1 00:00:00,465 --> 00:00:12,305 Rod Howe: So good afternoon, everyone. I'm Rod. How supervisor for the town of Ithaca! And this is very exciting to be talking to city and town officials 2 00:00:12,325 --> 00:00:18,345 Rod Howe: about community choice aggregation or Tompkins Green energy network. 3 00:00:18,545 --> 00:00:30,954 Rod Howe: We wanted to start with town officials and city officials to start answering questions that you might have. We're going to go through a presentation and then certainly leave time for Q. And A. 4 00:00:30,985 --> 00:00:34,864 Rod Howe: Some of us have been talking about Cca. For 5 00:00:34,955 --> 00:00:43,954 Rod Howe: quite a long time, maybe 3 years. It's been a while, and we're excited that we have branded it specific to Tompkins County. 6 00:00:44,055 --> 00:00:47,264 Rod Howe: The Tompkins Green energy network. 7 00:00:47,655 --> 00:00:49,635 Rod Howe: we? 8 00:00:50,045 --> 00:01:03,494 Rod Howe: you know, we're Ithaca. We're Tompkins County. We like to be innovative. And so certainly the approach that we're taking to Cca has an innovative approach. And that's probably what you're going to learn about today. 9 00:01:03,525 --> 00:01:28,964 Rod Howe: Both the city and the town approved the enabling legislation to move in this direction. Last summer. There are other municipalities in Tompkins County that we have been working with and are interested and hopefully we'll join, you know, once this is approved next spring, or whatever. So we will be sharing we will be putting this on Youtube. We'll be sharing this link with our municipal sisters 10 00:01:28,965 --> 00:01:38,334 Rod Howe: so that they can see that we will certainly be doing additional education and outreach. We're required to do that, and we want to do that. But we wanted to start with 11 00:01:38,355 --> 00:01:58,295 Rod Howe: the policy makers who are going to be approving this hopefully in September, and we've also invited our Cce colleagues who might help us with education and outreach along the way. Gay Nicholson with sustainable finger. Lakes, is also here. She's been very instrumental the past few years. 12 00:01:58,295 --> 00:02:08,585 We did get a grant from the Park Foundation that allowed us to work with local power to get us to this point. So we wanna thank and acknowledge Park Foundation. 13 00:02:08,675 --> 00:02:36,594 Rod Howe: So today's goal is really to start giving you. II know some of you have been hearing about Ccat along the way, but this is sort of a practice session for us to see. How do we start conveying the information in a meaningful way? Because the general public is gonna have to understand this. You know we're both the city and the town will be doing public meetings about this. So we wanna do some of the education and outreach in advance of those public meetings. 14 00:02:36,995 --> 00:03:06,514 Rod Howe: I think that's oh, by the way, there is going to be a video but it wasn't ready for today so soon for the general public. We'll be able to start sharing a video to kinda help getting the word out. What is T. Jin? So we've been we're we're almost ready to launch that. And I'm gonna turn over to Rich just for a couple of minutes and rich. I don't know if you want to mention someone who is very helpful in coming up with the logo. 15 00:03:06,815 --> 00:03:13,074 Rich DePaolo: Yeah. Yeah. We worked with worked with Mickey Quinn, who some of you might know she's in events 16 00:03:13,215 --> 00:03:35,005 Rich DePaolo: promoter and coordinator around town, and she was kind enough to barter with me for audio services. So we did a little graphics work there. I also wanted to mention, while I had the floor for those of you who may or may not be concerned about quorum issues in the open meetings. Law and so forth, doesn't look like we have a quorum of any legislative entity at the moment, but I think the idea is that 17 00:03:35,145 --> 00:03:58,974 Rich DePaolo: this is an information session, and people are are free to ask questions specific to the initiative without deliberating about potential approvals, and so on and so forth. So as long as we steer clear from getting into the sort of legislative components we're we're good to go according to our respective council. 18 00:03:59,585 --> 00:04:07,645 Rod Howe: So the broader team. Is there anything else you think we need to mention that's not going to be covered in the slideshow to help set the stage. 19 00:04:11,445 --> 00:04:23,304 Rebecca Evans: I guess this is we're just really presenting on the Deer plan the distributed energy resource plan today. So there will be more information coming about the 20 00:04:23,955 --> 00:04:38,814 Rebecca Evans: a more holistic plan that includes procurement and selection of an energy service provider and all that sort of stuff. We'll dig into a little bit today, but aren't going to go into the details of that which is really focusing on the distributed energy portion. 21 00:04:38,985 --> 00:04:45,035 Rod Howe: And that's a good point that when we do the public. So the more public sessions we'll have to go back. 22 00:04:45,165 --> 00:04:45,875 Rod Howe: And 23 00:04:46,335 --> 00:05:13,095 Rod Howe: and we have the lots of slideshows to draw from what is Cca. And what? Yeah. So anyways, that's a good point. Thank you. Rebecca. Yeah. So we're be focused a bit tonight on what both the city and the town will actually be voting on, probably in September at some point. So with that we will turn it over to. And Rebecca, do you? I think everyone knows who Rebecca is, but if you wanna introduce yourself 24 00:05:13,185 --> 00:05:19,835 Rod Howe: and Paul will have you introduce yourself as well. So, Rebecca, I think you're starting first. Is that correct? 25 00:05:20,945 --> 00:05:29,015 Rebecca Evans: Yeah, I can. Paul and I can both introduce ourselves at least briefly at first, and then Paul has a more in-depth 26 00:05:29,115 --> 00:05:40,394 Rebecca Evans: introduction slide about himself and local power. I'm Rebecca Evans. I'm the Director of Sustainability for the city of Ithaca. I've been with the city for about a little over 2 years now. 27 00:05:42,925 --> 00:05:44,564 Rebecca Evans: Paul, do you want to introduce yourself? 28 00:05:44,805 --> 00:05:56,114 Paul Fenn: Oh, yes, certainly. Hi, I'm Paul Finn from local power. I've been working on Cca for about 30 years, and glad to be working with the city and town. 29 00:05:58,475 --> 00:06:07,694 Rebecca Evans: Great. So my apologies in advance to members of Pedc, because you will have seen at least a portion of this already. 30 00:06:07,785 --> 00:06:10,645 Rebecca Evans: But maybe it'll be a nice reminder. 31 00:06:10,675 --> 00:06:11,735 So 32 00:06:12,185 --> 00:06:28,435 Rebecca Evans: we're going to use the the term Cca community choice aggregation and the acronym token screen energy network interchangeably. They're the same thing. Tgin is just the name of our local program. But more generally it is a Cca program. 33 00:06:29,135 --> 00:06:38,055 Rebecca Evans: So just a quick reminder of what is Cca, it basically empowers municipalities to purchase energy on behalf of their residents. 34 00:06:38,315 --> 00:06:54,174 Rebecca Evans: It also maintains that the utilities still controls the distribution and transmission infrastructure. So we're not going to be buying any of that. We are just basically choosing who we're getting energy from and purchasing it in bulk. 35 00:06:55,745 --> 00:07:04,345 Rebecca Evans: So just sort of where we are in the timeline. About a year ago we entered into a contract with local power. Llc. Who is our Cca. Consultant 36 00:07:04,545 --> 00:07:18,474 Rebecca Evans: and there has been a number of changes throughout the year at the State level that determines the process through which new and existing Cca. Programs are approved by the State. 37 00:07:18,615 --> 00:07:25,095 Rebecca Evans: So we had to wait several months to get guidance from the State. But now that we have that guidance, we have 38 00:07:25,165 --> 00:07:42,085 Rebecca Evans: officially received this the er plan, and just last week it was approved by the Playing and Economic Development Committee to send on to council with the city, and, as Rod mentioned, it'll go to the town next month. It sounds like for both. 39 00:07:42,455 --> 00:07:53,845 Rebecca Evans: We will then have to select a Cca. Administrator, which is a lot of that work is done at the State level. So we just need to essentially choose 40 00:07:53,935 --> 00:07:59,384 Rebecca Evans: a master implementation plan that jive with the program that we're envisioning. 41 00:08:00,135 --> 00:08:19,595 Rebecca Evans: And once we've done that, though, we can get into the sort of the real meaty work of selecting and energy service providers starting to do that public outreach and ultimately starting to enroll customers. So we're still almost a year out from officially enrolling customers which we're aiming for. June 2020. Fourth. 42 00:08:22,735 --> 00:08:46,464 Rebecca Evans: So why are we doing this? So does this ultimately help us achieve our collective renewal goals. So if we look at this is a representation of the city's greenhouse gas emissions. But really, what we're targeting is that 14 down in the lower left hand corner, the electric bridge decarbonization. So yes, we are planning to purchase renewable renewable electricity. 43 00:08:46,465 --> 00:09:11,205 Rebecca Evans: But we're also concerned about the the heat loss from transmission, and I'll go into that in just a second. But before we do that, I just want to be really really clear. I know I've gotten a number of communication from from residents that are kind of confused as to what this program will and won't do so. I want to be really explicit about that. It will purchase electricity. Yeah, on behalf of residents and businesses. 44 00:09:11,405 --> 00:09:16,755 Rebecca Evans: It will provide pathways for renewable energy investment, which is exactly what we're talking about today. 45 00:09:17,115 --> 00:09:22,574 Rebecca Evans: It'll also provide pathways for the development of micro grids. And we'll go into what that means in a little bit. 46 00:09:22,865 --> 00:09:38,845 Rebecca Evans: and also eliminate scope to emissions. Which we, when you report your greenhouse gas emissions, there are 3 scopes and scope to just means everything to do with electricity and for the city that's right at around 50,000 metric tons of carbon dioxide equivalent. 47 00:09:39,375 --> 00:09:55,635 Rebecca Evans: This process will also provide transparency in the renewables market that is otherwise unachievable by purchasing renewable energy certificates. So there are a number of one transparency issues but 2 equity and environmental justice issues that come up with the purchasing effect. 48 00:09:56,435 --> 00:10:08,435 Rebecca Evans: and then again, very explicitly, what it will not do. It's not going to replace transmission or distribution infrastructure. So we are not intending to go out and buy the electrical lines that run around the street. 49 00:10:08,545 --> 00:10:23,645 Rebecca Evans: It's not going to eliminate. The delivery rate increases that are a result of the Nicag rate case that you probably have heard about in the last couple of months, that is, on the delivery side, and residents will still receive a bill for nickel delivery 50 00:10:23,905 --> 00:10:31,355 Rebecca Evans: and just to be extra clear, this is not going to replace my side. We will still be relying on them in some capacity. 51 00:10:33,055 --> 00:10:56,815 Rebecca Evans: So I mentioned that 14 of emissions. So when you are when you say, plug your phone into an outlet in the wall, you're not actually receiving all of the energy that it took. Actually charge that phone, you're really only receiving about a third of the energy that was produced in order to actually get that electricity to you. So you lose about 52 00:10:56,815 --> 00:11:11,024 Rebecca Evans: almost 2 thirds through the conversion process. The power actual running of the power plant is another 6%, and then you lose another about 10 through transmission and distribution losses. And so a good example, when you think about this is 53 00:11:11,135 --> 00:11:25,035 Rebecca Evans: you think about traditional incandescent light bulbs, they get really, really hot. If you turn them on for a long time. The reason for that is they a lot of the heat that they produce, or a lot of the light that they produce, that energy is lost to heat 54 00:11:25,075 --> 00:11:49,414 Rebecca Evans: so led, which are much more efficient. Don't get as hot. So it's the exact same idea when we're talking about transmission and distribution infrastructure. And that's something that cannot be avoided without the deployment of micro grid, basically creating our own little tiny grid. Like I said, we'll go into that. The details of what that means in just a second. So this plan, this Dr. Plan, is the only way that we can avoid 55 00:11:49,675 --> 00:11:50,695 Rebecca Evans: those emissions. 56 00:11:53,035 --> 00:12:22,535 Rebecca Evans: So Paul's gonna go into this in a little bit deeper but the whole purpose of this particular plan is to give customers the option to collectively, or did for individually invest in distributed energy, resources and that is accessible through a loan that is available to anybody, and that is approved by the Cca administrator. And when we start to actually collectively event, then we can actually achieve economies of scale and further financial savings. 57 00:12:22,615 --> 00:12:36,594 Rebecca Evans: So the process through which this happens the Administrator is going to engage with local financial institutions. To start setting up potential loans for customers that are interested in voluntary voluntarily investing 58 00:12:37,115 --> 00:12:52,385 Rebecca Evans: the lenders are then responsible for providing the administrator with data for tracking. Whatever the system is that they're investing in and ensuring and sharing the data associated with customer return on investment. 59 00:12:53,445 --> 00:13:05,855 Rebecca Evans: Those deer systems are designed, based on the priorities of a customer or a cooperative so essentially as a customer would have a menu of choices to invest in, and those will be predetermined. 60 00:13:05,915 --> 00:13:18,365 Rebecca Evans: although I think there will be some flexibility there, and a customer or a cooperative of customers can then choose. You know, this is the technology that we're most interested in, that we want to collectively invest in 61 00:13:18,925 --> 00:13:37,385 Rebecca Evans: the city, and the town will then ultimately have final oversight over the legal agreement that are signed between investors, site owners, and users. And again, we'll go into exactly what those terms need. But basically, anyone that is involved within the process of investment will need to have a legal agreement to ensure that. 62 00:13:37,835 --> 00:13:44,955 You know, dividends that are received are are meeting expectations, and people are getting ultimately what they thought they were investing in 63 00:13:46,035 --> 00:13:54,314 Rebecca Evans: the administrator, then manages procurement on behalf of the customers. So the administrator is going to create relationships with 64 00:13:54,595 --> 00:14:04,614 Rebecca Evans: deer developers like a solar developer or 2 thermal developer. What have you? So that a customer doesn't have to do that themselves or collective? 65 00:14:04,675 --> 00:14:05,715 She let me know. 66 00:14:06,325 --> 00:14:16,234 Rebecca Evans: And then the cooperative members, the residents that have invested in this technology will receive the monthly dividend based on what was ironed out in those 67 00:14:16,365 --> 00:14:18,455 Rebecca Evans: legal agreements in Step 4. 68 00:14:20,805 --> 00:14:30,485 Rebecca Evans: But just to clarify sort of what these relationships really look like on the left side of the screen. Really, my left. You have basic service. So this is just if 69 00:14:30,535 --> 00:14:54,185 Rebecca Evans: Cca was providing energy service and not the beer portion. So you have the city in the town of Ithaca at the top sort of acting as the oversight to this entire program. They employ Cca administrator. Who then, has a relationship with an energy service provider and provides electricity and natural gas service to the customers. 70 00:14:54,505 --> 00:15:12,095 Rebecca Evans: When we add the extra fold of the Dr. Investment, we're adding an entire other arm to the relationship matrix. So we still have the municipalities maintaining oversight of the program. The Cca administrator is still maintaining 71 00:15:12,335 --> 00:15:16,425 Rebecca Evans: sort of the everyday goings on of the program 72 00:15:16,475 --> 00:15:26,965 Rebecca Evans: still dealing with the energy service provider. But then we're also able to create customer cooperative. So it's not just an individual customer. You could have a group of customers. 73 00:15:26,975 --> 00:15:33,854 Rebecca Evans: and the Cca. Administrators managing the relationship between project developers and financial institutions on behalf of 74 00:15:37,845 --> 00:15:50,484 Rebecca Evans: so why, why would this be ultimately valuable to customers, to residents and businesses here? Locally? Ultimately, you know, the big selling point is that we're getting a net greenhouse gas emissions reduction through that. 75 00:15:50,545 --> 00:16:06,195 Rebecca Evans: For in the case of the city, 14% reduction in greenhouse gas emissions. we're also seeing financial savings both through reduced energy costs and through those monthly dividends. If residents choose to invest. 76 00:16:06,255 --> 00:16:08,674 Rebecca Evans: we're also getting on Site renewables 77 00:16:09,165 --> 00:16:21,715 Rebecca Evans: resiliency in the event of a block out, and I'll go into that. What that really means in just a second. the fact that we are using local financial institutions for these loans also keep well local. 78 00:16:21,935 --> 00:16:42,005 Rebecca Evans: It provides economic opportunity through the building of new projects, new opportunities for active participation. For example, a lot of questions that we get in sustainability offices are, you know, where can I plug in? How can I participate? And this is a very clear way for individual residents to participate in our sustainability program. 79 00:16:42,745 --> 00:16:45,255 Rebecca Evans: It also is universally 80 00:16:45,365 --> 00:16:57,785 Rebecca Evans: accessible. So traditionally, with renewable energy systems are only accessible to a very wealthy household. This actually remove the the need for 81 00:16:57,965 --> 00:17:15,194 Rebecca Evans: a credit threshold in order to participate so that anybody is able to participate in this program, and renters who do not own their properties are also able to invest in renewable energy. And you know, in a town where we have 75 extremely valuable. 82 00:17:16,275 --> 00:17:35,585 Rebecca Evans: it also through traditional means. These are usually national searches to find developers to actually build projects. But we intend to try and keep this as local as possible. So we are, we have a specific program for an outreach for local developers and installers. 83 00:17:35,725 --> 00:17:40,405 Rebecca Evans: and it also opens up the doors to resources on public property. 84 00:17:42,485 --> 00:17:52,135 Rebecca Evans: So why is this valuable to the city in the town like, I said, this is given to Pedc last week, which is why you keep seeing the city and not the town all over this. So my apologies for that. 85 00:17:52,345 --> 00:18:07,315 Rebecca Evans: let's take a look at what this actually looks like traditionally versus what it would look like. Under a de our program. So this is what we're functioning under. Now, there's a single building that's connected to the big national grid which is ultimately in our region, managed by knife edge 86 00:18:09,195 --> 00:18:14,944 Rebecca Evans: during a blackout. As we all know, the big grid goes down, and nobody has any power 87 00:18:16,165 --> 00:18:27,165 Rebecca Evans: but buildings that have their own micro grid which I mentioned before can ultimately island off, which, essentially, if you think about it as a light switch, the power goes out, and 88 00:18:27,455 --> 00:18:33,295 Rebecca Evans: everyone is, has no lights, no heat, no air conditioning nothing. But 89 00:18:33,415 --> 00:18:40,984 Rebecca Evans: in a building that's connected to a micro grid, you can flip a switch that basically turns on your micro grid and allows you to have access 90 00:18:41,265 --> 00:18:43,525 Rebecca Evans: the power, even if your neighbors do not. 91 00:18:46,595 --> 00:18:49,474 Rebecca Evans: which allows the building to temporarily power itself. 92 00:18:50,765 --> 00:19:05,575 Rebecca Evans: you can also have micro grids that are within a larger grid. So you can connect multiple buildings to each other or to the same micro grid and still have access to the services that are provided by the utility, which is what we're talking about today. 93 00:19:07,195 --> 00:19:12,004 Rebecca Evans: Those micro rates can also store excess energy just like the battery. 94 00:19:13,785 --> 00:19:26,844 Rebecca Evans: So when the power goes out and the sun isn't shining or the wind isn't blowing. What have you? It can still provide energy to a neighborhood much like a traditional power plant. 95 00:19:30,265 --> 00:19:45,435 Rebecca Evans: and this came up in a in a previous meeting at at Pedc. Sort of the the issues of congestion. When you start to deploy a bunch of renewables all at once, you can get a lot of congestion if you think about electrical lines as 96 00:19:45,845 --> 00:19:46,855 like a 97 00:19:46,945 --> 00:20:05,304 Rebecca Evans: traffic on a street. They were really built for one way traffic. But when you start to add renewables now, you're adding another lane of traffic going the opposite direction. But you haven't changed the infrastructure at all. You haven't added additional lines onto the road, telling people where to go. So you end up with a whole bunch of traffic jams. 98 00:20:05,695 --> 00:20:15,305 Rebecca Evans: When you have a micro grid, you can actually prepare to balance out those fluctuations and grid voltage and frequency so that you can avoid that contraction altogether. 99 00:20:17,535 --> 00:20:19,245 Rebecca Evans: And this is just a fun visual. 100 00:20:20,285 --> 00:20:24,875 Rebecca Evans: And that's all for me. So I'm gonna pass it on to Paul, our CC, 101 00:20:28,245 --> 00:20:29,625 Rod Howe: Paul, you're on mute. 102 00:20:31,885 --> 00:20:34,344 Paul Fenn: Thank you. Thank you. Rebecca. 103 00:20:35,095 --> 00:20:37,625 Yeah. So I'm just gonna provide a little 104 00:20:37,875 --> 00:20:45,514 Paul Fenn: more detail on some of these points. you know the emphasis here is microgrids. Nanogrs. 105 00:20:45,715 --> 00:20:56,624 Paul Fenn: you know. Micros are larger multiple building networks connecting customers and solar panels and and loads. 106 00:20:57,205 --> 00:21:09,695 Paul Fenn: Nanny grids are smaller networks that don't require as much integration. Often within one building, between different meters. Thermal loops are are small. 107 00:21:10,255 --> 00:21:12,845 Paul Fenn: heat sharing or hot water. Sharing 108 00:21:14,125 --> 00:21:17,464 Paul Fenn: groups districts are obviously larger 109 00:21:17,585 --> 00:21:21,525 Paul Fenn: ev shares are electric vehicle shares 110 00:21:21,785 --> 00:21:27,384 Paul Fenn: and then waste sequestration reuse decarbonization really concerns 111 00:21:27,505 --> 00:21:32,005 Paul Fenn: the sequestration and separation, 112 00:21:32,115 --> 00:21:44,854 Paul Fenn: and reuse of of waste to decarbonize waste, which is significant source of methane and and greenhouse gas emissions. So it's just a long title there. But in some ways this sums up the 113 00:21:45,165 --> 00:21:47,555 Paul Fenn: technological paradigm of the program 114 00:21:47,655 --> 00:21:55,364 Paul Fenn: which is connective processes that involve more than one isolated consumer. to 115 00:21:55,375 --> 00:22:08,065 Paul Fenn: take advantage of some of the economic opportunities that come with sharing and some of the technologies that have emerged in the last decade or 2 that that makes sharing 116 00:22:08,225 --> 00:22:15,045 Paul Fenn: easy to do, provided organization. Next slide. Please, Rebecca. 117 00:22:15,485 --> 00:22:17,694 Paul Fenn: First, I'll just give a little background 118 00:22:17,875 --> 00:22:21,385 Paul Fenn: for myself and and for a company. 119 00:22:21,435 --> 00:22:26,905 Paul Fenn: This, this program is really the culmination of of 120 00:22:27,565 --> 00:22:42,254 Paul Fenn: of our work with community choice aggregators around the country for the last 30 years. It was to really developed for New York. This program design after having developed the 121 00:22:42,555 --> 00:22:49,534 Paul Fenn: the on the right side there the original Municipal Aggregation Bill, which came to be known as Cca. One 122 00:22:49,625 --> 00:22:55,995 Paul Fenn: that was just buying buying power. And we're doing larger certificates 123 00:22:56,205 --> 00:23:08,804 Paul Fenn: as a community in order to to get greener legally greener power cheaper. Then we that is in the mid nineties and then 2013, we we came up with a 124 00:23:09,425 --> 00:23:20,875 Paul Fenn: actually completed and started launching the second model in California, known as Cca. 2. And this was a model designed to enable 125 00:23:21,275 --> 00:23:28,254 Paul Fenn: Ccas to to build renewable energy and not just to buy power and certificates from 126 00:23:28,345 --> 00:23:48,564 Paul Fenn: third parties. To actually build new renewable energy was a quite a leap to get that to happen. That includes the writing of a new kind of CC law intervening with the State Regulator for 2 years, and then working with the Calgary Energy Commission on, and 2 counties to 127 00:23:48,595 --> 00:23:49,615 Paul Fenn: A 128 00:23:49,845 --> 00:23:58,414 Paul Fenn: to design the programs we partnered with Los Alamos National Laboratory and then implemented 6 or 7 years 129 00:23:58,505 --> 00:24:04,545 Paul Fenn: Cca programs across California, particularly in the Bay area, which kind of started the whole thing in California 130 00:24:04,675 --> 00:24:32,804 Paul Fenn: that had a big splash there. It's resulted in, I think, 30 Billi, 30 over 30 billion dollars of local renewable energy investment by the Ccas. But what we kind of to take away from that was from a carbon point of view. For communities like the city in town, Ithaca, that aren't just concerned with green power per se, but are actually looking for carbon reductions and realizing carbon goals 131 00:24:33,075 --> 00:24:48,084 Paul Fenn: that it wasn't enough. So we started working on New York. With this in mind, we also, as you can see on the top that works in other States. But it's 2,014 wrote a Cca. Bill for New York. The Governor then ordered Cca. 132 00:24:48,605 --> 00:24:50,834 Paul Fenn: And the Public Service Commission 133 00:24:51,055 --> 00:24:59,805 Paul Fenn: wrote the regulations for it. So we intervened in that process, but then, hired by Nicara to help them develop the Cca. Toolkit for municipalities. 134 00:24:59,965 --> 00:25:03,295 Paul Fenn: And then we're appointed to the Dps. 135 00:25:03,835 --> 00:25:12,375 Paul Fenn: Cc. Sub group of the voluntary investment working group. And that was specifically focused on what to do about barriers 136 00:25:12,395 --> 00:25:23,975 Paul Fenn: to distribute energy resource development by Ccas in the New York system. Because the dps was aware that there are barriers in the New York system. 137 00:25:24,515 --> 00:25:26,454 Don't exist in California. 138 00:25:26,765 --> 00:25:39,915 Paul Fenn: and there are a lot of details around that. But in a nutshell there needs to be a new model that could work in the New York system within the constraints that that authorized Cci. 139 00:25:40,185 --> 00:25:42,994 Paul Fenn: So we 140 00:25:43,285 --> 00:25:50,185 Paul Fenn: got a a grant and and partner with 11 cities, including Saratoga Springs, New York. 141 00:25:50,375 --> 00:25:55,045 Paul Fenn: with the Urban Sustainability Directors, Network 142 00:25:55,095 --> 00:26:01,714 Paul Fenn: and wrote The Cca-unknowno, Plan, or business, model in 2,000 and 20 143 00:26:01,815 --> 00:26:04,504 Paul Fenn: and That really was Kind Of 144 00:26:04,915 --> 00:26:08,784 Paul Fenn: How We got really Going with Ithaca 145 00:26:08,935 --> 00:26:24,114 Paul Fenn: and hired as a consultant there, and should be working out since then. But it's the idea. Yes, to deliver a Cca. That Ca, and like California did the leap from just buying certificates to building Wind farm solar farms, geothermal farms which are doing 146 00:26:24,225 --> 00:26:28,335 Paul Fenn: to a a higher level of car reduction 147 00:26:28,465 --> 00:26:35,765 Paul Fenn: than just power plant renewable power plants. And so that's what got us here. So please next slide, Rebecca. 148 00:26:39,515 --> 00:26:48,005 Paul Fenn: So a a really important part of the leap is realizing that carbon isn't just about electricity, that power. 149 00:26:48,125 --> 00:27:01,055 Paul Fenn: heat, transportation waste represent the full spectrum of addressable carbon for municipalities as identified by the United Nations. That. These are the carbon sources that 150 00:27:01,095 --> 00:27:03,555 Paul Fenn: communities can address 151 00:27:03,685 --> 00:27:12,215 Paul Fenn: and so we wanted to bring them all into the purview of the policy so that you would have the biggest 152 00:27:12,335 --> 00:27:13,954 Paul Fenn: possible climate 153 00:27:14,175 --> 00:27:16,325 Paul Fenn: impact in in your program 154 00:27:16,865 --> 00:27:21,265 Paul Fenn: and not just be limited to the power slice officially 155 00:27:21,505 --> 00:27:34,734 Paul Fenn: which is, maybe you know a quarter of your emissions technically. So, if you aren't dealing with heat and you're missing out on 20 or something, I don't know what it is locally transport another, you know, 2025% waste. 156 00:27:34,835 --> 00:27:39,495 Paul Fenn: Being a significant fourth on that list. 157 00:27:39,665 --> 00:27:54,805 Paul Fenn: So addressable carbon. 4 types of de R. Are needed to have a really robust climate strategy with the Cca. And then 7 kinds of energy users. Right? The the typical Cca in in New York 158 00:27:55,325 --> 00:28:04,445 Paul Fenn: really just has residential customers and small commercial customers. Many of them exclude subsidize participants 159 00:28:04,715 --> 00:28:09,904 Paul Fenn: like the assistance program participants, low income Lmi customers 160 00:28:10,045 --> 00:28:13,785 Paul Fenn: that qualify for subsidized utility bills. 161 00:28:13,965 --> 00:28:15,505 Paul Fenn: They're often excluded. 162 00:28:15,905 --> 00:28:22,425 Paul Fenn: And so you lose a huge part of the population. And therefore a huge, significant part of the carbon 163 00:28:22,575 --> 00:28:28,754 Paul Fenn: many of them exclude their government energy procurement. Governments are often 164 00:28:28,845 --> 00:28:50,085 Paul Fenn: among the largest energy users in their communities depending on the on the community educational institutions, large commercial institutions, specifically municipal institutions. Medical these are major uses. I mean, there's some CC is like San Francisco. We work there for 10 years and setting up their program 165 00:28:50,115 --> 00:28:55,574 Paul Fenn: where 50 buildings in downtown San Francisco consumed half of the energy in the city. 166 00:28:56,185 --> 00:29:14,704 Paul Fenn: So if they weren't included. Then where's the carbon? You know you're you're missing out on this huge slice. So to get carbon, you need an all addressable carbon, all 4 sources and a full range of customer types that are included. So this this program does that next slide, please, Rebecca. 167 00:29:16,945 --> 00:29:26,224 Paul Fenn: So, yeah, this this is just, you know, a visual on that, on that argument that if you have just electricity, you're only going to get so far in your carbon reductions, if you add 168 00:29:26,315 --> 00:29:34,375 Paul Fenn: heating or gas so that you're able to to electrify gas and and then to repower 169 00:29:34,835 --> 00:29:45,035 Paul Fenn: the electricity sources with renewables. Then you get a big leap on your carbon emissions. If you add transportation with electric vehicles. 170 00:29:45,565 --> 00:29:52,255 Paul Fenn: then all the more, and if you add waste decarbonization, then you get the full. You're really getting 171 00:29:52,705 --> 00:29:57,475 Paul Fenn: what you can get out of this out of this program next slide. 172 00:29:59,945 --> 00:30:16,915 Paul Fenn: And so yeah, the the the same that with with with the customer types. That residential is. Most of the of the users are residential, but a small fraction of the of the energy cons of the electricity. Consumption, anyway, is is residential 173 00:30:16,945 --> 00:30:25,665 Paul Fenn: in in most communities. So if you add small commercial, those are the so-called opt-out enrollment eligible customers in New York. 174 00:30:25,985 --> 00:30:27,935 Paul Fenn: Then, you know you're getting 175 00:30:29,605 --> 00:30:33,624 Paul Fenn: quite a bit, but you're but you're missing out on a lot. 176 00:30:33,665 --> 00:30:42,954 Paul Fenn: if you add municipalities, governance institutions, then it's getting more robust. If you add everybody. And you just say, Okay, whether you're opt out enroll 177 00:30:43,065 --> 00:30:58,945 Paul Fenn: or opt-in enrolled, you're eligible, and we're gonna offer service to you, and we're gonna solicit your participation. Then you get the full impact in terms of participating load, at least the potential impact from participating load 178 00:30:59,105 --> 00:31:00,075 Paul Fenn: next slide. 179 00:31:01,705 --> 00:31:04,535 So yeah, I mean the the way to do it is 180 00:31:04,635 --> 00:31:08,365 Paul Fenn: universal eligibility. All carbon. 181 00:31:08,935 --> 00:31:12,025 and the Cca. Is intended to to 182 00:31:12,255 --> 00:31:14,525 Paul Fenn: to throw the net wide. 183 00:31:14,685 --> 00:31:20,755 Paul Fenn: and so so that everyone has the opportunity to participate in this program 184 00:31:21,175 --> 00:31:25,555 Paul Fenn: and then to include technology types across all addressable carbon 185 00:31:26,465 --> 00:31:30,225 Paul Fenn: or in order to achieve the 2030 goal of the city and town 186 00:31:30,845 --> 00:31:31,835 Paul Fenn: next slide. 187 00:31:35,105 --> 00:31:42,154 Paul Fenn: So it's complex. But it it's it is actually necessary the the core strategy program 188 00:31:43,715 --> 00:31:44,795 is 189 00:31:45,625 --> 00:31:46,655 Paul Fenn: 2 190 00:31:47,065 --> 00:31:53,645 Paul Fenn: more rapidly. S switch people over to decarbonize power heat vehicles and waste 191 00:31:54,115 --> 00:31:55,894 Paul Fenn: that otherwise 192 00:31:56,305 --> 00:32:04,195 Paul Fenn: that otherwise can be Deli delivered a community scale. And currently, up until now. most 193 00:32:04,925 --> 00:32:06,925 Paul Fenn: programs. 194 00:32:07,075 --> 00:32:15,124 Paul Fenn: Cca programs, even. But also renewable energy incentive programs, energy efficiency incentive programs. 195 00:32:15,315 --> 00:32:18,584 Paul Fenn: just can't deliver 196 00:32:18,925 --> 00:32:24,344 Paul Fenn: the goals that the city and town adopted. They just don't have a sufficient 197 00:32:24,605 --> 00:32:31,634 Paul Fenn: amount of of leverage and if you want to call it 198 00:32:32,525 --> 00:32:33,955 Paul Fenn: purchase 199 00:32:33,995 --> 00:32:45,424 Paul Fenn: on the causes of carbon in the community to do that. it takes a lot to decarbonize the entire community. It can't just be done based upon a piecemeal approach 200 00:32:45,485 --> 00:32:49,335 Paul Fenn: or based upon approaches that have that that 201 00:32:49,745 --> 00:33:01,414 Paul Fenn: that concede exclusions or or or niching out of of the different customer types and the different carbon types where they're all separately decided and separately 202 00:33:01,705 --> 00:33:03,155 Paul Fenn: sourced. 203 00:33:03,335 --> 00:33:10,105 Paul Fenn: That piecemeal approach leads to the kind of very slow progress that we've seen 204 00:33:10,535 --> 00:33:25,284 Paul Fenn: in the country and around the world in the past 25 years that we need something more robust. We need an umbrella that that connects the the dots between technologies. The opportunity technologically, is so called technology convergence 205 00:33:25,475 --> 00:33:44,065 Paul Fenn: that today, in the past really 15 years, but but increasingly the electricity, heating transportation and waste technologies are converging into essentially to a common electrical system. 206 00:33:44,105 --> 00:33:47,684 Paul Fenn: So an electric vehicle is a battery 207 00:33:47,705 --> 00:33:53,195 Paul Fenn: electric vehicles that are configured properly. Can power buildings 208 00:33:53,905 --> 00:33:56,554 Paul Fenn: that's new. You couldn't do that before. 209 00:33:56,735 --> 00:34:00,965 Paul Fenn: and being able to do that, and also being able 210 00:34:01,015 --> 00:34:11,394 Paul Fenn: to put controls on a building that decides whether or not it uses the grid, or uses a solar panel or other resources on a nano-grid or a micro grid. 211 00:34:11,515 --> 00:34:33,654 Paul Fenn: These are all now happening and so they're no longer futuristic technologies. They're now in the market. The vehicles are in the market with with bi-directional chargers. The hybrid inverters are in the market that allows software control the grid connection heating systems, and cooling systems essentially have become 212 00:34:33,745 --> 00:34:36,874 Paul Fenn: forms of of energy storage. 213 00:34:36,954 --> 00:34:48,784 Paul Fenn: And these facilitate A new level of energy transition that just wasn't possible before. And so we have. 214 00:34:49,335 --> 00:34:55,105 Paul Fenn: This program. Is is very much focused on taking advantage of these technologies 215 00:34:55,285 --> 00:34:58,675 Paul Fenn: and creating a a matching 216 00:34:59,805 --> 00:35:05,135 Paul Fenn: program structure to to support their 217 00:35:05,685 --> 00:35:06,715 Paul Fenn: they're 218 00:35:06,825 --> 00:35:09,154 Paul Fenn: development in the community. 219 00:35:09,565 --> 00:35:18,355 Paul Fenn: So it's not simple. But the reason it's not simple is the community. Wide energy transition is a is a major initiative. It's inherently complex. If it's going to succeed. 220 00:35:18,515 --> 00:35:29,555 Paul Fenn: it, it has to be robust, and it has to evolve a degree of complexity. So the complexity is on the program design side. It's on the on the 221 00:35:29,925 --> 00:35:32,955 Paul Fenn: If you wanna call it the the soft side of the program. 222 00:35:33,195 --> 00:35:45,154 Paul Fenn: Energy transitions all over the world are challenged by these facts. Right? That's why carbon goals have not been met. That's why climate action is is in many ways stalled out around the world. 223 00:35:45,255 --> 00:35:55,355 Paul Fenn: And so this program is is intended to to provide that robust platform to enable community wide decarbonization 224 00:35:55,375 --> 00:36:02,854 Paul Fenn: as an answer to the call of the United Nations Secretary General regarding energy transitions by 2,030 to get to have 225 00:36:02,925 --> 00:36:20,904 Paul Fenn: energy transitions accomplished by that date that can serve as examples to the world for replication. and so this is a, you know, an answer that based on a largely proven model widely successful 2,000 cities across the country that are Ccas 226 00:36:20,945 --> 00:36:24,735 Paul Fenn: And half of the Us. Energy market 227 00:36:24,955 --> 00:36:44,494 Paul Fenn: and with the 2 point o model proven in California, usually successful in developing renewables. This is a third iteration to that, says, Okay, let's really put the the pedals and metal on what Cca can do, provided the the an adequate program structure to support it. 228 00:36:44,565 --> 00:36:46,775 Paul Fenn: So next slide, please. 229 00:36:47,645 --> 00:36:58,934 Paul Fenn: And Paul, just to note it's almost 4 40. II think I don't know how many more slides. I think it's just a few more. Okay, few more. So it's a robust engagement outreach education process 230 00:36:59,045 --> 00:37:00,154 Paul Fenn: to sign up. 231 00:37:00,385 --> 00:37:05,145 Paul Fenn: share own share buyers, users and site owners. And I'll just to explain that 232 00:37:05,285 --> 00:37:15,854 Paul Fenn: share buyers are people who who buy shares in a do so strictly financial participation, where the dividends from 233 00:37:15,985 --> 00:37:18,705 Paul Fenn: the generation of power on an asset. 234 00:37:18,785 --> 00:37:33,995 Paul Fenn: go to the investors and to localize that process to residents and businesses. In inside of the Cca users are people who are gonna use the energy that's generated by these systems, and they also will be 235 00:37:34,145 --> 00:37:45,634 Paul Fenn: share buyers, but that they will only be participantially. They'll also be physically taking their power, their heat, their transportation from from the dos physically. 236 00:37:45,755 --> 00:38:15,504 Paul Fenn: so that's the the robust engagement will be connecting these these people with site owners. Who's obviously permission will be required to develop assets like this and therefore to have a a site acquisition process as opposed to just a marketing process, which is the usual approach to to green power, you know, just having advertisements and wait for people to sign up. We're taking an acquisition approach to this instead. 237 00:38:15,795 --> 00:38:24,324 Paul Fenn: More like the way that a cell network is built out. It's not. It's it's it's based upon putting technologies where they fit 238 00:38:24,695 --> 00:38:33,515 Paul Fenn: and and soliciting participation of building owners and users on those locations. So there's more engineering involved. 239 00:38:33,605 --> 00:38:38,574 Paul Fenn: So we're we're we're going to have support 240 00:38:38,765 --> 00:38:40,375 Paul Fenn: from the city and town 241 00:38:40,395 --> 00:38:45,095 Paul Fenn: to provide ongoing communications identifying the program to the public. 242 00:38:45,375 --> 00:38:49,645 Paul Fenn: So we're trying to project a different idea here, because a key 243 00:38:49,805 --> 00:38:52,984 Paul Fenn: part of the opportunity is is 244 00:38:53,165 --> 00:38:59,585 Paul Fenn: to to to help people recognize in a market. That's very kind of in a way. 245 00:38:59,725 --> 00:39:03,435 Paul Fenn: energy markets are very opaque. 246 00:39:03,735 --> 00:39:06,505 Paul Fenn: and they are very 247 00:39:06,555 --> 00:39:09,184 Paul Fenn: saturated with 248 00:39:09,445 --> 00:39:17,954 Paul Fenn: bad information. Right? There's so we need to penetrate this this bad information. What I mean by that information is false marketing. 249 00:39:18,125 --> 00:39:26,445 Paul Fenn: which of which is a great deal in the energy sector, and and predatory 250 00:39:26,735 --> 00:39:27,995 Paul Fenn: activities 251 00:39:28,015 --> 00:39:47,315 Paul Fenn: that take advantage of people. So the need to to convey to the to the community. This is more like recycling meant as a community initiative. It's not just a product it's about people participating in a community wide energy transition. Its purposes are public in nature. 252 00:39:47,415 --> 00:39:57,635 Paul Fenn: and rather than just being essentially a product that's owned by a non-local 253 00:39:57,755 --> 00:40:01,595 Paul Fenn: financier, which is almost the entire renewable energy industry. 254 00:40:02,555 --> 00:40:08,704 Paul Fenn: because it's all obviously funded by investment tax credit, 255 00:40:08,735 --> 00:40:09,915 Paul Fenn: and so it's 256 00:40:09,995 --> 00:40:21,245 Paul Fenn: it's concentrating capital that's financing most renewable energy. This is looking to localize the finance, to enable the energy user to become the owner. So an authentic 257 00:40:21,515 --> 00:40:24,624 Paul Fenn: investment vehicle for 258 00:40:24,985 --> 00:40:26,705 Paul Fenn: residents and businesses 259 00:40:26,885 --> 00:40:38,304 Paul Fenn: to receive the benefits of ownership as opposed to paying a premium for a product whose economic benefits go to someone who's not local. And it's usually not identified. 260 00:40:38,655 --> 00:40:44,804 Paul Fenn: So to make the user into the beneficiary economic beneficiary. 261 00:40:45,695 --> 00:40:47,244 and the local power. 262 00:40:48,295 --> 00:40:54,304 Paul Fenn: I should say here, pardon me. The CC administrator in our current role now is a consultant 263 00:40:54,365 --> 00:41:07,274 Paul Fenn: But whoever the CC. Administrator will is is will act as a procurement agent for the customer, and designing and soliciting proposals for Dr. Projects. So, in other words, to help consumers, to 264 00:41:07,355 --> 00:41:10,865 Paul Fenn: to evaluate options 265 00:41:11,155 --> 00:41:29,434 Paul Fenn: without having to become experts in these technologies, because it is difficult to choose the technologies, and to to understand which ones make sense, for, like your home or your business, your circumstances, to help people adapt technologies to their circumstances, and then help them evaluate proposals 266 00:41:29,495 --> 00:41:33,264 Paul Fenn: from distributed energy resource providers 267 00:41:34,365 --> 00:41:35,574 Paul Fenn: next slide, please. 268 00:41:37,335 --> 00:41:46,194 Paul Fenn: So yeah, the the the purpose here is to go to scale. And right now, it's only the few, really who can participate in most of these technologies. And we we need it to be normalized 269 00:41:46,325 --> 00:41:51,214 Paul Fenn: in order to get greenhouse gas impacts that need 2030 goals. 270 00:41:51,985 --> 00:41:58,674 Paul Fenn: Excellent. And here's just a simple ex illustration of of the idea in terms of 271 00:41:58,715 --> 00:42:12,144 Paul Fenn: you know, how would people cooperate. These are for single family homes as opposed to, you know, denser, urban core. But you know some homes are good platforms for photovoltaic panels. Some are not 272 00:42:12,455 --> 00:42:15,654 Paul Fenn: some of them have ready parking, others don't. 273 00:42:15,945 --> 00:42:24,525 Paul Fenn: So different circumstances provides a pathway for cooperation right? And so to to help 274 00:42:24,795 --> 00:42:35,125 Paul Fenn: people share resources like a geothermal loop, like a solar panel. or hydrogen, or an electric vehicle 275 00:42:35,185 --> 00:42:39,995 Paul Fenn: on a network. To make their 276 00:42:40,235 --> 00:42:46,964 Paul Fenn: energy to lower the cost of the systems, to lower the capital burden, which is really the one of the main barriers to advance 277 00:42:47,185 --> 00:42:52,525 Paul Fenn: distributed energy resources to lower those capital burdens 278 00:42:52,825 --> 00:43:01,644 Paul Fenn: through co-investment into larger, more integrated systems. That's the core kind of strat technology strategy work. Nice slide. 279 00:43:03,925 --> 00:43:13,385 Paul Fenn: So in terms of the administrator. Roles and responsibilities. They include procurement of electricity. of natural gas and de R for customers 280 00:43:13,415 --> 00:43:16,264 Paul Fenn: to ensure compliance with State regulations. 281 00:43:16,485 --> 00:43:23,444 Paul Fenn: to facilitate neighborhood level co-investment by customers in these projects, and then to manage the bookkeeping 282 00:43:23,495 --> 00:43:35,465 Paul Fenn: for the Co. Investors to track the performance of systems that are installed, maintain the data and keep it current and provide annual reports to to the customer, to the Municipality and to the Public Service Commission. 283 00:43:35,845 --> 00:43:38,165 Paul Fenn: I think that is the end. 284 00:43:38,315 --> 00:43:50,114 Paul Fenn: Oh, no, there's one more. It's a summary, really, that just going up to high level again, you know. How do you achieve it? The twenty-thirty transition. What are the key kind of levers that you need to get that huge of an impact 285 00:43:50,155 --> 00:44:01,695 Paul Fenn: in such a short period of time. You need to include technologies that replace all addressable carbon types by the United Nations definition, you need to offer universal eligibility for investment. 286 00:44:02,165 --> 00:44:12,194 Paul Fenn: You need to include municipal electricity and gas accounts include both opt out eligible. Those are the small, the small commercial and residential customers. 287 00:44:12,285 --> 00:44:24,145 Paul Fenn: and then also include all opt ineligible electricity and gas accounts. Those are the large commercial and institutions universities. and then to provide 288 00:44:24,435 --> 00:44:42,015 Paul Fenn: trusted third party support to facilitate wrecking record keeping and track the air performance so that there's effectively a safe zone, a reliable source of information, so that consumers feel comfortable making these types of decisions. I believe that is the end. 289 00:44:43,495 --> 00:45:07,095 Rod Howe: Yes, great. Thank you. Both Paul and Rebecca, you know I again, just to underscore something, Rebecca said. At the beginning we thought it was important to go through this with local town and city officials, because presumably both will be potentially voting on this in September, the distributed energy resource plan. But certainly, when we do, the education and outreach. For the greater. 290 00:45:07,275 --> 00:45:10,244 Rod Howe: The general public will have to go back and 291 00:45:10,475 --> 00:45:23,464 Rod Howe: just do some table setting again about Cca. What is Cca. Why should I be interested? So these are sort of paired present. You can think of them as paired presentations. I think the general public will be more interested 292 00:45:23,475 --> 00:45:36,865 Rod Howe: in the Cca. The more general Cca. Part because not everyone's going to jump into being part of a deer initiative right away, although we would like to be encouraging that as we move forward. So 293 00:45:37,165 --> 00:45:39,455 Rod Howe: this is really an opportunity for 294 00:45:39,485 --> 00:45:50,765 Rod Howe: anyone to ask questions. If there's something we can go back to a slide if you want us to go back to a slide, but we're just open it up, and if I don't see your hand 295 00:45:50,815 --> 00:45:56,384 Rod Howe: just on view and say, Hey, I'm trying to ask a question. But who would like to start? 296 00:46:04,845 --> 00:46:07,705 Rod Howe: Bye, Laura? Thank you for joining us. 297 00:46:10,865 --> 00:46:22,835 Rod Howe: and and some of us have been looking at this a long time, and we still have questions. So know that we know it's not something you absorb. and one or 2 presentations 298 00:46:22,885 --> 00:46:29,265 Rod Howe: rich. I think you can agree to that right? Sometimes. It's yeah. I mean, I will. Just. I'll start the bidding by 299 00:46:29,385 --> 00:46:33,064 Rich DePaolo: asking Paul to maybe reflect a little bit on the 300 00:46:33,515 --> 00:46:42,214 Rich DePaolo: area of questions that I had most persistently along the way related to investment, equity 301 00:46:42,455 --> 00:47:11,525 Rich DePaolo: dividends, etc. Suppose, can you delineate, for example, between, say, a a sort of investor and a user? How does the investor derive a financial benefit? What happens if someone is participating in a deer as an investor or user and then elects to, they move out of town, or they're no longer participating. What happens to the their equity? Or is the equity only in the form of 302 00:47:11,585 --> 00:47:18,144 Rich DePaolo: of cost savings, etc., etc.? Can you just break that down a little bit because I know there's going to be some question about that. 303 00:47:18,815 --> 00:47:21,154 Paul Fenn: Yeah, no, it's it's it's 304 00:47:21,465 --> 00:47:27,334 Paul Fenn: it's a it's a good question. They they they are good. See series of questions, and there's a lot and 305 00:47:27,875 --> 00:47:29,835 Paul Fenn: a lot to talk about there 306 00:47:29,885 --> 00:47:34,004 Paul Fenn: the protocol that we've set up. And the local Dr. Plan 307 00:47:34,035 --> 00:47:35,685 Paul Fenn: is iterative? 308 00:47:35,805 --> 00:47:37,895 Paul Fenn: The the 309 00:47:38,195 --> 00:47:39,375 Paul Fenn: because these are 310 00:47:40,205 --> 00:47:42,685 Paul Fenn: this approach is 311 00:47:42,795 --> 00:47:48,624 Paul Fenn: designed to facilitate co-investment by neighbors. 312 00:47:48,975 --> 00:48:04,895 Paul Fenn: And so in the current market this is entirely voluntary activity, right? It's anyone can do this theoretically, nothing stops anyone from co-investing and and solar panels. And people do that. There are community solar projects. And 313 00:48:05,085 --> 00:48:18,814 Paul Fenn: there are vehicle shares, and there's nothing inherently new or regulated about the activity. People are free to co-invest in a way that they wish to co-invest with each other. 314 00:48:19,365 --> 00:48:24,915 Paul Fenn: the the and so between the the site owner, a user 315 00:48:24,965 --> 00:48:26,795 Paul Fenn: and a share buyer. 316 00:48:27,025 --> 00:48:35,314 Paul Fenn: These are, you know, the users are in the building site. Owner owns the building. The sharers are the users and neighbors who are not users. 317 00:48:35,345 --> 00:48:37,075 Paul Fenn: When I say neighbors, I mean 318 00:48:37,495 --> 00:48:41,834 in the same neighborhood. So not just in the same city, but in the same neighborhood. 319 00:48:42,145 --> 00:48:44,565 Paul Fenn: And so. 320 00:48:44,575 --> 00:48:46,845 Paul Fenn: because we have 321 00:48:47,115 --> 00:48:51,375 Paul Fenn: 4 categories of deers, power, heat. 322 00:48:51,675 --> 00:48:58,644 Paul Fenn: transportation, and waste. There's going to be a great diversity of projects 323 00:48:58,995 --> 00:49:03,595 Paul Fenn: in terms of the technologies that are involved. 324 00:49:03,715 --> 00:49:08,314 Paul Fenn: and because we're offering eligibility to 325 00:49:08,525 --> 00:49:10,255 Paul Fenn: all customers. 326 00:49:10,385 --> 00:49:13,785 Paul Fenn: There's gonna be a great diversity of 327 00:49:13,855 --> 00:49:19,295 Paul Fenn: forms of cooperation between people, right? Whether it's low income. 328 00:49:19,335 --> 00:49:35,975 Paul Fenn: You know, renters, public housing owners, condominiums, Co. Ops have all these different types of there, there have different kinds of Co investment that will correspond to that. So what we did in the local Dr. Plan was to set up a protocol 329 00:49:35,985 --> 00:49:49,515 Paul Fenn: to create templates for agreements between different types as they emerge because it is iterative. We have to to sign people up that want to basically lead the idea here is to use leadership in the community. 330 00:49:49,545 --> 00:49:53,675 Paul Fenn: To drive the process. One of the takeaways of 331 00:49:53,745 --> 00:50:02,354 Paul Fenn: what we had from CC, 2 point was that this is lacking. There needed to be something for the activists to do, people that want to need 332 00:50:02,765 --> 00:50:08,135 Paul Fenn: And so the leaders then can can 333 00:50:08,465 --> 00:50:27,765 Paul Fenn: through the enrollment process. We'll work with them to to develop template agreements with the the early groups that form and then bring those back to the Cca Advisory Group for review and sign off. And this pretty much matches the Public Service Commission 334 00:50:27,905 --> 00:50:29,435 Paul Fenn: Protocol 335 00:50:29,515 --> 00:50:45,425 Paul Fenn: for approval of Cca. Supply documents. So it's it's like a little a little version of the Psc approval process. At the Dr. Level, recognizing, though, that those agreements are consensual. They're not regulated. And so 336 00:50:46,385 --> 00:50:53,405 Paul Fenn: we believe, and we agreed that that the municipality should have some oversight. even though it's not required 337 00:50:53,845 --> 00:51:05,555 Paul Fenn: just so that there is a coherent process, and so that it sets a good example for others that may follow. In implementing this kind of a model. So it isn't just some 338 00:51:05,645 --> 00:51:14,764 Paul Fenn: a broker with a black box, and no one knows how it works, and and they use whatever agreements they want, and can take advantage of people, but instead to have a 339 00:51:14,895 --> 00:51:24,875 Paul Fenn: some process around that for review and sign off before the templates are approved, then, once the templates approved, it can be reused. Ultimately we'll end up having a bunch of different templates 340 00:51:25,205 --> 00:51:37,054 Paul Fenn: reflecting the different types of groups, different kinds of technologies. But those will take some time to develop. And and we didn't wanna sort of over determine or over design a priori how that's gonna work. 341 00:51:37,135 --> 00:51:46,075 Paul Fenn: Recognizing that diversity is a very important part of universal service, universal access that you really don't get universal access. 342 00:51:46,085 --> 00:51:55,435 Paul Fenn: If you over determine how those agreements are gonna work. Yeah. So thank you for that clarification. I just want just wanted to ask one 343 00:51:55,475 --> 00:52:05,344 Rich DePaolo: verifying question. So these projects, they're all gonna take shape in different ways. They're all gonna have different values based on the investment that is needed in order to get them 344 00:52:05,505 --> 00:52:19,274 Rich DePaolo: up and running, there will be a finite number of shares available. Am I to presume the the the investor base can't be infinite. Right? It just is, there's a yeah. 345 00:52:19,405 --> 00:52:20,365 Paul Fenn: So yeah. 346 00:52:20,475 --> 00:52:27,765 Paul Fenn: it'll be based entirely on the size of the project the number of participants. So if you're in a you know, if if you're in a 347 00:52:27,815 --> 00:52:37,834 Paul Fenn: a multi unit, residential building or a mixed use, high density, urban area downtown city of Ithaca. Then you might have hundreds of people right that are in a co-OP 348 00:52:37,915 --> 00:52:48,525 Paul Fenn: the the the users in the building, and then the neighbors, if you're in a small S. Edge of town of Ithaca single family homes 349 00:52:48,915 --> 00:52:51,525 Paul Fenn: it could be, you know, 7 people. 350 00:52:52,195 --> 00:52:54,774 Paul Fenn: 2 houses that are connected. 351 00:52:54,925 --> 00:53:07,295 Paul Fenn: And so that the the users, the site owner and the users are the first steps of decision making 352 00:53:07,305 --> 00:53:11,355 Paul Fenn: for enrollment and and and for 353 00:53:11,585 --> 00:53:17,045 Paul Fenn: specifying the size of the facility and with the technology components 354 00:53:17,145 --> 00:53:24,544 Paul Fenn: to physically serve the buildings that are involved. Right? So it's essentially scale to the buildings, appropriate technology kind of approach. 355 00:53:24,595 --> 00:53:37,224 Paul Fenn: And then, once that has occurred, that and that's the key challenge right to to to enroll people in investment decisions is a hard, harder part of it who are actually going to use the system. That's the hard part. 356 00:53:37,245 --> 00:53:45,344 Paul Fenn: The easy part is enrolling investors because it's essentially a financial decision. It is strictly 357 00:53:45,665 --> 00:53:56,905 Paul Fenn: on paper does not require real cooperation like you need between people that are going to share an electric vehicle right? 2 people going to share electric vehicle. They have to decide 358 00:53:56,995 --> 00:54:23,594 Paul Fenn: how it is we're gonna share this car right? Or if it's a heating system, or if it's a solar panel on a micro grid. That's a serious relationship that takes some parsing and coordination. And that's the hard part the easy part is, who in the neighborhood wants to buy into this system, and that'll be based upon availability of shares which are entirely the result of the size of the project. So it goes back to the need for diversity. It's not cookie cutter. It's based on specific 359 00:54:23,665 --> 00:54:31,844 Paul Fenn: parameters in specific buildings that whose occupants and owners have responded to this message. 360 00:54:31,895 --> 00:54:41,325 Paul Fenn: And the the share buyers that participate financially are essentially are the third step in in in enrollment 361 00:54:41,405 --> 00:54:51,765 Paul Fenn: and the number of investors will depend on basically what amount of equity the users and owners are opening up to investment. 362 00:54:51,995 --> 00:55:21,244 Rich DePaolo: Okay, that all makes sense. I'll I'll stay out of the weeds, for now I will eventually there'll be be more clarity as to what happens, let's say, when a resident in a multi family building or department building leaves town, their share becomes available. Somebody else wants to purchase a share. Is that bought at par value? Is there? Is the equity taken into consideration? All those questions that I still have. But I appreciate your your clarification to this point. 363 00:55:23,015 --> 00:55:30,774 Rod Howe: So other questions it would be really helpful for those who haven't been. Cj. 364 00:55:30,885 --> 00:55:37,754 C.J. Randall, TOI Planning: yes, thank you so much. For this presentation. That's Rebecca and Paul. So fascinating. Topic. 365 00:55:37,865 --> 00:55:53,834 C.J. Randall, TOI Planning: You know, being a land use planner first and foremost. I'm trying to understand a little bit about how you foresee the different renewable technologies. And what scale? If I think, if I'm hearing you correctly. 366 00:55:53,975 --> 00:56:04,695 C.J. Randall, TOI Planning: This could be a variety of renewable generation technologies at both, a say, smaller parcel, urban parcel 367 00:56:04,905 --> 00:56:21,695 C.J. Randall, TOI Planning: scale, as well as perhaps more quote utility scale. When I mean utility scale like large scale. You know, the community solar, maybe size or community wind 5 megawatt or 5 to 20 megawatt size. 368 00:56:21,955 --> 00:56:38,174 C.J. Randall, TOI Planning: and just conceptually trying to understand how a program can address. You know all those different scales and how it works with this. And then you know what we can do? We, as you know, planners to to help. 369 00:56:40,845 --> 00:56:43,915 Paul Fenn: Should I take that, Rebecca, are you? We won't take it, or 370 00:56:44,065 --> 00:56:48,244 Paul Fenn: okay, I'll give mine. I'm taking notes. So if you don't mind, that'd be great. 371 00:56:48,955 --> 00:56:54,364 Paul Fenn: Yeah. So there, there are. Cj, there, there are essentially, I guess, 2 categories 372 00:56:54,525 --> 00:57:03,055 Paul Fenn: one category, which is really the the emphasis of this program because it's focused on decarbonization is on the building level. 373 00:57:03,305 --> 00:57:15,055 Paul Fenn: And that's where the generation and the load are physically connected on the same site. And so it's not seeking to export back onto the grid, seeking to self consume on the site 374 00:57:15,465 --> 00:57:21,745 Paul Fenn: that's where you get your biggest carbon impact per per dollar, you know, per, per Watt. 375 00:57:21,925 --> 00:57:27,304 Paul Fenn: and so that is the strategic focus is getting that to happen, because that's the 376 00:57:27,435 --> 00:57:32,095 Paul Fenn: really the main part of the market that has never been penetrated at scale 377 00:57:32,425 --> 00:57:35,305 Paul Fenn: effectively, I mean, except for very few places 378 00:57:35,485 --> 00:57:43,995 Paul Fenn: but typically is, is is under exploited. That is the urban core, right? But also people's 379 00:57:44,045 --> 00:57:50,684 Paul Fenn: most homes, most businesses. Whereas the market tends to gravitate out into green fields. 380 00:57:50,815 --> 00:58:12,225 Paul Fenn: The reason is that the transaction costs are higher and and that the system is really set up for that arrangement right? Other utilities prefer it because they get revenue from transmission. And and so the whole regulatory paradigm has been sort of pushed things out into the suburbs just like development. Right? This is where there's preference for Greenfield. And so 381 00:58:12,225 --> 00:58:22,844 Paul Fenn: we anticipate that there will be you know, brown field systems that are that are grid connected. And there may be some 382 00:58:22,845 --> 00:58:40,654 Paul Fenn: some green field systems that come into play. Those have to basically feed through the grid like any other system. They have to basically feed through the the energy service provider to the Cca so they effectively. That would be a sort of conventional part of the program. 383 00:58:40,755 --> 00:58:44,784 Paul Fenn: But it's really not the the, the 384 00:58:46,145 --> 00:58:52,665 Paul Fenn: the core goal really, of this program which is to break into behind the meter systems 385 00:58:53,015 --> 00:58:56,685 Paul Fenn: that are eliminating grid load 386 00:58:57,455 --> 00:59:15,175 Paul Fenn: and and natural gas load. And so when I say the systems, they're not just generation systems, they're also appliance retrofits their billy envelope, envelope retrofits and efficiency measures. So it's it's really a deep retro fit approach to buildings that really fits into the city's decarbonization program. 387 00:59:15,175 --> 00:59:28,825 Paul Fenn: Building decarbonization programs very partly. Why, I think we we got hooked up was that it's very aligned to that kind of paradigm. But yeah, there can. There may be some some Greenfield elements to this. 388 00:59:28,825 --> 00:59:48,064 Paul Fenn: but we're trying to minimize it. And just because that's become a problem, right? I mean, so that's become a big conflict area where farms are getting converted to essentially industrial uses. And it's causing a lot of opposition to renewable energy. And it's just the missed opportunity. 389 00:59:48,455 --> 00:59:56,415 Paul Fenn: And and these markets just like redevelopments in this opportunity that that you know, the urban cores are left to rot. 390 00:59:56,505 --> 01:00:03,174 Paul Fenn: and then the farms all get destroyed. And it's because of essentially a dysfunctional market that 391 01:00:03,365 --> 01:00:12,364 Paul Fenn: that continues to to cause a lot of damage in effect, when, when, if the transaction costs can be addressed. 392 01:00:12,695 --> 01:00:16,514 Paul Fenn: which more the the approach we're taking is really designed to do. 393 01:00:16,715 --> 01:00:36,765 Paul Fenn: Then the create, the the added marginal cost of developing systems in buildings can be reduced. The marketing costs can be reduced. Those are very significant percentage of the costs installed systems like half right. And then the photovoltaic arena. 394 01:00:36,915 --> 01:00:40,544 Paul Fenn: Half of the cost of your install system is customer acquisition 395 01:00:42,215 --> 01:00:45,264 Paul Fenn: of the cost of your system was to find you. 396 01:00:45,335 --> 01:00:59,095 Paul Fenn: and which is retarded. And so, you know, we're we're trying to to to rationalize those processes in this program. Use the aggregation just the way. Same way, aggregation lower the cost of supply 397 01:00:59,125 --> 01:01:14,005 Paul Fenn: and broke a lot of the the assumed economic rules of the market, namely, that green power is more expensive than brown power. That was an unquestioned rule until about 15 years ago, and it was mostly Cca. That broke it 398 01:01:14,465 --> 01:01:20,794 Paul Fenn: because aggregations enabled Ccas that were greener and cheaper, and before that there were that didn't happen. 399 01:01:21,005 --> 01:01:33,575 Rod Howe: So let me stop you there, cause I think you've answered the question. I'll see if there's other questions. Now the town is head of Rebecca. Sorry, just wanted to add one thing to Cj's question. I think 400 01:01:33,615 --> 01:01:50,275 Rebecca Evans: one of the benefits of this program is to your question about utility scale, or, you know, larger than just a couple of buildings, is that this would provide a pathway for, say, the municipalities to co-invest in, say, large-scale battery storage. 401 01:01:50,435 --> 01:02:06,335 Rebecca Evans: That it's a different relationship, I think. Then say, a group of neighbors or something like that. And I think that allows for the scale to be bigger but just wanted to to add that as well, that this would provide the the financial structure, I guess, to to enable that. 402 01:02:07,355 --> 01:02:14,884 Rod Howe: So the town has had a couple of opportunities. Oh, good Cynthia, Cynthia has a question, Cynthia, you need a different picture. It's summer. 403 01:02:19,065 --> 01:02:23,505 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): Yeah. Sorry about that. That's a hold over from a while ago, apparently. 404 01:02:23,825 --> 01:02:42,375 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): Thank you also. Thank you for all the work on this, and thank you for Rebecca for bringing in the answer to the question that I'd raise at the Peep meeting. having to do with the energy coming in into this grid as well as coming out of the grid, and I think you use the traffic analogy. So thank you for that. 405 01:02:42,735 --> 01:02:50,955 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): and also appreciate, your mentioning that battery storage can open up the the zones that can participate. 406 01:02:51,765 --> 01:03:05,965 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): As you all know, I'm I'm from Hawaii. My, my island is actually Maui. So I'm paying a lot of attention to what is happening in communities. You know it's a tropical island, and the island is on fire. 407 01:03:06,045 --> 01:03:11,225 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): And I am reminded the of the importance of creating 408 01:03:11,375 --> 01:03:18,084 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): resiliency in the system. It was mentioned that the system is not talking about distribution. 409 01:03:18,095 --> 01:03:26,165 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): that you are basically talking about production and purchasing processes and and ownership processes. 410 01:03:26,305 --> 01:03:30,155 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): But, as we see on Maui, the distribution 411 01:03:30,265 --> 01:03:40,235 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): system of of energy is equally important. If we want to be resilient. Many decisions were made over the years to 412 01:03:40,275 --> 01:03:43,325 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): Do not put our distribution system underground. 413 01:03:43,715 --> 01:03:49,675 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): And that makes us exposed, obviously, to fires and droughts. 414 01:03:49,775 --> 01:04:01,825 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): I'm recalling recent discussions on the county level, having to do with the fact that much of the undeveloped land in Tompkins County has been planted with red pine 415 01:04:02,045 --> 01:04:12,125 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): as a mono crop in 1930. Red pine has a very shallow root structure. Very obviously it burns very hot and fast during a drought. 416 01:04:12,225 --> 01:04:20,985 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): So as we look to Canada as we look to Mali, as we look to other cities that are facing drought and the risk of fire. 417 01:04:21,005 --> 01:04:41,344 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): Are we going to at some point include a conversation about making our electrical distribution systems more resilient? I know it's not part of the con. The conversation at this point, but I think it needs to be in terms of a long term, holistic view of how do we support our community. 418 01:04:43,575 --> 01:04:54,334 Rebecca Evans: I may be able to just comment on that. I know there wasn't. There wasn't really a question in there. I think we can remain flexible in terms of where this goes in the future. I don't think that 419 01:04:54,345 --> 01:05:05,535 Rebecca Evans: anything is out of the question at this point, but we would need to have the capital in order to to purchase that infrastructure. The other thing that's important to remember is that we need to get off of gas 420 01:05:05,735 --> 01:05:29,384 Rebecca Evans: before we can start undergrounding our electrical utilities. If we want to save a boat located dog is so cute if we want to save a boatload of money, because we can actually utilize that infrastructure, and then the utility will actually have to pay for it. So when the util, when we are no longer using natural gas. It is the utilities responsibility to decommission, that infrastructure. 421 01:05:29,405 --> 01:05:37,044 Rebecca Evans: and they have to pay for it. When we do that. That's a really really good time to start undergrounding our electrical lines. 422 01:05:37,265 --> 01:05:46,055 Rebecca Evans: But I think if we start trying to do step 2 before doing step one. It causes a lot of unnecessary costs. 423 01:05:46,135 --> 01:05:51,665 Rebecca Evans: So as we have neighbors, for example, investing in these, 424 01:05:51,825 --> 01:06:02,514 Rebecca Evans: say, heat pumps or otherwise electrifying thermal loads. That is the time to start having the questions of, okay, can we start decommissioning neighborhood? And then what's the next step? 425 01:06:02,775 --> 01:06:15,875 Rebecca Evans: But I don't think we're. I don't think we're close to the point of having a conversation at the whole city scale. Not yet. And I do know that you're right, Cynthia. This is 426 01:06:16,055 --> 01:06:31,984 Rod Howe: somewhat broader than obviously what we're focused on right now. But I do know that Terry Carroll and others are having conversations to try to figure out this broader resiliency issue. So I think those I I've sort of lost track, but I do know that those discussions 427 01:06:32,065 --> 01:06:33,155 Rod Howe: are happening 428 01:06:34,535 --> 01:06:56,094 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): and and it's fun to see your travel and a dog and all that kind of stuff so good just very quickly, I mean, I don't know if it's something where, when the city or town is looking at, putting in and replacing water and and sewer pipes, and so on, and dealing with I and I. Is this something that 429 01:06:56,125 --> 01:06:57,925 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): can be folded into that 430 01:06:58,085 --> 01:07:02,334 Cynthia Brock (She/Her): project as well just just to put that out as an aside 431 01:07:04,655 --> 01:07:05,525 Rod Howe: noted. 432 01:07:06,345 --> 01:07:24,275 Rod Howe: yeah, you're you're you're taking us in directions. We weren't ready to go in yet, but that's good. That's good. So other questions from the city and Bill, this is kind of newer stuff for you, I mean. So I'm I'm I'm hoping you might have a question in part to help us 433 01:07:24,345 --> 01:07:41,114 Rod Howe: figure out. Oh, you know we missed that. We need to dig more deeply into some issue, and even though I had said to my CC. Colleagues, we'll wait for you to ask questions at the end. You can ask questions now, too. So if any of our CC colleagues have any questions, please just raise your hand. 434 01:07:56,755 --> 01:07:58,105 Rod Howe: Guillermo. 435 01:07:59,975 --> 01:08:04,515 Rod Howe: Thank you, Emma. You some people may not know who you are. So if you can just 436 01:08:04,795 --> 01:08:06,175 Rod Howe: introduce yourself. 437 01:08:06,335 --> 01:08:14,625 Guillermo Metz: Yeah. Hi, thanks. I do. You know what's with cooperative extension? I run what's called the energy and climate change team. So we 438 01:08:14,665 --> 01:08:24,005 Guillermo Metz: run a variety of programs that help residents and municipal officials understand their energy use and programs that 439 01:08:24,435 --> 01:08:29,254 Guillermo Metz: allow them to reduce energy use and convert off of fossil fuels essentially 440 01:08:29,775 --> 01:08:38,054 Guillermo Metz: at extension in Tompkins County. And we, we run programs throughout the Southern tier and even more broadly. 441 01:08:38,114 --> 01:08:44,555 Guillermo Metz: but a very specific question to the investment side. Is there 442 01:08:44,965 --> 01:08:55,035 Guillermo Metz: thought at this point in how to make it available to everyone, Rebecca, you talked about it being accessible to everyone at every level renters, etc. 443 01:08:55,085 --> 01:09:01,425 Guillermo Metz: No credit check. It sounds like, and no minimum investment. Is that the idea? 444 01:09:02,864 --> 01:09:14,144 Paul Fenn: That is yes, that is the idea? The the obviously we have to to pre-qualify, enroll banks and define the terms that are gonna 445 01:09:14,205 --> 01:09:19,205 Paul Fenn: work for them with co-ops. But part of the idea is to use a shares vehicle 446 01:09:19,335 --> 01:09:30,024 Paul Fenn: to open up investment. So that. And that's the emphasis on on. You know, users de R. Users and site owners. 447 01:09:30,074 --> 01:09:41,825 Paul Fenn: To, you know. Provide the project, the platform for the project, and but to define it as as as open to to the neighborhood 448 01:09:42,065 --> 01:10:01,145 Paul Fenn: and to have active enrollment people in the neighborhood in those projects. But it does depend upon consent of parties. It is a voluntary activity consent of the owner. Consent of the users and consent of the lender. So you know, there's there's work still to be done on, on 449 01:10:01,615 --> 01:10:14,185 Paul Fenn: facilitating that, and specifically on establishing security for the parties an adequate security to for the lender. 450 01:10:14,245 --> 01:10:21,464 Paul Fenn: But that's partly the concept here is that you, instead of just exposing or requiring the lender to deal with 451 01:10:21,585 --> 01:10:33,274 Paul Fenn: with? Sub whatever sub. 6 70 s. Credit score borrowers to essentially bundle together. Credit worthy borrowers 452 01:10:33,425 --> 01:10:53,724 Paul Fenn: with non credit, worthy borrowers in into co-ops, right? So that there is a structure to that relationship, and then to work out the security factors in the cooperative agreements between them in a way that's sensitive to their situation rather than cookie cutter. 453 01:10:53,785 --> 01:10:56,115 Paul Fenn: so it's it's it's 454 01:10:56,125 --> 01:10:58,735 at this point an art, not a science. 455 01:10:58,795 --> 01:11:11,515 Paul Fenn: but the structure of those intended to be more robust than what the market gives you, which is just individual exposure to credit conditions, and therefore de facto redlining of the vast majority of of consumers. 456 01:11:13,415 --> 01:11:16,025 Rod Howe: Jeremiah, do you have a follow-up question, or did that? 457 01:11:16,075 --> 01:11:22,274 Guillermo Metz: No, that's very helpful. I think that there is a lot to be figured out in the details. And I 458 01:11:22,745 --> 01:11:32,085 Guillermo Metz: would wanna see, I guess, little concerned about the timeline that it would take for a project to be identified, a developer to edit be identified, the founders 459 01:11:32,165 --> 01:11:35,654 Guillermo Metz: or institutions that can fund the project 460 01:11:35,775 --> 01:11:40,564 Guillermo Metz: to be identified, and then investors to be identified, and then the project actually built. 461 01:11:40,635 --> 01:11:44,544 Guillermo Metz: etc. So I think I would want to be realistic with 462 01:11:44,795 --> 01:11:56,725 Guillermo Metz: off takers on what the expected timeline of something like that could be. And obviously it it depends on whether it's solar or geothermal or whatever. But I expect that they would be quite long. 463 01:11:59,065 --> 01:12:06,585 Paul Fenn: Yeah, I mean, it would be, I guess, a comparison of the site acquisition process A 464 01:12:08,195 --> 01:12:10,294 and the development process 465 01:12:10,445 --> 01:12:12,895 Paul Fenn: versus the interconnect queue. 466 01:12:14,015 --> 01:12:27,734 Paul Fenn: Yeah, that's true. And so we're just like we're trying to. We'll have a new set of problems through this strategy and and clearly. But we're but it won't have that problem. 467 01:12:27,895 --> 01:12:34,675 Paul Fenn: and it partly will, I think, offer relief to that problem and and just open up a new pathway to 468 01:12:34,705 --> 01:12:38,355 Paul Fenn: to a rebels development that isn't there right now. So it's 469 01:12:38,425 --> 01:12:43,394 Paul Fenn: but yeah, no, it's it's a lot of work in the process. 470 01:12:43,495 --> 01:12:46,124 Paul Fenn: You know, we're we're there, are obviously there. 471 01:12:46,195 --> 01:12:47,664 Paul Fenn: there, there are. 472 01:12:47,725 --> 01:12:54,975 Paul Fenn: That's why we want to use this template process so not to be over standardized, but to work towards standardization 473 01:12:55,045 --> 01:13:13,864 Paul Fenn: and and hopefully, that will speed up the enrollment processes. And obviously we'll have to develop a a like, I said, adequate up terms for the lenders to participate. That's gonna be a whole discussion but it's yeah. It's a 2030 strategy. It's it's not looking to 474 01:13:14,035 --> 01:13:23,994 Paul Fenn: complete the whole thing in one or 2 years. It's it's, you know, 6, 7 years out, but it's trying to set up a robust process with good principles, you know, so that 475 01:13:24,045 --> 01:13:29,544 Paul Fenn: we've got a solid basis 476 01:13:29,585 --> 01:13:35,305 Paul Fenn: to to work out those those those problems, and hopefully, that by doing it speed up the process. 477 01:13:36,125 --> 01:13:37,415 Guillermo Metz: That's great. Thank you. 478 01:13:38,105 --> 01:13:49,664 Rod Howe: So I put Bill Goodman on the spot, and he left. So I'll see if Texan or Dev have any questions, and see if that means they leave too. Dixon or Deb. Do you have any questions? 479 01:13:49,865 --> 01:13:58,434 Deb Mohlenhoff: No, I'm good. I've been in a few iterations of this presentation, and I have direct access to Rebecca anytime I need. So I'm set. But, thank you. 480 01:13:59,105 --> 01:14:00,455 Rod Howe: Dixon. 481 01:14:05,715 --> 01:14:10,455 Rod Howe: he's also good, he says in the chat. 482 01:14:11,555 --> 01:14:13,455 Rod Howe: Anyone else have 483 01:14:13,545 --> 01:14:17,485 Rod Howe: questions rich. Did you want to circle back around to anything. 484 01:14:18,605 --> 01:14:23,355 Rich DePaolo: No, I only prolong the meeting for everyone else 485 01:14:23,655 --> 01:14:32,244 Rich DePaolo: I mentioned. There'll be. We'll be meeting going forward. If we get into any specifics. I'll hold off until those meetings. 486 01:14:32,825 --> 01:14:39,545 Rod Howe: So one last chance for any questions. If you think of things afterwards. 487 01:14:39,625 --> 01:14:51,465 Rod Howe: just email me rich. Rebecca, whoever you know, just email us questions, and we'll the Cca team meets. We still call it the I guess we call it the Tjen 488 01:14:51,495 --> 01:15:00,125 Rod Howe: team meets every other week. So we meet on a regular basis. So feel free to ask us additional questions. 489 01:15:00,185 --> 01:15:16,305 Rod Howe: We will be starting to think about education and outreach about the broader Cca. Picture fairly soon. But we this was important, since both the city and the town will be presumably voting on the Dr. Plan in September. So 490 01:15:16,415 --> 01:15:18,885 Rod Howe: any final questions. 491 01:15:21,365 --> 01:15:26,675 Rod Howe: So Rebecca and Paul, thank you very much. For your presentation. 492 01:15:26,745 --> 01:15:32,295 Rod Howe: and I think it's it's a beautiful evening. So go out and enjoy the evening 493 01:15:32,415 --> 01:15:33,725 Paul Fenn: next chair. 494 01:15:33,795 --> 01:15:35,325 Paul Fenn: Alright. Thanks, everybody. 495 01:15:35,435 --> 01:15:37,895 Gay Nicholson: Thanks. Do see you later.