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join us for the invocation, which will be led by Reverend

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Anna Singh and followed by the Pledge of Allegiance, which

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will be led by Richard Voloshin.

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Good morning. Good morning. Thank you for

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inviting me. Let's join together in heart, mind and

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spirit. Creator of our universe who breathed light and life and

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divine love into our lives. Thank you for drawing us

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together. Thank you for uniting us as one people. Your people.

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Our people. We may come from different places and live in a

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variety of ways and exist in varying circumstances. But out

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of we who are many, you have made us one. Loving one. As we

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begin a new school year, and as we enter a new season of

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governance for the people of our beloved Martin County, we

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ask for your wisdom, your grace, and your compassion for

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all your people in the decisions we face today. You

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have commissioned us to look after our future, that is, our

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children and our students. You call us to honor our seniors,

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those who have helped us to become who we are, and you have

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appointed us to serve, to protect, to defend, and to

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uphold the very values that bind our community together in

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the decisions we make today. May we do all these things to

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the very best of our abilities, with the talents that you have

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blessed us. Amen. Amen. Thank you, Mr. Olson.

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My Richard Olson. Good morning. All right. Thank you. Good

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morning. I'm only. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

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United States of America and to the republic for which it

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stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and

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justice for all. God bless America.

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And I see that you are a Vietnam veteran. Would you like

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to tell us a bit about your Army service, sir?

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I was drafted into the Army at the age of 22 years old. If I

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finished my apprenticeship as a machinist. And of course, being

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a machinist, they made me in military policemen. And, uh, I

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refused to be in office. I passed the test and, uh, so I

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made me a military policeman at Fort Riley, Kansas. And then

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when Vietnam broke out, I was transferred to the first

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Infantry Division at Fort Riley, Kansas. And I landed

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with the first troops. We went over by troop ship, and we got

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there. And the very beginning of October, and I was at the

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Michelin rubber plantation at like that was our base camp

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next to the camp, right next to the Cambodian border. I've been

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in a couple of major battles and, uh, I came home June 30th,

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1966, and we ended in San Francisco. And they asked me I

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wanted to re-up, and I said no. And they gave me money to go

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back to Brooklyn, New York, where I came from. And I landed

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in Brooklyn. I went to get my job back at the New York Daily

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News. I was hired there two months before I was drafted,

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and they told me I didn't finish my probationary period,

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again. But the VA had and my union had a little different to

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say. So anyway, uh, I got a phone call. I reported to the

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New York Times and I worked at the New York Times as a

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machinist and a machine shop foreman for 43 years, and I

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lived in Brooklyn. I was in Long Island Valley Stream, and

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then I went to Milford, Pennsylvania, on the New York

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New Jersey border, because we did most of our printing in

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Jersey, and I didn't want to pay New York tax, Jersey tax,

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and commuting. So I moved to Pennsylvania and I built a home

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there, and I was there for 40 years. And then my daughters

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lived in Florida, and I moved down here to Palm City, and

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here I am at 83 years old now. Fantastic.

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And that's basically it. Here you are. Thank you for

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your service. Thank you, Mr. Gold.

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Sir Richard is a Purple Heart recipient.

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And a Purple Heart recipient. Thank you.

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Thank you very much. Uh, our agenda this morning

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will consist of an additional item. It's consent nine, which

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is an adopt a proclamation commending Jacob Crosby and

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Parker bestowed upon the achievement of Eagle Scout.

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There's one request to withdraw from the agenda, and that's a

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public hearing. Quasi judicial. Number two, which is request

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for certification of an agricultural enclave pursuant

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to sections one, six, 3.31, six two and one six, 3.3164.

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Florida Statutes. Um, there are no, uh, agenda pulls. Is there

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a motion to approve the agenda, including the consent agenda?

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I'll move approval of the agenda and the consent agenda.

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Second. Any objections? The motion is

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approved. We will begin with proclamations. The first

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proclamation is a proclamation. Uh. Declaring Purple Heart Day.

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Good morning, commissioners. The Purple Heart is the oldest

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military decoration in use today and evolved from the

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Badge of Military Merit created by General George Washington in

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1782. The Purple Heart is awarded to members of the

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United States Armed Forces who have been wounded or died in

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combat with the declared enemy of the United States of

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America. The board recognizes August 7th as Purple Heart Day

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in Martin County, and appreciates the sacrifices our

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Purple Heart recipients and all veterans have made in defending

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our freedoms and once again, here to accept we have Richard

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Voloshin, US Army Vietnam veteran and Purple Heart

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recipient. I was wounded while we were

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going to an ambush. The jolly, the Viet Cong ambushed a bunch

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of men on highway 13, which is nothing but a little blacktop

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two lane road that went from Saigon all the way up into next

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to Cambodia. They hit them and we were going with the medical

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Corps, and we were their escort. I was in a jeep on the

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right hand side with an M14 rifle on my lap, and I was

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covering the right flank, and it was an explosion. Uh,

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shrapnel went through the jeep, passed the sandbags into my

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leg, and, uh, I was blown out of the Jeep. I landed on my

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right shoulder where I have arthritis now, and, uh,

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basically that's it. Medic ran over to me, and you saw the

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wound? It was hot shrapnel. It was like being kicked in the

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shin with a burning polka. And, uh, he went to rip my pants to

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get. And the shrapnel popped out, and he called me the

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luckiest S.O.B. he ever met. And, uh, he threw a bandage on

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my leg, and he said, can you wiggle your toes? I go, yep.

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And he says, can you get up? I go, yep. He says, give me a

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hand with the wounded. And we ran over. I limped over, he ran

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over, and, uh, we started working on the wounded. I was a

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military policeman, so I had more medical training than any

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regular GI. And, uh, basically that was it was beginning of

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June, and I was supposed to come home, what they called an

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early out. And then the early out was canceled. And the

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meantime, I took all got signatures of all the men I

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served with. And that's all the Vietnamese South Vietnamese

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flag, the men I started with, plus my brigade commander,

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Colonel William Broad back, who was the best, best military

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officer I have ever met. He cared about his men, and he was

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a World War Two retread. Now, the one thing I can say about

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him, he was very smart. We used to bring when we went on a

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search and destroy, we would bring three 105 howitzers by

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Chinook helicopter out in the field to set up a set up an

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artillery base, and this is long before they ever thought

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of doing, uh, little bases with artillery and military police.

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We used to be bodyguards for all dignitaries. And him. I was

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an Margaret's bodyguard. In January of 66, I was Charles

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Kuralt bodyguard, and they had a Christmas special. The only

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time in Vietnam we had a truce. It was a Christmas truce from

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Christmas Eve to the end of Christmas Day. And he was

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there. And it was a TV special, if you ever want to see it, you

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go on the computer and you put down Christmas in Vietnam,

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1965, and we'll be Charles Kuralt. And that's exactly

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where I was at the Michelin rubber plantation. And

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basically, that's it. I came home, I married my sweetheart.

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We were engaged before I went over, and we've been married

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this year, 60 years. Nice.

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I'm 60 years. And, uh, I'm still above around. That's

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basically it. Thank you. Sir, when I. Well, one other thing.

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When I came home from Vietnam. Now I got home. And when you

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looked at me, you didn't want to come near me. I had that

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what they call the the thousand yard stare. And, uh, I got home

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and that was it. I left Vietnam, Vietnam the morning of

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June 30th, 1966, at four in the morning. I landed in San in San

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Francisco, June 30th, 7:00 in the morning. By 2:00 in the

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afternoon, I was out of the Army. That's how fast

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everything went. I received this Purple Heart in the mail

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with a letter from Colonel William, brought back one of.

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You know where the hell I was, he says, I called your name

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three times, and I was getting ready to put you down as AWOL.

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And then they told me they sent me home. So that's my story,

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and I'm sticking to. It. Every story.

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Thank you. Thank you for your service.

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And I promise. Our next proclamation is a

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proclamation congratulating the 50th anniversary of the

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Treasure Coast Regional Planning Council in Martin

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County, Florida. The Treasure Coast Regional Planning

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Council, or RPC, was established on August 19th,

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1976, through an interlocal agreement among Indian River

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County, Martin County, Palm Beach County, and Saint Lucie

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County to address issues of regional importance. TCP has

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supported sustainable growth, environmental stewardship,

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economic vitality and regional resilience for the benefit of

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its member counties and municipalities. The year 2026

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marks the 50th anniversary of the Treasure Coast Regional

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Planning Council, representing five decades of dedicated

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service to the region, and the board commends its longstanding

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service to the Treasure Coast region. And here to accept we

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have Thomas Lenihan, who's the executive director of the

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Treasure Coast Regional Planning Council.

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Thank you. Good morning. Um, I don't know if I could say it a

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lot better than that proclamation, but, um, it's

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absolutely been our our pleasure to serve as your

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regional planning council, uh, and undertake all the various

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things that we get to do with you all, whether it's, uh,

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rewriting CRA codes to make them more, uh, effective, um,

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different technical support, first responder hazardous

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materials training that we do for your fire department, uh,

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economic development activity, all those different things.

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It's absolutely been, uh, been a pleasure to be part of all

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that. And we look forward to many more happy years together.

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So thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Excellent.

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Thank you. Thank you so much.

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And our last proclamation is a proclamation declaring Florida

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Water Professionals Month in Martin County, Florida. Water

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industry professionals dedicate themselves to the production

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and distribution of safe drinking water, as well as the

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proper collection, treatment, reuse, and disposal of

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wastewater and stormwater. Water professionals are

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essential first responders as defined by Florida statute

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during storms and other catastrophic events. Working to

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ensure safe drinking water and safe disposal of wastewater for

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our communities. The board recognizes August as Florida

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Water Professionals Month and asks residents to join us in

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thanking all water and wastewater professional staff

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for their hard work and dedication, and here to accept

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several folks. But David Voisin, whose utilities and

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solid waste chief plant operator.

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Thank you. Thank you. Good morning, commissioners.

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Good morning. It's an honor to be here today

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as we recognize the month of August as Florida Water

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Professionals Month. Much of the work performed by water

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professionals have been out of sight, but never should be out

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of mind. 24 hours a day, seven days a week are dedicated. Team

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provides safe drinking water and protect the public health

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and preserve our environment. Access safe drinking water is

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fundamental to a healthy community. These essential

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services are often taken for granted because they are

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delivered seamlessly every day. Martin County Utilities has a

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long standing commitment to operational excellence. Our two

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water and wastewater facilities have each earned the Florida

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Department of Environmental Protection Operational

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Excellence Award on three occasions, recognizing

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outstanding operation, maintenance and regulatory

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compliance. In addition, the Martin County has won the

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American Waterworks Association Region eight Best tasting

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Drinking Water competition 11 times, reflecting the

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dedication and expertise of our team. While we do not seek

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recognition for the work we do, our team quietly serves the

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community every day. Our water distribution, wastewater

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collection, crews respond to water main breaks, wastewater

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collection, sewer line maintains critical

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infrastructure and ensures reliable service, often without

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the public even knowing the efforts are required. This is a

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hallmark to public service. Our department demonstrates

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humility through a meaningful work we perform every day. Our

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greatest success is that our customers can turn on the tap,

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flush the toilet, and trust that these essential services

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are always there. And on behalf of our dedicated men and women

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of our department. I want to thank you for this proclamation

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recognizing Florida Water Professionals Month. We

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sincerely appreciate your gratitude.

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Thank you. Thank you. These are coins commemorating 50th

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anniversary. Treasure Coast Regional Planning.

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Next, we will take up public. Comment. You want to give a

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speech first? Yes. Last. For those who are making public

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comments, since we are in an election season, politicking is

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prohibited, which is defined as advocating the election or

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defeat of a candidate for public office, either partisan

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or non-partisan. This includes the use of words, dates, signs,

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props, and or wearing apparel that convey a message of

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support for a person or group of persons. You'll have three

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minutes to speak. Uh, 15% 15 seconds before your time is up.

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Uh, a buzzer will sound you give you 15 seconds to wrap up.

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Thank you. The first request to speak

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form. I have is from Angela Harrison.

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Miss Harrison will be followed by Victoria Blake. Going to

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make me nervous. Uh, yeah. Good, good. Good morning.

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Everybody. Hello. Morning. Yeah. We're here again. Um, I

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really don't have much to say today. I just want to follow up

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on what I've been saying. Angela Harrison from Tent City

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Helpers. Thank you for always allowing us to speak and for

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hearing us and taking into consideration the things that

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we do speak about. Um, my main concern is getting us the

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Dignity Bus. Um, we are applying for a grant. I think

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it's Martin 100. If I'm not mistaken, grant? Um, Gail

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actually told me I thought that we were going to apply for the

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grant to try to contribute to the dignity bus, but what her

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idea was that if you guys could come together, if we could get

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the dignity Bus on the agenda, or maybe one of you guys could

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go and take a look at it and see what a wonderful idea it

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is. She actually thought that it would be an amazing idea to

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contribute that 100,000 for salaries, for the Dignity Bus,

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because, of course, with the Dignity Bus will need somewhere

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to park it. And we will also need, um, of course, people to

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take care of it at night when the people are there taking

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showers. Um, I guess maintaining, you know, the pets

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and whatnot. Um, I think that's really all I have for today.

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Um, once again, you guys can follow us on Facebook or come

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out with us on Mondays. We actually have a really good

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time. It's kind of sad how much fun we have. Um, we had a few

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guys get jobs this week and they were really, really proud

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of themselves. They were just, you know, I was I do have kind

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of a short story of one of our gentlemen that, you know, he

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did lose his job recently after being very proud that he did

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get a job. And he said to me, he's like, I'm, I'm sorry that

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I disappointed you guys. Oh my gosh. And it it absolutely

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broke my heart. And I just told him, I said, you could never

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disappoint us. We're just so proud of all of you guys for

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what you do. You know, there's such good people. They're so

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thankful. They're so kind. You know, they tell us to have a

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good week. They tell us, you know, they they bless us. And,

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um, they're just really amazing people. And. Dignity bus guys.

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Dignity bus. Dignity. Dignity bus. We need that for us. And

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as always, have a wonderful week. Um, looking forward to

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seeing you guys again with any decisions that you have for us.

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Thank you. Victoria Blake.

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Is next, followed by Larry Cohen.

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Good morning everyone. I'm Victoria Blake, representing

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tent City Helpers. I volunteer every Monday. We go to six

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different locations, um, and feed a warm meal, essential

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supplies, sleeping bags, tents, etc. for the unhoused in Martin

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County. Um, so we've come and asked to be on the agenda with

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no response to date. And Angie and I have talked are going to

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talk about some ideas like the Dignity Bus and some other

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ideas. We have to raise funding for at least land and or a

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shelter. Um, some quick stats. Um, since January of this year,

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we have seen 290 individual unhoused. I've personally had

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over 13,000 views of when I've spoken here. Awesome. And we've

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had over 103,000 views of since when Angie and we have come to

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speak in front of the commissioners. Um, so we're

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excited about that visibility. And we just reached a 4000

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followers on Facebook. Uh, so we have a lot of constituents

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and residents in Martin County that do care about our

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unhoused. Um, I'll start with some wonderful stories she

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mentioned. One, I'm going to change their name to protect

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their identity. But, um, Ned finally got a job, and his

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demeanor completely changed. He went from being completely

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defeated to just proud. You could see the hope in his eyes

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and tears. We're just. We're so proud of you. Um. Bobby still

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feels blessed. He has his job. Then he goes. He knows I give

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him crosses all the time. He goes, do you watch The Chosen?

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And we had this conversation about our favorite characters

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and disciples on the Chosen. I'm like, this is fantastic.

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Um, three unhoused thanked us for the Bibles. We deliver that

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Calvary Community Church donated, um, one of our

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unhoused has been an immobilized wheelchair for some

317
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time. And Rashawn, that works at Treasure Coast Homeless

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Service Council, helped him get up and walk yesterday. There

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were tears. It was beautiful. She is an angel. Um, so I'm

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going to just state some of this. Um, I'm asking that

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people please send letters or call governor DeSantis office.

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Um, House Bill 1365 passed the Florida Legislature,

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legislature and was signed into law by governor DeSantis on

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March 20th, 2024. The law went into effect October 2024. The

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bill, 1365 says it is illegal to sleep in public properties.

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The law mandates that counties and municipalities designate

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specific areas for public camping or sleeping. Yet Martin

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County has nowhere. We have nowhere for the unhoused to go.

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Governor DeSantis address is 400 South Monroe Street in

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Tallahassee. His phone number is on his website. Um, I'm

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personally going to be reaching out to some friends of mine at

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WPBF and other news media for visibility, requesting action.

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Um, also, thank you from our state local grants and local

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00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:55,813
churches, um, churches, residents and more. I just pray

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that you will search your hearts for action. Please.

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Action to support Tent City Helpers and our unhoused. Thank

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00:24:02,286 --> 00:24:06,157
you very much. Thank you. Larry Cohen is next,

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followed by Mike the Armed Fisherman. Good morning. Good

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00:24:15,433 --> 00:24:20,233
morning commissioners. Uh, Larry going. Here for the

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Woodlands Owners Association. I have an aerial, but I

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00:24:24,375 --> 00:24:27,712
understand it's too late to present that to submit this.

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00:24:27,712 --> 00:24:31,516
The last time this aerial was in this room was 25 years ago

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00:24:31,516 --> 00:24:38,116
this week. And our concerns are still concerning. I'd like to

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speak today about the Cove Road project, a live local project

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that purports to build 198 apartments in four different

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buildings, each one three stories high. It presents

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00:24:52,948 --> 00:24:56,151
serious concerns to our residents, which I'd like to

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00:24:56,151 --> 00:24:59,621
highlight. The first one has to do with surface water runoff,

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especially during the 100 year, three day storm events which

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seem to be occurring about 4 to 5 times in the last 25 years

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00:25:09,364 --> 00:25:16,370
since I've been here with this map. As all this water is

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00:25:16,370 --> 00:25:19,975
routed through the main ditch of the Coral Gardens drainage

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basin. You have an alternative. You can route this water to the

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south through the improvements that you made 20 years ago, 20

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to 25 years ago. Up in the Summerfield area. And I'd like

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you to consider that, because the flooding that has occurred

357
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downstream of the Coral Gardens drainage basin is tremendous,

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including culminating with 5 to 6ft of water in Fisherman's

359
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Cove some 25 years ago. This aerial map has been all the way

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to Tallahassee, and has been in the hands of the governor and

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00:25:55,877 --> 00:26:02,477
his ombudsman, and 25 years ago. So as an alternative, I hope

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you will consider routing a lot of that water to the south and

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have your staff really look at drainage. We are also concerned

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00:26:11,893 --> 00:26:15,290
this project is out of character by its three story

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height, and also by its tremendous density, which is in

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contrast to the single family residential neighborhood that

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is going to be placed in. We are also concerned about

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increased need for public safety, which now makes up 60%

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of the county's budget. If I'm correct. Traffic impact to Cove

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and Willoughby is going to be added. And these roads are

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already over capacity. Another concern, especially three times

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00:26:46,328 --> 00:26:51,466
a day on Willoughby. Another concern is that the impact that

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this dense project presents to the schools. Project also

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raises concern about concerns for seniors and handicapped

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00:27:01,943 --> 00:27:06,748
about accessibility. Will this project have elevators to get

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00:27:06,748 --> 00:27:12,860
to the third floor and I'll stop right here. Except to

377
00:27:12,860 --> 00:27:16,357
point out that these this offers major tax concessions

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00:27:16,357 --> 00:27:21,496
all the way from sales tax to ad valorem tax. That cannot be

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00:27:21,496 --> 00:27:26,296
recouped and will only increase residents existing residents

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00:27:26,368 --> 00:27:32,641
taxes. Thank you for your time. Thank you. Mike, the armed

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00:27:32,641 --> 00:27:36,841
fisherman is next, followed by Justin Dugas.

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Hi, friends. Hello.

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All right. I'm going to be as nice as

384
00:27:49,925 --> 00:27:54,863
possible. I have a huge problem with Martin County Sheriff's

385
00:27:54,863 --> 00:28:00,863
Office right now. Currently, I'm under an injunction. I was

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00:28:03,405 --> 00:28:10,605
out open, carrying and I had just got my guns back. The

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00:28:10,812 --> 00:28:15,817
court said, hey, you could have your guns. And they came and

388
00:28:15,817 --> 00:28:21,355
they were ready to take me off to jail. They were ready.

389
00:28:21,355 --> 00:28:24,292
That's not the problem, because they were lucky enough to. I

390
00:28:24,292 --> 00:28:27,695
got Ahold of my attorney. He called whoever he had to call

391
00:28:27,695 --> 00:28:32,433
over here. I'm sure it's the the attorney here. My name is

392
00:28:32,433 --> 00:28:37,773
Michael Taylor, by the way. Whoever the attorney is, you

393
00:28:37,773 --> 00:28:40,909
got that phone call? Yeah, well, somebody got that phone

394
00:28:40,909 --> 00:28:46,114
call anyway. And in a nutshell, they were taking me off. They

395
00:28:46,114 --> 00:28:49,317
got a phone call from the attorney or whoever my attorney

396
00:28:49,317 --> 00:28:54,389
talked to, and they drove me back around. But then I did a

397
00:28:54,389 --> 00:28:59,728
records request, a FOIA public records request. Well, guess

398
00:28:59,728 --> 00:29:04,933
what? With the Martin County Sheriff's Office right now, I'm

399
00:29:04,933 --> 00:29:10,739
number as of Thursday of last week, I was number 85. And I

400
00:29:10,739 --> 00:29:18,790
put it in in July. I, I can see where they're at. There are

401
00:29:18,790 --> 00:29:24,790
people that have not received the records request from almost

402
00:29:24,552 --> 00:29:31,752
March. I here we are. I've. My records request has been paid

403
00:29:33,295 --> 00:29:37,980
for and done with. And they're saying, oh, you know, we're

404
00:29:37,980 --> 00:29:43,305
well. Well and and I go by the armed fishermen. And I promise

405
00:29:43,305 --> 00:29:45,974
you, if you look at the next video that I put out, it's

406
00:29:45,974 --> 00:29:49,911
going to be showing you that I went to your to your sheriff's

407
00:29:49,911 --> 00:29:53,714
office. I was like, hey, do you want me to work for you?

408
00:29:53,714 --> 00:29:58,720
Because I'm a YouTuber. I can edit videos all day long, every

409
00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:02,724
day and whatever. I could probably do my job. I could

410
00:30:02,724 --> 00:30:07,529
probably do their job better than they can do their job. But

411
00:30:07,529 --> 00:30:12,534
hey, I'm sitting here waiting. Actually, it's probably been at

412
00:30:12,534 --> 00:30:15,470
this point. It's been two and a half months since I paid for

413
00:30:15,470 --> 00:30:20,208
it, and they just say, oh, you're just in the queue. And

414
00:30:20,208 --> 00:30:23,478
then I keep asking for, all right, the last ten records

415
00:30:23,478 --> 00:30:28,483
that you produced turning, you probably know that anything

416
00:30:28,483 --> 00:30:32,821
that you already produce and I ask for a copy of, I'm allowed

417
00:30:32,821 --> 00:30:36,758
to get it for free. But for some reason they sit on their

418
00:30:36,758 --> 00:30:43,564
hands. I do not want to have to sue this city or this county

419
00:30:43,564 --> 00:30:48,964
over a records request. You know, under the 119 statutes.

420
00:30:49,103 --> 00:30:52,649
And that's exactly what's going to happen if I don't get these

421
00:30:52,649 --> 00:30:55,652
records. So look up Michael Taylor.

422
00:30:55,652 --> 00:30:59,550
Sir, your time is up. The armed fisherman and you all

423
00:30:59,550 --> 00:31:03,927
be the next YouTube stars to.. Thank you, Mr. Taylor. Thank

424
00:31:03,927 --> 00:31:09,327
you. Justin Dukas is next, followed by Jamila. Something.

425
00:31:20,209 --> 00:31:23,209
Good morning. Good morning. Good.

426
00:31:26,549 --> 00:31:29,886
So my name. Is the mic on. Know the

427
00:31:29,886 --> 00:31:33,956
microphone is. All right. All right. My name

428
00:31:33,956 --> 00:31:39,956
is case number two six cv 14065SM and the Southern

429
00:31:40,290 --> 00:31:46,290
District of Florida Federal Court. I now hold a Martin

430
00:31:46,569 --> 00:31:52,569
County record of committing a crime. 678 nights in a row.

431
00:31:53,643 --> 00:31:59,249
What is that crime? That crime is sleeping. House bill 1365

432
00:31:59,249 --> 00:32:03,920
was passed 678 days ago and turned into Florida. Statute

433
00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:08,720
1250125.0231. And basically it says that, uh, you cannot

434
00:32:11,127 --> 00:32:15,265
sleep, um, in public. But we all know that you cannot, uh,

435
00:32:15,265 --> 00:32:17,534
sleep in the woods because that's trespassing. The woods

436
00:32:17,534 --> 00:32:21,404
is owned by somebody. So it basically says that if you are

437
00:32:21,404 --> 00:32:23,807
houseless in Martin County, if you want to go to sleep, you

438
00:32:23,807 --> 00:32:29,120
cannot sleep in Martin County. That, um, is a violation of the

439
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:34,818
right to travel on top of a few other things. So for about four

440
00:32:34,818 --> 00:32:39,289
months in a row by ten different people, we have, um,

441
00:32:39,289 --> 00:32:43,493
came up here and spoke at this very podium and voiced our

442
00:32:43,493 --> 00:32:48,365
concerns and our needs. And, um, you guys have talked about

443
00:32:48,365 --> 00:32:51,301
a lot of things. Uh, you've talked about train whistles,

444
00:32:51,301 --> 00:32:54,704
you've talked about, um, RV parks, you've talked about a

445
00:32:54,704 --> 00:32:57,307
lot of things, but there has been no mentioning, no

446
00:32:57,307 --> 00:33:01,244
muttering, no, uh, syllable about this civil rights crisis

447
00:33:01,244 --> 00:33:08,444
that's going on right now. Um. So the ship agenda was great,

448
00:33:09,453 --> 00:33:12,122
and that was passed even though we didn't talk about it. It's

449
00:33:12,122 --> 00:33:14,924
great. Thank you for that because we need that. But that

450
00:33:14,924 --> 00:33:18,728
does not address the crisis in which it's going on tonight, in

451
00:33:18,728 --> 00:33:23,132
which I have to commit a crime tonight in order to sleep. So I

452
00:33:23,132 --> 00:33:27,604
called the senator two times and told them to amend the law.

453
00:33:27,604 --> 00:33:31,875
How, uh, amend the law. And of course, they don't listen to me

454
00:33:31,875 --> 00:33:36,146
because I'm just, you know, a constituent. Who am I? Um, and

455
00:33:36,146 --> 00:33:39,883
since I filed this lawsuit, I have been harassed and, um,

456
00:33:39,883 --> 00:33:44,220
pulled over for three times by the Martin County Sheriff's

457
00:33:44,220 --> 00:33:47,891
Office, um, for minor traffic and very minor traffic

458
00:33:47,891 --> 00:33:52,280
infractions, I believe, for the sole purpose of harassing me,

459
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:55,565
that is, um, retaliation to my First Amendment right. And I

460
00:33:55,565 --> 00:33:58,168
want to let everybody know that, um, everything is being

461
00:33:58,168 --> 00:34:02,839
held accounted for. Um, now, the federal judge ordered me

462
00:34:02,839 --> 00:34:07,377
and the defendants to confer in court in person on August 18th.

463
00:34:07,377 --> 00:34:10,914
Um, if you guys want to show up, it's open to the public.

464
00:34:10,914 --> 00:34:16,914
It's open. Everybody. Um. Spending so much money in, uh,

465
00:34:18,654 --> 00:34:23,192
legal fees instead of addressing the actual problem.

466
00:34:23,192 --> 00:34:26,797
Um, flock cameras. We don't want them take them down. And

467
00:34:26,797 --> 00:34:30,400
please address this, uh, during the public comments, please.

468
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:35,800
Thank you. Jamilah is next, followed by Candace Callahan.

469
00:34:48,885 --> 00:34:50,554
Good morning. Good morning everyone. How are

470
00:34:50,554 --> 00:34:52,222
you this morning? Good morning.

471
00:34:52,222 --> 00:34:57,270
I just had the. Oh, Taylor. Hold on. My doctor was on the

472
00:34:57,270 --> 00:35:00,163
phone at the same time. My name is Jamie Yang, Escalona,

473
00:35:00,163 --> 00:35:02,965
executive director of Yaya Pobeda. You guys should know my

474
00:35:02,965 --> 00:35:07,437
face already. Let's chat about why I haven't been here since

475
00:35:07,437 --> 00:35:12,242
June. On June 18th, one day before Juneteenth, my

476
00:35:12,242 --> 00:35:16,780
participant, Toni Miller was lynched in Miami. She was what

477
00:35:16,780 --> 00:35:21,251
we call motel homeless. The system failed her. And while we

478
00:35:21,251 --> 00:35:23,720
are still fighting for transparency, unhoused

479
00:35:23,720 --> 00:35:27,657
individuals in Martin County now have to worry about hate

480
00:35:27,657 --> 00:35:32,728
crimes compounded by mass surveillance, aka flock. I want

481
00:35:32,728 --> 00:35:35,665
to publicly thank my friends at Tent City Helpers. They have

482
00:35:35,665 --> 00:35:39,202
shown up to speak to you consistently no matter what.

483
00:35:39,202 --> 00:35:44,730
This shelter line item has been asked for for months without a

484
00:35:44,730 --> 00:35:46,543
single acknowledgment from the commission outside of a

485
00:35:46,543 --> 00:35:49,880
possible visit to La Jolla for land use, which I'm not sure if

486
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:52,415
that was done or not. I would love to hear some comment on

487
00:35:52,415 --> 00:35:56,219
that. We have all invited you to our fireside chats, our

488
00:35:56,219 --> 00:36:01,158
outreaches. Still no response. It is election season. Might I

489
00:36:01,158 --> 00:36:04,895
add. Remember that for later. Tent City Helpers has

490
00:36:04,895 --> 00:36:08,310
consistently provided evidence jailing unhoused individual

491
00:36:08,310 --> 00:36:11,434
cost taxpayers more than housing them. A transitional

492
00:36:11,434 --> 00:36:13,969
housing facility with wraparound services, employment

493
00:36:13,969 --> 00:36:16,840
access, disability applications, veteran services,

494
00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:19,909
pathways to permanent housing is cheaper than raids and

495
00:36:19,909 --> 00:36:24,709
incarceration, and let's address the age old argument 40

496
00:36:24,781 --> 00:36:28,318
to 60% of unhoused people in the US do have jobs. The whole

497
00:36:28,318 --> 00:36:33,923
get a job excuse that doesn't stand anymore. And I lost my

498
00:36:33,923 --> 00:36:41,123
place. Give me one second. I'm going to lose some time here.

499
00:36:42,798 --> 00:36:45,335
The criminalization of not having a home is metastasizing

500
00:36:45,335 --> 00:36:48,537
cancer across our region. We just had to fight SR four in

501
00:36:48,537 --> 00:36:51,340
Miami, a city ordinance that took away the lead time before

502
00:36:51,340 --> 00:36:54,276
police raids, allowing folks to move and service workers to

503
00:36:54,276 --> 00:36:57,480
connect with them. That model threatens the spread here. But

504
00:36:57,480 --> 00:37:01,240
here is what I saw today. What really breaks my heart. Human

505
00:37:01,240 --> 00:37:03,293
services are the lowest funded department in your entire

506
00:37:03,293 --> 00:37:06,280
budget yet on the Florida Opioid Abatement Fund website,

507
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:08,297
there is yet another massive award to Martin County

508
00:37:08,297 --> 00:37:11,168
Sheriff's Office under the guise of prevention. Meanwhile,

509
00:37:11,168 --> 00:37:13,970
smaller nonprofits like ours are barely scraping by. The

510
00:37:13,970 --> 00:37:17,374
barriers to access these funds are so high that even when all

511
00:37:17,374 --> 00:37:20,644
of these type of grants can have, we barely cover peer

512
00:37:20,644 --> 00:37:24,247
support, specialist salaries alone. The flock lease expires

513
00:37:24,247 --> 00:37:26,717
next year. Pensacola used opioid abatement funds to

514
00:37:26,717 --> 00:37:28,985
purchase those cameras, a violation of federal usage

515
00:37:28,985 --> 00:37:33,523
standards. I urge this board not to renew. I'm wondering if

516
00:37:33,523 --> 00:37:36,927
we're using those dollars here. We're going to find that out to

517
00:37:36,927 --> 00:37:41,727
the commissioners. My tone deserved better. My tone

518
00:37:42,865 --> 00:37:46,602
deserved better. I hope that this is not happening here,

519
00:37:46,602 --> 00:37:52,409
because we will find out. Thank you. Candace Callahan is

520
00:37:52,409 --> 00:37:55,612
next, and Miss Callahan is the last request to speak for me. I

521
00:37:55,612 --> 00:37:59,212
have. Good morning. On my good.

522
00:38:05,822 --> 00:38:11,222
Hello. Not yet. Are we good? Okay. Um. Good

523
00:38:11,294 --> 00:38:13,496
morning everyone. It's been some time since I've come

524
00:38:13,496 --> 00:38:16,433
before you. I'm Candace Callahan, the executive

525
00:38:16,433 --> 00:38:19,769
director for Stuart Main street. Um, Stuart main Street

526
00:38:19,769 --> 00:38:21,905
is the nonprofit that has been partnering with the City of

527
00:38:21,905 --> 00:38:25,909
Stuart for 40 years to help revitalize them and maintain at

528
00:38:25,909 --> 00:38:28,845
this point, the historic downtown. We serve as a key

529
00:38:28,845 --> 00:38:32,982
economic vitality driver and also of cultural preservation

530
00:38:32,982 --> 00:38:35,185
and community engagement throughout the historic

531
00:38:35,185 --> 00:38:39,189
downtown, functioning as a central economic hub for Martin

532
00:38:39,189 --> 00:38:42,192
County. There's been a lot of discussion recently about

533
00:38:42,192 --> 00:38:45,662
preservation amongst all of our communities, not just downtown

534
00:38:45,662 --> 00:38:48,531
Stuart. So I thought I'd come and share some initiatives that

535
00:38:48,531 --> 00:38:52,269
we have been doing and working on to help O and also some of

536
00:38:52,269 --> 00:38:56,206
our recent accomplishments as well. So we are proud to have

537
00:38:56,206 --> 00:38:59,275
recently helped our CRA received the designation for

538
00:38:59,275 --> 00:39:02,612
the historic downtown, putting the district on the National

539
00:39:02,612 --> 00:39:05,749
Register of Historic Places, and we have just applied for

540
00:39:05,749 --> 00:39:09,419
the historic marker to serve as a permanent symbol of community

541
00:39:09,419 --> 00:39:13,489
identity. We have just been awarded a $50,000 grant to help

542
00:39:13,489 --> 00:39:16,893
the city develop design guidelines to help preserve and

543
00:39:16,893 --> 00:39:20,430
protect our downtown charm that we've become so known for. We

544
00:39:20,430 --> 00:39:23,833
have also applied for a $25,000 grant to help enhance and

545
00:39:23,833 --> 00:39:27,704
develop a new user friendly digital walking and art history

546
00:39:27,704 --> 00:39:30,640
tour to help better engage our youth and promote the

547
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:34,978
importance of preservation and strengthen local tourism. A few

548
00:39:34,978 --> 00:39:38,515
weeks ago, we recently, um, were recognized from the

549
00:39:38,515 --> 00:39:41,718
Secretary of the state and awarded in four categories

550
00:39:41,718 --> 00:39:45,122
among 70 other Main Street programs across the state. We

551
00:39:45,122 --> 00:39:48,191
received an award for volunteer of the year, Business owner of

552
00:39:48,191 --> 00:39:51,728
the year, board Member of the year, as well as recognition

553
00:39:51,728 --> 00:39:53,863
for our Saving Stuart event, which some of you have

554
00:39:53,863 --> 00:39:56,866
participated in before and come and supported. So thank you for

555
00:39:56,866 --> 00:40:00,203
that. And that was in the category of telling Main Street

556
00:40:00,203 --> 00:40:03,539
Story. We applied for the Great American Main Street Award and

557
00:40:03,539 --> 00:40:06,943
waiting their decision. This week. We are long overdue for

558
00:40:06,943 --> 00:40:09,746
this almost 40 years of proven transformation, national

559
00:40:09,746 --> 00:40:12,349
recognition and tourism attraction. But most

560
00:40:12,349 --> 00:40:15,886
importantly, our resilient public private partnerships

561
00:40:15,886 --> 00:40:19,288
with the City of Stuart and the good folks like you. We will

562
00:40:19,288 --> 00:40:23,160
begin work on a large scale art mural project for Flagler Park,

563
00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:26,229
um, where we host our farmers market every week. And that

564
00:40:26,229 --> 00:40:29,365
should start, I think, next month. And just a friendly

565
00:40:29,365 --> 00:40:32,350
reminder that this is the slowest time of the year for

566
00:40:32,350 --> 00:40:35,380
our small business owners in our downtown. If we don't want

567
00:40:35,380 --> 00:40:37,574
to lose our charm, we need to support our small businesses.

568
00:40:37,574 --> 00:40:40,510
So whether you're grabbing an ice cream or a coffee or having

569
00:40:40,510 --> 00:40:44,180
dinner, coming to Rock and Riverwalk, it all helps. Um,

570
00:40:44,180 --> 00:40:47,384
and we are happy to maintain our weekly events market on

571
00:40:47,384 --> 00:40:50,453
Maine. Our Farmer's Market, Rock and Riverwalk, and our

572
00:40:50,453 --> 00:40:54,524
Summer Car Show series to help boost foot traffic as well. And

573
00:40:54,524 --> 00:40:57,600
we appreciate your support and your partnership, and thank you

574
00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:01,798
all for your service. Thank you. Thank you. Next

575
00:41:01,798 --> 00:41:04,534
comes Commissioner comments. Commissioner Vargas.

576
00:41:04,534 --> 00:41:08,738
, yes, I would like to send a special recognition to the

577
00:41:08,738 --> 00:41:13,900
teachers administration and all of the support professionals

578
00:41:13,900 --> 00:41:15,945
that support our schools. All the other professionals support

579
00:41:15,945 --> 00:41:19,816
our schools and our students. Uh, when this gentleman, uh,

580
00:41:19,816 --> 00:41:22,953
Mr. Voloshin was speaking, I remember being in Lao Cai,

581
00:41:22,953 --> 00:41:27,890
Vietnam and near the Lao border in Cambodia. It's mountainous

582
00:41:27,890 --> 00:41:32,629
and rice paddies tucked right into the mountainous range

583
00:41:32,629 --> 00:41:38,902
right there. I have a couple of questions. This bill, 1365, has

584
00:41:38,902 --> 00:41:44,902
Human Services looked into this. I'm sorry. I'm asking Mister

585
00:41:45,410 --> 00:41:48,912
Donaldson. Miss Alder. Um, yes, we are familiar with

586
00:41:48,912 --> 00:41:53,183
the bill in terms of its actions, and we, um, are fully

587
00:41:53,183 --> 00:41:56,719
aware of all the restrictions it places on the county to

588
00:41:56,719 --> 00:42:01,925
provide them, uh, to not allow public property for the use of,

589
00:42:01,925 --> 00:42:04,925
um, uh, camping, sleeping, etc..

590
00:42:05,862 --> 00:42:09,332
We've spoken about that before. So is there any remedy, any

591
00:42:09,332 --> 00:42:13,532
other pathway? The, um, the remedy requires

592
00:42:14,700 --> 00:42:17,207
this, uh, public stated that the in order for the county to

593
00:42:17,207 --> 00:42:22,278
provide a shelter, they also have to provide all of the, um,

594
00:42:22,278 --> 00:42:25,548
uh, accessory components that goes along with it. So it's not

595
00:42:25,548 --> 00:42:28,951
just about providing the facility. You have to provide,

596
00:42:28,951 --> 00:42:32,622
um, uh, adequate health care and a whole group of other

597
00:42:32,622 --> 00:42:35,892
things that go along with it. So essentially, the bill

598
00:42:35,892 --> 00:42:39,295
requires that if you're going to provide a place for the

599
00:42:39,295 --> 00:42:43,566
homeless, that you have to have a well constructed, well-run

600
00:42:43,566 --> 00:42:48,705
operation that is not, um, simply designating a campground

601
00:42:48,705 --> 00:42:50,973
and with an arrow saying, you can camp here, you have to

602
00:42:50,973 --> 00:42:54,510
provide multiple services in order to provide that. And so

603
00:42:54,510 --> 00:42:59,649
that is a significant expense. And I'm not aware of of any

604
00:42:59,649 --> 00:43:03,586
county in the state that has yet to meet the requirements of

605
00:43:03,586 --> 00:43:05,187
the bill. Yeah, I'm going to look further

606
00:43:05,187 --> 00:43:08,992
into that. Um, with my fellow commissioners from other

607
00:43:08,992 --> 00:43:12,267
counties to see what they've done to get ideas there. The

608
00:43:12,267 --> 00:43:15,537
other thing is, Mr. Taylor was here and he was talking about

609
00:43:15,537 --> 00:43:18,407
the FOIA. Too slow. I've seen it very fast. Is there a

610
00:43:18,407 --> 00:43:22,344
problem in that department addressing his, um, request?

611
00:43:22,344 --> 00:43:25,681
The that would be the sheriff's department. We do not manage

612
00:43:25,681 --> 00:43:29,840
the sheriff. He's a separate elected constitutional officer.

613
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:31,754
And so, no, we do not provide oversight to that.

614
00:43:31,754 --> 00:43:34,289
Okay. So he hasn't made an application here with this

615
00:43:34,289 --> 00:43:38,827
county? No. Through the sheriff only. Okay. I needed to be sure

616
00:43:38,827 --> 00:43:42,427
about that. Thank you. Mr. Capps.

617
00:43:44,566 --> 00:43:48,437
There's been a lot. Of interest in helping the

618
00:43:48,437 --> 00:43:55,310
unhoused and a lot of comments made, um, for many of our

619
00:43:55,310 --> 00:44:00,182
meetings. And I know there's a lot more that we could probably

620
00:44:00,182 --> 00:44:06,182
do, but something came to mind that doesn't really get

621
00:44:06,254 --> 00:44:11,460
mentioned. And and that is what are we doing now? And there are

622
00:44:11,460 --> 00:44:16,464
some things we're doing now. We have a category of spending in

623
00:44:16,464 --> 00:44:20,690
our budget called grants and Aids. And I thought I would

624
00:44:20,690 --> 00:44:26,690
just mention that we do provide, uh, several of our

625
00:44:26,342 --> 00:44:32,342
grants and Aids that bring benefits to the unhoused. Um,

626
00:44:32,748 --> 00:44:38,190
I'm looking here at a list. One is called Veterans Homeless,

627
00:44:38,190 --> 00:44:41,619
$10,000. Another one is Treasure Coast Homeless

628
00:44:42,558 --> 00:44:47,358
Council, $25,000. Uh, another one is called food Bank.

629
00:44:49,970 --> 00:44:55,970
$20,000. And another one that I think is closely related to

630
00:44:55,170 --> 00:44:59,775
helping the unhoused is one called New Horizons, which is,

631
00:44:59,775 --> 00:45:05,247
um, mental health. It's like a hospital over by Martin South.

632
00:45:05,247 --> 00:45:07,715
That is the one, right? Yeah, that's where it is. New

633
00:45:07,715 --> 00:45:10,986
horizons. Am I getting them mixed up? That's the that's the

634
00:45:10,986 --> 00:45:14,589
name of that one over there by, uh, Martin South, right? Yes. I

635
00:45:14,589 --> 00:45:18,600
took a tour of them. Now that's Coral Shores. Coral shores?

636
00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:22,865
Yes. Anyway, we we, uh, we give, uh, $407,000 to New

637
00:45:22,865 --> 00:45:28,265
Horizons, uh, which is closely related to helping the

638
00:45:28,470 --> 00:45:33,341
unhoused. I don't say that to to say that that's all that we

639
00:45:33,341 --> 00:45:35,878
should do. I know that there's probably other things we can

640
00:45:35,878 --> 00:45:40,616
do, and we really appreciate people coming in to help us to

641
00:45:40,616 --> 00:45:45,487
come up with new ideas on how we can enhance services to the

642
00:45:45,487 --> 00:45:49,958
unhoused. But I wanted to mention that we do some things

643
00:45:49,958 --> 00:45:56,980
now and then. I wanted to mention another thing that I

644
00:45:56,980 --> 00:46:01,236
had the privilege to attend 10 or 12 days ago. I, along with

645
00:46:01,236 --> 00:46:04,706
numerous federal, state and local leaders, had the

646
00:46:04,706 --> 00:46:09,440
privilege of attending the Indian River lagoon South

647
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:14,444
Milestone celebration at the C23C24 reservoir and stormwater

648
00:46:16,118 --> 00:46:21,723
treatment area up in Fort Pierce and Indian River lagoon

649
00:46:21,723 --> 00:46:24,325
South is a part of the comprehensive Everglades

650
00:46:24,325 --> 00:46:29,130
Restoration Plan and sitting on a huge piece of land, it will

651
00:46:29,130 --> 00:46:33,930
have massive reservoirs of water, uh, containing runoff

652
00:46:34,869 --> 00:46:37,472
from the region that will filter through stormwater

653
00:46:37,472 --> 00:46:42,544
treatment areas that will clean the water before it goes into

654
00:46:42,544 --> 00:46:48,160
Ten Mile Creek and then into the North Fork of the Saint

655
00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:52,554
Lucie River. Uh, there was a very impressive lineup of

656
00:46:52,554 --> 00:46:56,425
federal and state speakers at this event. And I would like to

657
00:46:56,425 --> 00:47:00,562
point out that Commissioner heard was the only local

658
00:47:00,562 --> 00:47:03,899
official who was asked to speak at this event because of her

659
00:47:03,899 --> 00:47:08,504
role in Everglades restoration. From the very beginning. And

660
00:47:08,504 --> 00:47:11,239
Commissioner heard your comments were excellent. You

661
00:47:11,239 --> 00:47:14,375
represented us very well at this event. I appreciate that

662
00:47:14,375 --> 00:47:17,846
very much. And as I learned more about Everglades

663
00:47:17,846 --> 00:47:22,250
restoration, uh, I want to I become more grateful for the

664
00:47:22,250 --> 00:47:26,387
progress that has been made. And I want to put my own

665
00:47:26,387 --> 00:47:31,727
shoulder to the wheel and see what I can do to help, because

666
00:47:31,727 --> 00:47:35,730
the issue of Everglades restoration is very, very

667
00:47:35,730 --> 00:47:39,934
closely related to the health of our own local environment

668
00:47:39,934 --> 00:47:44,134
and our waterways. Another contribution that that

669
00:47:46,541 --> 00:47:52,814
Martin County has made to the, um, to homeless is in, I think,

670
00:47:52,814 --> 00:47:58,214
about 2010, uh, I was asked to contribute substantially to,

671
00:47:58,553 --> 00:48:03,910
uh, the construction of the Miss Butterfly facility in Port

672
00:48:03,910 --> 00:48:06,694
Salerno, new Monrovia. Um, it's a facility for homeless

673
00:48:06,694 --> 00:48:10,499
mothers. And I thought it was a very worthy facility. And I did

674
00:48:10,499 --> 00:48:14,102
contribute substantially to the construction of this project.

675
00:48:14,102 --> 00:48:18,573
It's been a wonderful success since then. So, you know, we

676
00:48:18,573 --> 00:48:23,512
have made inroads. We have addressed, uh, homeless and we

677
00:48:23,512 --> 00:48:26,381
haven't done enough, but we certainly keep moving in that

678
00:48:26,381 --> 00:48:29,451
direction to make sure that we provide the best quality of

679
00:48:29,451 --> 00:48:33,789
life for all the residents of Martin County, and also, I just

680
00:48:33,789 --> 00:48:38,726
wanted to mention the agenda item that's been withdrawn from

681
00:48:38,726 --> 00:48:42,397
the agenda today, and that's public hearing, quasi judicial.

682
00:48:42,397 --> 00:48:47,202
Number two, I just wanted to say that, uh, Gina Nabi was the

683
00:48:47,202 --> 00:48:51,339
staff person who prepared the staff report, and I want to say

684
00:48:51,339 --> 00:48:55,410
that it's the best staff report I have ever read. Uh, the

685
00:48:55,410 --> 00:48:59,547
proofing that she did on this extremely complex, complicated

686
00:48:59,547 --> 00:49:04,886
issue was remarkable. It was so professional. It was it was a a

687
00:49:04,886 --> 00:49:11,486
pleasure to see our staff. Uh, solve this very, very complex,

688
00:49:12,493 --> 00:49:17,893
uh, challenge. So thank you, Miss Nabi. Commissioner Candy.

689
00:49:19,101 --> 00:49:25,450
Thank you very much. Um, a week from today will be election

690
00:49:25,450 --> 00:49:30,850
day. Uh, we have the election and the. And the opportunity

691
00:49:30,850 --> 00:49:37,590
for voting has already begun. We are in our early voting. Uh,

692
00:49:37,590 --> 00:49:43,863
window. It started on Saturday. Uh, also, if you had requested

693
00:49:43,863 --> 00:49:48,535
a vote by mail ballot and have yet to turn it in, uh, you

694
00:49:48,535 --> 00:49:51,538
still can. You can either drop it off at the supervisor of

695
00:49:51,538 --> 00:49:56,276
elections office or mail it in. Uh, I know I'm serving on the

696
00:49:56,276 --> 00:50:00,790
canvassing board with Commissioner Vargas. Uh, and

697
00:50:00,790 --> 00:50:04,217
that supervisor of elections, Vicki Davis, had said she sent

698
00:50:04,217 --> 00:50:08,354
out approximately 15 or 16,000 ballots, and only about 6000

699
00:50:08,354 --> 00:50:13,493
have returned, which is a pretty low percentage even in

700
00:50:13,493 --> 00:50:17,630
an off year election. You can vote early in Hobe Sound. You

701
00:50:17,630 --> 00:50:21,634
can vote early in Indian Town, and you can vote early in the

702
00:50:21,634 --> 00:50:26,380
Martin Luther King on Martin Luther King and Stuart from 9

703
00:50:26,380 --> 00:50:31,578
to 5, I think, until this weekend. So, uh, the 15th, uh,

704
00:50:31,578 --> 00:50:35,315
and then of course, a week from today, August 18th, is Election

705
00:50:35,315 --> 00:50:40,520
day. Uh, this election for all of the local seats, the local

706
00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:44,724
positions will be decided during this primary. A lot of

707
00:50:44,724 --> 00:50:48,795
folks that think that, hey, I will not vote during the August

708
00:50:48,795 --> 00:50:53,733
primary, I will wait and vote in November. The local

709
00:50:53,733 --> 00:50:59,538
positions will be decided during the primary. So I know

710
00:50:59,538 --> 00:51:05,411
that some people after the fact are frustrated. Um, who you

711
00:51:05,411 --> 00:51:07,880
vote for is obviously your prerogative, but it is

712
00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:12,152
important to vote. I would tell you, I think this will be a

713
00:51:12,152 --> 00:51:17,424
historically low voter turnout. Uh, it's also an opportunity

714
00:51:17,424 --> 00:51:21,628
for people to vote for the positions that really, I think,

715
00:51:21,628 --> 00:51:26,766
have some of the most relevance to your day to day life. School

716
00:51:26,766 --> 00:51:29,766
board commissioners, city commissioners, village

717
00:51:30,770 --> 00:51:36,170
commissioners. So the opportunity to have a say in

718
00:51:36,576 --> 00:51:40,580
that is now, uh, so I appreciate that. And in regard.

719
00:51:40,580 --> 00:51:44,918
And let me add that all voters, regardless of your political

720
00:51:44,918 --> 00:51:49,550
affiliation, are eligible to vote in all of the local

721
00:51:49,550 --> 00:51:51,590
elections this year, which is kind of unusual.

722
00:51:51,590 --> 00:51:54,928
Yes, true. Sometimes if you are a one party affiliation or

723
00:51:54,928 --> 00:51:58,531
another, the ballot would be specific, but all seats are

724
00:51:58,531 --> 00:52:03,690
available for every. As Commissioner Heard said, every

725
00:52:03,690 --> 00:52:07,273
whatever your political party affiliation is, you can vote

726
00:52:07,273 --> 00:52:10,543
for all of the seats. Except, of course, if you're in an

727
00:52:10,543 --> 00:52:12,945
unincorporated Martin County, you don't vote in the city of

728
00:52:12,945 --> 00:52:16,415
Stuart, you're not voting in Indian Town. But for all of the

729
00:52:16,415 --> 00:52:20,220
seats that are available for you to select, you can, in

730
00:52:20,220 --> 00:52:24,424
regards to the unhoused situation that's been discussed

731
00:52:24,424 --> 00:52:27,827
quite a bit. Uh, I had a conversation with the ladies

732
00:52:27,827 --> 00:52:32,232
that spoke this morning several weeks ago, and I was very

733
00:52:32,232 --> 00:52:36,102
intrigued by the Dignity Bus and have reached out to the

734
00:52:36,102 --> 00:52:40,974
folks up north that have won and have planned to go and see

735
00:52:40,974 --> 00:52:44,110
it, because I think to hear about it is one thing, but to

736
00:52:44,110 --> 00:52:48,981
see it and to understand how they are able to do it, I think

737
00:52:48,981 --> 00:52:53,386
is an opportunity that might be the closest, uh, way that we

738
00:52:53,386 --> 00:52:56,989
can assist at a higher level without getting ourselves too

739
00:52:56,989 --> 00:53:01,861
much into a legal or a logistical quagmire. It's being

740
00:53:01,861 --> 00:53:05,865
done. From what I understand, successfully. Just to our

741
00:53:05,865 --> 00:53:11,700
north. So I will tell you that I'm heading up to see it and to

742
00:53:11,700 --> 00:53:14,874
speak to the folks that are doing it. And when I do, I will

743
00:53:14,874 --> 00:53:16,875
come back and give you my impression.

744
00:53:16,875 --> 00:53:19,275
Okay, good. Commissioner Hetherington.

745
00:53:20,413 --> 00:53:24,150
I look forward to learning more about the Dignity Bus. And then

746
00:53:24,150 --> 00:53:27,887
I just came back from, um, American Water Resources

747
00:53:27,887 --> 00:53:30,823
Association meeting, which is one of my favorite meetings of

748
00:53:30,823 --> 00:53:35,828
the year. Uh, several years ago at this meeting, on the way to

749
00:53:35,828 --> 00:53:39,980
the meeting, we were in our district two. We were having an

750
00:53:39,980 --> 00:53:43,302
issue with Monterey Subdivision and contaminated wells, as

751
00:53:43,302 --> 00:53:47,439
cited by the Health department. Um, I remember Drew Bartlett

752
00:53:47,439 --> 00:53:51,510
was just moving from the department. Uh, the DEP over to

753
00:53:51,510 --> 00:53:55,314
director of the South Florida Water Management, and I want to

754
00:53:55,314 --> 00:53:59,385
thank him again because, uh, because of his actions in

755
00:53:59,385 --> 00:54:04,924
connecting district to our office with DEP, we were able

756
00:54:04,924 --> 00:54:08,994
to mobilize within weeks. Um, and those folks were getting

757
00:54:08,994 --> 00:54:13,650
bottled water, and he was able to connect us with the right

758
00:54:13,650 --> 00:54:17,470
people at DEP. And we were able to partner with the city of

759
00:54:17,470 --> 00:54:22,674
Stewart to get those folks onto sewer. We received. I want to

760
00:54:22,674 --> 00:54:28,800
say it was about a $1.8 million grant at the time, and it was

761
00:54:28,800 --> 00:54:32,280
almost 100% funded. Moving those folks from contaminated

762
00:54:33,285 --> 00:54:38,824
wells to sewer. So and it was a great partnership between DEP,

763
00:54:38,824 --> 00:54:42,628
the district two office, the city of Stewart. I want to say

764
00:54:42,628 --> 00:54:47,700
this was again five years ago, and it was a result of being at

765
00:54:47,700 --> 00:54:51,904
that, a meeting and talking with the right people at the

766
00:54:51,904 --> 00:54:56,509
right time, and that they were on water within 18 months,

767
00:54:56,509 --> 00:55:01,180
which I would say the at the speed of government. It was a

768
00:55:01,180 --> 00:55:05,985
really good partnership. So that meeting, it always has a

769
00:55:05,985 --> 00:55:08,988
special place in my heart. And then as I sat there and listen,

770
00:55:08,988 --> 00:55:13,590
there were panels throughout the two days. We had Army Corps

771
00:55:13,590 --> 00:55:16,529
talking about and South Florida water management talking about

772
00:55:16,529 --> 00:55:20,332
Everglades restoration. Uh, Colonel Bowman was there. Major

773
00:55:20,332 --> 00:55:24,690
Bell uh, we had Drew Bartlett and all five water management

774
00:55:24,690 --> 00:55:29,542
districts around the state, and, uh, there were panels on

775
00:55:29,542 --> 00:55:33,684
biosolids. And I sat there very proud representing Martin

776
00:55:33,684 --> 00:55:38,555
County, because as they started to talk about biosolids and

777
00:55:38,555 --> 00:55:43,355
land application and emerging technology around the state,

778
00:55:43,560 --> 00:55:49,560
that was, um, really addressing how we manage biosolids. I

779
00:55:49,566 --> 00:55:52,302
wanted to raise my hand and say, yes, we're the poster

780
00:55:52,302 --> 00:55:55,706
child. And they did mention Martin County, you know, in the

781
00:55:55,706 --> 00:56:01,311
halls, because we are a leading example in the state of how we

782
00:56:01,311 --> 00:56:05,182
manage our biosolids, how we partner with Everglades

783
00:56:05,182 --> 00:56:10,587
restoration, and even the example of the site where we're

784
00:56:10,587 --> 00:56:15,859
going to eventually store muck dredged out of the Indian River

785
00:56:15,859 --> 00:56:20,330
lagoon is a very good example. I was very proud to represent

786
00:56:20,330 --> 00:56:25,268
Martin County and to listen to all the accomplishments and

787
00:56:25,268 --> 00:56:27,938
hear all these people from around the state of Florida,

788
00:56:27,938 --> 00:56:30,940
from the Panhandle, all the way to the keys, and the

789
00:56:30,940 --> 00:56:35,346
recognition that we get for and Martin County for being leaders

790
00:56:35,346 --> 00:56:38,946
in water restoration. Everglades restoration and

791
00:56:40,160 --> 00:56:44,870
water policy. So it was my pleasure to attend. And again,

792
00:56:44,870 --> 00:56:46,957
I came back very proud of Martin County and the things

793
00:56:46,957 --> 00:56:50,260
that we've done over the past ten years.

794
00:56:50,260 --> 00:56:55,699
Very nice. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Donaldson. Miss elder.

795
00:56:55,699 --> 00:56:59,636
Okay, in that case, let's proceed. We'll take up public

796
00:56:59,636 --> 00:57:03,841
hearing, quasi judicial number one, which is a public hearing

797
00:57:03,841 --> 00:57:07,177
to request approval of the major final site plan for

798
00:57:07,177 --> 00:57:10,581
southwest 96th Street. Mono pine. Wireless

799
00:57:10,581 --> 00:57:14,781
telecommunications facility tower. This is quasi judicial.

800
00:57:15,385 --> 00:57:20,791
Any ex-parte disclosures Mr.. Vargas I have none. The form

801
00:57:20,791 --> 00:57:23,791
has been filed. Commissioner Capps.

802
00:57:24,394 --> 00:57:25,929
If I have any. They have been filed.

803
00:57:25,929 --> 00:57:29,660
I don't have any. And they've been filed. Commissioner Campi.

804
00:57:29,660 --> 00:57:30,734
I don't have any. And that's been filed.

805
00:57:30,734 --> 00:57:32,870
And Commissioner Hetherington. I don't have any and they've

806
00:57:32,870 --> 00:57:35,139
been filed. Mr. Sinnott, have you filed all

807
00:57:35,139 --> 00:57:37,807
of your required things with the clerk?

808
00:57:37,807 --> 00:57:40,744
I'm turning a copy of my work history and the agenda item to

809
00:57:40,744 --> 00:57:44,214
be filed as exhibit one, and the applicant submitted their

810
00:57:44,214 --> 00:57:48,850
affidavit of mailers at this past Thursday's LPA hearing.

811
00:57:48,850 --> 00:57:51,555
Is the applicant here? Yes. Anyone who's going to be

812
00:57:51,555 --> 00:57:54,758
providing sworn testimony, please stand up, raise your

813
00:57:54,758 --> 00:58:00,697
Right hand and be sworn in. Do you swear or.

814
00:58:00,697 --> 00:58:02,766
Affirm the evidence you're about to give will be the

815
00:58:02,766 --> 00:58:05,102
truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth so help

816
00:58:05,102 --> 00:58:07,303
you God. I do.

817
00:58:07,303 --> 00:58:10,441
Please proceed, Mr. Sinnott. Thank you, Madam Chair. Good

818
00:58:10,441 --> 00:58:13,243
morning, commissioners. I'm John Sennett, principal planner

819
00:58:13,243 --> 00:58:16,780
with growth management. This is a request by United Commercial

820
00:58:16,780 --> 00:58:20,584
Telecom on behalf of Mr. and Mrs. Fazlul and Zarina Ahmed

821
00:58:20,584 --> 00:58:23,587
for major final site plan approval to construct a 120

822
00:58:23,587 --> 00:58:27,570
foot stealth design monoplane. Wireless telecommunications

823
00:58:27,570 --> 00:58:30,657
facility and associated infrastructure. The subject

824
00:58:30,660 --> 00:58:34,597
site is a portion of an approximately 1.7 acre parcel

825
00:58:34,597 --> 00:58:37,801
located on the south side of southwest 96th Street,

826
00:58:37,801 --> 00:58:42,272
approximately 230ft west of the intersection of southwest 96th

827
00:58:42,272 --> 00:58:45,742
Street and Southwest Corner Highway and Stuart included as

828
00:58:45,742 --> 00:58:49,279
a request for Certificate of Public Facilities exemption.

829
00:58:49,279 --> 00:58:54,679
There are no interviewers for this application. The subject

830
00:58:54,818 --> 00:58:57,887
site is just west of the intersection of 96th and

831
00:58:57,887 --> 00:59:02,492
Kanner, to the east of the site is an existing Sunoco gas

832
00:59:02,492 --> 00:59:07,497
station, right at the corner. The subject site is located

833
00:59:07,497 --> 00:59:11,835
within the LC limited Limited Commercial zoning district. The

834
00:59:11,835 --> 00:59:14,771
adjacent properties to the west and the south are also within

835
00:59:14,771 --> 00:59:19,375
the LC zoning district. The gas station property to the east is

836
00:59:19,375 --> 00:59:24,514
within the R-3 zoning district, with a covenant to GC. The

837
00:59:24,514 --> 00:59:27,384
future land use designation of the subject site is limited.

838
00:59:27,384 --> 00:59:30,454
Commercial. The adjacent properties to the west and

839
00:59:30,454 --> 00:59:32,856
south are also within the limited commercial future land

840
00:59:32,856 --> 00:59:36,860
use designation. The gas station property to the east is

841
00:59:36,860 --> 00:59:42,132
within the general commercial future. Land use. The closest

842
00:59:42,132 --> 00:59:47,400
existing cell tower is 1.5 miles to the east. Located on

843
00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:52,542
the northern end of the South Fork High School property. The

844
00:59:52,542 --> 00:59:56,346
proposed 96th Street Tower is a 120 foot stealth design

845
00:59:56,346 --> 00:59:59,346
monoplane. Wireless telecommunications facility to

846
00:59:59,683 --> 01:00:02,885
accommodate four wireless carriers. It will be within a

847
01:00:02,885 --> 01:00:07,624
1600 square foot lease area within an overall 1.7 acre

848
01:00:07,624 --> 01:00:10,961
parent parcel. A separate application has been approved

849
01:00:10,961 --> 01:00:15,632
for the development of a one story, 9472 square foot

850
01:00:15,632 --> 01:00:18,702
convenience store retail building on the parent parcel.

851
01:00:18,702 --> 01:00:21,638
The tower relies on infrastructure that will be

852
01:00:21,638 --> 01:00:24,241
constructed as part of the development of the convenience

853
01:00:24,241 --> 01:00:28,911
store. The proposal complies with the requirements of

854
01:00:28,911 --> 01:00:32,480
Division 18, article four, Land Development Regulations. Martin

855
01:00:32,480 --> 01:00:34,851
County Code. There are no existing structures of

856
01:00:34,851 --> 01:00:37,787
sufficient height in the area, which could support co-location

857
01:00:37,787 --> 01:00:40,123
of antennas and provide equivalent improvements to

858
01:00:40,123 --> 01:00:43,860
service within a three quarter mile search ring. The subject

859
01:00:43,860 --> 01:00:48,531
property owners were the only responsive landowners based on

860
01:00:48,531 --> 01:00:51,670
coordination with information Technology Services, the

861
01:00:51,670 --> 01:00:53,536
Sheriff's department and emergency management. The

862
01:00:53,536 --> 01:00:56,600
proposed tower is not expected to interfere with existing

863
01:00:56,600 --> 01:00:58,406
public safety. Telecommunications facilities,

864
01:01:00,760 --> 01:01:02,412
as part of the application review process. Martin County

865
01:01:02,412 --> 01:01:05,148
retained an independent technical consultant for

866
01:01:05,148 --> 01:01:09,619
Unwired 4G. Unwired confirmed that no existing tower within a

867
01:01:09,619 --> 01:01:12,422
reasonable distance can provide equivalent improvements due to

868
01:01:12,422 --> 01:01:15,692
spacing constraints, height limitations, and propagation

869
01:01:15,692 --> 01:01:19,960
characteristics. 4G Unwired verified the proposed tower

870
01:01:19,960 --> 01:01:22,165
would materially improve service quality and reliability

871
01:01:22,165 --> 01:01:25,835
for users in this area of the county. We do have present with

872
01:01:25,835 --> 01:01:29,906
us today, Mr. Mark Nygren of 4G on Wired. He available to

873
01:01:29,906 --> 01:01:35,445
answer any technical questions. This is the proposed final site

874
01:01:35,445 --> 01:01:39,248
plan. The tower is located east of the proposed convenience

875
01:01:39,248 --> 01:01:42,721
store on the parcel. The tower relies on a driveway,

876
01:01:42,721 --> 01:01:45,657
stormwater facilities and landscaping that will be

877
01:01:45,657 --> 01:01:47,792
installed as part of the development of the convenience

878
01:01:47,792 --> 01:01:51,863
store. As part of the approved convenience store development

879
01:01:51,863 --> 01:01:55,000
order. There is also a preserve area established on the

880
01:01:55,000 --> 01:01:58,470
southern portion of the property. That area shown in

881
01:01:58,470 --> 01:02:05,700
the the hatching to the south of the convenience store. This

882
01:02:05,144 --> 01:02:12,944
is a profile view of the 120 foot mono pine cell tower. Is a

883
01:02:14,219 --> 01:02:16,822
photo simulation of the proposed tower as viewed from

884
01:02:16,822 --> 01:02:21,292
the adjacent property to the west. Just under 500ft west of

885
01:02:21,292 --> 01:02:25,897
the tower, there's another photo simulation as viewed from

886
01:02:25,897 --> 01:02:31,897
Kanner Highway, roughly 450ft south of the tower. And there's

887
01:02:32,504 --> 01:02:35,507
a photo simulation as viewed from Pratt Whitney Road,

888
01:02:35,507 --> 01:02:39,707
approaching the intersection with Kanner Highway. This

889
01:02:40,645 --> 01:02:42,915
application was heard before the local planning agency this

890
01:02:42,915 --> 01:02:47,185
past Thursday, August 6th. The LPA voted 4 to 0, recommending

891
01:02:47,185 --> 01:02:51,985
approval, with one member being absent. Development review

892
01:02:52,458 --> 01:02:55,127
staff have found the United Commercial Telecom application

893
01:02:55,127 --> 01:02:57,262
to comply with all applicable regulations in the

894
01:02:57,262 --> 01:02:59,998
Comprehensive Growth Management Plan, as detailed in the staff

895
01:02:59,998 --> 01:03:04,336
report. Staff recommendation is to move that the board receive

896
01:03:04,336 --> 01:03:07,720
and file the agenda item and its attachments, including the

897
01:03:07,720 --> 01:03:10,141
staff report, as exhibit one and move to the board. Adopt

898
01:03:10,141 --> 01:03:13,110
the resolution approving the final site plan for the

899
01:03:13,110 --> 01:03:16,681
southwest 96th Street Pine Tower project. That concludes

900
01:03:16,681 --> 01:03:20,881
my presentation. Questions for staff. Mr. Kamps.

901
01:03:23,621 --> 01:03:29,621
How tall are these towers? Usually, is this common? 120ft.

902
01:03:31,896 --> 01:03:35,633
I'd have to defer to the applicant for common heights,

903
01:03:35,633 --> 01:03:39,904
but this one is 120. And that's that's permitted per Division

904
01:03:39,904 --> 01:03:42,107
18 of our land development regulations. But I'm sure the

905
01:03:42,107 --> 01:03:45,777
applicant could could address that as well.

906
01:03:45,777 --> 01:03:49,581
Thanks. Is this a major or minor

907
01:03:49,581 --> 01:03:52,584
development? The tower application is a

908
01:03:52,584 --> 01:03:56,184
major. How about the development order

909
01:03:56,588 --> 01:04:00,192
for the convenience store? That was a minor development.

910
01:04:00,192 --> 01:04:02,794
And that was approved in January of this year.

911
01:04:02,794 --> 01:04:06,531
So that was approved by staff. Yes. That was a separate

912
01:04:06,531 --> 01:04:10,468
application that did not include the scope of the tower.

913
01:04:10,468 --> 01:04:14,139
That is the convenience store, the preserve area, stormwater

914
01:04:14,139 --> 01:04:17,139
facilities and parking and driveways.

915
01:04:17,142 --> 01:04:20,879
So if I'm not mistaken, there is an existing convenience

916
01:04:20,879 --> 01:04:24,348
store gas station that's next door.

917
01:04:24,348 --> 01:04:27,219
Next door on the adjacent property. Yes, to the east.

918
01:04:27,219 --> 01:04:33,692
How on earth do we permit these things next to each other?

919
01:04:33,692 --> 01:04:36,270
Paul Schilling, growth Management Director for the

920
01:04:36,270 --> 01:04:39,498
record. Thank you, Commissioner. Um, so there is a

921
01:04:39,498 --> 01:04:43,234
Sunoco fueling station on the corner. I believe that's the

922
01:04:43,234 --> 01:04:48,390
the brand name that includes a smaller convenience store. This

923
01:04:48,390 --> 01:04:52,643
project, as I recall, which I approved, was, um, potentially

924
01:04:52,643 --> 01:04:55,647
other commercial uses, meaning other retail, if I'm not

925
01:04:55,647 --> 01:05:00,452
mistaken. So it's not a it's not a whole wholly developed

926
01:05:00,452 --> 01:05:03,655
convenience store there. There will be other retail uses, such

927
01:05:03,655 --> 01:05:10,261
as a dry cleaner. Um, um, those types of uses. A mailbox place,

928
01:05:10,261 --> 01:05:15,610
something like that. Okay. And, um, this application

929
01:05:17,869 --> 01:05:23,269
is the tower separation setbacks and fall zone criteria

930
01:05:23,274 --> 01:05:26,478
of our land development regulations shall not apply to

931
01:05:26,478 --> 01:05:31,616
any stealth tower. Why not? That's the criteria. As you

932
01:05:31,616 --> 01:05:37,616
indicated within Division 18. So it would if it wasn't a

933
01:05:38,223 --> 01:05:43,161
stealth tower. Those the fall zone and setbacks and tower

934
01:05:43,161 --> 01:05:45,561
separations would apply. Correct.

935
01:05:48,834 --> 01:05:55,434
Can you explain why? I mean, just because it's disguised as

936
01:05:55,840 --> 01:06:00,712
a pine tree? Um, why is it not subject to fall zone

937
01:06:00,712 --> 01:06:04,116
protections? Uh, as John indicated, Paul

938
01:06:04,116 --> 01:06:07,585
Schilling for the record. So, as John indicated, Division 18

939
01:06:07,585 --> 01:06:11,560
guides this process of the land development regulations and has

940
01:06:11,560 --> 01:06:16,594
for many years. Um, so the stealth tower is the is the

941
01:06:16,594 --> 01:06:21,933
appearance of it. Um, the requirements for it to blend

942
01:06:21,933 --> 01:06:25,336
into the neighborhood, for lack of a better term, but also more

943
01:06:25,336 --> 01:06:28,940
importantly, is the engineering involved. Uh, the towers are

944
01:06:28,940 --> 01:06:32,100
engineered to, in essence, and I'm sure the applicant or

945
01:06:32,100 --> 01:06:35,800
consultant could talk about this, but our engineered to

946
01:06:35,800 --> 01:06:39,160
fall within their own footprint. So the footprint of

947
01:06:39,160 --> 01:06:42,420
that leased area or right around that area, as opposed to

948
01:06:42,420 --> 01:06:47,920
having guy wires and other components of a traditional

949
01:06:47,920 --> 01:06:51,960
radio antenna. So they are designed I'm not aware of the

950
01:06:51,960 --> 01:06:54,699
research I've done of any of these ever failing, but they

951
01:06:54,699 --> 01:06:58,570
have at times had some, um, issues, maybe with a branch or

952
01:06:58,570 --> 01:07:01,840
two that need to be replaced from time to time. But they are

953
01:07:01,840 --> 01:07:04,376
engineered substantially, and I'm sure the applicant could

954
01:07:04,376 --> 01:07:08,447
talk about that. But that's the essence of of the requirement.

955
01:07:08,447 --> 01:07:10,447
Okay. Thank you.

956
01:07:11,983 --> 01:07:16,183
Thank you. With the applicant, like to

957
01:07:22,527 --> 01:07:25,329
make a presentation. I'm happy to answer any

958
01:07:25,329 --> 01:07:27,466
questions. If you guys would like me to come up and answer

959
01:07:27,466 --> 01:07:30,668
at least. Okay. Sure. Tell us about the

960
01:07:30,668 --> 01:07:36,680
fall zone protections. My name is Kevin Wright. I'm

961
01:07:36,407 --> 01:07:39,144
the director of operations for United Commercial Telecom. And

962
01:07:39,144 --> 01:07:42,681
thank you for having me. Uh, so fall zone, first and foremost,

963
01:07:42,681 --> 01:07:46,618
Paul is correct. Uh, the towers are designed typically to

964
01:07:46,618 --> 01:07:51,106
collapse on themselves. They design a break point. So towers

965
01:07:51,106 --> 01:07:54,510
don't fall like this. They fall like this on top, on top of

966
01:07:54,510 --> 01:07:59,315
themselves, like he said. So. So that fall on for this

967
01:07:59,315 --> 01:08:02,118
particular tower would fall within the footprint of our

968
01:08:02,118 --> 01:08:04,987
lease area. That's the way they're designed nowadays. I

969
01:08:04,987 --> 01:08:07,456
mean, maybe back in the day before my time they weren't,

970
01:08:07,456 --> 01:08:11,193
but that most all towers are designed to collapse on

971
01:08:11,193 --> 01:08:14,793
themselves. Into a 1600 square foot lease.

972
01:08:17,467 --> 01:08:19,936
Correct. So they would have multiple break points on the

973
01:08:19,936 --> 01:08:25,274
tower that if a section were to fail, it would fold over onto

974
01:08:25,274 --> 01:08:30,740
the tower, not fall off to the side.

975
01:08:30,413 --> 01:08:38,213
Okay. And I see that there was a consultant who was hired to

976
01:08:39,822 --> 01:08:45,962
do the, um, I don't know what you call it. The. Yes. So who

977
01:08:45,962 --> 01:08:49,562
paid for that consultant. Mark Kent.

978
01:08:49,699 --> 01:08:52,968
Johnson, for the record. And that is being reimbursed by

979
01:08:52,968 --> 01:08:54,636
the. Yes. Have we been I see that there's

980
01:08:54,636 --> 01:08:57,840
an outstanding balance. Yes. That is we've been

981
01:08:57,840 --> 01:09:00,909
reimbursed for most of the balance. The outstanding

982
01:09:00,909 --> 01:09:04,847
balance is to have Mr. Seagram present with us today. That

983
01:09:04,847 --> 01:09:07,917
balance will be payable, uh, during the post approval

984
01:09:07,917 --> 01:09:11,320
process for this. Okay. Thank you. Any further

985
01:09:11,320 --> 01:09:16,120
questions? I wish it was an American flag.

986
01:09:16,392 --> 01:09:19,595
I wish it was an American flag. I think the pine trees, you

987
01:09:19,595 --> 01:09:21,397
know, I get that it's stealth, but I.

988
01:09:21,397 --> 01:09:24,397
Mean. They look like. cheap

989
01:09:25,935 --> 01:09:28,804
artificial Christmas trees. I guess the flag wouldn't be

990
01:09:28,804 --> 01:09:31,673
stealth. So then they'd have to. They'd have to fly with the

991
01:09:31,673 --> 01:09:34,610
fall zones. No, it's stealth as a cell

992
01:09:34,610 --> 01:09:38,347
phone tower. It's obviously like, for instance, in Palm

993
01:09:38,347 --> 01:09:41,830
City, they a long time ago, they put one on a church

994
01:09:41,830 --> 01:09:45,200
property and it was a cross. Yes, sir. Uh, I like, you know,

995
01:09:45,200 --> 01:09:48,958
obviously if you see a flag on a massive flagpole, you

996
01:09:48,958 --> 01:09:52,761
understand it's a cell phone tower. I just think. Or even

997
01:09:52,761 --> 01:09:54,964
the one that we have that's right around the corner over

998
01:09:54,964 --> 01:09:58,567
here is just a monopole. That's not stealth. I guess.

999
01:09:58,567 --> 01:10:01,103
That's itself. Is all internal, correct? Yes.

1000
01:10:01,103 --> 01:10:04,439
I just think that that sort of you just your eye erases that.

1001
01:10:04,439 --> 01:10:09,445
Whereas when you see these large artificial pine trees

1002
01:10:09,445 --> 01:10:12,581
that are way taller and I get why they have to be that tall

1003
01:10:12,581 --> 01:10:15,584
than the surrounding landscape, they just look sort of

1004
01:10:15,584 --> 01:10:19,188
ridiculous. But I guess that's falls within the definition of

1005
01:10:19,188 --> 01:10:22,258
stealth. I just like the concept of a really large

1006
01:10:22,258 --> 01:10:26,395
American flag would be more appropriate than a cheesy, for

1007
01:10:26,395 --> 01:10:28,798
lack of a better word. Uh, pine.

1008
01:10:28,798 --> 01:10:30,599
Tree. But that's just a personal

1009
01:10:30,599 --> 01:10:34,799
opinion and won't affect my decision making.

1010
01:10:35,270 --> 01:10:39,875
Mr. Capps. So, uh, the the 120 foot height

1011
01:10:39,875 --> 01:10:43,546
is a common height for such towers.

1012
01:10:43,546 --> 01:10:46,415
It is? Yes, sir. I mean, we we build them much taller than

1013
01:10:46,415 --> 01:10:51,153
that as well. Uh, 200 foot, uh, keeping it under the 200 foot

1014
01:10:51,153 --> 01:10:55,900
threshold keeps with the FAA from having to light the tower.

1015
01:10:55,900 --> 01:10:58,427
That's the requirement with the FAA. But also, if you're in a

1016
01:10:58,427 --> 01:11:01,764
flight plan, we would like the tower. We're not in this

1017
01:11:01,764 --> 01:11:06,234
particular area, but 120 foot is a standard, a standard

1018
01:11:06,234 --> 01:11:09,971
height pole in Florida, built a lot of towers in Florida. I've

1019
01:11:09,971 --> 01:11:13,308
built a lot, 120 foot poles in Florida. Yes, sir.

1020
01:11:13,308 --> 01:11:17,513
Okay. And I have one question. Broward County Attorney, how

1021
01:11:17,513 --> 01:11:22,184
this issue of of towers and Martin County has been an issue

1022
01:11:22,184 --> 01:11:26,722
in the past where people have wanted the county commission to

1023
01:11:26,722 --> 01:11:32,722
intervene and perhaps prevent a tower, uh, from being located

1024
01:11:32,728 --> 01:11:35,730
somewhere. I think there was one. And right in a

1025
01:11:35,730 --> 01:11:38,730
neighborhood that created a stir.

1026
01:11:39,670 --> 01:11:41,203
A sidewalk. So those towers are a little

1027
01:11:41,203 --> 01:11:44,500
bit different. Those are towers that are not even towers. Those

1028
01:11:44,500 --> 01:11:48,900
are, um, communications that are installed in our right of

1029
01:11:48,900 --> 01:11:51,747
way by like AT&T, a company, and they have the right to do

1030
01:11:51,747 --> 01:11:54,216
that. So we can't intervene in this. This is a different

1031
01:11:54,216 --> 01:11:59,880
situation. This is on private property and it's 120 foot

1032
01:11:59,880 --> 01:12:01,824
stealth tower. So it's a different situation. But when

1033
01:12:01,824 --> 01:12:05,270
the utility when the utility companies want to install in

1034
01:12:05,270 --> 01:12:07,290
our right of way, we don't have a say in that. That's the

1035
01:12:07,290 --> 01:12:09,832
circumstance that came up with the sidewalk with the residents

1036
01:12:09,832 --> 01:12:11,567
and their house. So it's a little bit of a different

1037
01:12:11,567 --> 01:12:13,302
situation. Okay.

1038
01:12:13,302 --> 01:12:17,390
So our level of discretion would just be the general

1039
01:12:17,390 --> 01:12:19,775
principles of judicial decisions. Competent,

1040
01:12:19,775 --> 01:12:21,777
substantial evidence in the record.

1041
01:12:21,777 --> 01:12:24,246
Correct. So we have land development regulations that

1042
01:12:24,246 --> 01:12:28,451
govern these towers. And as long as like any other site

1043
01:12:28,451 --> 01:12:31,854
plan, if they meet the land development regulations, then

1044
01:12:31,854 --> 01:12:34,390
ideally it would be approved based on the competent,

1045
01:12:34,390 --> 01:12:37,193
substantial evidence proven that they met those land

1046
01:12:37,193 --> 01:12:41,393
development regulations. Further questions. This is a

1047
01:12:43,199 --> 01:12:45,467
public hearing. Would anyone from the public like to address

1048
01:12:45,467 --> 01:12:49,805
us? Thank you. I don't see any back to the board. Or is there

1049
01:12:49,805 --> 01:12:52,805
a recommendation? Move staff's recommendation.

1050
01:12:59,348 --> 01:13:01,350
Second. There's a motion and a second.

1051
01:13:01,350 --> 01:13:06,210
All those in favor? I opposed that motion passes unanimously.

1052
01:13:06,210 --> 01:13:09,225
Thank you commissioners. Thank you. We will now move on

1053
01:13:09,225 --> 01:13:15,225
to, uh, department quasi judicial number one, which is a

1054
01:13:15,698 --> 01:13:18,900
article ten appeal consideration of an article ten

1055
01:13:18,900 --> 01:13:21,570
appeal by Corey Beaton regarding denial of building

1056
01:13:21,570 --> 01:13:26,442
permit number so-and-so for the construction of a single family

1057
01:13:26,442 --> 01:13:29,645
residence. This is quasi judicial. Commissioners.

1058
01:13:29,645 --> 01:13:33,245
Commissioner Vargas, any quasi judicial disclosures?

1059
01:13:33,582 --> 01:13:35,982
Ex-parte disclosures. Okay, okay.

1060
01:13:36,251 --> 01:13:39,655
Um, I do not have any that, uh, form has been filed.

1061
01:13:39,655 --> 01:13:42,191
Commissioner Capps. If I have any. They have been

1062
01:13:42,191 --> 01:13:43,992
filed. I don't have any. And they've

1063
01:13:43,992 --> 01:13:46,795
been filed. Commissioner Campi. I don't have any. And that's

1064
01:13:46,795 --> 01:13:48,264
been filed. Commissioner.

1065
01:13:48,264 --> 01:13:52,134
If any. They've been filed. All right.

1066
01:13:52,134 --> 01:13:55,134
Uh. Let's see. So, commissioners,

1067
01:13:55,471 --> 01:14:00,900
this is the, uh, procedure for this is unique. Um, follow

1068
01:14:00,900 --> 01:14:05,300
along on page 335. We will now have the summary of an

1069
01:14:05,300 --> 01:14:07,302
introduction of appeal by staff.

1070
01:14:07,302 --> 01:14:10,505
So, Commissioner, we need to have everybody sworn in first.

1071
01:14:10,505 --> 01:14:12,107
I don't think that's happened. Has it?

1072
01:14:12,107 --> 01:14:15,911
So I thought that we didn't have to have people sworn in

1073
01:14:15,911 --> 01:14:17,913
because we're not accepting any new evidence.

1074
01:14:17,913 --> 01:14:20,715
We're not accepting new evidence, but it would be ideal

1075
01:14:20,715 --> 01:14:22,985
to just wear it in for this, for the appeal, just in the

1076
01:14:22,985 --> 01:14:28,323
abundance of caution. So. Do you swear or affirm the

1077
01:14:28,323 --> 01:14:30,525
evidence you're about to give will be the truth, the whole

1078
01:14:30,525 --> 01:14:32,928
truth, and nothing but the truth. So help you God?

1079
01:14:32,928 --> 01:14:35,664
I do.. Okay, so, commissioners, um,

1080
01:14:35,664 --> 01:14:37,866
Elise Elder, County Attorney, I'm just going to give an

1081
01:14:37,866 --> 01:14:40,269
overview of this process. It doesn't come before the board

1082
01:14:40,269 --> 01:14:44,500
very often. This is an article 12. I mean, our article ten

1083
01:14:44,500 --> 01:14:47,543
appeal. What that means is Mr. Beaton filed for a building

1084
01:14:47,543 --> 01:14:51,880
permit. It was denied by staff. He appealed that decision to

1085
01:14:51,880 --> 01:14:55,217
the county administrator, who held an administrative review

1086
01:14:55,217 --> 01:14:59,421
meeting to go over the building permit. Mr. Beaton was given an

1087
01:14:59,421 --> 01:15:02,357
opportunity to speak and present his case at the

1088
01:15:02,357 --> 01:15:07,157
administrative review meeting. Mr. Donaldson, um, issued a

1089
01:15:07,362 --> 01:15:10,298
opinion or a ruling upholding the denial of the building

1090
01:15:10,298 --> 01:15:14,569
permit. Mr. Beaton appealed that decision to this board. So

1091
01:15:14,569 --> 01:15:17,639
your your view today or your role today is a little bit

1092
01:15:17,639 --> 01:15:20,975
limited. As Commissioner Heard said, that there are quasi

1093
01:15:20,975 --> 01:15:24,450
judicial procedures in the agenda item. So what happens is

1094
01:15:24,450 --> 01:15:27,480
I'm giving you this quick overview. Mr. Beaton will have

1095
01:15:27,480 --> 01:15:31,253
20 minutes to present his case. Once he is done, the board will

1096
01:15:31,253 --> 01:15:35,323
have the opportunity to ask him questions. Once the questions

1097
01:15:35,323 --> 01:15:38,260
are over, staff will have an opportunity to present their

1098
01:15:38,260 --> 01:15:42,931
case. We will have 20 minutes. Um, the board can, um, ask

1099
01:15:42,931 --> 01:15:46,670
questions of staff, and then you deliberate and make a

1100
01:15:46,670 --> 01:15:51,600
ruling. So just to point out that the standard for your

1101
01:15:51,600 --> 01:15:55,476
review is limited. So the three questions you need to decide is

1102
01:15:55,476 --> 01:15:58,130
whether the county administrator accorded

1103
01:15:58,130 --> 01:16:02,170
procedural due process, whether the county administrator

1104
01:16:02,170 --> 01:16:05,860
adhered to the essential requirements of law, and

1105
01:16:05,860 --> 01:16:07,889
whether the final action by the county administrator was based

1106
01:16:07,889 --> 01:16:11,559
on competent, substantial evidence in the agenda item.

1107
01:16:11,559 --> 01:16:16,970
Those three different areas are defined so the procedural due

1108
01:16:16,970 --> 01:16:18,700
process just means that the board must decide whether the

1109
01:16:18,700 --> 01:16:21,769
county administrator's review of the building permit was

1110
01:16:21,769 --> 01:16:24,639
conducted fairly and impartially, according to all

1111
01:16:24,639 --> 01:16:27,976
of our land development regulations and our procedures,

1112
01:16:27,976 --> 01:16:31,113
to see if the essential requirements of law were filed,

1113
01:16:31,113 --> 01:16:35,450
the board must decide whether the Mr. Donaldson applied the

1114
01:16:35,450 --> 01:16:38,587
correct provisions of the applicable law and code when

1115
01:16:38,587 --> 01:16:42,190
making his decision, including state statute and the Land

1116
01:16:42,190 --> 01:16:45,860
Development Regulations and the county's code, and he did not

1117
01:16:45,860 --> 01:16:49,131
abuse his legal authority in the process, and the final

1118
01:16:49,131 --> 01:16:53,000
determination is whether the decision is based on competent,

1119
01:16:53,000 --> 01:16:57,338
substantial evidence that Mr. Donaldson received during the

1120
01:16:57,338 --> 01:17:00,609
Administrative Review hearing. Um, that's the board's

1121
01:17:00,609 --> 01:17:03,478
standard. So if you don't have any questions, we can have Mr.

1122
01:17:03,478 --> 01:17:07,215
Beaton come up and give his initial, uh.

1123
01:17:07,215 --> 01:17:10,285
Side questions for Miss Elder before we turn it over to Mr.

1124
01:17:10,285 --> 01:17:12,285
Beaton. Please. Okay.

1125
01:17:13,755 --> 01:17:16,891
Miss elder, so based on what you just told us, we are

1126
01:17:16,891 --> 01:17:20,162
deciding on those three criteria, not necessarily on

1127
01:17:20,162 --> 01:17:24,365
whether or not we feel that it's a legitimate project.

1128
01:17:24,365 --> 01:17:27,636
Correct. So you're not supposed to sub your substitute your

1129
01:17:27,636 --> 01:17:30,638
decision for the county administrator. If he made his

1130
01:17:30,638 --> 01:17:33,174
decision based on evidence presented at the review

1131
01:17:33,174 --> 01:17:35,977
meeting, you should uphold it. Even though there might be

1132
01:17:35,977 --> 01:17:40,449
evidence on the other side to substantiate Mr. Beaton's side

1133
01:17:40,449 --> 01:17:44,652
of the story. As long as Mr. Donaldson's was decided based

1134
01:17:44,652 --> 01:17:48,590
on the competent, substantial evidence, your role is to

1135
01:17:48,590 --> 01:17:51,859
uphold that, not to substitute your judgment for his. So

1136
01:17:51,859 --> 01:17:53,528
that's the standard in an appeal.

1137
01:17:53,528 --> 01:17:57,532
So, in other words, to decide if we felt that the technical

1138
01:17:57,532 --> 01:18:01,602
process was followed correctly. Yes. And there was evidence to

1139
01:18:01,602 --> 01:18:03,738
support his name. Not if we agree that it was a

1140
01:18:03,738 --> 01:18:05,673
good project or a bad project. Correct?

1141
01:18:05,673 --> 01:18:11,730
Correct. Final question. What would the applicant's, uh. What

1142
01:18:12,213 --> 01:18:15,817
could he do if he's unhappy? What's the recourse of based on

1143
01:18:15,817 --> 01:18:18,286
today's decision? Is there no. What's the next step in the

1144
01:18:18,286 --> 01:18:20,688
process for him. To follow up? Probably file a

1145
01:18:20,688 --> 01:18:24,158
lawsuit. If he was, if he chose to, um, to appeal your

1146
01:18:24,158 --> 01:18:26,558
decision, basically. Thank you.

1147
01:18:27,896 --> 01:18:31,700
Commissioner Vargas. So, um, and I understand

1148
01:18:31,700 --> 01:18:34,836
everything you've said, and I've looked at this before I

1149
01:18:34,836 --> 01:18:38,907
came to this meeting and had a lot of questions. So in the

1150
01:18:38,907 --> 01:18:43,178
event that the applicant is unhappy, file a lawsuit against

1151
01:18:43,178 --> 01:18:45,513
whom? The county. They would file a

1152
01:18:45,513 --> 01:18:49,251
lawsuit challenging the denial of a building permit with, um,

1153
01:18:49,251 --> 01:18:52,720
the circuit court. Okay. It was my understanding

1154
01:18:52,720 --> 01:18:55,724
that he can get a building permit. However, there's a

1155
01:18:55,724 --> 01:19:01,930
little bit difference in so far as the land mass he was going

1156
01:19:01,930 --> 01:19:05,600
to be building on. And it has to do with something dealing

1157
01:19:05,600 --> 01:19:11,473
with the, uh, regulations going back to the 1980s. Is this

1158
01:19:11,473 --> 01:19:13,475
correct? So he was denied a building

1159
01:19:13,475 --> 01:19:16,411
permit, so he cannot build any house at this time. And that is

1160
01:19:16,411 --> 01:19:19,815
what he's appealing. And he will provide you with his his

1161
01:19:19,815 --> 01:19:22,751
facts. And then we'll give you the county side.

1162
01:19:22,751 --> 01:19:28,222
So now we take what the vote dealing with Mr. Donaldson's.

1163
01:19:28,222 --> 01:19:29,690
At the end of. The activity.

1164
01:19:29,690 --> 01:19:32,427
Okay. At the end of this meeting, this agenda item,

1165
01:19:32,427 --> 01:19:36,270
you'll vote. Mr. Beaton, you'll have 20

1166
01:19:38,967 --> 01:19:41,969
minutes to to, uh, talk with us.

1167
01:19:41,969 --> 01:19:44,238
All. Good morning. Good morning.

1168
01:19:44,238 --> 01:19:45,774
Morning, chair and commissioners. Uh, my name is

1169
01:19:45,774 --> 01:19:49,578
Corey Beaton. I'm the appellant and the property owner at 18250

1170
01:19:49,578 --> 01:19:52,914
Southeast Box at River road, Jupiter, Florida. Um, just want

1171
01:19:52,914 --> 01:19:55,850
to thank you guys for your time and the opportunity to be here

1172
01:19:55,850 --> 01:20:00,588
today. Um, what I'm asking is for the board to reverse the

1173
01:20:00,588 --> 01:20:04,590
county administrator's decision, uh, and the denial of

1174
01:20:04,590 --> 01:20:08,263
my building permit application. So, uh, before I explain how we

1175
01:20:08,263 --> 01:20:10,399
got here, I think it's critically important to

1176
01:20:10,399 --> 01:20:13,936
identify and define what this case is and what it is not. Um,

1177
01:20:13,936 --> 01:20:17,606
this is not title action. I hold recorded title to the

1178
01:20:17,606 --> 01:20:20,810
property contained within my legal description. If another

1179
01:20:20,810 --> 01:20:24,213
party believes it has a competing ownership interest,

1180
01:20:24,213 --> 01:20:28,830
there's a judicial process for resolving that dispute. This

1181
01:20:28,830 --> 01:20:32,221
administrative appeal is not that process. Um, the questions

1182
01:20:32,221 --> 01:20:35,558
before this board are much narrower. Miss elder, uh, kind

1183
01:20:35,558 --> 01:20:37,560
of explained them. It's it's whether I was afforded

1184
01:20:37,560 --> 01:20:41,290
procedural due process, whether the county administrator

1185
01:20:41,290 --> 01:20:44,165
observed the essential requirements of law. And was

1186
01:20:44,165 --> 01:20:47,235
the decision supported by competent, substantial evidence

1187
01:20:47,235 --> 01:20:49,971
contained in the record. And I respectfully submit that the

1188
01:20:49,971 --> 01:20:53,709
answer to all three of those is no. Um, so I'd like to start

1189
01:20:53,709 --> 01:20:57,450
with kind of how we got here. Uh, before I purchased this

1190
01:20:57,450 --> 01:20:59,470
property, I contacted the Martin County Zoning

1191
01:20:59,470 --> 01:21:03,452
Department. My point of contact was Amy Offenbach. Um, I had

1192
01:21:03,452 --> 01:21:06,721
extensive conversations with Miss Offenbach, and at the

1193
01:21:06,721 --> 01:21:09,591
time, the property appraiser was showing the property to be

1194
01:21:09,591 --> 01:21:15,330
1.69 acres. Uh, the property boundary line had been moved to

1195
01:21:15,330 --> 01:21:18,733
the mean high water line. Um, contrary to what the legal

1196
01:21:18,733 --> 01:21:21,470
description actually called for, the boundary of the

1197
01:21:21,470 --> 01:21:25,607
property extends into the water. Um, so she explained

1198
01:21:25,607 --> 01:21:29,544
that a one zoning required two acres and that the acreage

1199
01:21:29,544 --> 01:21:31,880
discrepancy needed to be addressed. She gave me a

1200
01:21:31,880 --> 01:21:34,549
roadmap of everything that I would need to do before I

1201
01:21:34,549 --> 01:21:38,954
purchased the property. And, um, I performed extensive due

1202
01:21:38,954 --> 01:21:41,690
diligence before I, before I actually bought it, I hired a

1203
01:21:41,690 --> 01:21:45,761
professional license surveyor. I retained legal counsel, and I

1204
01:21:45,761 --> 01:21:49,231
researched the the property's history and chain of title. I

1205
01:21:49,231 --> 01:21:51,833
went through a lot of old documents and documentation on

1206
01:21:51,833 --> 01:21:54,302
it, and figured out exactly how it came to be and why it was

1207
01:21:54,302 --> 01:21:57,706
what it was. Um, so I specifically asked her if I'm

1208
01:21:57,706 --> 01:22:00,420
able to get the property boundary moved back out to its

1209
01:22:00,420 --> 01:22:03,111
rightful location, and the property appraiser then

1210
01:22:03,111 --> 01:22:07,182
reflects two acres, will that suffice? And she said yes. So

1211
01:22:07,182 --> 01:22:10,385
at the same time, I was closely watching a neighboring property

1212
01:22:10,385 --> 01:22:13,856
who was going through the permitting process. Um, his

1213
01:22:13,856 --> 01:22:17,459
property was strikingly similar to mine. It was 1.7 acres of

1214
01:22:17,459 --> 01:22:20,929
dry land and it was two acres total. It was also a non-legal

1215
01:22:20,929 --> 01:22:24,199
lot of record, and he had applied for a building permit.

1216
01:22:24,199 --> 01:22:29,204
Um, ultimately, the county approved his permit. So, uh,

1217
01:22:29,204 --> 01:22:33,800
this was not an isolated incident. Uh, instant. There

1218
01:22:33,800 --> 01:22:36,278
was three other properties within the same neighborhood

1219
01:22:36,278 --> 01:22:38,880
that the county staff had approved development on, under

1220
01:22:38,880 --> 01:22:42,951
the same exact circumstances. The first was in 1984, two

1221
01:22:42,951 --> 01:22:45,554
years after the comp plan. The people that knew it better than

1222
01:22:45,554 --> 01:22:51,554
anyone else, um, than another in 2016, and then this 1 in

1223
01:22:51,560 --> 01:22:54,562
2023. The county staff has now attempted to dismiss all of

1224
01:22:54,562 --> 01:22:56,765
those approvals by characterizing all of them as

1225
01:22:56,765 --> 01:23:03,365
mistakes. Um, but I feel that 40 years of county action, um,

1226
01:23:03,505 --> 01:23:06,775
does not erase those approvals. Those happen. These were

1227
01:23:06,775 --> 01:23:09,845
separate properties, separate applications, separate county

1228
01:23:09,845 --> 01:23:14,490
reviews and and separate growth management staff that that

1229
01:23:14,490 --> 01:23:18,187
reviewed these, um, most importantly, the most recent

1230
01:23:18,187 --> 01:23:22,391
and comparable property was actively being permitted while

1231
01:23:22,391 --> 01:23:25,660
I was performing my due diligence on this property. So

1232
01:23:25,660 --> 01:23:28,731
from everything reasonably available to me, uh, the county

1233
01:23:28,731 --> 01:23:31,733
staff guidance, the surveying, the appraisal records, the

1234
01:23:31,733 --> 01:23:34,200
historical county approvals, and a neighboring building

1235
01:23:34,200 --> 01:23:37,939
permit actively being built, I had every reason to believe

1236
01:23:37,939 --> 01:23:40,809
this property was buildable. I relied upon that information

1237
01:23:40,809 --> 01:23:44,813
when I purchased this property, and after closing, I presented

1238
01:23:44,813 --> 01:23:47,149
all of my evidence to the property appraiser and was able

1239
01:23:47,149 --> 01:23:50,218
to get the boundary moved back out to its rightful location,

1240
01:23:50,218 --> 01:23:53,889
which then reflected that the property was 2.01 acres, uh,

1241
01:23:53,889 --> 01:23:57,920
exceeding the two acre requirement. I contacted miss,

1242
01:23:57,920 --> 01:24:01,630
uh, Miss Offenbach. I contacted her back. Uh, I presented her

1243
01:24:01,630 --> 01:24:04,299
with everything. She confirmed that, yes, the property on her

1244
01:24:04,299 --> 01:24:06,568
end was now shown two acres. She confirmed that a single

1245
01:24:06,568 --> 01:24:09,170
family residence, uh, that I was eligible to put a single

1246
01:24:09,170 --> 01:24:12,775
family residence on the property. And, um, at my

1247
01:24:12,775 --> 01:24:17,246
request, she followed up in writing, defining, um, the

1248
01:24:17,246 --> 01:24:19,981
applicable zoning and setback requirements, and did verify

1249
01:24:19,981 --> 01:24:23,785
that a single family residence was an allowable use for this

1250
01:24:23,785 --> 01:24:28,523
property. So as a landowner, I that was it. I had everything

1251
01:24:28,523 --> 01:24:33,610
that I needed to to proceed with development. Um, I relied

1252
01:24:33,610 --> 01:24:36,598
upon that representation. I hired an architect, I hired

1253
01:24:36,598 --> 01:24:40,135
engineers, I got environmental studies, done, surveys, site

1254
01:24:40,135 --> 01:24:44,720
plans, core borings, uh, soil samples, testing everything

1255
01:24:44,720 --> 01:24:47,409
that was needed to prepare a building application. I spent

1256
01:24:47,409 --> 01:24:52,130
tens of thousands of dollars. I sold a ton of assets off a

1257
01:24:52,130 --> 01:24:54,750
truck, tractor buggies, farm equipment, vacant land,

1258
01:24:54,750 --> 01:24:56,952
everything to make sure I would have enough funding to finance

1259
01:24:56,952 --> 01:25:01,156
this build. Uh, ultimately, I sold my home that my family had

1260
01:25:01,156 --> 01:25:04,760
lived in for 15 years. Uh, to make sure we'd have enough

1261
01:25:04,760 --> 01:25:08,563
money to build this house. Um, sacrifice. That's what I told

1262
01:25:08,563 --> 01:25:11,700
my wife. It'll all be worth it in the end. Uh, you know, we'll

1263
01:25:11,700 --> 01:25:14,169
be able to build on this, and it's going to be all worth it.

1264
01:25:14,169 --> 01:25:16,838
Um, these were enormous decisions that I made, but I

1265
01:25:16,838 --> 01:25:19,441
made them because I had done my due diligence. I relied upon

1266
01:25:19,441 --> 01:25:22,778
the information, uh, that was available to me, including the

1267
01:25:22,778 --> 01:25:26,181
information that Martin County staff gave me. So fast forward

1268
01:25:26,181 --> 01:25:31,987
several months. Um, I submit my permit application. Uh, the

1269
01:25:31,987 --> 01:25:34,389
review process was moving forward, and then a staff

1270
01:25:34,389 --> 01:25:38,600
comment was added to my building, uh, file that said

1271
01:25:38,600 --> 01:25:44,600
lot size incorrect. Uh, staff cited comp plan policy 4.14 and

1272
01:25:44,650 --> 01:25:46,100
took the position that the submerged portion of the

1273
01:25:46,100 --> 01:25:48,137
property could not be counted towards the two acre

1274
01:25:48,137 --> 01:25:52,407
requirement. Uh, I discussed this extensively with staff and

1275
01:25:52,407 --> 01:25:56,945
with senior Assistant County Attorney Sebastian Fox. Um, Mr.

1276
01:25:56,945 --> 01:26:00,148
Fox made it very clear we're not disputing your property

1277
01:26:00,148 --> 01:26:03,218
boundary. We're not disputing the fact that you have. And you

1278
01:26:03,218 --> 01:26:05,754
own a two acre tract of land. We're just saying that because

1279
01:26:05,754 --> 01:26:09,158
of this policy, you can't use the submerged land portions of

1280
01:26:09,158 --> 01:26:16,970
it. So the problem was, is policy 4.14 does not say that I

1281
01:26:16,970 --> 01:26:20,102
can't use my submerged lands. It specifically defines exactly

1282
01:26:20,102 --> 01:26:24,374
a boundary. The boundary line, as where the submerged lands be

1283
01:26:24,374 --> 01:26:26,910
excluded. And that's to stop people from being able to use

1284
01:26:26,910 --> 01:26:30,914
riparian rights and try to claim land that's not theirs.

1285
01:26:30,914 --> 01:26:34,851
Um, that was the basis for the permit denial that that is

1286
01:26:34,851 --> 01:26:39,321
consistent on the conditions report. Um, that's precisely

1287
01:26:39,321 --> 01:26:42,192
why I filed the article ten appeal, because I needed Mr.

1288
01:26:42,192 --> 01:26:46,462
Donaldson to look at policy 4.1 for the actual reason the

1289
01:26:46,462 --> 01:26:49,132
permit was denied. Based upon the facts and the evidence that

1290
01:26:49,132 --> 01:26:52,669
was available at the time of permit denial. Uh, Miss Elder

1291
01:26:52,669 --> 01:26:55,472
stated that it's based upon the evidence presented in the

1292
01:26:55,472 --> 01:26:59,475
hearing. It is not an article ten appeal is specific. It's

1293
01:26:59,475 --> 01:27:04,130
the facts that we're in the in the the facts in the evidence

1294
01:27:04,130 --> 01:27:08,217
established at the exact time of permit denial. Um, his job

1295
01:27:08,217 --> 01:27:11,870
is to put himself in the shoes of the decision maker that had

1296
01:27:11,870 --> 01:27:13,757
the information available to look at it and figure out if

1297
01:27:13,757 --> 01:27:17,627
they made the right decision. But that unfortunately, policy

1298
01:27:17,627 --> 01:27:22,965
4.14, that question was never decided. Instead, the basis for

1299
01:27:22,965 --> 01:27:28,238
the denial changed. Uh, and this transformed into, uh, that

1300
01:27:28,238 --> 01:27:31,841
I hadn't conclusively established ownership of the

1301
01:27:31,841 --> 01:27:35,441
submerged portion of my parcel. Um.

1302
01:27:36,312 --> 01:27:39,716
At that time, the record included my recorded legal

1303
01:27:39,716 --> 01:27:43,786
description and unbroken chain of title extending more than 60

1304
01:27:43,786 --> 01:27:47,560
years. Two professional boundary surveys, not one, but

1305
01:27:47,560 --> 01:27:49,726
two professional licensed surveyors that are authorized

1306
01:27:49,726 --> 01:27:53,663
to conduct boundary surveys in this state. Uh, a letter from

1307
01:27:53,663 --> 01:27:57,333
my survey or written statement, uh, reiterating that this is my

1308
01:27:57,333 --> 01:28:00,536
property, uh, property appraiser records that are

1309
01:28:00,536 --> 01:28:04,206
recognizing is it a two as a 2.01 acre parcel? Decades of

1310
01:28:04,206 --> 01:28:06,809
taxation and historical evidence concerning the

1311
01:28:06,809 --> 01:28:09,545
property. Yet the administrator's decision

1312
01:28:09,545 --> 01:28:14,160
states, and I quote, following the administrative review

1313
01:28:14,160 --> 01:28:17,220
meeting, the county received confirmation from the state of

1314
01:28:17,220 --> 01:28:20,423
Florida that it claims ownership of the submerged

1315
01:28:20,423 --> 01:28:25,495
lands in question. Those five words are extremely important.

1316
01:28:25,495 --> 01:28:28,231
Following the administrative review hearing, the

1317
01:28:28,231 --> 01:28:31,634
administrator then relied upon that information to conclude

1318
01:28:31,634 --> 01:28:34,503
that I did not own the submerged lands and declared

1319
01:28:34,503 --> 01:28:38,241
the other issues of remaining the other remaining issues

1320
01:28:38,241 --> 01:28:42,912
moot. Um, the administrator never decided the issue that I

1321
01:28:42,912 --> 01:28:46,850
actually appealed. I was never given a meaningful opportunity

1322
01:28:46,850 --> 01:28:49,519
to examine or respond to the new information upon which

1323
01:28:49,519 --> 01:28:53,857
decision upon which that decision was based. The basis

1324
01:28:53,857 --> 01:28:57,794
for a governmental decision cannot become a moving target

1325
01:28:57,794 --> 01:29:02,399
after a hearing is over. Uh, that is a due process problem.

1326
01:29:02,399 --> 01:29:05,802
I had requested Miss Amy Offenbach be present during the

1327
01:29:05,802 --> 01:29:08,338
administrative review hearing. She was my point of contact at

1328
01:29:08,338 --> 01:29:10,607
the county. She knew this better than anyone else. She's

1329
01:29:10,607 --> 01:29:14,477
who I dealt with primarily. I was told by Miss Elder that the

1330
01:29:14,477 --> 01:29:17,747
administrative review process is limited to the county

1331
01:29:17,747 --> 01:29:20,150
administrator, the county attorney, and the growth

1332
01:29:20,150 --> 01:29:24,487
management director. And Miss Amy Offenbach would not be

1333
01:29:24,487 --> 01:29:28,910
present. And she wasn't. And instead, this county

1334
01:29:28,910 --> 01:29:30,360
substituted and didn't abide by their own code and brought

1335
01:29:30,360 --> 01:29:33,162
three extra people into the administrative review hearing

1336
01:29:33,162 --> 01:29:36,299
that had no business being there. That all had input, and

1337
01:29:36,299 --> 01:29:40,704
I was deprived of my procedural due process rights. Um, now the

1338
01:29:40,704 --> 01:29:44,306
essential requirements of law, the administrator was to review

1339
01:29:44,306 --> 01:29:47,443
the facts established at the time of denial. I presented a

1340
01:29:47,443 --> 01:29:51,514
recorded deed in a legal description, a chain of title

1341
01:29:51,514 --> 01:29:54,918
two boundary surveyors, a surveyors written statement,

1342
01:29:54,918 --> 01:29:57,987
property appraiser and tax records and historical evidence

1343
01:29:57,987 --> 01:30:01,657
concerning the property. So what legal authority authorized

1344
01:30:01,657 --> 01:30:05,261
the administrator to disregard this evidence? I found nothing

1345
01:30:05,261 --> 01:30:08,531
in article ten or Martin County Code or applicable law that

1346
01:30:08,531 --> 01:30:11,334
authorizes the county administrator while reviewing a

1347
01:30:11,334 --> 01:30:14,603
building permit denial to disregard those documents and

1348
01:30:14,603 --> 01:30:19,403
substitute an adjudicated ownership claim in his place.

1349
01:30:19,675 --> 01:30:23,480
He is he is not to adjudicate, completing competing claims of

1350
01:30:23,480 --> 01:30:26,950
real to real property. He is not authorized to disregard my

1351
01:30:26,950 --> 01:30:29,953
recorded title and professional surveys, and he is not

1352
01:30:29,953 --> 01:30:33,890
authorized to obtain new information. After the

1353
01:30:33,890 --> 01:30:36,359
administrative review meeting and use it against me without

1354
01:30:36,359 --> 01:30:39,295
an opportunity to respond. So the essential requirements of

1355
01:30:39,295 --> 01:30:44,434
law were not afforded to me as far as Depp's claim, uh, at

1356
01:30:44,434 --> 01:30:49,305
some point I just have to say this plainly. Uh, an

1357
01:30:49,305 --> 01:30:52,241
administrative building permit appeal is not a quiet title

1358
01:30:52,241 --> 01:30:57,113
action. I don't care what Depp claims to own. A claim is not

1359
01:30:57,113 --> 01:31:01,584
title. A claim is not evidence of conveyance, and a claim is

1360
01:31:01,584 --> 01:31:05,455
certainly not a court judgment. I hold the recorded title. I

1361
01:31:05,455 --> 01:31:08,591
have the legal description. I have an unbroken chain of title

1362
01:31:08,591 --> 01:31:11,661
spanning more than 60 years. I have boundary surveys and I

1363
01:31:11,661 --> 01:31:15,598
have Martin County has assessed and taxed this property and

1364
01:31:15,598 --> 01:31:18,468
treated it as buildable for decades. The county has

1365
01:31:18,468 --> 01:31:23,268
collected $269,000 on this property in the last 25 years,

1366
01:31:24,140 --> 01:31:26,810
and are going to try to say that it's unbelievable. I don't

1367
01:31:26,810 --> 01:31:31,414
think that that is fair. Yet somehow my entire interest in

1368
01:31:31,414 --> 01:31:34,217
this property is supposed to just disappear because Depp is

1369
01:31:34,217 --> 01:31:38,755
making a claim. I think everyone understands that

1370
01:31:38,755 --> 01:31:42,292
sometimes government agencies can be wrong. And I think

1371
01:31:42,292 --> 01:31:46,228
Jonathan Dickinson was a great example of that. With Depp. Um,

1372
01:31:46,228 --> 01:31:49,298
everyone remembers what happened there. Uh, Depp is not

1373
01:31:49,298 --> 01:31:52,701
a court. Martin County is not a court. And this article ten

1374
01:31:52,701 --> 01:31:59,301
proceeding is not quite title action. Um, if Depp believes it

1375
01:31:59,975 --> 01:32:02,779
owns property contained within my recorded legal description,

1376
01:32:02,779 --> 01:32:05,848
then they have every right to bring that claim into a proper

1377
01:32:05,848 --> 01:32:08,717
judicial forum and prove it. There's a process for that. But

1378
01:32:08,717 --> 01:32:11,530
until that happens, I'm not going to voluntarily surrender

1379
01:32:11,530 --> 01:32:13,990
my property that I purchased. I physically purchased this

1380
01:32:13,990 --> 01:32:18,728
property with my own money. I pay taxes on it, and it's been

1381
01:32:18,728 --> 01:32:22,650
delineated by a surveyor to to show his mine. And if they have

1382
01:32:22,650 --> 01:32:24,333
an issue with that, then there's there's another avenue

1383
01:32:24,333 --> 01:32:27,803
for that. But this, this proceeding is not that. So most

1384
01:32:27,803 --> 01:32:33,803
importantly, uh, the reason for today's appeal, um, this was

1385
01:32:34,829 --> 01:32:39,700
not the reason that the permit was even denied. Mr. Donaldson

1386
01:32:39,700 --> 01:32:42,637
violated the essential requirements of law by relying

1387
01:32:42,637 --> 01:32:45,974
upon post hearing information, disregarding my legal

1388
01:32:45,974 --> 01:32:48,242
description and boundary survey, and attempting to

1389
01:32:48,242 --> 01:32:51,460
adjudicate title to lands which is well beyond his legal

1390
01:32:51,460 --> 01:32:54,449
authority. And in an administrative hearing. Um,

1391
01:32:54,449 --> 01:32:58,186
finally, as far as competent, substantial evidence during the

1392
01:32:58,186 --> 01:33:01,857
administrative review, there were references to state TIF

1393
01:33:01,857 --> 01:33:05,927
deeds, leases and other documents, supposedly in the

1394
01:33:05,927 --> 01:33:10,465
record are supposedly, uh, that have been recorded. Not a

1395
01:33:10,465 --> 01:33:13,668
single document establishing that the state owns the

1396
01:33:13,668 --> 01:33:15,937
property contained within my legal description was

1397
01:33:15,937 --> 01:33:19,474
introduced for me to examine or rebut. Not a single document.

1398
01:33:19,474 --> 01:33:22,277
The documentary documentary evidence before the

1399
01:33:22,277 --> 01:33:25,346
administrator supporting my position included my deed,

1400
01:33:25,346 --> 01:33:27,816
legal description, chain of title, survey, surveyor

1401
01:33:27,816 --> 01:33:31,850
statement, property appraiser records, tax records,

1402
01:33:31,850 --> 01:33:33,889
historical evidence, and decades of county treatment of

1403
01:33:33,889 --> 01:33:38,930
similar situated properties. That was the actual evidence. I

1404
01:33:38,930 --> 01:33:41,229
was not presented with a single piece of evidence to say

1405
01:33:41,229 --> 01:33:44,310
otherwise. I public record requested any emails or

1406
01:33:44,310 --> 01:33:47,101
correspondence that Mr. Donaldson had with Depp.

1407
01:33:47,101 --> 01:33:50,772
Following the administrative review process. There was none.

1408
01:33:50,772 --> 01:33:55,310
He relied upon a verbal claim to make his decision. That is

1409
01:33:55,310 --> 01:33:59,510
not substantial evidence whatsoever. In conclusion, I'm

1410
01:34:02,517 --> 01:34:04,919
not asking for special treatment. I'm asking for the

1411
01:34:04,919 --> 01:34:07,522
code to be interpreted and applied to my property the same

1412
01:34:07,522 --> 01:34:10,570
way it's been applied for the last four decades in this

1413
01:34:10,570 --> 01:34:14,529
county. The permit was denied based upon policy 4.14. The

1414
01:34:14,529 --> 01:34:17,332
administrator never decided whether that interpretation was

1415
01:34:17,332 --> 01:34:21,403
correct. The citizens must be able to rely upon the recorded

1416
01:34:21,403 --> 01:34:25,300
deeds, legal descriptions, boundary surveys, property

1417
01:34:25,540 --> 01:34:29,211
records, and decades of taxation. Unless a court of

1418
01:34:29,211 --> 01:34:32,211
competent jurisdiction determines otherwise. Think

1419
01:34:33,348 --> 01:34:36,350
about what an alternative means. If somebody can simply

1420
01:34:36,350 --> 01:34:39,420
make a claim against property that a citizen holds recorded

1421
01:34:39,420 --> 01:34:43,157
title to, and has paid taxes on for decades, and the county can

1422
01:34:43,157 --> 01:34:45,961
disregard that citizens deed and surveys merely because of

1423
01:34:45,961 --> 01:34:49,310
that claim, then what exactly does property ownership mean in

1424
01:34:49,310 --> 01:34:54,703
Martin County? I'm asking to build a single family home on

1425
01:34:54,703 --> 01:34:58,907
my own property. For my family, my property surrounded on three

1426
01:34:58,907 --> 01:35:04,307
sides by four houses. I respectfully asked this board

1427
01:35:05,113 --> 01:35:07,490
to reverse the county administrator's decision,

1428
01:35:07,490 --> 01:35:09,651
reverse the permit denial, and direct staff to process my

1429
01:35:09,651 --> 01:35:12,187
building permit consistent with the property's recorded legal

1430
01:35:12,187 --> 01:35:15,323
description and the applicable provisions of the Martin County

1431
01:35:15,323 --> 01:35:19,527
Comp Plan and Land Development Regulations. Thank you. Any

1432
01:35:19,527 --> 01:35:21,329
questions? Thank you. Questions for Mr.

1433
01:35:21,329 --> 01:35:23,465
Beaton. We'll have to ask him.

1434
01:35:23,465 --> 01:35:29,465
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you sir. Um, just as an

1435
01:35:30,338 --> 01:35:32,474
aside, what do you do for a living?

1436
01:35:32,474 --> 01:35:34,474
Uh, firefighter. Interesting.

1437
01:35:34,743 --> 01:35:39,748
You did a nice presentation. Uh, second question. Um, am I

1438
01:35:39,748 --> 01:35:42,683
allowed to just generally ask questions just for background?

1439
01:35:42,683 --> 01:35:44,886
Like, what did you pay for your property and when did you

1440
01:35:44,886 --> 01:35:47,822
purchase it? I purchased it, uh, 2023. I

1441
01:35:47,822 --> 01:35:49,822
paid 1.3 million. 2023.

1442
01:35:50,559 --> 01:35:54,759
1.3. At the time, it was assessed at

1443
01:35:55,964 --> 01:35:58,964
1.1. On the property appraiser role.

1444
01:36:02,571 --> 01:36:06,842
It's a two acre is the criteria for being allowed to have the

1445
01:36:06,842 --> 01:36:12,380
building permit correct? Two eight, two acres or more. And

1446
01:36:12,380 --> 01:36:17,452
what is that? I'm just doing this for reiteration. What is

1447
01:36:17,452 --> 01:36:22,190
the what is the county saying that you what is their

1448
01:36:22,190 --> 01:36:26,194
interpretation of the amount of property that you have? Uh.

1449
01:36:26,194 --> 01:36:30,394
1.7 of dry land, 2.01 acres. Total, 1.7. 2.2.01. So that's

1450
01:36:40,800 --> 01:36:44,790
the little extra is what's in the water just.

1451
01:36:44,790 --> 01:36:46,479
Yes. Correct. Thank you.

1452
01:36:50,351 --> 01:36:54,756
Mr. Vargas. You know, um, having been in

1453
01:36:54,756 --> 01:36:57,825
real estate for many years, I really admire the lengths you

1454
01:36:57,825 --> 01:37:02,970
went to. I would do the same thing as you. Uh, if I were

1455
01:37:02,970 --> 01:37:06,968
planning on moving my family, my homestead, my last home, I

1456
01:37:06,968 --> 01:37:10,439
think forever home to this piece of property. You

1457
01:37:10,439 --> 01:37:14,642
certainly have spent a lot of money, uh, looking into. Is

1458
01:37:14,642 --> 01:37:17,512
this the right move for my family? And then also to sell

1459
01:37:17,512 --> 01:37:19,512
your homestead? Yeah.

1460
01:37:20,247 --> 01:37:25,386
That's admirable to me. When I have been involved with the

1461
01:37:25,386 --> 01:37:29,791
county, not this county, but another county. Uh, and looking

1462
01:37:29,791 --> 01:37:34,620
at property, I, too, had to rely on what staff said, uh,

1463
01:37:34,620 --> 01:37:37,332
because that's the only way I can say. Well, you know, this

1464
01:37:37,332 --> 01:37:41,269
is this is a good avenue to take or. No, I really should do

1465
01:37:41,269 --> 01:37:45,273
something else. But you've done the other something else in

1466
01:37:45,273 --> 01:37:50,412
addition to that, policies here should not be floating and

1467
01:37:50,412 --> 01:37:53,881
should not, you know, be constructed as situations come

1468
01:37:53,881 --> 01:37:57,752
up. Um, we're talking about three other properties, 1984,

1469
01:37:57,752 --> 01:38:02,552
2016, 2023, which were labeled as mistakes. They could have

1470
01:38:03,558 --> 01:38:08,496
been. However, you're basing your argument on the fact that

1471
01:38:08,496 --> 01:38:11,496
these are similar properties, correct?

1472
01:38:11,566 --> 01:38:15,166
Identical. Identical. Um, so having said

1473
01:38:16,370 --> 01:38:20,237
that, we're talking about submerged lands, riparian

1474
01:38:20,575 --> 01:38:25,580
rights. And this is this is the key component. Is that correct?

1475
01:38:25,580 --> 01:38:27,582
Correct. To be able to allow you to go

1476
01:38:27,582 --> 01:38:32,982
forward. Okay. Um, but you certainly have the landmass

1477
01:38:33,540 --> 01:38:37,854
without interfering with, um, conservation areas. That would

1478
01:38:39,393 --> 01:38:45,217
be unbelievable. Correct? Okay. Um, so having said that, I

1479
01:38:45,217 --> 01:38:49,354
understood that what you're looking for, I understand what

1480
01:38:49,354 --> 01:38:55,954
you've done to to spend $1.3 million, um, is a chunk of

1481
01:38:57,562 --> 01:39:05,170
change. And as I say, it's very hard to to remake that again.

1482
01:39:05,170 --> 01:39:09,708
Okay. Um, I just wanted to clarify. I think a report was

1483
01:39:09,708 --> 01:39:14,313
was thorough, complete. It was very understandable. We don't

1484
01:39:14,313 --> 01:39:16,247
need to go through all the facts again. It's already

1485
01:39:16,247 --> 01:39:18,316
recorded. Thank you. Thank you.

1486
01:39:18,316 --> 01:39:22,721
Any further questions? Would staff like to give a

1487
01:39:22,721 --> 01:39:24,456
presentation? Yes.

1488
01:39:24,456 --> 01:39:27,326
Thank you. Chair. Uh, Pete Walden, deputy growth

1489
01:39:27,326 --> 01:39:31,797
management director, and I do have a copy of the agenda with

1490
01:39:31,797 --> 01:39:36,602
some, uh, exhibits. I threw l which did not make it into the

1491
01:39:36,602 --> 01:39:39,872
formal agenda that is included. And I believe those were

1492
01:39:39,872 --> 01:39:44,900
provided on the DS for the commissioners. So I'm going to

1493
01:39:44,900 --> 01:39:48,147
go through a brief history of the events that led up and the

1494
01:39:48,147 --> 01:39:52,484
timeline that led up to this, and then I'll give it back to

1495
01:39:52,484 --> 01:39:55,287
the county attorney and administrator to follow through

1496
01:39:55,287 --> 01:40:00,625
about process and the decisions made. So this is a synopsis of

1497
01:40:00,625 --> 01:40:03,562
the property and the timeline that is the subject of the

1498
01:40:03,562 --> 01:40:08,166
quasi judicial appeal before you today. According to deeds

1499
01:40:08,166 --> 01:40:11,503
shown on the property, Appraisers website in April of

1500
01:40:11,503 --> 01:40:16,108
2000, lot one, River's Edge and unrecorded subdivision was

1501
01:40:16,108 --> 01:40:20,578
divided and sold. This created the parcel that Mr. Beaton now

1502
01:40:20,578 --> 01:40:27,178
owns. In January of 2016, a zoning letter was issued to Mr.

1503
01:40:27,853 --> 01:40:31,590
McNicholas of McCarthy, summers, Bob Co wood, Norman

1504
01:40:31,590 --> 01:40:37,529
Bass and MLBPA regarding the subject site. The letter stated

1505
01:40:37,529 --> 01:40:42,134
the zoning district of A-1 Small Farms District, the land

1506
01:40:42,134 --> 01:40:46,871
use of rural density, both required a minimum lot size of

1507
01:40:46,871 --> 01:40:51,343
two acres, and the development setbacks of the parcel. The

1508
01:40:51,343 --> 01:40:54,790
letter also called into question the lot size,

1509
01:40:54,790 --> 01:40:57,215
indicating that the property appraisers website described

1510
01:40:57,215 --> 01:41:02,870
the lot area as 1.69 acres. While the survey showed two

1511
01:41:02,870 --> 01:41:06,287
acres, including submerged lands. In October of 2023,

1512
01:41:08,960 --> 01:41:13,310
McCarthy summers submitted an application for a future land

1513
01:41:13,310 --> 01:41:16,501
use amendment and concurrent zoning district change for the

1514
01:41:16,501 --> 01:41:20,706
subject property. The amendment was to change the existing land

1515
01:41:20,706 --> 01:41:25,710
use of rural density to one unit per two acres to a state

1516
01:41:25,710 --> 01:41:30,982
density one unit per acre, and the concurrent A-1 Small Farms

1517
01:41:30,982 --> 01:41:37,582
District to one re dash one, a residential estate district. In

1518
01:41:38,560 --> 01:41:41,656
December of 2023, the application was formally

1519
01:41:41,927 --> 01:41:47,132
withdrawn. Of note, staff supported the land use changes

1520
01:41:47,132 --> 01:41:50,402
and was prepared to take it forward to the Board of County

1521
01:41:50,402 --> 01:41:56,402
Commissioners on August 7th of 2025. Mr. Beaton applied for a

1522
01:41:56,475 --> 01:42:00,546
building permit to construct a single family residence on

1523
01:42:00,546 --> 01:42:05,216
April 24th of 2026. The Martin County Building official

1524
01:42:05,216 --> 01:42:08,686
emailed a conditions report to Mr. Beaton, stating the

1525
01:42:08,686 --> 01:42:11,823
building permit could not be issued due to the inability to

1526
01:42:11,823 --> 01:42:16,623
meet zoning requirements. On May 14th, 2026, the county

1527
01:42:17,950 --> 01:42:21,990
administrator received a notice of appeal regarding the denial

1528
01:42:21,990 --> 01:42:25,899
of building permit build 2025 080317 for the construction of

1529
01:42:27,639 --> 01:42:31,839
a single family residence at 1802 50 Southeast Loxahatchee

1530
01:42:32,845 --> 01:42:37,645
River road. Mr. Beaton's property. On June 17th, 2026,

1531
01:42:38,650 --> 01:42:42,254
Don Donaldson conducted an administrative review of the

1532
01:42:42,254 --> 01:42:47,392
permit application. Mr. Beaton and county staff attended on

1533
01:42:47,392 --> 01:42:51,997
June 30th, 2026. Mr. Donaldson sent a determination to Mr.

1534
01:42:51,997 --> 01:42:57,869
Beaton that the denial of the permit was appropriate. On July

1535
01:42:57,869 --> 01:43:02,274
10th, 2026, the county received a Notice of Appeal to the BCC

1536
01:43:02,274 --> 01:43:06,477
for the subject parcel and building permit. Staff prepared

1537
01:43:06,477 --> 01:43:09,140
the earliest appropriate hearing regarding the matter

1538
01:43:09,140 --> 01:43:13,418
for today's agenda, and with that, I'll give it back to the

1539
01:43:13,418 --> 01:43:16,354
county attorney and Mr. Donaldson to follow through

1540
01:43:16,354 --> 01:43:18,690
with the process and the decisions made.

1541
01:43:18,690 --> 01:43:21,426
So I'm just going to summarize some of the facts that Mr.

1542
01:43:21,426 --> 01:43:25,697
Waldon, um, just told the board and that what were discussed at

1543
01:43:25,697 --> 01:43:29,700
the article ten appeal review meeting that Mr. Beaton

1544
01:43:29,700 --> 01:43:34,439
neglected to tell the board. So in 2001, like Mr. Waldon said,

1545
01:43:34,439 --> 01:43:37,642
Mr. Beaton's property was created by an illegal lot

1546
01:43:37,642 --> 01:43:42,981
split. Um, this was, uh, told to the previous owner who hired

1547
01:43:42,981 --> 01:43:46,718
Terry McCarthy's firm to do a land use and a zoning change

1548
01:43:46,718 --> 01:43:49,187
because they needed that change in order to build a house on

1549
01:43:49,187 --> 01:43:51,923
the property. Because the current zoning said you have to

1550
01:43:51,923 --> 01:43:56,610
have two acre lots, and they only had 1.74. So they went

1551
01:43:56,610 --> 01:43:59,264
through the entire application process, and it was teed up to

1552
01:43:59,264 --> 01:44:02,334
come to the board for a land use and zoning change, to

1553
01:44:02,334 --> 01:44:06,872
change the land use and zoning for one acre parcels. Because

1554
01:44:06,872 --> 01:44:10,609
the predecessor understood that Mr. Beaton's property did not

1555
01:44:10,609 --> 01:44:14,880
qualify for a building permit, as it was currently situated,

1556
01:44:14,880 --> 01:44:18,150
given it was an illegal lot split. Mr. Beaton bought the

1557
01:44:18,150 --> 01:44:21,153
property and withdrew that application. It was Mr. Beaton

1558
01:44:21,153 --> 01:44:23,955
who knew about the application. Staff explained the

1559
01:44:23,955 --> 01:44:30,161
implications of it. He withdrew the application so after he, um

1560
01:44:30,161 --> 01:44:32,431
applied for the building permit, I was involved in that

1561
01:44:32,431 --> 01:44:35,901
process as well. I spoke to Mr. Beaton. I've emailed Mr.

1562
01:44:35,901 --> 01:44:40,171
Beaton, I've had, um, meetings with Mr. Beaton and I

1563
01:44:40,171 --> 01:44:43,575
questioned the ownership of the submerged land because it's

1564
01:44:43,575 --> 01:44:46,978
very unique in Florida for anybody to own submerged lands.

1565
01:44:46,978 --> 01:44:50,782
So I did some independent research during that time. I

1566
01:44:50,782 --> 01:44:55,669
found tiff deeds that, um, the DEP in the state had over his

1567
01:44:55,669 --> 01:44:59,673
property, and it might show he has ownership of that property.

1568
01:44:59,673 --> 01:45:01,942
But if you have a Tiff deed over that, the state is

1569
01:45:01,942 --> 01:45:05,790
claiming an interest in it and it's not really your property.

1570
01:45:05,790 --> 01:45:08,749
So I explained that to Mr. Beaton and I asked him, can you

1571
01:45:08,749 --> 01:45:11,953
write to the state? You can write to DEP and you can get a

1572
01:45:11,953 --> 01:45:15,556
letter from DEP that they're not claiming any ownership in

1573
01:45:15,556 --> 01:45:20,161
the land. Mr. Beaton refused to do that through the process. So

1574
01:45:20,161 --> 01:45:22,697
this was something that I raised throughout the process

1575
01:45:22,697 --> 01:45:26,634
for Mr. Beaton to get this letter from DEP or some proof

1576
01:45:26,634 --> 01:45:30,105
that he owned the land, he insisted he had a legal

1577
01:45:30,105 --> 01:45:34,242
description and a boundary survey. So he owned the land

1578
01:45:34,242 --> 01:45:38,460
and he didn't need to do anything further. The building

1579
01:45:38,460 --> 01:45:41,315
permit was denied. We had the article ten appeal with Mr.

1580
01:45:41,315 --> 01:45:44,786
Donaldson. During the article ten appeal, I raised the issue

1581
01:45:44,786 --> 01:45:48,990
again. I told Mr. Donaldson that there was a question of

1582
01:45:48,990 --> 01:45:52,394
ownership of the submerged lands, that dep that the state

1583
01:45:52,394 --> 01:45:56,398
had some tiff deeds over these back from the 60s, and it was

1584
01:45:56,398 --> 01:45:59,868
in the whole area where his house was. So this issue was

1585
01:45:59,868 --> 01:46:03,871
raised during the article ten appeal. The other issue is that

1586
01:46:03,871 --> 01:46:07,609
even if Mr. Beaton owned the land in Martin County, based on

1587
01:46:07,609 --> 01:46:11,212
the comprehensive plan, you cannot use submerged lands

1588
01:46:11,212 --> 01:46:14,415
towards your lot density. That is a strict policy in Martin

1589
01:46:14,415 --> 01:46:17,180
County. Any applicant who's been before this board,

1590
01:46:17,180 --> 01:46:21,156
including prior developments, have followed that. And I'm

1591
01:46:21,156 --> 01:46:24,225
going to let Mr. Schilling talk about that for a second,

1592
01:46:24,225 --> 01:46:27,428
because that's an important aspect of this. Even if you own

1593
01:46:27,428 --> 01:46:30,297
the land, he wouldn't be able to have his building permit.

1594
01:46:30,297 --> 01:46:32,367
Uh. Thank you, Paul Schilling,

1595
01:46:32,367 --> 01:46:37,438
growth management director, for the record. So, um, yes. So the

1596
01:46:37,438 --> 01:46:43,438
1967 zoning code, which is the A-1, requires two acre lots.

1597
01:46:43,444 --> 01:46:47,982
Um, fast forward to today. Um, there's still that provision.

1598
01:46:47,982 --> 01:46:52,320
That provision is in place with the with the category C and the

1599
01:46:52,320 --> 01:46:58,593
land use appropriate to this. Um, that does not talk about

1600
01:46:58,593 --> 01:47:02,730
submerged land. It talks about lot area. In fact, um, it's

1601
01:47:02,730 --> 01:47:07,268
crystal clear says shall not be less than two acres. Um, that

1602
01:47:07,268 --> 01:47:12,140
has been the case since 1967. This lot was carved out of a

1603
01:47:12,140 --> 01:47:15,343
piece, as were multiple lots within this unrecorded

1604
01:47:15,343 --> 01:47:20,415
subdivision. Um, some met the lot size, some may not have.

1605
01:47:20,415 --> 01:47:23,751
But this one in particular was created in the year 2000 or

1606
01:47:23,751 --> 01:47:27,689
thereabouts. It does not qualify for any reduction in

1607
01:47:27,689 --> 01:47:30,825
shoreline protection zones, so it has a 75 foot shoreline

1608
01:47:30,825 --> 01:47:34,763
protection zone, which, as you may recall, was a matter that

1609
01:47:34,763 --> 01:47:38,700
was debated substantially. We've met with this gentleman,

1610
01:47:38,700 --> 01:47:43,500
um, multiple times throughout throughout this whole process.

1611
01:47:43,704 --> 01:47:47,975
Um, uh, the facts that he mentioned with a member of my

1612
01:47:47,975 --> 01:47:55,449
staff, um, are, are I would argue I would, uh, say that are

1613
01:47:55,449 --> 01:48:00,588
not accurate. Um, certainly, uh, he had his own opinion. Um,

1614
01:48:00,588 --> 01:48:03,658
he requested one of our members of staff withdraw that

1615
01:48:03,658 --> 01:48:08,196
application vehemently, uh, for the land use change. That that

1616
01:48:08,196 --> 01:48:13,467
Miss Alder just mentioned. So regardless of of of of a lot of

1617
01:48:13,467 --> 01:48:20,740
things, quite frankly, um, I, the board no one in this agency

1618
01:48:20,740 --> 01:48:25,346
has the has the jurisdiction to violate the comprehensive plan,

1619
01:48:25,346 --> 01:48:29,550
um, or the or the zoning district. Um, and what I was

1620
01:48:29,550 --> 01:48:32,487
getting at earlier, had this lot been created prior to the

1621
01:48:32,487 --> 01:48:36,423
zoning code, then it may have been a different matter. Uh,

1622
01:48:36,423 --> 01:48:42,423
but we have never allocated submerged land for creating a

1623
01:48:42,830 --> 01:48:46,234
buildable lot in that manner. We do have a couple down the

1624
01:48:46,234 --> 01:48:50,104
street, one in particular that Mr. Beaton mentioned. Um, it

1625
01:48:50,104 --> 01:48:53,307
was an application to redevelop that site. It had been a lot

1626
01:48:53,307 --> 01:48:57,645
split. I think that was in 2023 or thereabouts. Uh, and a

1627
01:48:57,645 --> 01:49:02,383
member of my staff and I missed that. Um, that was a survey

1628
01:49:02,383 --> 01:49:06,787
that indicated, uh, the water within the boundary, but also

1629
01:49:06,787 --> 01:49:10,525
the upland, which clearly did not meet it. I missed it, um,

1630
01:49:10,525 --> 01:49:14,328
but that does not give me jurisdiction. Uh, or the

1631
01:49:14,328 --> 01:49:17,131
ability to violate the comprehensive plan in the

1632
01:49:17,131 --> 01:49:20,734
zoning code and continue to do that. So have there been things

1633
01:49:20,734 --> 01:49:23,271
that have happened throughout the county within the last 40

1634
01:49:23,271 --> 01:49:27,674
years? Certainly. Uh, we're not perfect. We do our best. Uh,

1635
01:49:27,674 --> 01:49:32,474
fast forward to 2023 and certainly the last 15 years,

1636
01:49:32,880 --> 01:49:35,616
uh, our processes, we've got much more refined. We have the

1637
01:49:35,616 --> 01:49:41,289
tools to to make decisions instantly. But, um, the way

1638
01:49:41,289 --> 01:49:45,626
that was characterized is not necessarily accurate. Um. Any

1639
01:49:45,626 --> 01:49:49,497
other questions? Maybe I'll extrapolate a little

1640
01:49:49,497 --> 01:49:51,966
bit more on, uh, the comprehensive plan and what it

1641
01:49:51,966 --> 01:49:57,571
says. It basically goes in 4.18 states that we count the upland

1642
01:49:57,571 --> 01:50:00,641
areas from the mean high water line upland.

1643
01:50:00,641 --> 01:50:03,410
No it doesn't. So.

1644
01:50:03,110 --> 01:50:06,470
Um. So it's been our policy, at

1645
01:50:06,470 --> 01:50:08,516
least in the last ten years that I've been working with

1646
01:50:08,516 --> 01:50:11,853
Development Review, that all developments that get approved

1647
01:50:11,853 --> 01:50:16,324
in any sites have to meet the density of the upland area. So

1648
01:50:16,324 --> 01:50:19,327
that's that's been what we do. We even have when the

1649
01:50:19,327 --> 01:50:22,930
development comes in, we have the DEP certified, the mean

1650
01:50:22,930 --> 01:50:27,268
high water line. So we make an accurate determination as to

1651
01:50:27,268 --> 01:50:31,500
the upland area. So that is something that the county has

1652
01:50:31,500 --> 01:50:35,543
done thoroughly. And yes, there have been some mistakes in the

1653
01:50:35,543 --> 01:50:39,480
permit review process. Uh, like Paul said, but uh,

1654
01:50:39,480 --> 01:50:43,170
substantially throughout our history, we count the upland

1655
01:50:43,170 --> 01:50:46,220
area for density purposes. So the last thing I want to

1656
01:50:46,220 --> 01:50:48,956
touch base is the administrative review meeting.

1657
01:50:48,956 --> 01:50:52,894
And Mister Donaldson's decision. Mr.. Um, Schilling

1658
01:50:52,894 --> 01:50:55,229
was there, Mister Walden was there but didn't speak. And

1659
01:50:55,229 --> 01:50:59,330
Mr.. Um Dougherty was there. They're the department heads

1660
01:50:59,330 --> 01:51:02,437
that were responsible for the denial. So they were there. So

1661
01:51:02,437 --> 01:51:06,188
there was no no other testimony except for me. And then,

1662
01:51:06,188 --> 01:51:09,124
mister, if you read the letter, which is part of the record, it

1663
01:51:09,124 --> 01:51:11,527
says, after reviewing the record and considering the

1664
01:51:11,527 --> 01:51:14,263
information presented during the administrative review

1665
01:51:14,263 --> 01:51:17,600
meeting, I have determined that the denial of the above

1666
01:51:17,600 --> 01:51:20,469
referenced building permit was appropriate because you did not

1667
01:51:20,469 --> 01:51:23,873
conclusively demonstrate that you own the submerged lands at

1668
01:51:23,873 --> 01:51:27,410
issue. That was an issue raised during the hearing. It was an

1669
01:51:27,410 --> 01:51:30,879
issue addressed by staff, and that's what Mr. Donaldson based

1670
01:51:30,879 --> 01:51:36,152
his his decision on. Down below, there's a sentence that

1671
01:51:36,152 --> 01:51:39,489
says, in addition, Deb told us they are claiming an interest

1672
01:51:39,489 --> 01:51:42,558
to the land that did not go into Mr. Donaldson's decision.

1673
01:51:42,558 --> 01:51:45,161
As you can see, the way the letter is written, that was

1674
01:51:45,161 --> 01:51:48,764
just an FYI. We want to let you know that Mr. Donaldson found

1675
01:51:48,764 --> 01:51:52,769
this, but we also found out from DEP later, after he made

1676
01:51:52,769 --> 01:51:55,437
his decision, because Mr. Donaldson made his decision

1677
01:51:55,437 --> 01:51:59,242
relatively quickly that DEP agreed. So that was just for

1678
01:51:59,242 --> 01:52:02,178
informational purposes. It had nothing to do with Mr.

1679
01:52:02,178 --> 01:52:05,781
Donaldson's decision. He had no contact with DEP. So I'm going

1680
01:52:05,781 --> 01:52:08,517
to ask Mr. Donaldson to explain to you what he based his

1681
01:52:08,517 --> 01:52:13,317
decision on. So, there, uh, again, um, Mr.

1682
01:52:13,722 --> 01:52:19,929
Beaton's, uh, issue was, uh, uh, the two, as he's mentioned

1683
01:52:19,929 --> 01:52:23,733
about the, uh, interpretation of the code related to total

1684
01:52:23,733 --> 01:52:28,337
land area. And then it was, um, principally with his surveys

1685
01:52:28,337 --> 01:52:32,542
and his legal descriptions, as he has, saying that that that

1686
01:52:32,542 --> 01:52:36,278
was evidence that he owned the land. And reading the surveyors

1687
01:52:36,278 --> 01:52:41,551
note, if there is, uh, it simply has a boundary survey of

1688
01:52:41,551 --> 01:52:45,822
the legal description that was recorded in the courthouse or

1689
01:52:45,822 --> 01:52:50,292
that he had from the lot split. Um, and there was no testimony

1690
01:52:50,292 --> 01:52:54,363
to assert that they actually owned submerged lands. I think

1691
01:52:54,363 --> 01:52:58,234
it is a boundary survey. It is a survey of the legal

1692
01:52:58,234 --> 01:53:02,305
description that he has. But it's but there was no testimony

1693
01:53:02,305 --> 01:53:06,442
or evidence to say that this boundary survey, uh, meets and

1694
01:53:06,442 --> 01:53:11,513
bound survey, um, had, uh, ownership of, of the submerged

1695
01:53:11,513 --> 01:53:14,116
lands and in the state of Florida, you know, when we

1696
01:53:14,116 --> 01:53:19,722
became a state in all of the submerged lands to the mean

1697
01:53:19,722 --> 01:53:23,525
high water line are owned by the state, except for a few

1698
01:53:23,525 --> 01:53:28,731
areas where prior kings of Spain or England donated or

1699
01:53:28,731 --> 01:53:34,403
conveyed properties under um, uh, that so so that portion of

1700
01:53:34,403 --> 01:53:39,142
property is complicated, and I'm, I'm not, uh, testifying to

1701
01:53:39,142 --> 01:53:41,944
be an expert on it, but we've come across it with county

1702
01:53:41,944 --> 01:53:46,149
owned property, um, in various properties that we either own

1703
01:53:46,149 --> 01:53:50,190
or purchased, and it may have a boundary description that shows

1704
01:53:50,190 --> 01:53:52,955
out into the water, but we actually don't own it. And in

1705
01:53:52,955 --> 01:53:56,910
some cases we do. In Jensen Beach, there's some areas that

1706
01:53:56,910 --> 01:54:01,363
we actually have tiff deeds. Uh, and so that, that, that,

1707
01:54:01,363 --> 01:54:05,634
that, uh, it is complicated. All I said was that looking at

1708
01:54:05,634 --> 01:54:09,380
Mr. Beaton's survey, that he presented, it was certainly a

1709
01:54:09,380 --> 01:54:13,776
boundary survey. Uh, and the surveyors note, uh, which is, I

1710
01:54:13,776 --> 01:54:17,513
think one of the exhibits in here, he simply surveyed the

1711
01:54:17,513 --> 01:54:21,117
boundaries that were provided by Mr. Beaton and that what

1712
01:54:21,117 --> 01:54:25,854
they found that that were recorded, um, and and you can

1713
01:54:25,854 --> 01:54:29,925
record as was done in this property a lot split. You can

1714
01:54:29,925 --> 01:54:35,531
go in and split your property. Um, and create divided into

1715
01:54:35,531 --> 01:54:39,401
pieces the, the issues. When you divide it into pieces, you

1716
01:54:39,401 --> 01:54:44,806
may be legally able to do that. Um, and the I think the term of

1717
01:54:44,806 --> 01:54:48,677
art that we used as an a legal law split doesn't mean it was

1718
01:54:48,677 --> 01:54:54,883
done. Um, uh, you know, you know, it when, when you do a

1719
01:54:54,883 --> 01:54:57,419
lot split, it just means that it may not comply with the

1720
01:54:57,419 --> 01:55:01,290
county codes for building purposes. So a lot split that

1721
01:55:01,290 --> 01:55:05,961
would be considered, um, under the zoning code as a lot split,

1722
01:55:05,961 --> 01:55:09,498
like when Palm City Farms, you convey a ten acre lot could be

1723
01:55:09,498 --> 01:55:12,634
split into two, five acre lots. You can go and do that and

1724
01:55:12,634 --> 01:55:16,105
record it without even talking to the county at all. When it's

1725
01:55:16,105 --> 01:55:18,841
provided as evidence to the staff for a building permit.

1726
01:55:18,841 --> 01:55:21,977
Then they check to see doesn't meet the zoning codes. So those

1727
01:55:21,977 --> 01:55:25,247
are you can do lots of things in recording in the courthouse

1728
01:55:25,247 --> 01:55:28,250
of, of uh, conveyance of properties. Farmers do it all

1729
01:55:28,250 --> 01:55:31,253
the time to split out pieces of property that they farm

1730
01:55:31,253 --> 01:55:33,589
different pieces, but it doesn't mean it's eligible for

1731
01:55:33,589 --> 01:55:37,927
a building permit. So in this particular case, I specifically

1732
01:55:37,927 --> 01:55:41,530
looked at there was a lot of discussion on on. And as you

1733
01:55:41,530 --> 01:55:46,669
can tell about ownership of the entire parcel, I'm sure that's

1734
01:55:46,669 --> 01:55:49,872
what Mr. Beaton was conveyed, uh, from the prior property

1735
01:55:49,872 --> 01:55:55,100
owner, uh, the surveyor simply plotted out as a a boundary

1736
01:55:55,100 --> 01:55:59,815
survey, but I didn't feel that there was any substantial

1737
01:55:59,815 --> 01:56:05,220
evidence to actually affirm that the, um. And the surveyor

1738
01:56:05,220 --> 01:56:08,891
did not state that. It just simply said they they they they

1739
01:56:08,891 --> 01:56:12,428
did a boundary survey based upon was a recorded. So, uh,

1740
01:56:12,428 --> 01:56:14,963
other than Mr. Beaton's testimony that it had been

1741
01:56:14,963 --> 01:56:20,770
dredged from uplands, uh, in the past and, um, and the

1742
01:56:20,770 --> 01:56:24,306
assertion that that and other parcels of the property were,

1743
01:56:24,306 --> 01:56:28,978
were actually, um, privately owned, based upon the sequence

1744
01:56:28,978 --> 01:56:33,382
of events, um, under his opinion, I didn't find any

1745
01:56:33,382 --> 01:56:36,452
other substantial, competent evidence from from other

1746
01:56:36,452 --> 01:56:40,656
experts to affirm his, his, his claim on the submerged land.

1747
01:56:40,656 --> 01:56:44,994
And so that was basis of my decision. And then following

1748
01:56:44,994 --> 01:56:48,531
that decision, um, Miss Elder is correct. They did reach out

1749
01:56:48,531 --> 01:56:53,936
to DEP to find out if there was any, um, claim, because this is

1750
01:56:53,936 --> 01:56:57,673
on the Loxahatchee River, a wild and scenic river which has

1751
01:56:57,673 --> 01:57:03,278
a lot of, um, interest from the state. Um, and um, as well as

1752
01:57:03,278 --> 01:57:06,882
our Indian River lagoon and other areas. So it's a that

1753
01:57:06,882 --> 01:57:11,220
that portion of the of property rights is complicated and, and,

1754
01:57:11,220 --> 01:57:14,571
and given the what I had received, that was the basis of

1755
01:57:14,571 --> 01:57:19,420
my decision. I don't I don't have any

1756
01:57:19,420 --> 01:57:21,978
further questions. So under the board's rules, now is the time

1757
01:57:21,978 --> 01:57:25,582
for the board to ask questions to staff and then it's board

1758
01:57:25,582 --> 01:57:27,582
deliberation. Right.

1759
01:57:27,650 --> 01:57:30,319
Commissioner Hetherington. I have a couple questions. I

1760
01:57:30,319 --> 01:57:33,723
might have some more. So the lot was split prior to your

1761
01:57:33,723 --> 01:57:38,128
ownership? Yes. Okay. And then you started to go into this,

1762
01:57:38,128 --> 01:57:41,131
Pete and and Paul, you you mentioned the comprehensive

1763
01:57:41,131 --> 01:57:48,337
plan. I think it was 4.1 E. How do you defined in that policy

1764
01:57:48,337 --> 01:57:54,937
what is owned it. That's where the two acre requirement is.

1765
01:57:55,679 --> 01:58:01,679
What defines in that policy. Uh. Substantiates a lot ownership.

1766
01:58:04,153 --> 01:58:09,920
Well the policy from a simplicity standpoint, from our

1767
01:58:09,920 --> 01:58:12,562
regulatory role is we're regulating what is from mean

1768
01:58:12,562 --> 01:58:17,299
high water upland. Um, so the comprehensive plan is talking

1769
01:58:17,299 --> 01:58:22,972
about some other things, but generally, um, it is the, the,

1770
01:58:22,972 --> 01:58:30,460
um, uh, measurement of lot size from the mean high water line.

1771
01:58:30,460 --> 01:58:33,182
So like I said earlier, for example, the shoreline

1772
01:58:33,182 --> 01:58:36,853
protection zone that is not taken from a boundary out in

1773
01:58:36,853 --> 01:58:40,457
the Loxahatchee River. It is taking from the shoreline where

1774
01:58:40,457 --> 01:58:44,861
the mangroves are and so forth. You pull that provision up. So

1775
01:58:44,861 --> 01:58:47,329
I could see how it reads. Sure. And then while you're doing

1776
01:58:47,329 --> 01:58:51,267
that, Mr. Beaton, you said when when Mr. Schilling had said

1777
01:58:51,267 --> 01:58:55,337
reference 4.1 e you said it does not say that. What's your

1778
01:58:55,337 --> 01:59:00,877
interpretation of what it says? 4.14 is very clear. It's very

1779
01:59:00,877 --> 01:59:04,130
specific. It can be broken down in Webster's dictionary. It has

1780
01:59:04,130 --> 01:59:07,283
two legs to it. The first says the boundary must be delineated

1781
01:59:07,283 --> 01:59:09,753
as per the state statutes, which is having a professional

1782
01:59:09,753 --> 01:59:13,690
license boundary survey performed. It's based upon the

1783
01:59:13,690 --> 01:59:16,759
legal description of the parcel of land. That's the first leg

1784
01:59:16,759 --> 01:59:20,496
of the policy. The second says no submerged land areas, water.

1785
01:59:20,496 --> 01:59:25,340
Word of that boundary line can be used. So I keep hearing

1786
01:59:25,340 --> 01:59:27,636
staff's talking about the mean high water line. There's

1787
01:59:27,636 --> 01:59:30,840
nothing in there that references mean high water line

1788
01:59:30,840 --> 01:59:34,377
whatsoever. It's the boundary line is what's specifically

1789
01:59:34,377 --> 01:59:36,645
referenced. If no submerged land areas could be used

1790
01:59:36,645 --> 01:59:39,648
towards density, the policy could be this clear. It could

1791
01:59:39,648 --> 01:59:44,187
say no submerged land areas can be used towards density period.

1792
01:59:44,187 --> 01:59:46,723
It doesn't say that it says water word of the boundary

1793
01:59:46,723 --> 01:59:49,992
line. So when you're standing on the land looking out over

1794
01:59:49,992 --> 01:59:53,663
the water, the boundary line for this parcel is unique. It's

1795
01:59:53,663 --> 01:59:55,931
further out. You have to walk out to the boundary line and no

1796
01:59:55,931 --> 01:59:58,534
submerged lands, water, word or outside of that boundary line

1797
01:59:58,534 --> 02:00:01,537
can be used, which would stop me from using then riparian

1798
02:00:01,537 --> 02:00:05,407
rights which all waterfront properties have a right to go.

1799
02:00:05,407 --> 02:00:08,745
Access onto the state lands at that point. And that's what

1800
02:00:08,745 --> 02:00:11,547
this policy prevents. So if you turn around standing now,

1801
02:00:11,547 --> 02:00:14,751
that's your landward direction. The policy does not exclude my

1802
02:00:14,751 --> 02:00:17,860
privately owned submerged lands from being used towards my

1803
02:00:17,860 --> 02:00:20,622
density. It's part of my legal description. I pay taxes on it,

1804
02:00:20,622 --> 02:00:24,560
I'm assessed on it, and it's part of the lot area. He says

1805
02:00:24,560 --> 02:00:27,630
he spoke about the lot area, that the lot area is only 1.7.

1806
02:00:27,630 --> 02:00:32,301
That's that's wrong. The lot area is 2.1 acres, 2.01 acres.

1807
02:00:32,301 --> 02:00:36,505
That is the lot area. Um, it's uplands or submerged lands. It

1808
02:00:36,505 --> 02:00:40,309
doesn't matter. I own the river bottom there. Uh, Miss elder

1809
02:00:40,309 --> 02:00:44,379
speaks about tiff deeds. I keep hearing tiff deeds. Deeds?

1810
02:00:44,379 --> 02:00:47,917
There is no Divest me or my predecessors in

1811
02:00:47,917 --> 02:00:50,653
the chain of title from the ownership of this property. You

1812
02:00:50,653 --> 02:00:53,589
never presented one deed. You didn't give me anything. I

1813
02:00:53,589 --> 02:00:55,191
asked for it. Where?

1814
02:00:55,191 --> 02:00:56,992
Where you didn't ask for anything.

1815
02:00:56,992 --> 02:00:59,796
Okay, well, the decision is whether his decision was based

1816
02:00:59,796 --> 02:01:03,532
upon substantial evidence. There was none. I did ask you

1817
02:01:03,532 --> 02:01:06,802
for it. I did ask you for it. I said where? Show me a deed.

1818
02:01:06,802 --> 02:01:10,402
Give me something. There was nothing..

1819
02:01:11,140 --> 02:01:13,475
Any further questions, Commissioner Harris?

1820
02:01:13,475 --> 02:01:16,145
Are there deeds that we presented?

1821
02:01:16,145 --> 02:01:20,160
There are deeds and declarations that exist that I

1822
02:01:20,160 --> 02:01:22,218
have. But what were they?

1823
02:01:22,218 --> 02:01:25,688
He didn't ask for them, so I did not give them to him. But

1824
02:01:25,688 --> 02:01:28,824
they do exist. And I did bring them up to him, and asked him

1825
02:01:28,824 --> 02:01:32,161
to get a letter of the state, because we found them during

1826
02:01:32,161 --> 02:01:35,565
this process. So they exist. But he didn't ask me for them.

1827
02:01:35,565 --> 02:01:38,300
I mean, I've had him at meetings with him. but I was

1828
02:01:38,300 --> 02:01:40,303
never asked. And you're saying that

1829
02:01:40,303 --> 02:01:43,573
specifically his reference in the title to my property? Is

1830
02:01:43,573 --> 02:01:45,975
that what you're. Saying there? Referenced their

1831
02:01:45,975 --> 02:01:48,778
deeds and declarations that reference your the area of your

1832
02:01:48,778 --> 02:01:50,713
property. Area around my property.

1833
02:01:50,713 --> 02:01:52,248
Correct. Including your submerged.

1834
02:01:52,248 --> 02:01:55,251
Lands, including mine. For the record, my submerged lands.

1835
02:01:55,251 --> 02:01:58,654
That's what you're saying. That's that's what the. Yes.

1836
02:01:58,654 --> 02:02:00,722
All right, let's get back to the procedure here,

1837
02:02:00,722 --> 02:02:03,258
Commissioner Vargas. Okay, uh, just a couple of

1838
02:02:03,258 --> 02:02:08,597
comments. Um, did a realtor sell this parcel to you, or was

1839
02:02:08,597 --> 02:02:11,801
this a for sale by owner? I purchased it directly to the

1840
02:02:11,801 --> 02:02:13,536
owner. Okay. Did you take title

1841
02:02:13,536 --> 02:02:17,730
insurance out? I did, okay. You may want to pull out that

1842
02:02:17,730 --> 02:02:19,876
policy. Uh, because there was some question about the

1843
02:02:19,876 --> 02:02:25,547
ownership and it was divided. Just just a suggestion. You can

1844
02:02:25,547 --> 02:02:30,219
consult an attorney about this. A real estate attorney. Pull

1845
02:02:30,219 --> 02:02:32,619
the policy. Commissioner Campi.

1846
02:02:35,558 --> 02:02:41,558
Thank you. Staff had made testimony, I guess, uh, that

1847
02:02:44,834 --> 02:02:47,970
there was an application from the previous owner to change

1848
02:02:47,970 --> 02:02:52,442
this and that you withdrew that application? Why?

1849
02:02:52,442 --> 02:02:56,445
Yes, sir. So before I purchased the property, the error was

1850
02:02:56,445 --> 02:03:00,450
evident in the future land use in the flume. The error was

1851
02:03:00,450 --> 02:03:05,530
evident everywhere, all over it. 1.69 acres. Conversion of a

1852
02:03:05,530 --> 02:03:09,858
1.69 acre parcel to a one unit per acre. They were only trying

1853
02:03:09,858 --> 02:03:14,129
to rezone this because it wasn't two acres. That was it.

1854
02:03:14,129 --> 02:03:16,732
Um, the formal zoning verification letter that Pete

1855
02:03:16,732 --> 02:03:20,300
Walden issued for this parcel, he made a mistake. And instead

1856
02:03:20,300 --> 02:03:24,352
of owning the mistake, he he tried to just just. We're going

1857
02:03:24,352 --> 02:03:26,420
down the rabbit hole still right now. We're still going

1858
02:03:26,420 --> 02:03:29,490
down the rabbit hole. And he's trying to to defend his

1859
02:03:29,490 --> 02:03:33,227
position. He had a survey, the formal zoning inquiry letter is

1860
02:03:33,227 --> 02:03:36,231
very clear. It says property appraiser indicates the

1861
02:03:36,231 --> 02:03:40,434
property is 1.69 acres, while a private survey shows two acres

1862
02:03:40,434 --> 02:03:43,972
and submerged lands. Please verify that the lot complies.

1863
02:03:43,972 --> 02:03:45,440
Do you have a copy of that letter?

1864
02:03:45,440 --> 02:03:49,110
Yes, sir, I do. And I asked Miss Amy Offenbach. I said, did

1865
02:03:49,110 --> 02:03:52,380
the landowner ever just take the simple step of verifying

1866
02:03:52,380 --> 02:03:56,184
that it was two acres? And she said, no, they didn't. Instead

1867
02:03:56,184 --> 02:03:58,653
they were going to go for the rezone because the rezone would

1868
02:03:58,653 --> 02:04:01,523
have then allowed one unit per acre, and she wanted to split

1869
02:04:01,523 --> 02:04:04,325
it anyways, but she couldn't split it again. They called it

1870
02:04:04,325 --> 02:04:08,863
an illegal lot split. It wasn't illegal. State um, allows a lot

1871
02:04:08,863 --> 02:04:11,533
split on these parcels, but they they wanted to further

1872
02:04:11,533 --> 02:04:15,203
subdivide it into two parcels an acre and an acre. That was

1873
02:04:15,203 --> 02:04:18,739
the intention from. Madam Chair. May I just, uh,

1874
02:04:18,739 --> 02:04:23,100
just to clarify, throughout this entire last three years,

1875
02:04:23,100 --> 02:04:26,147
this applicant could have had he not agreed with that zoning

1876
02:04:26,147 --> 02:04:29,160
letter that was issued in 2016, which has been

1877
02:04:29,160 --> 02:04:33,354
mischaracterized, um, I may add, that was signed by my

1878
02:04:33,354 --> 02:04:36,825
predecessor. Had he not agreed of the with the contents of

1879
02:04:36,825 --> 02:04:40,962
that letter, he in and of himself could have prior to

1880
02:04:40,962 --> 02:04:44,432
purchasing this property, could have requested a zoning letter

1881
02:04:44,432 --> 02:04:47,702
to answer all those questions and make certain assumptions.

1882
02:04:47,702 --> 02:04:50,972
So I just wanted to. I spoke directly.

1883
02:04:50,972 --> 02:04:54,508
With staff. I'm asking questions. Thank you. Uh, next

1884
02:04:54,508 --> 02:04:58,713
question. I had heard testimony that said you could have

1885
02:04:58,713 --> 02:05:02,316
contacted the DEP, yet you chose not to. Did you ever

1886
02:05:02,316 --> 02:05:05,120
reach out to the state DEP or anybody at the state level?

1887
02:05:05,120 --> 02:05:08,723
Absolutely not. Just a hypothetical scenario. If you

1888
02:05:08,723 --> 02:05:11,526
own property, right. Everyone here lives in Martin County,

1889
02:05:11,526 --> 02:05:15,462
owns property. Uh, let's say you wanted to put a a mother in

1890
02:05:15,462 --> 02:05:17,932
law suite or build a pool in your backyard so you get a

1891
02:05:17,932 --> 02:05:21,268
survey done, you put it on the site plan, you present it to

1892
02:05:21,268 --> 02:05:23,337
the county, your neighbor goes, you can't build that right

1893
02:05:23,337 --> 02:05:26,700
there. That's my property. Okay.

1894
02:05:26,700 --> 02:05:27,542
Thank you. What do you say to that?

1895
02:05:27,542 --> 02:05:34,742
Um. The applicant had said this is to staff. The applicant had

1896
02:05:35,416 --> 02:05:39,553
said that there have been other homes built in the same area

1897
02:05:39,553 --> 02:05:44,892
where all of those lot sizes, two acres or more, or any of

1898
02:05:44,892 --> 02:05:49,964
them less actual homes that are currently existing there now,

1899
02:05:49,964 --> 02:05:53,901
are there homes on property that's less than two acres, or

1900
02:05:53,901 --> 02:05:59,307
are they utilizing water as to get to two acres?

1901
02:05:59,307 --> 02:06:02,844
The one in particular in which I don't recall the the name of

1902
02:06:02,844 --> 02:06:05,512
the property owner that was fairly recent that we missed,

1903
02:06:05,512 --> 02:06:10,584
that I acknowledged, um, in fact took portions of a small

1904
02:06:10,584 --> 02:06:15,322
tributary canal, if you will. Uh, certainly not the

1905
02:06:15,322 --> 02:06:19,527
Loxahatchee River, but it did have, um, it did have a lot

1906
02:06:19,527 --> 02:06:23,864
size less than two acres. Yes, sir. Now, I would point out a

1907
02:06:23,864 --> 02:06:28,136
lot. Split is a private action. So, um, as Mr. Donaldson

1908
02:06:28,136 --> 02:06:30,938
indicated, there can be property scattered throughout

1909
02:06:30,938 --> 02:06:34,609
the county that took it that that utilized that process. But

1910
02:06:34,609 --> 02:06:37,612
when it comes for a building permit is when that comes in.

1911
02:06:37,612 --> 02:06:44,180
There can also be certain there are, uh, almost infinite, um,

1912
02:06:44,180 --> 02:06:46,154
variables with these properties. When they were

1913
02:06:46,154 --> 02:06:51,625
made, what the particulars are, what the ownership. Um, so, um,

1914
02:06:51,625 --> 02:06:55,295
each one is unique in and of itself. But yes, sir, there are

1915
02:06:55,295 --> 02:06:58,232
at least one out there that does not meet the minimum lot

1916
02:06:58,232 --> 02:07:00,701
size of, of. At least one potentially more.

1917
02:07:00,701 --> 02:07:05,501
Correct. Yes. Um. Thank you. Uh, I heard

1918
02:07:05,773 --> 02:07:10,573
testimony that said that there were approvals in 1984, 2016,

1919
02:07:10,845 --> 02:07:14,982
2023, and then now, are those the approvals that you're

1920
02:07:14,982 --> 02:07:20,982
speaking of? Mr. Schilling? Those are, uh, I believe the

1921
02:07:21,455 --> 02:07:24,992
applicant had mentioned those those, um, I mean, we're

1922
02:07:24,992 --> 02:07:29,329
talking about the period of of almost 50 years or whatever.

1923
02:07:29,329 --> 02:07:34,134
Um, but as I indicated, certainly, um, there are some

1924
02:07:34,134 --> 02:07:40,208
things out there that probably don't. However, um, I have not

1925
02:07:40,208 --> 02:07:44,345
done a deep analysis of those properties back from the 80s

1926
02:07:44,345 --> 02:07:49,160
because, number one, I wasn't here. And number two, there may

1927
02:07:49,160 --> 02:07:51,819
be limited, limited records. I understand I'm just trying to

1928
02:07:51,819 --> 02:07:55,890
run through the points that I had heard from staff's

1929
02:07:55,890 --> 02:07:58,692
presentation in the applicant's presentation. These are things

1930
02:07:58,692 --> 02:08:04,431
that caused me to write a note down. Uh, I had heard that at

1931
02:08:04,431 --> 02:08:08,703
the hearing that you conducted, Mr. Donaldson, that there were

1932
02:08:08,703 --> 02:08:11,706
only supposed to be the administrator, the attorney,

1933
02:08:11,706 --> 02:08:13,775
and the head of the growth management department with the

1934
02:08:13,775 --> 02:08:15,976
three people that was supposed to participate in that.

1935
02:08:15,976 --> 02:08:18,780
However, there were six people at the meeting. We heard that

1936
02:08:18,780 --> 02:08:21,382
it was Mr. Walden. We heard that it was Mr. Doherty who was

1937
02:08:21,382 --> 02:08:24,986
the. Who was the other person? Uh, Mr. Dolan was also there at

1938
02:08:24,986 --> 02:08:27,789
my request. He did have interactions with the applicant

1939
02:08:27,789 --> 02:08:31,391
at some point in time. Now, when it's supposed to be

1940
02:08:31,391 --> 02:08:34,595
only three. Is that so? It's it's not only three, it's

1941
02:08:34,595 --> 02:08:37,532
the department director. So we did have Mr. Schilling and Mr.

1942
02:08:37,532 --> 02:08:41,268
Doherty who was giving all the testimony, um, to Mr.

1943
02:08:41,268 --> 02:08:45,720
Donaldson. So they were both supposed to be there. And then

1944
02:08:45,720 --> 02:08:48,900
Mr. Schilling, if he had questions, had Mr. Walden and

1945
02:08:48,900 --> 02:08:53,140
Mr.. Uh, Doolan if he if Mr. Schilling. But he gave the

1946
02:08:53,140 --> 02:08:55,149
presentation. Understood. But is there any

1947
02:08:55,149 --> 02:08:58,152
requirement that it only be department heads? Is there any

1948
02:08:58,152 --> 02:09:00,220
requirement that it only be three people.

1949
02:09:00,220 --> 02:09:02,556
Know there's a requirement that the people who are

1950
02:09:02,556 --> 02:09:06,361
participating speaking during the review are the department

1951
02:09:06,361 --> 02:09:09,300
heads, the county attorney and the administrator.

1952
02:09:09,300 --> 02:09:12,833
However, we're hearing now that Mr. Dolan did speak.

1953
02:09:12,833 --> 02:09:15,970
To miss. No, no. He. spoke just for the record,

1954
02:09:15,970 --> 02:09:19,440
Mr. Dolan did, in fact, speak. I believe what the applicant

1955
02:09:19,440 --> 02:09:21,909
prior to his purchase regarding the withdrawal of.

1956
02:09:21,909 --> 02:09:23,244
The. Loan, I'm talking only at the

1957
02:09:23,244 --> 02:09:25,579
meeting. No, he did not. Just Mr.

1958
02:09:25,579 --> 02:09:28,716
Schilling and then Mr.. Did you speak?

1959
02:09:28,716 --> 02:09:30,784
Clyde may have had a few words at the meeting. Yes.

1960
02:09:30,784 --> 02:09:34,800
Sir. Right. So, Mr. Walden, you did not

1961
02:09:34,800 --> 02:09:38,200
participate. Uh, was there I might have

1962
02:09:38,200 --> 02:09:42,802
spoken on 1 or 2 instances, but I don't recall.

1963
02:09:42,874 --> 02:09:46,474
Okay. Uh, some other questions. The

1964
02:09:50,615 --> 02:09:56,354
roadmap that the applicant spoke of, that in the beginning

1965
02:09:56,354 --> 02:09:59,558
of your presentation. Sir, you said that during your due

1966
02:09:59,558 --> 02:10:04,496
diligence, you did what most people, smart, savvy people

1967
02:10:04,496 --> 02:10:07,699
that are about to make a more than $1 million investment

1968
02:10:07,699 --> 02:10:11,769
would do due diligence. You said that you spoke to. And

1969
02:10:11,769 --> 02:10:15,440
what I liked is a lot of people would tell the commissioners, I

1970
02:10:15,440 --> 02:10:18,376
spoke to someone at the county who'd you speak to? I don't

1971
02:10:18,376 --> 02:10:22,914
know, makes it much more challenging. You do know you

1972
02:10:22,914 --> 02:10:26,384
said during this testimony that you stood up and swore that you

1973
02:10:26,384 --> 02:10:29,921
would tell us the truth, that you basically, in your word,

1974
02:10:29,921 --> 02:10:35,600
was you received a roadmap on what you would need to do prior

1975
02:10:35,600 --> 02:10:37,795
to you purchasing, closing on the property, correct?

1976
02:10:37,795 --> 02:10:41,395
Correct. For Mrs.. From Miss Offenbach.

1977
02:10:41,733 --> 02:10:47,133
Uh, was that a verbal roadmap or a document?

1978
02:10:47,405 --> 02:10:52,277
It started as a verbal and, uh, it evolved into a written

1979
02:10:52,277 --> 02:10:56,140
document from Miss Offenbach. After getting everything fixed,

1980
02:10:56,140 --> 02:11:01,619
she did confirm all the usage and I was very specific in the

1981
02:11:01,619 --> 02:11:03,287
email chain with Miss Offenbach.

1982
02:11:03,287 --> 02:11:09,227
Okay, so did was those email that email chain or this your

1983
02:11:09,227 --> 02:11:14,432
words roadmap? Um, was that presented to staff and to Mr.

1984
02:11:14,432 --> 02:11:18,369
Donaldson so that we'd have a better understanding of how you

1985
02:11:18,369 --> 02:11:21,639
got to where you were? Yes. Yes, sir.

1986
02:11:21,639 --> 02:11:26,439
Was. Um. I heard from our chair and

1987
02:11:30,248 --> 02:11:35,453
from Miss Elder what the procedure of today's agenda

1988
02:11:35,453 --> 02:11:39,724
item is meant to be, that we weren't going to necessarily be

1989
02:11:39,724 --> 02:11:43,728
hearing additional testimony, even though to me, this sounds

1990
02:11:43,728 --> 02:11:49,728
like testimony. Um, that being said, why isn't Miss Offenbach

1991
02:11:49,934 --> 02:11:54,739
and Mr. Fox here? Are they not allowed to participate in this?

1992
02:11:54,739 --> 02:11:59,744
She seems to be integral in the process that he decided to make

1993
02:11:59,744 --> 02:12:06,840
this investment, and even post closing would have been his at

1994
02:12:06,840 --> 02:12:08,687
least guide through the process. It doesn't get to Mr.

1995
02:12:08,687 --> 02:12:11,823
Schilling. It doesn't get to Miss Elder, and it doesn't get

1996
02:12:11,823 --> 02:12:16,940
to Mr. Donaldson. It goes through a process on the levels

1997
02:12:16,940 --> 02:12:19,694
of employment. Why aren't they here?

1998
02:12:20,564 --> 02:12:23,901
So they didn't participate in the article ten appeal hearing.

1999
02:12:23,901 --> 02:12:26,838
So that's why they're not at this meeting today. They

2000
02:12:26,838 --> 02:12:29,240
weren't at the article ten meeting because you only have

2001
02:12:29,240 --> 02:12:31,509
higher level management department directors that

2002
02:12:31,509 --> 02:12:34,178
participate in that. Except for Mr. Walton.

2003
02:12:34,178 --> 02:12:36,581
Well, their division heads within the growth management

2004
02:12:36,581 --> 02:12:38,850
department. So I think that's why they were there. But you

2005
02:12:38,850 --> 02:12:42,720
usually don't have staff level in there. Um, for article ten

2006
02:12:42,720 --> 02:12:45,389
appeals. It's just not what you do.

2007
02:12:45,389 --> 02:12:49,660
I'm not asking why they were not at that meeting. I'm asking

2008
02:12:49,660 --> 02:12:51,996
why they're not here. Because they didn't participate

2009
02:12:51,996 --> 02:12:53,731
in the administrative review meeting.

2010
02:12:53,731 --> 02:12:59,400
But a lot of what we're discussing is hearsay from

2011
02:12:59,400 --> 02:13:03,675
staff and from the applicant. Their names have been mentioned

2012
02:13:03,675 --> 02:13:06,677
several times. So the board shouldn't consider

2013
02:13:06,677 --> 02:13:09,747
new, should only consider what was presented at the

2014
02:13:09,747 --> 02:13:13,551
administrative review meeting, which is what staff has been

2015
02:13:13,551 --> 02:13:16,754
talking about. That's all that the board should consider in

2016
02:13:16,754 --> 02:13:18,890
this. So those people were not included.

2017
02:13:18,890 --> 02:13:22,260
Believe it or not, I actually can differentiate and discern

2018
02:13:22,260 --> 02:13:25,763
between the two. If so, to me there's really two

2019
02:13:25,763 --> 02:13:28,633
conversations happening at the same time. And from the

2020
02:13:28,633 --> 02:13:32,360
applicant's point of view, it's mostly about hey, I looked at

2021
02:13:32,360 --> 02:13:37,410
this property that I would tell me that I could purchase. Uh,

2022
02:13:37,410 --> 02:13:41,579
and build a single family home, not a neighborhood. One house

2023
02:13:41,579 --> 02:13:49,320
on one piece of property. And it was a 1.7 with a two wet,

2024
02:13:49,320 --> 02:13:54,580
1.7 dry to get him to the two. I can imagine the

2025
02:13:54,580 --> 02:13:58,196
conversations. Any of us can put our own, put ourselves into

2026
02:13:58,196 --> 02:14:01,733
that same circumstance and say, do we buy this? Can we build a

2027
02:14:01,733 --> 02:14:05,536
house on it? No one is buying a piece of property. You know,

2028
02:14:05,536 --> 02:14:10,275
knowingly, that can have a house on it. You're not buying

2029
02:14:10,275 --> 02:14:16,347
parkland, you're not buying a lot. Um, but that being said,

2030
02:14:16,347 --> 02:14:20,285
if I can separate all of like, hey, how did we get here? To

2031
02:14:20,285 --> 02:14:24,289
the process, Miss Elder. To the process. This that was sitting

2032
02:14:24,289 --> 02:14:30,628
on the dais this morning. This these documents, um, BCC public

2033
02:14:30,628 --> 02:14:35,633
hearing agenda item DPC one exhibits I through l attached

2034
02:14:35,633 --> 02:14:39,170
documents were inadvertently left off the board item left

2035
02:14:39,170 --> 02:14:43,641
off the board item by who? We did. Yes, sir. Our office

2036
02:14:43,641 --> 02:14:47,841
with the rendering of the PDF. Um.

2037
02:14:48,780 --> 02:14:52,250
So we're only getting to see this right now. This morning.

2038
02:14:52,250 --> 02:14:56,521
They were not part of the PDF. Yes, sir. That's my fault.

2039
02:14:56,521 --> 02:15:00,792
If I'm going to do a process of specifically, did the process

2040
02:15:00,792 --> 02:15:02,660
work itself. Out?

2041
02:15:02,660 --> 02:15:09,734
This wasn't part of it. We did have an admission that mistakes

2042
02:15:09,734 --> 02:15:15,734
had potentially been made in the past. Mr. Donaldson, um,

2043
02:15:18,209 --> 02:15:20,745
who I obviously hold in very high regard, I was one of the

2044
02:15:20,745 --> 02:15:27,850
people that voted to make him have the position that he had

2045
02:15:27,850 --> 02:15:33,557
when when commission Chair Hurd asked us if we had any ex-parte

2046
02:15:33,557 --> 02:15:38,696
communications, I said none. And that's been filed. Now,

2047
02:15:38,696 --> 02:15:42,990
that's not just because I had not spoken with you ever or

2048
02:15:42,990 --> 02:15:46,580
anyone that represented you. I hadn't spoken to staff either

2049
02:15:46,580 --> 02:15:50,317
about this particular item. Now there's the agendas come every

2050
02:15:50,317 --> 02:15:52,919
two weeks and there's lots and there's certain things that I

2051
02:15:52,919 --> 02:15:56,323
need to have assistance and hear more deeply on that. I

2052
02:15:56,323 --> 02:16:00,928
would reach out to staff and say, hey, I need to know more

2053
02:16:00,928 --> 02:16:04,598
about this. And then there's times where staff will schedule

2054
02:16:04,598 --> 02:16:07,801
and request to meet with me and say, hey, look, we have an

2055
02:16:07,801 --> 02:16:09,603
agenda item that's coming up. It's going to have this and

2056
02:16:09,603 --> 02:16:12,673
this and this and this. I didn't do that either. I didn't

2057
02:16:12,673 --> 02:16:16,810
hear from them and I didn't ask them. But now all of a sudden

2058
02:16:16,810 --> 02:16:20,213
I'm here with a pretty complicated agenda item. And

2059
02:16:20,213 --> 02:16:24,551
it's funny because when I read the item, the agenda, we all

2060
02:16:24,551 --> 02:16:27,221
look and say, how many items are here, how many pages is it?

2061
02:16:27,221 --> 02:16:30,230
How long is the day going to. Be?

2062
02:16:30,230 --> 02:16:34,227
This looks like a short agenda, but there's no such thing

2063
02:16:34,227 --> 02:16:38,365
because it could be a two agenda, two item agenda, and it

2064
02:16:38,365 --> 02:16:42,350
could take all day. I am finding, and I've been up here

2065
02:16:42,350 --> 02:16:46,506
a while. I'm finding this to be pretty complicated. I'm finding

2066
02:16:46,506 --> 02:16:52,506
that the stakes are remarkably high for you. Remarkably high

2067
02:16:53,447 --> 02:16:57,251
because. And for us, because one of the first questions I

2068
02:16:57,251 --> 02:17:02,560
asked, which I wasn't trying to foretell the future, is what

2069
02:17:02,560 --> 02:17:05,726
would your next step be if you don't get a decision that you

2070
02:17:05,726 --> 02:17:09,930
like today? And our attorney, who I hold in very high regard

2071
02:17:09,930 --> 02:17:14,668
because I also helped her get that job, um, is you would sue

2072
02:17:14,668 --> 02:17:21,674
us now as a commissioner. All five of us. We are not, um,

2073
02:17:21,674 --> 02:17:25,479
we're not looking for lawsuits. A lot of people say, well, you

2074
02:17:25,479 --> 02:17:27,815
shouldn't be afraid of a lawsuit. And I always tell

2075
02:17:27,815 --> 02:17:31,951
people the same thing. I'm not afraid of a lawsuit. I'm afraid

2076
02:17:31,951 --> 02:17:37,224
of losing a lawsuit. I'm afraid of entering into a legal battle

2077
02:17:37,224 --> 02:17:41,228
where going in? I sort of feel nervous. Like it might not go

2078
02:17:41,228 --> 02:17:46,567
our way. Then I try to figure out that these are not only

2079
02:17:46,567 --> 02:17:50,570
professional colleagues of mine. I'll be perfectly honest

2080
02:17:50,570 --> 02:17:54,841
with you, they're friends. These are friends of mine. So

2081
02:17:54,841 --> 02:17:57,377
while I'm listening to you speak, that's why I asked you,

2082
02:17:57,377 --> 02:17:59,980
what do you do for a living? And you said firefighter. I

2083
02:17:59,980 --> 02:18:04,510
thought for sure you were going to tell me. Attorney. Because

2084
02:18:04,510 --> 02:18:10,651
that was, in my opinion, a very well presented appeal. Very

2085
02:18:11,792 --> 02:18:14,260
well done, you know, and I'm thinking, wow, this guy sharp,

2086
02:18:14,260 --> 02:18:17,531
he's got the details. He's he's not reading really from notes.

2087
02:18:17,531 --> 02:18:21,602
He knows his topic. You've also afforded yourself of the

2088
02:18:21,602 --> 02:18:25,710
process of what you could and could not do. Some people would

2089
02:18:25,710 --> 02:18:28,876
have just taken the punch and said, oh man, I'm screwed.

2090
02:18:28,876 --> 02:18:32,813
Excuse my language. You have it. So now I have to. I'm not

2091
02:18:32,813 --> 02:18:37,830
going to guess that you would sue us, but boy, the stakes are

2092
02:18:37,830 --> 02:18:40,421
high for you because otherwise you own a piece of property

2093
02:18:40,421 --> 02:18:43,824
that everyone will know will be nearly impossible for anyone

2094
02:18:43,824 --> 02:18:46,894
else to do anything with. So it's not like you could sell it

2095
02:18:46,894 --> 02:18:52,700
off. And I know I'm talking much longer than I chose to,

2096
02:18:52,700 --> 02:18:55,635
but I really want to lay this out, and I know that I'm also

2097
02:18:55,635 --> 02:19:00,374
speaking on the record that could my words could come up

2098
02:19:00,374 --> 02:19:06,847
again in the future. So in my personal opinion, there's some

2099
02:19:06,847 --> 02:19:12,186
gray areas here. This was not a absolutely you were wrong and

2100
02:19:12,186 --> 02:19:15,789
staff was right. It's not an absolute that the staff was

2101
02:19:15,789 --> 02:19:19,593
wrong and you were right. That's why this process, as far

2102
02:19:19,593 --> 02:19:24,398
as I know, this third step, you appealed it and then you

2103
02:19:24,398 --> 02:19:26,266
appealed it again to Mr. Donaldson, and then you

2104
02:19:26,266 --> 02:19:30,404
appealed it to us, is designed so that the five of us can use

2105
02:19:30,404 --> 02:19:35,142
our opinions, our life experiences, to decide if we

2106
02:19:35,142 --> 02:19:40,213
agree or not. I would never want to be known for as much as

2107
02:19:40,213 --> 02:19:44,751
I like Mr. Donaldson to be his rubber stamp, I'm certainly not

2108
02:19:44,751 --> 02:19:47,821
a rubber stamp. I don't believe any of the five of us up here

2109
02:19:47,821 --> 02:19:53,293
are going to be rubber stamps. So in my particular opinion,

2110
02:19:53,293 --> 02:19:59,990
enough has happened here that this is not a a an agreement

2111
02:19:59,990 --> 02:20:05,105
with Mr. Donaldson's opinion. I don't know what the what the

2112
02:20:05,105 --> 02:20:10,430
negotiated outcome could be versus it's just a simply a yes

2113
02:20:10,430 --> 02:20:18,185
or a no. But if that's the case, I think that you did what

2114
02:20:18,185 --> 02:20:21,321
I would assume you should have done before you purchased the

2115
02:20:21,321 --> 02:20:26,721
property. Once you purchased the property, the two questions

2116
02:20:26,794 --> 02:20:29,630
I had that Miss Elder brought up, which I thought were very

2117
02:20:29,630 --> 02:20:33,266
valid, is why did you withdraw the application when you would?

2118
02:20:33,266 --> 02:20:36,136
This would never have happened had you left. But you said that

2119
02:20:36,136 --> 02:20:41,342
was a split to make it to one acre buildable lot. So instead

2120
02:20:41,342 --> 02:20:45,145
of having a single home on this property, it could have been

2121
02:20:45,145 --> 02:20:48,682
two. And you didn't want to do that. Okay. And then the other

2122
02:20:48,682 --> 02:20:53,620
question was why didn't you personally contact the DEP? And

2123
02:20:53,620 --> 02:20:56,690
since I'm being as honest as possible, I didn't really love

2124
02:20:56,690 --> 02:20:59,893
your answer that you just didn't want to. That could have

2125
02:20:59,893 --> 02:21:03,430
been the end of it, potentially, but you weren't

2126
02:21:03,430 --> 02:21:08,435
mandated to. So I'm giving you a pass on. Why didn't you

2127
02:21:08,435 --> 02:21:12,839
contact the DEP? And then on our side, there's been a couple

2128
02:21:12,839 --> 02:21:16,977
of things. I mean, these are very great professional people

2129
02:21:16,977 --> 02:21:20,647
that have to deal with hundreds and hundreds of issues every

2130
02:21:20,647 --> 02:21:27,121
year. And in this particular case, especially if I were you,

2131
02:21:27,121 --> 02:21:32,126
when I hear that someone was able to do this and I thought

2132
02:21:32,126 --> 02:21:36,130
Mr. Schilling was very honest, that's his way. I mean, I think

2133
02:21:36,130 --> 02:21:39,733
he's one of the greatest growth management professionals in the

2134
02:21:39,733 --> 02:21:42,603
state of Florida. And he was honest. He could have sort of

2135
02:21:42,603 --> 02:21:45,406
danced around and said, hey, I don't know what happened. He

2136
02:21:45,406 --> 02:21:48,875
was very honest. And he said, look, we made a mistake in my

2137
02:21:48,875 --> 02:21:54,823
mind, that means something to you. It has happened. Someone

2138
02:21:54,823 --> 02:21:57,693
else got to do this. And I get that. That doesn't. That

2139
02:21:57,693 --> 02:21:59,828
mistake doesn't mean that we've just opened the floodgates and

2140
02:21:59,828 --> 02:22:04,990
now it's a precedent. But in this particular case, I would

2141
02:22:04,990 --> 02:22:09,304
make a motion to disagree with Mr. Donaldson's opinion.

2142
02:22:09,304 --> 02:22:14,242
Commissioner Hetherington. Yes, I echo much of what you

2143
02:22:14,242 --> 02:22:17,245
said, and I won't repeat it, except for the fact that I

2144
02:22:17,245 --> 02:22:21,249
don't think it was your responsibility to reach out to

2145
02:22:21,249 --> 02:22:26,649
DEP to, um, substantiate what your survey and, everything

2146
02:22:27,589 --> 02:22:31,526
claimed. I think your title, your survey actually was

2147
02:22:31,526 --> 02:22:36,926
evidence enough. And, um, I think there's enough reasonable

2148
02:22:37,799 --> 02:22:41,336
doubt. Well, we have tremendous, um, staff. There's

2149
02:22:41,336 --> 02:22:46,140
enough reasonable doubt to me that at least one of the three

2150
02:22:46,140 --> 02:22:51,120
criteria, one is due process. Um, fairly applicable. I have

2151
02:22:51,120 --> 02:22:56,412
questions about how the 4.1 e four, um, either was

2152
02:22:57,152 --> 02:23:03,158
interpreted versus what it says on the document, and I think

2153
02:23:03,158 --> 02:23:08,960
that you presented evidence. So I'm going to second the motion

2154
02:23:08,960 --> 02:23:10,632
commissioners. I'm looking at the, uh,

2155
02:23:10,632 --> 02:23:13,902
supplemental memo that was given to us this morning. And

2156
02:23:13,902 --> 02:23:20,375
it's it's a copy of an email correspondence from Amy, often

2157
02:23:20,375 --> 02:23:26,314
back to Cary Beaton. And among the things that it says is, um,

2158
02:23:26,314 --> 02:23:31,453
zoning, a1 future land use, rural density. And I'll read

2159
02:23:31,453 --> 02:23:35,390
from comprehensive plan the minimum lot size for

2160
02:23:35,390 --> 02:23:39,600
development required by the zoning and future land use is

2161
02:23:39,600 --> 02:23:44,460
two acres. Furthermore, it says there's a 75 foot shoreline

2162
02:23:46,334 --> 02:23:51,540
protection zone from mean high water line, wet side of seawall

2163
02:23:51,540 --> 02:23:55,944
or backside of mangroves exceeds rear setback. So she's

2164
02:23:55,944 --> 02:23:59,140
quoting the comprehensive plan and the and the development

2165
02:23:59,140 --> 02:24:06,214
regulations and saying you have to have two acres and you also

2166
02:24:07,288 --> 02:24:13,161
have to provide for a 75 foot shoreline protection zone from

2167
02:24:13,161 --> 02:24:18,100
mean high water line. And Mr. Beaton knew that he didn't have

2168
02:24:18,100 --> 02:24:21,770
two acres, and he also knew where the mean high water line

2169
02:24:21,770 --> 02:24:25,507
was, and also were the boundary. So I caution you, uh,

2170
02:24:25,507 --> 02:24:31,513
in this motion, that is it is an an admission that you don't

2171
02:24:31,513 --> 02:24:37,519
have to have two acres in order to get a building permit. So I.

2172
02:24:37,519 --> 02:24:38,787
Am. Are you asking me for.

2173
02:24:38,787 --> 02:24:41,856
My. I'm really. Really nervous about proceeding

2174
02:24:41,856 --> 02:24:46,795
with because you then say it's okay to not comply with the

2175
02:24:46,795 --> 02:24:48,795
Comprehensive Plan requirements.

2176
02:24:49,630 --> 02:24:51,533
Well, I think the only difference, Madam Chair,

2177
02:24:51,533 --> 02:24:54,802
respectfully, would be that he. You said he knew that he didn't

2178
02:24:54,802 --> 02:24:59,340
have two acres, and I think his testimony today was the the

2179
02:24:59,340 --> 02:25:03,110
argument here is that he believes that he does. That's

2180
02:25:03,110 --> 02:25:06,681
the point. I'm not agreeing that, you know, it's to roughly

2181
02:25:06,681 --> 02:25:13,281
two acres to build. It's he had 1.7 dry and 2.01 wet. The

2182
02:25:13,621 --> 02:25:19,561
question is, is that portion that's wet able to be part of

2183
02:25:19,561 --> 02:25:22,897
the calculation or not? He's not saying, hey, I thought I

2184
02:25:22,897 --> 02:25:26,368
had 1.7 and that's what I want. He's the argument that I'm

2185
02:25:26,368 --> 02:25:30,105
hearing is that he believes that he does. So when you say

2186
02:25:30,105 --> 02:25:33,107
he said he knew that he didn't, I don't believe that he knew

2187
02:25:33,107 --> 02:25:36,178
that he didn't. I think he even to this moment, he believes

2188
02:25:36,178 --> 02:25:39,514
that he does because I agree with you. I don't want people

2189
02:25:39,514 --> 02:25:44,510
to think, well, it's two or thereabouts. It's two. But what

2190
02:25:44,510 --> 02:25:46,988
we can't figure out right at this moment is, is it

2191
02:25:46,988 --> 02:25:51,660
legitimately two? But he's not saying 1.7. He's saying two.

2192
02:25:51,660 --> 02:25:56,664
May I, but I disagree. He knew that his boundary was two and

2193
02:25:56,664 --> 02:26:02,270
he knew that his dry land was 1.69. And he also knew or he

2194
02:26:02,270 --> 02:26:06,475
should have known because Amy Offenbach wrote to him and said

2195
02:26:06,475 --> 02:26:10,412
that you also have a shoreline protection zone from the mean

2196
02:26:10,412 --> 02:26:13,348
high water line, and you knew that there was a difference

2197
02:26:13,348 --> 02:26:16,952
between mean high water and boundary. You knew that that

2198
02:26:16,952 --> 02:26:21,222
was a 3/10 of an acre difference. May I know

2199
02:26:21,222 --> 02:26:24,359
Commissioner Vargas? Yeah. My question is, are we

2200
02:26:24,359 --> 02:26:27,295
ready to take a vote? You had enough evidence.

2201
02:26:27,295 --> 02:26:30,899
Commissioner Capps would like to make a comment. Commissioner

2202
02:26:30,899 --> 02:26:34,703
Capps.. So, uh, there are two big

2203
02:26:34,703 --> 02:26:41,903
issues at hand here. Um, the first one is, uh, policy 4.1 e

2204
02:26:41,910 --> 02:26:47,310
four, which basically, according to our staff and our

2205
02:26:48,516 --> 02:26:53,121
county attorney, means that we do not count submerged lands.

2206
02:26:53,121 --> 02:26:56,992
Uh, and lot size. And then there's the issue of whether

2207
02:26:56,992 --> 02:27:02,130
you own the submerged lands. And I heard the county attorney

2208
02:27:02,130 --> 02:27:05,534
say earlier that even if it were determined that you did

2209
02:27:05,534 --> 02:27:12,474
own the submerged lands, that's some future date. Uh, we do we

2210
02:27:12,474 --> 02:27:17,110
still do not count submerged lands toward lot size, and I

2211
02:27:17,110 --> 02:27:22,550
I'm gathering that that is an important, uh, precedent and

2212
02:27:22,550 --> 02:27:28,422
policy in our comprehensive plan. Um, and I am I am

2213
02:27:28,422 --> 02:27:33,222
satisfied with the county attorney's analysis and the

2214
02:27:34,161 --> 02:27:36,898
county administrator's decision. And I'm going to make

2215
02:27:36,898 --> 02:27:39,767
a substitute motion. You can't. We have a motion

2216
02:27:39,767 --> 02:27:40,568
and. A second.

2217
02:27:40,568 --> 02:27:41,703
You got a vote. On it.

2218
02:27:41,703 --> 02:27:44,105
Okay? We just have to vote on it. Yeah.

2219
02:27:44,105 --> 02:27:47,705
Okay. Any further comments? There's a

2220
02:27:47,776 --> 02:27:49,911
motion. So just to be clear, are we

2221
02:27:49,911 --> 02:27:55,383
going to issue the building permit or is the board not

2222
02:27:55,383 --> 02:27:59,120
agreeing with Mr. Donaldson and requiring the administrative

2223
02:27:59,120 --> 02:28:02,723
review hearing to be done again to analyze the different

2224
02:28:02,723 --> 02:28:05,667
policies? What's the direction? So we're clear because I'm

2225
02:28:05,667 --> 02:28:08,200
unclear with the motion. I know you disagree with Mr.

2226
02:28:08,200 --> 02:28:10,472
Donaldson, but what is the outcome that the board is

2227
02:28:10,472 --> 02:28:12,940
looking for? So we're clear. We can send it back to Mr.

2228
02:28:12,940 --> 02:28:15,409
Donaldson for another administrative review meeting.

2229
02:28:15,409 --> 02:28:18,747
You can say, based on the interpretation of the code, we

2230
02:28:18,747 --> 02:28:21,415
can issue the building permit. So we need to know what the

2231
02:28:21,415 --> 02:28:24,619
ultimate decision is. Was that outline coming into

2232
02:28:24,619 --> 02:28:28,690
this hearing? It's just based on your whether

2233
02:28:28,690 --> 02:28:31,920
you agree with Mr. Donaldson. But we need to know what the

2234
02:28:31,920 --> 02:28:33,628
next step would be. Can we go to the agenda item

2235
02:28:33,628 --> 02:28:36,764
and see what the recommendation was? Because from what I

2236
02:28:36,764 --> 02:28:40,501
understood of the presentation, introduction was that we were

2237
02:28:40,501 --> 02:28:45,106
to decide if we felt that the process of those three criteria

2238
02:28:45,106 --> 02:28:49,377
was met. Uh, not approving necessarily the building

2239
02:28:49,377 --> 02:28:51,780
permit, because what I'm hearing from my colleague,

2240
02:28:51,780 --> 02:28:54,516
Commissioner Capps, what I'm hearing from staff, this

2241
02:28:54,516 --> 02:28:57,652
gentleman is obviously very capable of making his. Let me

2242
02:28:57,652 --> 02:29:02,791
finish, please. He's capable of making his presentation. Um, I

2243
02:29:02,791 --> 02:29:05,793
was making my determination on not whether or not I think he

2244
02:29:05,793 --> 02:29:08,996
should be allowed to build his house on his property. It's.

2245
02:29:08,996 --> 02:29:13,334
Was he given a fair process through this? And I'm not

2246
02:29:13,334 --> 02:29:15,670
saying it was a travesty. I'm just saying that there was

2247
02:29:15,670 --> 02:29:18,673
enough that would tip it my way and then give him the

2248
02:29:18,673 --> 02:29:25,680
opportunity to do it, look into it a little further. But on the

2249
02:29:25,680 --> 02:29:30,819
other hand, just as a caution, this is not meant to just put

2250
02:29:30,819 --> 02:29:35,900
him back to the starting line for the same outcome I want.

2251
02:29:35,900 --> 02:29:38,426
And I know our staff can do. Let's work with this applicant.

2252
02:29:38,426 --> 02:29:44,632
Let's figure out a way if if it can't be that it's the the

2253
02:29:44,632 --> 02:29:49,170
point, whatever, uh, is wet and it can't be used in the

2254
02:29:49,170 --> 02:29:52,973
calculation. Let's help this gentleman and his family build

2255
02:29:52,973 --> 02:29:55,309
a house on his property, because otherwise we're

2256
02:29:55,309 --> 02:29:58,780
basically telling him it's worthless because no one's

2257
02:29:58,780 --> 02:30:02,500
going to buy it from him. If they can't build. I don't know

2258
02:30:02,500 --> 02:30:05,587
if splitting it into two lots so that you'd put two houses.

2259
02:30:05,587 --> 02:30:09,524
That probably is not really even the the feel, the the

2260
02:30:09,524 --> 02:30:12,860
nature of the neighborhood. Let's help them out. So my

2261
02:30:12,860 --> 02:30:18,399
motion is that I disagreed with Mr. Donaldson's decision based

2262
02:30:18,399 --> 02:30:21,870
on the process, and that he would have to go back and work

2263
02:30:21,870 --> 02:30:27,270
with staff fairly and, uh, accurately to create an

2264
02:30:28,810 --> 02:30:30,411
opportunity. Okay.

2265
02:30:30,411 --> 02:30:32,680
So the alternative recommendation, I just wanted

2266
02:30:32,680 --> 02:30:34,215
to clarify that because it was unclear.

2267
02:30:34,215 --> 02:30:35,550
Okay. Mr. Walden, can.

2268
02:30:35,550 --> 02:30:39,287
You remind me? I just want to point out that a path forward

2269
02:30:39,287 --> 02:30:44,225
was presented to the applicant to rezone and reclassify the

2270
02:30:44,225 --> 02:30:48,229
land use on the property. Uh, Mr. Beaton's made the assertion

2271
02:30:48,229 --> 02:30:52,767
that that, uh, land use and zoning change was to make two

2272
02:30:52,767 --> 02:30:56,704
lots. That's not the case. That was to make it whole and

2273
02:30:56,704 --> 02:31:00,842
buildable. So you have a disagreement between staff and

2274
02:31:00,842 --> 02:31:05,460
Mr. Beaton as to the intent of that land use change? We saw it

2275
02:31:05,460 --> 02:31:09,517
from a competent land use attorney that they wanted to

2276
02:31:09,517 --> 02:31:13,654
make the lot buildable. Staff complied with that and was

2277
02:31:13,654 --> 02:31:16,524
going to take it forward. Understood. But now he's

2278
02:31:16,524 --> 02:31:19,594
hitting the reset button. He he thought that he had a different

2279
02:31:19,594 --> 02:31:23,465
path forward. It ended up right here in front of us. I know

2280
02:31:23,465 --> 02:31:27,669
that our staff will be professional and non unbiased

2281
02:31:27,669 --> 02:31:31,406
in helping him go forward. We can't tell him what to do. He

2282
02:31:31,406 --> 02:31:34,475
might just as readily say I'm hiring an attorney and suing

2283
02:31:34,475 --> 02:31:38,746
us. I hope that's not the case, but he's hitting the reset

2284
02:31:38,746 --> 02:31:41,348
button. So what I would recommend for all parties

2285
02:31:41,348 --> 02:31:44,953
concerned is that whatever has happened in the past remain in

2286
02:31:44,953 --> 02:31:49,230
the past, and we take what you've heard from us today and

2287
02:31:49,230 --> 02:31:53,270
we don't even know what the decision will be. Um, move

2288
02:31:53,270 --> 02:31:56,898
forward, because I'm assuming your ultimate goal for you. I'm

2289
02:31:56,898 --> 02:32:01,236
sure, for your wife, is to get this settled and build the

2290
02:32:01,236 --> 02:32:03,236
house. Sir.

2291
02:32:04,906 --> 02:32:09,706
Commissioner Hetherington. I've lost my train of thought.

2292
02:32:09,977 --> 02:32:13,648
Except for I did want to chime in that I believe that there's

2293
02:32:13,648 --> 02:32:17,719
a private property. Rights are so very important to me, and I

2294
02:32:17,719 --> 02:32:23,858
think there's enough doubt here that I lean into, um, having

2295
02:32:23,858 --> 02:32:28,329
this resolved. And for you to be able to build your family's

2296
02:32:28,329 --> 02:32:33,729
home, maintain my second. What's what? What is the

2297
02:32:35,136 --> 02:32:37,138
motion? So there's an alternative.

2298
02:32:37,138 --> 02:32:40,474
Sorry. There's an alternate alternate recommendation in the

2299
02:32:40,474 --> 02:32:43,344
agenda item. So I was just clarifying if that was the

2300
02:32:43,344 --> 02:32:46,614
motion made by Commissioner Campi. So it just means that

2301
02:32:46,614 --> 02:32:49,617
you are going to adopt a resolution reversing the county

2302
02:32:49,617 --> 02:32:52,821
administrator's decision, remanding the building permit

2303
02:32:52,821 --> 02:32:54,755
back to staff for further review.

2304
02:32:54,755 --> 02:32:58,955
Correct. Does that mean that that's he's

2305
02:32:59,560 --> 02:33:01,428
going to be receiving a building permit?

2306
02:33:01,428 --> 02:33:04,699
It means staff will work with him like we have to see if

2307
02:33:04,699 --> 02:33:09,103
there's an alternate way forward. Um, with the goal of

2308
02:33:09,103 --> 02:33:13,107
trying to work it out with them. But there's no guarantee.

2309
02:33:13,107 --> 02:33:14,642
Okay. Commissioner Vargas.

2310
02:33:14,642 --> 02:33:18,579
Okay. So, um, I've heard everybody's comments here from

2311
02:33:18,579 --> 02:33:23,317
the Dei, and of course, the department. Um, and I work with

2312
02:33:23,317 --> 02:33:27,588
them. Last year and a half, and I think they're wonderful. Uh,

2313
02:33:27,588 --> 02:33:31,725
they're inconsistencies here. We have to do the right thing.

2314
02:33:31,725 --> 02:33:36,263
I disagree with Mr. Donaldson. I want to follow along and go

2315
02:33:36,263 --> 02:33:42,263
ahead and approve the motion that was made by Commissioner

2316
02:33:43,137 --> 02:33:46,207
Campi and seconded by Commissioner Hetherington to

2317
02:33:46,207 --> 02:33:49,544
move forward. We want to do the right thing with you. You've

2318
02:33:49,544 --> 02:33:53,744
done a lot of homework. I understand.

2319
02:33:54,140 --> 02:33:56,414
Thank you. Mr. Donaldson.

2320
02:33:57,180 --> 02:34:00,821
So, following the remanding back to staff to review it, it

2321
02:34:00,821 --> 02:34:05,693
comes back to the two, um, just to say what our decisions will

2322
02:34:05,693 --> 02:34:09,764
be based upon. It comes back to the two fundamental questions

2323
02:34:09,764 --> 02:34:14,368
that Mr. Beaton brought up, which is one, the do you

2324
02:34:14,368 --> 02:34:18,177
include the entire lot boundary in the analysis for the zoning

2325
02:34:18,177 --> 02:34:22,782
district? And number two, the evidence of whether or not the

2326
02:34:22,782 --> 02:34:27,119
property owner owns that property could only be based

2327
02:34:27,119 --> 02:34:33,119
upon what was submitted and not any post evidentiary evidence

2328
02:34:33,326 --> 02:34:38,726
that's been supplied. That's my understanding of what staff's

2329
02:34:38,998 --> 02:34:42,802
job would be to do right now. Is that just remanded back for

2330
02:34:42,802 --> 02:34:45,202
further review? Anyway, limited.

2331
02:34:45,204 --> 02:34:50,543
So yeah, I want to make sure that that's not the case. It's

2332
02:34:50,543 --> 02:34:53,813
not just a review. The information that has already

2333
02:34:53,813 --> 02:34:59,886
been done. I want the more of a robust review. Mr. Waldon said

2334
02:34:59,886 --> 02:35:04,424
that there was some possibilities to, uh, work

2335
02:35:04,424 --> 02:35:07,627
something out that can have a house built on the property. I

2336
02:35:07,627 --> 02:35:14,827
would also, um, ask staff to go back and review the Largo

2337
02:35:14,834 --> 02:35:19,340
approvals decision. Those were inland waters. It's

2338
02:35:19,390 --> 02:35:21,107
not the same. I understand, but it was when

2339
02:35:21,107 --> 02:35:24,444
we were counting. I remember the debate of whether or not

2340
02:35:24,444 --> 02:35:27,514
those lot sizes would count water. I get that it's not the

2341
02:35:27,514 --> 02:35:31,450
Loxahatchee, but I'm just trying to create a situation.

2342
02:35:31,450 --> 02:35:36,550
Look, I'm trying to be very respectful of staff and not say

2343
02:35:36,550 --> 02:35:39,726
that the board or three of the board would approve a building

2344
02:35:39,726 --> 02:35:43,462
permit for this gentleman. That's not our job. That's not

2345
02:35:43,462 --> 02:35:47,467
what we even asked to do here today. I could make an

2346
02:35:47,467 --> 02:35:52,338
alternative motion to just grant him a building permit,

2347
02:35:52,338 --> 02:35:56,743
but I have always said that I value the professional

2348
02:35:56,743 --> 02:36:01,948
experience and and education of our staff. I'm asking that I

2349
02:36:01,948 --> 02:36:05,151
trust our staff to work with this gentleman who's obviously

2350
02:36:05,151 --> 02:36:08,354
capable to create an opportunity where he can build

2351
02:36:08,354 --> 02:36:12,425
a house on his property. I know that if we brainstorm and when

2352
02:36:12,425 --> 02:36:17,630
I say we, I don't mean me. I mean you all brainstorm to give

2353
02:36:17,630 --> 02:36:21,901
an opportunity to build a house here. If you need to come back

2354
02:36:21,901 --> 02:36:26,439
and, and it needs to have some kind of, uh, decision made by

2355
02:36:26,439 --> 02:36:32,450
staff for some change. The goal here is to help our residents

2356
02:36:32,450 --> 02:36:35,648
and landowners build on their property. That's as simple as

2357
02:36:35,648 --> 02:36:37,784
it could possibly be. And I know that our staff is trying

2358
02:36:37,784 --> 02:36:40,787
to do that. Madam chair, madam chair, may

2359
02:36:40,787 --> 02:36:44,657
I, Paul Schilling, for the record. So, um, that very

2360
02:36:44,657 --> 02:36:48,128
avenue or similar was presented about a year ago to the

2361
02:36:48,128 --> 02:36:52,865
applicant of, of ensuing or taking that land use change.

2362
02:36:52,865 --> 02:36:57,870
We've we've analyzed this property for many, many hours.

2363
02:36:57,870 --> 02:37:01,474
Um, and in fact, the only conclusion that I've come to

2364
02:37:01,474 --> 02:37:05,478
personally is that a land use change and rezoning would be

2365
02:37:05,478 --> 02:37:11,618
necessary. So, um, as did the previous owner. So, um, that,

2366
02:37:11,618 --> 02:37:15,221
that in theory would take out the ownership issue of the

2367
02:37:15,221 --> 02:37:20,426
submerged land, um, and so. Let me ask you a question on

2368
02:37:20,426 --> 02:37:23,896
that then, because basically our decision is to agree with

2369
02:37:23,896 --> 02:37:29,169
that or not at this point. Um, what will that entitle for him?

2370
02:37:29,169 --> 02:37:32,972
He's got to go all the way back to the drawing board.

2371
02:37:32,972 --> 02:37:35,442
Uh, it depends on your definition of drawing board,

2372
02:37:35,442 --> 02:37:39,450
but that would be the mechanism that would. We already have.

2373
02:37:39,450 --> 02:37:42,648
Uh, we've analyzed that application several years ago.

2374
02:37:42,648 --> 02:37:47,319
We could, uh, reevaluate it and then bring it back to the be a

2375
02:37:47,319 --> 02:37:49,856
small scale change, uh, land use change.

2376
02:37:49,856 --> 02:37:52,592
It would be decided by you. Decided by you.

2377
02:37:52,592 --> 02:37:54,260
Okay. Does it still come back to us?

2378
02:37:54,260 --> 02:37:56,463
Yes, sir. Sir. You heard?

2379
02:37:56,463 --> 02:37:58,865
That's fair. What are you thinking about? That.

2380
02:37:58,865 --> 02:38:01,467
Um. That was the proposal that

2381
02:38:01,467 --> 02:38:05,205
staff gave me originally. Um, is is to to do a land use

2382
02:38:05,205 --> 02:38:08,740
change. Uh, the neighborhood is highly against the land use

2383
02:38:08,740 --> 02:38:10,343
change. It's a very unique neighborhood. All the lots are

2384
02:38:10,343 --> 02:38:13,479
two acre lots. No one in that neighborhood. They were going

2385
02:38:13,479 --> 02:38:15,949
to come with pitchforks to the meeting. They had said staff

2386
02:38:15,949 --> 02:38:18,351
approved it, and they did. They they was going through the

2387
02:38:18,351 --> 02:38:21,687
process and staff was going to recommend it to the board. But

2388
02:38:21,687 --> 02:38:24,224
the neighborhood is extremely against a rezone. They're all

2389
02:38:24,224 --> 02:38:27,493
two acre tracts of land. People like it the way that it is.

2390
02:38:27,493 --> 02:38:29,829
They don't want to start seeing these lots get split into

2391
02:38:29,829 --> 02:38:32,565
different densities, and it doesn't need to be there. There

2392
02:38:32,565 --> 02:38:35,968
does not need to be a land use change for it. Um, the

2393
02:38:35,968 --> 02:38:38,437
ownership issue keeps coming up. There is no ownership

2394
02:38:38,437 --> 02:38:41,774
issue. This was something that was created by Mr. Donaldson.

2395
02:38:41,774 --> 02:38:44,777
If DEP has an issue, they can take me to court.

2396
02:38:44,777 --> 02:38:47,179
They can. Okay, so let's do this because I think we need to

2397
02:38:47,179 --> 02:38:51,250
wrap this up. I hear your point about splitting it. And if I

2398
02:38:51,250 --> 02:38:54,253
lived in that neighborhood and it's a two acre neighborhood, I

2399
02:38:54,253 --> 02:38:56,322
don't know if I would want because how many vacant lots

2400
02:38:56,322 --> 02:38:58,590
are still there? Uh, there's a handful, and

2401
02:38:58,590 --> 02:39:00,993
they're all less than two acres, so. Okay. Dry land.

2402
02:39:00,993 --> 02:39:03,620
So this. Is so let let that be somebody

2403
02:39:03,620 --> 02:39:06,399
else's problem. You're going to try to figure out a way that

2404
02:39:06,399 --> 02:39:11,204
says the two acres, your combined two acres of what?

2405
02:39:11,204 --> 02:39:14,607
You've been paying taxes on all this time. That's the that's

2406
02:39:14,607 --> 02:39:16,875
the avenue you're going to have to take. But I'm just saying

2407
02:39:16,875 --> 02:39:19,812
that my motion is that you and staff go back and try to work

2408
02:39:19,812 --> 02:39:21,812
that. Out.

2409
02:39:22,215 --> 02:39:24,616
I'm just fearful they're going to say the same thing. Well,

2410
02:39:24,616 --> 02:39:26,850
you can't use your submerged lands and you.

2411
02:39:26,850 --> 02:39:28,870
Have to. I don't I won't.

2412
02:39:28,870 --> 02:39:31,223
Reassure you that this is a group that they're not

2413
02:39:31,223 --> 02:39:35,940
vindictive. Uh, the five of us will be watching. This is a

2414
02:39:35,940 --> 02:39:38,964
professional group. I have the highest regard for, uh. They

2415
02:39:38,964 --> 02:39:43,970
hurt us. They sat right here. Um, I'm looking at Mr. Dolan,

2416
02:39:43,970 --> 02:39:48,774
Mr. Schilling and Mr. Walden. Um, you're going to be in good

2417
02:39:48,774 --> 02:39:51,310
hands. They heard from us that we want you to be able to build

2418
02:39:51,310 --> 02:39:55,314
a house on the property. So short of you being over at the

2419
02:39:55,314 --> 02:39:58,184
courthouse. Let's see if we can't work this out, because it

2420
02:39:58,184 --> 02:40:02,321
doesn't do any of us any good. You or the county taxpayers, to

2421
02:40:02,321 --> 02:40:05,792
let this go to the next level of a lawsuit for a judge to

2422
02:40:05,792 --> 02:40:08,861
figure it out. So try to work with DEP, try to figure out if

2423
02:40:08,861 --> 02:40:13,610
your scenario is accurate, then it's accurate.

2424
02:40:14,800 --> 02:40:20,200
Mr. Donaldson. This, as you said, this is a

2425
02:40:26,213 --> 02:40:31,217
difficult one. And the challenge by your I believe I

2426
02:40:31,217 --> 02:40:35,956
understand the the direction you want us to do. Obviously.

2427
02:40:35,956 --> 02:40:41,227
And, um, you know, certainly staff felt in their prior

2428
02:40:41,227 --> 02:40:44,300
recommendations to the previous property owner and to Mr.

2429
02:40:44,300 --> 02:40:48,340
Beaton that that was a, an a process by which we could get

2430
02:40:48,340 --> 02:40:51,504
to the end. And certainly we recognize that you can have

2431
02:40:51,504 --> 02:40:55,175
disagreements by neighborhoods, but in this case we would we

2432
02:40:55,175 --> 02:40:57,911
still felt that it was appropriate next door. Jason

2433
02:40:57,911 --> 02:41:00,980
Subdivision has a similar estate density. It would be

2434
02:41:00,980 --> 02:41:02,850
matching that. Actually more dense.

2435
02:41:02,850 --> 02:41:08,455
More so I think, um, and then your direction today is for an

2436
02:41:08,455 --> 02:41:12,125
expedient report review and, and work with Mr. Beaton so

2437
02:41:12,125 --> 02:41:15,596
that he can actually get a building permit without having

2438
02:41:15,596 --> 02:41:20,133
to come back to this board or through a lengthy process.

2439
02:41:20,133 --> 02:41:23,737
Ultimately, the the you've heard the challenges here, and

2440
02:41:23,737 --> 02:41:30,744
I just want you to understand that, um, your motion. While it

2441
02:41:30,744 --> 02:41:34,148
remits it back to a process, throws it back into the gray.

2442
02:41:34,148 --> 02:41:37,217
So it all I'm suggesting is we can take it like that, or you

2443
02:41:37,217 --> 02:41:39,753
can be more directive and and. This.

2444
02:41:39,753 --> 02:41:42,153
Today, the building. Permit.

2445
02:41:42,156 --> 02:41:46,356
Okay. I make a motion that directs

2446
02:41:46,493 --> 02:41:49,280
staff to create a building permit for this gentleman on

2447
02:41:49,280 --> 02:41:49,963
his. Property.

2448
02:41:49,963 --> 02:41:54,301
And second. amend my. Oh, was that the original

2449
02:41:54,301 --> 02:41:55,435
motion? Yeah, I was changing.

2450
02:41:55,435 --> 02:41:58,372
My amending. So you have a second..

2451
02:41:58,372 --> 02:42:01,308
A building permit in violation of the elders and the

2452
02:42:01,308 --> 02:42:05,508
Comprehensive Plan. Okay. Is there a second.

2453
02:42:05,645 --> 02:42:08,450
Second? Any further discussion?

2454
02:42:08,515 --> 02:42:11,515
No. All those in favor?

2455
02:42:16,923 --> 02:42:18,391
Aye, aye. Opposed?

2456
02:42:18,391 --> 02:42:21,729
Opposed. That motion passes 3 to 2 with

2457
02:42:21,729 --> 02:42:26,800
commissioners Heard and Capps dissenting. Uh, let's take a

2458
02:42:26,800 --> 02:42:29,800
ten minute break. Thank you.

2459
02:58:45,547 --> 02:58:48,417
We are back taking up Department one, which is the

2460
02:58:48,417 --> 02:58:51,200
Office of Management and Budget items, which require board

2461
02:58:51,200 --> 02:58:54,620
approval. Miss Murley. Good afternoon, Commissioner

2462
02:58:55,224 --> 02:58:57,644
Stephanie Murley, the director of the Office of Management and

2463
02:58:57,644 --> 02:59:03,116
Budget, here to present ten items today. Yeah. Um, item

2464
02:59:03,116 --> 02:59:06,520
number one is a permission to apply for the Florida

2465
02:59:06,520 --> 02:59:09,389
Department of Environmental Protection, or FDP, for the

2466
02:59:09,389 --> 02:59:13,460
bathtub beach sale. Sailfish Point beach joint nourishment

2467
02:59:13,460 --> 02:59:18,532
project. Our public works is requesting a grant. Award of

2468
02:59:18,532 --> 02:59:22,132
$1,575,380, um, for the construction and feasibility

2469
02:59:25,271 --> 02:59:28,808
funds for the bathtub, Beach and Sailfish. Sailfish Point

2470
02:59:28,808 --> 02:59:31,744
Beach restoration project. There is a grant match of

2471
02:59:31,744 --> 02:59:36,820
approximately 2.6 million, which is budgeted within the FY

2472
02:59:36,820 --> 02:59:42,820
27 Bathtub Beach CIP sheet. Item number two is a permission

2473
02:59:44,758 --> 02:59:49,162
to apply for FDP Saint Lucie Inlet Management project.

2474
02:59:49,162 --> 02:59:53,633
Public works is requesting application of 5.9 million for

2475
02:59:53,633 --> 02:59:57,237
design costs for the bypassing south at the Saint Lucie Inlet

2476
02:59:57,237 --> 03:00:01,240
State Park. There is a grant match of 5.9 million, which is

2477
03:00:01,240 --> 03:00:05,379
programmed in the FY 27 Saint Lucie Inlet Management Plan.

2478
03:00:05,379 --> 03:00:09,649
CIP shape. This is. The coastal show, by the way.

2479
03:00:09,649 --> 03:00:13,249
Today. Item number three is a

2480
03:00:13,720 --> 03:00:17,790
permission to apply for the local government funding or the

2481
03:00:17,790 --> 03:00:22,195
GFR from FDP for the shore protection project. Public

2482
03:00:22,195 --> 03:00:26,395
works is requesting application for $206,865 for monitoring

2483
03:00:28,802 --> 03:00:31,710
funds for the Martin County Hutchinson Island Shore

2484
03:00:31,710 --> 03:00:36,471
Protection Project. There is a grant match of $243,135, which

2485
03:00:36,743 --> 03:00:42,143
is programmed with the FY 27 Coastal Beach management CIP.

2486
03:00:44,170 --> 03:00:47,287
Item number four is a permission to apply for the FY

2487
03:00:47,287 --> 03:00:53,287
2728 FDP, l for for MacArthur Boulevard Dune project. Um. Our

2488
03:00:55,228 --> 03:00:59,320
public works is requesting application of 2.2 million for

2489
03:00:59,320 --> 03:01:01,968
design, construction and immediate post construction

2490
03:01:01,968 --> 03:01:04,770
monitoring funds for the MacArthur Boulevard Dune Beach

2491
03:01:04,770 --> 03:01:08,575
project. There is a grant match of 2.2 million, which is

2492
03:01:08,575 --> 03:01:12,311
programmed within the FY 27 coastal MacArthur Boulevard

2493
03:01:12,311 --> 03:01:18,911
project. CIP sheet. Item number five is a permission to accept

2494
03:01:18,918 --> 03:01:21,720
the Florida Department of State, Division of Library and

2495
03:01:21,720 --> 03:01:25,725
Information Services, State Aid to Libraries grant funds. Our

2496
03:01:25,725 --> 03:01:31,125
library is receiving $81,448. That helps fund a full time

2497
03:01:32,732 --> 03:01:35,668
library specialist with our Martin County Library System.

2498
03:01:35,668 --> 03:01:41,341
There is no no local grant match required on that one.

2499
03:01:41,341 --> 03:01:44,677
Item number six is a permission to accept the centers for

2500
03:01:44,677 --> 03:01:48,280
Disease Control and Prevention, or CDC Drug-Free communities

2501
03:01:48,280 --> 03:01:51,417
grant, um, our Health and Human Services Department is

2502
03:01:51,417 --> 03:01:56,355
requesting the acceptance of 125,000 for year six of funding

2503
03:01:56,355 --> 03:02:00,930
that helps expand and support local efforts that aim to

2504
03:02:00,930 --> 03:02:03,496
reduce and prevent youth substance abuse. There is a

2505
03:02:03,496 --> 03:02:08,330
grant match required of 125,000, but that is provided

2506
03:02:08,330 --> 03:02:10,437
through in-kind match dollars through Martin County Staff

2507
03:02:10,437 --> 03:02:15,908
time and coalition member time. Item number seven is a

2508
03:02:15,908 --> 03:02:19,245
permission to accept the FDP Saint Lucie Inlet Management

2509
03:02:19,245 --> 03:02:23,116
Plan Implementation Project grant. This is requesting

2510
03:02:23,116 --> 03:02:27,253
acceptance of 3.4 million for permit required sediment

2511
03:02:27,253 --> 03:02:32,530
sediment bypass monitoring cost. There is a $3.4 million

2512
03:02:32,392 --> 03:02:37,130
match that is programmed with the current FY 26 CIP. Saint

2513
03:02:37,130 --> 03:02:42,530
Lucie Inlet management budget. Item number eight is a

2514
03:02:42,936 --> 03:02:46,606
permission to accept amendment number two for the FDP Saint

2515
03:02:46,606 --> 03:02:50,143
Lucie Inlet Management Plan Implementation Project. This is

2516
03:02:50,143 --> 03:02:53,679
amendment number two. That's increasing the FDP share by

2517
03:02:53,679 --> 03:02:58,840
425,000, and will also be utilized for permit required

2518
03:02:58,840 --> 03:03:02,622
monitoring. There is additional grant match of 425,000, which

2519
03:03:02,622 --> 03:03:05,958
is programmed with the FY 27. Saint Lucie Inlet Management

2520
03:03:05,958 --> 03:03:12,310
Plan, CIP sheet. Item number nine is a permission to accept

2521
03:03:12,310 --> 03:03:15,235
amendment number three for FDP for the Martin County Shore

2522
03:03:15,235 --> 03:03:18,505
Protection Project. This is the Third Amendment that will

2523
03:03:18,505 --> 03:03:23,305
increase the FDP share by $206,865 for permit required

2524
03:03:24,110 --> 03:03:28,310
monitoring. There is an additional match of $243,135

2525
03:03:29,715 --> 03:03:33,319
that is programmed within the FY 27 beach management CIP

2526
03:03:33,319 --> 03:03:38,991
budget, and item number ten is adjustments to the FY 26

2527
03:03:38,991 --> 03:03:42,795
budget. Um, our Martin County Fire Rescue Department is in

2528
03:03:42,795 --> 03:03:46,199
receipt of additional grant funds from the um, Florida

2529
03:03:46,199 --> 03:03:49,802
Department of Health, Emergency Medical Services, or EMS grant

2530
03:03:49,802 --> 03:03:55,700
in the amount of $3,539, which is used for operating expenses

2531
03:03:55,700 --> 03:03:58,144
in small non-capital equipment needs within the Fire rescue

2532
03:03:58,144 --> 03:04:01,347
department. And this is just OMB requesting a budget

2533
03:04:01,347 --> 03:04:03,750
resolution to accept those funds.

2534
03:04:03,750 --> 03:04:09,489
Questions for Miss Murley. Is there a motion to approve?

2535
03:04:09,489 --> 03:04:12,292
So moved. Second, there's a motion. And a

2536
03:04:12,292 --> 03:04:16,162
second. All those in favor? Aye, aye. Opposed. That motion

2537
03:04:16,162 --> 03:04:21,233
passes unanimously. Will take up Department two, which is

2538
03:04:21,233 --> 03:04:23,970
contracts that meet the threshold for board approval of

2539
03:04:23,970 --> 03:04:26,970
$1 million or greater. Miss Brotherton.

2540
03:04:26,972 --> 03:04:29,309
Good afternoon, Christy Brotherton, your chief

2541
03:04:29,309 --> 03:04:32,912
procurement officer. I have several contracts for your

2542
03:04:32,912 --> 03:04:36,916
consideration. The first one is a pre-positioned contract for

2543
03:04:36,916 --> 03:04:41,588
disaster related debris removal. And this contract has

2544
03:04:41,588 --> 03:04:45,191
a maximum not to exceed value of $3 million, with the maximum

2545
03:04:45,191 --> 03:04:49,662
not to exceed term of five years. And staff is

2546
03:04:49,662 --> 03:04:52,465
recommending that the board award the contract to the three

2547
03:04:52,465 --> 03:04:56,736
highest scoring ranked firms, which is Serra's Environmental

2548
03:04:56,736 --> 03:05:01,941
Services, DRC Emergency Services and Ash Britt and move

2549
03:05:01,941 --> 03:05:04,677
that the board authorize the county administrator, or

2550
03:05:04,677 --> 03:05:08,300
designee to execute all documents related to this

2551
03:05:08,300 --> 03:05:13,302
request. Next, we have a contract for the Sailfish Sands

2552
03:05:13,302 --> 03:05:18,102
Golf Course Pump Station replacement project, and staff

2553
03:05:19,241 --> 03:05:21,576
is recommending that the board award the contract to the

2554
03:05:21,576 --> 03:05:25,181
highest scoring, responsive and responsible proposer. Centroid

2555
03:05:25,181 --> 03:05:30,581
diversified in the amount of $1,569,068.47 and move that the

2556
03:05:33,655 --> 03:05:36,592
board authorize the County administrator, or designee, to

2557
03:05:36,592 --> 03:05:41,992
execute all documents related to this request. Uh, number

2558
03:05:42,664 --> 03:05:45,670
three, we have another continuing services agreement

2559
03:05:45,670 --> 03:05:48,604
for household hazardous waste collection, transportation and

2560
03:05:48,604 --> 03:05:52,608
disposal services. Uh, this contract has a maximum not to

2561
03:05:52,608 --> 03:05:56,144
exceed value of $1 million and a maximum not to exceed term of

2562
03:05:56,144 --> 03:06:01,150
five years. And staff is recommending that the board

2563
03:06:01,150 --> 03:06:03,619
award the contract to the lowest responsive and

2564
03:06:03,619 --> 03:06:06,955
responsible bidder, which is Republic Services, doing

2565
03:06:06,955 --> 03:06:10,693
business as US ecology Tampa. And move that the board

2566
03:06:10,693 --> 03:06:13,295
authorize the county administrator or designee to

2567
03:06:13,295 --> 03:06:19,100
execute all documents related to this request. Number four is

2568
03:06:19,100 --> 03:06:22,104
a continuing services agreement for landscape maintenance for

2569
03:06:22,104 --> 03:06:25,373
utilities and solid waste facilities. This contract has a

2570
03:06:25,373 --> 03:06:29,177
maximum not to exceed value of 1.5 million, and a maximum not

2571
03:06:29,177 --> 03:06:34,649
to exceed term of five years. And staff is recommending that

2572
03:06:34,649 --> 03:06:37,252
the board award the contract to the lowest responsive and

2573
03:06:37,252 --> 03:06:39,988
responsible bidder, which is Treasure Coast Lawn and

2574
03:06:39,988 --> 03:06:43,580
Landscape, and move that the board authorize the County

2575
03:06:43,580 --> 03:06:46,195
administrator or designee to execute all documents related

2576
03:06:46,195 --> 03:06:51,400
to this request. And last, we have the Floridan Aquifer

2577
03:06:51,400 --> 03:06:56,405
supply wells. North Jensen row five, and Tropical Farms Row

2578
03:06:56,405 --> 03:07:01,805
eight projects and staff is recommending that the board

2579
03:07:01,810 --> 03:07:04,213
award the contract to the lowest responsive and

2580
03:07:04,213 --> 03:07:08,160
responsible bidder, which is all Webbs enterprises, in the

2581
03:07:08,160 --> 03:07:12,816
amount of $7,492,300. This includes the base bid and

2582
03:07:13,822 --> 03:07:18,930
alternates. Um, move that the board approve a budget transfer

2583
03:07:18,930 --> 03:07:20,429
from the utilities capital reserves in the amount of

2584
03:07:20,429 --> 03:07:25,229
$3,681,500 to the well TFR zero eight project and $1,910,800

2585
03:07:29,705 --> 03:07:35,105
for, well, Naro five project and $299,937 for the related

2586
03:07:37,513 --> 03:07:41,490
construction phase engineering services for well TFR zero

2587
03:07:41,490 --> 03:07:43,852
eight and move that the board authorize the county

2588
03:07:43,852 --> 03:07:47,122
Administrator or designee to execute all documents related

2589
03:07:47,122 --> 03:07:51,393
to this request done. Thank you. Questions for Mr.

2590
03:07:51,393 --> 03:07:53,395
Perry. Well presented motion to accept

2591
03:07:53,395 --> 03:07:56,999
that. beautiful work. Second. Oh, come on, Mr. Vargas.

2592
03:07:56,999 --> 03:08:02,399
Yes, I have a question. The. Excuse me, 3 million 681 500.

2593
03:08:03,805 --> 03:08:07,409
You're transferring from the capital reserve. So how is that

2594
03:08:07,409 --> 03:08:09,878
going to be replenished? Um, let me.

2595
03:08:09,878 --> 03:08:12,147
Pass that over. And then you want.

2596
03:08:12,147 --> 03:08:15,417
To the. It was put there specifically for this project.

2597
03:08:15,417 --> 03:08:19,488
So it's not to be replenished. You have capital reserves that

2598
03:08:19,488 --> 03:08:22,424
the utility department is holding funds for these

2599
03:08:22,424 --> 03:08:26,829
projects. And then we're pulling it out. So it's not a.

2600
03:08:26,829 --> 03:08:30,165
It's it's. Your, your your microphone.

2601
03:08:30,165 --> 03:08:36,704
So the funds and the capital reserve, um, are um, were

2602
03:08:36,704 --> 03:08:40,776
specifically placed in there for these for, for capital

2603
03:08:40,776 --> 03:08:44,246
projects like this. So the point is, is that there isn't

2604
03:08:44,246 --> 03:08:48,851
the, the replenishment comes over time based upon the

2605
03:08:48,851 --> 03:08:52,921
utilities department or putting in funds to, um, into the

2606
03:08:52,921 --> 03:08:56,792
capital fund for future expenditures. So it is a

2607
03:08:56,792 --> 03:09:00,992
reserve specifically for capital construction. Um, and

2608
03:09:01,130 --> 03:09:05,400
its replenishment is is only needed for future capital

2609
03:09:05,400 --> 03:09:11,273
projects as defined in the CIP or um, in the in the

2610
03:09:11,273 --> 03:09:14,276
department's budget. Okay. I was trying to clarify

2611
03:09:14,276 --> 03:09:18,880
this is not an additional, um, expense to our taxpayers,

2612
03:09:18,880 --> 03:09:21,149
correct. To replenish that account.

2613
03:09:21,149 --> 03:09:24,419
No, it is not. So if you look at the fiscal impact, it says

2614
03:09:24,419 --> 03:09:27,220
funding for this project will be provided through utilities,

2615
03:09:27,220 --> 03:09:31,760
CFC funds. That's capital facilities charges. So, um,

2616
03:09:31,760 --> 03:09:34,963
that's their equivalent of impact fees. So every time a

2617
03:09:34,963 --> 03:09:38,567
building permit is provided or a development is done, they

2618
03:09:38,567 --> 03:09:42,571
they provide capital facility charges, they go into the

2619
03:09:42,571 --> 03:09:46,442
capital reserve budget of the utilities department. Um, and

2620
03:09:46,442 --> 03:09:50,378
it's earmarked it can only stay for utilities. And then as the

2621
03:09:50,378 --> 03:09:53,382
utilities needs to do plan expansions or other things,

2622
03:09:53,382 --> 03:09:58,530
those monies get moved out of that capital facility's charge.

2623
03:09:58,530 --> 03:10:04,659
Um, uh, reserve fund, uh, and then moved into the CIP. Uh,

2624
03:10:04,659 --> 03:10:07,996
through actions like this. So the board has authorized the

2625
03:10:07,996 --> 03:10:14,203
use of CFCs, which is a revenue. It goes into the, um,

2626
03:10:14,203 --> 03:10:19,274
and you also recognize that a revenue in your budget and, uh,

2627
03:10:19,274 --> 03:10:22,945
and then it can't be spent until it's moved out of reserve

2628
03:10:22,945 --> 03:10:27,149
fund into the project fund, as we're doing here.

2629
03:10:27,149 --> 03:10:29,551
Um. This is not something that

2630
03:10:29,551 --> 03:10:32,220
we're borrowing funds for. I think you and I had a

2631
03:10:32,220 --> 03:10:35,290
discussion about. Yeah, this is not a borrowing

2632
03:10:35,290 --> 03:10:39,494
action. This is simply taking funds that have been, uh, built

2633
03:10:39,494 --> 03:10:43,432
up over time. This is a pay as you go project, if you will.

2634
03:10:43,432 --> 03:10:47,636
Um, if there is a borrowing action that will have a, um,

2635
03:10:47,636 --> 03:10:50,772
one will have a larger audience of consultants and bond counsel

2636
03:10:50,772 --> 03:10:54,977
here, uh, going through that and uh, um, which the utilities

2637
03:10:54,977 --> 03:10:59,777
department does on occasion for significant project upgrades.

2638
03:11:03,585 --> 03:11:05,788
Just wanted to be certain about that, because you and I spoke

2639
03:11:05,788 --> 03:11:09,591
about another matter, I think, that dealt with, uh, borrowing

2640
03:11:09,591 --> 03:11:11,193
funds. There is nothing that's being

2641
03:11:11,193 --> 03:11:12,861
borrowed on this particular project.

2642
03:11:12,861 --> 03:11:17,661
Today. Uh huh. Okay. Any further questions? There's

2643
03:11:17,744 --> 03:11:20,948
a motion and a second. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed.

2644
03:11:20,948 --> 03:11:24,951
That motion passes unanimously. Thank you. We will now take up

2645
03:11:24,951 --> 03:11:28,488
Department three, which is adoption of a resolution

2646
03:11:28,488 --> 03:11:31,910
updating the list of county owned properties appropriate

2647
03:11:31,910 --> 03:11:34,695
for affordable housing under resolution number 24. Dash

2648
03:11:34,695 --> 03:11:39,495
6.15, adopted on June 18th, 2024, and authorizing the sale

2649
03:11:40,834 --> 03:11:45,634
of such properties through public auction. Miss Segura,

2650
03:11:45,906 --> 03:11:50,844
good afternoon, Carlos Segura, road property manager, um, as

2651
03:11:50,844 --> 03:11:53,312
you discuss. This, um, current resolution

2652
03:11:53,312 --> 03:11:57,850
that we have directed staff to sell two county owned surplus

2653
03:11:57,850 --> 03:12:00,453
affordable housing properties through the request for

2654
03:12:00,453 --> 03:12:04,530
proposal process to nonprofit organizations, affordable

2655
03:12:04,724 --> 03:12:09,462
housing communities or land trusts, um, and other

2656
03:12:09,462 --> 03:12:14,670
associated facilities. Um the resolution also required that

2657
03:12:14,670 --> 03:12:17,270
each property remain unsold until the completion of the

2658
03:12:17,270 --> 03:12:20,540
related infrastructure improvements for each of their

2659
03:12:20,540 --> 03:12:25,145
projects. The new Monrovia had the water and sewer project,

2660
03:12:25,145 --> 03:12:31,351
and the Camino Trail had, uh, that project, uh, the Golden

2661
03:12:31,351 --> 03:12:34,821
Gate is what I meant to say. Sorry. Um, the proposed

2662
03:12:34,821 --> 03:12:39,250
resolution would instead authorize staff to market and

2663
03:12:39,250 --> 03:12:42,963
sell these properties through the county's contracted public

2664
03:12:42,963 --> 03:12:46,900
auction process. The public auctions have proven to be more

2665
03:12:46,900 --> 03:12:50,303
effective method for selling county owned properties by

2666
03:12:50,303 --> 03:12:54,574
expanding public participation and creating a more competitive

2667
03:12:54,574 --> 03:12:59,974
sales process. The two properties are. One is the

2668
03:13:00,313 --> 03:13:05,384
parcel on 47th Avenue in New Monrovia, and the other one is

2669
03:13:05,384 --> 03:13:09,723
between. It's in Golden Gate, between Hawthorne and Irish

2670
03:13:09,723 --> 03:13:13,392
streets, um, where the Camino Trail is running through. Both

2671
03:13:13,392 --> 03:13:17,630
properties have already been presented to their appropriate

2672
03:13:17,630 --> 03:13:21,863
Cras, and the agencies have received the required

2673
03:13:22,680 --> 03:13:26,873
authorization to move forward with those. Um staff is

2674
03:13:26,873 --> 03:13:29,943
requesting that the board consider one of the following

2675
03:13:29,943 --> 03:13:34,147
actions. Rescind the resolution and adopt the proposed

2676
03:13:34,147 --> 03:13:37,551
resolution. Updating the county surplus affordable housing

2677
03:13:37,551 --> 03:13:41,751
properties in accordance with section one, 25379. Florida

2678
03:13:42,355 --> 03:13:46,293
Statutes, and authorize staff to market and sell both

2679
03:13:46,293 --> 03:13:49,963
properties through the county's contracted public auction

2680
03:13:49,963 --> 03:13:54,701
process for affordable housing. Or we did a supplemental memo

2681
03:13:54,701 --> 03:14:00,106
where we would sell the, um, residential property in New

2682
03:14:00,106 --> 03:14:04,906
Monrovia through the auction process and possibly just

2683
03:14:05,645 --> 03:14:10,851
donate the property in Golden Gate to the Community Land

2684
03:14:10,851 --> 03:14:17,451
Trust. Um, we also would like the, um, board to authorize

2685
03:14:19,392 --> 03:14:22,796
staff to revise the language within the proposed resolution

2686
03:14:22,796 --> 03:14:26,466
to mirror the recommendation and authorize the chair to

2687
03:14:26,466 --> 03:14:31,866
execute any documents necessary to complete the transaction. If

2688
03:14:33,740 --> 03:14:37,340
there's any questions. Questions for staff.

2689
03:14:41,948 --> 03:14:44,618
Public comment. Would anyone from the public

2690
03:14:44,618 --> 03:14:48,154
like to address this? First, Commissioner Vargas.

2691
03:14:48,154 --> 03:14:51,891
Okay, so I'm understanding as to sell both parcels via

2692
03:14:51,891 --> 03:14:56,960
auction or the other is sell one parcel and then donate it

2693
03:14:56,960 --> 03:15:00,896
to a land trust. Is that correct? Correct.

2694
03:15:02,835 --> 03:15:05,238
Mr. Ranieri, would you like to to address this?

2695
03:15:05,238 --> 03:15:08,307
Yes. Thank you. Commissioner Rob Ranieri, CEO for House of

2696
03:15:08,307 --> 03:15:11,511
Hope, also a board member for the Martin County Community

2697
03:15:11,511 --> 03:15:17,451
Land Trust. Uh, here today to ask you to, uh, act on the

2698
03:15:17,451 --> 03:15:21,654
second request from staff to donate the Golden Gate parcels

2699
03:15:21,654 --> 03:15:25,658
to the Martin County Land Trust. We have an opportunity,

2700
03:15:25,658 --> 03:15:29,195
uh, working jointly with House of Hope, the county staff and

2701
03:15:29,195 --> 03:15:34,595
the land trust to potentially develop some affordable, um,

2702
03:15:35,602 --> 03:15:38,671
transitional housing in the Golden Gate community to be

2703
03:15:38,671 --> 03:15:43,276
used to help residents that are, in challenging times, to have

2704
03:15:43,276 --> 03:15:47,347
an affordable roof over their head. While House of Hope

2705
03:15:47,347 --> 03:15:51,351
provides wraparound services to those individuals or families

2706
03:15:51,351 --> 03:15:55,551
to help them move forward. Commissioner Campi.

2707
03:15:55,889 --> 03:15:58,958
Thank you. I think that that's a great idea for several

2708
03:15:58,958 --> 03:16:03,296
reasons. One, we, uh, constantly speak about how

2709
03:16:03,296 --> 03:16:06,433
we're trying to address affordable housing and and

2710
03:16:06,433 --> 03:16:10,103
transitional housing for our residents. This will be a

2711
03:16:10,103 --> 03:16:12,773
concrete step to show that we're actually trying. It's not

2712
03:16:12,773 --> 03:16:16,109
massive, but it's a step. It's like a sale. It's like a

2713
03:16:16,109 --> 03:16:20,913
starfish. Um, and then also we went through a tremendous

2714
03:16:20,913 --> 03:16:24,851
amount of effort, both on the private side and the county

2715
03:16:24,851 --> 03:16:28,387
employees, to create the land trust. And if all we do is

2716
03:16:28,387 --> 03:16:31,658
create it and then just let it wither on its own, then we

2717
03:16:31,658 --> 03:16:34,794
haven't accomplished much. So this is a step in the right

2718
03:16:34,794 --> 03:16:38,465
direction to show that we are legitimately interested in

2719
03:16:38,465 --> 03:16:43,300
creating a robust land trust. Uh, so I would make a motion to

2720
03:16:43,300 --> 03:16:45,339
accept the second recommendation.

2721
03:16:45,339 --> 03:16:48,675
Commissioner Vargas. Yes. Um, Mr. Ranieri, who would

2722
03:16:48,675 --> 03:16:52,345
be building this housing? Uh, the Martin County Land

2723
03:16:52,345 --> 03:16:57,145
Trust would be responsible for the construction, maintenance,

2724
03:16:58,840 --> 03:17:01,822
um, property management of of any facilities that are built

2725
03:17:01,822 --> 03:17:06,560
on the on the parcels. So, so in perpetuity, we'd be

2726
03:17:06,560 --> 03:17:09,629
responsible for this. How much money is in the land trust

2727
03:17:09,629 --> 03:17:12,566
right now. So the land trust is in its

2728
03:17:12,566 --> 03:17:16,770
early stages. It's a newer nonprofit to the community. Um,

2729
03:17:16,770 --> 03:17:20,400
we're waiting for some other land that the county had

2730
03:17:20,400 --> 03:17:23,243
authorized previously to provide to the land trust down

2731
03:17:23,243 --> 03:17:27,121
in Hope sound. Um, so we're beginning our fundraising and

2732
03:17:27,121 --> 03:17:30,991
development efforts. We've built a pretty strong board,

2733
03:17:30,991 --> 03:17:35,596
um, to navigate the land trust. And now we're trying to move

2734
03:17:35,596 --> 03:17:39,200
forward with some projects to actually utilize land for the

2735
03:17:39,200 --> 03:17:42,469
common purpose of creating affordable housing in

2736
03:17:42,469 --> 03:17:44,869
perpetuity across the community.

2737
03:17:47,274 --> 03:17:49,674
Commissioner Hetherington. Yes. Um.

2738
03:17:50,678 --> 03:17:53,414
I think that this. Has been something that the

2739
03:17:53,414 --> 03:17:56,951
Golden Gate community has, um, looked at.

2740
03:17:56,951 --> 03:18:01,889
For years.. And, um. I would like to see it

2741
03:18:01,889 --> 03:18:04,692
sometime in the near future because community, the land

2742
03:18:04,692 --> 03:18:08,830
trust, um, has been effective, it seems, in hopes and I would

2743
03:18:08,830 --> 03:18:14,501
love to have a presentation on, um, sort of the status and the

2744
03:18:14,501 --> 03:18:16,971
success, because I know Commissioner Jenkins and

2745
03:18:16,971 --> 03:18:21,509
Commissioner Capps are very, um, very intricate level

2746
03:18:21,509 --> 03:18:25,646
involved, um, in the land trust. But I will support this.

2747
03:18:25,646 --> 03:18:28,182
But I would like to see the community land trust, sort of a

2748
03:18:28,182 --> 03:18:31,385
presentation in the near future on where they're at and where

2749
03:18:31,385 --> 03:18:34,788
their vision is and where they hope to go.

2750
03:18:34,788 --> 03:18:37,788
Sure. Thank you. Mr. Capps.

2751
03:18:38,926 --> 03:18:42,196
This by way of review about what a land trust is for those

2752
03:18:42,196 --> 03:18:50,596
who may not know, uh, the land trust owns the land and the the

2753
03:18:51,720 --> 03:18:57,672
occupants of the housing on their, uh, house or their unit

2754
03:18:58,479 --> 03:19:01,348
in the apartment building or condo building or whatever you

2755
03:19:01,348 --> 03:19:07,210
want to call it. And and this enables them to stabilize their

2756
03:19:07,210 --> 03:19:11,826
housing costs and to build equity. Right. Those are the

2757
03:19:11,826 --> 03:19:14,762
purposes. Yes. So that would be, um, the

2758
03:19:14,762 --> 03:19:21,362
purpose for any, uh, any parcel that the, the construction on

2759
03:19:21,502 --> 03:19:24,705
it, the housing put on, it was going to be up for sale for

2760
03:19:24,705 --> 03:19:28,242
residential and not keeps the price affordable for the buyer,

2761
03:19:28,242 --> 03:19:31,979
but also again keeps that unit in affordable housing in

2762
03:19:31,979 --> 03:19:35,183
perpetuity. Um, for these lots, we've been discussing the

2763
03:19:35,183 --> 03:19:38,920
opportunity for transitional housing so that housing would

2764
03:19:38,920 --> 03:19:43,924
be maintained and owned by the land trust in addition to the

2765
03:19:43,924 --> 03:19:48,396
land and the land trust would charge a nominal rent, uh, to

2766
03:19:48,396 --> 03:19:51,999
the person or persons that are living in the homes. Um, and

2767
03:19:51,999 --> 03:19:55,402
then again, like, uh, like I mentioned, the part of the it's

2768
03:19:55,402 --> 03:19:59,607
a, it's a full transitional housing project that we want to

2769
03:19:59,607 --> 03:20:03,277
develop. So the residents would be working with House of Hope.

2770
03:20:03,277 --> 03:20:08,615
Um, and whatever areas of need they have, career coaching. Um,

2771
03:20:08,615 --> 03:20:12,815
medical assistants, um, case management, family centered

2772
03:20:12,820 --> 03:20:15,623
coaching, all different programs and services available

2773
03:20:15,623 --> 03:20:19,227
through House of Hope to help to elevate those residents to a

2774
03:20:19,227 --> 03:20:23,498
higher plateau so that by the end of the transitional period,

2775
03:20:23,498 --> 03:20:27,368
they're either, um, financially ready to purchase a home,

2776
03:20:27,368 --> 03:20:30,370
potentially through the land trust or habitat or the general

2777
03:20:30,370 --> 03:20:33,441
market, or they move on to another rental opportunity. And

2778
03:20:33,441 --> 03:20:37,311
then that transitional home that they had lived in, uh,

2779
03:20:37,311 --> 03:20:40,848
becomes available for the next person or family that may need

2780
03:20:40,848 --> 03:20:45,519
that support. And also, this is just another

2781
03:20:45,519 --> 03:20:48,723
example of a partnership that we're creating. Um, and in

2782
03:20:48,723 --> 03:20:51,259
order to protect Martin County's interest, we will, of

2783
03:20:51,259 --> 03:20:53,928
course, have development agreements and contracts that

2784
03:20:53,928 --> 03:20:56,931
will provide protection to the county.

2785
03:20:56,931 --> 03:20:58,132
That's what. I'm asking for. The

2786
03:20:58,132 --> 03:21:01,802
contribution that the county is making in perpetuity. So these

2787
03:21:01,802 --> 03:21:03,871
we've done them. We've we've done them with habitat. We've

2788
03:21:03,871 --> 03:21:07,141
done them with Miss Butterfly. They're they're different. The

2789
03:21:07,141 --> 03:21:10,344
legal department makes sure that, that our interests are

2790
03:21:10,344 --> 03:21:14,544
protected. That guy right there is going

2791
03:21:15,749 --> 03:21:18,749
to make sure. Those three.

2792
03:21:19,219 --> 03:21:23,240
So there's a motion and a second. Right? Yes. All in

2793
03:21:23,240 --> 03:21:27,428
favor I opposed that motion passes unanimously. Wonderful.

2794
03:21:27,428 --> 03:21:29,430
Thank you very much, commissioners. Good luck.

2795
03:21:29,430 --> 03:21:31,833
Great. Have a great day. Thanks.

2796
03:21:31,833 --> 03:21:35,102
We are now at the end of our meeting. Mr. Erler, would you

2797
03:21:35,102 --> 03:21:40,575
like to speak to us? This is the end of our meeting. Okay. I

2798
03:21:40,575 --> 03:21:43,440
don't see anybody else who needs to speak to us.

2799
03:21:43,440 --> 03:21:45,179
Commissioner Hetherington, any further comments?

2800
03:21:45,179 --> 03:21:47,480
All set today. How about you, Commissioner

2801
03:21:47,480 --> 03:21:49,250
Campi? You talked out yet? Mm.

2802
03:21:49,250 --> 03:21:53,450
Yeah. No such thing. Uh. Oh, gosh.

2803
03:21:53,787 --> 03:21:56,791
But I have. Nothing to add currently.

2804
03:21:56,791 --> 03:21:58,859
Thank you. Commissioner Capps. I'm good.

2805
03:21:58,859 --> 03:22:00,661
And, Commissioner Vargas. Thank you so much.

2806
03:22:00,661 --> 03:22:04,650
How about you, Mr. Donaldson? And Miss Zelda?

2807
03:22:04,650 --> 03:22:07,650
Yeah, right. We are adjourned.