[0:18] Good afternoon.
>> Good afternoon.
[0:20] » All right. I think we go ahead and
get started.
[0:27] Uh through here the August meeting
minutes.
[0:35] » I'll make a motion to accept them.
>> I'll second that.
[0:43] » Uh any discussion or do you want a
moment to review?
[0:47] You weren't here then.
>> Uh no, I did I did read them. Am I
[0:50] allowed to vote on this if I'm not
there?
[0:52] I can, right?
>> I smart would abstain.
[0:55] » Yeah.
>> I'd like you to abstain.
[0:57] » Okay.
>> Okay.
[1:01] Uh
any other discussion?
[1:04] » I'm good.
>> Okay. All those in favor?
[1:06] » I.
>> Uh
[1:09] Mike, you're going to abstain.
>> I'll yes, politely abstain.
[1:16] » Uh I'm telling you rather.
[1:20] Mike, you will abstain.
Uh Prospect
[1:27] Farm, I spoke with Rick Davis
uh yesterday morning and he will be up
[1:35] there at the end of the month.
>> End of September?
[1:38] » Yep.
Um
[1:42] and kind of just doing the similar
thing. Um I don't know
[1:46] » [snorts]
>> I have not heard if
[1:53] » Michael?
>> Yeah, if Michael is going to be out
[1:56] there before or something.
>> I'll talk to Michael
[1:58] tomorrow.
>> Okay.
[2:00] » [clears throat]
>> He called me today.
[2:01] » Does he have stuff that he's already
cut?
[2:04] Or trim that needs to be moved before
Rick gets up there?
[2:07] » There is I I haven't There was.
Some of it got moved. I haven't seen the
[2:13] extent of it, but I think that he was in
the game
[2:16] either when Rick was up there with um
the equipment, it would be easier just
[2:20] to load it on the equipment and pull it
out.
[2:23] » I would agree.
>> Yeah, I'll talk with Michael tomorrow.
[2:26] He called me today. I was just going
>> And some of it he may not be able to mow
[2:30] it that close to the tree anyway.
>> Right.
[2:32] And
And wasn't it last year that
[2:35] someone did groundwork, hand work?
>> Yeah, Rick did.
[2:38] » Okay.
>> Yeah.
[2:39] » I don't know if he said that out loud.
>> He did.
[2:42] They did it.
Last year
[2:44] in particular, it seemed like they did
an excellent job.
[2:46] » Yeah, I I made sure I
>> Yeah.
[2:48] » told him how much we appreciate it.
>> Yeah, it was excellent.
[2:52] They really set the precedent like for
Michael to go and see him go up there
[2:56] and see that.
[2:58] I can mow with this.
[3:04] » Okay.
[3:08] Um
[3:12] Other than that, I don't have
anything.
[3:17] On prospect is
>> I'll touch bases with Ian, who's the new
[3:20] ED, just to make sure that he and Silas
know that they're responsible to mow.
[3:26] Yeah, but feel then to check the water
bars coming down from Hall's Ledge.
[3:30] » Okay. Yeah, that was my only other
>> Yeah.
[3:32] » question.
And I'm a little delinquent, but uh
[3:36] one of the volunteers wants to get some
signs out for the old
[3:40] um cellar holes that are
on trip. I needed just find some time to
[3:45] do the background so that we have the
right information to put on those signs
[3:48] to put up there.
>> There used to be
[3:51] little plaques.
>> Yeah.
[3:54] » I don't find
>> There's There's one at the orchard, but
[3:56] I don't think there's any plaques left
on the sites [clears throat] there.
[4:00] » Well, there actually there should be a a
write-up.
[4:03] » Yeah.
>> There's already like a
[4:05] » I just need to look at it.
>> With a spreadsheet and write up all the
[4:08] the like the jazz we pulled together for
each of the different locations and then
[4:12] we
voted on how we were going to
[4:15] do the wording.
>> Do they want to put them like on the
[4:18] higher ones as well? Like the one that's
there up by
[4:21] Hub's Loop or just like the lower ones?
The orchard
[4:23] » All All of them.
The only one that they really don't have
[4:27] any that I've seen any history on is
you know where the orchard trail is of
[4:31] course the other way is the forest
service.
[4:33] » Mhm.
>> There's a cellar hole off
[4:36] on that access road to the log landing.
I don't think anybody's ever determined
[4:40] what that's
what what the history of that site is.
[4:46] » What site was that?
>> When you go out on the what we call the
[4:50] spur
>> Harter Spur
[4:52] » Yeah.
I wonder if Dexter Harding
[4:56] did that interpretive trail with
students like years and years ago. I
[5:00] wonder if that was part of it.
>> Maybe he didn't go that high.
[5:03] » I don't think he I don't think we went
that
[5:07] far cuz I did a a number of walks with
Dexter, Lucy and others.
[5:13] And um
[5:18] we did the full boundary of Prospect.
And bushwhacked down
[5:25] to um
Fallen Leaf Road.
[5:28] And I just
I can't I can't pull up the
[5:31] » I think if you look at the forest
management plan, it has that one as
[5:34] unknown.
>> Mhm. Okay.
[5:37] » I I'd have to go back and look, but
that's my recollection.
[5:40] » That's fun.
That's good.
[5:42] » I think the other five are
are tagged as new.
[5:45] » Yeah.
[5:49] » And I There's a little bit of that
history now as preface for this book as
[5:52] well.
[5:55] » I was trying to see where you had
[5:59] I'll look on the Google Drive
>> Yeah, I
[6:01] » There might have been a folder.
>> I I think you're right. I just haven't
[6:05] had time to go back and look.
[6:09] » How do you access that?
>> I can send
[6:12] » I'll send
>> you can If you can resend that.
[6:14] » I will share it.
[6:17] » That's about as far as I get.
>> Okay.
[6:31] » Okay. Anything else for Prospect Farm?
[6:39] Okay.
Jackson Falls, I met with the select
[6:43] board
at their last meeting and presented
[6:48] the
uh
[6:49] drawing uh plan drawings and the
uh cost estimate.
[6:56] Um
They said it looked
[7:00] interesting and might support having a
public
[7:03] meeting for to to discuss it and also we
discussed sort of the funding of it and
[7:10] um
I think they were leaning towards the
[7:13] Conservation Commission
trying to find
[7:16] some
of that out of funds that we have
[7:19] available to us and
I think that can be part of our
[7:23] discussion
public meeting or if you want to uh
[7:27] discuss that now. I
[7:30] There is the I mean we have funds in the
in the money market account
[7:37] which I think would be more appropriate
than using the land use
[7:41] » Yeah.
>> change. I would agree with you.
[7:42] » Mhm.
Um
[7:46] » Do you know how much residual we have in
the wildcat fund?
[7:51] Because that one, if I recall correctly,
we had to still maintain the the
[7:54] principal like the 12K.
>> Yeah, it's
[7:58] I I I think we've done a good job of
spending most of our
[8:01] balance every year, so
but I can check on that.
[8:09] » Is there a
I mean, I know it was a quote based on
[8:12] what we asked for, so it's probably what
it costs, but
[8:16] for the sake of conversation, is there
something in between?
[8:19] I don't know. Was it 86,000?
>> It was 86.
[8:22] » I'm just wondering like if is there
[8:28] discussion that we could have that's
like, well
[8:32] » Well, I could be only less stable.
>> You know, I mean, I could be getting a
[8:36] truly about stabilizing the thing cuz
86,000 for
[8:40] what if that doesn't engage at all and
they're just like,
[8:43] what? And then I'm like, well, there's
just other things that
[8:46] I mean
I don't know. I'm just throwing it out
[8:49] there.
>> Um
[8:54] Yeah, I think part of that could be if
it were to be opened up
[8:58] for a bid a bid process. So, if we were
to request bids and use this as our
[9:04] » Mhm.
>> as the plan sort of our baseline and see
[9:06] if other people would feel comfortable
doing that work or if there's
[9:10] other options.
>> Yeah, I was afraid we were going to get
[9:14] asked that question like someone like
just like, well
[9:17] didn't you
>> It's enough money, I think, that the bid
[9:21] process would
kick in.
[9:25] The other [clears throat] thing is for
the public meeting
[9:29] have as much of the money
answered as you can. Where
[9:35] » [clears throat]
>> Excuse me. Where would come from? How
[9:38] much?
Just so those are the questions that
[9:41] people are really being
they're interested in having good, solid
[9:47] answers.
>> Do we think the head of water resources
[9:50] ideology would be willing to come?
>> Yes, I think he would.
[9:55] » Yeah, so I I asked him if he was
available to come. I think if we
[9:58] schedule the public meeting
to occur with our next meeting in
[10:03] October, he's available for that.
>> Awesome.
[10:06] » Um
so I I guess if we just want to say
[10:10] schedule the public meeting at 7:00
or 6:30 and
[10:17] » I would suggest that we
schedule it maybe on a night that we
[10:20] have our conservation commission
meeting.
[10:23] » Yeah. Yeah, so next October 5th.
>> Yeah.
[10:26] » Uh and and Sean is available that night,
so
[10:29] » Let's go with it.
>> Okay. I just checked my schedule.
[10:35] Um
>> I think if we put it out for bid that uh
[10:39] we we should we should be clear that
we're looking for somebody with
[10:42] experience because you can get anybody
that can bid to go on and do the job.
[10:47] Of which
[10:49] I mean, this is the one that was
recommended to us. I did do a background
[10:53] check.
>> Oh, yeah. I don't know. I don't have a
[10:54] problem with it. I think people are just
cynical and
[10:57] you know, somebody just doesn't like the
idea and that's the first thing they
[11:00] throw at you.
>> And I don't think there's
[11:03] a fast track here for because
it's enough money that I think people
[11:08] would like to know. I think we can pick
our contractors.
[11:13] » Yeah.
>> Who we want to
[11:17] consult with.
[11:20] » To uh Dick's point,
should we try and figure out the
[11:24] partitioning of the money tonight or can
we do that by email between now and
[11:30] next month?
>> Uh I think we can have a
[11:34] discussion now and
>> Yeah.
[11:37] » Uh
I don't have
[11:40] uh
a current balance for the money market
[11:44] account, but the last time I talked
[11:48] uh to Julie, there was probably enough
to cover the full amount.
[11:54] But, I don't know if that include if
that was
[11:57] uh
I don't know how those funds were
[11:59] separated and if that included land use
[12:04] or if that's in a separate account.
>> Mhm.
[12:07] » And all those So, uh I can I can verify
that with with Julie.
[12:12] And Bob uh Bob Thompson said I mean, we
don't need to
[12:18] Well, I guess that's the question is do
we ask do we want to ask the town
[12:23] to help pay for this or do we believe in
it enough that it
[12:28] it needs to be done
and we don't just spend that
[12:32] money.
[12:34] » Or I don't think we should just spend
the money
[12:36] » I don't think we should just spend the
money without consulting the town, but I
[12:40] think that in the presentation
to the town, we say, "Look,
[12:46] we've got the funds or we've got, you
know,
[12:49] a large chunk of the funds. We think
it's important work
[12:54] and we would just like the,
you know, the town to give the go-ahead
[12:59] for the interest to whoever shows up at
the meeting, interested parties,
[13:04] uh
to say, "Yes, we want to do this."
[13:09] » Yeah, I guess
>> [clears throat]
[13:12] » I
thought about the money and did it that
[13:15] much, but maybe with that
should we discuss the things that we
[13:20] feel like
[13:23] that money could be better spent on or
items that
[13:28] we feel like
the residents or
[13:32] the town would be less willing to help
us
[13:36] do.
[13:39] You know, with our with money. Like
if if we can get the town behind
[13:43] something like this, it would be great
to not take the money that
[13:47] we have to do it.
>> But I I think going back to Dick's
[13:50] point, I think Dick is right.
We're going in to make a
[13:54] a proposal as to how we think it should
be done. After we get input, we might
[13:59] change what we did, but that's the
function of the town meeting.
[14:03] And my recommendation would be to go in
and say that, you know, the estimated
[14:07] cost is, you know, roughly 80,000,
whatever it was,
[14:12] um, you know, with inflation, it may be
as high as 90,000.
[14:16] Conservation Commission will put in half
of it. We're retaining the other half
[14:20] because we do have other needs that will
come, including potentially more work at
[14:24] the falls.
And we need some input from the town.
[14:28] And so we because then it would become a
vote of the town at the March meeting.
[14:33] So we're asking the town to come up with
45,000.
[14:37] » Right. Yeah, I like that idea.
>> That's I I think, uh,
[14:41] diplomatically, that's the way to
Mhm. approach it.
[14:45] » Yeah, I just didn't want to have it be
like,
[14:47] we have 86,000. Like who's going to vote
and go like, yeah, you know what, I'll
[14:51] give 10 bucks. Like there's
>> That's not the end-all, be-all for the
[14:55] Jackson Falls.
>> No, but I guess, you know, my point
[14:59] would be is this how our money
that we have in our accounts is supposed
[15:03] to be spent, it should be spent.
As soon as we start doing it, we kind of
[15:07] set a precedent on anything that happens
related to anything like that. Like, oh,
[15:12] Conservation Committee has money, they
pay for that. I'm just I'm not saying
[15:15] that's right or wrong. I'm simply
saying,
[15:18] is that how our money, and the way that
we get money, is that
[15:22] the best way to
>> The only place that
[15:24] » take our money out, how do you get it
back?
[15:26] » Uh the only place where I think that
makes a difference would be if we need
[15:30] to also tap into current use fund.
In which case the RSA is specific about
[15:36] what that money can be used for or not
be used for.
[15:38] » Mhm.
>> And that's
[15:40] we can't change that.
>> And the RSA says we cannot
[15:43] » I believe it says we can, but I I'd want
to go back and read it again as to just
[15:48] simply tell you what I think.
But my my take is because it's on town
[15:52] property a conservation project, but we
should check that.
[15:58] Because if we're making an offer to
cover something for which we don't have
[16:02] the full funds in the money market, then
we can't take it from that, then we we'd
[16:07] essentially be in a bind. So
we can look up the RSA.
[16:13] » And we have
a town driver right here today.
[16:19] If she would like to
have input in this discussion.
[16:25] » What?
Into Jackson Falls? No.
[16:33] » Um
Did you hear the question?
[16:35] » Well, we have the public here.
>> Did she hear the question? Rephrase the
[16:38] question.
[16:42] » I'm listening.
>> I hear
[16:45] No, we're just
wondering how the public will react to
[16:50] uh the idea of spending, you know,
$90,000
[16:56] uh
for bank stabilization
[17:00] at Jackson Falls.
>> I would
[17:05] love to have an opinion and know about
it and understand it. Knowledge will
[17:10] speak.
>> That's a serious thing.
[17:14] » From like Yeah.
>> Well, we're projecting to have uh an
[17:18] October meeting on the
subject.
[17:23] » Penny, the
the challenge is
[17:26] the
town did a little bit of work years ago
[17:29] in moving some of the boulders, but
we're getting the erosion. When they
[17:32] redid the bridge,
>> Yeah.
[17:34] » it's probably going to increase the
erosion a little bit more because the
[17:37] piers, I mean, the
the abutments that go out are going out
[17:40] further. They couldn't follow it.
But it is If you've been down there,
[17:44] it's chewing away, and it will cut
through where all the trails are. So
[17:49] there's a need to hire a professional
that comes in and And we've had a plan
[17:52] already developed by a
hydrogeomorphologist
[17:56] » Yeah.
>> to essentially restructure what was done
[17:59] before, but probably done better because
before it was the town just came in and
[18:03] moved it.
>> Right.
[18:04] » And, you know, they they did a decent
job, but that's not what they're
[18:07] professionals.
So the estimated cost, we already have
[18:12] it from somebody who does this kind of
work. It's 80-some-odd thousand dollars
[18:17] to go in
and sort of restructure to help prevent
[18:20] further erosion. That's That's basically
what's what's at stake.
[18:24] » And give my people the opportunity to
learn and understand.
[18:28] » Yeah.
>> And get behind the project is
[18:31] » Which is the part you need
>> I guess my only other
[18:37] funding source because this
may be something that there would be
[18:43] grant funding that
seek out, but I don't want to make
[18:49] making a decision contingent on finding
finding grant money. And then that would
[18:54] What portion of the budget would that
offset? Like our commitment would be
[18:58] half
whatever balance remaining covered by
[19:03] grant money and the town. Does that seem
like a logical
[19:08] » That would be a good structure there.
It
[19:13] » would be.
If we could find that money.
[19:16] » Well, and that's kind of when we when
when when Emily and I were going through
[19:21] the FEMA process, this would be the kind
of project that they would have given
[19:26] funds for.
2 years ago.
[19:30] But
>> And we can pursue that, but I think what
[19:34] you need is still for the town to vote
because
[19:37] you you I mean essentially you've got a
pool right now.
[19:41] All we need is one more big storm and
stuff is really going to be damaged. So,
[19:45] if you're just sort of chasing
potential that you have no idea where
[19:49] the potential is.
If the damage is greater than the cost
[19:52] to repair is going to be a lot higher
than what we're looking at currently
[19:56] right now.
Um normally under scenario like that is
[19:59] the town will vote it in if we get the
grants, then the town doesn't need to
[20:03] spend it.
>> Right.
[20:04] » But to get people's hopes up and have no
idea even what grants you can chase.
[20:10] » Right.
>> Chasing at this point is a little bit of
[20:12] pie in the sky.
>> Right. Well, and I I think presenting
[20:15] [clears throat] it as a we would like to
have this work done next fall.
[20:18] » Yeah.
[20:21] And there's urgency to it.
[20:24] » Okay.
[20:28] Um I don't know if we if I missed this,
but did [clears throat] they ever do the
[20:34] I just hate that I have this question be
asked and us not be able to answer it
[20:37] because we use it as a reason for
rational behind why the
[20:41] erosion's going to get worse.
Did they ever
[20:44] show the engineering
of the modeling of the change in the
[20:48] wall?
Like I still can't believe that
[20:53] all this stuff happens and we don't know
what that looks like.
[20:57] Like how how do you design something
around this situation?
[20:59] » damage is already been done before they
even did the bridge replacement from the
[21:04] last two major flood events. So,
you know the potential for that to
[21:09] happen without even the bridge
replacement. So, it's an interesting
[21:13] question, but it's
it may increase that potential, but we
[21:17] know we're not talking about potential.
We know what's happening when we get
[21:20] major events.
>> And I think where the
[21:24] work is
occurring is further down
[21:28] » Yeah.
>> the the river. So, it
[21:31] we're not going directly impacting that
particular thing.
[21:34] » Mhm.
>> No, it's just something something that
[21:36] we've used as a
like a catchphrase to say that why we
[21:41] have to be aware of it. It's just like
it comes up all the time with the change
[21:45] of the channel and all this thing. I'm
just asking.
[21:49] If someone was asking us again like that
the person in the room that says
[21:51] » Mhm.
>> Well, did you What's the Is that
[21:55] happening? Is this really going to
happen? What's the extent? What did the
[21:58] town do? Did you guys research it? How
did they get away with doing it without
[22:01] it being researched? Has it been Do we
understand?
[22:05] » I think you got some pretty simple
answers there because the big rocks that
[22:08] were moved out there before they moved,
you're seeing the erosion channel that's
[22:12] already cutting through where the bench
is out there.
[22:18] You know, it's it's not hypothetical.
You can go down and take a look as to
[22:21] what's happening.
>> No, I'm not saying that. I I know that's
[22:24] not hypothetical.
>> And that happened before the bridge
[22:26] replacement.
>> Yeah.
[22:30] I guess I would just be careful using
the change of the bridge
[22:34] in the conversation if we don't know
that that's
[22:38] » I would avoid
that
[22:40] aspect and just say we're dealing with
what's happening.
[22:45] » Right. I mean, I'm not saying it to be
argumentative as much as the person in
[22:49] the room who would find the thing to
push the button.
[22:51] » Cause it's it's nature nature happening.
>> But, I I think we have to be feel
[22:58] comfortable answering the question. We
don't know
[23:03] if this will solve any problem
that a 200-year storm or something will
[23:10] just
overtop.
[23:13] » Yeah. Probably most likely slow down the
damage that the 200-year storm
[23:18] Yeah.
>> Right. I
[23:19] » Yeah. Best case scenario.
>> I mean
[23:24] And and I guess that could be a question
we ask Shawn is that
[23:27] you know, what what level of storm
protection is this
[23:32] up to?
[23:35] I But I'm I'm certain he's not going to
guarantee
[23:37] » Yeah.
>> I don't think he could either.
[23:39] » How could anybody expect that?
I mean, Madison got what?
[23:43] 7 in in
>> Yeah.
[23:45] » an hour or something crazy in some
areas.
[23:47] » Yeah.
So then it just
[23:49] » Other areas got four.
>> And it just becomes a decision by the
[23:52] town, by the people of the town, like is
it worth putting this money in and they
[23:56] have to decide is it worth it not
knowing like how much do you value
[24:00] » the vaults. Exactly.
>> And
[24:02] and that should be
>> the discussion.
[24:05] » is okay, we
this chunk of money
[24:09] is it worth it to What are we going to
save?
[24:12] » Yeah.
>> Well, the town made a decision a long
[24:14] time ago because there was a proposed
hydro plant there. Which is why it got
[24:18] put into the wild and scenic.
So the town obviously valued
[24:23] the Jackson Falls or wouldn't have gone
through that whole effort.
[24:29] » It's what Yes, I
I Yeah.
[24:33] The town is interested in Jackson Falls.
>> Do you think that we should invite
[24:40] DOT to the discussion because
>> Well, this money that we're
[24:46] proposing to spend
[24:51] what percentage is, you know, is it
going to
[24:54] save 75%
of the erosion? is it going to save 50%?
[25:01] Is it going to save 90%?
Uh is it going to be a washout
[25:06] in a
another
[25:09] major flood year?
>> I guess you could say the other one if
[25:13] you spend
$115,000,
[25:16] does that get you to the next level
where you feel like he's like that would
[25:19] stop
>> everything.
[25:21] » You know, I mean
>> The one The one thing is pretty clear
[25:25] that it will happen because you can see
where it is. Just the trail comes down
[25:29] and it's really close all the way down.
Uh if you want to protect your trail, it
[25:35] gives people access from the upper part
to the lower part of the the falls in
[25:39] the upper part of the falls there.
Um
[25:42] you have to do something with that right
bearing buffer.
[25:47] If you're willing to give up a trail
that connects those pieces, then
[25:53] But other nature do what it's doing and
if it wants to go toward the road so be
[25:56] it.
[25:59] » I wonder at what point would DOT
actually get involved where they're like
[26:03] » I think DOT gets involved on a different
issue and that is is we Once we finalize
[26:08] some of this, we put together the final
proposed Jackson Falls Management Plan,
[26:12] cuz DOT is probably going to be
necessary relative to the parking
[26:16] because that part of Route 16 B
is actually state road. It is not town
[26:22] road.
>> No, I guess you My point is let's just
[26:24] say that like
if we did nothing
[26:28] and it takes out the the trail and then
after the trail
[26:32] it keeps coming. At what point would DOT
say, "Okay, that's
[26:37] too far.
We need to stabilize this."
[26:40] » It's a theoretical question. I don't
know how we could answer that.
[26:42] » Well, that's what I'm saying. Should DOT
be involved? It's like well maybe DOT
[26:46] should be involved because the
conversation is about
[26:48] » Well, the state of the state
>> comes the road.
[26:51] » But But right, the state will be
involved anyways because there's a
[26:54] required permitting because what I mean
>> involved in a like actual
[26:58] meeting
>> We just chunk the money cuz
[27:01] » That's right.
>> Yeah, that's correct.
[27:02] » They can stop, you know, we can put the
band-aid on now or we could not put the
[27:06] band-aid on, but if no one does anything
and it goes after the road, DOT's
[27:10] definitely going to do something.
They're going to put a band-aid on it.
[27:13] What I'm saying is, do we say, "Hey, we
want to do the band-aid?"
[27:19] » Yeah.
>> You there like
[27:20] » But I But I I think we're looking at
if there's erosion at that level, the
[27:26] DOT needs to come in. We're We're
talking about something that's totally
[27:29] different.
[27:32] Cuz that's gas funds.
>> Beyond the right of way
[27:37] I think they'd be
Mhm, it's not ours.
[27:40] » Mhm, it's not town property, right?
>> Yeah, no, I I get that.
[27:43] But I I guess that would be
Is it wise to spend money if
[27:51] we don't solve the problem and then it
becomes DOT's problem?
[27:55] And we have now
those funds have been wasted rather than
[27:59] waiting for the inevitable catastrophe
where someone else has to step in and do
[28:04] something.
>> it like really right or I mean I'm just
[28:06] just just
>> Yeah, or they just or they just throw a
[28:09] bunch of crushed rock down there and and
the path is gone.
[28:12] » Yeah.
>> Cuz that'll take care of the road, they
[28:14] don't care about the path.
>> True.
[28:17] » We know that the path is a true risk.
The road is hypothetical risk.
[28:23] » Yes.
>> Then we can hypothesize
[28:27] total disasters where it takes the road
and the houses.
[28:30] Um
I I think we're
[28:33] going a little bit far here right now in
getting too concerned about the 0.01%
[28:40] issue in front of us as opposed
>> That could be a hundred years down the
[28:43] » Yeah, cool.
>> Yeah.
[28:45] » Really? For
>> All right, yeah, or I mean you could
[28:48] just set the road back.
[28:52] Or that we may get enough salt in there
from something that is still building
[28:56] up.
>> Yeah, that's what I mean. You just don't
[28:58] know. I'm just
throwing it out there.
[29:03] » Well,
I guess we
[29:06] feel good. We can schedule a public
meeting. We can have We can ask these
[29:10] questions to to Shawn.
[29:14] » I I
We got to go back to Mike's question.
[29:18] » Yeah.
>> Which is did we agree on how we would
[29:21] propose the funding?
>> Well, I think Ben's going to
[29:26] look into what we have available.
I mean, you could email it to us
[29:33] uh if you wanted to take a shortcut
before the next meeting
[29:37] so that we would have
you know,
[29:40] good information in front of us
for that.
[29:44] » But, I don't think an email vote is
legit.
[29:47] » I I just think to get the balances.
>> Okay.
[29:51] But, if we're going to vote on what
we're proposing here today per Mike's
[29:55] question,
we have to vote in public. We can't vote
[29:58] via email.
>> No, no. I wouldn't
[30:01] Just to get information
before we vote.
[30:05] » Your concern is that we have to have how
we're paying for the say, if we pay for
[30:10] half up front,
we have to agree that we're we're
[30:14] reporting that from
before our October meeting
[30:18] so that
>> I I'll make a motion as follows,
[30:21] that um
we will propose that the Conservation
[30:24] Commission will
um put in 45,000
[30:29] for the project.
And the remainder
[30:33] would be a request from the town to put
in up to 45,000
[30:37] because they will need to vote on it as
an article.
[30:40] And the Conservation Commission will
pursue to determine whether there's any
[30:45] grant funding to reduce the cost of both
the Conservation Commission and the
[30:49] town.
We will pursue.
[30:55] » Can I ask a question on that?
What if the town says no?
[31:00] Could it come up with the other?
>> And decide We have to decide what we're
[31:03] going to do at that point.
>> If you cuz you didn't say up to us,
[31:08] right?
You said 45, so it could be
[31:11] » Okay, 45.
>> Yeah.
[31:14] » And if
when we take a look at the funds we
[31:18] can't, we don't have sufficient, we
can't do it. You'll still be meeting,
[31:24] but we're going to run into a problem
here because we have to tell the public
[31:27] what it is
and post what it is
[31:30] before that meeting so that they can see
it in advance.
[31:33] » Right, in fact, they need to know the
amount that isn't covered.
[31:36] » Correct. And my my my
So, I put that motion out. I'll need a
[31:40] second, then I'll come back and try to
remedy that problem.
[31:46] » So, the proposal is the Conservation
Commission pay 45,000, remainder to be
[31:51] paid by town via warrant article.
>> Well, we'll have to say up to because
[31:55] the town will not vote on an open-ended
number.
[32:03] » Up to
>> I'd be flabbergasted if it did.
[32:11] » And we think we have 45 in the money
market that we can spend.
[32:15] » Well, if it turns out that we do not,
we will know before, and then we would
[32:21] actually take a look at holding the
public meeting in November so that we
[32:25] can come back and do it properly.
>> Okay.
[32:40] » So I made the motion.
[32:46] I'll second that.
[32:51] » Okay.
>> So
[32:55] This is just saying that we'll come up
with 45,000 up to 45,000 dollars to
[32:59] cover it.
>> And we're asking the town for the up up
[33:03] to another We're asking for 45,000 from
the town expecting the cost to be
[33:09] approximately 90,000.
And that has a little bit of built-in
[33:14] cost overrun which many construction
projects do. We have a bid just not
[33:19] unusual in a bid you could have a cost
overrun.
[33:21] » Mhm.
>> Yeah, there is a a contingency around
[33:24] that.
>> 15%
[33:26] » And I think Brian, to your your question
about what if the town says no, I think
[33:30] that probably tells us something.
>> Right.
[33:32] » Yeah, if people are like we don't want
to spend 40,000 dollars to save this
[33:35] trail. Yeah, I think that's
>> I just didn't My concern was that we had
[33:39] committed ourselves to the full
>> Got you.
[33:41] » by saying like well, they didn't come up
with [clears throat] it, so we are. I
[33:43] just
>> Got you.
[33:44] » That's normal.
>> Well, I think that's after we
[33:47] » Yeah.
>> before we had a
[33:48] you know, a
hearing
[33:51] would uh
give us direction of whether to
[33:55] say hey.
>> Because because what what you have Brian
[33:58] in front of you is if you go and tell
the town well, if you vote no, we'll
[34:02] fund the rest of it, but then you burn
up the rest of your money for which you
[34:05] probably need for other projects there.
>> Mhm.
[34:07] » Uh
then [snorts] you have no money at all.
[34:09] » Mhm.
>> And they will vote for that. I mean,
[34:11] that's what everybody would vote for is
let them pay for the whole thing.
[34:13] » Exactly. Yeah.
>> And then that puts us in a bind because
[34:17] we're expected to manage up here, but we
have no funds to manage.
[34:20] » Right.
>> We we don't want to do that.
[34:23] I wouldn't
>> I wouldn't either.
[34:28] » Okay.
Any other discussions or
[34:33] Ready to vote?
Okay. All in favor?
[34:36] » I.
>> I.
[34:37] » Opposed?
[34:40] » Okay.
[34:46] » It's a lot of money. Everything costs
lots of money.
[34:50] » For construction projects, I don't think
that's out of line.
[34:53] » Oh, no, no, no. I don't either. No, I
don't Yeah, I don't either.
[34:55] » And I did check with Yeah.
Folks as I as I mentioned before because
[34:59] I
I was the chair of the committee with
[35:02] them in the negotiation. I've seen a
number of these funds and I've seen what
[35:04] the the cost are for these kinds of
things. This is
[35:08] You know, you you're hiring a
specialist.
[35:10] » Right.
>> Okay.
[35:12] » Um
And he's a one He's a small operation.
[35:16] more information
>> a big firm
[35:19] or someone to
quote off of.
[35:23] » How do they get that information?
>> They have two other people I think like
[35:27] what the state has just just crossed my
mind. I'm like
[35:31] Let's ask them.
But
[35:33] obviously
have to be after the fact.
[35:38] » And we don't have to cross that bridge.
>> I just didn't read I haven't seen
[35:41] anything
that I would be like, "Oh,
[35:44] that's what you'd be working on."
[35:47] » Um
Yeah, I'll I'll research that.
[35:55] Okay.
[35:59] Any
>> But I would also point out when we go to
[36:01] the town
is not only that we're paying at 45 but
[36:04] we've already spent and paid for the
engineering. It's not like we're out of
[36:08] the blue. We've already spent 18, 19,000
on the engineering.
[36:15] » That's part of the presentation.
>> Yeah, I'd just like to look at that.
[36:21] the engineering everything
[36:33] » Okay.
Um
[36:35] moving on.
Grazing?
[36:39] Anything?
>> Uh
[36:42] only that I
met with the new executive director at
[36:46] ski touring and was going to bring up
the cuts then with him, but we had a
[36:50] really long meeting about other things,
so I'm planning to follow up about the
[36:54] future sheds with him.
>> He will struggle because
[36:59] with with the time
for this fall. I can tell you that right
[37:02] now.
>> Yeah, I didn't Yeah, I got that
[37:04] impression.
>> Working with the forest service and
[37:06] getting the bridges qualified
and through is has been a nightmare with
[37:11] the forest service.
>> The town's done a great job keeping it
[37:16] accessible
>> Yeah.
[37:17] » to all
the areas that they're mowing. It just
[37:19] seems like they really
I remember he was talking about poison
[37:22] ivy and
>> Yeah, I was back there the other day and
[37:24] it seemed like poison ivy is I don't
know. Like
[37:27] » And then they've been really on top of
the mowing. It's I know a handful of
[37:30] people guests, just random people who've
said they've been out on the mystery
[37:35] house loop like I didn't believe it. I
was like, "Really?"
[37:37] » And Nessel Nok is really signed
>> Oh, yeah.
[37:41] » a lot of that. Yeah, it's a combination
of the Jackson snowshoe trails.
[37:44] » Yeah, they really have. They've been
They've had horses on on trails out
[37:49] there.
>> I Yeah, horses on them.
[37:51] » I walk it frequently.
>> 20 years now.
[37:55] » It's a neat trail system, actually.
>> It is.
[38:01] Community garden?
>> Well, irrigation still isn't
[38:05] functioning.
>> Okay.
[38:08] Since the
>> Since well, they cut the lines when they
[38:14] set the tank out there.
But we had a hose and a wrench.
[38:18] But what's happened is I think the one
of the valves must be gone in the in the
[38:23] timer.
And the box that's buried. So, I think
[38:28] we're going to need a new timer for the
hose, hook it up,
[38:32] and then maybe and still use the hose
above ground, but the town guys have
[38:36] gotten in the habit now of like
the hose up
[38:40] up to the library, so I can bring it
back.
[38:43] Yeah, so I've got to call the gym.
And um
[38:47] I guess we'll send it to the gym.
Um
[38:50] the loading.
>> Jim, I know.
[38:53] » Yeah.
Cuz it's been
[38:55] I've been asking for a couple of years
now.
[38:57] » Yeah, I mean seems kind of weird that
>> I know.
[38:59] I think I need to get a new I think I
need to stop by.
[39:03] » You could just go to the swap.
>> Yeah.
[39:05] » You just say what you had before and
>> All right.
[39:08] » what was taken away and
>> I can do that.
[39:10] » I mean
>> Yeah.
[39:11] » They got a fire station out of it.
>> Yeah.
[39:14] » You could get
>> It was so funny they
[39:15] » your water line back.
>> in two places. Apparently, they replaced
[39:18] the line,
but nobody hooks it up. So, we're kind
[39:21] of like I can't even do what you try to
stop me from doing.
[39:25] I think it's going to have to be cut.
I'm not sure.
[39:27] » Yeah, I mean it seems like
>> Yeah.
[39:30] » I don't know what that is.
>> At least we've been having water this
[39:33] year, so it hasn't been past credit. The
library was good because they let us use
[39:36] their timer.
>> Mhm.
[39:38] » So, then at least we you know, we made
it needed so we could use the timer and
[39:42] put the hose out,
which came in handy cuz we had water in
[39:45] the garden for the spring.
[39:48] Yeah.
>> Okay.
[39:50] » natural water
>> Okay.
[39:53] Um
Wildcat River, so our last month of
[39:58] river monitoring is well all happening
in September and then
[40:02] the data will be submitted to the state
and they release their report later in
[40:09] the fall.
That that will come their final report
[40:13] will come out
I think
[40:17] usually in December. I think that's when
it came out last year.
[40:21] And then we've received
a letter
[40:26] to the commission. It was submitted to
the town.
[40:30] Is that what you're here to discuss?
[40:34] I also received a letter from
>> even know if if it was on the agenda or
[40:37] not. I just wanted
>> We read it.
[40:39] » Is this the the annual one?
>> No, there's there's one from Anne
[40:43] » Garland.
>> And then
[40:45] I also received the letter you had sent.
So
[40:48] if you'd like to have that included in
the our meeting minutes.
[40:52] » Sure.
Sure.
[40:54] And the letter can be shared, of course.
I know the select board has it on their
[40:59] agenda for the 15th.
>> Okay.
[41:02] » And they're hoping DES they will pass
the DES fee there.
[41:08] » Okay. Can I ask if this Penny's letter
is similar to or is it the same
[41:12] situations as or different?
>> No, it's it's more general.
[41:17] » Okay.
>> How is it that the water gets diverted
[41:21] into the pond and then it doesn't go
anywhere? Because it's dry from where
[41:24] the pond is.
>> Um no. Well, if you recall the letter
[41:27] that we sent to DES, we raised
a number of issues.
[41:32] Issue number one was the water
withdrawal rates in the winter for snow
[41:35] making.
The second one that we raised was
[41:39] the main channel
is actually what's the water's being
[41:44] diverted So we've raised that issue with
DES.
[41:48] Um
and then the third issue that we raised
[41:51] was with sediment. And the sediment
issue is actually both the state and
[41:55] town.
I know at the What's the one selectman
[41:59] meeting before? I can't remember which
one.
[42:01] The selectmen have now cited Black
Mountain.
[42:05] Um but they have given them sort of a
caveat that if they clean up their act,
[42:09] then the fines won't be in place. But
the fines are basically 200 bucks and
[42:13] 700 bucks for the first and then 500
bucks a day afterwards or thereabouts.
[42:18] Um so we've raised all three of those
questions in the response that we sent
[42:23] back to DES at that time.
Um
[42:27] The one thing that I would note
is and I hope Anne
[42:33] is
and I have gone back and taken a couple
[42:36] of those and taken some pictures as
well. There's no question that the
[42:40] that the main channel is actually pretty
much dry. There's a few pools in there.
[42:46] If you have a heavy rain then it
overcomes the new burn that he's built
[42:50] there, but to me that's illegal what
he's got going on. We've raised the
[42:54] issue with DES. We know that there's
illegal stuff going on between them and
[42:58] DES now.
We're not because it is legal, I don't
[43:03] think we've seen some stuff, but I know
the selectmen have said that they've
[43:05] gotten some correspondence back, but I
don't know what the correspondence has
[43:10] been between DES and the selectmen.
But the issue that's raised here about
[43:14] the diversion I think is correct.
The only warning I would give is this
[43:18] means that somebody walked on Eric's
property to take these pictures. That's
[43:22] illegal.
>> Cuz it's posted. I saw that.
[43:26] » Yeah. Uh it doesn't change the fact when
you're going into
[43:29] um sniffing on somebody's property, you
need the permission to do it. I took
[43:33] some photos, but it was
at a I took those photos from Route 16
[43:38] in the right-of-way. I did not and you
can get a better picture of the way that
[43:41] this was done, but but that is a
challenge that individual could have
[43:46] from Eric that would be problematic for
this individual.
[43:50] And I don't know whether your pictures
were taken on it his property or not,
[43:53] but you do want to be careful about
doing that.
[43:57] That's my
advice.
[44:03] » Um
I'm going to be going to guess
[44:05] » Even if the town wants to go, they have
to alert the DES, I believe, has to
[44:09] alert that company here.
>> What if you're a guest at the end?
[44:12] What if you're a guest at the end?
Maybe Ann stayed.
[44:16] » Um
>> I'm just saying anybody could stay there
[44:18] and get pictures all you want.
[44:26] » He's got big He's got a lot of lawyers.
>> I My pictures also include
[44:32] um
extreme turbidity
[44:36] from Davis Stream Brook. Um
and very clear photos of Davis Stream
[44:42] Brook mixing with
>> Okay.
[44:45] » Great Brook in the color, you know,
during rain events. So, we've got the
[44:48] turbidity from Davis Stream Brook and
then there's the normal tannic acid
[44:53] color water coming down from
Great Brook. It's quite
[44:58] obvious as well as
photos of the stream coming in by the
[45:03] ranch house, but Yes.
>> I have other photos.
[45:07] » But this is
I mean, it's a legitimate question
[45:10] what's in this letter.
The reasons I say that is we put that
[45:14] into DES as a major concern.
>> Can One One of the things under the
[45:19] their dam permit is that
it was always supposed to be
[45:25] the dam the the water isn't supposed to
be
[45:28] the level of the pond for
kayaking and swimming and all that is
[45:32] supposed to be lowered
during the summer. It says it in that.
[45:38] » I I don't I mean, yeah, I um
I don't know because of You know, when
[45:43] we first moved here, we all used to swim
up there.
[45:46] And then the
bacterial level, from what I understand,
[45:49] got so high. That was probably because
of who raised pigs that were right up
[45:54] there, logging and so on, which is not
atypical when we get runoff from animals
[45:58] that um
And so, then that would have I believe
[46:01] the there was shut down by DES because
of the bacteria count.
[46:05] And that would have been in the '80s.
They used to all swim up there. You guys
[46:10] swam up there. We never Yeah.
Um I don't
[46:14] I'm not familiar with what you're
talking about, so I can't.
[46:17] » It's mentioned multiple times if you go
look in the folder
[46:21] for Whitney's for that property that
they bought.
[46:24] That it says quite explicitly that the
dam level is supposed to be lowered in
[46:29] the summer.
>> That could be. Um and then it's a
[46:33] question of whether that is a
requirement that is between them and DES
[46:37] or whether that is just an internal
policy. If it's an internal policy and
[46:42] now that
Eric has bought
[46:46] it, he could change the policy at will.
I don't know what
[46:49] » Yeah, it it was it's listed on the DES
information.
[46:53] » I I'm not familiar with that, so I
can't.
[46:58] » Folks,
I have to go.
[47:02] » You have a quorum.
So you can still vote.
[47:05] » You want to
>> Yeah, vote me out.
[47:09] » [laughter]
>> See you later.
[47:11] » I appreciate the time.
>> Thank you.
[47:13] » Thank you.
>> All right. Our next meeting will be at
[47:17] the regular time.
>> Which Which also, Dan, when you're
[47:20] taking the water samples right at the
bridge,
[47:23] um
you want to make sure that you're doing
[47:26] it in the road right of way, not on his
property.
[47:29] » I'm aware about his property, so
>> I only say that because of
[47:38] And he was as you know, he got pretty
adamant with us about who flagged the
[47:41] wetlands, which we were all clueless
about, but
[47:46] » Um
Yeah, so I I think
[47:55] I don't know.
[47:58] I You know, the other thing we could do
is just contact DES and just tell them
[48:02] that we've continued to observe that
that byway is still dry all summer
[48:07] outside of
you know, a major rain event and
[48:12] we'd like an update on how how it's
proceeding. I mean, it would be a
[48:16] question.
>> So, you're concerned about dam safety?
[48:22] » It was cited as an issue that could be
pursued separately from the
[48:29] uh letter of
deficiency.
[48:33] » It's ranked as a non-hazardous dam.
Um
[48:37] I think your your greatest threat if
that thing burst would be number one is
[48:42] you get a settlement load, which is
pretty typical when that happens.
[48:46] Um
how much damage? Probably the first
[48:49] place that would see the damage would be
Eagle Mountain, of course, would be my
[48:53] guess just from the bottom of water. If
he ex- and I I I'm going to guess that
[48:58] he's probably going to need to do this,
but I'm just guessing, is he's probably
[49:02] going to try to increase the volume of
that so that he can do snow making in a
[49:06] more legitimate way and I suspect that's
what is between him and DES now as he
[49:10] tries to get up to DES's
um
[49:14] Obviously, if you have more water stored
there, then you may move from a
[49:17] non-hazardous to a hazardous situation.
But usually hazardous is based on how
[49:25] much water is there. If the thing
breached, how much would go?
[49:30] But he does not have an emergency
spillway on that, for example,
[49:34] on that dam, which is why when it was
filled, it was going over the back.
[49:38] » There is a bedrock spillway.
>> On the dam?
[49:42] » Yes.
>> Whereabouts?
[49:45] » As you're facing down.
>> So, you got the dam and then on the
[49:48] left-hand side?
>> Left side is an overflow.
[49:52] » Then the question would be if it's earth
then it's pretty problematic. Usually a
[49:57] overflow would be smooth.
So that it would not erode when the
[50:00] water is going through it.
>> I'll inquire.
[50:05] » Yeah.
I don't My recollection from swimming
[50:08] here is there is no
real overflow. There There might be
[50:13] something that allows it to vent there
but if it's earthen
[50:16] um water moving through earth, we know
>> very well
[50:20] » very quickly.
But usually on dams it's going to be
[50:22] something that structurally is not going
to erode when it's being done.
[50:32] » Um
all right. Well
[50:38] » But we could write a letter to DES and
just say, you know, we have continuing
[50:41] concerns there.
Um the main channel still continues to
[50:44] be dewatered.
And we'd like an update.
[50:48] » What When is that select
>> Select the 15th.
[50:55] » I mean I I think
[50:59] select The select board has requested
DES attend that meeting, correct? So I
[51:03] think that would be
the time we have that discussion, so.
[51:11] » But I don't know when I'll be available.
[51:17] » Yeah. Yeah, they have requested
[51:21] that DES attend at a select board
meeting on the 15th at 3:30, so.
[51:27] I I'm not sure if I'll be able to be
there but I will make an effort.
[51:31] So thank you.
[51:34] Um
And and your letter and and I I'm I'm
[51:38] going to assume that Anne's letter cuz
it was also select board
[51:43] uh submitted to the select board will be
presented at that meeting.
[51:50] » You want to talk to Anne Garland, right?
[51:53] » Who's Anne Garland?
>> Yeah, on the pictures.
[51:58] » Um
selectmen meeting is at 3:30.
[52:00] » Yes.
>> All right,
[52:03] Seth Tyler.
>> There will be a Zoom option.
[52:09] » It's my wife's property, that's it. I'll
see how excited she is about it.
[52:12] See if Anne first selected it.
>> Stevie Nicks.
[52:16] » Uh
yeah, I got the perfect present for you.
[52:21] » Um anything else on Wildcat River?
[52:28] Okay.
Um
[52:35] letters will be going out to
easement
[52:40] holders
this week.
[52:45] Have you been out to overlook it all?
Have you seen all of the logging that is
[52:49] » No.
No.
[52:51] » That's
>> I was going to say
[52:53] » It's Yeah, Burgess Highland.
>> Yeah.
[52:55] » There's Yeah, I I It's posted. I looked
at the permit. It's just logging.
[53:00] » When did it start?
>> Uh it's been going on maybe like 2
[53:03] weeks.
>> Okay, that's the trucks that have been
[53:04] coming down.
>> Yeah, it's
[53:08] » Huh?
>> Yeah.
[53:09] There's been a couple a couple of the
easements that we monitor. They've had
[53:12] So, several of them have had some some
logging
[53:15] » going on.
>> But the conservation easement
[53:17] » allowed them to do the logging.
>> With a lot of logging.
[53:20] » The first time they cut heavy, and then
they cut heavy probably
[53:24] » Well, just something to tend to over
there.
[53:27] » Yeah.
>> The lower section of the Burgess section
[53:29] that comes by our house was logged
pretty hard
[53:32] » Yeah.
>> at one point.
[53:33] » Yeah, that was
I don't know, that was 10 15 years ago
[53:37] now.
[53:44] » Yeah. Anyway, just so you're
aware.
[53:47] » Yeah. You can see it's posted right by
the fire pond.
[53:50] » Mhm.
>> But read the easement first.
[53:54] » But if it's allowed
>> Yeah, yeah. And it's following
[53:57] you know, proper then, so be it.
[54:03] Um
Do you have any thing for wetlands or
[54:07] Dundee
Forest
[54:10] » Do you have any updates on the resource
inventory?
[54:13] » Yeah, um
I'm a little behind, but I'm mostly
[54:17] there. I just I wanted to raise a couple
questions here.
[54:21] First off is
the assessment that was done by Upper
[54:25] Saco Valley Land Trust the best that I
can tell was basically an update that
[54:29] was done in 2022.
This does rely on the New Hampshire Fish
[54:34] and Game's State Wildlife Action Plan.
Which is a premier tool that a lot of
[54:39] those use.
The State Wildlife Action Plan was
[54:42] updated in 2025. So, it is actually
relative to looking at lands relative to
[54:49] wildlife value and so on and so forth.
And when I look at Upper Saco Valley
[54:54] Strategic Conservation Plan and they are
having a meeting I think in September or
[54:59] so.
>> Yeah, September 24th.
[55:00] » Yeah, September 24th. And I'm going to
check I may just check with Kate before
[55:05] then.
Um
[55:07] their priority areas do not reach up as
high as Prospect Farm area. Whereas when
[55:13] you look at the State Wildlife Action
Plan, I'm just giving this as one
[55:16] example. Um this is what I've been
trying [snorts] to just overlay. I mean,
[55:21] these are tools in the end we decide
what we think is is best for the town.
[55:25] Um
for example, the 100 acres that sits up
[55:29] at Prospect that's the private
parcel to them
[55:33] is rated as real high within State
Wildlife Action Plan, which makes all
[55:36] the sense in the world. Because upper
Snake River doesn't
[55:40] priority area doesn't reach up quite
that high.
[55:44] It doesn't flash
the same way. So, there's a few things
[55:48] in there that's a little bit of cross
talk. And if you remember when we got
[55:51] the
prospect management plan approved by the
[55:53] town,
we had actually made a recommendation
[55:56] that that definitely should be a
priority area. And we know that that was
[56:01] contested years ago. We don't need to go
through all of that.
[56:05] So, there's a couple of those things
that I'm just trying to chase out
[56:09] and and and get squared away.
I think, you know, they
[56:13] getting this like the soils maps and the
geology, a lot of that stuff is just
[56:19] you go to the state GIS, which is
basically what upper Snake River Valley
[56:23] is. And we we can put those in.
It would be almost a rehash of what was
[56:27] out there before because a lot of that
hasn't really changed in a big way.
[56:32] But then it gets around to what are the
recommendations that we make. I mean,
[56:36] you can explain the situation that's out
there. And let me give you just
[56:41] a few scenarios to take into
consideration that we don't need to
[56:45] decide on today, but
for example, Jackson has a problem
[56:49] that's it's looking for more housing. At
the same time, you want higher water
[56:53] quality. You have steep slopes. You
have, you know, soils that can't take a
[56:58] lot of septic systems. So, the town has
a soil base
[57:01] uh
septic
[57:04] as opposed to like 1 acre
is and and you know, and my
[57:08] recommendation on that one would be is
you'd either recommend that the town
[57:11] still maintain that strategy. The same
thing, the town has a river conservation
[57:17] plan and it has stuff about what's
supposed to be enforced relative to
[57:21] sediment runoff with construction, etc.
Um we know that the town was a little
[57:26] bit slow in implementing the sediment
control of the black. I mean, they're
[57:30] into it now.
Um and that's partly because we raised
[57:34] another raised the question with the
town as to
[57:37] we can't enforce this, but you do have a
law on the book and it needs to be
[57:40] enforced.
So, our recommendation is in the
[57:44] in the natural resource would be here
here's the conditions you have.
[57:48] A number of these things the town had
was preemptive in developing a park.
[57:53] They had to do that to get the
the wildcat into the wild and scenic. It
[57:58] had to demonstrate that it had some
you know, money in the game as well as
[58:04] just
getting a a designation with nothing
[58:07] else attached to it.
So,
[58:10] those you know, the two parts would be
and I think for the most part the town
[58:14] has
you know, good zoning
[58:17] out there.
It's a matter of making sure that those
[58:20] don't get changed because they can get
changed. If your master plan sends you
[58:24] in a different direction,
then it becomes problematic. You can see
[58:29] this in the housing commission that's
looking at why can't we open up the
[58:32] forest land for housing.
I went through this when they were
[58:37] trying to put the bypass
in around North Conway and the route
[58:40] they were going to do was try to when
you when as a town when you plan poorly,
[58:45] then you look at whoever else's lands
are available. They were going to put
[58:49] the bypass around the mole mountains
through our forest because there's
[58:53] nothing there. That was only a result
because the town had done poor planning
[58:56] up to that point. You have to be very
careful and particularly with this
[59:00] administration of opening up Pandora's
Box about
[59:04] uh you know, starting to sell off forest
service land to meet a need out there.
[59:11] The these are the kinds of things that
it's not hypothetical anymore. I know
[59:15] that the housing commission is is
exploring with the the forest service
[59:19] county use some of the land
which is
[59:24] Well, if you look at out west
the current administration is willing to
[59:29] sell off national parks, BLM land,
forest reserves. The list is long. I
[59:34] mean, they basically want to privatize
everything that's that's publicly owned.
[59:40] So that'll be part of what we need to
discuss as we get into recommendation
[59:44] section when we get there.
[59:47] The resource base, I think most of you
know it.
[59:51] The soils, the slopes, and so on and so
forth.
[59:55] So that's
and I will I don't know what
[1:00:00] people have other thoughts real quick
because I'll try to put in some draft
[1:00:04] recommendations and then we'll need to
be
[1:00:06] discuss those and so on and so forth
before we finalize
[1:00:11] the resource inventory.
[1:00:17] And some of it, like what Upper Saco
has, is it's been
[1:00:22] they run it through a formula.
So you don't actually have the base
[1:00:26] data, but I can access like slopes and
soils and that sort of stuff. And some
[1:00:32] of it they have, but some they do not.
But it's the same database that the
[1:00:36] state weather action plan would be using
as well.
[1:00:48] » So areas be
um
[1:00:52] highlighted as areas as of high interest
to them in terms of
[1:00:56] as a result of the natural this natural
inventory?
[1:01:00] » Oh, yeah. And then same thing is if you
want to preserve water quality,
[1:01:04] you have to be careful about, you know,
your zoning laws relative to what kind
[1:01:08] of development, how, where it's going to
take place, which is the septic, the
[1:01:12] suburban runoff during construction,
etc.
[1:01:16] And the town has fairly decent zoning
that's
[1:01:21] » What about trails and that sort of
thing?
[1:01:23] » The trails were put in and Mike, you
were going to do the cultural part and
[1:01:26] give it to me.
>> Yeah, so I did
[1:01:28] uh I did contact historical society to
see if they had
[1:01:32] just something already existing. And
they came back and said, "All of our
[1:01:37] things are in storage and we don't have
time right now to answer your question."
[1:01:41] » And there is some stuff out there
actually that's online.
[1:01:45] » Uh
I was going to
[1:01:47] » In the historic district.
>> Oh, yes, right, right. And that's what I
[1:01:49] kind of That's mostly what I was like
looking for if they just had something
[1:01:53] easy that was translatable that like
mapped out the historic district. Um and
[1:01:57] when I asked that question, they
basically said,
[1:02:00] "We're just
we're busy moving the building." Or I
[1:02:03] guess the building was already moved at
that point.
[1:02:04] » It's a small town. Sure.
>> Yeah, they're they're they're busy. So,
[1:02:06] I was going to uh
I was going to ask again um
[1:02:11] to see if they just had something easy
and digital.
[1:02:14] Um
now that it seems like they're getting
[1:02:17] » Well, I'll go back and get them to the
finish line.
[1:02:22] » I'm happy I'm happy to help.
[1:02:25] » And we do have what you what you've got
here, what they did for the town
[1:02:30] in their original,
which was not the 2022, but it was the
[1:02:37] was derived from pre-2020. They they
cuz the 2022 was an update.
[1:02:43] And I believe what the town has on
record here
[1:02:46] in their resource inventory was from the
inventory
[1:02:50] They didn't have
>> Yeah, this is this is something else,
[1:02:52] but yeah.
>> Yeah.
[1:02:54] For the cultural component, what would
be most helpful? Something text-based or
[1:02:58] something map-based?
>> Um
[1:03:01] » Or both?
>> Maps, you know, it's like pictures worth
[1:03:04] a thousand words.
But I think also text-based. We we do
[1:03:08] have a historic district here in town.
Um the other stuff that's probably of
[1:03:13] interest is
um
[1:03:16] you know, we have a number of historic
buildings like the Ham House, etc., that
[1:03:20] are not in the hit
in the historic district.
[1:03:24] » Mhm.
>> And you know, that's the function of an
[1:03:27] inventory is to list out what the town
has.
[1:03:31] » I know when you go up Green Hill Road,
you have to go up and climb Iron
[1:03:35] Mountain.
That was last little funky building
[1:03:38] that's half dilapidated was one of the
original schools. They used to be six or
[1:03:42] eight schools. That's past that
building.
[1:03:45] » Yeah, maybe I'll ask
Ann Killian as well. Yeah, I think she
[1:03:48] would be a good resource for that.
>> And Alice Pepper's book is a good
[1:03:53] » Mhm.
>> summary of a lot of that.
[1:03:55] » Mhm.
[1:03:58] Um
Okay.
[1:04:00] Um
[1:04:03] Looks like we're moving along there.
[1:04:07] I I
I'm
[1:04:08] like looking at the
I've seen various
[1:04:14] versions of this and like Eaton's
research it they they have it all on as
[1:04:22] a as a website, but it's just using all
of those
[1:04:27] land trust resources and then state
state maps.
[1:04:30] » Yes.
>> They're they're not generating a lot of
[1:04:33] new stuff, so
>> No.
[1:04:35] » So, you didn't see nothing.
>> And actually she she sent uh
[1:04:38] she has sent to me
and I can cookie cut out
[1:04:43] the Jackson.
What I can't cookie cut out, but I'm not
[1:04:46] sure that we really need it is if you
threw it into GIS, you could actually
[1:04:51] start to generate some statistics, but a
lot of that stats exist that haven't
[1:04:56] changed that much.
You know, like what percentage is slopes
[1:05:00] greater than X percent, etc.
>> Mhm.
[1:05:03] Yeah, I mean they the
[1:05:07] Maybe I'll reach out to them and see if
they have a hard copy version of this
[1:05:10] because they do have some narrative
narrative
[1:05:12] » I've already I'll get back in touch cuz
I've already communicated
[1:05:15] » Great.
>> communicated with Kate.
[1:05:20] » All right.
Um I just have a couple of other small
[1:05:23] things. There's
a volunteer fair October 22nd at um
[1:05:33] I can't remember if it's
[1:05:37] at the library. Yeah.
[1:05:41] to bring
uh
[1:05:45] volunteer organizations in Jackson and I
think
[1:05:48] kind of use it as a recruitment drive.
Didn't really generate
[1:05:51] anything from it, but if anyone's
interested in
[1:05:55] participating on that, it's October 22nd
at the Whitney Center.
[1:06:00] So.
[1:06:03] See if we can
get additional members or just
[1:06:09] more visibility.
And then
[1:06:15] the library will also be working with um
[1:06:20] New Hampshire Saves to have a
winterization energy saving workshop in
[1:06:25] November.
I said I would would help promote, so.
[1:06:31] » When is that again? November 7th?
>> 17th.
[1:06:33] » 17th.
[1:06:36] Through the library. So.
>> How do you help
[1:06:40] » Promote that?
>> Whatever they want
[1:06:43] » Is telling the people
>> Tell Tell the people.
[1:06:46] » They'll They'll go out in our community
minutes.
[1:06:51] Um
That is That is everything I have for
[1:06:54] tonight.
>> Uh I have one quick new business thing.
[1:06:57] » Oh, okay.
>> And that is I had uh
[1:07:00] someone that lives in town uh concerned
about some work being done at with next
[1:07:06] to theirs.
Um a lot of
[1:07:08] uh
material sediment. It's a building on a
[1:07:11] steep slope. And uh after it rains, uh a
lot of that material coming down onto
[1:07:17] their property, coming down into the
road.
[1:07:20] Um
so they
[1:07:23] We're This is um
up Jackson Highlands on a
[1:07:28] Northampton Ridge.
And so I recommended uh talking to the
[1:07:33] town inspector, maybe
writing a kind of a formal letter, that
[1:07:39] sort of thing, taking pictures from the
road.
[1:07:42] Um
and so the person
[1:07:45] um
I don't think
[1:07:47] they said that they had
uh seen the town inspector there and
[1:07:53] briefly mentioned things, but hadn't
seen any changes, and then they'd sent
[1:07:56] me some pictures.
So I said I would
[1:08:00] bring it
to the meeting and um
[1:08:04] I went up and looked at one point, but
I don't really know what I'm looking for
[1:08:09] as well as someone like Brian Wood or
perhaps Ken. So um
[1:08:14] » Yeah, if you want to call me leading
>> Yeah, I might be able to give you give
[1:08:18] you the address and
>> I think But for greater efficiency, they
[1:08:21] actually should be bringing that to the
town because
[1:08:25] the town has ordinances and it has
policy.
[1:08:29] We We cannot enforce anything.
The town is responsible for both
[1:08:34] checking on those and enforcing those
things. So the pictures should actually
[1:08:37] be going to the town.
>> Yeah, I think I think she was
[1:08:41] » I mean, it's good to alert us so we can
support, but that's it.
[1:08:43] » Yeah.
>> Um
[1:08:45] » I think Yeah, I think she was maybe
looking for some help as to whether or
[1:08:48] not what was being done was
you know, against town codes and things
[1:08:52] like that. But yeah, no, you're right.
Um
[1:08:55] » You can go read the zoning laws. It's
all
[1:08:58] pretty straightforward, actually.
>> Yeah, but it's hard for people to dip
[1:09:01] People off and I've never known anyone
dip their toe into the
[1:09:05] I don't want to be the person pointing
the finger. They just By doing that, the
[1:09:10] hope is that
maybe
[1:09:12] you'll tell somebody.
And this is just happening cuz it's
[1:09:15] supposed to happen anyway.
>> Yeah.
[1:09:17] » But we have like what like what Ken
said, we have those things in place.
[1:09:21] How long have I been on the board, Pam?
How long have you been on the board? How
[1:09:24] often have you seen
the things that we talked about at
[1:09:27] company meetings be enforced or
and then they black
[1:09:33] » Plan is a little different because
>> Well, somebody could draw a
[1:09:37] » DES is required to notify us and to get
our input.
[1:09:43] » Right.
>> And that's what we were talking about
[1:09:45] all along.
[1:09:49] » Well, I mean
>> And I think it's good if people are
[1:09:52] spreading it out. You should go tell the
selectmen, but I think it's good if you
[1:09:55] tell your neighbor and tell someone
that's on the board that tell the
[1:09:58] selectmen that's on the board that just
get the word out.
[1:10:01] » Yeah. I'm I'm friendly with this person.
I just think they felt more comfortable.
[1:10:04] » Yeah, and that's how I usually find out
my information. People just
[1:10:08] » But you can point out this
I mean, on the chapter and verse we put
[1:10:12] in that letter to DES relative to what
the town's zonings are.
[1:10:16] » Mhm.
>> Because we also sent that to the town
[1:10:20] the same time.
>> Okay.
[1:10:25] » Um
just so I make sure we don't forget
[1:10:28] about this.
We are going to be hold holding a public
[1:10:33] meeting to discuss
this plan on October 5th.
[1:10:38] I'm going to say
[1:10:41] 7:00, 6:30 or 7:00
p.m. is that?
[1:10:45] » We should probably shoot for 6:30 and
that way we can just have our meeting be
[1:10:49] shorter. If we do 7:00, it's a long
meeting and then another
[1:10:52] » Yeah, okay.
>> I mean, I don't want to
[1:10:54] » 5:00, yeah, 5:45.
I mean, we can
[1:10:58] If if if it's preferable, we can do that
prior to holding the meeting.
[1:11:06] With that
>> It might be harder for people to make
[1:11:08] 5:30. It can be tough for everybody.
It's
[1:11:11] » Okay. So, public meeting October 5th at
6:30.
[1:11:15] » I think that's fair.
>> And then we've got to have something
[1:11:18] that they can look at in advance.
[1:11:25] I would suggest that we make the
[1:11:29] design plans
the response to the request.
[1:11:38] We would be discussing
and I think that there was an emotion
[1:11:41] that
we're recommending
[1:11:45] as a conservation commission to move
forward. The conservation commission is
[1:11:48] going to put up X dollars. I think we
said 45. And um
[1:11:53] we would be
that this public meeting would be also
[1:11:57] to see the town
put in the remainder.
[1:11:59] » Mhm.
>> And so that people come with some
[1:12:03] knowledge.
>> Mhm.
[1:12:05] » I always hate walking into a meeting of
which I'm
[1:12:08] trying to catch up to speed.
>> Right.
[1:12:10] » So, you put it on the notice and refer
people to
[1:12:14] the website.
>> Yeah.
[1:12:16] » So, what you're saying?
>> Yeah.
[1:12:19] » Otherwise, you're going to be
pulling up
[1:12:23] the picture and so on and so forth.
>> Yeah, I think you want to have the
[1:12:26] information out there and make sure it's
I think almost worse is when
[1:12:30] you think you have all the information
only to find out you go to a meeting
[1:12:33] that has moved ahead of
the last information I left you. So, you
[1:12:38] go there thinking you're going to
discuss something that's already been
[1:12:40] decided and you're
>> Right.
[1:12:42] » This is what I thought this was for.
>> Yeah, I I think the only
[1:12:48] guidance that I've gotten from the
New Hampshire Association is that it is
[1:12:56] we don't go into the meeting with a
decision already locked in with the
[1:13:00] place.
>> Mhm.
[1:13:02] » Uh for that purpose. So, I will
get the notice out on e-news and include
[1:13:09] uh the design plans and the
quote.
[1:13:15] Yeah, and so we'll do that.
>> And the Conservation Commission
[1:13:19] would be putting up 45 and
they would be
[1:13:24] a vote by the town whether we would put
up the other 45. It's a sounding board
[1:13:28] if everybody came in and said great
idea.
[1:13:30] Then you probably have a good chance of
getting it passed if everybody showed up
[1:13:34] and said this terrible idea.
>> So, that'll go out on e-news ahead of
[1:13:38] time.
>> Mhm.
[1:13:38] » So, it's another this is like this is
your first sounding board.
[1:13:42] And we'll see who shows up.
[1:13:45] » Okay.
>> And if you can send me any engineering
[1:13:47] stuff, that'd be awesome. If you have
that. If you have it.
[1:13:51] » And the only
I'll ask if there's any additional
[1:13:55] materials.
>> Yeah.
[1:13:56] » Um okay. So,
I guess we just need to have a motion to
[1:14:00] » And say that Shawn will be there.
>> Yeah.
[1:14:02] Yeah, that's Shawn will be there.
[1:14:06] A motion to schedule a public meeting
for this at 6:30.
[1:14:10] » I'll make the motion.
>> Is there a second?
[1:14:13] » I'll second.
>> I'm going to say Pam.
[1:14:17] » Getting on the board.
>> Pam's getting on the board. It's quick.
[1:14:19] » All right.
All in favor?
[1:14:21] » Aye.
>> Opposed?
[1:14:23] » I'll abstain from that.
>> [laughter]
[1:14:26] » No.
Okay.
[1:14:30] » And then our next meeting will be
October 5th, regular time.
[1:14:36] And is there a motion to adjourn?
>> Wait, may I make a comment?
[1:14:40] » Oh, I'm sorry.
>> Public comment?
[1:14:42] » Any additional public comment?
>> Any?
[1:14:46] » Thank you.
>> Motion to adjourn.
[1:14:49] » I'll second that.
>> Uh all those in favor?
[1:14:53] » I.
>> Opposed?
[1:14:56] » All right. Thank you, everyone.
>> Thanks, Ryan.
[1:15:00] » Thank you.
[1:15:02] » Thanks, Benny.
>> Thanks. Thanks for coming.
[1:15:05] » Ben, when you send in your view app,
do you put in any other comments because
[1:15:10] you
>> Do you have the address?
[1:15:11] » Yeah, this property.
>> Um it's going to take me a minute to
[1:15:14] figure that out.
>> I don't have the exact address. I tried
[1:15:16] to
>> I tried to scroll down with the number.
[1:15:19] » I don't have the address off.
>> Yeah, let's turn this
[1:15:21] » Get out.
>> Yeah.
[1:15:23] » Cuz there's one quality and there's one
quality.
[1:15:26] » Um
it just would be an observation.
[1:15:29] » Since it's not a test site,
>> it's a it's above and below that.
[1:15:33] » Um
[1:15:36] there wouldn't be
>> That's true.
[1:15:39] » There's a general comment
>> on the Insta.
[1:15:43] » Insta.
[1:15:47] » Oh, that's