[0:07] Good morning, everyone. Thank
[0:08] you all for being here. I call
[0:10] this meeting to order a time
[0:12] 10, 31. My name is COUNCILMAN
[0:14] Jimmy Palou. So I'm very
[0:15] grateful to see such a large
[0:15] crowd at a feeling that we
[0:19] have a good, a good group shot
[0:20] this morning. Going to go
[0:21] around the table real quick
[0:22] introduction starting with
[0:23] Kelly.
[0:23] >> Calling him see Council
[0:28] research. Red is speak pretty
[0:31] Norris for the administration.
[0:34] Shana Matt Dallas, office of
[0:35] General Counsel.
[0:35] >> Nick, Howland City Council
[0:37] at large group, 3 City Council
[0:40] district 7.
[0:41] >> On a holder city council
[0:45] elect at large. That one.
[0:46] >> grateful to have a city
[0:47] council member elect Holder
[0:47] with us going to be swearing
[0:51] in on Monday. I also want to
[0:51] recognize we have state
[0:53] Representative Dean Black in
[0:54] the room. He came here as
[0:55] well. We're grateful to your
[0:56] presence or areas in the back.
[1:01] All right. So you know this,
[1:01] this meetings got a good
[1:02] amount of fanfare and I'm glad
[1:04] to see such a such a large
[1:04] group of folks in here who I
[1:07] think kind of. Mere the
[1:08] political spectrum. And I
[1:10] think that's really important
[1:12] because this is an issue or
[1:13] isis. A conversation that's
[1:14] happening at the national
[1:15] level at the state level and
[1:19] at the local level about what
[1:19] are these cameras that have
[1:21] popping up a lot in the past
[1:23] several years? What what what
[1:25] kind of data do they have?
[1:26] What what relationship they
[1:27] have with law enforcement as
[1:27] law enforcement the best use
[1:31] out of them. And also is there
[1:32] constitutionality questions
[1:35] that that we should be asking
[1:35] and that, you know, neighbors
[1:36] and communities have been
[1:37] asking for a while now. And so
[1:38] I just kind of want to get as
[1:40] many answers we could at this
[1:41] moment. There's no draft
[1:44] legislation as of yet kind of
[1:46] kind of tinkering with ideas
[1:48] of what I would expect to file
[1:52] if we can. And so, you know,
[1:52] we have one of one of our
[1:54] attorneys here, one of best
[1:56] attorneys who also worked in
[1:57] the prosecutor's office for
[1:58] quite some time, which is a
[1:58] really good expertise on, you
[2:03] know. That kind of level of of
[2:04] criminal justice all that to
[2:06] if you do have public comment
[2:06] cards, please bring them up. I
[2:07] want to hear from as many
[2:09] folks as possible that we do
[2:09] have the room only for a
[2:13] limited amount of time. All
[2:15] right. So heading down the
[2:16] agenda goals for the automated
[2:17] surveillance equipment,
[2:18] policies, regulation and a
[2:20] possible temporary moratorium.
[2:25] So as we've been kind of
[2:25] looking at stuff from the
[2:27] policy perspective from city
[2:28] councils, perspective, I just
[2:29] don't know what as a county
[2:33] and as a municipality, we have
[2:35] the rights to do when it comes
[2:36] anything involving these
[2:36] cameras right there in the
[2:37] right of way public right of
[2:39] way. So one MAY assume that
[2:40] being in the public right of
[2:43] way. You have to get a permit
[2:44] or or there must be some sort
[2:46] of methodology as to how they
[2:49] got installed. And so first
[2:50] off, I don't know if if the
[2:52] mayor's office or some of the
[2:53] Sunday research on this as to
[2:55] how some of these got
[2:55] installed or if anyone has
[3:04] any. Knowledge of that.
[3:05] Bringing north for the
[3:06] Ministration. I don't have
[3:07] direct answers for you, but
[3:07] I've made a list of some of
[3:08] these questions will get.
[3:12] >> And back to you guys.
[3:12] Excellent.
[3:13] >> So seeing that was one of
[3:15] my first questions is who's
[3:16] installing these cameras and
[3:16] our taxpayer dollars being
[3:19] used to install them. Are
[3:20] there no taxpayer dollars
[3:21] being used to install them,
[3:23] but then when there's a
[3:24] subscription service, whether
[3:26] it be flock or when the other
[3:27] things. That's the of note
[3:29] here is it's not just flock,
[3:29] right. There are other. This
[3:33] is a larger conversation about
[3:34] kind of Cummings, automated
[3:39] camera devices so. I think
[3:39] what what what I would like to
[3:42] see. Minor draft legislation
[3:45] that I have. It's kind of. A
[3:49] couple different points. One
[3:49] is a an immediate moratorium
[3:51] for about 120 days on any new
[3:52] cameras being installed in the
[3:55] city of Jacksonville. 2 was a
[3:56] inventory of all cameras with
[4:03] the city of Jacksonville. New
[4:06] process to be drafted that
[4:07] last for public participation
[4:07] for when cameras do get
[4:08] installed or are going through
[4:10] the installation process,
[4:11] which I believe would go
[4:13] through the cpac setting. That
[4:14] makes sense, see packs for
[4:17] those of you familiar are the
[4:18] community, you know, the
[4:18] community groups that the
[4:20] citizen like groups we have, I
[4:24] think 6, throughout their
[4:25] throughout the city. And so
[4:26] oftentimes kind of land use
[4:28] and zoning issues go before
[4:29] the cpac. It's a good way for
[4:31] the public to be involved in
[4:32] the process. So, hey, if any
[4:33] new cameras are being
[4:35] installed, it has to go
[4:35] through and be briefed in
[4:38] front of that group. And then
[4:38] last thing that I've really
[4:40] been tinkering with, isn't
[4:43] that what I'm hearing a lot.
[4:44] Is how do we maybe remove
[4:47] these cameras? Now, the first
[4:48] thing I should note is as in
[4:51] my conversations with jso,
[4:52] they're very much in support
[4:53] of these cameras said they
[4:55] have helped lead to reducing
[4:57] crime to solving crimes, to
[4:59] ensuring that if there's a
[5:01] missing persons or something
[5:02] along those lines or or or
[5:03] someone who's in running
[5:04] running from the law that
[5:07] these value at. And I don't
[5:09] dispute that. I don't think
[5:09] that that is, you know, I
[5:10] think so long as one crime.
[5:12] It's all because of that. You
[5:13] could say, alright, I see the
[5:16] value in this. The crime
[5:17] prevention peas. However, it's
[5:20] just a matter of from the
[5:21] constitutional side. Well, we
[5:22] want to make sure that
[5:24] neighbors and those who live
[5:25] in the communities adjacent to
[5:26] these cameras, aware that
[5:27] there's a camera to begin
[5:31] with. And 2, if they don't
[5:31] want the camera right outside
[5:32] the neighborhood with in their
[5:34] neighborhood, what kind of
[5:35] process exists to not only
[5:36] give them as much information
[5:37] about the cameras possible but
[5:38] ways to potentially remove the
[5:42] camera. And so what I've been
[5:44] kind of tinkering with is if
[5:46] ever a neighborhood wants a
[5:47] speed hump. All right. I'm
[5:48] using a weird process here
[5:50] every neighborhood. Wants
[5:52] speed hump. They usually go
[5:53] through their city council
[5:54] member or go through a process
[5:55] where they get a petition. So
[5:59] listen from their neighbors.
[6:00] Then a more formal petition
[6:00] process goes out to the
[6:01] property owners and the select
[6:04] whether or not they speed hump
[6:06] or not. So I would envision if
[6:08] we were looking to remove a
[6:09] camera that it would go
[6:10] through a similar process that
[6:11] the neighborhood would come to
[6:12] their elected score through
[6:13] the cpac or through the city
[6:16] in general and just sort of,
[6:18] you know, a petition process.
[6:18] We go out to folks. They would
[6:19] say yes or no. They want the
[6:22] camera moved. As for how much
[6:23] of a cause for move the
[6:24] camera. That part, I don't
[6:27] know. Nor I know. You know
[6:28] what, what if public dollars
[6:29] to be used for move the camera
[6:29] for the up to the
[6:31] neighborhoods and communities.
[6:32] These are things I'm just
[6:34] tinkering with that. I've
[6:35] spoken to general counsel
[6:36] about and they are are doing
[6:38] their best to research this.
[6:39] Are there any thoughts or
[6:39] comments from my colleagues at
[6:42] this moment? Council PRESIDENT
[6:47] Helena? Yeah, thank you
[6:48] constantly. So I was in the
[6:50] office today. So I wanted
[6:52] already. And when I having
[6:53] this meeting, I want to drop
[6:53] by because this is a serious
[6:54] issue. It's a polarizing
[6:58] issue. I think it's one that.
[6:59] Israeli at the juxtaposition
[7:01] between public safety and
[7:02] privacy. I think it's one we
[7:07] shouldn't rush. In 2. We
[7:07] should have a kind of a
[7:09] community-wide debate on this.
[7:13] I know I've been talking the
[7:14] site's been council PRESIDENT.
[7:15] I'm also the liaison. So I
[7:16] speak regularly with the
[7:17] sheriff and his team issue
[7:18] such as this. And we've been
[7:20] talking to this issue and
[7:21] >> and the sheriff shares the
[7:24] same concerns. It's a very
[7:27] effective public safety tool,
[7:27] but he's concerned about
[7:28] misuse of data and concerned
[7:30] about protecting 4th Amendment
[7:31] privacy rights. And I think
[7:36] he's shown. Is for your tenure
[7:37] and the office for plus years
[7:41] that he's willing hold his own
[7:42] officers accountable and
[7:43] misuse. I think they've done
[7:44] that with David data and other
[7:50] things we have to think about
[7:51] those things as we go forward.
[7:52] We also need to think about
[7:53] the state has been clear that
[7:54] they want to address this
[7:55] issue. I current governor
[7:58] mentioned that he'd like to
[8:00] address I've heard the
[8:01] incoming governor mentioned
[8:04] that he'd like to address it.
[8:05] Governor view already chosen
[8:10] is always I have. I've heard
[8:10] the state legislature think
[8:12] about how they want to address
[8:13] it. So I think we need to
[8:15] think about the issue very
[8:17] carefully and make sure that
[8:17] we find the right balance.
[8:19] Listen to community concerns
[8:21] and ensure that we protect
[8:26] people's privacy rights. A
[8:27] council PRESIDENT Council
[8:28] councilmember elective any
[8:29] comments or thoughts on this
[8:30] >> You have to. But I just
[8:31] want to be an opportunity. Now
[8:36] feel like I have Now. Just
[8:37] appreciate the opportunity.
[8:40] Glad that the room is full.
[8:40] This is an issue that I've
[8:41] heard a lot about over the
[8:42] last couple weeks and months
[8:45] and a lot of concerns from all
[8:45] over.
[8:46] >> Jacksonville, from beaches,
[8:49] North side, South side,
[8:51] another something that we need
[8:52] to come into alignment on. But
[8:55] to appreciate the benefits of
[8:57] public safety with these
[8:58] cameras, but also understand
[8:59] the concern around
[9:02] surveillance privacy. So happy
[9:03] to be here today to hear more
[9:08] from the public. Excellent.
[9:09] Thank you.
[9:10] >> as we some sort of put you
[9:13] on the on the hot seat here,
[9:16] I'm seeing that a number of
[9:17] counties and cities within the
[9:18] state of Florida because, you
[9:18] know, if you look at the back
[9:20] of his hand out, it shows a
[9:24] very much it shows a number of
[9:26] municipalities and parts of
[9:28] the country contract was
[9:29] canceled with whether flock or
[9:30] one of the other private
[9:34] companies however, very few of
[9:35] them are within the state of
[9:38] Florida. Right? And so state
[9:40] law and it's a lot they have a
[9:40] lot of control of our counties
[9:41] or municipalities. So it is
[9:44] kind of better. You know, it's
[9:44] good to see stuff from
[9:47] Connecticut and Massachusetts,
[9:48] Wyoming but state state law in
[9:51] Florida's is very different.
[9:52] So I don't know because I'm
[9:53] seeing a few stuff in here
[9:54] from Tampa, Saint Leon County
[9:58] and Lake County. How what kind
[9:59] of rights that we potentially
[10:00] have that we are we able to
[10:02] say, hey, you can't build
[10:02] anything in the right of way,
[10:03] even if it's a public entity
[10:04] that can do it you have any
[10:13] thoughts on that.
[10:15] >> What other counties have
[10:17] done and what other what
[10:18] cities other counties have
[10:23] done other states. I have the
[10:23] distinct feeling that there is
[10:24] a lot more being done. It just
[10:27] doesn't make. An Internet
[10:31] search very quickly,
[10:32] especially when talk about the
[10:33] passage of laws, sometimes it
[10:34] takes, you know, our process
[10:36] takes 6 weeks, minimum. So
[10:38] sometimes it's just not
[10:39] actually in the public view
[10:45] quite yet. The second level on
[10:46] that. And it would be some
[10:46] that have to look at each one
[10:47] of these separately is just
[10:50] because
[10:53] >> municipality has passed an
[10:54] ordinance doesn't mean that
[10:57] ordinance is actually fully
[10:59] lawful because they MAY be
[11:01] split be having a policy
[11:01] declaration more than actually
[11:03] a change, a law. So I'd have
[11:05] to drill down on each one of
[11:08] them. And as to what can you
[11:09] do wear it depends on the what
[11:12] and the wear because of is it
[11:14] a state road is that city
[11:15] road? Whose camera is it?
[11:19] There's a lot really broad,
[11:20] detailed fact base question
[11:23] that I'm happy to dig into
[11:24] excellent. And we appreciate
[11:25] that. I I think it's something
[11:26] kind of work to get into.
[11:33] >> you know, actually state
[11:33] representative like, do you
[11:35] want to come up here and speak
[11:35] from kind of your perspective
[11:36] on this that it is not
[11:37] mandatory. Sarah, just want to
[11:38] give you that the time and
[11:42] attention. If you'd like. Have
[11:57] a with us.
[12:01] I think the city
[12:02] council PRESIDENT Said it well
[12:05] when he said we stand at the
[12:05] juxtaposition.
[12:06] >> Between security.
[12:10] >> And
[12:14] >> we have to be very cautious
[12:15] and how we proceed. We want to
[12:16] be safe. We want to make sure
[12:17] law enforcement has the tools
[12:20] to keep us so but we also want
[12:22] to make sure that we don't
[12:23] create the tools inadvertently
[12:27] in the service of security for
[12:28] one day police surveillance
[12:32] state to emerge. And speaking
[12:33] as your state representative,
[12:35] I know that many of my
[12:36] colleagues in Tallahassee
[12:38] share this concern. We want to
[12:42] make sure that. We remain a
[12:44] free people, but also a secure
[12:47] people. And so to that in
[12:48] COUNCILMAN, thank you for
[12:50] calling this meeting.
[12:51] PRESIDENT COUNCILMAN Elect.
[12:53] Thank you for being here. I
[12:55] think this is a very healthy
[12:58] discourse and I stepped in
[13:00] here before my other meeting
[13:01] because above all else, I
[13:02] wanted to hear what what you
[13:07] all have to say. And so the
[13:08] less I speak, the more value I
[13:11] will get from you. And so with
[13:13] that, I'll close and thank
[13:14] you, COUNCILMAN, thank you,
[13:15] rep and I do appreciate you
[13:17] showing up. I didn't want to
[13:18] >> put you on the spot, but I
[13:19] but I need you have some
[13:19] pretty good perspective on
[13:21] this. And you do have a
[13:22] district that is very diverse
[13:24] in terms of, you know, it's
[13:24] very rural and some parts
[13:27] quite line. New neighborhoods
[13:30] and our parts. I do want to
[13:31] dive in a public comment
[13:31] because I do think that's
[13:33] gonna maybe one last thing.
[13:34] Please go ahead. Coming up in
[13:38] case anyone make mention of it
[13:38] during public comment when I
[13:39] was talking Sheriff Waters
[13:42] recently about. How the state
[13:44] is likely to take a position
[13:46] on this. He said, well,
[13:47] there's no reason that we
[13:48] can't take a position now to
[13:51] shore up privacy rights. In
[13:52] the meantime, and I understand
[13:53] that there might be another
[13:53] councilmember considering
[13:54] piece of legislation that
[13:58] would potentially make misuse
[14:04] of lpr data more serious
[14:04] transgression. So a Class c
[14:06] misdemeanor or a company by
[14:09] fines and potential jail time.
[14:11] And that is a measure to
[14:12] address concerns right now
[14:16] about abuse of Lpr data then
[14:19] wait and see how state handles
[14:20] some other things. So might be
[14:21] some of those things which
[14:22] would be a proactive way of
[14:22] protecting privacy rights. In
[14:23] the meantime, while we have
[14:26] this discussion. Understood
[14:27] and yeah, I mean, I'm not here
[14:27] to necessarily rush things,
[14:28] but I am also here to
[14:29] recognize that we have an
[14:33] election in MARCH and then. Is
[14:34] JANUARY DECEMBER. Then you've
[14:35] got the new governor shows up
[14:37] and then eventually get that
[14:38] mean, there's a significant
[14:40] amount of time we're in. We're
[14:43] not as right now. And so, you
[14:44] know, I do want to make sure
[14:46] if even if we just do a
[14:47] moratorium until that point
[14:48] where the new legislature kind
[14:50] of needs, which I think is
[14:53] JANUARY what we should do,
[14:54] something I think I think
[14:55] we're about to hear from from
[14:56] speakers like I want to get
[14:58] their thoughts. We're going to
[15:01] go through pretty quickly just
[15:01] because there's a lot of
[15:02] speaker cards want to get
[15:03] people that 2 minutes time
[15:04] just because we don't have the
[15:07] room too long. Aaron Perkins.
[15:08] Next step after Aaron is
[15:19] Brooke. And what each speakers
[15:22] please say, your name. And if
[15:22] you're if
[15:23] >> you either I your address
[15:24] or if your address is on the
[15:25] card, you can simply say
[15:34] address on file. Give the red.
[15:37] >> Look for about everybody.
[15:38] Hear me. Aaron Perkins, 35
[15:39] West 9th Street live here in
[15:40] spring from a bike, appeared
[15:40] trying to dense 3 hours of
[15:44] conversation. 2 minutes. Okay
[15:44] things is not being discussed
[15:46] and I'm a little concerned of
[15:47] is a fiduciary responsibility
[15:49] as its mapped out like we're
[15:51] setting ourselves up to have
[15:52] yet another asset that we have
[15:53] to pay maintenance people
[15:54] hurricane comes through.
[15:54] People are going to cut these
[15:55] down the newest and greatest
[15:59] technology comes out. How is
[16:00] that contract settled
[16:01] installed improperly only on
[16:02] the hook because of technician
[16:03] installed incorrectly. It's
[16:04] one big issue. We definitely
[16:07] to pause. Get that sorted out.
[16:08] The safety, the other
[16:08] regulations, other cities.
[16:10] This is a brand new tool.
[16:12] First off the assembly
[16:14] concept. We're making a ring
[16:14] camera system for the whole
[16:15] city and other cities are
[16:17] taking a pause button. We
[16:19] should too pull that this
[16:19] thing is going to involve
[16:20] other people. Municipality's
[16:23] are going to figure out the
[16:23] rights and regulations and how
[16:24] to use as we should be
[16:25] spending money and we
[16:27] shouldn't be wasting all the
[16:28] taxpayers time. If we're gonna
[16:29] do it wrong but Stitt back
[16:31] paws. Get it right. The first
[16:32] time in my world of air
[16:32] traffic, we put a new
[16:34] equipment system we do a
[16:35] safety panel and we try to
[16:38] determine is it even feasible
[16:40] or is it worth the time and
[16:41] investment? Are we going down
[16:42] the right way? Seems like this
[16:43] case. What we did put the
[16:44] technology in place first and
[16:44] now we're trying to figure out
[16:47] how we should to play. We pull
[16:49] back figure out how to deploy
[16:52] it and make it sensible last
[16:52] Want to get it when you're
[16:55] fast. Once someone last want
[16:56] to get across, is that the
[17:00] frustration you're hearing and
[17:01] its multiple places in the
[17:01] absence of information, people
[17:02] are going to insert their own
[17:05] opinion into that space. So we
[17:06] if and when we move forward
[17:08] with this concept, there needs
[17:10] to be clear, concise
[17:11] information, how it's going to
[17:12] deployed and people should
[17:13] have chance to ask questions,
[17:16] get answers, not not. I'll get
[17:17] back with you. There should be
[17:18] a clear information of how
[17:19] this is done so we can know
[17:20] how it's deployed. I don't
[17:21] answer my own fears into that
[17:23] space. Thank you for your
[17:24] time. It was a less than 2
[17:27] minutes. Great job banner. And
[17:32] then Frederick. My name is
[17:38] Brooke 5 and oh, citizen
[17:40] concerned one of the points
[17:41] that I'm not sure adult
[17:43] totally dressed as the flock
[17:47] companies. Have been provided
[17:47] with access to driver's
[17:52] license information. That to
[17:55] me is definite concern.
[17:56] Initially. How do these
[18:00] companies? Rula get ruling or
[18:03] be allowed to install a
[18:04] private camera on public
[18:09] device. Public locations. And
[18:10] secondly, that needs to be
[18:14] tracked back. Are there any
[18:15] restrictions? Are there any
[18:16] requirements for that
[18:18] licensure and are there any
[18:20] limitations as to what they
[18:22] can have access to? That is
[18:23] deep concern because of that
[18:27] wide open. Technology like the
[18:28] flock cameras are essentially
[18:30] like a hammer. You can use it
[18:31] to build things or you can use
[18:33] it destroys things. It's all
[18:36] depending upon the
[18:38] restrictions or the intent of
[18:40] using that tool. And that's my
[18:52] concern. Thank you very much.
[18:53] My name is Red road off my
[18:55] address on the card. I'm here
[18:57] now to. Present my opinion
[19:01] against the broad collection,
[19:01] private citizens movement data
[19:03] through automatic license
[19:04] plate readers signal detection
[19:05] systems that just trace
[19:07] similar systems operated by
[19:08] private entities.
[19:08] >> first argument I want to
[19:09] make is that every person on
[19:10] their way to this meeting,
[19:14] like the best flock cameras,
[19:15] very recent history
[19:16] association. Data like this
[19:17] would absolutely have been
[19:19] used to target individuals for
[19:21] u.S. Mint. Lets them as
[19:22] political dissidents or to
[19:24] have the members of the false
[19:25] pretense.
[19:25] >> Can you get closer to the
[19:26] microphone so you can get
[19:28] recorded. Thank you.
[19:29] >> Recently we have been shown
[19:30] that the slippery s#
[19:30] #
[19:30] #
[19:30] #
[19:31] is not
[19:32] a fallacy. These automatic
[19:35] tracking systems are operated
[19:36] private companies and are
[19:37] beholden to shareholders who
[19:37] will push them to make as much
[19:39] money as possible. That means
[19:41] a constant flow of new
[19:43] products and services all
[19:44] centered around the collection
[19:46] and Adelaide at all is a
[19:47] shipment of the movement data
[19:51] of private citizens, the
[19:52] expansion of these networks to
[19:53] an artificially intelligent,
[19:54] but not to. And it's not that
[19:57] far from science fiction. A
[19:59] comparison of location data
[20:01] collected by cell phone
[20:02] companies often brought up the
[20:02] part words always left out is
[20:06] federal and state statutes.
[20:07] Requires specific legal
[20:08] threshold be met before those
[20:10] public. But for those records
[20:11] are obtained right now, all
[20:15] that needs for all right. Now,
[20:17] all that's needed for any
[20:17] office to accept civilian
[20:18] movements through the lpr is
[20:21] the case over. Again belabor
[20:22] the point all day. But the
[20:23] bottom line is this the
[20:24] average citizen should be free
[20:27] from government overreach,
[20:27] constant surveillance systems
[20:29] like these alprs collect every
[20:30] bit collecting every bit of
[20:31] moving from every citizen just
[20:34] in case is an invasive cancer.
[20:39] Thank you, sir. Tim Riggins.
[20:46] >> Followed by Michael Milton.
[20:47] >> for guns might addresses on
[20:51] file. I work as a senior staff
[20:53] engineer, the Civic Tech
[20:56] company. I followed much of
[20:58] the reporting around Flock and
[21:00] surveillance companies. And I
[21:01] grave concerns about security
[21:02] posture is that many of these
[21:03] companies about the actual
[21:04] design of the products to be
[21:09] able to. Like enforce
[21:11] restrictions on who can search
[21:12] things make make the they are
[21:14] designed to make it easier for
[21:16] law enforcement access to
[21:17] records. That's part of the
[21:18] value proposition. And I think
[21:21] that they they will always be
[21:22] prioritizing, making it easier
[21:24] over making sure that citizens
[21:25] privacy rights and
[21:25] constitutional rights are
[21:33] protected. Yeah, I don't think
[21:34] that penalties for misuse are
[21:35] likely. I have very little
[21:37] faith that that make much of
[21:38] an impact on privacy because
[21:39] if anything, it would just
[21:44] raised the stakes for. Police
[21:45] officers to, you it's just
[21:47] it's more of know I'm
[21:49] throwing, you colleague onto
[21:50] the bus and potentially
[21:51] putting them in jail, which is
[21:52] not something that police
[21:56] officer don't want to I also
[21:59] just wanted to add I would I
[22:01] would love for the much
[22:02] moratorium to include not just
[22:04] don't add new cameras, but
[22:07] let's also disable the cameras
[22:08] that we have for now, we even
[22:08] have wind down due to make
[22:10] their cities put bags over
[22:12] them. You can make until a
[22:16] public policy has been decided
[22:17] as as a community. I think
[22:18] that that would be a great way
[22:21] in the short Yet they're not
[22:28] violent. It was picked. 2
[22:29] minutes. I'm very grateful.
[22:30] Michael Milton and then Ben
[22:38] Elk Horn.
[22:39] >> Hello, my name is Michael
[22:40] Nelson, archaeologist and
[22:42] study human populations.
[22:46] There's going to be some tax
[22:47] revenue from tickets that are
[22:48] going to be distributed from
[22:49] the system. But the value from
[22:53] the data itself, Facebook has
[22:54] revenue of 270 billion dollars
[22:55] a year from the free website.
[22:58] Why is it free? Well, it's
[22:59] not. It's taking your data and
[23:01] giving it to advertisers.
[23:02] Those advertisers then tell
[23:05] you what you want to fight.
[23:07] Tiktok collects data on
[23:07] American users. Chinese
[23:08] company has our data but we
[23:12] don't have data on them.
[23:12] Pokemon Go. A company that
[23:13] spent 10 years collecting your
[23:16] data. The parent company
[23:19] Niantic has sold itself to the
[23:21] Saudi Arabian government, not
[23:21] accompany government has data
[23:23] on where our children go after
[23:27] school and what they buy. They
[23:28] have our shopping habits or
[23:31] leisure activities. Could you
[23:32] imagine if we were to go to
[23:35] war with the nation that new
[23:37] what our behavior was during
[23:37] school shooting or natural
[23:40] disaster or celebrity death.
[23:42] And the question that I have
[23:43] to really ask is what
[23:44] happened, sir, data when Flock
[23:45] goes bankrupt and they have to
[23:49] sell their assets. Thank you.
[23:50] Thank you, Ben Alcorn.
[23:58] >> Followed by Laura Harris.
[23:58] Veteran Elkhorn Madras and
[24:05] file. I think it's a
[24:06] complicated issue doesn't fit
[24:08] into our traditional 2 party
[24:09] system. Like we've got a
[24:12] design. Like most issues do.
[24:13] So it's a little nuanced. And
[24:18] I Next thing I want to say is
[24:21] a moratorium is not a ban.
[24:23] It's just time pause. Take
[24:26] time to look at the issues and
[24:26] talk through, especially since
[24:31] it is a nuanced. Ishan are
[24:33] some pros. I've seen it work
[24:33] in the construction industry
[24:34] and cameras have been put on
[24:37] job sites and stopped. And
[24:42] help catch criminals. That of
[24:44] gone to job sites to steal
[24:44] things which makes
[24:45] affordability of houses
[24:48] higher, right? So I mean,
[24:49] there's real good case uses of
[24:53] However. You know, we don't
[24:54] want to give jso that, you
[24:55] know, the tools to do their
[25:00] job. We want to be safe.
[25:01] Identification harassment,
[25:02] privacy, liberty are issues
[25:04] that matter and they need to
[25:06] be discussed. And so. I think
[25:07] transparency is really the
[25:10] issue. This is obviously
[25:10] authorized and jso is budget
[25:13] which the law budget with
[25:14] online. You know that not a
[25:17] lot of people necessarily see.
[25:18] What is the cost of this
[25:19] because it is a taxpayer cost
[25:21] ultimately our taxes pay jso.
[25:25] All right. So some
[25:27] transparency there. What is it
[25:27] being used for? Is it just
[25:29] being used for? A license
[25:33] plates? I think jso made a
[25:34] statement that that's the
[25:34] case. I don't know if that's
[25:37] necessarily fully true or not.
[25:40] So transparency is the issue
[25:42] is this data being shared with
[25:42] who else has access to this
[25:44] data besides jso? For
[25:48] instance. Immigration,
[25:49] customs, they have access to
[25:54] the as I said You know, just
[25:54] wondering and we don't know
[25:55] the answers to that. All
[25:59] right. So I want to go back to
[26:04] a moratorium is not a ban.
[26:05] Annex of Laura Harris played
[26:15] by Matt Hammond. Matt, if just
[26:21] kind of prep.
[26:23] >> I am not an active this
[26:26] time. Just an old lady. Who
[26:30] retired. And I'm here to tell
[26:33] you about an experience that I
[26:34] had in 2022. Where one
[26:35] Saturday morning I went out to
[26:37] my driveway. My car was gone.
[26:39] Name and address, I it's on
[26:42] the card. Got that. Name
[26:43] please. I apologize. Laura
[26:47] Harris. I'm sorry. I'm not
[26:52] accustomed public. Speaking.
[26:53] >> And you're doing great. You
[26:54] got it already had a minute.
[26:56] And 47 If you don't mind, I'm
[26:57] just going to read this since
[26:59] going be. Consistently
[27:06] interrupted. My name is Laura
[27:07] Harris. I live in
[27:09] Jacksonville, Florida, in
[27:10] 2022. 1 beautiful Saturday
[27:11] morning. I walked out to my
[27:14] driveway. It was empty. My car
[27:16] was gone. I posted on Facebook
[27:19] looking for my vehicle. I feel
[27:20] for scheme claiming to have
[27:21] the ability to find my car. I
[27:24] paid them for help. Victimized
[27:28] again. When police eventually
[27:31] recovered my vehicle in a week
[27:33] or so. All my belongings were
[27:34] gone in their place were
[27:39] dozens. Of other people's
[27:40] credit cards, purses and
[27:44] wallets. Initially, I didn't
[27:46] understand why I was asked to
[27:47] retrieve my car from the
[27:49] suspect's address or the
[27:50] suspect's residence or why the
[27:52] police have not removed items
[27:54] that obviously did not belong
[27:56] to me. I eventually realized
[27:58] that I was being rolled out in
[28:01] just out as a suspect. I was
[28:03] one victim. There were many
[28:06] others. If Lott cameras had
[28:08] been in place, then that car
[28:09] might have been located faster
[28:12] and some of those people might
[28:14] have been spared. The theft
[28:15] and the months of cleanup that
[28:19] followed. I understand the
[28:20] privacy concerns were already
[28:27] tracked on our phones. We're
[28:27] already tracked on our phones.
[28:29] Our computers are streaming
[28:30] accounts. These cameras
[28:33] photograph was 2 That's 2
[28:36] minutes. Could I ask
[28:37] >> afraid we have a very I got
[28:40] a large stack we created 2
[28:42] minutes I would just like to
[28:44] add it cost me well over
[28:46] $5,000 understood. I met him
[28:47] my head. Please come up next
[28:48] up at U.S. And Patrick, after
[28:51] met.
[28:52] >> Learning about him and
[28:55] addresses on file. Obviously
[28:58] everyone has most of us are
[28:59] many of us in and victims of
[29:00] crimes. That's not the point.
[29:02] Question here this use of
[29:08] flock. Use of flock cameras.
[29:09] Other a apl, ours or any
[29:10] others devices have been
[29:12] around for many years or
[29:14] direct violation of her 4th
[29:15] Amendment rights. Harris, U.S.
[29:17] Supreme Court. U.S. First,
[29:20] Jones, 5, 6, 5, U.S. 400. That
[29:21] just court reversed. The
[29:22] concluding that admission of
[29:23] evidence obtained by
[29:24] warrantless use of gps device
[29:25] violated the 4th Amendment
[29:28] rights of this is pervasive.
[29:28] Warrantless search of
[29:33] citizens. Carpenter verse U.S.
[29:34] 5, 8, 5, us 2, 9, 6, the U.S.
[29:35] Supreme Court again reversed
[29:36] holding that the acquisition
[29:40] of Partners, cell site records
[29:40] was a 4th Amendment search. So
[29:45] the 3rd party. Basis does not
[29:45] hold here either. So another
[29:46] fox Wing, it are the states
[29:51] it. If the states holding this
[29:52] information, then it's public
[29:53] record. People can access it
[29:54] for themselves if they
[29:55] destroyed and 7 days than they
[29:57] are in violation of protecting
[30:01] state records. Right? Also,
[30:05] Florida has a anti stalking
[30:05] statute. It's 74 died. 0, 4,
[30:08] 8, Which makes it a crime for
[30:09] any person. This is a put
[30:13] more. Your office to willfully
[30:14] and repeatedly follow another
[30:23] person. If you see a present
[30:28] their absent. Hello, do you
[30:29] see a person All right. Thank
[30:36] you, Corey. Go ahead. Ask him.
[30:38] >> Good morning. My name is
[30:39] Allison Patrick. Addison
[30:39] Liberty. Patrick, in my
[30:42] addresses on file. And I'm
[30:43] sure there's going to be a lot
[30:45] more people who are going to
[30:45] talk about the violation of
[30:48] her 4th Amendment rights. So I
[30:50] will leave that alone for now.
[30:54] >> I do want to say. Something
[30:55] that I don't believe. I've
[30:56] heard anybody say this
[30:57] morning. Somebody did mention
[30:59] what happens to the data if
[31:01] lock or any other companies
[31:01] like Accenture, whoever
[31:02] purchases these like, where's
[31:05] that day to go? How long do
[31:10] they have access to the data?
[31:11] Right now? I believe some of
[31:16] it is in the aws Cloud. I
[31:18] think that's an issue. I think
[31:18] this could be a national
[31:19] security issue. I think this
[31:21] is a bad, bad, bad thing all
[31:22] around.
[31:24] >> We have people from all
[31:25] political.
[31:26] >> Parties represented who are
[31:27] speaking against this for, you
[31:28] know, for some reason or
[31:32] another. And it's we have to
[31:33] we have to pay attention to to
[31:42] all of this jso. Town hall
[31:43] meeting that they have for
[31:44] district 6 now is that they
[31:46] mention that there and 9 month
[31:48] backlog of just responding to
[31:49] body cam requests because of
[31:50] all the things that have to be
[31:54] redacted. So if we have flock
[31:55] cameras and jso has any
[31:56] control over those and they
[31:57] have to redact public
[31:59] information that sensitive.
[32:00] How long would it take us to
[32:01] even find out what they even
[32:03] have going on there for
[32:04] records? Requests of its were
[32:05] already in almost a year of
[32:07] the backlog. They also have
[32:09] drones. I think this is a
[32:09] slippery slippery s#
[32:09] #
[32:09] #
[32:09] #
[32:10] . We've
[32:13] got all the cameras
[32:13] everywhere. They're all
[32:15] talking to. Each other are
[32:16] being tracked. And now we've
[32:19] got the drones. So if you're
[32:20] not aware, go, look those up
[32:22] jso has deploying those in
[32:26] certain situations. So I
[32:28] support canceling the full
[32:29] contracts, getting rid of them
[32:30] and anything else that we have
[32:32] in that sphere. And if not, I
[32:33] support the temporary
[32:36] moratorium so we can just get
[32:37] rid of them now. Thank you so
[32:40] much. Thanks, Patrick.
[32:41] Jennifer Dean.
[32:41] >> Followed by Rachel Read
[32:45] about Herb about. My my
[32:46] thoughts. Jennifer Dean, I'm
[32:51] sorry. Jennifer. 2 minutes,
[32:54] Rachel, you're next.
[32:54] >> I good morning. My name is
[32:56] Jennifer Dean. Patterson,
[32:59] record. I want to make thing
[32:59] one thing very clear. I am not
[33:01] against security and I'm not
[33:04] against technology. I support
[33:05] technology that helps law
[33:06] enforcement protect
[33:07] communities and improve
[33:08] emergency response. But the
[33:09] security and surveillance or
[33:12] not the same thing. Security
[33:14] protects people surveillance
[33:17] monitors people. And when
[33:19] technology contract core
[33:20] collect store information
[33:23] about ordinary citizens. We
[33:25] need to safeguards before that
[33:25] technology expands. Technology
[33:27] is moving faster than many of
[33:30] our laws and policies. We do
[33:32] not know exactly what these
[33:33] systems MAY be capable of 5 or
[33:35] 10 years from now. How
[33:38] databases MAY connect, how
[33:40] artificial intelligence MAY
[33:41] analyze the information around
[33:42] information can be used
[33:44] tomorrow. That is why the
[33:46] public deserves answers. Now
[33:49] who owns this technology who
[33:51] controls it, who has access to
[33:54] it? Why is the information
[33:54] being collected? How long has
[33:59] it stored? How how are audits
[34:01] used? What happens if it's
[34:03] abused? That should be clear
[34:04] limits. There should be
[34:07] Clinton clear in its limits.
[34:10] >> Oversight, transparency,
[34:12] accountability and meaningful
[34:12] public input before
[34:15] surveillance technology. Is
[34:18] installed, expanded or
[34:20] renewed. We should be also
[34:21] asked whether the technology
[34:22] is actually solving the
[34:25] problem. Not every public
[34:27] safety problem requires
[34:29] another camera, sometimes
[34:32] better lighting staffing,
[34:33] communication. Emergency
[34:34] response are less intrusive.
[34:36] Technology MAY be a better
[34:38] situation. The question should
[34:40] always be what actually makes
[34:42] people safer while creating
[34:43] the least unnecessary
[34:44] intrusion of their lives. I
[34:46] support law enforcement. I
[34:49] support fighting crime. I
[34:52] support innovation. But I also
[34:53] support privacy, civil
[34:54] liberties and reasonable
[34:57] government. There are things
[34:59] there are things that are not
[34:59] mutually exclusive to make
[35:02] public safety matters.
[35:02] >> Thank you. Thank you very
[35:04] much, Rachel. About and then
[35:12] Marshall Branick. It been.
[35:14] >> Thank you. My name Rachel.
[35:16] Be about address is on file.
[35:19] Thank you for the opportunity
[35:21] to speak. This is my first
[35:22] time ever speaking at a public
[35:30] meeting. Excuse me, I'm sorry.
[35:32] You're going start time for
[35:33] meant.
[35:37] >> You are. Brought.
[35:38] >> I stopped. Told my son that
[35:40] was coming this morning. And I
[35:41] would just like to say them
[35:42] that I'm speaking his behalf.
[35:43] He's been taking civics class
[35:47] in public school. And I told
[35:50] him that it's citizens
[35:52] responsibility. So if I don't
[35:53] come to a public meeting and
[35:55] speak I know that he can. And
[36:00] so on. I do want to just
[36:02] mention that state
[36:03] Representative Black said that
[36:03] we want to remain a free
[36:08] people. It's important and to
[36:09] keep our freedom for security,
[36:12] security and safety in the
[36:16] spirit of our 250 th-birthday.
[36:18] I just would like to read that
[36:19] Thomas Jefferson said and 17,
[36:22] 74 that a free people claim
[36:23] their rights as arrived from
[36:26] the laws of nature and not as
[36:29] the gift of their chief
[36:32] magistrate. It seems that
[36:33] there's an emphasis government
[36:34] rights, municipal jurisdiction
[36:39] to install this equipment
[36:41] recently on Columbus, Ohio
[36:43] town meeting doctor via trend
[36:45] who has a Ph d in crime,
[36:49] surveillance and policing and
[36:51] at Ohio State University said
[36:52] on the record that he believes
[36:56] in his professional opinion,
[36:58] that flock cameras is
[36:59] basically investigating.
[37:00] Everyone is under
[37:03] investigation at all times.
[37:04] And he acquitted Kay did that
[37:04] to prescribe them. Sure.
[37:07] Everyone in this room. A
[37:08] certain movie comes to mind
[37:13] when you think of that so it
[37:15] goes beyond protecting 4th
[37:16] Amendment rights to be secure
[37:17] in our personal property and
[37:21] in our effects. It's been
[37:22] Thank you. Thank you. Marshall
[37:24] Branick.
[37:30] >> Followed by Latasha hubs.
[37:32] >> Good morning. Marshall
[37:34] Anderson File Council includes
[37:34] a first thank you for holding
[37:35] this meeting in taking the
[37:36] time to hear us out. And thank
[37:37] you for your service in the
[37:38] Navy. That's going to be
[37:41] important. Second. For
[37:41] context, I just retired from
[37:44] the Navy last month after 20
[37:45] years, I spent that time
[37:47] aboard the u Geena before left
[37:48] Jacksonville and I we actually
[37:50] MAY have been stationed Jack
[37:51] or a Norfolk around the same
[37:55] time there's somewhere along
[37:55] the way. I also developed a
[37:58] strong interest in technology
[38:00] and data couldn't code called
[38:01] my way out paperback. But I
[38:02] spend enough time working with
[38:04] dad and I can understand how
[38:06] seemingly significant pieces
[38:10] information can be aggregated.
[38:11] And what that bring forth. So
[38:14] I'm not here simply because
[38:16] constitutional Burr order
[38:16] repeats some argument that
[38:18] you've probably already heard.
[38:19] I want to look at this risk
[38:19] created by collecting and
[38:21] retaining this data from a
[38:23] different for I'm sorry from a
[38:24] few different angles that I
[38:25] don't think I've received
[38:27] enough attention and public
[38:28] conversation maybe in private,
[38:29] but I'm going to say it out
[38:32] loud, atf. He training
[38:33] otherwise known as
[38:34] Anti-Terrorism Force
[38:35] Protection teaches us to
[38:36] recognize patterns and protect
[38:39] information routines.
[38:42] Routines, minimize or digital
[38:44] footprints and avoid
[38:45] unnecessarily. Revealing.
[38:46] >> Where we live, where we
[38:46] work. When we arrive, what our
[38:49] daily patterns look like.
[38:50] >> We do that because he's
[38:52] individually harmless pieces
[38:52] of information can become
[38:53] valuable intelligence when
[38:58] aggregated. We were literally
[38:59] stuck, told to stop using fit
[38:59] bits well on base because they
[39:02] map out our movements. Now, I
[39:03] understand that all these
[39:05] items mention aren't collected
[39:07] by flock and that a single
[39:08] picture of a license plate on
[39:10] the road is not particularly
[39:11] revealing, but thousands of
[39:14] them paint a different story.
[39:15] And the Supreme Court just
[39:17] ruled on recently with the
[39:19] Carter case. Now play that
[39:20] concern here in Jacksonville.
[39:22] We have an enormous military
[39:24] presence. If a foreign
[39:25] adversary associates, a person
[39:27] of interest with the vehicle
[39:29] and license plate access to
[39:30] retain lpr data or active
[39:31] feeds could turn into ordinary
[39:32] traffic. And answer
[39:35] observations. And, you know,
[39:35] understand. I appreciate and
[39:36] thank you for your service.
[39:37] Congrats in retirement. That
[39:40] option. After she's going Chad
[39:46] Charland. I get absentee and
[39:50] Latasha hops my address file.
[39:51] >> I want to take a minute a
[39:52] moment to speak about the
[39:53] importance of flock cameras in
[39:56] Jacksonville. As a mother of a
[39:56] murdered child. My son,
[40:00] Maurice Hobbs. As a mother of
[40:01] a murdered child fighting for
[40:05] justice for my son. Maurice, I
[40:07] understand firsthand how
[40:08] critical evidence can be when
[40:10] the family searching for
[40:12] answers. According to the
[40:13] Jacksonville Sheriff's Office,
[40:14] as I stated at the last agenda
[40:18] meeting at City Hall. And the
[40:19] license plate reader cameras
[40:24] have helped saw 15 murders. 17
[40:25] kidnappings, 6 forcible sex
[40:31] offenses. Nearly 100 shootings
[40:33] and 172 missing person cases
[40:35] since 2024, those are not just
[40:40] numbers. They represent
[40:40] families who need answers.
[40:42] Victims who needed justice and
[40:46] lives that were saved. I fully
[40:47] support the continued use of
[40:49] flock cameras because I
[40:51] believe public safety and
[40:54] accountability matter. I'm
[40:55] advocating to keep it locked
[40:56] cameras in use because I know
[40:57] what it feels like when the
[40:57] families left searching for
[40:59] Justice. I will continue
[41:02] fighting for Murray's. I will
[41:02] continue fighting for other
[41:04] families who deserve answers
[41:07] when violence into their
[41:08] lives. If technology can help
[41:09] law enforcement identify
[41:13] suspects. Violent criminals,
[41:15] murderers locate missing
[41:17] people, recover evidence and
[41:18] bring justice to families. And
[41:19] I believe we should continue
[41:21] investing in it while also
[41:23] ensuring appropriate
[41:25] safeguards and accountability.
[41:27] My son was robbed of his life.
[41:30] I was robbed of my son. My
[41:30] children robbed of their
[41:33] brother. I'll be d#
[41:33] #
[41:33] #
[41:33] #
[41:34] #
[41:34] if I
[41:36] let anyone Rodney of his
[41:38] justice and justice for other
[41:39] families. Please keep up. The
[41:42] flock cameras. Thank you for
[41:45] your time. Go to action.
[41:46] >> Chad Charles and followed
[41:51] by Albert Stern. My name is
[41:52] Chad Charles and I live at 3,
[41:54] 0, 4, 6, be First Avenue in
[41:55] Fernandina Beach.
[41:56] >> And I am running for state
[41:59] House in District 15, which
[42:00] include cannot you cannot
[42:01] campaigners or not. This is
[42:02] part of even that isn't
[42:04] Haitian government district
[42:05] includes parts of northern and
[42:06] northwestern Duval County and
[42:08] want to drive from my home in
[42:09] Fernandina through Nassau and
[42:11] into Duval is I routinely do I
[42:12] am under constant surveillance
[42:13] from a network of flock
[42:14] cameras installed by local
[42:15] police and sheriff's
[42:17] department. I am treated like
[42:19] a suspect. The mass
[42:19] surveillance is unwarranted
[42:21] and performed without any
[42:22] reasonable suspicion. It is
[42:23] only a matter of time before
[42:24] this technology is turned on
[42:26] people like meat and I say
[42:27] people like meeting people in
[42:29] the political minority. I am
[42:31] non party affiliated, but I
[42:31] oppose big tech and flock
[42:33] cameras and data centers. I
[42:35] support and Florida law
[42:37] enforcement to 87 agreements
[42:38] with ice. And for doing all of
[42:40] this, I'm considered an enemy
[42:41] of the state as spelled out in
[42:42] a presidential executive
[42:44] order. I subject myself to
[42:45] additional tracking and
[42:45] targeting by speaking out at
[42:48] meetings like this, giving my
[42:51] home address to the very
[42:51] companies with a technology
[42:52] capable of tracking my every
[42:54] move. I'm an honest, I'm also
[42:55] an environmentalist and it has
[42:57] been proven that the state of
[42:59] Florida through the Fish and
[43:00] Wildlife Commission has been
[43:00] using privilege. Law
[43:01] enforcement tracking data and
[43:04] tools to illegally and without
[43:04] cause investigate.
[43:05] Environmentalist in the state.
[43:07] I'm a target. The people in
[43:10] this room are targets. These
[43:12] cameras make it easier for big
[43:12] tech in law enforcement and
[43:14] corporations to target track,
[43:15] harass us GOD knows what else
[43:18] in the future. The first
[43:19] responsibility of government
[43:20] is to protect the people. You
[43:22] can protect the people by
[43:22] removing these mass
[43:23] surveillance cameras. Thank
[43:27] you. Albert Stern followed by
[43:34] Dragon late. Name is Albert
[43:39] Stern. My address is on file.
[43:40] >> Having this meeting, thank
[43:40] you for looking at the
[43:44] moratorium. Please do There's
[43:45] a lot of concerns and I am
[43:47] deeply concerned about the men
[43:48] surveillance tape
[43:48] specifically. I want to speak
[43:53] about the flock camera company
[43:53] specifically. This company has
[43:54] created a system that has been
[43:57] abuse throughout the country.
[43:59] Even here in the state of
[44:00] Florida where people are using
[44:01] it inappropriately to stalk
[44:08] people. It is clear that that
[44:09] company he's not a serious
[44:10] security company. You wouldn't
[44:13] make something like that.
[44:14] Their ceo, its kind on record
[44:14] saying that they've made
[44:18] mistakes. But I ask it is to
[44:21] think about that company. They
[44:22] have been they are funded and
[44:23] their their startup funds
[44:25] comes from places like y
[44:26] Combinator Marc and Resist
[44:28] group. They're a tech company
[44:29] like every other tech company.
[44:30] They're gonna play by those
[44:31] rules. Once you get hooked on
[44:33] the heroine of this, they're
[44:34] going to change the price
[44:38] structure. They're gonna
[44:39] change. But the offer you and
[44:40] then the cameras going to be
[44:41] up there and it's gonna be too
[44:41] expensive. And what you can
[44:42] do, you can take him down
[44:45] thing. The other thing about
[44:46] companies, if they get hacked,
[44:47] every tech company gets
[44:50] hacked. This is a tech
[44:50] company. It's not a security
[44:53] company. Thank you. Very much,
[44:54] Sir. Blight.
[45:04] >> Followed by. Casey Jones.
[45:06] >> Hey, everybody, I'm driving
[45:07] below my addresses on file.
[45:08] And as you know, I've been
[45:08] advocating about this for
[45:11] several months now. So I think
[45:14] it's really interesting that
[45:14] we think that we shouldn't
[45:15] rush into a decision, but they
[45:18] showed up overnight dishes,
[45:19] the people installing them. By
[45:20] the way, I've seen dish a
[45:22] go-around, installing them,
[45:24] they are installed without
[45:25] breakway plates at the bottom,
[45:26] which means if a car hits
[45:28] them, that metal doesn't move.
[45:28] And that person in the car
[45:31] gets very hurt. It's also
[45:32] really interesting that we
[45:33] think uk waters will hold off
[45:36] Tuesday accountable. Charles
[45:37] Matter, William McNeil Junior,
[45:38] will Hayden, Asia Bennett have
[45:41] something else to say on that?
[45:43] We have a lot of concerns of
[45:44] people that can't be here. I
[45:46] actually have a list of the
[45:49] concerns that I've put in on
[45:51] file for all the people that
[45:52] couldn't be here because it's
[45:54] 10:30am. I understand we have
[45:55] to do it sometime, right. But
[45:56] a lot of people are working
[45:57] right now into the working
[45:58] people that are being tracked
[46:02] every day. Usually couldn't
[46:04] come here. Also, if you're
[46:06] other counties are doing.
[46:06] Pasco County has just canceled
[46:08] its entire flock contract even
[46:10] after the purchase of several
[46:12] flock drones and the
[46:13] replacement contract with
[46:14] Axon. It is not just flock is
[46:17] also acts on is also Motorola.
[46:18] Again, these are tech
[46:18] companies, not security
[46:20] companies, and they are not
[46:22] secure. Ben Jordan is a guy on
[46:24] YouTube, right? He's not
[46:26] exactly a huge ways, but he's
[46:27] able to hack into these
[46:28] cameras within about 15
[46:32] seconds. I don't want to know
[46:34] what people that do this as
[46:35] their job and as the way they
[46:38] make money illicitly or
[46:40] otherwise can do with that
[46:41] camera, that data and that
[46:44] database. I am very concerned
[46:46] about the safety and security
[46:46] of Jacksonville. I am very
[46:49] concerned about the fact I
[46:49] have within a mile of my
[46:54] house. Literally more than 20.
[46:57] I they are pointed at
[46:58] children's homes. They're
[47:00] pointed apartment complexes.
[47:03] They are pointed at public
[47:04] pools. These should not be
[47:05] used for this purpose. And I
[47:10] don't think we can. Casey
[47:14] Jones followed by it Gonzalez.
[47:19] >> I don't. Casey 7 to 5.
[47:21] First re South Jacks Beach.
[47:24] All the trust that we the
[47:28] people have. They're all lost
[47:32] every bit. We're being
[47:32] tracked.
[47:35] >> I mean, is this is super
[47:35] scary.
[47:37] >> So we the people that want
[47:39] them gone. We don't want to
[47:40] restricted. We don't want to
[47:41] if you can't do what you're
[47:42] supposed to do and what is
[47:47] that? What are you supposed to
[47:47] You go to you that the cops
[47:51] want to do what? They want to
[47:52] look at. They want to track
[47:52] you. They want to see gps.
[47:54] Want to see your Google,
[47:55] whatever. That's what they got
[47:57] to do. It. Everybody knows
[47:59] what they got to do. So so let
[48:03] me ask you a question. How is
[48:04] the government dancing all
[48:09] over the 4th Amendment? Does
[48:10] anybody know that they're
[48:11] they're dancing on the
[48:12] Constitution because they're
[48:17] using a 3rd party. That's what
[48:18] they're doing. And nobody at
[48:19] of all the people to speak.
[48:21] And I appreciate everybody
[48:22] speaks, but nobody's vote of
[48:24] the Constitution in the 4th
[48:27] Amendment. This is what it's
[48:30] all about. They're dancing on
[48:31] the Constitution and the 4th
[48:31] Amendment because they're
[48:35] using a 3rd party. So let let
[48:36] me let me there was the clock
[48:43] at. 30 yeah minute. 26. So let
[48:45] let me quote our great
[48:46] governor state of Florida. And
[48:47] I know there's people on both
[48:49] sides. There's people on both
[48:53] sides that are against it. Not
[48:54] eliminating But let me let me
[48:56] quote our great governor. I
[48:59] think.
[49:00] >> These and these mean.
[49:04] >> The lpr. The license tag
[49:06] reader. He just got Cody
[49:08] yesterday. I think these
[49:09] licensed Hagley Road are out
[49:13] of control. That's what he The
[49:15] videos up on my Facebook page.
[49:16] So that's to answer. They are
[49:20] out of control.
[49:21] >> It here, Gonzalez followed
[49:30] by Robert Jeffers.
[49:32] >> Good Morning. Council
[49:32] members MAY need to hear
[49:33] Gonzalez. I'm a graduate
[49:33] public student at the
[49:37] University of North Florida.
[49:40] I'm here to talk about
[49:40] cameras. So the recently has
[49:43] said that we should compromise
[49:44] or privacy just so we can
[49:45] operate these cameras. I think
[49:47] that is a crazy statement to
[49:49] say, I says a student. I want
[49:52] to talk about how. We
[49:53] shouldn't compromise our
[49:57] privacy just so we can solve
[49:58] murders and kidnappings. Know
[49:59] I do have empathy and
[50:00] sympathize with you that your
[50:01] son was murdered. I'm so sorry
[50:04] that happened to you. But i
[50:04] think you know, so we should
[50:07] get to the bottom. The roots
[50:08] of this problem of why Jackson
[50:10] has so much crime lie. We have
[50:12] so much King inflated
[50:14] activity, I think instead of
[50:15] installing more rising our
[50:17] privacy. We should instead get
[50:21] to the root problem. And have
[50:23] more prevent violence
[50:25] prevention programs and we
[50:27] shouldn't have that money and
[50:29] serve spending flock cameras.
[50:32] We should spend that money
[50:32] more and after-school
[50:33] programs, things to prevent
[50:34] violence, having community
[50:34] members going to the
[50:37] community. And just spend it
[50:40] more where the money should be
[50:42] spent. I think having flock
[50:43] cameras as a waste of taxpayer
[50:45] money, we could use it to
[50:48] solve the homelessness v every
[50:49] I worked myself, I every time
[50:50] I go to class, I see a
[50:54] homeless person and it's just
[50:56] it's not cool to have that
[50:57] many as big as big as
[50:58] Jacksonville is. We should
[51:00] have this many homeless
[51:01] people. I also volunteered at
[51:03] a food pantry recently and so
[51:07] many people have to go and get
[51:10] So I think we can also try to
[51:16] lower grocery prices. But
[51:17] Robert Jeffers followed by
[51:23] Andrew Scott.
[51:24] >> Good Morning Council. Thank
[51:24] you for what you get is
[51:25] meeting. My name is Robert
[51:28] addresses on file. This MAY be
[51:29] the reference to some people
[51:30] but many people have gotten up
[51:31] here and talk about what to
[51:33] say. I can do, right.
[51:34] Hollywood has given us the
[51:37] script. We know what can do.
[51:38] When it when it is not put to
[51:42] good use. Hollywood is gave us
[51:44] a script. What can happen
[51:45] right? And we all know that it
[51:46] might be funny to some people,
[51:49] but it's not. I haven't taken
[51:50] a stance for dance because I
[51:51] think there's some very good
[51:52] things that can come out of
[51:53] flock cameras. I think that
[51:54] there's very good things come
[51:56] of. And I do believe in that.
[51:56] But then whenever it is used
[51:59] in a negative light. Problems
[52:00] can occur right in the privacy
[52:02] of our citizens are at risk
[52:03] and it can potentially harm us
[52:07] as a society. My problem is,
[52:08] is it this is a reaction. All
[52:10] right. This meeting is a
[52:11] reaction. There's thousands of
[52:13] flock cameras or the state of
[52:15] Florida right? Where was the
[52:15] protections at the beginning
[52:16] when this stuff started coming
[52:18] out to say, hey, we don't want
[52:19] that, that our state
[52:20] government not come together
[52:23] and say, hey. He's going to
[52:24] start. He's sort of stalling
[52:25] this and what protections are
[52:27] going to put before we start
[52:28] mass installing these all the
[52:31] way across our state. This is
[52:32] a very reactive instead
[52:34] instead of a proactive staying
[52:35] right. So now it's here. Now
[52:36] we have to deal with it. So
[52:37] now we're trying to figure out
[52:38] how to deal with it.
[52:39] >> So from here on out, I just
[52:40] want a statement. Let's be
[52:41] proactive. Jacksonville. I'm
[52:43] tired of being aggressive.
[52:44] Okay. We start thinking about
[52:46] things in the past and and how
[52:47] and how we want to move
[52:48] forward. But we can't we can't
[52:51] move forward if we're being
[52:53] reactive, we need to be
[52:54] progressive and be on the
[52:55] forefront of this. This this
[52:57] this this is a terrible it's
[52:58] great. We're looking at this
[53:01] and put a moratorium in place.
[53:04] Believe, but we need to be
[53:04] progressive and this and not
[53:07] reactive. Thank you. And under
[53:08] Scott followed by Deo
[53:21] Cummings.
[53:22] >> Good Morning. My name is
[53:22] Andrew Scott. Why addresses on
[53:27] file? I've been software
[53:28] developer manager for 15
[53:29] years, worked in computer
[53:34] vision machine learning. So on
[53:35] a little bit familiar with
[53:38] this and like this is how you
[53:39] could please surveillance
[53:40] tape. This is basically a
[53:45] package deal. This is the data
[53:47] set that anyone who wanted to.
[53:52] Abuse would dream of. It is.
[53:54] All the state is on aws.
[53:55] Jack's MAY own it, but they
[54:01] will not control it. And I
[54:03] found online search saying
[54:04] that basically jso is extended
[54:05] their digger attention for a
[54:11] year. A year's worth of data.
[54:12] Flock since they're coming
[54:15] under fire is actually going
[54:15] back and recommended 7 days as
[54:17] a recommendation. Think about
[54:19] what you could do with
[54:26] everyone's traffic data.
[54:26] Correlating that with any
[54:40] other data set would. Crazy?
[54:41] So yeah, and I didn't even
[54:42] know before that that they had
[54:45] been given access to Dave The
[54:46] in the information. So that's
[54:50] another data set. But I just
[54:52] I'm really concerned about
[54:53] this because their tech
[54:54] company, all the protections
[54:55] in place, it can still be
[54:56] hacked. It will be hacked. It
[54:59] will be abused. And the data
[55:06] there. And we have no say it.
[55:07] Deal. Cummings followed by
[55:18] John Uni.
[55:19] >> And we do have to cut off
[55:20] more. This is last week on a
[55:21] card that hey, we gotta we
[55:22] gotta kind of go through
[55:23] public comment that I got a
[55:24] few more comments. I'm gonna
[55:26] make me have to adjourn. Go
[55:26] ahead, sir. Give 2 minutes.
[55:27] All right. Good morning. My
[55:27] name is Dale Cummings
[55:30] addresses on file. So I think
[55:32] there are 2 questions that
[55:32] have not yet been answered at
[55:35] a very critical that's number
[55:36] one.
[55:38] >> What is the actual efficacy
[55:40] in solving cases, crimes,
[55:41] etcetera. Number 2, how
[55:43] necessary our these devices in
[55:44] doing so. So there's not a lot
[55:48] of data out there. And earlier
[55:49] this month, jso posted on x
[55:52] and presumably elsewhere,
[55:56] number of cases of summer
[55:56] criminals somewhere people
[55:59] missing so on and so forth of
[56:00] cases that were solved through
[56:02] the use of help ERs.
[56:02] Interesting, but doesn't tell
[56:04] me a whole lot. So I did a
[56:08] little digging. Turns out in
[56:11] 2024, in MAY, they actually
[56:14] posted jso. Likewise on x and
[56:15] other social media of a
[56:16] particular case of a shooting
[56:20] in the Hogan Creek area where
[56:22] there ended up being no, no
[56:23] fatalities, no injuries. But
[56:24] there was a bullet that into a
[56:27] school bus full of children.
[56:29] They credited these devices in
[56:31] solving the case. And I think
[56:32] the problem comes with the
[56:35] word solved. So I did a little
[56:37] more digging and I went to
[56:38] that Duval clerk and I started
[56:39] digging up because they posted
[56:41] the names and I read the
[56:43] charging document as it turns
[56:45] out all of the information
[56:47] that they would have needed to
[56:49] arrest the 2 individuals that
[56:52] they did came from witnesses.
[56:54] Witnesses said this person did
[56:55] it. This person did it. This
[56:56] is what they were wearing.
[56:57] This is the vehicle they got
[56:58] in. This is a location that
[56:59] they went to the cameras.
[57:02] We're just supplemental. Well,
[57:05] there's more to that story
[57:06] because I did a little more
[57:09] digging and it turns out the 2
[57:09] individuals at the time one
[57:12] was 23. When was 17, the 17
[57:13] year-old unfortunately passed
[57:17] away earlier this year.
[57:18] Circumstances are unknown, but
[57:19] I can only presume if you're
[57:20] involved in a shootout when
[57:21] you're 17, that doesn't leave
[57:24] you a very long life. The
[57:25] other individual had their
[57:27] charges dropped 2 minutes,
[57:30] sir. Yes, thank you so much,
[57:31] Jon. Uni followed by. Sean
[57:37] Costello. Not seeing John. Any
[57:38] is John Costello in audience
[57:44] for the room. Hello. My name
[57:45] is Sean Costello. Mattresses
[57:47] on file. I think some of the
[57:47] previous speakers are you
[57:49] cover this? But just to
[57:50] reiterate, there's a flaw
[57:53] camera pointed at a community
[57:55] pool as a premier apartments.
[57:57] And I notice that during this,
[57:59] you know, meeting today and
[58:03] also all of flocks official
[58:03] information they're referred
[58:06] to as license plate readers.
[58:06] So it seems little bit like a
[58:07] reflect to me that we're
[58:08] calling them license plate
[58:09] readers by some of that work
[58:10] point. It in a spot where they
[58:13] would not be reading any
[58:14] license plates. And one of the
[58:15] speaker also mention that it's
[58:18] important that we understand
[58:18] how these cameras are being
[58:20] used, but also I think it
[58:21] support understand what
[58:24] they're capable of and again,
[58:25] like previous speakers have
[58:26] mentioned with ai. With a
[58:29] capable of today MAY be
[58:31] different. What the people of
[58:31] tomorrow. So it's probably
[58:37] quite a difficult task to.
[58:38] Clear what they're capable I
[58:39] think it's really important
[58:44] for the council. Thank you.
[58:46] Thank you, Nick Harding
[58:49] followed by Zeri Davis. On out
[58:53] there and overflow court.
[58:54] Number. You're at 11 30, I'll
[58:57] able to extend it You know,
[58:58] you know, you are noticed Hill
[59:00] 30 I apologize that can we
[59:00] can. We can only public
[59:03] comment and then. And that
[59:05] means you are outside of
[59:09] public notice. Let's all stick
[59:10] around. We are going to we're
[59:11] going to during this meeting
[59:12] will stick around and
[59:14] >> talk to anyone that has any
[59:15] more comments. We had a number
[59:18] of comment cards left. I want
[59:19] to thank my colleagues for
[59:21] being here today. This is
[59:22] incredibly important. I do
[59:24] intend to continue to move
[59:24] forward. I'm very concerned
[59:25] about these devices, but I do
[59:28] want to make sure that jso is
[59:29] a major role to play in making
[59:31] sure that they're able to to.
[59:32] Continue solve crimes. But
[59:34] there is a there's a line to
[59:37] beat walked when it comes to
[59:39] personal security. Personal
[59:42] privacy and law enforcement.
[59:43] So there'll be more to come in
[59:44] this conversation. I'm here to
[59:49] stick around that. Thanks. If
[59:51] you did not get a chance to
[59:52] speak, you can't know you can
[59:53] email me directly j Peluso Pl
[59:55] It's date on that.
[59:58] >> Those comments are you can
[59:59] also get one of my cards of
[59:59] thank yous meeting's
[1:00:14] adjourned.