[3:58] good afternoon,
[4:01] everyone.
[4:03] It is 1:00.
[4:06] Welcome to the APRIL 28, 2026
[4:08] general government and planning
[4:09] committee meeting.
[4:11] I'm calling our meeting to
[4:11] order.
[4:13] The first item of business on
[4:14] our agenda is the approval of
[4:16] the MARCH 10, 2026 committee
[4:18] summary.
[4:19] Are there additions or
[4:22] corrections?
[4:24] >> move to approve.
[4:25] >> Chair: seeing none, I'll take
[4:26] a motion to approve.
[4:32] >> second.
[4:33] >> Chair: second.
[4:33] Any discussion on the motion.
[4:34] All those in favor say aye.
[4:36] >> aye.
[4:36] >> Chair: any opposed.
[4:40] That motion passes.
[4:42] The next item on our agenda is
[4:44] our charter review presentation.
[4:45] Vice mayor wu, since this is
[4:47] your item,ly turn it over to you
[4:48] for the introduction.
[4:49] >> thank you, chair.
[4:51] First I want to thank civiclex
[4:53] for the tremendous amount of
[4:54] work that you all have done on
[4:54] this.
[4:57] It was very thoughtful, it was
[4:57] very collaborative.
[5:00] I also want to extend my
[5:02] gratitude towards the city staff
[5:04] , the council members, both
[5:05] current and past council members
[5:07] that offered up some of their
[5:09] experience and wisdom.
[5:11] And finally, I really want to
[5:13] applaud the efforts of the
[5:14] assemblymembers themselves, many
[5:17] of whom are here right now, for
[5:18] lexington's first civic
[5:18] assembly.
[5:21] This is really historic,
[5:21] honestly.
[5:23] and I'm so excited to be part of
[5:23] it.
[5:24] So thank you all so much for
[5:27] participating in this process.
[5:28] And as per the resolution that
[5:31] we passed a couple months ago, I
[5:33] want to reiterate council's
[5:34] commitment to seriously
[5:36] listening to and considering the
[5:37] assembly's recommendations.
[5:38] So, with that, I will hand it
[5:39] over to richard.
[5:41] Thank you.
[5:42] >> thank you, so much vice
[5:43] mayor.
[5:46] We are so incredibly grateful to
[5:47] be bringing these
[5:50] recommendations to you all
[5:50] today.
[5:53] Planning this schlep has taken --
[5:55] planning this assembly has been
[5:55] a lot of work.
[5:57] You will hear about the most
[5:58] recent part of the timeline but
[6:00] this is a culmination of over
[6:02] three years of work, and I just
[6:04] wanted to say up front how
[6:05] grateful I am that you all have
[6:07] agreed to respond meaningfully
[6:09] to these recommendations.
[6:11] It has been a lot of work for
[6:13] both civiclex and for our
[6:13] assemblymembers.
[6:15] And so we are grateful for the
[6:17] trust and the time that you all
[6:19] are giving this process.
[6:21] So, I'm not going to say too
[6:22] much.
[6:24] I'll turn it over to civiclex's
[6:30] deputy director kitty anderson.
[6:30] >> hello.
[6:31] Thank you so much for having us.
[6:34] I want to echo the gratitude
[6:35] richard just expressed and beer
[6:37] here to talk to you today about
[6:39] the recommendations and the
[6:42] process of lexington's first
[6:42] civic assembly.
[6:45] So just to recap, I know you all
[6:46] heard about the assembly last
[6:48] july and I'm sure you remember
[6:50] every single word of richard's
[6:52] presentation, but to sum --
[6:54] summarize, a civic assembly is
[6:57] an internationally recognized
[6:59] model of getting everyday
[7:00] citizens involved in government
[7:03] and making decisions.
[7:05] It's participatory decision
[7:05] making.
[7:07] To learn about an issue and
[7:09] learn about it extensively,
[7:11] deliberate and ultimately pass
[7:12] recommendations on a specific
[7:13] topic.
[7:14] One of the really important
[7:16] aspects of an assembly is the
[7:17] assemblymembers themselves are
[7:20] both randomly selected through a
[7:22] process called a civic lottery
[7:23] and also more or less
[7:24] demographically representative
[7:27] of the community they are
[7:28] serving.
[7:29] Assemblies can be facilitated by
[7:31] governments, or in our case, the
[7:34] third party organization of
[7:35] civiclex and they really shine
[7:36] on issues that public
[7:38] institutions are having trouble
[7:39] solving for themselves.
[7:40] And we think charter review
[7:42] might be an example of that and
[7:44] we are excited to share what we
[7:44] came up with.
[7:48] So, I won't spend a ton of time
[7:50] on the background.
[7:51] But two key things I wanted to
[7:54] highlight with our assembly
[7:54] process.
[7:56] It took three years as richard
[7:56] mentioned.
[7:59] One of the bullet points is
[8:01] fundraising and grants
[8:01] submissions.
[8:02] This assembly was done
[8:04] completely with grant money from
[8:05] national and international
[8:05] philanthropy.
[8:07] We did not use a local
[8:10] government money in this
[8:10] process.
[8:13] And the actual assembly itself
[8:15] only took a month and it was a
[8:17] complete whirlwind of a month
[8:19] this MARCH, but as richard
[8:20] mentioned, the planning was
[8:22] almost a three-year process.
[8:25] One of the most important
[8:27] aspects of an assembly is who is
[8:29] in the room.
[8:31] And our selection process was
[8:34] incredibly robust, informed by
[8:35] professors at the martin school
[8:36] at the university of kentucky.
[8:38] I'm not going to touch on every
[8:40] single demographic we used.
[8:42] We actually tracked nine
[8:43] demographics of our
[8:44] assemblymembers and I wanted to
[8:45] make sure the actual
[8:46] representation was on the record
[8:48] for you to see.
[8:51] Suffice to say the goal, pie,
[8:55] smaller wedge is based on census
[8:56] data about lexington fayette
[8:57] county.
[9:00] We know that census data is not
[9:01] an exact representation of
[9:03] lexington but it's the closest
[9:05] most accurate, most documented
[9:06] reference that we have and in
[9:08] most cases we were using A.C.S.
[9:11] Data from 2023, but the full
[9:13] methodology is available online.
[9:14] As I just flip through these, I
[9:17] want to emphasize we were
[9:18] incredibly proud of our
[9:19] selection process after mailing
[9:22] out 10,000 postcards to 10,000
[9:23] randomly selected addresses, and
[9:27] a couple thousand reminder
[9:29] postcards, we had 387
[9:29] applicants.
[9:30] And from that we were able to
[9:33] build, I think, by all cases an
[9:34] extremely representative panel.
[9:36] And I think these charts
[9:38] showcase that so you can see our
[9:41] age breakdown, our race and
[9:43] ethnicity breakdown matching
[9:45] lexington according to the
[9:47] census very closely.
[9:47] Political registration is
[9:48] important for assemblies because
[9:50] it's important to have people
[9:51] with different political
[9:52] perspectives in the room and we
[9:54] were a pretty close match on
[9:55] that.
[9:56] We also made sure to track
[9:59] people who were not
[10:00] recommending -- registered to a
[10:02] political party and were not
[10:03] typically voters.
[10:05] Will you note we had at least
[10:08] one person from every council
[10:08] member.
[10:10] 12 districts is a lot of
[10:10] districts.
[10:12] I was worried we wouldn't get
[10:12] there.
[10:14] But we did and we have one
[10:15] representative from every
[10:15] council member.
[10:17] And going through all of the
[10:19] other categories, within 5% on
[10:21] every single demographic.
[10:23] This is a quick breakdown of the
[10:23] process.
[10:26] I will highlight orientation was
[10:27] MARCH 1, not MAY 1.
[10:28] Thank you to council member
[10:30] ellinger for pointing that out.
[10:32] This the is just the flow of the
[10:32] sessions.
[10:34] And with that, I want to turn it
[10:36] over to the most important part
[10:38] of this, which is the
[10:38] recommendations themselves.
[10:41] We will be hearing from four
[10:42] assemblymembers about the
[10:43] recommendations that they
[10:44] proked.
[10:46] There are three distinct
[10:47] recommendations that could
[10:49] potentially lead to three
[10:50] distinct chapter amendments and
[10:54] to start us off we have haley
[10:54] smalls.
[10:58] thank you.
[11:00] >> hi everyone.
[11:04] My name is haley small from
[11:06] council member district 5 and I
[11:07] want to talk about compensation.
[11:10] We came to an 84.6 super
[11:12] majority to increase council
[11:17] compensation to a new cap of
[11:17] 59,987.
[11:19] That is the average annual
[11:20] income in lexington.
[11:21] So that's where that number
[11:21] comes from.
[11:23] We want that number to continue
[11:25] to increase annually with cpi
[11:29] and to go into effect in 2030.
[11:31] Why did we make this decision?
[11:32] As an assembly we recognize that
[11:34] the role of a council member has
[11:36] changed in the decades since the
[11:40] charter went into effect in the
[11:40] 70s.
[11:42] We think the most effective
[11:43] council members are spending
[11:44] nights and weekends, lots of
[11:46] energy and lots of time
[11:48] innovating, thinking of ways to
[11:50] make lexington a better place to
[11:51] live for all of us.
[11:53] W also recognize the lack of
[11:55] competition for many council
[11:56] seats.
[11:58] Too many council seats are
[11:59] running unopposed too often.
[12:02] And so we think the crime
[12:04] scene -- the increasing
[12:05] compensation will better
[12:06] compensate hard working council
[12:07] members but also bring more
[12:08] people into public office,
[12:09] bringing more people from
[12:13] different backgrounds into this
[12:14] room.
[12:16] I think that this proposal
[12:19] represents what we, as an
[12:20] assembly, want the council do
[12:21] and to look like.
[12:23] We want council to be more than
[12:24] a rubber stamp.
[12:26] We want you to be busy, we want
[12:29] you to be active, we want you to
[12:30] be innovative and imagine tiff
[12:33] but we also want you --
[12:34] imaginative, but we also want
[12:35] you to feel what it is like to
[12:36] be an average citizen in terms
[12:38] of your compensation and so
[12:39] that's why we tied it back to
[12:41] the average lexington income.
[12:42] So with that being said, thank
[12:43] you for your time and I'm going
[12:46] to pass the mic over to sophia
[12:54] to talk about recommendation 2.
[12:56] >> hello.
[12:58] My name is sophia, I'm a high
[12:59] school student at lafayette and
[13:01] I was part of the assembly as a
[13:03] youth representative.
[13:05] Our second recommendation was
[13:06] about council accountability,
[13:08] and largely stemmed from our
[13:11] discussions on compensation, ais
[13:13] we talked with many former and
[13:14] current council members and
[13:16] realized that the duties of a
[13:17] council member were not really
[13:19] that well defined legally.
[13:21] And that it was largely up to
[13:22] the individual council member
[13:23] how much time they invested in
[13:27] the job.
[13:29] So, as a result, we decided to
[13:31] amend the charter to create
[13:34] publicly viewable attendance
[13:37] expectations and increase
[13:38] transparency for the general
[13:39] election as voters will have
[13:40] more information about the
[13:41] representatives to make informed
[13:43] decisions when they're voting.
[13:45] And it also aligns with our
[13:46] recommendation on compensation,
[13:55] as a more informed -- sorry, as a
[13:57] council that is better paid will
[14:00] be able to serve our
[14:02] constituents more effectively
[14:05] and this passed by 88.8% super
[14:06] majority.
[14:07] It was effective.
[14:11] So I will pass the mic to cath
[14:14] who will talk about our third
[14:15] recommendation.
[14:16] >> hello.
[14:19] My name is katherine and I'm
[14:22] here representing district 1.
[14:24] Our other recommendation that we
[14:26] made was for a mandatory charter
[14:27] review.
[14:29] I think you all can recognize
[14:32] that if we don't keep our
[14:35] charters regularlyley view --
[14:37] reviewed they can quickly become
[14:39] out of date and lose relevance.
[14:40] We thought it was really
[14:42] important to have a regular,
[14:44] fair, public review and we
[14:45] thought that should be done
[14:47] every eight years.
[14:51] Also done by a group of randomly
[14:54] selected demographically
[14:54] selected representatives.
[14:56] We like the way civiclex picked
[14:58] a group and so that was kind of
[14:59] what we were thinking would be
[15:01] another good idea.
[15:02] That way -- I know one of the
[15:04] last times we did a charter
[15:05] review, it ended up being
[15:07] appointing people who really
[15:09] benefited from the review by
[15:10] people who really benefited from
[15:11] the review.
[15:13] So in order to make sure that
[15:16] it's fair, we thought a random
[15:18] selection representative would
[15:19] be important.
[15:20] We also thought there should be
[15:22] a time limit on the process.
[15:23] As you know, these things can
[15:25] drag on forever if they don't so
[15:27] we recommended it take no more
[15:28] than 12 months from start to
[15:29] finish.
[15:31] And I guess the reason why we
[15:33] thought that that was important
[15:35] is so that we can make sure that
[15:37] our charter stays relevant to
[15:40] all of the peep living in
[15:42] lexington -- people living in
[15:45] lexington and we agreed with an
[15:46] 88.8% super majority that that
[15:46] was necessary.
[15:49] And I'm going to pass it on to
[15:50] bob, who is going to tell -- he
[15:53] is going to represent the
[15:58] dissenting voices.
[16:00] >> hello.
[16:02] My name is bob smith.
[16:03] I'm from 5.
[16:05] And like any question, any time
[16:06] you have a question, you are
[16:08] going to have opposing.
[16:10] So I'm the opposing.
[16:12] But it's nothing personal.
[16:14] [Laughter]
[16:15] So thank you for giving our team
[16:17] the time to let you know our
[16:19] thoughts behind our one month of
[16:19] deliberation.
[16:21] I will be giving our dissenting
[16:22] report.
[16:24] We had a lot of very thoughtful
[16:25] conversations and voted on the
[16:27] issues that you charged us with.
[16:30] The first one will be I would
[16:31] like to talk to you about is the
[16:32] charter review process.
[16:36] This probably had the shortest
[16:37] amount of time in discussion.
[16:39] It was easy that we came to this
[16:39] conclusion.
[16:41] It had more to do with time in
[16:43] between reviews and what we were
[16:44] allowed to review.
[16:47] We all believe -- I believe,
[16:49] thought that there should be
[16:51] more timely reviews of the
[16:52] charter.
[16:53] In particular I was disappointed
[16:55] we not allowed to review council
[16:56] term lengths.
[16:57] We were designated for two
[16:59] particular things and that all
[16:59] we could do.
[17:00] And one of the things I really
[17:03] want to talk about was term
[17:04] lengths for you people.
[17:06] I really people like we need to
[17:07] increase it from two to four so
[17:09] you spend more time doing the
[17:11] people's business instead of
[17:16] running for office.
[17:18] So hopefully in the near future
[17:21] that you guys let us have
[17:23] another -- because we, as we
[17:25] wanted to do the charter review
[17:26] every year, we can do one
[17:27] sooner.
[17:29] By the bylaws, you can have a
[17:30] special one sooner than eight
[17:31] years and hopefully this is one
[17:33] of the items that can be brought
[17:34] up.
[17:35] Second, accountability of the
[17:37] council members was discussed
[17:39] and dissent was mainly based
[17:40] around how to set up guidelines
[17:42] since we all felt there should
[17:43] be more accountability.
[17:46] It wasn't that we didn't think
[17:47] there should be accountability
[17:49] but how we came up with the
[17:49] items.
[17:50] Last was compensation.
[17:54] I bet you would believe that had
[17:55] the most discussion.
[17:57] Dissent was based not wanting to
[17:59] make the position appealing as a
[18:00] life long job.
[18:02] We don't need more 50 year
[18:04] council members like in
[18:05] congress.
[18:06] And we really don't want to make
[18:07] this so appealing that you think
[18:09] this is a lifetime position for
[18:10] you.
[18:12] The founders of our country
[18:13] perceive government positions as
[18:14] a public service.
[18:16] Men would leave their farms or
[18:17] businesses for short-term and
[18:19] then go back home.
[18:21] We felt review every three to
[18:23] four years would be more
[18:24] appropriate keeping the cpi
[18:26] index in place in the meantime
[18:27] and at the end of three or four
[18:28] years, we thought maybe there
[18:31] should be an extra bump because
[18:33] the way economic things were at
[18:34] that time, that would be
[18:35] appropriate to address that.
[18:38] We also felt that a 50%
[18:39] increase, which is what this is,
[18:41] would have a hard time getting
[18:43] passed in the fall.
[18:51] So thank you for your time.
[18:52] >> Chair: thank you so much to
[18:53] our four assemblymembers.
[18:55] I know firsthand how nerve
[18:56] racking it can be the first time
[18:59] you are talking to this u and
[19:02] you guys did a wonderful job.
[19:04] So just to close us out and talk
[19:07] about next steps, all three of
[19:08] these recommendations would
[19:11] require a chapter amendment to
[19:11] pass.
[19:15] -- charter amendment to pass.
[19:16] Civiclex is working with the
[19:17] department of law what that
[19:18] would look like and we want to
[19:20] use the opportunity to talk to
[19:21] our assemblymembers about it so
[19:22] the language included in this
[19:24] presentation is still very much
[19:26] a draft but we wanted to go
[19:28] ahead, go on record, let people
[19:30] know what we are thinking about
[19:31] and help you understand what
[19:33] this might look like in the
[19:33] actual charter.
[19:36] The biggest kind of decision and
[19:37] thing to figure out with the
[19:40] amendment language is what
[19:43] exactly would be a charter
[19:45] amendment versus what makes more
[19:46] since as an ordinance or
[19:47] resolution.
[19:48] That's an active question
[19:50] because we learned a lot about
[19:52] how charters are structural
[19:52] documents.
[19:53] They're meant to set out the
[19:55] general kind of process of
[19:57] government but not dictate
[19:58] specific policy and we want to
[20:00] make sure we are in line with
[20:01] that with our recommendations.
[20:02] So, with that, these are the
[20:04] drafts that we have.
[20:05] In terms of compensation, the
[20:06] big open question that we have
[20:10] with this is we know that the
[20:13] spirit of the assembly is to set
[20:15] compensation according to the
[20:18] number 59,987 which is the
[20:19] annual average wage as reported
[20:19] this year.
[20:23] And so we know that the spirit
[20:24] of the assembly is to set that
[20:27] bench mark now and by the time
[20:30] 231 rolls around and it is
[20:32] implemented, the cpi will have
[20:33] adjusted accordingly.
[20:35] But we are not completely sure,
[20:37] to be transparent,,000 talk
[20:38] about that because we don't know
[20:42] what the number will be.
[20:44] -- MAY I take one more minute to
[20:47] finish the recommendations.
[20:47] >> Chair: let's do two.
[20:51] >> even better.
[20:52] That is the primary question to
[20:53] answer with the compensation,
[20:55] although we know the exact
[20:56] spirit of the recommendation is
[20:58] more about the freezing.
[21:00] -- about the phrasing.
[21:01] The second amendment around
[21:02] council accountability would be
[21:05] added on to section 47.07 which
[21:07] is the rules and procedures
[21:07] article.
[21:08] The main thing to know about
[21:09] this is that ultimately it's up
[21:12] to council to set your own
[21:14] standards of accountability.
[21:16] That is what makes sense in the
[21:16] charter.
[21:18] There is kind of a separation of
[21:19] powers question there.
[21:20] This is more about just
[21:22] requiring council to create an
[21:23] ordinance around accountability.
[21:25] It doesn't specify exactly what
[21:26] would be in there.
[21:28] I will say there are several
[21:29] things that I think
[21:31] assemblymembers feel extremely
[21:32] strongly should be in the
[21:33] ordinance and who would be happy
[21:35] to engage throughout that
[21:35] process.
[21:36] The number one thing that we
[21:38] heard throughout the entire
[21:40] assembly was more transparency
[21:42] around attendance and attendance
[21:43] records.
[21:44] And also just more understanding
[21:46] of what the actual job
[21:48] description of a council member
[21:48] is.
[21:50] So those I think are two things
[21:51] that assemblymembers feel
[21:53] strongly should be included but
[21:54] ultimately that would be a
[21:55] council ordinance.
[21:56] And the final potential
[21:58] amendment is around charter
[22:00] review.
[22:01] Again, I will flag this is one
[22:03] where we are figuring out what
[22:05] makes sense to be an ordinance
[22:06] and what makes sense to be a
[22:07] charter amendment.
[22:09] I think cat did a great job
[22:10] explaining what the assembly
[22:12] feels are most important parts.
[22:13] And one thing I will flag with
[22:16] this is we think process wise
[22:18] perhaps the best way to make
[22:21] this happen would be to have a
[22:22] standing board or commission on
[22:26] charter review, that would be a
[22:28] smaller boarder commission that
[22:30] would include council members or
[22:32] committee chiefs to keep a
[22:34] running list of topics of
[22:35] charter review and organize the
[22:37] review that would happen every
[22:38] eight years potentially.
[22:39] So with that, I just want to say
[22:42] thank you so much to the true
[22:44] village that it took to pull
[22:45] this assembly off.
[22:46] We have many in the room.
[22:48] We have a handful of
[22:49] assemblymembers in the room.
[22:51] Richard and lilly and haley and
[22:52] the civiclex team.
[22:54] This was the largest project
[22:55] we've ever done.
[22:57] We are incredibly proud of it
[22:59] and we are curious to see what
[23:00] you guys think.
[23:00] Thank you.
[23:02] >> Chair: thank you for the
[23:04] presentation, for all the
[23:04] presenters.
[23:06] Colleagues go ahead and sign in
[23:09] if you have comments or
[23:14] questions.
[23:15] Council member brown.
[23:16] >> thank you, chair.
[23:17] And thank you for the
[23:18] presentation.
[23:19] I just wanted to take the
[23:20] opportunity to thank you all for
[23:21] your work on this, all the folks
[23:24] that, the community members that
[23:25] volunteered and took time and
[23:26] participated.
[23:28] I think it was a great exercise
[23:32] in civic engagement and look
[23:33] forward to the conversation
[23:34] about the recommendations and
[23:36] how they move forward.
[23:38] The one thing I will ask -- I
[23:40] know you all were awarded grants
[23:42] and didn't use any local public
[23:44] money to fund this activity.
[23:46] But what was the total cost so
[23:48] far that you all have spent on
[23:48] this effort?
[23:50] >> yes, the total budget from
[23:54] the grants was $220,000 to run
[23:58] this assembly and that included
[24:01] for the most part included
[24:03] civiclex time but it's possible
[24:04] we went a little over with the
[24:05] hours we worked.
[24:06] >> do you foresee if this was
[24:07] something we instituted and did
[24:10] on a regular basis permanently,
[24:12] that's what it would cost to do
[24:14] the whole exercise and would you
[24:15] recommend doing it the same way
[24:17] that y'all did this?
[24:18] >> that's a really good
[24:18] question.
[24:19] I think that if the city was
[24:21] going to be conducting a charter
[24:23] review every eight years with a
[24:25] randomly selected group of
[24:26] residents, there would be a lot
[24:27] of elements of this assembly
[24:30] that I think we think would work
[24:31] really well for that.
[24:33] I don't think every single piece
[24:34] of it needs to.
[24:35] Cost wise I think there are
[24:36] various parts of it that would
[24:38] make a lot of sense for the city
[24:38] to do.
[24:42] The mailing of 10,000, you know,
[24:44] 10,000 postcards to 10,000
[24:46] randomly selected addresses, I
[24:47] think the city could do that
[24:48] even better than we do.
[24:50] There are costs with venue,
[24:51] things like that.
[24:53] I also think because the topic
[24:54] would be set as charter from the
[24:55] beginning, the organization of
[24:56] it would be simpler.
[24:59] And I think the exact model is
[25:01] based on what you think is best,
[25:02] what the assemblymembers weigh
[25:06] in on, but I see it as not -- as
[25:08] kind of a hybrid model of what
[25:11] we just did versus like a
[25:12] traditional.
[25:13] >> I appreciate that answer but
[25:15] I think to some of that, as
[25:17] government could have some
[25:18] efficiencies, but I think the
[25:20] way that you all kind of
[25:21] separated this from coming down
[25:23] here and having the conversation
[25:26] and having that and making those
[25:28] decisions kind of leave what
[25:29] could be perceived as an
[25:31] influence on the process and the
[25:32] outcome.
[25:34] And I do have another question.
[25:36] So, today is just an update.
[25:38] It sounds like you still have
[25:39] some questions to be answered.
[25:42] So we are not being asked to
[25:44] make any decisions or take any
[25:45] action today.
[25:48] >> that's correct.
[25:50] We will need to bring the full
[25:53] amendment language and also the
[25:54] ballot language that will need
[25:56] to be voted on by council,
[25:57] whether or not it will be placed
[25:58] on the ballot.
[26:00] And it seems likely that the
[26:01] JUNE 2 work session will be when
[26:03] we will be sharing that out.
[26:04] >> okay.
[26:06] You said something that brought
[26:06] up another question.
[26:09] So is the council vote to put it
[26:12] on the ballot the only path
[26:12] forward?
[26:16] Do you also have a petition
[26:18] process potential for these
[26:19] initiatives as well?
[26:22] >> yes, so in the charter, it
[26:23] says there are two ways for an
[26:25] amendment question or any
[26:26] referendum question to end up on
[26:27] the ballot.
[26:29] It has to be paced by 3/5
[26:31] majority of council members or
[26:33] by a petition with the number of
[26:35] signatures that is equal to 10%
[26:38] of the voter turnout in the most
[26:42] recent mayoral election.
[26:45] I believe... Do not quote me on
[26:45] that.
[26:48] We are starting -- civiclex
[26:49] decided that going through
[26:51] council made sense because
[26:52] charter review was in committee
[26:54] and that's the path we are
[26:54] currently planning to take.
[26:56] >> thank you for your work on
[26:56] this.
[26:58] Thank you, chair.
[26:59] >> Chair: council member
[26:59] reynolds.
[27:01] >> thank you, chair.
[27:03] I want to especially thank
[27:05] civiclex for taking this on.
[27:07] I know it was a lot of work and
[27:08] a lot of years of work and then
[27:12] i want to thank all of the
[27:13] members of the assembly.
[27:14] I think it's super exciting that
[27:16] you all were able to catch a
[27:18] cross section of lexington, a
[27:19] cross section that we don't
[27:21] usually see here in chambers, a
[27:22] cross section that we don't
[27:23] usually interact with, and
[27:28] really be able to civically
[27:30] engage the average lexingtonian
[27:31] and I I think that's really
[27:32] important.
[27:34] So I'm really thankful that you
[27:35] all did this.
[27:38] I was also like surprised and
[27:41] pretty happy on my end, with
[27:42] what you all came up with.
[27:44] I think you all were super
[27:44] thoughtful.
[27:46] You went through a lot of
[27:48] different scenarios and I
[27:50] appreciate what you brought to
[27:50] us.
[27:54] I just have a few questions.
[27:55] About the council compensation,
[27:56] can you explain the rationale
[28:01] why you decided to wait until --
[28:03] I'm sorry, 231 to implement it?
[28:07] >> yes, so there is article 4 of
[28:10] the charter, there is kind of a
[28:11] specific provision about how
[28:13] compensation can be changed and
[28:14] also the requirement that it
[28:18] cannot be changed by council
[28:19] members for the term that they
[28:20] are in.
[28:21] So essentially because we knew
[28:23] this would be going on the
[28:25] ballot potentially this
[28:27] NOVEMBER, new council will be
[28:28] elected in JANUARY.
[28:29] If that new council is the one
[28:31] to pass the ordinance that will
[28:33] set the new level, we have to
[28:36] wait four years after that for
[28:37] at-large council members which
[28:40] puts us at 231 for
[28:40] implementation.
[28:42] >> that was not my understanding
[28:42] of that.
[28:43] That's interesting.
[28:44] What happens if some of the
[28:45] council members that are here
[28:48] now happen to still be on
[28:48] council then.
[28:53] >> my -- and I will defer to
[28:54] MR. Cravens, my understanding
[28:55] is it's just about the term.
[28:57] The term that the ordinance to
[28:59] change compensation is made, it
[29:02] just can't take effect during
[29:03] the sitting term.
[29:05] >> so because we are in the
[29:10] middle of a term right now.
[29:13] >> correct.
[29:16] >> and then for the council
[29:16] accountability part, can you
[29:22] help explain -- you said we would
[29:23] have to set it up because we set
[29:24] our own standards.
[29:26] So before this could go on the
[29:28] ballot, we would need to set up
[29:30] our standard?
[29:33] Or what would go on the ballot?
[29:36] >> so the language would be
[29:37] based -- the ballot language
[29:38] would be based on the amendment
[29:41] and the amendment is essentially
[29:44] requiring that -- requiring
[29:46] council to create an ordinance
[29:49] with accountability standards
[29:51] after the amendment is passed so
[29:53] that would be essentially a new
[29:55] mandate to create an ordinance
[29:56] that would then be created if it
[29:57] was passed.
[30:00] >> and the idea behind it, the
[30:04] main reason was just folks
[30:06] wanting to be able to see our
[30:07] attendance records more easily?
[30:10] >> I think the big picture idea
[30:12] was a lot of assemblymembers
[30:14] just, as kind of the
[30:18] conversation was evolving, there
[30:19] was a lot of interest in
[30:20] increasing compensation but from
[30:22] the council members we heard
[30:23] directly from in the sessions
[30:25] and public input and research,
[30:30] feeling like compensation is
[30:33] increased, the assembly was
[30:34] interested in increasing
[30:35] accountability alongside that.
[30:37] They go together quite closely.
[30:39] And this was the best way, using
[30:41] the charter, to increase
[30:42] accountability standards.
[30:44] >> so just saying we would like
[30:46] council to come up with some
[30:49] sort of transparency about the
[30:52] work that they do, maybe it
[30:55] being, you know, focus add
[30:58] round -- focused around
[31:00] attendance and what other roles
[31:01] that we hold.
[31:03] >> the ultimate accountability
[31:04] of council members is elections
[31:05] but wanting to have more
[31:07] transparency around that for
[31:09] informed voters to make
[31:09] decisions.
[31:10] >> that makes sense.
[31:10] Thank you.
[31:15] And then the last thing, so the
[31:18] charter review, I think that
[31:19] made sense and I like the
[31:20] recommendation that we set
[31:25] something up that is going,
[31:25] ongoing.
[31:27] So the hope from what you just
[31:28] said to council member brown is
[31:30] that by the JUNE 2 meeting we
[31:32] would have formalized language
[31:34] that we are voting yes or no
[31:35] on...
[31:36] >> to place on the ballot.
[31:38] Whether or not to place on the
[31:38] ballot, yes.
[31:39] >> perfect.
[31:41] Thank you, chair.
[31:41] >> thank you.
[31:42] >> Chair: vice mayor wu.
[31:43] >> thank you, chair.
[31:45] Thank you for your presentation
[31:46] and all this great work.
[31:48] I was especially impressed, if
[31:49] you go back to some early slides
[31:52] with the demographics, I was
[31:55] especially impressed with how
[31:56] this group almost overlaid
[31:59] nearly perfectly on most
[32:01] measures with folks in lexington
[32:03] and I think that's one of the
[32:04] things that we are always
[32:05] looking for when we are thinking
[32:07] about public engagement and
[32:08] input is are the people in the
[32:09] room actually representative of
[32:11] the whole city or is it just the
[32:13] people who are tuned in, who
[32:14] have the time and energy to show
[32:16] up all the time, right?
[32:18] So that's really impressive and
[32:19] I'm so happy that you all were
[32:21] very conscious conscientious
[32:22] about that.
[32:23] One of the things that I love
[32:25] about doing new stuff in
[32:27] lexington is a certain level of
[32:27] bragging rights.
[32:34] So I know that civic assemblies
[32:35] are not common in the united
[32:37] states yet and we are at the tip
[32:38] of the spear trying it.
[32:39] I think that's really great.
[32:42] Question about the charter
[32:43] review piece, the second piece
[32:46] of that amendment language talks
[32:49] about creating standing charter
[32:49] review board.
[32:51] And you had mentioned it could
[32:54] be council members.
[32:56] Just so I'm clear, this body
[32:59] would meet on a regular basis
[33:01] between in the middle of that
[33:02] eight-year cycle and basically
[33:04] say here are some topics you
[33:05] should look at.
[33:07] And then from there we take our
[33:08] hands off of it and the assembly
[33:10] happens and the assembly process
[33:12] and folks can choose to tackle
[33:13] those specific issues.
[33:14] Is that the intent?
[33:16] >> the intent is that the actual
[33:17] charter review is commissioned
[33:20] of a randomly and
[33:21] representatively selected group
[33:22] of prosecutors and that this
[33:24] standing board is keeping a
[33:26] running list of topics and
[33:27] potentially helping facilitate
[33:28] that commission review, which
[33:31] would be on the 12-month time
[33:31] limit.
[33:32] >> thank you for that.
[33:33] There was some conversation
[33:35] about the idea potentially
[33:37] combining recommendations 1 and
[33:40] 2 into one ballot.
[33:42] Can you speak to a little bit of
[33:43] what the assembly was thinking
[33:46] on that and why they're separate
[33:46] versus together?
[33:48] >> yeah, richard, do you want to
[34:01] speak to that a little?
[34:03] >> agree both of those
[34:05] amendments really, I think, were
[34:08] sort of tied together.
[34:09] Kit talked about this earlier,
[34:11] that, you know, many
[34:15] assemblymembers thought that
[34:16] compensation, you know,
[34:17] shouldn't be increased unless
[34:21] there is also an additional
[34:24] level of expectations around
[34:28] council member accountability
[34:29] and attendance.
[34:31] I think there were many people
[34:32] on the assembly that would not
[34:34] have voted for the compensation
[34:36] increase if there were not also
[34:37] this accountability piece.
[34:41] I think there are a number of
[34:43] reasons on this sort of
[34:44] non-legal side, I guess I would
[34:46] say, for why those could be
[34:50] combined or separated.
[34:52] Is ultimately we decided the
[34:53] simplest thing to do in terms of
[34:55] getting them on the ballot for
[34:57] clarity for voters was to have
[35:01] them be two sprat amendment --
[35:01] separate amendments.
[35:02] This is another great situation
[35:04] to defer to the city's
[35:05] department of law on what would
[35:09] be the most appropriate.
[35:10] >> thank you for that.
[35:13] i can see the arguments for both
[35:14] and it's a proven fact that when
[35:15] there are too many ballot
[35:17] measures on one particular
[35:18] ballot, they don't always do
[35:19] well.
[35:20] People kind of skip it.
[35:22] And looking at this year's
[35:24] sample ballot in NOVEMBER, it's
[35:27] going to be a long run, one,
[35:27] right?
[35:30] We have all 15 council states,
[35:30] national, state, mayor, who
[35:32] knows what page the ballot
[35:33] initiatives will be on but they
[35:34] will be at the end.
[35:39] Speaking to the strapped
[35:40] amendment language, it's my
[35:43] understanding that what you want
[35:45] from council in sort of
[35:48] finalizing and crafting these
[35:49] amendments is to follow the
[35:50] spirit of what the assembly is
[35:51] setting out to do.
[35:53] And I feel that we are
[35:54] relatively clear on that.
[35:55] The language you are giving us
[35:58] today is nowhere near final
[35:58] language, right?
[35:59] We are going to work with law,
[36:01] work with you all and the
[36:03] assembly to figure out what
[36:03] makes sense.
[36:05] The question of when things
[36:07] start, what that eight years
[36:07] looks like, right?
[36:08] >> yes.
[36:10] >> and the other piece, too,
[36:11] that I'm thinking about is both
[36:13] with the review and the account
[36:15] bit lang -- accountability
[36:16] lapping winning, you are
[36:17] basically charging us with
[36:18] creating the structures.
[36:19] You are not telling us what the
[36:20] structures are necessary.
[36:21] >> I correct.
[36:23] We wanted to build the hoof all
[36:24] structure with the amendment
[36:27] language and then allow the sort
[36:30] of specifics to be determined by
[36:30] council.
[36:32] I think our assemblymembers have
[36:33] a lot of thoughts they would
[36:34] like to share with you all about
[36:37] what those specific requirements
[36:39] would be, what would go into
[36:40] ordinance and resolution.
[36:42] But in terms of actually putting
[36:45] that on the ballot, and in the
[36:46] charter, and our conversations
[36:47] with the department of law, it
[36:51] seemed that restricting what is
[36:54] in the amendment to the sort of
[36:57] macro structural pieces is what
[36:59] would be most in keeping with
[37:00] the tradition of the charter.
[37:00] >> thank you.
[37:02] Thank you, chair.
[37:04] >> Clerk: council member lynch.
[37:06] >> thank you, chair.
[37:07] Thank you to civiclex for doing
[37:08] this.
[37:10] This was huge.
[37:14] Very excited that it was super
[37:14] successful.
[37:16] Thank you to all the
[37:17] assemblymembers for volunteering
[37:19] your time and your expertise and
[37:21] thanks to the volunteers and
[37:23] everyone that made this assembly
[37:23] happen.
[37:26] I'm just excited it has gone so
[37:27] well and thank you for the
[37:28] representations you have put
[37:29] before us.
[37:32] My questions are about the
[37:33] demographic information.
[37:35] You all did like an outstanding
[37:37] job of getting a great cross
[37:41] section of folks in our city.
[37:43] I think should all of this move
[37:45] forward, I would love for us to
[37:47] continue to work with you all to
[37:49] see how you all did this so that
[37:52] we can replicate it for not only
[37:54] the charter review board or
[37:56] commission, but in other ways
[37:57] throughout government, because
[38:00] as you know, vice mayor and i
[38:02] are working on making sure
[38:04] boards are equitable and true
[38:05] representative of the true
[38:05] population.
[38:06] I would love to get the formula
[38:09] and do a deep dive on that.
[38:10] I look forward to working with
[38:11] you on that in the future.
[38:13] My two questions are on the
[38:14] housing status.
[38:15] 7% of the group were other.
[38:19] I was just curious what other
[38:19] was.
[38:22] Was that unhoused or marginally
[38:23] housed?
[38:25] >> I believe it's yeah, living
[38:27] with family or friends, between
[38:29] you know, living situations,
[38:31] things like that, which is not
[38:32] tracked in the census.
[38:33] And actually housing status is
[38:36] not really in the census either.
[38:39] So we just went with the rate of
[38:41] owned occupants and rented
[38:42] occupants.
[38:44] Rented units in lexington that
[38:46] was our benchmark number.
[38:47] But that's what that other is
[38:49] referring to, is alternative
[38:50] housing statuses.
[38:51] I think we had somebody apply
[38:54] that lived in a parsonage.
[38:55] So they wrote that in.
[38:56] Things like that.
[38:56] >> thank you.
[38:58] My last question is regarding
[39:00] the political registration.
[39:02] On the gold pie there was a gray
[39:04] section that was not represented
[39:06] in the actual...
[39:09] >> yes, that is, I believe that
[39:11] is other parties.
[39:12] Like a combination of green
[39:13] party, things like that.
[39:15] And that was something we just
[39:16] did not have applicants to.
[39:19] So that was, yeah,...
[39:21] >> kudos to you all and thank
[39:22] you for all of your work.
[39:23] This is awesome.
[39:24] thank you, chair.
[39:25] >> Chair: I'm going to call on
[39:28] committee members first and then
[39:29] non-committee members.
[39:30] Council member sevigny you are
[39:30] next.
[39:31] >> thank you, chair and thank
[39:33] you so much for the
[39:33] presentation.
[39:35] Thank you all for spending your
[39:37] time working on this.
[39:39] It's really cool to have a group
[39:46] of people who really, this is
[39:48] some of you the first brush of
[39:49] being asked these kinds of
[39:51] questions and you had to get up
[39:52] to speed and that's great.
[39:53] Thank you for all of that.
[39:55] My questions are around a couple
[39:55] of things.
[40:01] One is, I generally believe that
[40:02] the questions that are at the
[40:05] end of the ballot are like the
[40:07] hardest to get to and, to be
[40:10] honest with you, they take a
[40:12] huge initiative by some
[40:13] organization to get people to
[40:15] actually vote on them or even
[40:17] think about them.
[40:19] I don't know who -- like we
[40:21] certainly wouldn't do that.
[40:22] Like it's kind of -- I'm kind of
[40:23] curious if you thought about
[40:25] things like that.
[40:27] And then the other thing that I
[40:31] wanted to talk to you is, I kind
[40:35] of feel like if we took the
[40:37] accountability measures and we
[40:39] did an ordinance of our own by
[40:40] talking with you about
[40:42] accountability measures, and
[40:44] then we put them into place,
[40:46] proo irto putting something --
[40:48] prior to put something on the
[40:50] ballot, we should be able to
[40:53] check a box that says like, hey,
[40:55] we are doing some
[40:56] self-accountability and we are
[40:58] making it a very public
[40:58] dashboard for you.
[41:03] we've agreed this is important.
[41:05] I don't knowsly know that all of
[41:06] them need to be a ballot
[41:07] initiative.
[41:08] I absolutely know that the
[41:11] income salary one has to be.
[41:14] But the other ones, I think, if
[41:16] we show good stewardship, and if
[41:18] we put those out there in an
[41:22] ordinance form, it can be part
[41:23] of our policy.
[41:24] Let me just ask you, did you
[41:26] think about that even deeper or
[41:29] what?
[41:32] >>
[41:35] >> so, yes, to answer your
[41:37] second question first, I won't
[41:38] always defer to law.
[41:40] I wish one of us was a lawyer,
[41:42] but as far as I know, I don't
[41:44] see any reason why council
[41:45] couldn't adopt accountability
[41:47] measures in advance of the
[41:49] ballot initiative and I do think
[41:51] many people might think that
[41:52] would be a gesture of good
[41:53] fades.
[41:55] I think the assembly was
[41:56] interested in mandating council
[41:57] produce an ordinance on
[41:58] accountability as that's kind of
[42:02] an extra level of chops, you
[42:03] know, potentially for future
[42:04] councils.
[42:05] One of the things we talked
[42:05] about.
[42:06] This is not just for lexington
[42:07] now.
[42:09] It's for lexington in 20, 30, 40
[42:09] years.
[42:11] I think that is why the assembly
[42:12] was interested in having that
[42:15] being mandated in the charter.
[42:17] And then to the question of the
[42:19] ballot question and campaign,
[42:20] it's a really good question.
[42:22] And as each of you know,
[42:24] civiclex does not advocate for
[42:25] issues and we are not going to
[42:27] start on this.
[42:29] i think we, as you know, cover
[42:31] local elections and can
[42:32] certainly cover what will be on
[42:36] the ballot, and I think/hope
[42:37] that some of the assemblymembers
[42:40] might be interested in helping,
[42:42] you know, inform people about
[42:43] these and potentially
[42:45] campaigning on them.
[42:46] Our assemblymembers are not
[42:47] civiclex staff.
[42:49] We have one assemblymember who
[42:50] is committed to campaigning
[42:52] against the issues, which is
[42:52] also great.
[42:54] That's what we are here to do.
[42:56] >> I would think we would have
[42:57] both.
[42:57] >> indeed.
[43:01] Civiclex, we are committed to
[43:01] educating about what will be on
[43:03] the ballot but beyond that, we
[43:05] will not be running I campaign.
[43:09] >> one more thing was and I did
[43:10] speak with richard before this,
[43:12] so I kind of was trying to get --
[43:14] what was in their head about 9 --
[43:17] I know you picked a current
[43:18] average.
[43:21] I don't believe the way this
[43:23] reads, like I think you picked a
[43:25] number and in five years that
[43:27] number, if you look at just the
[43:30] 2% cpi, is going to be about
[43:33] $6,000 short, and to me that
[43:34] doesn't seem fair.
[43:36] Like it seems if I were going
[43:38] for a ballot initiative, that
[43:39] would start, I like to start
[43:41] with something that is fair.
[43:42] And I think we are already
[43:45] putting people at a disadvantage
[43:48] and I don't particularly like
[43:48] that.
[43:50] So, tell me kind of how you got
[43:52] to this, if you don't mind?
[43:54] And I only have about 30
[43:54] seconds.
[43:55] I don't have another question.
[43:58] Just keep it succinct, thanks.
[44:00] >> yeah, I think I will say we
[44:01] are actively trying to figure
[44:02] out how to put that on the
[44:03] ballot and we also do not want
[44:04] to be misleading.
[44:06] And also legally cannot be
[44:07] misleading.
[44:09] There has been a recent mercy's
[44:11] law case about misleading ballot
[44:13] language and we do not want to
[44:14] stray in that direction.
[44:15] What I can say is we know the
[44:17] spirit of the assembly was to
[44:21] set the new baseline at that
[44:23] $59,987 and to adjust it
[44:25] according to rubber dollar every
[44:26] year.
[44:28] As it is right now in the actual
[44:30] charter it says council salary
[44:30] is $6,000.
[44:32] We are still figuring out a way
[44:33] to frame that that is not
[44:35] misleading but we know that is
[44:36] the spirit of the
[44:38] recommendation.
[44:39] >> thank you very much.
[44:41] That's all I have, chair.
[44:41] >> Chair: council member curtis.
[44:44] >> thank you, chair, and thank
[44:46] you, kit and richard and all the
[44:48] participants and everybody
[44:49] involved for being here today
[44:53] and the work you put into the
[44:54] civic assembly.
[44:55] It is a remarkable thing when we
[44:58] are able to inform our decisions
[44:59] through more democratic means
[45:01] and that is at the core of what
[45:04] you are doing and it's very much
[45:07] appreciated from my perspective.
[45:10] I don't have questions for
[45:10] y'all.
[45:14] I just have to take a second and
[45:16] just express my appreciation for
[45:18] being willing to dive into these
[45:20] thorny subjects because they are
[45:22] often times ones where were we
[45:24] to get into discussions about
[45:26] them solely on our own accord in
[45:27] this legislative body, there
[45:29] would be a question that I
[45:31] think, at least with the ones
[45:32] that y'all explored this go
[45:34] around, hopefully the first of
[45:37] many, that would raise questions
[45:40] about conflicts of interest, our
[45:44] ability to hold ourselves
[45:45] accountability.
[45:46] -- accountable and as you have
[45:48] seen over the past sever years,3
[45:49] you cannot always trust council
[45:51] members to hold themselves
[45:52] accountable so increasing any
[45:57] sort of accountability public
[45:59] trust is a tangible good and we
[46:00] are lucky to have y'all here and
[46:02] I'm looking forward to working
[46:03] with y'all and supporting
[46:05] whatever language comes forward.
[46:06] So thank you.
[46:10] Thank you, chair.
[46:11] >> Chair: council member morton.
[46:11] >>.
[46:12] Thank you.
[46:13] I also want to give my sincere
[46:16] appreciation and gratitude to
[46:19] civiclex for hosting and spear
[46:20] spearheading this and all the
[46:20] members vfd.
[46:22] There was a list of thank yous.
[46:24] So I will give my gratitude to
[46:27] everyone involved with this
[46:30] process and yes, you can put it
[46:31] back up there.
[46:33] >> it's an important list.
[46:35] >> thank you to anyone listening
[46:36] and in the crowd who took part
[46:38] in it.
[46:39] Regarding -- I don't have any
[46:39] questions.
[46:42] I will just speak my thoughts
[46:43] regarding council compensation.
[46:44] Me specifically I'm a firm
[46:45] believer no matter what position
[46:47] you are in, you should be paid
[46:47] your worth.
[46:50] That's just what I believe.
[46:50] Period.
[46:51] On the other hand, these council
[46:53] positions are pretty broad
[46:55] positions, baded on, you know,
[46:56] the philosophy of the council
[46:58] members, based on discretion and
[47:00] based on what we decide, what we
[47:02] want to do, how much time we
[47:04] want to spend and we know a lot
[47:06] of us spend a lot of time, full
[47:07] time on some of these, you know,
[47:10] on this work.
[47:11] See so I'm interested in, you
[47:14] guess, pushing it to the ballot
[47:15] and see what the constituents
[47:15] say.
[47:17] They know their council members.
[47:19] They are represented by council
[47:20] members and know the work that
[47:22] has been put in recently and in
[47:23] the past and I'm interested in
[47:26] seeing the decision they make.
[47:28] I won't speak personally, I was
[47:29] a legislative aide so I worked
[47:31] in the 1st district and made
[47:32] double almost what I'm making
[47:33] right now.
[47:35] So I totally understand the
[47:35] divide.
[47:37] And I understand both sides of
[47:40] that topic.
[47:43] Regarding council
[47:45] accountability, I'm a strong
[47:46] believer in transparency and
[47:48] accountability and you know,I
[47:49] think what, me specifically,
[47:50] I'll speak for myself again,
[47:54] when I ran, one of my number one
[47:55] principles was accessible
[47:55] leadership.
[47:57] Being attentive, available and
[47:58] showing up, showing up in the
[48:00] community, showing up to council
[48:01] meetings and showing up to
[48:04] boards and all the different
[48:06] things that we are on.
[48:07] Some of the information is
[48:08] already available.
[48:09] It's just not plastered out
[48:11] there and I don't think there
[48:12] should be nothing wrong with
[48:13] showing attend ansz of council
[48:14] members showing, what we are
[48:15] doing.
[48:17] I think a step further and going
[48:18] to show the legislative items we
[48:21] are work on and the commitments
[48:23] we have in the community in our
[48:25] district because then as you
[48:26] stated, it goes back into the
[48:27] number one recommendation to
[48:29] show, yo have increased the
[48:31] pay, what work are they actually
[48:31] doing.
[48:33] How much time are they actually
[48:33] putting in.
[48:34] I don't think there is ever an
[48:36] issue to are me specifically
[48:38] when it comes to transparency,
[48:40] or ctbility for this role.
[48:42] And -- accountability for this
[48:42] role.
[48:45] And I would support there is
[48:47] nothing wrong and it could only
[48:49] benefit the city to ensure there
[48:50] are regular opportunities to
[48:52] reflect and evaluate and make
[48:54] the updates to meet the evolving
[48:55] needs of our community.
[48:56] I look forward to this moving
[48:58] through the process and the
[48:59] residents to be the ones to make
[49:01] the decision hopefully.
[49:01] Thank you.
[49:04] >> Chair: thank you.
[49:05] Council member eblen.
[49:07] >> thank you, chair.
[49:09] My questions have been answered
[49:11] by the questions from my
[49:11] colleagues.
[49:13] I want to thank you for this
[49:13] process.
[49:15] I came into this role as a big
[49:16] fan of civiclex.
[49:18] I think the way it was thought
[49:20] out and the commission members
[49:22] who put a lot of effort into
[49:24] this and your recommendations
[49:24] were outstanding.
[49:26] Thank you for the work and I'm
[49:27] just really impressed by all
[49:29] that went into it and especially
[49:30] what came out of it.
[49:30] so thank you.
[49:34] >> thank you.
[49:35] >> Chair: I want to take a
[49:37] couple of moments to share my
[49:38] thoughts and comments and then
[49:40] I'm going to turn it over to
[49:42] vice mayor wu to wrap things up.
[49:45] But again, I extend my thanks to
[49:46] everyone who has been involved
[49:50] in this.
[49:52] I have -- I'm really excited
[49:53] about the level of engagement
[49:55] that we have gotten from the
[49:55] community on this.
[49:57] So you heard a couple of us
[49:59] already say like we tend to hear
[50:00] from the same people over and
[50:03] over again.
[50:08] And and it's great and we want
[50:10] to hear from them, we also want
[50:11] to hear from the broader
[50:11] community.
[50:13] I'm interested to do a year from
[50:15] now, where are they now on our
[50:16] civic assemblymembers.
[50:18] Like did you stay engaged or
[50:20] like how did you get involved in
[50:22] local government in other ways?
[50:26] Did we get you into a board or a
[50:26] commission?
[50:28] Or participate in some other way
[50:30] with our local government?
[50:32] But I would also be interested
[50:35] to see if there is a way for us
[50:37] to engage over 300 people that
[50:38] returned their postcard that
[50:39] said they would be willing to
[50:41] give of their time in this way
[50:45] because we definitely want that
[50:46] broader caption, like vice mayor
[50:49] wu was talking about, the pie
[50:52] charts and how well represented
[50:55] the assembly was based on the
[50:56] data that we have about our
[50:58] community and my researcher
[51:00] heart was like, yes.
[51:01] I love to see it.
[51:03] But I would like to see that in
[51:06] all of our issues that come
[51:07] before council when we get
[51:08] feedback from the community.
[51:09] I want to see the data that
[51:11] looks like that when we are
[51:14] looking at the demographics.
[51:15] I applaud ow that effort because
[51:17] I know it was not small.
[51:19] I want to see how we can keep
[51:22] people engabbinged that spent --
[51:23] engaged that spent all this time
[51:25] learning about government and
[51:27] keep them involved.
[51:28] And then.
[51:31] I will be interested to see how
[51:33] the conversation and definition
[51:36] around attendance goes on the
[51:43] accountability piece we have our
[51:45] standing committee meetings,
[51:47] work seases and budget meetings
[51:48] that are fixed.
[51:49] Quite often we also serve in
[51:50] council member seats on boards
[51:51] and commissions.
[51:53] So likely that be a part of the
[51:54] attendance reporting?
[51:56] Like how will we define that
[51:57] piece.
[52:03] I will follow along I think
[52:04] that's interesting.
[52:05] If we are going to talk about
[52:07] this at the JUNE 2 work session,
[52:08] we will need to discuss how this
[52:10] moves from committee to work
[52:10] session.
[52:12] So I'm going to turn the mic
[52:14] over vice mayor wu to discuss
[52:16] what actions we MAY need to
[52:16] take.
[52:20] >> thank you, chair.
[52:23] Just adding to chair sheehan's
[52:24] comments about partnerships, I
[52:26] feel like we have activated 30
[52:27] something potential community
[52:28] champions for lexington.
[52:30] So I hope this is not the last
[52:33] time you will show up in council
[52:33] chambers.
[52:35] We love for you all to get on
[52:36] boards and commissions.
[52:37] We have 70 boards and
[52:38] commissions in the city.
[52:39] anything you are interested or
[52:40] passionate about, there is
[52:41] probably a board out there for
[52:43] you and you are always welcome
[52:45] to contact me or the rest of
[52:47] council on questions and kind of
[52:51] how to manufacture in that
[52:51] direction.
[52:53] I want to address one comment
[52:54] council member sevigny made
[52:56] about the accountability piece
[52:56] of it.
[52:58] Like could we not just do our
[53:00] own thing in terms of creating
[53:05] our own ordinances and
[53:07] resolutions.
[53:09] I like the idea of putting
[53:10] something on the ballot that
[53:12] gives us a little flexibility
[53:15] and also holds us account.
[53:17] Changing the ballot is harder
[53:19] than changing an ordinance.
[53:21] It can be undone fairly easily.
[53:23] As opposed to a ballot
[53:24] initiative if we didn't like
[53:25] that particular item in the
[53:28] ballot, you know, hopefully in
[53:29] eight years, somebody will make
[53:30] a different kind of
[53:31] recommendation.
[53:32] So I like things being codified
[53:33] that way.
[53:36] Before I make my motion,
[53:37] MS. Anderson, can you talk us
[53:39] through, if this item moves out
[53:40] of committee today, can you give
[53:42] us a quick timeline all the way
[53:44] to election day in NOVEMBER?
[53:51] >> yes, so working backwards,
[53:53] election day is novemberment
[53:54] deadline for questions in the
[53:55] ballot is the first week of
[53:55] AUGUST.
[53:58] I believe this year it is AUGUST 3 or 4.
[53:59] And that is when the language
[54:02] has to be turned over to the
[54:05] count clerk to end up on the
[54:06] ballot.
[54:07] So council would just need to
[54:10] make their final -- your final
[54:12] vote to meet that deadline.
[54:15] In terms of crafting the
[54:18] language, I think that we are
[54:19] still interested -- this is
[54:21] really the first time we have
[54:22] convened the assembly since our
[54:23] final session.
[54:24] And we are certainly also
[54:26] willing to help work on the
[54:28] language, but that would be the
[54:29] ultimate timeline.
[54:30] >> I appreciate that.
[54:32] I think with that timeline, if
[54:34] it is the intent of this council
[54:37] to potentially put things on the
[54:38] ballot, my recommendation would
[54:40] be that we do it before summer
[54:41] break because we are not back
[54:44] the first week of AUGUST into
[54:44] session.
[54:47] So with that in mind, I move to
[54:49] accept the recommendations of
[54:51] the civic assembly regarding
[54:53] council compensation council
[54:54] accountability and charter
[54:58] review as set forth in today's
[55:00] presentation and refer the
[55:02] amendments regarding the same to
[55:04] full council on work session
[55:05] JUNE 2.
[55:06] >> second.
[55:07] >> Chair: we have a motion and a
[55:07] second.
[55:10] Any discussion on the motion?
[55:11] Council member brown.
[55:14] >> thank you, thank you, chair.
[55:16] Just to be clear.
[55:18] This is not accepting the
[55:19] recommendations as presented.
[55:20] This is just moving it forward
[55:23] to the full council to consider.
[55:24] >> that's correct.
[55:29] >> thank you.
[55:31] >> Chair: can we clarify because
[55:33] you say I move to accept the
[55:39] recommendation.
[55:41] >> I think -- I mean ultimately
[55:44] like this committee can't make a
[55:45] final vote on putting things on
[55:46] the ballot.
[55:48] so I'm okay with that language
[55:50] if it is the understanding of
[55:51] council that we are moving it
[55:53] out of ggp, into full work
[55:55] session for that discussion on
[55:57] whether or not we want to move
[55:59] these potential ballot measures
[56:00] forward.
[56:02] >> Chair: and then to be clear,
[56:03] the JUNE 2 reportout we might
[56:06] have changes to the language
[56:07] that could be presented to the
[56:09] full council during that report
[56:12] out discussion and then JUNE 4
[56:14] and 9 would be first and second
[56:19] reading if it passes on JUNE 2.
[56:19] MR. Cravens.
[56:21] >> yes, I think accepted in this
[56:24] context means you are receiving
[56:25] their recommendations.
[56:27] You are not actually approving
[56:28] their recommendations.
[56:29] You are accepting them.
[56:31] And just so you are aware, what
[56:34] I would like to do to facilitate
[56:35] your conversation on JUNE 2 is
[56:38] have a draft ordinance with the
[56:40] changes that we worked on with
[56:42] civiclex to kind of capture as
[56:43] best we can and resolve some of
[56:44] the discussion points talked
[56:46] about today so that we are not
[56:48] just talking a vacuum on JUNE 2.
[56:50] We have something we can
[56:53] actually act upon or you can act
[56:53] upon.
[56:54] >> thank you for the
[56:56] clarification on the language.
[57:00] Any other discussion?
[57:02] All those in favor?
[57:04] >> aye.
[57:06] >> Chair: any opposed?
[57:07] That motion passes.
[57:08] Thank you everyone.
[57:10] And I just want to add one quick
[57:12] thanks as well to lex tv because
[57:16] I know that they worked very
[57:17] hard on live streaming and
[57:20] making the session are available
[57:22] to folks outside of the meeting.
[57:25] so thank you.
[57:25] Okay.
[57:30] Our next item on our agenda is
[57:32] the landlord and tenant advisory
[57:37] groups presentation on how this
[57:37] initiative is going.
[57:43] This is council member lynch's
[57:44] item in committee.
[57:45] I'm going to turn it over to
[57:46] director lanter and council
[57:48] member lynch will give us some
[57:49] closing remarks toward the end.
[57:51] Take it away, director or
[57:52] commissioner, sorry.
[57:55] >> did you want to do an
[57:56] introduction?
[57:56] Great.
[57:58] I will begin with the
[57:58] presentation that is
[57:59] significantly less interesting
[58:00] than the charter.
[58:02] I appreciate you all having us
[58:03] out to talk about this.
[58:05] The landlord-tenant advisory
[58:07] group this is a straightforward.
[58:08] You MAY recall something we have
[58:09] been working on in our office
[58:12] really since the inception phs
[58:13] office almost four years ago and
[58:14] that is just to make sure that
[58:17] we are building feedback loops
[58:18] into the divisions so that the
[58:22] work they do is informed by both
[58:23] of these groups because those
[58:25] are the two groups that their
[58:26] work impacts the most and also
[58:29] that we are hearing from them,
[58:30] what their needs are in the
[58:39] community.
[58:43] 2023 we originally had this as a
[58:46] more inform al group, and they
[58:48] met quarterly.
[58:50] The landlord and tenant groups
[58:51] each met quarterly.
[58:54] It started when we had some
[58:56] requests for more tenant
[58:57] representation on boards and
[58:58] commissions which itself is a
[59:01] complex issue that we can talk
[59:04] about that we have been working
[59:04] on.
[59:06] The biggest barrier to that
[59:07] often is memberships on boards
[59:09] and commissions as all of us
[59:11] know, can be very time consuming
[59:16] and require a lot of meetings
[59:18] and not always conducive to
[59:19] people's personal schedules and
[59:20] family schedules so we tried to
[59:22] make this as simple and easy for
[59:23] these folks as we can to be
[59:25] heard and to influence our
[59:36] policy as an office not formally
[59:38] reporting and the agenda is fed
[59:40] by the division so they feed up
[59:44] into the commissioner's office
[59:45] and back down from the meeting,
[59:47] the feedback that we get from
[59:48] the two groups.
[59:50] Just taking a look at the
[59:50] landlord advisory group.
[59:52] This one started out with a
[59:52] group of 12.
[59:54] And we worked really hard to try
[59:56] and choose the different sort of
[59:58] sectors of the market to make
[1:00:00] sure that the different types of
[1:00:02] landlord were represented.
[1:00:06] The issues that a corporate
[1:00:09] owner with 400 units faces are
[1:00:13] significantly different than a
[1:00:14] rental units.
[1:00:16] And we, we are successful at
[1:00:17] building a group that
[1:00:19] represented all of them.
[1:00:21] These are some of the topics
[1:00:23] that the group has looked at.
[1:00:23] Basically everything you can
[1:00:24] think of.
[1:00:26] We have spent some time on with
[1:00:29] both the landlord and the tenant
[1:00:29] groups.
[1:00:32] As you can see, it is most more
[1:00:34] focused on building and property
[1:00:35] maintenance, code enforcement.
[1:00:36] Code is there every time talking
[1:00:37] to them.
[1:00:39] We have had other divisions come
[1:00:40] in, planning has come in and
[1:00:43] talked to them about the urban
[1:00:43] growth management zota and so
[1:00:45] it's just a great way to reach
[1:00:47] that group without having to,
[1:00:51] you know, do it so informally.
[1:00:52] More recently we are looking to
[1:00:55] kind of revitalize this group.
[1:00:57] As you can imagine, they can be
[1:00:58] difficult to get together.
[1:01:01] We have tried different meeting
[1:01:01] times.
[1:01:03] We feed them, buy them lunch.
[1:01:05] And we get good attendance from
[1:01:08] certain groups, not so good
[1:01:08] attendance from others.
[1:01:10] What I have tried to do is
[1:01:13] branch out and so for the groups
[1:01:15] that we are not seeing which
[1:01:17] tend to be the larger ones, the
[1:01:18] more corporate entities that
[1:01:19] don't come in, I'm going to
[1:01:20] them.
[1:01:22] And so we recently joined the
[1:01:24] central kentucky apartment
[1:01:26] association's advisory committee
[1:01:27] for public advocacy.
[1:01:30] I sit in on all those meetings
[1:01:31] to hear what their issues are
[1:01:33] and bring them back to the
[1:01:33] group.
[1:01:34] We MAY not be able to meet with
[1:01:36] everyone in the group but we are
[1:01:36] still hearing them.
[1:01:38] And we are going to revitalize
[1:01:40] that membership because some of
[1:01:42] our folks have fallen off and we
[1:01:44] are replacing them with new
[1:01:46] groups and we'll get the new
[1:01:48] group kicked off this summer.
[1:01:50] Probably healthy, to be honest
[1:01:52] with you, that we do flush out
[1:01:55] the membership every so often.
[1:01:57] Flush out is probably not the
[1:01:58] best word.
[1:02:01] Transition or turnover, for
[1:02:03] fresh ideas and new
[1:02:03] perspectives.
[1:02:05] Tenant advisory group, same
[1:02:06] approach.
[1:02:07] We wanted to represent as many
[1:02:08] different groups as possible
[1:02:10] within the subset of renters.
[1:02:13] So you've got families with
[1:02:14] children but you also have
[1:02:16] people who experienced
[1:02:16] homelessness, seniors, people
[1:02:18] who live in housing authority
[1:02:19] property.
[1:02:22] We tried to account for every
[1:02:25] possible angle for a renter;
[1:02:26] which can be difficult.
[1:02:28] You can imagine we had our
[1:02:29] biggest attendance challenges
[1:02:29] with this group.
[1:02:34] We have tried offering night
[1:02:38] meetings, food, child care.
[1:02:39] We have offered everything you
[1:02:41] can offer and we tend to get
[1:02:44] about 50 to 30% attendance on a
[1:02:45] good day.
[1:02:47] So that was extremely
[1:02:47] challenging.
[1:02:49] We had one meeting that we went
[1:02:50] to and none of the members
[1:02:53] showed up for the meeting.
[1:03:06] None.
[1:03:07] So we went to the organizations
[1:03:08] that work with the tenants and
[1:03:10] said can you give us people or
[1:03:13] staff to come talk about these
[1:03:13] issues?
[1:03:15] It's not as pure as a pure
[1:03:16] tenant advisory group is because
[1:03:17] it's largely organizations
[1:03:19] although we have added folks who
[1:03:20] are grassroots as we have
[1:03:21] encountered them.
[1:03:23] We have a very low barrier to
[1:03:24] you joining us in this group.
[1:03:26] It's very informal but we do at
[1:03:28] least get people to come and so
[1:03:30] we are getting some productive
[1:03:31] conversations out of those.
[1:03:32] The last one was actually quite
[1:03:32] good.
[1:03:34] And we are going to continue to
[1:03:36] work with that group to bring in
[1:03:37] more actual tenants and make
[1:03:43] sure the tenants they work with
[1:03:45] to make sure they're all
[1:03:45] represented.
[1:03:47] they have met now five times.
[1:03:52] This is the newly reconstituted
[1:04:11] group.
[1:04:12] You both fell off at different
[1:04:13] points along the way and had to
[1:04:15] be picked up and rejuvenated and
[1:04:17] we are still in the process with
[1:04:17] one of them.
[1:04:19] The landlord group although we
[1:04:20] are very much in communications
[1:04:23] with those members.
[1:04:24] Happy to take questions but that
[1:04:32] is where we stand as of today.
[1:04:34] >> Chair: colleagues sign in if
[1:04:36] you would like to have a comment
[1:04:37] or a question.
[1:04:38] Council member brown.
[1:04:39] >> thank you, chair and thank
[1:04:43] you commissioner for the
[1:04:44] presentation.
[1:04:46] Was today's presentation fyi, to
[1:04:47] let us know your efforts.
[1:04:49] >> an update on how it has been
[1:04:49] going.
[1:04:52] >> okay.
[1:04:53] Commissioner, what do you think
[1:04:54] moving forward?
[1:04:55] Do you think these groups need
[1:04:58] to be codified in some form of
[1:05:06] an official board or commission
[1:05:08] to maybe give recommendations.
[1:05:09] >> I would caution against that.
[1:05:11] We are having a hard enough time
[1:05:13] pulling it together in an
[1:05:14] informal basis.
[1:05:16] Formalizing it would make it
[1:05:17] more difficult and would create
[1:05:18] an obligation for the office and
[1:05:20] if the group doesn't meet, I
[1:05:23] have to find them and pull them
[1:05:24] together and reschedule it to
[1:05:25] meet the ordinance requirement.
[1:05:27] I think the informal nature of
[1:05:30] it allows it to be more flexible
[1:05:32] with memberships, with topics,
[1:05:33] all of the things because so far
[1:05:35] we have not been able to get
[1:05:36] either of these groups into
[1:05:38] enough of a routine that I would
[1:05:39] be comfortable saying that if
[1:05:41] you codified this, I could
[1:05:42] promise you in two years it will
[1:05:45] be running like a train.
[1:05:46] The two groups themselves are
[1:05:47] not super engaged with the
[1:05:48] government.
[1:05:50] You have to really massage that
[1:05:54] to get it.
[1:05:56] >> would you rather leave these
[1:05:58] as unofficial ad hoc groups that
[1:06:00] you bring together and have the
[1:06:03] opportunity to bounce ideas off,
[1:06:05] and policies and get feedback%
[1:06:06] and see if it is something you
[1:06:06] can grow?
[1:06:09] >> that's worked well for us so
[1:06:09] far.
[1:06:10] >> let me ask this.
[1:06:11] In regards to because it sounds
[1:06:13] like you are really having a
[1:06:15] hard time convening the tenant
[1:06:17] group and you tried everything
[1:06:18] as far as bringing them here.
[1:06:20] Have you tried going out to them
[1:06:21] like having them attend a
[1:06:23] meeting in a public accessible
[1:06:23] space?
[1:06:25] >> we have and we actually do
[1:06:26] that.
[1:06:27] I didn't add it to this
[1:06:29] presentation, but I know you all
[1:06:31] are aware we have our landlord
[1:06:33] and tenant rights and
[1:06:34] responsibilities forum that take
[1:06:35] place throughout the district.
[1:06:37] Those have been enormously
[1:06:37] successful.
[1:06:38] And they serve a similar
[1:06:39] function in that we are still
[1:06:40] engaging with the populations
[1:06:41] and presenting programs to them
[1:06:43] and we are hearing feedback from
[1:06:43] them.
[1:06:45] I go it way better attendance at
[1:06:47] those than I do the formal
[1:06:48] committees and groups.
[1:06:50] Part of that is because we are
[1:06:51] going out in the community but
[1:06:52] we tried that with the tenant
[1:06:52] group.
[1:06:54] we held that out in the
[1:06:55] community and nobody showed up
[1:06:56] for that.
[1:06:58] A lot of it is how are you
[1:06:59] engaging with them.
[1:07:01] If we say do you want to be on a
[1:07:02] big formal government committee,
[1:07:05] they MAY not be as interested in
[1:07:07] that but if I say I'm going to
[1:07:10] have a forum where you can be
[1:07:11] heard on housing, that seems to
[1:07:12] have more appeal.
[1:07:13] >> I can see that, where folks
[1:07:15] are invited to be part of this
[1:07:16] more official group and they're
[1:07:17] not comfortable with speaking
[1:07:19] about their personal
[1:07:19] situation...
[1:07:21] >> I think that's a lot of it.
[1:07:23] Because a lot of people, their
[1:07:25] experience as a tenant and
[1:07:26] things they would want to talk
[1:07:28] about in a group setting are
[1:07:28] very personal things.
[1:07:31] It has to do with your finances,
[1:07:32] medical history sometimes,
[1:07:33] things that you MAY not want to
[1:07:38] openly share about.
[1:07:40] >> I'm interested in seeing what
[1:07:41] my colleagues say.
[1:07:43] I appreciate you taking the
[1:07:44] initiative and convening the
[1:07:45] groups and trying to get
[1:07:46] feedback and elevating the
[1:07:48] voices as we deal with housing.
[1:07:50] Thank you, chair.
[1:07:50] >> Chair: council member curtis.
[1:07:51] >> thank you, chair.
[1:07:53] And thank you, commissioner
[1:07:56] lanter for all of your work on
[1:07:57] this, council member lynch as
[1:07:57] well.
[1:08:00] I have been very impressed by
[1:08:02] the flexibility y'all have shown
[1:08:04] in just making this work one way
[1:08:05] or another.
[1:08:08] I did have a quick question for
[1:08:09] you, commissioner, if you might
[1:08:11] be willing to expand on
[1:08:12] something which was you talked
[1:08:14] about the importance of having
[1:08:19] not just the property owners but
[1:08:20] property managers showing up to
[1:08:21] the landlord group.
[1:08:23] Could you speak to the
[1:08:24] significance of that and to the
[1:08:26] changes that, you know, come as
[1:08:27] a result of that?
[1:08:28] >> that's actually a really good
[1:08:30] point because those are two very
[1:08:31] different constituencies, you
[1:08:33] know, and in some cases very
[1:08:35] small property the owner MAY be
[1:08:37] the property manager but in most
[1:08:39] cases the average citizen deal
[1:08:40] when they're renting, are
[1:08:41] dealing with the property
[1:08:42] manager.
[1:08:43] They MAY never know who the
[1:08:43] owner is.
[1:08:46] So what we really like to do is
[1:08:47] engage with whoever the person
[1:08:50] the tenant is interacting with.
[1:08:51] Is it the owner?
[1:08:51] Great.
[1:08:53] If not the property manager.
[1:08:55] Property management is a whole
[1:08:56] different ball game.
[1:08:58] A lot of changes in that
[1:08:58] industry.
[1:09:00] It's very difficult, short
[1:09:00] staffed, under funded.
[1:09:02] A lot of times just getting
[1:09:04] their time can be difficult,
[1:09:04] too.
[1:09:06] But we've had a really good
[1:09:08] experience working with the
[1:09:09] central kentucky apartment
[1:09:09] association.
[1:09:10] They have been very
[1:09:11] collaborative and they represent
[1:09:13] a lot of those large property
[1:09:15] managers and they feed into that
[1:09:17] group so we are getting a lot of
[1:09:18] good feedback from them.
[1:09:20] >> I'm glad to hear that,
[1:09:22] speaking as a renter myself, I
[1:09:24] can tell you I have interacted
[1:09:25] with my property managers
[1:09:28] several times and I have never
[1:09:29] once actually met a landlord
[1:09:33] that I have had in person.
[1:09:35] I think that is often left out
[1:09:36] of the discussion and I
[1:09:38] appreciate you all highlighting
[1:09:38] that.
[1:09:40] Building off what council member
[1:09:43] brown had to say, I do just want
[1:09:45] to add that when we are having
[1:09:47] these conversations about
[1:09:51] tenants showing up and what not,
[1:09:56] there is a fundamental inkwik
[1:09:59] between -- inequity when between
[1:10:03] tenants and landlords when it
[1:10:04] comes between the economy of
[1:10:06] money and time and energy so I
[1:10:08] don't want anybody in the public
[1:10:10] or on this legislative body to
[1:10:12] mistake the difficulties with
[1:10:16] attendance for that group as a
[1:10:19] lack of need or lack of interest
[1:10:20] from tenants in the community
[1:10:21] because I can tell you for a
[1:10:23] fact that is not the case and
[1:10:25] I'm sure commissioner lanter and
[1:10:27] council member lynch, not to put
[1:10:29] words in your mouths, I'm sure
[1:10:31] would you say the same things.
[1:10:33] So I want to make sure that we
[1:10:34] are considering that.
[1:10:34] >> absolutely.
[1:10:36] I think it was clear but I want
[1:10:38] to make sure and reiterate the
[1:10:40] two groups are very separate and
[1:10:42] distinct for that railroad
[1:10:42] reason.
[1:10:44] We did not want to put the two
[1:10:46] in the room together and say
[1:10:47] okay y'all, fight it out.
[1:10:48] That wouldn't work well.
[1:10:50] We keep them very separate.
[1:10:50] >> thank you.
[1:10:52] I appreciate your dedication to
[1:10:53] this work, commissioner because
[1:10:54] we are better for it.
[1:10:55] Thank you, chair.
[1:10:57] That's all.
[1:10:59] >> Chair: council member
[1:11:02] reynolds.
[1:11:03] >> thank you, chair and thank
[1:11:04] you, commissioner.
[1:11:05] I really appreciate your
[1:11:06] willingness to try to make this
[1:11:08] work in one way or another, and
[1:11:10] to include the voices of both
[1:11:12] the landlords and the tenants.
[1:11:14] I will echo -- I feel like over
[1:11:16] my time on council, one of my
[1:11:18] greatest challenges has been
[1:11:20] communicating with tenants.
[1:11:22] It's really hard because
[1:11:23] sometimes you don't have access
[1:11:25] to leaving flyers at their door,
[1:11:29] you don't have access to
[1:11:30] gathering people from an
[1:11:32] apartment complex.
[1:11:33] It's just really challenging on
[1:11:35] a lot of levels.
[1:11:37] I see a little bit of your goals
[1:11:41] in here with the groups, but do
[1:11:43] you have like a specific goal
[1:11:45] and mission that maybe or maybe
[1:11:47] is there a way to incorporate
[1:11:49] that a little bit more firmly
[1:11:51] that would make people feel like
[1:11:53] they really have a buy-in both
[1:11:55] on the tenant and landlord side?
[1:11:56] >> yeah, I think it's good you
[1:11:57] brought that up.
[1:11:59] One of the things that tiffany
[1:12:01] and I talked about as we
[1:12:04] reconstitute it and bring life
[1:12:05] back into the groups was
[1:12:06] specifically that.
[1:12:08] And I think groups work best
[1:12:10] when that comes from them.
[1:12:12] So our first agenda item with
[1:12:14] each one in the landlord one we
[1:12:16] haven't done this with yet is
[1:12:17] what do you want to know and
[1:12:19] what do you want to talk about?
[1:12:21] What do we want to discuss?
[1:12:24] I will put things on there that
[1:12:26] I know we need to hear from and
[1:12:27] feedback, but we try to make
[1:12:29] sure that it is driven by what
[1:12:30] are the issues that the tenants
[1:12:32] themselves are facing.
[1:12:34] Often what that ends up look
[1:12:38] looking like in the meeting is
[1:12:42] very specific complaints.
[1:12:44] Tenants talking about, I had
[1:12:46] this issue or I had this issue
[1:12:47] because it's very difficult for
[1:12:49] an individual to sit back and
[1:12:51] have a policy conversation when
[1:12:53] their water heater doesn't work
[1:12:55] or their A.C. Doesn't work.
[1:12:57] And so what I'm trying to do is
[1:12:59] work through the context to say,
[1:13:01] okay, you are telling me your
[1:13:03] water heater doesn't work and
[1:13:04] that there is mold in your
[1:13:04] apartment.
[1:13:06] I think what we are hearing for
[1:13:08] the purpose of this meeting is
[1:13:09] the property manager is not
[1:13:11] responsive.
[1:13:12] So let's talk about how do we
[1:13:14] work on responsiveness of
[1:13:16] property managers opposed to how
[1:13:17] do I fix your water heater
[1:13:19] because that's not something we
[1:13:20] can personally do although we do
[1:13:21] try to help when we can.
[1:13:24] >> I think that makes a lot of
[1:13:24] sense.
[1:13:26] I also think that when we are
[1:13:29] asking people to have a buy-in,
[1:13:32] whether it's a time, an hour,
[1:13:33] four times, you know, a year or
[1:13:37] whatever that is, if they don't
[1:13:38] have a clear understanding from
[1:13:41] the very beginning of what their
[1:13:43] time and energy is going to help
[1:13:47] with or change or I think it
[1:13:48] could include time where you
[1:13:50] talk were what are their needs,
[1:13:52] but something that catches their
[1:13:55] attention to even be a part of
[1:13:57] it, then I often see it doesn't
[1:13:58] work because often times
[1:13:59] neighborhood associations, you
[1:14:01] can say come to this
[1:14:02] neighborhood association meeting
[1:14:04] and we will have pizza.
[1:14:06] We will have child care,
[1:14:07] whatever, but why are they
[1:14:07] coming?
[1:14:09] They don't know why, going to
[1:14:11] the neighborhood association
[1:14:14] meeting, why taking their time
[1:14:16] what that is going to do to make
[1:14:18] a difference in their iferred
[1:14:19] lives and these people are busy.
[1:14:21] These people are working a lot%
[1:14:23] of hours and they need to know
[1:14:23] their why.
[1:14:25] Why should I be there
[1:14:27] specifically, in addition to
[1:14:30] having a chance to talk about
[1:14:32] whatever you feel like is a
[1:14:32] concern.
[1:14:36] So that's a suggestion that I
[1:14:37] have because I think people want
[1:14:41] to do good things, but we are
[1:14:43] all so busy and tired, that
[1:14:45] unless there is I specific
[1:14:47] reason, we might not be willing
[1:14:49] to buy into whatever that is.
[1:14:50] >> I think you are absolutely
[1:14:50] right.
[1:14:51] I think I understand what you
[1:14:52] are saying.
[1:14:54] There is a big difference of
[1:14:57] asking someone to come to a
[1:14:57] general government business
[1:14:59] meeting about housing.
[1:15:01] If you reframe that ask as would
[1:15:02] you like to tell me about the
[1:15:03] problems you are having as a
[1:15:06] renter and with your landlord,
[1:15:07] you are giving them a chance to
[1:15:08] discus something specific they
[1:15:10] can connect with.
[1:15:11] But I think you are -- what you
[1:15:14] are saying there has to be an
[1:15:14] outcome.
[1:15:15] There has to be a goal.
[1:15:17] >> it can't just be a general
[1:15:19] come tell us how to make things
[1:15:19] better.
[1:15:20] I think you are right.
[1:15:21] I think that is part of the
[1:15:22] issue.
[1:15:23] Hey, do you want to be on our
[1:15:24] feedback group.
[1:15:25] Without them knowing what the
[1:15:26] group is going to talk about,
[1:15:27] there is less interest.
[1:15:28] >> exactly.
[1:15:28] Thank you.
[1:15:30] Thank you, chair.
[1:15:30] >> Chair: vice mayor wu.
[1:15:31] >> thank you, chair.
[1:15:33] Thank you, commissioner for all
[1:15:35] of this work.
[1:15:37] In the list of the organizations
[1:15:39] for tenant advisory group, you
[1:15:41] said there are 12 organizations.
[1:15:43] I count nine here.
[1:15:45] Kentucky tenants is a part of
[1:15:45] this advisory group?
[1:15:47] >> they have been.
[1:15:49] They have not participated
[1:15:51] regularly once it got going.
[1:15:52] But they're invited.
[1:15:54] >> and thinking about kind of
[1:15:56] your role in sort of
[1:15:58] facilitating both these groups
[1:16:00] who have obviously a lot of
[1:16:03] friction and conflict, kind of
[1:16:04] inherently, have you been able
[1:16:05] to or do you feel like it's your
[1:16:07] role at all to not necessarily
[1:16:10] mediate but to convey the
[1:16:11] complaints or challenges or
[1:16:13] issues that one group has sort
[1:16:16] of like citing the other because
[1:16:18] I know landlords will complain
[1:16:19] about their tenants as well for
[1:16:21] all these reasons and vice
[1:16:22] versa.
[1:16:23] Have you felt like that's a part
[1:16:24] of your role?
[1:16:26] Should it be a part of your
[1:16:26] role?
[1:16:27] Are you able to do that?
[1:16:29] >> that's a really excellent
[1:16:30] question because we've dabbled
[1:16:33] in that with these two groups
[1:16:38] and it doesn't always go well.
[1:16:39] If tenants are giving me a
[1:16:40] consistent theme of something
[1:16:41] they're complaining about and I
[1:16:44] go to landlords and I say hey,
[1:16:45] tenants are saying you guys are
[1:16:47] doing this, x, y, z.
[1:16:49] They just immediately go into
[1:16:50] defensive mode of no we are not
[1:16:52] or the tenants are not telling
[1:16:54] you all the facts amend of.
[1:16:55] And the reverse is true as well.
[1:16:57] Like if I go to the tenants and
[1:16:58] say well the landlords are
[1:17:00] saying you guys destroy their
[1:17:02] units or whatever, they give me
[1:17:03] the exact same thing.
[1:17:05] There is such a divide between
[1:17:07] the two, just trying, a
[1:17:09] government office trying to
[1:17:12] mediate two esoteric groups is
[1:17:12] really hard.
[1:17:14] I think we have had more success
[1:17:16] in trying to do that in a
[1:17:18] smaller one on one or two on one
[1:17:19] kind of setting.
[1:17:21] We have had conversations emerge
[1:17:24] from the groups that led to
[1:17:24] that.
[1:17:26] But probably what I would say is
[1:17:27] one of the things we've learned
[1:17:29] not to do is that because it has
[1:17:30] led to some hurt feelings.
[1:17:33] >> to build on what council
[1:17:34] member reynolds was saying, kind
[1:17:35] of, I feel like you were
[1:17:37] speaking to kind of what is the
[1:17:42] purpose or mission of these
[1:17:44] groups have there been any
[1:17:45] concrete recommendations from
[1:17:48] the groups, towards lfucg or our
[1:17:53] policies, things like that.
[1:17:56] >> a good example would be the
[1:17:57] housing stability program which
[1:17:58] I will be presenting on next
[1:17:58] week.
[1:18:00] The lalled program that -- legal
[1:18:03] aid program that provides access
[1:18:03] to council.
[1:18:06] That program was designed with
[1:18:07] these two groups.
[1:18:10] As this program was originally
[1:18:13] built, both groups gave feedback
[1:18:15] on the program design as it was
[1:18:16] built.
[1:18:17] Both groups have things in there
[1:18:19] that they asked for, both groups
[1:18:20] have things in there that they
[1:18:21] did not ask for.
[1:18:23] that has been an enormously
[1:18:26] successful program.
[1:18:27] One could argue one of the
[1:18:29] reasons it was successful is it
[1:18:31] was informed by the two groups
[1:18:32] it impacts the most.
[1:18:35] >> I appreciate that.
[1:18:37] Coming off the heels of the
[1:18:38] assembly, the work they, did
[1:18:39] bringing the recommendation to
[1:18:41] us, woo we decide what to do
[1:18:42] with it.
[1:18:44] I was thinking about that, too.
[1:18:46] Would there be a process formal
[1:18:47] or informal if members of a
[1:18:50] group or majority of the
[1:18:51] landlords or tenants say you
[1:18:53] know what needs to change is
[1:18:54] blank, something we would
[1:18:55] effectuate, I would be
[1:18:57] interested in to see is there a
[1:18:58] process for that?
[1:19:00] Is that just you bringing a
[1:19:01] recommendation to council saying
[1:19:02] hey, we've heard a lot about
[1:19:03] this issuing tisch.
[1:19:05] I think there are some tweaks we
[1:19:07] can make to, I don't know, code
[1:19:08] enforcement regulations whatever
[1:19:12] it is: I would be interested in
[1:19:14] see that because would I hate
[1:19:16] for your time being used as just
[1:19:17] sort of the person receiving
[1:19:20] complaints from one group or the
[1:19:21] other.
[1:19:23] I definitely take your point
[1:19:24] `about these complaints do lead
[1:19:28] to you thinking about either
[1:19:29] widespread issues or common
[1:19:30] issues with either group.
[1:19:32] I just want to make sure that
[1:19:35] your time is used well and the
[1:19:36] folks in these groups are not
[1:19:40] just using it as a venting
[1:19:42] session that MAY or MAY not be
[1:19:42] productive.
[1:19:44] >> that's a serious risk.
[1:19:45] It happens.
[1:19:47] We have had some of the members
[1:19:48] complain about the other members
[1:19:50] saying they would just come in
[1:19:51] to vent ayou will their
[1:19:52] grievances with the government.
[1:19:53] That's true and that's part of
[1:19:55] the reason we are doing some of
[1:19:56] the gasps with the membership,
[1:19:59] to be more productive.
[1:20:02] But there are two ways that
[1:20:02] things come out of this.
[1:20:04] Most of it is incidental.
[1:20:06] It's quick things that we can
[1:20:06] fix.
[1:20:08] They're saying oh, the process
[1:20:14] for getting a new hrbie is this.
[1:20:16] Before the end of the day, I
[1:20:18] have called manage many and we
[1:20:20] fixed it because it was a minor
[1:20:21] miscommunication.
[1:20:23] A lot of that emerges from both
[1:20:24] groups that we can make tweaks
[1:20:26] here or there and make their
[1:20:28] lives easier and respond to
[1:20:28] incidents.
[1:20:29] And then what I try to do over
[1:20:31] the course of the conversations,
[1:20:32] that's where I look for the
[1:20:33] larger policy recommendations.
[1:20:36] I think the process, to your
[1:20:39] speaking to and we have to watch
[1:20:40] for, those two groups rarely
[1:20:41] agree.
[1:20:43] If you have an exit policy
[1:20:44] strategy, have you to make sure
[1:20:46] it accounts for the fact that
[1:20:48] the two of them are saying we've
[1:20:51] reviewed this and we have two
[1:20:51] very different opinions about
[1:20:52] it.
[1:20:53] >> I appreciate it.
[1:20:55] It's very challenging work but I
[1:20:56] appreciate you doing it.
[1:20:58] >> council member sevigny.
[1:20:59] >> thank you, chair and thanks
[1:21:03] so much for the presentation.
[1:21:06] I've got a few ideas.
[1:21:09] And I appreciate what you are
[1:21:10] doing.
[1:21:15] One thought is have you done
[1:21:16] anything virtually?
[1:21:17] Have you done virtual a lot, too
[1:21:18] or not?
[1:21:21] >> not with these groups.
[1:21:22] That's something we have
[1:21:22] considered.
[1:21:25] >> that's one thing.
[1:21:30] And then have you guys thought,
[1:21:32] landlord registration concept is
[1:21:34] kind of -- it doesn't get a lot
[1:21:37] of excitement in general have
[1:21:39] you thought of a tenant
[1:21:45] registration system that would
[1:21:46] strictly be optional that you
[1:21:48] could push and we could push to
[1:21:50] gain tenant information so that
[1:21:52] you have a tenant pool but they
[1:21:53] tell you who the property
[1:21:54] manager is.
[1:21:55] Like where they live, who the
[1:21:59] property manager is and how to
[1:22:00] contact that property manager
[1:22:03] and if they know the owner.
[1:22:06] Or if we can find the owner from
[1:22:07] the address through a cross
[1:22:08] references.
[1:22:10] I'm just kind of wondering if we
[1:22:13] are -- if we enter it from that
[1:22:17] level, like say you had a pool
[1:22:18] of -- say a thousand tenants
[1:22:19] signed up.
[1:22:22] You would at least have a pool
[1:22:24] of people that you might say
[1:22:29] hey, I'm curious on the landlord
[1:22:32] content: you might have a
[1:22:33] survey for them.
[1:22:34] There might be something to fill
[1:22:37] out the survey you entered into
[1:22:45] a 50-dollar gift card trying to
[1:22:47] think of things to drive it from
[1:22:49] the other direction, to get the
[1:22:50] tenants to opt in.
[1:22:52] >> a quick response process.
[1:22:54] And then you have a way to kind
[1:22:56] of at least pump hey, I would
[1:22:59] like to know if tenants are
[1:23:00] feeling x and you send it out
[1:23:07] and see what response you get
[1:23:11] seems super simple.
[1:23:14] I think crowd sourcing any type
[1:23:16] of information we all
[1:23:17] unfortunately we have next door
[1:23:18] and we can look at that.
[1:23:22] So it's just another crowd
[1:23:24] sourcing concept and you might
[1:23:26] do it as a bulletin board.
[1:23:28] >> just want to make sure we
[1:23:29] have all the technological
[1:23:31] pieces in place to make everyone
[1:23:32] comfortable as far as personal
[1:23:36] identity and that kind of stuff
[1:23:42] and they can use they don't have
[1:23:44] on give a last name if they
[1:23:44] don't want to.
[1:23:45] So just a thought.
[1:23:48] I just think it would help you
[1:23:49] get some tenants.
[1:23:51] And you might be able to get
[1:23:53] some information.
[1:23:55] Thanks.
[1:23:56] Appreciate it.
[1:23:57] >> Chair: council member that
[1:23:59] sounds similar to what we do
[1:24:00] with engage lexington, right.
[1:24:02] We can most feedback
[1:24:02] opportunities, people register
[1:24:05] and give us some of their
[1:24:05] information.
[1:24:09] And then they can respond to
[1:24:11] different particular inquiries
[1:24:14] for feedback.
[1:24:16] I think when you say registry,
[1:24:19] sometimes it feels bigger than
[1:24:21] that because when we talk about
[1:24:22] short-term rental registry or
[1:24:26] any kind of like long-term
[1:24:27] rental registry it's a much
[1:24:28] bigger program but I can see
[1:24:29] what you are saying there.
[1:24:32] >> to give you an etch how the
[1:24:34] two groups differ, in very
[1:24:37] distinct incidents, the tent
[1:24:40] groups -- the tenant group has
[1:24:42] strongly asked for a rental
[1:24:43] registry, which there are legal
[1:24:46] questions around and the
[1:24:47] landlord has simultaneously
[1:24:48] insisted that we never do a
[1:24:52] rental registry.
[1:24:53] I have two groups that say don't
[1:24:56] do what the other one says.
[1:24:57] >> thank you, commissioner for
[1:24:58] the presentation but I'm going
[1:25:00] to turn it over to council
[1:25:02] member lynch who had some
[1:25:03] remarks to wrap us up.
[1:25:06] >> thank you, chair and
[1:25:08] commissioner lanter, medicines
[1:25:09] masden for taking this on and
[1:25:12] working with both advisory
[1:25:12] groups.
[1:25:19] Thank you for staying the course
[1:25:21] both groups voices need to be
[1:25:26] heard thank you for the
[1:25:27] facilitation and I will keep
[1:25:29] this item in committee for an
[1:25:31] annual update.
[1:25:32] >> Chair: colleagues, the last
[1:25:34] thing on our jabbed is items
[1:25:36] referred to committee.
[1:25:39] Does anybody have any domestics
[1:25:41] they would like to make about an
[1:25:49] item or remove an item council
[1:25:50] member reynolds you are up
[1:25:50] first.
[1:25:52] >> would I like to remove
[1:25:56] planning and development study
[1:25:58] recommendation eight and
[1:25:58] recommendation 10.
[1:26:00] That looks like it is item 3-z
[1:26:02] and 4 on the items referred list
[1:26:03] so moved.
[1:26:05] >> second.
[1:26:06] >> Chair: motion and second.
[1:26:10] Any discussion on the motion all
[1:26:14] those in favor say aye.
[1:26:16] Any opposed?
[1:26:20] Motion carries.
[1:26:22] >> is that all for yours,
[1:26:23] council member reynolds.
[1:26:24] >> yes.
[1:26:25] >> Chair: council member brown.
[1:26:26] >> thank you, chair.
[1:26:27] Since we just discussed the
[1:26:29] efficiencies in our development
[1:26:30] process and compliance of house
[1:26:32] bill 443, I'm comfortable with
[1:26:35] removing that item if we need to
[1:26:37] get some updates, I think we can
[1:26:43] put this item back in committee.
[1:26:45] A motion and a second.
[1:26:49] Any discussion on the motion?
[1:26:50] okay, all those in favor say
[1:26:51] aye.
[1:26:53] >> aye.
[1:26:54] >> Chair: any opposed?
[1:26:56] That passes as well.
[1:26:58] I don't see anyone else signed
[1:26:58] in.
[1:27:03] I'm going to say my window for
[1:27:06] item discussion is closing: it
[1:27:07] is closed.
[1:27:08] Thank you, everyone.
[1:27:10] Now that we are at the end of
[1:27:12] our agenda I am going to adjourn