call this uh regular meeting of the
whole bar council October 1925 order.
» Adequate notice of this meeting has been
provided by notice mail for Valley News
in the Fman times post on a bullet in
the bur and follow the bur as required
by you with license.
Pledge allegiance to the flag of the
United States of America to the republic
for which it stands one nation under God
indivisible with liberty and ally
>> here.
>> Mr. Fuller
>> here
>> Miss Steeler
>> here. Miss Williams
>> here.
>> Okay. Um, I'll take a motion for
resolution 2025106 to retire in
executive sessions for three possible uh
legal matters.
» All right, first.
>> All in favor?
>> I
Okay, thank you. Um, holding second.
Those watching online, we will return at
7 p.m. Thank you.
All right. Uh good evening everyone uh
on Zoom and here in person. We're going
to resume our regular uh October meeting
of the local Burough Council. Uh council
did uh have executive session at 6:00.
So we did our uh call to order and uh
flag salute then and we are starting
with item five resuming public session.
Uh next items are we had our packet
reports of the director of public works
and water and sewer and when any
questions uh for administrator now be
the time.
Next uh item take us as no. Uh next um
our standing placeholder uh for updates
on our water system sales. Want to thank
everyone uh who worked on attended or
watched the uh information session in uh
September.
Reminder that the video is up online as
well as video from the other sessions uh
some other information there. So, please
visit the water website uh for uh all
the information that we have uh on the
sale and a reminder that dates coming up
um particularly
October 14th is last day to register to
vote. So, please check to make sure you
are registered to vote. Uh early voting
uh is available for the Saturday through
the Sunday more than a week uh before uh
voting. And if you're getting your vote
by mails in the mail, uh please make
sure you use it and and vote. Uh with
that then our next item is we have a
presentation by a kind of subcommittee
uh for Halloween. So uh bear with me. I
will uh try to get that up on screen and
uh Deb or Sher or Chris whoever's been
working on it. Please uh
feel free give me one second to just um
it's on the screen here but not yet.
shared on Zoom
and um I will take credit that I did
that's my pumpkin that last
um I uh you know
>> the cat is one of my kids I can't take
credit for that level of detail but
anyway um whoever like to
start Jerry whoever um the floor is
yours
>> okay thank you everyone so uh we're very
excited this year to announce the
creation of a Halloween safe zone. Um on
Friday, October 31st, um our plan is to
shut down Columbia Avenue to all
vehicular traffic for that night
starting at 5:30.
We're looking forward to having um a
pedestrian walking zone for the length
of the street and um we've obviously
made plans for emergency vehicles to
have access as needed. Um, Columbia AB,
as everybody is probably aware, is the
busiest and most popular section of town
for trick-or-treaters and their
families. Um, there's always been at
least 500 kids that come by. Um, so far
there's been no um, incidents, but we'd
like to keep all of our kids safe. Um,
so the Burough Council, we're partnering
with the Hope Recreation Committee, the
Hope Valley Police, the Fire Department
and EMS services, and the Hope Valley
Office of Emergency Management. um as
well as all the residents of Columbia
Avenue to create a fun pedestrian
walkway for that night. Um all the
details about specific cross street
closures and parking are still being
finalized in partnership with the police
and the emergency services teams. Um
we'll have multiple offices from the
police will be troll be patrolling that
night and they'll have some cars on site
and I believe there's a rumor they're
going to have some uh trunk retrieving
going on. It should be fun. Um residents
will be asked to use alternative parking
off of Columbia AB as needed and to
limit street parking and we're going to
try to make arrangements for alternate
parking if we can. Um emergency vehicles
will be have access to make calls using
Greenwood A and they'll also obviously
have access to the pedestrian only
Halloween zone uh throughout the event
as needed. Um and residents would be
allowed to exit their driveways um in
the emergency during the closure.
Um so for communications um all impacted
residents will be receiving um a mail
letter with information on closure and
process for emergency access for the
night of Halloween. Um updates and
reminders will be emailed. Uh Ryan sends
out the Burough Blast on Sunday nights
with information and the Burough website
will also be updated with information on
plans and procedures for the evening.
Um we're hoping again that families take
advantage of this pedestrian zone and
plan to spend the evening strolling down
Columbia Avenue. Um the recreation
department volunteers encourage
residents of Columbia a to decorate
their homes to rival Halloween and
nearby towns. I think we can meet
Lambertville eventually.
Let's show them what hopeful is all
about. Um I think council is planning to
having a tent um set up along the route
to give out some candy and we're hoping
everybody can walk to view the costumes
and some home uh decorations. So
hopefully we can have a fun night.
That's it.
>> Thank you. Thank the subcommittee and
administrator current and former uh Opal
Township Police Department. um R O EM um
liaison um are the P Valley merch
there's a lot of people assembled to
>> make sure this this will make sense uh
and the specific uh I believe it's both
it will be both sides Colombia on either
side of Princeton and specific
information about which roads will be
closed when will go out to to residents
um but just as a kind of a preliminary
>> yes heads up Okay, excited.
One second to stop screen share here. Uh
but our next item will be uh public
comments. Uh so I will as I fumble to
get my cursor to the stop share button
here. Um going to open the floor to um
the public. Mayor Council will take
comments first from members of the
public attending in person, then for
members of the public attending via
Zoom. If you're on Zoom, uh push the
raise hand button. Uh we're going to
limit people here uh and then for the
first of our two public comment sessions
as we usually do to five minutes or at
least try to and and no immediate action
be taken on public comment issue. Um and
uh with that I'll ask you to state your
name. No need to give you your full
address and uh feel free to address the
council.
>> Hi everyone. David Waldman prospects
east prospects for um I'm going to read
from a prepared statement. I intend to
file an action in lie of prerogative ris
to block the clerk from counting the
vote on the referendum as the language
of the referendum is misleading and does
not accurately reflect the terms of the
contract with New Jersey American Water.
Thank you for that. Um,
anyone else have any comments or person?
» Okay. H O EUI.
So um uh I have a comment just with
respect to the referendum and first and
foremost I just want to make sure that
it's clear. I'm not for or against
selling the water system. Um, so my
point is going to be a rather discreet
one, which is my concern is the contract
or the draft agreement that is out there
that the voters would be voting on in
connection with the referendum.
So
I think that
to the merits of the proposal, right? I
think there's merit to seeking debt
relief. I think it was understandable
and I think there's logical that we're
trying to address issues regarding the
costs uh both from a long-term
standpoint infrastructure as well as
costs uh currently uh borne by the
rateayers and the residents within
burough. Um I know that you've all put a
tremendous amount of time into it uh
into this project.
I think my concern is that as a voter
when I'm looking at the referendum and
then what is ultimately as a lawyer
right who does this for a living what is
the agreement ultimately going to be
between the burrow and New Jersey
American water. So I read, you know,
it's 117 page document and I reviewed it
as a lawyer would and I have some
concerns. The first and foremost concern
is that it's a draft agreement. Now, if
I was drafting this, the very simple
remedy to that is you draft and execute
a a contract that has a contingency
clause that says in the event that the
referendum passes the you know the
document becomes self-executing and if
the referendum fails then the contract
automatically terminates. It's not a
complicated provision. I'm not entirely
clear why such a provision wouldn't be
in it because the concern I then have is
as a draft agreement. What's not clear
to me is is the referendum then advisory
or is it then binding? Right? Because
the agreement as a draft agreement could
be modified after the referendum and as
a voter that's concerning because I
would want to know ultimately what are
the final terms of the deal.
Let's assume presumptively that this is
the final deal. Well, then there are a
couple representations that are being
made that I don't see reflected in the
agreement. First and foremost, people
are saying we're going to, you know,
most people are going to save money.
I think and I'm not saying that it
hadn't been attempted but what would be
better from my perspective is is that I
don't see a reason why there wouldn't be
a moratorum on rate increases rather
than deferring to New Jersey American
water and the BPU in making
determinations as to whether or not
rates would increase. We have the asset
that they want. So why aren't we
guaranteeing that everyone in the burrow
has a moratorum at a minimum or a rate
reduction for at least a few years?
Because under the contract as drafted,
it is entirely possible that as soon as
the ink is dry
that they're going to the BPU and
seeking rate increases,
there is nothing in the contract that
precludes them from doing that. and is
nothing as a result of the request for
the rate increase. We would be relying
on the BPU in hopes that the BPU
approval of a rate increase isn't in
excess of what people are already
paying. And that even assumes that
everyone under the current recalculation
New Jersey American Water would actually
see their rates go down. And I haven't
seen any assurances that in fact that is
the case across the board for everyone.
The other point I want to raise has to
do with capital improvements.
It is an undefined term in a contract.
So, not only is it an undefined term,
that makes it ambiguous.
And as a taxpayer, my concern is that
when you have an ambiguity in the
contract and there is ultimately a
dispute between the parties, that
requires then litigation. in this case,
arbitration, which can be very expensive
because you're paying the arbitrator as
well as paying your attorney and the
people who pay for those legal fees and
the arbitrator
are the rateayers, i.e. the residents in
this township in this municipality.
So, with that, I guess the the point I
want to make is that if we're asking
them and they're agreeing to make $7
million worth of improvement and they're
willing to do it within five years,
those capital improvements should be
enumerated, right? because I don't want
them repainting a couple sheds and
replacing a couple shingles
after a contract with a friend of theirs
and then turn around calling that $7
million worth of capital improvements
and then washing their hands and saying
that they're done.
So from an enforcability standpoint, it
would be prudent that the capital
improvements
be enumerated in a contract in an
appendix.
Um and then
just want to make sure
one other
not going to stop you
>> and then I think so um as well as the
fact that the other undefined is that
there's there's reference to a
comprehensive analysis of the system and
I think like again that ought to be a
defined term so that the parties know
exactly what we're referring to when
we're talking about capital improvement.
The last is an enforcement mechanism.
Currently, under the contract, the only
remedy would be to go to arbitration.
>> There is no oversight provision, meaning
when the capital improvements are made,
there's no opportunity for an
independent inspection and approval by
the burrow.
Give you an easy example. When I built
my house, I had the contract. The
contractor built it. We had a contract.
There were certain provisions, but I
still had my own independent inspector
going in and inspecting the work to make
sure it was getting done because I don't
have that expertise,
right? So, the contract doesn't allow
for that. And in the event that there is
a breach, either they've got to fix it
or let's say hypothetically rates do go
up astronomically over the next 10
years. you do or you could negotiate
what's called a right of revision,
right? Reversion, which means in
property that you get the asset back and
then there are certain conditions you
have to meet as well. But in the event
that certain events don't happen as
expected. So in other words, let's say
hypothetically in 10 years rates go
through the roof, right? or capital
expenses go through the roof and they're
like economically we can't make these,
you know, we can't make these
improvements. Well, then we would have
the potential if we wanted to then step
back in and say, "Okay, well then we're
going to take the the system back. We'll
treat your capital improvements as a
loan and we'll just repay you at a
reduced rate over time."
What I'm saying is is there are creative
ways in which to make sure the things
that were that are being claimed are
supposed to happen actually happen and
that there are viable remedies.
>> But in short, I think the point is is
>> I think there could ought to be a
moratorum on rate increases. If that's
the promise they're making, they should
be able to stand behind it in a written
agreement that would be enforceable by
law. Capital improvements should be
enumerated and we should have the
ability for an independent inspection to
oversee this.
>> I see.
>> So, thank you very much. I appreciate
the time and the work they put in on the
issue.
>> So, some of those things we can try and
address a little bit. We have one of our
attorneys from the transaction. We don't
have our special outside counsel uh for
this um here tonight. So, some of these
things might be good for a followup. Um
the first one though and Lisa um stop me
when I stray from reality here but uh
just the process under whip for a
contract dictates that we do it this
way. Uh rather than signing it um it
goes as a draft to the board of public
utilities to be approved by them in this
form and under the statute it cannot be
executed or signed until the referendum.
uh was a just a statutory process uh
underwater infrastructure protection act
that dictates it it's done this way. Um
it's not a traditional draft. I guess I
want to add to that.
>> It's not really a draft any longer
because the BPU actually issued an order
approving this form of agreement. So if
the referendum goes through, this
agreement will be signed as it's done
>> without the draft on. So it's it's
different than know while it is unsigned
like a traditional draft would be and I
found this uh honestly as the person who
posts these things to the website
particularly confusing because I wanted
to find the signed one uh to include and
uh um so that that's
>> right but it has it's it is in final
form because the BPU has has essentially
found it to be acceptable to the BPU and we're locked in if if the referendum
goes This is the agreement that would be
signed.
>> So, just to be clear, the reason it's
titled draft is because there's a
referendum
>> and also because of the B. Yes. Right.
Well, it would have been draft even if
it if there was no referendum, it would
have been draft until the BPU approved
it.
>> Yeah. But because there's a referendum
as well, it can't be signed because and
I and I understand the points being
made.
But this is just the process.
>> I just want to be clear that it isn't
drafted in that like it can then change
the
>> right it it it it can't because because
of the VPU. The BPU has said basically
this is ex this is it. This is this is
what they've approved
>> and yeah that's that's it. And that
includes all of the um rate schedules
and tariff references that are in like
the approval was specifically rate
schedules that would apply which are
regional rate schedules not specific.
>> Exactly. Nothing is specific to the
bureau because it can't be
>> right.
>> It it it's the the regional uh
>> the rate action under the contract that
they have to deliver to us is to put us
to charge our residents. be schedule one
a tariff rate that Princeton or
Montgomery or that those other
municipalities
>> and the only schedules that are
referenced. Exactly. And then the only
those rates would change would be by
petitioning BP to change the rates for
the
>> the entire region
>> service areas that are served under
those tariffs,
>> right? They can't just say we want to
recoup the money that we are paying
from the burrow specifically and we're
going to raise the burrow's rates.
That's not the way it works. It's just
that's that's not legally the way that
the system works. If it would have to be
part of their next rate case and it
would be any increase would be
applicable across the board to the
entire region.
And I guess also um to rates um in many
other sales or municipalities rates were
largely lower than the tariff rates,
lower than the schedule that BPU had
that would be applicable. One of the
things that's negotiated is a phase in
or a moratorum of waiting until they
would catch up essentially to keep the
lower rates. Um here the I guess the
desire was to get to that largely lower
tariff schedule you know immediately
rather than delay and then once that
happens there's not really ability to
>> right
>> be different than the than the tariffs
>> right because you're in a very different
posture than most municipalities or most
municipalities that are selling their
rates are actually lower than the tariff
Right. So they want to maintain that and
there is a I there is a mechanism to do
that.
We know that because it's been done but
you guys are unique because your rates
are so much higher. So you want the the
tariff rates
>> and I don't think there's a mechanism to
go lower in in that instance.
Unfortunately, that's that was never
>> and of the um
I want to prejudge what was discussed or
maybe you know negotiate a bit or what
some of the other biders suggested but
to to Keith's point there are a group of
users um whose the tariff rate is um
high uh you know like the smallest users
in the municipality I think would be
about $11 a month more if they would
pay. um we I guess conceivably could
have negotiated with them or maybe even
did but ended up somewhere else with
maybe a delay in those rates catching
up. But ultimately, I think the position
the bro took was of the $1.2ish twoish
million dollars of savings a year that
the cumulative David is right about
$10,000
um if you added up all of the increases
at the at the lower end um can be made
up by an adjustment to the sewer fee. So
in aggregate
you take people that were at 1,000 2,000
3,000 and 4,000 gallons per quarter
5,000 and up are actually less
expensive. Um, and the largest
difference between what you would pay
under New Jersey American Hobo is for a
user of 2,000 gallons. All the other
users in that lower category, the
difference is less, but the largest is
that roughly $11 a month. But if you add
up the number of users is based on 24
data in each of those categories times
the difference in cost it adds up to
$10,100 for the whole which is easily
absorbed through our so if we want to
for example make an adjustment for sewer
rate
it's it would be something we could use
the and and in the September 11th and
the May presentation there was some
discussion this something that the
bureau could dedicate some of that
million dollars of debt relief savings
boards adjusting it to make sure that doesn't happen for for those few
>> also our understanding that I I don't
think you could I think it was all or
nothing with the rates so you couldn't
>> I don't think you could they could
change the rate for one class
>> right I mean I think because you're working on a regional tariff I
mean the whole idea was to make sure
that you know we're essentially paying
the same rates as Princeton Township and
all the other counties around us
>> which are less for all but a few. And
again, the only reason that we have
anybody that would be paying more is
because we've been subsidizing rates for
low volume users and charging more to
our higher volume users. We have that's
the way we do. But the interesting thing
about it is so this this threshold of 0
to 2,000 gallons
a fixed rate for our sewer rates. The
fixed rate is everything up to 10,000
gallons. So, the thing is, if you're
using 2,000 gallons of water per
quarter, you're paying the same amount
for your sewer. It's about $92 as as
somebody who's using 8,000 or 10,000
gallons. Um, and that's actually
something that we, you know, would have
to change. I mean, if we kept the
system, we would really have to
harmonize that because I think people,
in other words, you can offset, you can
adjust the rate structure within our
super charges and and that $10,000 and
suddenly you have a fairer system. It's
just that honestly the water system
rates have been always the thing that we
were focusing all our attention on
because the sewer collection system and
the economics of it were always strong.
or not, we weren't having trouble
carrying it financially. Um, but so does
flexibility. Um I think keep amongst
many other excellent points that you've
made and often make in the course of
just you being you um the the keell uh
pieces is interesting um and u part of
that you know and again without
prejudicing the discussions that we had
to get to this contract and I think I'd
like to get a little bit more support
maybe with a follow-up answer from the
other attorneys that worked on this. Um
but one was a function of um the type of
work that they would need to do. Um if
uh for example uh us insisting on an
immediate reservoir replacement that may
not be necessary if they are able to
serve the burrow predominantly through
water through their interconnection. And
uh the list that we have of what the
burrow will do if we maintain ownership
is based on how we'll run the the
system. Um and we went back and forth
about you know attempting to you know
impose that on them and ultimately
settle on that mechanism uh where they
would study it interestingly after
closing um and and come up with their
own plan. Um it's also um and again I'll
want some more backup from this from our
professionals because we have you know
it's been a year or so since we looked
at this particular parts of the contract
but um their obligations kind of have to
be looked at in in conjunction with the regulatory scheme that governs them
as a as a public utility and the whip of
process. So some of the items
um that they uh
would consider doing as capital repairs
that might uh not satisfy us locally. um
additionally wouldn't satisfy BPU for
them ever being getting approval for
doing the work or perhaps getting uh um
you know the way that a public utility
makes money is by doing work and uh
frankly getting a rate of return for
that uh that they've spread across the
state of New Jersey. So they wouldn't
economically um be incentivized to do
something that will not count as far as
the state is concerned as a as a capital
repair that you know passes muster. So
that's it's it's a little just but but
what you're saying is is important
because if you look at like a base rate
filing or actually if you look at the um
foundation filings that go with their um
distribution system improvement charge
which is a has to do with capital
investment they actually have to
document and account for all the capital
work that they've done up to that point
and do all the math on how that should
be distributed. Um the other thing is uh
and I'll just mention out of that let's
say $7 million there are certain
elements of it that are really
mandatory. One is the lead service line
replacement. So that has to happen by
July 31st. I'm sorry July 22nd of 2031.
Everybody has to do that. We would have
to do it. They would have to do it. Um
our estimate of the cost to us if you
were just to break that out was about
1.2 million. But um a big part of that
is actually replacing the both the
publicly owned uh lead boost and the
services along Broad Street which are
all connected to the Broad Street main.
And so in our capital uh plan I mean
it's 4.8 million total for Broad Street.
Basically you're not going to replace
the lead service lines without replacing
the main and the valves and everything
else it's attached to because it's all
ancient. And so they would I mean just
out of necessity they would replace
those mains which is one of our top
priority projects. But to Ryan's point
um we would put in an 8 in man which
would be a direct replacement white for what we have. Um if you New
Jersey American were to buy a place they
may have for other reasons having to do
with such a larger diameter man. So the
point is we're not in a position to
mandate the actual specifications for
the things that are done. Um, another
thing is that um, they are perhaps more
strictly held accountable by the D for
other regulatory things than a small
system like bars. So, for example, if
you've had a lot of unaccounted for
water from leakage from ms, um, they
have to address that. It's not something
they can just look the other way. It's
also a source of loss of revenue for
them because water is going into the
ground. So there are things economically
that are drivers toward uh fixing a lot
of the main and and again on our list of
priority projects also replacing for
example valves that we are having
trouble opening and closing whenever we
have to make repair. So in terms of
their daily operations and the practical
aspects of running a system they would
really have to do that stuff. They have
to make sure that the fire hyens are
operational and that any ones that are,
you know, have a potential for freezing
are replaced and and those are
requirements that they have. There's
rules, I'm sure, somewhere in terms of,
you know, at maintaining adequate fire
protection and pressure. So there
there's a lot of stuff that's baked in
there in the regulatory side and I can't
attest to all of it because I'm an
expert on this, but I spent a little
time looking at it that they would have
to do. There things that we have to do.
Um but uh and again the point about the
reservoir I mean if if we were going to
replace a reservoir we'd probably
replace it with a 300,000gallon tank.
They were going to replace the reservoir
it might be a larger tank or they might
decide that in fact they don't really
need it because they have a 1 and a half
million gallon tank in corner. So there
are when they say they're going to do a
comprehensive analysis engineering
analysis of the system
um I think that's that's what that's
about is how does the bureau are
currently our water system fit into
their system and and what are the
investments they would make. So again,
you know, there may be things that
they're going to do differently uh from
what we would do if we were simply
trying to maintain and preserve our
isolated.
Let me just one more thing like you. I'm not a utilities attorney. We do have
one, especially we're in this. So I
think a lot of what you've asked, we
we're here trying to answer it. I think
some of the stuff will connect with our
regular outside counsel and special
outside counsel.
I think some of the things particularly
on the the capital things the
enforcement um how that works with the
regulatory scheme because we really in
my mind can't just look at the contract
in itself outside of of the BPU and
regulation and the the whip stuff but
we'll task our people with you know
getting uh some better understanding uh
for you and we'll get you an answer on
that and perhaps it' be a good thing to
put out as a you know we do get
questions from time to time that make it
into frequently asked questions. I don't
know if this is yet frequently, but it's
a good one to be asked once. So, I think
they can make the list even without
asked a second time. Um, but that might
be the beyond, you know, the ability of
us as lay people to answer the point.
Might be we might be at that. Um, but we
have um you know, special outside
counsel who did this and negotiated for
us and we'll task them with
>> providing more information.
>> Right.
>> Yeah. And this isn't just a simple
contract between two parties. It's a
contract really with
>> three parties
>> or four even. You mean you have the DCA
as well, right? You have the BPU. It's
extremely complicated uh situation where
you're under the jurisdiction of the BPU
and DCA but most of the BPU forever. So,
it's not like the BPU walks away. This
is absolutely under the jurisdiction for
all time. And it's it's not a simple,
you know, we're just selling it to some
private organization. It's it's much heavier than that. Much much more
significant than that.
>> And NJT never walks away either.
>> No, absolutely not. So, but uh yeah, I
mean these issues were all I mean we
don't have to get into all the specifics
now because we can can do it in a in a
way that hopefully
>> answers everybody's questions in a multi
way. Excellent questions and comments
there and um I've got your contact
information I think but we'll as we have
the answer we'll let you know directly
and then get it out because that's I
think of general interest um as well.
Thanks.
>> Um
online please you want to push the
raised hand button that will be the good
time for that.
Um seeing none I'll take a motion to
close the first of our two public
comment. Oh, okay.
» Hi, Tom Man 59 North Greenwood. Um, just
a comment and then a question. I was
actually really disappointed when I got
the mailing from or I don't know if it
was the door hanger or the email from
New J's American Water with the
endorsement of the council members.
>> I think that was I'm not saying it was
illegal, but I think it was really
inappropriate. Um it's a complicated
situation because your um
well-intentioned and good idea about how
to fix the system happens to align with
the large corporations. And so that's a
legitimate position to have. But I think
it's really
would have been a lot better if we
didn't the citizens of this bureau
didn't see you what looks like shilling
for the corporation. So I think on that
level it was inappropriate and again I
wish you hadn't done it. And on another
level, it also seems to be problematic
that as political people with brands in
the community, you were essentially
getting advertising as by New Jersey
American Water, you had they they sent
your name to everybody in the bureau as
people who are, you know, working the
problem. And that's, you know, a good
thing to be working the problem. But I
don't think it's a really good idea to
have a large corporation,
you know, sort of um supporting your
sort of political brand. So I think I
would urge the bur to think really
carefully about doing that sort of
thing. It was a really bad look from my my perspective. And so then the
follow question is when did you those
burough council members that signed on
to this who agree to this? When and
could you sort of just take we take us a
bit behind the scenes how you came to
whatever arrangement you came to with
New Jersey American Water to get your
names on those pieces of paper and when
did that happen and was it their idea or
was it your idea? Did you say to New
Jersey American Water, you know, it
would be a really good idea if we had
our names on this brochure, or did they
come to you and say, you know, it would
be a really good idea if you did this it
just I just have the feeling that this
relationship
has gone from strictly business to one
of sort of partnership and advocacy in a
way that um will be best to sort of at
least keep under keep under wraps. So, I guess I'll just say um
it is the right and duty of everyone in
this community, including and especially
those elected officials to advocate for
what they think is best.
>> Agreed. And I thought your letter today,
the letter that I thought was perfect.
>> And and
>> but there's the other thing that the
other guys paid for that's not your
that's not it's not entirely your
advocacy. It is also New Jersey American
Waters advocacy.
>> You're you're correct. And they they pay
for that and they disclose and who paid
for that and
>> and they well okay
>> and I I'll I'll say anyone who's asked
me if I support this I'll tell them that
I do
>> including them
and um I'm happy to help anyone who
would like to know my position um hear
what it is. I don't let anyone else
speak to that point.
>> I just do briefly Tom. Um so from my
perspective I was careful not to engage
in anything.
Basically that that endorsement was
something that came in very late in the
game and I really wanted to make sure
that we got at least through that
September 11 presentation
uh if I was going to take a public
position on you know yes or no at all. I
mean, I've spent so much time digging
into the facts, trying to do the
analysis, trying to present everything
that we know. I didn't want to even
offer an opinion on I mean, people may
think that I have just because of how
the presentations are, but but I have.
Um, but at some point, I think it is
important,
at least for us on the water committee,
to say this is what we think is best for
the community. And as you say, there are
different ways of doing that. Um, and I
was asked if I would agree to, you know,
an endorsement or, you know,
>> by whom were you asked,
>> pardon?
>> Oh, American. No, they wanted to know if
I would add my name to the list of
people that endorsed it. And I thought
about it very carefully. Um, and I I
said I would only be willing to do that
after the September 11 presentation
because I didn't want anything to, you
know, cloud that. And I and I I kind of
struggle with it because I, you know,
I I like to just speak for myself. I
don't like to have anybody else. As far
as my brand, I don't think of myself as
having a brand. And whatever it is, my
brand's over in two months because I'm
not in office anymore. But I and I
understand your discomfort with it. And
I I thought about it. I struggled with
it a little. And then I just thought,
you know, at some point I have to say,
what do I think is best for the
community? and this was just another
vehicle for doing that. That's the way I
thought about it. Um, and so, uh, I
wrote an endorsement. They the actual
endorsement that they put, I think,
somewhere on their their social media,
which I don't have, was something that I
wrote. It wasn't something that they
told me to say. It's what I believe. Um,
and um, that that was the decision I
made. That's that's that's the best
explanation I can give you. It was very
blatantly gay.
>> All right. Well, I just just expressing
a level of discomfort at it. And again,
I don't you any of the decisions we've
made and really this is really about the
process and about what I feel is the
inappropriate sort of
>> I mean American they're they're a big
company. They're going to do okay. I
don't think they need to help so much.
Okay. Thank you.
>> Can I just say one one thing? It it you
know I understand the concerns raised
but it's very important that it was it
it's not it was not a council
endorsement.
>> That's right.
>> Absolutely not. It was not a necessarily
going to say members of the council that
may be endorsing
>> right and they right but
>> yeah mayor too I endorse them
>> right but it's import I mean all I'm
saying is it's very important that they
don't lose their first amendment rights
either so if if if they want to
>> do they being the council or the
>> individuals the individual it's it was
not a council endorsement it's it's the
individuals that are that made those
decisions to to be part of that
endorsement and they spoke as members of
the community, not on behalf of council.
>> They were identified as council members
for what it's worth. And we all knew
they're council,
>> right? And that's exactly right. You
can't and I'm just, you know, it's not
splitting hairs. It's it's a really
important um legal distinction. That's
>> And just to add, I mean, for what I
mean, we we always sought your counsel.
>> Yes. That's Yes. And we had a lot of
discussion with a lot of people, you
know. What are the guardrails legal and
otherwise and making sure that we stay
>> and there are a lot of guards
>> and there are a lot of guard rails on
right advocacy you know the council
cannot
>> advocate you know as a as a as a body
>> right
>> u because it adopted an ordinance
>> that that has the ballot question it's
just it it's it's not what council is
supposed to do. However, and and we
looked at a lot of other communities and
talked to a lot of lawyers and and
really did look at this issue very
carefully and um you know the council
members are not just uh sitting there
saying you have to do this because it's
they're in they're acting in their
individual capacities and they're they
are supporting their positions with with
factual information. So they're not
trying to mislead people and I mean you
may have an opinion about that. People
may have an opinion about that, but
they're they're within the confines of
law. And again, this was vetted by many
people.
>> Mayor, if I may, and I'm brand new to
this, so bear with me, but but having
been involved in other referendums and
other
loces,
it's absolutely correct in that it was
not a council endorsement. I mean, I
haven't seen seen the documents, but
you'd have to pass a resolution. you'd
have to go through the whole process.
So, while I respect the the question and
I understand the the certainly
understand his concern, you you have you
don't vacate your first amendment rights
by sitting up there.
Uh, I know there's obviously a different
maybe a difference of opinion, but I I
really do agree that that uh the very
fact that you put your name as a
councilman or mayor or council person uh
does does not mean that this is a
council decision or council endorsement
in any way. I don't think any court
would say so.
Got uh one person online. I will uh
spawn over
» unmute and turn your video on and
identify yourself. I believe we can
hear you here in the in the courtroom.
>> You can
we'll have a second bullet comment if
you want to try then just uh
we've
promoted you.
>> Shoot. Okay. Sorry. Uh,
>> oh, sorry. Do you want me to wait? Do
you want me to wait?
>> No, no, no. I just we you had to turn
your camera or unmuted yourself, so
you're you're
>> I was trying. I was trying. It just
didn't for whatever reasons it wasn't
doing it. Um, I just wanted to I just
Thank you um for letting me uh join. And
I just wanted to address the last point
which was that um I think I think it's
important to take into account the
particular
um community that we live in which is
quite small as we know. So there in
terms of
council members promoting the sale,
um, borrow residents have seen them
doing this um, over and over and over
again. Okay. So I don't think we can
just dismiss this. I think a credential
sort of assessment would say that yes,
our council is absolutely promoting this
sale and they're doing it in a lot of
different ways. They're using American
water um publicity that borrow residents
are paying for actually because we
currently get some what some of our
water from American water. So whether or
not we want to be paying for these
advertisements, we are paying for it.
Which is goes to the point of, you know,
when we go into this system of American
water, we pay for their
um, you know, trying to buy another
community's water system. So I think we
need to recognize that that needs to be
noted that this is not just a simple
like there are residents here who are
talking about just being residents. They
are council members. Everybody in this
1900 less or more town knows who council
members are and they see quite clearly
that they're promoting this sale. So,
you know, you
this is this is not something that we
can just brush over. This is a thing
that is a problem. And I that's what I
have to say about that. So, thank you
for letting me do.
>> Thank you. Um, one thing I'll just note,
you know, because we did
talk to him and check with our uh expert
on this. Um, hold on. Let me uh figure
out how to
bring you back. Um
sorry, hard to be the mayor and the Zoom
uh artisan uh at the same time. So,
apologies. Um one um you know, one note
um New Jersey American has never and we
checked um recovered any funds that they
spent on um advertising for referendum.
uh they've never asked BPU for it.
They've never been approved for it. Um
it is true that their just like with
capital repairs, their mechanism is to
um uh seek what they call recovery. Um
and to have uh the board of public
utilities allow them to be paid back
from the rateayers. Um that is one that
they have never um either through lack
of being permitted to or never asking.
Uh I guess I didn't ask them that much,
but they have never uh so for example,
South Orange um or these other
communities where they have spend their
shareholders money for um advocacy um
that has never been um returned uh to
them uh from BPU uh as as rateayers. Uh
we we we checked into that. Um um and
again, I I
may not it's okay to not like what some
members of council or myself are saying.
Um, I certainly recognize that.
>> No, I I I think I I I excuse me. I just
want to clarify that what I'm what I'm
what my what my issue is is that in the
last comment, you know, commentary, it
was that our council is not as council
officials promoting the sale and they
absolutely are. Everybody knows they
are. So, I mean, can we just not pretend
that this isn't happening? They they
are. Our council officials are promoting
some of them are promoting this sale and
they're going and talking to to
businesses. They're going and talking to
residents. They're going and they're
going and talking to them to tell them
to vote yes on this sale. I don't know
legally what that means, but I don't
like it. Okay. So, that's all I can tell
you.
>> Thank you. I'm going to take the
opportunity to ask the attorneys that
have given us advice on that to just
confirm once again uh that that is uh
100% u permissible for elected officials
to do.
>> Not only do I do I think it's
permissible, I think there's a certain
obligation under your positions to voice
your your position on this. This is
>> not not to advocate. They can voice
their position.
>> They cannot advocate and that is what
they've been doing.
>> They have been advocating
>> publicly and unpublicly. They've been
doing it and let's just be honest about
this.
>> Okay,
>> let's just be honest about it.
>> Um, thank you. I've muted you. Um um I
will be totally honest with it that yes
I am advocating for the sale. There are
members that this up to them
individually whether they are or not. It
is both under our um requirements
ethically um and right to do so. And
I'll be honest with you, you may not
like it. You don't like what I have to
say about the sale. I'm going to
continue to do that. Um that is what I
feel my job is as the mayor. If there's
something that I think is the uh best
thing for the burrow, that is what I'm
going to do. I will not use burrow funds
to do so. The case law on it is very
specific. That is the line. Other towns
um have done that. If you would have
gone to a presentation in South Orange,
it would have ended saying, "Please vote
yes." We're not doing that here.
Um again, if there's anything else our
attorneys like to add, I want to be
clear. It's I'm not hiding that I'm
advocating for the sale. I'm just
>> You are using your role as mayor
>> to promote this.
>> I'm advocating for it, too.
>> Thank you. I'm Again, I I'm No one's No
one is denying that. I I think you you
seem to think that that makes it
unethical or illegal. Uh the advice that
we're getting it is it does not.
>> Yeah, I do. I do. And I think all of the
other I think all of the other council
members doing this is also unethical.
>> And
We need to look at that. You know there
I don't see why you think you can act in
an autocratic way. I don't see why you
think you can do that. Why do you think
you can do that?
>> Answer me with that please.
>> Well let me start and then um I much
appreciate your time here. um um one um
the advice we've received from our legal
professionals um and that's based on a
Supreme Court case um in New Jersey that
says it's not just our right but it is
our duty to advocate for for such a
thing. So that that is what I base it on
for me and I I see I'm sorry that the
room can't see you rolling your eyes but
that is the advice we receive and uh the
guidance we've gotten from the New
Jersey Supreme Court. Um I I would if
you have something to the contrary um I please um
>> we didn't elect you we didn't elect you
to act in an autocratic fashion and
that's what you've been doing since you
started the whipa process that's what
you've been doing you're not listening
to residents you are not listening you
are not working with us okay
>> that's a fact that is a fact
>> I will thank you and and again encourage
you and your group to please send me the
us the slides that we've asked for from
your presentation and give us some dates
for the
>> We had a meeting. We had a meeting. You
were there.
>> Thank you.
>> And I'm also happy to to speak for
myself as an elected official. I and I'm
speaking for myself.
I think it is my obligation. I to to be
transparent
with voters of what I think you elected
me to do this job and it would be I
think a der election of my duty to say
I'm just neutral. You guys can do
whatever you want. It's such a
complicated situation. I don't expect
you to sit through the hours of meetings
that I've sat through to learn
everything about this. I think it's my
duty to synthesize that and say to you
here's what I have decided based on the
financial situation based on all this
the the the possible viable scenarios
and and I'm asked constantly well what
do you think and so for me to not answer
that I think is
an an odd position to take as an elected
official that that I'm just leaving it
up to you and as much as I would like to
follow you all into the voting booth I
cannot at the end of the day, you get to
make your own vote,
>> right?
>> So, it's it's not an autocratic thing.
It's it's my my duty as the person you
elected to represent you to make these
decisions for myself and to let you know
how I came to my decision. I mean, Mayor
Kennedy's administration focused a lot
on transparency.
That timer has gone off every public
session we've ever had, and we've never
stopped it.
Not one time. One time. I mean, so so
for us to say we're not listening to
people. Uh I I schedule I don't know how
many coffee talks. No one comes.
>> No one comes to them. I'm happy to talk
to everyone. So I'm left to have to post
on the only place that I think people
are paying attention, which is Facebook.
>> Y
>> we can talk about Facebook, but for
whatever reason, that is our community
forum.
And it has not been a pretty place
lately, but it's the only place I feel
like I can get a conver or you know put
facts out to people who aren't who thank
you the people who come here to this
meeting. But unfortunately that's the
reality. So that that's what we're left
with and then Facebook becomes a place
that gets very contentious. So,
I I I'm I'm feeling frustrated because I feel like we've done everything we can
to get people's uh attention, to get all
the information out there. We've asked
countless times to meet with people of
every way, shape, and form, and and here
we are. So, once again, it's up to every
individual voter. Uh, I just think it's
my obligation as your council person to
let you know everything that I know and
what has uh informed my decision.
>> I'll just add I think it's curious to
suggest that we're acting autocratically
with respect to a referendum.
That's all I'm going to say.
>> Um Ethan um you're next. You want to
unmute yourself and and speak?
>> Yes, absolutely. I uh can you guys hear
me?
>> Yes.
>> Um I just felt like I had to just give a
little bit of a a counterbalance to
whatever this I think
>> a public well state your full full name.
We don't
>> Sure. Sure. Ethan Unic um Rhett Burough
resident. Um yeah, I just felt like I
had to just sort of put a little bit of
a um a balancing perspective on this on
this kind of line of questioning which
to me seems pretty absurd. I I don't
understand at any level of government
why someone would have the expectation
that uh a policy maker uh or or elected
representative, a public servant
shouldn't have an opinion and voice that
opinion on on policy. You don't expect
that at a county level, at a state
level, at a federal level. And um these
criticisms don't feel to me constructive
because what's the alternative? I mean,
what are you guys supposed to do? Just,
you know, keep your keep your mouth shut
and say nothing? I mean, you're you're
working for free. your elected
representatives. So, I uh just want to
voice my my displeasure, my
disappointment at that at that line of
criticism because I just don't see it to
be a constructive one. Uh I see you guys
working a ton of hours uh volunteering
your time away from your your families
and as as Sher said, you know, always
maintaining decorum in these council
meetings even when things get heated.
So, um I I just have to make that public
comment and voice my approval of what
you guys do and uh the heavy um burden
that you have of of weighing these
decisions and then coming out with
informed uh public opinions on them. So,
thank you.
>> I think next um when we get back in, we
can we can circle back. Um there's still
one more person online. Um um EK, I'm
going to promote you. He'll be next. And
Ethan, I will try to
>> demote you back to an attendee.
>> Thank you.
» Try that again.
Um, EK online, you should get a um There
we go.
If you want to turn your camera on and
unmute yourself, you are
the time to do that.
» Sorry, EK. We don't know your full name,
but uh you you're been promoted to a
panelist. We can at least see that
you're online and um if you unmute
yourself and turn your camera on, we
should be able to hear you. Uh Ed Hall,
» he's saying, "Sorry, I'm having
technical issues."
>> Okay.
>> All right. Uh no worries. Um we'll we'll
there's another opportunity. Um we can
try you again uh later. Um if you'd
like. Um, I do the chat is way around
the room. I do see that you're having
some technical problems. All right. Um,
thank you. Um, I don't see anyone else
online. Uh, Keith, if you have a follow,
you feel free to come up.
» Still in the same place I did.
So I think and I'm going to try to
reframe the first amendment question of
the issue right is
um that
justice Brand I said right in democracy
the most important job is that of
citizen I would very much expect and I
would hope and I could want my council
to make known their views. I think
Facebook for all of its limitations has
been incredibly valuable around this and
other issues, right? Like I would like
to know and not everyone can make the
these meetings. So so knowing your
positions is incredibly valuable. Um I
think the as I understood sort of the
concern which I also shared is that when
a position is sponsored and the
advertisement of that position is
sponsored um in connection with that of
an elected official as opposed to right
I'm not saying that anyone of you can go
on Facebook and state your position
That's exactly where I would want it. A
letter to my house like Mayor Kenny did.
Highly appropriate whether I agree,
disagree, content neutral comes to my
house. Perfect. Not an issue. It's when
a corporation that has a vested interest
on an issue that is subject to elect
then has the name of individuals on the
council some of whom are up for election
is then sent to my house or hung on my
door then has a different connotation
than simply the post on Facebook or the
letter right because at that point then
you then that marry the two which are
otherwise obvious alignment issues. So I
think the concern is is whether it may
be legal right is different than the
impression or the feeling it leaves
among residents. So as I understood it
the concern is while maybe technically
legal as many things are technically
legal doesn't at the end of the day
that it leaves the residents feeling
comfortable. And here in the burrow, I
think the goal and the hope is that our
elected officials aren't simply doing
what is at the bare minimum legal, but
are actually striving for a higher
standard. So, I'm not saying I'm not
speaking to the legality. I'm just
simply trying to reframe the issue. I'm
not talking about autocracy. on. I'm
simply saying is I want to know your
opinions. I think it's appropriate. I
think just the issue as I see it here
was that the attachment between the
corporation and the individuals
particularly when they have some of the
individuals because they're not saying
Joe Schmo is supporting, right? They're
not saying, you know, Keith Hubby is
supporting or not or opposing. What
they're saying is that the elected
officials and tying that to the
corporation that's back in the um
leafleting and election. So, but again I
may be mistaken.
» Thank you very much for that.
But it's not about the right of the
council to speak.
>> Sorry.
I'm I'm not interrupting you because I
don't want you to speak and there are
people watching online that won't be
able to hear you and and I I want to
>> maintain some type of organization for
the meeting in the room.
>> So anyway, I appreciate your clarity on
the issues. I appreciate you letting me
know. I'm just simply how do you need
New Jersey American water that's helping
understood
and uh
do one last check
online. I'm
not
uh seeing anyone. Okay, EK, your hand is
still up. If you could lower it and
raise it again if you'd like to be
recognized. You want to give this
another try?
Okay, we will give it another go.
» I'm so sorry. Can you hear me now?
>> We can. Can't see you though. If you
could try your your camera, that'd be
>> gonna try it. But I
Let me see if it if it lets me do this
here. Oh, okay. Great.
>> Just your name and uh please uh make
your question.
>> Um my name is Alyssa Cap. Um I'm I'm
just with a quick clarification
question. Um I appreciate the
clarification earlier that the um any
arrays of rates would require the uh BPU
to um to approve that. Um but does that
include things like fees, delivery fees,
service fees, things like that? Is that
something that the BPU would still have
full jurisdiction over or is this
something that the uh private company
could decide to change or add new fees
or anything like that? I understand that it we have to be kind of discreet
about the um the language that we're
using and I know that rates has been
used specifically here and I'm curious
as to why that is. Uh thank you very
much.
>> That's a that's an excellent question.
Um I'll do my best uh to start and let
as I always do other people correct me
when I stumble um or or pick up. So, we
use the word rate usually pretty
generically uh to mean everything that
someone would pay to a regulated um uh
entity like New Jersey American. So, in
this case
>> or us Yes. Uh it has multiple
components. Our rate is not simple
because it's tiered, but it's really
just a a base fee and um amount of
water. Uh regulated public utilities do
it differently where there are lots of
things that all add up to a number. So,
example, um the example I use, I guess
just myself personally, you know, I use
12,000 gallons of water. um based if you
add up all of those fees which when I
say rate that's what I mean which is a
base rate plus the lead service fee plus
um several other fees whether those are
also rates but they make up one thing
that I refer to as as a rate that would
come out to $781
I believe for um as if you go to the
schedule with the or tariff which is
where these rates are filed and after
that they're approved by the board of
public utilities. It is a document that
lists these things. Um what they all are
um and uh my understanding is that no um
uh the company can't just change them.
They have to go through a process with
the state and the board of public
utilities to if they are going to change
to request them um and have them then
published in this document called a
tariff and then that becomes the rate
that is is paid. So the the the numbers
that I use um or when I say rate I I
mean all of those things added together
some of them are big like the thing for
the water component and some of them are
really kind of small like lead service I
think for that person it's like $40 a
year or something like that. Um and uh
but they all go into what I consider a
rate and what I refer to it and I think
what the burrow does it includes all of
those things. Right.
>> Can I just say thank you for paying the
cat tax?
>> Yeah I
very cute Chinese
adorable. Um, and just I'm sort of
saying the same thing, but in other
words, so if you look at that the
tariff, which is the big document that
has all of the rates in it. So there's a
whole series of rate schedules, right?
And as as Ryan said, so that the rates
are kind of broken up into two car
categories. There are fixed fees or
rates that you pay per month, for
example, in New Jersey American or per
quarter in the bureau. And then you have
what we call volumetric rates are the
ones that actually based on how much
water you use. So those things together
determine your bill. So each one of
those components for example with New
Jersey American is on a separate rate
schedule in the tariff. Um and they're
all called out for example in the
contract. So lead service line
replacement charge is on its own rate
schedule. Um the distribution system
improvement charge is on its own rate
schedule. So each time um New Jersey
America or any other utility wants to
change those rates, they have to file uh
they they file a BPU and they specify,
you know, these particular rate
schedules are going to be changed by
this much. They literally give them what
the numbers would be for each case. Um
and some of those things that the
fundamental ones change about every two
years and what's called a base rate
filing which consider rate. There are
other rates that are sometimes revised
uh as much as every six months like the
lead service line one, excuse me, but
you can actually go up or down because
it's literally based on how much money
they spent in the last six months on
replacing land service lines. And so
they do this cold file and says this is
what we spent. This is how many
customers we have and this is how we're
charging to. So um but all those things
individually have to be approved by the
BPU and they're all called out in rate
schedules. The ter is great fun to read.
It's about 125 page long. Um, but it's
all there. Um, but that's that's the
question. So, and and every single one
of them is regulated by the BPU and it
has to be approved. Um, yeah. One, just
for those who do go digging into that
tariff, one thing that confused many of
us early on and and we thought almost
was a mistake is that for the most
almost entirely I want to say it's it's
1A which is the the the rates that will
be charged to the burrow with the
exception of um fire hydrant fees. Um
what we will be paying for fire hydrants
is on a different schedule and it's much
lower than that schedule suggests. Um,
we have a we're on a different schedule
that's that's that's lower for that.
>> Basically, we would be paying the same
rates for most things that in
whole township and would pay, but they
actually put us on a different rate
schedule, but the fire monthly fire
hydrant fees, which is way lower, which
is actually the same one for and Carver
City. I get it confused, but we're on
that same one. So, that's basically
baked into the contract, and that's it's
a it's I think $15 a month instead of
60. So it's a big difference. Um but
again that's what's called out of the
contract is these are the rate schedules
that apply. So in the future any changes
are applied to those rate schedules. Um
that's what BPU one of the things that
BPU reviewed in the contract when they
looked at all the rate schedules that
were applied to us and made a
determination as to whether that was
movement.
» Thank you. Thank you.
>> Thank you. I appreciate the
clarification.
Please come.
>> My name
Kishman. I live at 59 North Cleveland
Avenue.
And I want to make a comment about how
everybody has um worked on this issue. I
feel like
there's been a whole lot of work done on
this issue. One thing that I was very
cognizant of was how when David Waldman
came up to speak on Sunday, he was very appreciative of all the work that
the council has done. I nearly went over
those to give great respect and thanks
for what you've done.
And I feel that David and Han and the
water committee have done a ton of work
and they've done it because they care
about this town.
There was not one word of thanks that
will come has come from you or the
council in recognizing that they are
working as you are for the love of this
town. There's been no thanks. So, I want
to say thank you very, very much. And
I'm sorry that when we all come and try
to contribute to the council, we're all
treated as if we're sort of interfering
and making a little bit of trouble for
you. You do you do you do look as if you
care, but it I feel like we all feel
like we're mostly in your way. Um, but I
thank you for the work you do.
>> Thank you.
address that.
Okay. Um, anyone else in person or
seeing none, happy to uh seek a motion
to close the first of two public comment
sections.
>> I'll motion.
>> All in favor? I
>> uh next item on our agenda is minutes
from our September 4th meeting. Uh both
regular and executive session.
I'll take a motion for for both if I
move.
>> Will I have a second?
>> I'll second.
>> All in favor?
» Uh next I've got our consent agenda.
Item 11, resolutions 2025
107 to 110. Um,
couple of uh quick items here. Um, and
then we'll just wait till everyone uh
files out and then we'll uh continue our
business once it's uh fin to here. Um,
we've got a appointment of our new
attorney, Mr. side here. Um uh a
settlement of a peculiar um small piece
of litigation uh that we dealt with uh
in executive session. Um final payment
to close out a road project on Park
Avenue uh and the hiring of public works
uh personnel. Um Jared, anything you
want to add to those or does anyone have
a question, comment or something like
pulled out?
» Seeing
I'll motion to move all board forward.
Do I have a second?
>> Second.
>> I will receive roll call.
>> Mr. Fuller.
>> Yes.
>> Miss F?
>> Yes.
>> Mr. Matthew?
>> Yes.
>> Steeler?
>> Yes.
>> Miss Weaver's joining us.
>> Yes.
>> Welcome.
>> Thank you.
>> Congratulations.
» Next, I will take a motion to approve
our uh bill list and plans for payment.
>> I'll move.
>> Oh, sorry.
>> All right. That was Deb first, Chris
second.
Mr. Culler. Yes. Miss Hook. Yeah. Mr.
Mackey.
>> Yes.
>> Miss Steeler.
>> Yes.
>> Miss Weaver. Yes.
>> Miss Millennials.
>> Yes.
>> Uh next we've got a proclamation. I
believe it was in our packet. Um uh
rather than read it though, if you could
I have the invitation we could just give
everyone the run gown. This is our
formal thanking the volunteers and
organization and and for the event
that's coming up. But since you have the
details, maybe we could just quickly
>> Yes. Yes. I had quick. Um, so the unity
comm community unity is was formerly
known as women's space communities of
blight has been moved to October 27th.
It used to be held in December. It's
moved to October to coincide with
domestic violence awareness month. It
will be Monday, October 27th. Um, and I put one of these flyers in the back so
folks can take a picture with their
phone. And we will also be sharing the
information out via the burough email
um, and on social media. Um, the
official burrow lighting will be at 6:15
p.m., which is about an hour later than
usual because it will be lighter and so
we need to wait until laterers and it
will be dark enough for us to light
candles. Um, and um there are if if you
would like to light um in front of your
home, which would be absolutely
wonderful. Um the kits are now 12. It's
a $12 donation to Unity. Um they can be
picked up at Dandelion Wishes on West
Broad and Hopewood or at Pennington
Quality Market as well as many other
locations throughout Mercer County. And
um
>> thank you. Um next we'll do our council
liaison reports. Um got to get better at
not surprising people and that that
seems to be punishing Anthony with going
first time. So apologies. I will
» the late of my audience out on
always do it during
>> they do it every time.
>> Yeah. So the the health update for this
month so on 10th of September we had the
annual joint meeting for the local
boards of health right here in Bar Hall.
um hosted by Gary Dorsy our health
officer and the two presenters were
Mackenzie Cobalt who's the executive
director for public health in Merca
County and our old friend Sean Jackson
talking about and work on lead which is
still a major issue in homes
particularly in Trenton.
Um the actual board of health itself
last met in July. The next and final
meeting of the year is October 29th. So
no major updates right now to share with
everyone
except for these three things. So um the
memorandum of understanding with capital
health for health education services
have been finalized and that was
discussed today in terms of what that
will look like. Um,
I'm not even sure whether to mention
this one about planning, but uh I've
been made aware of a potential
opportunity for us which is from the New
Jersey chapter of the American Planning
Association. They have some funding to
help make public health a major part of
the uh the master plan. So they are
putting together a model master plan of
public health element that we can use
and next year uh up to six communities
will be selected for a grant between 50
and $100,000 to adopt public health
master plan. So that may be an
opportunity for us to look at. Um, and
then finally on health matters, there
will be a vote and vax vaccination
clinic right here in Burough Hall on
election day 10:00 a.m. to 1 p.m. This
year is for the flu vaccine only, not
for co and uh anybody who wants to take
advantage, you can bring their insurance
card or not residency.
>> That's it.
>> Thank you. I think
>> um the green team we are upholding our you know we have it uh three times a
year. The potluck the next um zero waste
potluck will be Sunday October 19th from
5 to 7 and um all are welcome. Um there
will be an RSVP link that goes out in
the burrow email and is also on the
green team website. We're encouraging
people to use that RSVP link um because
there is a prize drawing again at this
that is um funded by the sustainable
Jersey grant. Again, um our sustainable
Jersey grant by the way is almost
complete. Um we're going to be printing
some educational compost brochures which
Mercer County Master Gardeners have have
put together. Um, and we're going to use
the balance of our funding to purchase
native plants that will be planted in
Burough Park by green team volunteers.
Um, working with Marian Labos who's, you
know, got a good command of what's going
on in the park there in terms of
planting. Um, on Thursday, October 23rd
at 6:00 p.m. at the train station will
be the Hopewell Valley Green Team's
annual green gathering. Um, that is for
local environmental activists as well as
local community leaders. Um, everyone up
here should have gotten an invitation.
Um, and um, so the RSVPs are to Joanne
Held and the two topics are energy
planning and also recycling the next big
steps. Um, the green team will be at the
farmers market this Sunday from 9 to 1,
collecting hard to recycle items. And
next month, November 9th, will be our
last um appearance at the farmers market
for the season. And our next meeting
will be Wednesday, November 5th at 700
p.m. at the Hope Public Library. and we
always welcome his volunteers
and open space did not be good. Thank
you.
>> Hi. Okay. Um so Jerry probably has to
say in his notes as well, but the
building committee is excited to
announce that the uh burough hall has
started to get little facelift. Um Alan
and his team were able to do some um
power washing and get the uh rear area
of the uni painted. So, it's looking
really good along with the flowers that
were planted. Um, personnel was
mentioned that uh we have the laborer
that's going to start on the 27th. I'm
very happy to get more help out for Alan
and his team. Um, the library has a lot
going on as always. Um, their survey is
out and there are it's broken up into
different age groups. So, we encourage
you to go to the library website um or
send your kids or your neighbors to um
let them provide feedback as to what
they uh envision the library to be in
the future. They want to hear from
everyone. So, we urge as many people to
go as possible. Um they also have really
cool event coming up called the Colonial
Taverns Libation and Liberty event. It's
going to be held at the Hope Theater on
October 22nd. Um it's free as is
everything that the library does. Um
we're going to be serving um some drinks
and food that are typical of colonial
times. Um that's all I have should be
done
like
» I know.
fire department made 38 calls last
month. EMS made 58 calls and Jerry, just
a heads up, the old topic of getting our
DPW guys certified as firefighters came
up again. I thought we'd forgotten about
that, but um I think the new young guy
now, they're they're really interested
in that. So I'm just Anybody have a
heads up if they're interested in that?
Um
>> the DPW guys are interested or
>> No,
activating. It's a thing.
>> It's a challenging time management
challenge.
>> Yeah. But I'm just like, you know, um
EDC couldn't make quorum, so they didn't
meet, but I went to uh Princeton
Chamber of Commerce kickoff event for
the Independent Business Association
meeting and it was a networking event
for small businesses, but I got to talk
to Anthony Caribelli Jr. who's the
director of Mercer County Economic
Development Department. Um and really
nice guy uh basically said that he has
out of all the municipalities in Mercer
County has spent the least amount of
time here. So was really open to us
doing some um events and it it
corresponds nicely with this survey that
we're doing with businesses to figure
out how we can help them bring some free
programming to them. So
>> try to move that forward. It's hard when
there's no meeting, but I might have a
little subcommittee. So,
>> um, senior advisory
board, they had their annual picnic last
month. Did you go to that, Brian?
>> Thank you for highlighting my
>> So, unfortunately, the burrow had it was on September 11th, which was like
>> Yeah. Um, but the AAP safe drivers class
is um October 28th. I don't know what
qualify for that, but it might be might
be my turn to go to that. Uh, and
lastly, Shade Tree Committee, the
celebration tree program is up and
running. We're going to have a big
launch, I think, in the spring. And,
um, I'm going to I'm hesitated saying
this, but it's such a cool idea that I'm
going to say it anyways. You know that
huge asht tree on Broad Street right
across from Mercer unfortunately died
which is a huge bummer.
>> I mean it looked
>> I know I know but they did all that
work.
>> Well no one knows why. Um
>> but it seemed to happen abruptly.
>> Yeah I I
>> and I couldn't imagine it still you know
>> I know
>> but that's got to come down because it's
actually very dangerous now. But my idea
was and I talked to Bill Glemer who said
it was possible. Whoever cuts it down,
which is we haven't figured this out
yet, to save a huge crosssection cuz I
think it's like the oldest tree in the
burrow.
>> What?
>> Make a
>> No, no, not
to the school and they can actually like
mark the history of hope on the rings or
something.
>> No, you can do you go to
dendocronologist and they'll figure all
that out.
>> Dendocrinologist.
>> See, this is why do we even give that
word? No, it's a great
>> All right, I'm following up with and and
furthermore, we talked about what else
to do with that wood, and it turns out
that our newest member of the Jade
community, so Sonia Cotton's husband,
has been studying natural playground
design.
>> So, he got really excited that we could
use this
immense amount of wood to build some
kind of natural playground somewhere.
So, anyway, so stay tuned.
>> A lot of things to think about. That ash
is it's it's ours to we
» know it's on there on their property.
>> Beautiful,
>> right? It's on there.
>> It's not a shade tree. It's just a tree.
It's just it's
>> it really it really and I kept kept
wondering why it was still alive if it
was an ashy unless they were treating
it,
>> right?
We have one about that diameter. Not
beautiful, but um
>> yeah. Oh,
>> so Jerry, that thing's going to be hard
to take down. So, we're gonna have to
>> clo.
So, Sonia's gonna talk to the woman
because I guess that's a rental house.
>> So, what do you think we're This is an
interesting time.
» No one's bad at trees or
>> Okay, I'm done.
Uh David
um water. So um my thanks to
committee members, our professionals,
Richie, Christine, everyone who helped
with the FAQ,
not only preparing it, distributing it,
stuffing envelopes. I did some but only
a fraction. Um but we wanted
>> 120. Pardon? We did 120
>> ideally
blocked me in the building. She left at
the other day and said, "All right, I'm
going to find you here in the morning or
what?" I said, "No, but I heard for a
couple hours and now I know when we do
those public notifications how much of a
bear it really is that stuff under the
arc." But anyway, thank you so much. Um,
I'll just say it's a living document.
We're already um working on additions to
it. Had some more questions come up. So,
the online version, I don't think we're
going to keep mailing them, but I think
to get them out there, let everybody
know that there are updates available uh
as they come available. Um, and uh well,
I guess we had our September 11th
presentation, right, which was uh and
again, thanks to everyone who helped and
thanks to everyone who attended um you
know, to take the time together. It was
long with both, you know, four hours.
So, not everybody sat through the whole
thing, but um we didn't have to. Um
anyway, very appreciative. Um it's it's good to be in a community where
people are paying attention and are
willing to invest that kind of time. So,
thank you. um and
planning for it. I'm going to let you
talk about it if you want. Sure. Okay.
But I'll but other than that on water um
» um so today we they did the cops and
cross dogs thing today. Correct. Um I
was unable to attend unfortunately but
I'm happy to um work with the Humble
Township Police Department to make it
happen. And this is essentially when a
plane closed officer goes out and
attempts to cross the street. There's
other officers waiting around. So if
there's any sort of violation, the other
officers will pull over the driver and
either give them a warning or a ticket.
Um so I'm excited to hear the results of
that. I know they had aimed to be there
at rush hour in the morning but had some
staffing interest and got there a little
bit later. Um, and this will be an
ongoing thing. So, we will probably do
some announcement like, hey, this week
it's happening, but you know, it's it's
not we're never trying to get obviously
um we want it to be an education
experience to learn. There's some laws
that maybe we don't even know or we
forget, but it is just being mindful of
the pedestrians. roads have many users
and everyone has a right to use the
road. Um we are having our kickoff
meeting with the with um WSP the
engineers that we selected the design
assistance portion of our safe routes to
school grant in a couple of weeks.
Actually ran into one of their members
just out and about and they are very
excited to work with us. So I'm looking
forward to that. Um, we Jerry and I met
with the Delaware Valley Regional
Planning Commission to talk about
implementing our complete and green
streets policy, which is a bit of a
heavy lift for smaller municipalities
like ourselves. And uh, the DBRPC sort
of floated the idea of potentially
helping us with that. We don't know the
details of that yet, but we're not the
only municipality struggling with this.
So, they're kind of thinking that, you
know, this is a good idea to reach out
to us and we might even be like a sort
of pilot for this project. So, um, Yeah,
looking forward to getting more
information about that as well. And I
think that's it.
>> Always the child that brings the apple
to class.
>> Yeah, I mean projects are wonderful and
stepping up to be part of one is a good
thing.
>> Well, I think it's it's a lot of
municipalities have engineering and
planning in house. Obviously, we don't
have that. We don't have that many
full-time employees. So, if we can get
assistance from our metropolitan
planning organization, that would be
hugely helpful. And it might also be
helpful for others.
>> Well, exactly. It helps. It's helpful to
others to go through the motions and
show how it's done.
>> Okay. Um
updates for me. Uh earlier last month,
um uh the Needle Creek Township hosted a
agricultural breakfast um about some of
the challenges to farming in our
community. appreciate the the egg
commissioner um and uh uh Jeff Bird who
was the assessor of Union Township but
uh I believe leads the egg efforts in
Mercer County for organizing that. I
really want to thank everyone who came
um and participated and especially the
first responders who helped um put
together um the special event that we
had here on September 11th. I encourage
everyone who has a chance to um maybe
not this evening after this meeting
because it's late but um in Burough Hall
uh for the next almost a year we will be
hosting a um section of the World Trade
Center um uh and I really want to thank
uh there our first responder community
uh particularly valley emergency
services um uh for organizing and and
honoring us with uh having the the um
display
here uh this year um
uh meetings. Uh Jared and I met with
several potential business um owners or
sug um uh for town. Um again, if you're
thinking about opening a business,
there's lots of resources. I heard some
things tonight, including the Mercer
County Economic Development Center led
by Anthony Cari Jr. uh downtown Hopewell
um would be a great place to connect
with or reach out to your administrator
who need help with uh you know a zoning
or sort of question like that. I'm happy
to try to to meet and and see to get you
in the right direction um to to help
choose hope for your business. Uh last
month's uh coffee uh with the mayor was
outside for the first time right on
Broad Street. Thought that was was neat.
Um this month it's actually getting
moved from the 2nd to 3rd um Saturday.
So, it's going to be on the 18th,
weather permitting, likely outside uh at
Burough Park, but check the website for
that where that will be. Uh have a cup
of coffee and and you know, state of
mind. Um I want to thank downtown
Hopewell and all our businesses who were
responsible for the beautiful uh
newformational and art display uh that
is adjacent to or posually thanks to the
Copel pharmacy. Uh it is a beautiful use
of uh that storefront um and a great way
to see what businesses um are in Hope
for Burough. Just adjacent to that, I
want to thank the Arts Council again for
their kind of art in the windows project
at the former Brothers Mill there. So
just really neat um artistic
presentations there. Also again want to
thank the Arts Council for their work.
Uh time seems to go very quickly and
slowly, but if it was last week or two
weeks ago, I don't even remember now for
our um tour to art um in uh hope in and
around Hope. I just want to thank the
arts council and give a shout out to
their upcoming pumpkin carve at Wolsey
Park. Check them out. They do a lot of
great things for our community uh and the area. Uh mentioned coffee will
be on the 18th uh and not this Saturday.
I'll again thank our water committee and
professionals and everyone who attended
the September 11th water meeting.
Reminder that the video from that
meeting, the May meeting, the other
public meetings, it's about 14 hours of
video content up on the website as long
as well as the contract information on
the possible water sale. Um again, next
week, the 14th, that's Tuesday, that is
the last day to register vote. Please
check to see that you're registered. If
you haven't voted in a while, you may
have been purged. So, please double
check and make sure you're registered.
Um,
continue to work possibly on a joint
project for flooding and storm water for
the lower Milstone watershed working
group. They're meeting next week. This
is the hope to get a grant fund to look
at the entire watershed region of this
particular water. We're kind of at the
end um but the joint project of the
municipalities in our area to try to do
regional a regional approach to to storm
water and flooding. Um
uh the water committee has a a meeting
not this week but the week after uh with
representatives from IBank. Uh that's
the one of the groups that has funding
uh and loans for for water and sewer
infrastructure. Uh it's not really
anything that seems to have changed, but
we do meet with them regularly to see
what's available and see what we can get
for for water um and sewer. And our next
meeting with them, I believe, is on the 27th. Uh there is a Veterans Day
ceremony on the 8th at Wy Park. Um I
think we sent the information out. If if
you didn't get it, members council, let
me know and I'll make sure you get it.
Uh it's a great event.
>> I think so.
>> Was it an actual fly?
>> Handout.
>> Thank you. I was uh I only saw it
electronically so I wasn't even seeing
it. That's that's way better than I
could have imagined. So thank you uh
Reggie for for doing that. But it's a
great event and actually I will not be
able to be there this year. So much
appreciated if um any of you would be
able to attend. Um uh if you do if you
are planning to attend, let me know and
I'll make sure that um you're let me say
giving a seat is not the right word, but
they usually do a ceremony and if
there's someone from the burrow there,
they like to have you participate um in
the the wreath ceremony.
>> Um uh as Christa did, I want to thank
Coco County Police Department for the
extra enforcement in that special event
today, the cops from the crosswalk. um
and particular for some continued
efforts on an event that might be coming
to town. Uh and uh there's a particular
neighborhood in town that has uh um made
some requests about a quality of life
issue. Um and I don't have resolution
for it, but I do want to thank our
police chief at Hope Township Police
Department for being attentive to them
and to us when things like that come up.
Um quite again uh Dev said personnel and
the buildings committee were very busy
this month. Uh they're thinking about
the update. Um and there was a at least
one uh valley municipal alliance meeting
this month. Finally uh next Friday is
the annual mayor's breakfast from the
municipal alliance. Um the honores this
year is the thrive uh PTO which is a um
one of the parents groups just is a
district-wide parent group for for
special needs families. Welldeserved and
phenomenal work that those folks do.
Excited that they're being honored. Uh
but the three mayors uh will be at the
Hopewell Golf Course. It's not uh I
think it's a free event. So, if you go
to the Musical Alliance website, you can
uh sign up for tickets and have a
usually long uh but lovely breakfast and
find out what's happening uh in in our
so thanks everyone for your updates. Uh
what's that? Okay, Kristen. Yeah, go for
it.
>> Real quick, um this is still TBD, but
North Greenwood is not going to be
repaved until the spring. So, we will be
moving forward with the traffic coming
project before repaving. We just don't
have an exact timeline yet because we
need to organize that. That's
>> okay. Um Sherry, if we've got um
anything you want to highlight from your
report or um add for the good of Sure.
floor is yours. Thank you, Mayor. Um
now, you all have my detailed written
report which provides updates on
approximately 20 items. I obviously
won't go through all of them, but for
the sake of the public, I'll touch on a
few of the key ones. Also, I'll touch on
a few of them that have had updates
since I submitted this to you all on
Friday. First, with respect to the
railroad station. The final payment was
on the bill list for tonight, but I have
been holding that check because there
have been some outstanding issues. I
wanted it to be on the bill list in the
event those issues were completed in a
week or two, so we didn't have to wait
another two or three weeks to process
the check. That being said, um, a couple
days ago I received final approval from
the architect that that project is
complete and all the punch list items
have been completed. So, I'll be
releasing that check and that project is
now finished.
» Next, gutter repairs on the library.
Since writing the report that I
submitted to you, I received a quote
from a gutter repair company. I spoke
with the CFO prior to our meeting
tonight and there may be funds available
to move forward with this um by the end
of this calendar year. I know this had
been initially a planned item for 2026,
but based on the quote what needs to be
done and potential for transfers and
monies in various parts of the budget,
there's an opportunity to get this
complete and get this moving. I'll
confirm that with DPW in the next day or
so. I want to make sure they don't have
any pending projects that I'm not aware
of that will take up some of the funds
that I might be thinking of. So, there's
an opportunity and I'll confirm that in
the next couple of days. On the grease
trap inspections, they have begun. It's
been a mix of education and enforcement.
Um, so far it's going well. Business
owners have been receptive to our
inspector that's been going out there.
Uh, the site visits have been going well
and there's been some compliance and of
course some enforcement when necessary.
But I don't know if you've heard any. I
have not heard any complaints yet from
anybody who's been visited by the
inspector who knows a lot about police
traps.
Um, safe routes to school, the council
woman mentioned that's moving forward.
The state has scheduled our kickoff
meeting in the next week or two. We're
going to be having that here in the
municipal building. So, the
representatives from the state
government will be coming here with the
consultant that we chose to help move
this project forward. And then um
finally, well actually not finally, let
me take that back. Uh councilwoman
mentioned the pillars and the facelift
out front. I did get confirmation that
work on repairing the pillars will begin
on the 15th of this month, which is
>> two days. So, you know, that's moving
forward. I'm pretty excited about that.
And then finally, um, I mentioned in my
report, there was a motor vehicle
accident, a pedestrian versus vehicle
that occurred over on Greenwood and
Broad as a result of what the police
department mentioned to me. They
thought, although not the cause of the
accident, they did make a note that the
lights over there were a little lighter
than they would have liked. They're
rooted at BSCG. Um, have the contract
ready to go and they're going to move
forward placing those lights um, based
on the police department's
recommendation.
with that I
>> Oh, the pedestrian did not have serious
injuries. That's correct. Yeah, sorry
in my notes
thankfully.
>> Yeah.
>> And that is all I was going to touch on
that changed since I submitted their
report. As always, if you have any
questions, I'm open to answering them
now or in the future.
>> Thank you. Um next um you know we have
our second uh public comment session
that
the reports triggers some uh some
thoughts for folks. So uh you're here in
person please come up to the front. If
you're on the online push the raise hand
button happy to recognize you and ask
questions or or uh make a comment for
the second time we try to limit it
though I don't think we've ever actually
limited uh to to three minutes. Um seeing none uh in person or online, I
will take a motion to close the second
public um comment section.
>> Moved. I'll second.
>> All in favor.
Now I will hold on. Just I think our
Zoom camera thought that we wanted to uh
end this as well. So that just shut
itself off prematurely. But you'll uh
hopefully hear um our uh motion to
adjurnn, which I will entertain now. Um
uh do I have uh Heidi then Deb for a
second? All in favor? All right. Thank
you again. Uh and our next meeting is in
November.