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Karen is helping with administering the oath of office. Thank you. Thank you.

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So raise your hand. Hi, Virgin Patel. Hi, Rajiv Patel. Do you solemnly affirm? Do solemnly affirm that I will support and defend that I'll support and defend the Constitution of the United States, the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of the State of California. And the Constitution of the State of California against all enemies.

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against

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all enemies foreign and domestic. Foreign and domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance. That I'll bear true faith and allegiance to the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of the State of

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California. To the Constitution of United States, and to the Constitution of the State of California. That I take this obligation freely.

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that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation.

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Without any mental reservation. Or purpose of evasion. Or purpose of evasion. And that I will…

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And that I'll well and faithfully. Well and faithfully discharge the duties upon which I'm about to enter. Discharge the duties.

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Upon

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which I am about to enter. Thank you.

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Congratulations, Rajiv.

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Also, we don't have to take roll call

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because he's already been.

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Um…

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You probably would want Karen to remain to do the appointment of the chair and vice chair. The floor is now open for nominations of chair for the Planning Commission. Are there any nominations? And I would nominate Jim Roshura. And I second that.

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I second that. Is there any discussion? Any other?

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Okay. May we have a roll call, please?

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Commissioner Janet? Yes.

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Commissioner Patel? Yes.

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Commissioner Brito.

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Yes, Chair. Yes. And with that the motion passes. Congratulations, Jim. You are now the chair of the Planning Commission, and I just want to say a quick thank you to my fellow residents and my fellow commissioners for.

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Helping me this year has been a real joy and pleasure to work with everybody. And now somebody else gets to lead the chair, which is Jim, quite capable hands. Thank you. With that, do you want to handle the next item at all? I can. Sure.

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Okay. Well, it'll take us just a second to do a little swaparoo here.

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Let's see.

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Here…

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I guess this…

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Bill Lewis. Yeah.

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Here…

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That says Vice Chair Chair. We'll have to fix it with somebody. I can do both today, actually, because Alyssa is not here today.

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I just need to plug this in to make sure I have power.

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That was not bad.

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Okay, that's ready. That's ready. That's ready.

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That

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is there.

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And this is too piled.

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Uh, before I begin, Brigitte,

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you did a fabulous job, and I want to thank you for from all of us, from all town residents.

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You have a superpower of your attention to detail and keeping us on track that this body really needs. And I'm so grateful that you are here and you did such a great job. Thank you very much.

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So as you just saw, the…

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Chair got assigned. Normally, we would go in now and assign a vice chair. We're going to going ahead and assigning the vice chair, even though she's not here.

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And then we're going to hope that she's okay with that. When we talk to her next. So I would like to at least take this opportunity to explain why.

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We

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are choosing. Please, go ahead. So typically, we rotate the position

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of chair and vice chair among the planning commissioners.

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So

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it's…

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Alisa Stern and or Malika.

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However, we heard at the last City Council meeting that the council has decided that any vice chair nominee.

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should be on the council for a year.

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So we want to go ahead with a similar type of arrangement in the Planning Commission.

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So instead of choosing Malika at this time, we thought we should choose Alisa.

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instead. Now, having said that, since she is not here today, we'll defer that decision till next meeting when we actually have her here.

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Um…

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Unless, uh, you feel you've already spoken with her, and we could appoint her, and then just do the signing in. I did speak…

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well, I texted her, and she texted back that, yes, she would be willing to entertain being Vice Chair, so we could just.

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Go ahead and entertain that. And I would make a motion then to nominate Elisa Brito to be Vice Chair. I can second that. Thank you. Why don't we go

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ahead and do that? Then we

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can take a roll call. Thank you.

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Commissioner Indico. Yes. Commissioner Jened. Yes. Commissioner Patel.

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Yes. Chair Washura? Yes.

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All

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right, we're fully constituted.

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Before we begin, I want to take a couple of minutes to talk about a subject that's really important to the Planning Commission and to staff.

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By the way, it's wonderful to see so many faces here. This doesn't happen very often, and it's really a great thing to see. This is how we learn what residents like and what they don't like. Uh, it's easy for us to represent the people who are here, and there are a lot of people who come to these meetings regularly.

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It's so much more difficult for us to represent what I call the silent majority, and yet it's very important for us to represent them well. So thank you for all being here today.

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But we have an issue with Planning Commission meetings. They start at 6 o'clock, and we've been here at one o'clock in the morning more than a couple times. The the agendas are very long. They're difficult subjects to get through.

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And so one of the things I'd like to focus on in my term as chair is to try to shorten the meetings. It's for our benefit, it's for your benefit, and really for staff's benefit. So I have a few ideas, and I wanted to mention them and see if we can get some concurrence on this.

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I have five ideas, and I'm… I'd love to hear any other ideas you have. First, let's try not to redesign projects from the dais.

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When an application needs substantial change, we serve the applicant better by continuing the item with clear direction, then by negotiating details in real time.

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If you find yourself proposing a specific design solution, consider whether it be belongs in a condition and then approval, or in a direction for a continuance. That's item number one.

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Item number 2, let's get to a motion as quickly as we can.

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Once we get a motion, then the discussion is focused on the motion, not on a lot of wide-ranging topics, and I think that may facilitate a quicker delivery.

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Third, at the stage, uh, there's a certain cadence to how we process hearings, and one of the steps is called clarifying questions. During that stage, let's make sure what we're asking are clarifying questions.

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That's not a time to kind of talk about anything and everything to do with the project. Really, we just want to make sure that we on the dais understand the things we need to move forward.

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Uh, fourth, please send your questions to staff in advance if you can.

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Many of them can be answered offline outside of meeting time, and that can help us. And where an answer is something all of us and the public need to hear, I'll ask staff to please include the answers to those questions in their presentations on those particular items.

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Obviously, at that point, you've already published your staff report, so we can't change the staff report. But during the presentation, please try to address the questions that you have heard about so that you can say them once instead of us asking you them.

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Three times in three different ways.

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In the same vein, if there are some aspect of the project that we believe the public and fellow commissioners would benefit from having described specifically, let staff know that in advance. And similarly, they can add that to their presentations.

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I think if we can get that information coming from staff once, that will help us.

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And lastly, and I'm the worst at this, if a colleague has already made your point, it's enough to simply say you agree and have nothing else to say.

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And you can call me on that anytime you want. That's fine. All right. I hope that those are some ideas. There are other ideas. Let's bring them up at any time. Let's try to get staff home at a reasonable hour.

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and us as well, and residents as well. Thank you. I just have one suggestion that, and we used to do that in Los Altos,

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since there were always

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a lot of people attending the meetings, that we should be really.

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Keeping an eye on the clock, because if we have a lot of people and we let one person talk longer, and then clocking the other…

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There was a 3 min, then it just becomes longer and longer, so if you have a lot of people in the room, at least we should try and see if we can make sure that we stick with the timing, at least for everybody. I totally agree with that.

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Everyone? Yeah.

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I suppose the other thing that goes along with that is people get a chance to say their 3 min. They talk, and that's it. We're not gonna dribble on and on and have comments.

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from the seats, that's a bad idea, because when you speak from the seats, people on Zoom can't hear you. You really do need to be at the microphone for this to be a public meeting.

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All right. All right. Thank you.

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Okay, the next item on the agenda is presentations from the floor. For those of you who haven't been to Planning Commission meeting, there's kind of 2 times to talk. One is, if you're addressing a specific item that's on the agenda.

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And the time to talk is during that agenda item. But if you're just here with something that you want to say, there is an opportunity now called presentations from the Floor. This is an opportunity for persons wishing to address the Commission on any subject.

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That's not on the agenda. Persons who wish to address the Commission on any subject not on the agenda are invited to do so now.

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Please note, however, that the Commission is not able to undertake extended items… extended discussion or act tonight on any non-agendized items. Such items will be referred to staff or placed on the agenda.

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For a future meeting.

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If you would like to address the Commission, please come to the podium or raise your hand on Zoom, and someone will assist you. We ask that you provide your name and where you reside for our records, but it's not required that you do so.

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Each person will be given 3 minutes to provide their comments. Are there any persons who wish to address the Commission?

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John.

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Good evening. I'm John O'Connell, Los Alto Sills.

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Since we're on a spree of changing some things as

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to how we do it to make things more efficient.

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in the last couple of weeks I've been trying to research things.

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I'd like to request both the Commission and staff.

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We have a system called Laserfiche.

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It takes quite a long time to get to a document.

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But

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when you get to it.

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All you can do is either screenshot it or leave it open in your browser and go back to it, and it takes just as long the next time you want to look at it. The print button.

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or download button is disabled, and it really does make it difficult to go back through a large number of records.

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I'd also like to bring up the issue of… I think we've gone too far.

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In this copyright, and therefore people can't really get access to the plans. The plans now are all digital.

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And I understand the issue of them being copied and copyright.

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But it really it really is to the point now where.

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There's new plans for tonight.

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And I haven't looked at them.

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I haven't looked at them because I just haven't had time to get to the town.

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So maybe we can also think about how to get the applicants and their architects, etc, to maybe organize the thing into two things. If there's some areas that they really do have a copyright claim on.

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Then that I understand is copyrighted. But an awful lot of the stuff I really don't think is copyrightable. It's so maybe you could do some things to the better informed that residents are.

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the more effective we will be at communicating our comments to you. Thank you.

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Well, I don't think we can make any motions about this, but let me just ask staff to please look into enabling the button and the downloads. That seems like a reasonable possibility, and maybe to agendize an item to.

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Make some suggestions about how we might be able to make some of this information from either sign off disclosure document or or some some way to get this information to residents better from the plans.

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Understand

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your direction. Chair. Okay, thank you. Thank you.

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Hi, my name is Faye. And the

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first thing is to address to your request earlier to ask us

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to speak shorter.

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Obviously, if we know where you are and your votes will be, we can be short. We can speak shortly, but if we worry about you not getting the picture, worry about this and that, how we have to address it is impacting.

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our lives seriously, right? The second thing is.

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The second thing is I just wish any regulation, any pilot rule ruling today, it can be thinking about for the whole Los Altos residence. If you consider some policy is eligible.

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compatible, whatever.

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make it public, transparent, applicable for all office. Don't do it as a patch up this time. We need it. If you want the patch up, we all want to patch up together. Right? You you understand what that.

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So that means different regulations and the trees. Do we preserve the trees? Do we preserve the slopes as our general plan request? Or do we? When there's a conflict.

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Your reason behind, and how you.

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modify the plan.

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Yes.

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I see. May I just comment your 1st point about.

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Being economical with speech didn't have to do with the residents. It had to do with us.

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We are the ones who need to be more economic with our speech. Economical with our speech. The speeches that residents provide, I want to modify in no way whatsoever. There's a timer on the wall, and you're welcome to say what you need to say. All right.

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Thank you so

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much for the clarification. Thank you.

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Pete, are you in line? I am.

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Good evening, Pete Carlino, Liam Brace. I'm here for an item tonight, but actually

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I want to speak on. I've been having ongoing conversations with planning staff

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about development area calculations as it relates to fire truck turnarounds and fire truck widths and assessment of roads.

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And it's just becoming clear with current review processes that alternative materials that have been tried to use to stay under MDA were not factored in in the nineties when the land use numbers were being developed with some of these items. And so I've been talking with staff.

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about maybe doing a reassessment of some of the items, such as like grass paid gets you a 50% credit because it's permeable, but gravel pay gives you 10.

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But they're both permeable. Fire will sign off on gravel pave, but they have a hard time signing off on grass pave. And so we're making decisions on MDA numbers instead of on actual performance of them. So I just wanted to let you know we've been talking with staff and want to encourage, maybe, Planning Commission to take up.

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some conversations about how to deal with MDA numbers that relates to fire, fire access, and improvements. So I don't see getting any easier based on some of the projects

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we're working on. Well, uh, thank you. Um, we are trying to streamline things as much as we can. I have to confess, I didn't follow exactly where this was applicable, but I can certainly appreciate.

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That there can be some improvements if things were locked in many years ago, and it's not

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a specific project, it's more of a global conversation about the development

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area. Yeah, just to understand what you're saying is.

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Since materials have changed over the last few decades, it's better to understand the different new materials available and appropriately apply MDA calculations using them. Is that part of it? Yes. And

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part of it is that.

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Some of the review with some of the jurisdictions are that you only have an impervious material, and it's where there's some struggles with how to comply with fire life and safety, as well as trying to be within MDA numbers, because it wasn't really factored in at the time.

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say, not a new home, but maybe an adu or something else that is not in that type of redevelopment stage

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of a project. Well, let me alert staff. Here's another great item to consider. Maybe you could.

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stand this up a little bit better, formulate it, bring it in, and we could discuss

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it. Maybe I can add a little reference, too, that maybe we could have the EDPC.

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Add this to one of their items that they do submit preliminary investigation and help staff out with a little bit of legwork, so you don't get stuck doing the

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main burden of it. Yeah, so one of our work plan items, uh, as it relates to ongoing discussions for code amendments was a consideration of.

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regulations that have

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come from committees and come from the Planning Commission. One of those was artificial turf. Because of that conversation, as well as some conversations that we've been having around gravel surfaces in the light of fire prevention. We've already started that conversation, and in fact, this week, um, we presented some modifications that we're looking at.

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As it relates to some of these types of surfaces. And so that conversation with the EDPC, we gave a presentation on some of the direct modifications, but now hearing the larger topic, we'll continue to expand that with them.

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Thank

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you. And and keep a keep after us again. I'm just I'm

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here at an off topic meeting item tonight. Wanted to make sure at least I get it out there. But we've already requested some conversations to be had at staff level. I figured I'd bring it up, saying hopefully it gets to this level of conversation, maybe with the residents as well, because it affects.

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residents with their potential development. Pete, you're a

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great resource for the community. Keep it up. Oh, thank you. Appreciate it.

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Are there any other people on Zoom? No, and no, I see no other people here in the room. We thank members of the public for coming forward to express their comments, questions, and concerns. The next item on our agenda is the consent.

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Consent calendar. We have two consent calendar items, both of which are approval of draft minutes, the April 22nd, 2026 Special Meeting and the May 7th, 2026 regular meeting.

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Uh, Marco, was there any corrections that you've already received on either of these? Uh, no.

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I was waiting on some corrections from…

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Vice Chair Brito.

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I'm still to receive in written. We could

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choose to continue this if she has some. Did she already tell you she had corrections? She was to send me some like 2 meetings

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ago, but

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I reminded her again, and

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then I asked you off.

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to send

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me corrections ahead of the time. Do you know if it has to do with one or both of these particular ones?

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Just the first

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one. The

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second one is new to everyone. All right, my suggestion is we continue the first one so that Alyssa can get her changes in.

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Uh, but that we go ahead with the second one, if that's amenable to everyone. Are there any changes on the

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second set

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of minutes? I'm good. All right. That's fine. Can I get a motion to approve these minutes? Have there been any changes since you published them? So we'll, uh…

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I'll make a motion to pass or yeah to pass the minutes for the May 7th, 2026. Okay. I'll second that.

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Commissioner Indico. Yes, Commissioner Jeanette. Yes, Commissioner Patel. Yes. Chair Washera. Yes.

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On to the fifth item in today's agenda, the public hearings. Chair, if

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I may. Could we bring up the course.

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Uh, we wanted to move the director's report up in the agenda for a good reason, and we're about to hear why.

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Thank you, Chair. Obviously, we typically do the director's report at the end of the meeting. But I do think, since we've got a number of the members of the public here, it's important to talk about some of the resources that the department has, and we've.

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We've been very successful in recruitment. We have a new, uh.

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Um, planning assistant with us. It's one of the most critical roles of our operation, and having an individual of the caliber that we were able to recruit in Amond Desai, who's here with us today, and who had asked to give a little bit of a background on himself for the benefit of the community and for the commission.

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We're very excited to have him on with us, and look forward to working with him as we dive into a number of projects in the coming year.

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Welcome,

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Amon. I think you'll find that there's a lot of work to do, and we will appreciate your efforts very much.

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Hello, thank you. I come here from Tulare County, where I was working for the county a

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little bit. I've also

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worked for developers, planner, and also in labor as well. Very good.

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Welcome. Some of

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the other things within the director's report. We are going to have a special meeting for our subdivision committee. We'll be having 2 different items on that particular agenda dealing with subdivision of the former Fenwick property.

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Um, with that, we've talked a little bit about what kinds of plans can be shared. For this particular item, we went through great length to make sure that we could give digital information to individuals relating to those plans. So now the agenda associated with this particular item that's going to happen on August 10th.

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has plans and specifications associated with it, as well as the general notice for that particular item. And then the last update was we had submitted, um, the last round of ADU amendments to the state to comply with state law. Um, we had a very good response from the state. However, there was two corrections that we need to be able to clarify for the state.

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Over the, um, coming months, we'll be working with them to clarify that, and if there are additional modifications, we'll be bringing those back for Planning Commission

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consideration. And let me explain to fellow commissioners. Remember, recently we went through quite a few ADU changes.

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That is not this. That is not part of this. We broke the large set of changes into the things that were all absolutely necessary, because legislation changed, or for some reason, such as that, and then the new newer changes.

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We filed for the legislative changes. Those are the ones we have two comments on. My understanding is that it's not on fire. They said, you know, take your time to respond, so I'm kind of hopeful that we might be able to.

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do the second batch, the larger batch, and these corrections at the same time. Of course, that'll depend on staff and the

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only comment I would make is.

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trying to batch everything in a larger batch.

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has lent us to delay this month after month, if not year after year. So, as long as we can.

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do the whole batch.

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In a reasonable amount of time. I like it. But if that's not doable.

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Let's continue with the small batch first. That's the only

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thing. I agree completely. I think what took us a long time was…

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Doing the thinking of what would be in the larger batch, and I do believe that is done now. Right. So,

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so, as long as in the next.

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Month or two, we can have this…

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finally come to the Planning Commission.

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Great. But if it's going to take more than that, I'm happy to take the smaller batch.

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sooner and get it out of the way.

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Because otherwise, my worry is this has to go through the council.

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And December, there is no council meeting.

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So we need to do this ASAP. If you want this to be signed off this year. And I definitely want to have it signed off this year. At least some part of it, if not all. And

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let me just say that the reason I want to batch them together is the things we really care about aren't the little technical changes, it is the bigger stuff.

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So I kind of want to use the technical changes as a vehicle to get the bigger stuff through the barn door.

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Fair, but this year? Yes. Oh, yes. And before ideally, no later than October, it should come to Planning Commission.

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I hope you've heard

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that. Tim is texting

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me now. He says he agrees that October will be fine, and for minor technical changes, September will be able to do so. Okay. Well,

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so this is not the only one. The same applies to another, you know.

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What we talked about, SB9. So I think both of these, we have to knock them out soon.

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Because we have other important housing element issues coming up which will suck us into a long discussion for a very long time. Well, what I would ask,

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I suppose, is if at by the next meeting, if this it isn't clear what we're doing here, please give us a.

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some information about the outlook for this, so that we can see that it is going to be able to happen by December.

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Yeah, the timelines, right? Outlook of timelines, yeah.

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Thank

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you.

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Anything else on that subject? No, that's great. All right. Now we're on to public hearings. Public hearings are specially noticed items for discussion. Anyone wishing to speak regarding a public hearing item should fill out a speaker card prior to the completion of the staff report.

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And give it to staff, or if you are attending on Zoom, raise your hand, and someone will assist you.

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The order of business for a public hearing is as follows. First, we'll hear a staff presentation. Then the applicant will give a presentation of up to 15 minutes in length.

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Then there will be commission… commissioner questions and clarifications.

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Then there will be an area for public comment, uh, and everyone will be given up to 3 minutes per person to speak.

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Then, after the applicant has heard all those comments, the applicant can have 5 min to respond to everything they've heard to date to that time.

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And then finally, we will close the public hearing and bring it back to the Commission, and the Commission will, uh, will do deliberation and develop actions on that item.

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If you challenge the proposed action in court, you may be limited to raising only those issues you or someone else raised at the public hearing or in written correspondence delivered to the Planning Commission at or prior to the public hearing.

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Any interested party may appeal a determination of the Planning Commission to the City Council by filing a written notice of appeal with the City Clerk by 4 p.m. within 21 days of the decision.

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A non-refundable filing fee and a deposit for services shall accompany each notice of appeal, except that any member of the City Council may file such an appeal without payment of a fee.

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First, can I ask my fellow commissioners about any ex parte they may have had? And why don't we just do all the hearings at once, and I will begin. I've had discussions with residents Doris Pond and Connie Oakson.

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On the subject of the La Barranca property, and also John O'Connell.

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Anyone else?

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Yeah, I've had a conversation with Fay and Amy on the La Branca property.

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And

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I thought for for 5.1. I've had expertise with John O'Connell, Carol Gottlieb. Neighbors say, and also Denise Gallo.

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I

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think that was all of them I spoke to.

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Thank

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you. Okay, we'll move on to the 1st public hearing item. Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you said you you

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didn't.

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I didn't.

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I didn't. I'm just saying… Oh, you

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have to recuse.

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Yes, I'm just waiting

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for… Uh, if you don't mind, I'm just going to explain for the residents. Go ahead. Malika Junaid is a world-class architect, and um…

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She is the architect on this project, and so she's going to recuse herself and not be part of this discussion. So, officially…

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Okay, all right, perfect. Just checking.

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I don't think it would hurt for me to at least begin. Item 5.1.

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is, uh, it's called 0 La Baranca Road. This parcel has an APN number, but it was never given an address. So it's called the unaddressed La Barranca Road, APN 18205034.

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property file number Sd25-0072, and also for the variance VAR 25- 006 lands of Bangala and Tokawa.

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0016.

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0016,

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pardon me.

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Uh, this is a request for a site development permit for the construction of a 4,584 square foot 2 story single family residence with attached garage.

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A 793 square foot attached accessory dwelling unit, a 999 square foot attached Sb. 9 unit and associated hardscape and site improvements.

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And also a variance to permit a driveway width exceeding the maximum 14 feet.

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and also a grading policy exception to allow the excavation to exceed the maximum cut thresholds for driveways, and for a Williamson Act compatibility determination.

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As the property is subject to a Williamson Act contract for agricultural land conservation.

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It's CEQA review is status is categorical exemption per section 15303A, and the staff.

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Senior Planner is Jonathan Fox. May we begin with the staff report, Jonathan.

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Thank you, Chair.

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Taking a look at the unaddressed property on La

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Branca. The Commission will recall that this application.

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Had its first public hearing with the Commission on June 8th of this

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year, where staff presented a recommendation for approval of the site development permit variances, grading policy exception, and also presented findings for the Williamson Act compatibility.

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At that public hearing, the Commission took public comment.

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deliberated and ultimately continued the item to a date uncertain, so the applicant can make changes to the plans, so staff could provide further information on the Wilmson Act, and for the Open Space Committee to provide a recommendation for an open space easement.

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Here's the property west of 280, south of La Branca Road.

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And here is a Google or the GIS aerial of the same property, noting the contours, high point being the northwest portion here.

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And then decreasing in slope as you get to the south.

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Um, to the southeast.

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So you'll find that this presentation is not going to focus on the changes, the design changes that have taken place since June 8th, as the applicant's presentation will go into those in great detail.

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product of scope, as the chair had read, was a site development permit for new residents, a variance to exceed the maximum driveway width.

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Previously, there was a variance to exceed maximum development area, but that has been designed out of the project, so that is no longer required as findings.

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A grading policy exception to exceed cut excavation thresholds and a William Snack compatibility determination. At the last public hearing. There also was a staff observation that the height did not comply with the the maximum building height of 27 feet.

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At that June 8th meeting staff presented a solution to to address as a condition of approval. However, that's just been again designed out of the project, so it will comply with the 27 foot height limit.

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Here's the proposed development calling a very similar outline and layout to what was presented on June 8th driveway coming off of La Biranca into the attached garage. The one.

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attached structure that features a primary dwelling SB 9 unit, and attached ADU.

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Couple of design changes is the pool has been removed from the scope, so that's how the applicant was able to not require a variance to MDA. Also, there's been some changes to the carports, so those do not count as floor area either.

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Again, we have the chicken coop and the…

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greenhouse in the center of the property, and the septic system that is accessed by a pump that is uphill, uh, northwest of the property.

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The

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Open Space Committee gathered.

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Shortly after Planning Commission on June 10th, and provided a recommendation on the open space easement.

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an open space easement in a U shape over a majority of the slopes greater than 30%, similar to the diagram presented at the meeting. The small bits of the steep slopes near the proposed septic tank would be excluded. The existing slope easement along La Barranca would be excluded.

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So, the Open Space Committee's approach was really by the general plan to require an open space easement on slopes greater than 30%, but highlighting that a couple areas would be excluded septic tank and the existing slope easement that is already protected.

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We acknowledge that the Open Space Committee meeting that.

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portions of the existing development are within the slopes greater than 30%, and it was open spaces open space community's desire not to factor that in that recommendation, factor that into the recommendation, but for the Planning Commission to take that position, that the area of the.

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proposed development in 30% slopes would obviously not have an open space easement on it.

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And you'll see that here. This is the applicant's proposed open space easement, which largely addresses the open space committees.

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recommendation, but again, there's portions in this back part of the residence that are, uh, proposed over slopes greater than 30%.

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So those areas have been excluded from the open space easement.

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And again, for reference, there's an existing slope easement adjacent to La Branco Way, very steepy slope, greater than 50% that's excluded because it's already protected by that open space easement.

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As I mentioned in the project scope.

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One of the findings for the planning commission to make a recommendation on, and for the city council to take final action on is the Williamson Act compatibility.

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Um, again, one of the…

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updates since the June 8th meeting is that the Willom Synap contract for this property has been located.

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It's been included in your staff report packet, and it's published online. That contract was approved, entered into the… entered by the town and the property owner in 1972.

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That contract limits the use of the property to the production of agricultural commodities for commercial purposes and compatible uses. It establishes a list of compatible uses. A screenshot of which is on screen, Exhibit A of that contract.

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And we've highlighted in red, um, of those compatible uses which apply to this proposed project.

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So obviously that is agriculture, open space uses, primary dwellings, and secondary dwellings. This project proposes all 4 of those.

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And lastly, the Williamson Act contract allows either party to initiate a non-renewal at any time, and that will be.

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Relevant

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to the recommendation slide.

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The public notice for this property was issued out again as this project was continued to a date uncertain. So the notice went out again on July 24th.

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Uh, staff did receive several written public comments.

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gearing up for this presentation. Those were included in the staff report packet. There have been supplementals, supplemental public comment that was received following publication of the staff report. Those have been forwarded to the Commission and uploaded to the town's website.

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And the town has also received a petition, which highlighted a number of concerns and a lot of questions, and that petition was signed by about 50 residents, and that has also been forwarded to the Commission.

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There, there you go.

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So the staff's recommendation, um, there's two options that are laid out in the staff report. Option one is to adopt a resolution, which is attachment 1, recommending that the City Council find the project categorically exempt from CEQA.

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Uh, consider whether the town should continue supporting the Williams-Snack contract for the subject property.

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Uh, to determine that the proposed project is consistent with the principles set forth in Government Code Section 51238.1, which is the Williamson Act, and is compatible with the property's existing Williamson Act contract.

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And finally, for option one is to approve the site development permit and all associated project entitlements subject to the attached conditions of approval.

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As an alternative to Option 1, the Planning Commission can continue the project to a date certain and direct staff to prepare a resolution recommending that the City Council deny the project.

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That

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concludes staff presentation and here for any questions.

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Does anyone have any clarifying questions for staff?

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I

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don't think so. I'm not clarifying. So just to

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clarification. The second recommendation you have.

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Is to have city council deny the project for what purpose?

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The

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the…

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Okay, so

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the second option is, I think it's important to note that we would have to come back at a second meeting because we don't have that denial resolution prepared yet. And we would use the conversation in today's public hearing if it were to go towards a denial to.

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inform how staff writes that denial resolution.

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Yeah,

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and I think what I would add is there's really 3 different decisions here that are before the Planning Commission. The first is the project that you're used to, for the most part, within the variance requests and general compatibility with our zoning. So that can be approved or denied. Um, and depending on what the, um.

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The Commission wants to do in that action, um, would cause staff, if the variances were denied, or the project was denied because of the lack of those variances, that then there would be a redesign of that project, and then a new project would need to come back that.

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propose either different variances or, you know, something that completely complied. The second part of the decision making is really tied to and the third is really tied to the Williamson Act. Because there's a development happening on this project, I'll handle the higher level.

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The question that we have to to the Commission, and ultimately to the city council, which is anytime a property is being developed, there is a question as to whether or not the contract is something that the the council would still want to have.

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Um, because of the new development, right? You're going from open space, you're adding new houses, you may be agriculture, you're shrinking open space. Is that really what the city council envisioned when they entered into this contract in 1972?

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Um, and so, because of the contract language, there's an ability for a non-renewal by both parties in that instance. And if the planning commission, who has typically been the body that makes recommendations through a report to the city council.

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Um, based on, um, again, the adoption of the town into an agricultural preserve, um, would have the ability to, um, go, uh, ask to have the contract non-renewed, and then the…

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That process would have a specific duration of time associated with it for notification to the particular.

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To the particular property owner or contract in this particular instance, parties in the contract. And then from there, um, then there's a number of things that would happen with the, um, the county assessor and the taxation for that particular piece of land.

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It's important to note that if, um, then in this next part of the conversation, um…

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And I'll talk about compatibility. But if for some reason compatibility resulted in something that was noncompatible, and the planning commission made a determination that it was noncompatible.

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00:50:48,000 --> 00:51:04,000
The contract would then make the the project have to stop. There wouldn't be a project that would move forward at that point in time. So there's another part where the applicant, if found noncompatible.

362
00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:20,000
would then have the option for non-renewal themselves, and could potentially then immediately cancel the contract, which would then give them the ability to move forward with development, assuming that the Planning Commission was supportive of the first thing that we talked about, which is the variances and the overall.

363
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:43,000
direction of the con… of the project itself. But if the project is compatible and the town council still feels like non-renewal is possible, then that allows the project to continue because it would be compatible with the contract at the time until the 10 years have expired, of which the non-renewal would then expire.

364
00:51:43,000 --> 00:51:58,000
And the contract would be void at that point in time. So those are really kind of the different parts of the consideration in front of the Commission today and kind of the ramifications of each of those decisions that you have before you.

365
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:01,000
And the recommendations you could be making to City Council.

366
00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:17,000
So I have a question here because this is kind of this is like a fork in the road. Basically, we have the Williamson Act. We have to figure out the compatibility and that's got to be decided first and foremost. And then you can talk about option A or B. And that decision rests solely.

367
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:29,000
on City Council. So we, as a recommending body, need to focus on the compatibility issue, because… and then have City Council weigh in on that, and then.

368
00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:39,000
At a later date, talk about, you know, Road A or road B, in a sense. I feel the compatibility is the crux of the issue here.

369
00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:55,000
I have a similar question about this. You listed the items in a particular order, and I wonder if, per what you just said, if the 1st subject really isn't the compatibility with the contract.

370
00:52:55,000 --> 00:53:10,000
Because if that's a no, there is no project moving forward. Now, but if that's a yes, I guess I would differ with you a little bit. I think that if we determine it's a yes, I think we could go on.

371
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:25,000
With the examination of the zoning variance and those sorts of issues, uh, because then it would go to City Council as a package, and they could take our recommendations on the whole package.

372
00:53:25,000 --> 00:53:31,000
and be done with it. I see a little bit of convenience there, but I don't think.

373
00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:32,000
Let

374
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:37,000
me ask you this, though. Since this is procedural clarifications.

375
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:49,000
Aren't you kind of preempting City Council by having, first, the determination of what we recommend as far as compliance with the Williamson Act, and then giving them.

376
00:53:49,000 --> 00:54:02,000
an option if they chose to go this route versus the other route. I don't know, it's kind of preemptive strike, in a sense. I guess I'm just trying to… That's what I'm kind of curious about, as far as pragmatic here, yeah. Um, yeah, the reason I

377
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:12,000
took it in the order that I did is because I do think that understanding if the Commission is supportive of the project, just as if it was a regular piece of property without the Williamson Act encumbrance.

378
00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:28,000
is something that is germane to the… probably the first thing that's germane to the conversation, right? Because if you're not willing to, under regular circumstances, consider this project, then, you know, we should tell the applicant that, um, first. Then we get into the conversation of.

379
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:46,000
You know, the Williamson Act and which conversation comes that whether you would support compatibility or not support compatibility, and then whether or not you would support the renewal of the contract or not. And those would all be recommendations to the to the city council.

380
00:54:46,000 --> 00:54:47,000
I think we should

381
00:54:47,000 --> 00:54:55,000
discuss this later. Okay, yeah, just I just wanted to ask a question, but I think this is a quite a long discussion. So let's table it.

382
00:54:55,000 --> 00:55:00,000
Other clarifying questions.

383
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:08,000
I do have one more Claire. Go ahead. But maybe I should have a clarifying question for the applicants, since they're the ones presenting the plans, right?

384
00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:11,000
Yes. We can do that

385
00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:25,000
at that time. My understanding is Claire is online. One of my clarifying questions has to do with the Williamson Act determination or compatibility determination.

386
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:37,000
And it has to do with whether agriculture has to be a primary use on the land for the primary and secondary dwellings to then be subordinate to.

387
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:39,000
And, um…

388
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:56,000
So far, what I've read in the packets is that that's not under consideration, that's not a requirement. But I'd love to get some to clarify whether tonight it's important for us to to consider or make findings about whether.

389
00:55:56,000 --> 00:56:00,000
Agriculture is the primary use of the land. Yeah. So I'll

390
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:17,000
start, and then Claire can follow. So one of the 1st things, as you heard me say, and and I do appreciate research from our residents, and specifically John O'Connell on this particular matter, because one of the things that he was able to find is in 1971, that agricultural preserve was established in town.

391
00:56:17,000 --> 00:56:39,000
That then means that the town has to accept Williamson Act applications, and that the town can itself move to take applications and consider them. So with that in mind, then you look at what local regulations that we have. And again, to John's research.

392
00:56:39,000 --> 00:57:00,000
An ordinance that we have before us is ordinance 616, and that ordinance was the establishment of that preserve, and in there it talks about the the criteria associated with the Williamson Act and how it performs comparatively to.

393
00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:16,000
the properties that are asking to be incorporated within the Williamson Act. What you'll see there is that there is some criteria that mimics the contracts that we have with these individual property owners.

394
00:57:16,000 --> 00:57:31,000
Those contracts talk about prime agricultural use, but they don't necessarily give quantities of the land that's necessary. But there was a question that I think you posed earlier to staff that we should.

395
00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:53,000
We'll probably bring up at this point, which is what is prime agricultural use versus open space in the context of Williamson. The Williamson Act. And so when you look at the definition for what prime agricultural use is, it's the sale of goods at a commercial level. And in this project, while has a minimum.

396
00:57:53,000 --> 00:58:11,000
footprint as it relates to the agricultural use. It does have commercial associated within the business plan that we've seen and reviewed as part of this project. So without a local statute, we're left to use what was originally, uh, uh.

397
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:28,000
designated within 1972, which is the overall state regulations related to agricultural uses and the definitions at the state. We can, as local government, have criteria that we've established locally. We haven't done that as a town that we've.

398
00:58:28,000 --> 00:58:44,000
We found in our research to date. But then there's the question of whether a land that has been undeveloped is an open space can have development and still remain that without the agricultural use. And I believe that was your question to staff, Commissioner.

399
00:58:44,000 --> 00:59:01,000
or chair. Um, and so, in that, we would do believe, and would concur, that the language within the contract would say that if you're moving from an open space into a development, that that would prohibit, then, the property from being considered as.

400
00:59:01,000 --> 00:59:19,000
a Williamson Act property, because we've had other properties in town that have similar configurations with Williamson Act that have had development that have then had to subdivide that piece of development out so that the remainder of the parcel could remain an open space and still qualify for Williamson Act.

401
00:59:19,000 --> 00:59:34,000
Um, so in this instance, because this project not only has open space that's remaining, but also has the agricultural use, though, um, the statutes don't necessarily put a finer point on what that percentage is, or the area or size.

402
00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:51,000
The fact that it exists is one of the things that we believe qualifies it for the contract and for the Williamson Act at the state level, and then it does allow for you to then consider other uses on that property, which are then ancillary to that agricultural use associated.

403
00:59:51,000 --> 01:00:04,000
With the number of things listed in the contract itself, which relating to this project are open space, the primary structure, the secondary structure, as Jonathan showed in his presentation.

404
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:05,000
The

405
01:00:05,000 --> 01:00:19,000
specific area that I'd like clarification on is that you're right. Our 1972 contract was pretty thin. It turns out it came from a kind of a boilerplate. The county had.

406
01:00:19,000 --> 01:00:26,000
Uh, back in 72, um, but you'll note that the second paragraph says.

407
01:00:26,000 --> 01:00:40,000
Although it specifies some things at the local level, and those things are very thin, it also in the second paragraph says will be consistent with the 1965 Conservation Act.

408
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:51,000
And the study that I did in this area shows that if you drill down into the 1965 Conservation Act.

409
01:00:51,000 --> 01:01:07,000
And also, all the lawsuits that have happened since then regarding this, this very specific item has been addressed multiple times, and it always appears to me to imp…

410
01:01:07,000 --> 01:01:18,000
imply that the agriculture needs to be the primary use of the land, and the… and I'm having difficulty with the idea that we would.

411
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:33,000
create findings that says it's a primary use of the land. And so I'm just trying to understand our role in this situation. Should we just believe the assessments from you and our attorney, and.

412
01:01:33,000 --> 01:01:49,000
Go based on that, or should we consider… may we consider our own research to understand if we think that the primary use of the land has to be agriculture to qualify? I

413
01:01:49,000 --> 01:01:53,000
think we should discuss that later. Again, my opinion.

414
01:01:53,000 --> 01:02:01,000
But since we are the planning commission, we should be having our own opinions also. We can't just.

415
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:11,000
blindly follow what staff or potentially legal is saying. But at the same time, I would say, let's talk about it when I'm just

416
01:02:11,000 --> 01:02:16,000
fishing for some good legal counsel here. I think we are not going to

417
01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:25,000
get it, so let's move on. Okay.

418
01:02:25,000 --> 01:02:33,000
Claire, if there's anything you'd like to add right now, that would be great. Otherwise, I think we'll just move on to open the public hearing. No, no.

419
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:45,000
Well, I'll just, and good evening, Commission. I'll just add, I think Jay summarized that really well that when you look at the statute, it is framed in such a way

420
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:56,000
that allows the city or the county to establish a preserve and then allows them to contract to preserve land within the preserve area.

421
01:02:56,000 --> 01:03:01,000
That's for agricultural use, and it delegates, obviously pretty

422
01:03:01,000 --> 01:03:07,000
substantial amount of authority to the local jurisdiction to establish the rules about

423
01:03:07,000 --> 01:03:09,000
What's the compatible use? What's the

424
01:03:09,000 --> 01:03:24,000
The contract provisions governing the preserves, preservation of the land, and etc. And so in this case, there is a contract, and it talks about the preserved use, or the compatible uses. So that contract

425
01:03:24,000 --> 01:03:29,000
Can guide your decision. But again, you know that

426
01:03:29,000 --> 01:03:40,000
I would advise a commission if you want to continue with the hearing and get some more information from the applicant, and then you can revisit this topic.

427
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:43,000
All right, thank you very much, Claire.

428
01:03:43,000 --> 01:03:53,000
It is a… I've been here 6 years. This is the first one of these I've seen. It is a very complex topic. So we'll we'll have to dig our way through this.

429
01:03:53,000 --> 01:04:07,000
Now we will open the public hearing. First, we will ask the applicant to make their hearing presentation. Please keep it to 15 minutes allocated to you. And the applicant is.

430
01:04:07,000 --> 01:04:18,000
Here we are. Very good.

431
01:04:18,000 --> 01:04:24,000
We we have several people here to speak, so we'll keep our part as short as we possibly

432
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:30,000
can. My name is Alpheus Jessup. I'm with M designs architects. And this is Nene, who's

433
01:04:30,000 --> 01:04:35,000
also with us and is the lead designer on this project. She's going to summarize.

434
01:04:35,000 --> 01:04:44,000
The changes or the alterations that have been made so far to the project, we're happy to be talking about it from the architectural side, rather than.

435
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:59,000
The Williamson Act side, and we'll go from there. We've got the civil engineer here as well to speak to issues that people have had. And we've also got the geotech and soils engineers to participate as well.

436
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:11,000
Oh, I'm sorry. And the homeowners are here on Zoom, and they will be if you do want to get into the Williams snack contract, they will be happy to talk about that at that point.

437
01:05:11,000 --> 01:05:16,000
Thank you.

438
01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:24,000
Good evening, Chair and members of the Commission. My name is Nini. I'm the lead designer of Caro, and we're just just try

439
01:05:24,000 --> 01:05:32,000
to get as close to this thing as you can. Good evening, Chair and members of the commissions. My name is Mini Malik.

440
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:35,000
designer of the Zero La Bronco Row project. I'm

441
01:05:35,000 --> 01:05:52,000
here to present some of the modifications that we've done on the project since we last met in June. I'm pretty sure everybody is already familiar with the projects scope of work and the site constraints. We have quite a steep load, and we are.

442
01:05:52,000 --> 01:06:08,000
We have our thoughts on across the property. We have. We are under evidence mapped. We have steep slopes and a very limited buildable area. So it's a very challenging site to develop. But, however, we managed to design something for the homeowner. Hopefully, that would benefit them in the long term.

443
01:06:08,000 --> 01:06:11,000
Can we go to the next slide, please?

444
01:06:11,000 --> 01:06:27,000
So since we last met, we have made modifications on the tree removal. We originally have 12 trees, heritage trees to be removed on site, and now we have 9. And now we also have reduced the floor area.

445
01:06:27,000 --> 01:06:34,000
from 5,178 square feet to 4,006, 683 square feet, which is.

446
01:06:34,000 --> 01:06:50,000
317 square feet below the maximum allowed Mfa. And then we also have reduced development area to under 7,500, which is 7,495 square feet. Now it complies to the bylaw limits, and we have reduced the height.

447
01:06:50,000 --> 01:07:10,000
to 27 feet by reducing the configuration, changing the configuration of the skylight. We have also removed the pool on the ground floor, and we have removed extensive amount of vegetable farming. That's in response to the neighbors comments. And now we have only greenhouse.

448
01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:26,000
And, uh, chicken croup on site. And we also had. We're planning to implement some rolling shades on skylights to and other areas to limit the light mitigation on site. Please.

449
01:07:26,000 --> 01:07:42,000
Can we go to the next slide. And so this slide shows the forest floor plan changes before and after. As you can see, we have removed the carport on the first floor. We have reduced the mud room and the storage room.

450
01:07:42,000 --> 01:07:49,000
Size pretty significantly to accommodate the MFA area. The next slide shows the.

451
01:07:49,000 --> 01:07:51,000
Next slide, please.

452
01:07:51,000 --> 01:08:03,000
shows the second floor before and after, so you can see that the pool has been removed from the backyard, and we also have reduced the backyard patio area near the adu.

453
01:08:03,000 --> 01:08:16,000
And the this slide shows the tree removal. We originally had 12 trees in red that is supposed to be removed because we we had.

454
01:08:16,000 --> 01:08:27,000
We had illuminated the pool construction on site. Now we have. We are able to preserve 3 more trees, 3 more heritage trees on set.

455
01:08:27,000 --> 01:08:43,000
And the next slide shows the height change. And this you can see the scale of the house is shorter. Right now we reduce the pitch angle on the gable at the front front covered porch, and we have.

456
01:08:43,000 --> 01:08:46,000
I also made the skylight shorter.

457
01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:58,000
And next slides, it's remaining variance request that we are asking the commissioners to support us on, which is a great exception, driveway based on the slope easement. We have our civil engineer.

458
01:08:58,000 --> 01:09:10,000
Carlino to speak up to explain the variances for us.

459
01:09:10,000 --> 01:09:14,000
Good evening, Pete Carlino, Liam Brace. Great to be up here again.

460
01:09:14,000 --> 01:09:30,000
the when we were 1st starting this project and siting building, it was, how can we gain a driveway access off the road in a safe manner with safe line of sight while trying to preserve the grading policies of the town, and it became apparent there was only one.

461
01:09:30,000 --> 01:09:48,000
area to come into the property that would meet fire turning radius of 28 feet to come up the driveway without having tunnels to like lower level garages or excessive grading on the downhill side or the uphill side. And so the grading exception is in relation to turning off of La Baranca in a safe manner.

462
01:09:48,000 --> 01:10:04,000
As it turns out, and steering the walls for to break up the vertical face of the cut. And so that's why you're seeing the the concentrated amount of grading is right where you come off La Barranca into the property as you turn up the site. So I'm.

463
01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:21,000
Also here, the widening opening is the fire department's requiring us to be able to swing either direction to come onto the property. We're close enough. We don't need to turn around, but they require that we show compliance of the truck turning in and going up the driveway to not park down on La Barranca as part of the design.

464
01:10:21,000 --> 01:10:22,000
Is

465
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:23,000
he…

466
01:10:23,000 --> 01:10:29,000
Is a truck turnaround required at the end of the driveway? It is not. It is. You can pull in and back out.

467
01:10:29,000 --> 01:10:40,000
But that's why we have to show we're working with the fire department on their standards as part of it. And that's was part of the review of the project.

468
01:10:40,000 --> 01:10:56,000
Thank you. The overwidened area is because of the 28 foot inside turning rate of Branca as part of it. That's why we're requesting more than the town standard is 20 feet of that opening. And as you spin up, it is wider as you go up the driveway.

469
01:10:56,000 --> 01:11:14,000
I there was an email from the neighbors. I had responded to that as well with some initial comments about the drainage. The septic system, and I think it's included in the staff report. It was sent back. So I'm here tonight to answer any further questions when the time is appropriate, but I don't want to take up any more time.

470
01:11:14,000 --> 01:11:17,000
than is necessary, unless there's questions from…

471
01:11:17,000 --> 01:11:19,000
Uh, council.

472
01:11:19,000 --> 01:11:25,000
Why don't we get through your presentation and see if there are any clarifying

473
01:11:25,000 --> 01:11:29,000
questions? Yes, next we have the homeowner online on zone 2.

474
01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:32,000
Speak about the Venus Mach findings.

475
01:11:32,000 --> 01:11:34,000
Naveen, it's online,

476
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:35,000
I see.

477
01:11:35,000 --> 01:11:38,000
Yeah, I'm here. Can you guys hear me?

478
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:40,000
Yes.

479
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:45,000
Okay, alright, sounds great. Let me try to turn on my video.

480
01:11:45,000 --> 01:11:46,000
Sorry, I just

481
01:11:46,000 --> 01:11:55,000
It is a little quiet if there's anything you could do to make it a little bit louder, or maybe we can do that on our end.

482
01:11:55,000 --> 01:11:56,000
Much better, much better.

483
01:11:56,000 --> 01:11:57,000
I can speak a little bit louder. Can you guys hear me a little better?

484
01:11:57,000 --> 01:11:59,000
Yes.

485
01:11:59,000 --> 01:12:00,000
Yes.

486
01:12:00,000 --> 01:12:15,000
Okay, okay, awesome. Yeah, you know, sorry we have to, as a family, we needed to travel for, you know, for an immediate health reasons, but happy to be here again and

487
01:12:15,000 --> 01:12:19,000
Also, you know, before I go into Williamson Act in just a minute

488
01:12:19,000 --> 01:12:32,000
I wanted to, you know, mention that, you know, after the June 8th meeting, you know, we and our team has worked really hard to take in all the feedback and advice and inputs and concerns

489
01:12:32,000 --> 01:12:49,000
And make all the changes necessary, right? So hope, you know, hope we are addressing, you know, most of them, if not all, and we can discuss further today. And regarding the Williamson Act, like I think we had some good discussion at the beginning

490
01:12:49,000 --> 01:13:05,000
And I think from last time, what was a big crux or a big concern at the point in June 8th meeting was we didn't have a contract, right? So because of that, it was subject to

491
01:13:05,000 --> 01:13:20,000
you know, large interpretation. So we did some homework and were able to find the contract written for the signed contract written for it. And based on that, and we are kind of making the the next steps here right

492
01:13:20,000 --> 01:13:34,000
And again, we want it to be consistent. We do not want to be different in whatever the council or the commission decides, we would like that to be consistent going forward.

493
01:13:34,000 --> 01:13:45,000
Just, you know, after saying that, so I just want to mention that we are following those, you know, there are multiple things that we could be doing in this land

494
01:13:45,000 --> 01:13:52,000
And we have, as submitted in the plans, those are the four highlighted areas is what we are

495
01:13:52,000 --> 01:13:56,000
using this landfill.

496
01:13:56,000 --> 01:13:59,000
We can go to the next slide, please

497
01:13:59,000 --> 01:14:03,000
Mm-hmm.

498
01:14:03,000 --> 01:14:11,000
Yeah, and I think like the staff said this using those four were making it compatible.

499
01:14:11,000 --> 01:14:17,000
And otherwise, I think these are the general points as a part of the Williamson Act research that we did

500
01:14:17,000 --> 01:14:28,000
Another key points I want to mention besides the compatibility high level is we we heard the concerns from the neighbors

501
01:14:28,000 --> 01:14:37,000
So there is the disturbance of business. I think that's something that we completely understand and cognitive of

502
01:14:37,000 --> 01:14:41,000
Based on that, we reduced the scope of the agriculture

503
01:14:41,000 --> 01:14:45,000
to limit it to just the green

504
01:14:45,000 --> 01:14:51,000
house, which is, like, you know, around 400 square yards. Sorry, square feet.

505
01:14:51,000 --> 01:15:04,000
And it's a combination of the potted plants and, you know, very small number of chickens, right? No more than probably the neighbors already have, right? So that kind of a situation that we are planning to

506
01:15:04,000 --> 01:15:10,000
So yeah, as it's saying, it's a very small scale cultivation.

507
01:15:10,000 --> 01:15:27,000
And another major thing is we like to keep the open space easement so that there is a free movement of, you know, of the animals, you know, and whatever is required for the open species meant from the front of the property to the back of the property

508
01:15:27,000 --> 01:15:32,000
So that is something that we have enabled

509
01:15:32,000 --> 01:15:37,000
Yeah, I think that's the main thing I wanted to mention.

510
01:15:37,000 --> 01:15:39,000
They have 2 voices.

511
01:15:39,000 --> 01:15:56,000
Thanks, Naveen. We also have, as I said, we've got the geotech and soils engineers here as well. And I know there were a lot of questions in the in the correspondence from the neighbors about soil stability and compatibility of the ground for development.

512
01:15:56,000 --> 01:16:02,000
And they're here to speak to that and also answer any questions as they may come up.

513
01:16:02,000 --> 01:16:05,000
Sure. So we since we'd have…

514
01:16:05,000 --> 01:16:07,000
A few minutes left. Of course.

515
01:16:07,000 --> 01:16:23,000
So okay. Yeah.

516
01:16:23,000 --> 01:16:26,000
My name is Craig Harwood, and I

517
01:16:26,000 --> 01:16:30,000
work for Quantum Geotechnical Engineering for the project.

518
01:16:30,000 --> 01:16:37,000
Um, there were 3 or 4 questions that were posed to us that I can cover. One of them was the question of faulting.

519
01:16:37,000 --> 01:16:42,000
We did do an exploration at the site. We identified the Monte Vista fault zone.

520
01:16:42,000 --> 01:16:53,000
And in fact, it was field reviewed by the town's peer reviewing consultant from Cotton Shire's office. They agreed with our findings in the field.

521
01:16:53,000 --> 01:17:02,000
We suggested a building setback of 25 feet from the fault zone for a habitable structure, which is the home, and they concurred with that.

522
01:17:02,000 --> 01:17:11,000
That report, the fault report was subsequently submitted to the city, and it was reviewed by the the peer reviewer, and they approved it.

523
01:17:11,000 --> 01:17:14,000
Um, there is another question about…

524
01:17:14,000 --> 01:17:25,000
uh, landsliding. Based on our explorations at the site, we didn't see any evidence for lands past landsliding, and didn't see any issues for future landsliding, uh.

525
01:17:25,000 --> 01:17:35,000
With regard to the way it's going to be developed, all the drainage and the grading will be done conventionally and will be inspected during the grading operations.

526
01:17:35,000 --> 01:17:39,000
Um, there was another question about, um…

527
01:17:39,000 --> 01:18:00,000
The groundwater table, that area up there has a deep groundwater table. It wasn't an issue for any of the geotechnical or geologic concerns at the site. We don't see that anything that developing the site will have any impact on a groundwater table, because it's so deep in that particular area.

528
01:18:00,000 --> 01:18:04,000
There was a question about, um…

529
01:18:04,000 --> 01:18:22,000
Slope stability analysis. We didn't consider it was necessary to do slope stability analysis for the natural slopes at the property. Of course, the the grading and construction will be done under standard grading operations and will be inspected by us.

530
01:18:22,000 --> 01:18:39,000
We will be doing a slope analysis along the road cut for La Barranca, because the septic system, right now, it's set back 40 feet from the top of that road cut, and they… for various design reasons, they need to encroach slightly closer, or they would like to.

531
01:18:39,000 --> 01:18:49,000
As an option, and so we're doing the slope stability analysis to see if that's feasible, and what a appropriate setback would be for the leach field.

532
01:18:49,000 --> 01:19:00,000
I think that the other questions are for our geotechnical engineer, Simon McDessie.

533
01:19:00,000 --> 01:19:02,000
Good evening. My name is Simon

534
01:19:02,000 --> 01:19:06,000
McNessie. I'm with Quantum Geotechnical, and I'll be addressing.

535
01:19:06,000 --> 01:19:12,000
some of the foundation and grading recommendations, as Craig has alluded to.

536
01:19:12,000 --> 01:19:13,000
Our project has

537
01:19:13,000 --> 01:19:14,000
been the

538
01:19:14,000 --> 01:19:22,000
subject of review with the town's third-party geotechnical consultant, and they have approved all the various design aspects of the project.

539
01:19:22,000 --> 01:19:32,000
Our grading is standard grading activities, slopes of 2 to 1 are acceptable on this site.

540
01:19:32,000 --> 01:19:48,000
It is a challenging site from a foundation point of view, and we do have mixed foundation of a maths lab and pure and grade beam. All of it will be sitting on rock. We do have shallow bedrock on the site, so that creates an overall positive stability to the site.

541
01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:50,000
The presence of rock.

542
01:19:50,000 --> 01:20:02,000
And with regards to erosion, any issues with erosion can be taken care of standard grading and planting operations.

543
01:20:02,000 --> 01:20:08,000
Well, that's exactly what I'm finished. I see. Thank you. Good, thank you.

544
01:20:08,000 --> 01:20:16,000
I have 1 clarifying question, and it might be for Pete. It's a water question.

545
01:20:16,000 --> 01:20:32,000
When we put concrete on this area, water that rain that used to hit the ground and it's take an hour to soak in now is going to be in a 4 inch ABS pipe in about.

546
01:20:32,000 --> 01:20:45,000
10 seconds, and down into that creek, and the acceleration is going to be high. What have you done to try to mitigate the increase in acceleration into the creek? Can you hear me?

547
01:20:45,000 --> 01:20:47,000
Okay, there you go.

548
01:20:47,000 --> 01:21:05,000
First, thank you for the question. I would respond with that the project, as most projects in the town, when we have net increase of development, we're required to put an on site detention system which we have on this project. We have on site metering device. Any drainage associated with the buildings, the patios.

549
01:21:05,000 --> 01:21:21,000
Everything is collected into that and drained into a system that is directed towards La Barranca side of the property. Okay. And as the primary release. The there is drainage from uphill west, the property as it comes down. That drainage is picked up in swales.

550
01:21:21,000 --> 01:21:25,000
and directed around the house, and released towards the.

551
01:21:25,000 --> 01:21:41,000
southeast direction, and as if that drainage naturally would have gone that direction. But the house development, and is all detained in the detention system and redirected towards La Barranca, which will go towards the right-of-way down into the street and down to the curb inlets that are at the

552
01:21:41,000 --> 01:21:45,000
bottom. The decelerator is in the path to LeBron La Branca. Correct.

553
01:21:45,000 --> 01:21:47,000
Got it. So again, we

554
01:21:47,000 --> 01:21:56,000
worked with the town on many projects. It's the same design system that has been installed through other projects and reviewed and approved by town staff. Thank you. I have a question.

555
01:21:56,000 --> 01:21:58,000
Do you have any a

556
01:21:58,000 --> 01:22:06,000
question for Pete here actually is about just curious, what is the grade on the driveway on this? It is 20% coming up.

557
01:22:06,000 --> 01:22:07,000
Okay.

558
01:22:07,000 --> 01:22:09,000
And that's been approved by the fire department. Right. And

559
01:22:09,000 --> 01:22:18,000
then so the fire department, because I… have you ever had any of the projects where they've asked for a 28 foot wide mouth to the, uh…

560
01:22:18,000 --> 01:22:21,000
driveways here in speaking generalities for a minute here. This

561
01:22:21,000 --> 01:22:34,000
is something that is newer, where fire would just usually park in the street. They have now made sort of part of our review process that we would like to turn into the properties and get off the street. This has happened in the last 8 months to a year.

562
01:22:34,000 --> 01:22:49,000
With projects where historically they had not been asking for it, but that has now been part of the plan check revive process. I'm not sure the change in approach, but I don't think this is going to be the last time we probably talk about over widened driveways turning into driveway projects.

563
01:22:49,000 --> 01:22:53,000
is the… from the road to the house, is it less than 150 feet? Yes, so

564
01:22:53,000 --> 01:22:54,000
there's no turnaround at the top.

565
01:22:54,000 --> 01:23:04,000
That's interesting, okay. And then also, just curious if they can bring up the other picture of the slopes, where is the 30% slope that occurs, I guess, on the… On the house at the back? Yes.

566
01:23:04,000 --> 01:23:10,000
I think it's, and I apologize, because someone, there's an exhibit, maybe.

567
01:23:10,000 --> 01:23:11,000
Five

568
01:23:11,000 --> 01:23:12,000
exhibits, right?

569
01:23:12,000 --> 01:23:21,000
It would be that upper purple area at the top of building at the top of the page. The triangle up in that general direction. Okay.

570
01:23:21,000 --> 01:23:24,000
Is that is that the patio or what is it?

571
01:23:24,000 --> 01:23:27,000
It's a covered patio.

572
01:23:27,000 --> 01:23:33,000
Does the cover patio, and then the little one down below. Is that the Sb. 9? The one to the left

573
01:23:33,000 --> 01:23:35,000
or the right, the right

574
01:23:35,000 --> 01:23:38,000
to the right the tiny triangle is that that's the

575
01:23:38,000 --> 01:23:42,000
Dg passway. There's a walkway around the building. Oh, that's a DG pathway. Okay. But the one.

576
01:23:42,000 --> 01:23:44,000
To the

577
01:23:44,000 --> 01:23:45,000
right is

578
01:23:45,000 --> 01:23:47,000
is the is the.

579
01:23:47,000 --> 01:23:48,000
The

580
01:23:48,000 --> 01:23:50,000
direct is the ADU speaking. That was

581
01:23:50,000 --> 01:23:57,000
at adu, and then the other one, the bigger triangle is the enclosed patio covered patio. Yes, a covered patio.

582
01:23:57,000 --> 01:24:03,000
Okay, thank you. And then…

583
01:24:03,000 --> 01:24:07,000
That's all my questions for right now. Thank you. Okay. Anything, Commissioner?

584
01:24:07,000 --> 01:24:08,000
No. All right.

585
01:24:08,000 --> 01:24:19,000
Next we'll ask for members of the public who wish to provide their comments regarding this item. Each member of the public will be limited to being recognized only once.

586
01:24:19,000 --> 01:24:33,000
Please restrict your comments to three minutes each. If you're interested in providing comments, please come to the podium or raise your hand in Zoom and someone will assist you. Why don't we…

587
01:24:33,000 --> 01:24:42,000
In fact, it would help maybe to get 2 or 3 people in a row ready who want to speak, and we'll just… We do have a list of cards we got

588
01:24:42,000 --> 01:24:43,000
in sequence.

589
01:24:43,000 --> 01:24:44,000
Oh, I see, you want

590
01:24:44,000 --> 01:24:46,000
to just go off of

591
01:24:46,000 --> 01:24:50,000
that. Why don't you call out two or three names at a time?

592
01:24:50,000 --> 01:24:55,000
So people can get ready and we'll just move as quickly as we can. Sounds good.

593
01:24:55,000 --> 01:24:56,000
And

594
01:24:56,000 --> 01:25:07,000
can I also suggest one thing just for better efficiency? This is for all residents. It may be valuable if you're.

595
01:25:07,000 --> 01:25:11,000
you know, stating what has already been stated.

596
01:25:11,000 --> 01:25:22,000
Do it in a shortened fashion, rather than repeating the same item again and again, because we will be taking notes.

597
01:25:22,000 --> 01:25:26,000
Okay, so the first three are gonna be

598
01:25:26,000 --> 01:25:30,000
Connie Yu, Julie Wicker, and Frank Cahill.

599
01:25:30,000 --> 01:25:31,000
That's

600
01:25:31,000 --> 01:25:40,000
a question. The owners, I understand, are in media.

601
01:25:40,000 --> 01:25:49,000
We can hear you. Yes, thank you. The owners are in India and I discussed with some of the residents I was going to go much later.

602
01:25:49,000 --> 01:25:55,000
But I would like them to hear the comments that I was going to make.

603
01:25:55,000 --> 01:25:58,000
So, I don't know if they're going to be… how

604
01:25:58,000 --> 01:26:07,000
long they're going… I would be fine putting you to the front of the list, if that's what you're asking. Let me just ask my fellow. Yeah, I'm fine with that.

605
01:26:07,000 --> 01:26:08,000
Would you

606
01:26:08,000 --> 01:26:09,000
care to go first?

607
01:26:09,000 --> 01:26:21,000
Well, I don't if the owners are going to be here for on the call for an hour or so, then I'm happy to go later, but I would like them to hear the

608
01:26:21,000 --> 01:26:28,000
comments. You know, John, you're standing right there. I think we ought to just go ahead and get it done.

609
01:26:28,000 --> 01:26:31,000
Okay.

610
01:26:31,000 --> 01:26:34,000
Okay.

611
01:26:34,000 --> 01:26:39,000
And John, try to get this close for the owner's benefits as well. Okay.

612
01:26:39,000 --> 01:26:48,000
We've had a discussion about what the real priority decision that we need to make on this project is.

613
01:26:48,000 --> 01:26:55,000
And I am going to speak with total certainty on what I believe the priority is.

614
01:26:55,000 --> 01:26:58,000
It's what, what is the path forward?

615
01:26:58,000 --> 01:27:01,000
That this project should take.

616
01:27:01,000 --> 01:27:11,000
And there are options, and most of those options, the decision on those options rests with the owner and the applicant.

617
01:27:11,000 --> 01:27:19,000
In my viewpoint, and I'm not advocating either way, but in my viewpoint.

618
01:27:19,000 --> 01:27:21,000
There are two ways.

619
01:27:21,000 --> 01:27:24,000
to approach this project.

620
01:27:24,000 --> 01:27:28,000
The 1st, I would characterize as being safe.

621
01:27:28,000 --> 01:27:31,000
Predictable outcome.

622
01:27:31,000 --> 01:27:35,000
with absolutely known parameters.

623
01:27:35,000 --> 01:27:47,000
The second is high risk with uncertainty as to when and how hard both the town and the owners may get impacted.

624
01:27:47,000 --> 01:27:50,000
So part one…

625
01:27:50,000 --> 01:27:54,000
is actually the path that the vast majority.

626
01:27:54,000 --> 01:28:00,000
Since the Supreme Court decision in 1981.

627
01:28:00,000 --> 01:28:05,000
take for Williamson Act contract terminations. In fact.

628
01:28:05,000 --> 01:28:15,000
One of the properties that was approved on in January 1971, along with this project, filed in.

629
01:28:15,000 --> 01:28:23,000
This January for what is called a notice of non-renewal.

630
01:28:23,000 --> 01:28:27,000
Once a notice of non-renewal is filed.

631
01:28:27,000 --> 01:28:34,000
The project is going to come to an end in 9 years time.

632
01:28:34,000 --> 01:28:38,000
But the applicants, once it is filed.

633
01:28:38,000 --> 01:28:46,000
can immediately file a request for what is called a contract cancellation.

634
01:28:46,000 --> 01:28:53,000
Assuming the contract cancellation has good public support.

635
01:28:53,000 --> 01:28:58,000
It could be approved before the end of this year.

636
01:28:58,000 --> 01:29:16,000
If the owners don't file a notice of non-renewal prior to October. This contract will extend for another year in its 10-year rolling period, and it will not be out of Williamson Act until January 2037.

637
01:29:16,000 --> 01:29:21,000
The cost of filing a non-renewal is 0.

638
01:29:21,000 --> 01:29:25,000
The cost of STEP.

639
01:29:25,000 --> 01:29:26,000
Two

640
01:29:26,000 --> 01:29:28,000
of option one.

641
01:29:28,000 --> 01:29:35,000
If the request for contract cancellation is approved, you know, I'm going to

642
01:29:35,000 --> 01:29:41,000
ask for clarifying questions, John, so you can continue. Okay, if if

643
01:29:41,000 --> 01:29:44,000
it is approved.

644
01:29:44,000 --> 01:29:49,000
The applicants will owe the Santa Clara County Assessor.

645
01:29:49,000 --> 01:30:00,000
12.5% of what the assessor determines is the value of the property in current market conditions minus the encumbrance.

646
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:06,000
But it's an absolutely known parameter.

647
01:30:06,000 --> 01:30:07,000
Path

648
01:30:07,000 --> 01:30:08,000
2.

649
01:30:08,000 --> 01:30:12,000
is the route that we are on tonight.

650
01:30:12,000 --> 01:30:22,000
A compatible use determination for a project which is at the limit of both Los Altos Hills.

651
01:30:22,000 --> 01:30:28,000
Codes. State SB 9 and ADU codes.

652
01:30:28,000 --> 01:30:34,000
And even if it is found that the, um…

653
01:30:34,000 --> 01:30:39,000
The contract, the.

654
01:30:39,000 --> 01:30:51,000
Compatibility? Compatibility, that's the word. The compatibility determination is found to be correct, or found to be supportive of that.

655
01:30:51,000 --> 01:30:57,000
The decision will almost certainly be challenged.

656
01:30:57,000 --> 01:31:09,000
The problem with the challenge is you will not know the outcome with the people that have to determine it probably until the project is complete.

657
01:31:09,000 --> 01:31:12,000
However, at that point.

658
01:31:12,000 --> 01:31:17,000
If the compatible use determination.

659
01:31:17,000 --> 01:31:22,000
is much less than the amount of the property that is built.

660
01:31:22,000 --> 01:31:31,000
The excess amount of property. So if there's 7,000 square feet, and the compatible use is 2.

661
01:31:31,000 --> 01:31:33,000
5,000 square feet.

662
01:31:33,000 --> 01:31:36,000
will be charged…

663
01:31:36,000 --> 01:31:41,000
First of all, a 25% penalty.

664
01:31:41,000 --> 01:31:45,000
on the same value, the assessor will work out for the land.

665
01:31:45,000 --> 01:31:47,000
and a 25…

666
01:31:47,000 --> 01:31:56,000
percent penalty on the on the value of the construction cost of the 5,000 square feet in excess.

667
01:31:56,000 --> 01:32:12,000
I've done that math very, very back of the envelope. And what I would say is the cost of option 2 is 4.5 to 5 times the cost of option one. Now, it may turn out.

668
01:32:12,000 --> 01:32:14,000
Nothing happens.

669
01:32:14,000 --> 01:32:19,000
in which case you might make a little bit of money.

670
01:32:19,000 --> 01:32:24,000
I I do not understand.

671
01:32:24,000 --> 01:32:26,000
The reason why…

672
01:32:26,000 --> 01:32:31,000
We are going down this compatible use path.

673
01:32:31,000 --> 01:32:36,000
The risk for the town is also considerable.

674
01:32:36,000 --> 01:32:45,000
A compatible use determination which is deemed by the courts to have been in this much in excess.

675
01:32:45,000 --> 01:32:48,000
is what the Supreme Court described.

676
01:32:48,000 --> 01:32:58,000
As the compatible — approving a compatible use that defeats the purpose of the Act.

677
01:32:58,000 --> 01:33:02,000
And that is direct words from the Supreme Court.

678
01:33:02,000 --> 01:33:06,000
What could happen to the town?

679
01:33:06,000 --> 01:33:08,000
is unknown.

680
01:33:08,000 --> 01:33:12,000
I don't want to go any further. I think… Yes,

681
01:33:12,000 --> 01:33:16,000
John, let's wrap it up. I really do appreciate all the information.

682
01:33:16,000 --> 01:33:20,000
So I would… I would strongly recommend.

683
01:33:20,000 --> 01:33:24,000
that if this information is new.

684
01:33:24,000 --> 01:33:36,000
Somebody should start to think as to whether or not they want to take the safe, known path, or if they want to stay on the high-risk path. Thank you very much. Thank you, John. Thank you.

685
01:33:36,000 --> 01:33:39,000
Next.

686
01:33:39,000 --> 01:33:43,000
Hello, I'm my name is Connie Young Yu.

687
01:33:43,000 --> 01:33:55,000
My husband and I have lived on on La Baraka at 12981, two doors down from the proposed building, and we've lived there

688
01:33:55,000 --> 01:33:56,000
since 19.

689
01:33:56,000 --> 01:34:03,000
70. So we've seen a lot, and we've raised chickens also. I was going to.

690
01:34:03,000 --> 01:34:14,000
discuss or talk about our concerns like all of my neighbors, my dear neighbors on La Baranca about building.

691
01:34:14,000 --> 01:34:19,000
This ambitious project with several, you know.

692
01:34:19,000 --> 01:34:27,000
buildings on such a steep slope with soil erosion and the problem of soil erosion and water runoff.

693
01:34:27,000 --> 01:34:43,000
And the specific issue that I was going to bring up was the number of chickens which you hear that has been reduced to a number of chickens that the neighbors would be are owning and that.

694
01:34:43,000 --> 01:34:51,000
It's not 50 to 100 chickens, as was stated in an earlier plan.

695
01:34:51,000 --> 01:35:01,000
I still would like to say that when we built the barn in 2001 and we have a large corral on the flat land.

696
01:35:01,000 --> 01:35:15,000
There was a stipulation for we were granted the variance, but the stipulation from the city council at the time was that our chicken could be moved a certain distance far from.

697
01:35:15,000 --> 01:35:31,000
the border where there's a creek running through. So that was a major concern, and we were told that it would be a hazard. It's cause pollution. You know the all that chicken manure, and of course we have a compost, and.

698
01:35:31,000 --> 01:35:46,000
That was taken care of, but it was a concern. So I think that we still can be talking about what is planned for the there will be a chicken coop on the property, and this is a very, very steep slope, and the runoff.

699
01:35:46,000 --> 01:35:52,000
Whatever will of the sludge will be affecting the properties that the

700
01:35:52,000 --> 01:35:53,000
neighborhood

701
01:35:53,000 --> 01:35:59,000
properties. So thank you. Thank you.

702
01:35:59,000 --> 01:36:08,000
Hello, I'm Julie Wilker, and I live on Coumbra Vista. So not the same, but one street over.

703
01:36:08,000 --> 01:36:18,000
Looking at this, I had a couple of, as as was noted in some of the notes I sent in a letter ahead of time.

704
01:36:18,000 --> 01:36:19,000
driveway safety. I'm really

705
01:36:19,000 --> 01:36:20,000
worried about every time

706
01:36:20,000 --> 01:36:23,000
I go up and down La Barranca,

707
01:36:23,000 --> 01:36:26,000
which is every single day, usually more than once.

708
01:36:26,000 --> 01:36:27,000
I look at

709
01:36:27,000 --> 01:36:32,000
those posts and I'm almost on top of them with my car before I see them, both directions.

710
01:36:32,000 --> 01:36:34,000
I am worried.

711
01:36:34,000 --> 01:36:35,000
I'm

712
01:36:35,000 --> 01:36:40,000
just going to leave it at that. I'm really worried. I am also worried about the hillside safety.

713
01:36:40,000 --> 01:36:41,000
Uh,

714
01:36:41,000 --> 01:36:42,000
it's a lot of excavation.

715
01:36:42,000 --> 01:36:50,000
Now I just heard that the water, don't worry, it's not going down the creek. It's going down La Barranca. What the?

716
01:36:50,000 --> 01:36:51,000
My

717
01:36:51,000 --> 01:36:53,000
gosh, we already have enough runoff

718
01:36:53,000 --> 01:36:54,000
on La

719
01:36:54,000 --> 01:36:55,000
Branca. Are

720
01:36:55,000 --> 01:36:56,000
you now? Is the

721
01:36:56,000 --> 01:36:57,000
street now not going to

722
01:36:57,000 --> 01:37:01,000
be usable when it's raining? I hope not. I hope that's studied.

723
01:37:01,000 --> 01:37:04,000
I hope I am panicking.

724
01:37:04,000 --> 01:37:05,000
And

725
01:37:05,000 --> 01:37:07,000
it's not needed.

726
01:37:07,000 --> 01:37:16,000
But we all know what runoff looks like and how we have not been able to get… use some of our streets because of runoff.

727
01:37:16,000 --> 01:37:20,000
Um, that's as far as the project.

728
01:37:20,000 --> 01:37:21,000
During

729
01:37:21,000 --> 01:37:25,000
the last almost year, I've had construction down the street from my house.

730
01:37:25,000 --> 01:37:29,000
I have had many days that I could not get out of my driveway.

731
01:37:29,000 --> 01:37:33,000
Because of people parked on the streets.

732
01:37:33,000 --> 01:37:40,000
I've had to go and ask for people to move. I bring this up only because this project is going to take quite a while.

733
01:37:40,000 --> 01:37:41,000
And there's

734
01:37:41,000 --> 01:37:42,000
really

735
01:37:42,000 --> 01:37:46,000
no parking there for the construction vehicles. So.

736
01:37:46,000 --> 01:37:54,000
Possibly not part of the approval or not approval of the project, but certainly approval of the… all of the permits.

737
01:37:54,000 --> 01:38:10,000
The safety of the construction that is not having vehicles on the street, on the pathway, not blocking La Barranca, not blocking a single lane, or if there is a lane, there's going to have to be flagged people on each end of it.

738
01:38:10,000 --> 01:38:12,000
I'm worried. I'm worried about safety.

739
01:38:12,000 --> 01:38:15,000
I'm fine with the house. Whatever.

740
01:38:15,000 --> 01:38:20,000
I'm not real keen about more chickens if it was 100 chickens.

741
01:38:20,000 --> 01:38:24,000
If you… if you tell me it's 5 chickens, if you tell me it's 6 chickens.

742
01:38:24,000 --> 01:38:28,000
Yeah, I'm alright with that, whatever. I know you'll keep it clean.

743
01:38:28,000 --> 01:38:38,000
You don't want… you don't want dirty chickens, you know, around where you're living. I'm sure you'll want to keep it clean, but 100 would have really freaked me out.

744
01:38:38,000 --> 01:38:50,000
Okay. Construction debris there again during the construction, we've got, if we've got water running down, it's going to pick up construction debris running down the street.

745
01:38:50,000 --> 01:38:53,000
The road's gonna have to be watched and washed.

746
01:38:53,000 --> 01:38:55,000
and cleaned. That's

747
01:38:55,000 --> 01:38:57,000
it for me.

748
01:38:57,000 --> 01:38:59,000
Thank

749
01:38:59,000 --> 01:39:03,000
you.

750
01:39:03,000 --> 01:39:06,000
Hi, Frank Cahill.

751
01:39:06,000 --> 01:39:07,000
Los Altos Hills

752
01:39:07,000 --> 01:39:11,000
on the corner of La Baranca and Elena.

753
01:39:11,000 --> 01:39:13,000
On Comra Vista.

754
01:39:13,000 --> 01:39:17,000
I'm also going to focus on La Barranca.

755
01:39:17,000 --> 01:39:18,000
We be so bold

756
01:39:18,000 --> 01:39:22,000
as to ask the Commission to raise their hand. Have you

757
01:39:22,000 --> 01:39:25,000
been to the La Barranca property? Many, many

758
01:39:25,000 --> 01:39:28,000
times. Excellent. Members standing down on La Barranca.

759
01:39:28,000 --> 01:39:44,000
And looking up, if this had been in Tahoe, this would be an expert ski slope or missing on the moguls. I mean, it's very steep. Now, I did hear that the fire department approved the 20% slope.

760
01:39:44,000 --> 01:39:46,000
That's their maximum.

761
01:39:46,000 --> 01:39:56,000
slope that they would approve. Now, I don't know if the firemen had been over there, but I cannot imagine a fire truck going up the side of that hill.

762
01:39:56,000 --> 01:40:01,000
And then backing out? I can't see that. I really can't.

763
01:40:01,000 --> 01:40:11,000
And the other thing that's going to happen is at least during construction, there is going to be dirt all over La Barranca.

764
01:40:11,000 --> 01:40:23,000
And when you drive your cars up, I've got an old car, I don't really care, but you have a lot of fancy cars in the neighborhood, and when you go over and it's going to be all of that dirt is going to be kicked up on your car and putting dings in your paint job.

765
01:40:23,000 --> 01:40:35,000
Uh, you're going to have to ask that the contractor have a full-time person down there sweeping the dirt and getting it out of the way during the day. You can't just do it at the end of the day.

766
01:40:35,000 --> 01:40:39,000
It's got to be done during the construction as it's going on.

767
01:40:39,000 --> 01:40:42,000
And, uh…

768
01:40:42,000 --> 01:40:46,000
The other last thing, as I was listening, John talk.

769
01:40:46,000 --> 01:40:52,000
I realize that there is a contract for this property, and there are a few other properties in town.

770
01:40:52,000 --> 01:40:54,000
Also under the Williams Act.

771
01:40:54,000 --> 01:41:01,000
Williamson that in real estate, if you don't have it on paper, it doesn't exist.

772
01:41:01,000 --> 01:41:23,000
The town needs to put their take on the Williamson Act on paper, so that we do have something that everybody can compare to the same requirements. Thank you. Thank you.

773
01:41:23,000 --> 01:41:29,000
Yeah, there's an order. She'll read the next 3. The next

774
01:41:29,000 --> 01:41:34,000
3, Michael Grady, Ginger Jenkins, Jill Cinder. That's neither.

775
01:41:34,000 --> 01:41:36,000
My name is

776
01:41:36,000 --> 01:41:44,000
Ginger Jenkins. I'm here with my husband, Ted and my son.

777
01:41:44,000 --> 01:41:46,000
I'm changing all my paragraphs

778
01:41:46,000 --> 01:41:47,000
because as

779
01:41:47,000 --> 01:41:48,000
people have spoke,

780
01:41:48,000 --> 01:41:53,000
I'm going to speak about the chickens, because Connie has just… if

781
01:41:53,000 --> 01:42:02,000
there's 5 chickens, that's fine. We'd like to know how many chickens the plan has. I heard there were 100.

782
01:42:02,000 --> 01:42:05,000
I'd like to talk to you about…

783
01:42:05,000 --> 01:42:12,000
Histoplasmosis, a lung infection that's caused by breathing spores.

784
01:42:12,000 --> 01:42:18,000
of the fungus histoplasma capsule.

785
01:42:18,000 --> 01:42:26,000
which is caused with a damp soil with chickens or other bird droppings.

786
01:42:26,000 --> 01:42:37,000
You do not catch it directly from the chickens and their fresh poop, but rather from the dry dust in the soil of the coops.

787
01:42:37,000 --> 01:42:41,000
When it hits, when the ground is disturbed.

788
01:42:41,000 --> 01:42:45,000
This is a big one for me.

789
01:42:45,000 --> 01:42:50,000
My original plan was to talk about the heritage oaks.

790
01:42:50,000 --> 01:42:53,000
And how many are being cut down?

791
01:42:53,000 --> 01:43:02,000
And I understood that every time you took out a heritage Oaks, that you would have to plant 3 more trees. I don't know whether that is the case.

792
01:43:02,000 --> 01:43:07,000
But that situation could not hold on that property.

793
01:43:07,000 --> 01:43:08,000
And

794
01:43:08,000 --> 01:43:10,000
of course, as…

795
01:43:10,000 --> 01:43:14,000
Just mentioned on the driveway.

796
01:43:14,000 --> 01:43:20,000
And I have a question, but if you're going to.

797
01:43:20,000 --> 01:43:29,000
put in an exception for the 14 foot wide driveway. I'd like to know how much it is.

798
01:43:29,000 --> 01:43:35,000
But the plan of cutting the road cut with the 20%.

799
01:43:35,000 --> 01:43:48,000
slope, and cutting into this La Biranca curves right as you see the the stakes that they're planting to go up on.

800
01:43:48,000 --> 01:43:57,000
I think people should take a look at the curve of the road and whether that would require retaining walls.

801
01:43:57,000 --> 01:44:00,000
Um.

802
01:44:00,000 --> 01:44:11,000
The Williamson Act. If I decide, by the way, I think it's a bit of a boondoggle to say I'm going to have a hundred chickens there.

803
01:44:11,000 --> 01:44:24,000
What if right across the road where I live, I decide that I want to put 100 chickens and get the same tax break that the Williamson Act affords.

804
01:44:24,000 --> 01:44:34,000
How will you justify how many people are going to do that? I think the Williamson Act is a little bit of a boondoggle myself.

805
01:44:34,000 --> 01:44:37,000
This project requires.

806
01:44:37,000 --> 01:44:39,000
6,400.

807
01:44:39,000 --> 01:44:43,000
uh, square feet of buildings.

808
01:44:43,000 --> 01:44:52,000
That's a lot. I think that this project would be a lot better in a rural community.

809
01:44:52,000 --> 01:44:55,000
Where you didn't have to make those road cuts.

810
01:44:55,000 --> 01:45:01,000
Just finally, if you look around the room.

811
01:45:01,000 --> 01:45:10,000
We moved them 50 years ago, actually 51. My son just turned 50, and it was a year before he, uh.

812
01:45:10,000 --> 01:45:14,000
He was born that we moved there, but if you look around the room.

813
01:45:14,000 --> 01:45:16,000
There's at least.

814
01:45:16,000 --> 01:45:27,000
seven or eight residents that have been in our neighborhood. La Barranca and Cougar Vista Court over 50 years.

815
01:45:27,000 --> 01:45:34,000
And we want it to be done right. Thank you.

816
01:45:34,000 --> 01:45:39,000
Michael Grady, then Jill Snyder, then C. Snyder.

817
01:45:39,000 --> 01:45:42,000
Thank you, Michael Grady, Los Altos Hills. The

818
01:45:42,000 --> 01:45:46,000
Planning Commission and the Council shouldn't go

819
01:45:46,000 --> 01:45:47,000
along with what

820
01:45:47,000 --> 01:45:48,000
is

821
01:45:48,000 --> 01:45:56,000
essentially a tax dodge to avoid paying the appropriate amount of taxes on a proposed.

822
01:45:56,000 --> 01:46:11,000
It's very clear that this project isn't consistent with the principles of the Williamson Act, nor with the original intent of a contract. Contracts are interpreted based upon the original intent.

823
01:46:11,000 --> 01:46:26,000
At the time they're entered into. Clearly, agricultural and out open space use are not going to be the principal uses of this property if this project goes forward. You know, I have to pay my full property taxes.

824
01:46:26,000 --> 01:46:31,000
If they want to build a mansion, they should have to pay their full property taxes.

825
01:46:31,000 --> 01:46:36,000
Don't give them a bootagle. Can I just take a moment? This that's.

826
01:46:36,000 --> 01:46:42,000
Uh, I hear ya. And that is an area that I did a lot of examination on.

827
01:46:42,000 --> 01:47:00,000
The House site, the land of the house site is taxed the same way all of our taxes are taxed. The house itself is taxed the same way all of our houses are taxed. It is just the agricultural area.

828
01:47:00,000 --> 01:47:16,000
The non-house site that would get this a little advantage. You'd be surprised how little this is relative to the dimensions of the property tax bill. And I'm not an attorney. I'm not a Cpa. I am an engineer.

829
01:47:16,000 --> 01:47:24,000
I've looked into this as carefully as I can and dug in 3 layers into the unwrapping this onion.

830
01:47:24,000 --> 01:47:33,000
This… it is less an issue about the fairness of people paying their fair share of property tax than you think. Okay, so

831
01:47:33,000 --> 01:47:41,000
the assessor goes and reassesses the house and all the improvements as if the Williamson Act was not a factor. That is the

832
01:47:41,000 --> 01:47:43,000
information that I have, yes.

833
01:47:43,000 --> 01:47:44,000
Okay,

834
01:47:44,000 --> 01:47:48,000
that's good to know. Thanks, Steph can confirm.

835
01:47:48,000 --> 01:47:51,000
I'm sorry, Jay, what did you say?

836
01:47:51,000 --> 01:47:57,000
Stephan can confirm. Yeah.

837
01:47:57,000 --> 01:48:00,000
Good evening. I'm Jill Snyder, and I have lived

838
01:48:00,000 --> 01:48:05,000
in Los Altos Hills for over 50 years. I have seen it grow. I've seen it change.

839
01:48:05,000 --> 01:48:08,000
The principles of what we

840
01:48:08,000 --> 01:48:09,000
value,

841
01:48:09,000 --> 01:48:14,000
the trees, the countryside, the hilltops, all of that still holds.

842
01:48:14,000 --> 01:48:17,000
Although I see it disappearing.

843
01:48:17,000 --> 01:48:25,000
Whether people are complaining about, I would like to second and double that.

844
01:48:25,000 --> 01:48:37,000
concern. It's the trees that you're cutting down, and then the driveway. So I go up and down La Biranca many times during the day during the week.

845
01:48:37,000 --> 01:48:52,000
And if you hit it at just that certain time in the afternoon when the sun is setting, you are blinded and you can't see. And so you're going to put a driveway there. It's a blind raising curve.

846
01:48:52,000 --> 01:48:57,000
and you're just asking for problems. I don't see any place else to put the driveway.

847
01:48:57,000 --> 01:49:03,000
Maybe it shouldn't be in the house. All right. Thank you. Thank you.

848
01:49:03,000 --> 01:49:10,000
Hi, my name is Carrie and I've lived in Los Altos Hills for over 50 years, right by La Barranca. And I

849
01:49:10,000 --> 01:49:14,000
would like to second, first of all, the issue of the

850
01:49:14,000 --> 01:49:18,000
driveway. I can't believe that you're thinking of putting a 27 foot.

851
01:49:18,000 --> 01:49:38,000
span cut into the hillside on a blind curve when I I, too, go up and down that La Branca multiple times a day, and if you hit it at the just the exact right time at the wrong time, you are completely blinded. And I, too, have gone with my car and seen the posts that are in there, and you are on top of them.

852
01:49:38,000 --> 01:49:55,000
So it is a very, very unsafe place to put a driveway, not only for the residents, the new owners of the property, but for all of us. So you were putting all of us in danger. You know, I have as a pedestrian, I have been hit by a car. It's not something that I recommend.

853
01:49:55,000 --> 01:50:12,000
But I determined that, you know, as unfun as that was, I never want to be somebody who in my car actually hit somebody, and that is my concern with where this driveway is going. It is never meant to have a driveway there. The other thing I want to talk about briefly, although I thank you for the clarification, is the Williamson Act.

854
01:50:12,000 --> 01:50:18,000
Because clearly there's some financial benefit that's trying to be sought here. The word used earlier was boondoggle.

855
01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:35,000
Um, and I think that that's, you know, there's a more extreme word for it. I think we are being asked to subsidize this property, because clearly it is not about open space or agriculture. What's being done with a 7,500 square foot house.

856
01:50:35,000 --> 01:50:52,000
I understand that there was a pool that was wanted and other things, and the chopping down of 9 heritage trees has nothing to do with the maintenance of open space, and I guarantee you I was unaware of the Williamson Act until this came into the limelight. There's a lot of residents in Los Altos Hills.

857
01:50:52,000 --> 01:51:09,000
who also don't know that the Williamson Act could benefit them, and getting chickens and putting in a greenhouse is something that's very easy to do with the land space that people have. So if this is a benefit for this individual, then I guarantee you there's a whole lot of other residents that are going to want that benefit as well.

858
01:51:09,000 --> 01:51:14,000
So thank you. Thank you.

859
01:51:14,000 --> 01:51:19,000
My name is Jeremy. I speak for the trees.

860
01:51:19,000 --> 01:51:23,000
I was born here, I'm 50 years old.

861
01:51:23,000 --> 01:51:24,000
These

862
01:51:24,000 --> 01:51:26,000
trees are the same age as me, and

863
01:51:26,000 --> 01:51:31,000
there's about 10 of them I hear that are, you know, just huge.

864
01:51:31,000 --> 01:51:34,000
The other thing I want to say is where they're trying

865
01:51:34,000 --> 01:51:39,000
to build the driveway. I see deer all the time trying to go up this road.

866
01:51:39,000 --> 01:51:43,000
There are owls, and uh…

867
01:51:43,000 --> 01:51:46,000
you know, red-tail hawks and coyotes.

868
01:51:46,000 --> 01:51:54,000
And these people are trying to build a house and take out like 10 of these trees. And it just kind of disgusts me.

869
01:51:54,000 --> 01:51:59,000
I'm sorry if I'm raising crap with Naveen here, but.

870
01:51:59,000 --> 01:52:12,000
You know, it just goes on and on. I don't think a lot of people are morning people, and if he's going to have 100 chickens roosting, it just the whole thing just seems ridiculous to me. Thanks.

871
01:52:12,000 --> 01:52:15,000
I do want to comment that hens.

872
01:52:15,000 --> 01:52:17,000
aren't roosters. Excuse me.

873
01:52:17,000 --> 01:52:22,000
Maybe what I was trying to say is that they're roosting. They're

874
01:52:22,000 --> 01:52:31,000
loud, you know? But this is my point. They're not nearly as loud as roosters, or gobblers, or turkeys.

875
01:52:31,000 --> 01:52:32,000
Yes. Well,

876
01:52:32,000 --> 01:52:39,000
I mean, if he has, like, 20 chickens, that's great, but, like, after a certain amount, I mean… I understand. I just

877
01:52:39,000 --> 01:52:48,000
wanted to make that one clarification. Hens lay eggs, roosters are louder than in the morning, and you don't want them next time. But hens also root. They

878
01:52:48,000 --> 01:52:51,000
make a lot of noise, and they…

879
01:52:51,000 --> 01:52:53,000
Lay those eggs.

880
01:52:53,000 --> 01:53:01,000
That doesn't bother me. The big point I'm trying to make is these trees that are 50 years old, you know, he's trying to take out these trees.

881
01:53:01,000 --> 01:53:08,000
And if it was my property, I would build the house around the trees, you know? And

882
01:53:08,000 --> 01:53:09,000
so I'm done. Thank

883
01:53:09,000 --> 01:53:12,000
you. Appreciate it. Next is Marjorie.

884
01:53:12,000 --> 01:53:13,000
Hmm.

885
01:53:13,000 --> 01:53:14,000
Mary.

886
01:53:14,000 --> 01:53:15,000
Marjorie Howey

887
01:53:15,000 --> 01:53:21,000
and then Cheryl Evans.

888
01:53:21,000 --> 01:53:26,000
Sorry if I mispronounce it.

889
01:53:26,000 --> 01:53:31,000
Yeah. All right. I'm 96, 95. All

890
01:53:31,000 --> 01:53:32,000
right.

891
01:53:32,000 --> 01:53:34,000
I've been in the

892
01:53:34,000 --> 01:53:35,000
Hills

893
01:53:35,000 --> 01:53:36,000
fellow guy.

894
01:53:36,000 --> 01:53:38,000
I think in the

895
01:53:38,000 --> 01:53:40,000
hills since 1965.

896
01:53:40,000 --> 01:53:41,000
Wow. So I've seen

897
01:53:41,000 --> 01:53:47,000
a lot of things happening. When you talk about the Williamson's Act.

898
01:53:47,000 --> 01:53:57,000
I've acquainted with it because I'm a cattleman's daughter, and I know all about chickens and roosters and everything else. But I

899
01:53:57,000 --> 01:54:02,000
noticed when we did the Williamson Act on our property.

900
01:54:02,000 --> 01:54:08,000
that I was not allowed to do anything. It was permanent.

901
01:54:08,000 --> 01:54:19,000
You know, so I don't know when you talk about the Williamson's Act being able to be taken away after a certain amount of time, didn't you say?

902
01:54:19,000 --> 01:54:20,000
I

903
01:54:20,000 --> 01:54:34,000
can just summarize it. You can post a notice that you're not going to renew it. Okay. Either of the 2 sides that are a party to the agreement. That doesn't end the agreement, but it says that.

904
01:54:34,000 --> 01:54:46,000
Over a 9-year period, it will slowly end, and after 9 years, it's ended. But once you file a notice of non-renewal, you can also then request to cancel it. And I…

905
01:54:46,000 --> 01:54:50,000
well, maybe it was different, because I'm from the Valley.

906
01:54:50,000 --> 01:55:02,000
And we had cattle, and so we put the Delta 2. We put the Williamson Act on property on a lot of the grassland.

907
01:55:02,000 --> 01:55:05,000
So I was just surprised.

908
01:55:05,000 --> 01:55:08,000
when you said that. All right, and I'm against…

909
01:55:08,000 --> 01:55:16,000
them going up that driveway now, because I go down and up that lumber on day and night, and that's terrible.

910
01:55:16,000 --> 01:55:18,000
To have

911
01:55:18,000 --> 01:55:20,000
a driveway there. All right.

912
01:55:20,000 --> 01:55:22,000
Thank you

913
01:55:22,000 --> 01:55:25,000
very much. Thank you. And and congratulations

914
01:55:25,000 --> 01:55:29,000
on your health. I have to

915
01:55:29,000 --> 01:55:30,000
say. Next

916
01:55:30,000 --> 01:55:34,000
three chair events, Jim Lai and Connie Oksan.

917
01:55:34,000 --> 01:55:35,000
I'm

918
01:55:35,000 --> 01:55:39,000
Cheryl Evans, Buena Vista Drive. This project. Okay, this project is

919
01:55:39,000 --> 01:55:40,000
completely against

920
01:55:40,000 --> 01:55:52,000
the spirit of the Williamson's Act, which is meant to protect agricultural land. Building a luxury home and trying to say that it's keeping in chickens and

921
01:55:52,000 --> 01:55:54,000
selling plants is agricultural use.

922
01:55:54,000 --> 01:56:02,000
An attempt to avoid the penalty of removing the land from the Williamson Act contract.

923
01:56:02,000 --> 01:56:20,000
You've covered the part about the house, not, you know, but you still haven't covered the part of the penalty. And that's just a dangerous… that's a dangerous precedent. I have chickens. I have an orchard. I have a garden, and maybe instead of sharing with my neighbors, I start selling my excess to them.

924
01:56:20,000 --> 01:56:35,000
Um, I could say that I have an entered into a contract with the Williamson Act, and I could save 50 to 70% of my taxes. And as you've heard, other people are thinking the same way. What's that going to do to the town's tax revenues? So I think we should take this out of William's nap.

925
01:56:35,000 --> 01:56:36,000
Thank

926
01:56:36,000 --> 01:56:43,000
you.

927
01:56:43,000 --> 01:56:46,000
Honey Oaks, and I've lived here 50

928
01:56:46,000 --> 01:56:47,000
years

929
01:56:47,000 --> 01:56:49,000
also. I would like

930
01:56:49,000 --> 01:56:57,000
to address the health and sanitation for the project and preserve the open space that we definitely

931
01:56:57,000 --> 01:57:03,000
need, and the environmental impact of 14 oak trees.

932
01:57:03,000 --> 01:57:11,000
Uh, being cut down, and there may be a few more, so could be 17 oak trees and.

933
01:57:11,000 --> 01:57:20,000
When they are cut down, they will be replaced by hardscape and hardscape when the rains come, it.

934
01:57:20,000 --> 01:57:35,000
just goes. So we've been told that it will go out to La Branca and down the hillside. Well, if anybody knows about La Barranca, it floods when the rains come.

935
01:57:35,000 --> 01:57:38,000
280 is over the top.

936
01:57:38,000 --> 01:57:54,000
And the runoff from 280 is also comes down right under La Barranca. So not only are we going to get all that runoff from this, this project, we also have 280.

937
01:57:54,000 --> 01:58:07,000
And everything else that goes along with it. So I'm not sure that's really. I don't think they've thought about the runoff from 280. We've had cars.

938
01:58:07,000 --> 01:58:13,000
stopped on La Baranca, you know, flooded because of the rain.

939
01:58:13,000 --> 01:58:28,000
Also, speaking of the chickens and the rain. They've talked about Deer Creek and can it handle all of that? But they say they're moving it away from Deer Creek.

940
01:58:28,000 --> 01:58:31,000
So, you have to, um…

941
01:58:31,000 --> 01:58:44,000
But I think the project as it is now should not be allowed. There needs to be more information looked into this, and it needs more.

942
01:58:44,000 --> 01:58:47,000
Just looking into.

943
01:58:47,000 --> 01:58:48,000
Thank you.

944
01:58:48,000 --> 01:58:53,000
Thank you very much.

945
01:58:53,000 --> 01:59:08,000
The next three, Alex Chen, Amy Huang, and Doris Lam.

946
01:59:08,000 --> 01:59:19,000
Hi, I'm Alex Chang and I live on La Barranca Road 12854, which is below the freeway. And I understand all the, um.

947
01:59:19,000 --> 01:59:24,000
Run off because we have the creek right behind our house,

948
01:59:24,000 --> 01:59:25,000
and I

949
01:59:25,000 --> 01:59:35,000
know how much water goes down there. It gets down up to, like, 3 feet, 4 feet high, and when you're looking at the grading and all.

950
01:59:35,000 --> 01:59:42,000
Runoff going down on La Barranca. It feeds into Deer Creek past our house.

951
01:59:42,000 --> 01:59:47,000
But I want to also talk about the Williamson Act.

952
01:59:47,000 --> 01:59:56,000
Let's see, um…

953
01:59:56,000 --> 02:00:11,000
The statute assumes that the Williamson Act parcel will be about 10 acres or more. That's what I believe. And in a sense, it's a trade off between property taxes and a promise not to develop the property.

954
02:00:11,000 --> 02:00:27,000
1.2 acres is an abuse. That means our neighbors, new neighbors will not be paying for their fair share of the cost of maintaining the city such as police, the streets.

955
02:00:27,000 --> 02:00:39,000
and the schools. I think the city is allowed to do the allowed to do a parcel of any size. It wants to, but why would it? That's my question.

956
02:00:39,000 --> 02:00:40,000
Thank you.

957
02:00:40,000 --> 02:00:50,000
Thank you.

958
02:00:50,000 --> 02:00:57,000
Hi, I'm Evie Huang, and I'm the Dan Hill neighbor of this project. I have a particular

959
02:00:57,000 --> 02:00:58,000
concern about the

960
02:00:58,000 --> 02:01:04,000
drinkage because the drinkage is really critical to the downhill resident like me. A

961
02:01:04,000 --> 02:01:07,000
clarification is needed regarding this proposed.

962
02:01:07,000 --> 02:01:14,000
uh, stormwater management system like how the stormwater is captured conveyed.

963
02:01:14,000 --> 02:01:22,000
discharged to prevent elution and the best impact to on a downhill property.

964
02:01:22,000 --> 02:01:32,000
And also, what is the measure will be implemented to ensure the drinkage pattern do not increase the runoff onto the neighboring lot?

965
02:01:32,000 --> 02:01:48,000
And you know, to use the heavy equipment like excavation activity, grading operation, and the tree removal will disturb and losing the existing soil. And what temporary or permanent.

966
02:01:48,000 --> 02:01:56,000
illusion control measurement will be implemented during the construction to prevent the soil movement onto the adjacent property.

967
02:01:56,000 --> 02:02:04,000
And how has the potential risk to neighboring property be evaluated and mitigated? That's for the drinkage.

968
02:02:04,000 --> 02:02:12,000
Because looks like there's absence in absence demonstrate a comparable project with similar land condition.

969
02:02:12,000 --> 02:02:24,000
We believe that it's more conservative development approach is warranted, and reduction in the scale of development to size more consistent with the site physical limiting.

970
02:02:24,000 --> 02:02:31,000
And that will reduce the burden placed on the Hue side and minimize the gradient and destructured intervention.

971
02:02:31,000 --> 02:02:38,000
So lower the risk of the slow intertibility and better protect the public safety and the neighboring property.

972
02:02:38,000 --> 02:02:41,000
And also talking about the Williamson Act.

973
02:02:41,000 --> 02:02:57,000
And, um, looks like it has… it has been noted as the tag does not appear to have a clearly defined policy or set of guideline for addressing Williamson at property and the related land use decision.

974
02:02:57,000 --> 02:03:11,000
So to promote this consistency, credibility and fairness. I think the town should consider adopting the approach similar to the use by the city of Santa Clara for the transition of the Williamson at designated properties.

975
02:03:11,000 --> 02:03:28,000
But if the town chose not to adopt the Santa Clara model, and I suggest the town council should establish the transparent objective and consistently apply the framework that respect the original intent and spirit of Williamson Act.

976
02:03:28,000 --> 02:03:37,000
So any such policy should be clearly articulated, responsible and equitable, ensuring fair treatment to all Los Angeles residents.

977
02:03:37,000 --> 02:03:49,000
Okay. And I also have another concern about the tree removal like approximately 9 heritage tree located near the crest side.

978
02:03:49,000 --> 02:03:58,000
Because the remote raised the question about whether the hillside could become more susceptible to elution, slow failure, or other forms of instability.

979
02:03:58,000 --> 02:04:13,000
And also in addition, removal of this existing tree may significantly increase direct yield into neighboring property like mine, reduce privacy like mine, and alert the character of the neighborhood.

980
02:04:13,000 --> 02:04:19,000
Thank you. Thank you.

981
02:04:19,000 --> 02:04:27,000
Hello, Doris.

982
02:04:27,000 --> 02:04:29,000
Hi, my name is, can you hear everyone

983
02:04:29,000 --> 02:04:33,000
in here? My name is Doris Lam and I live on Cornwall Vista.

984
02:04:33,000 --> 02:04:34,000
I am speaking

985
02:04:34,000 --> 02:04:40,000
on behalf of myself as well as a group of other parcel owners of Los Angeles Hills who cannot be here today.

986
02:04:40,000 --> 02:04:41,000
Um, on

987
02:04:41,000 --> 02:04:42,000
the Williamson Act,

988
02:04:42,000 --> 02:04:56,000
the town does not have a written policy with respect to the Williamson Act. We recommend that a written policy be adopted before the parcel of unaddressed La Barranco Road is approved so that we understand what guidelines are used.

989
02:04:56,000 --> 02:05:02,000
for the analysis for either the approval or rejection of comparability.

990
02:05:02,000 --> 02:05:17,000
Um, and this should the Boyism Act with the plan should all be looked at the same time review all reviewed at the same time, and the permit of released at the same time, and and not hold.

991
02:05:17,000 --> 02:05:24,000
The project, inconsistent with the Williamson Act, you know, having it done twice.

992
02:05:24,000 --> 02:05:39,000
Okay. Drainage on water and soil. The parcel sits on a hill surrounded by parcels of homes at a lower level. There is a house 13027, La Barranco Road, then could be severely impacted by the rainfall and soil movement.

993
02:05:39,000 --> 02:05:57,000
What is being done or technology to be implemented to prevent and to control rainwater and soil from spilling over or eroding the construction phase or after the property is developed onto other properties as it is currently open space in a natural state.

994
02:05:57,000 --> 02:06:14,000
As the soil is undisturbed, removal of trees. How can we be assured that only 9 heritage trees and 4 other trees, a total of 13 will be removed. The concern about the trees, specifically the heritage trees have long roots, and they help.

995
02:06:14,000 --> 02:06:30,000
In holding the soil from eroding. So there are 4 questions that I have on that one is number one, how many trees will be replanted on the property, and where? How large are the trees, and what kind of trees? The removal and planting of trees should be addressed and.

996
02:06:30,000 --> 02:06:33,000
resolved before the permit is issued.

997
02:06:33,000 --> 02:06:41,000
On construction traffic on La Bronco Road. As this is a one-lane, narrow, winding

998
02:06:41,000 --> 02:06:42,000
road with

999
02:06:42,000 --> 02:06:49,000
blind spots and a main thoroughfare for downtown Los Altos Santa San Antonio Road.

1000
02:06:49,000 --> 02:07:02,000
And Foothill Expressway, what is to prevent obstruction of traffic parking on La Barranca and soil and debris, including lumber screws, nails, and metal.

1001
02:07:02,000 --> 02:07:11,000
from landing on the road. Geological and land survey report. Where can we find that and can we review it?

1002
02:07:11,000 --> 02:07:17,000
Thank you. Thank you.

1003
02:07:17,000 --> 02:07:19,000
the next three.

1004
02:07:19,000 --> 02:07:30,000
Bracey and I need the amyst.

1005
02:07:30,000 --> 02:07:43,000
Thank you, Commission, and thank you, the applicant. First of all, we appreciate the current modification from previous version and we acknowledge that there's some change and we.

1006
02:07:43,000 --> 02:07:53,000
like it, but we are hoping to preserve more of the trees and preserve our environment. The 1st topic I'm going to talk about is a septic tank.

1007
02:07:53,000 --> 02:08:09,000
by EDPC report, it says the septic tank and the motor or motor whatever is within the 30 feet setback. I'm not sure if that's true, but if it's the case, can we move it? I don't.

1008
02:08:09,000 --> 02:08:15,000
There's no reason they have to be close to the property line. And because of that.

1009
02:08:15,000 --> 02:08:30,000
Because of the current location, they will ask to remove two huge heritage trees with trunks of 24 inch plus two because one has two and the other one is 24 inch. So there are two huge trees.

1010
02:08:30,000 --> 02:08:38,000
And there are other smaller oaks that they are not heritage. They didn't propose to remove, but if you put…

1011
02:08:38,000 --> 02:08:42,000
to likely they may have two septic tanks because it's huge development.

1012
02:08:42,000 --> 02:08:49,000
some of the trees may compromise, may be removed as well, and that will cause.

1013
02:08:49,000 --> 02:09:00,000
I'm sure you cannot see, but that would cause a huge… the whole canopy lost from my view, and there's no privacy between the 2 properties.

1014
02:09:00,000 --> 02:09:16,000
And, you know, the area is precious. We have very sloped lots, and that happened to be at the flat area. I don't want this cause my future development issue when using the flat area.

1015
02:09:16,000 --> 02:09:18,000
So first, I request…

1016
02:09:18,000 --> 02:09:28,000
to see if the septic tanks and each leach field can be as one of the engineer mentioned to move maybe more forward to there.

1017
02:09:28,000 --> 02:09:34,000
property or move to south facing slope. I don't know somewhere.

1018
02:09:34,000 --> 02:09:40,000
And the second thing is the slope variance that.

1019
02:09:40,000 --> 02:09:52,000
I understand some of the area that's close to La Branca Road. That's about 30% in slope, and that's supposed to be open space easement.

1020
02:09:52,000 --> 02:09:59,000
And there are some area, because of the proposed driveway.

1021
02:09:59,000 --> 02:10:02,000
thing, and they have to cut it.

1022
02:10:02,000 --> 02:10:18,000
I'm not going to comment too much on that because it's the fire department thing and that I don't know. But I would hope the other side, you know, the untouched, unneeded part still remain in the open space easement.

1023
02:10:18,000 --> 02:10:31,000
We certainly, because it's… I don't know if people have dropped there. It's very steep up there, and if there's no need to move it, don't touch it.

1024
02:10:31,000 --> 02:10:33,000
And, um…

1025
02:10:33,000 --> 02:10:48,000
I also want to address a little bit about the Williamson Act. I understand the owner has every intention to keep calm and sanitary operation with our neighborhood, and we appreciate that. But we would request legislation on.

1026
02:10:48,000 --> 02:10:57,000
If it get past what? Because they may move out, they may sell the property to the next owners. We need a legislation, not just there.

1027
02:10:57,000 --> 02:11:02,000
promise, you know, if there's a Williamson Act, what are need?

1028
02:11:02,000 --> 02:11:08,000
rules we have. The last thing is that my time's up. The last thing I want to address, James.

1029
02:11:08,000 --> 02:11:13,000
property tax calculation, but I don't have time.

1030
02:11:13,000 --> 02:11:17,000
Okay, so please try to summarize your thoughts very

1031
02:11:17,000 --> 02:11:20,000
quick. My property, because you

1032
02:11:20,000 --> 02:11:21,000
people been

1033
02:11:21,000 --> 02:11:28,000
here 50 years, maybe less matter. But for people moving here within the.

1034
02:11:28,000 --> 02:11:44,000
Last 10 to 15 years, a lot of property tax is value is based on our land. My property tax, the the house I have is 15% of the total value of my property in.

1035
02:11:44,000 --> 02:11:53,000
During the assessment. And I just checked my, you know, assessment letter from Santa Clara. So yeah, it is not that cheap.

1036
02:11:53,000 --> 02:11:54,000
Thank

1037
02:11:54,000 --> 02:11:56,000
you. Thank you.

1038
02:11:56,000 --> 02:12:08,000
I don't want to claim to be an expert in this area, and we probably should get some good advice and good legal explanations of this, but my understanding is the home site land.

1039
02:12:08,000 --> 02:12:14,000
is still valued at the regular, uh, tax rates.

1040
02:12:14,000 --> 02:12:22,000
Uh, anyway, that's a discussion for another time.

1041
02:12:22,000 --> 02:12:33,000
Hello, I am Grace. I live on Elena and Albaranca. So like Elena and Laboranka and I was just told by John

1042
02:12:33,000 --> 02:12:34,000
that

1043
02:12:34,000 --> 02:12:40,000
my house, when my house was built, there is a huge detention thing.

1044
02:12:40,000 --> 02:12:50,000
In my property. And let me tell you that it's not working when the when there is heavy rain runoff.

1045
02:12:50,000 --> 02:13:03,000
My property has huge pot of water. And then it break all my irrigation system. And when the water gets to the maximum, it…

1046
02:13:03,000 --> 02:13:12,000
all of a sudden it just goes down the road and to the other La Baraka residence. So I want to.

1047
02:13:12,000 --> 02:13:26,000
I want to let the engineers know that this is what's happening in the reality. So and the second thing I want to talk about is also on top of the property tax.

1048
02:13:26,000 --> 02:13:39,000
The property tax of Williamson Act, does the owner bought it at 700k in 2024. So when there is no Williamson Act.

1049
02:13:39,000 --> 02:13:54,000
The land should be 2, 3 million or 3-4 million. So when the Williamson Act got take out, I believe the Santa Clara County will slowly go up.

1050
02:13:54,000 --> 02:14:02,000
and assess the lab. So if the planning commission or the Council keep giving the Williamson Act.

1051
02:14:02,000 --> 02:14:11,000
Then the owner is paying a lot less property tax than the rest of us. So that's my second point.

1052
02:14:11,000 --> 02:14:18,000
And my first point is the Williamson Act. When I look at the staff report.

1053
02:14:18,000 --> 02:14:33,000
And look at all the planning and discussion seems like when the staff report look at it and the applicants, the owner to determine whether it is compatible, it seems like it's a checklist.

1054
02:14:33,000 --> 02:14:39,000
Okay, whether it has the primary gerry, whether it has the secondary.

1055
02:14:39,000 --> 02:14:55,000
Whether it has an aquaculture thing and then whether it has an open space. I'm sorry, this is an all of us, all of us here in LAH, we have all the four checklists.

1056
02:14:55,000 --> 02:15:01,000
So if the council, say, or planning commission say.

1057
02:15:01,000 --> 02:15:11,000
This property is compatible. Then all of us should be compatible to. Yes. So another thing.

1058
02:15:11,000 --> 02:15:16,000
Another thing I want to make is.

1059
02:15:16,000 --> 02:15:18,000
Why don't the

1060
02:15:18,000 --> 02:15:26,000
planning committee and the council follow the Santa character?

1061
02:15:26,000 --> 02:15:38,000
County. The Santa Clara County has this thing, say 10% limit, 10% development to the entire parcel. So if.

1062
02:15:38,000 --> 02:15:58,000
Santa Clara has this number. I keep hearing that say there is no quantity on this 4 item checklist. But then Santa Clara has a real number, 10% of the development limit. So why can we follow.

1063
02:15:58,000 --> 02:16:05,000
On it. Thank you. Good. Thank you.

1064
02:16:05,000 --> 02:16:14,000
Okay, last but not least, my name is Andy Gist, and I live on Footy Lane, but more importantly, I run a network of emergency of 70 house on

1065
02:16:14,000 --> 02:16:20,000
La Barranca, Elena, the whole neighborhood. I'm sorry. I'm having trouble hearing you. Go ahead and try that again.

1066
02:16:20,000 --> 02:16:25,000
Maybe you're so close, it's over-modulating like this.

1067
02:16:25,000 --> 02:16:27,000
Try that. Can you hear me

1068
02:16:27,000 --> 02:16:28,000
now? I have.

1069
02:16:28,000 --> 02:16:32,000
By the way, and I wear hearing aids, so I

1070
02:16:32,000 --> 02:16:34,000
should be able to hear you.

1071
02:16:34,000 --> 02:16:35,000
Thank you. My

1072
02:16:35,000 --> 02:16:37,000
name is Anne DeGuis, D-E-G-H-E-E-S-T, because

1073
02:16:37,000 --> 02:16:39,000
I thought you kind of killed it

1074
02:16:39,000 --> 02:16:40,000
there. I

1075
02:16:40,000 --> 02:16:41,000
run a group called

1076
02:16:41,000 --> 02:16:43,000
FLORT, which is an

1077
02:16:43,000 --> 02:16:45,000
emergency network of 70 houses on La

1078
02:16:45,000 --> 02:16:49,000
Barranca, Elena, all the side trees and Foothill Lane.

1079
02:16:49,000 --> 02:16:50,000
I want to expand on

1080
02:16:50,000 --> 02:17:05,000
one point, which is it is the job of the town to provide safety to all our residents. We have over 100 people in my in my organized group who go up and down La Baranca multiple times a day. I'd like to explain that that driveway.

1081
02:17:05,000 --> 02:17:21,000
The way it is designed in the blind turn is a safety hazard that the town will be liable if there's accidents. Is the town willing to make so many exceptions and so many changes to the law, you know, that makes an exceptions that just one property, that you increase the risk that we have accident.

1082
02:17:21,000 --> 02:17:38,000
It is a blind turn. We're going to be coming down at very high speed. That driveway there has to have a retaining wall because it's so steep there that visibility is going to be an issue, not only for the owner, who is going to be liable if it hits us, but for us to basically be at risk in an emergency route.

1083
02:17:38,000 --> 02:17:54,000
This role that Barranca has been identified by the fire department to be our emergency room in case of wildfires. And there's no doubt that it is compromising the safety of over hundreds of peoples in the neighborhoods. Please deny this request for all these exemptions that you're being asked.

1084
02:17:54,000 --> 02:18:00,000
Thank you.

1085
02:18:00,000 --> 02:18:04,000
The next three, Larry Del Carlo.

1086
02:18:04,000 --> 02:18:08,000
Liz Wilson and Eric Evans.

1087
02:18:08,000 --> 02:18:13,000
Thank you.

1088
02:18:13,000 --> 02:18:18,000
Thank you for letting me talk. Sure. My name is Larry DiCarlo.

1089
02:18:18,000 --> 02:18:24,000
Excuse me. And I live at 13117 La Branca, which is on the

1090
02:18:24,000 --> 02:18:27,000
corner of La Branca and Elena.

1091
02:18:27,000 --> 02:18:29,000
We've lived

1092
02:18:29,000 --> 02:18:32,000
there since 1976.

1093
02:18:32,000 --> 02:18:41,000
50 years. This is my first time talking in front of the Planning Commission, where they.

1094
02:18:41,000 --> 02:18:42,000
City

1095
02:18:42,000 --> 02:18:43,000
Council. Let's.

1096
02:18:43,000 --> 02:18:46,000
Hasn't been important to me all these years.

1097
02:18:46,000 --> 02:18:49,000
This has been, though. This is…

1098
02:18:49,000 --> 02:18:54,000
Something that both my wife and I.

1099
02:18:54,000 --> 02:18:55,000
feel

1100
02:18:55,000 --> 02:18:57,000
very strongly about.

1101
02:18:57,000 --> 02:19:06,000
And I'm not going to talk about all the things that our neighbors have talked about already. The driveway, I think, is ridiculous.

1102
02:19:06,000 --> 02:19:11,000
Having a 27 28 foot driveway in La Broncos.

1103
02:19:11,000 --> 02:19:13,000
It's a joke to me.

1104
02:19:13,000 --> 02:19:16,000
The heritage oak trees.

1105
02:19:16,000 --> 02:19:17,000
Terrible

1106
02:19:17,000 --> 02:19:19,000
thing to do.

1107
02:19:19,000 --> 02:19:25,000
That's going to increase the noise for the rest of us on that property.

1108
02:19:25,000 --> 02:19:30,000
My biggest concern is for the privacy of the neighbors that are close.

1109
02:19:30,000 --> 02:19:31,000
on

1110
02:19:31,000 --> 02:19:32,000
either side of that house.

1111
02:19:32,000 --> 02:19:35,000
A two-story house.

1112
02:19:35,000 --> 02:19:37,000
Uh…

1113
02:19:37,000 --> 02:19:44,000
Facing where it's facing is going to be.

1114
02:19:44,000 --> 02:19:49,000
take the privacy away from the neighbors in front, behind, and on the side.

1115
02:19:49,000 --> 02:19:52,000
which which I think is…

1116
02:19:52,000 --> 02:19:55,000
You know, everybody should have a.

1117
02:19:55,000 --> 02:20:01,000
The house of their dreams, but not at the expense of their neighbors.

1118
02:20:01,000 --> 02:20:10,000
The last thing I want to talk about is the Williamson Act. And I know that Los Altos Hills doesn't have a policy on that.

1119
02:20:10,000 --> 02:20:16,000
But the last time I checked, we were in Santa Clara, and Santa Clara County does have it.

1120
02:20:16,000 --> 02:20:20,000
A policy. And the policy that I read.

1121
02:20:20,000 --> 02:20:25,000
States that properties with 10 acres or less.

1122
02:20:25,000 --> 02:20:32,000
must have 75% of that property devoted to commercial agriculture.

1123
02:20:32,000 --> 02:20:36,000
And this certainly isn't the case in…

1124
02:20:36,000 --> 02:20:39,000
For this, uh…

1125
02:20:39,000 --> 02:20:40,000
For

1126
02:20:40,000 --> 02:20:41,000
this house. So.

1127
02:20:41,000 --> 02:20:54,000
I thank you for letting me talk and getting it off my chest anyway. Sure.

1128
02:20:54,000 --> 02:20:57,000
Good evening. I'm Elizabeth Wilson. I live on

1129
02:20:57,000 --> 02:20:58,000
Buena Vista

1130
02:20:58,000 --> 02:20:59,000
Drive in

1131
02:20:59,000 --> 02:21:01,000
Los Altos Hills. I am

1132
02:21:01,000 --> 02:21:02,000
not a

1133
02:21:02,000 --> 02:21:03,000
neighbor of this

1134
02:21:03,000 --> 02:21:05,000
project.

1135
02:21:05,000 --> 02:21:09,000
But I use that street regularly as my exit route

1136
02:21:09,000 --> 02:21:10,000
also. And

1137
02:21:10,000 --> 02:21:24,000
I think you need to be aware that that's actually a heavily used street and the ramifications the neighbors are speaking about should be taken into account because of that.

1138
02:21:24,000 --> 02:21:35,000
I also did some reading about development in Santa Clara County, and I'd like to confirm my reading also said that 10% of the property.

1139
02:21:35,000 --> 02:21:38,000
was to be.

1140
02:21:38,000 --> 02:21:39,000
developed,

1141
02:21:39,000 --> 02:21:40,000
uh…

1142
02:21:40,000 --> 02:21:53,000
and the rest put into the agricultural purpose. It appears to me in looking at this property, that more than 10% has been devoted to Mfa Mda.

1143
02:21:53,000 --> 02:22:03,000
And then my last thing that I'd like to say to you is that I encourage you to think about the precedents that you are setting here.

1144
02:22:03,000 --> 02:22:09,000
There are numerous variances that have been asked for on this property.

1145
02:22:09,000 --> 02:22:14,000
Almost all of us live on hilly pieces, and we all want variances.

1146
02:22:14,000 --> 02:22:31,000
Many of those were denied to other people. I think that you need to be aware that that's a sensitive topic, and that you need to be very careful about granting variances, especially with the quantity that are asked about for on this property.

1147
02:22:31,000 --> 02:22:38,000
And the same way about granting the Williamson Act.

1148
02:22:38,000 --> 02:22:54,000
situation. A lot of us would qualify for this, actually qualify much more easily than this particular property. And and get the tax write-off, and I I would remind you that that property tax helps just.

1149
02:22:54,000 --> 02:23:03,000
support our city. And without that money, that makes a big difference on our infrastructure. So thank you very much.

1150
02:23:03,000 --> 02:23:15,000
Thank you.

1151
02:23:15,000 --> 02:23:17,000
Eric Evans.

1152
02:23:17,000 --> 02:23:22,000
A combination of a large custom home adu and SE 9 simply does not fit

1153
02:23:22,000 --> 02:23:27,000
the allowable type of buildings nor use on a Williamson Act parcel.

1154
02:23:27,000 --> 02:23:44,000
building a custom home on a protected parcel would likely require an easement exchange whereby the area of land used for the development, which would be most of its Mda, would be removed from the contract in an equal amount of adjacent land, presume, presumably from an adjacent parcel.

1155
02:23:44,000 --> 02:23:49,000
would be encumbered by this contract. That's called an easement exchange. Alternatively.

1156
02:23:49,000 --> 02:24:05,000
cancellation of a Williamson Act contract by the owner must meet statutory findings, and if those can be met, then a penalty must be paid equal to 12.5% of the property's value as if the property were unencumbered by the contract. In other words.

1157
02:24:05,000 --> 02:24:10,000
current market value of an unencumbered property.

1158
02:24:10,000 --> 02:24:17,000
The town has given up significant tax revenue over many years to parcels that are under a Williamson Act contract.

1159
02:24:17,000 --> 02:24:32,000
The owner should not be allowed to remove this parcel from the contract without penalty and or paying back taxes, and then just to turn around and develop it to its fullest, most valuable potential under other non-allowed uses.

1160
02:24:32,000 --> 02:24:46,000
And with emphasis, they also should not be allowed to keep their Williamson Act contract and low tax base after building a full custom home to the limits of what's allowed with only a small greenhouse as the agricultural component.

1161
02:24:46,000 --> 02:24:50,000
This project could set a very dangerous precedent for the town.

1162
02:24:50,000 --> 02:25:05,000
Every owner in the town could very easily buy chickens, plant crops, maybe even just build a greenhouse, ask AI to develop an agricultural operations and business plan, which it would do in a couple of minutes, and then apply to enter into a.

1163
02:25:05,000 --> 02:25:16,000
a Williamson Act contract with the town, thus saving them huge amounts of money in property taxes and causing the revenue of the town to drop. Maybe that's what we all should do.

1164
02:25:16,000 --> 02:25:32,000
This application simply does not fit the requirements, intent, nor spirit of the Williamson Act. It should be denied in full until the owner has done the required work and paid the penalties and fees to properly cancel the Williamson Act contract, or let the 10-year contract.

1165
02:25:32,000 --> 02:25:40,000
non-renewal period run. Thank you. Thank you, Eric.

1166
02:25:40,000 --> 02:25:47,000
Is there any… a show of hands, is there anyone else who would like to speak on this

1167
02:25:47,000 --> 02:25:48,000
subject? I

1168
02:25:48,000 --> 02:25:49,000
see. We

1169
02:25:49,000 --> 02:25:50,000
still have two questions.

1170
02:25:50,000 --> 02:25:51,000
You have

1171
02:25:51,000 --> 02:25:53,000
names. I see. Very good. We still

1172
02:25:53,000 --> 02:25:57,000
have 2 more here. One from Harold.

1173
02:25:57,000 --> 02:26:01,000
Cut lab, and the other from sewerch.

1174
02:26:01,000 --> 02:26:02,000
That's

1175
02:26:02,000 --> 02:26:06,000
Carol Gottlieb, by the way. Thank you.

1176
02:26:06,000 --> 02:26:10,000
and ready.

1177
02:26:10,000 --> 02:26:15,000
Is there anybody online?

1178
02:26:15,000 --> 02:26:19,000
I don't see anybody online with their hands raised. Okay.

1179
02:26:19,000 --> 02:26:20,000
We

1180
02:26:20,000 --> 02:26:22,000
have one. Carol Gottlieb,

1181
02:26:22,000 --> 02:26:27,000
and I'm speaking for the environmental design and protection committee,

1182
02:26:27,000 --> 02:26:28,000
and we had

1183
02:26:28,000 --> 02:26:31,000
looked at it. Usually.

1184
02:26:31,000 --> 02:26:34,000
We usually one of our things is

1185
02:26:34,000 --> 02:26:37,000
to look up the property. How's how it

1186
02:26:37,000 --> 02:26:38,000
affects the neighbors.

1187
02:26:38,000 --> 02:26:42,000
But I think the neighbors tonight have done

1188
02:26:42,000 --> 02:26:49,000
an outstanding job of protecting themselves. So I'm going to speak on some sort of mundane.

1189
02:26:49,000 --> 02:26:51,000
topics.

1190
02:26:51,000 --> 02:26:52,000
First of all,

1191
02:26:52,000 --> 02:26:53,000
I'm very

1192
02:26:53,000 --> 02:26:55,000
concerned about the pump.

1193
02:26:55,000 --> 02:27:02,000
The sewer pump in the 30 foot setback. We do not allow swimming pool equipment.

1194
02:27:02,000 --> 02:27:04,000
We do not allow.

1195
02:27:04,000 --> 02:27:05,000
HVC

1196
02:27:05,000 --> 02:27:08,000
and our 30-foot step

1197
02:27:08,000 --> 02:27:09,000
back.

1198
02:27:09,000 --> 02:27:10,000
So if

1199
02:27:10,000 --> 02:27:11,000
we

1200
02:27:11,000 --> 02:27:12,000
start allowing pumps.

1201
02:27:12,000 --> 02:27:16,000
Electrical pumps in a 30-foot setback. I think this is going to

1202
02:27:16,000 --> 02:27:18,000
open Pandora's box. So I

1203
02:27:18,000 --> 02:27:23,000
ask if you're going to allow a pump in the 30 foot

1204
02:27:23,000 --> 02:27:25,000
setback that it becomes a variance.

1205
02:27:25,000 --> 02:27:26,000
At

1206
02:27:26,000 --> 02:27:28,000
least that doesn't open up quite the

1207
02:27:28,000 --> 02:27:34,000
Pandora's box, because we have a lot of see a lot of properties where people

1208
02:27:34,000 --> 02:27:35,000
have put pool equipment

1209
02:27:35,000 --> 02:27:42,000
and everything in the 37 set box. And we say, Oh, no, you can't do that.

1210
02:27:42,000 --> 02:27:47,000
The second topic that nobody has discussed is a.

1211
02:27:47,000 --> 02:27:56,000
the retaining walls, and this property is going to have excessive retaining walls to the driveway, and I would like to see it.

1212
02:27:56,000 --> 02:28:01,000
the color be a deutral color, earth tone color other than

1213
02:28:01,000 --> 02:28:03,000
a gray. So

1214
02:28:03,000 --> 02:28:04,000
I think

1215
02:28:04,000 --> 02:28:05,000
that's an

1216
02:28:05,000 --> 02:28:06,000
important, and that's

1217
02:28:06,000 --> 02:28:07,000
something we've

1218
02:28:07,000 --> 02:28:08,000
always

1219
02:28:08,000 --> 02:28:09,000
done in

1220
02:28:09,000 --> 02:28:12,000
site development when we see retaining walls.

1221
02:28:12,000 --> 02:28:17,000
The other thing is that the ADU. I think the height level of

1222
02:28:17,000 --> 02:28:19,000
an ADU is supposed

1223
02:28:19,000 --> 02:28:27,000
to be 19 feet, and I think this exceeds it, and I'm not sure whether you're supposed to have a

1224
02:28:27,000 --> 02:28:29,000
2-story adu. I thought it

1225
02:28:29,000 --> 02:28:31,000
was just one story adu.

1226
02:28:31,000 --> 02:28:38,000
So, that is something that needs to be looked at.

1227
02:28:38,000 --> 02:28:46,000
One of the things that I was really surprised at is to hear that the water is going to be directed down to La Balanca, because.

1228
02:28:46,000 --> 02:28:52,000
I always thought we weren't supposed to direct the water down to a street.

1229
02:28:52,000 --> 02:29:00,000
And it was supposed to be retained. And I'll tell you about these retention basins. My neighbors have them, and I have a ditch.

1230
02:29:00,000 --> 02:29:11,000
And so the retention masons let out water all summer long. So once I cleaned off the ditch, I no longer… I have to clean it out

1231
02:29:11,000 --> 02:29:12,000
again because

1232
02:29:12,000 --> 02:29:17,000
I get water coming down that ditch all summer long.

1233
02:29:17,000 --> 02:29:18,000
And I

1234
02:29:18,000 --> 02:29:28,000
gather it's from the retention basins, or somebody's swimming pool. I don't know what, but this means a lot more work on my part to maintain my property.

1235
02:29:28,000 --> 02:29:31,000
Um, I think that's…

1236
02:29:31,000 --> 02:29:47,000
Some of the little points that we would be mentioning if this was at a site development level. Thank you, Carol.

1237
02:29:47,000 --> 02:29:52,000
Okay, Sue Welch.

1238
02:29:52,000 --> 02:30:05,000
Sorry, I forgot my notes today, so I'm going to be more disjointed than usual. Okay. I sent you a written comments with two suggestions. One to do a better compatibility determination,

1239
02:30:05,000 --> 02:30:11,000
the one in the first report in June was based on what they heard.

1240
02:30:11,000 --> 02:30:27,000
From here, basically hearsay from the owner. He's going to do this and this, and this which is not adequate. And the the even the one from the from the most recent staff report is, I think, is lacking. Santa Clara County will not even consider.

1241
02:30:27,000 --> 02:30:42,000
would not even accept a file for a development project or a building permit from a Williamson Act parcel until they have a formal compatibility determination done.

1242
02:30:42,000 --> 02:30:59,000
And I don't know if anyone looked at? Did any of the staff or anyone look at what Santa Clara County does? Apparently they have a whole guidelines thing for this, and I just think we need we need better information about the compatibility. I think it's a major issue here.

1243
02:30:59,000 --> 02:31:01,000
Um…

1244
02:31:01,000 --> 02:31:20,000
And the second thing was get some better legal advice from a real land use lawyer who has an expertise in dealing with these parcels. This is a very complex, specialized things. If you make mistakes.

1245
02:31:20,000 --> 02:31:36,000
The penalties are enormous. So, you know, let's spend a little of the town money and get some get some real advice to make sure we're headed down the right road on this, because, you know, as people are saying.

1246
02:31:36,000 --> 02:31:55,000
I'm going to have chicken because my neighbor has chickens. I grew 500 plants and they'll have every time the last three years. That's an egg site. Okay. The other thing is that I think there's maybe people who don't understand that the Williamson Act also allows.

1247
02:31:55,000 --> 02:32:12,000
Just holding land is open space can be left as can be considered Williamson can meet the requirements for Williamson Act contract. And that's basically what the Fenwick property has been in. There's never been any grazing or ag there.

1248
02:32:12,000 --> 02:32:23,000
And that's what this… if you look at the aerial photos for this parcel, you can see that there's never been any ag done on this. And that's okay, because the Williamson Act allows that.

1249
02:32:23,000 --> 02:32:42,000
But now the contract that Parcel has with the with this parcel is that they can also have ag. And so they're going to be having a few chickens. And so okay, an important another point is that the regarding the.

1250
02:32:42,000 --> 02:32:57,000
building the law, the Williamson Act law requires that a residence built on the contracted parcel be quote incidental to the agricultural or open space use.

1251
02:32:57,000 --> 02:33:13,000
And it's very clear that the 10,000 square feet of development area that's coming with this house, with the residential stuff, is not incidental to the 300 square feet greenhouse chicken coop that.

1252
02:33:13,000 --> 02:33:24,000
That's going to constitute the ag. It's just not, okay? The other thing is that the open spaces, the.

1253
02:33:24,000 --> 02:33:30,000
Open Space Committee recommended open space easements over the the 30%.

1254
02:33:30,000 --> 02:33:39,000
Some of the 30% slope on the parcel, which is standard for the town. But the issue is because those.

1255
02:33:39,000 --> 02:34:01,000
You cannot put a open space easement, which is a requirement, a condition of development. It's required. You cannot put that type of easement in the Williamson Act. So they're going to have to be taken up that open space area will have to be taken out of Williamson Act.

1256
02:34:01,000 --> 02:34:16,000
And you can say, well, can't we just leave it in Williamson Act and have it act as open space? It would be the same thing. No, it wouldn't, because if it's left in Williamson's Act, the owner can get rid of it next year.

1257
02:34:16,000 --> 02:34:19,000
Whereas if it's in a formal.

1258
02:34:19,000 --> 02:34:28,000
Open space easement that was required as a condition of development. It is in perpetuity. Thank you. Complication.

1259
02:34:28,000 --> 02:34:42,000
Thank you. Thank you.

1260
02:34:42,000 --> 02:34:49,000
I don't see any others online or here in the chambers. I want to thank everybody.

1261
02:34:49,000 --> 02:34:50,000
Question.

1262
02:34:50,000 --> 02:34:51,000
Did

1263
02:34:51,000 --> 02:34:57,000
you make it this cold? So we go away? No.

1264
02:34:57,000 --> 02:35:07,000
Perhaps we we've warmed up the room enough that the thermostat kicked in hot air

1265
02:35:07,000 --> 02:35:09,000
out there yet.

1266
02:35:09,000 --> 02:35:10,000
I want to

1267
02:35:10,000 --> 02:35:25,000
sincerely thank all of you for coming here, especially resonate with the gentleman who said he somehow avoided this for 50 years. And this is what brought him here.

1268
02:35:25,000 --> 02:35:28,000
I appreciate that.

1269
02:35:28,000 --> 02:35:44,000
I do appreciate that every lot that we all have at one point was an empty piece of land, and somebody bought it and somebody wanted to develop something on it.

1270
02:35:44,000 --> 02:36:00,000
think that the owners of this property, they have rights as well. And the trick is to find something that works for everyone. But I am so grateful to have a thorough list of the issues that have come up.

1271
02:36:00,000 --> 02:36:15,000
for us all to discuss. Before we continue on with the normal steps here, I just wanted to ask, we've heard so much good information. Jay, is there anything you'd like to provide at this moment? Yes, certainly appreciate

1272
02:36:15,000 --> 02:36:16,000
it. Shouldn't we first

1273
02:36:16,000 --> 02:36:18,000
go with the applicant response?

1274
02:36:18,000 --> 02:36:19,000
If I

1275
02:36:19,000 --> 02:36:23,000
may, I believe I've had a conversation with the applicant

1276
02:36:23,000 --> 02:36:26,000
response staff. Naveen, hang on just one moment.

1277
02:36:26,000 --> 02:36:27,000
Go

1278
02:36:27,000 --> 02:36:45,000
ahead. Okay, so certainly appreciate the the residents and and the concerns that we've heard tonight. We've heard a number of property owners concerned with impacts to their property, and that the property owners are concerned with their property owner rights. I'd like to discuss a little bit about.

1279
02:36:45,000 --> 02:36:58,000
Those rights that all property owners have here in Los Altos Hills, and what our code allows for within the confines of the development of a property here in Los Altos Hills.

1280
02:36:58,000 --> 02:37:18,000
Um, when we look at that, we also have this conversation associated with the Williamson Act. And we've had a number of properties here developed in town that in the past have not even had a consideration of Williamson Act when they've gone through development. There's been a historic practice in town that has been inconsistent.

1281
02:37:18,000 --> 02:37:40,000
And this is one of the first properties that we've seen have this consideration for the Williamson Act be applied to their property when they've come in for development. We have a property on 2400 5 Oaknoll that went through two rounds with the town and never had the Williamson Act mentioned on their property when it came in for development.

1282
02:37:40,000 --> 02:38:03,000
Um, that was in 2006 and again in 2019. I heard a number of issues associated with the development tonight, and I'll start to try to address as many of them as I can before I turn it over to the the applicant to address maybe the more significant and things of impact that they feel are necessary to try to.

1283
02:38:03,000 --> 02:38:25,000
articulate their position and advocate for their project. But every project has a right to access. And this particular property is in a unique configuration where we've heard multiple property owners here talk about the steep slopes. When you look at where the access has been taken off of Law Baranca, it's actually one of the most sensible places to be able to access the property.

1284
02:38:25,000 --> 02:38:42,000
It has sight lines that allow for 205 feet of sight line to where the entrance to the driveway would be in both directions. That is consistent with the town's standards for being able to see safely the travel distance.

1285
02:38:42,000 --> 02:38:59,000
I heard a number of things about conditions and roads and glare and things of that nature, but I think if we're driving anywhere, there's always the potential for other constraints to impair drivers and their vision. This is not one of those issues.

1286
02:38:59,000 --> 02:39:22,000
When we come into the detention and runoff, obviously there's well-engineered design mechanisms to be able to control runoff, and they're poor mechanisms. We've worked with Lee and Braz on a number of projects here in town and hold them in high esteem. And we've heard that from the Commission as well as the Council when.

1287
02:39:22,000 --> 02:39:41,000
projects that have used their services, and certainly the review and the town has done of those designs would say that the tension associated with this project and runoff is appropriate for the level of access water that would be caused by the impervious constraint.

1288
02:39:41,000 --> 02:39:44,000
impervious materials.

1289
02:39:44,000 --> 02:40:05,000
For construction access, dirt and debris, we do have a number of city standards that relate to where vehicles can be parked, where the and maintenance for dirt and what Bmps would need to be in place. Those have been reviewed and approved associated with this project by the town's third party reviewers as well as town staff.

1290
02:40:05,000 --> 02:40:26,000
And will be monitored throughout construction. The slope of the drive specifically is related to the nature and the topography of this particular site. There could be additional requests to have increased grading and and cut associated with this to reduce the.

1291
02:40:26,000 --> 02:40:51,000
The slope of that driveway. But I believe this applicant was trying to be able to maintain compliance with our grading policy to the best extent possible, and it's a typical variance that we see for most development projects. As it comes to the driveway orientation. Again, it's controlled by a number of standards, and certainly the fire district is one of those controlling agencies when it comes to vehicle access.

1292
02:40:51,000 --> 02:41:03,000
And we defer in most projects to their requirements as it relates to access to the site. And that's not unique to this project. It's typical for projects within town.

1293
02:41:03,000 --> 02:41:21,000
Um, when it comes to the trees, our code has a preference for development over the trees themselves. If we're talking about the trees will be removed, typically for every tree removed, staff can require up to four trees of a 15 gallon variety, 24 inches in height.

1294
02:41:21,000 --> 02:41:38,000
Um, so there will be some allotment associated that with when landscape screening comes in for the project to be able to make sure that any disturbances associated with views and.

1295
02:41:38,000 --> 02:42:03,000
The removal of the trees in general, that there is a sensible number of trees put back to be able to make sure the performance aligns with the the current conditions of the project. We heard comments as it related to the septic pump. The septic pump is an underground utility. The town has shown an indifference as it relates to utilities that are underground that are within setbacks.

1296
02:42:03,000 --> 02:42:19,000
As it related to the penalties in particular for the property as it relates to violations of of the Williamson Act, those would be violations that would be occurring if there was not compatible use, and that there would have been.

1297
02:42:19,000 --> 02:42:28,000
No consideration for compatibility before the structures were introduced, and that's when you would find yourself in violation of a potential of our… of the contract.

1298
02:42:28,000 --> 02:42:47,000
And the contracts are looked at from an annual perspective to be able to see how they're performing associated with the intent of the contract. That responsibility has been for the portion, or the majority of the portion of the Williamson Act held by the county.

1299
02:42:47,000 --> 02:43:09,000
That has just recently transferred to the to the town. When I hear that there's a lack of regulations, we talked about the ordinance already and 616 that does set a local standard that is not codified within our municipal code, which does make it a much more difficult.

1300
02:43:09,000 --> 02:43:27,000
standard to find, but it relies heavily on the State regulations, not any local regulations, and staff actually heard a number of suggestions for having local designations of which staff would support. We heard some comments as it related to the value of the property and how it would be affected, and what the Williamson Act property.

1301
02:43:27,000 --> 02:43:46,000
designation does to that value. This property owner brought a property, and I heard $765,000. Well, that's the market value of the property because of the encumbrances associated with this property. It's not a $2 million property, not a $3 million property. If it was a property that was ripe for development, it would have been sold for that price.

1302
02:43:46,000 --> 02:44:02,000
And so, when we talk about what will happen as it relates to how the Williamson Act will affect this property, certainly design compatibility is one of those things that we're concerned with, and the performance of the overall contract. That's why in the staff report, we recommend that.

1303
02:44:02,000 --> 02:44:23,000
We look at those things very specifically, and what I would say is that this owner has tried to balance the intent of the compatibility with the Liamson Act, with the neighbors concerns, and has adjusted the ag use to their detriment, clearly in this conversation, as that there's a disbelief as to the ag use and its primary use on the property.

1304
02:44:23,000 --> 02:44:39,000
We do believe that there is a question as it relates to non-renewal, and whether the town would find this still compatible with the contract when it was entered in 1972, which is why we actually asked that the contract be looked at, and that there be a recommendation for the Planning Commission.

1305
02:44:39,000 --> 02:44:51,000
Above and beyond just compatibility. We think that's a best practice, even though we don't have a local standard that specifically would regulate those levels of compatibility above and beyond what state law has within them.

1306
02:44:51,000 --> 02:45:05,000
Um, when we look at the total area from the development perspective, we had, uh, I think an MDA associated with somewhere just under 8,000 square foot. This is a 1.16 acre property that has, um…

1307
02:45:05,000 --> 02:45:21,000
A number of steep slopes that will be protected by opsisace that were already protected by open space. And when you look at the total law coverage, we're talking about a homestead that is roughly 15% of the property, so by no means is it overly covering the lot.

1308
02:45:21,000 --> 02:45:41,000
And in some instances, we've seen properties with much greater areas and much greater development associated with them, even within the Williamson Act properties. So with that, there's a number of standards here that have been, I think, talked about and have been reviewed by staff and are comfortable with.

1309
02:45:41,000 --> 02:45:58,000
the project and the variances that have been requested. And so I just wanted to give that as some background as what all property owners have as rights, and then how the Williamson Act affects this particular property. And with that, I'd let the applicant respond to anything that they wish to address.

1310
02:45:58,000 --> 02:45:59,000
Thank

1311
02:45:59,000 --> 02:46:00,000
you. Thank you.

1312
02:46:00,000 --> 02:46:03,000
Okay.

1313
02:46:03,000 --> 02:46:20,000
Now let's ask the applicant if they wish to respond, provide any responses to the comments from the public or other discussions so far. Naveen, would you like to represent the response, or would you like one of your.

1314
02:46:20,000 --> 02:46:22,000
Consultants to do that.

1315
02:46:22,000 --> 02:46:28,000
I appreciate it. Appreciate it.

1316
02:46:28,000 --> 02:46:31,000
Can I… am I still audible?

1317
02:46:31,000 --> 02:46:32,000
Yes, I hear you.

1318
02:46:32,000 --> 02:46:44,000
Okay, great. So let me get started and then I will ask my team to add to me as well after me.

1319
02:46:44,000 --> 02:46:45,000
Yes.

1320
02:46:45,000 --> 02:46:46,000
For your information, your team is right here near the podium and already.

1321
02:46:46,000 --> 02:46:59,000
Yes. Yep, yep, got it. I mean, the only thing I would like to add to what Jay, you know, just you know added all the details, you know, and we've been working on this project for about 2 years now

1322
02:46:59,000 --> 02:47:09,000
We understand it's a complicated project, and we have… that's why we have hired the best of the, you know, best of the best to, you know, to make this project happen.

1323
02:47:09,000 --> 02:47:25,000
From the architect, you know, all the way to the civil engineering and everybody else. And at every point, you know, in this 2 years we have been working very closely with the staff, you know, making changes as you know for the recommendations like Jay just described

1324
02:47:25,000 --> 02:47:44,000
Now, also, I think there's a little bit of confusion. We did modify some of the ag use cases like Jay mentioned just now. We don't have 100 chickens, for example, that were there originally. It's reduced to like a very, very small number. You know, and the plants also have been reduced to a small restricted area, you know, things like that

1325
02:47:44,000 --> 02:47:58,000
So I just want to clarify that piece a little bit. Also, I think the location of the house and the driveway was a big concern, and I will let Pete talk about that more

1326
02:47:58,000 --> 02:48:11,000
But I do want to make sure that this was the only location possible that's buildable in that particular lot. And a lot of discussion went and debate and, you know, brainstorming went in with John Chow and everybody

1327
02:48:11,000 --> 02:48:14,000
Before we finalize that.

1328
02:48:14,000 --> 02:48:22,000
I hope, I think it's not us against them at this point. It's more like how we can make this project built

1329
02:48:22,000 --> 02:48:31,000
To, you know, so that it's good for everybody, right? I think that that's my hope here as we move forward.

1330
02:48:31,000 --> 02:48:33,000
Thank you.

1331
02:48:33,000 --> 02:48:41,000
Mm-hmm. There's three more minutes. If you'd like to respond with any other information. I think really brief.

1332
02:48:41,000 --> 02:48:46,000
I think really briefly, this is Chip Jessup again. First of all.

1333
02:48:46,000 --> 02:48:59,000
Jay described this property better and responded to all the comments way better than any of the rest of us could do that. I thought that was really excellent. One of the things that.

1334
02:48:59,000 --> 02:49:15,000
I guess Carol asked about was, can we call it the retaining ones? Absolutely. That's essentially, you know, we want a man, we want to fit in with what's going on. I do think that it's appropriate for people.

1335
02:49:15,000 --> 02:49:25,000
Maybe to reiterate some of the conversation about grading and grace, because that is, you know, obviously something that people can be concerned about.

1336
02:49:25,000 --> 02:49:37,000
Pete, if you could mention placement as well, and somebody else mentioned placement of the septic, whether it's in the 30 foot septex or not. I can

1337
02:49:37,000 --> 02:49:41,000
speak first to what is allowed in the setbacks, which is.

1338
02:49:41,000 --> 02:49:58,000
Excuse me, Pete, Carlene and Lillian Brace again talking about for this environmental health. The system will be below the ground. It's not a pool equipment structure above the ground. It's all subterranean equipment in vaults. So the town does allow for utilities, and so does the county.

1339
02:49:58,000 --> 02:50:13,000
To be located in the setbacks when they're below ground. When they're above ground, they are relocated outside of the setbacks. As transformers have been coming up lately as well. And so the septic tank is placed in an area. I don't think we're removing trees for the tank.

1340
02:50:13,000 --> 02:50:28,000
There are retaining walls adjacent to another reason the trees are being removed, but not the tank being placed there. We picked that location because it was the flattest of all the areas below the house where we could place it at, working with environmental health and the setbacks.

1341
02:50:28,000 --> 02:50:31,000
I think it's the leach field, probably, where the

1342
02:50:31,000 --> 02:50:32,000
right. It's

1343
02:50:32,000 --> 02:50:33,000
the tank and

1344
02:50:33,000 --> 02:50:37,000
the leach field. You pump it up to the pump it up to the upper area, so there's

1345
02:50:37,000 --> 02:50:43,000
a blood-grade tank that has storage that actually has a factor of safety of one and a half days, so if the power does go out.

1346
02:50:43,000 --> 02:51:00,000
That there's extra capacity for storage per the requirements of environmental health design manual. It is pumped up to the upper part of the site, and where it's dissipated in shallow systems on the upper part of the site. So all of the leaching of the septic is in the upper part of the site above the house.

1347
02:51:00,000 --> 02:51:06,000
And the leech is also underground and may be in the setbacks. Correct. Got it.

1348
02:51:06,000 --> 02:51:07,000
There

1349
02:51:07,000 --> 02:51:17,000
we are being mindful of trees that are up there. We have setback to trees, set back to the fault, setbacks to property lines, set back to steep slopes. So we really have one area to put the leash

1350
02:51:17,000 --> 02:51:22,000
field in. But there are 2 large heritage oaks in the leach field which are being removed.

1351
02:51:22,000 --> 02:51:23,000
Correct, because

1352
02:51:23,000 --> 02:51:32,000
that is the only area to put the leach field. Okay. And can you put the house up there because the house cannot be located in that area, given

1353
02:51:32,000 --> 02:51:38,000
the seismic. Yes. Can you speak a little bit about the location of the house and the placement of the house, which?

1354
02:51:38,000 --> 02:51:44,000
Attends the placement of the driveway. Why was this spot chosen?

1355
02:51:44,000 --> 02:51:45,000
I

1356
02:51:45,000 --> 02:52:01,000
would have to defer to the architect for the house placement. I did work with them on multiple iterations of driveway designs based on slope terrains, based on access points, based on establishing an area of the house, the backup area of the garages and the required parking spaces.

1357
02:52:01,000 --> 02:52:11,000
As part of it as well. So that was… I don't think it was specific to I want it there. I think as we started figuring out how to get to that an area

1358
02:52:11,000 --> 02:52:16,000
that could be developed. And is it you who looks at the safety concerns of the driveway?

1359
02:52:16,000 --> 02:52:19,000
The sight distances. Okay. I was the one that

1360
02:52:19,000 --> 02:52:32,000
did the placement working with town staff and working, uh, reviewing it. There's actually an exhibit that will be in the documents that I prepared as part of the AASHTO assessment for the line of sight. Okay, thank you.

1361
02:52:32,000 --> 02:52:43,000
And for the retention system, I did want to mention we did design with a factor of safety of 1.4. So there's not only the requirement, but an extra capacity requirement as well. So how

1362
02:52:43,000 --> 02:52:46,000
many year flood water calculations did you do? For the

1363
02:52:46,000 --> 02:52:47,000
town standards

1364
02:52:47,000 --> 02:52:57,000
of their drainage manual. I don't want to say it's 10, 25, or 50. It's their manual that we're complying with as part of it. I don't want to speculate on a rainfall intensity.

1365
02:52:57,000 --> 02:53:02,000
Because I think it's a storage requirement as required by town staff.

1366
02:53:02,000 --> 02:53:03,000
You know, I'd

1367
02:53:03,000 --> 02:53:05,000
be happy to give you a moment if you have

1368
02:53:05,000 --> 02:53:13,000
questions. I apologize, I just want to answer your questions. Any other questions? I'm happy to answer them. But again, I should mention also the walls are all built with pure and grade beam.

1369
02:53:13,000 --> 02:53:25,000
Not slide foundation, so they're going to be anchored into the bedrock. I'm not a structural engineer, but I'm saying when people are talking about concerns of soil movement, I don't think you can ask for a stronger wall. Pier and Grey being anchored into the bedrock. Okay,

1370
02:53:25,000 --> 02:53:30,000
thank you. I'd be happy to give you a moment if you had anything else to add. Sure, yeah, I want

1371
02:53:30,000 --> 02:53:35,000
to speak for the location of the house. If someone can pull up the cyclone, I can explain the.

1372
02:53:35,000 --> 02:53:50,000
why we chose the specific location, because that's the only spot we have because of the building envelope setback. 1st of all. So 40 feet on each side. It's in the front yard and 30 feet on the side and rear.

1373
02:53:50,000 --> 02:53:56,000
But and we also have those really steep slopes in the back, and the slope easement.

1374
02:53:56,000 --> 02:54:09,000
In the front, so… and the fault setback. It's a 50ft setback. So, like, really, we're we're just touching the borderline of those setbacks to meet the…

1375
02:54:09,000 --> 02:54:24,000
The design criteria that the owner gave us for the for this lot. I mean, this is we're trying to accommodate a family of actually 5. You know there. It's a multi-generational home. So it's not just.

1376
02:54:24,000 --> 02:54:42,000
the family of 3. So that's why we were using the maximum footprint as possible to to design this this actually it's only a $4,600 square feet home with the ADU and SB 9, which is a lot by the State.

1377
02:54:42,000 --> 02:54:43,000
Thank

1378
02:54:43,000 --> 02:54:46,000
you very much.

1379
02:54:46,000 --> 02:54:51,000
Also, Simon and Craig, do you have anything to add based on the discussions?

1380
02:54:51,000 --> 02:55:00,000
On the geoperspective.

1381
02:55:00,000 --> 02:55:08,000
Yeah, Craig Harwood here with quantum. The questions were raised about soil erosion.

1382
02:55:08,000 --> 02:55:13,000
Our geotechnical report provides recommendations on how to deal with.

1383
02:55:13,000 --> 02:55:30,000
erosion in the long term, and especially during construction. And so that's incorporated into the plans. We review those plans. And during construction, we would be out… a representative would be out there doing inspections and seeing to it that the recommendations are followed.

1384
02:55:30,000 --> 02:55:32,000
Thank you.

1385
02:55:32,000 --> 02:55:37,000
And the geotechnical engineer, and let's wrap this up kind of quickly. Yeah, with regard to

1386
02:55:37,000 --> 02:55:48,000
slope stability, that was obviously mentioned several times. There's an existing cut slope along the road there that's quite steep and tall, and that's been there for probably 60 years.

1387
02:55:48,000 --> 02:56:02,000
It's in good condition. It hasn't… there's no evidence of any movement or failure on it. And so that's a good example of what the future would look like on any similar kinds of cuts in there.

1388
02:56:02,000 --> 02:56:03,000
I see.

1389
02:56:03,000 --> 02:56:08,000
Thank you. I have a question for the applicants. Yes, in fact, it…

1390
02:56:08,000 --> 02:56:13,000
This is now the time for clarifying questions from commissioners. Yeah. Yeah, I just

1391
02:56:13,000 --> 02:56:21,000
have a question here. It's basically the big one has been ignored is the ADU. I mean, the ADU is a two-story.

1392
02:56:21,000 --> 02:56:25,000
detached ADU. And the thing is, when I look at my municipal

1393
02:56:25,000 --> 02:56:26,000
codes, you

1394
02:56:26,000 --> 02:56:33,000
know, we we give incentives to staying out of the setbacks, but the maximum building height, if it's detached, is.

1395
02:56:33,000 --> 02:56:37,000
Basically, it's one story and 19 feet.

1396
02:56:37,000 --> 02:56:41,000
and I've got and I've got the codes here. Do you have

1397
02:56:41,000 --> 02:56:42,000
any comments

1398
02:56:42,000 --> 02:56:44,000
on this? Oh, about the Edu.

1399
02:56:44,000 --> 02:56:48,000
Sorry, I was talking to the neighbor.

1400
02:56:48,000 --> 02:56:49,000
Brigitte, can you

1401
02:56:49,000 --> 02:56:53,000
repeat the question? Yes. You know, I'm.

1402
02:56:53,000 --> 02:56:54,000
But I…

1403
02:56:54,000 --> 02:56:56,000
Yeah, this is

1404
02:56:56,000 --> 02:56:57,000
probably for

1405
02:56:57,000 --> 02:56:58,000
staff,

1406
02:56:58,000 --> 02:56:59,000
right? We can address this. Yes.

1407
02:56:59,000 --> 02:57:00,000
I think the question was for Jay, actually. Yeah, I see that the question was meant… directed to Jay. Let's let Jay answer that first too.

1408
02:57:00,000 --> 02:57:01,000
Yes.

1409
02:57:01,000 --> 02:57:14,000
So based on, we did touch on this in the the June 8th meeting staff's view is that it is an attached adu because it's attached by the the covered porch.

1410
02:57:14,000 --> 02:57:17,000
So there's that physical attachment between the residents and we mentioned

1411
02:57:17,000 --> 02:57:33,000
at that meeting that that's not the way that we interpreted attach means is a shared common wall. It's not a walkway or a patio. That's the interpretation that we stated at the June 8th meeting as well, and that's why I asked this question, because.

1412
02:57:33,000 --> 02:57:36,000
It does go against our…

1413
02:57:36,000 --> 02:57:43,000
incentive, you know, the idea of adus are to be affordable housing, accessory dwellings.

1414
02:57:43,000 --> 02:57:48,000
not to be in… if it's attached, it's attached with a common wall. I

1415
02:57:48,000 --> 02:57:52,000
I I do appreciate the planning commission's interpretation, but I do want.

1416
02:57:52,000 --> 02:58:01,000
I think we could take that feedback, but I do not want this to be part of the decision-making tonight, as the ADU and SB 9 are ministerial.

1417
02:58:01,000 --> 02:58:12,000
And they're just shown as references to what is the master plan on the site. But the focus and the discretion that the Planning Commission has would be for the new residents.

1418
02:58:12,000 --> 02:58:13,000
I see.

1419
02:58:13,000 --> 02:58:28,000
And then one other issue I had a question for, because one of my big concerns, too, is that the glass roof is a huge skylight of 20 feet, 8 inches by 14 feet, 9 inches, and that intrudes upon dark skies policy.

1420
02:58:28,000 --> 02:58:44,000
Typically, we in the past, when we've looked at project, we make people reduce something that huge. I know you mentioned, you know, putting shades, auto shades. But that's something that we have no control over. And I know we had other projects on.

1421
02:58:44,000 --> 02:58:56,000
page mill and Altamont, exactly. Well, we had them reduce the size of their skylights because of dark sky compliance, and this is huge.

1422
02:58:56,000 --> 02:59:00,000
And I mentioned this also in the June 8th meeting as well. So this is not new.

1423
02:59:00,000 --> 02:59:01,000
uh, yo,

1424
02:59:01,000 --> 02:59:03,000
we did reduce the heights. Yeah, but then

1425
02:59:03,000 --> 02:59:08,000
we also mentioned the size of it as well. Right. This is something we can

1426
02:59:08,000 --> 02:59:19,000
discuss with the homeowner. I think this is not something that is detrimental to the project, that they must have such a huge skylight, but it is because the size of the courtyard that they want to maintain.

1427
02:59:19,000 --> 02:59:30,000
and have some sort of natural light coming down that's, you know, in line with the size of the courtyard. But I don't think that's something that we can… we cannot work on. Well,

1428
02:59:30,000 --> 02:59:31,000
that skylight is

1429
02:59:31,000 --> 02:59:32,000
not part

1430
02:59:32,000 --> 02:59:35,000
of the… it's the interior part of the living area.

1431
02:59:35,000 --> 02:59:41,000
So to me, that's not a courtyard. Courtyard to me is something exterior like the outdoor patio. Right.

1432
02:59:41,000 --> 02:59:47,000
Let me explain. So that's near the South Indian style home that we went after. And that is…

1433
02:59:47,000 --> 03:00:02,000
It was supposed to be a natural courtyard with without skylight, and to mimic that look, we created a skylight to provide natural light coming down. So that's when I said it's a courtyard, but it's not. It's not a courtyard. You're right. So we just.

1434
03:00:02,000 --> 03:00:07,000
Which is something that we can certainly work on the sides of the skylight

1435
03:00:07,000 --> 03:00:12,000
that is not. And the mechanical shade covers the entire skylight.

1436
03:00:12,000 --> 03:00:14,000
The mechanical shape?

1437
03:00:14,000 --> 03:00:16,000
Uh, Naveen, I think, yeah, the homeowner was…

1438
03:00:16,000 --> 03:00:24,000
Yeah, that's correct. I think the laurel shades that we have included in the document covers the entire

1439
03:00:24,000 --> 03:00:28,000
glass

1440
03:00:28,000 --> 03:00:34,000
Covers the entire glass. Got it. Thank you. Correct. Yes. Are there any other clarifying questions? Yeah, I do have

1441
03:00:34,000 --> 03:00:35,000
another from

1442
03:00:35,000 --> 03:00:45,000
the staff, actually. You know, when we talked about the 30% slope in that patio corner, is that included in the variance list? Because that requires, does not require a variance as well? It doesn't require a

1443
03:00:45,000 --> 03:00:49,000
variance. There's a bit of nuance in the town's regulations.

1444
03:00:49,000 --> 03:01:01,000
So, the municipal code does not prohibit development on 30% slopes. It goes down to a general plan policy, which says to reduce development in excessive slouch as much as feasible.

1445
03:01:01,000 --> 03:01:04,000
So the Planning Commission.

1446
03:01:04,000 --> 03:01:11,000
uh, would need to find that development is concentrated as much as possible in more gentler slopes.

1447
03:01:11,000 --> 03:01:16,000
But it… there's no prohibition on 30% slopes and greater.

1448
03:01:16,000 --> 03:01:30,000
If… if the town wanted to make that a development standard, it could amend the municipal code to fulfill the general plan, but presently it is not a development standard.

1449
03:01:30,000 --> 03:01:34,000
I thought we had done variances for. So that's for

1450
03:01:34,000 --> 03:01:36,000
not for the home. It's for…

1451
03:01:36,000 --> 03:01:43,000
development outside of homes, like pools and other such. Yeah, since it's a patio and it's

1452
03:01:43,000 --> 03:01:46,000
not liveable space, patio pools, and so on.

1453
03:01:46,000 --> 03:01:47,000
That's why

1454
03:01:47,000 --> 03:01:50,000
the triangles are only on outdoor areas. Exactly.

1455
03:01:50,000 --> 03:01:51,000
Exactly.

1456
03:01:51,000 --> 03:01:54,000
Well, thank you for clarifying for that. Okay, thank you.

1457
03:01:54,000 --> 03:01:57,000
Alright, I think I have…

1458
03:01:57,000 --> 03:02:02,000
Yeah, basic exhaust in my list for the time being.

1459
03:02:02,000 --> 03:02:03,000
any.

1460
03:02:03,000 --> 03:02:05,000
So I'm no question. All right.

1461
03:02:05,000 --> 03:02:07,000
Why don't we

1462
03:02:07,000 --> 03:02:12,000
close the public hearing, and we'll bring this back to.

1463
03:02:12,000 --> 03:02:27,000
The Planning Commission for discussion. There are a lot of issues here. And the first thing I just wanted to review before we get into it tooth and nail is the order of events here.

1464
03:02:27,000 --> 03:02:42,000
My own take is that it is still the case that the Williamson Act compatibility determination is kind of the pacing item. Yeah. And, um…

1465
03:02:42,000 --> 03:02:58,000
And I do think it would be good to offer the applicant feedback, and you know, maybe as far as approval or denial of the project as if it wasn't in.

1466
03:02:58,000 --> 03:03:14,000
a Williamson Act. I'm not sure that's that is what I want to discuss with you guys. So do we want to just look at the Williamson Act first, or do we want to look at it as if it wasn't in the Williamson Act?

1467
03:03:14,000 --> 03:03:27,000
First, and look at it as a zoning issue, and then look at Williamson. And wait, let me answer one other question, because I have a question which was that after that there's going to be a question of.

1468
03:03:27,000 --> 03:03:44,000
Does the town really want to have properties like this in Williamson Act and developing standards for how the town wants to react to Williamson Act, especially now that we're responsible for looking after Williamson Act properties.

1469
03:03:44,000 --> 03:04:02,000
Instead of the county doing that. I think that is a separate step to us. I don't think we need to focus on that right now. I think that is also just something that we make recommendations about, because we don't decide those things. City Council would decide those things.

1470
03:04:02,000 --> 03:04:10,000
So among these topics, how do you feel about the order of events here? So there are two ways of looking at it.

1471
03:04:10,000 --> 03:04:17,000
Do you want this to finish in 15 minutes or two hours? Okay. The two

1472
03:04:17,000 --> 03:04:19,000
hour

1473
03:04:19,000 --> 03:04:21,000
approach is go over everything.

1474
03:04:21,000 --> 03:04:28,000
Of which 1 hour and 45 minutes do not apply. Today, maybe apply later.

1475
03:04:28,000 --> 03:04:37,000
And the other way is focus on the most important part, and see if that at least gets to a conclusion for.

1476
03:04:37,000 --> 03:04:40,000
The project as it's today.

1477
03:04:40,000 --> 03:04:51,000
Giving an example, that 15 minutes is exactly the point you brought up first, that the most important thing is to talk about Williamson Act.

1478
03:04:51,000 --> 03:05:02,000
Now, what about Williamson Act is what we have to discuss in that 15 minutes, because clearly, that also is not in our purview alone. It has to go to the Council.

1479
03:05:02,000 --> 03:05:08,000
So, if I had to select, I would say, let's only talk about that.

1480
03:05:08,000 --> 03:05:15,000
Figure out exactly what we want to communicate to the council as to our viewpoint.

1481
03:05:15,000 --> 03:05:22,000
and leave it at that, because we are going to be back some other day.

1482
03:05:22,000 --> 03:05:34,000
to look at all the other things one more time, and based on today's feedback, I have no idea how maybe the applicant goes and changes things.

1483
03:05:34,000 --> 03:05:35,000
Right.

1484
03:05:35,000 --> 03:05:38,000
So that's… I agree. I think the top issue here is compatibility

1485
03:05:38,000 --> 03:05:52,000
of Williamson Act, because depending on what gets determined at city council level with our recommendation to city council level determines how we approach this site development. And that's, I think, the point that Sue well she made.

1486
03:05:52,000 --> 03:06:05,000
In Santa Clara County, you wouldn't even have a site development until the Williamson Act is resolved, whether it's a non-renewal, it's a cancellation. If it's whatever, because the thing is, too, if you file a non-renewal.

1487
03:06:05,000 --> 03:06:21,000
Okay, so that happens. And then what happens? Do you take path 1, like John O'Connell said, or path two? You know, there's still other procedural things that we're not exactly knowledgeable on, and I agree, we need to really focus on the compatibility issues.

1488
03:06:21,000 --> 03:06:22,000
I have

1489
03:06:22,000 --> 03:06:23,000
one more

1490
03:06:23,000 --> 03:06:37,000
little caveat, too, which is interesting. As part of… I've got a six-item list for non-compatibility that, as I've been delving into these issues, like all of us, we've spent a lot of hours working on this.

1491
03:06:37,000 --> 03:06:55,000
Is that the fact that SB9s are not allowed on Williamson Act. That was kind of a thing that I discovered as I was looking at other municipalities and places, because the 2 programs don't have… are totally polar opposite goals. One is preserving.

1492
03:06:55,000 --> 03:07:12,000
you know, agricultural lands preserving open space conservation. The other one is and staying away from urbanization. The other one, Sb. 9 is promoting urbanization and more construction. So they have polar opposite goals that conflict.

1493
03:07:12,000 --> 03:07:27,000
And there are counties out there that don't permit that at all, which actually adds another caveat. So that's why I say, if we look at the site development, there are little gotchas everywhere, so we really have to focus on the Williamson Act incompatibility first and foremost, because.

1494
03:07:27,000 --> 03:07:31,000
Depending what happens there will kind of help.

1495
03:07:31,000 --> 03:07:34,000
direct what happens at site development. So I

1496
03:07:34,000 --> 03:07:47,000
resonate with both of what you're saying, but I'd like to get some feedback from Jay and the team, and maybe Claire on the approach that we're describing.

1497
03:07:47,000 --> 03:07:48,000
Well,

1498
03:07:48,000 --> 03:07:52,000
it's pretty simple. City Council needs to decide on ways to act here. No, no, no,

1499
03:07:52,000 --> 03:07:56,000
I know how you feel about this, but I know,

1500
03:07:56,000 --> 03:08:04,000
but before that, let me also put my view. Yes, I do not want the staff to tell me, let's talk about the site development and.

1501
03:08:04,000 --> 03:08:09,000
Once that is blessed, we'll talk about the Williamson Act later. Sorry, I'm not going to go there.

1502
03:08:09,000 --> 03:08:19,000
I want Williamson Act to be resolved first. Then it comes back to Planning Commission for site development. I'm not talking about site development approval today at all.

1503
03:08:19,000 --> 03:08:22,000
So, I hear you?

1504
03:08:22,000 --> 03:08:25,000
And… and in addition, the reason I

1505
03:08:25,000 --> 03:08:34,000
wanted to say that is because I got hints from earlier staff's commentary of the reverse. Yes.

1506
03:08:34,000 --> 03:08:50,000
I think that the applicant has put in an awful lot of work in response to our first meeting, and I want to acknowledge that I think they have rectified everything we identified, and maybe there's some more things to identify.

1507
03:08:50,000 --> 03:09:00,000
But I do want to say that they did a job of trying to improve that situation.

1508
03:09:00,000 --> 03:09:06,000
And I hear what you're saying. I'm gonna take a little bit of prerogative here to… I agree with Rajiv. You know,

1509
03:09:06,000 --> 03:09:07,000
I don't…

1510
03:09:07,000 --> 03:09:08,000
let me say, I don't disagree.

1511
03:09:08,000 --> 03:09:11,000
Yeah, you want to keep it to be

1512
03:09:11,000 --> 03:09:12,000
15 minutes

1513
03:09:12,000 --> 03:09:15,000
or 2 hours. No, no, no, this is perfect. I don't disagree. It

1514
03:09:15,000 --> 03:09:25,000
is not going to be the two hours route, but I want to get some feedback from staff because I respect how much work they've put into this as well.

1515
03:09:25,000 --> 03:09:28,000
Jay, would you like to?

1516
03:09:28,000 --> 03:09:33,000
say anything in support of working on the Williamson Act first?

1517
03:09:33,000 --> 03:09:35,000
Yeah, I I certainly agree with that approach.

1518
03:09:35,000 --> 03:09:36,000
All

1519
03:09:36,000 --> 03:09:38,000
right. Done deal. So so if

1520
03:09:38,000 --> 03:09:45,000
I had to quickly, you know, comment on it, right? We already talked about the site development permit.

1521
03:09:45,000 --> 03:09:50,000
For now, we can wait till we get a clear.

1522
03:09:50,000 --> 03:09:55,000
Indication about the Williamson Act, right? In the Williamson Act also.

1523
03:09:55,000 --> 03:10:01,000
I think the most important thing which I did not hear from staff report.

1524
03:10:01,000 --> 03:10:07,000
was the fact, till the end was that.

1525
03:10:07,000 --> 03:10:16,000
Until recently, this was in the purview of the county, and only recently the county has been pushing it to the different towns.

1526
03:10:16,000 --> 03:10:19,000
Now, if that has been the case.

1527
03:10:19,000 --> 03:10:24,000
The logical thing for any town to do is.

1528
03:10:24,000 --> 03:10:27,000
Deer in the… you know…

1529
03:10:27,000 --> 03:10:32,000
headlights, right? You have no clue somebody has pushed something on you.

1530
03:10:32,000 --> 03:10:40,000
What is the first thing you do? If something comes up, you go back and look at the county rules and decide what to

1531
03:10:40,000 --> 03:10:53,000
do since you have none. That's not exactly what was pushed back. What was pushed back was the annual survey of how things are going, not the rules, the county's rules never applied here. Never applied.

1532
03:10:53,000 --> 03:10:54,000
But what

1533
03:10:54,000 --> 03:11:03,000
I'm saying is when you don't have anything, you go to your near neighbors and look at what they have. We do

1534
03:11:03,000 --> 03:11:04,000
have

1535
03:11:04,000 --> 03:11:07,000
something. We don't have anything. I'm not okay

1536
03:11:07,000 --> 03:11:08,000
with the

1537
03:11:08,000 --> 03:11:10,000
contract. I'm talking about.

1538
03:11:10,000 --> 03:11:17,000
What is the compatibility and development rules on Williamson Act parcels?

1539
03:11:17,000 --> 03:11:26,000
We don't have any guidelines. No, I agree. I think that we should… We don't have any guidelines. We don't have any policies. However, the county does.

1540
03:11:26,000 --> 03:11:28,000
The county does.

1541
03:11:28,000 --> 03:11:32,000
Okay, so we don't have any. The county does. That very well

1542
03:11:32,000 --> 03:11:43,000
may be something we could recommend. Just adopt the county's rules. So that doesn't affect the fact that these folks already have a contract. No, no, I agree about the contract,

1543
03:11:43,000 --> 03:11:46,000
but all I'm trying to say is.

1544
03:11:46,000 --> 03:11:56,000
This is what I would like for us to agree and send as a proposal to Council, because we need to tell the Council.

1545
03:11:56,000 --> 03:11:58,000
What is it that…

1546
03:11:58,000 --> 03:12:03,000
They should be looking at. So, in my opinion, what they need to be doing is…

1547
03:12:03,000 --> 03:12:17,000
Are you talking about it in respect to this property, or are you talking about it, generally speaking, when we see Williamson Act, this is where we think Williamson Act should be, this is where we think it shouldn't be. To me, I completely agree.

1548
03:12:17,000 --> 03:12:18,000
For

1549
03:12:18,000 --> 03:12:27,000
the general Williamson Act parcels in town. we need the council to have a proper.

1550
03:12:27,000 --> 03:12:33,000
compatibility, determination rule set or guidelines.

1551
03:12:33,000 --> 03:12:34,000
Along with… Well, okay,

1552
03:12:34,000 --> 03:12:52,000
I think we have to be careful. Compatibility is with the contract. The contract already exists, and we have to evaluate it on that. Separately, we need policies for how to handle Williamson Act. And by the way, the guy that told me first about the need for policies.

1553
03:12:52,000 --> 03:12:53,000
was J.

1554
03:12:53,000 --> 03:13:04,000
No, no, all I'm trying to say is it's not only about Williamson Act, but how and what are the guidelines and policies for developing.

1555
03:13:04,000 --> 03:13:14,000
Williamson Act properties for other than their uses, which is generally agriculture or open space.

1556
03:13:14,000 --> 03:13:15,000
Yeah, that's the bar,

1557
03:13:15,000 --> 03:13:19,000
which is the most important part, which needs to be…

1558
03:13:19,000 --> 03:13:36,000
Okay, so but let's just take a moment and assume that that's where we're gonna go. We're gonna ask staff to start putting together policies for a better roadmap for how to do Williamson. But what do we do today? Okay, well, let me

1559
03:13:36,000 --> 03:13:38,000
start then. So, so,

1560
03:13:38,000 --> 03:13:40,000
so on this property.

1561
03:13:40,000 --> 03:13:43,000
My view is, until we have that.

1562
03:13:43,000 --> 03:13:50,000
There is nothing we can do about site development, because we need that guidelines.

1563
03:13:50,000 --> 03:13:51,000
To apply to

1564
03:13:51,000 --> 03:14:05,000
this property. No, but what we need right now, though, Rajiv, is the fact that we need to come up with a non-compatible… to make a recommendation to city council so they can rule on this compatibility non-compatibility. For example, you know, other municipalities.

1565
03:14:05,000 --> 03:14:12,000
Riverside County, for example, anytime you change anything on a Williamson Act property.

1566
03:14:12,000 --> 03:14:22,000
no matter what, it basically nullifies the contract, and there is no grandfathering, and especially if there's no residents that exist on a property. But you're talking about policies

1567
03:14:22,000 --> 03:14:25,000
for the future for how we do… But

1568
03:14:25,000 --> 03:14:27,000
the thing is here, too.

1569
03:14:27,000 --> 03:14:29,000
You know, it puts away…

1570
03:14:29,000 --> 03:14:45,000
The contract is what it is on this property, but by them changing and putting all these other things, they're taking away the focus of the open space conservation that's been there. I know the talking agriculture, but there's no grandfather. I

1571
03:14:45,000 --> 03:14:46,000
agree. I

1572
03:14:46,000 --> 03:14:50,000
could not find… I could not develop a finding that said.

1573
03:14:50,000 --> 03:14:53,000
Agriculture was the primary use. No, here it's open space.

1574
03:14:53,000 --> 03:15:10,000
And actually, you know, even… Can I tell you one thing before you go further? On our general plan in the land use element there, this is on the map that's all shaded with the little hash mark showing that this is the open space conservation area per our land use.

1575
03:15:10,000 --> 03:15:26,000
On, um, in the general plan, the back portion of it, which is the area where, you know, open space play… so it was just interesting to see that we do have that designated even in our general plan, this particular property. I'm trying to tease apart the issue.

1576
03:15:26,000 --> 03:15:27,000
Can I tell

1577
03:15:27,000 --> 03:15:28,000
you about another compatible issues? The other thing…

1578
03:15:28,000 --> 03:15:30,000
So, Chair, if I

1579
03:15:30,000 --> 03:15:34,000
I'm sorry, if I may add, I just wanted to offer some

1580
03:15:34,000 --> 03:15:38,000
some discussion points, or maybe outlines for you to think about when you're

1581
03:15:38,000 --> 03:15:50,000
discussing the topic because as chair, you mentioned that there is the issue of this project in itself, and there is a contract

1582
03:15:50,000 --> 03:15:52,000
stating what are the

1583
03:15:52,000 --> 03:16:02,000
or compatible uses for the property. And there is the larger question about what you should do as a town when it comes to Williams map projects

1584
03:16:02,000 --> 03:16:10,000
the policies, and also keep in mind that we're agendized for the project tonight. So that's one consideration

1585
03:16:10,000 --> 03:16:13,000
The policies that

1586
03:16:13,000 --> 03:16:20,000
the town establishes and applies to projects going forward

1587
03:16:20,000 --> 03:16:23,000
They are not going to apply to this particular project.

1588
03:16:23,000 --> 03:16:28,000
Because the application, this is a housing project, the application is already complete. Here we are

1589
03:16:28,000 --> 03:16:30,000
at the hearing stage.

1590
03:16:30,000 --> 03:16:37,000
So I just want you to keep that in mind. So when you're considering these issues.

1591
03:16:37,000 --> 03:16:45,000
They're overlapping in some ways because they're they're you know similar discussions. But

1592
03:16:45,000 --> 03:16:57,000
You should keep that particular division in mind that we're talking, what we're talking about is whether the project which has a contract that's in place

1593
03:16:57,000 --> 03:17:00,000
So I think we could say something like.

1594
03:17:00,000 --> 03:17:17,000
Um, we can't find that this is compatible with your pro… with your contract. You need to exit your contract, clean that whole thing up, get rid of the Williamson Act, then come back and we'll talk about development.

1595
03:17:17,000 --> 03:17:20,000
Exactly.

1596
03:17:20,000 --> 03:17:22,000
Sure, exactly. That's exactly… And

1597
03:17:22,000 --> 03:17:33,000
I think one of the, uh, I forgot who, but one of the residents put it very clearly that Williamson Act compatibility is not a checklist.

1598
03:17:33,000 --> 03:17:39,000
It is all about what is the primary use? Well, be careful! And this is, in

1599
03:17:39,000 --> 03:17:41,000
my view, I've read everything I can

1600
03:17:41,000 --> 03:17:47,000
read about this, and I believe what you just said, but I'm not a lawyer. No, no, no,

1601
03:17:47,000 --> 03:17:49,000
I agree, but that's what

1602
03:17:49,000 --> 03:17:50,000
I'm saying. It's very unclear.

1603
03:17:50,000 --> 03:17:53,000
Yeah, I think we need legal advice on that.

1604
03:17:53,000 --> 03:17:54,000
So

1605
03:17:54,000 --> 03:17:55,000
at least I

1606
03:17:55,000 --> 03:18:00,000
believe I have the right to interpret it my way till somebody legally corrects me.

1607
03:18:00,000 --> 03:18:05,000
And to me, I think Williamson Act properties should primarily

1608
03:18:05,000 --> 03:18:06,000
be used

1609
03:18:06,000 --> 03:18:11,000
for their primary purpose, which is open space or act.

1610
03:18:11,000 --> 03:18:12,000
It's

1611
03:18:12,000 --> 03:18:13,000
only ag or ag. It's

1612
03:18:13,000 --> 03:18:14,000
it's ag.

1613
03:18:14,000 --> 03:18:15,000
But but

1614
03:18:15,000 --> 03:18:16,000
what I'm

1615
03:18:16,000 --> 03:18:21,000
saying is that's the way I would like to interpret it myself, till I

1616
03:18:21,000 --> 03:18:22,000
hear a

1617
03:18:22,000 --> 03:18:24,000
legal argument against it. So can

1618
03:18:24,000 --> 03:18:25,000
I, in

1619
03:18:25,000 --> 03:18:28,000
fact, add to that? Yes, as a primary

1620
03:18:28,000 --> 03:18:29,000
use. Yes,

1621
03:18:29,000 --> 03:18:31,000
ag has to be a primary use.

1622
03:18:31,000 --> 03:18:45,000
And then you can have these other things that are compatible with it. Yes. And I think that our policies could state things about percentages and limits and how much could be supported.

1623
03:18:45,000 --> 03:18:46,000
Right. But

1624
03:18:46,000 --> 03:18:50,000
I think personally that we're talking we're heading towards a continuance.

1625
03:18:50,000 --> 03:19:05,000
Right. Over getting legal advice about determining that this is not compatible with their own contract because it's not a prime agriculture. We cannot make a finding that the.

1626
03:19:05,000 --> 03:19:09,000
Agriculture is a primary use on the lot. Right. And that's

1627
03:19:09,000 --> 03:19:10,000
just one. But,

1628
03:19:10,000 --> 03:19:21,000
you know, the thing is too, it could also still, because I know that staffers wants to get like building up what other issues are there? Well, this since this is an open space conservation Williamson Act.

1629
03:19:21,000 --> 03:19:26,000
taking out 9 heritage oaks goes against that contract.

1630
03:19:26,000 --> 03:19:43,000
That's one item. Exportation of 1400… 1410 cubic yards of dirt also goes against the Williamson Act, because you're not preserving open space conservation. The other thing, too, is.

1631
03:19:43,000 --> 03:19:56,000
The interesting part is that the owner initiated a renewal of this act in January of this year for a continuation of the contract, which was open space conservation Area, and now they're switching.

1632
03:19:56,000 --> 03:20:00,000
hats and saying they want to use agriculture, and there's been no

1633
03:20:00,000 --> 03:20:01,000
agriculture. The

1634
03:20:01,000 --> 03:20:03,000
Prime Act never was open

1635
03:20:03,000 --> 03:20:04,000
space. It's agricultural.

1636
03:20:04,000 --> 03:20:06,000
No, it's out there. It's your…

1637
03:20:06,000 --> 03:20:07,000
Yeah.

1638
03:20:07,000 --> 03:20:08,000
It's agricultural or

1639
03:20:08,000 --> 03:20:11,000
undeveloped. Well, if it's undeveloped,

1640
03:20:11,000 --> 03:20:12,000
you

1641
03:20:12,000 --> 03:20:16,000
might think of that as being open space.

1642
03:20:16,000 --> 03:20:18,000
No, it's… It is

1643
03:20:18,000 --> 03:20:20,000
the confusion here that

1644
03:20:20,000 --> 03:20:29,000
is pointing me towards continuing this until we get legal advice from a land use attorney that specializes in

1645
03:20:29,000 --> 03:20:30,000
Williamson.

1646
03:20:30,000 --> 03:20:38,000
And outside of our counsel. Yeah, I think that we asked for that back in June. I want

1647
03:20:38,000 --> 03:20:40,000
to just make this comment.

1648
03:20:40,000 --> 03:20:46,000
The two parts of it, as Claire mentioned, today we are talking about this project.

1649
03:20:46,000 --> 03:20:55,000
And so for this project, it's exactly what you just mentioned. However, I would also like, because this is going to council.

1650
03:20:55,000 --> 03:21:08,000
I would also like to guide or recommend the council to come up with some guidelines and policies for Williamson Act parcels in town, so that we are not here again.

1651
03:21:08,000 --> 03:21:11,000
Talking about some other future project.

1652
03:21:11,000 --> 03:21:16,000
And determining its compatibility in a vacuum. And you know what, Kelson could come back and

1653
03:21:16,000 --> 03:21:28,000
say, you know what, Planning Commission, could you please go take a look at Santa Clara County policies and see what we can do to adopt those in to help us. And that would be something that Council could direct let's

1654
03:21:28,000 --> 03:21:29,000
try to let us get

1655
03:21:29,000 --> 03:21:30,000
this. Did

1656
03:21:30,000 --> 03:21:32,000
you close public hearings, by the way?

1657
03:21:32,000 --> 03:21:33,000
Yes. Let

1658
03:21:33,000 --> 03:21:34,000
us… I

1659
03:21:34,000 --> 03:21:36,000
was just going to try to help.

1660
03:21:36,000 --> 03:21:40,000
No, give us a moment and see if we can do it on

1661
03:21:40,000 --> 03:21:41,000
our own.

1662
03:21:41,000 --> 03:21:42,000
What I

1663
03:21:42,000 --> 03:21:46,000
don't want you to do, and I'm concerned it's going then.

1664
03:21:46,000 --> 03:21:52,000
The the primary goal here.

1665
03:21:52,000 --> 03:21:53,000
is

1666
03:21:53,000 --> 03:21:54,000
I don't think…

1667
03:21:54,000 --> 03:21:57,000
I spoke to the neighbors.

1668
03:21:57,000 --> 03:22:04,000
The neighbours don't want to see this project get held up for ever.

1669
03:22:04,000 --> 03:22:09,000
They're appreciative of the things that have been done. They'd like to see.

1670
03:22:09,000 --> 03:22:11,000
A little bit more done.

1671
03:22:11,000 --> 03:22:17,000
So, if you're not careful with the path that you're on.

1672
03:22:17,000 --> 03:22:20,000
We're going to throw the baby out with a bathwater.

1673
03:22:20,000 --> 03:22:37,000
I hear you, but I also don't want to set the precedent of stating that a property that has a minuscule amount of agriculture on it is compatible with a Williamson Act thing, because that could come back to bite us.

1674
03:22:37,000 --> 03:22:38,000
We

1675
03:22:38,000 --> 03:22:40,000
have…

1676
03:22:40,000 --> 03:22:41,000
And

1677
03:22:41,000 --> 03:22:44,000
it becomes…

1678
03:22:44,000 --> 03:22:45,000
Okay.

1679
03:22:45,000 --> 03:22:48,000
Sure, I'm sorry to interrupt. I just, if you're going to take public comment, you should open the public hearing again, if that's what the Commission wants.

1680
03:22:48,000 --> 03:22:53,000
I'm going to open the public hearing for 60 seconds.

1681
03:22:53,000 --> 03:22:57,000
Okay. The the town. I really do want to

1682
03:22:57,000 --> 03:22:58,000
hear John's

1683
03:22:58,000 --> 03:23:06,000
advice, because I know that he's put a lot of time into understanding this.

1684
03:23:06,000 --> 03:23:07,000
The

1685
03:23:07,000 --> 03:23:20,000
town has, if you go and read the ordinance or the resolution that I I pointed to the town does have beyond this contract.

1686
03:23:20,000 --> 03:23:28,000
Right? And this contract is identical for every single William Snack parcel in the town.

1687
03:23:28,000 --> 03:23:32,000
The town made a very conscious decision.

1688
03:23:32,000 --> 03:23:38,000
The parcels that it was going to allow William Snack contracts on.

1689
03:23:38,000 --> 03:23:40,000
Whereas yet.

1690
03:23:40,000 --> 03:23:44,000
Not subdivide as yet undivided.

1691
03:23:44,000 --> 03:23:46,000
or as yet unimproved.

1692
03:23:46,000 --> 03:23:56,000
And the goal was to slow down subdivision and to slow down the development in the town. So every single.

1693
03:23:56,000 --> 03:24:04,000
contract that's out there and some parcels are more open space than others.

1694
03:24:04,000 --> 03:24:09,000
But if we get into saying that this part.

1695
03:24:09,000 --> 03:24:17,000
parcel it because it is not open space is not a valid Williamson Act contract.

1696
03:24:17,000 --> 03:24:31,000
It's not an agricultural primary use. Then rather than simplifying things, we're just making this problem more complex. So my recommendation to you.

1697
03:24:31,000 --> 03:24:35,000
My recommendation is…

1698
03:24:35,000 --> 03:24:37,000
The applicant could…

1699
03:24:37,000 --> 03:24:40,000
File a non…

1700
03:24:40,000 --> 03:24:47,000
a non-renewal, and they could do it next week.

1701
03:24:47,000 --> 03:24:55,000
I don't know how long it takes to get done, but they could come forward with a request for cancellation.

1702
03:24:55,000 --> 03:24:57,000
And if…

1703
03:24:57,000 --> 03:25:05,000
There is a finding that it is, you know, there's no public interest issue and there is public support for it.

1704
03:25:05,000 --> 03:25:12,000
that could be findings made, and this entire thing could just be cleaned out in a month. Okay, thank you,

1705
03:25:12,000 --> 03:25:15,000
and that's going to be the end of the podium here.

1706
03:25:15,000 --> 03:25:16,000
I raised my hand too

1707
03:25:16,000 --> 03:25:18,000
Um, I… I would make a…

1708
03:25:18,000 --> 03:25:20,000
I raised my hand too.

1709
03:25:20,000 --> 03:25:21,000
Yes.

1710
03:25:21,000 --> 03:25:26,000
Chair, I'm sorry, if there are other comments, you should, I would advise commission to take them as well, since the public hearing was reopened.

1711
03:25:26,000 --> 03:25:28,000
All right.

1712
03:25:28,000 --> 03:25:29,000
So, Jim, I have a comment as well.

1713
03:25:29,000 --> 03:25:33,000
Awesome. Yes, Naveen.

1714
03:25:33,000 --> 03:25:46,000
So, Jim, I think at the very beginning, I think in Jay's submission, he very clearly stated that there is another property that went through this Williams that had the Williamson Act

1715
03:25:46,000 --> 03:25:51,000
And that has completed the development. In 2006 and 2019

1716
03:25:51,000 --> 03:25:57,000
And Williamson Act was never a consideration, right? We feel we are being

1717
03:25:57,000 --> 03:25:59,000
Particularly highlighted

1718
03:25:59,000 --> 03:26:08,000
We actually feel that the whole, you know, the room is completely, you know, picking up this one thing

1719
03:26:08,000 --> 03:26:12,000
Although it has been reviewed by the staff

1720
03:26:12,000 --> 03:26:14,000
reviewed by the Clare

1721
03:26:14,000 --> 03:26:16,000
And they came to a conclusion

1722
03:26:16,000 --> 03:26:22,000
And their conclusion being questioned without a policy in place

1723
03:26:22,000 --> 03:26:27,000
And the policy discussions are happening on the stage

1724
03:26:27,000 --> 03:26:31,000
I think this doesn't look the way we should conduct

1725
03:26:31,000 --> 03:26:35,000
And we will have our own measures that we will take

1726
03:26:35,000 --> 03:26:37,000
Thank you.

1727
03:26:37,000 --> 03:26:40,000
I thank you. Let me just comment one thing.

1728
03:26:40,000 --> 03:26:57,000
All the neighbors I have spoken to have said how they want to welcome you to the neighborhood that… and they want you to get started as soon as you can. And so I know it must feel.

1729
03:26:57,000 --> 03:27:00,000
challenging, but uh…

1730
03:27:00,000 --> 03:27:20,000
We're… we all want to get you started. We just want to do it in a way that is consistent with how we want to move forward with the Williamson Act. And I'm sorry that there were these other things that happened in the past. I… we don't know anything about that.

1731
03:27:20,000 --> 03:27:35,000
My understanding is that those… it was an overlooked thing. It wasn't something that was decided to not consider. And I think that it… that we're trying to do the right thing now.

1732
03:27:35,000 --> 03:27:46,000
And, um, I… there are some policy questions. I would like to see those separated from the this discussion. And so we can focus on just this.

1733
03:27:46,000 --> 03:27:49,000
Um, so…

1734
03:27:49,000 --> 03:27:55,000
I feel like there is a real need for some land use attorney input.

1735
03:27:55,000 --> 03:28:06,000
to understand the… our role in this compatibility determination and what criteria we should be applying.

1736
03:28:06,000 --> 03:28:14,000
I've read those contracts myself. They are thin, but they refer to other documents. I've read those, too. And with

1737
03:28:14,000 --> 03:28:19,000
that, there is two, three other adjacent questions, right? The one which…

1738
03:28:19,000 --> 03:28:27,000
I believe one of the residents, Sue Welsh, brought up about how open space easements play along with

1739
03:28:27,000 --> 03:28:29,000
Williamson Act. And SB

1740
03:28:29,000 --> 03:28:30,000
9. So that's

1741
03:28:30,000 --> 03:28:34,000
one. SB9 is another one. So there are these which need…

1742
03:28:34,000 --> 03:28:40,000
An expert to provide us a concrete answer for me, let

1743
03:28:40,000 --> 03:28:42,000
me quickly come in. Sorry

1744
03:28:42,000 --> 03:28:49,000
to interrupt, but first of all, I thank Jim's common sense in a way that.

1745
03:28:49,000 --> 03:29:05,000
Sorry, planning, you shouldn't use the overlooking or mistake you did in the past to rule the new finding or the newly identified issue here. I'm sorry. If anything happened past without attention.

1746
03:29:05,000 --> 03:29:11,000
It's not our responsibility. It's someone else's.

1747
03:29:11,000 --> 03:29:26,000
The second, I don't know how much we need to argue whether this is a primary agriculture or primary open space, or whatever with this kind of development, you invite any person in this world.

1748
03:29:26,000 --> 03:29:34,000
They will say, no, it doesn't look like an agriculture land. I don't know how much money or time or…

1749
03:29:34,000 --> 03:29:38,000
Among this highly educated people, we have to dig through the word wording

1750
03:29:38,000 --> 03:29:39,000
to see

1751
03:29:39,000 --> 03:29:52,000
what is the primary agriculture. It's not. Yeah, they were given the contract years or decades ago, or almost, yeah, but then at the time, the land was not developed and never used for the past.

1752
03:29:52,000 --> 03:29:56,000
70 years? I don't know how many years, 50 plus years.

1753
03:29:56,000 --> 03:30:00,000
You are changing the land as one of the neighbor…

1754
03:30:00,000 --> 03:30:07,000
brought up earlier, you are making big difference on it. And naturally, it's not supposed to inherit.

1755
03:30:07,000 --> 03:30:11,000
the contract of Williamson, because you're changing it.

1756
03:30:11,000 --> 03:30:12,000
Right.

1757
03:30:12,000 --> 03:30:15,000
Thank you very much. Yeah, exactly.

1758
03:30:15,000 --> 03:30:16,000
There's nobody else that would.

1759
03:30:16,000 --> 03:30:20,000
No, I do have to respond back, if I may, please.

1760
03:30:20,000 --> 03:30:21,000
Jim.

1761
03:30:21,000 --> 03:30:22,000
Yeah. Yeah.

1762
03:30:22,000 --> 03:30:23,000
So, yeah.

1763
03:30:23,000 --> 03:30:25,000
Please go ahead.

1764
03:30:25,000 --> 03:30:32,000
So I think the response to that is, what if in 1972 when this contract was written.

1765
03:30:32,000 --> 03:30:37,000
It was written, like, no development should be made in this one, right?

1766
03:30:37,000 --> 03:30:46,000
What would the neighbors say at that point? Right? So would that be? Oh, okay, you know it is what it is. You know, it cannot be changed.

1767
03:30:46,000 --> 03:30:55,000
We are inheriting a contract that is written, and we are following that contract at this time. We're not changing it. We are following it.

1768
03:30:55,000 --> 03:30:59,000
Whichever way it was written, right? We are not modifying it

1769
03:30:59,000 --> 03:31:02,000
And, also, it's, it's

1770
03:31:02,000 --> 03:31:03,000
It's

1771
03:31:03,000 --> 03:31:08,000
We feel the Williamson Act

1772
03:31:08,000 --> 03:31:11,000
compatibility has been checked

1773
03:31:11,000 --> 03:31:14,000
You know, by the staff.

1774
03:31:14,000 --> 03:31:17,000
And approved

1775
03:31:17,000 --> 03:31:21,000
And I think we would like to

1776
03:31:21,000 --> 03:31:23,000
go with that. Thank you.

1777
03:31:23,000 --> 03:31:41,000
Thank you, Naveen. Unfortunately, the staff doesn't approve that we do or or or we make the determination, and and my concern is, we don't know the criteria with which to make that determination. I'm going to ask for Jay's input.

1778
03:31:41,000 --> 03:31:42,000
Yeah,

1779
03:31:42,000 --> 03:31:56,000
so, um, certainly appreciate the robust discussion here again. And obviously, I understand that some of staff's comments here, you know, think to support or not support Williamson Act or the the project, and so…

1780
03:31:56,000 --> 03:32:19,000
I want to be very clear, you know, if someone comes for a new Williamson Act contract, the state law is very clear in the size and uses that the state law currently in its form requires. And so we would be evaluating any new property as it relates to that on those criteria as it stands currently.

1781
03:32:19,000 --> 03:32:32,000
And I think it would be very difficult for a number of properties of the size that this current property is to be able to meet that same burden that William Sinak now places on property owners that would be requesting Williamson Act.

1782
03:32:32,000 --> 03:32:52,000
It's one of the reasons why, again, you said, you heard me say earlier as best practice. We would suggest that you consider a recommendation on whether renewal or non-renewal should be decided tonight, and we would pose the fact that we've heard enough comment from the public that the non-renewal should be one of the first things that should be a fairly easy.

1783
03:32:52,000 --> 03:33:07,000
Um, topic for the Commission to weigh in on whether they would recommend that the Council look to non-renew this contract. The contract has provisions from both parties in it that allow for non-renewal for any number of reasons, or no reason at all. So, I would

1784
03:33:07,000 --> 03:33:12,000
first ask… Is there an advantage to the applicant filing for non-renewal instead of… Both parties

1785
03:33:12,000 --> 03:33:16,000
have equal right to file non-renewals in it.

1786
03:33:16,000 --> 03:33:35,000
So I think there's a question here that if we could answer first that, then we can talk about compatibility, and what compatibility means. If if we don't define this project as being compatible, we have the contract to use first to be able to determine compatibility.

1787
03:33:35,000 --> 03:33:50,000
But then, if we don't find that that's… and you don't find that that is compatible, then that will stop the project from moving forward until either our non-renewal takes place, and then a cancellation would take place after that. I would

1788
03:33:50,000 --> 03:33:52,000
be more comfortable if we…

1789
03:33:52,000 --> 03:34:07,000
uh, decided on non-renewal based on some standards, some objective criteria that we established or and that with city councils input. But I I wanted to make sure that that wouldn't preclude.

1790
03:34:07,000 --> 03:34:26,000
The applicant from saying, you know what, I don't want all this delay, I'm sorry it's going to cost me a couple hundred thousand dollars, but maybe I should file the non-renewal and do the cancellation and get on with the project, while we independently work on.

1791
03:34:26,000 --> 03:34:31,000
objective criteria for how we want to handle this in the future.

1792
03:34:31,000 --> 03:34:49,000
Yeah, certainly from a policy decision that that's certainly something that the Commission has purview over right? And I think what what staff was trying to get to in this point is whether or not that, you know, circumstances like this, you know, that we have before us now.

1793
03:34:49,000 --> 03:35:07,000
Should be part of that consideration, you know, and the criteria that moves these types of projects forward when they come in for development. So, you have an opportunity right now where you've heard a number of individuals say that they weren't supportive of the Williamson Act because of the nature of the ratio of the.

1794
03:35:07,000 --> 03:35:22,000
the agricultural use. And you've also heard staff say that the applicant has adjusted their agricultural use, you know, which then has an impact on whether or not it's a prime agricultural use or not. So, there's.

1795
03:35:22,000 --> 03:35:38,000
There's that question in general as to whether or not you want properties of this size, which don't currently meet the state statutes as it relates to 10 acres of prime acreage, which is not a hard and fast rule, it's a rule of law.

1796
03:35:38,000 --> 03:35:54,000
It's a general guideline and then you have 40 acres of subprime. So there's very few properties within Los Altos Hills that would still be able to fit those criteria. And when you looked at, again, resolution 616.

1797
03:35:54,000 --> 03:36:09,000
They talked about having 100 acres of land when it came into the Williamson Act. So I think there's enough things that, from a findings perspective, that certainly the Commission could make a recommendation on for non-renewal at this point. I just don't see the advantage to

1798
03:36:09,000 --> 03:36:11,000
it. Well, so the reason

1799
03:36:11,000 --> 03:36:19,000
that there's an advantage to it is eventually then there's a deterrent if you make the determination for compatibility, the individual gets.

1800
03:36:19,000 --> 03:36:37,000
to move his project forward, but the recommendation then at that point would be in 10 years, they're going to be paying full tax burden. And at that point, you know, they still can have their agricultural use. There's nothing that removing the Williamson Act would stop. Every property owner again has rights to agricultural use here in Los Altos Hills.

1801
03:36:37,000 --> 03:36:55,000
And so, from that perspective, what you're starting to do is forcing the applicant's hand as to whether or not you find for compatibility or non-compatibility whether they have to cancel immediately or if they have to cancel after 10 years. And that's the part here.

1802
03:36:55,000 --> 03:36:56,000
I

1803
03:36:56,000 --> 03:36:59,000
would rather that be their decision, and it will be whether they want

1804
03:36:59,000 --> 03:37:04,000
to develop now or 10 years from now. If you say that it's noncompatible.

1805
03:37:04,000 --> 03:37:05,000
Right.

1806
03:37:05,000 --> 03:37:11,000
You mean we file the notice of non-renewal, but they filed the cancellation? Correct. If they want to move

1807
03:37:11,000 --> 03:37:13,000
their project forward, they can cancel.

1808
03:37:13,000 --> 03:37:17,000
And they can do that, and then move their project

1809
03:37:17,000 --> 03:37:19,000
forward immediately. I could support that

1810
03:37:19,000 --> 03:37:25,000
I yeah, no, I get the logic here, right? If, let's say, we file for non-renewal.

1811
03:37:25,000 --> 03:37:30,000
We as in we recommend to the Council, and the council is the one who determines that.

1812
03:37:30,000 --> 03:37:34,000
Then the fork in the road for the applicant is.

1813
03:37:34,000 --> 03:37:43,000
To go forward, and in 10 years, it's anyway going to go out of Williamson Act.

1814
03:37:43,000 --> 03:37:47,000
Or, to pitch for compatibility.

1815
03:37:47,000 --> 03:37:56,000
Which, again, we have to determine yes or no. If it's yes, it's one path. If it's no, it's a 10-year sunset time.

1816
03:37:56,000 --> 03:37:57,000
So,

1817
03:37:57,000 --> 03:38:08,000
in a way, you're saying that along this path, there might be a chance that we get out of having to educate… adjudicate the compatibility question. Yes.

1818
03:38:08,000 --> 03:38:09,000
Because

1819
03:38:09,000 --> 03:38:19,000
the other option the applicant might have is, I don't want to go down this compatibility path, I'll just file for cancellation right now. Yeah. Well, okay, so

1820
03:38:19,000 --> 03:38:20,000
that was,

1821
03:38:20,000 --> 03:38:24,000
to me, the question. Is that right, the way I thought?

1822
03:38:24,000 --> 03:38:25,000
So,

1823
03:38:25,000 --> 03:38:30,000
you'd still have to make the compatibility determination. You don't get out from under that

1824
03:38:30,000 --> 03:38:31,000
one. Yes.

1825
03:38:31,000 --> 03:38:40,000
Okay, so to me, you either make the compatibility determination, and if it happens to be no, you also, at the same time.

1826
03:38:40,000 --> 03:38:44,000
Say you're going to file for non-renewal. Recommended

1827
03:38:44,000 --> 03:38:46,000
both of these instances.

1828
03:38:46,000 --> 03:38:50,000
Recommend for non-renewal, or you recommend for non-renewal now.

1829
03:38:50,000 --> 03:38:55,000
you're still coming back for the for the compatibility, right? No, no, no, I think

1830
03:38:55,000 --> 03:38:56,000
what I heard is we

1831
03:38:56,000 --> 03:38:57,000
have to

1832
03:38:57,000 --> 03:39:01,000
do more findings now for non-compatibility. And then I'd also like, you know,

1833
03:39:01,000 --> 03:39:12,000
depending on what motions are before you, I'd also say that there's maybe a check-in with the applicant, depending before you make a vote on a motion, because I think one of the things that.

1834
03:39:12,000 --> 03:39:32,000
you know, it is unclear right now is kind of where the commission's direction may be to staff, and I think they may have some some thoughts of their own, depending on where they see you may be heading. So maybe some straw poll voting would give them an ability to then intercede with maybe some other comments that they would have made. But having

1835
03:39:32,000 --> 03:39:35,000
said that, Jay, whatever we do.

1836
03:39:35,000 --> 03:39:37,000
It's going to the council.

1837
03:39:37,000 --> 03:39:44,000
So, if it's going to the council, let the applicant take the time to come up with a thought.

1838
03:39:44,000 --> 03:39:52,000
you know, thinking through it for at least the last next 2 weeks, or whatever the Council meeting is.

1839
03:39:52,000 --> 03:40:02,000
And let it get resolved then. What their viewpoint is. Why are we pushing them right now when the poor guy is in India and it's like…

1840
03:40:02,000 --> 03:40:03,000
way past,

1841
03:40:03,000 --> 03:40:04,000
you know,

1842
03:40:04,000 --> 03:40:08,000
yeah, morning there actually so it's fine.

1843
03:40:08,000 --> 03:40:17,000
I do not feel prepared to make a compatibility determination without legal counsel, legal advice. No, I'm

1844
03:40:17,000 --> 03:40:19,000
ready to. And

1845
03:40:19,000 --> 03:40:21,000
the reason is.

1846
03:40:21,000 --> 03:40:31,000
without legal counsel, I'm going to interpret it the way I would like to, and my interpretation is going to be that the primary use of this.

1847
03:40:31,000 --> 03:40:41,000
parcel as I see this project is residential and not agriculture, and to me, that is.

1848
03:40:41,000 --> 03:40:46,000
The reason for me saying not compatible. I see, and you

1849
03:40:46,000 --> 03:40:50,000
feel like it's just your opinion that matters. No,

1850
03:40:50,000 --> 03:40:51,000
right

1851
03:40:51,000 --> 03:40:53,000
now, without any other…

1852
03:40:53,000 --> 03:40:59,000
opinions or guidance, that's what I would like to.

1853
03:40:59,000 --> 03:41:00,000
say

1854
03:41:00,000 --> 03:41:01,000
state.

1855
03:41:01,000 --> 03:41:02,000
No, the second part is.

1856
03:41:02,000 --> 03:41:04,000
So

1857
03:41:04,000 --> 03:41:05,000
is

1858
03:41:05,000 --> 03:41:06,000
that we defer this

1859
03:41:06,000 --> 03:41:09,000
for legal opinion, like you had mentioned earlier.

1860
03:41:09,000 --> 03:41:10,000
But,

1861
03:41:10,000 --> 03:41:14,000
regardless of what I'm saying.

1862
03:41:14,000 --> 03:41:18,000
A legal opinion will be required, and.

1863
03:41:18,000 --> 03:41:23,000
I'll change my opinion when I hear the legal opinion, if need be.

1864
03:41:23,000 --> 03:41:25,000
Claire, could we get some advice?

1865
03:41:25,000 --> 03:41:30,000
Yeah, so to that question, if the commission is not

1866
03:41:30,000 --> 03:41:38,000
You want further information on that topic, you're not clear about the basis for compatibility

1867
03:41:38,000 --> 03:41:46,000
You can continue the item. As Jay mentioned, the contract does provide for the non-renewal process. There is

1868
03:41:46,000 --> 03:42:02,000
The Council ultimately decides to… to serve that notice, there is a notice period and then there is needs to be an additional public meeting or public hearing for to receive any objections. So there is a process for that

1869
03:42:02,000 --> 03:42:12,000
But with respect to the compatibility, if you're not clear, for example, there's two

1870
03:42:12,000 --> 03:42:20,000
Levels of compatibility. If you think about it this way, there's a contract. So the statue first says

1871
03:42:20,000 --> 03:42:29,000
Compatible uses. So the statute defines agriculture uses to be commercial agriculture. And then it says compatible uses essentially is

1872
03:42:29,000 --> 03:42:44,000
you know, anything that the city decides to be compatible, subject to findings, but includes agriculture, open space, recreation. And then it goes to introduce some compatible compatibility principles when you first

1873
03:42:44,000 --> 03:42:55,000
you know, at the first level, you're establishing what compatible uses are. But in this case, there is a contract. The contract says that primary and secondary dwelling units are compatible

1874
03:42:55,000 --> 03:43:03,000
and the section 2 of the contract says that it's supposed to. It's pursuant to the Wellness Act, and it's subject to amendment to the Willism Act.

1875
03:43:03,000 --> 03:43:12,000
That may be made after the contract is executed. So there's so there's that component. I would just say the statute does not

1876
03:43:12,000 --> 03:43:18,000
talk about the percentages, or whether the use of agriculture use has to be

1877
03:43:18,000 --> 03:43:26,000
primary or the compatible uses are incidental. It doesn't talk… it doesn't go into that, and all the

1878
03:43:26,000 --> 03:43:42,000
the examples and the legal authority which you know they really involve different situations where there's a subdivision or a cancellation. They relate to where the county, for example, Santa Clara County has rules about what constitutes

1879
03:43:42,000 --> 03:43:48,000
compatible uses, and those rules talk about incidental uses, or incidental to the agriculture uses

1880
03:43:48,000 --> 03:44:00,000
And so to the extent that you want to understand how the town can make a determination about compatibility when

1881
03:44:00,000 --> 03:44:12,000
You know, the contract has the uses and the statute doesn't give much guidance. If you want to understand that, you know, you can continue it. That's not that is within your purview.

1882
03:44:12,000 --> 03:44:16,000
So I just offer those thoughts for your consideration.

1883
03:44:16,000 --> 03:44:21,000
So the issue that I have with this, not now, not now, not now.

1884
03:44:21,000 --> 03:44:39,000
The issue that I have with this is that I've read the contract, and I've read the second paragraph that says it must follow the 1965 act, and I follow that thread down, and I my own analysis says that there is an issue.

1885
03:44:39,000 --> 03:44:57,000
about primary use of the property, and I want to know if my own analysis, my own understanding, my own opinion can direct me right now to say it is incompatible with the contract for that reason.

1886
03:44:57,000 --> 03:45:10,000
And it should be, uh… and we should file a notice of non-renewal. Can I do that based on my own read, my own understanding of the situation?

1887
03:45:10,000 --> 03:45:17,000
So with respect to the non-renewal, you don't have to make any findings. The contract provides for that.

1888
03:45:17,000 --> 03:45:25,000
The statute provides for that you can either side can not renew at any time, subject to the process I talked about

1889
03:45:25,000 --> 03:45:26,000
Yep, exactly.

1890
03:45:26,000 --> 03:45:27,000
If you

1891
03:45:27,000 --> 03:45:28,000
I'm sorry.

1892
03:45:28,000 --> 03:45:30,000
the findings. No, please go ahead. Go ahead.

1893
03:45:30,000 --> 03:45:45,000
But if you're speaking about compatibility, I think the commission should think about the contract provision says certain users are compatible. So if the opinion that

1894
03:45:45,000 --> 03:46:00,000
The uses that are stated there are not compatible, then you should give reasons why that is. And the reason should be based on what you're the record does before you and on the

1895
03:46:00,000 --> 03:46:07,000
applicable statutes. So if you feel that you can

1896
03:46:07,000 --> 03:46:20,000
Based on opinion on those grounds, then, you know, you can express that opinion and you can vote a certain way. But if you're not clear about that, you have the ability to continue the item.

1897
03:46:20,000 --> 03:46:23,000
So I want you to kind of think about it in that framework.

1898
03:46:23,000 --> 03:46:31,000
So I think the main thing, what you heard, Claire, is we are focusing on primary use.

1899
03:46:31,000 --> 03:46:32,000
As

1900
03:46:32,000 --> 03:46:33,000
one of

1901
03:46:33,000 --> 03:46:42,000
those main items. The second part, and the third part, could be, and we'd like to hear your views on applicability of SB9.

1902
03:46:42,000 --> 03:46:53,000
uh, development on Williamson Act parcels. And the 3rd part we'd like to hear from you is about open space easements in Williamson Act parcels.

1903
03:46:53,000 --> 03:46:56,000
All these three have come up today.

1904
03:46:56,000 --> 03:47:12,000
All right, well, as I mentioned before, the statute does not talk about primary use, it just identifies agriculture which needs to be present on the property and the compatible uses, it doesn't go into specifics about

1905
03:47:12,000 --> 03:47:23,000
What, you know, maybe 10% of land has to be this and 20% has to be the other use. It doesn't go into that. And I my view is and my read of that is because it

1906
03:47:23,000 --> 03:47:30,000
gives that ability to the local jurisdictions to adopt the rules and compatibility and make findings

1907
03:47:30,000 --> 03:47:40,000
So it doesn't… it doesn't really speak to that issue. And so that's where I'm I'm offering that if the Commission wants to

1908
03:47:40,000 --> 03:47:51,000
Some further research, some further information about that aspect, you know, you have the ability to continue the item. With respect to SB 9,

1909
03:47:51,000 --> 03:48:06,000
I mean, I do think that without specific findings of uses, so for example, if the Willis Mac policy says, you know the residential use has to be incidental

1910
03:48:06,000 --> 03:48:17,000
Or if the property is not zone residential or for single family, for example, then you might have a reasonable argument that the SB 9 is not allowed. But if its property is

1911
03:48:17,000 --> 03:48:19,000
Within

1912
03:48:19,000 --> 03:48:34,000
single-family residential, you know, it's not a prime farmland or a reserve for endangered species or some specific fish and game code provisions that are specifically referenced in SB 9. I do think the SB 9 would apply

1913
03:48:34,000 --> 03:48:42,000
Yeah, I think the difficulty that in those situations is that the contract says it's not allowed.

1914
03:48:42,000 --> 03:48:53,000
And then as the open space easement, it's… the easement is an easement, and so if it's recorded, against the property, it preserves that area in the same way.

1915
03:48:53,000 --> 03:49:08,000
I mean, as a from a talent perspective, we wouldn't allow development to be in somebody else's easement area or the area that's preserved for a specific use because that's really a property right. And so we've been

1916
03:49:08,000 --> 03:49:13,000
The SEI units wouldn't be allowed to be in there.

1917
03:49:13,000 --> 03:49:23,000
Um, I'm very leery to open the public hearing unless you have something truly informative that's extremely short. Yes.

1918
03:49:23,000 --> 03:49:24,000
I

1919
03:49:24,000 --> 03:49:27,000
think I do.

1920
03:49:27,000 --> 03:49:29,000
Given all this conversation.

1921
03:49:29,000 --> 03:49:37,000
We and our clients don't think that this should be continued. So if you're not going to approve it.

1922
03:49:37,000 --> 03:49:41,000
As it is, we'd like to have you just deny it. I see.

1923
03:49:41,000 --> 03:49:43,000
Okay. Got it. Thank you.

1924
03:49:43,000 --> 03:49:48,000
That is the level of information I was.

1925
03:49:48,000 --> 03:49:50,000
I did want to hear.

1926
03:49:50,000 --> 03:49:51,000
Now,

1927
03:49:51,000 --> 03:50:07,000
one thing to remember, we are recommending board. We do the legwork and the groundwork for city council. So what we say is going to get up to city council. They're the ones that have to make the determination. We're just recommending. And we had set this back on June the 8th. We wanted to have.

1928
03:50:07,000 --> 03:50:12,000
Legal, specifically knowledgeable in Williamson Act.

1929
03:50:12,000 --> 03:50:14,000
weigh in on this.

1930
03:50:14,000 --> 03:50:19,000
And I don't think we feel comfortable with what we've been presented, because I can tell you,

1931
03:50:19,000 --> 03:50:24,000
SB nine honor what the what the applicant just said. Yeah.

1932
03:50:24,000 --> 03:50:25,000
and

1933
03:50:25,000 --> 03:50:27,000
and.

1934
03:50:27,000 --> 03:50:31,000
I mean, clearly, I understand where that would head to.

1935
03:50:31,000 --> 03:50:37,000
and you have every right to do that.

1936
03:50:37,000 --> 03:50:45,000
If we deny the project as it came to the Planning Commission today.

1937
03:50:45,000 --> 03:50:55,000
is that are we? Do we need to deny both the zoning portion of it and the Williamson Act portion? You just deny the whole thing? No, no,

1938
03:50:55,000 --> 03:50:56,000
no. So

1939
03:50:56,000 --> 03:51:00,000
you have to identify findings for the denial? Yes.

1940
03:51:00,000 --> 03:51:18,000
Yeah. So again, this is why when I began the conversation, right? You've got your normal land use authority related to this project related to the variances. So if you were not going to be supportive of the project, and you were going to deny, it's going to be based on the merits of the project and the variances that are before.

1941
03:51:18,000 --> 03:51:24,000
for you. Okay. And you would have to make those findings specific to this property.

1942
03:51:24,000 --> 03:51:27,000
Is it sufficient to say that we.

1943
03:51:27,000 --> 03:51:32,000
deny the project because we do not.

1944
03:51:32,000 --> 03:51:35,000
find that it is compatible. No, no, no,

1945
03:51:35,000 --> 03:51:40,000
it's on the merits of the variances that are before you.

1946
03:51:40,000 --> 03:51:51,000
Oh, it's not on the merits of the no compatibility determination absolutely I thought that if we had if we failed the determinate the compatibility determination.

1947
03:51:51,000 --> 03:51:54,000
That is a denial, or that is the end of it.

1948
03:51:54,000 --> 03:51:55,000
It's…

1949
03:51:55,000 --> 03:52:01,000
I don't even want to talk about the site development. So variances are out.

1950
03:52:01,000 --> 03:52:05,000
I want to only focus our denial on

1951
03:52:05,000 --> 03:52:06,000
the Williamson Act

1952
03:52:06,000 --> 03:52:07,000
compatibility. So, Claire,

1953
03:52:07,000 --> 03:52:19,000
this is a question from staff, if you don't mind, to the chair. This is where what is the appropriate action that the.

1954
03:52:19,000 --> 03:52:27,000
Commission should be taking as it relates to compatibility. If they want to if they want to honor the applicant's request.

1955
03:52:27,000 --> 03:52:31,000
So the commission is making a recommendation.

1956
03:52:31,000 --> 03:52:35,000
And so if you're

1957
03:52:35,000 --> 03:52:39,000
If you're not able to make

1958
03:52:39,000 --> 03:52:45,000
So if you don't you're of the opinion that the uses are not compatible

1959
03:52:45,000 --> 03:52:48,000
You

1960
03:52:48,000 --> 03:52:54,000
we'd recommend that you articulate why, and you would forward that recommendation

1961
03:52:54,000 --> 03:52:59,000
Up to the city council and

1962
03:52:59,000 --> 03:53:11,000
That you know you would I don't think that you would need to reach the variance findings because you would essentially be foreigning the

1963
03:53:11,000 --> 03:53:13,000
the

1964
03:53:13,000 --> 03:53:18,000
determination that you know you recommend city council that

1965
03:53:18,000 --> 03:53:24,000
the find the use that's proposed could not be determined to be compatible with the contract.

1966
03:53:24,000 --> 03:53:25,000
And therefore, per the contract, you

1967
03:53:25,000 --> 03:53:27,000
Well, the good news here…

1968
03:53:27,000 --> 03:53:28,000
So, Jim,

1969
03:53:28,000 --> 03:53:32,000
if I hear what Claire just mentioned, and if I read.

1970
03:53:32,000 --> 03:53:34,000
There were three requests.

1971
03:53:34,000 --> 03:53:41,000
Variance for the driveway grading policy exception, VLAMCN Act compatibility.

1972
03:53:41,000 --> 03:53:47,000
So out of three, we could choose any one to deny the project. Yeah, but she wants

1973
03:53:47,000 --> 03:53:51,000
what she said, though, was that the first two, we don't have

1974
03:53:51,000 --> 03:53:56,000
to address. That's because we can address the third. The third one, uh…

1975
03:53:56,000 --> 03:54:12,000
We… the good news about denial on the third one is I pardon me, but I get what I want, because this is going to lawyers and attorneys, and this… that's where I think this needs to go.

1976
03:54:12,000 --> 03:54:30,000
to understand the true legal ramifications of this. And so I think we could deny saying that it is not compatible on the grounds that it is not a… agriculture is not a primary use of the parcel.

1977
03:54:30,000 --> 03:54:31,000
I would

1978
03:54:31,000 --> 03:54:32,000
like to

1979
03:54:32,000 --> 03:54:33,000
add

1980
03:54:33,000 --> 03:54:34,000
because I

1981
03:54:34,000 --> 03:54:46,000
think we need to give more information to the council on this, and we are uncertain about how open space easements apply to Williamson Act properties.

1982
03:54:46,000 --> 03:54:55,000
And we are uncertain about how SB9 zoning applies to Williamson Act properties. The issue with… And I want that to

1983
03:54:55,000 --> 03:54:56,000
be also

1984
03:54:56,000 --> 03:55:00,000
determined by the legal, uh, along with the… But the issue

1985
03:55:00,000 --> 03:55:04,000
with that is that if we're uncertain about something.

1986
03:55:04,000 --> 03:55:19,000
we should continue and go get certain about it. I'm saying that we're certain that this is not a primary application of agriculture. I agree. Right.

1987
03:55:19,000 --> 03:55:21,000
I agree.

1988
03:55:21,000 --> 03:55:25,000
And just to kind of preface a little bit, you know, getting back just to…

1989
03:55:25,000 --> 03:55:36,000
A little bit more information. SP9, this whole idea of not being allowed in Williamson Act, both Santa Cruz County as well as Sonoma County have that.

1990
03:55:36,000 --> 03:55:38,000
As part of their…

1991
03:55:38,000 --> 03:55:39,000
docs

1992
03:55:39,000 --> 03:55:42,000
for it. But the issue is that we don't. Right. Well,

1993
03:55:42,000 --> 03:55:47,000
you know, it's their interpretation from what's happened in Sacramento. I think it's in their ordinances. Right,

1994
03:55:47,000 --> 03:55:48,000
but it's… yeah,

1995
03:55:48,000 --> 03:55:49,000
so they've

1996
03:55:49,000 --> 03:55:50,000
made it

1997
03:55:50,000 --> 03:55:54,000
clear, but it's also the interpretations come from maybe… So we might have to do

1998
03:55:54,000 --> 03:55:55,000
that in

1999
03:55:55,000 --> 03:55:56,000
the future.

2000
03:55:56,000 --> 03:55:57,000
I am going

2001
03:55:57,000 --> 03:55:58,000
to propose

2002
03:55:58,000 --> 03:56:03,000
a motion… Yes. Actually, I'm the chair now and I shouldn't do that but you're so good at it though.

2003
03:56:03,000 --> 03:56:04,000
one

2004
03:56:04,000 --> 03:56:07,000
that the applicant does have his hand up. I don't know if that.

2005
03:56:07,000 --> 03:56:08,000
I'm

2006
03:56:08,000 --> 03:56:11,000
sorry, what? The applicant, the owner. Yes, go ahead.

2007
03:56:11,000 --> 03:56:19,000
So, Jim, I think your primary reason is, like, this is not, compatible with primary agriculture, right? That's your point.

2008
03:56:19,000 --> 03:56:25,000
And the point, and I think what you've also observed on June 8th and today

2009
03:56:25,000 --> 03:56:31,000
There is so much of pushback on any kind of agriculture in that one, right?

2010
03:56:31,000 --> 03:56:42,000
Okay, so it's in between the houses, you know, there, you know, like, there is health issues. We could… I think it allows grazing, right? So we can bring 1,000 cows, and then it considered as grazing. Would you allow that? But that would be a primary consideration.

2011
03:56:42,000 --> 03:56:46,000
Really?

2012
03:56:46,000 --> 03:56:47,000
I'll, uh…

2013
03:56:47,000 --> 03:56:50,000
I think we are kind of picking and choosing what is convenient

2014
03:56:50,000 --> 03:56:57,000
In your observation, but I think you're not looking from the contract the way it was written

2015
03:56:57,000 --> 03:56:58,000
I believe I am looking.

2016
03:56:58,000 --> 03:57:02,000
I understand where you're going, but you're not allowing us to do… you're looking at one particular way

2017
03:57:02,000 --> 03:57:06,000
And when entire neighborhood is also looking in the same way as you're looking

2018
03:57:06,000 --> 03:57:23,000
Honestly, Naveen, I've heard all the neighbors and their issues and it's not uncommon that neighbors that have lived next to a beautiful empty parcel object to development, and I've heard.

2019
03:57:23,000 --> 03:57:42,000
Many reasons. Those aren't the things that are driving me at all right now. What's driving me is that I believe if you look at 62 ops cal, attorney General 233 reinforced by Cleveland National Forest Foundation.

2020
03:57:42,000 --> 03:57:58,000
findings that there is a requirement for this agriculture to be the primary use of the property, so that these other things can be secondary to them.

2021
03:57:58,000 --> 03:58:15,000
It doesn't say that these things can be… this list of 11 things can be done on your property. It says these are 11 things that are compatible with the agriculture that's on your property. And anyway, by the way.

2022
03:58:15,000 --> 03:58:19,000
I could be wrong. I absolutely could be wrong.

2023
03:58:19,000 --> 03:58:41,000
But I'm not an attorney, and I think this does need to get to attorneys to figure this out, or we're going to be here at 3 o'clock in the morning and still talking about the same things. And I am sorry that this puts you in this situation. I really do want to help you get your house started. I really do. I like the house.

2024
03:58:41,000 --> 03:58:57,000
I really do, but I think that there are issues here that need to be resolved first. And this, at least, I know it's expensive, but this at least gives you the option of pulling a ripcord.

2025
03:58:57,000 --> 03:59:10,000
And finding a way out of this nasty back-and-forth that is only going to be rectified by attorneys butting heads.

2026
03:59:10,000 --> 03:59:12,000
Yeah. I'm sorry

2027
03:59:12,000 --> 03:59:15,000
about that, but…

2028
03:59:15,000 --> 03:59:16,000
And

2029
03:59:16,000 --> 03:59:19,000
we ask for that in June, you know, to have…

2030
03:59:19,000 --> 03:59:25,000
So, I'm going to propose a motion that we deny the project.

2031
03:59:25,000 --> 03:59:31,000
I'm sorry, just a moment. I'm getting a signal.

2032
03:59:31,000 --> 03:59:33,000
Okay, let's…

2033
03:59:33,000 --> 03:59:38,000
We should at least have a motion on the table, and then we can discuss if the Commission is

2034
03:59:38,000 --> 03:59:42,000
leaning towards the denial, then it would be option 2. I have a problem.

2035
03:59:42,000 --> 03:59:46,000
Wait, are you saying option 2? That says continue. That's continue so that we can bring

2036
03:59:46,000 --> 03:59:49,000
back a resolution for denial. Okay, all right, that at least

2037
03:59:49,000 --> 03:59:50,000
gives us

2038
03:59:50,000 --> 03:59:53,000
a little bit of hedge.

2039
03:59:53,000 --> 04:00:01,000
and maybe wiser people will come to bear on this question.

2040
04:00:01,000 --> 04:00:07,000
All right, I'm going to propose a motion to continue the project to a

2041
04:00:07,000 --> 04:00:11,000
date certain September third, I believe Thursday, September 3rd.

2042
04:00:11,000 --> 04:00:18,000
Thursday, September 3rd, and direct staff to prepare resolutions recommending that the city council deny the project.

2043
04:00:18,000 --> 04:00:35,000
Should I also say, on the basis of the Williamson Act incompatibility relating to the agriculture not being a primary, the primary use of the parcel.

2044
04:00:35,000 --> 04:00:39,000
Did you get it? Let's find out. You want

2045
04:00:39,000 --> 04:00:43,000
to read that back? Yeah. So just copy

2046
04:00:43,000 --> 04:00:52,000
the first part of part two. Yes. And for September 3rd, Thursday, on the basis of the Williamson Act incompatibility relating to.

2047
04:00:52,000 --> 04:00:59,000
Agriculture not being the primary use of the parcel.

2048
04:00:59,000 --> 04:01:01,000
I need a second.

2049
04:01:01,000 --> 04:01:03,000
I am checking.

2050
04:01:03,000 --> 04:01:11,000
We have a motion and a second. Is there any further discussion?

2051
04:01:11,000 --> 04:01:12,000
And the thing is also,

2052
04:01:12,000 --> 04:01:16,000
I hope everybody realizes, we are operating the best that we can.

2053
04:01:16,000 --> 04:01:28,000
With the amount of information that we've all studied on our own and derived on this, this does not come easy for any of us. I mean, we've all delved in deeply into this, and we really need.

2054
04:01:28,000 --> 04:01:32,000
Strong, Williamson Act-type legal counsel on this. I'd also

2055
04:01:32,000 --> 04:01:38,000
like to add the empathy that I have for the applicant going through this process.

2056
04:01:38,000 --> 04:01:56,000
Yeah, the other part, just as a comment I would make to staff is, since you will be taking this to City Council, I would highly recommend you to ask the city council to think about what should be done for Williamson Act parcels.

2057
04:01:56,000 --> 04:01:58,000
In town, so that's so

2058
04:01:58,000 --> 04:01:59,000
that we

2059
04:01:59,000 --> 04:02:04,000
don't have this discussion again, and so we don't have other frustrated applicants. You know,

2060
04:02:04,000 --> 04:02:13,000
I would like to take that further and consider passing another motion. Jay, can I get an option on this after this one?

2061
04:02:13,000 --> 04:02:17,000
I don't want to stack these for that exact purpose.

2062
04:02:17,000 --> 04:02:34,000
But first, can we vote on this motion? Oh, sure. I'm sorry. I guess I would like to hear what. I appreciate that. I'm speaking as an individual. I just say, if you would consider wording your motion

2063
04:02:34,000 --> 04:02:36,000
so that it's more neutral.

2064
04:02:36,000 --> 04:02:41,000
And asking for legal input, that might be a better way of approaching

2065
04:02:41,000 --> 04:02:42,000
it. Help

2066
04:02:42,000 --> 04:02:44,000
me understand what neutral would be. As it

2067
04:02:44,000 --> 04:02:51,000
stands, you're asking for the staff to come back with a proposal for denying the project based on.

2068
04:02:51,000 --> 04:02:53,000
On the Williamson Act.

2069
04:02:53,000 --> 04:03:04,000
agricultural use. Whereas if you word it so that you say, get us legal advice on what are the bearing… what is the bearing of the law in this area? I think… I guess I

2070
04:03:04,000 --> 04:03:10,000
could amend the motion. I want to keep in what we said, because that's where I think it's going.

2071
04:03:10,000 --> 04:03:15,000
But I would be willing to add to it, or…

2072
04:03:15,000 --> 04:03:18,000
comp… or how about deny the continuation

2073
04:03:18,000 --> 04:03:19,000
of the

2074
04:03:19,000 --> 04:03:32,000
Williamson Act on this property? Because that's what we're really aiming for is not, you know, basically non-renewal for the Williamson Act. That's really what it's not the legal advice.

2075
04:03:32,000 --> 04:03:37,000
I want to either…

2076
04:03:37,000 --> 04:03:52,000
follow through on what we just said, or if smarter minds have looked on this with legal advice, and there's a better thing that needs to happen, I don't want to force them to only come back with.

2077
04:03:52,000 --> 04:04:03,000
This recommendation, or this resolution, but that they may also come up with other resolutions that… for us to consider. Thank you.

2078
04:04:03,000 --> 04:04:04,000
Yeah.

2079
04:04:04,000 --> 04:04:06,000
Okay. So how are you going to rework?

2080
04:04:06,000 --> 04:04:07,000
How am

2081
04:04:07,000 --> 04:04:13,000
I going to say that? Okay, I would just add an or clause that says, or other resolutions.

2082
04:04:13,000 --> 04:04:17,000
incorporating legal advice.

2083
04:04:17,000 --> 04:04:19,000
for us to consider.

2084
04:04:19,000 --> 04:04:20,000
or

2085
04:04:20,000 --> 04:04:22,000
city council, or us, or

2086
04:04:22,000 --> 04:04:25,000
both? This is coming back to us.

2087
04:04:25,000 --> 04:04:29,000
or given additional legal counsel.

2088
04:04:29,000 --> 04:04:33,000
an alternate resolution can be considered

2089
04:04:33,000 --> 04:04:34,000
an

2090
04:04:34,000 --> 04:04:39,000
alternate alternate resolution for us to consider.

2091
04:04:39,000 --> 04:04:42,000
because it may. They may give us some

2092
04:04:42,000 --> 04:04:45,000
options or give an additional legal counsel.

2093
04:04:45,000 --> 04:04:48,000
And then what should

2094
04:04:48,000 --> 04:04:56,000
I put from there? Or given additional legal counsel, other resolutions for us

2095
04:04:56,000 --> 04:04:57,000
to

2096
04:04:57,000 --> 04:04:59,000
consider. Yeah.

2097
04:04:59,000 --> 04:05:04,000
Okay.

2098
04:05:04,000 --> 04:05:14,000
Second. Would you read the whole thing? Yes, please. Read the whole. Okay, continue the project to date certain September 3rd. Oh, could you put that

2099
04:05:14,000 --> 04:05:22,000
back? We need that back.

2100
04:05:22,000 --> 04:05:32,000
Continue the project to date CERN and direct staff to prepare a resolution recommending that the City Council deny the project.

2101
04:05:32,000 --> 04:05:40,000
On the basis of the Williamson Act incompatibility relating to agriculture not being the primary use of the parcel.

2102
04:05:40,000 --> 04:05:45,000
Or give an additional legal counsel, other resolutions.

2103
04:05:45,000 --> 04:05:50,000
are to be proposed for the Commission to consider.

2104
04:05:50,000 --> 04:05:53,000
I didn't follow the last point. You just

2105
04:05:53,000 --> 04:05:56,000
read it down. Should it be N?

2106
04:05:56,000 --> 04:06:00,000
Or perhaps the what I'm hearing is

2107
04:06:00,000 --> 04:06:01,000
So that first part or

2108
04:06:01,000 --> 04:06:03,000
Or…

2109
04:06:03,000 --> 04:06:09,000
to present to the Commission additional resolutions based on

2110
04:06:09,000 --> 04:06:12,000
legal counsel opinion.

2111
04:06:12,000 --> 04:06:17,000
I love it. Okay, there you go. That's nice and simple and to the point.

2112
04:06:17,000 --> 04:06:22,000
Or to present to the Commission.

2113
04:06:22,000 --> 04:06:23,000
Alternative resolutions

2114
04:06:23,000 --> 04:06:26,000
What was it? Alternative.

2115
04:06:26,000 --> 04:06:29,000
Resolutions…

2116
04:06:29,000 --> 04:06:30,000
Alternative

2117
04:06:30,000 --> 04:06:33,000
resolutions for us to consider. Gotcha. For

2118
04:06:33,000 --> 04:06:34,000
the Commission.

2119
04:06:34,000 --> 04:06:36,000
Yeah, based on legal counsel opinion.

2120
04:06:36,000 --> 04:06:37,000
Be

2121
04:06:37,000 --> 04:06:39,000
strong legal counsel opinion. Yes, hang on

2122
04:06:39,000 --> 04:06:42,000
there. We're going to take a break in just a moment.

2123
04:06:42,000 --> 04:06:43,000
Okay,

2124
04:06:43,000 --> 04:06:46,000
so now I'm seconding that. Okay.

2125
04:06:46,000 --> 04:06:47,000
Let's

2126
04:06:47,000 --> 04:06:49,000
take a vote. Commissioner Indico. Yes,

2127
04:06:49,000 --> 04:06:50,000
Commissioner

2128
04:06:50,000 --> 04:06:53,000
Patel. Yes, Chair Washara. Yes.

2129
04:06:53,000 --> 04:06:56,000
Do we want to do the other motion quickly, Jim?

2130
04:06:56,000 --> 04:06:57,000
Yeah,

2131
04:06:57,000 --> 04:07:00,000
do another motion for the

2132
04:07:00,000 --> 04:07:06,000
staff. I propose a another motion to direct the staff to develop.

2133
04:07:06,000 --> 04:07:07,000
a yes.

2134
04:07:07,000 --> 04:07:13,000
So, Chair, if I may, that we staff can take that as direction because we're not exactly agendized for that issue.

2135
04:07:13,000 --> 04:07:15,000
I see, okay. You shouldn't. So

2136
04:07:15,000 --> 04:07:16,000
let us

2137
04:07:16,000 --> 04:07:30,000
provide you direction to start developing policies around future use of Williamson Act in the town. We'd like to see it go through it, get some options, and then it would go to City Council.

2138
04:07:30,000 --> 04:07:31,000
Especially

2139
04:07:31,000 --> 04:07:32,000
for development

2140
04:07:32,000 --> 04:07:37,000
of Williamson, development on Williamson Act parcels. Wait, just a moment. I

2141
04:07:37,000 --> 04:07:38,000
think there

2142
04:07:38,000 --> 04:07:48,000
are three areas. One is the acceptance of another new Williamson Act parcel. The other is development on an existing.

2143
04:07:48,000 --> 04:07:50,000
Williams Act parcel

2144
04:07:50,000 --> 04:07:51,000
and

2145
04:07:51,000 --> 04:07:52,000
compatibility

2146
04:07:52,000 --> 04:07:53,000
and

2147
04:07:53,000 --> 04:07:54,000
and

2148
04:07:54,000 --> 04:07:59,000
how the Planning Commission would make compatibility determinations.

2149
04:07:59,000 --> 04:08:01,000
on a Williamson Act parcel.

2150
04:08:01,000 --> 04:08:03,000
Yes. staff understands

2151
04:08:03,000 --> 04:08:06,000
the direction. All right. Thank you.

2152
04:08:06,000 --> 04:08:07,000
Let's

2153
04:08:07,000 --> 04:08:11,000
take a 10 min break. Thank you. Thank you, everyone. That was a tough.

2154
04:08:11,000 --> 04:08:12,000
Very good

2155
04:08:12,000 --> 04:08:18,000
job, Jim. Thank you. Well, I mean that that's tough. I mean.

2156
04:08:18,000 --> 04:08:23,000
Let's see. The next thing is, um…

2157
04:08:23,000 --> 04:08:30,000
I guess we're going to move on. And Jay will find us here in just a second.

2158
04:08:30,000 --> 04:08:36,000
There he goes. The second public hearing item tonight.

2159
04:08:36,000 --> 04:08:44,000
is housing element program a 6, the proposed inclusionary housing ordinance and affordable housing in lieu fee program.

2160
04:08:44,000 --> 04:08:53,000
This item was originally noticed as a study session. Item 6.4, and has been moved to public hearings as item 5.3.

2161
04:08:53,000 --> 04:09:01,000
The staff report has been updated to include a staff recommendation and an action for the Commission.

2162
04:09:01,000 --> 04:09:07,000
Item 5.3 is a Housing Element Program A6, proposed inclusionary.

2163
04:09:07,000 --> 04:09:19,000
Housing ordinance and affordable housing in Luffy program public hearing to consider the proposed inclusionary housing ordinance and affordable housing in Luffy program.

2164
04:09:19,000 --> 04:09:29,000
The staff on this item is Jay Bradford, our community development director. Jay, you want to just move right into the staff report? Yeah, thank you,

2165
04:09:29,000 --> 04:09:41,000
Jim. Thank you, Chair. There's not going to be a presentation today. We received a number of communications from the League of Women Voters, and also from Cal HDF.

2166
04:09:41,000 --> 04:09:59,000
We didn't have access to strategic economics because of some staffing outages with their agency. And as a result, we weren't prepared to be able to respond to those in the time that we received the notifications from those agencies. We got one yesterday at 4 pm.

2167
04:09:59,000 --> 04:10:14,000
And we got another one today. I would like to highlight what those issues are. In the CalHDF letter, we had an instance where they thought that there was some preemption of density bonus law. We'll make some clarifications associated with that.

2168
04:10:14,000 --> 04:10:30,000
There was also an issue as it related to if a project proposed alternate affordable levels within a project, and we'll make some clarifications associated with that.

2169
04:10:30,000 --> 04:10:50,000
And then the last issue we had was the feasibility analysis and its findings for feasibility as it related to the various project types that were described within the inclusionary study and how those impact the projects and the inclusionary policy itself.

2170
04:10:50,000 --> 04:11:06,000
It sounds really complicated there, but really what the basis of this is is that we do stand by the study that was done and the market analysis that's there. But market analysis do change. And so we're going to be looking at 3 options from some cities that have.

2171
04:11:06,000 --> 04:11:22,000
recently modified them. Obviously, they're not necessarily going to be exact to Los Altos Hills, so that's why there's a little bit of analysis that needs done and why we needed strategic economics to be able to do so. But we're going to look at a model where applicants, um, with third-party.

2172
04:11:22,000 --> 04:11:41,000
a QAQC would provide a feasibility analysis that then would allow for us to trigger. We may also make recommendations associated with policy changes that we've seen in San Francisco or San Jose, because they have much larger and more robust inclusionary housing programs.

2173
04:11:41,000 --> 04:12:06,000
that we can model from, and we'll be relying on strategic economics to be able to provide those linkages within that conversation. And then for the League of Women Voters, what we had was association with the thresholds for affordability, and they've asked us to look at some different criteria than what we had previously studied, so we'll also ask strategic economics to weigh in on what those affordable levels are and what that performance would look.

2174
04:12:06,000 --> 04:12:21,000
like from the inclusionary policy perspective. With that, we would ask that this particular item be continued as a regularly rescheduled item to a meeting on August 13th.

2175
04:12:21,000 --> 04:12:35,000
If there are any questions, certainly I can respond to them, but I would ask that maybe we hold off on those and that we give them to staff in the interim, and then we'd come back with responses at that August 13th meeting. Should we

2176
04:12:35,000 --> 04:12:39,000
pass a motion to continue to date certain in one week?

2177
04:12:39,000 --> 04:12:40,000
Can

2178
04:12:40,000 --> 04:12:42,000
I ask one quick

2179
04:12:42,000 --> 04:12:43,000
question? You

2180
04:12:43,000 --> 04:12:45,000
mentioned that, you know,

2181
04:12:45,000 --> 04:12:46,000
like you

2182
04:12:46,000 --> 04:12:54,000
mentioned that you picked cities like San Francisco and others which have great inclusionary programs.

2183
04:12:54,000 --> 04:13:05,000
Again, you know, like in many other housing element issues, are we one of the leaders among small towns in such policy making? I think what we would

2184
04:13:05,000 --> 04:13:06,000
say here

2185
04:13:06,000 --> 04:13:19,000
is that there are some definitely unique approaches to how those feasibility studies that are done at point in times, each jurisdiction handles them. So it's not necessarily about the size.

2186
04:13:19,000 --> 04:13:23,000
of the jurisdiction or their programs. Jurisdictions like us, like

2187
04:13:23,000 --> 04:13:24,000
Hillsborough, Atherton,

2188
04:13:24,000 --> 04:13:28,000
Woodside I'm just thinking are we the front runners

2189
04:13:28,000 --> 04:13:29,000
here? So

2190
04:13:29,000 --> 04:13:30,000
on this

2191
04:13:30,000 --> 04:13:31,000
particular issue,

2192
04:13:31,000 --> 04:13:33,000
this is again one of the reasons why

2193
04:13:33,000 --> 04:13:34,000
we want

2194
04:13:34,000 --> 04:13:44,000
to be able to continue the issue to give strategic economics and our staff the ability to look at some of those other.

2195
04:13:44,000 --> 04:13:59,000
Okay. Those other cities, right? That's hard to compare us to a Palo Alto. We have at least three that other models that we know of currently that we're comfortable with from a perspective of how it would impact our proposal and our policy. Okay, I'm sure that this next step is not

2196
04:13:59,000 --> 04:14:03,000
going to take a lot of time, but I'd like to do it anyway.

2197
04:14:03,000 --> 04:14:19,000
Since it was publicly noticed, if there's anybody here in the audience or online that came here for this item and would like to to provide comments. I'd like to open the public hearing for that. I guess it's not. Is it a yeah, it is a public hearing. Correct. Yeah.

2198
04:14:19,000 --> 04:14:35,000
So I'd like to open the public hearing. Is there anyone? I don't see anyone. I am closing the public hearing. Okay. And then I'll propose a motion that we continue this item to a date certain.

2199
04:14:35,000 --> 04:14:38,000
And that date is September… August 13th. August 13th. 13th

2200
04:14:38,000 --> 04:14:39,000
week. Next

2201
04:14:39,000 --> 04:14:40,000
week. Yeah,

2202
04:14:40,000 --> 04:14:41,000
and I

2203
04:14:41,000 --> 04:14:51,000
would say that, you know, um, we'll also be noticing this for the council meeting that'll be on August 20th, assuming that there's a positive reaction for the policy from the Commission.

2204
04:14:51,000 --> 04:14:53,000
Okay. Okay.

2205
04:14:53,000 --> 04:14:54,000
Second,

2206
04:14:54,000 --> 04:14:55,000
I'll second it.

2207
04:14:55,000 --> 04:15:01,000
Uh…

2208
04:15:01,000 --> 04:15:08,000
I'm just wondering if I can throw a unanimous consent here. I just get the word. Go ahead

2209
04:15:08,000 --> 04:15:13,000
and do a vote. Commissioner Indico. Yes. Commissioner Jeaned. Yes. Commissioner Patel? Yes.

2210
04:15:13,000 --> 04:15:16,000
Chair Washira? Yes.

2211
04:15:16,000 --> 04:15:27,000
And then Cher, if I would, I'd ask for an adjustment to the schedule to be, or the agenda to be able to bring forward Betham. They've been patiently waiting through our last items.

2212
04:15:27,000 --> 04:15:28,000
I

2213
04:15:28,000 --> 04:15:38,000
agree. That is item 6, 2. So we'll take a short. We're moving on to study sessions.

2214
04:15:38,000 --> 04:15:41,000
And there are two study sessions this evening.

2215
04:15:41,000 --> 04:15:46,000
6, 1, 6, 2. Let me just make sure there's no 63. There

2216
04:15:46,000 --> 04:15:47,000
are 3.

2217
04:15:47,000 --> 04:16:04,000
Okay, so there are 3, and we will swap the orders of one and two. Please. In order to bring 6 2 forward. So study sessions are an opportunity for the Commission to review a topic, ask questions of staff, hear from the public and provide direction.

2218
04:16:04,000 --> 04:16:07,000
No formal action is taken on a study session item.

2219
04:16:07,000 --> 04:16:27,000
Members of the public will be given an opportunity to comment on each study session item with 3 min per speaker item. We will swap item 6.1 and 6.2. Let's move on to 6.2. 6.2, 26, 790, Arrastredaro Road, file.

2220
04:16:27,000 --> 04:16:44,000
Pound PA26-0037 lands of congregation Beth Am. This is a study session to review conceptual plans for a new security gatehouse and on-site parking and circulation improvements at Congregation Beth Am.

2221
04:16:44,000 --> 04:16:52,000
This is an information item only to provide feedback to the applicant. No formal action will be taken.

2222
04:16:52,000 --> 04:16:56,000
Uh, just a moment…

2223
04:16:56,000 --> 04:16:59,000
Okay, the.

2224
04:16:59,000 --> 04:17:06,000
Planner, the senior planner for this project is Jonathan Fox. Jonathan, would you like to commence with

2225
04:17:06,000 --> 04:17:07,000
the quick

2226
04:17:07,000 --> 04:17:17,000
words. Thank you, Chair. Congregation, Beth M operates a conditional use permit at the restaurant property for a religious institution that was originally improved.

2227
04:17:17,000 --> 04:17:19,000
In 1958.

2228
04:17:19,000 --> 04:17:30,000
the modern COP with its existing conditions or approval was approved in 1997. The last renewal was in 2006, meaning that the conditional use permit is expired.

2229
04:17:30,000 --> 04:17:48,000
Congregation Bethem is going to present conceptual plans for improvements to the property. We expect that project to come back with a formal application in front of the Planning Commission, which will provide a recommendation to the CUP renewal, the amendment, and the underlying site development permit or variances.

2230
04:17:48,000 --> 04:17:59,000
to the City Council. We expect that there will be a variance required for the reconfiguration of some existing parking spaces that are in the setback currently.

2231
04:17:59,000 --> 04:18:05,000
And with that, I'll give it to the Beth M team to give the presentation.

2232
04:18:05,000 --> 04:18:11,000
Yes, let's the applicant present the conceptual plans.

2233
04:18:11,000 --> 04:18:12,000
I'm

2234
04:18:12,000 --> 04:18:13,000
just going to introduce

2235
04:18:13,000 --> 04:18:21,000
our architect. I'm Deborah Raden. I'm the president at Betham. I also… so, first of all, honored to be able to represent

2236
04:18:21,000 --> 04:18:28,000
a congregation here. Also grew up in Los Altos Hills. I started in first grade at Bullis.

2237
04:18:28,000 --> 04:18:47,000
have really not have come and gone, but have grown up here, raised my family here. So still a resident of Los Altos Hills. So this is home for me as well. So very, very important. What Rob Steinberg, our architect, is going to show you is how important it is that we're working with you as partners on this.

2238
04:18:47,000 --> 04:18:59,000
We've been members of the community for 70 years, very important. And now with for many reasons we'll be explaining security is vital upgrading our security.

2239
04:18:59,000 --> 04:19:16,000
making our campus more accessible, more welcoming, easier for people to get up the hills at our campus. So so with that, I'm going to introduce you to Rob. I know it's a late night, but he's going to take the show away. Thank you all.

2240
04:19:16,000 --> 04:19:19,000
Good evening. Good evening.

2241
04:19:19,000 --> 04:19:20,000
It's very

2242
04:19:20,000 --> 04:19:21,000
nice

2243
04:19:21,000 --> 04:19:22,000
to be

2244
04:19:22,000 --> 04:19:23,000
with you. I also am.

2245
04:19:23,000 --> 04:19:27,000
move to Los Altos Hills in 1952.

2246
04:19:27,000 --> 04:19:30,000
And grew up

2247
04:19:30,000 --> 04:19:31,000
here. And.

2248
04:19:31,000 --> 04:19:34,000
I'm very pleased to be here with you tonight.

2249
04:19:34,000 --> 04:19:50,000
I wanted to tell you that my father, Goody Steinberg, who designed many, many homes in Los Altos Hills, was the design voice for Congregation Betham.

2250
04:19:50,000 --> 04:20:01,000
And he had two driving principles that have really directed our efforts over the years. One is that the building should be in harmony with nature.

2251
04:20:01,000 --> 04:20:14,000
And two, that there should be both because of our beautiful climate and the setting, indoor and outdoor rooms and places where people connect, and we can build community. Next, please.

2252
04:20:14,000 --> 04:20:23,000
Our site, which takes its access from a Racadero Road, was purchased in the 1950s. Next.

2253
04:20:23,000 --> 04:20:29,000
And our campus is blessed to have very good planning and architectural boats.

2254
04:20:29,000 --> 04:20:46,000
You can see by the sketch on the left on the sketch that the outdoor rooms, which are green in the indoor rooms in blue are shown on the campus. It's a little faded out here, but most of those are on the left side.

2255
04:20:46,000 --> 04:21:01,000
The parking in the yellow is on the right. And the takeaway here is that the parking is at the bottom of the hill, and most of the activities is on the left at the top of the hill. Next, please.

2256
04:21:01,000 --> 04:21:17,000
So this is a section through the site, and you can see that the bulk of the parking is at the lower level, and it is a significant climb, particularly for our aging congregation, to take to get up to the top of the hill.

2257
04:21:17,000 --> 04:21:22,000
where most of the activities are taking place. Next, please.

2258
04:21:22,000 --> 04:21:33,000
There were 3 building phases to the property in 1958 is the light blue, the 2.

2259
04:21:33,000 --> 04:21:49,000
Sorry, the colors are a little faded out here, but the lightest color in 1966, the main synagogue and social hall was added. And in 2000 was the Beit Kehila. Next, please.

2260
04:21:49,000 --> 04:21:55,000
So, this is the classroom and administration building, so we were first built in 1958.

2261
04:21:55,000 --> 04:22:12,000
Next. And this is a photo that I took in 1977 when I joined my father as an architect. And I don't know if you know this, but in 2006, the American Institute of Architects awarded Beth on their prestigious 25 year.

2262
04:22:12,000 --> 04:22:25,000
award for distinguished and enduring buildings in Silicon Valley. And I'll be honest with you on a personal note, Betham was one of the reasons that I wanted to become an architect.

2263
04:22:25,000 --> 04:22:27,000
Next, please.

2264
04:22:27,000 --> 04:22:34,000
I was privileged to be the architect for the lower campus in around 2000. Next, please.

2265
04:22:34,000 --> 04:22:42,000
and I want to tell you today, Betham was not designed to accommodate the same level of security that is required today.

2266
04:22:42,000 --> 04:22:56,000
And in addition to security and safety, welcoming others and a sense of openness, welcoming the community is also an important part of our values. Next, please.

2267
04:22:56,000 --> 04:23:07,000
So this is our existing entry on a Rastadero, and if you look at the picture on the left, I'm not sure that it either looks secure or invited.

2268
04:23:07,000 --> 04:23:14,000
The tired looking sign was a gift from my family to Congregation Bethlehem over 60 years ago.

2269
04:23:14,000 --> 04:23:21,000
The barrage of well-meaning signage and the lifeless guard check leave, frankly, a sad at first impression.

2270
04:23:21,000 --> 04:23:23,000
Next, please.

2271
04:23:23,000 --> 04:23:30,000
So our proposal is for a new entry that includes two lanes of egress.

2272
04:23:30,000 --> 04:23:39,000
ingress, one lane for individuals needing assistant that would have to stop at the guardhouse in one lane for those with approved access.

2273
04:23:39,000 --> 04:23:54,000
A new pedestrian path that's separate from the vehicles, so people could come in on bikes easily. A security pavilion. And directly after passing through security, a new electronic signage.

2274
04:23:54,000 --> 04:23:56,000
Next, please.

2275
04:23:56,000 --> 04:24:08,000
So this is a view of the entry, and we envision Betham, honestly, as a spiritual retreat nestled into a residential neighborhood.

2276
04:24:08,000 --> 04:24:21,000
A series of low organic walls, or what I refer to as reeds, emerging from the ground, literally reach out to welcome the visitor, funneling them towards the entrance.

2277
04:24:21,000 --> 04:24:23,000
Next, please.

2278
04:24:23,000 --> 04:24:27,000
As one approaches the entry pavilion, security becomes more evident.

2279
04:24:27,000 --> 04:24:36,000
These metaphorical reads become more closely spaced together, increasing in height, forming an entry portal.

2280
04:24:36,000 --> 04:24:47,000
the gaps in the oak in between the opaque walls are infilled with transparent fencing that allows partial visibility into the campus.

2281
04:24:47,000 --> 04:24:56,000
next place. So I'm sorry. This is a little light, but I just showed you the entry on the on the far right bottom.

2282
04:24:56,000 --> 04:25:07,000
And if you move clockwise, there are three modest but impactful interventions that we're also proposing to add.

2283
04:25:07,000 --> 04:25:22,000
There's a drop-off at the bottom with the classrooms. There's a new front door at what would be nine o'clock and a drop off again at the administration at 12 o'clock. And I'll show you what those look like.

2284
04:25:22,000 --> 04:25:39,000
Next, please. This is a view of the existing drop off at the classroom area. And you can see there's a significant grade level change from the drop off at the road up to the buildings themselves.

2285
04:25:39,000 --> 04:25:40,000
Next,

2286
04:25:40,000 --> 04:25:42,000
please.

2287
04:25:42,000 --> 04:25:51,000
So, without narrowing or impeding the existing two-lane roadway, we're proposing on the left, 8 additional parking spaces.

2288
04:25:51,000 --> 04:25:55,000
On the right are four off street drop-off spaces.

2289
04:25:55,000 --> 04:26:03,000
In a new accessible ramp providing access to the outdoor chapel in the other buildings at the top of the campus.

2290
04:26:03,000 --> 04:26:08,000
All of the improvements are inboard from the existing road.

2291
04:26:08,000 --> 04:26:09,000
Next,

2292
04:26:09,000 --> 04:26:11,000
please.

2293
04:26:11,000 --> 04:26:28,000
The existing drop-off near the classrooms and outdoor would be reconfigured to provide a little additional parking spaces on the left, the drop off in loading on the right in the landing at the bottom of the stair would be expanded to accommodate seating.

2294
04:26:28,000 --> 04:26:34,000
Signage in an accessible ramp leading directly to the outdoor chapel.

2295
04:26:34,000 --> 04:26:36,000
Next, please.

2296
04:26:36,000 --> 04:26:47,000
At the top of the hill, the only place where the topography is flat is an ideal location to create a welcoming front door, which we don't really have right now.

2297
04:26:47,000 --> 04:26:55,000
A community space and an arrival plaza could add energy to the arrival experience. Next, please.

2298
04:26:55,000 --> 04:27:01,000
Decorative paving, places to sit, enhanced landscaping, announce the arrival.

2299
04:27:01,000 --> 04:27:10,000
Just as an aside, we've recently re-roofed the entire campus with a combustible heavy shake roof.

2300
04:27:10,000 --> 04:27:16,000
Um, a fire retardant fiberglass, shingles, replacing our 70 year old.

2301
04:27:16,000 --> 04:27:19,000
wood shake roofs.

2302
04:27:19,000 --> 04:27:28,000
We're proud of that, and we're trying to upgrade the campus piece by piece. Next, please. Okay, you got it on the right.

2303
04:27:28,000 --> 04:27:43,000
Our 16 reconfigured parking places, including 2 required covered Ada spaces that we committed to provide to the city based upon a solar project that we completed last year.

2304
04:27:43,000 --> 04:27:55,000
On the left are 2 off street drop off spaces. And again, a new accessible ramp providing access to the offices, library and the social hall courtyard.

2305
04:27:55,000 --> 04:28:08,000
Next. In addition to adding more available parking at the top of the hill. The new off street drop off for unloading can facilitate short term transactions and deliveries with the office.

2306
04:28:08,000 --> 04:28:14,000
In a new accessible ramp directs visitors to the office in the main conference room.

2307
04:28:14,000 --> 04:28:15,000
Next,

2308
04:28:15,000 --> 04:28:16,000
please.

2309
04:28:16,000 --> 04:28:29,000
Lastly, this is a view opposite the entry stairs to the administrative office that shows the required ADA covered parking that we committed to provide as part of our previously approved solar project.

2310
04:28:29,000 --> 04:28:37,000
Now, I probably have given you more information that you wanted this late at night, but we're here tonight to.

2311
04:28:37,000 --> 04:28:53,000
give you a sense of where we're trying to go, and to get input from you, what we can include in our presentation and our submittal to you to give you all of the information that you need to make a thoughtful decision.

2312
04:28:53,000 --> 04:28:54,000
Thank

2313
04:28:54,000 --> 04:28:56,000
you, Commissioners.

2314
04:28:56,000 --> 04:29:00,000
No questions for now for I just have questions for staff.

2315
04:29:00,000 --> 04:29:01,000
Well, this isn't…

2316
04:29:01,000 --> 04:29:12,000
this is just an informational thing, so we're really just going to talk back and forth at this stage. If you have any feedback. I'm disappointed that I have nothing to say. This looks so beautiful.

2317
04:29:12,000 --> 04:29:18,000
I don't have really much to say. The only thing I would say,

2318
04:29:18,000 --> 04:29:22,000
1st of all, I love your bike lighting. I

2319
04:29:22,000 --> 04:29:23,000
like that. Sorry,

2320
04:29:23,000 --> 04:29:24,000
I love

2321
04:29:24,000 --> 04:29:27,000
the slides. Your hand painted drawings look wonderful.

2322
04:29:27,000 --> 04:29:31,000
So, I haven't seen many architects do

2323
04:29:31,000 --> 04:29:35,000
these days. So that is great. Oh,

2324
04:29:35,000 --> 04:29:37,000
you mean ChatGPT didn't

2325
04:29:37,000 --> 04:29:39,000
do that? I don't

2326
04:29:39,000 --> 04:29:41,000
know. No,

2327
04:29:41,000 --> 04:29:44,000
ChatGP did not do that.

2328
04:29:44,000 --> 04:29:52,000
But, uh, the only question I had is, with all the parking that you're adding, how close is it to the property line?

2329
04:29:52,000 --> 04:29:54,000
On the

2330
04:29:54,000 --> 04:29:56,000
sites. So if

2331
04:29:56,000 --> 04:30:00,000
we look at this drawing, the.

2332
04:30:00,000 --> 04:30:16,000
entry grade is exactly where it is now, just to configure right on the parking and drop off. I'm going to call it 6 o'clock, the bottom is all inboard of the road. So we're not going any closer.

2333
04:30:16,000 --> 04:30:17,000
11 o'clock.

2334
04:30:17,000 --> 04:30:20,000
Right. Right. On the left.

2335
04:30:20,000 --> 04:30:22,000
at 9 o'clock.

2336
04:30:22,000 --> 04:30:24,000
It's it's all inboard.

2337
04:30:24,000 --> 04:30:40,000
Uh, it's existing parking. It was accessible handicap parking when it was built, but it is not meet today's accessible standards today. So we want to fix that. We want to… we… our population is getting older.

2338
04:30:40,000 --> 04:30:47,000
And we've got to accommodate them so that they can participate and enjoy the facilities.

2339
04:30:47,000 --> 04:30:52,000
on the one at 12 o'clock.

2340
04:30:52,000 --> 04:30:54,000
We are…

2341
04:30:54,000 --> 04:31:04,000
I think we may be infringing a little bit beyond where we are today. But in the measure of 3 or 4 feet. So there is parking there now.

2342
04:31:04,000 --> 04:31:10,000
Uh, but we're reconfiguring it, we're making it, bringing it up to code standards today. Do

2343
04:31:10,000 --> 04:31:15,000
you anticipate the neighbors having any feedback about that? Well, we're… we will meet with

2344
04:31:15,000 --> 04:31:21,000
the neighbors. We wanted to meet with you first before we started meeting with the neighbors.

2345
04:31:21,000 --> 04:31:33,000
We, I believe, are going to ask for a variance for a small portion of that top part where we are in that setback a little bit, but we are in that setback currently.

2346
04:31:33,000 --> 04:31:49,000
So we are infringing another 3 or 4 feet. We're happy to work with the neighbors on planting or what have you. Their homes are quite a ways away in the closest thing on the other side of the is a driveway.

2347
04:31:49,000 --> 04:31:52,000
Going there, so it's not…

2348
04:31:52,000 --> 04:31:53,000
approximate

2349
04:31:53,000 --> 04:31:59,000
to a home. And you have enough room between the parking and the property line to put shrubs in. We

2350
04:31:59,000 --> 04:32:02,000
do, we do, yes. There's parking there now.

2351
04:32:02,000 --> 04:32:12,000
We're really, we're just reconfiguring it, because it doesn't meet today's parking standards. They were. They were done quite a number of years ago.

2352
04:32:12,000 --> 04:32:28,000
So really, what we're trying to do is to secure our entrance and have some security, because people are worried that it's a big campus and anybody can drive in. And that's that's not right.

2353
04:32:28,000 --> 04:32:29,000
Well, anything

2354
04:32:29,000 --> 04:32:42,000
I know staff feels the same way about this. Anything we can do to move this along and facilitate it and get that security in place, we want to be able to support that.

2355
04:32:42,000 --> 04:32:43,000
I

2356
04:32:43,000 --> 04:32:53,000
love hearing that. Next time we come, I want to be right in front of that other group, not after. I'm teasing you. I have a

2357
04:32:53,000 --> 04:32:58,000
couple of questions. This is coming in front of us because…

2358
04:32:58,000 --> 04:33:01,000
I just want to clarify something. Yes, so

2359
04:33:01,000 --> 04:33:14,000
study sessions. We we try to use sparingly for an opportunity to get in front of the Planning Commission. It's typically for more unique residential projects, and then we've done them more frequently.

2360
04:33:14,000 --> 04:33:15,000
Yeah,

2361
04:33:15,000 --> 04:33:16,000
but the

2362
04:33:16,000 --> 04:33:19,000
number of parking is changing from existing to how much?

2363
04:33:19,000 --> 04:33:20,000
Yeah,

2364
04:33:20,000 --> 04:33:26,000
the parking is not a trigger for the Planning Commission's review. The trigger is that it's a CUP renewal and an amendment. Okay,

2365
04:33:26,000 --> 04:33:33,000
that's basically it. I just wanted to clarify why we are getting this. It's similar to what we looked at previously for the other project. And if

2366
04:33:33,000 --> 04:33:36,000
I can. So there are no concerns about.

2367
04:33:36,000 --> 04:33:39,000
Mfa and MDA and all of those things. We haven't received

2368
04:33:39,000 --> 04:33:45,000
those numbers yet, but it's largely reconfigures of existing space, right? So it doesn't seem like it's an

2369
04:33:45,000 --> 04:33:49,000
issue. But I just wanted to know. Okay, we'll certainly be checking

2370
04:33:49,000 --> 04:33:50,000
that. Okay. And if I

2371
04:33:50,000 --> 04:33:55,000
can just make a suggestion to show like Google Maps, you know the aerials.

2372
04:33:55,000 --> 04:33:59,000
It just helps to kind of see the neighborhood and everything

2373
04:33:59,000 --> 04:34:00,000
else. Then

2374
04:34:00,000 --> 04:34:01,000
you submit.

2375
04:34:01,000 --> 04:34:02,000
I apologize

2376
04:34:02,000 --> 04:34:07,000
to you, but the first the slide that showed the 9 acres, our site, Aristadero.

2377
04:34:07,000 --> 04:34:19,000
is a Google Aerial. It's just… it's a little… it got a little, uh, washed down here. But that was my intention with this slide. That's actually to showing you the context. Okay, yeah, because I'm just looking at my own little

2378
04:34:19,000 --> 04:34:23,000
phone here, and just kind of getting a feel for it, and just…

2379
04:34:23,000 --> 04:34:26,000
It just helps to clarify better. I'm

2380
04:34:26,000 --> 04:34:32,000
sorry, but maybe we whited out the neighbors a little too much. But yeah, yeah.

2381
04:34:32,000 --> 04:34:33,000
No, but

2382
04:34:33,000 --> 04:34:38,000
I see what you were saying that the property on the top of.

2383
04:34:38,000 --> 04:34:41,000
This diagram are further out.

2384
04:34:41,000 --> 04:34:43,000
There's a road, yes. Yeah,

2385
04:34:43,000 --> 04:34:44,000
which is

2386
04:34:44,000 --> 04:34:57,000
good. Yeah. So the only thing we see is that when like to give feedback, I mean, the, the gate and everything looks like it's set back in, I'm guessing it's going to comply with all the town's requirements.

2387
04:34:57,000 --> 04:35:08,000
Um, the only thing is the parking spaces which are being pushed out in the top, which you called at 12. It looks like it's going in that 10 foot grading setback.

2388
04:35:08,000 --> 04:35:25,000
Or close to it, at least not in this, but in the drawing that was submitted. So that seems to be the only thing coming to maybe John Chau to review. But apart from that, the parking at the bottom, and there, I mean, these are very preliminary drawings, so it's very difficult to read the.

2389
04:35:25,000 --> 04:35:36,000
But that is what you will be submitting next as more detailed drawings. So from our side, it's just that if we are we are supportive of this.

2390
04:35:36,000 --> 04:35:37,000
Yeah,

2391
04:35:37,000 --> 04:35:51,000
I think what to your question earlier, right? About why we're here. So if there's anything that was an immediate reaction from any of the planning commissioners, you know, the kind of fail fast, you know, type of.

2392
04:35:51,000 --> 04:35:58,000
Um, like, uh, this is critical to us, this isn't critical to us, those types of things. Yeah. So please, yeah,

2393
04:35:58,000 --> 04:35:59,000
no, it

2394
04:35:59,000 --> 04:36:09,000
just came up mainly because since you're going to have a guard gate and gates, which I'm totally for sense of security for the campus, is I'm just concerned about the traffic on Arastadero.

2395
04:36:09,000 --> 04:36:25,000
As far as when you do have your different session, how much of a backup is going to happen on Arasadero as people are waiting to get past security? And there may need to be a traffic feasibility study or something where you might need to pull the guard gate back.

2396
04:36:25,000 --> 04:36:33,000
into the property a little bit, so you can accommodate more cars being queued up. I don't know, that's kind of my

2397
04:36:33,000 --> 04:36:34,000
initial gut

2398
04:36:34,000 --> 04:36:41,000
thoughts. So we're happy to do that. We have run this by a traffic engineer. We have about 4 car lengths.

2399
04:36:41,000 --> 04:36:56,000
Um, before you get to the gatehouse. Okay. And when we have events where we have a lot of people coming in, we will have the gates open, and we will have staff there to be able to facilitate moving people in.

2400
04:36:56,000 --> 04:37:15,000
And we have a second lane for people that will either have a fob or license plate readers so they can move through quickly. But this is generally for security when we're expecting and we know when we're going to have.

2401
04:37:15,000 --> 04:37:22,000
religious services, or we're going to have large activity, then the the gates would be open, and there would be someone there. I

2402
04:37:22,000 --> 04:37:28,000
guess the whole property fenced at its perimeter? It is. It is currently. It is.

2403
04:37:28,000 --> 04:37:29,000
Okay. So

2404
04:37:29,000 --> 04:37:31,000
when you'll be submitting formally, just like the.

2405
04:37:31,000 --> 04:37:43,000
Pinewood School, my guess is the number of cars and number of people, the timing, everything would be submitted, it'll be very clear how much traffic is coming through and not at what time. Right, yeah. Let me ask you,

2406
04:37:43,000 --> 04:37:44,000
is the rest…

2407
04:37:44,000 --> 04:37:45,000
Is there

2408
04:37:45,000 --> 04:37:46,000
a turning lane at Arrastred?

2409
04:37:46,000 --> 04:37:47,000
I was gonna

2410
04:37:47,000 --> 04:37:48,000
ask, Aristadera, what does that look like?

2411
04:37:48,000 --> 04:37:57,000
There is a left turn lane when you're traveling west, I guess east to west. But it's not

2412
04:37:57,000 --> 04:37:59,000
close to the intersection.

2413
04:37:59,000 --> 04:38:02,000
No. Near the no I wanted to

2414
04:38:02,000 --> 04:38:03,000
know if

2415
04:38:03,000 --> 04:38:06,000
at the gate, there's a left turn.

2416
04:38:06,000 --> 04:38:07,000
It's

2417
04:38:07,000 --> 04:38:11,000
coming from Foothill Expression from the Foothill

2418
04:38:11,000 --> 04:38:12,000
Express. It's

2419
04:38:12,000 --> 04:38:14,000
there on the other way. Yeah.

2420
04:38:14,000 --> 04:38:15,000
And

2421
04:38:15,000 --> 04:38:21,000
then do people that come from East going west making a left turn into there?

2422
04:38:21,000 --> 04:38:26,000
Currently, does… is there any queuing up that happens?

2423
04:38:26,000 --> 04:38:27,000
With the current, you know,

2424
04:38:27,000 --> 04:38:32,000
entrance at all, you know, when you've got your big services, or…

2425
04:38:32,000 --> 04:38:37,000
Or big events? No, because there, um, we have, um…

2426
04:38:37,000 --> 04:38:42,000
parking staff that is there directing people and keeping the flow.

2427
04:38:42,000 --> 04:38:43,000
Yeah.

2428
04:38:43,000 --> 04:38:52,000
And honestly, what we're doing is we're adding a second lane, which we don't currently have. Okay. We're facilitating.

2429
04:38:52,000 --> 04:39:08,000
So what we wanted is we wanted a secure lane where people could come in. There is a turnaround. If you decide you came in, and this is not where you want to go. So you can exit before the gate. Yeah. And then there is a separate lane.

2430
04:39:08,000 --> 04:39:21,000
for people that have passes that can move right through. Right. And when we have large activities, we'll man that and organize it. But we've never had any backup trouble. Okay. We've never had any problems. Rust

2431
04:39:21,000 --> 04:39:27,000
is a major road anyway for traffic normally, so it's not like we're in a residential…

2432
04:39:27,000 --> 04:39:29,000
setting right there, exactly. So, yeah.

2433
04:39:29,000 --> 04:39:30,000
Is it fair

2434
04:39:30,000 --> 04:39:35,000
to say most of your traffic's on the weekend?

2435
04:39:35,000 --> 04:39:38,000
Please.

2436
04:39:38,000 --> 04:39:39,000
Most

2437
04:39:39,000 --> 04:39:46,000
of our traffic would be maybe Friday night for services Friday night, which, um…

2438
04:39:46,000 --> 04:39:56,000
But but going in is never a problem. Going and no, because people come in and out at different times, or high holidays, Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur, but

2439
04:39:56,000 --> 04:40:02,000
then we have fully, fully staffed. I'm just thinking of the it competes with Tesla traffic and.

2440
04:40:02,000 --> 04:40:04,000
All of those… the others

2441
04:40:04,000 --> 04:40:07,000
off Deer Creek. That's further down the other

2442
04:40:07,000 --> 04:40:08,000
way. Yeah,

2443
04:40:08,000 --> 04:40:09,000
but they

2444
04:40:09,000 --> 04:40:17,000
come back. Yeah. So the entrance… but we're… our entrance is right across where… is it broadband now? Broadband? Yeah. Right?

2445
04:40:17,000 --> 04:40:21,000
It used to be a VMware. So we're east of…

2446
04:40:21,000 --> 04:40:23,000
Fremont. We're exactly, we're right,

2447
04:40:23,000 --> 04:40:38,000
not quite Deer Creek. So we're right in that in-between… we're right across from the Stanford. There's Stanford parking right across from us. So we're far enough back from the intersection, and then also from where Tesla comes out at Deer Creek that. Yeah.

2448
04:40:38,000 --> 04:40:40,000
That we're not backing. I

2449
04:40:40,000 --> 04:40:41,000
lived here

2450
04:40:41,000 --> 04:40:54,000
for 30 years, and I don't re… and I do travel that way to get up to 280. I don't recall any kind of traffic in front of Beckham, to be honest with you. So I'm like, I'm just asking the obvious questions, so, yeah.

2451
04:40:54,000 --> 04:40:56,000
There's also a dedicated left turn lane.

2452
04:40:56,000 --> 04:40:58,000
Oh, okay. So,

2453
04:40:58,000 --> 04:41:00,000
yeah, that helps. So I

2454
04:41:00,000 --> 04:41:01,000
think

2455
04:41:01,000 --> 04:41:04,000
just one more question. Have you, uh…

2456
04:41:04,000 --> 04:41:11,000
Had any neighbors have any concerns over the last, you know, years, like decades?

2457
04:41:11,000 --> 04:41:12,000
concerns

2458
04:41:12,000 --> 04:41:17,000
as in not not not about traffic, right? Just in general. No, no, in general,

2459
04:41:17,000 --> 04:41:18,000
right? We

2460
04:41:18,000 --> 04:41:23,000
have, um, so no, we've had an amazing relationship with our neighbors. Okay. Yeah.

2461
04:41:23,000 --> 04:41:25,000
That's great, because that helps.

2462
04:41:25,000 --> 04:41:26,000
It helps

2463
04:41:26,000 --> 04:41:28,000
a lot. I think most recently.

2464
04:41:28,000 --> 04:41:45,000
You might all know we had vacant land that was adjacent that we had. We know it well. Yes. So in that process, we made sure we spent a lot of time with our neighbors then. Okay. And there were no problems, there were just questions, and we dealt with it. So it was a relationship.

2465
04:41:45,000 --> 04:41:46,000
Okay, great. I

2466
04:41:46,000 --> 04:41:47,000
think as

2467
04:41:47,000 --> 04:42:05,000
study session, we're just giving feedback. I think our feedback is just, you know, having maybe a slide or two and some details about the left turn lane, how many cars can fit in before the gate, you know, things like that, timing of when you expect the most crowd, so you can have the doors open.

2468
04:42:05,000 --> 04:42:21,000
Is it just if you have two lanes, that's 4 plus… so 8 cars more than that. How are you? I mean, I think it's going to be more of a general question on that, so more details which are given just at that a gate intersection would be great.

2469
04:42:21,000 --> 04:42:37,000
Probably as a submittal, and the rest would be, to be very honest, is just that parking area, which is on the top, which is going to be probably very close to the property line, which is going to be more the city staff kind of looking at it, and you know, privacy screening and.

2470
04:42:37,000 --> 04:42:43,000
May and definitely talking to the neighbors and bringing those signatures in that, you know, they support that.

2471
04:42:43,000 --> 04:42:50,000
Yeah, I don't think there is anything much that we need to give you guys feedback on. No, but, you know, like,

2472
04:42:50,000 --> 04:42:52,000
when we did the Pinewood School, it

2473
04:42:52,000 --> 04:43:00,000
was really nice, even though this is so non-impacting, just to get the neighborhood. It's just kind of a nice way to say, you know.

2474
04:43:00,000 --> 04:43:02,000
Yeah, they agree, for sure.

2475
04:43:02,000 --> 04:43:03,000
Let's take

2476
04:43:03,000 --> 04:43:17,000
a moment and just see if there's anybody online or elsewhere that would like to provide any feedback on this. We do have a Francis Lew's hand raised.

2477
04:43:17,000 --> 04:43:21,000
Uh, can we determine if that's for real?

2478
04:43:21,000 --> 04:43:28,000
And ask her to go ahead. Go ahead, Francis. And Lila, can you present those?

2479
04:43:28,000 --> 04:43:49,000
And she asked to present some, uh, some photos. Oh, very good.

2480
04:43:49,000 --> 04:43:51,000
Can you hear us, Francis?

2481
04:43:51,000 --> 04:43:52,000
Can you hear me now?

2482
04:43:52,000 --> 04:43:53,000
Yes.

2483
04:43:53,000 --> 04:43:55,000
Yes, we can.

2484
04:43:55,000 --> 04:43:57,000
Okay, so

2485
04:43:57,000 --> 04:44:03,000
I have no problem with all your improvements and more buildings and making a better entry

2486
04:44:03,000 --> 04:44:06,000
Francis, Francis, can you hear me?

2487
04:44:06,000 --> 04:44:07,000
Yes, I can.

2488
04:44:07,000 --> 04:44:15,000
Francis, please try to talk right at your microphone and continue to talk right at your microphone.

2489
04:44:15,000 --> 04:44:19,000
I'm using

2490
04:44:19,000 --> 04:44:22,000
PC. So where's the microphone?

2491
04:44:22,000 --> 04:44:23,000
Is it on top

2492
04:44:23,000 --> 04:44:27,000
For a moment there, it was very good. So just continue doing that.

2493
04:44:27,000 --> 04:44:42,000
Okay, so I… my only concern is my house is right in the corner of Fremont and Arrest Rodero. My house faces is the first house that faces Fremont, and the corner of Fremontero

2494
04:44:42,000 --> 04:44:59,000
It's part of my property. And the only concern is with everything that you're doing, is it going to cost more water? I mean, the drainage, is it going to stay on site? Do you have any like drainage plan or because right now on my property

2495
04:44:59,000 --> 04:45:03,000
That's a kind of a drainage creek

2496
04:45:03,000 --> 04:45:20,000
doing the summertime is all dry, and it kind of runs along a restaurant. So between your driveway, go through to my neighbor's house before it come to my house, and then it goes through my property, and then it drains in the corner of Fremont and the rest of the Darrow

2497
04:45:20,000 --> 04:45:29,000
So this is the drain… this is the drain that I… that on your property, and it goes through one neighbor's house, and then the second neighbor's house

2498
04:45:29,000 --> 04:45:46,000
And then the picture with the little iron grid, that's the end of my creek from my neighbor's property. Then it goes to the corner and goes down, goes down under the pipe underneath Fremont. So my concern is right now, when it rains, that's a lot of water

2499
04:45:46,000 --> 04:45:56,000
So is it going to be more water coming my way when you do this project, or is it not going to make that much difference?

2500
04:45:56,000 --> 04:45:58,000
I don't think

2501
04:45:58,000 --> 04:46:03,000
that there is going to be a dramatic difference.

2502
04:46:03,000 --> 04:46:08,000
Between what's there now and.

2503
04:46:08,000 --> 04:46:21,000
in the future there is a retention basin at our entrance that collects our water. It's rarely.

2504
04:46:21,000 --> 04:46:38,000
You rarely see water in it, but is part of the original drainage for the project. There is a retention basin. If the low part of the site, and our intent is to improve that, and we'll have to.

2505
04:46:38,000 --> 04:46:44,000
meet the conditions of drainage and on-site water retention. Because

2506
04:46:44,000 --> 04:46:45,000
you are,

2507
04:46:45,000 --> 04:46:50,000
you are repaving some of your parking spaces.

2508
04:46:50,000 --> 04:46:51,000
We

2509
04:46:51,000 --> 04:47:00,000
are going to add a small amount of paving at 6 o'clock and 12 o'clock. Correct. But mainly at 6 o'clock. But there'll

2510
04:47:00,000 --> 04:47:04,000
be some repaving happening to your older.

2511
04:47:04,000 --> 04:47:08,000
Road to accommodate that new whatever edition, so… There will be some

2512
04:47:08,000 --> 04:47:09,000
additional pay… So

2513
04:47:09,000 --> 04:47:10,000
you will

2514
04:47:10,000 --> 04:47:11,000
be coming

2515
04:47:11,000 --> 04:47:14,000
in with some sort of a grading plan to

2516
04:47:14,000 --> 04:47:16,000
the amount of paving we have now.

2517
04:47:16,000 --> 04:47:22,000
I think the… I don't know the exact percentage, but the incremental increase will be very modest. What I meant

2518
04:47:22,000 --> 04:47:25,000
was that you will be coming with a grading and drainage

2519
04:47:25,000 --> 04:47:28,000
plan. Absolutely. That's yes. Yeah, I think that's the main

2520
04:47:28,000 --> 04:47:34,000
thing that just take care of that properly. I think that's required.

2521
04:47:34,000 --> 04:47:51,000
Okay, because last time when you put in that big parking lot, right, the one that's facing a resident arrow, at that time, you actually, you did do something really nice for me because you came in and kind of graded the creek, I mean, the dry

2522
04:47:51,000 --> 04:48:07,000
The drainage on my property, and then you put gravel there, so at least I won't have so many weeds in the wintertime. But then my two other neighbors will not allow you to go in to do anything, so I don't have no idea what it's like when the water drains through their property

2523
04:48:07,000 --> 04:48:23,000
But I do appreciate what you did for me last time when you put in a big parking lot, because that really helps to make sure it doesn't flow to my property and just go down the street. And the city made the drainage hole under Fremont bigger, so there's more water going through

2524
04:48:23,000 --> 04:48:42,000
So usually I try to clean all the leaves on my property before it rains and in the city cleans those two holes. It goes under Fremont. But then what the other neighbors do, I have no idea, but still a lot of leaves get washed out because there's so many oak trees around

2525
04:48:42,000 --> 04:48:46,000
So right now I'm fine. So far, I've lived here for

2526
04:48:46,000 --> 04:48:52,000
38 actually 49 years

2527
04:48:52,000 --> 04:49:02,000
This particular drainage has not overflowed, but I did get overflow from the other side, and it was like a river on my front yard

2528
04:49:02,000 --> 04:49:03,000
But then at least

2529
04:49:03,000 --> 04:49:16,000
Well, thank you, Francis. I think that we should just be sensitive to the grading and the water flow and that would be addressed when you come back for your project. If I could through the

2530
04:49:16,000 --> 04:49:19,000
chair, if I could just say, Francis.

2531
04:49:19,000 --> 04:49:28,000
It's nice to meet you, and we would be happy to sit down and meet with you in person and make sure that we're we've got a good solution that works for both of us. Thank you.

2532
04:49:28,000 --> 04:49:42,000
Okay, so we'll talk to you again. So anyway, so I do appreciate all that graph what you put there because it like helped me out with the weeds and how you graded as so the water froze properly. So that was good for me

2533
04:49:42,000 --> 04:49:48,000
So I do appreciate you guys doing that for me. Like when you did the big parking lot

2534
04:49:48,000 --> 04:49:49,000
Thank you.

2535
04:49:49,000 --> 04:50:08,000
So as long as the water doesn't flood my yard, I'm fine. So I'm glad you're making your… I've been to your… I have been to your place several times for my kids' bar mitzer parties

2536
04:50:08,000 --> 04:50:09,000
Awesome.

2537
04:50:09,000 --> 04:50:10,000
They get invited there. That triathlon was fun. I still remember it. I remember going to two of those bodies

2538
04:50:10,000 --> 04:50:13,000
It's 11 o'clock at night.

2539
04:50:13,000 --> 04:50:14,000
Okay.

2540
04:50:14,000 --> 04:50:15,000
Thank

2541
04:50:15,000 --> 04:50:16,000
you, Francis. We really appreciate it.

2542
04:50:16,000 --> 04:50:29,000
Because my kids grew up here. And I work at Stanford for 30 years, but I retired now. But I appreciate you guys being good neighbors, except sometimes they hear loud noise on weekend when you have those wild parties. But not so much now.

2543
04:50:29,000 --> 04:50:33,000
Okay, thank you.

2544
04:50:33,000 --> 04:50:34,000
Okay, so that's what I need to say. Yeah, good luck to your project. Okay.

2545
04:50:34,000 --> 04:50:37,000
Thank you, Francis. Stay in touch. Stay tuned. Okay. Thank you. Bye-bye.

2546
04:50:37,000 --> 04:50:41,000
Bye-bye.

2547
04:50:41,000 --> 04:50:55,000
Very good. Is there any other information any of us would like to provide? Well, thank you for coming by. It's great to see what you're doing and that you're doing so well. That's nice to know too. Thank you for the opportunity to

2548
04:50:55,000 --> 04:50:57,000
look forward to having you come back

2549
04:50:57,000 --> 04:51:00,000
with your project. Okay. Thank you. And thank you

2550
04:51:00,000 --> 04:51:01,000
for the

2551
04:51:01,000 --> 04:51:06,000
history. I enjoyed hearing the history. I mean, that's almost, I hope our history committee.

2552
04:51:06,000 --> 04:51:10,000
Has the historical information about your location as well.

2553
04:51:10,000 --> 04:51:11,000
We'd

2554
04:51:11,000 --> 04:51:13,000
love to invite you up. We

2555
04:51:13,000 --> 04:51:14,000
could show you.

2556
04:51:14,000 --> 04:51:15,000
Yeah, well, just mainly

2557
04:51:15,000 --> 04:51:21,000
because since you've been here since the 1950s, I mean, the History Committee, which they're going to have their.

2558
04:51:21,000 --> 04:51:30,000
There's things there. They're gathering just, you know, little tidbits of history from around our town. It sounds like you definitely have some… We'll

2559
04:51:30,000 --> 04:51:32,000
connect. We have an archives committee that's

2560
04:51:32,000 --> 04:51:33,000
very, um,

2561
04:51:33,000 --> 04:51:34,000
yeah,

2562
04:51:34,000 --> 04:51:36,000
there might be some good. Okay, why

2563
04:51:36,000 --> 04:51:37,000
don't we

2564
04:51:37,000 --> 04:51:41,000
move on to the next item that is also a study session.

2565
04:51:41,000 --> 04:51:55,000
Uh, this is a discussion of policy amendments to permit alternative review of variances for electrical equipment. Tim, are you online there?

2566
04:51:55,000 --> 04:52:01,000
It's this time, poor guy.

2567
04:52:01,000 --> 04:52:04,000
Hello, Tim. Wake up, he

2568
04:52:04,000 --> 04:52:05,000
fell

2569
04:52:05,000 --> 04:52:06,000
asleep. We have

2570
04:52:06,000 --> 04:52:08,000
to promote Tim, unfortunately. I

2571
04:52:08,000 --> 04:52:09,000
feel terrible

2572
04:52:09,000 --> 04:52:15,000
for him. That's right. He's in Wisconsin. Yeah. Boy.

2573
04:52:15,000 --> 04:52:16,000
Okay.

2574
04:52:16,000 --> 04:52:17,000
Okay, we

2575
04:52:17,000 --> 04:52:18,000
just promoted him.

2576
04:52:18,000 --> 04:52:19,000
I think we're good

2577
04:52:19,000 --> 04:52:20,000
Good evening, everyone.

2578
04:52:20,000 --> 04:52:24,000
Okay, Tim, can we have your staff report?

2579
04:52:24,000 --> 04:52:27,000
Certainly. Good evening, Commissioners.

2580
04:52:27,000 --> 04:52:32,000
Let me just get my slides up

2581
04:52:32,000 --> 04:52:41,000
We're trying to fake being in the council chambers, huh? The old ones. No,

2582
04:52:41,000 --> 04:52:44,000
he's in the corner here.

2583
04:52:44,000 --> 04:52:45,000
Yeah,

2584
04:52:45,000 --> 04:52:47,000
but that big

2585
04:52:47,000 --> 04:52:48,000
door

2586
04:52:48,000 --> 04:52:49,000
wasn't in his picture.

2587
04:52:49,000 --> 04:52:50,000
It's pre-renovation.

2588
04:52:50,000 --> 04:52:53,000
Remark.

2589
04:52:53,000 --> 04:53:01,000
Historic.

2590
04:53:01,000 --> 04:53:02,000
Okay, are y'all able to see that okay?

2591
04:53:02,000 --> 04:53:05,000
Yes.

2592
04:53:05,000 --> 04:53:07,000
Perfect.

2593
04:53:07,000 --> 04:53:11,000
Yes, so as Jay mentioned, we'll be talking about

2594
04:53:11,000 --> 04:53:20,000
transformer variants policy modifications, or at least gathering feedback on those modifications.

2595
04:53:20,000 --> 04:53:38,000
So this is something that has been kind of on staff's radar for quite a while now, particularly in recent years as above ground transformers and other electrical equipment in the setbacks has become a recurring theme at Planning Commission meetings with a larger and larger volume of them

2596
04:53:38,000 --> 04:53:42,000
coming to the Commission for variance requests.

2597
04:53:42,000 --> 04:53:55,000
Back in 2019, I believe you got our first one, and that's steadily ramped up to 8 cases, either going to the Planning Commission or instilling the application stage as of 2025.

2598
04:53:55,000 --> 04:54:10,000
So pretty significant year-on-year growth, and no signs of that slowing down, primarily due to increased electrification generally around, new construction, both with reach codes and just general design trends gravitating that way

2599
04:54:10,000 --> 04:54:20,000
As well as, supply of underground units, which would be the, obviously, the preferred method to stay out of viewpoint within the setback

2600
04:54:20,000 --> 04:54:31,000
And as well as just general PG&E process around undergrounding, they've shifted away from that over time, and we'll get into that later in the presentation

2601
04:54:31,000 --> 04:54:49,000
But both of those factors have led to a higher and higher volume of these projects coming to the Planning Commission for review. And yeah, we don't see any sign of that slowing down.

2602
04:54:49,000 --> 04:55:04,000
So currently, we usually get these variants processes mid-planning stage. So we know fairly early on that they're going to be coming, but it still is an extra variance that an otherwise compliant project may have to ask for

2603
04:55:04,000 --> 04:55:21,000
Meaning there's lead time on noticing, getting it on a planning commission again agenda, getting the design team to get their presentation together. It does add a decent bit of cost and time to any of those projects, which would otherwise normally be compliant

2604
04:55:21,000 --> 04:55:25,000
To get these transformer variances approved.

2605
04:55:25,000 --> 04:55:38,000
As I mentioned, yeah, most are driven by utility code constraints, not a discretionary design choice, and again, lack of underground units or underground arrangements being available for these projects.

2606
04:55:38,000 --> 04:55:54,000
The most recent communication we have received from PG&E has indicated this is, for all intents and purposes, a permanent change moving forward. So the planning department is requesting for consideration tonight. Feedback on a potential code amendment

2607
04:55:54,000 --> 04:55:57,000
which would involve

2608
04:55:57,000 --> 04:56:12,000
to basically demoting these types of reviews to an admin, or potentially site development level review with an ability to shorten some of that permit lead time and and that process of taking it to the Planning Commission for each and every project

2609
04:56:12,000 --> 04:56:30,000
Meeting either a set of adjusted objective requirements where certain types of projects are fast tracked and it would admin review where others are elevated still the planning commission or public hearing view. Or some combination of that just to allow for at least some of these projects to move

2610
04:56:30,000 --> 04:56:32,000
move through the process a little bit smoother

2611
04:56:32,000 --> 04:56:43,000
And whether or not we base these off of things like noise, or amount of encroachment, or height, or visual impact, or some other thing, there's obviously a series of standards we could use.

2612
04:56:43,000 --> 04:57:01,000
The plan would be that all these variances would still be appealable to the Planning Commission, and we would plan on noticing them, potentially like we notice a fence or other administrative permits where there's still a lead time given to adjacent neighbors who would potentially be affected, even though there's not a formal public hearing for

2613
04:57:01,000 --> 04:57:04,000
fence permits. We still do that noticing

2614
04:57:04,000 --> 04:57:10,000
And then regarding the timeline or sunsetting of this, considering

2615
04:57:10,000 --> 04:57:23,000
You know, this may not be a forever thing, but at least in the near term, maybe setting a 3-year time limit, a 5-year time limit, or, you know, whenever units become available to underground, or PG&E has a process change.

2616
04:57:23,000 --> 04:57:28,000
And staff is available for questions and comments.

2617
04:57:28,000 --> 04:57:30,000
Does anyone have any comments? I have a

2618
04:57:30,000 --> 04:57:31,000
couple. I think

2619
04:57:31,000 --> 04:57:43,000
it's simple. I don't have comments. I just have some suggestions of where we should go. Go for it. I think if I had to choose, I'd say since this is something new.

2620
04:57:43,000 --> 04:57:53,000
We should do this. But let's start with the three year duration period. And after 3 years, if all is going well, then we extend it.

2621
04:57:53,000 --> 04:58:03,000
And the other part is, from a process perspective. I would just say, whatever we determine as the guidelines for this approach.

2622
04:58:03,000 --> 04:58:17,000
Follow the fast track process. So it doesn't always come to the planning commission. It goes to the standard processes, and if the community development director believes that there is a need to go to the Planning Commission.

2623
04:58:17,000 --> 04:58:19,000
It comes to us. How about this?

2624
04:58:19,000 --> 04:58:33,000
How about we put a couple of guidelines, you know, kind of going on what we've had variance hearings already on, that use those as the guidelines between… Yeah, so we should develop the space and the parameter of the… on the pad, and then also, I would say.

2625
04:58:33,000 --> 04:58:40,000
Anything that's over 600 amp definitely comes before Planning Commission, you know, up to 600 amps, which is. Wait, wait, wait, wait,

2626
04:58:40,000 --> 04:58:41,000
wait, wait.

2627
04:58:41,000 --> 04:58:44,000
We care about the size. We don't care about amps.

2628
04:58:44,000 --> 04:58:45,000
Well, no, the

2629
04:58:45,000 --> 04:58:49,000
thing is, what happens is that the ones that get… that go bigger are…

2630
04:58:49,000 --> 04:58:57,000
We are 6 to 400 is fine. If you go bigger, like 800 amps, that's going to be a bigger cabinet. See, that's my point.

2631
04:58:57,000 --> 04:58:58,000
The 600

2632
04:58:58,000 --> 04:58:59,000
is already big.

2633
04:58:59,000 --> 04:59:00,000
Yeah. Like

2634
04:59:00,000 --> 04:59:01,000
600 is the size,

2635
04:59:01,000 --> 04:59:03,000
though, that's isn't the size of 800

2636
04:59:03,000 --> 04:59:07,000
or more going to be bigger and bigger because you need the airspace.

2637
04:59:07,000 --> 04:59:10,000
for the heat dissipation and all that. Yeah, but

2638
04:59:10,000 --> 04:59:15,000
600, I mean, 400 amp is like just a meter. Yeah, exactly. Like, 600 is already a

2639
04:59:15,000 --> 04:59:18,000
problem. Yeah. Refrigerator. So do we want to say…

2640
04:59:18,000 --> 04:59:21,000
Anything over 600 and above? I'd rather, like, we

2641
04:59:21,000 --> 04:59:22,000
should see

2642
04:59:22,000 --> 04:59:34,000
what the size is. Like they should maybe give us. It's just a study session, right? We are developing the guidelines. Correct. Like we give an idea of what that 600, 800 would look like, and then we can see which one is.

2643
04:59:34,000 --> 04:59:37,000
Yeah. Like not acceptable for us to stay fast.

2644
04:59:37,000 --> 04:59:38,000
Walter is

2645
04:59:38,000 --> 04:59:39,000
not so

2646
04:59:39,000 --> 04:59:40,000
much acceptable.

2647
04:59:40,000 --> 04:59:41,000
It has to come before us. That's

2648
04:59:41,000 --> 04:59:42,000
what I

2649
04:59:42,000 --> 04:59:43,000
mean. Like, it's

2650
04:59:43,000 --> 04:59:46,000
not acceptable that it stays in fast track. We

2651
04:59:46,000 --> 04:59:54,000
have approved a lot of 600s, and we've approved one which was three-phase, right? If I'm…

2652
04:59:54,000 --> 04:59:55,000
Yeah.

2653
04:59:55,000 --> 04:59:56,000
Yeah,

2654
04:59:56,000 --> 04:59:57,000
and 600 is, like, even in residential now. So

2655
04:59:57,000 --> 04:59:58,000
so those have become very common.

2656
04:59:58,000 --> 05:00:01,000
Yeah, maybe come up with, like, the parameters. Yes, we should

2657
05:00:01,000 --> 05:00:07,000
go with some sizes. But even for a 600 amp, there could be multiple sizes.

2658
05:00:07,000 --> 05:00:11,000
You know, some might be wide and short, tall and thin. So we can get

2659
05:00:11,000 --> 05:00:20,000
in the study session, we can ask that when they're coming back, they come up with those criterias, because there are not that many different

2660
05:00:20,000 --> 05:00:21,000
sizes. Are

2661
05:00:21,000 --> 05:00:23,000
there any criteria you have developed?

2662
05:00:23,000 --> 05:00:26,000
If we were to say, let's go ahead

2663
05:00:26,000 --> 05:00:32,000
with this. Yeah, in previous projects we've said that the height of the bollards cannot exceed.

2664
05:00:32,000 --> 05:00:40,000
a certain number of feet, and we've said that the surrounding concrete pad cannot exceed a certain inches. Yeah. No,

2665
05:00:40,000 --> 05:00:44,000
but the actual unit itself, the transformer unit itself. The unit…

2666
05:00:44,000 --> 05:00:45,000
We don't

2667
05:00:45,000 --> 05:00:47,000
get to pick that. Yeah.

2668
05:00:47,000 --> 05:00:49,000
It's mainly just to…

2669
05:00:49,000 --> 05:00:51,000
But what we can

2670
05:00:51,000 --> 05:01:04,000
do is pick a reaction to that. For instance, maybe the screening thing changes when it's this size. Correct. Or the placement. I have a question about if we were to provide this stuff.

2671
05:01:04,000 --> 05:01:13,000
to PG&E. Could they incorporate that, or would they respect it a little bit in terms of where

2672
05:01:13,000 --> 05:01:14,000
they put

2673
05:01:14,000 --> 05:01:15,000
stuff? That we

2674
05:01:15,000 --> 05:01:16,000
should be

2675
05:01:16,000 --> 05:01:20,000
pushing things back from the street further.

2676
05:01:20,000 --> 05:01:36,000
Yeah, so, um, we've had multiple conversations now, um, with PG&E over the last 2 years. We've worked with multiple representatives, and what we continue to hear is that there are a number of.

2677
05:01:36,000 --> 05:01:49,000
regulations at the local level that PG&E is not responsive to. There are utility provider and they have similar, um…

2678
05:01:49,000 --> 05:02:07,000
Um, acknowledgements from the CUPC, similar to the building codes that, you know, for public safety, you must do these things. And so, we cannot preempt PG&E and their placement of the utility, the location, and service sizes of the utility.

2679
05:02:07,000 --> 05:02:26,000
And so, in addition to that, they also have regulations that talk about screening for those types of utilities, all based on their Green Book standards. And so, where we do have maybe some level of pushback on PG&E is in how they are moving from.

2680
05:02:26,000 --> 05:02:46,000
Um, what is typically an approval from the town into construction, and then typically there's field modifications that happen. We can push back on the field modifications happening without prior approvals, things of that nature, because the laws that they would be potentially.

2681
05:02:46,000 --> 05:03:06,000
conflicting with our state laws. They're not local laws. So that's where we do have some level of pushback, but as it relates to the size of equipment, location of equipment, you know, color of the equipment, you know, those, you know, are all things that are coming from PG&E specifications and the suppliers that they acknowledge.

2682
05:03:06,000 --> 05:03:10,000
That can be installed within their system, so…

2683
05:03:10,000 --> 05:03:16,000
Well, I'd like to see a list or a series of options on screening.

2684
05:03:16,000 --> 05:03:26,000
Yes, certainly. The Green Book has those levels of screening associated with transformers, the panel boards, cabinets, things of that nature, and the clearance.

2685
05:03:26,000 --> 05:03:44,000
And clearance is associated with those particular types of utilities, so we can certainly bring those back, and what we'll try to do is we'll have… ask PG&E representatives to try to explain their standards, because they're certainly much more familiar than what staff is. Of anything that they want

2686
05:03:44,000 --> 05:03:48,000
from us, or that they need from us. They do not need anything

2687
05:03:48,000 --> 05:03:49,000
from us. No,

2688
05:03:49,000 --> 05:03:51,000
we could make a deal. No.

2689
05:03:51,000 --> 05:03:52,000
There is very little leverage

2690
05:03:52,000 --> 05:03:53,000
No, I

2691
05:03:53,000 --> 05:03:57,000
think the only thing what I recall is that.

2692
05:03:57,000 --> 05:04:07,000
The PG&E requirement is that the transformer is in the right of way, so they don't need any special easement to access it. So there

2693
05:04:07,000 --> 05:04:09,000
are some things

2694
05:04:09,000 --> 05:04:16,000
within the PG&E Green Book that do allow for things to go further back in site. Typically.

2695
05:04:16,000 --> 05:04:40,000
There's a crane and a crane exemption form that folks can fill out that would allow for, you know, placement of equipment further into the site. But when you're on a hillside like we saw at the West Wind project, you know, you can only go so much further into the site, even with the crane exemption applied for.

2696
05:04:40,000 --> 05:04:58,000
Um, because just the topography in that particular instance caused, you know, okay, great, you want to go in another 5 feet, you went up 10 feet, you know, and at that point, the crane reached its limitations with just another 5 feet, where on a flat piece of land, it probably could have gone in another 10, 15 feet.

2697
05:04:58,000 --> 05:05:17,000
They've been looking for access and clearances associated with access. We've certainly seen them on private property, put them adjacent to driveways so they get further in. But then just like the fire trucks, they have to have rated driveways, they have to be able to meet some of those same turnaround requirements. And so.

2698
05:05:17,000 --> 05:05:38,000
Um, we can work with individuals there, and certainly there's a difference between co-located equipment, which we've been talking about on some projects, where it serves multiple residents, and those do go in public right-of-way, where if it's a singular transformer for a singular residence, then those can be located further in, assuming that there is access.

2699
05:05:38,000 --> 05:05:42,000
And again, all of those other things we mentioned as it related to their

2700
05:05:42,000 --> 05:05:52,000
vehicle. Well, in general, I'd like to get them as far into properties as possible, screened as good as possible, because these are going to be everywhere now. Yep.

2701
05:05:52,000 --> 05:05:57,000
And, um, and that will minimize the number of complaints. I got two

2702
05:05:57,000 --> 05:05:58,000
things also.

2703
05:05:58,000 --> 05:06:04,000
One that it should be… this should only be for RA zoning, definitely not multifamily zoning.

2704
05:06:04,000 --> 05:06:05,000
Oh,

2705
05:06:05,000 --> 05:06:09,000
it'll be for multifamily as well. Oh, you mean the… But it'll come to

2706
05:06:09,000 --> 05:06:10,000
us for

2707
05:06:10,000 --> 05:06:22,000
multifamily. Exactly, exactly. Just, you know, I'm gonna say it's the obvious. You know, because you never know. And then also have a concern that, you know, this gets reviewed by our full-time employees here.

2708
05:06:22,000 --> 05:06:36,000
not contracted staff, you know, as far as because I mean, love you guys. But one day, maybe we'll have more contractors here picking up bits and pieces. I would really like to have any of this kind of review done by.

2709
05:06:36,000 --> 05:06:37,000
Uh,

2710
05:06:37,000 --> 05:06:40,000
can I clarify what you're asking for on the… and planning director

2711
05:06:40,000 --> 05:06:42,000
basically. Okay, so we're not

2712
05:06:42,000 --> 05:06:48,000
talking about the inspection process, because we do have contracted inspectors. Okay, so just the planning. Exactly. Exactly. It's like

2713
05:06:48,000 --> 05:06:51,000
the same way I would make the request for.

2714
05:06:51,000 --> 05:06:56,000
Anything with espionage, ADUs, full-time employees that work here.

2715
05:06:56,000 --> 05:07:00,000
That oversee that not contracted. You had mentioned 3 years.

2716
05:07:00,000 --> 05:07:01,000
I think

2717
05:07:01,000 --> 05:07:08,000
that to start this we might want to do just one one year, just to check it out, make sure everything

2718
05:07:08,000 --> 05:07:11,000
is okay. Yeah, I think, like, I mean.

2719
05:07:11,000 --> 05:07:13,000
probably, like, 7 months into a

2720
05:07:13,000 --> 05:07:15,000
year. Well, then what

2721
05:07:15,000 --> 05:07:18,000
I'd like to see is at least maybe some

2722
05:07:18,000 --> 05:07:19,000
reporting about

2723
05:07:19,000 --> 05:07:21,000
it. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. A

2724
05:07:21,000 --> 05:07:24,000
status report… I like that. After

2725
05:07:24,000 --> 05:07:30,000
a year, on what happened in that… Yes, but I was thinking, you know, maybe…

2726
05:07:30,000 --> 05:07:44,000
There's this little dashboard on our monthly reports where you put your… the, uh, the accommodation stuff, and you put in here's how many things we did on transformers. We already do that for Fast Track, we already

2727
05:07:44,000 --> 05:07:49,000
have this list, right? Because we get whatever will go to Fast

2728
05:07:49,000 --> 05:07:56,000
Track, we'll see it.

2729
05:07:56,000 --> 05:07:57,000
Correct, yeah.

2730
05:07:57,000 --> 05:07:58,000
Correct? It'll be here.

2731
05:07:58,000 --> 05:07:59,000
I see. So

2732
05:07:59,000 --> 05:08:00,000
so this would just be another fast track item. Correct. And

2733
05:08:00,000 --> 05:08:02,000
then some of us are already part of that fast track. So if you see something which is not looking good, we can always ask.

2734
05:08:02,000 --> 05:08:03,000
I

2735
05:08:03,000 --> 05:08:11,000
think that's why I like the fast track process. Just use that process so you know what process to use, you know what guidelines you have

2736
05:08:11,000 --> 05:08:14,000
set, you're done. What about appealability?

2737
05:08:14,000 --> 05:08:15,000
If

2738
05:08:15,000 --> 05:08:19,000
we include with fast track, then it's appealable to Planning Commission. So there's already a contract.

2739
05:08:19,000 --> 05:08:22,000
It follows the same process as any other fast track project would.

2740
05:08:22,000 --> 05:08:24,000
Yeah. Okay. It just need

2741
05:08:24,000 --> 05:08:28,000
any more than coming. Is that good? Did we hammer

2742
05:08:28,000 --> 05:08:29,000
that one

2743
05:08:29,000 --> 05:08:32,000
out pretty well? Does anybody have anything

2744
05:08:32,000 --> 05:08:33,000
else to add? No.

2745
05:08:33,000 --> 05:08:35,000
I

2746
05:08:35,000 --> 05:08:36,000
Very good.

2747
05:08:36,000 --> 05:08:53,000
I just wanted to follow up with a quick question on those size thresholds. Is the request to have thresholds based off of amps or size? Because I heard 600 mentioned

2748
05:08:53,000 --> 05:08:54,000
Right.

2749
05:08:54,000 --> 05:09:03,000
Um, probably sizes. Yeah, the amp's like 600 amp comes in variable sizes. I just I want to see the camera just in case we don't get it like I don't want to get a garden shed out there versus a sub-zero refrigerator size. You know, we already know. Basically, yeah, we're

2750
05:09:03,000 --> 05:09:07,000
just asking that whatever standard.

2751
05:09:07,000 --> 05:09:08,000
Okay.

2752
05:09:08,000 --> 05:09:09,000
two or three sizes they have for each of these boxes. Then I

2753
05:09:09,000 --> 05:09:10,000
want to know

2754
05:09:10,000 --> 05:09:11,000
about it. Correct, but… Yeah, and I think the reason we

2755
05:09:11,000 --> 05:09:20,000
need to know the sizes is so that based on the size, we can determine what type of screening has to be done. That's true. And also, what are the things we

2756
05:09:20,000 --> 05:09:25,000
are okay with, fast track, and what are the things we want to put a threshold on. And what collards

2757
05:09:25,000 --> 05:09:28,000
you might need and so on and so forth.

2758
05:09:28,000 --> 05:09:29,000
What

2759
05:09:29,000 --> 05:09:30,000
was it?

2760
05:09:30,000 --> 05:09:33,000
Bollard's data we put up? Wasn't it

2761
05:09:33,000 --> 05:09:36,000
like 30? 36 inches. Yeah, it

2762
05:09:36,000 --> 05:09:51,000
was proximity to a vehicle hazardous vehicle way versus the transformer, and then and in that instance, I believe we did settle on 36 inches as the protection for there.

2763
05:09:51,000 --> 05:09:53,000
I'd also mention that there's someone online.

2764
05:09:53,000 --> 05:09:54,000
Do we

2765
05:09:54,000 --> 05:09:57,000
want a smaller baller, then? No, because the… that is

2766
05:09:57,000 --> 05:10:06,000
still for the cars. Yeah, okay. You should just, like, make it as many things standard as we can, and then look at screening plan where we need to. Yeah.

2767
05:10:06,000 --> 05:10:07,000
And I think

2768
05:10:07,000 --> 05:10:08,000
and

2769
05:10:08,000 --> 05:10:09,000
have a kind of a menu of sizes.

2770
05:10:09,000 --> 05:10:16,000
When do you think you'll be developing this? How many other projects will come to Planning Commission before that?

2771
05:10:16,000 --> 05:10:26,000
I think the goal is to hopefully, I'm sorry if I'm cutting someone off, but I think the goal is to hopefully have this enacted to kind of

2772
05:10:26,000 --> 05:10:31,000
open the… or redirect the flow of current projects down to fast track

2773
05:10:31,000 --> 05:10:48,000
Yeah, so let's talk about what the timing of that looks like. You know, that's a four-month process. We come back to you next month with a recommendation. Then from there, it goes to city council. That's the first reading. Then we come another month, second reading, and then 30 days for that goes into effect. So welcome to the new year.

2774
05:10:48,000 --> 05:10:49,000
That's exactly what

2775
05:10:49,000 --> 05:10:50,000
I'm saying, and

2776
05:10:50,000 --> 05:10:54,000
then in that interim, there'll be probably 4 other projects. We have a few other

2777
05:10:54,000 --> 05:10:59,000
projects already in line that you guys will see. Well, let's get on it as fast as we

2778
05:10:59,000 --> 05:11:02,000
can. Which will get maxed out, not ours. Well, hopefully

2779
05:11:02,000 --> 05:11:07,000
we had enough of these hearings with all these variances. We do have someone online.

2780
05:11:07,000 --> 05:11:08,000
We

2781
05:11:08,000 --> 05:11:09,000
have

2782
05:11:09,000 --> 05:11:10,000
on

2783
05:11:10,000 --> 05:11:11,000
somebody online.

2784
05:11:11,000 --> 05:11:12,000
Oh, Carol. Yes. Sorry.

2785
05:11:12,000 --> 05:11:14,000
Okay. Chair, we

2786
05:11:14,000 --> 05:11:16,000
have Carol. Yeah. Yeah.

2787
05:11:16,000 --> 05:11:22,000
Okay, one of the things you haven't considered on Lidikotte Lane, there were three

2788
05:11:22,000 --> 05:11:31,000
Transformers within 100 feet of each other. It's not gone through.

2789
05:11:31,000 --> 05:11:43,000
Because I don't think it's ever planning commission, but when I went out there, they were very close on a very steep slope. They were in the almost in the pathway

2790
05:11:43,000 --> 05:11:53,000
So, I know that Brigida mentioned something that they had to be so far away from the pathways, but you might

2791
05:11:53,000 --> 05:11:59,000
I want to say something about how many transformers that you want on one property along

2792
05:11:59,000 --> 05:12:03,000
I'm not sure we have any ability to do that, Carol.

2793
05:12:03,000 --> 05:12:15,000
Well, I think you might. One of the things, because some of the transformers are only for one property and some are for two or three properties.

2794
05:12:15,000 --> 05:12:39,000
So you might want to say that if you have transformers altogether that you would want the transformer built, but they're bigger, but that might be better looking than three transformers on the same piece of property

2795
05:12:39,000 --> 05:12:40,000
Yeah, but

2796
05:12:40,000 --> 05:12:41,000
But we will not have that, like, for example, if one person develops it and then the other one comes in, they're going to not remove the other one and they'll put a new one. And sometimes they can only put it in

2797
05:12:41,000 --> 05:12:47,000
that position. Yeah, I think the one thing, though, this brings up is we should put down a note that.

2798
05:12:47,000 --> 05:12:51,000
per property, only one transformer is allowed.

2799
05:12:51,000 --> 05:12:58,000
So if somebody comes up with an ADU, they cannot have a separate transformer. It has to be one transformer per property.

2800
05:12:58,000 --> 05:12:59,000
But it's not in their control, though.

2801
05:12:59,000 --> 05:13:01,000
No, but what happens, what happens is the neighbor across the street

2802
05:13:01,000 --> 05:13:02,000
I

2803
05:13:02,000 --> 05:13:03,000
don't think we can

2804
05:13:03,000 --> 05:13:04,000
enforce it.

2805
05:13:04,000 --> 05:13:05,000
Why? PGE

2806
05:13:05,000 --> 05:13:06,000
gets the

2807
05:13:06,000 --> 05:13:07,000
pick.

2808
05:13:07,000 --> 05:13:09,000
PGE does the engineering. Can we

2809
05:13:09,000 --> 05:13:10,000
enforce

2810
05:13:10,000 --> 05:13:22,000
that? Um, so that's an interesting question. If it's not part of the public utility, there's a potential that you could have that performance standard for a single-family residence.

2811
05:13:22,000 --> 05:13:46,000
When it becomes a public utility serving multiple, we would use Torello Lane as an example that had an underground transformer. They installed an above ground transformer right beside it, right in front of the same house, and there was no control, and we had very specific conversations about PG&E.

2812
05:13:46,000 --> 05:13:59,000
We also had very specific conversations with them about Liticoat. They said verbatim that they would not acknowledge and they would not make any accommodations. So, you mean for one property, there were multiple transformers? So,

2813
05:13:59,000 --> 05:14:01,000
it was in public right-of-way, but

2814
05:14:01,000 --> 05:14:09,000
it was in front of one property, and there was an underground one and then an expansion to an above ground one.

2815
05:14:09,000 --> 05:14:13,000
all within 5-10 feet of each other. But for the same property

2816
05:14:13,000 --> 05:14:14,000
or different property? Because it

2817
05:14:14,000 --> 05:14:34,000
was in public right away, it was serving multiple properties, which is why it was able to be installed within public right of way. Right. If it's if it's serving at least two houses, we would allow for it to be installed in public right of way. If it's only for the benefit of one individual home like it's at the end of a very line.

2818
05:14:34,000 --> 05:14:50,000
Um, then if it's on that private property, then I think there's a chance that, you know, because it's for that private property, you know, the requirements could be, as opposed to adding a second transformer for that same property that it would be one.

2819
05:14:50,000 --> 05:14:55,000
But we can ask PG&E that again, but, you know, I'm not…

2820
05:14:55,000 --> 05:15:01,000
Yeah, but we've had instances, only a few, but where the house is a corner house.

2821
05:15:01,000 --> 05:15:18,000
And having an ADU or an SB 9, and then the main house, and PG&E has insisted on two transformers, even though it costs the clients an arm and a leg and thing. So I'm just saying, I don't know how much control we'll have on it, so we should be very careful on… Can we

2822
05:15:18,000 --> 05:15:23,000
keep them out of pathways or give a little bit of margin, you know, around the pathway

2823
05:15:23,000 --> 05:15:24,000
so they're not

2824
05:15:24,000 --> 05:15:26,000
the pathways aren't on public utility easements, are they?

2825
05:15:26,000 --> 05:15:27,000
Yes.

2826
05:15:27,000 --> 05:15:28,000
They're

2827
05:15:28,000 --> 05:15:29,000
in Road right away.

2828
05:15:29,000 --> 05:15:31,000
Yes, they are.

2829
05:15:31,000 --> 05:15:32,000
Yes.

2830
05:15:32,000 --> 05:15:33,000
Road

2831
05:15:33,000 --> 05:15:34,000
right away is a public utility. Yeah, so there could

2832
05:15:34,000 --> 05:15:37,000
be a POE right next to a pathway, but it should not be overlapping. Right, or it could

2833
05:15:37,000 --> 05:15:38,000
be, like, have

2834
05:15:38,000 --> 05:15:40,000
a little bit of margin between.

2835
05:15:40,000 --> 05:15:44,000
The PUE, or the transformer and the pathway, so it's like… Yeah,

2836
05:15:44,000 --> 05:15:51,000
when we've had these types of requests come from residents, it's been to the fact that, um.

2837
05:15:51,000 --> 05:16:09,000
when we've had surveying done that typically PG&E is fairly accurate as it relates to where their utilities are, and so it's what it's boiled down to is that the property owners assume that they owned more right-of-way than what they actually do.

2838
05:16:09,000 --> 05:16:26,000
Assuming that they come right up to the street, which is, as we all know, not necessarily the case in all instances. In most instances, you've got the edge of pavement, and then you've got some, um, the length of offset before the property line for that property owner exists.

2839
05:16:26,000 --> 05:16:39,000
And they oftentimes think that that gap in between is also theirs. It's theirs to maintain, but it's not theirs from a standpoint of where utilities or trails and things like that can be installed.

2840
05:16:39,000 --> 05:16:40,000
Could I say something?

2841
05:16:40,000 --> 05:16:42,000
Yeah.

2842
05:16:42,000 --> 05:16:45,000
There's a problem, too, because

2843
05:16:45,000 --> 05:17:00,000
The transformer that was being built was not on the person's property. It was on across the street. And I had that on my property. The people that were building across the street came over

2844
05:17:00,000 --> 05:17:06,000
Without, and nobody ever gave me any information about it

2845
05:17:06,000 --> 05:17:07,000
And they built the transformer. It was underground on my property.

2846
05:17:07,000 --> 05:17:12,000
Yep.

2847
05:17:12,000 --> 05:17:14,000
No, on your right of way.

2848
05:17:14,000 --> 05:17:21,000
Yes, am I right away. That's right.

2849
05:17:21,000 --> 05:17:22,000
Now, it

2850
05:17:22,000 --> 05:17:23,000
Well, and that… and the point is, it's

2851
05:17:23,000 --> 05:17:24,000
not

2852
05:17:24,000 --> 05:17:25,000
your right-of-way.

2853
05:17:25,000 --> 05:17:26,000
This town's right away.

2854
05:17:26,000 --> 05:17:31,000
But I'm paying taxes on it. So

2855
05:17:31,000 --> 05:17:32,000
Yeah, you know

2856
05:17:32,000 --> 05:17:33,000
I

2857
05:17:33,000 --> 05:17:34,000
know, but that's what everybody has the issue with. Well, all we

2858
05:17:34,000 --> 05:17:35,000
are hearing, Carol, is that.

2859
05:17:35,000 --> 05:17:39,000
We have very limited options when it comes to this. You don't have control. Yeah, I would want to…

2860
05:17:39,000 --> 05:17:49,000
No, but the thing is, maybe we could plan better, but I don't think the people I wasn't informed. So if somebody was building a transformer on somebody else's property or putting it on

2861
05:17:49,000 --> 05:17:56,000
Yeah.

2862
05:17:56,000 --> 05:17:58,000
I think the person who owns that

2863
05:17:58,000 --> 05:18:01,000
area of right-of-way should be informed

2864
05:18:01,000 --> 05:18:04,000
So I agree with that completely. Yeah. And

2865
05:18:04,000 --> 05:18:18,000
we have a process already in play. Yes, we do. And because we are able to check the, I think they're called a site plan or site index comes from PG&E because they're doing work in our right-of-way.

2866
05:18:18,000 --> 05:18:35,000
So we have an encroachment permit process where we're able to see where those are, and we've, because of these resident requests that we've been getting, you know, about concerns that it's their property versus public right away, we've had, just as Carol's mentioned, individuals.

2867
05:18:35,000 --> 05:18:53,000
Five houses down, you know, around the block, not even remotely close to a project that have no notification associated with an encroachment. So, staff has taken it upon themselves since PG&E has not, um, taken it upon theirs or their, uh.

2868
05:18:53,000 --> 05:19:11,000
contractors haven't taken it upon them to do outreach. So, while they say they do outreach, we also follow up with certified mail now to those property owners where they have a transformer adjacent to their house that has no dealings with a project in their area, or even adjacent to a.

2869
05:19:11,000 --> 05:19:12,000
So, so

2870
05:19:12,000 --> 05:19:18,000
in that case, when we require screening, who pays for it?

2871
05:19:18,000 --> 05:19:19,000
Yeah,

2872
05:19:19,000 --> 05:19:25,000
so, um, in that… that instance, the project owner would still pay for it, even though it's

2873
05:19:25,000 --> 05:19:27,000
around the corner. Correct. I see.

2874
05:19:27,000 --> 05:19:28,000
Well, I appreciate that

2875
05:19:28,000 --> 05:19:29,000
Assuming

2876
05:19:29,000 --> 05:19:39,000
that it's allowed for within a… and typically, if it's in public right-of-way, we don't necessarily always allow for screening either because of visual sight lines and other things like that.

2877
05:19:39,000 --> 05:19:43,000
We should look at ways to make that possible.

2878
05:19:43,000 --> 05:19:48,000
Some… some ways, because there's… these are going to be everywhere.

2879
05:19:48,000 --> 05:19:49,000
They are

2880
05:19:49,000 --> 05:19:50,000
Yeah,

2881
05:19:50,000 --> 05:19:55,000
in fact, in public right-of-ways, as far as I recall, we don't even allow irrigation.

2882
05:19:55,000 --> 05:19:58,000
So even if you look like maintenance issues.

2883
05:19:58,000 --> 05:20:10,000
Maybe an art committee will be involved and make it as an art sculpture throughout the town, wherever it's, like, painted, like we're doing in Mountain View. But I don't know.

2884
05:20:10,000 --> 05:20:20,000
I mean, we can suggest this in this study session, but I think the town staff needs to look at it because we can say screening, and then it becomes a liability, and now we don't have

2885
05:20:20,000 --> 05:20:21,000
funds to maintain

2886
05:20:21,000 --> 05:20:26,000
it. I want to suggest it anyway, and let's see what options you guys can think of.

2887
05:20:26,000 --> 05:20:27,000
Yeah,

2888
05:20:27,000 --> 05:20:34,000
and just figure out this irrigation part, because I remember irrigation is not allowed.

2889
05:20:34,000 --> 05:20:35,000
And

2890
05:20:35,000 --> 05:20:36,000
It's

2891
05:20:36,000 --> 05:20:37,000
not up on trip.

2892
05:20:37,000 --> 05:20:38,000
And yet

2893
05:20:38,000 --> 05:20:39,000
I would clarify

2894
05:20:39,000 --> 05:20:50,000
that the Community Development Department is not the agency or the department responsible for public right-of-way for the town. That would be the Public Works Department, so we

2895
05:20:50,000 --> 05:20:52,000
will certainly confer with that.

2896
05:20:52,000 --> 05:20:55,000
No, you're sure. What can I say?

2897
05:20:55,000 --> 05:20:56,000
Well, I

2898
05:20:56,000 --> 05:21:03,000
remember this because I was not allowed irrigation, so I had to put some plants which don't need water. They don't

2899
05:21:03,000 --> 05:21:04,000
grow that

2900
05:21:04,000 --> 05:21:05,000
tall. I'm

2901
05:21:05,000 --> 05:21:19,000
thinking of a little redwood fencer.

2902
05:21:19,000 --> 05:21:20,000
Yeah, I think we

2903
05:21:20,000 --> 05:21:21,000
It's

2904
05:21:21,000 --> 05:21:22,000
maintenance. And then who's

2905
05:21:22,000 --> 05:21:23,000
the

2906
05:21:23,000 --> 05:21:24,000
liability? So it's

2907
05:21:24,000 --> 05:21:25,000
in

2908
05:21:25,000 --> 05:21:26,000
the public. The building

2909
05:21:26,000 --> 05:21:27,000
department. Okay. The

2910
05:21:27,000 --> 05:21:28,000
info, do

2911
05:21:28,000 --> 05:21:29,000
search and study.

2912
05:21:29,000 --> 05:21:36,000
I think we have our marching orders. I did want to highlight one thing regarding the landscape piece of it, just in conversation with staff while we were prepping for this. I think the plan would be like normally for a house, we'd have the house go to fast track, and then have that followed later

2913
05:21:36,000 --> 05:21:53,000
By a separate landscape screening permit. I think the goal with this would just be to handle all that as one package deal. So landscape screening and the unit is all approved as part of the same process.

2914
05:21:53,000 --> 05:21:54,000
Correct, which is maybe a bit of a wild card. And then the second

2915
05:21:54,000 --> 05:21:55,000
Okay. Assuming that the timeline with PG&E and their plans align with it. The

2916
05:21:55,000 --> 05:21:56,000
house will be done and

2917
05:21:56,000 --> 05:22:00,000
there'll be no PG&E. I do think the

2918
05:22:00,000 --> 05:22:07,000
earlier you can set the expectations with the resident and PG&E, I'm not sure that's useful, but.

2919
05:22:07,000 --> 05:22:10,000
the better.

2920
05:22:10,000 --> 05:22:11,000
Okay,

2921
05:22:11,000 --> 05:22:12,000
let's move on.

2922
05:22:12,000 --> 05:22:14,000
The second thing regarding the multiple trans…

2923
05:22:14,000 --> 05:22:15,000
Sorry, one more point. The second thing regarding the

2924
05:22:15,000 --> 05:22:17,000
Yeah. All right, uh, we're on to… I think

2925
05:22:17,000 --> 05:22:18,000
Dim

2926
05:22:18,000 --> 05:22:20,000
is asking something. Tim. Any

2927
05:22:20,000 --> 05:22:21,000
more questions, Tim?

2928
05:22:21,000 --> 05:22:26,000
Oh, just one more quick point to answer the question of multiple transformers.

2929
05:22:26,000 --> 05:22:35,000
the… that's been touched on in our conversation with Hcd regarding adus. So basically, if if a transformer is required

2930
05:22:35,000 --> 05:22:39,000
born ADU development. There's some

2931
05:22:39,000 --> 05:22:50,000
I would say it's frowned upon, if not explicitly banned, and it might be explicitly banned to deny a project because there's an ADU as HCD would see that as an unfair denial of an ADU.

2932
05:22:50,000 --> 05:22:59,000
So it may be something that we just have to handle on a case-by-case basis to have multiple transformers on a single parcel

2933
05:22:59,000 --> 05:23:02,000
Okay, got it.

2934
05:23:02,000 --> 05:23:03,000
But that's all

2935
05:23:03,000 --> 05:23:14,000
I think that if it's on the parcel inside the parcel, that's probably okay. It becomes more of an issue when they're right on the street, or right in the right of way.

2936
05:23:14,000 --> 05:23:21,000
I think so. And presumably the adus would be somewhere near the ad.

2937
05:23:21,000 --> 05:23:22,000
Correct.

2938
05:23:22,000 --> 05:23:23,000
Yeah.

2939
05:23:23,000 --> 05:23:26,000
Again, it's PG&E. Who knows? That's

2940
05:23:26,000 --> 05:23:27,000
right. They

2941
05:23:27,000 --> 05:23:28,000
will choose

2942
05:23:28,000 --> 05:23:33,000
because if it's near the adu, they need an easement to access it.

2943
05:23:33,000 --> 05:23:37,000
Yeah, that's right.

2944
05:23:37,000 --> 05:23:39,000
Okay. Okay. All right. On

2945
05:23:39,000 --> 05:23:42,000
to 6.3. Thank you, Tim. Thank you, Tim.

2946
05:23:42,000 --> 05:23:44,000
Thanks.

2947
05:23:44,000 --> 05:23:59,000
Uh, housing element program E11, incentives for extremely low income housing development. The community development director, Jay Bradford is going to give us a staff report.

2948
05:23:59,000 --> 05:24:00,000
Yeah.

2949
05:24:00,000 --> 05:24:15,000
Thank you, Chair. As we, you just mentioned, housing element program. E. 11 is for a.

2950
05:24:15,000 --> 05:24:30,000
Uh, sorry, it says inclusionary housing. It should say for extremely low income density bonus there. And so when we look at the program E11 specifically.

2951
05:24:30,000 --> 05:24:52,000
And sorry, my screen's getting covered here by some things. We had a number of items that we were supposed to look at. The the second bullet point in the excerpt from the housing element itself talks about the development of a financial assistance for infrastructure studies, sewer, water improvements necessary for for affordable housing.

2952
05:24:52,000 --> 05:25:07,000
Annual contract, uh, contact of developers and identifying of opportunities to assist with funding for various incentives for facilitating housing development. And then the other criteria was to set a density bonus incentives beyond.

2953
05:25:07,000 --> 05:25:13,000
State law for extremely low-income units.

2954
05:25:13,000 --> 05:25:30,000
Um, history of work to date. We've certainly worked on the technical feasibility and the funding work, and we've done that through the allocation annually of consultant support for implementation of the housing element programs. This year we've budgeted $300,000.

2955
05:25:30,000 --> 05:25:53,000
for the implementation of all programs, of which this is a subsect. We've completed a water supply analysis and other technical studies associated with multifamily housing that also include those extremely low income units, and then there's ongoing coordination with the multifamily site owners as well as other agencies that promote affordable housing.

2956
05:25:53,000 --> 05:26:11,000
And then the last piece of this program that we've really been waiting on to see how the multifamily program was going to play out, as well as some of the other density bonus incentives and inclusionary housing policies that we had to have to be able to make this kind of relevant for where we were going to have the discussion.

2957
05:26:11,000 --> 05:26:31,000
So that's why we're bringing this last piece to you tonight. This is really meant to be able to focus on, you know, options for local extremely low income density bonuses. And there's kind of 4 flavors of these that we'd like to get some initial feedback on.

2958
05:26:31,000 --> 05:26:48,000
The first is very similar to what we've seen as those alignment with state law on density bonuses, which were specific to, you know, if you include these units, you get so many extra units. The second one for an incentive.

2959
05:26:48,000 --> 05:27:03,000
perspective was the development of additional standards as incentives. So think of this similar to what we did for the senior housing, where we gave additional parking. We gave larger size units.

2960
05:27:03,000 --> 05:27:22,000
There's also a third option, which is fee reduction, fee waivers, so that if a project comes in and it has extremely low income units, and I should talk maybe a little bit to remind the commission, the extremely low income units are above and beyond the low and the very low income category.

2961
05:27:22,000 --> 05:27:40,000
So this is typically around 30% of area and median income. So it's a very, very advantageous of a developer was going to come into the town with a project with extremely low income. And certainly there's cost because of the offset for that affordability level.

2962
05:27:40,000 --> 05:27:55,000
Um, so fee waivers and fee reductions may be applicable because of the additional cost the developer would be bringing forth. And then the other part that we could offer is maybe some expedited permitting process to be able to prioritize the reviews.

2963
05:27:55,000 --> 05:28:11,000
And early comments and consultations. I would caution on that one that, you know, we're one agency of multiple agencies that look at this, these types of projects. So, while we may be able to promise expedited services from the town.

2964
05:28:11,000 --> 05:28:28,000
We wouldn't be able to make those same promises. And the other thing I would say is because the state has these existing density bonus criteria that we've already adopted through other programs that we've just heard in recent months.

2965
05:28:28,000 --> 05:28:45,000
Really, the 2 that we would recommend the commission focus on and giving feedback would be the incentives to development standards, fee reductions, or some combination thereof. And based on that feedback, then staff will return with.

2966
05:28:45,000 --> 05:28:58,000
recommendations for an ordinance to be brought before City Council for adoption. With that, any questions or comments? Is this a particular…

2967
05:28:58,000 --> 05:29:07,000
tier of our Rena quota that we're having difficulty with that we need to provide hefty incentives. So

2968
05:29:07,000 --> 05:29:13,000
we've talked about this on the inclusionary conversation. Right now we've got a.

2969
05:29:13,000 --> 05:29:31,000
performance criteria that would say that we could count 50% of our very low into this category. This is meant to try to develop 62 extremely low income unit households.

2970
05:29:31,000 --> 05:29:46,000
how these programs tie into the RHNA allocations. These are meant to… there's kind of two flavors of themes when it comes to housing law. You have those that are meant to.

2971
05:29:46,000 --> 05:30:08,000
further fair housing. And this this would be one of those objectives that does that. The other are trying to remove constraints and barriers to projects. And so for this, there's not a specific alignment within the housing element Rena allocation, because that allocation looks at.

2972
05:30:08,000 --> 05:30:18,000
Very low, low. And then so on. And so typically the way that we've been meeting this paper plan. Yeah, these count as

2973
05:30:18,000 --> 05:30:21,000
households? Yes, they do. Yeah, these are

2974
05:30:21,000 --> 05:30:30,000
these are dwelling units, just like any other dwelling unit because of the affordability level, they're often smaller units.

2975
05:30:30,000 --> 05:30:33,000
Because… Would it satisfy the arena, though, or

2976
05:30:33,000 --> 05:30:35,000
is… Yes, it would. It would

2977
05:30:35,000 --> 05:30:38,000
satisfy Rena if these were developed in town. So if they

2978
05:30:38,000 --> 05:30:42,000
were developed, they would count towards a very low in Rina.

2979
05:30:42,000 --> 05:30:43,000
That's… well,

2980
05:30:43,000 --> 05:30:48,000
we would count them as very low. Yes, correct. Okay. Let me ask you, too,

2981
05:30:48,000 --> 05:30:57,000
on this, is that, you know, people… like, the builders will apply for this, but there's no enforcement that they have to build it.

2982
05:30:57,000 --> 05:31:06,000
So whatever bonuses or incentives we give, they could get those incentives and still not create the units. Well, so, you know, they certainly

2983
05:31:06,000 --> 05:31:15,000
are still get the benefit of density bonus. That was something that we just mentioned in the inclusionary policy. So this would be…

2984
05:31:15,000 --> 05:31:27,000
you know, doubling of incentives for developers above and beyond what state law is. And that that's the incentive, and that's the… So let me give an example of performance criteria of the program that

2985
05:31:27,000 --> 05:31:32,000
we've agreed. Let's take an example, right? Let's say a developer comes with.

2986
05:31:32,000 --> 05:31:59,000
a proposal with 10 very low-income housing units.

2987
05:31:59,000 --> 05:32:12,000
affordable units in that scenario, then they would get a doubling in the density bonus, and then if we had set, you know, reductions in standards for parking and size of units, they'd get those two.

2988
05:32:12,000 --> 05:32:21,000
No, but all I'm saying is, does the developer get any benefit if he develops ELI versus VLI? He doubles his… he can

2989
05:32:21,000 --> 05:32:25,000
stack these bonuses. Yeah, and we would be

2990
05:32:25,000 --> 05:32:37,000
giving more for, you know, because we have some that are on the very low that are aligned with state law, again, because of other programs that we.

2991
05:32:37,000 --> 05:32:41,000
we've adopted. This would allow for stacking.

2992
05:32:41,000 --> 05:32:42,000
Okay, so,

2993
05:32:42,000 --> 05:32:46,000
so we are allowing a higher bonus with

2994
05:32:46,000 --> 05:32:48,000
this program. Correct.

2995
05:32:48,000 --> 05:32:50,000
What is that number?

2996
05:32:50,000 --> 05:33:01,000
Well, we, uh, so we don't have to allow for additional units. You saw that as one of the options, but we had three others that you could

2997
05:33:01,000 --> 05:33:02,000
choose. I see.

2998
05:33:02,000 --> 05:33:03,000
You have

2999
05:33:03,000 --> 05:33:06,000
less fees or the fees you talked about.

3000
05:33:06,000 --> 05:33:08,000
These are only fees that.

3001
05:33:08,000 --> 05:33:11,000
The city controls. Can you…

3002
05:33:11,000 --> 05:33:16,000
You can't waive school fees, for example. No, correct. Okay.

3003
05:33:16,000 --> 05:33:21,000
But the question I have is what you were asking, I mean.

3004
05:33:21,000 --> 05:33:31,000
The ones we are doing when you… if you are showing affordable housing, you have to comply with it and have affordable housing at the end when the project is

3005
05:33:31,000 --> 05:33:32,000
finished. Yeah, yeah,

3006
05:33:32,000 --> 05:33:37,000
that's correct. If you're in the density bonus program, you have to provide the affordable units. If you're.

3007
05:33:37,000 --> 05:33:50,000
Uh, if you're in one of our local now bonuses that are tied to state law, you know, you have to provide those units to be able to get the density bonus. I think the question here is that, let's say

3008
05:33:50,000 --> 05:33:55,000
we did it, and they got the incentives, they got the density, they got everything.

3009
05:33:55,000 --> 05:33:57,000
And then when they built it.

3010
05:33:57,000 --> 05:34:04,000
My understanding is for our other projects, you have to make sure that you have this. You can't just change

3011
05:34:04,000 --> 05:34:07,000
those into… Yeah, because we're talking about being restricted

3012
05:34:07,000 --> 05:34:08,000
affordable units here. Why

3013
05:34:08,000 --> 05:34:13,000
did Steve Mattis make… remember he at a city council meeting? It was.

3014
05:34:13,000 --> 05:34:22,000
couple months ago, he mentioned that, you know, the builders can get all these different bonuses, and Denzie's been in practicality. They don't have to build it.

3015
05:34:22,000 --> 05:34:25,000
I've not seen that, because it's like I'll have to go back

3016
05:34:25,000 --> 05:34:30,000
in my notes, but with a city council meeting, he had mentioned it was later maybe what he

3017
05:34:30,000 --> 05:34:31,000
was saying

3018
05:34:31,000 --> 05:34:39,000
was they don't have to take the bonus if they don't want to. So they'll get the concessions and the waivers, but they won't necessarily have to take the density bonus.

3019
05:34:39,000 --> 05:34:55,000
Which, and so let's talk about that. So because this is one of the comments that came in the CalHDF letter that James Lloyd mentions, and it was this thought of preemption of density bonus, right? Where our inclusionary would still require.

3020
05:34:55,000 --> 05:35:15,000
a minimum percentage, regardless of the number of units, right? And that's not what we were talking about in that particular item. So there's… it was conflated a little bit. So, um, it will clarify that, as mentioned before, but the thought was that if you had, you know, a 15% inclusionary, um, or a 15% density bonus.

3021
05:35:15,000 --> 05:35:32,000
Well, the 15% density bonus was going to get you maybe 50% more units. You then weren't going to be able to use that inclusionary program to say of those new 50%. So if we had, let's just make it easy, 100 units, 15 of them were.

3022
05:35:32,000 --> 05:35:49,000
you know, going to be affordable, and then that was going to get you another 50 units. Those numbers are not accurate. I'll just be very clear on that. But what it was saying was, you're not going to then apply your inclusionary to those new 50 units, because those 50 units are really meant to offset.

3023
05:35:49,000 --> 05:35:54,000
The cost of the inclusion of the affordable units you've had. Yeah,

3024
05:35:54,000 --> 05:35:55,000
and diluting

3025
05:35:55,000 --> 05:36:09,000
that ability to then offset the cost by continuing to include through an inclusionary program. That's not what we're talking about here. What we're talking about are additional incentives to the existing incentives.

3026
05:36:09,000 --> 05:36:16,000
to be able to provide a higher level of probability that these types of units get built.

3027
05:36:16,000 --> 05:36:23,000
Malika, from your experience, that list of 4 things, what would a developer want the most? So the list, if

3028
05:36:23,000 --> 05:36:24,000
you can

3029
05:36:24,000 --> 05:36:30,000
put it back up. Oh, yep. Sorry. What we were looking at, I mean, of course, the…

3030
05:36:30,000 --> 05:36:33,000
The fee is always exciting for people. The number of

3031
05:36:33,000 --> 05:36:36,000
units is the most exciting, right? Number

3032
05:36:36,000 --> 05:36:44,000
of units are happening, I think, by default, right? So if you look at the other ones, the number 2.

3033
05:36:44,000 --> 05:36:54,000
And then the expediting process is the most exciting and that's the biggest discussion happening in Mountain View and Sunnyvale as well of how developers are not.

3034
05:36:54,000 --> 05:37:06,000
Coming in because it's just taking too long for approvals. But the problem is that Jay said, they might be able to control what's happening in the town, but the consultants, you can't control the

3035
05:37:06,000 --> 05:37:07,000
fire department,

3036
05:37:07,000 --> 05:37:11,000
you can't control… Well, what are they doing in those other towns?

3037
05:37:11,000 --> 05:37:13,000
They're struggling because the problem is

3038
05:37:13,000 --> 05:37:27,000
that it's not moving fast. So we are helping the city of Mountain View with trying to figure out an incentive of moving fast. Sunnyvale is has done a better job because they have like they you submit everything like you do like a study session.

3039
05:37:27,000 --> 05:37:32,000
But you get comments back from every department, like from fire, from public work. And

3040
05:37:32,000 --> 05:37:39,000
that's a full service agency versus an agency like ours that relies on outside support. Correct. So

3041
05:37:39,000 --> 05:37:45,000
there it's faster, because you submit within a month you get everybody's comments. So there's no gray.

3042
05:37:45,000 --> 05:37:48,000
and they move really fast. So

3043
05:37:48,000 --> 05:37:49,000
does that

3044
05:37:49,000 --> 05:37:52,000
mean let's say if we want to do that.

3045
05:37:52,000 --> 05:38:00,000
It might mean that we may have to have a dedicated staff member just to help.

3046
05:38:00,000 --> 05:38:01,000
accelerate

3047
05:38:01,000 --> 05:38:02,000
things and still

3048
05:38:02,000 --> 05:38:04,000
failure that's not

3049
05:38:04,000 --> 05:38:05,000
doing

3050
05:38:05,000 --> 05:38:07,000
their… It might still

3051
05:38:07,000 --> 05:38:08,000
fail,

3052
05:38:08,000 --> 05:38:12,000
but the whole… the possibility of improvement.

3053
05:38:12,000 --> 05:38:13,000
Yeah, but

3054
05:38:13,000 --> 05:38:17,000
my guess is if and when this is coming through as a project.

3055
05:38:17,000 --> 05:38:23,000
Our current staff is not going to be looking at this. I'm guessing at that point we will have to have.

3056
05:38:23,000 --> 05:38:38,000
At least 1 or 2 people who are just looking at multifamily. But, I mean, in this, I think, as Jay said, that 4 will be difficult. Maybe a study session is the fastest thing that can be given, but then the 1st.

3057
05:38:38,000 --> 05:38:45,000
Number one is happening by default, I think. But 2 and 3 is going to be very.

3058
05:38:45,000 --> 05:38:50,000
you know, is the incentives, the more incentives they have, the more they'll do.

3059
05:38:50,000 --> 05:38:57,000
Because it becomes as many units you're giving, then you have more unit per unit fee also, and things like that.

3060
05:38:57,000 --> 05:39:03,000
So, one, we are saying by the state laws, there will be some bonuses.

3061
05:39:03,000 --> 05:39:07,000
Now, you could go over and beyond that. This is local.

3062
05:39:07,000 --> 05:39:08,000
Great.

3063
05:39:08,000 --> 05:39:24,000
Yeah. Incentives just for our local, because by the time people are coming in and building, this is so expensive that if you don't give incentives to add this, nobody will add it much. I agree. Because they won't break even.

3064
05:39:24,000 --> 05:39:35,000
I mean, we are struggling with affordable. So going down it is going to be even more challenging for a developer, right? We are struggling even to.

3065
05:39:35,000 --> 05:39:36,000
convince.

3066
05:39:36,000 --> 05:39:50,000
But because these are study sessions, it'd be good to give ideas that these are the incentives which would be good to see. But maybe the town can also talk to a few developers just to see what incentives would be exciting for them.

3067
05:39:50,000 --> 05:39:51,000
I

3068
05:39:51,000 --> 05:39:55,000
mean, we probably could say a study session within 30 days.

3069
05:39:55,000 --> 05:39:56,000
Or something

3070
05:39:56,000 --> 05:39:57,000
like that. But we are

3071
05:39:57,000 --> 05:40:02,000
giving a guideline as to like what they should be looking at, right?

3072
05:40:02,000 --> 05:40:03,000
As

3073
05:40:03,000 --> 05:40:04,000
of today's study session.

3074
05:40:04,000 --> 05:40:10,000
So I'm saying that they should be also like we give incentives we think can work, but it'd be good for them to also.

3075
05:40:10,000 --> 05:40:14,000
Talk to a few developers just to get an idea. Yeah,

3076
05:40:14,000 --> 05:40:20,000
I see what you're saying. But let me ask towards that, do we know what developers are.

3077
05:40:20,000 --> 05:40:27,000
wanting, not for extremely low, but even for very low or low. Yes, we've had any

3078
05:40:27,000 --> 05:40:41,000
numbers of conversations with developers, and they would really like to have 80 to 100 dwelling units per acre to be able to hit their project criteria for the performer perspective.

3079
05:40:41,000 --> 05:40:42,000
Yeah, because it

3080
05:40:42,000 --> 05:40:43,000
comes down

3081
05:40:43,000 --> 05:40:47,000
to number. If that is the comment we are getting for very low and low.

3082
05:40:47,000 --> 05:40:58,000
Double that for this, because this is extremely low. So I don't think we need more feedback. We already have the feedback based on what they're asking for very low

3083
05:40:58,000 --> 05:41:06,000
and low. We just don't know what options we have. Exactly. You know, what are these development standards, height, setback, open.

3084
05:41:06,000 --> 05:41:07,000
Like,

3085
05:41:07,000 --> 05:41:18,000
just giving them more incentive, like, you know, if you did this many units, then you get extra this much height or an extra floor, or whatever it is.

3086
05:41:18,000 --> 05:41:34,000
less parking. I hope parking is one thing I think we should not add because we need parking. Everybody will have two cars regardless which unit it is. So I think apart from parking, like, we can give incentives on open space, setback and heights.

3087
05:41:34,000 --> 05:41:35,000
Because

3088
05:41:35,000 --> 05:41:37,000
that town is an open space like, but.

3089
05:41:37,000 --> 05:41:40,000
If you need to give them, but I would not

3090
05:41:40,000 --> 05:41:43,000
do parking, because what does it mean to give them

3091
05:41:43,000 --> 05:41:58,000
open space? No, give incentives that you don't have to, like, if our minimum open space is a certain thing in our whatever guideline, it's an incentive that if you did this, you can reduce your common area, or you can reduce parking, or setbacks, or height.

3092
05:41:58,000 --> 05:42:01,000
So it's an incentive for developers that, okay.

3093
05:42:01,000 --> 05:42:05,000
you know, they can get more units, and they can get away with certain things.

3094
05:42:05,000 --> 05:42:15,000
I think based on what I've heard so far, we'd like to understand what options are in number 2. What possible things we could do for number 2. I wouldn't

3095
05:42:15,000 --> 05:42:18,000
reduce parking, but I would do tandem parking allowed.

3096
05:42:18,000 --> 05:42:19,000
But not

3097
05:42:19,000 --> 05:42:20,000
reduce it. Yeah,

3098
05:42:20,000 --> 05:42:21,000
tandem parking.

3099
05:42:21,000 --> 05:42:22,000
Yeah. Those

3100
05:42:22,000 --> 05:42:23,000
kind of things,

3101
05:42:23,000 --> 05:42:30,000
I think if we can give, then maybe people will feel… because the problem is the number doesn't work for developers, so then they don't do it. Yeah.

3102
05:42:30,000 --> 05:42:33,000
But isn't parking expensive for developers, too?

3103
05:42:33,000 --> 05:42:34,000
From what I understood

3104
05:42:34,000 --> 05:42:39,000
when… But if we don't give like we have no public transit here. Oh, and

3105
05:42:39,000 --> 05:42:40,000
I'm just

3106
05:42:40,000 --> 05:42:49,000
saying, as a, you know, yeah, we need the parking, but parking also is just an added expense to the developer parking. Yeah. But since we

3107
05:42:49,000 --> 05:42:54,000
don't have public transport anywhere close to us, they will have to give.

3108
05:42:54,000 --> 05:42:57,000
per unit than standard.

3109
05:42:57,000 --> 05:43:01,000
thing, but I'm saying we should not reduce the standard with incentive.

3110
05:43:01,000 --> 05:43:03,000
We can say you can do… we'll give

3111
05:43:03,000 --> 05:43:04,000
flexibility. Being very

3112
05:43:04,000 --> 05:43:05,000
helpful to

3113
05:43:05,000 --> 05:43:06,000
you, to

3114
05:43:06,000 --> 05:43:07,000
be honest. Well,

3115
05:43:07,000 --> 05:43:12,000
actually, I think what we're saying is, number one, we don't like. Number four, we can't do. So

3116
05:43:12,000 --> 05:43:14,000
it's got to be number

3117
05:43:14,000 --> 05:43:15,000
two or number three.

3118
05:43:15,000 --> 05:43:17,000
Why don't we like that?

3119
05:43:17,000 --> 05:43:20,000
I mean, one is, I think, happening by default.

3120
05:43:20,000 --> 05:43:24,000
Isn't it? With the state density bonus? Not being any help at all to

3121
05:43:24,000 --> 05:43:26,000
him. Jay, explain me. I thought

3122
05:43:26,000 --> 05:43:31,000
that is going to be the biggest incentive. And that's going to happen by default.

3123
05:43:31,000 --> 05:43:32,000
Well,

3124
05:43:32,000 --> 05:43:38,000
okay, so give me one second here. I've got some things up on my screen. Uh, trying to minimize. Another thing I

3125
05:43:38,000 --> 05:43:39,000
can think

3126
05:43:39,000 --> 05:43:48,000
of as an incentive is high, but, you know, I just… I'm watching the construction of that five-story, you know, building in downtown Los Altos. I'm like.

3127
05:43:48,000 --> 05:43:49,000
Yeah,

3128
05:43:49,000 --> 05:43:53,000
but keep in mind that wherever this comes in, hopefully we'll be on acres.

3129
05:43:53,000 --> 05:44:00,000
Like in Los Altos and Mountain View, it's like this much a site, and then it's huge. So I'm hoping to scale.

3130
05:44:00,000 --> 05:44:02,000
is going to be like, you know, it's bigger.

3131
05:44:02,000 --> 05:44:07,000
So what we could do is we do have height. We do have height. We do have heights available.

3132
05:44:07,000 --> 05:44:10,000
I'm not a fan of doing that, but…

3133
05:44:10,000 --> 05:44:20,000
Yeah, and to your question, unfortunately, I don't have what the existing state density bonuses are to tell you kind of that threshold. I should have done that. I'll bring that back. That's okay. But what

3134
05:44:20,000 --> 05:44:22,000
I meant was we still get it.

3135
05:44:22,000 --> 05:44:43,000
Yeah, so they definitely have access to all state and local density bonus programs that we've already implemented at this point. And then this would be if for option one, say, say it was a 5%. Maybe we could make it a 7%, right? And they would get, you know, that many extra units as a result.

3136
05:44:43,000 --> 05:44:44,000
Okay. But

3137
05:44:44,000 --> 05:44:46,000
could we do, like, what

3138
05:44:46,000 --> 05:44:56,000
we did for senior housing where we increase the FAR by 0.05. Yeah, certainly. Right? So that's another approach.

3139
05:44:56,000 --> 05:45:03,000
Because if you don't give… if you don't give incentives where they can make money at the end, they will not add

3140
05:45:03,000 --> 05:45:04,000
this. I

3141
05:45:04,000 --> 05:45:06,000
like the idea of unifying on a.

3142
05:45:06,000 --> 05:45:10,000
idea, and then using it multiple places. Yeah, so whatever

3143
05:45:10,000 --> 05:45:11,000
we did

3144
05:45:11,000 --> 05:45:13,000
for senior housing, we should directly apply to

3145
05:45:13,000 --> 05:45:18,000
this. That would be number 2 here. And more, of course.

3146
05:45:18,000 --> 05:45:20,000
Review 1, 2,

3147
05:45:20,000 --> 05:45:22,000
and 3.

3148
05:45:22,000 --> 05:45:29,000
Let them review 1, 2 and 3. Come back with one on what the state number is, and maybe we can give a little bit more incentive in

3149
05:45:29,000 --> 05:45:30,000
there if need

3150
05:45:30,000 --> 05:45:35,000
be. And try to make them more concrete, so that we have real things to look at.

3151
05:45:35,000 --> 05:45:36,000
Okay.

3152
05:45:36,000 --> 05:45:38,000
No problem. Okay.

3153
05:45:38,000 --> 05:45:40,000
public comment. All right.

3154
05:45:40,000 --> 05:45:42,000
Public comment. Is

3155
05:45:42,000 --> 05:45:44,000
there any public comment?

3156
05:45:44,000 --> 05:45:45,000
Nobody.

3157
05:45:45,000 --> 05:45:46,000
Anyone where'd

3158
05:45:46,000 --> 05:45:48,000
they all go?

3159
05:45:48,000 --> 05:45:49,000
Disappeared. Nobody online?

3160
05:45:49,000 --> 05:45:52,000
I will close that

3161
05:45:52,000 --> 05:45:53,000
part

3162
05:45:53,000 --> 05:45:54,000
of the public

3163
05:45:54,000 --> 05:46:01,000
hearing. Awesome. All right. And why don't we go ahead and move on?

3164
05:46:01,000 --> 05:46:02,000
Let's

3165
05:46:02,000 --> 05:46:07,000
go. It's midnight. Number seven item number 7 is ongoing business.

3166
05:46:07,000 --> 05:46:19,000
Discuss and direct staff regarding housing element implementation. J. Do you have specific things there that you want to talk about?

3167
05:46:19,000 --> 05:46:37,000
I think we provided the update that we had gotten the two comments back that were fairly minor that will clarify with HCD. And if additional modifications are necessary, we'll bring that back to the.

3168
05:46:37,000 --> 05:46:48,000
Commission. Other than that, I don't have anything else that I'm thinking of at this point in time for an update. Okay. Yeah, the only thing

3169
05:46:48,000 --> 05:46:51,000
I would reiterate for this is.

3170
05:46:51,000 --> 05:46:58,000
We should conclude some subset or the whole of the ADU and SB9 ordinance soon. Yeah, Alisa and I are on the ADU one.

3171
05:46:58,000 --> 05:46:59,000
Right. Yeah,

3172
05:46:59,000 --> 05:47:01,000
and I would say… That's the only

3173
05:47:01,000 --> 05:47:02,000
thing. No,

3174
05:47:02,000 --> 05:47:03,000
I'm saying from

3175
05:47:03,000 --> 05:47:08,000
a timeline, we don't know how many of these are going to bunch up.

3176
05:47:08,000 --> 05:47:12,000
Together, and are just going to get kicked off just because there are

3177
05:47:12,000 --> 05:47:13,000
too many.

3178
05:47:13,000 --> 05:47:20,000
Yeah, and I would… In fact, let me just mention, on the ADU, the idea is to get those nailed and out and done.

3179
05:47:20,000 --> 05:47:42,000
And then there's a component having to do with communication. This is website, FAQ, all of the information that we've been gathering and getting that out. And then there's an aspect of streamlining, of trying to look for specific areas where we can modify our processes to get things done faster. No,

3180
05:47:42,000 --> 05:47:45,000
I'm just talking about the ordinance part.

3181
05:47:45,000 --> 05:47:49,000
That's the very first thing that we're on deck right

3182
05:47:49,000 --> 05:47:50,000
now. Right.

3183
05:47:50,000 --> 05:47:54,000
So the ordinance part, I think we should just.

3184
05:47:54,000 --> 05:48:03,000
We've done enough of discussions that we don't need workshops or study sessions. We should just go ahead and bring it to Planning

3185
05:48:03,000 --> 05:48:04,000
Commission. It's

3186
05:48:04,000 --> 05:48:09,000
independent, because we actually are having a study or a workshop-y thing in September.

3187
05:48:09,000 --> 05:48:26,000
And there's a debate right now about whether this is ADU-oriented or just development-oriented, whether it's a listening session with city council, I'm not in favor of that, versus a workshop with planning commissioners.

3188
05:48:26,000 --> 05:48:29,000
But is that workshop…

3189
05:48:29,000 --> 05:48:33,000
Going to delay the… No, no, no, the total

3190
05:48:33,000 --> 05:48:35,000
different track. Got it. That's

3191
05:48:35,000 --> 05:48:36,000
what I

3192
05:48:36,000 --> 05:48:39,000
would like to see. If they're on different tracks, perfect.

3193
05:48:39,000 --> 05:48:42,000
Perfect. I just don't want it to come in

3194
05:48:42,000 --> 05:48:43,000
the way of…

3195
05:48:43,000 --> 05:48:44,000
Yeah, we all feel

3196
05:48:44,000 --> 05:48:55,000
the same way. Good, good. Yeah, and I would mention we were circling around September 14th, um, for the workshop, um, and then the other thing I should mention is that on the SB 9.

3197
05:48:55,000 --> 05:49:07,000
We've been asking for meetings with HCD staff and have yet to have a response from them specifically. They've got a lot of things going on at the state level, so when they have… We should get around

3198
05:49:07,000 --> 05:49:09,000
that if we can. No, so we discussed

3199
05:49:09,000 --> 05:49:11,000
that at the ad hoc committee.

3200
05:49:11,000 --> 05:49:18,000
We are going to split what we are going to do on SB 9 into things we can do.

3201
05:49:18,000 --> 05:49:21,000
and get it on the books.

3202
05:49:21,000 --> 05:49:26,000
without getting HCD feedback. And then the broader aspects, we will wait

3203
05:49:26,000 --> 05:49:27,000
till we

3204
05:49:27,000 --> 05:49:36,000
get more feedback. But we need to get step one or some subset of it out, because there's a lot of mistakes or.

3205
05:49:36,000 --> 05:49:43,000
Changes in SB9 we need to do because of the new SB450. Got it.

3206
05:49:43,000 --> 05:49:50,000
Okay, uh, reports from commissioners. Let's see, in July, we didn't have a city council.

3207
05:49:50,000 --> 05:49:55,000
So, did I hear September 14th as a potential date?

3208
05:49:55,000 --> 05:49:58,000
That's correct, for the workshop. Okay, so

3209
05:49:58,000 --> 05:49:59,000
I'll block

3210
05:49:59,000 --> 05:50:01,000
it on my calendar.

3211
05:50:01,000 --> 05:50:02,000
I'm

3212
05:50:02,000 --> 05:50:05,000
okay with this, uh, my September 17th date. Right, that's

3213
05:50:05,000 --> 05:50:06,000
the next

3214
05:50:06,000 --> 05:50:10,000
question. Is everyone okay with these dates? I'll probably

3215
05:50:10,000 --> 05:50:17,000
attend the August 20th. So in case Elisa can't do it. Well.

3216
05:50:17,000 --> 05:50:23,000
It would be good, Jay, if somebody could just contact Alyssa and just confirm that.

3217
05:50:23,000 --> 05:50:30,000
She's on tap for that, August 20th. She probably knows about it already, but if she can't do it, let's ask… The

3218
05:50:30,000 --> 05:50:31,000
only thing

3219
05:50:31,000 --> 05:50:38,000
is, since August 20th, City Council, they're supposed to be working, hopefully getting the H, you know, the housing element standing committee up and running.

3220
05:50:38,000 --> 05:50:49,000
As long as there is not more than two of us in the audience, or if there's more than two, we'll have to take turns going outside, if there's any. I think I'm in Cleveland.

3221
05:50:49,000 --> 05:50:52,000
So I'm not coming. So Rajiv, you and I

3222
05:50:52,000 --> 05:50:53,000
can go to

3223
05:50:53,000 --> 05:50:55,000
August 20th. Yeah, I don't know yet

3224
05:50:55,000 --> 05:51:01,000
if I'm free, but I'll try. At least I know that no one else is going to be there. I don't want

3225
05:51:01,000 --> 05:51:02,000
to be

3226
05:51:02,000 --> 05:51:03,000
there, but I

3227
05:51:03,000 --> 05:51:06,000
do want to go and just see what's going on.

3228
05:51:06,000 --> 05:51:13,000
Oh, sorry, I'm not here August 20th. Okay. I'm flying that afternoon, so I'm not here. All right.

3229
05:51:13,000 --> 05:51:20,000
Well, then you take care of September 14th, because I won't be around for that one, so okay, great.

3230
05:51:20,000 --> 05:51:22,000
Okay.

3231
05:51:22,000 --> 05:51:29,000
Reports on Fast Track, or past fast track site development meetings.

3232
05:51:29,000 --> 05:51:30,000
Is

3233
05:51:30,000 --> 05:51:32,000
there anything there, Jay?

3234
05:51:32,000 --> 05:51:33,000
No,

3235
05:51:33,000 --> 05:51:36,000
I think, uh, just as it's… all

3236
05:51:36,000 --> 05:51:38,000
of that is canceled.

3237
05:51:38,000 --> 05:51:48,000
Okay. Um, reports on approved reasonable accommodations on Kate Drive. Is this the Kate Drive? This is the same K drive. Yes.

3238
05:51:48,000 --> 05:51:57,000
And so you guys heard the variance request. That was if they were going to keep improvements permanently.

3239
05:51:57,000 --> 05:52:10,000
When that was unsuccessful, they made the request for a reasonable accommodations for conditional approval, which included, you know, potential removal of those materials after use has ceased.

3240
05:52:10,000 --> 05:52:11,000
And

3241
05:52:11,000 --> 05:52:13,000
my…

3242
05:52:13,000 --> 05:52:15,000
Uh, nothing. So what was

3243
05:52:15,000 --> 05:52:16,000
the results

3244
05:52:16,000 --> 05:52:18,000
of all that then? Um, so

3245
05:52:18,000 --> 05:52:29,000
they did have to follow the direction that the Planning Commission gave them for the the majority of the the lighting and other improvements and things of that nature.

3246
05:52:29,000 --> 05:52:49,000
But then obviously because of a disability, we did allow for them to be able to maintain what was a five-foot path as opposed to a four-foot path. Well, so we would have given exemptions for 4-foot paths anyway under DG.

3247
05:52:49,000 --> 05:52:58,000
But because of the need for a different type of surface and a little bit more maneuvering clearance, we gave them an allowance for a 5-foot hardscaped path.

3248
05:52:58,000 --> 05:52:59,000
And

3249
05:52:59,000 --> 05:53:00,000
that's the only priority,

3250
05:53:00,000 --> 05:53:03,000
additional MDA that you approved. Correct. Right. And

3251
05:53:03,000 --> 05:53:04,000
they took

3252
05:53:04,000 --> 05:53:07,000
it down. They had 14 foot wide paths. Yeah, those,

3253
05:53:07,000 --> 05:53:15,000
those were, again, all things that the were part of the determination from the Commission at that point in time.

3254
05:53:15,000 --> 05:53:20,000
And those regulations still were in place based on their accommodation is

3255
05:53:20,000 --> 05:53:26,000
no longer being used, is there any follow-up? They got to take stuff

3256
05:53:26,000 --> 05:53:32,000
out? Yeah, so again, based on the recommendations, um, here, and then the council action.

3257
05:53:32,000 --> 05:53:46,000
There's a reporting period and then follow up from staff required on an annual basis. And then I think a potential three-year look ahead from those individuals as well. So how

3258
05:53:46,000 --> 05:53:47,000
confident are you of.

3259
05:53:47,000 --> 05:53:57,000
The reporting and the follow-up. Because if I look at our track record on CUPs, it's very poor, right? Oh, hold on now. We're doing a

3260
05:53:57,000 --> 05:53:58,000
lot of

3261
05:53:58,000 --> 05:53:59,000
work on that now.

3262
05:53:59,000 --> 05:54:02,000
I thought they were working hard on an

3263
05:54:02,000 --> 05:54:13,000
Excel sheet. Yeah, I forgot to mention one of our new interns in Zhe Zoo over there, he's been doing a ton of work. He helped on the MDA.

3264
05:54:13,000 --> 05:54:29,000
conversation about coverage and materials that we presented to the EPC that we were talking about, but he's also been doing a ton of work as it relates to organizing our CUPs and of various flavors that we have. Mostly from their inception all the way to current date.

3265
05:54:29,000 --> 05:54:48,000
We're getting a lot more information on when CEPs occurred, when they were renewed, and then current status. And so we've definitely got a lot of information on CUPs now that we didn't have before, and, you know, we certainly understand that there's a need to bring those that have been missed, and I'm going to say prior staff on this one.

3266
05:54:48,000 --> 05:54:58,000
Um, to be able to make sure that we're judiciously moving those forward so that they're all becoming more and more current in our list. It'd be

3267
05:54:58,000 --> 05:54:59,000
great if,

3268
05:54:59,000 --> 05:55:05,000
you know, whoever it is, uh, is, uh, can publish a report on this. This is awesome work.

3269
05:55:05,000 --> 05:55:06,000
I think

3270
05:55:06,000 --> 05:55:09,000
AI can do that right now, like, just give us priority. Yeah,

3271
05:55:09,000 --> 05:55:10,000
you have to

3272
05:55:10,000 --> 05:55:18,000
be careful. And, you know, add this one to the CUP list, because this one is a unique one. It will get lost if

3273
05:55:18,000 --> 05:55:28,000
it's not tracked somewhere. Yeah, so we… we also have set up specific record types, and within the parcel records themselves have been adding additional comments and notes associated with these things.

3274
05:55:28,000 --> 05:55:46,000
We also have, you know, private files because of the sensitive nature to this, so those aren't going in electronically, so it's a distillation of some of that information so that, you know, there's still confidentiality associated with what goes into the system. So even if someone got access to it, or for some reason it got shown to the public.

3275
05:55:46,000 --> 05:55:54,000
There wouldn't be anything sensitive associated with it. It'd be the determination of staff, and then the conclusion of the

3276
05:55:54,000 --> 05:56:03,000
request. I'm sure the interns are much better at using AI than the staff, right? You guys should use a lot more AI.

3277
05:56:03,000 --> 05:56:04,000
Is

3278
05:56:04,000 --> 05:56:05,000
there anything more

3279
05:56:05,000 --> 05:56:09,000
we should discuss tonight? Jay? Yes, on item 12, if

3280
05:56:09,000 --> 05:56:16,000
you would continue this meeting to the… to that August 13th. I see, so we don't have to re-notice.

3281
05:56:16,000 --> 05:56:18,000
Oh, we will be re-noticing

3282
05:56:18,000 --> 05:56:28,000
anyway, um, because we're going to be putting out the notice for the, um, City Council meeting for the inclusionary item. So we'll also include.

3283
05:56:28,000 --> 05:56:35,000
the item being rescheduled from the Planning Commission in that same notice. So we have no

3284
05:56:35,000 --> 05:56:45,000
problem with re-noticing. And so we're this is just going to August 13th August 13th. Can I propose a motion that we?

3285
05:56:45,000 --> 05:56:49,000
Continue this meeting on August thirteenth.

3286
05:56:49,000 --> 05:56:50,000
Okay,

3287
05:56:50,000 --> 05:56:53,000
I second whatever. Yeah. Second. Yep.

3288
05:56:53,000 --> 05:56:57,000
unanimous. Yep. Yes, yes, yes, yes. All

3289
05:56:57,000 --> 05:56:58,000
right.

3290
05:56:58,000 --> 05:57:04,000
Thanks, everybody. 1212. I'm not too bad.

3291
05:57:04,000 --> 05:57:07,000
I was really…

3292
05:57:07,000 --> 05:57:08,000
blown

3293
05:57:08,000 --> 05:57:21,000
away by how.