[0:58] Recording in progress.
>> Good evening. It is August 25th is
[1:05] special meeting of the Lewisville City
Council.
[1:11] Can we get a roll call, please?
[1:15] » Mayor Lee
>> here.
[1:18] Uh, Council Member Hamilton. Oh, sorry.
Uh, Mayor Prom Hamilton
[1:23] » here.
>> Council member Dickinson
[1:28] » here.
>> Council member Fe
[1:32] here.
>> Council member Hefner
[1:36] » here.
>> Council member Coopermanman
[1:39] » here.
>> And council member Kern present.
[1:46] If you'd join me as able for the pledge
of allegiance. Great.
[1:53] Pledge allegiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the
[1:58] republic for it stands. One nation under
God, indivisible, with liberty and
[2:04] justice for all.
[2:11] » Welcome all.
Um we have tonight uh several things on
[2:17] the agenda but the first one is joint
meeting with uh library board of
[2:24] trustees. So welcome to the meeting all
of you. Um, I think before we go any
[2:31] further, probably good to introduce
ourselves to you, uh, and you, uh, to
[2:39] us, even though we've met before.
Um, so perhaps we can start with you,
[2:45] Jamie.
>> I am Turn this on. Good evening. I'm
[2:51] Jamie Drain. I've been a resident of
Lewisville for nine years and on the
[2:56] library board of trustees for eight
years now. Way back, this is my last
[3:01] time here. I hearken all the way back to
the day when council members used to
[3:05] come and sit in on our meetings. And I
would like to say this is an auspicious
[3:09] board to be related to because our most
recent mayors Chris and Ashley were both
[3:14] our representatives to the library
board. So politically, I I just want to
[3:19] point that out.
[3:24] And then hi everyone. Uh my name is Ally
Benz. I've been living in Lewisville for
[3:28] about three years now. Um and I've been
this is the second year that I've been
[3:32] on the board. Um I don't have nearly the
credentials that you do uh in terms of
[3:36] the uh history year, but I am happy to
be here.
[3:41] » Hi, I'm Jean Baker. Um I am the newest
um board member here. This is my first
[3:47] year serving and I've lived in
Lewisville for eight years now.
[3:54] » Hello, my name is Cheryl October. Um,
I've been on the board three years I
[3:59] guess and I'm actually the superior
representative. Um, very very pleased to
[4:04] be here and to meet all of you.
>> Good evening. My name is Laurel Cole.
[4:10] Um, I have lived in Lewisville for six
years now. This is my fifth year on the
[4:15] board and my third year as chair. Um,
and we're so happy to be here tonight.
[4:22] » Great. Go ahead.
>> Hi everyone. I'm Samma Fox. I'm the
[4:25] deputy city manager.
>> Hi, I'm Diana Langley, city manager.
[4:29] » Uh, Judy Kern. I'm W 2 representative.
>> Caleb Dickinson, ward one.
[4:36] » Deb Fehey, W two.
>> Crystal, mayor.
[4:42] Barbara Hamilton, w three.
>> Josh Coopermanman, ward one.
[4:47] » Dietrich Hefner, W three. Thanks for
coming.
[4:50] » Brandy Cummings, director of cultural
services.
[4:55] » Right. I think um the first thing on tap
tonight is presentation.
[5:01] Um not sure how how are you handling is
one person doing the presenting or
[5:05] multiple? We're all going to share what
we value about the Lewisville Public
[5:10] Library tonight. And Brandy has a
slideshow up there that she will be
[5:14] driving as as we talk uh this evening.
>> Um I did want to mention we are missing
[5:20] three board members this evening. Um
Carol Burkett was our alter alternate
[5:25] representative from Superior and she is
moving out of state as of this summer.
[5:29] So we will be working with the town of
Superior to find a replacement for her.
[5:34] Heather Wigan has served for almost
three years now and she is also moving
[5:38] out of state very unfortunately. She's
been a really wonderful member of our
[5:42] board. And Alan Halpern, this is his
second year serving and he is out of
[5:46] town just this week to celebrate a
family member's 90th birthday. So I
[5:50] believe Brandy sent an email to you all
of a statement from him. He wishes he
[5:55] could be here but wanted to send his
thoughts as well.
[5:59] Okay. So last year I was here last
spring presenting to all of you and I'm
[6:05] so happy to be joined by the board this
evening and it's not just me. Um but
[6:10] last year we had quite a laundry list of
things that we were wanting to
[6:14] accomplish as a library board and we
wanted to support uh your master plan
[6:19] and your priorities. We have worked on
some of those things but we've also
[6:24] faced a few obstacles in the last year
and a half. Um, we have onboarded a new
[6:31] director. Not an obstacle, but a
wonderful opportunity. Um, and we're so
[6:35] glad that Brandy is here.
It's been a long day. Um, and we only
[6:42] meet once every other month. So, you
know, maybe that's something we can
[6:46] discuss in the future about maybe
meeting a little bit more, maybe monthly
[6:50] with all that is on our plate. Um we
have also learned more from the state
[6:56] libraries and also dug into state
statute and uh city statutes as well
[7:02] about more of our responsibilities. Um
so it's really been a learning year for
[7:06] us. Um we have put together or Brandy
has put together matters pertaining to
[7:12] budget for us. That's not something we
have done in the past is really advise
[7:16] her on budget areas and really get more
in involved in those details. Um, we
[7:22] have also been updating library um,
policies, which we did a little bit uh,
[7:27] with Sharon, the former director, but
Brandy seems to have more of a master
[7:30] plan and we're going through and making
sure all the the policies are relevant
[7:35] and applicable to libraries today. Um,
and we've also learned that we need to
[7:40] do some of our own education. So, that's
been fun, really learning what our
[7:45] responsibilities are as um, a board of
trustees of a Colorado library. So, it's
[7:51] been a great year for us and we're so
glad that Bry's here leading the way for
[7:55] us. Um,
in our last meeting, I brought up the
[8:00] idea that the we as a board really felt
that the library was a core service here
[8:04] in Lewisville. Now, granted, we are not
water, we are not sewer, we are not
[8:08] police, we are not fire. However, in our
our last meeting, Brandy brought up the
[8:14] the idea of a core quality of life
service and that really resonated with
[8:20] us. You'll hear from all the board
members tonight about how we really
[8:24] connect to the library and we feel it's
really the living room of the city of
[8:28] Lewisville and it means many different
things to us and also to our fellow
[8:34] residents in Lewisville and Superior.
So, we're hoping tonight to share some
[8:38] stories about what we value at the
library, but also show you some numbers
[8:42] about how we think other residents value
the library as well. Um, I think
[8:48] everyone who walks into the library can
see the value right away of our
[8:52] beautiful building, the outstanding
collection that we have, the beautiful
[8:56] community spaces. I mean, the library
really speaks for itself. Um, but I
[9:03] think when you hear from us tonight,
you'll hear about some of the other
[9:07] values that maybe are unseen when you
walk through the community doors. Um, I
[9:12] wanted to share a personal story to
start us out with that I moved to
[9:16] Lewisville with my two-month-old six
years ago. And if you recall, um, that
[9:21] was like six weeks into CO. That was
kind of a scary time to have a newborn.
[9:26] Um, but as he grew and we learned a
little bit about COVID and the library
[9:31] reopened, the library really offered me
as a stay-at-home mom who was so
[9:35] isolated at that time, a community.
Sorry.
[9:41] Um, we saw people and, you know, we made
friends and I made mom friends
[9:47] and it was just we go to Tuesday story
time, Friday music time and that's how I
[9:53] started to feel connected here. My kids
are older. We still come. The library is
[9:58] one of their favorite places. Now they
read to a dog,
[10:02] which is amazing. My six-year-old is
reading to a dog. Um, but the library
[10:09] has really fostered not only that sense
of community, but a love of learning and
[10:13] a love of reading. As an as an educator
and a mom, there's nothing better.
[10:21] » Sorry.
[10:25] Yeah,
that's something to follow up on.
[10:29] Thank you. Um, it just happened a very
auspicious evening. You perhaps heard
[10:36] that Dolly Pardon passed away today. Um,
and I just heard an interview where it
[10:42] was stated that her single from her
perspective, her single greatest
[10:46] accomplishment was starting the
Imagination Library. Um, and that's
[10:51] because of the value she learned. She
knew growing up uh in a family where her
[10:57] parents were illiterate how important
reading and access to books was. I feel
[11:04] the same way. I moved here to Colorado
almost four years ago now and
[11:11] I felt immediately to get involved in
community. I wanted to work with the
[11:16] library. Why? Because the library as
this goes back more than 200 years, the
[11:24] concept is it's the foundation for
democracy. It's the foundation for
[11:29] community. Democracy will not work in an
illiterate society.
[11:35] We can teach children how to read in our
schools, but to give all of our
[11:40] community members access to all of the
books and resources that they need to be
[11:46] educated and aware and um
also to stimulate new ideas, curiosity,
[11:55] partnership with others in the
community, a deeper level of knowledge.
[11:58] The library is absolutely essential in
any community in this country and I'm
[12:05] just so happy and so pleased to serve
and that I was welcomed here as a a
[12:10] newcomer from another state um to join
and to represent my community of
[12:15] superior as well. Thank you.
[12:21] Okay. Well, um, my library story is kind
of similar to Laurel's, um, in that I am
[12:27] the mom of a 5-year-old boy. Um, and
when I first moved to Lewisville in
[12:33] 2018, the first week I was here, I got a
library card. It's one of the first
[12:38] things I did and started using the
library the way most people do, checking
[12:42] out books. Also used the library of
things to check out, you know, state
[12:46] parks, passes, things like that. Um once
my son was born, you know, once he got
[12:52] to be a little bit older, it was, you
know, the became the center of our
[12:56] universe. Basically, we're here at least
once a week. Um not just for checking
[13:00] out books, but you know, for story time,
like Laurel mentioned, for the events
[13:04] that are put on throughout the year.
Last year, my son got his Halloween
[13:08] costume at the Halloween costume
exchange. Um, and particularly,
[13:14] you know, at a time when the cost of
things is just going through the roof,
[13:19] it's it's so nice to have a place that
provides quality, enriching programs um
[13:26] for for young people um of all ages, not
just for little kids, but you know, for
[13:31] middle schoolers and adults, too. Um
it's nice that we have a place where we
[13:36] can meet up with friends and you know we
don't have to worry about um you know if
[13:41] everybody can afford to you know go to a
museum or something like that we can all
[13:46] get together you know get books for our
kids hang out in the play area and then
[13:51] you know if we feel like it hop on over
to Sweet Cow or something like that. Um,
[13:56] but it is such a huge part of our lives
and um, like Laurel mentioned, I have
[14:02] made friends hanging out at the library.
My son has made friends. It truly is
[14:06] like the town center for us. Um, and
just being able to go there and use it
[14:12] the way you normally would, a library,
but then also you've got the wonderful
[14:15] town of Lewisville right outside the
door and so many great things to do
[14:19] afterward.
[14:26] I'll echo a lot of what's already been
said. Um, for me, I have always been
[14:31] very passionate about my community. I
believe very strongly in giving back.
[14:34] Uh, when I was in undergrad and then
grad school, a lot of my focus was on
[14:40] um, uh, national and international
politics. And for the longest time,
[14:45] that's what I wanted to go into. But
then as I uh went into internships, as I
[14:49] sort of explored what that looked like
and given the uh everchanging landscape
[14:55] um at the federal level, it it felt
unmaring. It felt like it was difficult
[15:00] to make a change at such a great and
grand scale. And I happened to uh start
[15:08] getting involved more in uh local
organizations, nonprofits, and really
[15:12] feel the impact that you can have on a
small community. uh how you can maybe
[15:17] not change the world uh but you can
brighten up your corner of the world. Um
[15:21] and so that's part of the reason why I
actually started working at the Denver
[15:24] Public Library um four years ago uh was
to give back to the community and to
[15:30] work for an organization that I was so
passionate about and that I saw doing so
[15:35] much good. And then when I moved to
Lewisville um out from Denver um I
[15:41] wanted to still be involved in the
community that I was now in. So while I
[15:45] still work for DPL, it felt very
important to be attached to this library
[15:49] and to care about uh the way in which
the library reaches community as one of
[15:54] the last free third spaces that we have.
I think it's so important that we have
[15:58] this community center and cultural
center and a way to meet one another and
[16:02] talk to each other without the need to
be anything other than yourself. Um and
[16:08] the library gives back so much, not just
in terms of books, though that's
[16:12] fantastic. and as an avid reader, I very
much make use of it. Um, but in all the
[16:16] other services that it provides, um,
with programming, with computers, um,
[16:21] with just a way to not feel so isolated
in an increasingly isolated world. Um,
[16:27] and so I'm just very happy and proud to
be here today and to talk with all of
[16:31] you.
So, you'll find that I'm going I've been
[16:35] given the task of talking about library
funding, which is fairly appropriate.
[16:39] Um, I like my numbers and I like to see
what a community values financially. One
[16:46] of the reasons that I made the decision
to buy a house in Lewisville was because
[16:50] I went to the library and I saw the
quality of this library. I brought my
[16:54] son here and saw where your funding
goes. And I said, "This is the type of
[17:00] community I want to be in." Clearly a
learned community. Clearly one that
[17:03] values their library. Um, and that was
indeed the main reason that we decided
[17:08] to buy our house in Lewisville instead
of Lafayette, instead of Boulder,
[17:12] instead of a lot of different locations.
The other thing that drew us was not
[17:16] just the library itself, but the fact
that it was right in the middle of
[17:19] downtown. I knew that we could go to the
library and then go get a cookie at Moxy
[17:25] or go get Sweet Cow. Um, and I think I I
want to highlight that for a lot of
[17:31] folks in Lewisville, the library is part
of a stop downtown. It is a part of a
[17:37] bigger package. And I want to make sure
we keep that in focus. It's a heart of
[17:41] our community, but also the heart of our
business community.
[17:52] Okay. So, just to kind of start us off
here, um this is a snapshot of um just
[17:59] some numbers from uh January through
June of this year. Um as you can see, we
[18:06] are increasing in in just about every
way in terms of um visitors, checkouts,
[18:14] um people signing up to get a library
card for the first time. What stands out
[18:19] to me about this is the program
attendance um increased by 49%.
[18:25] In this first six months of this year,
that's pretty wild in my opinion from
[18:30] last year. Um and just goes to show, you
know, something a lot of us talked about
[18:34] is um the library being more than just a
place to check out books, kind of a
[18:40] meeting place, a place for people to get
together, have community. Um, you know,
[18:45] you said it really well, Ally. Um, in an
increasingly isolated world, finding a
[18:49] place to get together, um, that's free.
And so, um, people are using these
[18:55] programs and they're really loving them
and they're coming regularly and they're
[18:59] bringing their friends. And so, I think
it just goes to show that's a really
[19:02] important service that's not a
traditional library service that that
[19:06] we're providing here. Um and of course
you know um just the increase in
[19:13] checkouts, unique digital users, you
know this is all going up. People are um
[19:18] reading books and coming to see us at
the library.
[19:26] » Next slide.
[19:30] So, as you can see from this next slide,
which describes how the library is
[19:35] staffed, these extraordinary services
are offered to the to the city of
[19:42] Lewisville um 7 days a week. And
those services um are being offered when
[19:52] we compare to other communities and
other libraries with a surprisingly
[19:57] small number of staff. There are 32
people who work in total at the library.
[20:03] Only 20 actually 19 plus 3/4 of another
person um are full-time for seven days a
[20:11] week. And um there are quite a few
part-time and volunteers that make the
[20:17] library um work as as we know it. 22 are
part-time. And you can see the number of
[20:24] volunteer hours and volunteers
um that contribute to the library as
[20:31] well. Um 70 hours per week. That means
the library is open to students after
[20:38] school. It means it's open on weekends.
It means it's open in the evenings.
[20:43] Truly making it accessible to everyone
at some point um in time during the day
[20:49] as well as on the weekends. Um
so I I think that's that's what we have
[20:56] to share so far about the staff.
[21:01] So I hope I don't need to harp too much
more on how libraries are such a
[21:05] foundational cornerstone to our
community. um they help uh connect
[21:09] people to each other and to needed
resources. We serve around 22,000 folks
[21:13] in Louisville and about 13,000 in
Superior. But I think what we lose when
[21:19] we look at these aggregate totals, these
large numbers, is uh we forget the
[21:24] individual folks and the folks that are
most in need. It's very easy to
[21:27] generalize what someone in Lewisville or
Superior looks like, acts like, or
[21:32] wants. But I wanted to dive into some of
the data surrounding marginalized and
[21:36] vulnerable populations within our city.
Uh so first around a quarter of our
[21:42] service population is under 18. Um
compared to the national average of
[21:46] about 20% um Lewisville has a large
child population. Uh the library serves
[21:51] our young community through early
childhood education uh story times and
[21:54] distinct spaces for children and teens.
Um, as I hope you all noticed with the
[21:58] 49% increase in program attendance for
the first half of 2026 compared to 2025,
[22:03] uh, the programming is very very popular
with children and families. Um, I also
[22:09] want to talk that about how 4% of um,
our households uh, within Lewisville uh,
[22:15] do not have access to internet. While
that does sound like a small percent uh
[22:21] as we shift towards an increasingly um
digital infrastructure uh for our basic
[22:26] needs, what that means is that about 900
people a month may experience undue
[22:31] barriers in doing something as simple as
paying their utility bills. The way that
[22:36] they go to access uh those resources to
be able to pay for their electricity,
[22:41] their gas, uh is to come to the library
and use our public computers. And you
[22:47] can see with our um data for PCs uh that
they are incredibly high demand.
[22:51] Additionally, it's not just computers
that the library provides, but staff
[22:54] time to help those folks. Um I have
worked in the past with people that uh
[22:59] have struggled with digital literacy. I
have sat down with someone that has uh
[23:04] tried to pay a medical bill uh and they
did not know uh their username or
[23:09] password to their health portal and they
did not know the password to their email
[23:12] to be able to reset that health portal.
It was a very long and frustrating
[23:17] conversation with a lot of fear. And
what our staff do is they're able to sit
[23:22] down and help those folks and make sure
that they don't feel alone. And without
[23:27] PCs, without staff, uh without that help
to combat that digital literacy, we have
[23:32] a lot of folks that are in very
vulnerable positions, especially older
[23:36] folks.
I also want to highlight that around 5%
[23:40] of people in Lewisville are at or below
the national poverty line. And while
[23:44] this number is significantly lower than
the national poverty line of 12.2%, that
[23:49] statistic is pretty misleading. The
poverty line is set at the national
[23:53] level, not at the local level. Um, and
does not account for the additional
[23:56] costs of high cost of living areas,
which I hope you all know Boulder County
[24:00] is a high cost of living area. Um, if
you look at uh what the federal poverty
[24:06] level estimates that you need, it says
that a single person can comfortably
[24:10] live off of $16,000 a year and that an
adult with one child can survive off of
[24:15] $21,000 a year. Um, that's not the
reality in which we live. Uh, using the
[24:21] MIT's cost of living calculator, it's
estimated that a single person in
[24:25] Boulder County needs to make $56,000
annually. A single adult with one child
[24:30] needing child care needs to make
$113,000
[24:34] annually. And a single adult with two
children needs to make $156,000
[24:39] annually. Uh just to meet basic food,
housing, and childare needs. Uh to do
[24:44] some quick math, that's about 426 times
higher than what the federal poverty
[24:48] level says. Um, so using those
statistics in Lewisville, it is
[24:52] estimated that 58% of single adult
households with children under 18 in
[24:57] them are at or below the cost of living
that they need to survive in this
[25:02] county. Um, if the library has to reduce
or eliminate programming for children or
[25:07] its support services for adults, that
can absolutely be annoying or
[25:11] frustrating to a married couple with
children that are in private school. But
[25:15] for a single mom working multiple jobs,
that is going to be lifealtering because
[25:19] that family cannot afford to pay for
alternatives. The services that are
[25:23] provided at the library cannot be met
anywhere else for free or for an
[25:27] affordable cost.
Um, so I hope that you can hear that
[25:32] it's vital that these communities
continue to receive services uh catered
[25:36] toward their unique needs and the
library is fortunately very uniquely
[25:40] equipped to provide many of these
services. However, I think that there's
[25:44] an immense opportunity here for all city
services and departments to work
[25:47] together um to prioritize that care for
all of our residents because no one
[25:52] deserves to be forgotten or overlooked.
[25:57] Thanks, Ally.
So, I told you I'd be back to talk about
[26:01] funding. Here we are. Um I don't think
it'll come as a surprise to council that
[26:05] the library funding comes from four main
sources. Those four that you see right
[26:10] there.
Our total operating budget is just over
[26:14] 2.2 million. The city of Lewisville
provides the bulk of that funding at
[26:19] 76%. The town of Superior provides 20%
of our funding. Um, serendipitously that
[26:26] happens to correspond with the usage of
the library by Superior residents. Uh,
[26:31] they have about 20% of our library cards
and usership. Just so happens to work
[26:37] that way. The Lewisville Public Library
Foundation supplies us with a grant
[26:42] every year. This fluctuates based on
what they bring in. The number that you
[26:47] see there, the $73,000, which makes up
3% of our budget, is about $20,000
[26:52] higher than what we typically receive
from the library foundation. This is
[26:57] because they received a very large uh
grant uh or a very large donation um
[27:03] from a resident last year. So typically
we do not see that level of funding from
[27:08] the foundation. The state of Colorado
grant to libraries that fluctuates
[27:12] slightly based on our um our citizenship
numbers. So if our citizenship numbers
[27:19] go up, that number goes up slightly, but
it should stay fairly constant.
[27:24] I also want to let give you an
opportunity to compare our library
[27:28] funding and where our money goes to a
similar size um library and population.
[27:36] So Lafayette's library, you can see that
um their operating budget, they spend
[27:42] 75% of their budget on personnel. We
spend a higher amount at 86%.
[27:47] We are staffing our library. We're using
our funds to keep programming and bodies
[27:52] um in our library and keep things going.
We spend a great deal less on operations
[27:58] than corresponding sized libraries do.
We make very efficient use of the
[28:03] funding that we have.
[28:08] All right. Thank you Jamie and Ally and
Jean Cheryl. Um so our priorities
[28:14] um our first priority is to represent uh
every citizen of Lewisville in Superior
[28:19] and to ensure the highest level of
library services and as you have heard
[28:24] from us all tonight that is really
important to all of us as board members
[28:28] and we we love supporting Brandy and
everything bless you that she's been
[28:33] doing for the library. Um, so in our
role as the board of trustees, we
[28:39] support staff as they work to complete,
finalize, and implement the strategic
[28:43] plan. We're very excited to hear what
Bry's team has compiled in our next
[28:47] meeting in September and to help her and
her team move things forward. Um, we
[28:53] also are here tonight providing
meaningful information to city council
[28:58] uh to help you with your citywide
decisions.
[29:01] Um, as I mentioned before, we also
review policies uh to make sure our
[29:06] library is up to date uh with national
policies, state policies, and city
[29:11] policies uh so that we can provide the
best services to all residents. Um, and
[29:18] we need to ensure ongoing alignment with
Colorado library law, which is has been
[29:23] one of our our big learnings this year,
as I mentioned earlier.
[29:29] All right. So, we just had a couple of
discussion points, but you know, we're
[29:32] also here to open conversation. Um, you
know, we'd love to hear what you all
[29:37] think about the library being um a core
service when we talk about the quality
[29:42] of life here in Lewisville and love to
hear what you feel are the priorities at
[29:47] the library as, you know, we start to
hear about the strategic plan and all
[29:51] the feedback that Brandy and her team um
has gathered. Um so I guess I'll pause
[29:57] here and open for comment or questions.
>> Sure. Um why don't we uh take just
[30:06] briefly if people have clarifying
questions for you about the presentation
[30:09] and then we can um address some of the
questions
[30:14] um that we've got. Any questions about
the presentation?
[30:19] Yes. May prom.
[30:23] » Thank you. um appreciate the
presentation and you all sharing your
[30:28] personal stories about connections to
libraries as well. Um two clarifying
[30:34] questions. The first one is Ally, the
data you presented on our community. Can
[30:39] you all help me understand what survey
that came from?
[30:45] » Absolutely. So that comes from the
American Community Survey. Um it happens
[30:49] every uh year. Um, usually best practice
for data is to pull 5-year aggregates.
[30:54] Um, so that's what we did for 2025. Um,
it's basically the annual equivalent of
[30:58] the census. Um, it's considered highly
valid.
[31:02] » Okay. Thank you very much. Um, and then
my other question is I wanted to um
[31:08] unpackage a little bit more the
statistic regarding program attendance
[31:12] and the 47% increase. Can you help me
understand what is behind driving that
[31:20] increase?
>> Absolutely. Thank you for the question.
[31:22] Um, looking at national trends, when we
see economic factors that downturn for
[31:27] the everyman, so John Q public, um,
we're starting to see some of those
[31:31] recession indicators show up in our
programming. Typically, if we look back
[31:35] to LA public libraries in 2007 to 2008,
similar program attendance results show
[31:41] up, but also as a visitor attraction and
an economic engine for tourism in
[31:46] downtown Lewisville. I think we pull in
higher numbers for some of our programs
[31:50] there that also influence that. Looking
back at 2025, there was a time frame
[31:54] where the library was closed um for the
carpeting and remodeling project. those
[32:00] programs were shifted to other locations
which could also have an impact. But
[32:04] looking programtogram, month-to-month
aggregates rather than just an
[32:08] overarching six-month um those program
attendance did not fluctuate greatly
[32:13] outside of increased attendance at the
things that we're doing. So a good
[32:18] example would be the um which is not in
this poll, but the summer reading
[32:22] carnival, which is an annual event we
host each year on French Street. This
[32:26] year it saw um just about 1,800
attendees and last year it was 1,200. So
[32:32] we're continuing to see percentage
growth in almost every program we do.
[32:36] » Okay, that's really helpful. So is it
fair to say that that increase is in
[32:43] part driven by increase attendance in
existing programs, not necessarily
[32:49] addition of a lot of new programs.
>> Correct. We haven't increased the number
[32:53] of programs we're doing. In fact, in um
in line with 2025 six month, we are
[33:00] about 20 programs less than we did in
January through June of 2025 for the
[33:04] same snapshot.
>> Okay, that's really helpful. Thank you.
[33:11] » Others? Yep. Council member,
>> thank you for asking those questions,
[33:14] Mayor Prom. They were mine as well. Uh
and thank you all. Really appreciate you
[33:19] being here and and I agree. Um
interesting to hear your connection to
[33:23] the to the library. Uh this is probably
more for the director. So same thing
[33:27] with the programming. I was curious is
the att the increase across the board on
[33:32] every type of programming or is there
like a heavier lean toward um young and
[33:37] children's programming is it seems like
that's a a really popular item.
[33:42] » Yeah. Nationally, public libraries are
definitely known for their bread and
[33:46] butter being how we serve families with
young children and how we serve an aging
[33:50] population. We are um gratefully seeing
increase across programs at all levels.
[33:55] In fact, with a higher growth percentage
for our adult programming um especially
[34:00] looking for those sort of midday focused
at senior community opportunities.
[34:04] » Okay. Interesting. Thank you.
[34:08] » Yes, Council Fee. I'm going to continue
on with this topic. Um, I'm wondering
[34:15] when you have an increase, which sounds
pretty significant in attendance, how do
[34:22] you staff or manage those larger events?
>> It's a great question. Thank you. Right
[34:28] now, we are relying on volunteer labor
for that core operation. We are far
[34:33] exceeding our ability for our volunteer
capacity to help us manage those rooms
[34:36] and those larger events. And so it does
take a little bit more finagling.
[34:40] Sometimes it's pulling me off of
whatever I'm working on to come be
[34:44] another body during a tie-dye program or
a bubble festival um or even a very
[34:49] interesting science program. So we are
doing our best to be as responsive and
[34:53] flexible as possible and nimble within
the restraints of our staffing.
[34:58] » All right. Well, thank you and thank you
for what all of you do.
[35:02] » Council member Cooperman.
Um,
[35:06] I was also going to ask a qu questions
about the the program number uh
[35:10] increasing, but I'll ask a very
different question. Um, I'm just
[35:14] curious, how does the library foundation
raise most of its funds?
[35:19] » It's a fantastic question. Thank you.
So, the library foundation currently
[35:22] operates two major fundraisers uh per
year. One being Colorado Giving Day um
[35:28] which will come up in November. They
give run that through the Colorado Gives
[35:32] platform. Otherwise, they do a targeted
summer reading program sponsorship. Um,
[35:38] traditionally, they have relied on
unsolicited donations. As we work closer
[35:42] with the foundation to set up some of
those structural and foundational
[35:45] policies, procedures, and processes much
like the board has spoken to, we hope to
[35:49] see a more concerted and targeted effort
in fundraising. The large challenge is
[35:54] that we are competing in a community
with many wonderful organizations. Um,
[35:58] and we're fighting for some of the same
dollars. Yeah.
[36:02] Thank you.
>> Other questions?
[36:07] Um
I have a couple um about the library
[36:12] snapshot in particular. Um
I guess I'm one of the things I was
[36:19] curious about is
um there's you know you've broken it
[36:23] down into
um full-time
[36:27] uh employees, part-time, and then
volunteers.
[36:32] um as well as volunteer hours. But just
the numbers of those three um full-time,
[36:39] part-time, and volunteers, how do those
compare with other libraries say in
[36:45] Colorado and if you know and same thing
nationally?
[36:50] » Yeah, I appreciate the question. So
looking at the front range and
[36:53] especially within our consorcia, so
Lafayette, Longmont, Loveland, Boulder,
[36:58] um Westminster for some things, we tend
to leave Boulder out because they're the
[37:02] big guy, so it's hard to compare
ourselves to them, right? We are more
[37:07] heavily staffed by part- timerrs than
any of our comparable um neighbors.
[37:12] Lafayette is our large our most similar
in service size. And so if we flash back
[37:17] to the January presentation, we have
about 120 less staffing hours than
[37:23] Lafayette does for the same number of
open hours to the public. So we are
[37:27] staffed 70 hours per week open to the
public 58 because we need opening
[37:31] shifts, we need closing shifts, we need
processing, things like that. So um
[37:36] looking at the same number of staffed
hours, we're about 120 hours less than
[37:40] our regional peers. Nationally, public
libraries have always been served by a
[37:45] combination of professional, full-time,
part-time staff. Um, I would say that we
[37:50] are probably still lagging behind a bit
with a stronger part-time presence than
[37:54] a full-time presence, specifically in
our professional librarians.
[38:01] » That's helpful. Thank you,
[38:07] » Council Member Dickens.
Just curious because I didn't see it in
[38:11] here if you guys are
um
[38:15] what role you guys might be playing in
you know what is the revamp of front and
[38:20] center and what I see as sort of the
outdoor library for much of the year
[38:26] like obviously street fair and farmers
market and things are are known as
[38:30] popular events there but I think there's
a lot of intention on making that space
[38:35] sort of you know hopefully feel like the
outdoor
[38:39] portion of the library and I'm wondering
if you guys are involved at all in
[38:43] conversations in that direction, if you
have excitement towards it, if it's kind
[38:46] of like news or how Yeah. how you feel
about the the redo of the Steinba Plaza.
[38:55] » Yeah. Can I hop in? I've been working
the winter festival in particular for
[39:00] the first f first light Friday um for
the last eight years and I think our
[39:05] revamp of our patio area has kind of
allowed more um participation. I mean I
[39:13] think our numbers in our art Friday are
up dramatically. It makes us more a part
[39:19] of those happenings to have that outdoor
platform to have the shading. Thank
[39:24] goodness. So, it's not so terribly hot
there. Um, I think all of the citywide
[39:31] events become the library becomes more
part of them because of what we've done.
[39:35] And I also have to say I think all the
artwork that has been added around that
[39:40] area, it's it's such a draw to folks. I
mean, I I don't know if you've seen, but
[39:44] little kids are always stopping and
pointing things out and talking about
[39:47] the squirrels and the books and and all
the different things. um both as a
[39:53] volunteer at the library and as a
citizen. I love the combination and what
[39:57] it's done for us and I'm thankful that
money was put aside for that.
[40:01] » Thanks Jamie. Um Council Member
Dickinson, as far as the front and
[40:04] center project, the board has not been
engaged on that project as it hasn't
[40:08] moved past LRC yet. While we have had
conversations about hopes of activating
[40:12] that space, we recognize that again our
restraint is in budget and staffing
[40:16] resources. We hope that as that design
comes to fruition, we're able to find
[40:20] ways to continue to activate it as we do
now, not overstretching past our
[40:24] capacity.
[40:28] » Yeah, I think that's my hope and
concern, right? This great opportunity
[40:32] for more programming and like more
programming, how do we do more, you
[40:36] know? So, I think it's it's a yeah, it
is an opportunity and uh and potentially
[40:42] a problem area as well.
I just wanted to add toss out um even
[40:48] before your your comments um that it all
depends on volunteerism,
[40:55] the the outdoor programming, the in town
programming,
[41:00] it depends on the number of volunteers
and their particular interests as well.
[41:07] » Um why don't we move to some of your
questions? I I I want to start by kind
[41:13] of maybe
well hitting hitting the first one. What
[41:19] are council's top priorities? I think
you've laid out some some good
[41:22] priorities. I I want to and this is
don't take don't take this negatively.
[41:29] This is a question or this is kind of a
comment that I have about about what the
[41:36] boards generally do and frankly what we
do. Um what we do is we hit policy
[41:45] broadly um and we when we're doing our
best work I think leave the operational
[41:51] stuff to the staff who do terrific job
and you know that Brandy does. Um so a
[41:59] couple of the priorities that I looked
at here um particularly the first and
[42:05] the last that is sort of supporting I
supporting staff as they work to
[42:12] finalize a strategic plan, encouraging
teamwork and shared success. I think to
[42:17] the extent that's like moral support,
we're all for that. And I know that
[42:21] that's um um an issue. Ensuring ongoing
alignment with the Colorado Library law
[42:29] is really more um more the director's
role. Um but I I do wonder on the middle
[42:38] two
um when we talk about um kind of
[42:44] priorities I I am in interested in
whether you feel like you have good
[42:51] opportunities
to present or provide information
[42:57] through staff to us
[43:02] » to that. Um, so as I mentioned at the
beginning of our presentation, uh, we
[43:06] have learned more about Colorado Library
Law and part of the way we have shifted
[43:11] our bimonthly meetings is that Brandy
makes a budget presentation to us now.
[43:17] Um, so we see every line item and what
the library is spending um, you know,
[43:23] across the board um, not only personnel
but with programs and technology and um,
[43:29] the New York Times subscriptions. Um, so
it's been interesting for us. You know,
[43:34] I'll speak for myself being on the board
now for five years. We we didn't do this
[43:38] before. We didn't get this detailed
level um of library operations. So, you
[43:45] know, Brandy has bounced ideas off of us
and said, "Hey, you know, I need to cut
[43:50] my budget by 3%. What is this is what my
team and I are thinking. You know, can
[43:56] you give me some feedback on that?" So,
you know, I I feel that we're a good
[44:00] sounding board for her and we can give
her, you know, some feedback on that.
[44:04] Um, and really get into the weeds a bit
about how much it costs to to really
[44:10] operate a successful library.
[44:17] » Um, we should probably take public
comment before we go into council
[44:24] kind of ask. It doesn't look like we
have any
[44:27] » public comment.
>> Okay. All right. Then back.
[44:42] » Questions about priorities. I know that
that's a question we get from every
[44:47] single
um board and commission. Yeah. Council
[44:53] member Coopermanman. Um, actually, I'd
ask like to ask a follow-up question
[44:57] first. Um, sort of coming off the
mayor's comments and questions. Um, so
[45:04] right, you're called the library board
of trustees rather than say the library
[45:07] advisory board.
>> Um,
[45:11] I'm just not I don't remember from our
statutes and s and such, but is is the
[45:16] library board of trustees more formal
than an advisory board? And could you
[45:22] clarify that for us? Yeah, that's a
fantastic question. Thank you. So,
[45:26] public libraries are governed by state
law. Part of our state law in Colorado,
[45:30] um believe it's statute 249 outlines
what a library board of trustees is
[45:34] charged with. That includes things like
budgetary oversight. Um typically hiring
[45:39] and some sort of performance management
of the director. Um things like policy
[45:44] and and including up to like our
budgetary discretion. So, if we were to
[45:49] make major changes, they have input in
all of that. So public libraries also
[45:53] operate as an odd entity in throughout
Colorado because you can be a municipal
[45:57] library which we are or a district which
is a special taxing district as a
[46:01] municipal library. Typically there is a
joint agreement between the board and
[46:06] the municipality about who's governing
the library director who's overseeing
[46:10] their performance who's doing the hiring
and firing there. Um but a lot of the
[46:14] dictation of policy approval um lies
with the board of trustees as a more
[46:18] formalized body than an advisory board.
And I don't know if anyone from the
[46:24] board would like to sort of comment on,
you know, whether I mean, you said
[46:28] you're learning a lot about how uh
library law works in Colorado and so
[46:33] forth. So, I don't know. Do you have any
thoughts or concerns about how you're
[46:38] functioning as a board of trustees
currently or or not or I don't know.
[46:44] » I can speak to that. So, uh, in the
past, um, prior to Brandy coming on
[46:51] board, I don't believe that we were
meeting our full duties and
[46:55] responsibilities, um, as a governing
board. Um, there were certain things
[46:59] that, uh, slipped through cracks. So,
it's been a lot of restructuring,
[47:03] ensuring that everyone has been trained
on what they need to do and what they're
[47:08] responsible for. And I think that we're
moving towards a much better state of
[47:12] being able to be not just a group of
people that meets um bimonthly and talks
[47:16] about how much we love the library,
although that's great, but also actively
[47:20] is informing the governance of the
library um and uh serving as uh
[47:27] responsible leasins um both to you all
and uh to the community as well.
[47:32] I'm actually going to hop in off what
Ally just said and and point out having
[47:36] seen the transition when Brandy came on
and and been for such a great deal of
[47:40] time, this board is more involved with a
lot of the detailed decisions and serves
[47:46] more of a role of representing our
fellow citizens um than we did before.
[47:50] I'll give you a small example that may
seem like nothing. Brandy came to us
[47:55] talking about an issue of needing to um
have folks empty out the the study rooms
[48:04] 10 minutes 10 15 minutes early and make
that a library policy that we start
[48:09] shoeing people out not exactly the best
words. Sorry Brandy.
[48:15] We kindly ask our patrons
to exit the study rooms 15 minutes early
[48:22] because our staff is is limited and they
need to be able to clear the library out
[48:27] on time. We need to find ways to
maximize our staff our staff usage.
[48:34] But this is something she brought to the
board and said, "Is this reasonable?
[48:38] What things do you think should be put
in place along with this? How should we
[48:41] address this with our patients? With
sorry, I'm a nurse. With with our
[48:45] patrons,
what policies do we need to put in
[48:49] place? What announcements should we
make? All of these details the board
[48:54] addressed. This is not something that
would have happened before. Our role is
[48:57] very different than it used to be.
I'll pop into uh based on my past
[49:04] experience. I formerly was serving on a
school board for 10 years. Um, and then
[49:11] as as a dean in higher education, I
oversaw three libraries. So, I had a
[49:16] sense of the way boards
are expected to work in a variety of
[49:21] settings. And previously, I think with
no criticism directed to toward any
[49:28] given person. Um, the board wasn't in
compliance either with state law or what
[49:35] would generally be expected by other
boards. um to public serving
[49:41] organizations. And so I'm I'm very
grateful to see the changes that have
[49:46] occurred in the last year
and it's been I think a little bit of a
[49:51] surprise to all of us as members how far
off we were in terms of the state law
[49:57] and compliance. So that's when we've
said a big learning curve, that's what
[50:02] it refers to. you know,
>> add to that, too. I feel like as a
[50:07] volunteer, it gives me more of a sense
of purpose and I I know, you know, what
[50:11] direction we're going in, you know, so
Bry's kind of steering the ship and, you
[50:15] know, we can help her correct course as
needed. But, um, going in every month,
[50:20] it's like, okay, this is what we're
doing. And it it feels more purposeful
[50:25] and also that my time is more valuable
and it's it's really um, sorry,
[50:31] respected and and valued.
So, all sorts of positive uh changes and
[50:36] I think we're on a really great
trajectory and a great path moving
[50:40] forward.
[50:46] » Go ahead.
>> I'm going to kind of follow up on this a
[50:50] little bit. Um, I'm wondering with some
advisory boards, they're not allowed to
[50:54] accept donations from the public, um,
and then specifically use them for their
[51:01] priorities.
As a licensed board, are you a 501c3?
[51:08] Can you accept cash and no?
>> It's a fantastic question. Thank you for
[51:14] allowing me to clarify,
>> so yes, the library board of trustees is
[51:17] not an independent 501c3. They are an
appointed body by this body, this
[51:22] elected body. Um, but our foundation is,
so the library foundation is an
[51:27] independent 501c3 which acts as the
philanthropic arm for the library which
[51:32] we are able to direct gifts to whether
that be cash, goods or artwork.
[51:37] » And do those two boards interact and
cooperate?
[51:41] » Yes, quite deeply.
>> Let me speak to that. So myself or
[51:45] Cheryl, the the vice chair, we attend
every meeting so that there's great
[51:49] collaboration and, you know, we can make
sure that we're sharing what we're
[51:53] working on as a board and the foundation
can ask us, you know, any questions that
[51:57] they may have. And then once a year we
have a joint meeting. So that's planned
[52:01] for September 10th. Um, and it's it's
really great to sit down with everybody
[52:05] who loves the library, is working hard
uh to make sure that our library is the
[52:10] best it can be. They're a wonderful
group and uh they meet monthly.
[52:18] » Thank you. So um first it sounds like
then based on the discussion that the
[52:24] board of trustees parieties
priorities yeah
[52:31] » um
aligns with your duties as is spelled
[52:37] out um in a variety of different uh
documents. So, I'm going to move on then
[52:41] to the discussion points that you all
have up here um and kind of give you my
[52:47] my viewpoint on those. So, as far as you
know, council's top priorities for the
[52:52] next year, and I'm going to blend that
one and two kind of together uh for for
[52:57] for me, you know, one of the top
priorities we're discussing through the
[53:02] budget cycle is maintaining the assets
that we have and taking care of what we
[53:08] have. Um, and I think that naturally
extends to the library as well for all
[53:14] the reasons that you beautifully told us
about. It's a really important asset
[53:18] that we maintain.
Um, as far as um, you know, goals and
[53:25] investments and such, I would say we're
going to start discussions about our
[53:30] work plan for next year. So, that could
help inform the direction that you all
[53:34] go in maybe with some of your work. Um,
the thing that stands out to me that's
[53:42] going to hopefully be happening soon is
the front and center project. So, I I
[53:46] would really like to be able to lean um
on you all to help us ensure in
[53:52] coordination with with director Cummings
that the library, you know, still
[53:57] remains accessible, how you're going to
do your programs, everything else. Um we
[54:00] I think we talk a lot about how it
impacts the businesses but equally it
[54:06] impacts you all as well in your work
right. Um and then for three and four
[54:12] about partnering and collaborating more.
I think you have a phenomenal director
[54:19] who does a great job partnering and
collaborating with you all and then
[54:23] bringing that information to us. So, I
fully put my trust in Director Cummings
[54:29] to continue to do that because I think
that's the the really from my point of
[54:33] view, the best way for us to partner
with you all is through her expertise,
[54:38] her strategy and visioning, which I wish
I could channel some of that myself. Um,
[54:44] I think honestly is the most impactful
way to achieve three and four. So, I
[54:48] hope that's helpful and I'll open it up
to my fellow council members.
[54:52] » Others? Yes.
Council member Hefner.
[54:57] » Yeah, thank you. Thanks. Thanks to all
of you for coming and and sharing in the
[55:00] presentation. I I agree with everything.
Um my word three colleagues said I I
[55:06] would add, you know, on the sort of
taking care of what we have front. I I
[55:09] do think that's really important. The
other thing we've all been working hard
[55:13] on is we just finished our comprehensive
plan for land use and we'll be
[55:18] implementing that with a development
code rewrite. you know, and depending on
[55:22] who you ask, I think one of the outcomes
of that is going to be we're hoping to
[55:27] get
open Lewisville to to more and different
[55:31] kinds of people than necessarily live
here now. And, you know, assuming we're
[55:36] successful in some of those efforts, uh
your role in the library's role will be
[55:41] more important than ever and and
hopefully we can continue to drive the
[55:46] um wonderful growth in in program
attendance and circulation and
[55:49] everything else. Um, and so on that
note, I think that's one one thing to
[55:54] come and and another reason to keep up
the good work, but really appreciate all
[55:58] all the effort and all Bry's effort and
um the the library is one of our gems of
[56:03] the city and whether it's a core service
or not, I'll I'll leave for others to
[56:06] decide, but it's um I always think about
what are the things that would, you
[56:10] know, if they went missing, everyone
would notice and certainly on that list.
[56:14] Um so, thank you.
Um, we have just a few minutes, but are
[56:20] there other council members want to
weigh in on these?
[56:25] » I think council member or member Tan did
a wonderful job of explaining I think
[56:32] encapsulating what certainly I said or
want to say.
[56:36] » Yeah, I I would absolutely echo um what
council members Hamilton and Hefner uh
[56:42] just said. I just wanted to add um I
mean on point point number two um
[56:50] I would say like what one of the things
we're looking from for for from you uh
[56:56] is advice on that. I mean I I feel like
you all are much more um qualified to
[57:04] to advise on where right where we need
to invest or or not to invest for the
[57:08] library. Um, and so I would say, uh,
sort of in line with number three, you
[57:13] know, you should really feel free to
provide us with that information. Um,
[57:17] and you know, I for one am happy to have
conversations about that or I think, you
[57:22] know, if you just want to send us memos
or emails or anything like that, um,
[57:26] we're always welcome. So,
[57:31] » yeah, I agree. Um, the mayor prom stated
everything so well. I won't try to
[57:36] restate. Um, I just wanted to see if you
guys hear some of the same things that I
[57:41] do. Do you hear from the senior
community at all the the members who
[57:45] come in and need especially books and
the access or lack thereof to like new
[57:51] like the newest like novels that are out
especially in large print or newspapers
[57:57] in large print because what I've what I
have been hearing is the only access is
[58:01] a digital one and I find that that is
not actually typically used by our
[58:06] senior population. So I was just curious
to see if that was something that you
[58:09] guys have heard as well. Yeah. So,
looking at patron feedback specifically
[58:13] in our senior population, we do hear
quite often um a frustration or a
[58:18] dissatisfaction with the large print
collection. Um our print collection
[58:22] budget is is remarkably restrictive and
because we need to invest in the items
[58:27] that are most highly used, we try to
lean into our consorcia as best we can.
[58:32] The real the realities of our beautiful
library is that the footprint is
[58:36] relatively small. So we have about
82,000 items in our collection. Of that
[58:40] maybe 5% is large print for a colle this
size and with a growing aging
[58:46] population. Our goal um internally so
under staff's direction is to grow that
[58:52] to a 7% of our collection. However,
print newspapers becomes a whole
[58:57] different world. Um, as the print
publishing world continues to struggle
[59:01] in an increasingly digital age, we do
see increasing costs in print
[59:05] publications that just aren't feasible
with with some of our budget
[59:09] constraints. So, when we start to have
to compare like what priority do we
[59:13] meet, whose needs do we put where, um,
that is why we're turning to things like
[59:17] the strategic plan, which is engaging
the entire populace to be able to help
[59:22] identify some of those sort of shared
values and shared priorities. So yes, we
[59:26] do we do hear some of those echoes. Um
and we are looking for creative ways to
[59:30] stretch what we have and meet those
needs to the best of our ability.
[59:34] » Thank you, director.
>> If I may, just real quick, is that also
[59:38] something that you guys share with the
foundation since they're responsible for
[59:42] helping to do some fundraising that that
might be targeted type of fundraising
[59:46] and there's specific organizations that
maybe they would be able to communicate
[59:50] with to raise money when it's something
specific for that? I don't know.
[59:54] » Yes. So the foundation is aware of
library needs. We have um monthly
[59:58] meetings with them where we check in on
our goals and priorities. They've also
[1:00:01] been a part of the strategic planning
process. Their fundraising currently has
[1:00:05] focused on programmatic things like the
summer reading program which could not
[1:00:08] happen without fun foundation support.
Otherwise, the bulk of their gift that
[1:00:13] they give us every year does already go
to collections. Our collections budget
[1:00:17] is about 50,000 less than our
surrounding communities from our
[1:00:20] operating budget from the city. And so
we do rely on subsidy from the
[1:00:24] foundation. And as that is a variable
and unreliable source of money depending
[1:00:28] year after year, we have to make some of
those decisions on a on a less um
[1:00:33] strategic visionary base year-over-year.
>> Thank you.
[1:00:36] » If I could add a little bit um
representing the superior community, I
[1:00:41] can guarantee you that the senior
community um is very very interested in
[1:00:46] the library and what resources are
available. they are primarily interested
[1:00:52] in ebooks and our collection is very
small um relative to other libraries. So
[1:00:59] it's not unusual to have a wait list of
82 people or even sometimes over 200
[1:01:04] people for a given book. Um so that's
one of the strongest areas of senior
[1:01:10] interest.
>> I agree. I buy my ebooks because I can't
[1:01:14] rent them.
>> Thank you very much for getting
[1:01:17] together. Um, one thing I do encourage
you, and I think you've heard it a
[1:01:21] couple of times, is um, watching budget
and giving us input is the way we get,
[1:01:31] uh, good good input from the boards and
commissions. And I hope you'll, you
[1:01:36] know, continue to to work with um, the
director on that and on um, on the work
[1:01:43] plan which is coming up too. If you're
interested in making, you know, some
[1:01:48] suggestions, we're getting close to
finishing the budget, but there will be
[1:01:52] a a a draft um budget that comes from
our city manager um the the first. We're
[1:02:00] going to have to shut um down because
we've got other um things coming. But
[1:02:05] please, if you have questions, thoughts,
don't hesitate to get in touch with us.
[1:02:09] But I think working with Brandy is, as
we've said, the best thing um we can do.
[1:02:16] » Well, thank you all for your time this
evening and thank you for having us here
[1:02:20] and thank you very much for your
feedback. I appreciate it.
[1:02:23] » Thanks.
>> Thank you.
[1:02:27] » Do you need a minute to set up? Um are
we are we headed back upstairs here? Are
[1:02:34] we
>> okay?
[1:02:38] I'm going to use a quick
[1:02:43] Why don't we plan to come back in a
couple of minutes things are set.
[1:06:41] on
[1:06:58] on and we're ready for
um our item B which is discussion and
[1:07:05] direction on the draft cross guide book
that's um Parks Recre open space guide
[1:07:12] book. Um and um why don't we start with
the presentation.
[1:07:24] » Sure. Thank you, Mayor. Adam Blackmore,
director of parks, wreck, and open
[1:07:28] space. Thrilled to be with you tonight.
Um in our rough estimates, closing in on
[1:07:33] our 30th public meeting related to this
specific project. Um as we we move
[1:07:39] forward. So, it's it's very exciting uh
with that amount of engagement and and
[1:07:44] time spent with the community, with our
elected officials and our boards uh to
[1:07:48] be able to present to you and I'll
highlight in all air quotes a draft um
[1:07:53] guide book which includes a 10yearish
10 plus year long range plan uh for the
[1:08:01] entire department as well as what would
be our first um city's trail system plan
[1:08:08] uh referenced in um areas as a trails
master plan. And so the drafts you have
[1:08:13] tonight um as I mentioned, they're a
culmination of um what would be four
[1:08:19] plus years of work. Um, one one of the
first items when I started with the city
[1:08:24] nearly four and a half years ago uh was
a high demand from the community to have
[1:08:29] um some more concrete direction and some
understanding of where this version of
[1:08:33] Lewisville sits as it relates to
priority uh for resources, priority for
[1:08:38] amenities
um and all the ins and outs um of what's
[1:08:42] valued in this community throughout our
very broad uh very highly used
[1:08:47] department. And so, um, you know, we've
gotten to this point, um, with the
[1:08:53] drafts. Uh, we are currently in, we're
right in the middle of, uh, potentially
[1:08:59] one of our last, if not our last full
community engagement periods. Um, we're
[1:09:06] seeking some guidance on if we're on the
right track tonight from city council as
[1:09:10] well as um feedback that would be
relevant to uh just any public input
[1:09:16] process as well after uh you've had a
chance to review the drafts. Um so I
[1:09:22] would just I'm I reiterate that because
we do still have uh three two and a half
[1:09:26] three-ish weeks left of public comment
to gain. Um, we have had some pretty
[1:09:33] robust comments thus far through our
engaged Lewisville site. Um, which I
[1:09:37] would encourage, um, anyone who hasn't
done that to go and review the draft
[1:09:40] plans, but also review the litany of
supporting documentation that's gone in
[1:09:44] to help uh, get us to where we are, but
also any comments. We've had comments
[1:09:49] from typos that will inevitably, no
matter how many times we read it, be
[1:09:53] found um to uh more substance and
substantive feedback that we can
[1:09:58] certainly take into consideration as we
work to refine these to a plan that can
[1:10:04] uh proudly be brought before you
hopefully in October uh for adoption.
[1:10:09] And so tonight, Brian's going to go
through um a brief presentation for you.
[1:10:15] So, if you're unaware, Brian Weber is
our planning and project manager for
[1:10:19] PROS. He's uh wearing a ton of hats, as
has been mentioned through our budget
[1:10:23] presentations over the past few months.
He's also juggling a um incredibly high
[1:10:28] workload while trying to uh crank out a
really high quality product I think is
[1:10:33] before you tonight uh to guide the
department moving forward. And so, Brian
[1:10:37] will go through his um his presentation.
We're happy to take any feedback um as
[1:10:44] it fits into refinements. Uh Brian will
touch on a few things that we've already
[1:10:48] kind of heard as it relates to
formatting and some content uh that
[1:10:52] we're going to be relaying back to our
consultant. We'll meet with the
[1:10:55] consultant later this week. Uh DTJ is
our primary consultant, but we have subs
[1:10:59] for all of the divisions uh outlined in
the plans you see before you tonight,
[1:11:03] including the trails plan. Um and then
once the public engagement period has
[1:11:08] ended midepptember uh again we'll take
all of those comments which we'll seek
[1:11:13] some direction tonight on how you would
like to see us utilize those um comments
[1:11:19] and hopefully again in October get you a
final plan. So without further ado, I'll
[1:11:24] turn it over to Brian to go through a
brief presentation on kind of where we
[1:11:27] are and how we got here.
[1:11:32] » All right. Thank you, Adam, and thanks
to council for having us at this special
[1:11:37] meeting to review these plans. Um,
really foundational for our department
[1:11:42] and our future and, um, worthy of as
many discussions as possible. So, as a
[1:11:48] quick recap, um, we started almost two
years ago developing our RFP, uh,
[1:11:54] request for proposal for this project.
um that came before our advisory boards
[1:12:00] as well as council prior to being
posted. Um fast forward now to August of
[1:12:05] 2026 and here we are with draft plans um
under public review. So it's been quite
[1:12:12] a process um for us to get to this
point. Um and that included really a
[1:12:18] foundation of robust community input.
Um, so over really the past 14 months or
[1:12:26] so, um, as Adam mentioned, we've had
over 20, uh, closing in on 30 now, um,
[1:12:33] meetings with various aspects of the
community, whether that's advisory
[1:12:38] boards, uh, popup events out at our, um,
trail heads or parks, rec center,
[1:12:45] um, opportunities for people to provide
input on, uh, surveys, both residents
[1:12:51] and an open link survey um as well as um
through open houses. So, we've had a
[1:12:59] number of opportunities for people to
engage and had great response to those
[1:13:04] opportunities. Um we've looked at a
variety of plans and policies, uh
[1:13:09] existing conditions, things that kind of
frame the plans that you see today, as
[1:13:14] well as getting uh guidance from a
variety of consultants on the team. um
[1:13:19] everything from trail and kind of
transportation experts to ecological
[1:13:24] u consultants,
survey experts that helped us draft and
[1:13:28] implement the survey itself and then DTJ
as our lead consultant kind of hurting
[1:13:33] everything and structuring the process
itself. Um, another thing that has been
[1:13:39] ongoing is obviously the budget and
planning process specifically this year
[1:13:43] as we look at um the 27 and 28 and on
capital improvement planning um as well
[1:13:51] as feedback from staff. So, not only our
superintendent of the various divisions,
[1:13:57] but field staff as well. Um, and so
really what this plan comes down to is
[1:14:02] we're trying to establish a clear
framework um, and a set of priorities
[1:14:06] for how our department can move forward.
The intent of the plans um, lots of
[1:14:14] terms out there that can be kind of
confusing, but ultimately a long range
[1:14:19] plan, a trail system plan, we would put
them in the category of strategic level,
[1:14:24] highlevel plans. Um, we're looking to,
hence the name guide book, we're looking
[1:14:30] to establish a direction for our future
and kind of guide the way. Um, help us
[1:14:35] to prioritize knowing that we can't
possibly accomplish everything that
[1:14:40] every single person wants us to do. Um
but looking at kind of the communitywide
[1:14:47] um high level, how can we
get kind of the most bang for our buck
[1:14:52] in investments um with limited resources
and kind of define the outcomes that the
[1:14:57] community as a whole desires
and then develop a framework um for
[1:15:03] action that we can really implement so
that we're not just talking about big
[1:15:07] ideas and lofty goals, but we're trying
to break that into a series of steps
[1:15:12] that we can actually take to achieve
these things. Um, identifying priority
[1:15:16] level, time frame, staff position
responsible, etc. That being said, uh,
[1:15:22] we do want our goals and strategies to
be actionable, but we by no means have
[1:15:28] all of the answers, um, or can these
plans provide all of the answers. um one
[1:15:34] for unforeseen challenges or shifting
priorities, but just the level of
[1:15:38] detail, meaning if we talk about a
certain amenity, we don't have it
[1:15:42] designed, right? So, we don't know
exactly how much it cost um or even
[1:15:47] exactly where it goes um within the
community, but we're just identifying
[1:15:51] that um some of these things like a
recreation field for example
[1:15:58] um are an amenity that's been desired by
the community and highlighted through
[1:16:01] this process and something that we need
to um carve out resources for going
[1:16:06] forward. So, um, we don't have all the
details today, um, on, you know, exactly
[1:16:12] how things will be implemented. Um, but
we do want to make sure that we're
[1:16:16] heading in the right direction and
pursuing the right, um, direction and
[1:16:20] priorities.
In terms of, um, kind of where we stand
[1:16:25] as staff, uh, I think one of the things
that we appreciate the most about the
[1:16:31] direction that these plans have gone is
that they're broken down by division. So
[1:16:36] looking at parks, the recreation and
senior services, open space, Cole Creek
[1:16:42] golf course and the trail system which
weaves between parks, open space and
[1:16:48] kind of public right away. Um
each division has its own unique needs.
[1:16:55] In some cases has its own funding
sources, has its own um governing
[1:17:00] documents in some cases such as the city
charter. So we really need to focus at
[1:17:05] the division level and these plans um
allow us to do that. Uh there also is a
[1:17:11] sentiment from the community to um
continue what we're doing right maintain
[1:17:17] what we have build on what's working. So
that to say, we're not starting from
[1:17:21] scratch, right? There's been a number of
um things in process for a long time
[1:17:26] that we want to look to continue to
leverage and continue um to build on the
[1:17:31] success of things that have been done
and and are ongoing. Now, more than
[1:17:36] anything, it's grounded in community
input. Um so we had great response from
[1:17:40] the community to help provide us
direction. At the same time, we're
[1:17:44] trying to balance lofty goals, big
picture ideas with the u realism of like
[1:17:51] where do we stand, you know, as a city
financially, what can we achieve, what
[1:17:56] resources do we have? Um, and trying to
strike that balance between goals that
[1:18:01] inspire us and pull us forward and
elevate us to a next level, but don't go
[1:18:07] so high that we could never achieve
them, and we're basically setting
[1:18:10] ourselves up for failure. So I think
we're striking um a good balance there
[1:18:15] as well.
Combined with that is uh guiding
[1:18:20] decision- making, right? We we can't say
yes to everything and every person. Um
[1:18:25] and so we can use this document as a
foundation for those decisions going
[1:18:30] forward for where we can say yes, where
we unfortunately do need to say no, um
[1:18:35] and how we can best focus our resources.
I think it's interesting timing coming
[1:18:40] to adoption here um with where we are in
the CIP process for the next couple
[1:18:46] years and kind of
balancing the community input of
[1:18:52] maintaining what we have the realism of
kind of where our budget is projected to
[1:18:58] be and the goals and objectives that
this plan sets and I think that there's
[1:19:02] a nice synergy there um between this
plan how it informs terms um CIP
[1:19:08] planning going forward and also what's
desired by our community of maintaining
[1:19:12] and leveraging existing assets. Um so I
think we're in a good place there. And
[1:19:16] then more than anything um the way that
this document set up that I've not seen
[1:19:22] before is there is a big booklet, right?
There's literally hundreds of pages to
[1:19:28] read through. But the spine and the
foundation of that is an action matrix
[1:19:33] that establishes the goals, strategies,
and action items for each division. And
[1:19:38] that's something that we can not only
use for implementation, but we can use
[1:19:42] that in ongoing fashion. Meaning that we
can update that, we can track progress,
[1:19:47] we can literally cross things off the
list as they're done. We can shift
[1:19:52] priorities and time frames um more
easily based on budget cycles. So it's
[1:19:58] not just a document that is intended to
sit on get adopted and sit on a shelf.
[1:20:03] It's a document that we can use on an
annual basis um and really be a living
[1:20:09] and working document um to guide us and
not be 10 years from now with another
[1:20:16] consultant going oh yeah back in 2025
and 2026 we did this. This action matrix
[1:20:22] is something that we can actively use on
a year-to-year basis. So, uh, staff are
[1:20:27] feeling good about, um, what we have,
the direction that we're headed, and,
[1:20:32] um,
the idea of, you know, building on what
[1:20:36] the community, um, input, uh, what the
community has told us over the past 14
[1:20:41] months. So, in terms of input, um,
tonight, there's a number of ways to
[1:20:46] kind of try to tackle all of the content
that was put before you guys and a lot
[1:20:51] of questions to kind of stew on as you
go through things. But ultimately, it
[1:20:55] really boils down to kind of this
central question at the bottom, and
[1:20:59] that's, you know, do we feel that the
long range plan and the trail system
[1:21:03] plan are setting the right strategic
vision for the department and each
[1:21:07] division going forward? Um, as we look
at a fiveyear and 10-year outlook, uh,
[1:21:13] some of the things that we've heard so
far, um, in terms of kind of refinements
[1:21:18] that are desired prior to adoption, um,
this idea of kind of connecting the
[1:21:23] dots. So, we have the long range plan,
we have the trail system plan, each one
[1:21:27] has an appendix with additional uh, very
thorough documents. So, how can we
[1:21:33] better connect the dots and strengthen
the plan so that a lot of that
[1:21:36] foundational work, specifically the
needs assessment and the community
[1:21:40] engagement summary is kind of more um
legible in the plans itself brought more
[1:21:46] to the to the forefront of those
documents um to understand kind of the
[1:21:50] context and the driving force. So, we've
heard that from some people um in kind
[1:21:56] of looking back to the earlier stages of
the project and how do we uh make sure
[1:22:00] that that information is present in the
final plans. Um at the same time, kind
[1:22:06] of looking forward uh with capital
improvement planning, how do we make
[1:22:10] sure that it's clear in these plans um
how the capital improvement planning
[1:22:15] will be informed by these plans? what
are some of the um key priorities coming
[1:22:20] out of these plans that will show up in
future capital requests, etc. Um and
[1:22:26] specifically with the trails plan, how
it relates to the transportation master
[1:22:31] plan that public works overseas, the
comp plan um with community development,
[1:22:35] and how is the trail system plan kind of
finding its home between those documents
[1:22:41] um building off of them, being informed
by them, and anticipating the future
[1:22:46] changes. uh specifically with the comp
plan that it kind of is projecting for
[1:22:50] Lewisville's future. Um and then
also kind of the prioritization. So um
[1:22:58] recognizing that each action item um and
strategy kind of has a high, medium or
[1:23:04] low and then has a time frame one to
fiveyear, 5 to 10 or is it something
[1:23:10] that we're doing in an ongoing fashion?
um that those are things that um we can
[1:23:15] get input on as well and kind of easily
tweak to meet um you know what what
[1:23:21] council thinks is the best direction um
for us. So with that, um just a quick
[1:23:27] recap, next steps. We're in public
comment till September 13th. Um seeking
[1:23:31] direction on kind of what happens after
September 13th with the feedback that we
[1:23:38] receive um through the website, through
email, um from this group, from our
[1:23:43] advisory boards who are also discussing
this plan at August and September
[1:23:48] meetings. Um, and really our goal is to
try to make these refinements,
[1:23:53] incorporate the input, and be able to
come back in October with a document um,
[1:23:57] that we feel is ready for adoption and
and get the thumbs up that this is the
[1:24:03] direction that we'd like to see the
department go um, for the next decade.
[1:24:08] So, with that, I'm happy to try to
answer any questions. I know there's a
[1:24:13] lot to digest with all of these plans
and appendices and all the things, but
[1:24:18] um if there's questions we can answer um
feedback we can incorporate or things
[1:24:23] that we can try to find an answer to,
happy to discuss.
[1:24:30] » Good. Um we will start with um council
questions. So who would like to kick off
[1:24:38] on this one?
[1:24:42] No questions at all. Wow.
[1:24:48] Okay. Um, we can go to public comment. I
I actually I've got a couple of
[1:24:54] questions myself, but yes, member
Goerman.
[1:25:03] Um,
let's see.
[1:25:08] Um
guess some a couple of smaller
[1:25:13] questions. Um
so on the there's the a map that shows
[1:25:19] all the open space properties and it has
the different designations of types of
[1:25:23] open space. Are those currently
established or are those suggestions?
[1:25:32] So, um that
[1:25:37] » um I can try to find it.
[1:25:46] » Yeah, I forget.
[1:25:58] Yeah, I think I know that you're talking
>> 45.
[1:26:05] » I'm off. I think I know the map you're
talking about and that map reflects uh
[1:26:10] the recent results of vegetation survey
that was done by open space staff. Um
[1:26:16] that is one of the reports um that you
can link to in the appendix and is
[1:26:20] available um on the engage website. All
of the different appendix um appendex
[1:26:26] items are there to read kind of that
full report.
[1:26:29] » But my understanding is that
>> as a result of the vegetation study,
[1:26:34] they correlated the types of vegetation
um to different classifications. And so
[1:26:41] in areas where they found more native
species, less weeds, etc. that warranted
[1:26:48] being um the highest like preserve
level. Things that were more like smooth
[1:26:53] broom, undesirable vegetation were in
the lower. So that map basically
[1:26:59] reflects classifications that were
informed by the vegetation survey data.
[1:27:05] So it's kind of a snapshot of where
things sit today.
[1:27:10] » Okay. But it's not like a formally
adopted in some sense.
[1:27:14] I mean like we haven't said like
>> No, it's meant to reflect current
[1:27:20] snapshot using the veg survey. We do
have designations and mapping for each
[1:27:25] property as it's came through council's
review or OSAB's review historically
[1:27:31] that we've been using for guidance as it
relates to um infrastructure
[1:27:35] improvements or the way that we manage
the properties. But that specific map I
[1:27:39] think is talking to just a snapshot of
the veg survey.
[1:27:46] » Okay. Um
and then another question about a map.
[1:27:52] Um so there's a one of the trails maps
showing existing
[1:27:57] um conditions. Again, it seems like it
shows some bicycle lanes but not all the
[1:28:03] bicycle lanes. So, I was wondering, you
know, is the is it supposed to is it
[1:28:09] supposed to show all bicycle lanes or
are there certain ones that have been
[1:28:15] emphasized or like there are there
actually ones that are sort of
[1:28:17] designated as parts of trails? I'm just
not sure. Yeah. So, we wrestled quite a
[1:28:24] bit with the classifications and try to
how to best adapt
[1:28:29] kind of industry standard or national
standard trail classifications to
[1:28:35] Lewisville.
>> Um,
[1:28:38] » it's interesting because for instance in
trails planning there's this idea of a
[1:28:42] regional trail.
>> In an industry standard, a regional
[1:28:45] trail would be something more like
Highway 36. you have this, you know,
[1:28:50] consistent width of concrete that goes
between jurisdictions, but then we have
[1:28:55] the Cole Creek Regional Trail, which is
anything but Highway 36, right? So, we
[1:29:01] we kind of looked at these breakdowns of
like what what does it mean for
[1:29:05] Lewisville? So kind of where we landed
was we do have these regional
[1:29:09] connections. We do have secondary
connections and then we also have um
[1:29:14] this this idea of kind of street routes
and those are things that are more in
[1:29:17] the public rightway.
>> Specifically for the bike lanes. That's
[1:29:21] something that I think we should go back
and look at that exhibit and kind of
[1:29:27] with a fine tooth comb say are we
showing these accurately or not? Um and
[1:29:31] double check that. In terms of the
trails planning, we are considering more
[1:29:35] of the street routes um being part of
the system, not just like a bike lane in
[1:29:41] the road, but more of something where
you have um kind of like a separated
[1:29:45] bike lane. So, if you think along
>> like the north side of Cherry Street
[1:29:50] over by Heritage Park, um there's like a
a concrete path on the north side of
[1:29:55] Cherry. Um that's kind of a street route
trail, right? Um but not like just a
[1:30:01] three foot wide section of a lane, so to
speak.
[1:30:04] » Yeah.
>> Okay, that's helpful. Um
[1:30:12] okay.
[1:30:15] And uh maybe
um
[1:30:20] » I don't know. Maybe that's all for now.
Thank you.
[1:30:22] » Okay,
member Kern.
[1:30:26] » Great. Thank you. Uh first off,
appreciate like this is huge amount of
[1:30:31] work. I know that I've mentioned this to
you guys before, but I thought in a very
[1:30:34] public setting I would I would offer
that as thanks because I think this is a
[1:30:38] big project. Um so I I had a question
about it's under the open space and it's
[1:30:45] I think in the details of the action
plan that we're kind of talking about
[1:30:50] page 114 Chris to help you find it. Um
and I think it's under the open space
[1:30:57] 2.3 it has a mention of wildfire
mitigation in with vegetation management
[1:31:03] practices and ecological restoration.
And then in 231 it's it like it talks
[1:31:11] about um incorporating resource
protection measures uh into project
[1:31:15] designs implementation and then aligning
projects with operational activities and
[1:31:20] adopted plans. Is there something like
this one in also the parks area because
[1:31:25] I know we also have to do this on that
kind of like unerrigated parks I think
[1:31:30] I'm saying that right out on irrigated
parks land um and is this enough
[1:31:36] information I mean given given like the
the importance of this to the community
[1:31:42] to I guess since this is going to be a
staff document to make sure that future
[1:31:46] people for the next 10 years or more
understand like what a high priority
[1:31:51] this is my concern is where it's living
and how small it is and I just wanted to
[1:31:57] see if if it felt the importance to you
because as I read this it doesn't strike
[1:32:02] me as it's high level
[1:32:09] for us it is
to your point though I think if there's
[1:32:14] a way to make it more prominent or to
highlight the language we can certainly
[1:32:19] consider that in the final draft for
future people that would be reading this
[1:32:24] or implementing it. Um,
you know, I do think
[1:32:29] and I'd have to go do a a word search of
sorts, but we did take the feedback from
[1:32:34] the April meeting specific to
reinforcing that message. Um, and
[1:32:39] incorporated that pretty substantially
throughout the document and all aspects
[1:32:45] really. Um, so I think that for what
we're trying to implement and in the at
[1:32:50] least the short term, it's definitely
got a high level of priority. Um,
[1:32:57] yeah, I'll I'll leave it at that. I I
think for us it's good, but you know, we
[1:33:01] can certainly consider ways to ensure
that number one, it is in parks and
[1:33:05] number two that it's highlighted.
>> Yeah. And there is mention of it in
[1:33:10] parks and golf also. um this idea of
fire mitigation. I think the how it fits
[1:33:17] into specifically open space with the
concept of lands management of as we do
[1:33:23] these restoration projects as we
increase um the percentage of native
[1:33:27] grasses get rid of things like smooth
broom that that is supporting fire
[1:33:32] mitigation um and managing those fuels.
So
[1:33:37] my understanding from discussion with
open space staff is that the fire
[1:33:41] mitigation falls under those um the land
management and kind of it's all the
[1:33:48] goals are all they all align I guess if
that makes sense. So as we restore
[1:33:51] native grasses we have better habitat
we're more resilient against wildfire
[1:33:58] kind of all goes hand inand together.
Um, so that's why I think you see it
[1:34:03] kind of nested under that broader goal
about the resource management.
[1:34:07] » Okay.
>> Um, but yeah, the feedback's good. It's
[1:34:10] important.
>> Thank you. I appreciate it.
[1:34:16] » Other questions?
[1:34:20] » Okay.
Um, I want to follow up on one of the
[1:34:23] questions that council member
Coopermanman asked, which is, um, when
[1:34:30] if and when we adopt this, probably when
we adopt this in some form
[1:34:38] on as to that figure 11.
Um, what are we going to be adopting
[1:34:47] and what are we not going to be
adopting? Are we going to be I mean is
[1:34:52] that going to set in
priority I guess your
[1:34:59] um future activity? Is that what we're
talking about or is there some something
[1:35:05] different than that?
[1:35:12] » So the way I understand it is I mean
everything in the document would be
[1:35:17] adopted. um the key aspects in terms of
priorities or future goals and
[1:35:24] objectives really comes down to that
matrix. So looking at the the goals,
[1:35:30] strategies and action items for each
division,
[1:35:33] priority level, time frame, etc. So if
there's something for instance that
[1:35:40] we have as a low priority happening 10
years from now and council thinks it
[1:35:44] needs to be a high priority happening
one year from now like that feedback's
[1:35:50] great because that's going to you know
trickle into CIP planning and um
[1:35:56] staff focus etc etc. So I think that's
you know the type of feedback from a
[1:36:02] high level um now of like do we have the
right goals, strategies, action items
[1:36:08] and are we thinking about this the right
way in terms of the priorities based on
[1:36:13] input from the community.
>> Okay. Um
[1:36:22] got a couple of
>> I think Adam has a thought too. I was
[1:36:27] just I was going to maybe highlight
something. Not that anybody asked, but I
[1:36:31] would. It's a it's a huge component of
the the plan that we were kind of able
[1:36:36] to work with the consultant and
especially OSAB. I appreciate uh Vice
[1:36:41] Chair Dorsy being here this evening and
the trails plan specifically as a a
[1:36:46] framework and a rubric for how to start
addressing the social or undesated trail
[1:36:51] issues throughout our system. And there
will be a direct tie-in to that with the
[1:36:56] figure 11 uh classifications based on
current recommendations for what that
[1:37:01] that's going to look like in the trails
plan. Um so there's definitely a tiein
[1:37:06] that impacts day-to-day maintenance and
future larger scale investment.
[1:37:12] Okay.
Um, another question I had relating to
[1:37:17] the I guess it's trail 18.
Um, and I I think um if I'm recalling
[1:37:27] one of the um emails that we received
suggested
[1:37:33] perhaps running that along 96.
Um, and I guess I was interested if you
[1:37:41] have any thoughts about that
um whether that's um something that was
[1:37:49] evaluated
um and what your thought is around that.
[1:37:55] I'm not suggesting thorough. I'm just
interested in what your thinking process
[1:38:00] was around that.
>> Yeah. So, the intent of the maps was
[1:38:06] really to cast out ideas and see um what
are potential connections that could be
[1:38:13] made in the future. We had a trails
workshop last November um that involved
[1:38:19] a variety of stakeholders from different
um kind of perspectives and and realms
[1:38:23] within the city. Um and some of that
came out of that um workshop of you know
[1:38:30] opportunities for new connections. I
think that trail in particular uh
[1:38:34] relates to the Red Tail Ridge and that
kind of emerging development and how
[1:38:39] that might shift um
circulation patterns around the city as
[1:38:45] well as the um
uh the what do we call it acquisition
[1:38:50] sorry drawing a blank of the Paradise
Lane properties um and how that kind of
[1:38:56] extends um to the north. So there's an
opportunity there. Um I will say that in
[1:39:03] the
prioritization of the different trails,
[1:39:08] the feedback that we got that specific
trail was not a high priority. So we
[1:39:13] asked for instance the OSAB group um and
trails task force of these you know
[1:39:19] 20some different potential trails which
are your top five. Um that trail was not
[1:39:25] in the top five. So from that
standpoint, I don't think that
[1:39:29] particular trail is something that we're
looking at as a a high priority item. It
[1:39:34] was more captured on a map for the
purpose of conversation and feedback
[1:39:39] collection and where the community
interest is in not only that connection,
[1:39:44] but 20 others around the city. Um in
addition to underpasses, regional trail
[1:39:51] connections, you know, there's some
different layers to that mapping um that
[1:39:54] was done. So that's kind of where that
trail falls in the the bigger picture.
[1:40:00] » So tell me if this is right that u
that's sort of a that's in the category
[1:40:06] of things to be determined later. It's
not something that we would be if we
[1:40:13] adopted this we would be adopting that
particular piece of it. I'll I'll go
[1:40:19] back to the slide a couple PowerPoint
slides again about what the intent of
[1:40:22] this plan is. Right? The intent of this
plan is to set strategy with clear
[1:40:27] understanding that investment. We'll
reference back to this when we make
[1:40:32] project recommendations,
infrastructure recommendations,
[1:40:35] maintenance, infrastructure needs.
It's not intended to be overly
[1:40:41] prescriptive. It's pretend it's intended
to showcase
[1:40:46] an incredibly high amount of public
feedback that we were able to attain
[1:40:52] that leads us to saying what we say we
think the community would like to see
[1:40:56] implemented out of this plan. But every
one of those implementation items,
[1:41:00] especially related to items like the
budget that council would be approving,
[1:41:05] uh would have the same public engagement
that any other project or planning
[1:41:10] process would have. Good. Thanks. Um,
any other questions? If there are any
[1:41:15] more questions, we'll take public
comment.
[1:41:21] » Um, first up is Matt Jones, followed by
Cindy Bedell.
[1:41:45] that on now. Uh Matt Jones live in
Lewisville. Thanks for the opportunity.
[1:41:50] I'm going to be talking about open space
tonight. I appreciate there's a lot more
[1:41:53] in the pro plan than that, but I'm
talking about open space.
[1:41:57] And you know, I'll remind you that the
city charter and the standards as
[1:42:02] preservation and protection is a
priority. I can read it to you if you
[1:42:06] want me to read the language. You
probably know it.
[1:42:09] And this the language that sets up the
land classifications areas.
[1:42:14] A lot of places in the plan you see the
word balance between recreation and
[1:42:18] ecolog and environmental protection. And
it's phrased a lot of different ways. I
[1:42:22] don't know why, but it is.
This plan is not even balanced between
[1:42:30] environmental protection and recreation.
It is way out of balance. And in part
[1:42:35] because there have been a lot of
decisions over the years that put it in
[1:42:39] that place
and there's a prime example that so you
[1:42:43] should be projecting right that's what
the charter says or constitution says
[1:42:48] not even balancing but balance isn't
even happening that's how out of whack
[1:42:52] this is a good example is the land
classifications you have them currently
[1:42:58] uh that the new ones have when we put
this together when we these land
[1:43:03] classifications went into I I was part
of that. We wanted roughly equivalent
[1:43:10] property
acreage in these things. And if you look
[1:43:14] at the map, preservation, the most
protective category is at 6%.
[1:43:22] Protections at 30%. Those should be at
50% or somewhere near that. And they
[1:43:27] should each be about 25%. And I'll tell
you where the most one of the most
[1:43:31] glaring examples of where this is a
problem is in the land classifications
[1:43:38] with in the Cole Creek. You can look at
Dutch Creek area and Cole Creek.
[1:43:43] They used the vegetation mapping for
eastern cottonwood flood plane woodland
[1:43:53] and only use part of it.
[1:43:57] flood plane's a repairarian area, right?
It's huge, huge miss. It should have had
[1:44:04] the whole part of that vegetation type
at a minimum. And then you should
[1:44:08] overlay environmental
protection criteria
[1:44:14] uh and use that such as repairing areas
of the highest value wildlife habitat
[1:44:20] you have. That was all supposed to be in
in a preservation category in the 2001
[1:44:28] in two two inventory. It was that way
and it's not. That should all be
[1:44:33] protected and it should be 25%. And
that's relative importance. Uh the other
[1:44:40] thing I would mention is the trail
connection you were talking about. I
[1:44:44] would take that trail off the map.
>> Off the map.
[1:44:49] » Mr. Jones, your time is over.
>> Okay.
[1:44:53] If I've done a lot of trail planning in
my life, that one wouldn't even make the
[1:44:57] list because of the environmental
impact. You can read my letter. Thank
[1:45:00] you.
>> Thanks.
[1:45:03] » Next up, Cindy Bedell.
[1:45:13] » Oh, hi. Can you hear me? Yeah. So, I'm
Cindy Bedell. I live in war I and um
[1:45:19] first of all I want to thank the open
space parks and recck department for
[1:45:23] everything they do. It's a wonderful
amenity and I really enjoy it. Um one of
[1:45:29] my concerns is bright flood lights from
properties bordering open space that
[1:45:35] impact wildlife, bird migration, and
evening human walkers and bike riders.
[1:45:41] As you probably know, city council was
presented with a possible dark sky
[1:45:45] ordinance in the past which was not
passed.
[1:45:49] That ordinance did include something
about residential light trespass on open
[1:45:54] space. The dark sky lighting information
that used to be on the city of
[1:45:59] Louisville website didn't make it to the
new website. And I'd like to see that
[1:46:04] put back up so that people who are
interested can learn more about dark
[1:46:08] night sky lighting and very simple
measures that can be taken to preserve
[1:46:12] our dark skies. Just um light fixtures
that point light down amber and the
[1:46:19] appropriate wattage. It's all that's
really needed. Um but a lot of people
[1:46:23] have these super bright flood lights
that are on motion detectors. So I walk
[1:46:27] at night in Coyote Run and they just
turn on and blind me, you know, and then
[1:46:32] it's very bad for the wildlife. What and
when these thousands of new housing
[1:46:36] units go in that's called for in the new
comp plan, especially the many planned
[1:46:41] for west of McCaslin, our dark night sky
over open space is going to be greatly
[1:46:46] impacted. Right now, many of us go to
Davidson Mesa to view planetary events,
[1:46:52] night photography, dark night sky, and
all of that is going to be lost without
[1:46:59] measures to protect the dark night sky
near Davidson Mesa and other open
[1:47:03] spaces. And again, um, I've studied this
a little bit about dark skylighting and,
[1:47:10] um, the measures can be very simple and
especially with new builds, I would
[1:47:14] think it wouldn't be that more cost
prohibitive just to put in fixtures that
[1:47:17] point down, have some measures in place
about wattage and, you know, amber
[1:47:22] lighting instead of bright light. So, I
don't think it's very expensive,
[1:47:26] especially at the new build. So, I'd
really like to see something about light
[1:47:31] trespass and light trespass mitigation
measures on open space um addressed and
[1:47:38] included in the um pros plan. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Cindy.
[1:47:47] » Any others?
>> No, there's no um thanks. Um let's take
[1:47:54] it back to council. I want to do a
little bit of framing on this one. Um,
[1:48:01] first I others can speak to this
obviously, but I think I speak on behalf
[1:48:09] of all all the council that this is a
monumental effort and we really
[1:48:14] appreciate all the work that's gone into
this by staff and by the community. Um,
[1:48:21] I was, um,
you know, I I I looked at the community
[1:48:28] engagement and and we've talked about
this a bit and I thought it was a really
[1:48:34] good example of community engagement
following on to the
[1:48:40] uh, comp plan, but it's actually more
community engagement than in the comp
[1:48:46] plan. And um I I really appreciate that.
I think that's this is you know uh open
[1:48:54] space and parks are huge as assets to
the city and we all want to protect them
[1:49:00] not just because the charter says we
have to protect the open space for
[1:49:04] example but because it's critically
important to who we are.
[1:49:10] Um, and it's worth maybe reminding us
based on some of the the stats there
[1:49:18] that we have 34 parks, 173 acres of
parks. That's um
[1:49:25] about what 8.2 to 8.5 acres um per
thousand. Uh that's below the average uh
[1:49:35] nationally and it's below the average in
our peer communities
[1:49:41] um
by a pretty significant amount. Um but
[1:49:47] uh it is those are very important to us
and especially as we attract um families
[1:49:53] and so forth. We're going to that's an
important concern in this on open space.
[1:49:59] I I think it's important to recognize
that although there are 675
[1:50:05] acres
of city-owned
[1:50:09] open space, there's, you know, 2,000ish
acres that are owned not necessarily by
[1:50:18] um the city, but others as well. So, um,
and we're second only to Boulder County
[1:50:25] and that, I mean, it makes me very
proud, but it also,
[1:50:30] you know, certainly informs the the
process. Um,
[1:50:37] you know, the north star for certainly
for open space is charter, as Matt Jones
[1:50:42] said. I um we can talk in just a minute
about that piece, but it's pretty
[1:50:50] important. The two documents are going
to be community documents though they
[1:50:55] have been um drafted with respect to
this wide community input and I am uh
[1:51:04] confident in the staff and the work
that's been done that um
[1:51:10] the content is consistent
with that um input. Um these are drafts.
[1:51:18] Um, we're not making a decision tonight.
Um, I think you heard a little bit in
[1:51:24] terms of what we're deciding on, what
we're not eventually, but um, there's
[1:51:29] more time for community input and there
will be, um, that. So, um, I think
[1:51:35] that's a pretty important thing for us
to
[1:51:38] to think about and I think there, as I
understand what staff is looking for,
[1:51:43] we're looking for some uh guidance on
forward direction
[1:51:47] and that's what we're here for. So, with
that in mind, what kind of comments to
[1:51:54] Yes. Council member Dickinson, what do
you have?
[1:51:57] » Yeah. Um, you know, I I liken this to
the comp plan. Um I think I've said in
[1:52:03] in other moments that you know something
this big is like it's everything and
[1:52:08] it's nothing, right? Like it's this
really really really important document
[1:52:12] and in the end it isn't what we actually
use on a on a daily basis. It's a
[1:52:18] guiding light. Um and so it's very
important we get it right and then
[1:52:22] there's a lot of work to do after its
eventual adoption um to think about like
[1:52:27] yeah what where's the money actually
coming from? which specific project is
[1:52:31] actually being funded and when. But I
think this is an awesome um
[1:52:37] uh draft and an awesome plan. I think
one of the things that's really clear to
[1:52:43] me and I just, you know, as as a council
person, I've actually been on council
[1:52:48] for nearly seven years and yet I take
almost in my mind no credit for what we
[1:52:56] have as a community when it comes to the
parks, the open space, uh our
[1:53:00] recreational facilities, all those
things. It it for the most part predates
[1:53:05] my time on council. And and I think, you
know, that's just a really cool story
[1:53:11] as, you know, this is this is my turn
and I'm here and what I think is being
[1:53:16] asked of me is don't screw it up. We've
done a really really good job over the
[1:53:21] last 20 years, 30 years, 40 years. Uh we
have incredible open space, incredible
[1:53:26] uh bike paths, amazing parks and
playgrounds and pools, and incredible
[1:53:31] rec center. um all these amazing things.
A golf course that I love I love to play
[1:53:37] at as well. There's so many wonderful
things that we have that you know it's
[1:53:43] not to say that we don't have our own
goals but I really like this idea of you
[1:53:48] know taking care of what we have because
we've done such a good job of creating
[1:53:55] it and and having it. And I say we as in
all the people that came before me, not
[1:54:00] so much me. Um, I I think we've done a
great job and I think this plan is
[1:54:07] thoughtful and I like how you guys um I
think the conversation we had the other
[1:54:12] day is uh less dreaming and more doing
like we have all these things that we
[1:54:18] want to do and all these things that we
need to do and this plan is a little bit
[1:54:23] more uh oriented towards you know
divisions getting their jobs done,
[1:54:29] divisions doing what they need to do
over the next 10 years to to preserve
[1:54:33] what we have. Um, take care of what we
have and and that's not just preserving
[1:54:39] open space, it's preserving our
incredible rec center, preserving our
[1:54:43] other incredible things. So, I think
it's great. Um, and I I'm I know it's
[1:54:50] still in draft form and I think similar
to the comp plan, it's so much bigger
[1:54:54] than the seven of us, right? This is a
living public document that so many
[1:54:59] people have had input on. So many
departments, so many um boards and we
[1:55:04] are another one of those groups that is
really important just like so many other
[1:55:08] groups are really important. Um I don't
currently have you know any certainly
[1:55:13] nothing substantial
uh to to change. I I think it's really
[1:55:18] well done and I think we've gotten a lot
of positive feedback uh both directly,
[1:55:22] you know, people speaking to me and
indirectly through comments I've heard
[1:55:25] from all sorts of people, talking to all
sorts of people. But, um I I think you
[1:55:29] guys have crushed it so far. It's not
done. I'm excited to hear other
[1:55:32] people's, you know, continued feedback
and to see what the next iteration looks
[1:55:35] like. But super impressed.
[1:55:40] » Others. Yes, Council Member Her.
>> Yeah, thanks. Um, you know, I know I've
[1:55:45] shared a lot of my feedback directly
with staff. Um, it I think there's a lot
[1:55:53] of things to like in here in terms of
the amount of community input. I think
[1:55:57] we have a lot of really good sort of
statistical information about what
[1:56:01] people asked for, sort of what what does
the wish list look like in terms of what
[1:56:05] people want. I think there's a lot of
great descriptive information about what
[1:56:10] um conditions are like now. um
especially in the trails plan. And I
[1:56:14] think there's a lot of that good
information
[1:56:16] um the vegetation survey the existing
condition the needs assessment the the
[1:56:22] thing that I struggle with is I look at
the action items and a substantial
[1:56:28] majority I mean well more than 50% feel
re just really generic like let's align
[1:56:35] our budget with our priorities you know
let's let's assess our needs and then
[1:56:39] figure out what to do about our needs
and it I don't know that it's going to
[1:56:45] be at a point for me where it's like oh
let's go back and tweak those I think
[1:56:49] it's kind of past that point now and so
the thing I'm struggling with and I
[1:56:53] guess my question to all of you is and I
think that the mayor was getting at this
[1:56:57] a little bit with his questions or
something similar is what does it mean
[1:57:01] if we adopt this as a plan right I mean
a lot of the things in here to me are
[1:57:06] like they're great wish list items
they're great best practices like we
[1:57:09] should align our budget with our
priorities I agree with that and and
[1:57:12] certainly wouldn't reject that idea. At
the same time, it doesn't The last time
[1:57:17] we were in here with a consultant, he
said, "This is going to spell out what
[1:57:20] we're doing in year one and year two and
year three, and it's going to be
[1:57:23] specific actionable items and that sort
of checklist to check off." I I don't
[1:57:28] totally see that here and I'm struggling
a little bit with how sort of how we
[1:57:34] adopt this as a plan when at least in my
mind it it sort of doesn't quite rise to
[1:57:40] the level of a of a plan that we could
implement in a meaningful way while at
[1:57:44] the same time it has lots of value in
terms of what does the community want,
[1:57:48] what are good practices for managing
open space and parks and recreation. Um,
[1:57:53] so that that's where I'm at and
certainly don't want to discount all of
[1:57:57] the work that went into it. I know
there's a tremendous amount of work and
[1:58:00] community engagement and I think the
most valuable thing we got out of it is
[1:58:03] the results of the community engagement
and the research into things we might
[1:58:08] do. Um,
I I just would hate to be sort of locked
[1:58:13] into saying these are all things we're
we're going to do. like if we did all
[1:58:17] the high priority and ongoing items, it
would far exceed
[1:58:21] our wildest dream of available
resources. So, um I think that's my
[1:58:27] piece. Thanks all.
>> Other comments? Yes, Council Member Fee.
[1:58:35] » I'll just build Well, sorry. Um on what
Councilman Hefner just said. I think
[1:58:41] that this is this isn't a plan. It's a
guide book. And so this is just going to
[1:58:48] guide us to the right plan and to the
right outcomes without specifying
[1:58:55] because we don't know what will be the
best decision two years from now. This
[1:59:01] is going to guide us and say, you know,
look at this and look at that and go
[1:59:05] this way, but we need this isn't the
plan for what we're actually going to
[1:59:10] do. And so I think it's it's been
wonderfully put together and it does
[1:59:16] have the priorities of of the public and
the council and so we're just moving
[1:59:23] forward in this direction and we can
change whenever we want.
[1:59:29] » Do you mind if I just
is your proposal we take like long range
[1:59:34] plan out of the title?
Well,
[1:59:40] um
I'm not sure. Well, this is the pros
[1:59:45] guide book.
[1:59:52] » Yeah, but the sort of the core document
is called the the long range plan,
[1:59:57] » right? But this is kind of guiding us to
a long range plan.
[2:00:04] So,
I'm not sure exactly.
[2:00:09] » I don't think we need to be that
specific
[2:00:12] » in in what what the book says
>> because it's just saying we're going to
[2:00:17] go in this direction. These are our
priorities and these are the order in
[2:00:22] which we would like to do things but
it's not what we're actually going to
[2:00:26] do. It's just possibilities and a guide.
That
[2:00:32] » that's helpful. I think I agree. Okay.
[2:00:41] Um
yeah. Um I guess first of all I I sort
[2:00:47] of share um Council Member Hefner's
concerns. Um I I do think though that
[2:00:53] Council Member Fehees comment helps to
delay that to some extent. Um
[2:01:00] I wanted to make a few more specific
comments.
[2:01:03] Um,
so reading through
[2:01:08] um both the trails and the and the pros
um plans or whatever you might call
[2:01:13] them. Um
so you know
[2:01:19] we have our guiding principles, we have
uh goals, strategies, action items, but
[2:01:26] then we also have places where there are
themes and where there are priorities
[2:01:29] and where they're recommendations and
where there are challenges and
[2:01:32] opportunities and next steps. And
I I just feel like it's kind of it needs
[2:01:39] to be less confused or less
uh or or somehow these things need to be
[2:01:44] condensed. Um
like because a lot of I mean if you if
[2:01:50] you go to a page with some priorities or
if you look at the challenges a lot of
[2:01:54] those are reflected in the goals or the
strategies or something like that. And I
[2:01:59] I just find it's rather confusing to,
you know, to have like read the goals,
[2:02:04] but then in next steps it's like, oh
wait, wait, like there are these next
[2:02:07] steps, but they're not aligned with the
goals. Um, and I just feel like there
[2:02:11] could be a lot more clarity in how we
present um all of those different
[2:02:15] things. Um, and you know, a little
aspect of that, like I think the the
[2:02:22] challenges is very nice. um especially
like how it really seems to have come
[2:02:27] out of feedback. Um it the opportunities
just feel a little silly because they're
[2:02:32] just like the the opposites of the
challenges. So it, you know, it's fine,
[2:02:36] but uh I just feel like it's a little a
little silly. Um so that's one comment.
[2:02:44] Again, something I brought up um
yesterday with staff um which kind of
[2:02:51] feeds into that general comment um you
know we on engage Lewisville you can go
[2:02:57] look at all the survey results um and
and such in full. Um I don't know if the
[2:03:02] idea is to include those as appendices
in the guide book or not. Um that might
[2:03:07] be a nice idea. Um, but I would just
like to reiterate I I feel a little bit
[2:03:12] like it's reading the
the plan the the two plans by
[2:03:18] themselves. It's a little hard to
understand how the community feedback
[2:03:23] sort of directly
uh flows into all the goals and
[2:03:28] strategies and so forth. So, um I don't
know if that could be clarified in in
[2:03:33] some way. I think that would be helpful
too.
[2:03:36] Um
okay. And then um
[2:03:44] a little bit more specifically than
that. So um
[2:03:51] let's see. Um I'll just go through a few
different comments. Uh there's talk
[2:03:57] about parking facilities at
I think both trail heads and open space
[2:04:03] properties and parks maybe. Uh but I
didn't really see anything about bicycle
[2:04:07] parking at those locations.
Um
[2:04:13] let's see in terms of the um the map
with the ideas for trails and so forth.
[2:04:20] Um
I I mean I that's I think that's a great
[2:04:24] part of the trails plan. I I would just
see and and in that section there is an
[2:04:30] introductory paragraph that you know
sort of explains um
[2:04:36] the the context for those maps. Um I I
would just think about making it more
[2:04:41] explicit like on the maps themselves
like these are ideas or you know just to
[2:04:46] just to be very clear like these are
ideas that our community has about where
[2:04:51] we could do these all the improvements
but you know they still have to then go
[2:04:55] through that whole kind of process that
you lay out in the plan. Uh just make
[2:05:00] that more explicit than it is at the
moment.
[2:05:04] Um
let's see.
[2:05:08] Um
and then what else did I Oh, so then to
[2:05:14] go back to the um the map with the open
space designations.
[2:05:19] Um so on the one hand that map is like
based on the vegetation survey is really
[2:05:24] informative. Um, I guess what I might
like to see is, you know, since we have
[2:05:31] established management designations, I
feel like
[2:05:37] that that should be shown maybe
somewhere and then like you could show
[2:05:42] the information from the vegetation
survey as like informing
[2:05:47] I don't know like possible changes to
that or something like or something
[2:05:51] around like that. But, you know, since
we do have formally adopted management
[2:05:55] practices for the open space, I feel
like that needs to be stated like those
[2:05:59] things are not going to be changed
unless the council makes a new decision.
[2:06:04] Um, and so it just needs to be clear
that what's being shown in that other
[2:06:08] map is like uh information from this
survey that we did. Um,
[2:06:14] okay, a couple other comments. Um,
let's see. Um,
[2:06:24] what was I going to say? The
there was a suggestion in some of the
[2:06:29] letters we got um about the open space
goals and whether or not they should be
[2:06:34] prioritized.
Um, you know, on the one hand, I
[2:06:38] understand why the goals are not
prioritized. Uh, but then on the other
[2:06:42] hand, like it is established in the
charter sort of what the priorities are.
[2:06:46] And so, I do feel like we should
I don't know what the best way to do it
[2:06:51] is, but we should we should take that
prioritization from the charter and
[2:06:56] somehow imprinted on those goals. Um,
that's one comment. Um, I know I'm just
[2:07:03] kind of skipping around, but um an
another one um related mostly to parks
[2:07:11] um and maps of parks. Um, so there's a
very nice map that shows all the parks,
[2:07:17] kind of the main parks. Um, I actually
think it would be really helpful if we
[2:07:21] have it to show those like smaller park
segments in some other map, the rights
[2:07:27] of ways and things like that. Um,
I don't know. I I think that's useful
[2:07:32] information. Um, not not crucial though.
Um, but then another there's another map
[2:07:39] that shows places sort of for potential
park development. Um, and on that I had
[2:07:46] two comments. one
um kind of related to the previous
[2:07:50] comment like are there it might be nice
to know if there are smaller parcels
[2:07:56] uh that could still see some kind of
park development um but are not
[2:08:01] highlighted there. Uh and then the other
thing is um kind of coming back to a
[2:08:06] comment that council member Heftter made
in the the first section of the meeting
[2:08:10] today. um you know like we're expecting
to see residential development in
[2:08:15] various places in the city and it might
be nice to say something about having
[2:08:20] park facilities in those places uh on
that map. Um
[2:08:26] okay.
Um
[2:08:33] Okay. Um maybe I have one more comment
um about the golf course. Um
[2:08:42] there was I don't know maybe maybe this
didn't come out in the community
[2:08:46] feedback but there was nothing that sort
of addressed like the golf course as a
[2:08:50] municipal golf course or or not very
directly I felt like and I was just
[2:08:55] wondering like did we did we get any
feedback about like you know this being
[2:09:01] the community's golf course a municipal
golf course rather than some other type
[2:09:06] of golf course and I don't know if that
came through or not um I thought it
[2:09:11] might be interesting if there were
something around that. Um
[2:09:19] okay.
Yeah, those are some comments. Um I
[2:09:22] think that's all for now.
[2:09:29] » Mayor, if I may.
>> Yes.
[2:09:30] » Um
comments. Thank you, Sam. It's important
[2:09:36] to reflect that um you know as these
comments are made, we take these unless
[2:09:43] we hear otherwise as direction from all
of council that you want us to make
[2:09:47] these changes. And so it's helpful as
these comments come up to get
[2:09:51] clarification from council as to is
there a majority support for some of
[2:09:57] these requests? uh because the next
steps would be for Adam and Brian to
[2:10:02] take this and then make these
modifications.
[2:10:05] And also um you know, we we appreciate
these comments. I think that's part of
[2:10:10] the direction that they're looking for
tonight as well as as we obtain
[2:10:15] additional public comment, as we obtain
additional council comments, because
[2:10:18] you'll continue to review these and have
comments like how do you want us to take
[2:10:22] this in? And if if staff's goal is to
bring this back in October, is that a
[2:10:28] realistic goal or do we need to take
these comments,
[2:10:33] bring it back again because there's
probably going to be additional comments
[2:10:36] and then say where are we drawing the
line on this or are we just bringing
[2:10:40] this forward as the best bet of what it
reflects from a community standpoint and
[2:10:46] then also from a council standpoint. And
then just one other thing that I really
[2:10:50] want to to highlight and um Brian if you
could go back to this slide the plan
[2:10:55] intent.
Um
[2:10:59] the intent of this was to gather input,
establish direction and set priorities.
[2:11:03] As we've noted, we've had tremendous
community input on this. We'll continue
[2:11:07] to have community input on this. Um this
is as much as this has been an outward-f
[2:11:12] facing process. this once this is moves
forward, it's going to be more of an
[2:11:18] inwardfacing
implementation document. And so, you
[2:11:23] know, staff wants to make sure that it
represents council and the community's
[2:11:26] priorities because it is it really is
going to be a great decision tool. And
[2:11:32] some of the things that we talked about
like yesterday is as we receive requests
[2:11:37] from individuals like for specific
recreational amenity and you might get,
[2:11:42] you know, sick people that submit an
email to council, but when you look at
[2:11:46] the survey results, we received two
survey results for that item, but we
[2:11:49] received a thousand results for another
item. That helps council and staff um
[2:11:54] determine what projects move forward.
And to council member Hefner's point,
[2:12:00] um, you know, this document, while
initially intended may have been to
[2:12:06] outline more details related to
projects,
[2:12:09] I think we're at a good point. I trust
staff to take this the next step in
[2:12:14] terms of development of project,
particularly with the challenges that we
[2:12:17] have with our budget and the CIP and
capital funding and figuring out
[2:12:22] prioritization based upon the funding
available. I would not um while the
[2:12:28] consultant is helpful, I would not rely
on the consultant to make those
[2:12:32] recommendations or decisions. I would
rely on staff to do that. And so I just
[2:12:37] want to say that um I I'm very
appreciative of staff and how you've
[2:12:42] gotten it to this point. Um, and it is
very valuable. And when I hear staff
[2:12:48] say, "This is what we need for the next
10 years to be able to operate this
[2:12:54] department and be able to present
options to council that are supported by
[2:12:58] statistically valid information and
supported by a lot of input from the
[2:13:02] community.
That means a lot. And um, you know, I I
[2:13:10] truly appreciate all the effort. I
appreciate council's input on this. I
[2:13:14] appreciate the public comments and as
you noted, tonight is not adoption. We
[2:13:19] will continue to make these changes, but
it is important for staff to understand
[2:13:25] what are the specifics of what you would
like to see in the next round that comes
[2:13:29] forward so that we're making sure that
we're using our time most effectively.
[2:13:33] Thank you.
>> Um, you anticipated me. I haven't made
[2:13:39] my comments yet and I want to try to
bring together and try to summarize some
[2:13:44] of the things that I hear so that we can
move forward and answer some of the
[2:13:50] questions that you've raised manager
because I I think those are really
[2:13:54] important particularly pra practical
questions about how we proceed. Um I I
[2:14:02] really wholeheartedly
think of of council member Cooperman's
[2:14:08] just uh um observations and
recommendations are terrific
[2:14:16] and um maybe to the point I I think part
of this is that is difficult is what's
[2:14:25] always difficult in this which is the
level of specificity
[2:14:29] and the level of generality that we
bring to this. Um, and you know, almost
[2:14:35] all of the comments, uh, you know, kind
of wrestled with that. Um, I I I agree
[2:14:42] especially with if we can kind of clean
up the many different descriptions
[2:14:49] and reference points of
um planning strategies, goal,
[2:14:54] priorities, challenges, strategy, you
know, next steps. It I think it'll read
[2:15:00] better for the public, for us. I think
we can uh that'll provide a good lens in
[2:15:08] in which to see this in a way that I
think it's harder now. Um I don't think
[2:15:15] you know I'm mindful of the timing in
the process because we're not going to
[2:15:20] redo all this. We're just not. And this
is a and not nobody's suggesting that. I
[2:15:27] mean, uh, I saw your eyes get very big
there for a second, Adam. Um, we're not
[2:15:33] going to do that. We don't have the
resources, but we have an extraordinary
[2:15:37] product to work with. These are, in my
mind, the things I'm talking about are
[2:15:41] tweaks. And frankly, I don't think I've
heard anything from any council member
[2:15:46] that is uh anything. But um
I I think from my perspective it may be
[2:15:55] good to distinguish more
between
[2:15:59] um the policy direction and the more
granular projects. Um I don't know how
[2:16:06] you do that. I don't know that you
necessarily want to put them in a you
[2:16:10] know in an appendex. I that may be too
much. But I think linking them to the
[2:16:16] goals and and linking them to the public
comment a little bit more tightly will
[2:16:24] be, you know, a I think a better result
at least for me. um
[2:16:32] on on parks particularly it it would be
nice uh as I think was mentioned to
[2:16:39] think about have some information
reference to the kinds of things that
[2:16:45] we've we've uh decided or um the
direction we gave in the comp plan we
[2:16:53] know certain parts of the city
particularly west of Mccasin are going
[2:16:57] to develop over some period of time or
at least we believe that it will and we
[2:17:02] certainly are encouraging that but it
might be nice to understand you know
[2:17:08] some thoughts on that and how at least
have it referenced so it's not out there
[2:17:14] um
and you know to uh Matt Jones point
[2:17:20] before I think it's always critical to
be looking at what I call the guiding
[2:17:26] star which is the uh charter I I don't
think anybody disagrees with that. And I
[2:17:31] do believe that staff has done a a good
job with that. I think it may uh based
[2:17:37] on what you've heard may be worth
fleshing out a little bit more. Um I'm
[2:17:42] not going to try editing any of that and
I'll leave that to staff's good
[2:17:48] judgment. Um, I really do appreciate the
degree to which you've worked with so
[2:17:54] many different boards, commissions,
people, uh, you know, in all of the
[2:18:01] public engagement. And I think we just
need to to bring that out. Um,
[2:18:07] I think to
summarize,
[2:18:11] um, and I would like some feedback on
these, um, because they are they're
[2:18:18] different points, right? They're not I I
didn't hear a lot of conflict. You may
[2:18:24] disagree with me on the level of
specificity. We may disagree a little
[2:18:28] bit on that. Um, I think there were some
just questions about uh how the document
[2:18:36] is written which I think you've taken in
and I don't know the are going to be
[2:18:41] really things that we really need to
debate too much here. I think all of the
[2:18:46] comments that were made about um you
know a revision of it were were pretty
[2:18:52] good in in terms of just language and
organization.
[2:18:57] Um
uh
[2:19:01] you know I I think
um
[2:19:06] one thing I certainly heard was the need
to establish connections between
[2:19:14] um the a little bit better than than
perhaps was done between um the
[2:19:21] vegetation survey and the the open space
app
[2:19:28] um and um address you know perhaps a
little bit more what the decisions were
[2:19:37] internally to get to that point. Um
uh I think we talked a little bit about
[2:19:43] you know parks where parks might be uh
built. I think we talked a bit um
[2:19:52] about maintenance. I I heard that coming
particularly from council member um
[2:19:59] Dickinson
um that it's really important to address
[2:20:04] um and maintain what we have and do it
well. Um
[2:20:10] I I don't think it ought to be in there
in the language, but don't screw it up.
[2:20:14] It is not a bad thing. We've got a
really good um sense of I think we've
[2:20:22] done pretty well on open space and
there's a lot of there's some
[2:20:26] disagreements around that but I do think
um we need to build we are building on
[2:20:32] that and I do appreciate uh affirming
that. Um,
[2:20:39] a couple of other um
[2:20:45] things. Um,
and I may have mentioned this, but just
[2:20:49] sort of the the distinguishing between
policy areas that council
[2:20:57] really needs in there and has talked
about
[2:21:01] as opposing
[2:21:06] as a main issue. I mean, we're going to
be adopting the whole thing. So I I
[2:21:11] don't want to minimize but I think
distinguishing
[2:21:14] um the major policy goals from
uh the more granular projects and so
[2:21:21] forth is something I've heard from
several folks. Um
[2:21:29] let's see
those are those are the main things that
[2:21:34] I've heard but I am I don't first I
don't know there any people agree with
[2:21:41] the way I've the ones that I've stated
are should be in there, but two whether
[2:21:47] I've left something out. Yeah.
>> Council.
[2:21:52] » Yeah. So, I guess I think about it in a
slightly different way. Um,
[2:21:59] which is it's been, you know, the better
part of two years of engagement. I am
[2:22:04] reluctant to insert ourselves directly
into the editing process. I I think this
[2:22:09] is all in my view this is all useful
feedback um to staff and they should
[2:22:15] sort of think about it and chew on it
and consider whether it it makes sense
[2:22:19] and whether there's sufficient remaining
resources to accomplish the feedback if
[2:22:24] it does make sense. Um I I don't know
that I'm especially comfortable sort of
[2:22:29] directing fine grain adjustments at this
point and and the one that I think I
[2:22:36] the most of them I don't necessarily
object to. I just don't want to sort of
[2:22:39] write from the dis. The one I do think
might be a problem is sort of
[2:22:44] substantial reorganization to try and
collapse the recommendations and
[2:22:48] opportunities and all, you know, action
items into a more better organized
[2:22:54] format. Like that would be nice, but as
I understand it, we've run through
[2:22:59] almost all of our $400,000 budget for
this. And I I don't want to send a
[2:23:04] consultant back to rewrite the whole
report to organize it differently. Um,
[2:23:10] even though I mean I I think I share the
quibble about I, you know, council
[2:23:13] member Coopermanman said it very well
that there's like a lot of different
[2:23:16] action items and recommendations and
things sort of scattered about and it's
[2:23:21] difficult to follow them. I I also don't
know if it's the best use of our
[2:23:26] remaining dollars to try and fix that.
So,
[2:23:30] back to sort of the the bigger picture,
uh, my preference would be to let staff
[2:23:35] continue through the remaining
engagement window. consider this input
[2:23:39] as part of that engagement window. Um,
and then I I I really don't know and
[2:23:46] others may feel differently like I don't
know that I necessarily want to adopt
[2:23:49] this as a council plan per se. I I think
maybe we receive it as like you know the
[2:23:56] plan the plan that we have um we receive
it from staff and say this is this is
[2:24:02] good work and important work that you'll
be able to use in the future. But I
[2:24:06] don't know if I'm at the point where I
want to, you know, sort of do a
[2:24:08] resolution saying this this is the plan
for the city. Um, and so in that vein, I
[2:24:14] I'd prefer to let staff just continue
doing the engagement they've done.
[2:24:19] » Let me clarify one thing. Just I said I
I think I'm not interested in the staff
[2:24:26] doing a rewrite either, and I'm not sure
council member Coopermanman was. Um but
[2:24:33] you know these are I think suggestions.
There's a few suggestions. Um and
[2:24:40] certainly the budget for this is we
don't want to blow it. We've already
[2:24:44] spent plenty of that. We don't have very
much left. Um and we do you know we
[2:24:50] trust you in terms of taking the input
that you've had and you decide what you
[2:24:56] want to do with it. Um I think the the
suggestions have been useful but um and
[2:25:03] I I think it's interesting
it's an interesting question about
[2:25:07] whether we adopted or not. I I'm
[2:25:14] um these it includes policy level um
recommendations and I think not to um
[2:25:23] not to adopt some form of it is
uh
[2:25:29] I think a real problem. I I understood
that there may be parts of it that you
[2:25:35] don't want to adopt, but I mean I I
think that's what staff has presented,
[2:25:41] what we have directed them to come up
with the has been spent in terms of the
[2:25:45] consultant and the public process. I
think it would be irresponsible
[2:25:51] not to
see that process through. Um but um
[2:25:59] anyway, I'll I'll leave others to kind
of debate that, but I it's an it's an
[2:26:04] important point. I just uh I think what
it may augur for is more time for staff
[2:26:11] to work on things as much as they expect
as opposed to trying to push this too
[2:26:17] fast you know to the October deadline
which I don't know is a you know it's
[2:26:24] not a hard and fast deadline especially
given
[2:26:29] you know the time that has been spent
but others
[2:26:35] Yes, ment
>> I have a question for my W three team
[2:26:40] member. Um, help me to understand from
your point of view
[2:26:47] the difference between adopting it as
for council adopting it versus it being
[2:26:54] a staff document. Walk me through that.
>> Yeah. So I mean I I think of it as are
[2:27:00] we signing off sort of that these are
the right set of recommendations and
[2:27:05] priorities
that have been sort of informed by our
[2:27:10] input
and at least what I'm looking at
[2:27:13] especially with respect to the long
range plan less so with respect to the
[2:27:16] trails plan it's it's more of just a
sort of a summary of a lot of
[2:27:21] information
and so to sign off on it as a plan and
[2:27:26] thinking about 10 years into the future
when most of us, probably all of us,
[2:27:29] won't be sitting here
and some proposal comes forward and it's
[2:27:33] like, well, that's in the plan. We
should go do it. Um, there's like this
[2:27:38] plan could justify almost any idea. It's
it just speaks in such broad
[2:27:44] generalities that I would rather have it
as a as a tool than a plan. And maybe
[2:27:48] it's just a semantics thing. Um,
I think about like for example the the
[2:27:54] police strategic document that was
presented to us which was really a
[2:27:58] police department
ideas that weren't substantially
[2:28:03] informed by us on a policy basis. It was
just sort of brought to us as here's
[2:28:08] some ideas we have and we're presenting
it to you and um this is all interesting
[2:28:12] information. And I think we heard it and
said that's great. we've received your
[2:28:16] strategic document, but I don't think we
adopted that as our plan. Um, I think I
[2:28:22] think we did a similar thing with the
sustainability plan where there was some
[2:28:25] question about does this really reflect
the sort of costbenefit analysis we were
[2:28:30] interested in. Um, and I think we
received it but didn't necessarily adopt
[2:28:34] it as a formal plan. I may be
misremembering that, but I know there
[2:28:37] was discussion.
Um or maybe it was the decar plan,
[2:28:41] » the community decar.
>> Community decar plan. Um
[2:28:47] and so to me, like I think this these
documents have a lot of value in so far
[2:28:52] as they're informative. I think they
have a lot of value in so far as the
[2:28:56] information is persuasive, but as I I
think of a plan as something different,
[2:29:01] like here's how we're going to go about
our business. This is what we intend to
[2:29:05] do. um you know and even the best laid
plans you end up doing something
[2:29:09] different but I don't see this like we I
don't see this as something we could
[2:29:13] just say okay let's go execute the plan
um because to the level of generality
[2:29:20] thing it's just a lot of it's a there's
a lot of plans to make a plan there's a
[2:29:26] lot of best management practices
uh there's a lot of things we're already
[2:29:30] doing but I don't see sort of a an
actionable
[2:29:35] set of priorities and I I also you know
to the extent I had comments earlier I
[2:29:39] just don't see those comments really
reflected
[2:29:45] » others
council fee
[2:29:50] » I'm wondering about the same kind of
thing um and instead of calling it our
[2:29:56] long range plan we could just call it
our guide book our
[2:30:02] pros guide book for what we would like
to see but it there is no requirement
[2:30:09] there's no timeline there's and it's up
for discussion and changes
[2:30:15] at any point
>> that's a long title
[2:30:21] » um others
[2:30:26] » yes may
>> so I'm I'm I would like to hear from the
[2:30:32] city manager
and other staff about um council member
[2:30:39] Hefner's thoughts around adoption versus
um not.
[2:30:46] » So, Adam, are you okay with me taking
this first?
[2:30:50] » Okay. Um
I think if council chooses not to adopt
[2:30:56] it, it's going to create confusion
within the community as to whether or
[2:30:59] not this is council supported.
[2:31:07] We have other plans within the city that
are not council adopted. There's a storm
[2:31:11] water plan as you know there's the
decarb plan. But I think that that has
[2:31:16] also created questions within the
community of like well you created this
[2:31:20] plan but why didn't council adopt is
this your official plan or is this just
[2:31:26] staff's plan? and some fresh staff. I
think it'll be confusing too because as
[2:31:31] there's um inquiries from the community
or we are uh referencing this plan to
[2:31:37] say why we're not putting something
forward as a recommendation then that
[2:31:41] could be challenged in terms of well
this wasn't adopted by council so does
[2:31:44] this represent council's feelings on
this too. Um
[2:31:50] you know so that's Adam do you have
anything to add on that or Samma as
[2:31:54] well?
[2:32:01] I would add that I think while I respect
the comments, I think that from a staff
[2:32:07] perspective,
there is specificity in the draft. I
[2:32:12] think we've heard that there's a desire
to tie more specificity
[2:32:17] into the final product to kind of align
with where we got from a scope of work
[2:32:21] or maybe be more clear. Um, we're we're
big fans of the matrix. I think the
[2:32:28] matrix can be refined. It's specifically
outlining what we consider to be the
[2:32:33] goals and future action items with
priority listing of where that would
[2:32:38] fall based on available resources. Um,
you know, I also I also think to the
[2:32:45] point earlier that I was I was going to
chime in on, I think there's real
[2:32:49] validity to the comments we've heard
tonight about making it easier to read.
[2:32:54] And I think that's really helpful for
us. I don't think we have to rewrite it
[2:32:58] to reformat it in a way that combines
four or five of those areas of focus
[2:33:03] into more of the executive summary
upfront. Here's what this is going to
[2:33:06] say. And then you get into the charts
and the graphs and the other things
[2:33:09] behind it. Um, so that's that's fine.
Um, you know, for for me I I I think it
[2:33:16] may be a bit of semantics, but I do
think to city manager's point
[2:33:22] there and and in our industry, right? So
I'm just speaking for how other
[2:33:26] communities go about doing this process
with people in my role sitting in this
[2:33:30] chair is there is real there's real
value to adopting
[2:33:35] the document from a support standpoint
from a you know I think it can be
[2:33:40] anecdotal it can have comments that are
associated with it about interpretation
[2:33:45] um it's it's similar to the resolution
that accompanies parks and recreation
[2:33:51] month for example and and aligning with
that designation I think it kind of
[2:33:55] reinforces
to staff and to the mayor's point
[2:33:59] earlier about the level of community
engagement even exceeding that of the
[2:34:03] city's 20-year plan. Um the the value of
that community's input through the
[2:34:11] adoption process. That being all said,
we're here to serve at the pleasure of
[2:34:15] the council and the city manager. And so
if it's supported and it's
[2:34:20] » Yeah. Yeah. I would support director
Black and Manager Langley as well in
[2:34:23] that it's really helpful for us as staff
to have council adopting these because
[2:34:28] we we have clarity for the community for
staff in what council supports. Now,
[2:34:32] these plans are living breathing things
and I think that Brian has done a really
[2:34:36] good job of explaining that this will
continue to breathe. I recognize that
[2:34:40] some of these things are subject to
appropriations, right? We can't do all
[2:34:45] of these things all the time, but this
will help guide staff when they're
[2:34:49] bringing forward CIPs, when they're
balancing projects, and knowing what the
[2:34:52] community has decided as a priority. And
having that council support and
[2:34:56] community support through this robust
process and the board and commission
[2:34:59] support really helps them use this as a
tool to do all of those things.
[2:35:05] » Thank you. That's um very helpful. I I
hear Council Member Hefner's concerns
[2:35:14] and comments.
My takeaway is
[2:35:18] it's really important that it's an
adopted document.
[2:35:23] I really don't have any interest in
workshopping tonight with council what
[2:35:27] the title is or what we're going to call
it or anything, but I think maybe you
[2:35:33] all can take that offline
um and maybe workshop it a little bit,
[2:35:39] but I hear you that what I'm hearing is
it's really important that it's an
[2:35:44] adopted document is what I'm hearing.
So, thank you for enlightening me on
[2:35:50] your thoughts and staff for for sharing
your thoughts on that as well.
[2:35:54] » Others who haven't spoken.
[2:35:58] » Yes, Council Member Kern.
>> So, can do you mind if I like segue off
[2:36:03] of this for a moment and just go to
actually something that's in here
[2:36:06] combining trails and the guide book?
Thank you. Is that okay? So, one of the
[2:36:13] things that you guys had mentioned in
here was providing trail connections to
[2:36:18] parks, and there is one map that has uh
like the parks numbered so that it's
[2:36:25] easier to see where they are on the map
and then have a reference sheet. is
[2:36:30] would it be helpful or is it possible
because I I would find it helpful if one
[2:36:35] of those trails plans actually had these
numbered 34 parks with it so we could
[2:36:42] see where those connections were. And
you it mentions I think throughout
[2:36:48] because I I I agree actually with
Council Member Heapner. I really um
[2:36:52] think that the the trails guide book is
particularly well put together. Um, but
[2:36:58] that was the one thing that I went I was
going back and forth between the two
[2:37:02] plans to try to match that up and
thought maybe I'm missing something and
[2:37:06] I would just bring it up with you guys.
You had said like take a little you
[2:37:10] asked us the other day like look at it
in a little bit more detail and I
[2:37:13] realized oh that that is the one thing I
couldn't find. So um I appreciate that.
[2:37:17] Thank you for the indulgence.
[2:37:22] Anybody else who hasn't?
>> Unless of course nobody agrees and then
[2:37:25] they should not listen to me at all.
[2:37:35] » Yeah, I don't think you have actually on
this issue.
[2:37:39] » Um
I don't know. I mean,
[2:37:42] I guess we never maybe made it explicit
in our previous conversations, but I um
[2:37:50] I I just sort of assumed all along that
we would eventually this would come to
[2:37:55] us and we would vote on whether or not
to adopt it. Um
[2:38:00] so,
um
[2:38:05] I don't know. I I I do like the sort of
the certainty that uh a formal adoption
[2:38:10] would give to staff. Um I think
um I don't know, maybe I just need to
[2:38:17] think a little bit more about um that
question, but I at the moment I I do
[2:38:22] think it would be helpful to our staff
if we considered it for adoption.
[2:38:32] » I agree. I think that uh staff needs the
assurance that uh we're supporting what
[2:38:39] they've done and the public needs to
know that we're supporting what the
[2:38:45] staff has done. So I would also support
um
[2:38:50] supporting the long range plan.
[2:38:58] Um, I I guess I want to
I want to push this a bit because I'm
[2:39:06] very concerned about where we are right
now. I think we can take a vote about
[2:39:11] how we do it. We've given direction on
this
[2:39:16] uh for some time now. There could be a
question of course whether you followed
[2:39:22] the direction or not. Uh I happen to
think you did. Um generally there's
[2:39:28] things that we all u disagree, you know,
probably disagree with. It sounds like
[2:39:34] the trails plan. Everybody I haven't
heard anybody complain about that. So
[2:39:39] that one it would be awfully odd in my
view to accept the trails plan or and
[2:39:46] and not do the same with the pros plan.
I think it would be equally bizarre to
[2:39:52] all agree on the trails plan and not
adopt it. But um how much have we spent
[2:39:58] on this? What is the budget for it and
how much have we spent?
[2:40:02] » It's a $400,000 total budget, 300 for
the long range plan, 100 for the trails.
[2:40:08] We have 14,000 remaining in contingency
and 5,000 contractually obligated.
[2:40:14] » I mean, when I say it's irresponsible, I
that's what I mean. I can't imagine
[2:40:20] anything I I certainly haven't done
anything in for in 14 years on council
[2:40:28] where we had an idea and and I don't
think there was any question that we
[2:40:33] were headed toward adoption
where we just said a month left to go
[2:40:41] maybe not. Um I I do think that that you
know among other things it leaves staff
[2:40:47] out to dry but I also think more
importantly because we are deciding how
[2:40:53] to move forward
um I just don't think that's a a very
[2:40:58] wise thing um on there you know I can
speak to one thing that council member
[2:41:06] Hefner mentioned the I think I think it
was mentioned about well the the the
[2:41:13] sustainability action plan or at least
that was kind of the illusion. I think
[2:41:19] the sustainability action plan was
adopted by council because I did it. It
[2:41:23] was part of that. Um and when we've
changed it, it was changed by council.
[2:41:29] So um you know others the transportation
plan I mean you know go on and on about
[2:41:36] the plans that we've had. Now you can
distinguish between them. I I suppose I
[2:41:42] my view is fix it. Don't mix it.
[2:41:48] I don't think it's good to throw the
baby out with a bath water. Not at this
[2:41:52] point. Go ahead. So, mayor, if to to try
to move this along,
[2:41:58] um what I'm hearing, so there's some
specific recommendations for map
[2:42:03] changes, clarification on the map,
trying to make some connections between
[2:42:08] um the action items, priorities, and the
public input, refining the executive
[2:42:13] summary to make it more robust. Move the
matrix up to the executive summary to
[2:42:17] identify um these action items. look at
nomenclature to see if we can try to
[2:42:22] kind of make it more condensed or um
easier to read. Um I think those things
[2:42:28] are all achievable. Um to address some
of of council member Hefner's concerns,
[2:42:35] I would like to take a step. We have a
CIP meeting um in September um where
[2:42:42] we're going to do further refinement of
the CIP. We have a meeting I believe
[2:42:46] this week with pros related to CIP. I
would like to take a step to let us kind
[2:42:51] of work through the CIP and see if we
can't somehow make a connection with
[2:42:56] that. Um, so you can see that we are
taking this plan and implementing it,
[2:43:02] applying it to the CIP. Um, it may not
be part of the document, but you can see
[2:43:07] how we're applying it. And then so just
leaves a couple of specific items that
[2:43:12] that I need direction on to move
forward. One being specific to trail 18.
[2:43:17] So if you remember as part of the comp
plan process there was conversations
[2:43:22] there was input received related to this
good hue ditch trail connection which is
[2:43:26] trail 18. So I pulled up the comp plan
um one of the figures and it says uh
[2:43:32] good hu ditch trail connection is
conceptual only future evaluation will
[2:43:36] occur outside this plan eg trails master
plan and will consider ecological
[2:43:41] agricultural and legal constraints.
So, the comp plan says that this trail
[2:43:48] um will be, you know, considered as part
of the the trail's master plan. So we do
[2:43:55] need direction at some point as to if
you would like to have this connection
[2:44:00] removed from the plan, if you would like
further consideration of this trail 18,
[2:44:05] if you would like further clarification
of the trail 18 to say, you know,
[2:44:10] additional feasibility studies will need
to be required before um this is
[2:44:15] conceptual only. You know, kind of
similar to the language that's in the
[2:44:19] comprehensive plan. So that's that's one
of the specific items. Um,
[2:44:24] and then we've heard, you know, through
some of the emails received today, we'll
[2:44:28] condense those. Um, give you some themes
from the additional public comment
[2:44:32] that's received, note how we've
addressed it. The other thing that I
[2:44:36] want to point out that I, you know, hear
clear from council member Coopermanman
[2:44:40] in terms of this and some of others of
you related to this open space map
[2:44:46] that's based upon a vegetation survey
versus a map that is the actual um like
[2:44:51] council designated classifications.
We can address that as well. And just to
[2:44:57] note that that's based upon a vegetation
survey. So I think a lot of these things
[2:45:01] can be addressed. um we do need specific
direction related to trail 18 and if you
[2:45:07] would um give us some time to go back
and kind of digest all of these comments
[2:45:13] and come with a recommendation to move
forward
[2:45:16] » if um the council is inclined to both
give you the what you need and
[2:45:26] the staff to go back and do the
reworking.
[2:45:30] that time is going to have to slip. I
mean, based on where we set it, right?
[2:45:36] This is not going to get done or is
>> I think it's to be determined. Okay.
[2:45:41] » Um, you know, some of this information
exists already. And so, from a mapping
[2:45:46] perspective, it might be additional
paragraph that's added to the map. Um,
[2:45:51] or it might be taking a map from another
source. I'm looking to Adam and Brian. I
[2:45:55] think we need to have more conversation
as to if this is going to make the
[2:45:59] timeline slip. Um, some of these things
are pretty straightforward to address.
[2:46:04] Others we already knew were going to
take a little bit more time in terms of
[2:46:07] moving u things into the executive
summary. So I I would I wouldn't not
[2:46:13] ready to say that it's going to slip
right now. We need to review it more.
[2:46:18] » It's fair enough. It's premature. That's
what I'm hearing. Um
[2:46:25] well, why don't why don't we take the
um the smaller, if you will, it depends
[2:46:31] whether it's a small or big issue, but
it's not the the big issue that council
[2:46:36] member Hefner made. How do people feel
about the uh that trail 18? Yes,
[2:46:44] » thank you. I think um
there's a desire for from the community
[2:46:50] to have connection.
Um and I would be in favor of of making
[2:46:57] sure it's clear like we did in the comp
plan that it's conceptual and additional
[2:47:02] due diligence would need to be had
before anything were to be implemented.
[2:47:06] But I do believe people want a
connection between RTR and downtown and
[2:47:10] other places within our community.
Council
[2:47:16] member.
>> Yeah, I would agree, but I would I would
[2:47:18] also say that that includes 17, 18, and
19. All three of which are heading south
[2:47:24] and are in the like the the the uh
necessary to be expanded and evaluated.
[2:47:31] I think all three could use greater
evaluation as to the mayor prom's point
[2:47:35] um as we develop red tail and see where
those needs really lie. It could be that
[2:47:41] it is greater access from a multi-use
wide path along 42, quicker, easier to
[2:47:47] get to the hospital or the businesses or
what have you versus a recreational
[2:47:51] trail. And I think that would be that
would require a lot more evaluation than
[2:47:56] we should be doing tonight.
[2:48:03] Um,
I mean the
[2:48:07] staff can correct me, but you know, the
way that I look at that map with the
[2:48:11] possible future connections is like we
went out to the community and we asked
[2:48:16] them where they want to see connections
and then we tried to summarize that and
[2:48:20] this is the summary of that engagement.
And so like I don't have any problem
[2:48:26] just showing that. I just would want to
be very clear like this is the status of
[2:48:31] that map. Like these are th these are
things that are ideas that our community
[2:48:35] had. Um but you know to move forward
with any of them we'd have to go through
[2:48:40] that process of figuring out you know
should you know should we actually go
[2:48:46] through with any of these council
>> just to make that very clear
[2:48:50] » could I just could I just read from the
plan and see if this solves the issue.
[2:48:55] Uh, the proposed trail improvements are
for consideration purposes only, each of
[2:48:59] which will require further evaluation
prior to final approval. All proposed
[2:49:04] trail system improvements will undergo a
thorough staff review and city council
[2:49:08] approval prior to implementation.
Evaluation criteria may include
[2:49:12] connectivity, safety, ecological
protection, maintenance cost, and staff
[2:49:16] resource ability.
>> That sounds good. Put that in there.
[2:49:19] » That seems like a seems like a good
disclaimer to me. Does that solve your
[2:49:23] uh issue on that? Um to the larger point
um I guess at this stage I mean I think
[2:49:29] we've had
good discussion about whether to adopt
[2:49:34] uh this or whether we're heading to that
direction whether people ultimately
[2:49:39] choose to vote for it or not. Um
is the direction to bring back a plan? I
[2:49:48] mean, in terms of something council
would adopt as opposed to just receive,
[2:49:58] » we are we going to vote on it and adopt
it as a as
[2:50:01] » as mayor. Can I ask one clarifying
question? I think also within
[2:50:07] » that conversation is the conversation
for what
[2:50:10] » staff would be bringing back to you next
as a whole. So based on the conversation
[2:50:15] tonight, is there a desire to have
another bite at the draft apple or
[2:50:21] adoption or supporting or whatever we're
going to call it when it gets to its
[2:50:24] final stage? Is there a stage that we
should be considering that happens
[2:50:29] between that?
>> I guess I had understood that we wanted
[2:50:34] to get it back, but um
is that a hand up or is that a thumbs
[2:50:42] up? and a merit
>> I think uh the city manager had proposed
[2:50:48] earlier that we continue on the path
forward of adoption of a document and
[2:50:53] she's planning through CIP conversations
to bring examples back to us of how the
[2:50:59] document is going to be used to plan um
so that was my understanding of the path
[2:51:05] forward is we're still planning for
adoption
[2:51:08] » as as opposed to bringing back one more
and then making a final decision on
[2:51:14] adoption.
>> Well, I think we are now blending
[2:51:17] together two separate things. So, the
question you asked was, are we going to
[2:51:22] adopt the document or are we going to
receive and file? And I think the city
[2:51:26] manager earlier had proposed we move
forward with adoption because she thinks
[2:51:31] she can show us how it's being used as a
plan through some CIP conversations with
[2:51:36] staff. And then Adam just director
Blackmore just asked I think a separate
[2:51:41] question which is between that point and
now is there another meeting where we
[2:51:47] want to go into more detail about the
document so I think there's two right am
[2:51:52] I hearing there's two separate things
here
[2:51:58] » put that way um
first yeah go ahead
[2:52:04] » I'll just say on the on the second
question for my money, the time is
[2:52:08] better spent um having staff continue
the continue community engagement
[2:52:13] window, focus on that process. That
that's who we really want to hear from.
[2:52:17] Um and I'm sure to the extent any of us
have additional comments on the draft,
[2:52:21] we'll share those. But that that's just
my view.
[2:52:26] » Yeah, go ahead.
>> Yeah, I would support both adopting when
[2:52:30] we're done and uh not having another
bite at the draft apple.
[2:52:41] Fair enough. I keep I I I keep trying to
find places where you where staff might
[2:52:47] want another chance to come back. I I
think that it sounds like
[2:52:52] we want to keep moving toward uh one to
get the public input, two to keep
[2:52:59] working toward a draft that or a draft
that we come back ultimately for
[2:53:05] adoption.
Um and that
[2:53:10] you know we will see the changes after
when we are on that path.
[2:53:17] Any
thumbs up, thumbs down,
[2:53:21] » thumbs up,
>> thumbs up.
[2:53:25] » Okay.
Does staff have the direction that it
[2:53:30] needs?
[2:53:34] » I think so.
>> Okay. But from our side,
[2:53:38] » we'll try to um incorporate some pretty
intentional
[2:53:44] effort into when we provide that plan
for adoption, how this feedback has been
[2:53:49] incorporated and we appreciate the
comments.
[2:53:51] » Okay.
If council members have additional
[2:53:55] thoughts they want to share with staff,
fine. We'll have thoughts from the
[2:54:00] public most certainly and look forward
to that good discussion. Um thanks
[2:54:08] uh for working through this with us.
Tough discussion but a good one. Um
[2:54:15] right
I think uh the next part is uh see
[2:54:21] appointment of council committee for
potential amendments to city manager
[2:54:25] employment agreement. Um I think um
those who are working on the
[2:54:33] uh evaluation of municipal judge
and the prosecutor are um I venture to
[2:54:42] say not going to be those who work on
this next
[2:54:46] » Mayor if I may yeah
>> just make a brief presentation on what's
[2:54:50] in your packet here. So this is um staff
requesting C is council to appoint two
[2:54:55] council members to serve on this
committee to review and recommend
[2:54:58] council potential amendments the
employment agreement for the city
[2:55:00] manager. As you pointed out this came up
after the city manager's review which
[2:55:04] happened very recently and council
directed staff to follow up. We do have
[2:55:08] two council members who have volunteered
to be on this committee and that is
[2:55:12] Mayor Pertam Hamilton and council member
Hefner. So if council is supportive they
[2:55:16] could make a simple motion to appoint
these two to the committee.
[2:55:20] All right. I spoke too soon. Go ahead.
Council,
[2:55:24] » I was just gonna say I'll make a motion.
>> Okay.
[2:55:29] » Second.
>> As long as they're willing.
[2:55:31] » Um, all in favor?
>> I
[2:55:52] So moved that we journ second.
>> I I
[2:56:04] fall apart in dry air and therefore
needed to be used almost immediately
[2:56:08] after being mined. At first, the coal
was only