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All right. Like to welcome everybody to
tonight's uh okay

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to tonight's uh burough council meeting.
Um we'll start with the uh call to order

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and roll call.
>> President Gerard.

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» Vice President Burns
>> present.

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» Council member Ferguson
>> here.

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» Council member Hoff
>> here.

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» Council member Weiss
>> here. Mayor Gerard.

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» Senior council person Thompson
>> present. B manager Snider

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» here Harper
>> here.

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» Thank you. And if we stand and do the
pledge of allegiance

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to the republic of the United States of
America and to the republic for which it

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stands one nation under God indivisible
with us for all.

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Stay standing for the invocation.
Let us take a moment to pause and

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reflect as we begin this meeting. May we
approach our work with open minds, clear

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purpose, and a shared commitment to the
common good. May respect guide our

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conversations, wisdom inform our
decisions, and unity strengthen our

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community. We're grateful for the
opportunity to serve and we strive to do

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so with integrity and fairness to all.
Amen. Nice.

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Buckeye show. Damn. I just got back from
the Buckeye State. Nice. Yeah. Still I

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can still feel the
All right.

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» So, we will start with approval of the
meeting agenda. I'd like a motion to

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approve that.
>> Motion.

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» Second.
>> Okay. We have a motion

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and a second. All in favor?
>> I

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» oppose.
Uh and then I'd like a motion for the

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approval of the minutes for July 15th.
>> Motion second.

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» All motion by Cyia and second by
Michelle White.

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All in favor? I
>> I opposed.

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» All right. Now, uh we will do the public
input. If there's anybody from the

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public that would like to speak, please
rise, state your name and address and

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your reason for addressing council.

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Okay.
I do have one um from President Gerard.

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uh he's not able to be here tonight, so
he asked me to uh read this um

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in in and this is a statement by him. In
light of the fallout from our recent

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meeting about the North Broad Street
development proposal, and the resulting

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reaction from various people, both
residents and non-residents, I've put

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together a statement that I'm requesting
to be read by Burough Vice Council

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President Larry Burns in my absence of
the next council meeting.

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I would like to take a few moments to
address the recent zoning decision that

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has prompted significant discussion
throughout our community. I understand

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that this decision, particularly the
choice to favor residential use over

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commercial development, has raised
concerns and in some cases frustration.

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Those reactions are heard and taken
seriously. It is important, however, to

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clearly explain how this decision was
made and what factors were carefully

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weighed throughout the process. This was
not a quick or simple determination and

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is not done not a done deal carved in
stone at this point. The council has

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considered input from the planning
commission, feedback from public

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meetings, the proposed developer,
applicable zoning ordinances, and the

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bureau's long-term comprehensive plan.
In addition, there will be a final

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evaluation of infrastructure capacity,
traffic patterns, neighborhood

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compatibility, and the impact on
essential community services. Once that

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is completed, the burough the burden
will then fall on the developer to meet

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our requirements before final approval
is given. One of the most significant

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considerations in this case is the
operational needs of our local fire

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department. As many of you know, their
ability to respond quickly and

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effectively depends in part on
maintaining adequate access and parking

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for emergency personnel. Any reduction
or disruption to those resources could

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directly affect response times and
public safety. The proposed commercial

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use raised legitimate concerns about
increased congestion and the potential

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loss of critical parking availability.
After careful review, council determined

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that preserving residential zoning in
this area better supports not only the

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character of the neighborhood, but also
the functional needs of the fire

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department and by extension the safety
of our residents. Not only that, but the

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fire department relies on the use of
additional parking spaces, which the

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devel developer agreed to preser
preserve, as a means to help with

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funding their operations so they can
remain a viable, necessary operation in

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the future. This does not mean that
commercial development is unwelcome in

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our bureau. On the contrary, thoughtful
and wellplaced commercial growth remains

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an important part of our va our economic
vitality.

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However, zoning decisions must reflect
the specific context

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of each location and the realities of
our current economic environment. And in

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this instance, the balance of factors
weigh in favor of residential use. I

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also want to address the tone of some
recent public commentary.

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While disagreement is a natural and
valuable part of civic engagement, some

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remarks directed at council members on
social media have gone beyond policy

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critique and into personal
disparagement. That is neither

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productive nor fair, especially coming
from some individuals who are not even

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residents of this bureau. Every member
of this council approached this decision

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with diligence and integrity. They
viewed the facts, listened to residents,

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and considered expert input. You may
disagree with the outcome, but it's

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important to recognize that these
decisions were made in good faith with a

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broader interest of the community in
mind. As we move forward, I encourage

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continued involvement from Aluro
residents. Your input is essential and

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it plays a meaningful role in shaping
future decisions.

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At the same time, I ask that we all
remain committed to respectful and

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constructive dialogue. We all share
responsibility for be for the well-being

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of this bureau, supporting our volunteer
fire department, preserving neighborhood

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stability, and planning responsibly for
the future and goals that are ultimately

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benefit us all. Finally, I would like to
say that it is truly an honor to serve

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as council president and to work
alongside the current members of this

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burough council. Their diligence,
thoughtfulness, and commitment to doing

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what is best for this community should
not go unrecognized. I am proud of the

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care they bring to each decision, even
when those decisions are difficult.

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Thank you.

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» Great. Any more public input?
>> Right. Thank you. All right. Next, we

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will move on to announcements.
Next pro council meeting is the

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September 16th workshop regular meeting
at 7 p.m. in council chambers. The next

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planning commission meeting is scheduled
for Monday, September 28th at 6 p.m. in

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council chambers. Moving in the park
that was scheduled for Thursday, August

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20th will be cancelled due to projected
forecast for tomorrow. Unfortunately,

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our fall fest though is scheduled for
Saturday, September 19th, starting at 3

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p.m. on East Lincoln Avenue. The Bur
offices will be closed from 12:00 p.m.

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to 1:30 p.m. on Wednesday, August 26 for
employee training. And the Bur offices

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will be closed on Monday, September 7 in
observation of the Labor Day holiday.

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Thank you. Any questions on those?
Uh, next we'll move on to number five,

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uh, land development presentation for
200 North Main Street, Lden Schlagger

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Senior Apartments.

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Good evening

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Stewart. Uh we represent the applicant
Latin flagger campus benefit LLC in

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connection with our application for
preliminary final land development

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approval from the burough. Applicant is
the owner of two adjacent parcels. one

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that's located in Hatfield Township and
then another one located that's

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approximately 1.46 acres in the burrow
which was the former location of the

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biblical Theological um seminary school
and that's located at the corner of

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Fairgrounds and Carol Road which turns
into North Main Street in Burrow. The

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furrow parcel is presently improved with
a small sliver of the principal school

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building, a secondary singlestory
building and two driveway accesses off

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street. The eastern driveway access is
currently shared with the green

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residential properties and connects to a
large sort of impervious parking field

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on the southern corner of the burough
parcel. applicant here is proposing to

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convert the existing school and
redevelop the site for age restricted

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imperence. The secondary building that's
located in the burrow parcel will be

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removed from um the property and the
parking field that's in the burrow

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parcel is being redesigned as shown. Uh
the existing imperous parking that's

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located in Wam's southern corner there
doesn't extend past what the current

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existing parking fields is. There's also
associated utilities, storm water

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management and landscaping proposed
within the burrow itself. Um

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although there are additional
development being proposed in connection

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with the project this is phased and you
can see on the overarching plan that was

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submitted you can see there is proposed
to be two additional buildings over time

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in phases those are both to be located
on the council and not in vern itself.

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Um, as you might recall, and I believe
might be discussed on the agenda later,

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there was zoning relief previously
granted for this project. Um, it was a

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special exception relief and we are
going back in on 24th of September to

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request that that be reinstated. That's
to allow the conversion from one

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non-conforming use to another. Um, we
are optimistic that will be reinstated.

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um as the applicant has really been
moving forward with this project in good

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low income. It requires a number of
groups from both here, the township and

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a variety of other kind of
parts in order to get the project

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moving. And so we're optimistic that'll
be reinstated so that this project can

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proceed and provide um much needed
housing for the community. Um I'm here

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tonight with Jacob Tacket. He's been an
engineer on this project um to further

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walk through the actual plan for you
guys in detail since he's the one that

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actually designed this and um more
articulate at least to the engineering

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than I am. But um we did
receive the engineers review letter um

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largely comply to everything. Um we
don't see any major red flags. Um there

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were some comments that were made that
um precipitated our um decision to

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request some waiverss. For example,
normally you request information about

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200 ft around the property. We'll
provide an aerial and necessary

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information, but we're asking for what's
typical of waivers to not have built in

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and surveyed neighboring properties. Um,
we're also asking for we'll get into

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them one by one um to allow for the
impervious that's going to provide for

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the carping to be shown so that there's
the the bishop circulation and that

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we're not kind of having to push into
the grassy area that currently exists.

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Um, I'm going to say planning south
which isn't actually south on the

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property. Um, in order to do this, the
layout does provide for more states than

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a row with how the landscape land. So,
we did ask for a partial paper for that

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when we presented it to the planning
commission. They were interested in

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potentially if it's possible and we work
with the engineer if there's a way in

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which they wanted the would provided for
enough space like a couple trees and a

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bush. So if you can fit that in
somewhere else on the property, we are

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willing to do so. Um we do currently
have this proposed this new landscaping

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that is very very planned out moment. So
we kind of provide that guarantee but we

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were against that in order to um
think if there were any other

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major kind of red flags. There really
weren't. Um again largely we we feel

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like we didn't comply. We're moving
through with the NPDS part. You don't

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see any anticipated kind of state
changes as a result of that. Um, and

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we're moving forward. We also again
participate to get cons. So, we are

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optimistic that we can kind of proceed
with you guys in working towards an

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approval of the burough side. Um,
conditioned on our ability

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necessary outside agency at zoning
relief.

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that I will turn it over to you.
>> Hold on for a second. Can we just get a

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couple questions?
>> Sure.

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» All right. Um, this project is in the
township and the burrow, correct?

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» That's correct.
>> All right. So, you're going to the

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burrow zoning hearing board for relief,
actually an extension of the relief that

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you're already granted for this
proposal.

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» That is correct. and you'll be filing if
you haven't already um land development

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plans here in the burrow but also in the
township. So we filed for the um

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approval here. We've also applied for
approval in the township. We're doing it

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in parallel and we've received review
letters from both right the board has

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them I think it is and so with the
burough we have completely will comply

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with the township. I think we're pretty
close. We have a couple questions

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because there were a couple comments
that felt a little vague which sometimes

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happens. So, we're going to have a
meeting with the township engineer, but

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we don't we didn't see any kind of red
flags or issues on the township side or

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if we do see that we're going to be able
to work on that. Township

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» in a way that's not going to result in
meaningful changes to the plan that

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we're proposing.
>> All right. And the plan you're proposing

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tonight, is it the same as the one that
already went to the zoning board and got

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relief some years ago or has it changed?
It It is the same. It's just further.

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» Very good. All right. Just a little
facts might be helpful to the council's

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understanding what we're doing here.

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» Any other questions?
I can always come back here.

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D can you just start by orienting us
where the municipal boundary line is?

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» Absolutely. Good evening. My name is
James Hacket. I'm a associate civil

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engineering consultant for the project.
Um the municipal boundary sort of runs

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diagonal along the uh parcel here. I
will and parallel to the existing

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seminary school. Julie is kind of
tracing it now. It's a light dashed line

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that runs sort of just north of the
bottom of the existing site. Um, so the

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proposed project, as Julie said, it is
contained mostly within the township

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boundary. There are no proposed
structures within the burrow's boundary.

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uh improvements generally consists of uh
reconfigured driveway parking

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improvements, utility improvements,
storm water conveyance, non-storm water

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management systems with storm water
conveyance types and structures,

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landscaping and lighting uh with some
pedestrian access via sidewalks uh and

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ADA compliant crosswalks and driveway of
Me Street. Comprehensively, the project

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consists of three different uh
buildings, two of which are proposed, as

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Julie said, one of which is a
rehabilitation or renovation of the

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existing baby school um existing
driveways uh present along Cowpath Road.

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One of which is proposed to be closed
part of the application. The other we

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show here to the south of the
development is proposed to be

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00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:36,559
reconfigured to align with our parking
and uh drive layout uh for safe

214
00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:40,000
circulation draw site. The residential
driveway to the south of our parcel,

215
00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:43,679
which kind of is bifurcated by our
property line, is proposed to remain

216
00:17:41,679 --> 00:17:47,679
untouched or unchanged to the extent
that we're able to uh leave it alone if

217
00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:52,480
it needs to be repaved. It's just a
function of rehabilitating the existing

218
00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:59,360
access points to the residential
properties that do not have access

219
00:17:55,039 --> 00:18:07,120
directly on West uh School Street.
The project generally is uh is is a a

220
00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:11,840
slight change in cover from the existing
condition. Meaning we are proposing to

221
00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:17,200
increase the impervious coverage very
slightly um and essentially diminish uh

222
00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:23,360
change in cover within the purpose
boundary itself. Um

223
00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:29,840
the project itself is proposed to
service three of the the three proposed

224
00:18:27,120 --> 00:18:33,840
the three proposed structures um
individually with water, sanitary,

225
00:18:31,679 --> 00:18:38,640
sewer, electrical gas as this project is
proposed to be completed in multiple

226
00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:44,240
phases. Um storm water management is
proposed uh in two phases essentially.

227
00:18:41,360 --> 00:18:48,799
The first of which is to service the
first phase of construction which is

228
00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:53,360
presently funded by DHFA. Um it is a
surface MRC basin which is just a way of

229
00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:58,720
saying that the the ground on this
property does not infiltrate. Um so it's

230
00:18:55,679 --> 00:19:02,000
sort of like a quasi infiltration basin
that doesn't actually seep into into the

231
00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:08,240
ground. It's contained within a soil
media um at the basin bed. Similarly for

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00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:12,799
phase two and three um though they are
not clearly defined on this plan the

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00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:18,960
separate MRC bases proposed to manage
both of those spaces in the future.

234
00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:23,360
We have in hand our engineer uh the
burough's engineering letter. Um again

235
00:19:21,360 --> 00:19:27,760
largely what we consider or will
complies. Um there is a comment that we

236
00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:31,039
would like to discuss with the town of
engineer as it relates to their storm

237
00:19:29,120 --> 00:19:35,360
water review. We have that scheduled for
early next week. Um I would like to also

238
00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:39,679
schedule a time chat with you to discuss
the engineer comments from the birth

239
00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:43,600
perspective. Um we don't think that
there is anything in that letter that

240
00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:47,120
you prepared as not able to be complied
with. Um there were a couple of comments

241
00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:50,799
certainly related to the zoning that we
expect to be reinstated. Um and

242
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:55,440
understand that the project cannot move
forward without that. Um but we're

243
00:19:52,960 --> 00:20:02,559
optimistic that that will occur here
later in September uh to put that to

244
00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:08,960
rate that ship. Um
excuse me sorry it's been a long day.

245
00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:12,320
We are uh currently under review and
addressing blance comments with an NPDS

246
00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,559
application with Montgomery County
Conservation District. We had a

247
00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:19,120
production call with them this
afternoon. Um the site does not

248
00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:23,520
infiltrate as I mentioned there shallow
bedrock. So we will be um installing in

249
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:29,360
permeable liner to separate any
potential groundwater from the runoff

250
00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:36,480
generated by this development. Um all
runoff generated by this development

251
00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:40,080
will be collected and uh again directed
to the storm water basins that discharge

252
00:20:38,559 --> 00:20:44,559
ultimately into fairgrounds road and
then further north into uh our receiving

253
00:20:42,559 --> 00:20:51,840
waters within the township's boundary.
The only runoff uh proposed to

254
00:20:48,320 --> 00:20:56,480
drain to the waterways within the burrow
uh are the grass area south of our

255
00:20:54,559 --> 00:21:00,640
proposed parking field within the
burough's boundary where there's kind of

256
00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:04,880
like no development shown uh between the
residential driveways and our parking

257
00:21:02,159 --> 00:21:08,640
field. That will continue to flow as it
does in its existing condition. There's

258
00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:13,840
no change to the cover. In fact, we're
actually um buffering that quite

259
00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:18,799
substantially with proposed landscaping.
There's an argument to be made that the

260
00:21:17,039 --> 00:21:22,880
density of our landscaping will actually
seep up more runoff that presently

261
00:21:20,559 --> 00:21:29,280
exists with a lawn cover today. But it's
not an argument to make um back in

262
00:21:25,840 --> 00:21:33,840
science. It's just a concept.
Regardless, uh we've demonstrated that

263
00:21:31,520 --> 00:21:38,240
both or all of our points of interest uh
from pre-development to post development

264
00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:42,400
condition are reduced. um meaning that
what is generating today will be less

265
00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:47,120
than what is generated tomorrow when the
site is fully built out. We received

266
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:52,400
feedback from the planning commission as
part of our presentation on Monday that

267
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:57,120
uh certainly we keep our storm water
basins in good condition. That's a state

268
00:21:54,559 --> 00:22:01,280
requirement uh that we agree to add the
requested notes to the plan. Um but we

269
00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:05,039
do have a couple of waiverss that we'd
like to discuss this evening as it

270
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:08,880
relates to the application.
first of which uh is to combine the

271
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:15,440
preliminary final plan development
process into a single uh application uh

272
00:22:12,559 --> 00:22:20,240
which was voted or considered to be
accepted as part of our presentation on

273
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:25,360
Monday. Uh we have a waiver as it
relates to presenting or detecting the

274
00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:32,000
existing conditions within 200 ft of
property boundary. Um the partial waiver

275
00:22:28,159 --> 00:22:37,679
that we're requesting was to omit the
irrelevant items that would be

276
00:22:35,039 --> 00:22:42,960
impractical to show or necessarily uh
obtain additional survey for examples of

277
00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:47,280
that would include uh topographic survey
down gradient of us in residential

278
00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:51,840
properties uh that we might not be able
to easily need access for. uh we would

279
00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:56,240
be showing aerial imagery to depict
existing conditions uh from surface

280
00:22:54,000 --> 00:23:00,960
level with the areas surrounding our
property um as well as you know kind of

281
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:05,120
omitting the storm water conveyance or
utility infrastructure that is relevant

282
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:11,520
to our application.
The two material waiverss that we're

283
00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:17,360
requesting uh support from include the
development of parking spaces within 20

284
00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:21,440
ft of our property line which exists
here to the south of our property line

285
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:27,039
or to the south of our development uh
very close to this other property line

286
00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:30,320
here. Um what we are proposing is to
maintain an existing condition where

287
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:34,880
there's presently paving up to the
property line today. we proposed to

288
00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:38,159
enhance that and make it more um
aesthetically pleasing and actually

289
00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:44,480
stripe it out and and bring it into
modern stance or construction standards.

290
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:49,120
Um we will be meeting the intent of the
ordinance from a buffering perspective

291
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:54,159
by installing an opaque fence um to
mimic a vegetative buffer so that there

292
00:23:51,440 --> 00:24:00,240
is some visual break up from the
residential uh property south of us. The

293
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:05,440
other waiver that we are requesting is
for the allowance of more than 18

294
00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:10,000
parking spaces uh to be laid out
continuously without the breakout of a

295
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:14,159
landscaping island. Um again this mimics
an existing condition while the site is

296
00:24:12,159 --> 00:24:21,679
currently vacant and the parking field
is very widely strike. Um there is

297
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:25,279
presently enough room uh within the
parking field to park more than 18

298
00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:29,440
spaces uh continuously without a
landscaping island. So again, we're

299
00:24:27,120 --> 00:24:35,919
proposing to sort of mimic that existing
nonconformity by bringing the site into

300
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:42,720
modern uh w with modern construction.
We understand that the burrow prefers to

301
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:47,360
provide electrical power to all of the
three proposed

302
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:51,039
uh redeveloped structures as was
discussed at our planning commission

303
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:57,200
meeting on Monday.
PPL has the authority or jurisdiction of

304
00:24:54,960 --> 00:25:03,520
electrical service within the township's
boundary. Um, and so we are working with

305
00:24:59,679 --> 00:25:08,960
the bureau now to get PBL to relinquish
their right to service the site uh so

306
00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:13,919
that the burrow can continue to service
the site electrically. Similarly, uh

307
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:19,120
there was a request to maintain existing
sanitary service maintain the existing

308
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:23,840
sanitary service for the vac seminary
school which we proposed to comply with.

309
00:25:21,360 --> 00:25:30,400
The other request was that both proposed
buildings are serviced by Hatfield

310
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:36,080
Burrow's uh sanitary um municipal
authority. However, knowing that there

311
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:39,039
is a moratorum within uh Main Street for
the next four and a half or four and a

312
00:25:37,679 --> 00:25:44,240
quarter years, I can't remember what
it's now. Um we and given the

313
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:49,760
topographical challenges of our site, we
are looking to connect our proposed

314
00:25:47,360 --> 00:25:55,039
buildings one and two to the fairgrounds
road sanitary system.

315
00:25:52,799 --> 00:26:02,039
Uh water service for all three buildings
will exist independently

316
00:25:57,679 --> 00:26:02,039
as well. Uh we maintain

317
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:09,840
the existing service points within uh
main street to the extent that we're

318
00:26:06,159 --> 00:26:14,080
able to with water, silver and uh
>> electric

319
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:18,080
» and so electric is presently uh we're
working through that as well. Uh but

320
00:26:15,919 --> 00:26:25,240
certainly for the uh for the seminary
you know we'll be continuing to be

321
00:26:20,159 --> 00:26:25,240
serviced through the existing initiative

322
00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:34,000
landscaping. Uh if you could go to the
the next sheets here, maybe two more

323
00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:38,640
here, you'll see is very substantially
built out. We've left very little square

324
00:26:35,919 --> 00:26:44,640
footage on the site that doesn't have a
shrub or a tree or a bush. Um but as

325
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:50,000
discussed at the planning commission
presentation on Monday, we will look to

326
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:53,679
install additional vegetative buffer
along that southern property line with

327
00:26:51,679 --> 00:26:58,480
the residents uh adjacent to us if
they're open to it. If not, we will

328
00:26:55,440 --> 00:27:02,840
continue to work with engineer to find a
satisfactory response to that request.

329
00:27:05,120 --> 00:27:11,279
» Can you ask you because it did come up
at the planning commission meeting and

330
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:14,880
continue appreciate for you guys to
understand this a little bit more since

331
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:19,600
this is a phase project. We understand
that neighbors are always concerned

332
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:23,360
about kind of ongoing construction for a
long period of time when there's a phase

333
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:27,279
project. Um, can you just explain
there's there's very clear permitting

334
00:27:25,039 --> 00:27:31,760
requirements for each phase when the
construction is done to bring the

335
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:36,400
property into a condition that looks as
though the construction's complete and

336
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:41,760
finished. And then when you move into
phase two, you would then obviously set

337
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:45,919
up the property for that next
construction project. But Jacob can

338
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:50,960
explain this better than I can. But I
know that that was um that was a concern

339
00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:55,279
that's been expressed and it is
considered. There will be a more

340
00:27:52,720 --> 00:28:00,799
detailed phasing thing provided so that
there is a full understanding of how the

341
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:07,279
phases will work, how the property will
appear at the end of each or in between

342
00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:11,600
each phase in case there is a delay um
in moving forward with the project. So

343
00:28:09,279 --> 00:28:15,919
it doesn't look like a construction site
for

344
00:28:13,279 --> 00:28:19,440
however long this takes. Right. We
definitely are going to need a phase

345
00:28:17,279 --> 00:28:22,559
plan that our engineer can't review.
Yes.

346
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:26,480
» And because when the time comes to give
approvals,

347
00:28:24,159 --> 00:28:29,600
you know, normally
say the construction has to be done in a

348
00:28:28,159 --> 00:28:34,720
year and that's not going to work here.
So you need to lay out for us what your

349
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:39,279
plan is. So that's the the burough
council can't consider that in any

350
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:42,799
approval resolution. The other thing is
I did ask the question about electric

351
00:28:41,039 --> 00:28:50,320
because you may or may not be aware of
this. Hatfield Burrow is a municipal

352
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:56,799
electric um provider. Very unusual in
this part of the world, but Landdale has

353
00:28:52,480 --> 00:29:02,080
similar situation. So um we would we had
originally talked about connecting the

354
00:28:59,279 --> 00:29:06,880
entire site to our electric. You would
have to run the the conveyancing from

355
00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:11,279
one end to the other to make sure it was
in the burrow when it connects.

356
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:15,679
I'm not sure I understand what you mean
by conveyancing, but yes, we do

357
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:22,559
recognize that and Jamie and I have been
in discussion with how we're approaching

358
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:25,120
PBL to get them to uh give us permission
the bureau permission to service the

359
00:29:24,159 --> 00:29:29,440
entire property.
>> Yeah. So, so Kate, that's actually a

360
00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:33,120
condition of their zoning order
>> was it was a condition. So, they get it

361
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:36,080
extended, they have to do it, but I just
want to make sure they understood.

362
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:41,120
» Yeah. You know why?
>> Electric and sewer is a condition of the

363
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:45,039
zoning order too. Now, keep in mind it's
a little bit gray. It says if possible.

364
00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:48,720
So, they could argue whether or not it's
possible, but that's something that

365
00:29:46,799 --> 00:29:50,559
should certainly be considered in the
zoning extension.

366
00:29:50,159 --> 00:29:54,960
» Absolutely.
>> And we do have a provision in our

367
00:29:52,640 --> 00:30:00,080
ordinance for if you have to tear up a
road that we just paved. Okay. There is

368
00:29:57,679 --> 00:30:06,320
a provision. We've had to do that for
the the Heckler property. remember they

369
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:10,559
had to come in make their case and uh B
granted it with certain conditions to

370
00:30:07,919 --> 00:30:16,080
make sure the road got repaired. Okay.
So that's a possibility. You shouldn't

371
00:30:12,799 --> 00:30:20,640
regard that as it's impossible. Okay.
>> Understood. And uh I I think I can speak

372
00:30:19,039 --> 00:30:25,520
for the applicant owner that they would
prefer to go through you guys as the as

373
00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:30,000
the utility makes it easier. It's more
for small town. Um so we're working

374
00:30:28,559 --> 00:30:35,600
through
>> those issues. Okay. And and if it was in

375
00:30:32,399 --> 00:30:40,159
the zoning uh approval and it's um
extended,

376
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:44,000
you know, we'll be expecting that. We're
we're not requesting any modification to

377
00:30:42,399 --> 00:30:48,000
any of the conditions of the prior
approval in connection with the

378
00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:53,039
extension. So the expectation is that
the conditions that were there before

379
00:30:50,399 --> 00:30:58,559
will still be in place and the project
is being designed and they're proceeding

380
00:30:56,559 --> 00:31:02,720
under the impression that they will need
to meet each of those conditions. Okay.

381
00:31:01,279 --> 00:31:06,880
Thanks. Just want to make sure we're all
on the same page.

382
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:10,720
» Um just for the purpose of this meeting,
can you point out the phases?

383
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:16,640
» Sure.
>> Yeah. Could you go back to the plan?

384
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:18,640
Are we doing the redevelopment of the se
second phase or third phase?

385
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:22,320
» Say it again.
>> The redevelopment of the existing

386
00:31:20,159 --> 00:31:26,799
structure. It's sort of flip-flop back
and forth. Phase two or three has been

387
00:31:25,279 --> 00:31:29,799
the redevelopment of the existing
structure.

388
00:31:29,919 --> 00:31:35,200
» It's going to be three.
>> Okay. All right. So, I'll go to the

389
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:39,440
screen here and point out basically what
we're looking at.

390
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:42,720
» Phase one includes the development of
proposed building one, which runs

391
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:46,960
parallel to Fairgrounds Road. the
necessary parking to facilitate

392
00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:50,240
operations on that will be installed as
part of phase one as well which

393
00:31:48,399 --> 00:31:55,039
generally includes all the parking
fields central to the site um and

394
00:31:52,640 --> 00:32:01,600
extending as far as we need to uh to
adequately service phase one. The

395
00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:05,679
remaining driveway as part of that
improvement will be installed as well.

396
00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:10,640
The parking spaces and sidewalk
associated with that would be deferred

397
00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:17,200
until phase two. landscaping is still
sort of ambiguous or undefined. Uh the

398
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:20,720
quantity of landscaping or or vegetative
spaces that need to be installed to

399
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:24,880
comply if this first phase were to be
the only part of the project will be

400
00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:28,960
installed as part of phase one. Uh but
the entirety of the site will not be

401
00:32:26,159 --> 00:32:34,559
planted until phases two and three.
Storm water basin one. If you can go to

402
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:38,960
the grading plan next sheet.
>> What page was that?

403
00:32:35,679 --> 00:32:42,080
» Right here. Stormwater basin one here,
the northern of the two will be

404
00:32:40,399 --> 00:32:47,120
installed as part of phase one, as well
as all of the necessary storm conveyance

405
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:51,360
infrastructure to facilitate runoff to
that basin. Phase two and three will be

406
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:56,320
installed or this basin would be
installed as part phases 2/3.

407
00:32:54,240 --> 00:33:01,279
Um, utilities for phase one will be
installed as part of phase one. The

408
00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:04,399
deferment of sanitary, sewer, water, and
uh, electrical connections would be

409
00:33:02,799 --> 00:33:08,320
deferred until phase two and three for
their respective buildings as well. Uh

410
00:33:06,799 --> 00:33:11,760
but from a site layout perspective,
you're talking about the driveway

411
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:18,080
improvements on both Main Street and
Fairgrounds Road. Uh the comprehensive

412
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:22,640
circulation loop that gets people to and
from each of those increas points. Um

413
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:27,919
the building itself of course and then
the north storm water basin uh would be

414
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:32,240
comprised of phase one. Phase two would
see the rest of the site uh built out

415
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:36,399
from a parking perspective as well as
all underground utilities so we don't

416
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:40,960
have to bring that up in the future. Um
and the phase two building which is

417
00:33:38,799 --> 00:33:44,720
running parallel to the western property
line. Phase three as we understand now

418
00:33:43,279 --> 00:33:50,799
will just be the redevelopment of the
existing bas.

419
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:54,480
» So a couple questions. So if the amount
of imperous ground didn't change

420
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:59,600
significantly why do you have to put the
basins in there?

421
00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:05,279
» We engineers today are paying for the
sins of our forefathers. uh storm water

422
00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:09,760
management has uh what we're supposed to
be doing as part of our NBDS permit

423
00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:14,800
regulations is essentially assessing a
part of the existing imperous site as a

424
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:18,079
meadow cover which triggers even a one
to one change in cover from a

425
00:34:16,720 --> 00:34:23,760
pre-development to post development
condition as u on paper generating more

426
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:30,320
cut off so it's been a long-standing
effort in state to correct some of the

427
00:34:27,919 --> 00:34:35,760
flooding issues that we see pretty
commonly in this uh neck of the woods.

428
00:34:33,119 --> 00:34:41,440
So uh we have water body requirements
that we need to adhere to as part of our

429
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:46,399
MDS requirements. Um as well as the way
that runoff presently runs off the site

430
00:34:44,240 --> 00:34:49,599
is is going to be different when the
site is built out than it is today. So

431
00:34:48,240 --> 00:34:54,800
it's it's just the best engineering
practice uh to maintain and improve the

432
00:34:52,720 --> 00:34:59,599
site from existing conditions. The
township also has uh more robust storm

433
00:34:57,920 --> 00:35:04,400
water regulations that require us to
dial back our storm water rates in the

434
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:09,040
post development condition.
So even if there was no increase in uh

435
00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:13,680
in previous coverage, you would still be
needing to follow your rates back to

436
00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:15,520
whatever the touch ordinance in this
case requires us to do.

437
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:19,520
» Okay.
>> So Jason, just touching this ground

438
00:35:17,119 --> 00:35:23,119
requires them to put basins in. And and
as a general statement, storm water

439
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:26,880
management, and it may be hard to
believe, is by far the hardest part of

440
00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:31,200
any land development project there is.
It's it's the most timeconuming. It's

441
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:35,520
the most difficult to comply with. Um,
you know, we we do private work as well

442
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:39,119
and and it's a nightmare. Um,
>> that's where I thought somehow it might

443
00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:42,480
be grandfathered in because it was it's
already been that way.

444
00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:47,040
» Nothing's grandfathered in. Um to
reiterate his point, anything that's

445
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:52,240
impervious currently, you have to assume
20% of that is meadow. So even though

446
00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:57,599
you're not increasing impervious, on
paper you are. And that's again to

447
00:35:55,599 --> 00:36:00,960
improve the sins of the past as they say
and and try to make think of the

448
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:04,640
Montgomery Mall for example. I mean
that's all parking lot. There's no storm

449
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:08,000
water management out there at all. You
wouldn't want to build something there

450
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:09,920
and not do some sort of improvements.
>> Got it.

451
00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:12,720
» This isn't quite to that extent, but
it's the same concept.

452
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:16,800
» Okay. I didn't know that. Okay.
>> Yeah. To avoid solar management design

453
00:36:15,359 --> 00:36:20,960
improvements or solar based
improvements, you typically be looking

454
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:26,320
at reducing the existing impurities
coverage by 20% or more uh in a proposed

455
00:36:23,599 --> 00:36:30,800
development uh condition, which is rare.
You really only see those in major like

456
00:36:28,240 --> 00:36:33,040
metro redevelopment like malls.
>> Yeah.

457
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:38,860
» Um so in other words, Yeah. So because
it wasn't done before, now we're doing

458
00:36:35,119 --> 00:36:43,520
it now. I get it. So
[laughter]

459
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:49,280
» yeah. Yeah. Um, okay. And so when we
think about the electric and sewer, so

460
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:52,720
do we already have connected connections
of burrow today for electric and sewer

461
00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:58,160
» to the existing building? Yes.
>> To the existing building. Right. Um, so

462
00:36:55,920 --> 00:37:03,040
when you talk about phase one and phase
two, you're going to have to connect

463
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:09,200
those into the existing electric and
sewer as part of that.

464
00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:13,200
» Zoning order. We are required to do that
if it is possible. Okay.

465
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:19,920
» An example of it being impossible in my
mind would be EDL not allowing

466
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:23,440
» their service area to be over ruled by
the

467
00:37:21,599 --> 00:37:29,440
municipal authority.
>> I will just add that electric is under

468
00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:34,400
legal review right now by our uh by use.
Electric is under legal review right now

469
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:38,079
by use. So Jacob and I have had a
conversation offline or might have met

470
00:37:36,079 --> 00:37:42,560
with his electrical engineer and we have
proposed um Hatfield having all three

471
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:47,359
buildings and it's under legal review of
Salsman use. So um when we get an answer

472
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:51,520
from legal as their special utility
council then we'll they will know how to

473
00:37:49,359 --> 00:37:57,520
move forward.
And now knowing that there is an ability

474
00:37:53,839 --> 00:38:01,200
uh to impact the
recently completed main street of the

475
00:37:59,920 --> 00:38:04,960
sewer connection, we we're going to have
to take a look at that, see if we can

476
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:08,800
make that work vertically as well. So
the only reason that would be an

477
00:38:06,079 --> 00:38:16,000
impossibility is that there's not enough
vertical space to make the connection.

478
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:16,960
» In my mind,
>> I keep going.

479
00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:20,880
» Yeah.
>> Okay. [laughter]

480
00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:24,240
So, so there you you you were talking
about, if correct me if I'm wrong, there

481
00:38:22,240 --> 00:38:27,040
were four different waiverss, right?
>> There were. Yes.

482
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:32,400
» Okay. So, the the first waiver was
combining all of this into one. I guess

483
00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:36,960
» the request one approval.
>> Yes. The request uh typically projects

484
00:38:35,359 --> 00:38:40,400
of this magnitude, you would combine
preliminary final development plan

485
00:38:38,720 --> 00:38:47,839
because it's a it's a concept that
doesn't anticipate changing much

486
00:38:44,240 --> 00:38:53,280
perspective. If we were proposing a
subdivision like a 10 lot subdivision

487
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:56,320
where uh buildings are not fully
designed, we would coming for I see.

488
00:38:55,839 --> 00:39:00,640
Yeah. Okay.
>> And then in the future

489
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:04,560
plan once the
individual lots are fully engineered but

490
00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:09,359
in this case we we know what the mission
is. We don't anticipate it changing much

491
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:12,400
uh but for address components from uh
the reviewing agencies.

492
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:16,720
» So how would that work if it was
combined versus separate? It's we would

493
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:20,640
you would just vote when the time came
on a resolution that gave preliminary

494
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,760
slashfinal
approval.

495
00:39:21,359 --> 00:39:26,079
» Okay?
>> It it's it's often done.

496
00:39:24,079 --> 00:39:29,760
» And if we didn't do it, then they would
have to go to the planning commission.

497
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:33,280
They'd have to get preliminary approval,
then come back to go to the planning

498
00:39:31,119 --> 00:39:38,480
commission again, and then come back to
us again. And so if their plans don't

499
00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:43,520
expect to change, preliminaryfinal is
probably a a good way to go unless the

500
00:39:41,599 --> 00:39:46,560
engineer finds something really serious
that will need to be changed and they

501
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:50,800
can't do it, right?
>> It saves them a meeting. It doesn't

502
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:54,560
really save them time. Well, they're
here anyway, so it saves one or two

503
00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:58,400
meetings. It doesn't necessarily save
them time because you're not going to

504
00:39:55,680 --> 00:40:03,119
issue I wouldn't recommend you grant
final approval until it's it's all

505
00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:07,040
buttoned up. A lot of times a developer
would want to get a preliminary approval

506
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:11,599
because their financing can can be
vested once they get their preliminary

507
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:15,920
approval. When the the banks will loan
money, that's when their vesting rights

508
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:19,040
are are in place. In this case, it
doesn't sound like they're, you know,

509
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:22,720
too concerned about that. So, they're
willing to forego the preliminary

510
00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:28,079
approval and go to final approval.
Again, I wouldn't recommend this board

511
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:30,720
approve it finally until it's ready to
go and you're comfortable with it,

512
00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:34,400
right? So it doesn't necessarily speed
up the process. It saves them a night or

513
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:39,200
two come to one of these meetings.
>> Well, the other thing is they could do

514
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:43,359
um and we often do approvals with
conditions.

515
00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:48,560
» Certainly there will be some conditions.
>> Yeah. Going to need a variety of

516
00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:52,640
conditions outside either the township
or the burrow.

517
00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:59,119
» Yeah. Correct. We we would not be
expecting a colony final that was not

518
00:40:55,599 --> 00:41:07,000
conditioned upon our compliance with his
review letter and um the

519
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:07,000
and

520
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:15,280
the NPDS any outside agency approval
that might be required for the project.

521
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:20,480
Um
>> township approval, the need for us to

522
00:41:18,319 --> 00:41:24,400
get the zoning, all of those types of
things. That way you guys are also

523
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:29,200
protected. If we didn't get one of those
things, we don't get that condition and

524
00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:32,800
further disapp. So, and the main reason
why we're really, you know,

525
00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:37,680
consolidating it here in particular is
when you look at where the line is, as

526
00:41:35,359 --> 00:41:40,880
we've discussed that the kind of the new
buildings, the big buildings that are

527
00:41:39,119 --> 00:41:45,280
happening. This really is the layout
that we're having here. It's not

528
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:49,520
modifying, but that's up in the
township. So what's happening in the

529
00:41:47,359 --> 00:41:54,800
burrow itself is really just about
parking utility connections and an

530
00:41:53,040 --> 00:41:59,119
existing building that's already there
that's going to remain there and inside

531
00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:03,280
happen but that's not kind of a land
development issue. So have a question on

532
00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:07,280
the existing building because one of the
things the burrow liked about this plan

533
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:12,000
was the reuse of the theological
seminary building for something

534
00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:17,440
different. Um and it looks like it's
going to be in phase three. So I Bill

535
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:21,760
probably can speak to this better than I
can and I don't want to fully put my

536
00:42:19,839 --> 00:42:26,560
sense in don't worry but I before I went
to law school I did design build and I

537
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:32,079
did this kind of work on the other side
the which is really sad to me because I

538
00:42:28,720 --> 00:42:37,119
love the reuse of buildings the it's
actually infinitely more expensive and

539
00:42:34,880 --> 00:42:42,240
so for funding purposes and getting that
kind of low housing funding in for phase

540
00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:47,200
one it's for that first bill thing so
it's kind of to get the project started

541
00:42:44,720 --> 00:42:51,359
and up and running, but it certainly is
in kind of there's, you know, no plans

542
00:42:49,119 --> 00:42:56,480
to demolish and the goal really here is
to kind of revitalize that building and

543
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:59,440
make it functional and [clears throat]
and

544
00:42:59,040 --> 00:43:04,880
the
>> So, do you have any plans to maintain

545
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:09,040
it? Because it's been years now. Do you
have plans to maintain it if it's going

546
00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:14,720
to take years to get it done?
>> From an exterior perspective, we will we

547
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:19,440
will be required to. Yes. Okay.
>> Can I make a couple comments?

548
00:43:18,079 --> 00:43:21,119
» We have to say your name so we get it
right the minutes.

549
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:24,560
» What's that?
>> You have to say your name

550
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:28,240
» so that we get it right. And we are
actually televising. So if you want to

551
00:43:26,079 --> 00:43:31,800
go up to that might even be better.
>> Okay. Thanks.

552
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:38,120
» How tall are you? [laughter]

553
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:48,880
» My name is Bill. Bill Brown. Um, and I
am really excited about our our project.

554
00:43:47,119 --> 00:43:54,720
We've been working on this for several
years. Uh, what I'm happy to say is that

555
00:43:51,680 --> 00:44:00,000
we have uh the state has funded us. So,
we've been awarded the funding for this

556
00:43:57,520 --> 00:44:04,800
phase one project. There is a
possibility in the future that we might

557
00:44:01,760 --> 00:44:10,079
be able to merge two and three together.
That's a possibility. We don't know that

558
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:16,000
for a fact yet, but that might be a
possibility.

559
00:44:11,599 --> 00:44:20,480
Um, unfortunately, it takes
this is probably four years of trying to

560
00:44:17,839 --> 00:44:26,160
get phase one funded, but we got it
funded. Once we get it up,

561
00:44:23,599 --> 00:44:33,680
it'll be occupied pretty quickly because
55 plus affordable housing for seniors

562
00:44:29,839 --> 00:44:38,319
is a big need in the area all over. Uh,
but we're excited about it. It's going

563
00:44:35,599 --> 00:44:43,920
to move. U people are calling me now
wanting to know when they can uh apply

564
00:44:41,119 --> 00:44:49,119
for admission which is very interesting.
I like that. Uh but we're excited about

565
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:54,480
the project. It's awesome. Uh I will
also comment that uh we're almost ready

566
00:44:52,720 --> 00:45:00,720
probably within two months of fully
remediating the uh Misio Seminary

567
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:07,920
building.
uh that needs remediation and we're

568
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:12,160
about ready to to start that. Um they'll
have no effect on the new construction

569
00:45:10,240 --> 00:45:16,800
at all.
Any questions anybody might have for me?

570
00:45:15,359 --> 00:45:21,040
» I have a question about the phase
timing. So I know that was something we

571
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:26,240
were going to get to. So what's the
what's the timing plan for phase one,

572
00:45:23,119 --> 00:45:31,680
two, and three? And uh what does that
future outlook look like?

573
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:36,880
So as soon as phase one is completed, uh
we can apply for phase two,

574
00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:42,319
possibly two and three at the same time.
Don't know that, but we'll take us a

575
00:45:39,359 --> 00:45:47,200
year after the building is complete to
apply. Uh they won't accept an

576
00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:49,520
application if the building is not
complete.

577
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:52,800
» It just won't
>> Can you can you kind of walk through

578
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:57,680
timing? Okay, we're going to start
approximately here and then phase two

579
00:45:55,200 --> 00:46:05,520
will begin here and phase three. Sure.
So it should take us uh

580
00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:11,359
12 at a minimum 13 probably maximum time
frame and construction of phase one. Uh

581
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:17,040
that's what our time frame has been.
Harkens will be the builder. Um they're

582
00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:24,000
an awesome building company and they
they can build that. Um and then we

583
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:27,200
don't have to wait 12 months once the
building is complete. Then we got to

584
00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:33,920
apply. But you can only apply once a
year. Uh this is a 9% tax credit

585
00:46:31,280 --> 00:46:38,000
application, but it the application is
due and they change it almost every

586
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:42,560
year. It could be due in February, it
could be March, it could be April. Uh so

587
00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:48,480
we're all worthy planning for
applications that we'll be submitting uh

588
00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:52,720
for early next year. Uh but that's
pretty much the time limit and how how

589
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:57,599
that stuff works. But it's generally 12
months. uh you got to be complete and

590
00:46:55,839 --> 00:47:01,200
then the next funding round that's when
you can apply but they only do it once a

591
00:47:00,079 --> 00:47:06,079
year.
>> So So I apologize I'm probably missing

592
00:47:03,760 --> 00:47:11,240
something. So So when do you estimate
the start date will be based on your

593
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:11,240
current plans

594
00:47:11,839 --> 00:47:15,359
» and I'm not talking about the
remediation right that's happening but

595
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:21,680
we're actually talking about the
construction. So shovels in the ground.

596
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:26,400
» Okay. As soon as we get all the uh um
authorization from township and abro

597
00:47:25,119 --> 00:47:31,359
um
>> we can start construction.

598
00:47:29,440 --> 00:47:34,359
» Okay.
>> Okay.

599
00:47:41,119 --> 00:47:45,440
» October it took him four years to get
fun.

600
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:48,560
» No, I got it.
>> Yeah.

601
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:50,400
» I said could be 10 years. It could be.
>> Okay.

602
00:47:49,040 --> 00:47:53,520
» I asked that in the planning commission
was 10 years.

603
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:57,359
» Okay. Yeah. I was just what I So, what I
was looking for was I understand it may

604
00:47:54,800 --> 00:48:02,319
not be in stone, but based on where
we're at today, what do we think?

605
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:04,880
» Didn't you did you say October?
Commission. I'd love to have a

606
00:48:03,359 --> 00:48:08,319
groundbreaking in October. That would be
my goal. Whether you get there, that

607
00:48:06,720 --> 00:48:10,880
depends on the approvals, but that was
your goal. Groundbreaking.

608
00:48:09,760 --> 00:48:12,400
» That was the goal.
>> Yeah.

609
00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:16,480
» Okay. Next summer.
>> May not have until December. May not

610
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:23,240
have until January or February. Just
depending on the timing of

611
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:23,240
» October 27th.

612
00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:27,200
» Yeah.
>> Okay.

613
00:48:25,599 --> 00:48:31,680
» Yeah.
>> Okay. Okay.

614
00:48:30,240 --> 00:48:36,079
» A lot of hoops.
>> Yeah. No, I get it. I get it.

615
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:40,480
» It's the fun. That's
>> so

616
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:45,040
probably told you this, but I'm
reminding our council that we can't

617
00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:51,119
actually grant any kind of land
development approval until you have your

618
00:48:47,040 --> 00:48:54,720
zoning document in place. Okay.
>> Did you hear that? We can't actually

619
00:48:52,880 --> 00:48:59,520
grant any kind of land development
approval until they have the zoning in

620
00:48:57,119 --> 00:49:03,599
place extended.
>> Yeah. So, I think what I our goal here

621
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:08,640
was to kind of provide a presentation.
we anticipated or were optimistic that

622
00:49:06,559 --> 00:49:13,359
if there weren't
major concerns that we were unaware of

623
00:49:10,960 --> 00:49:18,319
Chad or anyone else on you know the
board that we would be able to at least

624
00:49:15,359 --> 00:49:24,000
try to tee this up in a way that we
would be able to come back in October

625
00:49:21,599 --> 00:49:27,119
we get the zone reinstated so that you
guys could actually formally vote on

626
00:49:25,839 --> 00:49:30,079
this.
>> Yeah, there's a number of things that I

627
00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:35,040
would like to work offline with the
engineer. One thing in I'll say fairness

628
00:49:33,280 --> 00:49:38,480
to them is that they should hear your
input on the waiverss. Not necessarily

629
00:49:37,119 --> 00:49:42,160
that you have to vote on them, but at
least give them a warm and fuzzy when

630
00:49:40,319 --> 00:49:46,160
they walk out of the room because, for
example, if you don't allow that parking

631
00:49:43,839 --> 00:49:50,319
lot to be four feet off the property
line, that's a pretty significant

632
00:49:48,079 --> 00:49:53,200
redesign of the entire project.
>> So, they're going to need answers on

633
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:55,680
some of these.
>> Okay.

634
00:49:54,880 --> 00:49:57,359
» Okay.
>> Yeah.

635
00:49:56,720 --> 00:50:00,480
» Okay.
>> Yeah. No. So I I still have more

636
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:03,839
questions on waiverss if we can keep
going. So and and I apologize everyone

637
00:50:02,319 --> 00:50:07,040
has council and who's listened because
I'm annoying with questions. So you guys

638
00:50:05,839 --> 00:50:12,400
haven't dealt with me yet. So I'll
apologize to you up front. So um so that

639
00:50:10,240 --> 00:50:17,359
you also had a waiver on the survey, not
conducting a survey.

640
00:50:14,720 --> 00:50:21,040
What's the issue with not conducting a
survey? What's the risk if you don't do

641
00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:22,800
that?
So,

642
00:50:21,440 --> 00:50:26,800
» and when I say risk, sorry, when I say
risk, is there going to be a risk to the

643
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:31,839
bureau, to the residents if that survey
is not done because something wasn't

644
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:35,599
detected
with that? So, this is a partial waiver.

645
00:50:33,760 --> 00:50:41,200
It's not a complete waiver. So we would
be providing all of the information that

646
00:50:37,680 --> 00:50:48,800
be necessary and for an evaluation of
the site changes but this is regularly

647
00:50:45,599 --> 00:50:53,200
asked for um and I don't think I've ever
had a project where it wasn't asked for

648
00:50:50,960 --> 00:50:59,440
because there are private properties and
we you know will not get rights to go on

649
00:50:56,800 --> 00:51:04,880
and basically to inspect underground
what it has no impact on our property

650
00:51:02,400 --> 00:51:09,680
that exists on burning property. So,
this allows us to kind of provide you

651
00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:13,680
with an aerial a top down kind of view
of everything that's going on around the

652
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:19,200
property and we are agreeing to provide
you with any information that would have

653
00:51:15,680 --> 00:51:24,240
any impact on this development
going off the property within that area.

654
00:51:21,920 --> 00:51:27,440
So, it's really just a partial leap or
>> it's areas that you can't get access to

655
00:51:26,160 --> 00:51:29,280
underground for the neighborhood. Okay,
that's I wasn't sure. I didn't

656
00:51:28,559 --> 00:51:34,000
understood that. So,
>> so I'll agree with with what what she

657
00:51:31,440 --> 00:51:39,200
said. Um, it it's
It's a very common waiver to request.

658
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:45,200
It's I'll say standard DS and it's
standard to to grant that partial

659
00:51:41,280 --> 00:51:51,040
waiver. An aerial image that's
of you know legitimate clarity. It

660
00:51:48,240 --> 00:51:55,920
should be provided. Um their waiver
request is to omit irrelevant

661
00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:58,880
information. If you're comfortable with
me making the decision on what's

662
00:51:57,359 --> 00:52:03,280
relevant and what's not, I think that's
probably the way to go. There are a few

663
00:52:01,200 --> 00:52:07,200
items that I brought up in my letter.
Uh, for example, there's a wood curb, I

664
00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:11,599
think you call it, right off of your
your steep slopes that you're proposing.

665
00:52:09,839 --> 00:52:15,200
Um, which I would want to make sure can
stay structurally sound if they're

666
00:52:13,520 --> 00:52:21,440
cutting three toes at the bottom of that
that curb. Um, I know from imagery and

667
00:52:19,119 --> 00:52:25,839
being out there that I don't know, is
there access to the the school property?

668
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:29,920
It looks like there's some equipment or
sheds or something that they may use

669
00:52:27,440 --> 00:52:33,440
your property to gain access.
>> There's presently no fiscal barrier uh

670
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:36,480
property line,
>> right? And it looks like the

671
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:40,319
just continues and there's sheds or
something there.

672
00:52:37,359 --> 00:52:46,240
» So, yeah, I I there's an existing shed
right here uh that we don't anticipate

673
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:50,960
using in the future uh part of our
demolition. Um

674
00:52:49,359 --> 00:52:57,280
I'm sorry, what what is the question?
Even beyond that, I I don't know if they

675
00:52:53,359 --> 00:53:00,559
they store equipment there or or or what
it is, but it almost looks to me like

676
00:52:58,720 --> 00:53:04,079
there's no defined boundary between the
school property and this property and

677
00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:07,599
the parking lot just kind of continues
and they maybe they use it. So, I don't

678
00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:11,520
know if they have access rights, if
there's some sort of agreements or you

679
00:53:10,079 --> 00:53:15,359
can just put up a fence there and stop
them from accessing it.

680
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:19,839
» To our knowledge, there is no usement
right for the access of the existing

681
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:25,920
middle school. Um, as Cathedral point,
we are proposing to buffer our property

682
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:31,920
from the school um at the property line
via vegetative trees.

683
00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:32,960
» I would suggest they be notified and
then just

684
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:38,079
» Yeah. So,
>> be aware that they may be cut off from

685
00:53:35,040 --> 00:53:40,000
access if they are in fact using it. Um,
>> the school districts.

686
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:43,200
» Yeah.
>> Or or maybe it's the private property. I

687
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:48,240
don't know. But there's something there
that appear. Is that something you want

688
00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:52,559
to handle first or do we you want us to
write them?

689
00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:55,760
» Well, so I think it depends on what the
property is. Obviously,

690
00:53:54,000 --> 00:54:01,599
» it's a public school. The public school
that's right there. Um I mean we are

691
00:53:59,040 --> 00:54:05,440
unaware baseball,
>> right? It's not a elementary uses that.

692
00:54:03,760 --> 00:54:09,920
It's baseball fields that are owned by
North Penn School District, but um the

693
00:54:08,240 --> 00:54:13,839
little league uses that. So like they
use it and they do park in the biblical

694
00:54:11,599 --> 00:54:17,680
seminary parking lot to access the lower
fields. So I would probably say you

695
00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:20,800
would send to the school district
because that's who they rent the fields

696
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:24,559
from, but also send a courtesy letter to
the little lake like, hey, this is going

697
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:27,760
to happen and this is our pro, but it's
not going to be public parking anymore.

698
00:54:26,000 --> 00:54:31,200
They probably honestly park on biblical
seminary property when they used to

699
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:35,440
below.
>> Yeah, they

700
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:40,000
Yeah, there's no rights. We I mean I
think we're willing to notify them of

701
00:54:37,040 --> 00:54:42,400
that, but um in terms of like asking for
permission to kind of buffer our

702
00:54:41,839 --> 00:54:46,240
property.
>> No, I'm just using this as an example of

703
00:54:44,240 --> 00:54:49,680
why we would want some additional
information surveyed or or at least

704
00:54:48,000 --> 00:54:54,680
provided so we can understand what the
impacts are on the the res or the

705
00:54:51,359 --> 00:54:54,680
neighboring properties.

706
00:54:57,040 --> 00:55:05,359
» So one last question and I I promise I
will be quiet. Um,

707
00:55:03,359 --> 00:55:10,880
sh I don't know that.
>> No. Um, so there was a question about

708
00:55:08,160 --> 00:55:14,880
the the parking waiver, right? And that
I think that had to do with an island

709
00:55:12,400 --> 00:55:18,559
with so many spaces. Is that correct?
>> Okay.

710
00:55:15,839 --> 00:55:22,000
» Um, so it kind of brings up a question
about parking and how do we determine

711
00:55:20,240 --> 00:55:26,160
the amount of parking spaces that were
there? Because as everyone knows, we

712
00:55:24,160 --> 00:55:30,160
have overflow parking issues here in the
burrow in general. And so I'm curious

713
00:55:28,480 --> 00:55:33,920
how we determine the number of parking
spaces and does that take into

714
00:55:32,240 --> 00:55:39,440
consideration of potential overflow
issues that we've seen other places.

715
00:55:36,800 --> 00:55:44,240
» So I'll I'll answer that. The number of
parking spaces is calculated in the

716
00:55:41,839 --> 00:55:48,559
zoning ordinance. So they are actually
providing more spaces than are required

717
00:55:46,240 --> 00:55:53,359
by a significant amount. Zoning
ordinance actually only requires one

718
00:55:50,559 --> 00:55:56,960
space per unit because this is a an
elderly community. Mhm.

719
00:55:54,799 --> 00:56:01,359
» Uh for any other community it would be
two spaces per unit. I believe Ho

720
00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:05,119
Township requires two spaces per unit.
Um

721
00:56:02,880 --> 00:56:07,520
114 units.
>> That is correct.

722
00:56:05,839 --> 00:56:11,040
» And how many spaces?
>> 127.

723
00:56:08,559 --> 00:56:17,599
» 127. So the common thought is that
there's at max one car per unit.

724
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:20,559
» Um so you should at least consider that
when you think about this waiver request

725
00:56:19,119 --> 00:56:24,960
that they are providing more than the
burrow requires. I certainly understand

726
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:29,040
the sensitivity with parking in the
burrow. Um, but to answer your question,

727
00:56:27,680 --> 00:56:32,559
it is a requirement of the zoning
ordinance that defines how many spaces

728
00:56:30,640 --> 00:56:36,720
are required.
>> And uh, as an as an add-on to that

729
00:56:34,720 --> 00:56:41,599
point, the reason our park configuration
is as such is we are uh, compliant with

730
00:56:39,280 --> 00:56:49,520
the zoning order with township that
requires us to park 127 spaces on site.

731
00:56:47,040 --> 00:56:53,520
So, we have uh relief from the township
of Arizona ordinance to park less than

732
00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:57,280
what their required number is. [snorts]
>> Okay. Because that because correct me if

733
00:56:56,000 --> 00:57:02,960
I'm wrong, right? You said there's 114
units, 127 spaces. So, we're only

734
00:56:59,359 --> 00:57:06,960
providing 13 more spaces
than what the requirement than what

735
00:57:04,720 --> 00:57:09,839
you're required to in the burrow.
>> Yes.

736
00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:14,799
» Okay. So, and the and the township's
giving you a waiver that says you don't

737
00:57:11,359 --> 00:57:18,720
have to have two spaces per unit. They
granted a variance for that.

738
00:57:16,400 --> 00:57:22,240
» A variance, right? So if if you were
following the township ordinance, you'd

739
00:57:20,000 --> 00:57:23,599
have to have 228 spaces.
>> Yes.

740
00:57:22,640 --> 00:57:28,319
» Approximately. Okay.
>> Without going by. Yes.

741
00:57:25,520 --> 00:57:34,000
» Okay. So,
so for me, that's a potential problem.

742
00:57:32,319 --> 00:57:40,400
my understanding we're granting 13 more
spaces, but if we're talking about 114

743
00:57:37,119 --> 00:57:45,119
units, if you needed half of that as
additional spaces, you've just crowded

744
00:57:43,040 --> 00:57:50,400
up the whole area around the entire
property. So, to me, that's that would

745
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:55,520
be a problem, right?
From a from a from a parking standpoint.

746
00:57:53,839 --> 00:57:59,200
Does that does my statement make sense?
You kind of

747
00:57:56,240 --> 00:58:04,640
» No, I I am I am confused. So, so if
there's 100, so what we've seen in

748
00:58:01,040 --> 00:58:09,359
similar um building in the in our
community here is we've seen much more

749
00:58:07,040 --> 00:58:13,040
than two spaces needed per unit. Now, I
understand that this is a 55 and older

750
00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:18,000
community and they may have less
vehicles, right? But we've seen here

751
00:58:16,319 --> 00:58:25,280
where you almost need two and a half to
three spaces per location here. So

752
00:58:22,240 --> 00:58:28,319
saying that we're only going to have one
to me says we're going to have a parking

753
00:58:27,040 --> 00:58:33,839
problem that we're all going to have to
deal with. So that's that's my concern.

754
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:37,119
» So So we are again we are in significant
access

755
00:58:35,359 --> 00:58:43,040
parking is required and the waiver that
we're asking for here is to allow for a

756
00:58:40,079 --> 00:58:48,079
few extra spaces. So if you didn't grant
the waiver, we would end up with fewer

757
00:58:45,440 --> 00:58:52,640
spaces on the property because what our
waiver request has to do with the

758
00:58:49,839 --> 00:58:59,040
subcate island, which would remove one
of the parking spaces and convert it to

759
00:58:56,000 --> 00:59:05,839
a planted island. So here we're
optimistic that you would be supportive

760
00:59:02,079 --> 00:59:11,200
of us having a couple extra spaces on
the site for the overflow even though it

761
00:59:08,640 --> 00:59:16,799
is in excess of the burough requirement.
versus if you don't grant that waiver,

762
00:59:14,079 --> 00:59:20,559
you're still compliant, you end up with
less parking on site. And I would also I

763
00:59:19,359 --> 00:59:26,000
do understand what you're saying about
concerns about overflow particularly in

764
00:59:23,440 --> 00:59:32,160
apartment buildings.
We we've had traffic evaluations and

765
00:59:28,880 --> 00:59:37,280
kind of there's other senior the senior
apartment building that are similar to

766
00:59:33,680 --> 00:59:43,040
this and are significantly underfoot
that's quite different from an apartment

767
00:59:40,079 --> 00:59:50,559
building that is housing younger
workforce members as opposed to people

768
00:59:46,640 --> 00:59:58,559
who are older no longer drive at all. Um
it is actually the case that there is

769
00:59:53,280 --> 01:00:03,920
often only one car if that per kind of
apartment building. So it was very much

770
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:08,400
so evaluated and presented to the
township because again the township had

771
01:00:05,520 --> 01:00:13,040
a higher requirement for parking and so
they were comfortable that the parking

772
01:00:11,119 --> 01:00:17,920
that we're providing is adequate for
this particular type of use and waver

773
01:00:15,599 --> 01:00:21,680
here against so that we we don't lose a
couple spaces in the boat.

774
01:00:20,000 --> 01:00:24,480
» No, I I and I get it. I'm not I don't
necessarily have issue with the waiver

775
01:00:23,119 --> 01:00:28,720
for the island. I'm [clears throat] just
highlighting that the parking question

776
01:00:26,880 --> 01:00:32,319
brings up a bigger parking concern
because the the parking too, correct me

777
01:00:30,319 --> 01:00:35,599
if I'm wrong, you're going to have staff
there as well too. So staff is going to

778
01:00:34,160 --> 01:00:43,200
take up some of the parking as well,
right?

779
01:00:38,240 --> 01:00:49,520
» Staff will uh will park, but if you took
a ride two miles from here of the last

780
01:00:45,040 --> 01:00:57,520
three buildings I put up, uh there's uh
180 units. Uh, I think the partner

781
01:00:53,599 --> 01:01:01,040
places are are 200 that are there. Most
people don't even have a car because

782
01:00:59,520 --> 01:01:07,280
they're in their 80s and they can't
drive anymore. Um, it's I'm telling you,

783
01:01:04,720 --> 01:01:12,000
it's not going to be an issue uh about
parking. It's just and everybody thinks

784
01:01:10,559 --> 01:01:19,839
the opposite way that there's not
enough, but there's always so much extra

785
01:01:15,119 --> 01:01:23,520
space always. uh a lot of people don't
have cars.

786
01:01:21,040 --> 01:01:27,680
» Is it is it too much to ask for you guys
to do an analysis to highlight that?

787
01:01:25,760 --> 01:01:32,799
Because invariably what's going to
happen is is that residents are going to

788
01:01:30,319 --> 01:01:37,280
come to us and say, "Hey, we have a
problem here." And if we approve

789
01:01:34,160 --> 01:01:42,799
something and I and I understand that
we're for the burrow, we're within the

790
01:01:40,559 --> 01:01:45,760
numbers that that you know, so there's
not a waiver for the number of parking

791
01:01:44,079 --> 01:01:49,520
spaces, but invariably it's going to be
a problem for the community and if we

792
01:01:48,000 --> 01:01:53,359
approve something and then there's a
problem later on, we're all stuck with

793
01:01:51,119 --> 01:01:57,440
it. So, so that's why I'm saying would
it be too much to ask to have that

794
01:01:55,839 --> 01:02:01,599
calculation done? So, for example, if
you've done these communities before,

795
01:01:59,359 --> 01:02:06,319
you know, approximately, hey, if I have
a 100 units only 50, I'm only going to

796
01:02:04,160 --> 01:02:10,160
need 50 spaces because this is what
history tells me. If you can come up

797
01:02:07,760 --> 01:02:14,160
with an analysis like that, that'll help
us be able to talk to the community

798
01:02:11,520 --> 01:02:18,160
about it when the question arises.
>> Remember, this is affordable housing.

799
01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:23,520
It's not market rate. That's totally
different in the calculation.

800
01:02:21,200 --> 01:02:26,960
because a lot of people can't afford to
have a car because it's affordable

801
01:02:26,079 --> 01:02:30,160
housing.
>> Right. But I'm saying but you based on

802
01:02:28,799 --> 01:02:35,520
your experience, you have some
estimations on that. Can you provide

803
01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:39,000
estimations for what it would be based
on your experience?

804
01:02:40,319 --> 01:02:44,880
» We're going to submit our traffic impact
study. It made its way to the township

805
01:02:43,200 --> 01:02:49,280
but did not get submitted as part of the
application here to the but we do have

806
01:02:47,359 --> 01:02:51,599
traffic
one

807
01:02:49,920 --> 01:02:55,440
» that might be the PCSM report.
>> Okay.

808
01:02:52,079 --> 01:02:56,799
» It was we received a review from the the
traffic engineer.

809
01:02:56,480 --> 01:02:59,520
» Okay.
>> Yeah.

810
01:02:57,280 --> 01:03:03,680
» I can't recall. I I apologize. The
traffic impact study that was completed

811
01:03:01,599 --> 01:03:06,880
was in close proximity to the our
submission date. So I don't know if it

812
01:03:04,880 --> 01:03:11,119
made its way into our submission.
>> We have a review letter from

813
01:03:09,839 --> 01:03:14,480
» somebody on traffic.
>> Yeah. The traffic engineer for the

814
01:03:12,799 --> 01:03:18,559
township is also our traffic engineer.
So if you like one line one joint and I

815
01:03:16,960 --> 01:03:21,680
believe so he would have got it you
submitted for the township. He would

816
01:03:19,599 --> 01:03:24,319
have got it on
>> I do know that he has it.

817
01:03:23,200 --> 01:03:29,280
» Yes.
>> Well in all fairness it's dated August

818
01:03:26,960 --> 01:03:34,240
18th. So it hasn't been out there a
while.

819
01:03:31,760 --> 01:03:37,839
» We haven't but I thought I read that it
said that uh was going to produce that

820
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:40,799
much traffic. But
>> no but it's not going to tell us how

821
01:03:39,200 --> 01:03:45,680
many spaces are needed. It's going to
say how many vehicles per hour you

822
01:03:43,200 --> 01:03:49,119
expect to have flow, but it's not going
to tell you how many parking spaces you

823
01:03:47,200 --> 01:03:51,680
think are needed based on the needs of
the community who are living there.

824
01:03:50,799 --> 01:03:56,799
Right?
>> So, so it may be an unusual request, but

825
01:03:55,200 --> 01:04:01,119
the reason I'm asking for, like I said,
we've had numerous problems in the

826
01:03:58,400 --> 01:04:06,559
burrow in the past. And so if we can
show that, hey, the builder's done an

827
01:04:04,240 --> 01:04:11,200
analysis that thinks that we're only
going to need x number of spaces, then

828
01:04:08,960 --> 01:04:14,559
that helps us sell it to the community
to say, hey, we don't think there's

829
01:04:13,119 --> 01:04:18,400
going to be a problem. Or if your
numbers show that there's a problem,

830
01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:20,960
then maybe we can get that red addressed
ahead of time.

831
01:04:19,440 --> 01:04:25,280
» Right. Well, the other thing I was
thinking is whatever evidence you showed

832
01:04:22,559 --> 01:04:30,960
to the township zoning hearing board
might be helpful here. You said that the

833
01:04:27,520 --> 01:04:35,839
township gave you a waiver or
I wasn't you were housing council at the

834
01:04:33,280 --> 01:04:42,079
time so but I do know that
>> original relief uh was provided by the

835
01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:46,240
township neither TNM or got well
involved project at that time.

836
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:50,480
» Okay. But do you have whatever evidence
was used or no? I I'm sure if I don't

837
01:04:49,039 --> 01:04:55,839
have
>> right I mean to his point if he would

838
01:04:52,160 --> 01:05:02,319
like to show the the resident that we
understand their concerns and here's

839
01:04:58,240 --> 01:05:06,480
what the developer says about
>> so I do think the traffic impact site

840
01:05:04,480 --> 01:05:09,920
that we prepared for this application
was submitted

841
01:05:07,760 --> 01:05:14,400
» would satisfy that we have not had a
chance to fully address just the traffic

842
01:05:11,680 --> 01:05:19,039
engineer
>> Jason did you hear that they do think

843
01:05:16,240 --> 01:05:24,000
their traffic study might help us
understand that, but it's focused on

844
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:25,039
traffic in and out as you said, non-p
parking,

845
01:05:24,559 --> 01:05:28,880
» right,
>> spaces. So, we need a little more

846
01:05:26,640 --> 01:05:33,119
information on your parking
>> and uh burough council really should

847
01:05:30,960 --> 01:05:38,799
consider if this is a real concern of
yours what you want to do with North

848
01:05:35,280 --> 01:05:42,960
Main Street. The ordinance requires two
12oot travel lanes and and 8 foot for

849
01:05:41,119 --> 01:05:46,480
parallel parking. So, you're going to
want to consider if you want to allow or

850
01:05:44,640 --> 01:05:49,760
prohibit parking on the street.
>> Mhm. Right. Because again, that's

851
01:05:48,079 --> 01:05:54,240
something we'd have to consider if we
don't have enough spaces. So, Yep.

852
01:05:52,880 --> 01:05:57,920
» which is now a bigger deal, right?
Because now we're dealing with a pendot

853
01:05:57,039 --> 01:06:01,680
road and
>> Well, it's not pendot in the burrow.

854
01:05:59,920 --> 01:06:06,319
» Well, yeah, that's true. I'm sorry.
>> Um and and with that in mind, consider

855
01:06:04,319 --> 01:06:09,039
public transportation as well, whether a
bus stop or something along those lines

856
01:06:08,079 --> 01:06:12,440
would make sense.
>> Yeah. Yeah.

857
01:06:21,599 --> 01:06:27,839
I did not read the traffic study and
maybe Chad didn't either. I have no idea

858
01:06:26,000 --> 01:06:32,400
whether it says anything about parking
on Maine or not. We'd have to have an

859
01:06:30,319 --> 01:06:35,359
expansion of Main Street to do that,
right?

860
01:06:33,280 --> 01:06:39,599
» It's actually very close. I think
they're within two and a half inches of

861
01:06:38,240 --> 01:06:42,400
what's within.
>> Doesn't strike me that as that wide.

862
01:06:41,359 --> 01:06:46,640
» No, it doesn't. Um,
>> no. It'll just create other problems.

863
01:06:44,559 --> 01:06:51,200
» I believe when Mr. Brown came and you
presented a sketch plan with Mr. Clement

864
01:06:49,119 --> 01:06:54,319
like two years ago, if not more than
that, the same question was brought up

865
01:06:52,720 --> 01:06:58,880
about parking and you were talking about
maybe a space you did in Amler and you

866
01:06:56,480 --> 01:07:02,640
did talk about that you did have some
type of analysis done. I remember the

867
01:07:00,799 --> 01:07:05,839
conversation. So, I would be happy to go
back and see if something was provided

868
01:07:04,079 --> 01:07:08,240
at that time. I remember the
conversation coming up because it was a

869
01:07:07,200 --> 01:07:11,680
concern. It might have been your
concern, but I know it was a concern of

870
01:07:09,599 --> 01:07:15,280
rural council about parking. And I
remember Mr. Clement was your council.

871
01:07:13,520 --> 01:07:20,160
It was just a sketch plan. There were
residents here and that was a concern.

872
01:07:17,680 --> 01:07:25,280
And I remember you talking about studies
being done that it's really to have a

873
01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:28,400
bar if a Gar for age age restricted
income restricted housing. So I do know

874
01:07:27,200 --> 01:07:33,039
there has to be something out there
somewhere that could help Burough

875
01:07:30,480 --> 01:07:35,839
Council see something that backs what
your theory is about the parking.

876
01:07:35,039 --> 01:07:39,680
Remember the conversation,
>> right? Is that so that B council can

877
01:07:37,920 --> 01:07:43,280
answer questions that are raised by
their neighbors?

878
01:07:42,079 --> 01:07:46,480
» I check on that.
>> Yeah, I remember the conversation. I

879
01:07:44,880 --> 01:07:50,400
don't know. I remember something.
>> Okay. So, we we should go ahead and

880
01:07:48,799 --> 01:07:55,599
continue with the waiver part because
that's what we what we're talking about

881
01:07:52,880 --> 01:07:58,079
here because that's really not a part of
that.

882
01:07:56,319 --> 01:08:03,839
» Right. the waiver requests that were
were here before you tonight would allow

883
01:08:00,640 --> 01:08:06,160
for more parking on site and
>> eliminate the need or the requirement to

884
01:08:05,599 --> 01:08:07,839
install
>> because the elimination of the aisle.

885
01:08:07,520 --> 01:08:12,240
» Yes.
>> Yes, I did. Yeah.

886
01:08:09,280 --> 01:08:15,400
» So there any other questions from us on
the waiverss?

887
01:08:16,480 --> 01:08:21,600
» There was the fourth waiver just to
clarify regarding the parking at the

888
01:08:20,719 --> 01:08:24,239
» in the fence.
>> Yeah. Did you guys have any questions

889
01:08:23,199 --> 01:08:27,520
related to that?
>> No, we just went through that before.

890
01:08:25,839 --> 01:08:29,920
So, you know, I think the bigger
question will come up from the the

891
01:08:28,880 --> 01:08:33,759
neighbors,
>> right?

892
01:08:31,920 --> 01:08:35,600
» It's like 4 feet or so from the property
line

893
01:08:34,719 --> 01:08:38,560
» about that. Yes.
>> Yeah. Katie, can you pull up the

894
01:08:37,120 --> 01:08:42,799
existing plan?
>> It's one of the first.

895
01:08:39,839 --> 01:08:46,640
» Oh, it's the second or the third sheet.
>> Sorry guys.

896
01:08:44,159 --> 01:08:49,199
» Or the demo plan.
>> Is it number three?

897
01:08:48,080 --> 01:08:52,080
» Uh right there. Yes.
>> Go to the next one.

898
01:08:50,560 --> 01:08:57,279
» This one.
>> Show. Yeah. Go to the previous one. So,

899
01:08:55,759 --> 01:09:04,799
can you point to where it is now?
>> So, the existing parking line, this is

900
01:09:02,319 --> 01:09:08,239
this line right here,
>> the top or the bottom?

901
01:09:06,159 --> 01:09:10,799
» Uh, the top of the two parallel lines
right there is the parking. The bottom

902
01:09:09,600 --> 01:09:13,679
line is the property line.
>> Okay.

903
01:09:11,600 --> 01:09:20,480
» So, we're we're maintaining the existing
distance uh of the the parking field

904
01:09:16,480 --> 01:09:23,440
today as part of the post initial.
>> Yeah. Yeah. No, like I said, I I don't

905
01:09:21,920 --> 01:09:26,799
necessarily have any issue with that. I
think uh like in the past, people have

906
01:09:25,359 --> 01:09:30,000
always made accommodations where needed.
So, I don't think that's that I I think

907
01:09:28,880 --> 01:09:35,279
you could work something out if there
are any questions that come up about the

908
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:38,400
fence or type of fence or do we want,
you know, trees instead of a fence. I

909
01:09:37,199 --> 01:09:42,319
mean, I think you guys would be willing
to accommodate any requests that may

910
01:09:40,799 --> 01:09:45,279
come up from the community. So,
>> yeah, trees won't work there, but

911
01:09:43,920 --> 01:09:47,359
» I know, but you know what I mean. That's
Yeah. Yeah. Willing to accommodate

912
01:09:46,560 --> 01:09:51,440
something. So,
>> so the B manager has a question which I

913
01:09:49,839 --> 01:09:56,000
think we should talk about here. Go
ahead. I'm sure the engineer has the

914
01:09:53,679 --> 01:09:59,920
same question. So my question is you're
um planning to go to the zoning hearing

915
01:09:57,760 --> 01:10:04,320
board and you're planning to just ask
for that zoning hearing order to be

916
01:10:02,159 --> 01:10:08,719
extended. Three minute exact same thing
with the same nine implications. The one

917
01:10:06,960 --> 01:10:14,159
imple I'm calling it invocation. I don't
know the ter. Thank you. Um the one

918
01:10:12,000 --> 01:10:19,280
condition is that you have to put a
storm water pipe all the way down Main

919
01:10:16,480 --> 01:10:23,920
Street to the post office. I was
surprised when you resubmitted your

920
01:10:20,719 --> 01:10:27,360
zoning not to admit that because while
talking to our burough engineer that's

921
01:10:25,840 --> 01:10:31,040
just not something that's realistic for
your property according to you you're

922
01:10:29,600 --> 01:10:35,760
going to put most of your storm water in
Hel Township. So my question is how is

923
01:10:33,760 --> 01:10:39,040
that going to be addressed if you go
back and you're just going to get a

924
01:10:36,880 --> 01:10:42,560
letter that says yeah sure we agree with
everything we gave you before you're

925
01:10:40,800 --> 01:10:46,320
then going to be having to put that pipe
down and that final wasn't addressed in

926
01:10:44,480 --> 01:10:51,840
any of the zoning application that you
submitted. I don't know if this is the

927
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:56,880
correct uh form for that, but that is uh
something that we would have omitted uh

928
01:10:54,880 --> 01:11:02,239
or requested to be straightened from the
zoning order if it were to be reinstated

929
01:10:59,520 --> 01:11:06,880
as discussed in our staff meetings that
and as mentioned here's not a practical

930
01:11:05,600 --> 01:11:08,560
implementation
>> correct

931
01:11:07,280 --> 01:11:13,760
» of that still modified.
>> Yes. Um, so

932
01:11:12,159 --> 01:11:18,000
as part of our zoning hearing, we would
discuss that not being part of

933
01:11:16,080 --> 01:11:21,760
» because your letter just seemed like you
were okay and you were going to submit

934
01:11:19,600 --> 01:11:25,440
the same. Yeah. You were going to submit
the same thing and ask for nine and all

935
01:11:24,000 --> 01:11:29,760
of those implications would just be
reinstated.

936
01:11:27,679 --> 01:11:34,000
So I think council just want like to
understand in the engineer like that,

937
01:11:31,600 --> 01:11:39,440
hey, it's not practical or practical.
You planning on doing that.

938
01:11:37,120 --> 01:11:44,640
So
without it getting legal without legal

939
01:11:42,744 --> 01:11:49,199
[laughter] I think the idea is that the
because of the storm water changes that

940
01:11:46,400 --> 01:11:54,320
that is not practical anymore. We did
would be requesting to strike that

941
01:11:51,040 --> 01:12:00,480
particular condition and I will legally
amend our application. We do have time

942
01:11:56,320 --> 01:12:04,560
to do so so that it can be
looking.

943
01:12:02,000 --> 01:12:09,440
Yes, we would have time to rob that
properly so that it wasn't a continued

944
01:12:06,880 --> 01:12:16,159
condition that there
was needed added on

945
01:12:13,280 --> 01:12:19,120
like when the application came in.
>> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was our

946
01:12:17,600 --> 01:12:22,640
understanding based on everything we've
heard that you're just looking for. All

947
01:12:20,560 --> 01:12:28,320
right, let's extend it the way it was.
And I think almost to your benefit, we

948
01:12:25,920 --> 01:12:30,880
flagged that as a problem for you.
>> Great.

949
01:12:28,560 --> 01:12:34,960
» And Chad, from a burrow engineer
perspective, you have no objections.

950
01:12:33,280 --> 01:12:37,600
» I have no objections, particularly
considering the fact that they're

951
01:12:36,080 --> 01:12:40,640
looking to push all their water in the
opposite direction.

952
01:12:38,560 --> 01:12:44,960
» Anyway, right.
Okay.

953
01:12:42,400 --> 01:12:49,159
» Yes.
>> Thanks, J. Any

954
01:12:52,800 --> 01:12:58,320
other questions,
comments, questions? Go ahead.

955
01:12:57,199 --> 01:13:04,040
» I'm sorry.
>> Go ahead.

956
01:13:00,640 --> 01:13:04,040
» That's our pres.

957
01:13:08,800 --> 01:13:14,360
» Yes.
>> I think it's actually

958
01:13:14,560 --> 01:13:18,320
» state your name. I'm much daily vice
president.

959
01:13:17,920 --> 01:13:21,120
» Thank you.
>> Um

960
01:13:20,000 --> 01:13:25,840
there's going to [clears throat] be at
the end 114 apartments somewhere around

961
01:13:24,239 --> 01:13:28,719
there. So that's the number I hear.
>> Yes.

962
01:13:26,400 --> 01:13:32,800
» Okay. And it's age qualified. Is there
going to be anything like um personal

963
01:13:30,960 --> 01:13:37,920
care or any kind of medical? No.
>> This is all just street apartments.

964
01:13:36,719 --> 01:13:42,480
» Thank you.
And we do have a letter from the

965
01:13:40,480 --> 01:13:47,679
township fire marshal which we're
complying with as it relates to fire

966
01:13:44,800 --> 01:13:53,840
lanes and and proper signage and of
course all of the necessary building

967
01:13:49,840 --> 01:13:59,600
codes for spring and fire protection.
>> Just concerned if there's any anything

968
01:13:55,679 --> 01:14:02,239
in there that we need to worry about.
>> Sounds good. Thank you.

969
01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:05,199
» Great question.
>> Let me ask another question here too.

970
01:14:03,679 --> 01:14:10,239
Katie, if you can go back to the site
right there. right there.

971
01:14:08,320 --> 01:14:14,239
So, you said you're going to will comply
with with the comments in my letter. One

972
01:14:11,760 --> 01:14:18,640
of my comments is providing a handicap
accessible path from building I think

973
01:14:16,080 --> 01:14:23,760
that's two across the parking lot to the
the sidewalk. Would you do that without

974
01:14:21,360 --> 01:14:29,679
removing parking spaces?
>> We would not um be within the parking

975
01:14:27,120 --> 01:14:35,040
field itself. we would not be able to uh
provide struct parking. Uh we would

976
01:14:33,199 --> 01:14:40,000
require the removable parking spaces
strike out crosswalk. What we would be

977
01:14:37,280 --> 01:14:44,159
envisioning is the crossing somewhere
where there is no parking uh to get from

978
01:14:42,400 --> 01:14:49,920
the left side of the site to the right
side of the site. This is not this is

979
01:14:46,320 --> 01:14:54,480
live. Um potentially something along the
rear parking field here, rear parking

980
01:14:52,159 --> 01:14:58,800
field here or north uh where there is
presently no parking spaces provided.

981
01:14:56,800 --> 01:15:02,800
Uh, go back to where you just were. So,
you just had your finger in that general

982
01:15:00,239 --> 01:15:06,159
area. I was thinking of no doubt to that
corner to that that sidewalk. I think

983
01:15:04,960 --> 01:15:10,480
you need to get people from that
building too to that side to get them

984
01:15:08,080 --> 01:15:12,719
down to Main Street to, you know, go the
rest of the way down. How are you going

985
01:15:11,440 --> 01:15:16,640
to do that without losing parking
spaces?

986
01:15:14,719 --> 01:15:18,719
» I'm missing a point. From this building
to Main Street

987
01:15:18,159 --> 01:15:22,320
» down here.
>> Yes. Correct.

988
01:15:19,520 --> 01:15:26,560
» This entire length of the development is
proposed to be sidewalked. Um, we would

989
01:15:25,040 --> 01:15:31,040
potentially be looking at adding
sidewalk in this island here, providing

990
01:15:28,560 --> 01:15:35,120
an ADA access point from this building
across the parking field or the drive

991
01:15:32,880 --> 01:15:39,199
aisles to this sidewalk network down to
Main Street.

992
01:15:37,440 --> 01:15:42,640
» I think geometrically that makes sense.
That means you're not going to put trees

993
01:15:40,480 --> 01:15:45,960
in that island, which would then require
another waiver.

994
01:15:46,239 --> 01:15:52,560
» Yeah, this domino is in the will
complies domino into problems. to your

995
01:15:50,960 --> 01:15:55,560
point right we do need to talk and
discuss

996
01:15:57,120 --> 01:16:03,679
I don't have an answer to you right now
but we'll we'll talk and figure it out

997
01:16:02,159 --> 01:16:08,960
another thing that came up at the
planning commission meeting was and and

998
01:16:06,000 --> 01:16:13,760
we didn't solve it but we talked about
some something outside for the people to

999
01:16:11,520 --> 01:16:15,600
go to you know like a gazebo or
something like that

1000
01:16:14,320 --> 01:16:19,360
» that was in the township
>> yeah where would you put put that in

1001
01:16:17,440 --> 01:16:22,159
there so that's something else that we
talked about that

1002
01:16:20,960 --> 01:16:25,679
» and and these certainly aren't deal
breakers. These are all things that we

1003
01:16:23,440 --> 01:16:29,600
need to consider and again a reason why
don't just grant approvals without going

1004
01:16:27,840 --> 01:16:33,199
through the details of of the the
comments.

1005
01:16:30,159 --> 01:16:38,320
» Yeah, transportation vehicles would come
inside the inside the development pickup

1006
01:16:36,320 --> 01:16:44,080
residence. That's how it works in all
the all the communities. They come they

1007
01:16:40,640 --> 01:16:50,880
drive in uh scheduled pickup or whatever
it is, whoever is providing the service

1008
01:16:46,719 --> 01:16:50,880
and pick up residents that way.

1009
01:16:51,199 --> 01:16:57,920
to to go back to the comment you made
about a common space. Uh between the

1010
01:16:56,480 --> 01:17:03,040
proposed building one and existing
seminaries, uh there is

1011
01:17:00,960 --> 01:17:06,880
area that were kind of designated, you
know, informally as a courtyard space

1012
01:17:04,719 --> 01:17:12,080
for the outdoor congregation of the
residents. Um, presently as part of the

1013
01:17:09,199 --> 01:17:17,440
application, there's no site furnishings
or benches proposed, but believe the

1014
01:17:15,440 --> 01:17:20,560
owner and applicant are open to
discussions about how that ultimately

1015
01:17:19,760 --> 01:17:24,560
looks.
>> That was kind of the uh the tenor of the

1016
01:17:23,120 --> 01:17:29,120
discussion the other night.
>> Yeah.

1017
01:17:26,000 --> 01:17:34,159
» So, okay.
>> Okay. Very good.

1018
01:17:31,040 --> 01:17:37,280
» One more question. Can you clarify
what's happening with that driveway in

1019
01:17:35,679 --> 01:17:40,320
between the residential driveway and
your property?

1020
01:17:38,480 --> 01:17:45,440
» We want to leave it untouched as much as
possible. Um, we are proposing to

1021
01:17:42,640 --> 01:17:50,239
physically separate it via a chain fence
or something barrier gate that would

1022
01:17:47,440 --> 01:17:53,840
only be open in an emergency. It would
be for the continued use and benefit of

1023
01:17:52,320 --> 01:17:57,880
the residents that don't have access to
West Street. Good.

1024
01:18:02,000 --> 01:18:08,520
Okay, that's all I have.
>> Okay. Sitting too close to him.

1025
01:18:08,880 --> 01:18:13,440
» Okay. Thank you very much.
>> Appreciate it.

1026
01:18:12,080 --> 01:18:16,600
» Thank you guys.
>> Thank you.

1027
01:18:20,719 --> 01:18:29,760
» All right, we'll move on to number six.
Public hearing ordinance number 562

1028
01:18:26,719 --> 01:18:34,000
amending chapter 2 animals of the code
ordinances of the bureau of Hatfield

1029
01:18:31,920 --> 01:18:37,760
providing definitions and conditions to
regulate the keeping and feeding of

1030
01:18:36,080 --> 01:18:41,320
feral/outdoor
cats in the burough.

1031
01:18:41,679 --> 01:18:45,600
» Yes, please.
>> Okay.

1032
01:18:43,520 --> 01:18:49,679
» Um
this is the update to our pearl cat

1033
01:18:48,080 --> 01:18:55,679
which we've been working on for months
and months and months. Okay. So, um We

1034
01:18:53,360 --> 01:19:01,520
have advertised tonight for a public
hearing and I do have um an exhibit

1035
01:18:59,679 --> 01:19:08,080
tomorrow, two exhibits tomorrow that I'm
going to hand into Katie to make sure

1036
01:19:04,000 --> 01:19:14,159
that we have them in minutes. Okay. So
um guys would favor

1037
01:19:12,400 --> 01:19:18,800
the rest of the meeting.
>> No, they don't have to stay um for the

1038
01:19:16,960 --> 01:19:23,360
rest of the meeting, but during this
part of the meeting he doesn't watch.

1039
01:19:20,800 --> 01:19:29,600
» Yeah. Was that all right? Okay. All
right. So, I have burrow one is an

1040
01:19:26,239 --> 01:19:34,239
affidavit of publication proving that we
uh published in the newspaper that we

1041
01:19:31,679 --> 01:19:43,120
were going to consider adopting a new
fur cat ordinance and burrow 2 or B2 is

1042
01:19:39,199 --> 01:19:47,440
uh the a copy of the ordinance itself.
Um B council has discussed this several

1043
01:19:45,840 --> 01:19:56,000
times.
Um and the purpose of the public hearing

1044
01:19:51,120 --> 01:20:01,600
is to uh to let the public comment about
this process. The committee worked very

1045
01:19:58,400 --> 01:20:08,719
hard on this ordinance. And it basically
what it does is it provides a pathway to

1046
01:20:06,000 --> 01:20:14,800
allow people to feed furl cats, but only
if they register and the cats have

1047
01:20:11,679 --> 01:20:21,280
certain characteristics like proof that
they were um sterilized and that they're

1048
01:20:19,120 --> 01:20:25,199
marked that way and things like that.
Because

1049
01:20:22,800 --> 01:20:31,679
feeding furrow cats, and the ordinance
says this, creates a nuisance in the

1050
01:20:28,080 --> 01:20:35,280
burrow because uh you feed furough cats,
you get a lot more furough cats. And

1051
01:20:33,760 --> 01:20:39,440
they don't just hang out on your
property, they hang out on all of your

1052
01:20:37,199 --> 01:20:45,760
neighbors properties. And the burrow has
had complaints. So what we have tonight

1053
01:20:43,120 --> 01:20:50,320
is the burough's consideration of an
ordinance that

1054
01:20:47,840 --> 01:20:55,280
permits feeding of fur cats but only
under certain circumstances. And if you

1055
01:20:52,560 --> 01:21:00,159
feed fur cats without going through the
circumstances which are registering and

1056
01:20:57,360 --> 01:21:04,400
making sure that the cats are neutered
and and that that that you're taking

1057
01:21:02,400 --> 01:21:09,120
care of them. Um then you're going to
get fine. And it it announces three

1058
01:21:07,280 --> 01:21:14,560
fines.
Last page. First offense is only $50 and

1059
01:21:13,199 --> 01:21:21,679
you'll be informed that you have to
register. Second offense is 100, third

1060
01:21:17,679 --> 01:21:25,679
offense 200, and fourth offense $500.
Okay? So, what we're trying to do is get

1061
01:21:24,000 --> 01:21:30,320
people to realize that they have to
commit to compliance. They don't commit

1062
01:21:28,480 --> 01:21:35,600
to compliance, it's going to get very
expensive.

1063
01:21:31,920 --> 01:21:39,840
And um we could take other actions as
well, but it seems to me that once

1064
01:21:37,360 --> 01:21:45,040
people start getting fines for feeding
burrow cats that they will realize that

1065
01:21:42,480 --> 01:21:49,520
the burrow is serious about that. So
that's basically the exhibits showing

1066
01:21:47,520 --> 01:21:54,960
tonight's been appropriately advertised
and I just gave you a summary of the

1067
01:21:51,040 --> 01:21:59,360
ordinance. Um uh chairman I think the
best thing to do would be first ask for

1068
01:21:57,040 --> 01:22:02,719
questions from Bur Council and then ask
if there's any member of the audience

1069
01:22:00,880 --> 01:22:05,760
who has a question about the ordinance.
Good.

1070
01:22:03,280 --> 01:22:11,239
» All right. Anybody on council have any
questions on the new ordinance proposed

1071
01:22:08,239 --> 01:22:11,239
ordinance?

1072
01:22:12,000 --> 01:22:17,760
Anybody in the audience have any
questions? Okay. All right. The record

1073
01:22:16,400 --> 01:22:21,760
should reflect that neither burough
council nor anybody in the audience

1074
01:22:19,840 --> 01:22:25,199
there are people in the audience raised
any issues with regard to the burrow

1075
01:22:24,639 --> 01:22:29,440
cat.
>> Sarah Ke is there anybody online?

1076
01:22:27,360 --> 01:22:32,159
» Sorry. Is there anybody online who has a
question?

1077
01:22:30,480 --> 01:22:37,120
» We don't.
>> That's fair. It's very difficult to get

1078
01:22:34,880 --> 01:22:40,239
it's very difficult to get participation
unless the person in the room

1079
01:22:38,400 --> 01:22:41,440
» and nobody provided questions ahead of
time.

1080
01:22:40,719 --> 01:22:44,639
» Nope. So
>> did we receive any questions ahead of

1081
01:22:43,120 --> 01:22:48,239
time?
Dr.

1082
01:22:46,400 --> 01:22:52,320
» Jamie didn't mention it to me and she
usually would. So I think that we did,

1083
01:22:50,159 --> 01:22:56,480
but we can assume that we did not.
>> I would also then announce that um we

1084
01:22:54,800 --> 01:23:02,480
can close the public hearing, but this
is on the agenda tonight for action. So

1085
01:23:00,239 --> 01:23:07,520
um if anyone's interested in the federal
category, they can they can stay and see

1086
01:23:05,520 --> 01:23:12,520
what happens with this. Okay.
>> Thanks. I think we close the hearing.

1087
01:23:09,280 --> 01:23:12,520
» Thank you.

1088
01:23:14,719 --> 01:23:19,760
Okay, I think I can start this. Um,
we're going to move on to number seven,

1089
01:23:18,000 --> 01:23:24,639
reports from standing committees and the
mayor. Uh, budget, labor, and finance,

1090
01:23:22,719 --> 01:23:34,520
budget, finance, and labor committee
report. uh on that one. Um we did meet

1091
01:23:28,159 --> 01:23:34,520
we we met on I close my book

1092
01:23:35,199 --> 01:23:42,239
the fourth and uh we just we just
discussed uh upcoming

1093
01:23:40,639 --> 01:23:46,600
um
numbers for the um

1094
01:23:47,440 --> 01:23:55,120
the upcoming numbers coming for u next
year's budget. And uh that was about it

1095
01:23:52,400 --> 01:23:59,600
for for that committee.
Um planning, building and zoning

1096
01:23:57,040 --> 01:24:04,800
committee report. Uh we did not meet but
we've been working on both the feral cat

1097
01:24:02,400 --> 01:24:09,760
ordinance that as was stated. We're
going to address that later and also the

1098
01:24:08,239 --> 01:24:13,360
um
we have another one that we're bringing

1099
01:24:11,199 --> 01:24:19,360
up that we'll be talking about a little
bit later as well. So uh public safety

1100
01:24:16,800 --> 01:24:24,080
committee report. Um, we should be
meeting soon, but I have nothing in the

1101
01:24:21,280 --> 01:24:30,040
report as of right now.
>> Um, public works and property and

1102
01:24:26,159 --> 01:24:30,040
equipment committee report.

1103
01:24:30,320 --> 01:24:40,480
» Oh,
we just had meeting today for our

1104
01:24:36,400 --> 01:24:45,679
council. So, um, 2036 project includes
ongoing roads, storm water, utility,

1105
01:24:43,520 --> 01:24:51,040
park maintenance, and area ramp
improvements. And for 206 the future

1106
01:24:48,480 --> 01:24:56,159
plan includes delivery improvements park
priorities and funding includes safe and

1107
01:24:54,080 --> 01:25:00,480
handout and other infrastructure
programs.

1108
01:24:57,280 --> 01:25:04,960
» Okay. Very good.
>> Okay.

1109
01:25:03,040 --> 01:25:10,320
Uh utility committee report.
>> So the utilities committee did meet

1110
01:25:06,560 --> 01:25:14,560
about three weeks ago. So been a while.
Um there was nothing really to report

1111
01:25:12,320 --> 01:25:18,480
out to the public or to council on. We
did have a lot of discussion about uh

1112
01:25:16,800 --> 01:25:22,880
some current activities and things going
on with the grid uh and some of our

1113
01:25:21,280 --> 01:25:25,920
major customers, but there's really
nothing to report.

1114
01:25:23,920 --> 01:25:30,400
» Okay. Thank you.
>> Uh have the economic revitalization

1115
01:25:28,560 --> 01:25:36,000
outreach committee report? I don't if
there's anybody here from that.

1116
01:25:32,800 --> 01:25:41,280
» Nope. Okay. Yep.
>> Uh and uh the mayor is not here, so do

1117
01:25:38,800 --> 01:25:47,760
you do she leave you anything, Jamie?
No. Okay. All right. Thank you. We'll

1118
01:25:43,760 --> 01:25:52,320
move on to reports and correspondence.
>> Uh the monthly investing reports is in

1119
01:25:49,600 --> 01:25:56,480
your packets. Um we will get more into
investments later in this uh meeting. So

1120
01:25:55,040 --> 01:26:01,040
I won't really talk about key banks
since agenda items tonight, but the cash

1121
01:25:58,320 --> 01:26:07,639
accounts through June 30th is located in
packages as well.

1122
01:26:04,639 --> 01:26:07,639
» Okay.

1123
01:26:07,840 --> 01:26:18,080
The monthly EIT and LST report. monthly
EIT and LST report is in your packets

1124
01:26:13,199 --> 01:26:25,120
through the end of July uh 2026 326 214
and 2025 it was 323 381. If you look

1125
01:26:22,480 --> 01:26:28,480
down uh kind of going through August it
looks like August might be a really good

1126
01:26:26,560 --> 01:26:32,400
month for us. Uh last year it brought in
$101,000.

1127
01:26:30,080 --> 01:26:35,199
Year to date we're at 32. So it does
look like we have some room for growth

1128
01:26:33,840 --> 01:26:44,080
in August. So it seems like we're
tracking good. And when we move into LST

1129
01:26:40,080 --> 01:26:52,639
um through the end of July 2026, 25,000
226 2025 we're at 27,484

1130
01:26:49,120 --> 01:26:57,600
little bit behind but again um roughly
$10,000 comes in August. So we'll we'll

1131
01:26:56,080 --> 01:27:02,880
see where we are at the end of the month
at the September meeting.

1132
01:27:00,400 --> 01:27:06,639
» Monthly year-to- date report. Monthly
year-to- date report is in your packets

1133
01:27:04,639 --> 01:27:14,080
just highlighting roughly halfway
through the year. Uh 54% of revenues

1134
01:27:09,679 --> 01:27:22,000
received um 50% of expenditures used of
revenues were 352 538 for June and

1135
01:27:17,760 --> 01:27:26,400
expenses 424 584 which seems to track on
par with us. some expenses tend to be a

1136
01:27:24,000 --> 01:27:30,080
little bit higher sometimes in um June,
July and August just due to the electric

1137
01:27:28,000 --> 01:27:33,199
bill
>> and monthly zoning hearing board

1138
01:27:31,840 --> 01:27:38,400
applications.
>> So um as we just spoke about during uh

1139
01:27:35,679 --> 01:27:43,199
200 North Main Street, uh they do have a
zoning hearing board application um that

1140
01:27:41,120 --> 01:27:48,080
they will be coming back to zoning
hearing board asking for an extension of

1141
01:27:45,840 --> 01:27:53,199
one year. Uh that zoning hearing board
is scheduled for September 24th, 2026.

1142
01:27:51,679 --> 01:27:57,199
That's what I was out in the lobby
talking to them about. Um, just if you

1143
01:27:55,440 --> 01:28:01,040
had any comments or anything about their
zoning, um, they would be happy to come

1144
01:27:59,360 --> 01:28:05,360
back to the next meeting and talk about
it. Um, and I had said, I will let you

1145
01:28:03,440 --> 01:28:08,000
know. But again, this was already
pre-approved. They're just going back

1146
01:28:06,960 --> 01:28:11,840
and it looks like they're going to make
some type of amendment to address the

1147
01:28:09,840 --> 01:28:16,560
storm water pipe before they go back on
the 24th.

1148
01:28:14,320 --> 01:28:22,400
» Okay. And we'll have the Hatfield 250
committee report. Um even though uh July

1149
01:28:20,320 --> 01:28:26,000
4th has come and gone, uh the events
were great. You know, we did well. Uh we

1150
01:28:24,480 --> 01:28:30,880
actually we still have some events
coming up. Uh Thursday, September 10th,

1151
01:28:29,040 --> 01:28:36,239
7 p.m. at the Hatfield Township
Building. Um the speaker will be Chief

1152
01:28:33,520 --> 01:28:42,080
Blue J. uh also known as Barbara
Macowski of the um she's part of the

1153
01:28:39,440 --> 01:28:46,560
Lapi tribe and she'll be giving a talk
on the past, present, future of the Lafi

1154
01:28:44,239 --> 01:28:51,440
people and their culture including
important places in Bucks and McGomery

1155
01:28:48,639 --> 01:28:56,719
County, places we can go see and visit
and stuff. And she'll be having cultural

1156
01:28:53,679 --> 01:29:02,719
items and stuff there as well. Um, and
then on Monday, October 12th at 7 PM in

1157
01:28:59,840 --> 01:29:07,600
the Hatfield Township Building, uh, the
speaker will be Tim McGrath. He's the

1158
01:29:04,960 --> 01:29:11,760
author of a book, Give Me a Fast Ship:
The Continental Navy and America's

1159
01:29:09,520 --> 01:29:16,560
Revolution at Sea. The topic is the
history of the American Navy during the

1160
01:29:13,760 --> 01:29:22,960
Revolutionary War. And then Thursday,
November 12th at 7 p.m. at the Township

1161
01:29:19,199 --> 01:29:27,360
Building, Dr. Suzanne Johnston of the
Tmentson chapter of the Daughters of the

1162
01:29:25,199 --> 01:29:32,400
American Revolution. She'll be speaking
on spies of the revolution and the

1163
01:29:30,159 --> 01:29:36,480
lecture will talk about something called
the culprit ring and about the unusual

1164
01:29:34,639 --> 01:29:41,679
methods that were used to convey
messages. Um, for participants that are

1165
01:29:39,199 --> 01:29:45,679
there, bring a pencil and an eraser
because you're going to be decoding uh

1166
01:29:43,520 --> 01:29:51,366
ciphers and things to see if you could
really be a So,

1167
01:29:49,040 --> 01:29:54,239
like one of
[laughter]

1168
01:29:52,560 --> 01:29:58,800
» That's funny.
>> Yeah, these things uh if if you've ever

1169
01:29:56,800 --> 01:30:04,800
gone to any of them, they're actually
really good. Um, so see if you can get

1170
01:30:02,560 --> 01:30:09,040
out there and see. There's a fourth one
we're not sure of yet and we don't know

1171
01:30:06,800 --> 01:30:13,600
when it'll fit in there, but hopefully
there'll be a fourth one.

1172
01:30:11,120 --> 01:30:18,400
» All right. Um the Montgomery County
Planning Commission steering committee.

1173
01:30:17,040 --> 01:30:21,679
» Uh the Montgomery County Planning
Commission steering committee met on

1174
01:30:20,159 --> 01:30:25,520
Monday after our planning commission
meeting. We looked at the uh

1175
01:30:23,600 --> 01:30:30,239
comprehensive plan like the draft of it.
We went through made some like minor

1176
01:30:27,199 --> 01:30:32,880
changes and adjustments. Um the planning
commission is going to memory county

1177
01:30:31,920 --> 01:30:36,400
planning commission is going to put that
all together, give us a good draft that

1178
01:30:34,800 --> 01:30:40,800
we can share with the rest of council
and our consultants and then we'll move

1179
01:30:38,880 --> 01:30:44,480
through the process of scheduling a
public comment period and work through

1180
01:30:42,560 --> 01:30:47,120
the adoption of what that looks like
maybe more towards the end of the year,

1181
01:30:45,760 --> 01:30:50,800
maybe into the beginning of next year
depending on how long the process takes

1182
01:30:49,199 --> 01:30:54,960
for public comment. But we're going to
have a really nice cleaned up draft that

1183
01:30:52,400 --> 01:30:58,960
we can share with council and our
consultants and ask for input.

1184
01:30:57,679 --> 01:31:03,120
Yeah, we had asked them and they're
going to provide copies of each of us

1185
01:31:01,280 --> 01:31:08,239
get one so you guys could see it. You
know, it's really I guess what that runs

1186
01:31:05,440 --> 01:31:13,360
till November. Did he say next year?
>> Yeah. Our our contract runs I think

1187
01:31:11,199 --> 01:31:17,120
halfway through next year. So if we had
any like design work on parks or

1188
01:31:15,280 --> 01:31:20,480
anything like that after this they still
are contracted with us. They can help us

1189
01:31:18,560 --> 01:31:23,920
on some other things as well.
>> So

1190
01:31:21,520 --> 01:31:26,920
» all right. Uh the police department
report

1191
01:31:29,199 --> 01:31:34,913
» still awake out there.
>> I was actually about [laughter]

1192
01:31:36,239 --> 01:31:44,960
» uh fire department report.
>> We have another $50 month this end of

1193
01:31:41,760 --> 01:31:51,600
July. We're at 362
August for 387.

1194
01:31:48,239 --> 01:31:57,840
We had a bunch of virus recently.
actual fire alarm. So, very actively

1195
01:31:55,520 --> 01:32:00,159
made that way too.
>> Can we just briefly go back to the

1196
01:31:59,440 --> 01:32:02,639
police?
>> Oh, yeah. Sure.

1197
01:32:00,960 --> 01:32:08,400
» Just wanted to point out that the way we
wrote this ordinance with the fines, it

1198
01:32:06,080 --> 01:32:10,080
can be enforced by our own code officer.
>> Yes.

1199
01:32:08,880 --> 01:32:13,280
» Oh, that's better.
>> That's what I thought you would say. So,

1200
01:32:12,800 --> 01:32:18,639
there
>> and it doesn't go back to the first if

1201
01:32:15,679 --> 01:32:22,000
you get fined and you go a little while.
It doesn't go back. There you go.

1202
01:32:20,239 --> 01:32:26,719
» You you you're stuck at that and you go
to the next level. So it's not like you

1203
01:32:24,080 --> 01:32:29,120
can, you know, stop for a while and then
okay, it's only 50 bucks, you know.

1204
01:32:28,639 --> 01:32:30,159
Yeah,
>> that's a good one.

1205
01:32:29,840 --> 01:32:33,520
» Yeah.
>> Right. So that was one of the changes

1206
01:32:31,920 --> 01:32:36,080
the committee recommended. So I thought
the police be happy about that.

1207
01:32:35,040 --> 01:32:40,414
» Yeah.
>> Maybe do that for

1208
01:32:38,394 --> 01:32:40,414
[laughter]

1209
01:32:43,040 --> 01:32:52,639
» Okay. EMS report.
>> EMS report in your packets for the month

1210
01:32:48,239 --> 01:32:59,760
of July. uh 1,140 calls. 11 of those
were in Hatville Burrow and the highest

1211
01:32:55,199 --> 01:33:04,159
fall was 44% was falls.
>> That is that number higher than it's

1212
01:33:01,280 --> 01:33:09,760
been in the past. The 11 for the bur.
>> Uh no, it was about like between eight

1213
01:33:08,080 --> 01:33:13,440
and maybe 13 something.
>> Yeah, I I remember single digits. Yeah.

1214
01:33:12,480 --> 01:33:16,080
» It's always false.
>> Yeah.

1215
01:33:13,760 --> 01:33:20,400
» Yeah. One time it wasn't. I remember one
one meeting was like it's not false. It

1216
01:33:18,320 --> 01:33:24,239
was like sick nursing.
>> Yeah.

1217
01:33:22,400 --> 01:33:28,480
» Public works.
>> Um nothing really exciting to add. Um

1218
01:33:26,960 --> 01:33:31,480
here for any questions you might have
though.

1219
01:33:32,800 --> 01:33:39,280
» Engineering report.
>> Uh coming up you'll see on the agenda

1220
01:33:36,960 --> 01:33:43,760
release of escrow for 23 North Main
Street Hatfield Wall project that's

1221
01:33:41,440 --> 01:33:48,320
wrapping up. They have some sight
stabilization to complete, top coat of

1222
01:33:46,080 --> 01:33:53,280
paving, and some ancillary work to do,
but that's that's about wrapping up. Uh,

1223
01:33:51,280 --> 01:33:56,719
Brooks has been in communication with
Jamie and myself regarding a big parking

1224
01:33:55,360 --> 01:34:00,560
lot expansion they want to do in the
back. Originally, we thought it was

1225
01:33:59,360 --> 01:34:05,040
going to be a land development
application through the burrow. It turns

1226
01:34:02,400 --> 01:34:07,440
out the majority, if not all the parking
lots actually going to be in the

1227
01:34:06,000 --> 01:34:12,400
township, but they're going to be
sending their storm water to the burrow.

1228
01:34:09,199 --> 01:34:15,679
What's that sound like? Right. Um, I
believe it's going to be a storm water

1229
01:34:13,920 --> 01:34:19,520
permit as opposed to a land development
because again the majority of the work

1230
01:34:17,280 --> 01:34:23,440
is is in the township. But they kind of
been going back and forth with us for

1231
01:34:21,520 --> 01:34:27,920
two months plus at this point and and
they still don't have an application in.

1232
01:34:25,600 --> 01:34:32,000
But I suspect at some point in the
future that that's going to come in

1233
01:34:29,199 --> 01:34:36,719
soon. They have big plans from what we
understand. Um, they need to expand

1234
01:34:34,639 --> 01:34:40,239
dramatically. Um, and they need to
expand uh both the facilities and and

1235
01:34:38,880 --> 01:34:43,760
the number of employees that that
they're bringing in. So, I think they're

1236
01:34:42,159 --> 01:34:47,840
going through a lot of due diligence,
different options, potentially some

1237
01:34:46,000 --> 01:34:52,719
large buildings on the property with
again expanded parking lot.

1238
01:34:50,560 --> 01:34:56,000
All very preliminary at this point, but
there may be some good things coming

1239
01:34:53,920 --> 01:34:59,120
down the line on that property. Then,
the other thing I want to report on is

1240
01:34:57,280 --> 01:35:04,560
the ADA ramps. We've been working for
several months now on that. Um, I have

1241
01:35:01,840 --> 01:35:08,320
the draft designs on my desk right now.
Uh we are adding eight more. So that's

1242
01:35:06,480 --> 01:35:13,040
going to take a little bit of time. The
goal is to have this ready for bid uh

1243
01:35:10,560 --> 01:35:19,400
early next year. So that's the plan that
will be funded with liquid fuels funds.

1244
01:35:16,320 --> 01:35:19,400
I have

1245
01:35:20,320 --> 01:35:26,000
» zoning officer building code property
maintenance report.

1246
01:35:24,080 --> 01:35:30,080
» Zing officer report is in your packet
just highlighting uh completed by uh

1247
01:35:28,159 --> 01:35:36,080
five fire inspections, three rental
inspections, uh 10 notices of high

1248
01:35:32,800 --> 01:35:43,480
grass. uh rubbish sidewall repairs, work
without a permit, and one non-tra

1249
01:35:38,639 --> 01:35:43,480
citation uh for an unstaged structure.

1250
01:35:44,719 --> 01:35:49,679
» Our marshall safety inspection report.
>> There's no report included in your

1251
01:35:48,800 --> 01:35:53,040
packet.
>> And junior council person report.

1252
01:35:51,520 --> 01:35:56,040
» Nothing related to report for this
month.

1253
01:35:56,320 --> 01:36:04,320
» All right. Manager's report.
>> My report was included in your packets.

1254
01:36:00,960 --> 01:36:09,360
Um nothing new specifically um except
disconnections will resume in September

1255
01:36:06,880 --> 01:36:14,320
for pass to electric accounts. And just
wanted to highlight um most residents I

1256
01:36:12,080 --> 01:36:18,080
know I personally did at my house and I
know you staff member who did should

1257
01:36:16,000 --> 01:36:24,000
have re uh received a letter from
Congress Fitzpatrick um that he's proud

1258
01:36:21,199 --> 01:36:28,400
that he got Hatville Burough $1 million
for a storm water and sanitary uh sewer

1259
01:36:26,480 --> 01:36:32,239
infrastructure project. Uh we talked
about that in length tonight in um

1260
01:36:30,320 --> 01:36:35,920
public works and property and equipment
and we're really excited that the

1261
01:36:33,600 --> 01:36:39,360
burrow's you know uh awarded a million
dollars. Our match is you know only

1262
01:36:37,760 --> 01:36:44,480
300,000 of that and we've been working
with Chad's office to work on Cherry

1263
01:36:42,320 --> 01:36:49,280
Street, Diamond Street, Union Street
kind of getting that neighborhood all

1264
01:36:46,320 --> 01:36:53,520
the sanitary done with the ADA ramps
along with possibly paving and then it's

1265
01:36:51,679 --> 01:36:57,199
kind of going to be like east school
west uh east school forest and orchard

1266
01:36:55,920 --> 01:37:01,199
work. that neighborhood will basically
be completed. So, I know the committee

1267
01:36:59,040 --> 01:37:05,040
was excited about hearing about how the
grant worked and that we can, you know,

1268
01:37:03,119 --> 01:37:08,960
move forward and um so we're just
waiting for some grant documentation

1269
01:37:06,480 --> 01:37:11,760
from that, but um if we can reach out to
the congressman when we have those

1270
01:37:10,400 --> 01:37:17,560
documents and we can do some type of
groundbreaking or something, I think

1271
01:37:13,119 --> 01:37:17,560
their office would really appreciate it.

1272
01:37:19,679 --> 01:37:27,040
» Okay, move on to new business. Um first
one is 23 North Main Street, Hatfield

1273
01:37:24,560 --> 01:37:30,400
Block. Site work escrow release number
one.

1274
01:37:28,239 --> 01:37:34,880
» As Chad highlighted in his report on her
consideration this evening, uh based on

1275
01:37:32,639 --> 01:37:40,920
the construction status, the engineer is
recommending a site work expert release

1276
01:37:37,520 --> 01:37:40,920
of 326,799.30

1277
01:37:42,639 --> 01:37:51,360
and it's on for consideration as an
action item.

1278
01:37:47,440 --> 01:37:57,600
» Uh B defined benefit plan 2027 minimum
municipal obligation. Uh every year we

1279
01:37:54,239 --> 01:38:01,840
have to um approve a minim minimum
municipal obligation for our defined

1280
01:37:59,679 --> 01:38:07,119
benefit plan and defined contribution
plan. Uh ironically they're the same as

1281
01:38:05,119 --> 01:38:11,360
last year, not surprisingly for the
defined benefit because we had sunseted

1282
01:38:09,520 --> 01:38:16,480
that plan. So we'll basically know
moving forward uh what that amount is.

1283
01:38:14,080 --> 01:38:22,840
And for the defined benefit, our minimum
municipal obligation uh for 2027 is

1284
01:38:19,840 --> 01:38:22,840
$61,858.

1285
01:38:23,440 --> 01:38:32,480
And for item number C for the defined
contribution plan, minimum obligation

1286
01:38:28,719 --> 01:38:35,520
for 2027 will be $34,700.
And both of those are on for

1287
01:38:33,840 --> 01:38:39,280
consideration as an action item this
evening and will be placed in the 2027

1288
01:38:37,840 --> 01:38:45,360
budget.
>> Good. Great. So we did see we'll go to D

1289
01:38:42,320 --> 01:38:50,560
resolution 2026-10
key bankank investment accounts.

1290
01:38:48,080 --> 01:38:57,760
» Uh we talked about at the last meeting
um key bank and our investment accounts

1291
01:38:53,360 --> 01:39:02,000
and how we manage those and um budget
finance and labor um and myself had

1292
01:38:59,840 --> 01:39:06,320
created a memo that was uh sent out to
to burough counsel and the solicitor

1293
01:39:04,239 --> 01:39:10,400
just highlighted how we can move forward
with our investments. So currently right

1294
01:39:07,920 --> 01:39:14,080
now we have four investment accounts and
we're strictly looking to take those

1295
01:39:12,239 --> 01:39:17,280
four investment accounts and just making
them one investment account. The

1296
01:39:15,679 --> 01:39:21,199
investments will still be the same. You
will be investing in the same items. Uh

1297
01:39:19,440 --> 01:39:25,119
the money will be the same. We just pay
fees to manage four accounts. So instead

1298
01:39:23,679 --> 01:39:28,960
of paying fees and doing all the
administrative work for four accounts,

1299
01:39:26,960 --> 01:39:32,960
we're just putting it into one account.
Also, when we put them into one account,

1300
01:39:30,719 --> 01:39:39,199
it makes the investments that we're able
to look at a little bit larger. So when

1301
01:39:36,080 --> 01:39:44,560
we have, you know, $2.4 million in an
investment account versus $136,000,

1302
01:39:42,239 --> 01:39:47,840
we're just able to earn more money back.
So it's just a way we checked with Key

1303
01:39:46,400 --> 01:39:54,000
Bank. There's nothing that doesn't allow
us to do that. Uh Diane will still

1304
01:39:50,480 --> 01:39:58,480
continue to um use all four of those
accounts in her recordkeeping. So we

1305
01:39:56,320 --> 01:40:02,159
would take money from to buy something
for electric and we use electric money

1306
01:40:00,480 --> 01:40:06,159
to pay that back. that's still going to
be documented on a spreadsheet for our

1307
01:40:04,320 --> 01:40:11,360
auditor. It's just really for
administration purposes and um really

1308
01:40:09,520 --> 01:40:16,639
the fees that we pay every month to
manage four accounts goes down when we

1309
01:40:13,840 --> 01:40:20,080
only are managing one.
>> And I believe the solicitor looked at

1310
01:40:18,159 --> 01:40:24,960
it, she was okay with it.
>> Right. Right.

1311
01:40:22,000 --> 01:40:28,639
You might not remember this, but burrows
and all the governments are limited in

1312
01:40:27,040 --> 01:40:34,400
what we're allowed to invest in.
>> Right. So I sent that information to um

1313
01:40:31,840 --> 01:40:39,280
Ebank who
and um and they have acknowledged to to

1314
01:40:36,880 --> 01:40:43,440
Jamie that they understand that they
have to use those investments. I would

1315
01:40:41,679 --> 01:40:47,679
like to get a letter from them on
letterhead saying they understand and

1316
01:40:45,280 --> 01:40:53,199
that all the money that we put with them
they'll make sure stays in investments

1317
01:40:49,920 --> 01:40:57,520
that they're allowed to invest in under
uh Pennsylvania law. So I'm fine with

1318
01:40:55,840 --> 01:41:00,960
that. I was just worried that they
didn't understand that you're limited in

1319
01:40:59,360 --> 01:41:04,880
and where you could put your money
because the legislature selected certain

1320
01:41:03,679 --> 01:41:09,000
things they thought were safe
investments for local governments.

1321
01:41:09,920 --> 01:41:15,840
» And I would just sorry I'd like to just
say thank you to the manager, assistant

1322
01:41:13,679 --> 01:41:19,840
manager and budget finance and labor for
always evaluating opportunities to save

1323
01:41:18,239 --> 01:41:24,040
money and and make more in our
investments. So thank you for the

1324
01:41:21,040 --> 01:41:24,040
efforts.

1325
01:41:25,040 --> 01:41:30,080
» Sorry.
Wow, [laughter]

1326
01:41:27,360 --> 01:41:34,000
» that was so
good.

1327
01:41:31,199 --> 01:41:39,600
» I did that on purpose. I did.
>> Good timing. [laughter] Uh, E resolution

1328
01:41:37,520 --> 01:41:42,639
2026-11
closure of certain burough roads for

1329
01:41:41,440 --> 01:41:46,880
Fall Fest.
>> This is the annual resolution of the

1330
01:41:44,639 --> 01:41:52,400
closure of East Lincoln Avenue for the
burrow uh for the fall festival event.

1331
01:41:49,679 --> 01:41:56,719
This authorizes the closure for the fall
fest on September 19th from 12:00 p.m.

1332
01:41:55,119 --> 01:42:01,199
to 8:00 p.m. and it's on for
consideration as an action item. Though

1333
01:41:59,119 --> 01:42:04,880
we will not be having a car show this
year, we still are interested in closing

1334
01:42:03,440 --> 01:42:08,000
the road just for safety and traffic.
We're still going to be having vendors,

1335
01:42:06,159 --> 01:42:10,800
people walking around even though there
isn't any cars. It still makes the event

1336
01:42:09,600 --> 01:42:16,080
a lot more functioning.
>> Yeah.

1337
01:42:12,320 --> 01:42:23,000
Okay. Um F ordinance number 563
provisions to penalties for compliance

1338
01:42:18,639 --> 01:42:23,000
for vegetation and snow removal.

1339
01:42:24,080 --> 01:42:31,040
» Okay. This is another ordinance where we
are trying to um help enforcement of

1340
01:42:29,040 --> 01:42:36,480
things like
shoveling your sidewalk on a timely

1341
01:42:32,960 --> 01:42:42,960
basis and cutting your grass. And um
this ordinance makes it easier for our

1342
01:42:39,280 --> 01:42:48,880
code officer to to enforce compliance by
shifting to a basically fines, you know,

1343
01:42:46,159 --> 01:42:54,560
the same way. And the way we could do it
as opposed to filing a little lawsuit

1344
01:42:51,199 --> 01:42:58,880
with the district justice office, um
maybe put like a door hanger on saying,

1345
01:42:56,721 --> 01:43:03,920
[snorts] "Hey, you got to do this or
else." you know, and so that what we're

1346
01:43:01,920 --> 01:43:08,159
asking for tonight is just permission to
advertise this. And I think Jamie's

1347
01:43:06,239 --> 01:43:11,600
picked a September date, the regular
meeting in September for the hearing.

1348
01:43:10,880 --> 01:43:14,560
» Okay.
>> So, that's one for an action item just

1349
01:43:13,280 --> 01:43:18,159
to advertise.
>> We Okay,

1350
01:43:15,440 --> 01:43:24,560
» we we raised Did we raise the fines on
that, too? I thought we did. I think the

1351
01:43:19,920 --> 01:43:29,280
it's uh so for vegetation it's you have
five days after the door knocker or it's

1352
01:43:26,960 --> 01:43:36,000
$25 a day for every day. Yeah.
>> And for snow it's 24 hours and then it's

1353
01:43:32,480 --> 01:43:39,440
$25 a day every day continuous until you
take care. And if you do not comply with

1354
01:43:38,159 --> 01:43:44,639
either of that then we still have the
right as the solicitor said to go to um

1355
01:43:42,400 --> 01:43:49,920
Judge Lavine's office and file.
>> Okay.

1356
01:43:46,719 --> 01:43:55,360
All right. G43 Roosevelt escrow release
number two final site work escrow

1357
01:43:52,960 --> 01:44:02,040
» escrow releases on for consideration for
43 Roosevelt for their site work in the

1358
01:43:58,400 --> 01:44:02,040
amount of $82,5502.

1359
01:44:02,960 --> 01:44:09,199
Uh this would be release number two
final release and is being recommended

1360
01:44:07,280 --> 01:44:12,840
by our engineer and on for consideration
as an action item.

1361
01:44:13,119 --> 01:44:20,239
Uh H payment request number two final
payment for pedestrian crossing

1362
01:44:17,280 --> 01:44:24,480
improvement project.
>> Subject to whatever Chad says on this

1363
01:44:21,920 --> 01:44:31,119
one. Chad approved this final pay
Bowman. I'm sorry Bowman approved this

1364
01:44:28,000 --> 01:44:35,679
final payment on on this project. But
this is a project where we had a lawsuit

1365
01:44:33,119 --> 01:44:41,600
filed because somebody slipped and fell
or fell off a skateboard or something.

1366
01:44:38,480 --> 01:44:47,440
And um under our contract with the
contractor who who is armor

1367
01:44:44,560 --> 01:44:51,199
um who we do a lot of work with actually
they had to give us a certificate of

1368
01:44:49,360 --> 01:44:56,880
insurance and then offer to hold us
harmless in this situation. They gave us

1369
01:44:54,080 --> 01:45:01,760
a certificate of insurance and they
signed the contract

1370
01:44:59,280 --> 01:45:06,880
60 days ago. I notified them that we had
this lawsuit pending from somebody who

1371
01:45:04,000 --> 01:45:13,600
was injured while during while the
construction was proceeding allegedly

1372
01:45:09,679 --> 01:45:21,040
because the condition was unsafe. Okay.
Um and so my recommendation tonight is

1373
01:45:18,639 --> 01:45:25,119
this is ready for approval. I would
suggest that the motion be and I think I

1374
01:45:23,199 --> 01:45:26,880
think uh Jamie wrote it down here,
didn't you?

1375
01:45:25,440 --> 01:45:29,840
» Yeah. Yeah. We'll cover that when we get
to that part.

1376
01:45:27,600 --> 01:45:35,199
» Right. And the motion would be just to
that you can that you can authorize

1377
01:45:32,719 --> 01:45:38,880
payment when they comply with their
contract

1378
01:45:36,320 --> 01:45:43,760
» because if they fail to pick up the the
lawsuit, they're in breach. They have an

1379
01:45:41,360 --> 01:45:47,920
obligation under their contract to
ensure us. And I don't think it's Armor.

1380
01:45:45,679 --> 01:45:52,719
I think it's their insurance company. So
today um I resent the letter. Yes, I

1381
01:45:50,800 --> 01:45:56,080
resent the letter. And today I heard
from the insurance company saying,

1382
01:45:54,080 --> 01:46:01,119
"Okay, we have your letter." I said,
"No, what I need is a letter from abuse

1383
01:45:58,880 --> 01:46:04,880
saying you're picking it up and you're
taking care of it and you're going to

1384
01:46:02,639 --> 01:46:09,360
cover it." So, I didn't get that yet,
but my suggestion would be that you

1385
01:46:06,960 --> 01:46:11,600
authorize the payment when I get that
letter that they're going to comply with

1386
01:46:10,880 --> 01:46:12,880
the contract,
>> right?

1387
01:46:12,320 --> 01:46:17,040
» Okay.
>> Okay.

1388
01:46:14,719 --> 01:46:21,400
All right.
Uh, is there any old business

1389
01:46:21,840 --> 01:46:29,119
anybody?
All right. We'll move on to the action

1390
01:46:24,880 --> 01:46:35,199
items. Um, a motion to consider
ordinance number 562 amending chapter 2

1391
01:46:33,040 --> 01:46:40,159
animals of the code of ordinances of the
bureau of Hatfield providing definitions

1392
01:46:38,239 --> 01:46:46,800
and conditions to regulate the keeping
and feeding of feral/outdoor

1393
01:46:42,400 --> 01:46:55,119
cats in the burrow. I need a motion.
>> Second. So we have a motion by Michelle

1394
01:46:51,119 --> 01:46:58,880
Weiss and a second by Jason Ferguson.
All in favor?

1395
01:46:56,560 --> 01:47:02,280
» I opposed.
>> Motion passes.

1396
01:47:02,800 --> 01:47:10,400
B. Motion to consider site work escrow
release number one at 23 North Main

1397
01:47:07,600 --> 01:47:13,400
Street, Hatfield Walk in the amount of
$326,799.30.

1398
01:47:15,840 --> 01:47:19,400
I need a motion.

1399
01:47:19,760 --> 01:47:27,440
» Motion second.
>> Second. All right. We have a motion by

1400
01:47:23,760 --> 01:47:34,444
Sevilla and a second by Michelle. All in
favor?

1401
01:47:28,639 --> 01:47:37,760
» I opposed. Motion passes. Um C.
[clears throat]

1402
01:47:35,360 --> 01:47:44,560
Motion to consider the defined benefit
benefit pension plan 2027 minimum

1403
01:47:41,679 --> 01:47:47,560
municipal obligation in the amount of
$61,858.

1404
01:47:48,320 --> 01:47:51,800
You get a motion.

1405
01:47:53,280 --> 01:48:00,639
» Second.
>> Okay. Have a motion by Michelle, second

1406
01:47:56,000 --> 01:48:08,239
by Cynthia. All in favor? I opposed.
I have it D. Motion to consider the

1407
01:48:03,920 --> 01:48:12,880
defined contribution pension plan 2027
minimum municipal obligation for

1408
01:48:10,639 --> 01:48:17,920
employees receiving contributions of
their annual income in the amount of

1409
01:48:15,440 --> 01:48:22,239
$34,700.
Need a motion.

1410
01:48:19,600 --> 01:48:24,960
» Second.
>> Second.

1411
01:48:23,040 --> 01:48:28,159
» Okay. Motion by Michelle, second by
Sevilla. All in favor?

1412
01:48:27,040 --> 01:48:33,199
» I
>> opposed.

1413
01:48:29,679 --> 01:48:38,719
Seventh. E. Motion to approve re
resolution 2026-10

1414
01:48:36,719 --> 01:48:44,880
merging a key bank investment account
into one account titled Hatfield Burough

1415
01:48:41,520 --> 01:48:47,520
Capital Reserve. Need a motion?
>> Second.

1416
01:48:45,600 --> 01:48:51,920
» Okay. Motion by Michelle, second by
Sevilla. All in favor?

1417
01:48:49,679 --> 01:48:57,199
» I opposed.
Have it.

1418
01:48:54,320 --> 01:49:01,600
Um, close to agreements resolution
2026-11

1419
01:48:59,520 --> 01:49:07,119
closure of certain burough roads for the
annual

1420
01:49:03,199 --> 01:49:10,080
fall fest event. Motion. Okay. Second.
>> Second.

1421
01:49:08,000 --> 01:49:16,159
» All right. We have a motion by Michelle,
second by Sevilla. All in favor?

1422
01:49:12,960 --> 01:49:21,520
» I opposed. 57.
And we have a motion G a motion to

1423
01:49:18,800 --> 01:49:25,679
consider advertising ordinance number
563

1424
01:49:23,040 --> 01:49:30,719
amending chapter 10 health and safety
and chapter 21 streets and sidewalks of

1425
01:49:28,960 --> 01:49:35,440
the code of ordinances of the burrow of
Hatfield to revise and restate

1426
01:49:33,119 --> 01:49:40,880
provisions relating to penalties for
fail failure to comply with grass,

1427
01:49:38,400 --> 01:49:46,000
weeds, and other vegetation and snow and
ice removal for a public hearing to be

1428
01:49:43,280 --> 01:49:51,360
held on September 16,
26 at 700 p.m. I get a motion. Second.

1429
01:49:50,639 --> 01:49:57,679
» Second.
>> Right. We have a motion by Michelle,

1430
01:49:53,280 --> 01:50:03,600
second by Sevilla. All in favor? I post.
I have it.

1431
01:50:00,800 --> 01:50:09,199
Okay. H.
Motion to consider escrow release number

1432
01:50:05,840 --> 01:50:13,760
two, final site work escrow for 43 North
North Roosevelt Avenue, I'm sorry,

1433
01:50:11,600 --> 01:50:16,760
Roosevelt Avenue in the amount of
$82,5502.

1434
01:50:20,320 --> 01:50:25,199
» Second.
>> All right. Motion by Michelle, second by

1435
01:50:22,800 --> 01:50:31,040
Cadilla. All in favor?
>> I opposed.

1436
01:50:27,840 --> 01:50:35,679
Seven. All right. Last one is a motion
to consider payment request number two,

1437
01:50:33,679 --> 01:50:40,679
final payment to Armor and Suns
Electric, Inc. in the amount of

1438
01:50:37,679 --> 01:50:40,679
$143,28267

1439
01:50:43,199 --> 01:50:51,840
pending an acceptable response to the
Timothy Knox letter sent on June 10th,

1440
01:50:49,199 --> 01:50:55,440
2026.
>> Move. Second.

1441
01:50:53,600 --> 01:51:00,480
» Right. Motion by Michelle, second by
Sevilla. All in favor? I

1442
01:50:58,239 --> 01:51:04,480
» I oppos
have it.

1443
01:51:01,920 --> 01:51:11,239
» All right. And do we have a motion to
approve the payment of the bills?

1444
01:51:07,040 --> 01:51:11,239
» Any questions on those first?

1445
01:51:12,880 --> 01:51:20,422
» The ramp's done.
[laughter]

1446
01:51:16,719 --> 01:51:23,760
» So, we open it tomorrow.
[laughter]

1447
01:51:22,159 --> 01:51:27,760
» Ramp's done. It looks great. I think
Steve and the Steve's crew and the

1448
01:51:25,679 --> 01:51:31,360
contractor did uh I said in today it
looks awesome and amazing. I'm excited

1449
01:51:29,760 --> 01:51:35,440
for the business to open, but the ramp
looks awesome.

1450
01:51:33,119 --> 01:51:38,159
» Good job.
>> Because of the long hair.

1451
01:51:37,440 --> 01:51:42,037
» Yes,
>> it's just a feeling.

1452
01:51:39,920 --> 01:51:46,159
» It's getting cut tomorrow. Okay.
[laughter]

1453
01:51:43,360 --> 01:51:49,040
» Okay.
>> Getting text from him during the

1454
01:51:47,360 --> 01:51:51,520
meeting.
Yes.

1455
01:51:49,360 --> 01:51:56,560
» Steve, you need one of these.
Steve is just jealous.

1456
01:51:55,599 --> 01:52:00,000
» They're empty, huh?
>> Yes. [laughter]

1457
01:51:58,080 --> 01:52:04,960
» Can I get a motion for the to approve
the payment of the bills?

1458
01:52:03,040 --> 01:52:08,080
» Okay.
>> Second.

1459
01:52:07,199 --> 01:52:12,560
» I'll second it.
>> Okay. So, we got a motion by Cydia,

1460
01:52:09,840 --> 01:52:16,880
second by Jason. All in favor?
>> I opposed.

1461
01:52:15,199 --> 01:52:20,880
And
uh I guess we're going to have an

1462
01:52:18,400 --> 01:52:24,239
executive session. Uh motion for
adjournment.

1463
01:52:23,520 --> 01:52:29,000
» Second.
>> Okay. Motion by Michelle, second by

1464
01:52:26,000 --> 01:52:29,000
Cadilla.