[0:03] Great.
>> Okay. I'll now call the regular meeting
[0:05] of annual council for January 21st, 2026
to order. Please, can I get a motion to
[0:10] approve the agenda?
>> I councelor move to approve the agenda
[0:14] with removal. Oops. Never mind. Good.
The next one.
[0:19] » I councelor Fox second.
>> Any questions, comments?
[0:24] All those in favor signify by saying I.
>> I. I. Any opposed? Motion carried. Thank
[0:31] you. Item three, consent section. Can I
get a motion, please?
[0:35] » I, Councelor High, move to adopt the
consent section with the removal of the
[0:39] upper Kings Kings Clear Fire Department
report to be moved to business rising 7A
[0:45] and with the removal of the CAO report
to be moved to 7D.
[0:50] » A second.
>> I councelor Clea second.
[0:54] » All those in favor signify by saying I.
>> I. contrary minded. Motion carried.
[0:59] Thank you, council. Any disclosures
tonight?
[1:03] I'll take that as an
uh no other public input or inquiries.
[1:08] Moving on to item six. We have
presentations. We have two presentations
[1:11] tonight. Uh Mr. uh Keegan Webster from
Canada Post and John Gilbert from Kings
[1:17] uh talking about the Kings tree nursery
water issue. So, I'm going to ask Mr.
[1:21] Webster from Canada Post to go, please.
[1:28] Oh, I I've got no no PowerPoint ready.
All right,
[1:32] » it's making it easy.
>> Yeah, keep things simple.
[1:35] » Uh, okay.
[1:39] So, thank you all for having me here
tonight. Uh, as mentioned, I'm Keegan
[1:43] Webster. I'm here representing the
Canadian Union of Postal Workers. I'm
[1:46] the second vice president uh of the
Frederickton and Normaka Loco, which
[1:51] covers obviously the Hanwell area. We
cover all the way from Harvey up to
[1:55] Dotown and then a little bit east and
west of Frederickton as well. Um so
[1:59] mainly what I want to talk to you
tonight uh is about the proposed cuts uh
[2:04] coming to Canada Post. Proposed um well
it's been a tumultuous year for us as
[2:12] I'm sure anyone who's paying attention
is aware. Um but basically in September
[2:18] uh the minister in charge of Canada Post
announced significant alterations or
[2:24] what would becoming significant
alterations to the way we uh serve our
[2:28] communities and the way we work. Um so
there's there's two main ones that I
[2:33] want to touch on tonight. I'll try and
be brief. Um the conversion to community
[2:38] mailboxes and the ending of doorto-d
dooror delivery um is a a big problem
[2:42] for us. Um, and I know that especially
in rural communities, there's a lot of
[2:47] people who already have community
mailboxes, right? You might have a small
[2:50] one at the end of your street or
something along those lines. Um, but
[2:55] paired with the the idea behind
conversion to CNBs and elimination of
[3:01] door-to-d dooror delivery is the
elimination of jobs. Um, so just because
[3:05] you already have a community mailbox
does not mean your mail can't be uh less
[3:10] accessible than it is right now. because
with those same reports um the the
[3:16] Kaplan report from the Industrial
Inquiry Commission last year after our
[3:19] initial strike uh and then the uh
assessment from Minister Lightbound um
[3:25] the goal and the Canada Post uh like
annual assessment of what like their
[3:30] fiveyear plans, their 10-year plans,
they're to basically cut half the
[3:34] workforce over the next 10 years and you
have to make significant alterations to
[3:38] service st standards in order to do
that. So imag like if you had a CMBB
[3:43] right now, you might have, you know, one
at the end of your street or something
[3:47] along those lines that would be
transformed into, you know, a large bank
[3:52] of CNBs extending from uh me to the
mayor potentially that is now suddenly
[3:58] instead of a 5minute walk away, it's a
20-minute drive away. And this is
[4:02] reality for a lot of people in um rural
Newfoundland, for example. But this
[4:06] could be coming here as really the only
means of cutting down jobs in a in a
[4:12] significant manner on the delivery side
of things. Um, and I I think that that
[4:16] is really a shame and I think it's
basically shortsighted uh because we see
[4:21] as much as we see a decline in letter
mail, which you know on the union side
[4:25] we've been talking about for years as
and talking about ways that we need to
[4:29] be countering that and not just by
cutting our services down to nothing um
[4:33] and selling off our public assets to
private companies. Um but there's been a
[4:38] a spike in parcel uh parcel volumes and
deliveries. But the problem is that we
[4:43] are not capturing any of those in
instead that's being left to that work
[4:47] is being done by Amazon or other fly by
night companies that one they're paying
[4:53] like terrible wages. Uh people are not
able to get by on them. I see some of
[4:57] those guys working as I'm doing my
route. I'm a letter carrier in
[5:00] Frederickton. Their jobs are miserable
and they're not able to provide quality
[5:04] service, right? because they have so
much when they're paid, you know, per
[5:08] parcel or something like that, they are
constantly in a rush. You're forced to
[5:12] be throwing parcels at doors or leaving
them at the end of the driveway to get
[5:15] run over as they're squealing out to
make the next delivery.
[5:19] Um, so one, I I think that's a big
problem and and something that would
[5:23] affect uh rural communities uh in
particular. The other uh thing that we
[5:28] are emphasizing with this uh campaign
against these cuts is uh against the
[5:33] closure of post offices in particular
rural post offices. Now, as far as I'm
[5:38] aware, Hanwell does not actually have a
Canada Post Post Office within its
[5:42] boundaries, but you know, there's one in
uh New Maryland. There's ones that are
[5:47] close and accessible to you, and a lot
of these uh the protections are being
[5:51] lifted, right? There was uh from the
'90s until recently a moratorium on
[5:56] closing the rural post offices. Uh that
has been has been framed as being
[6:01] lifted. I don't want I don't want to put
these things in stone as of yet, but
[6:04] this is what the minister and this is
what Canada Post wants to do is to be
[6:07] able to close these things down. Um, and
even in our own negotiations, uh, there
[6:13] were a certain about 492 post offices
that were protected by the collective
[6:18] agreement. As part of our own
negotiations, we've let 100 off that
[6:23] list. Um, I think that's frustrating. I,
you know, did not agree with that
[6:27] decision by our negotiators, but you're
sometimes you're in a bind. uh you've
[6:32] got to make difficult decisions. But
what I'm at here for basically is asking
[6:36] for help from, you know, community and
municipal governments that are able to
[6:41] speak in the other ear of the federal
government because they're they're tired
[6:44] of hearing from us. Um and I think they
want to hear about what these cuts can
[6:50] do uh how how they can impact
small communities um across the country.
[6:56] And uh in particular, I think the
emphasis on making sure that there is an
[7:01] actual public mandate review um like a
review of Canada Post mandate and the
[7:06] Canada Post Act and not just one that's
dictated by a couple ministers um and uh
[7:13] backed up by private equity. So, uh, I'm
aware that I I we wouldn't be able to
[7:18] discuss a resolution here, but I would
like to, uh, propose a resolution for
[7:23] you to discuss at your next town council
meeting, as well as, uh, provide some
[7:27] information to help you do some further
research on this. I know I'm trying to
[7:30] squeeze a lot into a short presentation,
but, uh, some people like to take their
[7:34] time on those sort of things, but if you
wouldn't mind, I'd just like to read out
[7:38] some of the short bits from a resolution
just to get an idea of of what we're
[7:43] looking for. Um we have had some other
municipalities in the area sign on to
[7:48] something like this already. But
um whereas the federal government has
[7:54] announced drastic cuts to our treasured
public post office, killing good jobs,
[7:57] ending door-to-door delivery, removing
the moratorium and protection on post
[8:01] office closures and changes to delivery
standards for the mail. Whereas the
[8:05] federal government has done this without
meaningful public consultation and has
[8:09] made this decision unilaterally prior to
a planned Canada Post Corporation review
[8:14] from October 1, 2025 to March 31, 2026,
effectively eliminating any opportunity
[8:20] for input from the people who will be
most affected.
[8:24] Whereas thousands of postal jobs will be
destroyed and 4 million households will
[8:28] lose door-to-door delivery most within
the next few years. Whereas post office
[8:33] closures could degrade or completely
remove service in many communities.
[8:37] Whereas these cuts will hurt seniors and
people with disabilities in particular.
[8:42] Whereas it is crucial for the government
and mandate review to hear the views
[8:45] from municipalities on key issues
including maintaining Canada Post as a
[8:49] public service, the importance of
maintaining the moratorium on post
[8:52] office closures, improving the can
Canadian postal service charter, keeping
[8:57] daily home mail and parcel delivery to
the door, improving postal banking,
[9:01] greening Canada post, adding EV charging
stations, adding food delivery,
[9:06] improving delivery to rural, remote, and
indigenous communities and developing
[9:10] services to assist people with
disabilities. abilities to help older
[9:12] Canadians to remain in their homes for
as long as possible and at the same time
[9:17] helping to ensure that good jobs stay in
their communities and the Canada Post
[9:21] can remain financially self-sustaining.
Therefore, be it resolved that Hanwell
[9:26] rural municipality uh formerly writes
the Minister of Government, Transporta
[9:30] uh transformation, public works and
procurement Joel Lightbound to demand an
[9:34] immediate halt to the service cuts and
to look instead for ways to increase
[9:37] services and revenues in other areas
such as those as noted above. Demand
[9:41] that no mandate review takes place until
Canada Post returns to stabilized
[9:44] operations and demand that any review of
Canada Post and the Canadian Postal
[9:48] Service Charter must be done through a
full and thorough transparent public
[9:52] review, including public hearings with
all key stakeholders in every region of
[9:57] Canada. Therefore, be it resolved that
Hanwell will make a written submission
[10:01] and/or participate in hearings to
provide input in the upcoming mandate
[10:04] review of Canada Post. Now, that's a
lot. Um, but just to be clear because I
[10:09] I think I've had some questions on this
before. The last whereas where it's
[10:13] talking about all the services like EV
charging and things like that, those are
[10:17] things that we currently don't offer.
But the framing here is that we have
[10:21] this large network of infrastructure
across the country. And these are some
[10:25] things that we could offer to improve uh
service to Canadians and, you know,
[10:30] improve revenue streams and make this a
a continued viable uh project, basically
[10:36] a national project. And that's one of
the main things we're framing this as is
[10:40] that you know the current federal
government is talking a lot about nation
[10:43] building projects and stuff like that.
And um and I I think that's good but I
[10:47] think the focus should be on like nation
building projects that we need to
[10:51] maintain like Canada Post. Um and
letting it oify and ro away I think uh
[10:57] does us a disservice and disunites us as
a nation. Um so I tried to be brief but
[11:02] if you've got any questions fire away
I'd be happy to answer. Okay. Thank you,
[11:07] Mr. Webster. Any questions for Mr.
Webster while he's here?
[11:10] » Do we have time for questions?
>> Couple not not a lot of time, but some.
[11:13] » Okay. But I won't talk to you too much
then. Okay. Um um full disclosure, I
[11:19] could talk to you for hours because I
also work for a career company. I'm also
[11:23] the union rep for our company. And um
>> Teamsters.
[11:27] » Hm.
>> Teamsters.
[11:28] » No, Steel Workers.
>> Oh, okay. And uh so anyway um but I
[11:33] understand a lot of what you're talking
about and I understand a lot of where
[11:36] you're coming from because we have our
company has certainly benefited every
[11:41] time you go on strike
[11:45] » and and overworked me right to death. Um
but yet I I I see where you're coming
[11:50] from and I I tend to be very sympathetic
with you and I and I see um because I'm
[11:54] quite familiar with the industry. Um I I
see the value of Candipost and um ma
[12:01] mainly because the one that I work for
is not like purator. I don't work for
[12:05] them for ICS and we don't go everywhere
and I see the issue that we have here um
[12:11] with just delivering our um um our
newsletters. I've also run several
[12:16] elections. There's a real need for that
small non-addressed admail that you
[12:21] cannot send. Like I I I have to I
wouldn't I couldn't send my own with my
[12:24] company.
>> Yeah. you know, for example. Um, so
[12:28] I'm very sympathetic to your cause. Um,
I'm also quite interested in the things
[12:33] you said about um, you know, having new
services and new new whatever. So
[12:39] anyway, um, it's not so much as a
questions, it's more the fact that I'd
[12:42] like to know more. If you can send us
stuff, I'd be more interested in taking
[12:46] it for everybody have time to look at
your proposals and that kind of thing
[12:50] and and take it ser take it quite
seriously. So if you
[12:53] » Yeah, we've got lots of materials and
stuff I can send forward as well as I
[12:57] can send the text of the resolution just
so everyone's not
[12:59] » Yeah, that would be very helpful.
>> Sure. Everyone's got a photography.
[13:02] » All right. Any other questions,
comments?
[13:05] » Just curious. You said that other
municipalities have already put forth a
[13:09] motion like this somewhat of this. Which
which municipalities in our region?
[13:13] » Uh so I talked to Sunbury York South,
which is not a they don't have a
[13:18] functioning council right now. They just
have a supervisor. They're not privy to
[13:22] all the
>> but uh but they have approved a
[13:26] resolution through whatever their means
are and I gave a similar presentation to
[13:30] uh Nashwalk a couple weeks ago and I
think they are I think they meet tonight
[13:35] or sometime soon. So I don't know the
outcome of that but it was a I would say
[13:40] generally a positive response and then I
sent them some materials and they
[13:44] discussed and looked at them and
>> so no one's actually made a motion yet.
[13:48] This is just in discussions. Uh well the
Sunbridge South one but that's just a
[13:53] guy in an office so right but but yeah
uh and I think yeah so it's still just
[14:00] in discussions for the test region.
Thanks.
[14:03] » All right well thank you Mr. Webster for
certainly an interesting presentation.
[14:07] Uh we'll we'll see where council goes
from here.
[14:10] » Okay. Sweet. Thanks very much. Um
>> Mr. Webster if you could send that
[14:14] motion um forward to um the clerk.
sent the other one. Um, then we'll have
[14:21] it for
>> and I'll send some uh PDFs of like
[14:24] responses to the industrial inquiry
commission and stuff like that.
[14:28] » Not to be rude, but I have to leave cuz
I have a curling gift.
[14:32] » Yeah. First things first.
>> And he curls, too.
[14:36] » Are you my long lost son? Thank you.
>> He's wearing a blue hoodie.
[14:41] » He's wearing a blue hoodie.
>> Thank you.
[14:43] » All right.
>> Maybe a long lost nephew.
[14:45] » Maybe. Here we go.
>> Okay, moving on. We now have uh Mr.
[14:49] Gilbert and he wants to talk about the
water issues at the tree nursery. So
[14:53] I'll give him the voting.
>> Well, first of all, thank you very much
[14:56] for being here and it's great to be in
an island doing we're waiting for our
[15:01] signs.
[15:05] » They're coming. They're coming. That's
>> uh just very quickly, can everybody see
[15:10] that?
>> Yeah. Okay, great.
[15:11] » All right. So, so we all know last year
like I didn't mow my lawn since I think
[15:16] the middle of June and and it was a bad
and a dry year and we get the message
[15:20] from the government on the right hand
side saying every drop counts, you know,
[15:23] don't wash your cars and all that kind
of stuff. On our backyards is the tree
[15:27] nursery. We're in Garden View Drive and
the streets over from that. And the tree
[15:32] nursery's been there and we've been
there for a long time. But the tree
[15:36] nursery recently in the last two years
got a huge federal grant on the Trudeau
[15:41] 2 billion tree um project which Carney
cancelled. But they bought two large
[15:48] large green houses and this summer they
didn't have enough water to run them. So
[15:52] their ponds dried up and Maple Glenn
Brook which feeds the ponds pretty well
[15:56] dried up. And so they're struggling. and
they have 12
[16:01] wells in total. Um,
I live on the edge to the left of that
[16:06] picture is the tree nursery and my house
is there. I put a pool in two years ago
[16:10] and I like to think of volumes um, a
cubic meter of water kind of doesn't
[16:14] mean much to me. So, my pool is 29 cubic
meters and they're planning on
[16:18] increasing the tree nursery water
withdrawal from that aquifer to at least
[16:23] 19 of those pools a day. And there's no
real u science or no real studies yet as
[16:30] to whether that water is really there.
So we're all quite concerned in uh in
[16:34] island view and we don't know where how
far the aquifer goes in either
[16:37] direction. Could go over to Chuck Ever's
farm could go over you know well past
[16:42] ours we don't know. Um and there doesn't
seem to be a lot in the EIA. So the tree
[16:47] nursery had to file an EIA when you
anybody who withdraws over 5 cubic
[16:52] meters a day has to file an EIA. So we
got the We really didn't get the idea.
[16:57] We got this little piece of paper in our
mailboxes
[17:01] left. But anyway, it was in the middle
of a a a work um it wasn't a strike, but
[17:06] it's rotating strike. So, I'm not sure
we're already done it right away. Uh and
[17:09] some people didn't get it at all. Uh
there's um the tree nursery. That little
[17:14] arrow goes to my friend Daryl Bar's
house. It's showing uh they're putting
[17:18] they put in two uh test wells. Um this
isn't showing sorry on the screen, but
[17:24] the bottom of that uh arrow is one of
the test wells. The other one is would
[17:28] be located at the top left and those are
going to be um pump tested sometime in
[17:34] the next two weeks. Good place to put
them right before our subdivision.
[17:39] Uh however, there's a couple of of
issues.
[17:42] I'll summarize that for you, but
basically a large commercial well
[17:46] extraction can have a number of things.
It can deplete the aquifer if they're
[17:50] taking too much out. Uh there can be
well interference when you've got wells
[17:54] in the subdivision and you've got
something that's pumping a lot of water
[17:58] um not too far away from us. And um
there's also the aquifer from
[18:02] replenishing. We're not getting a lot of
water this fall and this winter to
[18:06] replenish that aquifer. Um so we're
we're concerned about that for sure.
[18:11] That's a little small, but I don't this
is the only kind you really need to
[18:15] worry about. So this is the wells they
currently own. They're planning on
[18:20] increasing um either by depth or by bore
size of the wells. And it's quite a
[18:25] spread, but anywhere from 95 to 205
cubic meters a day to the proposed 250
[18:31] to 545.
That's a lot. That's more than double.
[18:35] And nobody really knows what their wells
will produce because of this aquifer.
[18:40] This is one of the problems. Uh you get
what's called uh well interference, but
[18:46] also coner depression. So when you sink
a well, you drop the acryer almost like
[18:50] a reverse trumpet. So the acryer goes
down. The deeper you go, the steeper
[18:56] that curve is. And what's called a well
interference is when you get two wells
[19:00] close together, it more than doubles the
um the drain on the aquifer. And I
[19:06] circle these because I'm using these
kind of this was two wells but I'm using
[19:09] this as the wells in the tree nursery
which are fairly close together and the
[19:14] wells in our subdivision which are
fairly close together. And when you have
[19:18] the two together one aquifer you get
this doubling and you get a bigger
[19:22] counter depression. So that's one of the
things that we're a little concerned
[19:26] about.
Um this is from the EIA and the big
[19:32] thing that there's two wells there now.
They were drilled before Christmas. They
[19:36] plan on testing those within the next
week or so and then they plan on
[19:40] decommissioning them and those wells
should stay there. There's two of them.
[19:44] They're down at least 300 ft. We feel
they should put some monitoring devices
[19:48] on those. So as they draw more water, we
know at what point it's going to be too
[19:53] low to get to the wells in our
subdivision. And that's something we
[19:57] have to get to them right away.
The other thing that we were uh I'll
[20:03] show this one later, but anyway, it's
from the uh it's from the uh report.
[20:07] They're required to do a number of
things for the public involvement
[20:11] program meetings or workshops appearing
at community groups or regular meetings,
[20:15] council meeting like this. Uh all we got
was a flyer and the flyer said that you
[20:20] have to have your comments to us by
November 27th. That's it. Closed. And we
[20:26] asked them about that and um Terry sent
them a letter. They sent back said,
[20:30] "Nope, we're not going uh any further
than comments that were in by November
[20:35] 27th."
So Terry sent a letter to them and this
[20:40] came back and it says basically that the
fact that the nursery oper operations
[20:45] haven't changed, there's no increase in
the size of the nursery in the boundary
[20:49] of it and they're looking for a safe
operating yield. We believe it's not
[20:53] necessary at this time to extend the
consultation period or hold public
[20:56] meetings. We feel that's unfair because
there's very little information coming
[21:00] to us. Uh we're, you know, we've got
that they had the EIA online. It
[21:05] disappeared offline for a long time. It
came back up last week for some strange
[21:10] reason.
>> Oh, that would be the GMBB website.
[21:12] That's likely coincidental. That's a
whole other story. But
[21:16] » anyway, we couldn't access it.
>> Yeah.
[21:17] » So, that was where our information was.
Uh I did a little sluting myself. Uh you
[21:24] can uh there's a company in Ontario, the
Huskins laboratory, and you can get a
[21:30] probe and you can drop it down the well
and it will tell you exactly how much
[21:34] water is in that water column. And that
is the fancy one. It's not that
[21:39] expensive. It's 5,000 bucks, but a well
cost 20. And it will send the
[21:43] information by the hour, by the day, by
the week, whatever to the cloud. and you
[21:48] can have a look of actually what status
your aquifer is at. I would think the
[21:52] tree nursery would want to have that,
but they're planning on filling these
[21:56] two um test wells in and not converting
them to observation wells.
[22:01] This was what uh was done by the WSP,
another consultant company from New
[22:06] Maryland, and they just got three new
wells in 2000. And I read through their
[22:10] report and this is just the key points.
So they had an aquifer recharge rate was
[22:16] calculated that under prolonged dry
conditions as of last summer there's a
[22:20] higher potential risk of increased draw
downs and possibly overpumping if water
[22:23] levels are left unchecked. Groundwater
leveling logging devices were installed
[22:27] in the observation wells for continuous
level logging. They put um observation
[22:32] wells around their three new pumps for
the village plus four new ones. water
[22:39] level logging will en provisions will
enable provisions for automated well
[22:42] pump shutdown at a predetermined low
liquid level and they got public
[22:46] meetings. So I think what we're
concerned about is we would like to have
[22:50] something you know between the tree
nursery and ourselves that gives us a
[22:55] water level check on that aquifer and if
it goes below a certain level where
[22:59] where wells start to dry up in the
subdivision that they have to do
[23:02] something else. They can pump from the
river. They can uh tap in. They can
[23:07] enlarge their ponds. Um you know, all
kinds of different things. But at some
[23:12] point, we don't want to be the test
where our wells go around, we go, we're
[23:17] drawing our wells and oh, we better do
something. We want them to be proactive
[23:20] rather than reactive.
Uh so the key messages for us are
[23:24] immediately don't fill in the test
wells. Keep those as monitoring wells.
[23:29] So there's two right in the right place.
They want to take the caps off. They
[23:34] want to fill up those cement and seal
them. And I know why. Because you don't
[23:38] want uh if they're low to the ground, if
there was an oil spill, it could go down
[23:42] and pollute the aquifer. But these are
already in and they're like your well at
[23:44] home. They're they're got a at least a
foot or two above. We want prevention
[23:49] rather than mitigation. Don't let us be
the guinea pigs. Uh the idea to mitigate
[23:56] demand. So they could enlarge the
holding ponds. They could pump from the
[23:59] river. They could draw from
Macintoshbrook because they're drawing
[24:01] now from Maple Glennbrook, but they may
be able to take a bit more water and
[24:05] store it.
Really expect a public information
[24:08] meeting if Grant if New Maryland can
have one and other communities can have
[24:12] one. Why can't we? And could be hosted
perhaps by you folks or you know down at
[24:18] the fire hall. I think that you said
that Johnny's um
[24:21] » at the
>> gas fire down there in the restaurant
[24:24] was a place that they they volunteered.
>> And again, some ideas from the new
[24:28] Maryland process.
>> So So that's it. We're not against the
[24:32] trainership getting more water. If it's
there, take it. But worried, we're
[24:37] worried about they don't know how much
is there. They don't know their demand.
[24:41] And that stuff's not clear in the
consultants report. And we've had sort
[24:45] of limited access. So Terry, we met with
uh Cindy Miles yesterday or on Monday
[24:51] and she said that all of a sudden
they've opened back up the comment um
[24:55] period to February
>> 25th
[24:58] » 25th.
So all of a sudden it's back open.
[25:03] » Um
>> so that's a good thing.
[25:05] » That's a good thing.
>> But you know was the fact that they
[25:08] heard that we were kind of rattling
around a little bit did that make them
[25:10] do it? I don't know. But um so anyway,
we're just uh we're looking for your
[25:15] support as the new members of the
village. And again, like if the water's
[25:19] there, no issues, but we're worried and
and uh at least one or two neighbors um
[25:26] let me just go back to show you
this situation. So, the person that
[25:33] lives um right about here has not a deep
oil pump, but a flight pump in their
[25:37] house and they have the the column down
and they noticed theirs was cycling
[25:42] faster this year. I live I live here. My
neighbor asked me in the September, he
[25:48] said, "Is your water a little bit dirty
in your toilet?" And I said, "No, but I
[25:52] do have a filter on mine." And when I
look at the filter, I had changed it
[25:56] around the 1st of September. It was as
dirty at the end of September as it was
[25:59] for 3 months.
>> So, it's starting to get down to the
[26:03] point where my pump spins up. It's It's
rounding up a little bit more. So, my
[26:07] well's 150 ft. There are also some
people like Daryl that have geothermal
[26:11] heating pumps
>> pumps. He's down 300 ft. Um, and there's
[26:16] several of those around. So, those folks
really don't want to dry out. It's their
[26:19] heat source.
>> No heat.
[26:21] » I'd freeze up. So, anyway, we're we're
we've had great support from Terry.
[26:27] She's made calls. She's written a few
letters and and that kind of thing. Uh
[26:31] our biggest concern right now is we have
to get the DNR and not let them fill
[26:34] those test wells um in and use them for
observation wells. And then after that,
[26:40] we'll see what happens after the pump
tests. They're going to do a 72-hour
[26:44] pump test on that at this time of year.
I know it's dry. It hasn't had much of a
[26:49] chance to recharge, but it would have
been nice to do it last year in
[26:54] September when it was super dry. We're
we're still in a drought.
[26:58] » Yeah,
>> for sure.
[26:59] » According to the government, we're it's
a one in 150 year drought that we
[27:03] experience.
>> So anyway, we you know, for a number of
[27:07] reasons, um you know, just your house
value, you don't have good water. It's
[27:10] hard to sell your house. Um not planning
on moving, but once a once a community
[27:15] gets a reputation for not having a good
water source, like everybody knows about
[27:18] Carlile Road, you got to go down 700
feet to get water. And there's other
[27:22] villages around that are having to do
boil water or things like that.
[27:27] We don't want that to happen to oursel
for sure and our property values. So, um
[27:31] I can take any questions that you folks
have. That's it.
[27:36] » Yeah.
>> So, John
[27:38] » Yeah.
>> Cindy Miles.
[27:39] » Yep.
>> Um met you guys reached out to Cindy.
[27:43] » She did did a meeting. Yep.
>> She's a fellow uh resident of the board
[27:48] » right beside the trainer.
>> Absolutely. Mhm.
[27:50] » Um, did did Cindy have any personal
comments or anything like that that you
[27:54] can share or or
>> Yeah, she was very open. She was very
[27:57] helpful. She took a bunch of notes at
the same show I showed here.
[28:00] » Yeah.
>> She asked for a copy of the show and
[28:03] then she said that she was going to get
to the Department of Environment
[28:06] » um to uh get some answers to some of the
questions and then she back to us. I
[28:12] know that the conversation that I had
with her uh it would have been just
[28:16] before I guess the the original
consultation timeline ended.
[28:20] » Yeah. 12.
>> Yeah, exactly. Um
[28:26] it was it was felt that
uh the request for an extension um would
[28:35] have been would have been met. Uh but
the other requests that we had put out
[28:41] there I think after you and I talked and
I talked to another a few other uh
[28:45] neighbors the idea of you know having
water drawn off the river uh you know
[28:52] didn't necessarily uh go over well
because of uh what happens downstream to
[28:58] which then you know if something happens
to the downstream properties then it's
[29:03] you know it's it's and it's instigated
by an upstream property or draw that
[29:07] it's an issue. And it was rather I guess
it was uh I found it quite uh quite you
[29:15] know comical on some level that it's
it's okay to do it on a well but it's
[29:20] not okay to do it on uh on a water
source like a river.
[29:23] » Um a question I have is based on based
on the conversation you would have had
[29:30] with her um did she give any inclination
into alternatives or was it just open
[29:35] for open for dialogue? Yeah,
>> that was it
[29:38] » for dialogue. Yeah.
>> And and and what was the date again?
[29:41] » On Monday.
>> This Monday.
[29:42] » Yeah, we were there Monday.
>> Sorry. Open till date.
[29:46] » February 25th.
>> 25th.
[29:48] » 25th.
>> I think if you in your head those 19
[29:52] swimming pools in my backyard. I think
that's a buck a drop in the bucket of
[29:56] the St. John River.
>> Absolutely.
[29:58] » And they will need permits. No question.
The same as when you withdraw from any
[30:01] anything. But I don't think that that
will hurt St. never
[30:05] » no
>> any.
[30:07] » So, so they got to have some options for
us. So, if they test it and they say,
[30:12] "Well,
>> looks like we can withdraw 480.
[30:18] You know, I'm not so sure because the
consultant and the well driller are
[30:21] going to make it as good as possible for
them. They want to take as much as they
[30:24] can."
>> So, I would almost argue that I'd like
[30:28] to see third party review.
And I know that you folks have uh
[30:32] somebody looking at the water situation
in the the village I think and maybe
[30:37] that's a good test case right there as
to you know my interview.
[30:42] » Yeah.
>> Was there a separate hydro geological
[30:46] report done specific?
>> Not yet.
[30:49] » Not yet. They've been pumping for years
over there.
[30:53] » It's an older subdivision. I mean there
hadn't been a lot of new houses in the
[30:55] island. a few right here and there, but
but it's always been, you know, no
[31:00] issues. U I've been there since 1990. I
think in '92 we had a really dry year
[31:05] and back then it was kind of all my lawn
green and I watered my lawn for 3 weeks
[31:09] straight with the sprinkler and never
turned off the water. Tons of water.
[31:13] » Not sure that's the case now.
>> So,
[31:16] » well, you might have noticed we put out
advisories last year, last during the
[31:20] during the for people to try to conserve
as much water as they can. So certainly
[31:24] concern of the handle council council.
>> It seemed to me like something like that
[31:29] should almost be using this isn't enough
to do you guys nothing to do with it.
[31:33] She almost using like a mini water tower
pumping from the river when the level is
[31:37] high and gravity feeding that to when
they need it and then as it hurts a
[31:40] certain same way water tower works in in
a town or a city, right? When it hits a
[31:44] certain level it repumps. that that
would be a much more logical way to do
[31:48] this than pumping millions of gallons of
water from up for just it's much more
[31:53] sustainable and goes on.
>> People probably don't know it, but
[31:57] there's a big uh underground reservoir
up at the end of at the turn there where
[32:02] you come out Deerwood swing on to
Marion. There's a fire hydrant there
[32:06] actually,
>> but they they pump that full of for well
[32:09] water. They pump that full during the
evening or during the night and then it
[32:12] it supplies the down, you know, down the
hill people for water that are on the
[32:16] sitting water.
>> I mean, makes an excellent idea. Pump it
[32:19] pump it from the river into a tower or
reservoir or whatever and then use that.
[32:23] » I think they have a small system
outside, but that's just for one
[32:26] greenhouse.
>> And u they do have two goodsized ponds.
[32:30] Uh the bigger pond has a lot of area
that it could be expanded to.
[32:35] » So they could fill that in the spring
when there's lots of runoff and snow
[32:38] melting. Maple Glenn Brook is running
full and um they could get a
[32:42] » but they rig alongside the bloody river.
That's the obvious choice.
[32:46] » They own the property right to the
river.
[32:47] » Yeah. So I mean
>> yeah they should just make a drill make
[32:50] a pipe break to that and then pump it
and then
[32:53] » our area is full of springs. I mean
>> there's springs everywhere to the point
[33:00] that they're under John's basement and
he has to pump it out.
[33:05] » So
>> that's different water though. That's
[33:07] that's the thing.
That water is the reason why there's
[33:10] cedar trees at the top of our
subdivision because it's wet. And so
[33:15] when I drilled some soups for my deck, I
had a machine, you know, big machine
[33:19] come and they went down 4 feet and they
hit um limestone outcrop
[33:24] » and that's as far as they could go. So
in the spring when the snow melts um and
[33:29] it goes down, it hits the limestone
outcrop and I'm at the top of the hill.
[33:32] I have no relief to drain anywhere. So I
have to pump up to the DTI ditch. And so
[33:37] I have about five gallons a minute that
I'm pumping for about a month and a half
[33:42] because it hits and it comes up to about
a foot higher than my basement. But
[33:45] that's water that's perched. That's not
the stuff that's we're really talking
[33:49] about.
>> Yeah. That's that's above the sediment.
[33:52] » Yeah. It looks wet, but it's it's it's
sealed off from the the aquifer. The the
[33:58] other thing they don't mention in the
EIA is a tree nursery has grown
[34:02] immensely in the past five years, five,
six years. Um, John mentioned the
[34:09] federal program and it's something they
grabbed that money and we heard them
[34:14] working over there in 2024 and they were
heating these green houses. We think
[34:19] they're about 250 ft long. We we're not
sure, but they're about there's 10 of
[34:26] them. Each one is about 30 feet wide.
They're enormous, bigger than anything
[34:31] else they've got over there. And we're
sort of saying, well, before you build
[34:37] those great big green houses and
populate them with seedlings, shouldn't
[34:41] you looked at the water consideration
before this major expansion? But we I I
[34:48] don't know. We're just speculating. It
was the money that was there. They had
[34:53] to do it quickly. And now we're now
we're they're threatening our wells,
[35:00] » you know, because a new well cost, you
know, $15 to $20,000. That's a lot of
[35:04] money.
>> That's why I say that that little $5,000
[35:08] instrument
>> on those two $20,000 wells is a minor
[35:12] cost. And if they were totally
transparent, that thing will will
[35:17] actually transmit to a cloud and you can
go on the website and so the residents
[35:21] could go and see what the water level
is. I don't think that's going to
[35:23] happen, but I would think the trainers
would like to know for their own thing
[35:28] rather than fill those in. And
the worst thing that could happen is to
[35:32] monitor flow from a flow meter on the
pipes that are going to the tree
[35:37] nursery. So just think of it as one big
pipe. put a flow meter on that and they
[35:41] say, "Okay, well, we were only taking,
you know, 800,000
[35:47] liters a day out of that, but you don't
know how that's affecting the wells."
[35:51] That's what you're bringing in. And the
pump test for 72 hours may have told you
[35:56] that was there, but 72 hours is kind of
short.
[36:03] » Yes,
>> Mayor has a question.
[36:05] » Um, yeah. I I guess the thing that I I
strikes me most about this is um
[36:12] we can sit and speculate because none of
us are hydro geologists and we don't
[36:16] even know if the nurseries on the same
aquifer. Do you guys know if it's on the
[36:20] same acryer as you're on?
>> Well, I I would suspect that there's one
[36:24] that covers that whole area.
>> But see, but tech,
[36:26] » but the acryers usually are are
>> Yeah, the thing is we we don't know
[36:30] that. You don't know that. Nobody knows.
>> We don't know that either. And my point
[36:34] is is I don't know why there was not um
meetings that that to me is the thing
[36:40] that you can do something about. We can
sit and speculate whether there's enough
[36:43] water or there's not enough water or
whatever, but you know, we're none of us
[36:46] are the experts on it. And what we
should be pushing for I think is um
[36:53] questions to be answered at a meeting by
by the people who are experts in it and
[36:59] then you can make a you know a good
decision because I mean it's not us. I
[37:02] mean, I don't know whether you could
pump. I used to work in the nursery,
[37:04] another full disclosure, but that was in
the 90s.
[37:06] » I used to work in the in the tree
nursery in the 70s.
[37:09] » It was very 90s
and uh so it sounds like it's changed a
[37:13] lot since I and you know, you know, I'm
certainly not an expert at it, but
[37:19] there's no reason on earth that that you
know, because we can sit here and
[37:22] speculate. I know nothing about pumping
water from the river. Um you know, I
[37:26] might guess because of proximity you
might be in the same aquifer, but then
[37:29] again, you might not. Um, I've learned
that from this waters people I work with
[37:34] the the ones who were doing our water
surveying for fun. We were looking at at
[37:38] different things and as to why my my
well I I have a lot of water and why my
[37:42] neighbor down the road just went dry.
And our guy looked at it and goes,
[37:45] "Well, because you're not in the same
acquer, you know, and we're not that far
[37:47] apart." So that you just don't know. But
there are people who do. And my point is
[37:52] that I think we should be looking at you
getting somebody to come and answer
[37:56] these questions and and in a way that
you know you and I and all the rest of
[38:00] us here understand. So I'm hoping that
um you know you will push that and I'm
[38:05] hoping that Cindy will do something to
to get these people going. The reason
[38:09] they hire consultants is because the
consultants are supposed to know this
[38:12] and so they should be doing the testing
and they should be telling you know
[38:16] people in words that they understand
what's going on. So
[38:19] » that's the big thing. It's a lack of
information and that breeds fear.
[38:23] » That's right.
>> In your subdivision. Okay. So, we're not
[38:25] against them taking the water if it's
there.
[38:27] » That's fine.
>> Um, but you know, we don't want to be
[38:29] the litmus test as our wells go dry that
they're taking too much.
[38:33] » Too late then.
>> And it's too late then. So,
[38:35] » you need the assurance that the water is
there.
[38:38] » There. We need to know how much they're
going to take. We need to know how much
[38:41] the aquifer recharges it every year. And
it's not going to be great year for
[38:45] doing that. Yeah.
>> And um there's just a lot of questions
[38:49] and people are scared and um and two big
big well truck pulled up behind Daryl's
[38:55] house and started drilling well. So
people are like they're drilling already
[38:59] » kind of thing. But it was the test well
but they're going to fill it in.
[39:02] » Yeah.
>> It doesn't make any sense when they got
[39:04] an opportunity to put an observation
unit on there.
[39:07] » Yeah. But see that's the other thing we
don't know. I mean we we think the test
[39:10] well might be useful. They may have
reasons to think it's not. And it's the
[39:14] information of that that you need so
that you can make the the right
[39:17] decision.
>> Well, when New Maryland put their three
[39:20] wells, they put them all around the well
and they added four new ones. That to me
[39:23] kind of says we don't want to affect the
residents and at certain point you got
[39:27] to do something else.
>> But they also know their hydro geology
[39:29] too and we don't.
>> That is true. Yeah.
[39:32] » That's the thing.
No, no. All I'm not trying to be, you
[39:36] know, devil's advocate here, but all I'm
saying is we need to have the right
[39:38] information and the information is what
we should be pushing for. Yeah, we need
[39:42] we need the test wells and and asurances
>> and council, you have a question.
[39:47] » Is it for sure that they are going to
decommission
[39:51] » those wells? It says can be
decommissioned. It doesn't say will be
[39:55] decommissioned.
>> It does in another thing that I Oh, it
[39:57] does.
>> It does. There's they're to be capped
[40:00] with a say cement, but some sort of
plastic rubber stuff, you know. Yeah.
[40:07] And I and I get why they do that. I
mean, you're really, if you sell your if
[40:10] your house burns down and you sell the
lot, um, you're you're supposed to
[40:14] actually get a permit to decommission
the well.
[40:16] » Yes.
>> Every well has to be decommissioned.
[40:18] It's not used.
>> Yeah.
[40:20] » Because they don't water pollution going
down into the aquifer is the real
[40:25] » No one's falling in those small.
>> All right. Any other questions or
[40:29] comments?
>> No.
[40:31] » Appreciate the chance to talk to you
folks. Terry, I'll leave you the copy of
[40:33] the presentation.
>> That's great. I'll put it in our file.
[40:36] » Sure.
>> Well, thank you very much. Thank you
[40:37] very much.
>> Enlightening.
[40:39] » I got I got a few press. For some
reason, I got voted to be the
[40:42] spokesperson for the
[40:46] job.
>> Yeah. Anyway,
[40:47] » good job.
>> We have jobs for you.
[40:51] » Yeah.
>> Maybe I should run.
[40:56] » You know, everybody's concerned about
their their wellwater these days.
[40:58] » Oh, I I used to water my garden up front
and people are going by and they're
[41:02] looking at me going, "Oh, no. Sorry."
do that at night in the dark.
[41:07] » Yes, it's
>> bad counterfeit. Well,
[41:10] » but that's one thing that they found out
when they did the wells in New Maryland
[41:13] is that they did sink three big wells.
Two of the bigger wells they cannot run
[41:16] at the same time. They have to alternate
them.
[41:19] » Well, the Marylandto had a lot of water
problems out there anyway.
[41:22] » I used to live there. They didn't
develop spring water of yours spring
[41:25] water place and I was on a well but a
lot of the people when I was living
[41:29] there in the early late 80s
>> who were original residents of New who
[41:34] had 50 foot wells they all ran dry
>> because they have seven or 8 thousand
[41:38] people now and they're all stuck in the
water straws.
[41:41] » You should change the name from
Springwater Place to something else. I
[41:43] know we have we have a spring water lane
in in either of
[41:46] » you.
Thank you gentlemen.
[41:50] » Thank you
>> presentation.
[41:53] » You don't have to run away. You stay and
enjoy the rest of the council meeting if
[41:56] you like.
>> We want our signs.
[42:01] » We're working.
I wasn't one of the ones, but we had
[42:04] some very active folks in our in our
subdivision that did not want to be part
[42:08] of Verdictton. And
>> I must say that um was it um Austin
[42:14] » David Bath?
>> No, no, it was the MLA at that time for
[42:18] he's he's gone now, but um anyway, he
said, "No problem. Get the thing. Sign
[42:24] everybody onto it." And he says, "I'll
make the changes." And it happened.
[42:26] » Well, if you didn't hear, welcome to
>> H.
[42:31] » We've always liked it.
move into town.
[42:39] » Okay, moving item seven, uh, business
arising from the cons.
[42:44] » Yep.
>> Yeah,
[42:45] » we have Chief Graphs with us tonight.
So, we'll move on to 7A, the Kings Clear
[42:48] Fire Department report.
[42:58] » Good evening, worship.
No more from the public. Stop.
[43:05] » Should get you to go first. There we go.
>> No problem.
[43:10] » Uh,
you got my copy of calls we had in
[43:16] December.
[43:22] I think there was uh 12 accidents at 12
poles
[43:30] and hydro lines of course
three
[43:35] one structure
[43:40] it was put down as a electrical problem
that's what the call come in as
[43:46] what it was is buddy was throwing out
his water pipes with the
[43:52] » heater, right?
>> Oh, no.
[43:54] » Yeah. Went in the house and seeing the
smoke and
[44:00] so could be in this electrical problem,
but it was on fire when we
[44:08] » So, we got real quick and
moved on.
[44:12] » Yeah. Still people still try to unthaw
their place with a torch. Go figure.
[44:16] » Yeah. Well, no, this is heat gun. Yeah.
Heat gun. Yeah. So, I mean, the torches
[44:22] and trigger locked and
>> it was taped up. So,
[44:26] » there's a lot of heat up on those heat
guns.
[44:28] » Oh, yeah. He went inside to have a
coffee or whatever and
[44:34] » how quick it can happen.
>> Yeah.
[44:36] » Very simple.
Uh, another thing we're looking at
[44:43] is uh doing an ice rescue
course and elevator course.
[44:50] » It's going to be what? $425 per person,
but not everyone's taking it.
[45:00] And
with your blessing, I guess we will uh
[45:06] if we set it up, we'll probably sell
some seats to the capital district,
[45:12] » right? Like if we use six and they only
take 12, then we get six seats that we
[45:18] could sell.
>> That's a good idea. Help defay the cost
[45:22] anyway.
>> Yeah, that's right.
[45:25] » I think we only have one out of the
veteran hammer,
[45:28] » too. school in the hotel.
>> There's one in the school.
[45:32] » There you go.
>> So, good stuff to know.
[45:38] » Oh, yeah. You need to know that.
>> I got to deal with them.
[45:42] » And
we have some props from fire marshall's
[45:47] office.
Extinguisher prop. Basically shows you
[45:52] how to do use an extinguisher.
So, that's available anytime we want it.
[45:58] So any functions going on?
>> So Chief Crimson and I were saying that
[46:04] maybe ham days.
>> Yes.
[46:06] » We could probably have
>> probably do it.
[46:10] » Yeah.
>> And bring the trailer the trailer into
[46:13] the kids.
>> Good idea.
[46:15] » Good idea.
>> A little bit of knowledge comes in
[46:18] handy. I mean, you grab an extinguisher
and you can't you it doesn't work. I'll
[46:21] pull the pin out of it.
>> If you don't know that, you could be
[46:24] caught. Yeah. And with the trailer and
stuff, it's good to know well in
[46:29] advance.
So if you're up to it, I'll make the
[46:34] call.
>> So we'll have booked for a weekend.
[46:38] » Yeah. Sounds like a good idea.
>> So Chief Chris, will you be able to do
[46:44] our training for our summer students
this year on the fire extinguishers?
[46:48] Because we did that last year, right?
That didn't we do training on fire
[46:52] extinguishers? Yeah, we did. Not a lot,
but we did. Yeah.
[46:59] And you get there new students this
year.
[47:01] » Uh possibly we'll be probably getting
additional students.
[47:07] » Because EFF will be coming up too, the
end of May, 1st of June.
[47:12] » Yes. Right.
>> So,
[47:15] we have the other students. They're all
>> all have numbers and stuff. So, there's
[47:21] anything a major I'll be making a call
looking for bodies there.
[47:31] » Okay. Any questions for the chief?
>> That was it.
[47:35] » You're getting off easy tonight.
>> All right. Now to another meeting.
[47:41] » No rest.
>> So, thank you, Chief.
[47:44] » Thanks, Chief.
>> Appreciate it.
[47:45] » I, Council McKenzie, move to receive the
fire department report for December.
[47:49] » Second
floor. Second. Any questions, comments?
[47:54] All those in favor signify by saying I.
>> I.
[47:57] » Contrary minded. Motion carried. Thank
you. Uh item B, we have the municipal
[48:02] vehicle use policy number 202601. I'm
gathering everybody has read that in
[48:06] their package.
>> So if so, uh I'll get a motion, please.
[48:10] » I councelor duly move to adopt policy
2026-01,
[48:14] the municipal vehicle use policy.
>> Second.
[48:18] » I councelor Delete a second.
>> Okay. Do we have any questions? his
[48:22] comments.
>> Just didn't we already have this this
[48:25] municipal use policy? We just didn't. We
just never enacted it. We talked about
[48:29] it for a long time.
>> I think we talked about it, but it was
[48:31] never
really
[48:33] » Oh, I just assume we need it updated for
the fire department.
[48:36] » No, we've never had it.
>> Never had it.
[48:38] » I know we talked about it.
>> We did. We did, but we never but we've
[48:42] never
>> Okay.
[48:45] » Okay. Any other questions or comments?
>> All those in favor signify by saying I.
[48:49] » I. Contrary minded motion carried. Thank
you. Uh item C, black art portfolio
[48:55] phase one. Again, this was in the uh
package. If anybody I'm sure everybody's
[49:01] gone over it.
[49:04] So, we have to decide whether to move on
to phase two or or stop at phase one.
[49:12] But I do need you to um adopt
>> your your report for phase one.
[49:20] » Okay. So, need a motion to adopt phase
one.
[49:22] » I councelor Fox move to adopt the
strategic roadmap phase one report
[49:27] prepared by the black arcs and port
portfolio for phase one of the traffic
[49:32] flow growth and infrastructure planning
software.
[49:35] » Second.
>> I council Julie second.
[49:38] » Any questions, comments? We're good. All
those in favor signify by saying I.
[49:42] » I.
>> Contraminded.
[49:45] » Motion carried. Thank you. Now, uh the
second motion on there is whether we're
[49:49] going to uh move into phase two or what
not. So, we'll get the motion on the
[49:52] floor and then we'll have discussion if
needed.
[49:54] » I would like to. So I I councelor
McKenzie move to authorize the CEO to
[49:58] enter into a contract for black arcs and
portfolio to continue onto phase two of
[50:03] the strategic road mapping software
development and traffic flow plan in the
[50:07] amount of $38,871
plus HST for a total of $44,71.65.
[50:15] » Secer
high second.
[50:18] » All righty. We have a motion on the
floor. Any questions, comments?
[50:24] Um, no. I I think we met a presentation
from them
[50:28] » and it seems very pertinent to what we
want to do, what we need to do uh to
[50:32] continue on with our traffic issues and
hand also.
[50:36] » Okay. Any other comments?
>> No. All those in favor signify by saying
[50:40] I.
>> I.
[50:41] » Contrary minded motion carried. Thank
you. Item D, uh, adapted to the agenda
[50:47] treasures report. So, I'll turn this
over to chair.
[50:50] So, council, I wanted to um speak about
the
[50:54] my treasures report, the CIO report um
part of it, I just gave um a list of
[51:01] everything that we got accomplished
last year. So, you can um read that.
[51:08] However, for the treasures report, um I
just wanted to let you know that our
[51:13] 2026 general operating budget was
approved by the province on December the
[51:19] 17th
and they approved the following rate. So
[51:24] residential for no street lights, it's
going to be
[51:29] 3683
cents and street lights 3894.
[51:36] non-residential will be um 0.5525
cents and street lights would be 0.541.
[51:47] So based on the residential property
with no street lights and an assessed
[51:52] value at $300,000, this would equate to
a tax bill of about approximately
[51:58] $1,14.90.
[52:01] Um, so this is $44.70
increase over last year's rate of 3534.
[52:09] So with cost of living and us needing
additional staffing and um services and
[52:18] um recreation stuff, um I think $44 is
we did very well. So, um, property
[52:26] assessment notices for 2026 taxation
year have been mailed out. I think a lot
[52:32] of people probably got them this week.
>> As previously discussed, the province
[52:37] has applied a one-year freeze on the
value of the property. Therefore, tax
[52:42] bills will be calculated using the 2025
property assessment value. Um, these
[52:48] figures are used to calculate property
taxes, keeping in mind that not all
[52:53] properties are eligible for this freeze.
I did see on social media today somebody
[52:59] saying that, um, they received theirs
and there wasn't a freeze. So, um,
[53:04] refers to Service New Brunswick's
property tax freeze. Um, they have a
[53:08] website and it lists, um, all the
reasons for non-eligible,
[53:14] um, properties. There was about six of
them.
[53:17] Um, so Service New Brunswick is
responsible for assessing and
[53:22] classifying properties in New Brunswick,
not municipalities.
[53:26] So residents should address their
concerns with Service New Brunswick by
[53:31] calling 18887628600.
[53:37] And the deadline to file a request for
review is February the 18th. and
[53:43] property tax bills will be mailed out on
March the 2nd.
[53:49] » And just as a note of clarity, you had
mentioned the the tax bill for the
[53:52] $300,000 assessment. That was only the
municipal portion, which is about 40% of
[53:57] the tax bill. There's also an additional
60% of the tax bill that comes directly
[54:00] from the province. Yes.
>> So residents happen to notice that my
[54:03] tax bill should only be $1,000 on
300,000. Well, that's that's the reason
[54:07] why it would could be 60% higher than
that. So,
[54:09] » right. Correct.
[54:14] Okay. Any questions for Karen?
[54:20] » I move to receive the CA report.
>> Captain Mackenzie, I second.
[54:25] » All right. Any other questions,
comments?
[54:28] All those in favor signify by saying I.
>> I.
[54:31] » Contrary mind. Motion carries. Thank
you. Uh item 8 A, new business. Uh 8A,
[54:38] Madison Heights subdivision 2025 phase
2. So this is the second phase of that
[54:42] that's been going in. We already had
phase one. Yes.
[54:46] » Not that long ago.
>> Yeah. So with um phase two, they were um
[54:52] approved for this a little while back.
Um the developer um doesn't plan on
[54:59] doing anything for a bit. He's going to
do phase one. However, instead of having
[55:04] to come back later, he just figured that
we would just put these on the books
[55:10] now. So,
so once again, we can um take the 8%
[55:18] which is calculated in your table or you
can ask for 8%
[55:24] um of the total area of the lots as in
land.
[55:29] We can ask for part land, part cash.
[55:37] » Okay. Can I get a motion, please?
[55:42] » 8A motion under Madison Height
subdivision 2025 phase one in red.
[55:48] » I'll make a motion and then we can see
where it goes.
[55:52] I councelor Heislip move that the rural
community of Hanwell request a sum of
[55:56] money up to 8% of the value of the
property in the amount of $24,783.92
[56:03] as per similar sales and SMB property
assessments online as divined in the
[56:09] table following. Do you want me to read
the table?
[56:13] » No.
>> Okay,
[56:15] » it'll be in the minutes.
>> Thank you.
[56:17] » Can I have a second or please?
>> I councelor Dele second. Any questions,
[56:21] comments? Council Penzy,
>> just uh make a comment there for people
[56:25] that might be listening as to why I'm
going to vote the way I am. I made it
[56:29] clear hopefully probably not. Uh many
many moons ago that um in the cases of
[56:35] us looking for land public purposes,
whether it be land or money, I will
[56:39] always vote for the side of land. Um
tried a couple times in the past and
[56:43] know that usually always fails. Um so
this time, same holds true. I'm not
[56:49] going to support taking the money for
this. I would have rather see the land
[56:52] uh I don't care if it's only 100 square
feet and plant a tree on it, right? It
[56:55] doesn't really matter the the size. Um I
think we need the land is more usable
[57:01] regardless of what it is over the small
amount of money to get over this. So
[57:05] that's why I will not be supporting this
motion.
[57:08] » Okay. Any other questions, comments?
>> I have just one other comment.
[57:11] » Deputy Mayor. Um
I guess the one thing I would like maybe
[57:16] that we could ask the uh service
commission to do going forward um is
[57:22] they they put in a recommendation as to
whether you know they want land whether
[57:26] we should look at lander money. I know
every uh subdivision is different. Um
[57:31] I'm a great proponent of if we could get
land that's useful there. Um we should.
[57:39] If we don't then I don't have a problem
with the money. But I guess what I would
[57:42] like to see happen, I don't know how
much when people come in to do these
[57:46] things. I know sometimes people will
come and they'd like us to take a piece
[57:49] of land and we had that come up and it
it didn't seem feasible at the time, but
[57:53] I'd like to see somewhere in the
documentation because usually the
[57:56] service commission is very good at
working with the developers and I'd like
[58:00] to see some kind of in their report um
just where they've indicated whether or
[58:05] not they they've discussed this option
with the with the land owner
[58:10] » to take the land. No,
>> just to have
[58:13] » if there's any land that would be
>> to work with them for this to be a
[58:17] collaborative thing, I guess, is my idea
because some people, you know, would be
[58:21] interested in in that option and maybe
aren't aware of it and so and there may
[58:27] be cases where they are wanting to do
that. land's not suitable, but I'd just
[58:30] like to see a note in in their files
when we get them whether they've
[58:34] actually discussed this and and worked
with the land owner to see which option
[58:39] really is the best for everybody
concerned.
[58:41] » That would be nice. And
>> yeah,
[58:43] » like where it would be in the plot.
>> Yeah.
[58:46] » When you when you look at when when we
look at this map in front of us, what we
[58:50] see is the proposed building lots, what
we don't see is where where said
[58:56] property as the 8% could be. Yeah.
>> And and what value we would put on it.
[59:02] So
>> yeah,
[59:03] » that makes sense.
>> There's no knowledge as to where that 8%
[59:06] could be, what what it is, where it is.
>> Councelor Fox,
[59:09] » just a a question to um the CEO. I'm
just wondering, do we I can't recall how
[59:18] many lots there were in phase one.
>> I can tell you, right here.
[59:23] » I think there would have been eight
because there's nine. It starts at
[59:25] number nine in phase two. So there must
have been eight.
[59:27] » Must be eight. I'm wondering.
[59:32] » Yeah,
>> the same.
[59:34] » There was eight.
>> Okay.
[59:36] » Oh, well, eight. Uh, one of them was
that pond
[59:41] » one. So, there's actually one, two,
three, four, five, six, seven. Yeah,
[59:45] eight. And one was
>> not useful.
[59:49] » Not useful.
>> Okay. Any other questions or comments?
[59:51] Council Hawks.
>> Well, so just to comment on that. So now
[59:55] we're now we're looking at um 15 plots,
right?
[1:00:00] » Um in total. That kind of changes things
for me because now we're not looking at
[1:00:06] something small. Now we're looking at a
larger subdivision and how many lots do
[1:00:10] you need before we should have some land
um as opposed to, you know, just taking
[1:00:16] the money, right? So um yeah. So anyway,
just I just wanted to say that that it
[1:00:22] it just kind of changes things because
now it's it's bigger, right?
[1:00:27] » And and how big becomes big enough that
we need to take some.
[1:00:33] » So council, um I don't believe from
talking to the developer that he's in a
[1:00:39] big rush um for this. If you would like,
I can go back and ask them like, is it
[1:00:45] possible
to possibly do the land portion of it?
[1:00:51] How big of the area and where would it
be? And then I can bring it back. We're
[1:00:56] probably going to have a couple of um
meetings in February with the audited
[1:01:01] financial statements and different
things that we've got going on. So, I
[1:01:06] could certainly talk to the developer if
you want to kind of put this on hold and
[1:01:13] then bring it back to you afterwards.
>> Should I ask another question?
[1:01:19] » Yeah, possibly want to maybe run that
through Lonnie and he can contact the
[1:01:22] developer, right? Is that what I'm
saying?
[1:01:24] » Um, it can be. I mean, he's been here in
my office times. So,
[1:01:30] » yeah. But actually this was my point
exactly uh as to why we'd like to have
[1:01:35] this stuff worked out before because it
really is not up. We should not be the
[1:01:38] ones talking to him that it should go
through the develop through the
[1:01:43] development officers and go through
Lonnie's office.
[1:01:46] » It's their responsibility.
>> It's their responsibility to do that
[1:01:48] stuff for us. Yeah.
>> Our planners.
[1:01:51] » Yeah.
>> Yeah. So you can contact Li if if that's
[1:01:53] what council desires. Then we'd have to
table this motion to our next meeting.
[1:01:57] » I'd like to have the discussion with
them actually.
[1:02:00] as always.
>> Okay,
[1:02:02] » I can just resend the motion.
>> No, I think we just set the table with
[1:02:05] no
>> we could just make a motion to to
[1:02:07] postpone this to a future um council
session.
[1:02:13] » I can make a motion. I'd like to
make a motion to postpone the motion on
[1:02:18] the floor to a future session of council
to meet.
[1:02:21] » Second.
>> I councelor newly will second.
[1:02:23] » Any questions, comments? All those in
favor signify by saying I.
[1:02:27] » I. So, this motion has been postponed
until our probably our next meeting or
[1:02:32] until Lonnie gets some information for
us.
[1:02:35] » Okay, moving on to item B. Uh, the radon
testing uh remediation. Terry has uh
[1:02:41] talked to those folks and she has some
information for us.
[1:02:44] » Thank you. So, I
I contacted a company um I found one and
[1:02:51] actually plus
was talking to them the day before
[1:02:55] yesterday. um they had to come today um
to do something in Preerton. So they
[1:03:02] came over, they looked at our results.
Um they really think that it probably
[1:03:09] has something to do with the air
exchange. Um
[1:03:15] our boardrooms um were quite high.
However, in those areas, you're not
[1:03:21] getting a whole lot of air circulation.
We had them closed up a lot. There's not
[1:03:27] windows in there. Um they said that
I was worried because we didn't test the
[1:03:34] community hall
>> and I said, you know, like I'm just kind
[1:03:39] of worried with um rents and stuff. He
said the air circulating all the time,
[1:03:44] especially where the room is so large.
>> So I mentioned to him about using the
[1:03:50] boardrooms as well. And he said he
really he said as long as you kind of
[1:03:54] kept a wall part of our wall or a door
open like into the community hall or
[1:04:00] into this um part, he really didn't see
um an issue with it. He said radon is
[1:04:07] long-term exposure. So he said having a
a rent is not going to um do anything.
[1:04:16] Saying that u they did go through our
building, looked at all of the air
[1:04:20] exchange. I said that we are also
working with PMC right now to look at
[1:04:26] our air exchange system anyway. So there
is a pipe. I didn't think that we
[1:04:33] probably had the radon um pipe. 2015 it
was put in as code that you every
[1:04:41] building had to have one. I didn't think
that we had one. He said that for a
[1:04:47] building this size, there are probably a
few of them and they're probably in the
[1:04:51] walls
>> or whatever. Um, so I'm going to go back
[1:04:56] and look at the plans. He was just here
today and we'll try to see if there's
[1:05:01] other ones, but there is one in our
mechanical room. So, what they're
[1:05:07] thinking of doing um they will cut a
small hole um probably somewhere close
[1:05:14] to the front of the building in the
floor and it's like a vacuum.
[1:05:18] » Mhm.
>> Okay.
[1:05:18] » To be able to see and if there is a air
intake or something then they'll know
[1:05:24] more. So, they're going to do some
testing um first. I don't have a price
[1:05:30] for you. I had a kind of a blank motion
for you, but I think it's too premature.
[1:05:37] Um, if anything, maybe just do a motion
just saying that
[1:05:44] to let me mitigate it or whatever. But,
um, I think that's kind of common sense
[1:05:50] that it's something that we've got to
do. Um,
[1:05:53] » just being an operational thing.
>> Yeah, I really think it is an
[1:05:55] operational
>> or whatever. and until I find out costs
[1:06:00] and stuff and then I will bring it back.
But it's something now that we are aware
[1:06:04] of we really should.
>> Yeah. This would be budget under
[1:06:08] building maintenance. Really? Really?
>> Yeah. So, it's only if it came back and
[1:06:12] it was, you know, tons and tons of
money, then I would um bring it forward
[1:06:17] to you. But it is something that we've
got to uh
[1:06:22] get fixed. And um yeah, we're very
fortunate, I think, to uh be able to get
[1:06:28] them in days
>> notice or whatever. So, I will update
[1:06:32] you as soon as we knew know more. They
were going to I gave them um a copy of
[1:06:38] our foundation
plan and stuff. So, they were going to
[1:06:42] kind of look at that and see cuz we're
only on a slab kind of thing. So he
[1:06:49] really thinks that a lot of it is um
just the air circulation which may be
[1:06:54] fixed.
>> Is it the lack of air circulation or is
[1:06:57] it something that's in the circulation
system that's making that room worse or
[1:07:01] those areas?
>> So well the the boardrooms has um very
[1:07:05] little circulation because they're
always closed up, right?
[1:07:07] » Um the mayor's office also that was a
little bit higher but a lot of times
[1:07:13] he's kind of in our offices, right? So
not really um into that one.
[1:07:18] So,
I think it's just kind of usage and when
[1:07:23] things are closed off, of course, you're
not going
[1:07:26] » to the folding doors open unless there's
a reason to close them, then that would
[1:07:30] get rid of that problem.
>> Yeah, that's kind of good news.
[1:07:32] » Well, see, we didn't know until we had
this. So um yeah so I think um once we I
[1:07:39] will discuss this with um PMC as well
and maybe it's part of that whole air
[1:07:45] exchange um thing that we can rectify.
So maybe between the two companies we
[1:07:50] can uh get
>> Shouldn't be very expensive to do that.
[1:07:53] It's usually just a little fan. So if
the pipes were already done like that
[1:07:56] for code they probably already have the
electrical and everything already run.
[1:08:00] Yeah, cuz I think he said that um with
the pipe then it's another pipe that
[1:08:04] will go up through to the roof.
>> Yeah, it just fans
[1:08:10] like
>> I will say I will say this though. Um we
[1:08:13] can leave the doors open between the
hall and the boardrooms. However, both
[1:08:17] of those rooms are heated differently.
So then you've got a cross biting
[1:08:21] between the hall heat and the boardroom
heat.
[1:08:24] » Boardroom's geothermal where the hall is
not. So this side maybe
[1:08:29] » it is can be left open on this side like
towards the hallway.
[1:08:32] » Yeah.
>> Yeah.
[1:08:34] » Through the day.
>> Through the day. Through the day. Yeah.
[1:08:36] And then he said that was kind of
another thing. Um
[1:08:41] » our heating system it cools down at
night like usually 4:00 our heating
[1:08:46] system will cool down. So he said that
radon
[1:08:49] » will rise. Right. So he said that
there's other um systems that we can get
[1:08:56] the little pucks that we have um kind of
interesting the radon pits that plastic.
[1:09:05] So they have to take a microscope and
they have to count all those little dots
[1:09:10] that are have hit the inside of that. So
I was like okay this was like not much
[1:09:15] bigger than a tuni kind of thing. And
they counted like the 600 Sounds great.
[1:09:22] So, um, he said that there are tests
that will be more of a graph and I was
[1:09:30] mentioning about yours, Counselor
McKenzie, and he was wondering if yours
[1:09:34] hooks up to a computer that um will show
you those graphs.
[1:09:38] » You can. Yeah. I I don't I just use the
stuff that's built into the machine with
[1:09:41] it, but you can get
>> or whatever. So, good way to do it.
[1:09:46] » Yeah. Anyway, so um I ended up having to
leave to go to a meeting. So, I didn't I
[1:09:51] wasn't able to finish the last of it.
And he said he'd contact me um tomorrow.
[1:09:56] So, I'll know more as we move forward,
but maybe we'll have to do some other
[1:10:01] kind of testing. So, we're on
>> Okay. Okay. Moving on to item nine,
[1:10:06] proclamations. We do not have any. Uh
item 10, upcoming activities. January
[1:10:11] 22nd to February the 8th Frost of
Snowshoe and ski loan pickup Monday to
[1:10:15] Friday 8:00 a.m. to 400 p.m. Contact
Hanwell Recreation at Recreation at
[1:10:20] Hanwell.b.ca for more information.
February 28th, the Moonlight Hike at
[1:10:24] Hanwell Recreation Park at 7:00 p.m.
Item 11, we do not have a close session
[1:10:28] for tonight. Item 12, date, time, and
location. Next meeting will regular
[1:10:31] council meeting council chambers,
February the 18th, 2026 at 7 p.m. Can I
[1:10:35] get a motion to adjurnn, please?
I councelor Fox move to adjourn.