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I think we're going to go ahead and get

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started. Um, so we have a planned use

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work session

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to help address some of the concerns of

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the ordinance 569.

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Yeah. Well,

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Sarah, you're going to try and lead us

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on this first part.

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» Yeah. Once I figure out the microphone,

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I'll I'll be all ready to go. Like I

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can't see it. Hopefully they taught that

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to you in the engineering class.

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» Didn't teach me because the problem I

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can't see it.

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» All right. Yes. So, um I know I received

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some comments from Commissioner

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Montgomery. He's not here yet and I

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don't know if those are distributed to

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everyone for discussion or Okay.

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» Yeah. So we can go through those. Um or

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if you have any um concerns or questions

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or thoughts before we go into those. Um

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I'm I'm happy if you you've read this

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unless you want me to kind of give a

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presentation on I can do that.

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Otherwise, I can just address your

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concerns.

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» I think I mean you guys might have

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questions regarding it. I don't know if

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you want to ask those now and then she

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can help cover all those.

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Yeah.

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» Start good.

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» So, why don't you go ahead and just kind

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of give us a presentation over.

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» So, um the state has um wanted us to

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implement uh accessory dwelling units.

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We implemented the internal accessory

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dwelling unit and that was statemandated

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two or three years ago. I'm thinking now

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I wasn't a part of that but now um this

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year they just passed that we need to

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have some sort of a detached ADU

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ordinance and the state gave us some

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guidelines things we could consider some

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things we were not allowed to consider

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kind of typical boundaries and it is

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something I think as a city we were

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talking about before the state

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implemented it so um

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essentially what we've created is an

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ordinance that defines what an internal

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and a detached ADU is we talked about

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some lot sizes um and limitations that

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we were allowed to implement from state

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code. Um we determined we just wanted or

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this is what when I say we I'm talking

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about working with the planning

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commission. This is what they they

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proposed and that's what you're seeing

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in the proposed ordinance is one ADU per

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primary dwelling. So if you have an

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internal ADU, you wouldn't have an

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external ADU. Um, a prop property owner

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would need to live on the property means

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they could live in the ADU or in the

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main dwelling. They just need to be on

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the property. Um, no short-term or

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vacation rentals. Uh, we have we looked

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at addressing utilities permitting

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licensing requirements in this. And then

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I think most importantly the design the

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height setbacks compatibility um so that

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we

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may we allow ADUs with the least amount

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of impact surrounding properties. So in

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coming up with this ordinance I or the

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draft that we've been through I looked

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at statewide what are people what have

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people implemented for accessory mall

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units? What's working? what's causing

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complaints and frustrations. The the

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biggest complaints we're seeing were

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mostly like ADUs right next to a

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property line where the inhabitants can

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look into someone's property where they

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can see everyone. And you'll see some of

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the limitations are based on that

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feedback that people really felt a

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twotory ADU right next to their property

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line. It's one thing if it's a barn or

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uh any any sort of accessory structure

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where people aren't living, but once

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people are living in that space, it's

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like having someone live right on your

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property line. So, we tried to figure

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out how can we allow these with a lot of

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latitude without introducing too much um

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infringement on people's um privacy. So,

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uh, looking through,

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so our our general limitations, what we

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came up with at the planning commission,

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uh, no internal ADUs on parcels 6,000

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square ft or less and, um, no detached

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ADUs on parcels that are less than

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10,000 square ft.

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It's been a while now. I should have

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looked this. I'm trying to remember what

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the state code allowed. That's something

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I should have printed out. So I thought

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we went with the safe coat on that the

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minimum sizing minimum lot size. So a

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quarter acre but with that there also we

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the size of the ADU be tied to the lot

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size. So that's where um we see the

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maximum gross floor area of a detached

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ADU should not exceed the lesser of 10%

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of the lot area or the gross floor area

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of the primary dwelling. So, um, and it

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has to be the lesser of those two. So,

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if you have a 10,000 square foot lot,

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you could only have a 1,000 square ft

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ADU. And then like a third acre lot, you

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could have a 1500 ft ADU. Sorry. Yeah,

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1500. Making sure I did the math right.

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um up to

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um you know a 40,000 would be limited to

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a 4,000t ADU, but that would that's only

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if there's a 4,000 ft² or larger home on

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the property. So that's that's where

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we're getting the the size limitation.

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Um

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we limited to 30 consecutive days or

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longer and not be used as a vacation

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rental or short-term rental. That was

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the prohib the what we saw in internal

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ADUs. um from the state. And something

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Grover brought up it, not Grover, sorry,

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Grace brought up a different different G

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like what

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um was we could increase that to 90 days

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for the detach if we wanted to. Um so

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something to keep in your mind if if you

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want to do that, but it seems that we

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found that if you limit it 30 days,

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people aren't going to use that as a

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short-term rental in general. But

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something to think about just for

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simplifying the code. Um so and like say

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the property owner needs to occupy the

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primary dwelling or the ADU. One of them

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and uh of course they need all their

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permits, inspections, approvals, all

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sorts of life safety things that we'd

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expect from any sort of new building.

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And um and they cannot be created a full

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home park. And that's something the the

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state um allowed as well. So going on um

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for licensing, if it is going to be

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rented, they would need to have a

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business license

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and um utilities. We looked at

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um we didn't want to create a situation

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where people were putting in detached

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ADUs on failing septic lines or failing

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infrastructure. Am I missing something?

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No, this I just Thank you. Thank you. Um

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for the lot size.

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» Oh, the lot size. So the state said it

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at 11,000 square feet was the largest

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you could go and we went with 10,000

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square feet. So the state would let you

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go as low I mean as high as 11,000 ft.

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We did 10,000 so that that was the

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recommendation so that we could do the

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quarter acre lot so people would have

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small ADUs. But that's so that's what we

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» Now is that minimum or is that like the

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» Um that's the the minimum lot size that

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you can have a detached ADU.

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» Yeah. So then it would be

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» Above that you could do one as well but

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below that you could

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» Exactly.

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» Exactly. Um okay I should pause and

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breathe and see if you have any

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questions.

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» Okay. So we go back to the question of

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two story.

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» Oh yes. So is that an accumulative when

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we start talking about square footage

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first floor second floor has to be 12

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level.

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» Yeah it's a so the way it's written

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» That's nice I am

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» So max gross floor area

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» Max floor okay

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» Shall not exceed that

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» Yeah it's500 and 750 per level.

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» Yeah.

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» Any other questions? Uh, how do the tiny

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homes fit into this?

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» They fit just fine.

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» Well, they fit just fine because I know

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we have one person up around the corner

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here that has a tiny home and he's

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parked it and I know he's used it and

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now it's gone. So, I assume it's in a

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summer place or whatever. However,

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how does that fit into this ADU? If they

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park, pull something like that in and

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classify that as their ADU.

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» Oh, I see. If it's mobile,

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» Yeah,

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» That's not something we've addressed.

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So, that's something we probably want to

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look into.

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» I think you need to look into it because

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» Well, wasn't that your last statement?

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No mobile home.

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» Oh, it's slightly different. It can't be

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in a mobile home park.

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» Oh, sorry. Got you.

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» Um, but if someone wants to park their

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ADU temporarily, we probably should put

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some code in if that's what we want to

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allow on where it goes, what the hookups

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are, and it's just up to you. We want to

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allow temporary

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like

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tiny homes or do you want only permanent

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temporary homes? So, we were assuming

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only per permanent temporary homes. Um,

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the design standards would prohibit

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someone from just parking their RV and

236
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calling that an accessory dwelling unit.

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Um,

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00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:18,560
» I think that's I mean to my mind it when

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you start looking at a tiny home is even

240
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the RV world now are they're building a

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lot of

242
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park model type tiny home uh

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kickoffs if you will,

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00:10:31,839 --> 00:10:35,360
» You know, with some of them have two

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stories in them but there won't they

246
00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:41,040
more look like a mobile home still on

247
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wheels. still similar to what a tiny

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home is being built like.

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» And I guess that's the question. Do we

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00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:51,120
regulate the tiny homes on wheels as

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mobile homes or do we regulate them as

252
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um accessory dwelling units? Do I mean

253
00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:57,680
right now if someone wants to live in

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their mobile home on the property that

255
00:10:57,680 --> 00:11:03,120
would be just complaint driven of what

256
00:11:00,399 --> 00:11:05,200
happens for that situation. Uh if

257
00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:07,279
they're not hooking if these tiny homes

258
00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:10,079
are not hooking up to the utilities of

259
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the property. I mean, those are those

260
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are thoughts. Do we want to just leave

261
00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:18,079
it the way it is and they continue to

262
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operate as mobile homes that people own

263
00:11:18,079 --> 00:11:22,880
or do we want to actually make it a

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permitted use to have

265
00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:27,760
a mobile tiny home? I don't know how

266
00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:29,920
» My question would be since we're doing

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00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:31,839
this to comply with state law,

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00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:34,720
» They have anything to say about that?

269
00:11:31,839 --> 00:11:36,720
» I I don't think anything was addressed

270
00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:38,720
that. No, Grover's ahead of the curve

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00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:39,200
thinking of all these good things. Yeah,

272
00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:40,720
I

273
00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:43,279
» Well, I'm getting old. I may want to put

274
00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:45,200
something with my property because of

275
00:11:43,279 --> 00:11:49,839
this.

276
00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:52,399
» Um I I think what does cover it though?

277
00:11:49,839 --> 00:11:54,480
» Um I don't know if

278
00:11:52,399 --> 00:11:56,560
it's the language though, Sarah, that

279
00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:59,519
talks about it has to be hooked up to

280
00:11:56,560 --> 00:12:00,959
the utility. So the issue becomes health

281
00:11:59,519 --> 00:12:02,480
and safety with

282
00:12:00,959 --> 00:12:03,519
» Well that's that's the other part of

283
00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:05,040
this whole

284
00:12:03,519 --> 00:12:08,720
» Is is if we're going to be putting a

285
00:12:05,040 --> 00:12:11,040
permanent or even a semi-permanent

286
00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:12,880
uh structure on your home how does that

287
00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:16,240
tie into your electrical how does it tie

288
00:12:12,880 --> 00:12:19,360
into your sewer because because right

289
00:12:16,240 --> 00:12:22,399
now as I look at it just again a tiny

290
00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:24,320
home it's just parked there uh you know

291
00:12:22,399 --> 00:12:26,800
does it have its own tanks how does it

292
00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:28,399
do it because I know this tiny home

293
00:12:26,800 --> 00:12:31,519
Somebody may be living in it, but I can

294
00:12:28,399 --> 00:12:31,680
guarantee they're not doing their, you

295
00:12:31,519 --> 00:12:32,639
know,

296
00:12:31,680 --> 00:12:34,320
» Due diligence on that.

297
00:12:32,639 --> 00:12:36,800
» Due diligence on that. And I'm sure that

298
00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:38,639
individual goes and uses all the

299
00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:40,639
utilities and facilities inside the

300
00:12:38,639 --> 00:12:42,800
house, which for family, you could get

301
00:12:40,639 --> 00:12:43,839
away with, but if you're renting it, you

302
00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:45,519
know,

303
00:12:43,839 --> 00:12:47,440
» So the way the ordinance is currently

304
00:12:45,519 --> 00:12:51,200
written, you would not, it would have to

305
00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:53,040
be a permanent structure to be allowed

306
00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:54,720
as an accessory dwelling unit the way

307
00:12:53,040 --> 00:12:58,720
that we've currently proposed the

308
00:12:54,720 --> 00:13:00,639
ordinance. Um, so that's something if

309
00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:03,519
you wanted to look into allowing

310
00:13:00,639 --> 00:13:05,360
something, it would require significant

311
00:13:03,519 --> 00:13:07,839
I would really have to dive in and look

312
00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:10,639
at what kind of regulations we'd need in

313
00:13:07,839 --> 00:13:14,560
order to allow that. And I don't it it

314
00:13:10,639 --> 00:13:16,800
kind of gets more into an RV park or um

315
00:13:14,560 --> 00:13:19,200
a totally different area. So I don't

316
00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:21,600
know. I I really have to research that.

317
00:13:19,200 --> 00:13:23,920
I guess the question is is that

318
00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:26,560
something you want to allow? A lot of

319
00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:28,560
these tiny homes can be moved, but

320
00:13:26,560 --> 00:13:30,880
they're permanently affixed for the

321
00:13:28,560 --> 00:13:32,399
period of time. And then every time a

322
00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:34,800
home comes in, it would have to go

323
00:13:32,399 --> 00:13:37,360
through building inspection and

324
00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:40,160
permitting, make sure it's um meeting

325
00:13:37,360 --> 00:13:42,800
all of the utility requirements.

326
00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:46,160
So, is there a way of wording it in the

327
00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:48,959
in one sense to I mean, I've seen some

328
00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:52,000
buildings that are are pretty nice that

329
00:13:48,959 --> 00:13:53,760
have that were on wheels at one time

330
00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:57,360
that they haul up to the mountain and

331
00:13:53,760 --> 00:14:01,040
they put skirting around them and, you

332
00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:03,760
know, some 10 12 ft wide

333
00:14:01,040 --> 00:14:06,560
» And and they put it on, but yet they're

334
00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:09,519
also permanently connected to the sewer,

335
00:14:06,560 --> 00:14:12,639
» Permanently connected to the power, not

336
00:14:09,519 --> 00:14:15,199
by an extension core but by

337
00:14:12,639 --> 00:14:19,040
you know meter base and all those

338
00:14:15,199 --> 00:14:22,079
things. Um is there wording in our in

339
00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:23,839
this when now where it states about the

340
00:14:22,079 --> 00:14:27,120
requirements of those or just is it kind

341
00:14:23,839 --> 00:14:32,600
of a general statement? So it it says

342
00:14:27,120 --> 00:14:32,600
that they must um

343
00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:40,560
trying to think basically the um

344
00:14:38,720 --> 00:14:42,720
in design standards it must meet

345
00:14:40,560 --> 00:14:44,320
existing standards for residential homes

346
00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:45,839
as set forth in the Harrisville city

347
00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:48,000
code. So,

348
00:14:45,839 --> 00:14:51,839
» I think one way we can get around that

349
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:54,639
is uh or fix that is anything that's

350
00:14:51,839 --> 00:14:57,120
registered to the DMV is not a permanent

351
00:14:54,639 --> 00:14:58,560
home. So, anything on wheels is

352
00:14:57,120 --> 00:15:00,000
registered at the DMV. Just so

353
00:14:58,560 --> 00:15:00,639
everybody's aware of that.

354
00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:01,519
» Yeah.

355
00:15:00,639 --> 00:15:02,240
» Um and

356
00:15:01,519 --> 00:15:03,440
» Including tin

357
00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:05,040
» That wouldn't count. What?

358
00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:06,639
» Including tiny homes.

359
00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:08,560
» Uh they should be if they're on wheels

360
00:15:06,639 --> 00:15:10,959
still. They're they're registered the

361
00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:13,199
DMV. that once they take them off the

362
00:15:10,959 --> 00:15:15,680
wheels and as long as they meet the

363
00:15:13,199 --> 00:15:18,240
building standards, they can be wheeled

364
00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:20,720
to the property permanently affixed, get

365
00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:22,959
their building permit, and meet all the

366
00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:25,440
standards and be a tiny home. So, they

367
00:15:22,959 --> 00:15:26,639
can be constructed offsite and then

368
00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:29,360
they'll just go through the building

369
00:15:26,639 --> 00:15:31,279
process to be um permanent fixtures on

370
00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:33,199
site. So, that's currently how it's

371
00:15:31,279 --> 00:15:35,920
written. We wouldn't even have to add

372
00:15:33,199 --> 00:15:38,320
anything about the DMV. Currently, they

373
00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:39,839
have to meet building standards. And

374
00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:43,920
there are a lot of pre-manufactured

375
00:15:39,839 --> 00:15:46,160
homes, large and small, that are made to

376
00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:48,000
be transported and then permanently

377
00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:50,000
affixed to a site.

378
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:54,440
» I think if they follow the building

379
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:54,440
standards, I'm okay with

380
00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:58,560
I guess what is the whole purpose of the

381
00:15:56,800 --> 00:16:02,240
state wanting to bring this ordinance

382
00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:05,040
in? What's the idea behind it versus how

383
00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:06,880
is Harrison looking at it? Is it helping

384
00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:10,639
our citizens?

385
00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:12,240
» So your kids can live in your house.

386
00:16:10,639 --> 00:16:14,480
» So your kids or your parents can live

387
00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:14,880
with you but not in your house or else

388
00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:16,079
living?

389
00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:18,399
» Well, that's fine.

390
00:16:16,079 --> 00:16:19,519
» It's that what the state's saying we

391
00:16:18,399 --> 00:16:22,320
ought to do.

392
00:16:19,519 --> 00:16:23,920
» Sorry. Go ahead. So what we found is

393
00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:26,399
that they do increase housing

394
00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:29,680
opportunity, but where you have a

395
00:16:26,399 --> 00:16:32,480
permanent the a resident in charge of

396
00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:33,920
maintaining it on site, it reduces a lot

397
00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:36,480
of the problems we see with rental

398
00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:38,399
properties while providing the benefit

399
00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:40,800
of additional housing and income

400
00:16:38,399 --> 00:16:43,360
opportunities for the residents. So the

401
00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:45,920
balance I would say Grover is yes we

402
00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:47,199
want to give ample opportunity that when

403
00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:48,720
we were talking with the planning

404
00:16:47,199 --> 00:16:50,959
commission it's like how do we give an

405
00:16:48,720 --> 00:16:54,000
opportunity to all the residents without

406
00:16:50,959 --> 00:16:56,560
creating something that is detrimental

407
00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:59,360
to their neighbor. So is a home on

408
00:16:56,560 --> 00:17:01,519
wheels detrimental to the neighbor? is

409
00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:04,000
that

410
00:17:01,519 --> 00:17:05,760
um that would be the question. Would you

411
00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:08,480
expect to have a home there and gone and

412
00:17:05,760 --> 00:17:10,319
there gone? And to your point before, if

413
00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:12,240
we allow something like that, and I

414
00:17:10,319 --> 00:17:14,319
still not sure we could, how do we

415
00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:16,799
regulate it if someone's septic and

416
00:17:14,319 --> 00:17:19,280
sewer and water and and things like that

417
00:17:16,799 --> 00:17:21,679
or it's hard to regulate those on a a

418
00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:26,000
mobile structure? Well, and that's just

419
00:17:21,679 --> 00:17:28,880
fine. But now you kind of and now you

420
00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:30,080
start watching people play the

421
00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:31,679
borderline.

422
00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:33,200
» What is the structure? What is not? It's

423
00:17:31,679 --> 00:17:34,720
like an electric bike. What is it

424
00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,760
classified as?

425
00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:36,320
» Sorry.

426
00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:37,120
» Yeah. And

427
00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:38,960
» Nobody knows.

428
00:17:37,120 --> 00:17:42,640
» Yeah. And right now I think it is well

429
00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:44,640
defined that it has to meet um standard.

430
00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:45,679
So I think we do have a a good standard

431
00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:46,320
for that.

432
00:17:45,679 --> 00:17:47,679
» Okay.

433
00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:50,080
» If you're comfortable with it.

434
00:17:47,679 --> 00:17:50,480
» I am. I'm fine. I just I just know.

435
00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:52,080
Okay,

436
00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:53,440
» Question after question after question

437
00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:55,120
is going to come up.

438
00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:56,720
» How does it fit in? Well, if it has to

439
00:17:55,120 --> 00:17:58,400
be tied to sewer and it has to be tied

440
00:17:56,720 --> 00:18:00,720
to main electrical.

441
00:17:58,400 --> 00:18:02,000
» Uh, and then, you know, you got to

442
00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:03,440
figure out a way to get it in the back

443
00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:06,000
of your property because at this point

444
00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:08,080
in time, I'd have to tear down fences or

445
00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:10,000
get uh rightways

446
00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:11,520
» Or crane,

447
00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:12,080
put it on a crane, put it up over and

448
00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:12,320
park it.

449
00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:13,919
» Yeah.

450
00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:16,000
» I mean, that's the only way it is.

451
00:18:13,919 --> 00:18:18,080
» Yeah. But I think the other thing is

452
00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:20,400
regulating it so that we can monitor

453
00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:23,440
what's going on. When you start saying

454
00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:26,640
this is a a rental unit, does that open

455
00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:28,880
up the fact is it it it can't be a a

456
00:18:26,640 --> 00:18:31,039
summer rental or a twoe rental. Even

457
00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:32,880
though it says this, how do we monitor

458
00:18:31,039 --> 00:18:34,559
the other side of it?

459
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,840
» And that is always the problem with the

460
00:18:34,559 --> 00:18:36,559
short-term rental market.

461
00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:39,600
» Yes, it is.

462
00:18:36,559 --> 00:18:42,000
» And really,

463
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:44,000
it's it's complaint driven. Um, the

464
00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:46,160
state has given us a little more leeway

465
00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:47,840
at looking at what people are listing it

466
00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:51,200
as, but if your neighbor is renting it

467
00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:54,000
out, you can complain and and you can

468
00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:55,440
find um legitimate reasons, you know, to

469
00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:57,840
to make sure that those are not being

470
00:18:55,440 --> 00:18:59,520
used as short-term rentals. We we didn't

471
00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:02,400
require licensing unless it was rented

472
00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:04,799
because we wanted to avoid unnecessary

473
00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:07,679
we would like to know about all of the

474
00:19:04,799 --> 00:19:09,039
homes being registered uh as ADUs, but

475
00:19:07,679 --> 00:19:10,960
there was a concern that that might be

476
00:19:09,039 --> 00:19:12,960
burdensome for someone who's building it

477
00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:15,600
just for their family or just for a

478
00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:20,240
guest house or something that's just

479
00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:21,840
personal use, not as a business. Um and

480
00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:23,360
so that was the concern was PL from

481
00:19:21,840 --> 00:19:26,480
planning commission. They didn't want to

482
00:19:23,360 --> 00:19:29,039
require all of them except if they were

483
00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:29,679
going to rent them outside for money.

484
00:19:29,039 --> 00:19:31,120
And so,

485
00:19:29,679 --> 00:19:33,120
» But I guess that brings up the question

486
00:19:31,120 --> 00:19:35,360
is, okay, we build it for a family down

487
00:19:33,120 --> 00:19:36,640
the road and few years from now it

488
00:19:35,360 --> 00:19:37,280
changes hands.

489
00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:40,400
» Mhm.

490
00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:43,600
» Okay. So, how do we know that person's

491
00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:46,080
going to come in and do we have, you

492
00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:48,400
know, what ordinances and sent, okay,

493
00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:50,000
this is now yours, but you need to know

494
00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:53,280
how to register this if you're going to

495
00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:54,720
use it for anything but family. So, it's

496
00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:57,200
the same as if with your primary

497
00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:58,880
residence. You can you don't have to

498
00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:01,120
live not primary residence, but any home

499
00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:02,640
you buy, someone can rent it out

500
00:20:01,120 --> 00:20:04,400
illegally or legally. We're going to

501
00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:05,440
have the exact same problem with ADUs.

502
00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:06,720
Sometimes they're going to be rented

503
00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:10,240
legally, sometimes they're going to be

504
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:11,600
rented illegally. So, a building,

505
00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:14,799
they're going to have to have a building

506
00:20:11,600 --> 00:20:16,960
permit for every ADU they build. Uh, so

507
00:20:14,799 --> 00:20:18,480
we will have a and to get a building

508
00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:20,880
permit, they'll have to meet the ADU

509
00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:23,440
standards. So, we will have a record of

510
00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:25,919
the ADU being compliant because of the

511
00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:28,640
building permit. Okay.

512
00:20:25,919 --> 00:20:32,720
» But I know Rober mentioned some sort of

513
00:20:28,640 --> 00:20:34,880
um document going with Sorry, Craig.

514
00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:37,679
That is the worst

515
00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:39,039
two. Craig mentioned something about

516
00:20:37,679 --> 00:20:40,240
that. And we could put

517
00:20:39,039 --> 00:20:42,000
» It right next to each other.

518
00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:46,320
» I know.

519
00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:48,799
So, we could put something on the um the

520
00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:51,360
plat, I guess. I'm trying to think. uh

521
00:20:48,799 --> 00:20:53,200
or the title or something that says it

522
00:20:51,360 --> 00:20:56,080
does have an ADU, but I'd be more

523
00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:58,159
nervous doing that because then if it is

524
00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:59,760
destroyed and they want to rebuild, do

525
00:20:58,159 --> 00:21:01,919
they know they have to come in and go

526
00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:04,640
through the building process? Cuz the

527
00:21:01,919 --> 00:21:07,360
idea is the building process is the the

528
00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:08,960
vetting to make sure it's compliant. And

529
00:21:07,360 --> 00:21:11,200
I don't necessarily want to give them

530
00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:13,039
the right to tear it down and build it

531
00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:15,039
and build it again without going through

532
00:21:13,039 --> 00:21:17,360
the building process again.

533
00:21:15,039 --> 00:21:18,080
» If that makes sense. Yeah, that's what

534
00:21:17,360 --> 00:21:19,360
I'm saying.

535
00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:22,919
» Okay.

536
00:21:19,360 --> 00:21:22,919
» Okay. Other thoughts

537
00:21:23,679 --> 00:21:27,120
» On Greg's questions?

538
00:21:25,679 --> 00:21:30,080
» Yes.

539
00:21:27,120 --> 00:21:31,760
» Questions of the text and

540
00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:37,880
item

541
00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:37,880
» Item. Let's see. Got here.

542
00:21:38,159 --> 00:21:43,440
» I thought I thought your original

543
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:45,760
comment was is that the ADU had to be

544
00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:47,200
smaller than the current

545
00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:50,880
existing proposed

546
00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:53,360
» All I remember this um

547
00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:56,880
so

548
00:21:53,360 --> 00:22:00,320
the planning commission was it it it is

549
00:21:56,880 --> 00:22:02,960
limited in size but the actual ADU

550
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:05,600
portion of it but if you had like a

551
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:09,600
detached garage with an ADU above it the

552
00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:12,000
full structure could be larger in square

553
00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:13,520
footage. So, what we allowed for, and

554
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:15,840
this is something we spoke to them

555
00:22:13,520 --> 00:22:17,520
specifically about cuz they had been

556
00:22:15,840 --> 00:22:18,880
next door to properties that had done,

557
00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:21,200
you know, the apartment above the

558
00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:25,120
garage. And if you did that in your

559
00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:27,039
backyard, we wanted to make sure that

560
00:22:25,120 --> 00:22:30,400
it it didn't encroach on the neighbor.

561
00:22:27,039 --> 00:22:31,919
And that's why we did the the limit of

562
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:34,640
one and a half stories, I guess, because

563
00:22:31,919 --> 00:22:37,360
you can build in the attic um in your

564
00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:40,559
backyard or if you can meet the setback,

565
00:22:37,360 --> 00:22:43,919
you can go higher. Um,

566
00:22:40,559 --> 00:22:46,880
so, so anyway, it the provision I'm

567
00:22:43,919 --> 00:22:48,799
trying to think what he was addressing.

568
00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:50,559
» He talks about zoning papers. That was

569
00:22:48,799 --> 00:22:53,520
the next question we had.

570
00:22:50,559 --> 00:22:56,640
» Yeah. Um, yeah. So, it it's all this

571
00:22:53,520 --> 00:23:00,559
one. So, I think it was just

572
00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:00,880
zoning. Yeah. Um

573
00:23:00,559 --> 00:23:02,799
» So

574
00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:06,799
» So the home it has to maintain the

575
00:23:02,799 --> 00:23:08,799
setbacks of the the lot and either the

576
00:23:06,799 --> 00:23:11,200
set for a detach it can maintain the

577
00:23:08,799 --> 00:23:14,559
setbacks of the lot

578
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:16,480
or the accessory dwelling structure.

579
00:23:14,559 --> 00:23:18,240
Um if it's going to meet the accessory

580
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:20,720
dwelling structure setbacks there are

581
00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:22,960
further limitations. If you're going to

582
00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:24,480
meet the zoning setbacks there are not

583
00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:27,840
those same limitations.

584
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:29,679
» But if you wanted to if you had a multi

585
00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:30,159
acreage property.

586
00:23:29,679 --> 00:23:32,080
» Mhm.

587
00:23:30,159 --> 00:23:36,000
» And you want to does it does the

588
00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:38,320
regulations stop at one ADU or can you

589
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:40,799
have two or three ADUs?

590
00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:43,600
» So right now you're limited to one ADU

591
00:23:40,799 --> 00:23:46,159
for primary dwelling and you are limited

592
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:47,600
in that gross floor area. It cannot be

593
00:23:46,159 --> 00:23:51,120
more than the primary dwelling.

594
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:56,240
» Okay. So it is limited there and he's

595
00:23:51,120 --> 00:23:59,679
concerned about it not so in the

596
00:23:56,240 --> 00:24:02,080
design standards it says uh scale and

597
00:23:59,679 --> 00:24:04,159
massing detached ADUs shall be

598
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:06,720
subordinate in scale and massing to the

599
00:24:04,159 --> 00:24:08,159
primary dwelling which should naturally

600
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:09,919
occur because they're supposed to be

601
00:24:08,159 --> 00:24:11,279
smaller but if they did a bigger roof

602
00:24:09,919 --> 00:24:15,120
pitch or you know there's ways to make

603
00:24:11,279 --> 00:24:16,880
it look bigger the the except on larger

604
00:24:15,120 --> 00:24:19,679
lots that's made the exception so

605
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:23,279
someone could have a barn and put the

606
00:24:19,679 --> 00:24:26,000
ADU within it. So even though the whole

607
00:24:23,279 --> 00:24:30,960
area would not be con considered, the

608
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:32,799
building that it's in would be larger in

609
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:35,520
size than the primary building.

610
00:24:32,799 --> 00:24:37,679
» So one other question I this probably a

611
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:40,799
two-part question.

612
00:24:37,679 --> 00:24:43,279
So when when you go through the design

613
00:24:40,799 --> 00:24:46,640
standards of a zone of a particular

614
00:24:43,279 --> 00:24:49,039
zoning area or how many homes are

615
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:52,240
potentially going to be built in, you

616
00:24:49,039 --> 00:24:54,799
take into account sewer line sizes,

617
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:57,679
water line sizes, all those types of

618
00:24:54,799 --> 00:25:01,919
things. Um

619
00:24:57,679 --> 00:25:04,320
so when when you add an ADU, is that tip

620
00:25:01,919 --> 00:25:07,840
of that scale, if you will? And you know

621
00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:11,200
the um it's like right now in the bottom

622
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:14,000
Vista water per state standard we we

623
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:17,840
allow 34

624
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:18,880
it's 34 acre feet of water per unit.

625
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:21,679
» Mhm.

626
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:25,679
» Um but yet if you have an ADU unit on

627
00:25:21,679 --> 00:25:26,880
there does that 34 still pertain to that

628
00:25:25,679 --> 00:25:28,240
one lot? Right.

629
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:28,720
» Does it not?

630
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:29,679
» So

631
00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:31,360
» How do how does that

632
00:25:29,679 --> 00:25:34,559
» How do we accommodate that? How do we

633
00:25:31,360 --> 00:25:37,039
protect that from having a lack of water

634
00:25:34,559 --> 00:25:40,240
or that one

635
00:25:37,039 --> 00:25:44,559
lot going over the 341 that's allowed?

636
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:47,600
» Yes. So that's where in utilities um we

637
00:25:44,559 --> 00:25:49,120
this we want to have ADUs and the state

638
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:50,559
also said we need to have them. So

639
00:25:49,120 --> 00:25:53,120
figuring out how that fits with our

640
00:25:50,559 --> 00:25:56,799
infrastructure was definitely a concern.

641
00:25:53,120 --> 00:25:58,240
I mean one note most how much water is

642
00:25:56,799 --> 00:26:00,880
provided is one thing. the

643
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:03,600
infrastructure in general,

644
00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:07,120
a lot of it is minimum sizing, which is

645
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:09,520
plenty of size to add a few in. Um, and

646
00:26:07,120 --> 00:26:11,760
we if every single home has an ADU, it

647
00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:13,360
might be starting to look different. Uh,

648
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:18,000
and and where it is. So, that's why we

649
00:26:13,360 --> 00:26:20,880
put in that um the detach ADUs must have

650
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:23,360
adequate access to required utilities.

651
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:25,760
So first access and then a detached ADU

652
00:26:23,360 --> 00:26:27,600
application may be rejected if a utility

653
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:29,120
service to which the ADU must make a

654
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,799
connection does not have sufficient

655
00:26:29,120 --> 00:26:34,880
capacity to support the addition of the

656
00:26:30,799 --> 00:26:36,880
ADU. So we did put a caveat that if like

657
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:40,320
Bonabus is going to be telling us yes or

658
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:42,880
no and we won't be able to decide that.

659
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:44,960
Um we've made determinations on sewer.

660
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:47,919
Uh so they will be required to be

661
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:50,880
connected to utilities and a utility

662
00:26:47,919 --> 00:26:52,480
provider may reject them based on um

663
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:54,720
capacity.

664
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:58,240
» So do we know if Bonist

665
00:26:54,720 --> 00:27:00,159
Bon Vista is addressing the same issue?

666
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:01,679
» So that's something we discussed.

667
00:27:00,159 --> 00:27:03,120
» No, we don't know.

668
00:27:01,679 --> 00:27:05,760
» I can tell you we're not.

669
00:27:03,120 --> 00:27:07,679
» Okay.

670
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:09,039
In the end, that's why we put the caveat

671
00:27:07,679 --> 00:27:12,080
there that was really that gave

672
00:27:09,039 --> 00:27:14,799
Bonabistant blanket consideration for

673
00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:17,360
rejecting them because we don't know

674
00:27:14,799 --> 00:27:19,760
what their situation is and we have to

675
00:27:17,360 --> 00:27:22,240
pass some we have to pass an AD

676
00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:25,440
ordinance. So this way they can take it

677
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:28,640
on a case-byase basis and determine

678
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:31,440
what's required and and how to address

679
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:33,440
it from their end.

680
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:37,120
So,

681
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:38,640
I mean, this is kind of a

682
00:27:37,120 --> 00:27:41,760
interesting question. I would put it

683
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:43,679
that way. Not not that I'm trying to be

684
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:45,679
discriminatory to anybody wanting to

685
00:27:43,679 --> 00:27:47,760
build an ADU,

686
00:27:45,679 --> 00:27:50,559
» But in trying to restrict the number of

687
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:52,880
ADUs that might be put in in a in a

688
00:27:50,559 --> 00:27:56,080
subdivision,

689
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:58,320
» Are have we looked at the standards and

690
00:27:56,080 --> 00:28:01,120
such that it makes it a little more

691
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:03,279
complicated to put them in?

692
00:28:01,120 --> 00:28:04,320
That makes sense.

693
00:28:03,279 --> 00:28:06,480
» I don't know if I follow.

694
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:09,679
» So, if I had a lot size, maybe say I

695
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:11,360
have a subdivision and I have 15,000

696
00:28:09,679 --> 00:28:13,200
square foot lots. So, every one of them

697
00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:13,840
could have an ADU if they really want

698
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:14,880
one,

699
00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,120
» Right?

700
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:18,559
» Or even we'll take this development

701
00:28:17,120 --> 00:28:19,440
right across the street.

702
00:28:18,559 --> 00:28:22,559
» Mhm.

703
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:24,559
» There's what 32

704
00:28:22,559 --> 00:28:25,600
houses or something like that in there.

705
00:28:24,559 --> 00:28:29,120
» 23.

706
00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:31,039
» 23. So 23 houses and half of them

707
00:28:29,120 --> 00:28:32,399
decided to put a use in it and now it

708
00:28:31,039 --> 00:28:36,320
becomes

709
00:28:32,399 --> 00:28:38,159
» Not 23 houses but it becomes 50 houses

710
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:40,720
» Or

711
00:28:38,159 --> 00:28:44,559
just went way out of

712
00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:48,000
» But roughly 33 houses or 32 houses.

713
00:28:44,559 --> 00:28:51,760
» Mhm. Um, and yet still you have the same

714
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:54,960
infrastructure in there and yet the city

715
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:57,200
I I don't want to be in the position of

716
00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:59,120
well fortunately your neighbor was able

717
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:01,520
you know first come first ser was able

718
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:03,840
to get ADU and you can't go

719
00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:06,320
» It it may come down to that but really

720
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:08,799
when it comes to capacity on the smaller

721
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:12,559
unless it's already

722
00:29:08,799 --> 00:29:15,440
as in this city right now and I haven't

723
00:29:12,559 --> 00:29:17,679
looked as closely at it as Matt Um,

724
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:20,799
generally there are undersized lines

725
00:29:17,679 --> 00:29:22,399
that need to be improved no matter what

726
00:29:20,799 --> 00:29:25,679
and are part of the city's plan to

727
00:29:22,399 --> 00:29:27,279
improve. Um, but a minimum size line can

728
00:29:25,679 --> 00:29:29,360
handle a lot more capacity than the

729
00:29:27,279 --> 00:29:32,320
density of Harrisville is using right

730
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:35,200
now. So, I don't see that becoming a

731
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:38,240
huge issue except for localized areas

732
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:41,600
where we do have undersized for anything

733
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:43,279
kind of issues or um failing. And that's

734
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:46,399
why I put that caveat in. There may be a

735
00:29:43,279 --> 00:29:49,120
few roles where we're thinking we we

736
00:29:46,399 --> 00:29:51,120
need to address that issue which is an

737
00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:53,679
ex existing issue.

738
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:56,080
» I think clarification on that rather

739
00:29:53,679 --> 00:29:57,360
than ambiguity helps give some

740
00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:59,760
direction.

741
00:29:57,360 --> 00:30:01,840
» Okay. So my house, you know, is a newer

742
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:04,000
house. I know that it could comply as

743
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:06,480
far as that, but some other house that's

744
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:09,360
been in Harrisville that wants to put

745
00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:13,200
one in, you know, that's a 60 or 70 year

746
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:16,960
old house may not comply to that. So, is

747
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:18,960
that ordinance allow for that type of

748
00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:21,120
verbiage to be put in there to help it?

749
00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:23,279
So, it helps clarify and stream that.

750
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:26,960
» So, we do have the verbiage about a

751
00:30:23,279 --> 00:30:31,360
failing septic tank. um there there

752
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:34,720
isn't anything to prohibit um

753
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:36,720
or a failing lateral utility line. So if

754
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:39,919
a home has a failing lateral utility

755
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:44,240
line um they would need to address that.

756
00:30:39,919 --> 00:30:46,240
And so I so we do have that in the code

757
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:49,360
that if you have a failing septic tank

758
00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:52,080
like served by a failing lateral utility

759
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:53,679
line. Did we just put Oh, we don't have

760
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:55,440
septic tanks in Harrisville. That's why

761
00:30:53,679 --> 00:30:57,520
I was like we changed it. We don't have

762
00:30:55,440 --> 00:31:00,640
» Going to say I don't know.

763
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:03,120
» Sorry. Yeah. So, if you're if your

764
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:05,520
primary dwelling is served by a failing

765
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:07,760
um lateral utility line, then you would

766
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:10,720
need to address it, especially if you're

767
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:13,679
doing an internal ADU.

768
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:15,200
And if your home's new or old, that's

769
00:31:13,679 --> 00:31:18,320
going to be a problem whether you have

770
00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:20,799
an ADU or not. So,

771
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:22,559
» I don't know what other is there further

772
00:31:20,799 --> 00:31:23,760
language you'd like to see. No, I just

773
00:31:22,559 --> 00:31:25,440
want to make sure it's covering. When

774
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:28,720
you say utilities, is that covering

775
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:30,559
electrical, sewer, and water?

776
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,159
» Those are generally,

777
00:31:30,559 --> 00:31:34,080
» You know, when you say utilities in

778
00:31:32,159 --> 00:31:36,399
general. Okay. So, you can have not

779
00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:37,360
enough power. That's understandable

780
00:31:36,399 --> 00:31:39,519
because you're going to have to have

781
00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:40,080
that regulated before you can have cut.

782
00:31:39,519 --> 00:31:42,480
» Yeah.

783
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:44,640
» Okay. But water, we're back to the water

784
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:46,480
issue again. And now you've got more

785
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:49,200
people on the same amount of acreage,

786
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:51,760
foot acreage. That that one probably

787
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:53,519
concerns me more. I realize where you

788
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:55,919
put something. Okay. Bonavista could

789
00:31:53,519 --> 00:31:58,799
say, "Nope, it's not going to happen."

790
00:31:55,919 --> 00:32:01,760
Uh, but at the same time, do we need to

791
00:31:58,799 --> 00:32:04,240
cover Harrisville a little bit better in

792
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:06,559
blinding rather than to say it's up to

793
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:08,320
Bonavista to tell us no?

794
00:32:06,559 --> 00:32:09,840
» I don't think, and I'll have to look at

795
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:12,399
the state code again. I don't know that

796
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:12,960
we can ask for anything further than

797
00:32:12,399 --> 00:32:14,159
that.

798
00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:14,720
» And that's fine. I'm just asking

799
00:32:14,159 --> 00:32:16,559
questions.

800
00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:18,960
» Yeah, but I don't think there's I don't

801
00:32:16,559 --> 00:32:21,840
think we need are allowed to, but I'll

802
00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:21,840
I'll look. They

803
00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:28,159
We're looking at um

804
00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:30,240
» Yeah, I I can look and see if that's

805
00:32:28,159 --> 00:32:30,720
something that could be allowed. The use

806
00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:33,519
of

807
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:35,919
» I want to make sure it's clear. Is that

808
00:32:33,519 --> 00:32:40,399
» Yeah, the Well, right now it's clear.

809
00:32:35,919 --> 00:32:43,120
You It's It's served. It's um we're

810
00:32:40,399 --> 00:32:45,519
talking about the lateral utility 9, not

811
00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:48,000
the actual water. And so, we haven't

812
00:32:45,519 --> 00:32:50,880
said anything about providing water. In

813
00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:54,720
general, our indoor use is so small

814
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:57,279
compared to the outdoor use that

815
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:59,840
especially in these ADUs, it'll be

816
00:32:57,279 --> 00:33:02,399
fairly negligible on the on the large

817
00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:04,399
scale until we have every single home

818
00:33:02,399 --> 00:33:04,880
with large ADUs.

819
00:33:04,399 --> 00:33:06,640
» Sure.

820
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:09,279
» Coming in. And that might be when Monav

821
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:11,360
Vista starts asking for more water.

822
00:33:09,279 --> 00:33:14,399
» Okay.

823
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:19,440
And that's fine. I just I you know I

824
00:33:14,399 --> 00:33:22,480
realize this is a a network of er

825
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:24,080
and it's it's going to not we know that

826
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:26,720
» But I want to make sure that as we look

827
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:29,279
at the holistic of it we're trying to

828
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:31,600
take care of the needs of the city as

829
00:33:29,279 --> 00:33:35,000
well as the needs of the citizens that's

830
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:35,000
all I'm confident

831
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:41,440
» I mean I have this I had this discussion

832
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:43,120
when my garden my backyard my wife said

833
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:45,679
absolutely Not you're not putting water

834
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:47,679
out there and now I need to have it

835
00:33:45,679 --> 00:33:50,799
humidified

836
00:33:47,679 --> 00:33:52,320
because I have dry it's a dry barn and I

837
00:33:50,799 --> 00:33:53,919
have instruments that are suffering

838
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:55,200
during winter time.

839
00:33:53,919 --> 00:33:55,679
» So what do I do?

840
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:57,360
» Yeah.

841
00:33:55,679 --> 00:33:59,039
» Because as soon as I add water, I've

842
00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:00,640
already got utility. I know I got

843
00:33:59,039 --> 00:34:04,559
electric out there.

844
00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:06,720
» Water. Oh, I need sewer and I can go

845
00:34:04,559 --> 00:34:08,159
ahead and take my barn and it could be

846
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:12,399
an ADU.

847
00:34:08,159 --> 00:34:14,960
» Exactly. And I know um Greg mentioned

848
00:34:12,399 --> 00:34:18,560
this. Uh I should call him commissioner

849
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:20,800
Montgomery mentioned this. Uh anyone who

850
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:23,280
wants to

851
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:25,679
or council member, not commissioner get

852
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:27,200
all my cities mixed up. Council member

853
00:34:25,679 --> 00:34:28,720
council, I just came from the planning

854
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:30,240
commission meeting. Um

855
00:34:28,720 --> 00:34:32,480
» Let's just go back to Greg.

856
00:34:30,240 --> 00:34:34,800
» Greg's fine. Okay.

857
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:36,720
So he mentioned that anyone can convert

858
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:40,399
their accessory dwelling unit as long as

859
00:34:36,720 --> 00:34:42,320
it meets the requirements. So if it's if

860
00:34:40,399 --> 00:34:44,079
it's placed close to that property line,

861
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:46,240
it's got to meet the height in the

862
00:34:44,079 --> 00:34:48,879
window requirement. If it's far enough

863
00:34:46,240 --> 00:34:51,280
away, then it'll meet the setback

864
00:34:48,879 --> 00:34:53,119
requirements for the lot. So but and it

865
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:55,040
has to build the livable building

866
00:34:53,119 --> 00:34:56,399
standards of a primary dwelling. It

867
00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:59,399
would have to meet those.

868
00:34:56,399 --> 00:34:59,399
» Sure.

869
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:05,280
I have an unrelated question if we're

870
00:35:03,599 --> 00:35:07,359
ready for that.

871
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:09,040
» It's about parking. So, after I read the

872
00:35:07,359 --> 00:35:10,000
part about parking, I was pretty

873
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:10,720
confused.

874
00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:13,040
» Okay.

875
00:35:10,720 --> 00:35:15,440
» Are we saying that they do need

876
00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:18,000
additional parking or if they want

877
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:20,480
additional parking, these are the rules?

878
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:23,920
» No. Um,

879
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:27,200
it's required. So, I'll see it's

880
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:28,800
required. um regardless of whether the

881
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:30,079
primary dwelling is existing or new

882
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:32,000
construction. So, we wanted to make sure

883
00:35:30,079 --> 00:35:34,560
they knew that if you build a new home

884
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:36,880
or if it's an existing home, you need

885
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:38,640
one additional lot, one additional

886
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:42,720
on-site parking space requires an

887
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:47,599
internal ADU or a DTAU with less than

888
00:35:42,720 --> 00:35:51,599
650 ft of living space. Now, the um the

889
00:35:47,599 --> 00:35:54,240
650 came from just what we felt was

890
00:35:51,599 --> 00:35:58,000
reasonable to ask for size-wise for a

891
00:35:54,240 --> 00:35:59,760
detached and internal ADU. We cannot by

892
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:01,920
state law ask for more than one

893
00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:04,240
additional parking space. And then the

894
00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:07,200
two additional parking spaces are for

895
00:36:04,240 --> 00:36:10,240
any detached ADU exceeding 650 ft of

896
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:12,400
living space. Um

897
00:36:10,240 --> 00:36:14,160
the part that Oh, is it required ADU? Is

898
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:18,000
that the next one? I guess the question

899
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:21,040
is it it says additional

900
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:23,520
parking but I'm not sure if that

901
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:26,000
additional be above and beyond what so

902
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:28,240
what already exists may be that there's

903
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:31,119
a side driveway or something. So can

904
00:36:28,240 --> 00:36:33,680
that be counted toward this requirement?

905
00:36:31,119 --> 00:36:37,200
if it meets the parking requirements

906
00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:40,160
that we have in the um that are in the

907
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:42,079
other part of the code if it they what

908
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:43,599
we're trying to do in additional is

909
00:36:42,079 --> 00:36:45,200
making sure they're not taking the

910
00:36:43,599 --> 00:36:47,520
required parking for the primary

911
00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:48,640
dwelling and counting it as the ADA

912
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:50,720
parking as well.

913
00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:53,440
» Yes. So then my question is if the

914
00:36:50,720 --> 00:36:54,640
existing primary residence already has

915
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:55,680
extra parking.

916
00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:57,200
» Yes, they can use that.

917
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:59,520
» They can use that. And so what's

918
00:36:57,200 --> 00:37:01,440
considered extra

919
00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:03,359
like additional.

920
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:06,880
» Yeah. So, let's say the primary

921
00:37:03,359 --> 00:37:08,800
residence has a twocar garage plus a

922
00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:09,119
driveway that's the same width.

923
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:11,599
» Yes.

924
00:37:09,119 --> 00:37:13,520
» Is then is it additional beyond that

925
00:37:11,599 --> 00:37:15,760
that's required? But what if they

926
00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:17,359
already had say a side driveway that

927
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:19,280
goes to the side of their garage? Does

928
00:37:17,359 --> 00:37:19,760
can that be counted towards?

929
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:21,680
» Yes.

930
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:23,520
» I'm I'm not following if it's what

931
00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:25,119
already exists. We have to build beyond

932
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:27,440
that or we can count what already

933
00:37:25,119 --> 00:37:30,400
exists. If it's above what?

934
00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:34,839
» Yes. So, and we can look and I can work

935
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:34,839
on the language here. Uh,

936
00:37:35,119 --> 00:37:38,960
so right here I just say additional, but

937
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:40,400
I could say additional to required

938
00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:42,480
parking and that might make it more

939
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:44,800
clear.

940
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:46,240
» So, so I guess part one is what's

941
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:48,240
required if they're going to build an

942
00:37:46,240 --> 00:37:48,880
ADU.

943
00:37:48,240 --> 00:37:50,800
Um,

944
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:53,119
» And part two is if they want more

945
00:37:50,800 --> 00:37:53,920
parking, then this is what they have to

946
00:37:53,119 --> 00:37:56,079
follow.

947
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:59,760
» Oh, A and B. Those Oh, you're talking

948
00:37:56,079 --> 00:38:01,520
about 09.04. 040 is that parking

949
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:02,960
regulations

950
00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:04,960
4040.

951
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:05,359
» Oh, is Oh, just the parking b the code

952
00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:06,000
itself.

953
00:38:05,359 --> 00:38:08,000
» Yes, the code.

954
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:10,720
» Okay. Yes. Um,

955
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:12,160
» So part one is this is what is required

956
00:38:10,720 --> 00:38:14,240
if you build an ID.

957
00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:16,640
» Oh, part one is the parking regulations

958
00:38:14,240 --> 00:38:18,560
for all single family homes.

959
00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:19,920
» Okay. So, it's just a restatement of

960
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:22,480
what already exists.

961
00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:24,560
» It it's just referring So, these um

962
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:26,800
these code revisions are actually a

963
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:28,880
separate part of the code from the ADU.

964
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:31,760
They were ones that were revising that

965
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:34,240
applied to all of our residential lots

966
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:34,640
because they were non-compliant.

967
00:38:34,240 --> 00:38:36,079
» Okay.

968
00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:37,599
» Does that help?

969
00:38:36,079 --> 00:38:38,079
» Yes, I think that helps.

970
00:38:37,599 --> 00:38:40,480
» Sorry.

971
00:38:38,079 --> 00:38:42,400
» Yeah. So, the additional off street

972
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:44,160
parking is most likely what they'd be

973
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:46,160
looking at because they're trying to

974
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:46,720
most likely add parking for their new

975
00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:47,520
residence.

976
00:38:46,720 --> 00:38:50,560
» Perfect. Yes.

977
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:52,960
» Okay. But so then the requirements are

978
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:56,079
that they have

979
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:58,480
two required off-street parking spaces

980
00:38:56,079 --> 00:39:02,400
and access to those parking spaces is on

981
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:05,760
a concrete or asphalt driveway

982
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:08,320
off. So you're saying that an ADU can

983
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:10,640
only have but it says minimum. That's

984
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:13,640
what confused me. Is this not a maximum

985
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:13,640
two

986
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:17,200
» Or are we talking about the average?

987
00:39:15,359 --> 00:39:20,400
Okay. going to be out.

988
00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:22,400
» Addition A part I

989
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:24,800
» The dwelling unit has the minimum number

990
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:29,040
of two required off streetet parking

991
00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:29,680
spaces. Yes. So if it has the minimum of

992
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,280
two

993
00:39:29,680 --> 00:39:32,880
» The original dwelling unit.

994
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:34,720
» Yes. The original dwelling unit must

995
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:36,400
have the two that are required

996
00:39:34,720 --> 00:39:37,680
» And that would count. A driveway would

997
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:39,839
count for that.

998
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:42,079
» No, the driveway is specifically

999
00:39:39,839 --> 00:39:44,160
excluded because it's in the front yard

1000
00:39:42,079 --> 00:39:46,880
set back. The only part and there's that

1001
00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:49,280
diagram. The only part of the front yard

1002
00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:51,440
setback that's allowed for parking and

1003
00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:53,839
this is what's currently in the code is

1004
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:56,000
anything from the side of the house to

1005
00:39:53,839 --> 00:39:59,839
the sideyard. So to the side of the

1006
00:39:56,000 --> 00:40:01,680
driveway. So the driveway needs to well

1007
00:39:59,839 --> 00:40:05,280
remain clear so people can enter the

1008
00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:07,440
garage or they can park in the driveway

1009
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:09,680
but it's not counted as their parking I

1010
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:13,920
guess. Okay.

1011
00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:15,920
So, this part A of section two about

1012
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:17,920
additional off street parking. Sorry, I

1013
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:20,640
feel like I'm really slow on this, but

1014
00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:23,599
» This is confusing to me.

1015
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:27,920
» They may not park or store additional

1016
00:40:23,599 --> 00:40:30,480
vehicles unless there are two parking

1017
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:31,920
spaces aside from the driveway

1018
00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:34,000
» On the original building.

1019
00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:35,680
» Yes, this is saying. So, the original

1020
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:39,440
building would have to have a twocar

1021
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:41,520
garage at a minimum or a twocar parking

1022
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:43,440
space that's unobstructed that they can

1023
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:46,400
get to. That's why the driveway doesn't

1024
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:49,599
count is you have to be able to get to

1025
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:51,359
that. Um, well, it doesn't count cuz we

1026
00:40:49,599 --> 00:40:55,040
said we don't want it to count basically

1027
00:40:51,359 --> 00:40:58,000
by the front setback ruling. Um, we used

1028
00:40:55,040 --> 00:41:01,280
to in the code say um they had to be

1029
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:03,920
side by side, not tandem parking. Um but

1030
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:06,160
the state got rid of that allowance and

1031
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:08,240
said you had to allow tandem parking.

1032
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:12,640
Okay. In my experience, nobody uses

1033
00:41:08,240 --> 00:41:14,400
tandem parking and so we um made sure

1034
00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:16,880
that the front yard setback couldn't be

1035
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:20,000
used and that eliminated that access

1036
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:21,119
requirement for the side by side or for

1037
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:22,880
if someone has

1038
00:41:21,119 --> 00:41:24,480
» It seems like the goal of this is to

1039
00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:26,800
make sure that there's adequate parking

1040
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:31,280
for the ADU that doesn't obstruct the

1041
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:34,000
original primary residence and doesn't

1042
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:36,400
allow them to park just in the yard in

1043
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:39,200
the backyard. Uh

1044
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:42,319
» Unless it's uh

1045
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:43,839
there are recreational vehicle.

1046
00:41:42,319 --> 00:41:45,680
» Yes,

1047
00:41:43,839 --> 00:41:47,920
that's what it seems like from here. I

1048
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:50,640
don't we don't really rec regulate the

1049
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:52,240
backyard as much. So I there won't be as

1050
00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:54,800
much regulation on where it happens in

1051
00:41:52,240 --> 00:41:56,319
the backyard, but we really do want to

1052
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:58,000
control the front yard and make sure

1053
00:41:56,319 --> 00:41:59,520
that there is a place for the cars to

1054
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:01,119
park so they're not forced to park on

1055
00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:03,680
the street that they have an option off

1056
00:42:01,119 --> 00:42:05,920
the street. But it also has to have did

1057
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:08,480
it have to have hard surface

1058
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:11,280
» Only only for access

1059
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:13,599
» So not so it could be parked on gravel

1060
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:16,240
» And that's what the planning commission

1061
00:42:13,599 --> 00:42:23,400
was hoping for is the allowance for

1062
00:42:16,240 --> 00:42:23,400
gravel. Um, we we ended on um

1063
00:42:25,839 --> 00:42:34,119
I'm trying to put the two codes

1064
00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:34,119
together, but yes. Um,

1065
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:44,160
» Yes, it's it just needs to meet the off

1066
00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:46,640
streetet parking which does allow for a

1067
00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:48,640
gravel space. So, as long as the very

1068
00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:50,400
first part as you pull in is

1069
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:52,079
» Yeah. You pull into the driveway that's

1070
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:53,520
hard surfaced and then you can go onto

1071
00:42:52,079 --> 00:42:55,280
the gravel.

1072
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:57,359
» Okay.

1073
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:59,440
» So, my side driveway right now is all

1074
00:42:57,359 --> 00:43:02,160
gravel. So, that wouldn't count.

1075
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:04,480
» The side driveway is the one exception

1076
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:06,079
um allowed in the code in the front set

1077
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:07,040
back just that side driveway.

1078
00:43:06,079 --> 00:43:09,599
» Perfect. Thank you.

1079
00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:11,760
» As long as it's not a corner lot and

1080
00:43:09,599 --> 00:43:13,920
that's not adjacent to the street.

1081
00:43:11,760 --> 00:43:16,319
» Yes. Then they can't park there. So

1082
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:18,960
parking is just I think as a neighbor

1083
00:43:16,319 --> 00:43:20,720
that's one of the biggest headaches if

1084
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:23,119
your neighbor has maybe you and their

1085
00:43:20,720 --> 00:43:25,520
cars are everywhere that so that's why

1086
00:43:23,119 --> 00:43:28,000
this matters to me and so thank you for

1087
00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:29,440
taking the time to explain I think it

1088
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:32,440
matters to everyone I think it's

1089
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:32,440
important

1090
00:43:37,839 --> 00:43:42,800
» So talking about parking sorry

1091
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:44,079
talking about parking one of the

1092
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:46,480
questions

1093
00:43:44,079 --> 00:43:48,800
And I'm referencing your diagram for

1094
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:51,280
something like this. You show the two

1095
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:53,359
sides of the home. What do you do in the

1096
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:56,880
instance where there's not a drive cut

1097
00:43:53,359 --> 00:43:58,160
in? Are we going to allow more cutins to

1098
00:43:56,880 --> 00:44:00,319
the streets

1099
00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:03,280
» There? We already have an ordinance

1100
00:44:00,319 --> 00:44:05,280
about how close the cutins can be. Yeah.

1101
00:44:03,280 --> 00:44:07,440
So that's already regulated. It'd be the

1102
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:11,040
same as if they wanted to put a cut in

1103
00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:14,319
for access to an accessory building in

1104
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:16,480
the back. So we follow those samples.

1105
00:44:14,319 --> 00:44:18,640
» Remind me what that is if you

1106
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:21,040
» Know I'm not positive. I

1107
00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:22,160
» Foot to the property line for storm

1108
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:24,480
water.

1109
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:25,839
» So they can do a curb cut. Is that is

1110
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:28,880
that what you're referencing? The curb

1111
00:44:25,839 --> 00:44:30,640
cut can be within one one foot of the

1112
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:32,720
property line.

1113
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:35,680
» And the driveway width they have a

1114
00:44:32,720 --> 00:44:38,000
maximum of 32 ft.

1115
00:44:35,680 --> 00:44:41,280
» So in many instances like for example

1116
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:44,000
where I live there's only 8 ft.

1117
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:46,000
So there's not half that space to add an

1118
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:48,720
additional parking.

1119
00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:50,240
» Oh, where the cut in is only 8 ft

1120
00:44:48,720 --> 00:44:51,839
» From the property line to the edge of

1121
00:44:50,240 --> 00:44:54,160
the house is 8 ft.

1122
00:44:51,839 --> 00:44:57,520
» Oh, yeah. If your setback's only 8 ft,

1123
00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:59,440
you would be limited there. Yeah.

1124
00:44:57,520 --> 00:45:01,200
» But you could we'd assume a lot of

1125
00:44:59,440 --> 00:45:03,440
people you can access you can go on the

1126
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:06,000
driveway and then to the sideyard

1127
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:07,920
without creating a new cutting.

1128
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:10,560
Oh, the only the only other option would

1129
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:13,680
be to do a driveway on the other side of

1130
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:19,800
the house.

1131
00:45:13,680 --> 00:45:19,800
» Oh, homes that are in in that portfol.

1132
00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:38,480
» I'm trying to remember. Especially

1133
00:45:35,599 --> 00:45:40,240
mine's right next to a utility box.

1134
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:41,520
» Yeah, I think I think it's as long as

1135
00:45:40,240 --> 00:45:43,599
you're within the foot for the

1136
00:45:41,520 --> 00:45:45,520
encroachment permit. We just require

1137
00:45:43,599 --> 00:45:46,560
that you have an encroachment permit to

1138
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:48,960
do that currently.

1139
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:49,520
» Okay. So, you can if you get

1140
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:51,040
» Yeah. Okay.

1141
00:45:49,520 --> 00:45:52,800
» I'll look into that. But I believe it's

1142
00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:54,720
pretty liberal. I mean, I was when I was

1143
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:56,160
reading through it, it's been probably a

1144
00:45:54,720 --> 00:45:57,839
year since I looked at that.

1145
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,680
» Unless Unless you deal with your dog on

1146
00:45:57,839 --> 00:46:02,079
my way.

1147
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:04,319
» Sorry.

1148
00:46:02,079 --> 00:46:06,160
» And I apologize that I'm a little late.

1149
00:46:04,319 --> 00:46:09,040
I had a late appointment at work that

1150
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:12,079
went way long, but I have I did have a

1151
00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:15,520
couple questions. Um,

1152
00:46:12,079 --> 00:46:17,520
so the questions that I have were about

1153
00:46:15,520 --> 00:46:19,520
um, and you may have already discussed

1154
00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:22,160
these, so if you have, please let me

1155
00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:25,520
know and I'll I'll just catch up later,

1156
00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:29,920
» But we talked about um, restrictions as

1157
00:46:25,520 --> 00:46:33,200
far as um, short-term rentals um, and

1158
00:46:29,920 --> 00:46:34,960
that. And I'm I'm just wondering if you

1159
00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:36,640
know when we're when we're talking about

1160
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:39,520
enforcement,

1161
00:46:36,640 --> 00:46:41,599
how do you enforce something like that?

1162
00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:44,240
» Currently, it is difficult. It's it's

1163
00:46:41,599 --> 00:46:46,800
complaint driven. It's it's just

1164
00:46:44,240 --> 00:46:49,040
something that um the state has eased up

1165
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:50,960
a little bit. They used to not even let

1166
00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:52,480
you look at the listings, but now you

1167
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:55,040
can identify them through the listings,

1168
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:59,280
but it would be complaint driven.

1169
00:46:55,040 --> 00:47:01,680
» Okay. And is there a reason why we

1170
00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:05,200
wouldn't allow that?

1171
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:09,359
» The goal is to provide more housing and

1172
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:11,920
we wouldn't be meeting the additional

1173
00:47:09,359 --> 00:47:13,440
housing for Parisville. We'd be

1174
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:16,160
providing extra income for the

1175
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:18,319
residents, but we wouldn't be providing

1176
00:47:16,160 --> 00:47:21,599
more housing necessarily. I think the

1177
00:47:18,319 --> 00:47:24,240
biggest um the biggest issue would be

1178
00:47:21,599 --> 00:47:26,800
the when you're changing changing

1179
00:47:24,240 --> 00:47:28,720
occupants often that creates a greater

1180
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:30,560
nuisance. So in the scale of balancing

1181
00:47:28,720 --> 00:47:33,359
things out that would be something to

1182
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:34,720
consider is new continual new residents

1183
00:47:33,359 --> 00:47:37,359
when they don't live there and they're

1184
00:47:34,720 --> 00:47:40,880
leaving the next day. They're not as

1185
00:47:37,359 --> 00:47:43,200
great of neighbors to have.

1186
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:45,040
Well, but if it's the ordinance is

1187
00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:47,839
already requiring that you have an owner

1188
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:50,319
occupied that's at the

1189
00:47:47,839 --> 00:47:53,359
» Oh, and I forgot to say by state law

1190
00:47:50,319 --> 00:47:55,680
they cannot have I'm trying to think if

1191
00:47:53,359 --> 00:47:58,720
this was mandatory. I guess I'd have to

1192
00:47:55,680 --> 00:48:00,240
look this that um I thought the state

1193
00:47:58,720 --> 00:48:03,560
law made it mandatory that you cannot

1194
00:48:00,240 --> 00:48:03,560
use them as

1195
00:48:03,839 --> 00:48:08,240
Jenny. You're going to have to pull this

1196
00:48:05,040 --> 00:48:09,839
up for me again

1197
00:48:08,240 --> 00:48:12,400
cuz I'm trying to remember if it said we

1198
00:48:09,839 --> 00:48:15,440
could we could restrict it or we had to

1199
00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:16,319
restrict it. Do you remember?

1200
00:48:15,440 --> 00:48:20,319
» I'm trying to remember from the

1201
00:48:16,319 --> 00:48:21,920
ordinance. I just need your face.

1202
00:48:20,319 --> 00:48:24,559
» I can't remember if the ordinance stated

1203
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:27,119
that we could restrict it or we had to

1204
00:48:24,559 --> 00:48:30,119
restrict it from um short-term

1205
00:48:27,119 --> 00:48:30,119
» Rentals.

1206
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:34,559
Uh let's see. I'm pretty sure it said we

1207
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:36,720
could

1208
00:48:34,559 --> 00:48:39,440
» It's not my understanding is it's not

1209
00:48:36,720 --> 00:48:41,680
applicable for short-term rentals.

1210
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:43,760
That that would be a separate if we

1211
00:48:41,680 --> 00:48:45,280
wanted to allow short-term rentals. That

1212
00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:47,599
would be a separate.

1213
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:49,440
» So it doesn't mean that they couldn't

1214
00:48:47,599 --> 00:48:50,480
happen. It just means that it would be a

1215
00:48:49,440 --> 00:48:51,359
part of this.

1216
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:54,800
» I understand.

1217
00:48:51,359 --> 00:48:56,880
» Okay. I I was just curious because I I

1218
00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:59,200
think my number one concern is having

1219
00:48:56,880 --> 00:49:00,559
something that's a a law. what this are

1220
00:48:59,200 --> 00:49:02,400
going to be. Well, you can we can

1221
00:49:00,559 --> 00:49:05,119
approve an accessory dwelling unit, but

1222
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:08,400
only if Well, I'm like, well, how's that

1223
00:49:05,119 --> 00:49:11,520
enforceable? Because I I hear people all

1224
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:13,599
the time say it's we have ordinances on

1225
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:16,079
the books, but yet we can't enforce

1226
00:49:13,599 --> 00:49:17,839
those. And I would like to know

1227
00:49:16,079 --> 00:49:21,200
enforcement,

1228
00:49:17,839 --> 00:49:24,240
how enforcement would happen on things.

1229
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:26,480
And it's, you know, it's it's one of

1230
00:49:24,240 --> 00:49:28,559
those things that we want to make sure

1231
00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:31,440
we're not just having a law that is on

1232
00:49:28,559 --> 00:49:33,119
paper but not enforceable.

1233
00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:35,359
» Well, it just comes down to funding to

1234
00:49:33,119 --> 00:49:38,160
be quite honest at city level. This city

1235
00:49:35,359 --> 00:49:40,400
can enforce as much as they want to fund

1236
00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:42,720
and as much as they're able to fund, I

1237
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:45,599
think, and and then you just end up in

1238
00:49:42,720 --> 00:49:47,359
that in that balance. So, not

1239
00:49:45,599 --> 00:49:48,880
introducing the ordinance, I I don't

1240
00:49:47,359 --> 00:49:51,760
know if that really solves the problem.

1241
00:49:48,880 --> 00:49:54,640
We do have a lot of ordinances and we we

1242
00:49:51,760 --> 00:49:56,960
operate on kind of a platform of trust

1243
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:58,240
in communities. Um but it would just

1244
00:49:56,960 --> 00:49:59,680
depend on how much of the city's

1245
00:49:58,240 --> 00:50:04,200
resources they would want to dedicate to

1246
00:49:59,680 --> 00:50:04,200
enforcement. But absolutely they could

1247
00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:15,079
have

1248
00:50:11,599 --> 00:50:15,079
run out of time.

1249
00:50:17,599 --> 00:50:22,559
Greg, do you have any you'd like to

1250
00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:24,559
follow up on? We did follow up on

1251
00:50:22,559 --> 00:50:25,920
yours.

1252
00:50:24,559 --> 00:50:26,640
» You didn't just you didn't hear the

1253
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:28,240
answer.

1254
00:50:26,640 --> 00:50:30,800
» Oh, no. I did hear the answer. So, yeah.

1255
00:50:28,240 --> 00:50:33,440
I don't know what what to say. I guess

1256
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:33,920
it was just public meeting. I'll just

1257
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:37,440
» Okay.

1258
00:50:33,920 --> 00:50:40,440
» See in the presentation what's to cover.

1259
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:40,440
All right.

1260
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:45,640
» We got like three minutes.

1261
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:50,800
If not, we'll close the work session.

1262
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:54,520
» You're the boss.

1263
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:54,520
» Okay, let's do it.

1264
00:50:59,119 --> 00:51:03,440
» We need a motion to

1265
00:51:01,599 --> 00:51:05,119
make a motion to close the work session.

1266
00:51:03,440 --> 00:51:05,520
» I'll make a motion to close the work

1267
00:51:05,119 --> 00:51:07,839
session.

1268
00:51:05,520 --> 00:51:11,760
» So, I have a motion and a second. I'll

1269
00:51:07,839 --> 00:51:11,760
second. All in favor?

1270
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:18,640
Okay, we're going to start by having the

1271
00:51:14,960 --> 00:51:21,119
pledge of allegiance by

1272
00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:25,319
» Council member.

1273
00:51:21,119 --> 00:51:25,319
All right, everyone please stand.

1274
00:51:26,559 --> 00:51:31,760
» Ready, begin.

1275
00:51:28,319 --> 00:51:34,800
» I aliance to the flag of the United

1276
00:51:31,760 --> 00:51:37,760
States of America and to the republic

1277
00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:40,800
for which it stands. One nation under

1278
00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:44,440
God, indivisible, with liberty and

1279
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:44,440
justice for all.

1280
00:51:50,079 --> 00:51:53,520
Our dear father in heaven, we are so

1281
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:56,160
thankful to be gathered here this day as

1282
00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:58,000
as residents of Parisville and the city

1283
00:51:56,160 --> 00:51:59,599
council. We pray that we will be guided

1284
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:00,960
by thee and by thy spirit. that we will

1285
00:51:59,599 --> 00:52:03,200
make wise decisions that are pleasing

1286
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:04,880
unto thee and that we will do what is in

1287
00:52:03,200 --> 00:52:06,880
the best interest of the residents and

1288
00:52:04,880 --> 00:52:07,760
we say these things in the name of Jesus

1289
00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:10,000
Christ. Amen.

1290
00:52:07,760 --> 00:52:12,160
» Amen.

1291
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:15,280
» Our next item on the agenda is public

1292
00:52:12,160 --> 00:52:17,200
comment before we go up and have a

1293
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:19,040
public comment. I would like to make one

1294
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:21,040
comment

1295
00:52:19,040 --> 00:52:22,960
well a few comments but one try to keep

1296
00:52:21,040 --> 00:52:24,720
it to three minutes. You're more than

1297
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:26,079
welcome to come up and share your

1298
00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:29,359
thoughts.

1299
00:52:26,079 --> 00:52:31,440
We did hear that there may have been

1300
00:52:29,359 --> 00:52:34,400
miscommunication that has occurred

1301
00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:36,800
somewhere down the line and there is not

1302
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:39,280
a public hearing today for anything to

1303
00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:42,319
do with West Harrisville Road or the

1304
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:44,559
rideway. It's strictly a discussion that

1305
00:52:42,319 --> 00:52:47,760
goes amongst the council that the

1306
00:52:44,559 --> 00:52:49,440
council brought up regarding want to see

1307
00:52:47,760 --> 00:52:51,040
some of the avenues there. But there's

1308
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:55,359
not any decisions going to be made

1309
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:56,800
tonight. There's no no public hearing,

1310
00:52:55,359 --> 00:52:59,280
but if you want to comment it, you're

1311
00:52:56,800 --> 00:53:01,359
more than welcome to comment.

1312
00:52:59,280 --> 00:53:05,200
So, if you'd like to comment, please get

1313
00:53:01,359 --> 00:53:10,760
up, state your name, email address, and

1314
00:53:05,200 --> 00:53:10,760
your email address, and uh your concern.

1315
00:53:12,240 --> 00:53:18,240
» Good evening. My name is Mike Dere. I am

1316
00:53:15,119 --> 00:53:20,079
a trustee of the um property at 5967

1317
00:53:18,240 --> 00:53:24,400
West.

1318
00:53:20,079 --> 00:53:26,160
Um, email is miked debris 670gmail.com.

1319
00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:27,599
What else would you like to know?

1320
00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:30,800
» You got your name. You got the email

1321
00:53:27,599 --> 00:53:32,400
address. That's good. Y

1322
00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:35,040
» And I'll try to keep this real brief for

1323
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:36,880
you. So, Mayor Sham, members of the city

1324
00:53:35,040 --> 00:53:38,319
council, tonight I want to share with

1325
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:41,040
you some concerns that many residents

1326
00:53:38,319 --> 00:53:42,480
have regarding the widening of the road.

1327
00:53:41,040 --> 00:53:43,920
My dad and brother recently met with

1328
00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:46,559
Shannon Wix, some of the avenues

1329
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:48,720
consultants of Cody and Cody from ESI to

1330
00:53:46,559 --> 00:53:50,160
discuss the impact of the property.

1331
00:53:48,720 --> 00:53:52,160
During the meeting, Cody laid out a

1332
00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:54,400
tenative design plan detailed and the

1333
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:55,599
impact it would have on the property.

1334
00:53:54,400 --> 00:53:57,920
There are a couple of questions that we

1335
00:53:55,599 --> 00:54:00,960
have regarding the project. First, the

1336
00:53:57,920 --> 00:54:04,319
easement or ride ofway. If the city has

1337
00:54:00,960 --> 00:54:07,440
a 99 ft rightway then that they maintain

1338
00:54:04,319 --> 00:54:09,520
then in fact then why is the city

1339
00:54:07,440 --> 00:54:11,359
offering just compensation for taking

1340
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:13,200
out trees, grass, sprinklers, fences,

1341
00:54:11,359 --> 00:54:14,400
etc. that are impacted by the

1342
00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:15,839
development but not offering

1343
00:54:14,400 --> 00:54:18,480
compensation for the actual taking of

1344
00:54:15,839 --> 00:54:19,920
the land itself. The question was posed

1345
00:54:18,480 --> 00:54:21,839
to both Shannon and Cody during the

1346
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:23,200
meeting and the response was the city

1347
00:54:21,839 --> 00:54:25,280
wanted to be good neighbors by helping

1348
00:54:23,200 --> 00:54:28,079
out impacted landowners. Why would a

1349
00:54:25,280 --> 00:54:30,000
city spend limited taxpayer dollars on a

1350
00:54:28,079 --> 00:54:32,160
select few people simply to be

1351
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:33,760
neighborly? This approach does not seem

1352
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:36,400
equitable for the broader taxpaying

1353
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:38,319
citizens of Harrisville City. Also, if

1354
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,760
the city has a right of way that they

1355
00:54:38,319 --> 00:54:41,280
think they have, then why would the

1356
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:42,480
property owners be asked to sign a

1357
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:44,480
warranty deed transferring their

1358
00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:46,880
property to Harrisville City and then

1359
00:54:44,480 --> 00:54:48,559
reported to the county? A valid right

1360
00:54:46,880 --> 00:54:50,160
ofway does not require a transfer of

1361
00:54:48,559 --> 00:54:52,400
property. Nor does it require consent

1362
00:54:50,160 --> 00:54:55,200
from current owners. If the city wanted

1363
00:54:52,400 --> 00:54:57,520
me to transfer my property to them, then

1364
00:54:55,200 --> 00:55:00,240
I need to be properly compensated for

1365
00:54:57,520 --> 00:55:01,920
that property at fair value. I have yet

1366
00:55:00,240 --> 00:55:03,839
to receive the city's survey showing

1367
00:55:01,920 --> 00:55:06,079
where the easement even exists. We have

1368
00:55:03,839 --> 00:55:09,520
requested that.

1369
00:55:06,079 --> 00:55:11,200
Second, um current design project room

1370
00:55:09,520 --> 00:55:12,640
for improvement. A bike lane. I

1371
00:55:11,200 --> 00:55:14,800
understand the six foot bike lane was

1372
00:55:12,640 --> 00:55:17,680
part of the grant proposal by putting um

1373
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:20,160
a bike lane for less than a half a mile

1374
00:55:17,680 --> 00:55:22,800
in the current scenario and it doesn't

1375
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:24,960
connect to anything. It seems seems like

1376
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:27,760
a pretty big waste of uh federal and

1377
00:55:24,960 --> 00:55:29,200
state tax dollars. I also recognize that

1378
00:55:27,760 --> 00:55:30,960
one could argue the project could simply

1379
00:55:29,200 --> 00:55:32,960
be in phase one and the future projects

1380
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:35,119
or phases could connect the bike path

1381
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:36,960
further, but that might take decades for

1382
00:55:35,119 --> 00:55:38,640
that to even happen. I would ask the

1383
00:55:36,960 --> 00:55:41,280
council to reconsider the inclusion of a

1384
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:43,200
bike lane. sidewalks. The tenative

1385
00:55:41,280 --> 00:55:44,800
design also calls for a current 7 foot

1386
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:47,760
wide sidewalk. By the way, the standard

1387
00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:49,839
sidewalk is 4 ft um west of of all of

1388
00:55:47,760 --> 00:55:51,440
that new development potentially. Why is

1389
00:55:49,839 --> 00:55:53,119
such a large sidewalk necessary in

1390
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:55,520
keeping with agriculture residential

1391
00:55:53,119 --> 00:55:57,440
zoning in the neighborhood? With the 700

1392
00:55:55,520 --> 00:55:59,440
ft sidewalk, the irrigation head gates

1393
00:55:57,440 --> 00:56:01,119
would physically sit in the sidewalk.

1394
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:02,960
This design creates a safety hazard for

1395
00:56:01,119 --> 00:56:04,319
those who end up using the sidewalk. Not

1396
00:56:02,960 --> 00:56:06,160
to mention, it could be costly to

1397
00:56:04,319 --> 00:56:08,240
repair. Additionally, all the resident

1398
00:56:06,160 --> 00:56:10,640
mailboxes would physically be located in

1399
00:56:08,240 --> 00:56:14,400
the sidewalk. again creating a safety

1400
00:56:10,640 --> 00:56:16,240
hazard for those um using it. Lastly,

1401
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:18,240
when it shows the walk needs to be

1402
00:56:16,240 --> 00:56:20,160
cleared, there's an increased burden for

1403
00:56:18,240 --> 00:56:22,319
residents to clear such a large area

1404
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:24,400
with snow. The snow plows will push the

1405
00:56:22,319 --> 00:56:26,799
snow right up into that sidewalk area

1406
00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:30,000
because there's nowhere else to put it.

1407
00:56:26,799 --> 00:56:33,280
So, the ask is simply, would you please

1408
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:35,920
slow down and reconsider what we're

1409
00:56:33,280 --> 00:56:40,319
doing as a long-term

1410
00:56:35,920 --> 00:56:40,319
process? So, thank you for your time.

1411
00:56:41,040 --> 00:56:44,079
Hi, Danny Hammond with the Young

1412
00:56:42,559 --> 00:56:45,599
Automotive Group. I'm not here to talk

1413
00:56:44,079 --> 00:56:47,359
about Harrisville Road, but I am here to

1414
00:56:45,599 --> 00:56:49,599
talk to you about what the Young

1415
00:56:47,359 --> 00:56:52,400
Automotive Group can do here for you as

1416
00:56:49,599 --> 00:56:54,000
a city. I up until July of this year, I

1417
00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:56,240
was a municipal employee. I was in

1418
00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:58,960
charge of a fleet and I know what that's

1419
00:56:56,240 --> 00:57:00,880
like. I also served in my city council

1420
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:02,799
and on the planning commission and

1421
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:04,160
Syracuse where I grew up. So, I kind of

1422
00:57:02,799 --> 00:57:05,599
know what it's like to be in your shoes

1423
00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:07,839
and to be looking at how you can use

1424
00:57:05,599 --> 00:57:09,200
your best use of tax dollars and when it

1425
00:57:07,839 --> 00:57:10,960
comes to tight budgets, how you make

1426
00:57:09,200 --> 00:57:12,480
that all work. And a lot of times when

1427
00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:13,760
people see the Young Automotive Group,

1428
00:57:12,480 --> 00:57:14,799
they see the buildings, they see how big

1429
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:16,640
they are, and they think, "Oh, they got

1430
00:57:14,799 --> 00:57:18,319
to be the most expensive." And the

1431
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:20,240
reality is that's just not the truth.

1432
00:57:18,319 --> 00:57:21,760
So, in October 1st, all the new state

1433
00:57:20,240 --> 00:57:24,400
contracts are going to go into effect

1434
00:57:21,760 --> 00:57:27,359
for automotive prices, and we would love

1435
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:30,720
for a chance to earn your business. Um,

1436
00:57:27,359 --> 00:57:33,119
and in addition to uh the automotive

1437
00:57:30,720 --> 00:57:34,640
side of buying and selling vehicles, we

1438
00:57:33,119 --> 00:57:37,280
also do some other things that could aid

1439
00:57:34,640 --> 00:57:38,720
in your municipal uh endeavors there.

1440
00:57:37,280 --> 00:57:40,559
The next of which would be collision

1441
00:57:38,720 --> 00:57:42,880
services. So, we're on state contract

1442
00:57:40,559 --> 00:57:46,400
for collision services in Weaver County.

1443
00:57:42,880 --> 00:57:48,079
We have a facility out on 24th Street or

1444
00:57:46,400 --> 00:57:49,599
uh we can take care of any of your

1445
00:57:48,079 --> 00:57:51,440
vehicles you have. Anything that's

1446
00:57:49,599 --> 00:57:53,200
police or fire or something you can't go

1447
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:54,799
to enterprise and rent, we'll get you

1448
00:57:53,200 --> 00:57:57,200
first available bay, get your vehicle

1449
00:57:54,799 --> 00:57:59,280
in, get it fixed at the safe contract

1450
00:57:57,200 --> 00:58:01,280
prices, which in Wever County are some

1451
00:57:59,280 --> 00:58:03,760
of the best there are, and get you back

1452
00:58:01,280 --> 00:58:05,599
on the road and taken care of. In

1453
00:58:03,760 --> 00:58:08,079
addition to the collision services, we

1454
00:58:05,599 --> 00:58:09,599
also do upfitting. And so when you comes

1455
00:58:08,079 --> 00:58:11,359
to your public works vehicles, you've

1456
00:58:09,599 --> 00:58:13,200
got your service trucks, you need a

1457
00:58:11,359 --> 00:58:14,960
truck that has a boom on it, so you can

1458
00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:17,119
put up Christmas lights and trim trees

1459
00:58:14,960 --> 00:58:19,760
and things like that. We do all of those

1460
00:58:17,119 --> 00:58:21,680
trucks right at our uh center in

1461
00:58:19,760 --> 00:58:23,280
Cisville where we'll put where we'll

1462
00:58:21,680 --> 00:58:25,280
build them. We'll get a cabin chassis,

1463
00:58:23,280 --> 00:58:27,839
we'll build a service body, we get all

1464
00:58:25,280 --> 00:58:30,400
the stuff on there and we do it all at

1465
00:58:27,839 --> 00:58:32,319
that state contract price. And so we're

1466
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:35,040
for you guys and kind of the educational

1467
00:58:32,319 --> 00:58:37,040
side of things is you'll hear a lot from

1468
00:58:35,040 --> 00:58:38,720
various vendors of state contract price,

1469
00:58:37,040 --> 00:58:41,040
state contract price, and they notice

1470
00:58:38,720 --> 00:58:42,559
you have your your audit here today. And

1471
00:58:41,040 --> 00:58:44,160
one of the things that I used to do is

1472
00:58:42,559 --> 00:58:46,079
I'd sit down with our auditor and talk

1473
00:58:44,160 --> 00:58:48,160
about all the things I used to be over.

1474
00:58:46,079 --> 00:58:51,520
And my auditor always wanted me to have

1475
00:58:48,160 --> 00:58:53,440
state contract or three bids. And so I

1476
00:58:51,520 --> 00:58:55,440
would go out and get three bids and have

1477
00:58:53,440 --> 00:58:57,760
to play the big game and then state

1478
00:58:55,440 --> 00:58:59,119
contract. And then I got hired in my

1479
00:58:57,760 --> 00:59:00,880
capacity here. And then I come to

1480
00:58:59,119 --> 00:59:03,520
realize that not all state contract

1481
00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:05,359
pricing is the same. And the Young

1482
00:59:03,520 --> 00:59:07,920
Automotive Group when it comes to their

1483
00:59:05,359 --> 00:59:09,760
business model is they make their money

1484
00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:11,680
in volume. They don't make their money

1485
00:59:09,760 --> 00:59:14,000
by coming in and charging different

1486
00:59:11,680 --> 00:59:16,240
cities and people a lot of money and

1487
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:17,680
large markups and things so that they

1488
00:59:16,240 --> 00:59:19,839
take all this money from any one

1489
00:59:17,680 --> 00:59:21,920
individual entity. They make their money

1490
00:59:19,839 --> 00:59:24,960
by doing volume. Last year, the group

1491
00:59:21,920 --> 00:59:26,559
that I'm in sold almost 9,000 vehicles.

1492
00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:28,400
And when you look at all of our state

1493
00:59:26,559 --> 00:59:30,480
contract pricing and the services we

1494
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:32,559
provide to you as a city, you'll see

1495
00:59:30,480 --> 00:59:34,160
that our margins are thin, our prices

1496
00:59:32,559 --> 00:59:35,920
are low, and we would love for the

1497
00:59:34,160 --> 00:59:37,839
opportunity to build a relationship and

1498
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:42,119
earn your business. So, good luck

1499
00:59:37,839 --> 00:59:42,119
tonight and thank you for your time.

1500
00:59:53,839 --> 00:59:59,200
» I'll try to get this done with a little

1501
00:59:55,280 --> 01:00:00,480
bit of here. Good evening, mayor. Good

1502
00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:02,240
evening, members of the council and

1503
01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:04,480
planning commission. My name is Kevin

1504
01:00:02,240 --> 01:00:06,960
Barb. I live and I'm an owner on North

1505
01:00:04,480 --> 01:00:09,920
Harrisville Road. I'm here tonight to

1506
01:00:06,960 --> 01:00:13,280
enter a formal public objection to the

1507
01:00:09,920 --> 01:00:15,920
uh uh permanent record regarding the

1508
01:00:13,280 --> 01:00:17,760
cascading impact of ordinance 575 and

1509
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:19,680
the West Harrisville Road widening

1510
01:00:17,760 --> 01:00:21,839
project. Historically, both West and

1511
01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:24,160
North Harrisville Road have been an

1512
01:00:21,839 --> 01:00:25,920
agriculture backbone of the community.

1513
01:00:24,160 --> 01:00:29,280
Our properties are active use

1514
01:00:25,920 --> 01:00:33,280
agriculture atmosphere. This uh city,

1515
01:00:29,280 --> 01:00:36,319
excuse me, the city owns this city, this

1516
01:00:33,280 --> 01:00:39,520
city general plan exclusively uh pledges

1517
01:00:36,319 --> 01:00:41,280
to protect for us. First, we are facing

1518
01:00:39,520 --> 01:00:43,359
immediate crisis regarding municipal

1519
01:00:41,280 --> 01:00:45,599
overreach and property line

1520
01:00:43,359 --> 01:00:48,480
manipulation. The city is attempting to

1521
01:00:45,599 --> 01:00:52,240
assert an outdated

1522
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:54,240
historical 99 foot county right away

1523
01:00:52,240 --> 01:00:56,799
claimed along the corridor. This

1524
01:00:54,240 --> 01:00:59,359
directly contradicts the decades of

1525
01:00:56,799 --> 01:01:03,599
legal records uh private subdivision

1526
01:00:59,359 --> 01:01:06,559
plots and established a narrow 66 to 86

1527
01:01:03,599 --> 01:01:08,480
ft reality by using an unproven

1528
01:01:06,559 --> 01:01:11,200
historical claim to push construction

1529
01:01:08,480 --> 01:01:12,799
boundaries into our front yards without

1530
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:16,880
formal

1531
01:01:12,799 --> 01:01:18,960
uh amendment domain filing

1532
01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:21,359
and adverse

1533
01:01:18,960 --> 01:01:24,079
excuse me

1534
01:01:21,359 --> 01:01:28,160
a just compensation city open itself

1535
01:01:24,079 --> 01:01:30,960
up to serve to serve legal exposure and

1536
01:01:28,160 --> 01:01:32,880
reverse uh condemnation lawsuit. We have

1537
01:01:30,960 --> 01:01:35,119
already seen independent utility

1538
01:01:32,880 --> 01:01:37,680
districts digging trenches and damaging

1539
01:01:35,119 --> 01:01:40,319
yards without providing property owners

1540
01:01:37,680 --> 01:01:42,799
with timely notifications. Second, the

1541
01:01:40,319 --> 01:01:45,920
city is engaged in a dangerous uh

1542
01:01:42,799 --> 01:01:48,559
engineering negligence by ignoring the

1543
01:01:45,920 --> 01:01:50,799
uh unstudied funnel effect on North

1544
01:01:48,559 --> 01:01:54,319
Harrisville Road. Utah land use law

1545
01:01:50,799 --> 01:01:57,359
mandates that you evaluate and and

1546
01:01:54,319 --> 01:02:00,400
communive impact of development. Yet the

1547
01:01:57,359 --> 01:02:01,839
city has produced zero traffic modeling

1548
01:02:00,400 --> 01:02:05,520
showing that how North Harris School

1549
01:02:01,839 --> 01:02:07,920
Road will handle the in inevitable

1550
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:09,440
overflow bottleneck caused by West

1551
01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:11,760
Harrisville Road construction and

1552
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:13,520
increased subdivision density. North

1553
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:16,640
Harrisville Road features zero

1554
01:02:13,520 --> 01:02:19,359
sidewalks, zero structured gutters, and

1555
01:02:16,640 --> 01:02:21,839
zero engineered safety setbacks, forcing

1556
01:02:19,359 --> 01:02:24,000
high volume urban commuter traffic onto

1557
01:02:21,839 --> 01:02:26,079
the narrow open shoulders where farm

1558
01:02:24,000 --> 01:02:28,960
equipment, tractors, and livestock road

1559
01:02:26,079 --> 01:02:31,520
creates an extreme public safety hazard.

1560
01:02:28,960 --> 01:02:34,079
Third, the widening is a manufactured

1561
01:02:31,520 --> 01:02:36,559
emergency. Independent data shows that

1562
01:02:34,079 --> 01:02:39,520
West Harrisboro can easily handle its

1563
01:02:36,559 --> 01:02:41,760
current localized volume. Over 81% of

1564
01:02:39,520 --> 01:02:44,000
the areas community travel out of the

1565
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:45,920
city along for work. This expansion is

1566
01:02:44,000 --> 01:02:48,960
not being driven by the needs of

1567
01:02:45,920 --> 01:02:52,559
existing residents. It is being

1568
01:02:48,960 --> 01:02:54,960
aggressively pursued solely to satisfy

1569
01:02:52,559 --> 01:02:57,680
the future traffic model of developers

1570
01:02:54,960 --> 01:03:01,839
like the 13 home layout on 640.

1571
01:02:57,680 --> 01:03:04,640
Furthermore, and I'll finish up, uh

1572
01:03:01,839 --> 01:03:06,880
my concern is there's just not enough

1573
01:03:04,640 --> 01:03:08,880
evidence given to the citizens. There's

1574
01:03:06,880 --> 01:03:10,559
if you go on public records, all the

1575
01:03:08,880 --> 01:03:13,119
permits, all the studies, everything

1576
01:03:10,559 --> 01:03:14,480
that's needed uh aren't being done.

1577
01:03:13,119 --> 01:03:16,640
They're not filed.

1578
01:03:14,480 --> 01:03:18,720
» We don't even we don't even have a final

1579
01:03:16,640 --> 01:03:20,079
plan all the way.

1580
01:03:18,720 --> 01:03:22,160
» We're at 90%.

1581
01:03:20,079 --> 01:03:24,319
» I appreciate that, Mayor. That that I I

1582
01:03:22,160 --> 01:03:26,319
do I really do appreciate that. I'm just

1583
01:03:24,319 --> 01:03:29,920
bringing up things that people are

1584
01:03:26,319 --> 01:03:32,559
coming to. I thank each of you and I

1585
01:03:29,920 --> 01:03:37,079
just consider you to work on that.

1586
01:03:32,559 --> 01:03:37,079
Appreciate you very much. Thank you.

1587
01:03:49,680 --> 01:03:55,359
Marvin Ferrell. I reside at uh 2470

1588
01:03:53,359 --> 01:03:57,520
North 750 West. Marvin Ferrell

1589
01:03:55,359 --> 01:04:02,079
atmssn.com.

1590
01:03:57,520 --> 01:04:06,160
I have a partial that is at 607 West

1591
01:04:02,079 --> 01:04:09,760
Road. Uh again, West

1592
01:04:06,160 --> 01:04:11,680
uh uh and I understand there's not a

1593
01:04:09,760 --> 01:04:14,480
discussion for tonight, but this needs

1594
01:04:11,680 --> 01:04:17,680
to be brought up and some information. I

1595
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:20,799
sent out a a email to each one of you uh

1596
01:04:17,680 --> 01:04:23,119
if you had got it. So I'll just briefly

1597
01:04:20,799 --> 01:04:27,280
uh go through this

1598
01:04:23,119 --> 01:04:29,200
um that I that I have uh stating that uh

1599
01:04:27,280 --> 01:04:31,599
six months approximately about six

1600
01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:33,839
months ago uh we started a discussion on

1601
01:04:31,599 --> 01:04:37,280
Westville Road and it was brought up

1602
01:04:33,839 --> 01:04:41,119
that there was an 1885 uh right of way

1603
01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:43,440
along the road. Uh looking into that it

1604
01:04:41,119 --> 01:04:46,079
talks about the the road starting in in

1605
01:04:43,440 --> 01:04:48,559
the town of Lynn at a sandstone monument

1606
01:04:46,079 --> 01:04:51,359
which neither one of those exist today.

1607
01:04:48,559 --> 01:04:54,960
And so the starting point uh is not

1608
01:04:51,359 --> 01:04:58,400
there. So with the further discussion uh

1609
01:04:54,960 --> 01:05:00,880
I contacted the state of Bunsman. Uh

1610
01:04:58,400 --> 01:05:03,359
that was a transfer of uh emails back

1611
01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:06,400
and forth from uh the city to Bunsman

1612
01:05:03,359 --> 01:05:09,680
and back to myself. Uh nothing really

1613
01:05:06,400 --> 01:05:17,839
got accomplished at that uh time uh that

1614
01:05:09,680 --> 01:05:20,400
I filmed. And uh uh then then uh uh Cody

1615
01:05:17,839 --> 01:05:23,520
from uh ESI and Shannon Wixon, they

1616
01:05:20,400 --> 01:05:25,680
they've contacted me. We we've uh had a

1617
01:05:23,520 --> 01:05:27,520
couple of discussions along there and

1618
01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:30,319
I'd like to bring up the same uh

1619
01:05:27,520 --> 01:05:33,280
comments that uh Mike did and one of

1620
01:05:30,319 --> 01:05:37,680
those is the uh construction easement.

1621
01:05:33,280 --> 01:05:40,960
Along with that is the um

1622
01:05:37,680 --> 01:05:42,880
uh warranty deed that uh that we needed

1623
01:05:40,960 --> 01:05:45,359
to sign that warranty deed. If we didn't

1624
01:05:42,880 --> 01:05:48,240
then uh we wouldn't be paid for our

1625
01:05:45,359 --> 01:05:52,079
fences or uh any of the other uh

1626
01:05:48,240 --> 01:05:54,319
structures that that were there. Also uh

1627
01:05:52,079 --> 01:05:57,599
in front of uh Mr. Dan Baitman's

1628
01:05:54,319 --> 01:05:59,520
property uh there is a monument that is

1629
01:05:57,599 --> 01:06:02,319
in the ground that says Utah State

1630
01:05:59,520 --> 01:06:05,680
Rightway. Uh looking further into that

1631
01:06:02,319 --> 01:06:09,839
with Utah, it shows that

1632
01:06:05,680 --> 01:06:11,760
uh that is uh for an 80FT rightway uh

1633
01:06:09,839 --> 01:06:14,079
along there and there's several there's

1634
01:06:11,760 --> 01:06:17,039
a few other monuments along there but

1635
01:06:14,079 --> 01:06:19,599
they've yet to be be found. Uh I'm

1636
01:06:17,039 --> 01:06:21,520
running short on time.

1637
01:06:19,599 --> 01:06:23,680
Um,

1638
01:06:21,520 --> 01:06:26,240
so along West Seris School Road and and

1639
01:06:23,680 --> 01:06:28,799
the setbacks, the the city has approved

1640
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:30,240
those and

1641
01:06:28,799 --> 01:06:32,720
uh everything that I've been able to

1642
01:06:30,240 --> 01:06:37,200
find is an 80ft road along with the

1643
01:06:32,720 --> 01:06:39,920
setbacks. Um, if we do an 80ft roadway

1644
01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:42,960
uh would allow for utilities, including

1645
01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:46,079
air the irrigation ditch fit to fit

1646
01:06:42,960 --> 01:06:48,559
appropriately with the uh corridor.

1647
01:06:46,079 --> 01:06:50,480
uh the the seven side seven foot

1648
01:06:48,559 --> 01:06:52,640
sidewalk I don't think is necessary if

1649
01:06:50,480 --> 01:06:55,760
we have if we use a park strip then we

1650
01:06:52,640 --> 01:06:58,400
could put the irrigation in there uh so

1651
01:06:55,760 --> 01:07:00,240
I just ask the council and thank you for

1652
01:06:58,400 --> 01:07:02,640
your time

1653
01:07:00,240 --> 01:07:06,920
but anyway look at your look at your

1654
01:07:02,640 --> 01:07:06,920
source and consider this please

1655
01:07:15,200 --> 01:07:22,359
Any other public comment?

1656
01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:22,359
If not, we'll close the public comment.

1657
01:07:25,039 --> 01:07:29,839
Next item on our agenda is consent items

1658
01:07:27,520 --> 01:07:34,079
of quarterly budget audit and financial

1659
01:07:29,839 --> 01:07:35,920
review. Jill, if you leave us with that.

1660
01:07:34,079 --> 01:07:39,520
» Um hopefully you were able to look

1661
01:07:35,920 --> 01:07:41,200
through the um report I gave you guys.

1662
01:07:39,520 --> 01:07:44,000
Um

1663
01:07:41,200 --> 01:07:46,640
we had two dates given. I look through

1664
01:07:44,000 --> 01:07:50,319
them. Everything

1665
01:07:46,640 --> 01:07:52,799
besides our really seasonal type

1666
01:07:50,319 --> 01:07:55,359
employees who are recreational and our

1667
01:07:52,799 --> 01:07:57,839
parks um seasonal are actually

1668
01:07:55,359 --> 01:08:00,240
electronic. All the seasonal ones are on

1669
01:07:57,839 --> 01:08:03,599
paper. It's a little easier that way so

1670
01:08:00,240 --> 01:08:05,039
we don't have to train them. But

1671
01:08:03,599 --> 01:08:07,680
this was really focused on our

1672
01:08:05,039 --> 01:08:09,680
electronic end. We have that new time

1673
01:08:07,680 --> 01:08:14,240
card.

1674
01:08:09,680 --> 01:08:17,600
The process was really run run very um

1675
01:08:14,240 --> 01:08:20,319
smoothly except for the time card part.

1676
01:08:17,600 --> 01:08:21,839
We kind of ran into some employees that

1677
01:08:20,319 --> 01:08:25,440
kept forgetting to submit their time

1678
01:08:21,839 --> 01:08:27,920
cards. So we have created a new process

1679
01:08:25,440 --> 01:08:30,239
um that will hopefully

1680
01:08:27,920 --> 01:08:32,719
make sure that they submit or else they

1681
01:08:30,239 --> 01:08:36,719
might have to wait.

1682
01:08:32,719 --> 01:08:39,279
Mhm. Um, we did have our little snafu

1683
01:08:36,719 --> 01:08:43,759
with URS, but URS was closed for the

1684
01:08:39,279 --> 01:08:46,000
month, so because they um received a new

1685
01:08:43,759 --> 01:08:47,679
program called Aras, so we had to wait

1686
01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:50,799
for them to get that up and going and

1687
01:08:47,679 --> 01:08:53,600
then push everything through after.

1688
01:08:50,799 --> 01:08:55,040
Other than that, everything went very

1689
01:08:53,600 --> 01:08:57,679
well. There's some things that we can

1690
01:08:55,040 --> 01:08:59,199
work on, which are time cards, and we've

1691
01:08:57,679 --> 01:09:01,359
created the new process. Other than

1692
01:08:59,199 --> 01:09:02,880
that, everything went great. We just

1693
01:09:01,359 --> 01:09:06,640
wanted to make sure you guys were aware

1694
01:09:02,880 --> 01:09:07,759
of our progress and yeah, you have any

1695
01:09:06,640 --> 01:09:10,960
questions for me?

1696
01:09:07,759 --> 01:09:12,239
» You have any questions?

1697
01:09:10,960 --> 01:09:13,120
» No questions.

1698
01:09:12,239 --> 01:09:14,480
» Thank you, Jill.

1699
01:09:13,120 --> 01:09:16,400
» Yeah.

1700
01:09:14,480 --> 01:09:18,560
» Next item on the agenda is approval of

1701
01:09:16,400 --> 01:09:22,480
the meeting minutes for August 11th. I

1702
01:09:18,560 --> 01:09:23,679
know Rick submitted some adjustments.

1703
01:09:22,480 --> 01:09:24,960
You've already made those.

1704
01:09:23,679 --> 01:09:26,640
» Yeah, I made those.

1705
01:09:24,960 --> 01:09:31,120
» Anybody else have anything on that?

1706
01:09:26,640 --> 01:09:33,199
» Yes, I had one. I'll just read it.

1707
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:35,359
Um, I had a couple spelling things, but

1708
01:09:33,199 --> 01:09:37,120
then the third thing was in the budget

1709
01:09:35,359 --> 01:09:38,799
approval discussion where it states that

1710
01:09:37,120 --> 01:09:40,960
I was wanting my reservations to be

1711
01:09:38,799 --> 01:09:42,640
noted. I believe I stated that the

1712
01:09:40,960 --> 01:09:44,400
amendment I would like to see is to add

1713
01:09:42,640 --> 01:09:46,319
funds to the sidewalk repair

1714
01:09:44,400 --> 01:09:47,920
specifically. We are not getting

1715
01:09:46,319 --> 01:09:49,759
necessary repairs done that are needed

1716
01:09:47,920 --> 01:09:51,440
for the safety of the residents, which

1717
01:09:49,759 --> 01:09:53,279
should be our priority over traveling to

1718
01:09:51,440 --> 01:09:56,159
St. George for a training. I also

1719
01:09:53,279 --> 01:09:58,320
recalled a comment from Brian Fe which

1720
01:09:56,159 --> 01:10:00,480
said these sidewalk sidewalk repairs are

1721
01:09:58,320 --> 01:10:03,040
expensive and we could easily spend

1722
01:10:00,480 --> 01:10:05,520
60,000 on them in one year. Those were

1723
01:10:03,040 --> 01:10:07,760
my additions

1724
01:10:05,520 --> 01:10:10,400
for those changes.

1725
01:10:07,760 --> 01:10:14,120
Anything else? Okay. Can I have a motion

1726
01:10:10,400 --> 01:10:14,120
to approve the minutes?

1727
01:10:15,360 --> 01:10:20,000
» One or the other? I'll make a motion to

1728
01:10:18,000 --> 01:10:21,040
approve minutes with the two revisions

1729
01:10:20,000 --> 01:10:22,320
that have been noted.

1730
01:10:21,040 --> 01:10:22,960
» Okay.

1731
01:10:22,320 --> 01:10:24,000
Second.

1732
01:10:22,960 --> 01:10:28,719
» I'll second.

1733
01:10:24,000 --> 01:10:30,400
» So motion and a second. All in favor?

1734
01:10:28,719 --> 01:10:33,040
» Okay.

1735
01:10:30,400 --> 01:10:36,000
Next item on the agenda is the business

1736
01:10:33,040 --> 01:10:39,520
items. First one is discussion and

1737
01:10:36,000 --> 01:10:41,600
possible action to adopt ordinance 569,

1738
01:10:39,520 --> 01:10:46,400
the ADU and parking amendment, which was

1739
01:10:41,600 --> 01:10:49,199
part of our work session earlier. Um, so

1740
01:10:46,400 --> 01:10:52,080
we're going to have Sarah and Jenny kind

1741
01:10:49,199 --> 01:10:56,199
of take that one. You guys decide if you

1742
01:10:52,080 --> 01:10:56,199
can fight over who goes first.

1743
01:10:57,040 --> 01:11:00,880
» Grover, are you getting any feedback

1744
01:10:58,640 --> 01:11:02,719
now? And can you hear me?

1745
01:11:00,880 --> 01:11:04,239
» Okay, good.

1746
01:11:02,719 --> 01:11:07,679
» Um,

1747
01:11:04,239 --> 01:11:10,000
so we had a um work session before about

1748
01:11:07,679 --> 01:11:12,000
this. For the sake of this meeting, I'll

1749
01:11:10,000 --> 01:11:13,440
do kind of a quick overview of what

1750
01:11:12,000 --> 01:11:18,719
we're considering. Is it okay if I'm

1751
01:11:13,440 --> 01:11:20,880
here for this? Okay. So, um,

1752
01:11:18,719 --> 01:11:24,000
uh, in in past years, the state has been

1753
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:26,239
looking to require cities to have

1754
01:11:24,000 --> 01:11:28,960
ordinances for internal and external

1755
01:11:26,239 --> 01:11:32,080
accessory dwelling units. Um, we adopted

1756
01:11:28,960 --> 01:11:34,159
an internal AD ADU, accessory dwelling

1757
01:11:32,080 --> 01:11:36,080
unit ordinance a few years back when the

1758
01:11:34,159 --> 01:11:38,320
state um, asked for one and now they're

1759
01:11:36,080 --> 01:11:40,000
asking for internal or external ADU

1760
01:11:38,320 --> 01:11:42,320
regulations. This is something

1761
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:45,840
Harrisville has been considering outside

1762
01:11:42,320 --> 01:11:48,480
of um state regulations.

1763
01:11:45,840 --> 01:11:51,199
Uh so the ordinance that we're proposing

1764
01:11:48,480 --> 01:11:54,560
it defines internal and external

1765
01:11:51,199 --> 01:11:58,080
detached ADUs, minimum lot sizes and

1766
01:11:54,560 --> 01:12:00,239
limitations of specifically one ADU per

1767
01:11:58,080 --> 01:12:02,080
primary dwelling and requires that the

1768
01:12:00,239 --> 01:12:07,520
property owner live on the property in

1769
01:12:02,080 --> 01:12:10,080
one of the dwelling units. Um you sorry.

1770
01:12:07,520 --> 01:12:13,920
Uh also we've addressed uh short-term

1771
01:12:10,080 --> 01:12:16,239
rentals uh utility addressing permitting

1772
01:12:13,920 --> 01:12:18,960
licensing requirements and also uh the

1773
01:12:16,239 --> 01:12:22,600
design height setbacks and compatibility

1774
01:12:18,960 --> 01:12:22,600
standards for ADUs.

1775
01:12:23,760 --> 01:12:28,159
Um so I'm not going to go into a lot of

1776
01:12:26,239 --> 01:12:30,159
detail of exactly what we've done. I

1777
01:12:28,159 --> 01:12:32,159
think in our discussion we can do that.

1778
01:12:30,159 --> 01:12:34,480
Um essentially though what we're trying

1779
01:12:32,159 --> 01:12:36,320
to balance is we want to right now

1780
01:12:34,480 --> 01:12:39,360
residents are not allowed to build

1781
01:12:36,320 --> 01:12:42,159
detached accessory dwelling units. So uh

1782
01:12:39,360 --> 01:12:43,440
residents may have accessory structures

1783
01:12:42,159 --> 01:12:46,000
but they are not permitted to be

1784
01:12:43,440 --> 01:12:48,719
habitable. We're creating an avenue

1785
01:12:46,000 --> 01:12:51,360
where residents can have external

1786
01:12:48,719 --> 01:12:54,400
detached ADUs that are habitable but

1787
01:12:51,360 --> 01:12:55,679
trying to balance that with the um

1788
01:12:54,400 --> 01:12:57,600
impact that it'll have on their

1789
01:12:55,679 --> 01:13:00,960
neighbors. So, we've worked through

1790
01:12:57,600 --> 01:13:03,520
different setbacks and other

1791
01:13:00,960 --> 01:13:07,199
requirements for these detached ADUs to

1792
01:13:03,520 --> 01:13:09,120
make sure that they um limit the

1793
01:13:07,199 --> 01:13:10,640
exposure and impact on neighboring

1794
01:13:09,120 --> 01:13:13,679
properties.

1795
01:13:10,640 --> 01:13:17,040
So, with that, I think we can go into

1796
01:13:13,679 --> 01:13:21,239
our discussion. Um, we had some

1797
01:13:17,040 --> 01:13:21,239
discussion in our work session.

1798
01:13:23,360 --> 01:13:28,159
» So, Craig, why don't you start? So if

1799
01:13:26,000 --> 01:13:30,640
you're okay

1800
01:13:28,159 --> 01:13:33,520
» Well because I have I have you know I

1801
01:13:30,640 --> 01:13:37,199
mentioned the letter table. Yes, I have

1802
01:13:33,520 --> 01:13:39,840
three basic concepts. One, formatting.

1803
01:13:37,199 --> 01:13:44,800
And so in the formatting, I guess the

1804
01:13:39,840 --> 01:13:46,719
first question I have is uh the 1120 in

1805
01:13:44,800 --> 01:13:49,280
in the

1806
01:13:46,719 --> 01:13:52,640
musical code talks about these

1807
01:13:49,280 --> 01:13:54,640
provisions that are from 1120 are

1808
01:13:52,640 --> 01:13:56,880
provide further restrictions from what

1809
01:13:54,640 --> 01:14:00,080
is already stated in the ordinance. And

1810
01:13:56,880 --> 01:14:03,120
so I raised the question, why not have

1811
01:14:00,080 --> 01:14:05,199
ADUs defined as a land use and land use

1812
01:14:03,120 --> 01:14:09,600
section and then make reference to what

1813
01:14:05,199 --> 01:14:11,199
the standards are in the uh chapter 20.

1814
01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:13,679
And so that that was the first concern I

1815
01:14:11,199 --> 01:14:17,360
had is just the purpose of chapter 20

1816
01:14:13,679 --> 01:14:20,239
versus the other provisions and both in

1817
01:14:17,360 --> 01:14:24,000
the use being allowed and not allowed

1818
01:14:20,239 --> 01:14:27,360
» And also then the definitions being also

1819
01:14:24,000 --> 01:14:28,640
taken out of chapter 20 and put in the

1820
01:14:27,360 --> 01:14:29,840
definition section.

1821
01:14:28,640 --> 01:14:31,840
» And so I think those are great

1822
01:14:29,840 --> 01:14:33,679
suggestions. Um especially the

1823
01:14:31,840 --> 01:14:35,760
definitions can easily move because of

1824
01:14:33,679 --> 01:14:38,080
our our last recommendation. They're not

1825
01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:41,280
numbered anymore. So they can easily

1826
01:14:38,080 --> 01:14:44,000
move into the alphabetical order. Um and

1827
01:14:41,280 --> 01:14:47,760
then we can uh put that in the land use

1828
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:50,480
chart and then reference the um the

1829
01:14:47,760 --> 01:14:52,480
section of code from there. It was in

1830
01:14:50,480 --> 01:14:53,840
intentionally put in for just the

1831
01:14:52,480 --> 01:14:55,600
internal, but now that we're really

1832
01:14:53,840 --> 01:14:58,239
expanding on the accessory dwelling

1833
01:14:55,600 --> 01:15:02,080
units, I I think that it has a logical

1834
01:14:58,239 --> 01:15:03,440
pattern to it. Um whatever the other

1835
01:15:02,080 --> 01:15:06,080
council members feel, but I think that's

1836
01:15:03,440 --> 01:15:08,960
a a wise improvement. And then this may

1837
01:15:06,080 --> 01:15:12,320
be for Brody, but as I was looking at

1838
01:15:08,960 --> 01:15:14,159
the uh section going to land uses, we

1839
01:15:12,320 --> 01:15:16,320
have references to three different land

1840
01:15:14,159 --> 01:15:18,239
uses. And then when it says goes to

1841
01:15:16,320 --> 01:15:21,040
code, those are the wrong code

1842
01:15:18,239 --> 01:15:22,640
references. And so I know this is not

1843
01:15:21,040 --> 01:15:25,040
part of the ADU discussion, but it's

1844
01:15:22,640 --> 01:15:26,320
just an error that I I noticed there. Is

1845
01:15:25,040 --> 01:15:28,159
that something to be done as part of

1846
01:15:26,320 --> 01:15:29,360
this? Is that a separate item that's

1847
01:15:28,159 --> 01:15:31,199
being looked at?

1848
01:15:29,360 --> 01:15:34,000
» I can address.

1849
01:15:31,199 --> 01:15:36,400
» Okay. So, we did public notice this one

1850
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:37,760
for land use changes and I think we've

1851
01:15:36,400 --> 01:15:39,520
consulted with Brody with this on the

1852
01:15:37,760 --> 01:15:42,159
past. So, you could override me, but

1853
01:15:39,520 --> 01:15:43,520
because we are making other land use

1854
01:15:42,159 --> 01:15:44,480
changes, I think it's appropriate to

1855
01:15:43,520 --> 01:15:45,199
make those corrections.

1856
01:15:44,480 --> 01:15:48,679
» Okay.

1857
01:15:45,199 --> 01:15:48,679
» Any other thoughts?

1858
01:15:48,880 --> 01:15:57,040
» The next one then is um

1859
01:15:52,800 --> 01:15:58,800
» Well, it was just the in in section four

1860
01:15:57,040 --> 01:16:00,400
we had two A's.

1861
01:15:58,800 --> 01:16:04,000
» Yes, I saw that. So, we'll want to

1862
01:16:00,400 --> 01:16:06,400
correct that. Okay. Then there were the

1863
01:16:04,000 --> 01:16:10,239
next category policy questions and some

1864
01:16:06,400 --> 01:16:11,440
of the uh items discussed I didn't see

1865
01:16:10,239 --> 01:16:14,320
them discussed in the planning

1866
01:16:11,440 --> 01:16:16,400
commission or in any memo having a

1867
01:16:14,320 --> 01:16:19,280
discussion. Okay. Is this a a policy we

1868
01:16:16,400 --> 01:16:21,920
want to make as a city regarding some of

1869
01:16:19,280 --> 01:16:24,880
the requirements or not having

1870
01:16:21,920 --> 01:16:26,719
requirements. So the first one was the

1871
01:16:24,880 --> 01:16:28,560
uh

1872
01:16:26,719 --> 01:16:31,440
the one provision of the state law says

1873
01:16:28,560 --> 01:16:34,159
that communities can

1874
01:16:31,440 --> 01:16:37,199
put up to a 25%

1875
01:16:34,159 --> 01:16:41,040
limit on ADUs

1876
01:16:37,199 --> 01:16:43,199
of all their residential land use areas.

1877
01:16:41,040 --> 01:16:46,159
What's the thought about using that

1878
01:16:43,199 --> 01:16:48,560
provision? I I know why it would it was

1879
01:16:46,159 --> 01:16:50,480
created. Mhm.

1880
01:16:48,560 --> 01:16:53,920
» So, in general, the planning commission

1881
01:16:50,480 --> 01:16:56,080
didn't we discussed the ADUs in general

1882
01:16:53,920 --> 01:16:58,000
and there didn't seem a lot to have a

1883
01:16:56,080 --> 01:17:00,400
lot of appetite for restricting them

1884
01:16:58,000 --> 01:17:02,640
really far as far as where they went

1885
01:17:00,400 --> 01:17:04,400
other than the lot size. That was the

1886
01:17:02,640 --> 01:17:08,239
main concern of the planning commission

1887
01:17:04,400 --> 01:17:09,920
was not where they were, but more what

1888
01:17:08,239 --> 01:17:12,239
the lot size were. We had a lot of

1889
01:17:09,920 --> 01:17:14,320
discussion on what size lot would you

1890
01:17:12,239 --> 01:17:17,840
want to see it on and then that would

1891
01:17:14,320 --> 01:17:19,280
tie into kind of where they end up but

1892
01:17:17,840 --> 01:17:21,120
there was a concern so it's not

1893
01:17:19,280 --> 01:17:22,640
something we delved into. It's something

1894
01:17:21,120 --> 01:17:23,280
the council could look into if they

1895
01:17:22,640 --> 01:17:24,960
wanted to.

1896
01:17:23,280 --> 01:17:28,320
» Okay. So that really wasn't discussed at

1897
01:17:24,960 --> 01:17:33,520
all. Okay. No. Um the other one was

1898
01:17:28,320 --> 01:17:36,400
about uh a certificate once someone gets

1899
01:17:33,520 --> 01:17:38,960
their permit building permit suspected

1900
01:17:36,400 --> 01:17:42,080
that the city can issue a certificate

1901
01:17:38,960 --> 01:17:45,040
that's recorded with the property county

1902
01:17:42,080 --> 01:17:48,320
alerting to future buyers

1903
01:17:45,040 --> 01:17:51,520
um that this property has an ADU in it

1904
01:17:48,320 --> 01:17:53,520
that it's not a duplex that it has

1905
01:17:51,520 --> 01:17:55,760
provisions that you have to have on

1906
01:17:53,520 --> 01:17:58,719
occupancy and other units.

1907
01:17:55,760 --> 01:18:02,080
And then also put into it then that if

1908
01:17:58,719 --> 01:18:05,199
if uh you know if you if you want to

1909
01:18:02,080 --> 01:18:07,199
tear this down you've also lost your ADU

1910
01:18:05,199 --> 01:18:09,440
right and you have to start over again.

1911
01:18:07,199 --> 01:18:12,080
Those certificates I found been always

1912
01:18:09,440 --> 01:18:13,840
helpful and it's amazing once once

1913
01:18:12,080 --> 01:18:16,480
people know you have a certificate how

1914
01:18:13,840 --> 01:18:18,239
my me time lenders and all that also are

1915
01:18:16,480 --> 01:18:20,400
coming to the say show me your

1916
01:18:18,239 --> 01:18:23,199
certificate that the city has allowed

1917
01:18:20,400 --> 01:18:25,040
this not just something you've done and

1918
01:18:23,199 --> 01:18:27,440
I think it's a good safety feature

1919
01:18:25,040 --> 01:18:30,000
because you know sometimes we don't get

1920
01:18:27,440 --> 01:18:32,080
to everything that's done and it may be

1921
01:18:30,000 --> 01:18:35,280
an illegal ADU not meeting any of the

1922
01:18:32,080 --> 01:18:37,199
standards and you want this as a second

1923
01:18:35,280 --> 01:18:40,560
way to try to

1924
01:18:37,199 --> 01:18:42,080
police legal ADUs and make people know

1925
01:18:40,560 --> 01:18:44,400
I've got this right and lending that

1926
01:18:42,080 --> 01:18:46,080
solution knows they have that right

1927
01:18:44,400 --> 01:18:48,000
because they talk about doing something

1928
01:18:46,080 --> 01:18:49,360
like that any certificates that the city

1929
01:18:48,000 --> 01:18:51,920
would issue afterwards.

1930
01:18:49,360 --> 01:18:54,560
» No. So we we discussed this a little bit

1931
01:18:51,920 --> 01:18:56,640
in the premeating. Um and we can

1932
01:18:54,560 --> 01:18:58,800
definitely look into certificates from

1933
01:18:56,640 --> 01:19:00,719
from my standpoint. I saw the building

1934
01:18:58,800 --> 01:19:03,840
permit for the ADU. what would be a

1935
01:19:00,719 --> 01:19:07,760
specific building permit as the

1936
01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:10,560
certificate in essence. And so we could

1937
01:19:07,760 --> 01:19:12,000
do a specific certificate, but it I

1938
01:19:10,560 --> 01:19:14,239
would be concerned that certificate

1939
01:19:12,000 --> 01:19:16,320
might u lead people astray to think that

1940
01:19:14,239 --> 01:19:17,600
they can demolish it and rebuild it. Of

1941
01:19:16,320 --> 01:19:19,760
course, it would need to be stated in

1942
01:19:17,600 --> 01:19:21,120
the certificate, but a building permit I

1943
01:19:19,760 --> 01:19:22,640
think is pretty clear. If it's a

1944
01:19:21,120 --> 01:19:24,800
permitted use, then it goes through the

1945
01:19:22,640 --> 01:19:27,600
building permit process. Then that's

1946
01:19:24,800 --> 01:19:29,440
kind of your stamp of approval. Um homes

1947
01:19:27,600 --> 01:19:34,239
have the same issue. Is this is this

1948
01:19:29,440 --> 01:19:36,719
permitted? Is this not? Um it it is also

1949
01:19:34,239 --> 01:19:39,840
by the design standards we've included,

1950
01:19:36,719 --> 01:19:43,440
it will look different than a duplex or

1951
01:19:39,840 --> 01:19:45,360
a multifamily home because it it's

1952
01:19:43,440 --> 01:19:49,280
specified in the ordinance that it needs

1953
01:19:45,360 --> 01:19:51,600
to look um subordinate or it still needs

1954
01:19:49,280 --> 01:19:53,360
to look like a single family home. So

1955
01:19:51,600 --> 01:19:54,560
hopefully we can avoid that by the

1956
01:19:53,360 --> 01:19:56,960
building standards and through the

1957
01:19:54,560 --> 01:19:58,080
building permit process. But uh if the

1958
01:19:56,960 --> 01:19:59,520
council would like to include a

1959
01:19:58,080 --> 01:20:01,440
certificate and some language to that,

1960
01:19:59,520 --> 01:20:03,600
that's absolutely something we can do.

1961
01:20:01,440 --> 01:20:05,679
» Okay. I I think maybe for the other

1962
01:20:03,600 --> 01:20:10,080
council members, my feeling on that part

1963
01:20:05,679 --> 01:20:12,000
is the the the building license is fine,

1964
01:20:10,080 --> 01:20:13,280
but that is not anything any lending

1965
01:20:12,000 --> 01:20:15,360
institution will look at when they're

1966
01:20:13,280 --> 01:20:17,520
making a new loan on on a new purpose.

1967
01:20:15,360 --> 01:20:19,520
They don't look at building permits.

1968
01:20:17,520 --> 01:20:21,840
They'll look at what is recorded with

1969
01:20:19,520 --> 01:20:23,360
the title of the property. And that's

1970
01:20:21,840 --> 01:20:25,840
why I think that certificate is very

1971
01:20:23,360 --> 01:20:28,080
helpful. So people know, oh, this is a

1972
01:20:25,840 --> 01:20:30,560
legal one. And let institutions will

1973
01:20:28,080 --> 01:20:33,120
say, well, I'm not going to lose until I

1974
01:20:30,560 --> 01:20:36,080
guess I'm from here saying this is still

1975
01:20:33,120 --> 01:20:40,800
a legal unit because there's nothing to

1976
01:20:36,080 --> 01:20:44,000
to indicate it is legal. And you know,

1977
01:20:40,800 --> 01:20:45,760
there's some detached ADUs now,

1978
01:20:44,000 --> 01:20:48,480
which are, you know, we don't have any

1979
01:20:45,760 --> 01:20:50,800
permits. We don't have any uh notice

1980
01:20:48,480 --> 01:20:51,440
because we didn't allow them to put out

1981
01:20:50,800 --> 01:20:53,040
there.

1982
01:20:51,440 --> 01:20:56,880
» So you would recommend we have a

1983
01:20:53,040 --> 01:20:58,960
licensing section of to add a section

1984
01:20:56,880 --> 01:21:00,400
that says um so

1985
01:20:58,960 --> 01:21:01,840
» We would issue us a certain

1986
01:21:00,400 --> 01:21:02,320
» Certificate through this through the

1987
01:21:01,840 --> 01:21:03,360
city.

1988
01:21:02,320 --> 01:21:04,480
» Yeah. Okay.

1989
01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:06,640
» Record with

1990
01:21:04,480 --> 01:21:09,840
» Recorded with it with the property.

1991
01:21:06,640 --> 01:21:11,760
» Yeah. To the county recorder. Yeah.

1992
01:21:09,840 --> 01:21:14,800
Kind of improves what state law says

1993
01:21:11,760 --> 01:21:16,480
about an option we have.

1994
01:21:14,800 --> 01:21:17,920
Well, that's just my opinion. The

1995
01:21:16,480 --> 01:21:18,159
council hasn't weighed in on that yet.

1996
01:21:17,920 --> 01:21:20,000
So,

1997
01:21:18,159 --> 01:21:23,920
» No, but I just want to make it note so I

1998
01:21:20,000 --> 01:21:26,719
know what may end up in your motion.

1999
01:21:23,920 --> 01:21:30,480
Um the other one,

2000
01:21:26,719 --> 01:21:35,840
and this kind of gets back into um

2001
01:21:30,480 --> 01:21:37,760
that 25% rule, how do we plan to address

2002
01:21:35,840 --> 01:21:39,840
if an ADU is allowed? Because we say

2003
01:21:37,760 --> 01:21:43,760
they're allowed in a residential

2004
01:21:39,840 --> 01:21:46,880
property, how do we do it in zones that

2005
01:21:43,760 --> 01:21:48,320
uh a residential use is not conforming?

2006
01:21:46,880 --> 01:21:51,679
And two examples is

2007
01:21:48,320 --> 01:21:53,679
» Oh, yeah. One, we have residential homes

2008
01:21:51,679 --> 01:21:56,480
that are in commercial zones. They're

2009
01:21:53,679 --> 01:21:58,239
not allowed. They're not conforming.

2010
01:21:56,480 --> 01:22:00,239
But the private division says if you're

2011
01:21:58,239 --> 01:22:03,120
owner occupied, you could have an ADU.

2012
01:22:00,239 --> 01:22:05,360
So, how do we address that? We also have

2013
01:22:03,120 --> 01:22:07,520
the situation where we have some zones

2014
01:22:05,360 --> 01:22:09,760
in the city where there are single

2015
01:22:07,520 --> 01:22:12,239
family homes that meet the 6,000t

2016
01:22:09,760 --> 01:22:17,040
requirement, but they're in a zone that

2017
01:22:12,239 --> 01:22:19,679
is SAP or SA or whatever it is. um that

2018
01:22:17,040 --> 01:22:21,760
also don't have the standards or or

2019
01:22:19,679 --> 01:22:24,320
regulations that they those have also

2020
01:22:21,760 --> 01:22:26,320
been eliminated from the text. If

2021
01:22:24,320 --> 01:22:30,000
someone wanted to do something, how

2022
01:22:26,320 --> 01:22:32,719
would we treat those properties?

2023
01:22:30,000 --> 01:22:35,760
» So, I think your previous um suggestion

2024
01:22:32,719 --> 01:22:37,360
to put it in the land use table if it's

2025
01:22:35,760 --> 01:22:39,840
listed only for the residential

2026
01:22:37,360 --> 01:22:43,760
properties to address the non-conforming

2027
01:22:39,840 --> 01:22:47,040
uses, they would follow um what is it

2028
01:22:43,760 --> 01:22:49,520
1117. So there's a process they would be

2029
01:22:47,040 --> 01:22:51,760
able to if they're if they're

2030
01:22:49,520 --> 01:22:54,480
non-conforming in a commercial zone then

2031
01:22:51,760 --> 01:22:55,920
and commercial zones do not allow ADUs

2032
01:22:54,480 --> 01:22:57,600
then they would not be allowed to have

2033
01:22:55,920 --> 01:22:59,280
an ADU because that would be

2034
01:22:57,600 --> 01:23:00,639
non-conforming. Um

2035
01:22:59,280 --> 01:23:01,760
» Well the home to begin that's

2036
01:23:00,639 --> 01:23:04,719
non-conforming,

2037
01:23:01,760 --> 01:23:06,239
» Right? But there 1117 goes through all

2038
01:23:04,719 --> 01:23:08,080
the different iterations of what's

2039
01:23:06,239 --> 01:23:09,360
allowed to do with a non-conforming use

2040
01:23:08,080 --> 01:23:13,920
and what's not allowed for

2041
01:23:09,360 --> 01:23:16,960
non-conforming use. um if it I guess if

2042
01:23:13,920 --> 01:23:19,360
it stays where it's a different use and

2043
01:23:16,960 --> 01:23:21,679
it's in the land use table that they

2044
01:23:19,360 --> 01:23:23,920
would not be able to ask for a use that

2045
01:23:21,679 --> 01:23:26,639
is not presented in that zone unless it

2046
01:23:23,920 --> 01:23:28,960
was already in place before but where we

2047
01:23:26,639 --> 01:23:33,199
haven't allowed them before we would end

2048
01:23:28,960 --> 01:23:35,679
up in that situation um so I think it's

2049
01:23:33,199 --> 01:23:39,120
covered in in the code

2050
01:23:35,679 --> 01:23:41,440
» So how do we treat so I mean they're

2051
01:23:39,120 --> 01:23:42,639
residential S is a residential zone.

2052
01:23:41,440 --> 01:23:43,760
» Oh, for those Okay.

2053
01:23:42,639 --> 01:23:46,080
» How do we treat them? Yeah,

2054
01:23:43,760 --> 01:23:47,440
» Those are residential zones. Um,

2055
01:23:46,080 --> 01:23:48,639
» It's not a residential zone we have

2056
01:23:47,440 --> 01:23:52,480
listed in the ordinance.

2057
01:23:48,639 --> 01:23:53,679
» So, that's on our um agenda to change

2058
01:23:52,480 --> 01:23:54,800
the uh

2059
01:23:53,679 --> 01:23:56,560
» SS.

2060
01:23:54,800 --> 01:23:59,199
» No, just any of the repealed zones.

2061
01:23:56,560 --> 01:24:00,719
We're working on replacement zones and

2062
01:23:59,199 --> 01:24:02,880
so they'd be considered residential

2063
01:24:00,719 --> 01:24:04,480
zones because it is an existing

2064
01:24:02,880 --> 01:24:06,239
residential zone. The way that the code

2065
01:24:04,480 --> 01:24:07,840
is kind of vague and that's why we're

2066
01:24:06,239 --> 01:24:09,760
looking to address it and I think that's

2067
01:24:07,840 --> 01:24:11,040
something you requested. So, um,

2068
01:24:09,760 --> 01:24:12,639
something we want to do and we're

2069
01:24:11,040 --> 01:24:14,960
working with the planning commission to

2070
01:24:12,639 --> 01:24:16,480
put together replacement zones, but

2071
01:24:14,960 --> 01:24:17,920
where it was an existing residential

2072
01:24:16,480 --> 01:24:20,239
zone, and this is applying to all

2073
01:24:17,920 --> 01:24:22,000
residential areas, I think it'd be easy

2074
01:24:20,239 --> 01:24:25,199
to assume that those, as long as they

2075
01:24:22,000 --> 01:24:27,199
meet the requirements, would be um,

2076
01:24:25,199 --> 01:24:28,960
eligible.

2077
01:24:27,199 --> 01:24:31,280
» So,

2078
01:24:28,960 --> 01:24:35,280
would we want to do that? I mean, again,

2079
01:24:31,280 --> 01:24:38,080
I'm taking like the call cottages.

2080
01:24:35,280 --> 01:24:41,280
um

2081
01:24:38,080 --> 01:24:43,280
corn cottages at Cornell Springs. So,

2082
01:24:41,280 --> 01:24:45,920
it's a mixture of single family detached

2083
01:24:43,280 --> 01:24:47,440
homes on 6,000 foot lots and then town

2084
01:24:45,920 --> 01:24:49,840
homes.

2085
01:24:47,440 --> 01:24:53,360
And so,

2086
01:24:49,840 --> 01:24:55,920
again, we don't have that SAP zone in

2087
01:24:53,360 --> 01:24:57,440
our land use regulation. So, you know,

2088
01:24:55,920 --> 01:24:59,120
where it's permitted, it won't show up

2089
01:24:57,440 --> 01:25:01,760
as permitted

2090
01:24:59,120 --> 01:25:02,480
because it's not an SAP is not listed

2091
01:25:01,760 --> 01:25:03,840
anywhere.

2092
01:25:02,480 --> 01:25:07,440
» It's not. But right now it's being

2093
01:25:03,840 --> 01:25:09,760
governed as a residential zone. Um we

2094
01:25:07,440 --> 01:25:11,600
have some holes in the code and so there

2095
01:25:09,760 --> 01:25:12,880
there are plenty of issues with the SAP

2096
01:25:11,600 --> 01:25:14,400
zone I guess is what I'm saying. Right

2097
01:25:12,880 --> 01:25:16,080
now it is a residential zone and we're

2098
01:25:14,400 --> 01:25:17,920
working to patch that up but we probably

2099
01:25:16,080 --> 01:25:19,600
won't patch that up through the ADU

2100
01:25:17,920 --> 01:25:21,520
ordinance. We'll need to have a

2101
01:25:19,600 --> 01:25:22,159
replacement zone for it. you have

2102
01:25:21,520 --> 01:25:24,639
another

2103
01:25:22,159 --> 01:25:26,159
» Or would it would it be

2104
01:25:24,639 --> 01:25:30,159
better

2105
01:25:26,159 --> 01:25:32,000
if we say okay in the following

2106
01:25:30,159 --> 01:25:34,159
zones

2107
01:25:32,000 --> 01:25:36,080
we will not allow

2108
01:25:34,159 --> 01:25:39,040
a to use

2109
01:25:36,080 --> 01:25:41,840
» Um you bring that up earlier that it had

2110
01:25:39,040 --> 01:25:44,800
to be over 10,000 square ft

2111
01:25:41,840 --> 01:25:47,600
» Anything under 10,000 ft for correct

2112
01:25:44,800 --> 01:25:49,840
» No but internals

2113
01:25:47,600 --> 01:25:51,440
» Oh external okay

2114
01:25:49,840 --> 01:25:54,080
» Um but the internal No, we can't

2115
01:25:51,440 --> 01:25:57,120
regulate that. That's the the state law

2116
01:25:54,080 --> 01:26:01,679
says that it is anything 6,000 square ft

2117
01:25:57,120 --> 01:26:04,080
or um larger we must allow them to have

2118
01:26:01,679 --> 01:26:06,159
uh an internal ADU. So it'll be

2119
01:26:04,080 --> 01:26:08,560
regulated for the detach through the the

2120
01:26:06,159 --> 01:26:09,920
lot size and then internal we don't have

2121
01:26:08,560 --> 01:26:12,000
control over.

2122
01:26:09,920 --> 01:26:14,560
» Okay.

2123
01:26:12,000 --> 01:26:16,239
So we'll just kind of let

2124
01:26:14,560 --> 01:26:17,920
» If they have a homeowners association

2125
01:26:16,239 --> 01:26:19,280
says well we don't allow you to do that.

2126
01:26:17,920 --> 01:26:20,880
» Yeah. The Holders Association could

2127
01:26:19,280 --> 01:26:24,000
absolutely regulate it,

2128
01:26:20,880 --> 01:26:24,560
» Which they can. Okay.

2129
01:26:24,000 --> 01:26:26,480
» Okay.

2130
01:26:24,560 --> 01:26:30,440
» They want to.

2131
01:26:26,480 --> 01:26:30,440
» Um, let's see.

2132
01:26:35,199 --> 01:26:42,639
How do we make it clear that a town home

2133
01:26:39,120 --> 01:26:47,679
cannot become an AU? Um,

2134
01:26:42,639 --> 01:26:49,600
so the town home only has a lot size the

2135
01:26:47,679 --> 01:26:51,280
size of the town home and the rest is

2136
01:26:49,600 --> 01:26:53,440
common space.

2137
01:26:51,280 --> 01:26:55,679
» Not necessarily.

2138
01:26:53,440 --> 01:26:57,199
» Do you have larger town homes in on

2139
01:26:55,679 --> 01:26:59,440
6,000 foot lots?

2140
01:26:57,199 --> 01:27:00,639
» We we It's interesting as I kind of

2141
01:26:59,440 --> 01:27:02,639
looked at the different town homes.

2142
01:27:00,639 --> 01:27:05,920
There's some that Yeah. the lot itself

2143
01:27:02,639 --> 01:27:07,440
is the the the property,

2144
01:27:05,920 --> 01:27:10,880
» But then there's somewhere there's four

2145
01:27:07,440 --> 01:27:15,760
town homes and they're all described by

2146
01:27:10,880 --> 01:27:18,400
a lot that's uh 8 or 9,000 square ft.

2147
01:27:15,760 --> 01:27:18,800
» So that's figure out how how does that

2148
01:27:18,400 --> 01:27:20,800
work?

2149
01:27:18,800 --> 01:27:22,400
» We have set bath limitations as well.

2150
01:27:20,800 --> 01:27:24,400
» Well, they're all built. It could be an

2151
01:27:22,400 --> 01:27:26,000
internal dwelling unit.

2152
01:27:24,400 --> 01:27:26,560
» This is for external.

2153
01:27:26,000 --> 01:27:28,480
» No, this is

2154
01:27:26,560 --> 01:27:29,520
» Oh, internal as well. Um,

2155
01:27:28,480 --> 01:27:31,600
» Yeah,

2156
01:27:29,520 --> 01:27:33,520
» I don't know that by state law we can

2157
01:27:31,600 --> 01:27:35,679
regulate that. If I remember right, it's

2158
01:27:33,520 --> 01:27:37,360
something we discussed, Jenny, about

2159
01:27:35,679 --> 01:27:39,520
whether we wanted them in town homes or

2160
01:27:37,360 --> 01:27:41,440
not. And I think the intention state

2161
01:27:39,520 --> 01:27:42,320
code is that they can be allowed in the

2162
01:27:41,440 --> 01:27:44,560
internal.

2163
01:27:42,320 --> 01:27:46,800
» I thought we excluded any of those zones

2164
01:27:44,560 --> 01:27:48,800
in our internal,

2165
01:27:46,800 --> 01:27:51,360
but it's been too many years since we

2166
01:27:48,800 --> 01:27:51,920
visited that. Pull up the code if you'd

2167
01:27:51,360 --> 01:27:53,679
like.

2168
01:27:51,920 --> 01:27:55,120
» Yeah, that's why I just with these

2169
01:27:53,679 --> 01:27:57,440
revisions going on, I'm wondering, does

2170
01:27:55,120 --> 01:27:59,280
that now open that up? Sorry. Yeah, I

2171
01:27:57,440 --> 01:28:04,040
was thinking for detach, but internal I

2172
01:27:59,280 --> 01:28:04,040
don't know that

2173
01:28:15,520 --> 01:28:20,480
cuz I always talk about single family

2174
01:28:17,199 --> 01:28:22,000
dwelling, but by definition,

2175
01:28:20,480 --> 01:28:25,000
every town home is single family

2176
01:28:22,000 --> 01:28:25,000
dwelling.

2177
01:28:25,840 --> 01:28:31,920
It's just they share walls but not

2178
01:28:29,199 --> 01:28:35,040
necessarily property lines or sometimes

2179
01:28:31,920 --> 01:28:38,280
property lines. So it's specifically to

2180
01:28:35,040 --> 01:28:38,280
the internal

2181
01:28:53,840 --> 01:28:57,120
prohibit the creation of the internal

2182
01:28:55,520 --> 01:28:58,719
accessory dwelling unit. The lot

2183
01:28:57,120 --> 01:29:00,719
containing the primary dwelling is

2184
01:28:58,719 --> 01:29:03,440
6,000. So that's what your concern was

2185
01:29:00,719 --> 01:29:05,600
that some of our lot sizes for the town

2186
01:29:03,440 --> 01:29:07,679
homes are larger than 6,000.

2187
01:29:05,600 --> 01:29:09,840
» Yeah. You may have four town homes on a

2188
01:29:07,679 --> 01:29:12,000
lot that's 8,000. So there's one lot.

2189
01:29:09,840 --> 01:29:14,960
» I think theation

2190
01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:19,679
of an internal dwelling requires the

2191
01:29:14,960 --> 01:29:21,440
primary residence to be detached.

2192
01:29:19,679 --> 01:29:23,440
» I would hope I just couldn't find it. I

2193
01:29:21,440 --> 01:29:25,360
hope that's I mean that's my assumption

2194
01:29:23,440 --> 01:29:27,120
of what it is, but I just can't find it.

2195
01:29:25,360 --> 01:29:28,800
» A single family dwelling that is

2196
01:29:27,120 --> 01:29:30,639
detached. That's the definition of a

2197
01:29:28,800 --> 01:29:31,920
primary grilling under the internal

2198
01:29:30,639 --> 01:29:32,320
accessory unit.

2199
01:29:31,920 --> 01:29:33,120
» Okay.

2200
01:29:32,320 --> 01:29:35,600
» So, state code is

2201
01:29:33,120 --> 01:29:38,159
» Preemptive state. Okay.

2202
01:29:35,600 --> 01:29:40,080
» Okay. Thank you.

2203
01:29:38,159 --> 01:29:42,400
» Thank you.

2204
01:29:40,080 --> 01:29:45,880
Uh

2205
01:29:42,400 --> 01:29:45,880
let's see the other

2206
01:29:50,880 --> 01:29:56,639
then the one question I had was that 90

2207
01:29:53,600 --> 01:29:58,960
days for uh external and 30 days for

2208
01:29:56,639 --> 01:30:02,320
internal where the state law says you

2209
01:29:58,960 --> 01:30:06,480
can do 90 for detach and 30 for

2210
01:30:02,320 --> 01:30:08,639
internal. Um just the thought behind

2211
01:30:06,480 --> 01:30:11,920
why everything's 30 or do you see any

2212
01:30:08,639 --> 01:30:13,600
benefit one being 90 and one being 30?

2213
01:30:11,920 --> 01:30:16,320
» I I think it was just for simplicity. We

2214
01:30:13,600 --> 01:30:19,199
thought 30 days the planning commission

2215
01:30:16,320 --> 01:30:22,400
thought that was sufficient to deter the

2216
01:30:19,199 --> 01:30:24,480
short-term rental aspect of it. Um but

2217
01:30:22,400 --> 01:30:27,199
the the council could add a provision

2218
01:30:24,480 --> 01:30:30,440
for 90 days just for the detached if

2219
01:30:27,199 --> 01:30:30,440
they'd like.

2220
01:30:30,480 --> 01:30:36,719
» Discussion. Okay. Um,

2221
01:30:35,199 --> 01:30:40,080
one of the other questions you're making

2222
01:30:36,719 --> 01:30:42,719
that is not ADU related but in the other

2223
01:30:40,080 --> 01:30:45,360
provisions is u

2224
01:30:42,719 --> 01:30:48,080
uh taking out of course the the minimum

2225
01:30:45,360 --> 01:30:52,159
block size or home size

2226
01:30:48,080 --> 01:30:54,880
but then you also take out the maximum

2227
01:30:52,159 --> 01:30:56,639
block size because where the state just

2228
01:30:54,880 --> 01:30:57,280
deals with you can't regulate the

2229
01:30:56,639 --> 01:30:58,080
minimums

2230
01:30:57,280 --> 01:30:59,679
» Right

2231
01:30:58,080 --> 01:31:02,239
» Is that's something again that's a

2232
01:30:59,679 --> 01:31:04,639
discussion right now The owners has you

2233
01:31:02,239 --> 01:31:07,840
a maximum home size of 40 4,000 square

2234
01:31:04,639 --> 01:31:11,440
ft. Do we want to eliminate that? Say it

2235
01:31:07,840 --> 01:31:14,159
doesn't matter whatever big we want big

2236
01:31:11,440 --> 01:31:18,000
home or do you want the existing limit

2237
01:31:14,159 --> 01:31:19,199
on the home size? That's just

2238
01:31:18,000 --> 01:31:21,520
one of the things that wasn't discussed

2239
01:31:19,199 --> 01:31:23,040
and I just didn't know what people's

2240
01:31:21,520 --> 01:31:24,719
feeling is on that.

2241
01:31:23,040 --> 01:31:26,159
» Yeah. Um it isn't something we discussed

2242
01:31:24,719 --> 01:31:27,840
as a planning commission. of the

2243
01:31:26,159 --> 01:31:32,159
council. It's it's something that when

2244
01:31:27,840 --> 01:31:34,000
we were getting rid of all of the um

2245
01:31:32,159 --> 01:31:35,760
all of the controlling factors, it

2246
01:31:34,000 --> 01:31:38,320
seemed a little out of place that

2247
01:31:35,760 --> 01:31:40,400
randomly you can't build a bigger

2248
01:31:38,320 --> 01:31:44,159
footprint than 4,000 square ft, you

2249
01:31:40,400 --> 01:31:47,280
know. Um if the council still sees a

2250
01:31:44,159 --> 01:31:49,360
need for that, we can reinclude it. Um

2251
01:31:47,280 --> 01:31:52,639
but it just seemed unnecessary. It

2252
01:31:49,360 --> 01:31:54,800
didn't seem beneficial, I guess.

2253
01:31:52,639 --> 01:31:57,600
And then the last set of questions I had

2254
01:31:54,800 --> 01:32:01,040
were just text itself.

2255
01:31:57,600 --> 01:32:04,040
» And the one is the definition of an ADU.

2256
01:32:01,040 --> 01:32:04,040
» Yeah.

2257
01:32:04,159 --> 01:32:09,120
» Where uh the word household is used

2258
01:32:06,239 --> 01:32:11,360
rather than how the state uses as a

2259
01:32:09,120 --> 01:32:13,440
single family dwelling. And our

2260
01:32:11,360 --> 01:32:16,159
definition in both our local orders

2261
01:32:13,440 --> 01:32:17,760
talks dwelling not household.

2262
01:32:16,159 --> 01:32:20,639
» Because the definition of a household is

2263
01:32:17,760 --> 01:32:22,320
just anybody put together. when we do a

2264
01:32:20,639 --> 01:32:25,520
dwelling then it hits the family then it

2265
01:32:22,320 --> 01:32:28,239
says foreign related or and I just

2266
01:32:25,520 --> 01:32:30,159
wondered why it might be better to just

2267
01:32:28,239 --> 01:32:31,440
keep with the language of

2268
01:32:30,159 --> 01:32:32,960
» The dwelling unit rather than the

2269
01:32:31,440 --> 01:32:35,679
household. So that all those other

2270
01:32:32,960 --> 01:32:37,040
definitions apply of limiting unrelated

2271
01:32:35,679 --> 01:32:39,120
people at that.

2272
01:32:37,040 --> 01:32:41,679
» Yeah, I think I think that's a good

2273
01:32:39,120 --> 01:32:44,000
idea.

2274
01:32:41,679 --> 01:32:46,800
» And then the other part I mentioned in

2275
01:32:44,000 --> 01:32:49,920
that was sometimes we say lot, sometimes

2276
01:32:46,800 --> 01:32:51,360
we say parcel, but really it should be

2277
01:32:49,920 --> 01:32:53,280
lot. Yeah.

2278
01:32:51,360 --> 01:32:56,080
» Should be lot because that's how all

2279
01:32:53,280 --> 01:32:59,760
properties are. Not everyone is not

2280
01:32:56,080 --> 01:33:02,560
stuck by the partial property.

2281
01:32:59,760 --> 01:33:06,080
Um

2282
01:33:02,560 --> 01:33:07,920
then the second was where the detached

2283
01:33:06,080 --> 01:33:11,280
ADU can be larger than the existing

2284
01:33:07,920 --> 01:33:12,480
proposed home on larger lots. I just

2285
01:33:11,280 --> 01:33:14,320
raised a question of how's that

2286
01:33:12,480 --> 01:33:16,800
consistent with the intent of being

2287
01:33:14,320 --> 01:33:19,360
subordinate to the main use.

2288
01:33:16,800 --> 01:33:22,000
» So we discussed this briefly in the

2289
01:33:19,360 --> 01:33:23,760
premeating. The idea is the square

2290
01:33:22,000 --> 01:33:26,960
footage is limited to make it

2291
01:33:23,760 --> 01:33:30,639
subordinate in in size, but we wanted to

2292
01:33:26,960 --> 01:33:35,280
allow the external

2293
01:33:30,639 --> 01:33:37,679
the detach ADUs to be maybe the upstairs

2294
01:33:35,280 --> 01:33:39,920
of a large barn structure or in a large

2295
01:33:37,679 --> 01:33:43,600
structure or maybe the ADU is taking up

2296
01:33:39,920 --> 01:33:46,239
the entire structure but in size the ADU

2297
01:33:43,600 --> 01:33:49,040
is housed in a larger building than the

2298
01:33:46,239 --> 01:33:50,639
house. So that's where the distinction

2299
01:33:49,040 --> 01:33:53,920
came in.

2300
01:33:50,639 --> 01:33:56,800
So how would this thing? So in that

2301
01:33:53,920 --> 01:33:58,719
scenario then are we looking just the

2302
01:33:56,800 --> 01:34:00,159
square footies of the ADU and that barn

2303
01:33:58,719 --> 01:34:03,120
structure

2304
01:34:00,159 --> 01:34:08,239
» Or are you okay so would that still be

2305
01:34:03,120 --> 01:34:10,320
appropriate to say the ADU is

2306
01:34:08,239 --> 01:34:10,639
subordinate to that house size?

2307
01:34:10,320 --> 01:34:13,120
» Yeah.

2308
01:34:10,639 --> 01:34:15,840
» Meaning okay they can take a barn and

2309
01:34:13,120 --> 01:34:18,400
the barn may be larger but the dwelling

2310
01:34:15,840 --> 01:34:20,880
part of it is still a house size or

2311
01:34:18,400 --> 01:34:23,679
smaller. Yeah. House size are smaller or

2312
01:34:20,880 --> 01:34:25,280
10% of the lot area. Those those are the

2313
01:34:23,679 --> 01:34:28,280
minimums that has to meet. Whatever is

2314
01:34:25,280 --> 01:34:28,280
smaller,

2315
01:34:29,760 --> 01:34:33,679
» 40,000

2316
01:34:31,679 --> 01:34:34,000
square foot lot,000.

2317
01:34:33,679 --> 01:34:36,800
Yeah.

2318
01:34:34,000 --> 01:34:40,600
» Maybe you

2319
01:34:36,800 --> 01:34:40,600
still might be 2,000.

2320
01:34:41,199 --> 01:34:43,840
» Okay.

2321
01:34:41,760 --> 01:34:46,560
» Yeah. Whichever whichever is smaller. So

2322
01:34:43,840 --> 01:34:48,880
yeah, if you have a 4,000 foot home, you

2323
01:34:46,560 --> 01:34:50,400
can build a 309

2324
01:34:48,880 --> 01:34:51,920
3,990

2325
01:34:50,400 --> 01:34:53,520
ft

2326
01:34:51,920 --> 01:34:54,800
» Three. You know what I'm saying? Sorry,

2327
01:34:53,520 --> 01:34:59,400
it's too late for these meetings.

2328
01:34:54,800 --> 01:34:59,400
Anyway, just be just smaller.

2329
01:35:00,000 --> 01:35:06,159
» Okay. Any any thought then on the

2330
01:35:03,600 --> 01:35:08,800
how uh

2331
01:35:06,159 --> 01:35:10,639
264A

2332
01:35:08,800 --> 01:35:13,280
is

2333
01:35:10,639 --> 01:35:15,440
is

2334
01:35:13,280 --> 01:35:18,719
that really meant for interior is it or

2335
01:35:15,440 --> 01:35:20,080
meant for all ADUs whereas language some

2336
01:35:18,719 --> 01:35:21,679
seems like it was only interior then the

2337
01:35:20,080 --> 01:35:24,880
next one is detached.

2338
01:35:21,679 --> 01:35:26,719
» It's all ADUs have the first regulations

2339
01:35:24,880 --> 01:35:31,239
and then there's further regulations in

2340
01:35:26,719 --> 01:35:31,239
addition for detach ADUs.

2341
01:35:36,159 --> 01:35:42,000
So all ADUs need to meet the standards

2342
01:35:39,920 --> 01:35:45,040
of residential homes, comply with the

2343
01:35:42,000 --> 01:35:48,000
setbacks and be designed to preserve the

2344
01:35:45,040 --> 01:35:50,880
appearance of the property. And then the

2345
01:35:48,000 --> 01:35:54,320
um because and so that applies to

2346
01:35:50,880 --> 01:35:57,120
internal and detached. And then detached

2347
01:35:54,320 --> 01:36:00,639
has further design, height, attic, has

2348
01:35:57,120 --> 01:36:03,199
more limitations than the internal, but

2349
01:36:00,639 --> 01:36:06,800
it still has to meet the standards and

2350
01:36:03,199 --> 01:36:11,920
comply with the setbacks of the zone um

2351
01:36:06,800 --> 01:36:14,639
except for the um exception allowed in

2352
01:36:11,920 --> 01:36:18,560
the detached ADU portion.

2353
01:36:14,639 --> 01:36:21,520
So when it says uh one existing

2354
01:36:18,560 --> 01:36:24,080
standards for residential homes and then

2355
01:36:21,520 --> 01:36:27,520
two set requirements for the zone,

2356
01:36:24,080 --> 01:36:28,800
what's the first one alluding to the

2357
01:36:27,520 --> 01:36:30,159
standards for residential homes?

2358
01:36:28,800 --> 01:36:33,040
» That'd be more like the building code

2359
01:36:30,159 --> 01:36:35,679
requirements, your your electrical, your

2360
01:36:33,040 --> 01:36:37,440
like health and safety um would fall

2361
01:36:35,679 --> 01:36:39,120
into that.

2362
01:36:37,440 --> 01:36:40,880
So would it be better say meeting

2363
01:36:39,120 --> 01:36:45,280
existing building code requirements for

2364
01:36:40,880 --> 01:36:46,800
residential homes rather than standards

2365
01:36:45,280 --> 01:36:48,639
because I would look at standards as

2366
01:36:46,800 --> 01:36:50,639
being the same thing as step acts and

2367
01:36:48,639 --> 01:36:52,239
high other

2368
01:36:50,639 --> 01:36:54,480
» Um I guess it just depends on what you'd

2369
01:36:52,239 --> 01:36:55,920
like for specificity. I you know I

2370
01:36:54,480 --> 01:36:58,320
thought about building code standards

2371
01:36:55,920 --> 01:37:00,480
but I wasn't certain if maybe there's

2372
01:36:58,320 --> 01:37:03,360
other residential standards that I

2373
01:37:00,480 --> 01:37:05,520
missed and so I thought the two would

2374
01:37:03,360 --> 01:37:07,360
help be specific. one is if you're

2375
01:37:05,520 --> 01:37:09,520
building this, you're building it like

2376
01:37:07,360 --> 01:37:11,840
you would a residential, a single family

2377
01:37:09,520 --> 01:37:14,320
detached home as far as this the

2378
01:37:11,840 --> 01:37:16,960
standards go. And then the setback I

2379
01:37:14,320 --> 01:37:18,080
wanted to be specific about because I

2380
01:37:16,960 --> 01:37:19,440
think that's where there's some false

2381
01:37:18,080 --> 01:37:21,679
confusion, but if if you'd like to

2382
01:37:19,440 --> 01:37:23,040
clarify a different way that how

2383
01:37:21,679 --> 01:37:25,360
whatever the council feels.

2384
01:37:23,040 --> 01:37:26,239
» So So what setback are you referring to?

2385
01:37:25,360 --> 01:37:27,199
Are you referring to

2386
01:37:26,239 --> 01:37:29,119
» The single family

2387
01:37:27,199 --> 01:37:30,159
» Main dwelling setback or accessory

2388
01:37:29,119 --> 01:37:33,600
building setback?

2389
01:37:30,159 --> 01:37:35,600
» The main dwelling set setback.

2390
01:37:33,600 --> 01:37:37,040
So maybe it'd be clear clear to say

2391
01:37:35,600 --> 01:37:37,600
that's what setback you're talking

2392
01:37:37,040 --> 01:37:38,159
about.

2393
01:37:37,600 --> 01:37:40,719
» I think that would be good.

2394
01:37:38,159 --> 01:37:42,000
» There's two different setbacks.

2395
01:37:40,719 --> 01:37:44,960
So I just don't know which setback

2396
01:37:42,000 --> 01:37:47,760
you're referring to.

2397
01:37:44,960 --> 01:37:49,920
» So I have a question here. We're doing a

2398
01:37:47,760 --> 01:37:51,360
one-on-one oneonone. We have everybody

2399
01:37:49,920 --> 01:37:51,760
else sitting here listening to oneon

2400
01:37:51,360 --> 01:37:53,600
one.

2401
01:37:51,760 --> 01:37:56,400
» Okay. I'm wondering if this is something

2402
01:37:53,600 --> 01:37:58,239
that we ought to table and come back to

2403
01:37:56,400 --> 01:38:00,800
when we've got it clarified rather than

2404
01:37:58,239 --> 01:38:02,480
spend on the rest of the city council's

2405
01:38:00,800 --> 01:38:03,760
time here because I think there's a lot

2406
01:38:02,480 --> 01:38:06,639
of great questions that need to be

2407
01:38:03,760 --> 01:38:08,560
asked. I'm just looking at

2408
01:38:06,639 --> 01:38:11,520
what do you think?

2409
01:38:08,560 --> 01:38:14,080
» What's we need this by October 1st.

2410
01:38:11,520 --> 01:38:17,080
» You have to have it adopted by October.

2411
01:38:14,080 --> 01:38:17,080
» Okay.

2412
01:38:18,400 --> 01:38:22,560
» I don't know. Do we have to have it

2413
01:38:20,560 --> 01:38:23,119
adopted by October 1st?

2414
01:38:22,560 --> 01:38:24,960
» Yes.

2415
01:38:23,119 --> 01:38:27,440
» To comply with state law.

2416
01:38:24,960 --> 01:38:29,119
» What are they going to do if we don't?

2417
01:38:27,440 --> 01:38:30,880
» Fire.

2418
01:38:29,119 --> 01:38:35,119
» Can we

2419
01:38:30,880 --> 01:38:37,440
could amend it potentially if

2420
01:38:35,119 --> 01:38:39,600
» Answered?

2421
01:38:37,440 --> 01:38:42,080
The one the one risk of not doing it is

2422
01:38:39,600 --> 01:38:44,480
if you had a super intelligent person

2423
01:38:42,080 --> 01:38:45,840
like council member Montgomery, you

2424
01:38:44,480 --> 01:38:48,800
could essentially come in to make

2425
01:38:45,840 --> 01:38:49,600
application and not have controlling

2426
01:38:48,800 --> 01:38:51,119
ordinance.

2427
01:38:49,600 --> 01:38:53,119
» Yeah.

2428
01:38:51,119 --> 01:38:55,119
» So councilman Montgomery could build

2429
01:38:53,119 --> 01:38:57,920
whatever kind of a we wanted. We would

2430
01:38:55,119 --> 01:39:02,360
have no recourse if we don't have a

2431
01:38:57,920 --> 01:39:02,360
statute that complies the state law.

2432
01:39:02,400 --> 01:39:06,800
Maybe I shouldn't have said that on the

2433
01:39:03,679 --> 01:39:08,400
record, but too late.

2434
01:39:06,800 --> 01:39:10,560
Oh, that's true. That's true.

2435
01:39:08,400 --> 01:39:13,360
» I know. I have one question regarding

2436
01:39:10,560 --> 01:39:17,920
interior ADUs.

2437
01:39:13,360 --> 01:39:21,040
» So, entrance into an interior ADU, can

2438
01:39:17,920 --> 01:39:22,560
they share the same door?

2439
01:39:21,040 --> 01:39:23,520
» I believe so. I don't think they can

2440
01:39:22,560 --> 01:39:25,280
make

2441
01:39:23,520 --> 01:39:26,880
» No, they could.

2442
01:39:25,280 --> 01:39:29,600
» That's allowed.

2443
01:39:26,880 --> 01:39:31,600
» Okay. So, they don't have to have their

2444
01:39:29,600 --> 01:39:33,840
» Own entrance

2445
01:39:31,600 --> 01:39:36,159
entrance or exit. If I remember right,

2446
01:39:33,840 --> 01:39:37,679
we can't The code was clear that we

2447
01:39:36,159 --> 01:39:39,840
couldn't specify that.

2448
01:39:37,679 --> 01:39:42,080
» Okay, you're right.

2449
01:39:39,840 --> 01:39:44,480
» Yeah, that's that's not something we

2450
01:39:42,080 --> 01:39:48,159
could specify,

2451
01:39:44,480 --> 01:39:51,800
» Greg. How many of these you you have you

2452
01:39:48,159 --> 01:39:51,800
made it to E?

2453
01:39:52,400 --> 01:39:54,880
I believe

2454
01:39:53,040 --> 01:39:56,560
» I guess maybe the one other question

2455
01:39:54,880 --> 01:39:58,880
I'll ask and then we you can decide what

2456
01:39:56,560 --> 01:40:01,280
you want to do with it.

2457
01:39:58,880 --> 01:40:03,440
How do we

2458
01:40:01,280 --> 01:40:08,560
on the detached loan units where we

2459
01:40:03,440 --> 01:40:11,280
allow a barn, a man cave, anything else?

2460
01:40:08,560 --> 01:40:15,920
Um, you know, that could be two stories,

2461
01:40:11,280 --> 01:40:19,600
25 ft tall, could be by building 3 ft

2462
01:40:15,920 --> 01:40:22,560
from property. Zoning says 1 ft.

2463
01:40:19,600 --> 01:40:26,239
So, they can have a 25 ft tall building,

2464
01:40:22,560 --> 01:40:28,639
can have windows in it, and then

2465
01:40:26,239 --> 01:40:31,199
convert. Now you can't convert them now

2466
01:40:28,639 --> 01:40:35,080
because you need to meet the residential

2467
01:40:31,199 --> 01:40:35,080
main dwelling setback.

2468
01:40:35,360 --> 01:40:41,679
What is the difference? What is the

2469
01:40:38,159 --> 01:40:43,360
adverse impact of one versus the other?

2470
01:40:41,679 --> 01:40:45,520
One is I have all my teenagers in a

2471
01:40:43,360 --> 01:40:48,880
party up on the second floor looking

2472
01:40:45,520 --> 01:40:52,560
down on your the neighbor next to you or

2473
01:40:48,880 --> 01:40:55,119
one I have family calling in there. What

2474
01:40:52,560 --> 01:40:57,920
are the differences and impacts?

2475
01:40:55,119 --> 01:41:01,280
So, we discussed this in the premeating.

2476
01:40:57,920 --> 01:41:04,960
The the difference is someone living in

2477
01:41:01,280 --> 01:41:06,800
a space. Uh when we looked at um what

2478
01:41:04,960 --> 01:41:09,600
was happening statewide with these

2479
01:41:06,800 --> 01:41:13,600
detached ADUs, the biggest complaint was

2480
01:41:09,600 --> 01:41:14,960
privacy. And so by having an accessory

2481
01:41:13,600 --> 01:41:16,719
dwelling structure, even if you have a

2482
01:41:14,960 --> 01:41:19,760
rep room in it, you're not going to have

2483
01:41:16,719 --> 01:41:21,920
someone in that building 24/7.

2484
01:41:19,760 --> 01:41:23,600
And so that would be the difference

2485
01:41:21,920 --> 01:41:25,040
between your accessory structure and a

2486
01:41:23,600 --> 01:41:26,639
dwelling structure. So we really wanted

2487
01:41:25,040 --> 01:41:28,320
to where if you're going to be right

2488
01:41:26,639 --> 01:41:30,719
next to someone's house, you're

2489
01:41:28,320 --> 01:41:32,480
essentially building a house right on

2490
01:41:30,719 --> 01:41:35,520
their property line. We wanted to make

2491
01:41:32,480 --> 01:41:37,520
it so that it wouldn't intrude any more

2492
01:41:35,520 --> 01:41:39,760
than an accessory

2493
01:41:37,520 --> 01:41:44,480
um building which does not have an

2494
01:41:39,760 --> 01:41:47,920
occupant 247 and the noise etc.

2495
01:41:44,480 --> 01:41:50,400
Then how would that differ from

2496
01:41:47,920 --> 01:41:53,199
city approvals of main dwelling units

2497
01:41:50,400 --> 01:41:56,080
being 10 or 20 ft in our present

2498
01:41:53,199 --> 01:41:57,920
ordinances from the property line

2499
01:41:56,080 --> 01:42:00,320
» As long as it's in the setback?

2500
01:41:57,920 --> 01:42:02,480
» Well, no, it's not. If the residential

2501
01:42:00,320 --> 01:42:03,360
dwelling says it's a 30ft step back.

2502
01:42:02,480 --> 01:42:04,719
» Mhm.

2503
01:42:03,360 --> 01:42:06,000
» But some of the new ordinances we've

2504
01:42:04,719 --> 01:42:07,840
done and some of the approvals we've

2505
01:42:06,000 --> 01:42:10,639
done in the city says you can have your

2506
01:42:07,840 --> 01:42:13,520
rear sat back 10 ft from property line.

2507
01:42:10,639 --> 01:42:15,199
So why would that be any different? We

2508
01:42:13,520 --> 01:42:17,679
don't have any 10 ft from property line.

2509
01:42:15,199 --> 01:42:20,239
I think 20 the closest. Which one?

2510
01:42:17,679 --> 01:42:21,679
» It's right next to us.

2511
01:42:20,239 --> 01:42:22,960
» Is this Are you talking about single

2512
01:42:21,679 --> 01:42:23,679
family detached property?

2513
01:42:22,960 --> 01:42:26,000
» Yeah.

2514
01:42:23,679 --> 01:42:26,880
» Which one is it?

2515
01:42:26,000 --> 01:42:29,440
» Call.

2516
01:42:26,880 --> 01:42:31,040
» Oh, it's in a zone.

2517
01:42:29,440 --> 01:42:32,080
» It's in a special project. So, none of

2518
01:42:31,040 --> 01:42:34,159
these would be

2519
01:42:32,080 --> 01:42:36,639
» Well, but isn't the principal same if

2520
01:42:34,159 --> 01:42:39,639
it's a 10 foot setback? Is it privacy

2521
01:42:36,639 --> 01:42:39,639
privacy?

2522
01:42:40,159 --> 01:42:43,040
I think the main difference is if

2523
01:42:41,679 --> 01:42:44,639
somebody's building an accessory

2524
01:42:43,040 --> 01:42:46,800
dwelling unit, they're allowed to go

2525
01:42:44,639 --> 01:42:48,800
within one foot of the property line. I

2526
01:42:46,800 --> 01:42:51,280
think there's no argument 1 foot of the

2527
01:42:48,800 --> 01:42:52,960
property line is much closer than 10 ft

2528
01:42:51,280 --> 01:42:55,920
for privacy, especially if you have a

2529
01:42:52,960 --> 01:42:58,239
twostory accessory dwelling unit that's

2530
01:42:55,920 --> 01:43:00,239
converted, an accessory building that's

2531
01:42:58,239 --> 01:43:01,760
then converted to a dwelling unit, then

2532
01:43:00,239 --> 01:43:05,040
you're one foot from the property line

2533
01:43:01,760 --> 01:43:07,040
from a twotory window. to to Sarah's

2534
01:43:05,040 --> 01:43:10,719
earlier point, I think that's a a little

2535
01:43:07,040 --> 01:43:12,639
bit different. Even 10 ft would give uh

2536
01:43:10,719 --> 01:43:14,400
less of a view into your neighbor's

2537
01:43:12,639 --> 01:43:16,000
backyard. So, that would be something

2538
01:43:14,400 --> 01:43:18,320
that people would want to consider when

2539
01:43:16,000 --> 01:43:21,280
they're building an accessory building

2540
01:43:18,320 --> 01:43:24,880
if they have any intention of building

2541
01:43:21,280 --> 01:43:26,239
it into a external ADU. You might want

2542
01:43:24,880 --> 01:43:27,760
to consider that.

2543
01:43:26,239 --> 01:43:28,800
» Well, if you really couldn't, then if

2544
01:43:27,760 --> 01:43:30,480
it's uh

2545
01:43:28,800 --> 01:43:32,239
» Or you'd have to close up the windows,

2546
01:43:30,480 --> 01:43:34,800
right? You'd have to modify the

2547
01:43:32,239 --> 01:43:36,880
structure. I'm I'm thinking poleb barns

2548
01:43:34,800 --> 01:43:39,040
aren't going to qualify as external

2549
01:43:36,880 --> 01:43:41,600
dwelling units anyway. They don't make

2550
01:43:39,040 --> 01:43:43,520
building code to have habitation in

2551
01:43:41,600 --> 01:43:46,159
them. So there going to be some

2552
01:43:43,520 --> 01:43:49,440
limitations on people converting those

2553
01:43:46,159 --> 01:43:52,320
accessory buildings into living spaces.

2554
01:43:49,440 --> 01:43:55,600
And so the setback

2555
01:43:52,320 --> 01:43:57,920
currently for a metal building is street

2556
01:43:55,600 --> 01:44:01,199
but for an asphalt is 1 foot. It's storm

2557
01:43:57,920 --> 01:44:03,600
water related. Right. But then so any

2558
01:44:01,199 --> 01:44:05,199
dwelling unit then we're saying a 30ft

2559
01:44:03,600 --> 01:44:07,760
setback

2560
01:44:05,199 --> 01:44:10,320
is what we feel is appropriate for a

2561
01:44:07,760 --> 01:44:12,320
rear guard protection.

2562
01:44:10,320 --> 01:44:13,119
» Yeah, I hear what Yes, I understand what

2563
01:44:12,320 --> 01:44:14,639
you're saying.

2564
01:44:13,119 --> 01:44:18,480
» So that means really most people

2565
01:44:14,639 --> 01:44:21,119
wouldn't be able to do a detection.

2566
01:44:18,480 --> 01:44:23,440
» They would they would just have to limit

2567
01:44:21,119 --> 01:44:24,960
the windows which is most homes only

2568
01:44:23,440 --> 01:44:26,400
have windows on three sides because the

2569
01:44:24,960 --> 01:44:28,400
garage is on the other side. So, we're

2570
01:44:26,400 --> 01:44:32,880
saying don't put the garage windows on

2571
01:44:28,400 --> 01:44:34,800
the back and um don't do stories that

2572
01:44:32,880 --> 01:44:35,840
look that are a certain height looking

2573
01:44:34,800 --> 01:44:37,280
over into the neighbor's yard.

2574
01:44:35,840 --> 01:44:39,920
» So, no bedrooms or anything like that.

2575
01:44:37,280 --> 01:44:41,280
» Okay.

2576
01:44:39,920 --> 01:44:42,800
» They can have windows. They just have to

2577
01:44:41,280 --> 01:44:44,880
face the front of the property instead

2578
01:44:42,800 --> 01:44:46,960
of the back. So, it's possible. It just

2579
01:44:44,880 --> 01:44:49,280
would require special design.

2580
01:44:46,960 --> 01:44:51,360
» That's the side also.

2581
01:44:49,280 --> 01:44:55,360
» If it's but next to a encroaching on a

2582
01:44:51,360 --> 01:44:58,960
sideyard set back. Yes.

2583
01:44:55,360 --> 01:44:59,440
So it' be whatever that zone is 10.

2584
01:44:58,960 --> 01:45:00,560
» Yeah.

2585
01:44:59,440 --> 01:45:03,560
» 14.

2586
01:45:00,560 --> 01:45:03,560
» Exactly.

2587
01:45:06,960 --> 01:45:13,840
» All right. Any other discussion that any

2588
01:45:10,239 --> 01:45:18,600
other council members would like?

2589
01:45:13,840 --> 01:45:18,600
If not, any action?

2590
01:45:24,400 --> 01:45:29,920
So I think some of the discussion since

2591
01:45:28,159 --> 01:45:32,480
we didn't have this discussion while the

2592
01:45:29,920 --> 01:45:34,320
question was going back and forth I

2593
01:45:32,480 --> 01:45:36,639
think that the certificate idea is

2594
01:45:34,320 --> 01:45:39,040
actually a very positive thing that I

2595
01:45:36,639 --> 01:45:40,960
think should be included on how others

2596
01:45:39,040 --> 01:45:41,600
feel

2597
01:45:40,960 --> 01:45:43,840
but

2598
01:45:41,600 --> 01:45:47,199
» My concern with that is that if it gets

2599
01:45:43,840 --> 01:45:49,679
mishandled by one owner and then there's

2600
01:45:47,199 --> 01:45:51,280
a next owner are they having to deal

2601
01:45:49,679 --> 01:45:55,320
with the headache that the previous

2602
01:45:51,280 --> 01:45:55,320
owner didn't handle correctly.

2603
01:45:55,760 --> 01:45:59,840
If it's existing,

2604
01:45:57,920 --> 01:46:01,760
there's not a certificate or there's

2605
01:45:59,840 --> 01:46:03,920
some weird situation. It got demolished

2606
01:46:01,760 --> 01:46:05,520
and rebuilt without the certificate

2607
01:46:03,920 --> 01:46:09,480
being updated. Then does that become a

2608
01:46:05,520 --> 01:46:09,480
future homeowner's problem?

2609
01:46:09,920 --> 01:46:14,400
» Generally, what I've seen happen at a

2610
01:46:11,600 --> 01:46:15,280
demolition there'll be a new loan and so

2611
01:46:14,400 --> 01:46:17,600
that

2612
01:46:15,280 --> 01:46:17,920
» Not necessarily

2613
01:46:17,600 --> 01:46:20,920
loan.

2614
01:46:17,920 --> 01:46:20,920
» Okay.

2615
01:46:21,520 --> 01:46:28,719
I mean, most likely, I guess, but

2616
01:46:25,360 --> 01:46:30,239
» I think you also need to consider I I I

2617
01:46:28,719 --> 01:46:32,159
feel like sometimes we get caught up in

2618
01:46:30,239 --> 01:46:36,400
the whatifs, and I understand those

2619
01:46:32,159 --> 01:46:39,280
important, but as a city council, we

2620
01:46:36,400 --> 01:46:42,960
can't regulate every little thing. We

2621
01:46:39,280 --> 01:46:45,760
have to set a set of ordinances.

2622
01:46:42,960 --> 01:46:47,840
I'm not knocking the question at all. as

2623
01:46:45,760 --> 01:46:50,320
I look at the overall thing and what I

2624
01:46:47,840 --> 01:46:52,639
have questions we can't control.

2625
01:46:50,320 --> 01:46:54,320
» So the benefit to having a certificate

2626
01:46:52,639 --> 01:46:57,040
is

2627
01:46:54,320 --> 01:46:59,679
and correct me if I'm mistaken as you

2628
01:46:57,040 --> 01:47:02,320
see it. The benefit is that we don't

2629
01:46:59,679 --> 01:47:06,239
have someone demolishing and rebuilding

2630
01:47:02,320 --> 01:47:08,800
without paying

2631
01:47:06,239 --> 01:47:10,560
and we think that it's likely that that

2632
01:47:08,800 --> 01:47:12,800
could happen if we don't require a

2633
01:47:10,560 --> 01:47:15,040
certificate that they'll bypass the

2634
01:47:12,800 --> 01:47:17,760
building permit process. Well, it also

2635
01:47:15,040 --> 01:47:20,800
will put a person, a new buyer on on

2636
01:47:17,760 --> 01:47:22,239
notice that this is an accessory unit. I

2637
01:47:20,800 --> 01:47:25,440
can't buy this property as a rental

2638
01:47:22,239 --> 01:47:27,520
property, rent out two units.

2639
01:47:25,440 --> 01:47:28,800
So, it also puts them on notice matches

2640
01:47:27,520 --> 01:47:30,560
in the home and say, "Oh, there's two

2641
01:47:28,800 --> 01:47:33,440
units here."

2642
01:47:30,560 --> 01:47:35,119
» But it's condition on someone who lives

2643
01:47:33,440 --> 01:47:36,480
permanently,

2644
01:47:35,119 --> 01:47:38,880
the owner.

2645
01:47:36,480 --> 01:47:40,560
» So, we're making it easier on them. They

2646
01:47:38,880 --> 01:47:43,679
don't need to do their research to find

2647
01:47:40,560 --> 01:47:44,480
out what the city ordinance says. I

2648
01:47:43,679 --> 01:47:46,719
think it helps

2649
01:47:44,480 --> 01:47:49,040
» People who do research that tell folks

2650
01:47:46,719 --> 01:47:49,760
to buy it sign

2651
01:47:49,040 --> 01:47:52,320
» Right

2652
01:47:49,760 --> 01:47:57,280
» I also think it helps too on the the

2653
01:47:52,320 --> 01:48:00,880
other side that you can it can be sold

2654
01:47:57,280 --> 01:48:03,679
in that way which adds benefit to the

2655
01:48:00,880 --> 01:48:06,159
person who's purchasing. So it it has

2656
01:48:03,679 --> 01:48:09,760
benefits both ways,

2657
01:48:06,159 --> 01:48:12,000
you know, not just protecting the

2658
01:48:09,760 --> 01:48:14,239
the city, but it also helps, you know,

2659
01:48:12,000 --> 01:48:15,920
because just because somebody converted

2660
01:48:14,239 --> 01:48:18,159
an area of their home where somebody

2661
01:48:15,920 --> 01:48:21,440
could dwell doesn't mean that it

2662
01:48:18,159 --> 01:48:24,159
actually qualifies or is

2663
01:48:21,440 --> 01:48:28,159
set aside to be an accessory dwelling

2664
01:48:24,159 --> 01:48:31,199
unit, a home or even externally, you

2665
01:48:28,159 --> 01:48:36,119
know. So, I think it it actually helped

2666
01:48:31,199 --> 01:48:36,119
the pro the homeowner, too.

2667
01:48:37,760 --> 01:48:42,719
» I mean, I like the idea. I don't know

2668
01:48:40,560 --> 01:48:47,440
exactly where it'll go, but I think it's

2669
01:48:42,719 --> 01:48:48,639
it's a good it's a good thing. Helps I

2670
01:48:47,440 --> 01:48:52,000
can see where it can help both the

2671
01:48:48,639 --> 01:48:54,880
homeowner and it can also help the uh it

2672
01:48:52,000 --> 01:48:58,080
can help the potential buyer. But the

2673
01:48:54,880 --> 01:49:00,400
legal standpoint is it's documented

2674
01:48:58,080 --> 01:49:02,000
We know it was being followed up. We

2675
01:49:00,400 --> 01:49:04,800
didn't know it. Here it is. It's in a

2676
01:49:02,000 --> 01:49:06,800
legal document. This is a way for the

2677
01:49:04,800 --> 01:49:09,040
city at least to come back and say, "Oh,

2678
01:49:06,800 --> 01:49:10,960
it's registered."

2679
01:49:09,040 --> 01:49:11,600
» Well, we would still have a record of

2680
01:49:10,960 --> 01:49:15,320
them.

2681
01:49:11,600 --> 01:49:15,320
» Yeah. without

2682
01:49:16,320 --> 01:49:22,880
» And I lean toward favoring

2683
01:49:19,920 --> 01:49:26,000
residents, homeowners

2684
01:49:22,880 --> 01:49:29,639
over potential homeowners as far as if

2685
01:49:26,000 --> 01:49:29,639
there's going to be a headache.

2686
01:49:36,800 --> 01:49:41,440
I guess one of the item I'll just bring

2687
01:49:38,400 --> 01:49:44,560
up and that was the elimination

2688
01:49:41,440 --> 01:49:46,800
of the special provision to allow single

2689
01:49:44,560 --> 01:49:49,360
family homes to expand

2690
01:49:46,800 --> 01:49:53,440
to uh 15

2691
01:49:49,360 --> 01:49:55,440
yard rather than their 30. And uh you

2692
01:49:53,440 --> 01:49:58,480
know it's not in the ADU part. It's in

2693
01:49:55,440 --> 01:50:00,880
another section. The intent of that was

2694
01:49:58,480 --> 01:50:03,040
really to allow people to stay in their

2695
01:50:00,880 --> 01:50:05,280
home as their family grows and not have

2696
01:50:03,040 --> 01:50:07,920
to sell and move somewhere else and

2697
01:50:05,280 --> 01:50:09,920
encourage people to stay here

2698
01:50:07,920 --> 01:50:12,320
and this proposed ordinance that'll be

2699
01:50:09,920 --> 01:50:13,840
eliminated. And I don't know how many

2700
01:50:12,320 --> 01:50:16,000
took advantage of that provision while

2701
01:50:13,840 --> 01:50:17,600
it's been there what we treated now as

2702
01:50:16,000 --> 01:50:20,960
non-conforming. I thought okay I'm going

2703
01:50:17,600 --> 01:50:23,920
to counsel that can't any track at all.

2704
01:50:20,960 --> 01:50:25,679
» I do not know. It is a very strange part

2705
01:50:23,920 --> 01:50:27,280
of the code to say when you first built

2706
01:50:25,679 --> 01:50:28,960
your home, here are your setbacks. But

2707
01:50:27,280 --> 01:50:31,040
if you put an addition on your home, you

2708
01:50:28,960 --> 01:50:32,719
have different setbacks. So in reading

2709
01:50:31,040 --> 01:50:35,440
the code, especially when we're drilling

2710
01:50:32,719 --> 01:50:37,440
with internal accessory dwelling units,

2711
01:50:35,440 --> 01:50:39,840
we thought that that was an earmark that

2712
01:50:37,440 --> 01:50:41,600
was best left out that the setbacks are

2713
01:50:39,840 --> 01:50:44,480
the setbacks, whether it's new

2714
01:50:41,600 --> 01:50:47,280
construction or a remodel. So that was

2715
01:50:44,480 --> 01:50:50,000
the intent of eliminating that portion

2716
01:50:47,280 --> 01:50:53,280
of the code. I assume someone came in

2717
01:50:50,000 --> 01:50:54,880
who wanted to put an addition closer to

2718
01:50:53,280 --> 01:50:57,920
their step, you know, to encroach on

2719
01:50:54,880 --> 01:51:00,080
their setback and petitioned to have it

2720
01:50:57,920 --> 01:51:02,000
changed and then it was. We do we don't

2721
01:51:00,080 --> 01:51:03,119
have a record of when that happened or

2722
01:51:02,000 --> 01:51:04,480
why it happened.

2723
01:51:03,119 --> 01:51:05,840
» But that was the intent is to allow

2724
01:51:04,480 --> 01:51:07,440
someone to stay in the home and expand

2725
01:51:05,840 --> 01:51:09,360
it so they don't have to sell the home

2726
01:51:07,440 --> 01:51:10,639
and move somewhere else in the room.

2727
01:51:09,360 --> 01:51:11,360
» Well, you can see it that way, but I

2728
01:51:10,639 --> 01:51:12,880
just didn't see

2729
01:51:11,360 --> 01:51:13,840
» Well, that is the way it was. I was

2730
01:51:12,880 --> 01:51:16,880
involved in it.

2731
01:51:13,840 --> 01:51:18,880
» Oh, okay. Well, to me it just seems

2732
01:51:16,880 --> 01:51:20,880
strange that someone builds a new home

2733
01:51:18,880 --> 01:51:22,400
and they can't build that addition when

2734
01:51:20,880 --> 01:51:24,080
they first build it, but they can if

2735
01:51:22,400 --> 01:51:26,400
they wait 5 years and then do it as an

2736
01:51:24,080 --> 01:51:27,520
addition. It just seems inconsistent.

2737
01:51:26,400 --> 01:51:30,639
So, that was a concern.

2738
01:51:27,520 --> 01:51:32,400
» Yeah. So, what you're saying is that

2739
01:51:30,639 --> 01:51:33,679
» No, I'm saying I I don't I'll just bring

2740
01:51:32,400 --> 01:51:35,199
that up as a policy.

2741
01:51:33,679 --> 01:51:36,239
» Do you want to keep it in or do you want

2742
01:51:35,199 --> 01:51:37,679
to take it out?

2743
01:51:36,239 --> 01:51:41,119
» Well, I don't know how many homes took

2744
01:51:37,679 --> 01:51:43,679
advantage of it. How many um would be

2745
01:51:41,119 --> 01:51:46,159
pretty non-performing? Does that have

2746
01:51:43,679 --> 01:51:48,239
does that have to do with this?

2747
01:51:46,159 --> 01:51:50,159
» Doesn't have to do with ADU, but it's in

2748
01:51:48,239 --> 01:51:53,199
the text

2749
01:51:50,159 --> 01:51:55,520
» And and we can separate the or you can

2750
01:51:53,199 --> 01:51:57,920
pass the ADU portion of this and then

2751
01:51:55,520 --> 01:51:59,440
wait to do the text amendment changes um

2752
01:51:57,920 --> 01:52:02,480
at a later time. They're a little bit

2753
01:51:59,440 --> 01:52:05,880
combined, but not so involved that it

2754
01:52:02,480 --> 01:52:05,880
would be a problem.

2755
01:52:12,320 --> 01:52:15,840
And and to that point, we could when we

2756
01:52:14,159 --> 01:52:17,599
did the text amendment changes, make any

2757
01:52:15,840 --> 01:52:20,159
sort of text amendment changes we wanted

2758
01:52:17,599 --> 01:52:21,679
to to the AD ordinance at that point if

2759
01:52:20,159 --> 01:52:23,280
we wanted to go through it again and

2760
01:52:21,679 --> 01:52:25,760
then make the amendments at that point.

2761
01:52:23,280 --> 01:52:28,560
if we uh we make that a part of the

2762
01:52:25,760 --> 01:52:31,599
proposition that we schedule that cuz I

2763
01:52:28,560 --> 01:52:34,320
I think if we just say we're going to

2764
01:52:31,599 --> 01:52:36,000
pass it get often times things get

2765
01:52:34,320 --> 01:52:38,159
passed and then it never gets revisited

2766
01:52:36,000 --> 01:52:40,400
and if it's not on an agenda it's not

2767
01:52:38,159 --> 01:52:42,320
going to get talked about again. Yeah,

2768
01:52:40,400 --> 01:52:44,800
you could you could say table it to a

2769
01:52:42,320 --> 01:52:45,280
certain date and say table it until the

2770
01:52:44,800 --> 01:52:46,960
October.

2771
01:52:45,280 --> 01:52:51,760
» I think it would be that we adopt it in

2772
01:52:46,960 --> 01:52:54,719
its current form with the intention of

2773
01:52:51,760 --> 01:52:57,599
» To amend things in a future it's

2774
01:52:54,719 --> 01:52:59,599
scheduled so it's not oh we'll get to it

2775
01:52:57,599 --> 01:53:02,080
somewhere which is almost never. So you

2776
01:52:59,599 --> 01:53:04,960
could pass a portion and table a portion

2777
01:53:02,080 --> 01:53:06,719
and then in your and you can say however

2778
01:53:04,960 --> 01:53:08,320
you want to say it, but you could give a

2779
01:53:06,719 --> 01:53:12,040
specific date that you want to address

2780
01:53:08,320 --> 01:53:12,040
it at in your motion.

2781
01:53:12,719 --> 01:53:16,280
» Want to take a stand?

2782
01:53:17,760 --> 01:53:22,800
» I'm not clear that setting a date

2783
01:53:19,520 --> 01:53:25,360
necessarily solves the problem.

2784
01:53:22,800 --> 01:53:29,520
I think we need to just pass it as we

2785
01:53:25,360 --> 01:53:30,880
think is best today and then as council

2786
01:53:29,520 --> 01:53:32,000
members have questions they're welcome

2787
01:53:30,880 --> 01:53:35,280
to ask.

2788
01:53:32,000 --> 01:53:37,360
» I'm talking about address the other

2789
01:53:35,280 --> 01:53:39,440
revisions that are still up in the air

2790
01:53:37,360 --> 01:53:42,239
that we haven't flushed through yet. So

2791
01:53:39,440 --> 01:53:44,080
it's having another

2792
01:53:42,239 --> 01:53:44,880
» Work session so to speak and we

2793
01:53:44,080 --> 01:53:46,800
certainly can do that

2794
01:53:44,880 --> 01:53:47,119
» And that's what I mean by schedule. It's

2795
01:53:46,800 --> 01:53:48,639
not.

2796
01:53:47,119 --> 01:53:50,960
» So, are we saying that the passage of

2797
01:53:48,639 --> 01:53:52,639
this depends upon having that and if we

2798
01:53:50,960 --> 01:53:54,800
don't have that date?

2799
01:53:52,639 --> 01:53:56,800
» My fear is if we don't and I'm sorry, I

2800
01:53:54,800 --> 01:53:58,639
didn't mean to, but if if we don't

2801
01:53:56,800 --> 01:53:59,199
schedule it, it's just going to sit in

2802
01:53:58,639 --> 01:54:00,639
its current.

2803
01:53:59,199 --> 01:54:02,560
» I understand the fear, but what I'm

2804
01:54:00,639 --> 01:54:04,639
wondering is does it become obsolete

2805
01:54:02,560 --> 01:54:06,159
then? If we miss that deadline and we

2806
01:54:04,639 --> 01:54:07,760
don't do anything, we don't.

2807
01:54:06,159 --> 01:54:09,280
» No, we would have it scheduled and so

2808
01:54:07,760 --> 01:54:10,800
we'd be addressing.

2809
01:54:09,280 --> 01:54:13,360
» So, it's not necessarily part of the

2810
01:54:10,800 --> 01:54:15,520
passage of this that date.

2811
01:54:13,360 --> 01:54:17,360
» No, it would be that it's passed. It's

2812
01:54:15,520 --> 01:54:18,880
just that we make clear that we're going

2813
01:54:17,360 --> 01:54:20,880
to

2814
01:54:18,880 --> 01:54:23,520
circle back to those concerns and not

2815
01:54:20,880 --> 01:54:26,159
just have it sitting out there

2816
01:54:23,520 --> 01:54:29,440
with the changes that all the stuff Greg

2817
01:54:26,159 --> 01:54:30,800
talked about. You took all the notes on

2818
01:54:29,440 --> 01:54:33,280
those different things that they talked

2819
01:54:30,800 --> 01:54:36,960
about. Right. Mhm.

2820
01:54:33,280 --> 01:54:40,639
» I say we make a motion to adopt

2821
01:54:36,960 --> 01:54:44,639
ordinance 5698 with parking amendments

2822
01:54:40,639 --> 01:54:47,040
according to the notes taken as well as

2823
01:54:44,639 --> 01:54:51,119
add the certificate that Craig has

2824
01:54:47,040 --> 01:54:52,560
talked about to this. I don't know if I

2825
01:54:51,119 --> 01:54:53,840
said everything right, but that's what I

2826
01:54:52,560 --> 01:54:55,679
think.

2827
01:54:53,840 --> 01:54:56,239
» Okay. So, we have a motion. Do we have a

2828
01:54:55,679 --> 01:55:00,639
second?

2829
01:54:56,239 --> 01:55:03,760
» Um, we need to clarify. So the ordinance

2830
01:55:00,639 --> 01:55:07,280
includes the um

2831
01:55:03,760 --> 01:55:10,800
the let's see how we the changes to the

2832
01:55:07,280 --> 01:55:14,000
code and to the ADU ordinance uh

2833
01:55:10,800 --> 01:55:14,960
section. So what there are too many

2834
01:55:14,000 --> 01:55:17,520
papers here you guys.

2835
01:55:14,960 --> 01:55:18,880
» That's what I ask about.

2836
01:55:17,520 --> 01:55:20,960
» I tried to make it easy.

2837
01:55:18,880 --> 01:55:23,119
» I know. I know. Okay. So the ordinance

2838
01:55:20,960 --> 01:55:25,119
is 569

2839
01:55:23,119 --> 01:55:27,520
um which is accessory dwelling unit

2840
01:55:25,119 --> 01:55:30,960
standards and other revisions. So, you

2841
01:55:27,520 --> 01:55:35,679
could pass um the accessory dwelling

2842
01:55:30,960 --> 01:55:37,679
unit standards and not pass the other

2843
01:55:35,679 --> 01:55:39,199
visions. Make that your motion. And you

2844
01:55:37,679 --> 01:55:41,920
could say accessory dwelling unit

2845
01:55:39,199 --> 01:55:44,159
standards including

2846
01:55:41,920 --> 01:55:46,080
um

2847
01:55:44,159 --> 01:55:49,599
notes discussed if everyone's okay with

2848
01:55:46,080 --> 01:55:51,520
the the my like the formatting and

2849
01:55:49,599 --> 01:55:54,000
naming changes that was that we did

2850
01:55:51,520 --> 01:55:58,320
discuss. So you could say including the

2851
01:55:54,000 --> 01:56:01,280
discussed um changes for ADU ordinance.

2852
01:55:58,320 --> 01:56:03,760
Do you think that would be clear enough?

2853
01:56:01,280 --> 01:56:06,960
» What would we be eliminating if we don't

2854
01:56:03,760 --> 01:56:08,159
have the if we only do the ADU sections

2855
01:56:06,960 --> 01:56:10,080
and not the

2856
01:56:08,159 --> 01:56:11,599
» We wouldn't be addressing the the

2857
01:56:10,080 --> 01:56:12,400
building standards and parking quite

2858
01:56:11,599 --> 01:56:14,560
yet.

2859
01:56:12,400 --> 01:56:16,960
» The parking would not be part of it. it

2860
01:56:14,560 --> 01:56:18,960
the ADU parking would be included but it

2861
01:56:16,960 --> 01:56:21,119
would be referring to the old parking

2862
01:56:18,960 --> 01:56:23,760
standards which are still adequate in

2863
01:56:21,119 --> 01:56:25,119
the meantime and we would not be state

2864
01:56:23,760 --> 01:56:29,840
compliant but this one doesn't have a

2865
01:56:25,119 --> 01:56:33,280
deadline so we could table the um other

2866
01:56:29,840 --> 01:56:36,000
revisions to the October meeting

2867
01:56:33,280 --> 01:56:36,960
» What part would we not be compliant on

2868
01:56:36,000 --> 01:56:39,679
at the state

2869
01:56:36,960 --> 01:56:41,920
» Just the the other revisions but we have

2870
01:56:39,679 --> 01:56:44,400
been compliant for years so it a couple

2871
01:56:41,920 --> 01:56:46,719
months will be fine we just recognize it

2872
01:56:44,400 --> 01:56:49,360
as we were doing this

2873
01:56:46,719 --> 01:56:51,679
» And our concerns about including the

2874
01:56:49,360 --> 01:56:52,719
other revisions are do we have specific

2875
01:56:51,679 --> 01:56:54,880
ones?

2876
01:56:52,719 --> 01:56:57,520
» Well, I don't know if we have had I mean

2877
01:56:54,880 --> 01:57:00,080
we could take a lot of time to go item

2878
01:56:57,520 --> 01:57:03,360
by item. Like for example,

2879
01:57:00,080 --> 01:57:05,199
I do like his comment about letter E

2880
01:57:03,360 --> 01:57:07,599
about using the word consistent instead

2881
01:57:05,199 --> 01:57:09,679
of compliment. We could have lots of

2882
01:57:07,599 --> 01:57:13,520
discussions about each one of these and

2883
01:57:09,679 --> 01:57:15,360
so it's passing it but then coming back

2884
01:57:13,520 --> 01:57:17,280
because I think we've spent a lot of

2885
01:57:15,360 --> 01:57:21,599
time just trying to understand all of

2886
01:57:17,280 --> 01:57:23,840
what's going into it and address

2887
01:57:21,599 --> 01:57:27,440
it would take another hour and probably

2888
01:57:23,840 --> 01:57:29,920
nail down things within uh Okay, so we

2889
01:57:27,440 --> 01:57:34,560
have a we have one motion that's been up

2890
01:57:29,920 --> 01:57:36,320
here. Um we want to

2891
01:57:34,560 --> 01:57:38,239
we're not going to do a second motion

2892
01:57:36,320 --> 01:57:38,880
and that one just fails since we'll have

2893
01:57:38,239 --> 01:57:41,440
to start over.

2894
01:57:38,880 --> 01:57:42,719
» I will second it. Okay. So, we have a

2895
01:57:41,440 --> 01:57:44,800
motion and a second,

2896
01:57:42,719 --> 01:57:46,960
» But I think we we're talking about that

2897
01:57:44,800 --> 01:57:49,599
need to change because that motion would

2898
01:57:46,960 --> 01:57:51,599
not accomplish what needs to happen.

2899
01:57:49,599 --> 01:57:53,199
» So, we need a classification what we're

2900
01:57:51,599 --> 01:57:54,960
trying to

2901
01:57:53,199 --> 01:57:57,679
» Pass as far as

2902
01:57:54,960 --> 01:58:01,920
» So, you could pass the entire ordinance

2903
01:57:57,679 --> 01:58:04,080
and then come back to make revisions on

2904
01:58:01,920 --> 01:58:06,560
the parts that you're concerned about,

2905
01:58:04,080 --> 01:58:09,440
even the ordinance as a whole. If you

2906
01:58:06,560 --> 01:58:10,960
decide we pass the whole thing, but

2907
01:58:09,440 --> 01:58:14,080
maybe we want to bring something back

2908
01:58:10,960 --> 01:58:16,639
from this other section, that is another

2909
01:58:14,080 --> 01:58:18,719
option. And then it makes it more clear.

2910
01:58:16,639 --> 01:58:21,040
We pass the ordinance with the discussed

2911
01:58:18,719 --> 01:58:24,480
revisions from um Council Member

2912
01:58:21,040 --> 01:58:26,239
Montgomery and then

2913
01:58:24,480 --> 01:58:28,560
we could put it on the agenda. I will

2914
01:58:26,239 --> 01:58:29,920
make sure it's on the agenda um in

2915
01:58:28,560 --> 01:58:30,800
October.

2916
01:58:29,920 --> 01:58:33,119
» Okay.

2917
01:58:30,800 --> 01:58:35,440
» So, you want to restate your move.

2918
01:58:33,119 --> 01:58:37,119
» Brody, what do we need to do legally?

2919
01:58:35,440 --> 01:58:38,880
Yeah. So, legally there's been a motion

2920
01:58:37,119 --> 01:58:40,159
in the second. So, you have to have a

2921
01:58:38,880 --> 01:58:43,119
vote.

2922
01:58:40,159 --> 01:58:44,960
» Okay. So, I'll do roll call,

2923
01:58:43,119 --> 01:58:46,719
» But

2924
01:58:44,960 --> 01:58:49,599
for clarification and for the record,

2925
01:58:46,719 --> 01:58:51,280
the motion most needs to be restated.

2926
01:58:49,599 --> 01:58:52,000
However, because of the second, you have

2927
01:58:51,280 --> 01:58:54,480
to vote.

2928
01:58:52,000 --> 01:58:57,280
» Okay. Thank you. Okay. So, I have a

2929
01:58:54,480 --> 01:58:58,960
motion and a second. This a roll call

2930
01:58:57,280 --> 01:59:01,280
vote.

2931
01:58:58,960 --> 01:59:02,800
» Council member Hadley.

2932
01:59:01,280 --> 01:59:05,280
I'm going to say no.

2933
01:59:02,800 --> 01:59:07,280
» Council member recovery. No.

2934
01:59:05,280 --> 01:59:08,320
» Council member Christensen.

2935
01:59:07,280 --> 01:59:09,760
» No.

2936
01:59:08,320 --> 01:59:10,880
» Council member Prawl.

2937
01:59:09,760 --> 01:59:12,480
» Yes.

2938
01:59:10,880 --> 01:59:13,440
» Council member Willson.

2939
01:59:12,480 --> 01:59:15,760
» No.

2940
01:59:13,440 --> 01:59:17,599
» Okay. So, that fails.

2941
01:59:15,760 --> 01:59:19,199
» So, now we're back to coming up with

2942
01:59:17,599 --> 01:59:22,639
another motion.

2943
01:59:19,199 --> 01:59:27,040
» Okay. So, clarification in the motion

2944
01:59:22,639 --> 01:59:30,320
» Is that we are adopting ordinance 569

2945
01:59:27,040 --> 01:59:31,760
ADU and the parking

2946
01:59:30,320 --> 01:59:35,040
» And it current form

2947
01:59:31,760 --> 01:59:35,520
» In its current form.

2948
01:59:35,040 --> 01:59:39,880
It's

2949
01:59:35,520 --> 01:59:39,880
» With plans to revise it.

2950
01:59:40,400 --> 01:59:43,440
» I don't know if we'd say with plans to

2951
01:59:42,239 --> 01:59:45,199
revise it. I think it would

2952
01:59:43,440 --> 01:59:47,599
» Yeah, you can't make a motion to

2953
01:59:45,199 --> 01:59:49,440
guarantee council for the future.

2954
01:59:47,599 --> 01:59:51,199
» Okay, that's fine. That's that's why I'm

2955
01:59:49,440 --> 01:59:52,800
asking the question.

2956
01:59:51,199 --> 01:59:55,119
» I would say in other revisions because

2957
01:59:52,800 --> 01:59:57,199
the other revisions include more than

2958
01:59:55,119 --> 01:59:59,840
the parking. So,

2959
01:59:57,199 --> 02:00:03,440
» So we're basically saying we need to

2960
01:59:59,840 --> 02:00:04,719
adopt ordinance 569 ADU and parking

2961
02:00:03,440 --> 02:00:06,880
amendments.

2962
02:00:04,719 --> 02:00:09,280
» Is that how it's written on

2963
02:00:06,880 --> 02:00:12,159
» One of the things that is why it's okay?

2964
02:00:09,280 --> 02:00:13,280
Mine it says something different. Okay,

2965
02:00:12,159 --> 02:00:14,880
» I'm just reading what's

2966
02:00:13,280 --> 02:00:16,480
» Now. I know why everyone's talking about

2967
02:00:14,880 --> 02:00:20,480
parking.

2968
02:00:16,480 --> 02:00:22,560
» I would say um and other land use

2969
02:00:20,480 --> 02:00:26,480
amendments instead of just parking. I

2970
02:00:22,560 --> 02:00:30,560
didn't expand that. I'm so sorry.

2971
02:00:26,480 --> 02:00:33,599
and other land use amendments.

2972
02:00:30,560 --> 02:00:36,480
» So from your perspective, the other land

2973
02:00:33,599 --> 02:00:38,880
use amendments are basically made in

2974
02:00:36,480 --> 02:00:41,920
order to make sure that as we refer back

2975
02:00:38,880 --> 02:00:43,520
to them in the ADU language. We're

2976
02:00:41,920 --> 02:00:47,679
referring back to something that makes

2977
02:00:43,520 --> 02:00:50,080
sense. It's not changing previously

2978
02:00:47,679 --> 02:00:52,400
created ordinance. It's just updating

2979
02:00:50,080 --> 02:00:54,400
the language so that referrals back to

2980
02:00:52,400 --> 02:00:57,679
it. There there are some changes

2981
02:00:54,400 --> 02:01:00,880
» Some substantive changes to it. Um like

2982
02:00:57,679 --> 02:01:03,360
the the setback section and the the

2983
02:01:00,880 --> 02:01:04,880
parking elements they they are complying

2984
02:01:03,360 --> 02:01:06,400
some of them are comply with state code

2985
02:01:04,880 --> 02:01:08,000
some are for clarification some are for

2986
02:01:06,400 --> 02:01:10,880
consistency. So there are a variety of

2987
02:01:08,000 --> 02:01:13,040
things. So I'm trying to think how it

2988
02:01:10,880 --> 02:01:14,480
was noticed. I think it was land use

2989
02:01:13,040 --> 02:01:17,760
amendments. I don't think it said

2990
02:01:14,480 --> 02:01:20,400
parking amendments in the in the notice

2991
02:01:17,760 --> 02:01:21,920
online. Did it say

2992
02:01:20,400 --> 02:01:22,560
» Struggling to remember cuz it was like 6

2993
02:01:21,920 --> 02:01:26,719
months ago.

2994
02:01:22,560 --> 02:01:29,280
» I know. I know. And so we we can say um

2995
02:01:26,719 --> 02:01:32,480
what what do you think?

2996
02:01:29,280 --> 02:01:35,520
» Give me a second here. Sorry.

2997
02:01:32,480 --> 02:01:38,639
Does say

2998
02:01:35,520 --> 02:01:41,199
» In the the public hearing we had six

2999
02:01:38,639 --> 02:01:42,800
months ago?

3000
02:01:41,199 --> 02:01:44,400
» The ordinance I have has a different

3001
02:01:42,800 --> 02:01:46,880
title. Does someone else we have a

3002
02:01:44,400 --> 02:01:48,960
different ordinance?

3003
02:01:46,880 --> 02:01:51,679
Well, I had given that to Jack to change

3004
02:01:48,960 --> 02:01:54,400
it because the title was different about

3005
02:01:51,679 --> 02:01:56,480
general plan versus land use. And then

3006
02:01:54,400 --> 02:01:57,840
also there wasn't the the date of the

3007
02:01:56,480 --> 02:02:00,480
plan commission hearing was not the

3008
02:01:57,840 --> 02:02:03,440
actual date. So Jack made those changes

3009
02:02:00,480 --> 02:02:04,000
to the tooth

3010
02:02:03,440 --> 02:02:04,320
ordinance.

3011
02:02:04,000 --> 02:02:07,320
» Okay.

3012
02:02:04,320 --> 02:02:07,320
» Yeah.

3013
02:02:08,239 --> 02:02:13,199
So, I think as it's noticed and as it's

3014
02:02:10,800 --> 02:02:15,440
written, as I see it, you can pass the

3015
02:02:13,199 --> 02:02:18,159
whole thing and then come back and amend

3016
02:02:15,440 --> 02:02:21,520
or change it however you want.

3017
02:02:18,159 --> 02:02:24,960
You could pass the ADU portion of it.

3018
02:02:21,520 --> 02:02:27,199
You could pass the parking

3019
02:02:24,960 --> 02:02:28,880
portion of it.

3020
02:02:27,199 --> 02:02:30,560
I think you can separate them in

3021
02:02:28,880 --> 02:02:34,239
basically those three way. All of it,

3022
02:02:30,560 --> 02:02:36,159
just the ADU or the or just the parking.

3023
02:02:34,239 --> 02:02:38,400
But the parking was noticed as more than

3024
02:02:36,159 --> 02:02:40,239
parking and so it in saying parking it

3025
02:02:38,400 --> 02:02:41,599
does include all of the remittance.

3026
02:02:40,239 --> 02:02:43,760
Thank you.

3027
02:02:41,599 --> 02:02:45,920
» But for the motion I think that's how

3028
02:02:43,760 --> 02:02:48,719
you operate your motion is with those

3029
02:02:45,920 --> 02:02:51,920
three options.

3030
02:02:48,719 --> 02:02:54,320
» So if we don't pass the parking

3031
02:02:51,920 --> 02:02:56,560
which includes previous or revisions

3032
02:02:54,320 --> 02:02:57,599
previous ordinances as well as the ADU

3033
02:02:56,560 --> 02:02:59,440
section.

3034
02:02:57,599 --> 02:03:01,360
» So if we don't pass that part, we don't

3035
02:02:59,440 --> 02:03:01,840
have parking provisions for the ADU

3036
02:03:01,360 --> 02:03:04,159
section.

3037
02:03:01,840 --> 02:03:06,400
» We do it. It refers to the old code.

3038
02:03:04,159 --> 02:03:08,000
We've made minor revisions there, so it

3039
02:03:06,400 --> 02:03:10,320
would not be detrimental.

3040
02:03:08,000 --> 02:03:12,719
» So the ADU section, if we separate that

3041
02:03:10,320 --> 02:03:13,840
out, does include parking regulations

3042
02:03:12,719 --> 02:03:15,599
for the ADUs?

3043
02:03:13,840 --> 02:03:17,760
» For the ADUs, and it refers to the

3044
02:03:15,599 --> 02:03:19,040
existing code that still has enough

3045
02:03:17,760 --> 02:03:20,800
information to regulate parking.

3046
02:03:19,040 --> 02:03:22,719
» This is the

3047
02:03:20,800 --> 02:03:24,800
chapter 11. Does that have to be

3048
02:03:22,719 --> 02:03:26,800
included in this?

3049
02:03:24,800 --> 02:03:28,960
» Title 11.

3050
02:03:26,800 --> 02:03:31,760
Well, this is city code chapter 11,

3051
02:03:28,960 --> 02:03:34,159
title 9, chapter 11, title 20,

3052
02:03:31,760 --> 02:03:35,679
servability and providing an effective

3053
02:03:34,159 --> 02:03:39,119
date.

3054
02:03:35,679 --> 02:03:40,560
That's underneath an ordinance.

3055
02:03:39,119 --> 02:03:42,800
» That's on the warehouse.

3056
02:03:40,560 --> 02:03:45,360
» That's the warehouse.

3057
02:03:42,800 --> 02:03:46,400
» That's the we packet.

3058
02:03:45,360 --> 02:03:46,800
» That's in the back end.

3059
02:03:46,400 --> 02:03:48,560
» Yes.

3060
02:03:46,800 --> 02:03:51,760
» Or do we just go with what's here on the

3061
02:03:48,560 --> 02:03:54,000
city council agenda?

3062
02:03:51,760 --> 02:03:56,320
» I would go with what Brody told you.

3063
02:03:54,000 --> 02:03:58,000
» Got it. Okay.

3064
02:03:56,320 --> 02:03:58,960
We have a substantial record of what

3065
02:03:58,000 --> 02:04:01,840
we're talking about.

3066
02:03:58,960 --> 02:04:04,239
» Yes, I think we do. I'd like to make a

3067
02:04:01,840 --> 02:04:08,159
proposal that we

3068
02:04:04,239 --> 02:04:12,040
that we adopt ordinance 569,

3069
02:04:08,159 --> 02:04:12,040
the land use amendments.

3070
02:04:12,800 --> 02:04:15,800
Period.

3071
02:04:19,360 --> 02:04:23,360
So, as a point of order clarification,

3072
02:04:21,760 --> 02:04:25,280
that's to adopt everything that's

3073
02:04:23,360 --> 02:04:28,560
proposed. That's correct.

3074
02:04:25,280 --> 02:04:32,320
» Okay, I'll second it. Have a

3075
02:04:28,560 --> 02:04:34,080
» Motion and a second. Question.

3076
02:04:32,320 --> 02:04:37,320
» Could a substitute motion be made at

3077
02:04:34,080 --> 02:04:37,320
this point?

3078
02:04:37,520 --> 02:04:42,080
» You can amend the motion.

3079
02:04:39,520 --> 02:04:46,119
» Or is it just amend the motion?

3080
02:04:42,080 --> 02:04:46,119
» You can make a second motion.

3081
02:04:47,119 --> 02:04:49,920
» Do I have to post since I have no motion

3082
02:04:49,280 --> 02:04:51,760
in the second?

3083
02:04:49,920 --> 02:04:52,800
» No, he's he's asking the question the

3084
02:04:51,760 --> 02:04:54,239
right timing.

3085
02:04:52,800 --> 02:04:55,679
» Yeah.

3086
02:04:54,239 --> 02:04:56,159
So, there's been a motion and a second.

3087
02:04:55,679 --> 02:04:57,679
You can

3088
02:04:56,159 --> 02:04:59,440
» So, I'd like to make a substitute

3089
02:04:57,679 --> 02:05:02,800
motion. Okay.

3090
02:04:59,440 --> 02:05:05,520
» What I'd like to do is recommend

3091
02:05:02,800 --> 02:05:10,080
approval of revisions to the uh land use

3092
02:05:05,520 --> 02:05:12,639
code regarding accessory dwelling units.

3093
02:05:10,080 --> 02:05:14,960
uh to both this the chapters that deal

3094
02:05:12,639 --> 02:05:17,679
with the definition, the chapters that

3095
02:05:14,960 --> 02:05:22,960
deal with the land use and the special

3096
02:05:17,679 --> 02:05:25,840
regulation that is um found in in

3097
02:05:22,960 --> 02:05:29,199
1120260

3098
02:05:25,840 --> 02:05:32,080
and I make that motion with revisions

3099
02:05:29,199 --> 02:05:35,599
the following the land use of accessory

3100
02:05:32,080 --> 02:05:38,159
dwelling unit be placed as a land use in

3101
02:05:35,599 --> 02:05:42,239
that provision. The definition of

3102
02:05:38,159 --> 02:05:45,040
accessory use internal, external, and

3103
02:05:42,239 --> 02:05:47,280
distance accessory use be placed in the

3104
02:05:45,040 --> 02:05:49,840
definition section.

3105
02:05:47,280 --> 02:05:52,400
That the revised language be made on the

3106
02:05:49,840 --> 02:05:55,520
definition to be more consistent with

3107
02:05:52,400 --> 02:05:59,480
state laws discussed.

3108
02:05:55,520 --> 02:05:59,480
Um and that

3109
02:06:02,719 --> 02:06:10,960
and that we also add to the standards in

3110
02:06:06,719 --> 02:06:13,199
uh 1120260

3111
02:06:10,960 --> 02:06:15,520
of the city providing a record a

3112
02:06:13,199 --> 02:06:18,520
certificate of the county when an ADU is

3113
02:06:15,520 --> 02:06:18,520
approved

3114
02:06:19,040 --> 02:06:24,480
and uh

3115
02:06:21,520 --> 02:06:25,840
believe that is the motion.

3116
02:06:24,480 --> 02:06:28,880
» Okay. So we have

3117
02:06:25,840 --> 02:06:31,760
» Can I ask a question on the question?

3118
02:06:28,880 --> 02:06:35,440
» Could we not cover this as that was

3119
02:06:31,760 --> 02:06:37,440
already discussed after the fact?

3120
02:06:35,440 --> 02:06:40,320
» Why does it have to be added in now? I

3121
02:06:37,440 --> 02:06:43,040
mean, I'm asking why do you want it now

3122
02:06:40,320 --> 02:06:45,040
versus something we discussed later

3123
02:06:43,040 --> 02:06:46,960
» And added in then? Because we've talked

3124
02:06:45,040 --> 02:06:49,280
about this already.

3125
02:06:46,960 --> 02:06:50,880
I think the reason why I'm I'm making

3126
02:06:49,280 --> 02:06:53,440
that motion, well, I know the reason why

3127
02:06:50,880 --> 02:06:55,280
I'm making that motion is we clarify

3128
02:06:53,440 --> 02:06:57,119
that those or the revisions are made

3129
02:06:55,280 --> 02:07:00,400
that we've discussed and we've all felt

3130
02:06:57,119 --> 02:07:02,960
comfortable with. The others we have not

3131
02:07:00,400 --> 02:07:06,000
really figured where we are, but that

3132
02:07:02,960 --> 02:07:07,520
can be done later on

3133
02:07:06,000 --> 02:07:10,159
and especially the ones that aren't

3134
02:07:07,520 --> 02:07:12,320
specific to the ADU because of the time

3135
02:07:10,159 --> 02:07:15,040
deadline we have. At least we have

3136
02:07:12,320 --> 02:07:16,960
something we know it's clear. We know

3137
02:07:15,040 --> 02:07:20,159
where it will go. We don't have to go

3138
02:07:16,960 --> 02:07:22,239
back again and revise those areas a

3139
02:07:20,159 --> 02:07:23,440
second time. We have it set up to begin

3140
02:07:22,239 --> 02:07:25,840
with the first one.

3141
02:07:23,440 --> 02:07:28,639
» Okay. If we go with this, Jack, can you

3142
02:07:25,840 --> 02:07:30,320
clarify it all on paper?

3143
02:07:28,639 --> 02:07:30,800
» I will listen to the recording.

3144
02:07:30,320 --> 02:07:32,560
» Okay.

3145
02:07:30,800 --> 02:07:34,159
» There's nothing to stop us from making

3146
02:07:32,560 --> 02:07:35,920
whatever amendment you propose and

3147
02:07:34,159 --> 02:07:37,840
whatever discuss discussion you would

3148
02:07:35,920 --> 02:07:39,679
like to have in the future if we pass it

3149
02:07:37,840 --> 02:07:40,719
in full tonight. And if we pass it in

3150
02:07:39,679 --> 02:07:42,560
full tonight, we'll be in full

3151
02:07:40,719 --> 02:07:45,360
compliance with the state and we'll have

3152
02:07:42,560 --> 02:07:47,199
something to go based on until we get to

3153
02:07:45,360 --> 02:07:49,840
those discussions.

3154
02:07:47,199 --> 02:07:51,920
So that's how I see that as a win-win.

3155
02:07:49,840 --> 02:07:54,480
And then our the onus is on us to take

3156
02:07:51,920 --> 02:07:57,040
our time to do this kind of research to

3157
02:07:54,480 --> 02:07:59,280
ask our questions in a timely manner

3158
02:07:57,040 --> 02:08:01,599
instead of putting it off and not having

3159
02:07:59,280 --> 02:08:03,520
something in writing for the city.

3160
02:08:01,599 --> 02:08:05,679
» So are you saying that you're in favor

3161
02:08:03,520 --> 02:08:08,239
of this? I'm in favor of

3162
02:08:05,679 --> 02:08:11,760
» So I that call for the substantive

3163
02:08:08,239 --> 02:08:13,199
motion. What I haven't got a second.

3164
02:08:11,760 --> 02:08:15,520
» Yeah.

3165
02:08:13,199 --> 02:08:18,520
» So we have the

3166
02:08:15,520 --> 02:08:18,520
original.

3167
02:08:19,599 --> 02:08:24,719
» So I'm really confused as to what I'm

3168
02:08:22,400 --> 02:08:26,639
going

3169
02:08:24,719 --> 02:08:29,119
» Well, there if there's no second to the

3170
02:08:26,639 --> 02:08:31,360
subst.

3171
02:08:29,119 --> 02:08:33,360
» So Mr. Montgomery's motion has failed

3172
02:08:31,360 --> 02:08:35,199
for lack of a second. You have a valid

3173
02:08:33,360 --> 02:08:37,280
motion that's Grover that's been

3174
02:08:35,199 --> 02:08:39,920
seconded. So you need a roll call motion

3175
02:08:37,280 --> 02:08:41,760
on the original motion.

3176
02:08:39,920 --> 02:08:44,639
» I have a motion and I have a second with

3177
02:08:41,760 --> 02:08:47,280
Grover. Okay. So now we're going to do a

3178
02:08:44,639 --> 02:08:52,040
roll call.

3179
02:08:47,280 --> 02:08:52,040
And since I can't use the same list,

3180
02:08:55,040 --> 02:09:01,079
» I don't know where.

3181
02:08:57,599 --> 02:09:01,079
» Oh, here it is.

3182
02:09:02,639 --> 02:09:06,079
Councilman Christensen,

3183
02:09:04,320 --> 02:09:08,400
» Yes.

3184
02:09:06,079 --> 02:09:09,440
» Council member

3185
02:09:08,400 --> 02:09:10,079
Willson,

3186
02:09:09,440 --> 02:09:11,760
» Yes.

3187
02:09:10,079 --> 02:09:15,520
» Council member Hadley,

3188
02:09:11,760 --> 02:09:16,960
» Yes. Council member Montgomery, no.

3189
02:09:15,520 --> 02:09:17,679
Council member Crawl,

3190
02:09:16,960 --> 02:09:22,199
» Yes.

3191
02:09:17,679 --> 02:09:22,199
» Okay. Passes for

3192
02:09:24,079 --> 02:09:27,079
» Okay.

3193
02:09:27,119 --> 02:09:32,880
Our next item on the agenda is the

3194
02:09:30,159 --> 02:09:37,119
rightway width for West Harris for road

3195
02:09:32,880 --> 02:09:39,599
discussion. Um

3196
02:09:37,119 --> 02:09:41,440
» Greg, I I mean I could preface it if you

3197
02:09:39,599 --> 02:09:43,119
want to preface it

3198
02:09:41,440 --> 02:09:43,520
» More then that's great. I'll go ahead

3199
02:09:43,119 --> 02:09:44,239
and let

3200
02:09:43,520 --> 02:09:46,000
» Yeah. Well,

3201
02:09:44,239 --> 02:09:48,239
» You want me to you go ahead and start.

3202
02:09:46,000 --> 02:09:49,679
So I one of the reasons why this has

3203
02:09:48,239 --> 02:09:52,880
come up and I know there's a lot of

3204
02:09:49,679 --> 02:09:56,800
interest in the party today or that's in

3205
02:09:52,880 --> 02:10:00,159
the group is that we've had discussions

3206
02:09:56,800 --> 02:10:02,159
as city council and as the mayor

3207
02:10:00,159 --> 02:10:04,560
regarding the width of that road and the

3208
02:10:02,159 --> 02:10:07,119
determination of whether it's 99 ft

3209
02:10:04,560 --> 02:10:09,280
because there's all this not so sure

3210
02:10:07,119 --> 02:10:13,040
clarity. And so we were wanting to have

3211
02:10:09,280 --> 02:10:16,480
a discussion to discuss what the the

3212
02:10:13,040 --> 02:10:18,239
issues may be because our design the

3213
02:10:16,480 --> 02:10:20,400
design standards that we're currently

3214
02:10:18,239 --> 02:10:24,000
set up right now is only at an 80 foot

3215
02:10:20,400 --> 02:10:27,040
ride. It's not incorporating the 99 ft

3216
02:10:24,000 --> 02:10:29,520
that some parcels might say. We've

3217
02:10:27,040 --> 02:10:32,800
invited Cody to come as well so that we

3218
02:10:29,520 --> 02:10:36,480
could help have this discussion. Um and

3219
02:10:32,800 --> 02:10:38,320
so hopefully I've prefaced it good

3220
02:10:36,480 --> 02:10:39,760
enough. Greg, that's a you can take

3221
02:10:38,320 --> 02:10:42,880
over. That's a good preface.

3222
02:10:39,760 --> 02:10:46,239
» Okay. Appreciate that. So, my concern

3223
02:10:42,880 --> 02:10:49,920
has been as of even January when I first

3224
02:10:46,239 --> 02:10:53,520
came into the the council office was

3225
02:10:49,920 --> 02:10:57,199
that I I think we've got some um

3226
02:10:53,520 --> 02:10:59,119
miscommunications and some items taking

3227
02:10:57,199 --> 02:11:01,760
place that have created a lot of

3228
02:10:59,119 --> 02:11:04,719
confusion. And I think we don't even

3229
02:11:01,760 --> 02:11:07,520
have the accurate documentation to say

3230
02:11:04,719 --> 02:11:10,239
which is which.

3231
02:11:07,520 --> 02:11:11,760
State law, however, allows that the city

3232
02:11:10,239 --> 02:11:13,920
council

3233
02:11:11,760 --> 02:11:18,239
can consider

3234
02:11:13,920 --> 02:11:20,719
uh doing a a partial street vacation

3235
02:11:18,239 --> 02:11:24,079
under certain provisions. And that be

3236
02:11:20,719 --> 02:11:25,679
that uh we provide the names and

3237
02:11:24,079 --> 02:11:28,480
addresses of everyone who lives along

3238
02:11:25,679 --> 02:11:31,920
the street and those who are within 300

3239
02:11:28,480 --> 02:11:33,920
ft that may have access to that street.

3240
02:11:31,920 --> 02:11:37,040
uh we give notice of all the utilities

3241
02:11:33,920 --> 02:11:38,880
that are in that in that right of way.

3242
02:11:37,040 --> 02:11:41,760
We hold a public hearing and then we

3243
02:11:38,880 --> 02:11:43,920
determine the appropriate us that is

3244
02:11:41,760 --> 02:11:47,760
there good cause and a public interest

3245
02:11:43,920 --> 02:11:51,440
for making a revision to the right ofway

3246
02:11:47,760 --> 02:11:54,560
with of the street. If we decide to do

3247
02:11:51,440 --> 02:11:56,639
that, then an ordinance will be recorded

3248
02:11:54,560 --> 02:11:59,520
with legal description

3249
02:11:56,639 --> 02:12:01,760
and in this whole process. It does not

3250
02:11:59,520 --> 02:12:04,880
affect if we're doing the right of way

3251
02:12:01,760 --> 02:12:09,119
vacation. It does not affect the right

3252
02:12:04,880 --> 02:12:13,280
away or easement for public utilities

3253
02:12:09,119 --> 02:12:16,239
and water and sewer, gas that that this

3254
02:12:13,280 --> 02:12:19,760
is strictly discussion on the physical

3255
02:12:16,239 --> 02:12:23,440
road right of way that is travel lane,

3256
02:12:19,760 --> 02:12:26,960
sidewalk, those things public utilities

3257
02:12:23,440 --> 02:12:29,520
in place uh would still have their same

3258
02:12:26,960 --> 02:12:32,639
rightway easements.

3259
02:12:29,520 --> 02:12:35,679
I think that there's through our

3260
02:12:32,639 --> 02:12:38,320
ordinances, through our standards, even

3261
02:12:35,679 --> 02:12:40,159
through the whole process. I looked at

3262
02:12:38,320 --> 02:12:44,560
Wasach Toronto Regional Council and then

3263
02:12:40,159 --> 02:12:47,840
of course uh where the uh transportation

3264
02:12:44,560 --> 02:12:50,800
uh plan comes from. They talk about the

3265
02:12:47,840 --> 02:12:52,800
road widening being a collector street

3266
02:12:50,800 --> 02:12:56,480
and widening from two to three lanes in

3267
02:12:52,800 --> 02:12:57,679
the 66 right away in their document. We

3268
02:12:56,480 --> 02:13:00,320
also talk about it by

3269
02:12:57,679 --> 02:13:03,360
transportationally.

3270
02:13:00,320 --> 02:13:06,880
In the Harrisville general plan, we have

3271
02:13:03,360 --> 02:13:10,159
a map as a 66 to 80 foot ride ofway that

3272
02:13:06,880 --> 02:13:12,480
also includes a sidewalk and bike lane.

3273
02:13:10,159 --> 02:13:14,239
So, we have a map that's between 66 and

3274
02:13:12,480 --> 02:13:17,520
80 ft.

3275
02:13:14,239 --> 02:13:20,320
We also have in our um general plan

3276
02:13:17,520 --> 02:13:22,639
language that is a minor arterial which

3277
02:13:20,320 --> 02:13:25,119
is different from what we have on the

3278
02:13:22,639 --> 02:13:26,960
map or different from what watch front

3279
02:13:25,119 --> 02:13:28,719
regional council calls it as a local

3280
02:13:26,960 --> 02:13:31,760
collector.

3281
02:13:28,719 --> 02:13:34,239
Our own standards say that a standard

3282
02:13:31,760 --> 02:13:37,760
collector is 66t by the way and a minor

3283
02:13:34,239 --> 02:13:40,159
arterial is 84 ft which is the conflict

3284
02:13:37,760 --> 02:13:44,239
in language in our general plan. The

3285
02:13:40,159 --> 02:13:48,159
text says minor factor 84 feet. The map

3286
02:13:44,239 --> 02:13:50,560
says 8 66 to 80 feet.

3287
02:13:48,159 --> 02:13:52,800
And that

3288
02:13:50,560 --> 02:13:55,199
we have so much confusion that to

3289
02:13:52,800 --> 02:13:56,800
clarify it all as property owners have

3290
02:13:55,199 --> 02:14:01,119
tried to define different things as we

3291
02:13:56,800 --> 02:14:04,320
look at state law state law the record

3292
02:14:01,119 --> 02:14:06,079
um even federal law there are so many

3293
02:14:04,320 --> 02:14:09,040
conflicting things here. I think it is

3294
02:14:06,079 --> 02:14:12,639
important just to say look let's take it

3295
02:14:09,040 --> 02:14:15,599
and if we're saying it's 99 ft we're all

3296
02:14:12,639 --> 02:14:17,360
now saying we're designing this is 80T

3297
02:14:15,599 --> 02:14:20,960
let's get it 80 foot so everything's

3298
02:14:17,360 --> 02:14:23,040
consistent our local standards

3299
02:14:20,960 --> 02:14:26,400
front standards

3300
02:14:23,040 --> 02:14:28,719
um our city rightway standards

3301
02:14:26,400 --> 02:14:30,639
um we've got so much confusion going on

3302
02:14:28,719 --> 02:14:34,239
that the best way to clarify to say here

3303
02:14:30,639 --> 02:14:37,760
is by ordinance what the right way now

3304
02:14:34,239 --> 02:14:40,159
is my understanding is that while this

3305
02:14:37,760 --> 02:14:42,320
was once a state road, it then became a

3306
02:14:40,159 --> 02:14:45,599
county road and then it became a city

3307
02:14:42,320 --> 02:14:49,599
road. So now the jurisdiction in terms

3308
02:14:45,599 --> 02:14:51,920
of vacations or rightway reductions rest

3309
02:14:49,599 --> 02:14:53,840
upon the city.

3310
02:14:51,920 --> 02:14:56,239
And so that's what I wanted to bring up

3311
02:14:53,840 --> 02:14:59,520
as a discussion point because it's gone

3312
02:14:56,239 --> 02:15:00,960
on long enough of what is and what that

3313
02:14:59,520 --> 02:15:02,480
and I think it's just important to say

3314
02:15:00,960 --> 02:15:05,040
look this is where it is. We have all

3315
02:15:02,480 --> 02:15:07,040
these conflicting documents and let's

3316
02:15:05,040 --> 02:15:09,040
settle it by uh by having a public

3317
02:15:07,040 --> 02:15:11,280
hearing of an ordinance to establish the

3318
02:15:09,040 --> 02:15:13,040
rightway as 80 ft.

3319
02:15:11,280 --> 02:15:16,400
» Okay.

3320
02:15:13,040 --> 02:15:18,079
» Other discussion the council.

3321
02:15:16,400 --> 02:15:20,880
» I do have a question about some of the

3322
02:15:18,079 --> 02:15:23,199
comments that were made as far as we

3323
02:15:20,880 --> 02:15:24,719
made offers to

3324
02:15:23,199 --> 02:15:27,360
pay

3325
02:15:24,719 --> 02:15:29,040
homeowners or land owners for certain

3326
02:15:27,360 --> 02:15:31,679
things that they would do such as taking

3327
02:15:29,040 --> 02:15:33,199
out trees and sprinklers. Sounds like

3328
02:15:31,679 --> 02:15:35,119
I'm wondering if that is already

3329
02:15:33,199 --> 02:15:36,239
established, that's already done, that's

3330
02:15:35,119 --> 02:15:38,719
already committed.

3331
02:15:36,239 --> 02:15:40,560
» So, we can have Cody help answer some of

3332
02:15:38,719 --> 02:15:43,040
that, but I can help answer some of that

3333
02:15:40,560 --> 02:15:45,119
as well. And that is in the standard

3334
02:15:43,040 --> 02:15:48,719
procedure. And Cody, you help me if I'm

3335
02:15:45,119 --> 02:15:50,719
off or Roie, you can help as well. But

3336
02:15:48,719 --> 02:15:52,960
the standard procedure is is there's an

3337
02:15:50,719 --> 02:15:56,239
easement that's been there for whatever

3338
02:15:52,960 --> 02:15:58,880
that is. right now trying to determine

3339
02:15:56,239 --> 02:16:01,360
the 99 or the 80 ft which has always

3340
02:15:58,880 --> 02:16:04,079
been a real confusing point. Right?

3341
02:16:01,360 --> 02:16:07,920
There's some parcels along there that

3342
02:16:04,079 --> 02:16:11,440
say 99 ft. There's others where they've

3343
02:16:07,920 --> 02:16:15,520
been surveyed by professional surveyors

3344
02:16:11,440 --> 02:16:20,400
that call for 80 ft. Well, if if if that

3345
02:16:15,520 --> 02:16:23,599
if a if a land owner puts in a a fence

3346
02:16:20,400 --> 02:16:25,280
and it's within that easement area,

3347
02:16:23,599 --> 02:16:26,960
technically they don't have to do it.

3348
02:16:25,280 --> 02:16:28,719
They don't have to pay anything cuz it's

3349
02:16:26,960 --> 02:16:30,800
in the thing. But because it's

3350
02:16:28,719 --> 02:16:33,120
disturbing something that's already

3351
02:16:30,800 --> 02:16:36,479
there and then also when you start

3352
02:16:33,120 --> 02:16:40,399
looking at the elevation of the roadway

3353
02:16:36,479 --> 02:16:42,319
coming into a parcel comes in, that ends

3354
02:16:40,399 --> 02:16:45,359
up creating a problem. So it ends up

3355
02:16:42,319 --> 02:16:49,200
disturbing plants and other things. So

3356
02:16:45,359 --> 02:16:51,359
then it's it's a general plan that UD do

3357
02:16:49,200 --> 02:16:55,040
usually uses to help come in and

3358
02:16:51,359 --> 02:16:56,080
mitigate or take away some of that loss.

3359
02:16:55,040 --> 02:16:57,040
» Right,

3360
02:16:56,080 --> 02:16:57,519
» Cody? Is that

3361
02:16:57,040 --> 02:16:58,000
» That's right.

3362
02:16:57,519 --> 02:16:58,719
» Close.

3363
02:16:58,000 --> 02:17:00,800
» Okay.

3364
02:16:58,719 --> 02:17:02,000
» And that's already in progress.

3365
02:17:00,800 --> 02:17:04,479
» It's already in progress

3366
02:17:02,000 --> 02:17:08,319
» And we don't have plans to disrupt that

3367
02:17:04,479 --> 02:17:11,120
whether we change this 80 ft to 99 ft or

3368
02:17:08,319 --> 02:17:13,679
would that disrupt. It would disrupt.

3369
02:17:11,120 --> 02:17:16,639
» There will still be impacts.

3370
02:17:13,679 --> 02:17:18,240
» If we change it to 80 ft, we potentially

3371
02:17:16,639 --> 02:17:20,000
wouldn't be paying those homeowners

3372
02:17:18,240 --> 02:17:21,040
because we wouldn't be distributing. Is

3373
02:17:20,000 --> 02:17:22,399
that what we're saying?

3374
02:17:21,040 --> 02:17:23,120
» No, not

3375
02:17:22,399 --> 02:17:25,359
» We would still.

3376
02:17:23,120 --> 02:17:26,960
» So, right now we're

3377
02:17:25,359 --> 02:17:29,040
the only settlements that are being made

3378
02:17:26,960 --> 02:17:30,800
is on the 80 foot because that's the way

3379
02:17:29,040 --> 02:17:31,439
the design currently sits.

3380
02:17:30,800 --> 02:17:33,840
» Oh, I see.

3381
02:17:31,439 --> 02:17:35,840
» It's not going with the 99 ft.

3382
02:17:33,840 --> 02:17:38,319
» So, we haven't made offers on up to 99

3383
02:17:35,840 --> 02:17:40,559
ft yet, but we potentially could.

3384
02:17:38,319 --> 02:17:44,399
» No. So the impact of the design of the

3385
02:17:40,559 --> 02:17:48,080
roadway is only impacting 80 feet for

3386
02:17:44,399 --> 02:17:50,960
the improvements sidewalk to sidewalk.

3387
02:17:48,080 --> 02:17:54,160
But the and sorry that's the roadway

3388
02:17:50,960 --> 02:17:56,800
impact. But the grading issues and all

3389
02:17:54,160 --> 02:17:58,800
that go down into people's yards.

3390
02:17:56,800 --> 02:18:01,359
Whether you're whether you move the

3391
02:17:58,800 --> 02:18:03,840
rideway into 80 ft or keep it where it

3392
02:18:01,359 --> 02:18:04,319
is, we're still impacting.

3393
02:18:03,840 --> 02:18:06,639
» Okay.

3394
02:18:04,319 --> 02:18:08,880
» Yeah. So the intent is still there

3395
02:18:06,639 --> 02:18:11,280
regardless of this question and we will

3396
02:18:08,880 --> 02:18:14,240
still proceed with that

3397
02:18:11,280 --> 02:18:17,599
with the same number of owners.

3398
02:18:14,240 --> 02:18:20,719
» Well in addition to that there's the

3399
02:18:17,599 --> 02:18:22,479
impact is such where the the grading of

3400
02:18:20,719 --> 02:18:24,479
the property.

3401
02:18:22,479 --> 02:18:27,519
So if you have this roadway that sits up

3402
02:18:24,479 --> 02:18:30,160
here and their driveway was down here

3403
02:18:27,519 --> 02:18:32,479
and now we bring that line up to here.

3404
02:18:30,160 --> 02:18:35,920
it still needs to be sloped off or put

3405
02:18:32,479 --> 02:18:39,280
in block or something else, you know, to

3406
02:18:35,920 --> 02:18:42,080
to build it up to to hold the roadway or

3407
02:18:39,280 --> 02:18:43,439
the sidewalk. And so, yeah, there's

3408
02:18:42,080 --> 02:18:45,040
impact there, but that doesn't

3409
02:18:43,439 --> 02:18:46,960
necessarily

3410
02:18:45,040 --> 02:18:49,359
the easement

3411
02:18:46,960 --> 02:18:49,840
is is a different scenario.

3412
02:18:49,359 --> 02:18:51,840
» Okay.

3413
02:18:49,840 --> 02:18:55,280
» In one sense, is how I see it.

3414
02:18:51,840 --> 02:18:58,080
» So, you have the 99th

3415
02:18:55,280 --> 02:19:00,639
that is is a question.

3416
02:18:58,080 --> 02:19:03,519
» Yes. And then you have the 80 foot

3417
02:19:00,639 --> 02:19:05,599
design width.

3418
02:19:03,519 --> 02:19:06,240
That's what everything is being designed

3419
02:19:05,599 --> 02:19:07,040
to,

3420
02:19:06,240 --> 02:19:09,519
» Right?

3421
02:19:07,040 --> 02:19:11,599
» And then you have the

3422
02:19:09,519 --> 02:19:13,920
» The areas that are impacted because of

3423
02:19:11,599 --> 02:19:15,519
the elevations of the road versus the

3424
02:19:13,920 --> 02:19:15,920
properties.

3425
02:19:15,519 --> 02:19:18,240
» So

3426
02:19:15,920 --> 02:19:19,679
» So is every homeowner in that corridor

3427
02:19:18,240 --> 02:19:22,639
being offered this then?

3428
02:19:19,679 --> 02:19:24,399
» Well, because everybody that's affected

3429
02:19:22,639 --> 02:19:26,719
some there's some settlement that's in

3430
02:19:24,399 --> 02:19:28,960
there. That's part of the overall

3431
02:19:26,719 --> 02:19:31,760
estimate. I mean, it's, you know, when

3432
02:19:28,960 --> 02:19:34,479
when they came and when Highway 89 came

3433
02:19:31,760 --> 02:19:37,200
down my property, they changed the

3434
02:19:34,479 --> 02:19:39,040
elevation, you know, like 8 ft,

3435
02:19:37,200 --> 02:19:42,000
something like that. And so, it made a

3436
02:19:39,040 --> 02:19:44,800
difference of that approach piece in the

3437
02:19:42,000 --> 02:19:48,559
back of my property. Well, they came and

3438
02:19:44,800 --> 02:19:50,640
made arranged this with me to number one

3439
02:19:48,559 --> 02:19:52,399
to be able to run their construction

3440
02:19:50,640 --> 02:19:55,520
crews on along there and then and

3441
02:19:52,399 --> 02:19:57,680
addition changing the slow

3442
02:19:55,520 --> 02:19:59,600
I had to sign documents to that.

3443
02:19:57,680 --> 02:20:03,600
» Okay. So, that's the documents that they

3444
02:19:59,600 --> 02:20:06,080
were referring to in the public comment

3445
02:20:03,600 --> 02:20:10,399
that we're going to give you this in

3446
02:20:06,080 --> 02:20:12,800
addition in in turn for X, right? And

3447
02:20:10,399 --> 02:20:15,120
the X would be access to the land which

3448
02:20:12,800 --> 02:20:16,479
we already technically are claiming that

3449
02:20:15,120 --> 02:20:20,560
we own.

3450
02:20:16,479 --> 02:20:23,359
» We're not asking for that property with

3451
02:20:20,560 --> 02:20:25,680
» Fences, landscaping,

3452
02:20:23,359 --> 02:20:27,520
» Other amenities that are involved in the

3453
02:20:25,680 --> 02:20:29,439
properties. That's that's really

3454
02:20:27,520 --> 02:20:32,560
» So there signatures indicating they're

3455
02:20:29,439 --> 02:20:35,520
approval for access, not some sort of

3456
02:20:32,560 --> 02:20:36,640
land ownership transfer.

3457
02:20:35,520 --> 02:20:38,880
» You can answer that.

3458
02:20:36,640 --> 02:20:42,560
» Yeah. So, there's multiple things going

3459
02:20:38,880 --> 02:20:45,920
on there. So, um we're saying that the

3460
02:20:42,560 --> 02:20:47,520
right now the rightway is at 99 ft where

3461
02:20:45,920 --> 02:20:49,680
we're talking about where we need to tie

3462
02:20:47,520 --> 02:20:51,760
in their driveways because of the slope

3463
02:20:49,680 --> 02:20:54,160
differential of the road. We would need

3464
02:20:51,760 --> 02:20:56,800
an easement, a temporary easement to get

3465
02:20:54,160 --> 02:20:58,479
on. So, they're signing for that

3466
02:20:56,800 --> 02:20:59,520
easement. That's why

3467
02:20:58,479 --> 02:21:01,439
» Temporary

3468
02:20:59,520 --> 02:21:02,640
» Temporary construction easement

3469
02:21:01,439 --> 02:21:04,160
» Just for the duration of the project.

3470
02:21:02,640 --> 02:21:05,680
» Just for the duration of the project to

3471
02:21:04,160 --> 02:21:09,760
tie those improvements back in.

3472
02:21:05,680 --> 02:21:12,880
» Yeah. The second piece is we're paying

3473
02:21:09,760 --> 02:21:16,880
them for trees and fences that we're

3474
02:21:12,880 --> 02:21:19,280
disrupting inside the rideway.

3475
02:21:16,880 --> 02:21:21,120
And then the third thing is there's so

3476
02:21:19,280 --> 02:21:21,760
how many properties are on there?

3477
02:21:21,120 --> 02:21:25,760
» 16.

3478
02:21:21,760 --> 02:21:28,560
» 16 of the 16 properties

3479
02:21:25,760 --> 02:21:32,479
there are five that have overlapping

3480
02:21:28,560 --> 02:21:37,040
property that overlaps the rideway line.

3481
02:21:32,479 --> 02:21:40,000
For those five properties, we are um

3482
02:21:37,040 --> 02:21:43,600
asking them to sign a deed to clean up

3483
02:21:40,000 --> 02:21:47,840
their rideway or to remove the portion

3484
02:21:43,600 --> 02:21:50,880
that's inside the city right away.

3485
02:21:47,840 --> 02:21:54,000
That's the that's the discussion. That's

3486
02:21:50,880 --> 02:21:57,520
the main discussion.

3487
02:21:54,000 --> 02:21:59,680
» And we're saying we need their signature

3488
02:21:57,520 --> 02:22:02,960
because

3489
02:21:59,680 --> 02:22:03,920
» Right now it's changing the deed.

3490
02:22:02,960 --> 02:22:06,640
need.

3491
02:22:03,920 --> 02:22:08,640
» Yeah. And we don't have to have it. It's

3492
02:22:06,640 --> 02:22:09,920
just something that it's part of the

3493
02:22:08,640 --> 02:22:14,080
process

3494
02:22:09,920 --> 02:22:16,800
» To um

3495
02:22:14,080 --> 02:22:20,319
how do you term it? I'm using the word

3496
02:22:16,800 --> 02:22:22,560
clean up, but adjust.

3497
02:22:20,319 --> 02:22:26,399
So the property owner basically isn't

3498
02:22:22,560 --> 02:22:29,359
paying for for property that they're not

3499
02:22:26,399 --> 02:22:31,200
technically using. So it benefits the

3500
02:22:29,359 --> 02:22:34,399
property owner in the sense that they

3501
02:22:31,200 --> 02:22:36,800
are their parcel is now smaller and so

3502
02:22:34,399 --> 02:22:37,439
their tax bill is lowered. Is that what

3503
02:22:36,800 --> 02:22:39,680
you're saying?

3504
02:22:37,439 --> 02:22:40,960
» That that's one benefit. Yeah. Whether

3505
02:22:39,680 --> 02:22:42,560
it's a huge benefit.

3506
02:22:40,960 --> 02:22:44,720
» I was asking about what you're saying.

3507
02:22:42,560 --> 02:22:48,080
I'm not saying agree or disagree.

3508
02:22:44,720 --> 02:22:51,760
» Yes. But we I sorry.

3509
02:22:48,080 --> 02:22:54,240
Um, we did verify with you DOT that that

3510
02:22:51,760 --> 02:22:56,000
warranty deed to get their property

3511
02:22:54,240 --> 02:22:59,120
description to match up with the rideway

3512
02:22:56,000 --> 02:23:00,640
line um, isn't necessary to be able to

3513
02:22:59,120 --> 02:23:02,880
move forward with the project. So,

3514
02:23:00,640 --> 02:23:04,560
property owner has opt not to sign that

3515
02:23:02,880 --> 02:23:06,240
warranty deed.

3516
02:23:04,560 --> 02:23:09,280
» Then we can still do the other two

3517
02:23:06,240 --> 02:23:11,520
things. Pay them for the easement,

3518
02:23:09,280 --> 02:23:14,080
construction ement, and also pay them

3519
02:23:11,520 --> 02:23:16,080
for trees or whatever that we're

3520
02:23:14,080 --> 02:23:18,479
disrupting. And that's coming from all

3521
02:23:16,080 --> 02:23:20,000
all this goes through because it's a

3522
02:23:18,479 --> 02:23:22,479
fedally funded project. It all goes

3523
02:23:20,000 --> 02:23:24,080
through you right away division for all

3524
02:23:22,479 --> 02:23:26,319
the approvals of all the documents and

3525
02:23:24,080 --> 02:23:27,840
the process has to follow the federal

3526
02:23:26,319 --> 02:23:30,000
process for acquiring it.

3527
02:23:27,840 --> 02:23:33,280
» So if a homeowner decides that they want

3528
02:23:30,000 --> 02:23:35,520
to take legal action as far as claiming

3529
02:23:33,280 --> 02:23:37,439
the property that we're asking them to

3530
02:23:35,520 --> 02:23:39,680
sign the deed. So those five properties

3531
02:23:37,439 --> 02:23:40,560
where we want them to turn over the

3532
02:23:39,680 --> 02:23:43,280
officially.

3533
02:23:40,560 --> 02:23:45,760
» Sure. Would they be giving up the right

3534
02:23:43,280 --> 02:23:47,280
to any sort of legal action if they do

3535
02:23:45,760 --> 02:23:50,000
sign that deed

3536
02:23:47,280 --> 02:23:50,560
» Over to us?

3537
02:23:50,000 --> 02:23:53,920
» Yes,

3538
02:23:50,560 --> 02:23:55,680
» I think so. But keep it in mind if they

3539
02:23:53,920 --> 02:23:56,880
don't do it then their property will be

3540
02:23:55,680 --> 02:24:01,120
the road,

3541
02:23:56,880 --> 02:24:03,520
» Right? I mean, unless they decide to

3542
02:24:01,120 --> 02:24:05,920
» My piece of property on 750 West when I

3543
02:24:03,520 --> 02:24:08,800
first bought it. My property line went

3544
02:24:05,920 --> 02:24:12,479
to the center of the road and it has a

3545
02:24:08,800 --> 02:24:15,359
60oot easel. So, I'm paying for 30 ft of

3546
02:24:12,479 --> 02:24:17,600
property that isn't technically mine,

3547
02:24:15,359 --> 02:24:19,040
and I I took it off because I didn't

3548
02:24:17,600 --> 02:24:20,640
want to be paying

3549
02:24:19,040 --> 02:24:24,160
» That square footage,

3550
02:24:20,640 --> 02:24:26,880
» Right? And if the homeowner agrees

3551
02:24:24,160 --> 02:24:28,800
to that view of things, then it would

3552
02:24:26,880 --> 02:24:30,640
make sense to decide that. But if

3553
02:24:28,800 --> 02:24:32,319
they're in disagreement and they think,

3554
02:24:30,640 --> 02:24:33,600
"No, I do have a legal right to this

3555
02:24:32,319 --> 02:24:35,600
property and I don't want it built

3556
02:24:33,600 --> 02:24:36,479
upon," then that's a difficult decision

3557
02:24:35,600 --> 02:24:38,240
for the homeowner to

3558
02:24:36,479 --> 02:24:42,080
» Yeah.

3559
02:24:38,240 --> 02:24:44,800
» Thank you. Anything

3560
02:24:42,080 --> 02:24:46,880
else you have, Cody?

3561
02:24:44,800 --> 02:24:47,200
» Just here to answer questions if I can.

3562
02:24:46,880 --> 02:24:48,399
Yeah.

3563
02:24:47,200 --> 02:24:53,040
» Any others?

3564
02:24:48,399 --> 02:24:55,520
» I just The Eastman goes either way and

3565
02:24:53,040 --> 02:24:58,319
it's that one of those areas that's

3566
02:24:55,520 --> 02:25:01,280
really vague where the Eastman actually

3567
02:24:58,319 --> 02:25:03,280
goes. So when we're talking about the

3568
02:25:01,280 --> 02:25:04,720
80ft road, then their eastments are on

3569
02:25:03,280 --> 02:25:05,359
the outside of that.

3570
02:25:04,720 --> 02:25:07,840
» Yes.

3571
02:25:05,359 --> 02:25:10,479
» And they will still have

3572
02:25:07,840 --> 02:25:12,800
utilities will have access to all that

3573
02:25:10,479 --> 02:25:15,200
even though it may run into the property

3574
02:25:12,800 --> 02:25:16,640
even though it's an easement,

3575
02:25:15,200 --> 02:25:18,479
you know, and that's part of the

3576
02:25:16,640 --> 02:25:21,359
disruption of everything that's going on

3577
02:25:18,479 --> 02:25:23,040
right now. If I'm understanding what?

3578
02:25:21,359 --> 02:25:25,040
» Yeah. And so that would have to be a

3579
02:25:23,040 --> 02:25:28,880
separate question if I'm understanding.

3580
02:25:25,040 --> 02:25:32,319
If you move to the 80ft ride of way

3581
02:25:28,880 --> 02:25:34,319
and most of the utilities fit in there,

3582
02:25:32,319 --> 02:25:36,560
but their power lines and others that

3583
02:25:34,319 --> 02:25:38,000
are outside it, that would be the

3584
02:25:36,560 --> 02:25:41,359
discussion that they would have to come

3585
02:25:38,000 --> 02:25:43,359
and want an easement in order to

3586
02:25:41,359 --> 02:25:45,920
maintain their equipment across people's

3587
02:25:43,359 --> 02:25:48,080
property. Well, what what would happen

3588
02:25:45,920 --> 02:25:51,120
at least as I read state law street

3589
02:25:48,080 --> 02:25:54,080
vacation or street reduction vacating

3590
02:25:51,120 --> 02:25:55,840
all the parts is that utilities still

3591
02:25:54,080 --> 02:25:57,920
have a right to an easement.

3592
02:25:55,840 --> 02:26:00,720
» Yeah. So that be the sewer line, the

3593
02:25:57,920 --> 02:26:03,680
water line, power line,

3594
02:26:00,720 --> 02:26:07,120
» The public utilities still retain an

3595
02:26:03,680 --> 02:26:09,680
easement, but we do not if we vacate to

3596
02:26:07,120 --> 02:26:12,560
an 80oot right away, we do not have

3597
02:26:09,680 --> 02:26:15,280
right to public improvements of street,

3598
02:26:12,560 --> 02:26:16,800
curb, gutter, sidewalk on that property.

3599
02:26:15,280 --> 02:26:19,520
And that's what that's what the

3600
02:26:16,800 --> 02:26:22,160
reduction would do is saying those

3601
02:26:19,520 --> 02:26:24,399
physical things that are above ground

3602
02:26:22,160 --> 02:26:26,399
are reduced to staying within an 80ft

3603
02:26:24,399 --> 02:26:28,720
ride of plane. But those other things

3604
02:26:26,399 --> 02:26:30,399
that may be in place still will retain

3605
02:26:28,720 --> 02:26:32,399
an easement, but it'll still be on

3606
02:26:30,399 --> 02:26:34,479
private property with a public utilities

3607
02:26:32,399 --> 02:26:38,040
easement on them.

3608
02:26:34,479 --> 02:26:38,040
» Is that how you understand?

3609
02:26:38,399 --> 02:26:41,280
» Yes.

3610
02:26:38,880 --> 02:26:44,080
» And with that access, would that also

3611
02:26:41,280 --> 02:26:46,319
include limitations on things like trees

3612
02:26:44,080 --> 02:26:48,800
being able to be planted?

3613
02:26:46,319 --> 02:26:51,200
» Depends what the public facility

3614
02:26:48,800 --> 02:26:55,439
has as a reasonable. So let's say there

3615
02:26:51,200 --> 02:26:58,560
is a tree blocking access and we and the

3616
02:26:55,439 --> 02:27:00,880
homeowner has rejected our offer to pay

3617
02:26:58,560 --> 02:27:02,720
them to take it down.

3618
02:27:00,880 --> 02:27:05,520
Then where does that stand? If we go

3619
02:27:02,720 --> 02:27:08,399
down to the AD then do we not have any

3620
02:27:05,520 --> 02:27:12,399
ability to ask for that?

3621
02:27:08,399 --> 02:27:15,120
» Yeah. So, and I apologize. It's

3622
02:27:12,399 --> 02:27:16,960
difficult and and I don't mean this to

3623
02:27:15,120 --> 02:27:19,600
be rude, but you're all talking about

3624
02:27:16,960 --> 02:27:20,399
different things and I it's hard to

3625
02:27:19,600 --> 02:27:22,319
answer.

3626
02:27:20,399 --> 02:27:24,880
» Well, the homeowners are facing the same

3627
02:27:22,319 --> 02:27:27,040
things. So, we need to make it

3628
02:27:24,880 --> 02:27:28,000
understandable for them to know what

3629
02:27:27,040 --> 02:27:31,680
they're agreeing to.

3630
02:27:28,000 --> 02:27:34,560
» So, so let me ask kind of clarifying in

3631
02:27:31,680 --> 02:27:37,040
the question you just asked, did we move

3632
02:27:34,560 --> 02:27:40,240
forward with Greg's plan to shrink?

3633
02:27:37,040 --> 02:27:42,640
» Yes. to so if we shrink off our current

3634
02:27:40,240 --> 02:27:46,479
rideway, we've essentially given those

3635
02:27:42,640 --> 02:27:49,680
property owners land and is the city the

3636
02:27:46,479 --> 02:27:52,319
government is no longer able to use that

3637
02:27:49,680 --> 02:27:55,120
19 ft for any other improvement ever

3638
02:27:52,319 --> 02:27:57,680
unless we pay for it later on. Right.

3639
02:27:55,120 --> 02:27:59,280
» The city but utilities would still have

3640
02:27:57,680 --> 02:28:00,560
access to what they need.

3641
02:27:59,280 --> 02:28:03,520
» No, not necessarily.

3642
02:28:00,560 --> 02:28:06,880
» Okay. what's existing. If there needs to

3643
02:28:03,520 --> 02:28:10,240
be other utility improvements,

3644
02:28:06,880 --> 02:28:14,000
we don't have the ability to do that

3645
02:28:10,240 --> 02:28:15,439
if we vacate it. Would that make sense?

3646
02:28:14,000 --> 02:28:17,600
» I'm trying to square that with what I

3647
02:28:15,439 --> 02:28:19,840
know about recent utility updates that

3648
02:28:17,600 --> 02:28:21,520
have been made in our neighborhoods

3649
02:28:19,840 --> 02:28:22,000
» Updates. I'm talking about new

3650
02:28:21,520 --> 02:28:22,479
utilities.

3651
02:28:22,000 --> 02:28:25,760
» I see.

3652
02:28:22,479 --> 02:28:29,439
» Okay. So, so right now, Roie, yeah. Um,

3653
02:28:25,760 --> 02:28:31,280
if we went along with the 99 ft, the

3654
02:28:29,439 --> 02:28:32,560
road itself and all the improvements are

3655
02:28:31,280 --> 02:28:33,600
still going to only be 80.

3656
02:28:32,560 --> 02:28:37,040
» Correct.

3657
02:28:33,600 --> 02:28:38,800
» But the city still owns 99. Is that what

3658
02:28:37,040 --> 02:28:40,560
we're saying?

3659
02:28:38,800 --> 02:28:42,160
» Okay. I just want to make sure I

3660
02:28:40,560 --> 02:28:46,720
understand.

3661
02:28:42,160 --> 02:28:49,680
» So then we would have access to that

3662
02:28:46,720 --> 02:28:50,479
what 9 and 1/2 ft on both sides or just

3663
02:28:49,680 --> 02:28:53,280
one side.

3664
02:28:50,479 --> 02:28:56,319
» Yeah. It it moves, right?

3665
02:28:53,280 --> 02:28:58,479
» Okay. And then that's for utilities and

3666
02:28:56,319 --> 02:29:00,560
access, but we're not going to build on

3667
02:28:58,479 --> 02:29:01,760
anything on it. Right now, we're doing 8

3668
02:29:00,560 --> 02:29:03,120
ft

3669
02:29:01,760 --> 02:29:05,600
» Currently. Yes.

3670
02:29:03,120 --> 02:29:08,800
» But in the future, we could do something

3671
02:29:05,600 --> 02:29:09,280
is what the 99 ft is saying.

3672
02:29:08,800 --> 02:29:11,359
» Mhm.

3673
02:29:09,280 --> 02:29:13,120
» Okay, I understand. Thank you. Okay. I

3674
02:29:11,359 --> 02:29:16,479
just want to make sure. Sorry. Go ahead.

3675
02:29:13,120 --> 02:29:19,040
» So, the purpose of taking action

3676
02:29:16,479 --> 02:29:22,319
of the 80 ft here is not necessarily to

3677
02:29:19,040 --> 02:29:24,800
enable the current project. is looking

3678
02:29:22,319 --> 02:29:29,280
forward and saying we don't want to just

3679
02:29:24,800 --> 02:29:31,280
give out this land today,

3680
02:29:29,280 --> 02:29:33,280
but we could potentially in the future

3681
02:29:31,280 --> 02:29:35,359
if we just leave it be how it is.

3682
02:29:33,280 --> 02:29:37,600
» Yeah. So, and I can't speak for the

3683
02:29:35,359 --> 02:29:40,319
intentions. The way I understand it is

3684
02:29:37,600 --> 02:29:42,080
currently there's a 99 ft rideway.

3685
02:29:40,319 --> 02:29:43,840
There's some property owners who

3686
02:29:42,080 --> 02:29:47,359
disagree with that and that's fine. They

3687
02:29:43,840 --> 02:29:50,080
they can do that. Um

3688
02:29:47,359 --> 02:29:52,800
there's, you know, speaking to that,

3689
02:29:50,080 --> 02:29:54,640
like there is nothing that prohibits

3690
02:29:52,800 --> 02:29:58,880
them currently from trying to clear that

3691
02:29:54,640 --> 02:30:01,040
up in a title action, right? Okay. But

3692
02:29:58,880 --> 02:30:03,680
as I understand it, what Mr. Montgomery

3693
02:30:01,040 --> 02:30:07,120
is talking about is we as a city would

3694
02:30:03,680 --> 02:30:08,880
just say well we think to be nice for

3695
02:30:07,120 --> 02:30:10,560
goodwill for clarification because we

3696
02:30:08,880 --> 02:30:12,399
think it's the right thing to do we're

3697
02:30:10,560 --> 02:30:14,240
just going to make it now on and forever

3698
02:30:12,399 --> 02:30:17,920
more an 80 foot ride right away and

3699
02:30:14,240 --> 02:30:20,160
essentially lose that 19 ft

3700
02:30:17,920 --> 02:30:20,800
» What is forcing us to do that now is

3701
02:30:20,160 --> 02:30:21,920
there anything

3702
02:30:20,800 --> 02:30:24,479
» Nothing this is

3703
02:30:21,920 --> 02:30:26,960
» Okay so this only came up because we

3704
02:30:24,479 --> 02:30:27,760
were asking homeowners to make changes

3705
02:30:26,960 --> 02:30:29,359
to their property

3706
02:30:27,760 --> 02:30:31,120
» This came up because Mr. Montgomery

3707
02:30:29,359 --> 02:30:32,479
thinks it's a good idea unless I'm

3708
02:30:31,120 --> 02:30:34,240
wrong. Yeah.

3709
02:30:32,479 --> 02:30:36,399
» But if we weren't doing this project at

3710
02:30:34,240 --> 02:30:38,000
all, it most likely wouldn't be an issue

3711
02:30:36,399 --> 02:30:39,760
today.

3712
02:30:38,000 --> 02:30:42,399
Well,

3713
02:30:39,760 --> 02:30:44,800
» No, I think some other considerations

3714
02:30:42,399 --> 02:30:48,240
because like for example, one of the

3715
02:30:44,800 --> 02:30:53,200
considerations is if we go out to that

3716
02:30:48,240 --> 02:30:56,160
» 99 and whatever it is feet, you're uh

3717
02:30:53,200 --> 02:30:58,080
right right now we're pretty close to

3718
02:30:56,160 --> 02:31:03,040
some of the people's front porches

3719
02:30:58,080 --> 02:31:05,120
within 80T as is. And they essentially

3720
02:31:03,040 --> 02:31:07,120
can take all the way up to their front

3721
02:31:05,120 --> 02:31:08,880
porch. Okay.

3722
02:31:07,120 --> 02:31:10,319
» So, we weren't planning to shoot that.

3723
02:31:08,880 --> 02:31:12,479
» No, but that's what it's saying that

3724
02:31:10,319 --> 02:31:14,319
they could do with it. And then what

3725
02:31:12,479 --> 02:31:15,920
compensation are they going to get? Cuz

3726
02:31:14,319 --> 02:31:16,399
no one's going to buy that property,

3727
02:31:15,920 --> 02:31:18,720
» Right?

3728
02:31:16,399 --> 02:31:21,840
» No one's going to tear that house down.

3729
02:31:18,720 --> 02:31:26,600
And and so it gives them property rights

3730
02:31:21,840 --> 02:31:26,600
to be able to protect their homes.

3731
02:31:30,000 --> 02:31:35,200
But unfortunately, there's a lot of

3732
02:31:32,960 --> 02:31:36,399
confusion because like I said before, is

3733
02:31:35,200 --> 02:31:38,160
there's

3734
02:31:36,399 --> 02:31:40,800
professional

3735
02:31:38,160 --> 02:31:43,200
surveying companies that have come in

3736
02:31:40,800 --> 02:31:46,800
and done studies of whatever and have

3737
02:31:43,200 --> 02:31:49,120
determined on plats of property that

3738
02:31:46,800 --> 02:31:51,040
they're showing 80 ft. But then there's

3739
02:31:49,120 --> 02:31:53,760
also others

3740
02:31:51,040 --> 02:31:57,200
that show 99 ft, but I don't know the

3741
02:31:53,760 --> 02:31:58,880
exact number between how many show 99

3742
02:31:57,200 --> 02:32:01,280
versus how many show.

3743
02:31:58,880 --> 02:32:03,439
» Yeah, it's interesting. I mean our our

3744
02:32:01,280 --> 02:32:06,160
the professional land surveyor that was

3745
02:32:03,439 --> 02:32:08,720
hired to do this work has done so much

3746
02:32:06,160 --> 02:32:10,880
research and gone back the some of the

3747
02:32:08,720 --> 02:32:13,040
surveys that show 80 were fitted kind of

3748
02:32:10,880 --> 02:32:16,000
to the existing improvements and going

3749
02:32:13,040 --> 02:32:18,560
off the best knowledge they had. Um, so

3750
02:32:16,000 --> 02:32:20,399
there's a few that show the 80. Every

3751
02:32:18,560 --> 02:32:23,280
um, even if you go to the county, every

3752
02:32:20,399 --> 02:32:25,920
ownership plat they have on record the

3753
02:32:23,280 --> 02:32:28,399
plats going back to 1973. And every

3754
02:32:25,920 --> 02:32:31,120
ownership plat from there up to current

3755
02:32:28,399 --> 02:32:32,720
still show the 99 ft because I think

3756
02:32:31,120 --> 02:32:35,040
what it is, it was an old what the

3757
02:32:32,720 --> 02:32:37,439
surveyor said, it's an old county, it

3758
02:32:35,040 --> 02:32:40,479
was an old county road right away. That

3759
02:32:37,439 --> 02:32:44,000
was a six rod road of 99 ft. and there's

3760
02:32:40,479 --> 02:32:47,280
never been a document or a an instrument

3761
02:32:44,000 --> 02:32:49,600
that changed that. So, and then the 80

3762
02:32:47,280 --> 02:32:53,280
foot um state rideway that they talked

3763
02:32:49,600 --> 02:32:56,160
about, UD do had a proposal to widen and

3764
02:32:53,280 --> 02:32:58,560
do a big uh construction project on West

3765
02:32:56,160 --> 02:33:00,560
Harrisville Road back in the 60s. And

3766
02:32:58,560 --> 02:33:03,439
so, they had and on their plans they

3767
02:33:00,560 --> 02:33:06,000
showed a construction project right away

3768
02:33:03,439 --> 02:33:07,600
of 80 ft. And they also showed the 99

3769
02:33:06,000 --> 02:33:09,920
feet, but they were going to occupy the

3770
02:33:07,600 --> 02:33:12,479
80 feet for their project that was

3771
02:33:09,920 --> 02:33:14,399
abandoned in 1969.

3772
02:33:12,479 --> 02:33:16,960
Um, so some of the there was a survey

3773
02:33:14,399 --> 02:33:19,600
mark or find found out there from that

3774
02:33:16,960 --> 02:33:21,760
time when UDOT came in and set that 80

3775
02:33:19,600 --> 02:33:24,720
foot rideway for their construction

3776
02:33:21,760 --> 02:33:26,880
project, but that was within the 99 ft

3777
02:33:24,720 --> 02:33:28,560
rideway. But there weren't ever any

3778
02:33:26,880 --> 02:33:31,439
documents that the surveyor found that

3779
02:33:28,560 --> 02:33:34,240
showed that that was that that rideway

3780
02:33:31,439 --> 02:33:38,160
with ever was actually changed from the

3781
02:33:34,240 --> 02:33:40,319
99 to anything else. So that's um I mean

3782
02:33:38,160 --> 02:33:42,399
that's where the 99 comes from.

3783
02:33:40,319 --> 02:33:45,200
» So how many of the homes that are six

3784
02:33:42,399 --> 02:33:48,479
like what 16 houses that are affected?

3785
02:33:45,200 --> 02:33:50,880
How many of those 16 houses show 99

3786
02:33:48,479 --> 02:33:54,880
show?

3787
02:33:50,880 --> 02:33:56,960
He said, uh, 10 have 10 have legal

3788
02:33:54,880 --> 02:33:59,520
descriptions that agree with the 99 ft

3789
02:33:56,960 --> 02:34:01,840
rideway. Six have newer legal

3790
02:33:59,520 --> 02:34:04,319
descriptions that overlap the 99 ft

3791
02:34:01,840 --> 02:34:06,479
rideway. Several of the properties with

3792
02:34:04,319 --> 02:34:09,840
newer legal descriptions that overlap

3793
02:34:06,479 --> 02:34:11,760
the 99 ft can be researched to find

3794
02:34:09,840 --> 02:34:15,600
historical descriptions of the same

3795
02:34:11,760 --> 02:34:19,120
property that agree with the 99,

3796
02:34:15,600 --> 02:34:20,720
» But none of them go show 8 ft. That's

3797
02:34:19,120 --> 02:34:22,800
» The some of these newer descriptions.

3798
02:34:20,720 --> 02:34:25,359
» A couple of them show you and then a

3799
02:34:22,800 --> 02:34:28,240
couple of them buried.

3800
02:34:25,359 --> 02:34:32,080
» Weirdly enough,

3801
02:34:28,240 --> 02:34:34,000
» So that's kind of the challenge.

3802
02:34:32,080 --> 02:34:35,920
Anyway,

3803
02:34:34,000 --> 02:34:38,720
must be labor because it's not an action

3804
02:34:35,920 --> 02:34:40,640
item that I think is a discussion. I

3805
02:34:38,720 --> 02:34:44,160
think we've discussed it. I think that

3806
02:34:40,640 --> 02:34:48,000
we need to move it on to another

3807
02:34:44,160 --> 02:34:51,840
possible discussion where

3808
02:34:48,000 --> 02:34:54,000
you know even if you want to turn it

3809
02:34:51,840 --> 02:34:57,200
into a public hearing maybe the council

3810
02:34:54,000 --> 02:34:58,800
wants to turn it into a public hearing

3811
02:34:57,200 --> 02:35:00,560
figure out where you want to go with it

3812
02:34:58,800 --> 02:35:03,040
and make no change.

3813
02:35:00,560 --> 02:35:05,520
» Yeah, that'd be that'd be my reason I

3814
02:35:03,040 --> 02:35:06,880
brought this up today is to say here are

3815
02:35:05,520 --> 02:35:11,439
the issues out there. I think it'd be

3816
02:35:06,880 --> 02:35:14,160
important to set a public hearing uh to

3817
02:35:11,439 --> 02:35:16,880
get a a conclusion to run.

3818
02:35:14,160 --> 02:35:18,880
» Okay. So, what we need to have is three

3819
02:35:16,880 --> 02:35:20,160
of you state that we want to do a public

3820
02:35:18,880 --> 02:35:22,640
hearing.

3821
02:35:20,160 --> 02:35:24,479
» So, is that right? Well,

3822
02:35:22,640 --> 02:35:26,720
» I think a motion.

3823
02:35:24,479 --> 02:35:28,800
» Well, you can't you can't make a motion.

3824
02:35:26,720 --> 02:35:31,600
» Oh, this is discussion. Okay.

3825
02:35:28,800 --> 02:35:33,600
» But I guess the question is you have a

3826
02:35:31,600 --> 02:35:38,800
public hearing as I understand it. If

3827
02:35:33,600 --> 02:35:42,200
the plan is to vacate city property,

3828
02:35:38,800 --> 02:35:42,200
you don't really

3829
02:35:45,600 --> 02:35:50,240
» So, in other words, we need a plan. We

3830
02:35:48,160 --> 02:35:52,880
can't just say come in and tell us your

3831
02:35:50,240 --> 02:35:55,520
opinions, yes or no. We need to have a

3832
02:35:52,880 --> 02:35:57,760
plan of action and then hear what people

3833
02:35:55,520 --> 02:35:59,520
» So, if you wanted to schedule a special

3834
02:35:57,760 --> 02:36:01,200
meeting, a town hall type meeting to

3835
02:35:59,520 --> 02:36:04,000
just receive input, you can always do

3836
02:36:01,200 --> 02:36:06,240
that as a council, but an actual public

3837
02:36:04,000 --> 02:36:08,800
hearing on the item that's up for

3838
02:36:06,240 --> 02:36:12,319
discussion is a specific public hearing

3839
02:36:08,800 --> 02:36:14,319
under the state code to vacate city

3840
02:36:12,319 --> 02:36:16,080
property.

3841
02:36:14,319 --> 02:36:17,439
So if you want to do that then you'd

3842
02:36:16,080 --> 02:36:18,800
have to give some direction and staff

3843
02:36:17,439 --> 02:36:21,439
can work on that.

3844
02:36:18,800 --> 02:36:23,439
» So if I'm understanding you correctly we

3845
02:36:21,439 --> 02:36:25,280
could do a town hall that's a notice

3846
02:36:23,439 --> 02:36:27,280
town hall that all of us could be at but

3847
02:36:25,280 --> 02:36:28,479
that would still be a public meeting.

3848
02:36:27,280 --> 02:36:30,160
Absolutely.

3849
02:36:28,479 --> 02:36:31,680
» You can all because Yeah, you can always

3850
02:36:30,160 --> 02:36:34,960
have that special meeting if three of

3851
02:36:31,680 --> 02:36:36,800
you want to skip.

3852
02:36:34,960 --> 02:36:38,319
» And if it were just that type of meeting

3853
02:36:36,800 --> 02:36:40,640
at town hall, we wouldn't necessarily

3854
02:36:38,319 --> 02:36:42,399
need a plan of action or we still would

3855
02:36:40,640 --> 02:36:42,720
» Well, you can't make it you can't

3856
02:36:42,399 --> 02:36:45,040
decision.

3857
02:36:42,720 --> 02:36:46,800
» Yeah, you can't make a decision or pass

3858
02:36:45,040 --> 02:36:48,720
anything at the town hall. The town hall

3859
02:36:46,800 --> 02:36:49,760
would be for public to receive public

3860
02:36:48,720 --> 02:36:51,760
input,

3861
02:36:49,760 --> 02:36:53,200
» Have some discussion, but that's

3862
02:36:51,760 --> 02:36:55,359
» Isn't that also true with the public

3863
02:36:53,200 --> 02:36:56,640
hearing? public hearing.

3864
02:36:55,359 --> 02:36:58,160
» You have to if you're here to do a

3865
02:36:56,640 --> 02:36:59,040
public hearing, you got to have to have

3866
02:36:58,160 --> 02:37:00,479
something

3867
02:36:59,040 --> 02:37:02,000
» A plan like you have,

3868
02:37:00,479 --> 02:37:04,240
» Right? But I'm saying we wouldn't make a

3869
02:37:02,000 --> 02:37:04,960
decision that night with public hearing

3870
02:37:04,240 --> 02:37:07,920
either.

3871
02:37:04,960 --> 02:37:10,240
» No

3872
02:37:07,920 --> 02:37:12,640
code that they're considering has

3873
02:37:10,240 --> 02:37:14,960
» I thought that had to be the only item.

3874
02:37:12,640 --> 02:37:15,600
» No, that's only the tax. Okay. I

3875
02:37:14,960 --> 02:37:18,160
apologize.

3876
02:37:15,600 --> 02:37:19,680
» Yeah. And the other thing to consider

3877
02:37:18,160 --> 02:37:21,359
like

3878
02:37:19,680 --> 02:37:25,439
Montgomery said, you can write, you can

3879
02:37:21,359 --> 02:37:27,520
do this. It would as far as the roadway

3880
02:37:25,439 --> 02:37:30,880
construction project

3881
02:37:27,520 --> 02:37:35,120
that would obviously change all the doc

3882
02:37:30,880 --> 02:37:37,359
the rightway documents all the um um I

3883
02:37:35,120 --> 02:37:41,359
guess easements or temporary

3884
02:37:37,359 --> 02:37:43,920
construction easements. Um so that that

3885
02:37:41,359 --> 02:37:46,080
would have a big impact on the project

3886
02:37:43,920 --> 02:37:47,280
and being able to move forward. Now,

3887
02:37:46,080 --> 02:37:50,479
there's nothing to say, I don't think,

3888
02:37:47,280 --> 02:37:53,359
that you couldn't do that after another

3889
02:37:50,479 --> 02:37:54,800
project or after it's under construction

3890
02:37:53,359 --> 02:37:56,720
because it because the improvements

3891
02:37:54,800 --> 02:38:00,640
aren't changing either way, right? We're

3892
02:37:56,720 --> 02:38:02,399
not we're not either way. We're not uh

3893
02:38:00,640 --> 02:38:04,319
saying that the design of the roadway is

3894
02:38:02,399 --> 02:38:06,399
going to change. Um

3895
02:38:04,319 --> 02:38:07,359
» Because as of right now, you're saying

3896
02:38:06,399 --> 02:38:09,680
» All the doc Yeah.

3897
02:38:07,359 --> 02:38:10,960
» All the documents say that we own 99 ft.

3898
02:38:09,680 --> 02:38:11,520
» Yeah. Right. So, they're all based off

3899
02:38:10,960 --> 02:38:13,600
of that.

3900
02:38:11,520 --> 02:38:14,319
» So, right now, we own the land is what

3901
02:38:13,600 --> 02:38:17,760
it's saying,

3902
02:38:14,319 --> 02:38:21,280
» Right? And then if they do the 80 ft,

3903
02:38:17,760 --> 02:38:23,200
we're we want to do 80 ft either way.

3904
02:38:21,280 --> 02:38:25,439
» And we can do that whether or not

3905
02:38:23,200 --> 02:38:26,000
» Building

3906
02:38:25,439 --> 02:38:26,800
anything.

3907
02:38:26,000 --> 02:38:27,439
» You know what I'm saying?

3908
02:38:26,800 --> 02:38:30,720
» Yeah.

3909
02:38:27,439 --> 02:38:32,319
» But if we change it to 80 ft, then

3910
02:38:30,720 --> 02:38:34,640
you're saying we're giving the

3911
02:38:32,319 --> 02:38:37,200
homeowners land back is what you

3912
02:38:34,640 --> 02:38:37,760
mentioned, right, Roie?

3913
02:38:37,200 --> 02:38:39,120
» So

3914
02:38:37,760 --> 02:38:39,520
» I just want to make sure I understand.

3915
02:38:39,120 --> 02:38:41,920
I'm sorry.

3916
02:38:39,520 --> 02:38:44,560
» Yeah. So you could You're giving the

3917
02:38:41,920 --> 02:38:45,200
property owners lands.

3918
02:38:44,560 --> 02:38:46,960
Yes.

3919
02:38:45,200 --> 02:38:49,680
» Okay.

3920
02:38:46,960 --> 02:38:51,439
» Yeah. And why that matters is now UD's

3921
02:38:49,680 --> 02:38:52,880
rightway team to comply not only with

3922
02:38:51,439 --> 02:38:53,920
their standards but also the federal

3923
02:38:52,880 --> 02:38:56,560
standards

3924
02:38:53,920 --> 02:38:56,960
» Have to redo every right of way.

3925
02:38:56,560 --> 02:39:00,319
» Yes.

3926
02:38:56,960 --> 02:39:02,319
» And Matt's nicer than I you can do that.

3927
02:39:00,319 --> 02:39:04,399
It will mess up the project and it may

3928
02:39:02,319 --> 02:39:05,280
or may not happen

3929
02:39:04,399 --> 02:39:06,240
currently.

3930
02:39:05,280 --> 02:39:07,680
» Right.

3931
02:39:06,240 --> 02:39:10,680
» That's just the reality of this

3932
02:39:07,680 --> 02:39:10,680
discussion.

3933
02:39:10,960 --> 02:39:17,520
» Could I can I ask one question? So you

3934
02:39:13,840 --> 02:39:20,319
we talked about the 80oot rideway and if

3935
02:39:17,520 --> 02:39:22,479
we would if we approved a reduction to

3936
02:39:20,319 --> 02:39:25,200
80ft rideway

3937
02:39:22,479 --> 02:39:29,520
that would be from center line is the

3938
02:39:25,200 --> 02:39:34,040
design done such that the 80oot is 40 ft

3939
02:39:29,520 --> 02:39:34,040
on each side of the center line.

3940
02:39:35,359 --> 02:39:40,200
Yeah, I'm trying to remember. Um

3941
02:39:40,880 --> 02:39:46,240
cuz I think the center line of the

3942
02:39:42,800 --> 02:39:48,479
rideway, so for example,

3943
02:39:46,240 --> 02:39:51,040
where the road where the asphalt sits

3944
02:39:48,479 --> 02:39:54,720
now and the and the double yellow

3945
02:39:51,040 --> 02:39:59,479
stripe, the center line of the rideway

3946
02:39:54,720 --> 02:39:59,479
is about one or two feet north.

3947
02:39:59,520 --> 02:40:05,680
And so

3948
02:40:02,479 --> 02:40:09,840
of of that line.

3949
02:40:05,680 --> 02:40:14,080
So the improvements are being made where

3950
02:40:09,840 --> 02:40:16,160
50 ft of asphalt is beginning at the lip

3951
02:40:14,080 --> 02:40:19,280
of the curbon gutter on the north side

3952
02:40:16,160 --> 02:40:22,479
cuz the north side curb gutter staying

3953
02:40:19,280 --> 02:40:26,080
and then going 50 ft across.

3954
02:40:22,479 --> 02:40:28,720
Anyway, so it's not a perfect, you know,

3955
02:40:26,080 --> 02:40:33,319
uh 40 and 40, I guess.

3956
02:40:28,720 --> 02:40:33,319
Um, as far as center of the roadway,

3957
02:40:33,359 --> 02:40:39,120
it's one or two feet off

3958
02:40:36,960 --> 02:40:41,200
» Favoring

3959
02:40:39,120 --> 02:40:45,640
when I say favoring the south, less

3960
02:40:41,200 --> 02:40:45,640
impacting the south than the north.

3961
02:40:47,040 --> 02:40:50,960
» Let's just say

3962
02:40:48,240 --> 02:40:52,080
» Less impacting the north than the south

3963
02:40:50,960 --> 02:40:53,280
» Because all the work is going to be

3964
02:40:52,080 --> 02:40:54,560
taking place on the south side. Well,

3965
02:40:53,280 --> 02:40:56,399
all the work's going to be taking place

3966
02:40:54,560 --> 02:40:59,439
on the south side, but I'm saying we're

3967
02:40:56,399 --> 02:41:00,720
we're one or two feet hugging the road

3968
02:40:59,439 --> 02:41:01,280
to the north side.

3969
02:41:00,720 --> 02:41:03,200
» Oh, okay.

3970
02:41:01,280 --> 02:41:06,160
» But it's saying, yeah, if it got

3971
02:41:03,200 --> 02:41:08,000
changed, the rideway would actually be

3972
02:41:06,160 --> 02:41:10,960
further to the north of the north

3973
02:41:08,000 --> 02:41:12,560
sidewalk than it would be the south

3974
02:41:10,960 --> 02:41:12,960
sidewalk, right?

3975
02:41:12,560 --> 02:41:17,359
» Yeah.

3976
02:41:12,960 --> 02:41:18,560
» It's not centered. It's not centered

3977
02:41:17,359 --> 02:41:21,200
perfectly,

3978
02:41:18,560 --> 02:41:25,040
» But the improvements like uh I think

3979
02:41:21,200 --> 02:41:27,200
that 80 foot line lands a foot or so

3980
02:41:25,040 --> 02:41:29,200
behind the sidewalk. Our proposed

3981
02:41:27,200 --> 02:41:32,200
improvements, right? That sound right?

3982
02:41:29,200 --> 02:41:32,200
» Yeah.

3983
02:41:33,760 --> 02:41:38,319
If we choose, excuse me, if we choose

3984
02:41:35,920 --> 02:41:40,560
not to vacate the property and the

3985
02:41:38,319 --> 02:41:42,319
homeowners choose not to sign any of our

3986
02:41:40,560 --> 02:41:44,319
documents,

3987
02:41:42,319 --> 02:41:46,479
do we have what happens with the

3988
02:41:44,319 --> 02:41:48,560
project? Do we have some sort of feud

3989
02:41:46,479 --> 02:41:50,880
going on there or is it just we still

3990
02:41:48,560 --> 02:41:54,080
can do the project and the homeowners

3991
02:41:50,880 --> 02:41:57,280
just don't get compensation?

3992
02:41:54,080 --> 02:42:00,399
So of the three items that we discussed,

3993
02:41:57,280 --> 02:42:04,319
the temporary easement, the payment for

3994
02:42:00,399 --> 02:42:06,319
trees and then the so they and then the

3995
02:42:04,319 --> 02:42:08,560
third one would be signing of the

3996
02:42:06,319 --> 02:42:10,960
overlapping rideway for the the five

3997
02:42:08,560 --> 02:42:13,040
that have that issue.

3998
02:42:10,960 --> 02:42:17,120
Um so we wouldn't do the overlapping

3999
02:42:13,040 --> 02:42:18,560
rightway. We wouldn't sign that. Um,

4000
02:42:17,120 --> 02:42:20,399
some people don't want to be paid for

4001
02:42:18,560 --> 02:42:22,640
their trees,

4002
02:42:20,399 --> 02:42:25,680
but we wouldn't be able to get on their

4003
02:42:22,640 --> 02:42:27,760
property and tie in

4004
02:42:25,680 --> 02:42:30,760
their driveways. So, that would be the

4005
02:42:27,760 --> 02:42:30,760
showstopper.

4006
02:42:30,880 --> 02:42:36,479
» We go to the combination process for

4007
02:42:33,439 --> 02:42:39,280
that temporary construction.

4008
02:42:36,479 --> 02:42:41,040
And the goal of that would then through

4009
02:42:39,280 --> 02:42:44,960
condemnation,

4010
02:42:41,040 --> 02:42:47,920
you would have somebody basically

4011
02:42:44,960 --> 02:42:50,560
say yes or no that that

4012
02:42:47,920 --> 02:42:53,560
we allow the contractor to tie in your

4013
02:42:50,560 --> 02:42:53,560
driveway,

4014
02:42:54,560 --> 02:43:00,240
» Which would be a separate a follow-up

4015
02:42:58,399 --> 02:43:03,640
request separate from what requests have

4016
02:43:00,240 --> 02:43:03,640
already been made.

4017
02:43:03,920 --> 02:43:08,800
No, it would be not a se it'd be the

4018
02:43:06,560 --> 02:43:11,680
same request, but then it goes through a

4019
02:43:08,800 --> 02:43:12,800
more formal judge hearing process where

4020
02:43:11,680 --> 02:43:14,800
a judge decides.

4021
02:43:12,800 --> 02:43:15,280
» So then the homework has to make their

4022
02:43:14,800 --> 02:43:15,760
case.

4023
02:43:15,280 --> 02:43:19,080
» Yeah.

4024
02:43:15,760 --> 02:43:19,080
» Have a judge.

4025
02:43:19,280 --> 02:43:25,439
» So the temporary easement is what we

4026
02:43:21,600 --> 02:43:28,479
need to to do the prop project. We don't

4027
02:43:25,439 --> 02:43:30,160
need any of the other two things,

4028
02:43:28,479 --> 02:43:32,720
» But we could potentially get that

4029
02:43:30,160 --> 02:43:36,399
without vacating the property and

4030
02:43:32,720 --> 02:43:38,560
without forcing them to sign the deed.

4031
02:43:36,399 --> 02:43:40,240
» And areas has this all been clearly

4032
02:43:38,560 --> 02:43:40,800
explained to the homeowners?

4033
02:43:40,240 --> 02:43:41,920
» No.

4034
02:43:40,800 --> 02:43:44,479
» Okay.

4035
02:43:41,920 --> 02:43:47,040
» No, we've met with each homeowner and

4036
02:43:44,479 --> 02:43:49,760
discussed those options. In the

4037
02:43:47,040 --> 02:43:52,000
beginning, it was we needed them to sign

4038
02:43:49,760 --> 02:43:54,880
the deed, but we've gone back and met

4039
02:43:52,000 --> 02:43:58,319
with the federal agency that's helping

4040
02:43:54,880 --> 02:44:01,279
us and um asked them if we had to do

4041
02:43:58,319 --> 02:44:02,880
that, and the answer was no.

4042
02:44:01,279 --> 02:44:05,600
So,

4043
02:44:02,880 --> 02:44:08,319
» So those those property owners you can

4044
02:44:05,600 --> 02:44:09,840
go back to and say, "We don't if you

4045
02:44:08,319 --> 02:44:11,439
don't want to sign the warranty deal, we

4046
02:44:09,840 --> 02:44:12,720
don't need that." But they still could

4047
02:44:11,439 --> 02:44:14,880
sign the

4048
02:44:12,720 --> 02:44:18,680
» Construction easement and compensation

4049
02:44:14,880 --> 02:44:18,680
estimate. Yeah,

4050
02:44:20,000 --> 02:44:25,040
» Seems important that we discuss with

4051
02:44:22,399 --> 02:44:26,960
them instead of just clinging to our

4052
02:44:25,040 --> 02:44:28,800
legal like we have legal resources that

4053
02:44:26,960 --> 02:44:31,439
they don't have necessarily. So,

4054
02:44:28,800 --> 02:44:32,800
» Right. And our acquisition agent Shannon

4055
02:44:31,439 --> 02:44:35,120
that's been mentioned, she's been

4056
02:44:32,800 --> 02:44:38,120
meeting regularly with these property

4057
02:44:35,120 --> 02:44:38,120
owners.

4058
02:44:38,160 --> 02:44:40,319
» I know she's trying to reach out to all

4059
02:44:39,920 --> 02:44:42,880
of them.

4060
02:44:40,319 --> 02:44:45,520
» Yeah. Each time we get new information,

4061
02:44:42,880 --> 02:44:47,840
we try to update everybody.

4062
02:44:45,520 --> 02:44:51,240
I'm sure it's so confusing though people

4063
02:44:47,840 --> 02:44:51,240
who aren't lawyers.

4064
02:44:51,520 --> 02:44:54,520
» Okay.

4065
02:44:55,279 --> 02:45:00,640
» You want to do any

4066
02:44:57,520 --> 02:45:03,680
suggestions or you just want to

4067
02:45:00,640 --> 02:45:06,080
move on to the next item on the agenda.

4068
02:45:03,680 --> 02:45:08,640
We've had a pretty decent discussion.

4069
02:45:06,080 --> 02:45:10,240
I'm always open to town hall idea. I

4070
02:45:08,640 --> 02:45:14,120
don't know if anyone else. I am

4071
02:45:10,240 --> 02:45:14,120
definitely either that or

4072
02:45:14,880 --> 02:45:22,359
me too.

4073
02:45:18,000 --> 02:45:22,359
» We got three to do the town hall

4074
02:45:25,520 --> 02:45:29,359
like

4075
02:45:27,040 --> 02:45:31,520
» Before it gets cold

4076
02:45:29,359 --> 02:45:34,000
before.

4077
02:45:31,520 --> 02:45:34,880
» Well, maybe if we get a lot of people

4078
02:45:34,000 --> 02:45:36,319
here,

4079
02:45:34,880 --> 02:45:36,720
» This won't be a big enough place to

4080
02:45:36,319 --> 02:45:42,200
hold.

4081
02:45:36,720 --> 02:45:42,200
» We could do the cabin or Let's

4082
02:45:45,439 --> 02:45:50,760
say you guys have a time or date when

4083
02:45:47,120 --> 02:45:50,760
you'd like to do that.

4084
02:45:52,399 --> 02:45:56,000
» Tuesday night just because that's what

4085
02:45:53,840 --> 02:45:57,120
we normally do.

4086
02:45:56,000 --> 02:45:59,600
» We just can't do it.

4087
02:45:57,120 --> 02:46:00,399
» How much notice time is required?

4088
02:45:59,600 --> 02:46:03,880
» 24 hours.

4089
02:46:00,399 --> 02:46:03,880
» 24 hours

4090
02:46:04,240 --> 02:46:09,520
» For us to We give more notice than that

4091
02:46:07,120 --> 02:46:12,080
regularly. The state law requires 24

4092
02:46:09,520 --> 02:46:14,640
hours.

4093
02:46:12,080 --> 02:46:18,600
» How about September 22nd in two weeks?

4094
02:46:14,640 --> 02:46:18,600
» Say 22nd and 29th.

4095
02:46:19,120 --> 02:46:22,120
» 22.

4096
02:46:22,960 --> 02:46:26,520
How about the 22nd?

4097
02:46:26,560 --> 02:46:31,040
» Will we have the court?

4098
02:46:28,000 --> 02:46:31,840
» Yeah, I can be there.

4099
02:46:31,040 --> 02:46:37,200
» All right.

4100
02:46:31,840 --> 02:46:40,640
» Okay. So, the 22nd we'll do that.

4101
02:46:37,200 --> 02:46:44,120
Okay. Item number C, the North View Fire

4102
02:46:40,640 --> 02:46:44,120
Station presentation.

4103
02:46:44,240 --> 02:46:48,600
Cody, if you want to run away, you can.

4104
02:46:48,720 --> 02:46:52,640
» You guys really know how to throw a

4105
02:46:50,080 --> 02:46:55,640
party. I'll tell you. Staying up past my

4106
02:46:52,640 --> 02:46:55,640
bedtime.

4107
02:46:55,680 --> 02:47:01,880
» I should have gave you a warning.

4108
02:46:57,359 --> 02:47:01,880
» No, I appreciate you guys. All right.

4109
02:47:02,240 --> 02:47:07,439
» Talking too long. I think it's

4110
02:47:04,640 --> 02:47:07,439
important.

4111
02:47:13,200 --> 02:47:18,240
extra copy.

4112
02:47:15,840 --> 02:47:23,560
» You have a clicker.

4113
02:47:18,240 --> 02:47:23,560
» It's PDF. So, scroll down.

4114
02:47:24,560 --> 02:47:27,520
» All right. I'll do my best to stay

4115
02:47:25,760 --> 02:47:29,359
behind this. I'm kind of a walker when I

4116
02:47:27,520 --> 02:47:31,920
talk. So, if I start straying away too

4117
02:47:29,359 --> 02:47:35,240
much, Jay will be after. Maybe you

4118
02:47:31,920 --> 02:47:35,240
should. Of course.

4119
02:47:36,080 --> 02:47:39,680
All right. Thanks for uh making a little

4120
02:47:37,439 --> 02:47:41,520
bit of time. I'm uh pleased to accept

4121
02:47:39,680 --> 02:47:44,399
the invitation from the mayor. Went with

4122
02:47:41,520 --> 02:47:46,640
the mayor and Jenny last week to give

4123
02:47:44,399 --> 02:47:48,240
them an update on what our plans are and

4124
02:47:46,640 --> 02:47:50,880
and uh give the mayor kind of up to

4125
02:47:48,240 --> 02:47:52,640
speed with how this process has evolved.

4126
02:47:50,880 --> 02:47:54,479
There's a lot of history in the last 3

4127
02:47:52,640 --> 02:47:56,640
years. And they suggested that I come

4128
02:47:54,479 --> 02:47:59,359
and and give you guys kind of the same

4129
02:47:56,640 --> 02:48:01,439
uh education on on process history and

4130
02:47:59,359 --> 02:48:03,359
and what we have planned and kind of

4131
02:48:01,439 --> 02:48:04,720
what our next steps are. So, please keep

4132
02:48:03,359 --> 02:48:06,800
this informal if you guys have any

4133
02:48:04,720 --> 02:48:10,000
questions. I'll try to I'll try to move

4134
02:48:06,800 --> 02:48:12,560
quick. Got more to do than this. Looks

4135
02:48:10,000 --> 02:48:15,040
like. All right. So, all this started I

4136
02:48:12,560 --> 02:48:16,720
I came up to North View. I spent 25

4137
02:48:15,040 --> 02:48:19,439
years down in the Salt Lake Valley in

4138
02:48:16,720 --> 02:48:21,680
West Jordan here. Uh ton of experience

4139
02:48:19,439 --> 02:48:22,960
in strategic planning response analysis.

4140
02:48:21,680 --> 02:48:24,640
So, of course, that's the first thing I

4141
02:48:22,960 --> 02:48:27,120
did when I got here was dive into the

4142
02:48:24,640 --> 02:48:29,439
resource analysis. Look at our response.

4143
02:48:27,120 --> 02:48:31,680
How are we doing? We measure response

4144
02:48:29,439 --> 02:48:33,840
and concentration, distribution, and

4145
02:48:31,680 --> 02:48:35,120
reliability. Again, I won't go too far

4146
02:48:33,840 --> 02:48:37,040
into those, but that's sort of the the

4147
02:48:35,120 --> 02:48:39,120
framework of the things we talk about as

4148
02:48:37,040 --> 02:48:41,520
we look at how good is your service, how

4149
02:48:39,120 --> 02:48:43,680
well are we meeting benchmarks and and

4150
02:48:41,520 --> 02:48:45,359
uh national recommendations. So, one of

4151
02:48:43,680 --> 02:48:48,800
the first things we do is we try to do

4152
02:48:45,359 --> 02:48:50,399
the the thing that makes the most sense,

4153
02:48:48,800 --> 02:48:51,760
probably anybody, even without training,

4154
02:48:50,399 --> 02:48:54,319
is we want to look at where our calls

4155
02:48:51,760 --> 02:48:55,920
are. So distribution talks about are our

4156
02:48:54,319 --> 02:48:57,600
resources located in the correct

4157
02:48:55,920 --> 02:48:59,600
location to respond to where our

4158
02:48:57,600 --> 02:49:01,359
emergencies are. So just like in a war

4159
02:48:59,600 --> 02:49:03,040
if you have an enemy in a certain area

4160
02:49:01,359 --> 02:49:04,479
you'd expect to have contact. You would

4161
02:49:03,040 --> 02:49:06,479
want to have your people and your

4162
02:49:04,479 --> 02:49:07,920
resources in those areas. So this is

4163
02:49:06,479 --> 02:49:09,520
what's called a heat map. So you can see

4164
02:49:07,920 --> 02:49:11,760
the hotter areas are highest

4165
02:49:09,520 --> 02:49:14,000
concentration of emergence. So that is

4166
02:49:11,760 --> 02:49:15,760
lights and siren responses only. So that

4167
02:49:14,000 --> 02:49:17,520
is not anything that we would run

4168
02:49:15,760 --> 02:49:19,520
without lights and sirens too. So this

4169
02:49:17,520 --> 02:49:22,000
is a true emergency as coded by

4170
02:49:19,520 --> 02:49:24,800
dispatch. those areas show up for

4171
02:49:22,000 --> 02:49:26,479
medical in that high heat area. So you

4172
02:49:24,800 --> 02:49:29,920
can see in the district here that our

4173
02:49:26,479 --> 02:49:32,640
highest heat area, our most focus point

4174
02:49:29,920 --> 02:49:34,800
concentrated call volume is just right

4175
02:49:32,640 --> 02:49:36,960
around station 21 in North Odin and just

4176
02:49:34,800 --> 02:49:39,120
below and then up and down the 89

4177
02:49:36,960 --> 02:49:41,120
corridor. You can see that the little

4178
02:49:39,120 --> 02:49:43,040
icons represent the red ones, the fire

4179
02:49:41,120 --> 02:49:45,840
stations that currently exist. The white

4180
02:49:43,040 --> 02:49:49,600
ones are fire call. So heat is medical.

4181
02:49:45,840 --> 02:49:52,160
The white icons are fire.

4182
02:49:49,600 --> 02:49:54,240
Uh the next thing we look at is how long

4183
02:49:52,160 --> 02:49:56,319
not only are our resources located in

4184
02:49:54,240 --> 02:49:58,319
the correct location, but that dictates

4185
02:49:56,319 --> 02:50:00,000
how long it takes our resources to get

4186
02:49:58,319 --> 02:50:03,279
to an emergency. So that's when we start

4187
02:50:00,000 --> 02:50:05,600
to talk travel. NFPA 1750 says that we

4188
02:50:03,279 --> 02:50:08,479
should be able to get from our station

4189
02:50:05,600 --> 02:50:09,920
facility to your emergency in 4 minutes

4190
02:50:08,479 --> 02:50:11,279
or less. Now, that doesn't include the

4191
02:50:09,920 --> 02:50:12,560
time it takes us to get to the trucks,

4192
02:50:11,279 --> 02:50:14,080
and it doesn't include the time that it

4193
02:50:12,560 --> 02:50:16,240
takes for the call takers and dispatch

4194
02:50:14,080 --> 02:50:18,560
to take care information. This goes from

4195
02:50:16,240 --> 02:50:20,399
the time that our fire crews get into

4196
02:50:18,560 --> 02:50:21,680
the truck, they get on the radio and say

4197
02:50:20,399 --> 02:50:23,840
they're on their way and they're rolling

4198
02:50:21,680 --> 02:50:25,279
out the door, 4 minutes or less from the

4199
02:50:23,840 --> 02:50:26,720
time they roll out the door to the time

4200
02:50:25,279 --> 02:50:28,560
they set the park break at the

4201
02:50:26,720 --> 02:50:30,399
emergency. So then we look at that and

4202
02:50:28,560 --> 02:50:33,760
you can see in the gray out areas that's

4203
02:50:30,399 --> 02:50:37,279
the theoretical 4-minute travel or two

4204
02:50:33,760 --> 02:50:38,960
uh stations that exist currently um

4205
02:50:37,279 --> 02:50:41,359
based on computer modeling. And then you

4206
02:50:38,960 --> 02:50:44,240
can see in the red and green the red

4207
02:50:41,359 --> 02:50:46,560
dots are the actual emergent calls. So

4208
02:50:44,240 --> 02:50:48,800
again, those lights and sirens responses

4209
02:50:46,560 --> 02:50:50,160
that we took longer than 4 minutes to

4210
02:50:48,800 --> 02:50:53,279
get to and the green ones are the ones

4211
02:50:50,160 --> 02:50:54,399
that we made it in 4 minutes or less. So

4212
02:50:53,279 --> 02:50:56,160
you can see and we'll kind of touch on

4213
02:50:54,399 --> 02:50:57,359
this later, but you can see and this was

4214
02:50:56,160 --> 02:51:00,399
kind of a problem we had to figure out

4215
02:50:57,359 --> 02:51:03,120
was we expected to see outside of course

4216
02:51:00,399 --> 02:51:04,800
the theoretical uh computer generated

4217
02:51:03,120 --> 02:51:06,720
travel areas. We expected to see those

4218
02:51:04,800 --> 02:51:08,319
red areas, right? Because computer says

4219
02:51:06,720 --> 02:51:10,560
we can't get from our fire station to

4220
02:51:08,319 --> 02:51:12,399
that area in 4 minutes or less. So

4221
02:51:10,560 --> 02:51:14,000
predictably up and down the 89 corridor

4222
02:51:12,399 --> 02:51:15,600
all the way down to kind of cut off

4223
02:51:14,000 --> 02:51:17,200
there down to the Walmart area we

4224
02:51:15,600 --> 02:51:18,399
struggled to get to. And then the other

4225
02:51:17,200 --> 02:51:19,920
area that popped up that we weren't

4226
02:51:18,399 --> 02:51:21,520
really anticipating as much was up there

4227
02:51:19,920 --> 02:51:24,000
in the north area. As you can see that

4228
02:51:21,520 --> 02:51:26,080
big pocket all the way up in the what

4229
02:51:24,000 --> 02:51:28,000
would that be? The northeast corner

4230
02:51:26,080 --> 02:51:30,560
where we're quite regularly and

4231
02:51:28,000 --> 02:51:32,160
predictably missing that formative

4232
02:51:30,560 --> 02:51:33,920
benchmark. So we sort of look at that

4233
02:51:32,160 --> 02:51:35,760
and say okay well we need more fire

4234
02:51:33,920 --> 02:51:37,840
stations clearly. So where should those

4235
02:51:35,760 --> 02:51:39,120
resources be? So we looked at each one

4236
02:51:37,840 --> 02:51:40,880
of these areas. We looked at planning

4237
02:51:39,120 --> 02:51:43,120
and zoning.

4238
02:51:40,880 --> 02:51:45,520
Then we also looked at the uh insurance

4239
02:51:43,120 --> 02:51:48,000
service offic's recommendation for 1 and

4240
02:51:45,520 --> 02:51:50,160
a half road miles traveled. So it's

4241
02:51:48,000 --> 02:51:52,880
similar to 4-minute travel uh but down

4242
02:51:50,160 --> 02:51:55,279
on road mile rather than on travel time.

4243
02:51:52,880 --> 02:51:58,479
So they located they they show that we

4244
02:51:55,279 --> 02:52:00,960
get to the turquoise blue areas in that

4245
02:51:58,479 --> 02:52:03,200
1.5 road mile and that affects people's

4246
02:52:00,960 --> 02:52:05,680
fire insurance rates. So based on that

4247
02:52:03,200 --> 02:52:08,720
we identified three potential locations

4248
02:52:05,680 --> 02:52:10,800
for future fire station. So up in the

4249
02:52:08,720 --> 02:52:12,880
northeast corner of North Aen would be

4250
02:52:10,800 --> 02:52:14,319
planning zone 25 as we refer to it now

4251
02:52:12,880 --> 02:52:17,120
that we track data in that area.

4252
02:52:14,319 --> 02:52:19,359
Planning zone 24 further up on 89 and

4253
02:52:17,120 --> 02:52:21,840
then planning zone 23 right down here in

4254
02:52:19,359 --> 02:52:23,359
Harrisville.

4255
02:52:21,840 --> 02:52:24,960
But when we do this we not only take

4256
02:52:23,359 --> 02:52:26,319
into consideration future planning and

4257
02:52:24,960 --> 02:52:28,000
zoning but we also look at future

4258
02:52:26,319 --> 02:52:29,680
infrastructure projects. So we know that

4259
02:52:28,000 --> 02:52:32,160
the skyline project and Mount Road

4260
02:52:29,680 --> 02:52:34,880
projects are underway. uh talking with

4261
02:52:32,160 --> 02:52:36,720
North Ogden and talking to the county,

4262
02:52:34,880 --> 02:52:38,720
uh Mount Road is expected to be

4263
02:52:36,720 --> 02:52:40,720
completed prior to 2032 and they're

4264
02:52:38,720 --> 02:52:43,760
saying it's it's on track to be maybe

4265
02:52:40,720 --> 02:52:45,120
completed by 2030. Skyline Road is

4266
02:52:43,760 --> 02:52:46,960
predicted to come back down. It's going

4267
02:52:45,120 --> 02:52:48,319
to take a little bit longer to help us

4268
02:52:46,960 --> 02:52:51,040
out in that area that we're missing on

4269
02:52:48,319 --> 02:52:53,359
North 89. We felt like it was premature

4270
02:52:51,040 --> 02:52:55,120
to try to

4271
02:52:53,359 --> 02:52:57,120
move forward with trying to construct a

4272
02:52:55,120 --> 02:52:59,359
station up in that planning zone 25 area

4273
02:52:57,120 --> 02:53:01,279
in North Ogden until we see what happens

4274
02:52:59,359 --> 02:53:03,359
with that traffic. We want to see what

4275
02:53:01,279 --> 02:53:05,120
impact that future infrastructure has on

4276
02:53:03,359 --> 02:53:09,479
our response times in that area. You can

4277
02:53:05,120 --> 02:53:09,479
see again on that theoretical travel,

4278
02:53:09,520 --> 02:53:13,359
how much larger the travel distance is

4279
02:53:11,359 --> 02:53:16,000
for station 21, the trucks are the same

4280
02:53:13,359 --> 02:53:17,600
speed trucks. Uh but because the road

4281
02:53:16,000 --> 02:53:18,640
structures are just put together a

4282
02:53:17,600 --> 02:53:21,680
little bit differently. We don't have

4283
02:53:18,640 --> 02:53:23,840
any big all the way through roads. Uh

4284
02:53:21,680 --> 02:53:25,439
really constricts the the reach of

4285
02:53:23,840 --> 02:53:26,640
station 22. Now it still needs to be

4286
02:53:25,439 --> 02:53:27,840
there. We have a ton of risk there and

4287
02:53:26,640 --> 02:53:29,680
the citizens up there observe it and

4288
02:53:27,840 --> 02:53:32,000
they have wildland interface. uh risk

4289
02:53:29,680 --> 02:53:34,880
that we have to deal with, but we do

4290
02:53:32,000 --> 02:53:36,399
think it was is prudent to wait and see

4291
02:53:34,880 --> 02:53:38,000
what impact Mountain Road has on that

4292
02:53:36,399 --> 02:53:40,160
area before we start moving forward with

4293
02:53:38,000 --> 02:53:41,520
plans and put something there. So, that

4294
02:53:40,160 --> 02:53:43,040
really helped us narrow it down. And

4295
02:53:41,520 --> 02:53:45,439
this all happened right about the same

4296
02:53:43,040 --> 02:53:48,080
time that Harrisville approached us 3

4297
02:53:45,439 --> 02:53:50,960
years ago, almost exactly maybe a month

4298
02:53:48,080 --> 02:53:52,720
after I got here, uh to talk about the

4299
02:53:50,960 --> 02:53:54,479
government complex and invite us to be a

4300
02:53:52,720 --> 02:53:56,479
member of that. Now, that's nothing new.

4301
02:53:54,479 --> 02:53:57,760
a fire station from in Harrisville, from

4302
02:53:56,479 --> 02:54:00,720
what I understand, has been talked about

4303
02:53:57,760 --> 02:54:02,000
since 1981. Since Harrisville joined the

4304
02:54:00,720 --> 02:54:03,840
fire district, that was something that

4305
02:54:02,000 --> 02:54:05,520
people have wanted and the citizens of

4306
02:54:03,840 --> 02:54:07,439
Harrisville been taxpaying members of

4307
02:54:05,520 --> 02:54:09,840
the fire district since then. Uh, and

4308
02:54:07,439 --> 02:54:12,080
funding stations, you know, 21 and 22 in

4309
02:54:09,840 --> 02:54:13,359
North Pleas. So, we looked at that

4310
02:54:12,080 --> 02:54:14,960
again. We went back to our response

4311
02:54:13,359 --> 02:54:18,240
analysis. We said, "You know what? Based

4312
02:54:14,960 --> 02:54:20,800
on um our inclination to wait and see

4313
02:54:18,240 --> 02:54:23,439
what impacts the Mountain Road project

4314
02:54:20,800 --> 02:54:24,880
has at station 25, station 23 in

4315
02:54:23,439 --> 02:54:26,560
Harrisville looks like the correct

4316
02:54:24,880 --> 02:54:29,040
location. Let's study that a little bit

4317
02:54:26,560 --> 02:54:30,240
more." Again, we looked at our travel

4318
02:54:29,040 --> 02:54:32,399
and I'll get to that just a little bit

4319
02:54:30,240 --> 02:54:34,560
more. So, we began meeting with the

4320
02:54:32,399 --> 02:54:37,680
Harrisville team as they designed their

4321
02:54:34,560 --> 02:54:40,319
project and initially um it was a

4322
02:54:37,680 --> 02:54:43,040
combined building concept. So the idea

4323
02:54:40,319 --> 02:54:45,760
was try to save the taxpayers some

4324
02:54:43,040 --> 02:54:48,240
construction expense by having combined

4325
02:54:45,760 --> 02:54:50,240
building uh police/fire

4326
02:54:48,240 --> 02:54:52,560
station sharing some exterior walls to

4327
02:54:50,240 --> 02:54:54,560
save some cost sharing some shared

4328
02:54:52,560 --> 02:54:56,240
spaces to get kind of double duty out

4329
02:54:54,560 --> 02:54:57,760
and hopefully save some money. The

4330
02:54:56,240 --> 02:55:00,399
longer and longer we went through the

4331
02:54:57,760 --> 02:55:02,479
process and the design phase with lock

4332
02:55:00,399 --> 02:55:04,560
the more and more those projects t just

4333
02:55:02,479 --> 02:55:06,319
migrated apart and I think that really

4334
02:55:04,560 --> 02:55:07,600
ended up being a blessing. I think there

4335
02:55:06,319 --> 02:55:10,319
were so many questions that we hadn't

4336
02:55:07,600 --> 02:55:12,560
even be began to try to address like who

4337
02:55:10,319 --> 02:55:15,359
owns the land, how do we separate the

4338
02:55:12,560 --> 02:55:17,760
HVAC, uh who controls the the shared

4339
02:55:15,359 --> 02:55:19,760
spaces, uh how do we bond without

4340
02:55:17,760 --> 02:55:21,920
actually owning the property that our

4341
02:55:19,760 --> 02:55:23,520
station sits on. So, it got a little bit

4342
02:55:21,920 --> 02:55:24,720
confusing. They just sort of naturally

4343
02:55:23,520 --> 02:55:26,640
started to make more sense being

4344
02:55:24,720 --> 02:55:28,080
separate projects anyway, which again we

4345
02:55:26,640 --> 02:55:29,760
were kind of happy to see in hindsight.

4346
02:55:28,080 --> 02:55:31,200
We think it makes a lot of sense. So,

4347
02:55:29,760 --> 02:55:33,520
you can see everybody kind of know where

4348
02:55:31,200 --> 02:55:35,600
this is? Nope. So, the new building

4349
02:55:33,520 --> 02:55:38,720
under construction, we're just one lot

4350
02:55:35,600 --> 02:55:42,640
closer to Highway 89, and it has been

4351
02:55:38,720 --> 02:55:46,800
subdivided, uh, has been appraised,

4352
02:55:42,640 --> 02:55:50,880
um, and has been stubbed, I believe,

4353
02:55:46,800 --> 02:55:52,479
for the utilities for this design.

4354
02:55:50,880 --> 02:55:54,640
This is what that looks like. Uh, when

4355
02:55:52,479 --> 02:55:56,319
we met with Play initially, I think

4356
02:55:54,640 --> 02:55:58,080
architects, and this is no slam on them,

4357
02:55:56,319 --> 02:56:00,720
they're artists. I think they always

4358
02:55:58,080 --> 02:56:02,720
want to build the biggest most beautiful

4359
02:56:00,720 --> 02:56:05,040
uh building that they can possibly

4360
02:56:02,720 --> 02:56:06,720
build. Um

4361
02:56:05,040 --> 02:56:08,479
made a conscious decision that that our

4362
02:56:06,720 --> 02:56:10,720
building should not be that we we don't

4363
02:56:08,479 --> 02:56:12,399
want a station that is ostentatious. We

4364
02:56:10,720 --> 02:56:14,080
don't want to be excessive. Uh the

4365
02:56:12,399 --> 02:56:15,680
guidance I gave to layog in our first

4366
02:56:14,080 --> 02:56:18,080
several meetings was I want this to

4367
02:56:15,680 --> 02:56:20,560
represent the people who live in this

4368
02:56:18,080 --> 02:56:22,720
area and the fire department that it

4369
02:56:20,560 --> 02:56:24,880
represents. We want it to be strong. We

4370
02:56:22,720 --> 02:56:27,680
want it to be trustworthy. We want it to

4371
02:56:24,880 --> 02:56:29,840
be frugal, responsible, and plan for the

4372
02:56:27,680 --> 02:56:31,600
future. So, this isn't ostentatious.

4373
02:56:29,840 --> 02:56:33,200
This isn't extravagant. Uh, but it is

4374
02:56:31,600 --> 02:56:34,880
built for the future. So, we have three

4375
02:56:33,200 --> 02:56:36,800
bays, double deep, so we can put extra

4376
02:56:34,880 --> 02:56:39,040
apparatus. Uh, which we're already out

4377
02:56:36,800 --> 02:56:42,080
of room. We're we're currently parking,

4378
02:56:39,040 --> 02:56:43,920
you know, fairly outside because we just

4379
02:56:42,080 --> 02:56:46,240
don't have to worry about it. This has

4380
02:56:43,920 --> 02:56:48,000
seven bedrooms, so we can expand the

4381
02:56:46,240 --> 02:56:50,319
personnel in the area if we need to in

4382
02:56:48,000 --> 02:56:53,359
the future. Um, and then the one area

4383
02:56:50,319 --> 02:56:55,200
that sort of survived from the combined

4384
02:56:53,359 --> 02:56:56,560
police station, fire station section is

4385
02:56:55,200 --> 02:56:58,160
the fitness area that you can see over

4386
02:56:56,560 --> 02:56:59,840
here on the side. Now, we put it over

4387
02:56:58,160 --> 02:57:02,160
here on purpose because of that concept.

4388
02:56:59,840 --> 02:57:05,120
We wanted to be separate from the

4389
02:57:02,160 --> 02:57:07,840
firefighters living quarters. Um, but we

4390
02:57:05,120 --> 02:57:09,359
also wanted PD to be able to access that

4391
02:57:07,840 --> 02:57:11,359
space at any time of day without

4392
02:57:09,359 --> 02:57:12,960
interrupting my firemen's sleep. They

4393
02:57:11,359 --> 02:57:14,800
value their sleep, so I have to be very

4394
02:57:12,960 --> 02:57:16,880
careful.

4395
02:57:14,800 --> 02:57:19,840
We designed this to be key in from the

4396
02:57:16,880 --> 02:57:21,680
exterior and then no key access into the

4397
02:57:19,840 --> 02:57:24,399
station living quarters. Now, because

4398
02:57:21,680 --> 02:57:27,359
this was designed uh to not only meet

4399
02:57:24,399 --> 02:57:29,200
the needs of my fireman, but also police

4400
02:57:27,359 --> 02:57:31,040
department, uh it is a little bit larger

4401
02:57:29,200 --> 02:57:32,960
than we would need necessarily by

4402
02:57:31,040 --> 02:57:34,960
ourselves. So, generally speaking,

4403
02:57:32,960 --> 02:57:36,560
according to our architect, uh we would

4404
02:57:34,960 --> 02:57:38,399
have designed a space just for us that

4405
02:57:36,560 --> 02:57:41,920
was around 1,000 ft². This one's around

4406
02:57:38,399 --> 02:57:43,439
1,700. So, about 700 ft² larger than we

4407
02:57:41,920 --> 02:57:44,800
would need. And that's something I'll

4408
02:57:43,439 --> 02:57:46,560
have to talk about a little bit more I

4409
02:57:44,800 --> 02:57:48,399
needed.

4410
02:57:46,560 --> 02:57:50,240
So what does it look like? Yeah, we want

4411
02:57:48,399 --> 02:57:52,960
it to look like it's part of this uh

4412
02:57:50,240 --> 02:57:55,040
government center. So although I don't

4413
02:57:52,960 --> 02:57:56,880
believe in building large extravagant

4414
02:57:55,040 --> 02:58:00,240
buildings, we also want it to look like

4415
02:57:56,880 --> 02:58:01,760
it fits uh in the space. So taking

4416
02:58:00,240 --> 02:58:03,200
design cues from the buildings that you

4417
02:58:01,760 --> 02:58:04,560
guys are already building, we want it to

4418
02:58:03,200 --> 02:58:06,160
look similar. Again, it doesn't have to

4419
02:58:04,560 --> 02:58:08,000
be the same, but we felt like it was

4420
02:58:06,160 --> 02:58:09,600
important that they rhyme from a design

4421
02:58:08,000 --> 02:58:11,520
standpoint.

4422
02:58:09,600 --> 02:58:13,920
Show quickly kind of some overhead

4423
02:58:11,520 --> 02:58:16,399
stuff. So trying to save some space. So

4424
02:58:13,920 --> 02:58:19,760
this is exterior cladding is uh

4425
02:58:16,399 --> 02:58:22,479
transparent. Um hoping to save on this

4426
02:58:19,760 --> 02:58:24,319
south facing slope. Save on energy costs

4427
02:58:22,479 --> 02:58:26,000
by blocking some of that light. And then

4428
02:58:24,319 --> 02:58:27,520
trying to maximize outdoor space, which

4429
02:58:26,000 --> 02:58:31,040
is cheap construction, but still gives

4430
02:58:27,520 --> 02:58:33,680
the firefighters room to room to

4431
02:58:31,040 --> 02:58:36,080
recreate.

4432
02:58:33,680 --> 02:58:39,399
All right, here's the back view. Oh,

4433
02:58:36,080 --> 02:58:39,399
here's the back

4434
02:58:40,479 --> 02:58:44,720
interior again. not not huge. I would

4435
02:58:43,439 --> 02:58:46,160
call it conservative, especially

4436
02:58:44,720 --> 02:58:47,520
compared to some of the fire stations I

4437
02:58:46,160 --> 02:58:50,399
know have been built in the last 5 years

4438
02:58:47,520 --> 02:58:54,040
across the state.

4439
02:58:50,399 --> 02:58:54,040
That's not my support.

4440
02:58:55,600 --> 02:58:58,000
All right. So, what do you get from the

4441
02:58:56,880 --> 02:59:00,240
response standpoint? I kind of showed

4442
02:58:58,000 --> 02:59:02,160
you where our response gaps were and how

4443
02:59:00,240 --> 02:59:04,240
come we chose location we did, but I

4444
02:59:02,160 --> 02:59:06,960
want to show you guys why we're making

4445
02:59:04,240 --> 02:59:08,720
such a considerable uh investment in

4446
02:59:06,960 --> 02:59:10,319
public safety in Harrisville. This is a

4447
02:59:08,720 --> 02:59:11,840
big big deal. It's a game changer.

4448
02:59:10,319 --> 02:59:13,680
Again, it's been a long time coming, so

4449
02:59:11,840 --> 02:59:15,600
you guys should be aware of that. So,

4450
02:59:13,680 --> 02:59:17,279
faster response times along that 89

4451
02:59:15,600 --> 02:59:19,200
corridor where we show we're

4452
02:59:17,279 --> 02:59:21,279
consistently missing that 4-minute

4453
02:59:19,200 --> 02:59:22,800
travel that reduces the risk of poor

4454
02:59:21,279 --> 02:59:24,160
outcomes due to extended travel time.

4455
02:59:22,800 --> 02:59:25,760
So, again, here's that map that we

4456
02:59:24,160 --> 02:59:27,200
showed you before. So, we started to

4457
02:59:25,760 --> 02:59:29,279
model what would that look like with a

4458
02:59:27,200 --> 02:59:31,920
station 23 in place. So, you can see

4459
02:59:29,279 --> 02:59:33,600
that even the usually uh fairly

4460
02:59:31,920 --> 02:59:35,600
conservative computer model that shows

4461
02:59:33,600 --> 02:59:37,600
that that covers most of that area. So

4462
02:59:35,600 --> 02:59:39,359
all the way I actually got out and drove

4463
02:59:37,600 --> 02:59:42,080
it because I don't trust my computer all

4464
02:59:39,359 --> 02:59:43,439
the time in my own car here and was able

4465
02:59:42,080 --> 02:59:45,279
to make it all the way to the county

4466
02:59:43,439 --> 02:59:47,920
border in less than four. That was even

4467
02:59:45,279 --> 02:59:50,000
simulating red lights, clearing the red

4468
02:59:47,920 --> 02:59:51,920
light visually and then making my way

4469
02:59:50,000 --> 02:59:54,920
through like I would if I was driving

4470
02:59:51,920 --> 02:59:54,920
license

4471
02:59:55,760 --> 03:00:00,640
checking somebody's email.

4472
02:59:58,160 --> 03:00:02,240
Sorry.

4473
03:00:00,640 --> 03:00:04,399
All right.

4474
03:00:02,240 --> 03:00:06,240
So, increased reliability,

4475
03:00:04,399 --> 03:00:07,680
better distribution of calls up here.

4476
03:00:06,240 --> 03:00:09,040
So, again, here's our heat map. Where

4477
03:00:07,680 --> 03:00:10,880
are our calls happening? Well, they're

4478
03:00:09,040 --> 03:00:13,200
all happening down here. And it's

4479
03:00:10,880 --> 03:00:15,279
important. We we would never go back in

4480
03:00:13,200 --> 03:00:16,960
time and not build station 22. It needs

4481
03:00:15,279 --> 03:00:18,640
to be there to meet those travel time

4482
03:00:16,960 --> 03:00:20,960
when we have exceptional wildland risk

4483
03:00:18,640 --> 03:00:22,720
in that area. It has to happen. But, do

4484
03:00:20,960 --> 03:00:26,600
we have enough resources now to handle

4485
03:00:22,720 --> 03:00:26,600
these areas that are hot?

4486
03:00:26,720 --> 03:00:30,640
So, we map those out. Remember I talked

4487
03:00:28,319 --> 03:00:33,040
about some of these some of those red

4488
03:00:30,640 --> 03:00:35,040
dots that were near station 21 inside of

4489
03:00:33,040 --> 03:00:36,960
that theoretical travel. That was a big

4490
03:00:35,040 --> 03:00:39,520
question for us as we started to analyze

4491
03:00:36,960 --> 03:00:41,359
the data. Why are we missing so close to

4492
03:00:39,520 --> 03:00:43,120
the station? The computer says that we

4493
03:00:41,359 --> 03:00:45,520
should be able to make it easily to

4494
03:00:43,120 --> 03:00:48,720
those emergencies just south of station

4495
03:00:45,520 --> 03:00:50,880
21 right here uh in in less than four.

4496
03:00:48,720 --> 03:00:52,880
No problem. We dug a little bit deeper

4497
03:00:50,880 --> 03:00:54,720
and it has more to do with where our

4498
03:00:52,880 --> 03:00:56,640
calls are happening concentration than

4499
03:00:54,720 --> 03:00:57,920
it does travel distance. So that's when

4500
03:00:56,640 --> 03:01:00,720
we start to talk about what's called

4501
03:00:57,920 --> 03:01:02,880
reliability. So right now 80% of our

4502
03:01:00,720 --> 03:01:06,560
calls are taken by station 21 and only

4503
03:01:02,880 --> 03:01:09,359
20% of station taken by station 22. That

4504
03:01:06,560 --> 03:01:11,040
means when 21 is busy, 22 has to come

4505
03:01:09,359 --> 03:01:13,520
down off the hill and have an extended

4506
03:01:11,040 --> 03:01:15,680
response time and that area is now

4507
03:01:13,520 --> 03:01:17,600
unprotected. So that's a big problem for

4508
03:01:15,680 --> 03:01:20,960
us, right? So each one of these yellow

4509
03:01:17,600 --> 03:01:23,120
dots was a dot in 2024, I believe, uh

4510
03:01:20,960 --> 03:01:26,720
where 22 had to come off the hill to

4511
03:01:23,120 --> 03:01:30,000
take that emergency. Um

4512
03:01:26,720 --> 03:01:32,880
travel times for these probably where we

4513
03:01:30,000 --> 03:01:35,040
are for station 22 I would say 10

4514
03:01:32,880 --> 03:01:37,359
minutes plus travel. So you're looking

4515
03:01:35,040 --> 03:01:39,520
15 to 20 minutes to get somebody on

4516
03:01:37,359 --> 03:01:41,120
scene. People say well we have Odin fire

4517
03:01:39,520 --> 03:01:42,800
station right here. Well they'll show up

4518
03:01:41,120 --> 03:01:44,560
on fires but they won't respond on

4519
03:01:42,800 --> 03:01:46,479
medicals and I can't ask them to. They

4520
03:01:44,560 --> 03:01:49,120
take they run out of five stations

4521
03:01:46,479 --> 03:01:51,520
20,000 calls a year. They are too busy

4522
03:01:49,120 --> 03:01:53,040
to come and help us on every emergency.

4523
03:01:51,520 --> 03:01:54,479
It's our responsibility to make sure

4524
03:01:53,040 --> 03:01:57,439
that we have units available in the

4525
03:01:54,479 --> 03:02:00,319
right places to take those units.

4526
03:01:57,439 --> 03:02:02,479
And on top of that, not only is that 820

4527
03:02:00,319 --> 03:02:05,120
split starting to tax us, but uh call

4528
03:02:02,479 --> 03:02:06,880
volume is increasing out of control. So

4529
03:02:05,120 --> 03:02:10,160
emergency services demand has increased

4530
03:02:06,880 --> 03:02:12,399
85% since 2018.

4531
03:02:10,160 --> 03:02:14,560
So in 2018, we ran just over 2,000

4532
03:02:12,399 --> 03:02:16,080
calls. This year we're looking at 4,100

4533
03:02:14,560 --> 03:02:18,880
incidents based on our tracking report

4534
03:02:16,080 --> 03:02:21,359
on the year to date. So planning for the

4535
03:02:18,880 --> 03:02:23,040
future's huge for us. We try to project

4536
03:02:21,359 --> 03:02:24,640
that out using linear regressions in the

4537
03:02:23,040 --> 03:02:26,399
Ken Garner Institute's data on

4538
03:02:24,640 --> 03:02:28,960
population growth, but it's outpacing

4539
03:02:26,399 --> 03:02:30,800
population growth. So that 85% call

4540
03:02:28,960 --> 03:02:33,680
increase happened in a period of

4541
03:02:30,800 --> 03:02:35,520
population growth of only 16.5. Why that

4542
03:02:33,680 --> 03:02:37,680
is, we're not sure. We don't know. But

4543
03:02:35,520 --> 03:02:39,920
people are utilizing our services. Way

4544
03:02:37,680 --> 03:02:41,680
way more per citizen than they used to.

4545
03:02:39,920 --> 03:02:43,920
So it's about 85 calls per thousand

4546
03:02:41,680 --> 03:02:46,880
residents or about one resident in 11

4547
03:02:43,920 --> 03:02:49,920
will use our services each year.

4548
03:02:46,880 --> 03:02:51,920
And like I said, 281 calls increase over

4549
03:02:49,920 --> 03:02:53,920
last year in just the first half of

4550
03:02:51,920 --> 03:02:55,840
2016. So even on our most aggressive

4551
03:02:53,920 --> 03:02:59,040
linear regression progression, we're

4552
03:02:55,840 --> 03:03:01,840
already at 2018 high growth numbers.

4553
03:02:59,040 --> 03:03:05,040
We're trying to stay ahead of the curve.

4554
03:03:01,840 --> 03:03:08,479
So once we decided that 23 was where we

4555
03:03:05,040 --> 03:03:09,920
uh needed to be, uh had to sit down and

4556
03:03:08,479 --> 03:03:11,359
decide what that would look like. So

4557
03:03:09,920 --> 03:03:13,200
this is kind of what the the finished

4558
03:03:11,359 --> 03:03:14,960
product would look like once the project

4559
03:03:13,200 --> 03:03:16,880
was finished and we had the staff added

4560
03:03:14,960 --> 03:03:18,560
and the trucks were in service ready to

4561
03:03:16,880 --> 03:03:20,800
roll. Uh we would distribute our call

4562
03:03:18,560 --> 03:03:23,200
volume a little more effectively. So now

4563
03:03:20,800 --> 03:03:25,439
station 21 said taking 80% of call

4564
03:03:23,200 --> 03:03:27,520
volume would only take 50. Station 22

4565
03:03:25,439 --> 03:03:29,040
would stay about the same at 20% without

4566
03:03:27,520 --> 03:03:30,960
likely change as Mount Road goes

4567
03:03:29,040 --> 03:03:32,479
through. And station 23, the new one

4568
03:03:30,960 --> 03:03:35,040
here in Harrisville would pick about

4569
03:03:32,479 --> 03:03:37,120
30%. So really taking 30% of the load

4570
03:03:35,040 --> 03:03:39,520
off of 21 and really not affecting

4571
03:03:37,120 --> 03:03:43,120
station 22 much at all. So that should

4572
03:03:39,520 --> 03:03:45,040
give us not only that NFPA compliant 4

4573
03:03:43,120 --> 03:03:47,600
minutes or less travel all the way up

4574
03:03:45,040 --> 03:03:49,359
the 89 corridor, but it should also give

4575
03:03:47,600 --> 03:03:51,600
us that backup unit down here in

4576
03:03:49,359 --> 03:03:52,960
Harrisville when 21 is already on a

4577
03:03:51,600 --> 03:03:54,479
call, which again they're already

4578
03:03:52,960 --> 03:03:56,240
carrying 80% of the load and we're just

4579
03:03:54,479 --> 03:03:58,640
getting busier.

4580
03:03:56,240 --> 03:03:59,840
So you can see based on those uh so it

4581
03:03:58,640 --> 03:04:00,960
was really kind of a two for one.

4582
03:03:59,840 --> 03:04:03,200
They're actually pleasantly surprised

4583
03:04:00,960 --> 03:04:05,840
when we started modeling on Highway 89.

4584
03:04:03,200 --> 03:04:07,600
I think you mentioned councilman that

4585
03:04:05,840 --> 03:04:10,720
the state's sort of a pain when it comes

4586
03:04:07,600 --> 03:04:12,319
to access needs off of 89. I love it

4587
03:04:10,720 --> 03:04:13,920
because that means that our modeling

4588
03:04:12,319 --> 03:04:15,600
should stay consistent for a long long

4589
03:04:13,920 --> 03:04:17,600
time. So as long as they continue to

4590
03:04:15,600 --> 03:04:19,520
control access

4591
03:04:17,600 --> 03:04:21,359
off of 89, we can feel pretty

4592
03:04:19,520 --> 03:04:23,120
comfortable about northwest travel or

4593
03:04:21,359 --> 03:04:25,120
north south travel on highway units in

4594
03:04:23,120 --> 03:04:27,120
the city attack. You can see how much

4595
03:04:25,120 --> 03:04:29,279
more of those reds we start to pick up

4596
03:04:27,120 --> 03:04:32,080
in this new model.

4597
03:04:29,279 --> 03:04:34,000
Um, also as just sort of an aside, the

4598
03:04:32,080 --> 03:04:36,240
plan right now would be to leave station

4599
03:04:34,000 --> 03:04:37,760
22 staffed as it is, which is one

4600
03:04:36,240 --> 03:04:39,600
engine, three people, and an ambulance

4601
03:04:37,760 --> 03:04:41,200
for two. Right now, we have seven

4602
03:04:39,600 --> 03:04:43,680
people. We actually had to add bedrooms

4603
03:04:41,200 --> 03:04:45,520
at 22 and 21 cuz we're busting at the

4604
03:04:43,680 --> 03:04:47,359
seams. Uh, instead of having seven

4605
03:04:45,520 --> 03:04:49,120
people at 21 like we currently do, we

4606
03:04:47,359 --> 03:04:53,840
would move that ambulance to the new

4607
03:04:49,120 --> 03:04:55,200
Harrisville station and staff at 300.

4608
03:04:53,840 --> 03:04:56,800
All right, project timeline. We're

4609
03:04:55,200 --> 03:04:59,040
looking

4610
03:04:56,800 --> 03:05:01,279
early summer, maybe late spring for a

4611
03:04:59,040 --> 03:05:02,399
groundbreaking. Even this decision, even

4612
03:05:01,279 --> 03:05:04,479
though we're showing the need now and

4613
03:05:02,399 --> 03:05:06,080
the benefits now, as you guys know, it

4614
03:05:04,479 --> 03:05:07,279
takes time to not only plan for

4615
03:05:06,080 --> 03:05:09,439
construction, but actually build

4616
03:05:07,279 --> 03:05:11,520
something. So, even with the board

4617
03:05:09,439 --> 03:05:13,520
acting unanimously here just a month ago

4618
03:05:11,520 --> 03:05:14,720
to this tax increase to move forward on

4619
03:05:13,520 --> 03:05:16,800
this, we're working on the bonding

4620
03:05:14,720 --> 03:05:18,800
financing. If we can break spring by

4621
03:05:16,800 --> 03:05:20,800
break ground by late spring, early

4622
03:05:18,800 --> 03:05:22,880
summer, we're hopeful that we could get

4623
03:05:20,800 --> 03:05:25,840
the staff hired, trained, and be cutting

4624
03:05:22,880 --> 03:05:28,080
the ribbon on station January, February

4625
03:05:25,840 --> 03:05:29,760
of 29th, which is really, really

4626
03:05:28,080 --> 03:05:34,399
exciting.

4627
03:05:29,760 --> 03:05:37,359
All right, so any questions on that?

4628
03:05:34,399 --> 03:05:38,960
Could you go back maybe three slides

4629
03:05:37,359 --> 03:05:39,439
where you had the map of the

4630
03:05:38,960 --> 03:05:43,760
» Yes, sir.

4631
03:05:39,439 --> 03:05:46,399
» Three stations and gather. Yeah. So,

4632
03:05:43,760 --> 03:05:50,880
are the red dots

4633
03:05:46,399 --> 03:05:51,840
still are they were the responses not

4634
03:05:50,880 --> 03:05:52,800
happening now?

4635
03:05:51,840 --> 03:05:54,479
» Yes.

4636
03:05:52,800 --> 03:05:56,399
» Okay. So, it's not saying once station

4637
03:05:54,479 --> 03:05:58,479
23 those will still all be ragged off.

4638
03:05:56,399 --> 03:06:00,240
» No sir. No. So, that's historic data.

4639
03:05:58,479 --> 03:06:02,800
So, again, those are verified emergent

4640
03:06:00,240 --> 03:06:05,200
calls. I think this is 2025's numbers. I

4641
03:06:02,800 --> 03:06:07,680
think the other one was 2024.

4642
03:06:05,200 --> 03:06:09,279
But yes, it shows theoretically which

4643
03:06:07,680 --> 03:06:11,120
calls that we've missed on in the

4644
03:06:09,279 --> 03:06:12,800
historical data that we should be able

4645
03:06:11,120 --> 03:06:15,800
to manage within the prescribed time.

4646
03:06:12,800 --> 03:06:15,800
Okay,

4647
03:06:16,640 --> 03:06:19,920
questions you guys have a long night.

4648
03:06:19,200 --> 03:06:22,240
» Thank you.

4649
03:06:19,920 --> 03:06:24,560
» You bet. So, the last thing that uh that

4650
03:06:22,240 --> 03:06:26,240
we kind of need to discuss, so timeline

4651
03:06:24,560 --> 03:06:27,680
wise, again, we're kind of tracking

4652
03:06:26,240 --> 03:06:28,880
that. We're not in a huge hurry. We want

4653
03:06:27,680 --> 03:06:30,880
to make sure that we do everything the

4654
03:06:28,880 --> 03:06:32,800
right way. Uh the the one thing that we

4655
03:06:30,880 --> 03:06:35,279
will need some clarity on from you guys

4656
03:06:32,800 --> 03:06:37,760
is whether or not Harrisville intends to

4657
03:06:35,279 --> 03:06:39,520
participate in that shared space. So if

4658
03:06:37,760 --> 03:06:42,240
not, we'll need to adjust the size of

4659
03:06:39,520 --> 03:06:44,720
that down. Architect puts the cost of

4660
03:06:42,240 --> 03:06:47,279
that extra space at about $500 a square

4661
03:06:44,720 --> 03:06:49,920
foot or about $350,000 for just the

4662
03:06:47,279 --> 03:06:52,399
extra total cost of the fitness space

4663
03:06:49,920 --> 03:06:54,160
altogether is about $850,000.

4664
03:06:52,399 --> 03:06:55,840
So that would be the one thing that we

4665
03:06:54,160 --> 03:06:58,880
would need to to get clarification from

4666
03:06:55,840 --> 03:07:02,000
you guys. um and start at the top of

4667
03:06:58,880 --> 03:07:03,760
progress on uh purchasing the property

4668
03:07:02,000 --> 03:07:05,600
and figuring out how to acquire that

4669
03:07:03,760 --> 03:07:06,960
from you guys as well. But I think the

4670
03:07:05,600 --> 03:07:09,200
first thing that we would need from you

4671
03:07:06,960 --> 03:07:10,880
guys is to know yes, we're interested in

4672
03:07:09,200 --> 03:07:13,279
participating with this shared space

4673
03:07:10,880 --> 03:07:15,520
concept or no, I mean it doesn't it's

4674
03:07:13,279 --> 03:07:17,120
okay with us either way. We can reduce

4675
03:07:15,520 --> 03:07:18,800
this the size of the workout room and

4676
03:07:17,120 --> 03:07:20,560
move forward that way. But I think it

4677
03:07:18,800 --> 03:07:22,960
provides a really really good

4678
03:07:20,560 --> 03:07:24,720
opportunity to give a a safe comfortable

4679
03:07:22,960 --> 03:07:26,319
place that your police officers can work

4680
03:07:24,720 --> 03:07:27,920
out. I don't think it's comfortable for

4681
03:07:26,319 --> 03:07:31,680
these guys going to snap fitness.

4682
03:07:27,920 --> 03:07:32,800
Certainly certainly not in uniform.

4683
03:07:31,680 --> 03:07:34,080
And they get to hang out with their

4684
03:07:32,800 --> 03:07:35,600
fireman brothers, which we probably

4685
03:07:34,080 --> 03:07:38,880
love, right?

4686
03:07:35,600 --> 03:07:41,120
» Absolutely. Yeah. So, thank you. If you

4687
03:07:38,880 --> 03:07:42,880
guys don't have anything else for me,

4688
03:07:41,120 --> 03:07:44,160
» I have a random question. You were

4689
03:07:42,880 --> 03:07:45,760
talking about you're not quite sure why

4690
03:07:44,160 --> 03:07:47,840
the call volume has gone up so much,

4691
03:07:45,760 --> 03:07:48,319
disproportionate to population.

4692
03:07:47,840 --> 03:07:50,240
» Yes, sir.

4693
03:07:48,319 --> 03:07:51,840
» Have you looked at aging demographics

4694
03:07:50,240 --> 03:07:53,680
because I know a lot of calls we get are

4695
03:07:51,840 --> 03:07:56,319
older people involved. It's always been

4696
03:07:53,680 --> 03:07:57,760
an an older population anyway. So, I

4697
03:07:56,319 --> 03:08:00,479
think that's one component, but I think

4698
03:07:57,760 --> 03:08:03,279
there's way more. I think we're seeing

4699
03:08:00,479 --> 03:08:05,520
or call utilization rates increasing in

4700
03:08:03,279 --> 03:08:07,279
higher density of areas more than

4701
03:08:05,520 --> 03:08:08,960
anything else. And again, if you look at

4702
03:08:07,279 --> 03:08:10,479
Ogden and look at their demographics,

4703
03:08:08,960 --> 03:08:14,640
they're sort of the extreme example of

4704
03:08:10,479 --> 03:08:17,279
that. We're one for 11 citizens. They're

4705
03:08:14,640 --> 03:08:19,520
uh one for four and a half citizens.

4706
03:08:17,279 --> 03:08:23,040
Okay? They have 80,000 citizens and they

4707
03:08:19,520 --> 03:08:27,120
run 20,000 calls. We have uh 40,000

4708
03:08:23,040 --> 03:08:29,120
42,000 and we run 4,000 calls. So

4709
03:08:27,120 --> 03:08:32,479
there's a lot in there. I think if I had

4710
03:08:29,120 --> 03:08:35,600
spare time, I would dig into that. Um

4711
03:08:32,479 --> 03:08:37,920
the calls are not necessarily more

4712
03:08:35,600 --> 03:08:39,200
medical versus more fire. They're

4713
03:08:37,920 --> 03:08:41,520
they're both going up.

4714
03:08:39,200 --> 03:08:43,120
» Yeah. Everything kind of trends up

4715
03:08:41,520 --> 03:08:45,200
together.

4716
03:08:43,120 --> 03:08:47,200
But again, not sure why. There's there's

4717
03:08:45,200 --> 03:08:49,680
a whole PhD study in there if anybody

4718
03:08:47,200 --> 03:08:51,439
has the time. I don't. But I would love

4719
03:08:49,680 --> 03:08:54,319
to read it if you got it. Be really

4720
03:08:51,439 --> 03:08:55,520
interested.

4721
03:08:54,319 --> 03:08:58,680
» All right. Thank you.

4722
03:08:55,520 --> 03:08:58,680
» Thank you.

4723
03:09:00,960 --> 03:09:06,640
» Thanks.

4724
03:09:03,279 --> 03:09:08,640
» Discussion is council meeting frequency

4725
03:09:06,640 --> 03:09:12,279
discussion.

4726
03:09:08,640 --> 03:09:12,279
Council member Wilson

4727
03:09:12,720 --> 03:09:17,600
just trying to look at some options. But

4728
03:09:16,080 --> 03:09:19,760
we have one meeting once a month. It

4729
03:09:17,600 --> 03:09:21,840
becomes a marathon meeting just like

4730
03:09:19,760 --> 03:09:23,040
tonight, you know, close to an hour

4731
03:09:21,840 --> 03:09:25,920
discussing something that's very

4732
03:09:23,040 --> 03:09:27,680
important while everybody's waiting. And

4733
03:09:25,920 --> 03:09:30,000
the concerns that I had was is do we

4734
03:09:27,680 --> 03:09:32,479
need to divide the two meetings? I don't

4735
03:09:30,000 --> 03:09:34,800
necessarily think that's the answer. At

4736
03:09:32,479 --> 03:09:36,720
the same time, one other thing needs to

4737
03:09:34,800 --> 03:09:39,279
be considered

4738
03:09:36,720 --> 03:09:41,200
two meetings a month. That gave plenty

4739
03:09:39,279 --> 03:09:43,359
commission an opportunity to have

4740
03:09:41,200 --> 03:09:44,560
something on agenda that voted on. We

4741
03:09:43,359 --> 03:09:46,800
don't have that. They have to wait a

4742
03:09:44,560 --> 03:09:48,640
whole month. I think that needs to be

4743
03:09:46,800 --> 03:09:50,560
looked at.

4744
03:09:48,640 --> 03:09:53,520
What happened tonight I think is one of

4745
03:09:50,560 --> 03:09:55,680
the possible answers that if there is a

4746
03:09:53,520 --> 03:09:58,240
discussion that needs to be on the

4747
03:09:55,680 --> 03:10:01,840
agenda if that work meeting can tended

4748
03:09:58,240 --> 03:10:03,920
to that and we can have the 6:00 hour

4749
03:10:01,840 --> 03:10:05,920
for for an hour. I think that helps us

4750
03:10:03,920 --> 03:10:07,120
in making the decision. I think it

4751
03:10:05,920 --> 03:10:10,560
helped a little bit today.

4752
03:10:07,120 --> 03:10:13,359
Unfortunately, sorry that didn't didn't

4753
03:10:10,560 --> 03:10:15,840
seem to happen, but at the same time, it

4754
03:10:13,359 --> 03:10:17,439
was a healthy discussion and I think it

4755
03:10:15,840 --> 03:10:19,680
helped us come to the conclusion of

4756
03:10:17,439 --> 03:10:21,279
passing out ordinance today.

4757
03:10:19,680 --> 03:10:23,200
» However,

4758
03:10:21,279 --> 03:10:24,640
I don't think we're doing justice to our

4759
03:10:23,200 --> 03:10:27,200
citizens either when they have to sit

4760
03:10:24,640 --> 03:10:28,479
here for three or four hours.

4761
03:10:27,200 --> 03:10:30,160
» I'll sit mine.

4762
03:10:28,479 --> 03:10:32,000
» I know you would, but there's a lot of

4763
03:10:30,160 --> 03:10:33,920
others that like to go to bed, have

4764
03:10:32,000 --> 03:10:37,040
watched them.

4765
03:10:33,920 --> 03:10:39,520
And so my discussion is is what's the

4766
03:10:37,040 --> 03:10:41,680
best way to get into frequency? I mean,

4767
03:10:39,520 --> 03:10:43,760
here it's 9:30. We're we should 10:00

4768
03:10:41,680 --> 03:10:46,399
before we get done or later.

4769
03:10:43,760 --> 03:10:48,160
» Yeah. Or later. And so, you know, these

4770
03:10:46,399 --> 03:10:50,560
are marathon meetings that I don't think

4771
03:10:48,160 --> 03:10:52,000
do anything. I think past 9 or 9:30.

4772
03:10:50,560 --> 03:10:54,640
We're all shut. I don't think we're

4773
03:10:52,000 --> 03:10:56,800
making wise decisions a couple week. And

4774
03:10:54,640 --> 03:11:00,479
so, the idea of this discussion is, do

4775
03:10:56,800 --> 03:11:01,760
you have any ideas how to help solve

4776
03:11:00,479 --> 03:11:04,960
some of this problem or at least

4777
03:11:01,760 --> 03:11:04,960
streamline it?

4778
03:11:06,080 --> 03:11:08,960
comments.

4779
03:11:06,399 --> 03:11:12,439
» Well, maybe a couple questions. I know

4780
03:11:08,960 --> 03:11:12,439
what I had

4781
03:11:12,640 --> 03:11:17,920
some comments and I asked Jack about

4782
03:11:14,560 --> 03:11:20,319
send them out to the council members

4783
03:11:17,920 --> 03:11:23,520
beforehand rather than hand them out. I

4784
03:11:20,319 --> 03:11:26,960
think the response was really they just

4785
03:11:23,520 --> 03:11:29,200
need to be handed out. And Jack, help me

4786
03:11:26,960 --> 03:11:32,080
understand what was the reason why they

4787
03:11:29,200 --> 03:11:33,520
could have gone earlier. So, if you're

4788
03:11:32,080 --> 03:11:35,760
sending out items that would be a

4789
03:11:33,520 --> 03:11:38,080
discussion, they need to happen in a

4790
03:11:35,760 --> 03:11:39,840
public meeting where the public can view

4791
03:11:38,080 --> 03:11:41,840
it. If I'm sending it out in an email

4792
03:11:39,840 --> 03:11:44,000
and you guys are debating it or

4793
03:11:41,840 --> 03:11:45,760
considering it, the public doesn't isn't

4794
03:11:44,000 --> 03:11:47,439
part of that. So the whole point of the

4795
03:11:45,760 --> 03:11:49,600
open and public meeting such is every

4796
03:11:47,439 --> 03:11:53,439
decision of everything you guys do

4797
03:11:49,600 --> 03:11:54,720
should be here in these meetings

4798
03:11:53,439 --> 03:11:56,960
» Because that was one of the thoughts I

4799
03:11:54,720 --> 03:11:59,760
had first and then when Jack told me

4800
03:11:56,960 --> 03:12:01,120
about what's wrong with it this way then

4801
03:11:59,760 --> 03:12:03,359
because I think it'd always be helpful

4802
03:12:01,120 --> 03:12:06,399
if everyone saw stuff early and then

4803
03:12:03,359 --> 03:12:09,200
think about it and then don't have to go

4804
03:12:06,399 --> 03:12:11,359
over each item on that you just get it

4805
03:12:09,200 --> 03:12:14,160
at the same meeting and say okay now act

4806
03:12:11,359 --> 03:12:17,520
on it have another thought I think maybe

4807
03:12:14,160 --> 03:12:18,800
Two options are one do you hold a second

4808
03:12:17,520 --> 03:12:21,600
meeting and it's just work session

4809
03:12:18,800 --> 03:12:23,200
meeting it's not an hour before one do

4810
03:12:21,600 --> 03:12:27,680
you just hold a work session mean all

4811
03:12:23,200 --> 03:12:29,600
you discuss is these type of things

4812
03:12:27,680 --> 03:12:31,840
or do you do just what you're talking

4813
03:12:29,600 --> 03:12:33,840
about tonight you have a work session at

4814
03:12:31,840 --> 03:12:37,200
6:00 and then you have a regular meeting

4815
03:12:33,840 --> 03:12:41,560
at 7 and just make that the stand across

4816
03:12:37,200 --> 03:12:41,560
those are two two possibilities

4817
03:12:42,080 --> 03:12:46,560
» I do like the idea of a work session

4818
03:12:44,240 --> 03:12:48,960
where we were able to discuss each of

4819
03:12:46,560 --> 03:12:50,960
our thoughts and not have the pressure

4820
03:12:48,960 --> 03:12:52,960
of and then we're going to vote

4821
03:12:50,960 --> 03:12:56,160
immediately then we have time to think

4822
03:12:52,960 --> 03:12:58,640
and process before we have another

4823
03:12:56,160 --> 03:13:00,240
meeting. So it does seem like in order

4824
03:12:58,640 --> 03:13:03,680
to do that we would need to add a second

4825
03:13:00,240 --> 03:13:04,640
meeting per month. I agree. It's they

4826
03:13:03,680 --> 03:13:07,120
don't want to be able

4827
03:13:04,640 --> 03:13:09,840
» I know in a lot of the other cities I'

4828
03:13:07,120 --> 03:13:12,880
other mayors I've talked to, they've

4829
03:13:09,840 --> 03:13:15,600
implemented a work session before every

4830
03:13:12,880 --> 03:13:17,760
city council meeting just to have a lot

4831
03:13:15,600 --> 03:13:22,080
of those discussions

4832
03:13:17,760 --> 03:13:25,359
» Beforehand and they said it helps

4833
03:13:22,080 --> 03:13:27,040
» Because I do what I can on my own but

4834
03:13:25,359 --> 03:13:29,359
having these other thoughts from other

4835
03:13:27,040 --> 03:13:31,120
council members brought to my attention

4836
03:13:29,359 --> 03:13:33,600
does definitely increase my

4837
03:13:31,120 --> 03:13:36,319
understanding of the issues. So, I

4838
03:13:33,600 --> 03:13:39,520
appreciate that. And then having some

4839
03:13:36,319 --> 03:13:41,600
time to process and take notes and look

4840
03:13:39,520 --> 03:13:42,319
those over and do more research would be

4841
03:13:41,600 --> 03:13:44,319
helpful.

4842
03:13:42,319 --> 03:13:47,680
» Yeah, I think some of it too when you're

4843
03:13:44,319 --> 03:13:49,680
talking about research, I think we come

4844
03:13:47,680 --> 03:13:52,560
with a lot of questions cuz these are

4845
03:13:49,680 --> 03:13:54,479
questions we don't have that maybe we

4846
03:13:52,560 --> 03:13:56,399
could have answered if we had a little

4847
03:13:54,479 --> 03:13:59,760
bit more time to research. I don't know

4848
03:13:56,399 --> 03:14:03,439
if there's a possibility of getting us

4849
03:13:59,760 --> 03:14:06,560
materials sooner. I mean, uh, we're

4850
03:14:03,439 --> 03:14:10,080
we're getting some of these materials,

4851
03:14:06,560 --> 03:14:13,439
you know, a couple of days in advance,

4852
03:14:10,080 --> 03:14:18,720
it feels like. And you know having just

4853
03:14:13,439 --> 03:14:20,640
a few days is not

4854
03:14:18,720 --> 03:14:25,439
I mean cuz like when we get the last

4855
03:14:20,640 --> 03:14:28,560
amendment they amended thing just

4856
03:14:25,439 --> 03:14:33,439
yesterday this morning when we get the

4857
03:14:28,560 --> 03:14:35,680
amendment I have to look at my Thursday

4858
03:14:33,439 --> 03:14:37,279
» You know and so I mean and sometimes we

4859
03:14:35,680 --> 03:14:39,040
have when we've gotten amendments at the

4860
03:14:37,279 --> 03:14:42,800
very very last minute so I don't know if

4861
03:14:39,040 --> 03:14:45,040
we can get them even sooner. I mean,

4862
03:14:42,800 --> 03:14:47,920
it'd be great to have a week prepared

4863
03:14:45,040 --> 03:14:52,080
for uh to look at some of these things

4864
03:14:47,920 --> 03:14:56,720
cuz uh you know,

4865
03:14:52,080 --> 03:14:59,359
I spend a lot of time in the evenings.

4866
03:14:56,720 --> 03:15:01,520
Um, but my work has been exceptionally

4867
03:14:59,359 --> 03:15:03,520
busy as well. And sometimes you go

4868
03:15:01,520 --> 03:15:05,840
through those ups and downs. And so you

4869
03:15:03,520 --> 03:15:08,880
I came prepared with a lot of questions,

4870
03:15:05,840 --> 03:15:11,680
but a lot of them were answered as we

4871
03:15:08,880 --> 03:15:13,200
everybody else was asking them. But I

4872
03:15:11,680 --> 03:15:15,680
could probably answer some of those

4873
03:15:13,200 --> 03:15:18,080
questions and looking into some of the

4874
03:15:15,680 --> 03:15:21,040
state law, things like that. But don't

4875
03:15:18,080 --> 03:15:23,200
have all the time to go and find some of

4876
03:15:21,040 --> 03:15:25,200
those things. Greg has more time than

4877
03:15:23,200 --> 03:15:27,520
the rest of us. That's why I didn't

4878
03:15:25,200 --> 03:15:30,640
touch that, right?

4879
03:15:27,520 --> 03:15:32,800
» So, I mean, it would be helpful if we

4880
03:15:30,640 --> 03:15:34,399
could get it a little earlier.

4881
03:15:32,800 --> 03:15:36,720
» Another thing that I think needs to go

4882
03:15:34,399 --> 03:15:38,640
into this is we're asking staff to come

4883
03:15:36,720 --> 03:15:40,960
to a second meeting, which means they

4884
03:15:38,640 --> 03:15:42,399
have to have everything here, which is

4885
03:15:40,960 --> 03:15:42,720
extra time on them,

4886
03:15:42,399 --> 03:15:44,399
» Right?

4887
03:15:42,720 --> 03:15:44,880
» And I think we need to be considerate of

4888
03:15:44,399 --> 03:15:45,760
their time.

4889
03:15:44,880 --> 03:15:48,080
» I agree.

4890
03:15:45,760 --> 03:15:49,920
» So, that has to be part of the equation,

4891
03:15:48,080 --> 03:15:52,479
too. And I think that's an important

4892
03:15:49,920 --> 03:15:55,359
part of respecting for you guys, giving

4893
03:15:52,479 --> 03:15:58,000
up your evenings. That's really simply

4894
03:15:55,359 --> 03:16:00,239
put another meeting tomorrow. Somebody

4895
03:15:58,000 --> 03:16:03,600
said at least it was the option was

4896
03:16:00,239 --> 03:16:05,680
given what we swapped uh plotting

4897
03:16:03,600 --> 03:16:07,359
commission and city council which means

4898
03:16:05,680 --> 03:16:09,920
now we'll meet on Wednesday instead of

4899
03:16:07,359 --> 03:16:12,720
Tuesday. Is that something that we would

4900
03:16:09,920 --> 03:16:15,200
do a topy turby and what does that do

4901
03:16:12,720 --> 03:16:17,760
and how does that do a ripple effect

4902
03:16:15,200 --> 03:16:19,760
throughout everybody?

4903
03:16:17,760 --> 03:16:22,080
I mean that's just another thing I'm

4904
03:16:19,760 --> 03:16:23,920
concerned if planning commission is not

4905
03:16:22,080 --> 03:16:26,239
so much concerned about getting it onto

4906
03:16:23,920 --> 03:16:29,120
agenda

4907
03:16:26,239 --> 03:16:31,279
then that's that's not avoid but I think

4908
03:16:29,120 --> 03:16:32,960
it's something to consider which means

4909
03:16:31,279 --> 03:16:35,520
we need to be involved with climate

4910
03:16:32,960 --> 03:16:37,520
efficiency to see what their

4911
03:16:35,520 --> 03:16:40,800
I'm not proposing this I'm just looking

4912
03:16:37,520 --> 03:16:43,120
at ideas right now so that we have an

4913
03:16:40,800 --> 03:16:45,040
effective discussion that's going on

4914
03:16:43,120 --> 03:16:48,960
we're able to have the time to plan on

4915
03:16:45,040 --> 03:16:50,800
things and still be able do basically go

4916
03:16:48,960 --> 03:16:54,479
home in a decent hour because most of us

4917
03:16:50,800 --> 03:16:57,359
have to work the next day some others.

4918
03:16:54,479 --> 03:16:59,439
» So talking to us as a council I I'm

4919
03:16:57,359 --> 03:17:02,399
going to bring up some things too is

4920
03:16:59,439 --> 03:17:04,319
that I don't think that more time is in

4921
03:17:02,399 --> 03:17:07,040
a meeting is necessarily going to be

4922
03:17:04,319 --> 03:17:09,439
better either. Meaning we have another

4923
03:17:07,040 --> 03:17:13,359
meeting. Reason why is because how many

4924
03:17:09,439 --> 03:17:15,120
of us have been to meetings that you

4925
03:17:13,359 --> 03:17:16,960
felt like you didn't need to have had

4926
03:17:15,120 --> 03:17:19,680
that meeting but it still went just as

4927
03:17:16,960 --> 03:17:20,479
long and if not longer.

4928
03:17:19,680 --> 03:17:23,520
» Yeah.

4929
03:17:20,479 --> 03:17:27,279
» Um I think efficiency for me is all

4930
03:17:23,520 --> 03:17:29,120
about being able to research and find

4931
03:17:27,279 --> 03:17:32,960
answers to questions and there's a lot

4932
03:17:29,120 --> 03:17:35,520
of tools out there. It's just that um

4933
03:17:32,960 --> 03:17:39,200
need a little bit. I think time is the

4934
03:17:35,520 --> 03:17:39,200
biggest thing. Preparation.

4935
03:17:41,359 --> 03:17:46,640
Well, I mean, I'm thinking we ought to

4936
03:17:43,439 --> 03:17:48,640
like propose something to just try to

4937
03:17:46,640 --> 03:17:51,600
like see if we can streamline it a

4938
03:17:48,640 --> 03:17:53,600
little bit. And maybe that would be and

4939
03:17:51,600 --> 03:17:55,120
I'll strong suggestion is that we add

4940
03:17:53,600 --> 03:17:56,800
that

4941
03:17:55,120 --> 03:17:59,359
work session at the beginning of the

4942
03:17:56,800 --> 03:18:01,760
meeting at 6:00. So, we start at 6:00

4943
03:17:59,359 --> 03:18:03,520
instead of 7. give you some

4944
03:18:01,760 --> 03:18:06,319
opportunities to make those discussion

4945
03:18:03,520 --> 03:18:09,040
items and bring up those items that we

4946
03:18:06,319 --> 03:18:11,200
can that are in those area. I don't you

4947
03:18:09,040 --> 03:18:13,200
know I don't know on the agenda I've

4948
03:18:11,200 --> 03:18:15,120
been a part of making the agenda when we

4949
03:18:13,200 --> 03:18:18,640
get it done

4950
03:18:15,120 --> 03:18:20,160
that's a real I mean it's I thought it

4951
03:18:18,640 --> 03:18:21,680
would be really easy to make it so you

4952
03:18:20,160 --> 03:18:22,880
can do it but you can't necessarily cut

4953
03:18:21,680 --> 03:18:23,840
everybody off.

4954
03:18:22,880 --> 03:18:27,359
» Yeah.

4955
03:18:23,840 --> 03:18:29,040
» So timing wise we

4956
03:18:27,359 --> 03:18:32,239
I think we try to get them out as quick

4957
03:18:29,040 --> 03:18:35,520
as we possibly can. I know. I I meet

4958
03:18:32,239 --> 03:18:36,319
with Jenny on

4959
03:18:35,520 --> 03:18:39,279
» Tuesday.

4960
03:18:36,319 --> 03:18:41,040
» Tuesday before

4961
03:18:39,279 --> 03:18:44,319
like

4962
03:18:41,040 --> 03:18:46,319
this last like last Tuesday

4963
03:18:44,319 --> 03:18:49,200
» Tuesday before Tuesday.

4964
03:18:46,319 --> 03:18:51,120
So, but I mean we make the discussion,

4965
03:18:49,200 --> 03:18:53,760
you know, bring bring up the idea of the

4966
03:18:51,120 --> 03:18:55,680
agenda and what's on there and and so

4967
03:18:53,760 --> 03:18:57,760
then past that there's things that get

4968
03:18:55,680 --> 03:19:01,920
added, things are getting other

4969
03:18:57,760 --> 03:19:03,279
information getting sent. And so,

4970
03:19:01,920 --> 03:19:06,640
I mean, I don't know what we could do

4971
03:19:03,279 --> 03:19:08,000
about that, but I I do like the idea of

4972
03:19:06,640 --> 03:19:10,640
I mean, I like the idea of the

4973
03:19:08,000 --> 03:19:14,560
discussion we had today for that first

4974
03:19:10,640 --> 03:19:17,920
hour. I think that that helped somewhat

4975
03:19:14,560 --> 03:19:20,239
with the discussion later.

4976
03:19:17,920 --> 03:19:22,319
But I think any of that that we could

4977
03:19:20,239 --> 03:19:25,040
try to streamline,

4978
03:19:22,319 --> 03:19:27,359
you know, making those questions where

4979
03:19:25,040 --> 03:19:29,359
we're not necessarily having to talk to

4980
03:19:27,359 --> 03:19:31,040
the public and we will be talking to the

4981
03:19:29,359 --> 03:19:33,680
public,

4982
03:19:31,040 --> 03:19:36,319
we can have that discussion amongst us

4983
03:19:33,680 --> 03:19:39,279
and they can hear what's going on. So

4984
03:19:36,319 --> 03:19:42,880
anyway, that's my thoughts. Well, maybe

4985
03:19:39,279 --> 03:19:44,479
another thought too, Dan. You know, I

4986
03:19:42,880 --> 03:19:46,160
think saying we'll get us through the

4987
03:19:44,479 --> 03:19:48,160
6:00

4988
03:19:46,160 --> 03:19:50,720
work session

4989
03:19:48,160 --> 03:19:53,120
to have that. I'm wondering also if if

4990
03:19:50,720 --> 03:19:54,640
there's, you know, you see the consent

4991
03:19:53,120 --> 03:19:56,800
items

4992
03:19:54,640 --> 03:19:57,920
and I'm wondering if there, you know,

4993
03:19:56,800 --> 03:19:59,359
kind of take a look at some of these

4994
03:19:57,920 --> 03:20:01,439
things. Are there things that could be

4995
03:19:59,359 --> 03:20:05,439
just really consent?

4996
03:20:01,439 --> 03:20:08,800
There's a written item in the agenda.

4997
03:20:05,439 --> 03:20:11,439
So, yeah, you know what it is. And then

4998
03:20:08,800 --> 03:20:14,239
there's this one vote on on item A B C D

4999
03:20:11,439 --> 03:20:16,880
in common consent and there's not any

5000
03:20:14,239 --> 03:20:19,279
discussion at all. But you look at those

5001
03:20:16,880 --> 03:20:21,760
okay if we have enough back background

5002
03:20:19,279 --> 03:20:24,560
information and it doesn't really

5003
03:20:21,760 --> 03:20:26,319
require any other discussion. So that

5004
03:20:24,560 --> 03:20:28,960
could be just handled with with that

5005
03:20:26,319 --> 03:20:31,600
type of thing.

5006
03:20:28,960 --> 03:20:33,279
» I did enjoy Jill's comments though today

5007
03:20:31,600 --> 03:20:37,680
as far as what was going on. I think

5008
03:20:33,279 --> 03:20:40,880
that's important. I think having each to

5009
03:20:37,680 --> 03:20:43,439
the uh areas representative when they

5010
03:20:40,880 --> 03:20:45,439
need to. I think gives us a good feel

5011
03:20:43,439 --> 03:20:47,520
that they know what's going on and

5012
03:20:45,439 --> 03:20:49,520
they're double checking. So even if

5013
03:20:47,520 --> 03:20:51,040
maybe it only for two or three minutes,

5014
03:20:49,520 --> 03:20:53,439
I think that's helpful. I understand

5015
03:20:51,040 --> 03:20:56,000
where you're coming from and consolidate

5016
03:20:53,439 --> 03:20:57,920
the time. I like the discussions that we

5017
03:20:56,000 --> 03:21:00,160
have, but I don't want to go down a

5018
03:20:57,920 --> 03:21:02,479
rabbit hole and yet sometimes I know we

5019
03:21:00,160 --> 03:21:04,800
have to in order to get the information.

5020
03:21:02,479 --> 03:21:06,720
I'm not opposed to it, but I just watch

5021
03:21:04,800 --> 03:21:10,479
how it goes on and on and trying to get

5022
03:21:06,720 --> 03:21:12,000
discussions going and and we're getting

5023
03:21:10,479 --> 03:21:14,080
questions answered and we're thinking

5024
03:21:12,000 --> 03:21:17,439
about how we're going to vote. At the

5025
03:21:14,080 --> 03:21:21,120
same time, it's very detailed and and

5026
03:21:17,439 --> 03:21:24,239
takes a lot of time and I I don't know

5027
03:21:21,120 --> 03:21:26,160
if that's effective time. It is for that

5028
03:21:24,239 --> 03:21:28,720
one item, but it isn't for the whole

5029
03:21:26,160 --> 03:21:30,880
entire agenda of things that we need to

5030
03:21:28,720 --> 03:21:34,479
get to that we don't get to until very

5031
03:21:30,880 --> 03:21:36,640
last. I enjoyed the reports really and

5032
03:21:34,479 --> 03:21:38,640
yet they did last week.

5033
03:21:36,640 --> 03:21:40,239
» Okay.

5034
03:21:38,640 --> 03:21:42,640
» Is there an alternative way of getting

5035
03:21:40,239 --> 03:21:45,840
our questions answered outside of the

5036
03:21:42,640 --> 03:21:49,760
meeting? Is it just we email the person

5037
03:21:45,840 --> 03:21:51,760
who is on the agenda as a presenter?

5038
03:21:49,760 --> 03:21:55,520
» So you got to be careful with all that.

5039
03:21:51,760 --> 03:21:58,560
I think talk about that. That's

5040
03:21:55,520 --> 03:22:01,680
» You got to a lot of that discussion has

5041
03:21:58,560 --> 03:22:02,319
to happen in the public favor. all the

5042
03:22:01,680 --> 03:22:04,560
public meetings

5043
03:22:02,319 --> 03:22:07,439
» Among us.

5044
03:22:04,560 --> 03:22:09,359
» The problem with it is even even

5045
03:22:07,439 --> 03:22:11,439
answering those questions about that

5046
03:22:09,359 --> 03:22:13,439
become an issue as well.

5047
03:22:11,439 --> 03:22:15,520
» So it just does seem like we just need

5048
03:22:13,439 --> 03:22:17,840
more meeting time then I just don't see

5049
03:22:15,520 --> 03:22:20,000
a way around that.

5050
03:22:17,840 --> 03:22:22,880
And I I think if we have a discussion

5051
03:22:20,000 --> 03:22:24,479
time within that first hour and we all

5052
03:22:22,880 --> 03:22:27,920
are aware that that's going to take

5053
03:22:24,479 --> 03:22:30,399
place, then we know that we instead of

5054
03:22:27,920 --> 03:22:32,239
being here in 7, we're here at 6:00 and

5055
03:22:30,399 --> 03:22:35,120
we can have that. And I think if we come

5056
03:22:32,239 --> 03:22:36,640
prepared to do those items, we can get a

5057
03:22:35,120 --> 03:22:40,680
lot of that discussion out of the way

5058
03:22:36,640 --> 03:22:40,680
and then when we get to the audience

5059
03:22:41,200 --> 03:22:45,680
that happens with public hearings

5060
03:22:43,520 --> 03:22:49,840
because you might get some might change

5061
03:22:45,680 --> 03:22:52,720
your Yeah, but mayor maybe on that if in

5062
03:22:49,840 --> 03:22:54,080
that work session you see some of these

5063
03:22:52,720 --> 03:22:56,560
questions up that could be something

5064
03:22:54,080 --> 03:22:57,680
then when we come to agenda say okay we

5065
03:22:56,560 --> 03:22:59,840
have this we know these are going to

5066
03:22:57,680 --> 03:23:01,040
take longer let's put these further back

5067
03:22:59,840 --> 03:23:03,359
and let's get the other things done

5068
03:23:01,040 --> 03:23:06,000
quickly so people aren't just waiting

5069
03:23:03,359 --> 03:23:09,040
for some items you know like the fire

5070
03:23:06,000 --> 03:23:09,840
station or things like that thinking

5071
03:23:09,040 --> 03:23:13,120
about that done

5072
03:23:09,840 --> 03:23:13,840
» We can we can amend the agenda at the

5073
03:23:13,120 --> 03:23:14,720
beginning

5074
03:23:13,840 --> 03:23:16,880
» Of the meeting

5075
03:23:14,720 --> 03:23:20,479
» We have we have a work session, we see

5076
03:23:16,880 --> 03:23:21,840
that that can be changed. We make that

5077
03:23:20,479 --> 03:23:23,520
amendment at the beginning of the

5078
03:23:21,840 --> 03:23:25,680
meeting and that way everybody knows

5079
03:23:23,520 --> 03:23:28,080
what's in order.

5080
03:23:25,680 --> 03:23:31,680
» Yeah.

5081
03:23:28,080 --> 03:23:33,760
» So, do we just need three people to to

5082
03:23:31,680 --> 03:23:35,439
do the 6:00 work session?

5083
03:23:33,760 --> 03:23:38,800
» Yeah, we're happy to accommodate a work

5084
03:23:35,439 --> 03:23:40,640
session. Um, that's that's a bit easier.

5085
03:23:38,800 --> 03:23:42,560
It is very helpful if you send your

5086
03:23:40,640 --> 03:23:44,319
questions to staff members prior to

5087
03:23:42,560 --> 03:23:46,000
meetings that we can come prepared and

5088
03:23:44,319 --> 03:23:48,960
already know what your questions are.

5089
03:23:46,000 --> 03:23:50,560
That's very helpful. We do put anybody

5090
03:23:48,960 --> 03:23:52,720
that's doing a presentation, the

5091
03:23:50,560 --> 03:23:55,439
contracted, you know, we do that really

5092
03:23:52,720 --> 03:23:56,960
intentionally because we're trying to be

5093
03:23:55,439 --> 03:24:00,160
mindful of their time with how long

5094
03:23:56,960 --> 03:24:02,479
they're waiting. Um, but other things we

5095
03:24:00,160 --> 03:24:05,760
can manipulate hour of the council and

5096
03:24:02,479 --> 03:24:08,080
ultimately it's the mayor's agenda.

5097
03:24:05,760 --> 03:24:11,040
Well, I think one thing this time

5098
03:24:08,080 --> 03:24:12,560
because of Labor Day, I mean, I could

5099
03:24:11,040 --> 03:24:15,200
send my comments, but you guys wouldn't

5100
03:24:12,560 --> 03:24:17,120
get them until today and Sarah could

5101
03:24:15,200 --> 03:24:20,560
have sent some comments back and have

5102
03:24:17,120 --> 03:24:22,800
the discussion would have have happened,

5103
03:24:20,560 --> 03:24:24,640
you know, but again, that's because of

5104
03:24:22,800 --> 03:24:26,960
Labor Day and that is

5105
03:24:24,640 --> 03:24:29,359
» We'd still rather address your questions

5106
03:24:26,960 --> 03:24:31,040
in the public forum, but it prepares us

5107
03:24:29,359 --> 03:24:32,800
if we have it ahead of time. And yes, we

5108
03:24:31,040 --> 03:24:34,160
did have a holiday yesterday. It's rare

5109
03:24:32,800 --> 03:24:35,279
that that happens, but it does

5110
03:24:34,160 --> 03:24:37,920
occasionally.

5111
03:24:35,279 --> 03:24:40,720
» It does. It happens. So, anyhow, it's

5112
03:24:37,920 --> 03:24:42,960
just some of my thoughts. I I would nod

5113
03:24:40,720 --> 03:24:45,920
to say yes, it's a work session.

5114
03:24:42,960 --> 03:24:48,479
» So, do we need to amend the meeting

5115
03:24:45,920 --> 03:24:51,120
thing or or I know we we first of the

5116
03:24:48,479 --> 03:24:52,640
year we changed it just to one meeting.

5117
03:24:51,120 --> 03:24:54,080
I guess it's just work session. We're

5118
03:24:52,640 --> 03:24:57,040
okay. You not have to

5119
03:24:54,080 --> 03:24:57,439
» We can easily add a session.

5120
03:24:57,040 --> 03:24:58,800
Okay.

5121
03:24:57,439 --> 03:25:01,279
» So, that's the way we're going to move

5122
03:24:58,800 --> 03:25:04,720
ahead is just with the work session

5123
03:25:01,279 --> 03:25:05,760
» And then realign the decision,

5124
03:25:04,720 --> 03:25:06,319
» Streamline it.

5125
03:25:05,760 --> 03:25:07,520
» Yeah.

5126
03:25:06,319 --> 03:25:09,920
» Okay. Thank you.

5127
03:25:07,520 --> 03:25:11,920
» Um,

5128
03:25:09,920 --> 03:25:14,920
next item is rules and procedure

5129
03:25:11,920 --> 03:25:14,920
discussion.

5130
03:25:16,319 --> 03:25:21,040
So, this is something I've been working

5131
03:25:18,319 --> 03:25:22,319
on a little bit. Um, given the hour, I

5132
03:25:21,040 --> 03:25:25,359
don't know that I'm going to go too much

5133
03:25:22,319 --> 03:25:28,399
into it. Um, forgive me, but I get past

5134
03:25:25,359 --> 03:25:31,840
hour 15 in the day and I kind of lose my

5135
03:25:28,399 --> 03:25:33,120
mustard. Um, I know Mr. Montgomery

5136
03:25:31,840 --> 03:25:35,359
talked about this a while, just kind of

5137
03:25:33,120 --> 03:25:37,200
an update and a switch to our actual

5138
03:25:35,359 --> 03:25:40,880
rules of procedure in order. I have some

5139
03:25:37,200 --> 03:25:42,560
drafts uh that I've been preparing. Some

5140
03:25:40,880 --> 03:25:44,960
of this kind of bleeds into what we're

5141
03:25:42,560 --> 03:25:47,359
talking about because um, you know, we

5142
03:25:44,960 --> 03:25:48,880
talk about

5143
03:25:47,359 --> 03:25:50,080
following the open and public meeting

5144
03:25:48,880 --> 03:25:53,040
act. you do want to have your

5145
03:25:50,080 --> 03:25:54,160
discussions in public. Um, and you know,

5146
03:25:53,040 --> 03:25:56,800
when you're talking about getting

5147
03:25:54,160 --> 03:25:59,520
questions answered um, from a staff,

5148
03:25:56,800 --> 03:26:02,720
like council members are certainly okay

5149
03:25:59,520 --> 03:26:04,080
to ask questions. Um, but it kind of

5150
03:26:02,720 --> 03:26:06,399
gets a little tricky where one council

5151
03:26:04,080 --> 03:26:08,720
member really shouldn't be directing

5152
03:26:06,399 --> 03:26:11,040
staff or or or making them work

5153
03:26:08,720 --> 03:26:14,479
specifically for you. So, that's kind of

5154
03:26:11,040 --> 03:26:16,000
a a gray area. Uh, one thing that we

5155
03:26:14,479 --> 03:26:18,800
could do, kind of circling back to the

5156
03:26:16,000 --> 03:26:20,479
last conversation, is um, you know, when

5157
03:26:18,800 --> 03:26:22,720
there is a laundry list of questions

5158
03:26:20,479 --> 03:26:25,120
like Mr. Montgomery had tonight, uh,

5159
03:26:22,720 --> 03:26:27,600
that certainly be could be sent to staff

5160
03:26:25,120 --> 03:26:29,279
to be put in as part of the packet and

5161
03:26:27,600 --> 03:26:32,399
that would be an appropriate way to do

5162
03:26:29,279 --> 03:26:36,239
that. You don't want to email it out.

5163
03:26:32,399 --> 03:26:38,479
Um, I think if like hypothetically,

5164
03:26:36,239 --> 03:26:39,840
let's just say Mr. Montgomery sent you,

5165
03:26:38,479 --> 03:26:41,600
hey, these are all the questions I have

5166
03:26:39,840 --> 03:26:44,000
for tonight. I don't know that that

5167
03:26:41,600 --> 03:26:45,760
necessarily violates the act. The

5168
03:26:44,000 --> 03:26:47,359
problem is is that any discussion that

5169
03:26:45,760 --> 03:26:50,720
came from that outside of the meeting

5170
03:26:47,359 --> 03:26:53,680
would be problematic. So it's much it's

5171
03:26:50,720 --> 03:26:56,080
better to just how is that made possible

5172
03:26:53,680 --> 03:26:58,080
if we're getting the packet on Thursday

5173
03:26:56,080 --> 03:27:00,319
and you're supposed to have it in on

5174
03:26:58,080 --> 03:27:01,120
Thursday. Does that make sense? Your

5175
03:27:00,319 --> 03:27:02,160
questions.

5176
03:27:01,120 --> 03:27:02,640
» Yeah. I wouldn't be able to raise a

5177
03:27:02,160 --> 03:27:03,760
question to

5178
03:27:02,640 --> 03:27:05,439
» You wouldn't be able to raise questions

5179
03:27:03,760 --> 03:27:08,640
and have it go out in the packet because

5180
03:27:05,439 --> 03:27:10,479
you don't get the packet until it's out.

5181
03:27:08,640 --> 03:27:12,880
» Okay. But I think the idea is

5182
03:27:10,479 --> 03:27:15,359
» Yeah, you could send that to staff and

5183
03:27:12,880 --> 03:27:18,399
that could be part of like you could do

5184
03:27:15,359 --> 03:27:20,479
an amended packet um or anything like

5185
03:27:18,399 --> 03:27:22,640
that for those type of questions.

5186
03:27:20,479 --> 03:27:24,160
There's a way there's a way to do that.

5187
03:27:22,640 --> 03:27:27,279
I understand your question if you don't

5188
03:27:24,160 --> 03:27:30,000
have any idea that it's coming. Um but I

5189
03:27:27,279 --> 03:27:32,000
mean we can work on that with work

5190
03:27:30,000 --> 03:27:34,160
sessions and things like that because if

5191
03:27:32,000 --> 03:27:36,399
there was a work session and then you

5192
03:27:34,160 --> 03:27:38,239
you know had a later meeting you could

5193
03:27:36,399 --> 03:27:39,760
have a list of questions like that

5194
03:27:38,239 --> 03:27:44,399
provided.

5195
03:27:39,760 --> 03:27:46,000
Um and then also too um when there is

5196
03:27:44,399 --> 03:27:47,760
like today would be a good example if

5197
03:27:46,000 --> 03:27:49,040
you send that to staff even after the

5198
03:27:47,760 --> 03:27:50,560
staff could make that part of the record

5199
03:27:49,040 --> 03:27:54,399
and get to each individual council

5200
03:27:50,560 --> 03:27:57,920
member. So that could be done. Um,

5201
03:27:54,399 --> 03:28:00,399
» Can I ask a question about if we have

5202
03:27:57,920 --> 03:28:03,040
some agenda items

5203
03:28:00,399 --> 03:28:05,439
figured out, can we send out the

5204
03:28:03,040 --> 03:28:07,840
information as like a partial packet as

5205
03:28:05,439 --> 03:28:09,920
soon as we have it or does it the final

5206
03:28:07,840 --> 03:28:13,359
agenda have to be done and all the

5207
03:28:09,920 --> 03:28:14,720
information all the extras that go along

5208
03:28:13,359 --> 03:28:16,319
with it all has to be sent together?

5209
03:28:14,720 --> 03:28:18,960
» You have to Yeah, I mean it should be

5210
03:28:16,319 --> 03:28:21,439
set together once the meeting is

5211
03:28:18,960 --> 03:28:24,720
notified, put on the websites, noticed

5212
03:28:21,439 --> 03:28:26,720
and and sent out. Um,

5213
03:28:24,720 --> 03:28:28,399
yeah, there's I understand what you're

5214
03:28:26,720 --> 03:28:30,160
saying. There's just really not a a

5215
03:28:28,399 --> 03:28:32,479
great way to kind of piece in all that

5216
03:28:30,160 --> 03:28:36,200
because of the noticing and the

5217
03:28:32,479 --> 03:28:36,200
transparency requirements.

5218
03:28:36,880 --> 03:28:40,160
Okay. Specifically, and like I said, as

5219
03:28:38,640 --> 03:28:43,680
far as the rules of procedure, they are

5220
03:28:40,160 --> 03:28:45,840
adequated. They need to be updated. Um,

5221
03:28:43,680 --> 03:28:48,160
there needs to be some updates uh for

5222
03:28:45,840 --> 03:28:49,840
electronic participation, things like

5223
03:28:48,160 --> 03:28:52,080
that. A couple of things that I kind of

5224
03:28:49,840 --> 03:28:54,319
wanted some conversation on. Again, I

5225
03:28:52,080 --> 03:28:58,319
don't want to take forever, but one of

5226
03:28:54,319 --> 03:29:01,520
the things that come up is uh if

5227
03:28:58,319 --> 03:29:03,439
somebody wants to abstain from a vote,

5228
03:29:01,520 --> 03:29:05,359
uh one, do we want to put specific

5229
03:29:03,439 --> 03:29:07,040
requirements of why you can do that or

5230
03:29:05,359 --> 03:29:11,120
do you want to just allow that for any

5231
03:29:07,040 --> 03:29:14,880
reason? And then if the abstension

5232
03:29:11,120 --> 03:29:16,800
results in a tie, um should that be a a

5233
03:29:14,880 --> 03:29:18,239
no vote or should that be a tie that

5234
03:29:16,800 --> 03:29:21,520
then goes to the mayor? Those are two

5235
03:29:18,239 --> 03:29:23,600
questions that um the rules and

5236
03:29:21,520 --> 03:29:25,680
procedures of every city need to address

5237
03:29:23,600 --> 03:29:27,120
because it's not addressed in state law.

5238
03:29:25,680 --> 03:29:28,960
Kind of something I wanted to have

5239
03:29:27,120 --> 03:29:31,200
direction for as they kind of draft this

5240
03:29:28,960 --> 03:29:34,319
for what you know I'll propose that

5241
03:29:31,200 --> 03:29:37,760
we'll send to you.

5242
03:29:34,319 --> 03:29:39,840
» I guess I have a comment on that is we

5243
03:29:37,760 --> 03:29:41,520
were elected from the citizens and

5244
03:29:39,840 --> 03:29:45,359
there's nothing that we should be able

5245
03:29:41,520 --> 03:29:48,080
to abstain from in my opinion.

5246
03:29:45,359 --> 03:29:49,840
So I don't think I can cancel myself out

5247
03:29:48,080 --> 03:29:52,160
of anybody.

5248
03:29:49,840 --> 03:29:53,760
So I would agree. I think all of us

5249
03:29:52,160 --> 03:29:56,560
should be that way. But that's my

5250
03:29:53,760 --> 03:29:58,720
opinion.

5251
03:29:56,560 --> 03:30:00,560
» I think though there are times that

5252
03:29:58,720 --> 03:30:03,439
there is a conflict of interest.

5253
03:30:00,560 --> 03:30:05,439
» Well, so and and forgive me. We're not

5254
03:30:03,439 --> 03:30:07,680
talking about a conflict where you're

5255
03:30:05,439 --> 03:30:10,640
required to not vote. We're talking

5256
03:30:07,680 --> 03:30:11,920
about well these people are mad and but

5257
03:30:10,640 --> 03:30:13,760
my wife's going to be mad at me if I

5258
03:30:11,920 --> 03:30:16,239
vote and I don't want to vote. I want to

5259
03:30:13,760 --> 03:30:18,720
go home and I go back.

5260
03:30:16,239 --> 03:30:20,399
» So, it's a what a we could call it a

5261
03:30:18,720 --> 03:30:22,399
voluntary

5262
03:30:20,399 --> 03:30:24,399
abstension from the vote, not a

5263
03:30:22,399 --> 03:30:26,479
conflict, not any ethical requirement,

5264
03:30:24,399 --> 03:30:28,319
then where you shouldn't vote.

5265
03:30:26,479 --> 03:30:31,279
» I guess the question I have is who

5266
03:30:28,319 --> 03:30:33,439
determines which of which because I

5267
03:30:31,279 --> 03:30:35,760
mean, if I think there's a conflict of

5268
03:30:33,439 --> 03:30:38,319
interest, but I don't necessarily have

5269
03:30:35,760 --> 03:30:40,560
the legal involved inside of that.

5270
03:30:38,319 --> 03:30:42,000
» Yeah. So, that's a good question. And so

5271
03:30:40,560 --> 03:30:43,359
anytime you're concerned about a

5272
03:30:42,000 --> 03:30:47,040
conflict of interest, that's what I'm

5273
03:30:43,359 --> 03:30:48,319
hired to do. Um, and you can contact me

5274
03:30:47,040 --> 03:30:51,840
privately and we can have that

5275
03:30:48,319 --> 03:30:55,120
discussion uh to I can give you my

5276
03:30:51,840 --> 03:30:58,399
opinion ultimately. Um, and I say this

5277
03:30:55,120 --> 03:31:00,479
not sarcastically, but you as an elected

5278
03:30:58,399 --> 03:31:02,880
official are the most protected person

5279
03:31:00,479 --> 03:31:05,760
under law. You can actually violate

5280
03:31:02,880 --> 03:31:08,239
quite a few laws with no result. Uh, so

5281
03:31:05,760 --> 03:31:09,840
it's your decision. So, if you're

5282
03:31:08,239 --> 03:31:12,880
worried about a conflict, my advice

5283
03:31:09,840 --> 03:31:15,520
would be let's talk about it. Um,

5284
03:31:12,880 --> 03:31:17,920
» Well, we don't always have time. If we

5285
03:31:15,520 --> 03:31:20,000
don't if we're not aware of the conflict

5286
03:31:17,920 --> 03:31:20,960
until we get here and you're not at this

5287
03:31:20,000 --> 03:31:23,279
meeting,

5288
03:31:20,960 --> 03:31:24,720
» Then we just have to decide on our own,

5289
03:31:23,279 --> 03:31:26,800
» Which happened at the last meeting to

5290
03:31:24,720 --> 03:31:27,920
me. And I don't necessarily know how

5291
03:31:26,800 --> 03:31:31,439
that should have gone.

5292
03:31:27,920 --> 03:31:34,319
» Okay. But uh I just feel like if we're

5293
03:31:31,439 --> 03:31:35,840
being held to a certain standard,

5294
03:31:34,319 --> 03:31:37,840
but we're not clear what that standard

5295
03:31:35,840 --> 03:31:40,160
is.

5296
03:31:37,840 --> 03:31:43,359
» Yeah. So again, that's it's a good

5297
03:31:40,160 --> 03:31:44,880
question. They're separate questions. Um

5298
03:31:43,359 --> 03:31:46,399
let's say it's in the meeting and I'm

5299
03:31:44,880 --> 03:31:49,920
not here and I apologize if I wasn't

5300
03:31:46,399 --> 03:31:51,600
able to make it last time, but um we can

5301
03:31:49,920 --> 03:31:54,319
have a you can ask for a fivem minute

5302
03:31:51,600 --> 03:31:56,000
recess and we'll discuss it privately. I

5303
03:31:54,319 --> 03:31:58,399
mean

5304
03:31:56,000 --> 03:32:00,960
you

5305
03:31:58,399 --> 03:32:03,120
you heir on a on a conflict of either

5306
03:32:00,960 --> 03:32:04,720
discussing it with me, I will give you

5307
03:32:03,120 --> 03:32:06,800
advice ultimately, it's your decision.

5308
03:32:04,720 --> 03:32:11,359
You connect with or against my advice,

5309
03:32:06,800 --> 03:32:12,960
right? Um, but my my general advice

5310
03:32:11,359 --> 03:32:15,920
would be is if you're worried about it,

5311
03:32:12,960 --> 03:32:19,560
then you should you should declare the

5312
03:32:15,920 --> 03:32:19,560
conflict and not

5313
03:32:20,319 --> 03:32:26,560
in some situations I've seen where the

5314
03:32:23,680 --> 03:32:29,040
person will say, "I have a conflict of

5315
03:32:26,560 --> 03:32:32,319
interest at the meeting." Explain it.

5316
03:32:29,040 --> 03:32:35,200
And then the board, the commission, the

5317
03:32:32,319 --> 03:32:36,640
council then says, "No, you don't have a

5318
03:32:35,200 --> 03:32:39,840
conflict." Or, "Yes, you do have a

5319
03:32:36,640 --> 03:32:42,239
conflict." And then that determines

5320
03:32:39,840 --> 03:32:44,319
whether you leave the room

5321
03:32:42,239 --> 03:32:46,800
» Or or you stay in your zone.

5322
03:32:44,319 --> 03:32:48,640
» So, I would say that is a kind of a

5323
03:32:46,800 --> 03:32:51,279
standard practice that we've done for a

5324
03:32:48,640 --> 03:32:54,960
long time. Um, I'm not sure that's the

5325
03:32:51,279 --> 03:32:57,120
wisest practice in my opinion because

5326
03:32:54,960 --> 03:32:58,960
ultimately

5327
03:32:57,120 --> 03:33:00,640
if you did make a vote in conflict,

5328
03:32:58,960 --> 03:33:02,720
right, it's a violation of the the

5329
03:33:00,640 --> 03:33:06,319
ethics act and that's your

5330
03:33:02,720 --> 03:33:08,880
responsibility, not the boards. So, uh,

5331
03:33:06,319 --> 03:33:10,960
I don't think that's the best. I think,

5332
03:33:08,880 --> 03:33:13,439
you know, me as the attorney for the

5333
03:33:10,960 --> 03:33:15,520
city, I can advise you on that. um if it

5334
03:33:13,439 --> 03:33:18,319
was really a big issue and a question I

5335
03:33:15,520 --> 03:33:23,439
mean and you could always ask your own

5336
03:33:18,319 --> 03:33:25,439
counsel if you wanted to do that. Um but

5337
03:33:23,439 --> 03:33:26,720
let's say you disclose a conflict or a

5338
03:33:25,439 --> 03:33:29,600
potential conflict and then everyone

5339
03:33:26,720 --> 03:33:31,920
says ah no you're fine and then later

5340
03:33:29,600 --> 03:33:33,680
someone challenges on that on you the

5341
03:33:31,920 --> 03:33:35,840
consequences are yours but not the

5342
03:33:33,680 --> 03:33:36,640
council. So I don't know that that's the

5343
03:33:35,840 --> 03:33:39,600
best practice.

5344
03:33:36,640 --> 03:33:43,680
» Okay. But then maybe on your follow-up

5345
03:33:39,600 --> 03:33:47,040
question I think about well what your

5346
03:33:43,680 --> 03:33:48,800
second question was about conflict and

5347
03:33:47,040 --> 03:33:49,359
then

5348
03:33:48,800 --> 03:33:52,160
yeah

5349
03:33:49,359 --> 03:33:52,720
» I think that should just end to break

5350
03:33:52,160 --> 03:33:54,000
the tie

5351
03:33:52,720 --> 03:33:58,600
» Break the tie.

5352
03:33:54,000 --> 03:33:58,600
» Okay that's my opinion.

5353
03:33:59,359 --> 03:34:02,960
» So that's the second part. The first

5354
03:34:00,880 --> 03:34:04,800
part is should that be allowed? It's

5355
03:34:02,960 --> 03:34:06,080
just that hey I'm not voting on this.

5356
03:34:04,800 --> 03:34:08,080
No,

5357
03:34:06,080 --> 03:34:11,040
» I don't know that it should be allowed.

5358
03:34:08,080 --> 03:34:12,479
» Okay. And really, I'm just This is how

5359
03:34:11,040 --> 03:34:14,160
how I'm going to draft the rules of

5360
03:34:12,479 --> 03:34:15,920
procedure specific to Harrisville

5361
03:34:14,160 --> 03:34:20,720
because it's one of those areas, like I

5362
03:34:15,920 --> 03:34:23,200
said, the state doesn't opine on. Um,

5363
03:34:20,720 --> 03:34:24,720
you know, I I tend to agree that it

5364
03:34:23,200 --> 03:34:26,479
shouldn't be allowed personally just

5365
03:34:24,720 --> 03:34:27,680
because you guys signed up for this,

5366
03:34:26,479 --> 03:34:30,000
right?

5367
03:34:27,680 --> 03:34:32,160
you your responsibility, your mantle is

5368
03:34:30,000 --> 03:34:34,080
to vote and and if you're not voting,

5369
03:34:32,160 --> 03:34:37,200
they should be for an ethical legal

5370
03:34:34,080 --> 03:34:40,960
reason not to vote when you can't like

5371
03:34:37,200 --> 03:34:45,680
if I lived on West Ser Road, I would ask

5372
03:34:40,960 --> 03:34:48,399
if I could give out, but I don't. So

5373
03:34:45,680 --> 03:34:50,960
that's that's about the only way I think

5374
03:34:48,399 --> 03:34:54,080
it would be okay.

5375
03:34:50,960 --> 03:34:55,760
» Go ahead. My question is if that is the

5376
03:34:54,080 --> 03:34:57,359
legal

5377
03:34:55,760 --> 03:35:00,319
verbiage

5378
03:34:57,359 --> 03:35:03,439
and we feel we feel we're not sure where

5379
03:35:00,319 --> 03:35:05,279
we fall conflict of interest or we will

5380
03:35:03,439 --> 03:35:08,160
be held accountable for not voting when

5381
03:35:05,279 --> 03:35:11,920
we should have

5382
03:35:08,160 --> 03:35:13,120
what do you do with that how do we

5383
03:35:11,920 --> 03:35:15,040
is does that mean there's legal

5384
03:35:13,120 --> 03:35:17,279
consequences either way potentially for

5385
03:35:15,040 --> 03:35:18,880
us there's no safety

5386
03:35:17,279 --> 03:35:21,439
» So what I'm talking about is the rules

5387
03:35:18,880 --> 03:35:24,319
of procedure right and basically without

5388
03:35:21,439 --> 03:35:26,160
a rule, you can voluntarily abstain from

5389
03:35:24,319 --> 03:35:28,960
above because it's kind of this gray

5390
03:35:26,160 --> 03:35:31,040
area that's allowed and you can just say

5391
03:35:28,960 --> 03:35:32,960
I don't want to.

5392
03:35:31,040 --> 03:35:34,479
» Maybe there's political consequences to

5393
03:35:32,960 --> 03:35:36,160
that.

5394
03:35:34,479 --> 03:35:37,920
» So, can we add some sort of verbage that

5395
03:35:36,160 --> 03:35:41,040
says if you believe you have a conflict

5396
03:35:37,920 --> 03:35:43,439
of interest rather than there exists,

5397
03:35:41,040 --> 03:35:46,640
» Your conflict of interest is already set

5398
03:35:43,439 --> 03:35:49,600
up that way. If the conflict of interest

5399
03:35:46,640 --> 03:35:51,760
is yours to declare, it's not something

5400
03:35:49,600 --> 03:35:53,600
that's imposed on you by anyone else. So

5401
03:35:51,760 --> 03:35:55,760
if you believe you have a conflict, then

5402
03:35:53,600 --> 03:35:58,080
you say, "I have a conflict on this and

5403
03:35:55,760 --> 03:36:01,600
I can't vote."

5404
03:35:58,080 --> 03:36:04,080
So it's simple as Yeah. What I'm talking

5405
03:36:01,600 --> 03:36:04,399
about is when there isn't a conflict at

5406
03:36:04,080 --> 03:36:05,760
all.

5407
03:36:04,399 --> 03:36:08,000
» Yes, I understand. But if it's

5408
03:36:05,760 --> 03:36:09,520
adjudicated later that oh that person

5409
03:36:08,000 --> 03:36:11,120
actually didn't have a conflict of

5410
03:36:09,520 --> 03:36:13,760
interest but they declared it because

5411
03:36:11,120 --> 03:36:15,200
they wanted someone suspects they wanted

5412
03:36:13,760 --> 03:36:18,960
to get out of the vote.

5413
03:36:15,200 --> 03:36:20,560
» So that would be that would be extremely

5414
03:36:18,960 --> 03:36:22,640
difficult

5415
03:36:20,560 --> 03:36:25,680
and you wouldn't be in trouble for

5416
03:36:22,640 --> 03:36:28,720
imposing maybe a a bigger conflict than

5417
03:36:25,680 --> 03:36:30,880
it is because ultimately it's your

5418
03:36:28,720 --> 03:36:33,520
decision, right? You have all the

5419
03:36:30,880 --> 03:36:36,560
information about the conflict for you.

5420
03:36:33,520 --> 03:36:38,399
So it's it's yours to make. It's yours

5421
03:36:36,560 --> 03:36:39,840
to claim. I don't think I don't know

5422
03:36:38,399 --> 03:36:41,120
that there's actually a recourse if

5423
03:36:39,840 --> 03:36:42,000
somebody says, "Well, I have a conflict

5424
03:36:41,120 --> 03:36:43,120
that I can't."

5425
03:36:42,000 --> 03:36:46,479
» I think that

5426
03:36:43,120 --> 03:36:49,840
» Sorry for being persistent about it.

5427
03:36:46,479 --> 03:36:51,920
» Yeah. So that I'll say it this way. So

5428
03:36:49,840 --> 03:36:54,319
maybe it's I'm saying it backwards for

5429
03:36:51,920 --> 03:36:56,560
your question, but the only way you're

5430
03:36:54,319 --> 03:36:58,160
going to get in trouble is if you had a

5431
03:36:56,560 --> 03:37:00,800
conflict

5432
03:36:58,160 --> 03:37:03,120
that was objectively clear and just

5433
03:37:00,800 --> 03:37:06,080
ignored that they voted

5434
03:37:03,120 --> 03:37:09,560
» Or didn't vote without stating a

5435
03:37:06,080 --> 03:37:09,560
conflict of interest.

5436
03:37:11,760 --> 03:37:17,120
» No. So that's that's where I'm talking

5437
03:37:14,000 --> 03:37:19,279
about with the absention is if you

5438
03:37:17,120 --> 03:37:21,760
didn't have

5439
03:37:19,279 --> 03:37:24,560
a conflict and you just don't want to

5440
03:37:21,760 --> 03:37:25,359
vote, I'm asking what you guys want the

5441
03:37:24,560 --> 03:37:26,880
rules to be.

5442
03:37:25,359 --> 03:37:28,800
» Right. And if we have a rule that says

5443
03:37:26,880 --> 03:37:30,479
you must vote, then that can also get

5444
03:37:28,800 --> 03:37:32,800
you into trouble if we don't vote

5445
03:37:30,479 --> 03:37:35,279
» For violating our rules. Yes.

5446
03:37:32,800 --> 03:37:39,200
» Just

5447
03:37:35,279 --> 03:37:41,359
» Okay. So I know I got a couple.

5448
03:37:39,200 --> 03:37:44,399
Allow it. Don't allow what we do. Give

5449
03:37:41,359 --> 03:37:46,000
me some direction here.

5450
03:37:44,399 --> 03:37:48,640
» We have Blair and myself.

5451
03:37:46,000 --> 03:37:49,120
» I should be we should be required to

5452
03:37:48,640 --> 03:37:52,840
vote.

5453
03:37:49,120 --> 03:37:52,840
» Yeah, there you go.

5454
03:37:58,160 --> 03:38:04,640
» Okay. Uh that that was the biggest one.

5455
03:38:01,680 --> 03:38:06,479
Um, I'll make a lot of uh legal

5456
03:38:04,640 --> 03:38:09,120
adjustments mostly for technology to

5457
03:38:06,479 --> 03:38:11,840
update our rules and then I'll send uh

5458
03:38:09,120 --> 03:38:13,920
send that out for your review. Um, and

5459
03:38:11,840 --> 03:38:15,920
then we'll bring that back for an

5460
03:38:13,920 --> 03:38:18,239
ordinance that would update and passing

5461
03:38:15,920 --> 03:38:19,840
rules and procedures.

5462
03:38:18,239 --> 03:38:21,520
» So, that would sound like that'd be a

5463
03:38:19,840 --> 03:38:24,319
great item to do a work session on

5464
03:38:21,520 --> 03:38:28,600
before you get to the point of actually

5465
03:38:24,319 --> 03:38:28,600
getting the ordinance put together.

5466
03:38:29,520 --> 03:38:33,840
» That's fine.

5467
03:38:31,279 --> 03:38:36,000
That's how you get one done.

5468
03:38:33,840 --> 03:38:37,840
Okay.

5469
03:38:36,000 --> 03:38:41,760
All right. Thanks, Brody. Let's go on to

5470
03:38:37,840 --> 03:38:44,880
the next item. The item F. Discussion

5471
03:38:41,760 --> 03:38:47,120
possible action to adopt resolution

5472
03:38:44,880 --> 03:38:51,279
26-24,

5473
03:38:47,120 --> 03:38:54,160
special event policy.

5474
03:38:51,279 --> 03:38:56,399
» Thank you, Mayor. Um, council, this is

5475
03:38:54,160 --> 03:38:59,040
an item that was tabled at our last

5476
03:38:56,399 --> 03:39:01,359
meeting for some additional information.

5477
03:38:59,040 --> 03:39:04,399
I will be clear that this can also just

5478
03:39:01,359 --> 03:39:06,319
be a discussion uh item. You can table

5479
03:39:04,399 --> 03:39:08,239
again if I haven't provided the

5480
03:39:06,319 --> 03:39:11,520
information that you're seeking for it.

5481
03:39:08,239 --> 03:39:13,200
I did reach out. I believe ma mainly the

5482
03:39:11,520 --> 03:39:16,000
concerns that we had at our last

5483
03:39:13,200 --> 03:39:18,399
discussion were liability related or how

5484
03:39:16,000 --> 03:39:21,600
much insurance we should require from

5485
03:39:18,399 --> 03:39:24,960
the applicants. I did get in contact

5486
03:39:21,600 --> 03:39:27,359
with our insurance provider.

5487
03:39:24,960 --> 03:39:29,200
our claims.

5488
03:39:27,359 --> 03:39:31,840
I guess I could call him the specialist,

5489
03:39:29,200 --> 03:39:33,439
Jason Wat of the trust. He's also happy

5490
03:39:31,840 --> 03:39:35,359
to provide this information to you if

5491
03:39:33,439 --> 03:39:39,359
you have additional questions regarding

5492
03:39:35,359 --> 03:39:41,760
these items. He suggested first off, he

5493
03:39:39,359 --> 03:39:45,279
said our policy looks great. He likes a

5494
03:39:41,760 --> 03:39:48,800
lot of detail, our permit, so we could

5495
03:39:45,279 --> 03:39:52,080
ask for and require even more additional

5496
03:39:48,800 --> 03:39:54,319
information in our permit if you'd like.

5497
03:39:52,080 --> 03:40:01,120
The items I wanted to just address

5498
03:39:54,319 --> 03:40:04,080
briefly this evening are we we had a

5499
03:40:01,120 --> 03:40:06,319
a section in here about the attendance

5500
03:40:04,080 --> 03:40:09,760
and whether or not the public event

5501
03:40:06,319 --> 03:40:14,239
would have more than 500 people. We kind

5502
03:40:09,760 --> 03:40:16,640
of had language that gave it an option.

5503
03:40:14,239 --> 03:40:19,120
We've made that a little bit more strict

5504
03:40:16,640 --> 03:40:22,560
that if they're going to have more than

5505
03:40:19,120 --> 03:40:24,640
500 people, they must apply for that

5506
03:40:22,560 --> 03:40:27,120
mass gathering permit and then it's up

5507
03:40:24,640 --> 03:40:29,359
to the health department for them to

5508
03:40:27,120 --> 03:40:31,600
meet those requirements and provide

5509
03:40:29,359 --> 03:40:34,399
that. It doesn't it kind of removes the

5510
03:40:31,600 --> 03:40:35,760
city from making that determination. So,

5511
03:40:34,399 --> 03:40:37,040
these are not in your package.

5512
03:40:35,760 --> 03:40:37,520
» Oh, I was going to say I didn't see

5513
03:40:37,040 --> 03:40:39,279
that. Okay.

5514
03:40:37,520 --> 03:40:40,880
» They're here for discussion because they

5515
03:40:39,279 --> 03:40:44,080
were late in the day when they were

5516
03:40:40,880 --> 03:40:47,200
added to this. So, we've added language

5517
03:40:44,080 --> 03:40:50,080
that the application is due to the

5518
03:40:47,200 --> 03:40:52,800
Weaver Morgan Health Department 30 days

5519
03:40:50,080 --> 03:40:57,439
before the event. So, I have that

5520
03:40:52,800 --> 03:41:00,000
language added to the policy. There are

5521
03:40:57,439 --> 03:41:02,080
there was another suggestion by our

5522
03:41:00,000 --> 03:41:06,399
coverage

5523
03:41:02,080 --> 03:41:09,920
to identify excluded activities that the

5524
03:41:06,399 --> 03:41:12,399
city is not covered for in the policy.

5525
03:41:09,920 --> 03:41:14,720
So, we're specifically calling out, but

5526
03:41:12,399 --> 03:41:16,960
it's not limited to because we can't

5527
03:41:14,720 --> 03:41:21,920
possibly think of everything people

5528
03:41:16,960 --> 03:41:26,000
might try to do. And this is related to

5529
03:41:21,920 --> 03:41:29,040
events on city property as well. But the

5530
03:41:26,000 --> 03:41:31,600
following list are rebound devices,

5531
03:41:29,040 --> 03:41:34,239
anything trampoline related, any and we

5532
03:41:31,600 --> 03:41:37,040
included inflatable devices that may or

5533
03:41:34,239 --> 03:41:38,800
may not include water features. Some of

5534
03:41:37,040 --> 03:41:41,040
those inflatable devices they don't

5535
03:41:38,800 --> 03:41:43,200
consider bounce houses because they have

5536
03:41:41,040 --> 03:41:45,520
a water feature. We're just identifying

5537
03:41:43,200 --> 03:41:50,640
any inflatable device. We do not have

5538
03:41:45,520 --> 03:41:54,160
coverage for that. We also outlined

5539
03:41:50,640 --> 03:41:56,160
fireworks, mechanical amusement rides,

5540
03:41:54,160 --> 03:41:59,040
motor vehicle related events. These

5541
03:41:56,160 --> 03:42:01,040
would be like a de demolition der derby

5542
03:41:59,040 --> 03:42:06,000
or a dirt bike race or something like

5543
03:42:01,040 --> 03:42:08,160
that. And aircraft drones. um anything

5544
03:42:06,000 --> 03:42:10,720
like that would be excluded and not in

5545
03:42:08,160 --> 03:42:12,720
our coverage. So any event that uses any

5546
03:42:10,720 --> 03:42:14,000
of that we would not approve on city

5547
03:42:12,720 --> 03:42:16,880
property.

5548
03:42:14,000 --> 03:42:19,040
» Um motor vehicle related events sort of

5549
03:42:16,880 --> 03:42:22,160
sounds like car shows that

5550
03:42:19,040 --> 03:42:25,359
» Car shows are actually

5551
03:42:22,160 --> 03:42:27,439
a low risk as if they're a show and

5552
03:42:25,359 --> 03:42:29,520
they're parked

5553
03:42:27,439 --> 03:42:34,319
moving. So if you want further clarity

5554
03:42:29,520 --> 03:42:36,880
on motor related activi um moving motor

5555
03:42:34,319 --> 03:42:39,040
related activities we also talked about

5556
03:42:36,880 --> 03:42:42,319
does this include you know it's the

5557
03:42:39,040 --> 03:42:44,640
whole electric bike scooter discussion

5558
03:42:42,319 --> 03:42:46,640
it's really tricky so you feel like

5559
03:42:44,640 --> 03:42:49,359
there's better language we can use in

5560
03:42:46,640 --> 03:42:52,160
here we're happy to include it that was

5561
03:42:49,359 --> 03:42:54,160
just what was suggested by our

5562
03:42:52,160 --> 03:42:57,120
insuranceances he said motor vehicle

5563
03:42:54,160 --> 03:42:59,359
related events is there something in our

5564
03:42:57,120 --> 03:43:00,960
polic policy that gives us garbage.

5565
03:42:59,359 --> 03:43:01,600
» We're agreeing to put our policy.

5566
03:43:00,960 --> 03:43:03,680
» This is the policy.

5567
03:43:01,600 --> 03:43:06,479
» This is the policy. Yeah.

5568
03:43:03,680 --> 03:43:09,040
» If it comes from the policy that we

5569
03:43:06,479 --> 03:43:11,600
could spell it out further to high-risk

5570
03:43:09,040 --> 03:43:14,800
events would include demolition derby,

5571
03:43:11,600 --> 03:43:18,640
derbies, anything racing, burnouts,

5572
03:43:14,800 --> 03:43:20,960
lowrisk auto events would be car shows,

5573
03:43:18,640 --> 03:43:25,120
things that the the vehicles are not

5574
03:43:20,960 --> 03:43:28,560
moving. For example, I know a couple

5575
03:43:25,120 --> 03:43:32,640
years ago when we had

5576
03:43:28,560 --> 03:43:35,840
the fall thing, we had a little train

5577
03:43:32,640 --> 03:43:38,319
that was a cart and so it pulled cars

5578
03:43:35,840 --> 03:43:40,640
behind it and that would technically be

5579
03:43:38,319 --> 03:43:44,319
a motor vehicle.

5580
03:43:40,640 --> 03:43:47,520
» You notice we didn't have one next year.

5581
03:43:44,319 --> 03:43:48,000
» So that would be pulled by a motor.

5582
03:43:47,520 --> 03:43:49,840
» Yeah,

5583
03:43:48,000 --> 03:43:52,000
» It would not be in the lab. And these

5584
03:43:49,840 --> 03:43:53,680
are items that were drawn to my

5585
03:43:52,000 --> 03:43:54,960
attention specifically that we don't

5586
03:43:53,680 --> 03:43:57,520
have coverage for.

5587
03:43:54,960 --> 03:44:00,000
» Okay. So in that respect, let's talk

5588
03:43:57,520 --> 03:44:02,000
about the ebikes. Does that consider

5589
03:44:00,000 --> 03:44:04,479
them as a motor vehicle even though

5590
03:44:02,000 --> 03:44:05,279
they're not necessarily registered as a

5591
03:44:04,479 --> 03:44:07,680
motor vehicle?

5592
03:44:05,279 --> 03:44:11,359
» Can you add right there, Jenny? Ridden

5593
03:44:07,680 --> 03:44:13,279
or driven motor vehicle?

5594
03:44:11,359 --> 03:44:15,520
» Driven. I put whatever.

5595
03:44:13,279 --> 03:44:18,160
» I'm just saying that would count. That's

5596
03:44:15,520 --> 03:44:20,239
all I'm saying. and and this is this is

5597
03:44:18,160 --> 03:44:22,479
a discussion about special events,

5598
03:44:20,239 --> 03:44:24,720
right? We can address rights and that

5599
03:44:22,479 --> 03:44:27,760
kind of a policy separately, but this is

5600
03:44:24,720 --> 03:44:30,479
specifically whether you want to allow

5601
03:44:27,760 --> 03:44:31,600
people that are flying for a for a

5602
03:44:30,479 --> 03:44:33,760
special event.

5603
03:44:31,600 --> 03:44:35,439
» So, as we jump down to the insurance

5604
03:44:33,760 --> 03:44:38,160
requirements,

5605
03:44:35,439 --> 03:44:41,359
the his suggestion was actually the

5606
03:44:38,160 --> 03:44:43,040
liability limit shall be $2 million

5607
03:44:41,359 --> 03:44:45,680
combined single limit for personal

5608
03:44:43,040 --> 03:44:49,279
injury and property damage.

5609
03:44:45,680 --> 03:44:52,560
Um certainly we can require more but

5610
03:44:49,279 --> 03:44:56,319
that was the minimum that he suggested

5611
03:44:52,560 --> 03:44:58,640
and I did um and we do have a disclaimer

5612
03:44:56,319 --> 03:45:00,560
here that the city reserves the right to

5613
03:44:58,640 --> 03:45:03,199
require additional insurance based on

5614
03:45:00,560 --> 03:45:05,520
the nature and the risk of the event. So

5615
03:45:03,199 --> 03:45:08,560
just application itself for the permit

5616
03:45:05,520 --> 03:45:10,399
does not automatically qualify them.

5617
03:45:08,560 --> 03:45:12,160
It's not an approval just because they

5618
03:45:10,399 --> 03:45:14,880
applied for the permit. It has to go

5619
03:45:12,160 --> 03:45:17,199
through a process on the city's approval

5620
03:45:14,880 --> 03:45:20,160
site. So that leads to my next two

5621
03:45:17,199 --> 03:45:22,319
questions. So there are two items that I

5622
03:45:20,160 --> 03:45:24,720
wanted feedback on. Household

5623
03:45:22,319 --> 03:45:26,800
notification. Do we want to include

5624
03:45:24,720 --> 03:45:28,800
signatures from the affected households

5625
03:45:26,800 --> 03:45:31,439
like some other cities do? So, if they

5626
03:45:28,800 --> 03:45:32,960
were going to do a party and they were

5627
03:45:31,439 --> 03:45:34,640
going to close the road, they would

5628
03:45:32,960 --> 03:45:36,640
literally have to go around and gather

5629
03:45:34,640 --> 03:45:39,199
signatures from the property owners

5630
03:45:36,640 --> 03:45:41,279
showing that they had contact. Some

5631
03:45:39,199 --> 03:45:43,279
cities would just provide a flyer. I

5632
03:45:41,279 --> 03:45:44,960
believe they would put on the note their

5633
03:45:43,279 --> 03:45:47,439
door saying, "We're going to have this

5634
03:45:44,960 --> 03:45:49,680
event. Do you want it a little bit more

5635
03:45:47,439 --> 03:45:52,000
cumbersome? Do you want it to say,

5636
03:45:49,680 --> 03:45:53,840
"Yeah, I've signed this and I'm aware of

5637
03:45:52,000 --> 03:45:55,760
this." It doesn't sign or that they're

5638
03:45:53,840 --> 03:45:59,040
okay with it. It's just simply that they

5639
03:45:55,760 --> 03:46:02,160
receive notification.

5640
03:45:59,040 --> 03:46:05,120
of the event. And the second question I

5641
03:46:02,160 --> 03:46:07,199
have posed is the review process on our

5642
03:46:05,120 --> 03:46:09,840
permit. Do you want us to add blocks

5643
03:46:07,199 --> 03:46:11,520
that show signatures from the department

5644
03:46:09,840 --> 03:46:14,239
heads that it's been vetted through our

5645
03:46:11,520 --> 03:46:15,840
whole process?

5646
03:46:14,239 --> 03:46:18,080
» So I kind of want to go back to the

5647
03:46:15,840 --> 03:46:21,040
first question we had about that last

5648
03:46:18,080 --> 03:46:24,160
meeting about the insurance part. Okay.

5649
03:46:21,040 --> 03:46:28,080
» And the uh kids parade on North

5650
03:46:24,160 --> 03:46:30,640
Harrisville Road on the 4th of July.

5651
03:46:28,080 --> 03:46:33,600
So, the trust does not like us to have

5652
03:46:30,640 --> 03:46:35,120
parades in general.

5653
03:46:33,600 --> 03:46:36,800
There's a whole training. I can send the

5654
03:46:35,120 --> 03:46:39,199
link out if you'd like to watch the

5655
03:46:36,800 --> 03:46:42,160
training that he provides on parades.

5656
03:46:39,199 --> 03:46:43,680
» Oh, I Yeah. No

5657
03:46:42,160 --> 03:46:44,880
vehicles and everything else, but I'm

5658
03:46:43,680 --> 03:46:46,800
just wondering it's

5659
03:46:44,880 --> 03:46:49,600
» Up to you. you know, whole neighborhood

5660
03:46:46,800 --> 03:46:51,760
has done that for decades and is

5661
03:46:49,600 --> 03:46:53,920
tradition now to say, okay, someone in

5662
03:46:51,760 --> 03:46:56,640
the neighborhood has got to come up with

5663
03:46:53,920 --> 03:46:58,479
a insurance policy

5664
03:46:56,640 --> 03:47:02,239
for all those participants who just show

5665
03:46:58,479 --> 03:47:05,199
up. I I have other questions

5666
03:47:02,239 --> 03:47:07,600
also to deal with the use case, but I

5667
03:47:05,199 --> 03:47:10,479
mean that's a specific use case, right?

5668
03:47:07,600 --> 03:47:13,840
It's not about insurance, but

5669
03:47:10,479 --> 03:47:16,640
um what about weddings?

5670
03:47:13,840 --> 03:47:19,439
like someone at a church house.

5671
03:47:16,640 --> 03:47:23,279
Um what about school events? Do they

5672
03:47:19,439 --> 03:47:26,640
have to file for a permit? Um because it

5673
03:47:23,279 --> 03:47:29,359
says any private or public event.

5674
03:47:26,640 --> 03:47:31,359
Um, I I've looked up some things that

5675
03:47:29,359 --> 03:47:33,760
say, well, those might have different

5676
03:47:31,359 --> 03:47:35,520
jurisdictional things because of the

5677
03:47:33,760 --> 03:47:38,160
types of properties they are, but what

5678
03:47:35,520 --> 03:47:41,120
if someone has a a wedding in their

5679
03:47:38,160 --> 03:47:43,760
backyard that they have more than 200

5680
03:47:41,120 --> 03:47:47,120
people that come, you know, are we going

5681
03:47:43,760 --> 03:47:50,080
to require them to file a permit and

5682
03:47:47,120 --> 03:47:51,840
have 2 million $2 million worth of

5683
03:47:50,080 --> 03:47:53,920
insurance because they're holding a

5684
03:47:51,840 --> 03:47:57,040
wedding? Um,

5685
03:47:53,920 --> 03:48:00,000
» So I think the distinction between

5686
03:47:57,040 --> 03:48:02,800
having a wedding in your backyard and

5687
03:48:00,000 --> 03:48:04,560
applying for a special event permit is

5688
03:48:02,800 --> 03:48:05,920
going to come down to city resources,

5689
03:48:04,560 --> 03:48:09,279
right? It's going to trigger something

5690
03:48:05,920 --> 03:48:11,279
from the city that it's going to be they

5691
03:48:09,279 --> 03:48:14,960
want a road closure. They're using the

5692
03:48:11,279 --> 03:48:16,880
road for a 5k run, something like that.

5693
03:48:14,960 --> 03:48:19,600
» But I worry that we might want to add

5694
03:48:16,880 --> 03:48:21,520
some clarification clarifying language

5695
03:48:19,600 --> 03:48:23,199
for things like that. And you put on

5696
03:48:21,520 --> 03:48:24,800
that

5697
03:48:23,199 --> 03:48:27,279
put whatever you want in it

5698
03:48:24,800 --> 03:48:30,319
» Cuz I I don't know I don't know how you

5699
03:48:27,279 --> 03:48:32,960
would put the language as far as I mean

5700
03:48:30,319 --> 03:48:37,319
cuz the events are I came up with a

5701
03:48:32,960 --> 03:48:37,319
couple. Let me pull up my notes here.

5702
03:48:45,760 --> 03:48:50,000
I mean because if it does have anything

5703
03:48:47,359 --> 03:48:54,239
to do with church I mean our board has

5704
03:48:50,000 --> 03:48:56,160
200 people every week we have to follow

5705
03:48:54,239 --> 03:48:59,120
the church it wouldn't do anything with

5706
03:48:56,160 --> 03:49:01,840
churches there

5707
03:48:59,120 --> 03:49:03,359
» Are what about thresholds of private

5708
03:49:01,840 --> 03:49:05,199
property would there be anything that

5709
03:49:03,359 --> 03:49:08,880
should be in there about if the event is

5710
03:49:05,199 --> 03:49:12,800
on their own private property

5711
03:49:08,880 --> 03:49:14,560
um that's an exemption

5712
03:49:12,800 --> 03:49:16,479
um

5713
03:49:14,560 --> 03:49:17,760
» You would need to find a forbidden on

5714
03:49:16,479 --> 03:49:19,439
private property.

5715
03:49:17,760 --> 03:49:21,920
» Well, but if you have a wedding on

5716
03:49:19,439 --> 03:49:23,920
private property, it doesn't specify

5717
03:49:21,920 --> 03:49:25,520
really anything in there about that.

5718
03:49:23,920 --> 03:49:30,319
Just says if you're going to have an

5719
03:49:25,520 --> 03:49:32,800
event, a private event of 200

5720
03:49:30,319 --> 03:49:34,800
people or more city.

5721
03:49:32,800 --> 03:49:38,399
» No, no, it doesn't say anything about

5722
03:49:34,800 --> 03:49:40,960
the property itself.

5723
03:49:38,399 --> 03:49:43,600
This list right here says

5724
03:49:40,960 --> 03:49:44,319
any any event within Harrisville

5725
03:49:43,600 --> 03:49:45,680
» Within Harrisville

5726
03:49:44,319 --> 03:49:48,399
» With one or more of the following a

5727
03:49:45,680 --> 03:49:48,800
private event with 200 in attendance or

5728
03:49:48,399 --> 03:49:50,319
more.

5729
03:49:48,800 --> 03:49:51,520
» Yeah.

5730
03:49:50,319 --> 03:49:53,199
» Imagine the disruption

5731
03:49:51,520 --> 03:49:57,040
» That might be a family reunion

5732
03:49:53,199 --> 03:49:58,399
» At one house and what that will the

5733
03:49:57,040 --> 03:50:00,080
disruption that will create for the

5734
03:49:58,399 --> 03:50:01,920
neighborhood.

5735
03:50:00,080 --> 03:50:04,080
» It's a lot of people.

5736
03:50:01,920 --> 03:50:07,040
» Yeah. I've been to weddings where there

5737
03:50:04,080 --> 03:50:08,880
have been 200 you parked 10 minutes you

5738
03:50:07,040 --> 03:50:11,760
parked down two blocks or three blocks

5739
03:50:08,880 --> 03:50:13,520
away.

5740
03:50:11,760 --> 03:50:15,120
» Um

5741
03:50:13,520 --> 03:50:16,560
» Well I'm not saying it couldn't happen.

5742
03:50:15,120 --> 03:50:17,040
We're not saying it can't happen. We're

5743
03:50:16,560 --> 03:50:18,399
just saying

5744
03:50:17,040 --> 03:50:21,760
» So you need to get a permit.

5745
03:50:18,399 --> 03:50:24,560
» Getting the permit helps people around

5746
03:50:21,760 --> 03:50:25,439
you to be aware of

5747
03:50:24,560 --> 03:50:27,760
» The disruption.

5748
03:50:25,439 --> 03:50:30,080
» But how are people going to know that

5749
03:50:27,760 --> 03:50:32,080
for a wedding? They're going to do it in

5750
03:50:30,080 --> 03:50:34,000
their backyard.

5751
03:50:32,080 --> 03:50:36,000
There's also an opportunity for an

5752
03:50:34,000 --> 03:50:39,040
exemption for the insurance portion of

5753
03:50:36,000 --> 03:50:41,359
it. If it's a lowrisk event, then there

5754
03:50:39,040 --> 03:50:45,680
doesn't have to be insurance coverage.

5755
03:50:41,359 --> 03:50:49,680
The the liability insurance is suggested

5756
03:50:45,680 --> 03:50:52,399
on things that would be a higher risk.

5757
03:50:49,680 --> 03:50:55,680
So you we can eliminate high-risisk

5758
03:50:52,399 --> 03:50:59,680
completely and don't allow high-risisk

5759
03:50:55,680 --> 03:51:01,760
events in the city or we can exclude

5760
03:50:59,680 --> 03:51:03,199
that lowrisk events like a wedding,

5761
03:51:01,760 --> 03:51:05,120
somebody attending a wedding in a

5762
03:51:03,199 --> 03:51:06,880
private backyard is not going to require

5763
03:51:05,120 --> 03:51:07,439
insurance but maybe still requires the

5764
03:51:06,880 --> 03:51:08,960
permit.

5765
03:51:07,439 --> 03:51:11,040
» So one of the things that I had thought

5766
03:51:08,960 --> 03:51:12,880
is if we could include language like

5767
03:51:11,040 --> 03:51:16,080
this and might be clarifying that said

5768
03:51:12,880 --> 03:51:18,080
something like to avoid confusion.

5769
03:51:16,080 --> 03:51:20,399
Well,

5770
03:51:18,080 --> 03:51:21,840
if we were to say that um put in a

5771
03:51:20,399 --> 03:51:23,439
sentence stating that standard

5772
03:51:21,840 --> 03:51:25,359
activities held entirely within the

5773
03:51:23,439 --> 03:51:28,239
property boundaries of school district

5774
03:51:25,359 --> 03:51:30,640
facilities, houses of worship or private

5775
03:51:28,239 --> 03:51:33,359
residences where no road closures or

5776
03:51:30,640 --> 03:51:38,600
city services are requested and or

5777
03:51:33,359 --> 03:51:38,600
needed are exempt from this policy.

5778
03:51:40,800 --> 03:51:46,560
» I think that would clarify.

5779
03:51:44,399 --> 03:51:49,680
» Yeah.

5780
03:51:46,560 --> 03:51:53,600
So that would be my two cents worth. And

5781
03:51:49,680 --> 03:51:55,680
I think cuz I I I I brought that up the

5782
03:51:53,600 --> 03:51:59,600
last time talking about weddings, you

5783
03:51:55,680 --> 03:52:02,399
know, cuz we go down to the capital when

5784
03:51:59,600 --> 03:52:05,680
they redid the capital building to go

5785
03:52:02,399 --> 03:52:08,399
and do photos of a bride and groom in

5786
03:52:05,680 --> 03:52:10,319
their wedding dress on private property

5787
03:52:08,399 --> 03:52:12,880
grounds there or the public property

5788
03:52:10,319 --> 03:52:16,560
grounds there. They were requiring the

5789
03:52:12,880 --> 03:52:19,680
couple to have $2 million of insurance

5790
03:52:16,560 --> 03:52:21,920
to go and take photos in the building.

5791
03:52:19,680 --> 03:52:24,560
And they're like, "Well, how in the

5792
03:52:21,920 --> 03:52:26,239
world do I do that?" Cuz they don't have

5793
03:52:24,560 --> 03:52:30,080
a vehicle to do that. They'd have to get

5794
03:52:26,239 --> 03:52:33,520
a commercial policy to do that. and and

5795
03:52:30,080 --> 03:52:36,479
so photographers ended up having to get

5796
03:52:33,520 --> 03:52:38,239
a rider on their insurance for the

5797
03:52:36,479 --> 03:52:40,720
couple that wanted to do pictures of

5798
03:52:38,239 --> 03:52:43,120
their and that's not fair either. You

5799
03:52:40,720 --> 03:52:46,160
know, that require

5800
03:52:43,120 --> 03:52:49,840
require vendors to put their

5801
03:52:46,160 --> 03:52:51,920
their ratings at risk for something that

5802
03:52:49,840 --> 03:52:53,680
people want to do, you know. So, we got

5803
03:52:51,920 --> 03:52:56,000
to be conscientious of things like that.

5804
03:52:53,680 --> 03:52:58,399
And I think you'd end up having weddings

5805
03:52:56,000 --> 03:53:00,000
that they would ask that. Can my

5806
03:52:58,399 --> 03:53:02,319
photographer, will you give us the $2

5807
03:53:00,000 --> 03:53:03,760
million of exemption for coverage

5808
03:53:02,319 --> 03:53:06,880
because we're having a wedding?

5809
03:53:03,760 --> 03:53:08,720
» Well, you I did look I did a little

5810
03:53:06,880 --> 03:53:10,720
research and I found out that you can

5811
03:53:08,720 --> 03:53:12,880
just purchase an event liability

5812
03:53:10,720 --> 03:53:16,960
insurance pretty easily. It's not that

5813
03:53:12,880 --> 03:53:18,000
hard to do. It's like a couple hundred

5814
03:53:16,960 --> 03:53:21,520
owner policy.

5815
03:53:18,000 --> 03:53:24,560
» No, just a separate separate one day

5816
03:53:21,520 --> 03:53:26,640
fee. But um and it seems like anyone

5817
03:53:24,560 --> 03:53:29,680
could buy it. But I do have concerns

5818
03:53:26,640 --> 03:53:32,319
about people having weddings that large

5819
03:53:29,680 --> 03:53:34,000
in these small neighborhoods. 200 and

5820
03:53:32,319 --> 03:53:36,560
I'm assuming the 200 would be there all

5821
03:53:34,000 --> 03:53:39,040
at the same time, right?

5822
03:53:36,560 --> 03:53:40,720
» This doesn't necessarily

5823
03:53:39,040 --> 03:53:42,800
specify

5824
03:53:40,720 --> 03:53:44,720
» Cuz you could have a wedding is 2 hours

5825
03:53:42,800 --> 03:53:47,760
you could

5826
03:53:44,720 --> 03:53:51,040
now. That's different. Now this says

5827
03:53:47,760 --> 03:53:52,319
» And that could under this in attendance

5828
03:53:51,040 --> 03:53:54,560
seems to imply

5829
03:53:52,319 --> 03:53:57,120
» But his attendance all at once or is

5830
03:53:54,560 --> 03:53:59,760
attendance throughout the event because

5831
03:53:57,120 --> 03:54:02,800
if it's attendance all at once that's

5832
03:53:59,760 --> 03:54:03,600
different but doesn't specify that and

5833
03:54:02,800 --> 03:54:05,359
clarity

5834
03:54:03,600 --> 03:54:08,000
» We should clarify that

5835
03:54:05,359 --> 03:54:10,560
» And I think that

5836
03:54:08,000 --> 03:54:15,040
500

5837
03:54:10,560 --> 03:54:16,239
it's not unheard of to have two 500

5838
03:54:15,040 --> 03:54:18,560
people come

5839
03:54:16,239 --> 03:54:21,439
Oh, no, not at all. But at someone's

5840
03:54:18,560 --> 03:54:24,160
home in Harrisville City, at home

5841
03:54:21,439 --> 03:54:26,080
» Is one thing versus at a church.

5842
03:54:24,160 --> 03:54:29,439
» I've been at receptions where the line

5843
03:54:26,080 --> 03:54:31,600
lasted for 2 and 1/2 hours as 5 600

5844
03:54:29,439 --> 03:54:33,439
people that were invited came through

5845
03:54:31,600 --> 03:54:34,560
the line.

5846
03:54:33,439 --> 03:54:36,080
You know, maybe they weren't all there

5847
03:54:34,560 --> 03:54:38,720
at once, but they had five or 600

5848
03:54:36,080 --> 03:54:40,319
people. Would they be required to have a

5849
03:54:38,720 --> 03:54:43,199
permit because they had five to 600

5850
03:54:40,319 --> 03:54:44,560
people come to an event? I think one of

5851
03:54:43,199 --> 03:54:46,720
the things too to consider in this

5852
03:54:44,560 --> 03:54:48,640
discussion, I think it's a good point

5853
03:54:46,720 --> 03:54:52,479
you're making.

5854
03:54:48,640 --> 03:54:55,800
What's the penalty in this ordinance?

5855
03:54:52,479 --> 03:54:55,800
» Is there one?

5856
03:54:56,319 --> 03:55:01,279
» So, if you don't get a permit,

5857
03:55:00,080 --> 03:55:03,279
» There's no recourse.

5858
03:55:01,279 --> 03:55:05,840
» So, maybe this is just to protect the

5859
03:55:03,279 --> 03:55:07,840
city in case there is a problem at one

5860
03:55:05,840 --> 03:55:09,600
of these weddings and then the city

5861
03:55:07,840 --> 03:55:11,359
wasn't aware of it. we can say, "Well,

5862
03:55:09,600 --> 03:55:12,720
we weren't aware of it because they

5863
03:55:11,359 --> 03:55:14,960
didn't fill out the permit."

5864
03:55:12,720 --> 03:55:18,399
» And I'm not and I actually think your

5865
03:55:14,960 --> 03:55:19,760
discussion is really good. Um,

5866
03:55:18,399 --> 03:55:21,920
in my experience with all the

5867
03:55:19,760 --> 03:55:23,680
municipalities that I advise, the reason

5868
03:55:21,920 --> 03:55:26,880
this comes about is because someone is

5869
03:55:23,680 --> 03:55:28,239
asking the city, we want to do X, how do

5870
03:55:26,880 --> 03:55:31,279
we do it?

5871
03:55:28,239 --> 03:55:34,319
» And it's not a wedding. It's a

5872
03:55:31,279 --> 03:55:36,000
» Softball tournament. It's a 5K. It's a

5873
03:55:34,319 --> 03:55:37,840
» Right. Because if there's no penalty,

5874
03:55:36,000 --> 03:55:39,199
like Jenny can't go out and give you a

5875
03:55:37,840 --> 03:55:41,199
ticket for having a wedding in your

5876
03:55:39,199 --> 03:55:44,000
house because you didn't get a permit.

5877
03:55:41,199 --> 03:55:48,600
Yeah. But if there is

5878
03:55:44,000 --> 03:55:48,600
ordinance or law, it can be.

5879
03:55:48,720 --> 03:55:54,239
So, if you had somebody who wanted to

5880
03:55:52,080 --> 03:55:56,160
say, "Oh, I can shut you down because

5881
03:55:54,239 --> 03:55:59,520
we've got this ordinance and you didn't

5882
03:55:56,160 --> 03:56:02,319
get you didn't get this uh permit."

5883
03:55:59,520 --> 03:56:04,000
Then, are you going to get a citation

5884
03:56:02,319 --> 03:56:05,920
from the police cuz you didn't file a

5885
03:56:04,000 --> 03:56:08,560
permit for a wedding and somebody

5886
03:56:05,920 --> 03:56:11,040
complains?

5887
03:56:08,560 --> 03:56:12,160
I don't think so. That's what we want to

5888
03:56:11,040 --> 03:56:14,720
make sure that

5889
03:56:12,160 --> 03:56:17,120
» But I mean, in re reality, right,

5890
03:56:14,720 --> 03:56:19,920
there's no penalty in the ordinance for

5891
03:56:17,120 --> 03:56:22,239
not having So there isn't a citation,

5892
03:56:19,920 --> 03:56:25,520
right?

5893
03:56:22,239 --> 03:56:27,359
Any law that any ordinance, any law that

5894
03:56:25,520 --> 03:56:31,680
doesn't have a remedy or an enforcement

5895
03:56:27,359 --> 03:56:34,000
provision is a is a guideline, right?

5896
03:56:31,680 --> 03:56:35,840
This is and I'm not saying your your

5897
03:56:34,000 --> 03:56:38,399
changes aren't valid. Say I think

5898
03:56:35,840 --> 03:56:40,319
they're good discussion. Um but to say

5899
03:56:38,399 --> 03:56:41,760
that like someone's going to go patrol

5900
03:56:40,319 --> 03:56:45,520
this or get people in trouble if you

5901
03:56:41,760 --> 03:56:47,279
don't. um as the law as it's written

5902
03:56:45,520 --> 03:56:49,600
right now, there's non enforcement

5903
03:56:47,279 --> 03:56:52,239
provision.

5904
03:56:49,600 --> 03:56:53,760
I I I understand that. Um in the

5905
03:56:52,239 --> 03:56:56,880
public's perview though, if they were

5906
03:56:53,760 --> 03:56:59,600
like, "Well, do you have a permit?" Cuz

5907
03:56:56,880 --> 03:57:02,399
uh I mean, can the people say, "Well,

5908
03:56:59,600 --> 03:57:05,120
you should have permit."

5909
03:57:02,399 --> 03:57:07,040
You know, the public will enforce it in

5910
03:57:05,120 --> 03:57:08,640
a different way.

5911
03:57:07,040 --> 03:57:10,160
We'll make a complaint. We should have a

5912
03:57:08,640 --> 03:57:11,600
permit.

5913
03:57:10,160 --> 03:57:14,880
They know that there's observant

5914
03:57:11,600 --> 03:57:16,479
process. So, we should probably make it

5915
03:57:14,880 --> 03:57:19,760
clear.

5916
03:57:16,479 --> 03:57:23,520
So, we're not tying up police resources

5917
03:57:19,760 --> 03:57:28,760
too to go to somebody's house because

5918
03:57:23,520 --> 03:57:28,760
they're not liking that somebody had

5919
03:57:29,600 --> 03:57:37,720
again, but I'll go back to the parade

5920
03:57:32,239 --> 03:57:37,720
again. Impromptu yearly parade,

5921
03:57:38,000 --> 03:57:41,920
uh, you know,

5922
03:57:40,000 --> 03:57:43,760
Now, here's

5923
03:57:41,920 --> 03:57:45,920
like I said, okay, no enforcement, but

5924
03:57:43,760 --> 03:57:48,960
here's a rule

5925
03:57:45,920 --> 03:57:50,880
that the city says should be followed.

5926
03:57:48,960 --> 03:57:52,399
Okay, there's no enforcement, but let's

5927
03:57:50,880 --> 03:57:57,359
just say, well, I have to be following

5928
03:57:52,399 --> 03:58:00,239
the law in doing this.

5929
03:57:57,359 --> 03:58:03,199
I just Yeah,

5930
03:58:00,239 --> 03:58:04,239
it's the only parade we actually sponsor

5931
03:58:03,199 --> 03:58:05,840
the only parade that actually happens

5932
03:58:04,239 --> 03:58:07,439
when kids can ride their bike down the

5933
03:58:05,840 --> 03:58:09,279
street.

5934
03:58:07,439 --> 03:58:12,239
Are there any events that either of you

5935
03:58:09,279 --> 03:58:14,640
would say we definitely want a

5936
03:58:12,239 --> 03:58:16,319
requirement for a permit?

5937
03:58:14,640 --> 03:58:18,880
» Well, closing off a block.

5938
03:58:16,319 --> 03:58:19,760
» Okay. So, maybe that would be the line

5939
03:58:18,880 --> 03:58:21,359
we draw.

5940
03:58:19,760 --> 03:58:23,439
» Well, I also think through that any I

5941
03:58:21,359 --> 03:58:26,720
mean, if you were to have a wedding at

5942
03:58:23,439 --> 03:58:29,520
the city buildings, I think that's a

5943
03:58:26,720 --> 03:58:30,880
place where there should be a permit,

5944
03:58:29,520 --> 03:58:34,080
but that should just be part of the

5945
03:58:30,880 --> 03:58:37,199
application or rental fee.

5946
03:58:34,080 --> 03:58:39,359
So on city properties or closing down

5947
03:58:37,199 --> 03:58:41,520
streets

5948
03:58:39,359 --> 03:58:43,040
the two.

5949
03:58:41,520 --> 03:58:43,600
» Well,

5950
03:58:43,040 --> 03:58:46,000
» No.

5951
03:58:43,600 --> 03:58:48,319
» Well, because my parade comment is

5952
03:58:46,000 --> 03:58:50,479
streets closed for a half hour,

5953
03:58:48,319 --> 03:58:52,319
» But it does impact the residents of that

5954
03:58:50,479 --> 03:58:54,319
street and

5955
03:58:52,319 --> 03:58:56,720
it seems fair that they would need

5956
03:58:54,319 --> 03:58:57,920
notification or that they would get

5957
03:58:56,720 --> 03:58:59,199
notification of that.

5958
03:58:57,920 --> 03:59:00,000
» Yeah.

5959
03:58:59,199 --> 03:59:01,760
» They all know what's happening.

5960
03:59:00,000 --> 03:59:03,520
» So then they would easily get the permit

5961
03:59:01,760 --> 03:59:07,560
most likely.

5962
03:59:03,520 --> 03:59:07,560
who's going to pay the insurance policy

5963
03:59:07,680 --> 03:59:11,680
to commit to that.

5964
03:59:10,080 --> 03:59:14,640
» Yes.

5965
03:59:11,680 --> 03:59:18,279
» But what if someone gets hurt

5966
03:59:14,640 --> 03:59:18,279
and there's no insurance?

5967
03:59:18,640 --> 03:59:24,439
» It happens.

5968
03:59:20,720 --> 03:59:24,439
» You got a road crash.

5969
03:59:26,560 --> 03:59:31,479
» Now we've had fatalities and crimes

5970
03:59:28,479 --> 03:59:31,479
nearby.

5971
03:59:34,399 --> 03:59:39,600
What do you need from this?

5972
03:59:36,160 --> 03:59:41,920
» You just direction on modifications,

5973
03:59:39,600 --> 03:59:44,239
feedback on a couple of those questions

5974
03:59:41,920 --> 03:59:46,800
if you

5975
03:59:44,239 --> 03:59:50,319
are good with what we've included.

5976
03:59:46,800 --> 03:59:52,399
» Go back to the questions to

5977
03:59:50,319 --> 03:59:55,520
» Yeah. The household notification. Do you

5978
03:59:52,399 --> 03:59:58,720
want to include a required signature

5979
03:59:55,520 --> 03:59:59,439
that the neighborhood has been

5980
03:59:58,720 --> 04:00:00,720
» Or just a flyer

5981
03:59:59,439 --> 04:00:02,960
» Or just a flyer?

5982
04:00:00,720 --> 04:00:04,319
» I think just

5983
04:00:02,960 --> 04:00:07,520
» Okay. So, we'll leave it as it's

5984
04:00:04,319 --> 04:00:09,520
written. And then

5985
04:00:07,520 --> 04:00:12,000
» Do we want to include signature blocks

5986
04:00:09,520 --> 04:00:14,800
from the department heads on the actual

5987
04:00:12,000 --> 04:00:16,800
permit that they've been signed off from

5988
04:00:14,800 --> 04:00:17,840
the public safety, public works, the

5989
04:00:16,800 --> 04:00:18,800
parks and wreck?

5990
04:00:17,840 --> 04:00:20,880
» I think it's done

5991
04:00:18,800 --> 04:00:22,160
» Administration. why you're doing the

5992
04:00:20,880 --> 04:00:24,800
permit. This is the city. Everyone's

5993
04:00:22,160 --> 04:00:26,319
aware of it. They've signed up.

5994
04:00:24,800 --> 04:00:30,319
That's my thought.

5995
04:00:26,319 --> 04:00:32,800
» Yeah, I would agree with that.

5996
04:00:30,319 --> 04:00:34,960
» You absolutely want public safety to

5997
04:00:32,800 --> 04:00:36,880
sign off on a permit before we grant it.

5998
04:00:34,960 --> 04:00:40,600
» Yeah.

5999
04:00:36,880 --> 04:00:40,600
» Yeah. And I'm wondering

6000
04:00:41,040 --> 04:00:45,520
I mean if

6001
04:00:43,120 --> 04:00:48,479
Well, no

6002
04:00:45,520 --> 04:00:50,960
I answer question. So if we add to take

6003
04:00:48,479 --> 04:00:53,439
place on city property, I think that

6004
04:00:50,960 --> 04:00:55,600
helps with the wedding theme. And if we

6005
04:00:53,439 --> 04:00:59,680
add in the event of road closures,

6006
04:00:55,600 --> 04:01:02,160
» I just think we I gave the exemption of

6007
04:00:59,680 --> 04:01:05,199
school facilities, houses of worship or

6008
04:01:02,160 --> 04:01:07,520
private residents for where no road

6009
04:01:05,199 --> 04:01:09,439
closures or city services are needed or

6010
04:01:07,520 --> 04:01:11,760
requested

6011
04:01:09,439 --> 04:01:14,640
are exempt.

6012
04:01:11,760 --> 04:01:16,960
Are there any other types of properties

6013
04:01:14,640 --> 04:01:18,640
that we that aren't city property that

6014
04:01:16,960 --> 04:01:21,359
we do want a permit for?

6015
04:01:18,640 --> 04:01:25,120
» So, we do have an event requiring a

6016
04:01:21,359 --> 04:01:27,359
permit outlined here. Walks, fun runs,

6017
04:01:25,120 --> 04:01:29,120
parades, festivals, celebrations, public

6018
04:01:27,359 --> 04:01:31,439
gatherings, community events, charity

6019
04:01:29,120 --> 04:01:34,160
events, outdoor concerts, markets, any

6020
04:01:31,439 --> 04:01:35,680
event requiring a street closure. So

6021
04:01:34,160 --> 04:01:37,120
this is where you would make whatever

6022
04:01:35,680 --> 04:01:39,520
modifications you want.

6023
04:01:37,120 --> 04:01:43,600
» Celebrations would be the one we would

6024
04:01:39,520 --> 04:01:46,239
need to modify. I think celebrations

6025
04:01:43,600 --> 04:01:48,560
on public property.

6026
04:01:46,239 --> 04:01:51,520
» Oh, I think you can you don't have to.

6027
04:01:48,560 --> 04:01:54,800
You can just say events. You can put a

6028
04:01:51,520 --> 04:01:59,040
clause there about the events

6029
04:01:54,800 --> 04:02:01,120
that occur within those places. school

6030
04:01:59,040 --> 04:02:04,080
or district facilities, houses of

6031
04:02:01,120 --> 04:02:06,080
worship, private residences

6032
04:02:04,080 --> 04:02:08,479
where no road closures or city services

6033
04:02:06,080 --> 04:02:09,680
are requested are exempt from this

6034
04:02:08,479 --> 04:02:12,239
policy.

6035
04:02:09,680 --> 04:02:14,479
» So, if you're having a trunk or treat at

6036
04:02:12,239 --> 04:02:17,359
a local church,

6037
04:02:14,479 --> 04:02:18,960
you don't need to get a permit to have a

6038
04:02:17,359 --> 04:02:20,720
trunk or treat.

6039
04:02:18,960 --> 04:02:22,000
» I would I would actually suggest if

6040
04:02:20,720 --> 04:02:24,000
you're going to go with that, which I

6041
04:02:22,000 --> 04:02:25,120
think is really good, instead of private

6042
04:02:24,000 --> 04:02:26,560
residence, you just say private

6043
04:02:25,120 --> 04:02:30,560
property, right?

6044
04:02:26,560 --> 04:02:31,920
» Yeah. Because if McDonald's wanted to do

6045
04:02:30,560 --> 04:02:32,479
something, it's

6046
04:02:31,920 --> 04:02:34,960
» Walmart.

6047
04:02:32,479 --> 04:02:38,080
» Yeah.

6048
04:02:34,960 --> 04:02:40,640
» And that covers churches.

6049
04:02:38,080 --> 04:02:42,399
» Schools, aren't they just a completely

6050
04:02:40,640 --> 04:02:44,880
separate beast? I mean, they have their

6051
04:02:42,399 --> 04:02:46,880
own rules and process.

6052
04:02:44,880 --> 04:02:49,600
» Well, we would consider them private

6053
04:02:46,880 --> 04:02:51,920
property. Oh,

6054
04:02:49,600 --> 04:02:53,840
» Yeah. And it's technically public.

6055
04:02:51,920 --> 04:02:56,399
» It is technically public property.

6056
04:02:53,840 --> 04:02:59,520
That's why I think it's good to clarify

6057
04:02:56,399 --> 04:03:01,600
just for clarity. You are correct. Those

6058
04:02:59,520 --> 04:03:03,120
schools don't happen to listen to very

6059
04:03:01,600 --> 04:03:04,560
much that we have to say. So

6060
04:03:03,120 --> 04:03:05,439
» They have a lot of their own rules

6061
04:03:04,560 --> 04:03:07,359
though.

6062
04:03:05,439 --> 04:03:11,640
» So are there any other amendments you'd

6063
04:03:07,359 --> 04:03:11,640
like to make before the required

6064
04:03:12,880 --> 04:03:19,080
» Just the disclosure addition of that

6065
04:03:14,960 --> 04:03:19,080
disclosure statement at the end?

6066
04:03:20,960 --> 04:03:24,880
» I think so.

6067
04:03:21,920 --> 04:03:26,800
» All right. On the permit itself,

6068
04:03:24,880 --> 04:03:30,960
it says this application must be turned

6069
04:03:26,800 --> 04:03:32,960
in within 60 days of the event. Did you

6070
04:03:30,960 --> 04:03:35,760
mean to say

6071
04:03:32,960 --> 04:03:38,800
at least

6072
04:03:35,760 --> 04:03:39,760
» Within means you know a week within?

6073
04:03:38,800 --> 04:03:42,479
» Yes.

6074
04:03:39,760 --> 04:03:45,680
» So the recommendation actually is

6075
04:03:42,479 --> 04:03:49,040
between 45 to 60 days. So I say no no

6076
04:03:45,680 --> 04:03:52,319
later than 45 days ahead. No prior than

6077
04:03:49,040 --> 04:03:55,120
60 days cuz within seems to say if they

6078
04:03:52,319 --> 04:03:57,359
go 90 days prior they can't.

6079
04:03:55,120 --> 04:03:59,760
» Yeah, we're already getting outreach for

6080
04:03:57,359 --> 04:04:02,479
events in February. So I don't know that

6081
04:03:59,760 --> 04:04:03,760
I would say they have to be within that

6082
04:04:02,479 --> 04:04:05,279
window.

6083
04:04:03,760 --> 04:04:06,000
» But I'm just saying the verbage.

6084
04:04:05,279 --> 04:04:08,800
» Yeah,

6085
04:04:06,000 --> 04:04:10,399
» It must be turned in within 60 days.

6086
04:04:08,800 --> 04:04:13,680
Sounds like the equation.

6087
04:04:10,399 --> 04:04:16,560
» Yeah, I like your suggestion of and I

6088
04:04:13,680 --> 04:04:18,800
would actually put it to 45 days of

6089
04:04:16,560 --> 04:04:19,199
» Yeah. has a minimum of four to five days

6090
04:04:18,800 --> 04:04:21,920
before

6091
04:04:19,199 --> 04:04:24,920
» Minimum contact in at least rather than

6092
04:04:21,920 --> 04:04:24,920
within.

6093
04:04:29,120 --> 04:04:32,120
» Okay.

6094
04:04:32,640 --> 04:04:37,120
» Okay. Let's go on to the next.

6095
04:04:34,640 --> 04:04:37,520
» We need to do an action on that though,

6096
04:04:37,120 --> 04:04:39,439
right?

6097
04:04:37,520 --> 04:04:42,560
» If if you're okay with the discussion

6098
04:04:39,439 --> 04:04:46,640
and everything else included in that.

6099
04:04:42,560 --> 04:04:49,359
» So, we need an action. I need a motion.

6100
04:04:46,640 --> 04:04:52,479
And I make a proposal that we adopt

6101
04:04:49,359 --> 04:04:55,920
resolution 2624,

6102
04:04:52,479 --> 04:04:57,760
special event policy permits with

6103
04:04:55,920 --> 04:05:00,880
all of the guidance that we've given to

6104
04:04:57,760 --> 04:05:03,199
Jenny 9 as far as amendments and

6105
04:05:00,880 --> 04:05:05,600
changes.

6106
04:05:03,199 --> 04:05:07,920
» Okay, we got a motion. We have a second.

6107
04:05:05,600 --> 04:05:11,880
» Second.

6108
04:05:07,920 --> 04:05:11,880
» Got a motion and a second.

6109
04:05:11,920 --> 04:05:16,040
This is a roll call vote.

6110
04:05:16,080 --> 04:05:19,640
Councilman McGomery.

6111
04:05:20,239 --> 04:05:28,160
» No, I must say explanation. I I think

6112
04:05:22,720 --> 04:05:31,600
generally the policies are fine. I just

6113
04:05:28,160 --> 04:05:34,640
sty these neighborhood

6114
04:05:31,600 --> 04:05:37,520
traditions and puts a burden on them

6115
04:05:34,640 --> 04:05:39,439
that is not needed.

6116
04:05:37,520 --> 04:05:40,880
» Council member Billhson.

6117
04:05:39,439 --> 04:05:43,040
» Yes.

6118
04:05:40,880 --> 04:05:44,479
» Council member Hadley.

6119
04:05:43,040 --> 04:05:46,160
» Yes.

6120
04:05:44,479 --> 04:05:47,199
Council member Paul,

6121
04:05:46,160 --> 04:05:48,960
» Yes.

6122
04:05:47,199 --> 04:05:50,880
» Council member Christensen,

6123
04:05:48,960 --> 04:05:53,760
» Yes.

6124
04:05:50,880 --> 04:05:55,680
» Okay.

6125
04:05:53,760 --> 04:06:00,080
On to the next item on our agenda, and

6126
04:05:55,680 --> 04:06:03,680
that's the closed executive session.

6127
04:06:00,080 --> 04:06:06,479
For purposes described under UCA

6128
04:06:03,680 --> 04:06:09,439
52-4-2051

6129
04:06:06,479 --> 04:06:12,319
strategy session to discuss pending

6130
04:06:09,439 --> 04:06:16,279
reasonable and imminent litigation and

6131
04:06:12,319 --> 04:06:16,279
UCA 52-4-2051

6132
04:06:17,120 --> 04:06:21,279
strategy session to discuss purchase,

6133
04:06:19,359 --> 04:06:22,960
exchange and lease of real property

6134
04:06:21,279 --> 04:06:25,520
including the employment of water

6135
04:06:22,960 --> 04:06:28,960
rights, water shares to discuss the

6136
04:06:25,520 --> 04:06:31,520
proposed development agreement project

6137
04:06:28,960 --> 04:06:33,600
proposal or financing proposal related

6138
04:06:31,520 --> 04:06:37,840
to development or land owned by the

6139
04:06:33,600 --> 04:06:41,520
state political subdivision if public

6140
04:06:37,840 --> 04:06:44,560
discussion would expose the increase or

6141
04:06:41,520 --> 04:06:46,960
estimate value of property or under the

6142
04:06:44,560 --> 04:06:49,840
consideration or two prevent the public

6143
04:06:46,960 --> 04:06:54,560
body from completing the transaction

6144
04:06:49,840 --> 04:06:56,880
transaction on the best possible terms.

6145
04:06:54,560 --> 04:06:58,319
I have a motion to a close executive

6146
04:06:56,880 --> 04:07:00,080
session.

6147
04:06:58,319 --> 04:07:02,000
» I have a motion that we go to a closed

6148
04:07:00,080 --> 04:07:04,000
executive session.

6149
04:07:02,000 --> 04:07:06,319
» Have a motion.

6150
04:07:04,000 --> 04:07:09,199
» You have to read the whole thing in your

6151
04:07:06,319 --> 04:07:11,680
to read the whole thing.

6152
04:07:09,199 --> 04:07:13,359
» Then I withdraw my motion.

6153
04:07:11,680 --> 04:07:15,920
» And then I'll make the motion so he

6154
04:07:13,359 --> 04:07:18,560
doesn't have to. I motion that we go

6155
04:07:15,920 --> 04:07:20,399
into close executive session. close

6156
04:07:18,560 --> 04:07:24,840
executive session for the purposes

6157
04:07:20,399 --> 04:07:24,840
described under UCA 52-4-2051C.

6158
04:07:25,840 --> 04:07:30,640
Strategy session to discuss pending or

6159
04:07:27,840 --> 04:07:33,600
reasonable imminent litigation in UCA

6160
04:07:30,640 --> 04:07:35,359
52-4-2051D.

6161
04:07:33,600 --> 04:07:37,279
Strategy sessions to discuss the

6162
04:07:35,359 --> 04:07:39,760
purchase, exchange or lease for

6163
04:07:37,279 --> 04:07:42,399
property, including any form of water

6164
04:07:39,760 --> 04:07:44,160
right or water shares or to discuss a

6165
04:07:42,399 --> 04:07:46,880
proposed development agreement, project

6166
04:07:44,160 --> 04:07:48,479
proposal or financing proposal related

6167
04:07:46,880 --> 04:07:50,640
to the development of land owned by the

6168
04:07:48,479 --> 04:07:53,439
state or a political subdivision. If

6169
04:07:50,640 --> 04:07:55,120
public discussion would one disclose the

6170
04:07:53,439 --> 04:07:57,600
appraisal or estimated value of the

6171
04:07:55,120 --> 04:07:59,359
property under consideration or to

6172
04:07:57,600 --> 04:08:02,720
prevent the public buy from complete

6173
04:07:59,359 --> 04:08:04,319
transaction on the best possible terms.

6174
04:08:02,720 --> 04:08:05,600
So we have a motion. Do we have a

6175
04:08:04,319 --> 04:08:10,600
second?

6176
04:08:05,600 --> 04:08:10,600
» Second. Second. All in favor.

6177
04:08:10,640 --> 04:08:15,239
» Okay. My roll call list.

6178
04:08:17,840 --> 04:08:20,960
Council member Christensen,

6179
04:08:20,000 --> 04:08:22,479
» Yes.

6180
04:08:20,960 --> 04:08:23,359
» Council member Hadley,

6181
04:08:22,479 --> 04:08:25,040
» Yes.

6182
04:08:23,359 --> 04:08:26,160
» Council member Wilhelm,

6183
04:08:25,040 --> 04:08:27,680
» Yes.

6184
04:08:26,160 --> 04:08:28,239
» Council member Montgomery,

6185
04:08:27,680 --> 04:08:29,600
» Yes.

6186
04:08:28,239 --> 04:08:31,040
» Council member Crawl,

6187
04:08:29,600 --> 04:08:35,920
» Yes.

6188
04:08:31,040 --> 04:08:36,319
» Okay, we're now in a close session.

6189
04:08:35,920 --> 04:08:39,760
» Thank you.

6190
04:08:36,319 --> 04:08:43,600
» Okay, so we're to item number seven,

6191
04:08:39,760 --> 04:08:45,600
mayor, council, staff followup.

6192
04:08:43,600 --> 04:08:48,319
Assistant Chief.

6193
04:08:45,600 --> 04:08:51,760
» Yeah, I got just a few things. uh back

6194
04:08:48,319 --> 04:08:54,640
to school last two weeks. We've uh

6195
04:08:51,760 --> 04:08:56,720
integrated back in there, put a new SRO

6196
04:08:54,640 --> 04:08:58,800
there that's doing awesome. It's kind of

6197
04:08:56,720 --> 04:09:02,800
come out of our patrol rotation doing

6198
04:08:58,800 --> 04:09:05,520
good over there. Uh we had our night out

6199
04:09:02,800 --> 04:09:09,279
against crime with the Tri City agencies

6200
04:09:05,520 --> 04:09:11,439
in North Odin a few weeks ago. I think

6201
04:09:09,279 --> 04:09:12,800
it was awesome. It was a good success. I

6202
04:09:11,439 --> 04:09:15,520
think they had a good turnout with

6203
04:09:12,800 --> 04:09:17,680
everybody that came there. That was a a

6204
04:09:15,520 --> 04:09:20,960
really cool thing that happened.

6205
04:09:17,680 --> 04:09:24,319
» So like who who attends those things?

6206
04:09:20,960 --> 04:09:27,520
» Uh Weaver Metro SWAT team was there,

6207
04:09:24,319 --> 04:09:30,000
North View Fire, Pleasant View, North

6208
04:09:27,520 --> 04:09:35,040
Ogden, Harrisville Police, Weber County

6209
04:09:30,000 --> 04:09:39,680
Sheriff, the CTC Community Coalition,

6210
04:09:35,040 --> 04:09:42,080
had some volunteers that were there. Uh

6211
04:09:39,680 --> 04:09:43,840
the MOP was there cooking food for

6212
04:09:42,080 --> 04:09:46,239
everybody and stuff. It was just a

6213
04:09:43,840 --> 04:09:48,080
chance for the citizens to come out and

6214
04:09:46,239 --> 04:09:50,720
interact with us on a more personal

6215
04:09:48,080 --> 04:09:52,239
level and ask questions and do things

6216
04:09:50,720 --> 04:09:54,479
like that. Lots of people brought their

6217
04:09:52,239 --> 04:09:56,080
kids out and stuff and happened to be on

6218
04:09:54,479 --> 04:09:58,880
a back to school night and they had it

6219
04:09:56,080 --> 04:10:01,359
at the North Ogden Park. So I think that

6220
04:09:58,880 --> 04:10:03,439
probably bolstered attendance a lot of

6221
04:10:01,359 --> 04:10:08,199
people coming from out back to school

6222
04:10:03,439 --> 04:10:08,199
and stuff but it was really good.

6223
04:10:08,880 --> 04:10:12,880
» Anything else?

6224
04:10:09,840 --> 04:10:15,279
» That's all I got. Jenny,

6225
04:10:12,880 --> 04:10:18,239
» I only have one item. The Utah League of

6226
04:10:15,279 --> 04:10:20,960
Cities and Towns Conference registration

6227
04:10:18,239 --> 04:10:24,239
is now open. The conference will be held

6228
04:10:20,960 --> 04:10:25,840
October 27th and 28th in this is the

6229
04:10:24,239 --> 04:10:28,479
conference that's held in Salt Lake

6230
04:10:25,840 --> 04:10:30,479
City. So, if you'd like, we'd like to

6231
04:10:28,479 --> 04:10:32,479
take advantage of their early bird res

6232
04:10:30,479 --> 04:10:35,920
registration, which I believe ends the

6233
04:10:32,479 --> 04:10:39,920
end of September. So, I'll need to know

6234
04:10:35,920 --> 04:10:41,760
in the next few days uh so that staff

6235
04:10:39,920 --> 04:10:43,520
can make appropriate arrangements for

6236
04:10:41,760 --> 04:10:46,239
registration if you'd like to attend

6237
04:10:43,520 --> 04:10:48,319
that.

6238
04:10:46,239 --> 04:10:51,040
» Okay.

6239
04:10:48,319 --> 04:10:53,359
Council,

6240
04:10:51,040 --> 04:10:56,960
one of the things that came out from the

6241
04:10:53,359 --> 04:10:58,800
last subcommittee from the Utah League

6242
04:10:56,960 --> 04:11:00,319
when they were trying to get feeling

6243
04:10:58,800 --> 04:11:03,520
from different cities, what are they

6244
04:11:00,319 --> 04:11:06,000
doing about certain topics? One is

6245
04:11:03,520 --> 04:11:08,000
direct towards the police.

6246
04:11:06,000 --> 04:11:13,239
Do we

6247
04:11:08,000 --> 04:11:13,239
participate in license pl?

6248
04:11:13,279 --> 04:11:17,520
No, we don't have any LPRs that are

6249
04:11:16,000 --> 04:11:20,479
assigned to the Harrisville Police

6250
04:11:17,520 --> 04:11:24,000
Department. For that, we have a resource

6251
04:11:20,479 --> 04:11:27,439
we can utilize with anou that's through

6252
04:11:24,000 --> 04:11:32,399
the RTCC that's set up through Ogden. on

6253
04:11:27,439 --> 04:11:35,520
critical cases, we can um utilize that

6254
04:11:32,399 --> 04:11:39,920
and get data from the LPRs they have set

6255
04:11:35,520 --> 04:11:42,080
up through um all the Ogden and other

6256
04:11:39,920 --> 04:11:44,160
agencies that participate do

6257
04:11:42,080 --> 04:11:46,640
» But actually in Harris we don't have any

6258
04:11:44,160 --> 04:11:48,800
other than whatever agreements we have

6259
04:11:46,640 --> 04:11:49,520
with other communities to use that that

6260
04:11:48,800 --> 04:11:51,840
technology.

6261
04:11:49,520 --> 04:11:55,840
» Yeah, as of now we do not have anything.

6262
04:11:51,840 --> 04:11:58,560
And then do we have the uh

6263
04:11:55,840 --> 04:12:00,239
what are the uh surveillance camera

6264
04:11:58,560 --> 04:12:05,600
» Flock? Yeah,

6265
04:12:00,239 --> 04:12:09,840
» Flock. No. Um we've recently applied for

6266
04:12:05,600 --> 04:12:12,319
a grant that the Utah Highway Patrol has

6267
04:12:09,840 --> 04:12:15,040
put together based off of a fentanyl

6268
04:12:12,319 --> 04:12:17,760
grant fund that they've had nationwide.

6269
04:12:15,040 --> 04:12:21,439
What they've done is they uh conducted a

6270
04:12:17,760 --> 04:12:24,880
study. Ogden has several flop cameras.

6271
04:12:21,439 --> 04:12:27,680
North Ogden has them. Uh Pleasant View

6272
04:12:24,880 --> 04:12:29,199
has just I think got approval to get

6273
04:12:27,680 --> 04:12:31,199
one. And what they do is they look at

6274
04:12:29,199 --> 04:12:34,640
the study and they look at blind areas

6275
04:12:31,199 --> 04:12:36,800
based off of flock maps. And the travel

6276
04:12:34,640 --> 04:12:40,560
corridors that we have here in traffic

6277
04:12:36,800 --> 04:12:44,479
Harrisville is a blind spot. So with

6278
04:12:40,560 --> 04:12:46,160
that grant, I think uh we're in a

6279
04:12:44,479 --> 04:12:50,160
position where we'd be able to at least

6280
04:12:46,160 --> 04:12:53,680
get one. Okay. Okay. A couple other

6281
04:12:50,160 --> 04:12:57,880
things that came out um

6282
04:12:53,680 --> 04:12:57,880
one was um

6283
04:12:58,239 --> 04:13:02,159
about inspections

6284
04:13:00,159 --> 04:13:05,439
and that the legislature really pushing

6285
04:13:02,159 --> 04:13:08,000
hard that there be private inspectors

6286
04:13:05,439 --> 04:13:09,760
that could be allowed saying that the

6287
04:13:08,000 --> 04:13:12,080
cities aren't responding to the 3-day

6288
04:13:09,760 --> 04:13:14,399
inspection notice.

6289
04:13:12,080 --> 04:13:18,080
And I don't know how we do that on our

6290
04:13:14,399 --> 04:13:21,680
contract with them if we if they respond

6291
04:13:18,080 --> 04:13:24,319
to those days or if it's other cities

6292
04:13:21,680 --> 04:13:25,760
kind of say, "Well, you do it on this

6293
04:13:24,319 --> 04:13:28,800
day. We're close this day and this day

6294
04:13:25,760 --> 04:13:30,080
is really starts on the following

6295
04:13:28,800 --> 04:13:33,760
Tuesday or something like that." They're

6296
04:13:30,080 --> 04:13:35,920
saying, "There's just been some

6297
04:13:33,760 --> 04:13:38,000
misunderstand how this is used and just

6298
04:13:35,920 --> 04:13:40,640
check how your community is using that

6299
04:13:38,000 --> 04:13:42,000
3-day inspections notice." Yeah, we

6300
04:13:40,640 --> 04:13:44,080
haven't had any issue with our

6301
04:13:42,000 --> 04:13:46,479
contracted services for building

6302
04:13:44,080 --> 04:13:50,239
inspections. He's conducting them. He

6303
04:13:46,479 --> 04:13:51,680
has multiple inspectors. So, we we

6304
04:13:50,239 --> 04:13:53,040
haven't had any complaints

6305
04:13:51,680 --> 04:13:54,640
» Cuz I know they're really talking about

6306
04:13:53,040 --> 04:13:56,479
they got a lot of push back to just that

6307
04:13:54,640 --> 04:13:59,840
the contractors hired their own

6308
04:13:56,479 --> 04:14:01,520
inspector. I guess this is probably the

6309
04:13:59,840 --> 04:14:03,040
third legislative season they've been

6310
04:14:01,520 --> 04:14:06,000
having this discussion,

6311
04:14:03,040 --> 04:14:08,800
» But they implemented the mandatory

6312
04:14:06,000 --> 04:14:11,520
uh backup list that we have, but we

6313
04:14:08,800 --> 04:14:13,760
already have a contracted service. We we

6314
04:14:11,520 --> 04:14:15,040
we don't have any employees that conduct

6315
04:14:13,760 --> 04:14:17,040
those inspections.

6316
04:14:15,040 --> 04:14:21,520
» Okay.

6317
04:14:17,040 --> 04:14:25,040
And then the final one um

6318
04:14:21,520 --> 04:14:27,520
they're just talking about of course the

6319
04:14:25,040 --> 04:14:30,560
push again two things that they're

6320
04:14:27,520 --> 04:14:33,359
hearing. One is there'll be a real push

6321
04:14:30,560 --> 04:14:36,880
to try to eliminate sales tax I mean

6322
04:14:33,359 --> 04:14:39,840
property tax from the legislature which

6323
04:14:36,880 --> 04:14:41,760
that was disastrous to communities.

6324
04:14:39,840 --> 04:14:44,479
So there'll be a fight again for that.

6325
04:14:41,760 --> 04:14:46,319
And then the other one is of course to

6326
04:14:44,479 --> 04:14:50,479
say no matter what your zone is, you

6327
04:14:46,319 --> 04:14:53,359
have to allow a 5,000 foot lot.

6328
04:14:50,479 --> 04:14:57,279
» So, um I was just wondering, do we ever

6329
04:14:53,359 --> 04:14:59,600
have any meetings as a council with our

6330
04:14:57,279 --> 04:15:01,680
representatives with the our state

6331
04:14:59,600 --> 04:15:02,640
legislature representatives over our

6332
04:15:01,680 --> 04:15:05,840
district?

6333
04:15:02,640 --> 04:15:08,319
» We have in the past. We we have met with

6334
04:15:05,840 --> 04:15:12,279
uh Ryan Wilcox.

6335
04:15:08,319 --> 04:15:12,279
Um and

6336
04:15:12,319 --> 04:15:17,359
» We haven't had John

6337
04:15:14,720 --> 04:15:19,279
» John Johnson. We have not had one-on-one

6338
04:15:17,359 --> 04:15:24,960
meetings with John Johnson, but we have

6339
04:15:19,279 --> 04:15:28,479
with Ryan Wilcox in the past. And uh

6340
04:15:24,960 --> 04:15:32,239
» I would say this just as a pragmatic

6341
04:15:28,479 --> 04:15:35,040
answer to your question, the league will

6342
04:15:32,239 --> 04:15:38,800
push this, but the senators and members

6343
04:15:35,040 --> 04:15:41,600
of the house uh give you as city council

6344
04:15:38,800 --> 04:15:43,359
members quite a big ear. So if you feel

6345
04:15:41,600 --> 04:15:45,600
like there's something you want to talk

6346
04:15:43,359 --> 04:15:46,960
about or discuss it with them, email

6347
04:15:45,600 --> 04:15:49,279
them or call them because they'll listen

6348
04:15:46,960 --> 04:15:51,600
to you

6349
04:15:49,279 --> 04:15:54,720
» Do that rather than have a

6350
04:15:51,600 --> 04:16:00,800
» Just get them on the phone

6351
04:15:54,720 --> 04:16:03,520
and I have both Brian and John's number.

6352
04:16:00,800 --> 04:16:05,520
I have John's number because I do think

6353
04:16:03,520 --> 04:16:07,680
again some of these things

6354
04:16:05,520 --> 04:16:09,120
» Again are just

6355
04:16:07,680 --> 04:16:11,359
» An overreach

6356
04:16:09,120 --> 04:16:14,720
» And they'll the the league is really

6357
04:16:11,359 --> 04:16:16,319
good as we go into the session since

6358
04:16:14,720 --> 04:16:18,800
» I don't know if you were participating

6359
04:16:16,319 --> 04:16:21,199
in this last January so they'll do the

6360
04:16:18,800 --> 04:16:22,880
blitzes where they notify us and ask us

6361
04:16:21,199 --> 04:16:25,680
to reach out to our legislators which

6362
04:16:22,880 --> 04:16:28,399
are super helpful when things get close.

6363
04:16:25,680 --> 04:16:31,439
» Um but yeah, thank you. I think I missed

6364
04:16:28,399 --> 04:16:34,720
the last update. So, I appreciate that.

6365
04:16:31,439 --> 04:16:38,399
» Yeah, that came out the fall. So, I I've

6366
04:16:34,720 --> 04:16:41,120
got a couple things they said, you know,

6367
04:16:38,399 --> 04:16:42,800
I mean, questionnaires

6368
04:16:41,120 --> 04:16:44,640
doing. I just want to make sure I was

6369
04:16:42,800 --> 04:16:46,080
answering correctly when I

6370
04:16:44,640 --> 04:16:49,080
» The slido polls.

6371
04:16:46,080 --> 04:16:49,080
» Yeah.

6372
04:16:51,040 --> 04:16:55,920
» Last month, we uh talked a little bit

6373
04:16:53,359 --> 04:16:59,840
about the Weaver Community Orchestra

6374
04:16:55,920 --> 04:17:04,080
that we have at and we were able to let

6375
04:16:59,840 --> 04:17:06,239
the music happen for our rehearsals and

6376
04:17:04,080 --> 04:17:08,960
the last one letter wasn't here so we

6377
04:17:06,239 --> 04:17:11,920
couldn't get it on. So the question is

6378
04:17:08,960 --> 04:17:15,920
question is is that we're in the process

6379
04:17:11,920 --> 04:17:18,720
to try to create

6380
04:17:15,920 --> 04:17:20,960
is a little bit more broad than I

6381
04:17:18,720 --> 04:17:22,399
thought it was going to but he used to

6382
04:17:20,960 --> 04:17:24,319
say we'd still like to do some

6383
04:17:22,399 --> 04:17:26,720
rehearsals with the potential of doing

6384
04:17:24,319 --> 04:17:29,920
concerts and I didn't know what the

6385
04:17:26,720 --> 04:17:32,000
blessings were or or Harrison said this

6386
04:17:29,920 --> 04:17:34,880
is a nonprofit organization it's not

6387
04:17:32,000 --> 04:17:36,880
even organized right now it's more of a

6388
04:17:34,880 --> 04:17:39,199
community based

6389
04:17:36,880 --> 04:17:40,800
orchestra as what it is. We can still

6390
04:17:39,199 --> 04:17:43,359
use

6391
04:17:40,800 --> 04:17:46,399
the cabin for rehearsals, but then the

6392
04:17:43,359 --> 04:17:49,040
question comes up where

6393
04:17:46,399 --> 04:17:51,199
you are housing

6394
04:17:49,040 --> 04:17:53,359
and then the IBS is with liability

6395
04:17:51,199 --> 04:17:55,920
insurance. We want to have a concert

6396
04:17:53,359 --> 04:17:58,720
where we can have a concert.

6397
04:17:55,920 --> 04:18:00,800
So the question is is first of all is

6398
04:17:58,720 --> 04:18:04,000
the camera available

6399
04:18:00,800 --> 04:18:10,279
and you brought up the process what the

6400
04:18:04,000 --> 04:18:10,279
North community is doing with North

6401
04:18:11,359 --> 04:18:18,080
public works facility

6402
04:18:13,600 --> 04:18:20,560
that they allow us to use. We are under

6403
04:18:18,080 --> 04:18:22,479
we're not an individual 501c3. in the

6404
04:18:20,560 --> 04:18:25,760
north community band is actually an

6405
04:18:22,479 --> 04:18:30,159
organization, volunteer organization

6406
04:18:25,760 --> 04:18:34,080
within the city. We don't uh everything

6407
04:18:30,159 --> 04:18:37,279
is funded by us for us, but they do

6408
04:18:34,080 --> 04:18:39,840
allow us a facility. We're there to

6409
04:18:37,279 --> 04:18:43,439
perform whenever the city wants us or

6410
04:18:39,840 --> 04:18:48,720
needs us. Um and we go around our

6411
04:18:43,439 --> 04:18:51,120
goodwill representatives of the city.

6412
04:18:48,720 --> 04:18:54,080
So anyhow, there's a need a lot of

6413
04:18:51,120 --> 04:18:55,840
people want to have an orchestra, but

6414
04:18:54,080 --> 04:18:57,680
right now we're in the process of trying

6415
04:18:55,840 --> 04:18:59,520
to go through

6416
04:18:57,680 --> 04:19:02,640
articles of cooperation and get it

6417
04:18:59,520 --> 04:19:04,159
going. That's going to take time. And

6418
04:19:02,640 --> 04:19:07,359
then there's a broader picture that

6419
04:19:04,159 --> 04:19:09,840
starts to look like a Weaver Community

6420
04:19:07,359 --> 04:19:11,520
Alliance, which would include all arts.

6421
04:19:09,840 --> 04:19:15,680
Now I'm talking to the arts committee

6422
04:19:11,520 --> 04:19:19,840
here. We're in

6423
04:19:15,680 --> 04:19:22,399
needless to say good last time.

6424
04:19:19,840 --> 04:19:24,479
» That was a question I had for you.

6425
04:19:22,399 --> 04:19:26,640
» As a member of the orchestra, is that a

6426
04:19:24,479 --> 04:19:28,720
conflict of interest to a motion to

6427
04:19:26,640 --> 04:19:31,439
allow us to use the cabin?

6428
04:19:28,720 --> 04:19:32,720
» Uh, are you financially making a lot of

6429
04:19:31,439 --> 04:19:34,560
money with the orchestra?

6430
04:19:32,720 --> 04:19:36,239
» No. No.

6431
04:19:34,560 --> 04:19:37,680
» Okay.

6432
04:19:36,239 --> 04:19:40,680
» They're like most businesses, they're

6433
04:19:37,680 --> 04:19:40,680
nonprofit.

6434
04:19:41,600 --> 04:19:47,359
» Any other council comments?

6435
04:19:43,439 --> 04:19:50,399
» Yeah, I have just one. So I I've met

6436
04:19:47,359 --> 04:19:53,920
twice now with the with representatives

6437
04:19:50,399 --> 04:19:55,520
from Pleasant View, North Ogden, and

6438
04:19:53,920 --> 04:20:00,319
Harris

6439
04:19:55,520 --> 04:20:03,359
um talking about um economic development

6440
04:20:00,319 --> 04:20:06,239
and um we're at the point that we want

6441
04:20:03,359 --> 04:20:08,640
to start organizing

6442
04:20:06,239 --> 04:20:12,159
some possible things and I'm not asking

6443
04:20:08,640 --> 04:20:14,640
to know tonight, but if you have

6444
04:20:12,159 --> 04:20:17,439
thoughts on

6445
04:20:14,640 --> 04:20:21,760
the the proposition is they're looking

6446
04:20:17,439 --> 04:20:23,439
at possibly having a joint,

6447
04:20:21,760 --> 04:20:25,920
you know, I don't know if you'd call

6448
04:20:23,439 --> 04:20:28,720
them an economic development

6449
04:20:25,920 --> 04:20:32,479
officer or person that's there to help

6450
04:20:28,720 --> 04:20:36,080
promote. Um the thought process is that

6451
04:20:32,479 --> 04:20:38,640
we would advertise not Harrisville as

6452
04:20:36,080 --> 04:20:41,040
Harrisville, not North Ogden as North

6453
04:20:38,640 --> 04:20:42,560
Ogden, and not Pleasant View as Pleasant

6454
04:20:41,040 --> 04:20:44,239
View.

6455
04:20:42,560 --> 04:20:46,239
But when it comes to economic and

6456
04:20:44,239 --> 04:20:49,600
drawing businesses that this is a tri

6457
04:20:46,239 --> 04:20:52,319
city economic development team and

6458
04:20:49,600 --> 04:20:54,000
you're dealing now with 70,

6459
04:20:52,319 --> 04:20:55,760
you know,

6460
04:20:54,000 --> 04:20:58,880
60ish,000

6461
04:20:55,760 --> 04:21:02,720
households to bring businesses to rather

6462
04:20:58,880 --> 04:21:06,720
than 12 for Harrisville. I know we're

6463
04:21:02,720 --> 04:21:12,000
not there yet, right? Uh 20 for North

6464
04:21:06,720 --> 04:21:15,359
Ogden, 15 for Pleasant View. And uh and

6465
04:21:12,000 --> 04:21:17,040
we even have Far West who's interested

6466
04:21:15,359 --> 04:21:20,000
as well and thinking that we might be

6467
04:21:17,040 --> 04:21:23,760
able to create a very strong business

6468
04:21:20,000 --> 04:21:26,800
district business districts along our

6469
04:21:23,760 --> 04:21:28,960
our main thorough affairs Washington 89

6470
04:21:26,800 --> 04:21:32,640
and 2700

6471
04:21:28,960 --> 04:21:35,439
that impact our community. And so um

6472
04:21:32,640 --> 04:21:38,239
what thoughts you might have regarding

6473
04:21:35,439 --> 04:21:40,880
something to that effect and if we would

6474
04:21:38,239 --> 04:21:43,600
be interested in pursuing that further.

6475
04:21:40,880 --> 04:21:47,520
we grow to the point where we want to

6476
04:21:43,600 --> 04:21:49,760
start putting together like a

6477
04:21:47,520 --> 04:21:52,239
you know interlocal

6478
04:21:49,760 --> 04:21:54,960
agreement or memorandum of understanding

6479
04:21:52,239 --> 04:21:57,199
whatever you would call it

6480
04:21:54,960 --> 04:21:58,560
um to uh

6481
04:21:57,199 --> 04:22:01,560
to move forward with something like

6482
04:21:58,560 --> 04:22:01,560
this.

6483
04:22:03,199 --> 04:22:09,199
» Any other comments? Well, I just comment

6484
04:22:05,760 --> 04:22:11,680
on I think that's a a good idea because

6485
04:22:09,199 --> 04:22:13,520
the power is going to be in the legion,

6486
04:22:11,680 --> 04:22:16,239
not as an individual. You know what I

6487
04:22:13,520 --> 04:22:19,279
mean?

6488
04:22:16,239 --> 04:22:22,159
You know, basically I-15 is now the main

6489
04:22:19,279 --> 04:22:25,120
street of the state. You look at all the

6490
04:22:22,159 --> 04:22:27,199
development happens along I5 and how the

6491
04:22:25,120 --> 04:22:29,920
other streets have kind of just kind of

6492
04:22:27,199 --> 04:22:32,000
taken whatever is left

6493
04:22:29,920 --> 04:22:35,359
and to try to tell you all of us were

6494
04:22:32,000 --> 04:22:37,840
not on I15.

6495
04:22:35,359 --> 04:22:40,560
We need to pull together to have some

6496
04:22:37,840 --> 04:22:43,439
strength and security development to

6497
04:22:40,560 --> 04:22:45,760
happen.

6498
04:22:43,439 --> 04:22:48,880
I think it's a good idea.

6499
04:22:45,760 --> 04:22:50,399
you know, we're already involved with

6500
04:22:48,880 --> 04:22:54,800
supporting a lot of stuff that's in

6501
04:22:50,399 --> 04:22:56,640
North Aton with, you know, by 2700. It

6502
04:22:54,800 --> 04:23:00,319
makes sense that when we do a tri city

6503
04:22:56,640 --> 04:23:03,199
or quad city area, it gives a lot of

6504
04:23:00,319 --> 04:23:07,120
clout, but uh we want to approach

6505
04:23:03,199 --> 04:23:11,319
businesses or recruit for businesses.

6506
04:23:07,120 --> 04:23:11,319
We've been trying to do that for years.

6507
04:23:11,840 --> 04:23:18,359
I think I think it could give us more

6508
04:23:13,840 --> 04:23:18,359
power in the table if there's

6509
04:23:18,640 --> 04:23:26,600
some person that's actively searching

6510
04:23:21,840 --> 04:23:26,600
for all the interest.

6511
04:23:33,199 --> 04:23:36,439
» Thank you.

6512
04:23:38,319 --> 04:23:45,520
» Okay. Well, I just A heads up for for

6513
04:23:42,720 --> 04:23:50,359
all the council, all the staff knows,

6514
04:23:45,520 --> 04:23:50,359
but I'm headed to the hospital tomorrow.

6515
04:23:52,159 --> 04:23:58,239
» So I my I have open heart surgery on

6516
04:23:55,920 --> 04:24:03,800
Thursday.

6517
04:23:58,239 --> 04:24:03,800
I'll be there for at least seven days

6518
04:24:06,159 --> 04:24:09,560
for your speed.

6519
04:24:10,560 --> 04:24:16,080
You still haven't told me what I need to

6520
04:24:13,520 --> 04:24:18,560
I know I need to run this meeting, but I

6521
04:24:16,080 --> 04:24:22,000
would like to know more like if you can

6522
04:24:18,560 --> 04:24:24,880
include me on what I need to just

6523
04:24:22,000 --> 04:24:25,920
leave and you're good.

6524
04:24:24,880 --> 04:24:28,800
» So,

6525
04:24:25,920 --> 04:24:30,000
» How was it you do the first you want?

6526
04:24:28,800 --> 04:24:31,520
» What's that?

6527
04:24:30,000 --> 04:24:34,520
» How'd you do the first meeting? You just

6528
04:24:31,520 --> 04:24:34,520
kind

6529
04:24:36,239 --> 04:24:43,920
» Okay, so item number eight is in German.

6530
04:24:40,159 --> 04:24:45,600
How about a motion for 1110?

6531
04:24:43,920 --> 04:24:48,600
» You know, you could say without

6532
04:24:45,600 --> 04:24:48,600
objection.

6533
04:24:49,040 --> 04:24:54,640
» Okay, that's the same thing

6534
04:24:51,680 --> 04:24:58,319
when you're the

6535
04:24:54,640 --> 04:25:03,640
motion that need to be second.

6536
04:24:58,319 --> 04:25:03,640
» Okay. All in favor? I I

6537
04:25:13,600 --> 04:25:19,040
What was it? Yeah, there may couple

6538
04:25:16,080 --> 04:25:19,040
things.