00:23:57,504
They didn't

433
00:23:58,424 --> 00:24:01,664
have basically team meetings to talk about the goals that we had for the week.

434
00:24:02,044 --> 00:24:04,384
They didn't have basically professional development plans.

435
00:24:04,864 --> 00:24:06,504
We're now putting that all into place.

436
00:24:06,564 --> 00:24:10,004
And so we're looking at developing a structure where we have management,

437
00:24:10,104 --> 00:24:13,964
supervisors, and basically performance management and supporting staff to get

438
00:24:14,004 --> 00:24:16,464
better and plan better in terms of the work that we do.

439
00:24:16,544 --> 00:24:20,464
So we have less people, but we're going to work in a smarter way to be able to

440
00:24:20,484 --> 00:24:23,964
deliver services in a more meaningful way and in a cost-effective way.

441
00:24:24,304 --> 00:24:26,844
So more efficient and more effective is our goal. Okay?

442
00:24:27,824 --> 00:24:30,024
Moving on.So

443
00:24:31,124 --> 00:24:34,674
this isn't simply cost reductions, but it does move towards accountability,

444
00:24:34,804 --> 00:24:36,574
transparency, and performance-driven results.

445
00:24:37,184 --> 00:24:40,004
One of the key things this council has said that they wanted from us

446
00:24:41,284 --> 00:24:44,024
was accountability. Accountability and transparency.

447
00:24:44,304 --> 00:24:47,154
So we're here tonight to share with you exactly what's in the budget, which I've

448
00:24:47,164 --> 00:24:47,574
been doing,

449
00:24:48,524 --> 00:24:51,184
but it doesn't stop with the budget. The budget's the beginning, not the end.

450
00:24:52,264 --> 00:24:53,484
And what I mean by that is,

451
00:24:54,424 --> 00:24:58,054
we had our summer student in today, and he's been working on the last couple of

452
00:24:58,084 --> 00:25:01,464
days on developing a forecast year-end for the

453
00:25:01,504 --> 00:25:04,844
town and working on a quarterly report, which we're soon going to present to

454
00:25:04,904 --> 00:25:08,804
council, which means here's what we spent, here's what our actuals were,

455
00:25:08,944 --> 00:25:11,724
this is what we planned, and we're going to be doing that every quarter.

456
00:25:11,764 --> 00:25:14,674
So basically, a quarterly report, which will speak to the budget and where we're

457
00:25:14,724 --> 00:25:18,584
at, and we're going to allow and again, welcome any questions that they have in

458
00:25:18,604 --> 00:25:22,084
terms of how we're doing. We're also working very hard to manage our

459
00:25:22,144 --> 00:25:25,564
finances on an ongoing basis. So like I said, it doesn't stop with the budget.

460
00:25:25,844 --> 00:25:27,324
There isn't a fan belt,

461
00:25:27,664 --> 00:25:31,574
an oil change, or anything that really

462
00:25:31,604 --> 00:25:34,344
is going by right now without me saying okay to it.

463
00:25:34,403 --> 00:25:37,284
So I'm going over everything that people want to do.

464
00:25:37,324 --> 00:25:41,064
I'm actually reviewing every invoice and every basically request for funding.

465
00:25:41,104 --> 00:25:44,544
And so we're really trying to tighten our belts and create basically what I call

466
00:25:44,564 --> 00:25:47,324
financial literacy among our staff.

467
00:25:47,364 --> 00:25:49,464
We just can't spend whatever we want any longer.

468
00:25:49,494 --> 00:25:51,104
And actually, the staff have been great about it.

469
00:25:51,184 --> 00:25:54,774
So we're really changing the way that we are spending and changing our

470
00:25:54,784 --> 00:25:56,644
accountability model for council.

471
00:25:56,964 --> 00:26:00,324
So we're also looking right now at developing financial policies.

472
00:26:00,444 --> 00:26:03,654
We are working on a procurement policy, a debt management

473
00:26:03,744 --> 00:26:07,444
policy, and a reserve policy. Three key policies we

474
00:26:07,484 --> 00:26:10,824
believe are critical to the sustainability of the municipality.

475
00:26:10,834 --> 00:26:12,544
We don't want this to ever happen again.

476
00:26:13,404 --> 00:26:15,004
So procurement, why procurement?

477
00:26:15,044 --> 00:26:18,664
To make sure that it's really understood that we have to be accountable to council

478
00:26:18,684 --> 00:26:20,784
to spend. We can't just do whatever we want.

479
00:26:20,824 --> 00:26:23,764
We have to go to council, and there's got to be checks and balances for us to be

480
00:26:23,804 --> 00:26:25,494
able to take things on from now on, right?

481
00:26:25,544 --> 00:26:27,864
And we have to do that in a very transparent way.

482
00:26:27,884 --> 00:26:31,104
And ultimately, that's also going to be very, very transparent to the public.

483
00:26:31,184 --> 00:26:33,144
So we're changing the way that we spend.

484
00:26:34,204 --> 00:26:38,104
Debt management policy, we don't want to get into debt for the challenges that we

485
00:26:38,184 --> 00:26:41,174
have today. Operating debt, absolutely not.

486
00:26:41,204 --> 00:26:44,284
To cover off imbalances in our budget, we can't do that anymore.

487
00:26:44,324 --> 00:26:48,104
So we're creating a debt management policy that will

488
00:26:48,224 --> 00:26:52,213
keep us responsible and make us basically spend in the right

489
00:26:52,244 --> 00:26:54,084
ways when it comes down to taking out debt, right?

490
00:26:54,124 --> 00:26:57,864
And I have to say, there is good debt, and I'll explain that here later on in the

491
00:26:57,884 --> 00:27:01,664
presentation. The final policy we're looking at is reserve policy.

492
00:27:01,744 --> 00:27:04,504
As I said before, we have to start putting money in the bank,

493
00:27:05,524 --> 00:27:07,964
and we have to have restrictions on it.

494
00:27:07,984 --> 00:27:11,804
And by restrictions, I mean what happened was you'd had no debt

495
00:27:11,824 --> 00:27:15,344
management policy here. It was all in basically unrestricted surplus, which

496
00:27:15,444 --> 00:27:18,824
meant it could just be spent and not really with any plan.

497
00:27:19,234 --> 00:27:22,484
We're going to change that now so that we have restrictions on how it needs to be

498
00:27:22,524 --> 00:27:25,064
spent, and if we want to change that in any way, we have to go to council.

499
00:27:26,024 --> 00:27:28,644
Let's go to council to ask them for that permission to be able to spend it.

500
00:27:28,684 --> 00:27:32,024
So again, an additional control that will help support everything.

501
00:27:32,984 --> 00:27:33,134
Now,

502
00:27:34,964 --> 00:27:37,604
what is this going to do? It's going to help restore our financial discipline.

503
00:27:38,224 --> 00:27:41,064
It's going to align our services with sustainable funding.

504
00:27:41,644 --> 00:27:43,724
It's going to help us rebuild our reserves.

505
00:27:44,444 --> 00:27:48,364
It helps reduce our financial risk and strengthens our governance

506
00:27:48,404 --> 00:27:52,104
and accountability. And so we haven't just fixed the

507
00:27:52,144 --> 00:27:56,084
budget. We're trying to fix basically the way that we do business in a very

508
00:27:56,104 --> 00:27:58,944
different way that will allow us to make sure that this never happens again.

509
00:27:59,504 --> 00:28:03,044
And I can say with great authority, we're not going to be here much longer.

510
00:28:03,884 --> 00:28:07,804
So this is something that will last the test of time for you, again, with

511
00:28:07,944 --> 00:28:11,044
other administrations that come in because the rules will be in place.

512
00:28:11,304 --> 00:28:13,684
I think that's a very important consideration.

513
00:28:13,744 --> 00:28:16,644
The budget process will be aligned to build trust and transparency.

514
00:28:16,664 --> 00:28:20,114
And here's the thing. This council was very clear with us at the very beginning,

515
00:28:21,324 --> 00:28:23,004
we want to rebuild trust with our public.

516
00:28:23,784 --> 00:28:27,754
That is absolutely key. And that means rebuilding trust between administration

517
00:28:27,884 --> 00:28:31,604
and council. We worked very hard to do that, but this is something that we want to

518
00:28:31,644 --> 00:28:32,094
make sure,

519
00:28:33,244 --> 00:28:36,444
maybe we keep having town halls, we keep inviting you to the council chambers.

520
00:28:36,904 --> 00:28:38,204
We never want to see this happen again.

521
00:28:38,234 --> 00:28:42,224
And so hopefully, the work that we're doing now will help rebuild that trust

522
00:28:42,264 --> 00:28:44,744
that was lost. That's very important, but we have to prove it.

523
00:28:45,564 --> 00:28:49,514
Building a budget is just the start, but we have to show it in the way that

524
00:28:49,524 --> 00:28:53,004
we do our work. We have to show it in the way that we actually spend the money.

525
00:28:53,024 --> 00:28:56,364
We have to show it in the way that our financial statements will be audited and

526
00:28:56,424 --> 00:28:59,984
prove it to you over time. So don't take us at our word for it.

527
00:29:00,204 --> 00:29:02,424
Take us at how our results actually come in.

528
00:29:02,544 --> 00:29:06,424
I think that's the most important part. Lots of people can get up there and talk.

529
00:29:06,464 --> 00:29:07,904
You're measured by what you can do.

530
00:29:07,944 --> 00:29:10,164
And hopefully, you'll see that over the next year.

531
00:29:11,244 --> 00:29:15,114
Move along. So looking forward, again, we're looking at

532
00:29:15,124 --> 00:29:18,424
continuing with discipline, strong leadership, and a commitment to, again, the

533
00:29:18,464 --> 00:29:22,404
direction of council. And again, we want a clear financial plan, which we

534
00:29:22,444 --> 00:29:25,144
are currently building. I will say this, our work's not done yet.

535
00:29:25,204 --> 00:29:28,614
We're getting pretty tired, but realistically, we finished a budget which was

536
00:29:28,664 --> 00:29:32,584
incredibly difficult to balance, but we're now working on, again, the

537
00:29:32,624 --> 00:29:36,364
long-term financial plan, which includes the policies, includes forecasts, and also

538
00:29:36,404 --> 00:29:40,224
includes working with our neighbors and looking at maybe a different way of

539
00:29:40,284 --> 00:29:42,314
looking at financial collaboration.

540
00:29:42,344 --> 00:29:46,184
So these things all have to be done for this place to actually be successful.

541
00:29:46,654 --> 00:29:49,384
I want to just maybe say one thing looking forward.

542
00:29:51,604 --> 00:29:54,684
Again, I do a lot of work with municipalities across Canada, and

543
00:29:55,624 --> 00:29:59,474
when I first came to Gibbons and heard about what was happening here, I was

544
00:29:59,484 --> 00:30:02,694
confused, admittedly, because this isn't a place that

545
00:30:03,424 --> 00:30:06,084
should be just surviving. It should be flourishing.

546
00:30:06,124 --> 00:30:08,744
You have a location advantage over many.

547
00:30:08,804 --> 00:30:12,344
You have a lot of business actually in

548
00:30:12,384 --> 00:30:16,094
town. You have just so many

549
00:30:16,164 --> 00:30:18,684
attributes that shows, and again, interest in development.

550
00:30:18,694 --> 00:30:21,244
There's so many attributes that shows that this town should be one of the towns

551
00:30:21,284 --> 00:30:23,124
that's succeeding. It didn't make sense.

552
00:30:23,964 --> 00:30:24,364
And so

553
00:30:25,384 --> 00:30:26,274
the work we're doing

554
00:30:27,424 --> 00:30:30,464
will get you back on track to enjoy that success, and I truly mean that.

555
00:30:30,524 --> 00:30:34,324
This town will be one of the towns that flourishes in the long term if you continue

556
00:30:34,364 --> 00:30:36,664
on this track. I do believe that. I wouldn't just say

557
00:30:36,724 --> 00:30:40,500
it.I have to say, I worked for Strathcona County

558
00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:44,400
for, God, maybe 15 years of my 30-year career.

559
00:30:45,380 --> 00:30:48,370
So I'm very, very, very versed in basically a specialized

560
00:30:48,380 --> 00:30:52,150
municipality. And so when I first saw the situation, of course, I was

561
00:30:52,180 --> 00:30:55,840
thinking, "Yeah, dissolve and become a specialized municipality." I no longer

562
00:30:55,860 --> 00:30:59,490
believe that any longer with what I've seen because of this council and because of

563
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:00,760
the community and the residents I've seen.

564
00:31:00,820 --> 00:31:01,960
I think you deserve to

565
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:06,260
have your own autonomy, and you deserve to flourish, and I believe you will.

566
00:31:06,300 --> 00:31:07,880
So I think that this plan will do that.

567
00:31:08,260 --> 00:31:10,640
So this budget demonstrated decisive action.

568
00:31:11,180 --> 00:31:13,540
And again, we're no longer reacting.

569
00:31:13,580 --> 00:31:15,640
We're being proactive in the way that we're approaching things.

570
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:19,700
So we're always looking ahead. So the budget is about balance,

571
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:23,540
but we're looking at actuals on a daily basis to make sure we're anticipating

572
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:27,270
issues, and we're looking at plans to make sure that we're looking not just beyond

573
00:31:27,280 --> 00:31:30,110
this year, but beyond the next year, the year, and the year after that.

574
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,920
So the plans we're putting together is really in a sense looking at maybe a three

575
00:31:33,980 --> 00:31:37,860
to five-year window in terms of getting us on track, where we're managing our debt

576
00:31:38,100 --> 00:31:41,640
in a reasonable position. We have money in the bank. We're seeing development.

577
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:43,600
We're seeing this place actually flourish the way it should.

578
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:48,270
Moving forward. Okay. Now here's the one I wanted to put out because there was

579
00:31:48,300 --> 00:31:50,930
lots of questions about this. This is probably the thing I've gotten the most

580
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:54,100
questions about over my time here from the budget perspective.

581
00:31:54,140 --> 00:31:55,200
What's our debt at?

582
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:57,260
So if we look there,

583
00:31:58,540 --> 00:32:01,360
if you look on the very right, you see total debt outstanding.

584
00:32:01,380 --> 00:32:04,380
$12.78 million is our total debt outstanding.

585
00:32:05,220 --> 00:32:08,880
Our total debt capacity is approximately $14, $15

586
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:09,480
million.

587
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:13,380
15.5. So we're not at the maximum of our debt capacity.

588
00:32:13,580 --> 00:32:17,520
I want to make sure we get rid of that policy. So we're at $12.7 million.

589
00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:18,970
I'll say this, as

590
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:23,690
a former financial planner for municipalities, which was half of my

591
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:23,970
career,

592
00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:26,340
you should never get to this level of debt.

593
00:32:26,450 --> 00:32:29,980
I would say to any municipality, never go beyond 75%

594
00:32:30,180 --> 00:32:33,760
maximum of your debt capacity is a good internal policy. Okay?

595
00:32:34,420 --> 00:32:36,540
Now, if you're wondering how that works,

596
00:32:37,380 --> 00:32:41,320
under the Municipal Government Act, they allow you to go to 1.5 times

597
00:32:41,420 --> 00:32:45,040
your municipal revenue. So 15 million is

598
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:48,880
basically, our revenue is about 10, so they allow us to go to 15 million

599
00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:51,900
because, again, if they figure out your revenue, what's your ability to pay the

600
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:55,800
debt, that's how they come up with the debt capacity. So we're very high.

601
00:32:56,660 --> 00:32:58,109
The alarming part about our debt, though,

602
00:32:59,300 --> 00:33:00,160
is the yellow part.

603
00:33:01,180 --> 00:33:04,160
The yellow part is basically lines of credit and operating

604
00:33:05,060 --> 00:33:08,500
debt that had been taken out to balance those budgets, like I said, that were

605
00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:11,160
imbalanced for years, and this is very what I call bad debt.

606
00:33:12,060 --> 00:33:15,970
I teach classes on this subject all the time, and I tell all of my students,

607
00:33:16,150 --> 00:33:20,040
never take out operating debt. An operating line of credit to cover off shortfalls,

608
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:23,120
small towns have to do that occasionally, but it's replenished in the same year.

609
00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:24,250
But to do this is,

610
00:33:25,140 --> 00:33:26,660
I've never seen it before, to be quite frank.

611
00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:30,660
So that debt is challenging. So that's something we got to take care of.

612
00:33:31,380 --> 00:33:35,340
The debt in the purple part, again, we had a sewer upgrade, good

613
00:33:35,380 --> 00:33:39,080
debt. That's not bad. We have the Meadows project, 39,

614
00:33:39,260 --> 00:33:40,340
$1.3 million.

615
00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:43,859
Normally okay, and I'll explain that in a few moments.

616
00:33:44,660 --> 00:33:47,860
Okay? I'll explain it in a moment. 132, motor upgrade.

617
00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:50,530
Yeah, those things happen. Motors blow. We have to take care of things.

618
00:33:51,740 --> 00:33:55,260
4.5 acre development, 3.2. This one's rough. Okay?

619
00:33:55,820 --> 00:33:59,260
That one's a rough one. And then facilities and the fire truck. Okay?

620
00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:02,630
So two things. The two key ones there that cause us issues

621
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,920
is the Meadows project and the 4.5 acre

622
00:34:06,940 --> 00:34:10,460
development because basically $5 million was put out for development,

623
00:34:11,380 --> 00:34:14,940
and without cash flow coming in to cover it, that's the kind of thing that sinks

624
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:16,540
some municipalities, and that's what happened to us.

625
00:34:16,900 --> 00:34:20,600
We put out $5 million without an assured cash flow

626
00:34:20,660 --> 00:34:23,761
coming in to cover off the payments and make sure that we get that money back

627
00:34:23,781 --> 00:34:27,640
because we didn't have a proper local improvement by-law, and we

628
00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:29,480
didn't have proper development agreements in place.

629
00:34:31,140 --> 00:34:35,060
We're working on those right now, and we have assuredness that we will be able to

630
00:34:35,100 --> 00:34:37,080
recover this money, and that's why I put recoverable under there.

631
00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:39,100
So this has been a lot of work.

632
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:41,160
We're not quite there yet.

633
00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:45,100
And again, transparently, we'll be the first ones that come to you that says that

634
00:34:45,120 --> 00:34:48,580
this may not work if it doesn't. But this is basically that money that we said

635
00:34:48,620 --> 00:34:50,361
would come in, but we put to reserve if it doesn't.

636
00:34:50,700 --> 00:34:53,261
That's where the money comes in. We're actually working to get this money back.

637
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:58,100
I have some assuredness that we will, at $1.3 million with the Meadows,

638
00:34:58,519 --> 00:34:59,940
we might see that as early as this year.

639
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:04,400
And we now have an agreement in place with the 4.5 acre development.

640
00:35:04,870 --> 00:35:08,720
We have basically an agreement in place that we might see $400,000 a

641
00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:11,060
year for the next 15 years to cover off that debt.

642
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,660
So we're getting it back. And so that was lost before we started, but it does look

643
00:35:15,720 --> 00:35:17,980
like we'll be able to recover it now. But stay tuned.

644
00:35:18,100 --> 00:35:21,970
I got to get back to you on that one because we still have a lot of work to do, or

645
00:35:21,980 --> 00:35:25,900
the people that follow us will have a lot of work to do on that one. So moving on.

646
00:35:25,980 --> 00:35:27,060
Underneath, what you'll see there

647
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:32,280
is the payments. People have asked me about this. We are paying the debt off.

648
00:35:32,340 --> 00:35:35,100
So this is in the budget right now. We are paying on the operating side

649
00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:38,880
$500,000 a year. So by the end

650
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:42,280
of after three years, we are paying down 2 million of that

651
00:35:42,620 --> 00:35:46,380
5.8. And capital, we're paying off, again,

652
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:50,460
$274,000 in payments in '26, and then 126 every year

653
00:35:50,580 --> 00:35:54,200
after. Now, that's $2.6 million in debt repayment.

654
00:35:55,010 --> 00:35:57,770
That said, if we recover those funds,

655
00:35:59,300 --> 00:36:02,260
we'll likely put that towards debt repayment as well.

656
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:05,340
So we're saying this is kind of the minimum amount we're going to pay off.

657
00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:09,000
So we are paying things off. We're actually going to be aggressive in our debt

658
00:36:09,060 --> 00:36:09,520
payments

659
00:36:10,340 --> 00:36:13,740
if we receive the money from those developments, which we're really aggressively

660
00:36:13,780 --> 00:36:16,620
pursuing right now. So again, a good, strong debt management plan.

661
00:36:16,900 --> 00:36:18,970
I'll say this, after about three to four years,

662
00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:23,800
we will be within what would be considered a best practice debt limit, and you'll

663
00:36:23,820 --> 00:36:27,240
be fine. So we have a plan, and we do believe it'll work out. Okay?

664
00:36:27,980 --> 00:36:30,200
So that's our debt situation. Moving on.

665
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:34,470
I'm just going to leave you with this one before we ask some questions, we get into

666
00:36:34,500 --> 00:36:38,440
services. So this is something, again, as a bit of

667
00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:38,600
a

668
00:36:39,460 --> 00:36:41,600
person who often people call me

669
00:36:43,060 --> 00:36:46,788
basically the budget, I don't knowI love

670
00:36:46,798 --> 00:36:50,478
municipal government. And so this is a slide I created many years ago when I was

671
00:36:50,488 --> 00:36:54,088
presenting budgets, and this slide is used all across Alberta now

672
00:36:54,108 --> 00:36:57,908
by people taking my classes. But essentially, an average property

673
00:36:57,968 --> 00:37:01,638
in Gibbons of $396,000 is equivalent to about

674
00:37:01,688 --> 00:37:03,888
$279 a month in terms of your taxes.

675
00:37:05,728 --> 00:37:09,708
The 8.2% tax on increase is equal to about $283 a year or

676
00:37:09,718 --> 00:37:13,648
$24 a month over and above. So if I look at

677
00:37:13,688 --> 00:37:16,268
that total of $279 a month, what do I get?

678
00:37:16,968 --> 00:37:17,708
Each and every day

679
00:37:18,668 --> 00:37:19,908
I get snow removal,

680
00:37:20,808 --> 00:37:24,628
playgrounds. When I go to sleep at night, I'm being kept safe by our fire

681
00:37:24,668 --> 00:37:28,418
department. I wake up in the morning, I walk on a sidewalk that's been maintained

682
00:37:28,448 --> 00:37:32,148
by our public works department. I drive on a road that we've actually filled the

683
00:37:32,168 --> 00:37:35,348
potholes on. My kids go into the hockey rink.

684
00:37:35,608 --> 00:37:39,288
I was a hockey dad. I loved chasing my kid all around Alberta.

685
00:37:39,988 --> 00:37:42,588
So I love that part and doing those things. We make a lot of memories.

686
00:37:42,608 --> 00:37:45,048
There's a lot that you get for that $279 a month.

687
00:37:45,628 --> 00:37:49,518
And I often sit there across the kitchen table with

688
00:37:49,528 --> 00:37:52,868
my son as he's texting me, even though he shouldn't be because I'm right across

689
00:37:52,888 --> 00:37:56,768
from him. We pay more for this a month, our phones, than we do

690
00:37:56,808 --> 00:37:59,048
for all the things that we get for our property taxes in a month.

691
00:37:59,068 --> 00:38:01,668
And I know we think of a tax

692
00:38:02,788 --> 00:38:05,148
as something that we get nothing for, but we get a lot.

693
00:38:05,388 --> 00:38:08,328
And again, I hope that you would agree with that. And we get a lot in Gibbons.

694
00:38:08,408 --> 00:38:12,278
Gibbons is a special place. So I really believe in the taxes that we pay for,

695
00:38:12,648 --> 00:38:13,528
and I think comparatively,

696
00:38:14,608 --> 00:38:15,548
we get a lot

697
00:38:16,648 --> 00:38:20,428
of bang for our buck. So that said, okay, next one.

698
00:38:21,228 --> 00:38:24,228
That's just our balanced budget. If everybody wants to go through the details and

699
00:38:24,268 --> 00:38:25,888
ask me any questions, you certainly can.

700
00:38:26,768 --> 00:38:29,368
We will be posting this presentation online, so you'll all have it.

701
00:38:30,008 --> 00:38:30,908
And then next slide.

702
00:38:32,008 --> 00:38:35,188
So that's it for the budget. I've got service level changes, but I want to stop

703
00:38:35,208 --> 00:38:37,628
here because, again, we want to hear from you and we want to hear from council.

704
00:38:37,688 --> 00:38:39,748
So I'm going to open up the floor to questions.

705
00:38:45,728 --> 00:38:49,588
Wait, could you go back to the principal payment screen

706
00:38:49,608 --> 00:38:52,788
and tell us which of those have deferred interest payments

707
00:38:53,428 --> 00:38:56,367
or if there's any possible no interest payments?

708
00:38:58,148 --> 00:39:00,468
Sorry, can you say that again real quick for me?

709
00:39:03,188 --> 00:39:07,048
Can you go back to the budget slide and tell us where it says principal

710
00:39:07,068 --> 00:39:10,508
payments, are any of those interest

711
00:39:10,708 --> 00:39:14,608
deferred or no interest? And if not, what is

712
00:39:14,648 --> 00:39:16,228
the interest rates?

713
00:39:16,568 --> 00:39:17,328
All these are

714
00:39:18,388 --> 00:39:19,608
just straight principal repayments.

715
00:39:19,708 --> 00:39:23,648
I don't have anything built in the forecast as of yet for the interest-only

716
00:39:23,688 --> 00:39:27,468
portions. The principal, I don't have a breakout right now for

717
00:39:27,548 --> 00:39:31,418
anything regarding that principal section, so I can't break any of those

718
00:39:31,428 --> 00:39:34,988
sections out, but all these are just straight. This is principal repayments.

719
00:39:35,288 --> 00:39:39,118
There's no interest on any of these payments in this

720
00:39:39,148 --> 00:39:41,348
table. The interest is separate of these amounts.

721
00:39:42,188 --> 00:39:45,748
So these numbers are straight principal payments

722
00:39:47,148 --> 00:39:47,668
in the table.

723
00:39:47,798 --> 00:39:47,978
There's something

724
00:39:48,888 --> 00:39:49,368
Pardon?

725
00:39:50,528 --> 00:39:51,368
There's something

726
00:39:52,458 --> 00:39:56,328
No, we pay interest still on all of them. Yeah. We just haven't detailed anything.

727
00:39:56,368 --> 00:39:58,168
We're talking about the principal in this one here-

728
00:39:58,658 --> 00:39:58,658
Okay

729
00:39:58,658 --> 00:39:59,828
... specifically.

730
00:40:01,928 --> 00:40:02,288
Go ahead.

731
00:40:03,128 --> 00:40:04,967
I don't think it's working. Call it on here.

732
00:40:05,188 --> 00:40:08,248
So was there any deferred interest?

733
00:40:08,408 --> 00:40:10,308
I remember hearing talk of that before.

734
00:40:11,148 --> 00:40:15,088
No. No deferred interest. We have deferred principal on all the

735
00:40:15,188 --> 00:40:17,848
blue ACFA loans. It should be LTLA now.

736
00:40:18,268 --> 00:40:22,088
But all of those loans, we did a deferred principal

737
00:40:22,098 --> 00:40:26,088
portion that was repaid. So the principal gets reintroduced

738
00:40:26,128 --> 00:40:28,368
starting in 2029 for that one.

739
00:40:28,388 --> 00:40:29,108
Okay. Thank you.

740
00:40:31,488 --> 00:40:31,497
Yeah.

741
00:40:32,708 --> 00:40:33,048
Okay.

742
00:40:34,088 --> 00:40:37,428
My name is Daniel Ferrer. A lot of you people that were here know that

743
00:40:38,028 --> 00:40:41,888
back in 2023, I ran for council, and I figure

744
00:40:42,008 --> 00:40:45,928
that I'm not going to recriminate or put blame

745
00:40:45,988 --> 00:40:48,437
on anybody, past councils and that.

746
00:40:48,568 --> 00:40:50,368
I guess the saying goes, it is what it is.

747
00:40:50,688 --> 00:40:51,588
My concern

748
00:40:52,668 --> 00:40:56,448
is that I bought my house in November of 2004.

749
00:40:57,668 --> 00:41:00,588
So that would be 22 years this November.

750
00:41:00,648 --> 00:41:01,908
And since that time,

751
00:41:03,048 --> 00:41:06,408
I have seen nothing but an increase

752
00:41:07,008 --> 00:41:10,748
in our tax base. Everything that we get from

753
00:41:10,808 --> 00:41:14,688
this town has so far been an

754
00:41:14,788 --> 00:41:18,738
increase. The cost of garbage pickup, which we have to

755
00:41:18,788 --> 00:41:21,998
roll over from GFL or whoever, has increased.

756
00:41:22,288 --> 00:41:26,028
Water increased. Everything is increasing except for one

757
00:41:26,068 --> 00:41:28,168
thing that I've noticed, service.

758
00:41:29,148 --> 00:41:32,588
So my main concern is it's going to cost me

759
00:41:32,628 --> 00:41:36,028
approximately $6,500 this year in

760
00:41:36,068 --> 00:41:39,948
taxes just for the municipal tax coming from the

761
00:41:39,988 --> 00:41:40,348
town.

762
00:41:41,648 --> 00:41:42,008
Okay?

763
00:41:43,388 --> 00:41:46,618
On top of everything else, I know that the town does

764
00:41:46,768 --> 00:41:50,658
not have any control over what

765
00:41:50,688 --> 00:41:54,528
the province deems as the equitable value in your home,

766
00:41:55,108 --> 00:41:58,768
the tax base. But what my concern is, and my

767
00:41:58,848 --> 00:42:02,768
question for everybody here is, I'm hearing layoffs,

768
00:42:03,388 --> 00:42:06,688
I'm hearing reductions, I'm hearing everything else,

769
00:42:07,668 --> 00:42:11,298
but I live in a cul-de-sac, and when I see in the

770
00:42:11,328 --> 00:42:15,148
wintertime that there is a buildup in

771
00:42:15,208 --> 00:42:18,828
the gutters on the sidewalk to the street on 40th

772
00:42:18,928 --> 00:42:19,368
Avenue,

773
00:42:20,208 --> 00:42:22,328
that is a one and a half feet tall,

774
00:42:23,208 --> 00:42:27,188
and when they come in to plow, they refuse to knock that down.

775
00:42:28,248 --> 00:42:30,808
I am 77 years old,

776
00:42:32,468 --> 00:42:35,668
and I wound up with a sprained bad wrist

777
00:42:35,848 --> 00:42:39,288
starting because in order to not be

778
00:42:39,408 --> 00:42:43,008
charged again by the courts and

779
00:42:43,048 --> 00:42:46,248
everything when somebody walks past my house

780
00:42:46,908 --> 00:42:50,196
on the sidewalkAnd they slip and fall

781
00:42:50,236 --> 00:42:53,756
because the sidewalks are not perfectly level.

782
00:42:53,766 --> 00:42:56,276
We get pooling of water. That's one issue.

783
00:42:56,836 --> 00:43:00,676
Right now, we get kids out playing with these little step-on

784
00:43:00,736 --> 00:43:01,576
scooter things.

785
00:43:02,576 --> 00:43:06,476
I don't see any clearing of the streets

786
00:43:07,016 --> 00:43:10,056
going on in Gibbons. Maybe there is, but I don't see it.

787
00:43:10,716 --> 00:43:14,296
So all I can see is, coming from here, what kind of a

788
00:43:14,376 --> 00:43:18,296
guarantee are you, Mr. Miller, and you folks up there, going to

789
00:43:18,376 --> 00:43:18,896
give us

790
00:43:20,096 --> 00:43:23,816
that the services you're talking about are going to wind up

791
00:43:24,576 --> 00:43:25,756
null, zero?

792
00:43:27,316 --> 00:43:31,056
Because right now, we're so close to it, it isn't funny. Thank you.

793
00:43:32,096 --> 00:43:32,836
Thank you. I'm

794
00:43:34,676 --> 00:43:37,876
trying to look for Mr. Miller. My name is Mr. Duhamel, by the way.

795
00:43:38,356 --> 00:43:39,196
No problem at all, sir.

796
00:43:40,696 --> 00:43:44,376
I actually appreciate your question, and it's one that I've heard many

797
00:43:44,436 --> 00:43:47,026
times, and I understand. I'm a taxpayer too.

798
00:43:48,496 --> 00:43:52,256
The one thing I can assure you is that every municipality across Alberta has

799
00:43:52,276 --> 00:43:55,086
probably got the same type of tax increases we've had.

800
00:43:55,656 --> 00:43:58,946
As I mentioned before, the one thing that kills municipalities is inflation.

801
00:43:59,536 --> 00:44:03,106
Fuel costs us more, labor costs us more, contract services cost us more.

802
00:44:03,556 --> 00:44:07,376
So as I said earlier in the presentation, we have no choice but to pass those costs

803
00:44:07,396 --> 00:44:09,376
through to our taxpayers. If we don't,

804
00:44:10,396 --> 00:44:14,356
with normalized tax increases, what happens is you eventually hit what we

805
00:44:14,416 --> 00:44:18,016
call our service wall, and we either have to decrease services or we have to do

806
00:44:18,056 --> 00:44:21,216
what this place did and take out operating loans to cover off our services.

807
00:44:21,716 --> 00:44:21,896
So

808
00:44:22,716 --> 00:44:26,136
we go through a process, which is a very transparent process with councils, and

809
00:44:26,196 --> 00:44:29,356
again, they're your representatives, and they put the heat on us, this

810
00:44:29,376 --> 00:44:33,156
administration, with tax increases, and we try to do our best

811
00:44:33,216 --> 00:44:36,156
to pass on what we consider reasonable. I understand, though.

812
00:44:36,936 --> 00:44:39,696
But the fact of municipal government is that they're always going to be increasing

813
00:44:39,716 --> 00:44:41,516
because we're always faced with cost increases.

814
00:44:41,816 --> 00:44:42,646
I'm not arguing about tax increases.

815
00:44:42,776 --> 00:44:42,956
Yeah.

816
00:44:44,936 --> 00:44:46,296
I'm willing to pay my share.

817
00:44:46,536 --> 00:44:46,566
I know.

818
00:44:46,566 --> 00:44:47,396
I'm arguing about the lack of service.

819
00:44:47,476 --> 00:44:47,716
Okay.

820
00:44:47,776 --> 00:44:48,166
For the taxes we're paying.

821
00:44:48,236 --> 00:44:50,956
So from that perspective, I will say,

822
00:44:51,256 --> 00:44:53,836
I'm not necessarily in disagreement.

823
00:44:54,936 --> 00:44:58,666
We had one thing, I will, just to maybe give us a bit of a break, probably one of

824
00:44:58,676 --> 00:45:01,996
the most difficult snow clearing years on record.

825
00:45:02,016 --> 00:45:04,725
It seems every time I get one of these jobs, it's like the worst snow year that

826
00:45:04,796 --> 00:45:08,456
happens. I think it's because snow follows me around. We had a difficult year.

827
00:45:08,476 --> 00:45:12,125
But could we have done better? Yes. Yep. I will say that. We could do better.

828
00:45:12,136 --> 00:45:15,926
And one of the things that we've talked about as a team is performance management,

829
00:45:16,076 --> 00:45:18,076
performance appraisals, better training.

830
00:45:18,096 --> 00:45:19,226
We have

831
00:45:20,136 --> 00:45:24,036
a great public works team that we are now training three people on the grader,

832
00:45:24,046 --> 00:45:26,926
driving around in our yard right now, because we only had one person who knew how

833
00:45:26,936 --> 00:45:30,386
to drive the grader last year. We now have three people that are in training, and

834
00:45:30,396 --> 00:45:34,216
we have a company that came in on contract services that's agreed to train our

835
00:45:34,296 --> 00:45:36,296
staff on the graders. We're trying to get better.

836
00:45:36,896 --> 00:45:40,836
So I don't disagree. We're working at it, and we are

837
00:45:40,876 --> 00:45:42,856
committed to getting better as a team.

838
00:45:42,956 --> 00:45:44,396
But again, I think we have the right people here.

839
00:45:44,556 --> 00:45:45,625
Our staff are very committed,

840
00:45:46,536 --> 00:45:47,476
and they're willing to be trained.

841
00:45:47,536 --> 00:45:50,896
They've said it to me themselves, "We just never had anybody really push us

842
00:45:50,916 --> 00:45:53,226
before." So they're trying. So we'll

843
00:45:54,116 --> 00:45:58,076
do our best. Come to see me next year or call me next year and let me know

844
00:45:58,096 --> 00:46:00,776
if things improve, because we're sure going to try, sir, I promise you that. Okay?

845
00:46:01,516 --> 00:46:01,836
Thank you.

846
00:46:02,976 --> 00:46:06,176
Hi, my name is Dennis Mitchell. I've been a resident of Gibbons since

847
00:46:06,216 --> 00:46:07,166
1980.

848
00:46:08,496 --> 00:46:12,276
I have a couple questions. First off, which area is The Meadows?

849
00:46:13,876 --> 00:46:14,756
Just off Lynden.

850
00:46:15,196 --> 00:46:15,776
Oh, you guys go.

851
00:46:16,056 --> 00:46:17,416
It's just off Lynden Drive.

852
00:46:18,076 --> 00:46:19,136
Just off Lynden Drive.

853
00:46:19,486 --> 00:46:19,486
Yep.

854
00:46:19,536 --> 00:46:23,416
Okay. What's that new area called that Landrex is trying to

855
00:46:23,436 --> 00:46:23,896
develop?

856
00:46:25,616 --> 00:46:26,096
Riverside.

857
00:46:26,426 --> 00:46:26,426
Riverside.

858
00:46:26,476 --> 00:46:27,216
That's Riverside?

859
00:46:28,366 --> 00:46:28,756
Riverview. Yeah.

860
00:46:28,836 --> 00:46:30,176
Riverview.

861
00:46:30,216 --> 00:46:34,156
Riverview. We got two Riverview area plans from what I heard

862
00:46:34,196 --> 00:46:34,456
from the last-

863
00:46:34,476 --> 00:46:35,696
Yeah, there's two ASPs.

864
00:46:36,256 --> 00:46:36,396
Yeah.

865
00:46:36,436 --> 00:46:36,606
Right.

866
00:46:37,076 --> 00:46:38,216
Two possibilities.

867
00:46:38,576 --> 00:46:38,706
Yeah.

868
00:46:38,756 --> 00:46:42,616
Okay? One of them says we're going to have 57 homes

869
00:46:42,676 --> 00:46:45,136
in that area, under one plan.

870
00:46:45,376 --> 00:46:45,456
Yep.

871
00:46:45,676 --> 00:46:49,356
The next area says we're going to have 337

872
00:46:49,416 --> 00:46:51,476
separate residences in that area.

873
00:46:51,546 --> 00:46:51,845
That's the other one.

874
00:46:51,876 --> 00:46:55,716
Now, just a second here. You got 337

875
00:46:55,796 --> 00:46:58,896
separate residents going into that area.

876
00:46:58,956 --> 00:47:01,496
You got one road coming in, one road going out.

877
00:47:01,936 --> 00:47:05,736
51st Street is a freeway. The road coming in and out of that area is going to be

878
00:47:05,776 --> 00:47:08,256
another freeway. Why don't we join them at the end?

879
00:47:09,236 --> 00:47:13,156
Landrex is going to put that area and build it. Okay?

880
00:47:13,536 --> 00:47:17,116
They're going to put an emergency exit for emergency use

881
00:47:17,296 --> 00:47:21,096
only if there is a problem, if there is an emergency.

882
00:47:21,556 --> 00:47:24,976
You ever try and get 337 separate

883
00:47:25,076 --> 00:47:27,276
families out of one road,

884
00:47:28,576 --> 00:47:31,936
driving any type of vehicle that can possibly exist?

885
00:47:32,936 --> 00:47:35,526
Jasper burned. Fort McMurray burned.

886
00:47:35,716 --> 00:47:37,396
They're going to evacuate Whitecourt.

887
00:47:37,856 --> 00:47:41,596
If Landrex doesn't put a level crossing, a

888
00:47:41,676 --> 00:47:45,496
legal level crossing that can go in and out of both ends of

889
00:47:45,556 --> 00:47:49,176
that thing, we're going to end up with problems because we got dirt bikes going

890
00:47:49,196 --> 00:47:52,985
through there and all kinds of public utility, and through

891
00:47:52,985 --> 00:47:53,656
that area.

892
00:47:54,576 --> 00:47:57,256
I drove a 40-foot vehicle for 40 years.

893
00:47:57,596 --> 00:48:01,186
You try and maneuver that in there, get a fire truck in there when

894
00:48:01,236 --> 00:48:03,816
everybody's trying to get out. Good luck trying.

895
00:48:05,276 --> 00:48:09,136
Realistically speaking, it doesn't work, and if

896
00:48:09,156 --> 00:48:13,056
we're going to let them go ahead and do that, then we need our heads

897
00:48:13,096 --> 00:48:13,656
examined.

898
00:48:14,556 --> 00:48:18,436
As far as your training goes, for three years, I argued

899
00:48:18,476 --> 00:48:20,856
with Eric Lowe that water goes downhill.

900
00:48:22,736 --> 00:48:26,556
Okay? And that comes from a little incident that happened in my back

901
00:48:26,656 --> 00:48:30,026
alley. Where on 51st Street, there is

902
00:48:30,116 --> 00:48:33,596
only two catch basins, both on the 51st Street

903
00:48:34,196 --> 00:48:37,856
section. There is no catch basins going all the way down to

904
00:48:38,036 --> 00:48:41,396
44th and around Poplar Drive. Just the two.

905
00:48:42,916 --> 00:48:46,636
And Eric had the grader going down, and the back

906
00:48:46,676 --> 00:48:48,496
alley was graded like a country road.

907
00:48:49,336 --> 00:48:53,236
Well, if you lived on the west side of the back alley, you got a

908
00:48:53,296 --> 00:48:57,004
lakeThey cut down my next-door neighbor's

909
00:48:57,144 --> 00:48:57,424
part

910
00:48:58,284 --> 00:49:00,364
behind his driveway, seven inches.

911
00:49:02,164 --> 00:49:06,004
They ran into some concrete behind my yard and bent

912
00:49:06,044 --> 00:49:09,524
my fence, and I made a special deal with Eric and the town

913
00:49:09,644 --> 00:49:13,634
council that I wouldn't ask them to replace my fence and

914
00:49:13,704 --> 00:49:17,144
straighten it all out if they would grade the alley properly.

915
00:49:17,224 --> 00:49:19,844
Now you want me to wait another year, so it's going to be four years?

916
00:49:21,124 --> 00:49:24,844
All you got to do is to blade that way, and the water is going downhill.

917
00:49:26,744 --> 00:49:26,834
Okay.

918
00:49:28,324 --> 00:49:29,674
Council, do you want to answer these questions?

919
00:49:29,764 --> 00:49:32,804
I do have some answers, but I'll let council speak, and then I'll jump in.

920
00:49:33,964 --> 00:49:37,694
I think there's a little bit of confusion with regard to the Landrex development.

921
00:49:37,694 --> 00:49:39,884
Excuse me. I can't hear you.

922
00:49:40,204 --> 00:49:43,864
Speak louder. Can't hear very

923
00:49:44,464 --> 00:49:44,474
well.

924
00:49:45,564 --> 00:49:45,784
Good?

925
00:49:46,404 --> 00:49:46,784
That's better.

926
00:49:48,444 --> 00:49:51,164
Okay. The first mic wasn't on, so I apologize, sir.

927
00:49:51,724 --> 00:49:55,124
I think there's a little bit of confusion, because I shared it with you,

928
00:49:55,644 --> 00:49:57,584
with regard to the Landrex development.

929
00:49:57,974 --> 00:50:01,864
The first one that was approved, and Tim, you might be able to

930
00:50:01,904 --> 00:50:05,684
remind me of the year it was approved, 2012,

931
00:50:05,694 --> 00:50:05,914
'17-ish.

932
00:50:05,944 --> 00:50:07,223
Something. Yeah, it was something. It's a little while.

933
00:50:07,244 --> 00:50:10,604
A while ago, was the property that was over

934
00:50:10,644 --> 00:50:14,344
300-plus units. The development that they

935
00:50:14,404 --> 00:50:18,124
gave the open house to on, I've lost track of time,

936
00:50:18,304 --> 00:50:18,704
Tuesday,

937
00:50:20,204 --> 00:50:22,674
is 57 units. So it's

938
00:50:24,044 --> 00:50:27,704
a significant reduction. So just wanted to be clear with

939
00:50:27,764 --> 00:50:28,544
regard to that.

940
00:50:30,024 --> 00:50:33,824
So it's not the 300 individual homes that

941
00:50:33,864 --> 00:50:37,814
are now going into that area. There's absolutely sure, possibly

942
00:50:38,064 --> 00:50:41,874
some additional concerns, but I just wanted to qualify as far as that

943
00:50:41,924 --> 00:50:42,554
is concerned.

944
00:50:42,994 --> 00:50:42,994
Oh, okay.

945
00:50:43,504 --> 00:50:46,684
I also wanted to amplify something that the

946
00:50:46,704 --> 00:50:49,924
administration team has very much taken on.

947
00:50:51,844 --> 00:50:52,834
There were some challenges,

948
00:50:53,684 --> 00:50:57,324
agreed, within public works, and the training

949
00:50:57,364 --> 00:51:00,184
portion was what was definitely lacking.

950
00:51:00,944 --> 00:51:03,943
And sir, you're absolutely correct. Water does run downhill.

951
00:51:04,244 --> 00:51:04,524
Yeah.

952
00:51:05,204 --> 00:51:05,383
So

953
00:51:06,364 --> 00:51:10,233
I do truly, within my heart, believe that

954
00:51:10,284 --> 00:51:14,184
we need to give them time to take the individuals who are

955
00:51:14,224 --> 00:51:18,024
working there, who are remaining working there, who are all very, very

956
00:51:18,104 --> 00:51:21,804
strong, and let them have the opportunity to have their training and development

957
00:51:22,724 --> 00:51:26,104
moving forward. So I completely understand.

958
00:51:26,404 --> 00:51:30,304
It looks like it's probably going to be another year, but hopefully

959
00:51:30,344 --> 00:51:31,264
with resolution for you.

960
00:51:31,284 --> 00:51:34,444
Okay. I have no problem with that at all. We're getting training.

961
00:51:35,064 --> 00:51:38,904
The last thing I understand about the Landrex, and this came

962
00:51:38,964 --> 00:51:42,604
from the mouth of a previous councilor, that when Landrex was

963
00:51:42,644 --> 00:51:46,584
proposing that area, there was going to be an animal rescue

964
00:51:46,684 --> 00:51:47,564
place put in there.

965
00:51:49,484 --> 00:51:52,124
They were going to put that in as a donation.

966
00:51:52,164 --> 00:51:55,464
There was going to be a rehab center for

967
00:51:56,704 --> 00:52:00,104
disabled veterans. And the third thing was going to

968
00:52:00,224 --> 00:52:04,144
be what I believe was referred to as a Boys

969
00:52:04,184 --> 00:52:07,964
& Girls Club down in that area. We have

970
00:52:08,024 --> 00:52:11,793
the area here for that. Now, if it's a Boys & Girls

971
00:52:11,884 --> 00:52:15,844
Club, is it not, I understood it to be from the previous

972
00:52:15,904 --> 00:52:19,804
councilor, it was going to be a rehab center for

973
00:52:19,964 --> 00:52:23,664
indigenous and troubled youth. We have a center for

974
00:52:23,764 --> 00:52:26,784
that or in that area in Bon Accord,

975
00:52:27,584 --> 00:52:30,944
just south in Bon Accord.

976
00:52:31,564 --> 00:52:35,304
And if we're going to put that, and we've cut down on policing budget,

977
00:52:36,484 --> 00:52:38,164
now who's going to protect us?

978
00:52:39,664 --> 00:52:43,464
I don't want to have to sit out in my backyard with a shotgun to make sure that

979
00:52:43,504 --> 00:52:47,474
nobody's stealing anything out of my yard because some of

980
00:52:47,484 --> 00:52:49,904
the troubled youth are helping themselves to things.

981
00:52:51,644 --> 00:52:55,464
If we're going to have a center for indigenous and troubled youth or any

982
00:52:55,584 --> 00:52:59,404
kind of troubled youth, put it over in Morinville, where

983
00:52:59,464 --> 00:53:03,414
they're close to the RCMP, because we've budgeted to cut down

984
00:53:03,484 --> 00:53:06,764
on patrol services. We can't take care of it.

985
00:53:10,644 --> 00:53:11,044
Excuse me.

986
00:53:12,024 --> 00:53:15,464
What I can say about the Landrex deal and what might be going over

987
00:53:16,404 --> 00:53:20,274
in the donation lands they're giving, they talked about.

988
00:53:21,424 --> 00:53:22,314
What they had indicated,

989
00:53:23,364 --> 00:53:25,324
that was just suggestions at this point.

990
00:53:25,364 --> 00:53:29,014
There was nothing in black and white that says it will be an animal shelter,

991
00:53:29,364 --> 00:53:33,114
or it will be a rehab center. Those are just suggestions of what might

992
00:53:33,304 --> 00:53:37,004
go in there. And we still have to approve it.

993
00:53:37,164 --> 00:53:37,504
Okay.

994
00:53:37,564 --> 00:53:40,764
So it's not in black and white to exactly-

995
00:53:40,784 --> 00:53:40,804
Well-

996
00:53:40,814 --> 00:53:41,474
... what's going in there.

997
00:53:41,684 --> 00:53:41,944
Okay.

998
00:53:42,024 --> 00:53:45,824
And just for a point of clarification, it's only the

999
00:53:46,024 --> 00:53:49,464
budget or the bylaw that has been

1000
00:53:49,504 --> 00:53:53,264
reduced. RCMP, that has

1001
00:53:53,344 --> 00:53:56,164
not changed the level of RCMP coverage we have here.

1002
00:53:57,244 --> 00:53:59,364
Okay. Thank you very much. Yes.

1003
00:54:00,364 --> 00:54:01,264
I'd like to speak,

1004
00:54:02,344 --> 00:54:03,474
give you a bit of an answer there, too.

1005
00:54:03,964 --> 00:54:07,624
Regarding your concerns with what may or may not be going in there,

1006
00:54:09,064 --> 00:54:09,504
we don't

1007
00:54:10,524 --> 00:54:13,944
necessarily agree with what's been

1008
00:54:13,984 --> 00:54:17,764
proposed. So we are going to work hard to make sure

1009
00:54:18,484 --> 00:54:21,734
if this goes through, that everything is done correctly,

1010
00:54:23,224 --> 00:54:27,044
and we hear your voices with what you guys do want and what you don't

1011
00:54:27,124 --> 00:54:30,984
want. So I just wanted to let you know that, yeah, we don't share

1012
00:54:31,024 --> 00:54:34,624
that vision necessarily, and we want to hear from you

1013
00:54:34,664 --> 00:54:38,524
to have a control and have a say with what does and what doesn't go in there, for

1014
00:54:38,584 --> 00:54:38,724
sure.

1015
00:54:38,784 --> 00:54:41,653
No, I thought some of these things need to be brought up now because-

1016
00:54:41,884 --> 00:54:41,984
Yeah

1017
00:54:41,994 --> 00:54:45,904
... from what I got was spoken to me in all truth and

1018
00:54:45,964 --> 00:54:46,364
honesty.

1019
00:54:46,544 --> 00:54:46,724
Yep.

1020
00:54:46,804 --> 00:54:50,604
So I think everybody else should know that that was possibly one of the

1021
00:54:50,624 --> 00:54:53,754
proposals, and if you fall asleep and

1022
00:54:55,224 --> 00:54:55,403
let

1023
00:54:56,100 --> 00:54:59,740
The council be led down which other path is

1024
00:54:59,820 --> 00:55:03,200
done, or they've been taken, or they've been

1025
00:55:03,280 --> 00:55:04,610
coerced into taking,

1026
00:55:05,660 --> 00:55:05,880
then

1027
00:55:07,160 --> 00:55:10,300
we become victims of our own undoing.

1028
00:55:10,500 --> 00:55:11,700
Yeah.

1029
00:55:12,100 --> 00:55:14,260
I think all development was so strong.

1030
00:55:14,360 --> 00:55:18,260
Last meeting we had, there was no future development going on, so why

1031
00:55:18,270 --> 00:55:18,520
are

1032
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:19,930
we even talking about a-

1033
00:55:19,960 --> 00:55:20,480
We can talk-

1034
00:55:20,620 --> 00:55:20,800
Yeah,

1035
00:55:21,640 --> 00:55:22,710
why we're there and everything else.

1036
00:55:22,720 --> 00:55:23,010
That's not-

1037
00:55:23,040 --> 00:55:26,220
We said no future development that cost this town any money.

1038
00:55:27,460 --> 00:55:31,420
So any development going forward, 100% ironclad is in

1039
00:55:31,460 --> 00:55:34,580
development agreements. We don't put out a dime. That's what we said.

1040
00:55:35,160 --> 00:55:35,320
Yeah.

1041
00:55:36,480 --> 00:55:37,320
Then we might get-

1042
00:55:37,400 --> 00:55:40,580
Any development that happens in the future in this town

1043
00:55:41,480 --> 00:55:42,260
is not going to be left out-

1044
00:55:42,460 --> 00:55:46,240
Sir, if you don't mind, sir, I think if you could get in line, that'd be great.

1045
00:55:46,280 --> 00:55:47,180
Thank you.

1046
00:55:47,260 --> 00:55:48,910
I'm in line. Thank you.

1047
00:55:48,910 --> 00:55:49,460
Thank you very much.

1048
00:55:50,140 --> 00:55:50,360
Sorry.

1049
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:51,610
Sorry. Go ahead.

1050
00:55:51,660 --> 00:55:52,590
I just wanted to add that-

1051
00:55:52,600 --> 00:55:53,140
Just before you leave.

1052
00:55:53,940 --> 00:55:54,200
Oh.

1053
00:55:54,700 --> 00:55:54,900
Thanks.

1054
00:55:55,720 --> 00:55:58,120
With regard to the secondary access,

1055
00:55:59,100 --> 00:56:02,860
we're all very big on that, and it's very important not just in that area but also

1056
00:56:02,900 --> 00:56:06,800
in the south end of town. One of the biggest obstacles we have with a

1057
00:56:06,840 --> 00:56:10,770
secondary access that's a full-time access is getting permission from

1058
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:13,740
CN Rail since it is crossing their rail line.

1059
00:56:14,240 --> 00:56:15,920
So are we trying right now to get it?

1060
00:56:16,820 --> 00:56:17,000
Yes.

1061
00:56:19,080 --> 00:56:22,440
Good. Let's not try and get it after we get the community in. We're trying.

1062
00:56:23,230 --> 00:56:24,280
This council's pretty diligent-

1063
00:56:24,460 --> 00:56:24,490
Lessons were learned

1064
00:56:24,490 --> 00:56:25,140
... about good development.

1065
00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:29,990
The one thing I would like to say, maybe this will help everybody a bit, is,

1066
00:56:30,220 --> 00:56:31,820
again, I've been doing this for a long time.

1067
00:56:31,840 --> 00:56:35,070
If I had a dollar for every fancy drawing I saw from a developer that said they're

1068
00:56:35,080 --> 00:56:38,220
going to build us a new spray park or a fancy dog park or

1069
00:56:39,220 --> 00:56:41,860
a nature center or whatever it might be, I'd be very rich.

1070
00:56:41,900 --> 00:56:45,020
The reality of development is that they actually, under development agreements,

1071
00:56:45,160 --> 00:56:49,040
have to give approximately 10% of the land to what's called municipal

1072
00:56:49,080 --> 00:56:52,660
reserve. Basically, a playground or a park or whatever.

1073
00:56:52,820 --> 00:56:55,560
They're obligated. So they're not doing us any favors, guys.

1074
00:56:55,600 --> 00:56:58,530
So if you think, again, it's a typical thing that developers do. It's okay.

1075
00:56:59,080 --> 00:57:02,020
We'll probably get a park with some trees and everything else, so lower the

1076
00:57:02,080 --> 00:57:04,620
expectations. But we're going to protect ourselves.

1077
00:57:04,780 --> 00:57:07,280
It's just the normal things that we see in development.

1078
00:57:08,140 --> 00:57:11,740
We're going to do things right, but the reality is I wouldn't depend on all those

1079
00:57:11,760 --> 00:57:14,710
things, and nor, it's just part of the development business.

1080
00:57:15,460 --> 00:57:18,389
But we're going to protect ourselves in terms of basically making sure that

1081
00:57:18,420 --> 00:57:22,180
development is done at no cost to this town, and they'll give us the

1082
00:57:22,240 --> 00:57:25,620
municipal reserve that we are owed from a park space perspective, and that's the

1083
00:57:25,660 --> 00:57:26,040
key thing.

1084
00:57:27,980 --> 00:57:28,220
Go ahead.

1085
00:57:28,240 --> 00:57:31,260
Great. I've got a question regarding the

1086
00:57:31,480 --> 00:57:35,180
8.2%. Is it being added to what we paid

1087
00:57:35,280 --> 00:57:39,000
last year for taxes, or added to the

1088
00:57:39,060 --> 00:57:42,080
much larger assessment that we received this spring?

1089
00:57:43,060 --> 00:57:46,520
If I may, I'll speak to this. Assessment increases

1090
00:57:47,180 --> 00:57:48,560
don't necessarily make your taxes go up.

1091
00:57:49,660 --> 00:57:53,480
So say, for example, if we charge a million dollars for taxes and

1092
00:57:53,740 --> 00:57:56,830
everybody's assessments goes up, we actually reduce the mill rate so that we only

1093
00:57:56,860 --> 00:58:00,020
charge for a million dollars. What matters about assessments and why they

1094
00:58:00,060 --> 00:58:01,250
fluctuate is

1095
00:58:02,100 --> 00:58:05,180
assessments are used to compare you to the average in town.

1096
00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:08,380
So if your assessment, you build a new garage or finish your basement and yours

1097
00:58:08,420 --> 00:58:10,300
went up, you'll pay more taxes compared to your neighbors.

1098
00:58:10,760 --> 00:58:13,120
But assessment fluctuations don't actually increase your taxes.

1099
00:58:13,740 --> 00:58:13,930
Okay.

1100
00:58:13,930 --> 00:58:14,040
Now-

1101
00:58:14,340 --> 00:58:15,270
That's what I wanted clear.

1102
00:58:15,290 --> 00:58:18,260
Yeah. So, and the greatest example I have is I bought my first house.

1103
00:58:18,540 --> 00:58:21,240
I can still remember hyperventilating in 1998.

1104
00:58:21,280 --> 00:58:25,180
It cost me $160,000. I look back now and go, "Wow, was ever lucky."

1105
00:58:25,200 --> 00:58:28,600
But literally within four years, the house doubled in price.

1106
00:58:28,880 --> 00:58:32,580
They didn't double my taxes. The taxes basically were

1107
00:58:32,640 --> 00:58:36,300
massaged basically with the mill rate to make sure that we didn't pay double taxes.

1108
00:58:36,360 --> 00:58:39,700
So that's how it works. Assessments fluctuate, but it's about comparing you to your

1109
00:58:39,740 --> 00:58:40,720
neighbors. That's all it does.

1110
00:58:40,760 --> 00:58:41,640
Okay. No, that's fair.

1111
00:58:41,680 --> 00:58:42,160
Okay.

1112
00:58:42,360 --> 00:58:45,980
And the 3% extra on utilities,

1113
00:58:46,580 --> 00:58:50,229
is that added just to the utilities, or is it added

1114
00:58:50,300 --> 00:58:53,680
also to that extra $25 that was thrown in last year

1115
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:57,900
that was supposed to go to reserves and never did?

1116
00:58:59,840 --> 00:59:03,800
The 3% is added on top, and we do have a plan to replenish

1117
00:59:03,860 --> 00:59:07,380
and make up for the $25 charge, which was meant for a capital

1118
00:59:07,540 --> 00:59:10,600
project. Now, we couldn't fix everything in a day.

1119
00:59:10,820 --> 00:59:14,690
We do have a plan in the long term to fix the tax rates,

1120
00:59:14,740 --> 00:59:17,080
and we're committed to that in our long-term plan.

1121
00:59:17,160 --> 00:59:20,280
But I'll be frank, we needed to put some in utilities because we need to replenish

1122
00:59:20,320 --> 00:59:22,480
the reserves and start taking care of that.

1123
00:59:22,520 --> 00:59:25,980
But we're going to try to massage the rates down and increase the taxes where they

1124
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:29,340
should be. It's a bit complicated, but so it is over and above, but we're going to

1125
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:30,520
fix that situation as well.

1126
00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:34,820
Okay. And I'll get my last point in, and then I'll let somebody

1127
00:59:34,860 --> 00:59:37,940
else have a turn. I've only lived out here for two years.

1128
00:59:38,840 --> 00:59:42,620
So I did not bring in the previous council.

1129
00:59:43,320 --> 00:59:43,840
I just kind of

1130
00:59:45,720 --> 00:59:46,460
got them.

1131
00:59:49,160 --> 00:59:52,340
I only have a single income in my home because there's just me, because the cats

1132
00:59:52,380 --> 00:59:54,400
and dogs, they don't earn anything.

1133
00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:59,690
It's a challenge to have this extra 8% and then 7% and

1134
01:00:00,040 --> 01:00:03,360
7%. I don't get a raise like that every year.

1135
01:00:04,360 --> 01:00:07,940
So it means while I'm also dealing with inflation,

1136
01:00:09,600 --> 01:00:13,280
my budget personally is getting considerably

1137
01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:13,800
tighter.

1138
01:00:15,400 --> 01:00:15,580
So

1139
01:00:17,080 --> 01:00:20,660
it's not something I think you can fix, but it's just

1140
01:00:20,720 --> 01:00:22,880
something that you should be aware of.

1141
01:00:24,380 --> 01:00:24,770
That's all I've got.

1142
01:00:25,040 --> 01:00:27,800
It's a very fair statement. Thank you.

1143
01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:32,300
Okay. First of all, I apologize. I showed up 10 minutes late.

1144
01:00:32,820 --> 01:00:34,700
My neighbor texted me, said there's a meeting.

1145
01:00:35,680 --> 01:00:39,540
So all I can ask is moving forward, we're going to have town hall

1146
01:00:39,660 --> 01:00:42,220
meetings. Let's have something in the mailbox.

1147
01:00:42,700 --> 01:00:46,280
Look at the empty chairs. This place should be full.

1148
01:00:47,720 --> 01:00:48,240
Fair enough.

1149
01:00:49,580 --> 01:00:53,550
It's a minor fix, but let's have better acknowledgement

1150
01:00:53,560 --> 01:00:54,760
for the people information.

1151
01:00:55,680 --> 01:00:59,532
Secondly, I showed up a little late, butIf I'm not mistaken, our

1152
01:00:59,552 --> 01:01:02,912
taxes are going up 8.2% this year?

1153
01:01:03,152 --> 01:01:03,372
That's right.

1154
01:01:03,912 --> 01:01:06,132
Okay. 8.2 next year?

1155
01:01:06,792 --> 01:01:08,222
We're projecting 7% next year.

1156
01:01:08,392 --> 01:01:10,042
7% and 7% and 7%.

1157
01:01:10,042 --> 01:01:11,642
And 7% and 7%. We're trying to keep it even. Yep.

1158
01:01:12,812 --> 01:01:14,732
Plus three for utilities and everything else.

1159
01:01:14,912 --> 01:01:15,152
Pardon me?

1160
01:01:15,252 --> 01:01:19,142
Okay. My question with the development, last meeting

1161
01:01:19,142 --> 01:01:20,852
we had, it was mentioned that there was no-

1162
01:01:21,232 --> 01:01:21,582
Put a pause off

1163
01:01:21,582 --> 01:01:22,332
... future development

1164
01:01:23,432 --> 01:01:27,072
moving forward, but I guess previous council approved something over

1165
01:01:27,112 --> 01:01:27,952
along the

1166
01:01:28,972 --> 01:01:32,692
whatever. That's still going forward. Is that correct?

1167
01:01:33,012 --> 01:01:33,562
I'm sorry. I-

1168
01:01:33,572 --> 01:01:33,842
With landmarks

1169
01:01:33,842 --> 01:01:34,372
... was just talking.

1170
01:01:34,772 --> 01:01:35,342
Landmarks,

1171
01:01:36,372 --> 01:01:38,852
Landrix is still moving forward with their development?

1172
01:01:39,092 --> 01:01:39,292
Yes.

1173
01:01:39,612 --> 01:01:39,952
Okay.

1174
01:01:40,032 --> 01:01:41,441
So there's a piece of land,

1175
01:01:42,732 --> 01:01:43,552
called Riverside-

1176
01:01:43,772 --> 01:01:43,822
Okay

1177
01:01:43,822 --> 01:01:45,382
... that Landrix is planning on now.

1178
01:01:45,432 --> 01:01:49,362
They're the ones who are in charge of The Meadows, and they're

1179
01:01:49,432 --> 01:01:53,342
also the area south of A&W and

1180
01:01:53,392 --> 01:01:57,272
the Tim Horton's. They didn't develop that, but south of that is about

1181
01:01:57,452 --> 01:02:01,192
55 acres that is tied to that local improvement that we're going to enforce a

1182
01:02:01,212 --> 01:02:04,032
local improvement bylaw on to recoup our money.

1183
01:02:04,132 --> 01:02:07,042
So we're going to try to get them to develop that, but if they don't, we're still

1184
01:02:07,052 --> 01:02:07,692
getting our money back.

1185
01:02:07,732 --> 01:02:11,592
So just so I understand, if we have development in residential, that

1186
01:02:11,732 --> 01:02:15,432
increases taxes, then it helps the town out by having more residents, correct?

1187
01:02:15,812 --> 01:02:16,992
More than that, actually.

1188
01:02:17,072 --> 01:02:17,912
Understood. Okay.

1189
01:02:17,952 --> 01:02:18,152
Yep.

1190
01:02:19,212 --> 01:02:20,292
When the council...

1191
01:02:21,192 --> 01:02:25,012
We voted for you. When you have a meeting that's that important

1192
01:02:25,092 --> 01:02:25,852
on having a

1193
01:02:27,172 --> 01:02:30,952
welfare place for horses or animals in an indigenous area,

1194
01:02:31,512 --> 01:02:34,412
we all need to be part of that conversation.

1195
01:02:35,412 --> 01:02:38,802
Now, whether it's done in a gymnasium like this, because going through this, what

1196
01:02:38,812 --> 01:02:41,612
we went through, I've been in this town for over 20 years.

1197
01:02:42,112 --> 01:02:44,732
My wife grew up in this town, 56 years.

1198
01:02:45,672 --> 01:02:48,172
Going through this can never happen again,

1199
01:02:49,032 --> 01:02:52,892
so we need to be understood, full disclosure, everybody understands

1200
01:02:52,932 --> 01:02:56,671
everything. But a lot of people don't understand everything. They don't see it.

1201
01:02:56,772 --> 01:03:00,662
So we need to have a better, again, information going out to the people to

1202
01:03:00,712 --> 01:03:04,352
have better conversations. That's one of the things I have.

1203
01:03:05,892 --> 01:03:07,952
Well, another couple things or one more.

1204
01:03:08,052 --> 01:03:10,712
Sorry, I'm just taking the notes and I'm writing them down on my phone.

1205
01:03:11,342 --> 01:03:13,972
It's the way I do it, technology.

1206
01:03:18,292 --> 01:03:20,432
Service cuts. Again, I was 10 minutes late.

1207
01:03:21,292 --> 01:03:22,172
So service cuts.

1208
01:03:22,292 --> 01:03:22,532
Mm-hmm.

1209
01:03:22,952 --> 01:03:26,772
Now, I can understand people's issues with the street cleaning, but I

1210
01:03:26,812 --> 01:03:30,432
also seen the poor b*****s sitting there with the bobcat

1211
01:03:30,452 --> 01:03:33,782
shoveling gravel. Is our equipment that we have right now

1212
01:03:34,492 --> 01:03:38,452
fixed? Is the repairs needed, is that all part of your plan to make sure that

1213
01:03:38,512 --> 01:03:40,472
every piece of equipment we have is good to go?

1214
01:03:42,572 --> 01:03:46,292
So we are depending on our public works team to let us know what

1215
01:03:47,292 --> 01:03:50,752
capital needs to be fixed. As far as I've heard, our capital's in pretty good

1216
01:03:50,792 --> 01:03:54,302
shape. One thing I wanted to mention to the gentleman about the alleys, just today,

1217
01:03:54,512 --> 01:03:57,992
we were looking at the possibility of a new piece of equipment that helps grade the

1218
01:03:58,032 --> 01:04:01,692
back alleys in a better way, because doing it with a grader doesn't work very well.

1219
01:04:01,752 --> 01:04:05,382
So we are looking at our equipment as part of our service level increases,

1220
01:04:05,852 --> 01:04:08,852
but we're also having to do that, and we need to be careful this year because we

1221
01:04:08,892 --> 01:04:10,332
need to prove that we can put money in the bank.

1222
01:04:10,372 --> 01:04:12,872
And then we're going to start looking at long-term capital replacement, but this

1223
01:04:12,892 --> 01:04:14,432
year, we don't want to take the risk.

1224
01:04:15,792 --> 01:04:16,032
Okay.

1225
01:04:16,412 --> 01:04:16,512
Yep.

1226
01:04:16,952 --> 01:04:17,092
So

1227
01:04:18,112 --> 01:04:22,052
just so I understand, again, sorry, there's going to be a vote coming

1228
01:04:22,112 --> 01:04:24,932
up on path A or path B.

1229
01:04:25,172 --> 01:04:25,372
Yep.

1230
01:04:25,492 --> 01:04:28,752
Your path that we're paying you for and everything else and the councilors are

1231
01:04:28,772 --> 01:04:31,062
hoping for and the town's hoping for to stay a town-

1232
01:04:31,412 --> 01:04:31,532
Yep

1233
01:04:31,541 --> 01:04:32,642
... with path A.

1234
01:04:32,672 --> 01:04:32,821
Right.

1235
01:04:33,392 --> 01:04:35,812
Is there going to be a conversation at that time?

1236
01:04:36,252 --> 01:04:39,282
Because a lot of people don't really understand what's going on.

1237
01:04:39,432 --> 01:04:42,472
They're not here. They don't get the information. They don't have Facebook.

1238
01:04:42,912 --> 01:04:46,462
Is there going to be a moment where, Mayor, yourself, and the councilors can sit

1239
01:04:46,512 --> 01:04:48,122
here and tell everybody,

1240
01:04:49,012 --> 01:04:52,812
"Plan A, pros and cons. Plan B, pros and

1241
01:04:52,912 --> 01:04:56,812
cons," before we have the vote, just so everybody's up and up and understands

1242
01:04:56,852 --> 01:04:59,092
exactly what's at stake?

1243
01:04:59,752 --> 01:04:59,922
Yeah.

1244
01:05:00,012 --> 01:05:00,892
I fully don't know.

1245
01:05:01,112 --> 01:05:04,972
Yeah. That's absolutely correct, and it's not us that's putting it on.

1246
01:05:05,012 --> 01:05:08,812
It's the government's putting it on, and they'll notify

1247
01:05:08,912 --> 01:05:10,452
every single homeowner

1248
01:05:11,372 --> 01:05:14,272
here in town, taxpayer in town, when that date'll be.

1249
01:05:14,442 --> 01:05:14,521
Okay.

1250
01:05:14,782 --> 01:05:15,961
And then they'll

1251
01:05:17,112 --> 01:05:21,042
present both options and what it will look like if we stay a town and

1252
01:05:21,072 --> 01:05:23,162
what it might look like if we become Sturgeon County.

1253
01:05:23,582 --> 01:05:26,732
And that's going to happen end of May, first part of June.

1254
01:05:27,272 --> 01:05:30,992
And then at the end of June, once the people have been informed what it might look

1255
01:05:31,032 --> 01:05:34,692
like, end of June, June 24th and 25th, is when the vote

1256
01:05:34,972 --> 01:05:35,352
takes place.

1257
01:05:35,372 --> 01:05:39,232
Okay. When he comes here and has that conversation, it's probably a good

1258
01:05:39,312 --> 01:05:43,132
idea for the seven of you up there to have another meeting just

1259
01:05:43,252 --> 01:05:46,382
before the vote just to explain very clearly, with

1260
01:05:46,492 --> 01:05:47,612
accuracy-

1261
01:05:47,792 --> 01:05:47,802
Can-

1262
01:05:47,802 --> 01:05:49,332
... on exactly what path.

1263
01:05:49,412 --> 01:05:53,342
Can I ask basic- I'm hearing the sound isn't working by many people are

1264
01:05:53,372 --> 01:05:54,992
saying they're not hearing things. So I'm not sure.

1265
01:05:55,052 --> 01:05:57,692
I find you need to talk right into the mic, so maybe that's the issue.

1266
01:05:58,252 --> 01:05:58,712
But are-

1267
01:05:58,772 --> 01:06:00,622
Sorry. I hear myself quite loudly, but-

1268
01:06:00,952 --> 01:06:01,132
Yeah.

1269
01:06:01,222 --> 01:06:01,232
So-

1270
01:06:01,252 --> 01:06:04,092
No, I hear you really well, but some people are saying they can't hear anything, so

1271
01:06:04,152 --> 01:06:06,732
I'm not sure if it's- There's lots of empty seats at the front.

1272
01:06:06,752 --> 01:06:09,472
Perhaps maybe they could move up, because I think the people in the front are doing

1273
01:06:09,512 --> 01:06:11,172
okay hearing you. Well, they're the...

1274
01:06:11,592 --> 01:06:11,802
We have a group that-

1275
01:06:11,802 --> 01:06:15,592
All I'm getting at, the bottom line is for this, is I expect

1276
01:06:15,852 --> 01:06:19,652
the seven of you to make it very clear to everybody

1277
01:06:19,912 --> 01:06:23,692
exactly what path is this and what path is that without the Alberta

1278
01:06:23,732 --> 01:06:24,712
government involvement.

1279
01:06:25,512 --> 01:06:25,652
Yep.

1280
01:06:25,712 --> 01:06:28,672
Just so we have a clear understanding before we vote.

1281
01:06:28,792 --> 01:06:30,042
I agree with you that,

1282
01:06:31,012 --> 01:06:34,902
yeah, we should make it clear what this path is, what that path is,

1283
01:06:34,952 --> 01:06:38,572
because there's been a lot of misinformation that's been stated.

1284
01:06:39,642 --> 01:06:41,932
We're all accessible through email.

1285
01:06:42,372 --> 01:06:46,192
The majority of us have Facebook. Our cell phone numbers are on our business

1286
01:06:46,212 --> 01:06:49,082
cards. Please feel free to reach out if there's something you don't understand, and

1287
01:06:49,092 --> 01:06:50,572
we will do our best to help explain it.

1288
01:06:51,232 --> 01:06:53,812
But it is noted what you're saying about more advertisement.

1289
01:06:54,532 --> 01:06:55,552
The only thing is cost.

1290
01:06:57,332 --> 01:07:00,432
So I don't know. Maybe I'll print it at home and shove it in everybody's mailboxes.

1291
01:07:00,952 --> 01:07:01,332
Thank you.

1292
01:07:03,588 --> 01:07:06,328
I

1293
01:07:07,088 --> 01:07:10,548
appreciate your questions and your comments, everything you said.

1294
01:07:10,868 --> 01:07:11,808
I agree with everything.

1295
01:07:12,948 --> 01:07:16,348
And one thing to understand too is that we are

1296
01:07:16,408 --> 01:07:17,988
residents as well.

1297
01:07:18,888 --> 01:07:22,688
For me, I know I want to understand what I'm voting for,

1298
01:07:22,828 --> 01:07:24,628
what I'm deciding, what direction.

1299
01:07:24,848 --> 01:07:25,108
There's

1300
01:07:26,128 --> 01:07:28,248
pride and then there's foolish pride.

1301
01:07:28,788 --> 01:07:32,558
If option B was

1302
01:07:32,828 --> 01:07:35,508
far greater, far more affordable,

1303
01:07:36,508 --> 01:07:38,628
far more shiny than option A, then

1304
01:07:39,448 --> 01:07:42,228
that would be the route, right?

1305
01:07:43,108 --> 01:07:46,628
I'm not going to try to hold on to my position as

1306
01:07:46,688 --> 01:07:49,768
councilor or try to hold on to our title as a

1307
01:07:49,828 --> 01:07:53,528
town if it means paying loads of extra money

1308
01:07:53,608 --> 01:07:56,848
and losing services and all that kind of stuff.

1309
01:07:56,968 --> 01:08:00,828
I don't want to do that. So definitely, we want the information as well.

1310
01:08:01,428 --> 01:08:02,678
And then as far as

1311
01:08:04,068 --> 01:08:07,768
reaching out and everything like that, I want to have conversations with people

1312
01:08:07,828 --> 01:08:11,628
like yourself. I want to have conversations about the

1313
01:08:11,668 --> 01:08:14,208
development. I want to hear from everybody.

1314
01:08:14,428 --> 01:08:16,029
I want to hear everybody's voice.

1315
01:08:17,088 --> 01:08:21,029
So when I'm speaking with Tim, when we're sitting in meetings, when we're

1316
01:08:21,068 --> 01:08:25,029
deciding on what direction to go, I know full well what the people want.

1317
01:08:25,108 --> 01:08:27,228
I know what you want. I know what everybody wants.

1318
01:08:27,768 --> 01:08:30,428
I know what I want. I know where I stand.

1319
01:08:30,968 --> 01:08:34,268
And I need the confidence from all of you

1320
01:08:35,329 --> 01:08:38,628
so I can stand there and I can make my decisions, and I can

1321
01:08:39,529 --> 01:08:41,748
feel confident that I'm representing you properly.

1322
01:08:42,308 --> 01:08:45,128
So even before we're done tonight, if you want, you can come up here.

1323
01:08:45,168 --> 01:08:49,018
I'll take your number. I'll give you my number, and then we can kind of

1324
01:08:49,108 --> 01:08:53,008
stay in touch because that's something I'd like to do, is to be in

1325
01:08:53,088 --> 01:08:54,588
touch with people like yourself.

1326
01:09:01,588 --> 01:09:02,949
Go ahead,

1327
01:09:03,858 --> 01:09:03,858
Bill.

1328
01:09:03,958 --> 01:09:07,348
I think we should quit crying and give these people a chance to

1329
01:09:07,388 --> 01:09:10,248
get a hold of this stuff and get it sorted out.

1330
01:09:10,909 --> 01:09:14,888
It isn't going to happen overnight, but we got a whole bunch of new people that

1331
01:09:14,928 --> 01:09:17,489
want to do it right and give them a chance.

1332
01:09:19,708 --> 01:09:23,648
It isn't easy. Just like the guy who shovels snow,

1333
01:09:23,768 --> 01:09:26,148
I got 10 years on you, and I do it too.

1334
01:09:26,888 --> 01:09:28,409
But I do it because I like it.

1335
01:09:29,228 --> 01:09:29,808
I'm a fool.

1336
01:09:32,409 --> 01:09:32,617
But I

1337
01:09:35,449 --> 01:09:38,628
always got told the Lord helps him who helps himself,

1338
01:09:39,449 --> 01:09:41,248
so I do a lot for myself.

1339
01:09:42,208 --> 01:09:46,108
And I clean sidewalks and stuff for people that

1340
01:09:46,188 --> 01:09:46,829
can't do it

1341
01:09:47,708 --> 01:09:51,148
and look down the road and see physically fit people.

1342
01:09:51,228 --> 01:09:53,548
We have a snow removal bylaw

1343
01:09:54,828 --> 01:09:56,028
for sidewalks,

1344
01:09:56,848 --> 01:09:58,588
and it's one of the most ill,

1345
01:09:59,508 --> 01:10:02,968
most ignored bylaw on the whole damn book,

1346
01:10:04,228 --> 01:10:05,528
when you look out the window.

1347
01:10:06,708 --> 01:10:09,108
So everybody complains,

1348
01:10:09,908 --> 01:10:13,747
but sometimes those people got to stop complaining and start

1349
01:10:14,108 --> 01:10:15,448
leading the bandwagon.

1350
01:10:23,528 --> 01:10:23,538
Appreciate it, Bill.

1351
01:10:23,548 --> 01:10:25,228
Thank you, sir. We appreciate it.

1352
01:10:26,788 --> 01:10:28,008
Thank you, former mayor.

1353
01:10:31,328 --> 01:10:34,548
Tim, could you just pull up that one slide that indicated the

1354
01:10:34,748 --> 01:10:36,068
4.5 acre

1355
01:10:37,128 --> 01:10:38,888
reimbursement tally?

1356
01:10:42,088 --> 01:10:45,968
Yeah, you kind of glossed over it, and I just wanted

1357
01:10:46,028 --> 01:10:46,668
to ask,

1358
01:10:47,488 --> 01:10:48,788
what is the

1359
01:10:49,748 --> 01:10:53,408
negotiation tactics or what is the win-win

1360
01:10:53,468 --> 01:10:57,428
situation? Because you're negotiating with Landrix to try to pay back

1361
01:10:57,488 --> 01:10:59,068
some of that money, I'm assuming.

1362
01:10:59,988 --> 01:11:01,808
Yeah. I guess

1363
01:11:03,188 --> 01:11:04,248
it's not a negotiation.

1364
01:11:05,048 --> 01:11:08,388
We have a letter on file that says they agreed to a local improvement

1365
01:11:09,068 --> 01:11:12,798
methodology, which means that we need to create a local improvement bylaw that's

1366
01:11:12,828 --> 01:11:15,628
enforceable, and then we need to tax it.

1367
01:11:15,688 --> 01:11:17,538
And so it's pretty simple, basically.

1368
01:11:17,548 --> 01:11:21,508
But the problematic issue is that the way it was done before was done wrong.

1369
01:11:22,128 --> 01:11:24,768
So the local improvement bylaw was done with the wrong land parcels.

1370
01:11:25,148 --> 01:11:25,208
The

1371
01:11:26,768 --> 01:11:30,008
local improvement bylaw was flawed in its terminology and the way it was worded.

1372
01:11:30,488 --> 01:11:34,348
So we're creating a bylaw which enforces that land to be basically paid

1373
01:11:34,448 --> 01:11:38,068
back over the 30 years as agreed by letter that we have on file.

1374
01:11:38,728 --> 01:11:42,498
So it's not necessarily a negotiation more than an enforcement of the deal that

1375
01:11:42,508 --> 01:11:43,128
they agreed to.

1376
01:11:43,908 --> 01:11:46,968
Oh, perfect. Yeah, I just wanted to make sure it wasn't one of those win-win

1377
01:11:46,978 --> 01:11:50,348
situations where we had to give up a pile of items to get this.

1378
01:11:50,408 --> 01:11:52,648
Well, we already spent the pile of money.

1379
01:11:52,688 --> 01:11:53,088
Well, yeah.

1380
01:11:53,388 --> 01:11:53,398
So-

1381
01:11:53,928 --> 01:11:56,348
It's great to actually get that money back.

1382
01:11:56,558 --> 01:11:58,378
Yeah. One of the things maybe that would help is

1383
01:11:59,268 --> 01:12:02,538
the nature of development cost and charges

1384
01:12:03,228 --> 01:12:05,028
is that municipalities will put the

1385
01:12:05,828 --> 01:12:09,768
infrastructure in the ground because they want to receive taxation dollars

1386
01:12:10,128 --> 01:12:12,448
from the development because that helps our financial sustainability.

1387
01:12:12,968 --> 01:12:16,808
So they'll front the cost of the capital, which is pretty typical.

1388
01:12:16,828 --> 01:12:20,068
But the agreements are normally is that it's attached to what's called a

1389
01:12:20,608 --> 01:12:23,848
local improvement bylaw or a offsite levy bylaw.

1390
01:12:24,618 --> 01:12:28,028
And once those bylaws are in place, then you can enforce basically development

1391
01:12:28,128 --> 01:12:31,588
charges around the development, and that's enforceable and then they have to pay

1392
01:12:31,648 --> 01:12:34,648
us. That wasn't done. So the money went in the ground without the

1393
01:12:34,748 --> 01:12:38,718
proper work being done, and I've done those things before, and so that's

1394
01:12:38,728 --> 01:12:42,288
what we're working on. Takes some time, but I can say this with assuredness, we do

1395
01:12:42,388 --> 01:12:46,328
have opinions on file that says that this will be enforceable, and we will

1396
01:12:46,368 --> 01:12:46,968
recoup that money.

1397
01:12:47,668 --> 01:12:50,048
Perfect. Yeah. That's great news.

1398
01:12:50,148 --> 01:12:52,468
I just wanted to make sure we were going to get some money-

1399
01:12:52,768 --> 01:12:52,928
We will

1400
01:12:52,968 --> 01:12:53,598
... to help the town.

1401
01:12:53,628 --> 01:12:54,128
Yeah.

1402
01:12:54,628 --> 01:12:56,428
Kind of next question.

1403
01:12:56,728 --> 01:12:56,817
Yeah.

1404
01:12:57,408 --> 01:13:01,068
Now, with regards to the 54 lots or the 300 plus lots,

1405
01:13:02,428 --> 01:13:05,948
what actual say do we have in that? Just because all the

1406
01:13:06,008 --> 01:13:08,168
land actually was purchased by Landrix.

1407
01:13:08,268 --> 01:13:10,520
So I know they have to go through the-...

1408
01:13:10,560 --> 01:13:11,860
protocols of development-

1409
01:13:11,870 --> 01:13:11,890
Yeah

1410
01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:15,370
... permits and stuff like that. Do we have any

1411
01:13:15,520 --> 01:13:17,680
say? And will it be

1412
01:13:18,660 --> 01:13:21,760
just a council and administration

1413
01:13:22,400 --> 01:13:22,920
procedure-

1414
01:13:23,000 --> 01:13:23,010
Yeah

1415
01:13:23,010 --> 01:13:25,980
... or will this be open to the public so that we have some sort of say?

1416
01:13:26,440 --> 01:13:29,460
There's definitely, and again, council may want to speak to this, but there's

1417
01:13:29,500 --> 01:13:31,860
definitely a process that we can go through

1418
01:13:32,780 --> 01:13:36,340
to request and negotiate for developments to be done in a certain way.

1419
01:13:36,380 --> 01:13:39,780
And again, through land use planning and bylaws and our municipal development plan,

1420
01:13:40,080 --> 01:13:42,180
we can enforce things to an extent.

1421
01:13:43,120 --> 01:13:45,040
But I'll say this just for everybody's awareness,

1422
01:13:45,980 --> 01:13:49,500
and I think it's one of the things that would make our country special and quite

1423
01:13:49,520 --> 01:13:52,780
frankly, the way that we work, is that we can't control what people do on their

1424
01:13:52,820 --> 01:13:55,380
land to an extent. So,

1425
01:13:56,420 --> 01:13:59,680
they are the landowners. We can negotiate under our land use bylaw and our

1426
01:13:59,700 --> 01:14:02,500
municipal development plan, what types of densities and things like that go on

1427
01:14:02,540 --> 01:14:05,400
there, but they have some control.

1428
01:14:05,420 --> 01:14:09,360
And the one problematic issue that occurs is that I can say, because I've seen

1429
01:14:09,380 --> 01:14:13,060
it, when developers take a town or a municipality to court,

1430
01:14:14,260 --> 01:14:17,660
usually the courts will side on the side of the developers when they really push

1431
01:14:17,700 --> 01:14:21,400
what they want on their lands. That said, it's still open to negotiation, and

1432
01:14:21,420 --> 01:14:25,220
I'll say this. This council advocated very hard in the last meeting that we had

1433
01:14:25,280 --> 01:14:28,840
with Landrex, and Landrex seems to be open to those kinds of discussions right now.

1434
01:14:28,900 --> 01:14:32,040
So, we're doing our best. That's the key thing.

1435
01:14:32,100 --> 01:14:35,950
The one thing I'll say just for awareness around the riverside development is that

1436
01:14:35,960 --> 01:14:39,950
we have very old infrastructure that was put in the ground many years ago, which is

1437
01:14:39,960 --> 01:14:43,950
water and sewer infrastructure that falls under the new offsite levy bylaw that

1438
01:14:43,960 --> 01:14:47,900
we'll be putting together. That means $2 million of non-debt money that's

1439
01:14:48,000 --> 01:14:50,120
on there could possibly come into the town.

1440
01:14:50,920 --> 01:14:53,660
So, that's a very big opportunity for us.

1441
01:14:55,060 --> 01:14:57,050
I know that there's always going to be controversy around development.

1442
01:14:57,350 --> 01:15:00,760
That's always normal. I've seen it many years.

1443
01:15:00,780 --> 01:15:03,550
The Bremner development, for example, in Strathcona County was 10 years of

1444
01:15:03,560 --> 01:15:05,940
discussion at the council level before they approved it.

1445
01:15:06,580 --> 01:15:10,060
So, there's a long way to go here and a long runway, and this council is advocating

1446
01:15:10,100 --> 01:15:12,180
very hard for the right things to be put in that development.

1447
01:15:12,560 --> 01:15:13,460
That's the best we can do.

1448
01:15:14,280 --> 01:15:15,580
Perfect. Now, any-

1449
01:15:15,960 --> 01:15:16,100
I just, can I give-

1450
01:15:16,110 --> 01:15:17,490
... future development. Oh, go ahead.

1451
01:15:18,060 --> 01:15:19,500
Can I just, one thing.

1452
01:15:20,420 --> 01:15:24,020
There was an open house on Tuesday for anyone in the community who

1453
01:15:24,060 --> 01:15:27,060
wanted to speak against, better,

1454
01:15:29,020 --> 01:15:32,440
for or against that development or raise any

1455
01:15:32,520 --> 01:15:36,060
concerns. I'm not going to lie, I was

1456
01:15:36,100 --> 01:15:39,600
surprised that there were only three voices that raised

1457
01:15:39,680 --> 01:15:41,780
concerns with regard to that development.

1458
01:15:42,420 --> 01:15:44,480
As Tim indicated,

1459
01:15:46,300 --> 01:15:49,790
there are two landowners for that parcel of property,

1460
01:15:50,540 --> 01:15:54,220
and it's difficult for us to say

1461
01:15:54,340 --> 01:15:56,220
no to a development.

1462
01:15:57,160 --> 01:16:01,140
One, it's financially beneficial for the

1463
01:16:01,180 --> 01:16:05,080
town, but there's not a person that's sitting up here

1464
01:16:05,160 --> 01:16:09,020
that wouldn't have absolutely listened to every voice that came to that

1465
01:16:09,060 --> 01:16:11,360
meeting and the concerns that they raised.

1466
01:16:12,380 --> 01:16:15,620
The unfortunate part is there weren't a lot of voices raised.

1467
01:16:16,440 --> 01:16:20,100
The concerns with regard to access are all of our

1468
01:16:20,160 --> 01:16:22,120
concerns, because that's a safety issue.

1469
01:16:23,180 --> 01:16:26,800
But I'm not going to lie, I was surprised that there weren't more

1470
01:16:26,840 --> 01:16:28,180
people vocal

1471
01:16:29,060 --> 01:16:31,680
with regard to the development. But there was an

1472
01:16:31,740 --> 01:16:33,100
opportunity.

1473
01:16:33,140 --> 01:16:37,060
But I fully agree with you, and both myself and Anita

1474
01:16:37,100 --> 01:16:41,009
attended that, and she was one of the voices speaking

1475
01:16:41,060 --> 01:16:45,000
to those issues. It was the same type of event that happened

1476
01:16:45,020 --> 01:16:48,910
back in 2009-ish, roughly, when Landrex tried

1477
01:16:48,940 --> 01:16:50,729
to develop across the street from us,

1478
01:16:51,540 --> 01:16:55,360
and they wanted to have zero lot line houses with garages backing out onto the main

1479
01:16:55,620 --> 01:16:59,260
51st Street that would have then shut down all traffic flow if there was one

1480
01:16:59,270 --> 01:16:59,880
accident.

1481
01:17:00,850 --> 01:17:03,020
So, there wasn't a lot of people that came to that event.

1482
01:17:03,100 --> 01:17:06,380
I'm glad to see there's more people here at this event.

1483
01:17:06,420 --> 01:17:10,150
We need everyone in town to come and express their opinions, because

1484
01:17:10,180 --> 01:17:13,320
development doesn't happen if people express their

1485
01:17:13,360 --> 01:17:16,300
opinions and they're not in favor.

1486
01:17:16,310 --> 01:17:20,140
The people still, sort of in this country, still

1487
01:17:20,200 --> 01:17:21,000
have the power.

1488
01:17:22,400 --> 01:17:22,580
Sure.

1489
01:17:23,280 --> 01:17:25,170
I agree with you 100%. People need to speak up.

1490
01:17:25,180 --> 01:17:26,880
Curtis Toll, longtime resident.

1491
01:17:33,050 --> 01:17:33,340
Hello.

1492
01:17:34,380 --> 01:17:37,960
I'm John McBain, a pretty new resident, less than two years here, and

1493
01:17:38,060 --> 01:17:39,700
I've really enjoyed living in Gibbons.

1494
01:17:39,760 --> 01:17:43,750
I think it's a great town or possibly a great hamlet, but I'll still

1495
01:17:43,760 --> 01:17:46,360
be living here no matter what it turns out to be.

1496
01:17:46,900 --> 01:17:49,040
What I'm a little concerned about is

1497
01:17:50,280 --> 01:17:53,060
the word transparency. It's a very popular word,

1498
01:17:54,100 --> 01:17:57,120
but it's a lot harder to implement than it is to talk about.

1499
01:17:58,040 --> 01:18:01,900
I was glad to hear there's some plan to

1500
01:18:01,980 --> 01:18:05,720
improve transparency going forward, so there's more involvement with town

1501
01:18:06,260 --> 01:18:09,320
residents with what's going on with the town itself.

1502
01:18:10,280 --> 01:18:14,240
But I'm wondering about the details, because, for example, a very small thing,

1503
01:18:14,760 --> 01:18:18,700
even watching the slides, I found that it was very hard for me to read

1504
01:18:18,760 --> 01:18:22,080
some of the slides, because there's a lot on one

1505
01:18:22,260 --> 01:18:23,420
slide.

1506
01:18:25,140 --> 01:18:29,100
And again, in terms of communication, some of the slides were very general, some

1507
01:18:29,120 --> 01:18:31,800
were spot on, talking about the different cash flows-

1508
01:18:31,880 --> 01:18:32,210
No surprise

1509
01:18:32,210 --> 01:18:34,300
... operating versus capital versus

1510
01:18:35,700 --> 01:18:37,320
the third cash flow.

1511
01:18:38,180 --> 01:18:41,280
But a slide like the one up there, it's a lot of numbers.

1512
01:18:41,550 --> 01:18:44,610
It doesn't have too much explanatory detail.

1513
01:18:45,260 --> 01:18:48,940
I'm wondering what the plans are to provide transparency both

1514
01:18:48,960 --> 01:18:52,820
between now and June so that we are very well-informed when we make

1515
01:18:52,860 --> 01:18:56,660
our vote, and also in the future, because that was talked about, but

1516
01:18:56,860 --> 01:19:00,700
I don't know if you've been able to focus on how to

1517
01:19:00,780 --> 01:19:02,120
implement that.

1518
01:19:03,050 --> 01:19:06,960
By the way, I have to compliment the present town council on transparency

1519
01:19:07,000 --> 01:19:10,850
compared to previous ones. From everything I hear, you're doing a much better job,

1520
01:19:10,920 --> 01:19:11,380
so thank you.

1521
01:19:15,316 --> 01:19:15,796
Thank you.

1522
01:19:17,576 --> 01:19:20,056
We have increased our transparency.

1523
01:19:20,196 --> 01:19:23,416
We speak out about what we can. We're all available on social

1524
01:19:23,476 --> 01:19:26,756
media. The town halls, I was part of the

1525
01:19:27,096 --> 01:19:27,636
previous

1526
01:19:28,576 --> 01:19:30,036
petition to get a town hall.

1527
01:19:31,016 --> 01:19:34,716
We're offering them up just because we're not perfect, we're not there yet, but

1528
01:19:34,756 --> 01:19:37,956
it's only six months in and we're fighting, and we want to hear from you.

1529
01:19:38,156 --> 01:19:40,896
We keep encouraging people, email us, call us.

1530
01:19:41,936 --> 01:19:43,856
We want to hear your voices. That's why we're here.

1531
01:19:44,916 --> 01:19:45,216
Thank you.

1532
01:19:48,776 --> 01:19:49,716
So I got a question. I

1533
01:19:50,916 --> 01:19:54,636
look at your budget and you say you have $300,000 of savings in

1534
01:19:54,676 --> 01:19:58,636
contracted services and professional fees, yet your budget shows that

1535
01:19:58,696 --> 01:20:01,616
you're actually spending $295,000 more.

1536
01:20:02,836 --> 01:20:06,716
Yeah. So what happened there is we saved money in $300,000 from

1537
01:20:06,756 --> 01:20:08,736
year to year in current contracts.

1538
01:20:08,796 --> 01:20:12,176
We moved what was in the salary expenses previously.

1539
01:20:12,256 --> 01:20:15,956
So what was in the CAO salary, and the CFO salary, and the

1540
01:20:15,996 --> 01:20:19,956
assistant CAO salary, we moved down that to contracts for one year because we're

1541
01:20:19,966 --> 01:20:23,956
there. So it wasn't an increase, it was a reallocation from salaries to contracts

1542
01:20:24,016 --> 01:20:26,156
to compensate for us, but we're gone at the end of the year.

1543
01:20:26,476 --> 01:20:27,676
They were always contracted.

1544
01:20:27,996 --> 01:20:31,756
No, there was in the salaries area.

1545
01:20:32,356 --> 01:20:32,556
Ryan?

1546
01:20:35,616 --> 01:20:36,766
So they're contracted services.

1547
01:20:37,076 --> 01:20:41,036
Yeah. No. So within the budget, they were listed in the salary

1548
01:20:41,116 --> 01:20:41,516
section-

1549
01:20:41,696 --> 01:20:41,886
They were

1550
01:20:42,156 --> 01:20:46,036
... but I reclassed it into an actual contracted service account,

1551
01:20:46,116 --> 01:20:47,256
so it shows properly.

1552
01:20:47,266 --> 01:20:47,856
So they were contracted-

1553
01:20:47,876 --> 01:20:49,186
So then you don't actually have 1.2 million-

1554
01:20:49,196 --> 01:20:49,616
They were contracted

1555
01:20:49,876 --> 01:20:52,756
... in employment savings. You've only actually got

1556
01:20:53,836 --> 01:20:55,276
900,000 in employment savings.

1557
01:20:56,906 --> 01:20:56,906
I can't-

1558
01:20:56,916 --> 01:20:57,856
Which number are you off?

1559
01:20:58,236 --> 01:20:58,506
I can't hear you.

1560
01:20:58,516 --> 01:20:59,696
That's not correct.

1561
01:21:01,096 --> 01:21:04,896
So we calculated the salaries based on the 14 people that we

1562
01:21:06,056 --> 01:21:09,856
reduced, was equivalent to $1.2 million exactly.

1563
01:21:10,436 --> 01:21:13,756
We then moved 300, about,

1564
01:21:14,276 --> 01:21:18,156
around on the list of contracted salaries that were contracts but were under

1565
01:21:18,176 --> 01:21:21,816
the salaries incorrectly. We moved those down to contract services because we're

1566
01:21:21,836 --> 01:21:25,716
contracted staff right now. Once we leave, if council so chooses to hire

1567
01:21:25,756 --> 01:21:28,536
those as permanent salary positions, then it would be moved back.

1568
01:21:28,576 --> 01:21:32,396
But it'd be incorrect to put them in the budget as salary positions because we're

1569
01:21:32,416 --> 01:21:32,976
not staff.

1570
01:21:33,956 --> 01:21:36,556
So if you say you're leaving at the end of the year, why is it in the three-year

1571
01:21:36,616 --> 01:21:36,956
outlook?

1572
01:21:37,496 --> 01:21:37,836
Pardon me?

1573
01:21:38,176 --> 01:21:41,516
If you say you're leaving at the end of the year, why is your contracted services

1574
01:21:41,536 --> 01:21:42,556
in the three-year outlook?

1575
01:21:43,576 --> 01:21:44,346
That's, again-

1576
01:21:44,416 --> 01:21:45,156
And increasing

1577
01:21:45,536 --> 01:21:47,276
... we are leaving, I can guarantee you that.

1578
01:21:47,476 --> 01:21:48,096
So it's going to be-

1579
01:21:48,136 --> 01:21:48,636
I hope so.

1580
01:21:49,536 --> 01:21:50,416
Okay. Thank you.

1581
01:21:50,456 --> 01:21:50,616
Yeah.

1582
01:21:55,556 --> 01:21:56,256
Again, crickets.

1583
01:21:57,956 --> 01:21:58,046
It's-

1584
01:21:58,256 --> 01:22:00,336
I can't hear him. The echo is so loud

1585
01:22:00,616 --> 01:22:04,316
... it's up to council to speak to that, and they're not, so

1586
01:22:04,396 --> 01:22:05,056
that's fine.

1587
01:22:05,476 --> 01:22:06,086
I can't understand.

1588
01:22:06,136 --> 01:22:06,686
He said he's glad-

1589
01:22:06,716 --> 01:22:07,256
Is that better?

1590
01:22:10,276 --> 01:22:10,956
No, it's worse.

1591
01:22:11,945 --> 01:22:12,516
That's worse?

1592
01:22:12,776 --> 01:22:14,436
There. Whatever you were just doing.

1593
01:22:14,636 --> 01:22:16,836
Could you just maybe repeat what you said to council, please?

1594
01:22:18,316 --> 01:22:22,256
So the budget shows contracted services increasing from roughly 824,000

1595
01:22:22,276 --> 01:22:25,916
to about 1.19 million. At the same time, programs supporting youth and

1596
01:22:25,956 --> 01:22:26,856
vulnerable residents-

1597
01:22:26,866 --> 01:22:26,866
I don't know why you-

1598
01:22:26,866 --> 01:22:29,996
... as well as essential public services were reduced or eliminated.

1599
01:22:30,036 --> 01:22:33,746
Which specific contracted services account for that 295,000 increase,

1600
01:22:34,036 --> 01:22:36,356
and why were those prioritized over community supports?

1601
01:22:39,476 --> 01:22:42,856
Maybe slow down just a little bit and then repeat that, because it sounds like one

1602
01:22:42,916 --> 01:22:44,256
word.

1603
01:22:44,296 --> 01:22:45,356
I've already asked it twice.

1604
01:22:45,576 --> 01:22:45,876
Pardon me?

1605
01:22:46,165 --> 01:22:48,306
I've already asked it twice, and I've asked the council-

1606
01:22:48,336 --> 01:22:48,776
Okay. I

1607
01:22:49,796 --> 01:22:49,936
can't-

1608
01:22:50,496 --> 01:22:52,196
They can ask me that. He doesn't need to.

1609
01:22:53,556 --> 01:22:54,316
And I've repeated it.

1610
01:22:54,516 --> 01:22:56,176
We're trying to help, sir. So if you could-

1611
01:22:56,776 --> 01:22:59,216
Sorry. Can you just say it slower?

1612
01:23:01,296 --> 01:23:04,136
The published budget shows contracted-

1613
01:23:04,176 --> 01:23:04,206
No, we're not-

1614
01:23:04,206 --> 01:23:06,366
... services increasing from roughly-

1615
01:23:06,836 --> 01:23:07,156
Excuse me, sir

1616
01:23:07,176 --> 01:23:08,665
... 824,000.

1617
01:23:08,876 --> 01:23:11,945
Sit down. If you can't behave and you can't have proper decorum and etiquette,

1618
01:23:12,216 --> 01:23:13,906
you're going to be asked to sit down or leave. Okay?

1619
01:23:14,016 --> 01:23:15,046
I have proper etiquette, sir.

1620
01:23:15,696 --> 01:23:15,966
You don't need to be-

1621
01:23:16,016 --> 01:23:17,716
The way you're behaving is not proper.

1622
01:23:18,216 --> 01:23:18,576
Pardon me?

1623
01:23:19,336 --> 01:23:22,716
The way you're behaving is not appropriate.

1624
01:23:23,196 --> 01:23:23,206
Really?

1625
01:23:23,256 --> 01:23:24,516
Nor is it wanted in here.

1626
01:23:24,836 --> 01:23:25,456
Really?

1627
01:23:25,716 --> 01:23:27,036
Thank you.

1628
01:23:27,086 --> 01:23:30,036
I believe you invited me here. You told me to come here.

1629
01:23:30,076 --> 01:23:33,715
Yes, but we want people to just be normal. Nice guy.

1630
01:23:33,816 --> 01:23:36,956
Would you like Carol Barac's etiquette?

1631
01:23:37,126 --> 01:23:37,126
No.

1632
01:23:37,176 --> 01:23:37,336
We

1633
01:23:38,156 --> 01:23:40,116
do want to hear you.

1634
01:23:40,136 --> 01:23:40,226
Stop yelling in his ear.

1635
01:23:40,236 --> 01:23:41,996
It's just we can't. So-

1636
01:23:42,036 --> 01:23:42,406
What the heck?

1637
01:23:42,646 --> 01:23:43,996
... we want to hear what you have to say.

1638
01:23:45,016 --> 01:23:48,706
So if you could calmly say it again but a little bit slower so that we're not

1639
01:23:48,736 --> 01:23:51,496
getting the echo, I would appreciate it.

1640
01:23:52,956 --> 01:23:53,496
Is that better?

1641
01:23:54,416 --> 01:23:54,736
I think-

1642
01:23:54,756 --> 01:23:55,046
Let's see here

1643
01:23:55,056 --> 01:23:56,456
... you just have a very loud voice.

1644
01:23:56,536 --> 01:23:56,946
Try taking the mic-

1645
01:23:56,976 --> 01:23:57,706
I have a deep voice, yeah.

1646
01:23:57,756 --> 01:23:59,326
Try the microphone a little bit further from-

1647
01:23:59,336 --> 01:24:00,156
That's what I'm trying to do.

1648
01:24:00,256 --> 01:24:00,396
Yeah.

1649
01:24:00,756 --> 01:24:03,626
At one time you guys said I was too far, now you're saying I'm too close, so.

1650
01:24:03,656 --> 01:24:04,536
Just you have a loud voice-

1651
01:24:04,556 --> 01:24:05,076
Is this good?

1652
01:24:05,095 --> 01:24:06,296
... and it just really echoes.

1653
01:24:06,356 --> 01:24:06,936
Is that good there?

1654
01:24:07,876 --> 01:24:07,886
Yeah.

1655
01:24:07,976 --> 01:24:08,406
I can hear that.

1656
01:24:08,876 --> 01:24:09,076
Okay.

1657
01:24:10,996 --> 01:24:11,156
So

1658
01:24:12,276 --> 01:24:12,816
basically,

1659
01:24:13,616 --> 01:24:17,276
we got 824,000 turning into 1.19 million

1660
01:24:17,896 --> 01:24:21,536
for contracted services. At the same time, programs supporting youth,

1661
01:24:21,576 --> 01:24:25,096
vulnerable residents, as well as essential public services such as a bylaw officer,

1662
01:24:25,136 --> 01:24:28,136
which I believe is a contracted services, is being reduced or

1663
01:24:28,176 --> 01:24:31,956
eliminated. What specific contracted services account for that

1664
01:24:32,076 --> 01:24:36,046
295,000 increase, and why were those prioritized over community

1665
01:24:36,116 --> 01:24:36,536
supports?

1666
01:24:37,276 --> 01:24:40,406
I'll explain it very clearly. So-

1667
01:24:40,456 --> 01:24:42,796
I've asked for the mayor to explain or council.

1668
01:24:42,836 --> 01:24:43,136
Pardon me?

1669
01:24:43,476 --> 01:24:45,316
I've asked for mayor or the council to explain it.

1670
01:24:45,326 --> 01:24:48,296
Oh, okay. Go ahead. They can explain it, but from a... Okay, go ahead.

1671
01:24:52,156 --> 01:24:52,846
There was a change

1672
01:24:55,616 --> 01:24:59,376
from wages that were moved down into,

1673
01:25:00,016 --> 01:25:00,236
as

1674
01:25:01,476 --> 01:25:05,016
the interim CAO has already indicated, has

1675
01:25:05,096 --> 01:25:08,696
moved from wages to contract services because they are not an

1676
01:25:08,716 --> 01:25:12,486
employee, they are a contractor. When that

1677
01:25:12,516 --> 01:25:16,116
contract ceases, we will then reallocate back to

1678
01:25:16,176 --> 01:25:20,108
wagesThat's the reason for the increase

1679
01:25:20,148 --> 01:25:23,988
in contract services. It had absolutely nothing to do with the reduction

1680
01:25:24,028 --> 01:25:27,648
of service to the community. It was a change from wages to

1681
01:25:27,688 --> 01:25:31,448
contract services. Initially, you also made an indication that the

1682
01:25:31,488 --> 01:25:34,698
previous administration were all

1683
01:25:34,728 --> 01:25:37,648
contractors. That is an incorrect statement.

1684
01:25:37,668 --> 01:25:41,548
There was one contractor, and that was financial services.

1685
01:25:41,828 --> 01:25:44,108
The others were salaried employees.

1686
01:25:44,828 --> 01:25:45,028
So

1687
01:25:46,008 --> 01:25:49,748
if you want to be aggressive with us, I really honestly suggest

1688
01:25:49,968 --> 01:25:50,907
you be aggressive

1689
01:25:51,908 --> 01:25:52,848
with correct facts.

1690
01:25:55,088 --> 01:25:57,148
I suggest you be aggressive with correct facts as well.

1691
01:25:57,548 --> 01:26:00,348
Our last permanent CAO was a contractor.

1692
01:26:01,408 --> 01:26:01,958
No, he wasn't.

1693
01:26:01,958 --> 01:26:03,028
He was a contract employee.

1694
01:26:03,048 --> 01:26:04,988
But it was-

1695
01:26:05,328 --> 01:26:08,208
I FOIP'd his contract. He was a contract employee, which is different than a

1696
01:26:08,288 --> 01:26:11,868
contractor. That means that we paid

1697
01:26:11,968 --> 01:26:15,868
for the employee

1698
01:26:16,208 --> 01:26:19,428
deductions. We paid those. He didn't have his own WCB

1699
01:26:19,468 --> 01:26:23,448
contributions. He didn't have the things that would be

1700
01:26:23,488 --> 01:26:26,108
required of a contractor versus a contract employee.

1701
01:26:26,228 --> 01:26:28,428
So there is a difference. Thank you.

1702
01:26:28,988 --> 01:26:32,508
A contract employee or a contractor is all liable for that themselves.

1703
01:26:34,088 --> 01:26:34,208
I think-

1704
01:26:34,268 --> 01:26:34,827
Yes, they are.

1705
01:26:35,648 --> 01:26:38,928
I think the key thing, though, your question is, where were they were in the

1706
01:26:38,948 --> 01:26:42,528
budget? So whether it was a contracted employee or not, it was in the salaries

1707
01:26:42,588 --> 01:26:44,528
section. And one thing I want to make clear,

1708
01:26:45,608 --> 01:26:49,518
Farrell's contract was $240,000 a year, salaries and

1709
01:26:49,568 --> 01:26:53,438
benefits. Monique was $170,000, salaries and

1710
01:26:53,508 --> 01:26:54,668
benefits, and then plus more.

1711
01:26:55,488 --> 01:26:59,128
The assistant CAO was 150,000. Those three contracts were

1712
01:26:59,168 --> 01:27:02,848
combined, put into contracted services, and we're not taking one dime more

1713
01:27:03,648 --> 01:27:06,408
than what they were paid. And that's been a policy that's been around here for a

1714
01:27:06,448 --> 01:27:08,208
long time. That I'm making

1715
01:27:09,158 --> 01:27:12,188
500,000, I wish. We're being paid no more than what they were.

1716
01:27:12,228 --> 01:27:15,828
That was a deal I made with this council, and that's a reasonable deal for the work

1717
01:27:15,868 --> 01:27:18,828
that we've been doing. So we're being paid no more than your former staff were.

1718
01:27:19,668 --> 01:27:19,678
Right.

1719
01:27:19,678 --> 01:27:23,198
And it's been reallocated from the staffing section down to the contracted

1720
01:27:23,248 --> 01:27:27,208
services. So there's been a reallocation of approximately $500,000

1721
01:27:27,308 --> 01:27:30,128
for the former staff that were paid here under the contracts.

1722
01:27:30,708 --> 01:27:31,548
If I may intervene.

1723
01:27:32,548 --> 01:27:36,308
The other thing is that you're thinking it's just one person or two

1724
01:27:36,348 --> 01:27:38,088
people. It's not. We're getting a whole team.

1725
01:27:38,618 --> 01:27:42,358
The situation we are in currently,

1726
01:27:43,688 --> 01:27:47,508
I believe, to quote Mr. Miller, "What hasn't been seen since the Great Depression."

1727
01:27:48,548 --> 01:27:52,528
We needed somebody with the expertise and the skill set, and that's going to

1728
01:27:52,568 --> 01:27:55,088
cost more. But we are getting a whole team. We're getting IT.

1729
01:27:55,158 --> 01:27:58,668
There's so much value. Plus, we're all a new council,

1730
01:27:59,468 --> 01:28:02,588
and it does benefit you that we are doing extra training

1731
01:28:02,668 --> 01:28:05,248
online. We're getting strategic planning.

1732
01:28:05,268 --> 01:28:08,058
We're getting so much more than what you think we're getting.

1733
01:28:08,608 --> 01:28:12,188
And like they said, it's a movement in the budget in categorization.

1734
01:28:14,708 --> 01:28:18,588
Like I say, we can agree to disagree, but even at 500,000, I believe

1735
01:28:18,628 --> 01:28:21,448
if we add up what your two companies are taking, it's about

1736
01:28:21,628 --> 01:28:23,348
660,000 in a year.

1737
01:28:25,548 --> 01:28:26,128
So it's-

1738
01:28:26,568 --> 01:28:28,008
So it's about 160,000 additionally.

1739
01:28:28,328 --> 01:28:32,108
Again, it is for three positions

1740
01:28:32,868 --> 01:28:36,788
at the going rate, actually less than what we charge other clients for

1741
01:28:36,808 --> 01:28:40,668
the same work. But it's actually at the going rate for CAO, a CFO, and an

1742
01:28:40,728 --> 01:28:44,708
assistant CAO. But you're also getting, on top of that, a summer student, my

1743
01:28:44,768 --> 01:28:48,257
IT resources. I have three CPAs, not one, three that are

1744
01:28:48,308 --> 01:28:49,208
supporting the town,

1745
01:28:50,488 --> 01:28:53,098
and plus our strategic planning and everything else.

1746
01:28:53,128 --> 01:28:54,908
And so you're getting actually six.

1747
01:28:54,968 --> 01:28:57,648
At times, you've had support with six or seven people.

1748
01:28:57,668 --> 01:29:01,248
You've got a summer student working full time for the town right now at no extra

1749
01:29:01,288 --> 01:29:01,708
cost.

1750
01:29:03,328 --> 01:29:06,688
Yeah. That's fine. But how long is it going to continue?

1751
01:29:07,408 --> 01:29:10,088
Because I think we can all agree that a town of this size can't

1752
01:29:11,088 --> 01:29:11,228
even-

1753
01:29:11,288 --> 01:29:12,138
When we leave here-

1754
01:29:12,228 --> 01:29:14,848
Even Farrell's salary was too high for a town of this size.

1755
01:29:15,468 --> 01:29:17,038
I think what's very important to understand-

1756
01:29:17,058 --> 01:29:17,988
I've said publicly that-

1757
01:29:19,288 --> 01:29:19,608
The thing-

1758
01:29:19,738 --> 01:29:23,528
... your nature and your organization's nature is needed in a short-term

1759
01:29:23,548 --> 01:29:25,268
basis, as long as it stays that.

1760
01:29:25,288 --> 01:29:25,368
Yeah.

1761
01:29:25,388 --> 01:29:28,388
But it's also been said online that there's no intent for you guys to leave.

1762
01:29:28,928 --> 01:29:30,568
Now you're saying that there is within a year-

1763
01:29:30,678 --> 01:29:30,678
No, there is-

1764
01:29:30,678 --> 01:29:32,028
... which I can respect a lot more.

1765
01:29:32,248 --> 01:29:32,938
There's always been,

1766
01:29:34,868 --> 01:29:38,628
unfortunately, the intent for the Bloom team to leave because you are

1767
01:29:38,708 --> 01:29:40,928
absolutely correct. We can't afford them.

1768
01:29:41,598 --> 01:29:41,598
Yeah.

1769
01:29:42,108 --> 01:29:45,108
They've been an absolutely amazing resource for us.

1770
01:29:45,468 --> 01:29:49,388
Very, very quickly assessed a terrible situation and actually moved

1771
01:29:49,448 --> 01:29:49,848
through it.

1772
01:29:50,648 --> 01:29:51,488
So,

1773
01:29:53,008 --> 01:29:56,628
this is an interim solution for us, and this council

1774
01:29:57,628 --> 01:30:01,518
is very, very confident and very, very pleased with

1775
01:30:01,528 --> 01:30:04,008
the work that the Bloom team has done.

1776
01:30:04,028 --> 01:30:07,798
Sorry, my apologies. We will continue to have them as long as they'll have

1777
01:30:07,868 --> 01:30:11,828
us. But they've indicated to us

1778
01:30:11,868 --> 01:30:15,008
that there is an end time for them.

1779
01:30:15,048 --> 01:30:18,668
Yeah, and that's respectful. At the end of the day, what they've done is good.

1780
01:30:18,948 --> 01:30:21,588
95% of their budget is commendable.

1781
01:30:21,628 --> 01:30:24,088
It's what's needed in this town to drop the fees and everything else.

1782
01:30:24,168 --> 01:30:27,998
I've stated that publicly. It's not all bad, but this

1783
01:30:28,028 --> 01:30:30,968
town cannot afford to be paying administration

1784
01:30:31,168 --> 01:30:32,508
600,000-plus a year.

1785
01:30:33,348 --> 01:30:34,278
We also agree with you.

1786
01:30:34,278 --> 01:30:34,678
Just wait, I'm not done.

1787
01:30:34,678 --> 01:30:36,378
Do you have a second question? Do you have another question?

1788
01:30:36,378 --> 01:30:36,908
I don't interrupt you.

1789
01:30:38,128 --> 01:30:38,518
Please don't interrupt me.

1790
01:30:38,518 --> 01:30:39,988
Do you have another question?

1791
01:30:40,008 --> 01:30:40,208
Pardon?

1792
01:30:40,508 --> 01:30:41,608
Do you have another question?

1793
01:30:41,628 --> 01:30:42,768
Yeah, I got about 30 of them here.

1794
01:30:43,748 --> 01:30:44,488
We'll be here for a while.

1795
01:30:48,828 --> 01:30:49,108
Pardon?

1796
01:30:49,928 --> 01:30:50,598
Did you want a pen?

1797
01:30:52,708 --> 01:30:52,928
Yeah.

1798
01:30:54,388 --> 01:30:58,248
You going to stop a tax-paying resident's right to speak politely?

1799
01:30:58,258 --> 01:30:59,198
You're not being polite.

1800
01:31:00,188 --> 01:31:03,328
You've already threatened me once. I have not been rude.

1801
01:31:03,428 --> 01:31:05,628
I have not sworn at you. I have not done anything.

1802
01:31:06,188 --> 01:31:06,198
Sit down.

1803
01:31:06,198 --> 01:31:09,348
So we have citizens who are leaving because they don't want to listen to you

1804
01:31:09,428 --> 01:31:09,848
anymore.

1805
01:31:10,308 --> 01:31:11,868
That's great. I'm a citizen as well.

1806
01:31:12,368 --> 01:31:16,328
Okay. We're going to give you an opportunity to ask one more question, then

1807
01:31:16,348 --> 01:31:16,458
the-

1808
01:31:16,458 --> 01:31:18,648
Nope, I'll be asking all my questions before I sit down.

1809
01:31:19,328 --> 01:31:21,628
You'll give other people a chance to speak as well, sir?

1810
01:31:21,748 --> 01:31:25,268
If you noticed, sir, I did. I politely waited for everybody

1811
01:31:25,368 --> 01:31:28,560
elseAnd he can speak once I'm done.

1812
01:31:28,660 --> 01:31:31,620
If you can't speak without yelling, then don't speak, sir.

1813
01:31:31,780 --> 01:31:31,960
Really?

1814
01:31:31,980 --> 01:31:33,230
Hold on. Let's just-

1815
01:31:33,280 --> 01:31:34,419
You're the only one yelling here.

1816
01:31:34,480 --> 01:31:34,900
It-

1817
01:31:34,910 --> 01:31:36,480
No, he's got another microphone.

1818
01:31:36,910 --> 01:31:36,910
Okay

1819
01:31:36,920 --> 01:31:40,840
Go ahead. You deserve to be heard. Go ahead, finish your questions, and

1820
01:31:40,880 --> 01:31:43,120
we can move on. I have to say, this is awesome.

1821
01:31:44,400 --> 01:31:44,880
Go ahead.

1822
01:31:47,540 --> 01:31:49,750
Just if you can finish your questions, we'd appreciate it.

1823
01:31:49,760 --> 01:31:52,480
I'll even skip some that you've somewhat already answered.

1824
01:31:54,820 --> 01:31:56,940
We could sit

1825
01:31:57,000 --> 01:32:01,220
down.

1826
01:32:04,440 --> 01:32:07,660
So basically, are you guys confirming that the interim CAO and corporate

1827
01:32:08,480 --> 01:32:09,980
services director were sole source?

1828
01:32:12,020 --> 01:32:13,140
Yes. Sure they were.

1829
01:32:13,260 --> 01:32:13,980
As they normally are.

1830
01:32:14,600 --> 01:32:16,000
What's your justification for that?

1831
01:32:16,600 --> 01:32:19,340
What was the exact question?

1832
01:32:19,409 --> 01:32:19,909
Sole source versus justification.

1833
01:32:20,340 --> 01:32:22,620
They're not typically sole source.

1834
01:32:22,640 --> 01:32:24,580
There's typically a public advertisement.

1835
01:32:24,620 --> 01:32:24,690
Nope.

1836
01:32:25,170 --> 01:32:28,280
According to the New West Trade Partnership, it's required to be publicly

1837
01:32:28,350 --> 01:32:32,200
advertised if there's an intention to pay out more than $75,000 to one

1838
01:32:32,280 --> 01:32:33,160
entity in one year.

1839
01:32:34,500 --> 01:32:38,360
Well, I agree with you. If you look at our procurement bylaw, that isn't up to

1840
01:32:38,370 --> 01:32:42,290
par, and I agree with you on that. That's not what is required in our

1841
01:32:42,360 --> 01:32:43,320
procurement bylaw.

1842
01:32:43,880 --> 01:32:47,700
Just because your procurement bylaw lacks what's required at the provincial level

1843
01:32:47,980 --> 01:32:50,520
doesn't mean that it's an excuse not to do it.

1844
01:32:50,560 --> 01:32:54,550
For sure. And I will tell you that we've been in six months, just six months,

1845
01:32:54,560 --> 01:32:58,460
and we walked into a storm. So was that the least of our concerns when we

1846
01:32:58,560 --> 01:33:02,320
had help at the ready that had a plan and was ready to hit ground and go

1847
01:33:02,360 --> 01:33:06,340
running and has proven himself with his team? Yes.

1848
01:33:06,380 --> 01:33:08,520
So will we take that one on the shoulder? Sure.

1849
01:33:09,700 --> 01:33:13,500
I think we can all agree that at the end of the day, you're not supposed to

1850
01:33:13,560 --> 01:33:17,340
be sole sourcing contracts. One of our big issues in this

1851
01:33:17,400 --> 01:33:20,360
town is from these little back-end deals.

1852
01:33:24,700 --> 01:33:28,540
It's funny you guys aren't concerned, but the municipal affairs, the local

1853
01:33:28,600 --> 01:33:31,900
minister, local MLA are very concerned about this relationship.

1854
01:33:33,000 --> 01:33:35,080
They should be, because they knew all along.

1855
01:33:36,140 --> 01:33:36,940
They knew all along?

1856
01:33:37,399 --> 01:33:39,290
Yes, they did. I can confirm it. I have emails.

1857
01:33:39,440 --> 01:33:42,840
I was speaking to them continuously, as other councilors

1858
01:33:42,880 --> 01:33:44,730
were, as a former councilor was.

1859
01:33:45,840 --> 01:33:49,660
Yes, they should be concerned. Do we have a working relationship with them?

1860
01:33:49,740 --> 01:33:52,580
Yes. But they were all aware from the jump.

1861
01:33:52,660 --> 01:33:55,909
And as a citizen, I was continuously writing letters as well as

1862
01:33:55,940 --> 01:33:57,200
being

1863
01:33:58,720 --> 01:34:02,129
really into the legislative compliance review.

1864
01:34:02,280 --> 01:34:06,249
I was sending them information at least three times a week, if not speaking to them

1865
01:34:06,420 --> 01:34:06,840
as much.

1866
01:34:08,840 --> 01:34:11,040
Yeah, and I believe you did that compliance review wrong as well.

1867
01:34:11,100 --> 01:34:12,040
That's why it was rejected.

1868
01:34:14,120 --> 01:34:14,650
Okay, one more,

1869
01:34:15,960 --> 01:34:16,870
and then we'll move on to the next person.

1870
01:34:16,890 --> 01:34:17,640
It's not one more.

1871
01:34:17,650 --> 01:34:18,440
Yes. Thank you, sir.

1872
01:34:18,490 --> 01:34:21,960
No. It's an open town hall. You did not put a limit on the questions.

1873
01:34:21,980 --> 01:34:21,990
Sir-

1874
01:34:22,020 --> 01:34:23,960
We can publicly ask questions.

1875
01:34:24,080 --> 01:34:27,120
Sir, if you would ask your one last question, then go behind the person that's

1876
01:34:27,129 --> 01:34:30,480
patiently been waiting behind you, and then you can ask more questions after that.

1877
01:34:31,340 --> 01:34:34,780
You know what? I'll see you guys all in court.

1878
01:34:35,040 --> 01:34:35,720
I'll file tomorrow.

1879
01:34:40,200 --> 01:34:40,340
Okay.

1880
01:34:40,350 --> 01:34:40,350
One more.

1881
01:34:40,350 --> 01:34:40,350
No.

1882
01:34:40,350 --> 01:34:40,720
Okay, thank you.

1883
01:34:41,680 --> 01:34:41,940
Wow.

1884
01:34:43,120 --> 01:34:43,700
Oh, you're getting filed.

1885
01:34:43,710 --> 01:34:45,580
Well, that's too bad. I brought my lawyer with me.

1886
01:34:45,920 --> 01:34:47,100
Okay. Go ahead.

1887
01:34:47,340 --> 01:34:49,980
Hi, my name is Kim. I'm a fairly new resident.

1888
01:34:50,660 --> 01:34:51,960
Just moved here in November.

1889
01:34:52,180 --> 01:34:52,700
Welcome.

1890
01:34:53,340 --> 01:34:56,460
Just wanted to ask three very quick questions.

1891
01:34:56,860 --> 01:35:00,780
First being, when we go to vote for whether we go with plan A or plan

1892
01:35:00,860 --> 01:35:04,000
B, is there a certain percentage of residents?

1893
01:35:04,040 --> 01:35:07,860
So if we have 3,500 residents, is there a certain number of residents that have to

1894
01:35:07,880 --> 01:35:10,210
participate in that vote for it to go either way?

1895
01:35:11,040 --> 01:35:12,460
Or how does that work?

1896
01:35:12,760 --> 01:35:16,640
I believe from what I understand, it's 51% of the votes tallied.

1897
01:35:16,940 --> 01:35:19,160
Okay. So if only 10 people vote-

1898
01:35:19,460 --> 01:35:19,930
That is correct, yes

1899
01:35:19,940 --> 01:35:20,840
... six people have to vote.

1900
01:35:21,180 --> 01:35:21,550
Absolutely.

1901
01:35:21,550 --> 01:35:22,000
Well, that would be sad.

1902
01:35:22,900 --> 01:35:26,520
Second thing, just to follow up on the other gentleman from over there,

1903
01:35:27,560 --> 01:35:31,060
that said that we just need some way to

1904
01:35:32,140 --> 01:35:35,880
get it out that there are these meetings. I'm OCD. I saw it on Facebook.

1905
01:35:35,940 --> 01:35:37,200
I immediately put it in my calendar.

1906
01:35:37,260 --> 01:35:40,600
But then tonight I'm sitting there going, "Okay, I haven't seen anything else

1907
01:35:40,660 --> 01:35:42,520
posted on Facebook to remind us that it's tonight.

1908
01:35:42,540 --> 01:35:46,400
Is it really tonight?" So then I Googled on the town website and sure enough, it

1909
01:35:46,420 --> 01:35:49,950
said it was here. But like he said, if you don't have Facebook or you don't,

1910
01:35:49,980 --> 01:35:53,320
whatever, I don't know, and I know everything costs money, but there needs to be

1911
01:35:53,760 --> 01:35:57,360
some way to get it so that everybody knows that they should come.

1912
01:35:57,420 --> 01:36:01,330
You're not going to ever have 100% because some people are oblivious to what

1913
01:36:01,420 --> 01:36:03,400
goes on around them. Some people really don't care.

1914
01:36:03,460 --> 01:36:07,220
They know what's happening, but who cares? Anyways, just my two cents.

1915
01:36:07,640 --> 01:36:10,740
And third thing, when do the tax bills come out in this?

1916
01:36:10,780 --> 01:36:11,160
June 1.

1917
01:36:12,380 --> 01:36:13,720
June 1st they go to the mail?

1918
01:36:14,140 --> 01:36:14,190
Yeah.

1919
01:36:14,900 --> 01:36:16,420
Okay. Very good. Thank you very much.

1920
01:36:16,480 --> 01:36:18,420
Yeah, in regards to the advertisement,

1921
01:36:19,280 --> 01:36:23,090
sorry, Charlotte, that I think since the utility bills are

1922
01:36:23,120 --> 01:36:26,780
already going out, to put something like this added into the utility bill

1923
01:36:26,920 --> 01:36:28,060
would be beneficial.

1924
01:36:28,700 --> 01:36:30,620
Oh, so it'll probably come with the June utility bill then?

1925
01:36:30,980 --> 01:36:31,140
Yeah.

1926
01:36:31,540 --> 01:36:31,720
Okay.

1927
01:36:32,020 --> 01:36:32,080
Yeah.

1928
01:36:32,109 --> 01:36:33,400
And it's due by the end of June?

1929
01:36:33,420 --> 01:36:37,120
And as far as the viability information session, the

1930
01:36:37,160 --> 01:36:39,800
government will be contacting just like they did the last time.

1931
01:36:39,860 --> 01:36:41,000
Yeah, we all got a letter in the mail.

1932
01:36:41,170 --> 01:36:41,170
Yeah.

1933
01:36:41,170 --> 01:36:41,170
Yeah.

1934
01:36:41,200 --> 01:36:42,520
So that's going to happen that way as well.

1935
01:36:42,720 --> 01:36:43,720
Okay, perfect. Thank you.

1936
01:36:44,640 --> 01:36:46,660
Just to follow up, I agree with what you're saying.

1937
01:36:47,140 --> 01:36:50,340
I guess it was also on our electronic sign, on our electronic

1938
01:36:50,360 --> 01:36:51,480
billboard.

1939
01:36:51,560 --> 01:36:54,520
Oh, okay. The only thing I must drive by every time it says, "If you want your

1940
01:36:54,540 --> 01:36:54,640
bill."

1941
01:36:56,360 --> 01:36:57,180
Yeah. But yes-

1942
01:36:57,460 --> 01:36:58,120
That's all it ever says to me

1943
01:36:58,130 --> 01:37:01,630
... duly noted, we will do our best to put it out there.

1944
01:37:01,840 --> 01:37:04,800
I know many of us have our own councilor Facebook pages.

1945
01:37:04,840 --> 01:37:08,170
We put it out on there, and there are a couple of residents that are amazing at

1946
01:37:08,200 --> 01:37:10,040
putting things out on Facebook.

1947
01:37:10,050 --> 01:37:10,050
Yeah.

1948
01:37:10,060 --> 01:37:11,450
But we will do better. Thank you for your input.

1949
01:37:11,460 --> 01:37:14,420
No, that's good. And that big board would be good, but it obviously needs to be a

1950
01:37:14,440 --> 01:37:17,480
longer blip because- ... I don't roll through the stop, I

1951
01:37:17,560 --> 01:37:18,499
promise.

1952
01:37:23,660 --> 01:37:24,620
Check. Check.

1953
01:37:25,620 --> 01:37:26,420
How is the mic?

1954
01:37:28,120 --> 01:37:29,140
Can you hear me, council?

1955
01:37:29,540 --> 01:37:29,810
Maybe

1956
01:37:30,740 --> 01:37:34,528
just-No, it's

1957
01:37:34,568 --> 01:37:35,708
just maybe right into the mic.

1958
01:37:36,208 --> 01:37:36,438
Yeah, just-

1959
01:37:36,438 --> 01:37:37,488
Yeah, just right in... There you go.

1960
01:37:40,088 --> 01:37:41,087
Yeah. There you go.

1961
01:37:42,368 --> 01:37:43,768
Okay. Test, test.

1962
01:37:44,068 --> 01:37:44,488
Good.

1963
01:37:44,668 --> 01:37:48,318
Okay. Good evening, council, administration, and

1964
01:37:48,448 --> 01:37:49,048
residents.

1965
01:37:50,068 --> 01:37:51,908
My name is Dan Burrin. I'm with

1966
01:37:51,948 --> 01:37:54,748
municipalmedia.ca. In

1967
01:37:54,868 --> 01:37:58,768
2013, I was elected to the Thorhild

1968
01:37:58,828 --> 01:37:59,798
County counselor,

1969
01:38:00,748 --> 01:38:04,148
or to the council. That's where I met Counselor Harris

1970
01:38:04,848 --> 01:38:07,148
at orientation in Morinville.

1971
01:38:09,688 --> 01:38:13,308
I went through absolute hell in Thorhild County.

1972
01:38:16,788 --> 01:38:17,028
What

1973
01:38:18,148 --> 01:38:21,568
I'd first like to encourage the community is

1974
01:38:21,988 --> 01:38:24,788
seek the peace as much as you can.

1975
01:38:27,208 --> 01:38:31,198
My community was turned inside out by municipal affairs, and

1976
01:38:31,388 --> 01:38:32,748
I see their tactics here.

1977
01:38:33,988 --> 01:38:37,008
I was doing some consulting in Chestermere.

1978
01:38:38,068 --> 01:38:40,668
That community got absolutely destroyed.

1979
01:38:41,808 --> 01:38:44,188
I was there consulting for a short period.

1980
01:38:45,798 --> 01:38:49,308
I was ledge services manager for a short period of time as well.

1981
01:38:51,408 --> 01:38:53,168
I had one file of

1982
01:38:53,928 --> 01:38:56,328
$400,000 that

1983
01:38:58,408 --> 01:38:59,008
their sever--

1984
01:38:59,908 --> 01:39:03,308
I'm just giving you this as an example to see what's happening across the

1985
01:39:03,328 --> 01:39:04,908
province. So

1986
01:39:05,748 --> 01:39:08,268
their severance was capped at

1987
01:39:08,328 --> 01:39:09,748
75,000.

1988
01:39:11,668 --> 01:39:15,368
There was 600,000 dispensed, 200 for one

1989
01:39:15,508 --> 01:39:18,188
staff member, 400 for another.

1990
01:39:19,148 --> 01:39:22,088
Municipal Affairs knows about it, the RCMP.

1991
01:39:22,948 --> 01:39:26,408
That was one of the files I was looking dearly to work on, but

1992
01:39:26,418 --> 01:39:27,368
unfortunately,

1993
01:39:28,288 --> 01:39:31,048
things didn't work out there for me.

1994
01:39:31,108 --> 01:39:34,688
That council ran on the basis of

1995
01:39:34,748 --> 01:39:35,668
transparency.

1996
01:39:37,158 --> 01:39:39,908
They got outright attacked by Municipal Affairs.

1997
01:39:41,128 --> 01:39:42,608
So when I was on council,

1998
01:39:43,788 --> 01:39:45,908
we were on council for four months,

1999
01:39:47,008 --> 01:39:49,948
and Municipal Affairs, the briefing notes to the minister,

2000
01:39:51,148 --> 01:39:54,368
stated that they had phone calls.

2001
01:39:56,228 --> 01:39:59,568
That's what they had was phone calls, and they instigated an

2002
01:39:59,648 --> 01:40:03,388
inspection, which was illegal and unlawful, and Municipal

2003
01:40:03,448 --> 01:40:07,168
Affairs has been doing these illegally for at least

2004
01:40:07,288 --> 01:40:08,168
30 years now,

2005
01:40:09,008 --> 01:40:12,948
probably prior to right around 1994, when

2006
01:40:12,968 --> 01:40:14,508
there was a major MGA

2007
01:40:15,428 --> 01:40:15,908
review.

2008
01:40:16,788 --> 01:40:16,948
So

2009
01:40:18,248 --> 01:40:18,548
what

2010
01:40:20,968 --> 01:40:22,228
is so concerning,

2011
01:40:23,788 --> 01:40:26,668
it shocked me. Yesterday I saw that Mr.

2012
01:40:26,768 --> 01:40:30,328
Johnsroot is no longer the official administrator,

2013
01:40:31,088 --> 01:40:34,408
and Desiree Corey was just appointed.

2014
01:40:34,468 --> 01:40:34,648
Well,

2015
01:40:35,628 --> 01:40:39,008
I believe if you look on my website, municipalmedia.ca,

2016
01:40:41,208 --> 01:40:43,228
you will find a preliminary review

2017
01:40:44,228 --> 01:40:46,888
and preliminary review debunking information.

2018
01:40:47,998 --> 01:40:49,928
Well, Desiree was part

2019
01:40:51,148 --> 01:40:53,848
of that with a fellow by the name of Travis Nosco.

2020
01:40:54,468 --> 01:40:55,018
You'll see their

2021
01:40:57,068 --> 01:41:01,028
names on the report. Well, that report and the minister briefing

2022
01:41:01,068 --> 01:41:03,908
notes was not authorized by legislation

2023
01:41:05,708 --> 01:41:06,028
and-

2024
01:41:06,428 --> 01:41:08,048
Sir, may I ask, do you have a question, sir?

2025
01:41:08,848 --> 01:41:12,468
So what I'm doing is just sharing with you that

2026
01:41:13,668 --> 01:41:15,568
that was all false information.

2027
01:41:16,428 --> 01:41:19,248
Municipal Affairs is just, from what I just saw

2028
01:41:20,148 --> 01:41:23,768
yesterday posted on social media, the ministerial

2029
01:41:23,868 --> 01:41:27,688
order, and that's got to be the same person that's been

2030
01:41:27,728 --> 01:41:31,448
appointed as an official administrator that published false

2031
01:41:31,508 --> 01:41:34,628
information about Thorhild County.

2032
01:41:34,688 --> 01:41:38,048
And that preliminary review is illegal.

2033
01:41:38,628 --> 01:41:42,528
It's not authorized. It says right in the briefing notes that it's

2034
01:41:42,588 --> 01:41:45,968
not authorized in legislation. And what they told us,

2035
01:41:46,488 --> 01:41:47,548
it's voluntary.

2036
01:41:48,948 --> 01:41:50,667
So they outright lied to us,

2037
01:41:51,708 --> 01:41:53,628
had us go through this process,

2038
01:41:56,488 --> 01:41:56,708
and

2039
01:41:57,588 --> 01:41:59,068
then they used that to

2040
01:42:00,208 --> 01:42:04,008
information in an inspection. Well, an inspection is

2041
01:42:04,088 --> 01:42:07,388
never to look into conduct. A public inquiry is.

2042
01:42:07,978 --> 01:42:10,168
So I'm not trying to bombard you folks.

2043
01:42:10,288 --> 01:42:13,768
I was trying to condense it. But what's

2044
01:42:13,988 --> 01:42:14,648
happening here

2045
01:42:15,928 --> 01:42:19,108
is you councilors have to make some serious noise,

2046
01:42:19,788 --> 01:42:22,588
and what I would do is demand

2047
01:42:23,848 --> 01:42:25,117
a municipal inspection,

2048
01:42:26,228 --> 01:42:29,428
and you can develop terms of reference.

2049
01:42:29,988 --> 01:42:33,468
I'm willing to come out and do a town hall and step

2050
01:42:34,208 --> 01:42:37,228
you folks, the administration, and the community

2051
01:42:38,008 --> 01:42:40,807
through the process. I know it very well.

2052
01:42:42,028 --> 01:42:42,168
I

2053
01:42:44,168 --> 01:42:46,208
had a laugh the other day. Some councilors-

2054
01:42:46,288 --> 01:42:48,288
Sir, we're going to have to ask you to ask a question.

2055
01:42:48,318 --> 01:42:49,488
There's people waiting, so-

2056
01:42:49,548 --> 01:42:51,348
So what I would like to do,

2057
01:42:52,988 --> 01:42:54,308
what I'd like to do is come out,

2058
01:42:55,388 --> 01:42:58,988
share my situation, encourage you guys to all go on my website.

2059
01:42:59,868 --> 01:43:02,288
And as a municipal entity,

2060
01:43:03,128 --> 01:43:04,468
the way you people act,

2061
01:43:05,648 --> 01:43:06,428
you can act,

2062
01:43:07,428 --> 01:43:11,388
try and get the facts, because that's what an inspection or inquiry is about.

2063
01:43:11,508 --> 01:43:15,268
It's not a punitive process. And you can stop this corruption that's

2064
01:43:15,308 --> 01:43:17,117
moving from community to community.

2065
01:43:17,188 --> 01:43:20,388
If I may. We've asked for a viability review.

2066
01:43:20,998 --> 01:43:22,448
We've been through a compliance review.

2067
01:43:22,568 --> 01:43:25,668
I think we're going through a process, and quite frankly, there's always going to

2068
01:43:25,708 --> 01:43:27,568
be challenges between the province municipalities.

2069
01:43:27,608 --> 01:43:28,208
But right now,

2070
01:43:29,428 --> 01:43:32,208
we have a relationship with them, and I think right now

2071
01:43:32,288 --> 01:43:36,088
there's some concerns, but overall, I think the

2072
01:43:36,108 --> 01:43:38,728
relationship's good. And so if there's anything else, or-

2073
01:43:38,968 --> 01:43:39,668
Well, see-

2074
01:43:40,028 --> 01:43:41,388
There's somebody waiting to ask a question.

2075
01:43:41,628 --> 01:43:45,356
Sure. And in closingAn inspection and inquiry, the

2076
01:43:45,436 --> 01:43:48,896
evidence is documented by oath or affirmation.

2077
01:43:50,056 --> 01:43:50,066
Sir-

2078
01:43:50,136 --> 01:43:51,616
And that's where you would have-

2079
01:43:51,696 --> 01:43:55,226
Sir, I totally respect your voice,

2080
01:43:56,356 --> 01:44:00,236
but at this point in time, I think it's a little bit off topic and offside,

2081
01:44:00,256 --> 01:44:02,696
and we do have a resident just behind you.

2082
01:44:03,216 --> 01:44:06,876
So I would ask you to leave the podium and let the

2083
01:44:06,896 --> 01:44:10,826
resident ask his question specifically to this open house, which is

2084
01:44:10,916 --> 01:44:14,746
on the topic is the budget and the viability

2085
01:44:14,856 --> 01:44:18,436
review and the town as itself. So I

2086
01:44:18,536 --> 01:44:22,296
truly, I respect your voice, but let's move on to our

2087
01:44:22,336 --> 01:44:22,796
citizens.

2088
01:44:23,476 --> 01:44:25,956
So, well, thank you for your time, and I encourage-

2089
01:44:27,876 --> 01:44:31,566
I would just like to say, if you wouldn't mind emailing us,

2090
01:44:31,756 --> 01:44:34,256
if you wanted to email us the information,

2091
01:44:35,676 --> 01:44:38,396
that would be helpful, and we could have dialogue that way.

2092
01:44:39,316 --> 01:44:43,036
Yeah, I could email it. I'd like interaction from

2093
01:44:43,096 --> 01:44:45,236
council, admin, or the community.

2094
01:44:45,796 --> 01:44:49,376
I was going to ask for your contact info if I could.

2095
01:44:49,956 --> 01:44:49,966
Sure.

2096
01:44:49,976 --> 01:44:51,396
If I could come down there.

2097
01:44:51,696 --> 01:44:55,616
Sure. I'll give that to you. And, my goal wasn't to be

2098
01:44:55,736 --> 01:44:57,586
contentious or anything, but I just-

2099
01:44:57,596 --> 01:44:57,606
No

2100
01:44:57,606 --> 01:45:01,166
... wanted to give you all, council, administration, and the

2101
01:45:01,236 --> 01:45:02,696
community, some words of encouragement.

2102
01:45:02,716 --> 01:45:04,196
We're just worried about the people behind you waiting-

2103
01:45:04,346 --> 01:45:04,346
Yep

2104
01:45:04,346 --> 01:45:05,656
... to ask you a question, sir. So thank you.

2105
01:45:05,716 --> 01:45:06,496
Thank you very much.

2106
01:45:08,996 --> 01:45:09,856
No

2107
01:45:09,956 --> 01:45:14,186
problem.

2108
01:45:14,196 --> 01:45:17,746
It seems our town has gotten ourselves in a little bit of a mess.

2109
01:45:19,016 --> 01:45:19,616
We voted

2110
01:45:20,716 --> 01:45:24,136
for a new council. They've been doing a wonderful job, working hard.

2111
01:45:25,116 --> 01:45:27,296
They hired people to help us get out of our mess.

2112
01:45:27,836 --> 01:45:28,816
They've been working hard,

2113
01:45:29,896 --> 01:45:31,236
but there's that cloud

2114
01:45:32,296 --> 01:45:36,036
that hangs over our head that's not going to go away.

2115
01:45:37,436 --> 01:45:37,706
And

2116
01:45:38,636 --> 01:45:39,416
beginning of June,

2117
01:45:40,276 --> 01:45:44,176
we're going to have to make a decision, plan A or plan B.

2118
01:45:45,556 --> 01:45:48,956
We haven't heard from plan B. Obviously,

2119
01:45:49,796 --> 01:45:50,476
you're plan A.

2120
01:45:52,016 --> 01:45:54,506
So we haven't heard from plan B, so we're just waiting and waiting.

2121
01:45:54,506 --> 01:45:55,576
I wonder what's going to happen.

2122
01:45:56,796 --> 01:45:59,476
What are they going to do? What's our options? We'll find out.

2123
01:46:00,956 --> 01:46:04,936
But my question is, that cloud that hangs over our head

2124
01:46:05,976 --> 01:46:07,076
is that total debt

2125
01:46:08,176 --> 01:46:10,756
that was put up upon us from previous council.

2126
01:46:11,216 --> 01:46:12,956
Hmm.

2127
01:46:13,136 --> 01:46:13,426
When

2128
01:46:14,996 --> 01:46:17,096
do you expect that cloud

2129
01:46:18,236 --> 01:46:18,916
to disappear-

2130
01:46:19,216 --> 01:46:20,066
Wow. That's a very good question

2131
01:46:20,066 --> 01:46:21,496
... and sunny days to start coming?

2132
01:46:22,596 --> 01:46:24,256
And that's one question.

2133
01:46:24,456 --> 01:46:24,576
Yep.

2134
01:46:25,056 --> 01:46:28,556
Now, with the tax, you said 8.2%,

2135
01:46:29,456 --> 01:46:33,396
7.7 over the next couple of years. We've heard rumors that, oh,

2136
01:46:33,456 --> 01:46:37,276
and we've seen it on the news, Gibsons going to be hit with 30%

2137
01:46:37,396 --> 01:46:39,936
tax increase, 80% tax increase.

2138
01:46:40,006 --> 01:46:40,256
Hmm.

2139
01:46:41,036 --> 01:46:43,076
Can you publicly say that

2140
01:46:44,216 --> 01:46:46,556
no, you're not going to get no 30% increase?

2141
01:46:46,676 --> 01:46:49,016
No, you're not going to get no 80% increase.

2142
01:46:49,436 --> 01:46:51,476
We're going to hang around that seven, eight percent

2143
01:46:52,316 --> 01:46:52,876
increase, which

2144
01:46:53,776 --> 01:46:56,876
we can manage. It's happening everywhere.

2145
01:46:56,916 --> 01:46:59,935
Look at the City of Edmonton. Look at communities throughout Alberta, throughout

2146
01:47:00,076 --> 01:47:01,776
Canada. They're getting hit.

2147
01:47:01,796 --> 01:47:02,136
Yeah.

2148
01:47:02,216 --> 01:47:02,456
So.

2149
01:47:04,116 --> 01:47:05,276
On your first question-

2150
01:47:05,496 --> 01:47:05,876
Yeah

2151
01:47:05,896 --> 01:47:05,896
...

2152
01:47:06,816 --> 01:47:10,376
as I said, we have a debt plan. We're paying down at minimum

2153
01:47:10,496 --> 01:47:13,806
2.6, but we have some recovery plans on development charges.

2154
01:47:13,836 --> 01:47:16,836
We're hoping to aggressively get the debt down more.

2155
01:47:16,956 --> 01:47:20,516
I'd say within three to five years, we're hoping to be at what we consider sunny

2156
01:47:20,576 --> 01:47:23,616
days from a debt management perspective, and so in a much better place.

2157
01:47:23,816 --> 01:47:26,416
But it's going to take three to five years to be able to get into a really good

2158
01:47:26,456 --> 01:47:27,625
place. So that's

2159
01:47:28,476 --> 01:47:32,176
part A. Part B, to your question, definitively, we've developed a

2160
01:47:32,216 --> 01:47:36,066
plan 8%, 7.7, and we mean it. But we've had to make some really

2161
01:47:36,116 --> 01:47:39,036
hard decisions to get there. And so that's from my perspective.

2162
01:47:39,096 --> 01:47:42,496
I'd like to council maybe to kind of to give you the

2163
01:47:42,516 --> 01:47:44,776
definitive answer from a budget perspective, yes.

2164
01:47:44,916 --> 01:47:46,376
So council, what are your thoughts?

2165
01:47:46,396 --> 01:47:50,166
So we're looking at five years to be at what on our total debt five years from now?

2166
01:47:50,476 --> 01:47:50,696
Pardon me?

2167
01:47:50,706 --> 01:47:51,876
Besides seeing that 12.7.

2168
01:47:52,956 --> 01:47:56,636
In five years, if everything goes right,

2169
01:47:57,896 --> 01:48:00,736
at the end of five years, where would that 12.7 be?

2170
01:48:00,755 --> 01:48:01,896
What would that figure be?

2171
01:48:03,935 --> 01:48:07,796
So we go down by 500,000 a year on the operating

2172
01:48:07,876 --> 01:48:10,916
lines right now is what I have forecasted in the plan.

2173
01:48:12,156 --> 01:48:15,856
The firetruck loan is done as of

2174
01:48:16,036 --> 01:48:17,836
2029, if I remember right.

2175
01:48:19,836 --> 01:48:21,716
What's the other one in there?

2176
01:48:25,956 --> 01:48:26,996
Those are the big ones.

2177
01:48:28,616 --> 01:48:31,256
The water meter replacement one is gone this year.

2178
01:48:31,316 --> 01:48:34,916
So we're going to be down by the 2.6 million.

2179
01:48:34,976 --> 01:48:37,325
That's a low number, though. There's another

2180
01:48:38,136 --> 01:48:41,896
principal portion that I can't break out currently in 2029.

2181
01:48:42,156 --> 01:48:45,196
So it's probably closer to, if I had to guess,

2182
01:48:45,436 --> 01:48:47,756
2.75, 2.8, that we'll be down.

2183
01:48:48,316 --> 01:48:48,515
That would be good.

2184
01:48:48,596 --> 01:48:52,276
So you'll get down to about 10 million after three years, and then after that, it

2185
01:48:52,316 --> 01:48:54,436
just steadily decreases by the same amount.

2186
01:48:54,596 --> 01:48:57,176
So within five years, you're saying three million.

2187
01:48:58,116 --> 01:49:02,056
No, it would probably be closer to 7.5,

2188
01:49:02,836 --> 01:49:03,796
1.5.

2189
01:49:06,076 --> 01:49:09,176
Yeah, so you'd go down a minimum of

2190
01:49:09,396 --> 01:49:13,276
1.75 to two million over the two

2191
01:49:13,336 --> 01:49:14,976
years after the three-year period.

2192
01:49:15,696 --> 01:49:18,136
So we're going to continually, steadily decrease it.

2193
01:49:18,376 --> 01:49:22,046
It's probably, again, at a high level, just doing math in my head,

2194
01:49:22,556 --> 01:49:25,596
you're probably looking at about four and a half

2195
01:49:26,776 --> 01:49:30,096
million, I guess I'll say, as a round number after five years.

2196
01:49:30,316 --> 01:49:33,216
So after five years, four and a half million, you're looking at that 12.7.

2197
01:49:33,666 --> 01:49:33,746
Yeah.

2198
01:49:33,936 --> 01:49:34,136
Okay.

2199
01:49:34,316 --> 01:49:34,496
But-

2200
01:49:35,136 --> 01:49:38,536
And then the other question was, can you

2201
01:49:39,716 --> 01:49:40,456
eliminate the...

2202
01:49:41,896 --> 01:49:44,776
What their people were saying, the rumors of 30 to 80%.

2203
01:49:44,836 --> 01:49:47,116
Like I said, eight to seven percent-

2204
01:49:47,416 --> 01:49:47,856
I think-

2205
01:49:47,886 --> 01:49:50,416
... eight percent, seven percent, we can live with.

2206
01:49:50,516 --> 01:49:52,756
That was the whole point of this evening, sir, was-

2207
01:49:52,796 --> 01:49:52,846
Yeah

2208
01:49:52,896 --> 01:49:56,880
... honestly... is over the last five months, we've worked very diligently to

2209
01:49:56,920 --> 01:50:00,820
develop a financial plan, which included a lot of hard decisions to get to

2210
01:50:00,900 --> 01:50:04,520
8%. And we can, again, definitively guarantee that

2211
01:50:04,560 --> 01:50:07,880
8% is what we're going to charge this year, and seven, seven, but we have to

2212
01:50:07,960 --> 01:50:11,400
right-size our services and staffing to get there.

2213
01:50:11,800 --> 01:50:15,780
But yes, that is right now the plan that we have, and there's no

2214
01:50:15,820 --> 01:50:19,690
surprises behind it. So, that is our financial plan, and

2215
01:50:20,040 --> 01:50:22,120
that's the taxes we'll be seeing over the next three to five years.

2216
01:50:23,500 --> 01:50:24,480
Eight, eight, and sevens.

2217
01:50:25,920 --> 01:50:28,460
So will we see a 30% or 80% increase?

2218
01:50:28,800 --> 01:50:28,960
Nope.

2219
01:50:29,340 --> 01:50:29,440
No?

2220
01:50:29,640 --> 01:50:33,260
Nope. That's the work that we did to, again, right-size our services and our

2221
01:50:33,270 --> 01:50:37,100
staffing. So we started at 120, we got it down to 50,

2222
01:50:37,360 --> 01:50:40,360
60. Then we went to council, asked if they'd be okay with some service-level

2223
01:50:40,420 --> 01:50:44,280
reductions. They said yes. And so then we developed a

2224
01:50:44,300 --> 01:50:47,650
plan around service decrease. For example, the rink will be closed in the

2225
01:50:47,700 --> 01:50:48,220
summertime.

2226
01:50:49,100 --> 01:50:49,620
That's one.

2227
01:50:50,960 --> 01:50:54,280
We're, again, a little bit less, not pothole filling, we're doing that, but less

2228
01:50:54,360 --> 01:50:56,080
line painting, things like that. So another one.

2229
01:50:57,260 --> 01:51:00,420
There's a few others. By-law is going to be cut down a little bit.

2230
01:51:00,440 --> 01:51:04,100
We're going to be more reactive on by-law than proactive for a little while.

2231
01:51:04,280 --> 01:51:05,660
But we're going to be rebuilding those things.

2232
01:51:05,740 --> 01:51:09,440
But on the most part, services aren't going to be any, what I'd call,

2233
01:51:10,120 --> 01:51:12,980
catastrophic changes. But there are changes, for sure.

2234
01:51:13,120 --> 01:51:16,780
Yeah. Just letting you know as I feel as a

2235
01:51:16,820 --> 01:51:17,240
citizen,

2236
01:51:18,380 --> 01:51:22,220
personally for me, I can't speak for everybody else, but eight, seven, and

2237
01:51:22,260 --> 01:51:23,870
seven, in that ballpark,

2238
01:51:24,700 --> 01:51:25,560
I'm comfortable with.

2239
01:51:26,860 --> 01:51:30,260
Maintain the course you're going, we'll be fine.

2240
01:51:30,360 --> 01:51:33,670
But like I said, we need that information going in there that,

2241
01:51:34,380 --> 01:51:36,730
all of a sudden, okay, we've got you guys. You're good.

2242
01:51:36,800 --> 01:51:39,560
Three years come down, the eight's gone, the seven's gone, the seven's gone.

2243
01:51:39,580 --> 01:51:41,280
All of a sudden, oh, s**t.

2244
01:51:42,340 --> 01:51:43,000
Sorry, guys.

2245
01:51:43,960 --> 01:51:46,680
Things didn't go quite well. You're getting hit with 30%.

2246
01:51:46,740 --> 01:51:46,840
Yeah.

2247
01:51:47,820 --> 01:51:48,850
You're going, "What the hell do we do now?"

2248
01:51:48,900 --> 01:51:52,720
That's a super fair question. One of the things that we did, I

2249
01:51:52,760 --> 01:51:55,260
mentioned in the discussion is what we

2250
01:51:55,700 --> 01:51:58,940
call conservative budgeting in our world.

2251
01:51:58,980 --> 01:52:02,840
Which means that the revenue we put in, we know we're going to get, and the

2252
01:52:02,860 --> 01:52:06,180
expenses that we put in, we know we can control. So that is our budget.

2253
01:52:06,220 --> 01:52:09,960
And so we have a very strong, controllable budget, unlike what you had before,

2254
01:52:10,020 --> 01:52:13,040
which was dependent on revenues that may come in and may not.

2255
01:52:13,340 --> 01:52:16,560
And that was the problem, is that the revenues didn't come in, but it was overly

2256
01:52:16,580 --> 01:52:19,660
expensive. We're not doing that anymore. So we've fixed all that.

2257
01:52:19,700 --> 01:52:23,260
And so we are 100% confident with good management.

2258
01:52:23,320 --> 01:52:25,360
We will hit that 8% for sure.

2259
01:52:25,370 --> 01:52:25,370
Okay.

2260
01:52:25,400 --> 01:52:27,880
And council, again, council questions, comments?

2261
01:52:29,600 --> 01:52:31,600
I'm from here. I've been here all my life.

2262
01:52:31,780 --> 01:52:35,180
My wife will make me move if that were to happen.

2263
01:52:35,720 --> 01:52:36,250
So that's

2264
01:52:37,580 --> 01:52:39,760
under my watch, and I don't think so.

2265
01:52:40,760 --> 01:52:41,180
Thanks, Martin.

2266
01:52:41,800 --> 01:52:43,070
I just want to reiterate,

2267
01:52:43,880 --> 01:52:47,820
if we thought that we had to tax our residents to a point that they couldn't afford

2268
01:52:47,880 --> 01:52:48,440
to live here,

2269
01:52:49,740 --> 01:52:53,460
we wouldn't be doing it. We'd just hand in the keys and walk

2270
01:52:53,540 --> 01:52:55,680
away. We fought really hard for this.

2271
01:52:55,720 --> 01:52:59,680
We had to make some tough decisions about what to cut, how much to cut, where to

2272
01:52:59,720 --> 01:53:03,670
cut. And with guidance from Bloom and their team, we've

2273
01:53:03,700 --> 01:53:06,920
done so to a point that we feel that it hasn't impacted residents.

2274
01:53:07,040 --> 01:53:10,620
But of course, we still have to. The other point I wanted to make is Sturgeon

2275
01:53:10,680 --> 01:53:12,620
County has stated that we would pay our debt.

2276
01:53:12,680 --> 01:53:16,329
So even if we dissolve, we're going to pay this one way or another.

2277
01:53:16,560 --> 01:53:20,420
They have also stated, it was stated to me personally, that we will not get a

2278
01:53:20,460 --> 01:53:23,060
seat on council. They will divide us into two wards,

2279
01:53:24,580 --> 01:53:27,950
and they'll take us on. So we wouldn't have an actual

2280
01:53:28,280 --> 01:53:29,400
resident on council.

2281
01:53:30,500 --> 01:53:30,900
Therefore,

2282
01:53:32,020 --> 01:53:33,740
we wouldn't necessarily get a say.

2283
01:53:34,380 --> 01:53:36,380
Okay, just one quick statement and I'll

2284
01:53:37,200 --> 01:53:37,560
sit down.

2285
01:53:38,230 --> 01:53:38,410
Mm-hmm.

2286
01:53:38,440 --> 01:53:39,350
On transparency,

2287
01:53:40,500 --> 01:53:42,650
when you're going to inform the public of what's happening-

2288
01:53:42,890 --> 01:53:42,980
Mm

2289
01:53:45,300 --> 01:53:48,260
... tell it to them all. Tell it all.

2290
01:53:49,760 --> 01:53:53,580
Example, the grass clippings. Everybody was going, "What?

2291
01:53:53,820 --> 01:53:54,460
Huh? Who?"

2292
01:53:55,460 --> 01:53:55,730
And then

2293
01:53:56,620 --> 01:53:57,380
what's your options?

2294
01:53:58,540 --> 01:54:01,810
We were told it's closed, but we weren't told these are your options that it's

2295
01:54:01,820 --> 01:54:02,200
closed.

2296
01:54:03,340 --> 01:54:06,460
Yeah, it was a decision you had to make. Save money, great, thanks.

2297
01:54:07,320 --> 01:54:09,640
You saved us money. But give us the options.

2298
01:54:09,680 --> 01:54:13,280
And when somebody asks a question on social media, because that's where we

2299
01:54:13,320 --> 01:54:15,290
get our communication at going on,

2300
01:54:16,440 --> 01:54:17,440
be kind enough to respond.

2301
01:54:18,640 --> 01:54:20,980
Because I've asked questions, no response,

2302
01:54:22,000 --> 01:54:25,280
nothing. People was asking questions, no response. We don't know.

2303
01:54:26,240 --> 01:54:26,680
We work

2304
01:54:27,620 --> 01:54:31,160
6:00 in the morning to 6:00 at night. We can't pick up the phone and call the town.

2305
01:54:31,680 --> 01:54:34,310
Otherwise, that town's phone's going to be ringing and ringing and ringing and

2306
01:54:34,380 --> 01:54:38,160
ringing, answering the same question all the time by 60 different residents.

2307
01:54:39,280 --> 01:54:39,460
So,

2308
01:54:41,000 --> 01:54:44,840
thanks for your time and the great work you've been doing, and thanks for everybody

2309
01:54:45,040 --> 01:54:45,640
for letting me speak.

2310
01:54:46,280 --> 01:54:46,520
Thank you.

2311
01:54:46,730 --> 01:54:47,010
Thanks, Martin.

2312
01:54:47,020 --> 01:54:47,460
Thank you.

2313
01:54:48,260 --> 01:54:48,300
I

2314
01:54:49,260 --> 01:54:51,860
want to say just one thing.

2315
01:54:52,820 --> 01:54:56,439
I'm not going to lie, when we talked about

2316
01:54:56,480 --> 01:54:57,040
viability,

2317
01:54:57,980 --> 01:54:58,500
and when

2318
01:55:00,140 --> 01:55:03,980
we talked about Val, you're having a real hard time with that coffee mug tonight.

2319
01:55:06,140 --> 01:55:09,850
When we first got in and we really truly

2320
01:55:09,880 --> 01:55:13,830
began to realize the dire strait that

2321
01:55:13,860 --> 01:55:14,610
the town was in,

2322
01:55:16,220 --> 01:55:18,840
I was the first person to say,

2323
01:55:21,000 --> 01:55:24,720
"Hamlet looks really good." Hamlet looks good from a

2324
01:55:24,760 --> 01:55:27,760
perspective of I'll pay lower taxes.

2325
01:55:29,280 --> 01:55:32,960
Kids are all grown. It's my husband and I.

2326
01:55:33,100 --> 01:55:35,500
What services are we using? Okay.

2327
01:55:37,780 --> 01:55:40,160
Fast-forward to six months

2328
01:55:40,980 --> 01:55:44,580
and the fact, and I

2329
01:55:44,640 --> 01:55:45,440
saw

2330
01:55:46,820 --> 01:55:50,040
1.5, not 2.1. I saw 1.5

2331
01:55:50,100 --> 01:55:51,960
imbalance in the last budget

2332
01:55:52,880 --> 01:55:56,500
in the fact that the land that's next to my house, they were budgeting as

2333
01:55:56,540 --> 01:55:59,520
revenue the sale of that land, which still hasn't sold,

2334
01:55:59,600 --> 01:56:03,488
thankfully. The-So, I really

2335
01:56:03,528 --> 01:56:04,757
didn't think that

2336
01:56:05,808 --> 01:56:09,708
balancing a budget inside of the first six months was going to

2337
01:56:09,768 --> 01:56:13,748
even be remotely possible. I absolutely didn't think that we

2338
01:56:13,788 --> 01:56:16,458
would be able to pay down some debt inside of a year.

2339
01:56:17,728 --> 01:56:20,848
And I now believe that that's all possible.

2340
01:56:21,208 --> 01:56:24,868
I do also believe that in time, and perhaps with partnering

2341
01:56:25,848 --> 01:56:27,348
through the industrial heartland,

2342
01:56:28,388 --> 01:56:29,208
revenue sharing,

2343
01:56:30,008 --> 01:56:33,588
partnering, collaboration, whatever we want to call it, I

2344
01:56:33,828 --> 01:56:37,048
not only think that becoming a hamlet is a bad idea,

2345
01:56:38,308 --> 01:56:41,088
I think staying a town is a brilliant idea.

2346
01:56:42,208 --> 01:56:46,028
From a financial perspective, from an accounting perspective, I believe in the

2347
01:56:46,068 --> 01:56:49,308
budget that they've put forth. It makes sense.

2348
01:56:49,868 --> 01:56:53,638
And I do believe that we can remain viable and that we can

2349
01:56:53,708 --> 01:56:55,188
remain a community

2350
01:56:56,088 --> 01:56:59,288
amongst ourselves. So that's just my statement.

2351
01:57:03,408 --> 01:57:07,328
Once again, Curtis Toll, long time resident of Gibbons.

2352
01:57:08,688 --> 01:57:11,508
Just wanted to stay on topic, so Councilor Morrison

2353
01:57:12,428 --> 01:57:15,068
reminds me that it has to be a budget-related question.

2354
01:57:16,128 --> 01:57:16,988
Just want to see,

2355
01:57:17,908 --> 01:57:21,658
after the departure of our consulting team that has come in and

2356
01:57:22,048 --> 01:57:22,728
saved the town,

2357
01:57:24,088 --> 01:57:26,708
just want to know, who are we replacing that role with?

2358
01:57:26,768 --> 01:57:30,628
Is there another CAO, or is it the administrator

2359
01:57:30,688 --> 01:57:34,448
that everyone can see and meet on the YouTube of

2360
01:57:34,508 --> 01:57:38,128
council meeting at nine o'clock last Tuesday night?

2361
01:57:40,448 --> 01:57:40,738
What

2362
01:57:41,628 --> 01:57:42,658
we can tell you is

2363
01:57:43,728 --> 01:57:47,288
when the Bloom team has come to an end, believe it or not, the previous

2364
01:57:47,348 --> 01:57:49,408
council hired them to hire a new CAO.

2365
01:57:49,568 --> 01:57:49,748
So,

2366
01:57:51,348 --> 01:57:55,128
that would be their gift to us going out to ensure that we get a very good

2367
01:57:55,168 --> 01:57:58,888
person to fill that role as a CAO. So that's the

2368
01:57:59,488 --> 01:58:00,468
plan going forward.

2369
01:58:01,668 --> 01:58:05,628
And is it only just the CAO wage or

2370
01:58:05,688 --> 01:58:09,188
will we have another assistant CAO, an administrator, and

2371
01:58:09,288 --> 01:58:10,268
financial one as well?

2372
01:58:10,448 --> 01:58:11,688
We'll need a...

2373
01:58:13,268 --> 01:58:13,338
Go ahead.

2374
01:58:14,868 --> 01:58:18,228
A town this size, we never should have had an assistant CAO.

2375
01:58:18,328 --> 01:58:20,968
No, we won't have one.

2376
01:58:23,788 --> 01:58:24,528
We do need

2377
01:58:26,148 --> 01:58:27,748
financial support, obviously.

2378
01:58:28,968 --> 01:58:32,738
And I have to tell you, there's actually a lot of nuances to

2379
01:58:33,108 --> 01:58:36,128
municipal finance that are a little bit odd.

2380
01:58:36,138 --> 01:58:38,868
The fact that y'all love it is beyond my comprehension.

2381
01:58:42,288 --> 01:58:44,848
So there's still a finance team that has to be there, an element.

2382
01:58:45,788 --> 01:58:48,168
Whether that's on-site, whether that's

2383
01:58:48,208 --> 01:58:52,198
contracted, we don't know yet. But one of the things,

2384
01:58:52,248 --> 01:58:54,838
as Charlotte just mentioned, sorry, Councilor St.

2385
01:58:55,028 --> 01:58:56,248
Germain mentioned,

2386
01:58:57,248 --> 01:59:01,148
is that the previous council actually brought

2387
01:59:01,168 --> 01:59:02,748
the Bloom team in to

2388
01:59:03,788 --> 01:59:06,728
hire a CAO as a headhunter.

2389
01:59:08,288 --> 01:59:11,657
And we thank them for that, thank them for the introduction.

2390
01:59:12,588 --> 01:59:16,468
But also, to address some of the

2391
01:59:16,508 --> 01:59:17,918
concerns with regard to

2392
01:59:19,668 --> 01:59:22,688
we didn't put it out for tender, that contract and that time.

2393
01:59:23,788 --> 01:59:27,638
They were thoroughly vetted and investigated by just about, if not

2394
01:59:27,748 --> 01:59:31,548
all persons on this table. And so

2395
01:59:31,588 --> 01:59:35,148
much so that we contacted some of their clients to actually

2396
01:59:35,188 --> 01:59:38,248
get a little bit of insight and recommendation as well.

2397
01:59:38,288 --> 01:59:42,278
So they didn't come in blind and without knowledge.

2398
01:59:42,348 --> 01:59:44,788
But moving forward, we will have a CAO.

2399
01:59:44,908 --> 01:59:48,768
We absolutely will not have an assistant CAO.

2400
01:59:48,828 --> 01:59:52,348
We were overstaffed in this town by about 30%, and that's been

2401
01:59:52,368 --> 01:59:53,068
right-sized.

2402
01:59:54,368 --> 01:59:58,088
And now with regards to financial support,

2403
01:59:58,288 --> 02:00:00,628
because we won't have the dial-a-friend contract,

2404
02:00:02,008 --> 02:00:05,388
what financial officer or

2405
02:00:05,428 --> 02:00:08,898
subcontract will be put into place, and is that reflective in

2406
02:00:08,928 --> 02:00:09,888
this budget?

2407
02:00:13,268 --> 02:00:17,178
I think what's really key and important is what we did when we took

2408
02:00:17,228 --> 02:00:20,938
on the contract, we actually took the exact salaries that you paid your

2409
02:00:20,948 --> 02:00:24,737
director of finance, corporate services, your CAO, and your

2410
02:00:24,748 --> 02:00:27,848
assistant CAO, and we used that for our contract cost.

2411
02:00:27,908 --> 02:00:31,568
So you have ample funds to pay for a CAO, a

2412
02:00:31,688 --> 02:00:35,188
director of finance, and no longer an assistant CAO, but you are going to need

2413
02:00:35,228 --> 02:00:38,568
something, what we would probably call a director of operations, which would help

2414
02:00:38,608 --> 02:00:41,008
with the leadership, and basically the training.

2415
02:00:41,038 --> 02:00:44,498
And so you have ample funds to move that money from contract services

2416
02:00:44,868 --> 02:00:48,188
back over to salaries, and that's what we planned for, to make sure that you had

2417
02:00:48,228 --> 02:00:50,808
enough money to hire people. I can assure you this, though.

2418
02:00:51,868 --> 02:00:55,588
It's a fallacy. A good CAO is going to cost exactly what I

2419
02:00:55,668 --> 02:00:56,428
cost right now.

2420
02:00:56,878 --> 02:00:56,878
Yeah.

2421
02:00:57,088 --> 02:01:00,028
A good finance officer, it's going to cost maybe a little bit less, right?

2422
02:01:00,268 --> 02:01:03,088
We were about to lower ours because there was some heavy lifting, and the director

2423
02:01:03,108 --> 02:01:05,307
of operations, about the same. There's not going to be a big savings.

2424
02:01:05,588 --> 02:01:09,128
So that's wrong. We're charging basically the going rate for those

2425
02:01:09,148 --> 02:01:13,008
positions right now. And so it's reasonable, but you're covered

2426
02:01:13,028 --> 02:01:16,918
because you'll be able to move the money that's being used for us up and we are...

2427
02:01:16,948 --> 02:01:20,808
Again, I've told this council many times, we are countywide.

2428
02:01:20,848 --> 02:01:24,088
We're in about five or six municipalities doing this exact same thing in other

2429
02:01:24,108 --> 02:01:27,928
places with other individuals. We're not a permanent

2430
02:01:28,008 --> 02:01:31,908
solution, right? But we're very committed to this council and this community.

2431
02:01:31,968 --> 02:01:34,878
We loved working with you guys, and I promised them we wouldn't leave until things

2432
02:01:34,888 --> 02:01:37,307
were fixed. And we're sticking to that promise.

2433
02:01:37,608 --> 02:01:39,728
And with good recommendations for replacement.

2434
02:01:40,188 --> 02:01:40,588
Yeah.

2435
02:01:40,608 --> 02:01:43,968
Yeah. And we'll help. We will help find very good replacements.

2436
02:01:44,008 --> 02:01:47,918
It's important. Getting a good CAO is going to be critical to the success of

2437
02:01:47,948 --> 02:01:51,388
this municipality. And so we want to make sure we help do that.

2438
02:01:51,408 --> 02:01:54,258
We do hiring for CAOs, have been doing it for some time.

2439
02:01:54,278 --> 02:01:56,018
And I can say this, the ones that we've hired

2440
02:01:57,228 --> 02:02:00,208
have lasted the test of time. At Redwater, Bon Accord.

2441
02:02:00,488 --> 02:02:04,288
There's been many municipalities that we've supported the hiring of those CAOs, and

2442
02:02:04,948 --> 02:02:06,468
we'll continue that with this council.

2443
02:02:07,608 --> 02:02:07,818
Yeah, I just want to make sure-

2444
02:02:07,818 --> 02:02:09,508
We're doing that at no extra charge too, by the way.

2445
02:02:09,888 --> 02:02:13,128
We're not charging for a recruitment cost or strategic planning cost or anything

2446
02:02:13,168 --> 02:02:13,438
like that.

2447
02:02:14,008 --> 02:02:14,798
Perfect, thanks.

2448
02:02:15,008 --> 02:02:15,568
Okay.

2449
02:02:15,668 --> 02:02:17,848
I just wanted to make sure there was no gap in services.

2450
02:02:18,148 --> 02:02:18,248
Yeah.

2451
02:02:18,448 --> 02:02:22,168
You guys, Tail Light Warranty, you're gone, and we still don't have a

2452
02:02:22,228 --> 02:02:23,288
CAO in place-

2453
02:02:23,298 --> 02:02:23,298
No

2454
02:02:23,298 --> 02:02:25,128
... or financial officer and stuff.

2455
02:02:25,528 --> 02:02:27,128
We've promised to see it through.

2456
02:02:28,208 --> 02:02:28,218
Perfect.

2457
02:02:28,228 --> 02:02:31,668
But we also recognize that there needs to be a permanent solution at some point,

2458
02:02:32,288 --> 02:02:34,548
and we're going to work through that.

2459
02:02:34,608 --> 02:02:38,448
Now again, I think after the viability vote's done, that will be a key

2460
02:02:38,648 --> 02:02:41,908
consideration, and then we'll reassess right after that's

2461
02:02:42,768 --> 02:02:44,427
done, and then we'll get back to the public.

2462
02:02:44,848 --> 02:02:45,268
Perfect.

2463
02:02:45,448 --> 02:02:45,497
Okay.

2464
02:02:45,918 --> 02:02:49,348
And I kind of want to just throw it out as a challenge to everyone that's here.

2465
02:02:49,468 --> 02:02:50,988
You want to be the CAO, let me guess.

2466
02:02:51,168 --> 02:02:51,308
No.

2467
02:02:53,048 --> 02:02:56,928
No, I just want to make sure next time all these seats are

2468
02:02:56,988 --> 02:03:00,608
filled. So maybe a challenge to everyone here, including council,

2469
02:03:01,188 --> 02:03:03,747
is you can't show up unless you bring one neighbor.

2470
02:03:04,268 --> 02:03:07,468
You know what's interesting? I just wanted to speak to that.

2471
02:03:08,228 --> 02:03:11,908
We've done this three times. Every time we've had an absolutely packed house.

2472
02:03:13,488 --> 02:03:16,398
But this time we chose to live stream, and I told council there's always a risk if

2473
02:03:16,448 --> 02:03:18,168
you live stream, people don't show up because they're watching at home.

2474
02:03:19,128 --> 02:03:19,138
The other-

2475
02:03:19,188 --> 02:03:20,468
So that's part of it.

2476
02:03:20,508 --> 02:03:23,928
The other thing is there was the Given School open house.

2477
02:03:23,948 --> 02:03:25,248
There was something going on with soccer.

2478
02:03:25,368 --> 02:03:25,468
Yeah.

2479
02:03:25,728 --> 02:03:27,628
It was a jam-packed day for many residents.

2480
02:03:29,788 --> 02:03:31,488
The first meeting we had, we had a

2481
02:03:32,968 --> 02:03:36,548
moderator. He kept things rolling. Didn't let you ramble.

2482
02:03:37,048 --> 02:03:37,148
Yeah.

2483
02:03:37,488 --> 02:03:39,588
Tim, you're great. You're trying to ramble a little.

2484
02:03:41,368 --> 02:03:42,088
Thank you.

2485
02:03:42,188 --> 02:03:42,828
And we got some-

2486
02:03:42,928 --> 02:03:45,128
Thank you. Ramble on. That's like Led Zeppelin. Ramble on. Good.

2487
02:03:45,468 --> 02:03:48,548
If we put a limit on the amount of questions that the person can have-

2488
02:03:48,808 --> 02:03:48,898
Sure

2489
02:03:48,908 --> 02:03:51,868
... they can then go to the back of the line and ask again, if you're not turning

2490
02:03:51,908 --> 02:03:54,508
down any questions. But I have one statement-

2491
02:03:54,528 --> 02:03:56,268
Okay, sir, do you have a question? Let's move it on.

2492
02:03:56,568 --> 02:03:56,808
Okay.

2493
02:03:57,358 --> 02:03:59,228
Come on, let's go. Hurry up. Question.

2494
02:03:59,408 --> 02:04:03,288
Okay, I have to state how long I've lived here. 640 days at Oak.

2495
02:04:05,228 --> 02:04:08,788
I live close to Memorial Park. The kids

2496
02:04:09,208 --> 02:04:12,668
love that place. All I hear is laughter and

2497
02:04:13,048 --> 02:04:14,628
just great noise of kids.

2498
02:04:15,708 --> 02:04:19,248
Is there in the budget to put cameras up to find any

2499
02:04:19,348 --> 02:04:22,878
vandalism? I understand it was vandalized and they didn't know who did

2500
02:04:22,888 --> 02:04:25,948
it. Is it anywhere that somebody can

2501
02:04:27,508 --> 02:04:30,748
capture it on a video if somebody else vandalizes again?

2502
02:04:31,628 --> 02:04:34,708
Because I want that thing to stay open. Let the kids have it involved.

2503
02:04:35,808 --> 02:04:38,568
This is not a new issue. This is not something that just happened.

2504
02:04:38,618 --> 02:04:38,618
Oh.

2505
02:04:38,628 --> 02:04:41,027
There's nothing that has occurred, right? You're talking preventative?

2506
02:04:41,228 --> 02:04:42,328
Yeah, but it's vandalized

2507
02:04:43,168 --> 02:04:45,078
last, what, September, October?

2508
02:04:45,568 --> 02:04:45,888
Okay. Thank you.

2509
02:04:46,068 --> 02:04:48,588
And it's open now, and it's packed with kids.

2510
02:04:49,248 --> 02:04:50,918
And you hear nothing but good noise out of it.

2511
02:04:50,968 --> 02:04:54,008
You never get a scream by a little girl, maybe.

2512
02:04:54,788 --> 02:04:57,288
But I'd like to see video,

2513
02:04:58,268 --> 02:05:01,198
so that the kids know that if they're going to vandalize, they're going to be on

2514
02:05:01,248 --> 02:05:01,668
video.

2515
02:05:02,828 --> 02:05:02,957
So,

2516
02:05:04,388 --> 02:05:05,328
doing a good job, Council.

2517
02:05:07,688 --> 02:05:08,168
Thank you, Marty.

2518
02:05:08,368 --> 02:05:08,707
Thank you.

2519
02:05:09,488 --> 02:05:10,028
Go Broncos.

2520
02:05:10,508 --> 02:05:14,228
Yep. So I don't see any more questions coming forward.

2521
02:05:14,468 --> 02:05:16,468
Oh.

2522
02:05:18,318 --> 02:05:21,498
Are you here to drop your resume off for the CAO job again? No, I'm just kidding.

2523
02:05:21,868 --> 02:05:22,848
Oh, here we go. One more.

2524
02:05:24,708 --> 02:05:26,968
Go ahead.

2525
02:05:27,068 --> 02:05:28,508
Well, we had comments.

2526
02:05:29,468 --> 02:05:32,488
Yeah, I'm short. Vertically challenged.

2527
02:05:36,368 --> 02:05:38,568
We had a meeting on Tuesday night.

2528
02:05:39,388 --> 02:05:43,228
It was 6:00. A lot of people are working and trying to

2529
02:05:43,268 --> 02:05:43,928
get to a town

2530
02:05:45,288 --> 02:05:49,208
meeting at 6:00, when you're getting off at 5:00 or something like that.

2531
02:05:49,488 --> 02:05:53,248
Makes it extremely difficult. Also, when we're

2532
02:05:53,308 --> 02:05:54,708
talking in the council,

2533
02:05:55,528 --> 02:05:59,098
the councilors get a question, and we get a reply from

2534
02:05:59,208 --> 02:06:02,628
somebody over the side. Could be the recording

2535
02:06:02,808 --> 02:06:06,718
secretary, who judges whether you need motions, everything like

2536
02:06:06,828 --> 02:06:10,748
that. Half the time, we can't hear the reply from the, say,

2537
02:06:11,608 --> 02:06:14,388
in your case, Tim, your assistant who's giving some

2538
02:06:16,188 --> 02:06:17,258
data and everything like that.

2539
02:06:17,258 --> 02:06:17,428
Yeah.

2540
02:06:17,828 --> 02:06:19,908
So the volume could be better controlled there.

2541
02:06:20,308 --> 02:06:23,987
Okay, thank you. We do agree. We have some technology issues in council

2542
02:06:24,068 --> 02:06:26,807
chambers, and we're going to keep working on it. So thank you.

2543
02:06:28,648 --> 02:06:29,168
Thanks a lot.

2544
02:06:29,448 --> 02:06:29,947
You're welcome.

2545
02:06:37,648 --> 02:06:39,188
There's going to be payment.

2546
02:06:40,718 --> 02:06:42,268
Thank you. I appreciate it.

2547
02:06:42,877 --> 02:06:45,578
You're welcome. Okay, so we're doing this

2548
02:06:47,228 --> 02:06:49,808
8.2% increase or whatever kind of thing.

2549
02:06:49,928 --> 02:06:53,838
So it's 4% on tax increase, 3% on reserves?

2550
02:06:54,448 --> 02:06:56,428
5.2% is for our base budget-

2551
02:06:56,818 --> 02:06:56,818
5.2%

2552
02:06:56,818 --> 02:06:59,748
... and 3% is to support replenishment of reserves.

2553
02:06:59,848 --> 02:07:03,488
So when we're doing this type of increase, is that seven and

2554
02:07:03,588 --> 02:07:06,508
three, or is that four and three, or is it just a-

2555
02:07:07,088 --> 02:07:08,268
No, we're looking at

2556
02:07:09,108 --> 02:07:10,728
seven. That's 8.2.

2557
02:07:11,228 --> 02:07:11,288
Yeah.

2558
02:07:11,368 --> 02:07:14,408
And we're looking at, our forecast right now is seven, which will probably be about

2559
02:07:14,468 --> 02:07:14,928
four and three.

2560
02:07:15,568 --> 02:07:15,748
Okay.

2561
02:07:15,928 --> 02:07:16,068
Yeah.

2562
02:07:16,168 --> 02:07:16,838
So it's four and three. So-

2563
02:07:16,848 --> 02:07:17,188
Four and three.

2564
02:07:17,448 --> 02:07:17,528
Okay.

2565
02:07:17,648 --> 02:07:21,068
We're projecting something for the base, and then 3% probably for replenishment of

2566
02:07:21,108 --> 02:07:21,828
reserves. Yes.

2567
02:07:22,288 --> 02:07:25,428
So when that 3% is going into the reserve

2568
02:07:25,748 --> 02:07:29,648
fundings in the event of a catastrophic failure, does that

2569
02:07:29,708 --> 02:07:31,278
come out of that reserve funding then?

2570
02:07:31,568 --> 02:07:35,138
Yeah. No, so what we're going to do is we're going to create a reserve policy that

2571
02:07:35,148 --> 02:07:38,588
will speak to fleet and a number of things that would help support.

2572
02:07:38,728 --> 02:07:42,608
Again, so a typical reserve policy will say, "We're going to be replacing our

2573
02:07:42,668 --> 02:07:44,328
fleet, our roads," whatever it might be.

2574
02:07:44,348 --> 02:07:46,578
So we're going to develop some of that and put the money into the right

2575
02:07:46,588 --> 02:07:50,248
compartments. And I don't know if council wants to speak to that, but it's

2576
02:07:50,268 --> 02:07:54,198
basically for planning for replacement of our assets and

2577
02:07:54,228 --> 02:07:57,088
for if something happens like a disaster. So everything.

2578
02:07:57,398 --> 02:07:59,208
Let's say a water main break or something like that-

2579
02:07:59,288 --> 02:07:59,298
Yeah

2580
02:07:59,298 --> 02:08:00,938
... that would come out of that reserve funding then?

2581
02:08:00,968 --> 02:08:03,928
We would hope so. But it's going to take a while for us to get to that point.

2582
02:08:04,168 --> 02:08:07,928
So then what happens when that payment comes due in three years

2583
02:08:08,028 --> 02:08:11,108
because you're consolidating debentures?

2584
02:08:11,568 --> 02:08:15,028
Is there a payment coming up in three years where you've got a big payment again?

2585
02:08:19,198 --> 02:08:23,158
Correct. So 2029, the first portion of the principal payment comes on,

2586
02:08:23,378 --> 02:08:26,918
but the reserve transfers that we'll have built into the three-year

2587
02:08:27,018 --> 02:08:30,678
plan, I actually built them with the idea of not

2588
02:08:30,738 --> 02:08:34,278
having to increase for the full principal coming online.

2589
02:08:34,358 --> 02:08:38,258
So it would just offset a difference in what we would normally transfer

2590
02:08:38,318 --> 02:08:42,298
over to reserve, with the intent to be that it would not impact taxation.

2591
02:08:42,338 --> 02:08:42,648
We wouldn't

2592
02:08:43,778 --> 02:08:47,718
have a 15% jump in that year. That's why we wanted to try

2593
02:08:47,728 --> 02:08:50,138
and smooth it. That's why the number seven was in there.

2594
02:08:50,198 --> 02:08:54,138
Originally, I tried to build it around the 5 to 5.5% for

2595
02:08:54,158 --> 02:08:57,938
the three-year increases. But to get there so that we didn't have a big

2596
02:08:57,998 --> 02:09:01,938
jump in 2030, I had to do a bit

2597
02:09:01,998 --> 02:09:04,588
higher than the plan was. So that's where we ended up at 7%.

2598
02:09:04,898 --> 02:09:07,698
That's provided that reserve funding is still there.

2599
02:09:09,338 --> 02:09:09,658
Correct?

2600
02:09:10,298 --> 02:09:10,518
Sorry?

2601
02:09:10,938 --> 02:09:14,258
That's provided that reserve funding is still there to make that, or no?

2602
02:09:14,358 --> 02:09:18,058
No. So all the reserve funding that we're putting away and the money that we're

2603
02:09:18,098 --> 02:09:21,277
putting into the admin reserve, and that's just where it's been labeled to.

2604
02:09:21,357 --> 02:09:25,298
I don't have a reserve name built out for it, but the money that goes

2605
02:09:25,358 --> 02:09:29,128
into that reserve, that increases year over year, that money just

2606
02:09:29,498 --> 02:09:31,578
goes into the bank. It goes into the reserve.

2607
02:09:31,818 --> 02:09:35,658
So then in 2030, when we have a 300,000, 330,000, if I

2608
02:09:35,678 --> 02:09:39,498
remember the number right, debenture principal payment that comes online,

2609
02:09:40,218 --> 02:09:44,138
instead of putting money into the reserve at that point, it's just going to

2610
02:09:44,178 --> 02:09:48,128
fund that debenture come then. So we won't be putting as much money away at that

2611
02:09:48,158 --> 02:09:51,468
point in time, but I won't have to increase taxes by

2612
02:09:51,498 --> 02:09:53,398
15% in that year to offset it.

2613
02:09:53,948 --> 02:09:56,308
Okay.

2614
02:09:56,758 --> 02:10:00,738
I don't know if I was the only one here that didn't get it, but I

2615
02:10:00,838 --> 02:10:01,928
thought we were getting 11%

2616
02:10:02,838 --> 02:10:05,718
increase, not-

2617
02:10:08,178 --> 02:10:08,858
Yay.

2618
02:10:08,918 --> 02:10:12,638
Well, it's 8.2% on taxes, and then the utility rates are going up

2619
02:10:12,778 --> 02:10:16,198
3%. But thank you. We're here to make you happy, so

2620
02:10:16,598 --> 02:10:17,218
fantastic.

2621
02:10:19,318 --> 02:10:21,518
So I don't see any additional questions.

2622
02:10:21,538 --> 02:10:24,878
For anybody, anything else that anybody would like to bring up or have any

2623
02:10:24,918 --> 02:10:25,498
questions about?

2624
02:10:26,858 --> 02:10:29,798
Can I just thank you guys for putting the meetings

2625
02:10:29,818 --> 02:10:33,087
online? If I have one, I really appreciate that.

2626
02:10:33,398 --> 02:10:33,998
You're welcome.

2627
02:10:34,938 --> 02:10:35,128
Thank you.

2628
02:10:35,128 --> 02:10:36,678
Thanks. Fantastic. Sir?

2629
02:10:36,738 --> 02:10:37,838
Just very quickly.

2630
02:10:38,958 --> 02:10:42,898
We talked about the viability review

2631
02:10:42,938 --> 02:10:46,058
coming up, the questionnaire, the statements going out.

2632
02:10:47,338 --> 02:10:47,867
The thing is,

2633
02:10:48,898 --> 02:10:52,858
I have a personal commitment that's going to require me to be

2634
02:10:52,918 --> 02:10:55,418
in eastern Canada, where we're originally from.

2635
02:10:56,258 --> 02:10:59,978
Is there going to be a plan maybe for an absentee vote?

2636
02:11:02,198 --> 02:11:03,058
Yes, that is correct.

2637
02:11:04,038 --> 02:11:05,128
Sorry. Yeah, go ahead.

2638
02:11:05,128 --> 02:11:08,598
Yes, that is correct. You'll have an opportunity for an absentee vote. Yes.

2639
02:11:09,618 --> 02:11:13,498
Super. That's great, guys. We'll work it out in the next couple of weeks, but

2640
02:11:13,558 --> 02:11:17,438
we're planning on leaving. Granddaughter's the

2641
02:11:17,498 --> 02:11:21,358
highest in New Brunswick for scholastic standings in 9, 10, 11,

2642
02:11:21,418 --> 02:11:24,978
and 12, 98.9%, and she's been

2643
02:11:25,018 --> 02:11:27,458
accepted at Dalhousie University in veterinary-

2644
02:11:27,478 --> 02:11:27,558
Fantastic

2645
02:11:27,878 --> 02:11:31,338
... and we're very proud of that, and we will

2646
02:11:31,398 --> 02:11:35,198
be heading back and won't be back until

2647
02:11:35,258 --> 02:11:38,078
mid-July or so, but I really appreciate that.

2648
02:11:38,158 --> 02:11:39,318
Thanks, gentlemen and ladies.

2649
02:11:40,258 --> 02:11:44,148
There's a mail-in vote. So from what I understand-

2650
02:11:44,238 --> 02:11:45,078
Yes, that's correct

2651
02:11:45,118 --> 02:11:46,038
... there's a mail-in vote for you.

2652
02:11:47,138 --> 02:11:48,538
Super great. Yeah, thank you.

2653
02:11:50,678 --> 02:11:54,638
Okay, nothing else. Council, I would just like maybe do a

2654
02:11:54,698 --> 02:11:55,938
discussion of council. Well,

2655
02:11:57,118 --> 02:11:59,278
Mr. Thorpe, welcome to the podium.

2656
02:12:00,798 --> 02:12:01,238
Gary.

2657
02:12:03,238 --> 02:12:04,418
It's like the slow walk of

2658
02:12:05,218 --> 02:12:05,738
shame.

2659
02:12:05,838 --> 02:12:07,238
It's just old age.

2660
02:12:08,488 --> 02:12:11,748
Honorable Mayor, Council, and esteemed

2661
02:12:12,458 --> 02:12:13,388
administration,

2662
02:12:14,278 --> 02:12:15,358
can you tell me

2663
02:12:16,298 --> 02:12:19,688
how much I would be paying in taxes if we didn't have

2664
02:12:19,758 --> 02:12:21,838
this debt over our heads?

2665
02:12:25,658 --> 02:12:28,598
Well, I'll say to a lot of math in our head tonight.

2666
02:12:29,118 --> 02:12:29,568
Somebody?

2667
02:12:31,598 --> 02:12:31,778
Well,

2668
02:12:32,708 --> 02:12:36,638
the one thing that will help is most municipalities have

2669
02:12:36,678 --> 02:12:40,638
debt. I would say this, we're probably about 50% more than we should have, to be

2670
02:12:40,678 --> 02:12:44,357
quite frank. Believe it or not, it's crazy.

2671
02:12:44,667 --> 02:12:44,778
Yeah.

2672
02:12:44,798 --> 02:12:48,178
But if we didn't have basically all the payments and everything else, we'd be

2673
02:12:48,198 --> 02:12:51,858
looking at maybe a reduction of maybe 5, 10% tops.

2674
02:12:53,118 --> 02:12:54,158
If it helps,

2675
02:12:55,818 --> 02:12:57,558
Redwater, who's not in our position,

2676
02:12:58,588 --> 02:13:02,138
their tax increase is a little bit higher than our

2677
02:13:02,278 --> 02:13:03,178
8.2%.

2678
02:13:03,808 --> 02:13:03,808
Oh.

2679
02:13:03,838 --> 02:13:07,158
And they're not in the position we're in, to give you an example.

2680
02:13:08,078 --> 02:13:11,518
So it's really difficult to put a value on it to

2681
02:13:11,658 --> 02:13:12,118
estimate,

2682
02:13:13,098 --> 02:13:16,298
to say it could have been 5.5% or

2683
02:13:16,518 --> 02:13:20,158
4%, but just the communities close by to us

2684
02:13:20,238 --> 02:13:23,098
are equal to or more than what we're currently going up.

2685
02:13:24,578 --> 02:13:26,578
Well, I'm just trying to figure out,

2686
02:13:28,518 --> 02:13:32,478
we keep wanting to manage the debt instead of pay it

2687
02:13:32,558 --> 02:13:35,218
down. I don't understand that concept.

2688
02:13:35,718 --> 02:13:39,378
That's the same concept as the last administration.

2689
02:13:40,318 --> 02:13:40,938
What was that point?

2690
02:13:42,118 --> 02:13:43,678
We are paying the debt down.

2691
02:13:45,278 --> 02:13:45,328
We are paying the debt down.

2692
02:13:45,328 --> 02:13:46,598
We're paying the debt down. We're paying it down considerably.

2693
02:13:47,218 --> 02:13:47,718
Slowly.

2694
02:13:48,258 --> 02:13:52,218
No, considerably so. So we've got $2.6 million

2695
02:13:52,498 --> 02:13:53,778
right now in the budget to pay down.

2696
02:13:54,258 --> 02:13:57,898
The two things that said recoverable, we have plans to try and recover that money,

2697
02:13:58,118 --> 02:13:59,538
will likely go 100% to debt.

2698
02:14:00,858 --> 02:14:04,478
So you're looking at 3.2, 1.3, plus

2699
02:14:04,558 --> 02:14:08,158
2.6. The 3.2 is over 30 years or

2700
02:14:08,238 --> 02:14:08,658
15

2701
02:14:09,618 --> 02:14:13,518
years, I think. So we're looking, and we're looking at other opportunities

2702
02:14:13,558 --> 02:14:16,398
to generate additional opportunity for debt recovery.

2703
02:14:16,458 --> 02:14:18,838
So we're doing our best to get it down as fast as we can

2704
02:14:20,350 --> 02:14:23,950
You also said that you borrowed,

2705
02:14:25,110 --> 02:14:25,950
or at least

2706
02:14:27,030 --> 02:14:30,610
tried not to borrow, $2.5 million a couple of

2707
02:14:31,030 --> 02:14:31,810
meetings ago

2708
02:14:33,510 --> 02:14:35,350
in replace of your reserves.

2709
02:14:36,950 --> 02:14:38,490
We're not borrowing any additional money.

2710
02:14:39,410 --> 02:14:41,670
So you just said something about borrowing? We're not borrowing any money.

2711
02:14:42,910 --> 02:14:46,510
In order for this council and administration to

2712
02:14:46,590 --> 02:14:47,180
operate,

2713
02:14:48,070 --> 02:14:51,790
you went to the province and got a loan for

2714
02:14:51,970 --> 02:14:52,440
2.5 million.

2715
02:14:52,440 --> 02:14:53,870
The previous administration.

2716
02:14:54,770 --> 02:14:56,529
We actually didn't.

2717
02:14:57,670 --> 02:14:58,169
Yeah.

2718
02:14:59,610 --> 02:15:00,750
They gave us permission.

2719
02:15:01,530 --> 02:15:01,640
Oh, right.

2720
02:15:01,650 --> 02:15:05,460
They gave us permission to increase our debt limit, but we did

2721
02:15:05,510 --> 02:15:09,120
not increase our debt limit. At the same time, they gave us a

2722
02:15:09,150 --> 02:15:12,790
grant for $500,000. Utilizing the

2723
02:15:12,830 --> 02:15:15,070
grant, we were able to bridge

2724
02:15:15,930 --> 02:15:19,030
a bit of a runway to cash manage

2725
02:15:19,530 --> 02:15:22,990
our responsibilities. At no point in time, the

2726
02:15:23,150 --> 02:15:26,550
2.5 mil... Was it 2.5? I don't feel like that number is right,

2727
02:15:26,770 --> 02:15:28,280
but close enough for government work.

2728
02:15:28,930 --> 02:15:32,590
That they gave us an increase to our debt limit of 2.5

2729
02:15:32,630 --> 02:15:36,470
million to try to help us along, but we never took out

2730
02:15:36,530 --> 02:15:37,010
that debt.

2731
02:15:38,150 --> 02:15:38,160
Okay.

2732
02:15:38,210 --> 02:15:42,050
We were actually able to, with cost cuts, as

2733
02:15:42,130 --> 02:15:45,370
well as the $500,000 grant,

2734
02:15:45,970 --> 02:15:48,710
and the ability to use our, I will

2735
02:15:48,870 --> 02:15:52,210
massacre the acronym, L blah, blah, blah,

2736
02:15:52,450 --> 02:15:53,230
FF

2737
02:15:54,110 --> 02:15:54,370
ASFF

2738
02:15:54,390 --> 02:15:55,390
... which is normally a

2739
02:15:56,430 --> 02:15:57,230
capital grant.

2740
02:15:58,410 --> 02:16:01,070
They allowed us to use it for operations.

2741
02:16:01,790 --> 02:16:05,550
So we didn't have to go and take that additional 2.5

2742
02:16:05,590 --> 02:16:09,300
million. But I also think where you were going with that was,

2743
02:16:10,050 --> 02:16:13,970
we no longer have an ability. We also went out

2744
02:16:14,010 --> 02:16:17,390
looking to see if we could borrow, and we couldn't, because

2745
02:16:18,030 --> 02:16:18,950
we're too high risk.

2746
02:16:20,610 --> 02:16:21,470
Okay. Thank you.

2747
02:16:21,490 --> 02:16:23,030
Is that fair?

2748
02:16:24,090 --> 02:16:24,430
Uh.

2749
02:16:28,730 --> 02:16:32,359
So in this situation, just to add to that is, debt management

2750
02:16:32,670 --> 02:16:36,111
in our perspective at this point means how fast can we pay it off?

2751
02:16:36,210 --> 02:16:38,510
How do we get rid of it? What do we want to get rid of first?

2752
02:16:38,630 --> 02:16:38,810
So

2753
02:16:39,630 --> 02:16:43,470
everything that we've booked in the budget for reserve transfer, for operating

2754
02:16:43,531 --> 02:16:46,430
reserve transfer, that can all turn into debt payment.

2755
02:16:46,630 --> 02:16:49,830
That can all go straight against debt realistically.

2756
02:16:49,890 --> 02:16:52,781
It's just a matter of making that decision when the time comes, when we see what

2757
02:16:52,810 --> 02:16:56,770
the actual surplus looks like. So there's options on the table for where that's

2758
02:16:56,781 --> 02:17:00,380
going to happen. The big targets, the big things we want to get rid of, are

2759
02:17:00,430 --> 02:17:04,291
the lines in yellow. That's operating debt, which is bad, bad news.

2760
02:17:04,330 --> 02:17:08,240
We don't want any of that on there. So that's our first priority is to get rid

2761
02:17:08,270 --> 02:17:11,850
of that, and then when it comes to loans to local authorities, so everything in the

2762
02:17:11,871 --> 02:17:15,570
blue, I can't pay that off early. We don't have that option

2763
02:17:15,611 --> 02:17:19,350
without some pretty severe penalties from the loans to local authorities group.

2764
02:17:19,390 --> 02:17:22,310
So that one has to flow at its normal rate.

2765
02:17:22,350 --> 02:17:26,291
But the other ones, our focus is 100% on the yellow stuff.

2766
02:17:26,410 --> 02:17:29,150
The yellow is what we absolutely need to get rid of first.

2767
02:17:29,410 --> 02:17:33,080
So debt management in our heads and in our minds at this point is

2768
02:17:33,830 --> 02:17:36,910
get rid of as much as we can, as fast as we can, when it comes down to it.

2769
02:17:39,791 --> 02:17:40,470
Thank you.

2770
02:17:40,531 --> 02:17:44,250
Hi. I've lived in this town for 45 years now, and

2771
02:17:44,890 --> 02:17:48,691
every year we've had some kind of a fitness class or recreation program

2772
02:17:48,850 --> 02:17:51,541
that citizens can participate in.

2773
02:17:52,070 --> 02:17:55,240
Is that totally off the table? Because I don't see anything

2774
02:17:56,031 --> 02:17:59,970
that's available in the spring session, so I'm wondering if there's going to

2775
02:18:00,010 --> 02:18:03,310
be anything in the fall or if now we're not having anything at all.

2776
02:18:03,910 --> 02:18:07,830
We have a yoga room upstairs that we went, had yoga classes

2777
02:18:07,890 --> 02:18:10,791
in for I don't know how many years, and now it sits empty.

2778
02:18:10,930 --> 02:18:11,111
So

2779
02:18:11,990 --> 02:18:15,770
is there going to be any kind of recreation fitness programs

2780
02:18:15,791 --> 02:18:16,850
running in town?

2781
02:18:19,570 --> 02:18:20,650
Okay. You want me to answer?

2782
02:18:21,180 --> 02:18:21,180
Sure.

2783
02:18:23,531 --> 02:18:25,470
We have cut down programs significantly.

2784
02:18:26,150 --> 02:18:30,140
But what we've done is we've cut down programs, but left money in the

2785
02:18:30,230 --> 02:18:34,031
budget for basically what we call priority programs, and we're

2786
02:18:34,050 --> 02:18:37,359
depending on council. For example, just recently I was told, "If you get rid of

2787
02:18:37,390 --> 02:18:38,291
Lemonade Day, I'm going to

2788
02:18:39,229 --> 02:18:42,770
twist your arm off," so I've heard that. And then, what's the other one?

2789
02:18:42,810 --> 02:18:45,830
Pioneer Days, I think's another one. So there are things we're going to try and do.

2790
02:18:45,930 --> 02:18:48,670
So if we get demand from the public, say these are things that we really want,

2791
02:18:49,330 --> 02:18:51,791
we're going to try and deliver programs that matter to people.

2792
02:18:51,850 --> 02:18:55,650
We're also though having to stop doing things that maybe don't

2793
02:18:55,730 --> 02:18:58,770
serve the general public overall. So, hard decisions.

2794
02:18:58,791 --> 02:19:00,611
So I can't guarantee they'll be doing it.

2795
02:19:00,850 --> 02:19:02,730
Yoga program, I didn't see it in the budget.

2796
02:19:02,770 --> 02:19:06,210
I think there's things we cut back, and that might be one of them, but not sure.

2797
02:19:06,630 --> 02:19:10,090
But if there's a strong enough demand, we're going to try and do as much as we can.

2798
02:19:10,611 --> 02:19:14,230
Okay. Well, when you sign up, everybody pays a fee to

2799
02:19:14,270 --> 02:19:17,531
participate in class. Does that not help pay for some of it?

2800
02:19:18,470 --> 02:19:18,791
Pardon me?

2801
02:19:19,330 --> 02:19:22,691
When you sign up to take the class, you pay a fee.

2802
02:19:22,730 --> 02:19:24,180
Does that not help to pay for some of it?

2803
02:19:24,250 --> 02:19:27,791
One of the things about recreation programs, I can guarantee the fees never cover

2804
02:19:27,830 --> 02:19:31,031
the cost. Again, those things are almost always subsidized.

2805
02:19:31,090 --> 02:19:34,830
If we can find somebody who's willing to deliver a program and it can be

2806
02:19:34,890 --> 02:19:38,570
cost recovery, then we'd be more than open to having those programs

2807
02:19:39,451 --> 02:19:43,350
delivered in our facility. That's not a problem at all, but we have to find

2808
02:19:43,390 --> 02:19:45,510
instructors that would be willing to do that.

2809
02:19:45,611 --> 02:19:47,850
Usually, the towns usually subsidize them.

2810
02:19:48,291 --> 02:19:50,030
Okay.

2811
02:19:50,600 --> 02:19:50,600
Cool.

2812
02:19:51,590 --> 02:19:55,230
I use the fitness center. I enjoy having the

2813
02:19:55,630 --> 02:19:58,050
fitness programs and whatnot, so I feel you there.

2814
02:19:58,170 --> 02:19:59,450
So please,

2815
02:20:00,410 --> 02:20:03,630
if you want to reach out to me or the rest of the council or something with

2816
02:20:04,270 --> 02:20:07,570
your thoughts and what you'd like, because I would definitely like

2817
02:20:07,630 --> 02:20:11,530
to see something like that continue or something like

2818
02:20:11,590 --> 02:20:12,090
that happen.

2819
02:20:12,750 --> 02:20:15,770
Yeah, because that's all part of living in a small town.

2820
02:20:15,850 --> 02:20:17,830
You can go take the class in your town.

2821
02:20:17,870 --> 02:20:17,880
Yeah, of course.

2822
02:20:17,880 --> 02:20:20,190
You don't have to leave town to go to take it.

2823
02:20:20,200 --> 02:20:20,200
Yeah.

2824
02:20:20,210 --> 02:20:23,330
And it's sad now that there's no classes available to anybody.

2825
02:20:23,670 --> 02:20:27,230
Absolutely. Yeah. So please reach out to myself

2826
02:20:27,290 --> 02:20:28,590
or everyone here,

2827
02:20:29,570 --> 02:20:32,250
and I would like to see what we can do about that, absolutely.

2828
02:20:33,146 --> 02:20:36,746
I think it's very important. So I appreciate that you came up with that here.

2829
02:20:36,806 --> 02:20:37,246
So thank you.

2830
02:20:37,606 --> 02:20:38,586
All right. Thank you.

2831
02:20:39,386 --> 02:20:42,626
It is a valid concern that you brought up, but I think it would be important for us

2832
02:20:42,686 --> 02:20:45,046
to put out a survey and see what residents want.

2833
02:20:46,086 --> 02:20:49,666
And maybe we just put out a survey and see what the majority wants, and

2834
02:20:50,106 --> 02:20:53,546
we can't please everybody, but we can try and do our best to make sure your voices

2835
02:20:53,566 --> 02:20:56,526
are heard on what programming people want.

2836
02:20:58,786 --> 02:21:01,906
Just want to add also that one of the things we're looking at doing, and we had

2837
02:21:01,946 --> 02:21:03,306
brought it up is,

2838
02:21:04,726 --> 02:21:06,936
and it was just brought up recently, is as far as what

2839
02:21:09,106 --> 02:21:12,766
has been cut or what's not, it would be nice if we did a chart

2840
02:21:12,806 --> 02:21:16,236
for the residents, including ourselves, because we're residents, is

2841
02:21:16,306 --> 02:21:20,046
if any cuts that have been done from public works, have a

2842
02:21:20,086 --> 02:21:23,746
list of what's been removed. Anything from everything, if we can have an

2843
02:21:24,166 --> 02:21:27,956
itemized list of what would be, or what's gone or what's

2844
02:21:27,986 --> 02:21:31,686
eliminated or what's cut back, I think that would clear up a lot of confusion for

2845
02:21:31,726 --> 02:21:35,056
everyone, and I do believe that that's something that we could work towards as

2846
02:21:35,086 --> 02:21:35,236
well.

2847
02:21:39,726 --> 02:21:43,466
And if it comes down to it, we'll have yoga with

2848
02:21:43,886 --> 02:21:44,706
Councillor Burak.

2849
02:21:49,466 --> 02:21:52,226
I'd pay not to see that, but anyway.

2850
02:21:54,566 --> 02:21:58,526
Okay. I see nobody else at the podium. Going once, going twice.

2851
02:21:59,586 --> 02:22:02,326
Any other questions? Okay. You're funny.

2852
02:22:02,386 --> 02:22:06,246
So what I'd like now just to finish things off is basically each councilor to give

2853
02:22:06,286 --> 02:22:10,096
you their thoughts and maybe overall their thoughts on the situation from a

2854
02:22:10,386 --> 02:22:13,886
budget perspective and viability perspective, and then we'll end this evening.

2855
02:22:13,926 --> 02:22:16,186
So thank you. Go ahead, Council.

2856
02:22:20,666 --> 02:22:21,386
Yeah, I guess I'll start.

2857
02:22:22,686 --> 02:22:23,716
Yeah. Go ahead.

2858
02:22:23,746 --> 02:22:25,226
First of all, thanks everyone for coming.

2859
02:22:25,846 --> 02:22:29,826
At the end of the day, you look back to where the town

2860
02:22:29,866 --> 02:22:31,986
was six months ago to where it is now.

2861
02:22:33,956 --> 02:22:37,806
I think it's remarkable the distance that we've traveled in such a

2862
02:22:37,826 --> 02:22:39,246
short amount of time.

2863
02:22:41,046 --> 02:22:44,646
Personally, deep down, I think that this town will survive. It'll thrive.

2864
02:22:45,186 --> 02:22:47,645
As Tim says, this town should flourish.

2865
02:22:48,726 --> 02:22:51,306
There may have been some mistakes made along the way, and when we're here to

2866
02:22:51,346 --> 02:22:52,846
correct it. We want to

2867
02:22:53,766 --> 02:22:57,646
guide everyone through here, and we want you guys to communicate with us

2868
02:22:57,706 --> 02:23:01,306
as much as possible so that we can then speak up on your

2869
02:23:01,346 --> 02:23:03,716
behalf and speak up for the best interests of the town.

2870
02:23:04,486 --> 02:23:06,766
The Bloom team has done a fantastic job in their budget.

2871
02:23:09,106 --> 02:23:11,076
This town will survive. It will thrive.

2872
02:23:11,446 --> 02:23:14,326
I think we're well on our way to...

2873
02:23:15,666 --> 02:23:18,466
Well, we're going to be in the papers, we're going to be in books, there's going to

2874
02:23:18,506 --> 02:23:20,866
be articles written on us, but I think for all the good reasons.

2875
02:23:21,206 --> 02:23:23,946
I think for all the right reasons, at the end of the day, we have to stay the

2876
02:23:24,006 --> 02:23:27,806
course. We've made some tough decisions, and I think that this budget is showing

2877
02:23:27,826 --> 02:23:31,746
that we can do it. And just all I ask is for people

2878
02:23:31,786 --> 02:23:35,546
to bear with us and let us continue, and we will do

2879
02:23:35,586 --> 02:23:36,746
what's right by the community.

2880
02:23:40,556 --> 02:23:43,866
I echo everything that Councillor Burak says.

2881
02:23:45,006 --> 02:23:46,186
And being from this town,

2882
02:23:47,106 --> 02:23:48,106
being here all my life,

2883
02:23:49,286 --> 02:23:52,306
that's why I'm here. That's why I decided to run.

2884
02:23:52,426 --> 02:23:54,566
I care about this town. I care about all of you.

2885
02:23:54,626 --> 02:23:58,536
I care about all the residents. And I fully believe, yeah, that this

2886
02:23:58,586 --> 02:24:01,886
town should be thriving. There's no reason it can't

2887
02:24:01,895 --> 02:24:05,776
thrive. This has been a difficult journey so far, a lot

2888
02:24:05,806 --> 02:24:09,706
more than I think any of us expected

2889
02:24:09,826 --> 02:24:10,766
or anticipated.

2890
02:24:11,666 --> 02:24:15,186
It's been a lot of work, a lot of evenings, some weekends, a lot of

2891
02:24:15,266 --> 02:24:19,106
emails, a lot of everything. But in my mind,

2892
02:24:20,146 --> 02:24:23,686
as difficult as it has gotten at sometimes, it's

2893
02:24:23,946 --> 02:24:24,386
worth it,

2894
02:24:25,946 --> 02:24:29,786
because we care so much, and that's the only reason we're

2895
02:24:29,846 --> 02:24:32,166
up here doing this. It's not for

2896
02:24:33,766 --> 02:24:36,986
notoriety. It's not for the pay, believe me.

2897
02:24:37,026 --> 02:24:38,486
It's none of that stuff. It's

2898
02:24:39,746 --> 02:24:41,186
because we care about this town,

2899
02:24:42,206 --> 02:24:43,586
and we're trying to do everything right.

2900
02:24:44,626 --> 02:24:47,806
And I always believe the answer is in the room,

2901
02:24:49,286 --> 02:24:53,106
so that involves all of you guys. It's not just the seven

2902
02:24:53,166 --> 02:24:56,626
us up here. It's not just us and Tim and Ryan.

2903
02:24:57,106 --> 02:25:00,826
It's all of you as well. So we want to hear from you.

2904
02:25:01,226 --> 02:25:05,046
We want to speak with you. We want to know your thoughts and feelings, and we want

2905
02:25:05,066 --> 02:25:08,466
to make this thing go, and for that, it's going to take all of us.

2906
02:25:13,286 --> 02:25:14,126
I'll keep mine short.

2907
02:25:16,366 --> 02:25:18,006
First I'd like to thank everybody for coming.

2908
02:25:20,326 --> 02:25:23,956
First and foremost, I would like to apologize to everybody here,

2909
02:25:24,146 --> 02:25:27,816
including those that are watching the live stream, my fellow councilors,

2910
02:25:28,026 --> 02:25:31,246
and to Tim and Ryan for my very unprofessional outburst earlier.

2911
02:25:31,886 --> 02:25:32,906
I do apologize.

2912
02:25:38,066 --> 02:25:41,006
As for tonight, this is some pretty good information.

2913
02:25:41,646 --> 02:25:43,806
Hopefully, we were able to answer most of the questions.

2914
02:25:44,366 --> 02:25:47,766
It's not an easy road, but it's starting to look a little better

2915
02:25:48,346 --> 02:25:49,486
than it was six months ago.

2916
02:25:55,606 --> 02:25:59,126
Yeah, much the same as the rest of the guys. Thank you for coming.

2917
02:25:59,266 --> 02:26:03,146
It was an important night. We got a couple important dates

2918
02:26:03,226 --> 02:26:04,426
coming up as well,

2919
02:26:05,246 --> 02:26:06,526
with the viability review.

2920
02:26:08,446 --> 02:26:11,546
Our budget, lots of work went into our budget to get it balanced.

2921
02:26:12,226 --> 02:26:16,036
I think Ashley had mentioned earlier that we never thought

2922
02:26:16,086 --> 02:26:19,706
our first year out we'd be able to balance the budget considering the

2923
02:26:19,746 --> 02:26:22,046
condition the town was left to us in.

2924
02:26:23,606 --> 02:26:25,246
Lots of hard work and managed to do it with

2925
02:26:26,206 --> 02:26:30,166
a tax increase, yes. Minimal from what was

2926
02:26:30,326 --> 02:26:31,886
initially thought out of the chute.

2927
02:26:32,926 --> 02:26:36,806
And hopefully going forward, the town can continue to

2928
02:26:36,886 --> 02:26:38,866
move in that direction in a good way

2929
02:26:42,896 --> 02:26:46,736
Thank you everybody for coming, for your valuable

2930
02:26:46,776 --> 02:26:50,556
input. We do appreciate that. I will say ditto for

2931
02:26:50,576 --> 02:26:52,656
what's been said, so I won't repeat that.

2932
02:26:52,766 --> 02:26:56,276
But I think always on my mind is the communication

2933
02:26:56,376 --> 02:26:58,036
aspect. You're always going to hear it.

2934
02:26:58,535 --> 02:27:01,356
If you have some ideas, please let us know.

2935
02:27:01,516 --> 02:27:04,836
We're all accessible through phone, through

2936
02:27:04,956 --> 02:27:05,856
email.

2937
02:27:06,876 --> 02:27:10,046
The town has a newsletter. Unfortunately, we don't have a town paper,

2938
02:27:10,656 --> 02:27:14,516
and so we don't have access to a newspaper for any kind of town

2939
02:27:14,616 --> 02:27:17,016
council reporting or what's happening.

2940
02:27:17,636 --> 02:27:21,376
The town has the newsletter, but I think we have so many different

2941
02:27:21,436 --> 02:27:21,856
fragmented

2942
02:27:22,716 --> 02:27:25,636
pieces of communication, not everybody accesses them.

2943
02:27:25,676 --> 02:27:28,626
And so then somebody uses one, doesn't use the other.

2944
02:27:28,656 --> 02:27:31,696
But if you have some thoughts on that, let us know.

2945
02:27:31,736 --> 02:27:32,536
So thanks again for

2946
02:27:32,616 --> 02:27:35,776
coming.

2947
02:27:39,796 --> 02:27:42,396
I think the last thing I want to say

2948
02:27:43,336 --> 02:27:45,316
and to leave you with is,

2949
02:27:46,136 --> 02:27:50,056
if you want, we can be viable. So when you go

2950
02:27:50,096 --> 02:27:51,356
to that viability vote,

2951
02:27:52,196 --> 02:27:55,676
we can be viable. We can stay an autonomous community, a

2952
02:27:55,716 --> 02:27:56,576
municipality,

2953
02:27:57,496 --> 02:28:01,376
a strong community that we are, and we will get

2954
02:28:01,416 --> 02:28:03,706
us there financially. You do have to bear with us,

2955
02:28:05,116 --> 02:28:08,686
but it's there. I do truly believe it's

2956
02:28:08,736 --> 02:28:12,716
there. And a couple of the things we didn't talk about tonight, but they

2957
02:28:12,776 --> 02:28:16,586
have been open within council meetings, particularly in the last, is

2958
02:28:16,676 --> 02:28:20,636
starting to really look at collaboration with the industrial heartland and

2959
02:28:21,656 --> 02:28:25,416
moving towards what gaining from a revenue perspective, what

2960
02:28:25,436 --> 02:28:26,266
really should be ours.

2961
02:28:27,076 --> 02:28:29,636
So we can be viable. We just need your help.

2962
02:28:32,236 --> 02:28:33,996
I want to thank you all for coming.

2963
02:28:36,416 --> 02:28:37,516
You want to? And thank you.

2964
02:28:39,496 --> 02:28:43,036
Thank you all for coming, and I also believe that we can be viable.

2965
02:28:43,456 --> 02:28:45,136
We can be the masters of our own destiny.

2966
02:28:45,456 --> 02:28:48,516
We will not be beholden to another municipality.

2967
02:28:49,156 --> 02:28:52,976
We can decide for ourselves, and we can do this if that's what everyone chooses.

2968
02:28:53,396 --> 02:28:56,436
But regardless of what you choose, get out and vote.

2969
02:28:57,396 --> 02:28:58,055
Good job.

2970
02:29:04,176 --> 02:29:04,496
Okay.

2971
02:29:05,316 --> 02:29:09,276
Thanks everybody for coming, and look forward to seeing you again, probably

2972
02:29:09,296 --> 02:29:12,136
during the viability vote discussions. Bye for now.

2973
02:29:14,656 --> 02:29:14,876
Oh.

2974
02:29:15,476 --> 02:29:16,456
Okay. Thanks guys.