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Thank you very much.

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get a chair.

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thank you.

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thank you.

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thank you.

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thank you.

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thank you.

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bring this meeting to order and we will start

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I'd like to invite elder jeff anderson
of christ community church to lead the

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invocation.

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heavenly father, we praise you god and give you thanks for all of your mighty works.

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you are loving, good, and gracious.

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thank you for creating us and sustaining us day by day.

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thank you for making us in your image to exist in community with other people.

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father, you have created us to love you
with our whole hearts and to love our

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neighbors as ourselves.

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we often fall short of these commandments.

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we have sinned and fall short of your glory.

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we acknowledge that there is a severe cost for us turning our backs on you.

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yet you've demonstrated your love for us
and that while we were still sinners, christ

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died for us.

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it is by your grace we have a path to both
forgiveness and salvation through faith in

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jesus.

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you have said that you stand at the door
and knock, and if anyone hears your voice

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and opens the door,

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you will come in.

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all who receive jesus and believe in his
name have the right to become children of

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god.

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we thank you for our city.

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from lewis moulton's sheep and cattle ranch
over 150 years ago, you have blessed this

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community with
incredible progress.

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thank you for our elected officials, the
businesses, the churches, the schools, the

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families,

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and the individuals that make the city the great place that it is.

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we know that in your sovereignty, you have placed these leaders here for this time.

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grant that our city would be known as a
righteous city, a city of peace and hope, a

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city with happy homes,

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a city that welcomes the stranger, a
city that cares for the needy, a city that

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defends the innocent from evil.

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we are here this evening to serve the people of our city.

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we ask for your wisdom for our mayor, our city council members, and all city staff.

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give them clear minds, patient hearts,
and a strong sense of justice as they make

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choices today.

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help them to listen well to one another,
to respect diverse views, and to seek the

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common good for every neighbor.

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grant them peace, unity, and integrity in these discussions.

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we pray for safety for our first responders
and others who provide care to our

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community.

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we thank you for those who both serve
and sacrifice for our city and help our

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neighbors who are in need.

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we pray that you would continue to bless those who serve here

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for our future prosperity.

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all the glory of god is yours.

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in the name of the father, son, and the holy spirit.

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amen.

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amen.

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thank you very much.

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and the pledge will be led by council member pezold.

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please stand.

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place your right hand over your heart and repeat after me.

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I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
united states of america and to the republic

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for which it stands,
one nation under god,

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city clerk who for the roll call city council.

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yes.

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thank you.

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mr mayor let the record show that all members
of council are present in chambers okay

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I'm gonna take the
liberty to move item

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three point here it is three point

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or

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5.3.1 up, having to do with the proposed
update to the city of laguna hills banner

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program.

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we have a special guest, the principal at laguna hills high school,

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and I would like to have him to be able to get in and out as expediently as possible.

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so with that, we will start with director holland.

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thank you.

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good evening, mayor caskey and members of the city council.

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I have a brief introduction to this item
before I would like to introduce our special

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guest.

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on march 24th, 2026, city council approved
a hybrid street pole banner program

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consisting of two permanent banner designs
and three rotating designs that would

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allow the city to incorporate seasonal and community messaging throughout the year.

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since that time, the three new banner designs have been installed throughout the city.

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the civic center banner, the welcome banner, and the special america 250 banner.

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the america 250 banners are scheduled to come down at the end of september.

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at that time, they would be replaced
with a new seasonal banner, while the civic

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center and welcome
banners would remain in place.

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at the beginning of summer, staff was
approached by laguna hills high school about

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incorporating high school banners
into the city's banner program.

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at this time, I would like to introduce
laguna hills high school principal brent

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dohling to share his vision
for the banner program.

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welcome.

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well good evening mayor caskey members
of the city council and those in attendance

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this evening my name
is brent dohling and it is

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truly a blessing to stand before you tonight
as the principal of laguna hills high

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school thank you for
allowing me to speak this

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evening about our banner projects on behalf
of our school and the hawks that have

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soared above the rest for
nearly 50 years at laguna

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hills high school as the principal of our city's only high school,

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I have made it a priority in our school's
strategic plan to strengthen the connection

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between our high school
and our community.

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our message at laguna hills high school is simple.

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one town, one team.

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those words represent more than a slogan.

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it connects our high school with our city.

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because our students don't just attend
laguna hills high school, they represent the

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city of laguna hills.

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every time they compete, perform, volunteer,
achieve, or graduate, they carry the

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name of the city with them.

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our street pole banner project has two main objectives.

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showcase the partnership between the city
and laguna hills high school and celebrate

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our students in programs that
make laguna hills high school special

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we want to highlight our athletes artists
musicians scholars performers and student

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leaders throughout the community they proudly
represent imagine a young person driving

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through laguna hills with their family and
seeing a laguna hills high school student

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on a banner

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maybe they recognize a friend, a neighbor, or someone they aspire to become.

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that creates pride.

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it tells our students, this community sees
you, this community supports you, and this

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community is proud of you.

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the school gets to celebrate the city, the city gets to celebrate its students,

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and together we reinforce the idea that we are truly one town, one team.

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I hope you see this project not simply as a banner program,

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but as an investment in our young people
and in the relationship between our school

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and our city.

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because when our students succeed, our entire community succeeds.

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thank you for your partnership, your support,
and for helping us show the community

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why laguna hills high
school and the city of laguna

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hills what we're all about.

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and as always, go hawks.

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thank you.

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do we have any public comments on this particular item?

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not on this item.

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and do we have any online?

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no.

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okay.

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why don't you stay there for a second because
I'm going to ask if anyone up here has

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questions or want
to discuss the item

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in regards to clarifications.

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anybody here?

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erica, go ahead.

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yes.

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okay.

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first of all, I want to say thank you.

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for being involved with this program.

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I think it's extremely important.

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this is something that I mentioned the first
year that I was on the city council that

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this had to happen.

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however, I was met with a lot of resistance,
which is why it hadn't proceeded until

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now.

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so I'm very excited to see that there is
some program like this that is starting to

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occur.

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now I have a couple of questions, and the first one is

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what is the process?

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is it going to be, for example, you see in
some cities they highlight seniors so that

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the parents can pay.

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and then perhaps the city covers, highlights
athletic groups or an athlete that has

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done exceptional.

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what is the, and how many banners?

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what are we looking at?

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and I guess maybe that's a question for ms.

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gannon.

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thank you.

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I do have a presentation to further take us through this discussion.

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I just wanted to introduce principal doling
so that it made sense where I was leading

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this discussion.

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okay.

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my apologies.

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it's ok.

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but in terms of the selection of the
individuals, specifically the students that we

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chose to highlight,

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it was a collaborative decision that we
got together with our staff to identify the

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specific programs on our
campus that we wanted to be

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able to showcase, understanding that we weren't able to do all programs.

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with the hopes that if this is approved and
it's something that the city appreciated

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and our in our our
school appreciate it as well.

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it was something that we can I have one
question and it's my understanding that there

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will be I mean these
banners will go up for a

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period of time but there will be some kind
of rotating and and you know refreshing of

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things over over time correct I

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yes.

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speaking with holland and also mr.

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wingenroth as well and the gentleman
that makes the banners, we're looking at

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probably a three-year rotation.

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okay.

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very good.

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holland, did you have a continuing presentation to make?

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I do, yes.

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thank you.

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go ahead.

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I'm sorry.

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I have one more question.

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oh, sure.

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actually, oh, you?

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okay.

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dave, go ahead.

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oh, no, I just want to say welcome here.

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and I noticed you have the baseball and softball, I believe it's right.

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I was wondering what everybody remember that
laguna has two state champions, football

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and basketball.

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let me throw one of them in there, too, to celebrate our championship.

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I loved it that they did it the year I was mayor.

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and I get to present them the key to the
city, the first one ever, to laguna hills

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high school.

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well-deserved.

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so we do have a proposed draft of a boys'
and girls' basketball banner, as they had a

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ton of success,
obviously, last year,

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winning a state regional championship as well as a cif southern section championship.

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and, yes, football is on one of the banners as well.

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happens to be our starting quarterback.

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go hawks.

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awesome.

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okay, so we're going to let holland continue with your presentation.

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and if we have any more questions for you, we'll pull you back up here.

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go ahead.

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thank you mayor caskey so as principal
dohling mentioned the concept is to install

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banners immediately surrounding the
high school along alicia parkway paseo

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de valencia and laguna hills drive the
banners would highlight various sports teams

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clubs activities and programs at
the high school while also reinforcing

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the city's support of laguna hills high
school the high school has requested a total

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of 32 banner locations
for the program this would

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still leave banner arms for city messaging in the immediate area

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currently, the city has 136 total banner locations.

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under the existing program, those are
divided among 45 civic center banners, 45

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welcome banners, and
46 seasonal banners.

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allocating 32 of the 136 locations to the
high school would leave 104 banner arms

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available for the city's
other banner designs.

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because adding the high school banners
would require a change to the distribution

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previously approved
by city council,

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staff has developed four options for council's consideration.

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option 1 would be not to implement the
high school banner program and maintain the

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existing framework.

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option 2 would incorporate the 32 high
school banners while maintaining the existing

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45 civic center and
45 welcome banners.

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this would leave 14 locations for seasonal banners.

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option 3 would incorporate the high school
banners and redistribute the remaining

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locations more evenly among
the city's three other banner types.

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option four would incorporate the 32 high
school banners but eliminate the seasonal

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banner program the remaining locations
would be divided evenly between the civic

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center and welcome designs with 52 of each
this would require purchasing a few more

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of the existing banners being
the civic center and the welcomes

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designs the cost to design and print
the 32 laguna hills high school banners is

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approximately $4,145,

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and the estimated cost to install those banners is $4,800.

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that results in an initial estimated cost
of approximately $8,945 for the high school

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portion of the program.

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00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:59,532
the high school student banners are
anticipated to be redesigned and replaced

247
00:15:59,532 --> 00:16:01,000
approximately every three years.

248
00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:06,047
there's also an option to generate revenue
by selling the america 250 banners and the

249
00:16:06,047 --> 00:16:08,000
high school banners
as they are replaced.

250
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:15,000
this table provides a comparison of the estimated first-year costs for each option.

251
00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:18,750
for purposes of this comparison, staff
included the initial startup costs for the

252
00:16:18,750 --> 00:16:20,000
high school banner program,

253
00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:24,000
as well as the costs associated with producing and changing out seasonal banners.

254
00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:29,019
for the seasonal banners, staff assumed
a cost of approximately $100 per banner to

255
00:16:29,019 --> 00:16:30,000
produce each design,

256
00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:34,000
and $150 per banner for removal and installation.

257
00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:38,000
because the seasonal banners are anticipated to rotate three times during the year,

258
00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:42,226
the cost varies significantly depending on
how many seasonal banner locations are

259
00:16:42,226 --> 00:16:44,000
maintained
underneath each option.

260
00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:49,000
staff is seeking city council's recommendation on how to redistribute the banners.

261
00:16:49,000 --> 00:16:50,000
that concludes my presentation.

262
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:52,000
I'm happy to answer any questions.

263
00:16:56,000 --> 00:17:02,528
you're okay, so do we have any further
questions in regards for holland in terms of

264
00:17:02,528 --> 00:17:03,000
these?

265
00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:13,000
alternative plans questions of clarifications okay, we'll start with erica yes,

266
00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:18,868
I'm wondering so did I hear this correctly
that the high school banners would be up

267
00:17:18,868 --> 00:17:20,000
for three years?

268
00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:27,684
that is correct the one-town, one-team
design is not anticipated to change, but the

269
00:17:27,684 --> 00:17:33,000
pictures of the students would
change every three years, those 18.

270
00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:37,000
okay.

271
00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:40,000
so every year the students will change?

272
00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:42,000
every three years.

273
00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:44,000
for students, every three years.

274
00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:46,000
okay.

275
00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:57,678
and will, for the students, will that cost,
is that a cost that the parents can pay

276
00:17:57,678 --> 00:17:58,000
for?

277
00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:03,172
because that's usually something the
parents, for individual students being

278
00:18:03,172 --> 00:18:04,000
highlighted.

279
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:05,000
no.

280
00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:08,000
thank you, council member pezold.

281
00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:13,000
at this point, the city has been planning on paying those fees.

282
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:17,000
okay.

283
00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:19,000
okay.

284
00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:21,000
are we allowed to give our opinion?

285
00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:23,000
this isn't a public hearing.

286
00:18:26,000 --> 00:18:27,000
I don't know that.

287
00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:30,000
are we okay with that?

288
00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:32,000
yeah, I'm just going with that.

289
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:33,000
okay.

290
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:34,000
I just want to make sure.

291
00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:43,000
I support option three, but I don't like every three years, especially for a student.

292
00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:44,000
I think that...

293
00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:48,900
if we're going to honor seniors, I think
it might be something good to have it

294
00:18:48,900 --> 00:18:50,000
refreshed for seniors.

295
00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:56,000
we're getting into a little bit more than just clarifications at this point.

296
00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,000
yes, but I asked if I could provide my opinion.

297
00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:04,000
so I'm wondering if that's something that we can also look into.

298
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:10,329
but I think three years is to have an
individual up for three years might be a little

299
00:19:10,329 --> 00:19:11,000
too long,

300
00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:12,000
especially if you have the seniors

301
00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:14,000
uh...

302
00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:20,000
I know increases the cost and associated
but I I I like the idea of highlighting a

303
00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:23,000
senior when it's the
senior year and keep

304
00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:26,000
it going move on to uh...

305
00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:29,000
councilman uh...

306
00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:30,000
just a question of kind of bothered me uh...

307
00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:35,200
it's a hundred fifty dollars just to change
one banner that is correct at seventy

308
00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:38,000
five dollars to remove the
existing manner and seventy

309
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:42,505
five dollars to replace it with one she's
given the replacement have it all off on

310
00:19:42,505 --> 00:19:43,000
their way

311
00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:48,000
put the new one up on the same time up the puddle.

312
00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:48,000
that is $150.

313
00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:54,000
no, no, I mean that if it's $150 to remove it, I'm sorry, 75 to remove it,

314
00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:55,000
then they come back with a new one.

315
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:56,000
it is all at the same time.

316
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:58,000
they do it all at the same time?

317
00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:00,000
I'm sorry, but $150 is outrageous.

318
00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:03,000
that's outrageous.

319
00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:06,000
I'm in the wrong business, I guess.

320
00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:10,000
I just want to know which one you recommend.

321
00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:19,217
I personally like the idea of redistributing
them all evenly and maintaining the

322
00:20:19,217 --> 00:20:23,000
seasonal banner, which
would be option 3, 35 civic center,

323
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:28,000
34 welcome, 32 for the high school, and then 35 seasonal banners.

324
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:28,000
okay.

325
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:28,000
thank you.

326
00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:30,000
okay.

327
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:33,000
next we'll go to mayor pro tem mathis.

328
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:37,000
can we make questions now?

329
00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:39,000
I'm just on clarifications, questions.

330
00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:44,000
at this point, if you want to move on and make a motion, that's fine.

331
00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:44,000
sure.

332
00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:51,000
I would move to approve option three for the redistribution of the sign program,

333
00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:58,397
including the high school program with that
total first year cost estimated at around

334
00:20:58,397 --> 00:20:59,000
$35,195.

335
00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:03,000
and so I move approval for option three.

336
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:04,000
okay.

337
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:05,000
we have a motion.

338
00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:06,000
I'll second that.

339
00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:07,000
we have a second.

340
00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:07,000
yeah.

341
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:11,000
do we have, and now we're definitely into discussion.

342
00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:12,000
go ahead.

343
00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:14,000
I'd like to make, if we're going to go that direction,

344
00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:21,362
a substitute motion to have the staff work
with the high school on some sort of fee

345
00:21:21,362 --> 00:21:25,000
so that perhaps seniors
with the program,

346
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:31,653
they can have the seniors up annually as
soon as they get, as soon as a senior, they

347
00:21:31,653 --> 00:21:33,000
have the ability,

348
00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:36,000
I guess six months before or something like six months before

349
00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:40,000
the banner goes up, they can purchase that banner.

350
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:43,000
I think we should try some, have ms.

351
00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:49,119
gannon work on some sort of program that
allows seniors to have their banner up for a

352
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:52,000
year and perhaps
have the parents assist

353
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:55,000
with that cost and have her work that out.

354
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:56,000
okay.

355
00:21:57,000 --> 00:21:59,000
so there's a substitute motion.

356
00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:01,000
I understand where you're coming from.

357
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:02,000
is there a second for that?

358
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:09,894
and the first year, we go with the initial
process, what is presented, but then work

359
00:22:09,894 --> 00:22:12,000
something through for seniors.

360
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:16,000
that's it.

361
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:22,000
I'm not sure that we need a substitute motion for that.

362
00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:27,000
this baseline provides the opportunity to build on the program.

363
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:30,000
I don't know that we need to complicate it at this point.

364
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:36,428
if the high school has put together this
program with all of this three-year rotation

365
00:22:36,428 --> 00:22:39,000
in mind and we
want to build on it

366
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:43,435
further, incorporating parents and so forth,
I think we'll leave the high school to

367
00:22:43,435 --> 00:22:46,000
come to us with that
program and let them figure

368
00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:46,000
it out.

369
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:50,000
so I'm not sure that that substitutes the motion...

370
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:59,640
I was going to suggest, well, if, josh, if
you wanted to say something first, but I

371
00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:01,000
have the suggestion.

372
00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:02,000
no, please suggest, yeah.

373
00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:08,000
I was going to suggest that let's pick
one of these which we have a motion and

374
00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:09,000
seconded one.

375
00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:16,000
because I don't personally see this as being something that is forever.

376
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:22,000
I mean, we're going to be working on this and I think your ideas, erica,

377
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:27,683
are great about kids being able to buy
their own banner and maybe move this along,

378
00:23:27,683 --> 00:23:29,000
have it more often.

379
00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:32,000
but you've got to get started somehow.

380
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:39,540
and I don't see any particular reason to
actually have a substitute motion and all

381
00:23:39,540 --> 00:23:40,000
that.

382
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:42,000
if that's the case, I can pull it.

383
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:43,000
but the idea is to give direction

384
00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:49,857
to start the process, to build that, to
build that so that seniors, that it can be

385
00:23:49,857 --> 00:23:51,000
redone annually,

386
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,000
a certain number or whatever ms.

387
00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:56,000
gannon sees fit with that.

388
00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:59,648
I'm sure she can come up with something
with the principal so that we can honor our

389
00:23:59,648 --> 00:24:00,000
seniors.

390
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:04,000
and I see where you're coming from with that.

391
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:07,000
now, there's a lot more seniors than there are banners, I think.

392
00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:14,000
but, you know, the point is, I mean, this is really,

393
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:15,000
a wonderful thing.

394
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:21,724
it makes all the sense in the world to tie
our high school into the city, the whole

395
00:24:21,724 --> 00:24:24,000
pride in our
community, our town,

396
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:26,000
one team, one town.

397
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:28,000
it's just amazing.

398
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:34,384
so where we take it from, no matter what
we decide, from there I can just see we're

399
00:24:34,384 --> 00:24:37,000
just potentially
off to the races.

400
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:43,000
and so I don't see it as something that we're just one and done and that's it.

401
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:45,000
dave did you have a comment?

402
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:47,000
just a question.

403
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:52,035
I guess I'm trying to figure out here the
so we have a one-time cost to begin with

404
00:24:52,035 --> 00:24:54,000
the best roughly 35,000 it looks

405
00:24:54,000 --> 00:25:00,790
like you're then your annual maintenance
cost is the 10 5 plus the 15 7 so you know

406
00:25:00,790 --> 00:25:03,000
2026 is that roughly right?

407
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:09,000
for option three okay, so maintenance one time 35 maintenance 26 is that

408
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:14,627
are we going to have another initial
cost maybe every four years to refresh or

409
00:25:14,627 --> 00:25:15,000
reprint?

410
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:20,000
or how long will that maintenance process go on without another startup cost?

411
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:21,000
thank you for the question.

412
00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:25,000
it really depends on how much wear and tear those banners get.

413
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:32,047
hopefully, if we can keep the, I believe
it's 14 or 12 high school banners that are

414
00:25:32,047 --> 00:25:34,000
the one town, one team,

415
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:40,189
and keep those looking good for a long time,
we won't have to do the initial startup

416
00:25:40,189 --> 00:25:41,000
cost again.

417
00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:45,000
however, if we choose to redesign those banners or have a different look for those,

418
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:49,000
there would be the additional startup cost for those banners.

419
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:50,000
how long do you expect them to last?

420
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:51,000
about three years.

421
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:52,000
three to five years.

422
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:53,000
okay.

423
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:53,000
all right.

424
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:54,000
thank you.

425
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:58,000
now that we have the wind flaps in them, they've been holding up pretty well.

426
00:25:58,000 --> 00:25:59,000
okay.

427
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:00,000
councilman sweeney.

428
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:01,000
thank you, mayor.

429
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:06,400
I just want to say thank you again to
principal dohling for coming out and for

430
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:10,000
bringing us this and working
with holland and coming

431
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:10,000
up with this.

432
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:14,086
I mean, it's amazing, and I appreciate the
one team, one town, and bringing the whole

433
00:26:14,086 --> 00:26:15,000
community together.

434
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:16,000
so really great job.

435
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:17,000
yeah.

436
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:19,000
and back to you.

437
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:23,000
yeah, I mean, this is to me a slam dunk.

438
00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:28,268
I mean, to be able to surround our high
school with this kind of branding so that

439
00:26:28,268 --> 00:26:31,000
kids that are coming
up through elementary

440
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:33,000
school and junior high can see that there's.

441
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:38,666
town that cares about their high school
and for high school students to be able to

442
00:26:38,666 --> 00:26:41,000
see that every day
they drive up and then

443
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:47,579
opposing teams when they drive into our
nest to be able to see that there this high

444
00:26:47,579 --> 00:26:50,000
school is embraced
by the town let's

445
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:51,000
not make it complicated.

446
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:57,000
I think we approve option three and build from there I'm very much in favor

447
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:03,000
option three because it also we have the seasonal banners not just disappearing.

448
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:08,558
I mean the whole deal is to keep it fresh
so I'm I'm in favor of that as well any

449
00:27:08,558 --> 00:27:10,000
other comments erica.

450
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:11,000
it's just one more comment.

451
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:19,253
I know that we support grad night, but
I'm not sure if it's something that given

452
00:27:19,253 --> 00:27:24,000
given a lot of information
that's been posting

453
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:25,000
online about cities donating and

454
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:26,000
to high schools.

455
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:29,000
I'm not sure if it fits the profile.

456
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:36,000
I'm wondering maybe if we move the grad
night funding to have additional funding for

457
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:39,000
seniors to have
their banner posted.

458
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:43,799
so just I think that might be something
so then there's actual more revenue going

459
00:27:43,799 --> 00:27:47,000
into that and we can
increase the exposure of seniors.

460
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:55,000
well, one thing that we're very happy about this year is that we were able to cash in

461
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:59,000
and help the high school cash in on, I think,

462
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:06,943
about $15,000 in terms of being able to
resell the signs that we took down, you know,

463
00:28:06,943 --> 00:28:09,000
with our street signs.

464
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:15,000
and so that was a big, in a way, donation this year.

465
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:19,611
and I think there are a whole lot of things
that we can do to partner with the high

466
00:28:19,611 --> 00:28:20,000
school.

467
00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:22,000
a lot more involvement of...

468
00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:27,444
of the high school students with this
council, all kinds of things that we'll be

469
00:28:27,444 --> 00:28:29,000
talking about in the future.

470
00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:32,000
so I'm very, I'm excited about this.

471
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:36,000
so any more discussion in regards to this?

472
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:39,000
okay, with that, then we'll go ahead.

473
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:41,000
we have a motion and a second.

474
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:42,000
we'll ask for a roll call vote.

475
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:45,000
council member pezold?

476
00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:47,000
aye.

477
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:48,000
council member wheeler?

478
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:49,000
aye.

479
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:51,000
mayor caskey?

480
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:51,000
aye.

481
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:53,000
council member sweeney?

482
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:54,000
aye.

483
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:55,000
mayor pro tem mathis?

484
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:56,000
aye.

485
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,000
the ayes have it.

486
00:28:58,000 --> 00:28:59,000
I would say they do.

487
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:01,000
that's kind of unanimous.

488
00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:04,000
so with that, I appreciate it very much.

489
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:08,719
we're excited about this adventure, and
let's see where we can go with it from here,

490
00:29:08,719 --> 00:29:09,000
okay?

491
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:10,000
all right.

492
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:18,000
so I'm going to now move us back to the first part of our

493
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:27,606
and we have presentations and proclamations
and we'll start with one point one

494
00:29:27,606 --> 00:29:35,000
wildfire awareness and prevention
season proclamation thank you mr.

495
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:44,000
mayor let me invite reid gibson division chief of ocfa up to the podium here

496
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:47,000
thank you.

497
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:52,000
if you've noticed, it's a little hot outside, right, the last few days.

498
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:56,000
there's a lot of dry mountains out there, a lot of fuel.

499
00:29:56,000 --> 00:30:01,000
and we want to recognize in the public eye

500
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:07,886
the importance of awareness, and so we are
going to present this proclamation about

501
00:30:07,886 --> 00:30:12,000
wildfire awareness and
prevention season, whereas in 2020,

502
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:16,823
california experienced a record-breaking
wildfire season with over 4 million acres

503
00:30:16,823 --> 00:30:21,000
burned across the state, and then
again in 2024, the state faced 8,000,

504
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:26,396
over 8,000 wildfires that burned
approximately a million acres, reflecting a

505
00:30:26,396 --> 00:30:29,000
significant increase
from that previous year.

506
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:33,304
and whereas the recent wildfires in
los angeles county that we all remember,

507
00:30:33,304 --> 00:30:35,000
including the eaton
and palisades fire,

508
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:41,142
resulted in at least 29 fatalities and
destroyed over 16,000 structures, and whereas

509
00:30:41,142 --> 00:30:45,000
extreme fires are a growing
threat to public health and safety,

510
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:50,747
homes, and air quality, and whereas
every citizen has a key role in preventing

511
00:30:50,747 --> 00:30:53,000
destructive wildfires
from occurring,

512
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:59,821
now therefore I on behalf of mayor caskey
and the city council laguna hills do hereby

513
00:30:59,821 --> 00:31:04,000
proclaim the height of wildfire
season beginning in midsummer

514
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:09,000
and running through early autumn as wildfire awareness and prevention season.

515
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:21,000
thank you, everybody.

516
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:22,000
again, my name is reid gibson.

517
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:25,000
I'm your division chief for the orange county fire authority.

518
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:28,797
I just want to take the time to highlight
the orange county fire authority and what

519
00:31:28,797 --> 00:31:29,000
we do.

520
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:34,438
I brought a few of my partners here with
me today to show some support and some

521
00:31:34,438 --> 00:31:35,000
education.

522
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,000
as we did, it is a wildfire awareness and prevention.

523
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:43,125
and it's not just our 1,600 employees that
we have, 1,200 firefighters that are on

524
00:31:43,125 --> 00:31:46,000
the ground, but we have
our 400 support staff.

525
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:49,540
and that includes our mechanics, our
finance people, our fire prevention, our

526
00:31:49,540 --> 00:31:50,000
educators.

527
00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:51,000
that we have here.

528
00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:52,000
we have nurses.

529
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:55,000
we have a lot of support for the orange county fire authority.

530
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:59,000
and that's just to let you guys know that we are your regional fire department.

531
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:03,322
and when I say regional, that means not
just everyone who's surrounding the city of

532
00:32:03,322 --> 00:32:04,000
laguna woods.

533
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:11,000
you have 78 fire stations that could come here to help laguna hills at any time.

534
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:16,000
but what I want to do is introduce our community educator, milton neira,

535
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,000
to show you some of our programs that orange county fire authority provides.

536
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:23,000
good afternoon, evening, everybody.

537
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:26,000
I wanted to share a couple of things with you guys really quick.

538
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:31,381
and not only is it important to me as a
neighbor, but also my kids go to laguna hills

539
00:32:31,381 --> 00:32:32,000
high school.

540
00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:36,000
so it's really, really important to everybody here.

541
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,000
but we have lots of resources.

542
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:40,435
and what I'm going to ask you guys to do
right now is take your phones out, if you

543
00:32:40,435 --> 00:32:41,000
don't mind, please.

544
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:42,000
pull them out.

545
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:47,421
and I'm going to give you some phone numbers
and I'm going to give you some links as

546
00:32:47,421 --> 00:32:49,000
well as my personal cell phone

547
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:53,000
number so that we can go ahead and move forward and get prepared as a community.

548
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:57,000
so before anything else, we cannot tell you where the next fire is going to start,

549
00:32:57,000 --> 00:33:00,277
but what we know is that it's going
to happen, especially because we live in a

550
00:33:00,277 --> 00:33:02,000
community as beautiful
as we are, but the

551
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:04,000
topography and geography tells us that

552
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:07,000
we're right in the middle between the urban and the wildland interface.

553
00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:09,000
makes sense, right?

554
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:13,000
so because of that, we have a responsibility, not just for you, not just to you, but

555
00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:17,117
also to the family and to the community
that we serve and that we work with and that

556
00:33:17,117 --> 00:33:18,000
we live in, right?

557
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:19,000
so very, very important.

558
00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,000
so we have something called the ready, set, go program.

559
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:24,000
so please go ahead and open a browser on your phones

560
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:29,000
and visit ocfa.org, please.

561
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:31,000
orangecountyfireauthority.org.

562
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:33,000
once you're there, let me know.

563
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:36,000
just kind of wave and give me a thumbs up if that's okay.

564
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:39,000
and then you're going to see the menu, the bars on the upper right corner.

565
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:41,000
click on that, please.

566
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:44,441
and on the left-hand side, you're
going to have the menu with all kinds of

567
00:33:44,441 --> 00:33:45,000
information.

568
00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:49,009
a lot of information for you guys, for
your family, for your little ones, for your

569
00:33:49,009 --> 00:33:50,000
friends and your neighbors.

570
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:53,000
please take the time, go through that.

571
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:54,000
and I'm going to give you a phone number right now.

572
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:57,000
please write this down or save it on your phone, please.

573
00:33:58,000 --> 00:33:58,000
it is 714-573-6774.

574
00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:00,000
I'm going to repeat it once again.

575
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:00,000
714-573-6774.

576
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:14,189
this phone number is so that if you are
in doubt and or you're interested and you

577
00:34:14,189 --> 00:34:16,000
want a free assessment
of your home

578
00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:22,055
please let us know again I said free
make sense okay so give us a call you can

579
00:34:22,055 --> 00:34:24,000
actually do one on your own we

580
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:26,000
have actually a page I'm going to show it to you guys in a second

581
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:30,540
you can actually do an assessment of
your own home this afternoon and even this

582
00:34:30,540 --> 00:34:31,000
weekend.

583
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:34,000
and then if you have any questions or anything else, you can go, you know what,

584
00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:36,000
I'm going to call those guys at the fire authority.

585
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:38,000
and that number that I just gave you, right?

586
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:41,000
call us up and schedule a free assessment.

587
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:46,000
we'll come over to your site, to your home, to your community center, hoa.

588
00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:49,640
and we'll do a free assessment of your
community, of course, but your home on the

589
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:50,000
outside.

590
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:54,000
and we'll talk about, obviously, your home, hardening programs, vegetation, right?

591
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:58,000
and, of course, securing your home and talking a little bit about the risks.

592
00:34:58,000 --> 00:34:59,000
also, very, very important.

593
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:04,000
I know the browser, if you can open it up and look for alert oc.

594
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:05,000
extremely important.

595
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:06,000
I cannot tell you...

596
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:11,410
countless of times where we work at the eoc
up in loma ridge, and people call and say,

597
00:35:11,410 --> 00:35:13,000
hey, I'm looking for so-and-so,

598
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:17,183
or my neighbor or my friend or my family
member is missing, or I don't know what's

599
00:35:17,183 --> 00:35:18,000
going to happen.

600
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:21,000
you know, there's an evacuation order at this place, but we don't know where they are.

601
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:24,000
please plan ahead, and we're here to help you.

602
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:25,000
so I'm going to give you a bless you.

603
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:26,000
I'm going to give you another number.

604
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:27,000
okay, here we go.

605
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:31,000
it is 949-564-8887.

606
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:34,000
once again, 949-564-8887.

607
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:39,000
it is my phone, my cell phone number.

608
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,000
and you can schedule a fire safety class.

609
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:44,000
again, no cost.

610
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:48,000
and we can come over to your site, do home evacuation drills.

611
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:51,000
we'll teach you how to use a fire extinguisher.

612
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:54,000
we'll do a fire assessment, a fire training for you and your family.

613
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,000
so again, thank you guys for your time.

614
00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:58,000
we have lots of resources for you guys,

615
00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:00,000
thank you, sir.

616
00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:00,000
thank you, everybody.

617
00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:05,000
give them a round of applause for all they do to keep us safe.

618
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:06,000
thank you.

619
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:15,000
councilmember pezold, I believe you wanted to make a comment.

620
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:15,000
yes.

621
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:22,000
well, first of all, I want to mention that the free assessment is extremely important.

622
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,000
and a couple of years ago,

623
00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:27,000
uh...

624
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:34,538
during some construction to increase the
electricity going to my house a gas line was

625
00:36:34,538 --> 00:36:38,000
hit and a fire occurred
at my house and uh...

626
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:42,000
you don't think about it about uh...

627
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:46,000
fires until it happens and uh...

628
00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:51,666
it was mentioned to me that thank goodness
our trees have been trimmed and that we

629
00:36:51,666 --> 00:36:54,000
were putting the right
sort of vegetation

630
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:58,267
because it would have been problematic and
could have lit our whole neighborhood up

631
00:36:58,267 --> 00:37:00,000
because of the
aggressiveness of the flames.

632
00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:09,172
and also, we're extremely fortunate
because our fire, because they responded so

633
00:37:09,172 --> 00:37:10,000
quickly.

634
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:13,000
and we're very fortunate.

635
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:18,000
but if it wasn't for the good practices I had,

636
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,000
we would have, things would have happened differently.

637
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:27,291
and also, you never know how important
a fire safety drill is because when a fire

638
00:37:27,291 --> 00:37:29,000
happens, you go blank.

639
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:32,000
you just are stressed.

640
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:36,869
and my son, who was at the time very
young, ran out without his shoes and he was

641
00:37:36,869 --> 00:37:39,000
scared, didn't know
what to do, and

642
00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:44,000
thank goodness for, thank goodness,

643
00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:48,000
that you know how to handle the situation because my son wasn't scared.

644
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:53,000
but I will tell you, it's a scary moment when you're in a fire because you don't know.

645
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:55,000
there's only seconds before something could happen.

646
00:37:56,000 --> 00:38:01,147
so I'm really appreciative of everything
that you've done, and I just want everyone

647
00:38:01,147 --> 00:38:04,000
to know, use these
services because with me, I

648
00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:09,000
just went blank, and I ran out, and you're just confused.

649
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:09,000
so thank you.

650
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:11,000
I want to thank you.

651
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:15,000
and councilman sweeney.

652
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:16,000
thank you, mayor.

653
00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:17,000
thank you, chief gibson.

654
00:38:17,000 --> 00:38:21,000
and milton, thank you so much for being out here and for the presentation tonight.

655
00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:26,454
as chair of the orange county fire authority,
I see firsthand the extraordinary work

656
00:38:26,454 --> 00:38:29,000
that all of our men and
women, our firefighters,

657
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:34,696
our hand crews, our dispatchers, prevention
personnel, and professional staff do at

658
00:38:34,696 --> 00:38:36,000
orange county fire.

659
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:38,000
and they are all incredible.

660
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:40,000
they're all extraordinary individuals.

661
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:44,522
but I wanted to remind everybody
that wildfire preparedness is a shared

662
00:38:44,522 --> 00:38:49,363
responsibility and that residents play
an essential role in maintaining your

663
00:38:49,363 --> 00:38:50,000
defensible

664
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:54,000
space around your homes, making sure to reduce your combustible vegetation.

665
00:38:55,000 --> 00:39:00,000
register for those alerts, please, and have a family evacuation plan in place.

666
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:03,000
because wildfire doesn't recognize a boundary.

667
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:07,000
embers don't stop burning at a certain street or a certain boundary.

668
00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:13,354
but the preparation is really made before
our emergency and before our firefighters

669
00:39:13,354 --> 00:39:14,000
get there.

670
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:18,937
and that's the best opportunity for them
to be able to protect lives and property is

671
00:39:18,937 --> 00:39:21,000
that preparedness that
you do ahead of time.

672
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:23,000
so I strongly support this proclamation.

673
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:29,016
I would like for all of us to use it as a
commitment for continued public education

674
00:39:29,016 --> 00:39:31,000
throughout the height
of wildfire season.

675
00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:38,509
so again, please, I encourage every resident
out there to sign up for ocfa's ready,

676
00:39:38,509 --> 00:39:40,000
set, go and get the

677
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:44,000
resources there and take at least one action for preparedness in your home.

678
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:46,000
so thanks again.

679
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:52,000
thank you.

680
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:12,000
okay.

681
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:13,000
thank you very much.

682
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:23,153
we're moving on to item 1.2, which is a
presentation by octa in regard to the el toro

683
00:40:23,153 --> 00:40:28,000
road interstate 5
interchange project update.

684
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:33,000
and I'm going to ask melanie masud and potentially rose

685
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:37,000
casey to make that presentation.

686
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:37,000
thank you.

687
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:38,000
mr.

688
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:43,090
mayor before the presentation starts I
actually represent octa on a different matter

689
00:40:43,090 --> 00:40:46,000
out in irvine it has
nothing to do with the city

690
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:49,091
of laguna hills and nothing to do with
this matter but to avoid the appearance of

691
00:40:49,091 --> 00:40:51,000
impropriety I'm gonna go
ahead and conflict out on

692
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:55,606
this tom clark our special counsel has
agreed to field any legal questions on this

693
00:40:55,606 --> 00:40:56,000
matter.

694
00:40:57,000 --> 00:40:57,000
okay.

695
00:40:57,000 --> 00:41:02,000
thank you all right rose

696
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:07,000
good evening, mayor caskey, mayor pro tem mathis, and council members.

697
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:11,882
I'm rose casey, executive director of
planning for the orange county transportation

698
00:41:11,882 --> 00:41:13,000
authority, or octa.

699
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:18,000
and with me is angela hui, the principal community relations specialist at octa.

700
00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:22,500
so we appreciate this opportunity very much
to provide you with an update on the I-5

701
00:41:22,500 --> 00:41:24,000
el toro interchange project.

702
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:32,335
so the area studied in the draft environmental
document is depicted by the red line

703
00:41:32,335 --> 00:41:35,000
boundary and extends
nearly half a mile up and down

704
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:39,051
el toro road, bounded by rockfield toward
the bottom of the screen and paseo de

705
00:41:39,051 --> 00:41:41,000
valencia toward
the top of the screen,

706
00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:45,000
and it includes approximately two miles along interstate 5.

707
00:41:48,000 --> 00:41:53,492
to provide some important context for this
project, the I-5 el toro interchange was

708
00:41:53,492 --> 00:41:57,000
identified as a top priority
project by laguna hills,

709
00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:00,000
laguna woods, and lake forest during the development of measure m-2.

710
00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:04,000
in the m-2 ordinance that was approved by the voters in 2006,

711
00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:09,971
the I-5 el toro interchange project is one
of several local interchange projects in

712
00:42:09,971 --> 00:42:14,000
the m-2 freeway program,
and as a localized improvement,

713
00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:18,310
is to be developed in cooperation
with the local jurisdictions and affected

714
00:42:18,310 --> 00:42:19,000
communities.

715
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:23,000
in last year's update of the m2 next 10 delivery plan,

716
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:27,611
this project is identified to be environmentally
cleared by the end of this year to

717
00:42:27,611 --> 00:42:30,000
be ready for advancement
to the next phase.

718
00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:38,153
this slide provides an initial timeline of
project events beginning in february 2015

719
00:42:38,153 --> 00:42:43,000
with the planning phase where 15 alternatives
were considered to the completion

720
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:48,670
of the octa led alternatives assessment
study in 2021 which studied an additional

721
00:42:48,670 --> 00:42:50,000
seven alternatives.

722
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:55,594
so in total 22 alternatives were studied
highlighting this as a very challenging

723
00:42:55,594 --> 00:43:00,000
project that required a high
level of city involvement at every

724
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:00,000
step.

725
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:07,768
in march 2022, octa, caltrans, and all
three cities reached consensus on the two

726
00:43:07,768 --> 00:43:12,000
alternatives to move forward to the
environmental phase for evaluation.

727
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:17,000
then in january 2023, caltrans and octa restarted the environmental phase.

728
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:22,300
fast forward to this year, caltrans has
completed the preliminary engineering and

729
00:43:22,300 --> 00:43:24,000
environmental technical studies,

730
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:29,382
resulting in the draft project approval and
environmental document that was released

731
00:43:29,382 --> 00:43:31,000
for public review on july 31st.

732
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:39,000
so this is alternative one, which are the braided southbound I-5 hook ramps.

733
00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:45,800
this alternative includes a two lane I-5
southbound off ramp to el toro road with one

734
00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:49,000
lane assigned to el
toro road west using

735
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:51,000
the existing hook ramp.

736
00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:57,187
while one lane is assigned to el toro road
east, that is braided or grade separated

737
00:43:57,187 --> 00:44:00,000
on a bridge over the
southbound hook on-ramp.

738
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:06,414
this ramp then travels over el toro
road on a new bridge and then ties into a

739
00:44:06,414 --> 00:44:10,000
realigned avenida de la
carlota next to the village

740
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:10,000
at laguna hills.

741
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:21,000
this alternative is a design variation of alternative one on the previous slide.

742
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:26,036
it includes a potential public street
connecting the village at laguna hills

743
00:44:26,036 --> 00:44:31,536
development to the proposed signalized
intersection of the southbound I-5 ramps and

744
00:44:31,536 --> 00:44:32,000
avenida

745
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:33,000
de la carlota.

746
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:45,000
this shows alternative two, which is the flyover ramp with a roundabout.

747
00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:50,533
this alternative was evaluated but eliminated
because it is inconsistent with state

748
00:44:50,533 --> 00:44:51,000
policy.

749
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:53,000
excuse me?

750
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:55,000
inconsistent with what?

751
00:44:57,000 --> 00:45:03,612
so mayor caskey, according to caltrans
design policy, there cannot be access to a

752
00:45:03,612 --> 00:45:05,000
private property.

753
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:11,232
so if you take a look at the roundabout
and looking at the south leg of the

754
00:45:11,232 --> 00:45:12,000
roundabout,

755
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:16,000
it would provide access to a private property and not a connection to a public street.

756
00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:19,000
okay.

757
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:28,125
alternative three is the tsm-tdm alternative
that includes advanced traffic signal

758
00:45:28,125 --> 00:45:33,250
improvements and other intelligent
transportation systems or its enhancements like

759
00:45:33,250 --> 00:45:35,000
traveler information systems

760
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:37,000
or traffic management center upgrades.

761
00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:40,000
this alternative is a standalone alternative.

762
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:44,375
it's been evaluated that way, and it could
also be incorporated with the other build

763
00:45:44,375 --> 00:45:45,000
alternative.

764
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:52,841
so the project benefits are that it will
reduce traffic congestion, enhance safety,

765
00:45:52,841 --> 00:45:55,000
and improve emergency
response times.

766
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:59,766
all of these benefits are tied to being able
to travel on the streets and through the

767
00:45:59,766 --> 00:46:01,000
intersections quicker.

768
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,000
and we'll get into more detail with this next slide.

769
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:10,126
so this graphic, I know there's a lot
going on here and I'll try to explain it,

770
00:46:10,126 --> 00:46:13,000
summarizes the benefits
associated with alternative 1a,

771
00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:19,466
including reducing traffic congestion
and delays by distributing traffic from the

772
00:46:19,466 --> 00:46:25,000
existing southbound I-5 off-ramp to the
new braided off-ramp denoted by the purple

773
00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:26,000
arrow.

774
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:32,835
a substantial share of the southbound
I-5 traffic headed to eastbound el toro, or

775
00:46:32,835 --> 00:46:36,000
lake forest, would shift
to the new braided off ramp,

776
00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:42,881
replacing the two left turns of today, so
that's shown by the orange path, with two

777
00:46:42,881 --> 00:46:46,000
right turns, and that's
shown in light blue.

778
00:46:47,000 --> 00:46:51,330
this will reduce delays at key intersections,
so it will take less time to get from

779
00:46:51,330 --> 00:46:53,000
point a to point b in this area.

780
00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:58,211
the highest benefited intersections
with a substantial reduction delay or

781
00:46:58,211 --> 00:47:03,000
alternatively takes less time to get through
the intersection are circled in green.

782
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:09,490
so, for example, for today's trip in red,
that's basically taking the southbound

783
00:47:09,490 --> 00:47:11,000
off-ramp from the I-5,

784
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:18,000
making the left on avenida de la carlota,
and then making the left on el toro,

785
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:19,000
heading east.

786
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:25,000
that trip will be about 35% to 40% quicker during the morning and afternoon peaks.

787
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:30,000
an important related benefit is that safety will be enhanced as well.

788
00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:36,085
so currently, the I-5 el toro interchange
area has the most accidents in south orange

789
00:47:36,085 --> 00:47:38,000
county, south of the 55 freeway,

790
00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:40,000
in the past 10 years.

791
00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:42,000
and these are mainly congestion related.

792
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:47,000
so with this project, we'll enhance safety by reducing congestion.

793
00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:52,068
and then another key benefit is that with
the reduced delays, emergency responders,

794
00:47:52,068 --> 00:47:53,000
including the ocfa,

795
00:47:54,000 --> 00:47:57,000
will be able to move through the area quicker, shortening response times.

796
00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:02,000
and next, angela will share information on the public outreach efforts.

797
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:07,000
thank you, rose.

798
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,000
good evening, mayor caskey, council members.

799
00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:13,000
again, my name is angela hui, outreach manager for this project.

800
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:16,319
so I'm going to talk a little bit about
our outreach strategy and what we've been

801
00:48:16,319 --> 00:48:18,000
doing to make sure
residents, businesses,

802
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,000
and stakeholders are informed and involved.

803
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:25,064
during the public review period, we are
hosting two public hearings in an open house

804
00:48:25,064 --> 00:48:27,000
format, one in person
and one virtually,

805
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:31,761
to provide opportunities for the community
to learn more about the project, meet the

806
00:48:31,761 --> 00:48:34,000
project team, ask questions,
and provide feedback.

807
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:40,000
the in-person public hearing is scheduled for tomorrow, august 26, from 5 to 7 p.m.

808
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:42,000
at the laguna hills community center.

809
00:48:43,000 --> 00:48:47,000
the virtual public hearing is scheduled for wednesday, september 2, from 5 to 7 p.m.

810
00:48:47,000 --> 00:48:48,000
via zoom.

811
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:52,971
to support the public review and hearing
process, our team has developed exhibit

812
00:48:52,971 --> 00:48:56,000
boards and updated project
materials, including a fact sheet,

813
00:48:56,000 --> 00:49:00,628
postcard mailers distributed earlier this
month, flyers canvassed to surrounding

814
00:49:00,628 --> 00:49:03,000
businesses, and a
communications toolkit.

815
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:07,287
these materials are being used as part of
our broader community outreach and public

816
00:49:07,287 --> 00:49:08,000
awareness efforts.

817
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:12,855
we have also shared these materials
with key stakeholders to help inform the

818
00:49:12,855 --> 00:49:16,000
community and raise awareness
of opportunities to participate.

819
00:49:17,000 --> 00:49:21,488
overall, our goal is to keep the process
transparent and ensure the public continues

820
00:49:21,488 --> 00:49:24,000
to have a voice in the
selection of a preferred

821
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:25,000
alternative later this year.

822
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:29,000
with that, I'll hand it back to rose to discuss next steps.

823
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:40,000
so the public review or circulation period closes monday, september 14th.

824
00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:42,000
again, the two public hearings are shown here.

825
00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:46,000
the in-person meeting is tomorrow evening at the laguna hills community center.

826
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:50,000
the selection of the preferred alternative is scheduled for october,

827
00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:54,666
with the final project approval and
environmental documents scheduled for later this

828
00:49:54,666 --> 00:49:56,000
year or early next year.

829
00:49:57,000 --> 00:49:58,000
that concludes our presentation.

830
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:00,000
we're happy to answer any questions you may have.

831
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:15,455
that does first of all I thank you very
much does anyone here have any questions

832
00:50:15,455 --> 00:50:20,000
clarifications and I
actually have a few go

833
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:20,000
ahead.

834
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:20,000
go ahead.

835
00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:29,000
no, I'm I'm gonna I might I may actually go on and on so I'm gonna let other people

836
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:38,452
okay so courtesy okay I just want want
to make sure that I understand this um and

837
00:50:38,452 --> 00:50:42,000
it's it's clear um
I used to drive

838
00:50:42,000 --> 00:50:51,357
my children to practice and um years ago
years ago it was a water polo practice and I

839
00:50:51,357 --> 00:50:54,000
had to take el toro road

840
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:57,000
and I would be stuck and my children

841
00:50:58,000 --> 00:51:00,000
suffered many consequences being late.

842
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:03,000
and being late, there was an accident.

843
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:09,639
we didn't know that what could have been,
what should have been a 30-minute drive

844
00:51:09,639 --> 00:51:13,000
could be two hours
or an hour or whatever

845
00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:15,000
because you get stuck behind an accident.

846
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:19,000
and until things are cleared out, and I've been there.

847
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:25,000
and I've seen also, unfortunately, I have seen really bad accidents on el toro road.

848
00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:37,000
and so to say that you're responding to an urgent matter is an understatement.

849
00:51:37,000 --> 00:51:39,000
it is the busiest area in orange county.

850
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:40,000
is that correct?

851
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:51,132
and then another question I have is, is it
1-1 has the least amount of destruction of,

852
00:51:51,132 --> 00:51:54,000
I guess, if you're going...

853
00:51:55,000 --> 00:52:00,000
with respect to businesses, what is the least amount of impact?

854
00:52:03,000 --> 00:52:04,000
you make a statement.

855
00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:05,000
I'm just curious, which one?

856
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:07,000
the least one.

857
00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:10,000
she's referring to alternative one versus alternative two.

858
00:52:11,000 --> 00:52:15,000
yes, alternative one, excuse me, alternative one versus alternative two.

859
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:22,000
which one has the least amount of impact currently today on existing businesses?

860
00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:30,978
so starting first, councilmember puzzold,
starting first with alternative 1, there

861
00:52:30,978 --> 00:52:36,000
would be an impact on the
village at laguna hills property.

862
00:52:37,000 --> 00:52:44,000
and I, we acknowledge that since the july 14th city council meeting, we have been,

863
00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:49,245
the city and octa staff have been meeting
to try to come up with a solution that

864
00:52:49,245 --> 00:52:52,000
would allow both
projects to move forward.

865
00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:56,857
so yes, there would be potentially impacts
on the development property, but we're

866
00:52:56,857 --> 00:52:58,000
trying to minimize that.

867
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:03,595
we actually, the caltrans designers have
been working on an option that would bring

868
00:53:03,595 --> 00:53:04,000
in the

869
00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:09,000
the roadway improvements in closer towards the freeway.

870
00:53:09,000 --> 00:53:14,000
and then the impact on the st.

871
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:19,000
john's church on the other side of north of el toro is very minimal.

872
00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:27,079
it is basically landscaping area, no
buildings, no structures, very limited parking

873
00:53:27,079 --> 00:53:30,000
spaces that would be impacted.

874
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:40,696
and then for the, and then also the
businesses would be impacted in the southbound

875
00:53:40,696 --> 00:53:46,000
off ramp area between
avenida de la carlota and el

876
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:47,000
toro.

877
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:50,000
so there are a few businesses right now that are within that loop.

878
00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:53,000
and what about number two?

879
00:53:53,000 --> 00:54:01,000
so number two, the flyover alternative as currently shown on the screen,

880
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:07,000
it would impact the two shopping centers in that lake forest area.

881
00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:15,000
and that is primarily the impact associated with this one.

882
00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:20,000
this doesn't reflect, this reflects the design that it doesn't meet state policy.

883
00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:26,862
the revised design would shift the flyover
ramp closer to the homes existing homes in

884
00:54:26,862 --> 00:54:31,000
lake forest and it would also
leave potentially a landlocked

885
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:37,412
parcel as well as a very small remnant
parcel that would have very limited access to

886
00:54:37,412 --> 00:54:41,000
rockfield and it would
still impact the the two

887
00:54:41,000 --> 00:54:47,323
shopping center properties that are there
in that quadrant so essentially the least

888
00:54:47,323 --> 00:54:49,000
impact would be option

889
00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:59,336
as well as it is not, I guess, doesn't
have as many legal challenges because it

890
00:54:59,336 --> 00:55:03,000
doesn't go into a private road.

891
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:04,000
so it's that.

892
00:55:07,000 --> 00:55:12,689
I will say that the project team is
working very diligently on moving those

893
00:55:12,689 --> 00:55:18,000
improvements in towards the freeway
and minimizing as much as possible

894
00:55:19,000 --> 00:55:21,000
the impact on the on the village property.

895
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:30,510
thank you okay, councilman wheeler first
question so you're having a public hearing

896
00:55:30,510 --> 00:55:32,000
tomorrow yes,

897
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:34,000
that's correct public hearings used to be about one option I

898
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:42,094
it will be about alternative one, the design
variation 1a, two in the sense that it

899
00:55:42,094 --> 00:55:45,000
shows that it is
being eliminated,

900
00:55:45,000 --> 00:55:51,000
and then three, which is the technology build alternative.

901
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:52,000
okay.

902
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:55,000
I've got a number of problems with all these,

903
00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:58,962
and in particular there was a comment in
one of the earlier slides that there was an

904
00:55:58,962 --> 00:56:00,000
agreement back in 2022

905
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:03,000
that was the mayor in 2022.

906
00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:04,000
there was no agreement.

907
00:56:05,000 --> 00:56:07,000
we've always, you know, had problems with these drawings.

908
00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:08,000
I don't know where these things come from.

909
00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:10,000
there was no agreement.

910
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:15,409
I even walked these sites with the mayor of
lake forest, and we both thought that the

911
00:56:15,409 --> 00:56:17,000
two was the best one, for

912
00:56:17,000 --> 00:56:23,610
them and for us, because two actually put
traffic that belonged in lake forest more

913
00:56:23,610 --> 00:56:26,000
than any of the other options.

914
00:56:26,000 --> 00:56:28,000
and also, you know, helped on some number of things.

915
00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:31,000
yeah, dumping more traffic.

916
00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:33,000
just look at this 1a right here, which is similar to 1.

917
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:40,073
I guess it's actually four lanes that come
off when you get to the road at the first

918
00:56:40,073 --> 00:56:41,000
exit there.

919
00:56:41,000 --> 00:56:42,000
that's going to remain the same, I'm assuming?

920
00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:46,000
yes.

921
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:48,000
okay, so that doesn't change at all.

922
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:53,126
and then the other one is going to dump how
many lanes off right in the middle of our

923
00:56:53,126 --> 00:56:54,000
proposed new area?

924
00:56:56,000 --> 00:57:04,442
so councilmember wheeler if you're
referring to the the new southbound off-ramp

925
00:57:04,442 --> 00:57:10,000
that's south of el toro
that would be two two lanes,

926
00:57:10,000 --> 00:57:16,786
but where it meets the intersection it
would allow for left turns onto carlotta in

927
00:57:16,786 --> 00:57:22,000
this in this design variation a
through lane to the development

928
00:57:22,000 --> 00:57:25,000
and then right turn onto carlotta

929
00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:30,000
so what you're doing there, most of the people by habit probably, at first anyway,

930
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:34,000
are going to make a right turn off the second one and go right back to el toro road.

931
00:57:35,000 --> 00:57:38,828
so instead of having one turn to the left,
you're going to have two turns, one to the

932
00:57:38,828 --> 00:57:40,000
right and one to the left,

933
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:44,270
and competing traffic from both directions,
which does not seem like a good way to

934
00:57:44,270 --> 00:57:45,000
design things.

935
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:49,648
you have competing traffic, you have, you
know, it sounds like it might be a bigger

936
00:57:49,648 --> 00:57:50,000
problem.

937
00:57:54,000 --> 00:57:54,000
also this...

938
00:57:56,000 --> 00:58:02,775
the second 1a here, and one same to its
degree, this goes right through a brand-new

939
00:58:02,775 --> 00:58:04,000
proposed hotel,

940
00:58:05,000 --> 00:58:07,000
which will be brought up a little later today.

941
00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:14,000
that basically is going to not do any good for that area.

942
00:58:14,000 --> 00:58:18,022
and it also knocks out all the businesses
on the corner, because the freeways

943
00:58:18,022 --> 00:58:21,000
surround the whole thing,
pretty much, and the new roads.

944
00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:24,000
so maybe you might get in there, but that's not a good idea.

945
00:58:28,000 --> 00:58:29,000
can you turn to page six?

946
00:58:29,000 --> 00:58:31,000
I had some questions on that.

947
00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:32,000
I have to look at it to remember my questions.

948
00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:39,000
okay.

949
00:58:41,000 --> 00:58:42,000
I guess I can cover them elsewhere.

950
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:48,507
we've had an alternative proposed by our
own director who would bypass all these

951
00:58:48,507 --> 00:58:52,000
things and essentially does
what you're doing with that second

952
00:58:52,000 --> 00:58:54,000
ramp only with signs instead of

953
00:58:55,000 --> 00:58:57,739
instead of, you know, all this massive
concrete and all this massive work's going to

954
00:58:57,739 --> 00:58:58,000
be done.

955
00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:04,081
if traffic could be redirected to some
degree to go continue down, not turn left on

956
00:59:04,081 --> 00:59:06,000
altura, but turn
left on the next road.

957
00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:12,655
that would do essentially the same thing
as your proposed massively costly product

958
00:59:12,655 --> 00:59:13,000
here.

959
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:15,000
and I don't know why you haven't considered that.

960
00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:21,839
I mean, for a small, small fraction of what
they're going to spend all this money on,

961
00:59:21,839 --> 00:59:22,000
we

962
00:59:22,000 --> 00:59:24,829
could have the whole thing solved with a
few signs and a little bit of paint on the

963
00:59:24,829 --> 00:59:25,000
road.

964
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:28,614
and we're not accomplishing anything because
the same amount of traffic is going to

965
00:59:28,614 --> 00:59:30,000
flow through that
intersection in that area.

966
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:32,000
you're not relieving any traffic.

967
00:59:32,000 --> 00:59:35,429
the only way you can relieve the traffic
is if you have alternative two and some of

968
00:59:35,429 --> 00:59:37,000
the traffic was taken
away from laguna

969
00:59:37,000 --> 00:59:39,000
hills and put over lake forest, at least divide it up a little bit.

970
00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:44,000
so I don't see any value to any of the ones at all.

971
00:59:45,000 --> 00:59:47,000
two has some value to lake forest.

972
00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:49,000
I'll pass some more questions.

973
00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:50,000
I want to yield to the mayor.

974
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:51,000
okay.

975
00:59:53,000 --> 00:59:53,000
councilman sweeney.

976
00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:55,000
thank you, mayor.

977
00:59:57,000 --> 00:59:58,000
thank you both for being out here tonight.

978
00:59:58,000 --> 01:00:00,000
I appreciate it.

979
01:00:01,000 --> 01:00:02,000
option two was eliminated.

980
01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:05,000
when and how was that eliminated?

981
01:00:07,000 --> 01:00:13,604
councilmember sweeney, that was eliminated
in march or april of this year when the

982
01:00:13,604 --> 01:00:19,000
design from caltrans was going
to be published in the environmental

983
01:00:19,000 --> 01:00:24,000
document showing the connection that doesn't meet state policy.

984
01:00:24,000 --> 01:00:31,077
and with the revised design to meet state
policy, the landlocked parcel, the moving

985
01:00:31,077 --> 01:00:35,000
the flyover ramp closer
to the existing homes,

986
01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:42,000
and other impacts deemed it not feasible.

987
01:00:42,000 --> 01:00:43,000
okay.

988
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:49,000
and you had mentioned that it would take out two shopping centers there on that side.

989
01:00:51,000 --> 01:00:53,000
and sorry to flip-flop, but I'm going to go back to 1a.

990
01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:57,000
but 1a also takes out a shopping center on our side as well, correct?

991
01:00:57,000 --> 01:00:57,000
correct.

992
01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:01,000
if you're referring to the village plaza, is that the one?

993
01:01:01,000 --> 01:01:04,000
yeah, the one that's on the corner of el toro.

994
01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:07,000
yeah.

995
01:01:07,000 --> 01:01:10,000
so I guess both sides are impacted there.

996
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:16,000
could it?

997
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:19,000
it just seems interesting.

998
01:01:20,000 --> 01:01:22,000
so is option three still on the table then?

999
01:01:23,000 --> 01:01:24,000
very much so, yes.

1000
01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:24,000
okay.

1001
01:01:25,000 --> 01:01:26,000
so that is still an option.

1002
01:01:26,000 --> 01:01:26,000
gotcha.

1003
01:01:26,000 --> 01:01:26,000
okay.

1004
01:01:29,000 --> 01:01:37,300
yeah and has there been discussion with
merlon geyer and the impacts of what option

1005
01:01:37,300 --> 01:01:41,000
1a does and what
does that look like?

1006
01:01:44,000 --> 01:01:49,507
we have as as octa we have not been in
direct conversation discussions with merlon

1007
01:01:49,507 --> 01:01:53,000
geyer we've been working
through city the city staff

1008
01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:54,000
and okay.

1009
01:01:54,000 --> 01:01:55,000
all right.

1010
01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:57,000
okay.

1011
01:01:58,000 --> 01:01:59,000
that's all the questions I have now.

1012
01:01:59,000 --> 01:01:59,000
thank you.

1013
01:02:02,000 --> 01:02:04,000
okay.

1014
01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:06,000
I'm going to chime in here a little bit.

1015
01:02:07,000 --> 01:02:09,000
could we go to page 11, please?

1016
01:02:13,000 --> 01:02:14,000
and we're going to come back to 7.

1017
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:17,000
I have a lot of comments.

1018
01:02:19,000 --> 01:02:22,000
and I see this as a work in process, okay?

1019
01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:23,000
I'm up.

1020
01:02:24,000 --> 01:02:30,528
generally a pretty positive person, and
I believe in making improvements to our

1021
01:02:30,528 --> 01:02:34,000
transportation system
as much as possible.

1022
01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:40,752
but I find it interesting on page 11, I'm
just looking at it, that everything where

1023
01:02:40,752 --> 01:02:42,000
we just, you know,

1024
01:02:42,000 --> 01:02:48,254
have gone through at least the first reading
of an entitlement of the merlin geier

1025
01:02:48,254 --> 01:02:51,000
property, the old
laguna hills mall,

1026
01:02:52,000 --> 01:02:56,000
to quite an extensive 68-acre development.

1027
01:02:56,000 --> 01:03:01,333
on this particular slide, other than referring
to the village, access to the village

1028
01:03:01,333 --> 01:03:04,000
in laguna hills,
there's nothing in there.

1029
01:03:05,000 --> 01:03:06,000
it's empty.

1030
01:03:07,000 --> 01:03:12,946
and so I look at that and I'm thinking, I'm
really worried that that's what octa and

1031
01:03:12,946 --> 01:03:15,000
caltrans really looked at, is

1032
01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:17,771
that this was just a great big piece of dirt
and they could do whatever the heck they

1033
01:03:17,771 --> 01:03:18,000
wanted.

1034
01:03:19,000 --> 01:03:23,000
and so it is not the case so much right now.

1035
01:03:23,000 --> 01:03:27,000
we are working together on trying to do something.

1036
01:03:27,000 --> 01:03:28,000
could you go back to slide number seven?

1037
01:03:32,000 --> 01:03:33,000
seven.

1038
01:03:33,000 --> 01:03:33,000
yeah.

1039
01:03:34,000 --> 01:03:34,000
okay.

1040
01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:38,000
there we go.

1041
01:03:38,000 --> 01:03:38,000
there we go.

1042
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:40,000
all right.

1043
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:43,000
it's very difficult for a lot of people in the room to read this,

1044
01:03:43,000 --> 01:03:49,000
so I'm only going to basically explain that the same problem

1045
01:03:50,000 --> 01:03:56,639
that alternative two had on that side of
the freeway is the exact same issue that's

1046
01:03:56,639 --> 01:04:00,000
going to occur on
our side of the freeway.

1047
01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:10,333
basically, you see, you know, a four-lane
street sticking off carlotta going straight

1048
01:04:10,333 --> 01:04:12,000
into the village.

1049
01:04:13,000 --> 01:04:15,000
it goes straight into townhomes.

1050
01:04:16,000 --> 01:04:17,000
it goes straight into a hotel.

1051
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:24,000
and so those things really weren't thought about okay,

1052
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:31,364
and we're working on it together today
but we're a long ways from from having a

1053
01:04:31,364 --> 01:04:35,000
solution here and
just say oh look what

1054
01:04:35,000 --> 01:04:35,000
we did.

1055
01:04:35,000 --> 01:04:41,483
it's all great because it does the same damn
thing that that four-lane road that goes

1056
01:04:41,483 --> 01:04:44,000
in there the idea
of it as far as

1057
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:49,000
caltrans is concerned even though they might change their mind is that that would be a

1058
01:04:50,000 --> 01:04:54,000
a full four lane street going through to another public street.

1059
01:04:55,000 --> 01:04:59,000
the very reason why you can't do alternative number two on the other side.

1060
01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:01,000
okay?

1061
01:05:02,000 --> 01:05:06,000
and so that would basically destroy the village plan.

1062
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:09,000
that four lane road would go through the village park.

1063
01:05:09,000 --> 01:05:11,000
it would go through the whole foods.

1064
01:05:11,000 --> 01:05:12,000
it would go through the northstorm rack.

1065
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:19,000
it would be a disaster if it was to be like this.

1066
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:21,000
but this is what you're showing us.

1067
01:05:21,000 --> 01:05:25,000
so I can only go on the basis of what is in front of me today.

1068
01:05:25,000 --> 01:05:32,241
and I'm assuming that all of the ceqa stuff
that you're doing is based not upon what

1069
01:05:32,241 --> 01:05:35,000
the entitlements were from 2022,

1070
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:41,000
but what are the entitlements that we're looking at.

1071
01:05:41,000 --> 01:05:43,000
we've only done the first reading and approved that.

1072
01:05:44,000 --> 01:05:46,000
we still have another second reading to do.

1073
01:05:46,000 --> 01:05:49,000
and I think that's agendized today.

1074
01:05:49,000 --> 01:05:52,000
but the point is, is that we're a long ways.

1075
01:05:53,000 --> 01:06:00,218
I mean, the easiest thing for you to do
right now and actually maybe makes it happen

1076
01:06:00,218 --> 01:06:04,000
without it being crazy
is alternative three.

1077
01:06:05,000 --> 01:06:07,000
or you're not doing any of this.

1078
01:06:08,000 --> 01:06:11,000
because plaza drive, which exists right now,

1079
01:06:11,000 --> 01:06:17,000
it goes into the mall site, pretty much where this access ramp is, is

1080
01:06:17,000 --> 01:06:23,397
basically a two-way street in and out that
was met in the entitlement that we have

1081
01:06:23,397 --> 01:06:28,000
just approved the first reading
of to be the in and out for

1082
01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:34,000
whole foods and for king's fish house and all the rest of that.

1083
01:06:35,000 --> 01:06:38,000
and so the only other alternative besides this

1084
01:06:39,000 --> 01:06:45,201
four-lane road which should go through
the entire development would be not to do

1085
01:06:45,201 --> 01:06:49,000
anything at all there
and then there's no no lane

1086
01:06:49,000 --> 01:06:55,814
going in and or out unless we can
solve those problems those are the kinds of

1087
01:06:55,814 --> 01:06:59,000
problems we need
to solve and and we

1088
01:06:59,000 --> 01:07:05,000
need to do it sooner than later because we have the marriott hotel who wants to go in?

1089
01:07:06,000 --> 01:07:09,000
the site that would actually be uh...

1090
01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:15,000
hugely affected by this in terms of a taking in terms of uh...

1091
01:07:16,000 --> 01:07:16,000
uh...

1092
01:07:16,000 --> 01:07:18,000
you know project uh...

1093
01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:24,071
being and they wanted they want to be into
that building by the twenty eight olympics

1094
01:07:24,071 --> 01:07:27,000
which means they're
ready to go into plan

1095
01:07:27,000 --> 01:07:31,000
check and all of this stuff is we're gonna vote on it

1096
01:07:32,000 --> 01:07:35,000
october and then we're going to do more stuff,

1097
01:07:35,000 --> 01:07:40,519
and then we're going to design it how do
we move on with a village project if this

1098
01:07:40,519 --> 01:07:42,000
thing is hanging over?

1099
01:07:43,000 --> 01:07:51,590
everyone's head for years so that's I
mean, I'm only pointing these out not to be

1100
01:07:51,590 --> 01:07:57,000
adversarial but to
basically say this really really

1101
01:07:57,000 --> 01:08:00,000
isn't figured out yet not even close I

1102
01:08:02,000 --> 01:08:06,432
and I would love it if we could figure it
out in the next month because we need to

1103
01:08:06,432 --> 01:08:08,000
move on one way or the other.

1104
01:08:09,000 --> 01:08:15,601
and we have a developer since the first
reading who's ready to rock and roll and make

1105
01:08:15,601 --> 01:08:17,000
this stuff happen.

1106
01:08:17,000 --> 01:08:22,613
so if we were ever worried about, oh,
no, can we really trust they're going to do

1107
01:08:22,613 --> 01:08:24,000
this, they're ready.

1108
01:08:25,000 --> 01:08:29,000
and so I don't know how we solve this.

1109
01:08:30,000 --> 01:08:35,470
and now we can't even do anything because
we don't even have the ability to talk

1110
01:08:35,470 --> 01:08:38,000
about it in any
level other than this

1111
01:08:39,000 --> 01:08:41,000
until after september 14th.

1112
01:08:41,000 --> 01:08:48,000
because this is the public, you know, you're looking for public reaction.

1113
01:08:49,000 --> 01:08:53,000
I don't know what kind of public reaction
you're going to get when most people are

1114
01:08:53,000 --> 01:08:55,000
going to go to these
things and certainly

1115
01:08:55,000 --> 01:08:58,000
not understand what I'm talking about right now.

1116
01:08:59,000 --> 01:09:00,000
not even a clue.

1117
01:09:01,000 --> 01:09:07,752
and so I don't know how that's to the
public's benefit to have very little real

1118
01:09:07,752 --> 01:09:11,000
information about
what this really is.

1119
01:09:12,000 --> 01:09:16,000
so those are my comments, but I will end the way I started.

1120
01:09:16,000 --> 01:09:23,010
I would like to see us find a solution that
works, that's a win-win, or certainly not

1121
01:09:23,010 --> 01:09:24,000
a lose-lose,

1122
01:09:25,000 --> 01:09:28,000
and something that is done in an expedient way

1123
01:09:29,000 --> 01:09:31,000
and not hold everybody up.

1124
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:35,000
and so I'll leave it that way.

1125
01:09:35,000 --> 01:09:39,000
let's find that solution, but let's find it quickly.

1126
01:09:39,000 --> 01:09:41,000
otherwise, we need to move on.

1127
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:48,612
we have an almost billion-dollar development
that we're ready to, if it passes the

1128
01:09:48,612 --> 01:09:52,000
second reading
tonight, I'll give it that.

1129
01:09:53,000 --> 01:09:57,000
but if it does, then we need to move on.

1130
01:09:57,000 --> 01:09:58,000
this city needs to move on.

1131
01:09:59,000 --> 01:10:02,000
and that hotel is very important to us.

1132
01:10:03,000 --> 01:10:08,154
there's two hotels and the tot taxes are
really, really fundamental to that whole

1133
01:10:08,154 --> 01:10:10,000
development and how it works.

1134
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:17,000
not to mention the fact that this access way goes right straight into town homes.

1135
01:10:18,000 --> 01:10:21,000
and we were worried about town homes being close to town homes on the other side.

1136
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:24,000
this goes straight into them.

1137
01:10:25,000 --> 01:10:26,000
so I don't know.

1138
01:10:27,000 --> 01:10:32,000
mayor caskey, if I could comment on your timeline and the urgency.

1139
01:10:33,000 --> 01:10:39,000
similarly, we have a schedule to complete the environmental phase on this project.

1140
01:10:39,000 --> 01:10:44,000
once the public comment period closes on
september 14th, the team is going to be, and

1141
01:10:44,000 --> 01:10:46,000
actually is working
on it now, but

1142
01:10:46,000 --> 01:10:49,000
we'll be summarizing all the comments received.

1143
01:10:50,000 --> 01:10:54,510
we will meet with the three cities and with
caltrans to talk about all the comments

1144
01:10:54,510 --> 01:10:55,000
received,

1145
01:10:56,000 --> 01:10:58,000
and then the plan is to meet in october.

1146
01:10:58,000 --> 01:11:04,000
so it's between now, august 25th, and october.

1147
01:11:05,000 --> 01:11:09,086
there's time there, but we're going to be
getting on this as quickly as we can to try

1148
01:11:09,086 --> 01:11:10,000
to find a solution.

1149
01:11:11,000 --> 01:11:13,000
and in the meantime, I'm hoping that we're

1150
01:11:13,000 --> 01:11:17,000
trying to find a real solution and not just say, okay,

1151
01:11:17,000 --> 01:11:20,000
we've got the public comments and we're going to just move ahead with what it is.

1152
01:11:21,000 --> 01:11:28,000
because you had three cities who would have done the flyover in a flash, all of us.

1153
01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:32,000
and the problem really is the hydraulics.

1154
01:11:32,000 --> 01:11:34,000
I think erica brought it up.

1155
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:41,384
the hydraulics, the traffic hydraulics on
el toro between the freeway and tribuco is

1156
01:11:41,384 --> 01:11:42,000
a joke.

1157
01:11:43,000 --> 01:11:43,000
on the other side.

1158
01:11:44,000 --> 01:11:49,000
and that's not criticizing our colleagues on the other side,

1159
01:11:49,000 --> 01:11:56,927
but just creating these off ramps is not
going to really get the traffic flowing

1160
01:11:56,927 --> 01:12:00,000
again until things are in sync.

1161
01:12:00,000 --> 01:12:04,000
we've got way too many traffic lights on the other side.

1162
01:12:04,000 --> 01:12:09,000
we have five exits on our side from the freeway, five.

1163
01:12:09,000 --> 01:12:11,000
we don't have a real problem.

1164
01:12:12,000 --> 01:12:16,659
and that's not even to mention what wheeler,
sorry, councilman wheeler was talking

1165
01:12:16,659 --> 01:12:17,000
about.

1166
01:12:18,000 --> 01:12:22,000
we lose another, it's a small, but another shopping center.

1167
01:12:23,000 --> 01:12:25,000
I mean, it goes on and on.

1168
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:27,000
so, okay.

1169
01:12:27,000 --> 01:12:28,000
mayor kaskin, council members.

1170
01:12:28,000 --> 01:12:28,000
those are my comments.

1171
01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:32,000
I would, you know, all the traffic study that's been done is,

1172
01:12:34,000 --> 01:12:38,102
if I could boil it down, there's a lot
of data in it, a lot of analysis, is that

1173
01:12:38,102 --> 01:12:40,000
basically with the
build alternative,

1174
01:12:40,000 --> 01:12:44,000
whether it's 1, 1a, would reduce congestion in the area by 35 to 40%.

1175
01:12:44,000 --> 01:12:45,000
so the tsm-tdm one,

1176
01:12:49,000 --> 01:12:54,000
also would reduce traffic as well or reduce congestion by about 9%.

1177
01:12:55,000 --> 01:12:58,000
done in conjunction with each other, it could be around 44%.

1178
01:12:59,000 --> 01:13:03,615
so I think if I had to answer the question
of what are the benefits for laguna hills

1179
01:13:03,615 --> 01:13:04,000
is that

1180
01:13:07,000 --> 01:13:12,379
believe it or not, the traffic study shows
that more than half of the traffic stays

1181
01:13:12,379 --> 01:13:14,000
on the laguna hills side.

1182
01:13:14,000 --> 01:13:19,068
but regardless, if we split traffic to the
two sets of ramps, it will improve those

1183
01:13:19,068 --> 01:13:22,000
intersections that are
on the laguna hills side.

1184
01:13:23,000 --> 01:13:28,000
it will help people get to the medical facilities on the laguna hills side quicker,

1185
01:13:29,000 --> 01:13:34,000
and it will help emergency responders and also provide potentially

1186
01:13:35,000 --> 01:13:38,000
more direct access or closer access to the village at laguna hills.

1187
01:13:39,000 --> 01:13:41,000
so those are some of the general benefits.

1188
01:13:42,000 --> 01:13:43,000
that sounds like everyone's made up their mind.

1189
01:13:44,000 --> 01:13:45,000
so I beg you to differ.

1190
01:13:45,000 --> 01:13:48,000
but I thank you for your presentation.

1191
01:13:48,000 --> 01:13:54,602
I think it was well done in at least laying
out the time frames and all the rest of

1192
01:13:54,602 --> 01:13:55,000
that.

1193
01:13:56,000 --> 01:14:01,000
and I will assume that it is an honest assessment

1194
01:14:02,000 --> 01:14:08,942
effort on the part of caltrans and
octa to be working to make a solution that

1195
01:14:08,942 --> 01:14:13,000
actually works for
people and not just trying

1196
01:14:13,000 --> 01:14:18,000
to ram something down a whole community's throat.

1197
01:14:19,000 --> 01:14:20,000
so thank you very much.

1198
01:14:21,000 --> 01:14:21,000
any other comments?

1199
01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:22,000
oh, yeah.

1200
01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:22,000
yes.

1201
01:14:23,000 --> 01:14:24,000
councilman wheeler.

1202
01:14:24,000 --> 01:14:25,000
yeah, no, I have another.

1203
01:14:25,000 --> 01:14:26,000
you inspired me.

1204
01:14:26,000 --> 01:14:28,000
it's okay.

1205
01:14:28,000 --> 01:14:29,000
it doesn't matter.

1206
01:14:29,000 --> 01:14:30,000
just not late for dinner, right?

1207
01:14:36,000 --> 01:14:41,913
to continue something don said, in one way
you look at this like 1a dumps the traffic

1208
01:14:41,913 --> 01:14:44,000
on the laguna side and 2 dumps

1209
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:49,405
it on lake forest side, either into our
shopping center or our area that we're

1210
01:14:49,405 --> 01:14:51,000
building or their area.

1211
01:14:52,000 --> 01:14:54,000
but the big difference is lake forest wants it.

1212
01:14:55,000 --> 01:15:00,000
they want it dumped in their area for the reason is they can use the money there to

1213
01:15:01,000 --> 01:15:04,000
rehab, you know, refurbish their area, which will help them a lot.

1214
01:15:05,000 --> 01:15:06,000
so that's the big difference.

1215
01:15:06,000 --> 01:15:06,000
they want it.

1216
01:15:09,000 --> 01:15:10,000
I got a question on one thing.

1217
01:15:10,000 --> 01:15:13,000
you said, I don't know who does your traffic studies.

1218
01:15:13,000 --> 01:15:16,000
I'm not a traffic expert, but I do know volumes and physics.

1219
01:15:17,000 --> 01:15:20,000
and how, if the traffic is not going to reduce,

1220
01:15:21,000 --> 01:15:25,000
so how could you possibly have a 35 to 40%
reduction in conjection when you have the

1221
01:15:25,000 --> 01:15:27,000
same amount of traffic
going in that area?

1222
01:15:27,000 --> 01:15:30,000
I mean, it goes the same place.

1223
01:15:30,000 --> 01:15:33,000
where's the reduction?

1224
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:38,141
councilmember wheeler, what that benefit
is coming from is the distribution of

1225
01:15:38,141 --> 01:15:40,000
traffic to different
intersections.

1226
01:15:41,000 --> 01:15:41,000
say that again, please.

1227
01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:46,193
the benefit, the traffic benefit, comes
from distributing the traffic that's

1228
01:15:46,193 --> 01:15:50,000
currently coming off at one location
and making a bunch of left turns

1229
01:15:50,000 --> 01:15:52,000
to different intersections.

1230
01:15:52,000 --> 01:15:55,000
so it's spreading the traffic volume.

1231
01:15:56,000 --> 01:15:59,816
well, yeah, but if you look at the map
there, okay, you've got two exits instead of

1232
01:15:59,816 --> 01:16:00,000
one.

1233
01:16:00,000 --> 01:16:03,000
okay, you spread it out, but it comes right back down del toro road.

1234
01:16:04,000 --> 01:16:07,215
so just because you split a river into
two sections, it's still going to come back

1235
01:16:07,215 --> 01:16:08,000
together at the end.

1236
01:16:08,000 --> 01:16:09,000
it doesn't reduce it at all.

1237
01:16:11,000 --> 01:16:16,134
it's, there's a difference in the flows of
traffic that would come north to el toro

1238
01:16:16,134 --> 01:16:17,000
and then come,

1239
01:16:18,000 --> 01:16:20,000
those that come around south of el toro.

1240
01:16:21,000 --> 01:16:26,894
so signal timing, lanes, turn lanes, number
of turn lanes, all of that's analyzed to

1241
01:16:26,894 --> 01:16:29,000
come up with the traffic flow.

1242
01:16:29,000 --> 01:16:30,000
I don't know what they're doing.

1243
01:16:30,000 --> 01:16:32,000
there's a thing called deconservation of mass in physics.

1244
01:16:32,000 --> 01:16:35,000
you have the same mass in that area and you're not changing it at all.

1245
01:16:36,000 --> 01:16:38,000
so I don't know what they're doing.

1246
01:16:38,000 --> 01:16:39,000
it's just, it's not possible.

1247
01:16:39,000 --> 01:16:43,382
the only alternative is if you divert some
of the traffic at the second exit down to

1248
01:16:43,382 --> 01:16:45,000
the left, down to the next one.

1249
01:16:45,000 --> 01:16:47,000
I forget the name of it.

1250
01:16:47,000 --> 01:16:48,000
los alisas, I believe it is.

1251
01:16:49,000 --> 01:16:51,795
and that's the option that our directors
has explained to you that you can do with

1252
01:16:51,795 --> 01:16:52,000
signs.

1253
01:16:53,000 --> 01:16:56,000
that would be the only way you'd reduce the congestion.

1254
01:16:56,000 --> 01:17:02,010
the second part, you said 50% of the
traffic that comes off that exit goes into

1255
01:17:02,010 --> 01:17:03,000
laguna hills?

1256
01:17:05,000 --> 01:17:06,000
I can't believe that at all.

1257
01:17:06,000 --> 01:17:10,278
we had to create years and years ago,
before I was even on the council, coming off

1258
01:17:10,278 --> 01:17:12,000
that first
southbound lane there,

1259
01:17:13,000 --> 01:17:17,000
there are three lanes going left over into lake forest.

1260
01:17:18,000 --> 01:17:19,000
three lanes.

1261
01:17:19,000 --> 01:17:21,000
only one goes straight and one to the right.

1262
01:17:22,000 --> 01:17:24,000
and we have no housing in there.

1263
01:17:24,000 --> 01:17:28,000
the people would go to maybe laguna woods, which is

1264
01:17:29,000 --> 01:17:30,000
I mean, they're retired mostly over there.

1265
01:17:30,000 --> 01:17:35,519
they don't have a whole lot of traffic
coming off freeway at dinner time or in the

1266
01:17:35,519 --> 01:17:37,000
morning going to work.

1267
01:17:38,000 --> 01:17:39,000
all the traffic goes to lake forest.

1268
01:17:39,000 --> 01:17:41,000
so the half of it goes into laguna hills.

1269
01:17:42,000 --> 01:17:44,000
again, I just can't believe that's a true number.

1270
01:17:45,000 --> 01:17:47,000
we wouldn't have three lanes going left if that were so.

1271
01:17:48,000 --> 01:17:49,000
we'd have equal lanes going both directions.

1272
01:17:50,000 --> 01:17:51,000
and that hasn't been that way for decades.

1273
01:17:53,000 --> 01:17:54,000
I don't know what you guys are doing.

1274
01:17:55,000 --> 01:17:56,000
it just doesn't make sense as it goes.

1275
01:17:57,000 --> 01:18:02,151
council member wheeler, the traffic study,
the existing traffic is based on traffic

1276
01:18:02,151 --> 01:18:06,000
counts and also data that's
used now in the industry from cell

1277
01:18:06,000 --> 01:18:08,000
phones and connected vehicles.

1278
01:18:08,000 --> 01:18:10,000
so there's about two sets of data.

1279
01:18:10,000 --> 01:18:13,000
there's counts and then, you know, other data that's fed in.

1280
01:18:13,000 --> 01:18:16,000
okay, perhaps you'd make those studies available to us.

1281
01:18:16,000 --> 01:18:17,000
we could look at them.

1282
01:18:17,000 --> 01:18:20,000
because maybe I'll learn something doing that, but it doesn't make sense to me.

1283
01:18:21,000 --> 01:18:21,000
okay.

1284
01:18:21,000 --> 01:18:22,000
last question right now.

1285
01:18:22,000 --> 01:18:24,000
you said you had discussed with maloon dyer.

1286
01:18:25,000 --> 01:18:26,000
what did you talk about?

1287
01:18:26,000 --> 01:18:27,000
what do they want?

1288
01:18:29,000 --> 01:18:38,000
councilmember ruler, I believe I said we have not had discussions as octa.

1289
01:18:38,000 --> 01:18:40,000
I thought you said you did have a conversation with us.

1290
01:18:40,000 --> 01:18:41,000
you haven't talked with them at all.

1291
01:18:41,000 --> 01:18:44,000
I think she said that, but she's correcting that, right?

1292
01:18:45,000 --> 01:18:45,000
okay, yep.

1293
01:18:46,000 --> 01:18:50,000
to be clear, octa has not had direct discussions with merlongaia.

1294
01:18:50,000 --> 01:18:51,000
okay, all right.

1295
01:18:51,000 --> 01:18:52,000
that's a good thing to clarify.

1296
01:18:52,000 --> 01:18:55,000
okay, so dave, this is going to be a fun one.

1297
01:18:55,000 --> 01:18:59,000
I couldn't agree with your observations anymore, okay?

1298
01:18:59,000 --> 01:19:00,000
how about that?

1299
01:19:02,000 --> 01:19:03,000
and we've both lived here a long time.

1300
01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:04,000
this is recorded, right?

1301
01:19:05,000 --> 01:19:05,000
yeah.

1302
01:19:06,000 --> 01:19:07,000
but erica, go ahead.

1303
01:19:07,000 --> 01:19:14,000
yeah, I just, unfortunately, I have to point out some facts that may not be very...

1304
01:19:16,000 --> 01:19:17,000
nice to hear right now.

1305
01:19:17,000 --> 01:19:20,000
so as I'm like thinking about this, let's just see.

1306
01:19:20,000 --> 01:19:30,406
I'm just looking this up we are a
pass-through city and if you look at the

1307
01:19:30,406 --> 01:19:38,000
populations so I'm just
pulling these populations very

1308
01:19:38,000 --> 01:19:44,000
quickly so we're a pass-through city for laguna woods

1309
01:19:45,000 --> 01:19:53,000
laguna beach, laguna negal, alisa viejo, and many times dana point.

1310
01:19:54,000 --> 01:19:59,000
so if you think about the populations across the street to the other cities,

1311
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:06,688
and you think about the population that
are coming through our cities, you have I

1312
01:20:06,688 --> 01:20:09,000
think alisa viejo is 49,000.

1313
01:20:10,000 --> 01:20:13,000
then you have the population of laguna negal that's 64,000.

1314
01:20:14,000 --> 01:20:19,451
and then you have the population of laguna
beach that's 23,000, and then you have

1315
01:20:19,451 --> 01:20:21,000
laguna woods at 17,000.

1316
01:20:23,000 --> 01:20:33,000
and that is why this is a very serious location, because it feeds the other cities.

1317
01:20:35,000 --> 01:20:39,315
we're bearing the weight for pass-through
traffic, and that's why it's a dangerous

1318
01:20:39,315 --> 01:20:40,000
intersection.

1319
01:20:41,000 --> 01:20:44,000
that's why everything, so it's not because of our population,

1320
01:20:45,000 --> 01:20:50,890
it's because cities like aliso viejo
doubled their population within the past few

1321
01:20:50,890 --> 01:20:53,000
years through land use deals.

1322
01:20:54,000 --> 01:20:55,000
and they've changed.

1323
01:20:55,000 --> 01:21:00,951
and what's happened is because aliso viejo,
we're bearing the burden because aliso

1324
01:21:00,951 --> 01:21:04,000
viejo just has increased
their population.

1325
01:21:05,000 --> 01:21:07,000
laguna niguel has increased their population.

1326
01:21:08,000 --> 01:21:10,000
we see a little bit with laguna woods.

1327
01:21:10,000 --> 01:21:14,388
laguna beach, I mean, they have increased
theirs a little bit, but we've seen a

1328
01:21:14,388 --> 01:21:17,000
doubling in population
recently in aliso viejo.

1329
01:21:18,000 --> 01:21:21,000
that doesn't happen without an infrastructure consequence.

1330
01:21:22,000 --> 01:21:26,000
and that infrastructure consequence is occurring with accidents.

1331
01:21:28,000 --> 01:21:32,593
and that's something that you can't
just say, well, you know, it's not going to

1332
01:21:32,593 --> 01:21:33,000
happen.

1333
01:21:33,000 --> 01:21:36,000
but those are the numbers that we're seeing.

1334
01:21:36,000 --> 01:21:42,000
so I'm just pointing out the reality of population increases, land use decisions,

1335
01:21:42,000 --> 01:21:46,211
decisions to increase the population
through these land use issues without

1336
01:21:46,211 --> 01:21:49,000
understanding the sheer
consequence that happens.

1337
01:21:49,000 --> 01:21:52,000
and we're encountering the sheer consequence today.

1338
01:21:53,000 --> 01:21:57,000
and this is the result of what's happened over the past 10 years in aliso.

1339
01:21:58,000 --> 01:22:01,000
just pointing that out thank you.

1340
01:22:01,000 --> 01:22:01,000
okay.

1341
01:22:01,000 --> 01:22:03,000
I just have one last officer.

1342
01:22:03,000 --> 01:22:03,000
are you done?

1343
01:22:03,000 --> 01:22:04,000
I'm sorry.

1344
01:22:04,000 --> 01:22:12,695
I didn't mean to interrupt you but I
will I will add to what you're saying erica

1345
01:22:12,695 --> 01:22:19,000
those very population gains
have affected oh so la paz and

1346
01:22:19,000 --> 01:22:29,000
alicia that's where those real numbers are hitting us big time.

1347
01:22:29,000 --> 01:22:33,000
65,000 on, I think, alicia alone.

1348
01:22:34,000 --> 01:22:36,000
and this is a chump change compared to that.

1349
01:22:37,000 --> 01:22:39,000
and yet, I don't understand this.

1350
01:22:40,000 --> 01:22:46,196
the last little note that I wanted to just
put out here is that the entitlement that

1351
01:22:46,196 --> 01:22:49,000
was given to merleau
and geyer in 2022

1352
01:22:51,000 --> 01:22:55,000
for what was the village of laguna hills at that time,

1353
01:22:56,000 --> 01:23:02,514
had more than 400,000 square feet of
class a office buildings that they were

1354
01:23:02,514 --> 01:23:08,000
expecting to do, two major
parking structures, and maybe 60,000,

1355
01:23:08,000 --> 01:23:12,000
70,000 square feet more in retail space.

1356
01:23:14,000 --> 01:23:19,204
and when we're talking about the numbers
that you guys have looked at and how they're

1357
01:23:19,204 --> 01:23:20,000
all affected,

1358
01:23:21,000 --> 01:23:28,000
are you using the impacts from that old entitlement?

1359
01:23:28,000 --> 01:23:35,000
or are you taking into consideration the
new entitlement, if it's granted, the final

1360
01:23:35,000 --> 01:23:38,000
copy of it, or
second reading of it?

1361
01:23:40,000 --> 01:23:44,000
and it is considerably less traffic.

1362
01:23:45,000 --> 01:23:46,000
considerably.

1363
01:23:47,000 --> 01:23:50,000
and yet, all the numbers that are supporting this

1364
01:23:51,000 --> 01:23:54,000
seemed to be going back to something that was completely different.

1365
01:23:55,000 --> 01:23:56,000
so I'm confused.

1366
01:23:57,000 --> 01:24:02,165
so mayor caskey the one this traffic study
was done it was back before it was back

1367
01:24:02,165 --> 01:24:05,000
during the time the
development plan included

1368
01:24:05,000 --> 01:24:10,510
the office buildings since then that has
changed I think in general the trips now

1369
01:24:10,510 --> 01:24:15,000
that are associated with the
revised development plan on the whole

1370
01:24:15,000 --> 01:24:21,694
or less as you say but the majority of
the traffic so that is that would be trips

1371
01:24:21,694 --> 01:24:25,000
associated with people
who are traveling

1372
01:24:25,000 --> 01:24:28,000
to and from the development, the uses on the development.

1373
01:24:28,000 --> 01:24:34,574
there also is a lot of traffic that is
coming from around the city, from the coast,

1374
01:24:34,574 --> 01:24:36,000
north, west, east.

1375
01:24:36,000 --> 01:24:42,113
there are trips, origins, and destinations
that are in addition to the village at

1376
01:24:42,113 --> 01:24:44,000
laguna hills development.

1377
01:24:44,000 --> 01:24:51,063
so that is a factor, definitely, but there
is traffic that is using the I-5 el toro

1378
01:24:51,063 --> 01:24:52,000
interchange

1379
01:24:53,000 --> 01:24:55,000
for a variety of trips in the area.

1380
01:24:55,000 --> 01:25:00,000
and you mentioned oso and alicia and la paz.

1381
01:25:01,000 --> 01:25:05,958
those interchanges were actually improved
as part of oct's measure m2 freeway program

1382
01:25:05,958 --> 01:25:08,000
and done with the
freeway widening.

1383
01:25:08,000 --> 01:25:12,000
so definitely needed and completed.

1384
01:25:12,000 --> 01:25:13,000
thank you.

1385
01:25:13,000 --> 01:25:13,000
appreciate that.

1386
01:25:14,000 --> 01:25:18,772
all right, so we'll bring this to a close
unless you had anything else you wanted to

1387
01:25:18,772 --> 01:25:19,000
add.

1388
01:25:20,000 --> 01:25:20,000
sorry.

1389
01:25:20,000 --> 01:25:21,000
one more thing.

1390
01:25:21,000 --> 01:25:22,000
sorry, erica.

1391
01:25:22,000 --> 01:25:26,000
okay, so also laguna beach is a very popular city,

1392
01:25:27,000 --> 01:25:32,000
and el toro feeds to a very popular destination city where people go to the beach.

1393
01:25:32,000 --> 01:25:34,000
okay, that's one comment.

1394
01:25:34,000 --> 01:25:41,448
and then I also wanted to say why doesn't
octa get involved with all of the arena

1395
01:25:41,448 --> 01:25:42,000
events

1396
01:25:43,000 --> 01:25:45,000
land use issues that could create a lot of weight.

1397
01:25:46,000 --> 01:25:53,132
so, for example, why isn't there some sort
of check where cities have to check with

1398
01:25:53,132 --> 01:25:57,000
octa to see if it's even
possible to increase

1399
01:25:57,000 --> 01:26:00,000
the population and the burden that it could create?

1400
01:26:01,000 --> 01:26:06,752
I mean, it seems like we're not discussing
these very important issues, and octa is

1401
01:26:06,752 --> 01:26:08,000
encountering this.

1402
01:26:08,000 --> 01:26:09,000
this is what you're doing.

1403
01:26:09,000 --> 01:26:13,077
you're chasing after all of these
entitlements and all of these build-outs, and

1404
01:26:13,077 --> 01:26:17,000
there's so many consequences that are
happening, but no one's communicating.

1405
01:26:18,000 --> 01:26:21,000
maybe some of these projects that have been passed, there's been five in our city,

1406
01:26:21,000 --> 01:26:24,000
and in the newspapers you read all these other ones.

1407
01:26:25,000 --> 01:26:30,696
why isn't it there's a law that states you
have to go through a cta first to see if

1408
01:26:30,696 --> 01:26:32,000
it's even possible?

1409
01:26:33,000 --> 01:26:37,990
to bear that burden, just out of curiosity
why we're not having these communications

1410
01:26:37,990 --> 01:26:39,000
on a state level.

1411
01:26:41,000 --> 01:26:46,000
so cta being a transportation agency, we
are part of the scag, or southern california

1412
01:26:46,000 --> 01:26:48,000
association of
governments region.

1413
01:26:48,000 --> 01:26:51,000
they do the land use planning, all of the land use plans,

1414
01:26:53,000 --> 01:26:55,000
general plans and so forth feed into that.

1415
01:26:55,000 --> 01:27:01,036
we use all that information in our traffic
model to determine how much traffic will

1416
01:27:01,036 --> 01:27:03,000
there be in a certain area.

1417
01:27:03,000 --> 01:27:07,471
and then when there are developments
that are released for environmental public

1418
01:27:07,471 --> 01:27:09,000
review, generally speaking,

1419
01:27:09,000 --> 01:27:13,588
we get that as octa to comment on what
are the traffic impacts, what are other

1420
01:27:13,588 --> 01:27:16,000
impacts associated
with that development.

1421
01:27:18,000 --> 01:27:19,000
thank you.

1422
01:27:20,000 --> 01:27:21,000
thank you for your presentation.

1423
01:27:22,000 --> 01:27:26,100
mayor caskey, what I would say is thank
you very much for this opportunity to talk

1424
01:27:26,100 --> 01:27:27,000
about the project,

1425
01:27:27,000 --> 01:27:30,872
and I would just say that we are committed,
octa and caltrans are committed to

1426
01:27:30,872 --> 01:27:34,000
working towards a solution
that's beneficial for both projects.

1427
01:27:34,000 --> 01:27:35,000
I hope so.

1428
01:27:35,000 --> 01:27:36,000
we're working on it together.

1429
01:27:38,000 --> 01:27:39,000
all right.

1430
01:27:39,000 --> 01:27:45,000
so we're going to move on here.

1431
01:27:46,000 --> 01:27:50,000
I do want to move another item forward, but what I am going to do

1432
01:27:53,000 --> 01:27:58,133
actually go ahead with the schedule of
future events and also public comments but

1433
01:27:58,133 --> 01:28:02,000
before the consent calendar
we're going to move on to another

1434
01:28:02,000 --> 01:28:11,000
item and move it up so with that we'll go on to schedule of future events

1435
01:28:12,000 --> 01:28:13,000
thank you, mayor caskey.

1436
01:28:13,000 --> 01:28:16,000
mayor caskey, members of the city council, and members of the public.

1437
01:28:16,000 --> 01:28:20,000
the city council and planning agency will next meet on tuesday, september 8th.

1438
01:28:20,000 --> 01:28:22,000
the meeting will begin at 6 p.m.

1439
01:28:22,000 --> 01:28:23,000
here in the council chambers.

1440
01:28:24,000 --> 01:28:28,199
the events, communication, and beautification
committee regular meeting will be held

1441
01:28:28,199 --> 01:28:30,000
on monday, september
14th at 10 a.m.

1442
01:28:30,000 --> 01:28:31,000
in the admin conference room.

1443
01:28:31,000 --> 01:28:35,510
the traffic commission will have their
regular meeting on wednesday, september 16th

1444
01:28:35,510 --> 01:28:36,000
at 6 p.m.

1445
01:28:36,000 --> 01:28:37,000
also here in the council chambers.

1446
01:28:38,000 --> 01:28:40,000
moving to community activities and events.

1447
01:28:41,000 --> 01:28:44,208
the pacific symphony will be returning
to laguna hills tomorrow night for our

1448
01:28:44,208 --> 01:28:46,000
symphony on the go
performance at 6.30 p.m.

1449
01:28:46,000 --> 01:28:47,000
at cabot park.

1450
01:28:48,000 --> 01:28:50,000
parking is available along rapid falls drive.

1451
01:28:51,000 --> 01:28:55,392
the next day we have an excursion and will
be traveling to ramona for their annual

1452
01:28:55,392 --> 01:28:57,000
rodeo at the fred grand arena.

1453
01:28:58,000 --> 01:29:01,672
kicking off the weekend on friday, august
28th, we will be going to culver city for

1454
01:29:01,672 --> 01:29:03,000
their annual fiesta la bayona.

1455
01:29:04,000 --> 01:29:07,000
then on sunday, august 30th, we will be going to l.a.

1456
01:29:07,000 --> 01:29:09,000
for a tour of the academy museum.

1457
01:29:10,000 --> 01:29:13,818
later that week we have an excursion to the
laguna art museum on thursday, september

1458
01:29:13,818 --> 01:29:14,000
3rd.

1459
01:29:15,000 --> 01:29:19,505
that same day, we will be hosting orange
county library's meet the author event at

1460
01:29:19,505 --> 01:29:20,000
6.30 p.m.

1461
01:29:20,000 --> 01:29:24,219
in the heritage room, where award-winning
author tess gerritsen will be talking about

1462
01:29:24,219 --> 01:29:27,000
her latest book and series
that is in development for tv

1463
01:29:27,000 --> 01:29:28,000
with amazon studios.

1464
01:29:29,000 --> 01:29:32,608
on friday, august 4th, we have another
excursion and we'll be heading to orange for

1465
01:29:32,608 --> 01:29:34,000
their international street fair.

1466
01:29:35,000 --> 01:29:40,423
the next day, we will be on the road
again, but this time for an excursion along

1467
01:29:40,423 --> 01:29:43,000
route 66 from santa
monica to barstow.

1468
01:29:44,000 --> 01:29:47,428
finally, we have our always popular sold-out
excursion to the getty villa on sunday,

1469
01:29:47,428 --> 01:29:48,000
september 6th.

1470
01:29:49,000 --> 01:29:52,762
as a reminder, city facilities will be
closed on monday, september 7th in an

1471
01:29:52,762 --> 01:29:54,000
observation of labor day.

1472
01:29:55,000 --> 01:29:58,888
our next community event will be our second
annual harvest in the hills on saturday,

1473
01:29:58,888 --> 01:30:00,000
october 10th from 4 p.m.

1474
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:01,000
to 6 p.m.

1475
01:30:01,000 --> 01:30:02,000
on the town green of the community center.

1476
01:30:03,000 --> 01:30:06,940
it will be a family-friendly evening
of fall fun with crafts, face painting,

1477
01:30:06,940 --> 01:30:10,000
community partners, a pie-eating
contest, and a magic show.

1478
01:30:10,000 --> 01:30:13,000
that concludes my report, and I'm happy to answer any questions.

1479
01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:14,000
thank you very much.

1480
01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:15,000
any questions?

1481
01:30:16,000 --> 01:30:17,000
ok.

1482
01:30:18,000 --> 01:30:20,000
so with that, we're going to move on to public comments.

1483
01:30:21,000 --> 01:30:26,125
this is a time to address the city council
on any matter not listed on this agenda

1484
01:30:26,125 --> 01:30:29,000
that is within the
subject matter jurisdiction

1485
01:30:29,000 --> 01:30:30,000
of the city council.

1486
01:30:31,000 --> 01:30:33,000
public comments are limited to three minutes per person.

1487
01:30:34,000 --> 01:30:42,000
and I'm going to open that up to city clerk and ask if there are any public comments.

1488
01:30:43,000 --> 01:30:46,000
yes, there is, there is one in person, yining wang.

1489
01:31:08,000 --> 01:31:12,000
good evening, mayor and member of the city council.

1490
01:31:12,000 --> 01:31:13,000
I'm here again.

1491
01:31:13,000 --> 01:31:13,000
thank you.

1492
01:31:14,000 --> 01:31:18,308
so my name is yi-ning wang, and I'm the
owner of the dealer massage and facial in

1493
01:31:18,308 --> 01:31:19,000
laguna hills.

1494
01:31:20,000 --> 01:31:23,000
so thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak again today.

1495
01:31:23,000 --> 01:31:30,000
I'm here to start talking my expansion for my current next bar.

1496
01:31:31,000 --> 01:31:32,000
so, okay.

1497
01:31:35,000 --> 01:31:42,601
so I'm here to respectfully to ask for your
approval to expansion into my next doors,

1498
01:31:42,601 --> 01:31:46,000
1600 square feet
for current business.

1499
01:31:46,000 --> 01:31:49,000
so first, I want to make one thing very clear.

1500
01:31:51,000 --> 01:31:55,000
the expansion is not for more massage rooms.

1501
01:31:58,000 --> 01:32:04,000
we will keep our non-massage rooms exactly at the same, nothing change.

1502
01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:08,000
so the new space will be only using for facial and skin care service.

1503
01:32:11,000 --> 01:32:16,460
so every facial room, we will have its
own sink to meet california healthy and

1504
01:32:16,460 --> 01:32:18,000
licensed requirements.

1505
01:32:19,000 --> 01:32:24,000
when we opened, we only had one facial room.

1506
01:32:24,000 --> 01:32:27,000
it wasn't enough, but we have almost three years.

1507
01:32:29,000 --> 01:32:30,000
not enough anymore.

1508
01:32:30,000 --> 01:32:36,352
sometimes we have customers waiting for
one hour to have the service because we're

1509
01:32:36,352 --> 01:32:41,000
using the facial room and the
massage room together and then

1510
01:32:41,000 --> 01:32:45,000
we have some other massage room we have to use for facial room.

1511
01:32:45,000 --> 01:32:50,000
we have to go outside to grab the water for the customers to clean their facial.

1512
01:32:50,000 --> 01:32:53,000
it's very unprofessional.

1513
01:32:54,000 --> 01:32:59,000
so we want to, my next door, they move out, we want to for

1514
01:33:02,000 --> 01:33:03,000
only for facial.

1515
01:33:04,000 --> 01:33:08,602
I promise, only for facial, not massage,
because we already have nine rooms, it's

1516
01:33:08,602 --> 01:33:09,000
enough.

1517
01:33:09,000 --> 01:33:12,000
it is already enough, just one new room for facial.

1518
01:33:12,000 --> 01:33:19,000
so we have more than 400 reviews online from the yelp and then google.

1519
01:33:20,000 --> 01:33:20,000
it is 4.9.

1520
01:33:21,000 --> 01:33:27,000
it is really hard to get a 4.9 from the reviews from the yelp.

1521
01:33:30,000 --> 01:33:32,000
we always follow city and state laws.

1522
01:33:33,000 --> 01:33:36,000
the city check us for every four months.

1523
01:33:37,000 --> 01:33:41,000
everything we follow the city and state laws.

1524
01:33:44,000 --> 01:33:47,000
I'm not asking to become a different business.

1525
01:33:49,000 --> 01:33:53,000
we simply want to be better service to our existing customer.

1526
01:33:54,000 --> 01:33:59,000
and create more local jobs, and then continue serving in the laguna community.

1527
01:34:00,000 --> 01:34:05,076
and we respectfully ask your support,
and thank you so much for your time and

1528
01:34:05,076 --> 01:34:06,000
consideration.

1529
01:34:07,000 --> 01:34:09,000
I'm happy to answer any question.

1530
01:34:09,000 --> 01:34:12,000
all right, do we have any questions?

1531
01:34:13,000 --> 01:34:14,000
clarifications?

1532
01:34:14,000 --> 01:34:14,000
erica.

1533
01:34:15,000 --> 01:34:23,000
yes, I'm wondering, were you able to speak with staff since the last time you came?

1534
01:34:24,000 --> 01:34:24,000
yeah, I came.

1535
01:34:26,000 --> 01:34:35,333
city manager bob, he called me, so he say,
I'm not really understanding for the city

1536
01:34:35,333 --> 01:34:39,000
law and the
attorney what they...

1537
01:34:41,000 --> 01:34:45,000
because we expansion just for facial rooms, not for massage.

1538
01:34:46,000 --> 01:34:47,000
it's only for facial.

1539
01:34:48,000 --> 01:34:49,000
mr.

1540
01:34:49,000 --> 01:34:51,000
burns, can you comment on that?

1541
01:34:55,000 --> 01:35:00,419
I'm not familiar with the specifics of what
the applicant has done, but normally you

1542
01:35:00,419 --> 01:35:03,000
would submit an
application to planning,

1543
01:35:03,000 --> 01:35:07,112
and if there was disagreement of what the
planning director's determination was, then

1544
01:35:07,112 --> 01:35:09,000
you can appeal
that up to likely the...

1545
01:35:10,000 --> 01:35:11,000
likely the council.

1546
01:35:12,000 --> 01:35:15,000
at this point, we don't really have an item before us to act on.

1547
01:35:15,000 --> 01:35:18,000
this is just a public comment on an unscheduled matter.

1548
01:35:19,000 --> 01:35:23,271
so I'm sure that staff would be happy to
discuss the process with you after and help

1549
01:35:23,271 --> 01:35:25,000
you out with some
of the logistics

1550
01:35:25,000 --> 01:35:28,000
of how to go through the process of getting an opinion.

1551
01:35:28,000 --> 01:35:33,000
but at this point, there's just nothing on the agenda for the council to decide on.

1552
01:35:34,000 --> 01:35:40,165
I know because I don't know what is this
for or continue for one year or two year or

1553
01:35:40,165 --> 01:35:42,000
how long because the next

1554
01:35:42,000 --> 01:35:44,000
door is not forever there, you know.

1555
01:35:44,000 --> 01:35:45,000
it's opportunity for me.

1556
01:35:48,000 --> 01:35:52,000
is it possible to request that you work with staff?

1557
01:35:52,000 --> 01:35:58,239
yeah, I think this is something where
public comments are usually when you come up

1558
01:35:58,239 --> 01:35:59,000
and you're

1559
01:35:59,000 --> 01:36:00,000
making a comment to us.

1560
01:36:00,000 --> 01:36:05,000
it's not an agendized item, so it's nothing we can act on as a council.

1561
01:36:05,000 --> 01:36:10,000
so what I would suggest you do, and you're getting it from two other directions here,

1562
01:36:11,000 --> 01:36:17,149
is that you work directly with staff who
might be able to work with you based upon

1563
01:36:17,149 --> 01:36:20,000
your comment and
see what we can do to

1564
01:36:21,000 --> 01:36:23,000
help you resolve your issues.

1565
01:36:24,000 --> 01:36:26,000
I don't know where I can find who can help me to...

1566
01:36:29,000 --> 01:36:35,553
continue this one I'll remind my colleagues
they already had an application that was

1567
01:36:35,553 --> 01:36:40,000
part of a previous meeting
right to expand their location

1568
01:36:41,000 --> 01:36:45,000
so they've already worked with city staff it just so happens at that very moment.

1569
01:36:46,000 --> 01:36:52,890
we passed the ban on massage establishment,
so they've already had one bite at the

1570
01:36:52,890 --> 01:36:56,000
apple and so unless
you're willing to

1571
01:36:58,000 --> 01:36:59,000
deal with the ban.

1572
01:36:59,000 --> 01:37:05,352
I don't know that there's much anybody can
do is well this is my question if it is a

1573
01:37:05,352 --> 01:37:08,000
legitimate business
that isn't like

1574
01:37:08,000 --> 01:37:13,000
the ones characterized is there a way to?

1575
01:37:13,000 --> 01:37:16,000
make an exception during this time.

1576
01:37:16,000 --> 01:37:16,000
mr.

1577
01:37:17,000 --> 01:37:17,000
burns.

1578
01:37:18,000 --> 01:37:25,114
I'm you know what area I would I would
suggest is that that you work with staff and

1579
01:37:25,114 --> 01:37:27,000
if if it comes back to

1580
01:37:28,000 --> 01:37:33,000
from your side that we should agendize this and come back in a deeper way,

1581
01:37:34,000 --> 01:37:37,000
then I would think that that's a better way of doing it.

1582
01:37:37,000 --> 01:37:40,000
there's nothing that we can particularly do tonight.

1583
01:37:41,000 --> 01:37:46,517
so I think whether we're going to kick
it down or take it up to another level is

1584
01:37:46,517 --> 01:37:49,000
something that I
think needs to come

1585
01:37:49,000 --> 01:37:53,000
through a process that we have no ability to do.

1586
01:37:54,000 --> 01:37:57,000
between us and you during public comments.

1587
01:37:58,000 --> 01:37:59,000
I'm a little bit confused.

1588
01:37:59,000 --> 01:38:00,000
I have one question.

1589
01:38:00,000 --> 01:38:03,000
because the city, I think her name is jennifer.

1590
01:38:03,000 --> 01:38:07,000
she's saying no because she talked to the city attorney.

1591
01:38:07,000 --> 01:38:12,000
and then they say, because I have an existing business, it's called massage.

1592
01:38:12,000 --> 01:38:15,000
but I also, when I open, I have the facial, too.

1593
01:38:17,000 --> 01:38:21,641
in the beginning, I have the facial and
the massage, but the city just gave me the

1594
01:38:21,641 --> 01:38:23,000
massage for the license.

1595
01:38:24,000 --> 01:38:24,000
right.

1596
01:38:24,000 --> 01:38:27,000
we're not equipped to deal with that tonight.

1597
01:38:27,000 --> 01:38:28,000
okay.

1598
01:38:28,000 --> 01:38:31,000
I understand what you're saying, and we're taking it in.

1599
01:38:32,000 --> 01:38:37,297
we're making a suggestion that we work with
you, and if it's something that needs to

1600
01:38:37,297 --> 01:38:39,000
come back to the council...

1601
01:38:40,000 --> 01:38:43,000
in a larger way, then we will agendize it.

1602
01:38:44,000 --> 01:38:47,000
but we can't do anything with it right now, right here and now.

1603
01:38:49,000 --> 01:38:58,052
so when I can get my answer for next month
or next week, I don't want to wait forever,

1604
01:38:58,052 --> 01:38:59,000
you know.

1605
01:38:59,000 --> 01:38:59,000
all right.

1606
01:38:59,000 --> 01:39:04,000
well, I'm going to have to bring it to a close here because it's been, you know,

1607
01:39:05,000 --> 01:39:10,000
I think hopefully we can work with you on that, okay?

1608
01:39:10,000 --> 01:39:10,000
don, if I might.

1609
01:39:10,000 --> 01:39:11,000
okay.

1610
01:39:11,000 --> 01:39:12,000
yes, go ahead.

1611
01:39:12,000 --> 01:39:14,000
excuse me, ma'am.

1612
01:39:14,000 --> 01:39:16,000
if you speak with ms.

1613
01:39:16,000 --> 01:39:17,000
lowe over here at the end afterward.

1614
01:39:19,000 --> 01:39:20,000
she can take care of it.

1615
01:39:20,000 --> 01:39:20,000
she handles that stuff.

1616
01:39:21,000 --> 01:39:21,000
okay.

1617
01:39:22,000 --> 01:39:24,000
thank you.

1618
01:39:24,000 --> 01:39:25,000
she's very nice.

1619
01:39:26,000 --> 01:39:26,000
thank you.

1620
01:39:27,000 --> 01:39:27,000
all right.

1621
01:39:27,000 --> 01:39:28,000
thank you.

1622
01:39:29,000 --> 01:39:29,000
all right.

1623
01:39:30,000 --> 01:39:33,000
any online public comments or anything else?

1624
01:39:33,000 --> 01:39:34,000
not this time.

1625
01:39:34,000 --> 01:39:35,000
all right.

1626
01:39:35,000 --> 01:39:38,000
so now what I'm going to do is we're moving things around a little bit.

1627
01:39:39,000 --> 01:39:45,583
I am going to move to item 5.2, report
by the assistant manager, assistant city

1628
01:39:45,583 --> 01:39:47,000
manager, and I...

1629
01:39:49,000 --> 01:39:51,000
doing that partly because there are a lot of people here.

1630
01:39:51,000 --> 01:39:56,579
I see kids in the audience, and I think
it's courteous to let's let's get onto this

1631
01:39:56,579 --> 01:39:59,000
and especially if
we have some folks

1632
01:39:59,000 --> 01:40:04,000
who'd like to speak on that let's get it out of the way so 5.2,

1633
01:40:05,000 --> 01:40:10,000
and I'm going to move to joanne's assistant city manager

1634
01:40:11,000 --> 01:40:12,000
thank you, mr.

1635
01:40:12,000 --> 01:40:12,000
mayor.

1636
01:40:13,000 --> 01:40:14,000
yes.

1637
01:40:15,000 --> 01:40:15,290
item

1638
01:40:15,290 --> 01:40:21,472
5.2.1 is review of petitions received
regarding establishment of proposed residential

1639
01:40:21,472 --> 01:40:27,000
permit parking districts for the
streets listed on the screen in the subject

1640
01:40:27,000 --> 01:40:27,000
line.

1641
01:40:28,000 --> 01:40:28,000
next slide, please.

1642
01:40:30,000 --> 01:40:35,000
so by way of background, at the march 18th traffic commission regular meeting,

1643
01:40:35,000 --> 01:40:40,736
city staff made a presentation regarding
requests received by the city from residents

1644
01:40:40,736 --> 01:40:46,000
desiring the establishment of a residential
permit parking district that would

1645
01:40:46,000 --> 01:40:49,433
prohibit overnight parking on streets
near beckenham park, camberwell street,

1646
01:40:49,433 --> 01:40:53,000
beckenham street, and in the sunset place
neighborhood without a parking permit.

1647
01:40:53,000 --> 01:40:54,000
next slide, please.

1648
01:40:56,000 --> 01:41:00,191
as a reminder, to designate a neighborhood
as a permit parking area within the city

1649
01:41:00,191 --> 01:41:01,000
of laguna hills,

1650
01:41:01,000 --> 01:41:05,167
the laguna hills municipal code requires
that a city create a petition form be

1651
01:41:05,167 --> 01:41:08,000
submitted to the city with
the signatures of at least

1652
01:41:08,000 --> 01:41:12,000
67% of the property owners supporting the proposed permit parking area.

1653
01:41:14,000 --> 01:41:18,557
so residents residing on or near campbell
street as well as in the sunset place

1654
01:41:18,557 --> 01:41:23,000
neighborhood described undesirable
quality of life issues due to non-resident

1655
01:41:23,000 --> 01:41:27,303
vehicle parking and lack of enforceable
street sweeping as a basis for requesting the

1656
01:41:27,303 --> 01:41:31,000
establishment of a residential
permit parking district next slide, please

1657
01:41:32,000 --> 01:41:35,000
so then during the march 18th traffic commission meeting,

1658
01:41:35,000 --> 01:41:39,457
residents residing on or near camberwell
street as well as in the sunset place

1659
01:41:39,457 --> 01:41:43,000
neighborhood described those
issues to the traffic commission.

1660
01:41:44,000 --> 01:41:46,000
and there was a discussion also how, over time,

1661
01:41:46,000 --> 01:41:50,295
the establishment of nearby residential
permit parking districts resulted in more

1662
01:41:50,295 --> 01:41:53,000
parked vehicles being
displaced onto those streets,

1663
01:41:54,000 --> 01:41:58,000
presumably as a result of the lack of
available parking at or adjacent to nearby

1664
01:41:58,000 --> 01:41:59,000
multifamily housing.

1665
01:41:59,000 --> 01:42:00,000
next slide, please.

1666
01:42:01,000 --> 01:42:07,528
so currently we have existing permit parking
on the yellow streets shown on the map

1667
01:42:07,528 --> 01:42:08,000
above.

1668
01:42:09,000 --> 01:42:15,375
and then the purple line and red line, or
the purple line was actually added recently

1669
01:42:15,375 --> 01:42:18,000
by the city council
for no parking,

1670
01:42:18,000 --> 01:42:20,000
overnight parking around beckenham park.

1671
01:42:20,000 --> 01:42:21,000
next slide please.

1672
01:42:22,000 --> 01:42:28,000
so in response to those comments at that traffic commission meeting,

1673
01:42:28,000 --> 01:42:33,354
the traffic commission recommended that
city staff send out petition forms to those

1674
01:42:33,354 --> 01:42:34,000
residents.

1675
01:42:35,000 --> 01:42:37,894
and then the traffic commission also
recommended the establishment of that no

1676
01:42:37,894 --> 01:42:40,000
overnight parking on streets
adjacent to beckenham park.

1677
01:42:41,000 --> 01:42:44,774
and on the side of the street closest
to the park, and the establishment of no

1678
01:42:44,774 --> 01:42:47,000
overnight park on the
south side of beckenham,

1679
01:42:47,000 --> 01:42:49,000
extending from acacia lane to wilkes place.

1680
01:42:49,000 --> 01:42:51,000
that's the purple line on the previous slide.

1681
01:42:51,000 --> 01:42:52,000
next slide, please.

1682
01:42:56,000 --> 01:42:57,000
next slide.

1683
01:42:58,000 --> 01:43:03,928
so at the april 14th meeting, the city
council passed the purple line, no overnight

1684
01:43:03,928 --> 01:43:06,000
parking adjacent to the park.

1685
01:43:07,000 --> 01:43:12,000
and those parking restrictions were implemented by city staff shortly thereafter.

1686
01:43:12,000 --> 01:43:13,000
next slide, please.

1687
01:43:15,000 --> 01:43:21,254
and then so the petitions that the traffic
commission recommended that we send out

1688
01:43:21,254 --> 01:43:24,000
covered the streets
shown in orange.

1689
01:43:24,000 --> 01:43:31,000
we sent out a total of 308 petition ballot forms, is what we're calling them,

1690
01:43:31,000 --> 01:43:36,310
that would allow for residents to either
individually return interest in permit

1691
01:43:36,310 --> 01:43:39,000
parking or could
canvass for signatures.

1692
01:43:42,000 --> 01:43:43,000
the orange and red looks very close.

1693
01:43:44,000 --> 01:43:45,000
is the red just that one little line?

1694
01:43:45,000 --> 01:43:47,000
yeah, the red is just that tiny little line.

1695
01:43:48,000 --> 01:43:49,000
most of it's orange on the screen.

1696
01:43:49,000 --> 01:43:50,000
thank you.

1697
01:43:50,000 --> 01:43:50,000
next slide, please.

1698
01:43:52,000 --> 01:43:58,720
and then so more particularly, the blue
areas are the parcels where the ballots were

1699
01:43:58,720 --> 01:44:02,000
sent out to, and the
red area already has

1700
01:44:03,000 --> 01:44:09,000
existing permit parking no overnight parking without a parking permit next slide,

1701
01:44:09,000 --> 01:44:15,168
please so on june 9th related mayor pro
tem mathis and councilman wheeler requested

1702
01:44:15,168 --> 01:44:20,000
city staff returns to a future
city council meeting with a report

1703
01:44:20,000 --> 01:44:24,190
discussing parking and street sweeping issues
and also request the city staff look at

1704
01:44:24,190 --> 01:44:27,000
it allowing overnight parking
on the south side of laguna

1705
01:44:27,000 --> 01:44:28,000
hills drive next slide, please

1706
01:44:29,000 --> 01:44:35,000
and then june 15th, we mailed out the ballot petitions to those 308 property owners.

1707
01:44:35,000 --> 01:44:39,000
the deadline for receipt of those petitions was 5 p.m.

1708
01:44:39,000 --> 01:44:39,000
on july 15th.

1709
01:44:39,000 --> 01:44:42,000
next slide, please.

1710
01:44:43,000 --> 01:44:46,750
june 23rd, I provided a comprehensive
presentation on parking and street sweeping

1711
01:44:46,750 --> 01:44:48,000
issues to the city council.

1712
01:44:49,000 --> 01:44:52,671
and specific to solving the parking issues
near beckenham park, camberwell street,

1713
01:44:52,671 --> 01:44:55,000
beckenham street, and the
sunset place neighborhood,

1714
01:44:55,000 --> 01:45:00,006
city staff also recommended allowing parking
on the south side of laguna hills drive

1715
01:45:00,006 --> 01:45:04,000
between indian hill lane and
pasadena valencia in order to decrease

1716
01:45:04,000 --> 01:45:08,000
the number of vehicles parked in or near the above neighborhoods.

1717
01:45:08,000 --> 01:45:09,000
next slide, please.

1718
01:45:10,000 --> 01:45:13,000
so the blue line is what was just

1719
01:45:17,000 --> 01:45:22,753
passed by resolution by the city council
and it was recently implemented with marked

1720
01:45:22,753 --> 01:45:27,000
parking stalls on the street
and the residential the residents

1721
01:45:28,000 --> 01:45:33,971
and residing in the nearby apartment
complexes were notified of that new parking on

1722
01:45:33,971 --> 01:45:38,000
the street by their management
company next slide please

1723
01:45:39,000 --> 01:45:44,129
and so, yes, the city council adopted that
resolution, and those parking spaces were

1724
01:45:44,129 --> 01:45:47,000
striped, signed, and
available as of july 14th.

1725
01:45:47,000 --> 01:45:47,000
next slide, please.

1726
01:45:48,000 --> 01:45:54,384
so on july 15th, the traffic commission
reviewed the results of the ballot petition

1727
01:45:54,384 --> 01:45:55,000
process.

1728
01:45:56,000 --> 01:45:59,000
so I've taken this in two parts here.

1729
01:45:59,000 --> 01:46:03,184
we had the sunset place neighborhood,
and then we had the neighborhood around

1730
01:46:03,184 --> 01:46:04,000
beckenham park.

1731
01:46:05,000 --> 01:46:06,000
the sunset place neighborhood,

1732
01:46:07,000 --> 01:46:15,052
based upon the return of signatures, 39
of 68 residences indicated that they wanted

1733
01:46:15,052 --> 01:46:20,000
permit parking, which was
only a 57% approval rate.

1734
01:46:21,000 --> 01:46:25,576
my observation was, based upon the ballots
returned, that people in the outer portion

1735
01:46:25,576 --> 01:46:28,000
of the circle generally
wanted it, but in the

1736
01:46:28,000 --> 01:46:31,000
inner portion of the circle generally did not return anything.

1737
01:46:31,000 --> 01:46:32,000
signed petitions.

1738
01:46:32,000 --> 01:46:33,000
next slide, please.

1739
01:46:34,000 --> 01:46:38,719
so regarding camberwell street, hinton
street, calle carmel, villa balboa, avenida

1740
01:46:38,719 --> 01:46:42,000
avalon, luzon, casto, salford,
derby circle, york circle,

1741
01:46:43,000 --> 01:46:46,590
the city staff reviewed those results
also with the traffic commission, and the

1742
01:46:46,590 --> 01:46:49,000
traffic commission received
comments from the public,

1743
01:46:50,000 --> 01:46:54,253
including comments from one resident who
indicated wilks across from the park should

1744
01:46:54,253 --> 01:46:58,000
be included in any permit parking
district because the surrounding streets

1745
01:46:59,000 --> 01:47:03,397
had supermajority interest in permit parking
and but based on the results available

1746
01:47:03,397 --> 01:47:07,000
at the time the traffic commission
recommended a limit some of those

1747
01:47:07,000 --> 01:47:11,961
denoted in combination for map which
is attached to tonight's agenda report I'll

1748
01:47:11,961 --> 01:47:15,000
review that momentarily
and what that means well,

1749
01:47:15,000 --> 01:47:23,000
I take a swig of water here excuse me microphone for that however

1750
01:47:24,000 --> 01:47:28,609
after the traffic commission meeting, city
staff received eight more signatures that

1751
01:47:28,609 --> 01:47:33,000
were postmarked the day before the traffic
commission meeting that didn't arrive

1752
01:47:33,000 --> 01:47:35,000
until after the traffic commission meeting.

1753
01:47:35,000 --> 01:47:39,000
we consider those submissions to be timely due to the postmarked date.

1754
01:47:40,000 --> 01:47:43,000
therefore, the final results of the ballot petition process are as follows.

1755
01:47:44,000 --> 01:47:50,300
and this was also the subject of the
revision I made to you today regarding a hot

1756
01:47:50,300 --> 01:47:51,000
envelope.

1757
01:47:52,000 --> 01:47:59,262
making sure these numbers were notated
correctly for the agenda report so these are

1758
01:47:59,262 --> 01:48:06,000
the results based upon those eight
additional signatures and so unfortunately

1759
01:48:06,000 --> 01:48:09,516
there are fortunately or unfortunately
it's just an observation that some of the

1760
01:48:09,516 --> 01:48:10,000
streets are

1761
01:48:11,000 --> 01:48:17,631
I have a clear supermajority wishing to
participate in permit parking, and some fell

1762
01:48:17,631 --> 01:48:20,000
well short of a supermajority.

1763
01:48:21,000 --> 01:48:26,915
and so if you take it in total, you've got
approximately 48 percent of the residents

1764
01:48:26,915 --> 01:48:31,000
collectively among all those
streets wanted to participate

1765
01:48:31,000 --> 01:48:32,000
in permit parking.

1766
01:48:33,000 --> 01:48:34,000
next slide, please.

1767
01:48:35,000 --> 01:48:39,273
and so while the ballot petitions received
did not allow for all streets to be

1768
01:48:39,273 --> 01:48:43,000
included in the proposed residential
permit parking district because

1769
01:48:43,000 --> 01:48:46,000
the area as a whole did not reach the threshold,

1770
01:48:46,000 --> 01:48:49,733
there are several streets or portions
of streets where the majority of residents

1771
01:48:49,733 --> 01:48:53,000
desire permit parking, and I'm
calling them majority interest streets.

1772
01:48:53,000 --> 01:48:57,000
and some of these streets are contiguous with one another such that a logical,

1773
01:48:57,000 --> 01:49:02,204
clearly defined boundary could be implemented
for permit parking if so desired by the

1774
01:49:02,204 --> 01:49:03,000
city council.

1775
01:49:03,000 --> 01:49:06,968
additionally, because the percentage of
some majority interest rates are much higher

1776
01:49:06,968 --> 01:49:09,000
than 67%, as you saw
in the previous slide,

1777
01:49:09,000 --> 01:49:14,354
you can combine it with lower percentage
streets where you can still reach that 67%

1778
01:49:14,354 --> 01:49:15,000
threshold.

1779
01:49:16,000 --> 01:49:16,000
next slide, please.

1780
01:49:17,000 --> 01:49:21,000
and so there are different combinations and permutations about how that can be done.

1781
01:49:21,000 --> 01:49:26,000
and so our assistant engineer, samantha vu,

1782
01:49:26,000 --> 01:49:31,106
I went through the painful exercise of
going through all of those different ways

1783
01:49:31,106 --> 01:49:35,000
where you can reach 67% by
putting other different consiguous

1784
01:49:35,000 --> 01:49:36,000
street segments.

1785
01:49:37,000 --> 01:49:40,000
and so I'm going to show them to you right now.

1786
01:49:40,000 --> 01:49:41,000
next slide, please.

1787
01:49:42,000 --> 01:49:44,000
so combination one.

1788
01:49:46,000 --> 01:49:50,000
the yellow shows the existing permit parking areas that exist today.

1789
01:49:51,000 --> 01:49:58,495
the streets in green were generally
those streets or segments of streets that

1790
01:49:58,495 --> 01:50:02,000
returned ballot
petitions above 67%.

1791
01:50:03,000 --> 01:50:08,187
and then generally speaking, residents on
hendon street west of camberwell and east

1792
01:50:08,187 --> 01:50:09,000
of camberwell

1793
01:50:10,000 --> 01:50:15,000
returned a significant number of petitions, but short of 67%.

1794
01:50:17,000 --> 01:50:21,726
and the folks on hendon street, where
the knuckle occurs going south to costeau

1795
01:50:21,726 --> 01:50:24,000
street, had very
little participation.

1796
01:50:25,000 --> 01:50:26,000
it's not exactly shown on this slide.

1797
01:50:27,000 --> 01:50:32,444
but our assistant engineer is showing that
if you wanted to include all of the light

1798
01:50:32,444 --> 01:50:34,000
blue properties in here,

1799
01:50:34,000 --> 01:50:41,000
you would still, on a combination or a total basis, have a supermajority,

1800
01:50:41,000 --> 01:50:49,000
and you would have continuous street sign in this scenario for permit parking.

1801
01:50:50,000 --> 01:50:50,000
next slide, please.

1802
01:50:51,000 --> 01:50:52,000
so here's combination two.

1803
01:50:53,000 --> 01:50:57,000
the difference between this combination and the prior combination is that

1804
01:50:57,000 --> 01:51:02,579
the four properties across from beckenham
park on wilkes, it's actually wilkes, not

1805
01:51:02,579 --> 01:51:05,000
camberwell, it's
wilkes right there,

1806
01:51:06,000 --> 01:51:09,326
where one of the residents said that they
really wanted to be included in the permit

1807
01:51:09,326 --> 01:51:10,000
parking district.

1808
01:51:10,000 --> 01:51:15,463
that wouldn't be included in favor of having
additional properties on avenida avalon

1809
01:51:15,463 --> 01:51:18,000
and the cul-de-sac
be included in that.

1810
01:51:19,000 --> 01:51:20,000
underneath that combination.

1811
01:51:20,000 --> 01:51:25,000
that total represents 68% threshold being met.

1812
01:51:25,000 --> 01:51:26,000
next slide, please.

1813
01:51:27,000 --> 01:51:34,024
combination three is just shown for illustrative
purposes about how if a derby circle

1814
01:51:34,024 --> 01:51:37,000
were included,
what that looks like.

1815
01:51:37,000 --> 01:51:42,478
however, only 50% of the residents on derby
circle requested participation in permit

1816
01:51:42,478 --> 01:51:43,000
parking.

1817
01:51:43,000 --> 01:51:44,000
next slide, please.

1818
01:51:45,000 --> 01:51:47,000
and then we have combination four.

1819
01:51:47,000 --> 01:51:51,020
this is closest to what the traffic commission
at the time recommended without having

1820
01:51:51,020 --> 01:51:54,000
the benefit of the additional
information of the eight ballots,

1821
01:51:54,000 --> 01:51:59,008
which were principally submitted by people
on villa balboa, avenida avalon, and the

1822
01:51:59,008 --> 01:52:01,000
western portion
of hendon street.

1823
01:52:03,000 --> 01:52:05,000
and so this is combination four.

1824
01:52:05,000 --> 01:52:07,000
and then fifth combination.

1825
01:52:09,000 --> 01:52:16,401
next slide please is this combination
here which also allows for continuous

1826
01:52:16,401 --> 01:52:24,000
continuous permit parking along hendon
street as a whole but at the sacrifice

1827
01:52:24,000 --> 01:52:27,000
of the four residential properties across from beckenham park

1828
01:52:29,000 --> 01:52:31,000
so those are the five combinations that we were able to come up with.

1829
01:52:32,000 --> 01:52:37,833
a 66.7%, some would argue is not 67%, however
you could also argue that you can round

1830
01:52:37,833 --> 01:52:39,000
up, I don't know.

1831
01:52:39,000 --> 01:52:40,000
I'll let you guys decide that.

1832
01:52:40,000 --> 01:52:41,000
next slide please.

1833
01:52:42,000 --> 01:52:47,310
so again, while combination four was a
good choice based upon the information

1834
01:52:47,310 --> 01:52:48,000
available,

1835
01:52:49,000 --> 01:52:51,000
to the traffic commission at the july 15th meeting.

1836
01:52:53,000 --> 01:52:57,800
with the addition of eight additional ballot
petitions being cast, a larger group of

1837
01:52:57,800 --> 01:53:01,000
properties can now be included
closer to beckenham park.

1838
01:53:02,000 --> 01:53:08,428
therefore, city staff would prefer or suggest
that maybe a combination of one or five

1839
01:53:08,428 --> 01:53:11,000
be considered by
the city council.

1840
01:53:12,000 --> 01:53:16,048
especially in light of the fact that salford
street, york circle, derby circle, and

1841
01:53:16,048 --> 01:53:18,000
costeau street, south
of salford street,

1842
01:53:19,000 --> 01:53:23,000
return ballot petitions at much lower rates than the other street segments.

1843
01:53:24,000 --> 01:53:27,511
and so it's my recommendation against
including any of those residences in that

1844
01:53:27,511 --> 01:53:30,000
permit parking district based
upon this new information.

1845
01:53:30,000 --> 01:53:32,000
next slide, please.

1846
01:53:33,000 --> 01:53:34,000
and so I'm going to leave it.

1847
01:53:35,000 --> 01:53:39,189
city council to choose one of the boundaries
for permit parking and then if you

1848
01:53:39,189 --> 01:53:42,000
provide any direction on
permit parking to city staff

1849
01:53:44,000 --> 01:53:48,579
I would be I would be prepared to return
to city council september 8th with the

1850
01:53:48,579 --> 01:53:52,000
assistance of our city attorney
and implementing resolution

1851
01:53:52,000 --> 01:53:56,120
and couldn't do that at this point tonight
because I need a direction on that first

1852
01:53:56,120 --> 01:53:59,000
and of course any proposed
permit parking district require

1853
01:53:59,000 --> 01:54:03,000
a permit to park on the street between the hours of 10 p.m.

1854
01:54:03,000 --> 01:54:03,000
and 6 a.m.

1855
01:54:04,000 --> 01:54:08,698
as currently envisioned and would include
a street sweeping parking restriction for

1856
01:54:08,698 --> 01:54:13,000
the days and hours of street sweeping
that concludes my presentation at this

1857
01:54:13,000 --> 01:54:20,000
point in time happy to answer any questions okay

1858
01:54:21,000 --> 01:54:22,000
thank you very much.

1859
01:54:23,000 --> 01:54:25,000
and that was quite extensive.

1860
01:54:28,000 --> 01:54:32,000
so I will start with public comments.

1861
01:54:33,000 --> 01:54:38,330
and I ask the city clerk if we have any
public comments in person or online on this

1862
01:54:38,330 --> 01:54:40,000
particular agendized item.

1863
01:54:41,000 --> 01:54:43,000
we have one in person, curtis van buskirk.

1864
01:54:59,000 --> 01:55:04,000
good evening, mayor caskey, mayor pro tem mathis, council.

1865
01:55:05,000 --> 01:55:08,000
really appreciate the opportunity to speak in front of you again.

1866
01:55:08,000 --> 01:55:12,000
this, as you can imagine, has been quite the journey.

1867
01:55:13,000 --> 01:55:17,277
it taught me a lot about public service
and everything that you guys do, so I

1868
01:55:17,277 --> 01:55:19,000
appreciate, first and foremost,

1869
01:55:19,000 --> 01:55:22,000
taking the time to listen through everything that we've gone through.

1870
01:55:23,000 --> 01:55:29,000
this is a year and a half effort at this point, and I'm excited to see that

1871
01:55:29,000 --> 01:55:35,000
we have what seems to be a pretty fruitful solution to come forward.

1872
01:55:37,000 --> 01:55:41,199
I also want to recognize the great effort
by city staff that went through a diligent

1873
01:55:41,199 --> 01:55:42,000
process in this.

1874
01:55:43,000 --> 01:55:44,000
it was very exhaustive, I understand.

1875
01:55:45,000 --> 01:55:46,000
there's a lot that goes into this.

1876
01:55:47,000 --> 01:55:50,000
it's not simply just sending out a ballot and getting responses back.

1877
01:55:52,000 --> 01:55:53,000
I reviewed the packet ahead of time.

1878
01:55:54,000 --> 01:56:01,000
I agree with assistant city manager joe ames on option five.

1879
01:56:01,000 --> 01:56:08,172
I think that offers the most comprehensive
district for what we would consider a

1880
01:56:08,172 --> 01:56:14,000
geography or logistical area that
would encompass the area that's

1881
01:56:14,000 --> 01:56:16,000
most experiencing the issues today.

1882
01:56:17,000 --> 01:56:20,000
there's two things I'd like to add.

1883
01:56:21,000 --> 01:56:29,067
one, if you go back to option five and
you look at where wilkes, camberwell, and

1884
01:56:29,067 --> 01:56:33,000
costeau tee off,
there is one resident,

1885
01:56:33,000 --> 01:56:38,372
and I think assistant manager ames did
bring this up, was adamant about being

1886
01:56:38,372 --> 01:56:39,000
included.

1887
01:56:40,000 --> 01:56:46,000
in this petition because their frontage effectively is right at the t, and

1888
01:56:46,000 --> 01:56:51,000
they do experience a lot of the parking in front of their home as well.

1889
01:56:52,000 --> 01:56:57,000
it's kind of considered this no man's land to some extent in this little geography.

1890
01:56:58,000 --> 01:57:02,819
I recognize that maybe the other three
residences, most of which actually are rental

1891
01:57:02,819 --> 01:57:05,000
properties and
long-term living cares,

1892
01:57:06,000 --> 01:57:09,000
that did not respond to the petition who live in those homes today.

1893
01:57:11,000 --> 01:57:15,000
the second item, and I know this is a big ask, but I

1894
01:57:15,000 --> 01:57:20,558
want to recognize the fact that a lot of
the pushback we received from our residents

1895
01:57:20,558 --> 01:57:24,000
in the neighborhood was
the cost associated to this.

1896
01:57:25,000 --> 01:57:28,000
so a component of this, or at least a consideration,

1897
01:57:28,000 --> 01:57:33,780
is to consider not charging for these
permits for those that have lived in this

1898
01:57:33,780 --> 01:57:37,000
neighborhood, that
have lived here for many,

1899
01:57:37,000 --> 01:57:42,068
many years with a peaceful neighborhood
not having to deal with this previously and

1900
01:57:42,068 --> 01:57:45,000
only are trying to solve
for a solution that was

1901
01:57:45,000 --> 01:57:50,000
recently evident by the overflow parking from the apartments.

1902
01:57:51,000 --> 01:57:55,000
I will tell you thank you for making those adjustments on laguna hills drive.

1903
01:57:55,000 --> 01:57:58,000
that did ease some, did not ease enough though.

1904
01:57:58,000 --> 01:58:03,000
there is still a pretty extensive parking on the opposite side of the park there.

1905
01:58:04,000 --> 01:58:04,000
I'll...

1906
01:58:06,000 --> 01:58:06,000
I'll wrap up here.

1907
01:58:08,000 --> 01:58:14,000
finally, I just want to impress upon council staff to work with expediency.

1908
01:58:15,000 --> 01:58:20,409
as I had mentioned, a year and a half has
now gone by, and we have gone time and time

1909
01:58:20,409 --> 01:58:22,000
again making phone calls.

1910
01:58:23,000 --> 01:58:26,000
there's cd activity.

1911
01:58:27,000 --> 01:58:32,543
my daughter, my wife, all will wake up at
the wee hours of the morning from someone's

1912
01:58:32,543 --> 01:58:33,000
exhaust

1913
01:58:34,000 --> 01:58:37,000
system you know your old car alarm.

1914
01:58:37,000 --> 01:58:42,062
that's going off in the middle of the
night we we have just a myriad of different

1915
01:58:42,062 --> 01:58:45,000
issues with garbage and
trash and I for all the

1916
01:58:45,000 --> 01:58:49,905
reasons I presented in my original you
know presentation to council I just want to

1917
01:58:49,905 --> 01:58:52,000
work with some
level of expediency,

1918
01:58:52,000 --> 01:58:58,115
so I appreciate the opportunity to speak
to the group here thanks for bringing your

1919
01:58:58,115 --> 01:58:59,000
whole family

1920
01:58:59,000 --> 01:59:01,000
it wasn't a choice.

1921
01:59:04,000 --> 01:59:08,000
there was only parents allowed at open house tonight, so we had to divide and conquer.

1922
01:59:08,000 --> 01:59:09,000
okay.

1923
01:59:09,000 --> 01:59:13,000
I just wondered if any of them need to speak on this subject.

1924
01:59:13,000 --> 01:59:15,000
yeah, that little one right there.

1925
01:59:16,000 --> 01:59:17,000
or maybe just go to bed.

1926
01:59:17,000 --> 01:59:19,000
yeah.

1927
01:59:19,000 --> 01:59:19,000
okay.

1928
01:59:19,000 --> 01:59:20,000
so any questions?

1929
01:59:21,000 --> 01:59:23,000
go ahead.

1930
01:59:23,000 --> 01:59:24,000
dave, you had a question?

1931
01:59:24,000 --> 01:59:25,000
just one question.

1932
01:59:25,000 --> 01:59:26,000
which option do you prefer?

1933
01:59:28,000 --> 01:59:30,000
option five was the one I preferred.

1934
01:59:30,000 --> 01:59:30,000
thank you.

1935
01:59:32,000 --> 01:59:34,000
any other questions for speakers?

1936
01:59:34,000 --> 01:59:34,000
yes, I do.

1937
01:59:34,000 --> 01:59:35,000
okay.

1938
01:59:36,000 --> 01:59:39,681
so just to be clear, option five, but
what you're asking for, well, there was two

1939
01:59:39,681 --> 01:59:40,000
things,

1940
01:59:40,000 --> 01:59:46,189
but just in specific to extension of the
permit, there's four properties across from

1941
01:59:46,189 --> 01:59:47,000
beckingham.

1942
01:59:47,000 --> 01:59:48,000
yes.

1943
01:59:48,000 --> 01:59:50,000
you would want those included in five?

1944
01:59:50,000 --> 01:59:51,000
ideally, yes.

1945
01:59:51,000 --> 01:59:51,000
right.

1946
01:59:52,000 --> 01:59:56,598
I recognize that there's some level of
supermajority or, you know, maybe it's, you

1947
01:59:56,598 --> 01:59:58,000
know, a factor, but yeah.

1948
01:59:59,000 --> 01:59:59,000
but, well...

1949
02:00:00,000 --> 02:00:02,000
yeah, I'll save my commentary for later.

1950
02:00:02,000 --> 02:00:05,000
but, yeah, I just wanted to be very clear.

1951
02:00:05,000 --> 02:00:07,000
yes, yes, that would be the ideal outcome.

1952
02:00:07,000 --> 02:00:09,000
okay, thank you.

1953
02:00:10,000 --> 02:00:10,000
okay.

1954
02:00:10,000 --> 02:00:11,000
thank you.

1955
02:00:12,000 --> 02:00:14,000
so, thank you very much.

1956
02:00:14,000 --> 02:00:15,000
thank you.

1957
02:00:16,000 --> 02:00:24,000
I'm going to go next to questions of our assistant city manager in that very, very...

1958
02:00:26,000 --> 02:00:31,000
inclusive report anybody have any questions or clarifications of that?

1959
02:00:35,000 --> 02:00:39,725
sure yeah, go ahead sure thank you mayor
well first of all before we start on the

1960
02:00:39,725 --> 02:00:42,000
questions I want to
thank the residents

1961
02:00:43,000 --> 02:00:47,240
for coming out first and foremost because
you guys have been the one out there ones

1962
02:00:47,240 --> 02:00:50,000
out there communicating
with the neighbors you've been

1963
02:00:50,000 --> 02:00:51,000
going through the whole process.

1964
02:00:51,000 --> 02:00:55,000
you've been doing this for a year and a half like you said at least and

1965
02:00:55,000 --> 02:00:58,000
and just continuing to advocate for a solution.

1966
02:00:58,000 --> 02:01:01,000
you've been to the traffic commission meetings, you've been here,

1967
02:01:02,000 --> 02:01:08,222
and it's a significant amount of work that
you have put in to a genuine problem that

1968
02:01:08,222 --> 02:01:12,000
has been involving safety,
access, street sweeping,

1969
02:01:13,000 --> 02:01:16,199
and the quality of life, like you mentioned,
being woken up in the middle of the

1970
02:01:16,199 --> 02:01:17,000
night several times.

1971
02:01:19,000 --> 02:01:23,000
but I also want to recognize the chair of our traffic commission, scott miller, for

1972
02:01:23,000 --> 02:01:27,741
also jumping in and being very proactive
and working in conjunction with council and

1973
02:01:27,741 --> 02:01:30,000
the traffic commission
and you guys too.

1974
02:01:30,000 --> 02:01:35,481
so you guys have all been a collaborative
effort, but really appreciate everybody

1975
02:01:35,481 --> 02:01:39,000
coming out and really
doing this first and foremost.

1976
02:01:40,000 --> 02:01:47,000
for joe, real quickly, the overall number in the staff report is 113 petitions.

1977
02:01:49,000 --> 02:01:51,000
from 238 properties.

1978
02:01:52,000 --> 02:01:59,904
so what I want to make sure is that we give
that percentage overall context because

1979
02:01:59,904 --> 02:02:02,000
like curtis mentioned,

1980
02:02:02,000 --> 02:02:04,000
some of the petitions that were not

1981
02:02:05,000 --> 02:02:09,882
returned it's hard to count them mathematically
because the neighborhood includes a

1982
02:02:09,882 --> 02:02:14,000
lot of owner occupied homes so we
have rental properties with absentee

1983
02:02:14,000 --> 02:02:14,000
owners.

1984
02:02:15,000 --> 02:02:19,864
there's homes operated as residential
care senior care businesses so those those

1985
02:02:19,864 --> 02:02:24,000
different circumstances significantly
affect whether the petition or

1986
02:02:24,000 --> 02:02:27,966
reached the appropriate person or whether
the person understood the neighborhood

1987
02:02:27,966 --> 02:02:30,000
impact and whether
response was returned.

1988
02:02:32,000 --> 02:02:35,000
so among the residents who live in the neighborhood,

1989
02:02:35,000 --> 02:02:41,545
I want to see if we're able to pull some
sort of report to see how many of those

1990
02:02:41,545 --> 02:02:44,000
homes are either like a senior

1991
02:02:44,000 --> 02:02:45,000
care home or rental property.

1992
02:02:45,000 --> 02:02:49,000
are we able to parse that out of the petitions at all?

1993
02:02:50,000 --> 02:02:55,308
no, unfortunately, I don't have that didn't
have that information available the the

1994
02:02:55,308 --> 02:03:00,488
ordinance the city's ordinance requires
that the supermajority to return from the

1995
02:03:00,488 --> 02:03:01,000
property

1996
02:03:01,000 --> 02:03:07,666
owners yeah, and so it doesn't recognize
unfortunately if a neighborhood is mostly

1997
02:03:07,666 --> 02:03:11,000
renter occupied versus
homeowner occupied

1998
02:03:12,000 --> 02:03:21,411
the the city since those ballot petitions
to the property owner address for that

1999
02:03:21,411 --> 02:03:28,000
reason hoping that the folks
would receive them but also

2000
02:03:28,000 --> 02:03:32,612
that the word around in the neighborhood
would would get around and for some of these

2001
02:03:32,612 --> 02:03:35,000
folks who are interested
in the same program

2002
02:03:35,000 --> 02:03:39,000
to also contact their landlords to effectuate that.

2003
02:03:39,000 --> 02:03:43,722
in terms of like group homes and that kind
of thing, I can understand potentially why

2004
02:03:43,722 --> 02:03:46,000
that would be a whole
different scenario,

2005
02:03:46,000 --> 02:03:50,000
but the city's ordinance doesn't really reflect any part of that.

2006
02:03:50,000 --> 02:03:53,716
yeah, so there's several of those, and I
just want to make sure that that's brought

2007
02:03:53,716 --> 02:03:56,000
into consideration tonight
as well because a lot of

2008
02:03:56,000 --> 02:04:01,000
that never, the votes never came back because of those reasons.

2009
02:04:01,000 --> 02:04:05,811
so when we look at the actual homeowners
that live in the area that aren't rental

2010
02:04:05,811 --> 02:04:07,000
properties and such,

2011
02:04:08,000 --> 02:04:12,000
I would say probably close to 90% of them actually, you know,

2012
02:04:13,000 --> 02:04:17,146
responded so it's a it's a big variance
there and that would be the only reason why I

2013
02:04:17,146 --> 02:04:19,000
would say that some
of the percentages

2014
02:04:19,000 --> 02:04:28,566
were we're not matching so and with a super
majority requirement I think that that

2015
02:04:28,566 --> 02:04:33,000
has to be that has
to be front of mine

2016
02:04:37,000 --> 02:04:43,081
for you joe I appreciate everything
because, again, I know you went through

2017
02:04:43,081 --> 02:04:49,000
painstaking amounts of back and
forth and trying to figure out how to get

2018
02:04:49,000 --> 02:04:50,000
this.

2019
02:04:50,000 --> 02:04:55,000
but there's a couple things that we need to also look at.

2020
02:04:56,000 --> 02:04:57,000
curtis also mentioned it.

2021
02:04:57,000 --> 02:04:59,000
laguna hills drive was great.

2022
02:05:00,000 --> 02:05:04,507
and opening up that south side definitely
was a pressure relief valve for some of the

2023
02:05:04,507 --> 02:05:07,000
parking but it didn't
alleviate all the parking

2024
02:05:07,000 --> 02:05:12,299
so I just want to see if if in the next
meeting if we can bring back opening that

2025
02:05:12,299 --> 02:05:14,000
north side of laguna hills

2026
02:05:14,000 --> 02:05:19,751
drive and adding some more spaces over there
as well so then we would have both south

2027
02:05:19,751 --> 02:05:23,000
and north on laguna
hills drive as a possibility

2028
02:05:23,000 --> 02:05:26,000
to alleviate some of that parking if that's possible

2029
02:05:28,000 --> 02:05:33,000
and is that something we can bring forward next time?

2030
02:05:35,000 --> 02:05:38,000
it would be helpful if I got a second from one of your colleagues on that.

2031
02:05:39,000 --> 02:05:40,000
okay.

2032
02:05:40,000 --> 02:05:45,413
can I get a second on looking at the north
side of laguna hills drive being open to

2033
02:05:45,413 --> 02:05:46,000
partners?

2034
02:05:46,000 --> 02:05:48,000
we're still in questions and clarifications.

2035
02:05:48,000 --> 02:05:48,000
yeah.

2036
02:05:51,000 --> 02:05:55,000
I mean, we've got other people who maybe just have questions at this point.

2037
02:05:55,000 --> 02:05:56,000
sure.

2038
02:05:56,000 --> 02:06:00,000
yeah, so we'll get to that then, and we'll do it in a minute.

2039
02:06:01,000 --> 02:06:01,000
so thank you.

2040
02:06:02,000 --> 02:06:07,653
now, I also wanted to bring up the permit
costs because before we discuss who should

2041
02:06:07,653 --> 02:06:09,000
pay for the permits,

2042
02:06:10,000 --> 02:06:15,000
I know there's a lot of math that went on behind the scenes for you, but the

2043
02:06:15,000 --> 02:06:19,101
report states that the program has
approximately thirty two thousand five hundred

2044
02:06:19,101 --> 02:06:23,000
dollars in annual fixed costs plus
seventeen dollars and fifty cents for each

2045
02:06:23,000 --> 02:06:27,295
permit and at roughly fifteen hundred
permits for the whole city that produces a

2046
02:06:27,295 --> 02:06:31,000
total annual cost of approximately
fifty eight thousand seven hundred

2047
02:06:31,000 --> 02:06:38,800
fifty dollars and so the city would collect
absorb the remaining twenty one thousand

2048
02:06:38,800 --> 02:06:44,000
two hundred fifty dollars is
that kind of how that would

2049
02:06:44,000 --> 02:06:44,000
work in?

2050
02:06:48,000 --> 02:06:49,000
in terms of the math on that?

2051
02:06:51,000 --> 02:07:00,316
so the number that's missing there is the,
what we would absorb in that is the loss

2052
02:07:00,316 --> 02:07:02,000
of the revenue.

2053
02:07:02,000 --> 02:07:06,000
and so the revenue is the difference between the two.

2054
02:07:06,000 --> 02:07:07,000
so it would be the,

2055
02:07:09,000 --> 02:07:14,533
the program, the way it's currently structured
and will be rolled out is the 58,750

2056
02:07:14,533 --> 02:07:15,000
number.

2057
02:07:16,000 --> 02:07:22,000
and then the net cost was 21,250 after, if 1,500 permits were issued.

2058
02:07:23,000 --> 02:07:27,000
so that difference is approximately, is that 37,500?

2059
02:07:29,000 --> 02:07:30,000
sorry, that's not the right number.

2060
02:07:30,000 --> 02:07:30,000
I'm sorry.

2061
02:07:30,000 --> 02:07:32,000
I'm going to do the quick math here.

2062
02:07:41,000 --> 02:07:51,710
so the additional cost of waiving permit
parking fees as a whole based upon 1,500

2063
02:07:51,710 --> 02:07:57,000
permits issued per
year would be$37,500.

2064
02:07:57,000 --> 02:07:57,000
okay.

2065
02:08:00,000 --> 02:08:04,000
and just so we're clear, and for the record, that's talking about the whole city.

2066
02:08:04,000 --> 02:08:05,000
this isn't just this neighborhood.

2067
02:08:05,000 --> 02:08:07,000
this is the complete city.

2068
02:08:07,000 --> 02:08:10,000
so I want to make sure that that's clear for everybody.

2069
02:08:10,000 --> 02:08:16,000
I don't have an exact number on how many permits would be issued in this area.

2070
02:08:16,000 --> 02:08:22,000
combination 5 map has 102 residential properties that are slated for participation.

2071
02:08:22,000 --> 02:08:28,000
city staff generally estimates that two to three permits would be issued per address.

2072
02:08:29,000 --> 02:08:32,254
I won't know exactly how many people actually
want to buy permits until the program

2073
02:08:32,254 --> 02:08:33,000
actually rolls out.

2074
02:08:34,000 --> 02:08:35,000
that's just a general average.

2075
02:08:36,000 --> 02:08:37,000
okay, very good.

2076
02:08:38,000 --> 02:08:40,000
and, yeah, that's...

2077
02:08:43,000 --> 02:08:49,000
legitimate there the other thing I want
to bring up is the street sweeping and ask

2078
02:08:49,000 --> 02:08:52,000
you a question on
that because the street

2079
02:08:52,000 --> 02:08:56,671
sweeping becomes part of the overnight
parking but we need to pay attention that

2080
02:08:56,671 --> 02:09:00,000
schedule and it's been brought
to my attention by several

2081
02:09:00,000 --> 02:09:04,141
residences and that a lot of them have
either high school kids or college-age kids

2082
02:09:04,141 --> 02:09:05,000
that are driving,

2083
02:09:06,000 --> 02:09:10,673
and it's hard to move the cars completely
out of the neighborhood on those

2084
02:09:10,673 --> 02:09:12,000
street-sweeping days.

2085
02:09:12,000 --> 02:09:16,000
so if we could devise and, you know, between now and the next meeting,

2086
02:09:16,000 --> 02:09:20,358
look at a schedule where we could do one
side of the street maybe on one of the weeks

2087
02:09:20,358 --> 02:09:22,000
and the other side of the street

2088
02:09:22,000 --> 02:09:24,000
on the other week so that we're able to

2089
02:09:24,000 --> 02:09:28,165
flip flop so that they can just move to the
other side of the street then that would

2090
02:09:28,165 --> 02:09:30,000
be extremely helpful
for a lot of the

2091
02:09:30,000 --> 02:09:37,553
families in the neighborhood as well
yeah, and I know that there's a lot of

2092
02:09:37,553 --> 02:09:44,000
considerations with everything
on that so I appreciate that okay

2093
02:09:45,000 --> 02:09:46,000
that's all the questions that now.

2094
02:09:46,000 --> 02:09:50,358
thank you so I'm going to try to take this
back to less in deliberations and a little

2095
02:09:50,358 --> 02:09:52,000
bit more make sure everyone's in

2096
02:09:52,000 --> 02:09:57,000
got their questions and clarifications basically answered.

2097
02:09:57,000 --> 02:09:59,000
erica, you were next on the docket.

2098
02:09:59,000 --> 02:10:04,000
do you have any questions or clarifications, or are we ready to move on to?

2099
02:10:05,000 --> 02:10:06,000
we have one other person who wants to.

2100
02:10:06,000 --> 02:10:08,000
okay.

2101
02:10:08,000 --> 02:10:10,000
so I have some concerns.

2102
02:10:10,000 --> 02:10:17,000
so if you look at this whole map, so it seems like a good, I mean,

2103
02:10:17,000 --> 02:10:20,000
so you have the existing permit parking is in the yellow.

2104
02:10:21,000 --> 02:10:23,000
then you have the streets above 67.

2105
02:10:23,000 --> 02:10:27,000
and then there's also a strong interest in the potential combinations.

2106
02:10:28,000 --> 02:10:35,569
so what I am really concerned about is
that you're going to have a strong movement

2107
02:10:35,569 --> 02:10:40,000
that the traffic's going
to explode on the other

2108
02:10:40,000 --> 02:10:40,000
streets.

2109
02:10:41,000 --> 02:10:46,980
and I'm wondering, can the city council
supersede and just put permit parking

2110
02:10:46,980 --> 02:10:49,000
throughout that whole area

2111
02:10:49,000 --> 02:10:55,046
just so that it alleviates a potential problem
and the chasing after, because this is,

2112
02:10:55,046 --> 02:10:58,000
what's happened is
one street does it, the

2113
02:10:59,000 --> 02:11:00,000
other one does it, the other one.

2114
02:11:00,000 --> 02:11:01,000
I think you're talking about whack-a-mole.

2115
02:11:02,000 --> 02:11:03,000
yes.

2116
02:11:03,000 --> 02:11:09,000
so as a question, joe, can you answer that?

2117
02:11:10,000 --> 02:11:15,000
I mean, the question was, can the city council just override this thing and...

2118
02:11:17,000 --> 02:11:19,000
and do a much more blanket approach.

2119
02:11:19,000 --> 02:11:20,000
yes.

2120
02:11:20,000 --> 02:11:21,000
yes, I'm staring at you, mr.

2121
02:11:22,000 --> 02:11:22,000
city attorney.

2122
02:11:24,000 --> 02:11:27,915
if you have any input on what the city
council can and cannot do regarding an

2123
02:11:27,915 --> 02:11:30,000
ordinance that's on
the books and what it

2124
02:11:30,000 --> 02:11:33,000
says, I'd appreciate some insight into that.

2125
02:11:33,000 --> 02:11:35,000
yeah, I mean, you could take that action.

2126
02:11:35,000 --> 02:11:36,000
you just have to change your ordinance.

2127
02:11:37,000 --> 02:11:38,000
okay.

2128
02:11:39,000 --> 02:11:43,000
so did you have any other questions or clarifications?

2129
02:11:43,000 --> 02:11:44,000
because there's one other.

2130
02:11:44,000 --> 02:11:49,543
so changing an ordinance, we'd have to put
that on the agenda, and then we'd have to,

2131
02:11:49,543 --> 02:11:50,000
are you

2132
02:11:50,000 --> 02:11:55,543
saying that that's the process versus trying
to solve a huge problem that is about to

2133
02:11:55,543 --> 02:11:56,000
happen,

2134
02:11:56,000 --> 02:12:02,640
a wave of unhappy individuals that they're
going to all of a sudden see the parking

2135
02:12:02,640 --> 02:12:04,000
on their streets?

2136
02:12:06,000 --> 02:12:08,833
councilmember, the ordinance is currently
written, says that to establish a district,

2137
02:12:08,833 --> 02:12:10,000
we have to go
through this process.

2138
02:12:11,000 --> 02:12:13,000
so if we wanted to do something different, we would have to change the ordinance.

2139
02:12:14,000 --> 02:12:15,000
okay.

2140
02:12:16,000 --> 02:12:17,000
you've answered the question.

2141
02:12:17,000 --> 02:12:18,000
okay.

2142
02:12:19,000 --> 02:12:20,000
and sure.

2143
02:12:20,000 --> 02:12:21,000
oh, that was my question.

2144
02:12:22,000 --> 02:12:23,000
that was your question.

2145
02:12:23,000 --> 02:12:23,000
yeah.

2146
02:12:23,000 --> 02:12:24,000
there you go.

2147
02:12:24,000 --> 02:12:24,000
wow.

2148
02:12:25,000 --> 02:12:27,000
great minds think alike.

2149
02:12:27,000 --> 02:12:27,000
okay.

2150
02:12:28,000 --> 02:12:32,710
so that brings us fully around to, even
though I think we've been kind of discussing

2151
02:12:32,710 --> 02:12:34,000
it as we've gone along,

2152
02:12:36,000 --> 02:12:42,000
do we have any recommendations and or further discussion before we move ahead?

2153
02:12:43,000 --> 02:12:44,000
if I may mr.

2154
02:12:44,000 --> 02:12:50,955
mayor I have one more thought if the four
properties on wilkes across from beckoning

2155
02:12:50,955 --> 02:12:57,000
and park are important theoretically
you could consider and a combination

2156
02:12:57,000 --> 02:12:57,000
5a.

2157
02:12:57,000 --> 02:13:01,000
that's not on the screen here and just find four properties off of

2158
02:13:02,000 --> 02:13:08,710
for instance, henden or somewhere else that
would allow you to change that to include

2159
02:13:08,710 --> 02:13:11,000
those four to keep it at 67%.

2160
02:13:12,000 --> 02:13:16,000
but it would be that might be difficult.

2161
02:13:16,000 --> 02:13:19,000
so just a thought.

2162
02:13:19,000 --> 02:13:20,000
okay.

2163
02:13:22,000 --> 02:13:25,000
I am now going I see no other lights on.

2164
02:13:25,000 --> 02:13:28,000
what are we it's the pleasure of the council.

2165
02:13:28,000 --> 02:13:33,490
so basically, if I'm understanding this,
so it would be to have 5a would include

2166
02:13:33,490 --> 02:13:35,000
those four properties,

2167
02:13:36,000 --> 02:13:40,000
and you would just remove four from...

2168
02:13:40,000 --> 02:13:43,000
it's just an observation.

2169
02:13:43,000 --> 02:13:45,000
it would be at the sacrifice of...

2170
02:13:47,000 --> 02:13:51,695
you know removing four properties elsewhere
is what that would look like it would

2171
02:13:51,695 --> 02:13:55,000
look a little bit closer to
combination one at that point

2172
02:13:55,000 --> 02:13:59,628
in time but it could also be on hendon
street as an example I just did to have to

2173
02:13:59,628 --> 02:14:01,000
you'd have to decide how

2174
02:14:01,000 --> 02:14:05,000
that would work could it could it be homes that maybe didn't respond and

2175
02:14:07,000 --> 02:14:14,024
that's the hazard here is that I don't have
all that information right in front of me

2176
02:14:14,024 --> 02:14:17,000
right now just to
go through the 115

2177
02:14:17,000 --> 02:14:22,533
petitions that were returned to see what
specific addresses were returned on hendon

2178
02:14:22,533 --> 02:14:23,000
street.

2179
02:14:24,000 --> 02:14:26,000
our assistant engineer did go through this.

2180
02:14:27,000 --> 02:14:30,000
exercise trying to break up.

2181
02:14:30,000 --> 02:14:37,306
you'll see, for instance, on this slide
here, hendon street, actually it's already

2182
02:14:37,306 --> 02:14:39,000
written right here,

2183
02:14:39,000 --> 02:14:43,000
hendon street northeast had a really strong participation rate.

2184
02:14:45,000 --> 02:14:48,000
and then you had hendon west

2185
02:14:48,000 --> 02:14:50,000
that had a lower participation rate.

2186
02:14:51,000 --> 02:14:56,000
and so that would be maybe potentially a bad suggestion on my part.

2187
02:14:57,000 --> 02:15:06,239
but if you go back to combination one, slide
20, 21, robert, I'll just show you what

2188
02:15:06,239 --> 02:15:08,000
that looks like.

2189
02:15:22,000 --> 02:15:25,000
there's an example of where you would be able to include it.

2190
02:15:26,000 --> 02:15:31,000
regardless, there are a few different ways of making something happen here,

2191
02:15:31,000 --> 02:15:34,000
but that's up to the city council to decide how they wanted to do that.

2192
02:15:37,000 --> 02:15:43,148
so I can't read the street, unfortunately,
but the street here where you see just a

2193
02:15:43,148 --> 02:15:45,000
few homes that are blank,

2194
02:15:45,000 --> 02:15:49,000
is there a way to just cover that street, include

2195
02:15:50,000 --> 02:15:51,000
I'm not sure if you can see it.

2196
02:15:52,000 --> 02:15:53,000
no, yeah, I see what you're saying.

2197
02:15:53,000 --> 02:15:53,000
yes.

2198
02:15:53,000 --> 02:15:56,000
is there a way to include those and then just go with this map?

2199
02:15:57,000 --> 02:15:59,000
well, let me do some quick math.

2200
02:16:00,000 --> 02:16:00,000
okay.

2201
02:16:02,000 --> 02:16:04,000
it's the cul-de-sac that's missing.

2202
02:16:04,000 --> 02:16:09,010
so you have green, you have high interest
above 67%, and there's one, two, three,

2203
02:16:09,010 --> 02:16:10,000
four, five, six.

2204
02:16:10,000 --> 02:16:14,510
it's literally the cul-de-sac, so I'm
wondering if we can include those and go with

2205
02:16:14,510 --> 02:16:15,000
this one.

2206
02:16:15,000 --> 02:16:18,000
can you go back to slide 25, robert?

2207
02:16:24,000 --> 02:16:27,000
so we had one on avenida avalon that was 67.

2208
02:16:29,000 --> 02:16:31,000
and then go back to slide 21, please.

2209
02:16:31,000 --> 02:16:31,000
67 over 95.

2210
02:16:47,000 --> 02:16:51,190
anybody who was in attendance of the traffic
commission watched this process play out

2211
02:16:51,190 --> 02:16:54,000
painfully when we were
counting up individual properties.

2212
02:16:55,000 --> 02:16:57,000
I was just trying to get the most bang for...

2213
02:16:58,000 --> 02:17:02,000
yeah, so what that would result in is, based upon my math, 66.3%.

2214
02:17:02,000 --> 02:17:08,000
so we have to go with the other one.

2215
02:17:08,000 --> 02:17:08,000
okay.

2216
02:17:08,000 --> 02:17:10,000
all right.

2217
02:17:10,000 --> 02:17:12,000
or you find some other...

2218
02:17:14,000 --> 02:17:16,000
or you basically were off by one.

2219
02:17:16,000 --> 02:17:18,000
let me see if what happens when we get to 68.

2220
02:17:18,000 --> 02:17:23,000
sorry, when we get to 67 divided by one.

2221
02:17:23,000 --> 02:17:27,941
if you exclude one property on any of that
scenario somewhere, on hendon street, for

2222
02:17:27,941 --> 02:17:30,000
example, then you
would get to 67%.

2223
02:17:30,000 --> 02:17:36,000
you'd have to figure out which one you want to exclude.

2224
02:17:36,000 --> 02:17:38,000
maybe the corner, I don't know.

2225
02:17:41,000 --> 02:17:44,000
so maybe just stick to the combination five for now?

2226
02:17:44,000 --> 02:17:47,000
yeah, maybe stick to combination five for now.

2227
02:17:47,000 --> 02:17:50,000
it's up to you.

2228
02:17:50,000 --> 02:17:51,000
okay.

2229
02:17:51,000 --> 02:17:53,000
well, for action, combination five.

2230
02:17:53,000 --> 02:17:55,000
I actually have a question.

2231
02:17:55,000 --> 02:17:57,000
now we've got everybody lit up.

2232
02:17:58,000 --> 02:18:02,000
joe, you have worked on this thing immensely.

2233
02:18:02,000 --> 02:18:06,000
I mean, and it's complicated and all the rest of that.

2234
02:18:06,000 --> 02:18:08,000
and I would just like to ask you,

2235
02:18:10,000 --> 02:18:14,000
after all of that, what is your recommendation?

2236
02:18:14,000 --> 02:18:19,785
I mean, obviously it's the council's
decision, but you have the insight of having

2237
02:18:19,785 --> 02:18:23,000
done all this work,
and I would like to know.

2238
02:18:24,000 --> 02:18:30,000
I think what I would do, my understanding, and I need the help of curtis here,

2239
02:18:31,000 --> 02:18:36,312
my understanding is there's no direct access
from the park to avenida avalon and that

2240
02:18:36,312 --> 02:18:37,000
cul-de-sac.

2241
02:18:38,000 --> 02:18:42,000
is there any pass-through between the park and that cul-de-sac?

2242
02:18:43,000 --> 02:18:44,000
isn't it all fenced off?

2243
02:18:45,000 --> 02:18:51,521
so my revised recommendation would be then
to the combination 5a that I'm referring

2244
02:18:51,521 --> 02:18:56,000
to would be to exclude the
cul-de-sac on avenue to avalon

2245
02:18:56,000 --> 02:19:00,000
because it's a hidden cul-de-sac that people are unlikely to find.

2246
02:19:01,000 --> 02:19:05,905
of course they're watching a public meeting
tonight, but I mean unlikely to find for

2247
02:19:05,905 --> 02:19:09,000
open parking and then take
the four properties across

2248
02:19:09,000 --> 02:19:14,000
from beckenham park and include those in the permit parking so okay

2249
02:19:30,000 --> 02:19:31,000
thank you.

2250
02:19:32,000 --> 02:19:36,000
I'm going to, you know, we're with councilman sweeney.

2251
02:19:38,000 --> 02:19:38,000
okay.

2252
02:19:39,000 --> 02:19:45,669
thank you mayor, so I wanted to just move
this along and move forward and I want to

2253
02:19:45,669 --> 02:19:48,000
just make a motion that we do

2254
02:19:48,000 --> 02:19:53,125
exactly that what joe just suggested and
we'll kind of make that 5a so we'll we'll

2255
02:19:53,125 --> 02:19:56,000
exclude the four
properties on the cul-de-sac.

2256
02:19:57,000 --> 02:20:02,000
we'll add the four properties there and and then

2257
02:20:03,000 --> 02:20:07,705
subject to staff and city attorney
confirmation that it satisfies the applicable

2258
02:20:07,705 --> 02:20:12,647
petition requirements and creates a logical
enforceable boundary and direct staff to

2259
02:20:12,647 --> 02:20:13,000
return

2260
02:20:13,000 --> 02:20:18,168
on september 8th with the implementing
resolution because we want to keep this moving

2261
02:20:18,168 --> 02:20:22,000
forward and I appreciate
councilmember pazel but I want to keep

2262
02:20:22,000 --> 02:20:26,923
it moving forward since so much time has
already been spent on this and in addition

2263
02:20:26,923 --> 02:20:29,000
to that I'm going
to add what I had

2264
02:20:29,000 --> 02:20:34,746
kim had said earlier that I want to further
move the staff return with an equitable

2265
02:20:34,746 --> 02:20:38,000
citywide option for the
city to absorb the cost

2266
02:20:38,000 --> 02:20:42,000
of the standard resident and guest permits, number one.

2267
02:20:42,000 --> 02:20:47,201
number two, I want an alternating side
or staggered street sweeping schedule that

2268
02:20:47,201 --> 02:20:49,000
preserves necessary service.

2269
02:20:49,000 --> 02:20:53,848
number three, an evaluation of additional
overnight parking on the north side of

2270
02:20:53,848 --> 02:20:55,000
laguna hills drive.

2271
02:20:56,000 --> 02:21:00,000
number four, a resident education and warning period before citations.

2272
02:21:02,000 --> 02:21:06,178
number five, a process for monitoring
displaced parking and allowing adjoining

2273
02:21:06,178 --> 02:21:08,000
streets to petition
for inclusion.

2274
02:21:09,000 --> 02:21:14,399
and six, a six-month review of effectiveness,
enforcement, resident concerns, and

2275
02:21:14,399 --> 02:21:16,000
unintended consequences.

2276
02:21:20,000 --> 02:21:24,000
all of that, are we able to, mr.

2277
02:21:24,000 --> 02:21:31,327
city attorney, are we able to then add to
direct staff at a later date to return with

2278
02:21:31,327 --> 02:21:34,000
an ordinance that would then be

2279
02:21:34,000 --> 02:21:37,000
able to include the whole neighborhood if we changed that?

2280
02:21:38,000 --> 02:21:42,000
or is that, would we be able to do that now or should we do that as a separate item?

2281
02:21:43,000 --> 02:21:44,000
it's better to do that as a separate item.

2282
02:21:44,000 --> 02:21:44,000
okay.

2283
02:21:44,000 --> 02:21:47,000
under items for future consideration.

2284
02:21:47,000 --> 02:21:47,000
yeah.

2285
02:21:47,000 --> 02:21:48,000
perfect.

2286
02:21:48,000 --> 02:21:48,000
okay.

2287
02:21:49,000 --> 02:21:50,000
okay, we have a motion on the table.

2288
02:21:50,000 --> 02:21:51,000
do we have a second?

2289
02:21:52,000 --> 02:21:53,000
I have some confusion.

2290
02:21:54,000 --> 02:21:54,000
go ahead.

2291
02:21:54,000 --> 02:21:57,000
so there was a lot added to this initial motion.

2292
02:21:57,000 --> 02:22:00,000
I say we keep it simple and pass the 5a right now.

2293
02:22:00,000 --> 02:22:04,958
I don't know if some of the other things
are on the street sweeping is something that

2294
02:22:04,958 --> 02:22:07,000
we have to bring
back on the agenda

2295
02:22:07,000 --> 02:22:10,000
because it's something that should be addressed as well.

2296
02:22:10,000 --> 02:22:14,841
having the city subsidized when all, I
don't think I've heard, I don't think I know

2297
02:22:14,841 --> 02:22:17,000
of any other
neighborhood who has had

2298
02:22:18,000 --> 02:22:22,571
parking permits subsidized and I think
that's something we need to have a robust

2299
02:22:22,571 --> 02:22:26,000
conversation because it would
be unfair for all of the other

2300
02:22:26,000 --> 02:22:29,000
areas who have to pay for the process?

2301
02:22:29,000 --> 02:22:35,000
we would have to have a discussion about that and so I think we just go with I mean,

2302
02:22:35,000 --> 02:22:38,000
I I'm not okay with the substitute.

2303
02:22:38,000 --> 02:22:39,000
so do we let that?

2304
02:22:39,000 --> 02:22:42,000
do we have to vote on the substitute right now?

2305
02:22:42,000 --> 02:22:48,000
well, you might just make a suggestion you're making a point

2306
02:22:49,000 --> 02:22:54,347
would you would you make your own amendment
to that on that basis or do we need an

2307
02:22:54,347 --> 02:22:55,000
amendment?

2308
02:22:55,000 --> 02:22:56,000
so I'm open to the amendment.

2309
02:22:56,000 --> 02:23:00,000
here's here's the thing on that number one

2310
02:23:02,000 --> 02:23:06,165
the street sweeping is better off to look
at now because once this is done and we're

2311
02:23:06,165 --> 02:23:08,000
going to spend the
money on the signs

2312
02:23:08,000 --> 02:23:12,000
going up, so then we'd have to go back and if it was done at a later date,

2313
02:23:12,000 --> 02:23:15,000
then you'd have to go back and replace all those signs with a different cost.

2314
02:23:15,000 --> 02:23:19,105
so it makes sense to look at it now and
bring it forward now to just have that

2315
02:23:19,105 --> 02:23:21,000
something looked
at because we still

2316
02:23:21,000 --> 02:23:24,863
have to wait until the next meeting to bring
all this forward to have a final vote on

2317
02:23:24,863 --> 02:23:25,000
it.

2318
02:23:25,000 --> 02:23:29,000
so why not just look at that and see if it's something that is possible.

2319
02:23:30,000 --> 02:23:34,000
okay, we still have a motion on the table with no seconds.

2320
02:23:34,000 --> 02:23:35,000
I want to make sure I'm clear, too.

2321
02:23:35,000 --> 02:23:41,101
so is the motion, hey, let's pass 5a and
put that list of six things on the next

2322
02:23:41,101 --> 02:23:44,000
meeting's agenda
to be able to address

2323
02:23:44,000 --> 02:23:45,000
those things?

2324
02:23:45,000 --> 02:23:49,000
well, it was my understanding, and correct me if I'm wrong, mr.

2325
02:23:49,000 --> 02:23:52,000
ames, when I spoke to him earlier about this,

2326
02:23:52,000 --> 02:23:56,473
it was something that they were going to be
able to look at and bring forward for the

2327
02:23:56,473 --> 02:23:58,000
next meeting on some of those

2328
02:23:58,000 --> 02:23:58,000
items.

2329
02:23:58,000 --> 02:23:59,000
okay.

2330
02:24:00,000 --> 02:24:05,178
so is that the motion I guess yeah pass
5a and bring those other items to the next

2331
02:24:05,178 --> 02:24:06,000
meeting yeah?

2332
02:24:06,000 --> 02:24:08,000
just for clarification.

2333
02:24:08,000 --> 02:24:10,000
you're not passing 5a tonight.

2334
02:24:10,000 --> 02:24:14,930
you're directing city staff to draft a
resolution yeah for the next meeting where

2335
02:24:14,930 --> 02:24:17,000
you'll actually
vote on 5a correct

2336
02:24:22,000 --> 02:24:23,000
do we have a second?

2337
02:24:24,000 --> 02:24:25,000
we still don't have a second.

2338
02:24:25,000 --> 02:24:30,187
yes, I'll second that, that we're putting
the other resolution for 5a to be able to

2339
02:24:30,187 --> 02:24:33,000
vote on it at the next
meeting so that we can

2340
02:24:33,000 --> 02:24:37,581
bring this to resolution and that the other
items are brought up for discussion that

2341
02:24:37,581 --> 02:24:39,000
you listed on your motion.

2342
02:24:39,000 --> 02:24:40,000
correct.

2343
02:24:40,000 --> 02:24:40,000
okay.

2344
02:24:40,000 --> 02:24:44,615
now I'm going to turn back to you, erica,
and do you still want to substitute motion

2345
02:24:44,615 --> 02:24:45,000
or not?

2346
02:24:46,000 --> 02:24:53,384
I mean, for the sake of all of the residents
who are here tonight, I think they want

2347
02:24:53,384 --> 02:24:54,000
action.

2348
02:24:54,000 --> 02:25:00,000
and so I think that what we should do is vote on 5a, get that rolling,

2349
02:25:00,000 --> 02:25:03,000
and then come back and talk about the other elements.

2350
02:25:03,000 --> 02:25:08,000
and so I just want to have something where the residents feel like there's resolution.

2351
02:25:08,000 --> 02:25:10,000
so that would be my substitute motion.

2352
02:25:10,000 --> 02:25:17,000
we bring all that other stuff back to discuss, but have 5a for sure in the process.

2353
02:25:17,000 --> 02:25:18,000
that's what we're doing.

2354
02:25:18,000 --> 02:25:25,000
well, I thought the whole thing would be to bring everything together.

2355
02:25:26,000 --> 02:25:30,333
the whole thing was to direct staff
to be able to look at that and give us the

2356
02:25:30,333 --> 02:25:31,000
information.

2357
02:25:31,000 --> 02:25:36,425
we'd still pass 5a, but I want to have staff
looking at that other information in the

2358
02:25:36,425 --> 02:25:37,000
meantime.

2359
02:25:39,000 --> 02:25:44,000
I was a bit confused with that because I thought that it was, it's very confusing.

2360
02:25:44,000 --> 02:25:47,000
it's still going to come back on the next meeting.

2361
02:25:47,000 --> 02:25:48,000
right.

2362
02:25:48,000 --> 02:25:53,000
and what we're really doing is asking staff to prepare it for us to actually vote on.

2363
02:25:54,000 --> 02:25:54,000
okay.

2364
02:25:54,000 --> 02:26:00,000
is there a separation with the fees, a separation with all of that?

2365
02:26:00,000 --> 02:26:01,000
it's all separate.

2366
02:26:02,000 --> 02:26:03,000
okay.

2367
02:26:03,000 --> 02:26:08,000
so with, I mean, is this normal, mr.

2368
02:26:08,000 --> 02:26:08,000
burns?

2369
02:26:11,000 --> 02:26:14,838
the manager didn't have adequate information
or direction to prepare a resolution for

2370
02:26:14,838 --> 02:26:18,000
tonight so that's what he's seeking
tonight is some direction to bring

2371
02:26:18,000 --> 02:26:21,847
something more concrete and documented at
the next meeting and and we can we can add

2372
02:26:21,847 --> 02:26:24,000
some other areas of
consideration when we bring

2373
02:26:24,000 --> 02:26:33,000
the packet back at the next meeting okay, I understand any other discussion

2374
02:26:34,000 --> 02:26:36,000
I see lights on, but just want to make sure.

2375
02:26:38,000 --> 02:26:38,000
all right.

2376
02:26:38,000 --> 02:26:43,000
then I think we're going to go ahead and do a roll call vote.

2377
02:26:45,000 --> 02:26:46,000
council member sweeney?

2378
02:26:46,000 --> 02:26:46,000
aye.

2379
02:26:47,000 --> 02:26:47,000
council member pezzel?

2380
02:26:48,000 --> 02:26:48,000
aye.

2381
02:26:49,000 --> 02:26:49,000
mayor pro tem mathis?

2382
02:26:50,000 --> 02:26:50,000
aye.

2383
02:26:51,000 --> 02:26:51,000
council member wheeler?

2384
02:26:51,000 --> 02:26:52,000
aye.

2385
02:26:53,000 --> 02:26:53,000
mayor kosky?

2386
02:26:53,000 --> 02:26:54,000
aye.

2387
02:26:54,000 --> 02:26:55,000
may the ayes have it.

2388
02:26:56,000 --> 02:26:56,000
ok.

2389
02:26:57,000 --> 02:26:57,000
thank you.

2390
02:27:01,000 --> 02:27:02,000
all right.

2391
02:27:02,000 --> 02:27:03,000
now we're going to go back.

2392
02:27:04,000 --> 02:27:10,000
I've been dancing all around this agenda here.

2393
02:27:12,000 --> 02:27:14,000
well, no.

2394
02:27:15,000 --> 02:27:15,000
let's see here.

2395
02:27:15,000 --> 02:27:16,000
I had it here.

2396
02:27:17,000 --> 02:27:23,530
we were to, believe it or not, the consent
calendar, which is usually right at the

2397
02:27:23,530 --> 02:27:26,000
very beginning of our meetings,

2398
02:27:26,000 --> 02:27:28,000
but we've had a lot of meetings.

2399
02:27:29,000 --> 02:27:32,000
so we're back to the consent calendar, item no.

2400
02:27:32,000 --> 02:27:39,896
4. And so all of the matters under the
consent calendar, which there are many, are

2401
02:27:39,896 --> 02:27:45,000
considered routine and
will be enacted in one motion,

2402
02:27:46,000 --> 02:27:49,000
approving the recommendation listed on the agenda.

2403
02:27:50,000 --> 02:27:54,000
there will be no separate discussion unless members of the city council or city staff

2404
02:27:55,000 --> 02:28:00,000
requests specific items to be removed from the consent calendar.

2405
02:28:00,000 --> 02:28:06,000
so for that, I'm going to ask for public comments on the consent calendar.

2406
02:28:07,000 --> 02:28:07,000
are there any?

2407
02:28:09,000 --> 02:28:10,000
yes, there is.

2408
02:28:10,000 --> 02:28:12,000
and we wanted to pose it to you as the chair.

2409
02:28:13,000 --> 02:28:14,000
you can take them all at the beginning.

2410
02:28:15,000 --> 02:28:18,560
however, if any of these items are going
to be pulled, then we could call them at

2411
02:28:18,560 --> 02:28:19,000
that time.

2412
02:28:19,000 --> 02:28:20,000
it would be up to you as the chair.

2413
02:28:21,000 --> 02:28:22,000
let's do that.

2414
02:28:22,000 --> 02:28:22,000
okay.

2415
02:28:23,000 --> 02:28:26,000
so that is more pertinent to any that are pulled.

2416
02:28:27,000 --> 02:28:27,000
absolutely.

2417
02:28:27,000 --> 02:28:34,000
I have comments for 4.15, 4.16, and 4.17 for in-person comments.

2418
02:28:34,000 --> 02:28:39,613
and then I do have numerous online electronic
comments I would read names for for

2419
02:28:39,613 --> 02:28:41,000
those items as well.

2420
02:28:41,000 --> 02:28:42,000
all right.

2421
02:28:42,000 --> 02:28:43,000
do we have any online comments?

2422
02:28:50,000 --> 02:28:55,655
so I'm gonna ask let's get right to the
chase I'm gonna ask the council members or

2423
02:28:55,655 --> 02:28:58,000
staff if they'd
like to remove any

2424
02:28:58,000 --> 02:29:07,000
items give your pencil ready thank you six seven

2425
02:29:09,000 --> 02:29:15,000
8, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 19.

2426
02:29:11,000 --> 02:29:15,000
let me just make sure I have it.

2427
02:29:16,000 --> 02:29:16,000
6, 7, 8, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, and 19.

2428
02:29:17,000 --> 02:29:17,000
correct.

2429
02:29:17,000 --> 02:29:17,000
okay.

2430
02:29:17,000 --> 02:29:21,000
this is going to be a real quick consent calendar.

2431
02:29:35,000 --> 02:29:38,000
19 okay, so why don't we?

2432
02:29:39,000 --> 02:29:43,882
we're just gonna go ahead and go and ask
for a motion to approve the balance of the

2433
02:29:43,882 --> 02:29:46,000
consent calendar
do we have a motion

2434
02:29:46,000 --> 02:29:50,000
almost to approve yeah move the balance okay in a second okay,

2435
02:29:51,000 --> 02:29:59,262
and call for a roll call vote on the consent
calendar the items that are not removed

2436
02:29:59,262 --> 02:30:03,000
meritor I'm sorry
mayor pro tem mathis

2437
02:30:05,000 --> 02:30:05,000
aye.

2438
02:30:06,000 --> 02:30:07,000
councilmember petzold?

2439
02:30:07,000 --> 02:30:07,000
aye.

2440
02:30:08,000 --> 02:30:08,000
mayor caskey?

2441
02:30:09,000 --> 02:30:09,000
aye.

2442
02:30:09,000 --> 02:30:10,000
councilmember wheeler?

2443
02:30:10,000 --> 02:30:11,000
aye.

2444
02:30:11,000 --> 02:30:12,000
councilmember sweeney?

2445
02:30:12,000 --> 02:30:12,000
aye.

2446
02:30:13,000 --> 02:30:14,000
that's approved.

2447
02:30:16,000 --> 02:30:16,000
okay.

2448
02:30:18,000 --> 02:30:22,775
so I circled them myself, so correct me if
I'm wrong, but I think we're starting with

2449
02:30:22,775 --> 02:30:23,000
4.6?

2450
02:30:24,000 --> 02:30:24,000
yes.

2451
02:30:31,000 --> 02:30:35,000
since councilman mathis is exiting, could we take a five-minute break?

2452
02:30:36,000 --> 02:30:36,000
sure.

2453
02:30:37,000 --> 02:30:37,000
everybody?

2454
02:30:38,000 --> 02:30:40,000
I think I'm fine with that.

2455
02:30:43,000 --> 02:30:44,000
we'll call it a party break.

2456
02:30:44,000 --> 02:30:45,000
thank you.

2457
02:31:10,000 --> 02:31:10,000
thank you.

2458
02:31:39,000 --> 02:31:39,000
thank you.

2459
02:31:41,000 --> 02:31:42,000
thank you.

2460
02:32:11,000 --> 02:32:11,000
thank you.

2461
02:32:28,000 --> 02:32:35,000
and we're going to start with old item 4.6, treasurer's investment report day.

2462
02:32:59,000 --> 02:32:59,000
mr.

2463
02:33:00,000 --> 02:33:02,000
orrish, could you bring up the agenda packet?

2464
02:33:05,000 --> 02:33:08,463
yeah, because it would be illustrative if I
point to the pages I'm talking about for

2465
02:33:08,463 --> 02:33:09,000
the question.

2466
02:33:10,000 --> 02:33:11,000
they're relatively simple, the first part, anyway.

2467
02:33:18,000 --> 02:33:24,000
page 74 of the agenda packet, robert.

2468
02:33:40,000 --> 02:33:42,000
the little block will expand to full screen.

2469
02:33:47,000 --> 02:33:48,000
there we go.

2470
02:33:49,000 --> 02:33:50,000
now blow it up.

2471
02:33:50,000 --> 02:34:01,000
more, please.

2472
02:34:08,000 --> 02:34:14,000
okay, if you go up and tap the second one down, it looks like a ribbon.

2473
02:34:17,000 --> 02:34:17,000
up one.

2474
02:34:18,000 --> 02:34:19,000
no, up one.

2475
02:34:21,000 --> 02:34:24,000
that one, yeah.

2476
02:34:24,000 --> 02:34:29,000
where did it go to?

2477
02:34:29,000 --> 02:34:30,000
okay.

2478
02:34:30,000 --> 02:34:30,000
oh, there we go.

2479
02:34:30,000 --> 02:34:31,000
okay.

2480
02:34:31,000 --> 02:34:34,000
if you expand that, that will allow you to skip to the section immediately.

2481
02:34:39,000 --> 02:34:40,000
make it bigger to readable.

2482
02:34:41,000 --> 02:34:43,000
this must have been done on somebody's big screen.

2483
02:34:49,000 --> 02:34:50,000
the question will take half this time.

2484
02:35:12,000 --> 02:35:15,000
okay, could you scroll scroll down please?

2485
02:35:25,000 --> 02:35:28,000
down to the numbers please keep going

2486
02:35:36,000 --> 02:35:36,000
yeah, right there.

2487
02:35:36,000 --> 02:35:37,000
that's good.

2488
02:35:38,000 --> 02:35:38,000
okay.

2489
02:35:39,000 --> 02:35:43,000
actually, 4.6 and 4.7 are the same comment.

2490
02:35:43,000 --> 02:35:49,330
if you notice, it shows down there that
our totals, current monthly market value of

2491
02:35:49,330 --> 02:35:52,000
33 million, prior
month 33 million.

2492
02:35:54,000 --> 02:35:56,000
these numbers are actually kind of misleading.

2493
02:35:56,000 --> 02:36:00,000
because, you know, I've talked with eric, and he can chime in if I go wrong here.

2494
02:36:01,000 --> 02:36:04,632
our real bank account totals are more
on the line of about$20 million,$19 to$20

2495
02:36:04,632 --> 02:36:05,000
million.

2496
02:36:06,000 --> 02:36:10,666
so when we see this every month, it's sort
of artificial because we have outstanding

2497
02:36:10,666 --> 02:36:11,000
debts.

2498
02:36:12,000 --> 02:36:15,000
sometimes we have outstanding revenue we haven't collected, but more often it's debt.

2499
02:36:16,000 --> 02:36:18,000
we've maybe committed to a cip or something like that.

2500
02:36:19,000 --> 02:36:22,000
so I suggested to eric earlier today, and hopefully we can do it maybe next time,

2501
02:36:22,000 --> 02:36:25,000
to have another little section down below that says these are, you know,

2502
02:36:27,000 --> 02:36:32,398
I guess, revenue and expenditures that are
not shown, but it's still money we don't

2503
02:36:32,398 --> 02:36:35,000
really have because
it's been allocated.

2504
02:36:36,000 --> 02:36:38,000
and then you'll have another little line that will subtract off.

2505
02:36:38,000 --> 02:36:41,000
so it shows more realistically what we really have in the bank.

2506
02:36:41,000 --> 02:36:43,000
it's just a way to give us a better idea of what we really got.

2507
02:36:44,000 --> 02:36:47,000
it was 27 last month, I think, the last time we looked at it, and it was 33,

2508
02:36:48,000 --> 02:36:49,000
when we really had about 19 or 20.

2509
02:36:50,000 --> 02:36:53,000
eric, are you still here?

2510
02:36:53,000 --> 02:36:54,000
yeah.

2511
02:36:54,000 --> 02:36:55,000
do you want to comment?

2512
02:36:55,000 --> 02:36:57,000
I asked eric about this earlier today.

2513
02:36:58,000 --> 02:36:59,000
but that's not what this chart is.

2514
02:36:59,000 --> 02:37:01,000
this is just a list of our investments.

2515
02:37:02,000 --> 02:37:05,000
it's not a net report.

2516
02:37:06,000 --> 02:37:08,000
you're asking it for it to be a different report.

2517
02:37:10,000 --> 02:37:12,000
well, what we really want, though, is to see what we've got in the bank.

2518
02:37:12,000 --> 02:37:15,000
well, but that exists in other places.

2519
02:37:16,000 --> 02:37:20,000
but, I mean, this is an accurate portrayal of what our investments are.

2520
02:37:22,000 --> 02:37:24,000
but as far as the till is, it's terribly misleading.

2521
02:37:24,000 --> 02:37:25,000
but the number is right.

2522
02:37:25,000 --> 02:37:28,695
it doesn't mean that's our ending balance
in our bank account, but that's a different

2523
02:37:28,695 --> 02:37:29,000
report.

2524
02:37:30,000 --> 02:37:31,000
but that's what we need to see on this report.

2525
02:37:31,000 --> 02:37:31,000
it would be handy.

2526
02:37:32,000 --> 02:37:33,000
we see this every month.

2527
02:37:33,000 --> 02:37:37,000
you'd like another report added on to this that tells us what our balance is?

2528
02:37:37,000 --> 02:37:40,000
no, I think this one suffices just to give us an idea of what we really got.

2529
02:37:41,000 --> 02:37:44,000
because we don't have 30 million is a totally fictitious number.

2530
02:37:44,000 --> 02:37:46,000
it really doesn't tell you anything.

2531
02:37:46,000 --> 02:37:49,000
so, eric, would you like to comment on that?

2532
02:37:49,000 --> 02:37:52,000
yes, thank you, mayor and members of the city council.

2533
02:37:52,000 --> 02:37:56,000
so, yeah, this report is truly a snapshot in time.

2534
02:37:56,000 --> 02:37:57,000
we do this once a month.

2535
02:37:57,000 --> 02:38:00,000
it shows where the cash is at the end of the month.

2536
02:38:01,000 --> 02:38:04,000
so the$33 million at the end of june 30th.

2537
02:38:05,000 --> 02:38:07,000
2026 is a true number.

2538
02:38:07,000 --> 02:38:11,000
it's cash and investments that we owned to mr.

2539
02:38:11,000 --> 02:38:18,083
councilmember wheelers point it does not
show for example bills that maybe haven't we

2540
02:38:18,083 --> 02:38:20,000
haven't paid yet, and I

2541
02:38:20,000 --> 02:38:24,000
think that's the point he's getting at if you go to the next page robert

2542
02:38:25,000 --> 02:38:30,659
to further clarify the point here, 33
million is the total across all funds that we

2543
02:38:30,659 --> 02:38:31,000
have.

2544
02:38:31,000 --> 02:38:35,000
you'll see on the top right corner there's a$22 million balance.

2545
02:38:35,000 --> 02:38:37,000
that's the general fund balance.

2546
02:38:37,000 --> 02:38:40,000
that's more in line with what councilmember wheeler was talking about.

2547
02:38:41,000 --> 02:38:46,102
the rest of that money is reserved for
capital projects, gas tax money, measure m

2548
02:38:46,102 --> 02:38:49,000
money, clean air money,
senior mobility money,

2549
02:38:49,000 --> 02:38:50,000
and down the road there.

2550
02:38:52,000 --> 02:38:54,000
and that ties up to the$33 million on the bottom there.

2551
02:38:56,000 --> 02:38:59,512
so I'm going to work with councilmember
wheeler and try to figure out maybe some more

2552
02:38:59,512 --> 02:39:01,000
data I can add to
the bottom of this

2553
02:39:01,000 --> 02:39:02,000
page.

2554
02:39:02,000 --> 02:39:05,000
nothing too fancy, nothing too much, but maybe something that speaks to his point.

2555
02:39:05,000 --> 02:39:07,000
I can definitely do that for everybody.

2556
02:39:09,000 --> 02:39:10,000
yeah, that was my point.

2557
02:39:10,000 --> 02:39:13,000
with that, I'll move to pass both six and seven.

2558
02:39:14,000 --> 02:39:14,000
okay.

2559
02:39:15,000 --> 02:39:18,857
I'll second, but I do want to say thank
you to councilmember wheeler for pointing

2560
02:39:18,857 --> 02:39:21,000
this out because this
was a frustration I had

2561
02:39:21,000 --> 02:39:25,709
because a lot of people think this is
what you have in reserves, this is what you

2562
02:39:25,709 --> 02:39:26,000
have.

2563
02:39:26,000 --> 02:39:30,000
a lot of people get confused by these numbers,

2564
02:39:31,000 --> 02:39:35,421
and I think it's really important to show
what we actually have so that when we make

2565
02:39:35,421 --> 02:39:38,000
decisions financially,
what the fiscal impact is.

2566
02:39:39,000 --> 02:39:44,217
and this is one reason why the council
in the past has always been very fiscally

2567
02:39:44,217 --> 02:39:45,000
responsible.

2568
02:39:47,000 --> 02:39:49,000
all right, we have a motion and a second.

2569
02:39:50,000 --> 02:39:55,000
let's do roll call vote on six and seven mayor pro tem mathis.

2570
02:39:56,000 --> 02:39:57,000
hi councilmember sweeney.

2571
02:39:57,000 --> 02:39:59,000
hi mayor caskey.

2572
02:39:59,000 --> 02:40:01,000
hi councilmember wheeler.

2573
02:40:01,000 --> 02:40:02,000
hi councilmember pezold.

2574
02:40:03,000 --> 02:40:06,000
hi the eyes have it okay, we'll go on to 4.8.

2575
02:40:06,000 --> 02:40:11,000
okay 4.8 unfortunately, I have a chance to get with mr.

2576
02:40:11,000 --> 02:40:15,000
ames about these if you go to page 96, please in the presentation

2577
02:40:41,000 --> 02:40:59,000
can you blow that up a little bit?

2578
02:41:10,000 --> 02:41:11,000
okay.

2579
02:41:11,000 --> 02:41:13,000
my question to these was just some of the charges.

2580
02:41:14,000 --> 02:41:22,155
some of these seem rather large, particularly
the$54,000,$55,000 to community center

2581
02:41:22,155 --> 02:41:24,000
bike trail asphalt.

2582
02:41:25,000 --> 02:41:29,846
I don't know of any asphalt trail near the
community center, so I'd like to ask what

2583
02:41:29,846 --> 02:41:31,000
we spent$55,000 for.

2584
02:41:32,000 --> 02:41:34,000
there is an asphalt trail that begins on the

2585
02:41:37,000 --> 02:41:41,000
eastside of the community center that connects up to low salutes,

2586
02:41:42,000 --> 02:41:48,024
so I'm sorry up near laguna hills drive
and poseida valencia by the high school and

2587
02:41:48,024 --> 02:41:51,000
that goes down the
east side then circles

2588
02:41:51,000 --> 02:41:57,399
around in front of the staircase the
community center and that continues towards

2589
02:41:57,399 --> 02:41:59,000
along alicia parkway

2590
02:42:00,000 --> 02:42:06,000
underneath the tunnel that goes around the pocket park that's done near vialomas.

2591
02:42:06,000 --> 02:42:08,000
all of that was repaved.

2592
02:42:08,000 --> 02:42:15,083
we had a lot of complaints from bicyclists
and from pedestrians on there that we have

2593
02:42:15,083 --> 02:42:18,000
problems with the
asphalt buckling,

2594
02:42:18,000 --> 02:42:19,000
especially due to tree roots.

2595
02:42:20,000 --> 02:42:21,000
so we fixed all of that.

2596
02:42:22,000 --> 02:42:28,833
and we obtained a few proposals for that,
and quickle paving was the best proposal

2597
02:42:28,833 --> 02:42:30,000
for that work.

2598
02:42:31,000 --> 02:42:33,000
and it turned out to be an excellent job along there.

2599
02:42:33,000 --> 02:42:37,029
we got a nice smooth trail along there
wrapping around the community center and out

2600
02:42:37,029 --> 02:42:38,000
towards villa lomas.

2601
02:42:40,000 --> 02:42:40,000
okay.

2602
02:42:40,000 --> 02:42:44,000
I wanted to pick on one other one, the 38,000, the juniper removal.

2603
02:42:49,000 --> 02:42:53,628
juniper removal was a project that was
discussed in front of city council was the

2604
02:42:53,628 --> 02:42:57,000
juniper removal on the slopes
on poseidon valencia that was

2605
02:42:57,000 --> 02:43:02,000
specifically authorized for work by the city council.

2606
02:43:03,000 --> 02:43:10,000
I'm sure I know who wanted that one okay it's not a bad thing,

2607
02:43:10,000 --> 02:43:14,029
but I just curious that was an awful lot
of money to just tear out a bunch of weeds

2608
02:43:14,029 --> 02:43:15,000
or a bunch of plants

2609
02:43:15,000 --> 02:43:18,000
we approved a lot more than that

2610
02:43:21,000 --> 02:43:27,000
that's just the beginning, or maybe it's the end.

2611
02:43:28,000 --> 02:43:31,000
if that's the end, then we did okay.

2612
02:43:31,000 --> 02:43:33,000
okay.

2613
02:43:34,000 --> 02:43:37,000
with that, I'll motion to move.

2614
02:43:37,000 --> 02:43:37,000
do we have a second?

2615
02:43:38,000 --> 02:43:38,000
second.

2616
02:43:40,000 --> 02:43:41,000
motion and second.

2617
02:43:42,000 --> 02:43:44,000
I will call for 4.8.

2618
02:43:47,000 --> 02:43:49,000
4.10 holiday lighting and decorations agreement.

2619
02:43:49,000 --> 02:43:50,000
yeah 1011 sort of go together.

2620
02:43:50,000 --> 02:43:56,000
I just want to point out and ask one question and point out a couple things on 10 I

2621
02:44:12,000 --> 02:44:16,000
there was a question about the specifics on the decorations.

2622
02:44:16,000 --> 02:44:19,000
I brought up something about the dancing trees.

2623
02:44:19,000 --> 02:44:20,000
are we getting those back?

2624
02:44:22,000 --> 02:44:25,000
that was such a neat thing we had two years ago and didn't have it last year.

2625
02:44:26,000 --> 02:44:28,904
yes, council member wheeler, there are
the trees on the plaza area that will be

2626
02:44:28,904 --> 02:44:31,000
synchronized with the light
show at the community center.

2627
02:44:32,000 --> 02:44:34,000
so it would be more similar than to two years ago?

2628
02:44:34,000 --> 02:44:35,000
that is correct.

2629
02:44:35,000 --> 02:44:35,000
okay.

2630
02:44:36,000 --> 02:44:40,000
and the other thing, I just want to comment that the financials on both of these,

2631
02:44:40,000 --> 02:44:48,000
the 125 for 4.10 and then 4.11 mentions the activities, I guess I'll call it.

2632
02:44:49,000 --> 02:44:50,000
that is a combination.

2633
02:44:51,000 --> 02:44:55,000
so our additive 11 is not part of 10, so the total is like 156.

2634
02:44:57,000 --> 02:45:01,000
so we were sort of in the range in the past of the christmas, about right at 100.

2635
02:45:01,000 --> 02:45:02,000
now we're up to 156.

2636
02:45:02,000 --> 02:45:07,000
I just wanted to point that out for consideration for, you know, economics.

2637
02:45:10,000 --> 02:45:12,000
if there's no other comments with that, I'll move to pass.

2638
02:45:14,000 --> 02:45:16,000
I have some comments on 410.

2639
02:45:16,000 --> 02:45:16,000
okay.

2640
02:45:19,000 --> 02:45:19,000
I'm sorry.

2641
02:45:19,000 --> 02:45:20,000
so I just want to...

2642
02:45:20,000 --> 02:45:22,000
I'm looking at the thing myself, so I'm...

2643
02:45:23,000 --> 02:45:24,000
it's okay.

2644
02:45:24,000 --> 02:45:26,000
so the christmas schemes, are they here today?

2645
02:45:26,000 --> 02:45:26,000
no.

2646
02:45:28,000 --> 02:45:34,648
they are not known they are not okay um
okay I so I noticed on the staff report my

2647
02:45:34,648 --> 02:45:37,000
apologies why isn't the staff

2648
02:45:37,000 --> 02:45:42,827
report a nelly gill ranch sign that was
a sample of what we were looking for to

2649
02:45:42,827 --> 02:45:46,000
decorate the entry
monuments okay all right

2650
02:45:46,000 --> 02:45:51,752
thank you for for answering that and then
another question that I have is there any

2651
02:45:51,752 --> 02:45:53,000
possible way I can

2652
02:45:54,000 --> 02:46:00,000
ask for just a minor adjustment, and there's a reason for this adjustment.

2653
02:46:01,000 --> 02:46:08,758
so if possible, so on el toro, el toro
usually we decorate with a number of

2654
02:46:08,758 --> 02:46:10,000
decorations.

2655
02:46:10,000 --> 02:46:17,333
is there a way to remove one of the decorations
and add some decorations in front of

2656
02:46:17,333 --> 02:46:21,000
the civic center where
people take photos,

2657
02:46:22,000 --> 02:46:23,000
wedding photos?

2658
02:46:28,000 --> 02:46:31,000
yes, thank you, councilwoman hazel.

2659
02:46:31,000 --> 02:46:36,360
so you would like to remove some from the
medians and allocate that budget towards in

2660
02:46:36,360 --> 02:46:38,000
front of the civic center?

2661
02:46:39,000 --> 02:46:42,000
yes, like the area where you have, I think there is, it's...

2662
02:46:44,000 --> 02:46:47,000
where a number of pictures and photos are taken.

2663
02:46:47,000 --> 02:46:51,000
I think that would look really nice and be well received.

2664
02:46:52,000 --> 02:46:56,000
just adding some white lights or something like that, if possible.

2665
02:46:56,000 --> 02:46:57,000
is that too much to ask?

2666
02:46:58,000 --> 02:47:02,000
no, I would just like to clarify what you would like removed from el toro.

2667
02:47:03,000 --> 02:47:05,000
the boxes on the...

2668
02:47:05,000 --> 02:47:06,000
can you remove one of the trees?

2669
02:47:07,000 --> 02:47:09,000
wrapped around trees or something?

2670
02:47:09,000 --> 02:47:10,000
is that okay?

2671
02:47:10,000 --> 02:47:14,000
maybe to statter them instead of every tree, maybe like every other tree or something?

2672
02:47:15,000 --> 02:47:17,000
do something where we can just sort of...

2673
02:47:21,000 --> 02:47:27,000
so what decoration are you looking to see at the civic center and where, may I ask?

2674
02:47:27,000 --> 02:47:28,000
some lights.

2675
02:47:28,000 --> 02:47:33,000
there is some sort of a structure in the front of the community center.

2676
02:47:34,000 --> 02:47:38,434
and just some lights wrapped around that
structure, if it's possible, if there's even

2677
02:47:38,434 --> 02:47:40,000
an outlet that we can do that.

2678
02:47:40,000 --> 02:47:45,314
or maybe something in front of the civic
center, like something that would be nice

2679
02:47:45,314 --> 02:47:47,000
for people to take photos.

2680
02:47:47,000 --> 02:47:47,000
okay.

2681
02:47:53,000 --> 02:47:58,204
if I may suggest, I think what we can do
with that is you can keep the decorations on

2682
02:47:58,204 --> 02:47:59,000
el toro road,

2683
02:47:59,000 --> 02:48:05,467
and I'll work with essex property management
on the request for lighting at the civic

2684
02:48:05,467 --> 02:48:06,000
center.

2685
02:48:06,000 --> 02:48:09,632
essex normally handles lighting of the
civic center, so there's a very specific

2686
02:48:09,632 --> 02:48:10,000
request.

2687
02:48:11,000 --> 02:48:13,000
why don't I work with you on that, if that's okay?

2688
02:48:13,000 --> 02:48:14,000
yes, that would be wonderful.

2689
02:48:15,000 --> 02:48:15,000
perfect.

2690
02:48:16,000 --> 02:48:18,000
and by the way, I just want to say thank you.

2691
02:48:19,000 --> 02:48:20,000
after going through this, it looks great.

2692
02:48:21,000 --> 02:48:21,000
thank you.

2693
02:48:23,000 --> 02:48:26,000
once again, I'll move 10 and 11.

2694
02:48:27,000 --> 02:48:29,000
I have a question myself.

2695
02:48:29,000 --> 02:48:35,000
if you're ready to move it, then I take it.

2696
02:48:35,000 --> 02:48:38,000
I'm very impressed with the proposal.

2697
02:48:39,000 --> 02:48:44,487
and I'm very impressed with, by the way,
the items that they've put in that they've

2698
02:48:44,487 --> 02:48:47,000
done in a lot of
other places as well.

2699
02:48:47,000 --> 02:48:53,000
I'm assuming some of these things, which are outstanding, are a lot more expensive.

2700
02:48:55,000 --> 02:49:01,893
I'm understanding that this, did this
proposal come in on budget, over budget, or

2701
02:49:01,893 --> 02:49:03,000
under budget?

2702
02:49:03,000 --> 02:49:05,000
the proposal came in at$10,000 under budget.

2703
02:49:05,000 --> 02:49:07,000
the line item is$125,000 allocated for this year.

2704
02:49:07,000 --> 02:49:10,000
their budget or their item came in at$115,000.

2705
02:49:10,000 --> 02:49:10,000
okay.

2706
02:49:10,000 --> 02:49:11,000
well, I'll just throw this out.

2707
02:49:11,000 --> 02:49:13,990
I'm not on ecbc, but in looking at some
of the things that I've seen in some of the

2708
02:49:13,990 --> 02:49:15,000
actually other local cities,

2709
02:49:32,000 --> 02:49:37,458
I'm not terribly impressed with the ornament,
the walk-through ornament that would be

2710
02:49:37,458 --> 02:49:39,000
at the community center.

2711
02:49:40,000 --> 02:49:43,000
it seems like something that we've had before.

2712
02:49:43,000 --> 02:49:53,028
I would really like it if we could suggest
that we get back to these guys and ask

2713
02:49:53,028 --> 02:49:56,000
them if that can be done

2714
02:49:57,000 --> 02:50:04,000
in a way that is something that is enhanced over that which they are proposing.

2715
02:50:04,000 --> 02:50:04,000
that's right on this.

2716
02:50:06,000 --> 02:50:09,000
I don't know if everyone can see what they're proposing.

2717
02:50:09,000 --> 02:50:09,000
maybe they love it.

2718
02:50:10,000 --> 02:50:11,000
if they do, that's great.

2719
02:50:11,000 --> 02:50:16,000
but I would certainly love to see if we can't enhance that staying within our budget.

2720
02:50:17,000 --> 02:50:23,000
and I don't even mind exploring a little bit, if not this year but in the future,

2721
02:50:24,000 --> 02:50:29,314
what we can do you know in and around the
city hall we do this stuff on the street

2722
02:50:29,314 --> 02:50:31,000
right here el toro all the

2723
02:50:31,000 --> 02:50:38,000
rest of that and at the entrances, but are you suggesting that we amp that up also?

2724
02:50:38,000 --> 02:50:46,477
I I you know I think we need to pass something
tonight as far as I'm concerned but I

2725
02:50:46,477 --> 02:50:49,000
don't know whether we can

2726
02:50:49,000 --> 02:50:52,000
come back and amend it based upon you know some

2727
02:50:53,000 --> 02:50:55,000
don't know how we do that on the dais here.

2728
02:50:56,000 --> 02:51:03,727
you know without having discussion with
them, and I would like to see it oh, yes, the

2729
02:51:03,727 --> 02:51:04,000
the

2730
02:51:04,000 --> 02:51:10,333
item will be moved forward as mentioned
by the assistant city manager it was

2731
02:51:10,333 --> 02:51:15,000
mentioned that essex does
the lighting here at the civic

2732
02:51:15,000 --> 02:51:21,000
center, so it's a different it's a whole different issue so as mentioned we would

2733
02:51:22,000 --> 02:51:28,000
just have a discussion about some ideas and then just leave the bid and everything.

2734
02:51:29,000 --> 02:51:34,243
I'll fall back off of that piece, but I
would like to see if we can't at least

2735
02:51:34,243 --> 02:51:37,000
explore doing something
within our budget

2736
02:51:38,000 --> 02:51:44,000
that has a little bit more wow factor than what I'm seeing there.

2737
02:51:44,000 --> 02:51:48,000
and I don't know whether my colleagues agree with that or not, but, you know.

2738
02:51:49,000 --> 02:51:50,000
like I said, I was like the dancing trees.

2739
02:51:50,000 --> 02:51:53,000
that was cool for me.

2740
02:51:53,000 --> 02:51:55,000
it's like a mini spectrum that they have up there.

2741
02:51:55,000 --> 02:51:56,000
theirs are fantastic.

2742
02:51:56,000 --> 02:51:57,000
yeah.

2743
02:51:58,000 --> 02:51:59,000
just a quick temptation along those lines.

2744
02:52:00,000 --> 02:52:02,000
oh, now I'm going to forget what I was going to say.

2745
02:52:05,000 --> 02:52:06,000
do we have any time on this?

2746
02:52:07,000 --> 02:52:12,345
if we continue that to maybe add a few more
things like mayor caskey wants, or do we

2747
02:52:12,345 --> 02:52:14,000
have to do it pretty soon?

2748
02:52:15,000 --> 02:52:16,000
we do have time.

2749
02:52:16,000 --> 02:52:21,460
I would say I can come back with an
alternative proposal at the next city council

2750
02:52:21,460 --> 02:52:22,000
meeting.

2751
02:52:24,000 --> 02:52:27,000
I would recommend that we get a contract approved on that date.

2752
02:52:27,000 --> 02:52:31,000
okay, I'll leave that up to my colleagues if they want to do that or not.

2753
02:52:31,000 --> 02:52:32,000
that would be a continuation of just 410 then.

2754
02:52:34,000 --> 02:52:35,000
I'll second that.

2755
02:52:36,000 --> 02:52:37,000
that's what you're...

2756
02:52:38,000 --> 02:52:39,000
okay.

2757
02:52:39,000 --> 02:52:40,000
I'm sorry, josh.

2758
02:52:41,000 --> 02:52:44,000
and I agree with you, mayor caskey, with that stuff.

2759
02:52:44,000 --> 02:52:45,000
I don't know.

2760
02:52:45,000 --> 02:52:48,000
I do want to keep this moving forward and not stall anything,

2761
02:52:48,000 --> 02:52:50,000
but I don't know if there's a way to work behind the scenes, but

2762
02:52:50,000 --> 02:52:53,000
first, I want to express my gratitude to ms.

2763
02:52:53,000 --> 02:52:58,398
gannon for all the hard work she's put into
this and for coming in under budget and

2764
02:52:58,398 --> 02:53:01,000
doing an amazing job
and adding a second

2765
02:53:01,000 --> 02:53:04,000
seating for the breakfast with santa and so many other amazing things.

2766
02:53:05,000 --> 02:53:09,000
and I briefly had discussed with her and brought up

2767
02:53:10,000 --> 02:53:15,169
to enhance the tree lighting ceremony because
in years past, people kind of come and

2768
02:53:15,169 --> 02:53:18,000
then they leave pretty
quickly and it's not...

2769
02:53:18,000 --> 02:53:19,000
that's 4-11.

2770
02:53:20,000 --> 02:53:24,000
we're only doing 4-10?

2771
02:53:24,000 --> 02:53:25,000
all right.

2772
02:53:27,000 --> 02:53:29,000
I thought we were combining both into...

2773
02:53:29,000 --> 02:53:30,000
yeah, we can talk about both of them.

2774
02:53:31,000 --> 02:53:31,000
they're together.

2775
02:53:32,000 --> 02:53:32,000
no, they're not.

2776
02:53:33,000 --> 02:53:34,000
we both said.

2777
02:53:35,000 --> 02:53:36,000
are we on just 4-10 or...

2778
02:53:38,000 --> 02:53:39,000
or were you bringing up both of them together?

2779
02:53:39,000 --> 02:53:42,000
well, I brought up the combination because they're related.

2780
02:53:42,000 --> 02:53:47,795
one is like the decorations from the christmas
cakes, and the other is the activities

2781
02:53:47,795 --> 02:53:51,000
like, you know, santa
and those kind of things.

2782
02:53:51,000 --> 02:53:53,000
but they're all sort of together.

2783
02:53:55,000 --> 02:53:56,000
okay.

2784
02:53:57,000 --> 02:54:01,000
well, so it's been moved and seconded that we

2785
02:54:02,000 --> 02:54:08,616
bring back at least the lighting part
to the next meeting and see if there is an

2786
02:54:08,616 --> 02:54:13,000
alternative that we have
an appreciation for or would

2787
02:54:13,000 --> 02:54:14,000
just accept it.

2788
02:54:14,000 --> 02:54:21,383
you know the way it is right now and
and I will add by the way to that the work

2789
02:54:21,383 --> 02:54:24,000
that's been done by director

2790
02:54:26,000 --> 02:54:31,000
but your whole staff on this thing is is immense and it's timely and

2791
02:54:32,000 --> 02:54:35,000
and it was under budget and you'd be credited for that.

2792
02:54:35,000 --> 02:54:40,000
so even though I'm trying to dot an I across a t here,

2793
02:54:41,000 --> 02:54:46,000
that is not to take away from the effort and the amazing work that you guys do.

2794
02:54:47,000 --> 02:54:53,428
so with that, why don't we move at least
on 410 and take a roll call vote on the

2795
02:54:53,428 --> 02:54:56,000
continuance to the next meeting.

2796
02:54:57,000 --> 02:54:59,000
can we discuss just one element?

2797
02:55:00,000 --> 02:55:01,000
just one element.

2798
02:55:01,000 --> 02:55:05,000
can I say one thing before we move to vote?

2799
02:55:05,000 --> 02:55:11,370
is there a way that we can just move
forward and then just have mayor caskey work

2800
02:55:11,370 --> 02:55:12,000
with ms.

2801
02:55:12,000 --> 02:55:19,000
gannon on the item that you would like to be changed?

2802
02:55:20,000 --> 02:55:22,000
I'm going to be good with that if council's fine.

2803
02:55:22,000 --> 02:55:22,000
I'm fine.

2804
02:55:23,000 --> 02:55:26,000
anytime you want to streamline something, it's fine with me.

2805
02:55:26,000 --> 02:55:33,311
so I'm comfortable and confident that you'll
be able to find something that will work

2806
02:55:33,311 --> 02:55:34,000
for you.

2807
02:55:34,000 --> 02:55:39,000
what I don't know is whether it would change the price, and if that's the case,

2808
02:55:39,000 --> 02:55:41,000
then maybe it should be coming back to the council.

2809
02:55:41,000 --> 02:55:41,000
that doesn't hurt.

2810
02:55:41,000 --> 02:55:44,000
that's why there's plenty of time.

2811
02:55:44,000 --> 02:55:46,000
I mean, I'm giving the flexibility.

2812
02:55:46,000 --> 02:55:49,000
I'm not looking to make it go over our budget as well.

2813
02:55:49,000 --> 02:55:53,303
wanted just give the flexibility yeah,
let's just let's just give a complete motion

2814
02:55:53,303 --> 02:55:56,000
that gives the flexibility
of going up to the budget

2815
02:55:56,000 --> 02:56:00,468
and then whatever you decide behind the
scenes and we'll just there you go fine with

2816
02:56:00,468 --> 02:56:01,000
that okay,

2817
02:56:02,000 --> 02:56:05,000
so we will amend the motion according.

2818
02:56:05,000 --> 02:56:05,000
are you okay?

2819
02:56:05,000 --> 02:56:06,000
okay?

2820
02:56:06,000 --> 02:56:07,000
well, what's the amendment on that?

2821
02:56:09,000 --> 02:56:13,798
try that given given mayor caskey the ability
to meet with miss gannon to go over the

2822
02:56:13,798 --> 02:56:16,000
extra stay with you
know up to whatever

2823
02:56:16,000 --> 02:56:18,000
the budget was because it's 10,000 under the budget right now, so

2824
02:56:19,000 --> 02:56:25,666
whatever they decide if it goes up to
that center okay portrait piece the motion

2825
02:56:25,666 --> 02:56:29,000
would be that we
have a second on that I

2826
02:56:29,000 --> 02:56:31,000
assume right yeah, okay?

2827
02:56:32,000 --> 02:56:38,000
we'll call vote for 10 just clarify councilman pez you were seconding that motion

2828
02:56:39,000 --> 02:56:42,000
yes, it's for the piece, that one piece, yes.

2829
02:56:42,000 --> 02:56:48,280
for 410 on allowing, authorizing the mayor
to work with director gannon on this item

2830
02:56:48,280 --> 02:56:50,000
going up to the budget?

2831
02:56:50,000 --> 02:56:52,000
aye.

2832
02:56:52,000 --> 02:56:52,000
council member wheeler?

2833
02:56:53,000 --> 02:56:53,000
aye.

2834
02:56:53,000 --> 02:56:54,000
mayor caskey?

2835
02:56:54,000 --> 02:56:54,000
aye.

2836
02:56:55,000 --> 02:56:55,000
mayor pro tem mathis?

2837
02:56:56,000 --> 02:56:56,000
aye.

2838
02:56:56,000 --> 02:56:57,000
council member pezzel?

2839
02:56:58,000 --> 02:56:58,000
aye.

2840
02:56:58,000 --> 02:56:59,000
council member sweeney?

2841
02:56:59,000 --> 02:56:59,000
aye.

2842
02:57:00,000 --> 02:57:00,000
ayes have it.

2843
02:57:01,000 --> 02:57:02,000
okay, 411.

2844
02:57:02,000 --> 02:57:04,000
and then 410 says slam dunks.

2845
02:57:05,000 --> 02:57:06,000
move 410, or 411, I'm sorry.

2846
02:57:07,000 --> 02:57:08,000
you're moving it?

2847
02:57:08,000 --> 02:57:08,000
yes.

2848
02:57:09,000 --> 02:57:11,000
I have something to say on 411.

2849
02:57:11,000 --> 02:57:12,000
all right, erica.

2850
02:57:13,000 --> 02:57:22,081
okay, so with respect to 411, it's interesting
that council member sweeney mentioned

2851
02:57:22,081 --> 02:57:25,000
the tree lighting ceremony.

2852
02:57:27,000 --> 02:57:28,000
I agree.

2853
02:57:28,000 --> 02:57:30,000
I think that we need to have something extra

2854
02:57:30,000 --> 02:57:37,155
with respect to the tree lighting ceremony
and the holiday events, the budget isn't

2855
02:57:37,155 --> 02:57:40,000
just the budget
that is provided.

2856
02:57:40,000 --> 02:57:47,923
there are donors and sponsors of these events
that bring the budgets lower, or excuse

2857
02:57:47,923 --> 02:57:51,000
me, that assist
with the budgets.

2858
02:57:51,000 --> 02:57:58,000
in fact, I will be throwing a donation for the extravaganza to assist with the budget.

2859
02:57:59,000 --> 02:58:07,000
but I wanted to see if it was possible to bring in some singers and dancers from osha.

2860
02:58:07,000 --> 02:58:08,000
it doesn't have to be ballroom.

2861
02:58:08,000 --> 02:58:12,000
it doesn't have to be a specific genre.

2862
02:58:12,000 --> 02:58:18,954
but I think it would be nice to have something
like that to enhance the tree lighting

2863
02:58:18,954 --> 02:58:21,000
ceremony, just something.

2864
02:58:21,000 --> 02:58:24,000
I know that's done in other areas.

2865
02:58:25,000 --> 02:58:30,661
and I think it'd be nothing extravagant,
but I think it might be a little more

2866
02:58:30,661 --> 02:58:34,000
engaging for the kids
to see something that is

2867
02:58:34,000 --> 02:58:35,000
instead of...

2868
02:58:35,000 --> 02:58:40,000
I mean, the carolers are great, but you can only hear them in one small location.

2869
02:58:40,000 --> 02:58:45,000
and so, anyway, that is my...

2870
02:58:45,000 --> 02:58:52,217
I don't know if I need to get support from
the council for something like that, but

2871
02:58:52,217 --> 02:58:53,000
that's...

2872
02:58:55,000 --> 02:58:59,619
my recommendation, and I'll yield the comments
to hear what councilmember sweeney has

2873
02:58:59,619 --> 02:59:00,000
to say.

2874
02:59:02,000 --> 02:59:08,000
okay, I'm going to go down the list here, or up the list, and josh, you're next.

2875
02:59:08,000 --> 02:59:09,000
thank you, mayor.

2876
02:59:10,000 --> 02:59:13,761
yeah, just revisiting that, I think it's
important for our city to all come together,

2877
02:59:13,761 --> 02:59:15,000
especially during that time.

2878
02:59:15,000 --> 02:59:21,839
we also need to look at involving our chamber
of commerce, and so what I was thinking

2879
02:59:21,839 --> 02:59:22,000
is

2880
02:59:23,000 --> 02:59:27,770
along with councilmember pezold, expanding
the tree lighting ceremony just a little

2881
02:59:27,770 --> 02:59:28,000
bit.

2882
02:59:28,000 --> 02:59:32,864
and what I'm thinking is expanding it
into more of a european-style christmas or

2883
02:59:32,864 --> 02:59:37,000
holiday market experience where
we can invite our local restaurants,

2884
02:59:37,000 --> 02:59:43,000
our local retailers to operate booths there, offer some seasonal food and merchandise,

2885
02:59:43,000 --> 02:59:47,000
and help the residents maybe discover some of the local businesses at that same time.

2886
02:59:50,000 --> 02:59:53,000
and about a month ago, we also had the children's market that ms.

2887
02:59:53,000 --> 02:59:57,059
gannon put on where young people sold their
artwork and their crafts and different

2888
02:59:57,059 --> 02:59:58,000
creations they had.

2889
02:59:59,000 --> 03:00:04,666
and I'd love to incorporate a children's
artisan area into the tree lighting ceremony

2890
03:00:04,666 --> 03:00:09,000
night so our young entrepreneurs
can participate in that and sell

2891
03:00:09,000 --> 03:00:11,000
alongside the local businesses too.

2892
03:00:12,000 --> 03:00:16,829
but just create a nice atmosphere for
everybody that the whole community can come out

2893
03:00:16,829 --> 03:00:17,000
to.

2894
03:00:20,000 --> 03:00:26,000
I did like your idea, councilwoman pezold, about the carolers.

2895
03:00:26,000 --> 03:00:30,368
and I think one thing that would help a
lot of us is every year we sort of stand up

2896
03:00:30,368 --> 03:00:31,000
on the hill,

2897
03:00:32,000 --> 03:00:34,000
try to do the whole light switch to light the tree.

2898
03:00:34,000 --> 03:00:38,000
I think it would be nice to have, you know, just a small stage, but a smaller stage.

2899
03:00:38,000 --> 03:00:42,764
and then maybe the carolers and other
people that are performing can be up on the

2900
03:00:42,764 --> 03:00:45,000
stage because it's
kind of hard to see

2901
03:00:45,000 --> 03:00:47,000
everybody on the ground in the mix of everything.

2902
03:00:47,000 --> 03:00:48,000
so if we had...

2903
03:00:48,000 --> 03:00:51,774
a little bit of a raised stage there, I
think that would greatly increase the

2904
03:00:51,774 --> 03:00:53,000
visibility for everybody.

2905
03:00:53,000 --> 03:00:58,000
so those are some ideas and comments that I wanted to put out there.

2906
03:01:00,000 --> 03:01:01,000
all right.

2907
03:01:01,000 --> 03:01:01,000
sure.

2908
03:01:02,000 --> 03:01:04,000
well, I think we just ate up your 10 grand,

2909
03:01:04,000 --> 03:01:08,000
so I think you're going to have to be happy with that big walkthrough ornament.

2910
03:01:10,000 --> 03:01:14,951
the stage is absolutely critical because
everybody being on the same level, it's hard

2911
03:01:14,951 --> 03:01:16,000
for people to see.

2912
03:01:17,000 --> 03:01:18,000
that's an easy one.

2913
03:01:19,000 --> 03:01:24,752
and I'm all for extra entertainment, but
if we're going to do it, let's have people

2914
03:01:24,752 --> 03:01:26,000
from laguna hills.

2915
03:01:26,000 --> 03:01:29,000
let's have kids from laguna hills high.

2916
03:01:29,000 --> 03:01:31,000
we have a wonderful band program.

2917
03:01:31,000 --> 03:01:32,000
let's do that.

2918
03:01:32,000 --> 03:01:34,000
we don't need to bring in people from outside the city.

2919
03:01:35,000 --> 03:01:37,000
this is a laguna hills celebration.

2920
03:01:37,000 --> 03:01:38,000
let's celebrate laguna hills.

2921
03:01:38,000 --> 03:01:40,000
that would be my suggestion on that.

2922
03:01:41,000 --> 03:01:44,000
and so, you know, we have the principal here today.

2923
03:01:45,000 --> 03:01:49,000
we're supporting them in increasing their brand exposure within our community.

2924
03:01:49,000 --> 03:01:51,000
we should do it any chance we get.

2925
03:01:51,000 --> 03:01:56,764
and I think if you're going to bring in
people to sing and have a choir or something

2926
03:01:56,764 --> 03:01:58,000
like that or band,

2927
03:01:59,000 --> 03:02:01,000
that's where we should go.

2928
03:02:02,000 --> 03:02:02,000
but with that...

2929
03:02:03,000 --> 03:02:09,018
I think, holland, you're doing a wonderful
job, and these are nitpicky things, but

2930
03:02:09,018 --> 03:02:11,000
that would be my two cents.

2931
03:02:11,000 --> 03:02:11,000
hang on.

2932
03:02:12,000 --> 03:02:16,000
now I'm going to make a comment.

2933
03:02:16,000 --> 03:02:22,051
the one piece of continuity I see in all
of this and these comments is that in

2934
03:02:22,051 --> 03:02:25,000
regards to the tree
lighting ceremony,

2935
03:02:27,000 --> 03:02:27,000
we can amp it up.

2936
03:02:28,000 --> 03:02:31,000
and make it a little bit more of an event that, you know,

2937
03:02:32,000 --> 03:02:36,469
it isn't just about flicking a switch and
having bubble machines and stuff, which I

2938
03:02:36,469 --> 03:02:39,000
think really actually
helped, by the way, a few

2939
03:02:39,000 --> 03:02:40,000
years ago.

2940
03:02:42,000 --> 03:02:44,000
but making it a little bit more of a community event.

2941
03:02:45,000 --> 03:02:52,777
and what I'm hearing, you know, out of mayor
pro tem is that not only that, but, you

2942
03:02:52,777 --> 03:02:55,000
know, it's laguna hills.

2943
03:02:56,000 --> 03:03:02,120
so in every in any and every way that we
can emphasize you know our community and the

2944
03:03:02,120 --> 03:03:05,000
participants you know
from our community

2945
03:03:05,000 --> 03:03:11,666
all the better and so um I think all of
those are great ideas and something that

2946
03:03:11,666 --> 03:03:15,000
maybe you can run
with if not you let us

2947
03:03:15,000 --> 03:03:20,000
know I think we're trying to give you some feedback it's still incredible and uh

2948
03:03:21,000 --> 03:03:26,125
and, you know, most of these events, like
the santa event, you know, the breakfast

2949
03:03:26,125 --> 03:03:29,000
with santa, I mean,
they're already, you know,

2950
03:03:30,000 --> 03:03:37,000
sold out and people anticipate them with great, you know, vigor and excitement.

2951
03:03:38,000 --> 03:03:38,000
uh...

2952
03:03:39,000 --> 03:03:39,000
uh...

2953
03:03:39,000 --> 03:03:42,830
anytime that we can do something that just
answered up a little bit more makes it a

2954
03:03:42,830 --> 03:03:45,000
little bit more special
although all the better

2955
03:03:45,000 --> 03:03:50,000
I don't know that we need motions back and forth for all of this but uh...

2956
03:03:50,000 --> 03:03:52,000
I'm going to ask go back to uh...

2957
03:03:52,000 --> 03:03:55,000
day first and then erica you know I I

2958
03:03:55,000 --> 03:03:56,000
I'm encouraged.

2959
03:03:56,000 --> 03:03:57,000
everybody is so enthusiastic about this.

2960
03:03:59,000 --> 03:04:02,000
it shows what a neat time of the year it is and activities.

2961
03:04:03,000 --> 03:04:06,000
I particularly like what josh said about having the vendors.

2962
03:04:07,000 --> 03:04:10,560
I actually got a chance one time to have
chestnuts over an open fire in london at

2963
03:04:10,560 --> 03:04:11,000
christmas.

2964
03:04:11,000 --> 03:04:14,000
I didn't much care for them, actually, but the experience was interesting.

2965
03:04:15,000 --> 03:04:19,220
but little things like that would be
bringing vendors to do special christmas-type

2966
03:04:19,220 --> 03:04:22,000
stuff or that unusual stuff
at the time of the season.

2967
03:04:23,000 --> 03:04:23,000
I think that's great.

2968
03:04:23,000 --> 03:04:24,000
that would be really, really cool.

2969
03:04:25,000 --> 03:04:26,000
it's worth exploring.

2970
03:04:27,000 --> 03:04:27,000
erica.

2971
03:04:27,000 --> 03:04:27,000
yes.

2972
03:04:28,000 --> 03:04:32,000
and that was something we tried to do in the beginning, is to encourage the vendors.

2973
03:04:32,000 --> 03:04:36,000
and that was the purpose of having the holiday events, was to bring the vendors.

2974
03:04:36,000 --> 03:04:39,000
so I'm glad that council member sweeney is mentioning this,

2975
03:04:40,000 --> 03:04:44,930
because it is the purpose to try to bring
the businesses and the community together

2976
03:04:44,930 --> 03:04:46,000
in a positive way.

2977
03:04:47,000 --> 03:04:49,000
and so I do support that.

2978
03:04:49,000 --> 03:04:53,000
but as I'm listening to all of these

2979
03:04:54,000 --> 03:04:55,000
I have a couple of things.

2980
03:04:55,000 --> 03:05:02,024
first of all, in the history of trying to
find talent, while it's nice to have laguna

2981
03:05:02,024 --> 03:05:05,000
hills high school,
I've spent hours,

2982
03:05:05,000 --> 03:05:10,312
countless hours calling the high school and
seeing if I can get the students over and

2983
03:05:10,312 --> 03:05:13,000
it's their break time
and it's hard to have

2984
03:05:13,000 --> 03:05:17,000
a commitment and to have a program put together and to have something.

2985
03:05:17,000 --> 03:05:20,000
so there are programs such as osha

2986
03:05:20,000 --> 03:05:25,475
where these students are from laguna
hills, and they train in laguna hills, and

2987
03:05:25,475 --> 03:05:27,000
that's the profession.

2988
03:05:27,000 --> 03:05:32,950
and it's a program where it's where they
actually do this, and they have the costumes

2989
03:05:32,950 --> 03:05:34,000
and everything.

2990
03:05:34,000 --> 03:05:40,134
so I'm just saying that while we can still
try to bring in the kids from laguna hills

2991
03:05:40,134 --> 03:05:41,000
high school,

2992
03:05:41,000 --> 03:05:42,000
which I think is great.

2993
03:05:42,000 --> 03:05:45,000
maybe we try to communicate with the drama department.

2994
03:05:46,000 --> 03:05:52,000
it's not that it's the city has tried and tried for years.

2995
03:05:52,000 --> 03:05:53,000
I appreciate that.

2996
03:05:53,000 --> 03:05:56,000
I just say laguna hills first and give them the option.

2997
03:05:56,000 --> 03:06:00,000
there's a new principal, new band teacher, new drama teacher.

2998
03:06:01,000 --> 03:06:01,000
we can live.

2999
03:06:02,000 --> 03:06:04,000
there's no need to worry about what happened in the past.

3000
03:06:04,000 --> 03:06:07,000
I just think if we're going for our best ideal.

3001
03:06:07,000 --> 03:06:10,000
and it doesn't mean that it has to be only them, right?

3002
03:06:11,000 --> 03:06:13,000
but I think you've got to try and get them there first.

3003
03:06:14,000 --> 03:06:21,000
so with that, I can sense, and if I'm wrong, let me know, ms.

3004
03:06:21,000 --> 03:06:21,000
gannon.

3005
03:06:22,000 --> 03:06:28,049
I think that given the robust discussion
thus far, I think that we should at least

3006
03:06:28,049 --> 03:06:31,000
increase, because
renting a stage costs.

3007
03:06:32,000 --> 03:06:37,917
it's not cheap, and that would dig into
the budget quite a bit, and there might be

3008
03:06:37,917 --> 03:06:39,000
sound required.

3009
03:06:39,000 --> 03:06:45,165
so just those two things I'm thinking is,
in addition to some of the others, I think

3010
03:06:45,165 --> 03:06:47,000
we should increase costs.

3011
03:06:48,000 --> 03:06:55,327
the holiday budget by 10,000, which is what
councilmember or mayor pro tem mathis has

3012
03:06:55,327 --> 03:06:58,000
sort of thrown out as a number,

3013
03:06:58,000 --> 03:07:01,000
but I think that would be a conservative amount.

3014
03:07:02,000 --> 03:07:08,254
that was just the gap between what we were
spending on the ornament or the overall

3015
03:07:08,254 --> 03:07:11,000
plus what dawn
said we might be able

3016
03:07:11,000 --> 03:07:12,000
to spend up to.

3017
03:07:13,000 --> 03:07:14,000
not advocating bringing in another 10.

3018
03:07:15,000 --> 03:07:19,000
well, would it be all right to support, in order to support, well, ms.

3019
03:07:19,000 --> 03:07:26,545
gannon, would it assist to have the
extra$10,000 to make sure that these asks could

3020
03:07:26,545 --> 03:07:28,000
be accomplished?

3021
03:07:28,000 --> 03:07:30,000
thank you, councilwoman paisled.

3022
03:07:31,000 --> 03:07:34,555
in the staff report, staff has estimated
that the costs for the 2026 events will

3023
03:07:34,555 --> 03:07:35,000
be$31,465,

3024
03:07:35,000 --> 03:07:36,000
which is just about$10,000 over budget as is.

3025
03:07:36,000 --> 03:07:37,000
so, yes, money is always helpful.

3026
03:07:37,000 --> 03:07:38,000
we are already anticipating going over budget.

3027
03:07:38,000 --> 03:07:39,000
luckily, our...

3028
03:07:54,000 --> 03:07:58,000
a lot of the holiday event series budget is from the special events.

3029
03:07:58,000 --> 03:08:00,000
bigger pool of money, that's for throughout the year.

3030
03:08:00,000 --> 03:08:02,000
so this is just what we allocate.

3031
03:08:02,000 --> 03:08:05,000
so it's kind of robbing peter to pay paul.

3032
03:08:05,000 --> 03:08:12,000
we'll probably have to cut other things or more events from later in the year.

3033
03:08:12,000 --> 03:08:18,291
but yes, being able to add$10,000 to tree
lighting or to the holiday event series

3034
03:08:18,291 --> 03:08:20,000
would be very helpful.

3035
03:08:21,000 --> 03:08:22,000
I would like to make a suggestion.

3036
03:08:22,000 --> 03:08:27,399
the council has already given me some
latitude to work with you in regards to the

3037
03:08:27,399 --> 03:08:28,000
ornament.

3038
03:08:29,000 --> 03:08:32,000
I really would like to see us maintain our budget.

3039
03:08:32,000 --> 03:08:36,000
I think the ideas of the stage and the other kinds of things.

3040
03:08:36,000 --> 03:08:40,000
what I'd like to do, if it's okay with the council, is to work with you on...

3041
03:08:41,000 --> 03:08:43,000
on a number of those items, okay?

3042
03:08:44,000 --> 03:08:49,000
and if we need to bring back a small amendment at the next meeting,

3043
03:08:50,000 --> 03:08:54,462
if we really feel that we've looked at it
and it is going to push our budget beyond

3044
03:08:54,462 --> 03:08:55,000
something,

3045
03:08:56,000 --> 03:08:58,000
that we take that part back to the next meeting.

3046
03:08:58,000 --> 03:09:05,128
but my suggestion is that you hand it
back here to councilman wheeler and that we

3047
03:09:05,128 --> 03:09:09,000
kind of move ahead
with this with the budget

3048
03:09:09,000 --> 03:09:10,000
we have.

3049
03:09:10,000 --> 03:09:15,857
unless we need to, after doing some research,
I just don't want to add 10,000 from

3050
03:09:15,857 --> 03:09:17,000
out of the blue.

3051
03:09:17,000 --> 03:09:19,000
oh, yeah, 10,000 would be nice.

3052
03:09:19,000 --> 03:09:21,000
so would 50, you know, that kind of thing.

3053
03:09:22,000 --> 03:09:28,905
so, you know, so I don't think we need to
legislate that on the spur of the moment

3054
03:09:28,905 --> 03:09:30,000
just because.

3055
03:09:30,000 --> 03:09:32,000
let's work on it.

3056
03:09:32,000 --> 03:09:38,448
well, one point is I think that would be
a brown act because they have the ecbc

3057
03:09:38,448 --> 03:09:40,000
usually deals with,

3058
03:09:41,000 --> 03:09:46,000
the events, the holiday stuff that's usually at the ucbc meetings.

3059
03:09:47,000 --> 03:09:49,000
so then that would be adding in another.

3060
03:09:51,000 --> 03:09:51,000
you know what?

3061
03:09:52,000 --> 03:09:53,000
I'm wondering.

3062
03:09:53,000 --> 03:09:53,000
I'm fine.

3063
03:09:53,000 --> 03:09:55,000
whatever you guys want to do.

3064
03:09:55,000 --> 03:09:57,000
I'm going to turn it back over to dave.

3065
03:09:57,000 --> 03:10:00,000
and dave, you brought this one off.

3066
03:10:01,000 --> 03:10:04,552
I brought up the point of the budget to
make sure we knew how much we're spending

3067
03:10:04,552 --> 03:10:06,000
that's going to
be involved here.

3068
03:10:06,000 --> 03:10:07,000
but it's good stuff.

3069
03:10:07,000 --> 03:10:10,000
and I'm I'd still like to watch the money.

3070
03:10:10,000 --> 03:10:15,670
I don't think it would be a brown act
violation as long as don or even me talk to

3071
03:10:15,670 --> 03:10:17,000
holland separately.

3072
03:10:18,000 --> 03:10:19,000
then we can give her an idea.

3073
03:10:19,000 --> 03:10:21,000
that's not a conflict.

3074
03:10:22,000 --> 03:10:26,000
and yeah, I'd say we really allowed a little latitude on 10.

3075
03:10:27,000 --> 03:10:30,000
so we sort of, anything you find at 11 that might be additional carryover,

3076
03:10:31,000 --> 03:10:35,250
I think we can go ahead and if it's necessary
next meeting to increase or touch it up

3077
03:10:35,250 --> 03:10:36,000
a little bit, I

3078
03:10:36,000 --> 03:10:37,000
think we can deal with it then.

3079
03:10:37,000 --> 03:10:40,000
so again, I'll take a motion to move 11.

3080
03:10:40,000 --> 03:10:41,000
with the 10,000?

3081
03:10:42,000 --> 03:10:43,000
no, just as it is.

3082
03:10:43,000 --> 03:10:44,000
just as it is.

3083
03:10:44,000 --> 03:10:46,000
second.

3084
03:10:46,000 --> 03:10:47,000
that's why I preface it.

3085
03:10:49,000 --> 03:10:51,666
some people are going to work with holland,
and if it comes up, if there's something

3086
03:10:51,666 --> 03:10:53,000
really neat that costs
a few dollars more,

3087
03:10:53,000 --> 03:10:55,000
then we can make a minor adjustment next time.

3088
03:10:55,000 --> 03:10:57,000
okay, it's been moved and seconded.

3089
03:10:58,000 --> 03:10:59,000
let's call for the board.

3090
03:10:59,000 --> 03:11:00,000
we need to move on.

3091
03:11:00,000 --> 03:11:05,090
I understand we need to move on, but I would
like to just express as somebody that's

3092
03:11:05,090 --> 03:11:08,000
been involved in events
and understands in ecbc,

3093
03:11:09,000 --> 03:11:11,000
you understand how much our asks are.

3094
03:11:11,000 --> 03:11:17,000
I understand how much our asks are, and I think that we should

3095
03:11:17,000 --> 03:11:21,000
well, if you want to take it back to ecbc, then be my guest.

3096
03:11:22,000 --> 03:11:25,000
have the extra tenant talk about it at ecbc.

3097
03:11:27,000 --> 03:11:30,000
when you say our asks, I mean, the one...

3098
03:11:32,000 --> 03:11:36,000
these are just individual asks, almost like advice to holland.

3099
03:11:36,000 --> 03:11:39,000
I mean, there's no consensus here about what...

3100
03:11:40,000 --> 03:11:41,000
we would be willing to pay for.

3101
03:11:42,000 --> 03:11:43,000
there's been no price tag put together.

3102
03:11:44,000 --> 03:11:49,946
what dave is saying is that we can take a
pause, bring this back, and take a look at

3103
03:11:49,946 --> 03:11:52,000
what those things might cost.

3104
03:11:53,000 --> 03:11:55,000
well, I think ms.

3105
03:11:55,000 --> 03:11:59,000
gannon can tell based off of her experience approximately what that would be.

3106
03:11:59,000 --> 03:12:04,311
well, this was more to let her take this
and maybe explore some sponsorship, some

3107
03:12:04,311 --> 03:12:07,000
vendor participation,
community partners.

3108
03:12:08,000 --> 03:12:11,000
maybe, I mean, there's other partners that may want to even donate for this.

3109
03:12:11,000 --> 03:12:15,000
so there's other possibilities out there, but she's great at doing all that.

3110
03:12:15,000 --> 03:12:17,000
so we're just putting it back on you.

3111
03:12:17,000 --> 03:12:18,000
I think it is a staff issue.

3112
03:12:18,000 --> 03:12:19,000
yeah.

3113
03:12:19,000 --> 03:12:22,000
so let's, it's been moved and seconded.

3114
03:12:24,000 --> 03:12:24,000
mayor pro tem mathis.

3115
03:12:25,000 --> 03:12:25,000
aye.

3116
03:12:25,000 --> 03:12:25,000
aye.

3117
03:12:26,000 --> 03:12:28,000
mayor caskey all right councilmember wheeler.

3118
03:12:28,000 --> 03:12:29,000
aye. Councilmember pezold.

3119
03:12:29,000 --> 03:12:30,000
aye. Customers rainy.

3120
03:12:31,000 --> 03:12:36,754
I I have it all right for 12 okay, yeah,
I'll put a little apology here for taking

3121
03:12:36,754 --> 03:12:39,000
all these items off the consent,

3122
03:12:39,000 --> 03:12:43,115
but I did I did try to work sixty in our
page pack and I didn't talk with every one

3123
03:12:43,115 --> 03:12:45,000
of the directors
and try to get it all

3124
03:12:45,000 --> 03:12:50,000
done also the city manager so they're sorry bear with me okay, number 412

3125
03:12:52,000 --> 03:12:52,000
uh...

3126
03:12:52,000 --> 03:12:58,000
that has to do with I believe the releasing of uh...

3127
03:12:58,000 --> 03:13:00,000
of one of our use and my question just uh...

3128
03:13:01,000 --> 03:13:01,000
are we uh...

3129
03:13:01,000 --> 03:13:05,745
as far as our leasing our our management
of our building are we getting you know

3130
03:13:05,745 --> 03:13:08,000
market rate is it
is it going up uh...

3131
03:13:08,000 --> 03:13:09,000
system generics from uh...

3132
03:13:09,000 --> 03:13:10,000
mister mister uh...

3133
03:13:11,000 --> 03:13:14,000
thank you for the question council wheeler uh...

3134
03:13:16,000 --> 03:13:23,000
we, the market rates that we're getting are good, especially on this one.

3135
03:13:24,000 --> 03:13:30,000
this particular lease is one of five offices within a larger office suite.

3136
03:13:30,000 --> 03:13:35,533
so the actual per square footage price on
this one is higher than what we typically

3137
03:13:35,533 --> 03:13:38,000
would get for a
whole office on a per

3138
03:13:38,000 --> 03:13:39,000
square foot basis.

3139
03:13:39,000 --> 03:13:41,000
these folks are going to pay$350 a square foot.

3140
03:13:42,000 --> 03:13:47,090
our normal range here for general office
is$225 to$255 a square foot here in the

3141
03:13:47,090 --> 03:13:49,000
building for a general office.

3142
03:13:50,000 --> 03:13:55,000
so actually, and then our medical uses here in the building are closer to$340 to$350.

3143
03:13:57,000 --> 03:13:59,000
this is actually a pretty good, it's a win-win for both of us.

3144
03:13:59,000 --> 03:14:03,500
they only want a small space, and we're
getting a higher per square foot price on

3145
03:14:03,500 --> 03:14:04,000
this one.

3146
03:14:04,000 --> 03:14:04,000
okay.

3147
03:14:05,000 --> 03:14:05,000
that sounds good.

3148
03:14:06,000 --> 03:14:10,000
with that, I'll move to approve.

3149
03:14:10,000 --> 03:14:10,000
second.

3150
03:14:14,000 --> 03:14:14,000
okay.

3151
03:14:15,000 --> 03:14:15,000
roll call.

3152
03:14:17,000 --> 03:14:17,000
council member wheeler.

3153
03:14:18,000 --> 03:14:18,000
aye.

3154
03:14:19,000 --> 03:14:20,000
mayor pro tem mathis.

3155
03:14:21,000 --> 03:14:21,000
aye.

3156
03:14:22,000 --> 03:14:22,000
council member sweeney.

3157
03:14:23,000 --> 03:14:23,000
aye.

3158
03:14:23,000 --> 03:14:24,000
council member pezzel.

3159
03:14:24,000 --> 03:14:24,000
aye.

3160
03:14:25,000 --> 03:14:25,000
mayor kosky.

3161
03:14:25,000 --> 03:14:26,000
aye.

3162
03:14:26,000 --> 03:14:26,000
ayes have it.

3163
03:14:29,000 --> 03:14:29,000
okay, 413.

3164
03:14:32,000 --> 03:14:40,039
this one I believe is about the city side
fiber running some cables and the fiscal

3165
03:14:40,039 --> 03:14:42,000
impact said nothing,

3166
03:14:42,000 --> 03:14:46,000
but yet I still saw$1.2 million mentioned in the last sentence.

3167
03:14:46,000 --> 03:14:50,000
so is it no impact or 1.2 million or how those two fit together?

3168
03:14:51,000 --> 03:14:51,000
mr..

3169
03:14:51,000 --> 03:14:56,000
ames so this agreement does not involve city side fiber.

3170
03:14:56,000 --> 03:15:03,727
this is a agreement with the city of laguna
woods for the city of laguna hills to run

3171
03:15:03,727 --> 03:15:07,000
fiber optic cable
and their conduits

3172
03:15:07,000 --> 03:15:12,000
so we have redundant connectivity to our signals in north laguna hills and

3173
03:15:13,000 --> 03:15:19,594
so I the agenda report was meant to convey
that it's a similar kind of arrangement to

3174
03:15:19,594 --> 03:15:22,000
where we have a city side fiber

3175
03:15:22,000 --> 03:15:26,703
where we have a conduit sharing agreement
and then I went in further into the agenda

3176
03:15:26,703 --> 03:15:29,000
report to indicate
that we have some cost

3177
03:15:29,000 --> 03:15:34,129
savings due to the city side fiber agreement
on our existing regional traffic signal

3178
03:15:34,129 --> 03:15:37,000
synchronization projects
currently under design

3179
03:15:38,000 --> 03:15:43,103
that will allow for this redundant
loop that our engineering consultant is

3180
03:15:43,103 --> 03:15:44,000
recommending.

3181
03:15:44,000 --> 03:15:50,484
so because we are saving money here, we
have the ability to do this there to have a

3182
03:15:50,484 --> 03:15:54,000
redundant traffic signal
network loop in case

3183
03:15:54,000 --> 03:15:55,000
a conduit is cut.

3184
03:15:56,000 --> 03:16:01,850
it's pretty commonplace in the traffic
engineering world to have at least some

3185
03:16:01,850 --> 03:16:05,000
redundant loop
somewhere for connectivity,

3186
03:16:05,000 --> 03:16:10,429
especially in north laguna hills where we
would otherwise only be able to run fiber

3187
03:16:10,429 --> 03:16:12,000
optic cable at carlotta.

3188
03:16:13,000 --> 03:16:14,000
okay.

3189
03:16:14,000 --> 03:16:14,000
all right.

3190
03:16:14,000 --> 03:16:15,000
so that's good.

3191
03:16:15,000 --> 03:16:16,000
I saw cityside fiber.

3192
03:16:16,000 --> 03:16:20,000
I didn't know if they fit in with vad or not, but I understand what you're saying.

3193
03:16:20,000 --> 03:16:20,000
okay.

3194
03:16:21,000 --> 03:16:23,000
with that, I'll motion to move.

3195
03:16:25,000 --> 03:16:35,000
second any discussion any okay roll call customer wheeler.

3196
03:16:35,000 --> 03:16:36,000
aye. Councilmember pezold.

3197
03:16:37,000 --> 03:16:37,000
aye. Councilmember sweeney.

3198
03:16:38,000 --> 03:16:39,000
aye. We're perfect.

3199
03:16:39,000 --> 03:16:39,000
I'm at this.

3200
03:16:39,000 --> 03:16:40,000
aye. Mayor caskey.

3201
03:16:41,000 --> 03:16:41,000


3202
03:16:41,000 --> 03:16:50,000
ayes have it. 4.14 okay now the more serious ones the uvsp update

3203
03:16:53,000 --> 03:16:56,888
I was kind of upset when I saw this on the
agenda because there was no mention of it

3204
03:16:56,888 --> 03:16:58,000
that I could see before.

3205
03:17:01,000 --> 03:17:02,000
director lowe corrected me on that.

3206
03:17:02,000 --> 03:17:05,000
it was in the last or in a previous meeting.

3207
03:17:06,000 --> 03:17:10,047
and there was a from to, but I'd gone through
the first, you know, 15 or 20 pages and

3208
03:17:10,047 --> 03:17:11,000
didn't see anything.

3209
03:17:11,000 --> 03:17:14,000
so I assumed it was just a repeat of what the new one is supposed to be.

3210
03:17:14,000 --> 03:17:20,000
I went all the way through it actually yesterday and found the additional things.

3211
03:17:21,000 --> 03:17:25,000
and I just wanted to point out that it's not bad changes.

3212
03:17:25,000 --> 03:17:31,688
the only thing in there is a new paragraph
that discusses sort of the details and

3213
03:17:31,688 --> 03:17:34,000
three little caveat changes.

3214
03:17:35,000 --> 03:17:41,222
and all of them deal with single detached
family homes because there are some single

3215
03:17:41,222 --> 03:17:45,000
family detached homes
that were not in the previous

3216
03:17:45,000 --> 03:17:45,000
uvsp.

3217
03:17:47,000 --> 03:17:50,767
so I just wanted to, first of all, confirm
with director lowe that I'm correct on

3218
03:17:50,767 --> 03:17:51,000
that.

3219
03:17:53,000 --> 03:17:54,000
thank you, council member wheeler.

3220
03:17:54,000 --> 03:17:55,000
yes, you are correct.

3221
03:17:55,000 --> 03:17:56,000
okay.

3222
03:17:56,000 --> 03:17:59,000
and just to point out to the city council.

3223
03:17:59,000 --> 03:18:01,000
so I guess I would move to approve.

3224
03:18:02,000 --> 03:18:03,000
second.

3225
03:18:03,000 --> 03:18:03,000
second.

3226
03:18:05,000 --> 03:18:06,000
roll call.

3227
03:18:09,000 --> 03:18:09,000
mayor pro tem mathis.

3228
03:18:10,000 --> 03:18:10,000
aye.

3229
03:18:11,000 --> 03:18:11,000
council member sweeney.

3230
03:18:11,000 --> 03:18:12,000
aye.

3231
03:18:12,000 --> 03:18:13,000
council member pezold.

3232
03:18:13,000 --> 03:18:13,000
no.

3233
03:18:15,000 --> 03:18:16,000
council member wheeler.

3234
03:18:16,000 --> 03:18:16,000
aye.

3235
03:18:18,000 --> 03:18:18,000
yes.

3236
03:18:18,000 --> 03:18:19,000
mayor kosky.

3237
03:18:19,000 --> 03:18:19,000
aye.

3238
03:18:21,000 --> 03:18:21,000
the ayes have it.

3239
03:18:23,000 --> 03:18:24,000
okay.

3240
03:18:25,000 --> 03:18:28,000
and these next two items, or next three items, I do have comments for them.

3241
03:18:29,000 --> 03:18:29,000
okay.

3242
03:18:29,000 --> 03:18:32,000
4.15. And do we have public comments on 4.15?

3243
03:18:36,000 --> 03:18:41,789
approval of the ordinance adopting an
amended and restated development agreement

3244
03:18:41,789 --> 03:18:47,000
between the city of laguna hills
and mgp fund x laguna hills llc for the

3245
03:18:47,000 --> 03:18:54,000
village at laguna hills project public comments

3246
03:18:56,000 --> 03:18:57,000
mr.

3247
03:18:57,000 --> 03:19:01,000
mayor, if I can make a procedural comment just to remind the council.

3248
03:19:01,000 --> 03:19:02,000
we did have a public hearing.

3249
03:19:02,000 --> 03:19:04,000
it was noticed and it was closed.

3250
03:19:04,000 --> 03:19:07,281
the brown act provides that the public has
an opportunity to comment before any item

3251
03:19:07,281 --> 03:19:09,000
that's going to be
considered on the agenda.

3252
03:19:09,000 --> 03:19:12,581
so under the brown act, we need to
allow public comments, but for due process

3253
03:19:12,581 --> 03:19:13,000
purposes,

3254
03:19:14,000 --> 03:19:16,000
you shouldn't allow any additional facts to change your opinion.

3255
03:19:16,000 --> 03:19:19,943
you can always deliberate over the two
weeks or however long it's been since the

3256
03:19:19,943 --> 03:19:23,000
first motion, but you shouldn't
take additional facts tonight.

3257
03:19:23,000 --> 03:19:26,000
just as a due process issue, you've

3258
03:19:27,000 --> 03:19:30,786
of course, you can always change your
mind after deliberation, but the time to

3259
03:19:30,786 --> 03:19:32,000
consider facts is closed.

3260
03:19:32,000 --> 03:19:33,000
all right.

3261
03:19:34,000 --> 03:19:39,000
so the short of that is that we should not have public comments.

3262
03:19:39,000 --> 03:19:43,000
that's going to be additional information.

3263
03:19:43,000 --> 03:19:47,565
no, the way I summarize it is people have
to be able to speak, but you can't be able

3264
03:19:47,565 --> 03:19:48,000
to hear.

3265
03:19:48,000 --> 03:19:51,000
okay.

3266
03:19:52,000 --> 03:19:53,000
hey, we're all awake.

3267
03:19:53,000 --> 03:19:53,000
that's good.

3268
03:19:55,000 --> 03:19:57,000
okay, I need some clarification on that.

3269
03:19:57,000 --> 03:19:58,000
go ahead.

3270
03:20:00,000 --> 03:20:02,333
okay, whenever you bring anything before
the council, we always have the opportunity

3271
03:20:02,333 --> 03:20:03,000
for the public to speak.

3272
03:20:04,000 --> 03:20:08,722
and just because we voted one way on initial
reading doesn't mean it will go the same

3273
03:20:08,722 --> 03:20:10,000
way the second reading,

3274
03:20:10,000 --> 03:20:13,000
and we all gather information presumably between those two time periods.

3275
03:20:14,000 --> 03:20:18,000
so what you said I do not understand why we can't hear everything.

3276
03:20:18,000 --> 03:20:23,000
to make a final deliberation on all the facts that we hear, since it's all in public.

3277
03:20:24,000 --> 03:20:30,000
well, so it is all in public, and the public does have a right to comment.

3278
03:20:30,000 --> 03:20:33,000
but the notice went out, and we had an evidentiary hearing.

3279
03:20:34,000 --> 03:20:35,000
and we closed that evidentiary hearing.

3280
03:20:36,000 --> 03:20:43,000
if any additional facts, if the council wanted additional facts or anything else,

3281
03:20:43,000 --> 03:20:46,000
we would have had to re-notice another public hearing or continue the public hearing.

3282
03:20:47,000 --> 03:20:50,505
generally speaking, we've considered the
facts, and the time to present the facts has

3283
03:20:50,505 --> 03:20:51,000
been closed.

3284
03:20:51,000 --> 03:20:58,000
so procedurally speaking, that's where things sit at this point.

3285
03:20:59,000 --> 03:21:03,000
but isn't the public notice of this meeting, and this is an agenda item?

3286
03:21:03,000 --> 03:21:04,000
it is an agenda item.

3287
03:21:04,000 --> 03:21:05,000
that's sufficient.

3288
03:21:06,000 --> 03:21:07,000
the public does know about it.

3289
03:21:08,000 --> 03:21:10,000
that's true, but at the last meeting we closed the public hearing.

3290
03:21:12,000 --> 03:21:13,000
that's true.

3291
03:21:16,000 --> 03:21:20,000
true, but does the mayor have a right to reopen a public hearing if we re notice?

3292
03:21:20,000 --> 03:21:21,000
I'm sorry.

3293
03:21:22,000 --> 03:21:30,000
we would have to re notice okay, so I'm asking our city attorney do I?

3294
03:21:31,000 --> 03:21:36,000
entertain public comments yes on that basis or not yes entertain public comments,

3295
03:21:36,000 --> 03:21:40,032
but in your deliberations you it's it's
difficult to do but you need to be able to

3296
03:21:40,032 --> 03:21:42,000
parse through new
facts versus facts you

3297
03:21:42,000 --> 03:21:42,000
already heard there.

3298
03:21:42,000 --> 03:21:43,000
I just want to okay.

3299
03:21:43,000 --> 03:21:48,000
yes, all right, so city clerk bruce johnson you

3300
03:22:01,000 --> 03:22:01,000
welcome, bruce.

3301
03:22:02,000 --> 03:22:03,000
thank you.

3302
03:22:06,000 --> 03:22:06,000
mr.

3303
03:22:06,000 --> 03:22:10,403
mayor, members of council, and ladies
and gentlemen, thank you for giving me the

3304
03:22:10,403 --> 03:22:12,000
opportunity to speak tonight.

3305
03:22:13,000 --> 03:22:15,000
I promise you old facts tonight.

3306
03:22:16,000 --> 03:22:16,000
nothing new.

3307
03:22:17,000 --> 03:22:18,000
my name is bruce johnson.

3308
03:22:19,000 --> 03:22:25,000
I'm here on behalf of rona henry and the welcoming neighbors home initiative.

3309
03:22:26,000 --> 03:22:30,000
we're a coalition of residents who believe that the lack of affordable housing

3310
03:22:31,000 --> 03:22:35,000
is one of the most critical issues of our time, one that is only becoming more urgent.

3311
03:22:37,000 --> 03:22:41,500
we remain in support of this council approving
the revised development agreement for

3312
03:22:41,500 --> 03:22:43,000
the village at laguna hills.

3313
03:22:45,000 --> 03:22:48,000
there are three main benefits that we see to the revised plan.

3314
03:22:49,000 --> 03:22:53,000
this project will provide 200 lower income senior homes,

3315
03:22:54,000 --> 03:23:00,375
we're pleased that 10% of the units will be
reserved for people at 30% of the area of

3316
03:23:00,375 --> 03:23:03,000
median income,
about$30,000 a year.

3317
03:23:04,000 --> 03:23:08,308
it's commendable that the affordable
housing would be built in the first phase of

3318
03:23:08,308 --> 03:23:09,000
construction.

3319
03:23:10,000 --> 03:23:16,000
and finally, we like its location by the oc bus depot and memorial hospital.

3320
03:23:18,000 --> 03:23:20,000
our coalition continues to believe

3321
03:23:20,000 --> 03:23:25,000
that this site would be ideal for multifamily workforce affordable housing.

3322
03:23:27,000 --> 03:23:31,782
moreover, because it's so badly needed,
we urge you to work to facilitate the

3323
03:23:31,782 --> 03:23:37,000
building of multifamily workforce affordable
housing in laguna hills into the future

3324
03:23:37,000 --> 03:23:37,000
as well.

3325
03:23:39,000 --> 03:23:43,634
we understand that it's important to approve
this plan now so that the developer can

3326
03:23:43,634 --> 03:23:47,000
meet the fall deadline for
getting financing for the project.

3327
03:23:49,000 --> 03:23:53,730
if the project is not approved now, there's
a real danger that construction may be

3328
03:23:53,730 --> 03:23:55,000
significantly delayed.

3329
03:23:57,000 --> 03:24:02,354
the revised plan is a definite improvement
over the previous one, and we ask you to

3330
03:24:02,354 --> 03:24:05,000
vote yes on the revised
development plan.

3331
03:24:07,000 --> 03:24:07,000
any thanks.

3332
03:24:08,000 --> 03:24:10,000
thank you for your thoughts and your comment.

3333
03:24:11,000 --> 03:24:12,000
any others?

3334
03:24:13,000 --> 03:24:14,000
kathy udovch.

3335
03:24:29,000 --> 03:24:32,000
this meeting's been going on for a while, so I'm going to be quick.

3336
03:24:32,000 --> 03:24:35,000
this is opinion, so don't worry about any facts being spilled out.

3337
03:24:37,000 --> 03:24:40,000
my name's kathy udovch, and I live here in laguna hills.

3338
03:24:40,000 --> 03:24:41,000
I've lived here for about 15 years.

3339
03:24:43,000 --> 03:24:46,000
I cannot wait for something to happen to that mall project.

3340
03:24:47,000 --> 03:24:49,000
I want some demolition.

3341
03:24:49,000 --> 03:24:51,000
I want to see things being built.

3342
03:24:51,000 --> 03:24:55,000
I want all the noise because it knows that something's going on.

3343
03:24:56,000 --> 03:25:00,315
I do appreciate the fact that you're going
to have one of your first constructions

3344
03:25:00,315 --> 03:25:03,000
that's going to be the
senior living with the lower

3345
03:25:03,000 --> 03:25:04,000
income included in that.

3346
03:25:05,000 --> 03:25:06,000
that's really great.

3347
03:25:08,000 --> 03:25:13,000
I also wanted to mention that I love the idea of a central community park.

3348
03:25:14,000 --> 03:25:17,830
because it gives us just another place for
community activities and everything like

3349
03:25:17,830 --> 03:25:20,000
that, which I know is
over at the civic center,

3350
03:25:20,000 --> 03:25:23,000
so I really like, not the civic center, community center.

3351
03:25:26,000 --> 03:25:30,956
and so just having another place to
actually have activities and have people

3352
03:25:30,956 --> 03:25:35,000
gathering, shopping, eating,
living, and just visiting people.

3353
03:25:35,000 --> 03:25:36,000
so that's really awesome.

3354
03:25:37,000 --> 03:25:40,000
it helps our little city sort of have a central place

3355
03:25:40,000 --> 03:25:45,463
gathering place since we are a little city
although we're kind of spread out so this

3356
03:25:45,463 --> 03:25:48,000
puts it a little bit
more in the middle

3357
03:25:48,000 --> 03:25:52,846
especially for me who on the other side
of laguna woods I also like the idea that

3358
03:25:52,846 --> 03:25:55,000
there's going to
be two hotels built

3359
03:25:55,000 --> 03:25:58,000
soon as a travel advisor.

3360
03:25:58,000 --> 03:26:04,307
I can't wait to start booking them just
saying and yeah, that's that's pretty much

3361
03:26:04,307 --> 03:26:07,000
all I had to say
about this so yes,

3362
03:26:07,000 --> 03:26:10,000
please go ahead and do your thing and

3363
03:26:10,000 --> 03:26:11,000
thumbs up.

3364
03:26:11,000 --> 03:26:12,000
that's what we do.

3365
03:26:12,000 --> 03:26:13,000
we do our thing.

3366
03:26:13,000 --> 03:26:14,000
thank you for your comment.

3367
03:26:14,000 --> 03:26:15,000
all right, thanks.

3368
03:26:17,000 --> 03:26:19,581
I have no more comments, but I do
need to read the names of all the online

3369
03:26:19,581 --> 03:26:20,000
submissions.

3370
03:26:21,000 --> 03:26:21,000
please do.

3371
03:26:22,000 --> 03:26:28,709
michaela nozaki, kathy temple, christine
morinello, barbara siry, jeffrey gothard,

3372
03:26:28,709 --> 03:26:31,000
holly magana, judy northrop,

3373
03:26:32,000 --> 03:26:38,737
bruce johnson, rayna hamre, laura shapiro,
carol mcvay, vicki hines, marcella lawson,

3374
03:26:38,737 --> 03:26:45,000
ann beltran, sayre weaver, rona henry,
david salahi, alice soto, john mendonca,

3375
03:26:46,000 --> 03:26:50,000
keith tuominen, wendy washington, and cesar covarrubias.

3376
03:26:51,000 --> 03:26:51,000
okay.

3377
03:26:53,000 --> 03:26:54,000
back to you, dave.

3378
03:26:54,000 --> 03:26:54,000
do you have any?

3379
03:26:57,000 --> 03:26:58,000
you pulled it off, so...

3380
03:26:59,000 --> 03:26:59,000
okay.

3381
03:27:01,000 --> 03:27:04,000
I've got a few things to say, and I think my colleague has a few things to say.

3382
03:27:04,000 --> 03:27:07,000
you want to go first?

3383
03:27:07,000 --> 03:27:08,000
I'll let you.

3384
03:27:09,000 --> 03:27:09,000
okay.

3385
03:27:09,000 --> 03:27:11,000
let me start with a couple things.

3386
03:27:14,000 --> 03:27:19,000
actually, robert, could you open up the thumb drive thing I gave you?

3387
03:27:19,000 --> 03:27:20,000
there's one slide in there.

3388
03:27:20,000 --> 03:27:24,000
the slide I meant for the next two things, but one of them is pertinent at this point.

3389
03:27:31,000 --> 03:27:32,000
okay, that's not it.

3390
03:27:36,000 --> 03:27:37,000
right there.

3391
03:27:37,000 --> 03:27:38,000
that's the one that's...

3392
03:27:38,000 --> 03:27:48,000
can you go up a little bit more?

3393
03:27:48,000 --> 03:27:49,000
I want to see what else I have in there.

3394
03:27:51,000 --> 03:27:51,000
okay, okay.

3395
03:27:52,000 --> 03:27:52,000
go back to that one then.

3396
03:27:53,000 --> 03:27:54,000
yeah, that one right there.

3397
03:27:54,000 --> 03:27:55,000
okay.

3398
03:27:57,000 --> 03:28:01,000
I'll go in detail about this chart said it was meant for another purpose tonight,

3399
03:28:02,000 --> 03:28:10,842
but I want you to look at the yellow line
this project for our total commercial area

3400
03:28:10,842 --> 03:28:14,000
in the el toro area in general

3401
03:28:14,000 --> 03:28:14,000
there.

3402
03:28:14,000 --> 03:28:19,757
it's about ninety nine point seven seven
acres approved or allocated and the

3403
03:28:19,757 --> 03:28:24,000
allocations mainly to the
quote-unquote mall project and

3404
03:28:25,000 --> 03:28:27,000
the triangle across the street is also included there,

3405
03:28:27,000 --> 03:28:34,023
but that's that's small potatoes compared
to this eighty two point eight the what's

3406
03:28:34,023 --> 03:28:38,000
the fifth column over
there to date we have had

3407
03:28:38,000 --> 03:28:43,862
zero affordable housing houses or apartments
or anything built the percentage of loss

3408
03:28:43,862 --> 03:28:48,000
now of that area commercial
area is now eighty three percent

3409
03:28:49,000 --> 03:28:53,000
so eighty three percent that whole area around the el toro is gone for

3410
03:28:54,000 --> 03:28:54,000
for commercial.

3411
03:28:55,000 --> 03:28:57,000
and I even allocated the 82.8.

3412
03:28:58,000 --> 03:29:02,375
I actually added back in 10 acres for the
little few commercial things that are left

3413
03:29:02,375 --> 03:29:03,000
in the mall.

3414
03:29:03,000 --> 03:29:05,000
that's an overestimate.

3415
03:29:05,000 --> 03:29:06,000
it's probably much smaller than that.

3416
03:29:07,000 --> 03:29:08,000
so it's probably higher than 83%.

3417
03:29:08,000 --> 03:29:14,877
so I just want to talk to you that we
are giving up the prize jewel of all laguna

3418
03:29:14,877 --> 03:29:17,000
hills and now we're given

3419
03:29:17,000 --> 03:29:23,000
away and lost or will lose 83% of our best area for commercial.

3420
03:29:24,000 --> 03:29:28,000
the uvsp, we already talked about that the changes were minor.

3421
03:29:28,000 --> 03:29:33,754
I've contended, and I will repeat it again
and probably forever, this project does

3422
03:29:33,754 --> 03:29:36,000
not meet and never met the uvsp.

3423
03:29:37,000 --> 03:29:40,000
the uvsp actually had a lot of wise things in what was written.

3424
03:29:42,000 --> 03:29:46,000
they thought ahead and they said, okay, we don't want to go hog wild into something.

3425
03:29:47,000 --> 03:29:48,000
that's why they put limitations in there.

3426
03:29:49,000 --> 03:29:51,000
we can only change the commercial by so many square feet.

3427
03:29:52,000 --> 03:29:55,000
we can only change the residences by so many, like the limit was 200.

3428
03:29:55,000 --> 03:29:58,000
that was total for each change.

3429
03:29:59,000 --> 03:30:02,589
it was so that we wouldn't go just, you
know, like I said, hog wild in one direction

3430
03:30:02,589 --> 03:30:04,000
and realize we've
made a mistake.

3431
03:30:05,000 --> 03:30:09,742
we wanted to grow slowly and gradually so
we could take in the new situation that's

3432
03:30:09,742 --> 03:30:11,000
happened all the time.

3433
03:30:11,000 --> 03:30:14,000
and if any project is a lesser of that, it's this one.

3434
03:30:15,000 --> 03:30:19,000
the property was bought in 2013, and nothing has happened except it's been torn down.

3435
03:30:20,000 --> 03:30:23,843
and every, I guess it's about average,
about every four years, my loan guard comes

3436
03:30:23,843 --> 03:30:26,000
back and says, oh,
everything has changed now.

3437
03:30:26,000 --> 03:30:28,000
we can't do it the way we did it before.

3438
03:30:28,000 --> 03:30:30,000
and this is the same as last time.

3439
03:30:31,000 --> 03:30:32,000
I mean, first, it's so we can't have any...

3440
03:30:33,000 --> 03:30:37,000
we can't have that much commercial or that much retail because nobody goes to malls.

3441
03:30:37,000 --> 03:30:41,885
then it was, oh, well, we can't have any
office building because nobody's taking

3442
03:30:41,885 --> 03:30:45,000
their business and operating
out of office anymore.

3443
03:30:46,000 --> 03:30:49,405
where all these things are true, they
keep changing every four years, and we're

3444
03:30:49,405 --> 03:30:51,000
getting nothing,
nothing at all done,

3445
03:30:51,000 --> 03:30:54,000
and we're giving away all of our future for el toro.

3446
03:30:56,000 --> 03:30:58,000
I'll yield to my colleague now.

3447
03:30:59,000 --> 03:30:59,000
that's all.

3448
03:31:00,000 --> 03:31:00,000
erica?

3449
03:31:00,000 --> 03:31:01,000
erica?

3450
03:31:02,000 --> 03:31:12,000
so first of all, I want to point out that the developer that merlone geier,

3451
03:31:14,000 --> 03:31:18,712
it seems that they have multiple llcs
depending on which property they are dealing

3452
03:31:18,712 --> 03:31:19,000
with.

3453
03:31:20,000 --> 03:31:26,978
and these are protections for merlone
geier, but we are in a development agreement

3454
03:31:26,978 --> 03:31:28,000
with an llc.

3455
03:31:30,000 --> 03:31:35,917
and I think that we need to have specific
discussions, and perhaps we should bring

3456
03:31:35,917 --> 03:31:37,000
this up in a...

3457
03:31:39,000 --> 03:31:47,191
we need to have discussions because we
just had a presentation about the land and

3458
03:31:47,191 --> 03:31:48,000
about...

3459
03:31:50,000 --> 03:31:52,000
with respect to where the roads are going to go.

3460
03:31:52,000 --> 03:31:56,000
I think there's a lot of things up in the air right now.

3461
03:31:56,000 --> 03:31:56,000
and...

3462
03:31:58,000 --> 03:32:03,000
groups could perhaps, there could be legal consequences.

3463
03:32:04,000 --> 03:32:06,000
and I think we haven't flushed that through.

3464
03:32:07,000 --> 03:32:13,511
and I think that that's something that we
should have had some conversations because

3465
03:32:13,511 --> 03:32:17,000
if there is some sort
of legal ramifications,

3466
03:32:17,000 --> 03:32:25,000
who is going to wind up with the bill of that, especially if an llc decides to abandon

3467
03:32:27,000 --> 03:32:33,000
and essentially, I mean, if an llc just stops, who pays for after that?

3468
03:32:33,000 --> 03:32:41,673
so I think that we have, I think that we,
and this is something I did bring up in the

3469
03:32:41,673 --> 03:32:43,000
last meeting.

3470
03:32:43,000 --> 03:32:48,000
I also want to point out this is something that has been discussed.

3471
03:32:49,000 --> 03:32:53,329
and I'm curious, I guess I don't know if
we're allowed to ask, but this is something

3472
03:32:53,329 --> 03:32:54,000
that we have,

3473
03:32:56,000 --> 03:33:03,791
a city council are the client of our attorney
and being a client that means there are

3474
03:33:03,791 --> 03:33:07,000
five body members
that are a client

3475
03:33:07,000 --> 03:33:15,112
and should be treated equally equally as
such I don't recall receiving a phone call

3476
03:33:15,112 --> 03:33:20,000
about what are my thoughts
are on this development

3477
03:33:20,000 --> 03:33:28,453
agreement I didn't have any discussions
with respect until right before the meeting

3478
03:33:28,453 --> 03:33:31,000
the attorney reached out.

3479
03:33:32,000 --> 03:33:37,000
and that is, I am just saying I am the client.

3480
03:33:38,000 --> 03:33:41,000
and that is something that was a huge mishap.

3481
03:33:43,000 --> 03:33:47,000
and that and usually with clients you want to make sure that you

3482
03:33:49,000 --> 03:33:51,000
have conversations with your client.

3483
03:33:52,000 --> 03:33:57,957
so I'm just pointing that out and I'm not
sure if councilmember wheeler had that and

3484
03:33:57,957 --> 03:34:02,000
I'm not sure how many
conversations councilmember sweeney

3485
03:34:02,000 --> 03:34:07,000
had that we as being having legal representation.

3486
03:34:07,000 --> 03:34:09,000
I don't know if I'm allowed to ask.

3487
03:34:12,000 --> 03:34:13,000
okay.

3488
03:34:16,000 --> 03:34:23,118
okay, and and I just want I just want to
make aware that we are and that's that that

3489
03:34:23,118 --> 03:34:26,000
we are the client
and that that is

3490
03:34:26,000 --> 03:34:32,136
with any legal issue everyone should be
treated equally and I feel and this was a

3491
03:34:32,136 --> 03:34:36,000
disrespect with respect
to the council and a client

3492
03:34:36,000 --> 03:34:39,000
and the client we were overstepped

3493
03:34:40,000 --> 03:34:44,000
and that's completely inappropriate, especially when it's a legal document.

3494
03:34:45,000 --> 03:34:49,000
every person on the council should have been contacted, questions answered,

3495
03:34:49,000 --> 03:34:54,944
everything should have been flushed through
independently so that concerns could have

3496
03:34:54,944 --> 03:34:59,000
been discussed about legal
issues with the legal document,

3497
03:35:00,000 --> 03:35:04,000
especially when you have a hired attorney for that purpose.

3498
03:35:05,000 --> 03:35:08,000
I am very concerned about the development agreements

3499
03:35:09,000 --> 03:35:16,574
I mean, inadequate public benefits and
infrastructure provisions, weak accountability

3500
03:35:16,574 --> 03:35:18,000
and enforcement.

3501
03:35:20,000 --> 03:35:27,181
I think that there are inadequate financial
assurances, like performance bonds,

3502
03:35:27,181 --> 03:35:32,000
letters of credit, security
promises, like to insure.

3503
03:35:32,000 --> 03:35:35,000
we don't have the letters to make sure that there's backings.

3504
03:35:38,000 --> 03:35:43,152
what about what about the checkpoints
and the mandatory progress reports the

3505
03:35:43,152 --> 03:35:46,000
checkpoints and what
are the consequences?

3506
03:35:48,000 --> 03:35:53,790
we have had a number of situations over
the past number of years where the property

3507
03:35:53,790 --> 03:35:57,000
is laid completely vacant
and we've had issues

3508
03:35:57,000 --> 03:36:01,754
and I and we were told on the dais that we
can't enforce it because it wasn't in the

3509
03:36:01,754 --> 03:36:03,000
development agreement.

3510
03:36:03,000 --> 03:36:06,455
but then we're told, oh, we should have that
in the development agreement so they can

3511
03:36:06,455 --> 03:36:08,000
leave the property
essentially vacant.

3512
03:36:09,000 --> 03:36:14,662
and they can leave it, but we don't have a
way to make sure that that property looks

3513
03:36:14,662 --> 03:36:15,000
nice.

3514
03:36:15,000 --> 03:36:20,659
I mean, that is one of the largest complaints
in the city, yet we're not addressing

3515
03:36:20,659 --> 03:36:21,000
that.

3516
03:36:21,000 --> 03:36:23,000
and so I think that...

3517
03:36:23,000 --> 03:36:25,000
that wasn't handled.

3518
03:36:27,000 --> 03:36:37,022
I think that we also, cities with da s
that aren't strong, which is what I believe

3519
03:36:37,022 --> 03:36:38,000
this da,

3520
03:36:39,000 --> 03:36:41,000
they end up with stalled or incomplete projects.

3521
03:36:42,000 --> 03:36:47,000
stalled is a sign, a negative sign with any da, and we have it twice.

3522
03:36:49,000 --> 03:36:51,000
that is a huge red flag.

3523
03:36:55,000 --> 03:37:04,910
in it also creates locked in miss mismatch
developments it can create issues within

3524
03:37:04,910 --> 03:37:11,000
the city and the stalled
cities end up with stalled

3525
03:37:11,000 --> 03:37:17,747
incomplete projects I mean there's just
just a number of red flags where it doesn't

3526
03:37:17,747 --> 03:37:21,000
benefit our city I
think that we I think

3527
03:37:21,000 --> 03:37:25,000
that we also should have had these conversations.

3528
03:37:25,000 --> 03:37:29,000
I'm concerned about the public outreach and our vulnerability.

3529
03:37:30,000 --> 03:37:32,000
we did not have

3530
03:37:33,000 --> 03:37:38,558
any public outreach and I don't believe
that our committee had open houses to engage

3531
03:37:38,558 --> 03:37:42,000
with the community and see
what our community wants.

3532
03:37:43,000 --> 03:37:50,904
see about how a number of people feel about
the project and where it stands and the

3533
03:37:50,904 --> 03:37:55,000
community was absent
because they feel like

3534
03:37:55,000 --> 03:38:00,000
their voices are no longer necessary and they feel railroaded in this process.

3535
03:38:01,000 --> 03:38:06,864
so and it's very evident that we are
being railroaded in this process and I am

3536
03:38:06,864 --> 03:38:11,000
worried about the fiscal
the financial stability of our

3537
03:38:11,000 --> 03:38:12,000
city.

3538
03:38:12,000 --> 03:38:21,081
I I want to I would like to really stress
financially it has been told that the path

3539
03:38:21,081 --> 03:38:24,000
that we've been on we stand

3540
03:38:24,000 --> 03:38:28,000
we if we don't make a huge shift bankruptcy

3541
03:38:29,000 --> 03:38:30,000
is in our trajectory.

3542
03:38:31,000 --> 03:38:31,000
seven years.

3543
03:38:33,000 --> 03:38:37,226
and this project, I don't, it doesn't look
like it satisfies it besides increasing

3544
03:38:37,226 --> 03:38:38,000
the population.

3545
03:38:38,000 --> 03:38:39,000
it doesn't pay for itself.

3546
03:38:40,000 --> 03:38:44,930
so I think that we are not, we are looking
at things that are not positive and we

3547
03:38:44,930 --> 03:38:47,000
have to be very
cognizant of that.

3548
03:38:48,000 --> 03:38:54,125
so with that, I mean, I can put this out
there, but I understand it can't be weighed

3549
03:38:54,125 --> 03:38:55,000
on, but I at

3550
03:38:55,000 --> 03:38:57,000
least can put this out there.

3551
03:38:59,000 --> 03:39:03,000
I yield my comments.

3552
03:39:05,000 --> 03:39:06,000
are you adding a comment?

3553
03:39:06,000 --> 03:39:07,000
yes.

3554
03:39:07,000 --> 03:39:08,000
okay, go ahead.

3555
03:39:08,000 --> 03:39:09,000
I'll let you do that.

3556
03:39:10,000 --> 03:39:11,000
hopefully it's not duplicative.

3557
03:39:12,000 --> 03:39:12,000
excuse me?

3558
03:39:13,000 --> 03:39:15,000
hopefully it's not duplicative.

3559
03:39:15,000 --> 03:39:18,000
we've heard pretty much everything but the kitchen sink here.

3560
03:39:19,000 --> 03:39:23,047
well, one thing is duplicative because it
deserves to be, and that is that there's no

3561
03:39:23,047 --> 03:39:24,000
time to review this.

3562
03:39:26,000 --> 03:39:28,000
we were given it a few days before the meeting.

3563
03:39:28,000 --> 03:39:32,872
this was the you know, the subcommittee's
report, and it's like, you know, and we

3564
03:39:32,872 --> 03:39:36,000
refused any ability to
review it and said, you know,

3565
03:39:36,000 --> 03:39:37,000
you don't need to, basically.

3566
03:39:37,000 --> 03:39:40,000
we made the decision, and I don't appreciate that.

3567
03:39:40,000 --> 03:39:42,000
I had no chance to see what was in there.

3568
03:39:44,000 --> 03:39:48,414
there was some inaccuries, I think, in the
presentation, one of which was about the

3569
03:39:48,414 --> 03:39:49,000
financials.

3570
03:39:52,000 --> 03:39:56,000
there were two things, and only two things, that the ad hoc got

3571
03:39:57,000 --> 03:39:59,000
that wasn't already in the agreement.

3572
03:39:59,000 --> 03:40:01,000
I mean, the quimby funds and all those other things,

3573
03:40:02,000 --> 03:40:04,549
they were already there from the time that
jeanine and I were on the ad hoc committee

3574
03:40:04,549 --> 03:40:05,000
the first time.

3575
03:40:06,000 --> 03:40:06,000
there was nothing new there.

3576
03:40:07,000 --> 03:40:11,510
the two things that were new, the tot for
the second hotel, that is new, that is an

3577
03:40:11,510 --> 03:40:12,000
addition.

3578
03:40:13,000 --> 03:40:17,000
and the other thing that is new, and it's a pittance, and I probably need...

3579
03:40:19,000 --> 03:40:24,265
uh director lowe to to check this out but
uh and that is that when you change from an

3580
03:40:24,265 --> 03:40:26,000
apartment which you get like

3581
03:40:26,000 --> 03:40:31,317
fifteen hundred dollars for or fifteen
thousand dollars and you go to a house a

3582
03:40:31,317 --> 03:40:33,000
single family you get 18.

3583
03:40:33,000 --> 03:40:38,250
so you get you get a few a few dollars more
for that other than that the city gained

3584
03:40:38,250 --> 03:40:40,000
no financially I didn't have

3585
03:40:40,000 --> 03:40:43,980
any financial gain at all on this and what
we eliminated was approximately 120,000

3586
03:40:43,980 --> 03:40:45,000
square feet of retail

3587
03:40:48,000 --> 03:40:53,000
which again impacts our ability to do taxes and have any money come in.

3588
03:40:54,000 --> 03:40:58,819
and I also, after the earlier discussion we
had with the octa came in here and wants

3589
03:40:58,819 --> 03:41:01,000
to put a road right
through the hotel,

3590
03:41:04,000 --> 03:41:07,863
we brought this up a bit last time, and we
were told, well, we'll just move the hotel

3591
03:41:07,863 --> 03:41:09,000
if that actually happens.

3592
03:41:10,000 --> 03:41:15,634
but I've heard no assurance that that
hotel will be moved and will be kept to

3593
03:41:15,634 --> 03:41:19,000
maintain that one large
input in the financial

3594
03:41:19,000 --> 03:41:19,000
stimulus.

3595
03:41:21,000 --> 03:41:25,941
and I don't know, I guess we can't ask the
applicant of that because you said dexity

3596
03:41:25,941 --> 03:41:27,000
closed everything.

3597
03:41:27,000 --> 03:41:28,000
we're going to call him, but...

3598
03:41:30,000 --> 03:41:31,000
but I don't know.

3599
03:41:31,000 --> 03:41:33,000
maybe I can ask our counsel, though.

3600
03:41:34,000 --> 03:41:36,798
or you can ask the applicant questions
that are germane to what was already

3601
03:41:36,798 --> 03:41:39,000
considered as part of the
evidence during the last hearing.

3602
03:41:39,000 --> 03:41:42,085
you know, a lot of this that's being
discussed was part of the facts that came up

3603
03:41:42,085 --> 03:41:43,000
during the last hearing.

3604
03:41:43,000 --> 03:41:45,000
so it doesn't mean you can't discuss anything.

3605
03:41:45,000 --> 03:41:46,000
we just don't want to bring in something completely new.

3606
03:41:46,000 --> 03:41:46,000
all right.

3607
03:41:47,000 --> 03:41:51,666
I would like to ask the applicant, then,
if there, and also the counsel, if there is

3608
03:41:51,666 --> 03:41:52,000
solid,

3609
03:41:52,000 --> 03:41:56,000
ironclad assurances in the da that the hotel number two

3610
03:41:57,000 --> 03:42:01,662
if the road goes through it, then it will
be moved and it will be built in a timely

3611
03:42:01,662 --> 03:42:02,000
basis.

3612
03:42:04,000 --> 03:42:05,000
mr.

3613
03:42:05,000 --> 03:42:05,000
clark.

3614
03:42:08,000 --> 03:42:09,000
is this on?

3615
03:42:09,000 --> 03:42:11,000
yes.

3616
03:42:11,000 --> 03:42:16,519
councilman wheeler, I can't give you any
assurance that the hotel will be built if

3617
03:42:16,519 --> 03:42:18,000
the road goes through.

3618
03:42:19,000 --> 03:42:22,000
they are obligated to provide an alternative facility.

3619
03:42:22,000 --> 03:42:28,000
for hotel number one, which is where the area that it's interfered with, and they

3620
03:42:28,000 --> 03:42:31,934
can't proceed with the rest of the
development unless they complete, unless they

3621
03:42:31,934 --> 03:42:34,000
commence construction
of hotel number one.

3622
03:42:35,000 --> 03:42:35,000
okay.

3623
03:42:35,000 --> 03:42:35,000
okay.

3624
03:42:35,000 --> 03:42:36,000
hotel number one then.

3625
03:42:36,000 --> 03:42:37,000
okay.

3626
03:42:37,000 --> 03:42:39,000
let me be more specific so I understand this.

3627
03:42:40,000 --> 03:42:44,414
if the, if octa wins, they go eminent domain
or whatever and they get that, it goes

3628
03:42:44,414 --> 03:42:45,000
through one

3629
03:42:46,000 --> 03:42:51,142
then that hotel has to be moved, and it
still has to be built basically first before

3630
03:42:51,142 --> 03:42:52,000
anything else,

3631
03:42:52,000 --> 03:42:53,000
and that's if that would slow down the whole project?

3632
03:42:55,000 --> 03:43:02,022
the first phase includes the two retail
buildings, the two anchor buildings and

3633
03:43:02,022 --> 03:43:03,000
retail one,

3634
03:43:04,000 --> 03:43:09,000
along with hotel one and the low-income housing for the senior project.

3635
03:43:09,000 --> 03:43:11,000
okay, so hotel one isn't...

3636
03:43:11,000 --> 03:43:16,600
isn't the first part, so if something impacts
that, no pun intended, and it can't be

3637
03:43:16,600 --> 03:43:17,000
built,

3638
03:43:17,000 --> 03:43:18,000
the rest of the project gets delayed and stopped?

3639
03:43:19,000 --> 03:43:19,000
correct.

3640
03:43:19,000 --> 03:43:20,000
okay.

3641
03:43:20,000 --> 03:43:23,232
that's not a good thing, and it's a big
question about whether we should even be

3642
03:43:23,232 --> 03:43:24,000
proceeding on that.

3643
03:43:27,000 --> 03:43:27,000
okay.

3644
03:43:28,000 --> 03:43:29,000
that's all I have for right now.

3645
03:43:29,000 --> 03:43:32,000
all right.

3646
03:43:33,000 --> 03:43:36,000
there were a couple of accusations made about

3647
03:43:37,000 --> 03:43:41,462
some legalities as to whether, you know,
due notice was made and all the other kind

3648
03:43:41,462 --> 03:43:42,000
of things.

3649
03:43:43,000 --> 03:43:47,000
I'm just going to ask you, I thought we put all of that to bed in the last meeting.

3650
03:43:47,000 --> 03:43:55,000
do we have an issue here with any notices to council and all this other stuff?

3651
03:43:57,000 --> 03:43:59,000
we passed this the first time around.

3652
03:44:00,000 --> 03:44:01,000
it did.

3653
03:44:01,000 --> 03:44:01,000
in the first reading.

3654
03:44:02,000 --> 03:44:03,000
it passed the first read.

3655
03:44:03,000 --> 03:44:05,000
notice went out to the public.

3656
03:44:07,000 --> 03:44:11,611
and council received the agenda packet at
the same time that it was released to the

3657
03:44:11,611 --> 03:44:12,000
public.

3658
03:44:13,000 --> 03:44:15,000
that's the legal requirements.

3659
03:44:15,000 --> 03:44:16,000
okay.

3660
03:44:16,000 --> 03:44:16,000
thank you very much.

3661
03:44:17,000 --> 03:44:21,000
so I'm going to make a comment.

3662
03:44:22,000 --> 03:44:29,555
almost everything that my two colleagues on
the right-hand side of me said I disagree

3663
03:44:29,555 --> 03:44:30,000
with.

3664
03:44:31,000 --> 03:44:36,000
we worked very, very hard for three years to make this a reality for this city.

3665
03:44:37,000 --> 03:44:40,000
and for 12 years, it was not a reality.

3666
03:44:41,000 --> 03:44:42,000
I wasn't here.

3667
03:44:42,000 --> 03:44:43,000
I wish I was.

3668
03:44:43,000 --> 03:44:45,000
and, you know, maybe it would have happened earlier.

3669
03:44:46,000 --> 03:44:53,139
the 70,000 or 80,000 square feet of retail
that's gone is basically a theater and a

3670
03:44:53,139 --> 03:44:54,000
gym, okay?

3671
03:44:54,000 --> 03:44:56,000
it's not real retail.

3672
03:44:56,000 --> 03:44:58,000
it's not creating sales tax.

3673
03:44:59,000 --> 03:45:02,000
I mean, I could go on and on and on, and I won't.

3674
03:45:03,000 --> 03:45:04,000
so I move that...

3675
03:45:05,000 --> 03:45:10,000
item number 4.15 be adopted in a second reading.

3676
03:45:11,000 --> 03:45:12,000
do we have a second?

3677
03:45:12,000 --> 03:45:12,000
we have a second.

3678
03:45:13,000 --> 03:45:14,000
we have a second.

3679
03:45:15,000 --> 03:45:16,000
roll call vote.

3680
03:45:16,000 --> 03:45:17,000
no, you have to have a discussion first.

3681
03:45:19,000 --> 03:45:20,000
you have to have a discussion after the second.

3682
03:45:20,000 --> 03:45:21,000
we have a second.

3683
03:45:22,000 --> 03:45:22,000
I know.

3684
03:45:22,000 --> 03:45:24,000
you have to have a discussion after the second.

3685
03:45:25,000 --> 03:45:26,000
you have to ask for a discussion.

3686
03:45:29,000 --> 03:45:30,000
I'm not following it.

3687
03:45:30,000 --> 03:45:31,000
sorry.

3688
03:45:32,000 --> 03:45:33,000
I can't hear everybody.

3689
03:45:33,000 --> 03:45:37,409
I don't believe the city follows robert's
rules of order specifically, but under

3690
03:45:37,409 --> 03:45:40,000
robert's rules, which
is often used as a guide,

3691
03:45:40,000 --> 03:45:43,000
after there's a motion and a second, then it's open for discussion on the motion.

3692
03:45:44,000 --> 03:45:45,000
yes.

3693
03:45:45,000 --> 03:45:46,000
we've always done it that way.

3694
03:45:47,000 --> 03:45:48,000
okay.

3695
03:45:48,000 --> 03:45:50,000
I don't know why you disagree with stuff I said.

3696
03:45:51,000 --> 03:45:58,000
there's only two new revenue streams, tot and the change in the apartment to houses.

3697
03:45:58,000 --> 03:45:59,000
can you tell me of another one?

3698
03:46:02,000 --> 03:46:03,000
already made my comments.

3699
03:46:03,000 --> 03:46:10,083
I'm ready there's no if I'm if I'm wrong
that there's another benefit financially the

3700
03:46:10,083 --> 03:46:13,000
city I like know
what it is I think

3701
03:46:14,000 --> 03:46:19,000
it's all been out there before we're just going over the same old stuff.

3702
03:46:19,000 --> 03:46:19,000
no, that's the problem.

3703
03:46:20,000 --> 03:46:20,000
it has not been out there.

3704
03:46:21,000 --> 03:46:21,000
that's the problem.

3705
03:46:21,000 --> 03:46:23,000
I had no chance to review it before the first reading.

3706
03:46:23,000 --> 03:46:24,000
I don't agree with anything you're saying.

3707
03:46:24,000 --> 03:46:26,000
no reasonable chance at all to review that.

3708
03:46:27,000 --> 03:46:30,772
and now that this appears, you know, you
haven't contradicted me, so I say there is

3709
03:46:30,772 --> 03:46:32,000
nothing else but those two.

3710
03:46:34,000 --> 03:46:39,000
and you talked about, you know, the theater and the gym didn't produce much.

3711
03:46:39,000 --> 03:46:42,000
well, you put on whole foods, right?

3712
03:46:43,000 --> 03:46:44,000
a whole food sells food.

3713
03:46:45,000 --> 03:46:46,000
food is not taxed in california.

3714
03:46:46,000 --> 03:46:47,000
so that's another big zero.

3715
03:46:48,000 --> 03:46:49,000
okay, there we go.

3716
03:46:49,000 --> 03:46:50,000
so that's, you know, nothing.

3717
03:46:51,000 --> 03:46:53,000
I'm not getting involved in this filibuster.

3718
03:46:53,000 --> 03:46:55,000
this is a bunch of baloney.

3719
03:46:56,000 --> 03:46:57,000
no, it's not a bunch of baloney.

3720
03:46:57,000 --> 03:46:57,000
it's a fact.

3721
03:46:58,000 --> 03:46:58,000
okay, well.

3722
03:46:59,000 --> 03:47:01,000
this is a red herring.

3723
03:47:01,000 --> 03:47:02,000
we shouldn't even have this thing in the first place.

3724
03:47:02,000 --> 03:47:03,000
all right.

3725
03:47:07,000 --> 03:47:08,000
okay.

3726
03:47:08,000 --> 03:47:10,000
I moved the question now.

3727
03:47:10,000 --> 03:47:19,000
I I have a second I have some things to say the questions been called and seconded.

3728
03:47:19,000 --> 03:47:22,000
it's I I still can speak

3729
03:47:24,000 --> 03:47:25,000
not when you call the question.

3730
03:47:25,000 --> 03:47:27,000
I can still speak.

3731
03:47:27,000 --> 03:47:29,000
we're voting on the call of the question.

3732
03:47:29,000 --> 03:47:30,000
I can still speak.

3733
03:47:30,000 --> 03:47:32,000
no, you cannot do that.

3734
03:47:32,000 --> 03:47:38,000
to stop conversation, you have to have a 67%, two-thirds majority.

3735
03:47:38,000 --> 03:47:39,000
you do not have that.

3736
03:47:40,000 --> 03:47:40,000
yes.

3737
03:47:43,000 --> 03:47:46,000
so I don't think we follow robert's rules of order specifically.

3738
03:47:47,000 --> 03:47:48,000
it's used as a non-binding guide.

3739
03:47:48,000 --> 03:47:53,000
generally speaking, the mayor serves as parliamentarian and makes the final calls.

3740
03:47:56,000 --> 03:48:00,000
usually, the final call stands unless it's overridden by a majority of council.

3741
03:48:00,000 --> 03:48:02,000
I assume that's what the process is here.

3742
03:48:04,000 --> 03:48:06,000
there's been a call to the question and a second,

3743
03:48:06,000 --> 03:48:09,000
and I think the parliamentarian has the ability to make the call on this point.

3744
03:48:10,000 --> 03:48:12,000
I don't think you're bound and constrained by robert's rules.

3745
03:48:13,000 --> 03:48:15,000
thank you.

3746
03:48:15,000 --> 03:48:17,000
so we're going to do the question first.

3747
03:48:17,000 --> 03:48:19,000
so you're basically violating our right to speak.

3748
03:48:20,000 --> 03:48:22,000
we're elected by the people, just like you.

3749
03:48:22,000 --> 03:48:24,000
how long do you want to speak?

3750
03:48:24,000 --> 03:48:25,000
as long as I want to.

3751
03:48:25,000 --> 03:48:26,000
yeah, until midnight?

3752
03:48:27,000 --> 03:48:29,000
if I want to speak until midnight, I'll speak until midnight.

3753
03:48:29,000 --> 03:48:31,000
yeah, that's what this is all about.

3754
03:48:31,000 --> 03:48:34,000
yeah, and that's why robert's rules, a professional, and even mr.

3755
03:48:35,000 --> 03:48:37,000
mathis said he's an expert on robert's rules award.

3756
03:48:37,000 --> 03:48:38,000
he knows what it says.

3757
03:48:38,000 --> 03:48:39,000
it's two-thirds.

3758
03:48:40,000 --> 03:48:40,000
that's 67%.

3759
03:48:40,000 --> 03:48:41,000
you've only got 60.

3760
03:48:42,000 --> 03:48:43,000
you can't do it.

3761
03:48:43,000 --> 03:48:45,000
you're denying us the right to talk.

3762
03:48:48,000 --> 03:48:49,000
I don't even want to call the question.

3763
03:48:50,000 --> 03:48:51,000
roll call vote.

3764
03:48:54,000 --> 03:48:58,000
is this for the motion to the question, or is this for the approval of the item?

3765
03:49:00,000 --> 03:49:01,000
you want to draw the question?

3766
03:49:01,000 --> 03:49:03,000
sure, I'll draw the question.

3767
03:49:03,000 --> 03:49:03,000
go ahead.

3768
03:49:04,000 --> 03:49:05,000
roll call vote on the 4.15.

3769
03:49:06,000 --> 03:49:06,000
ok.

3770
03:49:09,000 --> 03:49:11,000
we can still have a discussion.

3771
03:49:15,000 --> 03:49:17,000
we'll call vote for...

3772
03:49:18,000 --> 03:49:20,000
if he withdraws that, she continues to talk.

3773
03:49:22,000 --> 03:49:22,000
I'm sorry?

3774
03:49:23,000 --> 03:49:27,000
if he withdraws the motion to stop talking, then she gets to vote.

3775
03:49:27,000 --> 03:49:28,000
she gets to keep talking.

3776
03:49:29,000 --> 03:49:30,000
that would be up to the chair?

3777
03:49:31,000 --> 03:49:32,000
no, it's up to the vote.

3778
03:49:32,000 --> 03:49:33,000
it's the vote.

3779
03:49:36,000 --> 03:49:42,597
I have very strong concerns, and I will
tell you it's regarding our police and our

3780
03:49:42,597 --> 03:49:43,000
fire.

3781
03:49:45,000 --> 03:49:49,000
so our emergency responders, so we lose the hotel.

3782
03:49:50,000 --> 03:49:53,000
what we're doing is we're hurting our police services.

3783
03:49:53,000 --> 03:49:54,000
we're hurting them.

3784
03:49:55,000 --> 03:49:57,000
they're overburdened as it is.

3785
03:49:57,000 --> 03:50:02,000
the fire authority, they receive property tax revenue.

3786
03:50:02,000 --> 03:50:04,000
this isn't filibustering.

3787
03:50:04,000 --> 03:50:08,000
this is talking about something that's valid and important.

3788
03:50:09,000 --> 03:50:14,311
we had a discussion earlier about the
consequences of building too much and how the

3789
03:50:14,311 --> 03:50:17,000
freeways are so full
by building too much.

3790
03:50:18,000 --> 03:50:19,000
this is a consequence.

3791
03:50:20,000 --> 03:50:23,000
why are we doing this to the people that save our lives?

3792
03:50:25,000 --> 03:50:26,000
why are we doing this?

3793
03:50:26,000 --> 03:50:29,000
why aren't we thinking through how to pay for it?

3794
03:50:30,000 --> 03:50:34,000
so just to let you know, the fire authority receives their money from property taxes.

3795
03:50:34,000 --> 03:50:37,000
there will be a little boost, but then with

3796
03:50:39,000 --> 03:50:41,000
the apartments, it doesn't satisfy.

3797
03:50:41,000 --> 03:50:49,000
and we're going to overburden our already, it is the busiest fire station all around.

3798
03:50:49,000 --> 03:50:50,000
why are we doing this?

3799
03:50:51,000 --> 03:50:51,000
and then the police.

3800
03:50:51,000 --> 03:50:57,000
do you have any idea how much work they do on a daily basis?

3801
03:50:58,000 --> 03:50:59,000
they're so busy.

3802
03:50:59,000 --> 03:51:05,538
and then we're going to increase the population
with a hotel that may or may not, and

3803
03:51:05,538 --> 03:51:07,000
we can't afford it.

3804
03:51:08,000 --> 03:51:12,000
this is why you have to be responsible.

3805
03:51:12,000 --> 03:51:14,000
this isn't filibustering.

3806
03:51:14,000 --> 03:51:15,000
that's not the pattern.

3807
03:51:15,000 --> 03:51:19,540
what I'm trying to let you know is a
consequence, because you can turn back the

3808
03:51:19,540 --> 03:51:20,000
minutes,

3809
03:51:20,000 --> 03:51:25,349
and any person who supports the police
can turn back and say, you had two council

3810
03:51:25,349 --> 03:51:27,000
members that said x, y, z

3811
03:51:27,000 --> 03:51:29,000
about protecting our residents.

3812
03:51:30,000 --> 03:51:34,000
this consequence is the increase in response times.

3813
03:51:35,000 --> 03:51:38,000
it's making it so that it's more difficult and challenging.

3814
03:51:39,000 --> 03:51:40,000
I'm just pointing it out.

3815
03:51:40,000 --> 03:51:42,000
why are we doing this?

3816
03:51:42,000 --> 03:51:47,000
I speak to people that work for the fire department all the time.

3817
03:51:47,000 --> 03:51:48,000
and do you know what?

3818
03:51:48,000 --> 03:51:49,000
they're overwhelmed.

3819
03:51:49,000 --> 03:51:50,000
they're overwhelmed.

3820
03:51:50,000 --> 03:51:51,000
and they can't say it here.

3821
03:51:52,000 --> 03:51:53,000
but they're overwhelmed.

3822
03:51:54,000 --> 03:51:55,000
as well, we have our police.

3823
03:51:56,000 --> 03:51:58,000
they're not saying it.

3824
03:51:58,000 --> 03:51:59,000
they're not coming up here.

3825
03:52:00,000 --> 03:52:01,000
but you can talk to people in private.

3826
03:52:01,000 --> 03:52:05,000
and we have an explosion of population in orange county.

3827
03:52:05,000 --> 03:52:07,000
what are you talking about, orange county?

3828
03:52:07,000 --> 03:52:09,000
we have our orange county.

3829
03:52:09,000 --> 03:52:11,000
an explosion of population in orange county.

3830
03:52:11,000 --> 03:52:12,000
yes, yes.

3831
03:52:12,000 --> 03:52:13,000
ok, here we go.

3832
03:52:14,000 --> 03:52:14,000
I mean.

3833
03:52:16,000 --> 03:52:18,000
and our city is replicating.

3834
03:52:18,000 --> 03:52:19,000
call the question.

3835
03:52:21,000 --> 03:52:22,000
4.15. That's it.

3836
03:52:23,000 --> 03:52:26,000
let's vote.

3837
03:52:27,000 --> 03:52:30,000
council member pezold?

3838
03:52:31,000 --> 03:52:31,000
no.

3839
03:52:32,000 --> 03:52:33,000
council member sweeney?

3840
03:52:33,000 --> 03:52:34,000
aye.

3841
03:52:35,000 --> 03:52:36,000
mayor caskey?

3842
03:52:36,000 --> 03:52:36,000
aye.

3843
03:52:37,000 --> 03:52:37,000
mayor pro tem mathis?

3844
03:52:38,000 --> 03:52:38,000
aye.

3845
03:52:39,000 --> 03:52:40,000
council member wheeler?

3846
03:52:40,000 --> 03:52:41,000
I refuse to vote.

3847
03:52:41,000 --> 03:52:42,000
we have not been given due process.

3848
03:52:49,000 --> 03:52:49,000
okay.

3849
03:52:49,000 --> 03:52:52,000
4.16. Is that an abstention?

3850
03:52:52,000 --> 03:52:53,000
no, it's a refusal to vote.

3851
03:52:54,000 --> 03:52:57,000
because I've not been given due process to review this material.

3852
03:52:58,000 --> 03:52:59,000
you heard my answer.

3853
03:52:59,000 --> 03:53:00,000
it's on the recording.

3854
03:53:02,000 --> 03:53:03,000
okay.

3855
03:53:05,000 --> 03:53:06,000
motion passes.

3856
03:53:06,000 --> 03:53:09,000
all right.

3857
03:53:09,000 --> 03:53:11,000
4.16, dave.

3858
03:53:11,000 --> 03:53:11,000
okay, 4.16.

3859
03:53:13,000 --> 03:53:16,000
robert, would you bring up my thumb drive?

3860
03:53:21,000 --> 03:53:23,000
k this item has to do with the uh...

3861
03:53:23,000 --> 03:53:28,000
no net loss uh...

3862
03:53:29,000 --> 03:53:29,000
uh...

3863
03:53:29,000 --> 03:53:35,000
work very very long and hard trying to find alternatives at last meeting we had uh...

3864
03:53:36,000 --> 03:53:40,527
d e f which might not mean something to
a lot of people areas in the city that were

3865
03:53:40,527 --> 03:53:42,000
allocated to fulfill no net

3866
03:53:42,000 --> 03:53:44,000
loss and also uh...

3867
03:53:44,000 --> 03:53:46,000
we had an area called ends

3868
03:53:49,000 --> 03:53:50,000
d and f are underperforming.

3869
03:53:51,000 --> 03:53:55,676
there's nothing been there for a long time
they there's it's it's a legitimate area

3870
03:53:55,676 --> 03:53:59,000
that could be redeveloped and
have something done to it and

3871
03:53:59,000 --> 03:54:01,000
however has businesses there?

3872
03:54:01,000 --> 03:54:06,640
it is also not currently zoned for housing
a lot of the area of the north and a lot

3873
03:54:06,640 --> 03:54:08,000
of areas in the city

3874
03:54:08,000 --> 03:54:11,000
are zoned for mixed use so conferring them over to sort of

3875
03:54:12,000 --> 03:54:17,421
submit then for the renewed process is
not as big a deal as taking an area that is

3876
03:54:17,421 --> 03:54:20,000
totally zoned for a
commercial and then

3877
03:54:21,000 --> 03:54:21,000
removing it.

3878
03:54:21,000 --> 03:54:23,000
it sets a horrible, horrible precedent.

3879
03:54:24,000 --> 03:54:26,000
you go to the first slide, please.

3880
03:54:27,000 --> 03:54:27,000
okay.

3881
03:54:27,000 --> 03:54:30,102
this slide is similar to the one I brought
up last time in the meeting, but there's

3882
03:54:30,102 --> 03:54:31,000
been a few things added.

3883
03:54:34,000 --> 03:54:40,146
the second column so I third column actually
seats purple title I I and then all the

3884
03:54:40,146 --> 03:54:43,000
properties that are
both approved but I

3885
03:54:43,000 --> 03:54:44,000
mean I proved the uh...

3886
03:54:45,000 --> 03:54:47,000
the mall area of the triangle the uh...

3887
03:54:48,000 --> 03:54:50,000
la paz village and the uh...

3888
03:54:50,000 --> 03:54:51,000
uh...

3889
03:54:51,000 --> 03:54:56,413
mill creek areas those books are approved
or allocated allocated up means the areas

3890
03:54:56,413 --> 03:55:00,000
that we've all would actually
put into the rhna process

3891
03:55:00,000 --> 03:55:01,000
saying if they're eligible

3892
03:55:02,000 --> 03:55:06,000
and they all add up to meet our hcd requirement.

3893
03:55:07,000 --> 03:55:09,000
so the numbers are a little different.

3894
03:55:10,000 --> 03:55:17,000
if you notice, the whole city only has 483.46 acres of commercial property left.

3895
03:55:17,000 --> 03:55:18,000
I mean, that's all there's in the whole city.

3896
03:55:20,000 --> 03:55:20,000
117.40 acres.

3897
03:55:23,000 --> 03:55:27,829
and I can read the acres to make it somewhat,
you know, something you get your handle

3898
03:55:27,829 --> 03:55:28,000
on.

3899
03:55:28,000 --> 03:55:29,000
people know what an acre is.

3900
03:55:30,000 --> 03:55:32,000
it was a meter squared before, which I apologize for.

3901
03:55:32,000 --> 03:55:33,000
I was just doing the ratios.

3902
03:55:34,000 --> 03:55:36,000
this maybe you can, you know, have a little better handle on it.

3903
03:55:37,000 --> 03:55:42,704
and just to give you an idea, an acre,
everybody's seen a football field or laguna

3904
03:55:42,704 --> 03:55:45,000
hills high school
football field.

3905
03:55:45,000 --> 03:55:48,079
a football field, and I'm talking about
just the field, you know, goalpost to

3906
03:55:48,079 --> 03:55:49,000
goalpost, side to side.

3907
03:55:50,000 --> 03:55:54,000
that's about 1.32 acres, just to give you an idea of the magnitude.

3908
03:55:55,000 --> 03:56:00,000
this new net loss proposal with the def and n add another 20.1 acres.

3909
03:56:02,000 --> 03:56:04,000
again, the fifth column.

3910
03:56:04,000 --> 03:56:06,000
to this date, no affordable housing has been built.

3911
03:56:08,000 --> 03:56:11,000
the percent of commercial property lost, 24%.

3912
03:56:14,000 --> 03:56:18,000
that's to date before the no net loss addition.

3913
03:56:18,000 --> 03:56:23,000
the no net loss addition, as you can see to the last column, adds about 4.1%.

3914
03:56:26,000 --> 03:56:34,000
so for the whole city, we already have lost almost 30% of our retail commercial area.

3915
03:56:35,000 --> 03:56:38,000
and there's a line added down at the bottom, the magenta line.

3916
03:56:41,000 --> 03:56:45,000
I added in the one area that we've also reallocated residential.

3917
03:56:47,000 --> 03:56:52,000
this is also kind of a problem because we start reallocating residential.

3918
03:56:52,000 --> 03:56:56,521
my guess is the next step will be they'll
come over and take a lot of the large areas

3919
03:56:56,521 --> 03:56:57,000
in nellie

3920
03:56:57,000 --> 03:57:00,000
gail because large housing they convert them all to apartments.

3921
03:57:01,000 --> 03:57:04,000
that's why the big red thing is we've actually put residential in there.

3922
03:57:04,000 --> 03:57:07,000
it doesn't add up to our loss of commercial but it's worth noting.

3923
03:57:10,000 --> 03:57:11,000
I think this slide speaks for itself.

3924
03:57:11,000 --> 03:57:13,000
the north, we've lost 15%.

3925
03:57:13,000 --> 03:57:19,954
the north part of laguna hills supplies most
of the money that we get in revenue, tax

3926
03:57:19,954 --> 03:57:22,000
revenue, to run our city.

3927
03:57:24,000 --> 03:57:29,466
the el toro, as I pointed out earlier in
the discussion about the da, with all the

3928
03:57:29,466 --> 03:57:31,000
allocations we've made,

3929
03:57:31,000 --> 03:57:34,000
we've lost 83% of our el toro area.

3930
03:57:34,000 --> 03:57:35,000
the only thing we have left is the

3931
03:57:36,000 --> 03:57:41,857
the furniture store, the total wines, and
the little corner across the street from

3932
03:57:41,857 --> 03:57:43,000
in-n-out burger.

3933
03:57:44,000 --> 03:57:48,827
and that is also an area that's in jeopardy
because octa wants to put a road through

3934
03:57:48,827 --> 03:57:49,000
it.

3935
03:57:51,000 --> 03:57:51,000
excuse me.

3936
03:57:51,000 --> 03:57:52,000
next slide, please.

3937
03:57:53,000 --> 03:57:54,000
ok.

3938
03:57:54,000 --> 03:57:58,000
like I said, I was trying very hard to protect our businesses that are in n.

3939
03:57:59,000 --> 03:58:01,000
this particular picture shows

3940
03:58:03,000 --> 03:58:06,000
shows the areas that are of concern in my discussion here.

3941
03:58:07,000 --> 03:58:10,000
I won't talk about de and f.

3942
03:58:10,000 --> 03:58:13,000
those are probably legitimate.

3943
03:58:13,000 --> 03:58:17,000
much as I hate to give up commercial, they're reasonable choices.

3944
03:58:18,000 --> 03:58:19,000
and I say it's not a reasonable choice.

3945
03:58:20,000 --> 03:58:26,000
and it's the orange area that is lowest on the chart sort of down and to the right.

3946
03:58:28,000 --> 03:58:29,000
did you go to the next slide real quick?

3947
03:58:29,000 --> 03:58:30,000
okay.

3948
03:58:30,000 --> 03:58:35,368
that other area that was up in the northern
part of my drawing there, those two areas

3949
03:58:35,368 --> 03:58:36,000
in orange,

3950
03:58:36,000 --> 03:58:37,000
I want to explain what they are.

3951
03:58:38,000 --> 03:58:45,018
the orange area to the left, which is the
larger one, that's an area that has already

3952
03:58:45,018 --> 03:58:47,000
been requested to build,

3953
03:58:47,000 --> 03:58:49,802
I think it's 100 houses on that, and we'll
talk about that a little later when we get

3954
03:58:49,802 --> 03:58:50,000
to 19.

3955
03:58:50,000 --> 03:58:55,000
that's everybody, you know, done the authority proposals put in.

3956
03:58:57,000 --> 03:59:01,000
the area to the right of that, and it sort of curves around it, is the

3957
03:59:01,000 --> 03:59:03,000
area that I propose that we substitute for n.

3958
03:59:04,000 --> 03:59:05,000
it's called area c.

3959
03:59:07,000 --> 03:59:12,274
if you note, area c is very contiguous
with something that's already going to be

3960
03:59:12,274 --> 03:59:13,000
apartments.

3961
03:59:13,000 --> 03:59:17,000
it's right there on avenue de carlota.

3962
03:59:18,000 --> 03:59:19,000
it keeps it together.

3963
03:59:19,000 --> 03:59:22,000
it doesn't put shotgun holes through our whole north.

3964
03:59:23,000 --> 03:59:24,000
if you go back to the previous chart, please.

3965
03:59:26,000 --> 03:59:31,000
and you can see that the area in c is only 8,300 square meters.

3966
03:59:31,000 --> 03:59:32,000
again, I'm sorry I couldn't convert that.

3967
03:59:33,000 --> 03:59:34,000
the computer program wouldn't do that.

3968
03:59:34,000 --> 03:59:40,000
but just to give you relative size, the n is 37,000 square feet.

3969
03:59:40,000 --> 03:59:44,000
so it's a smaller footprint, but still gets the job done.

3970
03:59:44,000 --> 03:59:51,083
and I might note that the n area would supply
units for rhna twice as much as what we

3971
03:59:51,083 --> 03:59:53,000
need, roughly speaking.

3972
03:59:55,000 --> 03:59:58,000
so it's a much better choice.

3973
03:59:59,000 --> 04:00:03,000
now the objection to that one, the c was, if you go back to this next chart,

3974
04:00:04,000 --> 04:00:08,709
the objection to c was that the owner
didn't say, hey, I want to build apartments

3975
04:00:08,709 --> 04:00:09,000
here.

3976
04:00:09,000 --> 04:00:10,000
I want to build housing there.

3977
04:00:11,000 --> 04:00:16,837
that is the main reason that n was picked
over c, because the owner of n actually

3978
04:00:16,837 --> 04:00:19,000
wants to build his whole area.

3979
04:00:19,000 --> 04:00:21,000
if you go back to the next, I'm sorry.

3980
04:00:22,000 --> 04:00:24,000
if you notice, just north or up,

3981
04:00:25,000 --> 04:00:30,752
from n at the bottom, the whole area that's
sort of pinkish there, not counting the

3982
04:00:30,752 --> 04:00:32,000
thing to the left,

3983
04:00:32,000 --> 04:00:36,000
which is the mobile home part, they wanted all of that.

3984
04:00:36,000 --> 04:00:37,000
we gave them a portion.

3985
04:00:39,000 --> 04:00:44,000
the only other difference is that the c has had some improvements on it.

3986
04:00:45,000 --> 04:00:48,000
so for those two reasons, ann was picked over c.

3987
04:00:49,000 --> 04:00:56,280
even though c is a much better choice, c
would come much closer to just meeting our

3988
04:00:56,280 --> 04:00:59,000
no net loss as opposed to going

3989
04:00:59,000 --> 04:01:00,000
way over what we don't need.

3990
04:01:03,000 --> 04:01:06,000
therefore, I do not think we should accept this.

3991
04:01:07,000 --> 04:01:11,000
I think we should go with the c over the n for the reason I just stated.

3992
04:01:14,000 --> 04:01:17,000
do you need a second or is that a motion?

3993
04:01:23,000 --> 04:01:30,798
I would just like, as I mentioned before, I
think the n is not a good idea because it

3994
04:01:30,798 --> 04:01:33,000
is enhancing in revenue.

3995
04:01:33,000 --> 04:01:37,000
and businesses are trying to find a way to find locations.

3996
04:01:37,000 --> 04:01:40,000
and that is an area where businesses have moved from

3997
04:01:42,000 --> 04:01:46,000
and they've moved businesses to that area where n is.

3998
04:01:47,000 --> 04:01:54,142
and I've had many discussions with business
owners and the stress that they encounter

3999
04:01:54,142 --> 04:01:57,000
when something
is going to rezone.

4000
04:01:57,000 --> 04:01:59,000
it affects their livelihood.

4001
04:01:59,000 --> 04:02:03,516
it affects when you have to start a business
and move, or when you have to move your

4002
04:02:03,516 --> 04:02:04,000
business.

4003
04:02:05,000 --> 04:02:08,000
this impacts them greatly with their revenue stream.

4004
04:02:09,000 --> 04:02:10,000
it impacts them.

4005
04:02:11,000 --> 04:02:16,000
and so we're going to create more stress for groups that have started.

4006
04:02:16,000 --> 04:02:19,000
I mean, we talked about the dance

4007
04:02:19,000 --> 04:02:25,891
groups, many of them, there are people that
live, many kids that live in laguna hills

4008
04:02:25,891 --> 04:02:28,000
go to these dance studios.

4009
04:02:29,000 --> 04:02:35,163
the parents take them and sway ballroom
and a number of them, sway was on la paz,

4010
04:02:35,163 --> 04:02:36,000
they moved.

4011
04:02:36,000 --> 04:02:38,000
a number of groups have moved.

4012
04:02:39,000 --> 04:02:41,000
why are we wanting to create this stress and chaos?

4013
04:02:42,000 --> 04:02:45,000
I mean, this is, with respect to a

4014
04:02:46,000 --> 04:02:48,000
site that is increasing.

4015
04:02:48,000 --> 04:02:59,216
it's organically doing something so I I
support councilmember wheelers suggestion I

4016
04:02:59,216 --> 04:03:08,000
think that n should be off the
table another comment back to dave

4017
04:03:08,000 --> 04:03:09,000
have another comment.

4018
04:03:09,000 --> 04:03:15,000
I'll yield to my colleagues if they would have something you have another comment yes

4019
04:03:19,000 --> 04:03:23,623
I can't show this in public because it
involves proprietary information, but I can't

4020
04:03:23,623 --> 04:03:25,000
talk about it in general.

4021
04:03:29,000 --> 04:03:36,601
our finance director gave me the new hdl
data that basically tells us how much income

4022
04:03:36,601 --> 04:03:40,000
in the form of sales
tax we're getting

4023
04:03:40,000 --> 04:03:41,000
from all of our businesses around the city.

4024
04:03:42,000 --> 04:03:45,000
I incorporated the new 26 data in my database.

4025
04:03:45,000 --> 04:03:46,000
and ran some scenarios.

4026
04:03:46,000 --> 04:03:52,201
we're trying to figure out, you know, the
city manager and I and director lowe are

4027
04:03:52,201 --> 04:03:55,000
trying to find some
ways to study our

4028
04:03:55,000 --> 04:04:00,000
businesses, to help them, and figure out what it is we can do to enhance laguna hills.

4029
04:04:00,000 --> 04:04:03,000
when I ran the data, I ran basically 2024 and 2025.

4030
04:04:03,000 --> 04:04:03,000
two years.

4031
04:04:03,000 --> 04:04:05,000
I wanted to get a whole year of data.

4032
04:04:05,000 --> 04:04:06,000
and I ranked them.

4033
04:04:06,000 --> 04:04:06,000
I ranked 25 first.

4034
04:04:06,000 --> 04:04:07,000
and I actually included the

4035
04:04:15,000 --> 04:04:20,000
first quarter 26, with the second quarter through fourth quarter 25, and

4036
04:04:21,000 --> 04:04:26,604
then 24 second quarter through 25 first
quarters to get a whole year, two consecutive

4037
04:04:26,604 --> 04:04:27,000
years.

4038
04:04:28,000 --> 04:04:34,000
and I ranked the 25-plus, I'll call it, data to see who were our best producers,

4039
04:04:34,000 --> 04:04:36,000
what were our businesses that were really contributing to the city.

4040
04:04:38,000 --> 04:04:39,000
okay, that was interesting.

4041
04:04:39,000 --> 04:04:43,414
and then I went back, and I went to the
next column, and I resorted the whole group

4042
04:04:43,414 --> 04:04:44,000
for the 24.

4043
04:04:45,000 --> 04:04:50,000
so with only one year difference, I was shocked, and I'm going to share this with you.

4044
04:04:51,000 --> 04:04:55,574
when I looked at what happened, which was
what happened, when I went down the list,

4045
04:04:55,574 --> 04:04:58,000
number three and number
four were not there.

4046
04:05:00,000 --> 04:05:00,000
they were gone.

4047
04:05:02,000 --> 04:05:06,000
so in one year, we lost our number three and our number four best producing companies.

4048
04:05:07,000 --> 04:05:08,000
and also missing was number 11.

4049
04:05:10,000 --> 04:05:14,000
and I was like, made me feel bad.

4050
04:05:14,000 --> 04:05:16,000
we're losing top 10 companies in the city.

4051
04:05:19,000 --> 04:05:19,000
that's a bad thing.

4052
04:05:19,000 --> 04:05:24,000
and now we're giving away more areas.

4053
04:05:24,000 --> 04:05:27,842
in particular, now we've gone to n, which
I've been complaining about, that n is an

4054
04:05:27,842 --> 04:05:29,000
area that has businesses.

4055
04:05:29,000 --> 04:05:31,000
it is zoned only for commercial.

4056
04:05:32,000 --> 04:05:36,536
and what are businesses thinking about
us or what have they thought about us that

4057
04:05:36,536 --> 04:05:39,000
we're doing that and
we've lost three, four,

4058
04:05:39,000 --> 04:05:39,000
and 11.

4059
04:05:40,000 --> 04:05:41,000
I can show you the data.

4060
04:05:42,000 --> 04:05:43,000
any one of the council members, I can show you the data.

4061
04:05:43,000 --> 04:05:44,000
you're allowed to see it.

4062
04:05:44,000 --> 04:05:47,000
it can't be releasable to the public, so I can't present it in a meeting.

4063
04:05:47,000 --> 04:05:48,000
actually, I can't give it to you either way.

4064
04:05:49,000 --> 04:05:52,000
I'd have to give it to you through our lawyer, I guess, or through the city manager,

4065
04:05:52,000 --> 04:05:53,000
because I don't want to provide like brown act.

4066
04:05:54,000 --> 04:05:58,000
but the data is, you know, you have the right to see it.

4067
04:05:59,000 --> 04:06:02,000
but, you know, I just, you know, we're giving up our businesses.

4068
04:06:03,000 --> 04:06:05,000
we're just giving up our businesses.

4069
04:06:05,000 --> 04:06:08,000
and it's just shocking.

4070
04:06:12,000 --> 04:06:15,366
I do have a public comment if you wanted to
move that unless you wanted to keep going

4071
04:06:15,366 --> 04:06:16,000
with discussion.

4072
04:06:18,000 --> 04:06:21,000
is it the same instructions, colin?

4073
04:06:26,000 --> 04:06:35,083
we had one online comment submitted from
cesar covarrubias that was in favor and then

4074
04:06:35,083 --> 04:06:40,000
the one in person is
patrick strader thank you

4075
04:06:40,000 --> 04:06:44,347
counsel my name is patrick strader I'm
with starpoint rangers yes you have great

4076
04:06:44,347 --> 04:06:45,000
perseverance

4077
04:06:46,000 --> 04:06:47,000
I do this a lot.

4078
04:06:48,000 --> 04:06:53,000
I've had six projects approved in four cities in orange county in the last 60 days.

4079
04:06:53,000 --> 04:06:54,000
I do this a lot.

4080
04:06:55,000 --> 04:06:59,918
with all due respect to the city attorney,
I think testimony on a second reading is

4081
04:06:59,918 --> 04:07:03,000
something you can consider
because you have a letter

4082
04:07:03,000 --> 04:07:06,000
in front of you from my client that owns the row, which is site n.

4083
04:07:07,000 --> 04:07:08,000
it was submitted today as a public comment.

4084
04:07:09,000 --> 04:07:15,000
we would encourage you to continue to vote to approve site n, but we do have a nuance.

4085
04:07:15,000 --> 04:07:20,466
the original proposal that we've worked
with your staff on included more of site n

4086
04:07:20,466 --> 04:07:22,000
and at a lower density.

4087
04:07:22,000 --> 04:07:27,627
so I watched the last hearing, and I've
got to say it was one of the most confusing

4088
04:07:27,627 --> 04:07:30,000
hearings I've ever
heard because it

4089
04:07:30,000 --> 04:07:33,738
rarely talked about the items that you guys
were actually looking at, and it talked

4090
04:07:33,738 --> 04:07:35,000
about a lot of other things.

4091
04:07:35,000 --> 04:07:38,000
so I apologize for being blunt,

4092
04:07:40,000 --> 04:07:42,000
your staff is fantastic.

4093
04:07:42,000 --> 04:07:45,000
jennifer and jay have been working at this a very long time.

4094
04:07:46,000 --> 04:07:51,085
we started meeting with them last november
and we submitted a letter that you have

4095
04:07:51,085 --> 04:07:54,000
attached to the letter
today in january of this

4096
04:07:54,000 --> 04:07:59,000
year saying that in order to help the city meet its no net loss provisions,

4097
04:07:59,000 --> 04:08:04,000
please consider the portion of the row that does not include the retail businesses.

4098
04:08:05,000 --> 04:08:06,000
and if you read today's letter,

4099
04:08:07,000 --> 04:08:10,883
you will see that the owner of the row,
george urban, has actually increased the

4100
04:08:10,883 --> 04:08:12,000
business in the retail.

4101
04:08:13,000 --> 04:08:14,000
they've opened up docent brewing.

4102
04:08:14,000 --> 04:08:16,000
they're investing in the front of the retail.

4103
04:08:17,000 --> 04:08:21,083
and the reason why they believe that
redeveloping the site behind it with the

4104
04:08:21,083 --> 04:08:24,000
industrial is they have not
had so much luck with those

4105
04:08:24,000 --> 04:08:24,000
buildings.

4106
04:08:25,000 --> 04:08:27,000
they can get leases, but they turn over very quickly.

4107
04:08:27,000 --> 04:08:30,000
they've got a lot of empty spaces at different times.

4108
04:08:30,000 --> 04:08:31,000
they roll at different times.

4109
04:08:32,000 --> 04:08:32,000
it's very difficult.

4110
04:08:33,000 --> 04:08:34,000
as a property owner.

4111
04:08:34,000 --> 04:08:37,000
but with docent and investing in the retail along the frontage,

4112
04:08:38,000 --> 04:08:41,411
having residential immediately behind
it will actually encourage the economic

4113
04:08:41,411 --> 04:08:45,000
development of the city because you'll
have more people to feed into that retail.

4114
04:08:45,000 --> 04:08:48,000
you will increase the sales taxes.

4115
04:08:49,000 --> 04:08:52,000
I'm running out of time, but I worked on the orange village mall.

4116
04:08:53,000 --> 04:08:55,000
I worked on the westminster mall.

4117
04:08:55,000 --> 04:08:58,000
I worked on the bristol and sunflower project for related in santa ana.

4118
04:08:59,000 --> 04:09:01,000
I worked on the great park for 15 years.

4119
04:09:01,000 --> 04:09:03,000
these are not guesses.

4120
04:09:03,000 --> 04:09:04,000
we know how this works.

4121
04:09:04,000 --> 04:09:05,000
we know how to plan.

4122
04:09:05,000 --> 04:09:12,555
I heard testimony in the last meeting that
you guys were considering 120 units to the

4123
04:09:12,555 --> 04:09:13,000
acre.

4124
04:09:14,000 --> 04:09:16,000
nobody is building 120 units to the acre.

4125
04:09:16,000 --> 04:09:21,000
the highest that's being built anywhere in orange county is 72 units to the acre.

4126
04:09:21,000 --> 04:09:23,000
and at the moment, there's no financing for that.

4127
04:09:24,000 --> 04:09:27,000
20 units to the acre, you can finance all day long for sale.

4128
04:09:28,000 --> 04:09:32,611
the state requires 30 to the acre, and so
that's why your staff has done their best

4129
04:09:32,611 --> 04:09:34,000
to try to give you a plan

4130
04:09:34,000 --> 04:09:37,828
that meets the state law so that you can
keep moving through without them taking your

4131
04:09:37,828 --> 04:09:39,000
permitting authority away.

4132
04:09:40,000 --> 04:09:45,000
so I do also support d, e, and f and ask you to, again,

4133
04:09:46,000 --> 04:09:51,000
approve n with the addition of the entirety of its property behind the retail center.

4134
04:09:52,000 --> 04:09:53,000
I can answer any questions if you have them.

4135
04:09:53,000 --> 04:09:54,000
thank you.

4136
04:09:54,000 --> 04:09:55,000
any questions?

4137
04:09:56,000 --> 04:09:57,000
dave.

4138
04:09:57,000 --> 04:09:58,000
yeah, a straight man.

4139
04:09:58,000 --> 04:10:01,000
I've got a slide that deals with something you just said.

4140
04:10:01,000 --> 04:10:01,000
perfect.

4141
04:10:01,000 --> 04:10:03,000
let's see, should I do it now?

4142
04:10:04,000 --> 04:10:06,000
let me ask the clarification question first.

4143
04:10:06,000 --> 04:10:06,000
sure.

4144
04:10:08,000 --> 04:10:08,000
you talked about a letter.

4145
04:10:09,000 --> 04:10:09,000
yeah.

4146
04:10:10,000 --> 04:10:11,000
are you the owner?

4147
04:10:12,000 --> 04:10:16,000
no, I'm the consultant, land use consultant to george urban.

4148
04:10:17,000 --> 04:10:22,708
as I mentioned, the reason that n was
predicted by our consultant over c was because

4149
04:10:22,708 --> 04:10:24,000
there was a letter.

4150
04:10:24,000 --> 04:10:27,000
saying you know I'd like to build houses basically okay,

4151
04:10:27,000 --> 04:10:31,823
well I want to go back to what happened
before it's a prelude to the question what

4152
04:10:31,823 --> 04:10:34,000
happened before in
our last rounds we

4153
04:10:34,000 --> 04:10:38,293
pick we picked areas for the same reason
you know this this area this is the person

4154
04:10:38,293 --> 04:10:40,000
owned that you
know they said you

4155
04:10:40,000 --> 04:10:44,798
know we want to build houses because they
went okay of all those and you saw my first

4156
04:10:44,798 --> 04:10:47,000
charter program
sure yeah that of those

4157
04:10:48,000 --> 04:10:51,000
out of all that whole area and all those four things we approve and

4158
04:10:52,000 --> 04:10:57,000
there's not a single affordable house unit that came out of that that's built to date.

4159
04:10:58,000 --> 04:11:00,000
and all of them skirted around the issue.

4160
04:11:00,000 --> 04:11:05,000
and when it came down to the point where we asked them, hey, pony up.

4161
04:11:05,000 --> 04:11:08,000
we need to meet an arena that's 75% affordable.

4162
04:11:09,000 --> 04:11:11,000
and that'll be the next issue on inclusionary.

4163
04:11:12,000 --> 04:11:16,000
but none of the letters said, yeah, we'll support affordability.

4164
04:11:16,000 --> 04:11:17,000
the question now, I'll get to it.

4165
04:11:17,000 --> 04:11:22,079
does your letters and the letter of your
client, does that support and give us a

4166
04:11:22,079 --> 04:11:25,000
reasonable large amount
of affordable housing?

4167
04:11:27,000 --> 04:11:30,000
I don't know how to answer the word large because you are attempting to adopt 15%.

4168
04:11:31,000 --> 04:11:33,000
do you consider 15% large?

4169
04:11:33,000 --> 04:11:35,000
you can answer percentage-wise.

4170
04:11:36,000 --> 04:11:36,000
I'm sorry.

4171
04:11:36,000 --> 04:11:38,000
your inclusionary ordinance that's on the next item is 15%.

4172
04:11:39,000 --> 04:11:39,000
is that large?

4173
04:11:41,000 --> 04:11:43,000
no, 15% is on the next item.

4174
04:11:44,000 --> 04:11:45,000
I consider it pathetic.

4175
04:11:46,000 --> 04:11:46,000
we have to do 75%.

4176
04:11:47,000 --> 04:11:48,000
I understand.

4177
04:11:48,000 --> 04:11:53,000
my client will definitely comply with the city's inclusionary housing ordinance.

4178
04:11:55,000 --> 04:11:56,000
meaning you only give us 15%.

4179
04:11:57,000 --> 04:12:01,648
not only, we will comply with the city's
inclusionary housing ordinance and may elect

4180
04:12:01,648 --> 04:12:04,000
to do density bonus
and provide additional.

4181
04:12:04,000 --> 04:12:07,545
we do that on a lot of projects I'm
working on right now because density bonus

4182
04:12:07,545 --> 04:12:10,000
enables you to waive objective
design standards and do

4183
04:12:10,000 --> 04:12:12,000
other sort of things.

4184
04:12:12,000 --> 04:12:16,446
so we are absolutely committed to meeting
the city's inclusionary requirements, and

4185
04:12:16,446 --> 04:12:18,000
we will do everything we can.

4186
04:12:18,000 --> 04:12:20,000
but if we're cut out or our site is cut in half,

4187
04:12:21,000 --> 04:12:23,000
I don't know how we could possibly plan to do affordable housing for you.

4188
04:12:24,000 --> 04:12:25,000
ok.

4189
04:12:26,000 --> 04:12:28,000
I have some verbal questions for you.

4190
04:12:28,000 --> 04:12:29,000
it gets into the debate, I'm afraid.

4191
04:12:29,000 --> 04:12:34,000
all right, thank you.

4192
04:12:34,000 --> 04:12:39,000
all right, dave, did you?

4193
04:12:40,000 --> 04:12:41,000
yeah, I have some things.

4194
04:12:41,000 --> 04:12:43,761
I can't ask the gentleman because it's a
question, but I'm going to comment on it

4195
04:12:43,761 --> 04:12:44,000
anyway.

4196
04:12:47,000 --> 04:12:49,000
yeah, like I said, the letters are not followed.

4197
04:12:49,000 --> 04:12:55,000
and as far as having more clients there to shop at the stores out front,

4198
04:12:55,000 --> 04:12:59,000
there's a whole big trailer park back there that will have many, many more residents.

4199
04:13:00,000 --> 04:13:02,000
so if you don't have it already, you're not going to get it.

4200
04:13:03,000 --> 04:13:10,000
and it's kind of a weak argument.

4201
04:13:10,000 --> 04:13:13,009
what I want to ask him, but I can't ask
him, is what's the highest percentage that

4202
04:13:13,009 --> 04:13:14,000
he's ever built affordable?

4203
04:13:15,000 --> 04:13:16,000
I wish I knew that.

4204
04:13:21,000 --> 04:13:24,000
can he yell it out?

4205
04:13:24,000 --> 04:13:25,000
I don't know.

4206
04:13:27,000 --> 04:13:29,000
we were never looking at 120 units.

4207
04:13:30,000 --> 04:13:33,000
80 is the most we've ever looked at.

4208
04:13:34,000 --> 04:13:40,000
and I agree with many of your observations
in terms of the marketplace and what's

4209
04:13:40,000 --> 04:13:42,000
really happening out there.

4210
04:13:43,000 --> 04:13:45,000
let me go on and pull up my other slides.

4211
04:13:46,000 --> 04:13:50,000
even though they're men's specific for inclusion, they cover both so you can

4212
04:13:50,000 --> 04:13:52,000
just remember then we get the next part of it.

4213
04:13:53,000 --> 04:13:55,000
robert, would you bring up my slides again?

4214
04:13:58,000 --> 04:13:59,000
at least I'll hit one of the pages.

4215
04:13:59,000 --> 04:14:00,000
that's fine.

4216
04:14:00,000 --> 04:14:01,000
let's do that.

4217
04:14:01,000 --> 04:14:03,000
we need to move on.

4218
04:14:05,000 --> 04:14:06,000
okay, down one, please.

4219
04:14:08,000 --> 04:14:08,000
another.

4220
04:14:10,000 --> 04:14:11,000
another.

4221
04:14:12,000 --> 04:14:12,000
I'm sorry, you're going the wrong way.

4222
04:14:14,000 --> 04:14:15,000
okay.

4223
04:14:15,000 --> 04:14:16,000
okay.

4224
04:14:16,000 --> 04:14:18,000
you've seen this chart before, so I won't repeat that right now.

4225
04:14:19,000 --> 04:14:20,000
next slide.

4226
04:14:20,000 --> 04:14:25,030
okay, there was my just illustration of
the football field so you have a feeling of

4227
04:14:25,030 --> 04:14:26,000
how much we get.

4228
04:14:26,000 --> 04:14:27,000
next slide.

4229
04:14:29,000 --> 04:14:29,000
density.

4230
04:14:31,000 --> 04:14:34,000
this applies to both the no net loss and what we're talking about now.

4231
04:14:37,000 --> 04:14:40,000
I did little, you know, matrix here.

4232
04:14:40,000 --> 04:14:44,000
and said, ok, we've got acres that we now have available,

4233
04:14:44,000 --> 04:14:50,279
and that 346 number is the number of acres
that we have left when we take out the

4234
04:14:50,279 --> 04:14:54,000
parts that's already been
allocated to the arena

4235
04:14:54,000 --> 04:14:55,000
process.

4236
04:14:55,000 --> 04:14:57,000
so we have 346 left.

4237
04:14:57,000 --> 04:15:01,000
that's 346 football fields, not a whole lot.

4238
04:15:03,000 --> 04:15:09,681
if you had a density requirement of two,
look at the second column now, ok, it would

4239
04:15:09,681 --> 04:15:10,000
take

4240
04:15:11,000 --> 04:15:13,000
4,000 acres to meet that.

4241
04:15:14,000 --> 04:15:19,000
acres remaining, of course, none because 4,248 is much bigger than 346.

4242
04:15:20,000 --> 04:15:22,000
so we have no percent remaining, zero.

4243
04:15:23,000 --> 04:15:25,000
if you go out there, you'll see the four and the eight.

4244
04:15:25,000 --> 04:15:27,000
and by the way, the two is executive houses.

4245
04:15:27,000 --> 04:15:28,000
that's nellie gale.

4246
04:15:28,000 --> 04:15:29,000
the four is large houses.

4247
04:15:30,000 --> 04:15:31,000
the eight is small houses.

4248
04:15:31,000 --> 04:15:35,000
when you get to 20, you start getting into condos and townhouses to some degree.

4249
04:15:37,000 --> 04:15:38,000
again, you can't do it at 20.

4250
04:15:40,000 --> 04:15:44,678
25 is the first place where it goes positive
as far as having anything left and I say

4251
04:15:44,678 --> 04:15:46,000
left I mean that we have

4252
04:15:46,000 --> 04:15:52,339
any retail or commercial left you have six
acres left which is basically one percent

4253
04:15:52,339 --> 04:15:54,000
of our of our current?

4254
04:15:56,000 --> 04:16:01,000
commercial area and you get 30 then you have 80 acres left,

4255
04:16:01,000 --> 04:16:07,000
but you've used up all but 17 percent of our of our commercial area when you have 250

4256
04:16:10,000 --> 04:16:15,312
you have 193 acres left, but you've used up
60% of our retail area and turned it over

4257
04:16:15,312 --> 04:16:16,000
to housing.

4258
04:16:16,000 --> 04:16:18,000
and, of course, you go up to 80, which they never let us go 80.

4259
04:16:19,000 --> 04:16:24,000
the consultant was saying that the best year we get is like, you know, 60s maybe.

4260
04:16:25,000 --> 04:16:30,000
and even at that rate, you've lost almost half of your retail.

4261
04:16:34,000 --> 04:16:35,000
so that's all, robert.

4262
04:16:36,000 --> 04:16:38,000
I'll go into the details and how it relates to the...

4263
04:16:40,000 --> 04:16:46,769
inclusion area when I get to that so I just
cannot support this we need to we need to

4264
04:16:46,769 --> 04:16:49,000
think about our businesses I

4265
04:16:49,000 --> 04:16:52,000
have miss lowe I

4266
04:17:01,000 --> 04:17:08,000
how many housing projects have been approved since?

4267
04:17:19,000 --> 04:17:23,000
how many of those have broken ground, showed financing and are building right now?

4268
04:17:26,000 --> 04:17:26,000
zero.

4269
04:17:27,000 --> 04:17:29,000
but we wouldn't require proof of financing.

4270
04:17:29,000 --> 04:17:30,000
no, I understand.

4271
04:17:30,000 --> 04:17:31,000
okay.

4272
04:17:32,000 --> 04:17:36,000
how many businesses have opened approximately within that period, space of time?

4273
04:17:37,000 --> 04:17:42,000
I do not have that data in front of me.

4274
04:17:42,000 --> 04:17:43,000
well, how many ballpark?

4275
04:17:44,000 --> 04:17:46,000
how many have opened?

4276
04:17:46,000 --> 04:17:48,000
new businesses have opened in the city.

4277
04:17:48,000 --> 04:17:50,000
just ballpark.

4278
04:17:51,000 --> 04:17:52,000
I couldn't tell you that.

4279
04:17:52,000 --> 04:17:54,000
I don't know our certificate occupancy data.

4280
04:17:54,000 --> 04:17:56,000
maybe 10, 20, 30?

4281
04:17:59,000 --> 04:18:01,000
I'm sorry, I really can't estimate that.

4282
04:18:01,000 --> 04:18:04,000
I would hate to give you a number that wasn't accurate.

4283
04:18:04,000 --> 04:18:06,000
it's okay if it's not accurate.

4284
04:18:06,000 --> 04:18:07,000
just clarification.

4285
04:18:08,000 --> 04:18:11,000
I could answer that, but I'd have to run that computer program.

4286
04:18:11,000 --> 04:18:12,000
it's just ballpark.

4287
04:18:12,000 --> 04:18:13,000
nobody really knows.

4288
04:18:14,000 --> 04:18:16,000
it is so nebulous, you can't answer it.

4289
04:18:16,000 --> 04:18:18,000
I could even, I've run the data and I've gone over and over,

4290
04:18:18,000 --> 04:18:21,000
I couldn't even answer it and I've looked at it in detail.

4291
04:18:21,000 --> 04:18:24,000
so, the point I'm getting at is that with...

4292
04:18:24,000 --> 04:18:28,000
the only two real new ones, we've had rei come in, we've had...

4293
04:18:29,000 --> 04:18:30,000
marshalls.

4294
04:18:30,000 --> 04:18:35,000
marshalls, trader joe's, but trader joe's goes back a little bit, not a whole lot.

4295
04:18:36,000 --> 04:18:40,593
so, I'm just pointing out that the theory
and this idea that businesses are dead and

4296
04:18:40,593 --> 04:18:43,000
that shopping is dead
when it's really about

4297
04:18:43,000 --> 04:18:49,581
strategic shopping, it's really important
to understand that element and that our

4298
04:18:49,581 --> 04:18:56,000
city has been busy, arguably, with these
new businesses, small business owners.

4299
04:18:56,000 --> 04:19:00,000
that's still happening today is what I'm trying to say.

4300
04:19:00,000 --> 04:19:03,681
and even though we don't have the number,
a concrete number, it's more than zero,

4301
04:19:03,681 --> 04:19:05,000
substantially more than zero.

4302
04:19:07,000 --> 04:19:12,000
and so I just wanted to point out that because of that, trying

4303
04:19:12,000 --> 04:19:19,182
to take out and carve out a section that
supports small businesses is anti what the

4304
04:19:19,182 --> 04:19:21,000
trend is in the city.

4305
04:19:23,000 --> 04:19:25,000
that goes against the trend.

4306
04:19:25,000 --> 04:19:31,091
the trend, arguably, is that small businesses
are small businesses as well as other

4307
04:19:31,091 --> 04:19:33,000
businesses are starting to

4308
04:19:36,000 --> 04:19:40,808
they're doing better, and based off of
councilmember wheeler's data, especially

4309
04:19:40,808 --> 04:19:43,000
within the n area,
and I understand,

4310
04:19:43,000 --> 04:19:51,367
it's always nice when you look at a site
and you think, oh, well, we could do this

4311
04:19:51,367 --> 04:19:53,000
with it, but the

4312
04:19:53,000 --> 04:19:56,899
reality is unless you have the financing,
which right now it's very, very challenging

4313
04:19:56,899 --> 04:19:58,000
to obtain the financing.

4314
04:19:59,000 --> 04:20:00,000
right now we're just essentially

4315
04:20:01,000 --> 04:20:06,000
in a position where we are eliminating something that we desperately need.

4316
04:20:07,000 --> 04:20:15,482
and I can't support the site when it can
support small businesses, and a number of

4317
04:20:15,482 --> 04:20:16,000
them.

4318
04:20:16,000 --> 04:20:18,000
it is a carve-out.

4319
04:20:18,000 --> 04:20:20,000
these are people's livelihoods.

4320
04:20:21,000 --> 04:20:25,425
and from what we've seen, we've seen
from across the street, we have a great,

4321
04:20:25,425 --> 04:20:26,000
brilliant,

4322
04:20:26,000 --> 04:20:30,000
amazing example how a mall has been completely gutted

4323
04:20:31,000 --> 04:20:36,868
and it's dirt, and it's been sitting as
dirt, and all of those people, all of those

4324
04:20:36,868 --> 04:20:38,000
businesses gone.

4325
04:20:38,000 --> 04:20:44,925
we have on la paz, businesses are leaving,
and it's just not leaving but being forced

4326
04:20:44,925 --> 04:20:49,000
out because of developers,
because of development.

4327
04:20:50,000 --> 04:20:51,000
and yet they're sitting vacant.

4328
04:20:51,000 --> 04:20:54,904
those businesses are sitting vacant because
a developer doesn't want to sign a new

4329
04:20:54,904 --> 04:20:56,000
contract right now, but

4330
04:20:56,000 --> 04:20:59,000
they can't get the financing to make sure to make this happen.

4331
04:21:00,000 --> 04:21:02,000
does this make sense to keep this pattern and this trend up?

4332
04:21:03,000 --> 04:21:04,000
it doesn't make sense.

4333
04:21:04,000 --> 04:21:06,000
we're just dealing with vacant.

4334
04:21:06,000 --> 04:21:10,000
we have an on the pause.

4335
04:21:10,000 --> 04:21:13,000
we have boarded up businesses on the pause.

4336
04:21:14,000 --> 04:21:15,000
a boarded up business.

4337
04:21:16,000 --> 04:21:18,000
I don't know if you, I don't know.

4338
04:21:18,000 --> 04:21:21,000
I mean, I lived in camden, new jersey at some point.

4339
04:21:22,000 --> 04:21:25,000
and that's where you get boarded up places.

4340
04:21:26,000 --> 04:21:30,000
I'm just saying that is unusual for orange county to have a boarded up business.

4341
04:21:30,000 --> 04:21:31,000
and what are we doing?

4342
04:21:31,000 --> 04:21:32,000
it's just sitting there.

4343
04:21:33,000 --> 04:21:35,000
point of order.

4344
04:21:35,000 --> 04:21:38,000
is this germane to the item that we're supposed to be talking?

4345
04:21:38,000 --> 04:21:39,000
it is because what we're doing is.

4346
04:21:39,000 --> 04:21:41,000
and are you not on council?

4347
04:21:42,000 --> 04:21:46,029
are you absolving yourself of any responsibility
as to what may be happening or not

4348
04:21:46,029 --> 04:21:47,000
happening on la paz?

4349
04:21:47,000 --> 04:21:50,000
you've been here longer than anybody else along with dave.

4350
04:21:51,000 --> 04:21:54,919
I mean, exactly, saying no to everything
is a wonderful thing and very convenient

4351
04:21:54,919 --> 04:21:57,000
when you know what
the vote is going to be.

4352
04:21:58,000 --> 04:22:01,540
but to actually do something proactive
for the city, that's where it's really

4353
04:22:01,540 --> 04:22:02,000
difficult.

4354
04:22:02,000 --> 04:22:07,495
and I take objection to the characterizations
of the work that this council has done

4355
04:22:07,495 --> 04:22:09,000
on all of these issues.

4356
04:22:10,000 --> 04:22:14,097
and you have a property owner consultant
who's now told you what's happening on that

4357
04:22:14,097 --> 04:22:16,000
property, and yet
you don't believe it.

4358
04:22:17,000 --> 04:22:20,000
because you don't have the experience as being a property owner.

4359
04:22:20,000 --> 04:22:22,000
you don't know what a landlord is all about.

4360
04:22:23,000 --> 04:22:25,000
you don't know exactly what development is about.

4361
04:22:26,000 --> 04:22:32,048
so I would suggest that you understand and
maybe listen to the folks that are living

4362
04:22:32,048 --> 04:22:35,000
it on that property
instead of making all

4363
04:22:35,000 --> 04:22:39,000
these wild accusations about what things are or are not.

4364
04:22:39,000 --> 04:22:43,000
so to me, let's try to zero in on the actual issue at hand.

4365
04:22:44,000 --> 04:22:47,000
I'm going to call this back to order in the sense that

4366
04:22:48,000 --> 04:22:49,000
make your argument.

4367
04:22:50,000 --> 04:22:54,000
you don't need to go for a half hour, 45 minutes on every single one of these.

4368
04:22:56,000 --> 04:22:57,000
make your argument and be done.

4369
04:22:57,000 --> 04:22:59,000
and then let's move on.

4370
04:23:00,000 --> 04:23:04,000
I am pointing out facts in the city that are happening and the trends.

4371
04:23:04,000 --> 04:23:06,000
when it becomes rant, then that's...

4372
04:23:07,000 --> 04:23:12,000
this is valid information that applies to eliminating a number of businesses.

4373
04:23:12,000 --> 04:23:14,000
I'm not going to argue with you about that kind of stuff.

4374
04:23:15,000 --> 04:23:17,000
you're just going to have a boarded up city.

4375
04:23:18,000 --> 04:23:19,000
oh, god.

4376
04:23:20,000 --> 04:23:26,000
we'll have empty, vacant businesses all around until they can obtain financing.

4377
04:23:26,000 --> 04:23:28,000
and where are you going with that?

4378
04:23:28,000 --> 04:23:30,000
is that the city council did that?

4379
04:23:31,000 --> 04:23:31,000
who did that?

4380
04:23:32,000 --> 04:23:36,000
and did we board up those businesses ourselves?

4381
04:23:36,000 --> 04:23:40,000
it's just going on and on and on.

4382
04:23:41,000 --> 04:23:43,000
the city council made those decisions.

4383
04:23:43,000 --> 04:23:49,000
and I have a chance to, yes, I use my vote correctly.

4384
04:23:49,000 --> 04:23:49,000
good.

4385
04:23:50,000 --> 04:23:51,000
I want you to use your vote.

4386
04:23:52,000 --> 04:23:53,000
I'm not trying to stop you from voting.

4387
04:23:54,000 --> 04:23:59,250
and I just want to point out, since I have
been on the council after the destruction

4388
04:23:59,250 --> 04:24:00,000
of the mall,

4389
04:24:00,000 --> 04:24:03,000
we've had a lot of businesses try to open because we've been focused on that.

4390
04:24:03,000 --> 04:24:06,000
that's where my energy and emphasis has been on.

4391
04:24:06,000 --> 04:24:08,000
and we have had great businesses come in.

4392
04:24:08,000 --> 04:24:08,000
all right.

4393
04:24:12,000 --> 04:24:13,000
josh.

4394
04:24:13,000 --> 04:24:13,000
josh.

4395
04:24:13,000 --> 04:24:14,000
thank you, mayor.

4396
04:24:14,000 --> 04:24:19,976
point of procedure, it's now 10:28, and
we're still considering pulled consent items,

4397
04:24:19,976 --> 04:24:23,000
and we have substantial
business remaining.

4398
04:24:23,000 --> 04:24:27,092
I'm concerned that continuing indefinitely
will undermine the quality of our

4399
04:24:27,092 --> 04:24:30,000
deliberations and the
public's ability to participate.

4400
04:24:30,000 --> 04:24:34,909
so before proceeding, could we ask the
city manager and city attorney whether any

4401
04:24:34,909 --> 04:24:38,000
remaining items must
legally be acted upon tonight?

4402
04:24:53,000 --> 04:24:57,569
I believe the bid rejections also need
action, but I'd have to ask the assistant city

4403
04:24:57,569 --> 04:24:58,000
manager.

4404
04:24:58,000 --> 04:24:58,000
ok.

4405
04:25:01,000 --> 04:25:01,000
so.

4406
04:25:04,000 --> 04:25:09,040
based on that, I just recommend that we
complete only those items that are genuinely

4407
04:25:09,040 --> 04:25:13,000
time-sensitive and continue the
remaining substantive items to our

4408
04:25:13,000 --> 04:25:16,923
next regular meeting, and that will allow
council and the public to address them when

4409
04:25:16,923 --> 04:25:19,000
everyone can give the
attention they approve.

4410
04:25:20,000 --> 04:25:25,000
we're going into the 11 o'clock hour, and we're still on consent.

4411
04:25:26,000 --> 04:25:27,000
thank you, mayor.

4412
04:25:30,000 --> 04:25:32,000
we've gone to midnight and 1 o'clock.

4413
04:25:33,000 --> 04:25:34,000
that's fine.

4414
04:25:34,000 --> 04:25:36,000
do our job.

4415
04:25:36,000 --> 04:25:40,846
but not when it's just going repetitive,
repetitive, repetitive, same stuff over and

4416
04:25:40,846 --> 04:25:42,000
over and over again.

4417
04:25:47,000 --> 04:25:54,701
you know, I think on 4.16, which, by the
way, happens to be something that is known

4418
04:25:54,701 --> 04:25:56,000
at law school,

4419
04:25:56,000 --> 04:26:02,461
we're actually responding to state law, and
based on time frames and all the rest of

4420
04:26:02,461 --> 04:26:03,000
that, I

4421
04:26:03,000 --> 04:26:06,000
think we need a motion one way or the other, up or down, and let's go.

4422
04:26:06,000 --> 04:26:08,000
let's deal with it.

4423
04:26:08,000 --> 04:26:09,000
so do we have a motion on that?

4424
04:26:10,000 --> 04:26:11,000
because I don't think we're going to get it from over here.

4425
04:26:12,000 --> 04:26:13,000
so moved.

4426
04:26:14,000 --> 04:26:14,000
second.

4427
04:26:15,000 --> 04:26:15,000
second, okay.

4428
04:26:17,000 --> 04:26:18,000
I have one comment.

4429
04:26:19,000 --> 04:26:20,000
yes, go ahead.

4430
04:26:20,000 --> 04:26:21,000
I'll let you do that.

4431
04:26:21,000 --> 04:26:22,000
all right, it'll be short.

4432
04:26:22,000 --> 04:26:24,000
we've been at each other's throats.

4433
04:26:25,000 --> 04:26:29,117
this is not the first time, and it probably
won't be the last, and it's actually not

4434
04:26:29,117 --> 04:26:30,000
any of our faults.

4435
04:26:31,000 --> 04:26:36,472
the fault lies with sacramento putting this
stuff on us and giving us no reasonable

4436
04:26:36,472 --> 04:26:37,000
way out.

4437
04:26:39,000 --> 04:26:45,000
so let's, yeah, let's put the blame where we squarely know that it needs to be.

4438
04:26:46,000 --> 04:26:49,000
but we're dealing with it within the law and the things that we have to deal with.

4439
04:26:50,000 --> 04:26:51,000
so remember that november.

4440
04:26:51,000 --> 04:26:51,000
yeah.

4441
04:26:52,000 --> 04:26:55,000
so with that, let's take a roll call vote on 4.16.

4442
04:26:56,000 --> 04:26:59,000
council member wheeler?

4443
04:27:00,000 --> 04:27:00,000
no.

4444
04:27:01,000 --> 04:27:01,000
council member pezold?

4445
04:27:02,000 --> 04:27:02,000
no.

4446
04:27:03,000 --> 04:27:04,000
council member sweeney?

4447
04:27:04,000 --> 04:27:04,000
aye.

4448
04:27:05,000 --> 04:27:05,000
mayor caskey?

4449
04:27:06,000 --> 04:27:06,000
aye.

4450
04:27:06,000 --> 04:27:07,000
mayor pro tem mathis?

4451
04:27:07,000 --> 04:27:07,000
aye.

4452
04:27:07,000 --> 04:27:08,000
ayes have it.

4453
04:27:12,000 --> 04:27:14,000
did you pull that one, dave?

4454
04:27:14,000 --> 04:27:17,000
I lost track after 4.16, or was it just jumped to 4.19?

4455
04:27:17,000 --> 04:27:19,000
I'm not sure all the stuff should have been.

4456
04:27:20,000 --> 04:27:21,000
okay, 17.

4457
04:27:21,000 --> 04:27:22,000
yeah, 17 and 19.

4458
04:27:22,000 --> 04:27:24,000
all right.

4459
04:27:25,000 --> 04:27:28,541
I think everything after 17 might be a bit
long, but the rest of them should be very,

4460
04:27:28,541 --> 04:27:29,000
very short.

4461
04:27:29,000 --> 04:27:30,000
we love the whole agenda, actually.

4462
04:27:31,000 --> 04:27:35,000
okay, robert, could you go back to my charts again, please?

4463
04:27:35,000 --> 04:27:38,000
it's going to be a bit of a repeat, but I'll try to minimize that.

4464
04:27:40,000 --> 04:27:41,000
okay, up please.

4465
04:27:44,000 --> 04:27:45,000
up towards the beginning.

4466
04:27:48,000 --> 04:27:48,000
other way.

4467
04:27:49,000 --> 04:27:50,000
okay, right there.

4468
04:27:52,000 --> 04:27:58,927
like I said, this is a repeat from before,
but I want to emphasize that for this 15%

4469
04:27:58,927 --> 04:28:00,000
inclusionary,

4470
04:28:02,000 --> 04:28:04,000
all of you know our total number is 1985.

4471
04:28:07,000 --> 04:28:16,274
of those 62, 64.2% are some form of below
market rate, either extremely low, very low,

4472
04:28:16,274 --> 04:28:18,000
low or moderate.

4473
04:28:19,000 --> 04:28:20,000
okay.

4474
04:28:20,000 --> 04:28:25,066
if you do the inclusionary, which is
only 15%, then you basically divide the

4475
04:28:25,066 --> 04:28:28,000
64.2 by 15 times the
1985 and you get 8,496.

4476
04:28:35,000 --> 04:28:42,000
that is our new rhna number that we have to do to meet the rhna.

4477
04:28:42,000 --> 04:28:44,000
that's just flat-out straight numbers, no fuzz on it.

4478
04:28:44,000 --> 04:28:48,382
just to give a perspective, like I said
before, we have about 10,500 family units in

4479
04:28:48,382 --> 04:28:50,000
the whole city of laguna hills.

4480
04:28:51,000 --> 04:28:53,000
that would be a city increase of about 81%.

4481
04:28:53,000 --> 04:28:56,000
next slide, please.

4482
04:28:57,000 --> 04:29:01,000
this, again, is just my example to give you
a feeling for what an acre is so you can

4483
04:29:01,000 --> 04:29:02,000
sort of visualize it.

4484
04:29:03,000 --> 04:29:04,000
like I said, it's not the track around it.

4485
04:29:04,000 --> 04:29:06,000
it's not the place of the prayers.

4486
04:29:06,000 --> 04:29:09,000
it's only between the lines, between the goalposts and between the sidelines.

4487
04:29:10,000 --> 04:29:10,000
next slide, please.

4488
04:29:10,000 --> 04:29:16,000
I went over this before, but you need to look at it and understand this, okay?

4489
04:29:17,000 --> 04:29:20,000
to meet the rhna, here's what we have to do.

4490
04:29:20,000 --> 04:29:23,000
we have to build at least 25 and whatnot.

4491
04:29:23,000 --> 04:29:24,000
all of our retail is gone.

4492
04:29:24,000 --> 04:29:25,000
all our commercials are gone.

4493
04:29:26,000 --> 04:29:27,000
we get to 30 and 50.

4494
04:29:27,000 --> 04:29:30,000
you know, 30, we even lose almost all of it.

4495
04:29:31,000 --> 04:29:40,413
50 and 80 and we're keeping roughly half
it it takes the 26 acres to complete that's

4496
04:29:40,413 --> 04:29:44,000
this would be 25 if 50 residents

4497
04:29:44,000 --> 04:29:49,141
take up 60% of our commercial, I'm sorry
at 50 residents it takes up 60% roughly of

4498
04:29:49,141 --> 04:29:51,000
our commercial land basically.

4499
04:29:51,000 --> 04:29:56,106
I'm just pointing out the eyes we're
gonna have anything left we just won't have

4500
04:29:56,106 --> 04:29:57,000
anything left.

4501
04:29:57,000 --> 04:29:59,000
we're going to degrade or

4502
04:30:00,000 --> 04:30:02,000
or whatever you want to call it.

4503
04:30:02,000 --> 04:30:04,000
we're going to go to a totally residential city.

4504
04:30:05,000 --> 04:30:09,000
and then sacramento is going to come in and say, well, your residents are too big.

4505
04:30:09,000 --> 04:30:13,000
you've got to tear some of them down and build a townhouse or something.

4506
04:30:14,000 --> 04:30:15,000
and don't think it's not going to happen.

4507
04:30:15,000 --> 04:30:16,000
I've been up to santa ana.

4508
04:30:17,000 --> 04:30:20,744
and some of the cities in northern
orange county, and I've literally seen that

4509
04:30:20,744 --> 04:30:23,000
there's houses, you
know, nice, one-time house,

4510
04:30:23,000 --> 04:30:28,017
a really nice neighborhood, a reasonably
nice-sized house that was, you know, the

4511
04:30:28,017 --> 04:30:30,000
american dream, and immediately,

4512
04:30:30,000 --> 04:30:37,000
immediately behind it is an apartment complex that has, you know, 10 to 15 apartments.

4513
04:30:38,000 --> 04:30:40,000
I'm sorry, the property values went right through the floor board.

4514
04:30:40,000 --> 04:30:41,000
it looks terrible.

4515
04:30:42,000 --> 04:30:43,000
it degrades all things.

4516
04:30:45,000 --> 04:30:46,000
that's what we're going towards.

4517
04:30:52,000 --> 04:30:55,000
seeing no other comments do we have a?

4518
04:30:56,000 --> 04:31:00,000
motion we do have public comments on this huh we do have public comments.

4519
04:31:00,000 --> 04:31:15,000
oh, we do okay absolutely bruce johnson welcome back

4520
04:31:23,000 --> 04:31:24,000
my name is bruce johnson.

4521
04:31:24,000 --> 04:31:27,000
I'm representing the welcoming neighbors home initiative.

4522
04:31:29,000 --> 04:31:34,147
ours is a ministry of tapestry unitarian
universalist congregation, which advocates

4523
04:31:34,147 --> 04:31:37,000
for affordable housing
in south orange county.

4524
04:31:38,000 --> 04:31:42,000
we have many members who live in both laguna hills and laguna woods.

4525
04:31:44,000 --> 04:31:49,290
we believe that the proposed inclusionary
housing ordinance is an important policy

4526
04:31:49,290 --> 04:31:54,000
step toward meeting the need for
more affordable housing in laguna hills.

4527
04:31:55,000 --> 04:31:59,887
a recent example shows how having this
policy in place can produce more community

4528
04:31:59,887 --> 04:32:02,000
benefit than not
having it adopted.

4529
04:32:03,000 --> 04:32:08,354
earlier this year, laguna hills approved
the terra vida project and was able to claim

4530
04:32:08,354 --> 04:32:11,000
only 5% of the homes
as affordable to help

4531
04:32:11,000 --> 04:32:14,000
meet its regional housing needs allocation.

4532
04:32:15,000 --> 04:32:20,684
a week later, mission viejo approved the
vista del lago project, and it included 15%

4533
04:32:20,684 --> 04:32:24,000
of the new units as
affordable because it had, in

4534
04:32:24,000 --> 04:32:30,018
june 2024, approved an inclusionary housing
ordinance similar to the one now being

4535
04:32:30,018 --> 04:32:32,000
considered by this council.

4536
04:32:34,000 --> 04:32:38,427
this policy won't solve the equation for
meeting all of the city's housing goals, but

4537
04:32:38,427 --> 04:32:39,000
without it,

4538
04:32:39,000 --> 04:32:43,882
it's unlikely to meet as much of its
lower-income housing goal as it would with the

4539
04:32:43,882 --> 04:32:45,000
ordinance in place.

4540
04:32:47,000 --> 04:32:52,197
we've seen this policy be successfully
used in nearby cities and believe it's time

4541
04:32:52,197 --> 04:32:56,000
for laguna hills to adopt this
ordinance so that much needed

4542
04:32:56,000 --> 04:33:01,543
affordable housing will be part of new
building housing developments now and into the

4543
04:33:01,543 --> 04:33:02,000
future.

4544
04:33:03,000 --> 04:33:04,000
thank you.

4545
04:33:07,000 --> 04:33:07,000
any questions?

4546
04:33:09,000 --> 04:33:09,000
thank you.

4547
04:33:11,000 --> 04:33:12,000
kathy udovch.

4548
04:33:27,000 --> 04:33:27,000
hello.

4549
04:33:27,000 --> 04:33:31,000
thank you, city council, for sticking it out and letting us talk.

4550
04:33:32,000 --> 04:33:36,000
again, my name's kathy udovch, and I've lived here for 15 years.

4551
04:33:37,000 --> 04:33:37,000
excuse me.

4552
04:33:38,000 --> 04:33:41,772
before that, my dad lived here for 35 years
before he had to move into a retirement

4553
04:33:41,772 --> 04:33:42,000
home.

4554
04:33:43,000 --> 04:33:47,000
so we got to hang out for a while, you know, just a block apart from each other.

4555
04:33:50,000 --> 04:33:50,000
excuse me.

4556
04:33:50,000 --> 04:33:52,000
I've had a cold for like a week and a half, so...

4557
04:33:54,000 --> 04:34:00,222
so when it comes to the inclusionary housing
ordinances I know it's an imposed thing

4558
04:34:00,222 --> 04:34:04,000
and it's down to percentages
and all this wonderful

4559
04:34:04,000 --> 04:34:14,877
confusing math but having something some
sort of guide to aim at really is helpful

4560
04:34:14,877 --> 04:34:17,000
when it comes to

4561
04:34:18,000 --> 04:34:23,223
dealing with getting the homeless off
the streets, possibly, by making them not

4562
04:34:23,223 --> 04:34:26,000
become homeless,
which is sort of the goal

4563
04:34:27,000 --> 04:34:30,000
of getting people into housing they can afford.

4564
04:34:31,000 --> 04:34:34,000
so I always see that as a plus.

4565
04:34:34,000 --> 04:34:37,867
if we can get somebody off the streets
or just somebody losing their own house

4566
04:34:37,867 --> 04:34:40,000
because they couldn't
afford it any longer.

4567
04:34:42,000 --> 04:34:47,000
and obviously we've seen success with some of the other, our neighboring cities.

4568
04:34:48,000 --> 04:34:52,000
and I'm sure there's some that, I guess, some are more high density.

4569
04:34:53,000 --> 04:34:56,000
and I think here in orange county, we do sort of value all of our space.

4570
04:34:57,000 --> 04:35:00,000
I mean, I've grown up in houses that were huge.

4571
04:35:01,000 --> 04:35:04,695
you know, you could have like a half basketball
court in the house I lived in in lake

4572
04:35:04,695 --> 04:35:05,000
forest,

4573
04:35:05,000 --> 04:35:06,000
just the other side of the freeway.

4574
04:35:06,000 --> 04:35:11,429
so I know what's what we're used to here
in this area, but sometimes we're probably

4575
04:35:11,429 --> 04:35:13,000
going to have to eat it.

4576
04:35:13,000 --> 04:35:16,000
and the terravita looks like it's going to be a little bit more dense.

4577
04:35:17,000 --> 04:35:21,456
looks like they have more room for what
they're going to build in the laguna hills

4578
04:35:21,456 --> 04:35:22,000
mall area.

4579
04:35:23,000 --> 04:35:23,000
that's awesome.

4580
04:35:25,000 --> 04:35:32,063
but I am going to say that when it comes
to, this is the affordability for the next

4581
04:35:32,063 --> 04:35:33,000
generation.

4582
04:35:34,000 --> 04:35:36,000
and an example is just like my own family, my sister's family.

4583
04:35:39,000 --> 04:35:44,000
my niece just graduated high school, and she just got moved up to cal poly pomona.

4584
04:35:45,000 --> 04:35:50,000
and as they were packing her up, the dishwasher broke and flooded their whole kitchen.

4585
04:35:51,000 --> 04:35:53,000
and so now they don't have a kitchen at the moment.

4586
04:35:54,000 --> 04:35:59,743
they've been storing everything outside and
moved the refrigerator into the garage so

4587
04:35:59,743 --> 04:36:04,000
they can repair that while sending
her off to school and paying

4588
04:36:04,000 --> 04:36:06,000
for what she's going to be doing at school.

4589
04:36:07,000 --> 04:36:11,421
and they're very concerned about whether
or not in the next couple of years her kids

4590
04:36:11,421 --> 04:36:13,000
are going to be able to afford

4591
04:36:13,000 --> 04:36:15,000
to live somewhere in the same area.

4592
04:36:16,000 --> 04:36:20,540
and so that's just sort of like an example
of why we want, you know, affordable

4593
04:36:20,540 --> 04:36:21,000
housing.

4594
04:36:21,000 --> 04:36:28,139
so I am asking you guys to continue to vote
positively for the inclusionary housing

4595
04:36:28,139 --> 04:36:29,000
ordinance.

4596
04:36:31,000 --> 04:36:32,000
and I finished on time.

4597
04:36:32,000 --> 04:36:33,000
slid into home plate.

4598
04:36:34,000 --> 04:36:34,000
yeah.

4599
04:36:35,000 --> 04:36:35,000
okay.

4600
04:36:35,000 --> 04:36:36,000
thank you so much.

4601
04:36:38,000 --> 04:36:38,000
any others?

4602
04:36:39,000 --> 04:36:39,000
patrick strader.

4603
04:36:42,000 --> 04:36:43,000
thank you, mayor and council.

4604
04:36:43,000 --> 04:36:45,000
patrick strader from starpoint ventures again.

4605
04:36:45,000 --> 04:36:50,195
I'm glad I got to come back up because I
can answer councilmember wheeler's question

4606
04:36:50,195 --> 04:36:51,000
from earlier.

4607
04:36:51,000 --> 04:36:55,000
I have delivered multiple projects that are 100% affordable.

4608
04:36:56,000 --> 04:36:59,000
I'm a founding member of the irvine community land trust since 2007.

4609
04:36:59,000 --> 04:37:03,000
I think we've delivered seven 100% affordable projects in the city of irvine for

4610
04:37:04,000 --> 04:37:05,000
I don't know, 2,000 units.

4611
04:37:06,000 --> 04:37:10,723
the way we do it there is we take either
land dedicated by the irvine company or we

4612
04:37:10,723 --> 04:37:13,000
take in lieu fees paid
for by developers

4613
04:37:13,000 --> 04:37:16,000
or sometimes we go out on our own and we actually just did this.

4614
04:37:16,000 --> 04:37:17,000
we bought a six acre site.

4615
04:37:18,000 --> 04:37:22,375
we are building 100% affordable on a portion
of the site and we are selling finished

4616
04:37:22,375 --> 04:37:23,000
lots to d.r.

4617
04:37:23,000 --> 04:37:26,000
horton for the highest price ever paid in the city of irvine.

4618
04:37:26,000 --> 04:37:29,000
so affordable developers can do that.

4619
04:37:29,000 --> 04:37:30,000
it can be done.

4620
04:37:30,000 --> 04:37:34,606
but the cities need to make it incentivized
and need to make it something that can

4621
04:37:34,606 --> 04:37:35,000
happen.

4622
04:37:36,000 --> 04:37:40,303
I read, so please don't anybody tell anybody
I know that I'm here speaking in favor

4623
04:37:40,303 --> 04:37:43,000
of an inclusionary housing
ordinance because I would

4624
04:37:43,000 --> 04:37:44,000
never do that.

4625
04:37:44,000 --> 04:37:45,000
but I know you have to adopt it.

4626
04:37:46,000 --> 04:37:51,000
I looked at tonight's draft ordinance, and it's silent as to the actual fee.

4627
04:37:52,000 --> 04:37:55,000
it says that there will be a fee adopted later on the in lieu fee.

4628
04:37:55,000 --> 04:37:57,000
I read the keyser marston report.

4629
04:37:57,000 --> 04:37:59,000
it is insane.

4630
04:38:00,000 --> 04:38:03,000
$41 to$62 as a range is not anywhere near market.

4631
04:38:03,000 --> 04:38:06,000
I took some notes just to read to you.

4632
04:38:06,000 --> 04:38:08,000
I know you're not adopting a specific number tonight.

4633
04:38:08,000 --> 04:38:11,000
so as you adopt your inclusionary tonight,

4634
04:38:11,000 --> 04:38:12,000
great.

4635
04:38:12,000 --> 04:38:12,000
you need to do it.

4636
04:38:12,000 --> 04:38:14,000
15% is appropriate.

4637
04:38:14,000 --> 04:38:19,090
as you come back later and set it in lufi,
costa mesa had a very similar report from

4638
04:38:19,090 --> 04:38:20,000
keyser marston.

4639
04:38:20,000 --> 04:38:21,000
I was there at that meeting.

4640
04:38:21,000 --> 04:38:23,000
they did $10 a foot.

4641
04:38:23,000 --> 04:38:25,000
santa ana, $15 a foot.

4642
04:38:26,000 --> 04:38:27,000
anaheim, 23.

4643
04:38:28,000 --> 04:38:32,000
laguna woods, 32 per market rate square foot.

4644
04:38:33,000 --> 04:38:36,000
irvine, off the top of my head, is about $33,000 a door.

4645
04:38:37,000 --> 04:38:39,000
so when we're talking about apartments, we just take like 1,000 feet.

4646
04:38:39,000 --> 04:38:41,000
I mean, it'll go up or down.

4647
04:38:41,000 --> 04:38:46,250
if you guys were to take the keyser marston
high number and put $62,000 of doors and

4648
04:38:46,250 --> 04:38:47,000
in lieu fee,

4649
04:38:47,000 --> 04:38:50,000
there's not a person that will come to this city by choice.

4650
04:38:50,000 --> 04:38:54,090
if they can go to the two or three cities
immediately adjacent and pay half that,

4651
04:38:54,090 --> 04:38:55,000
they will do that.

4652
04:38:55,000 --> 04:38:57,000
so as I stated earlier,

4653
04:38:57,000 --> 04:39:01,567
if the city wants to deliver affordable
housing, please pick a rate that will

4654
04:39:01,567 --> 04:39:04,000
incentivize developers
to come and do it.

4655
04:39:04,000 --> 04:39:06,000
adopt the one in front of you this evening,

4656
04:39:06,000 --> 04:39:10,132
but please invite industry back to come
and speak about an appropriate per square

4657
04:39:10,132 --> 04:39:11,000
foot in lieu fee.

4658
04:39:11,000 --> 04:39:13,000
and I promise you when you get your in lieu fees,

4659
04:39:13,000 --> 04:39:17,000
you'll be able to find somebody who can come build a 100% affordable project.

4660
04:39:18,000 --> 04:39:19,000
any questions?

4661
04:39:19,000 --> 04:39:20,000
I'm happy to answer.

4662
04:39:20,000 --> 04:39:20,000
thank you.

4663
04:39:21,000 --> 04:39:21,000
any questions?

4664
04:39:21,000 --> 04:39:22,000
yes, dave.

4665
04:39:23,000 --> 04:39:25,000
well, I've never met anybody that's built 100%.

4666
04:39:25,000 --> 04:39:27,000
I would like your card, please.

4667
04:39:28,000 --> 04:39:31,240
and I would like to discuss that you know
sometime afterward how these things are

4668
04:39:31,240 --> 04:39:33,000
done and get some get
some insight because I

4669
04:39:33,000 --> 04:39:40,599
need some insight in this absolutely
be happy to it is easier if the land is

4670
04:39:40,599 --> 04:39:45,000
dedicated if there are
not costs of the land

4671
04:39:45,000 --> 04:39:52,813
to build a building and charge the rent
less or sell it for less the land dedication

4672
04:39:52,813 --> 04:39:53,000
is

4673
04:39:54,000 --> 04:40:01,000
is for the land transfer is a huge element in allowing for affordability.

4674
04:40:01,000 --> 04:40:04,000
I think I'm just going to lay this out.

4675
04:40:05,000 --> 04:40:08,000
I understand this will it will I am in a losing position.

4676
04:40:09,000 --> 04:40:16,619
but I want to I've lived in many different
states and many different states have

4677
04:40:16,619 --> 04:40:23,000
dealt with population increases
in cities and population movements.

4678
04:40:24,000 --> 04:40:29,000
and they've always allowed for the natural economy to work its way through.

4679
04:40:30,000 --> 04:40:39,007
and so there are college campuses that
people created apartments in their own house

4680
04:40:39,007 --> 04:40:44,000
so that college students
could afford to rent.

4681
04:40:45,000 --> 04:40:51,430
and then the individuals that own the
property would be able to have a boost of

4682
04:40:51,430 --> 04:40:52,000
income.

4683
04:40:53,000 --> 04:40:58,590
I know that's the adu concept, but perhaps
maybe pushing this out to the community

4684
04:40:58,590 --> 04:41:02,000
makes it so that homeownership
is more affordable,

4685
04:41:02,000 --> 04:41:07,000
especially if somebody is renting a section of their home out.

4686
04:41:07,000 --> 04:41:14,608
but I just think that those are the answers
naturally with the economy and a number

4687
04:41:14,608 --> 04:41:18,000
of that's how
other cities you see it

4688
04:41:18,000 --> 04:41:19,000
happen.

4689
04:41:19,000 --> 04:41:21,000
and so with that, I yield my comments.

4690
04:41:24,000 --> 04:41:28,654
yeah, some comments to provide some of the
feedback on some of the things that were

4691
04:41:28,654 --> 04:41:30,000
said just recently here.

4692
04:41:32,000 --> 04:41:33,000
numbers are very important.

4693
04:41:34,000 --> 04:41:37,904
if you fail to look at the numbers in your
personal life, you will go bankrupt and

4694
04:41:37,904 --> 04:41:39,000
have a lot of problems.

4695
04:41:40,000 --> 04:41:42,000
I work with nasa, department of navy.

4696
04:41:43,000 --> 04:41:47,169
you miss by a fraction, you know, and
you're not on the moon, you're out in space,

4697
04:41:47,169 --> 04:41:49,000
and lost in space
becomes a reality.

4698
04:41:50,000 --> 04:41:51,000
learn the numbers if you don't know them.

4699
04:41:52,000 --> 04:41:53,000
it's extremely important.

4700
04:41:54,000 --> 04:41:58,914
second thing, building more houses
does not, and I repeat, does not solve the

4701
04:41:58,914 --> 04:42:00,000
homeless problem.

4702
04:42:02,000 --> 04:42:03,000
absolutely not.

4703
04:42:03,000 --> 04:42:07,000
I've spoken to secretaries of state deputies in washington, d.c.

4704
04:42:07,000 --> 04:42:08,000
I've spoken to the police.

4705
04:42:08,000 --> 04:42:11,000
I worked with the homeless for five years in the costa mesa.

4706
04:42:12,000 --> 04:42:16,000
the homeless, a lot of them, most of them, don't want to live in a place.

4707
04:42:16,000 --> 04:42:17,000
they want to be free.

4708
04:42:18,000 --> 04:42:20,000
you build houses for them, they'll destroy them.

4709
04:42:20,000 --> 04:42:22,000
that's exactly what happened to laguna hills.

4710
04:42:23,000 --> 04:42:27,919
we were forced to turn one of our hotels
into a covid hotel, but it was designated

4711
04:42:27,919 --> 04:42:29,000
for only homeless.

4712
04:42:30,000 --> 04:42:31,000
they destroyed every single unit.

4713
04:42:32,000 --> 04:42:35,000
they had to go back and they had to redo and refurbish the whole place.

4714
04:42:36,000 --> 04:42:37,000
that is not a solution.

4715
04:42:38,000 --> 04:42:40,000
and you're crazy if you think it is.

4716
04:42:41,000 --> 04:42:46,425
the homeless are probably 90% of mental
problems or drug problems or a combination of

4717
04:42:46,425 --> 04:42:47,000
the both.

4718
04:42:47,000 --> 04:42:50,000
if I work within a costa mesa, we'd have people come in.

4719
04:42:50,000 --> 04:42:51,000
everyone wants to know.

4720
04:42:51,000 --> 04:42:54,000
we've got a family or somebody that was just down on their luck.

4721
04:42:54,000 --> 04:42:59,000
they can be fixed, and they can be made whole very quickly, and all of them were.

4722
04:42:59,000 --> 04:43:03,000
the others, it's just crazy to think.

4723
04:43:04,000 --> 04:43:06,000
it's not true, and you're not going to accomplish anything.

4724
04:43:08,000 --> 04:43:12,000
as far as affordability, mill creek and terravita were mentioned, I believe.

4725
04:43:13,000 --> 04:43:14,000
those are not affordable.

4726
04:43:15,000 --> 04:43:18,000
the starting price for those units is $1.5 million.

4727
04:43:19,000 --> 04:43:21,000
if that's affordable to you, then okay, it's affordable.

4728
04:43:21,000 --> 04:43:22,000
I don't think it is.

4729
04:43:23,000 --> 04:43:25,000
so it's another total fallacy.

4730
04:43:25,000 --> 04:43:26,000
they're not affordable.

4731
04:43:29,000 --> 04:43:32,000
this is just a bunch of social engineering from sacramento.

4732
04:43:32,000 --> 04:43:34,000
and they screw things up more than they solve.

4733
04:43:34,000 --> 04:43:39,340
if they let the marketplace deal with it,
they would do like everybody's done for

4734
04:43:39,340 --> 04:43:40,000
centuries.

4735
04:43:40,000 --> 04:43:45,266
when it's too congested or too expensive
an area, you go out further and you build

4736
04:43:45,266 --> 04:43:47,000
something more inexpensive.

4737
04:43:47,000 --> 04:43:48,000
that's how orange county came about.

4738
04:43:48,000 --> 04:43:50,000
it used to be oranges.

4739
04:43:51,000 --> 04:43:54,000
that's how riverside used to be desert and stuff out there.

4740
04:43:54,000 --> 04:43:56,000
you go out past them, there's nothing out there.

4741
04:43:56,000 --> 04:43:58,000
there's land as far as you can see, not a house on it.

4742
04:43:59,000 --> 04:44:00,000
you build up where you can.

4743
04:44:00,000 --> 04:44:02,500
so I want to talk to the gentleman here
about what you could really do, what you

4744
04:44:02,500 --> 04:44:03,000
should be doing,

4745
04:44:04,000 --> 04:44:06,000
and the people from brona's group.

4746
04:44:07,000 --> 04:44:11,146
I wish you'd quit, you know, leaning on
cities and go lean on the county and take all

4747
04:44:11,146 --> 04:44:13,000
the vacant land
that's out in the east

4748
04:44:13,000 --> 04:44:16,669
of the county that nobody's out there,
build stuff out there that this gentleman

4749
04:44:16,669 --> 04:44:18,000
could probably help you with.

4750
04:44:20,000 --> 04:44:20,000
thank you.

4751
04:44:21,000 --> 04:44:23,000
thank you, dave.

4752
04:44:24,000 --> 04:44:25,000
okay, I...

4753
04:44:27,000 --> 04:44:34,094
not gonna get me to argue with the the
market ruling what we should be really doing

4754
04:44:34,094 --> 04:44:37,000
but that said I
will make a motion

4755
04:44:37,000 --> 04:44:46,750
to approve of 4.17 approval of ordinance
adopting rzne-0015-2026 for inclusionary

4756
04:44:46,750 --> 04:44:50,000
housing program and I'm not

4757
04:44:50,000 --> 04:44:57,000
going to read the rest of it, but it goes right in accordance with the your agenda and

4758
04:44:58,000 --> 04:44:58,000
do we have a second?

4759
04:44:58,000 --> 04:44:59,000
second.

4760
04:45:00,000 --> 04:45:00,000
all right.

4761
04:45:03,000 --> 04:45:04,000
any other comments?

4762
04:45:07,000 --> 04:45:07,000
all right.

4763
04:45:07,000 --> 04:45:07,000
call.

4764
04:45:08,000 --> 04:45:08,000
roll call.

4765
04:45:10,000 --> 04:45:10,000
council member wheeler?

4766
04:45:11,000 --> 04:45:11,000
no.

4767
04:45:12,000 --> 04:45:12,000
council member pezold?

4768
04:45:13,000 --> 04:45:14,000
no.

4769
04:45:15,000 --> 04:45:16,000
council member sweeney?

4770
04:45:16,000 --> 04:45:16,000
aye.

4771
04:45:17,000 --> 04:45:17,000
mayor caskey?

4772
04:45:18,000 --> 04:45:18,000
aye.

4773
04:45:19,000 --> 04:45:19,000
mayor pro tem mathis?

4774
04:45:19,000 --> 04:45:20,000
aye.

4775
04:45:20,000 --> 04:45:21,000
ayes have it.

4776
04:45:24,000 --> 04:45:24,000
all right.

4777
04:45:26,000 --> 04:45:27,000
dave, we are to 4.19.

4778
04:45:28,000 --> 04:45:28,000
4.19.

4779
04:45:30,000 --> 04:45:34,000
robert, would you bring up that part of the agenda?

4780
04:45:45,000 --> 04:45:46,000
scroll down just a bit.

4781
04:45:50,000 --> 04:45:52,000
okay, first a preface and a...

4782
04:45:54,000 --> 04:45:58,000
perhaps on a question for director lowe, I think you said we had five properties.

4783
04:45:58,000 --> 04:45:59,000
I only remember four.

4784
04:46:01,000 --> 04:46:02,000
we had terravita, mill creek.

4785
04:46:02,000 --> 04:46:04,000
we had the la paz village.

4786
04:46:05,000 --> 04:46:06,000
we had the triangle, I call it.

4787
04:46:06,000 --> 04:46:06,000
we had them all.

4788
04:46:07,000 --> 04:46:14,130
so for the five properties, we've had the
la paz village, the oakbrook plaza, your

4789
04:46:14,130 --> 04:46:15,000
apartment.

4790
04:46:15,000 --> 04:46:15,000
is that the triangle?

4791
04:46:16,000 --> 04:46:17,000
yes.

4792
04:46:17,000 --> 04:46:17,000
okay.

4793
04:46:17,000 --> 04:46:19,000
and then followed by terravita.

4794
04:46:19,000 --> 04:46:20,000
I'm sorry?

4795
04:46:20,000 --> 04:46:21,000
yeah, terravita.

4796
04:46:21,000 --> 04:46:24,356
and then followed by the khoshbin
site, and then now followed by the mall

4797
04:46:24,356 --> 04:46:25,000
redevelopment.

4798
04:46:25,000 --> 04:46:26,000
was it that?

4799
04:46:26,000 --> 04:46:31,000
khoshbin, so 23161 mill creek road, located just north of the terravita site.

4800
04:46:31,000 --> 04:46:31,000
oh, I see what you're saying.

4801
04:46:31,000 --> 04:46:33,000
yeah, I consider that part of terravita.

4802
04:46:33,000 --> 04:46:34,000
okay, I understand how you're counting.

4803
04:46:34,000 --> 04:46:34,000
okay.

4804
04:46:34,000 --> 04:46:35,000
okay, thank you.

4805
04:46:38,000 --> 04:46:42,822
overall comment, this chart, which we review
every month, need to include those, even

4806
04:46:42,822 --> 04:46:46,000
if they're passed, just to
know what's going on, please.

4807
04:46:48,000 --> 04:46:52,000
this first one, a 100-house project up in the north, this is actually, I believe,

4808
04:46:52,000 --> 04:46:56,285
the one I was pointing to in my charts
earlier, where I was suggesting we do c

4809
04:46:56,285 --> 04:46:57,000
instead of n.

4810
04:47:01,000 --> 04:47:05,000
I guess, well, is this scheduled for hearings?

4811
04:47:06,000 --> 04:47:10,000
no, the application is not ready to be presented to the council yet.

4812
04:47:10,000 --> 04:47:13,000
the application is not ready to be presented to the city council yet.

4813
04:47:13,000 --> 04:47:16,000
when do you expect?

4814
04:47:17,000 --> 04:47:23,000
I would say maybe best case scenario in the next two, three months.

4815
04:47:23,000 --> 04:47:24,000
that would be the best case.

4816
04:47:24,000 --> 04:47:27,000
we're still working through some of the application items.

4817
04:47:27,000 --> 04:47:28,000
okay, thank you.

4818
04:47:28,000 --> 04:47:29,000
next, please, robert.

4819
04:47:32,000 --> 04:47:33,000
scroll down just a little bit, please.

4820
04:47:35,000 --> 04:47:36,000
to the next chart.

4821
04:47:41,000 --> 04:47:42,000
oh yes, the quick quack.

4822
04:47:43,000 --> 04:47:45,000
what are they doing on that?

4823
04:47:48,000 --> 04:47:50,000
are they proceeding to break ground?

4824
04:47:51,000 --> 04:47:56,507
so quick quack is still working through
some of the comments that we received from

4825
04:47:56,507 --> 04:48:00,000
the edc and staff on how
to improve the architecture

4826
04:48:00,000 --> 04:48:01,000
and the site layout.

4827
04:48:01,000 --> 04:48:03,000
and then they will be resubmitting to the city.

4828
04:48:03,000 --> 04:48:05,000
and then we'll do a final review.

4829
04:48:05,000 --> 04:48:07,000
and if it's good to go, we'll schedule it for public hearing.

4830
04:48:07,000 --> 04:48:07,000
okay.

4831
04:48:08,000 --> 04:48:08,000
okay.

4832
04:48:09,000 --> 04:48:11,000
and the four we're missing, what is terravita doing now?

4833
04:48:12,000 --> 04:48:12,000
and both of them.

4834
04:48:13,000 --> 04:48:15,000
are they breaking ground?

4835
04:48:15,000 --> 04:48:16,000
are they going?

4836
04:48:16,000 --> 04:48:17,000
they're not breaking ground yet.

4837
04:48:17,000 --> 04:48:19,000
so they have plans.

4838
04:48:19,000 --> 04:48:23,000
so part of the site has been submitted to the city for plan check and review.

4839
04:48:24,000 --> 04:48:29,406
demolition of two of the office buildings
that will be constructed housing by toll

4840
04:48:29,406 --> 04:48:30,000
brothers.

4841
04:48:31,000 --> 04:48:34,541
and then kingsmart also has submitted plans
to look at the other office buildings for

4842
04:48:34,541 --> 04:48:35,000
demolition.

4843
04:48:36,000 --> 04:48:39,353
they're working through some of the other
items that are required prior to building

4844
04:48:39,353 --> 04:48:40,000
permit issuance.

4845
04:48:41,000 --> 04:48:45,000
they have submitted also, I believe, some preliminary grading to public works as well.

4846
04:48:45,000 --> 04:48:48,260
but there are some milestones that
they have to satisfy in terms of the map

4847
04:48:48,260 --> 04:48:51,000
requirements and everything
prior to getting any permit issued.

4848
04:48:52,000 --> 04:48:52,000
okay.

4849
04:48:53,000 --> 04:48:54,000
okay, we know what the mall is doing.

4850
04:48:55,000 --> 04:48:58,000
the triangle, are they doing anything?

4851
04:48:58,000 --> 04:49:02,666
the triangle site, oakbrook plaza, the
senior apartments, no, there has been nothing

4852
04:49:02,666 --> 04:49:04,000
submitted from them yet.

4853
04:49:04,000 --> 04:49:06,000
okay, still treading water.

4854
04:49:06,000 --> 04:49:10,000
okay, and last, but maybe it's the least, but la paz village.

4855
04:49:10,000 --> 04:49:13,178
as erica mentioned, there are two boarded
buildings, the 7-eleven and a restaurant

4856
04:49:13,178 --> 04:49:15,000
that was a favorite
sushi place of many people.

4857
04:49:16,000 --> 04:49:19,000
they literally have boards on it, which does look terrible.

4858
04:49:20,000 --> 04:49:21,000
what are they doing?

4859
04:49:21,000 --> 04:49:25,000
and then also, don't they have some kind of limitation on their approval?

4860
04:49:25,000 --> 04:49:27,000
because they were built at remedy, not regular.

4861
04:49:27,000 --> 04:49:30,000
right, so the site development permit is valid for two years.

4862
04:49:31,000 --> 04:49:36,607
the property owner, nick buchanan of cape
point, is working with some issues with

4863
04:49:36,607 --> 04:49:40,000
ocfa and negotiating
easements for the fire lane.

4864
04:49:41,000 --> 04:49:43,000
so that has to be satisfied also prior to permit issuance.

4865
04:49:44,000 --> 04:49:48,015
my understanding was, yeah, the fire problem
that the real estate group was not going

4866
04:49:48,015 --> 04:49:50,000
to budge and they
weren't going to change.

4867
04:49:50,000 --> 04:49:52,000
is that altered or is that still the case?

4868
04:49:53,000 --> 04:49:54,000
I don't actually know where they are.

4869
04:49:54,000 --> 04:49:58,565
I do know that they have not agreed to any
terms to grant the easement the last time

4870
04:49:58,565 --> 04:49:59,000
I heard.

4871
04:50:00,000 --> 04:50:04,000
it looked a little different as far as the layout, but I'm not sure how that's going.

4872
04:50:05,000 --> 04:50:08,000
okay, when is there a limitation on their bill to remedy approval?

4873
04:50:08,000 --> 04:50:13,659
I believe we took that to public hearing
september 23, 2025, so two years from that

4874
04:50:13,659 --> 04:50:14,000
date.

4875
04:50:14,000 --> 04:50:16,000
so their time's up in 27?

4876
04:50:17,000 --> 04:50:17,000
yes.

4877
04:50:17,000 --> 04:50:18,000
okay, thank you.

4878
04:50:18,000 --> 04:50:21,000
do you want to move?

4879
04:50:21,000 --> 04:50:23,000
unless someone wants to ask a question.

4880
04:50:25,000 --> 04:50:25,000
yeah.

4881
04:50:25,000 --> 04:50:27,000
do you want to move to?

4882
04:50:27,000 --> 04:50:31,000
yeah, unless they may have a question job move to move to I'll second very good.

4883
04:50:31,000 --> 04:50:37,000
we have a second all right it's been moved in second.

4884
04:50:37,000 --> 04:50:39,000
we'll take the vote call vote mayor pro tem mathis.

4885
04:50:40,000 --> 04:50:41,000
all right councilmember pezold.

4886
04:50:42,000 --> 04:50:43,000
aye. Councilmember sweeney.

4887
04:50:43,000 --> 04:50:45,000
aye. Mayor caskey.

4888
04:50:45,000 --> 04:50:46,000
aye. Councilmember

4889
04:50:46,000 --> 04:50:47,000
wheeler?

4890
04:50:47,000 --> 04:50:57,000
aye.  Ayes have it. We re going to persevere here a little bit.

4891
04:50:59,000 --> 04:51:02,000
I would like to move on to city manager's report.

4892
04:51:03,000 --> 04:51:05,000
I think it's important that we handle that one tonight.

4893
04:51:07,000 --> 04:51:09,000
thank you, mayor and members of the council.

4894
04:51:10,000 --> 04:51:15,651
on may 19th, the orange county grand jury
released a report titled, wildfires hit

4895
04:51:15,651 --> 04:51:16,000
home.

4896
04:51:17,000 --> 04:51:20,000
the grand jury issued six findings and three recommendations.

4897
04:51:21,000 --> 04:51:24,000
and all orange county cities were required to respond.

4898
04:51:26,000 --> 04:51:30,166
we received excellent, and I mean excellent,
support from the orange county fire

4899
04:51:30,166 --> 04:51:31,000
authority chief.

4900
04:51:32,000 --> 04:51:34,000
thank you very much for the help you've given to me on this.

4901
04:51:36,000 --> 04:51:44,645
and I want to just move to the most important
piece of this, which is the output is

4902
04:51:44,645 --> 04:51:46,000
our response.

4903
04:51:47,000 --> 04:51:53,000
and so based upon reading that, the proposed response that's before you, council,

4904
04:51:55,000 --> 04:51:59,000
is that the city agrees that the risk of severe wildfires are more frequent.

4905
04:51:59,000 --> 04:52:03,000
the city believes that home hardening can prevent wildfires.

4906
04:52:04,000 --> 04:52:08,662
the city agrees that safe homes grant funds
may assist residents in hardening their

4907
04:52:08,662 --> 04:52:09,000
homes.

4908
04:52:10,000 --> 04:52:14,000
the city will participate in countywide fire-pretention fairs

4909
04:52:15,000 --> 04:52:20,555
and the city will partner with the orange
county fire authority to engage and educate

4910
04:52:20,555 --> 04:52:25,000
our residents through public
education and wildfire safety guidance.

4911
04:52:26,000 --> 04:52:31,815
and so the recommendation before you is
that the council approve this response and

4912
04:52:31,815 --> 04:52:36,000
authorize the mayor to execute
the response and then direct

4913
04:52:37,000 --> 04:52:40,000
me to submit the response as required by applicable law.

4914
04:52:42,000 --> 04:52:44,000
I'm available if anyone has any questions.

4915
04:52:45,000 --> 04:52:46,000
any questions first?

4916
04:52:50,000 --> 04:52:55,000
actually, do we have any public comments on this particular one?

4917
04:52:55,000 --> 04:52:55,000
not on this item.

4918
04:52:56,000 --> 04:52:56,000
okay.

4919
04:52:56,000 --> 04:52:59,000
sorry, I got ahead of myself a little.

4920
04:52:59,000 --> 04:53:00,000
erica, go ahead.

4921
04:53:00,000 --> 04:53:01,000
I just have one.

4922
04:53:01,000 --> 04:53:12,162
so if possible, there is somebody, andre
perron, who is very active in trying to

4923
04:53:12,162 --> 04:53:13,000
assist

4924
04:53:13,000 --> 04:53:17,897
with fire prevention, if possible, it
would be nice if you could have some

4925
04:53:17,897 --> 04:53:22,000
conversations with them because
you may have some suggestions.

4926
04:53:23,000 --> 04:53:25,000
so I'd love to get that contact information.

4927
04:53:26,000 --> 04:53:26,000
yeah.

4928
04:53:26,000 --> 04:53:27,000
and I'll follow up with it.

4929
04:53:27,000 --> 04:53:31,000
thank you because there are concerns in some areas.

4930
04:53:31,000 --> 04:53:32,000
so thank you.

4931
04:53:32,000 --> 04:53:32,000
okay.

4932
04:53:33,000 --> 04:53:33,000
thank you.

4933
04:53:34,000 --> 04:53:35,000
okay.

4934
04:53:35,000 --> 04:53:37,000
any other comments?

4935
04:53:37,000 --> 04:53:38,000
josh.

4936
04:53:39,000 --> 04:53:44,107
yeah, I just want to say I support the
substance of the response and appreciate the

4937
04:53:44,107 --> 04:53:47,000
recognition that ocfa
serves as the city's fire

4938
04:53:47,000 --> 04:53:50,000
department and technical wildfire prevention partner.

4939
04:53:51,000 --> 04:53:54,595
and I would like to recommend, I would
like recommendations r3 and r4 to be more

4940
04:53:54,595 --> 04:53:55,000
concrete.

4941
04:53:56,000 --> 04:54:00,431
but the grand jury specifically asked
cities to establish a direct contact for

4942
04:54:00,431 --> 04:54:01,000
residents.

4943
04:54:02,000 --> 04:54:06,657
could we identify the responsible city staff
physician and explain how residents will

4944
04:54:06,657 --> 04:54:10,000
reach that person and set a
target date for placing localized

4945
04:54:11,000 --> 04:54:16,000
wildfire prevention, home hardening, defensible space, and such?

4946
04:54:16,000 --> 04:54:17,000
I'll turn that back over to bob.

4947
04:54:21,000 --> 04:54:21,000
ok.

4948
04:54:21,000 --> 04:54:23,000
and then so with that,

4949
04:54:25,000 --> 04:54:29,426
as ocfa board chair, I'm committed to
ensuring this partnership produces measurable

4950
04:54:29,426 --> 04:54:33,000
resident education and preparedness,
not simply a written response.

4951
04:54:33,000 --> 04:54:36,609
and we should approve an accurate
response, assign responsibility, set dates,

4952
04:54:36,609 --> 04:54:39,000
communicate clearly, and
then measure our progress.

4953
04:54:40,000 --> 04:54:44,799
and I would like to move approval of the
response with direction that staff identify

4954
04:54:44,799 --> 04:54:48,000
the city position serving as
the direct resident contact

4955
04:54:48,000 --> 04:54:49,000
under recommendation r4.

4956
04:54:50,000 --> 04:54:54,288
establish a resident facing wildfire
information page or equivalent communication

4957
04:54:54,288 --> 04:54:58,205
channel and return to the council
with the implementation of the update of

4958
04:54:58,205 --> 04:54:59,000
recommendations

4959
04:54:59,000 --> 04:55:06,042
are to through our for including evaluation
of an appropriate community level risk

4960
04:55:06,042 --> 04:55:13,000
reduction designation second moved and
seconded any other discussion hearing none

4961
04:55:13,000 --> 04:55:14,000
call rule customer wheeler.

4962
04:55:15,000 --> 04:55:16,000
I got the member sweeney.

4963
04:55:16,000 --> 04:55:18,000
all right, mayor caskey.

4964
04:55:18,000 --> 04:55:19,000
aye. Mayor pro tem mathis.

4965
04:55:20,000 --> 04:55:20,000
aye.

4966
04:55:21,000 --> 04:55:22,000
council member pezold?

4967
04:55:22,000 --> 04:55:22,000
aye.

4968
04:55:23,000 --> 04:55:23,000
ayes have it.

4969
04:55:24,000 --> 04:55:25,000
all right.

4970
04:55:26,000 --> 04:55:32,000
we're going to persevere here, but I will tell I'm going to ask chief burk

4971
04:55:33,000 --> 04:55:37,205
I mean, just because of the lateness of
the hour and all the rest of that, I think

4972
04:55:37,205 --> 04:55:39,000
your reports are
always so amazing.

4973
04:55:40,000 --> 04:55:45,000
I want to make sure that it's not lost on a crew that's pretty well spent.

4974
04:55:45,000 --> 04:55:51,299
I would like to postpone your report, with
your permission, until our september, 1st

4975
04:55:51,299 --> 04:55:54,000
of september
meeting, september 8th.

4976
04:55:55,000 --> 04:55:56,000
mayor, that's not a problem at all.

4977
04:55:59,000 --> 04:56:01,000
so let's move on to

4978
04:56:02,000 --> 04:56:04,000
our assistant city manager.

4979
04:56:04,000 --> 04:56:09,000
I think we've got one of these things off the docket, but let's continue on.

4980
04:56:10,000 --> 04:56:11,000
that was the longest one.

4981
04:56:11,000 --> 04:56:13,000
these two should be shorter.

4982
04:56:13,000 --> 04:56:15,000
this one does involve another decision point, however.

4983
04:56:16,000 --> 04:56:19,000
so thank you for listening to me.

4984
04:56:19,000 --> 04:56:25,391
item 5.2.2, rejection of bids for cip 101m,
the citywide local street rehabilitation

4985
04:56:25,391 --> 04:56:26,000
project.

4986
04:56:26,000 --> 04:56:27,000
next slide, please.

4987
04:56:28,000 --> 04:56:34,000
so on june 23rd, the city council authorized the rebidding of the subject project.

4988
04:56:35,000 --> 04:56:39,000
and at that time, the bid proposal included a base bid and three additive bids.

4989
04:56:40,000 --> 04:56:45,881
the base bid was for zone d streets that
have been identified by city staff and its

4990
04:56:45,881 --> 04:56:49,000
consultants for an
asphalt concrete overlay.

4991
04:56:49,000 --> 04:56:52,000
additive bid one was for the remaining streets in zone d to

4992
04:56:53,000 --> 04:56:58,152
for slurry seal work, additive bid two
was for zone a streets identified for ac

4993
04:56:58,152 --> 04:56:59,000
overlay work,

4994
04:57:00,000 --> 04:57:05,595
and additive bid three consisted of concrete
improvements scattered between the two

4995
04:57:05,595 --> 04:57:06,000
zones.

4996
04:57:06,000 --> 04:57:07,000
next slide, please.

4997
04:57:08,000 --> 04:57:16,063
so we got bids on july 30th, and I find
myself in the same situation again where the

4998
04:57:16,063 --> 04:57:20,000
lowest bidder provided
high additive bids

4999
04:57:20,000 --> 04:57:21,000
again.

5000
04:57:21,000 --> 04:57:25,762
normally I would have expected during a
re-bid process to have had bids that were a

5001
04:57:25,762 --> 04:57:28,000
little bit more in
line with the second

5002
04:57:28,000 --> 04:57:30,000
lowest bidder and did not happen.

5003
04:57:30,000 --> 04:57:31,000
I haven't.

5004
04:57:31,000 --> 04:57:32,000
encountered this before.

5005
04:57:33,000 --> 04:57:37,000
so there's the table of the results there.

5006
04:57:37,000 --> 04:57:44,000
as you can see, if all american asphalt had just had a $8,000 lower base bid,

5007
04:57:44,000 --> 04:57:49,271
then we would have gotten some good choices
between additive bid one and additive bid

5008
04:57:49,271 --> 04:57:52,000
two if that was what
the city council wanted

5009
04:57:52,000 --> 04:57:53,000
to award.

5010
04:57:53,000 --> 04:57:58,776
but instead I've got higher additive bid
one and kind of a high additive bid two from

5011
04:57:58,776 --> 04:58:00,000
the lowest bidder.

5012
04:58:00,000 --> 04:58:06,010
so based upon that, I'm rejecting the bids,
but I want to have a checkpoint here with

5013
04:58:06,010 --> 04:58:07,000
all of you, so

5014
04:58:07,000 --> 04:58:08,000
just one second here.

5015
04:58:08,000 --> 04:58:09,000
next slide, please.

5016
04:58:10,000 --> 04:58:13,000
so as I was just mentioning, the lowest bidders is...

5017
04:58:17,000 --> 04:58:20,655
would be more expensive to go with if the
city council wants to award an additive bid

5018
04:58:20,655 --> 04:58:21,000
as well.

5019
04:58:21,000 --> 04:58:22,000
next slide, please.

5020
04:58:23,000 --> 04:58:26,000
so just for recollection, here is zone d.

5021
04:58:26,000 --> 04:58:30,926
pink streets are the base bid work that
we're trying to bid out for an asphalt

5022
04:58:30,926 --> 04:58:32,000
concrete overlay.

5023
04:58:33,000 --> 04:58:38,230
and then additive bid one is all the colored
streets which would receive slurry seals

5024
04:58:38,230 --> 04:58:41,000
and area dig outs for
any deficient pavement.

5025
04:58:42,000 --> 04:58:44,000
and then next slide please.

5026
04:58:45,000 --> 04:58:48,000
zone a is asphalt overlay work.

5027
04:58:50,000 --> 04:58:52,000
that would be, that was an additive bid.

5028
04:58:52,000 --> 04:58:53,000
next slide please.

5029
04:58:54,000 --> 04:59:00,000
and these are the locations of where concrete work was to occur for repairs.

5030
04:59:00,000 --> 04:59:01,000
next slide please.

5031
04:59:02,000 --> 04:59:04,000
so here are some choices here.

5032
04:59:05,000 --> 04:59:11,509
so what I'm looking for from city council
is this idea of bidding out additive bids

5033
04:59:11,509 --> 04:59:13,000
is not working out.

5034
04:59:13,000 --> 04:59:22,000
what I would like to do is go out and bid one complete project just the way it is,

5035
04:59:22,000 --> 04:59:26,000
where we determine everything is a base bid, there are no additive bids,

5036
04:59:28,000 --> 04:59:33,099
so I'm looking for a decision point from
the city council based on what scope of work

5037
04:59:33,099 --> 04:59:34,000
you want to do.

5038
04:59:35,000 --> 04:59:42,018
so one of the choices you could say is zone
d ac overlay work plus zone d slurry seal

5039
04:59:42,018 --> 04:59:44,000
work plus concrete work.

5040
04:59:45,000 --> 04:59:49,009
based upon the bids last time and the time
before, the estimated construction cost on

5041
04:59:49,009 --> 04:59:50,000
that is $3.1 million.

5042
04:59:53,000 --> 05:00:00,545
and choice two is base bid zone d ac overlay
work plus zone a oversee work, overlay

5043
05:00:00,545 --> 05:00:01,000
work,

5044
05:00:02,000 --> 05:00:06,000
and concrete work where the estimated construction cost is $3.4 million.

5045
05:00:07,000 --> 05:00:09,000
there's some pros and cons to each one of those.

5046
05:00:09,000 --> 05:00:13,705
choice one, you would complete one entire
zone, which would be zone d, and you'd

5047
05:00:13,705 --> 05:00:15,000
defer zone a to later.

5048
05:00:15,000 --> 05:00:18,000
so it would look complete, I think, to the residents.

5049
05:00:20,000 --> 05:00:26,461
but choice 2, you know, addresses the
immediate needs of the worst rated roadways by

5050
05:00:26,461 --> 05:00:30,000
paving them now and
not deferring half the job

5051
05:00:30,000 --> 05:00:32,000
until fiscal year 28, 29.

5052
05:00:33,000 --> 05:00:37,823
but then that might cause some anxiety
for some people because they see that their

5053
05:00:37,823 --> 05:00:40,000
entire neighborhood
hadn't been done.

5054
05:00:42,000 --> 05:00:46,857
the only problem with all of this is that
when you add in the construction inspection

5055
05:00:46,857 --> 05:00:50,000
and materials testing minus
the total available budget,

5056
05:00:51,000 --> 05:00:54,111
choosing either one of those things would
require an estimated contribution from the

5057
05:00:54,111 --> 05:00:56,000
general fund reserves
of $800,000 and $1.1 million.

5058
05:00:59,000 --> 05:01:01,000
if you end up choosing that, we got to bid again.

5059
05:01:01,000 --> 05:01:03,000
that's where I think we're going to wind up.

5060
05:01:04,000 --> 05:01:10,666
a choice three that's not on your screen
now is to do the zone d ac overlay work only

5061
05:01:10,666 --> 05:01:12,000
for $1.2 million,

5062
05:01:12,000 --> 05:01:12,000
but then that leaves...

5063
05:01:16,000 --> 05:01:19,989
about that same amount on the table
that would be unused in the current capital

5064
05:01:19,989 --> 05:01:21,000
improvement project,

5065
05:01:21,000 --> 05:01:25,000
and it doesn't get us very far with our overall local streets program.

5066
05:01:25,000 --> 05:01:28,000
so those are kind of the choices.

5067
05:01:28,000 --> 05:01:30,000
I don't know if I have a next slide.

5068
05:01:30,000 --> 05:01:32,000
do I have a next slide?

5069
05:01:33,000 --> 05:01:33,000
nope, that's it.

5070
05:01:34,000 --> 05:01:39,000
so if you would kindly tell me which choice you would like to do, and if you

5071
05:01:39,000 --> 05:01:42,526
need to look at the maps again so I can
go out to bid where everything's part of a

5072
05:01:42,526 --> 05:01:43,000
base bid, I

5073
05:01:44,000 --> 05:01:48,000
think that would finally get somewhere, and we'll be paving then in october, november,

5074
05:01:48,000 --> 05:01:52,030
and we'll see if the super el nino gives
us rain now or after january like what

5075
05:01:52,030 --> 05:01:53,000
happened last time.

5076
05:01:54,000 --> 05:01:57,000
okay.

5077
05:01:57,000 --> 05:02:00,000
do we have any public comments on this item?

5078
05:02:01,000 --> 05:02:01,000
we do not.

5079
05:02:03,000 --> 05:02:05,000
you don't have any public comments, scott?

5080
05:02:07,000 --> 05:02:12,000
just checking to make sure he's awake there.

5081
05:02:12,000 --> 05:02:16,000
so we have no public comments.

5082
05:02:16,000 --> 05:02:17,000
do we have any questions?

5083
05:02:18,000 --> 05:02:21,000
let's just go questions and discussion on this one.

5084
05:02:22,000 --> 05:02:22,000
no problem.

5085
05:02:22,000 --> 05:02:23,000
let's move it along.

5086
05:02:25,000 --> 05:02:25,000
anyone?

5087
05:02:26,000 --> 05:02:26,000
dave?

5088
05:02:28,000 --> 05:02:28,000
okay.

5089
05:02:29,000 --> 05:02:30,000
just a couple of quick ones.

5090
05:02:30,000 --> 05:02:31,000
page 7, please.

5091
05:02:33,000 --> 05:02:33,000
back one.

5092
05:02:35,000 --> 05:02:37,000
I'm sorry, go back again, another page.

5093
05:02:39,000 --> 05:02:39,000
more.

5094
05:02:41,000 --> 05:02:42,000
I wrote down the wrong number.

5095
05:02:42,000 --> 05:02:42,000
more.

5096
05:02:45,000 --> 05:02:45,000
more.

5097
05:02:46,000 --> 05:02:47,000
there we go.

5098
05:02:48,000 --> 05:02:50,000
okay, I need to ask a question since I don't know what it means.

5099
05:02:50,000 --> 05:02:52,000
what do you mean by additive bid and base bid?

5100
05:02:56,000 --> 05:03:04,460
so what we were trying to accomplish with
the re-bid and the original bid was that

5101
05:03:04,460 --> 05:03:09,000
the base bid is the bare
minimum of the work

5102
05:03:09,000 --> 05:03:11,000
that we would award to the contractor.

5103
05:03:11,000 --> 05:03:16,000
it signals to the contractor that no matter what,

5104
05:03:19,000 --> 05:03:24,912
zone d asphalt concrete overlay would be
awarded to the to the low bid contractor

5105
05:03:24,912 --> 05:03:29,000
unless the bids were rejected
additive bid were optional

5106
05:03:29,000 --> 05:03:34,445
bids that the city council could consider
so we packaged it up to try to give the

5107
05:03:34,445 --> 05:03:37,000
council options
based upon how the bid

5108
05:03:37,000 --> 05:03:42,444
results came in to try to allow for if there
was some great bargain that came out on

5109
05:03:42,444 --> 05:03:44,000
slurry seal for instance

5110
05:03:45,000 --> 05:03:50,113
you might change your mind and say, let's
do zone d, asphalt overlay, and the slurry

5111
05:03:50,113 --> 05:03:52,000
seal project and call it a day.

5112
05:03:52,000 --> 05:03:56,000
or you might have said, well, we got a really great bid because...

5113
05:03:56,000 --> 05:03:57,000
hold on, you're starting to confuse me.

5114
05:03:57,000 --> 05:03:58,000
sure.

5115
05:03:58,000 --> 05:03:59,000
okay, let me get slow here.

5116
05:03:59,000 --> 05:04:02,000
the base bid, does the base bid do the job?

5117
05:04:02,000 --> 05:04:06,000
the base bid, in my mind, doesn't...

5118
05:04:08,000 --> 05:04:13,604
whatever you don't do this year, you're
going to need to catch up and do again in two

5119
05:04:13,604 --> 05:04:14,000
years.

5120
05:04:15,000 --> 05:04:22,870
and so in my mind, I would recommend that
you dip into your reserves eventually and

5121
05:04:22,870 --> 05:04:26,000
at least do one
of the two zones.

5122
05:04:26,000 --> 05:04:29,000
we used to be on a program here where we would do two zones every other year.

5123
05:04:29,000 --> 05:04:30,000
that's okay.

5124
05:04:30,000 --> 05:04:30,000
I don't need no details.

5125
05:04:31,000 --> 05:04:31,000
yeah.

5126
05:04:31,000 --> 05:04:32,000
so this is...

5127
05:04:32,000 --> 05:04:36,000
so the base bid would do it, but you're saying we'd have to do it again sooner.

5128
05:04:37,000 --> 05:04:41,000
the base bid will do 25% of what we should be doing.

5129
05:04:41,000 --> 05:04:46,225
a base bid plus an additive bid will do
about 50% of what we should be doing this

5130
05:04:46,225 --> 05:04:47,000
fiscal year.

5131
05:04:48,000 --> 05:04:53,120
and so that's, you could do just the base
bid and do about 25% of what we would

5132
05:04:53,120 --> 05:04:55,000
normally do in a fiscal year,

5133
05:04:55,000 --> 05:05:00,000
but then you're also leaving, you're not
spending $1.2 million that you had allocated

5134
05:05:00,000 --> 05:05:01,000
for this project.

5135
05:05:02,000 --> 05:05:02,000
okay, when you say 25%,

5136
05:05:03,000 --> 05:05:10,454
do you mean 25% of the area we need to
do or 25% as the core of the job at the one

5137
05:05:10,454 --> 05:05:11,000
place?

5138
05:05:11,000 --> 05:05:16,000
25% of the area of the two of the neighborhoods that we would normally do.

5139
05:05:16,000 --> 05:05:22,000
so basically what we could do is just stretch it out and do fewer areas.

5140
05:05:24,000 --> 05:05:24,000
we could.

5141
05:05:24,000 --> 05:05:25,000
and then we could stretch it out.

5142
05:05:25,000 --> 05:05:30,000
and basically instead of doing a six-year cycle, we go to an eight-year cycle.

5143
05:05:31,000 --> 05:05:35,000
I had originally mentioned in the past about like a 10-year cycle kind of thing.

5144
05:05:35,000 --> 05:05:36,000
I don't see that as an option.

5145
05:05:36,000 --> 05:05:38,000
I think that's probably the best.

5146
05:05:39,000 --> 05:05:42,181
I hate dipping into our reserve because
it's a bad present because we'll start doing

5147
05:05:42,181 --> 05:05:44,000
it, and pretty soon there
won't be any reserves,

5148
05:05:44,000 --> 05:05:46,000
as I've mentioned many times.

5149
05:05:46,000 --> 05:05:48,000
but, yeah, I'd like to see an option.

5150
05:05:48,000 --> 05:05:52,770
since you want to reject these anyway, I'd
like to see the next time you stretch it

5151
05:05:52,770 --> 05:05:53,000
out.

5152
05:05:53,000 --> 05:05:54,000
give us the option of stretch.

5153
05:05:54,000 --> 05:05:55,000
okay.

5154
05:05:55,000 --> 05:05:57,000
you don't have to reject bids tonight.

5155
05:05:57,000 --> 05:06:03,488
you could direct city staff to instead award
a contract to harding and harper for the

5156
05:06:03,488 --> 05:06:07,000
base bid for $1,182,000
and authorize the city

5157
05:06:08,000 --> 05:06:10,000
manager to execute the contract.

5158
05:06:10,000 --> 05:06:10,000
you could do that.

5159
05:06:12,000 --> 05:06:13,000
I haven't typed up the agreement.

5160
05:06:13,000 --> 05:06:16,000
you'd have to assume that I would type up the agreement.

5161
05:06:16,000 --> 05:06:18,000
we would award it that way, but we could award it that way.

5162
05:06:19,000 --> 05:06:20,000
okay.

5163
05:06:20,000 --> 05:06:21,000
I'm going to leave that to my colleagues.

5164
05:06:21,000 --> 05:06:25,000
I'm going to go to jared next, and then I have some comments.

5165
05:06:25,000 --> 05:06:29,000
so what gets all of area d done?

5166
05:06:30,000 --> 05:06:32,000
is that the base and the additive bid?

5167
05:06:32,000 --> 05:06:34,000
that's the base bid and additive bid one.

5168
05:06:36,000 --> 05:06:37,000
right, so 2.275.

5169
05:06:39,000 --> 05:06:41,000
well, that's if you wanted to award it tonight.

5170
05:06:42,000 --> 05:06:43,000
oh, all-american.

5171
05:06:43,000 --> 05:06:50,640
yes, that's the problem is that hardy and
harper's got$400,000 higher on additive bid

5172
05:06:50,640 --> 05:06:51,000
one.

5173
05:06:51,000 --> 05:06:51,000
got it.

5174
05:06:52,000 --> 05:06:54,789
but if you gave me direction, for instance,
that that's the direction you wanted to

5175
05:06:54,789 --> 05:06:56,000
go and I put it
out to re-bid again,

5176
05:06:56,000 --> 05:06:59,000
then maybe we'd save that kind of money.

5177
05:07:00,000 --> 05:07:02,000
I think, you know, spreading this stuff out does make sense,

5178
05:07:03,000 --> 05:07:08,000
but completing one area together at the same time is nice if we can do it,

5179
05:07:09,000 --> 05:07:12,000
understanding that there may be impact on the reserves,

5180
05:07:12,000 --> 05:07:20,021
but less than trying to get two districts
or two zones partially done or even with

5181
05:07:20,021 --> 05:07:21,000
additives.

5182
05:07:21,000 --> 05:07:27,533
so, I mean, I would be in favor of just
covering d with the base and additive bid if

5183
05:07:27,533 --> 05:07:28,000
that's

5184
05:07:31,000 --> 05:07:35,285
if that gets us where we want to go and
actually makes a difference in the quality of

5185
05:07:35,285 --> 05:07:37,000
life of the residents
in that area

5186
05:07:37,000 --> 05:07:40,000
and then you focus on other areas later.

5187
05:07:47,000 --> 05:07:53,247
parsis up as I could I could make the this
base bid work equal to the combination of

5188
05:07:53,247 --> 05:07:56,000
asphalt overlay
and slurry seal but I

5189
05:07:56,000 --> 05:08:00,973
think adds it to about 2.5 million dollars
and then to be a small additive bid on

5190
05:08:00,973 --> 05:08:03,000
that and then if
that doesn't get

5191
05:08:03,000 --> 05:08:07,153
done but then you won't have a complete
job for zone ds so then that would be the

5192
05:08:07,153 --> 05:08:09,000
hazard again would
be the perception

5193
05:08:09,000 --> 05:08:13,670
of not completing the whole area so I yeah,
I whatever the city council would like me

5194
05:08:13,670 --> 05:08:14,000
to do.

5195
05:08:14,000 --> 05:08:15,000
I'm happy to do I

5196
05:08:16,000 --> 05:08:20,000
okay, I have some remarks, and I go back to eric then after that.

5197
05:08:21,000 --> 05:08:23,000
could you go back to the actual bids?

5198
05:08:24,000 --> 05:08:24,000
yes.

5199
05:08:25,000 --> 05:08:27,000
okay, there you go.

5200
05:08:27,000 --> 05:08:31,762
okay, the interesting thing about
this, and it's not the first time I've seen

5201
05:08:31,762 --> 05:08:33,000
something like this,

5202
05:08:34,000 --> 05:08:39,040
is whenever you do notice that these additive
bids, you know, are like twice as much

5203
05:08:39,040 --> 05:08:40,000
as the base bid.

5204
05:08:41,000 --> 05:08:45,000
and so the game of public works is

5205
05:08:46,000 --> 05:08:47,000
is uh...

5206
05:08:47,000 --> 05:08:50,516
you know you they try to win on the base
that that they're hoping that you're going

5207
05:08:50,516 --> 05:08:52,000
to take an additive
did and they're

5208
05:08:52,000 --> 05:08:59,362
actually going to end up more money than
elvis and it doesn't become people anymore

5209
05:08:59,362 --> 05:09:03,000
you got it two weeks
these bits and these

5210
05:09:03,000 --> 05:09:08,599
guys are really pretty savvy about how they
go about doing this so I really like the

5211
05:09:08,599 --> 05:09:11,000
idea of of let's
simplify this thing

5212
05:09:11,000 --> 05:09:16,000
one way or the other and it would it seemed to me that your your basic

5213
05:09:16,000 --> 05:09:22,000
your budget was 2.5 million, which you really had, and so you

5214
05:09:22,000 --> 05:09:27,289
were looking at whether you did a certain
amount and you ended up going into the

5215
05:09:27,289 --> 05:09:30,000
piggy bank by $500,000
or $600,000 is one

5216
05:09:30,000 --> 05:09:34,666
thing, and the other one was more like a
million, million, one, something like that,

5217
05:09:34,666 --> 05:09:36,000
if you go the other way.

5218
05:09:36,000 --> 05:09:44,000
I do like the idea of not doing some partial job, and I think we should simplify it.

5219
05:09:45,000 --> 05:09:47,000
I don't have a problem with...

5220
05:09:48,000 --> 05:09:53,000
I'm not really excited, as dave is, going into the general funds at all.

5221
05:09:54,000 --> 05:10:05,325
but if we can keep the thing cohesive to
some extent, then, you know, half a million

5222
05:10:05,325 --> 05:10:06,000
is...

5223
05:10:07,000 --> 05:10:12,000
as opposed to 1 or 1.1 is more to my liking.

5224
05:10:13,000 --> 05:10:14,000
peacemailing this thing out

5225
05:10:15,000 --> 05:10:19,000
completely over, you know, a huge period of time.

5226
05:10:20,000 --> 05:10:25,538
you know, each one of these things that
need to be done is not really exciting to me

5227
05:10:25,538 --> 05:10:26,000
either.

5228
05:10:27,000 --> 05:10:30,000
so that's my thought process with that.

5229
05:10:30,000 --> 05:10:31,000
erica.

5230
05:10:32,000 --> 05:10:37,000
no, I just, I think this is not good news.

5231
05:10:38,000 --> 05:10:42,000
and I personally think that we have,

5232
05:10:43,000 --> 05:10:45,000
been so fiscally responsible in all the years.

5233
05:10:45,000 --> 05:10:51,371
I know I was very proud when we had a
proper pavement plan and that our city has

5234
05:10:51,371 --> 05:10:54,000
dipped into it and
made decisions

5235
05:10:54,000 --> 05:10:56,000
where we've lost that.

5236
05:10:56,000 --> 05:11:02,631
I just, I can't see us, I mean, it's just
not fiscally responsible to make decisions

5237
05:11:02,631 --> 05:11:05,000
and then say, okay, that's it.

5238
05:11:05,000 --> 05:11:11,000
you know, we want to pull, I mean, it's a million, it's a huge

5239
05:11:12,000 --> 05:11:13,000
amount of money out of the reserves.

5240
05:11:14,000 --> 05:11:18,848
so if we keep making these decisions,
what are the reserves and the reserves are

5241
05:11:18,848 --> 05:11:20,000
there for a reason.

5242
05:11:20,000 --> 05:11:29,494
so it is, I am very concerned because we
don't just pull money out of reserves for

5243
05:11:29,494 --> 05:11:31,000
paving roads.

5244
05:11:32,000 --> 05:11:38,000
we're being asked to make a decision to pull a lot of money out.

5245
05:11:39,000 --> 05:11:41,000
but I do understand

5246
05:11:42,000 --> 05:11:49,500
the necessity if you I mean to jump around
I think that cost is uh and uh mr ames

5247
05:11:49,500 --> 05:11:52,000
jumping around is that also

5248
05:11:52,000 --> 05:11:56,000
does that increase the cost of the project because you're jumping to streets

5249
05:11:57,000 --> 05:12:02,355
so it is helpful to keep it in a somewhat
helpful, not entirely helpful, somewhat

5250
05:12:02,355 --> 05:12:05,000
helpful to keep it
in a geographic area,

5251
05:12:05,000 --> 05:12:10,000
which is I think zone d makes more sense.

5252
05:12:10,000 --> 05:12:13,000
the more we're talking about it is just to finish off a job in an area.

5253
05:12:14,000 --> 05:12:19,000
but the paving contractor is not the same people as the slurry seal contractor.

5254
05:12:20,000 --> 05:12:24,759
so all you're really saving there is that
sort of remobilization from going from zone

5255
05:12:24,759 --> 05:12:27,000
d in the middle of
the city down to zone

5256
05:12:27,000 --> 05:12:29,000
a to do that overlay job.

5257
05:12:32,000 --> 05:12:35,000
I don't think it makes a significant difference in this case.

5258
05:12:36,000 --> 05:12:40,000
there's enough work there where they would just mobilize and do the work.

5259
05:12:40,000 --> 05:12:43,000
I don't know if that answers your question.

5260
05:12:43,000 --> 05:12:47,329
would it be worth going back out to bid if
you increase the area to see if they'd be

5261
05:12:47,329 --> 05:12:48,000
willing to...

5262
05:12:49,000 --> 05:12:50,000
change the bid numbers.

5263
05:12:50,000 --> 05:12:54,000
I don't want to add more work, but I'm just wondering if changing the strategy

5264
05:12:55,000 --> 05:13:01,000
no, the whole idea of doing the additive bids was already to sort of change strategy.

5265
05:13:01,000 --> 05:13:05,000
if I add more work, I'm not going to get appreciably lower pricing.

5266
05:13:05,000 --> 05:13:10,986
we actually got, surprisingly, despite
the current situation with oil prices, we

5267
05:13:10,986 --> 05:13:16,000
actually got some pretty good
bids for an asphalt concrete overlay.

5268
05:13:16,000 --> 05:13:18,000
I was surprised they came in where they were at.

5269
05:13:18,000 --> 05:13:22,000
I was expecting something worse, which

5270
05:13:23,000 --> 05:13:28,311
really tells me that the second lowest
bidder pricing and the third lowest bidder

5271
05:13:28,311 --> 05:13:31,000
pricing is, you know,
it was really good.

5272
05:13:31,000 --> 05:13:35,000
actually, the second lowest bidder pricing is really good.

5273
05:13:36,000 --> 05:13:38,000
so I was, anyway.

5274
05:13:40,000 --> 05:13:44,527
we're not going to get a whole lot better
by just adding more quantities, trying to

5275
05:13:44,527 --> 05:13:46,000
drive down the unit prices.

5276
05:13:46,000 --> 05:13:48,000
are you done, erica?

5277
05:13:48,000 --> 05:13:49,000
you're done.

5278
05:13:49,000 --> 05:13:52,000
okay, I have a couple things to add to that.

5279
05:13:53,000 --> 05:13:55,000
I think you got the right idea.

5280
05:13:55,000 --> 05:13:59,471
let's get rid of the additive bids and
go out and keep this straight up because

5281
05:13:59,471 --> 05:14:01,000
you're going to get better.

5282
05:14:01,000 --> 05:14:05,662
I think you're going to get better bids
than people plan the base bid, additive bid

5283
05:14:05,662 --> 05:14:06,000
thing,

5284
05:14:06,000 --> 05:14:09,000
and I think you're going to get better bids altogether.

5285
05:14:11,000 --> 05:14:13,000
that's just my own personal experience.

5286
05:14:13,000 --> 05:14:18,979
but, you know, the other thing that I would
just like to point out, when I came to

5287
05:14:18,979 --> 05:14:20,000
the city five,

5288
05:14:20,000 --> 05:14:21,000
five and a half years ago,

5289
05:14:23,000 --> 05:14:26,000
I was very interested in all these kind of numbers as well.

5290
05:14:26,000 --> 05:14:32,375
and one of the things I was acquainted with
right away which told me that this is not

5291
05:14:32,375 --> 05:14:35,000
some thing that
is brand new to the

5292
05:14:35,000 --> 05:14:36,000
city as far as a problem.

5293
05:14:37,000 --> 05:14:43,938
we had, I seem to remember, $36 million
worth of things that we could lay out that we

5294
05:14:43,938 --> 05:14:45,000
needed to do.

5295
05:14:46,000 --> 05:14:51,000
and we needed to do them within four years or whatever the amount of time was.

5296
05:14:52,000 --> 05:14:57,708
and the reality is the amount of money that
we could spend per year, okay, was about

5297
05:14:57,708 --> 05:14:59,000
one-fourth of that.

5298
05:15:01,000 --> 05:15:08,000
and so this issue of having to pick and choose, push things off, it goes way back.

5299
05:15:08,000 --> 05:15:12,000
it's not something that we just discovered day before yesterday.

5300
05:15:13,000 --> 05:15:16,000
and it might be getting more serious, no question about that.

5301
05:15:17,000 --> 05:15:19,000
and we've got to do economic development.

5302
05:15:19,000 --> 05:15:20,000
we've got to do a whole lot of things.

5303
05:15:21,000 --> 05:15:25,396
I'd like to approach it in a much more
positive way instead of just looking at it and

5304
05:15:25,396 --> 05:15:27,000
saying, oh, well, we're doomed,

5305
05:15:27,000 --> 05:15:28,000
you know.

5306
05:15:29,000 --> 05:15:34,000
and so, but I do think bottom line, keep it simple.

5307
05:15:35,000 --> 05:15:40,000
and that really gets down to whether we want to spend a dime over$2.5 million or not.

5308
05:15:42,000 --> 05:15:49,387
or we're willing to do these in some kind
of parts and take a risk that by doing a

5309
05:15:49,387 --> 05:15:52,000
straight bid and not additive

5310
05:15:52,000 --> 05:15:58,000
bids, that we're not going to be dipping into our general funds very much at all.

5311
05:15:58,000 --> 05:16:01,000
so that would be my advice.

5312
05:16:02,000 --> 05:16:02,000
dave.

5313
05:16:05,000 --> 05:16:13,895
sorry, okay, you're good do we have a anyone
want to make a motion or move this along

5314
05:16:13,895 --> 05:16:14,000
I

5315
05:16:17,000 --> 05:16:20,000
well, I think I just pretty much did it.

5316
05:16:20,000 --> 05:16:26,036
except I really would like to hear from
someone else as to whether or not we should

5317
05:16:26,036 --> 05:16:28,000
be going for zone d or not.

5318
05:16:29,000 --> 05:16:30,000
how do we all feel about it?

5319
05:16:31,000 --> 05:16:32,000
I think it makes sense.

5320
05:16:33,000 --> 05:16:34,000
I think it's definable.

5321
05:16:35,000 --> 05:16:35,000
and...

5322
05:16:38,000 --> 05:16:41,000
communicates a good message if we can do it all together.

5323
05:16:42,000 --> 05:16:47,429
and I agree going out with one bid instead
of the additive bids and see what we get

5324
05:16:47,429 --> 05:16:49,000
and then see what we can

5325
05:16:49,000 --> 05:16:49,000
afford.

5326
05:16:49,000 --> 05:16:50,000
but I will say.

5327
05:16:51,000 --> 05:16:55,628
I mean, the fundamental responsibility
of the city is to make sure that we've got

5328
05:16:55,628 --> 05:16:57,000
solid roads and, I mean,

5329
05:16:58,000 --> 05:17:03,423
if we're going to start, you know, pinching
on that over other things, you know,

5330
05:17:03,423 --> 05:17:06,000
property values, so
many other things,

5331
05:17:06,000 --> 05:17:11,000
quality of life are tied to this basic blocking and tackling of a city.

5332
05:17:12,000 --> 05:17:16,772
and so I think as it ranks among other
things that we may or may not spend money on,

5333
05:17:16,772 --> 05:17:17,000
this

5334
05:17:18,000 --> 05:17:19,000
is very much high on the list.

5335
05:17:20,000 --> 05:17:23,000
economic realities are that I think maybe it was mr.

5336
05:17:23,000 --> 05:17:29,074
ames had said to do this stuff cost twice
as much as it did what five years ago if

5337
05:17:29,074 --> 05:17:31,000
something like that or 50%

5338
05:17:31,000 --> 05:17:32,000
more percent higher.

5339
05:17:32,000 --> 05:17:38,538
yeah, so I mean you know that that's something
that that isn't just endemic to laguna

5340
05:17:38,538 --> 05:17:39,000
hills.

5341
05:17:39,000 --> 05:17:42,000
that's across the board so we just got to figure out how to manage it, but I

5342
05:17:42,000 --> 05:17:46,333
think doing one area at a time makes
sense and we got to figure out how we can

5343
05:17:46,333 --> 05:17:48,000
sequence it down the road, but

5344
05:17:49,000 --> 05:17:53,000
so yeah, if that's a motion I would I'll make a motion okay.

5345
05:17:53,000 --> 05:18:01,532
I'll make a motion that that you go out
to bid with essentially your base bid and a

5346
05:18:01,532 --> 05:18:04,000
zone d as one setup deal

5347
05:18:04,000 --> 05:18:09,466
okay pretty clean and and then let's roll
the dice see where we're at and then you

5348
05:18:09,466 --> 05:18:12,000
also include the
reject of all all the

5349
05:18:12,000 --> 05:18:15,000
current bid proposals in your motion okay

5350
05:18:17,000 --> 05:18:18,000
do we have a second?

5351
05:18:18,000 --> 05:18:18,000
second.

5352
05:18:18,000 --> 05:18:20,000
okay, we have a second.

5353
05:18:21,000 --> 05:18:22,000
any other discussion?

5354
05:18:22,000 --> 05:18:22,000
dave?

5355
05:18:23,000 --> 05:18:26,000
yeah, I wanted to understand this a little better.

5356
05:18:26,000 --> 05:18:31,586
okay, so your proposal is, well, let me
ask joe, what does the base and the slurry,

5357
05:18:31,586 --> 05:18:33,000
so those go together?

5358
05:18:34,000 --> 05:18:43,375
so what I'm understanding is the motion on
the table is to reject all bids placed and

5359
05:18:43,375 --> 05:18:49,000
then to create bid
specifications and re-advertise.

5360
05:18:51,000 --> 05:18:53,000
I would also like to get clarifications.

5361
05:18:54,000 --> 05:18:55,000
sorry, what?

5362
05:18:55,000 --> 05:18:56,000
too much detail.

5363
05:18:57,000 --> 05:18:59,000
is the base and the slurry the same thing?

5364
05:19:00,000 --> 05:19:05,000
no, the base bid is for the asphalt overlay of robert.

5365
05:19:05,000 --> 05:19:08,000
could you go to slide six, please?

5366
05:19:08,000 --> 05:19:09,000
the base of the asphalt.

5367
05:19:10,000 --> 05:19:11,000
sorry, go to slide five.

5368
05:19:11,000 --> 05:19:14,000
and the slurry is over top of it to seal it up?

5369
05:19:14,000 --> 05:19:14,000
no.

5370
05:19:14,000 --> 05:19:15,000
okay.

5371
05:19:15,000 --> 05:19:18,000
so this is zone d.

5372
05:19:19,000 --> 05:19:26,000
the pink streets would receive a one and a half inch asphalt overlay.

5373
05:19:27,000 --> 05:19:27,000
okay.

5374
05:19:28,000 --> 05:19:28,000
okay.

5375
05:19:29,000 --> 05:19:29,000
over those streets.

5376
05:19:30,000 --> 05:19:32,000
different streets and different things.

5377
05:19:33,000 --> 05:19:33,000
different streets.

5378
05:19:34,000 --> 05:19:42,769
the other colored streets will receive area
digouts of any deficient asphalt and then

5379
05:19:42,769 --> 05:19:47,000
a slurry seal treatment
on those streets.

5380
05:19:48,000 --> 05:19:48,000
okay.

5381
05:19:48,000 --> 05:19:49,000
so going back to the bit again.

5382
05:19:49,000 --> 05:19:50,000
for cost effectiveness.

5383
05:19:50,000 --> 05:19:51,000
going back to the bit again.

5384
05:19:54,000 --> 05:19:59,000
okay, so in area d, some streets need a base, some streets need a slurry.

5385
05:20:00,000 --> 05:20:01,000
yes.

5386
05:20:01,000 --> 05:20:01,000
period.

5387
05:20:01,000 --> 05:20:02,000
okay.

5388
05:20:02,000 --> 05:20:03,000
I understand what that is.

5389
05:20:03,000 --> 05:20:04,000
one is to lay the whole thing, one is to put the...

5390
05:20:05,000 --> 05:20:06,000
sort of patch it up.

5391
05:20:06,000 --> 05:20:13,000
so we're going to go out and do, okay, basically call two and call three.

5392
05:20:13,000 --> 05:20:15,000
I don't know how much better, but you'll get better.

5393
05:20:15,000 --> 05:20:16,000
it should be better.

5394
05:20:16,000 --> 05:20:20,435
the second, third, and fourth lowest bidders,
if you add up those numbers, they all

5395
05:20:20,435 --> 05:20:23,000
add up to almost exactly
the same dollar amount.

5396
05:20:24,000 --> 05:20:24,000
and you know what?

5397
05:20:25,000 --> 05:20:26,000
just an observation.

5398
05:20:28,000 --> 05:20:32,403
when things are clean like that and they're
looking at it and they know it's one

5399
05:20:32,403 --> 05:20:34,000
number and it's all base bid,

5400
05:20:34,000 --> 05:20:36,000
you're going to find these guys sharpen their numbers.

5401
05:20:37,000 --> 05:20:38,000
yeah, I actually had two more little points.

5402
05:20:38,000 --> 05:20:39,000
sure, go ahead.

5403
05:20:39,000 --> 05:20:42,000
no, I like that you have a keep it simple kiss system.

5404
05:20:42,000 --> 05:20:43,000
yeah.

5405
05:20:45,000 --> 05:20:45,000
as far as the...

5406
05:20:48,000 --> 05:20:51,672
the people that do this, are we under the
restrictions of the state that we have to

5407
05:20:51,672 --> 05:20:53,000
use the most expensive people,

5408
05:20:53,000 --> 05:20:58,000
like we have to use unions with full detail, etc., etc.?

5409
05:20:59,000 --> 05:21:03,141
all contractors doing this work must
pay prevailing wages as determined by the

5410
05:21:03,141 --> 05:21:05,000
department of
industrial relations.

5411
05:21:05,000 --> 05:21:09,000
so there is a minimum amount that all the workers must be paid.

5412
05:21:09,000 --> 05:21:11,000
I hear a yes in the cities.

5413
05:21:11,000 --> 05:21:11,000
yes.

5414
05:21:11,000 --> 05:21:15,000
sort of like a$20 way for people working at mcdonald's.

5415
05:21:16,000 --> 05:21:16,000
okay.

5416
05:21:18,000 --> 05:21:19,000
oh, I have another one.

5417
05:21:19,000 --> 05:21:20,000
I can't remember it now.

5418
05:21:20,000 --> 05:21:21,000
welcome to public works.

5419
05:21:23,000 --> 05:21:24,000
okay.

5420
05:21:24,000 --> 05:21:25,000
I can't think of it.

5421
05:21:25,000 --> 05:21:27,000
okay.

5422
05:21:28,000 --> 05:21:29,000
jarrett, you have your light on.

5423
05:21:30,000 --> 05:21:31,000
but nobody's home.

5424
05:21:33,000 --> 05:21:34,000
okay.

5425
05:21:34,000 --> 05:21:37,000
so with that, let's call the roll.

5426
05:21:38,000 --> 05:21:40,000
just to clarify, what is the question now?

5427
05:21:41,000 --> 05:21:41,000
go ahead.

5428
05:21:41,000 --> 05:21:45,000
reject this and go back to work for base and additive critique.

5429
05:21:46,000 --> 05:21:49,000
base and zone d.

5430
05:21:50,000 --> 05:21:52,000
so it won't be an additive.

5431
05:21:52,000 --> 05:21:53,000
it'll all be one big base.

5432
05:21:54,000 --> 05:21:54,000
how's that?

5433
05:21:55,000 --> 05:22:00,981
could I also ask the city council, would
you also consider starting to come back

5434
05:22:00,981 --> 05:22:03,000
again on september 8th, the

5435
05:22:03,000 --> 05:22:07,000
authority to re-advertise for construction?

5436
05:22:09,000 --> 05:22:12,816
or do you want to see the revised bid
schedule proving that I'm going to do it that

5437
05:22:12,816 --> 05:22:13,000
way?

5438
05:22:16,000 --> 05:22:18,000
as far as I'm concerned, whatever you think is the right way to go.

5439
05:22:19,000 --> 05:22:20,000
I would appreciate that.

5440
05:22:20,000 --> 05:22:24,000
it would help speed things along so we might have a hope of paving by halloween.

5441
05:22:24,000 --> 05:22:27,000
I don't want to micromanage you on that kind of stuff.

5442
05:22:28,000 --> 05:22:28,000
you know what you're doing.

5443
05:22:31,000 --> 05:22:35,207
by the way, before we vote, I just want to
say the amount of work that you did on all

5444
05:22:35,207 --> 05:22:36,000
of this, I mean,

5445
05:22:37,000 --> 05:22:42,000
the research about what we need on what streets and all the rest of that is stellar.

5446
05:22:43,000 --> 05:22:45,000
and I want to talk about saving money.

5447
05:22:46,000 --> 05:22:50,000
mean that was that's the that's the big job of just not throwing.

5448
05:22:50,000 --> 05:22:56,323
you know one one shoe fits all kind of
thing at it so kudos to you for doing that I

5449
05:22:56,323 --> 05:22:58,000
have an amazing staff.

5450
05:22:58,000 --> 05:22:58,000
thank you.

5451
05:22:59,000 --> 05:23:04,613
yeah, well all of you all of you together
when I say you I mean your old unit so with

5452
05:23:04,613 --> 05:23:06,000
that we're gonna call

5453
05:23:07,000 --> 05:23:09,000
the roll mayor pertain mathis.

5454
05:23:09,000 --> 05:23:11,000
hi councilmember wheeler.

5455
05:23:11,000 --> 05:23:12,000
hi mayor katsky.

5456
05:23:13,000 --> 05:23:13,000
hi.

5457
05:23:13,000 --> 05:23:14,000
come over sweeney.

5458
05:23:14,000 --> 05:23:14,000
hi.

5459
05:23:15,000 --> 05:23:16,000
that's a little abstain.

5460
05:23:18,000 --> 05:23:18,000
I have it.

5461
05:23:18,000 --> 05:23:20,000
okay.

5462
05:23:23,000 --> 05:23:28,486
and now we're to the last item, rejection
of bids on authority and authority to

5463
05:23:28,486 --> 05:23:33,000
re-advertise for the construction
of park improvements for cabot,

5464
05:23:33,000 --> 05:23:39,000
el canejo park, mckenzie park, san remo park, and v ranch park.

5465
05:23:40,000 --> 05:23:43,000
so thank you for that.

5466
05:23:43,000 --> 05:23:44,000
next slide, please.

5467
05:23:45,000 --> 05:23:50,115
so on june 24th, we opened up bids for
five park improvement projects, and we got

5468
05:23:50,115 --> 05:23:51,000
mixed results.

5469
05:23:52,000 --> 05:23:54,000
and as I was typing up this agenda report,

5470
05:23:54,000 --> 05:23:58,500
I was trying to figure out what the best
way of describing what happened with all

5471
05:23:58,500 --> 05:23:59,000
this was.

5472
05:24:00,000 --> 05:24:02,000
and so I think I've done a good job.

5473
05:24:02,000 --> 05:24:07,000
so for cabot park, the two lowest bidders failed to include the signed addenda,

5474
05:24:07,000 --> 05:24:10,617
and the third lowest bidder's price was
significantly higher than the lowest bidder's

5475
05:24:10,617 --> 05:24:11,000
proposal.

5476
05:24:12,000 --> 05:24:16,121
for el caneo park, the lowest responsive
bidder provided an unacceptable additive bid

5477
05:24:16,121 --> 05:24:20,000
for a neighborhood desired improvements
that we would have otherwise recommended

5478
05:24:20,000 --> 05:24:22,000
a city council for approval.

5479
05:24:22,000 --> 05:24:24,000
for mckenzie park, we got a bid protest.

5480
05:24:25,000 --> 05:24:27,000
we thought that the bid protest may have merit.

5481
05:24:28,000 --> 05:24:32,000
and rather than fight that one out, I would reject all bids there.

5482
05:24:32,000 --> 05:24:34,000
next slide, please.

5483
05:24:34,000 --> 05:24:39,000
for san remo park, again, added bid might have been a problem.

5484
05:24:39,000 --> 05:24:43,472
and then v ranch park, the lowest bidder
withdrew the bid due to a clerical error,

5485
05:24:43,472 --> 05:24:45,000
which they were entitled to.

5486
05:24:46,000 --> 05:24:47,000
underneath the code.

5487
05:24:47,000 --> 05:24:50,000
and the next lowest bidder's base proposal is$100,000 more.

5488
05:24:51,000 --> 05:24:56,000
and based upon how, when I was reading the results of the additive bids,

5489
05:24:56,000 --> 05:25:00,150
I think some bidders misinterpreted the
schedule making comparisons of those bids a

5490
05:25:00,150 --> 05:25:01,000
little difficult.

5491
05:25:03,000 --> 05:25:08,169
the only shining or silver lining in all
this was that the good news is that all the

5492
05:25:08,169 --> 05:25:11,000
base bids for each
project appear to be within

5493
05:25:11,000 --> 05:25:14,000
the original budget that I provided to city council for all of this.

5494
05:25:15,000 --> 05:25:18,644
so I'm just recommending the rejection
of all bids and the re-advertisement of the

5495
05:25:18,644 --> 05:25:19,000
project.

5496
05:25:20,000 --> 05:25:24,000
and I've self-identified some improvements to the plans and specifications

5497
05:25:25,000 --> 05:25:30,114
I think will work and will work better
and I still am not willing to throw out

5498
05:25:30,114 --> 05:25:33,000
additive bid schedules
I still like additive

5499
05:25:33,000 --> 05:25:37,000
bid schedules despite our experience with the prior paving job.

5500
05:25:37,000 --> 05:25:41,031
I think it's important for the city council
at least have some options on these park

5501
05:25:41,031 --> 05:25:43,000
projects I will look
to package them up a

5502
05:25:43,000 --> 05:25:44,000
little bit more and

5503
05:25:45,000 --> 05:25:49,869
and while those improvements to the bid
schedule aren't included in tonight's agenda

5504
05:25:49,869 --> 05:25:53,000
packet because I was out
of the office due to a family

5505
05:25:53,000 --> 05:25:57,000
emergency, I'm requesting authority to re-advertise now in the interest of time.

5506
05:25:58,000 --> 05:26:00,000
so that's the end of my staff report.

5507
05:26:01,000 --> 05:26:06,000
the next slides, if you care to see them, are, again,

5508
05:26:06,000 --> 05:26:11,793
showing what the base and additive bids
were that were being shown to the bidders of

5509
05:26:11,793 --> 05:26:14,000
what the park improvements were.

5510
05:26:15,000 --> 05:26:21,247
so then please let me know if you have any
questions any discussion once again keep

5511
05:26:21,247 --> 05:26:22,000
it simple,

5512
05:26:22,000 --> 05:26:26,000
and I think you're gonna get it this next time around hopefully I

5513
05:26:39,000 --> 05:26:39,000
all right.

5514
05:26:40,000 --> 05:26:42,000
so we have been moved and seconded.

5515
05:26:42,000 --> 05:26:43,000
we'll take a roll call vote.

5516
05:26:44,000 --> 05:26:45,000
council member wheeler.

5517
05:26:49,000 --> 05:26:49,000
your vote.

5518
05:26:50,000 --> 05:26:51,000
oh, I'm sorry.

5519
05:26:51,000 --> 05:26:52,000
I didn't hear you say my name.

5520
05:26:52,000 --> 05:26:53,000
aye.

5521
05:26:54,000 --> 05:26:54,000
council member sweeney.

5522
05:26:55,000 --> 05:26:55,000
aye.

5523
05:26:55,000 --> 05:26:56,000
council member pezzel.

5524
05:26:56,000 --> 05:26:56,000
aye.

5525
05:26:57,000 --> 05:26:57,000
mayor furtan-mathis.

5526
05:26:58,000 --> 05:26:58,000
aye.

5527
05:26:59,000 --> 05:26:59,000
mayor kesky.

5528
05:26:59,000 --> 05:27:00,000
aye.

5529
05:27:00,000 --> 05:27:00,000
aye.

5530
05:27:00,000 --> 05:27:01,000
cabot.

5531
05:27:02,000 --> 05:27:03,000
okay.

5532
05:27:04,000 --> 05:27:07,000
thank you, captain burke, for your comments.

5533
05:27:08,000 --> 05:27:14,000
flexibility and we'll look forward to hearing your report at the next meeting, okay?

5534
05:27:15,000 --> 05:27:19,500
and so we're now to city council committee
reports councilmember pays old did you

5535
05:27:19,500 --> 05:27:21,000
want to report on anything?

5536
05:27:21,000 --> 05:27:38,000
my apologies there are a number of presentations provided at the tca meeting.

5537
05:27:40,000 --> 05:27:46,775
but I think it's more important right now
to move to the orange county mosquito and

5538
05:27:46,775 --> 05:27:48,000
vector control.

5539
05:27:50,000 --> 05:27:57,589
and the reason why it's very important is
that right now there's a lot of buzz around

5540
05:27:57,589 --> 05:28:00,000
removing certain chemicals.

5541
05:28:00,000 --> 05:28:02,000
there's a lot of stuff happening.

5542
05:28:02,000 --> 05:28:08,538
in ladera ranch, there's a lot of, there's
just a lot of things, and many discussions

5543
05:28:08,538 --> 05:28:10,000
that are being had.

5544
05:28:11,000 --> 05:28:19,615
and what we're seeing right now at orange
county, at oc vector is an increase in the

5545
05:28:19,615 --> 05:28:23,000
west nile virus
mosquito samples.

5546
05:28:24,000 --> 05:28:31,000
and I just would like to make mention that there is not a lot of communication about

5547
05:28:32,000 --> 05:28:38,335
some of the consequences with west nile
with the mosquito and why it's important is

5548
05:28:38,335 --> 05:28:42,000
that in the meeting um
there was a an individual

5549
05:28:43,000 --> 05:28:49,538
that said that her her neighbor is a doctor
and he sees a lot of meningitis and um in

5550
05:28:49,538 --> 05:28:52,000
meningitis the symptoms are very

5551
05:28:53,000 --> 05:28:58,203
quick and you can die very quickly and
there isn't really a lot of conversations

5552
05:28:58,203 --> 05:29:01,000
whether or not it
derived from the mosquito

5553
05:29:01,000 --> 05:29:02,000
but it's happening.

5554
05:29:02,000 --> 05:29:03,000
there's increases.

5555
05:29:03,000 --> 05:29:09,000
and so with the increases of west nile, I think that we have to be very cautious.

5556
05:29:09,000 --> 05:29:10,000
we need to alert.

5557
05:29:10,000 --> 05:29:12,000
and by the way, I applaud ms.

5558
05:29:12,000 --> 05:29:13,000
gannon.

5559
05:29:13,000 --> 05:29:16,000
I believe that she has been posting this on social media.

5560
05:29:17,000 --> 05:29:22,000
but this is a concern in our area, and I think we need to try to send information.

5561
05:29:22,000 --> 05:29:23,000
the information out.

5562
05:29:23,000 --> 05:29:25,000
there is a video, a four-minute video.

5563
05:29:26,000 --> 05:29:31,000
I don't know if we want to even look at the video, but the consequences are dire,

5564
05:29:31,000 --> 05:29:34,521
and I think we need to alert the public
of the signs and symptoms that they could

5565
05:29:34,521 --> 05:29:36,000
have that could
change their life.

5566
05:29:38,000 --> 05:29:41,000
but I just, I mean, and with lack of time,

5567
05:29:41,000 --> 05:29:46,281
I don't know if anyone thinks maybe what
we should do is post it online, the video,

5568
05:29:46,281 --> 05:29:48,000
or if you'd like to see it.

5569
05:29:50,000 --> 05:29:53,000
it's up to you, whatever you would like.

5570
05:29:53,000 --> 05:29:57,000
if you'd like to see the four-minute video, we can play it, but...

5571
05:29:57,000 --> 05:30:02,000
you know, what I would suggest is it might be better to do it at the next meeting,

5572
05:30:03,000 --> 05:30:07,000
and you might even have some people out there who could actually see it, just not...

5573
05:30:07,000 --> 05:30:10,000
so maybe post it online, or we can post it in the beginning of the meeting.

5574
05:30:10,000 --> 05:30:12,000
yeah, or something like that.

5575
05:30:12,000 --> 05:30:12,000
okay, fair enough.

5576
05:30:12,000 --> 05:30:15,000
I think the idea of getting that kind of thing out to the public is...

5577
05:30:16,000 --> 05:30:24,076
important oh yes a few a couple days
is life is life-altering my my husband's

5578
05:30:24,076 --> 05:30:31,000
sister-in-law died of meningitis
just recently within very quickly

5579
05:30:32,000 --> 05:30:40,282
and that stuff comes and you have very
little warning and you're gone okay, and so

5580
05:30:40,282 --> 05:30:42,000
you're counseling

5581
05:30:43,000 --> 05:30:45,000
yeah, just a quick question.

5582
05:30:45,000 --> 05:30:47,000
I see you have some tables there.

5583
05:30:48,000 --> 05:30:51,000
what is the mosquito increase in laguna health?

5584
05:30:51,000 --> 05:30:52,000
are we on there?

5585
05:30:54,000 --> 05:31:00,000
thankfully, we are not, but the neighboring cities are seeing the increased activity.

5586
05:31:01,000 --> 05:31:03,000
like mission, lake forest?

5587
05:31:04,000 --> 05:31:10,284
abrea, coasta mesa, cypress, fountain
valley, fullerton, garden grove, huntington

5588
05:31:10,284 --> 05:31:13,000
beach, irvine, las
amidas, lajabra.

5589
05:31:14,000 --> 05:31:21,010
lagoon, newport beach, orange, placentia,
santa ana, seal beach, stanton, villa park,

5590
05:31:21,010 --> 05:31:22,000
westminster.

5591
05:31:23,000 --> 05:31:23,000
okay.

5592
05:31:23,000 --> 05:31:25,000
I'm hearing all those are farther north.

5593
05:31:25,000 --> 05:31:26,000
nothing that close.

5594
05:31:27,000 --> 05:31:29,000
just an incidental anecdote of my wife's.

5595
05:31:29,000 --> 05:31:32,266
been getting a lot of mosquito bites and
just never happened before and over last

5596
05:31:32,266 --> 05:31:34,000
year was like a little
this year it's a lot

5597
05:31:35,000 --> 05:31:40,448
yeah I think we've got us I think we've
got a serious problem it's huge okay my

5598
05:31:40,448 --> 05:31:43,000
report make it real
quick uh the oaac

5599
05:31:43,000 --> 05:31:48,906
uh they had a nice presentation it's uh
basically how to how to conduct your affairs

5600
05:31:48,906 --> 05:31:52,000
as talking about you
know powers of attorney

5601
05:31:52,000 --> 05:31:56,000
when you for your estate, having trusts.

5602
05:31:56,000 --> 05:31:58,000
very, very good information.

5603
05:31:58,000 --> 05:32:02,000
it's mainly meant for seniors of the audience, but it's good for everybody.

5604
05:32:04,000 --> 05:32:07,000
one other comment.

5605
05:32:07,000 --> 05:32:11,000
the membership there is like 35 delegates or 35 commissioners.

5606
05:32:12,000 --> 05:32:13,000
that's a big meeting.

5607
05:32:14,000 --> 05:32:16,000
I was the chairman of the goals committee.

5608
05:32:16,000 --> 05:32:22,000
they accepted all my goals, and I also chaired the metrics to meet those goals.

5609
05:32:22,000 --> 05:32:26,553
and I supplied them a table for our first
metric meeting, and the executive committee

5610
05:32:26,553 --> 05:32:28,000
is looking at it right now.

5611
05:32:29,000 --> 05:32:35,323
so we're moving along and trying to get
things done for the older adults, which now

5612
05:32:35,323 --> 05:32:37,000
number over a million.

5613
05:32:38,000 --> 05:32:39,000
oh, we have one additional thing.

5614
05:32:40,000 --> 05:32:46,000
the lawyers did give me permission to supply them with data, so I can now

5615
05:32:46,000 --> 05:32:50,000
legally supply them with data addresses and
things of these seniors in orange county

5616
05:32:50,000 --> 05:32:52,000
so that we can access
them and try to help

5617
05:32:52,000 --> 05:32:55,000
them that was a big guess and a million.

5618
05:32:55,000 --> 05:33:01,000
I'm assuming is somewhere between 25 and 33 percent of the whole county population.

5619
05:33:02,000 --> 05:33:02,000
no.

5620
05:33:02,000 --> 05:33:03,000
oh, you mean the seniors?

5621
05:33:04,000 --> 05:33:06,000
the population county is what I

5622
05:33:13,000 --> 05:33:18,439
I don't even know I don't know significant
and the and I can't like I thought so much

5623
05:33:18,439 --> 05:33:21,000
accessibility I have
addresses for every

5624
05:33:21,000 --> 05:33:25,612
single one of them phone for 30 percent and
an email all right that leaves us to city

5625
05:33:25,612 --> 05:33:28,000
council member comments
any comments tonight

5626
05:33:28,000 --> 05:33:42,000
I oh, just one comment.

5627
05:33:43,000 --> 05:33:53,898
we as a council received a letter from a
cynthia mcmullen who mentions that nellie

5628
05:33:53,898 --> 05:34:04,000
hill ranch homeowners association
without permission had announced that they

5629
05:34:04,000 --> 05:34:09,000
were going to fly drones all over the hoa without permission

5630
05:34:10,000 --> 05:34:17,327
and I'm just wondering if our city manager
responded, if this is something we need to

5631
05:34:17,327 --> 05:34:20,000
have a discussion with council.

5632
05:34:21,000 --> 05:34:25,000
so I just wanted to know if there was a response to her email.

5633
05:34:29,000 --> 05:34:31,000
yeah, absolutely.

5634
05:34:32,000 --> 05:34:33,000
I'll hand it to you.

5635
05:34:33,000 --> 05:34:34,000
thank you.

5636
05:34:38,000 --> 05:34:38,000
josh.

5637
05:34:39,000 --> 05:34:39,000
thank you, mayor.

5638
05:34:41,000 --> 05:34:45,846
since it's getting late, I would like to
demonstrate the curfew policy I previously

5639
05:34:45,846 --> 05:34:49,000
brought forward and say
that it might be good to bring

5640
05:34:49,000 --> 05:34:49,000
that back.

5641
05:34:49,000 --> 05:34:52,738
but anyways, first I want to thank captain
burke for sticking it out and the orange

5642
05:34:52,738 --> 05:34:54,000
county sheriff's department.

5643
05:34:55,000 --> 05:34:58,000
I also want to thank the orange county fire authority.

5644
05:34:58,000 --> 05:35:02,178
public safety remains our highest
responsibility, and I deeply appreciate the

5645
05:35:02,178 --> 05:35:05,000
deputies, the firefighters,
paramedics, dispatchers,

5646
05:35:05,000 --> 05:35:08,000
and professional staff who protect lugana hills every day.

5647
05:35:09,000 --> 05:35:12,000
I also want to clarify several statements that were made tonight.

5648
05:35:13,000 --> 05:35:18,500
the city attorney's client is the city
as an organization, acting through its

5649
05:35:18,500 --> 05:35:20,000
authorized officials.

5650
05:35:21,000 --> 05:35:24,776
the fact that every council member did
not receive a separate private consultation

5651
05:35:24,776 --> 05:35:28,000
does not establish that our city
attorney failed to represent the city

5652
05:35:28,000 --> 05:35:31,989
or properly review the agreement,
and I fully support our city attorney and

5653
05:35:31,989 --> 05:35:33,000
professional staff.

5654
05:35:34,000 --> 05:35:38,375
I also reject the suggestion that this
council is disregarding police or fire

5655
05:35:38,375 --> 05:35:39,000
protection.

5656
05:35:39,000 --> 05:35:45,056
development can create additional service
demands, but it also creates assessed value,

5657
05:35:45,056 --> 05:35:49,000
property tax revenue, including
revenue supporting ocfa,

5658
05:35:50,000 --> 05:35:54,299
development fees infrastructure and
other municipal revenue and as chair of the

5659
05:35:54,299 --> 05:35:58,000
orange county fire authority I'm
aware of no ocf a finding presented

5660
05:35:59,000 --> 05:36:04,384
in this record concluding that this project
will diminish fire protection the city's

5661
05:36:04,384 --> 05:36:09,000
fiscal analysis projects more than
3.8 million in annual revenue at full

5662
05:36:09,000 --> 05:36:10,383
build-out approximately

5663
05:36:10,383 --> 05:36:15,375
1.5 3 million in additional municipal
service costs and estimated annual surplus of

5664
05:36:15,375 --> 05:36:17,000
approximately 2.2 6 million

5665
05:36:19,000 --> 05:36:23,808
those are projections, not guarantees,
but they do not support claims that the

5666
05:36:23,808 --> 05:36:28,000
project provides no financial
benefit or the city will inevitably be

5667
05:36:28,000 --> 05:36:30,000
bankrupt in seven years.

5668
05:36:30,000 --> 05:36:35,000
finally, the potential octa impact on hotel 1 was not ignored.

5669
05:36:36,000 --> 05:36:40,421
section 12.4 expressly anticipates possible
relocation and preserves the developer's

5670
05:36:40,421 --> 05:36:42,000
obligation to build the hotel.

5671
05:36:43,000 --> 05:36:44,000
we may disagree, but

5672
05:36:45,000 --> 05:36:49,517
serious claims about our legal counsel
public safety and the city's solvency should

5673
05:36:49,517 --> 05:36:53,000
be supported by evidence and I
will continue supporting our city

5674
05:36:53,000 --> 05:36:59,328
attorney our staff ocsd ocfa and decisions
grounded in the written record leadership

5675
05:36:59,328 --> 05:37:04,000
is not measured by how long we
debate a problem but by whether

5676
05:37:04,000 --> 05:37:09,727
residents can fill the solution and with
that before today becomes tomorrow and with

5677
05:37:09,727 --> 05:37:10,000
that

5678
05:37:15,000 --> 05:37:21,213
I'm going to adjourn this meeting at
11:41, and our next regular meeting will be

5679
05:37:21,213 --> 05:37:23,000
september 8th at 6 p.m.