[This transcript was generated automatically from audio using AI and hasn't been reviewed by a person -- it can contain mistakes, including plausible-sounding sentences that were never actually said. Treat it as a starting point, not a verbatim record.]

[0:05] All in a lot of ways. Yeah. It's the ordinance meeting. Nice. Yeah. You know,
[0:14] take my hand.
[0:20] Good
[0:26] evening. I'm Brian Miller, Chair of the Game Board of Finance. I call this regular meeting of the Board of Finance to order at 7.02 p.m. on August 17th.
[0:42] So, as a reminder, the role of the board is to review the talent's finances carefully,
[0:47] transparently, and to make recommendations that reflect both fiscal responsibility and
[0:50] a long-term interests of our residents, while we may bring different perspectives,
[0:55] and the priorities that table share a common goal, serving the talent's integrity,
[0:59] diligence, and respect for the resources entrusted to us.
[1:02] I want to emphasize that this board functions best when we work together in a spirit of collaboration,
[1:06] mutual respect, thoughtful discussion, and different viewpoint strength in our decisions
[1:09] for our commitments with Tad and Naitsos.
[1:13] That will proceed with the agenda.
[1:17] One was roll call.
[1:21] Vice Chair Bob Nanu, here.
[1:24] Welcome back and we thank the person here, Bob.
[1:27] Great to have you in person with us.
[1:28] Thanks.
[1:30] A member can I'm free here.
[1:33] A member of the bank, Barry.
[1:35] A
[1:40] member of the accounting.
[1:42] Present.
[1:43] A member of the department called here.
[1:45] All right.
[1:46] for the record. Member Bagbury is participating remotely. Thank you. Roll call has been taken,
[1:51] warm as present. We will proceed. So we'll kick off the meeting tonight with public participation
[1:57] as usual. Please try to keep to a three minute time limit or speaker on any item. We will begin with
[2:05] comments from those folks in the room and then move to those who would like to participate remotely.
[2:10] And for the board, we did receive board emails throughout the day today that I forward
[2:15] to the long team guys and keep those in mind as well as comment for the evening.
[2:20] All right.
[2:22] Good
[2:27] evening.
[2:29] Good evening.
[2:30] My name is Kim Bowen and I live at 1-4-4 Cherry Park Road.
[2:35] I'm speaking tonight because I am not in favor of the board of finance reciting the federal
[2:42] of legions at the start of his meetings.
[2:46] I think that there are many reasons why one would not
[2:49] feel comfortable doing that.
[2:51] And while there's an option, there are several options.
[2:55] One can remain seated, stand and not put his hand
[3:00] up or his heart.
[3:02] Believe the room.
[3:03] I think those are all options that
[3:05] might make someone uncomfortable and feel
[3:10] will compel to stand and join in saying the pledge.
[3:13] So for that reason, I would rather not have
[3:16] pledged to leave this recited.
[3:18] Thank you.
[3:20] Thank you for your comments.
[3:22] All right, we'll move to those folks who are online.
[3:25] If you'd like to make public comment,
[3:27] please raise your hand at this time.
[3:41] The mic is unmuted.
[3:44] All right, Michelle, you have been unmuted.
[3:46] Please proceed with your public comment
[3:50] after you unmute yourself on your own.
[3:51] Yes.
[3:52] Okay.
[3:52] Can you all hear me?
[3:54] Yes.
[3:55] Okay.
[3:56] Excellent.
[3:56] I was just getting my notes in order, so I apologize because my name, first of all, Michelle
[4:03] Kulak, 167 Hill Street, I wanted to start with a little bit of a history lesson.
[4:08] So the Pledge of Allegiance, for those who don't know, as we know it, minus the phrase
[4:14] under God, which I will get to, owes its origins to a marketing campaign, the intent of which
[4:20] was to inspire American nationalism in school children and to sell some American flags
[4:25] to public schools.
[4:27] It was written in 1892 by Francis Bellamy, who was a Baptist minister and a Christian
[4:33] socialist, a fact I did not know until today.
[4:37] Bellamy's pledge came with a salute eventually removed in 1942 due to its similarities to
[4:43] the Nazi salute adopted in Germany in the 1930s.
[4:47] The phrase under God was added in 1954 in part as a way to differentiate the United States
[4:56] of America from quote unquote godless communist countries.
[5:02] It has quite the colorful history.
[5:06] In 1943 in West Virginia State Board of Education versus Barnett, the Supreme Court ruled
[5:14] that public school students are not required to state the pledge.
[5:19] It was justice, this is where I was looking, hang on one second, okay, it was justice
[5:25] Robert H. Jackson who said, if there is any fixed star in our constitutional constellation,
[5:32] it is that no official high or petty can prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism,
[5:40] religion, or other matters of opinion, or four citizens to confess by word or act
[5:46] their faith therein. If there are any circumstances which permit an exception,
[5:51] they do not now occur to us. I have to say that I agree. I have many personal
[5:57] feelings regarding the Pledge of Allegiance, especially when it comes to school
[6:01] children who by virtue of many of their age, not all of them, but most of them, are
[6:09] cannot give consent to say the pledge, cannot possibly understand it nor give
[6:13] consent. But tonight I will leave it at this. I do not believe a recitation of
[6:21] the pledge is necessary at town meetings. I believe it is performative and could
[6:26] potentially take focus away from what we are actually here to do and who we are
[6:31] here to serve. It is not important to me for my elected officials to pledge a
[6:37] allegiance to an inanimate object. Instead, I would rather they pledge allegiance to those
[6:44] they serve because it is not about the flag itself. It is about the flesh and blood beneath it.
[6:52] And that's all I have to say. And I appreciate your time, guys. Thank you very much for all you do.
[6:58] Thank you for your comments, Michele.
[7:07] I'm black for you, Mike, is on the agenda.
[7:11] All right, Tom, your mic has been on duty.
[7:13] Please proceed.
[7:14] Good evening, Tom.
[7:15] Glad to see you again, Connecticut.
[7:18] Wow, I don't know how to follow that last speaker.
[7:21] Particularly an elected official would make those comments remarks.
[7:25] First of all, I do implore that speaker to look up the general statutes,
[7:29] 10-2-30, which is a Connecticut general statutes.
[7:32] We just stay law, we're all schools in Connecticut,
[7:35] like at least public schools have to provide a time each day for students who want to say
[7:41] the pledge, to recite the pledge.
[7:47] Secondarily, the pledge allegiance, we recite it to show loyalty to the U.S. and the core
[7:51] values of freedom, unity, and democracy, and it was kind of pointing that the chairman
[7:57] mentioned the word, you know, unity or unification, uniformity in his open remarks, and that's
[8:03] something that we should all embrace.
[8:06] And I'm not sure where we've departed as a society
[8:10] where we can't say 31 words
[8:12] which will take approximately 10 seconds to recite.
[8:15] And I have a real hard time,
[8:16] I listen to the last meeting, the comments
[8:18] that were made, the opposition.
[8:20] And there was no substantive comments, you know,
[8:23] divisiveness, you don't have to recite it.
[8:25] People take a knee when the national anthem
[8:28] is recited or sung, you know.
[8:32] So there you don't have to say the word got you don't have to stand up like I said the state the Supreme Court
[8:37] Is that as much US Supreme Court and state law doesn't allow it
[8:40] But why we are back paddling away from embracing unity loyalty patriotism and particularly the veterans on this board
[8:49] And all those folks that lost their lives and given either their life or life and limb
[8:53] For sacrifices for our freedom. I don't know why we as a country are back and away from that the other two boards were cited
[9:00] the main boards in this town and I implored this board to do it. There's no
[9:05] harm in doing it. No one's going to be alienated. No one's going to be offended.
[9:09] And if they don't want to recite it or say it, whether it's the word God, or if
[9:13] they can't stand up and spend 10 seconds with saying 31 words or 30 if you take
[9:18] out God, looking at the flag and embracing the United States of America, then you
[9:24] know, I'm really at a loss for words. So again, I don't know who would speak
[9:28] against this. It's very shameful and embarrassing to be quite frank, but I implore you to vote in favor of it. Thank you.
[9:38] Thank you for your comments.
[9:40] All
[9:47] right,
[9:51] already been unmuted. Please proceed with your poll to comment.
[9:57] Hi, good evening. Can you hear me okay?
[9:59] Yes.
[10:01] Okay.
[10:02] Aubrey Blatchley-Bart Drive. I spoke already the last time this was on your agenda in favor of adding to the pledge of allegiance.
[10:10] And I just I won't repeat the comments I made then I just wanted to add because the discussion of the board followed and it it did give rise to some other comment for me.
[10:24] The discussion seemed to center around from your board anyway that this is a board of finance meeting and some suggested that the pledge has nothing to do with municipal finance, but I would respectfully disagree the work of this board is not separate
[10:38] it from the principles of our country.
[10:41] It exists because of them.
[10:42] Every budget decision, every allocation of tax dollars
[10:45] and every act of public service that you carry out
[10:49] or any of the other boards, which I'll say
[10:51] because several other board members have now spoken
[10:53] out public comment from different boards.
[10:55] Every act of public service is carried out
[10:57] under the authority of a government that's founded
[11:00] on the very ideals that our pledge represents.
[11:05] So to me, this isn't about politics
[11:07] for making a statement, it's a few seconds at the beginning of a meeting to recognize
[11:12] the country and the principles that make local government what you're all doing here
[11:17] and what we all elected you to do possible.
[11:20] Thank you.
[11:24] Thank you for your comments.
[11:37] All right.
[11:37] Sarah, you've been unmuted.
[11:38] Please proceed when you're ready.
[11:40] Thank you very much.
[11:41] Can you hear me all right?
[11:43] Yes, we can.
[11:44] Good.
[11:45] with Sarah Faulkner, 25-Dyar Avenue.
[11:48] With respect to both blatchlies, I understand their position and I understand how strong
[11:53] they feel about saying the pledge.
[11:55] And I would like to disagree with their premises and agree with Kim.
[12:01] I have been a teacher for 27 years and the pledge is recited in school every single morning
[12:06] and every single school I've been in.
[12:08] And it's quite true that you don't have to recite it.
[12:11] You could stay seated or you could stand up.
[12:13] not put your hand over your heart. That's allowed. But when you do something like that and the majority of people are reciting a pledge, especially in a governmental setting like ours, it makes those who choose to not do that feel ostracized and identified.
[12:30] And I think that our role, especially in a local government, is to embrace everyone and to make our actions transparent and open to all people.
[12:39] And to start off a meeting with something that by its very nature causes people to feel separate is inappropriate.
[12:47] And this is with full respect to our military and to our country.
[12:51] As you know, I'm a selectman. I served at the Board of Finance for eight years.
[12:54] I served at the Conservation Commission for 30 years.
[12:58] And I am a patriot. I absolutely am. And my dad was a veteran.
[13:02] But I do not think that stating the pleasure of allegiance, the beginning of all of our meetings,
[13:07] is either appropriate or embracing to the public.
[13:11] And I think we need to be conscious of that.
[13:13] Whenever we do something like this,
[13:15] whether it's prayer in school
[13:17] or it is reciting the pleasure of lesions
[13:20] or singing the same song
[13:22] or having Christmas decorations up,
[13:24] we are doing something alienates part of our population.
[13:28] And I think we need to be conscious of making sure
[13:30] we really encourage everyone to participate
[13:32] and feel equally welcome.
[13:34] And the pledge is a divider,
[13:35] particularly in these times of a lot of political upheaval in this country.
[13:40] I have a flag up in front of my house, I am a patriot, I love the country, I wouldn't volunteer
[13:45] for it if I didn't feel that way, but I do not think it's appropriate to force people
[13:50] to recite the Pledge of Allegiance, or necessarily to even have to participate or stand there
[13:56] and watch others participate because then they will feel more unwelcome.
[13:59] So I respectfully disagree, I think the principles of our country are founded on individual
[14:04] rights and I think by pushing us to recite something that some people may not feel comfortable
[14:10] reciting is not a principle of our country and it's not being respectful of individuals.
[14:16] So thank you for your time, that's my opinion.
[14:20] Thank you for your comments.
[14:22] If anyone else on the line would like to make a public comment, now is the time to raise
[14:27] your hand.
[14:38] All right, seeing none, thank you everyone who emailed in, there are clouds for the evening
[14:44] tonight.
[14:45] Thank you, those of the person in the room who shared their comments tonight and those online who also shared their thoughts and thoughts.
[14:52] I always appreciate hearing from those who participate in our meetings.
[14:59] Thank you.
[15:00] We're taking the time to do so. All right, and with that, we'll move on and close public comment. Move on with the rest of the meeting. agenda item two updates from the chair. I don't have any particular updates at this time. And we have no new business on the agenda. So we'll move straight to our old business, which is the topic that was the focus of our public comment, so meeting opening procedure.
[15:32] So while this topic of how to open up the board of finance meetings, what's the best way
[15:39] to do it?
[15:40] What's the best way to state our community together?
[15:43] This is a reprisal of this agenda item from two months ago.
[15:47] We had some debate on chair opinions on this board or opinions from the public.
[15:54] And upon number on freeze requests, we delayed this further discussion on this.
[16:00] and so Nutri-McGullag to be back from vacation.
[16:04] So now that we have our full board here,
[16:06] I think we can go forward with the rounding out
[16:09] our discussion at this topic.
[16:11] I do regret that this has turned into a referendum
[16:14] on the question of allegiance,
[16:15] which is not the business of this board.
[16:20] But there's strong feelings about it on both sides,
[16:23] so it is what it is.
[16:25] With that, I'll open it up to this board
[16:29] to share any additional thoughts, reactions you have on the topic, and go from there.
[16:37] So, start with down at the other table with Madam Annem.
[16:46] Thank you. I can only reference my personal experience with this. I was a high school teacher
[16:52] for 23 years, and what the school did not say the pledge. Every day of the week it did
[17:00] on Mondays, the man to the pledge be said, and to tell you the truth, this is high school.
[17:09] My home was usually the upper-classmen, junior sub-sacers. It caused consternation among the kids in a room,
[17:19] especially the ostracizing those who chose not to participate. It did create much discord.
[17:29] And it seemed to me a bizarre way to start the school week with Discord.
[17:35] This issue is a personal issue.
[17:38] I don't think it's all right to demand one way or another, even with exclusions.
[17:45] People be subjected to the pledge of allegiance personally.
[17:51] I don't mind saying the pledge of allegiance.
[17:53] But I respect the behaviors and needs of other people that we should not be creating a situation
[18:03] that begins a meeting with unrest.
[18:07] It's divisive.
[18:09] It's no secret that the country has two different views on this.
[18:14] And I think it's a battle that we shouldn't withdraw from.
[18:18] Thank you.
[18:20] Thanks, Bob.
[18:27] I appreciate everybody's comments and I'm from the letters that we received to Cam and everyone online.
[18:36] I think I just have confusion myself overall because I'm just curious on how we got here as a board of finance.
[18:45] was it because we were not saying the Pledge of Allegiance and people residents were upset
[18:55] at that or we were saying it and the residents didn't like us to say it.
[19:03] Were we just not saying a period with a certain board if it was a chairman or someone decided
[19:07] that we were just weren't going to say it, I think that's where my confusion is, not that
[19:12] matters.
[19:15] Listening to some of the comments tonight personally I don't really believe that
[19:26] individuals would be ostracized if we decided to say it as a board and people decided to either
[19:32] sit or not say the word God but that's an opinion.
[19:39] If I were to share my personal belief and opinion of the issue, I have no problem saying
[19:47] in the pleasure of allegiance.
[19:50] Me, I think because we have the choice in this great country to either say it or not
[19:59] say it is a good enough reason to say it.
[20:07] Now, if it were to pass the night, I'd be happy if it doesn't, I'd be a little upset
[20:13] because I think we'd lose something.
[20:16] My overall concern though is if we decide not to say it, I'm going to feel bad for those
[20:24] individuals that want it to be said.
[20:27] You know, we have to support those residents too.
[20:29] So I don't know if there's a compromise on this at all.
[20:34] I know we're going to get to the vote and it's going to, the chips are going to lie.
[20:39] But I support having it being said for me.
[20:43] So thank you very much.
[20:46] Thank you, Bill. Just real quick, can we try to move to you?
[20:50] How do we get here?
[20:52] The Pledge of Allegiance hasn't been on the Board of Finance agenda in recent order
[20:59] of long history.
[21:01] It's been, you know, at least 30 years plus that has not been recorded as being an agenda
[21:05] item on the Board of Finance.
[21:08] So it is precedent that it just has not been part of the regular meeting of the Board of
[21:13] Finance.
[21:14] Two years ago, I remember, I remember Blashley started requesting that we add the Pledge
[21:20] the Regents to the agenda.
[21:25] And I didn't take action on it at that time and then more recently,
[21:31] we had a member of the public recite the Pledge of Allegiance during public comment. And I think
[21:38] that kind of sparked a discussion on this board about whether it should or should not be part of
[21:43] our opening procedure. And then I at the year request bill I did add it as an agenda item so we
[21:50] can have a discussion about it in Outlook. And so that's why we're having this discussion
[21:55] tonight. So if we as a board can all share our opinions here, all of the opinions on it,
[22:00] we're making an informed decision.
[22:04] I think I'm
[22:10] going to think what I said last time.
[22:16] Well, it's, you know, just a start off with the color bunny screen doesn't really care about
[22:23] anything else. And the pledge is a pledge to our nation.
[22:29] My father served in the word of finance. They did not say in the use 20 years military.
[22:37] They didn't say the pledge of allegiance. I've been on board around roughly 18 years.
[22:44] We didn't say the pledge of allegiance.
[22:48] I'm not hung up on whether we do or we don't.
[22:52] I am going to vote for it because as pointed out by very intelligent people
[23:02] That it is offensive to some people but not saying it is also offensive to some people
[23:10] So the choice if we stand up when we say to pledge allegiance they do not have to stand up and say the pledge allegiance
[23:18] That's their choice and that's how long they'll look at it from this point on. Thank you
[23:24] Thanks, Kim
[23:31] Appreciate you guys delaying until I was able to get back and I put a lot of thought into this
[23:36] So to avoid the usual criticism this board gets
[23:40] about glossing over topics and proposals,
[23:42] I put about eight to 10 hours in researching
[23:45] the history of the Pledge of Legends.
[23:47] Unfortunately, we've already had the history lesson this evening.
[23:51] And so I will just skip through most of my notes.
[23:55] Just because I really wanted to get everyone on the same page
[23:58] about where this, where it originated from,
[24:01] and where it came from.
[24:02] And I can provide this to the group offline.
[24:05] but Michelle's already kind of educated us on a lot of it. So I'll kind of just skip to the end.
[24:15] About, you know, it was a marketing campaign written by a socialist with goals of a utopian society.
[24:21] That's what it was written by. And so why do we need to say the Pledge of Allegiance?
[24:27] I went back and listened to the comments of all those that are pro for all the board members
[24:31] that are pro-ported. And I feel like the argument is that it's a shared ritualistic focus of the
[24:39] group to honor the nation to remind us of our civic duty. I think that's kind of the gist
[24:44] of it why people want to do it. And I think that's great. I see absolutely nothing wrong with that.
[24:50] Something that centers the members of the board and reminds us that we're not loyal to a party
[24:56] but to both national and state constitutions.
[25:00] And that's kind of where my problem lies with the pledge.
[25:04] It doesn't put the focus on my commitments
[25:06] on the law of the land created by the people and for the people.
[25:10] When I was elected to this position,
[25:13] it took something far more significant than a pledge,
[25:17] and that was an oath.
[25:20] For the general statutes of the Connecticut Constitution,
[25:23] For those following along in your annual section, 7341, and the Cameham Charter Article 1203,
[25:31] every elected member of the board must be sworn or affirmed to a faithful performance
[25:35] of their duties.
[25:36] And I'll quote, this is the oath we all took.
[25:39] I do solemnly swear that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the
[25:45] Constitution of the State of Connecticut, that I will faithfully discharge according to
[25:49] law, the duties, the board of finance, and the best of my abilities, so healthy God.
[25:53] Additionally, 30 years ago, I was when I was commissioned here for such a similar
[25:56] oath.
[25:58] Very similar.
[25:59] It's important to defend the Constitution.
[26:01] I, for I'm a college who solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution
[26:06] against all enemies, foreign to end domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to
[26:11] the same.
[26:11] And I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion and
[26:16] and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties
[26:18] the office upon which I'm about to enter.
[26:19] So help me, God.
[26:21] We did not wake up every morning
[26:23] and recite the pledge of allegiance to remind us
[26:24] of our oath.
[26:26] It was never, we were never required to repeat that oath.
[26:29] We said it once, we meant it, and we were helped to it.
[26:33] Both, both are binding commitments
[26:35] that create legal accountability.
[26:38] The pledge is technically just a poem.
[26:41] It neither adds nor places the obligation we already carry.
[26:44] If the board truly wishes to begin each meeting with a reminder to our duty to the Constitution
[26:49] and to the people we serve, the more meaningful practice would be for the board members to
[26:54] recite our office itself.
[26:56] It's a shared ritualistic focus, the original focus of the group, and honor the nation
[27:01] and the reminders of our civic duty.
[27:04] The second I concern I have with starting the meeting with this pledge is suggesting that
[27:09] people have the choice if they're opt out or don't want to participate.
[27:13] We all agree that the Supreme Court said mandating the pledge is a labor, and Michelle has
[27:21] already quoted us from the West Virginia State Board of Education, versus Barnabt.
[27:26] However, when participation is formally made voluntary, leading the room in a collective
[27:32] recital creates a real social pressure to conform, and proof of that was a quote we had
[27:40] during public comments tonight we always hear that no one's going to judge you
[27:45] forcing down and not or not saying the pledge but it was said I don't know who
[27:51] would do this it is very shameful to speak against it there's proof that if
[27:56] there's already judgment in this and we haven't even got to the point where there
[28:01] are people sitting down during the pledge so there's proof that people will be
[28:05] shamed for this. However, public meetings of the Board of Finance are government functions.
[28:15] People who object on principle, conscious or simple preference, should not have to choose
[28:20] between standing out or performing a ritual or reject. Board serves every resident and should
[28:26] not turn a traditional gesture into an informal litmus test of patriotism.
[28:33] Our legion is
[28:34] this town into this country is proven by doing the hard off, hard off and tedious financial work
[28:40] we're elected to do. I believe our oath of office already binds the board members to the
[28:44] Constitution and the Faithful Service. The pledge is an optional traditional gesture that some
[28:50] communities choose to retain for its symbolic value. As a veteran, it has zero impacts on my view
[28:56] of this town or the members of the community. I repeat that as a veteran and an active duty member,
[29:01] or I could care less if we said the Pledge of Allegiance.
[29:04] That is a personal choice between you
[29:07] and I don't know who that would be between.
[29:09] It's a personal choice on your own.
[29:11] It makes no difference as a veteran
[29:13] or an active service member to me whether you do it.
[29:18] Whether opening the meetings with any motivational words
[29:20] adds any civic meaning.
[29:22] But he just said this when I was trying to say it,
[29:24] but he said it.
[29:25] I think you said it last time
[29:26] and I stole it from you.
[29:27] Thank you.
[29:30] Whether opening the meeting with any motivational words adds any meaningful civic value to our meetings, this question we really can't answer.
[29:38] So no one on this board is arguing that the pledge is inherently harmful or that the communities who choose to retain it are wrong.
[29:44] I'm only arguing that it's not necessary here, and we don't need to recite 130 year old poem to prove that we are ready to do our jobs.
[29:54] Thank you.
[29:57] Thank you very much for our deep.
[30:00] And, aye, would you like to make any comments?
[30:06] Thanks for putting me after Brian, Brian.
[30:10] Honestly,
[30:11] I shared my position at the last meeting where this was discussed. I agree with Brian 100% about
[30:19] everything he said. They said for the fact that I am not a veteran, but my grandfather,
[30:24] my brother, my brother-in-law, and many family members were, have had this discussion with
[30:30] all of them. I can't say any more than what Brian said. I agree 100 percent.
[30:39] All right. Thank you, Pat.
[30:43] All right.
[30:46] So with that, you're currently, you know,
[30:50] forings of precedent and currently do not have this as, and I don't want to reoccurring
[30:57] agendas? Yes, can. Can
[31:01] I actually make a suggestion there? We don't take a thing. So we don't do it.
[31:08] Certainly can, yeah. Just don't vote. So I was going to say,
[31:12] offer up if anyone wants to make a motion, I'm not going to make a motion on the topic.
[31:17] I can make a motion.
[31:21] What's what you're thinking on that can is because we don't say it right now.
[31:26] We don't say it right now, but I'm
[31:32] looking at the controversy on both sides of this, and it shouldn't be the controversy that the town has over this.
[31:40] And I think this board of finance, we deal with money.
[31:44] And I know it hasn't done according
[31:49] to one of the emails that was not going all the way back to 1988.
[31:54] So it has had 46 years that hasn't been done in board finance.
[31:59] And why there's a controversy over this on both sides, that is not something that we
[32:08] do with dollars and cents, but that's why.
[32:12] And it's really, for the public to have the conversion of both sides, I really think
[32:17] the board should not invoke just say we're not going to vote on them, and just let it go
[32:23] like that.
[32:23] So we stand at that point of view.
[32:27] I would agree. I mean, moving forward, what if we're proposed with a moment of silence?
[32:34] What if we're proposed with playing the national anthem? What if someone wants to recite something
[32:38] else? This could go on and on and on. Right. I do, I am curious, that just not taking
[32:45] a vote would just end now. Right, we just, if I make a motion, a motion, we do not vote
[32:53] I
[32:56] think that it's a brilliant strategy on Ken's part that we not vote on this because we
[33:04] can rely on a long standing practice.
[33:08] Once we take a vote on it, it legitimizes the issue as being important enough for this
[33:14] board to consider it with emotion, and we don't need to, as Ken has pointed out, we're here
[33:22] to work on the finances of the town and it's somewhat shocking that we've had so much conversation
[33:30] from the public and out tonight. I'm a loss about this issue that's not an issue for us.
[33:37] We have a long-standing practice. We can rely on it and a paraphrase can. We should just move on
[33:45] and do the business that we're elected to do. I'm
[33:55] okay not taking a vote. I just
[33:57] Just to your point, though, Bob, I mean, we have passion to people in this town.
[34:02] And it doesn't matter whether it's finances or our forest select man or Florida education.
[34:08] There's passion to people and we have to respect that.
[34:12] And yeah, we're dealing with money, I mean, it says, got it on our dollar bills and everything.
[34:17] Now that it has anything directly to do with the pleasurable reasons, but you know what I'm saying.
[34:21] Okay, I'm okay, not taking a vote.
[34:24] I think one thing that just popped in my head is, you know, there could be an occasion
[34:30] where a resident gets up and speaks in their two minutes or three minutes and they're
[34:33] going to say the pleasure of allegiance.
[34:36] So be it.
[34:37] And we can react to that accordingly.
[34:40] So I'll do whatever this board wants to do.
[34:43] And not vote.
[34:44] I don't care.
[34:46] I was happy to listen to everyone's food point tonight though.
[34:48] but a lot of it made sense.
[34:51] I just want to make sure we don't take a vote
[34:53] to not vote.
[34:56] Let's just move on.
[34:57] Let's move to the agenda.
[34:59] I think everybody said the opportunity
[35:01] to speak through piece
[35:04] and say a lot of sense.
[35:06] That's a lot of different.
[35:07] We're just being clarified.
[35:09] So be correct, you know, can you ask
[35:12] for a vote to be made?
[35:15] I did not.
[35:16] There's no vote on the agenda.
[35:17] If we want to make this illegal, he can pass it for so many a second and nobody seconds it and then we don't have to deal with it.
[35:31] I'm not making a motion.
[35:34] I just stand corrected.
[35:37] I don't think it's up to us to be able to vote, yes or no, whether we allow someone to say 31 words or not say 31.
[35:44] right. It doesn't matter what those words are. They have three minutes and there you will be
[35:49] correct. Someone wants to stand up and recite the Wiccan Bible. They could do that if they
[35:54] don't question. I know. It sounds crazy. They know it doesn't.
[36:00] But I'll tell you, my favorite part of this board is the public comments. The rest of it's pretty
[36:05] boring.
[36:08] I love it. I love it. But I do. I love watching people exercise their rights.
[36:13] It's wonderful and that's why we're here and the restricts someone from doing that or not restricting them is
[36:20] Probably, it's not our fault.
[36:22] I mean that point to defend us.
[36:25] They actually defend the board.
[36:29] That's what my comments in that.
[36:32] I'm talking about that.
[36:34] All right. Well received.
[36:38] All right. So not hearing any motions being made will move on in our agenda.
[36:42] And I thank everyone for their comments this evening, and we will proceed to, next item is the Board of Education Monthly Report.
[36:52] As you can see, they are not here. We are going to receive our monthly report in your end numbers from the Board of the next month. So, stay tuned for that.
[37:01] You know, it had to do with, they were asking for some money, then they cited the playgrounds, and they were going to do it for themselves.
[37:17] You know what they did that?
[37:19] So did they do it already?
[37:21] because I went down to Cherrybrook.
[37:24] I was in the school,
[37:28] taking the money,
[37:30] and repairing the playgrounds
[37:32] at Cherrybrook in the immediate school.
[37:35] Because one of the playground equipment
[37:37] at Cherrybrook has tape bottle over it,
[37:39] but it's shred.
[37:42] It's not blocking.
[37:44] So it's like,
[37:45] I want to ask the Danielsville Pugh's here,
[37:48] if that's what happened.
[37:49] Mark, I don't know if you know anything about that.
[37:51] I do. They're still working on that issue.
[37:57] You know, it's my knowledge they have not. There's been no repairs. There's been just discussion on the financing.
[38:05] I met with Kevin Wiccoz and Elizabeth Windsor and he and Robbins and Jordan Grossman.
[38:16] Today, didn't there still working out preliminary approaches within their undesignated CIP and then other line item accounts to see if there's money to
[38:32] to take a look at making that purchase,
[38:35] just as they were directed to by another finance.
[38:38] Okay, I just want to point this out.
[38:41] I don't know if the shredding is done by a man's person
[38:43] or some kids, if that piece of equipment is still
[38:49] not safe for the kids, it's very accessible to them
[38:52] because all the taste and shredder, the yellow tape,
[38:56] around that piece of equipment at church, right?
[38:58] So it's like, I was gonna have to look
[39:15] I don't know what the police take looks like, but tomorrow I'll go take a look myself. I know that's the way it is over at the intermediate school event.
[39:26] I'm absolutely so to my knowledge they then fenced off. I don't know what the police take looks like, but tomorrow I'll go take a look myself.
[39:30] order to fence it so that we're not looking at liability issues. But I don't have
[39:36] firsthand knowledge of what's going on at Cherry Book. I'll take them to you.
[39:39] We do have shared annuals on in the meeting. So, I'll have to speak to the whole
[39:44] sale line. Yes. It wasn't where the online game has got to be in some.
[39:51] Go back on to the Microsoft book.
[39:55] I mean, the regional part of that question was
[39:58] the financial part because of what I saw from a little shock sale, taken part on. That means
[40:06] I couldn't have accessable to the kids. Yeah, ten. You're right. There was tape on the equipment,
[40:16] and through the weather, the tape probably needs to be reinforced. Just so you know, the equipment
[40:24] that was ordered, the playgrounds will be repaired,
[40:27] probably sometime in September and in September.
[40:31] We're still working through the funds component,
[40:34] is CAO Penny had mentioned.
[40:37] And we think that there may be someone in the CIP area
[40:42] of unused projects, it would help offset that number
[40:46] but we'll know better.
[40:51] Thank you, thank you.
[40:53] It wasn't, I didn't get it's concerns,
[40:55] was like, you know, the money spent the tapes there, the equipment's successful over the kids.
[41:02] And that's what I was looking at. And I didn't know if the money was spent or some kids
[41:09] or the tape on. Okay, thank you, Bill. Just let me know.
[41:15] Yeah, thank you, Ken. So, you know, in terms of, you know, our board's role, you know,
[41:21] we that discussion was on the agenda for last meeting and then we removed it to the prior discussion
[41:27] about how that should be handled and that's going to be moving money around in our approved
[41:30] function to write for those expenses. I do expect that they will report to us where that might get
[41:36] moved from to fund those expenses that are next meeting.
[41:42] And in the same vein as that, you may
[41:51] is willing to be retiring at the end of this next year.
[41:57] And he will, so the executive search
[42:00] for our next superintendent is gonna cost some money.
[42:04] And so I believe the same, you know, advice
[42:07] that we gave them on playground equipment
[42:09] that is to find somewhere within their budget
[42:12] to move money around to finance that executive search.
[42:17] So you surely hear more about that as well
[42:19] from the board to put it in our next meeting.
[42:22] I was going to say so.
[42:23] All right.
[42:24] Board of minutes was not something on our agenda for this month.
[42:27] So I will move forward with over to.
[42:31] Forward Zoe.
[42:32] We did get a.
[42:35] So the.
[42:38] Before we move to the monthly reports from the town.
[42:40] Was there any board of select with updates referrals?
[42:43] I don't see anything on the agenda.
[42:45] Okay.
[42:46] All right.
[42:47] So we did receive the preliminary year end results, Zoe, about six o'clock today.
[42:55] So no one's really had a chance to review these. So we'll do like just a brief,
[43:01] you know, if you have any initial questions, so we can give us any initial information she would
[43:06] like and we'll dive into it in more depth next month as well. Zoe? Sure, yeah. So these are all very
[43:15] preliminary. The packet was put together last minute just because these year-end
[43:22] numbers are very tedious. It takes tons of journal entries and I don't want to
[43:27] report on anything that I'm not 100% positive up. So I'm just going to
[43:31] prop us this by saying these numbers will change. I'm also reporting year-end
[43:38] numbers at the August 26th quarter-selection meeting. These numbers will
[43:43] will probably change by the time that I report on them
[43:47] at that meeting, and then again after.
[43:49] So, all right, so I did not include revenues in this report.
[43:57] This is just expenditures.
[43:59] So this is the approved spending and happy to report
[44:07] that as of right now, we are in a, just the town.
[44:13] This is not including the board of ed. We're going to have $170,000 surplus, so I can go
[44:21] up or down, but as of right now, we're looking pretty good. So I'll go through these pretty
[44:29] quickly. If anybody has any questions, just stop me. So on page two of the packet, you'll
[44:36] see just an overview of the expenditures, the numbers on the left side are from
[44:43] physical 25, just in our comparison, and the numbers on the right side are
[44:47] physical 26 numbers.
[44:51] So for general government, really, the only kind of things
[45:00] To note, there are overall, we came in at about a $16,000 surplus.
[45:08] Pretty much the main reason
[45:10] for that is because we did have a large surplus in the town council line item. Now, we budget
[45:17] $57,000 and only ended up spending about $26,000. And then our IT line is about $16,000
[45:26] in a deficit and that is because we were paying full for our new website and to keep our old website
[45:32] running and we had a contract with them. So we were kind of double-pit there with our website.
[45:42] Finance came in and wrote a $22,000 deficit. Sorry, surplus.
[45:51] Moving on to public safety.
[45:58] we did go into a deficit a little bit on our communication dispatch line item. That
[46:06] was due to overtime.
[46:10] Then I will touch on paper call. We budgeted $170,000 for paper
[46:16] call and year-to-date fiscal 26 became in at $139,000, $245, so
[46:27] that's a fine number.
[46:35] Public
[46:35] work is really our only section that came in under a deficit, and I would say that is primarily due
[46:44] to the winter that we had, we had about $60,000 worth of overtime due to the amount of storms
[46:50] that we had. So that is the reason for that.
[46:58] Human services again came in at a surplus,
[47:02] planning and development came in at a surplus.
[47:06] Under insurance we did have a $9,900 deficit
[47:12] and then is mostly due to the amount of unemployment that we paid out in the last fiscal year.
[47:17] range
[47:22] of benefits. The bottom line kind of broke pretty even. We did have a
[47:28] little bit of an overage on fake social security. That's just because we did.
[47:33] Well, we're the amount of employees we had during fiscal 26. And then our
[47:37] attention is just about my
[47:44] daughter.
[47:47] I wanted to ask you a question. I'm sorry that
[47:52] That's the way I got your judgment.
[47:56] Did you get the renewal for the medical insurance for next year?
[48:02] It's both 28 or for the year we're in right now.
[48:07] 20 sets, 27.
[48:09] Yes, yeah, the increase was 20 percent.
[48:11] It was 20 percent.
[48:13] Do you know what the industry average was for renewal?
[48:16] I do not, the top of my head, but I know we are in a little bit of a different situation
[48:26] just because our self-insurance reserve fund had gotten hit so hard that we didn't have enough
[48:33] in it. So we are kind of trying to build that reserve back up. Therefore we have to budget a little
[48:40] bit more so that we do have a safety net. Into the count of self-insured, so 20% would be rather large
[48:48] number for renewal. Correct? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, Peg is our representative on the insurance
[48:57] committee, some committee, so if she, if she's still on, I have some insight into that if you want
[49:03] to ask. Correct. Yeah. I can speak to that briefly if you'd like, Brian. Yeah, please,
[49:15] So Bob to answer your question, I believe the average increase on renewal is 12 to 14% was, you know, for last year.
[49:25] I don't have that number in front of me, but so I'm going from memory. I may be off by a percentage or two.
[49:30] And as Zoe said, our reserve funds, which are typically what we keep in reserve for high-cost
[49:43] claims that do not qualify at our pooling point for stop loss, that's what we need to have
[49:54] in balance for, in case we have claims that run over what we're covered for.
[50:07] We had a couple of years, 23, 24, 24, 25, where we significantly depleted that balance.
[50:16] The target balance is around 1.2 to 1.5 million.
[50:21] in. We were a couple of years ago in like the 300 to $400,000 range.
[50:27] The good news is our claims for last year ran under what they had been in prior years.
[50:33] So we had a good year. A lot of that is luck and planning. And we looked at a number of
[50:45] alternatives including stopping being self-insured and going back to a traditional
[50:52] indemnity plan. While that is something that we could consider, because we were in a contract
[51:00] with United Health Care, we entered into a three-year contract with United Health Care.
[51:05] There would be some penalties that we would pay plus run-out on our claims,
[51:10] so that we'd make it fiscally not advantageous for us to do that. So for all of those reasons,
[51:19] We're staying the course where we are, that 20% renewal rate with the goal of if we continue to have favorability on our claims running somewhat under what we're reserving, we would be able to build that reserve backup.
[51:34] And at that point we could consider reducing our increase, you know, based on where we are with claims.
[51:41] And we also have the ability to make changes to the plan, and we're looking at that.
[51:46] We're entering negotiations with our unions, and there will be discussions around how
[51:55] we can improve by doing more generics for pharmaceuticals and that sort of thing.
[52:01] So there's a lot of options on the table that will enable us to potentially see savings in
[52:06] long-term. We are bound by our negotiations. I believe our members of our insurance committee
[52:16] will be able to participate in those negotiations. So there's a lot of variables right now, but
[52:22] we're still, as Zoe said, recovering from a few very, very bad years that put us in financially,
[52:28] to leave very bad shape.
[52:30] And as, again, if we don't have the reserves,
[52:34] we go to our fund balance.
[52:37] So there's no good answer
[52:41] if our claims run over what we have reserved for,
[52:46] it costs the town.
[52:51] Thanks for that.
[53:01] Okay, so then that brings us down to the last line
[53:04] on the first page and that is the town wide budget.
[53:08] from again, it does sort of less of $172,400, $45.
[53:15] The next page just shows our CIP,
[53:18] which is just a budget allocation.
[53:20] We go on the amount of client that our capital recruitment
[53:24] account fund at the beginning of the year,
[53:27] and then I just make the allocation,
[53:29] and that those funds go into that account.
[53:33] Then we have the Board of Finance budget,
[53:35] which is really just the budget of mailer,
[53:37] our auditor fees, and our debt service payments.
[53:41] and our debt service payments are not negotiable,
[53:45] really, we have to pay those.
[53:47] So really, the only overage on the board of finance budget
[53:49] was for
[53:55] that budget meeller and Auditor Fees.
[54:00] I don't know why the Auditor Fees are over.
[54:02] Maybe the budget amount is just set a little bit under,
[54:08] but it's only a $1,200 variance there.
[54:13] Any questions on that?
[54:16] The budget mailer. I mean, the one we sent out this year was not glossy paper or anything.
[54:23] It was pretty flimsy. And we still went over by a lot. Is that just like to cost the mailing
[54:28] cost like those dishes? They cost one out, yeah. Yeah, okay. So have we, I don't remember increasing
[54:34] that budget for this current fiscal year? So we're going to run it the same issue.
[54:39] I can share, I can see if I increased it accordingly.
[54:44] Okay, but I don't need to know right now.
[54:46] I'm just curious, now in the bottom line for board of finance,
[54:50] does it show us a surplus or is that just from the overall town?
[54:56] The bottom line is.
[54:57] I'm running to a little bit over, so we can have a little bit over, kind of like it.
[55:07] The next page is our special revenue update.
[55:12] All right, so I will just kind of go through and say what the change in fund balance was for each special revenue fund.
[55:22] For Parks and Rag, they came in at a deficit. Their fund balance at the beginning of the year was about 117,000.
[55:31] Their deficit was around 13,000, so that will decrease their fund balance to about 104,000.
[55:42] I did, I tried to look at it a little bit before I came, but is that, do you know if that's due to, is there primarily a revenue issue or primarily an expensive issue?
[55:55] That's just the way I'll this year.
[55:59] Yeah, it was looking at the details on this.
[56:02] It looks like the park, this is the park and Rick special revenue.
[56:06] We read the numbers here, it looks like it's $93,000 less than the budget, it is that correct.
[56:14] There is this.
[56:16] Yes, yeah.
[56:18] That was the, but they estimate how much they're going to take in for program fees, swimming lessons.
[56:24] The concession stands.
[56:27] And they took in almost $100,000 less than I thought they were going to come.
[56:30] I'm just curious. The program fees are all of that. I guess do we know that? It's a huge
[56:39] reduction this year of people who didn't program. I'm not sure. I do know that these special
[56:46] revenue budgets are simply just got it lines. So it's not like the town voted on it and
[56:54] that's what they expected. I think we just kind of set them as guidelines as an expectation
[56:59] of what we could collect, but yeah, that is definitely
[57:06] a good one.
[57:07] It is.
[57:09] And I'm, you know, my time at Marx and Marx, I'm curious, just because the program
[57:12] I'm going to come in will usually be substantial and generally more than expensive.
[57:17] So that's why I was wondering if maybe they spent a bunch of money on something,
[57:20] and I just wasn't aware of that.
[57:22] If you wouldn't mind, maybe you could pour the next feed in.
[57:25] Yeah, I cannot.
[57:26] I don't think it was quick narrative.
[57:28] Sorry.
[57:36] WPCA, the, their beginning year fund balance was approximately 1.3 million.
[57:42] They ended the year with a $544,000 surplus.
[57:48] And that will increase their fund balance to approximately 1.9 million.
[57:55] WPCA funds all of their own projects.
[57:58] And I know Jonathan Minsky has a number of projects coming up.
[58:03] in your future. So that is why the fund balance is so high. And he's adding to it every year.
[58:10] Good. They're going to need it.
[58:15] Is that the form of higher rates or what? Or is that just standard rates?
[58:26] I believe he increased the rates already.
[58:31] It just the net change just is a result of the
[58:38] revenues you took in less what you spent. So I think maybe he's just budgeting higher
[58:44] revenues and spending less so that he knows that he's going to add to his fund balance
[58:48] so that he's prepared for the future projects.
[58:55] But yeah, WPCA has their own budget and they
[58:59] vote on it separately. So sewer assessment, yes. sewer assessment started the year with a fund
[59:09] of balance approximately 350,000.
[59:12] They're here to date revenues for approximately 356,000.
[59:19] The year to date expenditures are just that clean water
[59:22] loan that we pay off every single year.
[59:25] And so they ended the year with a surplus of about 278,000.
[59:31] We'll increase their fund balance to 634,000.
[59:37] Those are just the sewer connection fees.
[59:39] The more buildings that they put up and apartment complexes that they're building, that increases
[59:45] those two connection fees significantly, so that's why this year is so much higher than
[59:49] last year.
[59:52] EMS, this is always a kind of problem.
[1:00:00] Special revenue fund, they typically run into a deficit, it's because they don't carry a fund balance. It's the town's responsibility that if they do end in a deficit, we have to fund them and bring them back up to zero.
[1:00:14] So I'm happy to report that they did not end the year in a deficit. Their year-to-date revenues are currently about 1.1 million. And their year-to-date expenditures are about 1,060,000.
[1:00:32] So that is a fund that is still constantly moving.
[1:00:36] We have more revenues coming in just due to the fact that if an incident occurred in June,
[1:00:45] that still qualifies as fiscal 26 revenue.
[1:00:48] So people that are still making payments in August, we put that revenue back to fiscal 26.
[1:00:54] So that's going to change until we fully close the books.
[1:01:00] So I'll report more on that at a later date.
[1:01:05] The transfer station has a fund balance
[1:01:07] at the beginning of the year of approximately 26,000.
[1:01:11] They ended the year with about $9,000 surplus.
[1:01:15] So that will increase their fund balance to about 35,000.
[1:01:25] And their fund balance is a little bit low.
[1:01:27] I believe it used to be around 50,000.
[1:01:30] And then, I think
[1:01:35] that brought it down.
[1:01:38] so it's good to see us ending the year in a surplus and slowly starting to build up back up.
[1:01:47] Transfer station 400 runs as long as it's one dollar
[1:01:51] favorite town that's good. I need to say it that way but yeah.
[1:01:59] So all of the details behind that is in the packet so if you have any questions about
[1:02:04] on the event and look there or send me the e-mails.
[1:02:08] I don't get the e-mails send.
[1:02:13] All right, and then I just added a little additional
[1:02:16] information on our opioid funds, our NIP funds,
[1:02:21] our cannabis revenue, and accounting
[1:02:23] bros just because this is not going to change.
[1:02:29] So
[1:02:32] total amount of opioid funds we have to year to two day,
[1:02:36] not year to date, but in total.
[1:02:38] is $86,096 and 77 cents. We recently approved that a Lucas device be purchased, so that
[1:02:49] leaves us with about 51,000 left in our opioid funds, and we are still actively looking
[1:02:54] for things to spend those funds on.
[1:02:58] The NIFS funds, we started the year with about $13,900
[1:03:04] dollars in there. Throughout fiscal 26 we received $15,400 in revenue and throughout the year we
[1:03:14] sent $17,794. We sent that on a street sweeper rental and catch basin cleaning. So that
[1:03:24] we just went about $11,600 left over. And that does carry into the next year.
[1:03:32] Canada's year-to-date revenues for fiscal 26 are 93,265 dollars and 73 cents.
[1:03:40] We have not yet received our May and June payments, so that number will change for
[1:03:44] fiscal 26.
[1:03:47] That's what we have so far.
[1:03:49] I think the same restrictions on the cannabis funds as they are on the opioid settlement
[1:03:55] funds.
[1:03:56] No, the cannabis funds are much more lean on what you can spend those on, yeah.
[1:04:01] Yeah, the opioid funds are really just for opioid remediation.
[1:04:10] And then, tummy growths, we received $339,192, that was fully spent, and I am working on
[1:04:21] the tummy growth reporting that is due on September 1st, and that sums up our pre-liminary year-end
[1:04:29] report.
[1:04:31] I didn't just want to highlight the ask for a sum of cannabis funds that we have budgeted
[1:04:38] out $150,000 of that current balance toward PLCB for this current fiscal year and has
[1:04:45] improved the most recent budget.
[1:04:47] So anyone who's listening and doesn't see the text, doesn't realize that we are, we do have
[1:04:53] a name tag on a good chunk of that fuel sponsor.
[1:04:59] Thank you, Zoe.
[1:05:00] All right. That was a good overview. As we wait the revenues and some final
[1:05:09] tallying, so we get some final numbers. You know, I encouraged the board a little
[1:05:15] myself. Continue to look over these numbers, go with questions for next meeting.
[1:05:19] You know, so we can wrap up that annual review and we will presumably get the
[1:05:26] board of ed's final numbers with enough time to review those numbers as well.
[1:05:30] Any
[1:05:36] additional questions comments before we move on?
[1:05:42] Make sure I was going to be here in September.
[1:05:44] Thank you.
[1:05:45] Good.
[1:05:48] All right.
[1:05:51] Here none.
[1:05:52] We'll move on to the last item, our agenda, which will be
[1:05:55] the approval of the minutes for our July meeting.
[1:06:12] Does anybody have a copy?
[1:06:13] Anybody have a copy of the movement?
[1:06:16] I don't.
[1:06:17] Okay.
[1:06:17] They were in the email that so we just sent out around
[1:06:20] six o'clock, so no one's really had a chance to renew them. All right, I have to
[1:06:26] abstain, I wasn't.
[1:06:35] For a seven o'clock meeting, they were posted online. I know what happened,
[1:06:40] that's right. We're moving them online.
[1:06:45] All right, let's pend that without any objection,
[1:06:49] we'll pend the approval of those minutes for our next meeting. I have no one a chance to
[1:06:54] to do that. For sure, he will show his office read my tablet and see why I'm not getting
[1:07:02] emails.
[1:07:08] Here are no objections depending on the next meeting. All right, so with that,
[1:07:17] that concludes our board of finance regular meeting for the night. Meeting is adjourned at 809.
[1:07:23] and we have time for more for the wife.
[1:07:27] Thank you.