1 00:00:02,240 --> 00:00:04,400 Okay, it's all you, Andrea. 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:09,760 >> Okay, it is Monday, April 6th at 3:02m 3 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:11,599 and we have our stewardship committee 4 00:00:11,599 --> 00:00:15,280 meeting. Members in the room are Molly 5 00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:19,600 uh Taylor and Mark Pope and uh Melody 6 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:22,160 McCalis from this uh Grand County 7 00:00:22,160 --> 00:00:25,039 Commission liaison online. Oh, we also 8 00:00:25,039 --> 00:00:28,320 have uh Christie 9 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:30,320 >> Kristen Hoffine. Sorry, I don't know why 10 00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:33,200 I slipped up on that. And then online, 11 00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:35,920 we have members Tom Dylan and we have 12 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:39,200 Katie Stevens from the BLM. So, and 13 00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:42,559 myself, Andrea Brand. So, uh, the first, 14 00:00:42,559 --> 00:00:45,440 um, order of business is action item to 15 00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:48,719 decide, um, uh, if we need any edits for 16 00:00:48,719 --> 00:00:52,800 our letter to the commission. 17 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:55,280 And 18 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:59,920 let's see, you have that up, but I think 19 00:00:59,920 --> 00:01:02,399 No, that's not the one I want. 20 00:01:02,399 --> 00:01:04,080 >> Oh, do you do you have the correct one 21 00:01:04,080 --> 00:01:04,559 then? 22 00:01:04,559 --> 00:01:06,640 >> Yeah. Yeah, I sent it to you, but I can 23 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:08,799 put it up on my end. It'll be bigger. 24 00:01:08,799 --> 00:01:13,750 >> Yeah. Yeah. Do it on your end then. 25 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:15,360 Wait a second. Let me make sure you're 26 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:17,520 it's uh 27 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:19,280 >> Oh, you want me to share my screen? 28 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:21,439 >> Yeah, share your screen if you could. 29 00:01:21,439 --> 00:01:24,400 >> Do that again. Let me go back. 30 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:26,960 Share. 31 00:01:26,960 --> 00:01:31,520 Post. Disabled attendee screen sharing. 32 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:33,360 Disabled. Share. 33 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:37,200 >> Is Is it working now? Try now. 34 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,320 No, it still has the dialogue box says 35 00:01:40,320 --> 00:01:45,030 disable. 36 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:47,680 » It's not working. They changed the 37 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:52,710 setting. Hold on here. 38 00:01:52,720 --> 00:02:01,190 Share settings. 39 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:02,960 Well, he's working on that. Would it be 40 00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:06,719 appropriate if I just clarified a little 41 00:02:06,719 --> 00:02:09,830 bit? 42 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:12,800 » So, we're meeting for the approval of 43 00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:18,160 letter and through my 44 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:20,239 involvement with the letter. I just 45 00:02:20,239 --> 00:02:23,360 wanted to state this is in response to 46 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:24,959 our public hearing. So, the public 47 00:02:24,959 --> 00:02:29,040 hearing opens up at 6 PM tomorrow. So I 48 00:02:29,040 --> 00:02:30,959 just wanted I didn't know if everyone 49 00:02:30,959 --> 00:02:32,720 just understood the whole process. 50 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:34,080 >> Yeah. So appreciate that. 51 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:37,360 >> Yeah. Just that this the start will be a 52 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:40,480 public hearing for what started as the 53 00:02:40,480 --> 00:02:42,400 planning commission uh sending the 54 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:45,760 letter as to recommend to the county 55 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:49,120 commission for a public hearing. 56 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:51,120 >> Avery, are you going to present? Are you 57 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:53,840 going to be public the letter 58 00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:56,879 >> or you just going to send the letter? I 59 00:02:56,879 --> 00:02:59,519 was gonna read it or a portion of it 60 00:02:59,519 --> 00:03:02,080 because we only had two minutes. Okay. 61 00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:03,040 >> Um 62 00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:03,840 >> and you have to wait 63 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:05,360 >> three minutes 64 00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:07,760 >> and you have to wait till six 65 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:08,959 >> whatever. 66 00:03:08,959 --> 00:03:11,760 >> No, not anymore. But only time. So they 67 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:13,519 were you doing public hearings after six 68 00:03:13,519 --> 00:03:15,519 o'clock, but when we reread the code, 69 00:03:15,519 --> 00:03:16,879 the only time we have to do a public 70 00:03:16,879 --> 00:03:19,280 hearing after six o'clock is if it 71 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:21,680 require if it affects the budget or like 72 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:24,000 fee structure. So I think I can open the 73 00:03:24,000 --> 00:03:26,319 public hearing immediately. after 74 00:03:26,319 --> 00:03:27,840 assistance. Well, we have a few other 75 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,159 things. We have like 76 00:03:30,159 --> 00:03:31,519 >> some other miscellaneous things and then 77 00:03:31,519 --> 00:03:33,360 we'll go into the public hearing. 78 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:35,440 >> As long as it was noticed that 79 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:36,319 >> it should have been noticed that way 80 00:03:36,319 --> 00:03:37,280 because that's what Dana was going to 81 00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:37,519 do. 82 00:03:37,519 --> 00:03:38,720 >> As long as it was noticed that way 83 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:39,200 though. Okay. 84 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:40,400 >> And I'll double check with her. But 85 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:41,840 that's where it should be. Um 86 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:43,599 >> No, I was just trying and not was on the 87 00:03:43,599 --> 00:03:45,440 agenda for after because before we were 88 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:46,560 doing it that way. We were doing all 89 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:48,400 public hearings after six o'clock. Yeah. 90 00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:51,280 >> But when she read the law, she's like we 91 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:52,640 don't have to wait till after 6. 92 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:54,879 >> But on the website it says after 6 and 93 00:03:54,879 --> 00:03:57,280 then I called in and she said, "Well, 94 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:00,879 you can't do a comment until after 6." 95 00:04:00,879 --> 00:04:02,159 >> And she said that 96 00:04:02,159 --> 00:04:04,640 >> the day Dana on the phone and then just 97 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:06,000 for general com but you could do a 98 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:08,640 general comment before public hearing 99 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:10,720 but otherwise it opens up 100 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,120 >> right so when the public hearing opens 101 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:15,120 for public comment. So basically what 102 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:16,959 will happen is they'll open the public 103 00:04:16,959 --> 00:04:19,040 hearing and then the public hearing is 104 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:22,160 open for a number of days set by the 105 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:24,320 >> and then during that time every comment 106 00:04:24,320 --> 00:04:27,360 that is that comes in for that public 107 00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:29,680 hearing is meant to be sort of taken 108 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:32,240 into consideration by the legislative 109 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:34,560 body and then they vote on it at the 110 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:36,240 next one. That's why our commission does 111 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:36,880 it that way. 112 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:37,440 >> Right. 113 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:40,400 >> Yeah. So any comment that is made during 114 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:42,479 that period whether it's in that meeting 115 00:04:42,479 --> 00:04:44,639 at 6:00 or whatever time like that 116 00:04:44,639 --> 00:04:46,639 part's kind of immaterial after it's 117 00:04:46,639 --> 00:04:48,400 open whatever comments are supposed to 118 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:51,199 be included in packets or or logged in 119 00:04:51,199 --> 00:04:53,199 some way so that they become part of the 120 00:04:53,199 --> 00:04:55,680 record if it ever does go to or 121 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:56,320 litigation. 122 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:58,080 >> So there will not be a vote unless 123 00:04:58,080 --> 00:04:59,680 >> No, it's going to be unless they decide 124 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:02,720 to suspend policy which can happen. They 125 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:04,479 can the commission always has the option 126 00:05:04,479 --> 00:05:07,280 to suspend policy and vote immediately. 127 00:05:07,280 --> 00:05:09,840 Um, usually in something like a land use 128 00:05:09,840 --> 00:05:11,360 decision, they there would be no reason 129 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:14,560 for that unless um it's a one of those 130 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:16,880 decisions that people wouldn't really 131 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:18,400 care about something like this. I think 132 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:21,280 it would be I mean it's in my opinion it 133 00:05:21,280 --> 00:05:22,639 would be very strange for the commission 134 00:05:22,639 --> 00:05:24,080 to decide to have something like that. 135 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:26,080 >> Thanks. Just clarifying that it's a 136 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:27,840 public hearing 137 00:05:27,840 --> 00:05:29,680 >> and 138 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:31,440 you can we'll be voting on it. We'll 139 00:05:31,440 --> 00:05:33,280 have have the whole, you know, 140 00:05:33,280 --> 00:05:35,520 >> 10 days or whatever to have public 141 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:38,720 hearing come in through emails and then 142 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:40,320 we'll vote on next. 143 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:41,440 >> You can revisit that. So, 144 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:45,199 >> no, it's me. It's me. So, um it's just 145 00:05:45,199 --> 00:05:47,360 been 146 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:48,639 >> okay. There was there was one change 147 00:05:48,639 --> 00:05:50,080 that I would like to recommend. It's in 148 00:05:50,080 --> 00:05:51,759 this paragraph here. 149 00:05:51,759 --> 00:05:53,360 >> One that's the big one that you see 150 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:55,680 right there. The word adjacent 151 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:59,440 >> that the 235 acre parcel is uh located 152 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:02,160 adjacent. In this case, it's adjacent. 153 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:05,520 >> You may have gotten rid of 154 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:08,000 both. 155 00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:10,720 >> I I prefer the word encompasses parts of 156 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:12,400 both instead of adjacent. 157 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:14,080 >> I like that better. 158 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:15,840 >> Encompasses. 159 00:06:15,840 --> 00:06:17,680 >> The parcel encompasses. 160 00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:18,639 >> Encompasses. 161 00:06:18,639 --> 00:06:19,840 >> What the? 162 00:06:19,840 --> 00:06:23,440 >> Yeah. It's not adjacent to those trails. 163 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:25,360 >> Well, I would say adjacent to and 164 00:06:25,360 --> 00:06:26,319 encompasses. 165 00:06:26,319 --> 00:06:26,800 >> Fine. 166 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:28,560 >> All right. Because it is next. You know 167 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:31,759 that that word is um 168 00:06:31,759 --> 00:06:33,039 >> so 169 00:06:33,039 --> 00:06:34,639 >> basically 170 00:06:34,639 --> 00:06:39,280 it and encompasses parts of both. 171 00:06:39,280 --> 00:06:43,670 >> Oh, what the heck does that say? 172 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:47,600 » Okay. And encompasses parts of both. 173 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:49,919 >> And we have a double and back. 174 00:06:49,919 --> 00:06:52,400 >> Thank you. Oh, there it is. Surprised it 175 00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:59,909 didn't come up and tell me. 176 00:06:59,919 --> 00:07:00,560 Okay. 177 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:02,400 >> You need to say of both. Can you just 178 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:06,400 say parts of the SL? 179 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:08,240 >> It's nice to say both. 180 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:10,479 >> I think I like both because it it's not 181 00:07:10,479 --> 00:07:11,759 just 182 00:07:11,759 --> 00:07:13,759 >> just 183 00:07:13,759 --> 00:07:15,280 >> um 184 00:07:15,280 --> 00:07:16,880 Okay, for that paragraph, you didn't 185 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:20,000 have anything else. 186 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:22,560 And then um 187 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:25,840 background or mission statement. 188 00:07:25,840 --> 00:07:27,520 um then that it's managed the 189 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:28,880 destination special recreation 190 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:32,390 management area 191 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:37,120 and um visitation and I got this updated 192 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:39,759 by the BLM. I was always saying 17 193 00:07:39,759 --> 00:07:42,080 million at usually when I would do my 194 00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:45,039 annual report and uh Bill Bill Stevens 195 00:07:45,039 --> 00:07:48,000 looked at it again and gave me um said 196 00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:50,639 another 8 million. So, 197 00:07:50,639 --> 00:07:53,280 uh, 198 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:55,840 um, yeah. So, there's the 99 businesses, 199 00:07:55,840 --> 00:07:58,400 75 that are local. 200 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:01,039 There's our easement that the county and 201 00:08:01,039 --> 00:08:03,919 the BLM have with the 202 00:08:03,919 --> 00:08:06,639 handover 203 00:08:06,639 --> 00:08:12,950 our concerns. 204 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:14,479 There is one thing I I realize our 205 00:08:14,479 --> 00:08:16,720 letter doesn't have to speak to every 206 00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:19,039 argument made by the planning commission 207 00:08:19,039 --> 00:08:21,199 and its approval. And maybe if you're 208 00:08:21,199 --> 00:08:23,280 speaking, you know, you can go off the 209 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:24,960 letter a little bit. There was a a 210 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:26,960 comment made that the because of the 211 00:08:26,960 --> 00:08:30,160 topography of the parcel is capped or 212 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:32,640 limited as to what can be built, which 213 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:35,680 may or may not be true. However, the 214 00:08:35,680 --> 00:08:37,279 correlary to that is most of the 215 00:08:37,279 --> 00:08:39,599 buildable land is where the trails are. 216 00:08:39,599 --> 00:08:43,120 Well, so that's true and it's not. So 217 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:45,279 topography 218 00:08:45,279 --> 00:08:48,880 as it stands it it because it's in a 219 00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:51,360 water source protection district it will 220 00:08:51,360 --> 00:08:53,519 be it is considered constrained lands by 221 00:08:53,519 --> 00:08:55,680 our land use code which limits the 222 00:08:55,680 --> 00:08:59,200 density because of that. Um, and because 223 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:00,640 it is a water source protection 224 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,200 district, it will also require a CD to 225 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:06,160 be developed because water source 226 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,160 protection districts require specific 227 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:09,600 engineering and this one is specific to 228 00:09:09,600 --> 00:09:10,800 the city. So, it would require us 229 00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:13,680 working with the city to get that done. 230 00:09:13,680 --> 00:09:16,560 Um but that that doesn't mean that it 231 00:09:16,560 --> 00:09:18,560 can't be done like with enough money 232 00:09:18,560 --> 00:09:20,959 these things as we've as the county is 233 00:09:20,959 --> 00:09:23,279 discovering can be done and they can be 234 00:09:23,279 --> 00:09:26,720 done relatively easily as um techn 235 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:27,839 technology continues. 236 00:09:27,839 --> 00:09:29,519 >> But if you didn't have that capability 237 00:09:29,519 --> 00:09:31,839 you would tend to build where it's less 238 00:09:31,839 --> 00:09:34,560 steep and flatter and that's where our 239 00:09:34,560 --> 00:09:35,519 trails are going to be. 240 00:09:35,519 --> 00:09:36,800 >> You can't argue that it's not going to 241 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:38,800 impact the trails because of the limited 242 00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:39,680 building. 243 00:09:39,680 --> 00:09:41,200 putting the higher density. 244 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:43,360 >> And the way that the law works as far as 245 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:46,399 easements go is that just has to if if 246 00:09:46,399 --> 00:09:48,160 an easement is granted, it doesn't have 247 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:50,640 to stay exactly where it is. It just has 248 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:53,680 to um they just have to maintain the 249 00:09:53,680 --> 00:09:54,959 access. 250 00:09:54,959 --> 00:09:55,600 >> Um 251 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:57,680 >> but would revenge have to stay where it 252 00:09:57,680 --> 00:09:59,920 is because it's a prescriptive easement? 253 00:09:59,920 --> 00:10:01,440 >> No, 254 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:03,680 >> we had to move at seven mile. We had to 255 00:10:03,680 --> 00:10:06,800 move Gemini Bridges access to around the 256 00:10:06,800 --> 00:10:09,279 Balls property not that long ago and it 257 00:10:09,279 --> 00:10:10,959 was there 258 00:10:10,959 --> 00:10:12,240 been there for years and years and years 259 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:13,839 and they moved it to the edge of their 260 00:10:13,839 --> 00:10:15,600 property 261 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,480 and they can you know and those I mean 262 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:20,480 they could do that now but there's not 263 00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:22,880 this isn't going to prevent or allow 264 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:24,880 that either way they can do that that's 265 00:10:24,880 --> 00:10:26,320 their right as property owners as 266 00:10:26,320 --> 00:10:29,519 private property owners um they just 267 00:10:29,519 --> 00:10:32,560 have to allow these not exactly what the 268 00:10:32,560 --> 00:10:34,800 reason 269 00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:38,240 Well, a mile of the Slick Rock Trail. I 270 00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:40,959 mean, it's a mile long ement trail, 271 00:10:40,959 --> 00:10:42,880 >> right? And the BLM does hold the 272 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:44,959 easement. That easement was gotten from 273 00:10:44,959 --> 00:10:47,839 Charlie Steen in 1969. So, I checked 274 00:10:47,839 --> 00:10:51,200 that today that the BLM does indeed hold 275 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:53,360 an easement on the Slick Rock Bike 276 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:55,360 Trail. Yeah, those have all been 277 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:56,959 perfected over. Yeah, I thought I think 278 00:10:56,959 --> 00:10:57,839 they in 279 00:10:57,839 --> 00:11:01,760 >> 2016 Katie is when it was looked at 280 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:03,200 again because when they built the 281 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:06,160 Raven's Rim, they uh realized that it 282 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:07,279 when they were in the process of it, 283 00:11:07,279 --> 00:11:08,800 they realized that the bike trail was 284 00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:10,959 not really where it was supposed to be 285 00:11:10,959 --> 00:11:13,920 in the paperwork. So 286 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:16,880 that was, you know, rectified by 2016. 287 00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:19,279 Yeah, 288 00:11:19,279 --> 00:11:21,360 >> I feel your first paragraph under 289 00:11:21,360 --> 00:11:27,120 concerns is concise and uh clear and uh 290 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:29,839 points out the confusion of why not the 291 00:11:29,839 --> 00:11:33,680 special zoning, right? Of like why, you 292 00:11:33,680 --> 00:11:37,519 know, of that they're going for this um 293 00:11:37,519 --> 00:11:39,200 bigger resort commercial and there's 294 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:40,399 other options. 295 00:11:40,399 --> 00:11:40,800 >> Correct. 296 00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:43,120 Is that how it's that? That's 297 00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:45,440 very concise and nice that you point 298 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:46,160 that out. 299 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:48,959 >> Are these zonings defined by the state? 300 00:11:48,959 --> 00:11:50,079 >> Are they local? 301 00:11:50,079 --> 00:11:51,120 >> Local. Okay. 302 00:11:51,120 --> 00:11:54,160 >> The state has given a lot of leeway to 303 00:11:54,160 --> 00:11:56,640 the local jurisdictions to write their 304 00:11:56,640 --> 00:11:58,560 own land use codes and actually requires 305 00:11:58,560 --> 00:11:59,040 them to 306 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:00,399 >> because it sound like there was some 307 00:12:00,399 --> 00:12:02,880 confusion about where resort special can 308 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:05,200 and can't be applied and I thought, do 309 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:06,800 we have any control over that? Can we 310 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:10,639 resolve that issue? Well, so our general 311 00:12:10,639 --> 00:12:12,399 plan, uh, we have what's called the 312 00:12:12,399 --> 00:12:16,639 north corridor something plan. Um, and 313 00:12:16,639 --> 00:12:19,360 in that is where both of these zoning 314 00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:24,399 designations are are listed. Um, a lane 315 00:12:24,399 --> 00:12:26,800 amendment generally has to abide by what 316 00:12:26,800 --> 00:12:30,720 the general plan says. our general plan, 317 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:33,279 it speaks specifically to both resort 318 00:12:33,279 --> 00:12:34,800 special and resort commercial and where 319 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:37,680 they can and cannot be in in relation to 320 00:12:37,680 --> 00:12:40,560 properties. Um, and that's what the 321 00:12:40,560 --> 00:12:45,430 commission was speaking to specifically. 322 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:48,560 » But resort special remains an option for 323 00:12:48,560 --> 00:12:49,839 this property. 324 00:12:49,839 --> 00:12:51,440 >> Okay. 325 00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:54,000 >> Well, yeah. So the 326 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:55,600 >> go the weeds of 327 00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:57,120 >> the planning commission letter didn't 328 00:12:57,120 --> 00:12:59,440 really address any of that. They just 329 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:02,240 approve the regional commercial. 330 00:13:02,240 --> 00:13:05,360 >> Yeah. They uh so so they're also 331 00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:07,839 limited. If if an applicant doesn't say 332 00:13:07,839 --> 00:13:09,920 that they want something like that, we 333 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:12,160 couldn't change it like this wasn't 334 00:13:12,160 --> 00:13:13,040 there. 335 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:15,360 >> They couldn't it's not in their perview 336 00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:16,880 to do that. If someone comes here and 337 00:13:16,880 --> 00:13:18,480 says like we want to go hike this, you 338 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:20,639 say you don't send them somewhere else. 339 00:13:20,639 --> 00:13:21,920 So the commission could deny it then 340 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:24,000 they can come back with a different 341 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:25,839 >> resume. 342 00:13:25,839 --> 00:13:29,440 >> Okay. So any other edits under concerns? 343 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:32,880 >> Let's see. The rest of it is uh 344 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:36,240 about the roadway and illegal access is 345 00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:39,760 near the hot tubs 346 00:13:39,760 --> 00:13:41,839 would necessitate paving portions of the 347 00:13:41,839 --> 00:13:43,440 elderbench trail. 348 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:44,240 >> Yeah. 349 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:47,040 And that wasn't ne clear to me. So 350 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:48,880 what I remember before when I did have 351 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:50,720 access to the parcel map, there were 352 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:52,480 kind of two corners of this property 353 00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:54,800 that impacted Hell's Revenge. One would 354 00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:57,600 be in the southeast quadrant near the 355 00:13:57,600 --> 00:13:59,360 exit of tipover challenge where the 356 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:01,440 current exit of Hell's Revenge would be 357 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:03,519 and you could you could put a paved road 358 00:14:03,519 --> 00:14:05,199 right up to there, but that's separate 359 00:14:05,199 --> 00:14:06,399 from the hot tubs. 360 00:14:06,399 --> 00:14:08,000 >> So the question would be, do you have 361 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:09,519 access to both corners? 362 00:14:09,519 --> 00:14:11,600 >> It's whatever their legal access is, 363 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:14,959 >> which is the hot tubs. So there 364 00:14:14,959 --> 00:14:21,040 when when a property is entitled it gets rights it gets legal access to 365 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:23,600 the property whatever that legal access 366 00:14:23,600 --> 00:14:27,680 is is the only one that they have that 367 00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:30,480 they have control over. So if we grant 368 00:14:30,480 --> 00:14:33,040 if the county grants them commercial 369 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:34,800 access or commercial uses on that 370 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:37,600 property whatever road they have legal 371 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:39,600 access on is the one that they are 372 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:42,000 getting rights on. So if that's the top 373 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:43,519 part, it doesn't matter if it's 374 00:14:43,519 --> 00:14:46,320 accessible somewhere else. The only 375 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:49,040 legal right they have is to a legal 376 00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:53,040 access. If they wanted to change that, is something completely different. 377 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:54,639 They would have to vacate it. It would 378 00:14:54,639 --> 00:14:57,440 be something that they would have to um 379 00:14:57,440 --> 00:14:59,440 do on their own. We can't make them do 380 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:01,760 that. So if legal access is health 381 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:06,240 revenge which they it is the only access 382 00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:08,240 that they can change the only access 383 00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:10,240 they can pave is hell's revenge 384 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:12,800 >> right what I guess my question is that 385 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:14,959 there are there are two places where the 386 00:15:14,959 --> 00:15:17,199 hell's revenge trail enters this 387 00:15:17,199 --> 00:15:19,519 property from two different corners 388 00:15:19,519 --> 00:15:21,279 would they have to improve both of those 389 00:15:21,279 --> 00:15:23,120 or one of them 390 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:25,279 >> um I I don't think that they I think 391 00:15:25,279 --> 00:15:27,519 that their access is only one of them 392 00:15:27,519 --> 00:15:28,079 >> okay 393 00:15:28,079 --> 00:15:29,839 >> whichever one their legal access The hot 394 00:15:29,839 --> 00:15:32,959 tubs would not necessarily be 395 00:15:32,959 --> 00:15:34,880 if they come in. 396 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:36,160 >> Yeah, but I don't think that's the legal 397 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:37,440 access. I think the top is 398 00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:38,160 >> I see. 399 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:39,519 >> Wow. 400 00:15:39,519 --> 00:15:41,680 >> That means their current Raven's Rim is 401 00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:43,120 not illegal access. 402 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:45,760 >> No, they're just using they're accessing 403 00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:47,600 it from 191, but that's not their legal 404 00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:49,199 access to the property. 405 00:15:49,199 --> 00:15:50,959 >> And those are very different things. And 406 00:15:50,959 --> 00:15:52,480 that's 407 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:53,920 those that would probably have to be 408 00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:55,759 annexed to the city in order to get that 409 00:15:55,759 --> 00:15:58,079 >> and that came up too. And you said that 410 00:15:58,079 --> 00:16:00,079 that's granted access right now at the 411 00:16:00,079 --> 00:16:02,639 highway. Is that called granted access? 412 00:16:02,639 --> 00:16:04,639 >> No, I have no idea what it is. 413 00:16:04,639 --> 00:16:10,800 >> So significant is say you pave pave the current exit by lines back. That's 414 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:13,120 marginally impactful. But if you if you 415 00:16:13,120 --> 00:16:14,720 come in by the hot tub, you're talking 416 00:16:14,720 --> 00:16:18,320 about paving half of the 417 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:20,000 half of Hell's Revenge if not more than 418 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:21,040 half just to get to that 419 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:22,240 >> corn. Yeah. I mean, I think I don't 420 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:23,680 think I maybe I didn't articulate it 421 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:25,120 well the first time this came up, but 422 00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:26,959 that was like always has always been my 423 00:16:26,959 --> 00:16:28,880 biggest concern with this. Please don't 424 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:31,920 is that and that's that's it. 425 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:34,000 >> Yeah. And I I didn't get that either 426 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:35,040 last time at all. 427 00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:36,880 >> And when we met with editor, that was my 428 00:16:36,880 --> 00:16:38,160 thing. I said if you guys wanted to move 429 00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:39,839 your change access, then this would be 430 00:16:39,839 --> 00:16:43,040 an appropriate thing to come do. Until 431 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:44,720 that happens, I don't I didn't think it 432 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:45,279 was 433 00:16:45,279 --> 00:16:48,560 >> either that or putting a paved road that 434 00:16:48,560 --> 00:16:50,399 cuts through Health Revenge to get to 435 00:16:50,399 --> 00:16:52,320 that location as opposed to Health 436 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:54,160 Revenge itself or would you have to be 437 00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:56,000 >> They would have to They only have legal 438 00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:59,040 access because it's granted from BLM2. 439 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:01,440 They only have the class E road. 440 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:04,000 >> So that basically with redemption. 441 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:06,240 >> Yeah. 442 00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:07,919 >> And and who would pay for that road? 443 00:17:07,919 --> 00:17:10,160 >> They would have to. Well, I mean there 444 00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:11,520 they could make an argument that the 445 00:17:11,520 --> 00:17:13,120 county has to because they granted them 446 00:17:13,120 --> 00:17:15,360 the entitlements. 447 00:17:15,360 --> 00:17:17,600 I don't know if they would win, but they 448 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:20,319 could try that. 449 00:17:20,319 --> 00:17:22,400 >> Wow. 450 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,640 >> Okay. So, is that given that legal 451 00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:26,640 access property is via class D road near 452 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:28,400 the hot tubs, this would likely 453 00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:30,320 necessitate paving portions of the Herbs 454 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:32,000 trail. Such changes would fundamentally 455 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:34,160 alter character of the trail system and 456 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:35,679 diminish the experience that supports 457 00:17:35,679 --> 00:17:36,960 local guiding businesses and 458 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:39,120 recreational users. The economic impact 459 00:17:39,120 --> 00:17:41,200 on the 75 local businesses operating 460 00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:43,280 under BLM permits would be substantial 461 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:45,600 with correspond corresponding effects on 462 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:49,750 the broader local economy. 463 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,799 » Okay. Um that brings up that point. So 464 00:17:52,799 --> 00:17:54,160 that's great. 465 00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:56,480 >> The uh the committee also noted that we 466 00:17:56,480 --> 00:17:58,320 had this in our letter last year that 467 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:00,799 allowing alternative access points from 468 00:18:00,799 --> 00:18:02,640 the Hell's Revenge exit road could 469 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:04,480 compromise Santa Claus's abilities to 470 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:06,320 manage its trail system. This includes 471 00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:08,559 impacts to revenue collection, visitor 472 00:18:08,559 --> 00:18:10,080 safety, orientation and resource 473 00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:12,400 protection. 474 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:14,880 And why is it highlighting that there? 475 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:16,480 We wanted to say it that way though, 476 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:18,799 right? Since this establishment 477 00:18:18,799 --> 00:18:21,679 >> has been managed to maintain. 478 00:18:21,679 --> 00:18:22,559 >> Well, I mean, 479 00:18:22,559 --> 00:18:23,919 >> yeah, I think it should say 480 00:18:23,919 --> 00:18:28,960 >> I think I should say that on the heck 481 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,520 >> uh to maintain it natural character 482 00:18:31,520 --> 00:18:33,280 without commercialization of its core 483 00:18:33,280 --> 00:18:34,880 resources. The proposed reszone 484 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:36,960 represents a significant departure from 485 00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:38,320 that approach and introduces the 486 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:40,559 potential for long-term changes to both 487 00:18:40,559 --> 00:18:42,000 the environmental integrity and the 488 00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:44,320 visitor experience of the area. For 489 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:45,919 these reasons, Samplot stewardship 490 00:18:45,919 --> 00:18:47,840 committee voted to recommend denial of 491 00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:49,600 the reszone application in its current 492 00:18:49,600 --> 00:18:51,919 form, finding that it conflicts with the 493 00:18:51,919 --> 00:18:53,440 established management objectives of the 494 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:56,960 Slots Recreation Area. 495 00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:59,200 >> We need a motion. 496 00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:02,880 I make a motion we accept this letter um 497 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,080 as modified to be submitted to the 498 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:09,039 commission. 499 00:19:09,039 --> 00:19:13,510 >> I second. 500 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:15,360 » Do we need to say it the way exactly the 501 00:19:15,360 --> 00:19:19,600 way I've written it in the minutes of 502 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:22,789 this? 503 00:19:22,799 --> 00:19:23,760 Good. 504 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:27,280 >> Okay. Molly seconded. 505 00:19:27,280 --> 00:19:30,720 Okay. Um 506 00:19:30,720 --> 00:19:33,760 Tom and Tom, can you hear us? 507 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:34,880 >> Yes. 508 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:38,799 >> Okay. So, uh we're going to vote on this 509 00:19:38,799 --> 00:19:40,320 motion. 510 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:44,870 All in favor? 511 00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:50,870 » You're abstaining. Okay. 512 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:55,679 » All right. And we have um Tom. 513 00:19:55,679 --> 00:19:59,440 Okay. Thank you. All right, we can go 514 00:19:59,440 --> 00:20:02,240 into the next one 515 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:05,200 which um 516 00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:08,960 so this Okay, so the next one is 517 00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:10,080 Okay, let me just give you some 518 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:13,280 background on this. So week before Jeep 519 00:20:13,280 --> 00:20:16,559 Safari, uh we were pretty busy because 520 00:20:16,559 --> 00:20:17,600 there are people that don't want to be 521 00:20:17,600 --> 00:20:18,960 here Jeep Safari and they come before 522 00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:21,120 and after anyway and I was talking to 523 00:20:21,120 --> 00:20:24,720 Lucas Turk Turkington who is the um 524 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:26,960 state one of the state rangers who comes 525 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,120 up a lot to Sand Flats and we really 526 00:20:29,120 --> 00:20:31,120 appreciate him being there and he was 527 00:20:31,120 --> 00:20:33,679 saying well I can't be here these days 528 00:20:33,679 --> 00:20:36,640 because I've reached my 40 hours and we 529 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:39,360 are limited to 40 hours. no, not allowed 530 00:20:39,360 --> 00:20:42,640 to have any overtime. And so I was 531 00:20:42,640 --> 00:20:44,640 talking to him about that and he said, 532 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:46,400 um, you might want to call Brody Young 533 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:48,159 because I said, well, maybe Sand Flats 534 00:20:48,159 --> 00:20:49,679 can 535 00:20:49,679 --> 00:20:52,159 uh transfer some money over to you folks 536 00:20:52,159 --> 00:20:55,280 possibly. Uh, in our original agreement 537 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:58,559 between the the BLM and the county uh 538 00:20:58,559 --> 00:21:01,200 way back in the 1994, 539 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:03,919 they do talk about SAM flats paying for 540 00:21:03,919 --> 00:21:05,919 some law enforcement, and we have never 541 00:21:05,919 --> 00:21:08,000 done that all these years. I guess they 542 00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:10,400 were maybe thinking Katie maybe they 543 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:13,440 were thinking of Samplat's paying for 544 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:15,840 BLM law enforcement. Do you have any 545 00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:17,679 idea? 546 00:21:17,679 --> 00:21:20,480 >> No. Although I think that's probably, 547 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:22,320 you know, and we don't charge for our 548 00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:24,240 law enforcement up in Sand Flat. So 549 00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:26,240 maybe that was something they put in way 550 00:21:26,240 --> 00:21:28,320 back then, but I doubt if they were 551 00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:32,870 thinking of the state guys. 552 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:37,760 Well, we don't have to uh you know vote 553 00:21:37,760 --> 00:21:40,000 on it today. We could just decide. I 554 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:41,840 mean, I don't have theou ready. This is 555 00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:45,760 just a sample that Brody Young sent me 556 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:48,480 and um I have to go to the commission 557 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:50,000 and everything, but I just wanted to see 558 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:52,400 what kind of support you all had for 559 00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:55,039 that. Um I did talk to Quinn Hall about 560 00:21:55,039 --> 00:21:56,880 it and he said that I needed to go to 561 00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:58,880 my, you know, committee first before I 562 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:01,520 progressed any further. Um, looking at 563 00:22:01,520 --> 00:22:04,480 it, he had come back. Brody Young had 564 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:07,440 suggested $28,000 565 00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:11,039 for six months um of eight hours extra a 566 00:22:11,039 --> 00:22:13,600 week for a law enforcement range. It 567 00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:15,520 wouldn't necessarily be just Lucas. It 568 00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:16,880 could be someone else as well. 569 00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:19,200 >> That entail mostly speed limit, just 570 00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:20,080 presence. 571 00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:22,720 >> Presence. And what he does now is he 572 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,600 sits um right near the exit of Fins and 573 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:26,400 Things 574 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:28,480 >> and he'll do a lot of his paperwork when 575 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,400 he's sitting there. He has reception and 576 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:33,360 he's a people see him and then he also 577 00:22:33,360 --> 00:22:34,799 catches a lot of people when they come 578 00:22:34,799 --> 00:22:36,159 off of fins and things and go on the 579 00:22:36,159 --> 00:22:38,720 road really fast. He goes out on the 580 00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:42,720 trails and patrols. Um he's checking uh 581 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:46,240 the registration as well. Um so he he 582 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:49,280 does all of it. He helps with uh with 583 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,360 accidents, emergencies as well. 584 00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:53,760 >> This winter I' I've seen that white 585 00:22:53,760 --> 00:22:56,400 truck there about 15% of the time that 586 00:22:56,400 --> 00:22:57,679 I've come through there. 587 00:22:57,679 --> 00:23:00,000 >> Yeah. So, you need more than him cuz he 588 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:01,280 goes over a 40 hour. 589 00:23:01,280 --> 00:23:03,120 >> He goes over 40 in the spring and the 590 00:23:03,120 --> 00:23:05,120 fall, I guess. Uh 591 00:23:05,120 --> 00:23:07,200 >> well, he would he is avail he would like 592 00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:09,200 to be available to go over 40. I guess 593 00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:11,679 they've gotten tighter. What What do you 594 00:23:11,679 --> 00:23:13,280 think of this, Kristen? 595 00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:14,880 >> I just have a question. Why aren't you 596 00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:17,200 guys just utilizing title 17, modifying 597 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:21,919 it, and making the sheriff take it? 598 00:23:21,919 --> 00:23:26,240 Title 17 is a is a 599 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,799 govern. Well, but title 17 allows the 600 00:23:28,799 --> 00:23:31,440 sheriff to uh it was a an agreement 601 00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:32,960 between BLM and the sheriff. 602 00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:34,640 >> Well, we do have Brad Hines up there 603 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:35,520 sheriff. 604 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:38,480 >> Yeah. What a I mean he's a sergeant. I 605 00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:39,039 think 606 00:23:39,039 --> 00:23:41,120 >> I think like to I know this is a tight 607 00:23:41,120 --> 00:23:43,280 budget. So I think I was just trying to 608 00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:45,360 um I mean I think that the sheriff would 609 00:23:45,360 --> 00:23:47,520 have I think that you know maybe try 610 00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:50,480 that way to save money. 611 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:50,880 Okay. If 612 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,200 >> you already have title 17, it would 613 00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:56,240 require very little modification to 614 00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:58,159 >> Sorry, am I speaking really out of order 615 00:23:58,159 --> 00:23:59,840 on 616 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:01,760 just exploring this? I've only talked to 617 00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:04,080 Brody and I've only talked to uh Quinn 618 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:04,640 Hall. 619 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:05,120 >> Okay. 620 00:24:05,120 --> 00:24:06,000 >> So, um 621 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:09,520 >> yeah, you just already have title 17. Um 622 00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,080 adding in a section with law enforcement 623 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,240 specifically for all of these things 624 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:17,039 that are dictated in Title 17. 625 00:24:17,039 --> 00:24:19,039 Technically, if the county is has 626 00:24:19,039 --> 00:24:22,320 already adopted it, it is the county's 627 00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:25,200 obligation to enforce it, even by the 628 00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:28,400 sheriff. So, I mean, I don't think that 629 00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:30,000 I I mean, I I get that what you're 630 00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:31,360 trying to do, but I just think that the 631 00:24:31,360 --> 00:24:32,720 county already is already obligated 632 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:34,159 under title 17. 633 00:24:34,159 --> 00:24:34,960 >> Okay. 634 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:36,480 >> Sounds like I need to explore more with 635 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:37,360 the sheriff. 636 00:24:37,360 --> 00:24:37,840 >> Okay. 637 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,400 >> Is it a class B county road? 638 00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:41,440 >> Class. Yeah. 639 00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:43,039 >> Okay. So, it's in their jurisdiction 640 00:24:43,039 --> 00:24:44,080 already. Mhm. 641 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:45,919 >> And then I've seen him sitting there 642 00:24:45,919 --> 00:24:48,000 too, but I've never actually seen him, 643 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:50,240 you know, pulling something over. So, 644 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:53,039 couldn't even it rotate with like the 645 00:24:53,039 --> 00:24:55,120 sand flat staff being more official 646 00:24:55,120 --> 00:24:58,480 looking vehicle sitting there like 647 00:24:58,480 --> 00:24:59,039 >> he does. 648 00:24:59,039 --> 00:25:00,640 >> So, in other words, you want me to yell 649 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:02,880 at people, Molly? 650 00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:04,960 >> No. Flash your lights on him. 651 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,600 >> No, there's We definitely appreciate law 652 00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:10,640 enforcement. We need law enforcement. We 653 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:12,720 can only do so much. 654 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:14,159 for the day. Somebody was doing donuts 655 00:25:14,159 --> 00:25:16,000 in the parking lot. 656 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:18,159 >> I yell at them if they are. 657 00:25:18,159 --> 00:25:19,360 >> Okay. 658 00:25:19,360 --> 00:25:20,080 >> All right. 659 00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:21,679 >> Definitely appreciate all of the law 660 00:25:21,679 --> 00:25:23,039 enforcement presence that we get up 661 00:25:23,039 --> 00:25:23,360 there. 662 00:25:23,360 --> 00:25:25,440 >> And Jeff Urban will rotate in there. I 663 00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:27,919 mean, he Lucas isn't the only state, 664 00:25:27,919 --> 00:25:29,919 >> right? 665 00:25:29,919 --> 00:25:30,400 >> Okay. 666 00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:31,520 >> Yeah. 667 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:33,120 And you guys, I don't know if you could 668 00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:35,360 know, you know, all three law 669 00:25:35,360 --> 00:25:37,279 enforcement, you know, the county, the 670 00:25:37,279 --> 00:25:41,520 state, and uh and with the federal um 671 00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:44,720 with BLM, they all have, you know, 672 00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:47,200 four-wheel drive trucks or vehicles, 673 00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:49,679 then they all have a side by side, and 674 00:25:49,679 --> 00:25:53,039 then I think BLM has a dirt bike, you 675 00:25:53,039 --> 00:25:56,000 know, and so so I've seen them all out 676 00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,159 there on all those vehicles. They're 677 00:25:58,159 --> 00:26:00,159 mainly on, you know, their pickup trucks 678 00:26:00,159 --> 00:26:02,400 or four-wheel drive vehicles on the dirt 679 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:03,840 road, but yeah, it's nice to see them 680 00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:04,880 when they're out there on the real 681 00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:10,549 trails. 682 00:26:10,559 --> 00:26:13,200 » Okay. So, it sounds like maybe we need 683 00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:16,080 to I don't know. You can tell me like if 684 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:18,640 you have support for this. Well, but I 685 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:19,600 think 686 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:20,159 >> yes. 687 00:26:20,159 --> 00:26:22,640 >> Yeah. Explore options. 688 00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:24,080 >> Yeah. Okay. Okay. So, it sounds like we 689 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:26,799 need to table it and not vote on it, but 690 00:26:26,799 --> 00:26:28,720 explore options and I can have things 691 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:30,640 ready for you at the June meeting. I'll 692 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:32,720 tell you what I found out and go from 693 00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:34,640 there. Yeah, one of the options might be 694 00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,120 I mean instead of actually paying for 695 00:26:37,120 --> 00:26:40,240 more would actually be somebody doing a 696 00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:43,440 calendar where like I mean it's always 697 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:45,840 amazing like oh what you know 698 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:47,840 >> I tried that with them a little bit but 699 00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:50,960 they're like no we are kind of all over 700 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:53,360 the place and yeah I have talked about 701 00:26:53,360 --> 00:26:54,799 that with them like 702 00:26:54,799 --> 00:26:56,400 >> you guys kind of 703 00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:58,000 >> say okay I'm here Monday Tuesday I'm 704 00:26:58,000 --> 00:26:59,760 here but you can 705 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:01,679 >> you can communicate where your needs are 706 00:27:01,679 --> 00:27:03,440 greatest and then they can factor that 707 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:04,799 into their own skills. 708 00:27:04,799 --> 00:27:06,559 >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, they're really good 709 00:27:06,559 --> 00:27:08,400 at, you know, sometimes, well, lots of 710 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:09,200 times 711 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:10,480 >> there won't be any law enforcement up 712 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:12,400 there and we're just really busy and 713 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:15,279 there aren't any issues yet, but I'll 714 00:27:15,279 --> 00:27:17,600 call dispatch or I'll or I'll text 715 00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:20,080 usually the BLM rangers and stuff. I say 716 00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:22,080 anyone available to just come up and 717 00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:23,679 drive through so that people don't think 718 00:27:23,679 --> 00:27:25,360 it's the wild west up here because it's 719 00:27:25,360 --> 00:27:27,360 just like feeling really it's really 720 00:27:27,360 --> 00:27:29,120 crowded and really chaotic and 721 00:27:29,120 --> 00:27:30,799 >> and then they come up and then sometimes 722 00:27:30,799 --> 00:27:32,640 the other week I called them the week 723 00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:36,240 before Jeep spray and right after I 724 00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:37,919 called them there was an emergency on 725 00:27:37,919 --> 00:27:39,520 Hell's Revenge SO EVERYONE WAS COMING 726 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:42,159 ANYWAY. Then they went out and did some 727 00:27:42,159 --> 00:27:43,520 of the other stuff I was hoping for, 728 00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:45,440 which was just like some rolls on the 729 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:47,360 trails because we'd heard about drinking 730 00:27:47,360 --> 00:27:49,440 open containers on one of the trails. 731 00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:51,360 And so I that's why I was calling for 732 00:27:51,360 --> 00:27:52,240 presence. 733 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:56,640 >> So this would be actually just for this 734 00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:58,960 was just for the state. 735 00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,200 >> This one I mean this is the sample Cody 736 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:02,799 sent me. So this isn't even 737 00:28:02,799 --> 00:28:05,919 >> Well, so they could go over meaning so 738 00:28:05,919 --> 00:28:08,960 they could come over their 40 hours. 739 00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:11,360 >> Yeah. even though it says special event 740 00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:11,840 like 741 00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:14,159 >> well this is this is anou he just pulled 742 00:28:14,159 --> 00:28:16,080 out of somewhere to give an example for 743 00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:18,159 us to have to start writing something I 744 00:28:18,159 --> 00:28:19,919 guess I just he just mentioned it he 745 00:28:19,919 --> 00:28:22,080 said I can send you some things we've 746 00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:23,600 used in the past I said okay just send 747 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:24,240 it to me 748 00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:26,320 >> what if you had this and then you could 749 00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,200 use it when 750 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:33,520 they weren't able to come 751 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:37,919 but you needed like Jeep Safari covered 752 00:28:37,919 --> 00:28:40,240 >> well he and he had said, "How about 6 753 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:42,480 months, 8 hours a week and I came back 754 00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:45,840 with how about 17 weeks, eight hours 755 00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:47,279 because and then that brought it down to 756 00:28:47,279 --> 00:28:49,520 20,000 because I felt like that was 757 00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:51,440 enough coverage, 758 00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:53,200 you know, it was like 11 weeks in the 759 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:55,840 spring and six weeks in the fall." 760 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:58,080 So, but it sounds like I have I have 761 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:00,080 homework. Well, I'm a couple just 762 00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:02,159 because this is also a state agency, you 763 00:29:02,159 --> 00:29:03,840 could do this under instead of a me 764 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:05,919 anou, you would do it under a 765 00:29:05,919 --> 00:29:08,000 cooperative cooperative agreement in 766 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,760 title 11. Um, which if you reach out, 767 00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:13,120 well, our office will help you with 768 00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:13,600 that. 769 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:14,880 >> Okay. Okay. 770 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:16,960 >> But lovely idea. 771 00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:19,840 >> Okay. Okay. Well, I, you know, I just 772 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:21,360 thought while we're meeting, I'll put it 773 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:24,240 on here to discuss. So since it just was 774 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,919 recent happenings and um and then just 775 00:29:27,919 --> 00:29:29,440 to 776 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,320 kind of tie into this uh I just wanted 777 00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:35,279 to give you um with this budget talking 778 00:29:35,279 --> 00:29:38,720 about cost and budget I thought I would 779 00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:41,600 just um give you updated and I 780 00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:43,679 unfortunately didn't print on both sides 781 00:29:43,679 --> 00:29:47,760 updated agreement stuff 782 00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:52,720 um we are 29% over last year through 783 00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:54,559 this time. And it's not just a fee 784 00:29:54,559 --> 00:29:57,440 increase. I did the math and um 785 00:29:57,440 --> 00:29:58,720 >> the warm winter we had. 786 00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:00,720 >> It's the warm winter. Yeah, 787 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:02,000 >> that's pretty substantial. 788 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:04,320 >> Yeah. So, that's substantial. So, I had 789 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,559 some numbers wrong when we met last time 790 00:30:06,559 --> 00:30:08,159 and I caught them and went, "Oh my 791 00:30:08,159 --> 00:30:10,799 gosh." So, here's an updated one because 792 00:30:10,799 --> 00:30:12,640 I think I told you 4% when we met last 793 00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:13,120 time. 794 00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:14,720 >> Set the bar really hard. Really high 795 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:16,240 though for future years. 796 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:17,679 >> Yeah. We'll see. I know. Look at that. 797 00:30:17,679 --> 00:30:20,159 red line going right up. 798 00:30:20,159 --> 00:30:21,679 pink right over there. 799 00:30:21,679 --> 00:30:22,720 >> Yeah, March is crazy. 800 00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:24,320 >> Yeah, we'll see. We'll see if people 801 00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:26,880 were coming early if it starts dropping 802 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:29,120 more quickly in the next month. 803 00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:31,600 >> Yeah, if it keeps getting hotter and 804 00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:32,320 hotter. 805 00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:34,640 >> Okay. Well, that's all I have. 806 00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:36,880 >> I have a question though, Andrea, and 807 00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:40,159 it's here. Let me share. And it's I you 808 00:30:40,159 --> 00:30:41,600 know, I don't know if anybody has the 809 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:44,640 answer. Uh get back to my share screen. 810 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:45,760 Um 811 00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:48,240 >> Oh, do I have to get out or you 812 00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:49,760 >> No, you're good. Can you see Can you see 813 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:51,039 my desktop? 814 00:30:51,039 --> 00:30:51,840 >> Yeah. 815 00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:54,000 >> So, looking through this is, you know, 816 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,600 back to the Hell's Revenge easement. Uh, 817 00:30:57,600 --> 00:30:59,200 you know, if I I'm scrolling through the 818 00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:01,600 document and I get to this page and I'm 819 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:03,279 like, you know, they're highlighting 820 00:31:03,279 --> 00:31:05,840 these hot tubs that are at the top of, 821 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:09,120 you know, sort of the dragon's tail. Uh, 822 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:10,960 and they're saying that, you know, this 823 00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:13,039 is trespassing. And then they have a 824 00:31:13,039 --> 00:31:16,320 photo over here of the jeeps off the 825 00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:18,240 main trail and they're parked off the 826 00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:23,120 side and you know been there many many times. People play in those mini 827 00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:25,039 hot tubs let's say up at the top the 828 00:31:25,039 --> 00:31:26,559 devil hot tubs. 829 00:31:26,559 --> 00:31:28,159 >> Are they not going to allow that 830 00:31:28,159 --> 00:31:30,559 anymore? What I mean I don't understand 831 00:31:30,559 --> 00:31:33,120 why they put this in there to highlight 832 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,960 uh uh that area. Does anyone 833 00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:38,480 >> the last when this came up the first 834 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:41,279 time because Mark Steen was making that 835 00:31:41,279 --> 00:31:43,440 argument that there was trespassing 836 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:44,159 >> anyway 837 00:31:44,159 --> 00:31:46,080 >> that raised my eyebrows because if we 838 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:47,600 are trespassing that's a totally 839 00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:49,679 separate issue that we need to deal with 840 00:31:49,679 --> 00:31:52,559 on its own but I think it was somewhat 841 00:31:52,559 --> 00:31:54,559 of an emotional argument that was being 842 00:31:54,559 --> 00:31:57,120 made. So but you're right I mean one one 843 00:31:57,120 --> 00:31:58,640 maybe people should not be there at all 844 00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:01,360 and it should be marked accordingly. Um, 845 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:03,120 obviously if they start developing the 846 00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:04,720 property, I'm sure there'll be more 847 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:08,799 controls over leaving the the UR. 848 00:32:08,799 --> 00:32:10,720 >> My understanding was they needed to 849 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:12,799 fence people out if they didn't want 850 00:32:12,799 --> 00:32:14,880 them on there. 851 00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:16,399 >> Nobody up there knows that it's private 852 00:32:16,399 --> 00:32:17,760 property at all. 853 00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:18,880 >> Correct. 854 00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:20,000 >> There's an argument that there's a 855 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:25,350 prescriptive easement for that. Um, 856 00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:27,679 because there's nothing that's prevented 857 00:32:27,679 --> 00:32:29,679 people from using it for 20 years. it 858 00:32:29,679 --> 00:32:30,960 becomes what's called prescriptive 859 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:34,159 easement in Utah state law. Um, 860 00:32:34,159 --> 00:32:36,320 technically because it's, you know, just 861 00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:40,149 kind of a loop. 862 00:32:40,159 --> 00:32:42,000 » Here it is on Google Maps. You can see 863 00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:44,880 how well defined it is with the tire 864 00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:48,000 tracks and stuff. But yeah. Yeah. 865 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:49,760 >> Using it for more than 20 years. Like 866 00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:52,320 that's not even a question. Um, and it 867 00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:53,840 wouldn't be hard to even 868 00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:56,080 >> if it were on BLM land, I'd be out there 869 00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:58,159 building fences and shutting it off. 870 00:32:58,159 --> 00:33:00,399 Well, we were we did discuss this. We 871 00:33:00,399 --> 00:33:02,080 were very 872 00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:03,519 that he was bringing it up. I didn't 873 00:33:03,519 --> 00:33:05,600 know if he was bringing it up as a we're 874 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:07,760 sharing so you should share or I didn't 875 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:08,080 know 876 00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:09,279 >> Well, he didn't bring it up at the 877 00:33:09,279 --> 00:33:10,799 planning commission this last time. 878 00:33:10,799 --> 00:33:14,159 >> No, when he did his first presentation. 879 00:33:14,159 --> 00:33:16,720 >> Well, and in 2012 880 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:19,200 >> when we did the easement, I asked them I 881 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:20,960 bought the private property signs and I 882 00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,399 asked them, "Do you want us to put those 883 00:33:22,399 --> 00:33:24,960 up?" And they said, "No." 884 00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:26,240 Okay. 885 00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:27,919 >> Okay. Yeah. Yeah, cuz in the document 886 00:33:27,919 --> 00:33:30,159 I'm looking at here right now that was 887 00:33:30,159 --> 00:33:32,320 submitted to the county, there's no it 888 00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:34,480 just says TR area of trespassing. I'm 889 00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:36,480 like, okay, why did they put that there? 890 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:38,320 That's why I'm scratching my head. 891 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:39,679 >> Have to use the things they had last 892 00:33:39,679 --> 00:33:40,559 time. But 893 00:33:40,559 --> 00:33:44,720 >> yeah, they were um Yeah, my my memory is 894 00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:46,559 that they were pretty upset that that 895 00:33:46,559 --> 00:33:53,519 the prior staff said that um that was recommending denial on this for a 896 00:33:53,519 --> 00:33:55,679 lot of reasons. and they said that in 897 00:33:55,679 --> 00:33:57,919 sort of not retaliation but that they 898 00:33:57,919 --> 00:34:01,200 might um limit access to that because of 899 00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:03,440 that. 900 00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:05,039 >> So sounds when it comes to that we'll 901 00:34:05,039 --> 00:34:08,240 have to look into whether or not it's 902 00:34:08,240 --> 00:34:10,159 >> because it's not a county road because 903 00:34:10,159 --> 00:34:13,119 it's you know it would it would be more 904 00:34:13,119 --> 00:34:15,040 prescriptive easement sort of fight. 905 00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:15,839 >> Yeah. 906 00:34:15,839 --> 00:34:18,480 >> Um and it would be up to the commission 907 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,119 on how how far they wanted to take that 908 00:34:21,119 --> 00:34:21,599 fight. 909 00:34:21,599 --> 00:34:22,879 >> Right. 910 00:34:22,879 --> 00:34:25,280 >> Yeah. I I just went to another mapping 911 00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:27,839 online mapping system and here it's it's 912 00:34:27,839 --> 00:34:30,320 actually highlighted as a road on this 913 00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:33,119 one. It's this little loop right here. 914 00:34:33,119 --> 00:34:33,839 >> Well, you know, 915 00:34:33,839 --> 00:34:35,520 >> we have a lot of problem with that with 916 00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:37,280 Google Earth, Google Maps where people 917 00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:39,520 go in and start making trails that 918 00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:41,119 aren't there without any regard to 919 00:34:41,119 --> 00:34:44,159 what's designated and not. So, this is 920 00:34:44,159 --> 00:34:46,560 battle to fight if it goes there. 921 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:48,879 >> Yeah. Yeah. That's That's little 922 00:34:48,879 --> 00:34:50,879 compared to what we're dealing with, 923 00:34:50,879 --> 00:34:52,879 right? Zone change. 924 00:34:52,879 --> 00:34:54,480 >> Okay. But yeah, I just had the question 925 00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:56,320 just scrolling through that document. It 926 00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:58,000 was just like, okay, what's what's up 927 00:34:58,000 --> 00:34:59,119 with that? 928 00:34:59,119 --> 00:34:59,920 >> Okay. 929 00:34:59,920 --> 00:35:02,320 >> Well, sure. All right. Well, thank you. 930 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:05,920 Um, I guess we can adjourn. 931 00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:07,599 >> Thank you for coming. You have a wealth 932 00:35:07,599 --> 00:35:10,960 of knowledge on the rails. 933 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:15,520 >> Okay. She votes to the journey.