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We had some

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more, huh. I don't know who yet. Oh.

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Oh, well, I think we're close enough, huh?

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The rash.

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That's child porn.

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Didn't be looking at that.

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I see that.

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That was too late.

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Council, I will call this meeting to order.

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and with those that wish to please stand for a moment of silent reflection, I see nobody

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for a invocation tonight.

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Thank you. Mr. Wallin, would you lead us in a flag, please?

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please?

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Two of the flag of the United States of America and two republic for which it stands.

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One nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

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So, Clark Davis, would you call the role, please?

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Yes.

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Mayor Jensen.

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I'm here.

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Council Member Boltero.

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Present.

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Council Member Hutchinson.

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Present.

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this is now the specifications.

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New dumping.

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The deputy manager Gregory a train here at today.

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Now so you have the minutes of September 26, 2013.

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What's your pleasure?

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To approve your order and move them

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Seconded to approve the minutes of September 26, 2013.

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Any further comment or discussion?

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Seeing none, all in favor say aye.

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Aye.

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Opposed?

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Motion carries.

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Next is changes to agenda.

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Manager Gregory, do you have any changes?

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Council, do you have any changes you wish to make?

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Seeing none, we'll go to presentations and awards.

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Is there a handcock?

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Are you here?

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Oh, please come forward.

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I thought I saw you out there.

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from the emergency sports shelter.

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Hi.

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I have a proclamation I'll read and then if you come forward and get it and then if you have something to say, please help yourself.

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This is a proclamation of the city of Longview, domestic violence awareness month, October 2013.

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where as domestic violence is a serious white raging crime that affects people of all races, age as income level, sexes and society as a whole.

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And whereas the crime of domestic violence violates an individual's privacy, dignity, security and humanity through the systematic use of physical, emotional, sexual, psychological and economic control and or drug abuse.

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Whereas children who grew up in violent homes are abused and neglected at a rate of 1,500

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percent higher than the national average.

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And whereas domestic violence costs the nation between 5 billion, that's what a B, and 10

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billion also with a B, annually in medical expenses, police and court costs, shelters and

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foster care, sick leave, absenteeism, and non-productivity.

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And whereas only a coordinated community effort will put a stop to this heinous crime

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end.

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Now therefore, I, Don Jensen, mayor of the City of Longview, Washington, do hereby proclaim

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the month of October 2013 as domestic violence awareness month.

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In the City of Longview, I urge all citizens to actively participate in the scheduled activities

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program sponsored by the emergency support shelter to work towards the elimination of

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personal and institutional violence against women and helps shed light on domestic violence

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by actively reporting their concerns to the proper authorities. In wetness, I am here

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to set my hand and cause a seal of City of Longview to be affixed this 10th day of October 2013.

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Please come forward and get this

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proclamation. Thank you very kindly for being here.

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If you have something safe, please do.

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Thank you so much, Mayor and council members.

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I mean, just hearing you read that again is so powerful

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to hear out loud and to say we as a city

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and community commit to nonviolence in our community

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and to recognize this as a system,

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community church neighborhood and family problem.

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So, yes, I'm Sarah from Emergency Support Shelter, and we serve victims of crime, sexual

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assault, domestic violence, of course, long view, and as well as Callett's County.

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Each day we see people who have been verbally, emotionally, physically, financially abused,

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children, women, men, the cycle of power and control, and we hear their stories of tremendous

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unimaginable courage and bravery to somehow escape every story is different.

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And I'm always honored and humbled to hear people share their story.

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And I honestly don't know what I would be able to do in that same situation.

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It's very heroic.

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And as we know, people die trying to escape.

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People die stuck in the relationship of power and control.

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And I saw something on the internet about that said domestic violence awareness month

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and the awareness was crossed out and it said action, domestic violence action month.

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And I thought that was really fitting, especially for tonight, that the leaders of our community

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are saying, yes, let's take action, this is an important issue.

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No more excuses, no silence.

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We got to talk about this and start conversations about healthy relationships and non-violence

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in our homes and our communities.

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So I thank you for standing with us in the work we do every day and making that commitment.

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And it says a lot and makes a statement to our community as a whole where you stand on

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this issue.

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So thank you very much.

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Thank you very kindly for all that you do.

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We appreciate it.

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Thank you.

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next

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we have constituent comments let me get my little spiel uncovered here so

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that we can do this. Constituent comments is a portion of the meeting council

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set aside to take comments on items that are not on the agenda. Persons

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addressing a council are not specifically scheduled on the agenda will be

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requested to step up to the podium. Speak their name and city of residence into

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the microphone for the city clerk's record. Individuals are allowed three minutes whether representing a

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group or an individual viewpoint. The light on the timer will turn yellow when you have one minute

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left, turn red when your time is up. The total time allotted for constituent comment is 30 minutes.

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If there are additional people wishing to speak, we will take those comments at the end of the

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meeting prior to adjournment. One of the cornerstones of democracy is the right of the

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minority to speak to the issue. Because of this, we do not allow any clapping, cheering,

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or any other form of demonstration during comment period. This could be intimidating to

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those supporting the minority position. Curious and civil comments are expected. Drogatory

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remarks and personal attacks are not acceptable and will be caused for the constituent's

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comments, time to be revoked. Thank you for your understanding and for coming to the council meeting tonight.

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Mr. Wells.

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Oh,

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I'm pretty well with a long view. Um, I've been here for a while. I heard what people talk about the coal that wants to come to

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Longview. I want to say that if this does being 300 plus jobs to Longview, then I think that the city of Longview should really think about

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a concerted because of the way up in the line with the Montana. He was dealing with

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a cold place and he said there was no cold stuff in the air. I was born and raised in

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this town and I love long view on my heart and we now know that this is in comedy right

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now that it's not as used to be. It's going back to where it's supposed to be but I for

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one if there is a chance for a 300-foot of jobs in this town then I think that the state

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I love you to consider it.

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I know a lot of people are against the coal,

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but if it does not bring hazardous things to the air

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and if it's clean things to the air, I'm for it.

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But I think people realize that did they just study it

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before they against it?

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Because like I said, with this, this is a people town.

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We were half in the coming to the mint farm already.

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But like I said, if this coal terminal does come in

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and it does provide clean air and three-inch jobs,

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that's something the lobby needs.

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And I know a lot of people have heard that they're against coal, but there's people all for it and people are against it.

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I for one, what they have, people have 300 plus jobs in this town.

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It's not going to hurt.

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But if there's for the air, that's something that we should consider.

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But if it's going to keep the air cleaner and be more jobs, I'm for it.

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Thank you.

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Thank you, Cody.

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Mr. Fred Starkle.

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Mayor

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and council, by the way, Mr. Mayor Jensen and Mr. Gregory, I saw a couple of really big

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yawns a couple of minutes ago, come from you too.

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Once you'd be real careful, last time I saw somebody do that, that big of yawnt, they

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fell it and I haven't seen him since.

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Two things I have here, recently a situation rose where certain people acted without consideration

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of the neighbors or Longview Municipal Code.

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Their actions started to affect my health, and I contacted Captain Robert Huda of the Longview

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police department, and he put a plan of action together using patrol officers and their supervisor

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and resolved the situation.

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So I want to command, not knowing whether Jim would be here or Captain Huda, I talked

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to Captain Johnson earlier, so if you'll make notes, I want to command Captain Huda and

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the other officers for a job really well done.

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Secondly, I have a request of the council.

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I would like you to review the Longing Municipal Code regarding fireworks.

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Why not?

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Why don't we have fireworks available 365 days a year,

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to which I'd like some answers?

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Normally council doesn't react to anything from constituent comments, so you'll see silence

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a lot of times.

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Should I throw a cup of fireworks?

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Please don't.

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I wouldn't say that. I'm just asking, why don't we have in 365? What are your thoughts?

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I'm just wondering, are you saying you can welcome 365?

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You're not answering my question. You're answering my question with a question.

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The question is, why don't we have fireworks 365?

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Pardon?

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Mr. Starkel, because it'd be a nuisance if they were 365 days a year.

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Any other thoughts?

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No comments? No comments? No comments?

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Okay. Well, that's only one of several reasons why we don't have fireworks 365 days a year.

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And I'm well aware of those. Actually, my request would be for you to review

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the Longley Municipal Code with the idea of drastically reducing the time that they're available,

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that time they're allowed to be lighted and not cause so much of a nuisance. I myself

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sit around my house on 4th of July and New Year's waiting for the other shooter to drop

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nervous and literally have left my home the last three years during that time in an effort

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to get some relief. And I hear lots of complaints from people I know about not only the nuisance

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noise, the problems I talked to Jim Dutje about the problem with enforcing the code as

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it is and so forth and it's just a real problem.

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There are people with their dogs that take off and don't come back that they have to tend

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to their dogs because of the noise, noise, noise, noise, noise.

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And I just don't think it's appropriate.

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I think about our veterans who are coming back from war and those kinds of things.

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I stepped out of the Walmart store one day about two years ago on 4th of July and you would

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swear that there was a war going on.

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You could look at the hills around Kelsal, Longview and there was this flash, flash, flash,

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flash.

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It sounded and looked like a war going on.

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So I would like you to consider that.

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I do have some information that I will give to the clerk for reproduction so you can take

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a look at this information about how many other cities have banned totally and at least major

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your restrictions on fireworks.

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Any way. Thank you, Mr. Starkle. I will say that we do have a system for reviewing this type thing and that's it. Two council members get together and sign on to want to bring that item to council. And then we would discuss it. If that didn't happen, it probably won't come before us. All right. Thank you. This was the clerk. Yes, please. Thank you.

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The next one, two, three, four, five, six, seven,

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eight are on water. We have towards the end of the meeting we have a water

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quality briefing you can speak then or you can speak now whichever you

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prefer. We do have been. Is there anybody that wants to speak now on on water?

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Are you willing? Okay.

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I just brought some laundry for you and some bottled water

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that I got from my tap and my hose last night after the fleshy.

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But it's safe to drink, so I thought I'd bring enough to share.

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Anyhow, my name is Dawn White Campbell, I'm from Longfield.

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I come here before you today again against the water, it's becoming a real issue.

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My family, it's ruining my home, as we all know, the list just gets longer and longer and

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longer.

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However, the support and knowledge from and my close neighbors has been some emotional

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English and stress relief does not take it away.

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With all the research I personally have done is looking more like a legal matter sooner

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than later, because the situation was allowed to get so severe out of control and our elected

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officials were unaware. It's becoming evident to many people in our city.

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It is in capable

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of dealing with the issues at hand. This complex situation is out of hand.

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I now personally

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am suffering a topical yeast infection and being a type one diabetics. It's one dependent.

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The option of infection and loss of a limb is not an option due to ignorance. I would take

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off my coat, but it's kind of disgusting. So when my doctor was talking to me that

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if I do get an infection and that is staring at me in the face, it's unacceptable.

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Having to put in 13 to 14 more claims, which I have copies here, in regards that our

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extra expenses due to the current city swamp water in which have taken away from my family

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on small budgets. Where is the relief I haven't seen or heard of it yet?

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Again, flushing hydrants weekly during morning hours, 15,000 plus gallons just rolled down the city streets.

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Us residents having to walk through it to get through to our walkways.

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With that being said, I would like to bring to the table that my neighbor on Monday, elderly with a cane,

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was trying to get through to his sidewalk and he fell flat on his back through the

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muck. As the city workers were sitting in their truck there just watching. I personally

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watched somebody help him up out of the muck and across the sidewalk. Ridiculous. Now

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that was last Monday, this last one. With as many neighbors far and close this is affecting

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And with fighting this issue myself and now having my water is still stinky like metal with brown tint.

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I want to thank the neighbors that have came aboard the ship to help me fight this and stand behind the issues.

230
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It's not just affecting me and our animals but our families.

231
00:19:14,460 --> 00:19:19,700
I don't know how much more we can take, mentally, emotionally, financially, it's ridiculous.

232
00:19:20,940 --> 00:19:25,400
I'm tired of being told patience, patience, patience, patience, what's it's going to

233
00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:25,720
take?

234
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:33,140
My hot water to go out, my hot water heater, which I just replaced the hoses last night.

235
00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:35,880
Now my husband fell off a five-story roof roofing.

236
00:19:36,380 --> 00:19:41,540
He shattered his left ankle, he shattered his right knee, and he just had his ankle fused

237
00:19:41,540 --> 00:19:42,780
August 17th.

238
00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:46,880
As he's standing up there trying to help me get those hoses on my hot water heater,

239
00:19:49,180 --> 00:19:49,360
his

240
00:19:49,360 --> 00:19:55,020
nasty brown stuff. Where does it end? And then having to go to the doctor to date

241
00:19:55,020 --> 00:20:00,260
have X-rays to see if he did something to that reset fusion. It's not okay.

242
00:20:00,500 --> 00:20:05,920
Could I get you to sum up please? Yes, I'm done. Thank you. Would you like to try water?

243
00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:07,100
No, thank you.

244
00:20:22,730 --> 00:20:25,710
Is there anybody else who would like to speak to water or wait till

245
00:20:25,710 --> 00:20:29,770
the end? I'm only going to take your comment once, so it's either now or at the end.

246
00:20:29,770 --> 00:20:37,950
Again, I'm Provi Vasquez and I live on the 500 block of 17th and I just wanted to add

247
00:20:37,950 --> 00:20:46,310
a little bit from last meeting that I was kind of a little bit, I would say, hurt because

248
00:20:46,710 --> 00:20:56,910
on the KLOG News, they mentioned something about horror stories that were giving the members

249
00:20:56,910 --> 00:21:06,370
here and to meet our stories are not as horrible as or yeah horrible as the way

250
00:21:06,370 --> 00:21:15,290
that the other people our our horror stories are truth stories as you say the

251
00:21:15,290 --> 00:21:19,070
horror story I remember listening is they saw all the people saying about how

252
00:21:19,070 --> 00:21:25,430
good the water how good is gonna be or mumbo jumbo and the bottom line was that

253
00:21:25,430 --> 00:21:26,570
they can't fix the problem.

254
00:21:27,530 --> 00:21:30,630
Today we had a nice visit around the neighborhood

255
00:21:30,630 --> 00:21:33,010
and there was a Sierra water.

256
00:21:33,690 --> 00:21:40,890
And it was wonderful because I got tired of changing my filters

257
00:21:40,890 --> 00:21:42,590
and my little pictures that I have.

258
00:21:42,710 --> 00:21:45,810
So I said, I got to start doing something else.

259
00:21:46,190 --> 00:21:48,290
So they always on the shore up and I said,

260
00:21:48,370 --> 00:21:50,890
wonderful, it's for me, it's a lot easier that way.

261
00:21:50,990 --> 00:21:55,090
But it is expensive, I'm a single woman, I'm a widow,

262
00:21:55,090 --> 00:22:04,830
and I decided to resign. Well, I kind of retired from my job and stay home and take care of my

263
00:22:04,830 --> 00:22:10,490
great granddaughter. And I do not want my granddaughter, my great granddaughter, to drink this water,

264
00:22:10,730 --> 00:22:17,850
because I do get sick with it. Also, I get nauseated, I mention, of course, this infection.

265
00:22:19,150 --> 00:22:27,970
and I like like she said it's kind of a little bit tired and financially it's not easy.

266
00:22:28,230 --> 00:22:32,750
Well for me I'm a single person so it's going to be a little bit more than.

267
00:22:35,810 --> 00:22:38,810
Wait I'm kind of down and I still have a lot of time.

268
00:22:39,570 --> 00:22:41,910
So I just thought I'd put that there.

269
00:22:42,410 --> 00:22:43,310
Please help us.

270
00:22:44,730 --> 00:22:52,290
Thank you, ma'am, and I think towards the end, when we do our report, you may see some

271
00:22:52,290 --> 00:22:54,230
things that you like. We'll see what happens.

272
00:22:56,510 --> 00:22:56,950
My

273
00:23:00,980 --> 00:23:04,280
name is Ken Spring. I live in Longview. I'm going to have to hurry because I've got three

274
00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:10,340
things I want to cover. One is I agree with this lady 100% over here. I brought some water in

275
00:23:10,340 --> 00:23:15,900
myself and my water looks clear compared to hers. I have a brand new water main. They just ran

276
00:23:15,900 --> 00:23:24,380
through my area, plus I live close to the wells. So I guess it doesn't have a chance to

277
00:23:24,380 --> 00:23:29,620
get as clouded up as her water. I wouldn't drink that stuff. I wouldn't even water my

278
00:23:29,620 --> 00:23:34,780
lawn with that stuff. Thing number two that I wanted to talk about was with what Mr.

279
00:23:34,980 --> 00:23:40,000
Stark will talk about. I would like to see a stick a little different tacked and do like

280
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:45,200
Oregon. Oregon has a sensible fireworks law. They don't allow these things like they shoot

281
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:51,460
off down the lake that are dangerous as heck and smoke up the whole town and keep the

282
00:23:51,460 --> 00:23:58,540
whole town for a week awake. Why don't you look into the Oregon ordinance? That is

283
00:23:58,540 --> 00:24:03,680
a fair one. All the people of Morgan, they run over here because we're so liberal with

284
00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:13,680
our stuff. I can't believe the stuff that we have. My third thing is, oh, I guess I still

285
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:18,720
We must have an ordinance of this, but I walk around the lake every day, and I'm so

286
00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:25,760
tired of these yard sale signs being nailed to trees and telephone poles and stuff like

287
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:26,060
that.

288
00:24:26,300 --> 00:24:27,140
Don't we have an ordinance?

289
00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:30,800
When they decide to take them down, they just come rip them down.

290
00:24:31,100 --> 00:24:36,280
I snag my arm on a nail on a tree that has a darn yard sale sign on it, and they don't

291
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:36,900
take them down.

292
00:24:36,900 --> 00:24:44,100
so don't we have an abatement officer and it's easy to find out who put it up

293
00:24:44,100 --> 00:24:52,500
there the address is right on the poster and there certainly ought to be

294
00:24:52,500 --> 00:24:57,000
something why don't you make an ordinance free standing then that would do

295
00:24:57,000 --> 00:25:01,060
away with it anything make a heavy fine for anything that isn't free

296
00:25:01,060 --> 00:25:06,880
standing and give them a day or two to take it down. And most of them, they just leave

297
00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:11,960
them there. And to me, that's just like throwing garbage along the road, expect somebody

298
00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:17,820
else to clean it up. I clean up my dog crap down at the lake and I don't expect somebody

299
00:25:17,820 --> 00:25:23,040
else to do that. And so I don't expect to have to pull nails out of trees and be careful

300
00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:28,080
about leaning on a tree or a telephone pole. And I'm sure that you people have been out

301
00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:33,480
around and seen all these things nailed up. Well, they don't pull the nails. It'd be fine if they'd

302
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:39,340
pull the nails and that. But anyway, I hope that you've listened carefully to these people,

303
00:25:39,380 --> 00:25:44,880
especially of water. I didn't bring my water up here because like I said, mine is just colored,

304
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:51,880
but it's nothing compared. That looks like the water's in the slew behind my house only a little

305
00:25:54,820 --> 00:26:04,000
And if I might Mr. Spring, we do have two abatement officers and do to the economy the way it is.

306
00:26:04,100 --> 00:26:09,400
We're basically down to about half of an abatement officer to be able to.

307
00:26:10,120 --> 00:26:18,480
We used to have Terry Kegler who was really an animal going out and chasing those signs down and making him take him down and pull all that out.

308
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:24,120
We're hoping that when the economy gets a little better we can go back to that and I appreciate your input.

309
00:26:24,700 --> 00:26:27,680
Okay, you have alligators which are very good.

310
00:26:27,940 --> 00:26:31,760
I volunteer to be a voluntary abatement officer.

311
00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:35,160
Give me the authority to do it and I'll take them down and I'll pull the nails.

312
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:44,700
And I'll bring a list of the addresses so that these people can be contacted and told never to do that again.

313
00:26:44,700 --> 00:26:47,740
Thank you.

314
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:54,700
We're still on the on the water. Do you want me to read the names?

315
00:26:54,860 --> 00:26:59,060
Or is there anybody else that wants to speak on water that hasn't spoken?

316
00:27:01,020 --> 00:27:02,500
There's several people here.

317
00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:09,940
My name is Bailey Campbell. I live in Longview,

318
00:27:09,940 --> 00:27:13,660
Washington, and I have some examples that I would like to bring to your attention.

319
00:27:15,060 --> 00:27:26,740
When we were flushing out our water heater and our sink without the purification or the

320
00:27:27,260 --> 00:27:35,220
screen on there, this is the water that we have got and this is the most severe example

321
00:27:36,020 --> 00:27:41,060
that after you mix it up, there's still debris at the bottom and barnacles.

322
00:27:43,740 --> 00:28:00,000
And I just don't know how this is safe if our schools are running off the same water, then I don't know I've heard kids say our water tastes like metal and kids will have cottonmouth when NPE and they don't want to drink the water because of the metal.

323
00:28:00,700 --> 00:28:04,920
So I don't know how that is safe, but I would also like to ring to your attention.

324
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:13,040
and some of the questions that I have is when our water gets flushed,

325
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:22,640
when our water gets flushed, why would there still be barnacles in the water if our water is supposed to be clear and clean?

326
00:28:23,820 --> 00:28:29,740
And when our water is flushed, how come when they say we flushed it and it's clean?

327
00:28:29,740 --> 00:28:35,540
we go to run our water and either our water is being pushed and the yuck is coming

328
00:28:35,540 --> 00:28:40,860
through from after they flush it or our water is just not getting clean. They were

329
00:28:40,860 --> 00:28:49,660
flushing it down by the car lot around four o'clock today and we were seeing all

330
00:28:49,660 --> 00:28:55,580
the water come out and from what we could tell it looked clear but it just doesn't

331
00:28:55,580 --> 00:29:03,560
look as brown as our water over on 17th so thank you thank

332
00:29:06,180 --> 00:29:07,340
you and and some of

333
00:29:07,340 --> 00:29:13,220
that may come out and we have talked about the possibility of the in the line

334
00:29:13,220 --> 00:29:18,280
the mains and and it might even be some of the lines going from the mains up

335
00:29:18,280 --> 00:29:24,260
to the house but we'll be talking about that here later. Is there anybody else on

336
00:29:24,260 --> 00:29:26,020
water that wants to talk.

337
00:29:33,790 --> 00:29:40,850
Hi my name is Elizabeth and I have some water to what was filled

338
00:29:40,850 --> 00:29:50,960
up from today and this was from my bath and I have to bathe in this. I get sprayed

339
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:58,980
with the dog hose and it is not comfortable. I have to use special soap from my hair and

340
00:29:58,980 --> 00:29:59,500
my body.

341
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:07,900
And the special soap doesn't work either. My whole body gets really, really, really red when

342
00:30:07,900 --> 00:30:15,780
I get really, put this soap on me, it just gets really red when I put the water on me too,

343
00:30:16,180 --> 00:30:24,660
and I don't like the waters. And that's the reason my tummy hurts, and I had to stay home from

344
00:30:24,660 --> 00:30:32,020
school today and since I had to stay home from school today my throat had been

345
00:30:32,020 --> 00:30:38,420
hurting and I had to take two pills today and a special medicine my mom just

346
00:30:38,420 --> 00:30:43,920
got and that's all I have to say. Thank you young lady.

347
00:30:47,470 --> 00:30:49,010
Is there anyone else on

348
00:30:49,010 --> 00:30:50,410
water that would like to speak?

349
00:30:52,570 --> 00:30:56,970
Hi my name is Brandon Nicole Gisman and I live here

350
00:30:56,970 --> 00:31:05,090
I love you. We have the brush of our teeth with a bottle of water. I could taste a metal in my mouth. Thank you.

351
00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:10,900
Son of water.

352
00:31:21,230 --> 00:31:27,150
Leon Colock along the Washington. I was wondering when your results on the workshop from last Thursday are going to be available.

353
00:31:30,490 --> 00:31:31,030
Mr. Gregory?

354
00:31:32,530 --> 00:31:35,990
That is going to be on the 24th, October 24th Council agenda.

355
00:31:37,170 --> 00:31:43,670
Okay, and I talked the last time, I think on the exportation of thousands of jobs, I felt that the coal

356
00:31:44,190 --> 00:31:52,230
terminal thing would be an exportation of a lot of jobs, boiler maker jobs. I got out my boiler maker, my

357
00:31:52,230 --> 00:31:58,070
bench boiler operator training workbook, first page, pure water is colorless, tasteless and

358
00:31:58,070 --> 00:32:01,250
Autolus, what if these people are getting pumped?

359
00:32:01,390 --> 00:32:02,590
Mrs. Boilermaker handbook.

360
00:32:03,650 --> 00:32:04,530
Thank you.

361
00:32:12,100 --> 00:32:14,780
Please, please come forward.

362
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:22,260
Mr. Wallace, you'll be next.

363
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:23,440
I've got you down here.

364
00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:25,440
I won't let you fall off.

365
00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:28,180
Ray Van Tongren, in a great city,

366
00:32:28,500 --> 00:32:29,720
live in the great city of Longview.

367
00:32:30,820 --> 00:32:31,760
I have a couple of things.

368
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,380
I want to compliment the city of Longview.

369
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:38,480
I had a break in my neck of the woods on Jennifer

370
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:43,480
place area on Labor Day weekend. There's Sunday I come for church and saw this water run down

371
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:51,140
the street. So I went in and called this number. I guess it was in a what they call those

372
00:32:51,140 --> 00:32:56,840
call numbers or call zone and probably within a half an hour I had a guy out there checking it out.

373
00:32:58,180 --> 00:33:08,460
And he said it's not that big of a gig so we'll be back probably Tuesday to work on it and they

374
00:33:08,460 --> 00:33:12,600
I guess it's a service line, so they're going to come back some day and fix it.

375
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:15,500
So I felt pretty good about that.

376
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:21,980
I called the city and somebody came on board right away, so I need to compliment Craig

377
00:33:21,980 --> 00:33:23,560
or Jeff to do the job.

378
00:33:23,740 --> 00:33:27,060
The second thing, my water is pretty good.

379
00:33:27,500 --> 00:33:27,900
It's good.

380
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:32,700
I shower every day and press my teeth with it and comb my hair.

381
00:33:33,780 --> 00:33:34,840
And so, and shower.

382
00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:40,520
I don't have the smell course. I probably live in the good neck of the woods. I don't know

383
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:44,260
if that where I live that is behind print my or good neck of the woods. We have problems

384
00:33:44,260 --> 00:33:52,800
out there also, but as I say, my water is pretty good. So my wife tells me, wait till it and

385
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:59,960
for a couple years till the water settles or the aqueduct gets hits the bottom of the pot.

386
00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:03,740
So thank you for listening and have a great day or a great night.

387
00:34:03,740 --> 00:34:04,660
Right. Thank you, Gray.

388
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:08,600
Mr. Wallace.

389
00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:15,540
Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Chuck Wallace, 600 block, 22nd.

390
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:23,340
Could you help me understand the level of involvement the city had in helping the private property owners,

391
00:34:23,720 --> 00:34:28,720
the former private property owner, the property that's known as Tri-County Trust and the current property owner?

392
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,500
What was the city's involvement in that?

393
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:37,960
Mr. Gregory, would you like to private, that was a private transaction between the Tri-County Trust and the new property owner?

394
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:41,920
Oh, okay. I just was wondering about that. Thank you. Thank you.

395
00:34:45,950 --> 00:34:48,610
Is there anyone else that would wish to speak?

396
00:34:53,780 --> 00:34:54,500
Thank you.

397
00:34:55,840 --> 00:35:00,320
Oh, we do have a lady. I'm sorry. I didn't see it. I'm up around the corner there. I apologize.

398
00:35:01,060 --> 00:35:05,300
My name's Melissa Davison. I live on the 300 block of 22nd. I was at your last meeting.

399
00:35:06,300 --> 00:35:13,360
I've got here a little late. I was just wondering if there's been anything that you've thought about that you're going to change since everybody's telling you about their problems.

400
00:35:13,980 --> 00:35:24,980
on the water problem water we are going to have later on in the meeting I report by staff and we have some ideas and

401
00:35:24,980 --> 00:35:33,360
is that the one you're talking about this coming up on the 24th or something? Nope. Whenever this meeting gets to it it'll be towards

402
00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:41,260
end of the meeting. And I was wondering too when I was here last time they were discussing that I'm not sure if the lady's here or not.

403
00:35:41,260 --> 00:35:48,120
But how should her report on the where the waters did was a lot different than what they showed us on that

404
00:35:48,860 --> 00:35:54,920
Projector up there. So have you checked that out or I don't well that be part of what we're gonna

405
00:35:54,920 --> 00:36:03,140
I'm not sure. I don't believe so no because I believe when I was here you told her to give her information to the city clerk and that you would look it over

406
00:36:04,260 --> 00:36:05,820
We've still not got that information

407
00:36:07,260 --> 00:36:09,000
So we haven't gotten it.

408
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:14,440
Right, so how long does it take for you to get around to getting a chance to?

409
00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:16,180
It's their information.

410
00:36:16,460 --> 00:36:17,940
We can't require them to give it to us.

411
00:36:18,180 --> 00:36:19,120
Oh, okay.

412
00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:23,400
The lady that had the information was going to bring it in and it has to hit her.

413
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:24,780
Oh, she did not leave it here.

414
00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:25,600
Okay, because.

415
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:28,840
Yes.

416
00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:29,640
four

417
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:47,340
directions as to the most effective and expedient way to deliver this information. I've gone four days with no response.

418
00:36:49,060 --> 00:36:51,120
That's what you don't have to do with it.

419
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:52,660
Thank you.

420
00:36:53,040 --> 00:37:00,840
Anyway, so I was just curious if anything is getting looked into. I know I hear a lot of that we're gonna and we want to, but

421
00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:03,540
that they're not trying to be rude,

422
00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:06,020
but it just seems like it takes a little longer

423
00:37:06,020 --> 00:37:08,040
than maybe if the people that,

424
00:37:08,220 --> 00:37:10,580
if everybody else getting to have this problem

425
00:37:10,580 --> 00:37:13,020
with their water, is it just certain areas?

426
00:37:13,720 --> 00:37:16,740
Is it just down in on the other side of the lake

427
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:19,220
or is it on this side of the lake also?

428
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:25,080
Well, I'm sure that if when we do our report later

429
00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:27,120
on a lot of that will come up in it.

430
00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:29,300
And if you want to ask those questions later

431
00:37:29,300 --> 00:37:32,900
to be fine because it'll have to be the proper time to ask those questions.

432
00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:33,160
All right.

433
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:33,580
Thank you.

434
00:37:33,780 --> 00:37:33,960
All right.

435
00:37:34,420 --> 00:37:34,840
Thank you.

436
00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:47,100
My name is John Craig.

437
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:49,340
I live in Longview here.

438
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:53,500
And the water is reasonably good.

439
00:37:53,820 --> 00:38:02,320
Although I step ahead of everybody, I've put a filter in my system from a household 10 years

440
00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:02,740
ago.

441
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:04,420
I wanted a cleaner water.

442
00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:06,060
It was some segment coming through.

443
00:38:06,060 --> 00:38:14,800
So I put a filter in and I change it yearly and I put a filter in my water for my refrigerator

444
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:21,160
for drinking and so I'm clean on water there except for my outside water.

445
00:38:22,060 --> 00:38:23,900
Now that is kind of a problem.

446
00:38:24,100 --> 00:38:34,920
My flowers and my garden hate it and if anybody has any idea that zucchini can look like this

447
00:38:34,920 --> 00:38:42,760
and it should be very fruit. I'm going to leave these pictures with your folks to look at.

448
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:50,940
And I hope that the chemicals or whatever is in the water can be cleared up because it

449
00:38:50,940 --> 00:38:58,140
sure is held, don't look good in the garden. And I love my flowers and I love my garden.

450
00:38:58,700 --> 00:39:04,300
And a lot of soil folks do that. And I got two different gardens here. My garden and

451
00:39:04,300 --> 00:39:12,400
neighbors guard and his garden zone same thing thank you sir you can give it to this city clerk

452
00:39:12,400 --> 00:39:13,520
thank

453
00:39:20,300 --> 00:39:25,260
you there anybody else we're reaching our half hour

454
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:33,920
okay we will move forward there's no

455
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:41,360
public hearings there's no ords and commissions the next thing on our agenda is an ordinance ordinance

456
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:46,160
and it's number 3254 authorizing indoor shooting ranges

457
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:50,700
in certain industrial zones, Ms. Davis,

458
00:39:50,940 --> 00:39:53,300
would you please read the ordinance by title only?

459
00:39:54,780 --> 00:39:59,140
An ordinance adding a new section 19.58.110

460
00:39:59,980 --> 00:40:06,980
indoor shooting ranges and the mending table 19.58.020-1

461
00:40:06,980 --> 00:40:09,920
permitted uses in industrial zones,

462
00:40:10,540 --> 00:40:15,120
mending section 19.55.040, noise,

463
00:40:15,700 --> 00:40:18,500
and provide a definition for shooting range.

464
00:40:21,110 --> 00:40:21,890
Thank you.

465
00:40:22,130 --> 00:40:22,450
Mr. Mayor?

466
00:40:22,810 --> 00:40:22,930
Yes.

467
00:40:23,350 --> 00:40:27,210
I would make a motion then we refer ordinance number 30254

468
00:40:27,210 --> 00:40:28,730
back to the Planning Commission.

469
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:33,820
Do we have a second to that motion?

470
00:40:34,940 --> 00:40:35,580
I'll second it.

471
00:40:36,460 --> 00:40:37,120
Mr. Coacher.

472
00:40:37,460 --> 00:40:38,700
Mr. Mayor, if I could comment on that.

473
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:39,380
Yes.

474
00:40:39,380 --> 00:40:46,000
Direct some questions to staff about the proposed ordinance, it concerns me that the ordinance

475
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:52,120
does not address the retail use of an indoor shooting range.

476
00:40:52,140 --> 00:40:58,300
Every indoor shooting range I've been to, they sell firearms, ammunition, other related

477
00:40:58,300 --> 00:41:01,660
equipment and firearm related material.

478
00:41:01,660 --> 00:41:09,540
The, as I understand from staff, this proposal would only allow that in an incidental and secondary

479
00:41:09,540 --> 00:41:10,040
use.

480
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:14,240
And from my experience with indoor shooting ranges, that's a prime, it's more of a primary

481
00:41:14,240 --> 00:41:14,600
use.

482
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:18,040
I wades gun shop and East Melvue there.

483
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:23,700
Their primary use is a gun shop and they have the indoor handgun range.

484
00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:29,460
So it concerns me, and I know that Longby Police Department is wanting to have an indoor shooting

485
00:41:29,460 --> 00:41:36,620
range, it concerns me that and I feel that the proposal here is geared towards that municipal

486
00:41:36,620 --> 00:41:40,780
use indoor shooting range for the purpose of law enforcement and doesn't really look

487
00:41:40,780 --> 00:41:47,460
at and encompass the market need for commercial indoor shooting range that would meet the needs

488
00:41:47,460 --> 00:41:52,680
of the market such as we have in Portland or Vancouver, Bellevue, these areas where have

489
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:55,040
an indoor shooting range that for commercial use.

490
00:41:55,040 --> 00:42:00,560
In addition, this ordinance limits it to the certain industrial zones.

491
00:42:00,900 --> 00:42:06,000
And many of the other indoor shooting ranges around our state and Oregon, some of the

492
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:13,540
zones where these are located are more commercial like in nature, where there are similar other

493
00:42:13,540 --> 00:42:19,200
business entities and are less industrialized than what's proposed here.

494
00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:24,280
My suggestion would be that we send this back to the Planning Commission and have them review

495
00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:31,760
potential zoning uses and also have them look at the commercial aspect of the

496
00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:35,820
indoor shooting range in addition to this municipal law enforcement aspect

497
00:42:35,820 --> 00:42:39,600
which it seems that this is really focused on.

498
00:42:43,650 --> 00:42:49,690
Well we've got a motion on the floor to have any discussion by council on this

499
00:42:49,690 --> 00:42:50,170
motion?

500
00:42:52,250 --> 00:42:57,170
Is there anything prohibiting with this ordinance that's being presented? Is there

501
00:42:57,170 --> 00:43:02,710
anything prohibiting commercial sale? John, can you help? You want to answer that?

502
00:43:04,110 --> 00:43:09,390
Yes, Councillor Armon. As was pointed out by Councillor Wallain, it would be allowed

503
00:43:09,390 --> 00:43:16,150
as an incidental use. An incidental use is not the primary use, but a use that is subservient

504
00:43:16,150 --> 00:43:22,690
to the primary use. So it would allow for sales of ammunition and guns. What it would

505
00:43:22,690 --> 00:43:31,230
not allow is for a wholesale or a retailer to locate a gun sales retail business in

506
00:43:31,230 --> 00:43:35,670
an industrial district and then have a shooting range, ancillary to it. It would have to be

507
00:43:35,670 --> 00:43:40,390
primarily for the shooting range and then it would allow for incidental sales.

508
00:43:42,450 --> 00:43:42,910
Is that

509
00:43:42,910 --> 00:43:48,610
Nope, yes, I understand the, and so can I have a follow up question?

510
00:43:49,050 --> 00:43:55,170
So Mr. Rowland you're suggesting that we flip that around to make it more primarily focused

511
00:43:55,170 --> 00:44:01,070
on the gun shop side of it with a shooting range aspect instead of the shooting range

512
00:44:01,070 --> 00:44:05,950
with being able to purchase ammunition at there for that purpose?

513
00:44:06,570 --> 00:44:09,450
The concern is that they're not exclusive of one another.

514
00:44:10,070 --> 00:44:16,170
It's unlikely you'll find a commercial indoor range without the retail aspect because they're

515
00:44:16,170 --> 00:44:19,910
selling the ammunition for the users, they're selling the targets to the users, they're

516
00:44:19,910 --> 00:44:23,710
selling handguns and other firearms to the users of the facility.

517
00:44:24,470 --> 00:44:29,230
And that's where the large part of their for-profit business comes from.

518
00:44:30,070 --> 00:44:31,790
It's a matter of a business model.

519
00:44:32,230 --> 00:44:37,830
The current ordinance sets up a great structure for, as I mentioned, a municipal or law enforcement

520
00:44:37,830 --> 00:44:43,010
use if we want just law enforcement to have an indoor swing range an industrial park you know area

521
00:44:43,590 --> 00:44:48,770
that would work well because they're not buying and selling firearms or ammunition they may

522
00:44:48,770 --> 00:44:55,050
bring their own or have their own supply you know the department provides but if we want to encompass

523
00:44:56,050 --> 00:44:59,890
the commercial aspect you have to recognize that the retail

524
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:23,400
So, it shouldn't be incidental either way. The retail sales be incidental to the shooting range or the shooting range incidental to the, but they go hand-in-hand. So, it's not a primary unit. You wouldn't have a commercial shooting range without the sale of those.

525
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:35,180
if I might Mr. Brickie did is what Mr. Wallen suggested is that work can not happen with

526
00:45:35,180 --> 00:45:40,900
this ordinance? Not with this ordinance as written. I mean it would have to be an

527
00:45:40,900 --> 00:45:45,820
amendment to it or as he suggested going back to the Planning Commission for further

528
00:45:45,820 --> 00:45:52,600
consideration. Thank you. One one thing I might mention to the council for your consideration

529
00:45:52,600 --> 00:46:00,140
as well as that allowing retail sales in the industrial districts could not be it would

530
00:46:00,140 --> 00:46:07,180
be difficult to limit it to just firearms if we're allowing retail sales.

531
00:46:09,420 --> 00:46:11,020
And that's precisely my concern.

532
00:46:12,340 --> 00:46:14,200
Mr. Motero had his hand up here.

533
00:46:14,540 --> 00:46:21,310
Well, I just have a question on this and I agree with you, Joe, if you can't limit it just

534
00:46:21,310 --> 00:46:27,990
specific types of guns or whatever. But in the ordinance in section one, we're talking

535
00:46:27,990 --> 00:46:33,490
about a shooting range and the noise from the shooting range. It means a facility designed

536
00:46:33,490 --> 00:46:38,850
to provide a confined space for target practice with firearms, archery equipment, or other

537
00:46:38,850 --> 00:46:44,410
weapons open to the public, open only to private membership or open to organizations with training

538
00:46:44,410 --> 00:46:51,270
such as law enforcement or any combination of. That's just stipulating in there the shooting

539
00:46:51,270 --> 00:46:58,510
range that they're talking about here is a building provided for practicing a firearm

540
00:46:58,510 --> 00:47:00,790
that has nothing to do with the sale of firearms.

541
00:47:02,930 --> 00:47:08,090
Yes, Mr. Mayor. So for all practical purposes, and I would encourage anyone in the public

542
00:47:08,090 --> 00:47:13,570
who attends shooting ranges to speak up, is it most commercial shooting ranges that are

543
00:47:13,570 --> 00:47:18,770
intended for the public to use, have the sale of ammunition and firearms.

544
00:47:19,110 --> 00:47:21,190
So without those, it would be non-existent.

545
00:47:21,250 --> 00:47:25,630
It's unlikely that a commercial operator would establish a shooting range.

546
00:47:25,650 --> 00:47:26,870
I'll call you in just a minute.

547
00:47:27,150 --> 00:47:31,990
Well, without this, you know, without the sale of the ammunition and

548
00:47:31,990 --> 00:47:32,790
firearms, it's not likely.

549
00:47:33,010 --> 00:47:39,190
So obviously, this ordinance works very well for, you know, law enforcement use.

550
00:47:40,570 --> 00:47:41,050
There's you with that.

551
00:47:41,050 --> 00:47:45,990
So the issue concerning the zoning, if we limited to industrial, as Mr. Brickie has said,

552
00:47:46,450 --> 00:47:51,530
and stated, and if we're looking at opening up for retail, that creates complications.

553
00:47:51,710 --> 00:47:55,650
That's why I suggested we need to look at areas outside of just industrial.

554
00:47:55,770 --> 00:48:00,970
We have other zones that this may better fit and better suit with this commercial application

555
00:48:00,970 --> 00:48:01,630
and flight as well.

556
00:48:02,950 --> 00:48:09,550
This is very narrow and scope, and not to belabor the point, but this would work very well

557
00:48:09,550 --> 00:48:14,250
only for law enforcement use and if that is the goal of this then it should be

558
00:48:14,250 --> 00:48:18,470
plainly stated that this is not for public but it is for law enforcement use

559
00:48:18,470 --> 00:48:23,930
only but if we want to allow commercial shooting range you know for the use of

560
00:48:23,930 --> 00:48:27,670
the public then then this needs to be more broad and needs to have another look

561
00:48:27,670 --> 00:48:34,630
at a further comment if not I'm in a lot of public to speak Mr. Spring please

562
00:48:34,630 --> 00:48:36,170
come forward I

563
00:48:40,300 --> 00:48:42,380
wish people let's spoke to issues new with the

564
00:48:42,380 --> 00:48:47,380
we're talking about. I've been shooting at shooting ranges for years. Most of them are for

565
00:48:47,380 --> 00:48:53,260
primarily public shooting ranges. There are some of them that do furnish ammunition. There are some

566
00:48:53,260 --> 00:49:02,960
of them that supply a limited amount of guns for rent and so forth. What the hell is a big deal

567
00:49:03,500 --> 00:49:08,600
about this? I don't know why people have to make such a big deal out of everything. I don't think

568
00:49:08,600 --> 00:49:12,500
Have you ever been in a public shooting range, huh?

569
00:49:13,740 --> 00:49:16,960
Well, did you see them shooting, selling guns and ammunition?

570
00:49:17,760 --> 00:49:20,340
If you did, tell me which one I want to go see it.

571
00:49:21,300 --> 00:49:22,700
I think you're full of bloney.

572
00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:27,340
And I have a constitutional right to talk to you how I want to.

573
00:49:27,740 --> 00:49:32,420
And I'm sick of all this jabber, dabber crap,

574
00:49:32,780 --> 00:49:34,840
when you don't know what the hell you're talking about.

575
00:49:34,840 --> 00:49:39,380
And this range, I know the person that has, this

576
00:49:44,020 --> 00:49:48,260
is my constitutional right, did you tell her to set me this?

577
00:49:48,260 --> 00:49:49,440
Yes, I did. I didn't tell her to set me this.

578
00:49:49,440 --> 00:49:50,240
Okay, I got one.

579
00:49:50,240 --> 00:49:50,420
I got one.

580
00:49:51,260 --> 00:49:51,800
That's fine.

581
00:49:52,180 --> 00:49:53,100
That's fine, Ken.

582
00:49:53,840 --> 00:49:56,840
We're not going to have you going after people already but...

583
00:49:56,840 --> 00:49:58,660
You took my constitutional right away, Don.

584
00:49:59,000 --> 00:49:59,920
Okay, thank you.

585
00:50:00,380 --> 00:50:02,660
Is there anybody else that would like to speak to this?

586
00:50:07,850 --> 00:50:09,990
Chuck Wallace, 600 block of 22nd.

587
00:50:10,190 --> 00:50:12,510
I think you're right.

588
00:50:12,510 --> 00:50:18,570
Okay, I think they ought to consider the retail or commercial zoning.

589
00:50:19,990 --> 00:50:27,070
Remember a few years back when we are the council re-zoned, that's parcel of, is everything going to be all right?

590
00:50:27,450 --> 00:50:27,550
Yeah.

591
00:50:27,890 --> 00:50:28,050
Okay.

592
00:50:28,830 --> 00:50:42,080
That parcel of land between, I believe it's 36 and all of the way, there's a parcel of land that's close to the Mount Solo.

593
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:49,380
So that's zoned for commercial use and it's to have a regional draw.

594
00:50:49,620 --> 00:50:55,660
So something like Bass Pro Shop or something that would have a regional draw here.

595
00:50:56,100 --> 00:51:03,520
I could easily see that kind of business opening up in a parcel of land that's geared

596
00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:05,380
toward that development in the future.

597
00:51:07,700 --> 00:51:15,240
give future potential investors opportunities to really think big with their future business.

598
00:51:15,520 --> 00:51:21,140
And that's what, and further one thing, Mary Jane Millink, councilmember Mary Jane Millink,

599
00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:26,520
her remarks the last time the council discussed this was, I appreciate that.

600
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:33,300
It seems to me that maybe the city can't find people to occupy industrial land,

601
00:51:33,300 --> 00:51:35,240
So now we're resorting to shooting ranges.

602
00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:38,920
I mean, thank you.

603
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:42,320
I just, there's a lot of people that are questioning this move.

604
00:51:43,740 --> 00:51:44,520
Thank you.

605
00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:46,740
Mr. Starkle, please come forward.

606
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:47,400
Mr.

607
00:51:55,160 --> 00:51:59,500
and Council, I have re-quited a number of shooting ranges in my 75 years

608
00:51:59,500 --> 00:52:06,180
and most of them do sell retail, ammunition, guns, whatever.

609
00:52:07,040 --> 00:52:08,720
It's a side-by-side thing.

610
00:52:08,720 --> 00:52:12,500
you can go in and shoot with your own ammunition, your own guns, or you can go there by a gun,

611
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:17,340
rent a gun, buy ammunition, buy targets, buy other kinds of shooting, things, holsters, belts,

612
00:52:17,780 --> 00:52:21,840
whatever. So I think that it probably, if you're going to put a shooting range together,

613
00:52:22,060 --> 00:52:28,160
unless you're talking about a long-range shooting range, they all have retail outlets. We walk

614
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:33,520
in, I was looking in my wallet while you were talking to see if I sell my card for one out of

615
00:52:33,520 --> 00:52:34,580
you all up where I used to live.

616
00:52:35,320 --> 00:52:38,560
And the card says that I have been a member

617
00:52:38,560 --> 00:52:40,920
or have gone through their safety regulations

618
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:42,260
and understand them.

619
00:52:42,620 --> 00:52:45,020
And if I want to go in and shoot, I'm welcome to do that.

620
00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:47,660
Or if I want to buy something like the gun shop

621
00:52:47,660 --> 00:52:50,520
or over at Bob's at their sporting goods,

622
00:52:51,180 --> 00:52:53,240
they know me that have gone through the regulations

623
00:52:53,240 --> 00:52:53,980
and so forth.

624
00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:59,240
So I think that Mike Wallin has a perfectly good idea

625
00:52:59,240 --> 00:53:02,000
in making sure that they're side-by-side operations.

626
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:04,040
and I think they'll be very, very successful that way.

627
00:53:04,500 --> 00:53:09,040
One question, do we know whether it's going to be a long range shooting range for the police officers,

628
00:53:09,700 --> 00:53:11,800
practice, or most of the protesters?

629
00:53:12,460 --> 00:53:13,060
I don't know.

630
00:53:13,880 --> 00:53:14,080
What's that?

631
00:53:14,140 --> 00:53:15,140
Okay, so this is an ordinance.

632
00:53:15,340 --> 00:53:19,180
Somebody is trying to maybe develop one, and you need to have an ordinance to cover that.

633
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:23,360
Yeah, and it might be the city, it might be private enterprise.

634
00:53:23,820 --> 00:53:31,580
We just have been asked to open the possibilities up, and there's another possibility, and that

635
00:53:31,580 --> 00:53:38,060
That is that we have it not only in industrial but maybe in a commercial zone.

636
00:53:38,820 --> 00:53:43,880
So I think where this is headed is back to the planning committee and that would really

637
00:53:43,880 --> 00:53:48,080
be the place to debate where and how and what we do.

638
00:53:48,520 --> 00:53:54,340
And I think Mike also has a good idea in terms of not just industrial land but in a commercial

639
00:53:54,340 --> 00:53:55,160
area also.

640
00:53:55,700 --> 00:53:59,240
And as far as the noise is concerned every one of the ranges I've been to about a half

641
00:53:59,240 --> 00:54:04,280
a dozen in my lifetime, they are built so that there is no outside noise. In fact, I

642
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:08,400
actually left one range because my hearing protection wasn't adequate. And somebody in

643
00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:12,920
the booth next to me had a very large caliber pistol, and I said, I've had enough of this.

644
00:54:13,720 --> 00:54:21,620
So those things are, if they're built according to not only the city's code, NRA code, national

645
00:54:21,620 --> 00:54:27,820
code, police organization codes, whatever, there's going to be noise outside. But I think

646
00:54:27,820 --> 00:54:31,180
Mike has a really good idea to send it back to the Planning Commission and it should be

647
00:54:31,180 --> 00:54:33,280
the retail and the shooting range together.

648
00:54:34,220 --> 00:54:34,560
Thank you.

649
00:54:37,140 --> 00:54:39,880
Any other citizens want to speak to this issue?

650
00:54:41,180 --> 00:54:42,200
Please come forward.

651
00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:42,740
Give your name.

652
00:54:46,010 --> 00:54:46,170
Hello.

653
00:54:46,370 --> 00:54:49,210
My name is Janice Barrera and I'm from Longview, Washington.

654
00:54:49,990 --> 00:54:57,950
And I would like to say I'm in favor of the more commercial use of it because I see more

655
00:54:57,950 --> 00:55:00,130
potential for revenue for our city.

656
00:55:00,130 --> 00:55:05,990
and we have a history of hunters in this area so I think it would give an

657
00:55:05,990 --> 00:55:10,390
opportunity for everybody to enjoy their sales it might even be a

658
00:55:10,390 --> 00:55:15,450
recreational place. The other thing is if I remember correctly there was at

659
00:55:15,450 --> 00:55:22,050
one time a shooting range underneath the School of Arilong High School and I don't

660
00:55:22,050 --> 00:55:26,430
know if that still exists or not but you know it doesn't. Yes there was. You know

661
00:55:26,430 --> 00:55:33,850
It was a time gone by but you know that speaks something about the history of our town and and the use of firearms

662
00:55:33,850 --> 00:55:36,790
It was promoted in school. Thank you. Thank you

663
00:55:37,930 --> 00:55:45,210
Yeah, people would roll over if they knew there was a small caliber shooting range down in the basement of very long

664
00:55:45,210 --> 00:55:48,390
I know a guy that shot a 22 down there

665
00:55:49,630 --> 00:55:50,150
Me

666
00:55:52,410 --> 00:55:55,650
It's there, but it's full of pipes you couldn't use it. Yeah

667
00:55:56,630 --> 00:56:04,950
Is there anyone else who would like to speak to this issue if not Mr. Gregory has something he'd like to make sure I understand the the question

668
00:56:04,950 --> 00:56:11,050
I'm if we're gonna be if it does it refer to back make sure I understand what we're asking so is the concern that a

669
00:56:11,050 --> 00:56:15,270
Person couldn't come in and just buy ammunition or a gun if they didn't shoot or

670
00:56:16,430 --> 00:56:23,250
Because I'm on as I understand that's I think they could do that even though it's just because it's an auxiliary use

671
00:56:23,250 --> 00:56:26,110
it doesn't mean that if they didn't shoot they couldn't come in and buy ammunition.

672
00:56:26,510 --> 00:56:29,710
So I'm just trying to make sure how we would change this if we remanded it back.

673
00:56:29,870 --> 00:56:32,250
What would we change and what the difference is?

674
00:56:32,410 --> 00:56:36,330
And so, I mean, Councillor Wong could you just make sure I understand what your concern is.

675
00:56:36,470 --> 00:56:37,710
So if we do remand back, where?

676
00:56:38,270 --> 00:56:43,010
The question I asked of staff was would retail sales of firearms and ammunition

677
00:56:43,010 --> 00:56:45,310
and related items be allowed in indoor shooting ranges.

678
00:56:45,850 --> 00:56:49,470
Staff told me that as long as it was incidental, secondary to the primary use.

679
00:56:50,050 --> 00:56:54,290
What I hear from that is no that an individual cannot walk in by their firearm and ammunition

680
00:56:54,290 --> 00:56:55,850
and walk out without using the range.

681
00:56:57,410 --> 00:57:03,190
The range as I've been to in for the record for my integrity, since college days was Wade's

682
00:57:03,190 --> 00:57:09,150
East Side guns in Bellevue where I've shot on a regular basis for a decade and a half now,

683
00:57:10,310 --> 00:57:20,050
Which, by the way, you can buy firearms, ammunition, holsters, containers, all number of things.

684
00:57:20,310 --> 00:57:26,170
You can rent guns, you can shoot all these things.

685
00:57:27,030 --> 00:57:32,510
The point I'm trying to make is, you know, what I heard from staff is it's incident or secondary use.

686
00:57:33,930 --> 00:57:40,730
It's my understanding from the commercial side that, and I don't know the business that

687
00:57:40,730 --> 00:57:45,110
well, but the ones I've been to at least have this commercial component to them.

688
00:57:45,750 --> 00:57:50,910
Aside from just the renting or shooting of guns, they have the commercial sale aspect.

689
00:57:51,790 --> 00:57:57,830
My reading and understanding of this ordinance is its narrow in scope that it is not intended

690
00:57:57,830 --> 00:57:58,750
to be commercialized.

691
00:57:58,750 --> 00:58:04,910
I think it's important to recognize that if this is directed for law enforcement use that that be what it's for

692
00:58:04,910 --> 00:58:13,100
But if we want to open it up for the commercial and retail use that that we have the planning commission look at that and

693
00:58:14,160 --> 00:58:19,320
Let's not fall up on it with staff and so to John Clark farming so even though it's incidental answer

694
00:58:19,320 --> 00:58:25,900
We use could a person just come in and buy a gun or ammunition and not shoot. I don't know how we would regulate them

695
00:58:25,900 --> 00:58:30,960
I mean, we wouldn't have somebody at the door waiting to see who was buying if they were shooting or not.

696
00:58:31,100 --> 00:58:36,520
I mean, it's intended to support the primary use, which is the...

697
00:58:36,520 --> 00:58:36,960
Okay, but...

698
00:58:36,960 --> 00:58:37,840
But enforcement...

699
00:58:37,840 --> 00:58:43,100
But enforcement, why? I mean, if we did do that, I mean, so somebody could not do that according to what the intent of the code is in.

700
00:58:43,360 --> 00:58:44,880
That's not stated in the code. No.

701
00:58:45,600 --> 00:58:53,860
You know, if you go there to buy your gun and go back the next day to shoot it, you're still being supported for the activity that is a permitted use.

702
00:58:53,860 --> 00:58:55,460
that could be done. Okay.

703
00:58:56,300 --> 00:59:00,960
Mr. Walland, the remand of that in Austin include to look

704
00:59:00,960 --> 00:59:04,920
at not only industrial zones, but commercial zones.

705
00:59:04,980 --> 00:59:09,040
Because as Mr. Brickie has stated, if you were to allow this

706
00:59:09,040 --> 00:59:11,720
commercial retail secondary or incidentally used

707
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:14,540
in industrial zone, that could be, that could be

708
00:59:14,540 --> 00:59:17,540
create complications, you know. Particularly like Tenantway,

709
00:59:17,720 --> 00:59:21,340
you know, we've made some changes there in other places

710
00:59:21,340 --> 00:59:23,600
where we're not allowing certain retail sales

711
00:59:23,600 --> 00:59:29,400
that's kind of things. So it could be a complication to allow these sales if these are to be

712
00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:32,960
zoned in industrial areas. And I wasn't questioning the zoning thing. I was just trying to make

713
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:37,340
sure I understood the one other question you had there. So, okay, I'm clear. Mr.

714
00:59:37,460 --> 00:59:44,160
Otero, I'm still confused. Like, could you explain how would you amend this motion or amend this

715
00:59:44,160 --> 00:59:50,400
resolution? My motion was to send this back to the planning commission. If I had my way with the

716
00:59:50,400 --> 00:59:55,440
planning commission, it would not be an incitory or secondary use. It would be a

717
00:59:55,440 --> 00:59:59,160
permitted use to do the retail sales of firearms and ammunition in related

718
00:59:59,160 --> 00:59:59,460
Thanks.

719
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:20,080
And they would also look at other zones, including business and commercial zones that might work to allow the siding of the indoor shooting range with the cell of these additional items. But I guess I'm reading something wrong here then because in our charge. Under commercial industrial, it

720
01:00:24,430 --> 01:00:26,970
states that you can sell commercial

721
01:00:31,480 --> 01:00:38,460
industrial wholesale trade of durable goods, including but not limited to motor vehicle parts and supply furniture and home furnishings.

722
01:00:38,460 --> 01:00:43,420
lumber and other construction materials, professional and commercial equipment and supplies, metal and mineral

723
01:00:43,420 --> 01:00:49,260
except, electrical goods, hardware, plumbing, heating, equipment and supplies, machinery equipment and supplies.

724
01:00:50,100 --> 01:00:51,600
Those are all permitted uses.

725
01:00:52,080 --> 01:00:56,020
And what's known? Commercial and industrial.

726
01:01:00,090 --> 01:01:04,750
So commercial and industrial would actually take in the whole city.

727
01:01:09,230 --> 01:01:10,690
Is that material statement?

728
01:01:10,690 --> 01:01:17,230
The commercial industrial district is a specific district, primarily the largest one is between

729
01:01:17,230 --> 01:01:22,270
California way, Oregon way, and industrial way, and that is a mixed use commercial industrial

730
01:01:22,270 --> 01:01:25,810
district. That I

731
01:01:28,210 --> 01:01:31,370
might have, Steve Langdon is here, might have some speak to that. I don't

732
01:01:31,370 --> 01:01:38,710
believe that that zoning district is included in the ordinance, but I would like for him to clarify

733
01:01:38,710 --> 01:01:38,990
that.

734
01:01:38,990 --> 01:01:48,410
on the ordinance talks about city industrial zoning districts. So maybe this will help.

735
01:01:54,100 --> 01:01:57,480
Yeah, I'm Steve Langenham, the planning manager for the city of Longview.

736
01:01:58,100 --> 01:02:07,940
Indoor shooting range is subject to the clause that Mr. Wallen referred to was the draft clause of 19.58.10

737
01:02:07,940 --> 01:02:14,540
would be allowed in all three of the industrial districts, which is the

738
01:02:14,540 --> 01:02:20,660
light industrial A and B heavy industrial district and the mixed-use

739
01:02:20,660 --> 01:02:28,060
commercial industrial district. But not in commercial alone. But not in

740
01:02:28,060 --> 01:02:32,560
none in any of the commercial districts. We had two people who were talking to us

741
01:02:32,560 --> 01:02:40,520
about citing a gun range, both of them on property or not the police department, but the individual

742
01:02:40,520 --> 01:02:48,580
was in a owns property and industrial district. So taking in mind those two folks in the

743
01:02:48,580 --> 01:02:53,160
Longview Police Department has been looking at industrial districts, that's what the planning

744
01:02:53,160 --> 01:02:58,380
commission was looking at, trying to take care of the needs of a couple of people who were

745
01:02:58,380 --> 01:03:00,080
interested in locating a gun range.

746
01:03:00,960 --> 01:03:03,660
What I would talk about incidental sales

747
01:03:03,660 --> 01:03:06,540
is what I would do is I would compare it to a bowling alley.

748
01:03:07,660 --> 01:03:10,000
OK, you go down to the triangle bowling alley

749
01:03:10,000 --> 01:03:12,680
and primary people are there to bowl.

750
01:03:13,280 --> 01:03:15,160
But do they have bowling balls there?

751
01:03:15,360 --> 01:03:16,160
Do they have bowling gloves?

752
01:03:16,440 --> 01:03:17,360
Do they have bowling bags?

753
01:03:17,940 --> 01:03:18,620
Yes, they do.

754
01:03:19,600 --> 01:03:24,340
So that is kind of the idea when I was brief sponge

755
01:03:24,340 --> 01:03:26,740
to Mr. Wallins' question about incidental sales,

756
01:03:26,740 --> 01:03:28,380
Those would be something along those lines.

757
01:03:29,500 --> 01:03:32,000
And does someone walk into the triangle bowling alley

758
01:03:32,000 --> 01:03:34,140
and buy a bowling ball and take it home

759
01:03:34,140 --> 01:03:35,480
or go bowling someplace else?

760
01:03:35,700 --> 01:03:35,940
Yes.

761
01:03:36,720 --> 01:03:39,600
But it is not the primary floor space.

762
01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:46,340
So what I wouldn't say is, so for instance, Bob Surplus

763
01:03:46,940 --> 01:03:49,540
is a huge store that sells a lot of guns,

764
01:03:50,220 --> 01:03:52,440
but they have an archery range that

765
01:03:52,440 --> 01:03:54,920
takes up a small portion of their shop.

766
01:03:54,920 --> 01:04:02,240
So, that is the other, the inverse of that, is there primarily sales and then they have

767
01:04:02,240 --> 01:04:05,420
ancillary to it, archery range.

768
01:04:08,660 --> 01:04:09,680
So, that helps clear things up.

769
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:17,420
Yes, and for clarification, how it's written here would allow for a business to set up

770
01:04:17,420 --> 01:04:24,600
to be able to sell guns, ammunition, targets, all that, but the primary focus is still the

771
01:04:24,600 --> 01:04:29,760
range itself is what this is stating. When it doesn't prohibit anybody from having any

772
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:35,360
temporary cell in a commercial zone. When we went through the process of updating

773
01:04:35,360 --> 01:04:42,640
the industrial code, that question came up often. And the answer was, and the intent was,

774
01:04:43,220 --> 01:04:47,720
is, okay, let's say you have a truck repair place. Are you going to be able to sell some,

775
01:04:47,800 --> 01:04:53,300
even though it's a repair place, are you going to be able to sell some wheels or something

776
01:04:53,300 --> 01:04:58,780
hang from your mirror or what have you yeah we're not going to go in there and say no no your truck

777
01:04:58,780 --> 01:05:06,480
repair you can't have any sales so that that's kind of the idea behind it most services also have

778
01:05:06,480 --> 01:05:14,890
some kind of sale are you saying the pubs or in goods can put in a shooting range no I'm not saying

779
01:05:14,890 --> 01:05:20,950
that right now no they have an archery range I I hope I said that they're in a commercial zone

780
01:05:20,950 --> 01:05:22,030
They're not in one of these.

781
01:05:22,090 --> 01:05:23,390
Yeah, and they have an archery range.

782
01:05:23,530 --> 01:05:24,710
They shooting range.

783
01:05:24,950 --> 01:05:27,450
And we do, by the way, include archery

784
01:05:27,450 --> 01:05:29,510
in this industrial one.

785
01:05:30,670 --> 01:05:33,990
But we had a certain request in the planning commission

786
01:05:33,990 --> 01:05:35,070
dealt with that request.

787
01:05:35,730 --> 01:05:38,750
If you guys want an addition, that's fine.

788
01:05:38,990 --> 01:05:41,370
It's a planning commissional look at it.

789
01:05:43,560 --> 01:05:46,020
Mr. Hutchins, so your honor, it's

790
01:05:46,020 --> 01:05:47,120
based on all this discussion.

791
01:05:47,240 --> 01:05:51,000
It seems that this ordinance does cover what

792
01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:58,380
Mr. Wallen is talking about it. I mean, as opposed to going out there and promoting big

793
01:05:58,380 --> 01:06:05,040
time outlet for sale of more firearms. But I mean, anybody comes to this shooting range.

794
01:06:05,040 --> 01:06:14,340
It sounds like they can buy a gun and ammunition. And I think the main thrust of this was to have

795
01:06:14,340 --> 01:06:19,580
a shooting range for law enforcement. And that was my understanding the background. And

796
01:06:19,580 --> 01:06:23,600
And I'm not that interested in promoting any more outlets for sales of guns.

797
01:06:24,600 --> 01:06:25,880
I'll say that.

798
01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:30,020
But I think this covers what I heard was the original interest.

799
01:06:31,820 --> 01:06:34,780
I don't know, Mr. Waln, does that cover it?

800
01:06:35,100 --> 01:06:39,800
I know that commercial industrial and commercial area was one that you talked about.

801
01:06:41,000 --> 01:06:46,100
I don't think we'll ever get indoor shooting range for firearms at Bob's.

802
01:06:46,940 --> 01:06:48,180
I just don't see that happening.

803
01:06:49,080 --> 01:06:56,900
I wish I had gotten as clear answer to my question prior to the meeting that I didn't.

804
01:06:58,980 --> 01:07:06,600
You know, I can't say I'm 100% satisfied, but I certainly wouldn't be opposed to the ordinance.

805
01:07:06,620 --> 01:07:10,040
I wouldn't oppose the ordinance, but I don't think it's clear.

806
01:07:10,040 --> 01:07:20,020
here. I don't know how we enforce the incidental use or whether we're measuring the square

807
01:07:20,020 --> 01:07:23,700
footage of the range versus the retail area or what have you.

808
01:07:26,580 --> 01:07:28,140
Still, I feel like the

809
01:07:28,140 --> 01:07:31,980
commission could probably give a little look at it, but I could also go along with Council

810
01:07:31,980 --> 01:07:40,500
moving forward if you felt compelled to, but we had one touch on this when we were asked

811
01:07:40,500 --> 01:07:44,260
to have the attorney draft in ordinance. This is our first touch of actually considering

812
01:07:44,260 --> 01:07:50,900
the language of this ordinance, and it's going to have substantial impact going forward.

813
01:07:51,400 --> 01:07:54,780
We have at least three entities who may want to do indoor shooting ranges.

814
01:07:55,360 --> 01:08:00,980
Mr. Moody, just for clarification, I think it's at the point. If the retail side per shows

815
01:08:00,980 --> 01:08:07,940
has it's more profitable than the range side if it's still a second you know is

816
01:08:07,940 --> 01:08:16,260
that is it no longer an incidental and secondary function because you could sell

817
01:08:16,260 --> 01:08:21,100
ten guns and make a lot of money off of selling ten guns compared to running out

818
01:08:21,100 --> 01:08:26,200
of lane to shoot out you know to for target practice through a hundred different

819
01:08:26,200 --> 01:08:33,460
people. I mean, where's the line? How is that defined by code, by your rules that this is

820
01:08:34,180 --> 01:08:40,740
from primary to secondary? Typically, it's defined when a building permit is applied for and

821
01:08:40,740 --> 01:08:45,800
they're showing the primary uses of the building. We look at zoning at that time as well to make

822
01:08:45,800 --> 01:08:56,180
sure that the use is permitted in the zoning district. And if they show, just for example, if they

823
01:08:56,180 --> 01:09:06,120
shooting range, we would say I'm sorry that is not a secondary or ancillary use to the shooting range. Your shooting range is ancillary to your sales and then it would not be allowed.

824
01:09:06,440 --> 01:09:11,120
Okay, so flip the numbers around. Yeah, but the numbers around and then there's no issue.

825
01:09:13,800 --> 01:09:23,280
Council, can we kind of bring this to final decision here? Do we have any more? Mr. Wall, and what's your pleasure on your any

826
01:09:26,160 --> 01:09:27,920
further comment or discussion?

827
01:09:30,140 --> 01:09:35,500
So your other the motion is to send this back to the planning commission for further.

828
01:09:36,260 --> 01:09:49,160
Further review and for them to look at commercial zone and commercial industrial and so on and look at expanding the.

829
01:09:49,720 --> 01:09:57,180
I guess we don't have to expand because it sounds like that's part of it now after having it.

830
01:09:58,560 --> 01:10:03,720
I believe basically we're sending it back to planning commission to

831
01:10:03,720 --> 01:10:10,580
understanding to allow more preventable zoning areas to allow gun shooting

832
01:10:10,580 --> 01:10:14,020
ranges at this time. Is that basically where we're at on this is my

833
01:10:14,020 --> 01:10:19,660
understanding to allow more other than just the commercial because I'm getting a

834
01:10:19,660 --> 01:10:25,240
little lost on some expectations here. Pretty convoluted. You have if you want you

835
01:10:25,240 --> 01:10:31,000
You can vote this down past the motion and then amend it at some time, and yes.

836
01:10:32,040 --> 01:10:35,120
I'm kind of with Mr. Hutchinson, it feels like this does everything.

837
01:10:36,280 --> 01:10:40,760
Mr. Wall wants to do, except be located in a retail area.

838
01:10:41,480 --> 01:10:44,820
I think it's adequate, I think it's what the people who are interested in a shooting range

839
01:10:44,820 --> 01:10:49,100
want, so I don't believe I can support the, or will support the amendment, I think that the

840
01:10:49,100 --> 01:10:51,960
planning commission is done what they've been asked to do.

841
01:10:54,620 --> 01:11:01,100
Okay, the motion is to send it back to the Planning Commission. Any further comment on that?

842
01:11:01,360 --> 01:11:07,920
Well, I feel the same way. I think it's adequate for the purposes at this point. So I don't

843
01:11:07,920 --> 01:11:12,840
really see any purpose in sending it back to the Planning Commission at this point. I mean,

844
01:11:14,180 --> 01:11:19,960
any ordinance can be adjusted amended over time. So I don't know, I think at this point,

845
01:11:19,960 --> 01:11:23,000
and I don't see any purpose in sending it back to the planning commission.

846
01:11:23,680 --> 01:11:24,460
Mr. Wallin.

847
01:11:24,860 --> 01:11:27,740
As I said, Mr. Mayor, I can go along with the ordinance as written

848
01:11:28,700 --> 01:11:33,540
but I expect from what I'm hearing that if said commercial

849
01:11:34,500 --> 01:11:38,400
or shooting ranges installed and if an operator wants to sell

850
01:11:38,960 --> 01:11:42,080
firearms and ammunition for retail that they be allowed to do such.

851
01:11:42,440 --> 01:11:45,660
I mean that's what I'm hearing and I hope that the effect of what I'm hearing tonight

852
01:11:45,660 --> 01:11:48,820
is actually translated into the ordinance it's before us

853
01:11:48,820 --> 01:11:52,040
As we're being told it is and that they're actually permitted to do so

854
01:11:52,040 --> 01:11:55,820
So if that were the case, you know, then I could go along with it

855
01:11:56,840 --> 01:11:57,360
Let's

856
01:11:57,900 --> 01:12:00,760
Any further comment call for the question you're under

857
01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:07,670
All in favor say aye all opposed say aye

858
01:12:10,390 --> 01:12:12,710
Please raise your hands for no

859
01:12:13,390 --> 01:12:18,610
No, yes against for them. Thank you. Motion fails

860
01:12:18,610 --> 01:12:33,310
Mr. Mayor I move we adopt ordinance 30 to 54. I'll second the move. Seconded to adopt the ordinance as presented number 32 54. Is there any further comment on that seeing none all in favor say aye?

861
01:12:34,690 --> 01:12:35,330
Opposed

862
01:12:35,330 --> 01:12:37,030
motion carries

863
01:12:38,330 --> 01:12:40,450
Next on the agenda is

864
01:12:41,110 --> 01:12:47,150
ordinance creating a public development authority for college County for the college County event center

865
01:12:47,150 --> 01:12:50,950
Ms. Davis, would you read that by title only please?

866
01:12:51,850 --> 01:12:55,470
An ordinance creating the Longview Public Development Authority,

867
01:12:55,670 --> 01:12:58,930
granting a charter to the Longview Public Development Authority,

868
01:12:59,650 --> 01:13:04,230
approving by-laws for such authority, and providing for an effective date.

869
01:13:07,020 --> 01:13:09,100
Do I have a motion to accept?

870
01:13:09,420 --> 01:13:10,320
I think I'm...

871
01:13:10,320 --> 01:13:10,680
Second.

872
01:13:11,220 --> 01:13:11,440
Okay.

873
01:13:12,300 --> 01:13:13,220
That worked.

874
01:13:13,540 --> 01:13:14,480
Don't get run over.

875
01:13:15,220 --> 01:13:17,780
We have a motion to approve.

876
01:13:17,780 --> 01:13:21,100
move? Do we have a staff report at all on this?

877
01:13:21,920 --> 01:13:25,140
Well, just briefly, Council, we had a workshop on the public development authorities

878
01:13:25,140 --> 01:13:28,800
and some of the applications of this a couple of months ago on this.

879
01:13:29,420 --> 01:13:33,940
Again, this is a proposal that we would create a, it's a

880
01:13:33,940 --> 01:13:38,900
be a municipal corporation that referred to as a public under the public development authority

881
01:13:38,900 --> 01:13:45,020
statute. The purpose of this particular public development authority is to affect the implementation

882
01:13:45,020 --> 01:13:49,700
of the Calitz County Event Center and Conference Center Master Plan.

883
01:13:49,840 --> 01:13:54,940
We were a partner in that master plan several years ago.

884
01:13:55,820 --> 01:14:02,040
And this is one of the vehicles that we think would be a good tool

885
01:14:02,040 --> 01:14:07,040
to allow us to actually entertain and invite the private sector into seeing some

886
01:14:07,040 --> 01:14:12,140
of those facilities, i.e. I think in particular we think the equestrian,

887
01:14:12,140 --> 01:14:18,780
and the hotel and the indoor sports complex lend themselves very well to the private sector development

888
01:14:18,780 --> 01:14:22,960
and in talking to the county having a public development authority, municipal corporation

889
01:14:22,960 --> 01:14:27,300
and the ability to transfer property or convey property to a public authority

890
01:14:27,300 --> 01:14:31,300
and then a public development authority having the ability to work with the private sector

891
01:14:31,300 --> 01:14:33,920
this seems to be a real viable tool for that.

892
01:14:34,080 --> 01:14:39,000
And so we have been working with Kalas County as well as the public facilities district

893
01:14:39,000 --> 01:14:44,520
who are the main two users and tenants over there at the Expo Center and they have

894
01:14:44,520 --> 01:14:48,920
encouraged us to create this and make this additional tool available to them

895
01:14:48,920 --> 01:14:52,500
for the implementation of that. I know a representative of the Public

896
01:14:52,500 --> 01:14:56,600
Facilities District and Calis County are also here tonight if you have questions

897
01:14:56,600 --> 01:14:57,740
or want to speak to this too.

898
01:14:57,740 --> 01:14:59,900
You have a question of staff before.

899
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:29,880
So we go to the, yeah, just a quick question from staff. And we talked about this before about this is a, a commission is going to be a point of five members to serve for your terms. Good. We do anything with the bylaws to set those split terms. We have not, the ordinance language hasn't been changed to do that. So, um, so they would be appointed for for your terms. Um, maybe see the attorney of McNamara, is there a ability? If we, when we appoint those to do those in staggered terms, how would that work?

900
01:15:29,880 --> 01:15:34,880
Yeah, you could do that and stay in terms. Initially, the idea is to point them all for the initial four-year terms.

901
01:15:35,440 --> 01:15:42,100
And then once they have adopted their bylaws, they can amend their bylaws to adopt mechanisms for, you know,

902
01:15:42,580 --> 01:15:47,120
setting the, how the rotation of board members would come about.

903
01:15:47,900 --> 01:15:49,280
But they're all going to be for four-year.

904
01:15:49,300 --> 01:15:51,080
Initially, they would be for four-member terms, right?

905
01:15:51,380 --> 01:15:52,380
Okay, into the four-year.

906
01:15:53,400 --> 01:16:01,340
They could be reappointed or they could then have a by-laws in place by that point which would address the staggering of terms.

907
01:16:02,820 --> 01:16:06,020
And we're not approving the by-laws that we have here.

908
01:16:07,320 --> 01:16:09,780
You are approving an initial set of by-laws.

909
01:16:10,260 --> 01:16:15,280
Yes, that's the exhibit say the charter and the by-laws are part of the ordinance as well.

910
01:16:15,280 --> 01:16:21,580
but the public thought authority once appointed they'll have the ability they

911
01:16:21,580 --> 01:16:24,420
can't change the charter on their own but they can't change their bylaws with

912
01:16:24,420 --> 01:16:32,120
by by board question mr. Hutchinson your honor just looking at this article

913
01:16:32,120 --> 01:16:39,720
seven board I need a little clarification so it says the existing PDA board members

914
01:16:39,720 --> 01:16:44,960
shall recommend new board. I'm confused. I thought we were creating a PDA.

915
01:16:45,420 --> 01:16:48,580
There's already an existing PDA. I don't understand.

916
01:16:48,580 --> 01:16:52,760
I'm not an existing PDA. If you're looking at Article 7 of the charter, so you're saying

917
01:16:52,760 --> 01:16:58,560
once it's created, then the existing PDA board members shall recommend new board members

918
01:16:58,560 --> 01:17:02,840
to the City Council. Correct, one for their replacement.

919
01:17:03,200 --> 01:17:06,900
Right, okay. Initially, once they are in place, Council will establish who those initial

920
01:17:06,900 --> 01:17:11,800
members are, as time goes by, they can make recommendations for replacement of additional

921
01:17:11,800 --> 01:17:12,240
board members.

922
01:17:12,660 --> 01:17:16,860
And it also goes on to talk about an executive committee or something.

923
01:17:18,480 --> 01:17:20,060
Five member executive?

924
01:17:21,080 --> 01:17:26,980
They may provide for an executive committee basically just to handle management issues.

925
01:17:28,980 --> 01:17:37,540
So the executive committee would be responsible for the operations of the PDA and not the

926
01:17:37,540 --> 01:17:40,520
The board would just oversee this, is that all?

927
01:17:41,060 --> 01:17:44,960
The board would be dependent upon the board how they want to establish it.

928
01:17:45,020 --> 01:17:50,160
The board can have an executive director who could be one of the board members or they

929
01:17:50,160 --> 01:17:56,580
can, as it's provided in Article 6, they can contract with the City of Longview to have the

930
01:17:57,140 --> 01:18:02,620
City Manager or some other designee serve as executive director to do the managerial running

931
01:18:02,620 --> 01:18:04,880
of the operations of the board.

932
01:18:04,880 --> 01:18:10,920
So that was another question I had. So is there going to be a cost then to the city if we provide the executive director?

933
01:18:11,200 --> 01:18:12,180
Is that a cost that

934
01:18:13,040 --> 01:18:15,300
Comes from this city to support this?

935
01:18:15,460 --> 01:18:15,660
The

936
01:18:16,520 --> 01:18:21,200
Provides that the authority can contract with the city for longer. We don't necessarily have to bill them for that.

937
01:18:21,360 --> 01:18:22,060
I mean we can make

938
01:18:22,920 --> 01:18:26,920
Staff available to them at the direction of the city manager and that's up to the

939
01:18:26,920 --> 01:18:30,620
The city initially how to how to make that provision. There's no

940
01:18:30,620 --> 01:18:35,900
requirement that we be financially compensated for the support of it.

941
01:18:36,220 --> 01:18:40,880
The contemplation is that initially getting the public development up and

942
01:18:40,880 --> 01:18:45,860
running, they would have support from City Manager's Office and the City Attorney's

943
01:18:45,860 --> 01:18:53,020
Office as they engage in their activities and are engaged in raising revenue they

944
01:18:53,020 --> 01:18:57,780
might then have the ability to either contract out for the Road and Inhouse

945
01:18:57,780 --> 01:19:02,240
council or have if they want to have their own executive director and a

946
01:19:02,240 --> 01:19:04,960
non-board member they could do that on their own but initially I don't think

947
01:19:04,960 --> 01:19:09,660
there's any provision in here that would require an expense or a cost to the

948
01:19:09,660 --> 01:19:15,640
city because we this hasn't been really discussed as part of the budget so I see

949
01:19:15,640 --> 01:19:19,240
this as a whole other enterprise I'm just I'm not against this I just see this as

950
01:19:19,240 --> 01:19:23,440
a concern that this is a whole other enterprise and we're going to provide

951
01:19:23,440 --> 01:19:25,920
support staff to get this up and run.

952
01:19:28,000 --> 01:19:30,960
I'm just kind of concerned that they're

953
01:19:30,960 --> 01:19:35,660
looking at we should have additional staff to actually do this if we're

954
01:19:35,660 --> 01:19:40,700
going to do it the right way. Could I speak at that? I guess I'm envisioning

955
01:19:40,700 --> 01:19:45,500
initially that you know part of my responsibilities and duties are public

956
01:19:45,500 --> 01:19:51,140
economic development and I have already been working with the PFD in the county on

957
01:19:51,140 --> 01:19:55,160
the Expo Center site in PDA. So I guess I'm right now I'm kind of looking at this initially

958
01:19:55,160 --> 01:20:01,080
initial startup. I would probably if the if the new board asked for an executive director

959
01:20:01,080 --> 01:20:05,140
or some assistant there I would offer and say I would be willing to do that as part of my

960
01:20:05,140 --> 01:20:09,360
duties that I already have there. I think if they get up and running and have a whole

961
01:20:09,360 --> 01:20:15,200
to a viable hotel and a comp you know a questionnaire facility and start generating some revenues

962
01:20:15,200 --> 01:20:19,620
that I would expect that I would become a lot more than just a little bit of my time to support them.

963
01:20:19,620 --> 01:20:22,480
at that point, they probably need to think about hiring an executive director, whether

964
01:20:22,480 --> 01:20:26,340
it's contracting the city of Longview or they could hire their own executive director.

965
01:20:26,560 --> 01:20:30,140
So once they got up and running, then they would probably bring a person, separate person

966
01:20:30,140 --> 01:20:30,640
into that role.

967
01:20:30,640 --> 01:20:31,500
That's how I envision that.

968
01:20:31,560 --> 01:20:32,200
That's how I envision that.

969
01:20:32,340 --> 01:20:35,540
But I think initially, you know, I wouldn't envision I'm going to spend a whole lot more

970
01:20:35,540 --> 01:20:39,500
time than I haven't already with the conference center and the PFD supporting them right now

971
01:20:39,500 --> 01:20:42,160
with what they've been trying to do at the conference center.

972
01:20:42,500 --> 01:20:43,780
Further questions of staff?

973
01:20:44,180 --> 01:20:44,580
Mary Jane?

974
01:20:44,580 --> 01:20:49,800
I see that long views bring some resources to the table with with the city manager

975
01:20:49,800 --> 01:20:54,860
I'm assuming that the county is also bringing some resources from staff support to the table to help

976
01:20:54,860 --> 01:21:01,480
I would hope that they have some mankind and possibly the public facilities district also as we begin embarking on you know

977
01:21:01,480 --> 01:21:05,140
Whether it's the hotel of the indoor sports complex or equestrian

978
01:21:05,140 --> 01:21:07,920
Initially yes because I do worry about the budget all the same

979
01:21:07,920 --> 01:21:14,020
We've got executive direction. We've got staff support for a new board and you know that takes time

980
01:21:14,020 --> 01:21:15,380
and staff time and staff energy.

981
01:21:15,660 --> 01:21:17,300
Yeah, but this is only longer.

982
01:21:17,640 --> 01:21:20,020
That doesn't include social or the county.

983
01:21:20,680 --> 01:21:21,800
This is the long use.

984
01:21:22,060 --> 01:21:23,400
What long is creating the PDA?

985
01:21:25,600 --> 01:21:27,820
There are any other further questions of staff

986
01:21:27,820 --> 01:21:29,500
before we go to the citizens.

987
01:21:29,500 --> 01:21:31,600
And then we will go to discussion.

988
01:21:32,420 --> 01:21:35,580
Is there anybody that would like to speak to this,

989
01:21:35,920 --> 01:21:40,760
Mr. Eisner or anybody that can see Brian's out there?

990
01:21:40,760 --> 01:21:43,520
and welcome permission.

991
01:21:44,020 --> 01:21:45,160
It's great to be here.

992
01:21:45,900 --> 01:21:46,580
Good evening, Council.

993
01:21:47,160 --> 01:21:48,300
Mayor, staff.

994
01:21:49,060 --> 01:21:50,260
Thank you all for this opportunity to come here.

995
01:21:50,340 --> 01:21:51,160
Talk about the PDA.

996
01:21:51,280 --> 01:21:53,340
We've been working on the PDA for several months now.

997
01:21:54,680 --> 01:21:55,480
Great question.

998
01:21:55,540 --> 01:21:57,300
Could I interrupt you for just one second?

999
01:21:57,520 --> 01:21:59,460
Yeah, before you give your name and city of residence.

1000
01:21:59,760 --> 01:22:00,700
Oh, of course I can.

1001
01:22:01,120 --> 01:22:02,540
My name is Jim Meisner.

1002
01:22:02,720 --> 01:22:04,900
Calis County Commissioner District 3, live at Silver Lake.

1003
01:22:05,280 --> 01:22:05,720
Thank you.

1004
01:22:06,080 --> 01:22:06,440
You're welcome.

1005
01:22:07,640 --> 01:22:09,720
With the counties bringing to this particular PDA

1006
01:22:09,720 --> 01:22:14,520
from the office that would be the land, about 48 acres of fairgrounds property right now

1007
01:22:14,520 --> 01:22:15,220
that we have.

1008
01:22:15,740 --> 01:22:21,540
The PDA is a multi-win facet here, for long view what it could be is that whatever is built

1009
01:22:21,540 --> 01:22:26,260
on that property that is generating revenue, obviously that would end up back in long

1010
01:22:26,260 --> 01:22:27,260
view in great part.

1011
01:22:27,680 --> 01:22:30,760
For the county, you have to consider that we have all that acreage over there around the

1012
01:22:30,760 --> 01:22:31,320
conference center.

1013
01:22:31,720 --> 01:22:36,120
The conference center, the Expo Center events or whatever we want to call it, is hit

1014
01:22:36,120 --> 01:22:40,500
somewhat of what you might call peak performance. Since its inception every year the staff

1015
01:22:40,500 --> 01:22:44,860
stood a wonderful job of attracting venues to the event center. But because there's

1016
01:22:44,860 --> 01:22:48,660
not a hotel and there's not other amenities around there we've really hit about the maximum

1017
01:22:48,660 --> 01:22:52,880
that we can go. When we ask people why didn't you choose us you know they'll call up and

1018
01:22:52,880 --> 01:22:56,660
ultimately decide to go somewhere else but we ask them. Why didn't you choose is that there's

1019
01:22:56,660 --> 01:23:01,820
not a nearby hotel accommodation. There's not a restaurant or something with them walking

1020
01:23:01,820 --> 01:23:07,920
distance. So a master plan was written on the events in a property, overall that 48 acres,

1021
01:23:08,080 --> 01:23:13,280
of things that could happen there. And we spoke about an equestrian center, I think Mr. Gregory

1022
01:23:13,280 --> 01:23:18,840
had spoken about indoor sports complex and restaurants, hotels, actually have approached us in the

1023
01:23:18,840 --> 01:23:24,040
last year. We've reached out for them. With the PDA does, the PDA has the ability. And that board

1024
01:23:24,040 --> 01:23:28,520
has the ability to do something that we don't necessarily have the opportunity to do as council members

1025
01:23:28,980 --> 01:23:34,060
that is to reach out and engage with the development community to say, hey, this property is available.

1026
01:23:34,640 --> 01:23:38,200
We do have that master plan with the conference center and those grounds.

1027
01:23:38,760 --> 01:23:43,460
It's not to say that somebody with a developer with a great idea couldn't come in and say, hey, I got a great idea.

1028
01:23:43,560 --> 01:23:45,040
This would work really well here.

1029
01:23:45,560 --> 01:23:50,140
And then the conveyance of that, the county is unable to issue a portion of that property that they're looking at.

1030
01:23:50,660 --> 01:23:54,740
Turn it over to the PDA and the PDA negotiates that deal with that entity.

1031
01:23:54,800 --> 01:23:56,240
It's a lot cleaner way to do that.

1032
01:23:56,680 --> 01:24:06,000
For the county, it's great that we've got that property, but I'll tell you the fairgrounds and the fair and the rodeo, they're wonderful to have in the community, they break even.

1033
01:24:06,580 --> 01:24:08,700
They cost us about as much as they cost to run.

1034
01:24:09,940 --> 01:24:12,980
Taking care of those grounds costs about $150,000 a year.

1035
01:24:13,840 --> 01:24:19,620
The event center itself is the opposite. The event center actually receives less and less of a subsidy every year.

1036
01:24:19,720 --> 01:24:22,220
It's about to hit $1 million mark. It's very close right now.

1037
01:24:22,220 --> 01:24:25,340
So PDAs are successful, not all the time.

1038
01:24:26,000 --> 01:24:29,340
You want to watch your PDAs, but many PDAs are very successful.

1039
01:24:29,440 --> 01:24:31,220
They'll say a Pike Street market up in Seattle.

1040
01:24:31,700 --> 01:24:32,420
That's a PDA.

1041
01:24:32,880 --> 01:24:36,000
Very similar to PDA would be the Hilton Conference Center

1042
01:24:36,000 --> 01:24:37,800
down there in Vancouver to take a look at that one.

1043
01:24:37,920 --> 01:24:40,380
And that's how we helped to set the framework for this one.

1044
01:24:40,500 --> 01:24:42,320
So I'm here essentially just to say,

1045
01:24:42,440 --> 01:24:44,260
I'm very much in support of this.

1046
01:24:45,420 --> 01:24:46,840
Even getting to where we are right now,

1047
01:24:46,900 --> 01:24:48,200
it wasn't just a rubber stamp thing.

1048
01:24:48,300 --> 01:24:50,220
Actually several times we went back, looked at the language.

1049
01:24:50,220 --> 01:24:54,160
We did engage with the folks from Vancouver, the people who wrote the PDA around the Hilton.

1050
01:24:54,580 --> 01:24:58,680
How did you do this? How is it working? So we did that research before we got to the point we were at today.

1051
01:24:59,060 --> 01:25:03,120
So just look forward to your support on this and thank you all for your service by the way.

1052
01:25:03,140 --> 01:25:06,440
It's great to be here. I haven't been here yet with some of your new council members.

1053
01:25:06,440 --> 01:25:08,780
And since I was here last, it's nice to see you all.

1054
01:25:09,380 --> 01:25:10,960
Any questions have happened to answer them.

1055
01:25:13,040 --> 01:25:14,980
Thank you. You're wonderful. You bet. Have a great evening.

1056
01:25:23,780 --> 01:25:28,620
Brian Magneson, Longview, Washington, and I am a public facilities district commissioner

1057
01:25:28,620 --> 01:25:34,220
and we've been in existence for a little over 10 years and see as Commissioner Meisner

1058
01:25:34,220 --> 01:25:35,680
has said it's been a very successful.

1059
01:25:35,820 --> 01:25:41,600
I was looking back at our numbers that we've done from when we first opened it up and to

1060
01:25:41,600 --> 01:25:48,640
now and we're just about ready to go for a million dollars and that is why the four, there

1061
01:25:48,640 --> 01:25:54,380
was the P.F.D., the City of Longview, City of Kelsoon County, we put together 25,000 each

1062
01:25:54,380 --> 01:25:59,340
to put this study together. And you know, I want to make sure that the study doesn't

1063
01:25:59,340 --> 01:26:07,580
sit up in the bookshelf. I want to make sure that it gets exercised. And so I'm pretty

1064
01:26:07,580 --> 01:26:12,240
certain that you guys are in favor of this tonight, but I just want you to know that from

1065
01:26:12,240 --> 01:26:18,860
the PFD we are in favor we we voted to support it and we really look forward to

1066
01:26:18,860 --> 01:26:24,160
bringing more revenue. I'm pretty excited about a indoor sports complex on that

1067
01:26:24,160 --> 01:26:28,900
west side of seventh as well as the hotel and I think the revenue that that

1068
01:26:28,900 --> 01:26:32,340
will create will then put money back on the other side of the street to be able to

1069
01:26:32,340 --> 01:26:37,520
do more with the equestrian and it'll feed upon itself to finally utilize that 48

1070
01:26:37,520 --> 01:26:45,820
acres to its potential. Thanks. Any questions of Ryan? Yes. Just one clarification. What's the

1071
01:26:45,820 --> 01:26:51,300
difference between the public facilities districts in a PDA? So public facilities district does not have

1072
01:26:51,300 --> 01:26:58,940
the authority that the PDA does. We do not have the ability to attract or to have the land.

1073
01:27:00,180 --> 01:27:05,640
So in other words, the PDA public development authority has the ability to take land and sell it

1074
01:27:05,640 --> 01:27:09,280
and lease it and do things with it that the PFD does not have.

1075
01:27:10,600 --> 01:27:15,240
The other main difference is the public facilities district was created and has a certain

1076
01:27:15,240 --> 01:27:19,900
tax revenue that's been allocated by the state that generates a revenue source for the

1077
01:27:19,900 --> 01:27:21,380
PFD to do things like that.

1078
01:27:21,660 --> 01:27:25,500
The PDA, just because you create a PDA, doesn't come with a revenue stream to go along with

1079
01:27:25,500 --> 01:27:25,760
that.

1080
01:27:27,520 --> 01:27:35,080
So, one other question, so the PDA, if it goes and sells bonds for a project, is that that's

1081
01:27:35,080 --> 01:27:36,480
part of what you can do with the PDA?

1082
01:27:37,100 --> 01:27:38,700
I don't see it that way.

1083
01:27:39,060 --> 01:27:40,720
What I would see happening here is that,

1084
01:27:40,980 --> 01:27:45,180
so what the PDA does is it's a mechanism to be able to accept

1085
01:27:45,180 --> 01:27:46,740
land from the county.

1086
01:27:47,060 --> 01:27:49,920
So let's just say the aid acres, it's on the west side of

1087
01:27:49,920 --> 01:27:53,560
seventh, they would be able to, as you will,

1088
01:27:53,680 --> 01:27:54,860
deed that to the PDA.

1089
01:27:55,920 --> 01:27:58,900
And so now we would have the ability to go out and attract,

1090
01:27:58,960 --> 01:28:02,280
let's say, a Hilton Honors, maybe a 50-bed type,

1091
01:28:02,280 --> 01:28:06,100
and maybe it's somebody, maybe it's a public private adventure,

1092
01:28:06,220 --> 01:28:09,560
maybe it's something where instead of selling them the land,

1093
01:28:09,560 --> 01:28:11,380
you would have some type of a lease arrangement

1094
01:28:11,380 --> 01:28:15,880
and have some type of a share based on the revenue

1095
01:28:16,520 --> 01:28:18,140
or maybe you just sell it outright.

1096
01:28:19,060 --> 01:28:20,300
Same would go with the sports.

1097
01:28:22,100 --> 01:28:23,500
So what I was trying to get around to,

1098
01:28:23,660 --> 01:28:27,640
one paragraph here says the purpose of securing the exemption

1099
01:28:27,640 --> 01:28:31,740
from federal income taxation has to do here

1100
01:28:31,740 --> 01:28:41,820
with revenue code and that the interest that could be earned is tax exempt is what I'm

1101
01:28:41,820 --> 01:28:47,140
reading. I'm just trying to understand how that works. Is that part of the incentive

1102
01:28:48,080 --> 01:28:49,200
under a PDA?

1103
01:28:52,000 --> 01:28:58,000
Well, it says the purpose of securing exemption from federal income taxation

1104
01:28:58,000 --> 01:29:00,840
for interest on obligations of the authority.

1105
01:29:03,040 --> 01:29:04,360
I'm just trying to understand how it's going to be.

1106
01:29:04,360 --> 01:29:04,840
No, that's right.

1107
01:29:04,960 --> 01:29:05,540
That's a good question.

1108
01:29:05,660 --> 01:29:06,940
I can't speak to that exactly.

1109
01:29:07,340 --> 01:29:11,400
But what I can speak to is the ability for the PDA to be able

1110
01:29:11,400 --> 01:29:15,380
to receive properties and be able to utilize it to those types

1111
01:29:15,380 --> 01:29:15,900
of uses.

1112
01:29:16,580 --> 01:29:18,900
That's something that the city, that the county,

1113
01:29:19,200 --> 01:29:20,700
and that the PFD cannot do.

1114
01:29:21,980 --> 01:29:25,360
And that's the main purpose of the PDA is to be able

1115
01:29:25,360 --> 01:29:31,480
to take that property and utilize it for those types of opportunities.

1116
01:29:32,240 --> 01:29:35,120
If I might, Mr. Mack, be out of turn to his mic on.

1117
01:29:35,320 --> 01:29:36,800
Thank you, thank you, Mr. Mayor.

1118
01:29:37,120 --> 01:29:42,360
Mr. Hartzend, I was just going to point out that the provision of the charter merely illustrates

1119
01:29:42,360 --> 01:29:48,960
that four purposes, that is not the intended purpose of the PDA, it says four purposes of

1120
01:29:48,960 --> 01:29:53,440
securing income, it has the, it constitutes an authority and instrumentality of the city

1121
01:29:53,440 --> 01:29:53,980
of Longview.

1122
01:29:53,980 --> 01:29:59,740
So, under that definition of sections 103 and 145 the internal revenue.

1123
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:03,140
That is the tax status of the PDA.

1124
01:30:08,310 --> 01:30:32,310
It is to the, to whatever extent, an instrumentality of the city of Longview has tax treatment, then that is, that is how the PDA will be treated. PDAs can issue bonds as well. They can do almost anything a city can do except for taxation and the power of eminent domain. That's what I was trying to get around to is to, you know, why this is a good way to go?

1125
01:30:32,310 --> 01:30:35,330
I mean, that's just a little extra benefit.

1126
01:30:36,010 --> 01:30:41,590
The main benefit, I think, that was visualized was the management aspect of it and having

1127
01:30:41,590 --> 01:30:48,470
the separate entity for managing things such as this property, which would have the expertise

1128
01:30:48,470 --> 01:30:55,430
and the freedom from the city from potential liability and free the city from the management

1129
01:30:56,110 --> 01:30:57,450
obligations of this property.

1130
01:30:59,620 --> 01:30:59,860
Thank you.

1131
01:31:01,140 --> 01:31:03,140
Any further questions of Ryan?

1132
01:31:03,660 --> 01:31:05,680
Thank you for all you do, my friends, if you'd like.

1133
01:31:10,530 --> 01:31:14,610
Any one else in the audience would like to speak to this issue?

1134
01:31:15,650 --> 01:31:18,470
Council, discussion amongst yourselves.

1135
01:31:18,750 --> 01:31:21,370
If not, will your honor?

1136
01:31:21,670 --> 01:31:21,790
Yes.

1137
01:31:22,070 --> 01:31:30,230
I think Mr. Botero mentioned about staggered terms which makes sense to me and so would we

1138
01:31:30,230 --> 01:31:34,030
We need to make an amendment to include that here because it doesn't say that.

1139
01:31:34,450 --> 01:31:38,530
No, because that comes from the governing body of the PDA when they get put together.

1140
01:31:39,130 --> 01:31:42,170
They set the a parameter for their bylaws, not us.

1141
01:31:42,710 --> 01:31:42,890
Okay.

1142
01:31:43,210 --> 01:31:44,750
And then one other question.

1143
01:31:45,730 --> 01:31:50,010
So the members of the PDA are appointed by the city council.

1144
01:31:50,630 --> 01:31:55,750
So I'm assuming would they be appointed in the same manner that we make other appointments,

1145
01:31:56,070 --> 01:31:57,330
there'd be no different than.

1146
01:31:57,330 --> 01:32:04,870
Right. I think I read where the where the mayor makes the appointment and the council ratifies or something like that effect.

1147
01:32:06,210 --> 01:32:10,590
Um, the committee gets together and picked up and yeah, bring it to council.

1148
01:32:11,310 --> 01:32:20,130
All the locations. The final point is by the city council. That's how the charter sets up. Right. So it's the same process as we would follow further. Right. Right. Right.

1149
01:32:20,390 --> 01:32:25,210
They can think the council can do whatever process they want as far as appointing those. Yes.

1150
01:32:31,460 --> 01:32:35,680
I don't even know that it's appropriate, but I just want to bring it to the attention

1151
01:32:35,680 --> 01:32:40,060
being a mom and coming from a family and group on a farm and a ranch and all that.

1152
01:32:40,980 --> 01:32:45,940
But my question is, is we're talking about all these hotels and revenue and such for

1153
01:32:45,940 --> 01:32:46,500
the city.

1154
01:32:47,160 --> 01:32:51,320
Have we thought about maybe bringing like a kids club or roller skating rink,

1155
01:32:56,500 --> 01:32:56,500
I guess they

1156
01:32:56,500 --> 01:32:59,700
to do or something for families to bring in revenue?

1157
01:33:01,180 --> 01:33:05,120
Well, I'm not at liberty to speak to that right now but there's something in the works.

1158
01:33:06,160 --> 01:33:07,340
That is great to know.

1159
01:33:08,440 --> 01:33:08,760
Sorry.

1160
01:33:09,180 --> 01:33:09,760
Thank you.

1161
01:33:09,960 --> 01:33:10,560
Mr. Mayor.

1162
01:33:11,120 --> 01:33:11,260
Yes.

1163
01:33:12,160 --> 01:33:17,900
Mr. Mayor and the master plan for the site

1164
01:33:18,500 --> 01:33:23,080
has the indoor sports arena and all that in the master plan.

1165
01:33:23,080 --> 01:33:29,420
miss Campbell and Mr. Mayor. So master plan clearly shows all these youth

1166
01:33:29,420 --> 01:33:31,800
activities that will be able to use that site.

1167
01:33:34,040 --> 01:33:37,200
There's yeah any further

1168
01:33:37,200 --> 01:33:38,400
discussion council.

1169
01:33:41,400 --> 01:33:45,140
Seeing none. One question. Yeah so the question so so this is

1170
01:33:45,140 --> 01:33:51,460
that the motion is that the PDA would commence operation there's even a date

1171
01:33:51,460 --> 01:33:53,640
November 10th, 2013.

1172
01:33:54,480 --> 01:33:57,200
The motion is to approve ordinance 3255,

1173
01:33:57,460 --> 01:33:59,480
creating the public development authority,

1174
01:33:59,760 --> 01:34:02,800
granting a charter to the public development authority,

1175
01:34:03,120 --> 01:34:05,580
approving bylaws for such authority

1176
01:34:05,580 --> 01:34:09,740
and providing for an effective date of November 10th, 2013.

1177
01:34:10,240 --> 01:34:11,340
So that's when it takes off.

1178
01:34:11,480 --> 01:34:13,800
So by then, this council would be appointing

1179
01:34:13,800 --> 01:34:15,860
the members of the PDA.

1180
01:34:16,380 --> 01:34:18,240
The ordinance doesn't go into effect to 30 days,

1181
01:34:18,240 --> 01:34:24,100
and there's a provision in there and the council has some time within that window

1182
01:34:24,100 --> 01:34:27,360
beyond that window to appoint the members and it's not going to go into effect

1183
01:34:27,360 --> 01:34:32,680
until the members are there and operational. They have to report back some of

1184
01:34:32,680 --> 01:34:35,460
their operational things to the council by April I think of 2014.

1185
01:34:36,680 --> 01:34:41,900
Mr. Mr. Hutchinson happened to actually have a coffee before he must have had a

1186
01:34:41,900 --> 01:34:45,820
espresso or something. Mr. Miller, two things. Where did you read November 10?

1187
01:34:45,820 --> 01:34:58,640
It's information I have says November 1st on the agenda under recommended action. It says November 10 no my agenda says November 1 the

1188
01:34:58,640 --> 01:35:01,820
The first agenda summary said November 1st

1189
01:35:03,420 --> 01:35:06,820
It's effectively a 30-day effect of date for our ordinances

1190
01:35:06,820 --> 01:35:11,240
So 30 days from today from today, which is when ordinances take effect

1191
01:35:11,240 --> 01:35:19,540
Okay, the typical 30-day effective date for it. Okay, so the 30 days for today is the 10th. Okay. I'm literally I'm looking at my agenda right here

1192
01:35:19,540 --> 01:35:24,720
It says November 1. That's the current one. Have you ever heard of the I legislated agenda? Okay, it's on there

1193
01:35:24,720 --> 01:35:30,880
So all right. All right. I just want to add something to it if I could miss my head. Yeah, I was recognized as a date

1194
01:35:30,880 --> 01:35:39,540
I just want to say this is something that's a long time coming. I think that our community's talked about the underutilization of our

1195
01:35:39,540 --> 01:35:44,320
our Expo Center and our fairgrounds and the right stuff we need to take for future development

1196
01:35:44,320 --> 01:35:47,560
and economic growth in our community, so I will be supporting this.

1197
01:35:49,000 --> 01:35:50,860
Any further comment, Council?

1198
01:35:53,050 --> 01:35:54,750
Seeing none, all in favor say aye.

1199
01:35:55,370 --> 01:35:55,530
Aye.

1200
01:35:56,690 --> 01:35:57,250
Opposed?

1201
01:35:58,930 --> 01:35:59,630
Motion carries.

1202
01:35:59,890 --> 01:36:03,290
Without objections, please show us that as unanimous, Ms. Davis.

1203
01:36:07,280 --> 01:36:12,900
The next thing on our agenda is an interlocal agreement for legal services, for

1204
01:36:12,900 --> 01:36:20,040
for stormwater, NPE, D-E-S, Promet, Appeal, Ms. Davis.

1205
01:36:20,260 --> 01:36:21,540
Would you read that by title only?

1206
01:36:24,270 --> 01:36:26,710
A resolution authorizing the city manager

1207
01:36:27,300 --> 01:36:29,830
to amend the interlocal agreement for participation

1208
01:36:29,830 --> 01:36:32,450
and an appeal of the Department of Ecologies,

1209
01:36:33,190 --> 01:36:36,850
phase two national pollutant discharge elimination system,

1210
01:36:37,230 --> 01:36:39,170
N-P-D-E-S, Promet.

1211
01:36:41,600 --> 01:36:42,760
Thank you, council.

1212
01:36:42,760 --> 01:36:42,960
Council.

1213
01:36:43,520 --> 01:36:47,800
I move that we approve resolution 20-28-3.

1214
01:36:50,430 --> 01:36:52,450
Here we have a staff report that you want to do.

1215
01:36:52,450 --> 01:36:53,290
We do not know.

1216
01:36:53,410 --> 01:36:54,810
I can address that real briefly.

1217
01:36:55,330 --> 01:36:57,650
This is an interlocal authority in place.

1218
01:36:57,950 --> 01:37:03,250
Council has earlier authorized the city to participate with a number of other jurisdictions

1219
01:37:03,250 --> 01:37:08,250
who are an intervener and appeal for the pollution control of hearings board currently ongoing.

1220
01:37:09,170 --> 01:37:12,510
And so you've already authorized our participation.

1221
01:37:12,510 --> 01:37:14,890
and as we've gone on, the litigation costs have gone up.

1222
01:37:15,450 --> 01:37:19,130
So this is an authorization to expand an additional $10,000

1223
01:37:19,130 --> 01:37:22,050
as our proportionate share of litigation costs

1224
01:37:22,050 --> 01:37:22,510
in this appeal.

1225
01:37:23,590 --> 01:37:24,310
Yes, Tom?

1226
01:37:24,650 --> 01:37:28,230
Do we have any idea if this, how much higher this cost could

1227
01:37:28,230 --> 01:37:30,850
go or that's pretty much going to cover it?

1228
01:37:30,910 --> 01:37:32,130
I mean, you know, billblowers.

1229
01:37:32,350 --> 01:37:33,510
This should cover it.

1230
01:37:33,670 --> 01:37:37,970
I mean, we are in the final stages of the appeal as we speak.

1231
01:37:37,970 --> 01:37:44,530
So this is, I can't make any promises, build flowers, team what they are these days, but

1232
01:37:45,010 --> 01:37:50,970
this was, we're not doubling, this is not, earlier allocated 20,000, this is only half

1233
01:37:50,970 --> 01:37:54,090
again as much, and the contemplation was that they should see us through to the end.

1234
01:37:55,090 --> 01:37:59,830
And the funds for this comes out of the general fund, or more.

1235
01:38:02,110 --> 01:38:06,670
Any further questions or staff seeing that, is there anybody in the audience that would

1236
01:38:06,670 --> 01:38:08,110
I would like to speak to this issue.

1237
01:38:09,530 --> 01:38:15,110
Seeing none, the motion is to adopt Resolution 2883 authorizing a city manager to amend the

1238
01:38:15,110 --> 01:38:21,330
interlocal agreement to an amount of $30,000 for the city of Longview's portion of legal

1239
01:38:21,330 --> 01:38:21,830
fees.

1240
01:38:22,530 --> 01:38:23,630
On favor say aye.

1241
01:38:24,210 --> 01:38:24,410
Aye.

1242
01:38:25,010 --> 01:38:25,630
Opposed?

1243
01:38:26,410 --> 01:38:27,250
Motion carries.

1244
01:38:29,210 --> 01:38:34,030
Ms. Davis, would you read Resolution 284 by title only please?

1245
01:38:34,970 --> 01:38:52,270
A resolution authorizing the city manager into an interlocal agreement with the association of Washington City's employee benefit trust to authorize the health care program created by the trust to provide self-insured benefits to participants.

1246
01:38:54,640 --> 01:39:03,080
Mr. Gregory, do you have a yes to like to ask the HR Director Keith Larson if he can give counsel or review of what this interlocal agreement does?

1247
01:39:03,660 --> 01:39:05,440
Thank you, Mr. Gregory.

1248
01:39:05,840 --> 01:39:15,480
Counsel, the AWC Trust was formed in 1970 by the Association of Washington Cities to offer affordable coverage for cities and towns.

1249
01:39:15,480 --> 01:39:19,720
Today, the trust serves about 275 participating entities.

1250
01:39:20,440 --> 01:39:26,220
The city of Longview currently subscribes to medical, dental, vision, and employee assistance

1251
01:39:26,220 --> 01:39:26,840
programs.

1252
01:39:27,570 --> 01:39:35,120
We have 173 employees taking part in the medical program and about 290 in their dental programs.

1253
01:39:35,120 --> 01:39:45,780
This trust has just recently formed a non-self-insurance agency effect of January 1.

1254
01:39:46,300 --> 01:39:51,360
There are cost savings and tax advantages to doing this, and this interlocal agreement

1255
01:39:51,360 --> 01:39:57,380
is necessary to incorporate the City of Longview into the program and provide the coverage

1256
01:39:57,380 --> 01:39:58,920
is available to the employees.

1257
01:40:02,030 --> 01:40:07,030
Yes, Mr. Moon. I like to make a motion that we approve resolution 2084.

1258
01:40:07,430 --> 01:40:07,830
Second,

1259
01:40:09,890 --> 01:40:16,090
then move and second it. Thank you, Mr. Moon. I like you keep me on my toes.

1260
01:40:16,290 --> 01:40:22,470
I try, Mr. Mayor. I try. Is there any further questions of staff on this?

1261
01:40:23,650 --> 01:40:26,710
Is there anybody in the audience who would like to speak to this issue?

1262
01:40:27,970 --> 01:40:34,030
Council, the motion is to approve resolution 2083 authorizing a city manager to amend interlocal

1263
01:40:34,030 --> 01:40:37,490
agreement, whoops, wrong one, move down, cancel.

1264
01:40:38,190 --> 01:40:44,590
The motion is to approve resolution 2084 authorizing city manager to enter into an interlocal

1265
01:40:44,590 --> 01:40:49,350
agreement with the association of Washington City's employees benefit trust.

1266
01:40:49,770 --> 01:40:50,610
Any further comment?

1267
01:40:51,750 --> 01:40:53,270
Seeing none, all favor say aye.

1268
01:40:53,830 --> 01:40:54,050
Aye.

1269
01:40:54,050 --> 01:40:57,150
I posed, motion carries.

1270
01:40:57,790 --> 01:41:00,950
Next we have the marriage report and council members report.

1271
01:41:01,250 --> 01:41:05,970
Do we have any reports from, yes, Mr. Plotero?

1272
01:41:06,250 --> 01:41:09,770
I had a private being gone for two weeks, so maybe an hour

1273
01:41:09,770 --> 01:41:10,910
and a half will be done here.

1274
01:41:11,190 --> 01:41:11,370
OK.

1275
01:41:14,030 --> 01:41:16,550
Just a couple of things I'd like to report on our airport work

1276
01:41:16,550 --> 01:41:16,810
meetings.

1277
01:41:17,050 --> 01:41:20,390
There'll be a special workshop on October 25th at noon

1278
01:41:22,090 --> 01:41:27,570
between Kelsa Longview, the port and the county commissioners to talk about the

1279
01:41:27,570 --> 01:41:31,370
future of the airport and what we're doing with that. The only other thing I'd

1280
01:41:31,370 --> 01:41:38,070
like to bring up is I don't know how long you came on on top of things, but we

1281
01:41:38,070 --> 01:41:42,910
have two of the most outstanding lobbyists that are around. I had the

1282
01:41:42,910 --> 01:41:48,590
privilege spending some time with Joel Rubenbach and DC and the guy is

1283
01:41:48,590 --> 01:41:53,190
amazing. We have gotten more and more money's worth out of Joel Ruben back in DC.

1284
01:41:54,150 --> 01:41:57,030
And then we come back to the state of Washington and one of the most outstanding

1285
01:41:57,030 --> 01:42:04,470
members of the team is up in Olympia, Mark Brown. And if anybody in this room

1286
01:42:04,470 --> 01:42:08,770
has tennis shoes on, think they can keep up with Mark Brown. I'd like to take you up

1287
01:42:08,770 --> 01:42:15,610
with me. This guy has just amazing how he gets around up there and gets things done.

1288
01:42:15,610 --> 01:42:20,570
But we're very fortunate and I would like to publicly thank both of our lobbyists and

1289
01:42:20,570 --> 01:42:23,630
our city manager and the council for bringing these two people on board.

1290
01:42:24,090 --> 01:42:28,070
We're getting a lot done and I think the DC trip turned out to be pretty positive.

1291
01:42:29,670 --> 01:42:34,590
He's the Joel's pretty amazing isn't he, he walk into anybody's office, any of the legislators

1292
01:42:34,590 --> 01:42:40,350
and they say hi Joel, what's up and that's what it takes, thank you for doing what you

1293
01:42:40,350 --> 01:42:40,810
did Ken.

1294
01:42:41,810 --> 01:42:42,930
Do you have any further report?

1295
01:42:42,930 --> 01:42:50,070
I do but I'm not going to do them. You didn't have the coffee. I didn't drink coffee when

1296
01:42:50,070 --> 01:42:56,970
Tom. You didn't invite me. Okay. There are any further council member reports that want

1297
01:42:56,970 --> 01:43:04,190
to bring forward. If not, you have the consent calendar. What's your pleasure? I'm usually

1298
01:43:04,190 --> 01:43:08,290
approved the consent calendar in its entirety. I'll second that.

1299
01:43:09,130 --> 01:43:15,210
But moving and seconded, is there anything anybody would like to pull off for separate considerations?

1300
01:43:15,650 --> 01:43:16,670
So just a quick question.

1301
01:43:17,030 --> 01:43:19,790
Is the McClellan Arch Center, is that part of the consent calendar?

1302
01:43:20,150 --> 01:43:20,910
I believe so.

1303
01:43:21,610 --> 01:43:28,030
I don't really have any issues with it, but so other than to ask, it's done, it's going

1304
01:43:28,030 --> 01:43:30,410
to last us now for 50 years.

1305
01:43:31,710 --> 01:43:32,390
Open for business.

1306
01:43:32,890 --> 01:43:32,970
Yep.

1307
01:43:33,250 --> 01:43:35,550
He said, well, maybe next week it'll last.

1308
01:43:35,550 --> 01:43:37,170
People are in it and meeting already.

1309
01:43:37,170 --> 01:43:43,010
Good. Thank you. In the consent calendar we have approval of claims. We have liability

1310
01:43:43,010 --> 01:43:49,350
claims and lawsuits set of public hearing for their proposed revenue source for the 2014

1311
01:43:50,140 --> 01:43:51,290
general fund budget.

1312
01:43:53,590 --> 01:43:58,030
And that, no, then it's set of public hearing for the home CDBG,

1313
01:43:58,850 --> 01:44:06,370
annual performance evaluation, the paper, project completion for the McClellan Arts Center,

1314
01:44:06,370 --> 01:44:12,710
Tom and that's what's on there. Is there any further comment on the consent

1315
01:44:12,710 --> 01:44:20,670
calendar? Seeing none, all in favor say aye. Opposed? Motion carries. Manager

1316
01:44:20,670 --> 01:44:24,310
Grigory. Thank you, Council. First item I have for you tonight is a notice of

1317
01:44:24,310 --> 01:44:28,570
intent to annex. This is from Pacific fiber products and Davis Brothers

1318
01:44:28,570 --> 01:44:32,150
investments and I'm going to ask community development director John Brickie to

1319
01:44:32,150 --> 01:44:33,350
give the staff report on this.

1320
01:44:42,070 --> 01:44:43,850
Thank you, Manager Grigory. Mayor,

1321
01:44:45,410 --> 01:44:56,330
The item before you at this time is a notice of intent to annex a request by by specific

1322
01:44:56,330 --> 01:44:59,910
Fiber products for the city to consider any.

1323
01:45:08,120 --> 01:45:28,840
In conjunction with PAC Fibers, notice of intent. There is another request by Davis Brothers Investments, LLC, and that is a small parcel up in this general vicinity, and I'd like to show you the next map, which includes that property and additional properties.

1324
01:45:28,840 --> 01:45:32,420
to be included in an annexation.

1325
01:45:33,160 --> 01:45:38,740
This map shows both the PAC fiber property which is in the hash marked area.

1326
01:45:39,540 --> 01:45:47,980
And the blackened areas are some additional parcels that were staff is recommending included as well.

1327
01:45:50,480 --> 01:45:53,660
Yes, the Davis Brothers property is right here.

1328
01:45:53,840 --> 01:45:57,880
There is a property adjacent to them that would be included as well

1329
01:45:57,880 --> 01:46:03,960
because it would be completely encompassed by city boundary if it were not included in the annexation.

1330
01:46:04,680 --> 01:46:12,440
The proposed area to be annexed consists of approximately 12 parcels and comprises about 263 acres.

1331
01:46:12,740 --> 01:46:18,840
The area primarily contains log yards, wood chip, bark dust storage, and vacant land.

1332
01:46:19,580 --> 01:46:25,440
There's also a 110 acre industrial log pond within this area.

1333
01:46:25,440 --> 01:46:31,700
So, the staff was recommending that three parcels and part of another parcel be added to the annexation area.

1334
01:46:32,440 --> 01:46:39,720
Those parcels, quick description of them all, but one of those parcels needs to be included to prevent islands of land being created.

1335
01:46:40,260 --> 01:46:47,980
For instance, this parcel is one of those that should be included so that we do not create an island of land.

1336
01:46:47,980 --> 01:47:10,860
and then also the port owns a rail cord or that splits the pack fiber property and that is a separate parcel which would need to be included so that we have contiguous parcels of land that are owned by pack fiber and no without a separation there both in this location and in this location here.

1337
01:47:11,580 --> 01:47:25,480
This map was generated and provided to City Council in the meantime, about a week ago, in the meantime, staff met with the Three Rivers Waste Water Authority, which is this larger blackened parcel here.

1338
01:47:26,160 --> 01:47:35,160
They had expressed interest through their board and manager that they were interested in being included in the annexation request.

1339
01:47:35,160 --> 01:47:41,980
and, however, when we met with them this week, the board was unable to forward a recommendation

1340
01:47:41,980 --> 01:47:46,580
indicating their desire to be in the annexation petition.

1341
01:47:47,920 --> 01:47:54,440
And so, PAC Fiber has asked or requested that the TURWA personal not be included

1342
01:47:54,440 --> 01:48:03,260
with this notice of intent, the reason being that if there were some reason why the TURWA could not

1343
01:48:03,260 --> 01:48:20,980
or decided not to be included in the annexation request, their evaluation would cause the notice of intent and annexation requests to become negated and pack fiber would have to start the process all over again.

1344
01:48:20,980 --> 01:48:27,800
And I will tell you that if the three rivers wastewater treatment plant wants to annex,

1345
01:48:28,480 --> 01:48:34,440
they certainly could on their own annex after a PAC fiber-complete cell annexation process

1346
01:48:35,160 --> 01:48:36,640
if council were to approve it.

1347
01:48:37,240 --> 01:48:42,720
There is a second option for the three rivers wastewater treatment facility.

1348
01:48:43,040 --> 01:48:49,240
They could also at the time that this annexation goes before the battery review board.

1349
01:48:49,240 --> 01:48:55,380
they could request, um, invoked jurisdiction and request, uh, inclusion in the annexation

1350
01:48:55,380 --> 01:48:55,880
at that time.

1351
01:48:56,280 --> 01:49:01,660
And so there is opportunity for them to, um, annex into the city, uh, in the future

1352
01:49:01,660 --> 01:49:02,480
if they chose to.

1353
01:49:03,220 --> 01:49:08,900
With that, uh, the motion before council, uh, the staff would recommend is to accept the

1354
01:49:08,900 --> 01:49:14,880
proposed annexation request plus the, the lock year parcel, which is this blackened parcel

1355
01:49:14,880 --> 01:49:23,240
here. And the Port of Longview parcels, which are the rail corridor along here with a slight

1356
01:49:23,240 --> 01:49:29,180
enlargement of that property there and then the rail corridor along this portion.

1357
01:49:32,310 --> 01:49:33,830
Each that

1358
01:49:36,900 --> 01:49:42,060
would be all the parcels that would be included. And then the second part of this motion would be to

1359
01:49:42,060 --> 01:49:46,700
transmit the annexation request to the planning commission for a recommendation on the zoning designation

1360
01:49:46,700 --> 01:49:55,880
for the subject property and the third portion of this motion would be to require the

1361
01:49:55,880 --> 01:50:01,300
assumption of any existing city and deadness by the area to be annexed and fourth direct

1362
01:50:01,300 --> 01:50:06,220
staff to coordinate with the applicant and preparing the 60% petition to be circulated

1363
01:50:06,220 --> 01:50:12,660
by the property owners. If you have any questions, I might have missed it but it isn't

1364
01:50:12,660 --> 01:50:16,720
before is that piece of property are talking about performance sheet metal that's

1365
01:50:16,720 --> 01:50:20,880
correct that's you know Davis brothers incorporated our property development

1366
01:50:20,880 --> 01:50:30,140
yeah thank you council I don't believe I have a motion yet do so move like it before

1367
01:50:30,140 --> 01:50:42,020
uh mr. Moon jumps me thanks for keeping me honest okay is there any questions

1368
01:50:42,020 --> 01:50:44,460
questions or staff before we move forward?

1369
01:50:45,600 --> 01:50:48,880
Is there anyone, yes, I mean, you want to public go ahead?

1370
01:50:48,880 --> 01:50:53,360
That's what I was going to do, ask if there was, that was my next question.

1371
01:50:53,680 --> 01:50:54,140
Thank you, Tom.

1372
01:50:54,760 --> 01:50:58,000
Is there anybody in the audience that would like to speak to this issue?

1373
01:51:03,770 --> 01:51:06,290
Chuck Wallace, 600 block, 22nd.

1374
01:51:07,530 --> 01:51:13,010
This parcel of land is zone heavy industrial, if I'm not mistaken, is that correct?

1375
01:51:14,190 --> 01:51:20,690
Well, it's in our comprehensive plan, the recommendation to zoning will have to come from planning commission.

1376
01:51:21,270 --> 01:51:32,950
Okay, but it's current use is heavy industrial for, okay, so there's probably zero likelihood it's going to be rezoned to light industrial or commercial or anything like that.

1377
01:51:33,050 --> 01:51:34,250
It's going to be heavy industrial.

1378
01:51:34,250 --> 01:51:42,790
So, does, do we know what kind of an impact this is going to have after the city starts to collect revenue and put it into the general fund?

1379
01:51:42,890 --> 01:51:49,330
What kind of an impact that's going to have on the pending crisis in 2018?

1380
01:51:53,520 --> 01:51:56,300
The fact that this, well, that's another point.

1381
01:51:56,660 --> 01:52:00,420
I'm just more interested and I would encourage a yes vote on this.

1382
01:52:01,620 --> 01:52:10,300
the more businesses, the more productive land that we have in the city, of course the city is going to reap the benefits and that's pretty much what I'm saying.

1383
01:52:10,360 --> 01:52:20,180
But it is interesting to heavy industrial land that a couple of agenda items we had to talk about shooting ranges so thanks.

1384
01:52:21,340 --> 01:52:24,440
Thank you. Is there anybody else that would like to speak to this issue?

1385
01:52:24,440 --> 01:52:38,380
if not the motion I believe is to approve the motion to approve the what

1386
01:52:38,380 --> 01:52:45,180
Mr. Frickie read it's about two pages long so rather than read it I'm gonna

1387
01:52:45,180 --> 01:52:49,220
see if there's any further comment from council yes Tom so your other I guess

1388
01:52:49,220 --> 01:52:56,840
That's my obvious question and I'm almost afraid to ask you more questions, Ken, but I'll

1389
01:52:56,840 --> 01:52:57,340
put that down.

1390
01:52:57,620 --> 01:53:02,480
Anyway, so why is it that they want to be annexed?

1391
01:53:02,540 --> 01:53:07,500
I mean, we spent a cruddle amount of time not too long ago, with all the other industrial

1392
01:53:07,500 --> 01:53:13,620
areas along the waterfront coming and doing everything they could to make sure they didn't

1393
01:53:13,620 --> 01:53:15,500
get annexed to the city.

1394
01:53:15,500 --> 01:53:19,880
So why, why, why does this group want to be in X and city?

1395
01:53:20,220 --> 01:53:22,980
Is this going to cost us money in the long run?

1396
01:53:24,420 --> 01:53:25,780
What are the consequences?

1397
01:53:26,600 --> 01:53:30,020
There are several reasons that they've expressed why they would like to be in the city.

1398
01:53:30,160 --> 01:53:34,260
One is that their office is currently in the city and the rest of their property is in

1399
01:53:34,260 --> 01:53:34,640
the county.

1400
01:53:35,300 --> 01:53:42,640
They have had some cross jurisdictional misunderstandings you might say during building permit process

1401
01:53:42,640 --> 01:53:46,820
where they wanted to build something that was partially in the city or partially in the county

1402
01:53:46,820 --> 01:53:54,440
and they think that the city is a preferred place for them to be at this time. Also it would reduce some

1403
01:53:54,440 --> 01:54:03,300
of their fire service contracts costs if they were all in the city and of course the city would like

1404
01:54:03,300 --> 01:54:09,820
to see them in the city because of proper tax revenues and those sorts of things.

1405
01:54:09,820 --> 01:54:10,760
so

1406
01:54:13,540 --> 01:54:18,700
they're willing to do this even though it may cost them more money. They've

1407
01:54:18,700 --> 01:54:28,100
canceled it out. They approached us. Okay. Sorry to. We didn't ask them they

1408
01:54:28,100 --> 01:54:33,020
wanted in. That's good. Any further comment? Comment from council.

1409
01:54:45,330 --> 01:54:46,010
Seeing

1410
01:54:46,010 --> 01:54:47,030
Council, next item you have for now.

1411
01:54:47,490 --> 01:54:50,450
We have a private manager Amy Blaine here tonight.

1412
01:54:50,770 --> 01:54:54,070
I have asked staff to provide a progress reports

1413
01:54:54,070 --> 01:54:56,190
at the council's business and we're here tonight

1414
01:54:56,190 --> 01:55:00,450
to talk about the work that we have done

1415
01:55:00,450 --> 01:55:02,370
since our workshop last Thursday.

1416
01:55:02,690 --> 01:55:04,610
And I'm going to ask Amy to do a council overview

1417
01:55:04,610 --> 01:55:05,490
and ask questions.

1418
01:55:12,450 --> 01:55:13,050
I got to move.

1419
01:55:16,570 --> 01:55:17,050
You're not.

1420
01:55:35,610 --> 01:55:36,790
Thank you, Mr. Gregory.

1421
01:55:37,430 --> 01:55:39,810
I'm here tonight to give you a follow-up

1422
01:55:39,810 --> 01:55:45,130
for the information that was presented at the workshop last Thursday and a status report

1423
01:55:45,130 --> 01:55:46,990
on where we are with water quality.

1424
01:55:48,940 --> 01:55:54,480
I'll start with a progress report on what was done this week to address the issues that

1425
01:55:54,480 --> 01:55:55,160
we've been having.

1426
01:55:55,640 --> 01:56:00,780
I'll give you a snapshot on the softening investigation and the results of the evaporation

1427
01:56:00,780 --> 01:56:03,820
testing that we did about a week and a half ago.

1428
01:56:05,040 --> 01:56:09,680
Talk about some of the recommendations that we have for expanding our flushing program

1429
01:56:09,680 --> 01:56:13,960
and rolling out a program to assist homeowners.

1430
01:56:15,040 --> 01:56:20,080
We'll talk about main replacement work projects

1431
01:56:20,080 --> 01:56:22,300
that were completed this year in 2013,

1432
01:56:22,300 --> 01:56:25,460
and then the list of potential main replacement projects

1433
01:56:25,460 --> 01:56:27,220
that we are looking at towards the future.

1434
01:56:28,120 --> 01:56:30,180
We'll talk about the phosphate treatment option

1435
01:56:30,180 --> 01:56:33,880
and recommendations that will be provided tonight

1436
01:56:33,880 --> 01:56:37,240
as well as at the council meeting on the 24th.

1437
01:56:39,760 --> 01:56:43,160
This week we flushed three of the problem areas.

1438
01:56:43,900 --> 01:56:47,860
St. Helens was flushed on Monday and Thursday, the Highlands on Tuesday,

1439
01:56:48,360 --> 01:56:49,700
and Olympic on Wednesday.

1440
01:56:50,920 --> 01:56:54,960
Two automatic flushers were installed on Monday for a water exchange.

1441
01:56:55,820 --> 01:57:00,600
We're not able to pass enough flow through those devices to get enough

1442
01:57:00,600 --> 01:57:05,880
velocity for a good scouring effect, but it is good just for water turnover

1443
01:57:05,880 --> 01:57:08,700
and it helps keep complaints to a minimum.

1444
01:57:08,700 --> 01:57:15,300
The unidirectional flushing was not performed this week, it was scheduled to be done next week

1445
01:57:15,300 --> 01:57:22,100
and the following and that will continue, it will be done on October 23rd in areas 1-4.

1446
01:57:24,190 --> 01:57:30,230
We collected samples as part of our distribution system monitoring plan at 9 sites

1447
01:57:30,230 --> 01:57:37,710
and expanded the list of things that are being tested for at those locations to include total and soluble aluminum.

1448
01:57:37,710 --> 01:57:47,430
That was because we had an indication that the album was possibly exacerbating the spotting effect that we've been seeing and hearing about.

1449
01:57:48,190 --> 01:57:58,630
We also added total and orthophosphates to the testing list so that we could establish a benchmark if we do choose to move forward with the phosphate injection option.

1450
01:57:58,630 --> 01:58:03,110
We also pulled a complete metal analysis at two of the sites.

1451
01:58:03,670 --> 01:58:09,030
One was a control site where we do see spotting issues, but no water quality issues, and

1452
01:58:09,030 --> 01:58:15,510
the other was site 17, which is in the Baltimore area on 17th Avenue where we do have the water

1453
01:58:15,510 --> 01:58:16,290
quality issues.

1454
01:58:16,690 --> 01:58:20,590
We wanted to compare the metals results to what we saw back in July.

1455
01:58:21,830 --> 01:58:27,270
And we are continuing with public outreach and issued updates to our citizen

1456
01:58:27,270 --> 01:58:32,470
sentinels, postings on our Facebook and updates to our website that we

1457
01:58:32,470 --> 01:58:33,490
maintain for the project.

1458
01:58:35,900 --> 01:58:38,020
I won't go through a lot of these graphs but I

1459
01:58:38,020 --> 01:58:44,380
wanted to point this one out. As I mentioned last week we did increase the

1460
01:58:44,380 --> 01:58:50,240
chlorine residual leaving the treatment plant to 1.4. We made some correlations

1461
01:58:50,240 --> 01:58:55,960
last week, as far as the trends that we are observing, that the problems that we are currently

1462
01:58:55,960 --> 01:59:01,920
seeing are due to a release of manganese scale. The way to keep the manganese down is by keeping

1463
01:59:01,920 --> 01:59:07,700
the ORP up. The way to keep the ORP up is by keeping the chlorine up. So we bumped up the chlorine

1464
01:59:07,700 --> 01:59:13,980
level, leaving the plant so that we could hopefully see that translate to an increase in chlorine level

1465
01:59:13,980 --> 01:59:19,560
throughout the distribution system. Now, this graph is really just showing the problem areas

1466
01:59:20,240 --> 01:59:23,080
There's just fewer lines so it's less confusing.

1467
01:59:23,500 --> 01:59:25,780
In general, throughout the distribution system,

1468
01:59:26,220 --> 01:59:27,960
we are seeing an increase in chlorine.

1469
01:59:29,320 --> 01:59:31,040
And you'll see this tracking up.

1470
01:59:31,880 --> 01:59:34,100
This blue one is leaving the plant.

1471
01:59:34,620 --> 01:59:37,120
These others are several of the problem areas.

1472
01:59:38,280 --> 01:59:40,420
The one thing that I want to point out here

1473
01:59:40,860 --> 01:59:46,960
is that at site 17, we see our chlorine is close to nothing.

1474
01:59:48,580 --> 01:59:56,780
and that's a problem. Site 18 you'll see is also decreasing, but that one doesn't necessarily

1475
01:59:57,560 --> 01:59:59,980
cause me a lot of concern because there was no

1476
02:00:06,880 --> 02:00:25,520
I believe it was October 2nd, and still the chlorine there is low. So there's a problem there. My best inclination at this point is that it is flow-related, but we still haven't determined the exact cause.

1477
02:00:28,660 --> 02:00:32,080
These are some photos of the evaporation test.

1478
02:00:32,180 --> 02:00:34,520
that we collected, two different locations.

1479
02:00:35,340 --> 02:00:41,540
On the right is a glass pan showing the white residues

1480
02:00:41,540 --> 02:00:44,420
that we collected from the treatment plant.

1481
02:00:45,440 --> 02:00:48,580
And on the left, what was collected in the 600 block

1482
02:00:48,580 --> 02:00:49,620
of 17th.

1483
02:00:49,860 --> 02:00:52,400
And basically, we're just pouring water into these pans,

1484
02:00:52,980 --> 02:00:56,380
two liters, and evaporating it off at about 200 degrees

1485
02:00:56,380 --> 02:00:56,920
overnight.

1486
02:00:57,560 --> 02:00:58,700
And this is what was left.

1487
02:00:58,700 --> 02:01:05,680
you can see a visible difference. The lab analysis came back on this at about

1488
02:01:05,680 --> 02:01:12,220
3 o'clock this afternoon, and it was expedited to us, so they have not completely

1489
02:01:12,220 --> 02:01:17,400
to see the data, so I didn't want to provide hard numbers, but we do have some

1490
02:01:17,400 --> 02:01:25,740
preliminary results, and the indications are that there is a variation between the

1491
02:01:25,740 --> 02:01:28,220
treatment plant and the distribution system.

1492
02:01:28,920 --> 02:01:32,500
There is evidence that Allen is contributing to the spotting,

1493
02:01:32,960 --> 02:01:36,360
but it is largely controlled by the calcium carbonate.

1494
02:01:37,140 --> 02:01:41,820
Silica is also present, but the calcium is the predominant factor.

1495
02:01:43,240 --> 02:01:45,440
Based on that, softening treatment should help

1496
02:01:45,440 --> 02:01:49,000
to address the spotting issues, but we do still need to verify

1497
02:01:49,000 --> 02:01:52,580
that our objectives will be met without any unintended consequence.

1498
02:01:52,580 --> 02:01:53,580
Moving

1499
02:01:57,830 --> 02:02:01,110
forward, we'd like to see our flushing program be expanded.

1500
02:02:02,450 --> 02:02:06,930
As we did this week, we'd like to continue flushing the St. Helens area

1501
02:02:06,930 --> 02:02:12,110
and that Baltimore main twice each week and flushing the other problem areas

1502
02:02:12,110 --> 02:02:14,270
on a rotating weekly basis.

1503
02:02:14,970 --> 02:02:20,390
So that includes St. Helens, Old West Side, Robins.

1504
02:02:21,830 --> 02:02:26,270
We want to also begin flushing some of the emerging problem areas

1505
02:02:26,270 --> 02:02:30,090
once the unidirectional flush is complete in late October.

1506
02:02:30,530 --> 02:02:35,450
It's important to not disrupt the sequence of the unidirectional flush

1507
02:02:35,450 --> 02:02:40,010
so that you're always flushing from a clean source out to your dirty areas.

1508
02:02:40,730 --> 02:02:45,150
So, we want to wait to flush commerce, for example,

1509
02:02:45,630 --> 02:02:47,910
and so after that unidirectional flush is complete.

1510
02:02:48,610 --> 02:02:52,890
In order to do this, we need additional staffing.

1511
02:02:52,890 --> 02:02:58,990
We're proposing three full-time employees to perform

1512
02:02:58,990 --> 02:03:03,450
Fleshing four days a week and the estimated cost of that is $20,000 a month.

1513
02:03:04,050 --> 02:03:09,230
Some additional costs are associated with obtaining decordation chemical.

1514
02:03:10,190 --> 02:03:15,210
Now it is possible to attempt to do this as we did this week using our own staff

1515
02:03:15,210 --> 02:03:20,550
And diverting them from other projects, it just means that there's other work that doesn't get done.

1516
02:03:20,550 --> 02:03:28,670
And if there are emergency main breaks or things of that nature that would pull those resources away, then the flushing work is done.

1517
02:03:32,900 --> 02:03:39,860
This is a preliminary look at what an expanded flushing program schedule would look like.

1518
02:03:40,100 --> 02:03:50,520
I cannot say with certainty that by the end of June, we can completely be done with this flushing program.

1519
02:03:50,520 --> 02:03:55,620
I think this will be a work in progress, but basically what you see in green is the

1520
02:03:55,620 --> 02:04:00,720
unidirectional flush that we have traditionally done in zones one through four occurring

1521
02:04:00,720 --> 02:04:05,520
in the fall and in zones five through eight occurring in the summertime and August in

1522
02:04:05,520 --> 02:04:14,400
blue this weekly flushing being proposed in specific areas and spot flushing what happening

1523
02:04:14,400 --> 02:04:17,120
in June and in December.

1524
02:04:21,270 --> 02:04:25,350
This is primarily for reference so that you can associate what zones it is that I'm

1525
02:04:25,350 --> 02:04:26,090
talking about.

1526
02:04:26,310 --> 02:04:31,910
There was a comment earlier or question earlier about where the problems are primarily

1527
02:04:32,390 --> 02:04:33,730
and it's in zone one.

1528
02:04:35,050 --> 02:04:40,210
Most of the issues are from Washington Way to Oregon Way on the south side of the lake.

1529
02:04:40,570 --> 02:04:46,310
We have had a few complaints on commerce, a few complaints in the Robbins area out 50th,

1530
02:04:46,310 --> 02:04:49,390
but predominantly we are looking at zone one.

1531
02:04:55,380 --> 02:05:00,040
We are also proposing to provide some assistance

1532
02:05:00,040 --> 02:05:02,340
to customers at their homes.

1533
02:05:02,820 --> 02:05:05,980
It is a logical extension to make that if we are experiencing

1534
02:05:05,980 --> 02:05:07,220
these problems in our main,

1535
02:05:07,840 --> 02:05:09,980
they are experiencing similar problems

1536
02:05:09,980 --> 02:05:11,600
in their own private plumbing.

1537
02:05:12,360 --> 02:05:15,420
So it's important to identify the problems

1538
02:05:15,420 --> 02:05:18,680
that are occurring between the meter and the tap.

1539
02:05:18,680 --> 02:05:21,100
We don't have any control over those things.

1540
02:05:21,500 --> 02:05:25,740
All of the sampling that we have been doing has been on the city side of the meter.

1541
02:05:26,560 --> 02:05:31,860
But we recognize that they are having similar issues, and there are things that we can do to help.

1542
02:05:32,700 --> 02:05:46,040
So we're proposing that city staff go out to homeowners houses, and assist them to flush the service line, assist them to flush their plumbing, drain and flush their hot water heaters.

1543
02:05:46,040 --> 02:05:52,040
look at their plumbing or point of use filters and provide some recommendations for changing

1544
02:05:52,040 --> 02:05:58,660
up filters or perhaps installing them if there is none. This again would require some

1545
02:05:58,660 --> 02:06:04,100
outside or an additional employees with some utility as experience. The cost of that

1546
02:06:04,400 --> 02:06:12,800
is approximately $8,000 a month. We're estimating six weeks to contact 100 customers assuming

1547
02:06:12,800 --> 02:06:15,700
that that can be accomplished into our appointments.

1548
02:06:16,240 --> 02:06:20,960
I use the number 100 because that's the number of complaints that we've had related to water

1549
02:06:20,960 --> 02:06:25,160
quality since we made the transition to groundwater in late January.

1550
02:06:26,960 --> 02:06:35,000
There would also need to be some criteria to establish how customers become eligible for

1551
02:06:35,000 --> 02:06:40,480
this service or to establish what priority they are served.

1552
02:06:40,480 --> 02:06:49,380
And the two that are considered to be simplest and could be done readily in the field are turbidity and color.

1553
02:06:50,120 --> 02:06:53,920
And then there would be some public outreach to be able to unroll the program.

1554
02:06:55,960 --> 02:07:01,360
The question came up last week about our main replacement program, so we wanted to present some of those costs.

1555
02:07:02,680 --> 02:07:04,760
We did several projects this year.

1556
02:07:04,760 --> 02:07:10,900
The first was Maple Street, from 30th to Northwest Nichols, Ocean Beach Highway, currently

1557
02:07:10,900 --> 02:07:15,740
underway from Northeast Nichols to Olympia, and the alley behind 21st and 22nd.

1558
02:07:16,120 --> 02:07:22,380
You can see the construction costs there, design and engineering costs, and total at 1.2

1559
02:07:22,380 --> 02:07:25,980
million for 5,300 feet of linear pipe.

1560
02:07:28,210 --> 02:07:33,230
This then is the list of remains in need of replacement.

1561
02:07:33,230 --> 02:07:40,750
They are in order of priority, and the beach street is at the top of the list there,

1562
02:07:42,870 --> 02:07:43,130
and

1563
02:07:43,130 --> 02:07:46,790
you can see off to the right the costs that are associated with those.

1564
02:07:46,910 --> 02:07:53,390
Those are all based on a construction cost of $270 per lineal foot, which is the average

1565
02:07:53,390 --> 02:07:59,490
of the bid tabs that we saw for the projects completed this year, plus an allowance for design

1566
02:07:59,490 --> 02:08:02,150
and construction management and contingency.

1567
02:08:02,150 --> 02:08:03,250
The

1568
02:08:07,660 --> 02:08:13,240
phosphate treatment option, this week we collected samples from each of the production

1569
02:08:13,240 --> 02:08:18,900
wells from the combined filter influence and the finished water to determine the background

1570
02:08:18,900 --> 02:08:21,220
levels of phosphates that was in the groundwater.

1571
02:08:21,900 --> 02:08:27,840
There is some phosphate in the raw ground water, but the green sand filtration process also removes

1572
02:08:27,840 --> 02:08:29,100
some of that phosphate.

1573
02:08:29,520 --> 02:08:34,620
So we want to make sure we know what those levels are before we head down the path of injecting

1574
02:08:34,620 --> 02:08:40,000
additional phosphates. We are contacting suppliers to determine what what

1575
02:08:40,000 --> 02:08:44,880
blends are available of ortho and poly mixes and how quickly we can procure those to

1576
02:08:44,880 --> 02:08:50,220
begin doing some testing. It will be necessary to do jar testing to determine

1577
02:08:50,220 --> 02:08:55,320
how effective this is, what different blends we want to use and that is sort of a

1578
02:08:55,320 --> 02:09:00,840
it's a very static test. In addition to that we would like to do a dynamic test so

1579
02:09:00,840 --> 02:09:07,340
So that we can optimize the process, we can vary the flow, we can stagnate the flow,

1580
02:09:07,640 --> 02:09:14,420
and we have the opportunity to do a pipe loop test by sectioning out a 4-inch pipe

1581
02:09:14,420 --> 02:09:18,740
from the Ocean Beach Water Main Replacement Project.

1582
02:09:19,840 --> 02:09:27,160
So we would propose to have two lengths of pipe, a 4-inch diameter and 10 feet long.

1583
02:09:27,160 --> 02:09:32,320
One would be a control pipe where there's no injection whatsoever and the other where

1584
02:09:32,320 --> 02:09:36,360
you would be using phosphate injection to compare the difference.

1585
02:09:36,800 --> 02:09:37,800
So a side-by-side trial.

1586
02:09:38,880 --> 02:09:46,580
We have also selected two homes where we could potentially conduct a full-scale trial using

1587
02:09:46,580 --> 02:09:47,720
of orthophosphates.

1588
02:09:48,160 --> 02:09:54,280
The first is in the 2,700 block of orgate avenue where they do experience a spotting issue but

1589
02:09:54,280 --> 02:09:55,500
no water quality issues.

1590
02:09:55,500 --> 02:10:03,440
And the second is in the 900 block of 15th or the 500 block of 19th, one of the other,

1591
02:10:03,640 --> 02:10:08,720
but it is in that Baltimore area where they are experiencing water quality issues.

1592
02:10:08,880 --> 02:10:14,060
So again, it gives us a snapshot of what the difference is for different customers.

1593
02:10:15,560 --> 02:10:20,300
We are working with Consulance Engineering to develop a work plan and a testing protocol

1594
02:10:20,300 --> 02:10:22,780
for all of those tests that I just talked about,

1595
02:10:23,120 --> 02:10:25,520
and working with Kennedy-Janks to develop a scope

1596
02:10:26,160 --> 02:10:30,040
for the phosphate injection system design work.

1597
02:10:33,150 --> 02:10:36,950
Recommendations at this point are to provide additional staff

1598
02:10:36,950 --> 02:10:38,630
to expand our flushing program.

1599
02:10:39,450 --> 02:10:43,690
Additional staff also to support this residential program

1600
02:10:43,690 --> 02:10:44,630
to assist homeowners.

1601
02:10:45,450 --> 02:10:47,930
We'd also like to investigate some alternative

1602
02:10:47,930 --> 02:10:51,550
main cleaning options we made contact with PNE

1603
02:10:51,550 --> 02:11:01,130
And they do have the capability of doing jetting and gave us some pricing on a trial in the area of ocean beach.

1604
02:11:02,690 --> 02:11:08,490
Primarily, at this point, we are still recommending time for the distribution system to stabilize.

1605
02:11:09,010 --> 02:11:20,190
But we will bring back recommendations on the 24th for the phosphate injection and the softening treatment, as well as a rate reduction proposal for

1606
02:11:20,190 --> 02:11:24,550
the 1100 customers that are in that affected area.

1607
02:11:26,610 --> 02:11:32,390
We also will present an option to install a water dispensing station at the mid-farm

1608
02:11:32,390 --> 02:11:33,290
water treatment plant.

1609
02:11:33,370 --> 02:11:37,850
It's not necessarily as convenient as some of the bottled water options that were presented

1610
02:11:37,850 --> 02:11:41,890
last week, but it can be controlled as far as the distribution.

1611
02:11:41,890 --> 02:11:50,190
and it's attractive to me to be able to demonstrate to customers who don't

1612
02:11:50,190 --> 02:11:56,630
necessarily believe that the groundwater is good high-quality water. It's a

1613
02:11:56,630 --> 02:12:01,410
very clear illustration that there is a huge difference between what leaves

1614
02:12:01,410 --> 02:12:04,190
the plant and what may be delivered at their tap.

1615
02:12:06,930 --> 02:12:08,050
And that's all I have is there

1616
02:12:08,050 --> 02:12:08,610
any questions?

1617
02:12:10,890 --> 02:12:15,670
Mr. Jensen, can you tell me just Calcine because Calcine appears to be

1618
02:12:15,670 --> 02:12:20,670
an issue with water moving the plant. Does Calcine build up in the pipes? Will that

1619
02:12:20,670 --> 02:12:26,930
down the road or something that we're trying to ice pig out? It will build up in the pipes as well.

1620
02:12:28,230 --> 02:12:32,790
Just like anything else, just like the iron of manganese and the other scales that we are seeing now,

1621
02:12:32,790 --> 02:12:39,370
we will see that in the pipes, but we are also seeing that the scale that's there dissolving.

1622
02:12:39,750 --> 02:12:43,090
So I don't think it will accumulate to the point that our pipes are plugging.

1623
02:12:43,550 --> 02:12:45,030
It's not a new issue.

1624
02:12:45,110 --> 02:12:46,110
It's just a different issue.

1625
02:12:46,470 --> 02:12:46,710
Thank you.

1626
02:12:49,180 --> 02:12:54,480
So I guess the big question is the huge elephant in the room.

1627
02:12:55,400 --> 02:13:01,560
Will we be seeing any improvement or difference for these folks that are having all the problems?

1628
02:13:03,200 --> 02:13:10,420
We will, with the flushing that we have been doing, we have been seeing clear water, the

1629
02:13:10,420 --> 02:13:14,540
reports that I had from the flushing crews, and I think I heard one of these young ladies

1630
02:13:14,880 --> 02:13:19,660
who spoke tonight say that the water from the flushing was clear water.

1631
02:13:20,900 --> 02:13:31,540
The chlorine is still a problem, but the results that I got yesterday for the manganese in

1632
02:13:31,540 --> 02:13:37,960
So 0.05, our goal should be less than that but it is below or right at that secondary

1633
02:13:37,960 --> 02:13:38,720
MCL.

1634
02:13:39,400 --> 02:13:46,020
We still need to address the idea that what we are delivering at the point of connection

1635
02:13:46,500 --> 02:13:49,500
could be different from what they are seeing at their tap.

1636
02:13:50,800 --> 02:13:55,220
And I think that's why we're recommending that we have the home flushing program available

1637
02:13:55,220 --> 02:13:55,400
to.

1638
02:13:55,800 --> 02:13:56,620
Again, it doesn't.

1639
02:13:56,840 --> 02:13:59,940
We've got to flush the main area clear water there but if we're not going all the way

1640
02:13:59,940 --> 02:14:04,260
to the into the faucet to there. We're not going to, there's, there's customers

1641
02:14:04,260 --> 02:14:06,880
are going to see that and that's why we want to add that element to it and

1642
02:14:06,880 --> 02:14:09,860
actually be out and trying to do those two things in conjunction with each

1643
02:14:09,860 --> 02:14:17,260
other. Um, so my question would be, have staff had a chance to check out the home

1644
02:14:17,260 --> 02:14:24,220
of the folks here that have that? Jeff Coleman, we tried to look at their

1645
02:14:24,220 --> 02:14:29,300
situation. I have not had any conversations with Mrs. Campbell but I know that

1646
02:14:29,300 --> 02:14:31,360
Jeff Coleman has on a number of occasions

1647
02:14:31,360 --> 02:14:33,240
and has been to her house.

1648
02:14:33,380 --> 02:14:34,400
And they did come out

1649
02:14:36,700 --> 02:14:37,420
this Wednesday,

1650
02:14:39,810 --> 02:14:42,230
toss it running in my home,

1651
02:14:42,670 --> 02:14:45,770
and my hose running out into the alley all night long.

1652
02:14:48,590 --> 02:14:49,410
And after all,

1653
02:14:51,430 --> 02:14:53,490
I got a clear violin, said it's clear.

1654
02:14:53,750 --> 02:14:55,690
It still stinks, but it's clear.

1655
02:14:56,190 --> 02:14:58,890
And then later, they came back and it was yellow tent.

1656
02:15:00,140 --> 02:15:10,060
So it's up and down. So one other question for you, Mrs. Campbell, that the posed interim solutions

1657
02:15:10,060 --> 02:15:23,940
to try to alleviate the situation, do those sound like that would be helpful to you? Do you

1658
02:15:23,940 --> 02:15:28,960
staffing and stuff. I don't understand the extra. When it's not already currently

1659
02:15:28,960 --> 02:15:30,620
it's up and down.

1660
02:15:33,030 --> 02:15:39,050
What about providing the clean the water? Well personally I can't

1661
02:15:39,050 --> 02:15:45,270
lift with my back and hips all this water coming back and forth. My husband's

1662
02:15:45,270 --> 02:15:50,310
down with two legs and casts. I can't do it. So is the city going to come bring it

1663
02:15:50,310 --> 02:15:57,190
to me and deliver it into my home. I don't have any way of carrying by a gallon

1664
02:15:57,190 --> 02:16:01,730
and buckets of water. Is that what you're asking? I'm trying to get it. What

1665
02:16:01,730 --> 02:16:08,690
would help you? You've been suffering with this and what do you think? What would

1666
02:16:08,690 --> 02:16:13,510
help me is clean water that doesn't look like this, tastes like this, that me and my

1667
02:16:13,510 --> 02:16:21,730
daughters aren't on medication to fade and my appliances and stuff replaced it's ruined.

1668
02:16:24,580 --> 02:16:30,400
And what about all the water heaters we just ran out last night for the second time

1669
02:16:30,400 --> 02:16:37,700
in three months and I have pictures on my phone of the corroded brass piping with all these

1670
02:16:37,700 --> 02:16:42,760
barnacles around it and I don't remember the correct wording for it's not the element

1671
02:16:42,760 --> 02:16:44,680
and it's something else in our hot water heater.

1672
02:16:45,260 --> 02:16:47,300
But it's so thick with barnacles

1673
02:16:47,300 --> 02:16:49,220
and seashell-type stuff.

1674
02:16:50,520 --> 02:16:52,480
Who's gonna replace my hot water heater?

1675
02:16:53,860 --> 02:16:55,360
I mean, these are things that are going

1676
02:16:55,360 --> 02:16:58,140
and going in my dishwasher and everything.

1677
02:17:04,490 --> 02:17:04,930
Any other?

1678
02:17:05,050 --> 02:17:06,270
I'm just going in our bodies

1679
02:17:06,270 --> 02:17:09,930
and I just don't understand how we don't have the money

1680
02:17:10,310 --> 02:17:12,650
to replace the problem, which is the pipes,

1681
02:17:12,830 --> 02:17:16,810
but what we have money to pay all these employees extra overtime

1682
02:17:16,810 --> 02:17:20,630
or not over time, or more importantly, it doesn't make sense to me.

1683
02:17:21,250 --> 02:17:26,230
Well we're trying, we're doing everything we can to try and solve this problem.

1684
02:17:28,270 --> 02:17:32,690
And that may be, but like I say, we're trying our best to try and solve.

1685
02:17:33,010 --> 02:17:35,830
You gotta admit, we're working hard on this thing, trying to.

1686
02:17:36,470 --> 02:17:40,770
I understand that I was the first complaint back in March

1687
02:17:40,770 --> 02:17:44,230
that I got in the shower and I thought, what in the world?

1688
02:17:44,230 --> 02:17:49,690
It's not like I was rolling around in dead blood. I mean that's the only way I can describe it and my walls

1689
02:17:49,690 --> 02:17:57,750
I have pictures out there of my walls and my shower and everything is just ruined. I mean it looks like I've never washed nothing in years

1690
02:17:59,010 --> 02:18:00,730
all my brushed

1691
02:18:01,790 --> 02:18:02,350
arms

1692
02:18:03,150 --> 02:18:13,060
Stuff is all room. I mean it's like the stuff has eat it. I don't know what else to say and as far as waiting and damn patient

1693
02:18:13,060 --> 02:18:18,280
And I think it's pretty logical to say that me and my family have been being patient.

1694
02:18:19,760 --> 02:18:20,980
And we're trying.

1695
02:18:21,280 --> 02:18:27,160
And if I might on a little different subject, I have never seen a family of young folks

1696
02:18:27,160 --> 02:18:34,160
that have been that great in a meeting this long, I'd like to congratulate you so much on

1697
02:18:34,160 --> 02:18:34,440
that.

1698
02:18:35,120 --> 02:18:37,740
But if there's change, they were a part of it.

1699
02:18:38,180 --> 02:18:38,340
Yeah.

1700
02:18:38,580 --> 02:18:41,160
No, they've been so well-mannered.

1701
02:18:41,160 --> 02:18:47,820
It's it's my grandson's would have eaten a couple of these chairs by now. So you've done a great job

1702
02:18:49,440 --> 02:18:53,640
Can we ever come to the microphone Mr. Mayor? I'm sorry, but Miss Campbell

1703
02:18:53,640 --> 02:18:58,420
Can we ever come to the microphone for public right here? So it's at home can hear what she has to say

1704
02:19:04,310 --> 02:19:06,930
Is this time we're gonna go because that makes me nervous

1705
02:19:08,250 --> 02:19:11,830
Go up safe. That makes you nervous. I'm gonna turn it on

1706
02:19:17,550 --> 02:19:24,930
Well that's just my concern, you know, I've already stated before regardless, my daughter

1707
02:19:24,930 --> 02:19:31,250
has immune deficiency disorders and then to have all these nasty sores all over her

1708
02:19:31,250 --> 02:19:36,570
and on top of it to be a six-year-old and have a yeast infection that is out of control

1709
02:19:36,570 --> 02:19:43,570
down below is unacceptable to me, and that's with a dog hose, and I have pictures of all

1710
02:19:43,570 --> 02:19:49,630
of that, but now I have topical yeast infections that aren't even under rolls, they're on top

1711
02:19:49,630 --> 02:19:57,890
of my skin. So this all sounds great in theory, but in logical, it doesn't make sense to

1712
02:19:57,890 --> 02:20:04,190
me. We could be taking all this extra money in putting it where the problem is, and the problem

1713
02:20:04,190 --> 02:20:09,910
is the pipes. That's the problem. And why add extra chemicals? I mean, we're already

1714
02:20:09,910 --> 02:20:15,390
getting chemicals. We're already living on the toilets. I put in a claim for extra toilet

1715
02:20:15,390 --> 02:20:21,590
paper because we've been fighting over the toilets. And as a matter of fact, call it what

1716
02:20:21,590 --> 02:20:26,610
you will, but while we were getting that water out of our tap after they flushed, they flushed

1717
02:20:26,610 --> 02:20:32,110
Monday, Tuesday, yesterday, they were testing with their little testers, and then today

1718
02:20:32,110 --> 02:20:36,510
they were out there. I bought a bottle out and I said, look, what I'm still getting

1719
02:20:36,510 --> 02:20:41,110
as you're flushing. He says, I don't know what to tell you. It's clear out here. Okay,

1720
02:20:41,190 --> 02:20:46,230
I have all brand new pecs plumbing in my home. They even came out and dug up the old meter,

1721
02:20:46,390 --> 02:20:52,450
put a new meter in and then came into the fence and dug into my backyard to make sure that

1722
02:20:52,450 --> 02:20:53,830
we were in fact telling the truth.

1723
02:20:57,180 --> 02:20:59,820
So it's all proven. I have all brand new pecs plumbing

1724
02:20:59,820 --> 02:21:02,360
and all this, all that, and it's all getting ruined.

1725
02:21:03,600 --> 02:21:09,600
And then after, like I said, deleting or diluting or draining whatever you want to call it,

1726
02:21:09,740 --> 02:21:12,540
our hot water heater, for the second time in three months,

1727
02:21:13,500 --> 02:21:16,560
it's so corroded my brass stuff, it broke.

1728
02:21:20,370 --> 02:21:23,830
And to see my husband in cast, it's not you most supposed to be standing,

1729
02:21:24,330 --> 02:21:26,010
trying to help put those fittings on.

1730
02:21:26,870 --> 02:21:28,730
It's just unacceptable to me.

1731
02:21:28,730 --> 02:21:33,490
And like I said, I've been dealing with this since March, but be patient, be patient.

1732
02:21:33,630 --> 02:21:34,810
I can't be patient anymore.

1733
02:21:35,630 --> 02:21:37,570
Everything's deteriorating, including our health.

1734
02:21:39,900 --> 02:21:40,380
Thank you.

1735
02:21:42,480 --> 02:21:43,940
I feel for you.

1736
02:21:44,040 --> 02:21:45,940
I just don't know what else we can do.

1737
02:21:46,080 --> 02:21:47,500
We're trying, trying, trying.

1738
02:21:47,880 --> 02:21:54,180
And today I have to say I came home from having a meeting and some coffee in this cute little

1739
02:21:54,180 --> 02:21:54,780
coffee shop.

1740
02:21:54,780 --> 02:21:55,760
I've never been to.

1741
02:21:55,940 --> 02:21:57,080
It was on Broadway somewhere.

1742
02:21:59,080 --> 02:22:13,060
And I walked up on my porch, and I saw a water station thing with little nozzles, something like what we had at the Credit Union with two five gallon buckets of water, two cases of 24 bottles of water.

1743
02:22:14,340 --> 02:22:23,140
I said, what neighbor sent this to me? There's no way. I opened up the door and my husband was in this wheelchair, and he said, that's for you and I'll see.

1744
02:22:24,360 --> 02:22:30,820
That's another bill, because he's on L&I, broken legs, well I'm limited income but that's

1745
02:22:30,820 --> 02:22:31,520
one more bill.

1746
02:22:34,530 --> 02:22:40,410
I don't know what else to do, it's ridiculous, and there's no way I can take those five

1747
02:22:40,410 --> 02:22:44,610
gallon buckets and warm them up by the wood stove to give my daughter a bath.

1748
02:22:46,510 --> 02:22:49,710
I guess hook up the air compressor and blow it out, I don't know what else to do.

1749
02:22:50,350 --> 02:22:52,810
None of it makes sense to me, absolutely none of it.

1750
02:22:53,690 --> 02:22:54,390
Thank you.

1751
02:22:55,710 --> 02:23:01,510
Yes, is there any way that we could deliver water to folks that are disabled or unable

1752
02:23:01,510 --> 02:23:02,730
to pick up the water?

1753
02:23:03,450 --> 02:23:07,930
The other part about their bathing, I don't know how you'd fix that, you know.

1754
02:23:09,670 --> 02:23:15,850
I do have pictures out there of my home in our pool in the filter, which that filter that

1755
02:23:15,850 --> 02:23:17,330
shows out there is two days.

1756
02:23:18,330 --> 02:23:21,270
My shower and everything pictures don't lie, they tell the truth.

1757
02:23:23,130 --> 02:23:28,590
As far as bathing, I am open to suggestions, like I said, hooking up the air compressor and blowing it in.

1758
02:23:28,810 --> 02:23:29,370
I don't know.

1759
02:23:31,270 --> 02:23:32,310
Manager Craig, would you?

1760
02:23:32,530 --> 02:23:38,030
Well, I think delivered waters and other options, dispensing, I mean there's several different methods we could do for that.

1761
02:23:38,130 --> 02:23:39,910
I think that's another one we can certainly show you.

1762
02:23:40,130 --> 02:23:43,450
We showed you some of those options last week and we can certainly do those two.

1763
02:23:43,690 --> 02:23:47,830
We could do a combination of dispensing station and that too if that's something council would like to do.

1764
02:23:47,830 --> 02:23:51,550
I mean, that'd be something to help them down as far as...

1765
02:23:51,550 --> 02:23:55,410
And what about water bills? I even have my water bills here.

1766
02:23:56,030 --> 02:23:58,690
As far as fluctuation goes, July,

1767
02:23:59,590 --> 02:24:03,790
I tried to vacuum the pool and clean the pool, but I was putting back into the pool,

1768
02:24:03,990 --> 02:24:05,370
what I was trying to take out of the pool.

1769
02:24:05,770 --> 02:24:09,530
So my water bill is up to here. Now it's down here. Then it's up here, down here.

1770
02:24:10,130 --> 02:24:11,890
Because I have to double wash everything.

1771
02:24:13,090 --> 02:24:16,090
I believe that was part of...

1772
02:24:16,090 --> 02:24:21,870
But is that going to be retroactive back to when I very first started complaining about this and taking pictures?

1773
02:24:22,110 --> 02:24:24,990
We're working through a proposal for that, yeah, and how we want to build a dress out.

1774
02:24:25,170 --> 02:24:28,790
As your Gregory and staff will talk to you about that.

1775
02:24:31,050 --> 02:24:32,250
Okay. Is that everything?

1776
02:24:33,010 --> 02:24:33,510
Thank you.

1777
02:24:36,270 --> 02:24:39,290
Is there anybody else here that would like to speak to this issue?

1778
02:24:41,670 --> 02:24:44,330
Okay, we're not going to, everybody's not going to speak again.

1779
02:24:44,430 --> 02:24:47,730
I told you that at the beginning, but you can, I'll give you a couple minutes.

1780
02:24:54,470 --> 02:25:03,730
I just wanted to say with what you were saying with her things breaking my water here is making really loud noises in the middle of 90 wakes me up.

1781
02:25:04,510 --> 02:25:08,490
And so I don't know what's going on with that either that might have something to do with that.

1782
02:25:08,490 --> 02:25:15,970
I'm single. I'm scared to mess with soft stuff. So I haven't done any of that stuff. I

1783
02:25:16,710 --> 02:25:21,870
don't know who to call for that. So somebody to drain that for me. So I just wanted to add that.

1784
02:25:22,210 --> 02:25:24,190
Thank you. Thank you so much.

1785
02:25:29,140 --> 02:25:37,620
Leon Cohen, I'm staying in the 600 block of 17th. There are over 15 patches in the alleyway between 16th and 17th.

1786
02:25:37,620 --> 02:25:44,160
in the 600 block, there are over 9 patches in the 500 block that everyone in the neighborhood

1787
02:25:44,160 --> 02:25:45,740
is complaining about the same thing.

1788
02:25:46,480 --> 02:25:51,800
In regards to the time of day and which days that you are going to do your flushing,

1789
02:25:52,340 --> 02:25:57,140
our water system goes down in volume and we don't know exactly what time of the day you

1790
02:25:57,140 --> 02:26:00,960
could say you are going to do it in the neighborhood and post things on the lake bank or post things

1791
02:26:00,960 --> 02:26:06,760
down on the beach, but we don't always know when the water level is going to go down.

1792
02:26:06,760 --> 02:26:11,660
my brother has worked as a plumber, he says, do not touch the hot water heater. If you draw the

1793
02:26:11,660 --> 02:26:16,860
water out of the hot water heater, you stand a real good chance of blowing yourself up, shut the

1794
02:26:16,860 --> 02:26:21,440
water off. If you're going to go higher low, let us know. You're going to shut off the water because

1795
02:26:21,440 --> 02:26:26,540
you've got a burner in there. And if you take the water out, you've got an explosion hazard,

1796
02:26:26,860 --> 02:26:31,400
and that could be the knocking in that lady's water problem. And is there some way we can

1797
02:26:31,400 --> 02:26:34,600
And I'm going to opt out of this system until it's fixed.

1798
02:26:37,120 --> 02:26:39,460
And about turbidity and color, I've got my boiler.

1799
02:26:39,620 --> 02:26:43,940
I'm not a boiler maker myself, or I work with boiler makers, but I'm not an operator.

1800
02:26:44,140 --> 02:26:44,860
I lock things out.

1801
02:26:45,440 --> 02:26:48,920
The boilers have to be shut down before I can work where I work.

1802
02:26:49,940 --> 02:26:55,680
And I'm thinking you've got people over warehouse and long fiber boiler makers or operators that

1803
02:26:55,680 --> 02:26:57,920
could probably do a better job than what's going on right now.

1804
02:26:59,220 --> 02:26:59,940
Thank you.

1805
02:27:00,980 --> 02:27:02,100
Anybody else?

1806
02:27:06,010 --> 02:27:12,370
Chuck Wallace, 600 block, 20 second, when the City Council and the other interested groups

1807
02:27:12,370 --> 02:27:18,050
endeavored in the mint farm water project, we had a taste test.

1808
02:27:19,150 --> 02:27:23,150
And during this taste test, it didn't look like that water.

1809
02:27:24,130 --> 02:27:25,910
Otherwise we probably wouldn't have voted for it.

1810
02:27:32,230 --> 02:27:33,350
Just a...

1811
02:27:33,350 --> 02:27:43,050
slide show that Ms. Blaint, I'm sorry, Amy, okay, I presented there, shows the pipe,

1812
02:27:43,470 --> 02:27:47,310
you know, the water going through the system versus right out of the source.

1813
02:27:48,030 --> 02:27:53,350
The other thing that I would, that I like about this proposal when I heard tonight

1814
02:27:53,350 --> 02:27:56,550
is the rate possibility of a rate reduction program.

1815
02:27:57,430 --> 02:28:05,650
According to my research, the number of latent disconnect notices have increased quite remarkably

1816
02:28:05,650 --> 02:28:10,530
over the last four years, and it's a combination of several different things.

1817
02:28:10,770 --> 02:28:15,710
Two major public works projects in conjunction with our economic conditions.

1818
02:28:16,230 --> 02:28:22,470
I think it's entirely appropriate that the city have this conversation, and Mr. Hutchinson,

1819
02:28:22,470 --> 02:28:25,950
and I appreciate your efforts and converse dialogue

1820
02:28:26,810 --> 02:28:29,770
to try and figure out and provoke a way

1821
02:28:29,770 --> 02:28:31,510
for people to get clean water.

1822
02:28:31,910 --> 02:28:34,510
So I know you guys are doing whatever you can,

1823
02:28:34,650 --> 02:28:36,930
and this is a monstrosity of a mess

1824
02:28:36,930 --> 02:28:38,790
to have to deal with right now.

1825
02:28:39,030 --> 02:28:42,050
And thank you so.

1826
02:28:42,510 --> 02:28:42,870
Thank you.

1827
02:28:50,570 --> 02:28:50,930
Hi.

1828
02:28:51,950 --> 02:28:55,710
I'm Raleen Agarri, and I live on six Monterey Place.

1829
02:28:55,710 --> 02:29:01,250
And my area apparently said it wasn't affected, but I can't wash my brand new car.

1830
02:29:01,830 --> 02:29:04,670
I know it's not sad, but I get spots all over it.

1831
02:29:05,070 --> 02:29:07,650
I have other neighbors that are complaining about the same thing.

1832
02:29:08,250 --> 02:29:11,010
So I know that you guys are talking about certain areas.

1833
02:29:11,430 --> 02:29:13,130
Can you guys look at my area too please?

1834
02:29:15,630 --> 02:29:18,110
Because I need my...

1835
02:29:18,110 --> 02:29:23,150
We are getting complaints across the distribution system from people about the spotting issue

1836
02:29:23,150 --> 02:29:28,550
and the change in hardness. What I was primarily focusing on right now because

1837
02:29:28,550 --> 02:29:34,270
you feel it's the paramount issue is the water quality that is in the area

1838
02:29:34,270 --> 02:29:42,970
of 1700 block of, excuse me, 600 block of 17th avenue. Those water quality issues

1839
02:29:42,970 --> 02:29:48,090
are taste, odor, color, but we are very much aware of the spotting issues.

1840
02:29:48,090 --> 02:29:53,610
not just thoughting my toilet it looks like okay so I love entertaining I

1841
02:29:53,610 --> 02:29:58,570
love having people over my toilet looks like I never clean it okay and I clean

1842
02:29:58,570 --> 02:29:58,930
it

1843
02:30:07,220 --> 02:30:11,480
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

1844
02:30:16,340 --> 02:30:18,420
Just a quickie.

1845
02:30:18,420 --> 02:30:22,760
Hi, my name is Bruce Smith.

1846
02:30:25,580 --> 02:30:30,420
In the bathroom here, I just refill this.

1847
02:30:30,980 --> 02:30:33,940
It's clear there, but it tastes like metal.

1848
02:30:43,890 --> 02:30:48,330
Yes, I thought you were coming forward, but I'm looking your way.

1849
02:30:54,320 --> 02:30:55,520
Oh, thank you.

1850
02:30:58,160 --> 02:31:01,560
My concerns tonight are regarding last week's PowerPoint.

1851
02:31:01,560 --> 02:31:04,020
Oh, I'm sorry. I should know my name.

1852
02:31:04,020 --> 02:31:07,820
I do, but not my name, but that I should say it.

1853
02:31:08,060 --> 02:31:09,420
No, Jim Matthews, Longview.

1854
02:31:09,720 --> 02:31:10,180
Thank you.

1855
02:31:10,700 --> 02:31:16,820
My comments tonight are regarding last week's PowerPoint

1856
02:31:16,820 --> 02:31:19,400
presentation, providing information

1857
02:31:20,180 --> 02:31:23,060
of Longview's current water situation.

1858
02:31:25,490 --> 02:31:29,250
It's a hesitation that I even approach this subject,

1859
02:31:29,530 --> 02:31:31,710
but I feel that it's critical.

1860
02:31:31,710 --> 02:31:40,590
I'm still in a quandary and have some concerns in regard to the information disseminated during

1861
02:31:41,830 --> 02:31:43,810
the last council meeting.

1862
02:31:44,430 --> 02:31:51,130
In my 30 years of professional appointed and elected positions is unprecedented to

1863
02:31:51,130 --> 02:31:59,610
have a presentation of that magnitude and technicality presented with no hard copy to refer

1864
02:31:59,610 --> 02:32:02,170
to, especially for our elected officials.

1865
02:32:03,850 --> 02:32:10,110
Whether intentionally, whether intentionally done or not, I believe it served a real purpose

1866
02:32:10,110 --> 02:32:17,390
in that with no copies available to refer to, fact check or dispute, no informed challenge

1867
02:32:17,390 --> 02:32:18,890
could be made or discussed.

1868
02:32:19,630 --> 02:32:25,650
However, the daily news was willing to put to bed their Friday's paper by 10 o'clock

1869
02:32:25,650 --> 02:32:34,570
by 10 p.m. that night, containing the bulk of the presented by the experts that night unchallenged.

1870
02:32:35,350 --> 02:32:45,050
I do know that there was at least one questionable contaminant figure according to the city's official figures

1871
02:32:45,450 --> 02:32:51,270
emailed directly from the water department approximately four weeks ago.

1872
02:32:51,270 --> 02:33:04,440
I find it mind-boggling that no one responsible for last week's presentation considered researching

1873
02:33:04,600 --> 02:33:13,040
the possible increase of retail water sales, yet by not doing so, it allowed the wide-eyed

1874
02:33:13,040 --> 02:33:19,720
proclamation that the numbers show that the current water situation has not led to any

1875
02:33:19,720 --> 02:33:22,980
significant increase in water consumption or usage.

1876
02:33:24,870 --> 02:33:33,860
I now know that a water retailer was indeed contacted by a long view employer to look

1877
02:33:33,860 --> 02:33:38,900
into the cost of providing retail bottled water delivered to affected households.

1878
02:33:39,560 --> 02:33:46,000
However, the prices stated in last week's presentation were top dollar retail cost for full

1879
02:33:46,000 --> 02:33:53,520
set up and extras to a single family dwelling yet used to illustrate how prohibitive, or

1880
02:33:53,520 --> 02:33:57,840
illustrate or infer how prohibitive this cost would be.

1881
02:33:59,780 --> 02:34:06,160
Illustrated by the fact that this option was not even included in the four pages, in

1882
02:34:06,160 --> 02:34:12,000
the 44 pages, a final hard copy that was presented to the City Council.

1883
02:34:12,000 --> 02:34:19,960
You might find it, you might be interested, and I find it disturbing that the discounted

1884
02:34:19,960 --> 02:34:26,560
price offered the city by the water retailer was never mentioned.

1885
02:34:34,390 --> 02:34:40,210
In good faith, I can't present the actual dollar amount that the city was offered.

1886
02:34:41,570 --> 02:34:48,210
But as of now, I'm currently waiting for confirmation from a second and third party source.

1887
02:34:48,210 --> 02:35:00,290
Oh, combine all of these concerns with the questionable prioritization, I'm sorry,

1888
02:35:01,490 --> 02:35:11,070
combine these concerns with I must ask just how much of a priority the situation truly

1889
02:35:11,070 --> 02:35:18,150
is throughout our city process if at the request of our city's highest elected official

1890
02:35:18,150 --> 02:35:26,070
to obtain pertinent additional information to be entered into council minutes. It was

1891
02:35:26,070 --> 02:35:32,730
not a priority to take the time approximately two minutes to text or simply call letting

1892
02:35:32,730 --> 02:35:38,170
me know the most effective way to get this information.

1893
02:35:41,170 --> 02:35:45,310
You have to, I'm really emotional tonight and I'm sorry.

1894
02:35:45,310 --> 02:35:52,770
I know, ma'am. And that's why I'm allowing you to speak for longer than I normally would. I want you to tell us what you think.

1895
02:35:53,210 --> 02:36:01,650
Well, I'm not going to tell you what I think right now. I'm going to go to what I feel and just leave it at that.

1896
02:36:03,980 --> 02:36:12,240
Mark Twain was quoted as saying, there are three kinds of lies. There's lies, there's damn lies, and there's statistics.

1897
02:36:12,240 --> 02:36:13,440
My

1898
02:36:20,600 --> 02:36:28,240
Angelo is quoted as saying, people will forget what you say, some people will even

1899
02:36:28,240 --> 02:36:36,080
forget what you do, but nobody ever forgets how you make them feel.

1900
02:36:37,540 --> 02:36:42,540
And though we are now 14 days into this process,

1901
02:36:45,010 --> 02:36:49,850
the lives of the people involved haven't

1902
02:36:49,850 --> 02:36:50,350
changed.

1903
02:36:53,010 --> 02:36:58,150
They still scrub their kids in the same dirty water. They still have little

1904
02:36:58,150 --> 02:37:04,450
ones and it inadvertently take a drink whether or not it's supposed to. And again, not

1905
02:37:04,450 --> 02:37:14,050
that I doubt the words you're saying, but I doubt sometimes if you understand the ramifications

1906
02:37:14,050 --> 02:37:15,530
of the words you're saying.

1907
02:37:19,630 --> 02:37:24,870
I was always taught that you can only know people by what

1908
02:37:24,870 --> 02:37:33,590
they teach you of themselves. And quite frankly, we are still at this in a situation where we have

1909
02:37:33,590 --> 02:37:42,860
been taught that it's not always reliable to trust what we are being told or being presented with.

1910
02:37:43,780 --> 02:37:52,360
And I simply encourage you to keep those words, not my words, but the quotes of those two well

1911
02:37:52,360 --> 02:37:59,760
established people in where proceedings go from here. Thank you. Thank you,

1912
02:37:59,980 --> 02:38:05,460
ma'am. And we're we've gotten a lot of time and man hours trying to fix this

1913
02:38:05,460 --> 02:38:12,160
for you and I know that it's very passionate that and I'd be jumping up and

1914
02:38:12,160 --> 02:38:18,560
down just like you. I do have some water problems and and the same as you do and

1915
02:38:18,560 --> 02:38:24,420
And council has told staff that we want this taken care of.

1916
02:38:24,740 --> 02:38:27,600
And as you can see, they are trying.

1917
02:38:28,240 --> 02:38:31,780
We're not there yet, obviously, but we will get there.

1918
02:38:32,720 --> 02:38:40,240
And it's due to people like you and this lady out here stepping on our toes and making

1919
02:38:40,240 --> 02:38:40,920
us do it.

1920
02:38:41,500 --> 02:38:44,760
We would do, I can tell you right now, I didn't know.

1921
02:38:44,760 --> 02:38:51,680
I don't know how many of the other council members knew of the problem I didn't and just

1922
02:38:53,950 --> 02:38:55,770
a short one, yes.

1923
02:39:00,060 --> 02:39:07,740
And I'm going to say to premise, a personal premise that may endear me or disturb you

1924
02:39:07,740 --> 02:39:10,580
for the rest of our relationship.

1925
02:39:13,010 --> 02:39:18,710
After the amount of time that I have spent in the field, need you in that muddy water with

1926
02:39:18,710 --> 02:39:26,470
the guys working, the research that I've done, I have to come to one of two conclusions

1927
02:39:27,030 --> 02:39:28,450
until proven otherwise.

1928
02:39:29,550 --> 02:39:36,670
There is either a total ineptitude of communication with the city of Longview to the point where

1929
02:39:36,670 --> 02:39:45,990
jobs should be lost and procedures should be changed, or there has been a conscious effort

1930
02:39:45,990 --> 02:40:01,730
to keep the severity of this problem not only from the people of long view, but most importantly from the members of the City Council as voted as elected representatives of the people.

1931
02:40:02,390 --> 02:40:03,110
Thank you.

1932
02:40:21,230 --> 02:40:25,870
We're moving ahead with those already and we're going to come back with some specifics

1933
02:40:25,870 --> 02:40:28,410
on the water treatment, water softening, 24th meeting.

1934
02:40:28,410 --> 02:40:33,130
I would look at it as unless you do not want it to happen.

1935
02:40:33,630 --> 02:40:36,210
Manager Gregory has the authority to go forward.

1936
02:40:36,370 --> 02:40:36,670
Thank you.

1937
02:40:38,170 --> 02:40:40,150
Is there anybody else?

1938
02:40:40,290 --> 02:40:41,330
Yes, Tom, excuse me.

1939
02:40:41,370 --> 02:40:41,690
Your honor.

1940
02:40:41,810 --> 02:40:46,550
I'm almost afraid to ask this, but I would be interested in hearing from Ms. Matthews

1941
02:40:46,550 --> 02:40:53,530
as to what she would like us to be doing because she's very concerned about this

1942
02:40:53,530 --> 02:40:55,550
and I appreciated all of her comments.

1943
02:40:55,550 --> 02:41:01,110
and she's very well educated and I would like to hear what would you you know

1944
02:41:01,110 --> 02:41:06,130
one two three what would you like us to do to address this problem in the

1945
02:41:06,130 --> 02:41:06,890
short term.

1946
02:41:13,670 --> 02:41:18,050
I believe that the only acceptable answer to that question is that

1947
02:41:18,050 --> 02:41:26,470
there be that the houses and the communities that are affected the worst be

1948
02:41:26,470 --> 02:41:34,030
contacted immediately, and within the next week that they are provided with enough water

1949
02:41:34,030 --> 02:41:38,390
that they know is not going to make them sick or blister their children.

1950
02:41:39,650 --> 02:41:45,870
I know ice, I spent an entire summer bathing in ten gallons of heated water in Alaska.

1951
02:41:47,110 --> 02:41:48,910
These people need help.

1952
02:41:49,070 --> 02:41:51,590
We're talking about Vietnam vets.

1953
02:41:52,250 --> 02:41:54,470
We're talking about World War II vets.

1954
02:41:54,470 --> 02:42:03,130
We're talking about diabetic amputees, we're talking about multiple people on SSI, and now we're talking about children.

1955
02:42:04,550 --> 02:42:06,470
The fact that people aren't...

1956
02:42:07,310 --> 02:42:14,960
When I hear a comment made, we're doing everything we can for you.

1957
02:42:15,500 --> 02:42:25,100
That to me indicates that you think it's our problem because it doesn't affect you behind your closed doors.

1958
02:42:25,100 --> 02:42:32,700
You may get spots on your cars. Your faucets might look yucky, but you're not

1959
02:42:32,700 --> 02:42:42,340
having to load the lives that these people live. Sometimes a dollar of vote and

1960
02:42:42,340 --> 02:42:51,500
a concern aren't enough. The most viable impact that we have as individuals is

1961
02:42:51,500 --> 02:42:53,980
about 36 inches.

1962
02:42:56,340 --> 02:43:04,000
It has to be people talking to people and people choosing to do what's necessary to fix it.

1963
02:43:05,980 --> 02:43:10,060
I used to have kids and I would tell them, did you clean the bathroom?

1964
02:43:10,860 --> 02:43:13,720
Did I clean the bathroom? I'd go in and say, no.

1965
02:43:15,320 --> 02:43:18,420
The bathroom's not clean so you didn't clean the bathroom.

1966
02:43:18,920 --> 02:43:21,480
I spent an hour in there. I cleaned the bathroom.

1967
02:43:21,480 --> 02:43:28,100
No, the definition of a clean bathroom is a clean bathroom, not that you spent an hour

1968
02:43:28,100 --> 02:43:34,220
doing it, or thousands of dollars, or thousands of flushings, or whatever.

1969
02:43:35,960 --> 02:43:38,400
So I hope that helps you.

1970
02:43:38,780 --> 02:43:44,980
If it were me and I were running the program, I would be doing full scale, but we have been

1971
02:43:44,980 --> 02:43:46,720
doing personally in our neighborhood.

1972
02:43:48,660 --> 02:43:55,620
Dropping water off on people's porches late at night because they're too proud to take it personally.

1973
02:43:57,380 --> 02:44:03,840
What, helping them bathe their children, taking them the places to get the water?

1974
02:44:05,600 --> 02:44:11,100
What are the things that you do every day to run your household?

1975
02:44:11,100 --> 02:44:18,200
find out what it's taking these people to now live their lives. It's down and

1976
02:44:18,200 --> 02:44:22,320
dirty and it's not pretty, but it's human.

1977
02:44:25,680 --> 02:44:29,440
Ma'am, here's a copy of tonight's presentation if you'd like to have it.

1978
02:44:29,600 --> 02:44:33,960
I sincerely appreciate it. Thank you. Yes, Tom.

1979
02:44:34,200 --> 02:44:41,120
Well, your honor, I would propose that the city supplies water to the most

1980
02:44:44,100 --> 02:44:50,820
most affected households. I don't know how we determine who they are or where you draw

1981
02:44:50,820 --> 02:44:56,240
the line, but it seems like if we are going to have staff go out and check the residences

1982
02:44:56,240 --> 02:44:59,380
cases in any case, that could be determined.

1983
02:45:00,000 --> 02:45:29,820
And then we provide them with fresh, at least fresh drinking water. Mr. Moon. I'd like to even bring that a little further. I want to find a way if there's possible to allow the citizens even to bathe their family. That's causing medical issues. Obviously, one was brought up, you know, having yeast infection, topical yeast infections and children eating antibiotics, just a bathe, special medication. Can we look at possibly setting up some type of

1984
02:45:29,820 --> 02:45:36,160
pass for them with the local YMCA. I know it's not convenient, it's not their home, but it's...

1985
02:45:36,160 --> 02:45:37,500
I just joined the YMCA.

1986
02:45:37,520 --> 02:45:44,300
There you go. I mean, again, for those... I mean, I don't know how to determine who's

1987
02:45:45,040 --> 02:45:47,480
qualifies for that, but we need to come up with something because

1988
02:45:48,060 --> 02:45:52,480
we're not providing them with safe, clean water for them to bait their drink.

1989
02:45:52,640 --> 02:45:53,560
This is not acceptable.

1990
02:45:54,800 --> 02:46:03,480
We may figure out a way to be able to provide this necessary resource, you know, a staple of life to these citizens.

1991
02:46:04,120 --> 02:46:10,820
And I can tell you that manager Gregory and staff are working on that, trying to figure out how you do that program.

1992
02:46:12,220 --> 02:46:22,400
Yeah. Well, you're honor if I may. Sure. Could be is maybe we advertise this in the newspaper

1993
02:46:22,400 --> 02:46:29,960
or wherever the people that are feeling hardest hit by this to contact the city. You know,

1994
02:46:30,020 --> 02:46:34,780
so you start with those folks, these folks have been here and check out what they have

1995
02:46:34,780 --> 02:46:39,380
and if it seems like we need to help them, we start providing them with assistance.

1996
02:46:39,380 --> 02:46:43,860
Oh, and the word will go out and we keep testing and checking those households.

1997
02:46:44,360 --> 02:46:51,400
And if we agree, yes, you need help, then we provide them with some kind of short-term assistance.

1998
02:46:51,680 --> 02:47:00,240
And I think we have that information, the people that have complained in that area that water has.

1999
02:47:01,280 --> 02:47:05,820
Because I fear up to this point that we haven't really provided them with anything.

2000
02:47:05,820 --> 02:47:11,220
We're just telling them what we're going to do and if you're living like this, I mean my water

2001
02:47:11,220 --> 02:47:16,560
I'd like to have it improved, but it's not, it's nothing like my water's fine real relatively,

2002
02:47:17,160 --> 02:47:20,320
but if I had that kind of water, I would be pretty upset.

2003
02:47:22,840 --> 02:47:27,540
I think your Gregory hears you and he will do something.

2004
02:47:28,660 --> 02:47:30,300
Just a small portion.

2005
02:47:30,940 --> 02:47:38,800
I just wanted to add if I didn't already, like I said, it's been such emotional English on everything in financial.

2006
02:47:39,240 --> 02:47:44,700
But when they come out in flesh and come right across the street to my house and run it

2007
02:47:44,700 --> 02:47:50,760
out of the same spicket that I run it out of, a little bit of color, not bad, much

2008
02:47:50,760 --> 02:47:57,460
better, then it's time to give my oldest otter, it's time to get a shower, mom it's brown.

2009
02:47:58,960 --> 02:48:04,900
So is the city supposed to sit there in my house 24 hours to spectate the water because

2010
02:48:04,900 --> 02:48:08,860
just because it's clear the minute they come check it and then last night we

2011
02:48:08,860 --> 02:48:11,980
it I don't know if you heard but we were up at the lake trying to inform

2012
02:48:11,980 --> 02:48:16,460
everybody of the council meeting tonight for the water wrote all over my car

2013
02:48:17,860 --> 02:48:23,700
came back and I ran those and I just couldn't believe it but what I got this

2014
02:48:23,700 --> 02:48:32,220
morning was we just flushed who cares it's still coming through my pipes and they

2015
02:48:32,220 --> 02:48:36,120
test after they flush, so that's not even fair.

2016
02:48:38,530 --> 02:48:39,010
Thank you.

2017
02:48:43,120 --> 02:48:47,480
Mr. Mayor, I'm just going to comment I agree with the comments made,

2018
02:48:47,820 --> 02:48:50,920
concerning providing the clean water that the people most affected.

2019
02:48:51,620 --> 02:48:55,860
I also think looking at the recommendations made by staff, I'd be interested at the earliest

2020
02:48:55,860 --> 02:49:03,200
opportunity to know with respect to the reprioritization of the water mean projects for

2021
02:49:03,200 --> 02:49:11,100
Beach Street and two alleys there which seem to be the most affected areas you know exactly

2022
02:49:11,100 --> 02:49:14,900
what we're going to be doing to add those going forward. I think I heard at one point

2023
02:49:14,900 --> 02:49:19,760
those were going to be we're waiting until the November rate workshop on water I think.

2024
02:49:19,980 --> 02:49:25,760
I think if there's some way we could hear about those at an earlier opportunity because

2025
02:49:25,760 --> 02:49:30,940
it seems to be that could possibly be part of the solution and I think a couple of comments

2026
02:49:30,940 --> 02:49:34,280
I think at a previous meeting, in this meeting, individuals have made comments about the

2027
02:49:36,640 --> 02:49:39,920
historic maintenance issues with these water mains.

2028
02:49:40,520 --> 02:49:45,000
I think one gentleman commented on the number of repairs made in just the last few months,

2029
02:49:46,140 --> 02:49:49,140
and I'm not aware of the facts or any of that.

2030
02:49:50,000 --> 02:49:56,440
Like, continually he concerns about the amount of time that our staff spends repairing those

2031
02:49:56,440 --> 02:49:56,720
pipes.

2032
02:49:58,160 --> 02:50:03,680
And I appreciate that these are moved up on the prioritization list, but it seems like we should

2033
02:50:03,680 --> 02:50:06,960
probably hear a little bit more about what we're going to do to get those done.

2034
02:50:13,000 --> 02:50:14,100
Yeah, let's talk about it.

2035
02:50:14,200 --> 02:50:19,860
I mean, at the end of the day, if you want to do them all at one time there, we're going to have to issue debt and raise rates.

2036
02:50:20,060 --> 02:50:21,080
I mean, that's the short answer.

2037
02:50:21,200 --> 02:50:25,160
And if you want to do, how far down do you want to go to the list and how many of those may as you want to replace?

2038
02:50:25,540 --> 02:50:35,060
I mean, we're trying to give you the context of the rest of the other capital needs we have in the system there, but I mean, can we do it on the 24th?

2039
02:50:35,180 --> 02:50:38,000
We probably can, but I mean, that's what you will hear at the rate workshop.

2040
02:50:38,680 --> 02:50:44,320
But it could move up two weeks earlier, a design process, I guess, if you want to start the design process two weeks earlier.

2041
02:50:44,320 --> 02:50:49,460
there. And Mr. Mayor, what I'm trying to get my mind around because I'm not an engineer

2042
02:50:49,860 --> 02:50:56,480
or a water expert is, and maybe Miss Blaine could speak to it, is the correlation between

2043
02:50:57,180 --> 02:51:05,020
the drop in the chlorine, the increase in the magnies and the scale and the water quality

2044
02:51:05,020 --> 02:51:13,380
issues in these areas where we hear these large amount of maintenance concerns and the need

2045
02:51:13,380 --> 02:51:19,440
for replacing those water mains. I've heard individuals in the community describe these

2046
02:51:19,440 --> 02:51:25,700
particular water mains as being held together with twine, and that's something they heard

2047
02:51:25,700 --> 02:51:29,560
from our staff, apparently, or something along the line. So what I'm trying to understand

2048
02:51:29,560 --> 02:51:33,920
is, I don't, maybe I need a little bit more education on this, how do that correlate?

2049
02:51:34,400 --> 02:51:40,260
The drop, particularly the drop in the chlorine, as shown here in this graph on page 4,

2050
02:51:43,360 --> 02:51:43,360
you

2051
02:51:43,360 --> 02:51:47,420
see an increase in the other areas and drop in 17 or 18.

2052
02:51:48,640 --> 02:51:51,900
I think there's a number of things going on in that area.

2053
02:51:52,520 --> 02:51:57,280
The age of the mains in that area is dating back to the 40s.

2054
02:51:58,460 --> 02:52:00,180
So we have a lot of galvanized service lines.

2055
02:52:00,420 --> 02:52:02,840
And I know that Don has does not,

2056
02:52:03,020 --> 02:52:04,420
apparently, have galvanized service line.

2057
02:52:04,500 --> 02:52:07,420
But there are several galvanized lines in that area.

2058
02:52:07,920 --> 02:52:11,520
The mains are all online cast iron AC pipes.

2059
02:52:11,520 --> 02:52:20,320
So that in itself, the condition of those mains is poorer than other areas, but also because

2060
02:52:20,320 --> 02:52:30,520
the city historically was on untreated groundwater, those mains have more accumulation of iron

2061
02:52:30,520 --> 02:52:37,780
and manganese inside of them, dating back to the origination of the city.

2062
02:52:37,780 --> 02:52:44,280
So the third factor that compounds it is that we had certain areas where there was the

2063
02:52:44,280 --> 02:52:44,940
flow reversal.

2064
02:52:45,540 --> 02:52:51,260
This is one of those areas, so we have a number of things coming into play that are all

2065
02:52:51,260 --> 02:52:53,280
adding up to this situation.

2066
02:52:53,460 --> 02:52:59,840
Look, kind of, I'm thinking maybe fast forward here two weeks when we hear the detail of

2067
02:52:59,840 --> 02:53:04,120
the phosphate proposal, but my understanding about this, the introduction of the phosphate

2068
02:53:04,120 --> 02:53:09,700
to the water. Is that'll just change the color of the water? And I'm trying to understand

2069
02:53:09,700 --> 02:53:14,100
how do we change the properties of the water and not just the color?

2070
02:53:14,540 --> 02:53:23,040
The phosphates hold, they sequester the the manganese, the iron, the calcium, certain elements

2071
02:53:23,040 --> 02:53:30,700
and hold them in suspension so that they do not precipitate out and form the color. They

2072
02:53:30,700 --> 02:53:37,820
still are in the water, but they do not, they don't precipitate out to deposit on things

2073
02:53:37,820 --> 02:53:42,180
and so that you see the, the, the, the color.

2074
02:53:42,800 --> 02:53:44,480
Um, they just were, they were made in solution.

2075
02:53:46,080 --> 02:53:53,340
Well, if, if I might, so if, if we did the treatment, maybe you don't know this, if we did

2076
02:53:53,340 --> 02:54:00,420
this treatment before that goes into the filter system at the water plant, would those things

2077
02:54:00,420 --> 02:54:04,460
that are getting in the water and now be filtered out in the filter system.

2078
02:54:05,120 --> 02:54:09,460
If you're putting them in suspension, it sounds like they can be filtered out.

2079
02:54:10,580 --> 02:54:15,840
Right, there is a certain level of phosphates in the raw ground water and some of that

2080
02:54:15,840 --> 02:54:20,140
is being filtered out when the water passes through the green sand filters.

2081
02:54:20,920 --> 02:54:26,240
So if we were to inject the phosphates ahead of the filters, we would then remove it when

2082
02:54:26,240 --> 02:54:31,220
the water is treated. So it really needs to be injected into the finished water supply

2083
02:54:31,220 --> 02:54:33,320
just prior to leaving the plant.

2084
02:54:34,160 --> 02:54:40,420
And I'm not an engineer and I don't play one on TV, so what I'm thinking is maybe those

2085
02:54:40,420 --> 02:54:48,440
things get filtered out, even though it takes phosphate out, everything's been put in suspension

2086
02:54:49,020 --> 02:54:50,340
and it's filtered out.

2087
02:54:50,340 --> 02:54:56,220
Well, in order to get them to filter out, you need to precipitate whatever's

2088
02:54:56,220 --> 02:55:01,640
in the water. And so that's why we dose it with chlorine that precipitates the iron,

2089
02:55:01,840 --> 02:55:07,320
the arsenic comes with it. And once you precipitate it, it's able to be filtered out through

2090
02:55:07,320 --> 02:55:14,060
the green sand. So I think it's exactly the opposite of what I heard you say if I understood

2091
02:55:14,060 --> 02:55:14,400
correctly.

2092
02:55:15,280 --> 02:55:23,520
So is it fair to say that one of the problems is the chemistry of the water that's dissolving

2093
02:55:23,520 --> 02:55:27,800
what's ever in the pipes, is to think that could be some of the problem.

2094
02:55:27,980 --> 02:55:28,520
That's fair to say.

2095
02:55:29,540 --> 02:55:30,100
Mr. Weirder.

2096
02:55:30,600 --> 02:55:31,800
Yes. Another question if I could.

2097
02:55:32,140 --> 02:55:33,160
Maybe I missed it.

2098
02:55:33,300 --> 02:55:39,560
But do we know how come the chlorine has continued to decline in these two test sites?

2099
02:55:40,660 --> 02:55:42,900
So I really think that it's just the one.

2100
02:55:43,160 --> 02:55:47,040
You do see site 18 in that graph that's also deteriorating.

2101
02:55:47,260 --> 02:55:51,940
But that area has not been flushed for quite some time.

2102
02:55:51,940 --> 02:55:57,160
It'll be flush next week or the following and I would expect in that area for the chlorine level to come up

2103
02:55:57,740 --> 02:56:03,160
But site 17 we we have done a lot of flushing and the chlorine level is still low

2104
02:56:03,160 --> 02:56:07,820
So in my mind that is the one that's of concern and it could be at 18

2105
02:56:07,820 --> 02:56:09,320
You know, we'll test it next week

2106
02:56:09,320 --> 02:56:13,560
Maybe that will be down as well and then you know my answer could change but at this point

2107
02:56:13,560 --> 02:56:18,280
I really think it's just site 17 that we're continually seeing that low

2108
02:56:19,580 --> 02:56:23,140
fluorine and maybe I missed it in your presentation but what contributes to a

2109
02:56:23,140 --> 02:56:27,460
low chlorine at that site? It's coming from the plant through the distribution

2110
02:56:27,460 --> 02:56:32,860
system. How does it decide in these other sites to have the appropriate amount

2111
02:56:32,860 --> 02:56:37,280
and then when it gets to site 17? What's causing it to drop off on the way there?

2112
02:56:37,880 --> 02:56:42,440
Do we know? It's the scale inside the pipes. So it's the build-up? Yep. And it's

2113
02:56:42,440 --> 02:56:45,880
coming off and it meets up the free chlorine that you have and then there's less

2114
02:56:45,880 --> 02:56:51,920
available. So aside from replacing the mains, once possible solution might be to completely remove the

2115
02:56:51,920 --> 02:56:56,640
scale from the pipes until they're perfectly clean and there's no more scale to come off.

2116
02:56:57,500 --> 02:57:03,840
Yes but once you come in with some aggressive main cleaning like jetting and things,

2117
02:57:04,240 --> 02:57:10,280
if you remove so much scale that you don't have any pipe wall left then you begin to have leaks.

2118
02:57:10,280 --> 02:57:24,320
And some of the leaks that they have seen in this area, we've experienced several pinhole leaks just after the picking, the ice picking that was done, which was a relatively gentle process compared to jetting.

2119
02:57:25,000 --> 02:57:35,380
So does the the picking in the pinhole leaks you're describing there, is that explained the number of repairs have been made in a couple blocks have been mentioned or those are pairs for some other issue?

2120
02:57:35,380 --> 02:57:50,980
The pinhole leaks seem to be, since the ice picking was done, I'm not familiar with all of the repairs that have been done in that area over the last several years, but they have had some recent leaks since the ice picking was done in July.

2121
02:57:51,960 --> 02:57:54,120
That they attribute to the picking.

2122
02:57:54,120 --> 02:58:00,400
I guess what I'm trying to understand is, with these mains on the, you know, 16-17 on the Alley's Air,

2123
02:58:01,540 --> 02:58:08,140
do we have a higher maintenance costs and maintenance demand on those than other areas? Is that why we have a higher

2124
02:58:08,660 --> 02:58:09,540
prioritization of those

2125
02:58:09,540 --> 02:58:14,360
I think those are on the list for water quality. I

2126
02:58:15,540 --> 02:58:19,260
Water Department really put together that list. I don't want to

2127
02:58:26,760 --> 02:58:33,480
It almost looks at some point and I think Mike's hidden that way that maintenance of

2128
02:58:33,480 --> 02:58:38,000
that might become more expensive than tearing it out and putting a new one in.

2129
02:58:38,400 --> 02:58:39,580
I think it's going to be a combination.

2130
02:58:39,940 --> 02:58:43,620
I mean, again, these are 90-year-old pipes and they may be replaced anyway there and I think

2131
02:58:43,620 --> 02:58:48,240
maybe a combination of some replacement as well as phosphates both and that and I think

2132
02:58:48,240 --> 02:58:52,920
is going to, you know, not one of them is going to fix everyone that they can have a combination of them.

2133
02:58:55,050 --> 02:58:57,230
Two, I forgot, I have two other questions here.

2134
02:58:57,610 --> 02:59:01,590
The contractors we're working with, confluence is, that's the group we decided to go with in July.

2135
02:59:02,310 --> 02:59:04,330
In Kennedy, Jinks, we work with in the past.

2136
02:59:04,690 --> 02:59:07,910
Are they the only groups that do this kind of work in the area?

2137
02:59:08,430 --> 02:59:10,830
Are there others that we should be consulting and talking with?

2138
02:59:11,250 --> 02:59:15,310
And how did we go about selecting these folks, or are there alternatives?

2139
02:59:15,310 --> 02:59:21,590
There are some alternatives. I know that CH2 and HDR both have some experience with

2140
02:59:21,590 --> 02:59:27,150
the designing of the phosphate treatment. So we could look at some alternative consultants

2141
02:59:27,150 --> 02:59:33,790
there. Confluence is really a leading expert in the area of the water chemistry.

2142
02:59:36,370 --> 02:59:37,690
So I wouldn't

2143
02:59:37,950 --> 02:59:43,950
I think they are absolutely qualified for what they are tasked to do, but there are other

2144
02:59:43,950 --> 02:59:49,050
firms also capable of designing the phosphate injection system.

2145
02:59:50,830 --> 02:59:57,590
Mr. Johnson, I just real quick, I think people are thinking that we replace the pipes and

2146
02:59:57,590 --> 02:59:58,850
the problems going to go away.

2147
02:59:58,850 --> 02:59:59,970
But if we...

2148
03:00:00,000 --> 03:00:28,340
We decide today, this minute right now, we're going to replace the mains in that area. That's a long term. You're still going to be taking duty showers for a year, for six months, for eight months. That's not a quick fix. And so in addition to looking at the mains, I think it's important to know that we're trying to figure out some alternatives to keep people healthy and safe until we get to that point. Because it's designed, I don't even know what's involved with replacing mains.

2149
03:00:28,900 --> 03:00:36,240
It's a good conclusion, I mean it doesn't replace the main decision tomorrow it's going to take some time to actually get the mains replaced.

2150
03:00:36,880 --> 03:00:38,000
Thank you Mary Jane.

2151
03:00:39,640 --> 03:00:43,620
Is there any further discussion from council on this matter?

2152
03:00:43,940 --> 03:00:48,580
I was going to bring up something that was brought up to me and I just kind of want to get it out there.

2153
03:00:49,760 --> 03:00:56,020
When the development and planning stages for this water treatment facility was being created.

2154
03:00:56,560 --> 03:01:04,260
Did we not anticipate these type of problems, and if so, what type of contingency plans did we have in place?

2155
03:01:04,520 --> 03:01:11,980
Was the plan just keep flushing and hope it went away, or what type, I mean, we needed to have some type of vision with this process.

2156
03:01:12,160 --> 03:01:20,140
We knew when this plant came in that there was going to be some flow changes to these pipes, which was going to cause some problems.

2157
03:01:20,140 --> 03:01:27,380
We're going to see some sediment distribution, but we're going on months and months and months of this.

2158
03:01:28,080 --> 03:01:31,720
What type of contingency plan did we have in place at that time?

2159
03:01:31,840 --> 03:01:34,720
Did we have anything? Did we anticipate this problem? Do we know?

2160
03:01:35,600 --> 03:01:42,120
Anyone address it? I want to know. I'm asking, what was the plan? Well, what was the fourth thought?

2161
03:01:42,120 --> 03:01:50,300
But, again, Amy, would you address, I'm getting the questions, that's why I'm asking the question, I'm getting those questions.

2162
03:01:51,400 --> 03:01:52,340
Sorry, Bob, go ahead.

2163
03:01:52,660 --> 03:01:52,800
Okay.

2164
03:01:53,580 --> 03:02:02,500
We did anticipate some of what is going on, but not to the degree that it is happening and not for this duration of time.

2165
03:02:02,500 --> 03:02:09,900
time. We did do a number of things in advance of making that transition to alleviate some

2166
03:02:09,900 --> 03:02:17,160
of these issues. I can go through them, but I think several of us are familiar. I can

2167
03:02:17,160 --> 03:02:24,540
list them if you want, but we did take steps to reduce these sorts of issues, but we had

2168
03:02:24,540 --> 03:02:30,100
under estimated how long this transition process would take.

2169
03:02:30,740 --> 03:02:32,440
Okay, thank you.

2170
03:02:35,610 --> 03:02:39,190
Any further questions, Council?

2171
03:02:40,630 --> 03:02:42,310
I think we're done for tonight,

2172
03:02:43,630 --> 03:02:47,710
unless Council has more questions on this issue.

2173
03:02:49,730 --> 03:02:55,290
I would have you look that our next meeting is October 24th.

2174
03:02:55,290 --> 03:03:04,030
Remember that November both meetings are moved November 7th and November 19th, which is a Tuesday

2175
03:03:04,570 --> 03:03:09,070
We will be having our council meetings. They will be special meetings

2176
03:03:09,710 --> 03:03:15,210
October 17th. We have a workshop in November 14th. We have a workshop

2177
03:03:15,870 --> 03:03:19,750
There any further business to bring before council meeting

2178
03:03:21,990 --> 03:03:22,490
adjourned