1 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:55,880 Good morning, everyone. Welcome to Committee of the Whole for June. 2 00:01:53,280 --> 00:02:01,000 I'd like to ask any member to declare a pecuniary interest now or where it may 3 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:04,440 arise anytime during the meeting. Councilor Lusby, please. 4 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:10,679 » Thank you, Warden Merritt. I'd like to declare conflict of interest on 4A AEMS 5 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:15,840 Master Plan and the closed meeting A B E M S Master 6 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:19,840 Plan. And I've completed the necessary paperwork. Thank you. 7 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:19,840 » Okay. Thank you. 8 00:02:19,920 --> 00:02:26,040 Seeing no others. Item number three, infrastructure and 9 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:29,800 development management services division. 10 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:33,560 We have two information reports to consider this morning unless there's 11 00:02:31,959 --> 00:02:37,959 questions. I'll look for a motion to receive and file. Councilor Miller 12 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:43,240 moves, Councilor Kay seconds. All in favor. A question by Councilor Atkinson. 13 00:02:40,920 --> 00:02:45,959 » Thank you, Warden. Relating to item three 14 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:51,560 B number A of B, the feasibility report 15 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:56,000 study. I was just wondering down the road, are other municipalities going to 16 00:02:53,600 --> 00:03:00,519 be allowed to be considered taking part of this once it's uh 17 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:05,760 the report comes back? >> Okay, I'll ask Mr. Cole to respond, 18 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:05,760 please. 19 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:16,880 » Thank you through you, Mr. Warden. I I think that's in the under the reports 20 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:20,360 requiring a motion, the fire um 21 00:03:17,959 --> 00:03:26,320 uh the fire services report. Uh correct. Right. Thank you. Um and I 22 00:03:23,880 --> 00:03:30,840 the the goal out of this is is to uh look and to whether or not we 23 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:34,760 council wishes us to proceed in considering options. So, if that's an 24 00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:38,560 option that um uh is of concern whether or not other 25 00:03:36,800 --> 00:03:43,519 municipalities could participate in the future, we could include that in the 26 00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:43,519 reporting back to council. 27 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:53,400 » Motion to receive and file the two information reports. All in favor. 28 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:57,360 Opposed, that's carried. And 3B reports requiring a motion. The first one 29 00:03:55,960 --> 00:04:02,720 is a report regarding the fire prevention feasibility review. 30 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:07,240 Look for a motion to approve the two recommendations. Councillor Ferguson and 31 00:04:04,840 --> 00:04:10,720 Councillor Bushy. All in favor? 32 00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:15,240 That's carried. And 3BB 33 00:04:12,920 --> 00:04:17,920 report regarding Sarnia organic waste collection. 34 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:25,600 Councillor White moves the recommendation. Councillor 35 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:31,480 Sageman seconds. All in favor? 36 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:31,480 Opposed if any? That's carried. 37 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:39,040 Item number four, public health services division and the EMS department. We have 38 00:04:37,560 --> 00:04:45,919 uh one information report regarding the 39 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:48,800 Lambton EMS master plan update. I'll look for a motion If there's no 40 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:52,919 discussion, I'll look for a motion to receive and file. Councillor White 41 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:56,240 and Councillor Ferguson. You have a question, Councillor Ferguson. 42 00:04:56,280 --> 00:05:01,840 » Yes, thank you, Warden. Looking through there, there was talk at the time of 43 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:06,600 putting a station in the Westbrook area, Inwood. Is that still 44 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:10,280 in the books somewhere? >> Okay, Mr. Churchill, please. 45 00:05:11,400 --> 00:05:16,360 » Thank you for the question through you, Warden. Um 46 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:20,880 our Chief Stephen Turner is here, so I'll ask him to respond to that 47 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:24,240 question. Thank you. >> Good morning, and through you, Mr. 48 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:29,720 Warden. Um so, in master plan, the master plan identified that the last 49 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:34,680 stage of uh fleet movements and and allocations would be to take a look at 50 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:38,880 the Thedford or Thedford decoupling, placing 12 hours of service from 51 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:43,240 Thedford in Forest, and the other 12 hours we would take a peek at where the 52 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:47,080 best and most appropriate seating was for the that location. One of the three 53 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:52,120 options that was identified in the master plan was one putting in Sarnia as 54 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:56,840 a day car. The second creating a 24-hour vehicle in Sarnia if 55 00:05:54,800 --> 00:06:01,960 the need was required overnight and the third was taking a look at the Ennwood 56 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:06,400 Alvinston area as a possibility. So those three 57 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:09,840 are the last stage options of the of the master plan and at that point we 58 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:13,960 would take a look at where the need was greatest and place those 12 hours of 59 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:18,520 service at that point. >> Okay and counselor White. 60 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:22,720 » Uh thank you Ward Marriott. Just want to have a comment really to 61 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:27,360 Mr. Turner and and and and Mr. Churchill and and the whole team. 62 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:31,919 This is a master class on how to implement a 63 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:38,120 master plan. The progress made in this very very very detailed and logistically 64 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:41,640 complicated EMS master plan is incredible and the progress with which 65 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:45,000 you're moving forward is absolutely commendable. So I just want to say you 66 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:48,480 know thank you for the incredible work that you're doing and 67 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:52,919 and it really should be recognized as something to to be very proud of for 68 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:58,600 everyone here at the county. Thank >> Thank you counselor White and thank you 69 00:06:55,280 --> 00:07:02,200 Mr. Turner and Mr. Churchill. Question by counselor McRoberts. 70 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:10,120 » Thank you through the chair. I'm just curious on page two of the summary of 71 00:07:07,280 --> 00:07:14,680 the progress number eight reduce unnecessary code eight standbys. Can you 72 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:20,440 please tell us what that was why it existed in the first place and then what 73 00:07:16,919 --> 00:07:20,440 deemed it to be unnecessary? 74 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:28,640 » Certainly through you Mr. Chair. The code eight standbys are a movement 75 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:31,640 of fleet whenever we have a 911 call and we have to move one of our ambulances 76 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:36,240 and and respond to an emergency. What that 77 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:41,520 does is it leaves a gap in the coverage and kind of the mesh of the network 78 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:45,920 and I I like to Uh, liken it to basketball uh, which just happens to be 79 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:49,640 very timely right now. Uh, instead of man-on-man, it's floating 80 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:54,080 zone. So, when we move one ambulance, we have to move another ambulance to cover 81 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:57,640 the gap that's left. Uh, when we took a look at the the outset of 82 00:07:55,880 --> 00:08:02,000 the master plan, we identified that a lot of that fleet movement was 83 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:06,920 unnecessary and often was detrimental. So, we moved a vehicle, uh, I'll give 84 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:10,760 you an example, um, from Brea to to uh, to Corona. Uh, so, when the Corona 85 00:08:08,880 --> 00:08:14,240 station went out on a call, we would move the vehicle from Brea to over to 86 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:18,480 Corona because Brea has a lower call volume. What that left was a gap in the 87 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:22,480 south end of our county, uh, and the 88 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:27,520 uh, the split 50% of the time the call would actually be back in Brea. 89 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:31,400 Uh, rather than in the Corona area and made a big run to get back to the call 90 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:35,880 that was there. So, we took a really deep analytic view of that and took a 91 00:08:33,919 --> 00:08:39,840 and identified that we could lessen the number of standbys that we did, which 92 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:44,400 was also a fairly significant component of the workload of our crews. Uh, it 93 00:08:42,080 --> 00:08:48,040 also uh, on top of that, uh, added to wear and tear on our fleet and 94 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:52,080 significant fuel usage. Uh, as a result, we've actually found 95 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:58,120 that we've been able to reduce a code eight standbys by about 50%, uh, save 96 00:08:55,240 --> 00:09:03,200 about $80,000 in fuel, a significant reduction in uh, task times on our 97 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:06,640 crews, uh, and have not have had a negative effect uh, on our response 98 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:10,920 times. We've continued to meet our response time performance plan. 99 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:14,440 » Perfect. Thank you. Any other questions? 100 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:19,120 Seeing none, um, 101 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:26,360 call of the We We have a motion on the floor. Okay. All in favor of the save 102 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:31,520 and file, opposed if any. That's carried. Thank you. 103 00:09:28,040 --> 00:09:31,520 Any other business for 104 00:09:31,680 --> 00:09:38,560 Public Health Services and EMS this morning? 105 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:41,920 » Mr. Warden, if if I may, uh, I'd just like to introduce Carol Moore. 106 00:09:40,400 --> 00:09:47,040 Identified in the master plan was our reorganization. Carol Moore has joined 107 00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:51,200 us as our new deputy chief of community programs and system quality. She started 108 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:56,600 a couple weeks ago and we're very fortunate to have her on board. 109 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:56,600 » Great. Welcome, Ms. Moore. 110 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:07,080 Okay, moving on to number five, cultural services division. We have 111 00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:17,440 First report is regarding the revised circulation policy. Look for a motion to 112 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:22,120 approve the recommendation. Councilor Sageman. 113 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:25,400 Seconded by Councilor Atkinson. Discussion. 114 00:10:23,560 --> 00:10:29,680 All in favor. Opposed if any, that's carried. 115 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:35,280 5AB, report regarding the Bright's Grove 116 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:40,360 Library expansion project. Look for a motion on the four 117 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:40,360 recommendations. 118 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:47,920 Councilor White. Moves. Seconded by 119 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:47,920 Councilor Atkinson. 120 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:55,600 Question by Councilor White. >> Uh thank you. Um 121 00:10:52,200 --> 00:11:01,440 I I know it's not clear yet when the work is to begin, but um 122 00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:06,880 is there a plan on notifying notifying the public uh of the impending closure? 123 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:09,160 Temporary closure of the Bright's Grove Library. 124 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:13,040 And what would that plan look like? Thanks. 125 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:15,640 » Mr. Meyer, please. >> Uh through you, Warden, and thank you 126 00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:19,920 for the question. Um certainly the city staff are still 127 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:24,400 confirming the timeline with the contractor that was just engaged. 128 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:28,320 Uh there is it is anticipated that perhaps this summer 129 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:32,560 work will commence. Once we've got that date confirmed with their contractor, um 130 00:11:30,920 --> 00:11:36,040 we'll be reaching out to our card holders 131 00:11:33,680 --> 00:11:38,480 as well as promoting the availability of the other sites as outlined in the 132 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:41,920 report. So yeah, we're working with city staff 133 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:45,560 to develop a communications plan regarding the service disruption. 134 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:49,440 » Follow up, Councillor White. >> Thank you and obviously that's going to 135 00:11:48,280 --> 00:11:54,160 also mean the gallery in the Grove is is 136 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:59,080 included in that. Is there a temporary plan for relocation of that of any 137 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:05,000 potential showings and the work that they do or 138 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:07,680 will it just be on hiatus for a year plus? 139 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:11,600 » Mr. Mayor, please. >> Through you, Warden. 140 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:15,040 Similar to our approach, the gallery is planning to close for the duration of 141 00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:18,880 construction just given the the limited access and the work at the site. 142 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:22,640 However, we as cultural services division will be working with the 143 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:25,800 gallery to determine if we can accommodate some of 144 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:29,680 their programs, their exhibitions at other county sites. 145 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:33,160 Looking to partner with the JNAAG, perhaps certain library 146 00:12:31,680 --> 00:12:36,560 to ensure that some of their the programming can continue. 147 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:44,560 » Okay, call the question on the motion on the floor. All in favor? 148 00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:50,200 Opposed if any, that's carried. 5 AC report regarding museums, gallery 149 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:54,480 and archives collection management up to April 2026. 150 00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:59,400 There's no Councillor Case moves recommendation. Councillor Loosley 151 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:03,480 seconds. All in favor? That's carried. 152 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:06,680 Is there any other business for cultural services this morning? 153 00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:11,280 Seeing none, move on to six long-term care. 154 00:13:11,249 --> 00:13:17,000 » [clears throat] >> We have one information report to 155 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:17,000 receive and file. 156 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:22,760 For a motion for that, Councillor Hand and Councillor 157 00:13:23,839 --> 00:13:30,000 Let's see, Cook. Sorry. And you have a question, Councillor 158 00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:34,040 Cook? No, okay. So, motion on the floor. All 159 00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:38,360 in favor? Opposed, if any. That's carried. 160 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:43,520 Any other Any other business 161 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:43,520 for long-term care? 162 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:49,320 Okay. Moving on to number seven, Corporate 163 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:54,360 Services Division. We have one information report here to 164 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:59,000 receive and file. Councillor Miller. 165 00:13:56,560 --> 00:14:04,760 Seconded by Councillor Atkinson. 166 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:04,760 Question by Councillor Ferguson. 167 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:10,480 » Most of this is supposed to be self-funded through the fines, etc., but 168 00:14:07,880 --> 00:14:14,880 it appears not going that way anymore. Any comments from staff 169 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:17,400 for the future to look for If we got to fund this from the county general 170 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:20,880 reserves, and if the staff's going to negative number, what really happens? 171 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:25,640 » Ms. Leger, please. 172 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:30,680 » Yeah, thank you for the question, Councillor Ferguson, through the Warden. 173 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:34,440 So, uh what has been happening? So, over the 174 00:14:32,760 --> 00:14:39,280 There's another report in the package today that provides a a holistic view of 175 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:44,200 the POA program and what's been happening over the last 18 years, I 176 00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:48,200 would say. So, in 12 of those years, the uh department has essentially been 177 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:52,720 operating at a loss. So, the fine revenue has been insufficient, like you 178 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:57,240 said, to cover the operating costs of the POA program. 179 00:14:54,839 --> 00:15:03,920 In those instances, it's been funded either uh partially by reserves or 180 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:03,920 through the general tax levy. 181 00:15:05,760 --> 00:15:14,360 » Any other questions before I call the question? Uh Councillor White. 182 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:18,160 » My uh question's similar in nature, um and uh 183 00:15:15,839 --> 00:15:22,640 really it just comes down to, you know, this is a mandated service. I get that, 184 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:26,720 but uh is there ever a discussion with the province about kicking in? I mean, 185 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:29,440 this is the Provincial Offences Act. 186 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:33,400 Uh, are they ever, 187 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:37,600 you know, at the table in discussions with picking up the, uh, 188 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:40,680 the, uh, the tab? >> Ms. Leger, please. 189 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:50,360 » Yes, thank you, Councillor White. So, uh, from the department's perspective, 190 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:53,120 we've taken an approach in that, uh, the goals and objectives of the department, 191 00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:57,520 uh, looks to aim to address these 192 00:15:55,080 --> 00:16:02,120 challenges, the, particularly the budgetary pressures experienced by the 193 00:15:59,880 --> 00:16:07,000 department. So, we're looking internally as well as externally. So, we've really 194 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:11,200 prioritized advocacy efforts, uh, as it relates to our POA program, uh, 195 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:16,920 particularly the rising court security costs, and the province provides, uh, 196 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:22,640 grant funding that partially offsets those costs. So, advocacy efforts to, 197 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:26,960 uh, work with the province in reviewing those grant funding so that, uh, 198 00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:31,560 currently it partially offsets by about 40%. Perhaps there could be a review 199 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:35,640 that the grant funding, uh, provides more. 200 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:39,600 And then also advocacy efforts around the set fine structure and court 201 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:45,000 administration fees. So, those efforts are underway, uh, both through the 202 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:49,560 regular county channels, but also in partnership with other municipalities 203 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:55,960 throughout the province. This isn't only a land and, uh, POA court problem. This 204 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:59,760 is a challenge faced by many, many POA program programs throughout the 205 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:03,880 province. So, we partner with municipalities through our Municipal 206 00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:06,640 Court Managers Association, as well as through AMO. 207 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:12,600 » Any other questions or comments before I call the question? 208 00:17:11,079 --> 00:17:17,600 Motion on the floor, receive and file. All in favor? 209 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:21,439 That's carried. Thank you. 7B, 210 00:17:19,360 --> 00:17:26,360 a review regarding the policing grant 211 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:31,160 consultation discussion or motion to approve the recommendation. 212 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:36,240 Councilor Case. Okay, and do we have a seconder? 213 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:40,080 Uh Councilor Atkinson, go ahead Councilor Case, please. 214 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:44,720 » So, I'm curious. I know that consultation was to take place with the 215 00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:47,440 lower tier municipalities. I didn't really notice anything and I 216 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:51,600 apologize if it's in here and I didn't see it on what the opinion of the lower 217 00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:55,280 tier municipalities on this. I know Warwick did have an opinion on this 218 00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:59,680 and it was to continue with the grant process. I understand the rationale why 219 00:17:57,320 --> 00:18:03,760 staff is asking us not to. But, I guess my question is 220 00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:07,000 did every municipality weigh in on this? I'd be interested to know what the 221 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:13,000 results of that their opinion were on that particular issue. Thank you. 222 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:13,000 » Okay, thank you. Ms. Leger, please. 223 00:18:14,840 --> 00:18:20,760 » Yes, thank you. Through the Warden. So, uh the consultation process started the 224 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:24,280 beginning of May um and all staff from member 225 00:18:22,800 --> 00:18:29,480 municipalities were invited to participate as part of that process. Uh 226 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:34,360 there were eight staff members through uh the member municipalities that uh 227 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:37,280 joined the participation, six of which voiced their preference. 228 00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:43,160 Uh all being in favor of eliminating the 229 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:47,240 policing grant. And well, some said either option. So, 230 00:18:45,120 --> 00:18:52,240 uh I'll back it up a uh little bit. We had prepared uh in preparation for the 231 00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:56,720 consultation, we had suggested, knowing the budgetary pressures of the POA 232 00:18:54,280 --> 00:19:01,880 program, we had suggested a gradual phase out of the policing grant wherein 233 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:07,560 it would continue for 2027, but then thereafter it would reduce by 100,000. 234 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:12,000 So, by 2033 the policing grant would be eliminated. Uh so, that was what was on 235 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:16,480 the table uh in terms of the consultation process, but after going 236 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:20,880 through the background information and explaining the position of the POA 237 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:25,600 program, staff from member municipalities had voiced that they were 238 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:31,040 in favor of eliminating the POA grant effective 2027. While some had said were 239 00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:35,440 were comfortable with either option, either 240 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:41,640 gradually phasing it out or eliminating it effective 2027. Uh there was no 241 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:46,720 member municipality that had said they wanted the grant to continue 242 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:46,720 indefinitely though. 243 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:50,560 » Councillor Loosley. 244 00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:56,720 Thank you, Warden Merritt, and I do understand there were discussions. Um I 245 00:19:54,920 --> 00:20:01,040 have a concern cuz I still think policing costs that are going up. An 246 00:19:58,360 --> 00:20:05,560 example, this year 11%. Petroleum received $17,000. 247 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:10,320 I cannot support cutting that out. I think we need to continue to keep that 248 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:15,680 going. And I will not support this. Thank you. 249 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:18,880 Councillor Ferguson. May I like to ask her how much of the 250 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:23,000 money is money we would pay into the county and then get it back, money in, 251 00:20:20,360 --> 00:20:23,000 money out? 252 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:30,880 Yeah, not sure. Ms. Lejeune, you want to tackle that one? 253 00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:35,280 In in terms of the levy or can I ask clarification in terms of the levy? Is 254 00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:39,760 that what you're referring to? So a grant coming back 255 00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:44,480 from the county. How much has we paid into that to start with? 256 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:48,720 Is it just money that we pay in that that is coming back to us? 257 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:53,280 And we eliminate it because it's really in the end of the day it's 258 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:56,360 it's a zero in our books. Ms. Lejeune, please. 259 00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:03,600 Yeah, so that was uh at least as I understood it, that was 260 00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:08,480 one of the um alarming pieces from the staff of the member municipalities in 261 00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:15,200 that when we provide the policing grant out to member municipalities, 262 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:19,520 but if we're budgeting a deficit for the department, then we're essentially 263 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:24,600 redistributing the funds back to the county through the general tax levy 264 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:28,360 process. So, it's like you had said, 265 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:32,880 somewhat of a wash or an exercise rather. 266 00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:37,040 » Councilor Case. >> So, we also had those discussions as I 267 00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:42,680 referenced earlier. And the our discussions were not to to 268 00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:47,480 continue on with the grant, actually to continue on with the grant. So, I don't 269 00:21:44,960 --> 00:21:51,000 know where the communication went wrong from our standpoint because we were very 270 00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:54,720 much on the record saying that we wanted this grant to continue. We look at it as 271 00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:58,520 we're paying in and we're getting out. That's the same for everybody to a 272 00:21:56,560 --> 00:22:02,080 certain point. So, anyways, I'm not going to support the recommendation of 273 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:04,480 staff on this one. I do understand with all due respect why they're trying to 274 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:07,320 find the money. By the same time, I think we should 275 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:11,640 continue on with this grant as well as Mayor Lusby has said. I agree with that. 276 00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:16,960 » Thank you, Councilor Case. Any other questions, comments before I call 277 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:16,960 Councilor Bradley. 278 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:21,800 » Yes, Mr. Warden and County Council. The city doesn't have any involvement in 279 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:24,640 this obviously with their own police service. 280 00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:28,240 Would it be wise to table this for a year and continue the program into next 281 00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:32,280 year and allow the new council to deal with 282 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:35,480 what they are facing on a number of financial fronts? 283 00:22:34,120 --> 00:22:40,400 And if there is support for doing that, I would move to table it with the grant 284 00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:44,520 continuing at least through 2027. >> Okay, is there a seconder for that 285 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:48,760 motion to table? Councilor White seconds. 286 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:51,640 Councilor Hand, do you have a comment or you're seconding it? 287 00:22:54,120 --> 00:22:58,720 » I was just putting my hand up to second it. Thank you. 288 00:22:56,520 --> 00:23:02,920 » Okay, so I'll call the question on tabling. All in favor to table? 289 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:07,440 Opposed? 290 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:14,600 I declare that uh the motion is defeated. 291 00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:17,640 » I I'm sorry, it's a bit late, but can I 292 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:21,400 ask for a recorded vote? >> Okay. 293 00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:23,400 Oh, it's committee of the whole, yes. Sorry. 294 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:26,440 » Okay. All right. So, we'll save that for the next 295 00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:30,600 meeting. >> Okay, Counselor Case. 296 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:34,960 » I will make the motion that we continue with the funding in the grant process as 297 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:37,240 we have for many years. I'll make that motion that we continue on with the 298 00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:41,240 grant process. >> Okay. Do we have a seconder by Counselor 299 00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:46,080 Loosely seconds. Uh we had one motion on the floor though 300 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:46,080 already. 301 00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:48,640 So 302 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,720 Yeah, we did. Yeah, two. 303 00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:59,000 Yeah, that was your your motion, Counselor Case, so if you want to 304 00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:02,120 withdraw the first one. >> I made the motion that we put it on the 305 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:04,200 floor for this session. I will withdraw that motion. 306 00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:09,840 » Okay. And now you're making a motion to 307 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:09,840 keep it. 308 00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:13,680 Any discussion? 309 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:20,560 So, call the question. All in favor of the motion. 310 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:20,560 Opposed, if any. 311 00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:23,800 The motion carries. 312 00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:38,840 Okay, 7 BB regarding report regarding the municipal election restricted acts. 313 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:43,640 Look for a motion to uh approve the recommendation on this. 314 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:46,800 Counselor Ferguson. Counselor Loosely. 315 00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:50,600 Seconds. Any discussion? 316 00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:55,040 All in favor. Opposed, if any. That's carried. 317 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:59,000 Any other business for corporate services division this morning. 318 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:06,400 Seeing none, moving on to number eight, find finance facilities and 319 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:11,400 acquisitions. We have no agenda items. So, look for open it up for other 320 00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:11,400 business. 321 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:18,440 Seeing none, moving on to number nine, Social Services Division. 322 00:25:17,652 --> 00:25:22,560 » [clears throat] >> One report regarding the child care 323 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:27,800 facility development update. Look for a motion to receive and 324 00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:27,800 file this. 325 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:35,360 Councillor Bushy. Seconded by Councillor Atkinson. 326 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:38,080 All in favor. That's carried. 327 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:47,720 And nine 328 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:51,600 AB, information report regarding the affordable housing update. 329 00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:57,280 I guess this we could have included that with 330 00:25:55,480 --> 00:26:00,280 uh Councillor McRoberts, please. 331 00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:07,760 » Thank you, through the chair. I do have a question that uh came up in Sarnia 332 00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:13,000 Council. Can we please get a definition 333 00:26:10,360 --> 00:26:16,000 of affordable housing, also a definition for supportive 334 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:22,000 housing, and if we could, is the George Street 335 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:27,200 build going to be within dwell, going to be supportive housing or affordable 336 00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,200 housing? Thank you. 337 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:34,480 » Ms. Fitzpatrick, would you be able to address that, please? 338 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:37,480 » Thank you for the question and through you, Warden. So, as far as the 339 00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:42,360 definitions, affordable housing, we can consider 340 00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:46,600 affordable or deeply affordable or rent geared to income. So, with affordable 341 00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:51,800 housing, it's considered 80% of the average market rent as set by CMHC. 342 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:55,920 Deeply affordable is rent geared to income. so it's assessed based on the 343 00:26:53,440 --> 00:27:00,280 individual's income. Supportive housing is generally rent 344 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:04,000 geared to income with intensive supports. 345 00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:08,840 So, it's it's not only the financial supplement that makes the um 346 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:13,520 housing sustainable, it's also the case management supports that allows the 347 00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:17,240 person to remain successfully housed. In terms of the George Street project, it 348 00:27:15,320 --> 00:27:22,480 is the intention that it will be supportive housing with uh deeply 349 00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:22,480 affordable rents. 350 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:33,000 » Any other uh Counselor White? >> Again, just two things uh I'd like to 351 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:36,440 highlight in this report because and we know that the negative likes to 352 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:41,280 stick uh in the public narrative, but here we 353 00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:45,440 are with two uh very good good news stories here, both with the uh 354 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:47,920 the uh Aboriginal housing 355 00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:52,440 uh operation that uh that is open 356 00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:56,360 on Confederation Street along with the 10 uh rent supplements that the county 357 00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:59,640 is providing to make some of those affordable units even more deeply 358 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:03,680 affordable for those uh who otherwise wouldn't be able to 359 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:08,960 handle that uh in their budgets. And of course, the on time uh and on budget uh 360 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:12,800 construction at Kathleen Avenue is a very good news story 361 00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:16,200 uh as we're expecting that to be online later this year. 362 00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:21,640 Uh again, I just want to highlight the the positive here. Great great work 363 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:26,520 to staff um and uh and thank you for your ongoing commitment to making sure 364 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:30,160 that these priorities are met. >> Thank you. 365 00:28:28,360 --> 00:28:33,160 Look for a motion to receive and file this report. 366 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:41,400 Counselor Sageman, Counselor Ferguson, all in favor. 367 00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:41,400 Let's carry. Thank you. 368 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:48,920 And 9B, report regarding closure of emergency 369 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:53,120 overflow shelter and expansion at Inn of the Good Shepherd. 370 00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:57,120 There is uh There is four recommendations 371 00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:59,720 here. Councillor Bradley 372 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:03,520 moves. >> Yeah. Well, I wouldn't move it forward, 373 00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:08,080 but the one one that's missing ingredient, I'll ask 374 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:12,000 this question to staff, is that there's um 375 00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:15,000 no public engagement. Are you going to uh have what you did 376 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:19,200 elsewhere uh on George and elsewhere, this type of 377 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:23,880 open house where these people can come in and deal with the facts and not what 378 00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:28,000 they're hearing through other sources? Is that part of the plan cuz it's not in 379 00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:31,760 the uh report or the recommendations? >> Okay, I'll look for a seconder first. 380 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:37,560 Councillor White seconds. Um and I'd ask uh Ms. Fitzpatrick to 381 00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:37,560 respond, please. 382 00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:45,000 » Through you, Warden, to Councillor Bradley. So, with the expansion of the 383 00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:48,240 Good Shepherd's Lodge as proposed, I mean, public input is certainly 384 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:52,920 important in many planning decisions. However, with an expansion, the zoning 385 00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:57,520 is already in place, and as part of municipal municipal planning, municipal 386 00:29:54,920 --> 00:30:00,720 consultation is not a requirement. So, in the essence of time and moving 387 00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:05,360 this project forward in a timely fashion, we wanted to get it in front of 388 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:09,600 council as soon as possible, which uh the details are in the report today. 389 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:15,360 Certainly, as we proceed through this project with pre-development um 390 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:19,240 minor variances, we could engage with the public to inform them of the plan, 391 00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:23,160 but in the interest of time and moving the project forward and ensuring a 392 00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:27,040 timely solution to permanent shelter beds and being able to wind down the 393 00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:30,640 overflow operation, we did not preemptively um 394 00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:34,360 initiate public consultation, so to speak. But, certainly, we would be happy 395 00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:40,720 to share the plan if approved by this council with the public moving forward. 396 00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:43,960 » Follow up, Councillor Bradley. >> Well, I understand that and I understand 397 00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:47,360 that from our meeting last week that uh that there's not a need for a rezoning 398 00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:51,640 which would start a whole public process. However, I do think 399 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:54,560 watching all the stuff on social media and the first casualty is usually the 400 00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:58,120 truth. I think it's really important to bring 401 00:30:56,560 --> 00:31:01,720 this forward as soon as possible just to inform that neighborhood. And also, I 402 00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:04,920 know you have regular meetings for the Melrose neighborhood and as part of our 403 00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:10,920 discussion last week, I personally would prefer that that exit is much shorter 404 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:14,320 than what's predicted. But can you say on the record here now 405 00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:18,040 what is happening at Melrose Place on Melrose Street, the actual number of 406 00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:22,160 people using it has decreased significantly and I think that's 407 00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:26,000 important for people to know. >> Ms. Fitzpatrick, please. 408 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:31,120 » Through you Warden to Councillor Bradley, I mean yes, you are correct 409 00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:36,320 with the Melrose overflow shelter. The usage is on average for the past couple 410 00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:40,520 of months around 15 people a night. Of course, giving times of the month, it 411 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:44,960 may be a few more or a few less, but there's 25 beds available, but on 412 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:48,400 average we've been using 15 of those 25 beds. 413 00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:53,640 Certainly activity is significantly lower than it was this time last year. 414 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:57,400 We continuously, on a regular basis, every two to three months, we meet with 415 00:31:55,120 --> 00:32:00,440 the Melrose neighborhood. They reported the same to us. They're they're happy 416 00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:06,640 with the changes. Of course, they want to see it um eventually close, which 417 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:10,960 again, that is also the wish of staff. I I with regard to the timeline of 418 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:15,600 closing overflow, it is the intention once the lodge expansion project is 419 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:20,960 complete, it will result in the closure of the overflow. However, closing it 420 00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:24,400 prematurely as as we all can appreciate, there is not enough capacity at the 421 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:27,840 lodge on its own to meet demand, so we will need to 422 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:32,080 maintain that for the foreseeable future to meet shelter need. We'll continue to 423 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:36,800 to monitor monitor though on a monthly basis and wherever possible, look to 424 00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:40,520 minimize the operations at the Lower Lee Church. 425 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:43,760 » I appreciate that. Now, can I just go back for a second and ask on this idea 426 00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:47,560 at least informing the neighborhood through an open house of exactly 427 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:52,720 what this is and it is an extension of existing service which is is positive. 428 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:55,880 I I think there's a need to do that in that commercial area and that 429 00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:59,360 residential area uh that they've informed as soon as 430 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:03,760 possible the details. And we went through that on George Street. Uh once 431 00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:08,000 that got rolling the um the misinformation was enormous. 432 00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:11,520 And I think we should do everything to bring it down knowing that that's not 433 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:14,800 always possible. And I'll leave that with you. I'll leave 434 00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:19,200 that with your judgment on your timing and when you would do that. 435 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:23,560 » Okay. Councillor White. >> Uh thank you, Warden. 436 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:29,040 Through you to Ms. Fitzpatrick. In the past um there were conversations about 437 00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:34,040 the possibility of expanding services on this particular site and 438 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:38,880 uh if I if my memory serves me correctly the conclusion was that there just 439 00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:43,440 wasn't enough land uh available to make any sort of real difference in in 440 00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:47,560 expanding that. Uh there's limited parking for staff and and visitors and 441 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:51,720 and the building itself takes up a fairly large 442 00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:56,920 uh portion of the property. So, what what has changed or what what allowed uh 443 00:33:54,480 --> 00:34:01,360 a creative reconsideration of that option here? 444 00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:04,440 » Ms. Fitzpatrick, please. >> Through you, Warden, to Councillor 445 00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:08,560 White. So, we did engage with Gloss Engineering and Architect. 446 00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:11,720 They they did the feasibility study for us. 447 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:16,320 So, the expansion of the lodge operation it's it's really one dorm room. So, if 448 00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:20,000 you're if you're facing the lodge from Confederation Street, it would be the 449 00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:24,720 east side of the building uh between that and the Salvation Army. 450 00:34:21,879 --> 00:34:29,240 So, it's it's it's one dorm room on that side, a little bit of office space, and 451 00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:34,399 some interior renovations of existing spaces. So, being able to convert an 452 00:34:31,679 --> 00:34:38,320 existing boardroom into a female dorm. So really using their creativity and 453 00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:44,040 their expertise the the net result is 1,700 square feet 454 00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:50,639 that falls within building code requirements. So it is a it is a viable 455 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:50,639 project on the existing site. 456 00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:57,440 » Thank you. Any other questions before I call the vote? 457 00:34:55,679 --> 00:35:01,880 Okay, so I have a motion on the floor to approve the four recommendations. 458 00:34:59,720 --> 00:35:05,800 All in favor? Opposed if any? 459 00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:10,240 That's carried. Any other business for social services 460 00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:10,240 this morning? 461 00:35:11,440 --> 00:35:19,720 We have no agenda items for our office of the CAO unless there's other business 462 00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,720 to be brought up. 463 00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:26,560 Seeing none. Brings us to item number 11 in camera. 464 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:31,280 I'll look for a motion to go in camera for the items listed on the agenda. 465 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:35,600 Councillor Lusby and Councillor Sageman. All in favor? 466 00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:35,600 That's carried. 467 00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:26,920 » Mhm. 468 00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:21,920 » Mhm. 469 00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:16,960 » Mhm. >> Okay, before I call for a motion to 470 00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:21,400 adjourn, we have a couple invitations I'd like to note. Uh the first one being 471 00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:26,640 Marshall Goulding Manor has a family barbecue on Saturday, July 472 00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:30,880 25th at 5:00 p.m. And the second one is a Northland and 473 00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:36,920 Lodge family barbecue, Thursday, August 6th at 5:00 p.m. 474 00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:41,600 Look for a motion to adjourn. Councilor Loosely 475 00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:44,600 and Councilor Ferguson, all in favor. Let's carry it, thank you. 476 00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:51,680 Oh, yeah, and the audit committee meets upstairs immediately following 477 00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:54,680 the uh this meeting. 478 00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:57,680 Oh, no, we're doing it in the council chambers, sorry.