1 00:00:00,030 --> 00:00:09,240 that's 18 - 43 and ordinance of the city of Onalaska master forgiving these 2 00:00:07,290 --> 00:00:15,839 sellers from providing buyers with single-use plastic disposable shopping 3 00:00:11,940 --> 00:00:23,189 bags recommended dates introduction September 24th 2018 public hearing and 4 00:00:19,140 --> 00:00:28,430 second reading on June 8th - wait is there a motion for the introduction 5 00:00:25,380 --> 00:00:28,430 before that's 18 - 6 00:00:30,029 --> 00:00:45,899 I won't or next you okay there any any discussion of this because we're going 7 00:00:43,590 --> 00:00:49,409 to be I just wanted to say that for those people who were concerned about 8 00:00:47,460 --> 00:00:54,360 why aren't we putting this off for a vote the next election would be a year 9 00:00:52,260 --> 00:01:01,500 from this coming October so that would delay this for one more year and I think 10 00:00:57,239 --> 00:01:05,700 timing I'm not I don't believe I'm doing this for the environment who speaks up 11 00:01:03,030 --> 00:01:11,570 for the environment if it isn't us we don't care the city that is our job to 12 00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:15,240 watch out for the environment and I truly believe that says that would hurt 13 00:01:14,520 --> 00:01:20,100 anyone I'm not picking on any one business but 14 00:01:18,150 --> 00:01:25,320 I think it's important that we take a stand on this and I I think are the 15 00:01:22,979 --> 00:01:28,829 people who spoke said put it back out for a vote well that just kicks it down 16 00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:32,280 the lane for a year and I will be back in a year but that if that's what you 17 00:01:30,150 --> 00:01:37,080 that's wrong but I think we can do this now and I think times have changed I 18 00:01:35,010 --> 00:01:42,570 think people are so much more educated I am with 100% Rachel I thank you very 19 00:01:40,380 --> 00:01:48,150 very supporting us because I I really do think the timing is right for this now 20 00:01:44,640 --> 00:01:50,600 a lot has happened since 2013 we know so much more 21 00:01:52,900 --> 00:02:02,450 more discussion council member action I appreciate your ordinance and I just 22 00:02:00,650 --> 00:02:09,100 want you to clarify to the listing audience on this single-use plastic 23 00:02:06,650 --> 00:02:15,650 disposable shopping bags you also said though that then the 24 00:02:12,620 --> 00:02:32,600 grocery stores would have a a heavier bag to use plastic bag versus the light 25 00:02:21,860 --> 00:02:38,360 ones I struggled with this one because I go to Safeway and I really don't like 26 00:02:34,489 --> 00:02:46,070 having three bags but I do reuse all my bags also so but to me as I've been 27 00:02:43,670 --> 00:02:51,080 thinking about this over the weekend I think that there's actually a bigger 28 00:02:48,350 --> 00:02:57,580 issue that I'm seeing and I'm seeing people that are just doing really 29 00:02:52,850 --> 00:03:03,799 irresponsible with the trash and and then the wind blows and it's not just 30 00:03:01,610 --> 00:03:06,000 the single use bags it's everything that's on the sides of the Rhoden is 31 00:03:05,510 --> 00:03:13,590 like things along along my properties it's 32 00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:18,660 we're picking on one little thing we're not actually solving the big problem is 33 00:03:16,290 --> 00:03:24,300 people being irresponsible and if you watch at these dump stations people when 34 00:03:22,290 --> 00:03:28,500 they're full they just dump it on the ground and they really don't care it and 35 00:03:26,190 --> 00:03:33,840 I think that the man from India the burrow landfill I appreciated what 36 00:03:31,470 --> 00:03:39,030 he had to say because he's he's seen it firsthand over and over again there's a 37 00:03:36,900 --> 00:03:47,400 lot of different kinds of trash it's not just one kind and so I'm struggling with 38 00:03:44,300 --> 00:03:51,630 completely banning because I think that there's maybe a little bit more 39 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:57,830 education really needs to go out with how are we dealing with our trash when 40 00:03:54,030 --> 00:04:01,950 you see the when the landfill is is closed 41 00:03:59,250 --> 00:04:07,770 you see businesses with their dumpsters and people come to just dump their trash 42 00:04:03,690 --> 00:04:11,940 in front of it just overflowing and to me that's a that's a problem because I 43 00:04:10,050 --> 00:04:16,560 may end up paying for crash and the other business owners do and the wind 44 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:19,380 takes it and the way it goes and then they're out there cleaning it up but so 45 00:04:18,060 --> 00:04:23,610 I think that we maybe have a little bigger problem that we should really be 46 00:04:20,970 --> 00:04:28,200 focusing on is how are we dealing with our stuff from being people being 47 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:33,810 responsible to get their trash actually to the landfill and so we don't have one 48 00:04:32,850 --> 00:04:36,960 single issue we're trying to fix because it's way 49 00:04:35,010 --> 00:04:41,250 bigger than that and I don't know if you've ever seen the pictures of what's 50 00:04:38,910 --> 00:04:45,870 happening how to be Neil Canyon where people are just dumping their stuff 51 00:04:43,290 --> 00:04:49,889 because the garbage disposals are full they don't care and the guys can't even 52 00:04:48,389 --> 00:04:55,080 get up to a little advertise and the pictures when they're looking at it so I 53 00:04:51,660 --> 00:04:58,530 I really um I appreciate where you're going with this but I don't feel like 54 00:04:56,520 --> 00:05:05,070 it's right we're right where it needs to go and I would rather see us move this 55 00:05:01,980 --> 00:05:09,870 move this to a little bit longer term or trying to fix it that where it would 56 00:05:06,900 --> 00:05:16,050 work better where you were maybe dealing with more big issues than just just 57 00:05:12,780 --> 00:05:23,580 plastic bag because I mean I see the black trash bags more often than I see 58 00:05:19,860 --> 00:05:28,620 these woods that's whatever yeah the reason that these bags these very 59 00:05:25,950 --> 00:05:35,460 lightly single-use plastic bags break down very very easily when they're in 60 00:05:30,870 --> 00:05:40,710 the ocean into tiny tiny parts tiny and those that is where the environment is 61 00:05:38,310 --> 00:05:45,270 in trouble because of tiny little partisan and 62 00:05:42,060 --> 00:05:49,620 the things that we eat halibut and fish than have been birds we don't eat the 63 00:05:47,670 --> 00:05:54,450 birds with universe I mean it isn't really the bag itself it's what happens 64 00:05:52,530 --> 00:06:00,540 to it when it hits the environment and they're so in it so light and so easily 65 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:04,590 broken up that when they get off the ocean they're not really a whole bag any 66 00:06:02,250 --> 00:06:08,070 learn a black plastic bag probably looks like a plastic bag for a little bit 67 00:06:06,420 --> 00:06:12,300 longer than these little lightweight bags 68 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:15,240 so I'm I'm not saying we don't have a garbage problem 69 00:06:13,050 --> 00:06:21,270 I do really agree to but I'm thinking this is something we can do to protect 70 00:06:18,660 --> 00:06:27,540 our environment we are in marine environment and if we don't join the 71 00:06:24,840 --> 00:06:33,810 other cities and the other countries then we are saying we live in a marine 72 00:06:31,140 --> 00:06:40,620 environment but it doesn't matter for us and it does it manage of my city matters 73 00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:45,810 for you and I think we all need to be educated I I really truly believe we do 74 00:06:44,190 --> 00:06:49,890 but part of that education in three years has been house how doesn't take 75 00:06:48,630 --> 00:06:54,279 very long for these things to break under those tiny little pieces and it's 76 00:06:52,290 --> 00:07:00,819 the tiny little pieces not the real bag itself follow the money 77 00:06:58,359 --> 00:07:06,969 these banks are very very cheap for stores follow the money they like store 78 00:07:04,179 --> 00:07:12,399 it like they're cheap they they have given us an opportunity to buy it to 79 00:07:09,159 --> 00:07:16,959 have cheap bags hey if you want to reuse a plastic bag don't you want it to be a 80 00:07:15,069 --> 00:07:22,889 sturdier one than what little single use bags are if it doesn't make someone you 81 00:07:19,539 --> 00:07:27,999 can't put kitty litter don't try that these banks are not reusable for 82 00:07:25,509 --> 00:07:31,899 anything and it's not like a bag that you get that is something that you can 83 00:07:29,799 --> 00:07:36,489 say oh I've got my mom jeans babe I reuse that for something these are the 84 00:07:34,239 --> 00:07:41,679 single use bags that are just there's a difference you're like oh she knows we 85 00:07:40,389 --> 00:07:45,339 don't stand up and protect our environment then who else is going to 86 00:07:43,659 --> 00:07:49,389 protect our environment and I don't I really think the government is nothing 87 00:07:47,349 --> 00:07:55,149 government this is our community saying and an awareness on our casual hey we 88 00:07:53,109 --> 00:07:59,829 care about the environment we are very environment we can't close our eyes to 89 00:07:57,069 --> 00:08:04,689 see we don't know that now maybe we could have 10 years ago but I hear the 90 00:08:01,809 --> 00:08:11,619 research I teach at the college I see these young people they know what that 91 00:08:07,599 --> 00:08:14,850 damages my look at them is I'm gonna do everything 92 00:08:12,300 --> 00:08:19,980 city council members to make sure that doesn't happen and I don't believe that 93 00:08:18,270 --> 00:08:29,010 government intervention I think that is being wise because individual certain 94 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:32,580 hair course you can do it individually make a difference we can think the 95 00:08:30,630 --> 00:08:35,820 difference and if we don't do this I really feel like somewhere along the 96 00:08:34,260 --> 00:08:39,030 line we're going to be very sorry in ten years what other people have done it 97 00:08:37,500 --> 00:08:43,470 home are still sitting there well we didn't yeah we're an ocean 98 00:08:40,740 --> 00:08:50,190 environment yep bring your cheap plastic bags because we did not get together and 99 00:08:47,970 --> 00:08:55,200 we're confident government intervention is not what it's about it's caring about 100 00:08:52,170 --> 00:09:00,720 our environment and those people that say oh this is the government taking arm 101 00:08:57,110 --> 00:09:04,830 it's people who care us city council people saying yes we are listening to 102 00:09:03,060 --> 00:09:10,029 the people and this is something that needs to have 103 00:09:06,790 --> 00:09:16,400 it's just the single use touch base it's just because they break Thomas 104 00:09:12,230 --> 00:09:20,300 if they didn't do that but I have to say I heard at the college I've seen it on 105 00:09:19,310 --> 00:09:25,760 those books and it's a shame and I eat fish I grew 106 00:09:24,770 --> 00:09:29,150 up on fish that's raised in the Comanches look you're an Alaskan I'd 107 00:09:27,860 --> 00:09:34,040 like to think my fish that's a little tiny particles of plastic in it I don't 108 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:40,640 want to ingest Buzzbee so I don't want to say I care about our 109 00:09:37,940 --> 00:09:47,600 environment this to me is not an activist on this I'm just saying it's 110 00:09:42,860 --> 00:09:55,460 time for City Council votes this down tonight I'm going to be very embarrassed 111 00:09:49,900 --> 00:09:59,570 we are not thinking for the future and I've heard you guys tonight saying all 112 00:09:57,560 --> 00:10:04,940 Caroline we pulled it for a year but didn't for the boat takes one more year 113 00:10:01,430 --> 00:10:09,710 a whole year I don't think so I can't wait a year the kids can't wait here Oh 114 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:14,450 Caroline go talk to say for you're a beast a boy won't do it well state boy 115 00:10:12,110 --> 00:10:19,430 will do it if they make money on says having cheaper Maddox the only thing 116 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:23,110 that's going to make these stores and I'm only talking maybe one or two 117 00:10:26,839 --> 00:10:34,519 I'm not saying all plastic bags they can have heavier bags just put the little 118 00:10:32,240 --> 00:10:38,149 tiny ones and showing you implemented today your boots or your shoes have 119 00:10:36,230 --> 00:10:44,540 broken it was tiny little particles that is what's dangerous to do 120 00:10:41,510 --> 00:10:51,920 and so I the plastic is not bad it's just that these ones break down you know 121 00:10:48,139 --> 00:10:55,730 I can't I don't know what I I'm hoping that in five years 122 00:10:53,380 --> 00:10:59,260 it's things been for actually whatever that we have been a more educated 123 00:11:02,250 --> 00:11:11,160 councilmember Eriksen and I want you to know I'm not opposed to the environment 124 00:11:07,830 --> 00:11:16,680 or protection I remember back when John was little boy twenty-some-odd kind of 125 00:11:16,290 --> 00:11:22,050 go we got moose back in the back Hills and 126 00:11:19,170 --> 00:11:27,210 there was plenty bacon assuming so I you know I can't just say it's all about the 127 00:11:24,570 --> 00:11:32,250 marine mammals like I'm saying that you I realize it was a problem all the way 128 00:11:29,220 --> 00:11:39,600 around and I just I feel like that because it was such a strong and 129 00:11:36,830 --> 00:11:45,420 contentious thing the last time around it's only fair that we give the people 130 00:11:41,580 --> 00:11:52,170 the voice to say yay or nay and if they all want if they want to embrace it 131 00:11:47,780 --> 00:11:58,890 great and I know that a lot but people probably well because I think that we we 132 00:11:55,650 --> 00:12:01,500 are getting tired of our food coming and disposable 133 00:11:59,700 --> 00:12:05,580 everything's disposable and there's a lot of waste that goes in those 134 00:12:02,700 --> 00:12:11,550 landfills but I I think that because of the vote before that I think that it's 135 00:12:07,650 --> 00:12:15,720 only respectful of them to let them do it again and I would say whichever next 136 00:12:13,740 --> 00:12:22,130 election it is and there's probably gonna be one of the sprinkles elsewhere 137 00:12:19,590 --> 00:12:30,540 word Lord I think elsewhere thank you and you know we certainly 138 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:37,470 heard a lot of folks in support of this and emotionally so and factually so and 139 00:12:35,220 --> 00:12:42,900 and and certainly also people frustrated with government generally and kind of 140 00:12:40,650 --> 00:12:45,570 what is our role and that's I've spent a lot of time thinking about what is the 141 00:12:44,250 --> 00:12:51,150 role of what is the role of government why why do we collectively try to take 142 00:12:48,510 --> 00:12:56,070 action what does that mean when is what is the point of a threshold where we say 143 00:12:52,890 --> 00:13:00,089 okay yes this is now it is it's an okay time to act or or whatever 144 00:12:57,780 --> 00:13:04,260 what are those parameters and I think that that's gray and that's what kind of 145 00:13:02,070 --> 00:13:09,839 makes it interesting and we can ask those questions of ourselves and of one 146 00:13:06,630 --> 00:13:16,589 another honestly it sincerely and when they hopefully would have vitriol you 147 00:13:14,490 --> 00:13:25,110 know and I think the idea of that the people voted is is is important and it 148 00:13:20,070 --> 00:13:28,080 is true that being said we are we are we are a community of a lot of different 149 00:13:27,060 --> 00:13:31,740 people with a lot of different perspectives I you know I appreciate 150 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:36,839 Caroline bringing the story because it is contentious I have been asked since 151 00:13:33,990 --> 00:13:42,360 before I ran for council to run for Council and - please help move the 152 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:46,380 community back in this direction and you know it's go for it for everybody who 153 00:13:44,339 --> 00:13:49,380 really doesn't like it there are people who really do and for everybody who 154 00:13:48,060 --> 00:13:55,270 really does there's somebody who really doesn't doesn't make 155 00:13:51,640 --> 00:14:01,930 I mean or bad and it's it's just what is in the five years since the the vote 156 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:06,340 which was turned over here in home since the ordinance was was over traumatic go 157 00:14:03,460 --> 00:14:09,790 to the people there has been changed as things have come operate like there's 158 00:14:07,870 --> 00:14:15,280 there's reason to kind of look at this again I do I do believe that that is 159 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:19,660 valid and it's not just from an agenda whatever that particularly means but you 160 00:14:17,170 --> 00:14:24,610 know we do know more the science doesn't change it's only really strengthened in 161 00:14:21,610 --> 00:14:29,260 evidence for the impacts of plastics and micro plastics and again those those 162 00:14:26,170 --> 00:14:32,620 small pieces that break up along the cycle of that science is really looking 163 00:14:31,150 --> 00:14:37,270 at the communities around us from Onalaska than just past a very similar 164 00:14:35,620 --> 00:14:39,910 event you know and different communities are doing you know that this this 165 00:14:38,620 --> 00:14:46,870 ordinance as it's written has a 2.25 mil exception so bags heavier 166 00:14:43,900 --> 00:14:50,560 than that can be used well that's I mean the signal response food is really 167 00:14:48,310 --> 00:14:56,910 important I believe in Anchorage it's all soft plastic bags in Palmer it's for 168 00:14:54,220 --> 00:15:04,540 girls and Onalaska it's for males in Kodiak gets for males in Wasilla it's 169 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:11,080 2.25 and Soldotna 2.25 cordova 2.25 but also none of those styrofoam trays can 170 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:14,560 be used or styrofoam for for takeout flew them online so you know i mean this 171 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:20,320 has been going on for a long time there are a lot of western villages who have 172 00:15:16,270 --> 00:15:24,490 passed similar restrictions on what retailers hand out to people right but 173 00:15:22,930 --> 00:15:28,420 we all can still make whatever choices we want to make about what we use what 174 00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:33,430 we buy what we have we move our goods from one place to 175 00:15:30,010 --> 00:15:37,450 another this really is looking at all of these all of these communities around 176 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:43,510 the state are looking at what retailers can provide to consumers at a point of 177 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:46,750 sale to move those Goods around so we still have the power to make whatever 178 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:54,070 choices we want it's what are we being provided with at the cash register so 179 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:59,530 I'm a little conflicted I go in Alaska had a task force I don't know I I know I 180 00:15:57,400 --> 00:16:05,320 know I'm not gonna propose a task force of because we are we are good right now 181 00:16:02,980 --> 00:16:09,730 with task forces I think that they take significant city resource resources of 182 00:16:08,170 --> 00:16:15,060 staff time and even if it's not a dollar value attributed to them the staff time 183 00:16:11,860 --> 00:16:21,250 is a dollar value that we all pay for and so I'm not going to propose that but 184 00:16:17,610 --> 00:16:25,750 but I'd like to see this maybe I'd like to see this introduce tonight I'd like 185 00:16:22,990 --> 00:16:31,600 to see the opportunity for continued conversation and you know if their ideas 186 00:16:29,830 --> 00:16:36,940 of how to make it more palatable for folks what that looks like but I would 187 00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:41,160 like to see us introduce this tonight and move it forward to at least a second 188 00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:41,160 meeting and 189 00:16:49,500 --> 00:16:59,740 well I will say this I'm not prepared to do exactly what it council did five 190 00:16:56,860 --> 00:17:06,120 years ago was that was pre proposed and as a result of that the people spoke 191 00:17:04,270 --> 00:17:11,680 and they spoke in a rather loud voice and I think that the only proper thing 192 00:17:09,010 --> 00:17:15,820 at this point is not to make the same assumption no matter how compelling the 193 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:21,040 evidence is I went back and I read the minutes it was by and large people that 194 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:27,190 sat and testified that were in favor of the plastic bag back then there is no 195 00:17:24,730 --> 00:17:33,910 question but when I went to a vote it did not play out the same way if we put 196 00:17:31,390 --> 00:17:37,740 it on about me and with all the respect Caroline I mean she's been in Council 197 00:17:36,280 --> 00:17:43,750 for almost a year she could have had it on this ballot 198 00:17:40,060 --> 00:17:48,910 there was time to do that and so yeah of having to wait another year to allow the 199 00:17:45,790 --> 00:17:52,660 public process to do its thing for us to educate the public for the people to 200 00:17:51,070 --> 00:17:57,940 organize that really want to see it happen to do that without even having a 201 00:17:55,090 --> 00:18:02,740 task force and make their case make their case to the people the 7% they 202 00:18:00,190 --> 00:18:07,390 need to win over that they would need to have the majority I don't see anything 203 00:18:04,570 --> 00:18:12,100 lost in that process I'm not going to put myself in a position where I'm going 204 00:18:09,040 --> 00:18:15,430 to tell the public they got it wrong and they made the decision on this 205 00:18:13,630 --> 00:18:19,870 yes we've grown we've got more information all that stuff's great but 206 00:18:17,950 --> 00:18:23,320 we've gone through this gyration once and I don't think anything's lost 207 00:18:21,970 --> 00:18:28,690 leaving this to the voters they spoke rather than fat actually on 208 00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:33,690 it and and so I'm not going to support it just because of them 209 00:18:31,140 --> 00:18:38,040 you know I was in a business today I'm in one of those little magic 8-balls 210 00:18:38,130 --> 00:18:47,800 I'm gonna ask you one question has the world gone mad and I flipped it 211 00:18:44,470 --> 00:18:53,980 over and it said reply hazy please ask again the reply that the public gave us 212 00:18:51,220 --> 00:18:57,820 was not hazy and we can come back time and time again that's fine I mean that's 213 00:18:56,290 --> 00:19:02,620 basically what people do when they don't get they want they get a basket but I 214 00:19:00,940 --> 00:19:06,730 think that we go through the right process especially when it comes to 215 00:19:04,300 --> 00:19:09,040 something they spoke about and we will get the answer if they want it at that 216 00:19:08,620 --> 00:19:13,690 point no problem subordinate but I'm not going 217 00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:20,890 to take the position that I know better than they did and and move forward in 218 00:19:16,690 --> 00:19:27,440 that fashion because the members muses thank you 219 00:19:23,670 --> 00:19:35,870 this is a this is a tough night here you know Carolina I listen to what you 220 00:19:32,010 --> 00:19:43,080 say you know I hear what you say I listened to what he said sitting next to 221 00:19:39,780 --> 00:19:47,520 you and I hear what he says you know when we're faced with a tough issue we 222 00:19:46,590 --> 00:19:57,840 have a choice do we react or do we respond if we react 223 00:19:53,480 --> 00:20:04,790 that's considered negative and to go ahead and push this forward right now 224 00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:13,860 would be a reaction do we respond as responsible people in government who set 225 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:22,020 policy nomer do we respond and try to educate the public on the merits perhaps 226 00:20:16,770 --> 00:20:27,930 of why a ban should be imposed and then we let the public vote on after they've 227 00:20:24,450 --> 00:20:36,860 received all the material in information that they can swallow on both sides of 228 00:20:32,130 --> 00:20:43,080 the issue and let the public vote and that's why I'm not going to be a support 229 00:20:39,360 --> 00:20:49,560 this at this time I see Meriton I knew I see merit on the other side but it's but 230 00:20:46,290 --> 00:20:55,890 as policymakers in this community we owe it to the public to let them make a 231 00:20:51,840 --> 00:21:03,270 decision let when I go to the grocery store more often than not I take my 232 00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:08,080 reusable bag with me I have a bunch of in the bathroom I instructor always use 233 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:14,679 them I wash him my wife Washington Washington so I know 234 00:21:12,700 --> 00:21:21,820 that I'm not going back with a contaminated pan but very often - I'll 235 00:21:18,700 --> 00:21:26,800 forget my bag or you know they'll put my eggs in one of those plastic bags like 236 00:21:23,740 --> 00:21:31,480 you you know refer to earlier and it's just we go about our business but I 237 00:21:29,410 --> 00:21:38,020 don't throw my bags not use them for all kinds of things I take my recyclables to 238 00:21:35,740 --> 00:21:44,260 the dump in them and then I throw them in the in the plastic bag then they had 239 00:21:41,830 --> 00:21:47,320 with the dump so they're all collected I don't know what they do with them but 240 00:21:46,030 --> 00:21:54,880 they're all within there so they're not blowing around when I break my fish or 241 00:21:52,059 --> 00:21:59,550 seafood or whatever I put my my breading in these plastic bags and I put my fish 242 00:21:56,980 --> 00:22:07,450 in there and I use it as a breading bag so I'm getting bad looking you scored so 243 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:15,640 go back to the week react or do we respond and I think that we should 244 00:22:11,410 --> 00:22:20,380 respond and let the public decide what they want so unfortunately I won't be 245 00:22:18,670 --> 00:22:24,630 able to support it as it is right now I'd like to British people and educate 246 00:22:23,170 --> 00:22:39,600 them on the merits of classic bank man or not 247 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:45,270 thank you I I just want to say you know I I can support a boat as well and I do 248 00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:50,580 think that time is unfortunate and I and I you know in all of this and just the 249 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:54,420 only thing that I wanted to respond to tom is that I think that I could 250 00:22:52,740 --> 00:22:59,930 actually write a similar story of what you just emphatically said to us in the 251 00:22:56,790 --> 00:23:05,160 reverse direction where I feel like another way of painting that picture is 252 00:23:02,610 --> 00:23:11,490 to say that bringing forward this is really responding to statewide movement 253 00:23:08,580 --> 00:23:17,280 as responding to you a lot of community concern and and feedback and comments 254 00:23:14,220 --> 00:23:21,630 and comments and comments and again we've got you you know that's we all 255 00:23:19,890 --> 00:23:26,760 hear different segments of our community and every single one of those 256 00:23:23,580 --> 00:23:30,630 communities segments is valid and so the other way to paint that is that you know 257 00:23:28,500 --> 00:23:36,780 this ordinance really is responding to you science community concern and and 258 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:40,710 what's going on around the state and a reaction is you know there are there is 259 00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:46,140 a segment of the community that is really against this very fundamentally I 260 00:23:44,820 --> 00:23:51,480 don't I don't necessarily know that education is going to change that 261 00:23:47,580 --> 00:23:57,410 ostensibly perhaps a numbers game and so I'm not you know I hear what you're 262 00:23:53,790 --> 00:24:00,040 saying I am NOT I don't see it actually you 263 00:23:58,540 --> 00:24:05,350 you do I don't necessarily see it going in a different direction if if we try to 264 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:08,440 kind of do the same thing again I think that's unfortunate and I just want to 265 00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:13,330 say that I don't I think you can paint both sides as being reactionary or 266 00:24:10,350 --> 00:24:18,270 responsibly leader responsive and it's not entirely fair to to really paint one 267 00:24:15,610 --> 00:24:24,490 side one way or the other all right this is I think we had some 268 00:24:22,510 --> 00:24:33,160 really wonderful public testimony earlier we received some comments via 269 00:24:29,500 --> 00:24:44,890 email earlier today a lot of really good points raised both sides and this is 270 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:50,550 this is a complex issue and I I'm going to propose something and I hope that 271 00:24:46,450 --> 00:24:50,550 somebody will will make a motion 272 00:24:52,420 --> 00:25:00,290 that I believe that we need that this is a big issue for the community and we 273 00:24:58,610 --> 00:25:05,810 need to have some additional discussion I think that having one public hearing 274 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:13,670 on it is not enough and I'd like to see a motion to have at least two public 275 00:25:09,260 --> 00:25:20,240 hearings I would like to hear from the public I'd like to hear very 276 00:25:15,230 --> 00:25:26,210 specifically on aspects of this proposed ordinance that people like and dislike 277 00:25:22,610 --> 00:25:32,390 and like to have discussion about what we really want to see in this in this if 278 00:25:30,590 --> 00:25:37,130 we were to if we were to if we were to pass this or if we were to put it on as 279 00:25:34,340 --> 00:25:41,860 a ballot measure what how should it read what should it look like what do we 280 00:25:38,450 --> 00:25:46,940 really want in this community and you know let's hear from the public 281 00:25:44,660 --> 00:25:55,300 council members have the opportunity to provide substitutes amendments but let's 282 00:25:52,670 --> 00:26:00,740 have a community dialogue about this and then make a decision about whether we 283 00:25:57,710 --> 00:26:09,200 want passed this not passed this or have it as a ballot measure in a year let's 284 00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:14,800 like you know I I feel that this is an important enough community discussion 285 00:26:11,780 --> 00:26:18,730 that it should not be shut down evening that we should continue the 286 00:26:17,050 --> 00:26:24,220 dialogue that we should continue to hear from the public before we make any kind 287 00:26:22,360 --> 00:26:27,850 of decision on this so that's my recommendation and I would love it if 288 00:26:26,140 --> 00:26:37,050 somebody would make such a motion I make a motion that we have two more 289 00:26:32,410 --> 00:26:37,050 public hearings on ordinance 18 - 43 290 00:26:38,930 --> 00:26:44,750 because probably best to amend the main motion to introduce and have it the 291 00:26:43,130 --> 00:26:49,100 amendment to say to introduce and schedule too 292 00:26:47,290 --> 00:26:53,350 with motion that's on the floor introduced okay so 293 00:26:55,370 --> 00:26:59,290 I make a motion then that 294 00:27:00,790 --> 00:27:10,120 oh the ordinance that ordinance 1843 have tonight we have some dates 295 00:27:08,860 --> 00:27:12,960 do I have camp didn't seem like anyone Seconal Johnson 296 00:27:54,840 --> 00:28:06,840 I make a move to amend the motion to say to introduce ordinance 1843 and 297 00:28:01,110 --> 00:28:12,769 scheduled for public hearings second all right was there any discussion on 298 00:28:09,690 --> 00:28:12,769 the amendment oh 299 00:28:16,380 --> 00:28:22,960 I guess to public currents is not going to 300 00:28:20,929 --> 00:28:29,960 change that having people decide this we can have 301 00:28:27,380 --> 00:28:40,100 any number of people come in here any long list of reputable science-driven 302 00:28:34,340 --> 00:28:44,330 whatever is and ultimately the people have spoken on our Lots I want them to 303 00:28:41,570 --> 00:28:49,910 have the decision and if the idea is to provide them with a forum to become more 304 00:28:47,090 --> 00:28:54,290 educated through that conversation that might be one thing but again if there's 305 00:28:52,370 --> 00:29:01,490 a ballot initiative when we have a lot of people that are passionate about this 306 00:28:58,820 --> 00:29:05,530 I think that that can be something that they can take on to educate public 307 00:29:05,900 --> 00:29:13,520 I'm not I'm not going to be comfortable with the six of us making a decision to 308 00:29:12,110 --> 00:29:18,230 tell the people that they got it wrong and that's just kind of the bottom line 309 00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:21,170 for me so I know I don't know that my mind will change there was some very 310 00:29:19,670 --> 00:29:24,070 compelling stuff that was said here tonight I'm not gonna argue with that 311 00:29:22,580 --> 00:29:29,420 I'm not arguing for or against abandoning all I'm saying is that 312 00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:35,320 ultimately regardless of the information that's presented us here I think it 313 00:29:32,510 --> 00:29:35,320 needs to be up to them 314 00:29:39,030 --> 00:29:47,070 thank you I think that well times when I've spent may be correct that nobody at 315 00:29:45,390 --> 00:29:51,450 this tables mind has changed on the direction and and I think that some of 316 00:29:48,900 --> 00:29:57,180 us may not even have our minds made up as far as you know this ordinance 317 00:29:54,780 --> 00:30:02,760 specifically I do think that that it is timely that this ordinance was brought 318 00:29:58,860 --> 00:30:07,430 forward it's been you know there's a lot of interest in it and it's happening 319 00:30:04,380 --> 00:30:13,320 right now all around us very very yeah it's just happening right 320 00:30:11,700 --> 00:30:17,340 now around this so I think that by having those two additional public 321 00:30:14,940 --> 00:30:23,160 hearings on this ordinance would give a lot of opportunity outside of the task 322 00:30:19,530 --> 00:30:27,179 force or any other formal effort but you hear from the public and I think that if 323 00:30:24,990 --> 00:30:31,980 you know if it does go to a to a ballot measure next October then it does give 324 00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:35,250 an opportunity to have some more conversation about what that might look 325 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:38,370 like because I'm gonna say that if you know I mean I might I would like to 326 00:30:36,990 --> 00:30:41,900 think more about this and if we were going to look to a ballot measure for 327 00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:47,309 next fall you know I am compelled to at least 328 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:52,710 learn more about the four mill or you know there I stay at exceptions you know 329 00:30:51,450 --> 00:30:57,059 that that we are seeing in the communities surrounding us and so I 330 00:30:54,840 --> 00:31:01,200 think that it gives opportunity from our for more dialogue for more of the public 331 00:30:59,340 --> 00:31:06,900 if they so wish to come forward and have conversations and whether that be you 332 00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:12,850 know to help frame a better ordinance or to frame ballot language moving forward 333 00:31:10,140 --> 00:31:17,210 I think that that would be helpful and and possibly been 334 00:31:15,710 --> 00:31:20,900 responsible as far as kind of giving giving a little bit more voice to an 335 00:31:19,039 --> 00:31:28,130 issue that is very weighty for the community I think this would give time 336 00:31:26,179 --> 00:31:31,940 for the council members to they want to amend this they can think about it I 337 00:31:29,929 --> 00:31:37,120 know I put this in there Hackett and it was only there and I didn't really 338 00:31:33,490 --> 00:31:43,390 because of the how many I can speak to not many of you maybe it was a surprise 339 00:31:39,799 --> 00:31:47,720 to some of you who I apologize but I think this to schedule two public 340 00:31:45,890 --> 00:31:53,210 hearings and gives us city council members a chance to to maybe give us 341 00:31:51,260 --> 00:31:58,100 something that will be palatable to you I don't want to delay this for a year I 342 00:31:55,610 --> 00:32:03,230 don't think we need to I think we can find an agreement on this I have heard 343 00:32:00,230 --> 00:32:09,049 this said before were split worse City Council I always say no or not but I saw 344 00:32:06,740 --> 00:32:13,760 tonight that we kind of are so I'm hoping that we can that I can help you 345 00:32:12,020 --> 00:32:19,190 facilitate this that you can ask your questions and we have two public 346 00:32:15,679 --> 00:32:25,640 hearings I think that won't benefit the entire community especially at us as a 347 00:32:21,260 --> 00:32:28,940 as a city council tomorrow you may think you will have time to put in your 348 00:32:26,780 --> 00:32:33,049 amendments and think about it maybe we can craft something that everyone will 349 00:32:30,919 --> 00:32:36,919 like then what else we live we care about the environment all of you care 350 00:32:34,940 --> 00:32:41,539 about the environment and here every one of you so give us the words tell us what 351 00:32:39,409 --> 00:32:46,510 you want to put in this and maybe we can pass something all of us 100% 352 00:32:44,810 --> 00:32:51,830 because that's what it'll take and I didn't word this to be mine or anything 353 00:32:50,090 --> 00:32:56,890 but when you're doing this solo it's kind of like this is what I I would have 354 00:32:54,200 --> 00:33:02,870 gone for all plastic bags BAM and straws but this is something a start of 355 00:33:00,100 --> 00:33:09,410 something that I see is a huge problem to us as ears of dish which I am a deep 356 00:33:07,220 --> 00:33:13,010 eater of issues so I'll be happy to hear the amendments let's work on this 357 00:33:11,780 --> 00:33:17,090 together and see if we can craft something that is acceptable to all of 358 00:33:15,020 --> 00:33:22,160 you order that ones that will go home today thank you and I do like working 359 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:25,820 with all of you I just want to know this has nothing to do with my working with 360 00:33:23,900 --> 00:33:31,370 you this is one single issue we just happen to have different opinions at 361 00:33:27,890 --> 00:33:37,700 this time and that's all and it doesn't it doesn't but I like working with you 362 00:33:34,070 --> 00:33:41,600 and I take you this money passion I guess to be honest a counselor that 363 00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:46,370 listen to the people who my constituents in name 364 00:33:42,260 --> 00:33:50,020 I was elected so it wouldn't be very nice my dispatchers didn't do anything 365 00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:05,120 Thank You Caroline I know you're very passionate about this I think I think 366 00:34:04,370 --> 00:34:09,530 that's wonderful but whether we have one public here in 367 00:34:07,250 --> 00:34:18,850 her to pop appearance or ten public hearings is not going to change my mind 368 00:34:13,250 --> 00:34:27,020 either what's going to change my mind is the battle box and so be it we have to 369 00:34:24,290 --> 00:34:33,830 wait till next October but I think you know in the interest of being 370 00:34:30,070 --> 00:34:41,500 responsible council people in this community we need while I would be able 371 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:41,500 to speak we don't need to be 372 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:49,270 speaking for them they need to have the option to go and make that decision on 373 00:34:46,909 --> 00:34:49,270 their own 374 00:34:54,950 --> 00:35:03,470 the the reason that I brought forward this is because I want to here I want to 375 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:08,480 have an additional public hearing so that I can hear from the people so that 376 00:35:06,019 --> 00:35:12,920 they can speak and it gives us an opportunity to hear what their 377 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:19,549 objections are what they like what they don't like and even if we vote this this 378 00:35:16,670 --> 00:35:28,250 down and you come up with a ballot measure later or if this we bring 379 00:35:25,490 --> 00:35:33,440 somebody brings forward a substitute to turn this into a ballot measure we have 380 00:35:31,339 --> 00:35:39,890 heard from the people of this community about what they actually want to see if 381 00:35:37,069 --> 00:35:45,619 there were to be some sort of bagman like this that is why I suggested that 382 00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:51,289 we have an extra public hearing and that we do introduce this this ordinance 383 00:35:49,670 --> 00:35:56,730 tonight so that we can hear from the public 384 00:35:52,860 --> 00:36:02,120 so that we we we have some idea of what we're doing and we're not shooting in 385 00:35:59,340 --> 00:36:02,120 the blind 386 00:36:05,240 --> 00:36:11,900 I've appreciated the conversation because I think it's important as things 387 00:36:09,890 --> 00:36:18,140 I think that a lot of the struggle book and it's how do we live in the life that 388 00:36:14,329 --> 00:36:22,940 we live in our society with huge package again all those different things and how 389 00:36:20,270 --> 00:36:28,940 do we live in a world full of plastic and glass and tin and right we should 390 00:36:26,750 --> 00:36:34,250 all go back to our own little garden and even straight from the garden and that's 391 00:36:30,410 --> 00:36:39,650 it but that's the extreme and of course my life stuff will never afford that but 392 00:36:37,309 --> 00:36:44,660 I think one of the other things why I don't get a little worried about maybe 393 00:36:42,230 --> 00:36:51,170 about a vote because I think that that's really important I think it also gives 394 00:36:47,270 --> 00:36:56,150 time for people to maybe start making some changes and see that oh maybe this 395 00:36:53,510 --> 00:37:01,010 isn't as hard as I think it would be and so I think that I just wanted to say 396 00:36:58,730 --> 00:37:06,230 that I think there is some some good in the midst of waiting and so don't look 397 00:37:04,309 --> 00:37:10,599 at it as maybe as a failure it's actually a great teaching time 398 00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:29,420 I would just like to comment that the motion on the floor 399 00:37:31,309 --> 00:37:35,229 so there is there any additional discussion on 400 00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:53,410 okay we have a roll call vote on the motion to amend introduction to 401 00:37:48,609 --> 00:37:57,839 two public hearings miss Lord yes is that all yes mrs. Eriksen 402 00:37:58,190 --> 00:38:09,840 it's just Jesus no it's just that yes this is Benny 403 00:38:05,230 --> 00:38:09,840 yes notified yes 404 00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:22,100 okay so now procedurally we're back to the main motion which is to introduce or 405 00:38:15,230 --> 00:38:28,340 did we or did that okay so we're back to the main motion to introduce the 406 00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:39,550 coordinates so we have a roll call vote for the introduction yes miss Larry yes 407 00:38:37,240 --> 00:38:42,550 yes No 408 00:38:44,329 --> 00:38:48,740 no mrs. Eriksen 409 00:38:48,990 --> 00:38:53,220 notice for yes I'm to know 410 00:38:54,020 --> 00:39:04,490 okay so coordinates 18 - 43 has been introduced thank you very much everybody 411 00:39:00,170 --> 00:39:08,530 for a really good discussion and that brings us to the city manager's report