[0:47] Welcome everyone to the
[0:50] regular scheduled Grant County
[0:52] Commissioner's meeting on May 19th. It's
[0:55] 4:02 and we will call this meeting to
[0:57] order. We have in attendance Mr. Trisha
[1:00] Hedin, Mr. John Heather,
[1:03] Commissioner Brian Martinez.
[1:05] Is Mary on Zoom? Yes, yeah. Okay.
[1:07] Commissioner Mary McGlenn on Zoom.
[1:10] Mr. Mike McCurdy, Commissioner Bill
[1:12] Winfield, and myself, Commissioner Bill
[1:14] Kelly. Also, our clerk
[1:16] Administrator Martina, and also our
[1:18] auditor Shelly Wyant, and our county
[1:21] attorney is online, Stephen Stocks.
[1:24] And with that, you'll stand up for the
[1:26] Pledge of Allegiance.
[1:30] I pledge allegiance to the flag
[1:33] of the United States of America.
[1:35] And to the republic for which it stands,
[1:38] one nation under God, indivisible, with
[1:41] liberty and justice for all.
[1:48] right, we have our 4:00 citizens to
[1:50] be heard, so if you would like to speak,
[1:52] go ahead and raise your hand. We do have
[1:54] a 3-minute timer that our assistant is
[1:57] going to put up. So, when it turns red,
[1:59] stop. pop it in or I'll pop it up.
[2:02] 3 minutes. Thank you. Okay, right here
[2:04] in the blue shirt. Come on up. You can
[2:06] use the podium here or sit down, either way. They have a
[2:10] microphone so hopefully the audience can
[2:12] hear you. Before you start, I just want
[2:14] to thank you for using your microphone
[2:16] for the hard of hearing of of us out
[2:17] there in the world. Rest of you, need to
[2:19] use your mic as well.
[2:20] >> Okay, got it.
[2:21] >> them that too, but thank you. I'm Diane
[2:23] Allen. I am retired from the National
[2:25] Park Service as Chief of Interpretation
[2:27] at Arches National Park.
[2:29] Um
[2:31] I participated in many many hours of
[2:34] planning while at the park. And I also
[2:37] ran the shuttle system at Stehekin and
[2:39] North Cascades National Park for 6
[2:41] years. So, a little bit of background
[2:42] back there. Um there's several things
[2:44] about this project that concern me. Um
[2:46] there's many more, but you won't give me
[2:48] a whole hour, so I'll try to narrow it
[2:51] down. Um I One of my concerns is
[2:53] transparency.
[2:55] Most of us have no idea what's been
[2:57] going on. It's planned. Now things are
[3:00] coming out that it's like time to vote
[3:02] on it. Um
[3:05] But there's a lot of operational issues
[3:07] that I think many of us have questions
[3:08] about. For instance, VIA or VIA, the
[3:12] company that operates the Moab area
[3:14] transit um and
[3:17] local
[3:18] transit their shuttles in other
[3:19] communities, apparently it has already
[3:21] been chosen as the shuttle provider for
[3:24] Arches. Or at least they think they
[3:26] have. They issued a feasibility
[3:28] statement. I'm not sure exactly what it
[3:30] was meant to be. Saying that they could
[3:31] begin as soon as yesterday.
[3:34] Somehow that just ain't right.
[3:36] Um
[3:37] Mr. Martinez, you state that the shuttle
[3:39] will, quote, "Protect the park,
[3:41] strengthen our economy, and improve
[3:43] quality of life for locals." I sure like
[3:45] to see some specifics on all of those
[3:47] because it just doesn't make sense to
[3:49] me. I realize that you're primarily
[3:51] focusing on the economy. And my big
[3:54] issue, of course, as most of the people
[3:56] out here are concerned about is the
[3:57] funding. Um I am no expert on TRT
[4:01] funding and what it's supposed to be
[4:02] used for and all of the hullabaloo
[4:04] that's been going on about it. But it
[4:07] just seems like there are many other
[4:08] community needs that could be met by
[4:11] that half a million dollars, which is a
[4:13] lot of money. Um
[4:16] And I also am unclear if this is meant
[4:19] to be a one-time statement of TRT money
[4:22] or if that's going to continue every
[4:24] year
[4:25] or as long as the shuttle is in
[4:27] operation. I realize it's a pilot
[4:28] program, but what happens in the future?
[4:32] Um
[4:33] I don't see that this shuttle system
[4:36] will actually enhance the visitors'
[4:38] experience at Arches. I know there are
[4:39] people that will disagree with that, but
[4:42] that's my opinion. Um I also find it
[4:45] interesting that somehow having a
[4:46] shuttle system will protect park
[4:48] resources. I don't see that happening at
[4:50] all.
[4:51] And it's interesting to me that while
[4:53] this august body is required to know a
[4:56] lot of things about a lot of different
[4:58] subjects,
[4:59] I don't think visitor management in a
[5:00] national park is in your job
[5:02] description. So, leave it to the
[5:03] professionals. Yes.
[5:07] Thank you.
[5:07] All right.
[5:13] Axman, um
[5:15] concerned citizen,
[5:17] um
[5:18] I'd like to
[5:20] think a lot of what she said, but the
[5:21] transparency hasn't been that great.
[5:24] Um when you guys decided to get rid of
[5:27] the reservation system, I really liked
[5:29] the idea.
[5:30] The reservation system had some
[5:33] problems, but
[5:35] it would have been really nice if you'd
[5:36] have worked through that before you just
[5:39] opened it up and then all of a sudden we have this
[5:43] transportation
[5:45] thing going on that nobody's even put
[5:48] any
[5:49] voice it to.
[5:50] Uh for one, um I don't know where the
[5:52] money's coming from cuz I thought we
[5:54] didn't have the money. And then all of a
[5:55] sudden, here's $500,000.
[5:58] The
[5:59] Where did it come from? And here
[6:01] [clears throat] we are raising taxes on
[6:03] all of us locals. I just don't get it.
[6:06] Uh um
[6:07] Uh
[6:09] man with the
[6:11] reservation system, I mean, there if you
[6:13] wanted to start by getting some of the businesses here
[6:16] in town to to get you guys in there or
[6:19] have people park at their businesses so
[6:21] they can put them on coaches and see how
[6:23] that works for a while. I mean, that
[6:25] would be really
[6:26] We let's do some studying and stuff
[6:29] before we just throw this in. I don't know what you guys are thinking,
[6:33] but the transparency, like she said, is just not there.
[6:36] And I'd like to know where the money is
[6:38] because I the stuff that I read, it
[6:41] doesn't look good. And if we have
[6:42] another
[6:44] COVID or if we have something else,
[6:47] where's that
[6:49] where's the trans
[6:51] TRT money going to come from?
[6:53] I just don't think you guys have thought
[6:56] of this very through.
[6:58] Um so, please just take a step back.
[7:01] Let's figure out what we need to do and
[7:03] then we'll go from there. Thank you for
[7:06] all your hard work, by the way, cuz I
[7:08] know it's not easy.
[7:11] » [clears throat]
[7:12] >> All right.
[7:12] Come on up, Pete.
[7:21] I wanted to get it out of the way
[7:22] because then I can relax and listen to
[7:23] other people.
[7:25] My name is Pete Brust.
[7:26] I'd like to point out that the current
[7:28] majority campaigned on transparency and
[7:31] fiscal responsibility.
[7:33] How has that manifested itself?
[7:36] $1,000
[7:38] out of four to two vote four to two vote
[7:40] for the deceptively named Utah Public
[7:43] Council, which advocates for public
[7:44] lands grazing,
[7:46] >> [clears throat]
[7:46] >> even though Utah's percent of beef
[7:48] production in the US is like a small
[7:50] fraction of 1%.
[7:52] $10,000 for a dubious cloud seeding
[7:56] project in Grand County.
[7:58] $60,000
[8:00] I don't even mention what it's for, but
[8:02] I will. Kem C. Gardner
[8:04] uh uh policy Institute report
[8:07] to allegedly prove that timed entry
[8:09] depressed Moab's economy.
[8:12] And first of all, as even the person who
[8:14] advocated for that presented the idea
[8:16] pointed out, correlation does not prove
[8:18] causation.
[8:20] So, then the reality came out when the Kem C. Gardner report was
[8:24] issued,
[8:25] um
[8:27] as chaos and congestion returned,
[8:31] you know, at the entrance to Arches,
[8:33] we find that visitor spending in Grand
[8:35] County during that timed entry period
[8:37] went up 22.2%.
[8:40] Visitor tax revenue increased 27.8%.
[8:44] Tourism-related jobs in Grand County up
[8:46] 16.3%.
[8:48] Now,
[8:50] they also pointed out that it's likely
[8:52] that visit visitor
[8:54] um
[8:56] visitors to Arches may have declined,
[9:00] but maybe those same visitors, because
[9:02] they didn't have to wait in line, they
[9:04] spent more time
[9:05] in Grand County, because some people
[9:07] like to actually plan ahead and not
[9:09] just, you know, randomly show up
[9:11] somewhere.
[9:12] Okay. And now,
[9:14] we're talking about a half million dollars of our tax
[9:18] money to fix, supposedly, some of the
[9:21] chaos created by abolishing timed entry.
[9:24] As I echo what the other speakers
[9:26] already said, um
[9:28] I just don't get it. Thank you for your
[9:30] time.
[9:36] Come on up.
[9:47] Thanks for having me. Uh commissioners,
[9:49] I know some of us have found ourselves
[9:50] >> Say your name. Oh, sorry. Uh Luke
[9:52] Wojcicki, Grand Rapids resident.
[9:55] Um commissioners, I know some of us have
[9:57] found ourselves on opposite sides of
[9:59] public debates before. But I hope you
[10:01] can recognize that I've tried to be
[10:02] consistent about one thing. Process
[10:05] matters. How something is done is not
[10:07] separate from whether the public can
[10:08] trust it. It is how public trust is
[10:11] built. I'm not here tonight to argue
[10:12] that an Archer shuttle is a bad idea.
[10:15] The question is whether this specific
[10:16] proposal, with this timeline, with this
[10:18] level of public information, is ready
[10:20] for a $500,000 public funding
[10:23] commitment.
[10:24] When I was on the City Commission, I
[10:25] learned that controversial projects do
[10:27] not get better by keeping them away from
[10:28] public scrutiny.
[10:30] They get better when they are brought
[10:32] into the open. Public engagement can be
[10:34] repetitive and uncomfortable, but it
[10:36] also [clears throat] made the final
[10:37] proposal stronger every single time.
[10:39] That is what good public process is
[10:41] supposed to do. I understand that a lot
[10:43] of
[10:44] has to happen before a vote. I genuinely
[10:46] appreciate the interagency coordination
[10:48] that has taken place, but coordination
[10:51] among agencies is not the same as public
[10:53] process.
[10:54] There's a difference between preparing
[10:56] an agenda item and moving a major
[10:58] project this far ahead before the public
[11:00] has had a meaningful chance to
[11:01] understand it, question it, or provide
[11:03] input.
[11:04] The working group was formally created
[11:06] about 6 weeks ago. At that point, the
[11:08] public was told that this was exploring
[11:10] a shuttle. Now, this commission is being
[11:12] asked to approve the county's share of a
[11:14] $3 million pilot. After state and
[11:16] federal funding commitments, public
[11:18] announcements, and a September launch,
[11:20] Target have already created significant
[11:22] momentum. That is the concern. Not that
[11:25] partners have been doing work, but that
[11:27] public messaging about this project is
[11:28] much further ahead than the
[11:29] documentation in the agenda packet.
[11:32] Messaging makes this sound like a
[11:33] project moving from concept to reality.
[11:36] But the agenda materials leave major
[11:38] pieces for later. That gap matters
[11:40] because it asks the public to trust a
[11:42] process it has not really been able to
[11:44] see. When significant decisions move
[11:46] forward with limited public visibility,
[11:48] people fill the gaps, sometimes fairly,
[11:50] sometimes not. But if the commission is
[11:52] frustrated by speculation, it should
[11:54] recognize the conditions that allowed it
[11:55] to thrive. Transparency is not simply
[11:58] taking the final vote in an open
[11:59] meeting. Transparency means giving the
[12:01] public enough information early enough
[12:03] to participate meaningfully.
[12:05] If residents, businesses, and affected
[12:07] stakeholders only see the details after
[12:09] the direction has already been set, then
[12:11] public comment becomes more performative
[12:13] than substantive. Asking for two due
[12:16] diligence is not the same as trying to
[12:18] kill the project. Similarly, prior
[12:20] general support for shuttles is not the
[12:22] same as public input on this specific
[12:24] pilot. And just because a concept has
[12:26] been discussed for years does not mean a
[12:27] new specific operational plan is ready.
[12:30] If there's a hard deadline or a real
[12:32] risk of losing NPS or U.S. funding, put
[12:34] that clearly on the record. But if the
[12:36] urgency is mainly a September launch,
[12:38] then the commission should slow down
[12:40] long enough for the public to understand
[12:41] what's being approved. This project may
[12:43] be worthwhile, but worthwhile projects
[12:45] still need public trust. And public
[12:47] trust is built before the vote, not at
[12:49] the time of the vote. So, I'm not asking
[12:51] you to say no to a shuttle. I'm asking
[12:53] you say not yet. Pause. Put the details
[12:56] in front of the public, allow input, and
[12:58] decide whether this pilot is ready for a
[13:00] $500,000 commitment. A stronger public
[13:03] process will not weaken a good project.
[13:05] It will make it more likely to succeed.
[13:07] Thank you.
[13:09] Okay, we're going to go. We have a
[13:10] couple online. We're going to go to
[13:11] those and then we'll come back into
[13:12] chambers. So, we'll go to um
[13:14] Tory Hill. Okay, Tory.
[13:21] Hi, thank you.
[13:22] Um I just barely heard about this. I
[13:25] keep
[13:26] pretty close eye on what's happening in
[13:28] our county. I've been on the
[13:31] uh town council here in Castle Valley
[13:32] for 18 years now.
[13:35] Um
[13:38] there is no
[13:40] uh I don't know. I don't think that you
[13:42] can fairly bring something
[13:45] to the agenda that's going to spend
[13:48] $500,000.
[13:50] Um let's break this down um
[13:53] because I am the treasurer out here.
[13:57] Uh if you look at the breakdown from what is the Forest
[14:03] Service to say the population of the US,
[14:06] $0.01 per person in the United States
[14:09] for this pilot program.
[14:11] The state of Utah, their portion would
[14:14] be $0.28 for every person in the state
[14:17] of Utah. Grand County, it would be $50
[14:21] per person.
[14:23] And I know this isn't coming out of our
[14:26] taxes, but the TRT is our taxes. The TRT
[14:30] goes to community
[14:33] and it should go to helping the
[14:36] community mitigate the trouble with
[14:40] tourism, not to encourage more tourism.
[14:44] It should be a mitigating tax.
[14:48] Um I'm not willing to give up 50 bucks
[14:51] that could go to the EMS. It could go to
[14:55] the law enforcement. It There are things
[14:58] that need to be fixed. Look go look at
[15:01] Old City Park. That's in Grand County.
[15:03] There's There's things that are way
[15:06] higher priority than trying to shuttle I
[15:09] don't know. What is the percentage of
[15:11] people that would willingly take a
[15:12] shuttle into Arches? The uninformed
[15:15] would take the shuttle. The informed
[15:17] would want to take their car because
[15:19] they would want to take a gallon of
[15:21] water per person
[15:23] in their trip, they would want to take
[15:25] food, probably a cooler, they would want
[15:28] to make sure that they have a first aid
[15:31] kit. I mean, I'm thinking about if I was
[15:33] to take a bus into Arches to enjoy my
[15:35] day,
[15:37] I couldn't carry everything that would
[15:40] be required for me to be safe. What
[15:42] you're going to do is you're going to
[15:44] get uninformed people taking too few
[15:46] little water, not having anywhere to be,
[15:49] being dropped off on trailheads,
[15:52] and then what? There's no cell service
[15:55] out there.
[15:56] I don't think you're really thinking
[15:59] this through. I have you know, what what
[16:01] does Grand County get after doing this?
[16:04] I can see where the state of Utah and
[16:06] the Forest Service would be you had
[16:08] Grand County give us $500,000
[16:11] for this pilot program. You know, I did
[16:14] not go into Arches for over 15 years,
[16:16] and I wrote to this commission at the
[16:19] very beginning when this first came up
[16:21] about the the timed entry.
[16:24] I did not go into Arches for 15 years
[16:26] because it was such a
[16:28] cluster.
[16:30] And after the timed entry, I actually in
[16:33] a year and a half went to Arches three
[16:35] times with my family, took other people.
[16:40] It worked.
[16:42] The timed entry system worked. It might
[16:44] not have worked
[16:46] completely, but it did work, and it cost
[16:49] pennies compared to what you're
[16:51] proposing now.
[16:53] Um I [clears throat] don't know. I'd like
[16:56] to say, "Brian, what are you getting out
[16:59] of this? And what is your
[17:02] motivation to mess with Arches?" Um I I just don't get it. I really
[17:10] Who Who are you to tell the National
[17:13] Park how to run itself or to even
[17:16] inflict your opinion on it in the world.
[17:18] >> want to take up all your time. Thank
[17:20] you.
[17:23] Okay. Emily, would you like to go?
[17:27] Yes, thank you. Um my comment
[17:31] Oh, sorry. I hope you can hear me. Um
[17:33] I'm Emily Campbell from Graham County.
[17:35] Um fund 23 and fund 26 in the budget are
[17:38] fully allocated. And um for us to pull
[17:41] any money against TRT revenue,
[17:44] mitigation, or promotional into this
[17:46] pilot will require us substituting out
[17:49] other things in our budget.
[17:51] And I think that that's a very dangerous
[17:54] precedent for us to set given the
[17:55] current state of things. I imagine that
[17:57] many of our budgets are going to be
[17:59] overdrawn this year just due to the cost
[18:01] of fuel. And I haven't seen that
[18:04] accounted for in this conversation, and
[18:07] that speaks to the lack of transparency
[18:09] and the lack of time to give
[18:11] well-reasoned citizen input about
[18:13] something that could very well have an
[18:14] impact on all of our bottom lines. I
[18:16] mean, the sheriff's office alone, I'm
[18:18] sure, is going to be looking at a much
[18:20] higher cost for fuel and and vehicle
[18:23] ownership costs, you know, as a result
[18:24] of the current state of things. And we
[18:26] don't see any reason for that high cost
[18:28] of fuel to abate anytime soon. I think
[18:29] that needs to be addressed very directly
[18:31] this evening if you do vote in favor of
[18:33] this. Um you know, I understand
[18:37] sometimes you have a windfall, and
[18:38] that's great. And if we do end up with a
[18:39] windfall this year, lucky us. And I
[18:41] think we should be very grateful for
[18:43] that. Um you know, there's a lot of
[18:45] stuff I want to do around my house and
[18:46] my property. Some might make my house
[18:48] more comfortable, more efficient. And we
[18:51] even have the money for some of those
[18:52] projects, but that doesn't mean we're
[18:53] going and spending that money
[18:55] immediately because we know that it's an
[18:56] uncertain time. We don't know what's
[18:58] going to happen to, you know, visitor
[19:01] spending as we see, you know, this AI
[19:04] bubble maybe on the verge of collapsing.
[19:06] Certainly, the cost of fuel will put
[19:07] pressure on things. It's wise to save
[19:10] when we can and to make well-reasoned
[19:12] decisions, and I think the lack of trans
[19:14] transparency and time here really does
[19:16] suggest that this is not well-reasoned
[19:18] or um I think it it potentially creates
[19:23] quite a bit of risk for us as taxpayers.
[19:25] Um and I'm I'm really disappointed that
[19:28] there wasn't more opportunity given for
[19:30] us to be informed about this decision
[19:33] that ultimately will come down to our
[19:35] tax dollars if it uh doesn't pan out.
[19:37] So, uh please be reasonable this
[19:40] evening, and um taking a little extra
[19:43] time and and doing this right doesn't
[19:45] mean a shuttle is a good or a bad idea.
[19:47] It may very well be a very good idea,
[19:49] but we should be smart about how we
[19:50] approach it. Thank you all.
[19:53] Thank you.
[19:54] Okay, back into the commission chambers.
[19:56] Who would like to speak?
[19:58] I'm Allison.
[20:05] I'm going to ask Bernie to hold up some
[20:07] of my charts, if that's okay.
[20:09] I'm Allison Stephen Van White. I also
[20:12] have hard copies of some of the
[20:13] materials I've sent to y'all. I'm going
[20:16] to hold this up.
[20:17] Um
[20:18] anytime an elected official Oh, I'm
[20:20] Allison Mathers. I'm a resident of Moab,
[20:23] Utah, and I actually lived in a national
[20:25] park with the shuttle system for 13
[20:27] years. So, I understand the pros and the
[20:29] cons, and I'm not saying I'm against the
[20:32] shuttle a shuttle system in the ideal
[20:34] for Arches National Park. What I am
[20:36] saying is that this
[20:38] there the math does not work for this
[20:40] shuttle proposal in any sort of way. And
[20:43] it's not about hard work, and I use that
[20:45] phrase because Brian Martinez had a
[20:47] piece in the Moab Times-Independent
[20:50] says, "Oh, we're doing the hard work."
[20:51] It is not about hard work. It is about
[20:54] good judgment.
[20:55] Anytime an elected official makes a
[20:57] decision, they have to
[20:59] operate in their fiduciary
[21:01] responsibility to their citizenry.
[21:03] Secondly, they need to weigh the
[21:05] decision based on facts, and they also
[21:07] need to weigh the decision based on
[21:11] something relative. In this case, timed
[21:13] entry is what the shuttle system
[21:16] is supposed to be
[21:18] replacing, so that's a very useful point
[21:21] of comparison. And Brian Martinez
[21:24] himself in his op-ed put four criteria
[21:28] on which to judge the shuttle system.
[21:30] One,
[21:31] affordability. Number two, whether or
[21:33] not it relieves congestion. Number
[21:35] three, whether it improves visitor
[21:38] experience. And number four, whether it
[21:40] improves the quality of life for locals.
[21:43] Number one, I'm going to start with
[21:44] relieving congestion. Well, we know that
[21:47] the timed entry program did that. It was
[21:49] specifically what it was designed to do
[21:51] by spreading out visitation through a
[21:53] larger part of the day. Will timed entry
[21:57] relieve congestion? Maybe is the best
[21:59] you can do it. At most, with two buses
[22:01] an hour at full capacity entering the
[22:04] park, and these are numbers I got from
[22:06] the the summary, which was very skimpy,
[22:08] you can transport a maximum of 390
[22:11] people per day into the park.
[22:14] Out of what? 50
[22:17] 3,000 uh
[22:18] On average, 55,379
[22:21] people per day in the months in question
[22:23] using 2025
[22:25] visitation stats. So, is it is it enough
[22:28] vehicles
[22:30] being taken off the road to reduce
[22:32] congestion? Probably not. Also taking
[22:34] into account one of the major
[22:36] contributions
[22:37] for congestion is the number of vehicles
[22:39] on the road at any given time. There is
[22:41] nothing in the shuttle system to
[22:43] disperse di-
[22:45] get people out on a wider slot of the
[22:47] day. Whether it improve visitor
[22:49] experience? Well, we know from survey
[22:51] data that the timed entry program did.
[22:54] Will the shuttle bus system do it? Maybe
[22:55] not. Survey data said that relieving
[22:58] congestion and reducing crowding improve
[23:00] visitor experience. The shuttle system
[23:02] will not reduce uh crowding. Quality of
[23:05] life for locals, that's completely
[23:06] subjective. I will answer the question
[23:08] for me. Shuttle system like a
[23:11] the timed entry system for me improve my
[23:14] quality of life because like Tory Hill,
[23:16] that meant I could go into the park
[23:17] during the season and enjoy myself.
[23:19] Number of visitors served per day,
[23:21] something else to keep in mind, up to
[23:23] 390 visitors per day.
[23:26] That's almost nothing. Very many, I
[23:28] couldn't find the number right off um
[23:31] there. Uh cost, very expensive, $3
[23:34] million.
[23:35] Uh uh
[23:37] The cost of timed entry is likely
[23:42] uh
[23:44] The shuttle is 17 times times 30 to 79
[23:48] times of what the timed entry uh
[23:50] administration. And per Grand County
[23:52] resident, I used 2025 July 1 ACS census
[23:56] data and I got calculated it out that
[23:58] $51.70
[24:00] 7 cents per resident for the shuttle
[24:02] system. How much did timed entry cost
[24:04] per resident? Zero.
[24:07] Thank you.
[24:10] Okay, do we have more in the audience
[24:12] that would like to speak?
[24:16] I don't know.
[24:22] Hi.
[24:23] I'm Emily Niehaus, I'm a Grand County
[24:26] resident. Um and the former mayor of
[24:29] Moab.
[24:30] And I want to thank you for your
[24:32] service.
[24:34] Um I'm going to look at my notes.
[24:37] I'm not asking you to vote
[24:39] no.
[24:41] I'm asking you to table this item
[24:43] tonight because there's a lot of
[24:46] discussion to still be had about this
[24:48] spending of $500,000.
[24:52] Um
[24:55] I
[24:57] have always been a fan of the timed
[24:59] entry system.
[25:01] And when I was looking at the items for
[25:02] this agenda topic, that 2012 study
[25:06] reminded me why. So, if you look in the
[25:09] actual
[25:10] 2012,
[25:12] you know, agenda item,
[25:14] it lists, you know, consideration for
[25:16] shuttle
[25:18] and then consideration for timed entry
[25:20] system. Shuttle's expensive. Timed entry
[25:24] was like in 2015 going to cost $4,000.
[25:29] And so, I think the reason I've always
[25:31] been in favor of timed entry, as all of
[25:35] you know, cuz I've called you about it,
[25:37] is that it's the um
[25:40] less expensive solution for congestion
[25:43] mitigation.
[25:44] It feels like there's been this
[25:47] false narrative that if you couldn't get
[25:50] a timed entry, you couldn't enter the
[25:52] park.
[25:54] And I think that was not fair to
[25:56] visitors
[25:58] for us to be saying that because
[26:00] you just with this with the timed entry
[26:03] system that we had, you didn't have your
[26:05] preferred time entry. You could go
[26:08] before 7:00 a.m.
[26:10] You could go before or before or you
[26:12] could go after 4:00 p.m.
[26:16] And the Park Service really did do a
[26:18] good job in listening to our concerns
[26:20] and scaling back that timed entry
[26:22] system, so it wasn't all the time,
[26:26] as we know.
[26:28] Now, I know this item isn't about timed
[26:30] entry, but I know that it is about
[26:32] spending half a million dollars
[26:35] um on a shuttle system that I don't
[26:37] think really, as all the information's
[26:40] coming out, really mitigates the
[26:43] congestion that I think we're hoping
[26:45] that it does.
[26:46] Finally, you're about to approve half a [snorts] dollars that's going to
[26:51] compete with private sector, and that's
[26:53] not right. So, it's not just spending
[26:56] half a million dollars of TRT money.
[26:59] It's competing with private sector.
[27:02] The the businesses that have seaways,
[27:06] that have coaches,
[27:07] are going to be negatively impacted by
[27:09] government, and I know that's not what
[27:12] any of us want to do.
[27:14] So, we got to think about it.
[27:16] We could still potentially spend this
[27:18] money. We could still potentially have a
[27:21] really creative,
[27:22] locally built shuttle service,
[27:26] where we're buying coaches one time,
[27:28] like the Star Grant, but different.
[27:31] Where we're buying coaches for local
[27:33] businesses.
[27:35] I really think that that's the way to
[27:36] spend the money, local asset building.
[27:39] Thank you.
[27:43] Okay, and I think I saw a hand over
[27:45] here.
[27:47] She was in front of you, Michael. Well,
[27:49] I don't know. Okay.
[27:50] Sorry.
[27:50] >> [laughter]
[27:50] >> That is fine. Oh.
[27:56] Hello. I'm Michael Peck from Castle
[27:59] Valley.
[28:00] And I think one of the things that I
[28:02] noticed as not being addressed because
[28:04] most people never do it, and that's have
[28:07] you ever driven a shuttle? I have.
[28:10] And
[28:12] not everybody needs to go to the
[28:13] bathroom at the same time.
[28:15] And then in the park, there's very, very
[28:18] few bathrooms. And if you have a whole
[28:20] bunch of kids and a whole bunch of
[28:22] people on a bus,
[28:24] and you want to drop them off at a
[28:25] trailhead where there's no bathroom,
[28:27] with no alternatives to get in a car and
[28:29] go somewhere, you need to think about
[28:32] this. You're spending $500,000
[28:35] to put people in a confinement and
[28:38] shuttle them up this thing and drop them
[28:40] off at a trailhead. They may not have
[28:41] enough water for the walk up.
[28:44] It's a It's a really dumb idea. And you
[28:46] want to consider it a little deeper.
[28:48] Thank you.
[28:51] Okay, and then Michael list seems to
[28:53] come.
[28:59] Hi, my name is Michael list. I'm a local
[29:01] citizen and I've actually been involved
[29:04] um
[29:05] coming up with um
[29:07] advocating for solutions to Arches
[29:09] for like 11 years. But I want to talk
[29:11] about something else today because
[29:13] there's a lot of talk about how we
[29:15] haven't thought about this. I was the
[29:17] chair of the Moab Transit Authority ad
[29:20] hoc study committee formed by this
[29:22] council. And we studied all of these
[29:25] things. We did extensive studies on the
[29:28] Arches shuttle. We did extensive studies
[29:30] on the shuttle in town. We did studies
[29:33] on bike usage in town and how to make it
[29:36] more effective in town and to Arches.
[29:39] And um
[29:41] I just like to go through that because
[29:42] the math that we have right now that
[29:44] wouldn't exist without it. We did all
[29:46] the work and then when our work was
[29:48] done, I have to hand it to Karen Guzman
[29:50] because she got it over the finish line.
[29:52] So I don't think she gets enough credit
[29:54] for that math system because she did an
[29:57] amazing job with that once our committee
[29:59] stopped working.
[30:01] And then we had um bike paths and we
[30:03] wanted to get the bikes into Arches
[30:06] and the safest way is to go to Willow
[30:08] Springs and go in because it's not safe
[30:11] to go up that main road. And after the
[30:13] committee finished I personally went to
[30:16] Salt Lake to legislature and I
[30:18] campaigned on it I guess lobbied and I
[30:21] got us the money for that. So that was
[30:23] amazing. So then with this shuttle first
[30:26] the Park Service in 2012 did an
[30:29] extensive study all the way down to the
[30:31] street furniture and how it would work.
[30:33] Our committee did an extensive study
[30:36] which we gave you and you have and Mary
[30:38] McGann thank you because she was our
[30:41] um council liaison. So I think it's
[30:44] important for the audience to understand
[30:46] that even though it didn't happen
[30:47] yesterday or a week ago, this has been
[30:50] on the table for years, decades, and
[30:53] it's been studied extensively.
[30:56] And I actually have to hand it to you
[30:57] because
[30:59] action never happens in government, it's
[31:01] very rare. I mean, we know that timed
[31:03] entry was just a way to stop tourism and
[31:05] it was very effective. Well, now you're
[31:07] trying to take action to try and come up
[31:10] with with a real solution and I just
[31:12] want to thank you guys and thank the
[31:14] Park Service for putting money in and
[31:16] UDOT. And it's important to remind
[31:19] everyone that this council, in the form
[31:22] of the Moab Transit Authority Study
[31:24] Committee, actually in the past has
[31:26] researched this extensively. So, thanks
[31:28] for your work, Jeff.
[31:30] Thank you.
[31:32] All right.
[31:38] Hi, my name is Bruny Mason. I'm a
[31:40] citizen and I'm a voter of this county.
[31:44] And my quality of life is being
[31:46] diminished
[31:47] by the minute here.
[31:49] I've been coming to these meetings now
[31:51] for a few weeks and the circus that's
[31:54] happening here
[31:56] is outraging me.
[32:00] I'm not a numbers person,
[32:02] but I don't want to listen to people say
[32:04] timed entry diminished tourism. That is
[32:08] just a incentives. It's not
[32:11] true. If you've used it, you know it's
[32:14] not true.
[32:15] I'm getting angrier and angrier about
[32:18] this whole process. And then, I feel
[32:21] grubby little hands in my pockets
[32:24] looking for $500,000.
[32:27] Here's my wallet. I don't have $5 in
[32:29] there. I don't want you guys to take
[32:32] more of my money. And I don't want you
[32:35] guys to run the Park Service. It's being
[32:37] run already with my tax money.
[32:41] It's none of your business. I didn't
[32:43] vote you in
[32:44] to run the park.
[32:46] I voted you in to take care of me and
[32:50] other citizens in this city and county.
[32:54] Leave the park service to the park
[32:57] people.
[32:59] If you need a job, go apply for that. But they're not
[33:04] hiring right now.
[33:05] Then go get another job.
[33:08] But this is not working. This is really
[33:10] not working. Do you have any seconds
[33:12] left? I don't care.
[33:13] So, I mean, I'm just a general person.
[33:17] There are people out there like me.
[33:19] And most of them will not come here
[33:21] because they think you are some
[33:22] important people. You are our people. I
[33:26] we voted you in here to do what we want,
[33:29] not what you want.
[33:31] When our biggest hotel in town is at
[33:34] capacity, 95% almost every night, what
[33:38] problems do we have with our tourists?
[33:41] They're not being diminished. They're
[33:42] not
[33:43] being sent away. They're here. And
[33:46] they're spending a lot of money already.
[33:49] We don't need to throw another $3
[33:51] million at them to bring more people
[33:54] here and more money. We have enough
[33:56] tourists. We need to also take care You
[33:58] guys have to take care of our citizens
[34:01] here.
[34:03] And leave the tourists to themselves.
[34:05] They're coming.
[34:06] And we don't know how much longer with
[34:09] the other government that's going on,
[34:11] but they're here now.
[34:13] And they were happy. And now they're a
[34:15] little less happy, just like the
[34:16] citizens that live in this town. Thank
[34:19] you.
[34:22] Come on up.
[34:28] Hi, my name is Sandy Carey. I am a
[34:30] resident of Graham County. Um two two
[34:34] things that I just wanted to point out.
[34:35] I was not aware that this was on the
[34:38] agenda and boy, you guys are getting
[34:40] beat up. But anyway, uh
[34:43] the thing is is there's what
[34:45] 9 10 9 uh 10,000 people in Grand County
[34:48] and about 5 a little under in in Moab.
[34:51] Um
[34:52] basically, there's 100 kids that
[34:54] graduate every year from high school.
[34:56] There's 12 grades. It's 1,200 people not
[35:00] putting money [clears throat] in towards
[35:01] this project. At least. So, the
[35:04] responsibility is going on the parents
[35:06] or single people. So, that's one thing
[35:09] that I just wanted you to be aware of.
[35:11] And the second thing is um
[35:15] Arches is making their problem our
[35:16] problem.
[35:17] And uh
[35:19] you know, they could have more parking
[35:21] lots and they could have more, you know,
[35:22] they don't want to disturb the soil.
[35:24] Well,
[35:25] if you're attracting worldwide visitors,
[35:28] then you need to create facilities for
[35:30] it. And they're not putting a dime.
[35:32] They're making their problem our
[35:33] problem. Not putting a dime in towards
[35:35] expanding the parking. I mean, they've
[35:37] done it here and there, but it's the new
[35:40] thing and so they need to really
[35:43] um pay a little bit more attention and
[35:44] allocate a little bit more money. As I
[35:47] remember from people that I have been
[35:49] friends with with the Park Service, they
[35:51] always have to do a 5-year study just to
[35:53] make sure that the Park Service is
[35:55] spending money in the correct places and
[35:57] that they don't fall into
[35:59] um
[36:00] liability and and whatever. So,
[36:03] that's maybe
[36:05] you know, their the reason that they're
[36:07] looking for us for help. I don't really
[36:09] know. Anyway,
[36:10] I wasn't expecting this to
[36:13] explode like this, but nice to have
[36:15] people's opinion.
[36:17] Thank you.
[36:19] Oh, come on, Tim.
[36:29] Well, my name is Jim Webster and uh
[36:33] like Diane, I
[36:35] spent half of my career and uh many, many years living in Arches
[36:40] National Park.
[36:41] In the '90s all the way through the '90s
[36:43] and the first half of the 2000s.
[36:47] Um
[36:48] and
[36:49] since I retired quite a few years ago, I
[36:52] have
[36:53] just been watching as an observer and
[36:56] bystander what's going on at Arches.
[36:59] Very much a supporter of the uh timed
[37:02] entry. I saw it work well. I don't think
[37:05] it had anything to do with
[37:08] uh
[37:09] you know,
[37:10] hurting the community or hurting the
[37:13] visitor. I think it was a really a
[37:15] plus. But, I didn't come here tonight to
[37:17] speak at all.
[37:19] But, I
[37:21] think my advice to the commission is to
[37:23] slow
[37:25] down.
[37:26] Uh people are scrambling to understand
[37:30] what this project is all about because
[37:32] there has been
[37:33] >> [gasps]
[37:34] >> uh some of you've been involved in it,
[37:38] some for quite a while, but uh the
[37:41] community hasn't been following this at
[37:43] all. I just spent part of the day today
[37:46] looking at the 2014 feasibility study.
[37:50] That seems to have a lot of
[37:53] and that was a thoughtful process
[37:56] uh
[37:56] that involved a lot of people and
[37:58] professionals, professional
[37:59] transportation people and park service
[38:02] people. So, they um
[38:05] it seems like some of the ideas that
[38:07] have come for your for your this thing
[38:09] you've put together, Brian,
[38:11] came from that study. Is that correct?
[38:14] Yeah. Okay.
[38:16] That
[38:18] uh
[38:18] was well done. But, what I am seeing
[38:21] here is a considerable lack of
[38:23] transparency in terms of moving this
[38:25] forward
[38:26] with the community particularly. I am
[38:30] baffled by the procurement process that
[38:33] the Park Service
[38:35] has
[38:36] all of a sudden come up with a million
[38:38] and a half dollars for this project.
[38:42] I
[38:43] am
[38:43] >> [clears throat]
[38:44] >> baffled about how the county can
[38:46] proceed with this unplanned budget item.
[38:53] And
[38:55] the So, the procurement process
[38:58] seems like it's broken in this case.
[39:01] The last thing that I have really noted
[39:04] is that I have not heard or seen
[39:07] the National Park Service representation
[39:12] here in any of these commission
[39:14] meetings, but I haven't been to a lot of
[39:16] them.
[39:17] And I haven't heard or seen public or
[39:21] press releases from the superintendent,
[39:23] for example, or the regional director.
[39:25] Any support from that. I read that we're
[39:29] working with
[39:31] the Park Service, and I see the
[39:33] superintendent's name dropped
[39:35] frequently. But I haven't seen that,
[39:38] and I haven't talked to her about this
[39:39] at all. So, I have no idea.
[39:42] So, I think my advice again
[39:45] is to slow this thing down.
[39:48] Engage the community
[39:50] more, and uh be more transparent. Thank
[39:53] you.
[39:57] Okay, anybody else?
[40:05] I am Mary O'Brien with uh Grand County
[40:09] citizen. Uh I have sent
[40:12] some detailed comments about the
[40:15] financial lack of transparency, and I
[40:18] did mention that for instance the 1.5
[40:21] million coming from a Centennial
[40:23] challenge.
[40:25] I don't know whether it was already in
[40:28] the budget this last year but Trump is
[40:31] um
[40:32] in his the White House budget is zeroing
[40:34] out that for 2027. So I don't know.
[40:37] Again, there's like been no transparency
[40:40] about whether this has already been
[40:41] gotten how did it if so how did you get
[40:44] it when did it get it how was prior to
[40:47] priorities and so on.
[40:49] Um so I agree there's not been
[40:52] transparency and slow this thing down.
[40:55] But as I thought about it I thought you
[40:58] know
[40:59] the arches
[41:01] um shuttle planning of 25 2026 is kind
[41:05] of the epitome of what I would call the
[41:08] ballroom planning system.
[41:11] Someone say a president
[41:14] or a tech billionaire
[41:17] or a county commissioner
[41:19] has a plan and runs with it.
[41:22] This someone designs the whole thing
[41:25] and presents it with little advanced
[41:28] warning.
[41:29] Is it needed?
[41:31] Well, that's not the point.
[41:34] Is it met with objections from many? No
[41:38] time to deal with objections or data.
[41:41] The plan is just too good as it is.
[41:45] it sustainable?
[41:47] There's no tomorrow so that's
[41:49] irrelevant.
[41:51] Is it over the budget? Don't worry we've
[41:54] been making cuts elsewhere.
[41:57] Like to staff.
[42:00] Is it collaborative?
[42:02] Not with the public.
[42:04] Yeah, let's put this down for a while
[42:07] and start being responsible financially
[42:11] and start being transparent and start
[42:13] being collaborative with the forest the
[42:16] park service. You right now it's a
[42:18] non-consensual collaboration.
[42:24] Okay, anyone else?
[42:27] Okay, come on up.
[42:36] My name is Laura Cameron and I'm a Grand
[42:38] County resident. I've been here for a
[42:41] very long time, lived here full-time,
[42:44] and I do try to keep track of what's
[42:46] going on
[42:48] with our county and with our
[42:51] situations.
[42:52] And this whole council ever since it was
[42:56] formed and started, it's just seemed
[42:59] like suddenly there was this disconnect,
[43:02] this lack of transparency,
[43:04] and I never felt that way
[43:07] for the
[43:08] past 20 years.
[43:10] But, um,
[43:11] and there are so many people here that
[43:13] have so much more good professional
[43:17] information
[43:18] about the situation, and I appreciate
[43:21] them standing up here and talking to you
[43:24] about it.
[43:25] >> [clears throat]
[43:26] >> I
[43:28] First time I ever went to Zion Park, I
[43:30] was about 6 years old, and that was a
[43:33] long time ago. And I've seen the
[43:35] National Parks change a lot. And I
[43:38] remember when they started implementing
[43:41] the shuttle system for Zion,
[43:44] and I was trying to
[43:46] There is no comparison about what
[43:49] how that works and Brian Martinez's
[43:53] proposal
[43:54] about the shuttle system for Arches. It
[43:57] just seems so unworkable, so
[44:00] unrealistic, so many problems.
[44:04] So, it was my understanding there's only
[44:07] one shuttle in Zion and it
[44:10] [clears throat] goes from Springdale
[44:12] up up to into the canyon into Zion
[44:16] Canyon. That's the only place it goes.
[44:19] My understanding is in the rest of the
[44:21] park people go separately. So I just
[44:27] I was really curious so I called
[44:30] today Washington County Treasurer.
[44:34] And I the person I spoke to I asked them
[44:40] if if Washington County TRT
[44:44] tax money
[44:46] if any of that money went to supporting
[44:48] the shuttle
[44:50] in the park.
[44:51] And she said, "No, absolutely no."
[44:55] So why should we
[44:58] have this kind of a tax burden on our
[45:01] citizens?
[45:03] I just don't think it's appropriate at
[45:06] all.
[45:07] I really don't. So
[45:09] please reconsider.
[45:13] Thank you.
[45:15] Okay, do we have anyone else in the
[45:16] audience that would like to speak?
[45:19] No. Okay. Okay.
[45:22] Come on.
[45:25] » [clears throat]
[45:26] >> My name's Jerry Chew. I'm from town.
[45:29] And I realize sitting here maybe only
[45:33] here that uh
[45:35] I just have one simple hope
[45:37] coming into this.
[45:40] That in the face of all this
[45:43] concern
[45:45] uh
[45:46] ill conception of the whole thing
[45:49] uh
[45:51] in the face of all [clears throat] that we don't find another four-person
[45:56] block vote for something that is so
[45:59] ill-considered.
[46:02] It's becoming so predictable and
[46:04] [clears throat]
[46:05] I would think
[46:07] with four individuals
[46:10] they could sort this out separately and
[46:12] not vote as a block, which is starting to look suspicious. It's
[46:17] uncomfortable.
[46:21] Okay. Anybody else? I have one more on
[46:23] the phone. One more online. Do you have
[46:25] someone online that would like to speak?
[46:27] If you are, then take your
[46:29] um
[46:30] mute off and go ahead and start
[46:31] speaking.
[46:35] What's your name?
[46:36] I don't see him in there yet.
[46:38] >> [clears throat]
[46:41] » Okay.
[46:42] Um
[46:44] Okay. Come on up.
[46:45] >> [clears throat]
[46:50] » Hi. I'm Avery Holdenbrand, um resident,
[46:53] Spanish Valley.
[46:55] Um yeah, I'm against approving $500,000
[46:59] tonight. I suggest you guys table that,
[47:01] get some more input from people,
[47:03] understand the effect a little bit
[47:04] better.
[47:05] Um
[47:06] that's a lot of money and we could
[47:09] repair some roads with that instead. So,
[47:11] might be a better use of it.
[47:16] Okay. And let it Does Lynn get on the
[47:17] line? Lynn, do you have comment?
[47:27] Lynn? He's coming.
[47:31] Anybody else in the audience while we're
[47:33] waiting on our last online speaker? You
[47:36] guys all good? Okay.
[47:38] See if he shows up.
[47:42] » [clears throat]
[47:45] » No? But is he on there? Who's that?
[47:47] Yeah. Oh.
[47:52] Lynn, can you hear us? Are you here for
[47:53] public comment?
[47:58] Lynn, can you hear us? We're at the end
[48:00] of the session so we heard so we're just
[48:01] trying to wrap up.
[48:05] Okay, well then we're going to have
[48:06] another one at 6:00. So we're going to
[48:08] just go to 6:00.
[48:10] And I think we have our elected so we're
[48:11] going to move along to our elected
[48:14] officials report as needed and I think
[48:15] we have Jameson online and so he would
[48:17] like to speak.
[48:19] Jameson, if you're there.
[48:23] Yeah, I feel just be able to let me
[48:25] share my screen with you.
[48:28] Done.
[48:29] >> [clears throat]
[48:47] » Did you guys see that?
[48:49] Yeah. Yes, sir.
[48:52] So I'll be real quick. This is a first
[48:54] donation that we had. This was from
[48:56] Intrepid Potash. They donated $6,000 to
[48:59] our search and rescue team.
[49:02] And then this photo is from over the
[49:04] weekend.
[49:06] This is from the C10 car show. Uh just
[49:09] real quick, in April of 2005
[49:12] Chase was rescued by our search and
[49:14] rescue team. He was camping where he
[49:16] fell 60 ft down a cliff. Um
[49:19] SAR performed a rescue to get to him
[49:22] and provided medical attention.
[49:24] Fast forward to today, Chase is giving
[49:26] back in an incredible way through the
[49:28] C10 Red Rock Retreat car show. Chase,
[49:31] the event vendors, and another generous
[49:33] donor who was rescued about 2 years ago
[49:36] raised an amazing total of $71,564
[49:40] to our search and rescue team. Last
[49:43] year's uh donation, they donated
[49:45] $15,002.
[49:48] Um and so we we can't thank Chase
[49:50] enough. Donations like this help offset
[49:53] our general budget. We send staff to
[49:56] specialized training. We we special we
[49:59] make
[50:00] purchases for specialized equipment with
[50:02] this kind of money.
[50:03] And so
[50:05] we are really grateful that they
[50:07] continue to keep coming and supporting
[50:08] our economy. They stay in our hotels.
[50:11] They buy food in our community.
[50:13] Um and so I just wanted to do a quick
[50:15] report on that. He's an amazing person
[50:16] and it's his way of giving back.
[50:20] That's all I've got.
[50:28] Thanks to those awesome donors, too.
[50:31] Appreciate it. And I appreciate all the
[50:33] time they spent there. It was great
[50:34] event last weekend. Steve has his hand
[50:37] up.
[50:39] Stephen Stocks, he's also elected
[50:46] Can you hear me okay?
[50:47] Yes.
[50:49] Um just want to give a brief brief
[50:50] update. I'm at the the convention for
[50:52] crimes against women.
[50:54] Um this is the ICCR convention I've been
[50:57] speaking about a few different times in
[50:58] the past. Um this is brought to us um
[51:02] by Detective Robert Sterry with the Mont
[51:05] Police Department. Um they flew four of
[51:07] us out here to be able to get training.
[51:10] Um it's an awesome convention. We talk a
[51:12] lot about some of the different types of
[51:15] abuse that's happening
[51:17] throughout the US and domestic violence
[51:19] especially. Just going to give some
[51:20] information because we've got a larger
[51:22] audience. I like to give information out
[51:23] that can impact and help others.
[51:26] Uh today is the first day that take it
[51:28] down
[51:29] um legislation that was passed unanimous
[51:31] bipartisan effort. Um a lot of people
[51:33] refer to it as revenge porn.
[51:35] Um
[51:36] but it's images that are shared and
[51:38] distributed without the consent of the
[51:40] individual that's being recorded. And
[51:42] that legislation went into effect. It
[51:44] was signed last year and went into
[51:46] effect today. Utah also signed a measure
[51:49] as well that requires individuals
[51:52] and third-party websites to be required
[51:55] to remove down that content.
[51:58] Additionally, there's some emerging
[52:00] trends with AI and use of AI and
[52:02] creation of that those images as well,
[52:05] which is terrifying.
[52:07] Additionally, we're looking at patterns
[52:10] of domestic violence and how to support
[52:11] individuals
[52:12] especially on strangulation individuals
[52:14] that are strangled by their intimate
[52:18] partner abuser are 700 times more likely
[52:22] to die. And so this conference gives us
[52:25] additional resources, tools, information
[52:27] to be able to support people in the
[52:29] community
[52:30] that face domestic violence issues and
[52:32] to have more resources here. So it's
[52:34] wonderful conference. I'll give a fuller
[52:35] presentation when I get back and just
[52:38] want to give you guys that tidbit to
[52:39] start.
[52:42] Thanks, Stephen.
[52:44] Okay.
[52:45] So now we will move into our general
[52:47] business action items discussion and
[52:50] consideration of approvals. So number
[52:51] one is a commission member disclosures
[52:53] and future considerations.
[52:55] As for usual, my wife works for the
[52:56] sheriff's department. Okay.
[52:59] And Go ahead. You need a microphone.
[53:03] It's mine.
[53:04] Number two,
[53:05] uh future consideration.
[53:07] Uh
[53:08] we're going to
[53:09] go into we spoke this morning
[53:12] me and Chair McCanliss.
[53:14] Mark Steiner, we're going to go into
[53:16] uh looking at
[53:19] some
[53:20] hourly needs, some time needs, some
[53:22] staffing needs out of our O'Leary Arena.
[53:25] Uh it is a subject that has
[53:27] come up as of late, but
[53:31] it is being looked at
[53:35] by all staff levels to commission etc.
[53:38] but we are taking care of the problem. We want a facility
[53:42] uh that is usable by all
[53:45] as often as possible of our constituents
[53:47] who actually paid for this facility. So,
[53:50] we will be I would like in future
[53:52] considerations us
[53:54] devoting admin or staff time
[53:58] to OSTA
[54:00] to figure out a little more in depth of
[54:02] that staffing needs, some time needs,
[54:04] etc. Scheduling needs.
[54:07] But, I'd like that sooner than later to
[54:09] help [clears throat] with current
[54:10] We stacked them with current minutes, so
[54:12] they need to help now. We need to take a
[54:14] look at that as a commission.
[54:17] Okay. Any other
[54:19] disclosures of future considerations?
[54:24] No? Okay.
[54:25] We will move on to our approval of the
[54:27] consent agenda items. Commissioner
[54:29] Watko?
[54:30] Yes, I would like to remove item F,
[54:34] G, and H.
[54:37] F and G are still with Luso, and not
[54:40] ready for
[54:43] be approved, and H I believe that we
[54:45] need to do a vote on separately, and
[54:48] then
[54:49] it could be ratified at a future
[54:51] meeting.
[54:54] Okay. So, we'll add H
[54:57] on to just how about the end of our
[54:59] agenda this evening for November 13th.
[55:02] So,
[55:03] okay.
[55:05] And those are part of the county
[55:06] attorney's reports.
[55:09] Oh, we'll make an approval of H. We'll
[55:12] talk about H at the end of the meeting.
[55:15] So, with that, I will do the approval of
[55:19] the meeting minutes from May 5th, 2026,
[55:22] ratification of the payment of bills.
[55:25] Total bills is $955,255.51.
[55:30] Total payroll $166,980.03.
[55:36] Total bills and payrolls are $1,122.
[55:40] 200
[55:41] Sorry, 1 million 122,238,054
[55:46] cents.
[55:47] Ratification of the contract with Pivot
[55:49] Cycles to loan e-bikes to G cap for
[55:52] trail maintenance.
[55:54] Ratification of indigent defense council
[55:57] grant application.
[55:59] Approval of contingency expense for GC
[56:02] star.
[56:04] And we do move that and change
[56:07] the agenda.
[56:08] And I is the law of office of tourism
[56:11] participation in Utah office of tourism
[56:14] fiscal year 2027 international opt-in
[56:17] marketing program.
[56:21] Mike.
[56:22] So moved.
[56:23] Thank you.
[56:25] All in favor?
[56:29] Mary.
[56:30] I, yes.
[56:32] Okay.
[56:33] I pass with 7-0.
[56:36] And now we move on to number three is
[56:38] the local match for ordinary desert
[56:40] transportation initiative and this is
[56:42] Commissioner Martinez.
[56:46] Thank you.
[56:48] >> [clears throat]
[56:48] >> Um
[56:49] I'll go ahead and get started off on
[56:50] this real quick. Um Grand County, the
[56:53] National Park Service and the state of
[56:54] Utah have been working together to
[56:56] address the long-standing transportation
[56:58] challenges at Arches National Park
[57:00] and case forward along US 191 through
[57:03] corridor through the Moab corridor.
[57:05] This item considers the county's
[57:07] contribution in a three-partner funding
[57:09] plan for a 2026-2027
[57:11] shuttle plan.
[57:13] With a total budget of up to 3 million
[57:15] dollars of which is follows.
[57:17] The National Park Service will have 1.5
[57:19] million dollars of Centennial funding.
[57:22] That Centennial funding is good for
[57:24] fiscal year 2026.
[57:26] So we do not have it for 2027.
[57:29] The state of Utah I went up on Friday,
[57:32] um to speak in favor of UDot um awarding
[57:36] uh $1 million to this project um under
[57:39] the uh hotspot recreation hotspot
[57:41] program.
[57:42] And in that capital staff, Grand County
[57:45] would be responsible for $500,000 of
[57:48] that match right there.
[57:51] I also have a little bit of a statement
[57:52] I'd like to read.
[57:53] So,
[57:55] this is a big milestone for Grand County
[57:57] and everyone who cares about our economy
[58:00] and Arches National Park.
[58:02] A core component of the access and
[58:03] capacity enhancement alternative was the
[58:06] show by investing in infrastructure we
[58:09] can expand capacity, protect public
[58:11] lands, and keep the gate open.
[58:14] Arches does not have a people problem,
[58:16] it has a vehicle problem.
[58:18] According to National Park surveys,
[58:20] nothing would improve the visitor
[58:22] experience more than a voluntary
[58:24] shuttle.
[58:25] Shuttles have worked for decades at many
[58:27] National Parks.
[58:29] We have seen the results when we
[58:31] restrict access.
[58:33] Kem C. Gardner report estimated timed
[58:35] entry reduced visitors by 170,000.
[58:40] Every dollar of economic activity
[58:42] protected by this system is a dollar
[58:44] that funds Grand County families and
[58:47] raising without raising property taxes.
[58:50] Department of the Interior,
[58:52] UDot have stepped up and Grand County
[58:55] has a responsibility to meet that
[58:57] investment in in the infrastructure of
[59:00] our economy.
[59:01] The 2024 EIS by the NPS stated,
[59:05] "Currently, there are no reasonably
[59:07] seeable viable options for partnering
[59:10] with partnering with the community.
[59:13] However, the NPS remains open to
[59:15] proposals operate a shuttle system in
[59:18] the park."
[59:20] Conclusions from the feasibility study
[59:22] in 2012,
[59:24] "Overall, the shuttle would have a
[59:26] long-term beneficial impact on park
[59:29] visitors. Those impacts would not be
[59:31] limited to those on shuttle
[59:33] but to those who would benefit from
[59:35] fewer cars on the road and more
[59:37] available parking spaces.
[59:39] Overall, most park resources would
[59:42] experience long-term beneficial impacts
[59:46] from the reduction in the number of
[59:47] private vehicles traveling in Arches.
[59:51] The shuttle meets climate Arches climate friendly goal to reduce overall
[59:58] emissions from private vehicles within
[1:00:00] the park by diverting visitors to the
[1:00:02] shuttle during the pilot project.
[1:00:06] We are investing in our economic
[1:00:07] infrastructure infrastructure and just
[1:00:10] like advertising, it will pay dividends.
[1:00:13] Over 80% of Grand County's economy
[1:00:16] depends on tourism and nearly 70% of our
[1:00:19] local jobs are tied directly to park
[1:00:22] visitation.
[1:00:24] The National Park cannot solve for both
[1:00:26] economic and congestion challenges on
[1:00:29] their own.
[1:00:30] As a gateway community, we have to pull
[1:00:32] up a seat to the table and actively
[1:00:34] manage our future.
[1:00:37] It's taken us over a decade to get to
[1:00:39] this point and a shuttle to Arches
[1:00:42] National Park will benefit the people of
[1:00:44] Grand County for decades to come.
[1:00:47] I'm very proud of the collaboration from
[1:00:50] all the agencies that have helped step
[1:00:52] up and I'm proud of everyone who has
[1:00:55] invested time, money
[1:00:58] to make this happen and I'll open it up
[1:00:59] for questions.
[1:01:01] Hey Jack. Uh first off, I I just
[1:01:03] actually want to ask our attorney a
[1:01:05] question. It says legal review is not
[1:01:06] applicable on this, which
[1:01:09] is crazy to me. So, I would ask I'd ask
[1:01:11] Stephen if if that's truly the case.
[1:01:14] So, we're
[1:01:15] my office doesn't take a stance on on
[1:01:17] any of the items. I would like to review
[1:01:19] any contracts, especially contracts of
[1:01:21] this magnitude. To Commissioner
[1:01:23] Martinez's credit, he did give this to
[1:01:24] me roughly 11 days ago. I haven't had
[1:01:28] the opportunity to review this with a
[1:01:29] fine-tooth comb.
[1:01:31] Um it is a larger contract. I think it's
[1:01:33] 37 pages. I would need additional time
[1:01:35] and probably some follow-up. Um again,
[1:01:38] Commissioner Martinez did reach out. I
[1:01:40] did not get to connect with him on a
[1:01:41] call. And so, um my apologies for that.
[1:01:44] I've been out on trainings, but um it
[1:01:47] would need to be reviewed. I would I
[1:01:48] would hope the commission would uh would
[1:01:50] allow me that opportunity to review it
[1:01:52] because it's going to be a substantial
[1:01:53] contract with substantial terms.
[1:01:57] Go ahead, Frank.
[1:01:59] Yeah, Jack, like I explained to you when
[1:02:00] we had that call, right now we're not at
[1:02:03] the point of setting the contract.
[1:02:04] That's why it was irrelevant to what we
[1:02:06] were talking about. What we're looking
[1:02:07] for right now is the ability to go into
[1:02:10] a contract. We were trying to figure out
[1:02:12] two things um at the beginning of our
[1:02:14] working. First is is how we would have
[1:02:16] an arrangement with the National Park to
[1:02:19] provide a service.
[1:02:20] Um that arrangement will be the
[1:02:22] cooperative management.
[1:02:25] Funding source, the Centennial funding
[1:02:27] source, is also going to serve as that
[1:02:29] vehicle. So, the only way that we can go
[1:02:31] ahead and get the scope of work set up
[1:02:34] is if we actually have the matching
[1:02:35] funds to go up to the table.
[1:02:38] That's where UDOT has stepped up and
[1:02:40] Grant County will step up. Once we have
[1:02:42] a cooperative management agreement in
[1:02:44] place, we'll of course bring that back
[1:02:46] to the commission. We'll have time for
[1:02:48] council to review that, and we'll take
[1:02:50] comment on that actual the specifics of
[1:02:53] the agreement at that point. And that'll
[1:02:55] come back to the commission then?
[1:02:56] Correct. Yeah.
[1:02:59] I I would I'll speak to this because
[1:03:01] I've been on that um committee. Not only
[1:03:03] have I been on the subcommittee, but I
[1:03:05] was the one that um
[1:03:07] Superintendent Pace, and she's online, I
[1:03:09] believe, so if we have any questions for
[1:03:11] her, she online? She's going to be.
[1:03:14] Okay, I can't see.
[1:03:16] The little tile up there.
[1:03:18] >> Okay, thank you. Um, so she was
[1:03:20] officially she reached out to us the day
[1:03:23] after the reservation system um was
[1:03:26] taken away by the by the federal
[1:03:28] government and asked you know if we had
[1:03:29] ideas for this shuttle system and how
[1:03:31] that would work and she was quick to be able to go back
[1:03:35] and get a 1.5 million dollars to help
[1:03:37] with this. And so from there that was
[1:03:39] half the money working with the Via. Via
[1:03:41] is not the selected person. They just
[1:03:45] were very helpful in giving numbers and
[1:03:48] information to get to that approximately
[1:03:50] 3 million dollar mark. And then when the
[1:03:53] U dot was able to put in that hot spot
[1:03:56] funding um that left a shortfall of
[1:03:58] 500,000 dollars and that's where the
[1:04:00] commission comes into play.
[1:04:03] And I think when we look at um
[1:04:05] the Gardner report, the the purpose of
[1:04:08] that report was to look at I mean we
[1:04:11] can't we can't have the actual facts.
[1:04:13] The reservation system existed between
[1:04:15] 2020 and 2024 and there's no actual
[1:04:18] facts of
[1:04:20] money being brought in. There is the
[1:04:21] facts that they showed that our economy
[1:04:24] was able to withstand the job of that 41
[1:04:27] to 55 million dollars worth of visitor
[1:04:30] spending that comes in every year of the
[1:04:32] 170,000 people that they decide that
[1:04:36] they you know determined was lacking
[1:04:38] from Arches visitation in those years
[1:04:42] based upon the
[1:04:44] reservation system.
[1:04:45] So when people say that the time to
[1:04:49] entry was inexpensive
[1:04:52] it really questions you know when you
[1:04:54] lose two to three million dollars in
[1:04:56] local tax revenue
[1:04:58] seemed really expensive to me and
[1:05:00] 500,000 dollars doesn't seem like much
[1:05:03] in comparison for a two to three million
[1:05:05] dollar return.
[1:05:08] That's is where I'm at with it. So I
[1:05:10] mean I have been an open process. We've
[1:05:12] had all of the National Park, I think
[1:05:15] um in the press release that Grand
[1:05:16] County put out talks about all the
[1:05:19] people that have been involved in this
[1:05:20] conversation at the federal level as
[1:05:22] well.
[1:05:25] Patrice.
[1:05:26] Um
[1:05:28] I have a lot to say and I I guess I'll
[1:05:29] just start with a couple things. You
[1:05:31] know, one of the things that we've heard
[1:05:33] again and again tonight
[1:05:35] is
[1:05:37] you know, this concern by the general
[1:05:39] public that they feel that it came out
[1:05:41] of nowhere. And I feel the same way.
[1:05:44] Um
[1:05:45] and that's a concern and and I'll tell
[1:05:47] you one this this is a huge
[1:05:48] generalization of one things that I've
[1:05:50] noticed in the last year and a half. We
[1:05:52] don't have workshops anymore. Those
[1:05:54] they've stopped. They've ceased.
[1:05:56] And it's not great. It's not good. And the other thing that's happening is
[1:06:01] we used to have meetings that were 6
[1:06:03] hours long or 8 hours long and now we
[1:06:05] get done in an hour and a half.
[1:06:07] And that might be great for us, but
[1:06:12] what it also means is we're not
[1:06:14] deliberating.
[1:06:15] We're not taking the time to be very
[1:06:17] careful. We don't have experts up
[1:06:19] speaking and we're questioning them.
[1:06:22] It's It's just like we're on this
[1:06:26] just track of like speedy It's getting
[1:06:27] done. Things are getting done. It's like
[1:06:29] it's getting done.
[1:06:31] But is it done in a manner that people
[1:06:34] feel represented? Is it done in a manner
[1:06:37] that
[1:06:38] we have taken into account all of, you
[1:06:42] know, all the information that's out
[1:06:44] there? We've carefully dissected it. I
[1:06:47] don't think so. I do want to return to
[1:06:49] this concept of workshops and here's
[1:06:51] why. So, what we've done is supplanted
[1:06:53] them with subcommittees. Subcommittees
[1:06:56] don't have four commissioners. That
[1:06:58] being said,
[1:07:00] they are not open in public meetings.
[1:07:03] You probably are getting that. These
[1:07:06] subcommittees that are occurring.
[1:07:08] And I'm not saying that there's not some
[1:07:10] good stuff that's coming out of them.
[1:07:11] There are. But it's also people are not
[1:07:14] apprised. They can't go back and watch
[1:07:16] meetings. They can't go back and listen
[1:07:18] to audio of these meetings. So there
[1:07:22] things are being done
[1:07:24] in the veil of darkness and that's why
[1:07:25] you feel that you don't know what's
[1:07:27] going on. Cuz you don't.
[1:07:30] And then and and a lot of work has been
[1:07:32] done in a subcommittee and then it comes
[1:07:34] here tonight. And and and I want to tell
[1:07:37] you and I'm saying this um
[1:07:40] you guys have done a lot of work.
[1:07:42] And I and I won't I won't say I appreciate it, but
[1:07:45] you clearly have done a lot of work. You
[1:07:46] went out and got a lot of money and that
[1:07:48] that's that's you know, I I commend
[1:07:52] that.
[1:07:53] But
[1:07:55] people are feeling uncomfortable because
[1:07:56] we're not doing it in the in open. And I think we do need to turn return to
[1:08:02] workshops. There's a lot of value in
[1:08:04] those and and in those workshops we're
[1:08:07] all here. It's open and public and
[1:08:10] people can hear what's going on. And so
[1:08:12] I'm just going to make that
[1:08:13] recommendation. Um
[1:08:16] I think I'm going to start there and
[1:08:17] then I if and then maybe I'll ask Brian
[1:08:19] a question and I'll come back later when
[1:08:21] you guys Can you give me kind of a
[1:08:24] cuz this has obviously been in the works
[1:08:26] for a very long.
[1:08:29] I think.
[1:08:31] Would be my guess. Even maybe you know,
[1:08:33] prior to you.
[1:08:35] But what I would like you to do is kind
[1:08:37] of give the general public just a
[1:08:39] narrative of like
[1:08:41] where this was hatched, who you've been
[1:08:43] working with because it's not something
[1:08:45] that came about a few months ago. This
[1:08:47] has been a long time process, I believe.
[1:08:52] And so if you can kind of just give me
[1:08:53] where you stepped in, who you've been
[1:08:55] working with, whether it's at the state
[1:08:57] level, the federal level, just give
[1:08:59] people kind of paint a picture so that
[1:09:01] maybe we do have a better feel for where
[1:09:04] this came from, you know, and why.
[1:09:07] Um, it just just the narrative. All
[1:09:09] right, we're going to skip over that
[1:09:10] question for Brian. I'm going to go to
[1:09:12] the other commissioners that have their
[1:09:13] hands up, and then we'll go back to
[1:09:14] Brian.
[1:09:14] >> Okay, great.
[1:09:16] If you're done with your comments, do
[1:09:17] you have any Yeah, I'll come back. All
[1:09:19] right. Commissioner McCurtin. Mine's a
[1:09:21] two-part. Uh, Lena, you still there?
[1:09:26] I am.
[1:09:27] Uh,
[1:09:29] why [clears throat] did the uh
[1:09:31] I I don't know the selection committee
[1:09:32] or how it was uh passed through, but why
[1:09:34] did the National Park Service
[1:09:37] uh
[1:09:37] bill the the want to chip in 1.5 million
[1:09:40] dollars?
[1:09:41] And then
[1:09:42] do we have a state representative other
[1:09:44] than Larry on board here? I don't think
[1:09:46] Cuz I I want to know I know the state of
[1:09:49] Utah chipped in a million uh from the U
[1:09:51] dot recreation hotspot program. Uh, and
[1:09:54] I know that vote was unanimous. I just
[1:09:55] want to hear their
[1:09:57] hear why they said that was a unanimous
[1:09:59] vote.
[1:10:00] Uh, it it again, I'm probably directing
[1:10:02] it Brian on this one.
[1:10:04] But, uh
[1:10:05] Lena, you're you're up, if that's okay.
[1:10:08] Uh, yeah, sure. Um, I I do want to just
[1:10:10] clarify one thing. The National Park
[1:10:13] Service director uh or acting director
[1:10:15] has prioritized this project and is uh
[1:10:19] committing to uh participating and
[1:10:21] putting in the 1.5 million dollars, but
[1:10:23] that has not been confirmed. It has not
[1:10:24] yet gone through the process of of a
[1:10:26] confirmed budget. So, we we don't have
[1:10:28] that check in hand. Uh, although that I
[1:10:30] have been assured by the the director
[1:10:32] that it is a priority for her. So, um
[1:10:35] we're we're not quite at 100% in terms
[1:10:37] of that 1.5 million dollars. I will say
[1:10:39] when uh we discovered that timed entry
[1:10:42] was not going to be a a workable option
[1:10:44] for us this summer, um there was an
[1:10:46] effort at the National Park Service
[1:10:48] leadership level in the Department of
[1:10:49] Interior level to try to find other ways
[1:10:52] to mitigate the visitation and
[1:10:54] congestion that we were starting to see.
[1:10:56] And so, there's lots of different ways
[1:10:58] that we've approached that. Some of it
[1:11:00] has to do with the tactics and
[1:11:01] techniques that we're using on the
[1:11:02] ground in the field and one of those
[1:11:04] options was Grand County's coming to the
[1:11:07] table and asking if we were interested
[1:11:08] in looking into a shuttle option via the
[1:11:11] ASL alternative and so
[1:11:13] I have communicated that that is a
[1:11:15] priority for our local gateway community
[1:11:17] and the director has assured us that is a priority for her as well.
[1:11:22] But I do want to just just confirm again
[1:11:24] we do not have 100% certainty in that
[1:11:26] funding. It has not yet gone through the
[1:11:27] process of funding approval. That is a a
[1:11:30] verbal commitment from the the director
[1:11:31] of the National Park Service.
[1:11:34] Understood. I think it's a verbal
[1:11:36] commitment on our side too not a
[1:11:38] lockdown of funding until legal review
[1:11:40] etc. And coming back to the commission.
[1:11:42] So that's good to know.
[1:11:45] Did that Did that answer your question?
[1:11:47] Uh yeah and
[1:11:49] normally I'd ask
[1:11:51] a federal partner on for Udot partner
[1:11:53] but pending not having one is right now
[1:11:56] and You got to keep talking those since
[1:11:58] I had you too. Trish's comments you're
[1:12:00] going to have all these lists to answer
[1:12:03] and we're going to go to Bill cuz you
[1:12:04] might have some more questions here.
[1:12:07] And then Mary has her hand up too. So
[1:12:08] we're going to go to Bill, Mary and then
[1:12:10] we're going to go back to you Brighton.
[1:12:12] >> Sure.
[1:12:13] Yeah I want to I want to start with some
[1:12:15] of Commissioner Hadin's remarks
[1:12:18] hatched. I I've we've talked about this
[1:12:21] in the past and words matter. I think
[1:12:23] that you're basically
[1:12:25] conferring [clears throat]
[1:12:26] that Commissioner Martinez is doing
[1:12:29] something illegitimate or illegally. So
[1:12:32] let's let's be careful with our
[1:12:33] >> Come on Bill. Hatched? I mean that
[1:12:36] sounds
[1:12:37] >> Come on. It's your chicken coop. They
[1:12:38] It's not your turn to talk about this.
[1:12:40] And I'll continue on here but I do think
[1:12:42] it's important to remember that he is an
[1:12:44] elected official and he is just as
[1:12:49] I am or anybody else in this room should
[1:12:51] be represented and appreciated for what
[1:12:54] he's done and is up here and not
[1:12:56] disrespected, but
[1:12:58] let's go on with a few points that I
[1:13:00] want to make and then I'm going to make
[1:13:02] a motion. The current commission
[1:13:04] leadership is working hard and getting
[1:13:07] things accomplished and even you
[1:13:09] mentioned that Commissioner Hedin. Thank
[1:13:11] you for noticing.
[1:13:12] We have had unanimous and bipartisan
[1:13:16] support from all federal, state, and
[1:13:18] county, and city entities involved in
[1:13:21] this project. I've say I'll state them
[1:13:24] again, federal, state, county, and city.
[1:13:28] Unanimous support in our subcommittee
[1:13:30] meetings to move this forward.
[1:13:33] We even have a Moab City Council member
[1:13:36] who wants to bid on this process, which
[1:13:39] I think is magnanimous. I think this
[1:13:42] should be put out bid.
[1:13:44] We're getting things done. We're
[1:13:47] for the people of this county and they
[1:13:49] might not necessarily be the people in
[1:13:51] this room, but there are 9,000 residents
[1:13:54] in this county and we're getting things
[1:13:56] done for them. I ran on affordable
[1:13:58] housing,
[1:13:59] a strong economy, and fiscal
[1:14:01] transparency. And to question any of
[1:14:04] those is just a political game. It's not
[1:14:07] looking at the reality of what this
[1:14:08] commission has accomplished in the last
[1:14:10] year and a half.
[1:14:12] That's what
[1:14:14] we're trying to do is get things done
[1:14:16] and to continue to point and to make
[1:14:19] political Patrick remarks against your
[1:14:22] fellow commissioners, I think it needs
[1:14:24] to be called out and I would I just
[1:14:26] appreciate a level of professionalism up
[1:14:29] here. And with that, I'm going to make
[1:14:31] the motion to approve the allocation of
[1:14:33] 500,000
[1:14:35] from transient room tax,
[1:14:38] TRT mitigation funds at the county's
[1:14:40] local match for the Grand County Arches
[1:14:44] National Park Shuttle Pilot.
[1:14:49] Mike. Uh
[1:14:50] no, Mike second round is talking. Okay.
[1:14:53] I'm not saying that. Captain for a
[1:14:55] second for the Mike Brian. I'll second,
[1:14:57] yeah. Brian second, okay. And it's
[1:14:59] Mary's turn to talk and then Brian and
[1:15:00] then we'll go to Mike.
[1:15:01] >> Okay. So, Mary
[1:15:05] Whether or not this is a good idea is
[1:15:07] not my concern. My concern is the
[1:15:10] budget.
[1:15:12] $500,000,
[1:15:14] half a million dollars.
[1:15:17] Our job is to take care of the citizens
[1:15:19] and the people of this county.
[1:15:22] We need We're looking. They're
[1:15:25] forecasting a huge
[1:15:27] uh season of monsoons.
[1:15:31] We have flood mitigation.
[1:15:34] We've been pulling money out of our
[1:15:36] flood mitigation.
[1:15:38] We did not fund
[1:15:40] uh the uh
[1:15:42] solid waste to the degree that they
[1:15:45] asked for with our TRT mitigation fund.
[1:15:47] We said we didn't have enough.
[1:15:50] We did not fund the museum
[1:15:53] fully. We said we did not have enough uh
[1:15:56] mitigation money.
[1:15:59] It's a shell game to say this is not
[1:16:01] coming from the general fund.
[1:16:04] It is coming from the general fund.
[1:16:08] Flood uh TRT mitigation money
[1:16:12] is to offset
[1:16:15] our general fund for the things that
[1:16:19] Grand County needs to accomplish.
[1:16:23] This
[1:16:24] shuttle system as whether it's a good
[1:16:27] idea or a bad idea is not our per day.
[1:16:31] We should not be spending a half a
[1:16:33] million dollars
[1:16:36] when we have not given our our employees
[1:16:39] a cola.
[1:16:41] When we've had told uh heads of
[1:16:44] departments that no, you can do it
[1:16:46] without this this year because we don't
[1:16:49] have the money.
[1:16:52] When we have put a
[1:16:54] hold, a freeze on hiring because we
[1:16:57] don't have the money.
[1:17:01] And then you turn around and you want to
[1:17:02] spend a half a million dollars on
[1:17:05] something that we don't even know it's
[1:17:06] going to do what it's claiming to do.
[1:17:10] It's so fiscally irresponsible that I am
[1:17:12] shocked.
[1:17:16] This is
[1:17:17] We went through a very tough
[1:17:20] budget season this year.
[1:17:23] We told a lot of people no.
[1:17:26] We didn't fund them and some of them are
[1:17:28] facing some really hard things because
[1:17:30] we did not choose to get that give them
[1:17:33] the employees that they requested. We
[1:17:36] chose not to fix the things they asked
[1:17:39] to be fixed.
[1:17:42] I think to spend a half a million
[1:17:45] dollars
[1:17:47] to subsidize a federal agency
[1:17:52] is irresponsible and wrong.
[1:17:57] Thank you. Now we're going to go to
[1:17:58] Brian. He's got some questions to answer
[1:18:00] and then Mike and Chuck.
[1:18:03] Yeah. You know, I don't even know if I'm
[1:18:04] going to go ahead and start answering
[1:18:05] the questions with everything that's
[1:18:07] going around.
[1:18:08] You know, if everyone's just going to
[1:18:09] jockey for political position right now,
[1:18:12] then I guess I'll just join the crowd.
[1:18:15] Mary,
[1:18:16] you know, I
[1:18:17] respect you but but the grandstanding is outrageous, right? Absolutely
[1:18:22] ridiculous. You know, under the previous
[1:18:25] leadership, the state audit caught this
[1:18:27] county illegally overspending mitigation
[1:18:30] funds at $900,000.
[1:18:33] Trish, you you agreed to it. I didn't
[1:18:35] agree to it. Our 2022 financials, right,
[1:18:38] were so riddled with errors that they
[1:18:40] had to be refiled and restated, right?
[1:18:42] Our our county property tax
[1:18:44] distributions were suspended in 2023 and
[1:18:48] 2024.
[1:18:49] You you uh Jack, when you called to
[1:18:51] testify up there in front of the state
[1:18:53] audit for intentional abuse behind the
[1:18:55] backs of all of the commissioners right
[1:18:57] here after you received a Wasn't behind
[1:19:00] anyone's anyone's back. It was in front
[1:19:01] of everyone.
[1:19:02] >> After you received a tax notice right to
[1:19:05] respond in 60 days, right? Despite
[1:19:08] long-running attempts to minimize the
[1:19:11] state findings, right? Everybody uh
[1:19:13] well, not us, but you guys sat up here
[1:19:15] and accepted their accepted unanimously
[1:19:18] their damning conclusions, right? You continued last year to illegally
[1:19:24] appropriate TRT funds to the responsible
[1:19:27] recreation program. And it's funny
[1:19:29] because the same people that came up
[1:19:31] here to speak today about this were
[1:19:33] speaking out for the Tiff the the
[1:19:35] responsible recreation program. The
[1:19:37] height of hypocrisy right there. I will
[1:19:40] go ahead and we can go ahead and talk
[1:19:41] about why this is fiscally responsible.
[1:19:44] Let me pull up a spreadsheet right here.
[1:19:50] And I use I used October right there for
[1:19:52] the numbers because two things happened
[1:19:54] in October. First, this commissioner
[1:19:56] right here went ahead and started
[1:19:58] advertising again with Madden, who's
[1:20:00] been doing a fantastic job. And the
[1:20:02] second thing is it will reflect what
[1:20:04] happened minus the timed entry
[1:20:06] reservation system. We're up 23%
[1:20:10] from those decisions right there in TRT.
[1:20:13] We're up 18% I'm sorry, 11%. These are
[1:20:16] the numbers that Gabe presented right
[1:20:18] here inside your pocket. We're up 11% in
[1:20:21] total sales tax revenue.
[1:20:24] A easy moderate 10% right there from our
[1:20:27] 4.5 mitigation that we also used for
[1:20:30] last year would say that there's going
[1:20:32] to be $450,000
[1:20:34] more in TRT mitigation.
[1:20:36] Look at the previous 6 months to that
[1:20:38] right there, and we were shooting at 8%
[1:20:41] on the negative to what we budgeted, and
[1:20:43] also four to 4% down on total tax
[1:20:46] collected. And that's after the
[1:20:48] adjustment that this commission right
[1:20:50] here made when we recognized the problem
[1:20:52] of where our county was headed. Had we
[1:20:54] continued on last year's path, we'd be
[1:20:57] looking at 11% down and 7%. So, I just I
[1:21:01] just like to clear the air real quick on where everybody's sitting at. Now,
[1:21:05] getting back to Mike's conversation, I
[1:21:08] think that that we owe a ton of
[1:21:10] gratitude to the the commissioners up
[1:21:12] there at the U.S. Transportation. Um
[1:21:15] they were very supportive of this
[1:21:17] program. They asked um a couple of
[1:21:20] questions while I was up there. I think
[1:21:21] the the most important is that they
[1:21:24] would like to see the results. The folks
[1:21:26] who have been most interested are really
[1:21:28] interested in the data that we're going
[1:21:30] to be able to produce with this right
[1:21:32] here. And the reason that they would
[1:21:34] like to see the results isn't just to
[1:21:35] see if this was a success or a failure.
[1:21:38] They'd like to make sure that this isn't
[1:21:40] a one-time type of a a pilot, right?
[1:21:42] They want to make sure that this is
[1:21:43] something that continues to go on
[1:21:46] because they see the need for this here
[1:21:48] in Grand County.
[1:21:49] Um talking to Trish, I mean, I don't
[1:21:51] know where to start on this. I mean,
[1:21:53] I've been involved since, you know, 2011
[1:21:55] inside of of this conversation on Arches
[1:21:58] management. Um I mean, it really has
[1:22:00] been a long time standing that I've that I've studied these documents.
[1:22:04] I've read every report. I've made
[1:22:06] comments publicly um prior to becoming a
[1:22:09] commissioner.
[1:22:10] Um I've made, you know, um
[1:22:13] you know, I've done a lot of work here
[1:22:15] to try to to try to help with the
[1:22:17] visitor management plan inside of
[1:22:18] Arches. Um
[1:22:20] I've I've guided in Arches. I mean, it
[1:22:22] probably as many times as as most folks.
[1:22:25] I mean, it is near and dear to my heart
[1:22:27] inside that park. And I do want to see
[1:22:30] that place run as efficiently, and I
[1:22:33] want everybody to to understand this. I
[1:22:35] just want to tell a quick story about
[1:22:37] why I guide. So, when I'm out on a trip,
[1:22:40] and I'm out there, I get asked the
[1:22:42] question, "Do these red rocks ever get
[1:22:44] old?" Right? And the question is is
[1:22:47] yeah, I've seen the scenery, you know, a
[1:22:48] thousand times. But the biggest thrill
[1:22:51] that I get, right, is when I see that
[1:22:53] look in someone else's eye that reminds
[1:22:56] me of the first time that I saw. Right?
[1:22:58] And I want to make sure that everybody
[1:23:00] has that opportunity. I don't want to
[1:23:02] keep people out of the park. I want them
[1:23:04] to be able to go there and light up and
[1:23:06] go and tell all their friends about how
[1:23:08] amazing the place it is that we live.
[1:23:11] And that's my inspiration, right? When
[1:23:13] we started our conversation with
[1:23:17] Superintendent Pace, Commissioner
[1:23:19] McCandless, and Commissioner Linfield,
[1:23:22] we started off on this basic this basic
[1:23:24] trust right here, right? And that is I
[1:23:27] have a love for Arches National Park and
[1:23:29] the Park Service has a love for Arches
[1:23:31] National Park.
[1:23:32] I think from that foundation right
[1:23:34] there, I think that there was an
[1:23:36] understanding that we could solve big
[1:23:38] problems. And and and that's and that's
[1:23:40] it. I mean, I'd say that's probably the
[1:23:42] story of of of of how we got to to where
[1:23:46] we are. I think that when we work
[1:23:48] collaboratively, that that we can do big
[1:23:50] things. And and and and and it shows. I
[1:23:53] mean, we can we can make things happen
[1:23:56] in a time in time before things go
[1:23:59] wrong. And that's what I'd really love
[1:24:00] to see. I'd love to be able to see a
[1:24:02] solution come into Arches National Park
[1:24:05] to where we don't have to see any kind
[1:24:07] of destruction.
[1:24:08] Um that we can have a great visitor
[1:24:10] experience. You can look back at all of
[1:24:12] the documents that that are in there,
[1:24:14] whether it's in this commission agenda
[1:24:16] items or the other 20 that we've loaded
[1:24:18] up with.
[1:24:19] There's so much inside there that talks
[1:24:22] about all of the ways to to handle a
[1:24:26] visitor use management inside of the
[1:24:28] park.
[1:24:29] And and I know that that that folks who
[1:24:31] really liked timed entry, and some folks
[1:24:34] did, but it also was keeping a lot of
[1:24:36] people out of our parks. And no matter
[1:24:39] how we look at it, no matter how we look
[1:24:41] at it, if you want to go back to the
[1:24:43] 2012 study, it said it's going to cost
[1:24:46] you 190,000 visitors. It said that right
[1:24:48] there in the cost analysis. So yeah, it
[1:24:51] says it's only going to cost you two
[1:24:52] bucks a person, but it did say right
[1:24:54] there 190,000 visitors. We've known this
[1:24:57] all along. We've just been blind to it
[1:25:00] because we were in favor of another
[1:25:02] solution. And that's really the big
[1:25:04] difference is right now there's
[1:25:06] political will to do just like I had
[1:25:08] said earlier, right? We can have that
[1:25:11] expand that access. We can still protect
[1:25:14] our park.
[1:25:15] And we can keep those gates open.
[1:25:18] We're going to go to Stephen. He has his
[1:25:19] hand up and then we're going to go to
[1:25:20] him. Is Jack in front of me? No. You're
[1:25:23] next.
[1:25:24] Stephen Stephen's voting. Well, and and
[1:25:26] my my points are just on it's not
[1:25:29] necessarily policy, but I did want to,
[1:25:31] you know, address a couple things. When
[1:25:33] we're looking to allocate the funds, if
[1:25:34] we're looking at TRT mitigation funds,
[1:25:36] are we looking at allocating 2026
[1:25:40] mitigation funds or in the future 2027
[1:25:42] mitigation funds?
[1:25:44] Next, where we're going to budget or how
[1:25:46] we're going to budget those funds.
[1:25:48] And then if we're looking at allocating
[1:25:50] those funds if there's an extra 500,000.
[1:25:53] I'm just raising those points when we
[1:25:55] move forward. I know
[1:25:57] what's being stated is that we're not
[1:25:58] making the expenditure yet at this
[1:26:00] point, but I just wanted to raise those
[1:26:02] issues well to to make sure that we're
[1:26:03] doing this in the uh the cleanest way
[1:26:06] possible, but just raising those issues.
[1:26:09] Thank you, Stephen. Stephen, I'll go
[1:26:10] ahead and just answer those questions
[1:26:12] real quick for you. So the idea was a out of the 22 26 funds
[1:26:19] right there for the TRT, but this that's where this money would be coming
[1:26:22] from. It was already stated at the end
[1:26:26] of last year during budget season that
[1:26:28] we were going to be doing a budget
[1:26:29] amendment come next month. So, I would
[1:26:31] imagine that this would be part of that
[1:26:33] budget amendment moving forward.
[1:26:36] Okay. Commissioner [clears throat]
[1:26:37] Decker.
[1:26:39] Can Sure, can I
[1:26:40] Yeah, go ahead. Thoughts? Go ahead. Just following up on that thought. So,
[1:26:44] that means before we make
[1:26:46] um So, so then my question is whether we
[1:26:49] should be allocating the funds prior to
[1:26:53] the budgeting process. I think that the
[1:26:55] commission can express a clear intent to
[1:26:57] do that. I just don't know if we're
[1:26:59] muddling muddling things if we're making
[1:27:01] the allocation prior to doing the budget
[1:27:03] amendment process.
[1:27:07] Well, I think that that that at least in
[1:27:09] the previous commission that we had that
[1:27:10] we made allocations and then we handled
[1:27:12] all of those allocations at the budget
[1:27:14] amendment process last year. Things
[1:27:16] might have been different under previous
[1:27:18] commissions, but last year that's how we
[1:27:20] handled our budget amendments.
[1:27:27] Any more, Steven?
[1:27:29] I I would
[1:27:31] I'm just making sure that that yeah, I I
[1:27:33] don't I would probably
[1:27:36] um inquire if Gabe if the clerk auditor had a had a
[1:27:40] preference or insight. I'm not trying to
[1:27:41] put him on the spot. Um but it does seem
[1:27:44] like if we're making these things in the
[1:27:45] future, we could probably circle up
[1:27:47] between now and then and and figure out
[1:27:49] the best way to approach all of this.
[1:27:51] Um but I know that the intent to try to
[1:27:53] make the allocation tonight or or to
[1:27:55] signal that clear intent that that's
[1:27:57] what you guys would like to do. I'm just
[1:27:59] trying to make sure we vet all the
[1:28:01] issues.
[1:28:03] You want to comment on that?
[1:28:06] My question right now is in the agenda
[1:28:07] packet it says working with county
[1:28:08] administration funds have been
[1:28:10] identified for this project from the
[1:28:11] county's TRT mitigation account without
[1:28:14] reducing funds for essential services.
[1:28:17] So, does that mean that we're
[1:28:19] anticipating that the next 10 months of
[1:28:21] revenue will will create such a windfall
[1:28:24] that it will justify this expense? Is
[1:28:26] that Why doesn't If that's what we mean,
[1:28:28] why doesn't it say that in the packet?
[1:28:32] What does that mean?
[1:28:34] Okay.
[1:28:35] When I speak Mike, go ahead. Well, we'll
[1:28:37] see.
[1:28:38] I'd like to make a secondary motion
[1:28:41] in that I move to approve the allocation
[1:28:42] of 500,000
[1:28:44] from fund reserves fund 47
[1:28:48] uh
[1:28:50] as the county's local match for the
[1:28:51] Grand County Arches National Park
[1:28:53] shuttle pilot pending legal review.
[1:29:02] I'll second that.
[1:29:04] It's for discussion going on. Okay.
[1:29:08] It's that we have motion to paid out of
[1:29:10] our fund 47 which is trails, it's
[1:29:12] optional sales tax
[1:29:15] uh funds. Well, when a question comes
[1:29:19] just so everyone knows, it's options
[1:29:21] on that those fund reserves are trails
[1:29:25] uh shuttle services and I can't remember
[1:29:27] [clears throat] the third What was the
[1:29:28] other restriction on that?
[1:29:31] It was trails
[1:29:33] shuttle services and one more
[1:29:34] restriction on that on those those
[1:29:36] direct funds.
[1:29:37] >> Transit system. Transit system, yeah.
[1:29:39] >> transit. Thank you.
[1:29:44] And and sure just a point of
[1:29:45] clarification for the for folks in the
[1:29:48] public it might be helpful to identify
[1:29:49] fund 47.
[1:29:54] Yeah, he said fund 47 and that's
[1:29:56] our optional [clears throat] sales tax
[1:29:58] reserve. It's the trails fund where
[1:30:00] there's allocations made. There have
[1:30:01] been allocations made for the last 6
[1:30:04] years um
[1:30:06] uh from the roads department, um, and
[1:30:08] transferred to fund 47 for potential,
[1:30:11] uh,
[1:30:12] pay path maintenance, trail, um, you
[1:30:15] know, and trail type projects that are
[1:30:17] qualifying those funds.
[1:30:20] Okay, is Jack Hugh or next?
[1:30:23] So,
[1:30:24] virtual So, that means that's money that
[1:30:26] we could spend on, for example, the
[1:30:27] Spanish Valley multi-use pathway,
[1:30:28] correct?
[1:30:30] There's not money in that account in
[1:30:31] both. There's not money in both. There
[1:30:33] is.
[1:30:34] Uh,
[1:30:35] Um, wasn't identified.
[1:30:36] >> Anyway, um,
[1:30:39] to to to to speak to some of the things
[1:30:42] that have been said about about the
[1:30:43] past,
[1:30:45] uh, my involvement in the audit, um,
[1:30:48] there's enough political there
[1:30:51] for me to write a book on it, and
[1:30:52] sometime I'm going to. It It's That was a singular experience, and, uh,
[1:30:58] we were subject to some pretty,
[1:31:01] uh, interesting,
[1:31:02] uh, political maneuvering on that.
[1:31:05] Um, there's some hypocrisy going around.
[1:31:07] It's coming thick and fast from near
[1:31:08] quarter, and, uh,
[1:31:10] it's it's, um, awesome of you to bring
[1:31:13] that up. That's
[1:31:14] >> [laughter]
[1:31:15] >> That's That's rich, Brian. Um,
[1:31:17] it sounds like this is it's So, this
[1:31:21] it doesn't need to go through legal
[1:31:22] review. We'll get to that when we get to
[1:31:24] a contract.
[1:31:25] Um, it sounds like it's about the money,
[1:31:27] uh,
[1:31:28] and I would second much what Mary said
[1:31:31] about the money. I just
[1:31:33] I
[1:31:33] While a shuttle system in arches is is
[1:31:37] definitely interesting and and and a
[1:31:40] good idea,
[1:31:42] um,
[1:31:43] I think it it seems to me there needs to
[1:31:45] be a lot more that goes into that
[1:31:47] thought than than
[1:31:49] starting something up in the next 3
[1:31:51] months on a shoe string.
[1:31:54] And our commitment for half a million
[1:31:57] dollars, to me to me there's just so
[1:31:58] many places that we could spend that
[1:32:00] money.
[1:32:01] Um,
[1:32:01] there as it was pointed out the money's
[1:32:04] up this year. It's great. It's been a
[1:32:05] great season. It's awesome. I've been
[1:32:07] affiliated with I think four businesses
[1:32:09] in town and we're all doing well.
[1:32:11] There's a lot you can attribute that to.
[1:32:12] I think a lot of it is due to increased
[1:32:14] advertising that that all of us voted on
[1:32:16] last year. I think even more of it is
[1:32:18] due to the incredible weather we've had
[1:32:20] combined with the super poor ski season
[1:32:22] this year. I ran a
[1:32:24] uh very busy outfitting business on Main
[1:32:27] Street for 12 years
[1:32:29] and nothing
[1:32:32] dictated business more than the weather.
[1:32:34] If we had a crappy rainy weekend, we
[1:32:36] didn't have tourists.
[1:32:38] We had a uh
[1:32:39] early spring and a bad ski season, we
[1:32:42] were we were flush and and that's the
[1:32:43] case this year. I don't think we should
[1:32:46] count
[1:32:47] on those dollars going forward. It's a iffy proposition. We could have a
[1:32:52] fire. There's there's a million things,
[1:32:54] recessions, price of gas that that go
[1:32:56] into
[1:32:58] the way that people spend money here.
[1:33:00] Just because we're doing well on tax
[1:33:02] collection right now, doesn't mean we
[1:33:05] should allocate those funds towards
[1:33:06] something like this um that is a pilot
[1:33:09] and has the potential not to be renewed.
[1:33:12] It
[1:33:13] is I think irresponsible. I would love
[1:33:15] to see some of the things funded that we
[1:33:17] didn't get to fund in the last budget
[1:33:18] system and and the last budgeting season
[1:33:21] um
[1:33:22] including and foremost solid ways to see
[1:33:24] Chris here.
[1:33:26] Um I know you guys are are in need of a
[1:33:28] lot of that mediation money as well. Um
[1:33:32] that's it for now.
[1:33:34] Okay Mary, go ahead.
[1:33:37] Thank you. Uh
[1:33:39] I'm sorry I lost I'm I apologize for my
[1:33:41] anger.
[1:33:42] I'm just not giving our people a cola
[1:33:47] this year was really hard on my heart.
[1:33:50] I think our most important
[1:33:53] asset is our staff and I don't think we
[1:33:57] not giving them a cola and then this
[1:33:59] year
[1:34:00] with inflation going up and
[1:34:03] uh
[1:34:04] price of gas
[1:34:06] I mean it's really been hard on them.
[1:34:08] And I'm concerned about many things in
[1:34:12] the county from flood mitigation to
[1:34:14] solid waste to
[1:34:16] uh continuing the search and rescue. So,
[1:34:19] I just think there are so many needs
[1:34:21] that we need to focus on.
[1:34:24] And I'm also concerned that this
[1:34:26] windfall may not continue.
[1:34:29] We've always relied a great deal on our
[1:34:33] uh
[1:34:33] international travel
[1:34:36] in the summer.
[1:34:38] And I've spoken to innkeepers and such
[1:34:41] and the international people are not
[1:34:43] booking.
[1:34:45] It was bad last year, but it's gotten a
[1:34:47] lot worse.
[1:34:48] So, I'm really concerned that this uh
[1:34:51] summer we're going to see a dip.
[1:34:54] Un- unlike this spring that has been
[1:34:56] really nice and wonderful for our our uh
[1:34:59] tax base. But, I don't I'm really I'm
[1:35:02] concerned with what's happening uh on
[1:35:05] the national stage
[1:35:08] and
[1:35:09] we're not going to see
[1:35:12] the tourist continue moving forward.
[1:35:16] And I'm
[1:35:19] I I just I think that
[1:35:24] this is not in our lane.
[1:35:27] And more people
[1:35:29] will use the trails in our county
[1:35:32] than will use the shuttle.
[1:35:36] Trails in this county is what brings
[1:35:38] people here.
[1:35:40] They're internationally known. They are
[1:35:42] our many in many ways our bread and
[1:35:46] butter.
[1:35:47] They they are the one our trails are
[1:35:49] what bring our jeepers, what bring our
[1:35:51] hikers, what make brings our mountain
[1:35:54] bikers, what brings many many people,
[1:35:57] just people that like to just take
[1:35:58] casual walks.
[1:36:00] Maintaining and taking care of our
[1:36:02] trails is of such
[1:36:05] a high need to even consider taking
[1:36:08] money out of that.
[1:36:10] We just don't have the money.
[1:36:13] And we need to start putting money back
[1:36:16] into our savings. We were saving every year.
[1:36:22] We were saving $400,000 a year for flood
[1:36:26] mitigation. We haven't been doing that
[1:36:28] over the last 2 years.
[1:36:30] I'm just
[1:36:32] I think this is ill-conceived on a
[1:36:35] financial level, whether or not it's a
[1:36:37] good idea or not. Financially, I think
[1:36:40] it's a very poor poor decision.
[1:36:47] And Trish, go ahead and next. Okay. All
[1:36:49] right. So, I have No, we're going to be
[1:36:51] wrapping this. I know I've done with
[1:36:52] talk one more time, but I think we're
[1:36:53] going to all talk one time, and we're
[1:36:54] going to call it a night. Okay. Yep.
[1:36:56] That's fine.
[1:36:57] And so,
[1:36:59] um it might take me a couple minutes.
[1:37:00] So, first of all, I want to respond to
[1:37:02] Commissioner Winfield's attack on me.
[1:37:05] Um
[1:37:06] I I did not make an attack on Brian. I
[1:37:09] asked a simple question and asked him to
[1:37:12] give a narrative, and there's no reason
[1:37:14] to continue to attack me. It's getting
[1:37:16] really really really tiresome. But, I
[1:37:19] will continue to be here. You're not
[1:37:21] going to I'm not going to quit. I know
[1:37:23] that's what you want, but it ain't ain't
[1:37:24] going to happen.
[1:37:26] Um next, Mel a minute, I'm going to
[1:37:29] state that when I make random comments
[1:37:31] and I'm called out on it,
[1:37:33] understandably, I expect every
[1:37:35] commissioner to be called out. Brian has
[1:37:36] made multiple comments tonight and not
[1:37:38] been called out on it. So, please, let's
[1:37:41] just be consistent. It's all I'm asking,
[1:37:44] and there it's it's hasn't been.
[1:37:47] Um Brian, you didn't really give the
[1:37:49] story. You told like a personal story,
[1:37:51] but again, I believe that, you know,
[1:37:53] there's been work at a at a state level,
[1:37:56] a lot of work with PlipCo would be my I
[1:37:58] guess, because I know PlipCo's been
[1:38:00] involved with your guys' subcommittee. I
[1:38:02] think there's been work at a federal
[1:38:04] level. I know you guys went back to DC,
[1:38:06] and that's kind of what I wanted you to divulge to the citizens. Didn't
[1:38:10] happen, but it is what it is.
[1:38:13] I will not
[1:38:14] be voting for this. And it's and it's
[1:38:18] I first want to state I I support the
[1:38:20] concept of a shuttle system. I do.
[1:38:24] think that it should begin with a
[1:38:27] feasibility study, an updated
[1:38:29] feasibility study. We have a feasibility
[1:38:31] study from 2012.
[1:38:33] Thank you for putting that in the
[1:38:34] packet. That was great. I think the
[1:38:36] first step should be an updated
[1:38:37] feasibility study, and then we move from
[1:38:39] there. And it's a holistic process. So,
[1:38:42] I would all day long support
[1:38:45] that those are the initial steps, and I
[1:38:46] would spend money on that. I don't
[1:38:48] really want to spend more money right
[1:38:50] now, but I would spend spend money on
[1:38:52] that. Um, and then, you know, I guess
[1:38:55] the last thing I'll say is I don't I
[1:38:57] cannot stress enough, and I've stressed
[1:39:00] it all along, as we continue to spend
[1:39:02] money out of budget.
[1:39:04] We have a budgeting process.
[1:39:07] We do that from September to December.
[1:39:10] And there's a reason for that. And by
[1:39:13] the way, we started 2026 in a deficit.
[1:39:16] We were in a deficit in 25. We started
[1:39:18] 26 in a deficit.
[1:39:20] And what I would think,
[1:39:23] on just a personal level, if I was in
[1:39:25] the hole, I wouldn't be randomly
[1:39:27] spending money.
[1:39:29] And yet, we continue literally almost
[1:39:32] every single mini meeting to spend more
[1:39:36] money that is out of budget. And that's
[1:39:39] my concern, and I would agree, we have
[1:39:41] endless needs in this county, endless
[1:39:44] needs in this county. We have a capital
[1:39:45] projects list this long.
[1:39:48] We have staffing needs. It goes on and on. Mary's already said it,
[1:39:51] Jacques has already said it. So, if
[1:39:53] that's my main, I guess, twofold, two
[1:39:56] things. I don't I don't think this has
[1:39:58] been properly vetted. I think I would I
[1:40:00] think a feasibility study, an updated
[1:40:03] feasibility study would be perfect.
[1:40:05] And then, two, we currently do not have
[1:40:08] the money. We're running in the red, and
[1:40:10] we need to stop spending money outside
[1:40:12] of budget.
[1:40:14] Okay, Bill is next.
[1:40:17] Okay. Um I'll start off with I'll buy
[1:40:20] the first copy of your book, Jacques.
[1:40:22] I'd like to have it signed, preferably.
[1:40:26] Um and then,
[1:40:27] I'd like to go back, and I agree with
[1:40:29] Mary. I think every one of us struggled
[1:40:33] when we didn't weren't able to give
[1:40:34] staff a cola. I don't think it was taken
[1:40:37] lightly by any commissioner here. We all
[1:40:40] struggled with that. And it's also
[1:40:42] something that should be addressed when
[1:40:44] we
[1:40:46] amend our budget at midyear, because
[1:40:48] although Trish keeps saying that we're
[1:40:50] running in the red, um actually, I think
[1:40:54] um Gabe's numbers show that we are not
[1:40:56] running in the red, and even Brian
[1:40:58] mentioned it, we're back to running in
[1:41:01] the black, and that's because of the
[1:41:03] leadership for the last year and a half.
[1:41:06] It's not because of the prior
[1:41:07] leadership. We're running in the black
[1:41:10] now in our books, and if somebody wants
[1:41:12] to prove otherwise, please give me those
[1:41:14] numbers.
[1:41:16] So,
[1:41:17] um running on a shoestring, this isn't
[1:41:20] running on a shoestring. This pedal
[1:41:23] system has been worked on. Commissioner
[1:41:25] Hedin, you mentioned and you keep
[1:41:27] questioning Brian about where all this
[1:41:30] was hatched, or where the work started.
[1:41:32] You were at the meeting in Salt Lake
[1:41:34] City. I was at the meeting, Commissioner
[1:41:36] Martinez, yourself.
[1:41:38] We were working with the federal
[1:41:41] government, Kevin Lilly.
[1:41:43] I might be wrong. It wasn't Kevin Lilly.
[1:41:45] Um Karen Butt Fallon was there. We also
[1:41:48] had Plitko there. Yes, there's been work
[1:41:50] with Plitko. The National Park Service,
[1:41:52] Lena was there as well. I think at your
[1:41:55] table. And so
[1:41:57] we have had multiple meetings on this
[1:42:00] that you have been involved in. So to
[1:42:02] keep stating that where was this
[1:42:05] hatched? How did we come up with this?
[1:42:07] Well, you were there. You've been had
[1:42:08] every opportunity with many of us to be
[1:42:11] updated. Sometimes you choose not to. I
[1:42:14] know that Brian put out a message to all
[1:42:16] of us commissioners. Anybody ask
[1:42:18] questions, call me.
[1:42:20] So you could have been further updated
[1:42:22] with that.
[1:42:24] I um
[1:42:25] I will say that there are a lot of local
[1:42:29] keyboard warriors that are spreading
[1:42:32] misinformation from day one about this.
[1:42:35] It is no wonder that the public is
[1:42:37] misinformed, as you say.
[1:42:41] You'd have to be delusional to keep
[1:42:43] believing the misinformation that is
[1:42:45] going out on social media in this
[1:42:47] community because none of it is fact,
[1:42:50] especially when we have been in meetings
[1:42:53] together and you have been informed
[1:42:55] about them and he has and I have.
[1:42:58] All of us as commissioners have been in
[1:43:00] these meetings. So to continue to
[1:43:03] rely on social media, anybody in this
[1:43:05] community should um question that one.
[1:43:12] Clearly, several commissioners are
[1:43:14] struggling with this issue.
[1:43:17] But Jacques, you say that you're against
[1:43:19] using it for TRT. So are you fine with
[1:43:22] the secondary motion? Because we have
[1:43:24] another source here that we can use it
[1:43:26] so we don't have to take it out of
[1:43:29] as Gabe says, our numbers are up, we're
[1:43:32] running in the black." You say they're
[1:43:34] in the red, Trish. Let's go with what
[1:43:36] Mike has and let's come back together as
[1:43:38] a commission here.
[1:43:40] Let's come back together and move
[1:43:42] forward with some money out of fund 47
[1:43:46] and
[1:43:47] move this shuttle system forward.
[1:43:51] And constantly I hear commissioners
[1:43:53] talking about how we need to slow down.
[1:43:56] We've got commissioners that
[1:43:58] are going backwards here.
[1:44:00] You vote no on workforce housing, but
[1:44:04] you say you're for workforce housing.
[1:44:06] You say you're for shuttle, but you want
[1:44:09] to slow it down and you want to vote no
[1:44:11] now. So, you can't have both ways. You
[1:44:14] either are or you aren't
[1:44:17] for the shuttle system. You are you
[1:44:19] aren't for housing. Your vote shows
[1:44:22] where you are.
[1:44:24] Let's move forward. We've got another
[1:44:26] fund to pull this out of.
[1:44:28] Let's have a vote.
[1:44:31] Mike.
[1:44:33] That's what I want to make clear to
[1:44:34] everyone.
[1:44:35] Uh
[1:44:36] Mary, I understand your uh
[1:44:39] heated your feelings on the subject, but
[1:44:42] even with the first motion motion,
[1:44:43] transit room tax TRT mitigation funds
[1:44:46] can't be used for COLA.
[1:44:49] But they simply can't. They have
[1:44:50] restrictions on
[1:44:51] fund 47 has restrictions on them.
[1:44:54] But uh fund 47 restricts
[1:44:57] I'm going to need that last one again,
[1:44:58] Gabe. Uh
[1:44:59] trails,
[1:45:01] shuttle system, transit. And transit.
[1:45:04] They're all restricted funds. We can't
[1:45:06] pay a COLA out of those. I want to give
[1:45:09] our uh employees a raise, too.
[1:45:11] It's not going to happen out of that
[1:45:12] fund.
[1:45:13] It shouldn't happen per state statute
[1:45:15] that out of that fund.
[1:45:18] So, I understand the heated discussion
[1:45:21] from many up here. But we have 1.3
[1:45:25] give or take million dollars in a fund
[1:45:28] restricted to shuttle.
[1:45:30] Go ahead and use it.
[1:45:33] Okay, I remember Trisha's to Trisha's
[1:45:35] saying gaslighting me that I'm not
[1:45:38] calling other people out because I don't
[1:45:39] think there's been anyone else who's
[1:45:40] spoken out of turn tonight, but we can
[1:45:41] go back and look at the tape. Um
[1:45:43] and then
[1:45:45] I also want to bring out the fact that
[1:45:48] if another person, say Jacques, brought
[1:45:51] up the shuttle system, then it'd
[1:45:52] probably be a a slam dunk. He'd support
[1:45:54] it. But I feel like it's because it's
[1:45:55] Brian and that it's not. Another thing
[1:45:59] is that when I was looking at the
[1:46:00] revenue and the expenditures in '21
[1:46:03] through '24 before I became a
[1:46:04] commissioner, you know, the revenues
[1:46:06] were down, but the expenditures were up
[1:46:08] year over year. So, we've been running
[1:46:11] this county negative in a really long
[1:46:13] for a really long time. Um it's not like
[1:46:16] it's a brand new thing. And if we'd been
[1:46:18] getting that two to three million
[1:46:19] dollars from the visitors in the last
[1:46:22] four years, we'd be up
[1:46:24] additional eight to 12 million dollars
[1:46:26] in tax revenue. So, anyways, that's my last comment. I'm going to let
[1:46:31] Brian talk and then I'm going to call
[1:46:32] for a vote.
[1:46:34] Yeah, thanks.
[1:46:36] The reason that we're up right now is
[1:46:38] cuz we invested in tourism.
[1:46:41] Melody, you you you asked you asked some
[1:46:43] of the other commissioners, do you
[1:46:45] support tourism? And we received a
[1:46:47] double negative. Well, I don't not
[1:46:48] support tourism. And I think everybody
[1:46:51] kind of felt comfortable. I mean, our
[1:46:53] actions showed that we support tourism.
[1:46:55] You know, we started right off on day
[1:46:57] one coming in here and raising our
[1:46:59] advertising budget, having a welcoming
[1:47:01] message.
[1:47:03] Everybody said the sky was going to fall
[1:47:05] the second that we did that. We started
[1:47:07] opening up access to bike trails. You
[1:47:09] were against access restricting to our parks. Once again, every time
[1:47:14] that happened, everyone said the sky is
[1:47:16] going to fall. And here we are today,
[1:47:18] right? We're in the black, we have have
[1:47:20] bit of money, and we're saying, guys,
[1:47:22] let's keep investing in our
[1:47:23] infrastructure, right? Let's make sure
[1:47:25] that we can have those funds available
[1:47:27] so that we can have COLAs. Let's make
[1:47:29] sure that the families here in Grant
[1:47:31] County can actually be able to put food
[1:47:33] on the table cuz there's enough of work
[1:47:35] moving through. I I just don't get where
[1:47:37] there's the hang-up on that portion.
[1:47:39] Now, getting back on on track right
[1:47:42] here, I I really think that the best
[1:47:44] place we could pull the funds from would
[1:47:46] have been for mitigation. Um I look at
[1:47:49] it, we have those as you the most
[1:47:50] restricted funds that we could have
[1:47:52] right there. Um and it makes sense to me
[1:47:54] to pull them from mitigation.
[1:47:56] Fund 47, this whole thing, I mean, I I
[1:47:59] can tell you that I'm that I'm super
[1:48:00] frustrated um on this. You know, we
[1:48:03] went, you know, over the last couple
[1:48:05] commission meetings and have been trying
[1:48:06] to find money for the Spanish Valley
[1:48:08] Pathway, and I asked for all funds that
[1:48:10] we could be used to be identified, and
[1:48:13] they weren't brought forth to the table.
[1:48:14] So, I don't know where or how we're
[1:48:16] hiding money from this commission, but
[1:48:18] I'm going to tell you I'm going to find
[1:48:20] out, and I'm going to investigate it,
[1:48:21] and there will be some consequences for
[1:48:23] that.
[1:48:24] Unacceptable. Right? Unacceptable. Um I
[1:48:28] have no problem pulling from fund 47,
[1:48:30] but I'm telling you I think that it
[1:48:32] would be it would be better to use the
[1:48:35] money that is more restricted,
[1:48:38] and and it's appropriate. It's listed in
[1:48:40] the legislation. Either which way we
[1:48:42] want to go, right? The legislation says
[1:48:43] that we can use it uh
[1:48:45] under
[1:48:46] 2B, right? I'm sorry, a 3B, or it also
[1:48:49] says it right here under the uh optional
[1:48:52] sales tax that we can use it for a
[1:48:54] system for public transit. Um
[1:48:57] I don't know. I mean, I
[1:48:59] Yeah, I mean, I'm a little bit torn on
[1:49:01] pulling it out of this this fund, but if
[1:49:03] that's if that's the way that we're
[1:49:04] going to go because people don't think
[1:49:05] that we're going to have the um
[1:49:08] the the TRT, and then then let's go that
[1:49:11] way. You know, Zach, do you want to
[1:49:13] Zach, go ahead.
[1:49:15] Uh I'm I'm not going to vote for it. So,
[1:49:18] it I I It's going to pass. I think it's
[1:49:21] up to you guys to decide which fund it's
[1:49:22] going to come from. Okay.
[1:49:24] >> [clears throat]
[1:49:25] >> Okay, so we're going to go ahead and
[1:49:26] call for a vote on the substitute motion
[1:49:28] that Mike put forth to put that up to
[1:49:31] pay that out of 147. All in favor?
[1:49:36] And all opposed?
[1:49:37] Nay.
[1:49:39] Okay, so that fails. So, we're going to
[1:49:40] go back to the original motion, which
[1:49:42] was the motion that Bill put forward,
[1:49:45] and
[1:49:46] that was to pay that out of TRT. So, all
[1:49:48] those in favor?
[1:49:51] And those opposed?
[1:49:53] Nay.
[1:49:54] Okay, so that passes 4-3 with
[1:49:59] um, Hadine, Hadler, and Begay in
[1:50:01] opposition.
[1:50:03] All right, and then we'll move on to
[1:50:04] number four, which is drought
[1:50:06] declaration for the emergency management
[1:50:08] director Kinkade.
[1:50:15] We have a follow-up after subjects.
[1:50:17] conversation with Mike. I did. We should
[1:50:20] discuss the alley road. Sorry.
[1:50:22] >> [laughter]
[1:50:23] >> Hey. You're like more of a bad news
[1:50:25] bear.
[1:50:27] Drought declaration.
[1:50:29] It's not a good talk.
[1:50:31] Hey, good evening.
[1:50:33] Uh, Commissioner Hadler, you mentioned
[1:50:35] it for the ski season.
[1:50:38] That is correct. Um, it's not a secret
[1:50:40] that we were pretty light on snowfall,
[1:50:44] and then we had a very, very warm
[1:50:46] spring, which those two things in
[1:50:48] conjunction have deepened drought
[1:50:52] conditions across the county.
[1:50:55] Um, I put this in the background of this
[1:50:58] agenda item, but I reached out to our
[1:50:59] partners at the National Weather Service
[1:51:01] in Grand Junction for just some
[1:51:04] background on what things look like in
[1:51:06] this county right now.
[1:51:08] Um, some of the things that they sent
[1:51:10] back, snow tell set sites across the
[1:51:12] West Elks reached wet record low snow
[1:51:16] water equivalent by March 11th
[1:51:18] and melted out completely before we
[1:51:20] normally reach our median peak snow
[1:51:22] water.
[1:51:23] So, those had completely gone even
[1:51:26] before we're normally at our our max.
[1:51:29] Um US drought monitor degraded one to
[1:51:32] three categories across the county since
[1:51:34] March 3rd and all of the counties
[1:51:36] currently in D3, which is extreme
[1:51:38] drought.
[1:51:41] Water supply forecast along the Colorado
[1:51:43] and Dolores Rivers are less than 30% of
[1:51:46] average.
[1:51:47] March 2026 was the fifth driest March on
[1:51:50] record over 132 years of record keeping.
[1:51:54] And the evaporative demand drought
[1:51:56] index, which is a measure of plant
[1:51:58] atmospheric thirst, has been 100% dry
[1:52:01] over the county for the last month.
[1:52:04] So, kind of taking all of those
[1:52:05] together,
[1:52:07] um I put together a declaration for the
[1:52:10] existence of a drought emergency within
[1:52:13] Grand County's jurisdictional
[1:52:14] boundaries.
[1:52:16] Um reason being
[1:52:18] the drought has had an impact across
[1:52:20] multiple operations through the county
[1:52:22] that are listed in the declaration, but
[1:52:24] most notably with producers. So, that
[1:52:27] would be our farmers and ranchers.
[1:52:29] Having an active declaration opens up
[1:52:31] individual assistance opportunities for
[1:52:33] those people.
[1:52:35] Um one example would be like emergency
[1:52:37] relief and emergency food programs.
[1:52:41] Yeah, that's all that I've got. Mr.
[1:52:43] Winfield?
[1:52:45] Well, um I want to add just a few
[1:52:46] comments and then I'm going to make the
[1:52:48] motion to approve this, but um this
[1:52:50] there's state and federal officials both
[1:52:53] are weighing in on this and recommending
[1:52:55] this with the governor saying that
[1:52:57] there's
[1:52:58] an executive order most likely going to
[1:53:00] come out about this.
[1:53:02] I do believe that San
[1:53:04] Juan County, Iron County, and maybe one
[1:53:07] more of the already also Uinta County, I
[1:53:09] believe done it drought declaration.
[1:53:12] I know that
[1:53:14] it's
[1:53:15] we're tracking about half the normal
[1:53:17] water and even though it feels a little
[1:53:19] bit funny asking for a drought
[1:53:21] declaration after it snowed yesterday.
[1:53:24] Um which I'm very thankful for and that
[1:53:27] rain that we got it was a long slow hard
[1:53:30] not hard long slow
[1:53:33] rainfall that soaked in for us. I think
[1:53:36] that was extremely beneficial to us, but
[1:53:38] I will make the motion to support this.
[1:53:41] I move to approve the declaration of the
[1:53:43] existence of a drought
[1:53:46] emergency.
[1:53:47] Okay, we have a second by Mike. Thank
[1:53:49] you. Any more discussion? Brent?
[1:53:53] Yeah, can you just go over the the
[1:53:54] difference real quick between the state
[1:53:56] declaration and the county doing the
[1:53:59] declaration? I think that it has to do
[1:54:01] with the time of the declaration. Is
[1:54:03] that correct?
[1:54:05] Yeah, so if you look at this declaration
[1:54:09] it is
[1:54:11] retroactively taking effect April 1st
[1:54:14] due to the fact that conditions
[1:54:15] deteriorated so much in March.
[1:54:18] Um which means that producers
[1:54:21] if they had costs that they incurred
[1:54:24] that they could get relief for up to
[1:54:25] April 1st, they would qualify.
[1:54:28] They would be covered under a state
[1:54:30] declaration, but where if we didn't have
[1:54:32] a county declaration it would be the
[1:54:33] effective date of the state one.
[1:54:35] So, I think
[1:54:37] and and maybe Trish can help me answer
[1:54:39] this.
[1:54:39] The last meeting that we were at over
[1:54:41] this it was that the state declaration
[1:54:44] is shorter than the county declaration.
[1:54:47] Is that correct? I believe that was one
[1:54:49] of the big benefits of having a county
[1:54:51] declaration. Is that
[1:54:53] declaration lasted longer than the
[1:54:55] state's declaration? And Yeah, sorry. I really is
[1:55:00] we re-evaluate as conditions change and
[1:55:02] then we separate when we're out of it.
[1:55:06] And it was Emery County bill that was
[1:55:08] the other
[1:55:08] Um, yeah.
[1:55:13] Okay, any other questions or comments?
[1:55:15] No.
[1:55:17] Go ahead and call for a vote. So, all
[1:55:18] those in favor of passing the drought
[1:55:20] declaration.
[1:55:22] I.
[1:55:23] Thank you, Mary. That's 7-0. That passes
[1:55:25] unanimously. Thanks, KC. Thank you. Can
[1:55:27] I ask a question before I go? Yeah. I
[1:55:30] got a little lost during the consent
[1:55:32] agenda. The cooperative wildfire system,
[1:55:35] is that future meeting or is that later
[1:55:37] in this meeting? It's going to be a
[1:55:38] future meeting. Um, Stephen wanted to
[1:55:41] have time to respond to that. Thank you.
[1:55:44] Yeah, so future meeting, probably next
[1:55:45] meeting. Thank you.
[1:55:49] All right, so now we're moving on to
[1:55:50] number five, which is the Moab office of
[1:55:52] tourism summer campaign budget
[1:55:53] recommendations. Back to you.
[1:55:57] Yeah, so we've had uh um meetings with
[1:55:59] Madden
[1:56:01] and uh um to boost summer visitation.
[1:56:04] They're proposing a $236
[1:56:07] or I'm sorry, $236,000
[1:56:09] campaign um proposed that a tactical
[1:56:12] budget increase focused on driving
[1:56:15] visitation in July and August of this
[1:56:17] year. One of the office's long-term
[1:56:19] goals is to increase summer visitation
[1:56:21] to lessen the visitation dip we've seen
[1:56:24] in prior years. Uh Madden Media prepared
[1:56:27] a summer summer marketing campaign to
[1:56:29] encourage a late summer trip to Moab.
[1:56:32] Um, the Moab Tourism Advisory Board
[1:56:35] approved this budget increase during its
[1:56:37] May 12th meeting.
[1:56:39] Um, just a couple of other things um
[1:56:41] that I have from this. Um, Madden did
[1:56:44] not really start uh having ads placed
[1:56:47] until about mid-July. Um, so last year
[1:56:51] we kind of missed out on that initial uh um summer summer campaign
[1:56:56] right there.
[1:56:57] Um we've also asked um for a couple of
[1:57:00] other small things. I don't know if
[1:57:01] anyone's had a chance to see the Who is
[1:57:03] Moab videos. If you haven't, they're really good. Um but that's one
[1:57:07] additional request and we've also had a
[1:57:10] um request on to Madden for a uh um
[1:57:14] influencer campaign so that we can tell
[1:57:16] stories faster and a little bit more
[1:57:18] accurately to visitors.
[1:57:20] Um and what we don't want to see is we
[1:57:22] don't want to see these these one-offs
[1:57:24] that we've kind of put up in front of
[1:57:25] them take away from the main advertising
[1:57:28] campaigns that we've had. Um I think
[1:57:30] that we can all agree that the summer
[1:57:31] visitation is something that we would
[1:57:34] like to see get risen up. Um when we
[1:57:37] look at places like Zion and Bryce,
[1:57:40] summer visitation is actually one of
[1:57:42] their their biggest seasons still. Um
[1:57:45] and so thinking that St. George is, you
[1:57:47] know, having very similar climates, you
[1:57:49] know, the summer is one of their biggest
[1:57:51] seasons. Um what Madden is uh proposing
[1:57:54] to do is a conquesting type of campaign
[1:57:58] where we're going after the same type of
[1:58:00] um visitors that Zion is going to be
[1:58:02] having. So try to get those visitors
[1:58:04] that are already coming to Zion can make
[1:58:06] sure that they come up on up here and uh
[1:58:09] visit Moab as well.
[1:58:11] Okay. I can answer questions if you guys
[1:58:12] have any.
[1:58:13] But Mike Yeah.
[1:58:15] I approved them within budget.
[1:58:18] Uh
[1:58:20] is this an extra ask or already in
[1:58:22] within
[1:58:22] >> No, this would be this would be above what's in budget.
[1:58:25] >> Got it.
[1:58:30] So pulling from
[1:58:31] advertising paid media? Correct. Yeah.
[1:58:34] And then also speaking on that, we are pushing up again on the uh um
[1:58:40] on the limit that we can hold inside the
[1:58:42] reserves for TRT. So that fund right there actually does need
[1:58:48] to be spent. So I think that if we were
[1:58:51] to try to find a place to spend some
[1:58:53] advertising funds, advertising in the
[1:58:55] summer would be the best bang for our
[1:58:57] buck. And so that's why they've
[1:58:59] identified this as a good spend.
[1:59:03] Okay. Mike. I'd like to continue on. Uh
[1:59:07] That's So the public knows that is an
[1:59:09] advertising paid media budget. Uh we are
[1:59:12] required to keep a certain under balance
[1:59:15] uh within that budget. We can't bank
[1:59:16] those funds and they were required uh
[1:59:19] under uh statutory requirement uh that they
[1:59:22] are advertising. They are paid
[1:59:24] advertising media. Right. Uh
[1:59:27] and with that I move to approve $236,000
[1:59:30] for the Moab Office of Tourism add-on
[1:59:32] summer marketing campaign.
[1:59:35] Right.
[1:59:36] Second.
[1:59:37] Okay.
[1:59:38] Any other um
[1:59:40] questions, comments?
[1:59:43] Okay.
[1:59:44] Doug. No, I don't have any.
[1:59:46] >> [laughter]
[1:59:47] >> All right. So go ahead and call for a
[1:59:48] vote. All in favor of the Moab Office of
[1:59:50] Tourism summer campaign budget
[1:59:51] recommendation. I.
[1:59:53] Okay, that passes 6-0, 6-1 absent.
[1:59:59] Chris Mr. Nielson.
[2:00:02] So number six, Moab Office of Tourism
[2:00:04] new position proposal.
[2:00:07] I'd like to make the motion to postpone
[2:00:09] this until the June 2nd meeting.
[2:00:12] Okay. Second.
[2:00:15] So the June 2nd after budget details. Is
[2:00:18] that why we're pushing it?
[2:00:19] No, just for to allow Nick time to come
[2:00:23] back.
[2:00:24] More information. More information.
[2:00:27] So and then
[2:00:29] All right, Martinez. Do you have a
[2:00:31] question, Chuck? No, it's the same thing
[2:00:32] Mike. I was just wondering why.
[2:00:34] Or I should say that. All in favor.
[2:00:38] That passes six with one absent.
[2:00:41] Commissioner
[2:00:42] Oh, sorry, Mary.
[2:00:44] You're good on that one?
[2:00:46] Yeah, I said I. I was just slow on the
[2:00:48] uptake.
[2:00:50] All right, thank you.
[2:00:51] Seven is a resolution amending the Grand
[2:00:53] County employee handbook. This is with
[2:00:55] our personnel services director Tess
[2:00:57] Barger.
[2:01:00] I'll say she's outside.
[2:01:02] She's been patiently waiting.
[2:01:06] All right, good evening commissioners.
[2:01:08] Um, so we brought before you a larger
[2:01:11] revised version of the handbook.
[2:01:15] A little over a month ago, probably
[2:01:16] closer to two months this time.
[2:01:18] It has been determined that it would be
[2:01:20] best for us to have this last little bit
[2:01:22] of additional language that
[2:01:24] limits was not accounted for in that
[2:01:27] revised handbook. Specifically,
[2:01:30] this additional language ensures that
[2:01:32] it's
[2:01:33] that any resolutions passed is made to
[2:01:37] the handbook are effective immediately,
[2:01:40] that they will
[2:01:42] that they are able to be added to our
[2:01:43] handbook and that services department is
[2:01:46] the determinant department um,
[2:01:48] specifically named to will ensure that
[2:01:50] any additional resolutions,
[2:01:53] modifications, etc. are updated within
[2:01:54] the handbook.
[2:01:57] So, just housekeeping.
[2:02:01] I I move to approve the resolution
[2:02:02] approving the revised 2026 Grand County
[2:02:05] employee handbook.
[2:02:07] Motion by Commissioner McCarty, second
[2:02:09] by Commissioner Hedler. Any other
[2:02:11] discussion?
[2:02:13] All right, seeing none, I'll call for a
[2:02:15] vote. All in favor?
[2:02:18] I.
[2:02:20] Thank you, Mary. Passes with one
[2:02:21] abstention.
[2:02:22] Six zero with one absent Commissioner
[2:02:26] McCandless
[2:02:28] absent. So, we will move on to number
[2:02:32] eight. Do you want to do a citizens to
[2:02:33] be heard?
[2:02:34] Oh, thank you, Jacques. Sure, let's do a
[2:02:37] citizens to be heard. It is 6:03 p.m.
[2:02:40] and we will continue with citizens to be
[2:02:44] heard. Those that were not able to speak
[2:02:46] earlier are welcome to do so later.
[2:02:50] Yes, ma'am. Come up.
[2:02:53] Give us your name.
[2:02:55] Name's Chris Davis. I'm a voter here in
[2:02:57] Brown County and I just have one
[2:02:59] question. What happens if the park
[2:03:01] doesn't get their 1.5 million dollars?
[2:03:07] Anyway. Jared Knight. Jared
[2:03:10] You know, we don't answer questions, but
[2:03:12] the agreement would fail. Huh?
[2:03:15] So, the agreement would fail. Okay.
[2:03:20] anybody else in the chamber like
[2:03:22] come up? Yes, sir. Oh, we've already had
[2:03:25] you up once this meeting, sir. Thank
[2:03:26] you.
[2:03:28] Um Quinn, do we have anybody online?
[2:03:35] Nobody. Anybody else in the chamber?
[2:03:41] All right, we will move forward with
[2:03:43] number eight. Jerry, you can take it
[2:03:45] back over. Um we did our 6:00 citizen to
[2:03:48] be heard.
[2:03:50] Okay.
[2:03:51] So, removal of parcels from the 2026 tax
[2:03:54] sale. So, Treasurer Chris Chris Huffman
[2:03:57] and
[2:03:58] Quick Auditor Ginger Roland.
[2:04:01] Is he here or is he hopping online? He's
[2:04:02] hopping online.
[2:04:08] Thank you. Can you hear me?
[2:04:09] Yes.
[2:04:13] So, it's that time of year again when
[2:04:15] parcels that are 5 years delinquent on
[2:04:16] their property taxes are eligible for
[2:04:18] tax sale. The tax sale has been
[2:04:20] scheduled for the later part of June.
[2:04:23] And we this year have seven parcels that
[2:04:26] are still eligible for tax sale. Five of
[2:04:28] those parcels have requested to my
[2:04:31] office to get a little bit more time to
[2:04:34] pay their taxes because they are going
[2:04:36] to have a difficult time
[2:04:38] making the deadline. We have in the past
[2:04:41] and many other counties do this as well,
[2:04:43] given people a little bit more time to
[2:04:44] pay. In this case, removing them from
[2:04:47] the tax sale for 2026.
[2:04:49] And just to make it clear, interest
[2:04:51] still accrues on their um
[2:04:54] delinquent property taxes. And if they
[2:04:57] were delinquent and eligible for tax
[2:04:59] sale in the prior year, we do not
[2:05:01] generally
[2:05:02] request that they get a second year
[2:05:05] to pay.
[2:05:06] And the two parcels that are not on this
[2:05:08] list were eligible for tax sale last
[2:05:10] year and so they will continue to be
[2:05:12] eligible for the tax sale.
[2:05:14] But we are requesting, myself and the
[2:05:16] clerk auditor, to remove these five
[2:05:18] parcels
[2:05:19] to allow the folks a little bit more
[2:05:20] time.
[2:05:28] I'm sorry. You're okay.
[2:05:30] Uh
[2:05:32] Thank you guys for working with these
[2:05:34] five people trying to get a little more
[2:05:35] time on it, but in that, I move to
[2:05:38] approve the removal of parcels from
[2:05:41] the removal of recommended parcels from
[2:05:43] the 2026 tax sale as presented.
[2:05:51] All right, any more
[2:05:52] >> [clears throat]
[2:05:52] >> discussion, questions?
[2:05:56] No.
[2:05:57] All in favor of those in favor of
[2:05:59] removal of parcels from the 2026 tax
[2:06:00] sale.
[2:06:02] I abstain. And does the against?
[2:06:09] I'm for it.
[2:06:10] You're for it? Okay.
[2:06:12] 7-0, that passes unanimously. Thank you.
[2:06:16] Number nine is dark skies reimbursement
[2:06:18] program.
[2:06:20] Brandon Blacker, code enforcement and
[2:06:21] Commissioner Hadine.
[2:06:24] Brandon online?
[2:06:25] No, I'm not there. Oh, hey. Sorry, I
[2:06:27] didn't
[2:06:28] mean to interrupt you.
[2:06:30] I was just going to be "Where's
[2:06:31] Brandon?"
[2:06:32] Thank you.
[2:06:34] Awesome. Thanks.
[2:06:35] Um
[2:06:36] So, basically just kind of a quick
[2:06:38] overview with Rocky Mountain Power to
[2:06:40] update all the street lights. They all
[2:06:42] reached out and offered all of the uh
[2:06:44] residential customers and commercial
[2:06:46] customers the opportunity to update
[2:06:48] their semi-area lights, which are
[2:06:50] basically a street light on private
[2:06:51] property
[2:06:53] um for the same cost at $210 a piece.
[2:07:00] So, trying to get as many people to sign
[2:07:01] on board while it was cheaper like
[2:07:04] we started talking and
[2:07:06] Trish and I had actually been talking
[2:07:08] for a while about starting a like a real
[2:07:10] person program as as money was
[2:07:12] available.
[2:07:14] Um and with this with this opportunity
[2:07:16] we tried to jump on it and see if we get
[2:07:17] as many people to sign up to update
[2:07:19] their lights.
[2:07:21] Um
[2:07:22] just like a rough cost comparison, the
[2:07:25] contract company per hour for in the
[2:07:28] lights installed was like $102 roughly.
[2:07:32] And Rocky Mountain [clears throat] Power
[2:07:33] was 190. So,
[2:07:36] just try to get everyone on board um as
[2:07:38] many people as as possible to try and uh
[2:07:42] help with the astrotourism.
[2:07:44] Just because of I can't remember where
[2:07:46] it was at, but there was somewhere that
[2:07:47] said that that's actually a really big
[2:07:49] push right now for the tourism industry.
[2:07:52] So,
[2:07:53] um there's a total
[2:07:56] » [clears throat]
[2:07:56] >> So, on the agenda
[2:07:58] um the total cost request was six 6,090
[2:08:03] um which would have been a total update
[2:08:05] for 29 lights.
[2:08:07] Currently,
[2:08:09] there were eight residential lights that
[2:08:11] were updated. Um eight additional lights
[2:08:14] if there was an HOA that installed the
[2:08:16] lights was approved.
[2:08:19] And three commercial lights have been
[2:08:20] updated.
[2:08:21] There are three pending residential
[2:08:24] lights
[2:08:25] and four commercial expanding
[2:08:28] um
[2:08:30] installation. And then there's one,
[2:08:32] maybe two
[2:08:34] residential that like are waiting to
[2:08:36] hear if if funding is approved before
[2:08:38] they sign up for it.
[2:08:40] Um [clears throat] and then the last one
[2:08:42] was one of the properties that was
[2:08:44] annexed in by the city down kind of like
[2:08:45] where the new apartments are going in um
[2:08:48] back by Harrison's old shop.
[2:08:50] Um
[2:08:51] So he's trying to look at it and uh
[2:08:55] take advantage of a of a of a better
[2:08:57] time to buy
[2:08:59] upgraded lights. Um
[2:09:04] What questions do you have for me? I
[2:09:06] think Bill had has had it first. Um I've
[2:09:09] got some questions more possibly for the
[2:09:12] commissioner administrator, but
[2:09:15] I know that Commissioner Hadean has
[2:09:17] already dipped into the discretionary
[2:09:20] fund when she was the one that voted to
[2:09:22] reduce it
[2:09:23] in
[2:09:24] um what maybe November, December of last
[2:09:27] year. So my question would be
[2:09:30] considering that the
[2:09:32] funds that you requested previously I be
[2:09:35] believe were for the archery center and
[2:09:37] you now have a grant for the archery
[2:09:39] center, could those discretionary funds
[2:09:42] be
[2:09:43] paid back so that we can allocate them
[2:09:46] here
[2:09:47] because um I I just can't see
[2:09:50] this working out continually dipping
[2:09:53] into a fund that you voted to reduce.
[2:09:56] So I'd like I
[2:09:57] kind of like to see if we can't go
[2:09:59] backwards here a little bit and repay
[2:10:01] that out of your grant.
[2:10:04] Mike, you first, but do you want to pass
[2:10:06] it to Trisha she can consent? Answer the
[2:10:08] question, I'll be next. I put my hand
[2:10:10] up.
[2:10:10] Okay.
[2:10:11] Mary, I'll get to you next.
[2:10:13] >> whenever you say.
[2:10:14] I'll just answer the question then I do
[2:10:16] have some comments later.
[2:10:18] Um
[2:10:18] maybe. Maybe it depends. I mean I I will
[2:10:21] state with the archery range, I've already
[2:10:28] had an individual do approximately
[2:10:32] $17,000 worth of dirt work, which he
[2:10:35] also volunteered also donated all the
[2:10:37] fuel and the transport of the traco.
[2:10:40] I've asked a lot of people.
[2:10:42] Um, and so maybe I mean, with the new
[2:10:45] budget because we were going to
[2:10:47] basically I had asked another contractor
[2:10:49] to do the fencing and we had taken old
[2:10:51] high school fencing we were going to
[2:10:52] reuse that and he was like, let's just pay fencing. So, it depends
[2:10:57] on what that Taylor fencing quote comes
[2:10:59] in at or the other quotes. Um, you know,
[2:11:02] because we did reduce we did reduce this
[2:11:05] the height of the height of the fencing.
[2:11:06] So, it's feasible. I mean, right now my
[2:11:08] budget is, you know, absorbing all of
[2:11:11] that, but it is feasible. But the one
[2:11:12] thing that that grant did do
[2:11:15] is on the capital projects list there
[2:11:17] was an ask of 10 grand for gravel for
[2:11:20] the archery range. So, that grant will
[2:11:22] remove that off that list. Um, so
[2:11:25] Yeah.
[2:11:26] So, I'm I'm feeling pretty good about
[2:11:28] the grant. We got a grant from
[2:11:30] outdoor rec to to work on that range.
[2:11:32] And so, it will take, you know, again
[2:11:34] that off the archery off that list.
[2:11:37] And then I'll I'll have some comments
[2:11:38] later on.
[2:11:39] Okay. So, maybe the the answer is maybe.
[2:11:42] Okay. And then Commissioner
[2:11:44] McCurdy and then Commissioner McGowan.
[2:11:47] Not to speak disparagingly about people,
[2:11:48] but
[2:11:49] some people were slow on that ask to
[2:11:52] replace their light.
[2:11:54] >> [laughter]
[2:11:55] >> Is there any hope for this continued to
[2:11:58] continue in the future? Or is this is is
[2:12:01] dead in the water? So, I mean, if I I
[2:12:03] thought it was a good trade-off, but not
[2:12:05] everyone, including myself,
[2:12:07] knew about it in a timely fashion. Yeah,
[2:12:09] and we were we were pretty rushed cuz by
[2:12:11] the time we the county was brought on
[2:12:12] board, the city had already been working
[2:12:14] with Rocky Mountain Power for a while.
[2:12:16] And so, we had kind of like a last
[2:12:17] minute like, "Hey, let's do this too."
[2:12:19] >> [clears throat]
[2:12:19] >> Um
[2:12:20] Uh so, Cody with County Road jumped in and started on that. Um
[2:12:24] but I talked to Hannah with Rocky
[2:12:27] Mountain Power earlier. I guess it was
[2:12:29] last week. Um we're looking at adding
[2:12:31] some shielding to a few lights in town
[2:12:33] and possibly adding some at the arena
[2:12:35] just due to some complaints for the
[2:12:38] community next door. Um and they wanted
[2:12:40] that deadline by last week for the
[2:12:42] manufacturer of those shields. Okay. Um
[2:12:46] cuz originally they were supposed to
[2:12:47] come down in March for like a second
[2:12:49] wave.
[2:12:50] So, long story short, yes, we can
[2:12:53] probably still get you hooked up. Okay.
[2:12:55] There there I I have a decent size list.
[2:12:57] There's nothing Yeah. Okay. I don't want
[2:12:59] to pay anything extra just because I was
[2:13:00] slow. But uh if they're still in a mount
[2:13:03] I would like to get in on on. Yeah.
[2:13:06] Um Mary's next.
[2:13:08] Mary McGinty. Yes. Uh I have a thought
[2:13:12] with uh
[2:13:15] in our uh Trail to Tomorrow and with the
[2:13:18] push nationally where uh
[2:13:21] we're pushing dark skies and
[2:13:24] astrotourism,
[2:13:26] I'm wondering especially now that like
[2:13:29] it was stated that we have an
[2:13:30] overabundance, we're getting close to
[2:13:33] the max that we can have in saving in
[2:13:35] our promotional
[2:13:36] TRT,
[2:13:38] I I I wonder if we could pay for these
[2:13:42] the sliding
[2:13:44] this shading and such through our
[2:13:46] promotional TRT with it being a
[2:13:51] push with
[2:13:53] uh
[2:13:54] you know, in the uh in the Trail to
[2:13:57] Tomorrow. They said this would be a
[2:13:58] really good way to
[2:14:00] help with especially summer tourism
[2:14:03] because people don't want to be out
[2:14:05] during the day, but they would love to
[2:14:07] be out, you know, in the night in the
[2:14:08] our wonderful evenings in the summer to
[2:14:11] look at the stars and gaze at things.
[2:14:14] I I think this could be a way to help
[2:14:17] offset the cost.
[2:14:21] I I think it would probably be Steven
[2:14:23] that would maybe have to look into that,
[2:14:26] but I would like to consider having it
[2:14:28] paid for out of promotional TRT if we
[2:14:31] can.
[2:14:35] Okay.
[2:14:36] And I have a couple questions on this.
[2:14:38] So, this is
[2:14:40] a light that's already on someone's
[2:14:42] proper private property, but it's
[2:14:43] basically a street light. So, it's not
[2:14:44] like their own like someone's homes.
[2:14:47] Correct. Yeah, so it's basically Yeah,
[2:14:49] basically So, the parking
[2:14:51] lot in the HOA is probably like their
[2:14:53] parking area.
[2:14:54] Um so, the HOA was down Pump Creek
[2:14:57] Drive, which is a private drive still
[2:14:59] maintained by the HOA. And so, they had
[2:15:02] a little bit different expense just
[2:15:04] because they needed to repair and update
[2:15:06] some of the the post themselves. And so,
[2:15:09] um for the most part, they're all
[2:15:12] basically the exact same that the the
[2:15:13] street lights got installed. Or if
[2:15:15] you're out at the arena, like they just
[2:15:17] updated the the tall lights on the north
[2:15:19] end of the parking lot as well.
[2:15:21] Um but yeah, these lights were
[2:15:22] pre-existing. They were the uh I can't
[2:15:25] remember the name of them, but you can
[2:15:26] see them from all the way across the
[2:15:28] valley.
[2:15:29] Um
[2:15:30] so, this kind of gets rid of that and
[2:15:32] just shines it straight down. So,
[2:15:33] there's no like side light. If you go
[2:15:35] above the golf course, there's not as
[2:15:36] much light as you look out across the
[2:15:38] valley. So, the private properties got
[2:15:40] this one-time low cost of only $210, but
[2:15:43] then we're going to you're ask we're
[2:15:44] asking the kind of inverse of those
[2:15:46] individual people for the cost of the
[2:15:48] light.
[2:15:49] Okay, just wanted to make was
[2:15:52] I read it a few times. I just wanted to
[2:15:54] double-check exactly what was happening.
[2:15:56] So,
[2:15:57] Um all right. And I think that uh Trish
[2:15:59] is next. Okay, that's her. Um
[2:16:03] You have it. So, I'm not sure question.
[2:16:04] Sorry.
[2:16:06] Oh, Trish is one. Okay.
[2:16:08] Um you know, we've Brandon and I've been
[2:16:11] talking about dark skies and code
[2:16:12] compliance as far as coming into
[2:16:14] compliance for a long time.
[2:16:17] Um
[2:16:18] this is one little kind of move in that
[2:16:20] direction and I appreciate Brandon for
[2:16:22] working on this with Rocky Mountain
[2:16:24] Power. I think it's a small ask, but it
[2:16:26] is what commission discretionary is for
[2:16:28] or for these little kind of one-offs
[2:16:30] that we didn't really foresee in the
[2:16:32] budget. You're right, I did ask for the
[2:16:35] commission discretionary budget to be
[2:16:38] diminished because
[2:16:39] we we were trying to take it up quite a
[2:16:42] bit. So, I asked that it just be pulled
[2:16:44] back to kind of the status quo. I've
[2:16:46] asked for two very small asks this year
[2:16:49] and I feel that both of them are for
[2:16:52] community [clears throat]
[2:16:53] and for people in the community. One is
[2:16:55] for an archery range for our community.
[2:16:56] We may be able to use the range
[2:16:58] hopefully for events, too, which would
[2:16:59] be very cool.
[2:17:01] Um but it's really for this community
[2:17:03] and this is just to feasibly, if we
[2:17:06] don't pass it, we won't be reimbursing.
[2:17:09] But this is I think a nice way to get
[2:17:11] people compliant and to reimburse them.
[2:17:13] It's a little little ask. These are you
[2:17:16] know, these are community asks that are
[2:17:18] very small.
[2:17:19] Brandon, did you have your hand up? I
[2:17:21] thought I saw it. Yeah, sure. Yeah, just
[2:17:22] wanted to go. So, just just looking over
[2:17:24] that right there uh um going to to
[2:17:26] Mary's comment right there. Um there's
[2:17:29] the 3A, which is the
[2:17:31] loading, right? And then there's the 3B.
[2:17:34] Um when you look at the 3B right there,
[2:17:37] it is furnishing, maintaining, or
[2:17:39] operating. And I think that this would
[2:17:41] probably then fall under the 3B category
[2:17:44] right there. That would be the
[2:17:45] separation of those two.
[2:17:47] Um you know, as far as dark sky tourism
[2:17:49] goes, I think you know that there's a huge there is there there is a
[2:17:53] big push from the state on that and I
[2:17:55] think that it's you know, something that
[2:17:56] we could definitely talk about with the
[2:17:59] tourism board. Um you know, in town, if
[2:18:01] this is something that you guys wanted
[2:18:02] to push as a campaign.
[2:18:04] Um, you know, it might even be something
[2:18:06] that you'd like to bring up in the near
[2:18:07] future as they're pushing that summer
[2:18:09] campaign right there to see if you can't
[2:18:11] get some more astrotourism involved in
[2:18:13] it. I think that's a great idea. Um,
[2:18:15] but as far as using these funds, I I
[2:18:17] think that we would definitely be
[2:18:18] stepping over that line. That's just my
[2:18:20] opinion on it. Um, but yeah, I mean, I'm
[2:18:23] supportive of it.
[2:18:25] Okay, Commissioner Winfield. Mike, have
[2:18:27] you spoke yet? I'd be number two for Go
[2:18:30] ahead and sign in before you.
[2:18:32] I would move to approve the $6,090
[2:18:35] from crew commission discretionary for
[2:18:38] reimbursement for life replacement
[2:18:41] reimbursement with the caveat that if it
[2:18:44] can re be repaid out of the artery grant
[2:18:47] that it be done so.
[2:18:51] Mike, could you second that?
[2:18:53] Uh, TRT promotional if it could come out
[2:18:56] of that.
[2:18:57] Could you add that to your so it could
[2:18:59] come out of those three funds?
[2:19:03] Um, I'd rather not. I think Brian was
[2:19:05] talking about a campaign that they would
[2:19:08] take to the team or to or to the tourism
[2:19:11] board, Mary, not this specific item.
[2:19:14] Was the way I understood it.
[2:19:18] Well, I'm just wondering if it could. I would like to get Steve to look into
[2:19:22] it cuz uh, it makes sense to me since
[2:19:25] it's
[2:19:26] a push by the state and also a push by
[2:19:30] it was mentioned in the trail to
[2:19:31] tomorrow.
[2:19:34] Well, we can always move funds around in
[2:19:36] our budget at the end of the year if
[2:19:39] David and Stephen decide if it's in
[2:19:40] that, but I think currently we're going
[2:19:42] to stick with where it's being asked to
[2:19:44] be pulled out of. Um, Mike, are you
[2:19:46] seconding? I'll second but I still
[2:19:48] >> have a comment. Okay. Mary, I know you
[2:19:49] have your hand up and I'll get to your
[2:19:51] comment after we get around cuz
[2:19:52] everybody else did speak first.
[2:19:55] I'm sorry. I forgot to lower it. I
[2:19:57] apologize.
[2:19:58] Uh Mike, go ahead. And number two,
[2:20:00] uh
[2:20:02] me and another guy in a room that really
[2:20:04] know that dark sky tourism is is a
[2:20:06] moment.
[2:20:07] Uh we
[2:20:10] should get with tourism and push a
[2:20:12] campaign. I think it would be huge. Uh
[2:20:16] with the current push for
[2:20:17] uh
[2:20:19] astro tourism. I I know that term till
[2:20:21] today.
[2:20:22] Uh but uh
[2:20:25] I I'll second Bill's motion in the fact
[2:20:27] that uh it's good that we got some
[2:20:29] people on. I'd like a better campaign
[2:20:31] out next time so more community members
[2:20:33] can take part in this also. Uh
[2:20:38] I I'm not saying that I'm happy that
[2:20:40] some did. I want I want more. If we're
[2:20:43] going to push uh different points of
[2:20:45] tourism including this, I we need to let
[2:20:47] everyone know that it's going on.
[2:20:50] And we can use our county Facebook page
[2:20:52] to do so.
[2:20:54] I'm in. Um so I had it still did anybody
[2:20:57] else want to Mary's hand I thought was
[2:20:59] up. But No. So we are going to go ahead
[2:21:02] and call for a vote. Those in favor of
[2:21:04] the dark sky reimbursement program.
[2:21:06] Those in favor? I.
[2:21:08] Okay.
[2:21:09] >> I. That was 7-0. Thank you. Brandon,
[2:21:12] thanks for coming and sorry I didn't see
[2:21:13] you. No worries. And then I was just
[2:21:15] going to just kind of do a quick little
[2:21:17] update. Um I'm planning on coming back
[2:21:19] in a little while. I know it's been a
[2:21:20] while since I've been here and kind of
[2:21:21] giving an update.
[2:21:24] But just kind of a couple things that
[2:21:25] I'm working on.
[2:21:28] Uh starting to implement the light
[2:21:29] inspections with new business licenses.
[2:21:32] Um just because that's been a
[2:21:33] requirement since the law passed in
[2:21:35] 2019. Um so I'm starting on that. I've
[2:21:38] been working with with Emily at the
[2:21:40] clerk's office. Um
[2:21:42] So that's in progress. The next is going
[2:21:45] to be building permits cuz that's
[2:21:46] another one and then conditional use
[2:21:48] permits as well. Um
[2:21:50] So just some some the I'm working on and
[2:21:52] moving forward. Um
[2:21:55] the short-term rental tracking software,
[2:21:59] we just had the training with um Gov OS,
[2:22:03] which has changed to Numa.
[2:22:05] Um and so, like I'm actually like in the
[2:22:08] process of getting the data That's
[2:22:10] great.
[2:22:10] >> compiled to send to them. They started
[2:22:12] tracking about mid-April, so there's not
[2:22:14] much data for this year just because
[2:22:15] they were trying to get this program up
[2:22:17] and running.
[2:22:19] That's great. Um
[2:22:21] and then we still have access to um
[2:22:23] through the state,
[2:22:25] but it's restricted. It shows the whole
[2:22:27] state, so I can't search just Grand
[2:22:29] County.
[2:22:30] Um
[2:22:31] so I'm I've I've reached out and asking
[2:22:33] for like clarification what it would
[2:22:35] take for that. Um
[2:22:37] Numa?
[2:22:38] What is their acronym or what's their
[2:22:40] Oh, that's just their name. N U M O.
[2:22:42] Yeah. Okay. Yeah, Numa.
[2:22:45] Um
[2:22:47] Thank you.
[2:22:48] Yeah, and so So, that's still work in
[2:22:50] progress. Um I mean, just kind of a
[2:22:52] heads-up like there's been an increase
[2:22:54] in cases regarding shipping containers.
[2:22:57] Um so, I'm reaching out to different
[2:23:00] agencies across the state getting
[2:23:01] information from them on what their
[2:23:03] rules are regarding shipping containers.
[2:23:06] Um
[2:23:07] recently clarified with Mr. Stocks that,
[2:23:09] you know, they are
[2:23:11] considered buildings and can't be in the
[2:23:12] setback.
[2:23:14] Looking to add verbage to our our land
[2:23:16] use code that
[2:23:18] clearly states like where and how they can be used.
[2:23:22] Um looking [clears throat] at color, you
[2:23:23] know, max number of shipping containers,
[2:23:26] uh restricted on the front side of the
[2:23:28] property, just different things like
[2:23:29] that moving forward just for the like
[2:23:30] the quality of life
[2:23:32] for it, so.
[2:23:33] Um it's kind of a rough outline.
[2:23:37] Still doing the the other code
[2:23:38] enforcement cases as well. I've just got
[2:23:40] a like a mix of those. Um
[2:23:43] so.
[2:23:44] Okay. I think Commissioner Martinez has
[2:23:46] another question. Thanks.
[2:23:47] Yeah, question comment. Um when you go
[2:23:49] through that Gov OS, did you guys Were
[2:23:51] you guys aware of 10 8 8 5 that passed
[2:23:55] in 2025?
[2:23:57] No. Okay. Well, maybe we we can have a
[2:23:59] quick chat about that. So, there was a
[2:24:01] new law that passed um in 2025 that
[2:24:05] helped with the um
[2:24:07] well, the uh
[2:24:10] looking after folks that are that are
[2:24:12] advertising on other websites. So,
[2:24:16] rather than just using the Gov OS, you
[2:24:18] can actually now go ahead and look on
[2:24:19] Airbnb or VRBO or Rent-A-Tent or any of
[2:24:23] those types of things. And before that
[2:24:25] wasn't That wasn't enough to actually
[2:24:28] the citation, but that has changed now
[2:24:30] so that you can go ahead and and do the
[2:24:32] citations. We get together and you can
[2:24:34] look at that or you can look at that.
[2:24:35] And so, that was 10 8 is Yes, Kia. 10 8 5. Okay.
[2:24:41] And that was hunting them down via their
[2:24:43] listing. I mean
[2:24:44] >> Yeah, I thought we had that on a
[2:24:45] commission meeting where we all were
[2:24:46] agreeing that that was something that we
[2:24:48] wanted to go ahead and not just have it
[2:24:50] by um
[2:24:51] complaints, but be able to you know,
[2:24:54] proactively Yeah. Yeah, so that is one
[2:24:56] that's proactively enforced. Um
[2:24:59] the band just wasn't there for the the
[2:25:00] Gov OS
[2:25:02] as they started tracking me today.
[2:25:06] The training was last week. And so, I
[2:25:08] just hadn't had the experience out
[2:25:10] there. And then
[2:25:11] for the the Granicus software that's
[2:25:13] provided by the state, like it's
[2:25:14] literally one like I have to zoom in on
[2:25:16] a map and just like scroll and click on
[2:25:18] a little button and see instead of like
[2:25:20] being able to compare like submit a list
[2:25:22] of business licenses and
[2:25:23] cross-references with with these
[2:25:25] listings type of a thing.
[2:25:27] Um so, just
[2:25:29] a tedious way to work um just kind of
[2:25:31] while the other platform was down. So,
[2:25:34] um
[2:25:35] with both of those up and running, then
[2:25:36] you know, we're going to hit the hammer
[2:25:38] hard and and see if we can get like a a
[2:25:40] comparison of apples to apples instead
[2:25:42] of like the state
[2:25:45] site being the entire state that we have
[2:25:47] to sort through, um, see what it would
[2:25:49] cost
[2:25:50] to adjust just to Grant County. Um,
[2:25:53] and look at that. And so, that way we
[2:25:55] can, you know, if we can save money by piggybacking off the state and the
[2:25:59] software that they're using, then I
[2:26:00] think that'd be a a viable option. So.
[2:26:03] Okay.
[2:26:06] Neither.
[2:26:13] All right, number 10 is our STAR Grant
[2:26:15] ABC Tavern.
[2:26:32] All right, so I included a staff report
[2:26:34] in here, so I'm just going to kind of
[2:26:35] give you guys an overview on what has
[2:26:37] happened with this particular, um, grant
[2:26:41] applicant. And Stana is here, she will
[2:26:43] come up to speak after I'm finished. Um,
[2:26:46] so in 2022, we had the STAR Grant, um,
[2:26:50] program. Many people applied.
[2:26:53] This ABC Tavern was one of them. They
[2:26:55] were awarded $100,000, um,
[2:26:58] to open a cafe and some other things.
[2:27:01] Um, there has been work done on since
[2:27:05] then, there's been work done. Um, it's
[2:27:07] sort of stalled out in a
[2:27:11] in the site plan process with within
[2:27:13] planning. Um, and so, we've had a few
[2:27:16] meetings with different members of the
[2:27:17] commission and applicant and, um,
[2:27:20] planning and zoning. And we thought that
[2:27:22] it would probably best to just put it in
[2:27:26] front of you guys and let you decide how
[2:27:28] we should move forward. Whether we
[2:27:30] should,
[2:27:31] um, recall the grant, ask for the money
[2:27:34] back,
[2:27:35] um, or extend sort of the deadline for
[2:27:38] um, forward movement on this. Um,
[2:27:41] the applicant has has provided a lot of
[2:27:45] information to the county on things that
[2:27:48] have been done.
[2:27:50] Um, but there's a disconnect on things
[2:27:52] that actually that the county needs to
[2:27:54] move forward. And that is sort of where
[2:27:56] we've um, come to this impasse is we
[2:27:59] need a site plan. We need to move
[2:28:01] forward with um, the process in planning
[2:28:04] and zoning to get the next steps and
[2:28:07] it's just sort of stalled out for quite
[2:28:09] some time. So, that's why it's in front
[2:28:11] of you.
[2:28:12] Um, did you guys have any specific
[2:28:14] questions for me before I invite Al come
[2:28:16] up and then I think Steven has a couple
[2:28:18] things to say as well.
[2:28:21] Go ahead, Steven. I don't think I don't
[2:28:23] see any questions from us.
[2:28:25] And I can address this at the end. So,
[2:28:27] after Ms. Carey presents.
[2:28:32] And then do you want to come up and
[2:28:33] speak? Sure.
[2:28:41] So, I'd never written a grant before, so
[2:28:43] it was scary and exciting and I was
[2:28:45] really pleased to
[2:28:47] get awarded grant. Um, first thing was
[2:28:51] is they said that I would not receive
[2:28:53] any funds until my water was turned on.
[2:28:56] And so, that took about a year. Uh,
[2:28:59] right then there. Although, I was
[2:29:01] continuously
[2:29:03] doing what I had written on grant. And
[2:29:05] there were three things. Basically was
[2:29:07] to get rid of the uh, update the
[2:29:10] inventory or the product or the the
[2:29:13] stuff in the building. The second one is
[2:29:15] to uh, give a new face lift to the
[2:29:18] property. And the third one what let's
[2:29:21] see, it was um,
[2:29:23] employ um, Thompson Springs people. And
[2:29:27] I've done all three of those things. Um,
[2:29:30] waiting for the architect.
[2:29:34] Um,
[2:29:36] it was definitely a miscommunication
[2:29:38] with Jim Dressler.
[2:29:40] Uh, I told him that I when he went to
[2:29:42] the building department that I wanted to
[2:29:43] be there. He had two meetings without me
[2:29:46] and he used a um, a program that uh,
[2:29:52] surveyor or
[2:29:53] uh, architects use,
[2:29:55] which is a standard form and when I
[2:29:58] started to read over it, I realized
[2:30:00] there were a lot of gross mistakes. One
[2:30:02] of them was that um, he said I needed 56
[2:30:06] parking spaces
[2:30:08] uh, for the cafe that hold like 36
[2:30:11] people.
[2:30:12] He had people down in my basement, which
[2:30:14] means you have to go into the kitchen,
[2:30:16] lift up a
[2:30:17] uh, the floor, climb down a ladder and
[2:30:20] you could serve four people to eat
[2:30:22] there.
[2:30:23] And the same thing with the um, in the
[2:30:26] white house, uh, he had
[2:30:28] one or two people there and and so, you
[2:30:31] know, I started to go over all these
[2:30:33] things that were
[2:30:34] you know, stock standard stuff. The same
[2:30:37] thing with the bathrooms, they weren't
[2:30:39] big enough for ADA.
[2:30:40] I had um, I had taken some uh, um,
[2:30:48] graphic stuff in college.
[2:30:50] Um, I graduated and our college didn't
[2:30:52] even have computer system. That's how
[2:30:54] old I'm 75 years old.
[2:30:56] And so, I learned how to do architect
[2:31:00] by hand and so, I did it in graph paper
[2:31:02] and I gave it to Jim beforehand. He
[2:31:04] goes, "Oh, this is great."
[2:31:06] If you look at his plans, he doesn't
[2:31:07] have any measurements on any of my
[2:31:09] building, any of the buildings. And so,
[2:31:11] that's another graphical error that he
[2:31:14] had made. Um, soon after
[2:31:17] I had talked to him about some of the
[2:31:19] things that we needed to
[2:31:20] uh,
[2:31:22] go over or change, he said he'd just
[2:31:24] gotten hired from a building a company
[2:31:27] in Salt Lake City and that he wouldn't
[2:31:29] be able to continue on.
[2:31:31] So, that was the first architect. The
[2:31:33] second architect, um
[2:31:35] she said, "Well, I'm really busy right
[2:31:37] now. I can't do anything till January."
[2:31:40] And this was in January, February,
[2:31:42] March, April, May. So, I had to wait all
[2:31:44] that time to get the And [clears throat]
[2:31:47] at the same time during this time I
[2:31:49] didn't have the grant money because my
[2:31:51] water wasn't turned on.
[2:31:53] And so, and that was the TSS D decision.
[2:31:57] It wasn't
[2:31:58] my decision.
[2:32:00] Um
[2:32:01] So, in January I called her and she
[2:32:03] said, "I just lost an employee and I've
[2:32:05] got some really big projects, so I can't
[2:32:07] do yours." I went through five different
[2:32:09] architects
[2:32:10] um before
[2:32:12] uh you know, I I started to move forward
[2:32:15] on it. So, it's been I've gone through
[2:32:17] some challenges and some difficultness.
[2:32:19] I could have spent the money
[2:32:22] really quickly on all the products, but
[2:32:24] I kept waiting and waiting and waiting
[2:32:26] to make sure that
[2:32:28] um
[2:32:28] I was going through the process.
[2:32:31] Uh one of the big
[2:32:32] hassles that I had was that
[2:32:34] um
[2:32:35] the planning and zoning said that they
[2:32:37] needed to rezone the property to
[2:32:40] commercial. And it originally was
[2:32:42] commercial and I was paying commercial
[2:32:43] taxes, but it was changed to
[2:32:46] um residential because
[2:32:48] the highway had changed to I-70.
[2:32:51] So, that was another hurdle that um they
[2:32:54] said if you want to wait, it won't cost
[2:32:56] you anything, but it's going to be 2
[2:32:57] years to do it. So, I spent the money on
[2:33:00] a on a um
[2:33:02] to request a zone change even though I
[2:33:05] was paying
[2:33:06] commercial taxes on it.
[2:33:09] Uh so, I've had a lot of different
[2:33:11] things put in front of me that has
[2:33:13] slowed me down. Finally last year I just
[2:33:15] figured, "You know what? I know I need
[2:33:17] this equipment. I've been showing out
[2:33:20] money out of different accounts to pay
[2:33:22] for stuff. I'm just going to start
[2:33:24] buying the big equipment. So I got ADA
[2:33:26] toilets, ADA sinks, ADA
[2:33:28] urinals,
[2:33:30] touchless
[2:33:32] hand wash systems for the employees,
[2:33:35] new ice machine,
[2:33:37] new refrigerator for bottled and and
[2:33:40] canned soda,
[2:33:42] a table, a heat lamp,
[2:33:44] larger sink for
[2:33:47] washing vegetables and pots and pans. A
[2:33:50] lot of this stuff I paid actually cuz I
[2:33:52] knew I had $100,000 left.
[2:33:55] And one of the other things was is I got
[2:33:57] a electrical permit, which was great.
[2:34:00] But within
[2:34:01] a month or so, the guy that owned the
[2:34:03] company died. His wife was going through
[2:34:06] a divorce, so she took all of his
[2:34:08] equipment and put it at a yard sale. So
[2:34:10] they sold all my equipment. So I had to
[2:34:13] call ADA A&E, and they ended up
[2:34:17] finishing up the job for another
[2:34:18] $15,000. So I paid once one time to have
[2:34:22] everything changed over, and now I paid
[2:34:24] it a second time.
[2:34:25] And so I paid that out of my own funds.
[2:34:29] And then
[2:34:32] So I you know you guys have been
[2:34:35] beaten up. I'm not trying to beat you
[2:34:37] up, but it's it's been a struggle for me
[2:34:39] for this. We had
[2:34:42] two county commissioners come to the
[2:34:44] TSSUD meeting with a sheriff and Steve
[2:34:48] Stocks and said, "You need to turn
[2:34:50] Santa's water on." So after turned the
[2:34:52] water on, then I started to move forward
[2:34:54] and continued to buy all the internal
[2:34:57] equipment that I needed. Star Grant,
[2:35:00] like I said,
[2:35:02] issues three different projects, which
[2:35:06] if you look at the grant
[2:35:11] it states
[2:35:13] the different things. And if you look
[2:35:15] and I can email you the photographs of
[2:35:17] the before and after of all the
[2:35:18] buildings, uh
[2:35:20] um, the different
[2:35:22] structures that we've worked on.
[2:35:25] Um, that you know, you know, planting
[2:35:27] flowers and you
[2:35:28] >> [clears throat]
[2:35:29] >> I think it was either 11 or 13 junk cars
[2:35:31] off the property and recycled them and
[2:35:33] we've been just recycling, recycling, And
[2:35:36] you know, um, we have
[2:35:38] um,
[2:35:40] booths that were all ripped and torn and
[2:35:42] cracking and broken and we I replaced
[2:35:44] them and I paid for all that. We have
[2:35:47] ADA tables and chairs. I have 100 500 lb
[2:35:52] chair that I bought because they're once
[2:35:55] in a while you get somebody who's
[2:35:56] really, really big. Um, and there's
[2:35:59] nothing more embarrassing than going
[2:36:01] into a place and having a chair break on
[2:36:02] you. And I've been into meetings where
[2:36:05] that's happened to heavy people. And
[2:36:07] each one of the booths got another
[2:36:09] chair, a big chair in the side of it so
[2:36:12] that if someone can't slide in the
[2:36:14] booth, they've they've got the chair
[2:36:15] right there on the side.
[2:36:18] So, I've been
[2:36:20] um, and then the same thing with uh,
[2:36:22] getting rid of all the junk and some of
[2:36:25] the painting and the different things
[2:36:26] like that. I've hired all um,
[2:36:30] Thompson Springs people. So, you know,
[2:36:32] I'm definitely satisfied. Never once put
[2:36:35] in the um, grant that it was contingent
[2:36:39] on opening.
[2:36:41] It was contingent on
[2:36:43] uh, getting getting the place cleaned
[2:36:45] up, uh, getting it a facelift and
[2:36:48] employing uh, employees. Sure, I do want
[2:36:52] to have it open and I want to I want to
[2:36:54] I put the sign up that we're going to
[2:36:55] open in 2023. But, uh, there's been a
[2:36:58] change of planning and zoning,
[2:37:02] um,
[2:37:02] I think four times since I started this.
[2:37:05] And so, each time it's starting right at
[2:37:07] the beginning or, you know, a
[2:37:09] miscommunication. So, it's been that's
[2:37:12] been another thing that has uh
[2:37:16] been a a hurdle. And every day I'm not
[2:37:18] open and I'm paying for it through my
[2:37:20] own funds, not not the grant funds.
[2:37:23] There's about $30,000
[2:37:25] that I have left through the account,
[2:37:28] which I waited because I need the new
[2:37:30] septic tank. Needs to be pulled out,
[2:37:33] filled in, and a new one put in.
[2:37:35] Um
[2:37:36] need to have a new
[2:37:38] uh hood with a fire suppression system.
[2:37:41] And those are probably going to eat up
[2:37:42] the rest of the
[2:37:44] uh the uh the $30,000 that
[2:37:47] um
[2:37:48] I probably put about 50 or 60,000 of my
[2:37:51] own money into it. And if you need I
[2:37:53] don't want to get you guys in trouble
[2:37:55] because this grant's been going on and on. If you need to call it back, Um
[2:38:00] you know, here's the bank statement. I
[2:38:02] haven't bought anything since um
[2:38:05] January. It's I have $30,000 left. If
[2:38:08] you want the 30, I'll give it. If you
[2:38:10] want the 100, I'll give you the 100. You
[2:38:12] know, I got other places I do get funds
[2:38:14] from, uh other businesses. I'm not
[2:38:16] looking to get you guys in trouble and
[2:38:18] with grant program. But, you know, I'm
[2:38:22] I've had a lot of struggles and that
[2:38:23] that's basically what my problems have
[2:38:26] been. So, if for some reason I don't
[2:38:29] qualify, it doesn't in the grant say it
[2:38:31] has to be done in a certain period of
[2:38:33] time, but I know you want to get it
[2:38:34] done.
[2:38:35] Um
[2:38:36] so, I've done everything the grant has
[2:38:38] that I've written up the grant for that
[2:38:39] I got a proof for. But, the problem is I've just been hitting
[2:38:43] a bunch of um
[2:38:45] you know, blockades. That's basically.
[2:38:47] And I'm going to email each one of you, know, here are the employees
[2:38:52] somewhere in here.
[2:38:54] You get this one.
[2:38:56] Uh the junk that we've had in the the
[2:39:00] different projects that we've been doing
[2:39:02] in planting flowers and mowing lawn.
[2:39:03] Right now, my lawnmower's broken, so I
[2:39:05] need a new lawnmower.
[2:39:06] Um so, we got a few leaks in the front
[2:39:08] of the building.
[2:39:09] Um
[2:39:10] Yeah, I specifically I don't think
[2:39:11] anyone's Okay. I don't think anyone's
[2:39:13] Whatever. um
[2:39:15] concerned that you're not that you've
[2:39:16] done anything illegal. Yeah, we Yeah, we all know it.
[2:39:20] I think we have some Stephen Oh, Stephen
[2:39:23] has his hand up. Stephen was going to
[2:39:24] comment and I think his and Chris's are
[2:39:26] have some questions. Okay, let's go. I'm
[2:39:28] good either way. I know a lot of you.
[2:39:30] It's not going to affect my friendship
[2:39:32] at all, you know, I know you need to do
[2:39:33] what you need to do.
[2:39:35] I've had a lot of black You know, I'm
[2:39:37] not being lazy by any
[2:39:39] means.
[2:39:40] You know, I just um
[2:39:42] You know, I just uh it's just the way it
[2:39:44] is. It's I would rather be open and
[2:39:46] making money instead of not being open
[2:39:48] and costing me more money. There's no
[2:39:50] money revenue coming in, basically.
[2:39:54] So, there you go.
[2:39:58] Okay, Stephen, go ahead. Okay. Um, so we
[2:40:01] had the I think both Commissioner
[2:40:04] McCandless and Commissioner Winfield at
[2:40:05] one point um both attend meetings. One
[2:40:07] of the things that we've we've had a
[2:40:09] little bit of difficulty with
[2:40:11] was getting the paperwork finalized.
[2:40:14] And we brought together Commissioner
[2:40:16] McCandless, as well as the applicant,
[2:40:18] Chrissy Hoffman, and myself, the entire
[2:40:20] building department, the entire uh
[2:40:22] planning department uh to sit down and
[2:40:24] kind of identify where the issues were needed, and what things need to be
[2:40:29] done, site plan, etc. And then we set a
[2:40:32] follow-up date. My difficulty was that
[2:40:35] between those two meetings we didn't get
[2:40:37] the site plan submitted, and we didn't
[2:40:38] get the process continued on.
[2:40:40] I I know this is
[2:40:42] uh
[2:40:43] Thompson's a complex, complicated area.
[2:40:46] I think that it's a unique area. I It is true that um myself and law
[2:40:51] enforcement had to go sit out at the the
[2:40:53] water department meeting. Um, we didn't
[2:40:56] we we encouraged them to make the
[2:40:57] correct appropriate action. Um, and it's
[2:41:00] been difficult. This project contract
[2:41:03] original contract period
[2:41:05] was supposed to originally have ended on
[2:41:07] June 20th of 2024. We're now into 2026
[2:41:11] and we still don't have a site plan. And so those were some of the issues
[2:41:16] that we've been struggling with. We want
[2:41:17] to provide as much support as possible.
[2:41:20] But it's it is difficult when we when we
[2:41:23] do have a meeting, we bring all the
[2:41:24] department heads there that we need to
[2:41:26] have that action and that change that's
[2:41:28] necessary. And then in a follow-up
[2:41:30] meeting
[2:41:31] we don't have that change that's
[2:41:32] necessary.
[2:41:33] And so from from my point, there is some
[2:41:36] paperwork that still needs to be resolved to move the project
[2:41:40] forward. But at a certain point it is
[2:41:42] hard.
[2:41:44] I'll reach out and and then we'll see a
[2:41:45] flurry of action, a flurry of emails,
[2:41:47] and I know the commissioners have
[2:41:48] received those. And then it'll fade into
[2:41:50] the background, and then it'll be
[2:41:52] brought up again in a flurry of emails
[2:41:54] and actions. And and this year was kind
[2:41:56] of another final attempt to try to see
[2:41:59] if we could get all the tools and
[2:42:01] personnel available to help assist it.
[2:42:04] And we just didn't see that that
[2:42:06] finalized. So that was just the
[2:42:08] information I wanted to add.
[2:42:10] There was a site plan delivered by Jim
[2:42:13] Dressler, the very first
[2:42:16] um
[2:42:17] within the first few months before I
[2:42:18] even got my water done. And that's when
[2:42:21] he decided to take this other job. So
[2:42:24] and I have it and the problem is is I'm
[2:42:27] not computer literate. I'm like your
[2:42:30] grandmother.
[2:42:31] >> [clears throat]
[2:42:31] >> And so I have photographs and documents,
[2:42:35] and I've got three things this big that
[2:42:37] I've been, you know, And chair
[2:42:40] work. Yes. And and that site that site
[2:42:42] plan that was delivered by by that
[2:42:44] individual, that was back in 2024,
[2:42:47] right?
[2:42:48] No, it was uh 20 right after I got the
[2:42:50] grant. Okay, even earlier than then. And that's that's kind kind some of the
[2:42:55] issue that we've had is we've we've had
[2:42:57] documents and then they just sit idle.
[2:43:00] And so then when we sat down earlier
[2:43:02] this year to have the meeting to kind of
[2:43:04] see what we needed to identify,
[2:43:06] we listed all those concerns, we
[2:43:07] exchanged contact information, um and they listed out what what we needed
[2:43:12] to see.
[2:43:13] And so it's not about what was
[2:43:15] originally filed, it was just like from
[2:43:17] this year we kind of started with clean
[2:43:18] slate and then saying, "Hey, let's let's
[2:43:20] get the final documents going and and we
[2:43:22] just we didn't achieve that."
[2:43:24] Right. Yeah, and so I have so many
[2:43:27] documents on all this stuff that it
[2:43:29] wouldn't your um computers wouldn't take
[2:43:32] it all. It kept bouncing off cuz you
[2:43:34] gave me a a list of the stuff I needed
[2:43:37] to submit, and I submitted all that
[2:43:39] stuff and it bounced back and I talked
[2:43:42] to the building department and said,
[2:43:45] "This is what This is my problem I'm
[2:43:47] having." So I put it on a thumb drive
[2:43:49] and they said, "No, we couldn't accept
[2:43:51] thumb drives." So they recommended I go
[2:43:53] to the library. So I went to the library
[2:43:56] and they put it all on there and it
[2:43:58] bounced it off again. And so then I went
[2:44:00] to Sean who is the
[2:44:03] I guess the engineer and uh he ended up
[2:44:06] putting it on his computer. So
[2:44:10] um but there's so much there, you know,
[2:44:12] when we were talking, we'd bounce from
[2:44:14] one topic to the other and not really
[2:44:16] open everything up so that you could see
[2:44:18] the information. But yeah, there was a
[2:44:20] site plan. I have a
[2:44:22] site plan for the already completed with
[2:44:25] the um septic, but you can't get into it
[2:44:26] because I can't download it cuz the
[2:44:29] files are too big and the same thing
[2:44:31] with
[2:44:32] um
[2:44:34] I have the information for the the um
[2:44:38] the
[2:44:38] uh hood and the um fire suppression
[2:44:41] system, but it's the same thing. All my
[2:44:44] files are way too big and I even JPEGed
[2:44:46] everything uh thinking that that might
[2:44:48] help because everything was in Word
[2:44:50] document. And so I spent
[2:44:53] almost a month going through all my
[2:44:54] files to change it so it would get into
[2:44:57] the file. So,
[2:44:59] um yeah, no, I'm not there yet. If if
[2:45:02] you know, I could spend the $30,000
[2:45:04] tomorrow,
[2:45:05] you know, on just equipment uh to finish
[2:45:08] up the the thing, but it doesn't mean
[2:45:10] the doors are going to be open. Yeah,
[2:45:12] you know, it's not going to be open
[2:45:14] until this until you have that plan into
[2:45:17] Well, I need a new I need a new site
[2:45:19] plan because the gym's was incorrect,
[2:45:22] and I can send you that and you can see
[2:45:24] 56 parking spots
[2:45:27] on a commercial um property? Yeah, we
[2:45:29] got to start over on that. I think that
[2:45:31] Mike had a had his hand up. I'm going to
[2:45:33] let Mike go.
[2:45:35] Is the property zoned commercial as of
[2:45:37] right now? Yes. Okay. It was zoned that
[2:45:39] way.
[2:45:40] That was the first thing I did.
[2:45:41] >> rezoned So, you couldn't be paying
[2:45:42] commercial taxes.
[2:45:43] >> back in back in '22 before the um grant
[2:45:47] was
[2:45:47] approved or not. If you had to spitball,
[2:45:50] I know I know this is a spitball, how
[2:45:53] long would it take to uh
[2:45:55] in your mind, how long would it take to
[2:45:57] finalize the paperwork if provided a
[2:45:59] list and a clean slate today?
[2:46:01] The paperwork on the spending of the
[2:46:02] grant or the fund work? Uh
[2:46:05] My grant didn't say the doors will be
[2:46:07] you know, I'm doing it to have the doors
[2:46:09] open. It It said three specific things.
[2:46:11] And and that I could probably within a
[2:46:13] week get the rest of the $30,000.
[2:46:17] I mean, I've probably spent I don't
[2:46:19] know,
[2:46:20] 80,000 of my own money.
[2:46:23] I I very I trust me when I say I know
[2:46:25] the cost of opening a restaurant. Yeah.
[2:46:27] Uh I can only say
[2:46:30] uh
[2:46:32] the follow-through on the paperwork, uh
[2:46:34] that's what I was asking on the
[2:46:35] spitball. If you had 3 months more,
[2:46:38] could we could we get to that point
[2:46:39] where a site plan would be As long as I
[2:46:41] can get an you know, I've had um
[2:46:44] uh what's his name, Smith do one for the
[2:46:47] um
[2:46:48] for part of the I I too I too like you
[2:46:51] can
[2:46:52] draft by hand. Yeah. I learned before
[2:46:55] computer taught me. Yeah. Uh
[2:46:58] if it comes to it, we can sit down and
[2:47:01] draft a site plan by hand.
[2:47:04] Right. Well, I I'd be willing to throw
[2:47:06] my time to help you out. But I need to
[2:47:07] know if we could do that work in the
[2:47:09] next couple of
[2:47:09] >> out a site plan
[2:47:11] on PDF. Stop that. This Just really
[2:47:14] quickly. So, because this is a
[2:47:15] commercial space, it's going to require
[2:47:17] a specific kind of site plan that would
[2:47:19] be um
[2:47:21] that would include engineering.
[2:47:23] Like it would be a drafted site plan.
[2:47:25] It's a commercial space. So, it can't be
[2:47:29] a site plan that's just, you know,
[2:47:30] drawn. It does require a little bit
[2:47:32] >> We could get an architectural stamp, I
[2:47:33] understand. But we had a discussion
[2:47:35] I just wanted to make sure that that was
[2:47:37] clear before we I know what you're
[2:47:38] talking about. went down a a path that
[2:47:41] And Jim did do that, and he gave it to
[2:47:44] Bill. You know, and we had multiple
[2:47:47] discussions, and I would start think I'd
[2:47:49] go there and say, "Do I need a permit to
[2:47:52] do a
[2:47:53] ADA ramp on the front of the building?"
[2:47:56] And he goes, "No, he goes, "No, you
[2:47:57] don't." The next day, I I hired some
[2:48:00] people to start drilling the uh steps up
[2:48:03] and getting ready to lay the forms, and
[2:48:06] I get a phone call from planning and
[2:48:07] zoning saying, "Stop what you're doing.
[2:48:09] Um we
[2:48:11] uh we want to talk to you more about
[2:48:13] it." And then that person, you know,
[2:48:15] left, and so we've been walking over
[2:48:17] rubble the whole time. I understand that, and no one I don't
[2:48:20] think anyone's benefiting if we don't
[2:48:23] get those doors open. All right. Return
[2:48:24] back to what Mel was saying. Especially
[2:48:26] me. Especially Thompson, especially you,
[2:48:28] especially
[2:48:29] >> money every day that it's not open. Yeah. I
[2:48:33] get that. I think Bill had a comment. I
[2:48:35] saw Brian's hand. Or Doc. Yeah.
[2:48:38] Um
[2:48:39] my own
[2:48:40] Go Go Okay, thank you.
[2:48:42] Um
[2:48:43] first off, I I've got to
[2:48:45] I've been part of this since the very
[2:48:46] beginning. I was part of that start
[2:48:47] grant
[2:48:49] board that awarded Santa the
[2:48:51] uh grant to begin with. And and when the
[2:48:54] five of us There was a It was a It was a
[2:48:55] great board. There was some good good
[2:48:57] folks on it, but um
[2:48:59] this was This was honestly the project
[2:49:01] that we were absolutely most excited
[2:49:03] about on that on that board. I think it nailed all the all the
[2:49:08] aspects of what we wanted that start
[2:49:10] grant program to be about as far as
[2:49:12] economic development goes and going into
[2:49:13] other parts of the county. Um and and supporting
[2:49:19] So, it was a It was It was a good start.
[2:49:22] I was also on the Thompson Water Board
[2:49:23] when we
[2:49:24] you know, we we Bill came up and that
[2:49:26] was That was great and Stephen as well.
[2:49:28] We made sure that you got this ERUs that
[2:49:31] you were entitled to, Santa. Um
[2:49:34] And it's it's been a long time.
[2:49:37] >> [laughter]
[2:49:38] >> And and I know you've had you've had so
[2:49:40] many headwinds and it's and it's it
[2:49:43] it's like everything that could go wrong
[2:49:45] has gone wrong and I I feel for you.
[2:49:47] It's a really
[2:49:48] tough position to be in and it would be
[2:49:50] really cool to have that cafe open out
[2:49:52] in Thompson. Um but at the same time, I mean I think I think
[2:49:59] Mike was asking the question that I
[2:50:01] really
[2:50:02] wanted to ask too. Like like honestly if
[2:50:04] you really look at this in the process
[2:50:05] and your capacity and everything, like
[2:50:07] how how long do you really think it
[2:50:08] would take you to fulfill the terms of
[2:50:10] the of the grant like going forward? I
[2:50:13] Are we closer or is
[2:50:15] Cuz we we've sat down. Bill and I have
[2:50:17] been on a couple of of calls with
[2:50:19] Stephen and we've talked about it and we
[2:50:21] really like the project, but it's it's
[2:50:23] There there There just comes a time when
[2:50:25] you know, you know what I'm saying, but
[2:50:28] um
[2:50:30] Yeah, so yeah, I mean do you do you do
[2:50:32] you think you're
[2:50:34] that closer or we
[2:50:36] kicking the can down the road again. And I know this is probably really
[2:50:40] stressful for you, too. So, it's Yeah,
[2:50:42] and it's might be better to do it
[2:50:44] >> What you requested from the grant, I
[2:50:45] fulfilled all those things. Everything
[2:50:47] I've written down I need the grant for,
[2:50:49] I've completed.
[2:50:51] As far as the site plan goes, we when I
[2:50:53] first started, we handed in the
[2:50:55] document.
[2:50:57] Um now it has to be downloaded. So, I
[2:50:59] need to have somebody else
[2:51:01] um you know, do it. And that's been a
[2:51:03] really difficult problem because
[2:51:05] everybody says I'm so busy doing hotels,
[2:51:06] I don't have time for that. I can't even
[2:51:08] get new glass that's broke, that's
[2:51:10] shattered
[2:51:12] from Rick's Glass. He said, "Oh, sure.
[2:51:14] I'll I'll um
[2:51:15] get a
[2:51:16] uh order it for you, but I'm not putting
[2:51:17] it in." How am I going to put a 4 by 8
[2:51:19] piece, three 4 by 8 pieces of glass in a
[2:51:24] window?
[2:51:25] Unless you're a professional. So, I've
[2:51:27] either got to go to Price or I've got to
[2:51:28] go to Grand Junction. No, I I I I
[2:51:30] understand, Sayda. We can There's a lot
[2:51:32] of contractors
[2:51:34] that won't even do anything there
[2:51:36] because it's out of it's out of town.
[2:51:38] So, yeah, I've been I've had a lot of
[2:51:40] different varieties of struggles. And
[2:51:42] so, it's kind of to the point I don't
[2:51:44] want to get you guys in trouble. If you
[2:51:46] need to put the money somewhere else, if
[2:51:48] you need to put the balance of the money
[2:51:49] somewhere else, or if you need to put
[2:51:50] the whole thing,
[2:51:52] I have the money to cover it
[2:51:54] um one way or another. I don't I'm not
[2:51:56] going to feel
[2:51:58] any animosity or whatever. You know, um
[2:52:02] I've been
[2:52:04] you know, um
[2:52:05] I mean, every every time I'm up there
[2:52:07] people say, "When are you going to uh
[2:52:08] when are you going to supply and
[2:52:09] coffee?" You know, "When are you going
[2:52:10] to open?" And people, you know, it's a
[2:52:12] truck stop. Well, I don't have a uh
[2:52:13] It'll be It'll be Come and get a meal.
[2:52:15] They don't want to eat They're trucking
[2:52:16] out of the 7-Eleven. So,
[2:52:19] yeah, I've uh you know, they laugh. I
[2:52:21] see the signs that say, "So, can be open
[2:52:23] 2023." We're in 2026. It's like,
[2:52:27] you know,
[2:52:28] Okay, I think I I think that they'll
[2:52:30] have a comment. I see Steven's hand,
[2:52:31] Mary's hand. So, we're going to go move
[2:52:33] around with these Mr. Chairs. Go ahead,
[2:52:36] Bill. So, I'm in agreement with Jacques.
[2:52:38] We've had a lot of meetings about this.
[2:52:40] We've had several with county attorney.
[2:52:43] My interest is not
[2:52:46] in anything other than seeing a
[2:52:47] restaurant open. And I think we need
[2:52:50] some clarification. I know Mike's kind
[2:52:53] of asked around about question and even
[2:52:55] Jacques around about me. I want to know
[2:52:57] when the doors are going to be open.
[2:52:59] That's where I am. And not when you're
[2:53:02] going to get the site plan and all of
[2:53:04] these things. I'm a little bit
[2:53:06] curious and I I wish we would have had
[2:53:09] Mr. Um
[2:53:10] Jackson here to to get his opinion on
[2:53:13] how do we move this through in a more
[2:53:16] timely manner. I want to see a
[2:53:18] restaurant open in Thompson Springs.
[2:53:21] My recommendation is going to be
[2:53:24] that we put a hold on the 30K.
[2:53:27] Or that we have the 30K returned that's
[2:53:30] sitting there.
[2:53:31] Not to take it away, but to
[2:53:34] I I don't know how to motivate you
[2:53:36] saying that to open the restaurant cuz
[2:53:38] that's what I want. That's all I want.
[2:53:40] It's to see a light on and people in
[2:53:42] Thompson Springs. And I think that's as
[2:53:44] he said the board's motivation, too. So,
[2:53:47] it's I I know that you're frustrated and
[2:53:49] you have issues with computers, but
[2:53:52] go to the college and hire somebody and and get this dealt with. I mean
[2:53:58] Well, I I
[2:54:00] had five different
[2:54:03] um architects.
[2:54:04] I I understand all that, but I think
[2:54:07] I'd take a sixth one.
[2:54:09] I was hoping it would happen that first
[2:54:11] year in in January and the site plan.
[2:54:14] And that's what's holding me up is the
[2:54:16] site is finding someone that will
[2:54:18] complete it. Well, and you mentioned
[2:54:21] friendship. I think everybody in here I
[2:54:23] don't I don't know of a commissioner
[2:54:24] that wouldn't say that we want to be
[2:54:26] your friend or that we already are your
[2:54:28] friend, right? But we also have a
[2:54:30] responsibility to the taxpayers and the
[2:54:33] restaurant is 2023 is 6 years behind
[2:54:37] being open or excuse me, 3 years behind
[2:54:39] being open. And I want to help that
[2:54:41] happen, you know.
[2:54:42] And anybody has any suggestions or
[2:54:44] ideas, um I'm open to it, but I think
[2:54:48] we've got to do something. Okay, so you
[2:54:49] need the site plan.
[2:54:52] And you need it by a professional
[2:54:55] architect. I have the site plans.
[2:54:58] Uh I hand drawing and I have Jim's which
[2:55:00] are incorrect.
[2:55:02] Um I need to hire another person to do
[2:55:05] site plans cuz basically to start moving
[2:55:08] forward is is basically what it is.
[2:55:11] I'm at a loss of knowing who
[2:55:14] I'm going to be willing and can do it.
[2:55:16] Belong to Mary. We got a couple more
[2:55:17] hands up. We're going to Mary, Stephen,
[2:55:18] Trish to see what they have to say,
[2:55:21] okay? Go ahead, Mary. I think there's a
[2:55:23] couple things that everybody's concerned
[2:55:25] about. One is getting the restaurant
[2:55:27] open and two is not having
[2:55:30] uh the money
[2:55:31] that the county gets either the
[2:55:34] restaurant opens or we get reimbursed
[2:55:37] the money.
[2:55:38] Could we put a I mean, Stephen, this is
[2:55:41] probably for you uh a lien on the
[2:55:44] property so that that wouldn't stop her,
[2:55:47] wouldn't cost any money for but it would
[2:55:50] say no, but it would
[2:55:53] guarantee us
[2:55:56] that if it ended up being sold or such
[2:55:58] that we would get our money back.
[2:56:03] Theoretically, you you'd need Yeah, you need it needed to be voluntary
[2:56:07] unless we're looking at
[2:56:09] um a different process. But yeah, it's
[2:56:11] theoretically possible. So she could put
[2:56:13] a lien voluntarily put a lien on her
[2:56:15] property to for the $90,000.
[2:56:19] You you theoretically could do that, but
[2:56:22] I
[2:56:22] Yeah, there's some there's some issues
[2:56:24] in that because it then it encumbers the
[2:56:26] property and makes it harder for her to
[2:56:28] utilize
[2:56:30] any of the equity that she has in the
[2:56:31] property to get any additional funding.
[2:56:33] Oh, okay. I was I was just trying to
[2:56:35] find a way to
[2:56:37] move forward cuz I think this is a real
[2:56:40] I think we all want it open, but we also
[2:56:44] are concerned that it's not going to
[2:56:45] open.
[2:56:49] Did you have another comment as well?
[2:56:51] Yep, just super quick. Um
[2:56:53] re- reopening the cafe was was the
[2:56:55] language that was used in the
[2:56:56] application. It has its six different
[2:56:59] locations. The summary in the original
[2:57:01] contract does say that the goal is to
[2:57:02] reopen the cafe in in Thompson.
[2:57:06] Um I just note that but that the
[2:57:08] applicant said otherwise. Um I pulled
[2:57:10] the
[2:57:11] 2023
[2:57:13] agenda summary and it has that
[2:57:15] information there. Um I don't know what
[2:57:17] else we can do to help the applicant. We literally grouped everybody from both
[2:57:21] departments
[2:57:23] in a room, gave all the connections
[2:57:25] possible. So, if the commission wants to
[2:57:27] give a really hard serious deadline, we
[2:57:30] can definitely do that.
[2:57:32] But I I don't know how how else we can
[2:57:34] help the applicant. Um other individuals
[2:57:37] in this community are able to do site
[2:57:39] plans, are able to process that through.
[2:57:42] Um I know Thompson's a unique place, but
[2:57:44] we we do have we do receive site plans
[2:57:46] from Thompson. And so, if that's the
[2:57:48] place the commission wants to go, clear
[2:57:51] direction for the applicant, and she's
[2:57:53] in contact. We've provided the contact
[2:57:56] for everybody in the building
[2:57:56] department, planning department um for
[2:57:58] that to be done. And I've made it clear
[2:58:01] when I attended the meetings, and I
[2:58:03] think the chair, the vice chair, Ms.
[2:58:05] Hoffline, and myself, when all of us
[2:58:06] attended, we expressed that it was our
[2:58:09] goal and support, and we wanted to see
[2:58:11] that this program finalize,
[2:58:13] but I don't know what else the county
[2:58:15] can do to be helpful.
[2:58:18] Patricia had her hand up.
[2:58:20] Um
[2:58:21] and yeah, this is it is not very fun.
[2:58:23] So, the the 30k part of the 90.
[2:58:28] Yeah, well, yes, and I believe that
[2:58:31] there's been 20 withheld or was it only
[2:58:33] 10?
[2:58:34] >> 10 10 10
[2:58:34] >> withheld. So, there's 10 that we have
[2:58:37] not given.
[2:58:38] Um and then um I believe that we've been
[2:58:40] informed that there's 30 in an account.
[2:58:43] Okay. So, um there is a separate Okay.
[2:58:46] in the in the Please bear with me.
[2:58:48] Sorry, sir. January hasn't changed at
[2:58:50] all except for the um uh septic uh
[2:58:55] contractor that's has done that and I
[2:58:57] paid to get it approved by the
[2:58:59] um
[2:59:00] uh Orion. So, it's been paid and paid
[2:59:02] for that.
[2:59:03] You know, the
[2:59:05] So,
[2:59:06] it's the only thing that's been paid for
[2:59:08] out of that account since January.
[2:59:11] So, my recommendation would be to and
[2:59:13] you know, it is what it is, is to revoke
[2:59:15] the remaining 30 and put in lien the
[2:59:17] property for um the other 60. And that
[2:59:22] way if the property is sold, so, you
[2:59:24] know, maybe she I I don't know.
[2:59:25] It's
[2:59:26] I I hate to to put the burden on her to
[2:59:29] give us, you know,
[2:59:31] 90k back.
[2:59:33] But it that in that way liening the
[2:59:36] property, the you know, if the property
[2:59:38] is sold, we will get paid back.
[2:59:41] Are you making a motion?
[2:59:42] >> a motion.
[2:59:44] Well, Sure, I'm going to make a motion,
[2:59:46] but I agree, Stephen, if I guess we can
[2:59:48] ask for a voluntary lien. Well, let's
[2:59:51] maybe if if that's the route the
[2:59:53] commission wants to go, we can talk
[2:59:54] about that. Essentially, the request is
[2:59:56] to return the 90 to return all funds
[2:59:59] provided to the applicant, period.
[3:00:00] However, the county gets that back, we
[3:00:02] can talk with the applicant if that's
[3:00:03] the motion that wins today.
[3:00:05] >> Okay. I can't Okay, I got you.
[3:00:07] >> I have a problem with the brightness,
[3:00:08] so, Andy.
[3:00:12] I do. Okay. Well, I have funds in other places that I've been Okay, got
[3:00:17] you. putting into this. So, no, I can
[3:00:19] write a check tomorrow. Tonight, I don't
[3:00:21] have the the uh print the account here
[3:00:23] with me, but it's this account right
[3:00:25] here, and I will
[3:00:27] write it for 90,000 if that's makes if
[3:00:30] it makes you move on and you know, move
[3:00:33] forward.
[3:00:34] But Like I said, I know grants are a
[3:00:36] little tricky and I'm not trying to
[3:00:40] I don't want to get into I guess I'm in
[3:00:41] your shoes. You want to go ahead and ask
[3:00:42] your trouble here? Did you want to go,
[3:00:43] Mike?
[3:00:44] I had a question, but
[3:00:46] No, but she can make a motion. She can
[3:00:48] make a motion. We can talk about it. I
[3:00:49] can talk I move to revoke the grant
[3:00:51] award to ABC Tavern LLC in the amount of
[3:00:54] $90,000.
[3:00:56] I'll second.
[3:01:01] Keep it Keep it going.
[3:01:03] And um let's see. I mean, Brian,
[3:01:06] go ahead and speak.
[3:01:08] And you said I read that the I I have
[3:01:10] application and um we went out to the uh
[3:01:12] um
[3:01:14] Canyon Spirit, you know, that was out
[3:01:16] there. And that was the first time that
[3:01:17] I actually really saw that Oh, yeah,
[3:01:18] that's where this this restaurant was
[3:01:20] going to be. They have that whole new
[3:01:21] thing. And just reading through your
[3:01:23] application, I was really bummed that we
[3:01:24] don't get to have the bubble gum blowing
[3:01:27] contest. Right? That was the I can
[3:01:29] hardly hear you. I said the bubble gum
[3:01:31] blowing contest that you listed in that.
[3:01:33] I mean, that sounded really fun. I I I
[3:01:35] really do. I think it would be amazing
[3:01:36] to see a restaurant out there. Um So,
[3:01:40] why do you think I invested this kind of
[3:01:41] money in it?
[3:01:42] >> Yeah. And and I just had a couple
[3:01:44] questions real quick. Um this was the
[3:01:46] STAR grant. And I'm I'm not
[3:01:48] I think this was before I was a
[3:01:50] commissioner. Did you write these
[3:01:51] contracts?
[3:01:53] I wrote the STAR contract. Yeah.
[3:01:55] And I I
[3:01:57] did on three
[3:01:58] >> like for all of us. Job
[3:02:00] >> I think he's asking Steven. Steven wrote
[3:02:01] the contract. Steven, were you were you
[3:02:03] the attorney that wrote the contract?
[3:02:06] No.
[3:02:07] Oh, okay. That's what I just was I was
[3:02:09] saying. And this was one that came
[3:02:11] This was This was This came from the TRT
[3:02:14] right here. It came from Monday, but it
[3:02:16] was previous It was the one that got
[3:02:18] canceled by 426. And on economics Yeah,
[3:02:21] the economics verification. Got it. I
[3:02:23] just want to get the background. I was I
[3:02:25] wasn't here when all this went down, so
[3:02:27] I'm just trying to First timeline, it
[3:02:28] was awarded, I believe, they were
[3:02:30] awarded in December. They entered into
[3:02:32] their contracts later, but the contracts
[3:02:34] were
[3:02:35] um written and approved under County
[3:02:37] Attorney, I believe. 202022
[3:02:40] was the year that it was.
[3:02:42] Okay. Thank you for that. But I didn't
[3:02:44] get the I got the grant, but I didn't
[3:02:47] get the funds until 2023.
[3:02:50] May 17th, 2023, the intensive
[3:02:54] TSSG
[3:02:55] uh wouldn't turn my water on.
[3:02:58] And my next question is, you know, if if
[3:03:01] the county had written contract, I would
[3:03:02] just kind of ask, you know, why we
[3:03:04] delivered these types of funds without the um
[3:03:09] you know, the work being done. Why we we
[3:03:10] front-loaded It was much cash out. It
[3:03:12] was 90% the way the way it was
[3:03:14] structured, it was you were giving them
[3:03:16] 90% to to to get a to get a start on
[3:03:18] things. It was to stimulate
[3:03:21] economic development, and then it was
[3:03:22] 10% on the back end.
[3:03:24] Got it.
[3:03:25] Okay. Cool. Thanks, Chuck. Yeah.
[3:03:28] Mike.
[3:03:29] I'd like to make a secondary motion.
[3:03:31] Or a Yeah, secondary motion.
[3:03:34] Uh I'd move to extend the contract by
[3:03:37] uh term by end of year
[3:03:40] 2026 to give the grantee
[3:03:43] additional time to comply with the
[3:03:45] contract with the caveat that the grant
[3:03:48] awarded to ABC Thompson LLC
[3:03:51] in the amount of $90,000 will be
[3:03:52] returned upon failure of contract
[3:03:55] completion.
[3:03:57] Um um the contract completion she keeps
[3:04:00] stating doesn't require her to open her
[3:04:02] doors. So, I think you need to clarify
[3:04:05] that you want the doors open if that's
[3:04:07] what you mean. Steven has said that the
[3:04:10] doors are the business functioning. What
[3:04:12] was the exact term used there, Steve?
[3:04:14] Okay. So, couple couple thoughts. If
[3:04:17] it's the commission's intent to
[3:04:18] re-engage in a contract and extend out
[3:04:20] the period of time, I'm more than happy
[3:04:22] to work with the applicant to get the
[3:04:23] language done if you guys indicate
[3:04:25] that's what you want to see as a
[3:04:26] contract amendment. We can do that.
[3:04:28] However, what I'm what I'm requesting
[3:04:31] that the commission require is that the
[3:04:34] applicant provide a site plan. That's
[3:04:37] we we need to have a date where that is
[3:04:40] due because we keep having these
[3:04:42] meetings and the site plan keeps not
[3:04:43] being
[3:04:44] provided and and that's the thing that
[3:04:47] we originally set the the meeting at the
[3:04:49] beginning of this year to achieve
[3:04:51] even despite our best efforts
[3:04:53] that never happened.
[3:04:55] So, if the commission's intent is to
[3:04:56] say, "Hey, we want you guys to take
[3:04:58] another look at this,
[3:04:59] do an amendment to the contract and and
[3:05:01] sit down and and really set a deadline
[3:05:04] for that
[3:05:05] to be done, we can do that. Um but
[3:05:07] without a hard deadline for that site
[3:05:09] plan
[3:05:11] I think we're going to find ourselves
[3:05:12] back here in
[3:05:14] a handful.
[3:05:15] Question, that site plan is required uh
[3:05:17] for the business to open up according to
[3:05:20] the contract?
[3:05:22] It's the next step in the plan in the
[3:05:24] process that the planning The planning
[3:05:26] has to sign off on it to open the doors.
[3:05:28] Yeah. Yeah, I mean that's the next step.
[3:05:30] It's it's already within that timeline
[3:05:32] of the end of the year. Building
[3:05:34] department has the site plan, but it's
[3:05:37] not on computer.
[3:05:38] >> Then we'll get him another one. I'll
[3:05:39] help you do it. Okay.
[3:05:42] Yeah, because I But we only have to my
[3:05:44] motion, I only have to the end of the
[3:05:46] year.
[3:05:49] It's just that need to have the site
[3:05:52] plan in your motion. It sounds like from
[3:05:55] Steve, Mike.
[3:05:56] You need to mention that say a new site
[3:05:58] plan. has to be done such and such a
[3:06:01] time.
[3:06:05] I thought that was encompassed in the
[3:06:06] year date end date.
[3:06:08] A site plan.
[3:06:10] It's part of the doors opening.
[3:06:13] Be very specific. Here's here's going to
[3:06:15] be the difficulty again. It's part of a
[3:06:17] bigger process. The site plan is just
[3:06:19] the next step. There there are more
[3:06:21] things that will be need to be done
[3:06:22] before this is open. I mean, in a
[3:06:25] perfect world and and Chrissy Chrissy,
[3:06:27] let me know on on my time frame. I'm
[3:06:30] thinking that if she provided the site
[3:06:32] plan,
[3:06:33] you're still going to need
[3:06:36] another 90 to 120 days to finalize
[3:06:38] everything.
[3:06:40] Is that is that too generous on the time
[3:06:42] frame or or too restrictive, Chrissy?
[3:06:45] Well, so a a site plan would would
[3:06:47] be sent and then um I there will be a
[3:06:50] DRT
[3:06:51] um
[3:06:53] a meeting. I mean, I would say
[3:06:56] optimistically, the planning process is
[3:06:59] going to be 3 months.
[3:07:01] Yeah. Um and that is if this happens
[3:07:04] immediately. Like if we get the site The
[3:07:06] site plan that I've seen the site plan
[3:07:07] that has been provided to me
[3:07:10] is not what the planning commission or
[3:07:11] the planning department needs. Um I'm
[3:07:14] assuming that to get that site plan,
[3:07:16] it's going to be 6 weeks. You hire
[3:07:18] someone or or like a month to 6 weeks.
[3:07:21] They're going to draft your site plan.
[3:07:23] It's going to be sent to you know, go
[3:07:25] through DRT. It's going to be sent to
[3:07:26] Shums Coda.
[3:07:28] And then um they can begin to get your
[3:07:30] building permits and etc. etc. Um
[3:07:34] that's going to be
[3:07:37] 3 months very optimistically. Um
[3:07:41] and then it would be, you know, getting
[3:07:43] a septic tank in there, getting I mean I don't think that
[3:07:48] I don't see that there's any way that
[3:07:49] the the restaurant will be to by the end
[3:07:51] of the year. Um maybe, I don't but it to
[3:07:56] me it that seems really optimistic that
[3:07:58] the restaurant would be open by
[3:07:59] December. But if you if that's what you
[3:08:01] guys want to do
[3:08:02] >> I hope it's by March.
[3:08:04] Uh Yeah. I think that I think that maybe
[3:08:07] the contract could include the timeline,
[3:08:09] Steven. Uh the contract amendment could
[3:08:12] include the timeline in that. If the
[3:08:14] commission's okay with us drafting the the contract amendment, then we can
[3:08:18] move forward with the commission in turn
[3:08:21] uh to finalize the document. We'll have
[3:08:22] the chair ratify it and
[3:08:24] uh work work out the logistics with the
[3:08:26] applicant.
[3:08:29] And so Steven, you would just make sure
[3:08:31] that the contract will be having a site
[3:08:34] plan, correct? Yeah, Chris and Chris and
[3:08:37] I would work to set different benchmarks
[3:08:39] to help encourage compliance throughout
[3:08:41] the process to get it moving through the
[3:08:42] end of the year.
[3:08:44] So can I use the same Jim Dressler's
[3:08:47] site plan with an amended amendment of
[3:08:50] stuff that And you need to use
[3:08:53] You have the um
[3:08:55] Okay. So his isn't good anymore.
[3:08:59] That one is good. Yeah.
[3:09:02] I'm going to I'm trying to draft the
[3:09:03] motion. Yeah.
[3:09:05] Okay.
[3:09:07] And if that's the goal of the
[3:09:08] commission, we might be able to just
[3:09:09] move forward with the the vote and move
[3:09:12] it along. I mean, I think we're going to
[3:09:13] have a substantial number of questions
[3:09:15] between the applicant and my office.
[3:09:20] Okay. Did we get a second on yours? I'll
[3:09:23] second all of these stuff. I'll second on the motion. Okay, we're going
[3:09:27] to go ahead and call for a vote. Who
[3:09:29] voted against You um You we state the
[3:09:32] motion.
[3:09:33] All of Steven's stuff.
[3:09:36] End of the year.
[3:09:36] >> It's like what I think the motion says
[3:09:38] is
[3:09:39] from what I'm understanding you're
[3:09:41] wanting us to make uh Steven is to uh
[3:09:45] move forward with a new contract with
[3:09:48] deadlines that have to be made.
[3:09:50] And I think part of that contract will
[3:09:52] be if these things aren't if each
[3:09:55] milestone isn't made, then then the
[3:09:59] money will be asked to be brought given
[3:10:01] back.
[3:10:02] Is that what you're thinking?
[3:10:04] And make sure
[3:10:06] to develop a new contract
[3:10:07] >> He's going to strike this. Yes, so Brian
[3:10:09] going to make substitute motion. We're
[3:10:11] going to see if it fits everything that
[3:10:12] Stephen needs in it, okay?
[3:10:14] I motion to extend the contract for the
[3:10:16] term of December 31st, 2026
[3:10:20] to give the grantee additional time
[3:10:23] to comply with the site plan
[3:10:26] or
[3:10:28] return any
[3:10:30] return
[3:10:32] the grant fund amount of $90,000.
[3:10:37] By a due What do I have a time frame?
[3:10:39] >> You said it's for the for the return of
[3:10:40] the money?
[3:10:42] I think that the return of the money or
[3:10:43] the site plan would be due December
[3:10:45] 31st, 2026.
[3:10:48] Does that Does that hit it?
[3:10:50] No. If it hits it with that,
[3:10:52] guys. The site plan is just another
[3:10:54] step. It doesn't get hurt to the open I
[3:10:57] think we'll have to go ahead and
[3:10:58] drop that.
[3:11:00] I think what we do is say that uh
[3:11:04] we postpone
[3:11:06] until we have a new contract
[3:11:10] written for us to look at and approve.
[3:11:14] That so that
[3:11:15] Can we do that, Stephen? Just postpone
[3:11:17] this.
[3:11:18] And and direct staff to get a contract.
[3:11:22] I think you see most of our intent on
[3:11:24] that one.
[3:11:25] Is that what we wanted to do?
[3:11:27] I I can I can do any of those any of
[3:11:30] those options. I
[3:11:31] Yeah. And the only the only to to come
[3:11:34] up with until you sit down and kind of
[3:11:39] made a map of what's happening, I don't
[3:11:41] think we could make a motion that would
[3:11:42] fit that, but we can make a motion to
[3:11:44] postpone and have a contract back
[3:11:47] brought back to us.
[3:11:48] Would that work?
[3:11:50] I'll second Mary's motion, if that was a
[3:11:52] motion.
[3:11:53] Yes, I make a motion that we postpone
[3:11:55] and have
[3:11:57] a contract brought back to us
[3:11:59] uh
[3:12:01] in a timely fashion.
[3:12:03] This intent Sure, I'll second that.
[3:12:07] He's gone. Okay, all in favor?
[3:12:10] I.
[3:12:12] Opposed?
[3:12:13] Okay.
[3:12:14] That passes 7-6-1 with Michelle
[3:12:17] abstaining. So
[3:12:18] Thank you. You have a list of um site
[3:12:20] plans.
[3:12:21] Good luck writing all this down. I have
[3:12:22] a list of my plans. Bring it back. I'll
[3:12:24] make a phone call tomorrow morning.
[3:12:29] » [clears throat]
[3:12:31] » No, you don't. We're going to move on to
[3:12:36] Mike's going to help you find somebody
[3:12:37] to do your site plan. Yeah. He said he
[3:12:39] was really Thanks.
[3:12:41] That's what I need. I got about three
[3:12:42] people Okay.
[3:12:43] >> I can think of right now that are
[3:12:46] looking for projects
[3:12:47] and
[3:12:48] Utah architectural uh
[3:12:52] Perfect.
[3:12:52] >> qualify. Perfect.
[3:12:53] >> How long dated? I don't know.
[3:12:55] You have to text me in Utah. Okay. Do
[3:12:57] you want my business I have to mean go
[3:12:59] out and give her some My business card.
[3:13:01] I will give you my contact information
[3:13:03] in mere minutes. Okay.
[3:13:05] The next one is the ordinance
[3:13:08] for Grand County's clean energy program.
[3:13:11] And this is something that I've been
[3:13:12] working on for the whole time that I've
[3:13:14] been on the commission and I think that
[3:13:17] I've been updating all of you along the
[3:13:19] way and you already like our
[3:13:21] commissioners that were here prior
[3:13:22] obviously knew what was going on
[3:13:24] with that.
[3:13:25] So I I think I put a really good summary of
[3:13:29] what's going on. Um
[3:13:31] Did I put the slides? I don't know if I
[3:13:32] have the slides in the packet.
[3:13:35] If anyone has any questions, I'm just
[3:13:37] waiting.
[3:13:39] Yes, can I can I speak?
[3:13:42] Yes.
[3:13:44] I want to begin with by saying uh
[3:13:48] Melody, thank you very much for taking
[3:13:49] this on.
[3:13:51] I I was part of it beginning and it was
[3:13:54] a very complicated and and
[3:13:57] involved process and I appreciate that
[3:14:00] you were
[3:14:01] you know, tackled it and I would like to
[3:14:04] make a motion motion to I move to
[3:14:06] approve the ordinance enacting the Grand
[3:14:09] County Community Clean Energy Program.
[3:14:13] Thank you, Mary, and I'll second to
[3:14:14] that.
[3:14:16] Is there any other discussion?
[3:14:18] Brian? [clears throat]
[3:14:19] I just like to reiterate what Mary had
[3:14:22] said.
[3:14:23] Um, I know that that Melody, when you first took this on right here
[3:14:26] that you were you were this was not one
[3:14:29] of your main interest or it was not
[3:14:30] something that you had a lot of
[3:14:32] knowledge in it. And I know that you
[3:14:33] spent a lot of time getting yourself up
[3:14:36] to speed and becoming very knowledgeable
[3:14:37] in this and and and you did great work.
[3:14:41] When we were up
[3:14:42] at the legislature this year speaking
[3:14:44] with both Hankins and Monson, they
[3:14:47] mentioned, you know, the amount of
[3:14:48] communication that you had back and
[3:14:50] forth trying to get this passed with the
[3:14:53] opt out rather than the opt in. I know
[3:14:55] that that was
[3:14:57] one of the sticking points of getting
[3:14:58] this through. So, I just want to
[3:15:00] congratulate you you on all the work
[3:15:02] that you did on that. So, thank you.
[3:15:06] No.
[3:15:07] Yes, also actually I started this,
[3:15:09] passed it off to Melody. When she came
[3:15:12] on as a commissioner still was working
[3:15:14] with Summit County on this. I can't even
[3:15:16] remember the lady's name that was in
[3:15:17] charge of it up there. Emily. Emily,
[3:15:20] there she go. But yes, I think this is a
[3:15:22] good program. I know we've had multiple
[3:15:24] emails that have come in in support of
[3:15:27] this. I think we
[3:15:28] had one person said they were willing to
[3:15:31] pay more
[3:15:32] than they than the allotted amount.
[3:15:35] Um so it's clearly got some interest in
[3:15:37] a good way and I think with the
[3:15:40] option to opt out for people that do not
[3:15:44] want to support it, why that that gives people a way out if they
[3:15:48] don't want to be a part of it. So I'm
[3:15:50] very supportive of it.
[3:15:52] Yes.
[3:15:53] Stephen has his hand up. Stephen, go
[3:15:55] ahead. And chair, just just a quick
[3:15:57] note, these are probably de minimus
[3:16:00] expenses on the contract on 7.2.
[3:16:04] It lists out the obligations for the
[3:16:05] county. It says the county shall pay for
[3:16:08] the third party
[3:16:09] uh
[3:16:11] expertise contracted in connection with
[3:16:13] the program's development and initial
[3:16:15] approval by the commission and then
[3:16:17] proportional costs associated with the
[3:16:20] RMP providing the notices to Grand
[3:16:23] County's customers and then the
[3:16:25] termination costs not paid by a
[3:16:27] participating customer.
[3:16:29] I I don't know if there's an estimate or
[3:16:31] if other counties have seen the costs.
[3:16:33] Again, they might be de minimus or they
[3:16:35] might be smaller amounts. I'm just
[3:16:37] noting those for the commission.
[3:16:39] And I I don't know how much they would
[3:16:40] be.
[3:16:45] That was a lot of word salad there.
[3:16:47] Uh
[3:16:47] does that mean county's going to pay for
[3:16:49] people who opt out? Mhm.
[3:16:52] No. That Okay. Just want to make sure of
[3:16:54] that.
[3:16:55] No, it's just it's in in certain
[3:16:58] circumstances like
[3:16:59] it's on page eight of the contract
[3:17:02] section seven 7.2.3.
[3:17:06] Termination charges not paid by a
[3:17:08] participating customer shall be incurred
[3:17:11] or shall be included in the uh
[3:17:13] participating customer rates. That won't
[3:17:14] be paid by the county, but then the
[3:17:16] items above it, those three items
[3:17:19] um pay proportional costs associated
[3:17:22] with RMP providing the notices to Grand
[3:17:25] County's customers as discussed in
[3:17:27] section two above. But I was just noting
[3:17:29] those things
[3:17:30] for the county. I don't know exactly how
[3:17:32] much those are.
[3:17:34] I think that's the mailer that will go
[3:17:35] out to the customers to notifying them
[3:17:39] when it's that 90-day or the 90-day time
[3:17:43] frame that they're going to be so it's a
[3:17:44] it's going to be a mailing cost.
[3:17:46] And I did see the city's
[3:17:51] mailing cost. I think they figured out
[3:17:53] about $2,000.
[3:17:56] Okay. Yeah, and sometimes sometimes when
[3:17:58] the treasurer or the clerk send out some
[3:18:01] of the notifications, there's a way that
[3:18:03] they've piggybacked them on other items
[3:18:05] to save money as well. And so if there
[3:18:07] is already a notice that that worked out
[3:18:11] that can be sent out.
[3:18:14] Okay. Mary has her hand up, too.
[3:18:17] Okay, I just yeah, want to move the
[3:18:18] meeting on, but I wanted to say this has
[3:18:20] really been a very, very long process.
[3:18:22] It started under Zachariah Levine and
[3:18:25] myself and we worked on it and then when
[3:18:27] Sarah Stocks came on, she with her
[3:18:31] scientific background and such, she
[3:18:34] really started moving it forward. I
[3:18:36] mean, it's taken This is one of those
[3:18:39] things that it's taken a belly gin a
[3:18:43] sense to come to fruition. And Melody,
[3:18:46] thank you for bringing it across the
[3:18:48] finish line.
[3:18:52] So yes, we will have to send out those
[3:18:53] mailers. So we'll figure out how to how
[3:18:55] do you do that?
[3:18:57] And it is opt-out program. So those that
[3:18:59] don't want to be involved with it and it
[3:19:01] is create the purpose of it is to create
[3:19:04] new energy. It's not just like people
[3:19:06] that have solar panels,
[3:19:09] they wouldn't be included in this. So
[3:19:10] they already have their own clean
[3:19:12] energies and they're not on that power
[3:19:14] grid right now. So they wouldn't be
[3:19:16] paying this $4 on their their bill. Just
[3:19:19] regular power customers that don't opt
[3:19:22] out.
[3:19:23] This gives everybody the option. So, all
[3:19:26] right. So, we had a Do we have a motion?
[3:19:29] Yes. [clears throat] Yeah. I got it.
[3:19:31] Motion by Mary and a second by Bill.
[3:19:34] Okay.
[3:19:35] All in favor?
[3:19:38] All right. I.
[3:19:39] It passes 7-0. Thank you.
[3:19:42] And I'm sure there'll be plenty more
[3:19:43] work to do in that group.
[3:19:46] So, the work is not over, but thank you.
[3:19:48] And number 12 is the
[3:19:50] appointment of commissioners to the boat
[3:19:52] ramp working group.
[3:19:53] Yes, this is
[3:19:56] um an item that pertains directly to the
[3:19:59] Moab boat ramp uh close to the
[3:20:01] pedestrian bridge.
[3:20:03] There's a working group that is being
[3:20:06] put together and that group will assess
[3:20:09] the viability and funding sources to
[3:20:11] complete the project. Um
[3:20:14] our recommendation is to appoint two
[3:20:16] commissioners to that board.
[3:20:19] Um it will be
[3:20:22] other partners will be BLM, National
[3:20:24] Park Service, U dot,
[3:20:27] City of Moab, Utah State Parks, just to
[3:20:29] name a few. So,
[3:20:30] this may very well be um
[3:20:34] a little bit of a lengthy process or a
[3:20:36] lot of applicants and
[3:20:39] stakeholders. So, I think it would be
[3:20:41] good to have two commissioners.
[3:20:43] Go ahead, set up and then shock.
[3:20:45] Um
[3:20:47] the motion says to approve the
[3:20:50] assignment of
[3:20:52] commissioner as in singular.
[3:20:56] Um so, I was going to make the motion
[3:20:59] based off of that for Commissioner
[3:21:00] Martinez with his river experience, but
[3:21:03] if there's somebody else that has a
[3:21:05] desire to participate, I'll make the
[3:21:07] motion
[3:21:09] to add a second one. I would love to
[3:21:11] participate. I mean, I feel like I've
[3:21:13] written a couple grants now with um
[3:21:15] outdoor rec and and would be happy to
[3:21:18] help, right? You know, I'd love to be
[3:21:20] involved in this. And was around with Alyssa and John when they, you
[3:21:25] know, put that site plan together and so
[3:21:28] I if you're psyched if you're good with
[3:21:29] that, Brian, I I'd be psyched.
[3:21:32] I move to approve the assignment of
[3:21:34] Commissioner Hadene and Commissioner
[3:21:36] Martinez to the boat ramp working.
[3:21:40] Second. Okay, we have a first And then
[3:21:43] did you have a comment, Zack? No. Okay.
[3:21:45] I was going to make that motion, but
[3:21:47] Bill beat me to it. All right, do we
[3:21:48] have any more discussion? Just real
[3:21:50] quick, I just want to thank
[3:21:51] uh Christian administration for carrying
[3:21:54] this on and getting us here.
[3:21:56] Um I think this is something that that
[3:21:57] folks here in Grand County been wanting
[3:21:59] for a long time. So, it's it's great to
[3:22:01] see some access and I can't think of a
[3:22:03] better timing than right now, especially
[3:22:05] with what's happening up at Flaming
[3:22:07] Gorge. I think there's going to be a lot
[3:22:09] of talk with the funding of that boater
[3:22:11] access
[3:22:12] um for ramps. That's that's going to be
[3:22:14] coming up, so. And and Mr. Hall, our
[3:22:17] associate administrator,
[3:22:19] has been instrumental and and he'll be
[3:22:21] involved as well. So, we appreciate
[3:22:23] >> This meeting's on the 27th and you
[3:22:24] already
[3:22:25] >> Put it down already. Got it. Thank you
[3:22:27] guys.
[3:22:28] >> [clears throat]
[3:22:28] >> All right, all in favor?
[3:22:30] I.
[3:22:31] All right, that passes 7-0. Thank you.
[3:22:33] Okay, now we're going to go back to H
[3:22:35] on our consent agenda, the Moab Office
[3:22:39] of Tourism contract renewal with Camp
[3:22:42] Stories Public Relations. I believe that
[3:22:44] this has not gone through legal, so if
[3:22:46] we pass it, we need to say pending legal
[3:22:49] as well as pending um
[3:22:52] that it's gone through
[3:22:55] our purchasing
[3:22:57] policy.
[3:23:00] Go ahead, Brian.
[3:23:01] I move to approve the Moab Office of
[3:23:03] Tourism's renewal contract with Camp
[3:23:05] Stories pending legal review.
[3:23:08] I'm going to add
[3:23:09] purchasing review. And purchasing policy with you.
[3:23:16] Second, Jacques. So, we have a motion by
[3:23:19] Brian and second by Jacques. All right,
[3:23:21] any more discussion? Yeah, just real
[3:23:22] quick. Camp Stories I think has done a
[3:23:24] really good job.
[3:23:25] Um and I just want to make sure that we
[3:23:26] send their praises. It's uh um it's it's it was a I think a tough decision
[3:23:31] to get a PR firm. Um but it's the first
[3:23:34] time that Grant County is really
[3:23:35] starting to tell its own story rather
[3:23:37] than just have stories told uh about us.
[3:23:40] So.
[3:23:40] I I've
[3:23:42] Chair, if you want me to speak a little
[3:23:44] bit to this, I'm I'm happy to.
[3:23:47] Um Sure, we'll go ahead, Mike and
[3:23:49] Jacques, and then we'll Quick
[3:23:49] clarification, this is just to add legal review and and approve the contract. And
[3:23:57] approve the contract, okay?
[3:23:59] Yeah, that but it had to be pulled off
[3:24:01] of our consent agenda because
[3:24:03] it needed that additional Yeah, it
[3:24:05] required the additional wording.
[3:24:07] All right, that that was my question as why we pulled it off the consent
[3:24:09] agenda. Yeah, that's why it's I feel
[3:24:10] like we've had that kind of day. Okay.
[3:24:12] So, I've listened to
[3:24:14] Well, I can And go ahead.
[3:24:17] There was renewal language in the RFP
[3:24:19] that we put out that it could be
[3:24:20] renewed, but that wasn't
[3:24:22] really clear language. I'd like to firm
[3:24:24] that that up. In talking with the office
[3:24:25] of tourism, we kind of thought, well,
[3:24:27] let's renew this for 1 year and then go
[3:24:29] out to bid. And I think the intent from
[3:24:30] the office of tourism would be to go out
[3:24:32] to bid on this every 2 years to keep it
[3:24:33] competitive, keep it fresh, and get the
[3:24:35] best service as possible. But at this
[3:24:37] point where we're kind of getting into
[3:24:39] the second cycle, I think we're going to
[3:24:40] rely on the renewal language as long as
[3:24:42] Steven's okay with that in the RFP we
[3:24:44] put out in the beginning. So, that's how
[3:24:45] you that's how you write here.
[3:24:48] Okay.
[3:24:50] All right.
[3:24:51] go ahead and call for a vote.
[3:24:53] All in favor?
[3:24:55] I.
[3:24:56] All right, that passes 7-0. Thank you.
[3:24:59] And we'll move on to our
[3:25:03] Um I'm trying infrastructure wish list.
[3:25:06] So, I would be included it in the
[3:25:07] packet. There's been multiple meetings
[3:25:09] on this ultra infrastructure wish list.
[3:25:12] We've gone out there and toured the
[3:25:13] site. We've looked at the
[3:25:15] um all the different
[3:25:19] infrastructure that's out there. I got
[3:25:21] had the site futures list um included in
[3:25:24] there and I think that uh the the site
[3:25:26] put together encompasses all those
[3:25:28] things. That list also encompasses
[3:25:31] things that the city has um recommended
[3:25:33] as well. So, try to just put everybody's
[3:25:35] they just want one list and so that's
[3:25:37] going to be the county's list.
[3:25:39] And that list doesn't mean we'll get it.
[3:25:41] Just because it's on the list doesn't
[3:25:42] mean we'll get it, but if we don't ask
[3:25:44] for it, we won't get it. So, that's it's a little bit bigger than even the
[3:25:47] infrastructure list that they gave us
[3:25:49] saying this is the infrastructure that
[3:25:51] we have, but we added, you know, more
[3:25:53] things. We want to see if they can help
[3:25:55] us get some access to the river or do
[3:25:57] some trail work or, you know, vehicle
[3:25:59] fuel stop and those are just that's
[3:26:01] above and beyond what their kind of
[3:26:02] infrastructure list, but they said that
[3:26:04] go ahead and add it to the list because
[3:26:06] that would keep it on their forefront.
[3:26:07] So, we have completion date of 2029 is
[3:26:11] their completion date and none of this
[3:26:13] will come to us until after they are
[3:26:15] complete, but just getting the word out
[3:26:17] there going to have to go through their
[3:26:19] own um procurement and then make sure
[3:26:21] that this that there's not contaminated.
[3:26:24] So, lots going into this, but um anyway,
[3:26:27] this is the list that we are going to
[3:26:28] give them on June 1st. And I just wanted
[3:26:32] to make sure that everybody knew and it
[3:26:33] was transparent and and um
[3:26:36] we're not trying to do anything crazy
[3:26:37] out there, but we pretty much asked for
[3:26:38] all of it. All of it plus the moon.
[3:26:41] >> [clears throat and laughter]
[3:26:42] >> But was there anything that we didn't
[3:26:43] ask for that was
[3:26:45] presented to us?
[3:26:47] No. Okay.
[3:26:49] There's still a lot more.
[3:26:51] >> [clears throat]
[3:26:53] >> Just a quick question.
[3:26:54] >> Go ahead. So, the um the Alta survey
[3:26:57] summer of 2026 right of way, is that for
[3:27:00] the pipeline?
[3:27:03] Actually, they're paying a company to
[3:27:05] come in and do a
[3:27:08] complete property description.
[3:27:12] That So, a description of the property,
[3:27:14] legal description, and then to
[3:27:17] map out all of the easements. I believe
[3:27:19] there's a power line over against the
[3:27:22] west side. There's the pipeline that you
[3:27:24] just mentioned running through, and I
[3:27:26] think there's some easements up along
[3:27:28] 191 to the north of where their offices
[3:27:31] are. So, that's all it is. But, it would
[3:27:34] include the right of ways on the
[3:27:36] >> The all the survey will show those
[3:27:38] survey That's That's That's what I was
[3:27:39] asking. But, yeah. So, they're going
[3:27:41] They are doing an Alta survey, which is
[3:27:42] a a very intensive survey, more than
[3:27:46] what most people get when they purchase
[3:27:47] land. And so, that Alta survey will go
[3:27:50] and it'll it'll show those things. Um,
[3:27:52] it's a really in-depth survey, and
[3:27:54] they're already doing that. They have
[3:27:55] already put the RFP out for it, and we
[3:27:57] said it should be done this summer. And
[3:27:59] so, that will be something that we'll be
[3:28:00] able to ask for a copy of through the
[3:28:03] FOIA.
[3:28:04] Um,
[3:28:05] government, you know, ask We can ask for
[3:28:07] a copy of that. And I think that the
[3:28:09] city has asked for some other things
[3:28:11] from that FOIA as well. And and I I
[3:28:13] don't know if the whole commission was a
[3:28:14] copy on that, but we have a list of the
[3:28:15] items that city's asked for as well. So,
[3:28:18] that's additional information as far as
[3:28:20] that's up in advance, you know, because
[3:28:22] they already kind of know where that infrastructure that's underground
[3:28:27] is, but um, this Alta will be really
[3:28:30] specific.
[3:28:31] And so, those right-of-ways also
[3:28:34] wouldn't necessarily be given to us.
[3:28:36] We'd have to apply for them. So, some of
[3:28:37] them, like up the road that goes up to
[3:28:39] the tracks,
[3:28:40] and so, if we were going to have, you
[3:28:42] know, some de plane de plane de railing,
[3:28:45] um, it is BLM, and so, we would have to
[3:28:48] um,
[3:28:48] ask [clears throat] We'd have to
[3:28:50] reinstate that in our name and lease it.
[3:28:53] So, and so, it would it would it would
[3:28:55] show where all of those different leases
[3:28:57] are.
[3:28:58] That's all. Perfect. Thank you.
[3:29:03] All right.
[3:29:04] Anyone else? I didn't put it as an
[3:29:05] action item. I just figured we just
[3:29:07] wanted to make sure everybody knew, so.
[3:29:08] We don't have any more further
[3:29:09] discussion on that. Mary, you good with
[3:29:12] that list?
[3:29:13] I was very pleased. Thank you very, very
[3:29:16] much. Thank you, Bill. Thank you,
[3:29:19] uh, Melody, for the people that, you
[3:29:20] know,
[3:29:22] where I've been so absent, I really
[3:29:24] appreciate people taking the reins.
[3:29:27] All right. Thank you. Sean, our, um,
[3:29:30] maintenance also spent a good deal of
[3:29:32] time out there on this, as well. And
[3:29:34] Mark, too. Yeah, he was at our last
[3:29:36] meeting. When I see him, I'll tell him
[3:29:38] thanks. He was very cordial.
[3:29:41] Yes.
[3:29:42] All right. On to number 14, the Kemsley
[3:29:44] Garden financial payments.
[3:29:47] Um, I think we've dealt with this. Okay.
[3:29:49] We're going to skip this one. Yeah. All
[3:29:51] right. So, I'm not going to ask for
[3:29:53] general commissioner reports and
[3:29:54] tonight, but if there's Does anyone have
[3:29:57] anything that they just Go ahead,
[3:29:59] Jacques. Thanks. Um, I it's it's
[3:30:02] interesting cuz the last I gave my
[3:30:03] report and the last 2 weeks I was
[3:30:06] um,
[3:30:07] I I had experience with the two
[3:30:09] different motorized events in town.
[3:30:11] They went very differently. Uh, there
[3:30:14] was one at the the park that, um, our
[3:30:18] sheriff referenced earlier and
[3:30:20] I think I went to that event. We had a
[3:30:22] great time. It was super well put on.
[3:30:24] They gave back to the community. They gave us, uh,
[3:30:27] search and rescue a significant amount
[3:30:29] of money.
[3:30:30] Um,
[3:30:31] it was it was a
[3:30:34] I probably had 400 trucks parading past
[3:30:37] my house at 7:00 in the morning and it
[3:30:40] wasn't a burden at all. We were out in
[3:30:42] the front yard drinking coffee, watching
[3:30:43] them go by and it was it was it was a
[3:30:45] great time. And there was another
[3:30:46] motorized event. I'm not going to name
[3:30:48] it, but, um, I had a very negative
[3:30:51] experience with that event when I was
[3:30:53] out leading a group of um group of kids
[3:30:56] and it I I very much appreciate how that
[3:30:59] was dealt with in the county. But I just
[3:31:02] want to say to people who come to Grand
[3:31:06] County to put on their events that that
[3:31:09] there are folks that live here. There's
[3:31:11] a way to do things and there's a way not
[3:31:12] to do things and treating locals with
[3:31:14] respect and and
[3:31:16] um
[3:31:17] uh
[3:31:18] posing yourself while you are visiting
[3:31:22] our county makes a huge difference.
[3:31:25] Okay, Trish. Um I Thanks. Sorry, did I
[3:31:28] cut you off? Um I just wanted to bring
[3:31:31] this up. So I went to the Planning and
[3:31:32] Zoning 101 Understanding Land Use with
[3:31:35] Craig Call at the library and I was on
[3:31:37] Thursday like I had things on both ends
[3:31:39] so I only got to stay for about an hour,
[3:31:41] but it was phenomenal. And so I did
[3:31:44] bring that up at the Planning Commission
[3:31:46] level like are we interested in having
[3:31:48] some kind of joint joint workshop way
[3:31:51] I'm talking way in the future maybe
[3:31:53] winter-ish um to have Craig come and do
[3:31:56] something again. So I'm just kind of
[3:31:58] throwing that out. It was so good
[3:32:01] um and the the Planning Commission was
[3:32:03] interested. So I'm kind of throwing that
[3:32:04] out. I think it would behoove all of us
[3:32:06] to kind of go through that with Craig
[3:32:08] because he he not only kind of lays out
[3:32:11] some basics of of land use planning our
[3:32:13] planning and zoning, but he also gives
[3:32:15] these cool little scenarios which I
[3:32:18] think kind of brings it to life and
[3:32:19] helps. So Yeah, he he doesn't even know
[3:32:21] that he wrote the
[3:32:22] book. Wrote the book. And then he we've
[3:32:24] definitely dealt with him a few times,
[3:32:26] right, when we appealed to things and he's good. He's really good. So I'm
[3:32:31] just going to throw that out and like I
[3:32:32] said it would be I would think
[3:32:34] winter-ish would be a nice time to do
[3:32:35] it. He might not be able to help us out. The
[3:32:39] reason why is he's our ELJ and we get an
[3:32:42] awesome deal with him. He's only a 100
[3:32:45] bucks an hour. Um if if he gave a
[3:32:48] training and we later relied on his, you
[3:32:50] know, training or did something.
[3:32:53] We've just been really blessed to have
[3:32:55] him as an ALJ for the price that he
[3:32:57] charges. But
[3:32:59] I I think we can discuss it. Yeah. Well,
[3:33:02] I think we can we can discuss it. Okay,
[3:33:04] we can discuss it. So, it could be
[3:33:05] public, but we just make sure that all
[3:33:07] the petitioners know about it. Something
[3:33:08] like that.
[3:33:09] Yeah. Okay. Yeah, it was it was quite
[3:33:12] good.
[3:33:13] I was impressed.
[3:33:15] Okay. And that was it. Stephen, you had
[3:33:17] your hand up. And
[3:33:18] then what about Mark? Do you have any
[3:33:23] Thank you. Okay, I'm going to adjourn
[3:33:25] this meeting at 7:00